# My husband wants a gun



## Nurturing Mama (Nov 11, 2003)

Ugh. My husband works with a man who just retired from the police force and is selling one of his guns. My husband has said on and off that he would like to own a gun, but I have always been able to dissuade him, but now the opportunity is there and it is happening soo fast, we haven't really been able to discuss it.

Yesterday my husband told me that the guy was selling a gun, today the guy brought it into the office to show it to my husband, and my husband said on the phone to me that he would probably buy it. I didn't know what to say, but I definitely don't want a gun in my house!!

So far my husband said that he just wanted to learn to use a gun at a shooting range, and that he would never keep ammunition in the house. That sounds reasonable, but I still hate the idea.

So, do any mamas here have a gun in the house? How do you feel about it?

Also, could anyone point me to gun statistics? Are kids with guns in their homes more at risk for gun accidents? It would seem to me that they are, but I'm looking for statistics to show and hopefully sway my husband.

Thanks.

Carrie


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## MsMoMpls (Oct 22, 2002)

Guns are most often used to kill people in your own home... your family. As a psychologist working with some very depressed people, I worry so much about how easy it is for kids and adults to get a gun when they are depressed... or as happened in Minnesota this week, when they are depressed and very angry. This would be a deal breaker for me. No guns in my house. He would need to find somewhere else to keep it.


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## willowsmom (Oct 28, 2004)

We don't own a gun...my dad and stepmom do...and when I was living there and came in late one night...my stepmom had been drinking and didn't know who'd be coming in her house. So she pulled the gun on me. It's just too easy for something like this to turn into a tragedy....no matter how careful you are...kwim?

I hope this works out for you...I'd also have to tell him to find someplace else to keep it....
Best of luck


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## momof1sofar (Oct 6, 2004)

At the risk of being flamed off this forum, I'll say that we own firearms. They are stored in a locked gun cabinet, partially disassembled, with trigger locks. Ammunition is locked in a separate safe. DH and I are both comfortable with this arrangement for now. We've agreed to re-evaluate the situation when our children are older and having friends over. Our kids will be educated on gun safety, so honestly it is the other kids that worry me.

There was a recent study released which showed that the increased threat level to kids in homes with guns really comes into play with firearms that are unsecured. I'll try to find the reference and edit to post it.
ETA: I think this is the one I'm remembering:
http://www.centerforhealthstudies.org/news/050208.html

All that being said, this is a huge issue, and I would recommend requesting that DH store the gun in a safe deposit box until you and he can reach an agreement on having it in the house. We wouldn't have our firearms (and won't in the future) if we were not both comfortable with the situation... and if our kids aren't comfortable with it when they're older.


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## MomInFlux (Oct 23, 2003)

We're another family with firearms. Like momof1sofar, the guns are locked in a safe, partially disassembled. My DH likes going to the shooting range and he wants to start hunting (for food only). Two of the guns are "mine", and I'll become proficient with their use when I find some time to get to the range with DH. We are teaching DS gun safety from an early age, and he's already been to the shooting range with DH. Quite frankly, he got bored and has lost interest, which pleases me greatly, because guns aren't this big ticket item out there that we don't talk about. The gun safe doesn't open with a key, but rather with a number pad, and only DH knows the combination, so I know there is no way my child or any other child (or adult, for that matter) in my house can get into the safe. I'm more worried about my child playing in someone else's house where I don't know the status of their guns.

Having said all that, if you're uncomfortable, then your DH needs to respect that and come up with a plan to keep you comfortable. Storage of the gun in outside your home (or at least no amunition in the home) is a good compromise, in my opinion. Good luck!


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## MomInFlux (Oct 23, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *willowsmom*
my stepmom had been drinking and didn't know who'd be coming in her house. So she pulled the gun on me. It's just too easy for something like this to turn into a tragedy....no matter how careful you are...kwim?

I absolutely don't mean to turn this thread into a debate, but I really need to point this out. This is NOT an example of responsible gun ownership/use and this is NOT an example of being careful and still having a tragedy occur. Drinking and guns never belong together.


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## mylilmonsters4 (Mar 23, 2005)

Hi.. I'm new here and this probably should not be my first post...lol
I hate guns.. but my DH convinced me that we needed one. At first I threw a big fit at the mention of guns.. but when he pointed out how I would feel if he couldn't protect my children if someone invaded our home.. I caved. We also live in the country where the police are a half an hour away at a minimum.
I have also noticed that since we live in cowboy country... EVERYONE HAS GUNS... so I have enrolled my boys in a gun safety class. I want them to be educated about how dangerous guns are... I also want to take the excitemnt out of them so that if they ever come across one.. they won't feel so curious as to touch it... Oh man.. I hate the thought!!!!!


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## Stone Fence (Mar 10, 2004)

Another Mama (to be) with guns.

We have a safe and a locked cabinet. DH and I are fanatical about safety. There are lots of places to get training for shooting, safety and cleaning. The NRA website can probably help you find a place locally.

Depending on your state there may be permitting requirements like a backround check and training class. Responsible gun ownership is not something to take lightly. Maybe both of you could take a safety class? There may even be one for women only.


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## L.J. (Nov 20, 2001)

I'm anti-gun.
I would think that your house & home is yours too.
If I were married to someone who wanted a gun in the house, I would be clear that I will not live in a house with a gun. He can buy it and keep it somewhere off my/our property.


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## Eaglevoice (Nov 30, 2004)

Just the thought makes me shudder....


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## pajara2 (Oct 5, 2004)

Okay, another person here that may get flammed.









I grew up in a house with guns. Not guns secured away, dismanteled, etc. My father's revolver was loaded and in his holster hanging on the headboard of their bed since probably WWII.

From an early age I was taught gun safety AND the value of life. My father's moto was this... "Don't have a gun if it's not going to be loaded. Don't draw the gun unless you intend to use it. If your intent is to protect yourself, shoot to kill." Based on this teaching I have NEVER drawn my gun out of its holster at home, because I've never had occassion to protect myself or my family. I have never even thought of drawing a gun on another person in anger or depression, because I was taught that life is precious! Also my father taught me to not point EVEN A TOY gun at a person, that it was disrespectful.

I have had and will always have guns in my home. However, from birth, my son has not been allowed to have ANY KIND OF GUN AS A TOY. Meaning nothing other than a water gun once he was 4 or 5 years old. From the beginning I have explained that a gun is not supposed to be a toy, so that hopefully he will never confuse a real gun for something to show his buddies and 'play' with. (Sidenote-he too grew up with my parents as caregivers and dad's same gun on the bed. He touched it once, the only time my father has ever reprimanded my son, the reprimand scared him so much that he never got near it again.)

BUT...that said...my mother never liked my dad having a gun and I'm sure they reconcilled themselves somehow. So I strongly urge you to take the PPs suggestions of storing the gun elsewhere until this can be resolved.

Great question/topic, thanks...

Ana


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## iamama (Jul 14, 2003)

I had this same talk with my dh just this week. He feels the best way to protect his family is with a gun. I told him by the time you unlock the safe, unlock the gun and unlock the bullet I'm going to be running with dd out the door in our room and down the block and the robber can have what they want. In my town there are hardly any armed robberies and the ones we have had are relatives of the victims looking for drug money. My dog makes me feel safer than a gun.


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

Why a gun ?









Has he considered Brinks?


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

We've had guns. Our kids shoot (one competitively actually...) It's not an issue for us. It's about responsibility and common sense IMO.


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## Dechen (Apr 3, 2004)

I would not personally allow a gun in my home. I realize opinions differ, and I'm not chastizing anyone for their own choice.

But in my house? No way. Non-negotiable.

You need to decide for yourself where you stand. It is a very individual thing.


