# Leaving a child home alone for a (short) while? WWYD?



## changes (Jun 4, 2009)

From what age are you and your child comfortable for him/her to be home alone for a (short) while, and how long and under which circumstances, and how often? What, in tis regard, do you 'deem' appropriate in general, and then again, do you see it differently when specifically about you, your child and your home and situation or a particular occasion?


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## treeoflife3 (Nov 14, 2008)

It really depends on the kid. In third grade, I was home alone two days a week for a couple hours after school. However, I fully understood not to try to use the stove or matches or anything unsafe, to not tell anyone on the phone mom wasn't home (although we had caller id so I actually just ignored numbers I didn't know) and to not answer the door. I'd just get myself a snack from the fridge and turn on the tv or do my homework if I had any.

By the time I was 11, I was babysitting my 6 year old brother full time.

However, my brother couldn't have been left for a couple hours alone at 8. He DEFINITELY couldn't have babysat full time at 11. He wouldn't have been able to handle it.

My mom was also a single mom so its a good thing I was able to handle things like that. She couldn't afford to put me in after school full time and it was much easier on the finances to have me babysit in the summer rather than sending us to daycare all day every day.


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## chaimom (Aug 22, 2007)

I have twin boys who are about to turn 9. I regularly leave one of them alone for about an hour while I'm running the other kids around to lessons. He just stays home and works on home work, then watches TV or does something in his room. I think it really depends on the kids. My boys are very mature (most of the time), and we live in a safe neighborhood where he knows many people he could turn to if he needed help.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

In my old state of Georgia 8 to ten year olds could be left alone for "short" periods of time. But to be in charge of other children they must be older than 12.

I live in Oregon now and I don't know what the law says here. My 15 and 17 years olds are safe to leave for several hours if hubby and I want to go on a long day hike.


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## treeoflife3 (Nov 14, 2008)

haha by 17, I was home alone for full weekends so I could work while my family was at the land hunting.


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## insidevoice (Feb 16, 2011)

My nine year old is fine on her own for a couple hours. She does have easy access to help with family nearby if she needs it, and has the phone to call if she needs anything, but she really does fine. She isn't allowed to use the stove on her own but she can use the microwave if she wants a quick snack or a cup of cocoa.


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## Tamsin (Dec 20, 2009)

Ive left my 9 year old for short periods. She has a very responsible personality though.

eta: she also has access to lots of neighbours, and an aunty all within a few houses.


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## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

My 8 year has stayed home a couple times while the rest of the family takes a walk. She knows how to call if there is an issue. I'm not ready to be away from the neighborhood yet while she is alone, town is 15 minutes away, but I can see that day will be coming. She is very much a rule follower so I'm not concerned about her.


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## frugalmum (Nov 5, 2009)

Around age 12 I am ok leaving them alone and having them babysit younger sibling alone for up to 2 hours maximum, with frequent phone calls home. If there are no younger children in the house, maybe a very mature 9 and up -- it depends on maturity and saviness about personal safety. Some kids "get it" and others just don't.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Ds is 9, turning 10 this week, and we just started leaving him alone in the last 3-4 months. He doesn't like to be alone in the house, so it's not very frequent. He's becoming more comfortable with it. The first time we left him, we were gone for about 45 minutes (he was getting over being sick, his sister had something she wanted to do, and dad had a meeting). Most times it's about 15-20 minutes tops.

Before I let him stay home alone, I confirmed that he knew how to reach us on the cell phone. I made sure he knew the rules about answering the door (don't do it) and answering the phone (let the answering machine get it). He was under strict instructions not to use the stove or anything else possibly dangerous and to call us if he needed us. He spent the entire time playing Wii and didn't even notice!

I'd be comfortable leaving him home alone for about an hour. After that I think he would be uncomfortable. He's a very cautious and responsible kid. (I remember that my mom went back to school when I was 10, and I came home to an empty house and started dinner. So, 10 can be mature enough.)


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

I've left my now 9 year old home alone for 1/2 an hour a few times. However, part of the reason I felt comfortable with this was that we had a really awesome next door neighbor who always kept an eye on the house and a 120 lb dog who was very sweet but very very protective of ds. Both my dog and my neighbor have passed away. While I'm sure he'd still be completely fine, I just haven't left him since.

He does know my cell phone number and a handful of others who live close and he knows all the safety things I worry about (letting someone in, using the stove, etc).


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## MJB (Nov 28, 2009)

I've left my 8 and 5 yr. old sons alone for less than an hour 3 or 4 times now. They know to call us if they need anything, we know and trust our neighbors, they keep the door locked and don't open it for anyone (we tested), don't use the stove or knives, etc. The past couple times (the first times over 15-20 minutes) we let them play Wii while we were gone and we were <2 miles away. They loved it-- we usually limit their screen time to half an hour per day.

My sister and I were home alone after school every day starting when we were 7 and 5, and I remember us being very responsible. My favorite memory is when there was a tornado watch and I took her down to the basement with snacks, board games, blankets, flashlights, and a radio. If I could manage that at 7, I'm confident that my boys (especially my oldest) are capable of playing Wii for an hour.


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Off topic, but sometimes it takes me aback that there are mothers here who grew up with caller ID. We didn't even have a touch tone phone growing up (my siblings and I grew up in the 60's and 70's). Not that it doesn't make sense that women who could be my own daughter is having children... I just, realize how much things have changed since my bell-bottom days when things like this come up. It's funny.

Anyway, my dd was 9 in February and she absolutely does not want to be left alone at all. She is so, amazingly, responsible and mature, and wins the award every year for her grade for "integrity"... she would probably be fine if I left her alone for 30 minutes. But she doesn't feel comfortable with it. Perhaps it's because she IS so responsible that she realizes that there are many situations she's still not old enough to handle. Having a good head on the shoulders vs. having a good head on the shoulders to know your own shortcomings makes a difference in our book. I highly respect that in her and she has a lot of common sense. It will probably be another couple of years until dd is left alone for more than a 10 minute outdoor visit with the next-door neighbors, but I'm willing to go at her pace.


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

I remember being left alone for a couple hours at a pretty young age--don't remember how young. My parents left me and our two dogs home alone for 2 weeks when I was 15.

I saw some website that listed things your kid should be able to do before being left alone, like some first aid stuff that I *still* don't know as an adult. Well, it would be a good idea, I think, to teach them that stuff if you were going to be gone for more than an hour or so. Depending on who your neighbors are, maybe.


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

My kids are still young for this-- my oldest is six, and I will leave her alone in the house while we sit on the porch or chat with a neighbor, but that's as far as I'll go. Honestly, I feel she's safer outside, where there are neighbors she can go to if there's trouble. There are more dangers indoors, and I worry she might need help and forget how to access it. But I plan on using the same guidelines my mother used, unless there is some factor about my kids or our house or whatever that causes me to change my mind.

alone in the house for a very short time, in daylight (like the 20 minutes it takes to run to the grocery store)- nine years old
Alone in the house, for a few hours in daylight-- ten years old
alone in the house at night, for no more than a few hours--- twelve years old
alone in the house and responsible for siblings or other younger children-- thirteen
alone overnight-- 16
alone for more than overnight-- 18


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## mamalisa (Sep 24, 2002)

We started leaving ds home alone when he was about 9 1/2. He is not the sort of child who would ever really consider doing something he's not allowed to do, he just doesn't have it in him  He has stayed home for as long as 4 hours (for some reason he always gets sick on the day I have my specialist appts. that I can't miss!). If dd stays home with him they can stay for about 2 hours before they start to fight, so anything longer than an hour or so we get a sitter. We have super close neighbors and live in the sort of place that makes it almost impossible to know if someone is home so I don't worry much.


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## pigpokey (Feb 23, 2006)

Georgia doesn't have any laws about it.


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## mizznicole (Feb 13, 2007)

I always thought this was a legal thing too. I know for sure it's a legal thing in Texas with cars.


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> Off topic, but sometimes it takes me aback that there are mothers here who grew up with caller ID. We didn't even have a touch tone phone growing up (my siblings and I grew up in the 60's and 70's). Not that it doesn't make sense that women who could be my own daughter is having children... I just, realize how much things have changed since my bell-bottom days when things like this come up. It's funny.
> 
> Anyway, my dd was 9 in February and she absolutely does not want to be left alone at all. She is so, amazingly, responsible and mature, and wins the award every year for her grade for "integrity"... she would probably be fine if I left her alone for 30 minutes. But she doesn't feel comfortable with it. Perhaps it's because she IS so responsible that she realizes that there are many situations she's still not old enough to handle. Having a good head on the shoulders vs. having a good head on the shoulders to know your own shortcomings makes a difference in our book. I highly respect that in her and she has a lot of common sense. It will probably be another couple of years until dd is left alone for more than a 10 minute outdoor visit with the next-door neighbors, but I'm willing to go at her pace.


