# I think I have *that* child :(



## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

I am very sad to even be posting this. And I don't mean it to be dramatic.

I have 3 sons: aged 13, 11 and 2.5. The littlest is the challenge of the brood. He is playful, smart, imaginative and very precocious....but he's really high maintainance.

So...for about 6 months he has been getting worse and worse playing with other kids. ANY other kids. He wants to pretend "fight" all the time. All he talks about is good guys/bad guys, he makes guns out of his fingers, he "playfully" hits people often (even adults) and it's at the point where I cant take him anywhere and I am afraid that he is THAT kid who parents do not want their kid to be around. It breaks my heart because he is a treasure! But he is very difficult to be around. Even his 2 friends that he absolutely adores...he's realy physical with them and they hate it!

When my mother or gmother ask him for a kiss he will wind up and punch/hit them.

He pinches people for the reaction.

I cant let him just go off and play in the playground because he'll hold out his arm and pretend to shoot/punch/whatever other kids and he physically touches them. it's *always* about imaginative play (not outright aggression or anger) but it's never well recieved, obviously.

So far I have handled it by removing him from the situation, talking to him about how it felt to the other person, asking him to apologize....and Im at a loss now. It's getting worse and I'm embarassed daily, not to mention worried for him and his future. We are out of people to play with.

I am, by nature, an advocate of GD but i admit I am uneducated on the semantics of it. Does anyone have any advice for me and my boy? Please?

Oh and YES, my older boys play rough with him to a point and theres not much I have been able to do to stop it. But he does not play with tpy weapons or watch inappropriate telly.


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## princesspennie (Jul 26, 2005)

IWell my son is only 21 months and he is just getting into imaginative play. Also He is an only right now.

Your son sounds very bright, articulate and normal.

Most toddlers, my 21 month old included can exhibit this behavior.

As a matter of fact I tend to go to the park when it is empty or skip it all together.

Quote:

All he talks about is good guys/bad guys, he makes guns out of his fingers, he "playfully" hits people often (even adults) and it's at the point where I cant take him anywhere and I am afraid that he is THAT kid who parents do not want their kid to be around.
I remember being a kid and playing like that and I am a girl!. Sounds like he has a great imagination as as he gets older you may be able to explain why you do not want him to play pretend he has a gun. Right now he is just creating and being imaginative.

As for having a kid other parents dont want their kids around..dare I say..who cares what they think..I mean he is just 2.5 years old..


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

My daughter was like that too around that age. They get to a point where they can physically hurt people but they aren't aware that they're strong enough yet. He'll figure it out if you gently remind him that it hurts people when they're hit every time he does it.


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## ~PurityLake~ (Jul 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamazee* 
My daughter was like that too around that age. They get to a point where they can physically hurt people but they aren't aware that they're strong enough yet. He'll figure it out if you gently remind him that it hurts people when they're hit every time he does it.

My daughter is like that, too, only with kids she knows. She thinks it's funny when her older brother yells "Ow!" after she smacks him, and she just does it again. We've been trying to tell her that hitting (kicking, biting, etc.) is not a good choice, or ... gives owies. It seems to be working. We also have always taught her gentle along with baby sign language for communicating with her. She just doesn't yet understand how what she does affects other people. I'm sure she will just 'get it' one day.

As far as the imaginative play not being received well, I can relate to that. My daughter is very affectionate and likes to be involved in what others are doing. Every time she's around new kids, she wants to join (and they don't want her to because they don't know her or don't want to share) or she wants to hug them, and they shover her on her a**. I'm just glad that she picks herself right up, gives them a look, and goes to give someone else a hug.


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## moma justice (Aug 16, 2003)

my almost 4 yr old is STILL like that, except now she uses violence for fun, imagination time/play (this morning she came up and bit the crap out of me while pinching me with both hands, afte the fact she told me it was because she was pretending i was a mean wizard), boredom, and when other people do not give her her way.
IT SUCKS!!!
while i was at my parents with my sister and her kids (who she loves more than life and they mostly are awesome together) she bit her cousin so hard i could see his blood on her teeth.

it FREAKS me out and i am sure i have handled it wrong and right and all the imbetweens.

maybe she is that kid too.

she is also very caring, giving, thoughtful, helpful, deep

i am sure she will grow out of most of it and have to learn a few things the hard way

no advice, just a hug! and a me too


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

I have "that kid" too.









