# "The family bed destroys married life"



## annmartina

You've probably heard something that goes like this: "Sure, co-sleeping might be great for the baby, but it takes a toll on your marriage (or partnership)." Sometimes it's not stated but you get the same vibes -- as though you MUST CHOOSE between a fulfilling marriage (and sex life) and a happy baby.

(I do not mean to be judgemental. I know wonderful people with medical and other good reasons for not co-sleeping, so I am more directing this query at our culture in general than at any one family's sleeping arrangements.)

I suspect the assumed choice between baby and marriage is one of the biggest factors in families choosing not to co-sleep. I have friends who weren't even allowed into their parent's room during the day because of the perceived need to protect the sacredness of their parent's marriages. While that is more extreme than not allowing your child into your room at night, it's still an extension of the same idea.

I am fearful of the consequences for a child who grows up believing that his needs are in direct competition with his parent's marriage. Often, the continuation of the parents' relationship is part of the child's own sense of security, so wouldn't a child who believes her very existence threatens her parents' union feel some pressure not to express all her needs, or to learn how express them in manipulative ways?

We have been presented with a terrible (and I believe false) choice. Our marriage or the baby. One must be sacrificed every night.

It's a false choice because it's based on the idea that our lives can be neatly (with medical precision) divided into different personas which must be addressed in turn. While we all have many different roles, and obviously switch between them, I feel the idea of 'protecting the marriage bed' goes farther than asking us to switch between roles. _It asks us to switch between personas._ It requires us to stop being a mother in order to be a wife -- but I feel being a wife and mother are two different and important roles acted out by the SAME person.

In every relationship, there is a balance between separateness and oneness, between individuality and community. But I do not believe that I have to pretend not to be married in order to achieve that balance in my relationship with my spouse. When we hide the baby in another room, are we are pretending not to have a child?

I believe we can balance these roles without viewing them as competing personas. I go out alone with girlfriends when I need a break, we get a sitter for our little one when my husband and I need a date, we set aside adult time in the evening to be together elsewhere in the house while the baby sleeps in our bed. I'm one person with many roles and I don't have to sacrifice anything.

In addition, how much healthier is it for our children to see us model a balanced lifestyle, meeting our own needs and theirs, without creating a scenario in which people must compete with each other for a limited amount of affection and attention?

In conclusion, if your marriage can't survive a baby in your bed at night, it probably can't survive a baby in your life during the day. One hundred percent of what goes on between us and our spouses that builds or detracts from the happiness of our marriages happens during our waking hours, not when we're sleeping soundly at night. But that is not true of our young children, many of whom need us close at night and need us to learn, for their sakes, how to balance our different roles without sacrificing a part of ouselves.


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## AlmostAPpropriate

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annmartina* 
One hundred percent of what goes on between us and our spouses that builds or detracts from the happiness of our marriages happens during our waking hours, not when we're sleeping soundly at night. But that is not true of our young children, many of whom need us close at night and need us to learn, for their sakes, how to balance our different roles without sacrificing a part of ouselves.

I agree with most of your post but that last bit was not quite on target for me. My husband is away most of the day. Much of our evening hours are consumed with kid oriented activities & I need to be asleep early enough to allow for dawn wake up calls. So, no, 100 of our marriage nurturing does not happen during the day.

I think you do have to sacrifice a bit in order to co-sleep. Is it a marriage destroying amount, no, not in a healty marriage. When my kids were in bed with me our sex life required a bit more creativity. There were times when, yeah sex sounded good but not good enough to go thru the process of extricating myself from bed at 2 am and moving to another room, etc...

Now that DH & I have our bed to ourselves again, sex is more spontaneous. It often happens in the middle of the night, after Ive slept enough to have the energy for it. I wake to delicious sensations and it progresses from there - fluidly. That just isnt possible with a baby, much less a preschooler, in bed. I do in fact look forward to when my children have vacated our room at night, not just our bed.

I do think it's interesting that you mention the stability of the marriage affecting the child since Ive often seen comments here stating that a partner refusing to cosleep or share a room is something of a deal breaker....


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## norajune'smama

well, i can't figure out how to quote...but the part about the child competing with the marriage is well said. and, as a child of divorce (because of mental illness) i can say from experience, it makes a lot of sense.
i guess i'm just lucky. of the other couples that we know that co-sleep, the dads hate it but the mamas are adament. the dads are good friends of dh and gave him an earful. so, he was open to it from the start (because he knows how much i research) but i was braced for the time when he got tired of it. the opposite has happened, dd went from sleeping between me and the wall to between the two of us, and we're both very happy.
that being said, yes, it's a bit of a compromise. we find other places to have sex. but we also don't fall asleep talking anymore and i thought that was really special.
i guess i just feel like the years the kids are in our bed are still such a small percentage of our parenting and our marriage yet can do SO much good. it's totatlly worth it to us.


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## petra_william

Quote:


Originally Posted by *norajune'smama* 
i guess i just feel like the years the kids are in our bed are still such a small percentage of our parenting and our marriage yet can do SO much good. it's totatlly worth it to us.

i totally agree... contrary to popular belief they are not going to co sleep for ever lol and those few years they do are nothing compared to a whole lifetime really.


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## clavicula

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlmostAPpropriate* 
Is it a marriage destroying amount, no, not in a healty marriage.









: So true!


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## the_lissa

I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.


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## umami_mommy

:

right, because mom getting up 6 times in the middle of the night to feed the baby doesn't affect her ability (or desire) to stay awake for sex you know.


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## crunchymomofmany

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annmartina* 
In conclusion, if your marriage can't survive a baby in your bed at night, it probably can't survive a baby in your life during the day. One hundred percent of what goes on between us and our spouses that builds or detracts from the happiness of our marriages happens during our waking hours, not when we're sleeping soundly at night. But that is not true of our young children, many of whom need us close at night and need us to learn, for their sakes, how to balance our different roles without sacrificing a part of ouselves.

Well said!

And on a lighter note...why does most of America believe that sex has to take place in the bed? Really, folks, let's get a little more creative - there are other rooms in the house!


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## Juvysen

I think it makes our marriage more exciting because we *have* to find somewhere else to have sex







Before it was always just bed, bed, boring bed


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## pcasylum

Exactly! Um, there are other places to have sex! In fact, we have added so much spice to our married life by finding creative spots all over the place! I find it way more fun than just the ol' roll over and go at it, LOL! I'm sorry, but once I'm in bed I'm sleeping, lol!!!


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.


I hear this sentiment a lot around here. I am one of those people









I am a person who gets more "into" it when I am in a safe, comfortable place. The brain is the biggest sex organ, after all, and mine works best in my personal bedroom.

We've been cosleeping for 7+ years. And, yes, it has taken a toll on our intimacy. Our marriage has survived, but we are very much looking forward to the days when both of our dc are sleeping in their own beds!


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## WeasleyMum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
I think it makes our marriage more exciting because we *have* to find somewhere else to have sex







Before it was always just bed, bed, boring bed










Quote:


Originally Posted by *Baby_Makes_5* 
Exactly! Um, there are other places to have sex! In fact, we have added so much spice to our married life by finding creative spots all over the place! I find it way more fun than just the ol' roll over and go at it, LOL! I'm sorry, but once I'm in bed I'm sleeping, lol!!!

Not just location, but what about *time*? Who are these people who take all night to make love? Maybe we're just lame, but for me and DH, our night is like 1/2-hour of sex, with eight of just cuddling/sleeping/etc. (Sorry, babe, I mean, "an hour".







) Although we don't have a baby yet, I don't see why-- assuming we both even *want* to DTD, which I understand could not even be the case-- how hard could it be to put Baby somewhere else for that short time, and bring her back for the rest of the night?

I guess what I'm wondering is, how many couple's pre-baby "marriage bed" is just all sex, all night long? 'Cause ours is like Sexy Bed for a little bit, but Cuddly Bed Where a Baby Could Fit Right In like 95% of the time... (And I think we're not so different than the norm as far as that goes!)


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## NiteNicole

Quote:

And on a lighter note...why does most of America believe that sex has to take place in the bed? Really, folks, let's get a little more creative - there are other rooms in the house
I think the reality is that for most couples, one or more person works all day away from the home, often late into the evening. When that person comes home, the "bedtime machine" usually starts for one or more kids and by the time all that is done it's bedtime and really the only time most couples get together is when they go to bed at night so bed makes the most logical sense because that's where you are.


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WeasleyMum* 
how hard could it be to put Baby somewhere else for that short time, and bring her back for the rest of the night?

This wasn't possible for either of my babies. They didn't transfer easily. Rule #1 in our house--don't mess with a sleeping baby!


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## chaoticzenmom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.

That's what I was thinking. Plus, Hello? That's what a guest bed, or some blankets next to the fireplace are for.LOL Cosleeping actually helped our intimate relationship by getting us OUT of the bed, or at least out of sleep mode and into fun mode when we had to go make a place just for intimacy.


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## AlmostAPpropriate

Of course you can have sex in other places. We did for nearly 4 years. But there is something special about being woken or waking your partner in the middle of the night, getting all heated up, and the letting it happen where you are. Without having to stop and think about it.

When DS was still in our bed I would feel DH initiate and I couldnt just go with it - I had to put my sensuality on hold long enough to manouver myself away from DS without him waking, sometimes requiring several attempts, and then get out of our warm bed and into another room. Sometimes it could take 5-10 minutes. By that time my arousal had faded a bit. And sometimes I wasnt horny enough to make it worth the effort. And then as we DTD I couldnt stop myself from keeping an ear out to hear if DS had noticed I was gone.

Now, if DH initiates, it happens very smoothly and I enjoy it more. No thinking, just feeling. So yeah, we still had a good sex life while Co-Sleeping. But sex without any planning involved is amazing - for me anyway.


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## the_lissa

We have A LOT of sex without planning involved too, just not during sleep time hours. In fact, it is rare for us to be in bed, want to have sex and then move. Once I go to bed, I want to sleep. It is mostly in the evenings after the kids go to bed. Now that the kids are older, we can manage day time stuff too. Even before kids, we didn't always have sex in bed, and we almost never had sex during sleep time hours too.


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## Twinklefae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlmostAPpropriate* 
Of course you can have sex in other places. We did for nearly 4 years. But there is something special about being woken or waking your partner in the middle of the night, getting all heated up, and the letting it happen where you are. Without having to stop and think about it.

Not to get to far OT, but REALLY? If DF ever tried that with me, he'd be sleeping on the sofa for a month. I can't even imagine. Sex before sleep is okay, but why on earth would you WAKE SOMEONE UP????? Am I missing something? I don't like being woke up for anything... waking me up for sex is ..







:

That said, we love our new futon.


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## Francie

I always love those people that find out we co-sleep and actually have all three children in our bed by morning and are still shock that we have 3 kids under 5.
It doesn't take a bed to have sex- it takes a happily married committed couple to have sex. NO bed needed- And actually sometime we like the idea that we leave them all safe and sound in the bed- and go someplace else (in the house) and have sex.
Just my 2 cents


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## AlmostAPpropriate

wow, maybe it is just us. I love middle of the night sex, its my favorite. In the evenings Im just so wipes all i want to do is sleep! But once Ive had 4-5 hrs of sleep I have rested enough to be up for it, and Im all drowsy, relaxed, not thinking about household stuff. I love it. leisurely lovemaking sessions were rare when DS was still in our bed.
That said, we still use some of our old fave spots from our cosleeping days, places we probably wouldnt have thought of otherwise, so that was a fringe benefit of having DS in bed with us.


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## pcasylum

I have to agree with the pp. If my dh *ever* woke me up to initiate sex I would not be amused. At all. Sleep is a precious commodity around here! When I'm in bed, I am sleeping. Period. Even before children. But before bedtime, during the day, whenever? No problem. My dh is fine with that, because A: He wants to sleep at night too, and B: I'm so accomodating the rest of the time as far as our "us" time. LOL!


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## crissei

Sleeping in a bed with my child no more affects my marriage than sleeping in a bed with my husband affects my personal identity.


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## wombatclay

I think our marriage, at least the sexual aspect, has been "hit" more by plain old sleep deprivation than co-sleeping. I love co-sleeping, dh loves co-sleeping, the girls love co-sleeping. I've never felt like I couldn't have sex in my own bed just because my little ones are there too... ok, yes, we're not talking extreme acrobatic wild monkey love here of course (for that there is the couch, armchair, poang, floor, shower, garden, kitchen, etc). My kiddos are only 3yo and 11mo so I can't say how I'll feel in a few years... but for now it's not an issue in terms of killing desire or needing to get out of bed for a quick re-connect.

