# Watching TV = no big deal?



## desertwind (Mar 21, 2008)

Does anyone else share my view that watching TV is no big deal?

I don't understand why sooo many folks think TV is actually evil. I am talking about toddlers watching commercial free cartoons say several hours a day.

Also, that is not unsupervised hours like mommy is napping or off in another room, that is more the tv is on and maybe a 20 minute show gets watched and then we color and craft, maybe go eat food out back and then come in and say watch another 20 minute show before getting dressed to go to the park, etc.... not every day.... etither.

I know some people let their kids watch hour after hour of tv, day after day, and don't even know what they are watching. I get that that is not a good parenting choice, but my dd loves her cartoons and I have not yet discovered why so many folks don't let thier kids watch tv at all and actually think I am a bad parent because I do.

???????


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## dimibella (Feb 5, 2007)

I don't think it's a big deal if it's like what you are saying, mostly/totally commercial free, monitored, limited and educational. My kids watch a little. Letting your kids watch tv does not make you a bad parent, not letting your kids watch tv doesn't make you a bad parent either. It's just another parenting choice IMO. To me it's more of a big deal when people think not letting you kids watch tv is mean and crazy. Kids don't NEED television, but when supervised they aren't going to be irreversibly damaged by it IMO either.


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## bellymama (Apr 15, 2007)

i don't think its horrible. my kid for some reason doesn't seem to want to watch tv...he's too hyper to sit still like that, but if he watched a bit, i wouldn't stress.


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## MommaGreenBean (May 8, 2007)

I know a family like that, and their kids grew up to be super great









I choose to not have toddler TV in my home, or any TV for the kids because I'm super picky about what my kids are around, and I usually disagree with at least part of even the educational shows. And I grew up with a TV addicted brother, who lived to watch TV, so it's not worth it to me.

But it totally is fine in some families


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## aja-belly (Oct 7, 2004)

we have the tv on alot here. i like baby einstein for just some good background noise and something pretty to look at. when the kids request help turning on a certain show i'll help, and when they want it off they turn it off. they spend most of their day doing other stuff, and we are only actually home a few days a week (although they do get to watch dvd's in the car too).

i get that some people have alot of problems with tv, i really do. it's just not something i'm really sold on. i feel like i'm very attuned to how my kids handle tv and for now anyways it is definately more good than bad for us.


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## Sharlla (Jul 14, 2005)

We don't restrict TV/video games but my kids aren't couch potatoes either. I think putting restrictions on things just makes a forbidden fruit. DS1 has a tv in his room and he rarely tulrns it on and I can't recall the last time I turned mine on. DS1 would rather read.


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## thebarkingbird (Dec 2, 2005)

i used to feel so guilty until i remembered how much tv i watched as a kid. i'm a professional creative person. i didn't "play" much but i did other things. i was always immersed in a narrative. books, my own writing, or tv. my kid does other things too. he plays, he jumps, he's autistic and not very verbal about some things but since we've gotten a bunch of jim henson things on DVD he's become much more verbal about his imagination and adapted the stories into his own. i think tv can be great. especially if you have hours and hours to fill. nobody wants to be playing with mom ALL the time and for a young child who's still at home there's like 15 hours a day to fill up. watching for less than a third of that, especially with no commercials is not gonna render any body's brain useless.


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## LionTigerBear (Jan 13, 2006)

We watch a few hours of TV a day. We have no backyard so that's a factor. I feel like it's not the ideal but it's not terrible either.

The shows I have them watch are commercial free and high-quality. I am always present and aware of the content. I don't let them watch episodes with story lines I don't approve of (like one episode of Miss Spider where the moral of the story is "don't trust your intuition"







)

BUT . . . to be perfectly honest with myself . . . to me, the amount of TV we watch is an indicator of some degree of escapism on my part-- a desire for a "break" . . . and sometimes a desire to tune out, to not have to constantly be tuned-in to the kids-- and I need to be careful that I use these "breaks" with discretion so as not to avoid the children's needs for real human interaction and bonding-- even when I feel tired or bored. It is tempting to want to tune out the most when they are the most needy, but that's not good parenting.

I have also heard that the amount of TV watched in childhood affects leadership skills in adulthood . . . . I don't know if that's true . . . and that it can affect eye and brain development. I don't know.

My intuition tells me that TV watching is fine-- even good-- if it's quality content, watched in moderation and in the context of a healthy attachment with a nurturing caregiver-- but that "too much" TV is not "natural" and not good for the mind. What is too much? I'm sure it depends, and I guess that's really the question, isn't it?

It's definitely too much TV if it is taking away from necessary or health-building pursuits, such as, for my family, taking walks outside. So, with this in mind, my family's TV-watching threshold rises in the winter when it is very cold and snowy. If the TV-watchign was preventing my family from talking and sharing together at dinnertime, then I would institute a no-TV during dinner rule. For me, I feel that TV and movie-watching in the evening with my spouse prevents us talking meaningfully, sharing spiritual-reading and study together (one of our goals which we rarely accomplish) and even gets in the way of nookie sometimes. Unfortunately he's rather attached to his screen time, so it is what it is.

I am interested to hear other perspectives on TV watching, as my own opinion is open to evolution.


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## 2shy2post (Oct 11, 2005)

Here's the thing I keep remembering. When I was little (and when our parents were young) ~ we were sent out of the house to roam the neighborhood. We left after breakfast and only came back before dark if one of the *other* parents didn't feed us lunch.









If I did this to my children ~ CPS would be at my door for failure to supervise and probably rightfully so. It's just not the same world.









So, my kids can only ride bikes and go to the playground if I'm with them. Our yard is not fenced in and we're at the corner of two fairly busy streets. Even letting them out the door unsupervised is NOT an option for us.

I know there's a lot of "kids don't need TV" parents out there. Just like everything else, that's what works best for their family. TV is in ours. We borrow DVD's from the library, watch educational shows, etc. (We do however, believe that commercials are EVIL!!!!)

We don't worry about TV in our life. Our children are articulate, intelligent, creative, polite, and healthy.

That said, We do notice sometimes when my DS gets into a "slump" and DOES want to spend all day for several days in a row watching TV. We will step in and try to break that cycle. However, it's not all that often...

JMHO


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## bellymama (Apr 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sharlla* 
We don't restrict TV/video games but my kids aren't couch potatoes either. I think putting restrictions on things just makes a forbidden fruit. DS1 has a tv in his room and he rarely tulrns it on and I can't recall the last time I turned mine on. DS1 would rather read.

hey sharlla, what's up with your siggY? why the puke guy? does homeschool make you sick, or barack obama? i don't get it.


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## Kiddoson (Nov 19, 2001)

I don't intend to let this baby watch much TV. DD did the baby einstein thing (not this time). DD (7 years) watches a few hours of TV at night, it was on during dinner and a commercial came on, she watched it, listened than said... yeah right, I don't believe that! I looked at DH and said we're doing our job with that. ROFL I think children need to know what commercials are, there intent and how to take them. Now i see no need for toddlers to watch TV, my first never did for long anyway....


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## princesstutu (Jul 17, 2007)

I don't get the desire to look at being TV-free as some sort of status symbol, either. My concern when my oldest was a toddler was that he literally zoned out when the TV was on. But, that didn't stop me from buying a bajillion Elmo tapes.

The TV-watching, zoned out toddler has _always_ been my friend. It's how I got laid regularly and a sexed mommy is a happy mommy in my household.


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## WC_hapamama (Sep 19, 2005)

It's not a big deal to me. My kids generally don't zone out in front of the TV... they get up and move around, play with toys, wrestle with each other, all while watching TV.


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## Sharlla (Jul 14, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bellymama* 
hey sharlla, what's up with your siggY? why the puke guy? does homeschool make you sick, or barack obama? i don't get it.

nope, just thought I would put it in the sig


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## dawn1221 (Sep 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *desertwind* 
Does anyone else share my view that watching TV is no big deal?

It isn't evil in my world.

And you are not a bad mom because you are okay with it.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

My family loves to watch TV. We've learned many things from it, and it's also just a fun way to relax and enjoy. It's not more or less "evil" or a big deal than reading or etc IMO. I think being mindful parents is a good idea with regard to media just like it is with any other area of life. I share my thoughts on TV with my kids just like I share my thoughts on food, news, what we want for dinner, clothes, friends, and the rest of life.


