# if i give formula for feed before sleep?



## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

my son is 12 months old.. and seeing as i am offering solids in the way... wouldn't it be better if i offer him formula milk at night to keep him full for the rest of the night(after i breastfeed him.. sort of like a top up)... cuz apparently formula fills their stomach more??

i'd really like better sleep.. we currently co-sleep and breastfeed but am up numerous times for a quick feed(although i just roll over and put the boob in his mouth.. i cant sleep in the position that he feeds in)

anyone try this? worked or failed?


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## woodchick (Jan 5, 2007)

I wouldn't do it. Any formula could decrease your supply. You could try a filling bedtime snack, maybe oatmeal?


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Better? Absolutely not. Breastmilk is always better than formula. Have you read the ingredients in formula?

-Angela


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

yeah but my son doesnt eat very well so at night i cant give him anything to fill him up. im talking about after his last feed at the breast... to top up.
I mean he is getting some solid food in the day.. how is that different from formula? should i then offer cows milk??

I have no idea whats in formula??


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

If you have no idea what's in formula, why would you give it to your son?


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
yeah but my son doesnt eat very well so at night i cant give him anything to fill him up. im talking about after his last feed at the breast... to top up.
I mean he is getting some solid food in the day.. how is that different from formula? should i then offer cows milk??

I have no idea whats in formula??

Here's a run down of one formula's ingredients. Can you even identify what half of them are? 'Cause I can't.

Quote:

(From Enfamil Website)
Ingredients: Powder: Nonfat milk, lactose, vegetable oil (palm olein, soy, coconut, and high oleic sunflower oils), whey protein concentrate, and less than 1%: Mortierella alpina oil*, Crypthecodinium cohnii oil†, vitamin A palmitate, vitamin D3, vitamin E acetate, vitamin K1, thiamin hydrochloride, riboflavin, vitamin B6 hydrochloride, vitamin B12, niacinamide, folic acid, calcium pantothenate, biotin, ascorbic acid, choline chloride, inositol, calcium carbonate, magnesium oxide, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, manganese sulfate, cupric sulfate, potassium chloride, potassium citrate, potassium hydroxide, sodium selenite, taurine, L-carnitine, nucleotides (adenosine 5'-monophosphate, cytidine 5'-monophosphate, disodium guanosine 5'-monophosphate, disodium uridine 5'-monophosphate).
Formula is for when breastmilk is not available. Your breastmilk is available.

Why on earth would you offer a substandard substitute?

-Angela


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Here's a good article from kellymom.com that cites studies that have shown giving formula/solids at night do not help babies sleep better at night.

http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/so...ids-sleep.html


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
should i then offer cows milk??

Is he a cow?









Of course not. Breastmilk is STILL perfect for him.

-Angela


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

so why do some mothers give formula then if it was so horrible? i am still breastfeeding at 12 months. i do NOT intend on stopping but i obviously think my child is still hungry when he sucks me dry and constantly wakes up at night. instead of judging me how about you try and come up with helpful solutions or atleast tell me What is wrong with it??? i didnt ask you to judge.. i came here to get information and be more informed. if i knew what was in formula and didnt mind it would i be posting here in the first place? no.. i'd be giving it to him.
I came for knowledge about what is best for a child of his age.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

umm.. then why do people give children solids and food? i thought formula would be concerned part of food.. thats why i asked. i thought it was different once their bodies were dealing with food and it wasnt exclusive breastfeeding?


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## lemurmommies (Jan 15, 2007)

As a formula-feeder (after an unsuccessful attempt to BFAR) I'd like to tell you that giving your son formula will not necessarily help him sleep more. My son is 14 months old and gets formula day and night. He has never, ever slept through the night.

So if the only reason you are going to give formula is in the hopes that he will sleep more, I definitely wouldn't do it. As previous posters have mentioned, it could affect your supply. If you have breastmilk, breastfeed.


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## lemurmommies (Jan 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
umm.. then why do people give children solids and food? i thought formula would be concerned part of food.. thats why i asked. i thought it was different once their bodies were dealing with food and it wasnt exclusive breastfeeding?

Formula isn't part of food, it is a breastmilk substitute. Since you have breastmilk available, you don't have any need for it that I can see.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
so why do some mothers give formula then if it was so horrible?

Answering in parts- feeling scattered today...









Why? Because formula makers are BRILLIANT salespeople. They've convinced people to feed something that is PROVEN to be significantly sub-standard to their babies. Sure- it has it's place. It is the best currently available replacement when breastmilk is not available for whatever reason.

BUT it is significantly substandard. It is a chemical concoction. Why would you feed your child a chemical concoction when the perfect food is available?

-Angela


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

At a year it is very normal for him to be waking to nurse. Even at 2yrs a lot still wake a lot to nurse. You might try working with him on not nursing as much say when he wakes to nurse instead do a back rub or even a sippy cup of water. But in all honesty I wouldnt be comfy night weaning at a year at all. Not even cutting back since young ones do most of their growing at night and bm at night is a bit different and helps with that.

I am sorry you are sleep deprived. I have BTDT and it sucks. But this time in the long run is only a short time. I know not much help when you are right in the middle of it but it will pass.

There is no way I would give a baby formula to try and get them to sleep longer it is just to hard on their gut.


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## saimeiyu (Aug 13, 2007)

I understand that you want to get better sleep, but...
No, formula will not do that.
More likely, formula will make him sick to his stomach and miserable. and have you SMELLED formula poop? ugh! it's HORRID. and his breath would be horrid.
and he probably would throw a fit about it because it TASTES horrid.
Don't waste your money.
Formula doesn't fill their stomach more. It fills it the same amount. It's just that formula sits like a lead lump in their poor little tummy instead of being digested. don't torture yourself or him. Just don't do it.
Most moms that give formula do it because they can't breastfeed, don't know any better, they don't care, or someone lied to them and they can't be bothered to read for themselves.

Good on ya for checking!
As far as the sucking dry thing...well, it may just be that he wants to suck.
and babies are SUPPOSED to wake up at night. keeps them breathin'. 12 months old is not usually old enough to sleep through the night.

How many times during the night are you feeding him?