Now, sleep deprivation... that's a whole different story! And it would most certainly be worse if I had been getting out of bed every 3 hours, every night, for the last 3 years. So really co-sleeping has improved our chances of getting some intimate time together since it's one of the few times DH and I are in the same place, at the same time, without the need to check on the girls or even think about other stuff.

I guess in general I agree that a marriage that is strong enough to survive children is strong enough to survive co-sleeping. And my personal opinion is that children and co-sleeping both have the potential to make that marriage relationship stronger rather than weaker.


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## llamalluv

Honestly - DH and I have NO kids, and I'm a SAHW right now, but we still have to PLAN sex. I have fibromyalgia, and if I knock myself out running errands and mopping the floors, washing laundry (I have to climb two full flights of stairs to get to the laundry room in our building) - we aren't going to have sex. Period. I'm just too tired and sore. So DH will give me a little wink and nudge in the morning, and I know that, *for today*, I will not do laundry or mop the floors.









I can forsee that even if we weren't planning on co-sleeping or "rooming in" with our babies, we would have to "schedule" sex. Between feedings, diaper changes, rocking the baby to sleep, cleaning the apartment, running errands, cooking dinner, etc - I'm going to be TIRED when DH gets home - even if I didn't have FMS.


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## llamalluv

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchymomofmany* 
Well said!

And on a lighter note...why does most of America believe that sex has to take place in the bed? Really, folks, let's get a little more creative - there are other rooms in the house!









Some of us have health issues that make it the only place we can. Believe me, I've TRIED!







But when you have a painful cluster of raw nerves across the back of your pelvis (so laying on anything hard is out) and bad knees (so kneeling is out), in bed is the only place that works.









Plus....that's where all my *stuff* is plugged in at....


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## Norasmomma

You know before DD was born I had heard "horror" stories of baby sleeps with mom and dad, parents sex lives end and I totally bought it. I even said "well the baby won't sleep with us." Which was really against pretty much everything I truly believe in as a parent(but this was before I was a parent really). I had no idea what it was like to be a sleep deprived momma just wanting some rest, plus I had a c/s and that made us have to move a bed downstairs and so DD couldn't sleep in her crib, so she slept with us, and it just kept happening. We even bought a new bed because we were uncomfortable and worried about our cruddy old mattress. DD still sleeps with us every night and I really don't know when that will end, and you know what I don't really care.

I remember a friend saying that another couple I know wanted to have another baby, but they just could never DTD because their DD was in bed with them, I believed her at the time, now I scoff at that, you can't find another place? I have to agree with the PP's that the biggest thing that kills a sex life after a child is SLEEP DEPRIVATION, I can say that this has been a big factor for DH and me, we're both freaking tired. When 9pm hits all I want to do is go to bed and sleep. DH uses this time to have some alone time, that's just life.

My step-sis is one of those co-sleep *haters* she is always saying that DD will never leave the bed, she'll sleep with us forever. She also measured every oz of her son's food and fed on a schedule, so I definitely don't agree with her parenting style, and it's really none of hers(or anyones) business what is happening in my household sleep routine. I love that DD sleep with us, sometimes she can drive us crazy but most of the time it's wonderful, and if we *really* need our bed to DTD, we let her get up on Sat. am and watch a DVD, and get our time alone.


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## chfriend

thus the origin of the nookie bed.......


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## RomanGoddess

Haven't read all the post but wanted to say, I do know of marriages that broke apart in large part because the couple basically gave 100 percent to the kids and had no intimate time (they co-slept).

I do think that co-sleeping means that a couple makes sacrifices when it comes to intimacy. People often say that you can "do it anywhere" but well, first of all, my DH works all day and we don't get a lot other other moments besides in bed and secondly, I don't equate intimacy with just sex. That time spent alone in bed, cuddling, sharing thoughts, worries, etc., some of that is just plain lost when you have a kid lying between you or beside the bed.

I also do believe that it is not a question of the kids taking second place to the marriage. I think the kids' best interests DEPEND on a good relationship between husband and wife. I don't think any child would prefer to live in a home where mommy and daddy have lost touch with each other.


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## AlmostAPpropriate

nookie bed... funny... We used the guest room a lot.

Wombatclay made an excellent point. it doesnt matter if your kid is in a crib in a sound proof room across the hall - if you are too tired you are too tired. So I will qualify my prior post by clarifying that that was all once I was past the too tired to breathe stage...


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## pcasylum

I guess maybe it's just individual to the couple as to how they get their "together time." Even before kids, my husband and I connected outside of bed. Our cuddling and together time to talk or whatever was always on the couch. When we got to bed, it was to sleep. Always. I can't connect with my husband if I'm falling asleep, which is what I do when I get into a bed, lol!

We've gotten to the point where we have more ... umm ... interludes now with 3 kids than we ever did with no kids, and we're 110% convinced it's because we've learned to be creative since there are kids in our bed. I have a Body By Jake ab machine that no one uses but I can't get rid of because it's "special" to my firstborn son. He doesn't know it, but we do. LOL!!


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
That time spent alone in bed, cuddling, sharing thoughts, worries, etc., some of that is just plain lost when you have a kid lying between you or beside the bed..


I agree....but I will qualify that we've only experienced this problem while cosleeping with an older child. In our experience, cosleeping with a 7 yo presents entirely different challenges than cosleeping with a baby or toddler.


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## LianneM

OH, that middle-of-the-night sex is THE BEST EVER







DH agrees too. Sometimes I wake him and sometimes he wakes me, but it's definitely the best







Co-sleeping hasn't hindered us at all though







I love cosleeping but I think my DH may even love it more







he feels so connected to our DS and has told me on many occasions how glad he is that I learned about it and stuff


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## LianneM

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
That time spent alone in bed, cuddling, sharing thoughts, worries, etc., some of that is just plain lost when you have a kid lying between you or beside the bed.

That hasn't been true AT ALL for us. Our DS falls asleep best if we are talking quietly to each other. It's like a security knowing mama and daddy are right there, he can hear our voices, and he just goes to sleep next to us.


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## the_lissa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
.

I do think that co-sleeping means that a couple makes sacrifices when it comes to intimacy. People often say that you can "do it anywhere" but well, first of all, my DH works all day and we don't get a lot other other moments besides in bed and secondly, I don't equate intimacy with just sex. That time spent alone in bed, cuddling, sharing thoughts, worries, etc., some of that is just plain lost when you have a kid lying between you or beside the bed.


Yeah and none of that has to take place in bed. My partner and I do that on the couch together in the evenings. We also do it in bed, kids or not.


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## the_lissa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Baby_Makes_5* 
I guess maybe it's just individual to the couple as to how they get their "together time." Even before kids, my husband and I connected outside of bed. Our cuddling and together time to talk or whatever was always on the couch. When we got to bed, it was to sleep. Always. I can't connect with my husband if I'm falling asleep, which is what I do when I get into a bed, lol!

We've gotten to the point where we have more ... umm ... interludes now with 3 kids than we ever did with no kids, and we're 110% convinced it's because we've learned to be creative since there are kids in our bed. I have a Body By Jake ab machine that no one uses but I can't get rid of because it's "special" to my firstborn son. He doesn't know it, but we do. LOL!!

I agree.


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
Yeah and none of that has to take place in bed. My partner and I do that on the couch together in the evenings. We also do it in bed, kids or not.

The more I read, the more I think our experience is due to our particular child.

Our child does not fall asleep in our room until we are going to bed. If we try to chat in the evening, she is _right there_ adding her input









Our child will come look for us if we leave the bed and she awakens after she falls asleep. So there would be no nookie on the exercise equiptment, even if we had any









Our child also is a really lousy sleeper









When our child sleeps in her own bed (which she has done intermittently over the years, but not with any regularity....just enough that we know what we are missing), we can close our door and have sweet, golden *privacy*. That is exactly what we are missing out on by cosleeping with an older child--privacy. Our room is respected as a private space (knock before you enter), but it is the only room respected as such. So, when she is always _in there_, we have no place that we can relax an assume that we won't be disturbed









Anyway, I just really find the "can't you find anywhere better to do it?" comments extremely unhelpful. I guess if your kid actually falls asleep and stays in bed predictably, then cosleeping wouldn't hinder intimacy. But not all kids are so cooperative, and some families really do struggle with this issue.


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## the_lissa

Well, yes, but if your kid is like that, that is not the fault of cosleeping. It is the personality of your child.

Cosleeping or not, I need that break I get from my children when they go to bed at 7.


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## Incubator

Quote:


Originally Posted by *llamalluv* 

Plus....that's where all my *stuff* is plugged in at....































:


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## chfriend

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 
The I guess if your kid actually falls asleep and stays in bed predictably, then cosleeping wouldn't hinder intimacy. But not all kids are so cooperative, and some families really do struggle with this issue.

sunnmama...I really get this...dd1 just started sleeping in her own room a couple of months ago. I still lay down with her at night and squish her awake in the morning. She said she moved because she slept better.

She asks me to read in the hall while she's falling asleep.

Honestly, for me, the lack of sleep is a much bigger problem in intimacy than finding a location. Nurturing the intimacy with dp is essential with the challenges of a sensory kid. All kinds of intimacy.

Sometimes we stay up too late just because we want to talk.

Dp calls me at work sometimes if the kids give her a minute. When both kids are occupied happily for a space and we are together, we call it a date. Sometimes the kids are willing to stay with a friend or at a friend/sitter's house and we go home and dtd.

We've joked that's why we have a van, but haven't become quite that desparate







Yet.

We have a friend with a similarly engaged child....we have recently offered to have a playdate with her son at our house when her dh is home from work wink wink....We moms gotta stick together on this.


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chfriend* 
We have a friend with a similarly engaged child....we have recently offered to have a playdate with her son at our house when her dh is home from work wink wink....We moms gotta stick together on this.

Oh, we've done that!

Our church once had a "parent's night out", where you pay a few bucks and drop off the kids as a fundraiser for something. Dd had a great time; we went home and dtd.


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## wombatclay

I guess one thing that may make a difference here is socio-cultural meanings to the word "privacy"...

Some cultural groups value "auditory" privacy (they can't be overheard, so it's "private" even if there is an uncovered ground floor window for example) while others value "visual" privacy (so a seperate room but one in which you can still "hear everything" from outside)... and others value a combination of the two. Some groups feel that you need to be physically isolated to have privacy, others don't.

When I was little I shared a room (not a bed) with everyone in my family till I was about 6yo. Then I shared a room with just my younger brother till I was about 12yo. From 12-17 I did have my own space but then I went to college and tah-dah! A roommate. After college I shared apartments with roommates and my now-DH. Once children arrived we added them into the mix. Our current home only has two real rooms... a "living room" and a "sleeping room". So even if our children weren't in the same bed, they'd be in the same room. It has never felt like we lacked privacy...

But that could be because of the socio-cultural context within which we both grew up... privacy simply never meant "A Space Into Which No One Else is Allowed".


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## major_mama11

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay* 
I think our marriage, at least the sexual aspect, has been "hit" more by plain old sleep deprivation than co-sleeping.

My thoughts exactly. Sleep deprivation keeps me from feeling like middle-of-night fun much more than co-sleeping. Afternoon naptime is usually the only time when dh and I are both awake enough to play!


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## annmartina

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay* 
Some cultural groups value "auditory" privacy (they can't be overheard, so it's "private" even if there is an uncovered ground floor window for example) while others value "visual" privacy (so a seperate room but one in which you can still "hear everything" from outside)... and others value a combination of the two. Some groups feel that you need to be physically isolated to have privacy, others don't.

That is really, really interesting!!! I always thought the entire argument against co-sleeping is very elitist on top of being culturally subjective. Few people in the world have the luxury of a dwelling place with multiple rooms . . . for so many families, that is just reality. Obviously babies keep getting born, so those parents are making it work. When people insist that their marriage or sex life would suffer terribly if there was a child in their bed, I am reminded of how many luxuries we take for granted.


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## umami_mommy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annmartina* 
That is really, really interesting!!! I always thought the entire argument against co-sleeping is very elitist on top of being culturally subjective. Few people in the world have the luxury of a dwelling place with multiple rooms . . . for so many families, that is just reality. Obviously babies keep getting born, so those parents are making it work. When people insist that their marriage or sex life would suffer terribly if there was a child in their bed, I am reminded of how many luxuries we take for granted.


