# Healing the Gut Tribe--January 2007



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Happy New Year, everyone!


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Happy New Year! Hope everyone had a great holiday!

I started my new Failsafe diet today, I get to eat rice, lentils and pears oh my!


----------



## joeysmom1729 (Sep 12, 2006)

Happy New Year! I'm new to this tribe! I really need some major healing, I don't think I'm digesting much of anything right now. My gut is severely damaged from ulcerative colitis and corticosteroids. I just don't even know where to begin. As mentioned in the December thread, I've tried SCD so many times but I just get sooo hungry and end up eating some kind of carb with rice in it. I'm only doing no gluten and no dairy now. I've been off dairy three years and gluten six months.

I'm currently taking Flax oil, L-Glutamine, prenatal multi and Floradix Floravital for anemia.

Would love to see what everyone else is doing.


----------



## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Subbing


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Hi all! Hope everyone enjoyed the holidays.

Welcome Melissa! I'm also new here, and my DD and I have major thrush issues. There's a ton to learn!

Some questions for y'all.....

-If I'm taking digestive enzymes to assist my antifungals, when should I take them? The directions say before food, but shouldn't I take them before my meds (which come after I eat)?

-Which is better, virgin coconut oil in a whole spelt flour cake made with brown rice malt - which is the ONLY way I can eat enough to help me - or this: http://www.omeganutrition.com/produc...et-coconut.php which is made from copra and goes through a process to remove the flavor. It is not refined: http://www.omeganutrition.com/faqs-n...coconut.php#q8 I know it's not optimal, but if the only way I can eat it is in a cake, that's REALLY not optimal!

Any thoughts???


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
Happy New Year! I'm new to this tribe! I really need some major healing, I don't think I'm digesting much of anything right now. My gut is severely damaged from ulcerative colitis and corticosteroids. I just don't even know where to begin. As mentioned in the December thread, I've tried SCD so many times but I just get sooo hungry and end up eating some kind of carb with rice in it. I'm only doing no gluten and no dairy now. I've been off dairy three years and gluten six months.

I'm currently taking Flax oil, L-Glutamine, prenatal multi and Floradix Floravital for anemia.

Would love to see what everyone else is doing.

I'd add cod liver oil, maybe evening primrose oil (or borage oil). Perhaps some MSM (helps heal the interstitial spaces between cells). Vitamin C + bioflavonoids (we use Pure Radiance C, for example) - go read JaneS' vitamin C link somewhere here.

For snacking, why not use soaked nuts/nut butter with fruit? Apples and almond butter or apples with cashew butter are divine. In fact, I've come to believe that the only reason apples exist is so that they can be carriers of nut butters.

Cashew butter pancakes are heavenly. And cashew butter cookies are even better than peanut butter cookies.

not that I've done SCD... but I would recommend the book "Grain-free Gourmet" - lots of good ideas in there that ARE SCD-legal.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Happy New Year! Hope everyone had a great holiday!

I started my new Failsafe diet today, I get to eat rice, lentils and pears oh my!

Yummy. Let us know how it goes. Nothing like a New Year to begin a new healing process.


----------



## mommy2girlies (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:
Originally Posted by caedmyn
mommy2girlies--Thrush is a symptom of a yeast overgrowth. Eczema can be caused by yeast, too, or by food allergies, or by essential fatty acid deficit. Splenda's a chemical sweetener and I wouldn't use it. Stevia, while not SCD legal (but Splenda isn't either), is an herbal calorie-free sweetener you could try.

If you think dairy is causing your DS's problems, you need to eliminate it for several weeks--it takes up to 6 weeks for dairy to get out of your system. If that doesn't help or doesn't completely clear up the issues, you might want to consider a candida program with diet changes, anti-fungals or enzymes, and probiotics. The probiotics would be a good idea in any case.

Ok, so thrush is gone. I found Stevia at our local grocery store and I've been using that. But eczema is still there. I haven't gone full non dairy yet hard thru the holidays..And we've stopped giving him any solids. But we were really analyzing what could be the problem and we both (dh and I) recall that the eczema didn't start till after we started him on solids. So although Im pretty sure he is dairy sensitive, I don't think thats what caused the eczema, seeing as how it didn't appear earlier, before solids. So now Im only bf'ing and watching the eczema and if it disappears, we'll add solids back in one at a time. I read a good way of introducing solids. You touch their face w/ the food, then wait 4 hours for a reaction, if no reaction, you put some on their lips, wait again, etc. I think this'll be the way we do it.

Anyone have any suggestions or thoughts on what could be the cause of the eczema. its fairly mild, but I hate that he has it at all. He only ever ate either fresh or jarred (organic) sweet potato, avocado, carrot, pear. Im not sure if these foods are normal allergens. Thanks in advance

ps, Dh is doing wonderfully after we started w/ the SCD diet!! We're not following it to the letter (hard to make the commitment) but he's been pain free since we started!


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

I have Bacteria for Breakfast for $10. PM me if you want it...

Joeysmom - I havent done SCD either, but bluets is right about FAT (nuts, butter, oil, etc), and lots of it. Ive heard that butter, nuts, and olive oil stick to your ribs more than coconut oil. Im doing anticandida, and until I started eating A LOT of coconut oil I was losing weight. Cademyn, another ati-candida mama, eats about 1/2 C of CO/day. I definitely eat that much if not more. Also, if you do start on lots of nuts, do soak them (maybe SCD requires this







)- I dont know about UC but nuts are hard to digest and I imagine that would not be a good thing for an inflamed colon.

Happy New Year everyone!!


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

saskiasmom, how do you stand the taste? I really, really need to eat coconut oil, as I'm also anticandida, but I can't, unless I mask the taste in a cake, which is NOT anticandida! So I'm stuck. See my previous post - I found a coconut oil that has the taste taken out, but it's made from copra, is that okay?


----------



## joeysmom1729 (Sep 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
I have Bacteria for Breakfast for $10. PM me if you want it...

Joeysmom - I havent done SCD either, but bluets is right about FAT (nuts, butter, oil, etc), and lots of it. Ive heard that butter, nuts, and olive oil stick to your ribs more than coconut oil. Im doing anticandida, and until I started eating A LOT of coconut oil I was losing weight. Cademyn, another ati-candida mama, eats about 1/2 C of CO/day. I definitely eat that much if not more. Also, if you do start on lots of nuts, do soak them (maybe SCD requires this







)- I dont know about UC but nuts are hard to digest and I imagine that would not be a good thing for an inflamed colon.

Happy New Year everyone!!

How do you eat the coconut oil?


----------



## EBG (May 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MeMommy* 
saskiasmom, how do you stand the taste? I really, really need to eat coconut oil, as I'm also anticandida, but I can't, unless I mask the taste in a cake, which is NOT anticandida! So I'm stuck. See my previous post - I found a coconut oil that has the taste taken out, but it's made from copra, is that okay?


I'm not saskiamom but I have some ideas....
Copra is dried coconut and could be contaminated with mycotoxins...
It's better to get virgin CO. Or if you can't stand the taste, organic refined not from copra such as Jarrow or Tropical Traditions Expeller Pressed.

You can put it into smoothies: coconut milk, CO and berries, or avocado, or other low-sugar stuff.
You can make chocolate with it. Melt, mix in pure cocoa/carob powder and stevia. put a scoop into hot peppermint tea.
Use it for cooking eggs.
Another dessert: mix with almond butter, drop spoonfuls on chilled pan and put in freezer for an hour.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
How do you eat the coconut oil?









Hmm, well, I dont have the problem of hating the taste. I think its yummy (so do the kids! Never have they eaten so many vegetables). How I eat it; use about 4 tbsp. per meal in cooking (every meal is a pile of veggies sauteed in CO and eggs or meat). I used to put some in my tea, but didnt like it. I sometimes mix a few tbsps with a few drops of stevia and a LOT of cinnamon, mash it all together, put it in the freezer until hard and munch on CO/cinnamon chunks. The kids beg me to share, whereas my friend said it almost made her hurl, so be warned. I have made *fake cream* out of butter, CO (total of 1/2C melted fat), 3 raw eggs, 1 C boiling water and 2 tbsp. gelatin mixed in a blender. It will have the consistency of jello. You can use this in tea, or just eat it. But I am out of the habit of making that... Seriously, my kids line up in the morning; "viatmin C!, blue oil! [aka cod liver oil - the bottle is blue], coconut oil!" and they get each one, the CO on a spoon.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MeMommy* 
Hi all! Hope everyone enjoyed the holidays.

Welcome Melissa! I'm also new here, and my DD and I have major thrush issues. There's a ton to learn!

Some questions for y'all.....

-If I'm taking digestive enzymes to assist my antifungals, when should I take them? The directions say before food, but shouldn't I take them before my meds (which come after I eat)?

-Which is better, virgin coconut oil in a whole spelt flour cake made with brown rice malt - which is the ONLY way I can eat enough to help me - or this: http://www.omeganutrition.com/produc...et-coconut.php which is made from copra and goes through a process to remove the flavor. It is not refined: http://www.omeganutrition.com/faqs-n...coconut.php#q8 I know it's not optimal, but if the only way I can eat it is in a cake, that's REALLY not optimal!

Any thoughts???

Digestive enzymes need to be taken 2 hrs after meals or 1 hour before (at least)...they are supposed to work by destroying the cell walls of the yeast, and then anti-fungals can come in and finish killing the yeast, so enzymes and anti-fungals don't need to be taken at the same time of day.

From what I understand refined CO still has health benefits, it just isn't as good as unrefined, so if you can find good quality refined that might be the way to go.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
How do you eat the coconut oil?

I add a Tbsp or so to hot tea, use a Tbsp to cook my eggs in the morning, add about 4 Tbsp to my meat and veggies dinners, and add 2-3 Tbsp to my soup for lunch. I also make mayo with 1/2 EVOO and 1/2 CO, and then make "Thousand Island" salad dressing with that and have a couple of salads a day. If you're doing the SCD you can add it to nut butters if you make your own.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
I sometimes mix a few tbsps with a few drops of stevia and a LOT of cinnamon, mash it all together, put it in the freezer until hard and munch on CO/cinnamon chunks. The kids beg me to share, whereas my friend said it almost made her hurl, so be warned.

I tried this once...it was nasty!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommy2girlies* 
Quote:
Originally Posted by caedmyn
mommy2girlies--Thrush is a symptom of a yeast overgrowth. Eczema can be caused by yeast, too, or by food allergies, or by essential fatty acid deficit. Splenda's a chemical sweetener and I wouldn't use it. Stevia, while not SCD legal (but Splenda isn't either), is an herbal calorie-free sweetener you could try.

If you think dairy is causing your DS's problems, you need to eliminate it for several weeks--it takes up to 6 weeks for dairy to get out of your system. If that doesn't help or doesn't completely clear up the issues, you might want to consider a candida program with diet changes, anti-fungals or enzymes, and probiotics. The probiotics would be a good idea in any case.

Ok, so thrush is gone. I found Stevia at our local grocery store and I've been using that. But eczema is still there. I haven't gone full non dairy yet hard thru the holidays..And we've stopped giving him any solids. But we were really analyzing what could be the problem and we both (dh and I) recall that the eczema didn't start till after we started him on solids. So although Im pretty sure he is dairy sensitive, I don't think thats what caused the eczema, seeing as how it didn't appear earlier, before solids. So now Im only bf'ing and watching the eczema and if it disappears, we'll add solids back in one at a time. I read a good way of introducing solids. You touch their face w/ the food, then wait 4 hours for a reaction, if no reaction, you put some on their lips, wait again, etc. I think this'll be the way we do it.

Anyone have any suggestions or thoughts on what could be the cause of the eczema. its fairly mild, but I hate that he has it at all. He only ever ate either fresh or jarred (organic) sweet potato, avocado, carrot, pear. Im not sure if these foods are normal allergens. Thanks in advance

ps, Dh is doing wonderfully after we started w/ the SCD diet!! We're not following it to the letter (hard to make the commitment) but he's been pain free since we started!

I posted a reply for you on the December thread


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I'm trying a major herbal gut healing protocol for the next couple of months...dandelion, burdock root, nettle, slippery elm bark, vitamin C, liquid chlorophyll, chlorella or spirulina, 32 oz of water kefirs a day and 12 oz of kombuch a day







: I hope it works!

DD's reflux symptoms seem to have gone away since I eliminated wheat. Unfortunately I think she may be reacting to something else I'm eating, probably either eggs or tomatoes







I think I will have to eliminate them for a bit but it's going to be difficult as I only eat about 10 foods on a regular basis and those are two of them. I'm going to start her on solids again, too, as she's really wanting to eat when I eat now and eliminating solids didn't help her eczema any, so I might as well feed her.


----------



## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

joeysmom, what is it about the SCD that makes you hungry? I remember being hungry only when I tried to combine SCD and anti-candida. Is it because you can't do dairy? That would make it harder. Can you do nuts? I think nut butter is the first to be introduced. Eat lots of fatty meat, like lamb and dark meat poultry and salmon and beef. Eat freqently. Eat bananas! And introduce cooked apples fairly soon. And if having it around temps you then don't have it in the house! If you need carbs, eat more carrots! The soup has a ton of carrots in it, that should help. You could also try a bit of cooked squash like butternut squash. It's not on the intro diet, but it's better than rice!


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Hi everyone,
No time to catch up right now but a quick question.

I bought the bobs red mill coconut flour. Are other brands of coconut flour better? This stuff tastes like cardboard! I thought the brm almond meal was bad!


----------



## joeysmom1729 (Sep 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
joeysmom, what is it about the SCD that makes you hungry? I remember being hungry only when I tried to combine SCD and anti-candida. Is it because you can't do dairy? That would make it harder. Can you do nuts? I think nut butter is the first to be introduced. Eat lots of fatty meat, like lamb and dark meat poultry and salmon and beef. Eat freqently. Eat bananas! And introduce cooked apples fairly soon. And if having it around temps you then don't have it in the house! If you need carbs, eat more carrots! The soup has a ton of carrots in it, that should help. You could also try a bit of cooked squash like butternut squash. It's not on the intro diet, but it's better than rice!

I guess I just have too many rice products in the house and it's too easy for me to grab them. I was also hooked on Van's gluten free waffles. I also couldn't do the yogurt, so I just didn't know what else to eat. Too much juice makes my diarrhea worse. I actually am trying again today. I'm really determined to do this!! I've had diarrhea for over a month now and I'm getting so weak. I see my gastro tomorrow and I know he's going to bring up 6-MP, which I refuse to go on. That is why I really have to give this diet a shot. How soon can I try the nut flour muffins?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Hi everyone,
No time to catch up right now but a quick question.

I bought the bobs red mill coconut flour. Are other brands of coconut flour better? This stuff tastes like cardboard! I thought the brm almond meal was bad!

wilderness family naturals is a good one. i've also read that tropical traditions has good stuff too.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
I guess I just have too many rice products in the house and it's too easy for me to grab them. I was also hooked on Van's gluten free waffles. I also couldn't do the yogurt, so I just didn't know what else to eat. Too much juice makes my diarrhea worse. I actually am trying again today. I'm really determined to do this!! I've had diarrhea for over a month now and I'm getting so weak. I see my gastro tomorrow and I know he's going to bring up 6-MP, which I refuse to go on. That is why I really have to give this diet a shot. How soon can I try the nut flour muffins?

if you make bone broths and can get some of the broth to gel, the gel also makes a yummy snack. or buy some gelatin powder from the store and use it to make plain gelatin.


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Anyone on here tried EFT (Emotional Freedom Techniques) for their gut issues? I'm an EFT therapist, but I didn't even think about trying it for my yeast! Yesterday I read this article, andthat's what gave me the idea.

I'm going to try it, I'll let you all know what happens!!


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Anyone here dealing with reflux? Seems it is what I have, or at least one of many things. Curious as to what you are doing for it.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Anyone here dealing with reflux? Seems it is what I have, or at least one of many things. Curious as to what you are doing for it.

I take Betaine HCL tablets with meals. As long as I take the right amount I don't have problems with reflux. They're supposed to eventually teach your stomach to produce the right amount of HCL again, and I was able to reduce my dose from 4 per meal to 2-3 per meal after a while, so hopefully I'll eventually be able to stop them altogether. I take the 350 mg ones but the 60-650 mg ones seem more common.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Anyone have any experience with kinesiology (sp?)? I'm thinking about trying it for DD if nothing else works.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Subbing.

We've talked about IgE vs IgG allergies here before. When I started this whole gut-healing journey, I was sure that we had food sensitivities (IgG) due to leaky gut. Now that we've been diagnosed with regular old IgE ones, I wonder how that plays into gut healing. I'm frustrated by not knowing how it's all connected. I don't buy that we've got these allergies because of unlucky genetics since we do not have a family history of allergies at all. And yet, my dd is definitely allergic to a few things now, and sensitive to many more. SCD isn't even an option because, among other things, we are avoiding all nuts and dairy and many fruits.

Anyone want to discuss this?


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Anyone have any experience with kinesiology (sp?)? I'm thinking about trying it for DD if nothing else works.

we tried NAET 4 years ago when dd1 was just shy of 2. the accupuncturist used kinesiological testing as the basis for diagnosing the allergies, then as the retest after applying the technique (accupressure on some particular meridian while in contact with the allergenic item or a vial of homeopathically prepared allergen).

i also saw a chiropractor for pregnancy induced hypertension, and he used kinesiological testing to decide what supplements to give me, and as pre/post testing for treatment.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

been reading here for about a month, trying to learn more in relation to our family's issues. dd1 had numerous food sensitivities as a baby, we did elimination dieting (off dairy and soy for over a year), later did NAET and a candida cleanse with some success, in that her sleep improved somewhat, eczema (developed at 18 mos in elbow/knee folds) improved somewhat, and adding soy and dairy back into our diet didn't exacerbate things.

i've suspected at times that yeast has flared back up, and reading here makes me wonder if anyone ever really gets rid of it. as maintainance we take probiotics, and i've been adding commercial kefir, kombocha tea recently since learning about them here. i added coconut oil (spectrum organic virgin unrefined) as a supplement about 3 weeks ago, taking 1/2 tablespoon 2-3 times a day. a week ago i had a reaction to some nuts dh brought home (my lips itched and swelled a bit) whereas i usually eat nuts (occasionally) with no problem. yesterday i felt my mouth itch about 10 min after taking the coconut oil. i also itched after eating an avocado, which i reacted to sometimes years ago, but haven't had any problem with lately.

so i'm wondering if i've been unknowingly allergic to coconut, and daily exposure is making it more apparent, and lowering my tolerance to all things that i might be "a little" allergic to. i've always loved coconut, especially fresh in the tropics, but also dried, candied, milk, etc. i know that sometimes the foods you love are the ones you're allergic to, once you get hooked on the body's beta-endorphine response.

some earlier posts mentioned mycotoxins in some CO; i'm also wondering if the brand i'm eating has this issue, and maybe i'm reacting to that, not the coconut (i hope...).

i had my husband do NAET on me for the CO. i hope he hit the right spot; he's quite the skeptic and it'd been a few years since i needed anything cleared so i'm a little fuzzy on where to press. i'll try the CO again in a few days.

any advice/insight?


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
yesterday i felt my mouth itch about 10 min after taking the coconut oil. i also itched after eating an avocado, which i reacted to sometimes years ago, but haven't had any problem with lately.

so i'm wondering if i've been unknowingly allergic to coconut, and daily exposure is making it more apparent, and lowering my tolerance to all things that i might be "a little" allergic to. i've always loved coconut, especially fresh in the tropics, but also dried, candied, milk, etc. i know that sometimes the foods you love are the ones you're allergic to, once you get hooked on the body's beta-endorphine response.

some earlier posts mentioned mycotoxins in some CO; i'm also wondering if the brand i'm eating has this issue, and maybe i'm reacting to that, not the coconut (i hope...).

i had my husband do NAET on me for the CO. i hope he hit the right spot; he's quite the skeptic and it'd been a few years since i needed anything cleared so i'm a little fuzzy on where to press. i'll try the CO again in a few days.

any advice/insight?

Oh my, this has been my experience recently. I've never been a big coconut eater. I enjoyed it, but never went out of my way to get it.

We bought coconut oil when we gave up dairy (to replace butter) and I've been using it somewhat regularly. But I just started eating more coconut milk and last week, I made coconut yogurt. I ate one small container every day that week and I noticed that my mouth started to feel a bit itchy and I felt a bit congested. Also, dd (who is nursing and allergic to other things) refused the yogurt after her first bite. Last night, I made an Indian dish that included about 5 oz of that yogurt. DD ate one bite of the meat, and spit out the next. My mouth started to feel very itchy , and the roof of my mouth seemed scratched (like when I ate Captain Crunch as a kid







: ). I got a headache, too, that came on suddenly a few minutes later.

Anyway, I'm taking dd in for some further allergy testing, but we're definitely avoiding coconut for now. I'm really freaked out that I'm having a problem with it, because in the past little while, I seem to be reacting to many things I've never had a problem with before.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Could this be die off? You are both, if i remember right, dealing with yeast? CO is an antifungal... although that wouldnt explain the reactions to the other stuff..


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Moonshine - are you still doing TCM? Ive heard of people having success with reflux doing that, if the HCL doesnt work. Walt Stoll's site has a lot of info about the relationship btwn stress and GI issues (and not in the obvious, Im stressed/anxious so shunting blood from my GI tract). I have found his ideas - based on well accepted research - very relevent to me, surprisingly so. If you want to hear more, PM me, and Ill tell you all about my issues


----------



## amis2girls (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
DD's reflux symptoms seem to have gone away since I eliminated wheat. Unfortunately I think she may be reacting to something else I'm eating, probably either eggs or tomatoes

Can I ask you what diet you're doing? Eliminating the top 8 or something else more geared toward healing the gut?

Or is it all the same?







:


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

i *just* read on the yahoo GFCFNN list that coconut oil and avocados are high in salicylates (amongst other offending things). could that be part of the problem?


----------



## mommy2girlies (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I posted a reply for you on the December thread










Thank you....Eczema looks great today. Redness is completely gone, although you can still see very faint little bumps. In the areas where it was really mild, its now gone







: So its either the solids or dairy. So I've stayed off dairy for good for the past few days, but we're pretty sure its the food he's eating. We're gonna wait for a few more days and try solids again and see what his trigger is.

Thanks for the feedback


----------



## mommy2girlies (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
joeysmom, what is it about the SCD that makes you hungry? I remember being hungry only when I tried to combine SCD and anti-candida. Is it because you can't do dairy? That would make it harder. Can you do nuts? I think nut butter is the first to be introduced. Eat lots of fatty meat, like lamb and dark meat poultry and salmon and beef. Eat freqently. Eat bananas! And introduce cooked apples fairly soon. And if having it around temps you then don't have it in the house! If you need carbs, eat more carrots! The soup has a ton of carrots in it, that should help. You could also try a bit of cooked squash like butternut squash. It's not on the intro diet, but it's better than rice!

We're doing the SCD with my dh and he swears he's not hungry. I would be starving!! So as a household we've cut down on carbs and have gone vegetarian again. And because of ds, Im dairy free!







: We've really had to get rid of some of our foods that we crave, cuz both of us have no will power. If its in the house and I want it, its nearly impossible for me to say no. I can rationalize anything, especially if chocolates involved.







I LOVE food and now its so frustrating. Im hungry but its almost too much trouble to figure out what I can eat. Im a huge cheese fan!! Does anyone have any good suggestions for veggie cheese. A kind that melts good? Am I asking the impossible?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Subbing.

We've talked about IgE vs IgG allergies here before. When I started this whole gut-healing journey, I was sure that we had food sensitivities (IgG) due to leaky gut. Now that we've been diagnosed with regular old IgE ones, I wonder how that plays into gut healing. I'm frustrated by not knowing how it's all connected. I don't buy that we've got these allergies because of unlucky genetics since we do not have a family history of allergies at all. And yet, my dd is definitely allergic to a few things now, and sensitive to many more. SCD isn't even an option because, among other things, we are avoiding all nuts and dairy and many fruits.

Anyone want to discuss this?

I feel like we are in a similar situation. We have food sensitivities, maybe some food allergies, but are they caused by leaky gut or is leaky gut the result of being sensitive to these foods? I have started on the Failsafe diet to see if that can help us. I have just started it, so I don't know that I can offer you any advice, but I can post the websites where I have been getting my info.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...tolerance.html
http://www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuf...tion-diet.aspx
http://www.fedupwithfoodadditives.in...afebooklet.pdf
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~breakey/index.html

I am also a member at the yahoo groups FailsafeUS, FailsafeNT, and failsafebaby. I have started the Failsafe elimination diet CFGF and egg free. I have also cut out all my supplements, as many of them bother chemically sensitive people. I want to start the diet as clean as possible so we can try to find out what is bothering us.

SCD helped but in the end it is not the answer for us.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
i *just* read on the yahoo GFCFNN list that coconut oil and avocados are high in salicylates (amongst other offending things). could that be part of the problem?

This is one of the things that Failsafe aims to cut out, as well as amines and sulphites, and of course nasty chemicals.

Only on day 3 of the diet, but I have no cravings of any sort. I am usually a late night muncher (especially for crunchy foods) and even though sugar is allowed on this diet, I don't want it.


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Anyone have any experience with kinesiology (sp?)? I'm thinking about trying it for DD if nothing else works.

We got DD tested by a kineseologist when I thought she had reflux, but really she just had multiple food sensitivities. The kineseologist was able to tell me what to avoid, and since then DD has been a different, and happier baby.


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
some earlier posts mentioned mycotoxins in some CO; i'm also wondering if the brand i'm eating has this issue, and maybe i'm reacting to that, not the coconut (i hope...).

i had my husband do NAET on me for the CO. i hope he hit the right spot; he's quite the skeptic and it'd been a few years since i needed anything cleared so i'm a little fuzzy on where to press. i'll try the CO again in a few days.

any advice/insight?

I think the mycotoxins were in reference to my question, on coconut oil made from copra. If you are using virgin CO, I don't think you can make it from copra and call it virgin, but I may be wrong. Just check out how your CO is made.

As for the NAET, you can also use EFT (Emotional Freedom Techniques) for food sensitivities/allergies. The website is here. I have been using EFT on DD for her food issues since we got her tested. We will be going back soon to get tested again, and I am hopeful that they will have all cleared by now.

I am also treating us for the thrush with EFT, although I will have to wait until next week to really begin in earnest, things get a little hectic here at the end of the week.


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Someone mentioned here about probiotics feeding yeast? Does anyone know about this? It's funny, 'cuz DD's thrush has been looking great, I haven't given her probiotics in a while, and yesterday I gave her and today it looks worse.

But it also could have been the doughnut I ate







.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MeMommy* 
Someone mentioned here about probiotics feeding yeast? Does anyone know about this? It's funny, 'cuz DD's thrush has been looking great, I haven't given her probiotics in a while, and yesterday I gave her and today it looks worse.

I posted it, and here's what Ive made of it since; yeast serves the purpose in your body of eating dead things - dead skin cells (your gut turns over new cells every 14 hrs, ideally), and dead bacteria, and waste. When you die, it eats your body (yeah, nice). If there are too many yeasties in your gut, your Ph is likely affected, more alkaline than acid. Bacteria need an acid environment to live, so they wont survive an alkaline gut, die, and the yeast eat it. Supposedly, primal defense can survive in alkaline conditions (no I didnt read the above on a PD webpage







and over time can affect the Ph of the gut, so say you take PD for 3 mos and then slowly switch to regular pb's and wean off the primal defese.

Now, how to verify this, I dont know. Another problem is that the dose for affecting gut Ph w/ PD is high, so $$$.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Supposedly, primal defense can survive in alkaline conditions (no I didnt read the above on a PD webpage







and over time can affect the Ph of the gut, so say you take PD for 3 mos and then slowly switch to regular pb's and wean off the primal defese.

Now, how to verify this, I dont know. Another problem is that the dose for affecting gut Ph w/ PD is high, so $$$.

how high a dose?

when we did the candida cleanse diet 4 years ago i took 6-8 primal defense caplets each 24hrs for 3-4 weeks, after working my way up to that level the prior 2 weeks. i had a lot of die off symptoms then: crabby, achy, cravings, junkie withdrawal feelings. i tested (kinesiology) negative for candida, then went back to eating fruits, carbs etc., though not the same diet as before the cleanse. i've taken up to 3/day since, but not all the time; i've gone off them for months occasionally, and also eat yogurt and take jarrodophilus sometimes.


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Subbing.

We've talked about IgE vs IgG allergies here before. When I started this whole gut-healing journey, I was sure that we had food sensitivities (IgG) due to leaky gut. Now that we've been diagnosed with regular old IgE ones, I wonder how that plays into gut healing. I'm frustrated by not knowing how it's all connected. I don't buy that we've got these allergies because of unlucky genetics since we do not have a family history of allergies at all. And yet, my dd is definitely allergic to a few things now, and sensitive to many more. SCD isn't even an option because, among other things, we are avoiding all nuts and dairy and many fruits.

Anyone want to discuss this?

Me, me! Though I have less to say than to learn. I finally broke down and took my 7 mo old to a traditional allergist yesterday because I'm so sick of guessing. Fortunately, she is interested in doing more than just IgA testing, so I take that as a good sign. We're doing the ImmunoCAP RAST and some other blood testing. She is doing some gluten sensititivity testing and IgG, IgA, and IgM, so maybe we'll learn something. It will be a week and a half before we get any results, though.

I'm in the same boat about not understanding how it is all related to gut healing. We've been doing SCD since late July, and while I feel a lot better physically, it is soooo hard to do without dairy, eggs, and nuts. There are times when the die-off and hunger make me crazy, and it is so time consuming to have to make everything from scratch. And on top of all that, I don't know how much healing is going on.

I've thought about the amines connection, but it doesn't seem to match up with her reactions yet, though I've just started thinking about it and going back through my food journals.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
how high a dose?

Ive read btwn 12-18/day. However, I think this may be for people who have serious candida overload, and the PD would be your antifungal. So it could be that if you have less yeast, you need less PD to get your gut more acid (not fighting as much alkalinity from as much yeast as some have?) This is all my putting reading together, subject to change


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I feel like we are in a similar situation. We have food sensitivities, maybe some food allergies, but are they caused by leaky gut or is leaky gut the result of being sensitive to these foods? I have started on the Failsafe diet to see if that can help us. I have just started it, so I don't know that I can offer you any advice, but I can post the websites where I have been getting my info.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...tolerance.html
http://www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuf...tion-diet.aspx
http://www.fedupwithfoodadditives.in...afebooklet.pdf
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~breakey/index.html

I am also a member at the yahoo groups FailsafeUS, FailsafeNT, and failsafebaby. I have started the Failsafe elimination diet CFGF and egg free. I have also cut out all my supplements, as many of them bother chemically sensitive people. I want to start the diet as clean as possible so we can try to find out what is bothering us.

SCD helped but in the end it is not the answer for us.

I think there may be something to this for us, but I haven't trialed it yet because I want to get rid of all the known allergen reactions she's had (when we get cross-contamination from corn, as it is so pervasive). I've also eliminated most fruits because at the beginning she was reacting to them.

I'm going to go for some more allergy testing, the capRAST blood test to see if there is an allergy explanation for her sensitivity to some of these things before I do failsafe. We're already cooking everything from scratch, so it won't be that much more difficult. I am however worried about dd's growth and nutrition. She's very small and she can't take vitamins or eat anything enriched because several vitamins are corn-derived.

baby's calling...


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amis2girls* 
Can I ask you what diet you're doing? Eliminating the top 8 or something else more geared toward healing the gut?

Or is it all the same?







:









I started out with healing the gut (candida diet) and eliminating dairy since DD reacted to it with blood in her stools. My gut seems to have healed (although maybe not cuz she reacts to stuff I eat) but hers seems to have gotten worse, so now I am trying to figure out what she is allergic to it. So far she reacts to dairy, wheat, and tree nuts, and I'm avoiding peanuts. The only soy I ever eat is soy sauce every once in a while (or whatever is snuck into processed foods that I occasionally cheat with), so I haven't really focused on that. I don't think healing the gut and eliminating allergens really have the same focus, but I'm starting to wonder if most people don't need to eliminate their allergens, or at least their major ones, in order to heal.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LovinLiviLou* 
Me, me! Though I have less to say than to learn. I finally broke down and took my 7 mo old to a traditional allergist yesterday because I'm so sick of guessing. Fortunately, she is interested in doing more than just IgA testing, so I take that as a good sign. We're doing the ImmunoCAP RAST and some other blood testing. She is doing some gluten sensititivity testing and IgG, IgA, and IgM, so maybe we'll learn something. It will be a week and a half before we get any results, though.

I'm in the same boat about not understanding how it is all related to gut healing. We've been doing SCD since late July, and while I feel a lot better physically, it is soooo hard to do without dairy, eggs, and nuts. There are times when the die-off and hunger make me crazy, and it is so time consuming to have to make everything from scratch. And on top of all that, I don't know how much healing is going on.

I've thought about the amines connection, but it doesn't seem to match up with her reactions yet, though I've just started thinking about it and going back through my food journals.

The more I think about it, the more I believe MY leaky gut is what caused all this. No one in my or my dh's families are allergic. But I, more than any other members of our families, has had an abundance of antibiotics, as well as a poor diet growing up (think generic brand, processed food). My health improved as my diet did (in college and beyond, as I became more educated about it), but in the past few years (shortly before I became pg with dd), I've developed a corn sensitivity and now, a coconut one. Also, the antibiotics we had during labor didn't help, and I think made my dd more susceptible to a variety of allergies (she's also allergic to milk, and I believe somewhat allergic to soy).

I'm going to look at the salycilates and amines connection, but I want to have the capRAST done, too. The allergist I saw was very unreceptive to me when it came to that test (he only wanted to do the scratch test, which isn't very comprehensive. It only looked at 8 foods). I'm going to see a new doc, a pediatrician, and hopefully, he'll order the test.

The advantage dd has is that she's a toddler and CAN outgrow these sensitivities. I don't know if adults can or not. Maybe I'll post a question about that in the allergy forum. . .


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Could this be die off? You are both, if i remember right, dealing with yeast? CO is an antifungal... although that wouldnt explain the reactions to the other stuff..

I don't think so. Strangely, since we've identified and eliminated her allergens, the yeast has completely gone away. No more yeast rashes anywhere. I do think that there is a whole body connection to all of this. A damaged gut leads to yeast leads to food sensitivities/allergies leads to more gut damage and so on.

Also, the reaction to coconut, at least for me, has become quite immediate, and I think dd is experiencing the same thing, since she rejects it so quickly (even when the presence of the substance isn't at all of obvious, in either taste or texture).


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
i *just* read on the yahoo GFCFNN list that coconut oil and avocados are high in salicylates (amongst other offending things). could that be part of the problem?

It's possible. But the reaction I had seems similar to oral allergy syndrome. I don't know if the salycilate foods cause that same kind of response.


----------



## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Has anyone seen/taken http://secure.unikeyhealth.com/index...PROD&ProdID=38?

What do you think?


----------



## amis2girls (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I started out with healing the gut (candida diet) and eliminating dairy since DD reacted to it with blood in her stools.

I eliminated dairy about three months ago and things got better for about a week, but now back to the beginning.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I don't think healing the gut and eliminating allergens really have the same focus, but I'm starting to wonder if most people don't need to eliminate their allergens, or at least their major ones, in order to heal.

That's exactly where I'm at.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyofPunkiePie* 
Has anyone seen/taken http://secure.unikeyhealth.com/index...PROD&ProdID=38?

What do you think?

I was going to get these at one point but in the end I didn't because I didn't like not knowing how many billion CFU's of beneficial bacteria were in it. It sounds good. If you decide to get it, it's $31.50 at iherb.com.


----------



## amis2girls (Mar 2, 2005)

Here's my second "is this a leaky gut?" question...

My dd #3 has just turned one. I believe leaky gut causes her reflux which causes her chronic middle ear fluid. Can leaky gut also cause fever? She will, out of the blue, start a fever of 100-101 (although this latest round is 101.5-102.0) and continue for 3-5 days. No other symptoms, other than feeling absolutely lousy.

