# Should you make your daughter wear a bra?



## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

My daughter just turned 11 today.














She's been starting to develop since last summer. I expect she'll be getting her period soon. Anyway, here's the thing. At first she wanted bras, now that I feel she should wear one she doesn't want to wear them.







: I don't know if I should push the issue with her or not? She's developing before the rest of the kids in her class and I thought maybe if she wore a bra it wouldn't cause as much attention to her so she won't get teased or whatever because you can see her nipples through her shirt. Sorry if that's TMI.

What would you do?


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## oceanbaby (Nov 19, 2001)

Gosh, I really don't know.

I remember when I was 13 or 14, my dad was driving me over to our highschool homecoming dance. He glanced over at me, and registered that I wasn't wearing a bra. I was wearing a flashdance style sweatshirt, and it finally occured to him that there was no brastrap on my bare shoulder. He turned the car around, and made me go home and put a bra on. He kept saying that he knew how lewd guys were, and how they talked about certain girls, and he wasn't going to have me being one of those girls.

Now granted, this was paranoid overprotective daddy/daughter stuff coming out, but I guess I could see where he was coming from.


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by oceanbaby_
*
Now granted, this was paranoid overprotective daddy/daughter stuff coming out, but I guess I could see where he was coming from.*

:LOL I guess that's why you have issues? Who got you with that DDDDC?

Maybe I should lighten up? I don't want my daughter to have issues. :LOL


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## Elphaba (Nov 19, 2001)

I don't know that I would force her to wear a bra, but I think it would help to find out WHY she's resistant to them. If it's because they're uncomfortable, maybe you could try getting her some tank-style or sports bras.
If it's because she feels weird that she's the only one who needs a bra in her class, well, I don't have any advice there. It's always weird to be "the only one" when you're a preteen or teen, whether you're the first or the last to do something. I guess she needs reassurance from you, but I don't have a clue as to what precisely, or how to say it.


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## EllasMummy (Dec 10, 2003)

First, Happy 11th Birthday to your DD!







:

I was the first in my class to need a bra and get my period. I was 11 too.

My mum took me shopping and let me choose some pretty bras. My sister was the same and she really didnt want to wear a bra so she chose a sleep bra that looked more like a short vest.

How would she feel if you let her choose something herself?

I dont think you should make her wear one if she really objects. I'm sure as soon as another girl in her class is wearing one she will want to.

Perhaps you could encourage her to try wearing it at home at wkends first to see how it feels.

Sorry this is a bit disjointed but ideas keep coming to me as I think about being 11.

HTH


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

This is a tuffy. What about those tank style undershirts to keep her nipples from showing. She doesn't need a support garment at this time, just something to keep her modesty.

-Heather


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## mamaley (Mar 18, 2002)

i got my period at 11 and i remember when i was either 10 or 11 my mom telling me that i needed a bra with certain shirts. i hated this and thought it was silly that i needed one. i don't think i knew how to explain it to my mom at the time, but i think it was because i still felt like a little girl, but i was supposed to wear this thing that my mother wears. it felt akward. i remember my dad asking why i didn't want to wear one, and this was mortifying.








i guess my advice is to be nonchalant about it. don't make it an issue about how she's becoming a woman (although looking back it is a very cool time in a girls life, but at the time i didn't see it that way) and give her the bra, saying that it might be a good idea to wear it with some tops.
ok, this probably didn't help much at all. and please excuse the typos, nak.


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## Dar (Apr 12, 2002)

Rain is 11. She has some bras and sometimes she wears them, and other times she doesn't. It's up to her. They're "training bras", so they don't have real cups - they just kind of flatten out the nipples a bit. Most of her friends seem to be at about the same stage, breast-wise.

If people tease her we'll deal with it then, but I don't think we should teach our girls to make decisions based on what other people might say about their bodies. There's nothing wrong with having breasts, you don't have to hide the fact that you have nipples. We did go look at bras when she started developing so she'd have some, and recently she asked if we could go get a few more, so we did...

I'm 35 and almost never wear a bra, FWIW.

Dar


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## stik (Dec 3, 2003)

If it was my daughter, I wouldn't make her wear a bra but I wouldn't want her nipples showing either.

I think I'd probably talk to her about the problem in private at a neutral time (maybe while folding laundry - clothes are present to be a topic of discussion, but you don't have to criticize whatever she's got on in order to point out that some of these garments are no longer providing adequate coverage) and discuss options. Maybe she could wear an undershirt or tank top under the offending shirts, if she's currently opposed to bras.