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## clothdipemomof2boy

if people ask me if co sleeping has destroyed our sex life I always sy nope we are just creative. I also throw in there which i am sure to them is TMI but it gets them to shut up, we didnt concieve either of our children in the bed so why should we have sex in our bed now hehehe


----------



## bdoody11

Quote:


Originally Posted by *honeybeedreams* 







:

right, because mom getting up 6 times in the middle of the night to feed the baby doesn't affect her ability (or desire) to stay awake for sex you know.

Absolutely!

Co-sleeping doesn't effect my sex life, it's being exhausted all the time! If my DD STTN I would happily get it on 6x a week in our guest room.









We can be creative when it comes to finding time/space, but mustering up energy after waking over and over, that's where I'm at a loss.

(My marriage is fine, BTW. Yes, we don't have sex often due to the issues above, but at least we can laugh about it and say "this too shall pass".)


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay* 
.. privacy simply never meant "A Space Into Which No One Else is Allowed".

So, when people talk about having sex in creative places outside the family bedroom, these are places that the children are likely to walk in on them?

I am aware that privacy standards vary from culture to culture. But I live in _this_ culture, where it is frowned upon to have sex in the same room as your 7 yo.


----------



## wombatclay

I'll answer since I was quoted









Quote:

So, when people talk about having sex in creative places outside the family bedroom, these are places that the children are likely to walk in on them?

I am aware that privacy standards vary from culture to culture. But I live in this culture, where it is frowned upon to have sex in the same room as your 7 yo.
I think most people would say that they would certainly hope they're not walked in on... but that "walking in upon" is obviously possible no matter where you are. Bedroom or kitchen, someone can always "walk in on you" if there isn't a locked door. So... while I wouldn't say "likely" I would certainly agree with "possible".

And as to culture... even within a single nation (say the US) there is a wiiiiiiiide range of cultural norms. I'm pretty sure most Americans would agree that having sex "in front of" a 7 year old (meaning an awake, aware child) is wrong. I'm not sure that having sex "in the same room" as that 7yo is the same thing. I know plenty of families that live in lofts or studio spaces (and we're one of those families)... those parents are having sex "in the same room" as their children. I don't see the problem?

I apologize for getting a little further astray from the main subject of the thread... but I do think this conversation applies! I've often thought that the "debate" over co-sleeping has a very strong connection to how the individuals involved define privacy.


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay* 
I know plenty of families that live in lofts or studio spaces (and we're one of those families)... those parents are having sex "in the same room" as their children. I don't see the problem?
.

I was comfortable having sex in the same room as my sleeping 3 yo. If a 3 yo happened to wake up, it wouldn't be such a big deal. My dd is 7, and knows _all about_ sex. That changed things for me.

I am not debating the merits of cosleeping. I _cosleep_ with my 7 yo and my 16 mo. But we also have found (no theoreticals) that it comes at a cost to our intimacy--even just spending time alone together chatting. When dd sleeps in her own room, dp and I enjoy a different quality of intimacy.


----------



## wombatclay

I know you're not debating the merits







... hope it didn't sound like I was saying that. And I certainly understand things changing with a child's age/understanding...

But I also know that regardless of how old my kiddos get, we only have the one sleeping space and there are no interior doors at all (even the bathroom is a curtain). It's a question that get's bounced around the small house thread a lot... not just in terms of partner intimacy of course... but the family bed is part of it.

It's not something I think of in a "things should be like this" way... personal privacy is personal privacy, and not something an outside force is likely to change. It's just my own opinion that comments like the OP is responding to have a lot to do with where individuals draw their own privacy boundaries. Co-sleeping was the norm till fairly recently, and remains the norm in some groups. And until recently/in different cultural settings "privacy" means something different that "a room of your own". So I think it's part or the whole co-sleeping vs intimacy discussion. If intimacy requires privacy and privacy = a space set apart specifically for intimate relations only then co-sleeping certainly will impact that (positive or negative, the impact will be there!) but if privacy = visual/auditory seperation but not necessarily a completely seperate dedicated space then the impact is very different.

If that makes sense? I know I'm sort of rambling a bit and I don't want to hijack the thread completely!


----------



## the_lissa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 
But we also have found (no theoreticals) that it comes at a cost to our intimacy--even just spending time alone together chatting. When dd sleeps in her own room, dp and I enjoy a different quality of intimacy.

But it sounds to me like it isn't about cosleeping, but that your dd won't sleep by herself.


----------



## ShaggyDaddy

sleeping in a pile as a family of 4 is like a sleep-over with all of my favorite people every night. It isn't the exact same thing as before we had kids, but c'mon it is my life now and it is great. Inflexable things break, having this strict idea in mind that bedtime is some inflexable unbreakable bond between the partners seems like an ideal that is destined to fail eventually.

I mean, we can't dtd on our bed in the middle of the night anymore. We also can't watch horror movies in the living room, or go to smokey dives to watch local punk bands. There was lots of stuff we couldn't do before we had kids that we can do now. I am willing to trade a lot for my kids, but an intimate relationship with my wife isn't one of those things I had to give up... We just had to change things up a little. Different, not worse.


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
But it sounds to me like it isn't about cosleeping, but that your dd won't sleep by herself.

I guess so







It didn't "click" with me until this past year that most cosleeping children actually went to bed before the parents, and not with the parents. Oh, how I wish!


----------



## ShwarmaQueen

Well all I have to say is that those people who only have sex in bed probably have the most boring sex lives (missionary only!)...UGGhh!
We used to never move our little one once she was sleeping, but now that she's older and sleeps more soundly, we can move her to where ever if we want the bedroom, then move her back.
Has anyone slept apart from their little one(s) and felt lonely and worried the whole night about him/her? I can't even imagine that feeling for a mood-killer, all the time!


----------



## orangefoot

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 
But we also have found (no theoreticals) that it comes at a cost to our intimacy--even just spending time alone together chatting.

We live in a small 2 bed house with a teen and a pre-teen in one bedroom and dh and I with a 5 yo and 20mo in the other bedroom. Sometimes we have a hard time getting five minutes quiet to talk to each other without interruption let alone do anything else.

Shwarma - when you have older kids in the house, sometimes doing it in bed can be the safest place and it doesn't mean you have a boring sex life!! This afternoon our 14yo was out on his bike, our 11yo was gaming and listening to You Tube (at my suggestion







) and the girls were outside in the garden. The bedroom was empty and the bed had only me and dh in it. Pure bliss for the 10 mins it took for the little ones to come and find us.


----------



## Kiddoson

Quote:


Originally Posted by *petra_william* 
i totally agree... contrary to popular belief they are not going to co sleep for ever lol and those few years they do are nothing compared to a whole lifetime really.









:
FTR my DH loves co-sleeping with DS. wouldn't have it another way.


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ShwarmaQueen* 
Well all I have to say is that those people who only have sex in bed probably have the most boring sex lives (missionary only!)...UGGhh!









Why would you assume that?

Just maybe it is the wild nature of our sex life that makes the privacy of our bedroom so appreciated!


----------



## sunnymw

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Twinklefae* 
Not to get to far OT, but REALLY? If DF ever tried that with me, he'd be sleeping on the sofa for a month. I can't even imagine. Sex before sleep is okay, but why on earth would you WAKE SOMEONE UP????? Am I missing something? I don't like being woke up for anything... waking me up for sex is ..







:

That said, we love our new futon.

















This only applies on weekends since DH works 3rd shift, but yeah... once I'm asleep, don't even BREATHE in my general direction!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
That time spent alone in bed, cuddling, sharing thoughts, worries, etc., some of that is just plain lost when you have a kid lying between you or beside the bed.

We haven't had any issues with this so far (again, on weekends... when DH is home and sleeps w/ us). Then again DS is a fairly good sleeper too.

And as far as sex goes, for some reason this pregnancy the only thing that works for me is DTD in the bed (mostly missionary style, ironically enough). Otherwise it's pretty hard to get into it, and sometimes painful... SO, we either wait until DS is passed out... or napping (he naps on the couch/recliner/wherever he passes out). Worst case, if it's been a week or so, DS spends an afternoon shopping with GMIL









Would we have sex more often if we weren't co-sleeping? (And DH worked 1st shift like normal folks, lol)... probably not. Because it isn't co-sleeping that puts a damper on my libido... it's pregnancy, exhaustion, and just plain being a mama.


----------



## AlmostAPpropriate

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ShwarmaQueen* 
Well all I have to say is that those people who only have sex in bed probably have the most boring sex lives (missionary only!)...UGGhh!

Huh?


----------



## barefootpoetry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ShwarmaQueen* 
Well all I have to say is that those people who only have sex in bed probably have the most boring sex lives (missionary only!)...UGGhh!









This is just what I was going to say. And I don't mean that bed sex is boring sex, just the kind of people who go, "OMG. There are children in the bed. We cannot have sex. O noez." must be pretty boring.


----------



## avivaelona

Co sleeping has ruined our sex life less than the fact that DS wakes up earlier than DH and I want to...we used to like morning lie ins. I think sometimes there is this fantasy that somehow children will also remain on a more convenient time schedule if they are also sleeping in another space from you. I can't see that would be true really but I think those who don't co-sleep might be more likely to think its true. The truth is though that DS wakes up even earlier if he is in his own room for some reason. I still sometimes miss having our huge bed to ourselves though. There will be both some sad and some happy when he does graduate to sleeping in his own space.


----------



## umami_mommy

i think there is this huge "status" thing that happens with people who are first time parents... "this baby is going to have to fit into our family! i'm not changing anything for this baby."

it's a delusional idea, but one that clearly has lots of support in popular culture.


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barefootpoetry* 
just the kind of people who go, "OMG. There are children in the bed. We cannot have sex. O noez." must be pretty boring.

I have just the opposite perspective. Anything we do with my (7 yo) dd sleeping in the room needs to be 1. quiet, 2. under covers, and 3. in the dark. _That_ is boring to me.

But give us a child-free room, and







:


----------



## wombatclay

But does the child free room have to be the bedroom? I guess that's where I'm getting hung up... quiet, relaxed, middle of the night snuggle nookie is plenty for this sleep deprived mama and isn't a problem with toddlers in the bed. Wild swinging from the rafters monkey love is fun when I've got the energy and that doesn't require the bedroom (regardless of who is in the bed)...

But for me, it's mostly the sleep deprivation that affects what I want (or can







) do, not where people are sleeping. And since the family bed means I'm getting more sleep it also means I have more energy for intimacy.


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay* 
But does the child free room have to be the bedroom? I guess that's where I'm getting hung up... quiet, relaxed, middle of the night snuggle nookie is plenty for this sleep deprived mama and isn't a problem with toddlers in the bed. Wild swinging from the rafters monkey love is fun when I've got the energy and that doesn't require the bedroom (regardless of who is in the bed)...

But for me, it's mostly the sleep deprivation that affects what I want (or can







) do, not where people are sleeping. And since the family bed means I'm getting more sleep it also means I have more energy for intimacy.

See, we have completely different perspectives. And we have different children. I am getting most of the sleep I need, but not nearly the time alone with dp that I need. And for the adult time that we want, we really need some true privacy--not the living room or dd's room where dd could walk in at any moment.

Sigh. One day. I love my kids with all my heart, and intend to enjoy their childhood to its fullest. But I also intend our empty nest


----------



## llamalluv

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ShwarmaQueen* 
Well all I have to say is that those people who only have sex in bed probably have the most boring sex lives (missionary only!)...UGGhh!

Missionary? I wish! Belly's too big for that. Thank goodness for genetic hyperflexibility, or I'd never get the nookie.


----------



## CaraboosMama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Baby_Makes_5* 
Exactly! Um, there are other places to have sex! In fact, we have added so much spice to our married life by finding creative spots all over the place! I find it way more fun than just the ol' roll over and go at it, LOL! I'm sorry, but once I'm in bed I'm sleeping, lol!!!

I was going to post the same thing! If anything, the family bed helps because everyone is getting more sleep & we are all less tired and crabby. When people mention about the family bed interfering with our sex life, I just respond that "We have the whole rest of the house to have sex in" and look pointedly at the couch, dining room table, etc! That usually ends the conversation


----------



## KSD

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchymomofmany* 
Well said!

And on a lighter note...why does most of America believe that sex has to take place in the bed? Really, folks, let's get a little more creative - there are other rooms in the house!










Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
I think it makes our marriage more exciting because we *have* to find somewhere else to have sex







Before it was always just bed, bed, boring bed










Quote:


Originally Posted by *Baby_Makes_5* 
Exactly! Um, there are other places to have sex! In fact, we have added so much spice to our married life by finding creative spots all over the place! I find it way more fun than just the ol' roll over and go at it, LOL! I'm sorry, but once I'm in bed I'm sleeping, lol!!!

We were married almost 3 years when DD came along, we hadn't had any trouble find places, time, and adventure for our sex life. I agree that it is so odd to think you can only have sex in a bed. I know what I was like as a 19 year old, I don't remember a bed coming in to play that often and I didn't find it hard to come up with a new and interesting place.

Time - Whenever opportunity presents then have some fun. I am man who is very blessed to have a DW who is up for an adventure and isn't afraid of a quicky or two now and then. If you are a stickler for the "Big Mac" then go for the "Happy Meal" now and then.


----------



## KSD

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Twinklefae* 
Not to get to far OT, but REALLY? If DF ever tried that with me, he'd be sleeping on the sofa for a month. I can't even imagine. Sex before sleep is okay, but why on earth would you WAKE SOMEONE UP????? Am I missing something? I don't like being woke up for anything... waking me up for sex is ..







:

That said, we love our new futon.









I must say that I have a habit waking my DW with a back rub and seeing where it would go from there. We never, and I did ask, thought it was weird or out of line. The part I think a lot of people are missing is that we COMMUNICATED about what we needed and how we wanted those needs met.

I am not sure why being awoke by a SO who wants to show love in it's physical form would not be accepted openly and even welcomed.







:


----------



## kittywitty

A family bed makes it more exciting.







Who woulda guessed the kitchen counter would be an option when you're married?

What really destroys married life is your husband not doing the dishes.


----------



## Arwyn

Y'know, I actually haven't had sex outside of our bed in the 14 months since having a child. I also have a child who (at night) has never slept outside of our kingsize family bed. And we probably have a better, more contented sex life now than we did before (breastfeeding = my libido finally matches DP's







).


----------



## klg47

Quote:


Originally Posted by *petra_william* 
i totally agree... contrary to popular belief they are not going to co sleep for ever lol and those few years they do are nothing compared to a whole lifetime really.

I think that is a great comfort to those who only have a few children, but what about those who lean more toward quiverfull thinking? My ideal would be to allow breastfeeding to space my children, but to never directly limit them from coming. I started at age 20, and so I'd have 20+ years of fertility and 25+ years of cosleeping to go through. 25 years is a whole different ball game!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WeasleyMum* 
how hard could it be to put Baby somewhere else for that short time, and bring her back for the rest of the night?

Based on that statement right there I would've known you're not a mom yet







With most babies, once they're asleep, you DO NOT MOVE THEM AT ANY COST!!! Otherwise you'll be spending another hour getting her back to sleep and then you and your dp will fall asleep and miss out on the sex









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Twinklefae* 
Not to get to far OT, but REALLY? If DF ever tried that with me, he'd be sleeping on the sofa for a month. I can't even imagine. Sex before sleep is okay, but why on earth would you WAKE SOMEONE UP????? Am I missing something? I don't like being woke up for anything... waking me up for sex is ..







:

You REALLY feel this way? I can't even comprehend this. . . And I work full time and get an average of 5-6 hours of sleep per night, even on weekends. I LOVE it when dh wakes me up in the middle of the night on the weekends. He works graveyards and I work days, so it's really our only option.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KSD* 
I am not sure why being awoke by a SO who wants to show love in it's physical form would not be accepted openly and even welcomed.







:

Absolutely. I have experienced sexual rejection from my dh, and it affected me deeply. I realized that it really only happened our first year of marriage, yet I still am walking on eggshells in those situations, afraid of being rejected again.


----------



## chfriend

Quote:


Originally Posted by *klg47* 
IBased on that statement right there I would've known you're not a mom yet









Second oldest of six, mom of two.....completely different experience....

Can't tell you how many times I've moved a baby/little kid from the car/couch to the bed without a minutes worth of trouble....

Certainly a possiblity not to discount until you've tried...and as sleep changes developmentally, worth trying again along the way...

Now the folks who can get their kids up to pee and have them back asleep have me in awe.


----------



## Twinklefae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KSD* 
I am not sure why being awoke by a SO who wants to show love in it's physical form would not be accepted openly and even welcomed.







:

Because I might not be able to get back to sleep. For me, sex doesn't lead to sleep, I get all wired. And being woke up at 2am or something, having sex and not being able to get back to sleep is my worst nightmare! Plus, I just don't wake up well. I'm of the "don't talk to me until I've been awake for a hour" type.

I just can't imagine being woken up, even to a back rub, being pleasant. I would appreciate the effort, if I hadn't specifically told DF NO WAY! (Thanks to this thread), but I would not want to participate.

Oh and chfriend, my youngest niece is one of those kids you can pee while sleeping. And a good thing too, she was a bedwetter. She's also just impossible to wake up in general.


----------



## the_lissa

Yeah- sex wakes me up. I have sleep issues, and can't nor want to wake up to have sex. I also don't wake up at 2 to go for a jog and then go back to sleep.


----------



## starflower1

Hello I am a new mom - my dd is 3 months and I am in love with her and love our family bed, however I am having a little trouble figuring out the intimacy thing. Currently we share a house with my younger sister, and in a month and a half we will be moving in with my parents, who already share a house with my aunt, uncle, and cousin. I grew up this way in a multiple famiy home, and know that this is how most of the world lives. We are doing it because it will allow me to stay home with dd and for dh to not take a second job so that he has time with us. Also, this kind of communal family living will have benefits for DD - she will have so many people to love her, and DH and I will have lots of support as new parents. In addition this arrangement has environmental benefits, which I like. Anyway, all this talk about using other rooms for sex makes me anxious, becasue all that my husband and I will have is the room we share with DD. There are of course other rooms, but the kitchen counter is not much of an option when you share it with your folks, aunt and uncle, and a teenager. Remember I am new to this, and I just need some reassurance that we wil be able to do it. . . I am looking forward to the move, but having a lot of anxiety about the sex part. I guess I am less worried about the family bed ruining our sex life - I wouldn't consider another sleeping arrangement - as much as the family house.

So far we wait until she is asleep and then we are really quiet on the other side of the bed (remember we share a house with my sister). My husband seems more comfortable with this than I am, but I can do it. But what about when she gets older and is able to move and might remember what she hears and sees if she happens to wake up.
It is hard because while most of the world lives in multigenerational houses, cosleeps and shares space, this is not as common in our culture, so there is not a lot of support or understanding.

I am hoping to get some support and understanding here. Is there anyone else who cosleeps but does not have the luxury of a guest bedroom, or kitchen/livingroom of their own?


----------



## mimim

No, no, no, _children_ destroy marriages.









Seriously though, anyone who expects their life to be the same and "convenient" after having kids is either deluded or has really bad parenting potential.

(Didn't read all responses - forgive me if I'm repeating)


----------



## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *starflower1* 
But what about when she gets older and is able to move and might remember what she hears and sees if she happens to wake up.

Since your dd is only 3 mo, you have years before this would be an issue. Don't borrow trouble







. It works right now, and it will work for a long time to come.

I've been pointing out the struggles of intimacy while cosleeping with my dd, but she is 7. I also have a 16 mo son, and have absolutely no issue being intimate with him asleep in the room.


----------



## starflower1

thanks sunnmama!


----------



## MiaMama

Whoever thinks co-sleeping puts a strain on married life should try a 15 month deployment sometime.

No, I take that back. No one should ever have to do that.


----------



## mamazee

I haven't read this whole thing, but the only thing that hurt our sex life was PPD. I had ZERO interest in sex for oh I bet about 12 months after our daughter was born. My husband was relaxed about it. He said he'd had dry spells before we got together and he could survive a dry spell then.

My husband wasn't able to sleep with our daughter (he said she breathed too loudly and he couldn't sleep - LOL) so he moved into another room. And that didn't hurt our marriage either. In fact it's turned out to be a good thing because everyone sleeps so well.

Once my hormones were back in gear, co-sleeping was irrelevant as far as our sex life went. Him sleeping in a separate room helped because we just had sex there. He sleeps better by himself so he's stayed in the other room and we actually have sex more often now than when we first got married because we're both so well-rested and relaxed.

We've been very happily married for over 11 years now. The only hard part was during the PPD and my husband was infinitely patient and loving so it was just a minor bump rather than a big problem, and the hormonal problem would have existed regardless of where people slept.


----------



## Arwyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MiaMama* 
Whoever thinks co-sleeping puts a strain on married life should try a 15 month deployment sometime.

No, I take that back. No one should ever have to do that.


----------



## MeloMama08

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kittywitty* 
A family bed makes it more exciting.







Who woulda guessed the kitchen counter would be an option when you're married?

What really destroys married life is your husband not doing the dishes.









I read every post until this one and now I am satisfied and ready to browse elsewhere








I'm due any day with #1 and confident that we will just find a way to make the intimacy happen.....

But dishes, yes! Once I told DP that he was bad at doing dishes and immediatley regretted it. He, always great at communicating basic feelings, responded by saying "well that makes me feel like I should never do them again."
WHOOPS. I back peddled on that one for quite a awhile before he went back to doing them again regularly. I will never make that mistake again!


----------



## ninelives

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annmartina* 
I suspect the assumed choice between baby and marriage is one of the biggest factors in families choosing not to co-sleep. I have friends who weren't even allowed into their parent's room during the day because of the perceived need to protect the sacredness of their parent's marriages. While that is more extreme than not allowing your child into your room at night, it's still an extension of the same idea.

Ah, consider the grand irony: they were conceived in that room; that's where their lives began, and yet they were no longer allowed in that room, even during the day. Ah, the great irony!


----------



## GooeyRN

I would be pi$$ed if dh woke me for sex! I am willing to have sex just about anywhere in the house. It doesn't have to be in our bed. Our problem is just finding the time, not that there is a kid or 2 in the bed. By the time both kids are sleeping we are both exhausted. That would happen regardless of sleeping arrangements. Our marriage would suck if not for co-sleeping. Its the only way I can get enough sleep to not be a sleep deprived miserable mess.







:


----------



## KnitLady

Eh...sex doesn't have to happen at night or in bed. I think it's funny and strange that other people are suddenly so interested in concerned about our sex life when they find out we are co-sleeping. Co-sleeping hasn't destroyed our marriage. Not co-sleeping would have put a strain on our marriage though because DS wouldn't sleep anywhere else. Put everyone where they get the most sleep and you are more likely to have adults who are better rested and more up for sex.


----------



## loraxc

You know, I have known quite a few couples whose marriages have taken some serious hits from long-term cosleeping and baby sleep issues. No one got divorced, but some of them decided "no more kids." Let's not pussyfoot around. Cosleeping really can be hard on a marriage/family.

We have a full-sized bed and no money or space for anything bigger. DS and I are going through hard sleep times anyway, and with the small bed, it just sucks for DH and isn't fair to him. So DS and I are cosleeping and my husband is on the couch. It really is no fun, and I miss my husband. A lot. For now the cosleeping is what baby needs, but I will be working to get him to a crib when he's older.

I also find that talking before sleep is one of our most intimate couple times, and once baby gets old enough to be easily disturbed we lose that. It's about much more than sex, for me (though that's an issue too).

Also, I never would have sex with the child in the room or bed. It's really really not for me, at all. I kinda resent the implication that this makes me uptight.

I don't think anyone is well-served by the idea that people who struggle with hard times due to cosleeping are in a marriage that can't handle kids.


----------



## LoveChild421

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.

I agree...and there's always the "guest bedroom" if you just find GIO in a bed more comfy...

My friends always assume we have no sex life because dp sleeps in "his room" and I sleep in another room with the kids...then I inform them that I "visit" dp after I put the kids to bed and they get miffed that we GIO more than they do!


----------



## LoveChild421

Quote:


Originally Posted by *loraxc* 

Also, I never would have sex with the child in the room or bed. It's really really not for me, at all. I kinda resent the implication that this makes me uptight.

I don't think it makes you uptight at all...I'm the same way...who wants to get almost "there" and have a 3 year old wake up screaming because of all the noise distrubing his sleep? No way.


----------



## Incubator

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LoveChild421* 
I don't think it makes you uptight at all...I'm the same way...who wants to get almost "there" and have a 3 year old wake up screaming because of all the noise distrubing his sleep? No way.