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## Nurturing Mama (Nov 11, 2003)

Thanks for the replies, everyone. I realize this is a touchy issue. We talked about it some more, and we both are okay with him owning it, but keeping it somewhere else, like a childless friend's house or, more likely, a safety deposit box. Thanks for that idea, I don't know why I hadn't thought of that.

Quote:

Why a gun ? Has he considered Brinks?
Huh? Was that supposed to be helpful? Insulting one's spouses intelligence is not a very good way to convert somebody to your agenda. You can't shoot a "Brinks" at a shooting range, I suppose that's why he didn't consider that.









Carrie


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## ~Quse~ (Aug 8, 2004)

Personally, I wouldn't live in a house without a gun.


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nurturing Mama*
Huh? Was that supposed to be helpful? Insulting one's spouses intelligence is not a very good way to convert somebody to your agenda.
Carrie


I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to be insulting and I can see why you'd take it that way...

I'm at work and I am responding short hand, my apologies...what I mean't...I understand your DH is trying to protect his homefront, but instead of using a gun have you guys discussed other *security measures* like a home security system such as Brinks as a *compromise* since *you* are not comfortable with it being in your home?

*PersonallY* I could not live with a gun in the house...not with a curious wandering toddler...loaded or not.

We just had an incident in our hometown where a 3 year old and 4 year old were playing....well the 4 year old found a loaded gun in the drawer of a nightstand by the bed and was showing it to the 3 year old. He pointed and pulled the trigger shooting the 3 yr old in the head. This just happened about 2 weeks ago. No this is NOT responsible gun ownership, but it IS the reality of what can happen with a gun in the house.

And of course, the Minnesota Shootings, such a tragedy...

Seriously, I think you and DH should compromise on other *security measures* if YOU are not wholeheartedly agreeable to the gun concept.


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

I have grown up around guns, and knew how to properly shoot them, clean them and secure them, at a young age.
We have a revolver that we consider our home defense weapon which remains loaded at all times. All other rifles and pistols and ammo are kept in a gun safe and all are equipped with gun locks. My DH and I target shoot once every three months to retain our familiarity and skill level of our weapons.
With that said, I can totally understand where you are coming from and I urge you and your husband to discuss the real reason why he wants a gun. Make your wishes known loud and clear. It dumbfounds me when people go out and buy a gun and have no clue how to even shoot it. That is asking for trouble. If you decide to purchase this gun, I would strongly suggest that both of you attend a gun safety class, and be trained (and proficient) on how to shoot a gun BEFORE buying one.
DS # 1 has been taught what he should do if he sees a gun and he can repeat it by heart. We have also tested him (with the help of some police officer friends) and he has passed with flying colors. DS # 2 is a bit too young yet but he will be taught the same thing. We do not allow fake guns of any kind in our home. In addition, we do not allow him to play with any fake guns anywhere else. Many real guns out there look just like fake water pistols. That's why we have a no gun at all policy in our house. Kids are too little to be expected to know what is real and what is not. So there is no gun playing at all.
Having a gun in your home is a decision that needs to be made by BOTH of you.


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## bravofrenchie (Oct 15, 2004)

I grew up in a house full of guns. My Dad is an avid hunter and a collector of guns. None of his guns were ever locked up while I was growing up. They were either up on a gunrack in my parent's bedroom, in a holster hanging from said gunracks (if they were pistols), or leaning in a corner. Almost all of them were loaded. (But without a round in the chamber.) I honestly can't remember a time where I didn't know that guns were not to play with, ect. If I wanted to go out shooting with my Dad, we'd go shoot targets, pop cans, ect. If I wanted to examine a gun, he would unload it and give it to me to look over. It was always drummed into my head that guns were NOT toys, and you were never to point a gun at a person, unless that person was a threat to your life. And to always treat a gun as if it was loaded, even if you "knew" that it wasn't. I didn't have a facination with guns because they weren't some forbidden, mysterious entities. Like MomInFlux's son, target shooting bored me. But I'd get a hankering for it every once in a while. Guns just weren't a big deal in my home.


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
Why a gun ?









Has he considered Brinks?


Actually most home security systems are a joke and the crooks know that. For example, do any of you keep your alarm on when you are home? If not, then you are not using it correctly.
Home security systems tend to give people a false sense of security. On average by the time the police are dispatched and actually make it to your home, the crooks have been in and out and are gone with your valuables. A gun is not the solution for everyone by no means, but neither is Brinks.


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## peaceful herbivore (Mar 17, 2005)

This is a topic where I might be confused with a republican







: lol jk to the conservative mamas!

In my experience it is a cultural difference. I am a city girl. Hubby grew up on a farm. He is not *country* but he grew up rural and they owned guns from birth and learned to shoot and it was like recreation for them. No one got shot, no one he ever knew got shot, no baby ever died, no horrible stories, no one pulled a gun on their wife in a drunken rage, it just didn't happen. Guns were treated as dagnerous weapons that could kill you or others, but also as something to be treated with care, safety, respect. They NEVER touched their Dad's guns, which were loaded and not locked by the way, hubby says more for fear of what their DAD would do, not the gun









Anyway, I corrupted hubby in the sense that now he is a vegan feminist *liberal* animal rights activist intactivist, and he has "corrupted" me in the sense that, while I don't know if I would ever be comfortable with guns all around, I am definately more respectful of them and the right of people to own them safely and legally. I don't want to turn this into a gun ownership debate, but the statistics are SO skewed because they also include illegally obtained guns, guns owned by criminals, former felons etc---Any statistics with specifically law abiding, background checked, legally obtained guns would show much lower "gun violence" etc.... I digress. I am not suggesting that accidents don't happen and tragedy occurs, and of course it is absolutely terrible, but take into consideration how many children die each year because the cabinet where the cleaning agents are kept isn't locked. I am not saying it is any better, I am just saying that if you are an irresponsible parent, or a careless parent, or forgetful, or whatever, accidents will not just be confined to your gun.

Anyway, we don't have a gun at the moment, and I don't know how cool I would really be with one, because as the one poster pointed out--if it has to be locked, unloaded, kept on a high shelf, in a locked case and all this--how the heck is it supposed to *protect* you from anything?


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

See im a strange one who doesn't think it always has to be locked, kept up high, hidden etc. I agree it can be something of a cultural, where you're from sort of thing too.


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## peaceful herbivore (Mar 17, 2005)

Hubby doesn't either, and I agree to a point--but of course being the nutty nervous first time mom I would be a wreck lol...

Where he grew up, having a gun was like having a bicycle or something, EVERYONE had one, even the kids (supervised)...but they were always loaded, not locked, etc and no one ever got shot anywhere...again, not that it doesn't happen, but I think people think it is a lot more common than it is...


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *peaceful herbivore*
Hubby doesn't either, and I agree to a point--but of course being the nutty nervous first time mom I would be a wreck lol...

Where he grew up, having a gun was like having a bicycle or something, EVERYONE had one, even the kids (supervised)...but they were always loaded, not locked, etc and no one ever got shot anywhere...again, not that it doesn't happen, but I think people think it is a lot more common than it is...

Yep. I mean I totally understand not leaving a load firearm around a 3 year old etc, but when I was kid my experience was much like yours... guns were visible, loaded, and not locked up. It was never an issue. As a kid you just did not touch them, and we knew it. Then as we got older we learned gun safety, etc. It was just life ya know? My kids have grown up much the same way. When my kids stay at my father's house the room they sleep in is adjecent to his gun and ammo room. Nothing locked up in there at all.


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## mysonshine (Jan 29, 2005)

dallaschildren -- how have you taught your dc about guns? - that he can repeat and can be tested? I'm very interested in that.
BTW-







your sig!