My 2.5 year old is a biter. It's bad. I have to stay next to him _every single second_ he's playing with other kids because at the drop of a hat he'll bite. Hard.

He's also just.... wild. He loves to run and scream and that quickly can turn aggressive, even if he doesn't mean it that way.

He's funny and smart and can be so, so sweet, but also very (very) rambunctious.

He is really and truly a handful right now, and I have gotten "the look" from other parents many, many times.


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *greeny* 
He is really and truly a handful right now, and I have gotten "the look" from other parents many, many times.

ROFL I know that look!

I had a mom tell a librarian my daughter shouldn't be allowed at storytime around that age. She might have been right.







My poor sweetie. I just did my own storytimes for her.


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## ~PurityLake~ (Jul 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *greeny* 
I have gotten "the look" from other parents many, many times.

I hate that look so much. Like their kid is perfect. They give me that look when they think I shouldn't give my daughter so much freedom. I quit going to baby class because I got in a big argument with another mother who wanted to tell me I was a negligent parent because I let my daughter climb on the empty chairs.


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

oh youre making me feel much better already. I just am not sure if Im doing the right thing, the wrong thing, enough, etc. It helps to hear that others can relate









We should rename this the That Kid Thread.


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## Tinas3muskateers (May 19, 2004)

I have "That kid"

He has to ask EVERYONE what their name is, and he touches people, he has no idea what personal space is. I try to hard to explain to him not everyone wants talked to or touched. He is overly social, so is my oldest son. They jsut wanna talk to everyone lol. ISaiah can also get to the hitting etc.. with strangers not jsut friends. I am always affraid some person who isnt into kids will get super offended because my kids all in their personal space.


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

Yeah the most anxiety is at places like the library or the playground, where I KNOW he's going to touch/push/hit someone eventually so I'm kind of a basketcase following closely but trying not to be hovering. Or even just the constant pretending to fight and shoot and whatnot.

At the post office yesterday he picked up 2 rolls of bubble wrap and pretended they were "cannons"!







: I am a very non-violent person and I do NOT like weapons or weapon-play so it's extra embarassing.

ETA: He just came up to me just now with a Lego guy and said, "take his head off!"









sigh.

This does not mean he's going to be a violent person, does it?? I hate the thought of him not having friends in school because he is not practicing self control and empathy.


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

Quote:

the most anxiety is at places like the library or the playground, where I KNOW he's going to touch/push/hit someone eventually so I'm kind of a basketcase following closely but trying not to be hovering
I know _exactly_ how you feel! Sometimes I don't go places simply because it stresses me out so much to have to constantly watch every single second and, even when I do, to know that I might not be able to stop something from happening.

Sometimes I tell moms, "I'm actually not a 'helicopter mom,' but he can get aggressive and I need to stay nearby," to which they'll either respond with a sympathetic and knowing look or with an "oh" that speaks volumes and lets me know that they want to get their sweetie away from mine as fast as they can.







:


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## mavery (Jun 3, 2005)

My ds is 3yrs 8mo and he is quite aggressive, often in the context of imaginative play. It has changed over time since he was the age of your ds -- he charges/attacks us less at home, which we have worked on and worked on (so maybe we actually helped him learn something!) but he lashes out at other kids more when he is angry. He doesn't hit or push other kids so much in pretend play any more but he is verbally aggressive instead, excluding them from what he's doing, bossing them around, etc.

One thing that we have instituted at the playground lately is that we remind him before we go that the playground is for everyone, we have to be gentle with other kids, and if he can't do that we will leave. Then he gets to mess up once or twice and we remind him, talk about it, help him apologize, and then the next time we leave. It does seem to have an impact the NEXT time we're at the playground and we say "remember how we had to leave...?"

Oh, and we have got more careful about what he watches -- even things we thought to be quite innocuous (like Thomas the Tank Engine!) get misused in his play. We haven't banned Thomas (bc he loves it too much) but we do talk through the behaviour (bumping each other, name-calling) more. The movie Cars was awful for promoting this kind of behaviour!! The number of boys at ds's preschool who run around bumping into each other on the playground pretending to be Chick, the mean racecar, is ridiculous.


