# anyone wanna join my toy-free tribe?



## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

I think I'll wait to see if there's any interest before I totally spill my guts on why I am considerring a toy-free lifestyle or or very selectively purchased quality-over-quantity of toys for ds2. We are not a family in need, I would just like to bounce ideas off of other like-minded mamas without sounding judgemental of those who feel differently or have had life experiences that bring them to different conclusions.


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

I'm interested. We do have toys, but I keep plastic and battery powered ones out of the house. And I really favor toys that are actually tools, like real, working child sized brooms, garden tools, woodworking tools, etc. And I especially like open ended waldorfy style toys- the waldorf doll, silks, etc.


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## moon.mom (Feb 27, 2007)

i'm interested.

my dd doesn't even really like any of the toys we've acquired...
we haven't bought anything...

she'd rather play with boxes, tools, read books, etc.

i'd like to know more of what you are thinking.

joy


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

I'm subbed in.

We have plenty of nice toys but far fewer than most others I know. I have a few rules regading toys that start with no batteries, no new 'collections', they cannot outgrow their allotted space, I can't say no plastic as we have legos, open-ended, flexible, much loved (2nd hand) multi-use tools/toys are good. Also, if the real thing works, why buy a toy? Examples: my small sauce pan, hand crank flash-light, call nana on the real phone. If you are going to mess with baking, skip the easy-bake oven and make enough brownies for everyone!

I have a long ways to go on this one but as a minimalist i am curious and hanging around!


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## nerdymom (Mar 20, 2008)

I'd like to hear more! I already have the no batteries rule. I'm curious about you philosophy.


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## patrickq (Feb 8, 2008)

Very interested in hearing your reasons, I'm of similar mind, with little one arriving in just over 3 months.

Plastic is definitely out, which must cross off about 95% of toys anyway. However, even if all toys were made from natural materials, I'd still be selective and be pursuing quality not quantity. I hope to construct rather than purchase, where I can.

It will be intriguing to hear your reasons


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## PuppyFluffer (Mar 18, 2002)

I'm in!


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## Tithonia (Mar 18, 2008)

I'm interested too! We've never bought any toys for our 8-month-old, although she has some that people have given her and some hand-me-downs. We got rid of any battery-powered noise-making ones that people gave us, though.

Like others have said, she likes real stuff like pans. She especially loves feeling (and tasting!) glass and paper. And bananas.









I'd be really interested to find out more about other people's approaches on the subject.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

For those of you without toys, how old are your DC?

What do you consider a toy?

Here is what we could not get rid of:
-playsilks
-stuffed animals
-Bilibos
-wooden food

We have plastic stuff as well as some electronics, but these are the only items used regularly. Add craft supplies like paper, string, scissors, markers, recycled materials (oldest DD regularly makes her own toys), and books, books, books . . .that rounds out what they use consistently.


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## Hesperia (Sep 3, 2007)

I'm also very interested.

I've been working as a nanny, and I really see how play evolves with many 'toys', or more over, doesn't. I like the idea of more open ended toys, and items that can be used a toys without specifications.

We are still childless, but have some strict ideas of which 'toys' will be in our home. So far we have a set of wooden blocks to set the pace. We are similar to many parents here, no batteries, hugely limit plastics (although my DP collects Schleich knights, so these will be in the home, although not often 'played' with. Toys that don't make sounds (non-battery toys) will be limited, but not banned from the home, I'd much prefer my child create the sound to the toy instead of the toy creating the sound, although some are just lovely wooden and click...that's ok.

My idea of great 'toys' would be;
Cooking supplies; bowls, wooden spoons, plates, wooden fruit etc
Dress us clothing from the thrift store.
Doll house with wooden people, tables, chairs etc. (both for a female or male).
Blocks, basically pieces of wood in all shapes, sizes, colours and whatnot. Made over purchased.
Gardening tools.
And craft materials.

Lets keep this thread alive.

Of the people who limit toys, or are toy-free do you have a TV/Cable? We are a Cable free family (although we do have a TV sitting in our bedroom unplugged for movies once per month).

Subbing for sure.


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

extraordinary spider, are you willing to spill your guts now?


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

subbing

We've drastically cut down the toys but I need to do more! Its hard... reading things like this helps though.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

so, i wrote a post and my husband said it was too "fundamentalist."

personally, i agree with you. my husband doesn't want to "put limits" on anything.


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## YummyYarnAddict (Sep 24, 2007)

My kids are 6yo and (almost) 21mo and I aspire to become a toy-minimalist. We've acquired wayy too much stuff over the years as hand-me-downs that my 6yo dd needs to simply let go of and I need to be an "enabler" in this regard. We don't even play with 98% of it. It gets moved around and takes up space and it annoys the living daylights out of me to have this stuff in my house. One of my goals this Spring is to get rid of the things that we are not actively playing with and/or emotionally attached to.

One thing that sort of amazes me when I look at all the toys we've acqured is that we don't get things from family and friends for holidays really. Last Chanukkah, I bought my dd the American Girl doll Kaya and she received a combined belated Chanukkah/early b'day present in late January of books from a friend. So that wasn't a major acquisition time. It's just that when people with older kids have done their Spring cleaning, they look at me and say, "hey, you have younger kids... here, take this!" and my dd's eyes light up and ... here we are.

I'm putting on the brakes and stopping the insanity. In fact, I sent my dd in the playroom right now with two boxes. One is for toys that are broken so that we can toss them, and the other is for toys that she knows we don't use. That's a beginning.

ETA: my kids are happiest with the "toys" we make ourselves. We paint and dye our own playsilks. We make our own puppets and playdough. Since I homeschool, we have a plethora of arts and crafts going on at any point in time. My dd has also expressed an interest in pottery so she knows that things have to GO to make room for that to happen.


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

Noordinaryspider, I think you were quite eloquent and I could have said much of it except that age range is only 11 years to 7 months and my dp is the father of them all.

To your post I could add many irrational thoughts but I do think you are on the right track. I hope I can post coherently soon.


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

The Gome's Home had a really great show on this a while back: http://www.dootieproductions.com/11142007.mp3

If anyone has relatives that don't understand, send them this radio show!


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## Lillianna (Feb 14, 2006)

I'm in.
I've been thinking alot lately about what a nightmare all the toys are. It is unbelievable the toy piles I have seen in some homes. I have tried to keep it to a minimum, mostly natural and often real, purposeful items rather than toys. It's hard though! She has so many stuffed animals it is ridiculous. I stick unused toys in the closet and then give to good will after they've been forgotten about for a couple months.
SPIDER I though you were very eloquent. It really resonates with me.
Thanks.


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## um_hanna (Nov 3, 2004)

we have totally elimated the majority of plastic toys. I have kept the higher quality ones, use alot of natural hand made material now also. I keep eliminating the junk







 but have done major cleansing around here w/ our canceled move etc. So less if def more now too







can someone just send that memo to my family around holidays? lol feels great!
Blessings~
Heather


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Thinking about this more . . .

I don't think toys are inherently wrong by any stretch of the imagination. I think a toy is anything that one plays with. Take a box. If my child plays with it, it becomes a toy, and there is nothing wrong with that: my child is playing with a toy.

For myself, I also think limiting toys by materials or the way it operates (like batteries) isn't quite right, either. If my child loves to play with a toy made from plastic (like a Bilibo, a spatula, etc.) then so what? My DD had a little plastic bird that she carried around endlessly when she was 2. She slept with it, put in the stroller, and wanted to learn everything about it from a bird book (it was a Cockatiel). Should I have taken it away-- her prized bird-- and instead have handed her a wooden one?

I do not subscribe to the idea that toys must be purposeful, because that is imposing an adult's perspective on a child. Who are we to decide what is purposeful? For example, my oldest loves her fox stuffed animal. Is it "purposeful"? Well, not to me, but for her it is. She brings it everywhere, has learned about red foxes, has made things for it out of recycled things, and makes up stories about it. To me, that means the fox has helped her play, and when she plays, WOW does she learn.

The toys with batteries I do not find horrible, just a waste of money for the most part. I don't think the toys with batteries we have (though I admit, these have almost 100% been gifts) have affected the imaginations of my children. They couldn't, because they haven't played with them very often!

I think there are bigger problems (as mentioned on this thread) than toys themselves and what toys are made out of, which come from excess. Excessive amounts of toys (and everyone has their own definition of excess!) is what leads to a loss of time and money. Children can get overwhelmed. Play spaces can become inaccessible. Too much of anything at any age can lead to feeling empty and always wanting more. Why impose that on our children?

My biggest obstacle is gifts. People give very nice items, but the truth is . . .my children don't play with most of them, even the pretty natural ones. I would just like less stuff overall in our house!


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## SAHDS (Mar 28, 2008)

I'm not a fan of toys, especially anything commercial.

DD is nearing 9 (in July) and she has a ton of dress-up clothes (store bought and thrift store bought), art/craft supplies and over 400 books. She loves to help me clean and cook and help DH in the yard. She also loves playing sports and torturing our dog







She does have a collection of Care Bears she's gotten as gifts over the years.

DS is 7 1/2 and has a bit more toys. While he still is the same as DD when it comes to cooking, cleaning, DH helper, dog tormentor and book collector, he does have a TON of cars and a ridiculous amount of toy dinosaurs. He is definitely more into 'stuff' than DD.

We just bought a 5 bedroom house and DH wants to make one room a playroom and I said "What are we going to put in there???".

I'd rather have the kids helping me (HA HA) or out enjoying the fresh air and sunshine, getting tons of exercise.

When it comes to presents, I donate them or give them to friends/family. We've raised them from day one to be empathetic so they have no problem going with me to the thrift stores and taking their toys in. Also, most people ask what they wants so it makes it easier. One year, DD asked for money to buy animals for villages in Africa. Talk about a gift!

As for Christmas, it's such a blessing, for us, to be able to focus on the true meaning of the holiday instead of WHAT AM I GETTING??? Don't get me wrong, they see 'stuff' and sometimes want 'stuff', but I like to keep it minimal.


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## patrickq (Feb 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
so, i wrote a post and my husband said it was too "fundamentalist."

personally, i agree with you. my husband doesn't want to "put limits" on anything.

Am I reading this right ... you wrote some thoughts to post on this thread and your husband told you that _in his view_ it was too "fundamentalist", so you decided not to post?

If so, I'd be intrigued to know what you said ... so please, please post ...


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

well, the post i wrote was what i thought my husband and i agreed on. but when i read the post about what i believed to be "our" position, he said that he didn't agree with that position. but, we discussed it more, and of course, he agreed with my original post at that point.

