# When does a circumcision take place?



## evilgenius (Jun 4, 2004)

After a baby is born, when does the circ take place? Immediately? A few days later?


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Hopefully never.

But it depends. Usually the next day. (Before the awareness of the baby as a real human being sets in.)


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## shelbean91 (May 11, 2002)

When I had ds1, if I chose to do it, it would have been when he was about 6 hrs old (he was born in the middle of the night and would have done it around 9am).


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## broodymama (May 3, 2004)

They asked me the day I was released, DS was about 30 hours old. Of course my response was "H*ll no!"


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## feebeeglee (Nov 30, 2002)

I think it is the custom to wait until the 8th day for a bris (Jewish ritual and circumcision) and until some variable time in childhood but usually before puberty for a Muslim ritual and circumcision (I don't know if there is a name for the ceremony.)

In the US, most (like 90% or more, surely) non-religious circumcisions are done before the baby leaves the hospital.


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## My2Matthews (Aug 9, 2004)

If I remember correctly from my childbirth class, the circ's are done by pediatricians starting at 9:00AM every morning. If you want your baby circ'd, it is done the next 9AM after his birth.

Can you imagine going to work every morning, knowing you are going to torture a bunch of helpless infants? I'd rather die.


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## Frankly Speaking (May 24, 2002)

There are also a few hospitals out there that will not allow the circumcision procedure to be performed on their premises and the parents that give birth at those go to a pediatrician later for the procedure. These are done a few days to a month or so after leaving the hospital.

Frank


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## zaftigmama (Feb 13, 2004)

Around here (and I don't know if it's a state thing, an insurance thing, a hospital by hospital thing) pediatrician's don't do the circumcisions. The OB's do. I always thought that was weird. I'm not sure who does it if there's a midwife at birth, but maybe parents who use midwifes are less likely to circ?

Also, I think Medicaid (in MA) is either considering not covering circ. or already doesn't. I wish insurance companies wouldn't pay for it at all - what a great message that would be. And if parents had to pay $200 (I'm guessing) maybe that would them think twice about it.


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## Mamm2 (Apr 19, 2004)

They wanted to take my ds on the 2nd day!!









I know the following states (as of 2003) do not pay for circ: Arizona, Missouri, North Carolina, Montana, Utah, and most recently Florida. They are a total of 12 states!!


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## Frankly Speaking (May 24, 2002)

OBs do about 80%, Peds do about 15% and FPs do about 5% nationwide. That can vary greatly from locality to locality. It is odd that OBs do most of them since they are specialists in female systems and have little knowledge or experience with male sexaulity issues but you also have to consider that they are the first ones that have a shot at them and the first at the money trough.

Mass. did consider ending Medicaid funding but in the end, did not.

Frank


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## zaftigmama (Feb 13, 2004)

Quote:

Mass. did consider ending Medicaid funding but in the end, did not.

That's unfortunate. Although if only Medicaid were to stop coverage, it could end up being a class thing- with the lower income families on Medicaid not able to afford it if it wasn't covered. I think it's a huge waste for everyone paying for their health insurance to cover an un-necessary surgery. Obviously in the rare cases that it is medically necessary, it should be covered. But never for a healthy infant. Or any infant with a healthy penis.

Take care!


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## shelbean91 (May 11, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Frankly Speaking*
There are also a few hospitals out there that will not allow the circumcision procedure to be performed on their premises and the parents that give birth at those go to a pediatrician later for the procedure. These are done a few days to a month or so after leaving the hospital.

Frank

Frank, I sure wish that were the case around here. Ds1 was 5 weeks early and they still asked if we wanted it done. The first day I said I hadn't discussed w/dh, the 2nd day they asked again and i said no, still hadn't discussed w/dh, but made the decision alone. After I got home, I couldn't believe they even asked me since he was so early.


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## Quirky (Jun 18, 2002)

Yeah, my BIL and SIL weren't at a hospital that might give a rat's patootie about the impacts of circ on a preemie - the hospital was perfectly willing to accede to their demands to circ their 35-week, 5-pound baby.

Ethics, shmethics.


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## MonicaS (Oct 27, 2002)

When I had my hospital births, I would have had to make an appt w/ my OB to do it after leaving the hospital. I have since had a "friend" that had a boy in the same hospital this past summer. They did his circ the day after he was born, about an hour before they were to be discharged from the hospital.









I had a friend that was so pleased w/ the fact that her birth was only going to cost her $125 b/c of her excellent insurance. The $125 was for the cost of the circ.







Even when insurance doesn't cover that particular procedure, having the insurance may allow it to still be very affordable.







: (That was worded weird, I'm not anti-insurance.)


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## zaftigmama (Feb 13, 2004)

Not anti-insurance, just anti the idea that insurance covers (fully or partially) a procedure that is cosmetic and not medical. And that we all end up paying for such services through co-payments and premium costs.

Least, that's how I read what you said.