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## 2xmommy (Aug 17, 2004)

Hopefully this link works.
http://webappa.cdc.gov/cgi-bin/broker.exe

If not, it basically shows that in terms of unintentional injury, firearm injuries do not even rank in the top twenty for children under 15, and do not go above #19 for any age group. You and your children would be more likely to be injured by:
Falling, Being Struck by/against something, Cut/Pierce, Cycling, Bite/Sting, Overexertion, Poisoning, Motor Vehicle Accident, Other Transport, Dog Bite, Foreign Body, Inhalation, Machinery, Drowning, and a number of other unspecified or vague dangers. The statistics are taken from the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control.


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## monkaha (Jan 22, 2004)

:


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mysonshine*
dallaschildren -- how have you taught your dc about guns? - that he can repeat and can be tested? I'm very interested in that.
BTW-







your sig!


Yes we test him about once every couple of months. Sounds weird, but I take the responsibility very seriously. Some parents don't and that is who I am protecting him from. I won't go into detail as to how we test for privacy issues. But the education can begin like this:

*What do you do when you see a gun?*
Don't touch it, run away and find an adult. Tell the adult and then stay far away. (the last part is in case the adult is a dumbs*** and picks it up and it accidently fires or something)

Thanks for the compliment on my sig.


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## stafl (Jul 1, 2002)

My DH owns guns. They are all locked in a gun safe that is hidden in the back of his closet, trigger-locked and unloaded, and all ammo is locked away somewhere else. The issue of responsible gun ownership is about respect for firearms and teaching gun safety starting at a very young age. The children who shoot other children haven't been taught how dangerous guns are and that you are never ever to point a gun at another person (or other living being), even if you think the gun is not loaded. I can't even stand it when someone points a pretend gun at another person - that's just wrong as far as I'm concerned.

as far as home protection goes, the dog is our first line of defense. Nobody can so much as walk down the street without the dog barking at them! That's her job, and she does it very well. She has prevented *twice* the theft of DH's car stereo (when I lived in a less desirable neighborhood before we were married and had kids). Nobody would ever be able to come into our house without us knowing about it well ahead of time.







And, when there was a recent epidemic of home invasions, not a single one of those households had a dog or a security door, but half of them had "security systems"


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## griffin2004 (Sep 25, 2003)

I grew up in a house of loaded, unsecured guns. As an adult, I will NOT allow a gun in my home. I even made my brother get his ancient BB gun out of my guest room closet!

As DD gets older and starts to visit friends' houses without me, it's a question I'll ask the parents. I think I may live in the gun capital of the world, so there will likely be homes I won't allow her to visit alone.

Teaching young children about gun safety is great, but is mine the only youngster with a 30-second memory? I frequently have to remind her to "hold hands when we cross the street" and "don't touch the stove knobs." No way am I putting gun safety on the list (at least for the foreseeable future)!

Here's a different perspective: I work as a public defender in juvenile court. Want to guess how many of my residential burglary clients stole guns from the houses they burgled? Every single one! And yes, some of the guns were in safes which, when you're a slightly clever and very motivated juvenile, are not that hard to open.

Statistics show that it's not necessarily the little ones who are at biggest risk for in-home firearms incidents. For example, pre-teens and teens attempting suicide most frequently use firearms. There's some very interesting and thought-provoking reading at Jim (Regan's press secretary who was shot by Hinkley) and Sarah Brady's website if you're interested. Here's the link:
http://www.bradycampaign.org/facts/faqs/?page=cap

Very interesting thread!


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

I too grew up with loaded guns and I hated it. My stepfather kept a loaded shotgun in his bedroom closet.

The only time he (and my 4 stepbrothers) used it was on New Year's Eve. As soon as Midnight came...they would raise the shotgun in sky and Pow! Pow!.

It was always so loud and totally unnecessary







: My mom would be standing right beside them *waiting her turn*.

I just felt what if someone got accidentally shot, and I always stayed in my room hiding under the bed because I was so scared.

But when DH and I got marrried, he was also against guns and we signed up for Brinks. We had a system with a Silent Alarm/Panic Button. Thank goodness we never had to use it but there were a couple of times our cat accidentally set the alarm off and the Police were there in minutes.

In our neighborbood, there are at least 3 Police Cars patrolling the neighborhood so in the event of an emergency, they would literally be right down the street so I feel pretty safe with it.

Dh often jokes when we get rich, we are going to build a Panic Room (like the one in the movie with Jodie Foster)


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## monkaha (Jan 22, 2004)

newmommy, watch out for those false alarms. In my city, they've started charging the homeowner the cost of sending police out when it is a false alarm. And I would worry about the cops in your neighborhood rolling eyes and saying "ah, that house, it's just a false alarm" even if (god forbid) it wasn't. Crying wolf, doncha know.

Back on topic, we have guns in our house too. I was really against them, having grown up in a family where even toy guns were not allowed. But after learning about them, and how to use them safely, and especially now that they are locked up, I feel safe with them around. Not safER because of them, just safe with them.

OP, you really need to have a talk with DH. I think you have to be comfy with the gun in your house, or it will be an issue between you. Good luck.


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
I too grew up with loaded guns and I hated it. My stepfather kept a loaded shotgun in his bedroom closet.

The only time he (and my 4 stepbrothers) used it was on New Year's Eve. As soon as Midnight came...they would raise the shotgun in sky and Pow! Pow!.

Guess they didn't understand the law of gravity







People get hurt pretty frequenly in areas where lots of people shoot guns off on new year's eve, because what goes up must come down.


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
I too grew up with loaded guns and I hated it. My stepfather kept a loaded shotgun in his bedroom closet.

The only time he (and my 4 stepbrothers) used it was on New Year's Eve. As soon as Midnight came...they would raise the shotgun in sky and Pow! Pow!.

It was always so loud and totally unnecessary







: My mom would be standing right beside them *waiting her turn*.

I just felt what if someone got accidentally shot, and I always stayed in my room hiding under the bed because I was so scared.


You were pretty smart to stay away. Every New Year's there are hundreds of fatalities and injuries of people due to the actions of those (usually innocent and not part of the crowd doing it) who randomly shoot off guns to welcome the new year. A really stupid tradition IMO.


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## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

I would divorce my dh before I would let a gun in my house. I don't care how it would be stored.

I had a five year old cousin who was killed by a neighbor's child, in a house where everyone had attended all the alleged safety training and where the gun and ammunition were locked up and stored separately.

My BIL also died from a gunshot in another so-called safe house. No guns, period.


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

Personally I feel that owning a gun is dangerous and hate the idea of it. That said, we have a 22 shot gun. DH owned it before I met him, his dad gave it to him for his 14th b-day and he won't give it up. It's in the bedroom closet unloaded, I have no idea where, or if there is ammo for the gun anywhere. Finally after years of telling him I really don't like it, he has agreed the gun will go to storage and kept more as a keepsake from a father son gift, and not in the house. Our son is 14 months old and very curious and I think that has had a lot to do with his change of heart.


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## Dreamer (May 26, 2004)

I have to start out saying that guns scare the crap out of me. However, we have 4. 2 pistols, a shotgun & a pellet gun. We keep one pistol unloaded, in a locked holster in the top of the kitchen cabinet. The other pistol is loaded, in the top of our bedroom closet. We have a latch on the closet door that stays locked all the time. We also have a shotgun in the closet (unloaded). Our pellet gun is in the foyer (dh likes to shoot at squirrels







)

Anyway...our ds (4) has always been around guns. We started very early, letting him shoot the pellet gun at targets and just getting him familiar with what guns are, what they do, the potential hazards, etc. When my husband went to get his hunting liscense last year, he had ds take the gun safety course that is required for a liscense with him. He's been to the hunting club with dh (yes, we shoot deer for sport) and actually shot a spike with a shotgun last year, with dh's help. We even let him touch the pistols and he watches my dh shoot them regularly. He's very familiar with guns.

