# Baby Whisperer?



## cndnveggie (Jul 2, 2007)

DS is 4.5 months old, and we need to help him improve his sleep - he can't fall asleep unless we walk around with him, and can't get himself back to sleep unless he's sleeping in his swing. Unfortunately, he's getting too heavy to keep walking around with, and is also going to hit the weight limit of the swing at some point... We are not going to try CIO, so we're looking for alternatives. Someone recommended the Baby Whisperer, so I bought the book. Although I don't agree with many of her philosophies, I am considering trying her "Pick Up Put Down" approach to help DS learn to fall asleep on his own. Because we aren't leaving him when he's crying and do comfort him, I hope it will not have the same affect that CIO would.

Just wondering if anyone else has tried this, and if it worked? Any other comments?

TIA!


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## maiat (Dec 15, 2006)

Yes, the Whisperer has helped me. The PU/PD method is what she calls a last resort. At first I was just doing PU/PD and it did work, but when I incorporated the 5 S's ritual, I never had to do PU/PD again, because DD didn't really cry much with those. I even wrote up a instruction sheet for babysitters using the Whisperer methods which worked for us so that babysitters could get her to sleep easier.

That being said, I always seem to go back to nursing to sleep because it works so darn well and she falls asleep so peacefully and quickly.

These links about 4-mo old wakefulness and "sleep regressions" were posted the other day and really helped me feel better about what's happening at night at our house.

http://moxie.blogs.com/askmoxie/2006...t_are_sle.html

http://www.kellymom.com/parenting/sleep/4mo-sleep.html

Let us know how it goes for you!

Maia
Ruby 5 mos


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## nina_yyc (Nov 5, 2006)

That sounds pretty normal for a 4mo old. Some babies just aren't ready to go to sleep by themselves until they're much older. Do you have a rocking chair? That might help with the weight. Or you could wear him down in a carrier.


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## TirzhaZ (Jun 15, 2007)

DD slept through the night a few times around 3 months of age, but after 4 months she hit that sleep regression and she wakes up multiple times a night since then. It's normal. The absolute best thing I've done for myself and my family is accept the night wakings. As soon as you get your DC to start STTN, he'll hit a milestone and start waking again. In my opinion, the stress over trying to get DD to STTN only to revert back to night wakings isn't worth it and I'm so much happier now that I've just made peace with it.

We rock and nurse to sleep. Also, DH has stepped in and begun rocking DD to sleep after I nurse her. This gives me a bit of a break to read before bed or get some things around the house done. I've met people whose children didn't sleep through the night until 4 years old, so don't get too bent out of shape trying to get your DS to sleep for 8-12 hours solid consistently every night. He needs a little mama loving in the middle of the night! And that's ok, because in a few years he'll be off to college and won't want to be hugged anymore. Enjoy it while it lasts!


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## TinyMama (Sep 4, 2007)

My 4mo dd doesn't STTN either--she's in bed for about 10 hrs, but she nurses at least twice (sometimes for ages, although I usually fall asleep after a while and don't really know how long). She also doesn't nap anymore at all unless she's walked in the ergo for HOURS. It's hard to determine how long is too long to try to get a baby to sleep, at least it is for me. Sometimes I try to get her to sleep for two hours, then she sleeps for 20 minutes and I ask myself if it was worth it at all.

I like Pantley's suggestion for babies who fall asleep for the night (or a nap) then wake up shortly afterwards. She says to catch the baby before she's completely awake, then nurse/rock back to sleep (use whatever works the fastest). Sometimes I can extend dd's nap or postpone her first night waking by doing that.


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## Momtwice (Nov 21, 2001)

The Baby Whisperer has bad breastfeeding advice. Kellymom (a website written by a board certified lactation consultant) http://www.kellymom.com lists it as a book that may jeopardize your breastfeeding relationship. So while you may want to "take what you need and leave the rest," be aware that there is a lot of advice in the book that can be harmful to your breastfeeding relationship.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Will your ds not nurse to sleep at all? Really at that young babies all need to be parented to sleep every single time. It's simply not realistic to expect otherwise.

-Angela


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## delphiniumpansy (Mar 1, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
Will your ds not nurse to sleep at all? Really at that young babies all need to be parented to sleep every single time. It's simply not realistic to expect otherwise.