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## AngieB (Oct 25, 2003)

My ds is "that" child. He is 6 1/2 now and things aren't great but they are getting better. I can let him play at the playground and monitor from a distance. I still have to calm him down sometimes and every once in a while I don't get there in time but it's much better than it was. School is hard because some of the other parents aren't very understanding but I figure that's thier problem. It sounds to me that you are doing everything right. I think these crazy boys are going to grow up to be amazing Men and we just have to stand by them. Don't let other people make you feel bad about him. I'm not sure how you feel about the weapons play but I've noticed that when I started letting my ds play with toy swords and Knight outfits at home he didn't feel the need to act it out everywhere we went. I let him get it out at home. I haven't bought him any toy guns, but he makes them out of things and plays make believe that way.


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## Erin+babyAndrew (Jan 2, 2004)

I so have that kid too







he's 3.5 and going through a "hate" phase right now. He tells me several times a day how he hates his little brother, he hates me, he hates dh.. We respond every single time how much we love him, and little brother loves him.
he also gets agressive with others. but not all kids, usually only other boys his age. When he plays with babies (except for baby brother) he is gentle and sweet. when he plays with girls he is wonderful, caring, respectful. There is just something about playing with other boys that he finds difficult. I think he may have trouble reading them and their imaginative play. He tends to take a lot of physical cues from other kids and even if they are just playful, he often feels like he needs to defend himself and he can be agressive. he is a lot better since he turned 3 last fall. When he was a toddler I could not take him around other children, it was a recipe for a really stressed out, fried mama and potentially injured other kids. I started taking him to a weekly playgroup just before he was 2 and he had some really bad moments in the beginning, but he slowly got better and better. now when I see other moms with that kid, I feel all kinds of sympathy for them. It's hard to be that mom too.


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## elizawill (Feb 11, 2007)

aww mama, i don't have much advice....but i wanted to tell you that my son is 3 and he thinks he is a power ranger. seriously...if you ask him what his name is....it's daniel power ranger. if he really likes you, he wants to wrestle you. it's seriously his love language or something.

he's just now coming out of this after months. he still thinks he's a power ranger of course.....but after lots of patience, talking, and redirecting from my husband and i ....he's *mostly* great around other children now. hang in there....this too shall pass!


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## Nature (Mar 12, 2005)

My dd is almost 4 and she's still like that. You are not alone in having THAT kid.









Its hard. I know.


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## monkey's mom (Jul 25, 2003)

Oh yeah, my 2 yr old is all about the "bad guys" and "shooters." He loves to rough house with his 5.5 yr. old big brother and daddy.

He's learning and playing.

Sometimes I think we're just not that far removed from the Darwinistic urge to fight, hunt, and kill.

Our little dudes would make GREAT cave-babies!

So, I really think it's normal and healthy play, you just have to mediate if other kids aren't into it or if they're having trouble with social and/or personal boundaries.

And for me, that just looks like staying close, asking other kids, "Do you want to play like this?" or "Is that bothering you?" and guiding my kid to be gentle or not touch or not "shoot" someone and redirecting him to something he can do.


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## Pinky Tuscadero (Jul 5, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *monkey's mom* 
Our little dudes would make GREAT cave-babies!

This made me think of something that might be helpful. Have any of you read The Happiest Toddler on the Block by Harvey Karp? I thought the book was a little silly but for a "caveman" kid it might be perfect. He recommends talking to your kid in caveman type talk that they will relate to. Check out the book and see what you think!


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## LowFlyingAnimals (Nov 30, 2003)

I wish there was some way for all these "that" kids to get their physical appetites sated without the looks or danger. I have one, too. He started beating up babies when he wasn't quite 2. He's been a biter. He loves to wrestle, chase, scream, fight. He came out of the womb like this. As a baby, his nursing was very energetic and "hands on." I had bruises, pinches, bite marks everywhere. I got advice to roughhouse with him before nursing, and that helped some, and helped me realize that he just has a physical need to fill.

He's been A LOT better, but still sometimes slips usually when I least expect it and am not shadowing him. I worked a lot with him teaching him what was "gentle" and that he needed to be "gentle" with his friends. That's what worked best. I also try to make sure he gets his fill of touch, roughhousing, and rambunctiousness. It's not uncommon, given the responses I get from moms who have btdt with their kids. But, the looks you get from those who haven't had "that" kid and the comments are difficult to deal with to say the least.


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LowFlyingAnimals* 
But, the looks you get from those who haven't had "that" kid and the comments are difficult to deal with to say the least.

