# MIL making DD call her "Mom"**UGLY UPDATE POST 65**



## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

How would you handle this?

We live with my in-laws. We rent out their basement apartment. Long story, I've gotten into detail in previous posts so if you're super curious you could look that up if you wish.

My MIL makes my 2yo DD call her "Mom". She doesn't do it around us, but whenever DD comes back from spending time with her she refers to her as "Mom". MIL in the past has flaunted this in a way.. asking DD who "mama" was and who "mom" was. (I'm "Mama").

We have asked her to stop. We're fairly young parents- 20yo and MIL is young herself- in her late 30s. She has said she'd stop- but she doesn't. She jokes that DD will be allowed to call her "grandma" when DH & I graduate from college







DD _knows_ that MIL is her grandma, but otherwise usually refers to her by her first name (which doesn't bug me too much- we refer to her as grandma when we speak about her, she just calls her by her first name because she hears others do it).

The same goes for my FIL- he really doesn't care one way or the other, but MIL has started referring to him as "Papi" to DD. We refer to him as grandpa but now DD calls him "Papi" which means "Father" in spanish. She calls DH "Daddy", but still.. it bugs me. DH and I have started referring to FIL as "grandpapi" and it is starting to stick- but MIL just won't kick the "Mom" and "Papi" thing.

How would you feel about this? What would you do? It's getting really annoying and quite frankly I don't like DD calling anyone else their mother.

(Note: My mother passed away and my father isn't in the picture anymore, so these are DDs only grandparents (though she has a set of great-grandparents, "Bisa" and "Abuela") and I really don't want to downplay the grandparent thing by calling them names that would otherwise refer to me and DH. Maybe I should get my head out of the clouds... but either way, this really irks me)


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## rightkindofme (Apr 14, 2008)

As long as you live in her house you are going to have a hard time fighting it and setting boundaries. Get out as quickly as possible. Then you can start enforcing some boundaries there. It sounds like a hard situation. I'm sorry.


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## E.V. Lowi (Sep 16, 2005)

How awful. I don't blame you for being irritated. It's cruel of her.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *E.V. Lowi* 
How awful. I don't blame you for being irritated. It's cruel of her.



















I like what Oprah said:

"We teach people how to treat us."

Tell your MIL she can't spend any "alone" time with DD if she is going to continue doing this. And mean it. Your dh should tell her this, as well.


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## baglady (Jul 13, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rightkindofme* 
As long as you live in her house you are going to have a hard time fighting it and setting boundaries. Get out as quickly as possible. Then you can start enforcing some boundaries there. It sounds like a hard situation. I'm sorry.



















You've really done all you can by asking her to stop. She's clearly not going to. Figuring out an exit plan seems like your only option.

I'm sorry.


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

It sounds like what you really need is a term for grandma that doesn't make MIL feel old. Being in my late 30s, I can understand that she isn't quite ready to feel like a grandma. It also must get odd when she is in public with your DD and there are women her own age who are moms of kids your DD's age.

Would both of you be comfortable with DD calling her "aunt," sticking to her first name, using grandma from another language (abuela, oma, or somesuch) or just an endering word. We called my dad's mother "nanny" which actually means grandma in Irish Gaelic, not a nurse maid like in English. We called my mom's mother "gammy" b/c my oldest sister couldn't pronounce grandma and it just stuck. Here is a whole article with ideas, and another.

Papi is a pretty common grandfather term, so that wouldn't bug me. Though a few people use it for fathers, I would say more people in the US use it for GP.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eepster* 
It sounds like what you really need is a term for grandma that doesn't make MIL feel old. Being in my late 30s, I can understand that she isn't quite ready to feel like a grandma. It also must get odd when she is in public with your DD and there are women her own age who are moms of kids your DD's age.

Yes, my mother refuses to be "grandma," "granny" or any other "old lady" names. Though I was 25 when DS was born, she was only 17 when I was born, so she was in her early 40s. She just felt that signified a move into being "old." The kids call her Mimi, which she likes much better. Perhaps you can brainstorm a way to make her more comfortable with a "grandma" term.


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## Jaesun's Dad (Feb 19, 2010)

Since your mom is younger than me I can kinda dig not wanting to be called grandma or anything close to it. My best friend from my school days was a grandfather two years before I became a first time dad so I'm new to being old 

Maybe you could compromise on something? My dad hasn't met my son yet but he's expressed a desire to be known as "big pop" which is fine with me. I think of myself more as dad than pop.


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## fierrbugg (Jul 24, 2006)

Is it maybe a cultural thing? I know my sister's sons' grandparents did this especially w/ dn1. She was lucky that they lived in another state and it always confused the kid - because they would do the same thing about asking him who Mom was. They'd say something like give Mom a kiss (they may have gone w/ Mommy though) and he always went to his mom.







I think they tried to do Papi for the dad too? If I remember correctly they are from Chile maybe?

My sis was able to stand her ground w/ them about the name thing and a whole host of other things (they aren't too fond of her because she didn't just fall in line w/ whatever they wanted - but







) now all 3 dn's call them grandma and grandpa - but they aren't the _fun_ grandma and grandpa (those are my parents).


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## paintedfire (May 3, 2010)

While I do think it will be harder since you live with them I don't think that has anything to do with it. You said you rent their downstairs apartment, so I'm assuming you pay rent. If you have a lease, then all the better.

Your MIL is wrong. Period. Tell her this. Have your DH tell her this. Until she gets it, keep telling her this. Your kid. Not hers. Your MIL sounds pretty dense about this so it'll probably take some time, but it's worth it. She needs to be put in her place, so to speak. Your husband is her child. The baby you gave birth to is not.

ETA: Not that it would be okay if even you didn't rent and you just lived with them - it still wouldn't be. But if you're renting and she's still doing this? Then I'd best keep my mouth shut, lest I risk a UAV.


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## VK1987 (Apr 28, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *paintedfire* 
Your MIL is wrong. Period. Tell her this. Have your DH tell her this. Until she gets it, keep telling her this. Your kid. Not hers. Your MIL sounds pretty dense about this so it'll probably takes some time, but it's worth it. She needs to be put in her place, so to speak. Your husband is her child. The baby you gave birth to is not.

Exactly.
If she is a young grandma who doesn't want to feel old, too bad! Doesn't erase the fact that she is Grandma and NOT Mom. This is completely bizarre and not okay. Whenever she refers to herself as Mom, correct her. Every. Single. Time.
It really does not matter that you live in her house, she still needs to respect you.


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## new2this (Feb 11, 2010)

The mom thing is not acceptable at all and I would correct it each time. But if its an issue about not wanting to be called grandma why not offer some help in choosing a different name. The Papi thing is a pretty common grandparent term from what I have noticed. So that one wouldn't bother me.


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## ~Charlie's~Angel~ (Mar 17, 2008)

I dont think it matters how "young" of a grandma she is. She is still your DDs GRANDMOTHER. I think her trying to train YOUR daughter to call HER mom is cruel, mean spirited, and just morally wrong. I think you should start looking for an exit strategy pronto, but in the mean time, you may need to be a bit firmer with her, and offer no alone time if possible.

FYI, that is totally NOT normal behavior, no matter how young the grandmother is.


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## sahli29 (Jan 23, 2004)

Talk to the MIL.It will annoy her and she might not stop,but you need to tell her it is not OK.Tell her every time. Papi seems ok,but mom and momma is just to close. Need something different.My kids call my mom nenie which is their version of the turk gm term nene.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

I'd say keep at it. Keep telling her that it is not cool. Tell her flat out "You are not her mom." Tell your daughter "she is not your mom."

I would be way beyond pissed. I would be furious.


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## theoldmommers (Sep 15, 2009)

I agree with PP's that you should definitely work out something to call her that everyone is comfortable with.

I thought I'd mention my own history though. My brother and I always called my maternal grandmother "mom" or "mom + her last name". We never considered her our mom. In our child minds it meant grandmom even though it was the same word.