And if your finger slipped out before you got all the way around the rotary dial, you'd have accidentally dialed the wrong number...









My 9 yo ds is the same way, not comfortable or interested in being left alone. I'll mail a letter a block away leaving him at home for about 5 minutes. For a few years now, I've been leaving him in the car for 5-10 minutes if I can park up against the building so he doesn't have to cross the lot. I think he'd rather be left in the car. He feels like people are more available in an emergency. He can just go in the store and there will be someone. The house is more isolated and few neighbors are home during the day.


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## Polliwog (Oct 29, 2006)

We not only had dial telephones (and I can still remember the sound,) but my grandparents phone numbers both started with letters. They were either TU7-XXXX or TU8-XXXX.


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Polliwog*
> 
> We not only had dial telephones (and I can still remember the sound,) but my grandparents phone numbers both started with letters. They were either TU7-XXXX or TU8-XXXX.


Yes, the first two letters were the name of the area telephone exchange. Mine was MA6-XXXX or MAdison 6-XXXX. Just think of the evolution of texting (or lack thereof) without those letters on the phone that were only there to represent the name of the exchange!


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## zebra15 (Oct 2, 2009)

My son is 10 and is ok being home alone for 2-3 hours at a time. He knows how to use the phone and call me if he needs something. Ive worked up to this over the past couple years and am fully working up to dropping the sitter when I hopefully go back to work full time. DS will be 11 at the end of summer, is homeschooled and is completely responsible, able to manage himself, get his schoolwork done, make his meals in the microwave, do laundry, etc.

Again this is totally dependent on the child and I know many many 10 yr old who I wouldn't leave alone for 2 mins let alone 2 hours.

We live in the city/suburb and I do need to work with DS on his public transportation skills. My goal is by the time he is 12 he is able to get around via the bus if he needs to.


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## BubbleMa (Sep 24, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4evermom*
> 
> Yes, the first two letters were the name of the area telephone exchange. Mine was MA6-XXXX or MAdison 6-XXXX. Just think of the evolution of texting (or lack thereof) without those letters on the phone that were only there to represent the name of the exchange!


I always wondered why there were letters. 

My DD stays home by herself every now and then. She was 8 when we started (she just turned 9). It's never more than a few hours. Usually when SO has to work nights (or is out of town) and I have to work later and can't make it to the school before after school care ends. She's very responsible and mature, and likes staying home alone.


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

at 5 for about 20 minutes as i went across the street to water the community garden or to the grocery store or drop books at the library. always told my neighbor. dd LOVED it. i'd leave her reading her book and find her in the same position when i got back.

the first time when i seriously left her alone (with neighbour next door knowing) was 8 1/2 for 2 hours. she LOVED it. then she begged for more. so we left her for 5 hours. she HATED it. it was too long. we've maybe done it a couple of times. because i have roommates now she is never really alone.

i have no idea what is legal in my state.

but yeah. even at 5 i trusted my dd completely.

i've always made it a point since infancy to point out what exactly is HUGEly dangerous so she has never really tried anything she wasnt supposed to do. i mean yeah she has done it - only when we were home. but smaller things. never big things.

however she is my super independent child too. she has been cooking since she was 6. in fact we are now in the throes of concept cooking. what goes with what. so not everything cooked might be edible.


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## pigpokey (Feb 23, 2006)

It's not, in 48 states at last check and Texas is not one of them.

The car laws are because some people have left babies / toddlers in cars (usually on accident due to brain fog) and they've died when the cars got hot from the sun. It's reactionary. Of course you shouldn't leave small children and pets trapped in cars in the sun, and could have been adequately punished under child endangerment laws already on the books. If you leave a child home alone who is not up for it, you also risk child endangerment charges. However if you have a great basis for believing that the child can handle latch key / short periods on his or her own then there's no problem. So if my 8 year old is well behaved and responsible, it would not, I believe, be child endangerment for me to leave her alone watching TV or doing school work while I ran an errand. On the other hand, if she is 13 years old but has known conduct disorder and a drinking problem, I better not leave her alone. So you see it's not, and shouldn't be, about age and I truly hope most States continue to keep bright lines off the books. It also gives busybodies an opportunity to feel good about themselves by reporting perfectly safe children who are being spared considerably more statistically dangerous car trips while the parents run errands or other children to activities.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mizznicole*
> 
> I always thought this was a legal thing too. I know for sure it's a legal thing in Texas with cars.


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

http://www.latchkey-kids.com/latchkey-kids-age-limits.htm

georgia, md, sc, nc = 8 years old (stated guideline, except MD). however as pp pointed out it depends on how responsible/mature the child is.


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## SilverFish (Jan 14, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Llyra*
> 
> My kids are still young for this-- my oldest is six, and I will leave her alone in the house while we sit on the porch or chat with a neighbor, but that's as far as I'll go. Honestly, I feel she's safer outside, where there are neighbors she can go to if there's trouble. There are more dangers indoors, and I worry she might need help and forget how to access it. But I plan on using the same guidelines my mother used, unless there is some factor about my kids or our house or whatever that causes me to change my mind.
> 
> ...


i guess to me that seems extreme! i moved out when i was 18 and was living on my own (well, i had roommates), and had briefly lived alone at 16. but, i guess it really depends on what each child is capable of.

for myself, i remember my mom leaving me and my younger sister home when i was about 6 or so. i think, depending on where we live, i would be comfortable with that for short periods. especially with cellphones, communication in the case of something happening at home or a delay on your end is pretty easy and makes the whole experience safer.


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## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pigpokey*
> 
> It's not, in 48 states at last check and Texas is not one of them.
> 
> The car laws are because some people have left babies / toddlers in cars (usually on accident due to brain fog) and they've died when the cars got hot from the sun. It's reactionary. Of course you shouldn't leave small children and pets trapped in cars in the sun, and could have been adequately punished under child endangerment laws already on the books. If you leave a child home alone who is not up for it, you also risk child endangerment charges. However if you have a great basis for believing that the child can handle latch key / short periods on his or her own then there's no problem. So if my 8 year old is well behaved and responsible, it would not, I believe, be child endangerment for me to leave her alone watching TV or doing school work while I ran an errand. On the other hand, if she is 13 years old but has known conduct disorder and a drinking problem, I better not leave her alone. So you see it's not, and shouldn't be, about age and I truly hope most States continue to keep bright lines off the books. It also gives busybodies an opportunity to feel good about themselves by reporting perfectly safe children who are being spared considerably more statistically dangerous car trips while the parents run errands or other children to activities.


Agreed. I just looked at the latchkids link and was surprised to find that my state has a age 12 law to be left alone. I won't bore anyone with the details but I was always an independent child despite coming from a "good" home where I didn't have to be and was fully caring for myself by the time I was 15, including not living with my parents, working, and doing my own schooling . That was of my own choosing. And now, I'm not supposed to leave my children home alone at all until they are 12? I can see that for some children, and my 8y is the only one that is old enough yet for me to really get a good sense of her judgement. She may have her share of issues in some areas but being responsible is not one of them. She is very careful about safety and is quite the rule follower. 4 more years until I can legally leave her alone when I do have multiple other children and many, many car trips a day back and forth to various places seems well, crappy, for a lack of a better term.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

IMO-

when you think that MANY 17 year olds are in college and living alone and the military at 18 just starting to leave a 16 year old alone is extreme to me and I have raised a child into adulthood and starting leaving her alone by age 6-she went to sleep-over camp (in another state-without knowing anyone) at age 12 and sadly she had to "baby-sit" a 15 year old when she was in college

parents that encourage (for safety sake) children to be sheltered as above mentioned really are doing a long term disservice down the road in adulthood


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## kythe (Dec 20, 2007)

Be careful about relying too much on the "letter of the law" when it comes to appropriate age to leave a child home alone. This is very subjective and very much an interpretation of individual situations, when it comes to dealing with police or CPS. In my state, you are not allowed to leave a child 15 or under in a car alone, even for a few minutes. If they are not old enough to drive, they may never be left in a car alone. I used to think this only applied to babies and toddlers, until a mishap a couple of years ago that I don't talk about online, but lets just say local police take this law very seriously.