The only thing I've found online is

Quote:

seven results of the preliminary inflammation of the gut...5. Interference to the gut's protective coating of immunoglobulins, resulting in decreased defence against bacteria, protozoa, viruses and yeasts. 6. Spread of infection due to the 'escape' of bacteria and yeast from the intestine.
Does it look like I'm on the right track or should I look someplace else (and if that's the case, where??) for the cause of the recurrent fever?


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Sorry I'm a lousy buddy lately.
I'm wanting some opinions on what is going on with me lately.

Last week I started a few new things and my gut isn't happy about something.

On Thursday I started using npc (natural progesterone cream).
On Friday I started taking Nu Zeruba (anti-parasite/anti-fungal)
I have also been making an effort to get more probiotics, pills, water kefir, kombucha etc.

My symptoms. I'll have diahrea but only pass a little bit of stool. Then later on I'll have to go very urgently and pass a large fairly formed stool. Lots of gas and it is stinky (haven't had this in months). My poop today and yesterday is very pale. For the past week is very peanut butter-y sticky and hard to get out of me. I have found myself running for the bathroom many times lately only to get there and not be able to go or it takes a long time to go.

Thoughts? Is this die off? Is this something else? Any other ideas? I have done the hcl before and seemed to improve my digestion to the point where I didn't need it anymore but could it have gotten bad again?

Also, I fasted today for breakfast and lunch (church thing). I felt fine while I was fasting. In fact I felt the best I have felt in a while. Then tonight I ate dinner and although my stomach didn't hurt like it has been I found myself running for the bathroom again this evening (it didn't happen all day). The only thing I consumed before dinner tonight was tea and water kefir.


----------



## Bex80 (Feb 8, 2004)

Subbing---been curious about this topic for a LONG time. Is there a thread that outlines *how* to heal the gut? Specific foods, do's and don'ts? Please advise.


----------



## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Ever since I have started taking my supplements (B50, Cal/mag/zinc, vitamin A & D, vitamin E, EPO) I have not had good bowels. The day I got everything, I also started to get a little sick, so I did vitamin C to bowel tolerance, and I think that's where it started. I was also taking fish oil and it gave me horrible gas, so I stopped taking it.

Stools are the usual color, but they are very sticky. Bleeding hemorrhoids (had them since high school but never this bad) have me wiping with DD's cloth wipes and using diaper rash cream so I can sit comfortably. I also have a little flap of flesh that sticks out of my anus (leftover from the crappy sewing job after my fourth degree tear despite episiotomy -- there should be a law about men being OB's







) which can sometimes hide stool and cause irritation. And I keep forgetting to take my probiotics because they are in the fridge.

I am not eating dairy, eggs, or wheat, and I am more of a meat and veggies kind of girl. I have been craving oils a lot lately, coinciding with the start of the supplements.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Sorry I'm a lousy buddy lately.
I'm wanting some opinions on what is going on with me lately.

Last week I started a few new things and my gut isn't happy about something.

On Thursday I started using npc (natural progesterone cream).
On Friday I started taking Nu Zeruba (anti-parasite/anti-fungal)
I have also been making an effort to get more probiotics, pills, water kefir, kombucha etc.

My symptoms. I'll have diahrea but only pass a little bit of stool. Then later on I'll have to go very urgently and pass a large fairly formed stool. Lots of gas and it is stinky (haven't had this in months). My poop today and yesterday is very pale. For the past week is very peanut butter-y sticky and hard to get out of me. I have found myself running for the bathroom many times lately only to get there and not be able to go or it takes a long time to go.

Thoughts? Is this die off? Is this something else? Any other ideas? I have done the hcl before and seemed to improve my digestion to the point where I didn't need it anymore but could it have gotten bad again?

Also, I fasted today for breakfast and lunch (church thing). I felt fine while I was fasting. In fact I felt the best I have felt in a while. Then tonight I ate dinner and although my stomach didn't hurt like it has been I found myself running for the bathroom again this evening (it didn't happen all day). The only thing I consumed before dinner tonight was tea and water kefir.

Could you be doing too much at once and overwhelming your system with die-off? All my gastrointestinal symptoms now are die-off--every once in a while I get diarrhea or lots of gas or stomach rumbling and it usually is after meals but that's when I drink most of my kombucha and water kefirs. My stools do vary a fair amount from day to day, too, and I think it is because my gut bacteria are still trying to find a balance. Maybe you could try stopping your probiotics and anti-fungals for a couple of days and then adding them back one at a time to see what happens. It might be that one specific thing is causing it, too--I can drink a quart of water kefir a day with little or no gastro symptoms but a few ounces of kombucha can give me diarrhea.

Is your DD doing any better?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bex80* 
Subbing---been curious about this topic for a LONG time. Is there a thread that outlines *how* to heal the gut? Specific foods, do's and don'ts? Please advise.









There's a "Healing the Gut Cheat Sheat" stickied at the top of this forum.


----------



## Kundalini-Mama (Jul 15, 2002)

Hey mamas,

I'm not here much, and not really on the diet anymore come to think of it







I'm not eating any sugar or anything, but I've added potatoes (in limited quantities), some grains (even corn chips--no problem) and ezekial bread. I'm still not eating any crap, soy oil or anything like that. The biggie though, is that our local cafe makes sourdough bread (spelt starter) that is yeast free. I have been unable to consume gluten in any capacity without raging and immediate bloating and run to the toilet diarrhea. I tolerate the bread--no exception. I did have a tincture last week (grain alchohol) and became hugely bloated, so I still cannot consume straight gluten, but properly prepared NT gluten is no problem









I was on SCD for 7 months. Very strict w/TONS and TONS of probiotics. I'd eat almost a quart of 24hr raw goat yogurt daily and tons and tons of kombucha. I know this helped tons!

Anyway, just wanted to check in with you all and show you this thread I posted. Unfortunately no one is interested in it, but I know you all would be









Amy


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I need some opinions on this...I strongly suspect that DD is allergic/intolerant to coconut. I think she reacts (eczema flare-up) when she eats coconut oil and when I eat coconut products, although not when I eat coconut oil unless that is the reason her eczema won't go away. I don't think it is die-off because this has been going on for too long. I really, really do not want to eliminate coconut oil from my diet--1/3 of my calories come from it and I can't use olive oil in nearly as many ways as I use CO. Here's my dilemma: if she doesn't noticeably react when I eat CO, even though she reacts to other CO products and when she eats CO, is she less likely to outgrow a coconut sensitivity because she is continually being exposed to CO? Or could it be more of a dosage thing, where she has to be exposed to a certain amount of it before it affects her (assuming no visible reaction=no immune reaction, I guess)? Does that make sense?

This might do a better job of explaining than I can, from http://allergies.about.com/gi/dynami...dditives.info/

Quote:

Dose

Allergic reactions can be to the tiniest amount of an allergen.

Intolerance reactions to food chemicals are dose-related. Some people are more sensitive than others. In theory, everyone will react to food additives if they consume enough and one study on MSG confirmed this, although a few of the subjects reacted to very high doses which were unlikely to be consumed in one sitting.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Subbing...late as usual!

Caedmyn, I have to say I strongly disagree with that excerpt. What they are saying, in essence, is that they don't SEE a reaction, which as we all know is far different from not having a reaction. My dd has no visible reaction from a tiny bit of soy, but I wouldn't take the chance and give her a tiny amount. I wouldn't necessarily see neurological disfunction right away, KWIM? Bottom line, if it can't be given in large amounts, it can't be given in small amounts IMO. Damage is damage no matter how small. (wow, that was very Dr. Suess of me!)

However, I spent the last two years feeding my kids known allergens along with a strict (SCD) diet to heal their guts. I know that it isn't the food that is the issue in IgG reactions, but the leaky gut. More exposure can result in more issues (eczema, behavioral issues etc.) but won't effect healing time. I guess what I always believed was as long as you are taking steps to close up that gut exposure wasn't a problem. I took away anything that fed bacteria and would ferment in their guts and made it really simple. I fed my dd the same foods she was reacting to all the way through the SCD, and my ds for that matter and they DID stop reacting. However when we went off the diet the reactions came back. Clearly we didn't spend enough time there. I know not everyone has success with it, but we saw HUGE improvements...physically and emotionally. Their rashes were gone, they began napping, their BM were more normal and more regular, they weren't as hyper and dd started really talking. Now I'm feeding them their known allergens and we are seeing huge regression. I keep falling off the dang diet, but it's clear we need to be there.

Long story short, I'm very confused. It seems that everything I *know* from textbooks, workshops, conferences etc. is really off base. I have had alot of education and am feeling like I don't know much anymore.

Most of the accepted literature says that these reactions stop IF the children stop being exposed.

I hope that made sense!


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MeMommy* 
I think the mycotoxins were in reference to my question, on coconut oil made from copra. If you are using virgin CO, I don't think you can make it from copra and call it virgin, but I may be wrong. Just check out how your CO is made.

As for the NAET, you can also use EFT (Emotional Freedom Techniques) for food sensitivities/allergies. The website is here. I have been using EFT on DD for her food issues since we got her tested. We will be going back soon to get tested again, and I am hopeful that they will have all cleared by now.

I am also treating us for the thrush with EFT, although I will have to wait until next week to really begin in earnest, things get a little hectic here at the end of the week.

We use EFT daily! I have seen amazing differences for me and ds, not so much dd though. Interesting thing is he's totally willing to have me tap for him, she's not.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
It's possible. But the reaction I had seems similar to oral allergy syndrome. I don't know if the salycilate foods cause that same kind of response.

Absolutely they can! In fact they are the likely culprits as far as I know.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I need some opinions on this...I strongly suspect that DD is allergic/intolerant to coconut. I think she reacts (eczema flare-up) when she eats coconut oil and when I eat coconut products, although not when I eat coconut oil unless that is the reason her eczema won't go away. I don't think it is die-off because this has been going on for too long. I really, really do not want to eliminate coconut oil from my diet--1/3 of my calories come from it and I can't use olive oil in nearly as many ways as I use CO. Here's my dilemma: if she doesn't noticeably react when I eat CO, even though she reacts to other CO products and when she eats CO, is she less likely to outgrow a coconut sensitivity because she is continually being exposed to CO? Or could it be more of a dosage thing, where she has to be exposed to a certain amount of it before it affects her (assuming no visible reaction=no immune reaction, I guess)? Does that make sense?

This might do a better job of explaining than I can, from http://allergies.about.com/gi/dynami...dditives.info/

I would be very concerned that she wouldn't outgrow it if she's being constantly exposed through bm. Can you eliminate it to see if her eczema goes away? Can you make up the calories with other oils?

It is so frustrating, isn't it? I really thought coconut milk was going to be our magic bullet, a great way to get the probiotics into dd, and a good replacement for many dairy products. But now, it seems we're both reacting to it


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Subbing...late as usual!

Caedmyn, I have to say I strongly disagree with that excerpt. What they are saying, in essence, is that they don't SEE a reaction, which as we all know is far different from not having a reaction. My dd has no visible reaction from a tiny bit of soy, but I wouldn't take the chance and give her a tiny amount. I wouldn't necessarily see neurological disfunction right away, KWIM? Bottom line, if it can't be given in large amounts, it can't be given in small amounts IMO. Damage is damage no matter how small. (wow, that was very Dr. Suess of me!)

However, I spent the last two years feeding my kids known allergens along with a strict (SCD) diet to heal their guts. I know that it isn't the food that is the issue in IgG reactions, but the leaky gut. More exposure can result in more issues (eczema, behavioral issues etc.) but won't effect healing time. I guess what I always believed was as long as you are taking steps to close up that gut exposure wasn't a problem. I took away anything that fed bacteria and would ferment in their guts and made it really simple. I fed my dd the same foods she was reacting to all the way through the SCD, and my ds for that matter and they DID stop reacting. However when we went off the diet the reactions came back. Clearly we didn't spend enough time there. I know not everyone has success with it, but we saw HUGE improvements...physically and emotionally. Their rashes were gone, they began napping, their BM were more normal and more regular, they weren't as hyper and dd started really talking. Now I'm feeding them their known allergens and we are seeing huge regression. I keep falling off the dang diet, but it's clear we need to be there.

Long story short, I'm very confused. It seems that everything I *know* from textbooks, workshops, conferences etc. is really off base. I have had alot of education and am feeling like I don't know much anymore.

Most of the accepted literature says that these reactions stop IF the children stop being exposed.

I hope that made sense!

It does make sense...my issue with feeding DD things she reacts to is that she ISN'T healing, in fact she's gotten worse. So I wonder if her poor little body is so busy reacting to the allergens that she isn't able to do any healing.

Sometimes I feel that way, too...the more I learn the less I know!


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Subbing...late as usual!

Caedmyn, I have to say I strongly disagree with that excerpt. What they are saying, in essence, is that they don't SEE a reaction, which as we all know is far different from not having a reaction. My dd has no visible reaction from a tiny bit of soy, but I wouldn't take the chance and give her a tiny amount. I wouldn't necessarily see neurological disfunction right away, KWIM? Bottom line, if it can't be given in large amounts, it can't be given in small amounts IMO. Damage is damage no matter how small. (wow, that was very Dr. Suess of me!)

However, I spent the last two years feeding my kids known allergens along with a strict (SCD) diet to heal their guts. I know that it isn't the food that is the issue in IgG reactions, but the leaky gut. More exposure can result in more issues (eczema, behavioral issues etc.) but won't effect healing time. I guess what I always believed was as long as you are taking steps to close up that gut exposure wasn't a problem. I took away anything that fed bacteria and would ferment in their guts and made it really simple. I fed my dd the same foods she was reacting to all the way through the SCD, and my ds for that matter and they DID stop reacting. However when we went off the diet the reactions came back. Clearly we didn't spend enough time there. I know not everyone has success with it, but we saw HUGE improvements...physically and emotionally. Their rashes were gone, they began napping, their BM were more normal and more regular, they weren't as hyper and dd started really talking. Now I'm feeding them their known allergens and we are seeing huge regression. I keep falling off the dang diet, but it's clear we need to be there.

Long story short, I'm very confused. It seems that everything I *know* from textbooks, workshops, conferences etc. is really off base. I have had alot of education and am feeling like I don't know much anymore.

Most of the accepted literature says that these reactions stop IF the children stop being exposed.

I hope that made sense!

FF, were their allergens IgG or IgE? I really think that if they are IgE mediated that it takes more than gut healing to get them to stop reacting. Their whole immune system has to be re-set, which may or may not happen, depending on their age and how long they follow strict avoidance. Of course, this is just one theory, but it's the theory we are following as far as my dd's IgE allergies because I know of first hand instances (and have read many more online) of children outgrowing the allergies.

If you're talking about IgG intolerances, then, I don't know. Can you do SCD AND avoid their allergens? Maybe that would lead to a more permanent gut-healing?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

That would be almost impossible. We could be doing SCD with no dairy, eggs, nuts, tomato, peaches, banana, avacado, coconut, plums, carrots, peanuts, pear, apple, orange, onion etc... I'm just not up for that.

We have IgE and IgG. I am doing far more than diet stuff to reset their systems. Beyond diet and supplements we do EFT, homeopathy, accupuncture, CST etc. I don't believe in chasing allergens, but in healing the body. Everything needs to be addressed for this to happen. I feel like that is what we are doing. We have tried so many things. I still have a few tricks up my sleeve though....we'll see.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
It does make sense...my issue with feeding DD things she reacts to is that she ISN'T healing, in fact she's gotten worse. So I wonder if her poor little body is so busy reacting to the allergens that she isn't able to do any healing.

Sometimes I feel that way, too...the more I learn the less I know!

Since I know that you have been experiencing that for a long time I would say that may be the case. I'm so sorry. I wish I could offer more. I'm talking to my homeopath about doing specific remedies for known allergens. I'll let you know what I come up with.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I need some opinions on this...I strongly suspect that DD is allergic/intolerant to coconut. I think she reacts (eczema flare-up) when she eats coconut oil and when I eat coconut products, although not when I eat coconut oil unless that is the reason her eczema won't go away. I don't think it is die-off because this has been going on for too long. I really, really do not want to eliminate coconut oil from my diet--1/3 of my calories come from it and I can't use olive oil in nearly as many ways as I use CO. Here's my dilemma: if she doesn't noticeably react when I eat CO, even though she reacts to other CO products and when she eats CO, is she less likely to outgrow a coconut sensitivity because she is continually being exposed to CO? *Or could it be more of a dosage thing, where she has to be exposed to a certain amount of it before it affects her (assuming no visible reaction=no immune reaction, I guess)?* Does that make sense?

This might do a better job of explaining than I can, from http://allergies.about.com/gi/dynami...dditives.info/

my understanding from research, and personal experience leads me to believe that there's a lot of immune reaction happening before any "visible" reaction shows up. allergists talk about "allergic load," where you can tolerate a lot of low exposure to your allergens, or a few big exposures, then you show a reaction, sort of a "straw that broke the camel's back" thing. the histamines released from low exposure can circulate and build up. my experience is that after i gave up dairy and soy 5 years ago (which i didn't think of myself as being allergic to), because dd1 was reacting to them in the bm, i "suddenly" was able to tolerate going to my friend's cat furry house without visibly reacting, and i didn't get seasonal allergies. i had been allergic to dairy as baby/child, and given soy formula as a result. (oh, and i was weaned at 2 weeks because i was "allergic" to mama's milk







: great bfing support in the 60's). i was probably allergic to them all along, especially looking back on the dairy cravings i had.

also, if your baby is getting a consistent level of exposure, she might not "show" any reaction because the baseline you're referencing is one of that constant exposure.

sorry i can't offer support for continuing coconut. this gut stuff is so frustrating, full of hope at new ideas, then despair when things don't get/stay better. and so much effort making and eating things that aren't very satisfying.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

All this talk of allergies makes me wonder if that is also what I am dealing with. Since October, I am getting face rashes, which I never had before. They are now happening fast and furiously, as in, as I am almost healed from a flareup, it starts again. I noticed the start of another one yesterday. This morning I woke up and my eyes are so swollen I can barely see. I really don't know what to do about this. Blood tests indicated that I am not allergic to anything I was tested for (apple, coconut, walnuts, almonds, banana, gluten, carrots, avocado, cinnamon). But I am clearly reacting to something. I have no idea how to make this go away. Today I am trying H2O2, as soon as DH comes back with an eye dropper. Allergy medicine (Benedryl, Claratin, Zertec) is not helping -- should that tell me something?

If anyone has any ideas on how to reduce swelling (as in my eyelid is swollen to about 500x its normal size) I would be most appreciative.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
All this talk of allergies makes me wonder if that is also what I am dealing with. Since October, I am getting face rashes, which I never had before. They are now happening fast and furiously, as in, as I am almost healed from a flareup, it starts again. I noticed the start of another one yesterday. This morning I woke up and my eyes are so swollen I can barely see. I really don't know what to do about this. Blood tests indicated that I am not allergic to anything I was tested for (apple, coconut, walnuts, almonds, banana, gluten, carrots, avocado, cinnamon). But I am clearly reacting to something. I have no idea how to make this go away. Today I am trying H2O2, as soon as DH comes back with an eye dropper. Allergy medicine (Benedryl, Claratin, Zertec) is not helping -- should that tell me something?

If anyone has any ideas on how to reduce swelling (as in my eyelid is swollen to about 500x its normal size) I would be most appreciative.

You poor thing







That sounds really uncomfortable.

I know that all of those meds have corn or corn-derived ingredients (I know because dd and I can't have them due to corn allergy).

Also, dd is the one that tested positive for corn, but once we eliminated it (she's bfing), a small itchy patch on my face cleared up (I'd had it for 3 years). It was annoying but somehow, I never thought seriously about it and never attributed it to an allergy.

Did you test for soy? I think there are soy derivatives in some of those meds, too.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
That would be almost impossible. We could be doing SCD with no dairy, eggs, nuts, tomato, peaches, banana, avacado, coconut, plums, carrots, peanuts, pear, apple, orange, onion etc... I'm just not up for that.

We have IgE and IgG. I am doing far more than diet stuff to reset their systems. Beyond diet and supplements we do EFT, homeopathy, accupuncture, CST etc. I don't believe in chasing allergens, but in healing the body. Everything needs to be addressed for this to happen. I feel like that is what we are doing. We have tried so many things. I still have a few tricks up my sleeve though....we'll see.

Well, if anyone can overcome it, you can! You're such a wealth of knowledge and I know that I appreciate all the information you provide on this thread. Now if we could only get a HTG subforum


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Actually I did test for corn, not sure about soy. I don't take any of those pills regularly, but I have gotten a bit desperate. I too one Benedryl this morning and it made no difference, same with Zertec.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Moonshine- how did you test for allergies? WHat kind of blood test? And was it just for IgE or for IgG too? I'm very concerned that your eyes are swelling shut at this point. You may need to think about an epi pen, if this is progressive and you haven't isolated the cause you may want to follow the better safe than sorry adage...


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Not to be an alarmist, and I don't think that an epi pen solves anything, it is a medication and does have side effects. However it is better than risking an anaphylactic reaction.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Caedmyn- DD is doing well. (knock wood) we have made a few changes here and I'm not sure what to atribute the changes too but I'm feeling optimistic. We did a homeopathic remedy last week on wed. On thurs at the chiro she was perfect! Didnt' need any kind of adjustment. Then we had a horrible weekend. I cleaned the bedroom really well on thurs. On Monday we got a air purifier for the bedroom and began getting bottled water for she and I that we know takes out floride (dd does much better at my parents house and they have well water). Starting Wed she is sleeping better and in general easier to be arround. I also am reading Sleepless in America and realizing that I have been missing her sleepy windows and am putting her down earlier for nap and bed and it is working! We'll see if this continues.

Ugh, I've got to sneak by her door and go downstairs now or I'll be stuck up here till her nap is over and I haven't gotten lunch yet. Hopefully I'll bbl tonight.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
It does make sense...my issue with feeding DD things she reacts to is that she ISN'T healing, in fact she's gotten worse. So I wonder if her poor little body is so busy reacting to the allergens that she isn't able to do any healing.

Sometimes I feel that way, too...the more I learn the less I know!

It is frustrating to be so diligent about diet and supplements and feel like this. The more strict I became with SCD the worse DS got. In theory the diet makes so much sense, but when it comes down to it if there are naturally occurring chemicals in food that I cannot tolerate, even if the are monosaccarides/easy to digest, my body will not process them. The only thing that is clear to me right now is that my liver isn't keeping up with what I am giving it. I am trying to figure out how this gut healing and Failsafe work together, what the underlying causes are to all of our problems.

I am being very careful to follow the Failsafe elimination diet, that means I am not taking any supplements, remedies, herbs, using no lotions, and simple unscented soaps and cleaners and trying to avoid strong scents of any kind. I want to be as meticulous as I possibly can because I feel desperate to help DS. Since I started cutting down on amines and salycilates I have had stinky pee, my body is getting rid of something! I am expecting things to get worse before they get better as we detox. From what other failsafers say it may take 1-2 months.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

moonshine--vitamin C is supposed to help with histamine reactions


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Any suggestions on what I can do for fats if I eliminate CO? I could see if DD can tolerate butter since I've heard many people with dairy allergies are okay with butter, but...would that be another thing where there might be just enough casein in the butter to keep sensitizing her even if she doesn't visibly react?

And what on earth am I going to do with the FOUR AND A HALF GALLONS of CO I have (I just bought a five gallon container)? firefaery--want to buy some CO?









And how concerned should I be about coconut or wheat derivitives in my body care products? They are "natural" products but I know some of them have coconut-derived ingredients...who knows about wheat ingredients.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

You could try palm oil.

I have been makin gmy own bodycare products for a long time now. It is almost impossible to find products that are soy. gluten and dairy free. When you do they are super pricy (california baby is an allergen free company, but I think they use coconut) I am of the belief that anything you put on your body ends up in it. I just don't like taking chances.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I have been out of SA, but ordered some and it was sent yesterday, so hopefully it will arrive quickly. I actually do have an epipen now -- seems my doc got concerned too.

The allergy testing was a blood test. Initially I thought I had a low level allergy to all things tested (b/c that is how my doc read it), but it shows no reactions actually. I don't really know enough about allergy testing to know what to push for. I have never paid that much attention when you all were discussing it because I never could attribute any of my reactions (rash or otherwise) to anything specific.

Did I mention here that I had an upper endoscopy this week? He found that my stomach lining is all red, and a little white spot which he is getting a biopsy for, as well as other parts of my stomach. But I guess for now I have reflux. I got DH to get me some HCl today, although he could only find one with MSM, not Betaine.

I am seeing my acupuncturist on Sunday. I hope he has a clue about all of this because I cannot live like this!


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
If anyone has any ideas on how to reduce swelling (as in my eyelid is swollen to about 500x its normal size) I would be most appreciative.

cucumber slices are soothing, also teabags. the tannins in teabags help reduce swelling. (presuming you aren't allergic to them!)

are you still nursing? you might try your own milk as a topical.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
On Monday we got a air purifier for the bedroom

i was actually just going to ask if anyone uses an air purifier, as i've thought about it as a way to lessen total allergic load, dust mite/pollen-wise.

we tried one last spring, then it broke and i returned it. it was kind of loud to sleep through, too. i'm not a big fan of white noise. it didn't seem to make a huge noticable difference (like any improvement in dd1's eczema), but hard to tell if it might have raised our threshold for tolerance or other allergens, and we didn't know, because who can tell how far one is below threshhold?

anyone use and like one?

on another note, i had a teaspoon of CO this morning (3 days after having dh do NAET on me) without a "noticable" reaction.


----------



## megincl (Sep 10, 2002)

Hi Folks,

We are TTC #2 and I know that many folks here (from my times hanging around every few months!) say that Omega 3s and 6s are good for both TTC and during pregnancy. How much? Via what sources? And why (DW is a bit of a skeptic)? I can pretty much guarantee DW will NOT take CO straight (like drink it off a spoon), so anything other than that would be great.

Bring on the suggestions!

thanks!
megin


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I have been out of SA, but ordered some and it was sent yesterday, so hopefully it will arrive quickly. I actually do have an epipen now -- seems my doc got concerned too.

The allergy testing was a blood test. Initially I thought I had a low level allergy to all things tested (b/c that is how my doc read it), but it shows no reactions actually. I don't really know enough about allergy testing to know what to push for. I have never paid that much attention when you all were discussing it because I never could attribute any of my reactions (rash or otherwise) to anything specific.

Did I mention here that I had an upper endoscopy this week? He found that my stomach lining is all red, and a little white spot which he is getting a biopsy for, as well as other parts of my stomach. But I guess for now I have reflux. I got DH to get me some HCl today, although he could only find one with MSM, not Betaine.

I am seeing my acupuncturist on Sunday. I hope he has a clue about all of this because I cannot live like this!

I am sorry you are going through this. If you want to check out foods that contain histamine here is a good list:
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...fi/amines.html
There are also histamine releasing foods, but I do not understand it enough to give any advice about it. What are you eating, or not eating? Do you suspect something inyour diet?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I am sorry you are going through this. If you want to check out foods that contain histamine here is a good list:
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...fi/amines.html
There are also histamine releasing foods, but I do not understand it enough to give any advice about it. What are you eating, or not eating? Do you suspect something inyour diet?

I really don't know what to suspect. Yesterday afternoon I felt "hives" starting, which then in the evening I also felt on my eyelids. I juiced a beet, apple and carrot, which I had in the afternoon. I think that I felt something after this. I seem to recall I had something else too, but I can't remember. For dinner I had black-eyed peas (soaked overnight) and broccoli.

I am not really following any particular diet. I am newly trying to cut out dairy, but I have not been hugely successful.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I really don't know what to suspect. Yesterday afternoon I felt "hives" starting, which then in the evening I also felt on my eyelids. I juiced a beet, apple and carrot, which I had in the afternoon. I think that I felt something after this. I seem to recall I had something else too, but I can't remember. For dinner I had black-eyed peas (soaked overnight) and broccoli.

I am not really following any particular diet. I am newly trying to cut out dairy, but I have not been hugely successful.

Have you ever done any elimination diets? Or a rotation diet? Maybe something to try and help you pinpoint what is bothering you.


----------



## EBG (May 3, 2006)

Caedmyn,

You could try pure shea butter or jojoba oil (desert essence) for skincare. I liked shea butter when I used it. Now I use CO. I'm so sorry your babe is reacting to it... My DD2 gets these pimple like bumps on her torso if she gets a substantial amount of CO. She gets the same reaction from culturelle and candidase (this one gives her tons of bumps) so I figured it's die-off. DD1 gets a tummy ache from CO. She gets a tummy ache from a bnunch of things so I think it's a HCL or bile problem??? Even with enzymes. But not all the time.

Moonshine,

chamomile tea is really soothing for swollen eyes. Hopefully you're not allergic to it (cross reactive with ragweed). It works every time for us although we use it for infections. My Mom gets allergic swollen eyes and uses chamomile, too.

Enzymedica has an enzyme product called Allerase. It's a high dose of amyleses and is supposed to help with allergies but I've never tried it.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Would it be terrible to do a detox diet while DD2 is still nursing? She is over 3 now. She basically only nurses to go to sleep at night and when she wakes in the morning. I have tried to cut her back (shorter sessions), but when I try to cut back too much or talk of weaning, she gets very sad. But I simply must do something for my body. I did the Elson Haas detox diet a number of years ago, with good results and am contemplating do it again.

Here are the particulars. What do you think?

Quote:

THE DETOX DIET
SPECIAL GUIDELINES for THE DETOX DIET:

1. Chew your food very well and take enough time when you eat.
2. Relax a few minutes before and after your meal.
3. Eat in a comfortable sitting position.
4. Eat primarily steamed fresh vegetables and some fresh greens.
5. Take only herbal teas after dinner.

THE DETOX DIET MENU PLAN
Morning: (upon arising): Two glasses of water (filtered, spring, or reverse osmosis), one glass with half a lemon squeezed into it.

Breakfast: One piece of fresh fruit (at room temp), such as apple, pear, banana, grapes, or citrus. Chew well, mixing each bite with saliva.

15-30 minutes later: One bowl of cooked whole grains -- specifically millet, brown rice, amaranth, quinoa, raw buckwheat, or buckwheat. Flavoring can be two tablespoons of fruit juice for a sweeter breakfast taste, or use the "better butter" mixture mentioned below with a little salt or tamari for a deeper flavor.

Lunch: (Noon-1 P.M.) One-two medium bowls of steamed vegetables; use a variety, including roots, stems, and greens -- e.g. potatoes or yams, green beans, broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, beets, asparagus, kale, chard, and cabbage. CHEW WELL !

Dinner: (5-6 P.M.) Same as Lunch

Seasoning: Butter/canola oil mixture. Make this "better butter" by mixing a half cup of cold-pressed canola oil (or olive or flaxseed oils) into a soft (room temperature) half-pound of butter; then place in dish and refrigerate. Use about one teaspoon per meal or a maximum of 3 teaspoons daily.

11 A.M. & 3 P.M. One-two cups veggie water, saved from steamed vegetables. Add a little sea salt or kelp and drink slowly, mixing each mouthful with saliva.

Evening: Herbal teas only -- e.g. peppermint, camomile, pau d'arco, or blends.

NOTE: You may feel a little weak or have a few symptoms the first couple of days; this will pass. Clarity and feeling good should appear by day 3 or 4, if not before. If during this diet, you start to feel weak or hungry, assess your water intake and elimination; if needed, you can eat a small portion of protein food (3-4 ounces) in the mid-afternoon. This could be fish; free-range, organic chicken; or some beans, such as lentils, garbanzos, mung, or black beans.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

moonshine--I don't think it would be a big deal. Really all of us are detoxing with these diets/attempts to heal to one degree or another, and I would think even if you did a lot of detoxing, a three year old could handle it pretty well. You could do some things with the diet to absorb some of the toxins and keep them from getting into BM.


----------



## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

My naturopath does kineseology for testing supplements and food sensitivities. She's helped some, but not much.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

New thought on allergies: I just read about a study done with children who had anaphylactic allergies to peanuts or another food (forgot which one). In the study, they very carefully (under medical supervision) figured out what dose of the food the child would react to, and then gave them just under that dose for a period of time, and then increased the dose to just under what they would react to, and kept doing that for the length of the study. Basically they built tolerance to the point where a trace of peanuts would no longer cause anaphylactic reactions in these kids. They had to continue to take their "maintenance dose" of peanuts or whatever to make sure they maintained tolerance.

Now I've read a bit about oral tolerance, which as I understand it basically means that your immune system should tolerate foods, it should not react to them, and people with allergies don't have oral tolerance to those foods.

So...I wonder if it would theoretically be possible to build oral tolerance in DD by exposing her to things like butter (assuming she doesn't react to butter), and hopefully she'll eventually be able to tolerate at least small amounts of dairy. If she is reacting to CO this wouldn't work for that, unfortunately, as she seems to have issues with the CO I eat, also...although maybe small amounts would be okay.

Thoughts, anyone?

Oh, and firefaery--if your kids were eating more of their allergens on the SCD than when you went off it, I wonder if this principle/theory would explain why they started reacting to things again? Just a thought.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

That technique (can't remember the name of it now) was used very frequently in the late 70's early 80's. Interesting that it is getting some press now. Caedmyn, do you know where you read this? I think Doris Rapp writes about it as well...


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Isn't this the same concept that allergy shots (for environmental allergies) are based on?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
That technique (can't remember the name of it now) was used very frequently in the late 70's early 80's. Interesting that it is getting some press now. Caedmyn, do you know where you read this? I think Doris Rapp writes about it as well...

It was in a newspaper article in the last 10 days or so.

It kind of contradicts the theory that small amounts of allergen proteins will continue to sensitize even if no visible reaction occurs, doesn't it? Did the technique seem to be effective from what you've read?


----------



## joeysmom1729 (Sep 12, 2006)

Is it normal to feel worse once starting SCD? I'm on day 4 and I'm doing it in hopes to cure my ulcerative colitis. I've lost even more weight too and I just can't afford to lose anymore! I've been eating bananas, apple sauce and diluted grape juice for carbs. I'm trying to stick with the phase 1 foods until the diarrhea stops. I have such a headache and just feel so weak and dizzy, is this normal? Am I not eating enough maybe? I'm nursing my 9 month old son and he's pretty much still 99% BF. Any advice?


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I started out with healing the gut (candida diet) and eliminating dairy since DD reacted to it with blood in her stools. My gut seems to have healed (although maybe not cuz she reacts to stuff I eat) but hers seems to have gotten worse, so now I am trying to figure out what she is allergic to it. So far she reacts to dairy, wheat, and tree nuts, and I'm avoiding peanuts. The only soy I ever eat is soy sauce every once in a while (or whatever is snuck into processed foods that I occasionally cheat with), so I haven't really focused on that. I don't think healing the gut and eliminating allergens really have the same focus, but I'm starting to wonder if most people don't need to eliminate their allergens, or at least their major ones, in order to heal.

As this was our experience: I healed and DS did not ... it seems like it was allergens for him. With my leaky gut and poor intestinal flora the cause. His poor flora gave him leaky gut when his immune system was maturing and therefore it recognized and developed food allergies. So with kids, allergens must be involved as well.








DS is doing awesome on Rotation Diet without eggs, coconut or nuts. Previous things which sent his poops to custard: raw fruit for ex. he is eating with no problem. This goes to show you that an Elimination Diet might not always be accurate: as he is not allergic to these fruits which showed horrible reactions, but his intestines were so inflamed from the allergens that he simply couldn't digest them. He even ate some sugar (Rapadura) over holidays and no reactions (he had started NT grains but I still kept him to honey for sweetener).

Also is drinking straight non-yogurtized milk! (raw, _bien sur_) which is the most thrilling thing for me. Only you guys would understand that.









I'm thinking of posting on Pecanbread why the SCD for over a year didn't work for him but not sure it will be welcome.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *megincl* 
Hi Folks,

We are TTC #2 and I know that many folks here (from my times hanging around every few months!) say that Omega 3s and 6s are good for both TTC and during pregnancy. How much? Via what sources? And why (DW is a bit of a skeptic)? I can pretty much guarantee DW will NOT take CO straight (like drink it off a spoon), so anything other than that would be great.