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

Formula is not actually more filling, it seems to keep them full longer because is more difficult for your baby to digest.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

so why is it if i even ASK about formula i get judged on ? i mean i have made it exclusively breastfeeding through tough situations and going strong here at 12 months(which is more than quite a few people).. i am WORRIED that my child is still hungry since he has decreased eating solid food(he purses lips and shakes no for food).. so im not looking at formula as a substitute for breastmilk.. im looking at it as a substitute for food?? because he will not eat food and i thought it may be more filling. i dont want my child to be hungry and me be so stubborn about breastfeeding that im not doing right for my child, ya know?? being concerned for him doesnt make me less of a mother


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
i do NOT intend on stopping but i obviously think my child is still hungry when he sucks me dry and constantly wakes up at night. instead of judging me how about you try and come up with helpful solutions or atleast tell me What is wrong with it??? i didnt ask you to judge.. i came here to get information and be more informed. if i knew what was in formula and didnt mind it would i be posting here in the first place? no.. i'd be giving it to him.
I came for knowledge about what is best for a child of his age.

If you think your supply is lacking- look to increase your supply







There are LOTS of good ways to do that. Try increasing your water or adding oatmeal. Try researching herbs (fenugreek is great for increasing milk) Encourage frequent nursing to add more stimulation for your supply.

Breastmilk is best. As long as there is breastmilk available and there is no other extenuating circumstances (severe allergies or metabolic conditions) -breastmilk is ALWAYS better than formula. Period.

Formula is great as a MEDICINE. As a medical supply it is wondrous- truly.

When it is not needed for MEDICAL reasons- it is simply a money maker.

-Angela


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
so im not looking at formula as a substitute for breastmilk.. im looking at it as a substitute for food?? because he will not eat food and i thought it may be more filling. i dont want my child to be hungry and me be so stubborn about breastfeeding that im not doing right for my child, ya know?? being concerned for him doesnt make me less of a mother

Formula is NOT a substitute for food. It's a substitute for breastmilk.

Many (MANY) babies aren't really eating ANY solids at 12 months. At that age my dd had not yet EVER eaten more than about a tablespoon TOTAL in a whole day.

Breastmilk meets their nutritional needs. If they need more breastmilk- then there are ways to increase supply, as mentioned, that should be attempted before resorting to formula.

-Angela


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## GooeyRN (Apr 24, 2006)

I switched my dd to toddler formula at 18 months old, b/c my milk dried up due to pregnancy. She did not sleep any better. She now gets WCM and EBM at 27 months old, and still does not sleep any better. Thats been my experience. I hope you get some much needed sleep somehow!


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

No one has said that I dont think natalie. If he is still hungry after nursing he could be going through a growth spurt.

When you give him food do you offer to nurse first or offer food first? If you are giving him food first then your supply could be dropping a bit. Every nursing session missed=less milk your body thinks it needs to make. So if he is stilly truly hungry and not just wanting to suck then I would advice cutting out solids for a while and only bfed so that your supply goes back up.

At a year they can still do very well without any solid food at all and only live on bm.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

im not all clued up on formula as i havent given him any before.. thus i haven't smelled it.. nor do i know whats in it thats why i posted here.
i know breast is best thats why i dont want to stop.. i love the bonding.. i love the health benefits... i love everything about it.
but i looked at formula as a substitute for solids... after reading this thread i know that it is not... but got judged wrong because of that.

lol im fine with the night wakings.. once or twice i can deal with.. but 5 times recently? its like his sleep just gets worse and worse... since we co-sleep i roll over and feed him but the position we are in i cant just sleep like that(and i dnt want to sleep while feeding because i dont wanna smother him by mistake!) so i stay awake while he feeds.. and sometimes he just sucks for comfort...) i need to function as well and i have been dealing with a terrible sleeper for 12 months Plus most of my pregnancy i couldnt sleep a wink... body weight was just too much so im dealing with like a year and a half of sleep deprived nights.
I also thought that since hes taking in less solids his sleep got worse and that could be due to more hunger... thats all..
for those that did reply with nonjudgmental and helpful answers... i thank you


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## saimeiyu (Aug 13, 2007)

I'm totally not intent on judgin' ya, hon. I know someone probably told you that if you give your son formula he'll "sleep better" cause it makes him "fuller".
They lied to you. Maybe not intentionally, but it is a lie nonetheless.

Have you tried pumping and having your partner give him the bottle? Does he even drink out of bottles?
It's really not a big problem to not eat solids when they're 12 months old. A lot of people might tell you that, but a lot of the same people will try and convince you that 6 months of BF is "enough". We both know that's not true.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
lol im fine with the night wakings.. once or twice i can deal with.. but 5 times recently? its like his sleep just gets worse and worse... since we co-sleep i roll over and feed him but the position we are in i cant just sleep like that(and i dnt want to sleep while feeding because i dont wanna smother him by mistake!) so i stay awake while he feeds.. and sometimes he just sucks for comfort...) i need to function as well and i have been dealing with a terrible sleeper for 12 months Plus most of my pregnancy i couldnt sleep a wink... body weight was just too much so im dealing with like a year and a half of sleep deprived nights.
I also thought that since hes taking in less solids his sleep got worse and that could be due to more hunger... thats all..
for those that did reply with nonjudgmental and helpful answers... i thank you









This is what I would work on. At 12 months old, you're not going to smother him









Find a way to get comfortable enough to sleep while he nurses. Try propping yourself up with pillows- that often helps.

I found when I could sleep through the nursings I was much less resentful of them.

-Angela


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

It sounds like he is definatly going through a growth spurt. The good sleeping and now he is waking more to nurse. Once your supply catches up things should settle down for you.

