# Agressive Behavior -- Kicked out of daycare AGAIN



## ecrocks23 (Oct 1, 2004)

I am so upset and embarrassed right now. I just don't know what's wrong with my 2.5 year old ds. Tonight we were walking down the sidewalk when a family we barely know passed us. Ds went up to the infant in the stroller and gave her a nice touch on the cheek. I was right near him and reached out and told him not to touch the baby and then he very quickly slapped her across the face. I was so humiliated.

He's already been kicked out of one daycare and is on the verge of getting kicked out of his current daycare. I've been dealing with his aggressive behavior for about 1.5 years now, but he's made so much progress the last 6 months. In both daycare instances, parents see my ds hurt another child and call social services and the licensor demands he be kicked out or hire a one on one.

He's been evaluated through Early Intervention and I've been seeing a great child therapist for a couple months now and even these professionals tell me he has no delays, is very bright and intelligent, that he's normal and will grow out of it soon.

I know he's an incredible little guy - very bright, funny, curious, a joy to be around. Although he's extremely strong-willed, I generally have a great time with him. I just wish I could stay home with him, which is not an option b/c I'm a single mom with a mortgage to pay, etc. When I'm with him I think he's fine. It's when I have to deal with other parents or teacher that I begin to get upset and wonder maybe something's wrong with him.

The directors of his daycare are doing all they can so he can stay there. In our meeting the other day one of the directors broke down crying b/c she was so upset about all of this. She said she invited SK's teacher to come, but she said she was too upset about everything. They all adore him and are so compassionate. I don't know what I'll do if he gets kicked out of another daycare. It's such a great fit for him too. His teacher is so kind and patient, and they're always doing something fun so he never gets bored. I certainly will not be putting him in another daycare setting. I can't be moving him around from place to place every four months. Ds has a hard enough time transitioning from play dough to lunch let alone from one daytime environment to another.

I welcome any advice or support. Thanks.


----------



## chaoticzenmom (May 21, 2005)

Wow, I"m sorry that you're going through this. He seems awfully young to have been thrown out of a daycare already







Does he talk? I find that when my children have been the most aggressive, it's because they don't have the words for what they're feeling or wanting at that moment. Like, instead of saying "no, don't touch the baby" You might want to say " Yes, that's a baby, he's sweet and little, so be careful, like this"and then model to him how you softly touch the baby's arm.

I'm sure you've tried that, but just in case







It's hard for us to really teach children to use thier words because we have to tell them how they feel in order to give them thier words. You said that he's very bright, so maybe he thinks way more advanced than he can express with words.

I hope he doesn't get kicked out of daycare! Good luck.
Lisa


----------



## chfriend (Aug 29, 2002)

I'll bet you've thought of this, so it's probably no help...but, have you thought about hiring a babysitter instead of group care. He may just not be up to all the peer interaction that requires for a few more months.

I'm so sorry you're going through this...and happy that his current daycare is trying to find a way to work with him.


----------



## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ecrocks23* 
I am so upset and embarrassed right now. I just don't know what's wrong with my 2.5 year old ds. Tonight we were walking down the sidewalk when a family we barely know passed us. Ds went up to the infant in the stroller and gave her a nice touch on the cheek. I was right near him and reached out and told him not to touch the baby and then he very quickly slapped her across the face.

You probably have tried this, but maybe you could get everyone on board? I would try to be really positive in your language. This worked with my ds, though he's younger. I would just be very neutral and calmly take his hand and say, "Gently, gently. Thank you for the nice pats." or "Oh, Sheriff likes it when you pet him so gently." etc. I completely stopped any type of chastising when he hit, instead I just acted like he was intending to stroke the victim in a kind way and got carried away. He stopped hitting in less than a week. I also put a lot of very positive emotion into my voice when he was gentle, especially with his baby brother. I wouldn't go far as to say "good job", but only because I think that would have backfired, not because I wasn't willing to do anything to get him stop hitting!

I would think that the dcps would take a little more responsibility for protecting the other kids in a 2-3 year old setting. It might be better to look for a new place anyway!


----------



## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *natensarah* 
I would think that the dcps would take a little more responsibility for protecting the other kids in a 2-3 year old setting. It might be better to look for a new place anyway!


That's not all that easy. In this case, there were three adults standing right there, and he still managed to slap a neighbor's baby. Short of isolating him, there isn't always an easy answer.

I think it sounds like a good place for him. I just hope they will give him a little more time. Maybe with some more time, this will all just be a bad memory one day.


----------



## mamaduck (Mar 6, 2002)

First off, I would ask the center to document every single incident. I know its asking a lot -- but they could just keep a clipboard and jot down the time, what he was doing just before the behavior, who was involved, and any potential triggers. After a few weeks, you might be able to find some patterns in his behavior or clues for things in the structure/environment that can be manipulated to change the behavior.

Would the center be willing to work on learning, teaching and using some sign language with him? Sometimes, providing more avenues for communication improves violent outbursts in children. Sometimes.

