# 9yo writing on walls/furniture



## elisent (May 30, 2006)

What do I do about this? I have spent years explaining that writing instruments are for paper only but he still doesn't think twice about writing on anything and everything.

Yesterday he wrote all over my 4yo's new (expensive!) wood kitchen with a black magic marker he brought home from school. He said he wanted to make it look more real. I would accept this explanation from a preschooler but he is 9 years old!

A few weeks ago he wrote "Exit here" in crayon on the bathroom wall next to the door. I made him scrub it off. When he was done he wrote "All Clean! Joe" on it instead.

All of my doors are labeled by him ("Bathroom" "Girls Bedroom" "Basement"). All exits are clearly marked. By looking at his bedroom walls you can easily determine his name, his friend's names, his teacher's name, his favorite superheroes, what he wants for Christmas, etc.

He has notebooks to write in and he does. He has scrap paper. He knows writing on walls makes me upset and hurts the house value. I've had him clean them himself. I've had him watch while I clean them. I've taken away all art supplies, yet he still finds more.

How can I get through to him? I just want to have nice things for once. Everything I have he writes on or breaks. I saved for months to get a really good play kitchen and now it looks trashy like everything else.


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## ryleeee (Feb 9, 2005)

oh...gosh.
that is horrible.
i am interested in hearing how people would deal with this other than taking away all markers etc. i guess that's what i would do, have him clean everything off, make a rule sign saying the consequence of what will happen if writing is anywhere but designated places, and then have only supervised crayon/marker time.

our kitchen table is an art table, just a plain wood table that we let our 2.5 year old draw on and we cover it with a table cloth.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Give him one of those label makers. Tell him he can label anything he wants with that, but not a marker, pen, crayon, pencil, carving knife, chisel...

Am I missing anything.

Kids generally write on things they think are theirs. I don't know why, but I did it, my dd did it. He's going a little overboard though.


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## IdahoMom (Nov 8, 2005)

Does he get any allowance? Have him pay for touch-up paint and supplies. Then have him do the prep work, painting, and cleanup with your supervision. Enough times of that and it might get old.


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## Magella (Apr 5, 2004)

I like the label maker idea.

So, any insight into _why_ he labels everything and writes all over the walls? (Other than his alleged desire to make the wooden kitchen look more real?) Does he have an explanation for why he does it? Or what it might take to help him stop it? Does it seem at all compulsive to you? That behavior seems kind of odd for a 9 year old, in my completely non-expert opinion, and I wonder if maybe your typical disciplinary responses haven't worked because it's more complex than a simple "discipline issue." Maybe there's more going on there, and in order to bring an end to the behavior you'll have to figure out what that is?

Is this the only area in which he appears to be consistently defiant, where you just can't seem to get through to him?

That really sounds so frustrating. I hope you find a solution.


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## One_Girl (Feb 8, 2008)

I think it depends on how serious you are about him really not doing it again. Is it a decision you are willing to wait on or do you want all of the markings gone. If you want them gone try getting a bunch of those Mr. Clean magic erasers and tell him that on cleaning day once a week the walls need to be completely cleaned off and they need to stay that way all day before he goes off to play with friends, watch tv, read books, practice sports or whatever else he might do. The markings come off with the magic erasers but it will take a lot of effort and time and he probably won't want to repeat it again especially if it cuts into his time to do other things that are funner. If you really don't want markings any day then keep the magic erasers in the car or somewhere only you have access to them and only give them to him once a week. Usually if something isn't fun anymore it tends to go away without anymore needing to be said. You might also tell him that you are using his allowance money to buy the magic erasers if he gets an allowance and when he asks for money or something new tell him that when the things he has are kept neat and in good condition, reasonably good for his age, for X weeks then you will consider requests for new things.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

I may get flamed here, so I'll put on my flame retardant suit.









I think 9 years old is PLENTY old enough to know better than to write on things, and plenty old enough to have the impulse control to get a piece of paper, etc. to color on.









My 5 year old wrote with a black sharpie all over his walls a few months ago. He knew better .. he even came in and told me his imaginary friend Max had done something very bad to his walls. Imagine my shock when I found all 4 walls in his room were covered in black scribbles!!!

First, I figured it was partly my fault for leaving the pen down where he could get to it.

Then I explained how our landlord would not like black marks all over his walls, and we are supposed to keep our home just as fresh and clean as it was when we moved in. I told him we were going to fix the walls asap ... any other plans were going to be put aside until we could get them fixed. So we went to the hardware store and bought a paint brush, washed out a glass jar at home and went to the landlords to get some matching paint. Then we went home and painted over the walls until they were fixed again. He helped me, and was a part of the solution. I didn't at any point get angry or upset, just explained why we needed to fix it ASAP, and made him a large part of the process.

It's worked. I've accidentally left out a marker or two since then, and no slip ups.