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## kittyhead (Oct 28, 2005)

I







the television.

true story, one time when i was about 15 or 16 my mom went out of town and i decided to have a small party. i was going to marry my TV, because i loved it so much. about 10 of my friends came, dressed up, and we had a ceremony. when the time came for the TV to answer the "do you take kittyhead to be your partner" part we unmuted the TV so it could speak. the first words that came out of it were "we do". so, the TV loves me, too.

I







the television.


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## swimswamswum (Oct 26, 2005)

I think it's okay for older children to watch commercial-free television in moderation. I think it's harmful for babies and young children to watch it.

We have a television, but don't have broadcast tv (we live in an area where if you don't have cable, you don't get tv stations). We use hulu and rent dvds. This works really well for us and it allows us to totally control what comes into our home.


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## texmama (Jun 4, 2005)

I limit the amount of TV my 4 yo dd watches - my 18mo couldn't care less if the TV were on, he's got better things to do!

When dd watches TV, she does Nothing else, not a thing. She just sits, mesmerized by the show, and would sit and watch TV all day if I let her. We don't watch broadcast TV, just tapes/DVDs since dd is very sensitive, so I have to make sure the shows she watches have no conflict, even Curious George sometimes upsets her. Do to how intently she watches shows, she's also very prone to being overstimulated by them, so that's another reason I limit TV, if I didn't, after an hour she'd have a melt down.


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## MCR (Nov 20, 2001)

I don't feel guilty and we love out TV.
Dd loves to watch sesame street and Word World and Super Why.
My boys have loved it too, and the oldest is a well adjusted sophomore at a nice private university doing very well, so it hasn't effected his intellect at all.
Sometimes I think too much of a big deal is made over it. It's not like my kids were tied to chairs and made to watch. They mostly ignore it when Dh and I are watching something and go off outside to play.


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

I don't think TV is evil.

Neither Dh nor I watch TV though (we get our ample screen time at the computer, which frankly is just as bad as a total time suck). Our kids average maybe an hour a day over the week (some days less, other days a little more). We don't have cable, so it's the regular networks. They watch a little PBS, but most of their viewing is videos/DVDs.

Some how or another, they're all very smart, socially agile, and very creative even though they've exposed to TV.

I think excess of anything can be a problem though.

And I know plenty of kids who grew up with zOMG TV IS EVIL type of mentality who seem to be sane adults. And lots of people who couldn't escape the damn thing (like me, my parents love the TV as background noise, and whenever my mom visits she complains every day about us not having cable) who aren't interested in TV.

What I find funny are the folks who brag about having no TV, but let their kids spend an hour or two on the computer every day. It's the same difference IMO (which is why I'm not going to be snobby about people who watch a lot of TV, because I can probably beat them hands down in screen time--mine's just in front of a computer). I also think in our society, unless you're going to go totally alternative kids will by necessity receive more screen time than did previous generation. Kids start using computer programs in K here, in the public schools. So I vote for screen time (TV or console games or computer) not being a big deal so long as it's in balance for that child.


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## OhDang (Jan 30, 2008)

I noticed a lot of you are saying as long as it is commercial free..Whats wrong with commercials? (not being snarky i am really curious? I hate them but i was wondering why a lot of mamas dont want their kids watching them?)


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## dimibella (Feb 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OhDang* 
I noticed a lot of you are saying as long as it is commercial free..Whats wrong with commercials? (not being snarky i am really curious? I hate them but i was wondering why a lot of mamas dont want their kids watching them?)

For me it's mostly the teaching of consumerism, but also sometimes even though the show may be okay for the child the commercials could be more adult.


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## OhDang (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dimibella* 
For me it's mostly the teaching of consumerism, but also sometimes even though the show may be okay for the child the commercials could be more adult.

Oh okay i gotcha







Makes sense.


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## dubfam (Nov 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *2shy2post* 
Here's the thing I keep remembering. When I was little (and when our parents were young) ~ we were sent out of the house to roam the neighborhood. We left after breakfast and only came back before dark if one of the *other* parents didn't feed us lunch.









If I did this to my children ~ CPS would be at my door for failure to supervise and probably rightfully so. It's just not the same world.









So, my kids can only ride bikes and go to the playground if I'm with them. Our yard is not fenced in and we're at the corner of two fairly busy streets. Even letting them out the door unsupervised is NOT an option for us.

I know there's a lot of "kids don't need TV" parents out there. Just like everything else, that's what works best for their family. TV is in ours. We borrow DVD's from the library, watch educational shows, etc. (We do however, believe that commercials are EVIL!!!!)

We don't worry about TV in our life. Our children are articulate, intelligent, creative, polite, and healthy.

That said, We do notice sometimes when my DS gets into a "slump" and DOES want to spend all day for several days in a row watching TV. We will step in and try to break that cycle. However, it's not all that often...

JMHO

thank you for posting this.
I could have written this myself...


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## RadUnschooler (Jan 23, 2008)

T.V. is great. So are books, video games,movies and everything thing that builds connections and leads to discussions and learning.


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

I'm not against TV at all (hate commercials though, especially ads for junk geared toward children), but I do want my (future) kids to be aware of how much they are watching. It's all too easy just to get sucked in and spend hours and hours watching TV and before you know it your whole day is gone! Even if it is educational, that's not a good habit to get into.

Says the woman who spends 12 hours a day online.


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## bellymama (Apr 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *frontierpsych* 

Says the woman who spends 12 hours a day online.









word!








anyone who spends a lot of time on here shouldn't be saying anything about to much tv







! we all have our vices.


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## sacredmama (Dec 27, 2007)

No TV household here! We do have this good old laptop that we watch dvds on maybe once a week. For us, we don't feel the TV is "bad", but that there are better things that we can do with ourselves. We had a TV once and it wasn't healthy. I get addicted to it, I just can't have one. I feel so much better when I put my energy into anything other than the TV. But thats just me and to each their own!!


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

I think commercials are fun, educational, stupid, clever, entertaining, and sometimes even touching. I get that they are trying to sell something though, and I think a mindful parent will share that information with their children.

We love to snark on and discuss commercials.


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## desertwind (Mar 21, 2008)

Hey!! What great responses. I guess my thinking is in line with most of you (which is what I was looking for I guess). That moderation, supervision, no lack of healthy attachement and bonding is being avoided, etc.... are all good indicators of what healthy TV watching is. My dd isn't one to zone out and we love to share and play as a result of some of the shows. I feel we have a healthy relationship with the TV... and everyone's posts helped.

I do hate commercials because of the fools these marketing people think we as consumers are... and the worst part is WE ARE. And also because of the toy and cereal and etc... commercials. We are at the point that when we see something we want we whine and cry and sometimes beg for it... very frustrating and I can't expose my dd to all of the possibilities she is missing out on... "I really, really, really want that swimmy baby because I don't have one and I want one and I really, really, really want one" sob sob "and I can't wait for my birthday its too long"... repeat a gazillion times.


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## ann_of_loxley (Sep 21, 2007)

I dont think its a big deal. My son watches a few hours every day. I cant count - I dont monitor it. When he asks for it, then ill turn it on for him.

When he was much younger, as in just born!, I used to have the tele on low all day long. Not becuause I was watching it but because I was lonely and it made me feel not so alone in the house. Because of this, and I really think it is because of this, my son is far from a 'zombie' when the tele is on! He has his shows that he watches - but hes hardly ever just sitting there for more than 10 mintues straight watching it. A lot of his friends however, who have tele very limited to them are like zombies when they see a tele on! You can not reach them at all - like they cant snap out of it or something! This has never been a problem for my son. I have read thats its called 'moving wallpaper' - Which I have read means that you then cant use tele as a source or education but thats bollox as well as my son has learned a lot from shows like discovery animals, etc! However, because my son doesnt turn into a zombie when the tele comes on, its really easy to suggest something else to do because I do realise he asks for the tele when he is bored - so we dont have to always watch tele. But I enjoy tele as well! I realise some would consider this a huge waste of electricity, the tele being on but not being 100% watched - yesterday he was in an out of the garden it was so nice and the tele was on even when he wasnt there, but I do know our electicity comes from wind powered turbines and we can afford the bill so far







lol

I realise tele can be abused and I realise anyone can pull up reports about how it turns your child into a carrot...and I usually am not one to say 'Well I..........and I am fine' - But really, I watched A LOT of tele as a child, and maybe I am just odd but I have never presented any of the problems that watching a lot of tele - One of them being obesity, but I have always been underweight (until I had my son...see having children is more dangerous to your health than tele!







lol) (even in an abusive way) that these reports show - and neither has my son!