I give you all this background, because I have a story to share that just makes me *so* proud of him, and of us for teaching him about guns at an early age...

So...our ds is an only right now...we have a relatively quiet home, not to rowdy or anything...well, one day, we had one of my dh's friends and his set of twins (b/g) over to play. They had just turned 3 at the time, and Braden was almost 4. Well, of course they were in and out, in and out, they were all getting rambunctious and wanted to be in different places of the house at different times, etc. and it was just really hard to keep up with them all (I'm not that used to that many kids at once!)

Well, I was playing with the little girl back in Braden's bedroom and I hear Braden scream at the top of his lungs, "DO NOOOOT TOUCH THAT GUN!"







Of course, my eyes bug out of my head, and I take off running to the living room...I see Braden holding the little boys arms behind his back (like in a backwards bear hug), and the pellet gun was laying in the living room floor...Evidently, the little twin boy, thought the gun was a toy...and, while it wasn't loaded, and really couldn't have done much damage, it was a situation that could have definately turned out different under differnt circumstances. I cannot express how PROUD I was of my ds for doing EXACTLY what we had taught him to do in that situation!!!

I just know that that little boy had never seen a gun before. He had never touched one, and he was just being a curious three year old when he picked it up. I am SO THANKFUL that my son had the correct training to know what to do in that situation, and I'm glad we've given him some protection against his own natural curiosities.

I think that while guns can be TERRIBLY dangerous, with the proper training, children can actually BENEFIT from the presence of guns. We have to remember that while someone may not have a gun in their own home, there are guns EVERYWHERE else in this country. We have to protect our children, and teach them to protect themselves against gun accidents.

Alayna


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## sharksmum (Dec 31, 2003)

I think it's really sad that there are so many people that are so scared that they feel like they need to protect their families with guns and alarms. How often do homes actally get broken into? And is the potential loss of material goods really worth the trade off of trust in your fellow human beings?


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## HoneymoonBaby (Mar 31, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Vivianna*
Personally, I wouldn't live in a house without a gun.

Nothing but agreement here. We have quite a few guns used for pleasure shooting at the range, home defense, and personal defense. Like a PP, I grew up in a house where guns weren't even locked up -- we were just taught from an early age not to touch them unless we intended to kill something. And we were also taught to value life. I don't expect that to work in my house since we have a boy (it was just my sister and I as kids), so our guns will be in a very sturdy safe with a combination lock way before Ian is old enough to get to them. Despite that precaution, Ian will still have extensive training in gun safety.


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## ~Quse~ (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sharksmum*







I think it's really sad that there are so many people that are so scared that they feel like they need to protect their families with guns and alarms. How often do homes actally get broken into? And is the potential loss of material goods really worth the trade off of trust in your fellow human beings?

There's nothing I own that I would shoot someone over. It's a matter of protecting my family and myself against physical harm.


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## momof1sofar (Oct 6, 2004)

Many gun owners (us included) do not have them primarily for home or personal defense. We both enjoy range shooting (archery and firearm), and my DH hunts to put extra meat in the freezer.

Not to say there's anything wrong with owning a gun for defense (in my opinion), but just another perspective...


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sharksmum*







I think it's really sad that there are so many people that are so scared that they feel like they need to protect their families with guns and alarms. How often do homes actally get broken into? And is the potential loss of material goods really worth the trade off of trust in your fellow human beings?


I agree it is a very sad world we live in. Babies being molested, abused and/or murdered, woman being raped, drugs, gangs, hell we can't even let our kids out of our sight for fear of them being taken......
I do not mean this rudely but rather matter of factly (is that a word?)..have you ever been burglarized? Because until you have, I don't think I can begin to make you understand with words only, how it feels. It's not about the material possessions. You feel dirty....your home, your sanctuary has been ransacked and all of your very personal things have been touched by a stranger. It is a violation in the truest sense of the word. In the back of your mind, you are always wondering if they are going to come back again and get what they missed. Do most people whose homes have been burglarized give a darn about their material possesions? No.
Personally I will begin to trust all of my fellow human beings when there is no crime. Until then, I'm not trading off anything. Been there, done that, and got robbed. IMO, trust is earned.


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momof1sofar*
Many gun owners (us included) do not have them primarily for home or personal defense. We both enjoy range shooting (archery and firearm), and my DH hunts to put extra meat in the freezer.

Not to say there's anything wrong with owning a gun for defense (in my opinion), but just another perspective...

ITA. Gun owners seem to get painted with the same brush. Not all gun owners own guns for self defense.


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## momof1sofar (Oct 6, 2004)

I would also like to add that I appreciate the calm tone overall of this thread. I know that this issue tends to bring out strong emotions, and I really appreciate everyone's restraint in not flaming one another.


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## sharksmum (Dec 31, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Vivianna*
There's nothing I own that I would shoot someone over. It's a matter of protecting my family and myself against physical harm.









I didn't mean to make it seem like I think that pps are buying guns to protect their material goods, but I do think that property plays a big role inthe situation in general.

To me, (and I'm not an avid anti-gun person) the saddest reason to buy a gun is to protect your family, because it means that you're scared. There is a real culture of fear in the US that I don't believe is well founded (take that opinion for what it's worth, I don't live in the US.







)

This is related to protecting material goods because why would somebody break into your house if they didn't want to steal from you? As screwy as the US may be, I just don't believe that there are a bunch of people wandering around, breaking into homes for the sole purpose of harming families. A few sensational stories aside, I just don't believe it.

So my 2 cents is...if you want a gun to hunt, or to shoot targets or whatever people do with guns, then go for it. But if it's in the name of "protection" I think it's worth a rethink because I think you lose alot more from giving into the *fear* then you gain from getting a gun.


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## medaroge (Dec 21, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *2xmommy*
Hopefully this link works.
http://webappa.cdc.gov/cgi-bin/broker.exe

If not, it basically shows that in terms of unintentional injury, firearm injuries do not even rank in the top twenty for children under 15, and do not go above #19 for any age group. You and your children would be more likely to be injured by:
Falling, Being Struck by/against something, Cut/Pierce, Cycling, Bite/Sting, Overexertion, Poisoning, Motor Vehicle Accident, Other Transport, Dog Bite, Foreign Body, Inhalation, Machinery, Drowning, and a number of other unspecified or vague dangers. The statistics are taken from the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control.


I am in no way disputing these stats, I know they are true. However, I can reduce the chance of my child being injured by a gun br reducing the ammount he is around guns just as I can reduce the chance of my child being injured by any other item by reducing the ammount he is around that other item. kwim?
Each family must weigh the benifits against the risks. My childs life is not a risk that I am willing to take.


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## heartmama (Nov 27, 2001)

Statistically the person most likely to be killed by the gun in your home is not the burglar, but the person who has the time to retrieve the gun from where you keep it~which would be someone who lives in your home, or an invited guest. A properly locked and stored gun offers minimal protection at best during a break in~you would need time to find, unlock, and load it. Time that you won't typically have with an intruder.

I won't comment on this general gun issue however, a few people in this thread have said they keep a loaded gun "out of reach" in their homes. This is not only incredibly dangerous, but illegal in many states. If you are going to own a gun it is absolutely ESSENTIAL that you follow the law, and common sense, and keep it unloaded, locked, and properly stored.