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## sjm_fdbg (Mar 11, 2008)

Just a suggestion....this is not a behavioral issue. it it were, your attempts at discipline would have yielded some results. I suggest that this may be the manifestation of OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder) or some other type of impulse-control disorder. Writing on things that have not been written on, or pristine surfaces such as the new wooden play kitchen is a compulsion. Not writing on it is creating more anxiety than the thought of punishment he might receive later if he does write on it. I would suggest you seek out a good mental health therapist that specializes in anxiety / impulse control issues in children. Of course, the mainstream mental health professional might likely refer you to a psychiatrist for medication. This problem can be handled with very specific coping strategies that must be learned if you are against meds. And I would work really hard on implementing those and use any type of meds as an absolute last resort (after all, most psychiatrists are just legalized drug dealers y'know, but I will save that soapbox speech for another time). Anyway, I do not believe that this behavior is something your child can be disciplined out of and I think greater understanding of what is behind it is in order. Just my .02. Best of luck. - Sarah (mom to William (4), Molly (3), and Sam (1). P.S. - I am new here, I registered so I could post. Forgive me if I don't have all the lingo


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## sjm_fdbg (Mar 11, 2008)

Incidentally, the label maker idea is excellent.


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I like the label maker idea too, or if you want to go on the cheap, suggest he make signs on paper and give him some scotch tape so he can tape the signs up where he wants.


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## Shane (Aug 6, 2005)

I completely understand the frustration here.

Why not let him write, paint, color on a specific wall in the house?
Even if you live in a rental, you can have him repaint the wall when you move out. We got some chalk board paint at home depot. We painted the backside of our kitchen island with that. They can erase it and redo it whenever they feel like putting up something new. If he wants to label every room in the house, then he can draw doors and label them as he sees fit, on his wall. We are allowing our children to paint their own room, along with us. They get one wall to paint whatever they want on, whenever they want to. The other walls are painted like a landscape, by dh and I and they can add things that fit into a landscape to those walls.

I was the kind of kid who got disiplined for coloring on the walls. I'm ok with that. Pretty cool though that we got the basement room at my mom's house to decorate, and my dad helped me and my sisters build a club house that we got to decorate however we wanted.
Don't forget, it's just stuff. And nobody's stuff lasts forever, and we can't take it with us. If it's disapointing when expensive stuff gets broken or messed up, then buy the cheap stuff.

But he does need disipline to stop in other areas where he shouldn't, so make him pay for materials to repaint and do it himself. Be patient, he will have to redo it several times to get it right. Don't get impatient and take over. Make him find a way, if you don't give allowance. He can sell some of his stuff to get the money, on ebay or hold a lemonade stand. He's old enough to rake leaves for neighbors, etc. Maybe he could sell some of his own artwork, and donate a portion of the money to charity. I'll bet a local gallery would love to showcase, if he is doing it for charity. Do you ever have yard sales?


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## Shane (Aug 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamazee* 
I like the label maker idea too, or if you want to go on the cheap, suggest he make signs on paper and give him some scotch tape so he can tape the signs up where he wants.

I like that idea!


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## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sjm_fdbg* 
Just a suggestion....this is not a behavioral issue. it it were, your attempts at discipline would have yielded some results. I suggest that this may be the manifestation of OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder) or some other type of impulse-control disorder. Writing on things that have not been written on, or pristine surfaces such as the new wooden play kitchen is a compulsion. Not writing on it is creating more anxiety than the thought of punishment he might receive later if he does write on it. I would suggest you seek out a good mental health therapist that specializes in anxiety / impulse control issues in children. Of course, the mainstream mental health professional might likely refer you to a psychiatrist for medication. This problem can be handled with very specific coping strategies that must be learned if you are against meds. And I would work really hard on implementing those and use any type of meds as an absolute last resort (after all, most psychiatrists are just legalized drug dealers y'know, but I will save that soapbox speech for another time). Anyway, I do not believe that this behavior is something your child can be disciplined out of and I think greater understanding of what is behind it is in order. Just my .02. Best of luck. - Sarah (mom to William (4), Molly (3), and Sam (1). P.S. - I am new here, I registered so I could post. Forgive me if I don't have all the lingo 

This is an interesting idea! That he has the compulsion to write on them.

But the fact that he wrote "all clean" after he cleaned it kind of made me think it was about power. Are you guys in a power struggle over it? Is there something that has happened recently in his life that would make him angry and lash out?


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## eunytuny (Jan 19, 2007)

That would make me want to





















. So frustrating. Hope you ind a solution ASAP.


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## elisent (May 30, 2006)

Okay, I love the label maker idea! I may have to buy two though so I can have one too. We can both drive my husband crazy.

I'm surprised that many people suggested it was compulsive. He is ADHD and we are testing next month for autism/aspergers/OCD spectrum disorders.

If you guys are picking up on compulsive behavior without me suggesting it then that's probably what it is. I will try to be understanding. Hopefully it will be warm soon so I can send him outside with chalk instead.


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

It definitely sounds like some kind of compulsion- the typical 4yo can understand "write on paper, not on walls" pretty well. I'm sure your son understands this as well, but something else is making it hard for him to keep those "pristine" things clear. A label marker, or taping paper to the surfaces, will likely meet his need for "no clear surface" without permenantly damaging those surfaces.