(and I have to say I love adverts as well! - My son hasnt been sucked in yet...and tbh, I dont think I ever have to worry about that. I find adverst very entertaining and its from adverts that I usually find really good songs!







)


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## 1xmom (Dec 30, 2003)

We are doing the Tv Turn off thing this week and I have to say, it's a nice refreshing change. although my dd isn't obsessed w/the tv, there are shows that she likes to watch. Funny thing is, I am reading more since the tv is off and my dd is probably reading about the same. But it's just the week day and we don't really have a lot of time to sit down and watch tv, especially since the weather has been so nice. I have also never put a restriction on the time she can watch, but most of the time we watch tv together anyway.


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## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

I feel guilty when my kids watch a lot of tv. My dh works hella long hours and I've problems with getting my thyroid medicine right until recently. Usually it is on for 1-2 hours a day especially when the weather is not nice. The weather has gotten better and they can play in the back yard by themselves. I can see out the window.

I want them to be able to entertain themselves, but I wonder maybe that is not a realistic expectation?


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I don't personally have an interest in TV. My daughter watches a little, but really just when the weather is bad. I don't have a problem with TV and I don't mind her watching it, and I'm not even particularly restrictive with what she watches, but it's possible that if she liked it and watched more, it would bother me. I have no idea.

Anyway, you probably know best whether it's a problem in your family.


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## siobhang (Oct 23, 2005)

agree with pps. Kids only watch stuff from TIVO and only without commercials (if there are commercials on the show, they need to have them fast forwarded through). Prehistoric planet is a current favorite around here.

Oh, and my oldest watches a lot of YouTube - he is obsessed with metro trains and he watches different videos of metro trains over and over again (the computer is in the family room so we can observe what he is clicking on - so far, if the video isn't metro trains, he isn't interested - before metro trains, it was garbage trucks. Do you have any idea how many people video their local garbage truck and post the video on youtube? Thousands...).

I am trying to teach them the difference between a show and a commercial, but they are a little young now.

My biggest concerns about TV:

* most dramas and sitcoms portray "normal life" as upper-middle class white america. There are tons of very loaded class, race, income, and gender based assumptions and stereotypes in these shows. Most adults don't pick up on them, so how is a child meant to? Most kids (and some adults) watch TV as documentaries purporting to show reality. Sure, we know that the story is fiction, but all the ancellary stuff (the size of the house, employment, how people dress, race, interactions between characters, etc.) are seen as "realistic", when in fact they may be more fantasy than the actual storyline. Case in point - the show Friends - what professor working at the Natural History museum can afford child support while living in an enormous apartment in Manhattan? And he was painted as RICH by the show. Hell, my dh and I were dual income no kids, working in IT in the dotcom boom during that same time period, and WE couldn't afford such a place in Manhattan.

* Many children's shows are actually just 20 minute commercials, with some commercials thrown in for good measure. And just because something is called educational, doesn't mean it actually teaches anything worthwhile (some do, some don't - educational is similar to the term "natural" - not a regulated term).

* commercials shown during kids shows are carefully crafted to ellicit specific responses from children, to get their parents to buy crap. That level of manipulation is, IMHO, ethically abhorrant.

I am not even getting into inappropriate content for the age, or developmental appropriateness, etc. I assume that most parents get that TV needs to be moderated at some level when it comes to kids.

Siobhan


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

My kids watch some TV, I try to keep it to a minimum though.

Why do people think TV is bad? Because there is research that shows it isn't good for kids, especially below Age 2. That kids who watch educational shows like sesame street actually know less when they reach shool than their non-tv watching counterparts even when parenting involvement like reading is accounted for. I recommend reading "The Plug In Drug" for more info on that.

But just from my personal experience, I'll tell you why I don't like it. I only let my kids watch preapproved shows generally on noggin or PBS. From some of these shows, my daughter has learned things she never would have come across on her own. She's learned to tell people to 'Go away', she's learned to tell people "I'm not talking to you", she learned to point at things and say 'Enh' when she wants something (at age 5) rather than asking politely because a character in a show does this, she learned to be afraid of the dark. Yes, I can pinpoint the exact show she watched that she learned these behaviors from.

Often these preschool shows deal with typical kid problems, but ones that my daughter has not encountered yet, so rather than learning a solution to a problem, she learns the problem. Rather than learning how to resolve a dispute in the 'I'm not talking to you' episode of the wonderpets, she instead learns that when you are mad at someone you tell them you aren't talking to them.

We do our best to keep TV to a minimum as a result. Am I super strict about it no? They do watch TV sometimes. But I try not to make it a regular thing.


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## Herausgeber (Apr 29, 2006)

We watch a limited amount of TV/DVDs, but no "kid" TV. I know DD watches shows at daycare on rainy days and during the half-hour that the DCP needs to clean up after lunch, and I am fine with that.

Aside from the studies that pretty consistently show that watching television has negative effects on young children, we also limit it for our own health: Having the television on in the background too long stresses me out and gives me a headache.

Mostly we don't watch, though, because we have no time. I WOH FT, and when I get home, we spend as much of our time outside as possible.


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## marybethorama (Jun 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RadUnschooler* 
T.V. is great. So are books, video games,movies and everything thing that builds connections and leads to discussions and learning.

Took the words right out of my mouth









All of those things are part of our life.


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## swimswamswum (Oct 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OhDang* 
I noticed a lot of you are saying as long as it is commercial free..Whats wrong with commercials? (not being snarky i am really curious? I hate them but i was wondering why a lot of mamas dont want their kids watching them?)

Small kids don't differentiate between commercial and program content. Very scary.

There have been some awesome articles and some research about the phenomenon of "branding baby". It's truly frightening.

Here are some links:

http://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/200011/baby.asp
http://www.commercialfreechildhood.org/


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## swimswamswum (Oct 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bellymama* 
word!








anyone who spends a lot of time on here shouldn't be saying anything about to much tv







! we all have our vices.

But this is active. Television watching is passive. I really think there's a difference because our brains are engaged when we're on MDC or the internet.

I agree that too much screen time isn't good, but I really think there's a difference in how our brains process discussions on line and vegging out in front of the television.


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## YesandNo (Mar 16, 2008)

I see no benefit to watching TV. My daughter is 1 month now, so I'm not dealing with this yet, but I don't want her to grow up like I did.....in a house where the TV was always on a "background noise".

Moving out, getting my own place, learning that I don't have to have that noise and distraction on all. the. time. was a huge liberator for me.

More recently, while I was pregnant I was zonked and watched several hours a day of TV. Stuff on TIVO, no channel surfing. Then the writer strike happened, I got sick of crappy reality shows, kept it off. I read a lot, did more visiting, organized my closets. Again, it was like my life opened up. I had so much more time every day. I had to think of things to do instead of zombie-ing out.

So, right now the plan is no TV for the kiddo.

The question is....... how many first-time parents feel that way, only to "succumb" in a couple years (or less)? I don't mean that in a judgmental way. Having a baby has taught me that my pre-birth expectations were sometimes laughably wrong. I can say now what I want for my child as she grows up, but I'm not so arrogant as to believe that I'll know what it's really like until I get there.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

I agree that no one "needs" TV ... I grew up without regularly going out in warm weather to play in the water and mud -- but my girls both love getting to play in the mud. They may not *need* to play in the mud -- but they sure are getting a lot out of it. And I say the same about TV.

We don't limit TV/computer in our house. I think the important thing is for parents to be available and attentive, and for children to have access to a variety of different ways to explore life. If my children are wanting to cook something, or play a game, or paint, or go outside, I don't believe in trying to redirect them to TV just because I'm feeling lazy.

So, since they know that all they have to do is say, "I'd like to ..." -- and I'm going to work with them to help them get what they want, if they watch TV it's because they want to watch TV, and it doesn't have control over them.


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## kewb (May 13, 2005)

TV is a part of our lives. I do limit the amount of tv/video/computer time because I can see differences in my kids behavior. On school days they get to watch one 30 minute show after dinner. On the week-ends I am more lax. The tv is probably on for about 2 hours in the morning and then at night we watch a movie. Now that the weather is beautiful the mantra is "Outside". Sometimes my kids complain that it is hot but they know they can come inside and play but the tv is remaining off.