Also -- I would experiment with some sensory activities. Sand, playdough, water, etc... Sometimes this sort of activity calms/soothes and decreases violent outbursts.


----------



## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Two thoughts:
Have you looked into Sensory Integration Disorder (Sensory Processing Disorder is the current name, but you'll find more info under Sensory Integration). The Out of Sync Child is a great book to start with. If your son is sensory seeking, it can lead to this kind of behavior - he just doesn't get the feedback that he needs to self-regulate. So, he keeps pushing and interacting physically to get that sensory input he needs. Usually this is assessed by an occupational therapist. A lot of kids who meet your son's description do have sensory issues (some don't, but some do).

Would it be possible to hire someone to 'shadow' him for 2 weeks? If there is someone at his side constantly, intercepting him BEFORE he gets to the hitting/pushing/shoving behavior, it'll be more effective than anything they can do after the fact.

I second the keeping a log of incidents. When does it happen? Were there any events leading up to it. Is it often at transition time? Well, then just have him be the teacher's 'helper' during transitions so that there's an adult there all the time. Is it when there are too many kids around? when he's bored? hungry?

Oh, and have you looked into diet? sometimes food sensitivities can really make it hard for a child to control his behavior.


----------



## katallen (Jan 4, 2005)

I agree with mamaduck, they need to be documenting the incidents and the possible triggers. In my dd's school they get an extra person in there to do that and the person follows only that child who is having trouble and documents. I would also suggest looking into a center that follows NAEYC guidelines because they tend to not use timeout, have lower ratios, and have a lot of sensory activities, and the teachers they hire tend to have child development degrees. It may cost a little more, but there are some nice perks to having a teacher with early childhood experience that include knowing how to deal with difficult children effectively.


----------



## lil_stinkyfeet (Nov 12, 2006)

My ds would do the same thing. I couldn't imagine having him in daycare








I think you have gotten some good advice.


----------



## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katallen* 
I agree with mamaduck, they need to be documenting the incidents and the possible triggers. .

Me too. As a provider, you feel really bad doing this. It feels like nagging, but it really is helpful. Just make sure they know you want them to write down even the small incidents.


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

I would also check into dietary triggers. Does your ds eat a lot of processed foods, sugar, dyes, etc..?

A lot of kids are sensitive to those things and the behavior completely turns around after they're removed.

Check out the Feingold Diet.


----------



## teddifer (Mar 24, 2006)

i'm not offering it as a cure-all, but my 2 boys had some extreme sib rivalry with aggressive behavior and nightmares and i tried a flower remedy and was amazed how much it helped them. There's a book by Barbara Mazzarella on Bach Flower remedies for children you might have a look at.


----------



## heartmama (Nov 27, 2001)

Ds was just like this and nothing but time helped. He just outgrew it.

I would hire a sitter have him cared for in home. A responsible college student may be affordable, especially if you exchange for meals as well as salary.

There is nothing "wrong" with your son--it's an unfortunate situation where he isn't quite old enough to conform to the expectations of these facilities.


----------



## ecrocks23 (Oct 1, 2004)

Thanks everyone for responding. Ds is pretty verbal - I think right where he should be. Encourgaing him to use his "big boy words" has certainly helped, but has not alleviated his behavior. I taught him to sign when he was younger, but he's dropped them all as his vocabulary has developed.

From day 1, his daycare has always given my incident reports - oh the dreaded incident reports. Based on everyone's suggestions, I've put them all in chronological order and created a chart along with the # of hours I worked on any given day, weeks that were higher stress for me b.c of work or grad school, etc. I'm going to ask his daycare for the meal schedules so I can try and find a pattern there as well. I've considered food allergies/sensitivities (I know he's sensitive to cow's milk so he doesn't have that), but haven't quite figured out the least disruptive way to pursue this. I know he has a profound awareness and sensitivity to my stress levels. Even though I may think I don't act any differently, somehow he still picks up on it and acts it out.

I have done some research on sensory disorders, and am not convinced one way or another. I'll have to get that book because it seems like a pretty complex issue. I'm also going to have an OT check him out.

I'm trying to get some legal advice and exploring some other avenues to try and fight this thing. This daycare really is a perfect fit for him, and considering that really want him to stay there, for now I'll put my energy into that (although doesn't help my stress levels much, does it







)

I decided that if things don't work out, I'll work something out with my (incredibly flexible) boss to change my schedule so I can stay home with him and do a combo of reduced hours/work from home/using up vacation time/coming into the office when my mom can watch him. At least this caould get us through September when he turns three and we have another 5 months of development on our side. There's no way I could put him through another transition to a new childcare provider right now. This way we could get a five months break and begin anew. Hopefully all will work out one way or another.

Thanks for everything.


----------



## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Even if he doesn't have developmental sensory issues, sometimes the activities they describe can be really helpful for highly sensitive kids who are on the border. I find this with our dd (who is sensitive, but doesn't have the sensory issues her brother does). Raising a Sensory Smart Child might be a good (even a better one) for you too. Have you read "The Highly Sensitive Child"?