I just had another thought- you just mentioned "send him outside with chalk"- why not let him write with chalk inside the house too? It will cause far less damage than markers!


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## paphia (Jun 22, 2007)

I like the idea of the label maker, but I was thinking that *if* this is a compulsive thing (which it sounded like to me in my completely unprofessional opinion), you might want to try another approach to the labeling so that he can still write but it won't damage anything.

Maybe you can get him some kind of heavy paper that he can use as placards, in different sizes, and some of that sticky tack that doesn't damage walls, and ask him if he needs to label things, he can use that and then hang the "sign" on the wall, toy, etc., in place of writing on the wall.

I don't know if that would work. Or you might try making some walls in your house "art walls" that you cover in art paper and he can draw on that. Good luck in finding a solution!


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## Shane (Aug 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elisent* 
Okay, I love the label maker idea! I may have to buy two though so I can have one too. We can both drive my husband crazy.

I'm surprised that many people suggested it was compulsive. He is ADHD and we are testing next month for autism/aspergers/OCD spectrum disorders.

If you guys are picking up on compulsive behavior without me suggesting it then that's probably what it is. I will try to be understanding. Hopefully it will be warm soon so I can send him outside with chalk instead.

Hoping your tests turn out fine. I'll be remembering you in my prayers. On a positive note, did you know Albert Einstein had ADHD? Maybe you got yourself a little Einstein!


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## zipworth (Jun 26, 2002)

I agree that this sounds like some sort of compulsion. Chalk washes off easily indoors too.....just in case the lable maker doesn't work.


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## colobus237 (Feb 2, 2004)

Medication adjustment + behavior modification may make a world of difference. Perhaps his doctor or therapist could help you make a plan. Just because a maladaptive behavior may be associated with a medical condition (or an emotional need) doesn't mean you have to smile and nod. Honestly it sounds more impulsive than compulsive.


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## UUMom (Nov 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elisent* 
What do I do about this? I have spent years explaining that writing instruments are for paper only but he still doesn't think twice about writing on anything and everything.

Yesterday he wrote all over my 4yo's new (expensive!) wood kitchen with a black magic marker he brought home from school. He said he wanted to make it look more real. I would accept this explanation from a preschooler but he is 9 years old!

A few weeks ago he wrote "Exit here" in crayon on the bathroom wall next to the door. I made him scrub it off. When he was done he wrote "All Clean! Joe" on it instead.

All of my doors are labeled by him ("Bathroom" "Girls Bedroom" "Basement"). All exits are clearly marked. By looking at his bedroom walls you can easily determine his name, his friend's names, his teacher's name, his favorite superheroes, what he wants for Christmas, etc.

He has notebooks to write in and he does. He has scrap paper. He knows writing on walls makes me upset and hurts the house value. I've had him clean them himself. I've had him watch while I clean them. I've taken away all art supplies, yet he still finds more.

How can I get through to him? I just want to have nice things for once. Everything I have he writes on or breaks. I saved for months to get a really good play kitchen and now it looks trashy like everything else.

You sound at wit's end, and I don't blame you! Have you read "Negotiation Generation"? It's a terrible title, but has lots of helpful info that might work with certain temperments. Check it out from the library, if you can. It could help. That would absolutely freak me out at age 9. He's trying to tell you something for sure.


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## sjm_fdbg (Mar 11, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elisent* 
Okay, I love the label maker idea! I may have to buy two though so I can have one too. We can both drive my husband crazy.

I'm surprised that many people suggested it was compulsive. He is ADHD and we are testing next month for autism/aspergers/OCD spectrum disorders.

If you guys are picking up on compulsive behavior without me suggesting it then that's probably what it is. I will try to be understanding. Hopefully it will be warm soon so I can send him outside with chalk instead.

Good luck next month. I am an LCSW and a diagnostician of sorts with experience working with emotionally disturbed and mentally ill children. I think you are on exactly the right track. I also would suggest a great deal of exercise (which you may be doing already). Does your son like to run? If you could run with him a mile or more twice a day (difficult to schedule I know) it could be greatly beneficial. You might also consider anxiolytic homeopathic remedies. I feel for you and your little guy. Keep us posted. I'd love to know what you discover and how you are able to help him. And, you will be able. - Sarah


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## DavinaT (Jun 28, 2005)

Ditto for Shane's idea - I was going to suggest a 'special' wall for him and only him to draw on and thought the idea of a label maker was good too. However, the poster who mentioned OCD may have had an excellent point worth noting. One cannot be disciplined out of OCD - only helped to cope it / overcome it.


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## DavinaT (Jun 28, 2005)

subbing


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## robynlyn80 (Jun 18, 2006)

i was also going to suggest a compulsion b/f i read the other replies. gl with your testing!


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## Piglet68 (Apr 5, 2002)

I think this thread is an excellent example of why punitive dicipline is so counter-productive.

When positive discipline has not resulted in any changes to the child's behaviour it points to a deeper issue, like OCD or something else, and the child gets the help they need.

When puniitive disciplline has not resulted in any changes, the answer always seems to be up the ante and make the punishment more unpleasant.


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