This is what works for us. I have friends who do no tv and some who have it on all day. Before having kids I used to keep the tv on if I was home for background noise. It was a hard habit to break. DH is still not 100% broken of this habit.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OhDang* 
I noticed a lot of you are saying as long as it is commercial free..Whats wrong with commercials? (not being snarky i am really curious? I hate them but i was wondering why a lot of mamas dont want their kids watching them?)

I use commercials to talk about consumerism, so I don't want all commercial-free TV. DS only watches PBS on cable (otherwise, he watches DVDs), but I think it's important to expose and then discuss rather than try to eliminate.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *swimswamswum* 
But this is active. Television watching is passive. I really think there's a difference because our brains are engaged when we're on MDC or the internet.

This is a good point, but I think it depends largely on what you're watching. If you're sitting in front of drama after drama, then no, that's terrible. Certainly there's a good bit of value in certain shows, though. The history channel, for example, has some interesting information, and I think I'm actively engaged in it a way similar to reading a historical monograph. I'm also a huge, huge football fan. I'm not making justifications for that; I don't need to. BUT, I will say that though it's a "spectator" sport, it's not an entirely passive experience to watch that type of high-intensity sport. Watching political debates and discussion require brain power, too. So, in those cases, I don't think there's less involvement than there is on a message board.

Now, would it be better to actually go to archives and read, play football, and participate in a political debate? Sure, but I'm not going to be able to do all of those things all the time, and in that way, I think TV isn't terribly evil.

I actually have more concern over what I see for children slightly older than mine. I've yet to see a female on any show, for example, that I'd want my daughter exposed to regularly. I feel I'd have to constantly reinforce our beliefs about gender, and then the experience becomes draining. Unfortunately there's not a huge TV market for brilliant girl without self-esteem problems and who doesn't need to dress trendy.


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

I don't think its a big deal. We watch a couple movies a week and its usually on so I can listen to the news. Neither of my kids watches much even if it is on, they're normally in their room or off playing somewhere else.


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## nancy926 (Mar 10, 2003)

I think there are many ways to "watch" TV. I would not want the TV on all the time as background noise. Nor would I just want to sit there and click through channels, looking for something for my kids to watch. But I see nothing wrong with them watching 2 or 3 shows a day on TiVo or DVD or videotape.

And I disagree that all TV watching is passive. My kids sometimes ask questions about a show, or we make comments about what we see. For a long time, my older DD would play Blue's Clues herself - she cut out three blue pawprints and would think up something she wanted to do, and then put the clues around the house. Then DH or I would find them, draw them in a notebook, and try to solve the puzzle. (Sometimes he or I would place the clues and DD would solve the puzzle.) That takes creativity as well as analytical skills (and it helped me learn how to draw better, LOL).

So it's cool with me as long as a) the TV is not just randomly "on" and b) we avoid ads as much as possible. Kids under about 8 can't distinguish an ad from reality, so they think those happy kids playing with plastic junk or eating sugary snacks really are happy BECAUSE of those things. So of course they want them, too.

also...my older DD didn't watch much TV until she was about 3.5. We tried to keep it from my younger DD, but you can only do so much - we didn't feel like it was fair to suddenly forbid DD1 to watch TV just because DD2 might see it. So DD2 has been watching since a much younger age.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

We watch tv and play video games.







:

I've done the research and it's not something I'm concerned about. Everything in moderation.


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## GooeyRN (Apr 24, 2006)

I see no problem with TV as long as it is somewhat educational. I chose no TV until age 2 for dd. I let her watch as much tv as she wants now. However, she is limited to PBS and DVD's I buy. She watched a lot in the winter since I had a new baby and couldn't play with her much. (major bfing difficulities) Now that it is nice out we go to the playground for 2-3 hours a day, go for walks, go in the backyard, etc. She usually watches about 2 hours a day now. She is learning a lot from Sesame St. She is 30 months old.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Hmm, it is the part though, where desertwind said "several hours a day" that bugs me the most. There are so many other things for a little person to do. Paint, playdough, picture books, sorting the dishes or laundry with you, helping to make the meals, helping you shop, taking a walk, petting or brushing the dog or cat, crayons, make believe play with a "tent" and a flashlight..... etc, etc, etc.

My kids have had tv on a short leash their whole lives so far. They have "down time" in their day just to hang or read or book. We pretty much only watch Tv as a family from the Tivo so there's no commercials and we use the "pause" button quite a bit to talk about the plot or a mistake being made by the central characters.

No, Tv is not evil but there's no need for it to be your only life. Folks who watch too much Tv tend to be obese and undereducated.... why take this chance with your kid?


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## EnviroBecca (Jun 5, 2002)

Read _The Plug-In Drug_ by Marie Winn.

YesAndNo wrote:

Quote:

So, right now the plan is no TV for the kiddo.

The question is....... how many first-time parents feel that way, only to "succumb" in a couple years (or less)?
Well, our PLAN was to succumb in a couple years! Everything we read was indicating that TV is a bad idea for babies under 2 years old, but after that a moderate amount of appropriate programming does little to no harm. So:

We stopped watching television in his presence as soon as he started to look at the screen. We avoided taking him to places where TV would be on, and when we were in those places we avoided watching the TV ourselves, which reduced his interest in it.

When he was 22 months old, we began to let him watch an occasional short video (5-15 minutes) on the computer.

After he turned 2, we began to let him watch TV, watch videos, or play on the computer on a more regular basis. Our policy was that he had to do these things WITH A PARENT. As tempting as it is to use TV as a babysitter, we realized that watching with him means we're certain of exactly what he's seen and gives us plenty of leverage for limiting TV time: "No, we can't watch because I have to wash these dishes. Would you like to help?"

Around his 3rd birthday, he became adept with the mouse, so we now let him do computer drawing or play a computer game on his own. There's always a parent nearby to check in on what he's doing and provide tech support.









His total screentime is under 2 hours a day unless he's sick, in which case we let him watch as much as he likes. This winter, he had some screentime almost every day, but now that it's spring he's playing outdoors in the evening and running out of time for TV/computer.









I must say, holding back on TV for the first two years was totally worth it just to see my son's astonishment and excitement when he first saw Cookie Monster on TV! He had thought Cookie Monster was just a book character and stuffed toy! He did not know he was "real"!!! And he certainly did not expect him to eat an M! He told everyone we met about it for WEEKS.


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## amitymama (Nov 17, 2006)

I used to feel guilty but I don't anymore. DD watches about an hour and a half of cartoons in the morning (in between eating her cereal, kissing Daddy goodbye and running around playing with toys or chasing the cats) while I have my breakfast and get some things done. We have a strict "no tv between 9am and 5pm" rule and always do at least one outing and one craft a day. We read books, sing songs, do gymnastics on the bed, and just enjoy each other. But at about 5.30 or 6pm I am tired, she is bored and we're both just waiting for DH to get home so I let her watch a bit of CBeebies (like PBS in the States, sort of) or a video until he comes home and then she's off, ripping and roaring around the house with him until bedtime.

I don't feel guilty in the least for this. She is a bright child and we know how to enforce limits. Like anything else, it is best in moderation and using common sense.


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## cancat (Jun 15, 2004)

Hmm, I don't think its evil, just prefer my life without it, think it causes problems in many young children, and has shown no proven benefit at all.

Plus, I'm scared that my children wouldn't learn how to amuse themselves, which is the only way I get "met" time.


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## Narn (Nov 7, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LionTigerBear* 
For me, I feel that TV and movie-watching in the evening with my spouse prevents us talking meaningfully, sharing spiritual-reading and study together (one of our goals which we rarely accomplish) and even gets in the way of nookie sometimes. Unfortunately he's rather attached to his screen time, so it is what it is.

me too


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## chinaKat (Aug 6, 2005)

Well, in our house, it's all or nothing -- there is no such thing as just "having it on in the background" while DD plays. If the TV is on, she is transfixed. Always has been -- from as soon as she started looking at the screen. She's 3 and will watch an entire football game -- even though she understands very little of the sport!

Because of that, I don't enjoy letting her watch a lot of television. A little downtime is okay, but I don't think she needs to be in such a passive, catatonic, zombie like state for long periods of the day.

In our house we only watch PBS kids shows, and the Pats.







(Like that line in Raising Arizona where Hy talks about what programming he lets Nathan Jr. watch -- "PBS and football only, so he can be exposed to the finer things in life.") DD usually gets a show or two in the morning and then when I need a break or to do something during the day, but I try to limit it.

