# Do you ever say anything to strangers?



## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

The other day I was at the mall and a mom was walking a few feet ahead of her 2 young girls, maybe 4 and 6. It seemed like they were pretty sick of shopping. She was saying things to them like "The Easter bunny isn't going to bring you anything for easter" I guess in an attempt to make them walk faster. I was so tempted to ask "does that method ever work for you?" but of course I didn't because the situation was pretty minor and I'm also a big chicken lol.
But have there been times where you stepped in and said something about someone's tactics? Or when do you think you'd draw the line and say something?


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## pianojazzgirl (Apr 6, 2006)

I don't think I would ever comment on someone's parenting techniques. I mean, I would defend a child who was being beaten, but I don't think that's what you mean, right? I certainly wouldn't have said anything in the case you mentioned. Not by a long shot.


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

If a person is not physically abusing a child I don't feel it's okay to ever critique a complete stranger for using a different parenting style than I would.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

No I didn't mean beatings. I would definately say something (and report) abusive parents.

But what about just spankings?


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

spanking falls under "physical abuse" as far as I am concerned


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *artgoddess* 
spanking falls under "physical abuse" as far as I am concerned

So you would say something? How would you say it?


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## juljaytyty (Jan 6, 2010)

You never know she could be a very gentile and patient parent in most cases. No one is a perfect parent and every one has a moment of weakness. I don't think you would like some one to call you out on you parenting skills so why would you do it to another mom. I don't understand why so many parents think all family's should raise kids the same way. My mom has told me since I was young that every one dose things differently. No ones right and no ones wrong just different. So no I wouldn't have said any thing it isn't my place to judge another mom when I am not perfect my self and can understand the challenges that come along with being a parent.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

No, I would not say a thing. I would assume the best - that she was also tired and in a hurry and it was not one of her finer parenting moments. And that saying something would only make her feel that much worse.

I don't know about you - but I've had moments where I've said something less than gentle to my 7 year old ds. I've also usually realized what I said was totally rude, or uncalled for and try to stop and tell ds I'm sorry - and I also feel like a total a** and have to work hard not to beat myself up over it. I don't think it's fair to take a snapshot out of someone's life and judge their parenting skills, or even worse, make a comment about how they are parenting!!


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Ok well first, let's remember that I didn't say anything.

Secondly. She wasn't saying it in a stressed out voice or "losing it" or anything. It was like, singsong voice. Almost kinda mocking. "the easter bunny is going to bring you anything for eeeaaasterrrr" kwim?


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Mods, just go ahead and delete this thread. I didn't mean it in a "judging other parents" way. I meant it in a "when would you step in" way.


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## pianojazzgirl (Apr 6, 2006)

Sorry mama, I hope you didn't feel attacked by my post - that wasn't my intention!







I know you didn't say anything to the woman, and I get that you just want to feel out when/if it's sometimes ok to say something. I'm sure I would have felt sorry for the girls, but I do believe that it's not my place to step in and say something about another person's parenting. I guess that might be different if it was someone I know well (depending on the circumstances), but not with a stranger.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

No not yours hun. More Misty's and Juljay's. Kind of implied that I think I'm better than other moms and don't tolerate other parenting styles. I do. That's why I didn't say anything to the mom. Someone more brash might have.


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## pianojazzgirl (Apr 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
No not yours hun.

I'm glad.









I am kind of curious if anyone will post to say that they would speak up about a strangers parenting (physical abuse aside). What if someone was really screaming abuse at their kid or something? Or taunting and teasing them when the kid was in tears - yk? I happen to be very non-confrontational, _and_ (as mentioned in my other posts) I don't believe in butting in over other peoples' parenting techniques... but maybe there is a point at which it's ok/important to say something - to stick up for a child?

What do you think mamas? Anyone BTDT?


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## One_Girl (Feb 8, 2008)

The Easter Bunny thing does work very well so saying something would probably get you that answer. My mother used to use it and I used a birthday cancelation once when my patience was just gone. I later apologized and we got through it, but it does work.