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## tabitha (Sep 10, 2002)

i *rarely* wear a bra. i dont think nipples are a big deal. it took me 21 years and a baby to feel so normal about my breasts, i dont want that to be my daughter's story.

that being my background... bras wont be a 'coming of age' treat, or requirement, here. if my daughter desires a bra, i am sure i can make her something nice. people of all ages have 'issues' but that isnt my daughter's fault. bras serve no purpose IMO. (unless you need support for large breasts and want to wear one)

tabitha


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## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

Iwould not make my daughter wear a bra. I think it sends a weird message to force it , like having breast and oh forbid nipples is a bad thing and you must cover them. I could not see making my daughter since I seldom wear a bra myself. Plus I am of the believe bras are bad for breast health too.


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## spero (Apr 22, 2003)

I encourage my 10yr old to wear a bra. She is developing faster than most of her friends (it's obvious she's going to be big-breasted, like me) and I am not comfortable with her walking around with her nips poking out all the time. Of course there's nothing wrong with them, but there's just too many pervs out there, KWIM? Plus, she really does need the support, for sports...she mentioned that her breasts were hurting when she ran.

I took her shopping last spring and let her choose several pretty bras and a couple of sports bras for softball season. It wasn't at all traumatic for either of us, and she felt very grown-up and responsible for herself.


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## mosschops (Nov 21, 2003)

ITA! (with Sheacoby)

I've had this discussion in the past at hipmama, and we came to the conclusion that bras seem to matter a lot more to Americans than to europeans! But I would think that if your daughter is happy not wearing one, then that's fine. Why do you feel that she should be? Are you worried about other people's reactions?

I was blessed with very pointy sticky-out nipples, which were clearly visable through most clothering _and_ bras, and they were commented on _constantly_ . WTF??? Why are nipples so important??? I'd be more worried if somebody didn't have them.... I think that they probably ARE still pointy... it's just that they're pointing in a different direction...:LOL

Best of luck mama, I hope she and you had a lovely 11th birthday!!

Steph


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## polka hop (Dec 23, 2003)

*


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

I am completely with Dar on this one. Not only wouldn't I make her wear one I wouldn't even bring it up. I think all girls go through this. I know my dd did. She is 14 now and doesn't always wear a bra. She does have an assortment of choices in bra styles from traditional ones to tank top style. If she wants to wear them fine, if she doesn't fine.


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by Dar_
*
If people tease her we'll deal with it then, but I don't think we should teach our girls to make decisions based on what other people might say about their bodies.*
Which of course I don't teach her. That's just what I fear. She has enough to deal with in school already, *I* don't want to see her teased because of her perfectly normal body.

Someone mentioned about not wanting to grow up. I know that's not it. She wants to grow up too quick as it is. She doesn't understand why she's not allowed to wear make-up or have boyfriends.







:

She used to want to wear bras. I have no idea why she doesn't now. I'll have to talk to her about it more. I'll tell her that when she's ready she has the ones that she picked out before and the ones I bought her, but for now I'll have her, and my other daughter, wear T-shirts. It's not that I don't want her to feel comfortable with her body, it's the other people I worry about. Let's face it, certain things DO attract attention and I don't think 11 is old enough for that kind of attention. There are a lot of sick people out there. For the same reason I don't allow my girls (or boys) to walk around half naked like some of the kids I see. I don't think modestly is a bad thing.

Thanks for all your replies!

Oh, and I think bras are kind of stupid, but I'm not up for changing society on that one. Someone else will have to do it. :LOL


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## USAmma (Nov 29, 2001)

What if you make it a special "grown up" day for her? Like take her to the salon for a manicure, buy her some light make up (if you wear it yourself and don't mind), and let her get a new outfit . . and a bra at the same time.

When I started to develop I felt so awkward about it and wanted to hide it. I was raised by my father, so he asked a good female friend of his to take me out to get bras. She also painted my nails that day and styled my hair and went out for ice cream. It was special and after that I wore the bras off and on until I felt comfortable enough to wear them full time.

If that doesn't work, maybe give her the talk about boys thinking lewd thoughts and you just want to protect her from that. Maybe she's not aware of that. But don't force it. She'll come around.

Darshani


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## Foobar (Dec 15, 2002)

I think I started wearing bras around that age because I was getting made fun of because of the nipples.
Sigh.

I personally like the support for my (normally) B cup size, although with pregnancy, I NEED the support for my D+ breasts.

I wouldn't force her, but I would ask. As non confrontational as possible...


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## spero (Apr 22, 2003)

Quote:

_Originally posted by AnnMarie_
*Oh, and I think bras are kind of stupid, ...*
While I _kinda_ agree with that statement, I still have to say that for us "well-endowed" ladies they are a necessary evil. I am almost 40 years old; and if I didn't wear a bra my breasts would, quite literally, be hanging somewhere around my waistline.

I'm sorry but I don't find that attractive OR comfortable.