Personally, I take laws about child endangerment and leaving kids alone very seriously. I was left alone at a young age and I always did fine, I don't personally see it as a big deal. I have never reported anyone for leaving a child home alone, including my neighbor who had her 7 year old come home from school alone and let himself into their apartment for a half hour each day after school until his mom got home from work. He wasn't allowed to answer the door or go outside when his mom wasn't home (and he didn't), and all he did was watch TV, so I never said anything. But all it takes is crossing the wrong person, or a nosy busybody who likes to get involved, and you may have a hard time explaining to authorities why you didn't believe "proper" supervision was appropriate.


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## pigpokey (Feb 23, 2006)

A DFACs guideline is not a law that applies to parents. It is a guideline for case workers. The Latchkids site is very misleading. Just because DFACs is not going to be interested if busybody in Georgia calls and says "there is a nine year old home for an hour on his own after school" does not mean that I am going to be in trouble if my responsible seven year old is home alone while I run an errand.


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## newsolarmomma2 (Jan 6, 2011)

In TX you CAN leave any kid, even a baby in the car, if it's for FIVE MINUTES, but no more. Higher limits for older kids. This is sensible, as it is too hot here to leave kids in cars. When I was in San Diego and Mexico, I didn't mind because it was usually 65-70 deg tops. Anyway, there are more regulations too, but I only recalled the 5 minute rule, which was relevant to me. I checked only a few days ago, it's on DHS website.

I say it depends on the kid. Where I lived in Mexico, there were 5 yr olds out begging and working, and 7 yr olds in charge of their siblings. So, kids are capable in general, but not every one, KWIM? I think the dangerous ages are between 1-5, when they are big enough to be mobile and can escape safe places like pack n plays/play rooms,but too young to really know what is dangerous. Once they can follow directions and use the phone, I think it's OK to leave them for short periods, as long as it's a SAFE environment. By 9 they ought to be independent and by 11, capable of babysitting for a few hours. Just my opinion.

My favorite blog, Free Range Kids, talks about this topic a LOT! You may want to check it out.


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## newsolarmomma2 (Jan 6, 2011)

serenbat- couldn't agree more!!!


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## camracrazy (May 27, 2006)

In our state we don't actually have a law about the age when a child can be left alone. I did hear on the news one night when they had a story about some children being found alone that if the children were under 12 it would definately be "looked into" by law enforcement and CPS.

I can remember being in first grade and my sister being in 4th or 5th and we used to get up, make our breakfast, walk to the bus stop, and get on the bus to school by ourselves. Then in the afternoon we would ride the bus home, walk home from the bus stop, and do our chores until our mom got home. The only reason we didn't do the same when I was in K was because it was half a day K so I got out before she did. I can remember cooking my own scrambled eggs and stuff but luckily we never had any mishaps. In Jr High I walked home 2 miles from school with my friends everyday because the bus wouldn't run past your house unless you were 2 1/2 miles from school.


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serenbat*
> 
> IMO-
> 
> ...


Interesting perspective. One I don't agree with. I was very sheltered... had a babysitter until I was 13. My grandfather lived with us, so I was never actually ever alone in the house. Ever. I went off to college (and was supporting myself) when I was 17 and didn't have any problems adjusting to that, even though I was not given any real independence until I actually left home. However, my parents taught me that there is always accountability in life, even if it's to myself and how to be a responsible person. I think it's kind of ridiculous to imply that because there is supervision, that a child won't be able to go off to college by themselves or become responsible adults. That's like saying a kid will never learn to drive unless they are in the car alone. A kid doesn't have to be alone in a house to learn responsibility. If you're doing your job as a parent to prepare your child for adulthood, it doesn't matter if they are home alone or there is always someone else in the house.


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## belltree (Mar 10, 2009)

What an interesting thread. I grew up in the 70s in Europe and I was going to the bakery (10min walk) on Saturday mornings alone at age 4. I was left alone at home for several hours once I knew how to operate a phone (age 4 as well). I was roaming the neighbourhood with friends at age 3. I was taking trains including transfers at age 6 once I could read. I never felt afraid or unsafe.

My mother kept always telling us how I was her responsible child, while my little brother was always in dreamland and would not have been able some of these scenarios before age 8-10.

Now I live on a different continent several decades later and have a child of my own and people are reacting surprised because I let him roam more freely than others would. For instance, he (1.5years old) stays in the children's room of the library (which has doors he cannot open and the librarians know him) for 10min or so, while I check out some adult books on a different floor.

Some people even mentioned that this is illegal and he is way to young to be left alone. I cannot imagine not leaving my child alone for an afternoon at age 6.

I feel most people would think I am insane, but I loved my freedom as a child, I enjoyed unsupervised time and we all knew we had to watch out for one another, those free days were important to me. Our school district even encouraged parents to let children walk alone (without parents) to school, to allow for bonding among the children.

I am having a hard time reconciling my childhood experiences with modern behavior and norms on a different continent.


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> A kid doesn't have to be alone in a house to learn responsibility. If you're doing your job as a parent to prepare your child for adulthood, it doesn't matter if they are home alone or there is always someone else in the house.


i agree. i leave my dd alone not to teach her independence/responsibility but to honor her wishes. she wants to stay home alone rather than go with me somewhere and interrupt what she is doing. i honor that wish. has nothing to do with teaching her independence or responsibility. to me its the same as letting her cut with a sharp knife. as long as she can do it, she can do 'whatever' she wants to do.


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## camracrazy (May 27, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *belltree*
> 
> What an interesting thread. I grew up in the 70s in Europe and I was going to the bakery (10min walk) on Saturday mornings alone at age 4. I was left alone at home for several hours once I knew how to operate a phone (age 4 as well). I was roaming the neighbourhood with friends at age 3. I was taking trains including transfers at age 6 once I could read. I never felt afraid or unsafe.
> 
> ...


At our library you cannot leave an unattended child under 7. Older siblings under 12 cannot be a sole caretaker for a child under 7. If a child under 7 cannot locate their parent in the library the police will be called.

That said, I have let my older 2 go upstairs by themselves at the main library, and have left all 3 in the children's section in some of the smaller branches (mine are 10, 6, and 3). No one has ever said anything. I think the "rule" may be more to stop people from thinking they can drop younger children off at the library and leave like it's some kind of daycare.


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *belltree*
> 
> What an interesting thread. I grew up in the 70s in Europe and I was going to the bakery (10min walk) on Saturday mornings alone at age 4. I was left alone at home for several hours once I knew how to operate a phone (age 4 as well). I was roaming the neighbourhood with friends at age 3. I was taking trains including transfers at age 6 once I could read. I never felt afraid or unsafe.
> 
> ...


The 70's and Europe are much different than the 2010's and urban US. Of course you can't reconcile it. They are vastly different.


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## AllisonR (May 5, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> The 70's and Europe are much different than the 2010's and urban US. Of course you can't reconcile it. They are vastly different.


And the 2010's and Europe are much different than the 2010's and urban US.

Maybe I'm not on another continent but another planet. Either that or I'm raising chickens. Or both.









My 6yo and 4yo have both been left alone in the house, together and by themselves. They ask to do this. And I think they enjoy the little freedom and responsibility. Not for 4 hours. But for 15 min when my DH drops me off at a meeting or the bus stop, or if I walk down the street to the neighbors to pick one or the other up after a play date. They also walk to the local playground together or by themselves, and I join them every 15 min or so, in between chores. If they were flaky, or not ready, or not wanting to, I would not leave them. But they are, and I do.

I just can not imagine a 13yo needing a babysitter. As opposed to being able to babysit. Or a 15 yo not able to say home for extended periods. At that age, they will be taking the bus or bike into town with friends. If not then, then when? When they are 18 and leaving for university? Seems to me like a huge dose of independence to learn in no time, as opposed to a more gradual learning curve.


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## kythe (Dec 20, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> The 70's and Europe are much different than the 2010's and urban US. Of course you can't reconcile it. They are vastly different.


This does bring up another point I don't believe anyone has gotten in to. I don't believe the world ever has been a "safer" or "better" place for kids to be left alone. I know I said earlier that I tend to be rather lenient in personal views of kids being left alone. But while most of us turned out fine, all it takes is one accident or problem, and you have serious issues. This is why guidelines have been set in place as to what age child is likely to be able to care for themselves.

I work in a nursing home, we have a resident who has PTSD after an incident when she was left home alone when she was 10. This was back in the 1930's and she had been so proud that her mother believed she was mature enough to take care of the house for a few hours. That day, a man broke into her house while her mother was out and abused her, and she never fully recovered. In her dementia in her old age, she kept reliving that moment over and over. Now, even if she had been 12 or older, the outcome may not have changed. But it's something to consider with this type of situation. Most of us never had a bad experience being left alone, but there is always the possibility and many problems can be prevented.