Like Angela said at a year old if you get him in a spot were his breathing is compromised he will move, I know because I have woke a many of a time to one of mine snuffling and moving around so they could breath, they were not totally smothered but they we pretty tight agains my boob









Again







I know what it is like to be sleep deprived. My dd woke every hour or less till she was 2yo to nurse. I wasnt sure I would even have more kids after that but I did and it went better thank goodness









If you can at all try to nap during the day or go to bed earlier and let your dp take care of him for a little while even a good solid hour of sleep can make all the difference.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

i read in a book that breastmilk makes up most of their nutrition up until one year.. so i assumed after a year solids would be doing that?

i dont think that he lacks breastmilk in the day because i am a full time mom.. i breastfeed on demand.. basically he breastfeeds on no schedule... sometimes 30 minutes after a feed.. sometimes 10 minutes later.. sometimes 2-3 hours.. thats why i dont think my milk supply isn't enough to sustain him in the day... i just think that my milk isn't 'filling' enough which is why he needs to constantly drink so often even into the night.

im also confused cuz at one of my playgroups one of the moms said she cut back on breastfeeding(her child used to be very clingy.. he has gotten more independant so i asked her why and thats the answer she gave).. so i said oh ok so what are you giving instead? formula?cows milk? so she said no... im giving him food and he feeds around 3 times a day...
my son is the opposite.. he feeds all throughout the day and night and hardly eats anything... theres a few other moms like that as well...
but i know that they may not follow the AP beliefs that i have that MDC follows.. which is why i came here


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

and one other thing which has really been working on me inside...
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once.. i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

these other kids are happy and exploring the world and they sleep through...


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
If you have no idea what's in formula, why would you give it to your son?









:


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

also.. now that i am thinking about it clearly.. maybe he isnt very hungry at night.. i think that he doesnt know HOW to sleep without breastfeeding so everytime he wakes up.. the only way he knows how to go back to sleep is to breastfeed.. i dont know how to change this.. any suggestions? ive tried pantley's PPO(pulling out before fully asleep) but he gets really worked up and mad... SOMETIMES it works sometimes it doesnt. how do i help him fall asleep on his own with me next to him.. patting him... i think if he could fall asleep without breastfeeding he wouldnt wake up much....
also, i dont think i'll be giving formula. i had no idea that formula itself smelled badly or tasted yukky.. but that has me wondering... i plan to wean at 2 year(religious reasons)... what would i give him then??


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
and one other thing which has really been working on me inside...
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once.. i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

these other kids are happy and exploring the world and they sleep through...


Some babies wake up a lot. I am nearly 28 years old and I still wake up a lot. My husband sleeps through the night. It is sometimes personality. My friend has a high-needs baby. He is 11 months old and frequently wakes. It is really frustrating for her, but her son is just amazing.

It's not a competition. It's not really about "knowing how to make the baby sleep through the night." Some babies just DONT and it's NOT your fault.

The one suggestion I've seen work for others is chiropractic. Sometimes, babies' spines are out of alignment and this causes them pain and makes them wake frequently. It's a shot in the dark, but it has helped some of my friends' babies sleep through the night (which is defined as 5 hours in a row btw)


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
i plan to wean at 2 year(religious reasons)... what would i give him then??

Cuddles and comfort? Some of my friends who have weaned did so by allowing baby to fall asleep next to daddy for a while. This helped somehow.

I'm curious as to which religion mandates 2-year weaning? If it's a very old religion, that does not make much sense to me, as babies, say, 2,000 years ago wouldn't have had much choice at night -- breastmilk or nothing.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

i guess in the environment im in i feel that a good mom is someone who can help her baby through life and teach her/him good habits like sleeping through(sleep is good for them) and i feel like everyone else has been able to and im the only one that doesnt seem to know how? it makes me feel like im doing something wrong..
lol it would be a lot easier if everyones babies woke up a lot... then it would be the norm!!


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

no i dont mean for night time.. i mean what would i give in the day to replace breastmilk?
i personally feel two years is right for us to wean... the religion islam i think says 2 years. i dont think it would be appropriate to discuss this further.. the choice of weaning at that time isn't a consideration it is what is best for me and my family









i am happy to have so far made it this far in my breastfeeding journey and am loving every moment of it (ok... so i dont love the waking up but i do love the night cuddling)


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

oh and you know how sometimes on the internet its really hard to understand what people are saying and their tone so i hope i havent come across harshly at all!!
milktrance, thank you so much for your opinions and help







i really do appreciate you taking the time out to give me such detailed answers in ways to actually help me, not judge my question


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## lovesdaffodils (Jul 11, 2007)

Is he cutting teeth or learning to walk? Those are common reasons for a one-year-old to wake more at night.

Also, it may seem that your friends' babies are sleeping through the night, but if they CIO and sleep in different rooms, the baby is probably waking but the parent never sees them and goes to them. Even adults wake up a few times a night! So you certainly haven't done anything wrong to make him wake during the night.


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## FancyD (Apr 22, 2005)

Formula fills them up longer because it's more difficult to digest. It gets soooooooo much easier in _such_ a short time. Really.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

he has taken steps for the past few weeks but chooses not to walk.. he's scared of falling and so he's being very slow about it and prefers to crawl. he cut a tooth a few days ago .. its halfway out... halfway still for it to come out full.
his night waking of 3-4 times has been since birth.. for last two weeks its 5-6 times.. and last two nights like 8 lol

i guess what i really came here for was someone to tell me its normal and been there done that and that it eventually does get better without me(the mom) having to make any type of drastic changes


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## gwerydd (Jun 7, 2007)

i'm sorry that people haven't been that supportive of your situation. it's hard sometimes for people to step outside their own situations. my dd had formula from 5 weeks to 7 months due to some medical issues that i had. she slept through the night from about 3 months to 6 months but then starting night waking again. during that time i would nurse her at bedtime and then my dh would give her a bottle. i don't think the formula helped her sleep longer stretches. i think that what youa re suggesting won't necessarily decrease your supply but i also don't think that it will necessarily work to help him sleep longer stretches either. i wish i could give you more concrete advice but each situation is different.


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## ShannonT (Dec 6, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
and one other thing which has really been working on me inside...
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once.. i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

these other kids are happy and exploring the world and they sleep through...

I'm gonna bet some of your friends are lying about STTN.









A good mother responds to her child's needs -- a one-year old doesn't need a day planner with everything scheduled in.

I don't believe all the hype about STTN. See this link from kellymom on sleep studies.

Brief highlight: % of 12 mo olds waking at night: 55%.