-----

first, my husband and i are in the process of transitioning from "their stuff" to "our stuff." this has a lot to do not with a "change in values" but rather in a desire to be ourselves.

due to our parent's and cultural influences, and our youth and fear of being rejected, we didn't often follow our own instinct to live within our own minimalist values and aesthetic, and nor could we find a way to communicate to our family what our values are in regards to "stuff."

our desire to live "our way" has only heightened with the advent of our first pregnancy, also the first grandchild and great grandchild for both of our families. our family's desires for us to live "like them" has only heightned as well, largely because they see their gifting methods as participation in "caring for" the child.

the bottom line is, we have very different perspectives of how we want to raise this child and how we want to live as a family. when we express our desire for minimalism, we are confronted with a great deal of criticism.

in regards to toys specifically, my desire is as many have espoused. to have fewer, high quality toys with an emphasis on the child's interests and choice of play. i take the approach that children are naturally creative and curious and that the create their own toys out of everyday objects. i find that most children are drawn to objects that they can repurpose to their "imagiscapes" rather than necessarily prefering "toys."

but, this isn't a rigid standard by any means, as the most important aspect is being attuned to the child's creative-and-learning (play) processes, and then providing what that child requires and desires in light of that information.

this means that, anyone who is not present with the child regularly doesn't really have knowledge of which toys are truly appropriate and not. therefore, our families should not really be buying toys at all--unless we indicate what the child wants.

my mother asserts that i am truly "no fun" because i prefer an african drum from the fair-trade shop to the plastic drum at the toy store, or because i prefer to 'make' action figurines rather than purchase them (and when the child is old enough, s/he can also make his/her own figurines, puppets, etc--assuming there is interest).

right now, i really don't want any toys for the baby. between our childhood toys that are most valued (i have a musical teddy bear; my husband has his favorite stuffed animal), we feel that we have more than enough toys for an infant.

as that child grows, we will be seeking toys based on the child's interest and process, and we would ask for those toys specifically.

but it's difficult for family to understand, when their belief is that by purchasing, they are demonstrating love.

we want to turn that around--demonstrating love without purchasing by spending time together, talking, and doing activities and projects together. we would prefer if our family joined us more often--but they are often 'too busy' and in osme cases, they simply do not want to participate. we ask them to assert activities, and most of these consist of shopping (my family) or cleaning out the basement and taking objects (usually trash) "for our own use" (my ILs).

so, there we are. in the square of the common mess of family, with a desire to be "minimalist" and seeking high quality, child-lead toys.

ah well.


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## patrickq (Feb 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
well, the post i wrote was what i thought my husband and i agreed on. but when i read the post about what i believed to be "our" position, he said that he didn't agree with that position. but, we discussed it more, and of course, he agreed with my original post at that point.

-----

first, my husband and i are in the process of transitioning from "their stuff" to "our stuff." this has a lot to do not with a "change in values" but rather in a desire to be ourselves.

due to our parent's and cultural influences, and our youth and fear of being rejected, we didn't often follow our own instinct to live within our own minimalist values and aesthetic, and nor could we find a way to communicate to our family what our values are in regards to "stuff."

our desire to live "our way" has only heightened with the advent of our first pregnancy, also the first grandchild and great grandchild for both of our families. our family's desires for us to live "like them" has only heightned as well, largely because they see their gifting methods as participation in "caring for" the child.

the bottom line is, we have very different perspectives of how we want to raise this child and how we want to live as a family. when we express our desire for minimalism, we are confronted with a great deal of criticism.

in regards to toys specifically, my desire is as many have espoused. to have fewer, high quality toys with an emphasis on the child's interests and choice of play. i take the approach that children are naturally creative and curious and that the create their own toys out of everyday objects. i find that most children are drawn to objects that they can repurpose to their "imagiscapes" rather than necessarily prefering "toys."

but, this isn't a rigid standard by any means, as the most important aspect is being attuned to the child's creative-and-learning (play) processes, and then providing what that child requires and desires in light of that information.

this means that, anyone who is not present with the child regularly doesn't really have knowledge of which toys are truly appropriate and not. therefore, our families should not really be buying toys at all--unless we indicate what the child wants.

my mother asserts that i am truly "no fun" because i prefer an african drum from the fair-trade shop to the plastic drum at the toy store, or because i prefer to 'make' action figurines rather than purchase them (and when the child is old enough, s/he can also make his/her own figurines, puppets, etc--assuming there is interest).

right now, i really don't want any toys for the baby. between our childhood toys that are most valued (i have a musical teddy bear; my husband has his favorite stuffed animal), we feel that we have more than enough toys for an infant.

as that child grows, we will be seeking toys based on the child's interest and process, and we would ask for those toys specifically.

but it's difficult for family to understand, when their belief is that by purchasing, they are demonstrating love.

we want to turn that around--demonstrating love without purchasing by spending time together, talking, and doing activities and projects together. we would prefer if our family joined us more often--but they are often 'too busy' and in osme cases, they simply do not want to participate. we ask them to assert activities, and most of these consist of shopping (my family) or cleaning out the basement and taking objects (usually trash) "for our own use" (my ILs).

so, there we are. in the square of the common mess of family, with a desire to be "minimalist" and seeking high quality, child-lead toys.

ah well.


Hmmm







Could have been written by me, I'm going to have to take some time in next few days and put down some thoughts. Thanks for that.


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## wrenbrrd (Feb 26, 2008)

I, too, am a minimalist, but my son has lots of toys. Other people have bought them for him. Most are recycled from thrift stores or free hand-me-downs. But when we move to our new place, I'll probably get rid of a lot of them (or keep them at my parents' house where we live now. They let him watch tv when I'm not around too... grrrrr). My son is much more interested in things other than toys. I'm hoping for "things" to be lavished on him so much that he rebels against them. That's what happened to me. Incidentally, it's what happened to Buddha as well, more or less.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

NOS:

as a new, first-time mom (20 weeks pg tomorrow!), i'm curious to know what you have and use for your baby during these first months. i really only want to purchase (or have purchased for me) that which i will use.

most of my friends and such assert that they have a lot of stuff, most of it not used, and some of it even turned over to consignment unused! that's such a waste of time, money, and space to me!

so, if you could let me know, that would be awesome.


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## jadekat (Jun 25, 2007)

This thread is very interesting. I've been going through DC toys. I totally agree about them playing with items that are not really toys. I think mine would be happy with a box and some craft supplies.


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## notwonamesalike (Nov 13, 2007)

I like this thread. DH and I have a very small wicker basket downstairs that had 6 play silks, 2 dolls that my son's uncle gave him, and plastic stacking rings (which I want to trade out for wooden stacking rings).

He also has horribly ugly plastic walker/rider toy that he loves. It stays in the garage when not in use (the garage is our large lawnmower box that he also loves.







)

He has lots of classic children's books because DH and I love to read to him. And in his toy box upstairs is my collection of medium sized muppets. He actually isn't in his room much, because we co-sleep.

I do have some items I would like to get him in the future:

A bead maze
A child size wooden rocking chair
A wood shape sorter
A wooden kitchen/play felt food

I would also like to pick up a classic radio flyer wagon.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
NOS:

as a new, first-time mom (20 weeks pg tomorrow!), i'm curious to know what you have and use for your baby during these first months. i really only want to purchase (or have purchased for me) that which i will use.

most of my friends and such assert that they have a lot of stuff, most of it not used, and some of it even turned over to consignment unused! that's such a waste of time, money, and space to me!

so, if you could let me know, that would be awesome.









I would say:
- cloth diapers if you'll use them (my favorite system is simple prefolds, a few Snappis, and nylon pull on covers-- then maybe wool after the runny poo phase is over; so simple and so comfy for your babe)
-wipes (whatever system you want-- soft washcloths and water work well; avoid hemp . . .too rough for wipes, IMO)
-about 10 outfits (depends how easy laundry is for you to do)
-a good baby carrier (a wrap will take you through every stage with delightful comfort)
-some sort of bag (maybe one you own?) to carry the diapers and an extra outfit
- some nursing gear for you if you plan on nursing (nursing bras and pads for leaks)
- a car seat
- saline and an aspirator
- thermometer (we have the one you swipe across the forehead)
- a blanket (maybe a small one you already have)
- a bed rail or one of those co-sleeping mattresses if you plan on co-sleeping, even if the bed is against the wall (if your babe will be in between you and your DP, you won't necessarily need this)

That's all I can really think of. Remember-- the stores are always open, online stuff gets delivered pretty fast . . .so if there is anything else you need, you can always get it AFTER the baby comes. I think it's easy to forget that, so people end up overbuying "just in case."

Also, it is nice to have a safe place to put the baby down, but since this is your first, even the floor will do. (This is not necessarily true when you bring a newborn into a home with a young toddler!)

Congrats!!!


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

Zoebird- I think the answer to this question is as varied as every mother here.









Assuming the essentials are taken care of (diapers, clothes, food (boobs!







)), you really need NOTHING in the way of toys for an infant- dd really liked a Haba stroller/carseat clip toy, but other than that, she played with spoons, measuring cups, my nursing necklace, and as she got older, she crawled around exploring- she really liked Goodnight Moon from about two months old- I think the bold red/green of the pictures attracted her- and I definitely think books are a "must" "toy".







I really enjoyed playing with her- during diaper changes, baths, singing and dancing to music, wearing her as I washed diapers (oh, that was hard work!). I didn't really even feel like I needed toys for her til she was about 6 months old, and even then, not many. It wasn't prolly til after 9 months that she even had a lil basket of toyish things. And I really like the idea of making toys- I am just starting to realize how many of those "natural" toys you can make! And babies really like containers to put things in, colored blocks, shakers/musical instruments, "discovery bottles"- which are basically water bottles filled with all kinds of different things- oil/colored water, glitter, confetti, etc. Some preschool/kinder/early elementary sites have good ideas for discovery bottles. Or an idea I saw in a store recently that you could make at home is to fill a water bottle with trinkets, and rice, and sort of make a homemade "I Spy" bottle. There are so many things!