I lost a friend over this. We were excited to get pregnant right around the same time because our kids would be the same age. We were excited when it turned out we were both having girls. But her daughter was quiet and compliant and happy all the time, and mine was *that child*. She kept telling me how I was being a bad parent by "allowing" it. It got ugly. I don't see her anymore but I hear her second child was one of "those children" too, and was a learning experience for her.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

i also feel like i have THAT kid. it is hard but i am confident that doing the things most people suggest will help (ie. spanking) will not help the situation. i don't really have much in the way of suggestions, i just wanted to say that you are not alone in this situation and that i think MANY toddlers go through this at one point or another.


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## wifeandmom (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Stinkerbell* 

When my mother or gmother ask him for a kiss he will wind up and punch/hit them.

He pinches people for the reaction.

it's *always* about imaginative play (not outright aggression or anger) but it's never well recieved, obviously.


Perhaps the last bit about it 'always' being about imaginative play was only meant to apply to the playground portion of your post. If not, I do not understand how someone asking him for a kiss and him punching them is *not* outright aggression and/or anger.







:

Either way, imaginative play or not, his behavior is simply not appropriate. As he gets a bit older, the natural consequences of his behavior (nobody wants to play with him) will surely sink in. In the meantime, I have no idea what to tell you other than the very first time he shows any aggression towards anyone at all, he should immediately be removed from the situation. He obviously cannot be allowed to hit/pinch/punch other people.


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## AngieB (Oct 25, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wifeandmom* 
Perhaps the last bit about it 'always' being about imaginative play was only meant to apply to the playground portion of your post. If not, I do not understand how someone asking him for a kiss and him punching them is *not* outright aggression and/or anger.







:

You must not have "that" kid, because I totally understand what she is saying.














These kids live in a world of imaginative play all the time. Grandma may be asking for a kiss but they are fighting off a dragon trying to eat them.


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## PumpkinSeeds (Dec 19, 2001)

Yes...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
You must not have "that" kid, because I totally understand what she is saying. These kids live in a world of imaginative play all the time. Grandma may be asking for a kiss but they are fighting off a dragon trying to eat them.


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## Nature (Mar 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
You must not have "that" kid, because I totally understand what she is saying.














These kids live in a world of imaginative play all the time. Grandma may be asking for a kiss but they are fighting off a dragon trying to eat them.









This is it exactly!!


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## wifeandmom (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
You must not have "that" kid, because I totally understand what she is saying.














These kids live in a world of imaginative play all the time. Grandma may be asking for a kiss but they are fighting off a dragon trying to eat them.

I honestly do not see how pinching people 'to see their reaction' can be chalked up to 'imaginative' play.

And honestly, if my 4 year old did not comprehend Grandma asking for a kiss and thought they were slaying a dragon as they smacked her in the face, I'd have him evaluated for comprehension problems.

It almost seems to me as if some posters are expecting a 'free pass' on their child's behavior because they are 'just using their imagination'. In the end, it doesn't really matter if he's using his 'imagination' to terrorize others or if he knows exactly what he's doing, it must be dealt with to protect other people from getting hurt.

FWIW, I *do* have a 4.5 year old with a temper problem. I do not, however, attribute it to an overactive imagination, nor do I allow him to lash out at other people inappropriately or aggressively. It is not acceptable. Period.

I do everything in my power to avoid meltdowns on his part (make sure he's well rested, isn't hungry, not too much sugar/junk food/processed stuff, routine as much as possible, keep him occupied, praise efforts to be kind/thoughtful/gentle, etc). In the end though, if he does have a meltdown and starts acting out aggressively towards me or anyone else, he is immediately removed from the situation until he has calmed down and we can discuss the problem.


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## hhurd (Oct 7, 2002)

I had "that kid" too, but at age 5 he's outgrown many of the "that kid" behaviors, thank heavens.

Wifeandmom, I don't think anyone was expecting a free pass, just comiserating with one another, and trying to understand their child's motivation. Jeesh.


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## pitchfork (May 3, 2005)

Anyone out there seen the video "Raising Cain"? It helps put into context the rough active gun play. Also puts in context of other cultures like Japan, where (according to the video) adults don't intervene in that sort of hitting and the kids work it out themselves. I rented it from netflix.