Above all, never, EVER assume that your child does not know where the gun is kept. This is a FATAL mistake. Second only to the fatal assumption that your child cannot pull the trigger. There are enough horrible stories of 3 and 4 year olds pulling a trigger, or dropping a gun and having to go off, that this should NEVER be a reassurance for keeping a gun loaded in a home with children. And again, it is another fatal mistake to think your child "knows how to use a gun properly". There is a reason why children don't drive until a certain age, and I wish there was the same recognition of maturity issues with gun use and kids.

I think this is an important issue to discuss here. Statistics show that the highest causualties for gunshot wounds in the home are women and children, *not* men, and not burglars. As mostly women here, many home with children, I am glad the OP brought this up, as I see handgun issues not in terms of politics but in many ways, as an issue of concern for women.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dallaschildren*
I do not mean this rudely but rather matter of factly (is that a word?)..have you ever been burglarized? Because until you have, I don't think I can begin to make you understand with words only, how it feels.

dallaschildren, I don't mean to pick on what you have said, but I wanted to offer a different perspective. I hope you don't mind









I have never been burglarized, but I have been physically assaulted by a group of men who jumped out of a car and beat me up. I have also been raped. If I could redo either situation, I would not choose to have a gun with me.

I live in Baltimore, a city that has a fairly poor rep in terms of safety issues.

I very, very conciously choose not to be afraid. I say conciously because it was a lot of work at first. (Both the rape and the assault happened the summer before my freshman year at college- and I had a lot to work through.)

But for me, the effect of fear on my life and my psyche just isn't worth whatever benefits extra caution might confer. I choose to believe that the vast majority of humanity _wants_ to be good to others, _tries_ to be good to others.

I don't always lock my door; I give rides to the participants in my ged class; I do other things that some people consider downright recklous. But, for me, the quality of my life is greatly improved because I have choosen not to be afraid.

I will never own a gun, nor have one in my house, because I never want to shoot anything.

This works for me. I recognize that it doesn't work for everyone.
Kaly


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## Mothra (Jun 4, 2002)

I grew up in a house with guns. I was instructed from an early age not to touch guns, blah, blah, blah. My dad kept the guns locked up. They were not for protection, but for sport. We did the Eddie the Eagle course and everything. My brothers and I still played with those guns. I knew how to open the box when I was seven. My heart stops to think about it now. My parents were not neglectful, we were well cared for, yet we still found time to play with those guns when no one was looking.

I would leave my husband if he ever brought a gun into the house and I would take my children. Thankfully, he would do the same if I ever brought a gun into the house. I remember all too clearly being a 7yo child playing with a pistol.

It doesn't really matter what others are comfortable with. You seem uncomfortable with this situation. I hope that you find the time and the words to tell your husband how you feel.

zipperump-a-zoomum-- I agree with everything you have said. My home has been invaded and I have been the victim of a violent crime. I refuse to live my life in fear and I refuse to put my children's lives in danger by owning a gun. The chances of them being shot by a gun we own is zero.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sharksmum*







I think it's really sad that there are so many people that are so scared that they feel like they need to protect their families with guns and alarms. How often do homes actally get broken into? And is the potential loss of material goods really worth the trade off of trust in your fellow human beings?

Well for me it isn't just about potential robbery. We just like guns.







And to be honest if someone broke into my home, particularly with me and my kids in it (it has happened to someone I know) I wouldn't much care if they didn't trust me or not. If you don't want the possibility of someone pulling a gun on you don't break into someone's house, KWIM?


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

If you are going to get a gun, learn how to use it.

There are weekend trainings available for learning how to handle yourself and a gun.

Go for it.

Knowledge in all areas of life is power.


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## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

Ooh, a _whole weekend_ of training for a device that could blow a big chunk out of you or your kid in a fraction of a second.


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

Either for protection or sport...

If a burglar DID break into your home in the middle of the night and you and the kids are home, what would you and your SO do?

Just curious...


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## Stone Fence (Mar 10, 2004)

Well the thread was going along with a very civil tone.

I don't want to sound aggravated here, because I am not. However, I guess I need to dispute some stats.

The reason women are the victims of gun violence is because it is culturally acceptable for us to be victims. These women are largely victims of domestic violence. The law cannot protect you all the time. Police are over worked, understaffed and in some cases just too far away. Sometimes they choose not to respond either, because they don't feel there is a real threat. (I'm not knocking all police).

I agree that we have a culture of fear in this country. Hopefully we will not export this culture everywhere.

To the OP: I hope you and DH have a good talk about reasons for having a gun and can agree on something. I hope you can find some peace for both of you in a decision.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *girlndocs*
Ooh, a _whole weekend_ of training for a device that could blow a big chunk out of you or your kid in a fraction of a second.









Obviously you know nothing about the training or you would no say that. The training includes how to handle a weapon.

Yes, a gun can "blow a big chunk out of you or your kid in a fraction of a second", but so can a knife, nail gun, or other tools; precautions need to be learned and done.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
Either for protection or sport...If a burglar DID break into your home in the middle of the night and you and the kids are home, what would you and your SO do? Just curious...

That is why I posted that one needs to take time to be trained mentally and physically to be prepared to handle a weapon. A good training includes this preparation.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Stone Fence*
The reason women are the victims of gun violence is because it is culturally acceptable for us to be victims. These women are largely victims of domestic violence. The law cannot protect you all the time. Police are over worked, understaffed and in some cases just too far away. Sometimes they choose not to respond either, because they don't feel there is a real threat. (I'm not knocking all police)

I AM KNOCKING ALL POLICE. I had three strangers in my home one Saturday afternoon who refused to leave. I called the police, three times, and the police arrived four hours later!

The strangers already left. The police accused me of making it up, and backed off when my children told them I was telling the truth.

With protection like that, you are better off without it. Who needs it?

Furthermore, if I had called the police the first time, telling the police that I had three strangers in my home who refused to leave and added that *I HAD A GUN*, I doubt it would have taken the @$$es four hours to come to my home.

It is really a sad commentary on the state of our culture that the police react this way.







:

Another time, I called seven (7) times for the police to come to my rental home to document vandalism for an insurance company. They finally came when my DH called and he stayed there to let them in, only to have them leave halfway through the visit to go somewhere else on another call.

Yet, once I took my then year old son to the ER for an injury visited on him by a negligent babysitter. DH and I took him to the ER; we told the ER staff what happened, and I was soon surrounded by seven police officers. I was held there for six hours. ALL of the officers stayed there, calling me names, threatening me, and trying to get my address so they could confiscate my other three children.

I was let go. I had a visit by a CPS worker six months later because of the incident; if I was such horrible threat to my child, why wait six months to go out and investigate me in my home?


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## Stone Fence (Mar 10, 2004)

Applejuice-









We cross posted. I'm sorry that happened to you. I had something similar happen to me once. (burglar was already gone though). In my experience there are lots of professional police officers that do a great job. As with every profession there are duds.

Personal responsibility can go both ways. You have to take resposibility for your own safety. You can't always rely on law enforcement to do it for you.

Also, choosing to not be afraid reduces your chances of being a victim, in my experience.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *girlndocs*
Ooh, a _whole weekend_ of training for a device that could blow a big chunk out of you or your kid in a fraction of a second.









So take more than a weekend. Heck, take years... whatever works


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
Either for protection or sport...

If a burglar DID break into your home in the middle of the night and you and the kids are home, what would you and your SO do?

Just curious...

I'd head for the kids, and Dh would head for the phone/weapon.


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *applejuice*
That is why I posted that one needs to take time to be trained mentally and physically to be prepared to handle a weapon. A good training includes this preparation.

Agreed. But are you *mentally prepared* to shoot to kill?


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Stone Fence*
Applejuice-







... choosing to not be afraid reduces your chances of being a victim, in my experience.


ITA, however in Los Angeles, most of the good cops have desk jobs or resign.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
Agreed. But are you *mentally prepared* to shoot to kill?