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## annekevdbroek (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
he has taken steps for the past few weeks but chooses not to walk.. he's scared of falling and so he's being very slow about it and prefers to crawl. he cut a tooth a few days ago .. its halfway out... halfway still for it to come out full.
his night waking of 3-4 times has been since birth.. for last two weeks its 5-6 times.. and last two nights like 8 lol

i guess what i really came here for was someone to tell me its normal and been there done that and that it eventually does get better without me(the mom) having to make any type of drastic changes


Its completely normal. My oldest son (now age 4 1/2) didn't sleep through the night until he was 18 months old. My youngest - now 12 months still does not sleep through the night. He is now waking 2-3 times per night. However, for most of December and jan he was waking 5+ times and was consistently awake from 1-4am every single night. Both kids are/were breastfed. We did not cosleep. I found it impossible to get a comfortable nursing position in bed.

I never found solids or milk to make any difference in how much they sleep. Some babies sleep through the night at a young age, some don't. It looks like youi've read the No Cry Sleep Solution - maybe there are a few other things to try to help improve your son's sleep. I also know with my older son that he *could not* fall asleep without nursing. The youngest is slighly less attached to nursing (and takes a paci) and is a bit better at getting himself back to sleep.

I hope you get some rest - exhaustion is hard on a Mama.


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## bri276 (Mar 24, 2005)

Quote:

i guess what i really came here for was someone to tell me its normal and been there done that and that it eventually does get better without me(the mom) having to make any type of drastic changes
Ok. It's normal, I've btdt (actually DD _still_ wakes up at 30 months even though she's not bf anymore), however it has gotten better, and you don't need to make any drastic changes unless either you or your son are very unhappy or unhealthy with the way things are.

we don't know what "normal" is in America for a 12 month old anymore because of all the abnormal things we force on them (CIO, formula, etc). I don't know many people who raise their family in a natural lifestyle whose 12 month old STTN on a regular basis.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

As the mother to a 14.5 month old her sleep has sucked lately - but it's getting better.

Is your son getting ready to walk, or talk? Getting close to and achieving big milestones can really hurt their sleep.

At 7 months my DD was waking once or twice. At 8 months it went to hell. She started waking 5 to 10 times a night. At 8.5 months she started walking... By 9 months she was sleeping a bit better (waking 3 to 4 times each night)

Now starting at 13 months she started waking alot again. And over the last 2 weeks her vocabulary has started to explode. She's also getting more teeth again.

Formula won't make your baby start STTN.

The other babies do that because getting formula early on - that's how they developed their sleep patterns. Also - I would bet that their parents don't practice AP.


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## lachingona1 (May 16, 2007)

No advice here....Just a







.

My 6 mo old wakes about 8 times a night and will only nurse to sleep. I know what you mean about not being able to sleep while in a nursing position, it is pretty uncomfortable.


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## riversong (Aug 11, 2005)

Natalie- The fact that you're questioning the mainstream norms for raising children shows that you really do have your baby's best interest at heart. You don't sound like a bad mom. I've wondered about many of the same things you have.

My ds is now 14 months and is only waking a couple of times during the night. I know this is probably temporary and the waking could increase or decrease (one can hope







). Your ds is probably comfort nursing during the night. I doubt he's really very hungry if you bf on demand and also offer solids. If you want to try to get him used to going to sleep without nursing, you can try rocking him to sleep or walking around the room until he falls asleep on your shoulder. This is what we did with ds to get him down for naps and bedtime. During the night I just nurse him back to sleep, though. I can't deal with getting up and he only wants the boob when he's really sleepy.

Some suggestions from the No Cry Sleep Solution that worked for me were:
moving as far away from your baby in the bed after he nurses,
keeping nursing sessions short during the night,
and not nursing immediately with every sound he makes in his sleep.

I've btdt with my dd and she now sleeps through the night in bed with her dad. I night-weaned at 23 mo. and day-weaned at 26 mo. We never used CIO or formula. It will get easier!

HTH!


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## Maggirayne (Mar 6, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once..

WHAT??? ALL of them? My first question is do they CIO? I've read several stories where parents who CIO-ed didn't awake to their LOs crying anymore. So, I'd hardly believe that all of the 12 mos are STTN!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

Is he happy? growing? You sound like a great mom! Being a great mom DOES not mean "having it all tog." I think it's a trait of moms to think we are lacking in some area. I bet if you posted a thread asking if anyone had it all tog. you'd get a lot of laughs. You do what's best for you and your LO. I think schedules are good, but I'm not on one and neither is DD! Her naps keep changing. Babies go thru so many changes and milestones upset sleep patterns.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
i think that he doesnt know HOW to sleep without breastfeeding so everytime he wakes up.. the only way he knows how to go back to sleep is to breastfeed.. i dont know how to change this.. any suggestions?

Possible he doesn't. My DD fell back asleep two nights with patting, and then had to nurse *a lot* last night, so. . .







Maybe let your DP snuggle/comfort if you're tired out.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lovesdaffodils* 
Is he cutting teeth or learning to walk? Those are common reasons for a one-year-old to wake more at night.

Also, it may seem that your friends' babies are sleeping through the night, but if they CIO and sleep in different rooms, the baby is probably waking but the parent never sees them and goes to them. Even adults wake up a few times a night! So you certainly haven't done anything wrong to make him wake during the night.

















that:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
he has taken steps for the past few weeks but *chooses not to walk.. he's scared of falling and so he's being very slow about it and prefers to crawl*. he cut a tooth a few days ago .. its halfway out... halfway still for it to come out full.
i guess what i really came here for was someone to tell me its normal and been there done that and that it eventually does get better without me(the mom) having to make any type of drastic changes

Yep, sounds pretty normal, haven't BTDT, but keep it up, you're doing good.


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## Shenjall (Sep 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
he has taken steps for the past few weeks but chooses not to walk.. he's scared of falling and so he's being very slow about it and prefers to crawl. he cut a tooth a few days ago .. its halfway out... halfway still for it to come out full.
his night waking of 3-4 times has been since birth.. for last two weeks its 5-6 times.. and last two nights like 8 lol

i guess what i really came here for was someone to tell me its normal and been there done that and that it eventually does get better without me(the mom) having to make any type of drastic changes

Its normal and btdt. It will get better. My youngest dd is 5. She wasnt eating very many solids at all at one year and from time to time, she was waking up alot during the night. Some nights moreso than others. My sil, who ff her baby from birth, and is an AP mama, had a baby who was up all the time at that age as well. Its very, very normal. Hang in there.









p.s. I was often told about how clingy my dd was and how she was going to be that way forever b/c I "refused" to wean her!! Yeah, well guess who will talk to anyone and everyone now? Guess who's miss independent? Thats right, dd. Little social butterfly that one.