But for me, other than the essentials I mentioned above, the things I found I used every day for a long time were my boppy and my sling.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

thing is, i don't know how much clothing, etc, is needed.

i see my friend's showers, and i'm overcome with how much they get. i find it overwhelming.

so far, my list is this:

mother-ease diapers (though we are going to EC, we want some 'just in case')
10-14 baby outfits
baby blanket (afghan style)
wrap carrier
nursing gear (bras, pads, pump, storage that isn't plastic!)
car seat
and since we're going to co-sleep, we want to get a new mattress. our current one is a full size and about 20-25 years old--well past it's life span. we want to get an organic, king size (my husband insists on king size) mattress for our home. so we'll also need new linens, but not blankets.

i would also like a sheepskin to toss over the rocking chair that my mother is giving me (it's very much to my style, it's one that she had when i was little, etc--my sister dislikes it so i get it! yay!) which can also be used as a comfy spot for the baby anywhere,

as far as toys go, we have our childhood favorites (my musical teddy, a few stuffed animals), and i'm making myself a nursing necklace (which is a fun process), and basically that's it. we really don't see a need for a lot of toys at this phase, and as the child gets older, we can do some things.

i'm just glad to know that i don't need 47 outfits, 12 blankets, and so on. . . .


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

Ah, clothes and blankets- I think I had 2-3 dozen diapers, and 3-4 covers. I used about 3-4 recieving blankets, and got a couple packs of cheap diapers from the grocery store to use as burp cloths, I used them a LOT. I found that I liked sleep and plays better than baby gowns, because her feet were covered (she held her legs up in the air all the time, and the gowns would just slide up- but she was a winter baby, and I think I wouldn't have minded so much if she was a summer baby, so I kept all the gowns just in case- I think I used about 12-14 sleepers/onesies, and had a few cute outfits for outings where I wanted her to look a lil nicer. And a few things my mom had saved from when I was a baby- the truth is, she's two now, and we are STILL overrun with clothes! TOO many! She has lots of generous family that likes to give clothes. I have rarely needed to spend money on clothes at all. I found clothing the HARDEST thing to judge when I was pg in regards to what I needed, so I just said, "We need clothes", and since no one else could get us anything on our list (you know, like cloth diapers and wool covers), I got TONS of clothes. I took a gigantic bag of them to Once Upon a Child, and got $35 for them! Considering what a rip off OUAC is, that was a LOT of clothes!


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
thing is, i don't know how much clothing, etc, is needed.


I think your list looks good, especially if you have easy access to laundry. Stick with your list, and if you need more once your child is born, then get more.

I got rid of all my baby clothes size 0-6 after my 2nd DD (I was sure I was done). We had a lot of clothing because we had had 2 girls by then, and that was pretty much all people gave us. Then when I wanted to have one more child, I bought just a few outfits (and we finally lived in a house with our own washer/dryer), and it was actually MUCH easier having less clothing.

I agree with getting things with feet. Sometimes onesies are a pain with cloth diapers. So, if you babe will be born when it is colder, it might be good to stick with the one piece sleepers with zippers (way faster than snaps).

The reasons I'd change DD more than once a day where either when (1) poo leaked out of the cover (pretty rare) or (2) I leaked on her when we nursed (pretty common).


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Ah, clothes. One of the things i looked forward to the most with this (final) pregnancy was that I was going to dress this baby the way *I* wanted to and I was going to refuse to own excessive quantities of clothes that I didn't even like.

I thought I was doing pretty good when I finished shopping for a reasonable quantity at the consignment store, turnid some well-loved but way too threadbare flannel sheets into receiving blankets, and did a bit of sewing so that Terran could have some nice bamboo and organic cotton gowns.

All he actually wound up using was the homemade gowns: five tie-dyed bamboo, one white bamboo, and two green and natural striped organic cotton. I liked the gowns for him, even though he was born in the dead of winter, because he's my first EC babe. I used leg warmers and yes, they actually did hold on the little miniature socks that I got him as a joke for Christmas.

He didn't like to be swaddled so the receiving blankets have been repurposed as flats, part of my Amazing $10 diaper stash (I made fleece covers out of scraps left over from making slings, so my only expense was good quality velcro).

He DOES own a very nice cherry wood rattle, but I haven't seen any need to take it out of the drawer where I keep it and show it to him. The nursing necklace is because I know from experience how much nipple twiddling gets to me and I do have post-abuse gender isues that might make me even less tolerant of a little boy. The yoga ball (a great big hunk of inflatable plastic) is because I don't have enough room for a rocking chair; with my teen sleeping in the living room, Terran and I pretty much live and WAH in one tiny bedroom.

We do have books---oh, lordy, do we ever have books. The only thing I "forgot" and had to run out and get right away after Terran's birth were _My Little Miracle_ and _On The Day You Were Born_ because it didn't occur to me beforehand that anyone could have written better books for babies than what I had held on to and hoarded all those years.

I also very much want to get him African Playground, but other than that it made more sense to get a new machine to play all of my old Raffi and Lester Family cassettes on rather than replace them with CDs or legal MP3s.

I'm way too much of a packrat, as you can now imagine, and way too attached to my own "stuff". It just doesn't seem like something I want to do to wave the rattle enticingly in front of my son saying "LOOK, baby! I've got a wonderful surprise for you! It's better than Brother, better than Sister, better than your foster Gramma, and even better than the cats! It's a THING!"

It's so ingrained in our culture that I don't think I even realized I was doing it with the bigger kids. Another incident that sticks in my mind about the materialistic ILs was being obligated (maybe they just invited us and exy made me feel obligated) to go to their adult-centered cocktail parties for the holidays, where dd was paraded around briefly since she was the only granddaughter and then quickly dispatched to her cousins' room to play with their toys.

The cousins themselves had been disposed of earlier by being sent to visit their father.

My own parents don't seem to be able to express love any other way than sending the big kids stuff. We had a fairly major tantrum from my mother this year because dd had not sent a thank-you note for her Christmas present, which dd explained was not because of forgetfulness or ungratefulness (although she refuses to use anything my mother sends her; long story) but because "gratitude is a feeling, not a material object". Makes sense to me.

It's nice to see that I started such a busy and active tribe. Maybe I'm not so crazy to not want all this crap in ds2's life after all.


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

I get so tired of taking in everyone else's hand-me downs. I do appreciate the generosity but I have no idea how a person could wear all that and I pick through it ruthlesssly sending things on their way. I do laundry often (or else it would take over my life) so I don't think my 2 yo needs more than 6 outfits along with appropriate outer wear. If/when they wear thin I will head back to the consignment store. Truly reducing what is in the house saves time, energy and my good humor for what reeally matters - My children.

The tons and tons of baby stuff that doesn't get used turns into a disposal nightmare. Good for those of you figuring it out early!


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
Another incident that sticks in my mind about the materialistic ILs was being obligated (maybe they just invited us and exy made me feel obligated) to go to their adult-centered cocktail parties for the holidays, where dd was paraded around briefly since she was the only granddaughter and then quickly dispatched to her cousins' room to play with their toys.

I hate it that so many people treat babies as objects, and not PEOPLE.







: My MIL commented as dd got older, "Oh, she's turning into a real person now!" Um, she was a real PERSON before!


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

thanks for that information about clothes.

i'm due in august, and so i'm not too concerned about the baby being too cold, but i was planning on babylegs and little socks anyway.

i do have great access to laundry and will form here until the end of time no matter what. i lived my days without it. it was not good for me. LOL much better to have laundry.


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## jbie (Mar 21, 2006)

ooh i like this thread. i'm guilty of buying toys for ds (95% are second hand) hoping that it will magically absorb all his attention and need for my attention.. which of course never happens.

but i'm finding that the most successful toys are things that really aren't toys, or the simple things.

for example..
- our computers and mobile phones and cameras, the real things (he rejects the fake toy substitues for what they are).
- a cardboard box, when he started standing, was perfect for standing and bouncing in, as it prevented him from hurting his head when he fell against the soft sides.
- anything magnetic that stuck to the dishwasher/fridge
- the dishwasher/fridge; kitchen cupboards, drawers
- we did get a toy kitchen that was v succesful, as it offered a scale of proportion that was very delightful for his imaginative play
- spoons, sticks, laundry pegs; cups, clear plastic bottles, pots = huge favourites. pens, spools of thread, etc etc.
- books books books books
- some exceptions: a multi coloured windmill, bath ducks, any sort of pushing toy eg cart

basically the theme seems to be.. imaginative exploration or an object's properties and fun ways it can be used; fascinating cause and effect; mimicking of what he sees us use daily.

so this is a kid who has access to lots of all the usual toys, and yet he's proving true to the common sense philosophy expressed in this thread.

so this will guide my future approach to his play..

i personally am not fussed about plastics; i prefer not to, but there're things where only plastic will do, eg light clear bottle, bath duckies


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## weliveintheforest (Sep 3, 2005)

We aren't toy free buy I lean more and more that way all the time. I love some of the toys we have chosen (stacking bowls and playsilks being the best) but most of it stresses me out. I hate seeing an overflowing box or drawer full of stuffed animals or dolls, and all the little things that seem to add up. I am constantly decluttering toys but they keep coming back! My dd is only 2 and a half, I'm not looking forward to when she is older and I can't just get rid of things. Hopefully we can keep it all under control.


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## SeekingSleep (Mar 25, 2008)

We aren't toy free but I've been seriously working on cutting back on toys that we have and buying less in general! I would love to get DS a wood kitchen set and get off my bum and acutally make him his felt play food for when he's a little older. One day I'll get it done! I would like to get more wood toys for him, bit by bit I keep telling myself.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

well, we have begun our 'big purge.' it's amazing how much stuff one can collect.

we are going to organize our toys this weekend. by "our toys" i mean those toys which we currently own for ourselves. some we're going to pass along; others we're goign to keep (sentiment and for the kiddo) and pack up into a nice box to bring out later.

my husband also has his action figure collection. he's going to let go of some stuff, but keep his original 1970s star wars collection, and we're "arguing" (not really! LOL) about his 1990s star wars collection which is considerably larger than the 1970s one. He might actually let go of the 1990s one. I would love to display his 1970s collection in full, in protective cases and what not, and so would he--but the 1990s collection is so huge, it would have to be rotated out and stored. that really irks me! i hate storing stuff. LOL

decorations, that's a big one. a lot of them are gifts or hand-me-downs. his mother gave him all of the christmas ornaments that he made OR that were given to him over the years. it's a lot of freakin' ornaments. we don't use them on our tree, and so there they sit in their boxes. i just have no clue what to do with them. I keep our decorations for all seasons in a single large tub--christmas, easter, summer, fall, and halloween all in one tub. now, i have tubs and boxes and more little tubs. . .just because someone goes "i think you'll like this" or doesn't want a certain decoration anymore.

it makes a gal crazy!


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## Himom (May 25, 2005)

I'm trying to slow down the rate at which we accumulated toys, mainly through birthdays and Christmas. I'm sad to say that I'm not making any progress whatsoever. DS just had a birthday, he turned 5, and I'm feeling stressed looking at the pile of toys that were given to him. I couldn't take them away because they are his gifts, but at the same time, I don't want to keep them. It's a constant struggle. And then there're the junks from goody bags of birthdays that DC attended. Arrgghhh...