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## berry987 (Apr 23, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> The 70's and Europe are much different than the 2010's and urban US. Of course you can't reconcile it. They are vastly different.


How do you mean? There is often a misconception that the US today is more dangerous than it was in the 1970s, when in fact it is safer. The only real difference I see is a culture that supports children walking around alone without adults.


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

It's not about safety... it's about culture. There is a difference between then and now and there is a difference between there and here. I've lived in all of those times and places. There's just a difference.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I can't understand, for the life of me, letting a 4, 5, 6, or 7 yr old (hell, 8 or 9 yr old, for that matter) home all alone. For 15 minutes, or for 4 hours. What could be worth that risk? A sense of independence? Not having the nuisance of loading them in the car to run to the grocery store? Not having to ask a neighbor to watch them or send them to the after school program? I wouldn't call it free-range; more like neglectful parenting.

Flame away, I don't really care. Doesn't matter to me if you walked to the store as a kid when you were 2, still doesn't make it a sound decision to leave a child home alone.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife*
> 
> I can't understand, for the life of me, letting a 4, 5, 6, or 7 yr old (hell, 8 or 9 yr old, for that matter) home all alone. For 15 minutes, or for 4 hours. What could be worth that risk? A sense of independence? Not having the nuisance of loading them in the car to run to the grocery store? Not having to ask a neighbor to watch them or send them to the after school program? I wouldn't call it free-range; more like neglectful parenting.
> 
> Flame away, I don't really care. Doesn't matter to me if you walked to the store as a kid when you were 2, still doesn't make it a sound decision to leave a child home alone.












Thanks! That is awesome. I feel much the same way.


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## MamaofLiam (Nov 20, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife*
> 
> I can't understand, for the life of me, letting a 4, 5, 6, or 7 yr old (hell, 8 or 9 yr old, for that matter) home all alone. For 15 minutes, or for 4 hours. What could be worth that risk? A sense of independence? Not having the nuisance of loading them in the car to run to the grocery store? Not having to ask a neighbor to watch them or send them to the after school program? I wouldn't call it free-range; more like neglectful parenting.
> 
> Flame away, I don't really care. Doesn't matter to me if you walked to the store as a kid when you were 2, still doesn't make it a sound decision to leave a child home alone.


So then would you allow your children to play outside or in the neighborhood alone? Or are you with them there too? I'm just wondering because I don't really see home alone and home outside as that much different...

I personally think there is a fine balance you have to walk. Too much hovering (i.e., helicopter) isn't good, but at the same time you don't want to be neglectful either. I think it's a bit extreme to say you wouldn't leave an 8 year old home alone for 10-15 minutes. Of course it would depend on the child, but really, all 8 year olds??? There is always going to be some element of risk in life - you are alive, therefore there is risk.

Drummer's Wife I'm not knocking you for believing or thinking that you shouldn't leave an 8/9 year old home alone in _your situation_. But I don't think you can take what you believe is right in your situation and generalize to the rest of the world. Different strokes for different folks, yk? I think there are circumstances where it is fine for a child to be alone. Just like there are circumstances where its not okay. I'm not the judge, jury or the authority on other people's circumstances. Just my own.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

I left my three year old alone (downstairs) for 15-20 minutes so I could take a bath - I guess I'm a bad parent too. WOW!


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## belltree (Mar 10, 2009)

Yes, I can see that people behave different towards children if I compare now (small town US 2010) and then (small town Europe 70s). I also agree that one instance can be potentially harmful, but I am not sure that we as parents can prevent this incidence from happening even if we are with them every second until they are 18; and it raises the question if we should let go at age 18, or even later? Most abuse happens from family members and not random strangers. There is less crime compared to several decades ago. The sidewalks around here are wide, there are crosswalks on every intersection.

I personally did enjoy being without parental supervision at times, there is a difference in play, social structure, conversations amongst friends without adults; we also knew that we had to watch out for each other and for ourselves. I would love for my child to be able to experience these adult free moments without having to wait until their 18.

I prefer my child learns at an early age how to handle "life" (walking across the street, using the phone, putting on a jacket, asking for help, taking the bus, being responsible towards themselves and others). From my experience in the US, a lot of students entering college have no idea how to handle their newly gained freedom. Maybe practicing how to behave responsibly for oneself at an earlier age would have been good for these young adults.

That said, there are different neighborhoods, different parents and different children. I cannot imagine that there can nor should there be one rule for every child in the US for when they can be left alone.


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *velochic*
> 
> Interesting perspective. One I don't agree with. I was very sheltered... had a babysitter until I was 13. My grandfather lived with us, so I was never actually ever alone in the house. Ever. I went off to college (and was supporting myself) when I was 17 and didn't have any problems adjusting to that, even though I was not given any real independence until I actually left home. However, my parents taught me that there is always accountability in life, even if it's to myself and how to be a responsible person. I think it's kind of ridiculous to imply that because there is supervision, that a child won't be able to go off to college by themselves or become responsible adults. That's like saying a kid will never learn to drive unless they are in the car alone. A kid doesn't have to be alone in a house to learn responsibility. If you're doing your job as a parent to prepare your child for adulthood, it doesn't matter if they are home alone or there is always someone else in the house.


I must agree. This reminds me of when ds1 was about to enter Kindergarten. The Principal gave a speech about those kids who had never been in daycare or preschool would have a hard time separating from mom. I don't think that's the case. It wasn't true for my ds at all. I felt that having him at home with me for all of those years would make him very prepared to be away from me when it came time for school.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serenbat*
> 
> I left my three year old alone (downstairs) for 15-20 minutes so I could take a bath - I guess I'm a bad parent too. WOW!


But how is that comparable to leaving a 4 and 6 yr old, or a 5 yr old home all alone? I know when I'm in the house with my kids, but taking a shower, I can hear the smoke alarms go off and (hopefully) save their lives in the event of a fire. A fire can kill someone in minutes. I can also hear the alarm system chime if someone were intruding - or my kids decided to run out the front door. I can also hear my kid scream because he is bleeding, or broke his leg jumping off a bunk bed. There is a big difference between being home and accessible vs. getting into your car and driving away, where you could get into a car accident or be held up for some reason, thus leaving your 3 yr old home for longer than the intended 15-20 minutes it should have taken to run to the store real quick.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MamaofLiam*
> 
> So then would you allow your children to play outside or in the neighborhood alone? Or are you with them there too? I'm just wondering because I don't really see home alone and home outside as that much different...
> 
> ...


Hi, Shannon. My kids are 4, 6, 8, and 10, and I do feel comfortable with them playing outside w/o me standing right there. They are outside playing tetherball right now, actually, though I happen to be able to see them through the sliding glass doors and window, and I can hear my super loud 6 yr old's voice. We are on half an acre, with the backyard fenced, in a semi-rural area with dirt roads and a bit of space between properties. I guess I'm not cool with say, my 4 and 6 yr old wandering the 'hood - as safe as it seems to be here. I am comfortable with my 8 and 10 yr old's riding their bikes, sure, but I don't think it's the same thing for them to be playing outdoors where I am still reachable and me purposely leaving them home all alone while I run an errand. It would take me 10+ minutes to get back to them if they were able to call me if something horrible happened vs. if my DS fell off his bike and cut himself and they were on my road while I was doing something inside my home.

I don't think an occasional 10 minutes at home alone for a 8-9+ yr old b/c mom got held up picking up a younger sibling from daycare, or whatever, is that big of a deal for most mature, responsible kids. However, intentionally leaving a 5 yr old to fend for themselves because you think they are capable of taking care of themselves for hours at a time w/o you nearby, seems like way too big of a risk to take. That's really what I was getting at, b/c people were commenting about leaving small children at home alone like it was a normal thing to do.


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife*
> 
> What could be worth that risk?


not respecting your child's wishes. to me that was worth the risk at 5. i had said no to a lot of things. i couldnt keep on saying no. dd unlike most children her age has gone thru numerous experiences that made me trust her. she knew what to do in an emergency. i just never have had the fear of what if she slipped and broke her leg. i guess she would cry and the neighbor would come running.

i guess we all have our own parenting philosophy to follow.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

Quote:


> I can't understand, for the life of me, letting a 4, 5, 6, or 7 yr old (hell, 8 or 9 yr old, for that matter) home all alone. For 15 minutes, I don't think an occasional 10 minutes at home alone for a 8-9+ old b/c mom got held up picking up a younger sibling from daycare, or whatever, is that big of a deal for most mature, responsible kids.


10 minutes is OK but 15 is not?