I have spoken up when I see a really frustrated mom going over the edge, but not in a condemning way. I usually say something like "it gets easier" or "we've all been there, it will get better soon."


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Yea I agree. I think there are times where parents aren't technically abusive per se, but condiscending...


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## griffin2004 (Sep 25, 2003)

I wouldn't. It's been done to me and it was terrifying for both me and DD. I guess the woman was well-meaning, but she completely misunderstood the situation. And when she got in between DD and me, I nearly had a heart attack. I shook for 2 days.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Oh man, I wouldn't physically step between the mom and child. That must have been scary!


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## hakeber (Aug 3, 2005)

I thought that's why the Easter Bunny and Santa were invented...to have something to hang over the kids' heads during times of the year that tend to be consummeristic nightmares.

I mean if you DO push the myth of the Easter Bunny, it only seems natural that you would also push the myth that he comes only to the good little boys and girls and that the bad children recieve a basket of rabbit poop...or something.

I know Santa holds great weight for my nieces. My SIL need only whisper "tsk tsk tsk what would Santa think?" anytime betwen July and December and it's all smiles and sunshine for at least ten minutes.

We don't do the Easter Bunny or Santa. We decorate homemade chocolates and cookies and give them to eachother, as a celebration, but leave judgemental mythical beings out of the mix...because that is sort of their purpose for being isn't it? To be all judgy and pick which kids deserve toys and candy and which ones were too rotten (or poor) to count?

So in THAT case, no I wouldn't say anything because they are just being socially appropriate/normative, and to confront them would probably give away the hoax which they probably go to great lengths to keep up.

But if I saw a mom or dad being _particularly_ verbally violent with a child and felt it was only escalating, I would WANT to suggest to the kid/s that they give mommy/daddy a break, and then ask the parent in question if I could offer to keep thier kid safe while they go outside and scream/have a cigarette/punch a wall, or I would WANT to maybe lighten the mood with a punchy bit of parenting humor we can all relate to that would result in the awkward silence/laughter that only a diffused disaster can create...but more likely I would ask a nearby guard or police officer to step in and diffuse before someone got hurt.


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## Kuba'sMama (Oct 8, 2004)

This thread reminds of a very painful regret I have from long ago. I was a teenager, working in a big department store chain. There was a woman there, raging at her kid, screaming, pulling her arm and the poor girl was just hysterical. I think she ended up peeing on the floor. My manager (also very young) and myself just stood back surveying the situation, feeling completely helpless. I think about it often (I get tears in my eyes even writing about it now). The poor child haunts me, but so does my lack of response and the utter helplessness I felt. I SHOULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING! but what?
Sorry, OT, but it's been in my heart for so long, just had to get it out somewhere.


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## pianojazzgirl (Apr 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kuba'sMama* 
This thread reminds of a very painful regret I have from long ago. I was a teenager, working in a big department store chain. There was a woman there, raging at her kid, screaming, pulling her arm and the poor girl was just hysterical. I think she ended up peeing on the floor. My manager (also very young) and myself just stood back surveying the situation, feeling completely helpless. I think about it often (I get tears in my eyes even writing about it now). The poor child haunts me, but so does my lack of response and the utter helplessness I felt. I SHOULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING! but what?
Sorry, OT, but it's been in my heart for so long, just had to get it out somewhere.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Oh dear. That's so sad. My heart aches for the child.









I guess more often than not we think "I shouldn't say anything. It's not my business. What difference will I make." But in the end the regret of not saying something might be worse than saying something and getting yelled at.


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## Kuba'sMama (Oct 8, 2004)

Yes! Thank you.
I think it is our culture that makes us feel isolated and alone, even in a crowded place like the mall, and that's why we prefer to ignore injustice rather than step out of our comfort zone.
That being said however, I've heard many cringe-worthy comments from parents (even my good friends), which I just let go, because I know they came from places of frustration, or being overwhelmed, or just tired. And I know that I must have said some things that perhaps could be interpreted as not-so-nice too, if not in content then in tone and delivery (like screaming at the top of my lungs, perhaps?)