-Angela

Not true. My hyperlactation made it impossible for my newest dd to nurse to sleep. So, I rocked her to sleep for weeks. Now that she is 13 weeks I found that she will roll over and go back to sleep herself after nursing. She puts herself back to sleep by rolling her head back and forth a bit and then "mmmmm's" a bit and she is asleep. Some babies are just that way.

I agree that nursing back to sleep works for many. It worked for my first until she was almost. 3 years. But, it does not work for everyone.


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## lurve (May 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *yellowpansy* 
Not true. My hyperlactation made it impossible for my newest dd to nurse to sleep. So, I rocked her to sleep for weeks. Now that she is 13 weeks I found that she will roll over and go back to sleep herself after nursing. She puts herself back to sleep by rolling her head back and forth a bit and then "mmmmm's" a bit and she is asleep. Some babies are just that way.

I agree that nursing back to sleep works for many. It worked for my first until she was almost. 3 years. But, it does not work for everyone.

i think, if i may humbly interpret Angela's post, she was trying to make the point that children really needed to be parented back to sleep some way, whether it is breast or not. not everyone has the magic boob (alas, i do not), but our society seems to think that babies should be able to put themselves to sleep. when in reality, babies need to be parented to sleep for YEARS!!! as i keep telling everyone who thinks i am crazy regarding helping my DD get to sleep - take a look at the number of adults who take prescription sleep medicines! obviously sleep is hard to come by for adults, so why do people think it is so easy for babies?


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## blsilva (Jul 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lurve* 
our society seems to think that babies should be able to put themselves to sleep. when in reality, babies need to be parented to sleep for YEARS!!!

ITA. It is entirely normal for a baby so young to need to be parented to sleep, be it nursing, walking, rocking, etc. If he is too heavy to carry, then you could find another way, but, IMHO, expecting a baby to put himself to sleep at that age is not realistic.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lurve* 
i think, if i may humbly interpret Angela's post, she was trying to make the point that children really needed to be parented back to sleep some way, whether it is breast or not. not everyone has the magic boob (alas, i do not), but our society seems to think that babies should be able to put themselves to sleep. when in reality, babies need to be parented to sleep for YEARS!!! as i keep telling everyone who thinks i am crazy regarding helping my DD get to sleep - take a look at the number of adults who take prescription sleep medicines! obviously sleep is hard to come by for adults, so why do people think it is so easy for babies?









:

Thank you for eloquently explaining that which I did not have the energy for.

-Angela


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

I haven't tried the Baby Whisperer approach (I bought this book before DS was born, and then lost it... a sign, perhaps?) but we do have to "parent" DS to sleep every time, pretty much. I guess it's just the way it is. I mean, even adults have their bedtime "routines" and some adults can't sleep if they don't have THEIR "pacifiers" (whether that's sex, PJs, tea, a shower, whatever) so I can't imagine babies are any more capable of putting themselves to sleep.

It sounds silly, but I find that if I'm rocking DS to sleep, I will try to engage eye contact with him by singing or whatever, and then slowly close my eyes myself and pretend that I'm very sleepy. I'm not sure why that works but it usually does.


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## swampangel (Feb 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TirzhaZ* 
As soon as you get your DC to start STTN, he'll hit a milestone and start waking again. In my opinion, the stress over trying to get DD to STTN only to revert back to night wakings isn't worth it and I'm so much happier now that I've just made peace with it.

I've met people whose children didn't sleep through the night until 4 years old, so don't get too bent out of shape trying to get your DS to sleep for 8-12 hours solid consistently every night.

I have to say I agree with most of what TirzhaZ said but let's not scare this poor mama by suggesting that she might have to live with sleepless nights for 4 years! That is very unlikely...most kids start to sleep much better much sooner than this. Not to worry.

But I do think that it helps a bit to accept that sleep goes in phases with babies and we can do some things to help but we also need to ride it out sometimes. You've probably hit a sleep regression...it is so hard when sleep starts to get rough again after a little break.

This time around with ds2, I just sucked it up as best as I could for nearly 1 1/2 years. I just knew that sleep is an up and down thing for the first year usually. Now that he can understand us so much more and has some words, we've started using some phrases to cue sleeping time and have dh get more involved. Ds has moved into sleeping most of the night (wakes up once to nurse now instead of 6 to 8 times!) and it is such a relief.