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *belltree*
> From my experience in the US, a lot of students entering college have no idea how to handle their newly gained freedom. Maybe practicing how to behave responsibly for oneself at an earlier age would have been good for these young adults.


That's because the parents were CONTROLLING. There is a huge difference between allowing your child to grow up and learn to be independent (with supervision) vs. being a controlling parent that tells the child every thing to do until they hit the door to be on their own. Being unable to handle the freedom is not a product of never staying at home alone. Not AT ALL. It's because the parent didn't teach their child to do things for themselves.

And to the person who questioned not leaving a child of 8 home alone for a half hour or so - no freaking way. My dd has gotten the award for "RESPONSIBLE" for her grade every year, these past 3 years. She is the most mature and responsible 9 year old I've ever met. There is no way I'd leave her home alone and she doesn't WANT to be left alone. She is smart enough to know that there could be situations she wouldn't know how to handle, and therefore says she isn't ready to be left alone. And even though I quit my great career to stay home with her, she left me EASILY the first time she went off to school (full-day!). And even though we co-slept until just a few months ago, she has been going to overnight camp for a few years and enjoys it immensely. Not supervising your children doesn't make them independent. You TEACH independence and life skills to a child... and you have to be there to do that.


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

I have three kids, age 6, 4, and 4. I am absolutely okay with them playing outside without my direct supervision. Outside, there are fewer hazards-- we live off the road, so traffic is not an issue. We do not have dangerous wildlife. The kids, when they're outside, are typically in the company of my neighbors' kids, and all the kids are under the eye of a whole neighborhood of adults, who all endeavor to keep half an eye on the doings outside. If something went wrong, more than one of us would be alerted very quickly. It's a very safe situation.

I am not comfortable leaving them in my house unsupervised, if I am not within earshot outdoors. (I do leave them alone while I do things like chat with a neighbor in the yard, or weed the gardens, or stuff like that-- where I am still in the yard or nearby.) There are far many more hazards indoors. Also, a child left inside alone is more isolated-- if something goes wrong, it could take a lot longer for somebody to become aware of the situation.

It's an issue of visibility, for me. A child in a visible public location is far safer than a child squirreled away alone at home where nobody will notice if the child is not okay.

I'm actually surprised which side of this argument I'm coming up on-- I'm constantly criticized and hassled for allowing my kids to roam the neighborhood so freely, and I've come to think of myself as much more "lax" than the mainstream, on issues of supervision.


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## belltree (Mar 10, 2009)

Velochic, you are right. I thought about what I wrote last night. It is easy to become controlling and overbearing, if you believe you cannot leave your child alone for an hour even at age 17. Similar it is easy to be negligant if you leave your 4 year old alone for an afternoon.

But I also believe that most mothers who write here are thoughtful people and evaluate their family and their children based upon their circumstances and find a good middle ground to ensure to raise independent and responsible children. Children are different, and while your does not want to be alone, I know tons of 8years old who are mature and responsible children that can and want to spend some time alone without adult supervision. You should not project from your child towards others. And I guess this is where my problem lies. People tend to judge and scream out loud to call CPS when they think a child is too young to be left alone or do a certain thing by themselves.

I also believe and have heard from children that they were afraid of walking by themselves to the corner store alone even at age 12. Mostly because they were never aloud too. Some fears in life are irrational and can be overcome.

And on a last note, co-sleeping does not have anything to do with it. My husband co-slept until age 13-14 and still spent tons of time without adults even at age 3-4.

Maybe one cannot understand the value of time without adults if one has not experienced it.


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

I do leave my 10 and 9 year olds alone for 10 mins very, very occasionally. Like once every 5 months. I don't "worry" about it because if I did, I wouldn't do it. I would be concerned that if I were to get in an accident, what would happen at home. If I left my kids to go to the store and ended up in the hospital, what would happen to them?


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *belltree*
> 
> Maybe one cannot understand the value of time without adults if one has not experienced it.


We believe very strongly in the value of unsupervised time here. I start allowing my babies to play by themselves in a room, with me in a nearby room, as soon as they can reach for a hanging toy. That's why my kids play outside alone, or play in other parts of the house without me, or play inside while I am outside. I don't think I need to get in the car and drive away, to allow them the space to experience the world on their own terms. Not until they have more experience of how to handle situations that arise. Around nine or ten, as I said, beginning with short periods of time-- that's when I'm ready to try that.


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## madskye (Feb 20, 2006)

DD is 6. I leave her alone in the house and at this point, I'll take the dog for a walk down the block to do her business. I'm probably gone about 10 minutes. When I go out, DD is usually riveted in front of iCarly, and that's why she doesn't want to walk with us. Ultimately, I think what each child can handle maturely is very individual and you as the parent are the only one who can make that assessment.

I was a latchkey kid, and took care of myself from 8 and up. I had a single mom who dealt with a series of unreliable babysitters and at a certain point she decided I would be better with a key and firm rules in place of what I was to do after school. It was all fine. No fires or molesters breaking into the house. Perhaps knowing that we lived in a sturdy structure where I had no access to matches and that we lived in a neighborhood that was also very safe was part of my mothers good parenting, and allowed her to feel comfortable letting me be a latchkey kid. Again-the situation is all individual.

I think there is a quite a bit of class-ism going on in this thread. We're all very lucky (myself included) to be in the position where we can not leave our child alone for any amount of time. I'm lucky that we can afford aftercare. My mom couldn't, I rose up to the challenge, and I don't think that made her any less of a good mother. I hear moms (not even just on this thread, out there in IRL, too) limiting what they think their child is capable of handling, and I often wonder how much of it is true and how much of it is the mother's need to feel indispensable. But then again--I tell myself, each kid is different, and I am totally sure there are kids who couldn't handle it.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serenbat*
> 
> I left my three year old alone (downstairs) for 15-20 minutes so I could take a bath - I guess I'm a bad parent too. WOW!


See.... and I had a three year old danger boy that would have torn the house up in 20 minutes unattended. And probably hurt himself or started a fire as well.


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## MamaofLiam (Nov 20, 2010)

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife*
> 
> I can't understand, for the life of me, letting a 4, 5, 6, or 7 yr old (hell, 8 or 9 yr old, for that matter) home all alone. For 15 minutes, or for 4 hours. What could be worth that risk? A sense of independence? Not having the nuisance of loading them in the car to run to the grocery store? Not having to ask a neighbor to watch them or send them to the after school program? I wouldn't call it free-range; more like neglectful parenting.
> 
> Flame away, I don't really care. Doesn't matter to me if you walked to the store as a kid when you were 2, still doesn't make it a sound decision to leave a child home alone.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife*
> 
> I don't think an occasional 10 minutes at home alone for a 8-9+ yr old b/c mom got held up picking up a younger sibling from daycare, or whatever, is that big of a deal for most mature, responsible kids. * However, intentionally leaving a 5 yr old to fend for themselves because you think they are capable of taking care of themselves for hours at a time w/o you nearby, seems like way too big of a risk to take.* That's really what I was getting at, b/c people were commenting about leaving small children at home alone like it was a normal thing to do.


Hi Drummer's Wife. I don't disagree with anything in your response to my post. I actually agree with the bolded for the most part - esp the age 5 and hours at a time home alone. I just think it's important to choose our words carefully. I didn't agree with your first sweeping generalization that it's _never_ okay to leave any child under the age of 9 home alone, even for 15 minutes. I just don't think you or I can say that. It just seems too extreme. Especially calling it neglectful parenting. Because to me 15 minutes alone and an 8 year old don't always equal neglectful parenting. I'm guessing that you didn't mean your first post that extremely, and that you were trying to make a point?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philomom*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


I just want to point out that this illustrates every situation / kid is different. It becomes a really slippery slope when one starts make generalizations for other people's kids and other people's situations.


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## mommy212 (Mar 2, 2010)

My mom left my sister and I alone for short periods starting at 11, and for a day or two for business trips when I was 13 (my sister was 15). When I was 14 she went on a weeklong business trip. We did just fine, we all grocery shopped before hand and my sister and I were quite independent with using the public bus and such.


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## kythe (Dec 20, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madskye*
> 
> DD is 6. I leave her alone in the house and at this point, I'll take the dog for a walk down the block to do her business. I'm probably gone about 10 minutes. When I go out, DD is usually riveted in front of iCarly, and that's why she doesn't want to walk with us. Ultimately, I think what each child can handle maturely is very individual and you as the parent are the only one who can make that assessment.
> 
> ...