(she does not get that from me, thats for sure! lol)

Its all going to be okay.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
i read in a book that breastmilk makes up most of their nutrition up until one year.. so i assumed after a year solids would be doing that?

Actually, right at a year the recommendation I've seen (average of course) is that breastmilk should make up around 75% of their nutrition.

Many breastfed babies it stays around that level until 18 months or longer- perfectly normal.

-Angela


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## jmmom (Sep 11, 2007)

I just wanted to say that I'm currently feeling it with an 11th month old waking, for the first time in his life, every 2 hrs+ at night - and I think you and I should really listen to the posts that have talked about how much this can be related to getting ready to walk and talk. I talked to another mom at the park the other day who had just gone through the same thing.

Try to get comfortable falling asleep while he nurses! And takes naps with him - I do - it helps A LOT.

I'm going to start drinking a nursing tea in case it's a supply thing for me, b/c he does seem to be in a growth spurt.

Oh, and my son eats a TON of solid food, and still nurses a LOT more than he ever has - they need it, especially the nurses.

My ds would NEVER fall asleep without nursing - and that's ok! Some kids will, some won't. He's pretty intense and high needs - just like me, LOL, and sleeps about as well, too!

I liked the recommendation to sleep away from him after he nurses. I've tried that. I've also tried the opposite - making sure my breast is right there for quick comfort sucks. I'm still trying to figure out which works better.

Also, I'd make sure to nurse not just on demand, but very often - maybe 1x per hour, at least - during the day, to help get supply up, give plenty of cozy time, and maybe decrease the night wakings slightly if he is in fact doing it because he's hungry.

Relax, it's totally normal, if you're not into CIO...

Anyway, ds needs to get to the park...


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## channelofpeace (Jul 14, 2005)

Just when things seem really bleak, you turn the corner and it is over









My ds (who is almost 18 months) _just now_ is starting to be more interested in solids. I would offer them at mealtimes, but he would mostly just play with them. But he nursed plenty. Often a lot at night. He knew what he needed. My personal theory about my ds was that he might have had some slight food allergies and just wasn't interested in solids until his little body was ready for them. Sounds like your baby just knows what he needs. Which is breastmilk







You have the perfect food.

Good luck, Mama!


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## treehuggermama (Jan 3, 2007)

I just wanted to jump in after reading this post as both of my children have had frequent night wakenings since birth...I did a lot of reading from every sleep "expert" known to man and one of the main things they all agreed on was that trying to stuff babes/toddlers with food before bed actually could worsen the problem. The reason being is that then their digestive systems were forced to work overtime and were stimulated at a time when they should be trying to settle down and sleep. One of the authors likened it to you or I eating a huge turkey dinner with all the fixings and then trying to bam lie down and go to sleep. Most people would be stuffed and uncomfortable and unable to just go to sleep for the night.

Anyways, I just found that info interesting.

good luck!


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## moonfirefaery (Jul 21, 2006)

Other milks do not fill the baby's stomach more but take longer to digest. Breastmilk is healthier than cow milk, but if your son is a year old, he is ready for it according to most experts. Formula has more nutrients than cow milk, but it also has a lot of questionable ingredients. Your baby doesn't need as many calories and nutrients at night especially if he is nursing and eating solids during the day. If you do offer a bottle at bedtime, I think cow milk would be better to give than formula. I don't think that will help a whole lot, but I don't see any harm in trying a few days. It may or may not help, just like the ol' rice cereal in the bottle thing. It works for some babies, on some nights, and other times it doesn't.

My first son was an awful sleeper. I know how difficult it is to have to wake up for feedings well after you've lost the ability to sleep in the position they prefer to nurse in. I was more sleep-deprived around the one year mark than at the newborn period. I thought perhaps I wasn't filling him up or something was wrong with him, but I finally learned it's totally normal for some babies not to sleep through the night and to wake up to nurse. Don't let others get you down.

Ultimately, what I had to do was spend a longer time in bed. I went to bed earlier and got up later to make up for the lost sleep. I think that is your best bet.

This will pass. It will get better. I'm sorry that some of the responses given here have been impolite, inconsiderate, and unhelpful and have made you feel judged. You can PM me if you need to talk. I've been down the same road.


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## AlexisT (May 6, 2007)

Actually, I think formula would be better--it's more nutritionally complete. But I wouldn't give either. What I would do is try to make sure he nurses a lot during the day, and gets plenty to eat. Not right before bed (can't sleep on an over-full stomach) but he should get plenty of food and milk in the evening, and one last nursing before bed. I also recommend trying some of the No-Cry Sleep Solution tips--check to see if it's really milk he wants or something else (so try a cuddle and a pat first) and keep nursing sessions short and quiet. If he only wants to suck, you might want to try a paci if he'll take it.

I actually agree that night waking (while not necessarily universal) is more common than a lot of parents think. Many babies awaken briefly--even cry--and go back to sleep. If your baby is not right next to you, you only notice the nightwakings that result in prolonged crying. Thanks to sleeplessness, I've been able to hear DD's sleep patterns pretty well and can confirm that she often has these brief wakings where she settles herself. Some co-sleeping mothers develop an almost reflexive action with nursing--all night wakings become night nursings, and it becomes a cycle. So I would always try other methods of soothing first. Of course, if he's hungry, he's hungry--feed him! But not all wakings mean nursing.


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## mom2snugbugs (Nov 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlexisT* 
Actually, I think formula would be better--it's more nutritionally complete. .

You're kidding, right?


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom2snugbugs* 
You're kidding, right?

I think she meant it would be better than cow's milk. And if supplementation was needed, I agree. However I hear nothing in this situation that tells me it is needed.

-Angela


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## crazyrunningmama (Dec 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
and one other thing which has really been working on me inside...
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once.. i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

these other kids are happy and exploring the world and they sleep through...









to you.
Regarding all the other babies sleeping through the night.. they are NOT. I don't think the other moms are really trying to lie to you, (but some might be), but if you don't cosleep, you don't hear all the wake ups. At that age, they might wake up and cry loudly or they might wake up and be quiet or just make a bit of noise and eventually go back to sleep on their own, so the moms don't even know about it. When you cosleep, you notice every wake up, and your dc notices the boob there and like that!