:









We're now having this problem. DS has started sleeping in his own toddler bed wedged between our bed and the wall, but it is very awkward when he wakes up (which thank god has only happened twice, but MAN! what a moodkiller!) I'm thinking about cleaning out the closet.... It's a BIIIIIIG closet...







you know.. like... big enough to put a mattress in? Before someone also calls me uptight, I love the kitchen, but we don't live alone. Sometimes the rest of the house isn't an option because it would be disrespectful. And our bathroom doesn't have enough space for our particular brand of fun.


----------



## shooflymama

I agree with Loraxc.

If we ever had another baby, I would consider figuring out if it was possible for us to NOT co-sleep after the first few months. (We co-slept with DS1 till 20 months, are still mostly co-sleeping with DS2 at 19 months).

Just my experience, for what it's worth.


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## pookel

Cosleeping or not, I've got no energy or libido for at least the first 12 months or so. At least with the baby in the bed I get more sleep.


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## MilkTrance

Quote:


Originally Posted by *honeybeedreams* 







:

right, because mom getting up 6 times in the middle of the night to feed the baby doesn't affect her ability (or desire) to stay awake for sex you know.

My thoughts exactly.

I think that crib sleeping goes hand-in-hand with formula feeding. Formula-fed babies tend to sleep longer and can be fed by either mom or dad (my brother's baby book states that he STTN at TWO months!). There is no "need" for a formula-fed baby to sleep next to Mom, so co-sleeping happens less often.


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## stacyann21

Honestly, if anything destroys your sex life it's having a baby...not co-sleeping. The only way DB and I could have sex while DS sleeps would be if he were down the hall in his own room (he's a very light sleeper) and that will never happen









Quote:

I think that crib sleeping goes hand-in-hand with formula feeding.
I agree. I don't understand how you BF a crib sleeper. We'd be up all night because as soon as I put DS down, he wakes up.


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## Arwyn

I don't know how, but I know people do. Some people do by getting up out of bed and sitting in a rocker several times a night. Some people do a combination crib and bed. Some people let their little ones cry in the middle of the night until they learn not to, or use formula at night, or have their partner get up and give a bottle of pumped milk. It happens, even if I can't imagine doing it, and sometimes it happens in very attached, loving ways, and sometimes not.


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## pookel

Quote:


Originally Posted by *stacyann21* 
I agree. I don't understand how you BF a crib sleeper. We'd be up all night because as soon as I put DS down, he wakes up.

If you had a kid like my first, you'd understand. He would not lie down to go to sleep - he would just scream and scream unless you got up and rocked him. Then once he was sound asleep, you could put him down wherever, except that if we put him down in our bed and then we moved around in the night, we'd wake him up. In the crib, by himself, he slept longer. Plus, we didn't have to lie frozen in uncomfortable positions to try to avoid waking him up.

What this worked out to was that I had to get up with him anyway, every time he woke up, and it was easier to put him down in the crib than bring him to bed with us.

Now, with Simon, he'll just lie down with us, nurse, and go to sleep. In the middle of the night, he wakes up, nurses, rolls over, and goes back to sleep. I can read while he's sleeping next to me and he doesn't wake up, and I can move around normally in bed without waking him up, and I don't have to get up and rock him every time he wakes up. It's an amazing thing. NOW I understand how people can say you get more sleep cosleeping; I never understood that before.


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## phathui5

Quote:

we set aside adult time in the evening to be together elsewhere in the house while the baby sleeps in our bed.
That worked for us when we had one or two kids. Now that ds1 or dd could wander downstairs to use the bathroom or put a book away, it's a little more difficult.


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## MichaelsSahm

I don't think sharing a room or bed with kids destroys married life. Its almost like some people feel the need to blame their problems on the kids. If you chose to have a family bed/room great, if you can get some nookie in the bedroom while kids are sleeping, great. If you have different rooms to get some, groovy. If you can't figure out where to do it, then i would question myself "how badly do I really want it then?" LOL Because to me, if I want me some, i don't care where it is. LOL!


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## anitaj71

Ya . . co sleeping does not ruin a marriage BUT I DO miss my dh. We often sleep apart because it's too crowded for all three of us in one bed. I really miss the first thing in the morning nookie. Just waking up . . . rolling over snuggling in. Especially after a good nights sleep. Looking forward to ds sleeping in his own bed so I can snuggle in the dh and wake up next to dh. and . . .


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## texanatheart

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.

The other day dh and I were discussing this, and I said, "You would think that the people who argue that co-sleeping would affect their sex life would be the ones who are more sexually creative and would know how to find a way to have sex at another time than at 10pm in their bed."


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## annalenasmom

Isn't that why we have couches?







Nobody else uses them in the middle of the night!! LOL! :-D I know all the old ladies wonder what happens because our children sleep in our bed, even though my 4 1/2 year old and 2 year old are out of our bed doesn't mean they don't still come in a couple times a week in the middle of the night because they woke up and couldn't find comfort themselves. They're not dependent, they just know they will be taken care of in our room and loved and will quietly go back to sleep, sometimes they'll just come in and say HI and go back to their own bed knowing we're "still there".


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## FaerieBabyAvalon

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
I think it makes our marriage more exciting because we *have* to find somewhere else to have sex







Before it was always just bed, bed, boring bed









I agree, but now when we actually DO get to have sex in our own bed, it's a treat, because it hardly ever happens there!


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## yasmel

I am not married so I can't comment too much but the sex in the bed thing reminded me of the years when it was normal for husband and wife to sleep in separate twin beds.


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## stacyann21

Quote:

we set aside adult time in the evening to be together elsewhere in the house while the baby sleeps in our bed.
That's what we do too. Once I nurse DS to sleep on our bed, I crawl away, turn on the monitor and DB and I get busy on the downstairs couch LOL.


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## rightkindofme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AlmostAPpropriate* 
wow, maybe it is just us. I love middle of the night sex, its my favorite. In the evenings Im just so wipes all i want to do is sleep! But once Ive had 4-5 hrs of sleep I have rested enough to be up for it, and Im all drowsy, relaxed, not thinking about household stuff. I love it. leisurely lovemaking sessions were rare when DS was still in our bed.
That said, we still use some of our old fave spots from our cosleeping days, places we probably wouldnt have thought of otherwise, so that was a fringe benefit of having DS in bed with us.

Sex in the middle of the night is our favorite too. We haven't figured out how sex is going to work yet (I'm not done healing from birth) but I'm sure we will manage somehow.


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## pohaha

sunnmama said:


> I hear this sentiment a lot around here. I am one of those people
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am a person who gets more "into" it when I am in a safe, comfortable place. The brain is the biggest sex organ, after all, and mine works best in my personal bedroom. QUOTE]
> 
> Since DS doesn't sleep in the full-size bed in his room, which is set up mostly as a play room, thats our "comfortable" place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you could do something similar in your kids room? granted there isn't just a toddler bed in there


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## anewmama

There is no one size fits all. A month ago, I would have said that it isn't a strain. But after 2 weeks of illness with my daughter over the past 3 weeks (she was well between illnesses for about 3 days), her constant night nursing, my lack of sleep and the fact that DH and I, after working 40 hours a week, don't have time to be creative for sex, I am afraid I do feel that our co-sleeping is affecting our relationship. Up until now, we both have really enjoyed it. But I spend a lot of time preventing DD from waking DH by nursing her so I sleep much less than him. I have been sick too. Right now, ALL I want is for my daughter to be able to sleep through the night in her own crib, in our room, and for me to stretch out and sleep however I want with DH. And get a solid 8 hours, which I haven't had probably in the past 2 years (including last part of pregnancy and now with dd who is 14 months).

Does it destroy a marriage or damage it? Who knows. I wouldn't want to make any such blanket statement. It's worked for us but I feel that we need to do something different right now.


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## anewmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annmartina* 
In conclusion, if your marriage can't survive a baby in your bed at night, it probably can't survive a baby in your life during the day.

This is preposterous. Sounds like blatant co-sleeping propaganda to me. I work 40 hours a week, have a 45-1 hour commute every morning and night. I pump like a mad woman at work, I have NO time for exercise. I am barely keeping up with everything. I don't know when I last had time for anything for me. If I do continue on this path _I_ won't survive. And if _I_ can't, then I will have nothing to bring to my marriage. But this is just my situation. So I don't think you can make such black and white statements and make paint parenting and marriage with such broad stroke.


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## [email protected]

My husband and I have made love right there beside our sleeping daughter, no waking... ( 5 months old)
But mostly we throw down a small futon mattress and yes of course do it like hippies. It feels much more primitive. The guys dig it...


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## One_Girl

Even if you put her in a crib she may still wake up during the night in the crib. Then you will either have to make her CIO or you will have to get up and get her back to sleep. Kids take a tremendous toll on marriage but so do work and other aspects. Most parents of young kids are extremely sleep deprived unless they ignore their child's needs and make them cry all night. I think that how you deal with getting sleep as a couple is more of an indicator of how your marriage will do with children added to the picture than the actual location of the child. If you are sleep deprived, from rolling over and latching the child on or from getting up and soothing the child back to sleep, and your husband does not take over the care of the baby so that you can get sleep on occassion, then he doesn't respect your needs and that is something that dooms a lot of relationships. If you don't trust him to care for your child for a couple hours and bring the child to you when she needs to nurse then your relationship probably isn't going to last either. The babies actual location during this interupted sleep has nothing to do with lack of respect for a loved ones needs or lack of trust.


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## anewmama

One Girl, not sure if your post was directed at me but you lumped a whole lot of things in there and created a nice picture that is again too black and white.

Of my experience, DH is very participative. He stays home one day a week to care for her and I trust him explicitly. But my DD has now gotten in the habit of doing far more than nursing in her sleep. Once the milk let down has passed, I am her human pacifier. I fall asleep forgetting she is still latched on. Then wonder why I am even more unrested from not ever really getting comfortable. The truth is, for me, when I used to have her in our crib and would get up, sit on the side of the bed and nurse her and put her back and go to sleep, I was far more rested than this constant nursing/comfort nursing that she has become accustomed to doing.

I just get extremely bothered by these co-sleeping threads that say, "to be a parent, you MUST be sleep deprived, you must sleep with your baby, there is no alternative to being a good parent, if you can't suck it up and sleep in one bed, you are not an attached parent, you are doing something wrong, and god forbid, you must be doing the CIO if you AREN'T sleep deprived and sleeping with your kids." And, now I read basically, your marriage is nothing if you can't co-sleep? Has co-sleeping become this dogmatic?


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## hedgewitch

Quote:


Originally Posted by *anewmama* 
O And, now I read basically, your marriage is nothing if you can't co-sleep? Has co-sleeping become this dogmatic?

I can understand that you feel really stressed and pressured, co-sleeping, or any aspect of family life is a personal choice and has to work for everyone. I think because it is something that is seen as taboo in western culture that people like to talk about the benefits for a change!

Reading Onegirl's post it seemed that she was saying that being woken in the night is inevitable whether small children are in bed or next door to you. That was certainly my experience as someone who has tried pretty much every approach! I read her post as saying that the most important 'survival' technique is a supportive partner who takes a share, regardless of sleeping arrangements. If *you* (one) is doing it all and *your* dh/dp seemed uncaring of this, that would be a marriage killer rather than choosing to co-sleep.

I agree, there is no one answer and it sounds like you are under a tremendous strain. Each family has to work out what to do for themselves and no-one can judge that. I honestly think these threads are more about celebrating choices than condemning or judging. There are very few spaces where people will see sleeping with your child as a norm or even ok. People like to discuss and celebrate instead of always defending. I really don't think anyone is trying to make you feel bad.


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## One_Girl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *anewmama* 
One Girl, not sure if your post was directed at me but you lumped a whole lot of things in there and created a nice picture that is again too black and white.

Of my experience, DH is very participative. He stays home one day a week to care for her and I trust him explicitly. But my DD has now gotten in the habit of doing far more than nursing in her sleep. Once the milk let down has passed, I am her human pacifier. I fall asleep forgetting she is still latched on. Then wonder why I am even more unrested from not ever really getting comfortable. The truth is, for me, when I used to have her in our crib and would get up, sit on the side of the bed and nurse her and put her back and go to sleep, I was far more rested than this constant nursing/comfort nursing that she has become accustomed to doing.