Yes, it is a mindset that you get trained for.

That is why people who grow up with guns around, know how to use them because they do.

It is the same way with the mindset that most people have with a phobia of guns in our society.

P.S., DH and I did NOT have guns around when the children were little. DH was a sharpshooter in the military, but did not want anything like that around when the children were small. He grew up with no guns around the house even though he lived in apartments that his parents owned on busy streets; there were guns around my house when I grew up, even though I lived in a very safe neighborhood.

It is just POV, world view.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmommy*
Agreed. But are you *mentally prepared* to shoot to kill?

Yep. The only instances in which I'd be shooting at someone would involve me feeling as though I had to. Obviously if someone dies it would be very sad that the person put themselves in a situation where death was a possibility (Ie, breaking into my home, threatening my children, etc)


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## ibahippiemama (Aug 24, 2003)

I did not read any of the replys. Please have your Dh read this.

On May 22, 2004, my son was shot, accidentaly by his dad, in the head. The bullet tore through the right frontal lobe through the parietal and occipital lobes. The bullet is still there. My son was very lucky in the sense that he survived the shooting. He doing so well now. He has gross motor skills on the left side of his body. Meaning, he can move his left leg and arm but he can not walk or wiggle his toes or fingers. There is more to this story and I might post it all on day. Just not today.

PLEASE DO NOT GET A GUN!!! Please heed this warning. I wish that we had cleaned out our closets better before we moved here. i wish that my grandfather had not brought a gun in this house.

love and blessings
angie


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *applejuice*
Yes, a gun can "blow a big chunk out of you or your kid in a fraction of a second", but so can a knife, nail gun, or other tools; precautions need to be learned and done.

Yes, but let's be emotionally honest- injuring another person or animal are not the primary purposes of those objects.

I think (correct me if I'm wrong- don't want to speak for you) that girlndocs comment was meant to point out the essential nature of guns. Spending a weekend learning how to opperate a gun so that I could (would know how to)maim or kill is a very foriegn idea to me, and I'd guess that others would agree.

I totally agree that it is just POV, worldview. I know people feel very differently about guns, and I can respect that.
kaly


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## HoneymoonBaby (Mar 31, 2004)

Hippiemama, I am so sorry that happened to your son, but the gun didn't do it to him -- your husband did, albeit accidentally. If your husband had had proper safety training before handling a weapon, there is NO way that would have happened.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneymoonBaby*
Hippiemama, I am so sorry that happened to your son, but the gun didn't do it to him -- your husband did, albeit accidentally. If your husband had had proper safety training before handling a weapon, there is NO way that would have happened.

Without knowing any of the details, how can you say that?
I'd guess that accidents are more rare when people have undergone training, but I would seriously doubt that they never happen.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zipperump-a-zoomum*
Yes, but let's be emotionally honest- injuring another person or animal are not the primary purposes of those objects.

I think (correct me if I'm wrong- don't want to speak for you) that girlndocs comment was meant to point out the essential nature of guns. Spending a weekend learning how to opperate a gun so that I could (would know how to)maim or kill is a very foriegn idea to me, and I'd guess that others would agree.

I totally agree that it is just POV, worldview. I know people feel very differently about guns, and I can respect that.
kaly

I was quoting girlndocs, those are her words.

I said that she did not know anything about these weekend gun workshops.

These gun workshops teach not only how to load and hold a gun, but before anyone can buy a gun they have to pass a written test. Granted, anyone can cheat and/or guess, bluff their way through a written test, but if one is serious about being responsible in owning a gun, then one needs to know how the law, how to clean, store, carry and present a gun.

The workshops teach law, case and statutory. You are taught how to conceal the weapon and the laws thereof. You are taught NOT to present the weapon unless you are going to use it. You are taught how easy it is to have a weapon taken from you, and turned against you. Proper handling, holding, posturing, is taught. It is serious business. Different scenarios are presented, and resolutions, good and bad are discussed.

Before you ask, I have not been to one, but my DH took my older boys when he felt they were old enough. I will have to take my youngest son myself.

I have had Krav Maga classes, which is Israeli army self-defense which incorporates all manner of the best of self-defense from judo to karate, to street fighting.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Sorry, applejuice, I don't think I was totally clear in my last post.

What I meant was that a weekend spent learning how to use a gun seems really strange to some people. No matter what is taught, (and it sounds like a really good class for people who want to own a gun







) for some of us the very idea of taking a class that concerns the use of something that is primarily designed to take life feels strange and wrong (for us). But if you are going to own a gun, sounds like a crucial class to take.

Like you said, I think our different worldviews/povs really affects our ideas.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

Thank you zipperump-a-zoomum.

It was strange to me at first also, but it has proven to be a necessary evil.

I have read and heard from different sources (that probably have an agenda) that the first settlers to this country always carried guns, and left them outside the church when they went in to worship; not sure if that is true, but it is an illustration of different worldviews - different time, different needs, different ways of handling problems.

I do not want to be a victim, nor do I want to be defenseless.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *applejuice*
I do not want to be a victim, nor do I want to be defenseless.

Me neither









I think we all want the same ends, just have different means of getting there.
kaly


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## thundersweet (Feb 28, 2003)

Dh is a police offer so we have guns in the house. I am with some of the other posters. I would not live in a home without a gun. Period! It is sad to say as someone else pointed out that todays world is one we fear for our safety. I am not concerned with getting robbed. I am concerned about how I would protect my children if someone were coming to harm my family. Dh works night so we are home alone. I mean I guess for me its a little different. I fear a criminal my dh locked up or testified against in court coming after my family. It's rare but it does happen. Lets be honest, in most cases the person coming into your home knows that just because the alarm goes off they do not just send the police. They call first. It would actually be better to just have the alarm noise to scare someone off and call the police yourself rather than wait for the alarm comany to call and say "is this a false alarm" My dh says time and time again we do not really need it monitored if we are using it for safety purposes. It would be quicker to call the police myself.

Our alarm has gone off twice since living in the house. We have 3 motion detectors downstairs as well as all the doors and windows so our dogs have to stay upstairs at night. It is scary to be awaken by a loud alarm in the middle of the night. But I am so glad we have it even though both times they were false alarms. I am glad I do have protection in case one time it is not. What I have done in the past after literally bolting out of the bed is go grab my baby from the crib (dd is already in my room) and lock us all in the bedroom. I try and leave my dogs out in the hallway but all they do is howl. I would not just automatically wip ouy my gun. My dogs would give some clues someone was coming up the stairs.

What would you do if someone came into your home? Stand there with a baseball bat? Chances are if they are going to rob you they will do it when nobody is home. At least dh says that robberies mostly happen when you are not home. Robbers dont want you to be there. By chance if you are there and you confront them they will most likely HURT YOU OR KILL YOU! There have been alot of home invasions here is Atlanta Ga where the person is killed.

Its just my opinion so no flames please. It is such a personal decision. If you are going to have a gun in the house there is always a risk. But there is a risk in just about everything. Teach your kids about gun safety, keep them locked properly and take every single precaution you possibly can think of.


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

At work, I have been left with two classes to supervise so my partner can go home and meet the police who are ther to investigate why her home alarm has gone off...

These things affect everyone.

i am looking into putting in a system.

So so sad.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thundersweet*

What would you do if someone came into your home? Stand there with a baseball bat?

Personally, this is not something I spend time worrying about. Again, concious choice- I realize that approach is not for everyone.

My goal: to work throughout every avenue of my life to ensure that these things don't happen to me or others, to work with people who may commit a crime, or have done so in the past, to attempt to prevent crime before it is commited by addressing the root causes.