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## coloradomama1 (Dec 31, 2006)

subbing! i may have found my tribe...one of them anyway







.


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## Tithonia (Mar 18, 2008)

I've been following this thread with interest, and have come up with three aspects to the toy issue for our family:

1. People are more important than things. This means that we are committed to an anti-materialist approach to our life, both animate and inanimate members. This applies not only to our attitude toward acquisition of things (or lack thereof), but also guides our larger family philosophy. It impacts the way we choose to spend our time, the things we talk and think about, and our goals for our family.
2. "Stuff" is a burden. This leads us in the minimalist direction as well as the anti-materialist (I think it's possible to be anti-materialist but not minimalist; I'm thinking it may also be possible to be minimalist but not anti-materialist). Everything we acquire weighs us down, although second-or-more-hand stuff weighs less heavily, at least on me.








3. It's important to spend time playing alone. Both DH and I have precious memories of playing alone as children, and we want to allow DD to develop this skill as well--although, not surprisingly considering her genes, she seems to be a natural! This means, as far as I can see, that we will make toys in some form available to her. I agree with the many people who mentioned that everyday objects are often superior to made-to-be-toys objects, although I also agree that some toys are just plain really good toys!

Okay, so that's my "philosophical" musing on the subject. As background, I grew up in an anti-materialist, TV-free family and loved it (although I do remember being jealous of some of the toys my friend across the street had). One thing that my family did which DH and I are carrying on into our family is to not include presents in our Christmas celebration. I also had a fascinating conversation about children and play with my MIL (who is wonderful) a couple of months ago when we visited. She talked about the two small children that lived across the street and used to come over a lot (she's the kind of person kids like to spend time with), and how they didn't know how to play. They had all sorts of fancy toys from this or that movie, but all they did was push buttons or "replay" the story. She was pretty disturbed about how uncreative they were already--and how clearly this was connected to being part of the materialistic culture we live in. This made me also think about how approach is as important as quantity. While we were there my FIL kept telling my MIL that she was overwhelming DD with too many toys at once (all out of a box of toys DH and siblings played with, mostly "educational"). It was interesting, though, to see MIL and DD interacting over the toys. MIL kept showing DD new things and how they worked, and DD just watched and watched and tried new things. You could practically see her learning and soaking it all in. It was almost the opposite of the "using everyday objects as toys." They were using toys as objects to explore.

Okay, this is getting way too long. Obviously I've been thinking about this quite a bit.







Just ignore me if my ramblings aren't interesting!


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

I have to sub to this thread.... I sooo want to get rid of allllll the toys that have been given to the kids and give them to good will. they dont play with any of them. I would love it if I had maybe some wooden ones but atleast for alittle while I would like to go toy free and maybe we would stay at the toy free type lifestyle. I would like to get more into books with them. I think i can do this.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i think a question that comes up is how to handle toys coming in from those who do not necessarily share your philosophy.

i mean, i agree with a lot of the various underlying principles espoused here--obviously it's a tribe i relate to--but it seems that all of us struggle to 'control' what comes in from others at christmas, birthdays, and random events where our children find themselves (parties, etc).

i would say that my parents and i have very divergent values about 'stuff.' i would say the same is true of my ILs, but they are different than my parents. my sister is more like my parents, and so they tend to 'get along' better.

for my family, my values about things such as organic, fair trade, and minimalist approaches are very difficult to understand and, in their minds, very limited and "not enjoying life." of course, i do not feel this way.

another aspect of the struggle is that buying things is one of the ways that the family "shows love and caring" for each other. often, they buy on impulse, based on what they like or think you might like--rather than on what you really want.

in this process of planning for the baby, we are taking a very minimalist approach with it--something they are not happy with.

my mother wants to buy a full nursery set, we just want a new, organic, king-size mattress for our family bed. what we want costs half of what my mother wants to get, but because she doesn't want to get what we want, she won't get anything.

and she's upset about that because she can't share her love/affection for the baby in this way (her way of spending), and she's upset because we're "rebuffing" her.

drama, i know.

and i can only imagine that it gets more difficult when you add in birthdays and what not.

any advice to this?


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## tubulidentata2 (Aug 6, 2006)

We have toys, and some are pricey (the Learning Tower and wooden kitchen), but we try to stick with open-ended, basic toys, and I really don't want so many toys that our child is overstimulated and can't concentrate on one project for long. I also don't want her to feel like having a bunch of natural toys is a status symbol.

I really like the toys suggested in _Toymaking With Children_. My friend is borrowing the book, so I can't check, but I believe the author recommends only 3-4 toys (homemade) for the first year, one of which is a ball, and another is a cloth doll. The author does stress the importance of doll play for both boys and girls.

We have many baskets that we got from Salvation Army, and we fill them with various collections of simple "toys" - acorns, nuts, sea shells, feathers, play silks, pieces of bark, puppets, dress-up toys, sticks, etc. DD (23 months) loves these toys (by the way, she is not one to put things in her mouth, and we supervise her - this might not be an appropriate suggestion for other children until they are older). Sorting and dumping dried beans is one of her favorite games. Then she loves to sweep up the beans when we are done.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i think a question that comes up is how to handle toys coming in from those who do not necessarily share your philosophy.

and i can only imagine that it gets more difficult when you add in birthdays and what not.

any advice to this?

A few things I've learned along the way . . .
(1) Ask for books. At least around my house, we can just never have enough children's books. They are used more than any toy.
(2) Ask for classes/memberships to museums as a gift.
(3) Don't have large birthday parties. Have people over, but not for a gift-giving situation. (Even I ignore invites that say "no presents" so I am not sure how well that strategy works in real life.)
(4) Don't feel guilty about blessing someone else with what you've been given as a gift. People have every right to buy what they want as a gift, but you are never obligated to keep it.
(5) Keep a catalog like Nova Natural Toys around. Sometimes people just don't realize how gorgeous non-commercial toys are.
(6) Be grateful. I don't have these gift issues with my family, but I've heard friends complain about how their parents aren't "allowed" to buy clothes for the baby because they don't pick cute outfits. I don't get it-- why not just say THANK YOU and then move on?

In the case of the nursery set-- could you and your mom shop online together for something (if local isn't available) more functional like an organic blanket and clothes-- maybe she just wants the experience of buying something cute, and the mattress doesn't fill that want? I REALLY think once she sees how beautiful these things can be, she'll be hooked. Maybe try Fairy Cove


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## Girlymomwithsons (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mizelenius* 
Thinking about this more . . .

I don't think toys are inherently wrong by any stretch of the imagination. I think a toy is anything that one plays with. Take a box. If my child plays with it, it becomes a toy, and there is nothing wrong with that: my child is playing with a toy.

For myself, I also think limiting toys by materials or the way it operates (like batteries) isn't quite right, either. If my child loves to play with a toy made from plastic (like a Bilibo, a spatula, etc.) then so what? My DD had a little plastic bird that she carried around endlessly when she was 2. She slept with it, put in the stroller, and wanted to learn everything about it from a bird book (it was a Cockatiel). Should I have taken it away-- her prized bird-- and instead have handed her a wooden one?

I do not subscribe to the idea that toys must be purposeful, because that is imposing an adult's perspective on a child. Who are we to decide what is purposeful? For example, my oldest loves her fox stuffed animal. Is it "purposeful"? Well, not to me, but for her it is. She brings it everywhere, has learned about red foxes, has made things for it out of recycled things, and makes up stories about it. To me, that means the fox has helped her play, and when she plays, WOW does she learn.

The toys with batteries I do not find horrible, just a waste of money for the most part. I don't think the toys with batteries we have (though I admit, these have almost 100% been gifts) have affected the imaginations of my children. They couldn't, because they haven't played with them very often!

I think there are bigger problems (as mentioned on this thread) than toys themselves and what toys are made out of, which come from excess. Excessive amounts of toys (and everyone has their own definition of excess!) is what leads to a loss of time and money. Children can get overwhelmed. Play spaces can become inaccessible. Too much of anything at any age can lead to feeling empty and always wanting more. Why impose that on our children?

My biggest obstacle is gifts. People give very nice items, but the truth is . . .my children don't play with most of them, even the pretty natural ones. I would just like less stuff overall in our house!









:
How do you guys get your families to comply with the no plastic and/or batteries rule? Our families just don't get it. We haven't come right out and said that those things are banned, but we have been very clear about prefering things that can be built with, that are safe to go in mouths, that sort of thing. But most gifts that our kids get (baring clothes and books) are plastic, noisy things, because, I have been told, those are the sort of things that they wouldn't get from us. Which is true, because we really haven't bought them toys. Ever. My youngest loves things with wheels, and will play with anything he can drive, so that is usually what people give him. We really don't have many toys, and as a result, our kids do play with what we have, creatively, so I feel bad getting rid of them. I really think that play is a huge part of growing up, and toys are a big part of play, although definately not all of it, or even the biggest part. How do you broach this subject with 16 loving grandparents, all of whom want to give nice gifts a few times a year, without having them get upset with you for "ruining childhood" or being an extremist? And, a bit of a digression, but why is it always me who is the extremist, when my husband agrees with me? Why isn't he ever the bad guy?

Oh, yeah, we tried gift free birthdays, and were told categorically that it is unfair to do that to my grandparents, who had been planning for months for our 3 year olds birthday, because they were trying really hard to respect our leanings towards toys, and thought they had it nailed. (They got him, and his brother a few months later, some Thomas the train stuff, mostly tracks, that they LOVE to put together in different ways.) My mom said it was fine to go gift free from friends, but not family. Any thoughts on that?


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Girlymomwithsons* 
How do you broach this subject with 16 loving grandparents, all of whom want to give nice gifts a few times a year, without having them get upset with you for "ruining childhood" or being an extremist?

To start, if they are not on board with your philosophy, DON'T TELL THEM your philosophy. They will feel judged and criticized. I tell people (like my MIL) the truth when she asks what to buy, leaving out my world view. I tell her that, seriously, my kids don't play with toys, but they would really love clothes or books or art supplies. I only tell her that when she asks.

The more I think about it, the funnier I think it is that my kids don't play with designated toys for the most part. They spent 2 hours in the yard today using the hose, an umbrella, and some buckets.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

actually, with my mother, it's the fun and desire of shopping and buying on impulse. she doesn't like to catelogue or online shop at all. for her, it's "no fun." and because there aren't any shops that carry organic baby stuff, etc, it's really 'no fun.'

i've sent her numerous web sites that have adorable organic baby stuff of all kinds. i've ordered print catelogues to look at as well. she simply doesn't like to shop that way. and she doesn't like to give money--because that takes all the fun out of it too.