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## hakeber (Aug 3, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pianojazzgirl* 
I'm glad.









I am kind of curious if anyone will post to say that they would speak up about a strangers parenting (physical abuse aside). What if someone was really screaming abuse at their kid or something? Or taunting and teasing them when the kid was in tears - yk? I happen to be very non-confrontational, _and_ (as mentioned in my other posts) I don't believe in butting in over other peoples' parenting techniques... but maybe there is a point at which it's ok/important to say something - to stick up for a child?

What do you think mamas? Anyone BTDT?

The only thing close to that that I have come was when my MIL was looking after my SIL's girls and I was there and they were eating spaghetti and being messy and my MIL was standing over the youngest (not yet 3yo) brandishing a steak knife and screaming to be neater and I very calmly, but very sternly reached over and grabbed the knife with a cloth napkin out of her hand and said, "Hey MIL, I think you need you need a break for a wee bit. Okay. I'll take it from here...why don't you go watch Weakest Link and I promise you the kitchen will be clean and tidy in 30 minutes when your dinner will be ready, okay?"

She never really forgave me, I don't think for "making her seem crazy" (yeah, that was my fault, okay.







) but I still felt pretty good about not letting her terrorize the children over dinner because her life was feeling out of control and scary.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hakeber* 

She never really forgave me, I don't think for "making her seem crazy" (yeah, that was my fault, okay.







).

Haha yeah She did a pretty good job of that all on her own.
Good on you for saying something. I have a friend that likes to hold my son up in the air, sitting on his hand... Kind of balancing my son... I'm like uhh...

You want to say something but you don't want to offend them for being unsafe with your kids...
ugh.


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## St. Margaret (May 19, 2006)

Spanking or anything else physical or intensely verbally abusive, yes, I'd say something, just as I'd speak up or call authorities (depending on my assessment of the threat) if someone was treating any person of any age that way.

I'm sure I've looked like the crazy mean mom a handful of times, like when DD pooped her pants (after having visiting the bathroom, and being potty trained for almost a year) in the dressing room at the mall the ONE time in maybe two years I was trying to buy some clothes without holes in them or stains on them, and I had to get her back across the mall to the one place with tables to change her on, and she wanted me to carry her but I knew if I held her or put her in the carrier or stroller, it would smoosh the poo all over her, rather than the quick clean up and change it was... still, me leading a screaming child and trying to not express my frustration... I knew I probably looked no different on the surface right then than the least-GD mama out there. I try to keep that in mind. Sure, many parents ARE regularly abusive (verbally and phsyically) but I have to assume the best.

Now, the mama screaming at her kids for running around an uncrowded space at Disneyland, where they were contained and safe and she was playing with them the same way five seconds before... I was close to saying something b/c I felt that my DD did not need to be exposed to a mom threatening to hit her children. The one other mom there and I were staring at each other, like we both were about to say something-- and then luckily she moved on. What does everyone think about a situation like that? I think if I was someplace like a park or library I would say something, to at least protect my child. Hmm.


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## Tummy (Feb 24, 2005)

Couple years ago, my mother called me and was ranting and raving about a lunch date she had. She was going on and on about this other family that were having lunch next to her.

I guess the mother *was* being abusive in many manners. She was calling her child names, the child was slumped down in the seat-head lowered. The mother was kicking the child under the table, yelling at her to sit up straight, to stop embarrassing her (the mother), to use her manners, that she was NOT going to get to eat lunch cause she was an embarrassment, on and on. Food came, the child got NOTHING, her mother gave her water and a pack of crackers that came with the salad.

I was horrified by what my mother was telling me. Finally I cut her off in the middle of her rant and said, MOTHER WHAT DID YOU DO!?!? She did nothing! Said nothing!

I was applauded! I truly do not believe that I could have done NOTHING if I witnessed that event first hand. It would have taken all that I had not to intervene myself!