Kaly


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## CookieMonsterMommy (Oct 15, 2002)

I have not read all the posts (no need to, really). Just wanted to offer my thoughts re: the OP.

If my DH were to buy a gun and bring it into the house, I would take it, find the proper way to dispose of it (no, not re-sell it, dispose of it). End of story. If he brought another gun into the house, I would take my son and leave. Period.

I made that clear to ex-DP when he mentioned that he'd buy one--weekend class, month long class, whatever. I realize that this is unreasonable, but this is one issue that I will not negotiate. I also won't apologize for doing what I feel is protecting my family. I'm not suggesting that any of you do the same, just saying what I would do.

Best Wishes,
Kelly

PS-I would allow an antique/collectors gun (ie from the civil war or something) that was no longer working or was plugged up or something. So there's some leeway here.


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## thundersweet (Feb 28, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zipperump-a-zoomum*
My goal: to work throughout every avenue of my life to ensure that these things don't happen to me or others, to work with people who may commit a crime, or have done so in the past, to attempt to prevent crime before it is commited by addressing the root causes.
Kaly

I agree with that but you cannot control other people. You simply cannot know if someone you may be working with is capable. I definitely agree with not putting yourself in that situation but sometimes it has nothing to do with you or your actions. I dont by any means sit around all day worrying what if. I go about my day and dont think about it. But I am prepared if I ever am put in that situation.


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zipperump-a-zoomum*
dallaschildren, I don't mean to pick on what you have said, but I wanted to offer a different perspective. I hope you don't mind









I have never been burglarized, but I have been physically assaulted by a group of men who jumped out of a car and beat me up. I have also been raped. If I could redo either situation, I would not choose to have a gun with me.

I live in Baltimore, a city that has a fairly poor rep in terms of safety issues.

I very, very conciously choose not to be afraid. I say conciously because it was a lot of work at first. (Both the rape and the assault happened the summer before my freshman year at college- and I had a lot to work through.)

But for me, the effect of fear on my life and my psyche just isn't worth whatever benefits extra caution might confer. I choose to believe that the vast majority of humanity _wants_ to be good to others, _tries_ to be good to others.

I don't always lock my door; I give rides to the participants in my ged class; I do other things that some people consider downright recklous. But, for me, the quality of my life is greatly improved because I have choosen not to be afraid.

I will never own a gun, nor have one in my house, because I never want to shoot anything.

This works for me. I recognize that it doesn't work for everyone.
Kaly


Kaly,

First off I want to say I am sorry you were assaulted. You are a brave person to overcome what you have and I respect that.
I just wanted to make clear that I am in no way "afraid" on a daily basis. I am apprehensive and yes guarded, but afraid is not the reason we own guns. I was familiar with them prior to becoming a victim. I believe it is presumptious for anyone to equate fear with gun ownership. Is it true for some people, I'm sure it is. For me (and others) it is partly about being proactive. I do not rely on our guns to protect me. I rely on ME to protect ME. I also have many years of self defense training. That is an extension of me. Pulling a gun on someone would be the last thing I would do. If someone sets foot on my property without being invited, I reserve the right to use whatever means necessary to protect myself and my family. Whether it's a mean sounding dog, a security system, auxillary locks, guns, or thorny bushes by all the windows, all of us choose how best to protect ourselves. It's not about fear for me; it's about empowerment, strength, and confidence.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dallaschildren*
I believe it is presumptious for anyone to equate fear with gun ownership.

I got you. I certainly don't think that all gun owners are motivated by fear. Equally, those of us that are adamantly anti-gun are not all naive. I don't like the presumption that people who don't own guns have never experienced the violation of a crime against them, or that they "don't believe it can happen to them."

For me, empowerment comes from refusing to change how I live my life and my core beliefs about violence after having been assaulted.

Again, different means to the same end?

Kaly


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## mmace (Feb 12, 2002)

I'm the single mom of 3.5 kids, and I have guns in my house. There are two hunting guns that my H (don't really have anything else to call him, because we are still legally married) still has here in storage, and I have a handgun of my own. The guns are all in a locked cabinet, unloaded, with the ammo locked elsewhere. My kids know that they are never allowed to even touch the cabinet, let alone think of trying to open it.

My story is a bit different, guns are kept here for hunting, but they are also here for safety. The difference though, is that my family has a known threat. My sister has an ex-husband who is currently in state prison for the murder of his first wife. He sat on her chest, keeping her from her meds, while watching her slip into a diabetic coma and die. For 20 years he was a free man, until he finally confessed to it after attempting to kill my sister. He is in jail with no possiblitly of parole, but has always said he would escape and kill our entire family. If that ever happens, we would have approximately four hours before he could possibly get here, if the system works the way it is supposed to and we are notified right away. Would I ever want to kill another human being? No. Would I kill him if he came here and tried to hurt my family? Absolutely. Honestly, I think the probability of that ever happening is very, Very, VERY slim - but I am ready to protect my family if it ever comes down to it - not from some random stranger breaking into my house, I really have no worries about that, but from a known threat.


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## Mothra (Jun 4, 2002)

I can't believe that here, of all places, a mother is being told to IGNORE her instinct that having a gun in a home with small children is dangerous.

If you don't have a gun in your home, your child can't be accidentally shot by a gun you own. Period.

When I hear someone say that they have a gun for "protection", I know that I will never allow my children in their home. Ever. A gun that is kept for "protection" is not stored properly. If it was, it would be completely useless against an intruder.

At the age they are now, I would not allow them to spend time in a home with guns regardless of why the guns are kept. It is too dangerous. If my brothers and I played with guns when we were little, I have no reason to believe that my child wouldn't. I know that statistically my child is far more likely to be injured by a gun in an accident than by a criminal. Guns in the homes of our friends scare me a hell of a lot more than a burglar.


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## zipperump-a-zoomum (Jan 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mothra*
When I hear someone say that they have a gun for "protection", I know that I will never allow my children in their home. Ever.

I don't let my kids play in houses with guns, either. When they get older, I'll allow them to make that decision.

I think the op has already decided that they're going to keep the gun out of the house.

And actually, I kind of feel like I've hijacked her thread.







Sorry!

Kaly


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## applejuice (Oct 8, 2002)

I agree with you zipperump-a-zoomum.

When my DD, DS, DS, and DS were littler, I never let them go into anyone's home if I knew they had a gun/guns.

My children are grown now and I am all alone...so I am in a different situation, so I adjust.


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## newmommy (Sep 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mothra*
A gun that is kept for "protection" is not stored properly. If it was, it would be completely useless against an intruder.

I agree. Everyone would be dead by then...


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## Harper (Jul 10, 2003)

Quote:

When I hear someone say that they have a gun for "protection", I know that I will never allow my children in their home. Ever. A gun that is kept for "protection" is not stored properly. If it was, it would be completely useless against an intruder.










Quote:

for some of us the very idea of taking a class that concerns the use of something that is primarily designed to take life feels strange and wrong (for us).










Quote:

What would you do if someone came into your home? Stand there with a baseball bat?
Seems equally as effective as running around the house unlocking gun cabinets, reassembling guns and running someplace else to get the ammo and loading the gun and then shooting someone.


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## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

Quote:

What would you do if someone came into your home? Stand there with a baseball bat?
Heck yeah. Or a chair, or throw the contents of a pan from the stove, or kick over the computer desk or bookshelf in his path, or run out the back door, or or or. All of which are far more instinctive reactions to me than:

Quote:

running around the house unlocking gun cabinets, reassembling guns and running someplace else to get the ammo and loading the gun and then shooting someone.








and have the added benefit of reducing the chances that my children or I will be shot with our own gun to zero









Oh, and my comment about the weekend training course was meant to point out that to me, the idea of 48 hours of training to handle a weapon capable of (and _designed to do_) such huge damage in such a split second is absolutely ludicrous. More so if you asume that the weapon will be handled at a time when adrenalin is high.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Who told her to ignore her instincts? I may have missed that post.... Some of us were just discussing our own personal take on the issue. (And yes, I feel the need to apologize for any hijacking of this thread)

To the OP: by all means stick to what you feel is right. Discuss and debate with your Dh or whatever you need to do. Much luck in getting the issue resolved in a positive way.