_(1) Ask for books. At least around my house, we can just never have enough children's books. They are used more than any toy._

i don't think that this will be a problem. we're actually considering asking the family to be on a rotation--so that this birthday these grandparents buy books while those buy art supplies, etc. they actually do like this idea.

but, they also see this as "in addition to" the fun/cute things that they want to get.









_(2) Ask for classes/memberships to museums as a gift._

in doing this for myself, it bombs. i was asked what i wanted "for the mama" and i told them i would like prenatal massage. i was only asking that they pay for one ($55), while i would cover the rest (20 weeks worth-- so $1100). they wanted to get me an object, and so i suggested the nursing clothes that i want (bras, shirts--organic, fair trade--via the catelogues that i gave them), and that also went down hill.

it's very interesting how this process goes. i know that there are things that my parents would pay for--or that they asked my grandparents for, for us, when we were kids. we went to a water park and got season passes all summer--mom could drop us off there if one of us was over 12 (and that was me!) and so we'd spend the day there while she went to work (cheap day care! LOL). my grandmother often bought that for us as a christmas gift. so the idea isn't foreign. it just depends upon if they want to get it for us. LOL!

_(3) Don't have large birthday parties. Have people over, but not for a gift-giving situation. (Even I ignore invites that say "no presents" so I am not sure how well that strategy works in real life.)_

i'm not really concerned about this. we are planning on having small parties--starting with a family tradition of birthday breakfast with banana bread/cake. gifts to be given then. a birthday party with a few friends can come later, which we hope to host in the 'hobbit style'--sending information on the invitations that in the hobbit fashion, the birthday boy/girl gives gifts to the guests, not the other way around!

might go over like a lead balloon or might be considered clever.

_(4) Don't feel guilty about blessing someone else with what you've been given as a gift. People have every right to buy what they want as a gift, but you are never obligated to keep it_.

personally, i don't feel guilty about donating things that i don't want to charity. i do this every year with every purge thta we do in our home. our local charities actually call us "hey, are you getting rid of any X? i know you donated something last month, and we're looking for this!" even if i don't have it, i can find someone who does. LOL!

the problem comes in when something is purchased for me and i give it away, and then they come looking for it. and then it's a guilt trip.

_(5) Keep a catalog like Nova Natural Toys around. Sometimes people just don't realize how gorgeous non-commercial toys are._

yup. my MIL likes catelogues, my mother doesn't. i think my MIL would be more apt to follow.









_(6) Be grateful. I don't have these gift issues with my family, but I've heard friends complain about how their parents aren't "allowed" to buy clothes for the baby because they don't pick cute outfits. I don't get it-- why not just say THANK YOU and then move on?_

no, i definitely say 'thank you' and 'move on.' the issue is--do they move on?

notoriously, my parents and my ILs come to my house and look for the things they've given me. when they can't find them and they ask, and then discover that i gave these things to charity--it's a disaster.

so, i re-inform them that we simplify our lives as much as we can by letting go of what we do not want/use on a regular basis.

_I tell people (like my MIL) the truth when she asks what to buy, leaving out my world view._

in general, this is my process as well, except that my world view is obvious. if my mother asks me what baby clothing i want, and i give a web site of all organic baby clothing, then she knows the world view.

and, typically she'll ask why i want that clothing--meaning that i have to get into the world view. i then explain my position, and i am told that i am 'being silly.'

but, this is not just about things like organic clothing. in this instance, i asked for 7 items of clothing of each size (3-6 mo; 6-9 mo; 9-12 mo) as the 'foundation' of the baby's wardrobe over time. my mother asked why, and i asserted that i felt i likely wouldn't need much, and if i needed more, i could buy more. she said that i was 'being silly' and 'it never hruts to have more.'

so you see, she is also sharing her worldview, and it is different. and in my case, i am being judged as 'silly' whereas i do not tell my mother or ILs that i think living non-organically or whatever is "bad" because i dont' feel it is.

i just want to live this way.

----

i think the toughest thing is just letting people be angry or upset with you. i suppose eventually they'll stop sending things that you don't want, if you keep standing up for what you do one way or another.

i just wish it was possible to avoid this upset in the mean time.


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mizelenius* 
A few things I've learned along the way . . .
(1) Ask for books. At least around my house, we can just never have enough children's books. They are used more than any toy.
(2) Ask for classes/memberships to museums as a gift.
(3) Don't have large birthday parties. Have people over, but not for a gift-giving situation. (Even I ignore invites that say "no presents" so I am not sure how well that strategy works in real life.)
(4) Don't feel guilty about blessing someone else with what you've been given as a gift. People have every right to buy what they want as a gift, but you are never obligated to keep it.
(5) Keep a catalog like Nova Natural Toys around. Sometimes people just don't realize how gorgeous non-commercial toys are.
(6) Be grateful. I don't have these gift issues with my family, but I've heard friends complain about how their parents aren't "allowed" to buy clothes for the baby because they don't pick cute outfits. I don't get it-- why not just say THANK YOU and then move on?


Thanks for those tips! We are encountering our first "selective" toys birthdays! And I am having a hard time deciding what to do about this! We are only having a VERY small party for my ds's 3rd birthday. Only close family members, I was trying to think of ways to "word" it kindly that we would enjoy a zoo membership for ds much more than any toys!

I hope it is ok that I jumped in







We are not toy free, but I am in the process of going through my dc's toys to get rid of the plastic/battery operated toys..And we are slowly replacing them with quality, more natural toys but the # of toys is going to be significantly less than we have now!


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Zoebird, I hear you, we've gone through the struggles with trying to get relatives to understand what we don't want in our home. Recently I've come at it with the MIL through the angle of sharing research - casually mentioning a big lead recall in the news or something and we've had some good discussions. I also wrote up some research in a paper and shared that, I wasn't sure it would go over well but it did. I was very very cautious about how I gave her the paper, said I wrote it up for some friends online and wanted to share it with her. (Its in my blog, one of the first posts titled "article on lead plastics toys etc".) It helps me to remember that my way of thinking is actually very foreign to them and it took me awhile of reading on mdc, and other research to come to my own stance so I try to lead them slowly down that same path with exposing them to thoughts, news clips etc that over time sink in.

Another thought is that this is your first baby right? We had the power struggle with our first - the first grandbaby ever and had to stick to our guns and when it came down to it they didn't see her for a few months because things were strained, we tried talking with them and they got mad but eventually realized we were going to do things our way. DD is almost three and they have a ton of respect for us and how we are raising DD, MIL has commented on my parenting and that she learns from things I do, so when something like the toy issue comes up they might not understand but they respect us for the most part and are trying to learn. Building that relationship takes time but it can be done. Believe me things were really bad there for awhile but wonderful now. Give it time, patience, and lots of explaining calmly and matter of fact... they will come around and respect you in time. Its tough though to be in the middle of it and wanting understanding.


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## AbbottsMomma (Apr 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mizelenius* 
Thinking about this more . . .

I don't think toys are inherently wrong by any stretch of the imagination. I think a toy is anything that one plays with. Take a box. If my child plays with it, it becomes a toy, and there is nothing wrong with that: my child is playing with a toy.

For myself, I also think limiting toys by materials or the way it operates (like batteries) isn't quite right, either. If my child loves to play with a toy made from plastic (like a Bilibo, a spatula, etc.) then so what? My DD had a little plastic bird that she carried around endlessly when she was 2. She slept with it, put in the stroller, and wanted to learn everything about it from a bird book (it was a Cockatiel). Should I have taken it away-- her prized bird-- and instead have handed her a wooden one?

I do not subscribe to the idea that toys must be purposeful, because that is imposing an adult's perspective on a child. Who are we to decide what is purposeful? For example, my oldest loves her fox stuffed animal. Is it "purposeful"? Well, not to me, but for her it is. She brings it everywhere, has learned about red foxes, has made things for it out of recycled things, and makes up stories about it. To me, that means the fox has helped her play, and when she plays, WOW does she learn.

The toys with batteries I do not find horrible, just a waste of money for the most part. I don't think the toys with batteries we have (though I admit, these have almost 100% been gifts) have affected the imaginations of my children. They couldn't, because they haven't played with them very often!

I think there are bigger problems (as mentioned on this thread) than toys themselves and what toys are made out of, which come from excess. Excessive amounts of toys (and everyone has their own definition of excess!) is what leads to a loss of time and money. Children can get overwhelmed. Play spaces can become inaccessible. Too much of anything at any age can lead to feeling empty and always wanting more. Why impose that on our children?

My biggest obstacle is gifts. People give very nice items, but the truth is . . .my children don't play with most of them, even the pretty natural ones. I would just like less stuff overall in our house!

I totally agree with this. My son doesn't not have a ton of toys, he has two small bins that are filled with a variety of toys, mostly stuff that peaks his interest with lights and music (he is 10 months old). He also has stuffed animals that he loves because he can flop them around and they don't hurt him. In no way does my allowing him to have plastic "commercialized" toys make me a lazy or negligent mommy.... I love that he is exposed to all sorts of different things! Perhaps he will be a well rounded child with an appreciation for toys of all types!

We are minimalists by nature, we don't have tons of stuff, but every bit of what he does have he plays with and over the last few months he has learned to play by himself instead of relying on me to entertain him all hours of the day! It's helping him become independent and self-reliant which can only help him as he grows older!


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

mercy:

yes, it is our first child, and both sets of grandparents' first grandchild!

both of them have ideas of how they want to grandparent, and of course how we should parent!







i'm not surprised, because they also have strong opinions on how we should live in general.

what i find so interesting about my process is that i am finding myself really galvanized to my own position. not to the point of inflexibility, but recognizing just how much influence over my life my parents and ILs have/had because i haven't wanted to upset them, i wanted to keep them happy, etc.

and now, i really just want to "be me" as much as possible so that i can teach my child to just be "him/herself" and not try to pressure that child to "be me."

i mean, it might sound silly or perhaps even subtle, but my furnishing is far more to my mother's tastes than to my own. and my husband discovered that he's in the same boat. some of the things he's held onto are here because of his mother's worldview and not wanting to upset her.

example--we like a clean, zen/scandinavian design approach. we always have. it's just 'our style.' we're minimalists! LOL his mother loves antiques and hordes; my mother likes "traditional home."

when i decorated our home (where we currently live), i went to look for furnishing and thought to invite my mother 'for fun.' my husband and i had a scrapbook of ideas, and i wanted to follow that.

it wasn't my mother's design style at all, and while shopping, she convinced me that other things were "better" and that we would "tire" of the modern/clean look at that it would "look dated" whereas traditional, classic furnishing is "always in style."

well, as i've studied design more, good modern design is also always in style! go figure.







and, 'zen design' has been around for a VERY long time.









so, instead of buying what i wanted, i listened to my mother and now my house looks like hers. LOL!

and it bothers me now that i realize this! HA!

and so, of course, i want to make sure that in this aspect, I have that final say, that i'm the one making the choices, not my mother because i want to appease her.