I know you said he doesn't want to eat much, but if you can get him to eat in the evening, make it something whole grain and/or with protein, which helps them stay asleep.


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## BeeandOwlsMum (Jul 11, 2002)

I read about half the thread, but I just wanted to chime in with some stuff.

It sounds like you are having a rough time right now. My daughter had a *huge* growth spurt at 12 months, and another one around 18 months, and woke CONSTANTLY at night to nurse. they both lasted for a couple of months and tapered out. Then her second year molars started coming in. She wakes about 4 times a night right now. During the growth spurts she was waking every 45 minutes.

I would not give formula as a supplement. Part of the reason they nurse so dang much when they grow is to increase your supply. So, they are *supposed* to be doing it.









My dd didn't eat a whole lot at one year.







She nibbled. Only recently has she begun to eat what other people would consider normal portions. And she is coming up on two years old.

This too shall pass is a good mantra.









The biggest thing I can tell you - *ignore what your friend's babies are doing!* Completely. Your baby may not do the same thing as other kids at the same time, ever. And trying to compare what some kids do to yours is only going to stress you out. Your friend's babies are sleeping through the night -good for them. Remember that may not be what you think it is....they may be exaggerating because they think the kid is *supposed* to sleep through the night. Or sleeping through the night may look very different to them. And lastly, they may have used some unpleasant tactics to get them to sleep like that. It sounds like your child is doing just fine.
 






If he is gaining, and nursing and pooping and peeing - then congratulations!! YOu have a healthy kid, who is doing just fine.









I hope you find some comfort and your kiddo gets to longer stretches of sleeping.


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## Starleigh (Jul 27, 2003)

I think a two prong approach towards nightweaning would really help you.

First make sure he is full at bed time. Offer a meal after dinner, in the last hour before bedtime. Something yummy and filling, and takes a little time for the body to work on. A whole grain cooked cereal is great, like oatmeal. Some steel cut oats with a little fruit or juice to sweeten it, and maybe an egg yolk added for extra protein (Just stir it in as you take it off the heat, coming from a boil, the oatmeal will adequately heat it). Make this in an enthusiastic feeding. When he's done though, he's done. Don't force him to eat more than he wants. Offer the breast afterwards to settle him, and then brush teeth, read stories, and tuck in for the night.

When he wakes up in the middle of the night, try to sooth him without nursing. This may cause a little fussing, but do your best to comfort him. If he's not really hungry, he'll settle quick enough. If he really needs to nurse, you'll know. If he wakes again in a couple hours, go ahead and nurse him. Really follow your instinct here, and try to fall out of the roll over and plug in habit. Maybe start with eliminating the first feeding.. when he starts to sleep through to a later hour, then you can start working on that feeding. I'd be cautious about expecting too much out of him, though. At just a year he still may not be ready to get the bulk of his nutrition from solids, so these night feedings can have real merit. I would not expect him to sleep more than 6 hours straight, really. I think if you make it to one night feeding you'll be doing great!


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## miche28 (Sep 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
I think she meant it would be better than cow's milk.

-Angela

If we're talking about 1 bottle a day, I would say that she can use either, really. The extra iron in the formula is its primary benefit over cow's milk and one bottle isn't likely to tip the balance on that. And, come to think of it, that extra iron could mess with the absorption of BM iron and cause constipation - so actually, I'd go cow's milk.

But, as PP have more eloquently stated, sounds like some strategies around partial night-weaning and adjusting expectations are going to be healthier for everyone.


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## kittywitty (Jul 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
and one other thing which has really been working on me inside...
alot of my friends have babies the same age as my son.. and ALL of their babies are sleeping through the night.. if not then only waking up once.. i do SO much for my son he is everything to me.. i spend loads of time with him but i feel somewhat like a failure in the way of being a good mother. i mean a good mother has it all together? she knows how to help her baby sleep through the night(without crying)... has her baby on a flexible schedule so he knows what to expect each day... he knows his bed time etc etc... i feel like im not doing a good job at the MOST important job in the whole world... raising my child

these other kids are happy and exploring the world and they sleep through...

That is really not very common. What they are fed has had no bearing on sleeping through the night IME.


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## channelofpeace (Jul 14, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AdinaL* 

The biggest thing I can tell you - *ignore what your friend's babies are doing!* Completely. Your baby may not do the same thing as other kids at the same time, ever. And trying to compare what some kids do to yours is only going to stress you out. Your friend's babies are sleeping through the night -good for them. Remember that may not be what you think it is....they may be exaggerating because they think the kid is *supposed* to sleep through the night. Or sleeping through the night may look very different to them. And lastly, they may have used some unpleasant tactics to get them to sleep like that. It sounds like your child is doing just fine.







If he is gaining, and nursing and pooping and peeing - then congratulations!! YOu have a healthy kid, who is doing just fine.









This is worth repeating









My three babies have been vastly different in their nighttime needs. It is pointless and exhausting to try to compare. Each Mama/ child couple is different and all you can do is best parent your little guy the way *he* needs to be parented


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## beru (Nov 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Natalie143* 
so why do some mothers give formula then if it was so horrible? i am still breastfeeding at 12 months. i do NOT intend on stopping but i obviously think my child is still hungry when he sucks me dry and constantly wakes up at night. instead of judging me how about you try and come up with helpful solutions or atleast tell me What is wrong with it??? i didnt ask you to judge.. i came here to get information and be more informed. if i knew what was in formula and didnt mind it would i be posting here in the first place? no.. i'd be giving it to him.
I came for knowledge about what is best for a child of his age.

I don't think it would hurt your child to try it, anymore than chocolate milk. That's my analogy: you wouldn't expect your baby to get most of his/her nutrition from chocolate milk but one glass is not going to compromise his nutritional status (unless she's allergic). You could try an organic formula. My son got about 3 bottles a week on top of breastfeeding starting at 4 months and I preferred formula sweeteed with lactose because that is the sugar in breastmilk and the alternative is corn syrup...