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## ihugtrees (Oct 16, 2008)

I face this situation with my own family. My 2.5 year old second cousin and her dad live with my parents, and everyone in the house...my parents, my brothers, the little girl's dad...all taunt this little girl. Tease her, hold her down and tickle her until she cries, take things from her and hold them out of her reach until she cries...and often, she gets so upset she can't get a hold of herself, and she ends up being spanked for not stopping crying









I never know what to say, but I hate being around them for this very reason.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Tammy and Ihugtrees. I would definately say something in both situations. That's abuse to me.


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## Latte Mama (Aug 25, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ihugtrees* 
I face this situation with my own family. My 2.5 year old second cousin and her dad live with my parents, and everyone in the house...my parents, my brothers, the little girl's dad...all taunt this little girl. Tease her, hold her down and tickle her until she cries, take things from her and hold them out of her reach until she cries...and often, she gets so upset she can't get a hold of herself, and she ends up being spanked for not stopping crying









I never know what to say, but I hate being around them for this very reason.

Why? Why on earth would they do this to this poor baby







? Your family are bullies, sorry.


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## JMJ (Sep 6, 2008)

I talk to close friends about discipline, but even then, I do it when it's not in the moment, and I generally talk in general terms rather than about how what they did in x situation was wrong, just that I don't think that spanking, timeouts and other forms of manipulation are respectful of human beings regardless of age. As far as strangers are concerned, I would alert authorities if I witnessed an abusive situation. Maybe if I saw a situation that I thought I could help, I might say something validating to the child or the parent. I would want to send the message to the parent and child that I was trying to help, not judge.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

This is something that I worry about.
What if you're at the mall or something and witness abuse? Is there any way you can alert authorities? You don't know their names or where they live or anything...


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## hakeber (Aug 3, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
This is something that I worry about.
What if you're at the mall or something and witness abuse? Is there any way you can alert authorities? You don't know their names or where they live or anything...

I think the /mall gaurds or a police officer could intervene, or if you saw their car you could give the authorities the number on their license plate.


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## ssh (Aug 12, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
Mods, just go ahead and delete this thread. I didn't mean it in a "judging other parents" way. I meant it in a "when would you step in" way.

I've made pleasant small talk with a couple of frustrated moms whose preschoolers were throwing tantrums. Being pleasant and sympathetic can help a person feel less stressed and embarrassed.

I've never seen any spanking or other violent parenting in public before. Once a mom was making her toddler do a time out at a playground. The little boy kept getting up and trying to follow his mom. I tried to explain to my DD, 2.5 at the time, why the mom was "being mean" (my DDs words). I don't know or care if the women heard us. If someone was hitting their kid in front of us I would at least ask them to stop because I don't want my DD exposed to violence.


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## AFWife (Aug 30, 2008)

So, you (general "you") would call the authorities if a mom swatted her child on the butt in public? Even in a state where spanking is legal?

I'm not trying to be rude...I'm genuinely curious


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## LotusBirthMama (Jun 25, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
Mods, just go ahead and delete this thread. I didn't mean it in a "judging other parents" way. I meant it in a "when would you step in" way.

Own your words, bb.

And no, I wouldn't have said something in the situation you described in the OP. Spanking is legal where I live so I can't imagine calling the authorities. What would they do??


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## lizziebits (Sep 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hakeber* 
I thought that's why the Easter Bunny and Santa were invented...to have something to hang over the kids' heads during times of the year that tend to be consummeristic nightmares.

I mean if you DO push the myth of the Easter Bunny, it only seems natural that you would also push the myth that he comes only to the good little boys and girls and that the bad children recieve a basket of rabbit poop...or something.

I know Santa holds great weight for my nieces. My SIL need only whisper "tsk tsk tsk what would Santa think?" anytime betwen July and December and it's all smiles and sunshine for at least ten minutes.

We don't do the Easter Bunny or Santa. We decorate homemade chocolates and cookies and give them to eachother, as a celebration, but leave judgemental mythical beings out of the mix...because that is sort of their purpose for being isn't it? To be all judgy and pick which kids deserve toys and candy and which ones were too rotten (or poor) to count?