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## marlee (Aug 29, 2005)

I don't have time to read all the previous posts right now but will come back for support when I need it.

We live in a small home so when people offer to buy dd things or give hand me down's I just say we don't have any more room in our living space right now for more things. My MIL who will buy something anyways I was a little more direct last birthday and said that an outdoor toy would be good. Birthdays include a discussion with invited individuals that we would like no gifts and why. We have gotten dd one toy for holidays or birthdays. I am even rethinking this as she really doesn't play with many of the toys she does have. So instead of thinking I have to get her the right toy I am just letting it go and seeing what she really could use.

She loved the homemade hammock at my parents house so I thought for her birthday coming soon dh could put up the hammock we already have.

I am interested in adding a larger variety of crafts to our current playdough, painting, paper, markers, scissors, pictures, etc.

I think my family is doing well. MIL got dd a birdfeeder for outside for Easter and for Christmas my mom got dd a birdhouse she could paint and then have outside







Dd has been adding to the painting since Christmas.

We have gotten a few plastic gifts but they are outside. A water table for example. We'll see what this birthday brings.


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Oh, a birdfeeder is a great gift idea! So far I've seen zoo memberships or clothes mentioned, this is another great non-toy thing to add to the list. Along with books of course, hm... and art supplies... see, there are plenty of options.







(talking to the grandparents..)


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

well, i do have one thing moving forward for us.







my mother and my MIL were completely disturbed by the various reports about the problem with products coming otu of china--clothes and toys and the lot--and both are on board with "natural" toys/clothes etc.

so, i ordered a set of catelogues for both families, so they can have them. my mom said she would use them, even if they're less fun, because afterall, she can't just go and buy things and "taht's frustrating."

she said "now i know why you don't like shopping. once you cut one thing out (such as things made in china), then everything is so limited! you have organic, fair trade, etc, and that really thins things out!"

so funny.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

zoebird, you may want to get ready to say "pass the bean dip."

(The article was originally written for APers long ago-- now for HSing, but you can use the strategy in general for sticky situations.)


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i've read the article before; it's funny.









i've done pretty well lwith that concept overall, i would think.


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

Told the boys yesterday that this week we are getting rid of thier plastic toys. they of course asked why and i told them they are going to good will for other boys and girls they are ok with them. I am going to get them wooden blocks and play silks. I was thinking about a sand and water table or what we will use is rice instead of sand. Is that agains the toy free thing. The only problem i have is that it is plastic but it is the only one i have found. My mother gave it to them and that is going to be the only plastic toy in the house. Even the dinosaurs For Jacob that is decoration for Jacobs room is going to be wood. Was wondering what you all think. I want to go toy free but want educational stuff and that is all i could find for a table like that. what do you all think


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Yeah, I think you have to make some concessions for a few plastic things, especially when water is involved, lol, natural fibers just don't work as well.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

What a wonderful, supportive tribe I started.









I wanted to get y'all's opinions on whether or not you think it would be presumptuous of me to bring this up with Terran's KD (known sperm donor; the literal kind, not the "deadbeat dad" kind) before his upcoming visit. Under the circumstances, I think I'd be inclined to put away any hastily purchased Power Rangers Action Figure and save it in the back of the closet just because of who bought it for him, but I don't want KD to feel obligated to bring the kind of gift that I think would be most appropriate: a handwritten letter or a recording of his own voice for Terran to listen to when he's older.

My sometimes lucid but sometimes pre-alzheimer's father gave me a wonderful "in" to bring up the subject by mentioning all the wonders of the iPhone in his last email and saying "The ads for them are fantastic and no doubt both dd and
ds1 are slavering for them. Who doesn't want the currently most
expensive toy."

to which I replied quite honestly, "dd and ds1. And myself." and used Tithonia's three aspects in her "philosophical musings" post as a guide to explain why.

ds1 is WAY too materialistic, but he genuinely has no desire whatsoever for an iPhone. I can't believe such a perfect opportunity presented itself.

ds2 is still toy free and after I take this package of my favourite outgrowns to the post office to send off to a friend's baby, his "big(ger) boy" wardrobe will be neatly organized in his drawer and he will have enough credit at the consignment store to cover any "growth spurt emergencies" that my sewing machine and I can't handle.


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## Subhuti (Feb 18, 2005)

I'm in, too.

I enjoy living simply. I want to live even more simply. I do believe that craving for things and all that we do to acquire them is the part of the ruination of America. To wit: credit crisis, extreme disparities in income in the USA, poverty in the USA...

I put in a moderate effort into limiting toys, as much as a mom to two young kids can. I constantly give away/pitch toys. We rarely buy toys. We get many toys from recycling via friends or thrift stores.

A few well-timed gifts I feel are OK. We do give gifts at christmas, tho most were thrift-store/hand me down. We give presents at birthdays and some holidays for fun (like valentine's). I think gift giving and receiving is one of the most wonderful things between family and friends. I just don't believe the stuff should be expensive or numerous.

Our home mainly has a whole lot of books, paints, and some well-loved stuff animals. We've got board games, a few dress up clothes, and building sets (like wood blocks, tinker toys) that all get used day after day.

I see my daughter improvising little dolls out of paintbrushes and markers. This makes me happy.

Likewise, I live simply. This winter i wore basically two pairs of pants and about the same number of shirts (well, probably closer to four shirts). Perhaps i would like more, just out of the convenience of always having something clean to wear. But do I really, really need it? No.

I come from a wealthy background (as a child). I saw that there was no happiness from in material possessions. My real joy in childhood was playing in the woods with my dog and my friends. And reading. My one (brief) expensive hobby was horseback riding. I liked to dress up and pretend too.

I guess I feel like if we amass a lot of stuff, it comes at the expense of other people and the welfare of the planet.

But i do think some gifts and games and toys are fun for the kids and we put some effort into those at birthdays and holidays. Mainly the effort is collecting stuff over the months beforehand from the thrift store.

I too avoid plastic and china-made where ever possible. But plastic can be cheap and durable. Plus, if you are into recycling/thrifting ... that is often what you find.

OK, look forward to keeping open the dialogue here.

btw, our families basically understand our philosopy, and while there has been some friction here and there, for the most part we all make it work.

I think "no plastic toys" "no chinese-made toys" is the least of the weird things we do ... the extended co-sleeping and the extended breastfeeding really weirded people out ! So preferring a few wooden toys was nothing in comparison.

Liz


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

I realized why we still have the amount of toys we have:

(1) For guests. It's just easier to have them on hand for some of our friends than not . . . though at our last party, we barely had any toys taken out as the kids were too busy making up their own fun.

(2) Lack of time to declutter. This is seriously a big issue for me. My youngest is with me about 23 hours a day, so taking into account everything else + my other 2 DD, this makes anything beyond keeping the house neat a real challenge.


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## amygabrielle (Jun 25, 2006)

subbing. I'm in!


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

well, a very cool development.

my mother and MIL just got the news about the issue of various toys, clothes, etc coming from china and having problems. they also got the news about non-organic mattresses and it's affect on babies.

so, now they're 100% behind our choices. and, because these things are more expensive, they asserted that they will be "inclined to spend less" and therefore we won't get as much!

i love how it all comes around.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

This is definitely something that we struggle with. When we first started getting toys for our daughter (just turned 2 in March) I really wanted the no battery, no plastic, open-ended toys, and lots of good books. We talked to my MIL about it, and she was really receptive. Well... she does buy plastic stuff, but I must say, it is stuff that DD absolutely loves and plays with quite a bit. Little People, for instance. She found a nice little house at a thrift store, cleaned it up, and then bought some LP dolls online to go with it. DD plays with this every single day.

I know how important play is for a child. I know how much they learn through it. How they sort through emotions and struggles with play. I am not sure what roll I am to have in all of that, though. How involved should I be in her play? I find that when I play with her, I tend to be guiding her more than I think I should be. Thats why I often like to pull out her wooden blocks and just sit back and watch.

We have a Mom2Mom sale coming up in 2 weeks, and I will be getting rid of lots of stuff she doesn't play with. With her being an only child, me not having a car during the week, and needing to get this house packed up for a big move, I do need her to occupy herself. When she is bored, she wants me to "lie down. na-na's". All freakin' day.

So, this is what I want to keep around because she does love.

Puzzles
LP dolls and doll house
blocks
wooden animals (we have a variety of shapes and sizes)
Some dolls (not sure which ones to keep, which ones to get rid of, though. She has a laundry basket full)
Stuffed animals (once again, not sure which are worth keeping. She absolutely loves animals. Its an obsession with her. But she certainly doesnt need as many as we have.)
Cars and busses. She has a few, and is very creative with them.

We are a musical family, and she has a lot of real instruments. DH just bought her a Ukulele.

This is another one of those things that will definitely be a journey for us, but I know its right for us, so we should continue to pursuit it.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Oh man.. I hope I didnt kill this thread. Its a great one.


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## 5gifts (Nov 16, 2005)

One thing I hate about my kids getting a new fav toy - is displacing an old longtime fav. Whether it be a doll, animal, train truck ect.

When they keep getting more...nothing is 'really special'


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

just got rid of 226 toys today that were plastic we are well on our way to becoming toy free. we still have some cars and a few musical intstruments but that is pretty much it. we have wooden blocks too but the boys build things with them. hope it still counts


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

Can someone help me "word" on ds's birthday invitations that we don't want any new toys, but would love books, or $ for a zoo membership







I am having a really hard time with it.. I am having a very small family party so it will just be grandparents and uncles and aunts.. Thanks!


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *5gifts* 
One thing I hate about my kids getting a new fav toy - is displacing an old longtime fav. Whether it be a doll, animal, train truck ect.

When they keep getting more...nothing is 'really special'

Do I ever remember than from my own comfortable middle class childhood! I'd read books about the fun a child would have with one special log awaited and long loved toy (Like Laura Ingalls Wilder's Charlotte) and then look at the bed that my parents loved to describe as "so full of stuffed animals that there isn't any room for her to sleep!" as if it was just the cutest, cleverest thing a child could do, and feel so lonely and empty and hollow.