Bring on the suggestions!

thanks!
megin

Finally mainstream medicine is recognizing the importance of EFA's in our diet but they still have it all wrong. It is much more complex than popping a pill.

We get too many Omega 6's in our diets from vegetable oils and grain fed animal products. Overloading Omega 6's are a true cause of inflammation in body and most all vegetable oils are rancid and toxic, contain free radicals because they are not as stable as saturated fats and very susceptible to heat damage and oxidization.

A 1:1 ratio of omega 3:6 is ideal but very hard to get with the standard food choices available to us. Grass fed animal products have high omega 3's. High fat grass fed dairy is as healthy as fish for this reason.

High vitamin cod liver oil is only supplement that I would use for EFA's as you very much need the vitamin A and D. Read "Vitamin A for Fetal Development" at www.westonaprice.org and you will have your socks knocked off. I think WAPF recommends 2 tsp. high vit CLO for pg or ttc mamas as part of a diet including grass fed dairy, seafoods and organ meats for more fat soluble vits and omega 3's as well. I would take more CLO if you are not eating these foods.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Caedmyn,

Re: whether a small amount of allergen can be tolerated

I was also very skeptical about the Rotation Diet for this reason, but I now cannot argue with success. DS was on a very very limited diet for a while with only one small serving of allergen/day on a 7 day rotation. Meaning if he ate oatmeal on Monday he couldn't have it until (at least) a week later. He ate a lot of safe foods for him like bananas, pears, avocado, beef, chicken, dairy ... things that he didn't react to with allergy testing, and foods that didn't aggravate his gut lining (ie no raw fruit ex. banana). It was very hard and probably the most restrictive diet ever invented! But gradually things got better and I was able to pinpoint his serious reactions to nuts and eggs on those days he ate them.

I'm about to try apples again, even though he passed the second dilution round of skin testing with them, the sugar sorbitol was still hard for him to digest. We'll see how he does now.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
Is it normal to feel worse once starting SCD? I'm on day 4 and I'm doing it in hopes to cure my ulcerative colitis. I've lost even more weight too and I just can't afford to lose anymore! I've been eating bananas, apple sauce and diluted grape juice for carbs. I'm trying to stick with the phase 1 foods until the diarrhea stops. I have such a headache and just feel so weak and dizzy, is this normal? Am I not eating enough maybe? I'm nursing my 9 month old son and he's pretty much still 99% BF. Any advice?

Yes it could be die off, drink a LOT of water and take a lot of vitamin C but I wouldn't do to bowel tolerance in your condition, that can be painful in itself even using the ph buffered sodium ascorbate. I really believe in the natural form of C like Amla powder. I take this regularly and when I do bowel tolerance of sodium ascorbate in times of illness, my tissues seem to be so saturated with C that I always max out very quickly at 6 grams of the chemical form.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Oh and the other thing with DS is that we finally was able to increase his AFP Peptizyde high protease enzyme. For food allergies, it's usually the proteins that are causing the immune system reaction, so high proteases are very helpful in breaking down the proteins into amino acids and therefore slipping by this chain of events. Also Peptizyde is a special one with DPP-IV or whatever that special gluten breaking down enzyme is. I noticed a significant difference with adding this into his regime (slowly, slowly as it did cause hyperactivity at first with him, as with me!) along with introducing his grains. I also think that giving the Peptizyde WITH introducing grains into the diet helped the hyperactivity as apparently insulin aids amino acid function in the body.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

: JaneS! I was just thinking about you today. Is your DS doing any better (are you seeing any signs of healing)?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Oooh, I don't want to hear anything bad about elimination diets, as I am attempting a version of one now.

Refresh my memory, is gas a sign of die-off/detox? I have had some since my steamed veggie lunch. (Day 1 of the detox diet)


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joeysmom1729* 
Is it normal to feel worse once starting SCD? I'm on day 4 and I'm doing it in hopes to cure my ulcerative colitis. I've lost even more weight too and I just can't afford to lose anymore! I've been eating bananas, apple sauce and diluted grape juice for carbs. I'm trying to stick with the phase 1 foods until the diarrhea stops. I have such a headache and just feel so weak and dizzy, is this normal? Am I not eating enough maybe? I'm nursing my 9 month old son and he's pretty much still 99% BF. Any advice?

That was my experience too. I was miserable for a week. Dizzy, nauseated, irritable and I was STARVING all the time. I ate constantly. I am pretty sure it was my body going through withdrawal. I had so many food allergies that hadn't been identified before then.

I know that it is very common to lose weight. The wasy it has been explained is that your body is getting rid of unhealthy tissue. As long as you are eating enough it is thought to be fine.

Welcome aboard!


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
It was in a newspaper article in the last 10 days or so.

It kind of contradicts the theory that small amounts of allergen proteins will continue to sensitize even if no visible reaction occurs, doesn't it? Did the technique seem to be effective from what you've read?

Unfortunately all these techniques have followings and so many people have success for very different reasons. There really isn't a way as far as I can tell to know for sure what will work for you.

It is different than continually eating a suspected allergen though. You abstain orally and are given very specific prescribed amounts that increase over a specified period of time in accordance with the reactions. In theory it should work. I haven't tried it though. I'm talking to my homeopath on Tuesday and I'm going to pursue that avenue first.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
It is different than continually eating a suspected allergen though. You abstain orally and are given very specific prescribed amounts that increase over a specified period of time in accordance with the reactions.

I understand that. What I don't understand is how things like rotation diets, or people who are dairy allergic but can tolerate butter fine, fit into the whole scheme of things. Does doing things like rotation diets continue to sensitize someone, or is there actually a tolerance level that has to be exceeded (ie if there's no apparent reaction is there actually a problem)? Has anyone seen any studies on whether continued ingestion of small amounts of an allergen w/o visible reaction causes sensitization? Bluets, help!


----------



## my3peanuts (Nov 25, 2006)

Can I jump in here with a few questions?

I've been allergic to dairy for quite a while but have always tolerated it fairly well in small amounts up until recently when my face starts itching almost immediately. I know I obviously need to cut out all dairy from my diet but aside from that what other things can I do?? Would the first thing to do be to start healing the gut or are there things more specific to dairy allergies that I could start doing?

Hopefully that makes sense!


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Hi Jane!

Where do you get the alma?

Talk to me more about the rotation diet. I'm frustrated about dd and stuck. I don't know what to do next. As far as I can tell she isn't reacting to any foods she still eats except if she gets a lot of night shades and I try to keep those to a minimum (much easier in winter than summer). Her only reaction to night shades seems to be a rash on her bottom.

But she still wakes every 1-3 hours at night and that isn't really seeming to improve. At the worst she is latched on all night long w/o letting go. On good nights she unlatches for an hour or two at a time a few times a night. I actually get more sleep on a bad night (but wake up more sore).

Anyhow, I'm considering trying to eliminate eggs but I don't know how to do that w/o adding something back in.

Also, I'm making water kefir and drinking it myself and trying to get it into dd. She will drink it some days but not others. After reading bacteria for breakfast I'm convinced that the issue is her gut flora is messed up but I'm clueless as to how to fix it. Thoughts? What are you doing with your ds to fix his gut flora?

I've got an appointment with her ped in two weeks and I want to ask for something, testing, a referal to a specalist of some kind, something that may give some answers as to what to do next but I don't know what to ask him for.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 







: JaneS! I was just thinking about you today. Is your DS doing any better (are you seeing any signs of healing)?

Yes, healing is well underway!









DS is doing fantastic! Poops are not as regular as I would like but I'm not complaining thus far, hoping it will work itself out in next few months. I've started kefir again which he first loved, and then wouldn't touch and now seems to love again.







Dysbiosis "smell" is gone, no more mushy poops at least unless he eats nuts or eggs which are out now. Tolerating new foods like grains and fruits and raw milk well. Sleeping longer and better, therefore a better attitude! His teeth are whiter and calculus hasn't come back after his last dental cleaning so this tells me he is absorbing his calcium now and his ph is less acidic.

I'm seriously so happy, I tear up every time I think of it. It was a wonderful Xmas present.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Hi Jane!

Where do you get the alma?

Talk to me more about the rotation diet. I'm frustrated about dd and stuck. I don't know what to do next. As far as I can tell she isn't reacting to any foods she still eats except if she gets a lot of night shades and I try to keep those to a minimum (much easier in winter than summer). Her only reaction to night shades seems to be a rash on her bottom.

But she still wakes every 1-3 hours at night and that isn't really seeming to improve. At the worst she is latched on all night long w/o letting go. On good nights she unlatches for an hour or two at a time a few times a night. I actually get more sleep on a bad night (but wake up more sore).

Anyhow, I'm considering trying to eliminate eggs but I don't know how to do that w/o adding something back in.

Also, I'm making water kefir and drinking it myself and trying to get it into dd. She will drink it some days but not others. After reading bacteria for breakfast I'm convinced that the issue is her gut flora is messed up but I'm clueless as to how to fix it. Thoughts? What are you doing with your ds to fix his gut flora?

I've got an appointment with her ped in two weeks and I want to ask for something, testing, a referal to a specalist of some kind, something that may give some answers as to what to do next but I don't know what to ask him for.

Himalaya Amla at www.iherb.com

What about blood testing for allergies from Immunolabs, I think that is what Firefaery recommended? The adult panel that tests more foods than pediatric one.

For us it was not only gut flora but also allergens. I think that is probably more likely to be the case with babes than adults b/c their immune systems are trying to work out ok vs. invader while their guts are leaking.

The theory behind the Rotation Diet is that you are not eating something every day so your system doesn't continue to be assaulted with allergens every day. Each allergen causes a specific response, so somehow it allows the system to rest. DS was allergic to so many foods there was no way we could have eliminated them all and still have a reasonable diet ... and then you supposedly just get allergic to those small number of foods b/c you are eating them everyday.

I can type up the sample 4 day diet our dietician gave us if you are interested. When I started though I did my own thing with 7 days of rotation just to be sure.

DS is just on Reuteri capsules for now and the dairy kefir that I can coax into him. The nutritionist recommended Tyler's Permeability Factors for the glutamine et al but I just tried to be better about bone broths and I didn't want to add too many new things at once. We did add extra zinc supps again.

The funny thing is that when we put eggs and nuts on a rotation, DS seemed to have reactions more strongly than when he was eating them everyday. I have no earthly idea why this is.

I was also stuck in the "how can I eliminate anything when we are already down to so little" mindset too and I just decided to trust our Ped/Dietician, go for it, slowly, with past reactions and rotation in mind. It wasn't easy for a good several months let me tell you (why I was MIA).


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Refresh my memory, is gas a sign of die-off/detox? I have had some since my steamed veggie lunch. (Day 1 of the detox diet)

Quoting myself because I am a little concerned. Gas is really foul smelling, which I really haven't had in ages, and I am more bloated than usual. All good signs of die off?? Or is that just wishful thinking and I am eating stuff that isn't good for me? On a good note, the puffiness of my eyes is subsiding a bit.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Yes, healing is well underway!









DS is doing fantastic! Poops are not as regular as I would like but I'm not complaining thus far, hoping it will work itself out in next few months. I've started kefir again which he first loved, and then wouldn't touch and now seems to love again.







Dysbiosis "smell" is gone, no more mushy poops at least unless he eats nuts or eggs which are out now. Tolerating new foods like grains and fruits and raw milk well. Sleeping longer and better, therefore a better attitude! His teeth are whiter and calculus hasn't come back after his last dental cleaning so this tells me he is absorbing his calcium now and his ph is less acidic.

I'm seriously so happy, I tear up every time I think of it. It was a wonderful Xmas present.









HI Jane, great to hear you are both doing a lot better!

I would love to see a sample 4 day menu, or a 7 day menu, of the rotation diet. Do you follow a specific diet plan (from a book, from your DR, online)?
We are currently doing the Failsafe elimination diet(low salicylates, amines, no scented products of any kind, and for now no supplements.) After the intro I bet a rotation of foods could be worked out.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Quoting myself because I am a little concerned. Gas is really foul smelling, which I really haven't had in ages, and I am more bloated than usual. All good signs of die off?? Or is that just wishful thinking and I am eating stuff that isn't good for me? On a good note, the puffiness of my eyes is subsiding a bit.

I would venture to say that any reduction in the swelling is a good thing.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Yummy veggies I never ate much of before:
rutabaga, delicious roasted in oven with oil of choice

choko or chayote, a squash with a delicate slightly sweet flavor


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Quoting myself because I am a little concerned. Gas is really foul smelling, which I really haven't had in ages, and I am more bloated than usual. All good signs of die off?? Or is that just wishful thinking and I am eating stuff that isn't good for me? On a good note, the puffiness of my eyes is subsiding a bit.

It sounds like die-off to me, unless the veggies you ate were high in sulfur. Gas is definitely one of my die-off symptoms, and sometimes bloating is, too. Hard-to-digest foods also cause gas and bloating for me, but steamed veggies should be pretty easy to digest.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Yes, healing is well underway!









DS is doing fantastic! Poops are not as regular as I would like but I'm not complaining thus far, hoping it will work itself out in next few months. I've started kefir again which he first loved, and then wouldn't touch and now seems to love again.







Dysbiosis "smell" is gone, no more mushy poops at least unless he eats nuts or eggs which are out now. Tolerating new foods like grains and fruits and raw milk well. Sleeping longer and better, therefore a better attitude! His teeth are whiter and calculus hasn't come back after his last dental cleaning so this tells me he is absorbing his calcium now and his ph is less acidic.

I'm seriously so happy, I tear up every time I think of it. It was a wonderful Xmas present.









Yay, I'm so happy for you both


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Himalaya Amla at www.iherb.com

What about blood testing for allergies from Immunolabs, I think that is what Firefaery recommended? The adult panel that tests more foods than pediatric one.

For us it was not only gut flora but also allergens. I think that is probably more likely to be the case with babes than adults b/c their immune systems are trying to work out ok vs. invader while their guts are leaking.

The theory behind the Rotation Diet is that you are not eating something every day so your system doesn't continue to be assaulted with allergens every day. Each allergen causes a specific response, so somehow it allows the system to rest. DS was allergic to so many foods there was no way we could have eliminated them all and still have a reasonable diet ... and then you supposedly just get allergic to those small number of foods b/c you are eating them everyday.

I can type up the sample 4 day diet our dietician gave us if you are interested. When I started though I did my own thing with 7 days of rotation just to be sure.

DS is just on Reuteri capsules for now and the dairy kefir that I can coax into him. The nutritionist recommended Tyler's Permeability Factors for the glutamine et al but I just tried to be better about bone broths and I didn't want to add too many new things at once. We did add extra zinc supps again.

The funny thing is that when we put eggs and nuts on a rotation, DS seemed to have reactions more strongly than when he was eating them everyday. I have no earthly idea why this is.

I was also stuck in the "how can I eliminate anything when we are already down to so little" mindset too and I just decided to trust our Ped/Dietician, go for it, slowly, with past reactions and rotation in mind. It wasn't easy for a good several months let me tell you (why I was MIA).


Jane- I would love to see your sample diet. I'm just not sure how much help I'll get from our Dr. I really like him but he is so far outside of mainstream at times that it can be difficult to get him to do much but "wait and see".

So did you just jump into the rotation diet or try to do some time w/o any allergens to clear the system first?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Caedmyn, I honestly don't know. Hopefully Bluets can help.

Jane, I'm so psyched! That's an elimination diet done right. I have never heard of anyone on such a long rotation that stuck to it long enough to see results. You are awesome!


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
It sounds like die-off to me, unless the veggies you ate were high in sulfur. Gas is definitely one of my die-off symptoms, and sometimes bloating is, too. Hard-to-digest foods also cause gas and bloating for me, but steamed veggies should be pretty easy to digest.









I had garlic, onion, kale, sweet potato, broccoli, brussel sprouts and swiss chard, among other things. All high in sulfur. Should sulfer always cause gas?


----------



## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

Hi. I followed these threads pretty regularly for a while, but stopped when DS was diagnosed with aspergers because I really need to focus on that right now. I had a quick question that I hope someone will help me with. Should I be taking bifidus, as well, as my 10mo because I'm nursing? I was taking a regular adult probiotic, but stopped after my son's said that nursing mothers could take it.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 







I had garlic, onion, kale, sweet potato, broccoli, brussel sprouts and swiss chard, among other things. All high in sulfur. Should sulfer always cause gas?

sulfur doesn't always cause gas... only in those people who cannot metabolize it well. my ND seems to think that there is a genetic underpinning for this ability (or lack of ability) though i'm inclined to think that it is linked more to gut health and quantity of sulfurous food eaten.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I understand that. What I don't understand is how things like rotation diets, or people who are dairy allergic but can tolerate butter fine, fit into the whole scheme of things. Does doing things like rotation diets continue to sensitize someone, or is there actually a tolerance level that has to be exceeded (ie if there's no apparent reaction is there actually a problem)? Has anyone seen any studies on whether continued ingestion of small amounts of an allergen w/o visible reaction causes sensitization? Bluets, help!

http://www.food-allergy.org/page2.html

"When a patient has multiple food allergies, the offending foods must be eliminated and all other foods should be eaten at intervals of four to five days or longer. This is know as a "rotation" or "rotary diversified" diet. Rotation diets are necessary for patients with multiple allergies because if you have overt allergies to many foods, it is likely that you have slight, subclinical allergies to many other foods that you consider safe. Eating them on a rotated basis reduces your exposure to them and hopefully will help preserve your tolerance for them."

"Doctors prescribe rotation diets of varying degrees of strictness depending on the severity of your allergies. On the most strict diets each food is eaten only once on its rotation day and the length of the rotation cycle may be much longer than four to five days. One very allergic person I talked to had been put on a one food per meal, three meals per day, twelve day cycle diet by a prominent allergy clinic. Some doctors consider rotation diets with very long cycles to be counterproductive. For most patients, a four to five day interval between eating foods gives the best masking of symptoms. "

That page has a few references that may be useful as well, so be sure to visit it.

Going out on a limb here... Rotation diets probably work because of the combination of exposure and rest. And yes, it probably works in much the same way as allergy shots -- probably better. Remember allergy shots stick the offending proteins straight into your bloodstream whereas rotation diets stick the offending proteins into your gut - the more likely place where those proteins will be handled first (even in the case of proteins from allergy shots - why don't they let you slurp them down instead of injecting you with the proteins and other crap?).

The rest period probably varies from substance to substance and from person to person because of the individuality of allergies. One would need a varying amount of time to recover from the histamine response that the offending proteins invoke.

I'm not sure how dairy allergies work. My own response is pretty rapid and just plain unpleasant (postnasal drip, stuffy head, headache - all lasting from 1 hour postchallenge to 24 hours postchallenge), I have little desire to push the boundaries. Though, admittedly, I do have a tendency to overdo the quantity on those few times I've done a challenge.

I'm not sure if full gut healing will eliminate this allergy for me - I've had it since I was 4 months old so it may be just completely ingrained in my system.

(did I mention that I've learned that I can handle small amounts of goat cheese?! and since i only eat small amounts, because i'm not so enamoured with its flavor, there's no way i'll overdo the challenge!)


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

last month, i mentioned that ds was having issues with constipation (on a fairly regular routine of weekend-only constipation, fine during the week). in talking with the ND, i mentioned his tooth-grinding and the ND immediately thought about a remedy, linking constipation to parasites. the remedy is also for tooth-grinding and nose-picking (both of which ds was doing). oh yeah, the remedy is called homeopathic Cina.

well, in reading more, it seems that Cina is also good for sleeplessness in children.

so, i finally managed to get my hands on some Cina (i had to order it coz it isn't in the usual Boiron collection in either HFS here). we started it Thursday night. ds pooped 3x on Friday and 2x yesterday! of course, he's also been eating lots of apple.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
the ND immediately thought about a remedy, linking constipation to parasites. the remedy is also for tooth-grinding and nose-picking (both of which ds was doing). oh yeah, the remedy is called homeopathic Cina.

well, in reading more, it seems that Cina is also good for sleeplessness in children.

so, thinking of how homeopathic substances work, any idea if the remedy prompts the body to address the parasites directly (presuming they are the problem causing the grinding/constipation/nose-picking), or if it just prompts the body to address the symptoms/behaviors? not sure what cina is, and as usual i can't find my book; it always gets misplaced in the middle of the night when someone gets sick... is it herb, animal, or mineral?

what dose/potency/frequency? i tried it on your suggestion last month; one dose of 30C. i didn't see much difference, but she hasn't been waking/grinding much lately anyway, and had regular (1-2/day) bm. still goes for her nose often.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Rotation diet question for anyone who knows: if I do a rotation diet, would I still be able to drink kombucha and water kefirs every day? I could rotate "flavors" of water kefir if necessary.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
so, thinking of how homeopathic substances work, any idea if the remedy prompts the body to address the parasites directly (presuming they are the problem causing the grinding/constipation/nose-picking), or if it just prompts the body to address the symptoms/behaviors? not sure what cina is, and as usual i can't find my book; it always gets misplaced in the middle of the night when someone gets sick... is it herb, animal, or mineral?

what dose/potency/frequency? i tried it on your suggestion last month; one dose of 30C. i didn't see much difference, but she hasn't been waking/grinding much lately anyway, and had regular (1-2/day) bm. still goes for her nose often.

the ND told me to get 6C but of course didn't give much more information than that. so i've been following the directions on the bottle - 5 tablets at a time. i only give it 2x per day.

Cina = Worm-seed. How appropriate, eh?







http://www.abchomeopathy.com/r.php/Cina and i have no idea how it works - whether it just works on symptoms or on the parasites (if they're even there).

3 bowel movements today - and they're mushier than usual and sticky with undigested food -- it's been a while since we were explicit about poop, no?

so, i'm not sure if it is the remedy working or if it is loose stool from the lactose (but then ds is still breastfed so i would be skeptical that he would react in such a way to lactose).

i'm also not sure how long i should continue the remedy. there are a whole pile of indications for Cina that apply to ds. do i wait until they all go away?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Rotation diet question for anyone who knows: if I do a rotation diet, would I still be able to drink kombucha and water kefirs every day? I could rotate "flavors" of water kefir if necessary.

maybe alternate - one day kefir, one day kombucha ?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Bluets-in this instance I am inclined to go with the injections. Because the idea is to increase things incrimentally in the bloodstream and provoke a reaction until the body is able to right itself I think it would be more effective. I am SO not generally inclined to go with the more mainstream stuff, but this actually makes sense to me. I am sure that there's more out there that I don't know about though.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
the ND told me to get 6C but of course didn't give much more information than that. so i've been following the directions on the bottle - 5 tablets at a time. i only give it 2x per day.
...
i'm also not sure how long i should continue the remedy. there are a whole pile of indications for Cina that apply to ds. do i wait until they all go away?

i've learned enough about homeopathy to know there is considerable difference of opinion on what and how to Rx. for instance, my homeopath always Rx's high potency: 30C (usually 2 pellets) or 200C (usually 10 pellets--they're really tiny). you should probably check with your ND. Rx for chronic stuff is much more complicated than for acute stuff. i wouldn't venture an opinion, i just barely muddle through using it for colds/cough/fever, etc., when i can't get hold of my homeopath. (who is a treasure, but works 4 days/week. how come my kids always get sick on friday night??????). plus i don't leave home without arnica.







:









and thanks for the homeopathy link. i really haven't looked online for much info yet, handy to know a site.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

okie, so maybe ds's plentiful bowel movements over the past day or so were just a bug... dh is having unusual diarrhea now too, along with signs of magnesium deficiency (which precedes an intestinal infection, btw).

back to waiting for the body to work. forgot to give the Cina this morning but we gave it last night. we'll just see what daycare logs in the chart for today.


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Himalaya Amla at www.iherb.com

What about blood testing for allergies from Immunolabs, I think that is what Firefaery recommended? The adult panel that tests more foods than pediatric one.

For us it was not only gut flora but also allergens. I think that is probably more likely to be the case with babes than adults b/c their immune systems are trying to work out ok vs. invader while their guts are leaking.

The theory behind the Rotation Diet is that you are not eating something every day so your system doesn't continue to be assaulted with allergens every day. Each allergen causes a specific response, so somehow it allows the system to rest. DS was allergic to so many foods there was no way we could have eliminated them all and still have a reasonable diet ... and then you supposedly just get allergic to those small number of foods b/c you are eating them everyday.

I can type up the sample 4 day diet our dietician gave us if you are interested. When I started though I did my own thing with 7 days of rotation just to be sure.

DS is just on Reuteri capsules for now and the dairy kefir that I can coax into him. The nutritionist recommended Tyler's Permeability Factors for the glutamine et al but I just tried to be better about bone broths and I didn't want to add too many new things at once. We did add extra zinc supps again.

The funny thing is that when we put eggs and nuts on a rotation, DS seemed to have reactions more strongly than when he was eating them everyday. I have no earthly idea why this is.

I was also stuck in the "how can I eliminate anything when we are already down to so little" mindset too and I just decided to trust our Ped/Dietician, go for it, slowly, with past reactions and rotation in mind. It wasn't easy for a good several months let me tell you (why I was MIA).

I'd be interested in seeing this, too. I tried to do a rotation diet early on after talking with someone from this forum, but I just couldn't find enough foods to eat to truly rotate. But now that I'm pegging a few more things down and we should get our allergy testing results soon, I'm thinking about addressing with a rotation diet.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

i think the help of a rotation diet is the fact that if the gut is still leaking the body is getting allergic to anything (no matter how "hypoallergenic" it's considered) that it gets bombarded with, so a very limited diet gets increasingly limited until there's nothing left to eat.

with dd1, when she first went haywire (right after her 4mos vax







: ) i ended up going on the drastic elimination diet of just 13 foods outlined in sears' fussy baby book (lamb, turkey, rice, millet, sweet potato/yam, zucchini, pear, and 6 things i can't recall). the next day she became a calm, happy baby who could be held by others, took naps, woke 3-4 times just to feed nurse, not comfort leech all night... then after a few weeks we were back to square one of all night nursing, no naps unless attached, only mama can (and must) hold me.

so a rotation diet helps keep the dose of any individual current allergen low, and might prevent the body from deciding that new things it doesn't yet react to are worth becoming allergic to, which is where "exotics" like buckwheat, quinoa, teff, amaranth, rabbit, duck, buffalo (really bison?) and such come in. i think that's how sears' diet is derived; those foods are less commonly eaten in the US. i bet there are nepali's who are allergic to yak milk, but we probably aren't (until we start drinking a quart a day cause there's nothing else left to eat







).


----------



## kallyn (May 24, 2005)

Hey mamas! I am brand new to this section of the mothering boards.







Anyway, I am 100% sure I have some digestive and/or candida issues and I really think I need to get them under control. However, there are so many diets out there that I don't know which one would be the best for me, or indeed what I actually have wrong with me. Here are my issues:

lots of gas, from both ends
bad breath
get diarrhea or runny stools very easily
sensitive stomach
occasional bloating (usually after I eat a lot of carbs, I think. or maybe just grains? I don't know)
recurring vaginal itch (it's so bad that I keep a tube of topical cream from an OTC yeast infection med kit and use it if it gets too bad :/)
fatigue/lethergy/laziness/sleeping too much
a weird little itchy patch on one of my shins where the skin feels different. doesn't look like eczema to me, comparing to pics I found on google

I try to eat low-carb most of the time due to a different health reason (mitral valve prolapse), but I am a chronic cheater.







: All my symptoms get worse when I cheat, and I also start breaking out in zits.

Anyway, do you ladies have any advice on which diet would be a good one to start off with, or point me to a place to start reading? I am at least somewhat familiar with Bee's anticandida diet, SCD, failsafe, and paleo. I briefly tried Bee's anticandida diet, but the supplements made me feel horrible. I still have all of them though if you think any of those would be helpful (magnesium, calcium, powdered C, C with flavanoids, flushing niacin, B complex, E, chlorophyll, CLO, and I also have some butter oil).

Sorry if this is long and incoherent, I am just getting to my wit's end with all this. My husband can't believe how sensitive to food I am.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
That technique (can't remember the name of it now) was used very frequently in the late 70's early 80's. Interesting that it is getting some press now. Caedmyn, do you know where you read this? I think Doris Rapp writes about it as well...

I haven't read the rest of the replies, but Duke university is doing a study like this. Here's a link: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061225/...food_allergies


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
As this was our experience: I healed and DS did not ... it seems like it was allergens for him. With my leaky gut and poor intestinal flora the cause. His poor flora gave him leaky gut when his immune system was maturing and therefore it recognized and developed food allergies. So with kids, allergens must be involved as well.








DS is doing awesome on Rotation Diet without eggs, coconut or nuts. Previous things which sent his poops to custard: raw fruit for ex. he is eating with no problem. This goes to show you that an Elimination Diet might not always be accurate: as he is not allergic to these fruits which showed horrible reactions, but his intestines were so inflamed from the allergens that he simply couldn't digest them. He even ate some sugar (Rapadura) over holidays and no reactions (he had started NT grains but I still kept him to honey for sweetener).

Also is drinking straight non-yogurtized milk! (raw, _bien sur_) which is the most thrilling thing for me. Only you guys would understand that.









I'm thinking of posting on Pecanbread why the SCD for over a year didn't work for him but not sure it will be welcome.

I haven't read all, but I think this is the case with dd. She has a few true allergies, but she is very intolerant of a lot of fruits and vegetables (high salicylate ones usually) and I think she would be more tolerant if it weren't for her gut problems. I do notice that she is getting better, less sensitive, so I hope our gut-healing is working.

Good to see you again, Jane!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kallyn* 
Hey mamas! I am brand new to this section of the mothering boards.







Anyway, I am 100% sure I have some digestive and/or candida issues and I really think I need to get them under control. However, there are so many diets out there that I don't know which one would be the best for me, or indeed what I actually have wrong with me. Here are my issues:

lots of gas, from both ends
bad breath
get diarrhea or runny stools very easily
sensitive stomach
occasional bloating (usually after I eat a lot of carbs, I think. or maybe just grains? I don't know)
recurring vaginal itch (it's so bad that I keep a tube of topical cream from an OTC yeast infection med kit and use it if it gets too bad :/)
fatigue/lethergy/laziness/sleeping too much
a weird little itchy patch on one of my shins where the skin feels different. doesn't look like eczema to me, comparing to pics I found on google

I try to eat low-carb most of the time due to a different health reason (mitral valve prolapse), but I am a chronic cheater.







: All my symptoms get worse when I cheat, and I also start breaking out in zits.

Anyway, do you ladies have any advice on which diet would be a good one to start off with, or point me to a place to start reading? I am at least somewhat familiar with Bee's anticandida diet, SCD, failsafe, and paleo. I briefly tried Bee's anticandida diet, but the supplements made me feel horrible. I still have all of them though if you think any of those would be helpful (magnesium, calcium, powdered C, C with flavanoids, flushing niacin, B complex, E, chlorophyll, CLO, and I also have some butter oil).

Sorry if this is long and incoherent, I am just getting to my wit's end with all this. My husband can't believe how sensitive to food I am.

Your symptoms sounds like yeast symptoms to me, so a candida diet would probably be best. You could experiment with the supplements you have and see which ones you think you need--vitamin C and CLO would be good to take in any case, and probably the butter oil and B complex, too. Most people are magnesium deficient and I think you will get diarrhea if you take too much magnesium (I do, anyway).


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Yes, healing is well underway!









DS is doing fantastic! Poops are not as regular as I would like but I'm not complaining thus far, hoping it will work itself out in next few months. I've started kefir again which he first loved, and then wouldn't touch and now seems to love again.







Dysbiosis "smell" is gone, no more mushy poops at least unless he eats nuts or eggs which are out now. Tolerating new foods like grains and fruits and raw milk well. Sleeping longer and better, therefore a better attitude! His teeth are whiter and calculus hasn't come back after his last dental cleaning so this tells me he is absorbing his calcium now and his ph is less acidic.

I'm seriously so happy, I tear up every time I think of it. It was a wonderful Xmas present.










I'm so happy to hear of his progress! That is beyond wonderful!

Can I ask, of the foods he didn't tolerate, did you ever find out if any of them were IgE related? I'm curious to know if the rotation diet and nutrition/supplement regimen "cured" food intolerances AND food allergies--if there was any distinction between them as far as healing was concerned.

My dd is allergic to dairy and corn (IgE) and since we've eliminated them, her eczema and runny nose have cleared. But, she is intolerant to a long list of fruits (she can only tolerate bananas and pears). Otherwise, she doesn't digest them and she gets red bumps on her face, eczema and red bumps on her torso. I believe this is related to her gut, which we're working on healing, but it's difficult to find supplements that don't have corn or dairy in them.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I'm curious to know what we're all talking about when we say "rotation diet." The one that bluets posted here is what I'm familiar with: eliminate the problem foods and rotate the ones that aren't problems so as to avoid tolerable foods becoming intolerable ones. Are others here eating their known allergens, but on a rotating basis? And if so, are they food intolerances or are they histamine mediated food allergies?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
http://www.food-allergy.org/page2.html

"When a patient has multiple food allergies, the offending foods must be eliminated and all other foods should be eaten at intervals of four to five days or longer. This is know as a "rotation" or "rotary diversified" diet. Rotation diets are necessary for patients with multiple allergies because if you have overt allergies to many foods, it is likely that you have slight, subclinical allergies to many other foods that you consider safe. Eating them on a rotated basis reduces your exposure to them and hopefully will help preserve your tolerance for them."

"Doctors prescribe rotation diets of varying degrees of strictness depending on the severity of your allergies. On the most strict diets each food is eaten only once on its rotation day and the length of the rotation cycle may be much longer than four to five days. One very allergic person I talked to had been put on a one food per meal, three meals per day, twelve day cycle diet by a prominent allergy clinic. Some doctors consider rotation diets with very long cycles to be counterproductive. For most patients, a four to five day interval between eating foods gives the best masking of symptoms. "


----------



## moongoddess176 (May 16, 2006)

Hello all! I'm new to this thread and would appreciate any information. I have an exclusively BF 5 week old. Today while changing his diaper, I noticed a long( 2 inches), white, string-like thing (not moving) with the poop. Is it possible for a BF newborn to have worms of some sort? We have also been dealing with a minor case of Thrush. Please help. One more thing to be concerned about as a new momma!!


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It is more likely that it was mucus which can have many different appearances and consistencies. Not something you want there though! Does your little one have any other symptoms? Excessive gas, crying episodes, inability to nurse at times, odd colored poo? Thrush is definitely indicative of an imbalance...I'm just wondering what the rest of the picture looks like.

What are you doing for the existing thrush?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

JaneS:thank you for mentioning diet rotation. We are on a very limited diet but I am starting a rotation of foods for DS. With the stuff I have on hand I can only do a 3 day rotation but as I find meat sources and order some more gluten free grains I should be able to stretch it to 5 days. Veggies are tough though because the list for the elimination diet is short. I wonder if DS would mind single ingredient meals, is it healthy to do that?


----------



## moongoddess176 (May 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
It is more likely that it was mucus which can have many different appearances and consistencies. Not something you want there though! Does your little one have any other symptoms? Excessive gas, crying episodes, inability to nurse at times, odd colored poo? Thrush is definitely indicative of an imbalance...I'm just wondering what the rest of the picture looks like.

What are you doing for the existing thrush?

So after letting the diaper sit out for a bit, it dried up and the string was a hair that was poop/mucus covered. So that solves that mystery, but we definetely do have an imbalance. We were having alot of gas a couple of weeks ago and a few crying episodes before pooping/farting. His poop also started to turn green a few days ago, I think due to a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance and I altered our feeding routine which seems to be helping.

As for the thrush, I took diflucan for myself and for him I have been giving probiotics. I got nystatin from the ped, but I don't want to give it to him because it has so much sugar. What else helps thrush in newborns? I know that I am prone to yeast imbalances myself.


----------



## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
The funny thing is that when we put eggs and nuts on a rotation, DS seemed to have reactions more strongly than when he was eating them everyday. I have no earthly idea why this is.