Good luck with keeping him there! He sounds within the range of what I've seen at our kids daycare (dd had a chronic biter in her class last year - and there was never any talk of removing him), and I would HOPE that they would be willing to institute a lot of work with you before 'throwing him out'.


----------



## mamaduck (Mar 6, 2002)

Yes -- even if he does not have identifyable sensory issues, many of the sensory activities are calming and centering for *any* child. All children are sensitive, to one extent or another.

As far as verbal skills, there is a lag time between when a child "has words" and when they learn to use them in high tension situations. When a kid is stressed out, he will regress a little bit. Its hard to remember your words. In these situations, signs might come more easily. Other pre-verbal expressions (tantrums, crying, whining, etc.) should be taken seriously attended to as well.

When you look for patterns and relationships in the incident reports, take not of what time of day it is, especially in relationship to naps and meals. Also look at what areas in the classroom it tends to recurr. Try to get a feel for where and when it is NOT happening. If there are certain activities or times during the day that he is doing fine, that will give you some clues into what might help him at other times.


----------



## homewithtwinsmama (Jan 5, 2005)

There is an herbal tincture I used with my dd when she was aggressive for while at age four called Calm Child. That and fish oil (at peds suggestion-I used coromega brand)- kids called it orange pudding so it must not have bothered them). I second the solo childcare for a while till you get a handle on this. Then one on one playdates for a while before introducing the group setting. The SID is a good place to start and the FeinGold diet works miracles on a lot of kids with aggression issues.

Lorrie


----------



## tgb (May 17, 2005)

Besides the dairy intolerance, I would try eliminating wheat. At around the same age as your ds, we were having a lot of behavioral issues with my ds. He was oppositional and aggressive. After consulting with a natural parenting counselor, she said it sounded like a wheat reaction. We eliminated wheat and his behavior changed significantly. He is 5 now and has grown out of this intolerance and occasionally has wheat.


----------



## ecrocks23 (Oct 1, 2004)

Thank you so much for your ideas. After all the research I've and the advice I've been given regarding food allergies, we keep coming back to dairy and wheat. I actually bought the Feingold program a couple months ago and just haven't found the right time to begin all this.

He's so sensitive to change and things are so stressful now, I don't want to disrupt him anymore by him not being allowed to eat what his friends are eating at school. But at the same time, if the food he's eating is causing his agressive behavior, I want to end that ASAP. So I'm not sure what, when or how to do this the most gently and least disruptive to him.


----------



## ecrocks23 (Oct 1, 2004)

Does anyone know how I should begin with the dietary changes? Should I try Feingold first, or eliminate dairy first, or eliminate wheat first, or eliminate dairy and wheat, or do everything at once? I'm not sure which makes the most sense.

Thanks.


----------



## chfriend (Aug 29, 2002)

erocks, if you google "elimination diet" you can get some ideas about how to implement some changes. My dd1 is allergic to wheat and oranges.

I'd start by preparing your ds's favorite foods that don't have dairy and wheat in them for a week or so. See what kind of changes you get.

It helps me to remember with dd1 that the allergies cause pain to her, so when she acts in ways I find hard, she's responding to pain. It might help the teacher to think this way as well.


----------



## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ecrocks23* 
Does anyone know how I should begin with the dietary changes? Should I try Feingold first, or eliminate dairy first, or eliminate wheat first, or eliminate dairy and wheat, or do everything at once? I'm not sure which makes the most sense.

Thanks.

I'd ask the parents over on the allergies board:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...play.php?f=307

they're quite knowledgeable and can help, I'm sure.


----------



## guestmama9916 (Jun 24, 2006)

What about the amount of sleep he's getting? Is it enough? There was a little girl in my son's class that was aggressive (slapping, hitting, biting everyone.. even the teachers) and she was the only one that didn't nap consistently at daycare. Now that she's 3, she takes good naps and is so much better. She still tries to bite sometimes but not nearly as much. She is sweet, funny and a pleasure to be around now. Its like she's not even the same child anymore.
Hang in there!

Kim


----------



## Dechen (Apr 3, 2004)

There is no way in Hades my dd could have handled a group daycare situation at 2.5. She would have been kicked out for sure.









At 3, her physical behaviors have calmed down enough for preschool, but it really took until just before her third birthday that she's was up for it. And she still pushed her friends around, just not enough to be a big deal.

So based on personal experience, I agree with Heartmama. Your boy is on the more physical side of the spectrum. There doesn't have to be anything wrong with him. He may just be a kid who communicates with his body.

The baby slapping incident is sooo something dd might have done. I learned to never tell her "gentle" while she was near someone hittable. Heck, I still don't like her touching babies because she isn't very gentle. Not out of spite - she's just physically "loud." It sounds like he hit the baby as part of his communication with YOU.

I was lucky to be able to stay home with dd, but if I'd needed childcare I would have needed to find a babysitter or nanny rather than a group daycare.

I hope he doesn't get kicked out of where he is, but if he does don't let it make you feel like you're doing anything wrong as a mama, or that there's something wrong with him.


----------