Before I even imagined tentatively making a post on "Finding Your Tribe" to see if such a radical idea was even possible, I had a blast doing imaginary hoildiay shopping. Would the single toy be a birthday or Christmas present? Would it be a playsilk or a wooden spoon?

I love Terran's rattle, I really do, I just don't think he's old enough for it yet even if I was ready for him to have it, which I'm not. There are times when his hands feel a bit rough and his pounding on my chest with his little fist when he drops a boobie and I don't give it back to him fast enough feels like "punching", but those are MY issues with being an abuse survivor, not his with exploring his hands, and being whacked in the face with a piece of wood is going to freak me out even worse.


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## BlessedOne (Apr 22, 2008)

I used to be so opposed to the idea of no or little toys because I came from a very "spoiled" family. My husband brought up the idea of having only 3 toys per child, but at first I was just totally against that. Now I have been more and more open to it. I have been so stressed about the toy mess....the only problem is that I go through stages of having problems getting rid of them. Some are sentimental and some are broke so I would hate to give them away....but being an avid recycler has made it hard for me to just toss them in the trash....so with that being said...sometimes I have found myself between a rock and a hard spot so to speak. I have begged people not to buy my kids toys but instead get them more practical things such as clothes, money, or go in with us for a big nice outside toy......but most of the time, they still get all of the toys............ugg! And I kid you not, my kids are insainly blessed. Basically most of the family will not come to see them without giving them toys and that can really add up considering I see some of them weekly! I have finally gotten my mom (whom I see weekly) to focus on other things outside of toys.....so now she showers them with new shoes and clothes and treats ever time she sees them....but hey atleast it is not toys! However I still have not gotten her convenced of doing less on Christmas and birthdays. They basically require that they spend 100 dollars on each child for Christmas and 50ish for birthdays. They think it is horrible of us to not have toys around for our kids......but they are not the ones that has to deal with the mess and frustration of trying to get the kids to pick them up. I have gotten rid of over a crib full(actually over flowing) of toys in the past month......but you serious can not even tell that there was any taken away. They really do not do a whole lot of playing with them......and honestly I try to keep most of them locked away in the closet, so they have to ask to get them out ...but that has not worked that well.....even though a bunch of toys are up.....there are still tons out. There are toy boxes over flowing with toys all over the house..........and I have had my fill! I just really need to get out of this hard spot and stay consistent in getting rid of them. All of the families I know have just as many toys and are constantly having to purge and just like us in no time they are over flowing again. I am convenced the law of sowing and reaping works! If it just wouldn't work for toys...hehe.


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## BlessedOne (Apr 22, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mumkenna&lucas* 
Can someone help me "word" on ds's birthday invitations that we don't want any new toys, but would love books, or $ for a zoo membership







I am having a really hard time with it.. I am having a very small family party so it will just be grandparents and uncles and aunts.. Thanks!









hmmmm yeah I have been there before...

you could say that we would appreciate that instead of buying him toys, that we would prefer books or money to go towards a zoo membership.
If you feel the need to buy a toy, then we ask that you donate it to a needy family instead of us. Thank you!

The only problem with that....is that every person thinks.....well I could just get him one or two small inexpensive toys..... but once everyone does that..you are now piled up with toys again!
I think a lot of it comes down to how they think he will feel towards them for not getting him a toy.

Last Christmas I threatened everyone that I was not allowing any unapproved toy into our house and for them just not to get anything that we had not suggested....................but of course they still got my kids a bunch of useless toys and inevidtiable they came into the house.........although I will say some left very quickly. And the majority of the others were so cheap that they broke almost instantly........but if you read my other post you would see that just left me with a different problem. bah!

My sis in law wanted to have a party without gifts for my brother....so she said on the invite that it was a "no-gift party". The party is later this week....I am interested in seeing how well that works!


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BlessedOne* 
hmmmm yeah I have been there before...

you could say that we would appreciate that instead of buying him toys, that we would prefer books or money to go towards a zoo membership.
If you feel the need to buy a toy, then we ask that you donate it to a needy family instead of us. Thank you!

The only problem with that....is that every person thinks.....well I could just get him one or two small inexpensive toys..... but once everyone does that..you are now piled up with toys again!
I think a lot of it comes down to how they think he will feel towards them for not getting him a toy.

Last Christmas I threatened everyone that I was not allowing any unapproved toy into our house and for them just not to get anything that we had not suggested....................but of course they still got my kids a bunch of useless toys and inevidtiable they came into the house.........although I will say some left very quickly. And the majority of the others were so cheap that they broke almost instantly........but if you read my other post you would see that just left me with a different problem. bah!

My sis in law wanted to have a party without gifts for my brother....so she said on the invite that it was a "no-gift party". The party is later this week....I am interested in seeing how well that works!

Thanks for the advice! I am interested to know how your brother's no gift party went! Let us know!

I have completely gone through the playroom and limited everything! I bet there were hundreds of toys that went!! Now dd's room is next. she is fine with it though! I did tell her that I would buy her a Waldorf doll that she has been wanting to "replace" all the other "things" that went. I am ok with that though. I feel that it is a quality doll that she will LOVE! (she is 4)


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *5gifts* 
One thing I hate about my kids getting a new fav toy - is displacing an old longtime fav. Whether it be a doll, animal, train truck ect.

When they keep getting more...nothing is 'really special'

Yes, DD has two baby dolls and I find myself hoping that no one ever gives her another because she already has her precious baby!

I find it hard to get rid of stuffed animals - so and so brought this to the hospital when dd was born, and so forth. How do you handle that? Not to mention dh and I both have several boxes in the basement because our parents did that for us. old stuffed animals I can't part with. sigh.


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## riverbaby (Jun 17, 2005)

I'm so glad I stumbled upon this thread! Glad to find so many other mamas out there looking for plastic free environment for their kids.

I don't know that I could go completely toy free. But my toddler would certainly be blissfully happy with a few beautiful item made from natural materials, and a few balls for outside.

I'm concerned about the effect of staring at a hideous plastic doll has on him. I mean, it doesn't even look human - why would we present a child with something UGLY, that is a caricature of a human being?

But in my daily life I know only a handful of others who would appreciate only simple toys (or sticks) made from natural materials (or rocks or leaves) that are beautiful (like being out in nature.) hmmmmmm....... does he even need the toys, or just the outdoors?

And this does not even begin to address materialism which is just horrible for children!

Glad you started this one.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riverbaby* 
I'm concerned about the effect of staring at a hideous plastic doll has on him. I mean, it doesn't even look human - why would we present a child with something UGLY, that is a caricature of a human being?


I would guess the effect is none! My DD has always preferred animals to any sort of doll, but I made her a very cute Waldorf doll anyway. Around the same time she got a $3 plastic doll from Target while out with my mom. Guess which one she preferred? Soon she wanted neither.









My point in participating in this is a little different from some of you, I am guessing. Like I said before, I don't think toys harm children in any way, nor do I think the materials get to be the deciding vote as to whether or not the toy is OK. My thing is-- my children VERY RARELY play with "designated" toys at our house, so I don't know why we have them, have continued to buy them (I am guilty of this), etc. My oldest was very into roleplaying (she still is) but very rarely used props. My middle child prefers digging in the dirt with me over playing with a toy.

DD wanted to go to Toys R Us with her earned allowance. I felt so bad for her. She wanted to buy SOMETHING, though we urged her not to buy just to buy. So, she got moon sand. Have you heard of this? She was quite disappointed when it turned out to be difficult to work with. I felt like it was a hard but good lesson-- buying something rarely turns out to bring you the satisfaction you'd expect.

The plus side of them not playing with toys very often is that, while we do have toys, it usually doesn't take long to clean them up since they hardly use them!


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

So last night I went through her room with a garbage bag and filled it with stuff she has accumulated over the last year.. and yes, the garbage bag was full. That felt really great. (It will be either sold at the mom to mom sale, or given to goodwill.)

I noticed something about myself while doing this, though. Part of me thinks she NEEDS some of these toys in order to learn. Like, the shape-sorter. "How will she learn shapes and spacial reasoning without this shape-sorter?" And then I realized how silly that was. First of all, she is a very smart 2 year old. And second, how did kids learn this stuff BEFORE these toys were everywhere? As an aspiring un-schooler, it was a total "duh!" moment.


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## roxy21 (Apr 23, 2008)

I'm not a mom yet but do have many of the same concerns you have all shared related to toys. I also wanted to share this artical about play, modern toys, and development that some of you may find interesting.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=19212514


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

Doe anyone have suggestions of the "top toy" you would pick out for your young child? I would like to be able to tell grandparents, etc one nice thing to get DS for his 1st bday so that he gets 4-5 nice gifts, total, vs a bunch of crap. But I am really stuck on what. We might get him a waldorf doll from us, but then I thought maybe he is too young. Maybe we will just wrap him up boxes from us. (yes DS is only 7 m but I like to plan ahead).


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SuzyLee* 
Doe anyone have suggestions of the "top toy" you would pick out for your young child?

Yes-- books! As for what you should get him, seriously, you can get nothing unless it is an actual need. He WON'T care, not for years. Even my just 3 yo-- when we gave her presents on her b-day, she seemed surprised, though she'd seen her other sisters get gifts in Feb. She woke up on her birthday just happy it was her birthday, not expecting anything else.


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## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

I don't know if I'm in... I'm subbing because it has a certain appeal to it, but I don't know. I used to be pretty dogmatic about the toy issue, and I'm not wanting to go back to that - but right now we're surrounded by an ocean of toys. It's gotten ridiculous. Soooo.... I might be open to doing a major purge.

What to do with plastic toys though? Can they be recycled at all, or is Goodwill/Freecycle the only viable option? Not that that's a bad option, Freecycle rocks.


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## BMG580 (Jun 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
thanks for that information about clothes.

i'm due in august, and so i'm not too concerned about the baby being too cold, but i was planning on babylegs and little socks anyway.

i do have great access to laundry and will form here until the end of time no matter what. i lived my days without it. it was not good for me. LOL much better to have laundry.

The only thing I would add is to have some extra prefolds around for burp cloths. My DD never spit up, my DS has reflux and I feel like my entire house is draped in prefolds to catch what comes pouring out of him. I would just have a few at first to see what you really need but it isn't exaggerating to say that I need 10 or so extra for spit up alone, and I do laundry every other day.