:


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## anothermama (Nov 11, 2003)

I am in the minority I guess.......I'd make my dd wear SOMETHING especially if she was showing nipple.

It's all fine and good to say that in an ideal world breasts shouldn't be overly sexualized like that, but it's not an ideal world. Until my daughter can really own her own sexuality then I need to protect her and I already notice gross old men and teenage boys making comments about girls that age when they see them developing. In fact just yesterday my DH yelled at these two 15 year olds who were making sick comments to a girl who musta been 11 or 12 and just didn't seem AWARE that she had breasts and they were OUT THERE because she wasn't in a bra. It's sick. Sure, I plan on raising my boys differently but not everyone has.

Too many wack jobs and horny boys out there for my liking....I think that I can teach my daughter respect and love for her body while also teaching her that others might not always see things that way.

If she didn't want to wear a bra, per say, I'd go with a sports bra or tank or whatever was comfy for her, but once she starts getting breasts, she needs to take care of them.


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## Journey (Jun 12, 2002)

Do any of you remember being middle school aged, newly developing, wearing your first bra which you were so looking forward to getting, and... *SNAP*







: Some moron went and pulled on the bra strap.

Get her some cami's with built in bras, and cute matching panties.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Girls are so lucky that today the natural look is in and there are so many modest yet comfortable options.

So I am starting from a place that modesty is important. Even at 7 I will veto imodest outfits on my dd. So probably not nessecary fro her to wear a bra under a thick sweater or sweatshirt but perhaps there are some shirts that hang funny when she bends, that are slightly see through, or have a tendancy to show off nipple. Ok there are still lots of options. At the training bra phase anything that provides and extra thin layer is exceptable. An undershirt, camisole, sports bra any other bra, or some type of shirt with a built in bra like a tank top with a shelf bra. Also with some of these options it will avoid a bra line which may be embarrassing her. Io think you shoudl focus on what a bra does and go from there. What does she need a bra for? Why should she wear one, what sort of undergarments will meet those needs. And I think it is definitely ok to go without sometimes. especially at that age and if the shirt she is wearing isn't too revealing.


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by skellbelle_
*While I kinda agree with that statement, I still have to say that for us "well-endowed" ladies they are a necessary evil. I am almost 40 years old; and if I didn't wear a bra my breasts would, quite literally, be hanging somewhere around my waistline.

I'm sorry but I don't find that attractive OR comfortable.







:*

Which is why I wear one as well. The thing is, if we didn't wear bras it would be seen as normal and wouldn't be unattractive.

Anyway, I'm not going to push the bra issue. I don't want her to ever feel bad about her body and I don't want to send her the wrong message. She said she wants to wear the half shirt ones (sports bras), but without anything over it. :LOL I said those are for under your clothes, and I'll buy you some if you want them. So, I'll probably take her to the store and buy her some of those. I'll make it a day out just for her and I.

I did find out why she doesn't want to wear a bra anymore. One of the girls at school was teasing her saying she had big ones.







:

Thanks everyone for your advise! I appreciate all of your replies.


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## Piglet68 (Apr 5, 2002)

I think you should just sit down and have a frank and open discussion about bras. Don't *tell* her anything, ask her. Ask her if her breasts ever hurt her while running or stuff. Ask her how she feels about wearing a bra. Talk to the child!!

I was fairly flat chested as a teen, but when I was 14 our volleyball team got white shirts, and it was a coach who pulled me aside in the locker room and said I needed to wear a bra. Honestly, it had never ever even occurred to me to think about such things. I'm sure I was a bit embarrassed when she said that, but I also didn't want to be the one whose nipples were showing, lol.

There are so many comfortable options, like lilyka said, that I'm sure your DD could find something she likes. Let it be her decision, don't be preachy, and just let her know that if she ever wants to ask questions or talk she can come to you no problem!


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## spero (Apr 22, 2003)

anothermama









Quote:

_Originally posted by AnnMarie_
*The thing is, if we didn't wear bras it would be seen as normal and wouldn't be unattractive.*
Well maybe, yeah, but it would HURT!!!









My 38DD "ladies" are sore as hell right now (AF is on the way







) and if they weren't somehow supported I'd be in AGONY.

I like a pretty bra


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## HomeschoolLady03 (Mar 16, 2004)

I would make my dd wear a bra.


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## Artisan (Aug 24, 2002)

I would at least make her wear an undershirt or tank top. Our daughters are not adults capable of fending off lewd glances and inappropriate comments. She shouldn't have to deal with that. (Which she WILL deal with if she's around young boys at school.)