So in THAT case, no I wouldn't say anything because they are just being socially appropriate/normative, and to confront them would probably give away the hoax which they probably go to great lengths to keep up.

But if I saw a mom or dad being _particularly_ verbally violent with a child and felt it was only escalating, I would WANT to suggest to the kid/s that they give mommy/daddy a break, and then ask the parent in question if I could offer to keep thier kid safe while they go outside and scream/have a cigarette/punch a wall, or I would WANT to maybe lighten the mood with a punchy bit of parenting humor we can all relate to that would result in the awkward silence/laughter that only a diffused disaster can create...but more likely I would ask a nearby guard or police officer to step in and diffuse before someone got hurt.

I just want to say that we do Santa and the Easter Bunny, and no, we don't do it so we have something we can hang over our son's head. It's just a fun thing we do during the holidays.

To the original point, I would never say anything to parents who are simply parenting in a different way than I do. I'd like to think if I truly saw abuse going on, I would have some way of contacting someone in authority and have something done about it.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
No I didn't mean beatings. I would definately say something (and report) abusive parents.

But what about just spankings?


Quote:


Originally Posted by *artgoddess* 
spanking falls under "physical abuse" as far as I am concerned


Quote:


Originally Posted by *AFWife* 
So, you (general "you") would call the authorities if a mom swatted her child on the butt in public? Even in a state where spanking is legal?

I'm not trying to be rude...I'm genuinely curious

I would offer to call the police if I saw someone physically assaulted, regardless of age. Let them explain how they weren't assaulting "that hard."


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## laughymama (Oct 14, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AFWife* 
So, you (general "you") would call the authorities if a mom swatted her child on the butt in public? Even in a state where spanking is legal?

I'm not trying to be rude...I'm genuinely curious

These were my thoughts too.

Here, if you called the authorities and reported someone spanking their kid, they would laugh you off the telephone or be thoroughly confused as to why you're calling.

I would not say anything or step in either, honestly. It's very much considered normal here and not abusive or humiliating or wrong at all to most people.

Edit: Just want to specify that DH and I do not think spanking is okay. I simply mean that here it is common to see a child getting a swat on the bottom in the grocery store/mall/book store/whatever. No one bats an eye when it comes to the spanking.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

I wouldn't say "spanking." I would say what it is, "assaulting."


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## laughymama (Oct 14, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kelly1101* 
I wouldn't say "spanking." I would say what it is, "assaulting."

When they ask over the phone what specifically is happening though and someone explained the child was getting smacked/hit on the bottom there essentially would be no response.

It's not okay but it just wouldn't warrant a reaction from the authorities here. IF they sent someone, it wouldn't be quickly or with any sort of actual concern.

It's frustrating but it's how things really are. There have been a few cases where the child was actually injured but the authorities brushed it off as a parenting just disciplining their child and did not respond or did nothing but laugh it off when they did respond and the parent said they were 'just spanking' their kid.


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## AFWife (Aug 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughymama* 
These were my thoughts too.

Here, if you called the authorities and reported someone spanking their kid, they would laugh you off the telephone or be thoroughly confused as to why you're calling.

I would not say anything or step in either, honestly. It's very much considered normal here and not abusive or humiliating or wrong at all to most people.

Edit: Just want to specify that DH and I do not think spanking is okay. I simply mean that here it is common to see a child getting a swat on the bottom in the grocery store/mall/book store/whatever. No one bats an eye when it comes to the spanking.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughymama* 
When they ask over the phone what specifically is happening though and someone explained the child was getting smacked/hit on the bottom there essentially would be no response.

It's not okay but it just wouldn't warrant a reaction from the authorities here. IF they sent someone, it wouldn't be quickly or with any sort of actual concern.

It's frustrating but it's how things really are. There have been a few cases where the child was actually injured but the authorities brushed it off as a parenting just disciplining their child and did not respond or did nothing but laugh it off when they did respond and the parent said they were 'just spanking' their kid.