I only say this to give you hope and let you know that what you're going through is totally normal. If reading the books gives you some ideas to try and things that help just a little, that's great. But don't expect your little one to STTN regularly...most don't. In fact, I've never heard of a baby doing that naturally...only with CIO and I think folks revisit CIO whenever their babies hit a developmental leap/teething/sickness/sleep regression/etc. It makes me so sad to think about it.

Anyway, good luck with it and know that you're not alone!


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## cndnveggie (Jul 2, 2007)

I'm sorry I didn't get on here sooner - thank you to everyone for your comments. To be clear, I am not concerned if DS STTN or not (although he has been sleeping for 6-8 stretches for a couple of months, in his swing) - I am fine with getting up and giving him whatever he needs. My concern is more that it takes 20-30 minutes to get him to sleep in the first place, and sometimes he only stays asleep for 10-20 minutes and then we have to repeat the process. Getting up at 3am isn't so bad if I know it's not going to take 30+ minutes to get him back to sleep!

I think I'm going to focus on getting him to nap more during the day (I know realize I wasn't recognizing his sleepy cues and putting him down for a nap often enough), and also focus on an earlier bedtime with a bedtime routine. Hopefully those will help him get to sleep easier, and I won't have to resort to more "extreme" methods.

Thanks again!


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## herilane (Jul 1, 2007)

At 4 months my baby was definitely not ready for PU/PD, but Tracy's shush-pat worked well. It meant that she could go to sleep in a bed (mostly our bed). We really needed that, because my back was breaking after wearing her to sleep, and through all her naps every day (total wearing time 6-8 hours per day).

PU/PD may sound harsh, but isn't necessarily. We combined PU/PD with co-sleeping. After some months of shush-pat, DD showed very clearly that she didn't want me to pat or rock her, it only made her annoyed. So I stopped. She just needed to wiggle around and suck her thumb while I cuddled her, until she calmed enough to fall asleep. Sometimes she got upset, then I picked her up, she calmed down, and I put her down again and went back to cuddling.


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

Is it okay for a baby to have him sleep that long in a swing?


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## Decca (Mar 14, 2006)

Quote:

Really at that young babies all need to be parented to sleep every single time
Not true, even with your qualification. Mine needed to be put down and left to work it out for himself at that age. Any attempt to "help" made it worse. That's just his personality, and I respect that. That said, I don't think my experience means all babies should "learn" to self-soothe by that age.

The Baby Whisperer made me want to scream and throw things, and I like how Ask Moxie characterizes her. But I do think 4 months is too young for Pick Up, Put Down. I'd try the shushing and patting first, and perhaps think about if the baby is being overstimulated.


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## SublimeBirthGirl (Sep 9, 2005)

I got it at a thrift store but when scanning it couldn't get past her HORRIBLE, IGNORANT breastfeeding advice so I never read it. I can't take any sort of parenting advice from someone who thinks the benefits of breastfeeding are over-rated or entirely made up.

IMO, 4.5 months is too young for any sort of sleep training, and I've done some sort of sleep training with both of mine (around a year both times, again at 19 months to night-wean). I'm not totally opposed, I just think at that age it's too early. JMO.


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## meesa143 (Jul 3, 2007)

I used her EASY routine with DD and I am using it now with DS and it works well for us. Her nighttime suggestions haven't worked at all for me. It is a normal phase at this age to regress.
I don't think pu/pd would be considered CIO, as long as you are trying to comfort her.


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## danna (Mar 27, 2007)

Oops. Meant to start a new thread...sorry!


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## Evansmama (May 13, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cndnveggie* 
DS is 4.5 months old, and we need to help him improve his sleep - he can't fall asleep unless we walk around with him, and can't get himself back to sleep unless he's sleeping in his swing. Unfortunately, he's getting too heavy to keep walking around with, and is also going to hit the weight limit of the swing at some point... We are not going to try CIO, so we're looking for alternatives. Someone recommended the Baby Whisperer, so I bought the book. Although I don't agree with many of her philosophies, I am considering trying her "Pick Up Put Down" approach to help DS learn to fall asleep on his own. Because we aren't leaving him when he's crying and do comfort him, I hope it will not have the same affect that CIO would.

Just wondering if anyone else has tried this, and if it worked? Any other comments?

TIA!

Do you have a sling? They are a lifesaver!


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