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## Red (Feb 6, 2002)

I used toknow some people who belonged to a gun club. Some of the members stored their guns there, to avoid transporting them and to keep them handy. This might work for you.

If not, be smart. Trigger locks, safety on, no ammo stored IN THE HOUSE, ever. Ammo can be bought and used up, stored at a friends, kept in the smallest storage locker available, whatever. (So could the guns, be kept at a storage facility, I mean.) I grew up with guns in the house, 40 foster brothers and sisters. Everyone knew where the guns were, but I never saw, or was told of anyone who saw, any ammo, except for once! I just remembered that instant. My ffather once had a few bullets in his pocket! How safe was that? Anyway, no ammo, no accidents.

I didn't read this thread! Your a glutton for punishment, because this looks like it might take on a life of it's own.


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Red*
I used toknow some people who belonged to a gun club. Some of the members stored their guns there, to avoid transporting them and to keep them handy. This might work for you.


That's a terrific idea


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## dallaschildren (Jun 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zipperump-a-zoomum*
For me, empowerment comes from refusing to change how I live my life and my core beliefs about violence after having been assaulted.

Again, different means to the same end?

Kaly

I don't mean to be contrary...honestly...but I wonder how being assaulted as you were...how could that NOT change you in some way? (my statement is meant mostly as rhetorical and if you do not want to comment for personal reasons I totally understand). For example, I always lock my doors now and I keep the alarm on even while home. I go on about my day and don't dwell on it, but technically it changed me because I hardly ever locked my doors and never put the system on while at home, before. It is now second nature. It is automatic for me. It's relatively small in the grand scheme of things, but technically it changed me...I am more aware of my surroundings, of my neighbors, and of my "sixth" sense.
And yes, ITA with different means to the same end.


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## Past_VNE (Dec 13, 2003)

I know it has already been resolved for the OP, but I'll post my story anyway.

We are a gun-owning family. Always have been, always will be

For me, growing up, my mother kept a small cheap pistol in her nightstand, loaded. I was given no training and never told about it. I overheard its discussion once and then went and checked it out in secret. Thankfully, I was ALWAYS a very careful child.

DH grew up with a gun aficionado for a father. He collected various special guns...a WWI German Luger, a WWII Japanese something or other, he had many special and interesting guns. He also hunted and kept a few for protection. In his line of work, he was in scary places sometimes. He kept a pistol in his truck for that reason and for finishing off an animal if he injured it badly by hitting it.

I started DH when I was 16. His parents taught me proper gun handling, cleaning, safety, firing, etc. I have since practiced extensively and am competent with many sorts of arms.

I intend, in about 2 weeks, to exercise my right as an American citizen, to obtain a permit to carry a concealed weapon. How often will I carry? I don't know. That's neither here nor there. It is my right and rights which are not exercised are lost.

I believe in extreme care with children and guns.

My MIL tells a story about my DH. He was at a friends house when he was about five years old. The friend goes and gets a loaded gun to show the other kids. He had no training. Five year old DH takes the gun from the other child, unloads it, put the bullets in his pocket, returns the gun to the kid and tells him to put it away. He then gave the ammo to the parent when they arrived.









It's a call every family must make. I want my child to grow up educated and as a good shot. I also will protect him from his childish impulses.


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## SerenaWSU (Mar 5, 2006)

My husband's family has always been really big into guns. They dress up like cowboys and go shooting at a range and it has always been a big part of my husband's life.

Last Christmas his family bought him a gun. I was so furious that they did not ask me first. I have always been against having a gun in my house. Anyone else can have a gun in their house, I really don't care. I just don't want it in my house. I made his dad agree that he would keep it in his safe at their house and we were all happy.

However, several months ago, my husband's dad came over to take my husband to a gun show. I didn't have a problem with this as long as he didn't bring home a gun. My husband was upstairs fiddling with something and I mentioned something about why it was taking him such a long time. My husband's dad said he needed to get his gun. He had been keeping it at our house all along. I was so upset. I let them leave and I just cried.

When he came home I spoke with him. He lied and said that he had said that he had told me a long time ago that it was there. We had a big fight and it was unresolved. Pretty much anytime I have a problem with something it never gets fixed but that's another issue.

We got into another fight last month about the gun and I went looking for it. I found it in my computer desk in the locked drawer. I picked it up and noticed that it was loaded. There was no reason to have a loaded gun in our house. He lied again and said that he had already told me where the gun was.

I really did not want a gun in our house and I made a deal that he could buy a motorcycle (we are tight on cash so that was really the only thing holding us back) if he got rid of the gun.

He bought the motorcycle but then said he had never agreed to our deal. The gun remains in our house and I'm at my wit ends. I just can't stay in this house and I feel like he would choose it over me. We've been together 9 years now and I just don't know what to do.


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## Snowdrift (Oct 15, 2005)

Quick comment to those who have commented that a house that keeps guns "for protection" is never safe. In many cases this may be true; the house may not be safe for a child familiar with guns. But there are a lot of new technologies out there, particualrly biometrics. A friend of ours has good reason to have loaded handguns very handy.

He has biometric/digital combination safes, one in the bedroom, one near the door. To open them requires a thumbprint from him or his wife and a 4-digit code punched into a keypad. It takes less thana second for him to acces, his wife a fraction of a second longer, and it cannot be opened by anyone else. Should the biometric device fail, the 4 digit code is also required. He changes the code once a month.

Pretty safe.

DH and I are gun owners too. We do not have them accessable for protection but hope to move to a more isolated area at which time we will reevaluate and obtain the necessary equipment. I hunt, he target shoots and we both shoot clay pigeons. I got mine first.


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## MomInFlux (Oct 23, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SerenaWSU*
My husband's family has always been really big into guns. They dress up like cowboys and go shooting at a range and it has always been a big part of my husband's life.

Last Christmas his family bought him a gun. I was so furious that they did not ask me first. I have always been against having a gun in my house. Anyone else can have a gun in their house, I really don't care. I just don't want it in my house. I made his dad agree that he would keep it in his safe at their house and we were all happy.

However, several months ago, my husband's dad came over to take my husband to a gun show. I didn't have a problem with this as long as he didn't bring home a gun. My husband was upstairs fiddling with something and I mentioned something about why it was taking him such a long time. My husband's dad said he needed to get his gun. He had been keeping it at our house all along. I was so upset. I let them leave and I just cried.

When he came home I spoke with him. He lied and said that he had said that he had told me a long time ago that it was there. We had a big fight and it was unresolved. Pretty much anytime I have a problem with something it never gets fixed but that's another issue.

We got into another fight last month about the gun and I went looking for it. I found it in my computer desk in the locked drawer. I picked it up and noticed that it was loaded. There was no reason to have a loaded gun in our house. He lied again and said that he had already told me where the gun was.

I really did not want a gun in our house and I made a deal that he could buy a motorcycle (we are tight on cash so that was really the only thing holding us back) if he got rid of the gun.

He bought the motorcycle but then said he had never agreed to our deal. The gun remains in our house and I'm at my wit ends. I just can't stay in this house and I feel like he would choose it over me. We've been together 9 years now and I just don't know what to do.

With all due respect, you don't have a gun problem. You have a relationship problem









And







to MDC!


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