A good friend of mine has a friend in the police force. He informed her that minor bruising found on a child of spanking age (2-10 or something) in an "approved spanking area" (legs or butt) are not investigated. It would have to be excessive.
And calling the police for spanking? Wouldn't happen. The child would have to be being brutally beaten for someone to bat an eye...


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

If the police don't investigate charges of child abuse and assault in your area, who does? That's who I'd call in that case.


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## ssh (Aug 12, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AFWife* 
A good friend of mine has a friend in the police force. He informed her that minor bruising found on a child of spanking age (2-10 or something) in an "approved spanking area" (legs or butt) are not investigated. It would have to be excessive.
And calling the police for spanking? Wouldn't happen. The child would have to be being brutally beaten for someone to bat an eye...

Here if you leave a mark on a child you would be investigated by child services. Bruising would be a big deal if it was caused by a caregiver.


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## AFWife (Aug 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kelly1101* 
If the police don't investigate charges of child abuse and assault in your area, who does? That's who I'd call in that case.

What I'm saying is that spanking isn't considered abuse or assault in the state of Texas. There is no one TO call.

OP, I'm sorry I derailed your thread


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## LotusBirthMama (Jun 25, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kelly1101* 
If the police don't investigate charges of child abuse and assault in your area, who does? That's who I'd call in that case.

Spanking isn't assault or abuse _according to the law_. You really think CPS would take a call about a parent spanking a kid in a public place seriously?


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## Trinitty (Jul 15, 2004)

I used to speak up in lots of situations: littering, foul language, spitting, etc..... It depends on the situation.

If it was an assault, and I consider "spanking" an assualt, I would intervene on instinct, but I have no idea what I would do. I know that I would just react.

Otherwise, I am not sure. I would have to be in the situation.... in the restaurant situation, I imagine I would have said something.

Problem 1: When DH is with me, it really bothers him when I intervene with strangers, because it automatically involves him, and with men, especially muscular men such as DH, there is an instant physical layer added to the tension.

Problem 2: I now almost always have DD with me, and I never want to do anything that would endanger her or really upset her, so, it would really depend on what that other adult was doing.

Trin.


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## laughymama (Oct 14, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kelly1101* 
If the police don't investigate charges of child abuse and assault in your area, who does? That's who I'd call in that case.

Like PPs have said, here "spanking" is not consider abuse or assault. DFS/CPS would not look into it here at all.
There's no one to call.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AFWife* 
OP, I'm sorry I derailed your thread









No worries. It's all very interesting to read


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AFWife* 
What I'm saying is that spanking isn't considered abuse or assault in the state of Texas. There is no one TO call.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *LotusBirthMama* 
Spanking isn't assault or abuse _according to the law_. You really think CPS would take a call about a parent spanking a kid in a public place seriously?


Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughymama* 
Like PPs have said, here "spanking" is not consider abuse or assault. DFS/CPS would not look into it here at all.
There's no one to call.

I'm sure it is against the law if it causes serious enough injury, whatever the law may be in that case (bruising, bleeding, whatever). And since I don't know the severity of the assault (so to speak) on the child, and can't attest to whether it is legal spanking or illegal abuse, I would definitely involve whoever is qualified to make that judgement. I would report a case of suspected abuse, and let the matter be investigated, and that's exactly how I would word it: "It appears to be abuse." There's no way I could look myself in the mirror if I saw someone striking a child, and did nothing because I didn't know if it was "legal spanking" or actual abuse.

I mean, if I see someone breaking a lock to get into a house, I consider it my duty to call the police. Could it be totally legal-- as in, the person who lives there locked themselves out? Sure. But I'm not qualified to say that's the case, so I'm going to call in the experts and let THEM sort it out.


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## LotusBirthMama (Jun 25, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kelly1101* 
I'm sure it is against the law if it causes serious enough injury, whatever the law may be in that case (bruising, bleeding, whatever). And since I don't know the severity of the assault (so to speak) on the child, and can't attest to whether it is legal spanking or illegal abuse, I would definitely involve whoever is qualified to make that judgement. I would report a case of suspected abuse, and let the matter be investigated, and that's exactly how I would word it: "It appears to be abuse." There's no way I could look myself in the mirror if I saw someone striking a child, and did nothing because I didn't know if it was "legal spanking" or actual abuse.