I just get extremely bothered by these co-sleeping threads that say, "to be a parent, you MUST be sleep deprived, you must sleep with your baby, there is no alternative to being a good parent, if you can't suck it up and sleep in one bed, you are not an attached parent, you are doing something wrong, and god forbid, you must be doing the CIO if you AREN'T sleep deprived and sleeping with your kids." And, now I read basically, your marriage is nothing if you can't co-sleep? Has co-sleeping become this dogmatic?

I am sorry that you were offended by my post. It was not directed at you, it was directed at the line of thought that many people seem to have about co-sleeping being damaging to the family bed and the notion that everything is going to be great and everyone will get sleep once the baby is moved into the crib. I have never heard of anybody who got more sleep from getting out of bed and staying awake to feed their baby when they wake in the night, but if that truly works for you then I am glad that you found something that works, the opposite thing happened for me. I also wasn't saying that a person needs to sleep with their kids and if they aren't sleep deprived then they are making them CIO. I was saying that when your baby wakes up you will either have to get up and take care of her needs or do CIO. When people get up several times in the middle of the night they tend to be sleep deprived. I also wasn't saying that co-sleeping makes a marriage or breaks it, respect, trust, and being able to rely on the other person when you need them is what makes a marriage or breaks it.

I use the words "you" and "your" as a way of addressing whoever is reading the post not as a way to address the person who has posted right before I did, that is just my writing style not a criticism against you, if I was going to address a post at someone I would use their name or quote them.


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## alllyssa

I have 6 kids and have been "doing" the AP thing for almost 18 years, so take my experience for what it's worth . . .

Co-sleeping does effect the physical closeness that spouses have while lying in bed. It interferes with being able to simply roll over and touch, cuddle, etc. It makes spontanious love making almost impossible. If you think that this can't take a long-term toll on a marriage, then I think that you are terribly naive.

My DH and I decided a long time ago not to sacrifice our children and their nighttime needs, but there is a trade off that we both feel from time to time. It is harder, I think, to stay connected to each other some days, simply because we can't touch and hold one another as often as we need to. Our need to connect through touch and sex often goes unfulfilled. This does lead to frustration.

Something is sacrificed when you have kids in between you and your privacy is limited. It was easier to find "alone" time when the oldest kids were younger, but now we have little ones in our bed and older kids who are often awake even after we go to bed. So there is no option to sneak off to another room, go downstairs, etc.

We still love each other very much and are commited to our family, but to say that co-sleeping requires no sacrifice in the marriage, is false in my opinion.


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## stickywicket67

the title of the thread is "The family bed destroys married life".

imo-married life is defined by way more than sex. it's part of it but not all of it. important but not the most important part.

co-sleeping definitely calls for sacrifice, there is no way around it. but by it's very nature having children calls for sacrifice of all kinds.

*Shaggydaddy*- "_I mean, we can't dtd on our bed in the middle of the night anymore. We also can't watch horror movies in the living room, or go to smokey dives to watch local punk bands. There was lots of stuff we couldn't do before we had kids that we can do now. I am willing to trade a lot for my kids, but an intimate relationship with my wife isn't one of those things I had to give up... We just had to change things up a little. Different, not worse._"

i couldn't agree more.

*honeybee dreams*-"_i think there is this huge "status" thing that happens with people who are first time parents... "this baby is going to have to fit into our family! i'm not changing anything for this baby."
it's a delusional idea, but one that clearly has lots of support in popular culture._"

and this. though i think it's less "status" and more a resistance to change. a level of not wanting to give up that independence. our culture (western culture) is a culture of individuality.

*mimim*- "_No, no, no, children destroy marriages.








Seriously though, anyone who expects their life to be the same and "convenient" after having kids is either deluded or has really bad parenting potential._"

and this.

i think combined with the OP you three posters hit the nail on the head.

and i'm not saying if co-sleeping doesn't work for you and your family and baby and everyone is happier sleeping in their own beds don't do it.

but if a marriage fails i highly doubt it is all the fault of the "family bed".


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## basilisa76

Co-sleeping definately AFFECTS your bed habits, whether it is sex, sleeping or simply moving around. I co-slept with my daughter for the first 3 months of her life and after that we do it often when she is sick, wakes up scared or simply won't go to sleep by herself. I love the fact that the 3 of us can snuggle in bed but it is uncomfortable and my husband was never happy about co-sleeping at the beginning, now our baby is older and he is not afraid of rolling over her but we do not sleep well AT ALL when she is with us. She just moves and kicks too much. All situations are different.

Because we did not co-slept for a long time, I can't say that it really put a strain on our marriage but I would not deny that it affects it. I guess it is up to each couple to manage the situation the best they can... Either use the couch or somewhere else or do it during weekends only during the day! (which is what we did!)

Gigi


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## Fluffy_Pants

This is a great thread. I think the biggest indicator of your marriage's viability is not where your babies sleep, but how flexible you and your mate are about meeting challenges (ALL challenges). If you have to have things a certain way (whether that is sleeping arrangements, mealtimes, or anything else) you are bound to be disappointed. For people who can't flex, that disappointment can break them. If you can flex with the needs of your partner, yourself and your children, you will probably have a healthy marriage. Rather than seeing problems as insurmountable obstacles, you start looking for a path around them. Sometimes you find that things are better once you figure out a different arrangement (like, Woo hoo, who knew sex on the dining room table was so great?!) Marriage is a very long proposal, and having small children is a relatively short time of life. It isn't your circumstances that determines whether your marriage stays strong or breaks, it is your willingness to communicate your needs, to respect your partner's needs, and to figure out a way to meet the most needs the most amount of the time, without leaving anyone out in the cold all the time.

On another note, I am one parent who has happily exclusively breastfed two crib sleepers. When they were teeny, they were in our bed. As they got a little older, they moved to a cosleeper next to us. When they were down to 2-3 feeds at night, they moved to a crib, slept there until they first woke up, then came into our bed. If I was energetic enough to put them back into their own beds after nursing, I did. If not, they stayed. Once they were down to one feed a night, I mostly always put them back in their cribs. And night weaning took place on it's own, and without pushing. It worked beautifully for our whole family, while cosleeping was a mess after the first few months. Both of my girls wanted to play when they were in our bed. When they did sleep, I woke up sore and achy from holding still all night long.

I have to say that I am disturbed by these edicts handed down from on high. The same people who scoff at blanket statements like "cosleeping ruins your marriage" then go on to make blanket statements of their own like "If a marriage can't survive cosleeping, it can survive at all" or "people who only have sex in their own beds probably do it missionary and must have the most boring sex lives ever." We all agree that we have to make the choices that work best for our own family, so why are we still scoffing at the ways other people find to work things out? I for one am a breastfeeding, kids in their own rooms, sex in bed, love the missionary position mama. And guess what... we are happy in our family. If you like monkey love from the chandeliers, then props to you, but how can you judge the quality of my sex life based on your own? We all have different selves, different mates, and different children. I love the constructive sharing of ideas and thoughts, but I could definitely do without the judgement.

Cheers,
Sarah


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## Marandas

We co-sleep with our almost four year old; she sleeps between us and it's the best part of the day for all of us!! (Other "couple" activities can happen in other places). My child feels safe, I know she's safe...














e wouldn't change a thing!!!


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## DavinaT

I'm with AlmostAPpropriate on this one.
Actually Twinklefae, I too LIKE being woken up for it. I've slept enough to be refreshed and there is something special about the middle of the night in that way.
And like another lady said, if I have to head to another colder room, half asleep makign sure not to wake junior, the mood goes.
But even if I didn't want to - no way I'd make him sleep on the sofa, even for a night.
But if the lil'ones are asleep, I will wake them in the middle of the night ONLY IN CASE OF FLOOD, FIRE OR WILD ANIMAL INVASION.
But anewmama has a point too, in that not everyone is the same and different things work for different families. We "semi co-slept with one, as in the cot as beside us, with the side let down as we were terrified of rolling over in the night and hurting her. YES, we were sleep deprived obviously but we never would have considered practising CIO. We could still take care of her needs without getting up and my super-wriggly nature didn't disturn her sleep.
But we never did 'it' beside our sleeping l'il ones but you know that was probably way more to do with our hangups than their presence.


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## EnviroBecca

I agree that it's silly to think a marriage can survive only if the husband and wife are in bed together with nobody else all night every night. But I can't agree with this:

Quote:

One hundred percent of what goes on between us and our spouses that builds or detracts from the happiness of our marriages happens during our waking hours, not when we're sleeping soundly at night.
Even leaving aside sex and other forms of bonding that can happen at bedtime and waking up time, thinking just about the time when we're sleeping: Sleeping together makes a difference to people of all ages. While unconscious, we are still aware of each other's warmth, pheromones, maybe even some kind of psychic connection.

In my family, the family bed is in the kid's room, with the master bedroom kept as the place for couple time. EnviroDaddy usually sleeps in the master bedroom, but he was in the family bed with us for the first month, and since weaning he's been able to put EnviroKid to bed himself and sometimes falls asleep there while I go to sleep in the master bedroom. (Now that our kid is so big and acrobatic, it's difficult for all 3 of us to sleep in a full-size bed.) Eventually I hope that EnviroDaddy and I will be sleeping together in the master bedroom as our usual arrangement again. Our 3-year-old still needs someone with him while falling asleep and calls for me if he wakes in the night and I'm not there. He's allowed in the master bedroom and comes in there quite a bit during the day, but he's slept in there only a few times for only part of the night.

There have been many advantages to this arrangement (preserving our couple space, allowing EnviroDaddy to escape sleep disruption from night nursing, transitioning EnviroKid to sleeping alone without simultaneously moving him to a different bed) but I really, really miss sleeping with my partner! Much as I love the baby cuddles, I miss the manly cuddles.







And in the era when my partner and I were not sleeping together ever, we had more moments of not being on the same "wavelength", misunderstanding each other, feeling alienated, than at any other point in our relationship.

*Starflower1:* When we've had extended visits with family so that we're in the situation of sharing our only private room with our child, we wait until he's asleep and then take a shower together or go for a walk together and find some privacy in the woods.







As he gets older, I expect relatives will want to take him to parks and such without us, and we'll have privacy in our room then.


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## keilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
I always find the cosleeping and sex argument so bizarre. I don't know who these people are who only have sex in a bed.









:


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## Alexe

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Fluffy_Pants* 
This is a great thread. I think the biggest indicator of your marriage's viability is not where your babies sleep, but how flexible you and your mate are about meeting challenges (ALL challenges). If you have to have things a certain way (whether that is sleeping arrangements, mealtimes, or anything else) you are bound to be disappointed. For people who can't flex, that disappointment can break them. If you can flex with the needs of your partner, yourself and your children, you will probably have a healthy marriage. Rather than seeing problems as insurmountable obstacles, you start looking for a path around them. Sometimes you find that things are better once you figure out a different arrangement (like, Woo hoo, who knew sex on the dining room table was so great?!) Marriage is a very long proposal, and having small children is a relatively short time of life. It isn't your circumstances that determines whether your marriage stays strong or breaks, it is your willingness to communicate your needs, to respect your partner's needs, and to figure out a way to meet the most needs the most amount of the time, without leaving anyone out in the cold all the time.

On another note, I am one parent who has happily exclusively breastfed two crib sleepers. When they were teeny, they were in our bed. As they got a little older, they moved to a cosleeper next to us. When they were down to 2-3 feeds at night, they moved to a crib, slept there until they first woke up, then came into our bed. If I was energetic enough to put them back into their own beds after nursing, I did. If not, they stayed. Once they were down to one feed a night, I mostly always put them back in their cribs. And night weaning took place on it's own, and without pushing. It worked beautifully for our whole family, while cosleeping was a mess after the first few months. Both of my girls wanted to play when they were in our bed. When they did sleep, I woke up sore and achy from holding still all night long.

I have to say that I am disturbed by these edicts handed down from on high. The same people who scoff at blanket statements like "cosleeping ruins your marriage" then go on to make blanket statements of their own like "If a marriage can't survive cosleeping, it can survive at all" or "people who only have sex in their own beds probably do it missionary and must have the most boring sex lives ever." We all agree that we have to make the choices that work best for our own family, so why are we still scoffing at the ways other people find to work things out? I for one am a breastfeeding, kids in their own rooms, sex in bed, love the missionary position mama. And guess what... we are happy in our family. If you like monkey love from the chandeliers, then props to you, but how can you judge the quality of my sex life based on your own? We all have different selves, different mates, and different children. I love the constructive sharing of ideas and thoughts, but I could definitely do without the judgement.

Cheers,
Sarah

Great post









And to people thinking sex in bed must be boring .. or limited to the missionary position ... hehe it's me not believing *your* post.