I got a bra in 5th grade. I wanted one, but didn't want to tell my mom that. I just wasn't comfortable discussing it with her. We were shopping at JCPenney one day and she said, "I'm going to ge a couple of bras for you, OK?" I said OK, glad to not have to have a big "conversation". I was worried about other kids seeing my bra at first too. I wouldn't wear white shirts and was afraid of my straps showing. My mother, smartly, bought me a racerback style so I wouldn't have to mess with the straps and so it would be less visible to boys in the class.


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## nikirj (Oct 1, 2002)

I didn't wear them until I was 16 - even though I am of fairly "normal" size (34B) and even though I developed early (again, around 11 years old). It was just that until that time, my mom bought these cheap things for me that were outrageously uncomfortable (part of it was she didn't want to spend money, part of it was that she was jealous since her breasts are tiny - she did the same to my younger sister but I am 6 years older and took my sister out myself) - when I was 16 I got a job and got some bras that fit and felt right, and that I could wear.

I'd go bra shopping and focus on comfort. Go someplace that does fittings if you can, and make sure she is fit right. Make a day of it if you like, but the point is that you are getting ones that SHE likes. Buck up and spend a few $ if you have to, if it is important to you that she wear them.

I'd also take a look at her wardrobe and pick out (mentally) which ones can be worn without a bra, which ones are borderline (not to fight over) and which ones absolutely need a bra to be appropriate. If she doesn't want to wear bras, just make it a matter-of-fact thing - "this shirt goes with a bra, so pick a new one before we leave" (if this sort of thing doesn't set your daughter off or anything) or go ahead and take the unacceptable ones out of the rotation for now.

I totally wouldn't force her to wear them, though - and if none of the things anyone has said works, I'd just invest in some thick shirts and ride it out.


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by skellbelle_
*

Well maybe, yeah, but it would HURT!!!









*
I sooo know what you mean. There are some days I can go without, but others, OUCH! If I had small breasts I don't think I'd wear a bra though unless I still had pain.


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## mamawanabe (Nov 12, 2002)

Honestly, I never noticed girls first developping breasts in late grade school early jr. high, but I did notice girls frist wearing bras, and I was embarassed for them as I wasn't when I saw buds and even nips beneath a shirt. Wearing a bra seemed somehow an admission, an aknowledgement, even a flaunting of the breasts and thus of sexuality. So, contrary to the consensus here, bras were the opposite of modesty. Boys noticed the bras too and turned thier attention on those girls. I didn't wear a bra long after I should have and one of the reasons was to escape such attention. It worked

This changed in the middle of 8th grade when suddenly all girls were wearing bras.

Another reminder of just how socially constructed sexuality is (in this case the it wasn't the breasts but the bras that attracted sexual attention). This may be what your daughter is facing, in which case the tank bras should serve to satisfy both her and you.


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## Piglet68 (Apr 5, 2002)

Wow, mamawannabe, that is so true. I remember now the first girl in my class to get a bra (in grade 6) got ALL the attention (and all of it the unwanted kind, from the boys and the girls). But by the time the majority had them, it was NBD.


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by mamawanabe_
*Honestly, I never noticed girls first developping breasts in late grade school early jr. high, but I did notice girls frist wearing bras, and I was embarassed for them as I wasn't when I saw buds and even nips beneath a shirt.*
Well, my daughter is in 4th, but if she didn't stay back she'd be in 5th. It is noticeable with her. It's not just nipples, she's actually developing already. I know it seems early, but I was early too. My grandmother was around 9 when she got her first period. Maybe it's just something that runs in my family? Who knows, but she does have breasts now. I was teased in school because of my breasts, but it wasn't because I wore a bra. I think kids can be cruel and will find anything to tease you about. If she doesn't wear one she might get teased and if she does she might. It sucks.


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## Lucysmama (Apr 29, 2003)

If she were developing large breasts, I would gently nudge my dd into wearing a bra....developing breasts need support, too - and when they get to a certain cup size, they esp. need it.

My mom didn't push me into bras until I had C cups..and as a result, my breasts were very pendulous from an early age from lack of support during development. I ALWAYS hated that, but not for vanity issues - I really found it very uncomfortable. (I still do. I'm a 36DD. The only time I DON'T wear a bra is in the shower, because having such large pendulous breasts is very very uncomfortable.) I wish my mom would have pushed a little sooner, as I feel I wouldn't have ended up with an uncomfortable chest.


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## doulamomvicki (Nov 4, 2003)

I would really encourage her to wear one. For my dd first bras we got sports bras that under a shirt looked like tank. Her problem was the opposite - everyone else was wearing one and she didn't (and still doesn't really) need one. Poor thing, doesn't take after my side of the family - we are one big boobed bunch.