We are doing no TV this week (Turn Your TV off Week) and it's been great so far. We have read a ton of books and it's been nice every day so we've gone outside a lot.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *siobhang* 
most dramas and sitcoms portray "normal life" as upper-middle class white america. There are tons of very loaded class, race, income, and gender based assumptions and stereotypes in these shows. Most adults don't pick up on them, so how is a child meant to? Most kids (and some adults) watch TV as documentaries purporting to show reality. Sure, we know that the story is fiction, but all the ancellary stuff (the size of the house, employment, how people dress, race, interactions between characters, etc.) are seen as "realistic", when in fact they may be more fantasy than the actual storyline. Case in point - the show Friends - what professor working at the Natural History museum can afford child support while living in an enormous apartment in Manhattan? And he was painted as RICH by the show. Hell, my dh and I were dual income no kids, working in IT in the dotcom boom during that same time period, and WE couldn't afford such a place in Manhattan.


This is exactly the kind of stuff my family discusses often.









It's "What the hell is with the stereotyped characters?" or "Why is the sibling relationship always the same?" or "Wow, for once the parents and kids seem to really like each other in a real way..." and so on.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *philomom* 
Hmm, it is the part though, where desertwind said "several hours a day" that bugs me the most. There are so many other things for a little person to do. Paint, playdough, picture books, sorting the dishes or laundry with you, helping to make the meals, helping you shop, taking a walk, petting or brushing the dog or cat, crayons, make believe play with a "tent" and a flashlight..... etc, etc, etc.

 Well, people who desire to do those other things will do them I would think. In our house TV is available whenever, and so are most other things. We can go play or do something else and then watch TV again if we want to. No big deal.

Some days we watch several hours, or it's on for several hours but we come and go or "listen-watch" while we make dinner in the kitchen or etc. Some days we don't turn it on until the evening or at all downstairs.

Quote:

Folks who watch too much Tv tend to be obese and undereducated.... why take this chance with your kid?
That means we have to decide what "too much" is. And that's probably going to be different for everyone. It also assumes that TV somehow prohibits learning... unless I am reading you wrong.


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## amyleigh33 (Nov 2, 2006)

We've never had cable because we can't really afford it, but when we've lived in places where we could pick up a decent channel on the antennae vs. places we can't (we move a lot) I quickly learned that having access to TV necessarily increases how much TV I watch when it's so easy to "sit down, turn on, and tune out" sts. We have a TV and watch DVDs on it, we watch certain TV shows online occasionally (maybe too often), and I personally don't see anything wrong with enjoying TV as long as you also enjoy lots of other (esp. active) activities, too. I'm also "against" commercials.

A PP mentioned about spending time online--I definitely am guilty of spending way too much time online on MDC, on Facebook, blogs, things like that, rather than interacting with my family and friends in real life. I think TV has the potential to do the same thing, indeed it was probably the first thing to do it but is quickly being replaced by the net for a lot of people.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *philomom* 
There are so many other things for a little person to do. Paint, playdough, picture books, sorting the dishes or laundry with you, helping to make the meals, helping you shop, taking a walk, petting or brushing the dog or cat, crayons, make believe play with a "tent" and a flashlight..... etc, etc, etc.

With my own kids, I'm finding that since they have free access to all of the above, having free access to the TV doesn't prevent them from doing these other things.

It seems quite unusual for TV to be anyone's "whole life." Just as mud isn't my childrens' whole life -- just a big, interesting part of it, so TV and other media play their part.

I used to think I had to limit TV to enable my children to exercise their creativity: Then I learned that my children are naturally creative, active, and interested in relating to all the wonderful people, animals, and things in the world around them. Dh and I are eager to facilitate their involvement in life -- so TV, to them, is just one of many different avenues of exploration.

I still inwardly laugh when I remember a thread where someone criticized parents for "sitting toddlers in front of the TV for hours on end." I mean, have you ever tried to "sit" a toddler anywhere for hours on end?







I can't speak for everyone else -- but with my own kids, even if you _wanted_ to get them immobilized and catatonic for a couple hours, it just aint gonna happen.


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## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
I still inwardly laugh when I remember a thread where someone criticized parents for "sitting toddlers in front of the TV for hours on end." I mean, have you ever tried to "sit" a toddler anywhere for hours on end?







I can't speak for everyone else -- but with my own kids, even if you _wanted_ to get them immobilized and catatonic for a couple hours, it just aint gonna happen.

yah well this is why i don't let them watch too much. eventually they will get bored of it. when i'm sick or disparately need a few minutes to myself, i know it will still have it's magic powers of zombiedom.


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## chinaKat (Aug 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
With my own kids, I'm finding that since they have free access to all of the above, having free access to the TV doesn't prevent them from doing these other things.

It seems quite unusual for TV to be anyone's "whole life." Just as mud isn't my childrens' whole life -- just a big, interesting part of it, so TV and other media play their part.

I used to think I had to limit TV to enable my children to exercise their creativity: Then I learned that my children are naturally creative, active, and interested in relating to all the wonderful people, animals, and things in the world around them. Dh and I are eager to facilitate their involvement in life -- so TV, to them, is just one of many different avenues of exploration.

I still inwardly laugh when I remember a thread where someone criticized parents for "sitting toddlers in front of the TV for hours on end." I mean, have you ever tried to "sit" a toddler anywhere for hours on end?







I can't speak for everyone else -- but with my own kids, even if you _wanted_ to get them immobilized and catatonic for a couple hours, it just aint gonna happen.

My DD would sit in front of the tv for hours on end if you let her, even when she was 2. She's a bright kid that enjoys a zillion different activities, but TV has a pull on her like a tractor beam. It's uncanny.


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## EyesOfTheWorld (Apr 20, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *YesandNo* 
I see no benefit to watching TV. My daughter is 1 month now, so I'm not dealing with this yet, but I don't want her to grow up like I did.....in a house where the TV was always on a "background noise".

Moving out, getting my own place, learning that I don't have to have that noise and distraction on all. the. time. was a huge liberator for me.

More recently, while I was pregnant I was zonked and watched several hours a day of TV. Stuff on TIVO, no channel surfing. Then the writer strike happened, I got sick of crappy reality shows, kept it off. I read a lot, did more visiting, organized my closets. Again, it was like my life opened up. I had so much more time every day. I had to think of things to do instead of zombie-ing out.

So, right now the plan is no TV for the kiddo.

The question is....... how many first-time parents feel that way, only to "succumb" in a couple years (or less)? I don't mean that in a judgmental way. Having a baby has taught me that my pre-birth expectations were sometimes laughably wrong. I can say now what I want for my child as she grows up, but I'm not so arrogant as to believe that I'll know what it's really like until I get there.

I lived in that same house!







When I first moved out, I found the silence deafening, and I started doing the same thing. Then when DH and I moved in together, we had a TV (wedding gift) but no cable and very few movies, so I had to get used to it. I was awful at first, I honestly got a bit depressed. It was like a life long friend had died. But once I got used to it (and it really tooks years!) it was something I cherished.

We started out wanting no TV for DD1, and although they both watch very occasional DVDs now, they don't watch TV at our house. When DD1 was little I used to avoid places with TV, ask people we were visiting to turn thiers off, etc - but what I'm realizing now is that I don't want to make TV this big forbidden thing, and give it power in that way. So they watch a few cooking shows at my moms with her, sometimes see a show at a friend's house, etc. It's no big deal. Just not something we go at home.

This has worked really well for us so far, and I can't imagine getting cable at any point. DH and I aren't interested in missing time with each other to zone out (we had cable for about 6 months as a promo with our internet - our relationship took a serious downswing) and there's nothing there we need. We rent or buy movies for the tow of us, or the family occasionally. So yes, I think you can go without TV (or DVDs or any of it), indefinetly, if that's what you feel is right for your family.


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## LotusBirthMama (Jun 25, 2005)

We were TV free for a year when my kids were 9 and 4. Now we Direct TV and a hugh jass flat screen and I am eternally thankful for the blessed thing.

We like TV. We thought we were living some principled life not having it...but now that its back we are realizing how much it sucked not having it.

The kids are pretty unrestricted in what and how much they watch. I found after a week or so of endless TV they realized it wasn't going anywhere and now choose to go do other, more fun stuff. Which is fine by me..then I get to watch my shows.