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

Regardless of whether she thinks she's old enough to be a grandma, she is. There's no way I could let that go on, you have to insist that she comes up with something besides Mom. It's not fair to you and it sounds like your daughter is a little confused by the whole thing anyways. Sit down with mil and tell her that your daughter won't be calling her Mom and you two can come up with an alternate if she's not happy with Grandma.

I feel for you though, my mil always refers to herself as Mom to my kids. Dh and I have corrected her many times and now she will at least stop and rephrase using "Grandma". Course my kids have absolutely no problem letting her know that she's Grandma, not Mom.


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## AmyKT (Aug 20, 2009)

It is absolutely your right to stop this immediately. If you are not ok with it, it's not ok.

Just wanted to add a personal story similar to theoldmommers, though. Growing up, my best friend called her mother "mama," her maternal grandmother who lived next door was "mom" and her paternal grandmother was "mama margaret." These grandmothers were traditional grandmother age and not at all vain (esp. not the "mom" one), so I don't know how it got started, but my friend was never confused and never acted like grandma was actually her mom. I always thought it was weird and figured it was pretty uncommon, but I guess I was wrong.

I'm sure they did not insist that they be called that over grandma -- it somehow just happened -- and what your MIL is doing is way uncool.


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## newmommy7-08 (Feb 2, 2008)

It doesn't matter a bit if you live with her. I'd tell her the only person in the house to call her mom are the one(s) she raised! You are your daughters mother and I think it's absolutely horrible that she is using your age and her own insecurities about getting older to confuse a child. It wouldn't matter if you were 15, 20, 25, or 30. She's still grandma, and you are the only MOM, MAMA, MOMMY, MOTHER your child has!

If she's not listening to you you need to explain to your DH how much this hurts you, and he NEEDS to lay down the law to his mother!

I am absolutely furious that she's putting you through this!


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## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy7-08* 
It doesn't matter a bit if you live with her. I'd tell her the only person in the house to call her mom are the one(s) she raised! You are your daughters mother and I think it's absolutely horrible that she is using your age and her own insecurities about getting older to confuse a child. It wouldn't matter if you were 15, 20, 25, or 30. She's still grandma, and you are the only MOM, MAMA, MOMMY, MOTHER your child has!

If she's not listening to you you need to explain to your DH how much this hurts you, and he NEEDS to lay down the law to his mother!

I am absolutely furious that she's putting you through this!


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

I don't really understand the comments about how maybe the MIL just doesn't want to use an old-sounding term like "grandma." That may be true on some level, but of all the alternate names she could choose from, she picks MOM. That's no accident, and has nothing to do with simply not wanting to sound old. It's a calculated manipulation, especially when she continues doing it after she's been asked not to. Grandparents who love and respect their children and their partners don't say, "Gee, I'm uncomfortable with being called Grandma, how about another name? Oh I know, I'll be Mom!"









That said, OP, living on your own is the best way to gain complete autonomy. Your MIL is behaving inappropriately (and, IMO, maliciously), but unfortunately she may think she holds some power over you because you live in her home. As frustrating as it must be now, this is a good lesson for you guys for later -- she's showing you that accepting help from her comes with strings attached, so knowing that can inform your decisions about whether to accept any help from her in future years.


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:


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## cileag (Aug 16, 2008)

This wouldn't necessarily bother me---my mother was "Mom" to my niece (her step niece) until she was about 6 or 7 just because she heard us call her that and she could easily differentiate between "Mommy" or "Mom".

My good friend's mother goes by "Mom O" to her grandkids. She might not actually be doing it to intentionally bother you, it might be what she is used to being called and is comfortable with--and she still probably feels like a Mom in the situation you're in--you guys living with her etc.

BUT it bothers you, so I agree with the others that you and her need to sit down and find a name she likes.

My MIL is "Gigi", but she also objected to "Grandma".


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## ciga (Aug 10, 2009)

It sounds like she is daunted by the idea of being called "grandma" so maybe you can meet halfway

I call my dad papi and I called my grandfather "papi andres". All the grandchildren in my family now call my dad "papi chico". We called my grandmother "mami carmen"
the mami and papi at the beginnings were never confusing for us and having their real names after made sure there was no confusion when we were talking about them.

could you just ask your MIL to try out "Mami" and then her name? and same for the FIL?


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

I understand everyone who is saying that; no matter how much she doesn't want to feel old enough to be a GM, calling herself "mom" is just wrong and she needs to just stop. Philosophically I get your point.

The problem is, that the OP has already tried just telling her to stop and it hasn't changed anything.

By looking at the motivations behind the behavior and trying to understand them, it becomes easier to find a solution. If the OP wants actual change and not just to feel she is in the right, she needs to work with her MIL.

Think of it as practicing gentle disciple on adults. When our children are having temper tantrums or other wise misbehaving, we always try to figure out what is behind the behavior and talk about it, instead of just spanking them till they do as they are told.

Believe me, I'm all for saying that MIL behavior has crossed a line at some point and cutting off the relationship. I haven't spoken to mine in over 2 years. However, if this issue could be easily remedied by just acknowledging MIL's feelings, then isn't it worth a try. Especially considering the living situation.


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## texmati (Oct 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *E.V. Lowi* 
How awful. I don't blame you for being irritated. It's cruel of her.









this.

My mil lives with us, and ITA about what other's are saying about boundries.

Having your MIL want to be called mom is horrible. My mom's mom wants to be called grandma instead of great grandma or super grandma-- and my mom put a stop to *that*.

And if she doesn't want to be called grandma, start having your dd call her aunt, or just by her first name.


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:

I bet just an hour of this would get her very motivated to coming up with a compromise.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:

rotfl!


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## peainthepod (Jul 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:











I would be so livid if my MIL tried something like this. Living in their house has _nothing_ to do with it. I do think you should work on moving out as soon as you possibly can. It sounds like she doesn't respect your boundaries and this probably won't be the last time you have to set her straight. Honestly, I'd start limiting or ending their time alone together if she's unable to respect this basic, commonsense rule.

But definitely don't tolerate it, and don't let anyone tell you to let it go, or that you're overreacting. You aren't. Just reading the OP triggered my mama bear instinct and I'm furious on your behalf. How dare she?


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

If she is calling the grandfather Papi, which I've heard for a lot of grandfathers too, why not Mami instead of Mom?


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limabean* 
I don't really understand the comments about how maybe the MIL just doesn't want to use an old-sounding term like "grandma." That may be true on some level, but of all the alternate names she could choose from, she picks MOM. That's no accident, and has nothing to do with simply not wanting to sound old. It's a calculated manipulation, especially when she continues doing it after she's been asked not to. Grandparents who love and respect their children and their partners don't say, "Gee, I'm uncomfortable with being called Grandma, how about another name? Oh I know, I'll be Mom!"









That said, OP, living on your own is the best way to gain complete autonomy. Your MIL is behaving inappropriately (and, IMO, maliciously), but unfortunately she may think she holds some power over you because you live in her home. As frustrating as it must be now, this is a good lesson for you guys for later -- she's showing you that accepting help from her comes with strings attached, so knowing that can inform your decisions about whether to accept any help from her in future years.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:

love it!!!!!!!!!!


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eepster* 

Think of it as practicing gentle disciple on adults. When our children are having temper tantrums or other wise misbehaving, we always try to figure out what is behind the behavior and talk about it, instead of just spanking them till they do as they are told.


We shouldn't have to raise our parents.


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
We shouldn't have to raise our parents.

Just wait till they reach their 80s, then they start to _really_ need parenting.


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## Heavenly (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eepster* 
Just wait till they reach their 80s, then they start to _really_ need parenting.

I consider this comment ageist.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heavenly* 
I consider this comment ageist.

As a daughter of an elderly man, I see this more as truthful than as ageist. Although I think "caretaking" is a more accurate word.
Of course, there are always exceptions and I'm sure there are some 80 year olds who don't need caretaking.


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## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:









Gigi for short.