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## marybethorama (Jun 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
I'm not sure how you feel about the weapons play but I've noticed that when I started letting my ds play with toy swords and Knight outfits at home he didn't feel the need to act it out everywhere we went. I let him get it out at home. I haven't bought him any toy guns, but he makes them out of things and plays make believe that way.

I wonder if there could be a connection? I've known kids who were very restricted in terms of what they could play with/watch and they seem to be obesessed and wanting to pretend violence all the time and in every situation.

I'm very laissez-faire about weapon play and in our experience it's pretty limited. It happens but not all the time.


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## Aliviclo (Jul 3, 2007)

Some things I have learned from being the parent of one of "those" kids:

1. If kids are playing rough, there's always someone who is the roughest, and the other kids will need help telling that child when he's hurting them.
2. If a child has hurt their friend (and I disagree that all rough play needs to be stopped/discouraged...some kids LOVE to wrestle and play good guy/bad guy games), you as the parent should comfort the victim first, even before disciplining your child. Pull your child away from the situation, then talk to the victim "Ow! I saw that. That looked like it hurt. Are you ok?"
3. Once the victim has stopped crying, encourage them to tell your child how they feel about what happened. "Can you please tell Michael that you don't like that? Say 'I don't like it when you hit me. It hurts!'" That way you're empowering the victim and giving him safe tools to help himself next time.
4. After that exchange, turn to your child and use simple words (if they're small). "I won't let you hit/kick/bite your friend. That hurts. Come sit with me, and let's talk about how you can help keep your friends safe."
5. Sibling relationships are different. They just are. Siblings antagonize each other, and unless you're watching the whole thing unfold, you never know exactly what happened. Barring bloodshed or obvious painful injury, it's always better to let them work things out themselves if at all possible. Frame all fighting in a way that makes clear that they are choosing not to get along, without focusing much on whose fault it is. "Getting along with your brother/sister is a choice, and if you can't get along, you can each play alone in separate areas."


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## A Boy's Mama (May 15, 2007)

I'm pretty laissez-faire about weapon play as well (although I do limit shooter play since it has become an issue for him at preschool) and my son is sort of "that kid" at times too. He's a superhero, you see, and that involves a lot of showing off like getting into superhero poses (hysterical), running really fast (great!), yelling at bad guys (hmm), pretend punching (sigh), throwing things really hard (sometimes ok, sometimes not), shooting (ugh) and apparently sometimes yelling in people's faces how he's a superhero. Occasionally it can get physical which I'm pretty hardcore about but yeah, it's usually because he gets so wrapped up in this imaginitive play that he sort of like loses his mind for a few minutes.

Yay, it's not just us! Whew!


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wifeandmom* 
Perhaps the last bit about it 'always' being about imaginative play was only meant to apply to the playground portion of your post. If not, I do not understand how someone asking him for a kiss and him punching them is *not* outright aggression and/or anger.







:

Either way, imaginative play or not, his behavior is simply not appropriate. As he gets a bit older, the natural consequences of his behavior (nobody wants to play with him) will surely sink in. In the meantime, I have no idea what to tell you other than the very first time he shows any aggression towards anyone at all, he should immediately be removed from the situation. He obviously cannot be allowed to hit/pinch/punch other people.

Right. And thats what I do. But to clarify...my mother started this game with him where she chases him aroun d the house for a kiss and holds him down playfully and "steals" one while he fights her off. But that has grown to him doing it with everyone. I am not at all justifying his behavior or making light of it...I started the thread to ask for honest opinions and I appreciate them. But beleive me when I say he never hits someone out of anger...it is always in some imaginative world. He'll run up to a kid on the playground and say, "Stop right there, Venom. I am Spiderman and I'm here to rescue the kids!" and make a whooosh sound as he pushes him away. sigh.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
You must not have "that" kid, because I totally understand what she is saying.














These kids live in a world of imaginative play all the time. Grandma may be asking for a kiss but they are fighting off a dragon trying to eat them.

That's it exactly! Everything is a scenario of pretend play. He plays with boxes, cardboard tubes, bowls, towels, you name it. he is a dragon slayer, a robot, Spiderman, Captain Diaper, etc.

And he is sweet as pie, generous, funny, articulate and smart as a whip. But he's so playful and outgoing I worry about how he'll fare later on in school.