From what I've seen with friends, circumcision is just so automatic. The nurses ask if they want the baby circumcised, they say yes, baby is whisked away and brought back circumcised. No information is given about it (maybe there is if they ask, I don't know what the nurses or dr.s say if they are asked about it), no options are given. I think if they were told it wasn't covered by insurance but they would be billed for it (and told the amount), told it wasn't medically necessary, and if the parents had to go with the baby and watch - maybe it wouldn't be so automatic.

I remember when I had my son, he had some blood complications and was in the hospital for a week. I knew for a few days he was going to have a particularly painful and invasive procedure and I was fighting with the doctors and nurses that I wanted to be there for it. I ended up losing the fight and couldn't go with him. The nurse came to get him, and two of my aunts "showed up for a spontaneous visit" to get my mind off of it. They had been waiting at my mom's request, my family was afraid I'd start running up and down the halls screaming, looking for my son.

The scary thing was, after the nurse took him, I did kind of relax because it was out of my hands. I remember feeling like a horrible mom because I was glad they didn't let me go and I didn't have to see my son in pain and screaming. I can imagine that the same thing happens with people who aren't sure about circ. but end up doing it because of whatever reason- pressure from spouse or family, believe it's healthy, looking like Dad, whatever. It's too easy to dis-associate from the procedure. The nurse assures the parents the baby will be fine, and whisks baby away. Maybe if they could at least accompany the baby to the circ room and see the baby strapped down. I don't know.

I know, I'm rambling. I'll stop now.


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## Frankly Speaking (May 24, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MonicaS*
I had a friend that was so pleased w/ the fact that her birth was only going to cost her $125 b/c of her excellent insurance. The $125 was for the cost of the circ.







Even when insurance doesn't cover that particular procedure, having the insurance may allow it to still be very affordable.







: (That was worded weird, I'm not anti-insurance.)


One thing that has happened is with the defunding of Medicaid circumcisions in Utah, the doctors were not telling the parents that it was no longer covered and were doing the circumcisions and presenting the parents with a $200-$300 invoice for the procedure. They were very surprised by this and most did not have the funds to pay. This has ended up as a lawsuit in the Utah courts. Some doctors are so keen to circumcise boys that they are providing the circumcisions free when Medicaid no longer pays for them.

Frank


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## jessikate (Jul 19, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Frankly Speaking*
Some doctors are so keen to circumcise boys that they are providing the circumcisions free when Medicaid no longer pays for them.

That is appalling. Whatever happened to the Hippocratic Oath? "First, do no harm."


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## loving-my-babies (Apr 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *My2Matthews*

Can you imagine going to work every morning, knowing you are going to torture a bunch of helpless infants? I'd rather die.

Me too. This is why I decided not to become a nurse or a doctor in the US. I couldn't deal with the cruelty. My pediatrician doesn't circ his kids and doesn't circ AT ALL because he feels it's unethical to mutilate innocent children.


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## MonicaS (Oct 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zaftigmama*
Not anti-insurance, just anti the idea that insurance covers (fully or partially) a procedure that is cosmetic and not medical. And that we all end up paying for such services through co-payments and premium costs.


None of the circ was covered. Her prenatal care and birth were covered 100%. Just to clarify.







(I'm sure the price of the procedure has since gone up.)


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## MonicaS (Oct 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zaftigmama*
I think if they were told it wasn't covered by insurance but they would be billed for it (and told the amount), told it wasn't medically necessary, and if the parents had to go with the baby and watch - maybe it wouldn't be so automatic.

It would probably help. How many people do you hear that are so thankful that they didn't have to watch? Just about every circ parent I know of. Makes me ill that they can send their baby off to deal w/ it as long as they don't have to be uncomfortable. How can you claim it doesn't hurt, or believe it when the Dr says it, when you aren't willing to go b/c you know your baby will suffer?!







:


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## wasabi (Oct 12, 2004)

I do know more and more insurance companies are not covering it. However as Monica poitned out if you have excellent insurance and didn't have to pay much for the birth then $125-$200 for the circing isn't a huge burden. On the other hand if you have middling insurance like me and have to pay at leats $1250 for your pg/delivery then what's another $200? Unfortunately it's not that big of an amount to really dissuade people.







Still it would be a good message for more and more states to have Medicaid not cover it and insurance refuse as well. They don't pay for annual exams or birth control for me but circs no problem.


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## homebirthing (Nov 10, 2002)

I don't know many OB's that know a woman's body or birth any better then a mans. It makes sense that they would be the ones genitally mutilating. They are more then quick to cut a woman as well, whether a c-section or otherwise. They don't call it a day unless there is some scalpel on an innocent person.


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## liawbh (Sep 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mamm2*
They wanted to take my ds on the 2nd day!!









I know the following states (as of 2003) do not pay for circ: Arizona, Missouri, North Carolina, Montana, Utah, and most recently Florida. They are a total of 12 states!!










Oregon Health Plan hasn't covered it at least since 1996 (not that I was planning on it).


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## calpurnia (Sep 26, 2004)

My partner was circumcised when he was 10 (he had infections basically from the age of 6 and eventually they figured this was impossible and he was circed).

I know that's not normal but I can't get my head around that either!


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