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## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limabean* 
I don't really understand the comments about how maybe the MIL just doesn't want to use an old-sounding term like "grandma." That may be true on some level, but of all the alternate names she could choose from, she picks MOM. That's no accident, and has nothing to do with simply not wanting to sound old. It's a calculated manipulation, especially when she continues doing it after she's been asked not to. Grandparents who love and respect their children and their partners don't say, "Gee, I'm uncomfortable with being called Grandma, how about another name? Oh I know, I'll be Mom!"









That said, OP, living on your own is the best way to gain complete autonomy. Your MIL is behaving inappropriately (and, IMO, maliciously), but unfortunately she may think she holds some power over you because you live in her home. As frustrating as it must be now, this is a good lesson for you guys for later -- she's showing you that accepting help from her comes with strings attached, so knowing that can inform your decisions about whether to accept any help from her in future years.









Great post!


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## _ktg_ (Jul 11, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limabean* 
I don't really understand the comments about how maybe the MIL just doesn't want to use an old-sounding term like "grandma." That may be true on some level, but of all the alternate names she could choose from, she picks MOM. That's no accident, and has nothing to do with simply not wanting to sound old. It's a calculated manipulation, especially when she continues doing it after she's been asked not to. Grandparents who love and respect their children and their partners don't say, "Gee, I'm uncomfortable with being called Grandma, how about another name? Oh I know, I'll be Mom!"









That said, OP, living on your own is the best way to gain complete autonomy. Your MIL is behaving inappropriately (and, IMO, maliciously), but unfortunately she may think she holds some power over you because you live in her home. As frustrating as it must be now, this is a good lesson for you guys for later -- she's showing you that accepting help from her comes with strings attached, so knowing that can inform your decisions about whether to accept any help from her in future years.









well said!


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## liberal_chick (May 22, 2005)

My favorite people in the world are my grandparents, Mom and Pop. I have a mother, she is Mama (even at age 27). I never had a problem differentating that Mom was not my mother. B/c I love and admire her so much, I'm hoping that one day I'll be "Mom" to my grandchildren. I sure hope that is ok with my future DILs.

I totally get that you don't like it, though. You've asked her to stop and she hasn't, which is a boundry issue. No advice, just a







: and a "good luck" from me!


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## CherryBombMama (Jan 25, 2010)

didnt read all the replies, but i live with my in laws, and my MIL does the same thing. ds cant talk yet though, so she refers to herself as "mama" refers to FIL as "papi" and calls ds "her baby."

ive figured out there is no way to MAKE her stop, but i can rain on her parade every time she says those things by happily reminding her that I AM HIS MAMA, my dh is his papi, and he is MY BABY. i say something every single time just to watch her evil smile fade away.

example -

MIL to my ds, "come here, my baby, let mama pick you up."
Me, "um, your baby is away at work right now, and _I_ am his mama, thankyouverymuch." *smirk*

it always ruins her day







but she honestly does it on purpose


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## Earthy Mama (Jun 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CherryBombMama* 
didnt read all the replies, but i live with my in laws, and my MIL does the same thing. ds cant talk yet though, so she refers to herself as "mama" refers to FIL as "papi" and calls ds "her baby."

ive figured out there is no way to MAKE her stop, but i can rain on her parade every time she says those things by happily reminding her that I AM HIS MAMA, my dh is his papi, and he is MY BABY. i say something every single time just to watch her evil smile fade away.

example -

MIL to my ds, "come here, my baby, let mama pick you up."
Me, "um, your baby is away at work right now, and _I_ am his mama, thankyouverymuch." *smirk*

it always ruins her day







but she honestly does it on purpose

why why why would she do that?? It just blows my mind.

Completely off topic (but kind of similar) my ex-MIL and I are still close. I am remarried and am expecting. She tells me that she can't wait to meet her new grandchild. Uh? what? And wants to take him/her with her when she takes my other two to visit their father!!!


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## MaerynPearl (Jun 21, 2008)

My kids call my mother Mammaw and my MIL Nana... neither for the lack of wanting to be called grandma but that they are just more special names for the same thing.

It REALLY helps too, since if MIL was Gramma Sheryl... they would have Gramma Sheryl and Gramma Cheryl (my step-mother who does not get a special name as shes never been very nice to me or my children...)

all of their grandpas are Poppa.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

I think that is overstepping the boundaries pretty badly.. I'd make her stop. Not to mention it may confuse your child.


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## Bellabaz (Feb 27, 2008)

I have read about this a few times on here. It is one of the weirdest things I have heard of and frankly, quite creepy. I have no advice just a hug and i hope you find a solution. Young or not, you and your partner deserve respect.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bellabaz* 
I have read about this a few times on here. It is one of the weirdest things I have heard of and frankly, quite creepy.

Agreed.

I find this whole "I'm too young to be a grandma" thing to be totally screwed up. If you have a child at an earlier than usual age, you have a better-than-average chance of having a (or more than one) grandchild at an earlier than usual age. That's just a biological reality.

I just can't wrap my brain around it. I have a 16 year gap between my oldest and my youngest...and one of my oldest's classmates had a baby last week. I could _easily_ be a grandmother while I still have a child in diapers. I honestly don't think that's likely to happen, honestly, but if it does, it won't bother me in the least. Deciding I'm "too young" to be a grandma when I _am_ a grandma is...kind of whacky. "Grandma" is a label for a particular biological (usually) relationship and putting a different label on it doesn't change the biology.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

Yeah, I think the "too young to be a grandma" thing is funny, too. I'm glad that my mom, although relatively young (mid-40's) has no problem with it. Her SIL even asked "So what are you going to be called?" when I had my first last year-- Mom just blinked at her and said "Grandma."


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## pauletoy (Aug 26, 2007)

I would put a stop to that now! It is just so disrespectful especially if you and your dh have asked her to stop.


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## DoulaVallere (May 29, 2009)

Wow, I would be LIVID. My MIL feels like she's too young to be a grandma, too...um...she was like 50 when my eldest was born.







Anyway, she does NOT like grandma, so she picked Mimi. I thought it was kinda a dumb reason to pick a name, but oh well...the biggest issue we have with it is that I have a good friend whose NAME is Mimi and if I talk about us going to her house to play with her kids, my kids think that means they are going to my MIL's house. So even that is very confusing!

But if she tried to have my kids call her mom or mama, WW3 would begin.


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## gbailey (Mar 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CherryBombMama* 
didnt read all the replies, but i live with my in laws, and my MIL does the same thing. ds cant talk yet though, so she refers to herself as "mama" refers to FIL as "papi" and calls ds "her baby."

ive figured out there is no way to MAKE her stop, but i can rain on her parade every time she says those things by happily reminding her that I AM HIS MAMA, my dh is his papi, and he is MY BABY. i say something every single time just to watch her evil smile fade away.

example -

MIL to my ds, "come here, my baby, let mama pick you up."
Me, "um, your baby is away at work right now, and _I_ am his mama, thankyouverymuch." *smirk*

it always ruins her day







but she honestly does it on purpose

I love how you deal with your MIL









To the OP, I don't think living in her home is an excuse for her to be disrespectful or to overstep her boundaries. She needs to hear firmly from you and her son that she is nottotell her grandchild to call her mom. She isn't her mother. Period. If she continues, I would cease allowing my child to spend time alone with her. Hopefully you can move out soon and be away from her.


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

Thank you everyone! newmommy7-08 & limabean.. very good posts. Thanks to everyone









My father (no longer in the picture) is 60yo. When DD1 was born, my younger half siblings were 2 and 4- and my father was totally okay with being called grandpapa, even though he had two very young ones himself.

I'm going to keep holding my position on this and hope that things get better.


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## bluebirdiemama (May 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
Tell your MIL she can't spend any "alone" time with DD if she is going to continue doing this. And mean it. Your dh should tell her this, as well.