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## doulamomvicki (Nov 4, 2003)

I asked my dd if the bra strap pulling thing ever happened to her or any of her friends. She looked at me like I was stupid and said "No, that is really immature Mom" I guess in my day/the old days we were "immature".:LOL


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## AnnMarie (May 21, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by Lucysmama_
*My mom didn't push me into bras until I had C cups..and as a result, my breasts were very pendulous from an early age from lack of support during development.*
Don't blame the lack of a bra. That really has nothing to do with it IMO. I have really pendulous breasts, always have, and I started wearing a bra early. I can't believe I'm admitting this here, but my nickname in grade school was "droopy" because of it. I have issues about my breasts to this day because of it. I'd bet just about anything that my second daughter will have breasts like me while my older daughter won't. I can tell just from the shape her breasts have always been. She's always had little buds since birth, and even then it looked like they were pointing down somewhat. I think it's genetic because a lot of the women in my family are like that.

I'd love to have a reduction/lift some day. I don't think I'd wear a bra anymore if I did, depending on what I was wearing.


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## Justice2 (Mar 18, 2003)

Well, hope I am not flamed for this BUT....

I will not push a bra on my daughter. I actually hope that she WON'T want to wear a bra. A nice, LOOSE, cami will be fine. I very rarely wear a bra. It's not healthy for your breasts....wearing a bra can actually make your breasts sag MORE than if you didn't wear a bra. EVERYONE's breasts will sag eventually. Wearing a bra, especially a push up or underwire bra can restrict the flow of lymphatic fluid. Lymphatic fluid fights infection and disease. Here is a wonderful website about breast health (actually the link will take you to the information about bra wearing and the complications that it can cause).

Breast Health and Bras

Good luck and HAPPY BIRTHDAY to your daughter!


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## spero (Apr 22, 2003)

Not flaming you, Laura - you know I love ya even though I got my new nickname thanks to your LOVELY daughter :LOL

I have to say...
I think that it is great that so many of you don't have to wear a bra. I, however, am a well-endowed mama who NEEDS support for the ladies. My breasts are PAINFUL without a bra supporting them. Not to mention that I just don't think it's attractive or comfortable to have them hanging out the bottom of my t-shirt







Call me a jerk, but I also don't like to see 44E breasts bobbing around at someone's waistline...I'm sorry, but it gives me the willies. I think it looks sloppy and unattractive.

My DD started complaining last year, during softball season, that her breasts hurt when she ran. I'm not going to force her to be in pain. So I brought up the idea of getting a few bras, and she was OK with it.

I'm feeling a little defensive - like I am HARMING myself and my dd simply because we NEED to wear a bra. Believe me, if I could go braless, I would...I would LOVE to be able to wear one of those cute little spaghetti-strap tops in the summer. It just ain't ever gonna happen, though.


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## Lucysmama (Apr 29, 2003)

Quote:

_Originally posted by AnnMarie_
*Don't blame the lack of a bra. That really has nothing to do with it IMO. I have really pendulous breasts, always have, and I started wearing a bra early.*
Oh, man! You mean I can't blame my mom for this?!?!?! :LOL Just kiddin'!


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## Ravin (Mar 19, 2002)

I remember getting teased at Space Camp when I was 11 because I had a bra. I also had A-cups. If they actually fill a cup and are uncomfortable/jiggly when doing active stuff like running, I'd get her a bra and encourage her to wear them for working out. Same principle as a jock strap for boys with pendulous testicles, provide support so they stay comfortable.

I do think the universal wearing of bras all the time is screwy. I only wear one now to help contain the leakage, once I stop leaking I'll probably put the bras away except when when doing athletic activity during which the support is actually needed. My goal is comfort, lol!


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## Justice2 (Mar 18, 2003)

Quote:

_Originally posted by skellbelle_
*Not flaming you, Laura - you know I love ya even though I got my new nickname thanks to your LOVELY daughter :LOL

I have to say...
I think that it is great that so many of you don't have to wear a bra. I, however, am a well-endowed mama who NEEDS support for the ladies. My breasts are PAINFUL without a bra supporting them. Not to mention that I just don't think it's attractive or comfortable to have them hanging out the bottom of my t-shirt







Call me a jerk, but I also don't like to see 44E breasts bobbing around at someone's waistline...I'm sorry, but it gives me the willies. I think it looks sloppy and unattractive.

My DD started complaining last year, during softball season, that her breasts hurt when she ran. I'm not going to force her to be in pain. So I brought up the idea of getting a few bras, and she was OK with it.