I think a better reason not to do this is the studies a PP cited. The research says it doesn't work. That being said, studies tell you what the average baby does and maybe your baby would be different. I know my son started sleeping without waking to nurse at the same time that he suddenly decided he loved solid food. He was tanking up during the day and prior to that, he was a bit of a reverse cycler. My opinion is the formula-before-bed thing probably doesn't work for babies who are already getting "full" during the day, but it may work for an individual baby that is not.

You could try it for a week. And I don't think one bottle a day at 12 months will affect your supply in a dangerous way.

But here is a link on how to bottlefeed a breastfed infant:
http://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/bottle-feeding.html


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## beru (Nov 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlexisT* 
I actually agree that night waking (while not necessarily universal) is more common than a lot of parents think. Many babies awaken briefly--even cry--and go back to sleep. If your baby is not right next to you, you only notice the nightwakings that result in prolonged crying. Thanks to sleeplessness, I've been able to hear DD's sleep patterns pretty well and can confirm that she often has these brief wakings where she settles herself.









:
I used to say that my son started STTN at 8 months and he did it on his own (no sleep training). But I realize 1. he didn't really STTN and 2. I did "manage" his sleep in subtle ways. My son still wakes up at least once a night and he's 3. But he comforts or entertains himself. I am noticing this now because I am up with my infant and I get to witness it. Also, I realise now that my actions caused him to nightwean. I would offer other types of comfort before nursing and he accepted that easily because he is an easy going kid, plus he just naturally loves sleep (In the afternoons, he often will say, "I need a nap" and go to his bed on his own).


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## AlexisT (May 6, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom2snugbugs* 
You're kidding, right?

Yes, I only meant formula is superior to cows' milk--and then said I wouldn't give either one in this case


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## Shenjall (Sep 14, 2002)

I just wanted to add that rocking, patting, cuddling, etc my dd at one year would not work. It was only breast for her! (I just wanted to pass that info on just in case you have the same issue.)


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## a(TM)?Star (Oct 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MilkTrance* 
Cuddles and comfort? Some of my friends who have weaned did so by allowing baby to fall asleep next to daddy for a while. This helped somehow.

I'm curious as to which religion mandates 2-year weaning? If it's a very old religion, that does not make much sense to me, as babies, say, 2,000 years ago wouldn't have had much choice at night -- breastmilk or nothing.

What religion warrants weaning at 2? I'm just curious?

I think that your babe is waking more dure to seperation anxiety. He probably misses you! Feed him when he wakes, don't give him formula. This phase will pass. Just give him thw love and attention he needs, not a bunch of unfamiliar ingredients from a plastic container.


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## timneh_mom (Jun 13, 2005)

I think 12 months is a really hard time for them regarding sleep. There are so many developmental things happening that many babies just don't sleep "well". My kids have never been good sleepers and are high needs, but they are happy as long as their neediness is being taken care of. I understand how desperate one can feel when you're exhausted and just want the baby to sleep. I don't have answers for you but I do know that formula is probably not going to make them sleep more. I have a friend whose daughter was all formula fed (long story, she wanted to nurse but had NO help...) and was a terrible sleeper, so formula is not the panacea to sleep that many people think it is.

Don't ask me how to get a baby to sleep more. I haven't figured it out yet. But I can definitely tell you lots of reasons to avoid formula and nurse as much as your babe is willing!

I have a few Muslim friends, and they have told me that they are encouraged to nurse at least two years, but I don't recall any of them mentioning that it is required to wean at two.


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## Starleigh (Jul 27, 2003)

They're not required to wean at two.. The koran states that a child should be nursed till two unless the father objects, in which case the child can be weaned sooner. There's no age cap on nursing.


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## Natalie143 (May 14, 2007)

im a born muslim and from what I know of it... im not sure of the exact verse but In my and my families interpretation on it says to wean at two. This is something that is truly not up for discussion cuz i dont feel its relevant nor do i want it to be questioned. were these muslim friends converts or born muslims? im not the best follower of my religion in the form of hijab etc but i was brought up as a muslim and am amongst many religious people. but lets rather leave this subject cuz religious things arent supposed to be debated according to mdc rules(i think i saw that somewhere)

ok so im NOT gonna give him formula !!!














thank you everyone for your encouragement.. i really needed the support and motivation. i needed to know that just cuz he isn't sleeping through the night im not a bad mommy that cant teach my son good habits..







he is the light of my life... if he needs boob then he gets boob... and i didnt know formula tasted yukky.. no way im gonna give it to him if its not needed(which its not!!)















also.. i think i was so sleep deprived when i posted that i wasnt thinking clearly... i thought that the reason formula wasnt good was if it replaced breastmilk and that the baby shouldn't have foreign things in its body.. but i thought once solids was introduced.. then i thought baby cereals and solid foods were along the same lines...
now i know its not
thank you so so much!!!


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## scrabblelover (May 13, 2005)

I understand where you are coming from. My dd at that age was going through the exact same thing. All of he sudden waking more often, sometimes as much as every 45 min!!! She is now almost 17 months and back down to 1,2 or3 times a night. She was not eating hardly any solids then either.

I think it is completely normal. At that age they are learning to walk, talk, cutting teeth, just growing so fast. I think that has something to do with it. You could try offering a pacifier at night. If your dc has never had one they may not take it now, but it could help satisfy the sucking.

We recently moved dd to her own room. We are expecting baby #2 in July and i'm hoping she will be sleeping better by then. I also would like some sleep before this starts again. Amazingly enough she has loved it!! She's only waking 1 or 2 times and when she does she's just sitting up and smiling in bed and calls for me. She nurses and goes back to sleep. i think she was ready for the transition.

So hand in there momma, this to shall pass. You are doing a great job!!!


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## colobus237 (Feb 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
Here's a run down of one formula's ingredients. Can you even identify what half of them are? 'Cause I can't.

I can identify all of those ingredients - milk sugar, milk protein, vegetable oils, algae oils, vitamins and amino acids. Big deal. It's a beverage. But that's all it is, and more expensive/probably less tasty than trying a protein snack near bedtime.


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## mom2snugbugs (Nov 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlexisT* 
Yes, I only meant formula is superior to cows' milk--and then said I wouldn't give either one in this case









Got it. Thanks! Sorry...