I was also stuck in the "how can I eliminate anything when we are already down to so little" mindset too and I just decided to trust our Ped/Dietician, go for it, slowly, with past reactions and rotation in mind. It wasn't easy for a good several months let me tell you (why I was MIA).

So glad this worked for you, Jane! Yay!


----------



## bubbles (Jul 26, 2002)

I have followed on and off hear for months. I have read TONS about enzymes and probiotics. It is so confusing looking at the brands, types, etc. They get sooo expensive. Does anyone feel like they have found the most cost effective solution for those two supplements? I know that they are discussed a lot here, but I have never really found an answer to that particular question. I also know that they vary, especially the need for different types of enzymes, so it might be a difficult question to answer.
Thanks!


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I am now on Day 4 of the detox diet. Could it, starting at the end of day 3, be making my rash worse? Since the initial day of bad gas, I haven't had any noticeable detoxing symptoms. Since last night, I feel like I could rip my face off. My eyes are also worse than yesterday after they were much improved.

I am now treating myself for low stomach acid, as I am pretty much convinced that is a significant problem for me. That and stress. I have also started with H2O2, although I am having trouble upping the dose everyday as recommended because of having to time it around eating. I am not sure how my skin rash figures into all of this, only that my system is overtaxed. It sort of makes me wonder if I really did any healing in the past year since my symptoms started. Course, it has taken me almost that long to figure out what was going on.

I didn't feel very optimistic after my acupuncture treatment that that is the way to go for my healing. He thinks this *could* be a side effect from the antidepressant I have been taking since March. While I don't really want to be on them longterm either, they are largely doing what they are supposed to do and I am not ready to stop taking them. He also told me when I was starting to only stay on them for a week or so. As far as I understand, that is not how they work.

So for now, I feel that I am on my own with this, until figure the next step out. I do go back to see the GI doc to follow up on my endoscopy, but I can imagine not being satisfied with his recommendations, whatever they may be.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Moonshine - Im sorry there are no answers yet







Id think the rash could very well get worse after 3 days, if your body is clearing through the skin on your face? Is that your only symptom at this point (ie, do other symptoms get better or worse too?).

Ive been having a wierd time. Two weeks ago I decided to eat some carbs. I havent had a bite for 5 mos. Id been sort of afraid of what would happen (horrible headache? swollen eyelid?). I was/am so frustrated by my lack of change that I guess I felt defeatest. So I ate some banana bread that Id made with the kids. It was soo nice to sit with dd and share some b-bread! Anyway, no reaction. Since then Ive indulged 3 more times, and with food not so benign (although still *whole*), and again, there's been mostly no reaction. So now I get no reaction from nystatin and no reaction from food







: I think Im still yeasty, b/c symptoms that started with the abx are still there to some degree, but Im not sure how to judge my treatment anymore.

Meanwhile, my digestion has gotten increasingly worse on the anti-yeast diet, with a feeling of food being packed into my sternum, and slow digestion (all the talk about fat and meat being easy to digest, I think its crap, for me anyway). Since eating some carbs, that feeling has decreased a lot! Dh has been attributing that feeling and my gerd symtoms to the new diet (and stress), and now Im more inclined to believe it. Yet, if there's yeast there, I have to avoid carbs until.... I have had some rumbling with the carbs, but nothing significant, and it could easily be explained by a change in digestion (my stools are softer, and formed, rather than hard pellets).

Maybe I should get off the antifungals for awhile and try kefir...







:

JaneS - Im thrilled for you!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bubbles* 
I have followed on and off hear for months. I have read TONS about enzymes and probiotics. It is so confusing looking at the brands, types, etc. They get sooo expensive. Does anyone feel like they have found the most cost effective solution for those two supplements? I know that they are discussed a lot here, but I have never really found an answer to that particular question. I also know that they vary, especially the need for different types of enzymes, so it might be a difficult question to answer.
Thanks!

http://www.throppsnutrition.com/products.htm The cheapest good quality enzymes I've found are here...they make two different ones w/similar pricing and I've used both.

Kefir/water kefir/kombucha are definitely the most cost-effective probiotics. I use water kefirs and kombucha. Or if you want a probiotic product, I think www.customprobiotics.com are probably most cost-effective long-term, although they are really expensive up front. I use them for DD.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

moonshine--from what I understand, often when you are detoxing your symptoms will get worse for a while before they get better, so maybe that's what's happening with you.

Have you read Gale Force's book draft on battling depression with nutrition? That might be something for you to look into if you want to try to get off the antidepressant.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moongoddess176* 
So after letting the diaper sit out for a bit, it dried up and the string was a hair that was poop/mucus covered. So that solves that mystery, but we definetely do have an imbalance. We were having alot of gas a couple of weeks ago and a few crying episodes before pooping/farting. His poop also started to turn green a few days ago, I think due to a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance and I altered our feeding routine which seems to be helping.

As for the thrush, I took diflucan for myself and for him I have been giving probiotics. I got nystatin from the ped, but I don't want to give it to him because it has so much sugar. What else helps thrush in newborns? I know that I am prone to yeast imbalances myself.

I believe you can get a special sugar-free preparation of nystatin. From what I've read it's a lot safer (for both of you) than diflucan. Enzymes between meals like Candex or Candidase are good for yeast/thrush (you could call the manufacturers and see if they're safe for newborns, I know Candex is supposed to be okay for older babies and I give it to my DD), and a candida diet that eliminates sweeteners and fruit is also good. You can also take anti-fungals like raw garlic or grapefruit seed extract or coconut oil. Genetian violet is also supposed to be good to treat thrush topically.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
moonshine--Have you read Gale Force's book draft on battling depression with nutrition? That might be something for you to look into if you want to try to get off the antidepressant.

I read most of it some time ago. My current plan is to get over the hump of whatever is causing these god awful rashes, and work backwards, so to speak.

I know that detoxing can be awful, I just didn't expect another outbreak to start 5 days after the last one started. I wouldn't say that my other symptoms have gotten worse, although I might be more bloated. Hard to tell.

sasksiasmom, have you read the Metabolic Typing Diet book? I just got it from the library. Haven't gotten very far into it, but maybe it is something for you to check out to figure out the animal products/carbs thing.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Meanwhile, my digestion has gotten increasingly worse on the anti-yeast diet, with a feeling of food being packed into my sternum, and slow digestion (all the talk about fat and meat being easy to digest, I think its crap, for me anyway). Since eating some carbs, that feeling has decreased a lot! Dh has been attributing that feeling and my gerd symtoms to the new diet (and stress), and now Im more inclined to believe it. Yet, if there's yeast there, I have to avoid carbs until.... I have had some rumbling with the carbs, but nothing significant, and it could easily be explained by a change in digestion (my stools are softer, and formed, rather than hard pellets).

Maybe I should get off the antifungals for awhile and try kefir...







:

JaneS - Im thrilled for you!

i find that i MUST have oats in my diet lest i run the risk of getting "packed" as you say. otherwise, i don't take in much in the way of grains.

i would suggest going back to no grains, with the exception of one type (and i would start with oats because there is some indication that oats have helpful enzymes) for a few weeks. just make sure you soak them before cooking and eating.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
sasksiasmom, have you read the Metabolic Typing Diet book? I just got it from the library. Haven't gotten very far into it, but maybe it is something for you to check out to figure out the animal products/carbs thing.

I did awhile ago and I am a mixed type, which I *knew*. I seem to crave carbs, veggies, and protien when needed (like, on the days I had carbs for abig part of lunch, I didnt want more for dinner - was craving meat then. This happened to me beofre this diet. lunch was carb heavy, dinner was almost no carbs...). What I mean is, I think my body got pretty well regulated the past few years, although the fact that Im in yeast land suggests otherwise I guess - shrug.

Ive been thinking of adding either psyllium or flax. And taking more aloe vera gel, that seemed to help when I was doing it, and is supposed to benefit lgs. I am really wondering about the chest pain/reflux and maybe *just* having really slow motility (although I go every a.m.)







:

Moonshine - what tests have you/did you run with the GI doc? Can you get a CDSA through him/her? Iif you have low acid maybe something got through... Im reaching here. But if your doc could order it, maybe insurance would pay? Am I wrong that the rash indicates leaky gut (do all skin conditions?). Are you taking anything for that; bone broth, glutamine? Are you still taking a lot of probiotics? CLO?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Am I wrong that the rash indicates leaky gut (do all skin conditions?).

YES. Rashes (especially hives) are quite classic symptoms of leaky gut. Glutamine will help tremendously. I noticed almost immediate improvement when I added glutamine (with the herbal mixture in the IntestiNew product).

Now, my ND prefers the Metagenics Glutagenics product because Metagenics is a large enough company to throw money at quality control, so their products are definitely worth the extra money. (note that my ND doesn't actually sell anything himself - he just finds people/places that are local with good products). He also likes Standard Process? products and Nutraceutical products (Solaray, KAL, NaturalMax, VegLife, Premier One, Sunny Green, Natural Sport, ActiPet, Action Labs, FunFresh Foods, Ultimate Nutrition and Thompson) because, again, they do throw money at quality control.


----------



## bubbles (Jul 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
http://www.throppsnutrition.com/products.htm The cheapest good quality enzymes I've found are here...they make two different ones w/similar pricing and I've used both.

Kefir/water kefir/kombucha are definitely the most cost-effective probiotics. I use water kefirs and kombucha. Or if you want a probiotic product, I think www.customprobiotics.com are probably most cost-effective long-term, although they are really expensive up front. I use them for DD.


thank you so much for the links. i actually have been brewing kombucha but not drinking it regularly. thanks for reminding me of that. free probiotics are right in my fridge







. i am going to check both of those out.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

So it is wishful thinking that I will be rid of these rashes with a detox diet for a week???? Here I was convinced I don't have leaky gut. Or yeast.

I had been making yogurt. (first milk, then raw milk, then coconut. Stopped that, but am doing much more water kefir. I now have a gallon of raw milk in the frig that I am debating what to do with. I was really thinking I should go off dairy, but my dad brought me this milk. I think that I still have some kefir powder and was going to try that. The rest will have to be yogurt.

I am still faithful about the CLO. I have bones in the freezer, which have been there for months. You know, I am still a veggie at heart, so clearly I have been dragging my feet about making it, but keep thinking that I need to.

I also just got in the habit of making a nettles/red rasp berry leaf infusion and drinking most of a quart a day. Thinking I should get some bitter herbs (or maybe just a tincture) to aid in the HCl issue. Also taking a teaspoon of ginger juice every morning to help the reflux (from Walt S's website).

saskia, I know I have read in more than one place that if what you are doing to heal isn't helping after a month or than you need to change something.

Ok, going to get gluatamine. Thanks for that.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
saskia, I know I have read in more than one place that if what you are doing to heal isn't helping after a month or than you need to change something.

I KNOW, but I dont know what to do! Add carbs? When Im pretty sure I have some yeast. And then everything you read about yeast is lonnngggg term. Its so hard to know whether its a wait it out thing, or if Im on the wrong track


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
I KNOW, but I dont know what to do! Add carbs? When Im pretty sure I have some yeast. And then everything you read about yeast is lonnngggg term. Its so hard to know whether its a wait it out thing, or if Im on the wrong track

















: Yah, it is so hard to tell if you are going through some sort of healing reaction or having a REAL reaction. I started eating carbs a few weeks ago and I can tolerate small amounts of white rice, very well cooked mushy brown rice, lentils and beans are fine. I also quite ALL supplements, including my digestive enzymes so whatever I am digesting is what my body is doing on its own. I have been far less bloated than when I was doing SCD and am rarely gassy. sTill too new on the Failsafe diet to make any judgments.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

OMG, I am in so much pain. I sure hope this is a healing reaction.

I have a lead on a homeopath who is supposed to be very good, and not terribly expensive. Not very close either. Firefaery, you homeopath isn't in New Rochelle is he?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

No, he's not.

Caedmyn is right, you can get two separate sugar free preparations of Nystatin.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

So if I am detoxing and getting enough to drink, I shouldn't be constipated, right? Alas, for the last two days, that seems not to be the case. SA should be arriving today. That should help, but I really like to know that my body can do it on its own, ya know?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
So if I am detoxing and getting enough to drink, I shouldn't be constipated, right? Alas, for the last two days, that seems not to be the case. SA should be arriving today. That should help, but I really like to know that my body can do it on its own, ya know?

If your gut flora is adjusting that can cause constipation. Kombucha caused a bit of constipation for me.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Does anyone know if there are any studies on whether eating low levels of known allergens which don't cause obvious symptoms actually causes an immune response or not? Bluets, can you find anything? (Sorry to keep bugging you but you always seem to be able to find something!)


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

ask and you shall receive....

Importance of gastrointestinal ingestion and macromolecular antigens in the vein for oral tolerance induction

Wakabayashi et al. 2006. Immunology. 119(2): 167...

Oral administration of a certain dose of antigen can generally induce immunological tolerance against the same antigen. In this study, we showed the temporal appearance of ovalbumin (OVA) antigens in both portal and peripheral blood of mice after the oral administration of OVA. Furthermore, we detected 45 000 MW OVA in mouse serum 30 min after the oral administration of OVA. Based on this observation, we examined whether the injection of intact OVA into the portal or peripheral vein induces immunological tolerance against OVA. We found that the intravenous injection of intact OVA did not induce immunological tolerance but rather enhanced OVA-specific antibody production in some subclasses, suggesting that OVA antigens via the gastrointestinal tract but not intact OVA may contribute to establish immunological tolerance against OVA. Therefore, we examined the effects of digesting intact OVA in the gastrointestinal tract on the induction of oral tolerance. When mice were orally administered or injected into various gastrointestinal organs, such as the stomach, duodenum, ileum, or colon and boosted with intact OVA, OVA-specific antibody production and delayed-type hypersensitivity (DTH) response were significantly enhanced in mice injected into the ileum or colon, compared with orally administered mice. These results suggest that although macromolecular OVA antigens are detected after oral administration of OVA in tolerant-mouse serum, injection of intact OVA cannot contribute to tolerance induction. Therefore, some modification of macromolecular OVA in the gastrointestinal tract and ingestion may be essential for oral tolerance induction.

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/lin...7.2006.02418.x

Actually, it looks like a very good read because it gives a good bit of background about the current thinking of food allergens. EMAIL me if you want the pdf as it is probably restricted access.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Oral tolerance and its relation to food hypersensitivities

Chehade M, Mayer L. JOURNAL OF ALLERGY AND CLINICAL IMMUNOLOGY 115 (1): 3-12 JAN 2005 Review article

The gastrointestinal tract is the largest immunologic organ in the body. It is constantly bombarded by a myriad of dietary proteins. Despite the extent of protein exposure, very few patients have food allergies because of development of oral tolerance to these antigens. Once proteins contact the intestinal surface, they are sampled by different cells and, depending on their characteristics, result in different responses. Antigens might be taken up by Microfold cells overlying Peyer's patches, dendritic cells, or epithelial cells. Different cells of the immune system participate in oral tolerance induction, with regulatory T cells being the most important. Several factors can influence tolerance induction. Some are antigen related, and others are inherent to the host. Disturbances at different steps in the path to oral tolerance have been described in food hypersensitivity. In this review we provide an overview of oral tolerance and cite data related to food hypersensitivity wherever evidence available.

We don't have immediate access to this one but if EMAIL me if you are interested in reading more.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Immune privilege in the gut: the establishment and maintenance of non-responsiveness to dietary antigens and commensal flora

Iweala and Nagler. Immunological Reviews Volume 213 Issue 1 Page 82 - October 2006

Immune privilege in the gut is the result of a complex interplay between the gut microbiome, gut luminal antigens, and the intestinal epithelial barrier. Composed of both physical and immunochemical components, the intestinal barrier secretes immunoregulatory mediators that promote the generation of tolerogenic antigen-presenting cells, phagocytic innate immune cells characterized by 'inflammatory anergy', and regulatory cells of the adaptive immune system. Innate immune cells mediate controlled transepithelial transport of luminal antigens as far as the mesenteric lymph nodes, where the intestinal and peripheral immune systems intersect. This promotes the generation of adaptive regulatory lymphocytes that actively suppress effector cell responses against gut luminal antigens and flora. The net result is the generation of tolerance to dietary antigens and the maintenance of gut homeostasis. Dysregulation of this complex immunoregulatory network leads to diseases such as food allergy and inflammatory bowel disease. Future therapies for these diseases will likely involve the functional restoration of the barrier and regulatory cell functions at the epithelial/luminal interface.

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi...X.2006.00431.x

Again, another review article... I have access to the full article and it looks like an interesting read. EMAIL me if you want a peek.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

and another review article:

Food allergies: Prevalence, molecular characterization, and treatment/prevention strategies

Lee and Burks ANNUAL REVIEW OF NUTRITION 26: 539-565 2006

A significant proportion of the population is either affected by or concerned about food allergy. Our knowledge about food allergens and how they stimulate the immune system has increased dramatically over the past decade. However, reasons for the increased prevalence of food allergy are not clear. The diagnosis of food allergy requires that the patient and caregivers examine all foods for the presence of potential allergens in order to prevent inadvertent ingestion and further reactions. Fortunately, many children develop tolerance to allergenic foods after a period of dietary elimination. Various immunotherapy approaches are under investigation to alleviate or prevent food-induced reactions in those who have persistent food allergies.

http://bert.lib.indiana.edu:2276/doi....061505.111211

not sure if that link will work if you're not in the IU network.

this one has at least defined the varying presentations of food allergy (IgE-mediated vs cell-mediated) and food intolerance. haven't read the whole thing yet but it looks like another promising read.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Thanks, bluets! Now what the heck do they say (can you translate into plain English?)!


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Thanks, bluets! Now what the heck do they say (can you translate into plain English?)!

give me a few days... i'm in the middle of an office move and i'm working on the daycare newsletter at home. in the meantime, feel free to google words you don't know and give us a report


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Thanks, bluets! Now what the heck do they say (can you translate into plain English?)!

ditto. too many years of baby brain since grad school...


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I think I more or less understand what the abstracts are saying, but I don't think they answer my question, unless I'm just missing something. As near as I can tell, the first one is comparing injection vs. ingestion in the development of oral tolerance (or lack of it). The others seem to be talking about how oral tolerance works. The last one might possibly have some more useful information in the full text, I can't really tell.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I think I more or less understand what the abstracts are saying, but I don't think they answer my question, unless I'm just missing something. As near as I can tell, the first one is comparing injection vs. ingestion in the development of oral tolerance (or lack of it). The others seem to be talking about how oral tolerance works. The last one might possibly have some more useful information in the full text, I can't really tell.

Caedmyn, my uneducated observation from reading others' experiences and articles on allergies on the net is that even small amounts of an allergen cause a person's immune system to react. You may not see obvious outward signs, but the immune system is on alert and activated. Many people say they can tolerate their allergen in small doses, but only with breaks in between. Otherwise, they get a build-up response. So, a small dose one day does nothing (outwardly), but 3 days in a row finally produces observable reactions. In either case, their immune system is responding, but the reactions don't appear until later. Also, some people have reported that their responses (over years) became progressively worse, so that, at one time, they could tolerate small amounts, but constant exposure (presumably) caused them to react immediately even to single doses.


----------



## SweetAfton (Sep 23, 2006)

Today I got my jar of yogurt out of the fridge... then left it out for about 5 hours before I remembered and put it back in the fridge. It's 75 degrees in here. Do you think my yogurt is bad or should I still eat it?

-Afton


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I think I more or less understand what the abstracts are saying, but I don't think they answer my question, unless I'm just missing something. As near as I can tell, the first one is comparing injection vs. ingestion in the development of oral tolerance (or lack of it). The others seem to be talking about how oral tolerance works. The last one might possibly have some more useful information in the full text, I can't really tell.

You are pretty much right on. I'm not seeing the answer to your actual question, at least not here. Maybe in the full text. But, I don't know of anything that has been done to date that isn't a very medicalized study.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I tried really hard to get my doc to order a stool analysis today, but no go.







And he asked me what leaky gut was.







I didn't have enough impressive enough sounding science to roll of the tip of my tongue to make a true case of it. I have to jump through a few more of his hoops before we get there (like see a dermatologist). Sigh. However I do have an appointment with a homeopath in a bit over 2 weeks. I was almost tempted to ask if he treats leaky gut or similar, but then I didn't.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I tried really hard to get my doc to order a stool analysis today, but no go.







And he asked me what leaky gut was.







I didn't have enough impressive enough sounding science to roll of the tip of my tongue to make a true case of it. I have to jump through a few more of his hoops before we get there (like see a dermatologist). Sigh. However I do have an appointment with a homeopath in a bit over 2 weeks. I was almost tempted to ask if he treats leaky gut or similar, but then I didn't.

this might be helpful to haul around with you: http://www.thorne.com/media/intestin...rmiability.pdf


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
this might be helpful to haul around with you: http://www.thorne.com/media/intestin...rmiability.pdf

How awesome are you. Thanks bunches.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

there's actually a few more on that website that are relevant but i can't remember which issues... if you do an advanced google search on "intestinal permeability" and restrict it to the thorne.com domain, you may be able to get a few more articles to lug around.

keep in mind that this is an ALTERNATIVE medicine journal, so your mainstream docs might still brush it off.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Moonshine-just keep in mind that a classical homeopath would answer "no". The idea in homeopathy is that you don't treat a disease, but the person as a whole. So a classical homeopath doesn't "treat" leaky gut any more than they treat cancer, infectious diseases or colds. That doesn't mean they don't in the end help you. It simply means that they won't likely spend alot of time on that. I don't want that to discourage you, so I just wanted to give you a heads up. In the grand scheme of things that is a small part of your picture believe it or not! I know that is why I first went to a homeopath years and years ago and we spent alot more time on which side of my body I sleep on, what weather I felt better in, and the fact that I have a huge affinity for christmas lights-lol. It was weird, but like most I experienced a pretty big shift with my remedy.

Let us know how it goes!


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Anyone want to weigh in here?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Does anyone know if there are any studies on whether eating low levels of known allergens which don't cause obvious symptoms actually causes an immune response or not?

this is the basis of desensitization using oral tolerance and elimination diets.

one eliminates the food for some period of time. then the offending food is reintroduced - a little experimentation takes place to find the oral tolerance dosage but then the desensitization process occurs over a long period of time using that dosage. presumably, the dosage is low enough to NOT provoke an immune response.

food allergies are dependent largely on both the integrity of the gut mucosa (i.e., the lining of the gut) and the quality of the microbial flora. food allergies arise because of damage to the gut mucosa (and disruption to "gut homeostasis") and failure to achieve oral tolerance. diseases like IBS/IBD arise because of failure to achive tolerance to the microbial flora (but still a type of disruption to "gut homeostasis").

here's a real gem...
BRANDTZAEG Current Understanding of Gastrointestinal Immunoregulation and Its Relation to Food Allergy Annals of the NY Acad Sci. Volume 964, 2002, pp 13-45

abstract:
Tolerance to food antigens induced via the gut ("oral tolerance") appears to be a rather robust adaptive immune mechanism. However, the neonatal period is particularly critical in terms of mucosal defense, with regard to infections and priming for allergic disease. This is so because the intestinal barrier function provided by secretory antibodies, as well as the immunoregulatory network, is poorly developed for a variable period after birth. Notably, the postnatal development of mucosal immune homeostasis depends on the establishment of a normal commensal microbial flora and also on adequate timing and dose of dietary antigens when first introduced. In this context, breastfeeding apears to exert both shielding and positive regulatory effects. Altogether, the intestinal immune system normally seems rather fit for tolerance induction against innocuous antigens because most children with food allergy "outgrow" their problems, whereas airway allergy tends to persist.

-- inducing oral tolerance requires an intact gut lining
-- a recent Finnish study should that atopic infants had more clostridia and tended to have fewer bidifidobacteria in their stool compared to nonatopic controls
-- it appears that mixed feeding (rather than abrupt weaning) appears to promote tolerance to food proteins and avoidance of potentially harmful of cross-reactive auto-antibodies
-- cow's milk allergy is more likely to develop in infants whose mothers have relatively low levels of milk IgA antibodies (the antibodies that are specific to mucous linings of mouth through to gut) to bovine proteins; allergic mothers appear to have decreased levels of ovalbumin-specific IgA and elevated levels of Th2-promoting IL-4 in their breast milk (interleukin-4; b-cell stimulatory factor; one of the many genes involved in the cascading reactions of allergy and asthma) (Th2 part of the immune system is the allergic part of the reaction whereas Th1 responds to microbial/viral attack)

the best part of this article is (finally!) a picture of how the interaction schematically works between mama's immune system, her mammary glands, and the child. it seems to suggest that if mama's gut is compromised and her immune system fails to mount a reasonable IgA response to food antigens, then nursing baby will not receive the necessary antibodies to achieve full oral tolerance


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
this is the basis of desensitization using oral tolerance and elimination diets.

one eliminates the food for some period of time. then the offending food is reintroduced - a little experimentation takes place to find the oral tolerance dosage but then the desensitization process occurs over a long period of time using that dosage. presumably, the dosage is low enough to NOT provoke an immune response.

food allergies are dependent largely on both the integrity of the gut mucosa (i.e., the lining of the gut) and the quality of the microbial flora. food allergies arise because of damage to the gut mucosa (and disruption to "gut homeostasis") and failure to achieve oral tolerance. diseases like IBS/IBD arise because of failure to achive tolerance to the microbial flora (but still a type of disruption to "gut homeostasis").

here's a real gem...
BRANDTZAEG Current Understanding of Gastrointestinal Immunoregulation and Its Relation to Food Allergy Annals of the NY Acad Sci. Volume 964, 2002, pp 13-45

abstract:
Tolerance to food antigens induced via the gut ("oral tolerance") appears to be a rather robust adaptive immune mechanism. However, the neonatal period is particularly critical in terms of mucosal defense, with regard to infections and priming for allergic disease. This is so because the intestinal barrier function provided by secretory antibodies, as well as the immunoregulatory network, is poorly developed for a variable period after birth. Notably, the postnatal development of mucosal immune homeostasis depends on the establishment of a normal commensal microbial flora and also on adequate timing and dose of dietary antigens when first introduced. In this context, breastfeeding apears to exert both shielding and positive regulatory effects. Altogether, the intestinal immune system normally seems rather fit for tolerance induction against innocuous antigens because most children with food allergy "outgrow" their problems, whereas airway allergy tends to persist.

-- inducing oral tolerance requires an intact gut lining
-- a recent Finnish study should that atopic infants had more clostridia and tended to have fewer bidifidobacteria in their stool compared to nonatopic controls
-- it appears that mixed feeding (rather than abrupt weaning) appears to promote tolerance to food proteins and avoidance of potentially harmful of cross-reactive auto-antibodies
-- cow's milk allergy is more likely to develop in infants whose mothers have relatively low levels of milk IgA antibodies (the antibodies that are specific to mucous linings of mouth through to gut) to bovine proteins; allergic mothers appear to have decreased levels of ovalbumin-specific IgA and elevated levels of Th2-promoting IL-4 in their breast milk (interleukin-4; b-cell stimulatory factor; one of the many genes involved in the cascading reactions of allergy and asthma) (Th2 part of the immune system is the allergic part of the reaction whereas Th1 responds to microbial/viral attack)

the best part of this article is (finally!) a picture of how the interaction schematically works between mama's immune system, her mammary glands, and the child. it seems to suggest that if mama's gut is compromised and her immune system fails to mount a reasonable IgA response to food antigens, then nursing baby will not receive the necessary antibodies to achieve full oral tolerance

That's a fascinating article! It scares me though because of the connection between dairy allergy and asthma.


----------



## aprildawn (Apr 1, 2004)

Hey Gut Healing Mamas. I hope you don't mind my posting my question here. I think you can help me. I've tried to read through your cheat sheet and this thread to glean some information before posting my question, but it was kinda overwhelming...so...

My younger DD seems very suseptible to stomach bugs. I started a thread about it, then I noticed your thread. Maybe some of you could chime in on how to heal her tummy and build back up some immunity in her stomach?

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=593161

Or maybe this is just normal for some kids?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aprildawn* 
Hey Gut Healing Mamas. I hope you don't mind my posting my question here. I think you can help me. I've tried to read through your cheat sheet and this thread to glean some information before posting my question, but it was kinda overwhelming...so...

My younger DD seems very suseptible to stomach bugs. I started a thread about it, then I noticed your thread. Maybe some of you could chime in on how to heal her tummy and build back up some immunity in her stomach?

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=593161

Or maybe this is just normal for some kids?

okie... i posted my 2 cents worth in your thread.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Are any commercial brands worth trying or is this something that needs to be made at home? I saw some at WF the other day (don't remember the brand, though). Which ones have beneficial bacteria? I also need to find one that doesn't contain corn derivatives like citric acid or added vitamins and things like that. Suggestions?


----------



## naturegirl7 (Jan 27, 2005)

Hi! I was told to check this thread out so here I am









My son (19 months old) was just diagnosed with an anaphylaxis peanut allergy. The doctor also suspects soy and dairy allergies/intolerances. He tried to do the special immuno lab test that tests for 88 different allergens, but poor DS's veins did not cooperate. So now we are doing an intensive food diary for the next 8 weeks and going back to have it reviewed. It is to include types and amounts of food plus DS's reactions - sleep patterns, behavior patterns, skin conditions, diaper rash, etc. I was thinking that I might as well do an elimination diet while we are at it - eliminate all dairy, eggs, soy, and wheat from our diet (he is still BF so I have to do it too) for 2-3 weeks and then reintroduce a group each week. Does this sound like a good plan?

What can I do during this time (and after) to "heal the gut" for us both?

I have a history of IBS since HS. I have been able to manage it with diet - more grains, fruits, veggies, etc less red meats, fats, sugars, etc and by trying to manage my stress - it definitely is linked primarily to stress for me. There is a huge family history of IBS, especially in the women on my mother's side. Plus there is a huge milk allergy/intolerance from my dad's side. Not a big fan of milk, but love cheese and yogurt.
DS has had a "sensitive system" since shortly after birth - first he reacted to the antibiotic I was on for a PP UTI - I inisisted he was reacted, only to be told no, it's normal for babies to be colicky. Two weeks later it got to the point that he went 12 hours without nursing, sleeping, and just cried and cried and cried. FINALLY they listened to me, saw him, and decided he was reacting to the macrobid I was taking, and switched me to amoxicillin, which made him feel slightly better (enough to nurse and sleep anyway) and finally kicked my UTI. But it butchtered his stomach. Resulting in months and months (until about 8 months old) of severe colic like symptoms. I treated him with gripe water and probiotics and watched my diet carefully, eliminating anything that seemed to make it "worse" - it seems that his tummy troubles have gotten "better" over time, but he (and I) are still prone to very very sensitive tummies.

We held off on introing dairy products, when he did he seemed okay with cheese and yogurt but got tummy troubles with anything else dairy. his eczema got worse over time though, then the runny nose started and hasn't stopped - "it's just from teething" I was told. The sleep disturbances and irritability, "it's just teething" the diarrhea off and on "its just teething" Finally after reading, I decided to eliminate dairy and switched to soy products. It made things worse. He ended up with worse diaper rash, diarrhea more on than off, a constant runny nose, never sleeping soundly, "its just his molars, they are always the worst" Then the ear infection that lasted almost 2 full months. After kicking twice, only to get it back within a few days (using chiropractic care, homeopathic remedies, and finally anitbiotics) I threw out all the soy in my house - it cleared up within a few days and hasn't come back since!

Since my ped is an idiot as far as I am concerned at this point, when he reacted to peanuts and she refused to even call in an epipen or get on the phone and answer a few question for this panic stricken but fairly knowledgable mama - we switched. We started with a new doctor that is ancient but wonderful. LOL He doesn't believe in vaxing, was so proud that DS is still BF, proud to hear we do organic foods, and just the doctor of my dreams at this point. He specializes in food and environmental allergies, nutritional medicine, and treating vax damaged kids.

He wants an extensive food diary to help us pin point intolerances, allergies, and nutritional concerns.

What else can I do in the meantime? what exactly is "healing the gut" - it seems like diet based and supplements like probiotics from what little I have gotten a chance to read so far, can anyone give me a quick summary or some good links?

thanks - and sorry it is so darn long!


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I'm starting diflucan today. I can't take the itchyness anymore and I don't thinkt he herbal stuff I was doing is doing a darned thing.









I'm just so sick of dealing with this nightmare. I wanna go pretend it doesn't exist.







:

Sorry I'm just a downer today. DD didn't nap and I'm stressed out about our health.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Sorry I'm just a downer today. DD didn't nap and I'm stressed out about our health.

Me too


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Caedmyn and Pattyla-we all have those days. Hang in there, mamas. You're both doing so great-think of how many people have no idea and let the damage just continue? I know it sometimes feels like ignorance would be bliss, but you have done so much good already.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *naturegirl7* 
What can I do during this time (and after) to "heal the gut" for us both?

cutting the allergens would help in healing because you'll cut back on the inflammation. perhaps supplement with EFAs - Cod liver oil, flax seed oil, borage oil, evening primrose oil - any combination of them. some of us here require about 3g/day of EPO, so we're not talking RDA amounts of these EFAs.

some of us have had success with a variety of probiotics - either from a bottle or from homegrown cultures of kefir (cow milk, goat milk or coconut milk), yogurt, or kombucha. you might try doing some healing first before introducing these. if using probiotics from a bottle, you'll need to look for one that does not contain contaminants of the allergens you are eliminating.

i personally had success with glutamine - within a few days of use, my allergic reactions stopped completely. turkey contains natural occurring glutamine.

i think many of us are taking a whole foods vitamin C supplement, like amla or acerola.

Quote:

I have a history of IBS since HS. I have been able to manage it with diet - more grains, fruits, veggies, etc less red meats, fats, sugars, etc and by trying to manage my stress - it definitely is linked primarily to stress for me. There is a huge family history of IBS, especially in the women on my mother's side.
i just read that IBS is indicative of an imbalance in the gut with its microbial flora. probiotics probiotics probiotics.

Quote:

Plus there is a huge milk allergy/intolerance from my dad's side. Not a big fan of milk, but love cheese and yogurt.
you'll need to stay far away from dairy for at least 6 weeks to clear it out of your system. i am able to tolerate cultured dairy only - homegrown at that. though lately (9 months or so without cheese) i discovered i can tolerate some goat cheese.

Quote:

DS has had a "sensitive system" since shortly after birth - first he reacted to the antibiotic I was on for a PP UTI - I inisisted he was reacted, only to be told no, it's normal for babies to be colicky. Two weeks later it got to the point that he went 12 hours without nursing, sleeping, and just cried and cried and cried. FINALLY they listened to me, saw him, and decided he was reacting to the macrobid I was taking, and switched me to amoxicillin, which made him feel slightly better (enough to nurse and sleep anyway) and finally kicked my UTI. But it butchtered his stomach. Resulting in months and months (until about 8 months old) of severe colic like symptoms. I treated him with gripe water and probiotics and watched my diet carefully, eliminating anything that seemed to make it "worse" - it seems that his tummy troubles have gotten "better" over time, but he (and I) are still prone to very very sensitive tummies.
probiotics for ds should be on your list - again make sure that they do not contain the foods you are eliminating. call the manufacturer if you can't find easy information.

Quote:

We held off on introing dairy products, when he did he seemed okay with cheese and yogurt but got tummy troubles with anything else dairy. his eczema got worse over time though, then the runny nose started and hasn't stopped - "it's just from teething" I was told. The sleep disturbances and irritability, "it's just teething" the diarrhea off and on "its just teething" Finally after reading, I decided to eliminate dairy and switched to soy products. It made things worse. He ended up with worse diaper rash, diarrhea more on than off, a constant runny nose, never sleeping soundly, "its just his molars, they are always the worst" Then the ear infection that lasted almost 2 full months. After kicking twice, only to get it back within a few days (using chiropractic care, homeopathic remedies, and finally anitbiotics) I threw out all the soy in my house - it cleared up within a few days and hasn't come back since!
have you tried bodywork? some of us have had good experiences with craniosacral therapy. my ds responds to it particularly for constipation and for his head congestion (the former is our current problem though we initially started going for the latter).