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## nixie_nox

This is what I tell people.

Problem children and teenagters also destroy a marriage. So cosleeping gives children security and confidence, which makes them better children and teenagers.

In fact,I think child issues is the number two reason for divorce after money.

Not that I am implying that some people have difficult children from not co-sleeping. But I see it as an extra precaution.

I am of the personal belief that if you have children, it stops being about you.

While being in a happy marriage is extremely important, I think you can work that around co-sleeping.

It is one thing if you are super uncomfortable and or take medications or are a heavy sleeper, but it is when people say "I" need this. Or "I" need my space, etc. that is bothers me.

I believe you do what it takes for your children. Period.

If you as a parent, keep saying "I" "I" "I", then don't be surprised when your kids do also.

Considering how high the rate of divorce is in the US, and we co-sleep the least, I really don't think co-sleeping is the problem. When most countries co-sleep.

When I have spoken to friends from other countries, they think it is weird how much we isolate ourselves from friends and family, and from our own children.

Our whole society seems to be based on how much we can isolate ourselves.

To me, isolating a very young child to another room just seems so institutional.

I tell people, most adults don't like sleeping by themselves, yet we insist that a newborn, who doesn't even know they are a seperate person from you, should sleep by themselves for 12 hours in a room? jmo


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## the_lissa

No one said sex in bed is boring. They and I said only ever having sex in bed is boring. And it is the very definition of boring to only have sex in one place to me.


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## Lit Chick

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nixie_nox* 
I tell people, most adults don't like sleeping by themselves, yet we insist that a newborn, who doesn't even know they are a seperate person from you, should sleep by themselves for 12 hours in a room? jmo











Excellent point to make. I think anti-cosleepers can dismiss a lot of your other points, because it is not something they can even relate to. But if they have even been loney without their partner in bed... or had trouble settling... well, it makes co-sleeping seem less weird. They do it to (just not with a babe).


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## sharr610

ok, so I haven't read this whole thing, but my mom said something to me recently about how we need to stop co sleeping soon, "for the good of our marriage," meaning getting busy...

So its pretty personal to assume things about our sex life. We've never been do it before going to sleep types anyway(DH is all freakish about sleeptime rituals as he's always had trouble sleeping). We find opportunities during the day or evening to get it on, during a nap, after bedtime, etc. And we just go somewhere else in the house, the living room, a second bedroom, whereever. Its just no biggie.

This is like the lamest argument ever in my opinion


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
No one said sex in bed is boring. They and I said only ever having sex in bed is boring. And it is the very definition of boring to only have sex in one place to me.


Ok, that is true for you. But that isn't true for others. If others are saying that losing their bedroom privacy is a challenge (for them) when cosleeping, how is it helpful to judge their sex life as boring?


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## sunnmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nixie_nox* 
I am of the personal belief that if you have children, it stops being about you.

While being in a happy marriage is extremely important, I think you can work that around co-sleeping.

It is one thing if you are super uncomfortable and or take medications or are a heavy sleeper, but it is when people say "I" need this. Or "I" need my space, etc. that is bothers me.

I believe you do what it takes for your children. Period.

If you as a parent, keep saying "I" "I" "I", then don't be surprised when your kids do also.

I think you make some good points, but I think we also need to talk about balance. In my case, we coslept with a 1 yo and a 7 yo until a couple of months ago. The 1 yo still cosleeps, but the 7 yo has been moved into her own room against her wishes. She must begin the night there, although she may join us in our room if she wakes in the wee hours of the night (or in the morning).

This was definitely a matter of us, as parents, asserting what _we_ need for our marriage. We are trying to balance dd's needs and our needs.

I guess, in the context of your post, my dd could be labeled a "problem child". I just think of her as *my child*.


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## HisBeautifulWife

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nixie_nox* 
I am of the personal belief that if you have children, it stops being about you.


I agree with that.

However I've always been taught that your marriage comes first. One day it's just going to be you and your spouse again and you don't want to wake up 20 years later to a stranger. Besides if you put your kids before your marriage, you are setting yourself up to mess up your marriage.

Yes, I understand there are times when other things have to take priority over your marriage- new baby, parent gets sick, etc.- but I believe those are seasons and it shouldn't be the rule.

I am not for or aganist co-sleeping, to each his own, but perhaps people who think it interferes with marriage have some of that "marriage first, keep your marriage bed in tact" ingrained.


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## heidirk

I just wanted to share our cosleeping story. . .

When I was pregnant, and began investigating breastfeeding, I decided that to make nightime parenting work for ME, we'd need to cosleep. We bought a mini cosleeper, and for the first few weeks, everything went fine.

Then, everything went down the toilet- but not because of cosleeping.

I guess I had gathered the idea that if I coslept, breastfed, and practiced attachment parenting, I'd be guaranteed a happy, sleeping, nonfussy baby, and all the sleep I would need. But DS was NOT that baby. It had everything to do with, DS's personality, mastitis, incredible gas, a sensory defensive infant (and mama), and a completely overwhelmed DH. Oh, and PPD, can't forget that little tidbit.

When DH and I started marriage counselling, we had to find a babysitter for DS. No matter who took care of him, he screamed the entire time we were gone, until he fell asleep. He had just begun to be happy playing on the floor for a while by himself, and suddenly, complete hysterics anytime I left the room. DH and I made the decision to pull DS back into our bed (he'd been fine in the crib for a month or two before this) and get our sleep any way we could. We were so exhausted, we did sleep, and much better than before. We also decided that if DS was going to have such a huge anxious response to an evening's separation, it wasn't worth it to keep counselling.

Here we are today, DS is two, sleeps in a big boy bed (well, a mattress on the floor) and we're expecting our second in October. The cosleeper is going back up again, and the crib is staying in the attic until I'm good and ready to see what happens.

The only thing that's different this time is that We have zero expectations. THis baby will be what this baby will be. We surmounted the challenge, and we can do so again. If this baby wants to sleep with us, wonderful, if not, wonderful too. We have the luxury of extra space, which many do not have, and we are greatful for it.

It's funny, I was just telling the coffee guy at GIANT that when you have children, you learn who you really are. The same is true for your marriage, you find out just what your relationship can take. Making babies together is I think, the acid test for a stable relationship.

Thanks for listening!

BTW- this has been a great thread, kudos to everyone for keeping it going in a real life but respectful way.

Heidi


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## maliceinwonderland

My favorites can't even be done in our bedroom, forget about the bed









My SO was adamant that the baby sleep with us because he felt like the little guy needed me. It didn't seem natural to him that a baby sleep away from his mother. As he put it "That is NOT how other mammals do it, and I'd like to think we're at least as smart as animals" I think him being so into co-sleeping because of the benefit to the baby has made our relationship even better. I can't imagine wanting to be intimate with a person who ignored the needs of his children.

I think sex is even more spontaneous/fun now because we grab it when we can, where we can.

I have always hated the assumption that having children takes away from a marriage/relationship. I'm sure for some couples it may, but maybe they weren't so fantastic at communicating and showing affection for each other to begin with, and having a child just made it more obvious?


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## Annoia

I nodded my head while reading the posts that speak on flexibility.

Being flexible has worked for our family.

We started out co-sleeping with the first, moved him to his own room , then pretty much rearranged our entire house make-up so that now I co sleep with DS and DD while DH has his own room (which used to be DS' room). DH really benefits from his Man Cave (or Mantuary), DS benefits from being in the room with me and DD (he's such an extrovert always craving ppl, unlike DH), DD benefits from nightime nursing, and I benefit from a good nights sleep!







: And sneak into the ManCave every once in a while
















We will move into a new living space in a year, and will probably have totally different living arrangements.

For me it's all about Maximizing the Collective Happiness. Which for us involves alot of flex.









D.


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## pookel

Quote:


Originally Posted by *maliceinwonderland* 
I have always hated the assumption that having children takes away from a marriage/relationship. I'm sure for some couples it may, but maybe they weren't so fantastic at communicating and showing affection for each other to begin with, and having a child just made it more obvious?

Right .... if having children puts stress on your relationship, it must be your fault for having a crappy relationship in the first place.









Kids are hard work. They take a lot of time and energy and leave you sleep deprived for years. Why is it so hard to accept that it's perfectly normal for that to be a stressor on even the most stable of relationships?


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## heidirk

:


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## cottonwood

Quote:

have to say that I am disturbed by these edicts handed down from on high. The same people who scoff at blanket statements like "cosleeping ruins your marriage" then go on to make blanket statements of their own like "If a marriage can't survive cosleeping, it can survive at all"
(You meant "can't survive at all", right?) That's not exactly what the OP said, but regardless, if your marriage is going to be brought down by sleeping with your baby, that's a pretty weak marriage to my mind. If my husband said, "it's me or the baby," I'd be like, "okay, bye." Because if my marriage surviving was dependent on me forcing my kids to be apart from me at night, I wouldn't feel like that was a kind of marriage worth saving.

Anyway, as someone way up there said, yeah, it's bizarre to me that people really believe that co-sleeping and sexual intimacy can't co-exist. You just, you know, _have sex somewhere else._ It's not rocket science. In our case, we have two bedrooms, one for the family bed(s) and one for me and my husband. I've heard people say, "Oh, we can't do that, we don't have enough _room._" But you have enough room to isolate your baby from you? I don't get it. It's the same number of rooms, right?


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## llamalluv

Quote:


Originally Posted by *fourlittlebirds* 
In our case, we have two bedrooms, one for the family bed(s) and one for me and my husband. I've heard people say, "Oh, we can't do that, we don't have enough _room._" But you have enough room to isolate your baby from you? I don't get it. It's the same number of rooms, right?









Not necessarily. A crib is a LOT smaller than a queen or king sized mattress.

When I was born my parents had a California King waterbed and a 1-bedroom apartment, so they put my crib in the closet. (It was a rather large closet, by closet standards - about the same size as a full bathroom) Crib at the back, dresser/changing table to one side, and that was the nursery.


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## nerdymom

I just finished reading this whole thread and WOW. As a mom-to-be who is taking a "let's just see what feels right at the time" approach to co-sleeping, this is my take.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *starflower1* 
Hello I am a new mom - my dd is 3 months and I am in love with her and love our family bed, however I am having a little trouble figuring out the intimacy thing. Currently we share a house with my younger sister, and in a month and a half we will be moving in with my parents, who already share a house with my aunt, uncle, and cousin. [*snip*]
I am hoping to get some support and understanding here. Is there anyone else who cosleeps but does not have the luxury of a guest bedroom, or kitchen/livingroom of their own?

I too live in a multi-generational home. Sometimes I wouldn't have in any other way, and other times it's frustrating. Right now we have one bedroom of our own, and that's it. I almost decked my teen sister for making comments about "noise" at night (truuuust me, she has never even HEARD "noise", okEE?). And she's in another room. Thankfully we are finishing a small suite of rooms downstairs so we will have the option of another room for DTD. So it sounds like we are a little more fortunate than you in that respect.







I agree with pp who said "don't borrow trouble". A solution that is right for you and your situation WILL come when you're ready for it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Fluffy_Pants* 
This is a great thread. I think the biggest indicator of your marriage's viability is not where your babies sleep, but how flexible you and your mate are about meeting challenges (ALL challenges). If you have to have things a certain way (whether that is sleeping arrangements, mealtimes, or anything else) you are bound to be disappointed.









:

DH and I haven't made any decisions about nighttime parenting yet, and we don't plan to until we have our LO. But let me just say one thing more.

BED SEX ROCKS. I've had sex anywhere and everywhere. Outside, in public, too many different cars, in a hotel room with four other couples in it, bathrooms, kitchens, washing machines and dryers, on couches, behind couches, in the woods of a national park, whatever, wherever, I've done it. (yes Nerds can have adventurous, awesome sex lives). But there is no where I'd rather be than in the comfort of my own bed. That's right, in bed, missionary style, with my husband. Vanilla? maybe. The most satisfying, fulfilling sexual relationship of my life-definitely. And when it's over, nothing but snuggles all night long.


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## crazylady

Ok guys! Here is my question. I just found out that I am pregnant with our 2nd. What do I do with the 1st? Throw him out? He is not planning on leaving right now but I hear it is not safe for a toddler and newborn to cosleep. So What is the solution????


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## Kiddoson

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crazylady* 
Ok guys! Here is my question. I just found out that I am pregnant with our 2nd. What do I do with the 1st? Throw him out? He is not planning on leaving right now but I hear it is not safe for a toddler and newborn to cosleep. So What is the solution????