I mean, if I see someone breaking a lock to get into a house, I consider it my duty to call the police. Could it be totally legal-- as in, the person who lives there locked themselves out? Sure. But I'm not qualified to say that's the case, so I'm going to call in the experts and let THEM sort it out.

You really don't think you are qualified to decide if a mom swatting her kids butt in WalMart is abuse in the eyes of the law or CPS?









Four babies in the last 3 months have been beaten to death in NYC. I'm thinking CPS has its hands full in the child abuse department.


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## hakeber (Aug 3, 2005)

I think we all may have very different visions of spanking here. If I saw a mom doing to a child what _my_ parents called spanking (pants down, bottom exposed, bent over a knee, and smacked to leave welts with a wooden spoon) out in the open, I would call CPS...I am not sure what Kelley thinks, but I don't think of an instinctual, or sudden, or singular swat to someone's clothed behind as spanking. I don't think it's great parenting, but I also don't think that it's worth a call to the gaurds, personally. It's when things appear to be escalating, or a child seems visibly terrorized, that it makes me wonder...if this person is comfortable terrorizing their child openly with violent language and physical violence IN PUBLIC, what's happening behind doors?

Maybe I'm wrong though.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

As horrible as I find spanking (and yes, I'm in the camp that thinks any sort of hitting of another person is assault), NOTHING would happen if you called law enforcement or CPS in my state.

It's still legal (and well supported!!) to PADDLE kids in some of our public schools here! Bruising on the buttocks is not considered abuse here, is NOT agains the law and would not be looked into at all.

I guess maybe we are lucky - as accepted as spanking is around here, I don't think I've ever seen it happen in public. Once I heard a lady threatening her kids with it, but that's all. I really think it would be an upsetting experience for both ds and I to witness spanking - and in many ways I think I would have a hard time NOT reacting.


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## Kelly1101 (Oct 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LotusBirthMama* 
Four babies in the last 3 months have been beaten to death in NYC. I'm thinking CPS has its hands full in the child abuse department.

Maybe if someone had called when the parents were hitting their children in public, some of those deaths would have been prevented.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hakeber* 
if this person is comfortable terrorizing their child openly with violent language and physical violence IN PUBLIC, what's happening behind doors?

Exactly. For me a willingness to strike a child is a red flag, and seriously I would not feel right NOT calling it in, because obviously a closer look is warranted.


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## morgainesmama (Sep 1, 2004)

Sometimes, I say something. I say something to those parents who seem to be escalating. I do it with the memory of myself in my most difficult times -- the parent may have just gotten an eviction notice, for instance, or divorce papers, or a phone call from their husband's oncologist, and the kiddo may be off the wall after a long, stressful time.

So I look at that mama and just try to empathize in a way that might diffuse the situation. "Man, they really give you a run for their money, don't they?" (referring to the child). Try to engage her in conversation, talk to the kiddo directly, say something like "You're having a hard time in the store, huh? Maybe if you're good to your mama, you can leave the store a little faster." Or whatever might be appropriate in the situation.

Even if it's the mother's/caregivers' standard approach to scream, slap at, or snark at their kid, I've hopefully not made the situation worse by offending or embarrassing the adult. Even if the kids doesn't at all deserve to be the victim of his parent's bad behavior, his stopping whatever he's doing that's upsetting her isn't going to make the situation worse for him.

And, I've had days where I'm not parenting at my best, probably exhausted and under stress, and a kind word from another shopper or whatever allowed me to step back and realize I was overreacting.

OTOH, I don't comment on parenting techniques. I'm not going to change anyone's parenting philosophy in a fly-by comment. I'm more likely to piss off the parent who's hitting/manhandling their kid, and then the little one may "get it" worse later, when they get home.