Agreed. If this doesn't help I would inform her that you and your dh will be finding a new place to live, if she can't respect the fact that YOU are the mother, and not her.
I hope whatever you do, this situation improves for you. As pp-ers have I said, I do not think this is acceptable either. At all.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

I think mama definitely crosses a line. However if she does not want to be grandma I think your hsould respect that. but I would ask her to come up with something else (and maybe brainstorm with her) that sheis comfortable with. Something that is not a "mom" word. I think Papi is just fine. My grandpa was Pa and my kids grandpa is Papa. Id you husbvand goes by something disticyively different I don't see what the problem is.

anyway, I think it will help if you can help her find a name she can embrace. She clearly hates grandma and her grandchild calling her by her first name won't do at all. Thats just sad.







Really I think it is between the two of them what they call each other and not really our place as mothers to dictate. So long as they don't go around expecting to be called the same thing as us. and I think mom and mama are just to close.

Some unusual things people i know have called their young grandmas: Honey (I think this is so cute), mommom, two mama (this was actually my great grandmas because someone was explaining to my then two year old cousin its her mom's mom. and she exlaimed "two mamas?" ) nana, Bebe, really any term of endearment will work.


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## rightkindofme (Apr 14, 2008)

This isn't very nice of me, but I strongly dislike my partners parents so I religiously refer to them as Grandmother and Grandfather _Last Name_. They are not being encouraged to have a close relationship because they are crazy. The formality is a buzzkill.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rightkindofme* 
This isn't very nice of me, but I strongly dislike my partners parents so I religiously refer to them as Grandmother and Grandfather _Last Name_. They are not being encouraged to have a close relationship because they are crazy. The formality is a buzzkill.

I actually had a grandmother who INSISTED we call her "grandmother." That tells you a lot about her!!


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## ssh (Aug 12, 2007)

My 3.5 year old granddaughter calls me grandma. I also have a 4.5 year old DD. Last time we visited they both started calling me firstname about half the time, I guess the little girls felt weird one calling me mommy and the other calling me grandma. I really don't understand the whole "I'm too young to be grandma". My granddaughter calls her daddy's mom mimi and her daddy's stepmom is gigi.

My mother was from the deep south and we called our grandparents 'pretty momma' and 'big dad' when I was a kid. Mimi was pretty common with our friends though.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rightkindofme* 
This isn't very nice of me, but I strongly dislike my partners parents so I religiously refer to them as Grandmother and Grandfather _Last Name_. They are not being encouraged to have a close relationship because they are crazy. The formality is a buzzkill.


Careful with this. My mom did this. It did more to damage my relationship with my mom than it did with my grandparents (who I dearly loved). It made me think of my mom as cold and vindictive. Even as a small child I recognized her calling them gandmother and grandfather (when everyone else called them granny and pa) as just plain being mean and trying to keep me from liking them. It totally backfired.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ssh* 
My mother was from the deep south and we called our grandparents 'pretty momma' and 'big dad' when I was a kid. Mimi was pretty common with our friends though.

OMG!!!! That is about the sweetest thing EVER!!!


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## shanniesue2 (Jul 4, 2007)

I haven't read all the posts, but your OP gave me a thought... when you asked her to stop having your DD call you mom, did you just tell her that it bothers you b/c your the mom and that title ought to be reserved for you? Maybe you could have a conversation with her about the importance of the grandma role... and particularly it's perks... and tell her that since she is your DD's only grandma, that that makes her role extra special... make her role as grandma sound like just the absolute best thing in the whole wide world... and that you don't want your DD to miss out or to be confused about how great it is to be so close to grandma b/c she's calling her "mom." Maybe if you put it like that to your MIL, she will be more likely to follow through.


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## rightkindofme (Apr 14, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lilyka* 
Careful with this. My mom did this. It did more to damage my relationship with my mom than it did with my grandparents (who I dearly loved). It made me think of my mom as cold and vindictive. Even as a small child I recognized her calling them gandmother and grandfather (when everyone else called them granny and pa) as just plain being mean and trying to keep me from liking them. It totally backfired.

They live several thousand miles away and despite repeated invitations have never met my kid. I'd be pretty shocked if I look like the bad guy.


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## E.V. Lowi (Sep 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
We shouldn't have to raise our parents.

..


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## ashleyhaugh (Jun 23, 2005)

i havent read the entire thread, but how do you feel about something like mommom? my mom actually preferred "grandma" as opposed to some of the cutesier nicknames, but my 2 year old decided on mommom and so thats what it is, lol... hes got a mommom and a pop-pop, both of which are names he chose.

id seen it mentioned on here before, and i admit, i thought it was kind of weird. but he likes it, and he definitly know the difference between mommom and mama (or mommy, depending on his mood, lol)

that aside, it stinks that shes basically forcing it on your daughter, and completely disrespecting your wishes. she needs to stop


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## f&p'smama (Sep 3, 2006)

Her comment that she can be called grandma when you and your husband finish college is so passive aggressive! She is making it clear that she does not view your or your husband as adults. Is she providing child care while you are in school? I wondered if that's partly where this is coming from.

I'd try to have a calm conversation about it and why it is so hurtful some night after the little ones are asleep and let her know the damage it is doing to your relationship.

My MIL at 70-something with a 42-year old DD wasn't ready to become a grandma when SIL had her baby and she spent a ridiculous amount of time trying to come up with silly names she could be called other than grandma. None stuck and she is Grandma First Name now.


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## Darlingricki74 (Mar 11, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Earthy Mama* 
Completely off topic (but kind of similar) my ex-MIL and I are still close. I am remarried and am expecting. She tells me that she can't wait to meet her new grandchild. Uh? what? And wants to take him/her with her when she takes my other two to visit their father!!!

We have a similar situation in our family, and it's worked out wonderfully. My brother's ex wife remarried and had a daughter. She's now almost 13, and I consider her my niece. She calls my parents grandma and grandpa. She visits them a lot, with her brother(their bio-grandson) and even without him sometimes(they live about 5 hours away)She has even occasionally gone with her brother to stay with his dad(my brother)-she doesn't think of him as dad like her brother does, but thinks of him more as an uncle. My parents recently took all their grandkids(well, all over age 6, not the babies) to Disneyland-including her. We all love her just as much as the others(in all honesty I think she's my mom's favorite though my mom would never admit to having a fave grandkid LOL ). There is NO difference in how she is treated by anyone in the family, she is 100% included as a grandchild(or niece), even as far as being equal with the bio-grandkids in my parents wills. So it's not always a bad thing! It just gives her more people who love her!

Anyway, sorry for the thread jack...on the original topic-No advice, but I would be furious! I just would not allow her to be alone with your dd as long as this is going on, and when she is with her in front of you I would correct her every time(and I would expect dh to talk to her!).


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

NOT SO GOOD *UPDATE.* Ugh.

Today, MIL and I took the kids swimming. On the way home, DD calls MIL grandma and she scoffs "Hah, I'm not going to be called grandma until your mommy and daddy graduate from the university!". I told her that it was unfair and she insisted but we were getting out of the car so I went on my way. At the table, DD called her grandma again and she said the same thing about graduating







I told her that it was very unfair. She said something about how if DD calls he grandma now then it's like my DH never went to college and will never go to college and that she's been let down (uh.. something along the lines of her dreams would be "crushed" just with different wording). Talk about self centeredness... Ugh. I mean, good, have hopes for your kids.. but don't be so ridiculous and take it out on your grandchildren!

Then she the cherry on the cake. Or however that saying goes (I'm just so infuriated!!!)

DH got home and we were still sitting eating. DD called her grandma AGAIN. She said her load of junk about the graduating thing and my husband attemted to set her straight. She then exclaimed (and lied!) that my DH made a DEAL WITH HER! A DEAL!! In this deal _supposedly_ she gets to be called grandma after we graduate. What?! My husband exclaimed that there was no such deal, MIL tells him that "NO, you can't change your mind". DH was really confused. On TOP of this, she goes as far to say that she WILL NOT RESPOND TO DD if she calls her "Grandma". WHAT?! You're going to ignore my child because you don't want to be called grandma? DD doesn't have ill-intentions. Ugh. I don't even know what to say or feel right now.