Quote:

Since my ped is an idiot as far as I am concerned at this point, when he reacted to peanuts and she refused to even call in an epipen or get on the phone and answer a few question for this panic stricken but fairly knowledgable mama - we switched. We started with a new doctor that is ancient but wonderful. LOL He doesn't believe in vaxing, was so proud that DS is still BF, proud to hear we do organic foods, and just the doctor of my dreams at this point. He specializes in food and environmental allergies, nutritional medicine, and treating vax damaged kids.
yup - we dumped the ped and the allergist. i now have a family doc who knows what "leaky gut" means and offered to run tests if i needed them. i also added an ND to my list of practitioners (even though they aren't licensed here nor are they covered by insurance).

Quote:

He wants an extensive food diary to help us pin point intolerances, allergies, and nutritional concerns.

What else can I do in the meantime? what exactly is "healing the gut" - it seems like diet based and supplements like probiotics from what little I have gotten a chance to read so far, can anyone give me a quick summary or some good links?
there is a healing the gut cheat sheet sticky that JaneS created - it is daunting so don't hesitate to ask questions here. some suggested reading: "Breaking the Vicious Cycle", "Bacteria for Breakfast", for starters.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

nm, found what I was looking for.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I keep reading that eczema can be a sign of an omega 6 fatty acid deficiency. Now I know most people's diets are too high in omega 6's, but I just wonder if DD's eczema could possibly be related to this, as nothing I've done seems to help it. Thoughts on this? And what would be a healthy nut & soy free source of omega 6's?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

And I was just wondering, on the topic of EFAs, if I should be taking evening primrose oil. All I am currently taking is CLO and very little CO. Remind me, if you will, what EPO is good for? Skin problems, among other things, I believe.


----------



## mamalex (Mar 2, 2004)

I'm 5mths preggo and a history a bad stomach problems all my life (indiagnosed.) I've managed to control my bad stomachaches more and more with diet- haven't had debillitating pain in about a year.

However, my descending colon feels very, very bruised all the time and is getting worse as pregnancy progresses with the baby displacing it. My diet is basically whole foods- no sugar or honey. I do eat dairy. I try not to eat wheat unless it is sprouted or sourdoughed. We base most of our meals around protein and veggies (little grains- no pasta, etc.) So...that's where I've stopped. But now that I realize I have constant, chronic colon pain, I'm motivated to figure out what the heck is going on. Where do I start. I have an appt w/ a gastroenterologist, but I lack faith there- haven't taken antibiotic in years, blah, blah. Do I shell out the money for weird allergy tests or what??


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

mamalex--have you looked at the HTG cheat sheet stickied at the top of the forum? That might get you started. A couple of people with gut issues have had good success with the Specific Carbohydrate Diet. You definitely want to emphasize probiotics or probiotic foods (homemade yogurt, kefir, water kefirs, kombucha, sauerkraut, etc) and it would probably be a good idea to only eat easy-to-digest foods for a while, too (maybe eliminate grains for a bit).


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Anyone know if olive leaf extract is safe while BF'ing? Or any suggestions on other anti-fungals? CO is out right at the moment, so is garlic, GSE kills good bacteria too I guess, and OOO isn't safe for BF'ing.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

There is little safety information available on the effects of herbs in breastfeeding. In general, we look at the actions of herbs to see whether the herb's action would have a negative effect on the health of the mother or baby. Some of the herbal actions that you want to avoid in breastfeeding are the following: herbs that decrease the milk supply (e.g. sage); herbs with hormonal actions that may affect your hormones and therefore your breast milk supply (e.g. licorice); herbs that are stimulating (this may cause overstimulation or sedation of the baby's nervous system or of a particular organ (e.g. bladderwrack stimulates the thyroid gland); herbs that cause digestive distress (e.g. lots of garlic); herbs that are toxic in large doses (e.g. wormwood); herbal laxatives (e.g. senna, Cascara sagrada); herbs that cause an allergic reaction in the mother.

In olive leaf, you do not want the blood pressure lowering or blood sugar lowering actions transmitted to your baby. Without any safety information on the use of this herb with breastfeeding, it may be best to avoid it because of these actions.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
There is little safety information available on the effects of herbs in breastfeeding. In general, we look at the actions of herbs to see whether the herb's action would have a negative effect on the health of the mother or baby. Some of the herbal actions that you want to avoid in breastfeeding are the following: herbs that decrease the milk supply (e.g. sage); herbs with hormonal actions that may affect your hormones and therefore your breast milk supply (e.g. licorice); herbs that are stimulating (this may cause overstimulation or sedation of the baby's nervous system or of a particular organ (e.g. bladderwrack stimulates the thyroid gland); herbs that cause digestive distress (e.g. lots of garlic); herbs that are toxic in large doses (e.g. wormwood); herbal laxatives (e.g. senna, Cascara sagrada); herbs that cause an allergic reaction in the mother.

In olive leaf, you do not want the blood pressure lowering or blood sugar lowering actions transmitted to your baby. Without any safety information on the use of this herb with breastfeeding, it may be best to avoid it because of these actions.

I suppose considering I tend to have low blood pressure anyway OLE's probably not a good choice. Any suggestions on other anti-fungals? What's the oxygen therapy you've done with your kiddos?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Too much detoxing? This morning it seemed I was finally over the hump with this latest face rash. It wasn't completely gone, but the end was in sight. Then this afternoon/evening it appears to be coming back.







: I did get a homeopathic cream to help with rashes, inflammation, etc, and it seems to be helping, thank goodness, but I did wondering if this would be my die-off? The other possibility is that I am reacting to the dairy I had today -- raw milk kefir. Goodness, I hope not.

I have been taking epsom salt baths and I am now thinking I should get pascelite clay to help sop up toxins. I now also have glutamine and EPO and more SA. Any other ideas?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Too much detoxing? This morning it seemed I was finally over the hump with this latest face rash. It wasn't completely gone, but the end was in sight. Then this afternoon/evening it appears to be coming back.







: I did get a homeopathic cream to help with rashes, inflammation, etc, and it seems to be helping, thank goodness, but I did wondering if this would be my die-off? The other possibility is that I am reacting to the dairy I had today -- raw milk kefir. Goodness, I hope not.

I have been taking epsom salt baths and I am now thinking I should get pascelite clay to help sop up toxins. I now also have glutamine and EPO and more SA. Any other ideas?

What if you detoxed for a couple of days and didn't take any supplements? Any extra supplements that aren't getting used by your body have to be cleaned out by the liver and kidneys.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Too much detoxing? This morning it seemed I was finally over the hump with this latest face rash. It wasn't completely gone, but the end was in sight. Then this afternoon/evening it appears to be coming back.







: I did get a homeopathic cream to help with rashes, inflammation, etc, and it seems to be helping, thank goodness, but I did wondering if this would be my die-off? The other possibility is that I am reacting to the dairy I had today -- raw milk kefir. Goodness, I hope not.

I have been taking epsom salt baths and I am now thinking I should get pascelite clay to help sop up toxins. I now also have glutamine and EPO and more SA. Any other ideas?

What about enzymes?

I've finally found supplements that are free of our allergies, so as soon as a few more arrive in the mail, we'll be doing vit C + quercetin, broad spectrum enyzme, acidophilus/bifidus, high vitamin CLO, flaxseed oil and glutamine.

About your face rash, how often do you have dairy products? Have you noticed any ill effects from dairy before?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
About your face rash, how often do you have dairy products? Have you noticed any ill effects from dairy before?

I haven't had any dairy since starting the detox diet, which is now a week. I didn't really have any ill effect before that I specifically knew of, but I have wondered if my incessant nose blowing all my life is related to dairy.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I haven't had any dairy since starting the detox diet, which is now a week. I didn't really have any ill effect before that I specifically knew of, but I have wondered if my incessant nose blowing all my life is related to dairy.

When I went off dairy over a year ago, I was amazed at how my congestion cleared up. I'd lived with the phlegm so long, I thought it was normal.


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

I've pm'd both JaneS and firefaery about this. JaneS suggested I post here









I don't know if you've stumbled upon threads explaining our situation, but we are at the point where we're not sure what to do anymore. Dh desperately wants to put dd on a hypoallergenic formula so that I can eat again. I am going to include as much information as possible in my explanation about what's been going on. I'm wondering about Leaky Gut issues in myself, but don't know how to find out if that's exactly what's going on. There is so much information out there that it's overwhelming, and with a high-needs baby who can never be put down (I can't even sit down with her...she needs to be walked around CONSTANTLY!) I can't do too much researching at once. Basically, if you could let me know your opinions on all of this, that would be helpful. I'm going to include as much information about myself as I can, incase it makes a difference:

Let's start back to when I was a teenager...I had moderate acne and was put on antibiotics for about 2 years. They didn't help. Then I developed depression and an eating disorder and was hospitalized for anorexia for a year. I'm since fully recovered, but pretty much starved myself and ate crap (all fat free, low cal food) for about 5 years. After that, I started eating a vegetarian (mostly vegan) diet. Dairy began bothering me, so I didn't eat it anymore, was never a fan of meat, didn't eat eggs, so I was pretty much vegan for a couple of years. After starting to eat healthy foods and really loving the whole food diet I was on, my body seemed to thrive. I also started acupuncture to treat my depression and insomnia. I rarely got sick, looked great, felt good and had lots of energy, but had horrible migraines. During this time I was on birth control for a year before TTC dd. Then I get pregnant (was off the pill for 4 months) and my health deteriorates. After I stopped the pill, I started getting acne again, but it was mild. Once pregnant, the acne was HORRIBLE. Big welts all over my face, back, chest, upper arms...it was insane! It is still bad, although gone from my upper arms and chest. Around the 5th month, the eczema started on my hands and progressively got worse. My midwife (also a ND) suggested I be tested for allergies. (IgG) A bunch of things came back as positive, although cow's milk was the only really bad one. I was supposed to do a rotation diet, but didn't get any explanation or help with that and didn't know anything about it, so I just eliminated everything it said to: wheat/gluten/soy/dairy/yeast and certain fruits and spices. It was hard. I wasn't eating much and was probably lacking nutrients in many areas. This was most likely a big mistake while pregnant...I now realize that. Well, the acne got slightly better, but the eczema continued getting worse and worse. It eventually got to the point where I would wake up at night itching and have it bleeding by morning. I wouldn't be able to sleep because the itching was so intense, so I would lay awake and cry
So dd was born in September. She is high-needs and very fussy, but she would also have these bouts of screaming like she was in incredible pain. She has had horrible mucousy poops/runny/STINKY, etc. No visible skin rashes except the cradle cap. She has horrible gas, especially at night which keeps us up for about 4-5 hours at a time. She doesn't nap (20 minutes about 3 times a day...that is it!) Wakes up every 45 minutes to an hour to eat at night. We met with a kinesiologist who said dd was extremely sensitive and couldn't tolerate many things in my diet (keep in mind I was still on the restricted diet!). So I was down to organic chicken, carrots, kale, sunflower seed butter, basmati rice, yukon gold potatoes and peas. That's it. For 4 months I have been eating that. She is getting worse too. I stopped eating the chicken that was okay with her, and she slept great two nights in a row. I am so limited on protein options right now. I had salmon the past two nights and she was okay with that, but I don't want to eat salmon every night as she will grow intolerant to that too.
I had some blood tests done to see how my body was coping and turns out my liver is actually starting to produce fat for my body. My cholesterol was way too low as well. Surprisingly, my iron was okay.
My eczema is getting worse and worse and spreading down my hands. They have me on cod liver oil, a digestive enzyme, EPA and DHA and probiotics. I have been on probiotics for about 3 years now, BTW. Dd is now taking a neonate probiotic too.

So, seeing as how I have not slept more than 4 hours a night total since her birth, the days are horrible, and she is steadily getting worse and growing intolerant to the little variety in my diet, I have no clue what to do. I don't want to go to formula...I feel that will be bad for us both. But my hair is falling out in clumps, I am weak, tired and hungry. I don't know what else to do. I am starving and losing weight rapidly. I get barely 1,000 calories a day. FYI: CO gives her reflux. My only fat is olive oil, but I over do that everyday so I wonder if she's now reacting to that too







:

I've read about the SCD and such, but how can I eat foods she reacts to? I don't know what to do!

If any of you have suggestions or advice, please share! We are at the end of our ropes and I fear that either dd or I will suffer greatly from what we are doing now.

I've looked at the cheat sheat, but there is just so much information and our situation seems to be kind of unqiue (can't do a rotation diet, etc.) that I don't know what to do or where to start.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

mum2be--the first thing that popped into my head when I read your story was "rotation diet". It sounds to me like your situation is similar to that of JaneS's DS, who reacted to everything. You could eliminate her major allergens and then come up with a 7 day rotation plan for everything else. That will allow you to eat a wider variety of foods and get more nutrients which will help both of you. I would also recommend really focusing on high-nutrient foods like meats, bone broth, eggs (assuming they're not a major allergen), homemade goat or sheep's milk yogurt if possible, and coconut milk and coconut oil. You could also try herbal infusions that are high in nutrients like nettle, red raspberry leaf, red clover, and alfalfa.

What probiotics are you two taking and what are the doses (how many billion CFU's)?


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
I've pm'd both JaneS and firefaery about this. JaneS suggested I post here









I don't know if you've stumbled upon threads explaining our situation, but we are at the point where we're not sure what to do anymore. Dh desperately wants to put dd on a hypoallergenic formula so that I can eat again. I am going to include as much information as possible in my explanation about what's been going on. I'm wondering about Leaky Gut issues in myself, but don't know how to find out if that's exactly what's going on. There is so much information out there that it's overwhelming, and with a high-needs baby who can never be put down (I can't even sit down with her...she needs to be walked around CONSTANTLY!) I can't do too much researching at once. Basically, if you could let me know your opinions on all of this, that would be helpful. I'm going to include as much information about myself as I can, incase it makes a difference:

Let's start back to when I was a teenager...I had moderate acne and was put on antibiotics for about 2 years. They didn't help. Then I developed depression and an eating disorder and was hospitalized for anorexia for a year. I'm since fully recovered, but pretty much starved myself and ate crap (all fat free, low cal food) for about 5 years. After that, I started eating a vegetarian (mostly vegan) diet. Dairy began bothering me, so I didn't eat it anymore, was never a fan of meat, didn't eat eggs, so I was pretty much vegan for a couple of years. After starting to eat healthy foods and really loving the whole food diet I was on, my body seemed to thrive. I also started acupuncture to treat my depression and insomnia. I rarely got sick, looked great, felt good and had lots of energy, but had horrible migraines. During this time I was on birth control for a year before TTC dd. Then I get pregnant (was off the pill for 4 months) and my health deteriorates. After I stopped the pill, I started getting acne again, but it was mild. Once pregnant, the acne was HORRIBLE. Big welts all over my face, back, chest, upper arms...it was insane! It is still bad, although gone from my upper arms and chest. Around the 5th month, the eczema started on my hands and progressively got worse. My midwife (also a ND) suggested I be tested for allergies. (IgG) A bunch of things came back as positive, although cow's milk was the only really bad one. I was supposed to do a rotation diet, but didn't get any explanation or help with that and didn't know anything about it, so I just eliminated everything it said to: wheat/gluten/soy/dairy/yeast and certain fruits and spices. It was hard. I wasn't eating much and was probably lacking nutrients in many areas. This was most likely a big mistake while pregnant...I now realize that. Well, the acne got slightly better, but the eczema continued getting worse and worse. It eventually got to the point where I would wake up at night itching and have it bleeding by morning. I wouldn't be able to sleep because the itching was so intense, so I would lay awake and cry
So dd was born in September. She is high-needs and very fussy, but she would also have these bouts of screaming like she was in incredible pain. She has had horrible mucousy poops/runny/STINKY, etc. No visible skin rashes except the cradle cap. She has horrible gas, especially at night which keeps us up for about 4-5 hours at a time. She doesn't nap (20 minutes about 3 times a day...that is it!) Wakes up every 45 minutes to an hour to eat at night. We met with a kinesiologist who said dd was extremely sensitive and couldn't tolerate many things in my diet (keep in mind I was still on the restricted diet!). So I was down to organic chicken, carrots, kale, sunflower seed butter, basmati rice, yukon gold potatoes and peas. That's it. For 4 months I have been eating that. She is getting worse too. I stopped eating the chicken that was okay with her, and she slept great two nights in a row. I am so limited on protein options right now. I had salmon the past two nights and she was okay with that, but I don't want to eat salmon every night as she will grow intolerant to that too.
I had some blood tests done to see how my body was coping and turns out my liver is actually starting to produce fat for my body. My cholesterol was way too low as well. Surprisingly, my iron was okay.
My eczema is getting worse and worse and spreading down my hands. They have me on cod liver oil, a digestive enzyme, EPA and DHA and probiotics. I have been on probiotics for about 3 years now, BTW. Dd is now taking a neonate probiotic too.

So, seeing as how I have not slept more than 4 hours a night total since her birth, the days are horrible, and she is steadily getting worse and growing intolerant to the little variety in my diet, I have no clue what to do. I don't want to go to formula...I feel that will be bad for us both. But my hair is falling out in clumps, I am weak, tired and hungry. I don't know what else to do. I am starving and losing weight rapidly. I get barely 1,000 calories a day. FYI: CO gives her reflux. My only fat is olive oil, but I over do that everyday so I wonder if she's now reacting to that too







:

I've read about the SCD and such, but how can I eat foods she reacts to? I don't know what to do!

If any of you have suggestions or advice, please share! We are at the end of our ropes and I fear that either dd or I will suffer greatly from what we are doing now.

I've looked at the cheat sheat, but there is just so much information and our situation seems to be kind of unqiue (can't do a rotation diet, etc.) that I don't know what to do or where to start.

first of all, hugs to you. It sounds like things are really, really tough. I think the hardest part about all of this is that every person/child is unique, and all the research is really hard to fit in with a child needing constant attention.

Have you heard about the special foods rotation diet? You can read about it here:
http://www.specialfoods.com/rotationdiet.html

I had someone suggest it to me from these boards. I haven't actually done it yet - our case is not as severe as yours and I am trying a few other regimens first, but reading your story reminded me of it. I do think that we can create issues by just eating the same things (my dd was fine with cinnamon, and then it turned into a problem because I ate it all the time - it was the only flavor she could tolerate, so I overdid it), which makes it even harder because then you start chasing a moving ball.

My husband was pushing the hypoallergenic formula, too, until I really figured out how much it would cost (our insurance won't pay for it even with a dr. rx). And once I shared that with him, he became so much more supportive and hasn't said another word about how much I spend on supplements or time I spend researching!

Good luck!


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Thanks for the support









I guess what I would like to know is, how do I know that I am dealing with leaky gut for sure?

And...

If I am, and it's ME that's causing dd's problems, would she be better off on a formula?

See, I am all for BF'ing and know that it would be very hard to give it up, but if I keep damaging her gut by eating things that she can't tolerate, how on earth is she going to start to heal?

I am taking pharmax HLC high potency powder. There are 8 billion viable cells in 1 gram, and I take 3-1/4 teaspoons a day now. She takes the same brand of the neonate with 1 billion viable cells. I dip my pinky in it and stick it in her mouth about 3 times a day.

Also, I am taking L-Glutamine and just started the L. Reuteri today after all those studies came out about colic, etc.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
Thanks for the support









I guess what I would like to know is, how do I know that I am dealing with leaky gut for sure?

And...

If I am, and it's ME that's causing dd's problems, would she be better off on a formula?

See, I am all for BF'ing and know that it would be very hard to give it up, but if I keep damaging her gut by eating things that she can't tolerate, how on earth is she going to start to heal?

I am taking pharmax HLC high potency powder. There are 8 billion viable cells in 1 gram, and I take 3-1/4 teaspoons a day now. She takes the same brand of the neonate with 1 billion viable cells. I dip my pinky in it and stick it in her mouth about 3 times a day.

Also, I am taking L-Glutamine and just started the L. Reuteri today after all those studies came out about colic, etc.

There really isn't any way that I'm aware of to be sure, scientifically speaking, that you are dealing with leaky gut. Basically it works like this: if your gut is working properly the foods you eat will be properly broken down into their respective components and your BM will reflect that. If your gut is not working properly and is "leaky", the foods you eat don't get broken down properly and food proteins make their way into places they shouldn't be, like your bloodstream and BM. Because your DD's body isn't designed to handle BM like this, she reacts.

IMO your DD will not be better off on formula. The kids of people on this board who weaned have been worse off after weaning, no matter how poorly the child was doing while nursing. Your DD may very well react to formula, too, and then where would you be? The trick is to find a diet for you that will not keep aggravating her immune system, either by eating unusual foods that she doesn't react to or by rotating foods so that her system isn't constantly bombarded by the same foods over and over.

You may want to look at getting probiotics from www.customprobiotics.com They will probably be cheaper and much stronger than what you are taking now--1 gram of the one my DD is on contains 260 billion CFU's. How old is your DD? She should probably be getting a probiotic that only contains bifidus infantis and I know the pharmax neonate contains other strains.
She probably also needs way more probiotics than she is getting right now. My DD is getting 100 billion CFU's a day at this point.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
Thanks for the support









I guess what I would like to know is, how do I know that I am dealing with leaky gut for sure?

there is a test that you can do through genova diagnostics... costs about $65.

Quote:

And...

If I am, and it's ME that's causing dd's problems, would she be better off on a formula?
no.

Quote:

See, I am all for BF'ing and know that it would be very hard to give it up, but if I keep damaging her gut by eating things that she can't tolerate, how on earth is she going to start to heal?
breastmilk contains good things too which surpass the bad things.

Quote:

I am taking pharmax HLC high potency powder. There are 8 billion viable cells in 1 gram, and I take 3-1/4 teaspoons a day now. She takes the same brand of the neonate with 1 billion viable cells. I dip my pinky in it and stick it in her mouth about 3 times a day.

Also, I am taking L-Glutamine and just started the L. Reuteri today after all those studies came out about colic, etc.
ah. i would also add evening primrose oil... probably at least 3g per day. perhaps MSM (organic sulfur) to help strengthen connective tissue.


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 

You may want to look at getting probiotics from www.customprobiotics.com They will probably be cheaper and much stronger than what you are taking now--1 gram of the one my DD is on contains 260 billion CFU's. How old is your DD? She should probably be getting a probiotic that only contains bifidus infantis and I know the pharmax neonate contains other strains.
She probably also needs way more probiotics than she is getting right now. My DD is getting 100 billion CFU's a day at this point.

She's 4 mo. How would i get that much into her? She won't take a bottle.


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
there is a test that you can do through genova diagnostics... costs about $65.


I see two tests on their site. Which one is it? They're done by stool samples, correct? Would it be helpful to get dd tested too?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
She's 4 mo. How would i get that much into her? She won't take a bottle.

She can suck it off your finger. It's only a tiny amount--you start with one baby scoop (1/10th of a gram) and work your way up to however much you think you need. It would probably take 2 or maybe 3 "finger dips" to get all of a baby scoop into her mouth.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Can we talk about rotation diets? I'd like to start one to preserve dd's tolerance to her safe foods and give her a chance to tolerate some of the iffy ones, but I'm not exactly sure how to go about it. I've done some reading online and got a few ideas. Here's the idea so far. Tell me what you think:

Day 1: Rice, green beans/yam, peach, pork, palm oil
Day 2: Wheat, squash/onion, apple/tomato, chicken, canola oil
Day 3: White potato, spinach/mushrooms, blueberry, beef, olive oil
Day 4: Oats, peppers/peas, pear, turkey, coconut oil
Day 5: Quinoa, carrots/garlic, banana/grapes, eggs, sunflower/safflower oil

It's a five day rotation. One concern I have is how to incorporate legumes. Since they're related, I'm guessing I shouldn't do a different one daily, but what about twice a week? Also, is it worth it to rotate things like herbs and spices (or even garlic and onion)? I'm also thinking that rotating vegetables needn't be so strict since there's a lot of variety to be had in general. I'm especially interested in helping dd tolerate a wider variety of fruits and not lose her tolerance of grains.


----------



## Caden's Mom (Jul 27, 2006)

Hi all! I suspect my DS has a leaky gut. I've read the cheat sheet sticky, but its like reading French! Here's our deal

DS had horrendous cradle cap as a newborn, down his forehead and oozing. Ick! After that healed, he quickly dev'p eczema. I breifly tried an elimination diet, but his eczema got worse so I stopped. Finally when he was 10 months I insisted on allergy testing for dairy. Turns out he is allergic. I then insisted on a referral to an allergist.

Allergist tests show an allergy to dairy, egg, tomato, and strawberry. Since we have eliminated these, I've also discovered a allergy to watermelon (probably all melons) and possibly avocado. It seems like we get a new allergy every other week. Now I fear he may have one to potatos. I'm at my wits end with this.

This past week, I started dosing him with 1 tsp of a multi probotic (dairy free) and 1tsp of flax seed oil at lunch. I take 1000 mg of EPO and 1200 mg of fish oil daily. He is bf but also gets three meals a day.

DS eats freeze dried fruit and corn, rices, frozen veggies, french fries (bad momma, but may be cut out soon), chicken, sometimes beef (doesn't seem to care much for it), cheerios, oyster crackers (sometimes for a snack). I don't think he gets anything else with regularity. I make sure he doesn't ingest (nor do I) anything with his allergen in it, but if there is a cross contamination possibility, I may eat it, but he won't.

I'm not sure what else to do to help. I'm planning on continuing the probiotic/flax oil for 3 months straight, as I think I read that in the mothering link. Maybe I'm supposed to be giving it at a different time or throughout the day instead of all at once?

I don't know what else to do or if I'm even healing his gut, so I'd appreciate some suggestions. Oh, and I do have coconut oil in the house, but the thought of ingesting straight fat on a spoon about gags me. DS might like it though. Could someone break down some suggestions in layman's terms on what I should be doing or am doing wrong to heal DS's gut?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Can we talk about rotation diets? I'd like to start one to preserve dd's tolerance to her safe foods and give her a chance to tolerate some of the iffy ones, but I'm not exactly sure how to go about it. I've done some reading online and got a few ideas. Here's the idea so far. Tell me what you think:

Day 1: Rice, green beans/yam, peach, pork, palm oil
Day 2: Wheat, squash/onion, apple/tomato, chicken, canola oil
Day 3: White potato, spinach/mushrooms, blueberry, beef, olive oil
Day 4: Oats, peppers/peas, pear, turkey, coconut oil
Day 5: Quinoa, carrots/garlic, banana/grapes, eggs, sunflower/safflower oil

It's a five day rotation. One concern I have is how to incorporate legumes. Since they're related, I'm guessing I shouldn't do a different one daily, but what about twice a week? Also, is it worth it to rotate things like herbs and spices (or even garlic and onion)? I'm also thinking that rotating vegetables needn't be so strict since there's a lot of variety to be had in general. I'm especially interested in helping dd tolerate a wider variety of fruits and not lose her tolerance of grains.

I would rotate garlic b/c it's a pretty common allergen. You might consider whether you need to rotate food families and only eat the family once every 4/5 days. For instance, garlic and onion are in the same food family.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
I see two tests on their site. Which one is it? They're done by stool samples, correct? Would it be helpful to get dd tested too?

Its a lactulose/mannitol test, where you drink something with both of these in it and then do a urine sample. What's in your urine tells them whether your gut is hyerpermeable.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Caden's Mom* 
Hi all! I suspect my DS has a leaky gut. I've read the cheat sheet sticky, but its like reading French! Here's our deal

DS had horrendous cradle cap as a newborn, down his forehead and oozing. Ick! After that healed, he quickly dev'p eczema. I breifly tried an elimination diet, but his eczema got worse so I stopped. Finally when he was 10 months I insisted on allergy testing for dairy. Turns out he is allergic. I then insisted on a referral to an allergist.

Allergist tests show an allergy to dairy, egg, tomato, and strawberry. Since we have eliminated these, I've also discovered a allergy to watermelon (probably all melons) and possibly avocado. It seems like we get a new allergy every other week. Now I fear he may have one to potatos. I'm at my wits end with this.

This past week, I started dosing him with 1 tsp of a multi probotic (dairy free) and 1tsp of flax seed oil at lunch. I take 1000 mg of EPO and 1200 mg of fish oil daily. He is bf but also gets three meals a day.

DS eats freeze dried fruit and corn, rices, frozen veggies, french fries (bad momma, but may be cut out soon), chicken, sometimes beef (doesn't seem to care much for it), cheerios, oyster crackers (sometimes for a snack). I don't think he gets anything else with regularity. I make sure he doesn't ingest (nor do I) anything with his allergen in it, but if there is a cross contamination possibility, I may eat it, but he won't.

I'm not sure what else to do to help. I'm planning on continuing the probiotic/flax oil for 3 months straight, as I think I read that in the mothering link. Maybe I'm supposed to be giving it at a different time or throughout the day instead of all at once?

I don't know what else to do or if I'm even healing his gut, so I'd appreciate some suggestions. Oh, and I do have coconut oil in the house, but the thought of ingesting straight fat on a spoon about gags me. DS might like it though. Could someone break down some suggestions in layman's terms on what I should be doing or am doing wrong to heal DS's gut?

Don't have much time now, but for starters I would cut all grains out of his diet. They're hard to digest in general and babies don't produce the enzyme they need to digest them until they're at least a year old. Also, you might think about giving your DS high vitamin CLO directly, and also CO directly (my DD will eat it off a spoon). You can substitute CO for any other fat in cooking or baking--it's very versatile.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Can we talk about rotation diets? I'd like to start one to preserve dd's tolerance to her safe foods and give her a chance to tolerate some of the iffy ones, but I'm not exactly sure how to go about it. I've done some reading online and got a few ideas. Here's the idea so far. Tell me what you think:

Day 1: Rice, green beans/yam, peach, pork, palm oil
Day 2: Wheat, squash/onion, apple/tomato, chicken, canola oil
Day 3: White potato, spinach/mushrooms, blueberry, beef, olive oil
Day 4: Oats, peppers/peas, pear, turkey, coconut oil
Day 5: Quinoa, carrots/garlic, banana/grapes, eggs, sunflower/safflower oil

It's a five day rotation. One concern I have is how to incorporate legumes. Since they're related, I'm guessing I shouldn't do a different one daily, but what about twice a week? Also, is it worth it to rotate things like herbs and spices (or even garlic and onion)? I'm also thinking that rotating vegetables needn't be so strict since there's a lot of variety to be had in general. I'm especially interested in helping dd tolerate a wider variety of fruits and not lose her tolerance of grains.

I am confused about rotation diets. I found one that said eat the same foods all day and then don't eat those foods for 5 days. Another place said to only eat the food once during the day and then not again for 5 days. This same site said that you can eat related foods(green beans/lentils) a day apart but not 2 days in a row.

Aside from that confusion, there are some foods I would stay away from







es, spinach(high in oxalates and amines), pork, wheat.
What about these foods to add: steamed celery, steamed chayote, brussel sprouts,rutabaga, parsnip, beans/lentils, buckwheat (I just tried Poconos brand and it is yummy and mild in flavor), lamb, veal, ghee.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
She's 4 mo. How would i get that much into her? She won't take a bottle.

Sorry I didn't reply the other night...I have alot of catching up to do.
You can cup feed or dropper feed. I just mix the probiotics into breastmilk and cup feed ds. HE loves it! If that wasn't working though I'd be using a dropper (like a tincture bottle.)


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Breastmilk is the gold standard for any baby. IT will, as bluets said, do far more good than harm. It contains so many beneficial things that have not even been isolated to help your baby thrive, even if you are having some gut issues it is far better than formula. You can always alter your diet, with formula you are pretty much confined to what is out there-and remember that NOTHING is allergen free. It may contain things that most people don't react to-but there is no such thing as non-allergenic.

I just had to tell you that I kept thinking liver flukes while reading your message. I don't know why-becasue there are many parasites that would be consistent with your particular symptoms, and many non-parasitic issues as well. But I couldn't shake the thought so I figured I'd share.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I will be back later-it's been a crazy couple of days, but I just wanted to get a response out there so you didn't feel ignored! I have crying kiddos everywhere!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I am confused about rotation diets. I found one that said eat the same foods all day and then don't eat those foods for 5 days. Another place said to only eat the food once during the day and then not again for 5 days. This same site said that you can eat related foods(green beans/lentils) a day apart but not 2 days in a row.

Aside from that confusion, there are some foods I would stay away from







es, spinach(high in oxalates and amines), pork, wheat.
What about these foods to add: steamed celery, steamed chayote, brussel sprouts,rutabaga, parsnip, beans/lentils, buckwheat (I just tried Poconos brand and it is yummy and mild in flavor), lamb, veal, ghee.

From what I gathered it depends on how allergic you are. If you are highly allergic (like tend to react to everything or have to include many allergens in the diet) then you only want to eat the food once a day. Otherwise it's okay to eat it all day.

Are you still doing failsafe, Nolansmum? Are you seeing any results from that?


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I just had to tell you that I kept thinking liver flukes while reading your message. I don't know why-becasue there are many parasites that would be consistent with your particular symptoms, and many non-parasitic issues as well. But I couldn't shake the thought so I figured I'd share.

Thanks for the reply! I understand about being busy









Well, my blood tests showed no signs of parasites. Are there more that those tests wouldn't have picked up? Are you saying that parasites are IN my liver?







:

Just wanted to clarify!









We have established that my liver is working way too hard to filter everything out, as well as taking on the task of actually PRODUCING fat for my body. I didn't even think that was possible...
Also, they said as a result that my red blood cells are thin and looking funky. (Okay, the doctors didn't exactly say it like that, but that's what I understood of it!)


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I think that would indicate liver flukes for me too...yes, they are in your liver-though they can migrate. They totally mess with your hormone levels, many people see acne as a result (because of the hormone fluctuations and because of the damage to the liver. They also would make someone appear anemic without actually being anemic. They would likely elevate white counts and mess with red counts a bit. Not saying you have them...just saying that it came up for me as I read your post.

red cells thin as in not carrying/delivering oxygen?

Were you liver enzymes elevated? Were you spilling into the blood? THey said your liver was producing fat for your body? Or was it that your liver was fatty and not regulating properly?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
From what I gathered it depends on how allergic you are. If you are highly allergic (like tend to react to everything or have to include many allergens in the diet) then you only want to eat the food once a day. Otherwise it's okay to eat it all day.

Are you still doing failsafe, Nolansmum? Are you seeing any results from that?

We have been doing Failsafe for 2 weeks and have seen results. Little by little DS's rash is healing, it's about 50% better. He is less cranky/whiny. I am definitely less cranky, I have more energy, yet I have been sleeping less. I wake up in the morning refreshed. I don't have any food cravings, in fact I don't have the urge to cheat at all. On SCD I felt compelled to cheat, I couldn't control myself. I am almost never bloated, far less often than on SCD. My skin has been good(only mildly dry) despite the fact that it was cold and dry here for awhile. I highly suspect gluten to be one of my big problems and I was not careful on SCD when I cheated to not have gluten. I know it takes a long time for gluten to leave the body so I am willing to keep at this diet for awhile.


----------



## embers (Mar 24, 2006)

Start me off, pretty please?!

Links?

We are very willing...

I am vegetarian... My husband is mostly vegetarian. I have done some experimenting with vegan and raw foods...

In other words, we are willing to do the footwork for diet change.

We eat too much processed foods still... too much (empty or useless) carbs...

We are fighting infections, fatigue, acne, temperament issues, etc.

I want to be part of the Healing the Gut group here, but I don't want to clutter the thread(s) with newbie questions. Can y'all flood me with links, etc first?

Thanks!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *embers* 
Start me off, pretty please?!

Links?

We are very willing...

I am vegetarian... My husband is mostly vegetarian. I have done some experimenting with vegan and raw foods...

In other words, we are willing to do the footwork for diet change.

We eat too much processed foods still... too much (empty or useless) carbs...

We are fighting infections, fatigue, acne, temperament issues, etc.

I want to be part of the Healing the Gut group here, but I don't want to clutter the thread(s) with newbie questions. Can y'all flood me with links, etc first?

Thanks!