The thing is, you know in retrospect that you were "fine" home alone, that there were no fires or molesters who broke into your home. But such things have happened to people home alone, and it's not always because their parents weren't good enough or their neighborhood wasn't "safe". No one who has been victimized or had accidents happen actually thought they were putting themselves or their kids at risk.

It's interesting that you mention classism here, while talking about living in a "safe" neighborhood. I live in a middle class neighborhood at this time, though I was in low income housing with my kids for several years before finishing college. I felt safer leaving the kids with little supervision in our low income neighborhood, because there were always people around. Many moms left kids alone or loosely supervised by neighbors because they couldn't afford childcare. You were never really "alone". But in my current neighborhood, people seem more focussed on this being such a "good" area for families that they lose common sense. When we first moved to the area there was a rash of burglaries, and the general response among neighbors seemed to be "Here? This is such a great neighborhood I can't believe people would do that to us!" As opposed to people committing crimes against the lower class, more worthless or stupid people, I suppose... Sometimes I think people who claim to live in a "safe" neighborhood are just trying to compliment themselves on how great they are, instead of realizing crime occurs everywhere.


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## madskye (Feb 20, 2006)

But Kythe,your judgement call was that your neighborhood was safe. That was my mom's judgement too. My elaboration on our situation was about what made my mom feel OK with it--not what is the gold standard for all. We lived in a housing development in Florida that was lower middle class, so I don't think $ equates safety by any means. Look at the terrible Cheshire home invastion. I do think, that if you live in a neighborhood that you know is unsafe, and you have to leave your children unattended then you are in between a rock and hard place and my heart goes out to you--and a lot of people are in that position. If your choice is pay your rent or pay for aftercare or a babysitter for a child I thought could handle being alone, I would choose rent every time. I'm just more surprized that people don't recognize that a lot of people don't have the choice of paying for both.


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## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

My parents left me alone for a short time starting from around 5. I know I walked to the grocery store on my own, crossing a street, to buy eggs right after my 5th birthday (it was my sisters 2nd birthday and she dumped all the eggs we had on the floor mid-cake making!). I lived overseas though and people arn't as paranoid as they are here.

Ds, I let him be in the backyard on his own (its very safe, fenced, and I can hear him and see him if I stick my head out the window), and in the house he is sometimes in another room for a while without me. But he is only 3. I don't really have a reason to leave him home alone now, and I don't see me having to any time soon in particular. I suppose if the time comes where I'd need to run a quick errand and he didnt want to go, then I would re-evaluate at the time.

I think he would have to understand all the safety rules - no swimming, no cooking, no answering the door, how to answer (or not answer) the phone, how to call 911, what to do if there is an emergency, no leaving the house, knows how to get a hold of me/a neighbor, etc. ... and if he could do all of that, then it would be fine to leave him for a while. I'm guessing that is closer to 8 or so for most kids.


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kythe*
> 
> The thing is, you know in retrospect that you were "fine" home alone, that there were no fires or molesters who broke into your home. But such things have happened to people home alone, and it's not always because their parents weren't good enough or their neighborhood wasn't "safe". No one who has been victimized or had accidents happen actually thought they were putting themselves or their kids at risk.


Yeah, but what's age got to do with that? If your kids can never be alone because of the possibility of a fire or home invasion, then they won't even be able to move out when they become adults!

Take fires for example. How does a parent's absence increase the chances of a fire, or of the kid being harmed in a fire? You can intervene if your kid tries to do something likely to start a fire, e.g. burn things for the fun of it, and you can help your kid evacuate. But if your kid can be trusted to do that without you--whether they're 7 or 17--why do you need to be there?

Do 911 operators normally take calls from kids less seriously? That would make me concerned....


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## berry987 (Apr 23, 2008)

There are a million situations each day where a parent could ask "is it worth the risk?" for their child (riding a bike, eating grapes, riding in a car, jumping on a bed, playing at a friends house) but that doesn't mean we shouldn't let them do those things. Teaching a child independence is an important part of parenting. And letting them have freedoms, when they are ready, is how that is done. I think it is essential to put kids in situations here and there where they need to make decisions without a parents help...and leaving them alone for bits of time teaches them that skill.

I can still remember one of my best friends from high school who's parents were protective (and this was almost 20 years ago, so probably not that protective by todays standards). She got her drivers license at 16 and her parents heavily restricted her driving. By the time she left for college she had never driven on a highway because her parents figured it wasn't worth the risk so they drove when she needed to go anywhere on a highway. So there she was, 18 years old, heading off to college and never driving her car over about 35 miles an hour I remember riding in the car with her over Christmas break that first year. Even though she'd driven on a highway a few times at that point, she was terrified because all she thought was DEATH BY HORRIBLE CAR ACCIDENT every time she got on a highway and she just lacked the experience of changing lanes at a fast pace, etc. So she pulled over and I drove. It took her years to get comfortable driving on highways. I realize this is a different example, but to me it explains why "why take the risk?" may actually hinder your child from learning important skills. They will need to be left alone at some point and just because a child is 13 or 14 (or whatever magical age is old enough) doesn't mean they are suddenly capable of being left alone if they haven't had the chance to learn how.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

It really baffles me







the data does not justify some of the fear mentioned here (neither did the other tread about using a bus)-I expected far more from what I thought was a more educated segment of society (this forum)-

http://www.statisticstop10.com/Causes_of_Death_Kids.html The info is from the CDC and the link is at the bottom

statically speaking of molestation it is hardly *ever* random, in my area there have been several recent cases (religious-in such large number that many priests were removed and only one case took place in the home-and the parents even knew about, they were home and set up camera! The local papers had many stories and the parents did a lot of talking in this case to the newspaper--- the rest happened outside of the home---at churches and schools)--need it also be mentioned that many abuse cases do involve trusted family and babysitters

accidents-just look at falls, unless your child is over the age of 65---and this does not even break down into the number of sports related injuries and does not account for the parent being there at the time when most injuries actually occur

IF the numbers were there it would be a different story.

safer outside (viewed by some)-IF I felt that way I would ask for help in making my home safer and if it was not because of un-safe environment I would seek help for myself, unfortunately paranoia often times is inherit and I would never want to project to a child that the home is less or un-safe, be ok outside to roam but can't be alone in your own home---I can't begin to imagine the long term effect that would foster, knowing at say age 9 your parent has too much fear to let you alone but your friends parent does, as if children don't know what goes on with others

as many did state, it is misleading to group and generalize all as some have done-this really confuses me as well

it definitely is different now than it use to be, I finding more and more many young adults that lack skills and have irrational fears and I can't think it has a large part to do with how they were raised (mostly from educated, well off families and "good" neighborhoods)-----------very SAD!


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

Quote:


> safer outside (viewed by some)-IF I felt that way I would ask for help in making my home safer


My home is not "unsafe" in any way that could be remedied. What makes in the house less safe than outdoors is that at least where I live, a child who's outdoors is never truly alone or unsupervised. When my kids are outside, they are under the watchful eyes of a dozen or more adults (our neighbors) who know them, know me, and would help if help was needed. All of us make a point of watching out the windows, to keep an eye on what the kids are up to. I remember a day when my daughter forgot to look before crossing the parking lot, for example, and my neighbor reminded her, and then came by later that day to let me know that I maybe needed to review the rule with her. Or another day when she fell, and tore her knees up badly, and the nearest neighbor noticed, through her kitchen window, and came out and helped her get home. A child alone indoors is alone-- there is nobody else who's going to step in and help if I am not there. So if she gets sick, or hurt, or makes a poor choice about safe behavior, the responsibility would lie on HER to access help, and if she was not able to, there would be no help. Plus, nobody but me would know she was there-- so if there was an emergency, nobody would know to look in the house for her.

But I think you and I agree, anyway-- you are talking about a child nine years old. I'm not-- I fully agree that many children nine or ten years old are ready for the responsibility of being left home alone. I've said that already; I am speaking about younger kids. I am also not talking about leaving a child alone while I'm in another part of the house, or while I'm outside in the yard or the neighborhood. I'm talking about getting in the car and driving away. There is no place I go to in the car that is less than ten minutes away-- that's too far for me, for a few more years at least.

As far as class-- as near as I can see, the neighborhoods I'd call "middle-class" or higher are considerably less safe than the one where I live, which is decidedly poor to working class. In those neighborhoods, the houses are bigger, farther apart, and seem often to be deserted during the day--- the adults are all at work, the children are all at school or day care, and there are very few mothers at home. People don't have open windows during the summer, and don't sit out on their porches interacting with their neighbors. What makes my neighborhood safe is all the people, so close, all keeping an eye out for each other. (And yes, you don't need to point out that I'm generalizing. I am, and I know I am. My point is that being middle or upper middle class doesn't make a neighborhood any safer, and might make it a whole lot less safe.)