Oh, and just a note:
For us, in DHs culture, "Papi" is usually reserved for fathers. DH and I were talking today and the main reason why we're NOT okay with DD calling FIL "Papi" is because MIL is fueling all of it- it's not just a name for grandpa, it's a name for grandpa that in HER mind doesn't make him seem like grandpa. I totally understand that in other cases it would be fine as a grandparent name- but MIL has different intentions behind it. My DD has been calling him Grandpapi anyhow.

This just stinks. We really can NOT afford to move out. We're in a good amount of debt and are trying to pay it off- so until that's done (probably not until the beginning of next year) we're stuck here.


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

I'm surprised she thinks your dh can complete college if she thinks he's stupid enough to either make a deal like that or believe that he made a deal like that.

She does realize that she's destroying her chances of having a good relationship with your dd? If not, maybe your dh needs to lay it out for her. The choice is not between "mom" and "grandma" it's between "grandma" and "Ms. LastName the landlord".


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## ~Charlie's~Angel~ (Mar 17, 2008)

Im sorry, but I am having a hard time even understanding her "logic". What the hell does graduating college have to do with her being called Grandma, and instead, being called MOM, when she isnt the MOTHER? I just dont get it.

Im sorry, but she sounds toxic.


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

Why can;t you all come up with an acceptable alternative?


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## LROM (Sep 10, 2008)

I haven't read through the posts here, don't know what you've tried and not tried, but CLEARLY this situation is still not working for you. Have you tried basically just addressing your child directly every time she says it, something like "I don't know why it's so important to Grandma that she deny she's your grandma, but you know and I know she is." and then go back to your plate of food or whatever. Seriously, like EVERY time she says it you need a response to your child that helps your child not be confused, dismisses your MIL, and lets you keep gong with whatever.

Refuse to discuss it, tell her "You don't listen or have any respect for why it's damaging for you to keep asking DC, so there's nothing to talk about." Period.

From what little I've read, i can't see how any other appraoch is going to work befcore you move out. YOu are simply way too wrapped up in this dynamic and your frustration rewards her every time, that's obviously what she wants from this.


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## yokosmile (Apr 22, 2007)

Imagine the peace you'd feel in your heart if you'd just let this go. You can't change MIL - only how you react to her. You have to live with her until you're in a better financial state; that's your reality. When she behaves in a way you feel is inappropriate, you can choose to be stoic and kind and turn the other cheek or get outraged - the choice is yours. We're all fighting a hard battle, even your MIL.


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## MaerynPearl (Jun 21, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *yokosmile* 
Imagine the peace you'd feel in your heart if you'd just let this go.

Under the circumstances I just don't see that happening. This isnt a situation where letting her get her way is going to make anyone happy and may even mess with the OPs poor little DDs head more than it already is.

She is her Grandmother, not her Mother... she has _no_ right to tell her grandchild to call her mom unless _she_ is the one raising her with her mother nowhere in the picture. From how this all sounds, the actual mom is very much in the picture.

I still say its probably best to see if the MIL would be willing to go with some other form of endearment. As silly as it is to not want to be Grandma at a young age, its totally okay to come up with another term... but "mom" is not an appropriate one.

Thank goodness I know I will never be like this. I had my first child at a young age so I know the chances of being a grandma before I am 40 is fairly high... but I will still embrace it, just like my mother did when I made her a grandma at 42!


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

You need to stand on your own feet. I'm sorry, but other people get pregnant really young and manage. If you had a good relationship with your ILs, it would be a great idea to stay somewhere presumably for less (though you're still getting into debt), but it's not working here. If you want to be treated like an adult, then you'll have to move out on your own.

Fair or not, your MIL sees you and your husband as children, rather than adults. Though she's making it about college, I'd guess it's more about responsibility. I get that you don't make much money. College may take longer to finish if you move out and both get jobs, but it sounds like that's the best option if the 4 of you can't get past these issues.


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## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *VisionaryMom* 
You need to stand on your own feet. I'm sorry, but other people get pregnant really young and manage. If you had a good relationship with your ILs, it would be a great idea to stay somewhere presumably for less (though you're still getting into debt), but it's not working here. If you want to be treated like an adult, then you'll have to move out on your own.

Fair or not, your MIL sees you and your husband as children, rather than adults. Though she's making it about college, I'd guess it's more about responsibility. I get that you don't make much money. College may take longer to finish if you move out and both get jobs, but it sounds like that's the best option if the 4 of you can't get past these issues.

Agreed. For me, even living in a studio apartment with the littles would be better than dealing with that level of toxicity.


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## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

I agree. Get out of the house and rent a small efficiency. It will only get worse, esp. if your DH begins to stand up to her lies and games.


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## RiverSky (Jun 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan* 
Start teaching your dd to call her a "great grandma".







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *E.V. Lowi* 
Wow granny's trippin on the crazy train.









Totally!

Does your daughter ever say how it makes her feel that her grandma doesn't want herself called Grandma?

At this point, perhaps you can just be sure to mention to your daughter that that is her grandma and then just leave the issue be. Personally, I would avoid spending extra time with this psycho-grandmother if at all possible. She is totally sabotaging her own relationship with her granddaughter, bit by bit. Her loss.

My nephews call their dad "Papi" and I soooo don't see it as a substitute for Grandpa, it means "Daddy", IMO.

I agree with everyone else who said it's time to start figuring out how you and your family can leave their house. If you are paying rent there, then you can pay rent somewhere else. The longer you wait, I think the more other things will crop up to annoy the heck out of you and the more ways the Grandmother will find to undermine and disrespect you and your husband around your daughter.


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## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

Well I think she's being completely ridiculous & childish. I would tell her straight out that you & DH are her mother & father and any variation of 'mom' 'mama' 'papi' etc. is reserved only for you guys. She doesn't have to answer to grandma (again, childish, but whatever)... but she needs to pick a name that doesn't overstep the 'mom' & 'dad' bounds. Whether your DD calls her by her first name or some cutesy name MIL likes... whatever... but the 'mom' thing should be off-limits IMO. Quite honestly, I would not allow my child to spend any time with her if she refused to respect that YOU and ONLY YOU are the child's mother.

ETA: I also think it's totally disrespectful for her to make these 'college' comments, what does being a college graduate have to do with you being parents or her being a grandmother??!??


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

I'm curious - does she have a college degree?


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

She sounds toxic and I would work very hard to find anywhere else to live if I were in that situation. Is there absolutely nothing you can afford right now? How much longer until you graduate and can bring in more money? Is there married student housing or anything like that available at your university?


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## astra (Jan 21, 2006)

This is the craziest threat ever. I can't believe your MIL!!!! SERIOUSLY, what does being a grandmother have to do with college???

Would she consider letting your daughter call her another name instead of grandma? My MIL did not want to be called Grandma so she asked to be called Bella.


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## RoseDuperre (Oct 15, 2007)

I have a suggestion. I can SORT OF understand not loving "Grandma", but there has to be an alternative. My stepmother is called "Nona" (Italian) by my DD, just to name one example. It could be many things, but either she comes up with something besides Mom/Mommy/Mama or anything synonymous with "mother" or, I propose, your DD just cals her by her first name.







Just my 2 cents.

I would absolutely put/keep my foot down about the "Mom" thing. Mom is you and you alone.


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## DaughterOfKali (Jul 15, 2007)

She sounds like she's on a power trip. Maybe your kids can call her Jane Doe.


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## newmommy7-08 (Feb 2, 2008)

Just a title? To me being called mama or mommy means the world. I couldn't even imagine encouraging someone else's child to call me mom. What the OP's MIL is doing is positively heinous! I actually talked about this with my MIL the other day and she was completely disgusted. As parents we help our children... that help should NEVER come with strings. In this case allowing her child to rent her basement has a huge string... that her grandchild call her mom. That's disgusting!

OP, I don't care how in debt we were... (and we're in plenty personally) DH and I would be out of there, and frankly MIL wouldn't get much contact after we left!


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mtiger* 
Why can;t you all come up with an acceptable alternative?

because she shouldn't have to. The MIL is WAY out of line. It's not that she just doesn't like the name "grandma." She seems to be power-tripping.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *astra* 
This is the craziest thread ever.

Yep, it's destined to be a classic!