Check out the cheat sheet sticked at the top of the Health & Healing Forum.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
We have been doing Failsafe for 2 weeks and have seen results. Little by little DS's rash is healing, it's about 50% better. He is less cranky/whiny. I am definitely less cranky, I have more energy, yet I have been sleeping less. I wake up in the morning refreshed. I don't have any food cravings, in fact I don't have the urge to cheat at all. On SCD I felt compelled to cheat, I couldn't control myself. I am almost never bloated, far less often than on SCD. My skin has been good(only mildly dry) despite the fact that it was cold and dry here for awhile. I highly suspect gluten to be one of my big problems and I was not careful on SCD when I cheated to not have gluten. I know it takes a long time for gluten to leave the body so I am willing to keep at this diet for awhile.

I'm glad it's working for you! Do you have a link to the beginning diet (there is a beginning/intro diet, right?)? Also, I think you posted this before, but what made you suspect that salicylates and amines might be your problem?


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I am confused about rotation diets. I found one that said eat the same foods all day and then don't eat those foods for 5 days. Another place said to only eat the food once during the day and then not again for 5 days. This same site said that you can eat related foods(green beans/lentils) a day apart but not 2 days in a row.

Aside from that confusion, there are some foods I would stay away from







es, spinach(high in oxalates and amines), pork, wheat.
What about these foods to add: steamed celery, steamed chayote, brussel sprouts,rutabaga, parsnip, beans/lentils, buckwheat (I just tried Poconos brand and it is yummy and mild in flavor), lamb, veal, ghee.

Yes, tomatoes are iffy for us. So far, dd does react to them. I was thinking if I gave her a small amount every two rotation cycles (so every 10 days), she might tolerate them better. I suspect it's a salicylate issue and not a true allergy, but I haven't had her tested for it yet. She's get the caprast done this week, so I probably won't start the rotation until after we get the results.

She does fine with wheat and pork thus far. We eat it fairly regularly (pork probably once or twice a week, and wheat everyday). I don't want to overdo it (especially the wheat), so that's why I want to eat it only every 5 days. Do you think there's still a good reason to eliminate it entirely? BTW, dd is definitely allergic to corn (got some hidden corn 2 days ago and is all broken out







) and dairy, so we're avoiding those until I decide to challenge them, probably in a couple of years.

Here's a link that I found helpful if anyone is interested: http://www.tacanow.com/diet.htm


----------



## krankedyann (May 28, 2005)

Allright, I'm here, and I'm desperate. I've been homebound for over 6 months and I'll go a while and get well enough to where we think I might could get out, then I get sick again. I can't seem to avoid all allergens long enough to heal enough to be able to get out and function like a normal human being.

I'm looking for info on rotation diets and how to do them. Up until now, I've been rotating my proteins every 3-4 days and trying to rotate my grains, but it's awful hard to rotate rice, because it's in so many gluten-free things. When I'm sick, I have a hard time standing enough to be able to fix food, and I've got two kids who are also celiac and dairy free.

So far, we know through tests I'm allergic to gluten (I'm celiac), dairy and soy. Tests show soy, but on the test 1-10 was non-allergic, and I scored a 14 on soy, but I was over 200 for gluten and over 300 for dairy, IIRC. So I don't have a visible reaction to it that I know of, but I do make every effort to avoid it. Coming off of dairy and gluten has produced incredible improvements in my health, and exposures give horrible reactions- diarrhea and vomiting within 20-30 minutes which can go on for up to 18 hours, stomach pain and problems that last for weeks, severe joint and bone pain for days to weeks, etc...

We suspect I'm reacting to egg and corn. I seem to do ok with small amounts, like an egg in baked goods, but if I eat two scrambled eggs, I get sick- vomiting and diarrhea, like a smaller version of a gluten/dairy reaction with much less bone pain afterwards. Ditto for corn- cornstarch in a recipe gives no visible reaction, but a square of cornbread makes me throw up. With both of these, I haven't been rotating, so I've been consuming a large amount of them, especially eggs since they're a quick and easy meal when I've been sick. I've also consumed a large amount of Lara Bars (cashew cookie) and raw fruit as well, especially after reactions, since it's quick an easy and doesn't require prep and cooking.

I've had four reactions since Thursday. We suspect cashews and apples- of course. Thursday AM I reacted to amaranth cereal with cashew butter stirred in- at the time I assumed the cashew butter might have been contaminated with gluten or dairy at the plant. Thursday PM I had an apple and a Cliff Nectar cashew bar. Friday we aren't sure what kicked it off. Today I had an apple on an empty stomach- felt awful immediately, and had diarrhea but not vomiting. Since it seems I'm starting to become allergic to the foods I'm consuming most, it's time to go on a total rotation diet for a while.

So I'm off to read the sticky and learn as much as I can. My reading comprehension is low right now, so I'm struggling to learn what I need to. The main thing I'm looking for right now is how to do a rotation diet, and recipes for meals. I'm really struggling with coming up with meals to feed everyone that I feel up to preparing, since I don't get any help. I've got all the cooking, cleaning, laundry and child care to myself right now, and I'm having an immune storm from that last round of exposures (it feels like I've got the flu), so I'm not up to a lot of kitchen work. Of course, that's partially what has gotten me into this situation, isn't it?







:


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

bluets, how much glutamine to do you take daily?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I'm glad it's working for you! Do you have a link to the beginning diet (there is a beginning/intro diet, right?)? Also, I think you posted this before, but what made you suspect that salicylates and amines might be your problem?

Here is a link to the elimination diet. The person who wrote it out is the same person who started the yahoo failsafeNT group.
http://www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuf...tion-diet.aspx
For a couple of weeks before starting the elimination diet we cut way back on sals/amines and I saw some improvement so I decided to give the diet a go. What first sparked my interest is this list of high amine foods:
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...fi/amines.html
Everything that I had been eating the last month was on there as well as all my migraine triggers. I have always been hypersensitive to smells and enough of the wrong scent can give me a migraine( this would be a reaction to salicylates.)


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Yes, tomatoes are iffy for us. So far, dd does react to them. I was thinking if I gave her a small amount every two rotation cycles (so every 10 days), she might tolerate them better. I suspect it's a salicylate issue and not a true allergy, but I haven't had her tested for it yet. She's get the caprast done this week, so I probably won't start the rotation until after we get the results.

She does fine with wheat and pork thus far. We eat it fairly regularly (pork probably once or twice a week, and wheat everyday). I don't want to overdo it (especially the wheat), so that's why I want to eat it only every 5 days. Do you think there's still a good reason to eliminate it entirely? BTW, dd is definitely allergic to corn (got some hidden corn 2 days ago and is all broken out







) and dairy, so we're avoiding those until I decide to challenge them, probably in a couple of years.

Here's a link that I found helpful if anyone is interested: http://www.tacanow.com/diet.htm

Pork I suggested because it is high in amines, the protein breaks down quickly so unless you slaughtered it and ate it right away it would always be high. Wheat I only suggested because it is such a common allergen and if you are going through the effort to do a rotation why not eliminate that too, you could always challenge it first?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Not bluets, but I take glutamine daily and have for years...I do up to 4000 mg a day


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Not bluets, but I take glutamine daily and have for years...I do up to 4000 mg a day

Holy moly, just as I thought. I am not taking enough. This is also in bone broths, right? Are you doing bone broths? And do you always take with food?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *krankedyann* 
Allright, I'm here, and I'm desperate. I've been homebound for over 6 months and I'll go a while and get well enough to where we think I might could get out, then I get sick again. I can't seem to avoid all allergens long enough to heal enough to be able to get out and function like a normal human being.

I'm looking for info on rotation diets and how to do them. Up until now, I've been rotating my proteins every 3-4 days and trying to rotate my grains, but it's awful hard to rotate rice, because it's in so many gluten-free things. When I'm sick, I have a hard time standing enough to be able to fix food, and I've got two kids who are also celiac and dairy free.

So far, we know through tests I'm allergic to gluten (I'm celiac), dairy and soy. Tests show soy, but on the test 1-10 was non-allergic, and I scored a 14 on soy, but I was over 200 for gluten and over 300 for dairy, IIRC. So I don't have a visible reaction to it that I know of, but I do make every effort to avoid it. Coming off of dairy and gluten has produced incredible improvements in my health, and exposures give horrible reactions- diarrhea and vomiting within 20-30 minutes which can go on for up to 18 hours, stomach pain and problems that last for weeks, severe joint and bone pain for days to weeks, etc...

We suspect I'm reacting to egg and corn. I seem to do ok with small amounts, like an egg in baked goods, but if I eat two scrambled eggs, I get sick- vomiting and diarrhea, like a smaller version of a gluten/dairy reaction with much less bone pain afterwards. Ditto for corn- cornstarch in a recipe gives no visible reaction, but a square of cornbread makes me throw up. With both of these, I haven't been rotating, so I've been consuming a large amount of them, especially eggs since they're a quick and easy meal when I've been sick. I've also consumed a large amount of Lara Bars (cashew cookie) and raw fruit as well, especially after reactions, since it's quick an easy and doesn't require prep and cooking.

I've had four reactions since Thursday. We suspect cashews and apples- of course. Thursday AM I reacted to amaranth cereal with cashew butter stirred in- at the time I assumed the cashew butter might have been contaminated with gluten or dairy at the plant. Thursday PM I had an apple and a Cliff Nectar cashew bar. Friday we aren't sure what kicked it off. Today I had an apple on an empty stomach- felt awful immediately, and had diarrhea but not vomiting. Since it seems I'm starting to become allergic to the foods I'm consuming most, it's time to go on a total rotation diet for a while.

So I'm off to read the sticky and learn as much as I can. My reading comprehension is low right now, so I'm struggling to learn what I need to. The main thing I'm looking for right now is how to do a rotation diet, and recipes for meals. I'm really struggling with coming up with meals to feed everyone that I feel up to preparing, since I don't get any help. I've got all the cooking, cleaning, laundry and child care to myself right now, and I'm having an immune storm from that last round of exposures (it feels like I've got the flu), so I'm not up to a lot of kitchen work. Of course, that's partially what has gotten me into this situation, isn't it?







:

Have you considered SCD yet? Elaine Gotchdal said that celiacs could often not tolerate any grains. Sounds like you have a lot of damage from gluten.

Hugs







You are already on the road to recovery by knowing about the gluten and it will take time to figure out what diet suits your needs best.


----------



## krankedyann (May 28, 2005)

I have considered doing SCD, in fact I bought and read the book when I first got sick, but with not being able to eat eggs or dairy in any form, and having the pattern of being allergic to something after binging on it then not eating it for a time, I'm hesitant to give grains up entirely. However, I haven't completely dismissed it or decided against it.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Here is a link to the elimination diet. The person who wrote it out is the same person who started the yahoo failsafeNT group.
http://www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuf...tion-diet.aspx
For a couple of weeks before starting the elimination diet we cut way back on sals/amines and I saw some improvement so I decided to give the diet a go. What first sparked my interest is this list of high amine foods:
http://users.bigpond.net.au/allergyd...fi/amines.html
Everything that I had been eating the last month was on there as well as all my migraine triggers. I have always been hypersensitive to smells and enough of the wrong scent can give me a migraine( this would be a reaction to salicylates.)

What do you do about meats?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *krankedyann* 
I have considered doing SCD, in fact I bought and read the book when I first got sick, but with not being able to eat eggs or dairy in any form, and having the pattern of being allergic to something after binging on it then not eating it for a time, I'm hesitant to give grains up entirely. However, I haven't completely dismissed it or decided against it.

Here's a link that talks about rotation diets and gives a list of the food families for each day. http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/ric...tion_diet.html
The book "The Allergy Exclusion Diet" also talks about rotation diets and has a lot of recipes--it's very easy to read, too.


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Can I just vent for a minute? So, I broke down and did allergy testing for dd (7 mos) because I'm so tired of guessing. I was pretty happy with what the doc suggested as far as the tests, and then super happy when she was willing to do a few more things I wanted that most traditional allergists dismiss. Ok, so now comes the part where I'm not happy. They have had the results in their office since last Thursday. I called Thursday, Friday, and today, only to keep hearing "the dr. hasn't read the results yet, and we don't know when she will get to it." I get that to them it's only been 3 business days, but to a momma tired of watching her child in pain, it's been 5 looooooonnnnnnnngggggg days of waiting. And it is driving me crazy because I know they are sitting there if only I could get my hands on them! They won't release the results to me until the dr. has read them "because it is their policy." And the lab won't release the results directly to me. I am so frustrated.

I'm not quite to this point yet, but just in case ---anyone know what my rights are in this situation? Can I legally demand the info? The dr. officially "ordered" the tests from the lab, so I can see that they have an out not to release it, but I don't know about the dr. office. Since they aren't saying "no" but instead "not yet" I don't know how that plays out. This is driving me crazy (can you tell I'm not a patient person).









Ok, deep breathing. This stress is surely not helping my leaky gut . . .


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LovinLiviLou* 
Can I just vent for a minute? So, I broke down and did allergy testing for dd (7 mos) because I'm so tired of guessing. I was pretty happy with what the doc suggested as far as the tests, and then super happy when she was willing to do a few more things I wanted that most traditional allergists dismiss. Ok, so now comes the part where I'm not happy. They have had the results in their office since last Thursday. I called Thursday, Friday, and today, only to keep hearing "the dr. hasn't read the results yet, and we don't know when she will get to it." I get that to them it's only been 3 business days, but to a momma tired of watching her child in pain, it's been 5 looooooonnnnnnnngggggg days of waiting. And it is driving me crazy because I know they are sitting there if only I could get my hands on them! They won't release the results to me until the dr. has read them "because it is their policy." And the lab won't release the results directly to me. I am so frustrated.

I'm not quite to this point yet, but just in case ---anyone know what my rights are in this situation? Can I legally demand the info? The dr. officially "ordered" the tests from the lab, so I can see that they have an out not to release it, but I don't know about the dr. office. Since they aren't saying "no" but instead "not yet" I don't know how that plays out. This is driving me crazy (can you tell I'm not a patient person).









Ok, deep breathing. This stress is surely not helping my leaky gut . . .

The results would be part of her medical records, right? They have to release your medical records to you if you ask (you may have to pay a copying fee), as far as I know.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

IME noone in the office can deliver the news until the doc has read them, because they are not insured to interpret the results. However in the future you could ask that a copy be sent directly to you, and if you called the office you should be able to pick up a copy. I really hate those power struggles. I'm so sorry. Hopefully you will know soon!


----------



## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

nolansmum, how do you do that failsafe plan? Where do you get your meat? It looks so hard to do -- no leftovers, cook meat immediately, etc. I just don't know how I would do it, but I have to try something. SCD didn't do it for me, but I don't know what else to do.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
What do you do about meats?

Meats and any food that has protein forms amines as it ages. Cooking for a long time, charring, browning also creates amines. Freezing slows down the process but doesn't stop it. I buy my meat fresh (my local whole foods meat has been good, they package their meat daily) then I freeze it in serving size portions. I quickly defrost in warm water and cook only what we eat, ie. no meat leftovers. I only buy enough meat for 1-2 weeks. The meat shouldn't be frozen for longer than a month.

Pork, liver, anything aged (like a good steak) is high in amines. I have yet to search out a good fish source, the best is to go from live to table in a day, or flash frozen.

Does that answer your question?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 

Does that answer your question?

More or less...when are you planning to start the challenge?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
nolansmum, how do you do that failsafe plan? Where do you get your meat? It looks so hard to do -- no leftovers, cook meat immediately, etc. I just don't know how I would do it, but I have to try something. SCD didn't do it for me, but I don't know what else to do.

I don't eat meat at every meal, like I had been on SCD.I find I am spending far less time in the kitchen than I was on SCD because our meals are simple, grains, veggies, sometimes meat and sometimes beans/lentils. I feel ok about leaving a steamed veggie in the fridge for the day, or to take for lunch, but I don't leave them overnight. I also have some cooked veggies, beans, lentils, rice in the freezer so I can quickly thaw them to eat. This seems to be fine for us so far. Although I would like to do a rotation it is just too much for me right now, maybe after a couple months on the diet I will be able to work it out. I plan out what we are going to have for each meal the night before so I can soak what I need plus a little extra for the freezer.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
More or less...when are you planning to start the challenge?

We have to get to a baseline without any symptoms first. It could take another month or more. I won't start with wheat as my first challenge either. I'm thinking maybe egg or raw milk if I can get my hands on some to try without buying a cowshare. Eggs can be high in amines too so I will have to buy them as fresh as possible(1-2 days from being laid.) The other problem with eggs is that some people react if the yolk is cooked to much( hard boiled or scrambled).


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

firefaery (or anyone else who knows)--do you know if eczema can be caused solely by yeast, or does it tend to have a food reaction component?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
We have to get to a baseline without any symptoms first. It could take another month or more.

This is one of my big hang-ups about any of the diets that I think might help DD (failsafe, rotation, low-sulfite or low-acidic food diets)--I don't think they will be good for me because I would end up eating a lot of grains and probably fruit and I don't think I'm ready for that. Also I don't think I would be able to do water kefirs, kombucha, or fermented foods on any of them, and I really think I need those. Obviously I don't want to make my health more important than DD's, but I don't want to lose the progress I've made for myself, either. Plus anything that has a negative impact on me is going to have a negative impact on her at some point.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
firefaery (or anyone else who knows)--do you know if eczema can be caused solely by yeast, or does it tend to have a food reaction component?

Yeast is not the sole cause by any means. I mostly see people have eczema as a response to foods.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Yeast is not the sole cause by any means. I mostly see people have eczema as a response to foods.

I didn't mean that yeast is the only thing that can cause eczema, I was trying to ask if an individual person's eczema could be caused by yeast without any contributing food factors. That answers the question I tried to ask, though!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Nolansmum--how long after you or your DS eat a high-salicylate food would you see an eczema flare-up? I stopped eating tomatoes for 10 days and then on the third day after I re-introduced them DD had an eczema flare-up. Of course, tomatoes are high in salicylates AND sulfites. But I did just start giving DD solids again so it could have been one of those, or the bath she got that same morning, maybe a reaction to something in the soap although I've been using it all along (she only gets a bath every 7-10 days).


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Dd has had very mucousy spit ups for about a month now...I mean thick, globby, mucous mixed w/milk. Is this normal, or another reaction to something I'm eating? It's kind of like what you would cough up when you have a cold...


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Is that relatively new in the last month or has it gotten progressively worse? Does she sound rattly when she breathes? Is the mucus only in the spit up, or do you ever see it in the poop as well? How often does she spit up, and does she ever seem to choke on it?


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Is that relatively new in the last month or has it gotten progressively worse? Does she sound rattly when she breathes? Is the mucus only in the spit up, or do you ever see it in the poop as well? How often does she spit up, and does she ever seem to choke on it?

I guess it has gotten progressively worse. She does sound rattly when breathing, but not all the time...it drives me crazy though because I just want to clear her throat! It must be so annoying to her. I only see mucous in poop when she reacts to somethign I eat. Her reactions are all different depending on the food, but I haven't really switched anything in my diet since this first started. She spits it up about 3-4 times a day now, but never seems to choke on it. She usually cries when it happens though, or at least when the big ones happen









Poor girl...she's been through so much already...


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
This is one of my big hang-ups about any of the diets that I think might help DD (failsafe, rotation, low-sulfite or low-acidic food diets)--I don't think they will be good for me because I would end up eating a lot of grains and probably fruit and I don't think I'm ready for that. Also I don't think I would be able to do water kefirs, kombucha, or fermented foods on any of them, and I really think I need those. Obviously I don't want to make my health more important than DD's, but I don't want to lose the progress I've made for myself, either. Plus anything that has a negative impact on me is going to have a negative impact on her at some point.

Yes, all these thoughts occurred to me also. But, I feel so much better on Failsafe than on SCD. Right now I don't feel like yeast is our problem. I have been eating carbs, grains, a tiny amount of sugar (maple syrup), and pears and the symptoms that I thought were yeast related (vaginal itching, some of DS's stimming, my eczema-itchy skin) have gone away. I am not taking any supplements, I thought for sure with no B complex I would loose all my steam and I haven't felt this good in I don't know how long. I can only remember always being exhausted, lethargic, and not being able to keep up with the housework (even before the baby.) I also thought I was just a lazy person because I would look at what everyone else could do energy wise and I could not keep up. I feel like a fog has lifted (although it comes back if I eat the wrong things). Now, when I am feeling good I have so much energy. It's hard to believe that in 2 weeks I have come so far, and we aren't even at baseline yet.

So giving up all those things I thought I needed turned out to be the best thing for me, and in turn for DS.

Quote:

Nolansmum--how long after you or your DS eat a high-salicylate food would you see an eczema flare-up? I stopped eating tomatoes for 10 days and then on the third day after I re-introduced them DD had an eczema flare-up. Of course, tomatoes are high in salicylates AND sulfites. But I did just start giving DD solids again so it could have been one of those, or the bath she got that same morning, maybe a reaction to something in the soap although I've been using it all along (she only gets a bath every 7-10 days).
half hour to 2 days for sals/amine reaction, either with eczema, itching, or behavior. I think as we heal the reactions will be more obvious to us.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Yes, all these thoughts occurred to me also. But, I feel so much better on Failsafe than on SCD. Right now I don't feel like yeast is our problem. I have been eating carbs, grains, a tiny amount of sugar (maple syrup), and pears and the symptoms that I thought were yeast related (vaginal itching, some of DS's stimming, my eczema-itchy skin) have gone away. I am not taking any supplements, I thought for sure with no B complex I would loose all my steam and I haven't felt this good in I don't know how long. I can only remember always being exhausted, lethargic, and not being able to keep up with the housework (even before the baby.) I also thought I was just a lazy person because I would look at what everyone else could do energy wise and I could not keep up. I feel like a fog has lifted (although it comes back if I eat the wrong things). Now, when I am feeling good I have so much energy. It's hard to believe that in 2 weeks I have come so far, and we aren't even at baseline yet.

So giving up all those things I thought I needed turned out to be the best thing for me, and in turn for DS.

half hour to 2 days for sals/amine reaction, either with eczema, itching, or behavior. I think as we heal the reactions will be more obvious to us.

The thing is, I feel really good now and am pretty much symptom free (other than a couple of minor detox symptoms that I know are from kombucha), so I don't want to mess with that. And I know from past experience that grains and beans cause digestive problems for me even if they're soaked/sproated. I may have to make some changes, though.

Do you know if water kefirs would be allowed on failsafe or would they be considered high in amines like fermented foods? And you can't use any herbs/spices on failsafe, can you?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

was she ever evaluated for a tongue tie? Do you have discomfort nursing at all? Has an IBCLC ever one a suck assessment on her?


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

i read your tongue tie posts in the december thread, including about peristalsis through the GI tract being affected. from the info you gave (signs) i have suspicions that my 2 and 5 yo's have some tongue tie. in fact the 2yo was Rx'd shortly after birth by a CST, but she implied she'd done enough after ~5 visits. so i'm wondering if there's reason to have something done at these ages, and if so, what?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

The reasons to do something would be to help allergies, optimize digestive function, head off and/or correct any dental problems, deal with speech problems, prevent sleep apnea, help with sinus pressure and pain, and clear up chronic congestion.

That said, dd (almost 3) is tied in the labial and lingual frenulum and I haven't addressed it yet. I know I have to and don't really know what I am waiting on. You can still have them clipped (there were several cases presented of adults who were clipped and saw major results) but it would require some anaesthesia. It could be topical, but if the kiddo won't sit **** it would have to be general. My dd would require general.

A CST may have helped to stretch the frenulum a bit, and perhaps widen the palate. Based on what I have learned it may not be enough.

Mum2be, the reason I asked is that a classic presentation is that mucus that just doesn't go away but seems to stay in the throat. It's what you are describing-it just drives you nuts because all day long you are just waiting for them to clear their throats. I spent months clearing my throat because listening to it bothered me so much!


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
The thing is, I feel really good now and am pretty much symptom free (other than a couple of minor detox symptoms that I know are from kombucha), so I don't want to mess with that. And I know from past experience that grains and beans cause digestive problems for me even if they're soaked/sproated. I may have to make some changes, though.

Do you know if water kefirs would be allowed on failsafe or would they be considered high in amines like fermented foods? And you can't use any herbs/spices on failsafe, can you?

Good to hear you are symptom free









Kefir would be allowed after the elimination diet, it would be its own challenge. And from what people say, the kefir shouldn't be fermented longer than 12 hrs. The other thing about kefir/probiotics is that people often do better on a yogurt with only a few strains (like SCD legal strains.) Kombucha is allowed too after the elimination, it has salicylates.

Yup, no herbs or spices except parsley, garlic, chives, leeks, green onions, garlic.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Yes, all these thoughts occurred to me also. But, I feel so much better on Failsafe than on SCD. Right now I don't feel like yeast is our problem. I have been eating carbs, grains, a tiny amount of sugar (maple syrup), and pears and the symptoms that I thought were yeast related (vaginal itching, some of DS's stimming, my eczema-itchy skin) have gone away. I am not taking any supplements, I thought for sure with no B complex I would loose all my steam and I haven't felt this good in I don't know how long. I can only remember always being exhausted, lethargic, and not being able to keep up with the housework (even before the baby.) I also thought I was just a lazy person because I would look at what everyone else could do energy wise and I could not keep up. I feel like a fog has lifted (although it comes back if I eat the wrong things). Now, when I am feeling good I have so much energy. It's hard to believe that in 2 weeks I have come so far, and we aren't even at baseline yet.

So giving up all those things I thought I needed turned out to be the best thing for me, and in turn for DS.
.

I'm glad you guys are doing so well!

We're sticking to mostly failsafe "safe" foods and we've been doing well. I gave dd raisins today and she immediately got a rash around her mouth. We do eat some higher amine/sal foods like onions, garlic, lemon juice, lime juice--mostly ingredients used for flavorings.

Do you mind sharing the names of the failsafe yahoo groups again? Also, do failsafers feel that this sensitivity is something that can be overcome or is it just a matter of finding out your tolerance and sticking to it?

Thanks.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I'm glad you guys are doing so well!

We're sticking to mostly failsafe "safe" foods and we've been doing well. I gave dd raisins today and she immediately got a rash around her mouth. We do eat some higher amine/sal foods like onions, garlic, lemon juice, lime juice--mostly ingredients used for flavorings.

Do you mind sharing the names of the failsafe yahoo groups again? Also, do failsafers feel that this sensitivity is something that can be overcome or is it just a matter of finding out your tolerance and sticking to it?

Thanks.

Yahoo groups: Failsafebaby, FailsafeUSA, and FailsafeNT. Sensitivities are different for everyone, many children grow out of their sensitivities, some people through doing challenges figure out exactly which foods bother them, (some find it is only amines or only sals,) others slowly build up a tolerance, some can tolerate 'normal' foods once in a while. It all depends.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Yahoo groups: Failsafebaby, FailsafeUSA, and FailsafeNT. Sensitivities are different for everyone, many children grow out of their sensitivities, some people through doing challenges figure out exactly which foods bother them, (some find it is only amines or only sals,) others slowly build up a tolerance, some can tolerate 'normal' foods once in a while. It all depends.

Thanks!


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
bluets, how much glutamine to do you take daily?

sorry ... dealing with a sick toddler so i haven't had much time to keep up here.

initially, i followed the instructions on the bottle of the Intestinew (one dose per meal?), then when i moved to the Metagenics product, i moved to only 2 doses per day (i couldn't remember the lunch time dose).


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
The reasons to do something would be to help allergies, optimize digestive function, head off and/or correct any dental problems, deal with speech problems, prevent sleep apnea, help with sinus pressure and pain, and clear up chronic congestion.

That said, dd (almost 3) is tied in the labial and lingual frenulum and I haven't addressed it yet. I know I have to and don't really know what I am waiting on. You can still have them clipped (there were several cases presented of adults who were clipped and saw major results) but it would require some anaesthesia. It could be topical, but if the kiddo won't sit **** it would have to be general. My dd would require general.

A CST may have helped to stretch the frenulum a bit, and perhaps widen the palate. Based on what I have learned it may not be enough.

Mum2be, the reason I asked is that a classic presentation is that mucus that just doesn't go away but seems to stay in the throat. It's what you are describing-it just drives you nuts because all day long you are just waiting for them to clear their throats. I spent months clearing my throat because listening to it bothered me so much!

thanks for the response, firefaery. dd2 is a "rattler" (phlegm in her upper bronhci/pharynx) when she gets a cold, too. sounds like a big procedure, though. i have no idea how i would ever get dh to go for it. he's very hands off/let well enough alone, thinks it's all in my head and i'm getting worked up about nothing. he and his mother used to sabotage our elimination diet when i was at work, "it was just a little ____, why can't she just have a little?" as if his following the diet was admitting there was something wrong with dd1. he'd never go along with surgery.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It's actually ridiculously quick and simple. there's just no way to tell my three year old to sit still long enough to let a stranger in her mouth to clip. IT's all about the temperment. A close friend is having her dd done (almonst 2) with no sedation because she's just that kind of kid. She will sit no problem. It's not painful really, they just give a snip with scissors and it's over.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Oh- and just to clarify, rattling when you have a cold is not a problem. It's rattling every day and never having it end that's an issue. Like a chronic congestion in the throat with no other cause.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Anyone know if contact redness from a food (squash made DD's hands and face red) is a problem/sign of allergy or food chemical reaction? The butternut squash I gave her last night did this, but I gave her more this morning (less, though) and it didn't seem to. It was definitely the squash because that's all she had and I smeared some on her arm and it made her arm red, too.


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
The reasons to do something would be to help allergies, optimize digestive function, head off and/or correct any dental problems, deal with speech problems, prevent sleep apnea, help with sinus pressure and pain, and clear up chronic congestion.

That said, dd (almost 3) is tied in the labial and lingual frenulum and I haven't addressed it yet. I know I have to and don't really know what I am waiting on. You can still have them clipped (there were several cases presented of adults who were clipped and saw major results) but it would require some anaesthesia. It could be topical, but if the kiddo won't sit **** it would have to be general. My dd would require general.

A CST may have helped to stretch the frenulum a bit, and perhaps widen the palate. Based on what I have learned it may not be enough.

Mum2be, the reason I asked is that a classic presentation is that mucus that just doesn't go away but seems to stay in the throat. It's what you are describing-it just drives you nuts because all day long you are just waiting for them to clear their throats. I spent months clearing my throat because listening to it bothered me so much!


Is this whole post to me? Does this mean that she'll always have the mucous if nothing is done about it? Do you have any resources on this issue and the mucous problem?

Thank you so much







Everyone here is so helpful


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Could I have developed an ulcer?







:

Yesterday, right after breakfast, while running arround trying to get ready for dd's birthday party I got hit by the most horrible stomach pain. I was moaning on the couch. At one point I thought I was going to spend her party upstairs in bed







. It got better enough for me to be hostess and all but then again this morning wham! Right at the end of breakfast. It was much worse today than yesterday and lasted all morning coming and going in waves. I got dh to come home from work and take care of me and dd. I was a mess. I'm still in my pj's. I was too sick (and nervous about the reaction) to eat lunch. Once my stomach was completely empty I felt much better. Eating a snack and then light dinner made me slightly nauseated but nothing like this morning. Last night I felt like eating made me feel better but really it was just while the food was going into my mouth that I felt better.

I started diflucan on thursday of last week and took it first thing in the morning on an empty stomach the first time on Monday (and again today). My stomach has been bothering me to a small degree every day for weeks. I felt fine untill after I finished breakfast both days (eggs both times) and breakfast was probably a good hour after taking the pill. I have tried on other occasions to determine if the eggs are what makes me feel ill but I feel the same on no egg days. If I eat oatmeal (or quinoa or buckwheat) for breakfast I also feel really shaky and weak. I only do that once a week at most and I always mix in some coconut milk and often an egg to boost the protein but still I feel worse on those foods than eggs. I have also tried sausage for breakfast and it makes me feel the same as eggs.

A few months ago I had this same pain and it was apparently caused by the high protease enzyme. Monday I took a digest gold with breakfast as well as 2 hcl's. This morning I didn't take any enzymes or hcl at all.

The only day I felt perfect was when I fasted. On that day I took all my regular suppliments except the one targeted at digestion. I also drank water kefir and kombucha all day and tea with coconut milk in it.

My Dr is fairly outside of mainstream and this GI Dr was recomended by him but I still don't know anything about him. I think going into the appointment with a clue might help my cause.

Oh and if this matters (warning poop talk ahead







) I feel horrible this morning right before and as I was having a bm. I thought I would throw up. I was hot like I was running a high fever. It did not hurt. Once I was done I slowly felt better (although still pretty bad but never quite that bad again). I did not have diahrea and I did not throw up. I have had this happen before. It always seems fairly isolated, sometimes I have diahrea and sometimes I don't. But it usually lasts just a couple of hours at most and leaves me really weak but feeling mostly fine. My gut last night felt sore, like I had done 100 sit ups or something. It only happens every few months. It happened right before christmas (while dh was out of town). Does this ring any bells for anyone?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

It doesn't ring any bells, Pattlya, but if you do indeed have an ulcer, you doctor would (or should) check for h. pylori. Have you had it checked before? It is the bacteria that causes ulcers, and apparently gastritis too.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
It doesn't ring any bells, Pattlya, but if you do indeed have an ulcer, you doctor would (or should) check for h. pylori. Have you had it checked before? It is the bacteria that causes ulcers, and apparently gastritis too.

Can I be treated for this while nursing? Is there any other treatment besides abx?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mum2be* 
Is this whole post to me? Does this mean that she'll always have the mucous if nothing is done about it? Do you have any resources on this issue and the mucous problem?

Thank you so much







Everyone here is so helpful










No-someone else asked why it would be good to take care of, the last part was to you.

http://www.vegsource.com/talk/breast...ges/11981.html

As to tongue-tie:
look at the info on Brian Palmer's website--download the frenum
presentaion:
http://www.brianpalmerdds.com/frenum.htm

I have no doubt that your baby's latch is inefficient--the question
is why?

Go to the Breastfeeding online link (http://
www.breastfeedingonline.com/newman.shtml) and look at the
latch videos.

It is likely that your baby never latched this deeply and would not
now that she thinks she will br overwhelmed if she does. What
happens is that babies feed inefficiently which leads to oversupply
which causes them to HAVE TO feed with a shallow latch to avoid
"drowning". It is a viscikous cycle.

What I usually do in these situations is evaluate latch--evaluate for
tongue-tie--you cannot get anything else to work if you ignore a
tongue-tie (inability to hold onto the breast, clicking, rubbing on
the nipples with the tongue, inability to elevate the tongue to the
palate and/or extend the tongue, high palate, inefficient feed are
all common with tt--theese babes often have poor digestions, b/c
proper tongue function initiates proper gut parastalsis), evaluate
for structural anomoly and evaluate birth (mediclaized births are
more likely to require structural work). Here is a great article about
this:
http://www.lalecheleague.org/llleaderweb/LV/
LVDecJan04p126.html

Have to run, but check out Brian Palmer's site and I'll post more tomorrow.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Can I be treated for this while nursing? Is there any other treatment besides abx?

I'm pretty sure "Bacteria for Breakfast" mentioned treating h. pylori with probiotics.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I'm pretty sure "Bacteria for Breakfast" mentioned treating h. pylori with probiotics.

Off to look in my copy of that book! Thanks!


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

From the book, No More Heartburn, by Sherry Rogers MD, to test for H pylori, have your doctor measure the titer on two separate occasions to let you know if the infection is current or not. While you wait for the results you can take Pepto-Bismal, taking 2-4 caplets, 3-4 times a day, one dose before bed, for 2 weeks. (You can then get another titer to see if it worked). If you test postive, make sure you get a follow up in a year b/c there is a high recurrance rate, even with no symtoms and a high association with stomach cancer. Taking Helicobactrin (Ecologic Formulas), 2 caps btw meals 2-3 times a day promotes healing.

Drinking juice (combo of carrot, celery, beet, cabbage and cucumber works best) 3-4 times a day bathes the ulcer in phytochemicals that aid and hurry healing.

You can also take DGL (deglycyrrhizinated licorice root) to speed healing for both gastritis and ulcers.