I guess DH would have to sleep in one bed with toddler and me with new baby (beds in same room?). We use a co-sleeper attached to the bed when they are brand new so you could still have toddler in between you and DH. And I suppose you could always keep new LO on the outside after the co sleeper...


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## onyxravnos

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crazylady* 
Ok guys! Here is my question. I just found out that I am pregnant with our 2nd. What do I do with the 1st? Throw him out? He is not planning on leaving right now but I hear it is not safe for a toddler and newborn to cosleep. So What is the solution????

its just not safe for the toddler and the baby to sleep _next_ to each other. You can still have them in the same bed.

put toddler on dads side and baby with you.


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## crazylady

i never thought of that! that excites me so much. my little boy is just not ready to leave our bed. he could deal with sleeping on the other side of the bed though. i just don't know how people do it with kids in their own beds. i know that early on neither one of us would have ever gotten any sleep if he was in his bed!


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## abc123xyz

This thread is so long but I wanted to chim in and say that my husband and I both have decided that the more the merrier in our bed. As long as they are sleeping in their own beds before college, we will be happy. That being said, we only have a 9 month old but he is more than welcome to stay as long as he'd like. Creativity is the best part of marriage and without it, isn't the marriage bed already ruined? I think of it this way...
they say:"babies in bed ruin your marriage"
I say: "Marriage in your bed ruins babies"

Relations can happen in any room of the house...why does it have to just be the bed? Although, it can happen there too! Having children is a season of life and when they are gone, you can't go back and wish you'd kept them closer longer. I am excited about having many many more children..maybe 15, to share bed with! We just decided we'd keep adding mattresses until our floor is full of them!


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## Storm Bride

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jkseawell* 
Relations can happen in any room of the house...why does it have to just be the bed?

It can be a little more complicated than that, depending on your family. DH and I have a teenager in the house, and we don't feel okay having sex anywhere but our room, unless he's out of the house. OTOH, our 3-year-old (tomorrow - wow) and 5-year-old are out of our room. They're okay with it, and they both know they can come in any time.

I hate this "kids in the bed ruins marriages" crap. I'm sure it can cause some extra stresses, but sex can happen in other places, and snuggling and such can happen even with a child in the bed...I love big family snuggles with dh on one side, me on the other, and the child(ren) in the middle.


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## xojesse

We've been co-sleeping for 2 months and our marriage couldn't be better. People always have little comments like "oh you better get rid of that bad habit while you can" but people don't parent their children as I do who have these sort of comments. DS sleeps in between DH and I and we both love the cuddles. I'm a happier mommy because I don't even have to move to nurse DS and our other DS sleeps on a toddler bed mattress on the floor. He's a little too wiggly to be in bed with us with a newborn.

With that said, our sex life is better than ever! Theirs a lot more creativity than before. By the end of this pregnancy I was annoyed with the bed and ready for some spice in our lives!


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## RiverMamma

I couldn't imagine not sleeping with my baby! My whole life I have always had to sleep with something in the crook of my arm, a stuffed animal, pillow, a corner of the blanket, my husband, etc... it only makes sence to me that a baby was designed to fill that space. Cuddling with her at night is one of the most rewarding aspects of motherhood (and of course adds to my sleep & her night time nursing!) As far as sex is concerned, the post partum period is difficult anyways, and it take getting to know eachother in a whole new way regardless, so you might as well make the best of it and realize, then release such limitations as the bed.


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## Kiddoson

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RiverMamma* 
I couldn't imagine not sleeping with my baby! My whole life I have always had to sleep with something in the crook of my arm, a stuffed animal, pillow, a corner of the blanket, my husband, etc... it only makes sence to me that a baby was designed to fill that space. Cuddling with her at night is one of the most rewarding aspects of motherhood (and of course adds to my sleep & her night time nursing!) As far as sex is concerned, the post partum period is difficult anyways, and it take getting to know eachother in a whole new way regardless, so you might as well make the best of it and realize, then release such limitations as the bed.

















: 100%
I couldn't NOT sleep with my babes


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## RiverMamma

I think that the biggest challenge with post baby sex is simply hormonal changes. When a woman has a baby & is breastfeeding, her body is physiologicly aware that she has a baby, and so does not think it needs to make one, resulting in a lack of sex drive. Men on the other hand are hardwired to plant seeds, and don't experience a dramatic chemical/hormonal shift after the birth of their baby. It is these oposite physiological states that pose the real challenge. As far as I'm concerned, bedsharing with your baby really has very little to do with it, it is a simple challenge that can be easily worked arround, beeing far easier to deal with than having no sex drive & a frustrated husband with plenty of sex drive!


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## Devaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RiverMamma* 
I think that the biggest challenge with post baby sex is simply hormonal changes. When a woman has a baby & is breastfeeding, her body is physiologicly aware that she has a baby, and so does not think it needs to make one, resulting in a lack of sex drive. Men on the other hand are hardwired to plant seeds, and don't experience a dramatic chemical/hormonal shift after the birth of their baby. It is these oposite physiological states that pose the real challenge. As far as I'm concerned, bedsharing with your baby really has very little to do with it, it is a simple challenge that can be easily worked arround, beeing far easier to deal with than having no sex drive & a frustrated husband with plenty of sex drive!

Yes. i agree. i think co-sleeping isnt really the issue in the lack of sex problems in my relationship.

i also think it can go the other way round...while my sex drive isnt as high as it was before the birth, i am still up for it, and my partner couldn't be bothered to make an effort. He is so un-adaptable he cant get his head around any other possibility xcept DTD in our bed at night with no baby in the room...which makes me think he isn't really bothered about it. bit hurtful







:

today i have moved into the other room, two mattresses on the floor, me and DS. DP refused to take our bed off its base to make it safer, and DS is getting more mobile by the day, so i feel he's left me with no choice. As far as I can see, if you really want to have sex with your partner, you will make the effort. He seems to use it as an excuse (the cosleeping) and is bitter about it...the baby's taken over our lives, etc.

i read some of the posts on here, where mom and dad still have a happy sex life and are happy cosleeping, and i wish it were me. oh well. Its hard to withstand the pressure from DP to sleep train DS and 'move him on' from cosleeping, but i'm confident i'm doing the right thing(most of the time!)


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## KimPM

to you Devaya. I hope that you and DH can work it out somehow.


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## DavinaT

"the baby's taken over our lives" - Yeees, this is exactly what I expected to happen when we had one - for the first couple of years anyway.
"sleep train" - you can sleep train someone? Gosh - I wish I'd known that when I suffered with insomnia. Perhaps if someone could tell everyone how to do that, then all insomnia sufferers could dispense with their sleep medication!
We had our lil'one beside us, in a bedside-bed - am way too wriggly to have someone that tiny right beside me and I know I wouldn't sleep - which is not good for anyone in our household and yes it means 'relations' didn't happen in the room - at night, but this as more to do with our hangups than our lil-ones presence. Besides we could always re-invet the lounge







Maybe that might work for you Devaya as well.


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## neostudded

Amen!









great post by the way, and I agree.
My son has co-slept in mummies arms from birth and is now 12 months and still co-sleeping. I am proud of co-sleeping and I am happy we have done it this way. However I understand co-sleeping isnt for everyone and I am fine if people don't co-sleep as well.


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## RiverMamma

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Devaya* 
He is so un-adaptable he cant get his head around any other possibility xcept DTD in our bed at night with no baby in the room...

Yeah, my DH seems to be feeling a little inflexable these days too. The bed, 2am, not really wanting to try alternatives. I think though the issue for us right now is not the baby in the bed, but rather my exaustion keeping me from rousing. Which I'm sure would be worse if I were not sleeping with DD. I'm not too concerned though, he'll get over his limitations, I'll have energy again someday. It's just a little frustrating at the moment.


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## Laura88

I believe that co-sleeping, like all other decisions (parenting or marital)between husband & wife, need to be reached together. When one isn't comfortable w/the decision, it cretes a rift. This rift can damage even the strongest of marriages. It's not the act that hurts the relationship, but the lack of comprimise, the lack of working together as a team that destroys a marriage. CO-sleeping can create excitiment during this years as you try & find places to be together. In the end, it has to be what the two of you want and you must be willing to do the work. This is of course just my 2 cents.


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## Devaya

thanks for the sympathies,KimPM and RiverMamma.Actually things have improved, not in the sex department - there's been only one occasion in over 4 months, and it's not recently! - but in Dp's feelings about co sleeping. Well he still wants DS ultimately in the next room, but after a couple nights of me sleeping next door he said he was lonely and miserable and took down the bedbase, which he'd been refusing to do, so we are now quite happily on two mattresses on the floor in the main bedroom. It feels muchmore like we are a family now rather than 'me and ds' and Dp doing his own thing.

Laura88, I agree that cosleeping should ideally be both partners' wish. However, DP just isnt the one getting up all night, and my sanity is at stake should I have to do that 5-8 times a night which is how often DS wakes currently. It certainly has created a rift. But I feel more positive about it now. Only now,I think sex is even more off the agenda bc we've completely taken the cot down, and DS never goes in it anyway. Since DP doesn't seem to think of the lounge or any other room as a possibility, and i'm too shy to initiate that, I feel rather stuck and frustrated.


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## RiverMamma

something that has been working for us latley, (now that DD can sit up & is quite content to sit & play alone for short periods of time,) is when I get up in the morning, I take DD potty, change & nurse her, then set her up in the living room to play for a little while & I can crawl back in bed w/ DH & have some intamacy, wether it is just cuddling & rubbies, or some good sex. This seems to be working pretty well, at least on mornings that we both don't have to rush off somewhere!


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## Mamatolea

We co-sleep with a toddler and a newborn. I have to admit, it is tough sometimes. The baby wakes every 4 hours and Lea is a mover-all night! And she is one of those people that wakes if we get out of bed.

We try to put her to bed and then we get up to spend some time together, but she tends to wake up..we have to let her cry for a few minutes to fall back asleep. It usually only lasts 2 or 3 minutes, but it kills me to have to do that...

Anyways, we haven't had sex in bed for a while, but we have sex in lots of other places. Of course, it IS nice to have sex in bed..lol..but it isn't necessary!

All of our mainstream friends and family think we are crazy, but I have massive insomnia and had night terrors and I wish I could have slept with my parents but they were very against it and still are. And it bugs me because now they are using that as a reason for not watching the kids, because they "can't sleep in a crib", therefore they can't take them overnight-ever. Nice, huh?


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## CarsonBookworm

Our DD is 11.5 months.

I don't think that Co-sleeping has put a damper on our sex life....quite the contrary!
We just find times when she's sleeping and then sneak out the room and find someplace else to DTD. Its fun, if I do say so myself to find new places to DTD rather than in bed, or on the floor....


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## mamamelia

Quote:

I think that crib sleeping goes hand-in-hand with formula feeding.
why didn't anyone tell me this??? they should write that out on the formula can! i could of avoided the neck and back aches i've been having from dd not letting me move at night.

seriously









Quote:

Formula-fed babies tend to sleep longer and can be fed by either mom or dad (my brother's baby book states that he STTN at TWO months!). There is no "need" for a formula-fed baby to sleep next to Mom, so co-sleeping happens less often.
oh yes of course! because babies that are bottle fed are also somehow immune to wanting the warmth and cuddles from thier mamas at night. wanting to feel another person's warmth and presence aren't needs, only breastfeeding can be counted as a real need.

you need to get your head of your brother's baby book... because GUESS WHAT? wait for it... my 21mo bottle fed daughter STILL wakes up 3-4 times a night for a bottle. my 4yo still breastfed daughter woke up less than that at the same age. but somehow, according to you, my bottle fed babe should be STTN by now?

maybe you need to come and have a talk with her and convince her that since she has her milk from a silicon teat instead of a human one, she should also be hugging her teddy bear instead of her mama? oh, and don't she dare wake up mama or daddy because there is no real need for it.

hideous.







some people really need to step out of thier box.

happily breastfeeding, bottle feeding and co-sleeping mama to 2 beautiful girls.


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## forrestguy

Me too, I love feeling my husband close to me in the middle of the night and rolling over for a sleepy love making session. We moved our tiny crappy couch next to our bed and put a baby mattress on it. Our baby rarely sleeps all the way on our makeshift couch baby bed, but at least he can be on the edge of our bed without me worrying about him rolling off. This gives us enough room to quietly and gently be intimate in the middle of the night.


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