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## Xavismom (Dec 22, 2009)

I would be SO angry. I would just have my DC call her by her first name if she refuses to be called grandma. That or Mrs. -last name-


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

And one more thing- I might feel a bit stronger about this because my mom passed away while I was pregnant with DD1... the day after I told her that she'd be a grandma. My mom was very sick with cancer- she had always wanted a grandchild and that was her dying wish- it was my gift to her. She was expected to live much longer but took a turn for the worse in a matter of days. I suppose I kind of feel like MIL should be greatful about being a grandmother because there was someone out there (my mother) who wanted it so badly but didn't even get to meet her grandchild.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

As you plan your way out, I wouldn't leave dd alone with MIL at all. That way she doesn't have time to plant the "I'm Mom" card in dd's head. If she does it in front of you, just say to dd, "No, she's grandma. I'm your mom."


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

AND I would say to MIL, "She won't be calling you anything other than grandma." And just keep repeating it.


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## Kristine233 (Jul 15, 2003)

If you guys don't make enough to cover $500 rent and utilities, my guess is you guys might qualify for some assistance. If you could at least get some food assistance until you are on your feet it could help and get you out of the toxic environment.

Its just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt, but my children's well being and my own mental health are more important than paying off debt faster. While paying down debt is important, some things I will not sacrifice.


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *yokosmile* 
Imagine the peace you'd feel in your heart if you'd just let this go. You can't change MIL - only how you react to her. You have to live with her until you're in a better financial state; that's your reality. When she behaves in a way you feel is inappropriate, you can choose to be stoic and kind and turn the other cheek or get outraged - the choice is yours. We're all fighting a hard battle, even your MIL.

I know I've been strongly advocating working out a compromise, but I think just letting this kind of thing go is a bad idea.

One thing I learned from dealling with my MIL was that if you let stuff go she feels she won and tries to get more. With my MIL it was a competition of power over DH. If the OP tries to get a her MIL to agree to a reasonable compromise, she will see if her MIL is _capable_ of compromising.

MIL not wanting to be called "grandma" maybe very sill to some of us, but it is her title/name so I see it as her choice (think of the name shortening thread.) She really does have the right to be called what she wants, until it infringes on her DIL's right to hold the "mom" title for herself since she actually is the mom.

Working out a compromise and showing sympathy for MIL's feelings, can be a litmus test to see if MIL really can be reasonable. Just giving in, though, could be the first step to escalating attempts to undermine the OP.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

what on earth does college have to do with anything? It doesn't make her any more of a grandma if her son graduates college. I mean clearly the whole college education is important to her but being a pain iin your butt and IGNORING her grand daughter in an effort to manipulate you (nuts!!!!!) is just plainj crazy. Honestly I don't think she will be happy with an alternative. She is trying to manipulate your husband into going to college which unless she is willing to pay for does not sem to be on the menu right now. You guys are a young family with two small children, already in debt and not living in your own place. You have other things to worry about than living grandmas dreams.


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## DaughterOfKali (Jul 15, 2007)

*Contact your local Housing Authority* and see if you can get Emergency Housing. It's not right that you have to put up with your MIL like that.


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## EdnaMarie (Sep 9, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
AND I would say to MIL, "She won't be calling you anything other than grandma." And just keep repeating it.

I agree with this. I think that you have the right to set this boundary but that the best thing is find some way to remain calm and do like the other woman in this thread did:

"You are her grandmother. I'm her mom. She will call you by your name or your title, not mine." Smile. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Even in public.

I really think her insistence on something like this is very strange and a big deal. "Mom" is one of the most important words we learn, one of the first words. It's a huge thing. I'm sorry you have to live there but I agree that getting out of debt is important and you're probably doing the right thing staying there... unless it gets much creepier.


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## MaerynPearl (Jun 21, 2008)

In Illinois, due to the high unemployment, especially around Northern Illinois, housing waiting lists are something like 8 months long... so I do not see that as being very helpful right away... but getting ON the waiting list can help!

If you only have $50 food budget, I suggest going on SNAP though. I was barely making enough to make ends meet before I went on SNAP (formerly LINK... also called food stamps) and it helped so much that I was able to pay all of my bills and have a little left over each month to put into an emergency fund (okay by a little I am only talking 5 or 10 dollars... but that was WAY more than I had left over before then!)

At the end of the time I was on it I had only built up a $200 or so emergency fund... but it came in handy after my work closed down!


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## StephandOwen (Jun 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WindyCityMom* 
And one more thing- I might feel a bit stronger about this because my mom passed away while I was pregnant with DD1... the day after I told her that she'd be a grandma. My mom was very sick with cancer- she had always wanted a grandchild and that was her dying wish- it was my gift to her. She was expected to live much longer but took a turn for the worse in a matter of days. I suppose I kind of feel like MIL should be greatful about being a grandmother because there was someone out there (my mother) who wanted it so badly but didn't even get to meet her grandchild.











I can totally see being in your position with my (future) MIL. She's a piece of work and I do everything I can to avoid being around her without dp there too.

Anyway, I'm so sorry you all are going through this. The only thing I can suggest is to keep your dd away from her as much as possible (especially unsupervised). If MIL questions why dd can't be around her without you there then straight up tell her "because you won't respect our wishes about dd not calling you mom". Since you are a SAHM it shouldn't be too hard to keep your dd with you. I would also cut out any and all outings with MIL. If she can't respect you, don't spend time with her. Do what you have to to get out of there. Good luck mama!


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## HappyMommy2 (Jan 27, 2007)

I think that keeping some debt is a small price to pay for getting away from this toxic situation.


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## JollyGG (Oct 1, 2008)

If debt and the high cost of living in your area is keeping you living with your MIL and it's not a healthy place for you or your children then you need to find another solution. It may just have to be more drastic a solution than you would like.

You may need to declare bankruptcy, you may need to move to a lower cost of living area (hopefully far far away from your MIL), you may have to get a job, or you husband may need to take on a second job.

Are you working with a credit counselor or financial manager. Be wary of the numerous scams out there, but there are people who can help you figure out exactly what you need to be doing to get out of debt and let you know what your realistic options are.

Honestly a high enough debt load on a low enough income to have you trapped in this situation makes it sound like bankruptcy might be a good option. But if your debt load is low enough that you can get it paid off in the next year then maybe it's not. Can you work out a payment plan to pay it a bit slower and get a place of your own.

It doesn't sound like the current situational is something that can be allowed to continue.


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## tanyam926 (May 25, 2005)

I think that you already know that this issue isn't at all about the title of your MIL, but about a power struggle.

There is a dysfunctional dynamic going on, not uncommon w/young parents living w/their own parents. You have adult responsibilites but you are still the "child" in the relationship. If you add to that equation the real or perceived irresponsibility (for example, you MIL may think that you and her son are irresponsible which may be fueled by the fact that you guys can't afford your own place, haven't met her expectations for schooling, etc).

This is a power struggle which you can't fully put to rest until you seperate yourselves from her and get a little more distance. So getting your own place is the best bet, not ever borrowing money (don't know if you do now or not), etc is what it is going to take so that you can set up boundaries permanently.

Giving in on this won't work bc it only serves to give MIL more fuel for the fire. Your dd isn't served at all by being taught how to be a door mat.

Things happen no matter how old you are, it sounds like you and your dp are dedicated to being good parents. I'm sorry that you have to deal with unrest at home, hopefully things line up so you can get your own place soon.


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## MommatoAandA (Jun 4, 2010)

I agree with the numerous posters who said to find a way out. If it means living in a shelter (we have some great catholic charity shelters here in MA and I toured one when I was about to be homeless). It honestly might be better than staying around someone like your MIL. It seems to me, she is just a control freak. Your and DH going to college has nothing to do with calling her grandma. She IS a grandma. You can call her anything you want and she is STILL a grandma. My kids call MIL Grammy K, her other grandkids call her "honey". But one of her other grandchildren coined the term and I am not comfy with them calling her Honey, so we use Grammy K.