----------



## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
While you wait for the results you can take Pepto-Bismal

Doesn't Pepto-Bismol have aspirin in it? Or are the tablets different from the liquid?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyofPunkiePie* 
Doesn't Pepto-Bismol have aspirin in it? Or are the tablets different from the liquid?

I don't know about that, but (again from Sherry Rogers' book): it does contain aluminum and the tablet form contains saccharin -- so use sparingly. She recommends 2 caps 4 times a day, with meals and before bed. for about 2 weeks.

Alternatives to PB include 1) a nonperscription supplement containing bismuth and also DGL, or 2) Gastromet (Ecologic Formulas) which also includes DGL, as well as other things.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I'm pretty sure "Bacteria for Breakfast" mentioned treating h. pylori with probiotics.

All I could find was a speculation that lactobaccilli would work since there is an inverse relationship between h pylori and lactobaccilli. If you know of another reference I would love to read it.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
From the book, No More Heartburn, by Sherry Rogers MD, to test for H pylori, have your doctor measure the titer on two separate occasions to let you know if the infection is current or not. While you wait for the results you can take Pepto-Bismal, taking 2-4 caplets, 3-4 times a day, one dose before bed, for 2 weeks. (You can then get another titer to see if it worked). If you test postive, make sure you get a follow up in a year b/c there is a high recurrance rate, even with no symtoms and a high association with stomach cancer. Taking Helicobactrin (Ecologic Formulas), 2 caps btw meals 2-3 times a day promotes healing.

Drinking juice (combo of carrot, celery, beet, cabbage and cucumber works best) 3-4 times a day bathes the ulcer in phytochemicals that aid and hurry healing.

You can also take DGL (deglycyrrhizinated licorice root) to speed healing for both gastritis and ulcers.

Thankyou!

I'm trying to decide if I should eat today or not. I only feel really good if I don't eat and after the past two days I'm a bit gun shy about breakfast but I think I'll be weak and out of sorts if I don't eat anything.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Thankyou!

I'm trying to decide if I should eat today or not. I only feel really good if I don't eat and after the past two days I'm a bit gun shy about breakfast but I think I'll be weak and out of sorts if I don't eat anything.

Could you eat something different or lighter, like fruit?


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Could you eat something different or lighter, like fruit?

I'm planning on oatmeal. Unfortunatly if I don't eat a protein heavy breakfast I feel lightheaded and lousy for most of the day. If I do I have those horrible stomach pains. The only fruit we have is grapefruit and I'm nervous about the acid in the citrus.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
It is likely that your baby never latched this deeply and would not
now that she thinks she will br overwhelmed if she does. What
happens is that babies feed inefficiently which leads to oversupply
which causes them to HAVE TO feed with a shallow latch to avoid
"drowning". It is a viscikous cycle.

What I usually do in these situations is evaluate latch--evaluate for
tongue-tie--you cannot get anything else to work if you ignore a
tongue-tie (inability to hold onto the breast, clicking, rubbing on
the nipples with the tongue, inability to elevate the tongue to the
palate and/or extend the tongue, high palate, inefficient feed are
all common with tt--theese babes often have poor digestions, b/c
proper tongue function initiates proper gut parastalsis), evaluate
for structural anomoly and evaluate birth (mediclaized births are
more likely to require structural work). Here is a great article about
this:
http://www.lalecheleague.org/llleaderweb/LV/
LVDecJan04p126.html

Have to run, but check out Brian Palmer's site and I'll post more tomorrow.

this was dd2. at 2 she still latches shallow, i correct, she slides down...even after the CST work (which stopped the clicking and 80% of the pain) she was hard to get latched properly, partly because she tucked her chin and tried to stuff her fingers in, too. in the long term i thought it was because she was imprinted with the shallow latch and it felt "right" to her. maybe it's because it's still a "stretch" to be latched properly?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Oh- and just to clarify, rattling when you have a cold is not a problem. It's rattling every day and never having it end that's an issue. Like a chronic congestion in the throat with no other cause.

how about 2 weeks of rattling after each cold (with snotty nose)?


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I'm planning on oatmeal. Unfortunatly if I don't eat a protein heavy breakfast I feel lightheaded and lousy for most of the day. If I do I have those horrible stomach pains. The only fruit we have is grapefruit and I'm nervous about the acid in the citrus.

homeopathic "podophyllum peltatum" always helps me when i have cramping worsened by eating/drinking, even if i haven't actually had diarrhea. the indication on the tube is "diarrhea with intestinal growling worsened by eating or drinking." hope you feel better soon.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Anyone know if contact redness from a food (squash made DD's hands and face red) is a problem/sign of allergy or food chemical reaction? The butternut squash I gave her last night did this, but I gave her more this morning (less, though) and it didn't seem to. It was definitely the squash because that's all she had and I smeared some on her arm and it made her arm red, too.

we eat butternut squash, and i usually
bake it after cutting it in half, seeding it and rubbing it with olive oil. the last few times i did this i noticed the skin on my hands feel stiff and turn orange after rubbing the inside cavity. it felt like a chemical burn. i've been preparing it this way for years and i don't recall this happening in the past, which that made me think allergy. i don't seem to have any reaction to cooked squash, so it may be something that breaks down with cooking.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
we eat butternut squash, and i usually
bake it after cutting it in half, seeding it and rubbing it with olive oil. the last few times i did this i noticed the skin on my hands feel stiff and turn orange after rubbing the inside cavity. it felt like a chemical burn. i've been preparing it this way for years and i don't recall this happening in the past, which that made me think allergy. i don't seem to have any reaction to cooked squash, so it may be something that breaks down with cooking.

Hmmm...reading this makes me remember that when I handle the squash it makes my hands a bit red, too, although I don't remember it stinging or burning. The stiffness I think is because the squash is like glue and doesn't wash off very well, at least mine doesn't! But I wonder if salicylates or something are broken down more with cooking. Spaghetti squash doesn't do it, just butternut squash.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

GI Dr I saw is convinced I have gall stones. I get an ultrasound in the morning to find out. I know I don't want it removed. What else can I do?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Nolansmum--what is your DS eating now? All the low salicylate veggies seem to me to be things that would be hard to digest so I'm a bit reluctant to give them to DD.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
GI Dr I saw is convinced I have gall stones. I get an ultrasound in the morning to find out. I know I don't want it removed. What else can I do?

Gall bladder flush. Very unpleasant, but extremely effective. It consists of drinking ALOT of oil. Remind me, are you nursing?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I'm planning on oatmeal. Unfortunatly if I don't eat a protein heavy breakfast I feel lightheaded and lousy for most of the day. If I do I have those horrible stomach pains. The only fruit we have is grapefruit and I'm nervous about the acid in the citrus.

Me too. Do you have hypoglycemia or insulin resistance? have you ever tried regulating your hormones until the gut stuff is a little better?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
this was dd2. at 2 she still latches shallow, i correct, she slides down...even after the CST work (which stopped the clicking and 80% of the pain) she was hard to get latched properly, partly because she tucked her chin and tried to stuff her fingers in, too. in the long term i thought it was because she was imprinted with the shallow latch and it felt "right" to her. maybe it's because it's still a "stretch" to be latched properly?

how about 2 weeks of rattling after each cold (with snotty nose)?

That could be related. That original post came from vegsource from the bf mod. You could post over there and see if you can get any more info, or contact her directly. She knows way more about this stuff than I do.

And yes, the rattling *could* be related if the sinuses couldn't drain properly. The annoying part is that it could also be food allergies, but given your history and having already had a diagnosis it is likely a result of the tie.

Did you read any of Brian Palmer's stuff? He has written alot about bf and tongue tie.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Need opinions, please: is deli turkey an okay, hopefully-easy-to-digest food for DD (Applegate Farms natural/organic)? And is it safe to introduce eggs at this age since she doesn't react when I eat them? She's actually had a bit of egg a few times but it's been a while since the last time. And is 12 months too young for lentils or brown rice, very well cooked and soft? I'd definitely give her enzymes with those.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Gall bladder flush. Very unpleasant, but extremely effective. It consists of drinking ALOT of oil. Remind me, are you nursing?

Yup still nursing my now 3 year old.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Me too. Do you have hypoglycemia or insulin resistance? have you ever tried regulating your hormones until the gut stuff is a little better?

I was told many years ago by a np that I was hypoglycemic (I think w/o any testing).

What do you mean about regulating my hormones?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Nolansmum--what is your DS eating now? All the low salicylate veggies seem to me to be things that would be hard to digest so I'm a bit reluctant to give them to DD.

all well cooked/steamed:chayote, celery, red lentils, pinto beans, green beans, brussel sprouts, green cabbage, white and brown rice, rutabaga, pear, chicken, veal, lamb, turkey. I am experimenting with other grains but so far he has not digested anything well. I want to get some gluten free oats too.

I would stay away from any packaged meats, even applegate farms, the meat has a ton of amines even if it doesn't have nitrites.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Anyone know if FYI (garden of life product) is safe for me nursing a 3 year old? Here's the details.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
That could be related. That original post came from vegsource from the bf mod. You could post over there and see if you can get any more info, or contact her directly. She knows way more about this stuff than I do.

Did you read any of Brian Palmer's stuff? He has written a lot about bf and tongue tie.

yes, we (dd's and i







) looked at them, thanks for the info. it's hard to tell whether my kids are "within normal limits" from the photos, i wish there were some pictures of "normal" length frenums to compare with the short tight ones. oh well, maybe it's time for an ENT? is that who Dx's? i'd be suspicious a regular pedi would just blow it off with "looks ok to me" through inexperience. thanks for the lead on vegsource/bf mod.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Would you assume that there were environmental contributers to my face/allergy stuff if it gets aggrevated when I clean? I have been doing some serious cleaning with a serious vacuum cleaner and I can tell that I am being affected. I have always been sensitive to dust, etc, so I don't know if this is just an aspect of that or not. It seems really crazy to me to think that I am reacting to my dirty house. Although, who knows, but I guess I am more inclined to think that I am already sensitive, so am reacting because my immune system is not functioning optimally. Thoughts?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Just to let you know...my ds's tongue was clipped the first time by my FCP because the mod on vegsource contacted an authority on tongue ties and had her talk my FCP through the procedure. She told her what to look for, and what and how far to cut. Clearly my doc had done frenulectomies before, but this was her first anterior/posterior tie. She was very comortable doing it in the end after reading Dr. Betty's stuff and being talked through it. So it's possible to do it with a doc who knows next to nothing.

You could also have an over the phone consult with her privately. She's huge into gut healing too. She's wonderful.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Would you assume that there were environmental contributers to my face/allergy stuff if it gets aggrevated when I clean? I have been doing some serious cleaning with a serious vacuum cleaner and I can tell that I am being affected. I have always been sensitive to dust, etc, so I don't know if this is just an aspect of that or not. It seems really crazy to me to think that I am reacting to my dirty house. Although, who knows, but I guess I am more inclined to think that I am already sensitive, so am reacting because my immune system is not functioning optimally. Thoughts?

if you're already histamined up to the hilt, a little more dust mite allergen thrown in would certainly worsen things. i didn't vacuum for years, i used a dust mop that i'd shake out the window in a room i wasn't in, then pull the window shut immediately after. for furniture i'd use a cotton rag wrung out in hot water so the dust would stick, then rinse it. dh would vacuum the rugs when i was out.

does your vacuum have a hepa filter? since i got one i can vacuum again, because it really doesn't put the dust into the room. and i can dust with the hand attachments, which is much faster than the wet rag routine, so i do it more often. you can get hepa type vacs from target, etc. these days, 150+.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
does your vacuum have a hepa filter? since i got one i can vacuum again, because it really doesn't put the dust into the room. and i can dust with the hand attachments, which is much faster than the wet rag routine, so i do it more often. you can get hepa type vacs from target, etc. these days, 150+.

Yes, it does. I think the one I am currently using has two filters (borrowing my parents'). Our house is very old, so it has a lot of old dirt. And living in the city, it gets quite dirty that way too.

After all my excitment about the rash being better, or at least not as severe, it is back today -- puffy eyes, red & itchy skin....blech.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

moonshine--you really might want to think about taking a look at failsafe or something like that. It sounds to me like reducing your total chemical load might help you.


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Nolansmum or anybody else who may know -

I've been reading up no the FAILSafe diet and also looking into sulfur as potential issues. The list of high amine foods doesn't immediately seem to match our issues, but as I read through the list of high sulfur foods, many of dd's triggers are there. But I'm stumped on some of what I think are the basics of the whole sulfur issue. I've joined the yahoo sulfur group, but a lot of what I'm reading is way above my head right now, and many of those folks seem to need more sulfur (not less). And then I read "it takes sulfur to manage sulfur." Ok, not sure what that means, but it leads me to believe maybe just eliminating high sulfur isn't the right thing to do.

So, that was a long way to ask - Does anybody have a link to a good "sulfur 101" kind of overview, specifically focused on people who seem to react to high sulfur foods?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LovinLiviLou* 
Nolansmum or anybody else who may know -

I've been reading up no the FAILSafe diet and also looking into sulfur as potential issues. The list of high amine foods doesn't immediately seem to match our issues, but as I read through the list of high sulfur foods, many of dd's triggers are there. But I'm stumped on some of what I think are the basics of the whole sulfur issue. I've joined the yahoo sulfur group, but a lot of what I'm reading is way above my head right now, and many of those folks seem to need more sulfur (not less). And then I read "it takes sulfur to manage sulfur." Ok, not sure what that means, but it leads me to believe maybe just eliminating high sulfur isn't the right thing to do.

So, that was a long way to ask - Does anybody have a link to a good "sulfur 101" kind of overview, specifically focused on people who seem to react to high sulfur foods?

check out this site, if you haven't already: http://www.canarys-eye-view.org/chal...lfurfoods.html

and this is the corrected link for the Sulfur paper at Thorne Research: http://www.thorne.com/media/sulfur.pdf


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Nolansmum--if your DS ate cooked carrots and avocado (uncooked), did he digest those? DD doesn't digest either and I'm not sure if that's normal at this age or not. Also, how does he do with digesting meats and what meats do you give him?


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

No gall stones. Ugh! I'm frustrated. I wanted a quick easy answer so I could move on.

I think I need to call the other Dr that my Dr recomended. This one didn't exactly listen to me although he seemed very nice. I also got a lecture about parenting from him and all he knew is that my dd doesn't sleep well. Obviously that is my fault.

Gotta go today she doesn't nap well either.


----------



## mum2be (Jul 6, 2005)

So my ND ordered the leaky gut test. I'm waiting for it to arrive. Meanwhile, I'm out of my probiotics. I've been taking the Pharmax HLC probiotics. I get these from my ND. I've looked at the custom probiotics page too. Are those better? Should I switch?

Also, what's the deal with FOS??? It seems like there's mixed reviews about it.


----------



## MeMommy (Aug 31, 2006)

Hi all,
Just wanted to update everyone on our progress using EFT for our yeast issues... It's going SO GREAT!! I'm so excited!!! After months of half-hearted improvements, no matter how strictly I adhered to the diet and took my meds, we're finally getting somewhere! DD's tongue is looking great, it's almost cleared up!! Yay! My breasts are getting much better, the white is receeding and the areolas look darker than they've looked in months... Yay! Yay! I SO LOVE EFT! I'm feeling so much more optimistic about getting rid of this. My eczema is also 75% better, it just looks like really dry skin now. No more waking up to bloody sheets from middle of the night scratching episodes!!

If you don't know about EFT, check it out here. And if anyone wants the tapping statements I used, PM me and I'll send them to you.

My game plan is to first tap/treat/work on the yeast issues, get rid of those, then tap/treat/work on the leaky gut issues, get rid of those, and then tap/treat/work on the food intolerances/allergies, and get rid of those. EFT is so GREAT!!


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Nolansmum--if your DS ate cooked carrots and avocado (uncooked), did he digest those? DD doesn't digest either and I'm not sure if that's normal at this age or not. Also, how does he do with digesting meats and what meats do you give him?

This would be a good question to ask on failsafe baby.

I don't know what normal is, but it seems like whatever DS eats, his poop is that color. Sometimes the food comes out undigested (green beans, some grains.)It also smells like whatever food he has eaten, I think this is better than the vinegar it used to smell like. His poop is also solid now, it used to always be too soft. I don't know what his body would do with carrots or avocado. DS is eating turkey, chicken, veal, and lamb. When I put a few foods in front of him at a time, he always picks the meat first.

We had a bad day yesterday, DS's cheeks were so red and itchy. It took me until last night when he couldn't sleep to figure out that the veal we had eaten must have been high in amines.







We are both very sensitive to amines. I got so angry after dinner (because of the amines)last night I picked an argument with DH, I was an emotional mess. Now that we are getting reactions for fewer things it is easier to pinpoint what is causing them.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Just got back from the GI doc. He told me that I have a hiatal hernia. Anyone have any experience with this?


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Just got back from the GI doc. He told me that I have a hiatal hernia. Anyone have any experience with this?

not personally, but it's pretty common, i see it in people's medical history fairly often (at work as an inpatient PT). did the GI outline treatment options?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
not personally, but it's pretty common, i see it in people's medical history fairly often (at work as an inpatient PT). did the GI outline treatment options?

Aciphex (acid reducer) for 6 weeks or so and a high-protein, low fat diet.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Moonshine - many people have HH's.... Ive heard of Chiro being used to adjust it.... Are you still trying the GRJ?


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Aciphex (acid reducer) for 6 weeks or so and a high-protein, low fat diet.

Ooooooh, it's exactly the diet you have been longing for


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Aciphex (acid reducer) for 6 weeks or so and a high-protein, low fat diet.

Hm, why this diet?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Hm, why this diet?

Apparently it is fatty foods (and acidic, etc) that cause the spincter to weaken further and allow more stuff to flow up.







I believe the thought process is that after taking the meds, to lower stomach acid, allowing the stomach to heal, you then follow this diet for life and live with it. Nice, huh?

I am still not convinced I actually have too much stomach acid. Other than my home tests (baking soda), I am not sure how to check that.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Apparently it is fatty foods (and acidic, etc) that cause the spincter to weaken further and allow more stuff to flow up.







I believe the thought process is that after taking the meds, to lower stomach acid, allowing the stomach to heal, you then follow this diet for life and live with it. Nice, huh?

I am still not convinced I actually have too much stomach acid. Other than my home tests (baking soda), I am not sure how to check that.

Do you get reflux, indigestion, or that sort of thing after meals? If you do you can try taking about 1 T. of apple cider vinegar with some water. If symptoms go away or improve, you have too little stomach acid. If it makes it worse or shows no improvement, try 1 tsp. of baking soda in 8 oz of water. If it shows improvement then, it's too much stomach acid. I would try the vinegar first because most people have too little stomach acid, not too much.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Do you get reflux, indigestion, or that sort of thing after meals? If you do you can try taking about 1 T. of apple cider vinegar with some water. If symptoms go away or improve, you have too little stomach acid. If it makes it worse or shows no improvement, try 1 tsp. of baking soda in 8 oz of water. If it shows improvement then, it's too much stomach acid. I would try the vinegar first because most people have too little stomach acid, not too much.

Some time ago, I had a bought of severe nausea. I started taking prilosec and then nexeum which relieved the pain. I have since stopped those medications and don't feel any nausea. The only thing I really feel is that I need to spit after brushing my teeth and when in the shower or bath. After meals, I get a distended stomach, but I don't feel bloated. It is something I have to look at to know I have.

All the I have read on hiatal hernia doesn't ring true to me. I can buy that I might have reflux. Even when the doc was explaining this stuff to me, he talked about the sphincter not working properly, not that my stomach was in a place it shouldn't be.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Read this
Researchers blame bacteria for intestinal disorder


Weinstock is the GI I'm seeing next month.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

bump...where is everybody?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I was just looking for this thread to bump it, but caedymn bet me to it.

Speaking of missing folks, any word from Annikate?


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MeMommy* 
Hi all,
Just wanted to update everyone on our progress using EFT for our yeast issues... It's going SO GREAT!! I'm so excited!!! After months of half-hearted improvements, no matter how strictly I adhered to the diet and took my meds, we're finally getting somewhere! DD's tongue is looking great, it's almost cleared up!! Yay! My breasts are getting much better, the white is receeding and the areolas look darker than they've looked in months... Yay! Yay! I SO LOVE EFT! I'm feeling so much more optimistic about getting rid of this. My eczema is also 75% better, it just looks like really dry skin now. No more waking up to bloody sheets from middle of the night scratching episodes!!

If you don't know about EFT, check it out here. And if anyone wants the tapping statements I used, PM me and I'll send them to you.

My game plan is to first tap/treat/work on the yeast issues, get rid of those, then tap/treat/work on the leaky gut issues, get rid of those, and then tap/treat/work on the food intolerances/allergies, and get rid of those. EFT is so GREAT!!

I've been trying out eft and haven't managed to do anything yet with it. I've talked to dd about doing it to her and for some reason she is kinda freaked out by it. Thinks I'll poke her in the eye.

Are you tapping your dc or tapping yourself?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I've been trying out eft and haven't managed to do anything yet with it. I've talked to dd about doing it to her and for some reason she is kinda freaked out by it. Thinks I'll poke her in the eye.

Are you tapping your dc or tapping yourself?

I have also been using EFT for the past few days. I think I am seeing some things happening. I've been doing on DS too (while he is nursing) I don't really know how to do the surrogate tapping, but I am making the best go of it that I can. He has been very tired that past couple of days and has been sleeping a lot, so I hope it is his body trying to heal. I mostly tap myself. I have 3 sheets of paper filled with ideas for the basic set up. Seems like the art of it is all in the phrases you use to set everything up. Right now I don't really know what to think of it other than I am going to keep trying because it can only help us to have some positive thinking going on.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Yea where is everyone?

Tomorrow I see my normal Dr (who is also a homeopath but not classical) and my chiro that I trust for all things strange and internal to try to figure out what is going on with me and what can be done (before I meet the new GI and he wants to cut me open to extract my gall bladder.) I've done more reading and I think it is very likely that it is my gall bladder. I've started taking some tumeric. Anyone have any other good ideas? I want to feel good again!

Oh and we took dd to her 3 year well visit on Friday. (same family Dr who is a homeopath). He gave her a homeopathic to take to try to ward off colds (7 since I started counting in the begining of Sept). And ordered some pancreas something for her to take because he said that food allergies is a result of an underfunctioning pancreas. We'll see.

AND, at her chiro appointment on thurs we had an interesting discovery. The chiro was adjusting her and said something like "enjoy bountiful abundant sleep" and her back went out. So she adjusted her again and again said the same phrase and it happened again! Somehow she has some sort of deep seated sleep anxiety. Now how to correct it. EFT seems perfect but I can't get her to do it...

I ran out of no fenol a couple of days ago and realized just how much that is helping her digestion of veggies. They are coming out undigested again. Thankfully that helps! But it doesn't erase the dark circles under her eyes.









I'm very interested in this discussion of reflux. I'm having that as well as the gall bladder stuff (and probably symptoms that will get me an ibs dx as well.) Not sure if that can all be gall bladder related or not but I'm tired of food making me feel sicker than fasting does.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

You all have me thinking about EFT. I downloaded the manual some time ago, but haven't done anything with it. I also recently got to thinking that I could use some positive affirmations.

I am seeing an allergist/immunologist on Wed.







: that it is worth my time. I am now thinking getting tested for heavy metals would be good. DD1 had high levels when she was tested at a year, which we think was due to the renovations we were doing at the time. We got her levels down, but the rest of us never got tested. I tend to get a skin rash if I stay in our bathtub too long, which is an old clawfoot. And has someone reminded me this weekend, what is in those old tubs is lead.







I do have one amalgam, but never really thought about it. DH has a mouthful, but he is of course totally fine. Or so it seems.

I am also seeing a homeopath on Friday. Not even sure if he is a classical one or not, but he came recommended to me and isn't horribly expensive. Did I mention I am getting a colonoscopy on Monday?







: Not that I really relish the thought of someone prodding up my you know what, but at this point, since this doc is more than happy to do it (and it is paid for) I would like to know if there is anything to know.

I am still confused on what to do with my diagnosis from the endoscopy. I am told that my stomach lining is red and inflamed (and my esophagus). So he tells me to take meds to reduce stomach acid. But I am not convinced that I have too much acid. My tests at home tell me I don't. But then why red and inflamed, or more to the point, what to do about it?

I have read about the failsafe diet, and while I think it would be worth trying out, I have only been able to halfheartedly stick to it. I think I might be tapped out for the moment on diets. Seems like whatever I do doesn't help (not entirely true, but YKWIM), so I think that I am having trouble finding it in me to start something new again.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Speaking of missing folks, any word from Annikate?

She's taking a break from HTG right now.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

pattyla & moonshine--









moonshine--I'm pretty sure there is an actual test they can order to tell if you really do have low stomach acid. As far as the irritated stomach lining, can you take/eat some things that are soothing? How are you with dairy? Yogurt is supposed to be soothing. Slippery elm bark powder is also supposed to be good for stomach irritation IIRC. Oh, and bone broths would be good, too.

pattyla--have you looked at the failsafe diet at all? I read that people who had persistant yeast symptoms that wouldn't go away no matter what they did finally healed on that diet.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
moonshine--I'm pretty sure there is an actual test they can order to tell if you really do have low stomach acid. As far as the irritated stomach lining, can you take/eat some things that are soothing? How are you with dairy? Yogurt is supposed to be soothing. Slippery elm bark powder is also supposed to be good for stomach irritation IIRC. Oh, and bone broths would be good, too.


I don't _feel_ like I have an irritated stomach -- it is just what I was told. I still have constipation, or rather, again and bloating after eating. This is why I am interested in the colonoscopy.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I don't _feel_ like I have an irritated stomach -- it is just what I was told. I still have constipation, or rather, again and bloating after eating. This is why I am interested in the colonoscopy.

Have you tried water kefir? They helped my digestion immensely.


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I have read about the failsafe diet, and while I think it would be worth trying out, I have only been able to halfheartedly stick to it. I think I might be tapped out for the moment on diets. Seems like whatever I do doesn't help (not entirely true, but YKWIM), so I think that I am having trouble finding it in me to start something new again.

The Failsafe diet has been pretty easy to stick to compared to SCD, or the anti-candida. I have not cheated at all in 3 weeks, and that is saying a lot, I also do not have food cravings like I used to. My bloating after eating has calmed way down, I only get it now if I haven't cooked a grain properly. I tried doing it only halfway for a couple of weeks (cutting way down on salicylates)and it didn't work for me. I think in my case, the more of the harmful foods I ate, the more I craved them.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Moonshine - the test is a Heidleberg Gastric analysis. I think you swallow a pill that communicates to a computer, and the computer reads your acid production for 24 hrs, then the pill goes out. Its very spendy, but if insurance covers it... hth


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quick update.

Saw my chiro. He did muscle testing and said it is my gall bladder and my pancreas that are upset. He put me on something for both and said to call in a week and let him know if I'm feeling better. If not he wants to try something else.

Saw my gp (also a homeopath) he thinks my gall bladder is involved but since I'm tender right in the center of my abdomen where my stomach is but not so much at my gall bladder he ordered an upper gi. He also put me on two remedies. One is a homeopathic for bile stimulation and one is a herbal and is supposed to help digestion/absorbtion. (strawberry leaves, grape leaves and some other stuff in it).

Both Dr's gave me something with wheat in it so I'm going to be watching myself and dd closely the next couple of days.

Also, I've been giving dd 1/2 a pear every day for 3 out of the past 4 days. Yesterday and today she had diahrea and generally is acting unwell. Is there any chance that is the pear? She isn't having any of her typical food reactions except that her bottom is really sore but that could be the diahrea.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
The Failsafe diet has been pretty easy to stick to compared to SCD, or the anti-candida. I have not cheated at all in 3 weeks, and that is saying a lot, I also do not have food cravings like I used to. My bloating after eating has calmed way down, I only get it now if I haven't cooked a grain properly. I tried doing it only halfway for a couple of weeks (cutting way down on salicylates)and it didn't work for me. I think in my case, the more of the harmful foods I ate, the more I craved them.

Explain the failsafe diet better please!

Also how important is the fresh meat thing? I've got local farmers I get my meat from and they all freeze their meat right at processing but I dont' know how long it sits arround till I buy it. I like to get a whole lamb (cheaper that way) and that lasts us 2-3 months. I know I get the meat, frozen, 6 days after it is butchered.

I just ordered something called liverlife. I've been reading about it in various places and I'm wondering if it can help dd with digestion/absorbtion.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Explain the failsafe diet better please!

Also how important is the fresh meat thing? I've got local farmers I get my meat from and they all freeze their meat right at processing but I dont' know how long it sits arround till I buy it. I like to get a whole lamb (cheaper that way) and that lasts us 2-3 months. I know I get the meat, frozen, 6 days after it is butchered.

I just ordered something called liverlife. I've been reading about it in various places and I'm wondering if it can help dd with digestion/absorbtion.

I'll try to summarize it the best I can and Nolansmum can correct anything I get wrong...basically it is low in food chemicals like salicylates (found in most fruits and many veggies) and amines (found in aged meat and fermented products). There's an elimination diet which is pretty limited in scope and includes a few veggies, maybe a fruit or two, some meat, eggs, and a couple of fats like butter (no CO or EVOO). After at least two weeks on the elimination diet and when you are symptom free you can trial food chemical groups...I think salicylates is first and then amines. You can do a google search for "foods in high salicylates" for a list of foods high in them.

The fresh meat thing is important to find out if you are sensitive to amines but you could try just lowering your salicylate intake first and seeing if you feel any better. IIRC to keep meat low in salicylates it should be bought within a day of butchering (ideally), cooked and eaten ASAP, or frozen within two days and then eaten within...4 weeks I think, but maybe 6. The meat thing is one of my hang-ups with trying failsafe cuz I have about 85 lbs of frozen ground beef right now. Oh, and if you are getting grass-fed meat it is most likely aged (at least beef) so that right there will make it high in amines.

HTH!


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Explain the failsafe diet better please!

Also how important is the fresh meat thing? I've got local farmers I get my meat from and they all freeze their meat right at processing but I dont' know how long it sits arround till I buy it. I like to get a whole lamb (cheaper that way) and that lasts us 2-3 months. I know I get the meat, frozen, 6 days after it is butchered.

I just ordered something called liverlife. I've been reading about it in various places and I'm wondering if it can help dd with digestion/absorbtion.

Caedmyn did a good job explaining the diet.
Here is a website that spells out the elimination diet. The woman who started the FailsafeNT typed it out and posted it on her own website.
http://www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuf...tion-diet.aspx

YOu could slowly work your way onto the diet by cutting out salicylates, which I found to be the hardest to cut out because it includes anything with a scent, even essential oils. You could use up what you have in your freezer and then cut out the amines.

IMO the Failsafe diet is an up to date and more complete version of Feingold.


----------



## Aletheia (Oct 20, 2005)

hi mamas! you may have seen my threads regarding my 5 month old's low weight, food sensitivities, and projectile vomiting.

i'm doing a total elimination diet, and went into it knowing dairy and oats caused both green mucusy tiny frequent poos and skin rashes. i have reason to believe that the biggest culprit for his continued problems after these two things had been out of our systems for 2 months is gluten.

i'm now doing all i can to heal his ittle tummy and get him to start gaining weight and growing again. i thought i'd see what advice you all could offer. i'm doing as much reading as my schedule will allow, but there is so much out there to know.

i'd like to start him on a dairy free probiotic and perhaps some digestive enzymes. can you recommend some?

i'm making chicken stock right now too, having read a good gelatinny stock can be helpful.

i'm open to any and all suggestions to get this baby back on track!! thanks for any help and/or reassurance you can give me. i'm unfortunately not getting much at home... dh is an MD w/ a rather traditional scientific outlook. whereas i, well, i would say i'm following *my* gut in healing ds, but its more appropriate to say i'm following ds' gut!!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Aletheia* 
hi mamas! you may have seen my threads regarding my 5 month old's low weight, food sensitivities, and projectile vomiting.

i'm doing a total elimination diet, and went into it knowing dairy and oats caused both green mucusy tiny frequent poos and skin rashes. i have reason to believe that the biggest culprit for his continued problems after these two things had been out of our systems for 2 months is gluten.

i'm now doing all i can to heal his ittle tummy and get him to start gaining weight and growing again. i thought i'd see what advice you all could offer. i'm doing as much reading as my schedule will allow, but there is so much out there to know.

i'd like to start him on a dairy free probiotic and perhaps some digestive enzymes. can you recommend some?

i'm making chicken stock right now too, having read a good gelatinny stock can be helpful.

i'm open to any and all suggestions to get this baby back on track!! thanks for any help and/or reassurance you can give me. i'm unfortunately not getting much at home... dh is an MD w/ a rather traditional scientific outlook. whereas i, well, i would say i'm following *my* gut in healing ds, but its more appropriate to say i'm following ds' gut!!









You definitely want to give him probiotics (I read your other thread, too). Solaray BabyLife is dairy-free and worked well for my DD. Or I would recommend www.customprobiotics.com (get b. infantis only). They are spendy up front but much more cost effective long term and then you can really give him a high amount of good bacteria. IMO he is too young for digestive enzymes and shouldn't have those until he is eating solids. You could give him a bit of vitamin C powder (sodium ascorbate) as it helps the liver detox and helps with histamine reactions from allergies.

As for why he seems worse in some ways on the elimination diet, what are you eating a lot of now, or eating that you weren't before? Some babies do react to everything (it seems) or to foods on the elimination diet. You could try a rotation diet where you eat each food only once every 4 days. Do you know about other foods that contain gluten or could be gluten-contaminated like barley or rye?

Generally a baby has problems with BM because mom's gut is leaky, so there are many things you can do for your own gut--probiotics (or preferably homemade lacto-fermented foods like yogurt/kefir/water kefir/kombucha/sauerkraut, etc), digestive enzymes, vitamin C, and possible supplements like l-glutamine (or bone broth) for healing your gut.

That's all I can think of right at the moment. Hope it helps!


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Aletheia* 
hi mamas! you may have seen my threads regarding my 5 month old's low weight, food sensitivities, and projectile vomiting.

i'm doing a total elimination diet, and went into it knowing dairy and oats caused both green mucusy tiny frequent poos and skin rashes. i have reason to believe that the biggest culprit for his continued problems after these two things had been out of our systems for 2 months is gluten.

i'm now doing all i can to heal his ittle tummy and get him to start gaining weight and growing again. i thought i'd see what advice you all could offer. i'm doing as much reading as my schedule will allow, but there is so much out there to know.

i'd like to start him on a dairy free probiotic and perhaps some digestive enzymes. can you recommend some?

i'm making chicken stock right now too, having read a good gelatinny stock can be helpful.

i'm open to any and all suggestions to get this baby back on track!! thanks for any help and/or reassurance you can give me. i'm unfortunately not getting much at home... dh is an MD w/ a rather traditional scientific outlook. whereas i, well, i would say i'm following *my* gut in healing ds, but its more appropriate to say i'm following ds' gut!!









like caedmyn says, an infant's problems generally arise because of leaky gut in mama. my ND recommends only probiotics for young children (at least, nursing ones), with mama taking the heavy duty supplements. this means that mama needs to take a hefty enough dose to get herself healed and to have extra leftover for breastmilk.

glutamine supplements can't hurt for you - on top of the gelatin-y stock; a boost in your fatty acids - evening primrose oil, flax seed oil, fish oil, etc.

for your MD dh, there is a plethora of research done on leaky gut (aka increased intestinal permeability) in the context of NSAIDs, parenteral (and enteral) nutrition, etc. PM me if you need scientific articles to convince him. my own MD had heard of leaky gut and asked me if i was taking glutamine.


----------



## Aletheia (Oct 20, 2005)

thanks, caedmyn and bluets.

last night DH and I had an argument-- well, a disagreement, I guess-- as to whether or not a food sensitivity, or anything happening in the intestine, really, could have an effect on how much he spits up.

DH was very surprised to get on the internet and see how often a dairy sensitivity in infants has "vomit" as a symptom.







: It's not that he is a bad doctor. He's just really scientific and careful about causal relationships.