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A Boy's Mama* 
I'm pretty laissez-faire about weapon play as well (although I do limit shooter play since it has become an issue for him at preschool) and my son is sort of "that kid" at times too. He's a superhero, you see, and that involves a lot of showing off like getting into superhero poses (hysterical), running really fast (great!), yelling at bad guys (hmm), pretend punching (sigh), throwing things really hard (sometimes ok, sometimes not), shooting (ugh) and apparently sometimes yelling in people's faces how he's a superhero. Occasionally it can get physical which I'm pretty hardcore about but yeah, it's usually because he gets so wrapped up in this imaginitive play that he sort of like loses his mind for a few minutes.

Yay, it's not just us! Whew!

we shold get together for a playdate so they can save the world!


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## elizawill (Feb 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A Boy's Mama* 
He's a superhero, you see, and that involves a lot of showing off like getting into superhero poses (hysterical), running really fast (great!), yelling at bad guys (hmm), pretend punching (sigh), throwing things really hard (sometimes ok, sometimes not), shooting (ugh) and apparently sometimes yelling in people's faces how he's a superhero. Occasionally it can get physical which I'm pretty hardcore about but yeah, it's usually because he gets so wrapped up in this imaginitive play that he sort of like loses his mind for a few minutes.

Yay, it's not just us! Whew!


OMG - you and i have the same child!!!!!!!







i wish i could post pictures of my son in his superhero stances wearing his "get-up and go save the world" outfits....he's SOOOO cute! i have no idea how to post a youtube video in my siggy - otherwise i'd share his glory with you all!


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## hhurd (Oct 7, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pitchfork* 
Anyone out there seen the video "Raising Cain"? It helps put into context the rough active gun play. Also puts in context of other cultures like Japan, where (according to the video) adults don't intervene in that sort of hitting and the kids work it out themselves. I rented it from netflix.

I did see that and liked it. It's been a while so the details may be fuzzy, but the part where the little boys expressed their sadness when their "violent" stories were censored by the girls in their class really resonated with my dh and I.


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## clogmama (Dec 26, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pitchfork* 
Anyone out there seen the video "Raising Cain"? It helps put into context the rough active gun play. Also puts in context of other cultures like Japan, where (according to the video) adults don't intervene in that sort of hitting and the kids work it out themselves. I rented it from netflix.

I haven't seen the movie, but I have a Japanese friend with a son my son's age. When my son was 3 1/2, he started fighting with her son. I remember being in a very crowded park, and my son started hitting her son. When I started to walk towards my son to intervene, my Japanese friend encouraged me to stand back and watch them, and let them work / fight it out. She told me that in Japan, it is good for kids to be able to work it out on their own. My son and his friend rolled around on the grass, hitting and kicking for a few minutes. And then it was over. They played together wonderfully the rest of the afternoon. It was a good lesson for me!


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

That's pretty fascinating. I'm not an advocate of fighting, in general, but I can see how if you are friends it might be a good idea in some situations to let them work it out. Not many parents would be comfortable with that, though.


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## junipermuse (Nov 1, 2006)

I just wanted to recommend a book called "Magic Capes, Amazing Powers" it's available from Amazon. It's actually a teacher resource book meant for the classroom, but I think most of it can be adapted for home. It really deals with why children engage in the rough imaginative superhero kind of play and how we can help them meet their needs and respect their ideas without people getting hurt. I bought the book when we had a couple of "those" kids in our preschool classroom. I found it very playful and respectful.


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## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

Have you tried putting him in martial arts or wrestling? Or anywhere else where he could get some physical interaction, but while learning control?


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## AngieB (Oct 25, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wifeandmom* 
I honestly do not see how pinching people 'to see their reaction' can be chalked up to 'imaginative' play.

And honestly, if my 4 year old did not comprehend Grandma asking for a kiss and thought they were slaying a dragon as they smacked her in the face, I'd have him evaluated for comprehension problems.

It almost seems to me as if some posters are expecting a 'free pass' on their child's behavior because they are 'just using their imagination'. In the end, it doesn't really matter if he's using his 'imagination' to terrorize others or if he knows exactly what he's doing, it must be dealt with to protect other people from getting hurt.

FWIW, I *do* have a 4.5 year old with a temper problem. I do not, however, attribute it to an overactive imagination, nor do I allow him to lash out at other people inappropriately or aggressively. It is not acceptable. Period.