Her ego, self centeredness, and narcissism are not your responsibility. I would apply for housing ASAP, Food Stamps, get jobs, do whatever you have to and make a move. I would worry less about the debt and more about the mental health of your family. Sorry your going through this mama.


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## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

She doesn't get public assistance because she lives in an illegal apartment.

Yet another reason to move out.

$500 a month for a studio apartment on one full time minimum wage job should be achievable even if (of course) tight. (ETA: I haven't done this math. So I could be off base. But $500 a month for an apartment around here, where real estate is dirt cheap, is a pretty good deal. Granted, it would be a proper one bedroom apartment, not a studio, but my point is that I live in a very blue-collar town and $500 is considered a good rent).

You guys really need to make your move. And staying in Chicago shouldn't be your only consideration.

ETA#2: OK, I didn't consider debt problems. Still, a full time job plus a part time job (weekends, nights - either you or DH) plus potentially public assistance should put moving out into the "doable" column.


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## MaerynPearl (Jun 21, 2008)

living with a family member is not "an illegal apartment"

I rented from my mother when I first went on public assistance and they said its a common sight for those who are struggling enough to need the help to be renting a room or several rooms from another person in the family.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I think it's illegal because of the separate door issue? Anyhow, I agree, OP, that you need to find a way to move out. With that low of income you would qualify for assistance - probably even housing if that's available in your area. At the very least, food stamps - which would free up a little money. Child care assistance if it's necessary, even temporarily for you to get a job until your DH makes more. I honestly think that even making minimum wage (and if he's not, he needs a new job), $500 for rent is very do-able. Maybe you have to let the other bills slide for awhile so that you can pay for shelter, food, and utilities. If you don't get out soon, you may be stuck in that awful living situation for a very long time. DH made $7 an hour when I got pregnant with our first baby 10 years ago - and we made it somehow, even with car payments and higher rent - we did have medicaid and WIC for awhile, but that was all as far as assistance and we still kept a roof over our head.


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## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MaerynPearl* 
living with a family member is not "an illegal apartment"

I rented from my mother when I first went on public assistance and they said its a common sight for those who are struggling enough to need the help to be renting a room or several rooms from another person in the family.

I don't claim to know the details but apparently they are not living in MIL's apartment, as a family member.

MIL is charging them rent for an apartment that is not up to fire code. Hence, illegal.

Yet another reason to move.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *laohaire* 
But $500 a month for an apartment around here, where real estate is dirt cheap, is a pretty good deal.

We're in an average COL area, and it's pretty reasonable here, too. I don't think $500 for a studio is an insurmountable monthly rent, especially since they're already paying something to MIL for the basement apartment.

I wasn't thinking Section 8 housing when I mentioned public assistance, but you're right that in many cases, they'd have to include the ILs income, which will reduce or eliminate public assistance. DH works with Child & Family Services in the childcare subsidies division, and they see that all the time - really young parents who live with their parents and are thus disqualified for the subsidy.

OP, moving out really may be better for you guys financially. You should just do some research and see what shakes out.


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## new2this (Feb 11, 2010)

Its a power trip and huge boundary issue.

However she isn't going to stop as long as your living there. And to be brutally honest. I would get a job or your husband get a second job to move out yes you have debt but so does the rest of the world and there are resources out there to help.

I am not sure of your whole situation but there are certain sacrifices a person just has to make no matter what in order to get on their feet again. Like getting ride of all the "wants" internet, cell phone unless thats the only phone and even then anything outside of the basic plan is not needed.

We have been there before where DH's pay literally dropped over 50% of what we were used to living so all that debt came with us but we didn't qualify for anything either. I was happy we didn't have kids cause we were eating MRE's that he was able to take from work instead of grocery shopping outside of the basics like milk and bread and anything I could make do with. We were poor but we also went without/bare min to get back on our feet. Now we are finally debt free after 5 yrs of busting our butts.


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## New_Natural_Mom (Dec 21, 2007)

I live in the suburbs now, but used to live and go to school in the city. Yes, there are many areas with a high cost of living. Not knowing what your DH does for a living, have you considered moving to the suburbs? I get the debt issue, but your MIL has NO BOUNDARIES.

You are driving yourself crazy trying to understand someone who can't be understood. Your MIL isn't being rational. Obviously, everything you are saying is falling on deaf ears. If your DH isn't able to get through to her and your FIL either agrees with her or can't get through to her you are stuck.

I would sit her down with you and your DH (and not your DD present) and have a come to jesus talk with her. She either respects your wishes or you leave. And mean it. Find another alternative.

I know it is easier said then done and that there are obstacles. I was in a HORRIBLE job. Like boss sexually harassing me, no one at the company taking any action, hostile work conditions, the works. I was there for 3 years. We needed the income, and despite 13 interviews!!! I couldn't find anything else. I was a wreck. My health deteriorated, I was totally stressed out, and very depressed. I talked about my feelings with my DH, I even went to counseling. NOTHING HELPED. I finally found another job and quit like the company was on fire. The second I left that building everything was better. I couldn't change the situation and I couldn't accept the situation, so I had to leave.

Work with your DH on an exit plan and minimize the contact your MIL has with your DD. Tell her if she can't respect your wishes she can't interact with your DD. Everytime she won't respond to gma or tries to get DD to call her mom, pick DD up and leave the room.

As evidenced by the above story, I know how sucky it is to be in a situation you can't change or accept. Good luck on a resolution.


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## Sarah W (Feb 9, 2008)

I've been reading this thread for the last couple of days but haven't posted. This situation is crazy! It's so manipulative. you graduate college and she can be called grandma?

I'd stop her short next time she says it. If she pulls that, "I won't respond" then tell her that DD won't be talking to her anymore. I don't care what type of deal she says she made. You are her mother.

This is a hill I'd die on. I would be infuriated. I'm already mad for you.


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

Have you sat down with her and said, "Look. You cannot be called Mom or Mama. You don't want to be called Grandma or any variation. What can dd call you?"

There's got to be a way to come up with a solution.

(And yes, I know this is about something bigger, and you DO need to move out, but in the meantime, I think you should be able to come up with a name to call her!)


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## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *greeny* 
Have you sat down with her and said, "Look. You cannot be called Mom or Mama. You don't want to be called Grandma or any variation. What can dd call you?"

There's got to be a way to come up with a solution.

(And yes, I know this is about something bigger, and you DO need to move out, but in the meantime, I think you should be able to come up with a name to call her!)

If MIL were rational - sure.

MIL is using it as a means of control. She is not going to just come up with a "compromise" and give her her control. Especially now that she sees she hit a sore spot, she's going to ride it for all it's worth. Remember, she kept enforcing the "you're not calling me grandma" MINUTES after her DIL discussed it with her directly.


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## JessicaS (Nov 18, 2001)

Hello!

In some situations we do try and let certain disagreements be worked out on the boards among the members. That doesn't always work out. The side discussion has been removed so the OP's thread can continue.

~Jess


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## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

My ds calls my parents 'Buddy' and 'Nai Nai', his great grandparents he call by the same names I use to refer to them (Bompa, Nana, Grammy, Grandma Colvin and Grandpa Jack)

To me, it would be weird for ds to call my parents 'grandma and grandpa', because they arent that old, and because we live with them. So we thought of alternate names that work!

Buddy comes from my dad's love of Buddy Guy, he calls my ds 'Little Guy'
Nai Nai is ds's version of the chinese for Grandma, my sister and I were both born/raised in Asia.


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## becoming (Apr 11, 2003)

Honestly, I think you need to find a way to move out. She sounds... unstable... and I wouldn't want my child living in that environment and being taken care of by that kind of person.


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

Thank you EVERYONE. We're still in the same boat. I am becoming increacingly stressed about the situation and MIL is just getting worse (there are so many aspects of her personality that are very "off"). I don't want this to turn into a huge vent about my MIL so I'll refrain from posting those.

I did want to share this.