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## mamalibby (Aug 20, 2007)

We do the Wiggles. He loves them. We got a dvd player for the car when we moved 3 hours away from family (for the long trips originally, but now we do turn it on for shorter trips, too). He also gets about 2 songs after we brush his teeth twice a day, and unrestricted dvd-watching when he is sick. I actually love it, bc it's always there just in case, and it has introduced a lot of new songs and dances that we do together ALL the time, without the tv. And it is really too cute when he does all the gestures to "Hot Potato"


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## DevaMajka (Jul 4, 2005)

I've not read anything but the OP, but I don't think tv is a big deal. I've thought about it, and decided that a couple hours is just fine.

I'm not a morning person, I need some space.
There's a pbs like station on in the morning that ds loves to watch. No commercials, all cartoons aimed at young kids. Some learning stuff (abc's etc, which I don't care about) but mostly getting along, etc.
His limit is 2 hours a day, for tv and computer. A lot of days, *he* turns it off well before the 2 hours is up. I dunno, that seems like a healthy relationship with tv to me.

Tv is never a big deal to him. I'd way rather have it be like this than have it be a source of stress for us (meaning, him always wanting to watch more, and me saying no)

eta- I should add that I picked a 2 hour limit because it was the most that he usually watched. Just every so often he'd go much longer, and I didn't like that. He's quite agreeable to the 2 hour limit, and I can't think of a time it's ever caused any grief.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chinaKat* 
My DD would sit in front of the tv for hours on end if you let her, even when she was 2. She's a bright kid that enjoys a zillion different activities, but TV has a pull on her like a tractor beam. It's uncanny.

I guess it's different with every child. TV/computer definitely had that uncanny pull when I strictly limited it. And when I first pulled out all the stops and said, "You can watch whenever you want" -- well, for a while I just had to bolster my faith by reading Radical Unschooling stuff, cause it seemed like it was never going off again.

But, in time -- like a few months I think, it became just one of many interesting past-times to my children. I do see Nichole's point about it losing its "magic powers of zombiedom." Dh and I can no longer sneak off for some quick romantic time, cause we can't count on any show to reliably hold our girls enthralled for even 5 minutes.

I mean, sometimes they do still get enthralled in shows for way more than 5 minutes, we just can't count on that happening, for both of them, at the exact times when we're wanting to sneak off.









But, anyhow, dh and I do manage to connect sometimes after the girls go to sleep ... and I do manage to get "me-time" -- such as right now ... I'm so blessed to have a full-time WOH dh who loves doing the grocery shopping, and offers to take both girls along!


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## ann_of_loxley (Sep 21, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
I guess it's different with every child. TV/computer definitely had that uncanny pull when I strictly limited it. And when I first pulled out all the stops and said, "You can watch whenever you want" -- well, for a while I just had to bolster my faith by reading Radical Unschooling stuff, cause it seemed like it was never going off again.

But, in time -- like a few months I think, it became just one of many interesting past-times to my children. I do see Nichole's point about it losing its "magic powers of zombiedom." Dh and I can no longer sneak off for some quick romantic time, cause we can't count on any show to reliably hold our girls enthralled for even 5 minutes.

I mean, sometimes they do still get enthralled in shows for way more than 5 minutes, we just can't count on that happening, for both of them, at the exact times when we're wanting to sneak off.









But, anyhow, dh and I do manage to connect sometimes after the girls go to sleep ... and I do manage to get "me-time" -- such as right now ... I'm so blessed to have a full-time WOH dh who loves doing the grocery shopping, and offers to take both girls along!


yep - the novelty of it wears off when they realise its not longer controlled by anyone else than themselves.

its like - if you tried limiting my chocolate intake and then all of a sudded let me have as much as I want - I would stuff my face with it for awhile until the novelty had worn off - once I realise I have that control myself, then I would want it only every now and then...and probably much less than the amount I was limited!

But I also think its important for parents to set good examples as well! - I dont just sit here all day. I am always doing something from reading to making cards to knitting to cleaning the house, etc etc.... If I did just sit around, I am sure my son would just want to sit around as well watching tele. But he doesnt! - Now the weather is nice, he is always the one dragging me outside!!! lol

Also - someone mentoned how watching tele was 'passive' - unlike being on the computer. I would agree and disagree with that ...I guess it depends on what you watch! I would say everything my son does watch is educational. Hes never just sitting there. Hes running around and joining in with the actions and pointing out things and finding things and counting and singing along, etc. Even when I watch tele, its never very passive. Yeah sometimes it is for me, but I am not watching educational things lol....but even Dr.Who gets me thinking and talking about things with my DH...my brain is very active even when watching tele! hehe


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## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

We don't make a big deal about it. DS watches the morning PBS shows so I can check in w/ my email and shower and stuff. He like Caillou, Curious George and Super Why.

On the other hand, yeah, I do "limit" his TV. It's loosely limited though, if that makes any sense. In other words, it's not so much X hours per day or any formula of how much he can watch. Some days he might watch more than others, and I don't get all stressed about it.

But I also feel that if he's had enough then it's going to get shut off.

I see my nephews and my neice who can watch as much TV as they want, and I swear that they watch TV *ALL* the time.

So not everyone can self-regulate and the novelty sure hasn't worn off for them, and they are 10, 12 and 15.

I've noticed that parents whose kids this works well for (no limits) have a hard time believing that it doesn't work well for others, LOL.


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## Potty Diva (Jun 18, 2003)

Mightmoo and Swim- I agree with you and studies that show TV and young children just are not a good idea.

Plus the time spent watching TV is time taken away from being a family.

With Kailey we saw a dramatic change in personality when we started limiting TV. She is now limited to 30 minutes per day of television. No more, not even on the weekends.

And she is a changed person. She argues less, and wants to do more activities. She even reads more.

TV isn't evil, but IMO, it's a waste of time and energy.


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## mommy68 (Mar 13, 2006)

I don't think t.v. is evil. We don't turn our t.v. on until after 5pm every day of the week, with the exception of weekends. That is mainly because I H/S one child and I work from home and there's not enough time in a day for t.v. Usually on weekends though we are outdoors or going to church, out with family or friends, playing board games, going bowling, etc and no time for t.v. but I don't think it's a terrible thing.

I do believe in moderation. You have to be able to be a good example for your children in all areas, read a lot in front of them, have a good relationship with your spouse in front of them, don't watch a lot of t.v. in front of them, etc. My kids like t.v. and when they DO watch it they have more appreciation for it because they don't do it very often. They also know when enough is enough because it's not a very big focal point of any day of their week and it isn't for my husband and I either. They learn from us.

You could ask my 6 yr old child who Hanna Montana is and she won't know and I'm okay with that.







I don't feel like I'm a bad mom for that because I do let her watch t.v. in moderation. I'm just very careful in what I help her choose to watch.


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## Potty Diva (Jun 18, 2003)

Kailey knew who characters were even without watching TV because she was exposed to children who did watch TV. She could name characters and recognize them at the sotres because she was curious to know who the characters on clothing, etc the kids were wearing or had with them at preschool.


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## chinaKat (Aug 6, 2005)

Well, after a week of NO TV at all, I'm pleased to see that DD has totally stopped begging for it, which was half the hassle IMO. AND she's reading ten times more. So I don't think I'll be reintroducing it any time soon. It's not like she's missing out on anything important.

I grew up in a TV free house and I'm a voracious reader... I don't think the two are unrelated, and what I've seen this week supports my feeling on that.


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## Azuralea (Jan 29, 2007)

It totally depends on the family.

For us, we don't like TV much, we never watched much before DS was born, and both of us _hate_ being in places where the TV is on as background (we'll leave restaurants where that's the case). We both prefer a home life without TV. I think I'd really be resentful of the family time TV took away if we watched it regularly. So we don't, and we're pretty happy that way.

So I wouldn't say there is a way for us to do TV where it would be "no big deal." But I do think that there are plenty of ways for _other_ families to have TV and have it be no big deal. It's not possible for us, but I know plenty of families with happy, creative, well-adjusted kids who watch TV, so, I don't think it's the end of the world.

I'm definitely not a fan of parking toddlers and babies in front of the TV, but I think that reflects my inherent dislike of TV to begin with.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommy68* 
I do believe in moderation. You have to be able to be a good example for your children in all areas, read a lot in front of them, have a good relationship with your spouse in front of them, don't watch a lot of t.v. in front of them, etc.

What about watching a lot of TV _with_ them?







I do. I think often it's just going to come down to the personalities involved, like Alima (I believe) mentioned above. I don't think my watching 3 hours of TV in one day is setting a bad example.


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## LifeIZBeautiful (Jan 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
With my own kids, I'm finding that since they have free access to all of the above, having free access to the TV doesn't prevent them from doing these other things.