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## Mhorai (Mar 21, 2007)

I'm surprised about the tone of many of the comments here. The original poster asked an honest question about whether her child was getting enough to eat and from the responses you would think that she was asking if feeding her child pepsi from a bottle would solve all her problems. She's breastfed for 12 months, she's committed and it sounds like a great mom-

I'm all for natural parenting and breastfeeding and practice both myself. That said, I'm upset that as a community that is about attachment and offering understanding to our children, we would be so fast to judge another mother who is only trying to do the best she can by her child.

To make statements like "why would you give your child formula if you don't even know what's in it" or "your friends are lying to you" come from a well intentioned place I'm sure, but they read as attacks.

When someone comes to a thread asking for advice and support, I'm all for giving information as well as anecdotes from our own experience. However, I suggest that before we hit "submit reply" we take a moment and reread our posts so that in trying to "help" we don't isolate other moms like ourselves- moms who care deeply about our children and are seeking to make the best and well-informed choices they can in the often confusing and exhausting world of parenting.


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## jeeves67 (Jun 23, 2007)

OP, I completely understand what you are going through. Although my son is only 9.5 months, his waking 3, 4 sometimes 5 times between 11 and 6 and it is starting to get to me. He eats food pretty well 3X a day, and is less and less interested in BF during the day, but reverse cycles a bit.

Because I'm ramping up to going back to work full time, I have been concerned that I won't be able to handle this.

Just today, I went to Whole Foods and bought a can of organic soy formula. DH and I just started with a new nanny share and the nanny thinks I ought to BF less often (that is a giant topic for another thread - relax, everyone, I'm not going to heed her advice). Looking around MDC for insight, inspiration and encouragement regarding my situation led me to your post, and I just wanted to say that I am impressed with your commitment to BF for 12 months and beyond, that some posters are a bit careless (it's easier to flame someone via a forum than in person), and that your doubts in the context of our largely mainstream society are pretty darned normal.

Thanks to this thread and others, I am reminded of some very important things - BF frequency is often due to additional nutritional or emotional needs, sleeping through the night really isn't that normal for babies, and that co-sleeping is truly a wonderful blessing and that those of us who do it really know how their children feel loved and well cared for.

I am also reminded that it's okay to try a couple of things, like from No Cry Sleep Solution, such as making the milk "less available" (I try sleeping on my stomach after gently removing my boy after I am tired and feel that he is done getting a substantial amount of milk), trying to let him settle back to sleep before offering the breast first, and cuddling first. I assume when none of these works that he really must be hungry.

Best of luck. In spite of how hard it is, we are all going to miss these times when they are over!


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## dis (May 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
Here's a run down of one formula's ingredients. Can you even identify what half of them are? 'Cause I can't.

(From Enfamil Website)
Ingredients: Powder: Nonfat milk, lactose, vegetable oil (palm olein, soy, coconut, and high oleic sunflower oils), whey protein concentrate, and less than 1%: Mortierella alpina oil*, Crypthecodinium cohnii oil†, vitamin A palmitate, vitamin D3, vitamin E acetate, vitamin K1, thiamin hydrochloride, riboflavin, vitamin B6 hydrochloride, vitamin B12, niacinamide, folic acid, calcium pantothenate, biotin, ascorbic acid, choline chloride, inositol, calcium carbonate, magnesium oxide, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, manganese sulfate, cupric sulfate, potassium chloride, potassium citrate, potassium hydroxide, sodium selenite, taurine, L-carnitine, nucleotides (adenosine 5'-monophosphate, cytidine 5'-monophosphate, disodium guanosine 5'-monophosphate, disodium uridine 5'-monophosphate).


What does the chemical breakdown of breastmilk look like? Seriously, I'm wondering, because it looks to me like most of that stuff is the proper chemical names of various vitamins and minerals and such. There's plenty of perfectly valid arguments against formula; just because it's made of chemicals isn't really a good one. Everything is made of chemicals, including breastmilk.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dis* 
What does the chemical breakdown of breastmilk look like? Seriously, I'm wondering, because it looks to me like most of that stuff is the proper chemical names of various vitamins and minerals and such. There's plenty of perfectly valid arguments against formula; just because it's made of chemicals isn't really a good one. Everything is made of chemicals, including breastmilk.

Yeah, my quick search didn't turn up one of the formulas with corn syrup









Still not what I feel appropriate to feed infants and toddlers. I look for as few ingredients as possible as a rule.

-Angela


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## surfamy (May 24, 2005)

Hi Natalie,

First, congats on making it a year nursing (and still going!). You are right that not many moms make it as far as you. And please don't feel bad about asking. Most of us don't have role models (i.e. our own moms) to ask these kinds of questions to. A good place to go for support would be your local La Leche League. You can ask all the questions you like without being judged.

Now, as to your question. I think most of the other posters are right that formula won't get them to sleep longer. Kids go through so many changes at this age and just when you think they are starting to sleep well, they go and change on you. Could be a tooth, growth spurt, who knows. Also, they have tiny stomachs and so they probably are hungry at night. Remember that they do have a fierce need for sucking too and that the night nursing can give them the comfort or connection with you that they need. I know my babies like to nurse all night when they are sick or are getting a tooth or growing etc.

So, as for advice, umm...I think it is probably not so much an empty belly at 1 year as much as it is a need for just plain old nursing. Your baby needs you! I always like what Dr. Sears says: "A need that is fulfilled in infancy goes away." You are fulfilling your baby's need.

Now this is not to say that it needs to be at the detriment of yourself. Look through the posts in this forum. It is filled with other mamas looking for sleep too. There are lots of different ideas and you need to find the one that works for you and your baby. *They will eventually sleep longer.* This much I promise. You are doing the absolute best for your child. Good luck mama and hang in there!!! We have all been there!


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## simonee (Nov 21, 2001)

HI Natalie -- congrats for the great nursing relation you and your son have built up in the past year! I'd say, give the formula a try, if it works, great! If not, try something else. A happy mama is more important to a toddler than a by-the-book mama!

(And before the strong lactivists jump on me for saying this: my children have never had formula. The big one nursed till her 6th bday, and the little one still nurses at 4,5. And I have only one nursing breast. They didnt'sleep through the nite till well after their 3rd bdays. I know it's great when it works, but it doesn't for everybody)

A bit of formula won't kill or maim your son.


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