The other day, we were at a family BBQ. MIL was there. A friend of a friend of MIL asked MIL what my DD called her. MIL replied "DD calls me FirstName. She sometimes calls me "mom". They're forcing her to call me "grandma" but I won't have any of that". Ohhh wow. My DH almost choked on his food. The lady MIL was talking to said that she makes her granddaughter call her "Mom" also- that she's too young to be a grandma. Wow. just Wow. I think I almost fell over in my chair. DH and I left when DD was done eating.

I really want to move out. I can't sleep. I've been getting horrible migraines almost daily. I am SO stressed. It's not just this craziness- it's everything MIL does. There's a huge difference between not agreeing with your MIL and your MIL going on a huge power trip 24/7! Yesterday we were at another barbeque. MIL begged me to go. I asked her before we went if she would be able leave the party at 6pm because my girls go down at 7:30. She was fine with that. At 5:45 I let her know that I was going to gather the kids' things and set them by the door so that we wouldn't be going crazy looking for things before we left. She said okay. At 6pm I asked her if she were ready to go. She was sitting at a table with friends and family. Her response? "Uhh, no, I'm not." I then reminded her about the kids needing to go to bed. She agreed that we should go and told the people at the table "I'll be back. _These little girls_ need to go to bed. *eyeroll*". She still stuck around talking until 6:30.

I learned my lesson. I just can't stand how vindictive she can be. We NEED to get out of here. I've been trying to budget ourselves and see if there is any way that we could get out of here (financially). My husband works in sales and can't get transferred anywhere else. I feel completely overwhelmed.


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## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

Wow. First off, did your MIL stage her friend to say that she also had her grandkids call her Mom? That is just unbelievable, I thought your situation was so bizarre & then to hear another gma saying the same thing?!? I am in shock.

Anyway... it really sounds like while you're trying to figure out if you can move out, you need to set some really strict boundaries. You don't need to go to a cookout because MIL begs you. You don't need to visit with MIL all day. Do you have access to transportation? I would schedule tons of activities, story hours, playdates, trips to the park, etc. and just avoid MIL for the most part.


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## BabyMae09 (Sep 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WindyCityMom* 
Talk about self centeredness... Ugh. I mean, good, have hopes for your kids.. but don't be so ridiculous and take it out on your grandchildren!

This just stinks. We really can NOT afford to move out. We're in a good amount of debt and are trying to pay it off- so until that's done (probably not until the beginning of next year) we're stuck here.

We just moved out of our in-laws house about three months ago and I had to reply. My future MIL always calls my daughter 'her baby'. There were some other issues, too, but the long story short is that she repeatedly tried to raise my kids the way *she* thought they should be raised. Like, she would take my son, who is unschooled, and tell him he couldn't have a fruit juice popcicle until he sat down and wrote out a page of words for her, because in her words 'if you don't sit and read and write you'll never learn how!!' She also repeatedly gave my daughter those crappy saltine crackers (when she was still exclusively breast fed!!) which made her wake up screaming with a tummy ache in the middle of the night.







I could go on and on.

Anyway, GET OUT. DP and I put the word out, and less than a week later, we were in our 2000 sq. ft. house on 5 acres







for only $500 a month! We also help our landloard out with 50 hours of labor a month. For our area, this is really cheap! So options are out there.

Gotta go, PM me if needed.


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## BabyMae09 (Sep 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WindyCityMom* 
*(there are so many aspects of her personality that are very "off").*

I really want to move out. *I can't sleep. I've been getting horrible migraines almost daily. I am SO stressed.* It's not just this craziness- it's everything MIL does.

I learned my lesson. I just can't stand how vindictive she can be. We NEED to get out of here. *I've been trying to budget ourselves and see if there is any way that we could get out of here (financially).* My husband works in sales and can't get transferred anywhere else.

I feel completely overwhelmed.

You know what? I was getting headaches every day before we moved out. I too couldn't sleep. I felt awful. I considered leaving my DP just so I could get OUT. Luckily, he finally realized how bad things were (my MIL never did anything to me/the kids in front of him, until the last thing) and we got out. Our relationship almost ended because of how bad she was. I hear that your honey knows how things are; that's great. That's half the battle.

We couldn't afford to move. We are totally broke. But you know what? We did what's right for us, and for our kids, and so I KNOW everything is going to work out for us. Like karma, you know? When I do right, and am right within myself, good things always happen to and for me.

Sometimes you have to take a leap of faith. If I have to go back to work, I will. We choose to sell our Vanagon (my dream car) to pay our rent ahead 4 months. We're doing what we have to in order to not live with them. And even though we're broke, we're happier than we've been since we moved in with them!!

Good luck


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## BabyMae09 (Sep 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *VisionaryMom* 
you're right that in many cases, they'd have to include the ILs income, which will reduce or eliminate public assistance. DH works with Child & Family Services in the childcare subsidies division

MAYBE true. Just don't claim your IL's - say you're renting from them, list them by name - and then when you move out, it's not an issue anymore. I was never even asked about my parent's income. It was a non-issue. I think it was because I was over 24, though. Although, my parents did have to sign something saying I was paying them X rent for my living space. Sounds like your MIL won't do that!


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## BabyMae09 (Sep 19, 2008)

Also, you sound like you are a wonderful Mommy. Sorry for so many posts, as I kept reading, there was more I wanted to add


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

CrunchyMommy- I had to share that because it was that bizarre. It was totally un-staged. This is someone MIL didn't really know- we had just gotten there.

Thanks BabyMae09! Glad to know someone out there "made it". It is wonderful that you all were able to rent a house that cheap!

We're really broke. $1000/mo most months. I checked apartments.com and there aren't any listings in Chicago for $500/mo for rent. We really need to get out of debt.


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## Mountaingirl79 (Jul 12, 2008)

Okay, so I would pick a day where you and Dh can hash it out with them and make a big stink about this. That is just so ridiculous to me....she has been the grandma since the day she was born....does she need the pediatrician to tell her how that worked?!? She may not * feel* like a grandma, but she is not your children's MOM!!

I am just so mad for you. I was a young mom too, I had my first at 20, and also my mom was a teen mom when I was born. But how your MIL is acting is just so disrespectful, and not to be put up with.

Have you checked craigslist? Apartments.com is overpriced. Do you have any friends with a spare room? Trailer parks? Section 8? You are so young, I don't think getting out of debt should be your first priority here, if I can just speak honestly.

She doesnt have to be called Grandma and he doesnt have to be called Grandpa, but they are not the parents of your children. Even if you NEVER graduate from college.

This is a hill I would die on, or move out on so to speak.
That is just not worth the toxicity.

ETA: And also you should distance yourself from her as much as possible. You are allowed to say no.

PS Sorry for the forcefulness but this hits close to home for me, I am also in sales, and I also have a wacky MIL with no boundaries.








But you *are* an adult, no matter what she says. ((hugs))


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## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mountaingirl79* 
Have you checked craigslist? Apartments.com is overpriced.

Ditto to that... I just checked Chicago craigslist & there were lots of rooms under $500 (do a search with 500 as the max price otherwise you'll be overwhelmed with the $1000+ apts!) I don't know if they are in good areas or whatever but it's worth looking at. Also check the website for your local newspaper, that's how I found $350 apts when all the apt's in my area were $800-1200


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## Angela512 (Dec 22, 2007)

Just pulled up the Craiglist Chicago listings...in the city of Chicago...I would avoid almost every single one of those ads. There are some that "could" be ok, but the vast majority of the apts. that are listed are in very questionable areas...if not in gang-town anyways. If you got a bit out of the city (but you would have the expense of commuting) you could find some nice, more inexpensive places.


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## WindyCityMom (Aug 17, 2009)

Thanks. I posted another thread in TAO about potentially moving out of state. The Chicago craigslist ads aren't cutting it. I think we need to go out of state. We really need to get away from MIL. I don't have much family, only my "stepdad" (pretty much raised me for 9 years before my mom passed away- he was her fiance). Anyways- I need all the help I can get with this.


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## texmati (Oct 19, 2004)

I would. Get out. I've lived with my MIL for nearly four miserable years. I would do nearly anything to get out of this situation (i can't leave, she's dependent on us).


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