I do everything in my power to avoid meltdowns on his part (make sure he's well rested, isn't hungry, not too much sugar/junk food/processed stuff, routine as much as possible, keep him occupied, praise efforts to be kind/thoughtful/gentle, etc). In the end though, if he does have a meltdown and starts acting out aggressively towards me or anyone else, he is immediately removed from the situation until he has calmed down and we can discuss the problem.


My ds is never given a "free pass" for his behavior! However it is helpful to know where it is coming from and why he did what he did. I also do not think that every boy who doesn't conform to todays standard of calm little pacifists needs to be tested and labled as having something wrong with him. Yes, they need to be taught that they can't hurt people and It sounds to me like the original poster is working very hard at doing so. It would also be very helpful if other poeple could try and be understanding and not make the mom feel like she is failing because her ds it taking a little longer to learn self control.


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## mashenka (Oct 8, 2006)

Oh man can I relate. I will join my hand in the arm wavings of "I have that kid!" DS is 3.5 and also plays rough as we put it. He does have a temper, which we see at home, but with his friends it's mostly inappropriate roughness. He is big, has always been big, and is bigger than most of his friends. They are scared when he comes running towards them, goofy grin on his face, saying he will tackle or tickle or whatever physical interaction they are eager to avoid.

I have been in tears on and off for the last several months because we had to leave a play group of friends we've been playing with since the kids were babies [they are all boys--just imagine the chaos in a group of 3.5 year-old boys]. My friends have been understanding and encouraging me to not pull away, but I feel so bad when he makes other kids cry. It is also exhausting to keep asking him not to play rough.

What I have found works is that he plays better with older kids. He is intimidated enough by their bigger size and intellectual superiority that he cooperates and doesn't become inappropriate as often as with the same-age peers.

We are in a homeschool coop which is great because he is in just the environment that suits him. I think sending him to preschool would be a nightmare as he would just be playing in a way that he thought was fun but other kids thought was scary.


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## wifeandmom (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AngieB* 
My ds is never given a "free pass" for his behavior!

Great! What that means to me is he is not allowed to act aggressively towards the same child more than one time when in a particular situation. And if he exhibits a pattern of aggressive behavior in a particular situation, he is no longer put in that situation (i.e. hitting repeatedly at play group means he doesn't go to play group anymore).

Quote:

However it is helpful to know where it is coming from and why he did what he did.
Well, obviously this is helpful. I already touched upon how I go about reducing the opportunities my own DS has to act aggressively and the things I do to help him not lash out (i.e. enough rest, not hungry, etc etc).

Quote:

I also do not think that every boy who doesn't conform to todays standard of calm little pacifists needs to be tested and labled as having something wrong with him.
Expecting a 4 year old not to hit Grandma in the face when she asks for a kiss is considered a 'calm little pacifist'? What I said was if my 4 year old truly did not comprehend that hitting Grandma in the face in the name of 'imaginative play' was unacceptable, I'd have him checked out by professionals. I would be concerned if my 4 year old had that kind of comprehension problem.

Quote:

Yes, they need to be taught that they can't hurt people and It sounds to me like the original poster is working very hard at doing so.
I agree.

Quote:

It would also be very helpful if other poeple could try and be understanding and not make the mom feel like she is failing because her ds it taking a little longer to learn self control.
Personally, the times I've seen *the look* given to other moms were in situations where mom is standing by saying things like 'Oh, boys will be boys' or shrugging their shoulders as if to say 'What can I do?' instead of actually dealing with their aggressive child. My understanding stops where another child begins hurting my own child and _is allowed to continue_ with that same behavior because mom refuses to deal with her aggressive child for whatever reason.

Why or how long it takes another child to learn self control is really not the point. The point is, *the look* IME is most frequently seen when a child is allowed to continue behaving aggressively towards other people with no intervention. Even worse is the child who is told 'Now little Johnny, if you hit again, we'll have to leave.' and 27 hitting episodes later, little Johnny hasn't gone anywhere.


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *natensarah* 
Have you tried putting him in martial arts or wrestling? Or anywhere else where he could get some physical interaction, but while learning control?

Not yet but we've talked about it. My husband was a martial arts instructor for many years and his opinion is that Brady is not going to flourish in an environment with that sort of strict structure. He doesn't even sit for storyhour at the library.