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## hipumpkins (Jul 25, 2003)

Quote:

Now, the mama screaming at her kids for running around an uncrowded space at Disneyland, where they were contained and safe and she was playing with them the same way five seconds before... I was close to saying something b/c I felt that my DD did not need to be exposed to a mom threatening to hit her children. The one other mom there and I were staring at each other, like we both were about to say something-- and then luckily she moved on. What does everyone think about a situation like that? I think if I was someplace like a park or library I would say something, to at least protect my child. Hmm.
I witnessed this exact situation, only the kid did get hit and slammed into her stroller. she was dancing around lamp post while the rest of the family was eating lunch on the grass. she was right next to them and they kept screaming at her to COME HERE and to STOP RUNNING. finally one got up grabbed her swatted her butt and slammed her into the stroller.
I did gasp out loud b/c it was a natural shock and we also got up and moved. My sister said, "So much for the happiest place on earth"
Still I feel like if I were to say something it would make it worse for the kid so no I didn't say anything to interfere.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Oh dear







I'm sad for the child


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## hakeber (Aug 3, 2005)

I found Disneyland to be specifically designed to push parents to the brink of sanity and beyond. The ridiculously long lines for everything, the over priced food and the endless merchants of crap and sugar...I would so not judge anyone for losing their sh*t there.

My mom took me and DS there when he was three, and I was so over it about 15 mins after our arrival and we were booked for _three_ days.


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## luv-my-boys (Dec 8, 2008)

personally I wouldnt unless I saw dangerous/physically hurting the child. You never know what the "real" situation is by appearance. I know that I have had my moments of being a not so steller mom and really having someone critique me probably wont help.

Plus for me having a SN child I tend to have a more "what you dont know" type feeling. Im sure that there are times people have seen me with my children and thought what a horrid mother when in fact im doing all I can to help my child and keep my sanity. So for that reason I dont.


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## AFWife (Aug 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *luv-my-boys* 
Plus for me having a SN child I tend to have a more "what you dont know" type feeling. Im sure that there are times people have seen me with my children and thought what a horrid mother when in fact im doing all I can to help my child and keep my sanity. So for that reason I dont.

This is the same reason I don't judge the mom that appears to be ignoring her noisy child or dragging them around a store...


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## RoundAbout (Aug 3, 2006)

Most "bad" parenting that I see is just a really negative hostile tone of voice and I try to optimistically chalk it up to parent having a bad day. Lord knows I've been there myself on occasion. On the playground I try to set an example hoping that my positive tone with my DS and other kids will at least reinforce the fact that being mean/yelling is not normal and accepted.

I once saw a public spanking. I was at an event with a friend and she had brought another family with them. I didn't know this family at all and when the Dad started spanking his under 2 yo DS my friend (who had brought them) got really embarrassed and immediately swooped in and said "here let me take him" and picked him up and comforted the boy. I thought this was pretty effective but obviously not something that can be done with a stranger. Though it reinforces my belief that breaking the tension is probably a better route than lecturing.


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## goldingoddess (Jan 5, 2008)

OP what you witnessed, I would no way ever say anything to another parent about. It is simply none of your business. If she was a close friend you could strike up a conversation about bribing and threats and if they really work, but as a complete stranger it is just socially wrong to ay anything about a different parenting style.

As for spanking in public, I would tell the parent that what they are doing is inappropriate and they need to stop or go do it in private.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Yea that's why I didnt....


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bcblondie* 
Yea that's why I didnt....

I think people keep bringing it up because it's the example you chose to use in your OP. Yes, you didn't say anything at the time, but that is the example you gave in a thread about whether to say something, so people assume there's a possibility that the example you gave is one that's "on the fence" in your mind.


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## bcblondie (Jun 9, 2009)

Well I was tempted to say something but I kenw it would be more rude and intrusive than helpful. But it got me thinking about where I WOULD draw the line and say something.
I mean, you could write things off as "the mom is having a bad day" or "one spanking doesn't mean they're abused"... but what if it's more than that.... better safe than sorry, no?


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