It sometimes drives me bonkers.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Aletheia* 
thanks, caedmyn and bluets.

last night DH and I had an argument-- well, a disagreement, I guess-- as to whether or not a food sensitivity, or anything happening in the intestine, really, could have an effect on how much he spits up.

DH was very surprised to get on the internet and see how often a dairy sensitivity in infants has "vomit" as a symptom.







: It's not that he is a bad doctor. He's just really scientific and careful about causal relationships.

It sometimes drives me bonkers.

At least he's (somewhat) open to new ideas.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Aletheia* 
thanks, caedmyn and bluets.

last night DH and I had an argument-- well, a disagreement, I guess-- as to whether or not a food sensitivity, or anything happening in the intestine, really, could have an effect on how much he spits up.

DH was very surprised to get on the internet and see how often a dairy sensitivity in infants has "vomit" as a symptom.







: It's not that he is a bad doctor. He's just really scientific and careful about causal relationships.

It sometimes drives me bonkers.

i guess the thing to mention is that changing diet isn't going to hurt. "alternative" medicine (or should we say "traditional" medicine) relies heavily on the wait and see approach -- letting the body work on its own with the right stuff supporting it. modern medicine (allopathic medicine - the stff they teach in med school) focuses on instant gratification.

this might be an interesting read for the difference between the 2 schools of thought: http://www.lapsurgery.com/altermed.htm


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

oo... nice article here: http://medherb.com/Therapeutics/Gast..._Leaky_gut.htm

brief but shows that leaky gut is becoming more mainstream. chock full of references for those skeptical mainstream MDs.

and i highly recommend Galland's article - he is an MD himself. i think his website is something like http://www.mdheal.org ?


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

very interesting reading here: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/547083_3

basically, "they" are now acquiescing to the possibility that chronic constipation may be indicative of food allergy. moreover, somehow they've managed to link together physical intestinal damage to chronic constipation (damaged/flattened villi).

there's a comment about atopic dermatitis in the perianal region and in the periumbilical region. if one has atopic dermatitis (eczema) on the outside, there's a good chance that the gut lining too will be affected in the same manner. duh. i think i knew this but the science speak nailed it into my brain. or maybe it was that my assistant finally made a good pot of coffee for us this morning.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

thanks for all the researching, bluets.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
very interesting reading here: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/547083_3

basically, "they" are now acquiescing to the possibility that chronic constipation may be indicative of food allergy. moreover, somehow they've managed to link together physical intestinal damage to chronic constipation (damaged/flattened villi).

there's a comment about atopic dermatitis in the perianal region and in the periumbilical region. if one has atopic dermatitis (eczema) on the outside, there's a good chance that the gut lining too will be affected in the same manner. duh. i think i knew this but the science speak nailed it into my brain. or maybe it was that my assistant finally made a good pot of coffee for us this morning.

Ok, haven't read the article yet, but just to question this a bit....Based on what I know now about stool, intestines and general gut health, I have been constipated most of my life. It got "bad" a year ago when the very extreme (in my mind) bloating started. Throughout all of the various things I have tried in the past year, the constipation got much better, only now to be worse again, and has been for a little while.

The food allergy testing all came back showing I have no allergies, not even a little bit. Just got back from the allergist and he very much thinks that I have contact dermatitis. Am absolutely clueless as to what could be causing it. I need to find a dermatologist who does skin patch testing. Until then, I need to stay on the steroids I am taking. Ugh.

But I guess atopic dermatitis is not the same as contact dermatitis, is it?

Just had lunch of yogurt and a banana and my stomach is totally distended.







Will it ever stop????????


----------



## naturegirl7 (Jan 27, 2005)

Hi! I posted a few days ago regarding my son's ana peanut allergy, suspected food allergies (soy, dairy, and egg so far), and our working on an elimination diet.
I have been reading the book "Allergy Free" which devotes a rather nice sized section to Leaky Gut and its role in food allergies. Anyone else ever read this?? Can anyone recommend one or two more books - I know there is a sticky but there is soooo much info in there that I am not sure where to start with it all.
We are doing the elimination diet - eating only rice products (rice, rice bread, rice crackers, rice milk, rice cheese, etc), chicken, lamb, and turkey for meats. ANd then fruits and veggies - excluding the legume/bean family though due to the allergy issues. Some symptoms have gone away - but the eczema is really persisting. Not sure why though....

I hit up my healthfood store and got a bunch of supplements recommended in that books - but I don't know what combo to take them in or how much. can I take them all together, will they work better seperately? etc. Here's what I've got:
prenatal plus - basically all the prenatal stuff plus DHA 50mg, Chamomile 50mg, Ginger 75mg, raspberry leaf 25mg.
Complete essential fatty acids - says it had been moleculary distilled to removed lead and mercury and that it is hexane free and it has Borage seed oil 400mg, flax seed oil 400mg, deep sea fish oil 400mg, ALA 226mg, LA 210mg, DHA 46 mg, EPA 69mg, GLA 82mg, and Oleic acid 204mg.
Evening primrose oil - also hexane free, 500mg - also has GLA 45mg, LA 350mg, Oliec acid 35mg, and palmitic acid 30mg
L-glutamine 500mg
Ester C - 500mg plus 200mg of bioflavoniods

plus I have some probiotics in the fridge. Oh, and we are taking Nutribiotic Grapefruit Seed extract already for a nasty headcold turned throat infection (and also ear infection in DS's case). I am thinking about just staying on it since it was mentioned to kill parasites and stuff like that. Not sure if the dose has to change for a maintenance thing though.

Also the book recommends different tests - specifically a stool test for malabsorption and a stool test for parasites - anyone else do this? did your insurance company cover it? I think I can get our new doc to order it. Just want to know more about it before I go in there and start requesting stuff for me and DS.

thanks!


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *naturegirl7* 
Hi! I posted a few days ago regarding my son's ana peanut allergy, suspected food allergies (soy, dairy, and egg so far), and our working on an elimination diet.
I have been reading the book "Allergy Free" which devotes a rather nice sized section to Leaky Gut and its role in food allergies. Anyone else ever read this?? Can anyone recommend one or two more books - I know there is a sticky but there is soooo much info in there that I am not sure where to start with it all.
We are doing the elimination diet - eating only rice products (rice, rice bread, rice crackers, rice milk, rice cheese, etc), chicken, lamb, and turkey for meats. ANd then fruits and veggies - excluding the legume/bean family though due to the allergy issues. Some symptoms have gone away - but the eczema is really persisting. Not sure why though....

I hit up my healthfood store and got a bunch of supplements recommended in that books - but I don't know what combo to take them in or how much. can I take them all together, will they work better seperately? etc. Here's what I've got:
prenatal plus - basically all the prenatal stuff plus DHA 50mg, Chamomile 50mg, Ginger 75mg, raspberry leaf 25mg.
Complete essential fatty acids - says it had been moleculary distilled to removed lead and mercury and that it is hexane free and it has Borage seed oil 400mg, flax seed oil 400mg, deep sea fish oil 400mg, ALA 226mg, LA 210mg, DHA 46 mg, EPA 69mg, GLA 82mg, and Oleic acid 204mg.
Evening primrose oil - also hexane free, 500mg - also has GLA 45mg, LA 350mg, Oliec acid 35mg, and palmitic acid 30mg
L-glutamine 500mg
Ester C - 500mg plus 200mg of bioflavoniods

plus I have some probiotics in the fridge. Oh, and we are taking Nutribiotic Grapefruit Seed extract already for a nasty headcold turned throat infection (and also ear infection in DS's case). I am thinking about just staying on it since it was mentioned to kill parasites and stuff like that. Not sure if the dose has to change for a maintenance thing though.

Also the book recommends different tests - specifically a stool test for malabsorption and a stool test for parasites - anyone else do this? did your insurance company cover it? I think I can get our new doc to order it. Just want to know more about it before I go in there and start requesting stuff for me and DS.

thanks!

sounds like you're on the right track. just be aware that the GSE is going to wipe out ALL of your critters, not just the bad ones. i'd discontinue it if it were me. use garlic oil in the ear for the ear infection. consider homeopathics for the colds. and when you bump up the vitamin C, you'll start to notice diminution of cold symptoms.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

moonshine: have you read the material at "The Analyst" ?
http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/cond/C373737.html

you might try the point and click questionnaire (it is LONG). i thought there was a way to get some results without paying. you can get an abbreviated diagnosis for $29 and a reviewed diagnosis for $74. no idea how worthy they are.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
very interesting reading here: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/547083_3

basically, "they" are now acquiescing to the possibility that chronic constipation may be indicative of food allergy. moreover, somehow they've managed to link together physical intestinal damage to chronic constipation (damaged/flattened villi).

there's a comment about atopic dermatitis in the perianal region and in the periumbilical region. if one has atopic dermatitis (eczema) on the outside, there's a good chance that the gut lining too will be affected in the same manner. duh. i think i knew this but the science speak nailed it into my brain. or maybe it was that my assistant finally made a good pot of coffee for us this morning.

So...if a particular solid is making DD constipated (or not constipated, really, just not pooping every day), is that possibly a sign that she is allergic/intolerant to it?

And anyone have any suggestions on how to get her pooping regularly again? She isn't eating anything that should be constipating as far as I know, only a few veggies, eggs, and chicken.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

so constipation is our recurring issue. i'm not sure it is food, though i'm not sure it isn't. and then, i'm not sure if it is MY food or his food. daycare really throws a big question mark into the whole thing and i don't have the energy right now to explore beyond dairy. daycare is vegetarian and nutfree - so how the heck would we go wheat-free/gluten-free etc? though i just had an inkling today that it might be a tomato sensitivity.

[can too many probiotics cause constipation? this was another thought i had today but haven't had time to follow up]

[my own definition of constipation is no bowel movement in 2 days, dependent on amount of food ingested]

what i have found is that the homeopathic remedy Cina really really does work for constipation and midnight sleep issues. it apparently is GREAT for kids just to have on hand in general. we get the Boiron brand... 5 little pellets in the morning and 5 at night. with a toddler, we now make a big production out of his medicine. he likes picking the pellets out of his hand on his own and crunching them. once i notice that he's constipated (with daycare, it's easy for us to not notice he's constipated until he is quite so), it'll take 3-4 administrations of Cina before he starts to go. the best part is that it resolves some of his sleep issues that are often tied with his constipation (screaming at midnight, for example; needing to be rocked to sleep is another indicator).

BUT. i realized last night that i've been using the wrong homeopathic thing for this bout of constipation. i saw his lower jaw was a little puffy. asked him if his jaw hurt (to which he nodded yes - he was nursing so he couldn't really talk!). managed to get him to stop nursing for a sec whilst i poked around and discovered one partially emerged 2-yr molar, another molar about to emerge, a 3rd to follow soon and a 4th not showing any action. well, no wonder he's been miserable at daycare (like we're talking about major crying... inconsolable even).

so i looked up homeopathic chamomile last night. i knew it was for teething but didn't know it was indicated for constipation and for sleeplessness (we've been having a heck of a time getting ds to stay in bed... nurse, read, nurse, play, nurse, stall some more, ad nauseum).

gave him the chamomile this morning. found out that he had a much better day at daycare today. he had a bowel movement this morning after we had the chamomile. (had 2 bowel movements yesterday after Cina and Pulsatilla too)

i think we're on the road to better bedtimes again.

until he stops nursing, i'm inclined to keep his supplements to probiotics only, the occasional dose of sodium ascorbate (though we do use EmergenC as "juice" when needed), Olbas cough syrup, elderberry syrup and/or homeopathics. (my supplements are another matter but are now a wholefoods vitamin C, omega 369, CLO) i was quite a skeptic about homeopathy (and still am from time to time) but when i finally match the right symptoms/indicators and get the right treatment, it works amazingly and surprisingly well -- so well that it makes me want to go out and start taking courses. then i remember that i WOHM fulltime, have an active toddler, and am trying to start a holistic moms chapter so when the heck would i be able to also take courses.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

and i'm not quite sure what to make of this material:

http://jelleym.tripod.com/constipation/index.html


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
can too many probiotics cause constipation? this was another thought i had today but haven't had time to follow up.

i sometimes get constipated with primal defense, and it does tell you to drink a glass of water with it, so they're probably trying to make sure you don't without actually mentioning why to drink a whole glass.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
...homeopathic remedy...Boiron brand... 5 little pellets in the morning and 5 at night. with a toddler, we now make a big production out of his medicine. he likes picking the pellets out of his hand on his own and crunching them.

our homeopath says don't touch them because hand oils/etc. can contaminate them and confuse/dilute the body's response. put them into the cap, then toss them into the mouth. since they're sugar, he'll probably still like them. mine ask for them whenever they see anyone else in the family taking a remedy. also, nothing else by mouth for at least 10min before and after (15 min would be better). this is tough with kids! i often give them in the car because we'll be there for ~20 min without any eating going on. and our homeopath has us use 30c or 200c potency when dealing with chronic conditions, and that 2 pellets of Boiron is enough and saves buying so much.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
i was quite a skeptic about homeopathy (and still am from time to time) but when i finally match the right symptoms/indicators and get the right treatment, it works amazingly and surprisingly well -- so well that it makes me want to go out and start taking courses. then i remember that i WOHM fulltime, have an active toddler, and am trying to start a holistic moms chapter so when the heck would i be able to also take courses.

i used chamomile the other day on my 24mos old, who is getting the 2yr molars, remembering the diagnostic indicator "when you feel like throwing them out the window (because they're impossible to please, asking for things then refusing them, throwing fits), reach for chamomile." 10 minutes later she had disappeared to go play by herself, after spending the previous hour clingy, grumpy, and nursing off and on. it is hard sometimes to pick the right remedy, but when you do, it's great. like aconite for the very first inkling of a cold (<24hrs), and even as a preventative when someone else in the family has one.


----------



## Aletheia (Oct 20, 2005)

naturegirl7-
thought i'd just note that I'm pretty sure my DS had a reaction to the trace amounts of *gluten* in the rice milk I got (along with some rice chex that have barley







in them.)


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
our homeopath says don't touch them because hand oils/etc. can contaminate them and confuse/dilute the body's response. put them into the cap, then toss them into the mouth. since they're sugar, he'll probably still like them. mine ask for them whenever they see anyone else in the family taking a remedy. also, nothing else by mouth for at least 10min before and after (15 min would be better). this is tough with kids! i often give them in the car because we'll be there for ~20 min without any eating going on. and our homeopath has us use 30c or 200c potency when dealing with chronic conditions, and that 2 pellets of Boiron is enough and saves buying so much.

yeah yeah... i know... it's just one more battle i'm not prepared to fight







i'm just lucky he now accepts that he only gets 5 pellets. he used to always ask for more and then throw a fit when i said no.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

"our homeopath says don't touch them because hand oils/etc. can contaminate them and confuse/dilute the body's response. put them into the cap, then toss them into the mouth. since they're sugar, he'll probably still like them. mine ask for them whenever they see anyone else in the family taking a remedy. also, nothing else by mouth for at least 10min before and after (15 min would be better). this is tough with kids! i often give them in the car because we'll be there for ~20 min without any eating going on. and our homeopath has us use 30c or 200c potency when dealing with chronic conditions, and that 2 pellets of Boiron is enough and saves buying so much."

This is only paritally true. You can never touch another person's remedy, but you can absolutely handle your own. IT is for your body, so you can't contaminate it, you can however contaminate another person's remedy.


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
This is only paritally true. You can never touch another person's remedy, but you can absolutely handle your own. IT is for your body, so you can't contaminate it, you can however contaminate another person's remedy.

except that there's always other stuff, too, on your own hands: dirt, food, lotion, soap residue...


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
yeah yeah... i know... it's just one more battle i'm not prepared to fight









we pick our battles around here, too: messy hair and mismatched clothes a-plenty, shorts and barefoot in the january rain... but teeth will be brushed.


----------



## wendy1221 (Feb 9, 2004)

Hey, thought I'd post this here since you guys would have more experience. I had to quit taking my Enzymedica enzymes. THey were giving me horrible stinky gas and accompanying stomach cramps. I've never heard of this happening to anyone else, and no one has any idea what's wrong. I quit taking them for months and I took one last week and it happened again. I waited a few days before trying again and same thing. Do you have any idea what's going on here? THanks. Sorry if that was TMI for anyone.


----------



## adoremybabe (Jun 8, 2006)

Has anyone ever heard of Agrisept - L? Among many other things is is supposed to help bring Candida levels under control.. It's a concentrated liquid made from Citrus seed extract from grapefruit, lemon, lime and tangerine.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Ok, haven't read the article yet, but just to question this a bit....Based on what I know now about stool, intestines and general gut health, I have been constipated most of my life. It got "bad" a year ago when the very extreme (in my mind) bloating started. Throughout all of the various things I have tried in the past year, the constipation got much better, only now to be worse again, and has been for a little while.

The food allergy testing all came back showing I have no allergies, not even a little bit. Just got back from the allergist and he very much thinks that I have contact dermatitis. Am absolutely clueless as to what could be causing it. I need to find a dermatologist who does skin patch testing. Until then, I need to stay on the steroids I am taking. Ugh.

But I guess atopic dermatitis is not the same as contact dermatitis, is it?

Just had lunch of yogurt and a banana and my stomach is totally distended.







Will it ever stop????????

Moonshine, have you had one of th IgG tests? The allergy tests offered by allergists/MDs/allopaths are usually the IgE (histamine) variety. They don't yet recognize that many food intolerances and sensitivities also involve the immune system. I believe that Firefaery ordered hers through Immunolabs, and some people on the allergy board have had them done.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Moonshine, have you had one of th IgG tests? The allergy tests offered by allergists/MDs/allopaths are usually the IgE (histamine) variety. They don't yet recognize that many food intolerances and sensitivities also involve the immune system. I believe that Firefaery ordered hers through Immunolabs, and some people on the allergy board have had them done.

Sigh. I just had blood drawn today. I will try to call Monday to see if they can add it, although I rather doubt it.


----------



## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Moonshine, there are other tests for food intolerances besides a blood draw for IgG, but they are usually not covered by insurance or administered by mainstream labs. There is also muscle testing or kineseology, which you can actually perform yourself with the help of a partner, where you hold a food and the other person pulls your arm as you resist (the specifics are in the book "Energy Medicine" by Donna Eden). And then there is the elimination diet, which either removes one food at a time or all of them (adding one back in at a time).
Food intolerances aren't true allergies, so they are harder to detect. But they are thought by some to be behind not only digestive problems but also a lot of inflammatory conditions, including arthritis and chronic fatigue. See: http://www.foodallergytest.com/
and
http://www.immunesupport.com/library.../1/T/CFIDS_FM/
http://www.ei-resource.org/allergies.asp
http://www.allergyclinic.co.uk/tests_blood.htm

Wendy, as far as the enzymes, maybe you are either reacting to the plants or mold or bacteria used to produce them, or to die-off. Some people can't tolerate bromelain or papain because they are high in salicylates. I think Houston's makes some that are plant-free.


----------



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *formerluddite* 
except that there's always other stuff, too, on your own hands: dirt, food, lotion, soap residue...









Okay, contaminate wasn't the right word-just taking it from the previous post. If you touch another's person's remedy you can neutralize any beneficial effect. Not so if you touch your own. It may be dirty, but it would still be effective.


----------



## wendy1221 (Feb 9, 2004)

I'm quoting my post b/c it was the last post on the last page and I don't think anyone know it's there.







Thanks!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wendy1221* 
Hey, thought I'd post this here since you guys would have more experience. I had to quit taking my Enzymedica enzymes. THey were giving me horrible stinky gas and accompanying stomach cramps. I've never heard of this happening to anyone else, and no one has any idea what's wrong. I quit taking them for months and I took one last week and it happened again. I waited a few days before trying again and same thing. Do you have any idea what's going on here? THanks. Sorry if that was TMI for anyone.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wendy1221* 
I'm quoting my post b/c it was the last post on the last page and I don't think anyone know it's there.







Thanks!

You got one answer on post #364...I don't really have any ideas on why that would happen unless you're reacting to something in the enzymes themselves. Did you try starting out with a very low dose (just a sprinkle on food, I know they taste horrible) and working your way up slowly? That would tell you if it's die-off of sorts or a reaction to the enzymes themselves.


----------



## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Are leftovers out for all foods on failsafe, or just meats? I haven't found anything specific to which food increase in amine content vs which do not. I'm specifically wondering about rice and veggies. Thanks!


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LovinLiviLou* 
Are leftovers out for all foods on failsafe, or just meats? I haven't found anything specific to which food increase in amine content vs which do not. I'm specifically wondering about rice and veggies. Thanks!

I'm pretty certain that amines increase in all foods as they age. I think I read that unless you're very sensitive to amines, you can store food for 12-24 hrs (less is better, though). Otherwise you should freeze whatever you're not eating right away or at the next meal.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Jane we're at this point. Dd has food allergies as a result of her leaky gut. I've had to hunt down supplements that are free of her allergens (corn is incredibly pervasive), but I worry about the reactions we get to so many fruits and vegetables. I don't believe they are "true allergies" yet. So, I'm slowly adding in enzymes (we've already found a safe probiotic, though it doesn't have all the strains I would like), and once I rule out an allergic reaction, I'll add in the others.

So, my question, with your ds, regardless of whether or not an allergen was diagnosed as a true IgE allergy, if you witnessed a reaction to some food, did you eliminate it until you could do more gut-healing before re-introducing it?

Also, when do you give your ds enzymes and how much do you give? We just started using Phytopharmica plant-based enzymes, btw.

Thanks.

Enzymedica enzymes are without additives I think but then you have the bromelain/papain issue which I just posted about in the pinepple allergy thread in Allergies forum. I'm not familiar with the brand you mention.

I give Zyme Prime, No Fenol and AFP Peptizyde from www.houstonni.com. They have celluose as only other ingredients than fungal based enzymes, no fruit. We are now on

Breakfast: ZP, NF, AFPP
Snack: sometimes ZP depending on what it is
Lunch: ZP, AFPP
Snack: as above
Dinner: ZP

Working up to including AFPP with dinner, as he reacted with hyperactivity at first to high proteases. And actually today was the first day he got a whole capsule of AFPP with lunch and he is sound asleep before 8PM!!!









Enzymes are crucial for us. They definitely helped to handle reactions but still we were at such a point they were not enough. Yes, we did do a period of only foods he is not allergic to at first after we did testing (intradermal). It was very very hard.

Only: goat/cow dairy (raw/cultured), beef, chicken, turkey, salmon, haddock, carrots, tomatoes, broccoli, lettuce, peas, pears, bananas, lemon, strawberries, sweet potatoes, arrowroot. He reacted to about 25 other foods.

However, yes, sweet potatoes and strawberries and raw pears still couldn't be handled EVEN WITH enzymes b/c his gut was still so inflamed. Just like I constantly saw reactions to carrots, which is did not test allergic to. That is why an Elimination Diet is so very difficult to figure out. At least was so for us b/c there were just so many foods he is allergic to. An inflamed gut is so damaged, enzyme production is greatly impaired and practically ensures no foods are being broken down properly. Maybe if I had given him tons of enzymes? I don't know, was wary of that approach given reactions in past.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

BTW I wanted to keep that "How Not to Have an Allergic Child" thread more geared to prevention rather than healing.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I have no idea what the book was called, I just found it interesting that so many of the same things were attributed to two totally different causes:shru

Absolutely...meaning absolutely that might not be enough probiotics? I called a pediatric allergist's office and the nurse said testing was not accurate in such a young kid and an elimination diet was the best way to detect allergies at DD's age. I know she reacts to dairy, wheat, tree nuts, and coconut. She may also react to eggs--I'm having a really hard time figuring out if she does or not, even after eliminating them for 2 weeks and re-introducing with her eating them as well now. If she does it's a very minor reaction but there's enough little things that aren't quite right that I wonder if she is reacting to eggs.

And on another subject...is 1/2 tsp. of EPO a day enough for DD to take directly?

I much more buy the sugar argument Nancy Appleton makes b/c of mineral balance issue, and the fact that our enzymes won't work correctly without enough minerals in body! It was very interesting to me in light of all the other things I've learned about minerals ie. WAPF and MT's Immunity thread.

"Absolutely" meaning there are other things beside intestinal flora interfering with gut that probiotics can't all fix. I do think you can "fix" an allergic child in the very beginning with probiotics... when they are still an infant and their immune system hasn't decided that foods are allergens... by closing up their leaky gut with bifidus. And maybe if they are not so far gone. Or maybe with the right ones. But the last 2 factors are not as concrete to me as the first.

My DS is allergic to all the foods you list ex. dairy, so that could indeed be the case for your babe too that you are dealing with a lot of them.

1/2 tsp is what, 2.5 grams? Maybe enough, maybe need more. I think I posted more about EPO dosing from Leo Galland's book in Excema Tribe thread? Whatever that big eczema thread is called, I forget. I think Mercola said even more 6 grams but not sure if that was adult or child. I swear it was child but he has since taken it off his site I cannot find.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Enzymedica enzymes are without additives I think but then you have the bromelain/papain issue which I just posted about in the pinepple allergy thread in Allergies forum. I'm not familiar with the brand you mention.

I give Zyme Prime, No Fenol and AFP Peptizyde from www.houstonni.com. They have celluose as only other ingredients than fungal based enzymes, no fruit. We are now on

Breakfast: ZP, NF, AFPP
Snack: sometimes ZP depending on what it is
Lunch: ZP, AFPP
Snack: as above
Dinner: ZP

Working up to including AFPP with dinner, as he reacted with hyperactivity at first to high proteases. And actually today was the first day he got a whole capsule of AFPP with lunch and he is sound asleep before 8PM!!!









Enzymes are crucial for us. They definitely helped to handle reactions but still we were at such a point they were not enough. Yes, we did do a period of only foods he is not allergic to at first after we did testing (intradermal). It was very very hard.

Only: goat/cow dairy (raw/cultured), beef, chicken, turkey, salmon, haddock, carrots, tomatoes, broccoli, lettuce, peas, pears, bananas, lemon, strawberries, sweet potatoes, arrowroot. He reacted to about 25 other foods.

However, yes, sweet potatoes and strawberries and raw pears still couldn't be handled EVEN WITH enzymes b/c his gut was still so inflamed. Just like I constantly saw reactions to carrots, which is did not test allergic to. That is why an Elimination Diet is so very difficult to figure out. At least was so for us b/c there were just so many foods he is allergic to. An inflamed gut is so damaged, enzyme production is greatly impaired and practically ensures no foods are being broken down properly. Maybe if I had given him tons of enzymes? I don't know, was wary of that approach given reactions in past.

Thank you for giving this information. If I could go back in time. . .









We have more allergy testing tomorrow (immunocap). And then, I'm keeping a food log for the allergist for 2 wks and I am going to request in-office skin pricks for suspect foods when we return in 3 wks. I'm hoping to figure out what are true allergies and what are reactions as a result of leaky gut. If true allergies, then, we'll avoid those for a good while, but if not, I'd like to use them to monitor how well the enzymes are working and how well her gut is healing.

Dd woke with clear skin this morning and now it's all inflamed again. I suspect apricots. The thing that frustrates me is not being able to isolate if the reaction is a result of something she's eaten or something I've eaten. For the most part, we have identical meals, but sometimes, she won't eat one or more items from the meal (like chicken), or I'll have an additional piece of fruit or something. She and I are not anywhere near ready to wean, but sometimes I think it would be easier







:

Anyway, I've been giving enzymes, but today she had diarrhea. Could that be a result of the enzymes? BTW, we're taking this: http://www.phytostore.com/product/763948142392.html But I'm going to bet the Peptizyde one from Houston's. I'm reading DeFelice's book again, too.

Thank you again, Jane. I think it's really generous of you to share your knowledge.


----------



## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Can anyone review this list of what we are using and help me figure out the diarrea?

DD usually has constipation. We struggle to keep her pooping each day.

Our only new things are Naproxen, Serratio120K (high dose serrapepdidase 120,000 iu), and Natto-K or nattokinase. We used crushed aleve from the 19th to the 22nd, then switched to naproxen liquid from the 22nd until now. We started serratio120K around the 22nd, and the natto-k the 25th. For the past week we have had diarrea. I stopped the serratio120K for a day and the diarrea went away, it caused more joint pain is why I stopped it for a day. I don't know if joint pain and diarrea is a good herx reaction to this enzyme or a sign to discontinue.

With what else she is taking...should we discontinue the flaxseed and clo until the diarrea goes away? Discontinue Serratio120K?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Sort of OT, but...has anyone heard of an ozone food sterilizer? They're supposed to remove all traces of pesticide residues. I'm not sure "sterilizing" food is necessarily a good idea, but since I mostly buy conventional produce, I thought it might be worth getting. Here's a couple of links...thoughts, anyone?

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/ca...ils/sku__TS600
http://healingtools.tripod.com/NK.html


----------



## formerluddite (Nov 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Sort of OT, but...has anyone heard of an ozone food sterilizer? They're supposed to remove all traces of pesticide residues. I'm not sure "sterilizing" food is necessarily a good idea, but since I mostly buy conventional produce, I thought it might be worth getting. Here's a couple of links...thoughts, anyone?

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/ca...ils/sku__TS600
http://healingtools.tripod.com/NK.html

i heard about them a few months ago, was interested, then i think i read something saying they didn't work. sorry for the vagueness.


----------



## wendy1221 (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Sort of OT, but...has anyone heard of an ozone food sterilizer? They're supposed to remove all traces of pesticide residues. I'm not sure "sterilizing" food is necessarily a good idea, but since I mostly buy conventional produce, I thought it might be worth getting. Here's a couple of links...thoughts, anyone?

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/ca...ils/sku__TS600
http://healingtools.tripod.com/NK.html

I seriously doubt it works. And even if it did, I would not want to be producing ozone in my house. It's a strong oxidizer and possible mutagen (genetic damage.) I imagine that it could possibly be forming as many dangerous compounds as it destroys if you add it to your food. http://www.worksafesask.ca/files/cco...fo/cie774.html

I feel the same way about those "air purifiers" that basically create ozone in your room. Bad idea, imo. Ozone is great and safe for water purification, though. I just hope the workers at water plants that use ozone wear the proper safety equipment.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

CP & BB:

I believe I have read that enzymes can cause diarrhea ... something about increasing water in the system? I think also if you are causing die off the body will try to flush out dead stuff as the microbial balance shifts. True definition of diarrhea is watery stools more than 3x/day. You might be noticing looser stools for the above reasons, unless other undesirable symptoms, you might want to wait and see how things shake out.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wendy1221* 
Hey, thought I'd post this here since you guys would have more experience. I had to quit taking my Enzymedica enzymes. THey were giving me horrible stinky gas and accompanying stomach cramps. I've never heard of this happening to anyone else, and no one has any idea what's wrong. I quit taking them for months and I took one last week and it happened again. I waited a few days before trying again and same thing. Do you have any idea what's going on here? THanks. Sorry if that was TMI for anyone.









Hmmm... well Enzymedica has no other fillers than enzymes ...maybe you are sensitive to the specific funguses (aspergillus) used to create the enzymes? Or the bromelain/papain issue I posted about in another thread... are you allergic to pineapple/papaya?

Could be die off too maybe? which Enzymedica product was it? You took with food?


----------



## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

HI JaneS!
Could you post again how to test for iodine?


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
HI JaneS!
Could you post again how to test for iodine?

You mean putting an iodine patch on your skin? I believe it is supposed to stay for 48 hours? Search the Nutrition thread for the specifics.

When I first did it, it was gone within 4 hours or so. I have been supplementing with kelp fairly regularly, as well as using sea salt in cooking. I put a patch on this afternoon, around 4, and I still have a faint one, so I guess I am doing a bit better. You can also use the patch as a supplement.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Sort of OT, but...has anyone heard of an ozone food sterilizer? They're supposed to remove all traces of pesticide residues. I'm not sure "sterilizing" food is necessarily a good idea, but since I mostly buy conventional produce, I thought it might be worth getting. Here's a couple of links...thoughts, anyone?

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/ca...ils/sku__TS600
http://healingtools.tripod.com/NK.html

Have you tried H2O2? I believe Fallon mentions a few methods to "clean" produce in NT, the H2O2 being one method.


----------



## wendy1221 (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Hmmm... well Enzymedica has no other fillers than enzymes ...maybe you are sensitive to the specific funguses (aspergillus) used to create the enzymes? Or the bromelain/papain issue I posted about in another thread... are you allergic to pineapple/papaya?

Could be die off too maybe? which Enzymedica product was it? You took with food?

It was Digest. My hfs only carries 2, this one and another brand, can't remember the name. I did take it w/ food.

I have no problems w/ pineapple or papaya. My only food allergy is egg, although dairy bothers me a little (I don't drink milk at all, just yogurt and some cheese sometimes. I used to be allergic to milk, but am not anymore.) I LOVE piineapple. They've been carrying fresh organic ones locally lately and my kids and I eat them until our mouths are too sore.









I think you may have something there w/ the aspergillus thing. I don't remember reading that it contains aspergillus. This is the same bacteria found in miso, right? I also get similar symptoms from miso. I bought a whole tub of chick pea miso from South River months ago, but haven't been using it for the same reason as the enzymes. I assumed it was the chick peas, b/c I also get this from hummus, but I add miso to my hummus usually and leave it out at room temp for a few hours before refrigerating. hmmmm......

Is there another brand of enzymes that you tihnk I would do well with? I'll see if that's the one my hfs has, if not I'll order it online. Thanks so much!


----------



## wendy1221 (Feb 9, 2004)

Peroxides form free radicals, the very thing we are all trying to avoid having in our bodies when we take anti-oxidants, like vit C. I think the very best way to handle produce is to buy organic when you can and avoid the dirty dozen when you can't. I don't think there is any real way of removing pesticides from produce. THe pesticides are down in the vegetable, not just on the surface, so anything you use to try and destroy the pesticides will also affect the food, and the vitamins in the food. Pesticide laden foods already have fewer vitamins and minerals.

Commercial meat and milk have more pesticides per serving than a months' worth of vegetables, due to pesticides being fat soluble and accumulating in fats. If you are worried about pesticides in your body, then cutting them out of your meat and milk by only buying organic meats and milk will do a lot more for this than anything you can do w/ vegetables, assuming you are not vegan, that is.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Wendy, I think you should call and talk to Dr. Houston about the reactions you notice and see what he says www.houstonni.com

I think his enzymes are the best, expensive, but most effective I've found and the personal attention is a bonus.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wendy1221* 
Peroxides form free radicals, the very thing we are all trying to avoid having in our bodies when we take anti-oxidants, like vit C.

Except probiotics form hydrogen peroxide and this is supposed to be a good thing... natural antibiotic and all that.

I have Ed McCabe's book "Flood Your Body with Oxygen" but haven't read it yet, it came highly recommended from a sister research freak.


----------



## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
You mean putting an iodine patch on your skin? I believe it is supposed to stay for 48 hours? Search the Nutrition thread for the specifics.

When I first did it, it was gone within 4 hours or so. I have been supplementing with kelp fairly regularly, as well as using sea salt in cooking. I put a patch on this afternoon, around 4, and I still have a faint one, so I guess I am doing a bit better. You can also use the patch as a supplement.

Price Pottenger Nutritional foundation says 24 hrs. And you can put the patch continuously on your skin (in diff. areas) to tank up your thyroid until it stays for 24 hrs.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Wendy, I think you should call and talk to Dr. Houston about the reactions you notice and see what he says www.houstonni.com

I think his enzymes are the best, expensive, but most effective I've found and the personal attention is a bonus.

I want to second that. I have been having bad reactions to the enzymes and he is extremely knowledgable and very willing to reply to e-mails about enzymes.

As an aside my chiro finally figured out that it was my pancreas getting grumpy about the proteases in the enzymes. I'm on malic acid to support my pancreas and it seems to be better. He said that a better source of malic acid is apple juice but since dd is alergic to apples I have to do the suppliment.


----------



## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Anyone still around? How is everyone doing?

I will post my about my various doctor visits tomorrow and see what y'all think.


----------



## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

I can't find a February thread. Has one been started?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Here's a link to the Feb. thread http://www.mothering.com/discussions...58#post7223958


----------