I'm feeling a little defensive - like I am HARMING myself and my dd simply because we NEED to wear a bra. Believe me, if I could go braless, I would...I would LOVE to be able to wear one of those cute little spaghetti-strap tops in the summer. It just ain't ever gonna happen, though.*
I don't feel flamed Skell. I also don't think that you should feel defensive in the least. I am average sized in that location. I do have to wear a sports bra when I exercise or run for comfort. I do not wear one to go grocery shopping or to my neighbor's house. AND I do get "those" looks from men, like I am "asking for it" (I can actually be quite rude). I also get looks from little old ladies....you know the looks, like I am for hire or something. I try not to be rude to them because I understand that they are from an era gone by. I tend to flout convention. I am not going to wear a bra, needlessly, because some old lady thinks I am being improper.

and i told you, i LOVE your new ears!


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

I don't believe that the way to teach our dd's to be body confidant is to force them to wear bras for their protection. In fact I believe it just instills an attitude of fear. It is perpetuating the idea that girls are somehow responsable for boys behavior. Or others behavior. Of course none of us wants our kids to be teased, but by putting the focus of changing on our dd's sends the message that they can control others. That as long as they are invisible then they will be left alone.

Men do not rape because nipples are visible through a shirt. And to imply that hiding our dd's away will protect them is misguided at best and at worst damaging to their self worth and identity.


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## alsoSarah (Apr 29, 2002)

Arduinna, ITA!

alsoSarah


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## elyice (Apr 7, 2003)

Idid not wear a bra until I was 16. My boobs have ALWAYS sagged. I hate it. I feel unattractive when I have to "expose them" in a bathing suit or wearing certain clothing.
Buy her a bra asap.


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## Justice2 (Mar 18, 2003)

Quote:

_Originally posted by elyice_
*Idid not wear a bra until I was 16. My boobs have ALWAYS sagged. I hate it. I feel unattractive when I have to "expose them" in a bathing suit or wearing certain clothing.
Buy her a bra asap.*

Bra or no Bra...boobs are gonna sag...it's what they do


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## tabitha (Sep 10, 2002)

Arduinna!!

where do people get the notion that bras keep your breasts from assuming their natural shape? I mean, they do _while youre wearing one_, but Breasts will be Breasts, and they are supposed to be like that! The notion that a bra will keep them 'perky' is just an outdated leftover idea, like how people thought (and some still think) nursing caused your breasts to sag (it is known that pregnancy does this and not breastfeeding will not 'help'). really, if you want your breasts to be more perky (without surgery), you should work on upper body strength. chest strength- something most american women completely lack. Having stronger ligaments and strong posture is about the only thing you can do to change the state fo things there.

i myself have benefitted beyond description from overcoming my cuturally instilled feminine issues. i do not think my leg hair is gross, i know my breasts hang just how God and Mother Nature intended... I have shaved off my head hair countless times and discovered that i am still a woman, even without my hair! I urge everyone to recover from the trauma that our society does to females. You dont have to then live like a grunchy hippie- i shave my legs off and on, and love to be 'pretty'... but i have a great secret in my heart, that these things are not required of me in order to be attractive... i am valuable without them. I want my daughter to know this secret from the beginning! ok enough of that babble...

when i was pregnant with ds, i went to buy nursing bras at a special nursing bra store. The owner , a woman and mother, was really nice, but she said something that disturbed me so that i will never forget it.

I asked if after the baby if i would have to wear a bra every day (i didnt know what breastfeeding was going to be like...) And she says, "Well, you do if you dont want Serenghetti Boobs! Yk, no one wants to look like those women!"

At the moment i didnt say anything. But that is a perfect example of the attitude i refuse to instill in my kids, male and female.

I dont care what people think of me. I dont want my daughter to, either. And she should know she doesnt have to tolerate people so crude (like these alleged boys that might say nasty stuff about her...), or change her behavior to suit them or anyone else. i wouldnt tolerate it, why should she have to?

tabitha


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Right on Tabitha!!









I too have shaved my head and it was one of the most freeing experiences I ever had!

Quote:

I urge everyone to recover from the trauma that our society does to females
Perfect! Exactly!


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## Suzannah (Nov 19, 2001)

I think it's all about comfort, with dd's body and herself. If she runs and they hurt, get 'em a little support. If nips show through and she is a bit modest, get her a cami w/a shelf bra.

I have teeny girls, but right before my period they hurt like hell; bras make them feel a little snug and cozy, almost like a sling. Good luck, and happy birthday to your dd...


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## nikirj (Oct 1, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by Arduinna_
*
I too have shaved my head and it was one of the most freeing experiences I ever had!
*
\

Sorry to get OT - but I really want to do this too! My DH keeps saying it would be a bad idea and talking me out of it (he says everyone will assume I have cancer or something, and he just can't wait for his friends to start asking if 'it's in remission').