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

Quote:


> under the watchful eyes of a dozen or more adults (our neighbors) who know them, know me, and would help if help was needed


if there are that many people near you why can't you ask them to look in at your child and let them know you are going out?

that many neighbor that know me I certainly would speak up

that's how many neighborhoods function (at least the use) parents work and other knew the children were home or if the parent had to go away-----same for checking on the "OLDER" neighbor who lives alone, this isn't something new


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serenbat*
> 
> if there are that many people near you why can't you ask them to look in at your child and let them know you are going out?
> 
> ...


Um. I do. That's what I mean when I say that I don't leave my kids home alone.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

Quote:


> A child alone indoors is alone-- there is nobody else who's going to step in and help if I am not there. So if she gets sick, or hurt, or makes a poor choice about safe behavior, the responsibility would lie on HER to access help, and if she was not able to, there would be no help. Plus, nobody but me would know she was there-- so if there was an emergency, nobody would know to look in the house for her.


Quote:


> Um. I do. That's what I mean when I say that I don't leave my kids home alone.


this makes absolutely no sense to me---------either you tell your neighbors the child is in the house alone or you don't?


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## insidevoice (Feb 16, 2011)

I grew up as a 'latchkey' kid from about kindergarten (in short spurts) on. Never for long periods, but I did walk home when school was out and go inside. I usually watched tv for about half an hour waiting for a parent to come home.

Now, I wasn't ready to leave my daughter alone at that age, but at nine, if I'm headed off to do some grocery shopping it's entirely her choice whether she wants to go with me or not. Sometimes she enjoys getting out, and sometimes she lives for time for herself. She knows to have the phone nearby, and she knows I WILL call to check in while I am out and if she doesn't answer her grandfather will be at the door in about five minutes. She knows not to use the stove and knows how to respond to a fire without panic. She won't open the door to a stranger, and she knows where the emergency lights are in case of a power outage. Now that the weather is nice, she is allowed outside to play in the yard when I am not home- that is new, and to do that she had to demonstrate consistently good judgement about where she would be (near the road is out, in the garden is fine- for example.)

She has worked hard to earn enough trust to be left alone for short periods of time, and we have collaborated to find a way to allow her to do that safely.

Being dragged around to your little brothers' doctors appointments or out to get groceries just isn't as interesting as stretching out on the couch with a good book, or a stolen quiet hour or two to watch a movie. I fail to see meeting her need for autonomy as negligent parenting.


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serenbat*
> 
> this makes absolutely no sense to me
> 
> either you tell your neighbors the child is in the house alone or you don't?


If somebody knows she's there, and is keeping an eye on her, then she's not unsupervised, and therefore not really alone. So if I go out, and I pop in to Neighbor X, and say hey, I'm going out for a half hour, can you keep an eye on DD, then Neighbor X will come over once or twice and check that DD is all right, maybe coax DD to come play at her house or outside, where it's easier to watch her, then I'll know that if a situation arises, somebody's going to find out about it, and be there to help. I don't consider that "home alone."


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## DaughterOfKali (Jul 15, 2007)

I can only speak about my personal preference. I have no idea when I'd be able to leave my son at home alone even for a few minutes. However, my son has Asperger's.

I was left alone by my parents probably starting around age 7 or 8. I hated it. I wasn't ready and certainly wasn't prepared.

There are kids in my neighborhood that get left alone (either at home or to wander the neighborhood) at kindergarten age. There's no way I would do that (even with a neuro-typical child). But, that's my opinion.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

My brother and I were left alone starting at the age of 8 or 9. My mom worked 7 to 3, so my brother and I would get ourselves up and dressed, get our own breakfast, walk to school (and were never ever late!), then come home and be alone for about 45 minutes until our mom got home.

It was normal for us, so I didn't think much of it, and maybe by the time my own kids are that age (they're 6 and 3 now) my perspective will have changed, but for now, looking at my 6yo, it's hard to imagine doing that unless I absolutely had to.

It was a necessity for my mom, and my brother and I did great (aside from a few times when our fights turned much harsher than they would have if our mom had been there), but since I'm able to be home and my kids aren't clamoring for time alone in the house, I have no plans to start leaving them alone any time soon. I'll certainly shower with them in the house, or let them play (in the fenced backyard) without me being outside, but that's as much as I'm comfortable with for now.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

I leave my 8, going on 9 year old alone in the car while I run into the store .. but I don't think he's ready to be left home alone yet. I will leave him in the apartment while I go walk the dog around the block .. but I don't count that because he knows how to come find me if he needs me and I'm not gone for longer than 5-10mins.

I'm guessing maybe 11-12? Just going on my child and when I think he would be able to call for help, etc if necessary. I think each child is different and it could be earlier or later depending on the child.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaughterOfKali*
> 
> I can only speak about my personal preference. I have no idea when I'd be able to leave my son at home alone even for a few minutes. However, my son has Asperger's.
> 
> ...


My son has Aspergers as well and has always been a bit behind in the "self-care" area ... He still needs help getting ready in the am for school. I can't imagine leaving him to fend for himself at home alone for long, but I am very interested reading about what more neuro-typical children are ready for.


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## changes (Jun 4, 2009)

Well, here the op again.

I wondered what reactions would be and what other mother/parents would do and find acceptable regarding their children. What I learned here is that, as I personally was thinking as well, is that it mostly really depends on the child and not so much the age. My thinking actually shifted from 'age- appropriate' to 'child-appropriate' and this shifting happened through my own 7yo. Personally I would never feel comfortable to leave a 3yo at home alone for even a short while (or my youngest, not even in a room alone at that age ;-), nor at 4, 0r 5 for that matter, unless asleep and myself just being in the front or back yard with my other child (and the sleeping child within hearing distance and with regular checking in). But now my eldest reached the age of seven and I felt things shifting and I felt I needed to adjust my thinking, to look further than age and more at personal needs and abilities. His needs were obviously changing. He started to have the need to be able to be alone for a (short) while and he started to feel annoyed with the daily errands when he had to accompany me and his little brother. My need was for him to be ok and to be safe and for the 3 of us to be comfortable. His needs have been shifting and even though I felt a bit awkward about a '7' year old to stay at home for a while (speaking about 15 to 30 minutes here, not longer) I felt him to be ready and capable of an occasional staying at home. So I listened to his needs, he listened to mine, we made a deal that he could choose a maximum 1 or 2 times a week where he wouldn't come along bringing his brother to school, and but) the other 3 days their would be no need for resisting or nagging or stress from either side on him accompanying us. And he would also need to know what to do (and what not) during the time I would be out. So far, this is working great. He feels respected in his new need, and I do feel so in mine (I'm not comfortable doing this every single day yet so the deal of 0-2 a week is fine by me). He knows how to contact me and use the phone, he knows which neighbour he can go to in case of emergency, he knows how to open or lock the doors, he is under no circumstance allowed to open the frontdoor to ANYONE except mom or dad (we did test this as well ;-), he knows to pick up the phone when it's me and not to when it is another number, and he knows what to do best in case of fire or earthquake, and he knows what he is very aware of the 'hazards' in a regular home (like stove, electricity, tools etc.) . And usually he does his homework, reads a book or watches some tv. So this is my firstborn. However, looking at my ds of 5, his abilities and his character, I am not really sure if at 7 HE will be capable of doing the same and I suspect it will take a little while longer for him to reach the level of maturity and trust (regarding safety) it takes to stay at home alone for 30 minutes. And I would not go anywhere than by walking distance within max. 10-15 min. from home. I would NOT let my 7yo stay home for longer periods so far, nor would I leave him alone more than the present maximum we agreed on. That may change in the future, after discussion and mutual consent.

I see the above seems more like an exception than standard looking at all the reactions. But I also see there are others in the same situation who have a child they trust to be able to do this. And I understand every single one reaction comes from a whole personal set of experiences and elements, and so they're all different.

I know parents who've left their (very young) children at home for a while without really thinking it over, however, I do think it's not something you do 'just like that'. But it's so much about KNOWING your child that makes you able to come to such a shift or decision, and sometimes this shift may happen so fast you don't even notice and sometimes this may take much much longer. It also depends a lot on the parent, the bond, the trust involved from both sides, the environment, it's a whole package to look at, not just age, not just mere ability or responsibility. If the decision to leave a child alone for a while stems from well thought of, responsible parenting, and if the child agrees with the situation, it is imo, responsible.