WifeandMom, I do feel defensive about your posts. I have to say that. I'm here being very honest about it and it's not easy to talk about your child in a less-than-stellar light. I am a good mother and I most certainly do not want to see him grow up without learning empathy and self control but I hope you see that I am here putting my thoughts on the table to ask for true contribution and advice. And I do appreciate yours, but I think you are reading intent into his actions that simply is not there. I have raised 2 sons before this one and they are both empathetic, charming, self sufficient and socially responsible teens.


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## Nature (Mar 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Stinkerbell* 

WifeandMom, I do feel defensive about your posts. I have to say that. I'm here being very honest about it and it's not easy to talk about your child in a less-than-stellar light. I am a good mother and I most certainly do not want to see him grow up without learning empathy and self control but I hope you see that I am here putting my thoughts on the table to ask for true contribution and advice. And I do appreciate yours, but I think you are reading intent into his actions that simply is not there. I have raised 2 sons before this one and they are both empathetic, charming, self sufficient and socially responsible teens.











Having *that* child myself... you are not alone in your defensive feelings.

WifeandMom, its almost as if you don't really understand. We are not those mothers that let it happen and shrug and continue talking with our friends. We aren't the mothers counting to 10 a million times and never taking action. But we also aren't the mothers who have a child that is aggressive simply to be mean and hurtful.

I know in my case, my daughter is very empathetic of others. She is just very physical. There is no other motive for it and she certainly doesn't need professional help. It IS simply how she is. We as mothers just need to be able to discuss it and keep up the strength that it takes to parent these children. They are oh so lovable and unique.. but can be very intense as well. And we know that there are many people like you out there that simply don't understand and often make statements that are harsh and full of judgment.














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## RockStarMom (Sep 11, 2005)

I'm so glad I'm not the only one.
My daughter is 21 months old and has only been minimally aggressive in play date-type situations, but we live with another little girl her age and my daughter is a total bully toward her. The other little girl is never aggressive at all, and the other mom often treats my daughter as if her intentions are malicious. It's gotten to the point where I'm hoping to move.
It's so incredibly frustrating. So ironic, too, because I used to be so sure that *those* children were all somehow a product of their parents' parenting. Ha!


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## elizawill (Feb 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wifeandmom* 
Personally, the times I've seen *the look* given to other moms were in situations where mom is standing by saying things like 'Oh, boys will be boys' or shrugging their shoulders as if to say 'What can I do?'

i just wanted to say the only times i have gotten the "look" are when i've been at walmart or some store and he was hitting at me or screaming because i wouldn't buy him a toy or something. i have physically had to walk out of stores when my ds was younger (leaving my dd and dh to continue shopping) because he was having such a tantrum that people were giving me "the look". some were thinking, "why doesn't she spank that kid!" while others were thinking "oh that poor child - she's so mean!". meanwhile, all i wanted to do was cry, because i felt completely helpless. it just sucks. thank god my ds is past that stage!!


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I used to get "the look" and I think it was "why doesn't she control that child?"

My daughter is really relaxed and easy-going now so I don't get it anymore. But it frustrated me when I did. Anyway, she outgrew that stage, and tantrums, and everything else without me "controlling" her.


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## hhurd (Oct 7, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wifeandmom* 
What I said was if my 4 year old truly did not comprehend that hitting Grandma in the face in the name of 'imaginative play' was unacceptable, I'd have him checked out by professionals. I would be concerned if my 4 year old had that kind of comprehension problem.

Perhaps it's not a "comprehension problem", but more a matter of poor impulse control. Very few 4 year olds can control ALL of their impulses ALL the time.

If they did I'd have them checked out by a professional.


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## moma justice (Aug 16, 2003)

i agree with hhurd, it is not like my dd (almost 4) does not know that i am not an evil wizard, she just gets into her game and the lines blur.

plus impulse control is not %100 for that age child.

infact my elderly pedi/dr. (i love him, he is a grandfather and very wise and loving) reminds me that the part of the young child's brain that is the logic part does not fully muture till the age of 6 and you only see glimpses of logic (included in that is impulse control) till that point...then by the time they are 13 the teen hormones kick in and they overshadow that part of the brain so much that they are almost back to square one when comes to impulse control and logic.

and i get "the look" often for different kinds of behavior, sometimes i don't blame the other moms, i am guilty of thinking older children (children that are my dd's age NOW) were problem children/poorly raised for the kinds of things my dd does all the time now.

live and learn, and don't judge!


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