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## alsoSarah (Apr 29, 2002)

nikirj, I think you should go for it! I've shaved mine a few times, and I always love it!

peace,
alsoSarah


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

I did shave my head because chemo was making my hair so thin that it looked bad. But don't let that stop you from shaving it. No one ever said a word to me about my lack of hair and only wore a hat if it was really cold outside. I didn't do the razor shave though, just used the really short clippers so I had about 1/4 ince or so.

regarding bra wearing for teens, my point was that if they want to wear one fine. But FORCING it because of our own issues and insecurities and fears is not helping our dd's.


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## tabitha (Sep 10, 2002)

more OT : :LOL

i first shaved mine at 16, and my first words were, "OMG no one is ever going to find me attractive ever again". I am glad i shed that complex. I kept it shaved (all the way down) or super short for years. i had a andful of losers give me trouble about it, but ill tell you it weeded out a lot of people i didnt want to know anyway. I also never had trouble with people finding me attractive! it was very liberating. i grew my hair again when pg with ds and shave it off again this last summer. DH loved it.

ok thanks for tolerating my OT, tabitha


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## eilonwy (Apr 3, 2003)

When I was 10, I had a couple of trainer bras. I practiced with the hooks and then I stopped wearing them. Six months later, just about a week shy of my 11th birthday, I went to bed a little girl and woke up a woman, literally going from a 14 slim and a board chest to a size 2 and a 34 B overnight. I woke up that morning and went to get dressed in my school uniform which was identical to the one I'd worn the day before only to be unable to button the shirt and to have my waist smaller and my hips bigger so the kilt didn't fit. I stood in the bathroom for half an hour in tears because I couldn't get my shirt to button, my mother banging on the door telling me I was going to be late. I kept telling her that the shirt didn't fit and she said that I was being ridiculous, I'd worn an identical shirt the day before and it fit just fine. Finally, I got the shirt buttoned and opened the bathroom door. My breasts popped out, a tiny pearlized button hit my mother in the face and she said "Oh my God!!!" I was in tears, and very unhappy. I ended up wearing one of my older brother's polo shirts under a sweatshirt to school that day (which was ridiculous because it was so warm).

That afternoon, I came home and my mother had been downtown. She had purchased a few different sizes and styles of bras. I tried them on, and a lightly-padded 34 B was what fit me, so she returned the others and bought another one. I wore those two bras for the next 5 or 6 weeks and then was on to a C-cup with no padding. By the end of 6th grade, I was in a D and by the end of 8th grade a DD.

I can only think of a handful of times since that fateful morning that I've gone out in public without a bra on. I needed them to make my clothing fit me, and to feel comfortable. I can remember running to catch a bus one morning and one of my breasts popping out of my bra and hitting me in the chin, causing me to bite my tounge. I can remember all kinds of negative attention for not wearing a bra, but when I did wear one I was much more comfortable and therefore more confident. True, there was a group of boys who thought bra snapping was cute, but they were looked down upon by everyone else as very immature.

Okay, so to sum up: my early bra experiences are associated with a great deal of stress, especially that first day. If you are so lucky as to have a daughter who grows slowly, over a period of time, my advice is to teach her all about bras: the different styles, why some people wear them and some people don't, etc. The same way you might teach her about high heels or makeup or tampons. I plan to discuss this with my own daughter/s (should I have any!) before it happens, because of my own traumatic experience. Just as I hope to discuss menstruation and fertility before it becomes an issue.

Oh... and my breasts were perky until post-engorgement. Even as an H/I in late pregnancy, they were perky. They looked seriously fake. :LOL








T I have shaved my head a few times and I loved it... my only advice is not to do it while it's cold outside. The first time I did it was in December and boy, was that a mistake! :LOL


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## Mamid (Nov 7, 2002)

my mother was in denial that I was developing at 9. At 10, the other girls in my class were asking why I wasn't wearing a bra. And not in the nice way either.

So at one point I told my mother I needed one and that the girls in class said I did. She went into hysterics. You know the type - "if Jenny jumped off a cliff would you?" type of hysterics.

I ended up getting a bra within a week anyway.







:

I got my period when I was 11.5 Jan 2. I remember well because I had a bladder infection two months earlier and I told my mother I was bleeding this time and it was my period. She demanded to inspect me like she had when I had the bladder infection. Then I had a small cut and she thought that was the problem. It wasn't. Anyway, I refused to let her into the bathroom and again she had more hysterics. Took me an hour to convince her that it was my period and not another bladder infection!

It was almost as if she didn't want to believe I was developing. I had been 96lbs for 6months+ and had been having vaginal discharge and knew from a book that I read that if a girl is about 100lbs for about 6 months to a year, and has a vaginal discharge she can expect her period. I estimated that I would get it between January 1 and April 1. Little did I realize I was right.

I was a D cup by the end of 7th grade and a DD by the end of 12th. I went from 96lbs to 150 in the span of 6 months, but it took me 5 more years to grow into my weight.