I would NEVER (at least, not yet, and not for a LONG time) leave my two children home alone at these ages, because that, for sure, wouldn't work and wouldn't be safe. Not in the near or not so near future either. I trust that one day that shift will come true and thy will be up to this particular responsibility.

I started to wonder about the 'alone' idea, too, because I bring my child to school a little earlier (as some others do, too) to pick up his little brother in time to from (another) school. This means the 7yo will be 'alone' (not really ;-) in the school yard for about 15 minutes (unfortunately one day I got scolded (!!!) for this by someone who obviously didn't think it was something to be done). However, I find this pretty normal for a 7 year old who is very fine with that arrangement. Then, many other parents or grandparents, (in my eyes then again 'helicopter(grand)parents') stay in the school yard until the kids disappear in the schoolbuilding with their teacher (which I find pretty weird actually for children aged 7-12 years old). Actually, I would be more comfortable if those adults would NOT stay on school grounds after bringing their child(ren), and would be able to trust the schoolgrounds enough for their children (age 7 and up) to be ok, since they also won't be there sitting next to their child in the school benches for the next couple of hours nor during the breaks. And it's not really like they all are watching their children closely while waiting there.

But well, other people, other perspectives just as in the above.


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## wildmonkeys (Oct 4, 2004)

Haven't read the whole thread, but where I live it is illegal to leave a child under 8 home alone and illegal to leave a child under 8 home alone with a sibling under 13. We didn't leave our oldest (now 11) at home alone until he was 10 and only for a very short bit of time...15 - 20 minutes and have never lft our 7 year old with him. Once our 7 year olds turns 8 I will be comfortable leaving the two of them home alone for brief amounts of time - like to take the dog for a quick walk. It was not until 10 that I felt like my oldest could handle an emergency - phone call to 911, getting a neighbor to help, etc. in an EMERGENCY situation where he would be upset. My 4 year old...well he is my baby and I keep him with me


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I think, regardless of individual children and their maturity level (though, obviously that is of high importance) is that when considering these types of situations, leaving them at home alone, babysitting younger siblings, going to store several blocks away all alone, etc., is to think about whether or not you would be comfortable announcing this to other adults such as: your kid's teacher, principal, social worker, a police officer, your pediatrician/family doctor, etc. Or, are you okay with your kid talking about it at school the next day to his friends where a teacher could overhear?

I'm not saying these are all community members who should make these decisions for our kids (though they all happen to be mandated reporters), but that if you don't feel at ease sharing that information with them, maybe there is a good reason you should reconsider and wait a few more years.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

Quote:


> Or, are you okay with your kid talking about it at school the next day to his friends where a teacher could overhear?


I think you are being extremely naive if you think you can keep your child from talking to other about this and far more subjects.

teacher over hear far more than that









In most states it is not illegal to leave a child alone.

I repatriable teacher, "reporter" or the like would only report actual abuse.

The children that live next to me live in a house that I consider filthy ( I can see right in the windows)- social service WILL NOT even look into it-it is not abuse in my state.

The children are not beaten, they get food (regardless of what) and have shelter. It takes far more than being home alone to get social services involved and it is not a police matter nor would a Dr report on them unless they show physical or mental signs of abuse.

In my state most children and given information/taught how and can call 911 starting at K level. Several pre-schools also drill in this.


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## waiting2bemommy (Dec 2, 2007)

I'm not saying these are all community members who should make these decisions for our kids (though they all happen to be mandated reporters), but that if you don't feel at ease sharing that information with them, maybe there is a good reason you should reconsider and wait a few more years.

Quoting isn't working for me for some reason....anyway, while I get where you are coming from in that you (generally speaking, not you in particular) don't want to invite trouble in the form of CPS or other "official" people in your life, I disagree.

If someone is not a person who should be making decisions for my kids, then they.....just don't. If *I* make a decision based out of fear of how someone else is going to react, then they essentially made the decision for me.

As an example, I am planning a home birth with baby #3. I don't go around advertising it to everyone, but inevitably it comes up when people hear i'm pregnant, and I tell the truth. I have no doubts that it will eventually get back to the same family members who have called CPS on me in the past. While I don't relish the thought of being investigated again and going through that drama, to me it's a cowards way out to either a) lie and hide it, which does nothing to normalize natural birth and promote change, or b) give in and do it the way this other family member thinks it should be done, just to avoid trouble.

No one should be apologizing for how they raise their children, as long as they are making decisions thoughtfully and from a place of love for their individual child. That basically just reinforces these arbitrary rules (about whatever-- leaving your kid home alone, letting your kid sit in the car alone, home birthing, breastfeeding for 3 yrs, etc.). Just my two cents.

And to answer the original question, while I'm fine with ds playing outside alone to his heart's content, where all messes are forgiven, no way am I leaving that boy home alone for years to come! He never gets into anything dangerous because even at 3 he is trained not to touch the stove, daddy's tools etc, but I think even with a few years on him, I'd come home to find my house turned upside down. He's emotionally immature. And I imagine his anxiety would be through the roof at the thought of one of us not being accessible. I dread the day his sister surpasses him in what she is allowed to do, just because she is more even keeled. I imagine for her or any other typical kid 5 or 6 woul be ok for a few short minutes (like to walk to a neighbor's house down the street). i wouldn't get in my car and drive away before my kid was 8-ish, I think.


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## swampangel (Feb 10, 2007)

Oregon doesn't have a law stating a specific age a child can be left alone. It's based on the child and their maturity level...and discretion of their parent, of course.


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## Seie (Jun 9, 2005)

I haven't read through the entire thread but I do have some opinions of this that I want to share.

First - when kids are left alone and when they are - by the community in general - considered old enough to handle themselfes for various periods of time is VERY much a cultural issue.

Being european and reading a thread like this in a predominantly US forum, I find that my opinions and what I experience to be the norm among parents in my community differ a lot from the general views expressed here.

First I want to say that I dont think there is a "truth" about when kids are old enough to be left alone. I think it very very much depends on the childs level of maturity and experience, the dangers in the childs environment (traffic, access to other adults who can help in case of emergencies, presence of other children who can call for help if something happens, social environment - is it a "family area" or one with more crime and social problems etc.) All those things have to be taken into consideration and then a healthy amount of common sense.

Also I want to say that no child should be suddenly left alone for a long period of time without having been "taught" how to manage him or herself. Being left on his/her own is something a child has to learn - it is not an ability that magically appears the day the child turns 12. It is something that needs to be practiced and taught gradually over several years

My son who is 7 is perfectly able to handle himself for up to an hour or two. He often volunteers to go by bike to the shop to get groceries. around half a mile away and there is only one minor road to cross - the rest of the way is on a walking path with only bikes and pedestrians. And he handles that perfectly. He likes being on his own at home and will prefer that to going grocery shopping for instance. He also sometimes goes on his bike to school together with a classmate and that is 2 miles away and that too they handle very well. So far we have never had issues of broken trust when it comes to him being on his own. Would I let just any kid do that? No ofcourse not. But I know my son is capable and so over time I had gradually helped him learn how to handle himself. I have never ever pushed him or put any kind of pressure on him. He has taken the initiative to most develpments towards more independency on his own and it has all happened gradually.

I know to (most of) you US moms the above mentioned will sound absolutely outragous, dangerous and irresponsible. You may try to tell me I am an unfit mother and someone should call the CPS on me. I will consider those replies extremely culturally biased, as here it is perfectly normal for children of age 7 to be given that kind of responsibility. Again taking their personal level of maturity and responsibility into consideration. The after school programme my 7 year old son is in has a list of agreements with parents as many of the kids are not picked up in the afternoon but have to walk or go on their bikes home - on their own. And we are talking kid ages 6-10 here. So the (educated) staff have a list that says - at 4pm. it's time to send Julie, Magnus, Oliver and Tina home and at 16.30 it's time for another bunch to leave. This works perfectly well and is just the way things are done here. No big deal.

At my younger sons daycare it is official policy, that the kids be given a lot of freedom to play and explore on their own without an adult breathing down their neck all the time and it is not unusual for me to pick him up and have to look through the "secret jungle" of bushes for him. They do have a fence all around their big garden so the kids dont leave the area, but apart from that they are free to play whereever they want. My son is 4 and loves his daycare. (and so do I - its a great daycare really!)

I wholeheartedly believe that children are capable of a lot more than adults generally give them credit for, and I believe we are NOT doing them a favor by being overprotective or by stopping them from gradually exploring their own independence from us. And I do not believe we are teaching our children to protect themselfes if we dont allow them to learn by doing. Being independent and responsible and being able to overcome and solve problems and conflicts is something a child has to LEARN. It is NOT something that just magically happens when they grow older.


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