It seems quite unusual for TV to be anyone's "whole life." Just as mud isn't my childrens' whole life -- just a big, interesting part of it, so TV and other media play their part.

I used to think I had to limit TV to enable my children to exercise their creativity: Then I learned that my children are naturally creative, active, and interested in relating to all the wonderful people, animals, and things in the world around them. Dh and I are eager to facilitate their involvement in life -- so TV, to them, is just one of many different avenues of exploration.

I still inwardly laugh when I remember a thread where someone criticized parents for "sitting toddlers in front of the TV for hours on end." I mean, have you ever tried to "sit" a toddler anywhere for hours on end?







I can't speak for everyone else -- but with my own kids, even if you _wanted_ to get them immobilized and catatonic for a couple hours, it just aint gonna happen.

Yes, yes, YES!! I agree, exactly.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

I have no issues with the kids watching TV. DD and DS both have learned tons from watching childrens shows. It also helps expand their imagination and helps them understand real from fiction.

A big







: to what mammal_mama said


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UnschoolnMa* 
What about watching a lot of TV _with_ them?







I do. I think often it's just going to come down to the personalities involved, like Alima (I believe) mentioned above. I don't think my watching 3 hours of TV in one day is setting a bad example.

Yes, I like this idea! We interact *a lot* when we watch TV together.

I also agree with ann_of_loxley, that if we sit in front of the computer a lot, our kids are likely to sit in front of the TV more than they would if we were up and about, doing things that are more interesting for our children to observe and join in with.

Again, about the idea of "parking" children in front of the TV -- are some children really like cars such that you can "park" them, turn off the ignition, and have them stay where you've left them for hours on end? I guess I just have a hard time imagining that scenario, as my own children are so much the opposite.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *karina5* 
I've noticed that parents whose kids this works well for (no limits) have a hard time believing that it doesn't work well for others, LOL.

I've also noticed that parents who say their kids can't self-regulate, tend to not allow their children much chance to get the hang of self-regulation, before re-establishing the limits. With my own children, as I've already mentioned, it took at least a few months of freedom, before TV became less of a big deal, and became just one of many interesting options. And most parents don't allow more than about a week, before declaring that the experiment didn't work out.

And my one friend who allowed many years without limiting TV, but now says it didn't work, spent many, many hours each day plugged into a computer herself. So I see this more as a caution to me, that I need to get up and get busy developing a variety of interests, than as a caution that I need to limit TV. And now I'm off to pursue some of those other interests with my girls. See you later!


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## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
I've also noticed that parents who say their kids can't self-regulate, tend to not allow their children much chance to get the hang of self-regulation, before re-establishing the limits. With my own children, as I've already mentioned, it took at least a few months of freedom, before TV became less of a big deal, and became just one of many interesting options. And most parents don't allow more than about a week, before declaring that the experiment didn't work out.



Are you personalizing what I said? Why? All I'm saying is that not every kid is the same. Would you disagree with that?


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## NYCVeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *desertwind* 
I don't understand why sooo many folks think TV is actually evil. I am talking about toddlers watching commercial free cartoons say several hours a day.

Well, if you genuinely want to know why some parents choose to go TV-free, I would do some reading. My recommendations are _Buy Buy Baby_ and _The Plug-In Drug_.

I think "evil" is a very strong word, but I do think our lives have improved enormously since we've been TV free (dd, almost 2, has never watched any TV). We talk more, read more, interact more, and are more creative in how we spend our time. We sleep better. Our concentration has improved tremendously. And we were never big TV watchers to begin with. Dd is incredibly verbal, independent, social, and creative--I'm not saying that a child who watches TV *won't* be those things--I'm just saying that we don't see what TV could be giving her (and us) that she doesn't already have.

So many TV shows feed into (and are fed by) a culture of over- and conspicuous consumption that we want to avoid as much as possible. I like that dd's dolls are just dolls, not Elmo and Dora. I like that she doesn't ask for the fruit snacks or sugar cereal at the supermarket, just because it has a favorite character on the box. I like that all of her books are actual books, not product tie-ins meant to feed the cycle of watching and buying.

We watch movies at home (just dh and I) maybe once or twice a month. When dd is older, we will include her in that, but I don't think we'll want to do it more often. So many nights, one of us will say, "Hmm...do you want to watch a movie?" And after we think about it, we almost always say, "No, let's do X instead."

And "several hours a day"? Dd is "busy" (dinner, bath, stories, etc.) starting at 6:30 pm, goes to sleep around 8, wakes at around 7am. We're dressing and eating breakfast and tidying up until around 8:30. She naps for around 2 hours a day. So our big blocks of play time are 8:30-12 and then 3-6:30. I can't imagine if three of those hours a day were taken up with TV! We'd miss out on so many other activities--trips to the park, art class, walks around the neighborhood, cooking together, reading books, coloring, gardening, building, doing puzzles, whatever. Again, it's not that I think TV is "evil"--it's that there are so many other things that we find more enriching. But several hours a day seems really worrisome to me. Toddlers just don't have that much awake time!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *swimswamswum* 
Small kids don't differentiate between commercial and program content. Very scary.

Yes. And all the studies that have been done on this equate "small" with "seven or eight and younger"--we're not just talking about toddlers.


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## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Cheesecake isn't evil either, but if you make it part of your daily diet, it causes health problems. Same with TV, IMHO.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *karina5* 
Are you personalizing what I said? Why?

Oh, not at all! I didn't take your statement as being directed at me -- and I certainly wasn't directing what I said specifically to you.

I was just sharing what I've seen in my experience -- that most parents who say that their kids can't self-regulate, haven't allowed them more than a few days to get the hang of freedom, before swooping in to re-impose the limits.

And in the other example I shared, where my friend allowed her kids tons of freedom to watch TV and play computer games, I don't think they had tons of freedom in other areas -- such as freedom to interact with her and have her be available, freedom to explore the outdoors and make messes, and so on.

It's a natural response, when someone's used to being regulated, for them to try to take in all they can of the limited thing before it's snatched away again. It can take a looong time -- I'm talking months, not weeks or days -- for a child to finally trust that the freedom is there to stay. Sadly, many parents end up fulfilling the child's suspicion that the freedom really *isn't* there to stay.

Quote:

All I'm saying is that not every kid is the same. Would you disagree with that?
Oh, I certainly agree that every individual is unique. My two daughters are very different from one another in many ways. But, in both cases, they have a wide range of interests that includes, but is not limited to, TV and computer games.


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## Azuralea (Jan 29, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
Cheesecake isn't evil either, but if you make it part of your daily diet, it causes health problems. Same with TV, IMHO.









:

This is essentially my feeling as well.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

I guess we limit it here, but it is not usually a power struggle. If he wants to watch a cartoon, I let him. I won't let him watch one video after another, but he rarely wants to since we only have three and he is getting sick of them.

I watch tv a little bit and so does ds.

And I don't like cheese cake very much, but we have unlimited access to Ben and Jerry's in this house. I'm not kidding. Interestingly, ds seems to be able to self-regulate with that and only asks twice a week or so. But if he wants it for breakfast, he gets it. Ben and Jerry have a very special place in my heart.


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hoopin' Mama* 
And I don't like cheese cake very much, but we have unlimited access to Ben and Jerry's in this house. I'm not kidding. Interestingly, ds seems to be able to self-regulate with that and only asks twice a week or so. But if he wants it for breakfast, he gets it. Ben and Jerry have a very special place in my heart.

It's cool to meet another momma who's cool with ice-cream for breakfast!


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammal_mama* 
It's cool to meet another momma who's cool with ice-cream for breakfast!


Hahaha! Ds and I cheers with our ice cream spoons.
The universe just smacked me down though. We are having an issue today where he seems to want to do nothing but watch cartoons. ARg. Time to leave the house I guess!


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## fresh_water (Feb 29, 2008)

We love our TV here. I do think for our son's sake, we need to mind what we are watching. I tend to keep it off as much as possible throughout the day. This is part of my "Get the Electric Bill Down" campaign, but also so that DS isn't tempted at all to sit and watch. He's almost 10 months old. Some days he's more interested in it than others. But I do turn it on at breakfast and lunch when it's just me and him so he pays attention to that and I can eat.









My brother on the other hand. He has a son a month older than mine. That kid watches hours of TV a day. His mother told us he watches Baby Einstein to make him smart, and that she recently had to toss a copy of a Sesame Street video because he had watched it so much it wore out. I was speechless. He was 9 months old when she told me that. You have to watch a video A LOT to make it wear out.