Now, I'm a J. *sigh*


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## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

Quote:

_Originally posted by Arduinna_
*I don't believe that the way to teach our dd's to be body confidant is to force them to wear bras for their protection. In fact I believe it just instills an attitude of fear. It is perpetuating the idea that girls are somehow responsable for boys behavior. Or others behavior. Of course none of us wants our kids to be teased, but by putting the focus of changing on our dd's sends the message that they can control others. That as long as they are invisible then they will be left alone.

Men do not rape because nipples are visible through a shirt. And to imply that hiding our dd's away will protect them is misguided at best and at worst damaging to their self worth and identity.*

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!. I was trying to figure out how to say that very thing but couldn't find the right words. I will not make my daughter a victom by default,just becasue there are sick people in this world. Making her feel ashamed won't get rid of those disgusting people, nor will making her wear a bra.


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## eilonwy (Apr 3, 2003)

Quote:

_Originally posted by Mamid_
*I had been 96lbs for 6months+ and had been having vaginal discharge and knew from a book that I read that if a girl is about 100lbs for about 6 months to a year, and has a vaginal discharge she can expect her period. I estimated that I would get it between January 1 and April 1. Little did I realize I was right.
*








T I didn't know that, but it was definately true in my case. I got my period on April 18, exactly 6 months before my 11th birthday. (Yeah, I got my period before the boobs. :LOL) I'm a J/K cup now, too.







: Ain't life grand?


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## elyice (Apr 7, 2003)

I HAVE shaved my head. It does take intestinal fortitude to buck the ideas of feminie beauty and create your own.

I dO NOT like that my nipple and belly button are conversing. Support from a bra does help support and prolong the stretching and natural shape all of our boobs will take.

To each her own. If you want yours to swing over your shoulder like a continental soldier, fine:LOL .
:







Elyice


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## Penalt (Jan 28, 2004)

Bra's are ok....but there are alternatives. Being in the SCA I see a lot of women in bodices or light corsets. Just fit them correctly and I am told they quite comfy and supportive.

Not exactly helpful for a developing girl, which my DL is _praying_ we get this time. She doesn't want to be outnumbered anymore.


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## mischievium (Feb 9, 2003)

Just another voice of BTDT.

I too developed early and I seriously resisted wearing a bra. My mom did kinda force me to start wearing one ... at age 11 ... at size 32B. In my case, my mom "made" me wear a bra to leave the house-- which meant I learned to take it off under my shirt and either took it off on my way to the school bus stop or in the bathroom once I got to school, then put it back on on the way back from the bus stop or before I left school. After awhile, I'd forget to take it off and I adjusted to wearing a bra. I did get teased, but not for long.
We could argue about whether her insistence about my wearing a bra was appropriate or not, but that in and of itself was not the issue. What made it problematic is that she took my resistance as stubborness and never addressed the issues behind it. The issues? I didn't want to be different, or get teased, or have my bra strap snapped -- which *totally* did happen. I wasn't ready for the changes happening to my body or what they meant. I wasn't ready for boys (or girls) to be commenting on my breasts or looking at me in a sexual way. I certainly did *not* want my period (which showed up at about the same time). I'm not sure there was a good way for my mom to handle this, though. I did not want to talk about any of it *AT ALL.* I just didn't want it to be happening and my way of handling it was to try and deny that it was happening --- and talking about it with my mother meant it was happening. Ahhhh, preteens







.
The "ladies" are considerably larger now and I am one who requires a bra for comfort. I have definitely considered getting a reduction-- but I want to breastfeed and don't care to take the risk right now, so I will make that decision later.

I don't think there's a universal right way to handle this issue. Each girl/woman's experience and needs are different (hence the variety of replies). Just try to support you daughter (no pun intended :LOL) and try to find a compromise that you feel is appropriate and you both can live with.


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## Mamid (Nov 7, 2002)

I was 11 (or was it 12? I think 12 cause I was menstruating) and visited my grandparents in Ontario since we lived in BC by then.

My _grandfather_, a man who has been my substitute father all my life at that point, grabbed my bra back and would snap it saying "Robin Hood."

Not once, not twice. But several times daily when no other female was around to see. I complained to my aunt and she told me to essentially "get over it." That he had done it to her and her sisters (my mother and other aunt) and it wasn't a big deal.

You know.. the day he died, I was glad. That meant he wouldn't do anything like that or anything worse to any of his granddaughters.....


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## homebirthx2 (Jan 3, 2004)

My middle child keeps telling us she will not ever have a period nor will she ever wear a bra. We continue to tell her that someday she will have one and will need to wear a bra. Her viewpoint is they are gross, so much for explaining life to a nine year old.


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