I'll allow DS to watch TV as he grows up. Where we live, 6 months out of the year there's little to do outside anyway.


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## UUMom (Nov 14, 2002)

A black/white way of looking at the world scares the pants off me. TV is Evil. Sugar is evil. People who eat powdered donuts at Coffee Hour after services are evil. (Mmmmm, donuts). No playing with the evil schooled children who live next door. No playing with the evil pagan children next door. No letting the evil MIL hold the new baby. No reading the evil No, David! Or Harry Potter. No eating the evil Ranch Pringles with the evil Diet Coke chaser.

I don't want to live that way.







: And I know my family hasn't asked for any restrictions. (Plus, now my dh is happy you all scared the pants off me).


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UUMom* 
And I know my family hasn't asked for any restrictions.

Mine hasn't either!

Quote:

(Plus, now my dh is happy you all scared the pants off me).








Well, by all means go have some fun with it!


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## pumpkinmom2 (Apr 29, 2008)

I think of all the things my son would not know if we were not a tv watching family. The amount of knowledge mostly good that one can learn from tv is amazing.

I know I know well then read to him right? Well we do that too.

My son has been starring in amazement at the tv since 6months old. He now has an amazing vocabulary for a 4 year old and I feel it also helped him socialy. Programs like Little Bear, Clifford, and others really teach great manners and the proper way to treat your frinds.

I think tv is GREAT!


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## cancat (Jun 15, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *fresh_water* 
I'll allow DS to watch TV as he grows up. Where we live, 6 months out of the year there's little to do outside anyway.


It's funny you should say that, because we got 15 feet of snow this year in ottawa...we were too busy shoveling to watch TV!







:


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## Sarahbunny (Jun 13, 2006)

I don't think it is a big deal at all. Sitting in front of the tv all day long every day? Not great. Watching Sesame Street while mommy makes dinner? Fine by me. Watching the FlowerTots so mommy gets 20 minutes of peace and quiet? Great!


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pumpkinmom2* 
I think of all the things my son would not know if we were not a tv watching family. The amount of knowledge mostly good that one can learn from tv is amazing.

I know I know well then read to him right? Well we do that too.

I love to read, and my oldest sure does enjoy being read to -- but my youngest still mostly prefers just looking at books on her own (and telling us about them), and doesn't generally like being read to.

But she loves sitting on Mommy's or Daddy's lap and talking to us about the stuff she sees on TV!.

Quote:

My son has been starring in amazement at the tv since 6months old. He now has an amazing vocabulary for a 4 year old and I feel it also helped him socialy. Programs like Little Bear, Clifford, and others really teach great manners and the proper way to treat your frinds.

I think tv is GREAT!
One cool thing about the way children love to watch the same stuff over and over: It really does build vocabulary. After the umpteenth time watching a movie, I'll hear questions about the meanings of certain words and phrases, things that aren't always noticed in the thrill of watching the first time.

It kinda makes me sad when parents say their kids aren't allowed to watch the same show, or listen to the same book, over and over -- I think this kind of repetition is very important for most children.

Not that TV is the *only* way to learn to talk,







: I'm sure our TV-free counterparts can figure out _some_ way to fill in the deficit! (I hope y'all can figure out that I'm joking!).


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
Cheesecake isn't evil either, but if you make it part of your daily diet, it causes health problems. Same with TV, IMHO.

Actually, as part of a daily diet I think cheesecake could be just fine. There are many different kinds of cheesecake after all, and you could choose to have it in different amounts based on the rest of your diet for that day or how active you'd been lately, etc. You could make it at home from scratch which would allow you to control what the ingredients are, etc. You could even make it vegan!


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UUMom* 
A black/white way of looking at the world scares the pants off me. TV is Evil. Sugar is evil. People who eat powdered donuts at Coffee Hour after services are evil. (Mmmmm, donuts). No playing with the evil schooled children who live next door. No playing with the evil pagan children next door. No letting the evil MIL hold the new baby. No reading the evil No, David! Or Harry Potter. No eating the evil Ranch Pringles with the evil Diet Coke chaser.

I don't want to live that way.







: And I know my family hasn't asked for any restrictions. (Plus, now my dh is happy you all scared the pants off me).

LOL!


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## mammal_mama (Aug 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UnschoolnMa* 
Actually, as part of a daily diet I think cheesecake could be just fine. There are many different kinds of cheesecake after all, and you could choose to have it in different amounts based on the rest of your diet for that day or how active you'd been lately, etc. You could make it at home from scratch which would allow you to control what the ingredients are, etc. You could even make it vegan!

I like this idea!


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## blazer (May 6, 2007)

My prefence is to limit TV to only non commercial type shows. Even PBS lately has gotten to many commercials on their cartoons.


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## dex_millie (Oct 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UnschoolnMa* 
I think commercials are fun, educational, stupid, clever, entertaining, and sometimes even touching. I get that they are trying to sell something though, and I think a mindful parent will share that information with their children.

We love to snark on and discuss commercials.









Growing my siblings and I use to crank up over commercials. They even had a tape of commercials that was funny! Commercials don't influence my buying power, infact growning up we use to roll our eyes too at 'oh please, I don't need that, what I waste of money'. But I believe it has to do w/ your parents too. My parents are not shoppers of material stuff that made me feel I need stuff.

If anything I had a hard time even buying things, so does my siblings, we always think we can use the money for something better (except food, we all like to buy food). DH has to encourage me to buy stuff (cloths which I need).


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## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

I don't think tv is evil. I watched tv as a kid and I watch tv now, and I rather like the adult I've become. I do limit the time that the tv is on though. I'm a SAHM and during the day the tv is on for 1 hour for me to watch People's Court. Maybe once a week or so ds watches a kid program. But when daddy gets home, the tv is pretty much on until bedtime. As for comercials, I usually mute them. But they are also helpful when making mental notes of what not to buy.


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## UUMom (Nov 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dex_millie* 
Growing my siblings and I use to crank up over commercials. They even had a tape of commercials that was funny! Commercials don't influence my buying power, infact growning up we use to roll our eyes too at 'oh please, I don't need that, what I waste of money'. But I believe it has to do w/ your parents too. My parents are not shoppers of material stuff that made me feel I need stuff.

If anything I had a hard time even buying things, so does my siblings, we always think we can use the money for something better (except food, we all like to buy food). DH has to encourage me to buy stuff (cloths which I need).

So true. My kids have laughed: "Oh mom, a Hummer commercial! We neeeeeed that! They are so cool. They pollute the earth and rip up the roads! Let's get one!"


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## LionTigerBear (Jan 13, 2006)

We avoid commercials because . . . .

The commercials aimed at children are often edited to be visually abrasive, I suppose in order to catch a child's attention and seem cool. I think that kind of visual OVER-stimulation, with rapidly changing scenes and loud soundtracks, are probably bad for a young child's brain development. (Don't they just look ADD sometimes? You know the commercials I'm talking about . . . ) I'm guessing that studies that show TV to be bad for children are probably having the test groups watch this kind of TV, with cartoons and crazy commercials. I mean, I think there's a big difference between a young child watching Tom and Jerry, filled with junk food and toy truck commercials, vs. watching Little Bear with no commercials.

Besides which, I personally find those kinds of commercials annoying and distracting. When the boys do occasionally watch something from one of those other channels I pause the program at each commercial break and then fast forward through them. Also, the commercials are usually for some gluten-food-thing that my boys can't eat. I don't need them watching tons of cereal and cracker commercials, that's just cruel to them.

The adult- or family-audience prime-time commercials I tend to find much more interesting, but I still tend to skip them because I hate wasting time. Lol.


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## jaxinsmom (Jul 24, 2006)

like most of the pp, we're not big TV ppl here. We don't have cable, but dh 'watches' ds in the mornings while I sleep in with dd, and that means coming down to the play room and putting on TVO (Ontario equivilant of PBS).

I'm not big on ds watching these shows, but the other day when the gate wouldn't open in the back yard I heard him shout "Ah-bray" (phonetic spelling, 'open' a la Dora). I was pretty shocked, but I also thought it was pretty cute









However, my brother was visiting from teaching English in Taiwan, and taught Jackson how to say red and big in Chinese when he was playing with his trains. So, I think kids can learn from TV, or otherwise -- it's up to us to expose them to as may 'mediums' as we can and foster their development.


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