Toys:

We are minimalists when it comes to toys. Actually, I think most of my friends and family think I am a big meanie, but I just can't take the clutter. I remembered reading in the Little House books about Laura's one rag doll and how much she loved her- Charlotte was special to her because it was made just for her by her mother and she wasn't inundated with so many other things. When I visit friends and family with overflowing play rooms it is almost like the kids can't settle down and play because all the toys overwhelm them.

Personally, I think a lot of the toy problems are parents who choose things thinking they look really fun/interactive, the kids don't play with them and the parents can't bring themselves to get rid of them. Not to mention that kids get something for every activity in their lives- stickers at the library, toys at restaurants, balloons at the grocery store. None of it seems remarkable or special because there is a sense of expectation attached to it. This is more of what I'm worried about, my kids expecting to always get something for no reason at all.

We did a huge toy purge last night (before I saw this thread!). If the toys don't fit neatly in the few baskets we have to contain them around the house then we have too many.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Collinsky* 
What to do with plastic toys though? Can they be recycled at all, or is Goodwill/Freecycle the only viable option? Not that that's a bad option, Freecycle rocks.









Thats what we do. I wouldn't know how else to recycle toys.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JEB20005* 
Not to mention that kids get something for every activity in their lives- stickers at the library, toys at restaurants, balloons at the grocery store. None of it seems remarkable or special because there is a sense of expectation attached to it. This is more of what I'm worried about, my kids expecting to always get something for no reason at all.

I totally get what you are saying, and have worried about this same thing. Before dd was born, someone commented on how spoiled she would be. My thought was "well, I don't think having a lot of things makes a person spoiled. Its when they dont appreciate them and think they are entitled to whatever they see and want that I have a problem with."

I am thinking back to my childhood now... I had quite a bit of stuff. Dolls, Barbies, My Little Ponies, so on.. I didn't trash my stuff. I took good care of it. I loved it. I played with them a lot. I even have a few dolls that were so special to me growing up, that I wanted to keep and give to my children. Unfortunately we lost them in a move and I am still so sad about it. But ya know, I was a happy kid all around. My toys werent the cause for my happiness, but they also didn't make me feel sad and empty. I had loving parents (despite of divorce) a lot of siblings, and some good friends.

Limiting toys is generally a good thing for a lot of reasons. But, you can still have a happy child, or a sad child, or an angry child, regardless of how many toys you have.


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

I definitely have an issue with getting rid of toys that I bought myself, or that my mom bought for DS. For example, DS really liked this spinny toy at ECFE (parenting class) and my mom wanted to buy him a toy, so I told her he liked this thing, and she bought it (in retrospect, i should have asked for a book or told her he didn't need anything). Now, we have it, he isn't really interested in it anymore, and it is kind of big, but she only bought it a month ago and she paid 10$ for it- becuase I told her to get it. So i feel bad getting rid of it.

My IL's on the other hand, i would have no problem tossing the utter crap they buy us, but my husband feels guilty about tossing that stuff (even though he admits it is total crap).

I guess the moral of the story is that we both need to get over the guilt and just toss/regift this stuff.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SuzyLee* 
I guess the moral of the story is that we both need to get over the guilt and just toss/regift this stuff.

Yes, because once it is out of your life, you forget about it! If someone asks about it, say "DS grew bored of it. You know how kids are. So we gave it to a child without much, and now it is being used a lot!"


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)




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## boatbaby (Aug 30, 2004)

Hi there
My friends call me the Toy Police! Yes it's true.

I am the one who doesn't give a poop who gave us the gift, if it's a crappy plastic/ commercial/ battery operated toy... it goes away. Period.

As I look around the room at DS's toys (all scattered at my feet) here's what I see.
- A pile of rocks/ seashells/ coconut shells
- wooden gnomes
- buckets and shovels, old boxes, various kitchen items he's overtaken
- various toy animals
- playsilks, playsilks, playsilks
- wooden stacking rainbow
- plain wooden train, truck, pirate ship
- a handful wooden play people
- beanbags, blocks, and instruments
- a toy rocketship

That's it. Seriously. And you want to know what he plays with the most? The animals and the rocks/shells/playsilks. Imaginative play ALL DAY when we're not out playing in the dirt/sand.

Yes we live on a boat so space is severely limited, but it goes to show you, if you make a choice not to have crappy toys, if you take a stand and give your family a "wish list" to make sure you don't get crappy toys, if you decide to truly only keep open ended toys at home... it's amazing how they will make do with what they have. That's what kids did for thousands of years and what many children all over the world do. It doesn't mean your child doesn't have fun, or doesn't get great gifts on their birthday. It just means you may have to put some more thought and effort in to it.

And yes... BOOKS BOOKS BOOKS are the ultimate. My 3 year old begs for me to read to him and happily listen to a 165 page chapter book with only a handful of sketched pictures in one sitting.


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## boigrrrlwonder (Jan 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smalls181* 
Yes, because once it is out of your life, you forget about it! If someone asks about it, say "DS grew bored of it. You know how kids are. So we gave it to a child without much, and now it is being used a lot!"

I love that - and will have to remember that.


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## woaters (Oct 5, 2007)

Great thread.....We recently did a drastic toy purge.....well not a purge,but a "hide" EVERY toy was gone...he was left with only his craft centre.
Now, it happened partly as an experiment and partly as a desperate consequence for DS's behaviour (but that is a different story)
Anyway.......Once the toys were gone, not only did DS not ask for them, but he was the most delightful little boy without them!
So, here I am with closets full of toys!

Now we are able to slowly go through them and decide which ones will be leaving our family.......

I am pretty lucky and all grandparents are understanding about "junk" toys


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

I think I found my home.

I'm expecting my first any day now and I'm struggling to keep the plastic MIC junk out of my house already. I'm nervous whats going to happen once the baby is actually born & the family finds out the gender.

zoebird - I feel like I could have written your posts (if I were only so eloquent & collected)

My biggest problem at the moment is with my mom & aunt. My uncle is not well and in a rehab facility (long term) so they've been going out "shopping for the baby" to take their minds off things. When I talk to my mom about it she just says "well you're the only happy thought we have right now so just let us have our fun". Then I feel extra guilty & the money wasted makes me want to cry (the crying part could just be pregnancy hormones







). But I have to get rid of this stuff!

Reading through this thread really helps remind me that the Circo stuffed turtle that replays a recording of my aunt's voice saying "who loves the baby" (a family 'game' to teach names) is not important - and in fact, if I get rid of it now, there will be more space in our lives for my aunt to ACTUALLY play the game and develop a lasting relationship & memories. You just can't substitute that.

I'm subbing. I know it will be a lot easier to keep on top of this from the beginning. Hopefully by the time my DC is old enough to actually care about toys, I'll have figured out how to set the boundaries with family.


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xekomaya* 
I'm subbing. I know it will be a lot easier to keep on top of this from the beginning. Hopefully by the time my DC is old enough to actually care about toys, I'll have figured out how to set the boundaries with family.

I WISH that I would have had the same mindset about toys that I have now when my children were born! Now I am stuck with this giant purge, and I am having to retrain how my family members buy gifts!









My children are a little attatched to a few toys that I would LOVE to get rid of..How should I handle this? My dd is 4.5 and I think that I have her figured out since she REALLY wants a waldorf doll. But my ds is 3 and another story! He loves this little plastic racetrack, that you push a buttoon, and the track spins and plays obnoxious music







What would you do?
Thanks!


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mumkenna&lucas* 
I WISH that I would have had the same mindset about toys that I have now when my children were born! Now I am stuck with this giant purge, and I am having to retrain how my family members buy gifts!









My children are a little attatched to a few toys that I would LOVE to get rid of..How should I handle this? My dd is 4.5 and I think that I have her figured out since she REALLY wants a waldorf doll. But my ds is 3 and another story! He loves this little plastic racetrack, that you push a buttoon, and the track spins and plays obnoxious music







What would you do?
Thanks!

Is it still complete with all the cars and track pieces? Is there a battery to wear out or take out? Can you replace it with something you are more comfortable (like a trip to a racetrack







). This is the type of toy that wouldn't last long for my children and I would pass it along shortly when they grew bored by it.

I got really good at opening all my children's presents ahead of time and purging things out before they saw them. Dp has one aunt that would send giant boxes to each child, all individually wrapped junk. I would spend days unwrapping it in my spare moments, return most all of it for pennies at Kmart and Walmart, and then replace it with something like gymnastic classes or whatever the money would buy. I then would write one collective ty note teling her how generous she was and her taking the time to think of us meant so much. I was able to retrain my mil though but some people are very stubborn. If you don't think the toy is toxic and it is nip you could donate to the many drives around the holidays.

As for the giant purge, I am always purging it seems. Things just happen to us. We attended a fundraiser dinner but didn't bid on any of the baskets so an elderly neighbor bid and won a Marilyn Monroe barbie doll for my girls. They thanked her, played with it for two days and set it aside. After a bit of it never coming out I put it in the goodwill bag I always have going, they didn't notice for a couple of weeks, and now it is gone. I tend to remove things in stages just in case someone is attached to something or let them take it to the pool/sandbox where it gets destroyed. Dp tends to have a very frank discusssion and never bring the item into the house. No one but us have ever missed anything we have purged. Dp wishes he had his class notes from undergrad and I wish I had the kelty kids backpack I gave away after baby #3.


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## BlessedOne (Apr 22, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mercy589* 
Yes, DD has two baby dolls and I find myself hoping that no one ever gives her another because she already has her precious baby!

I find it hard to get rid of stuffed animals - so and so brought this to the hospital when dd was born, and so forth. How do you handle that? Not to mention dh and I both have several boxes in the basement because our parents did that for us. old stuffed animals I can't part with. sigh.

I know EXACTLY what you mean.............sigh


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

Just bumping us back up!!
We are preparing for our 1st birthday party that we have sent out requests for no toys, so we will see what happens! My ds's 3rd birthday party is Sunday!


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## Purple Sage (Apr 23, 2007)

Great thread!

We're currently doing a major purge in preparation for our move. This thread is a great source of inspiration and motivation.

Thanks!


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mumkenna&lucas* 
Just bumping us back up!!
We are preparing for our 1st birthday party that we have sent out requests for no toys, so we will see what happens! My ds's 3rd birthday party is Sunday!

Let us know how it goes! I'd love to hear what people's reactions were. Also if you don't mind, how did you phrase it on the invitation? Are you asking for something else like a donation to charity?


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## mumkenna&lucas (Aug 29, 2007)

I ended up wording it.. We are very appreciative of everyones generosity but would like to ask for a toy-free party. If you wish to buy gifts, Luke is in need of 3t clothes, books and money to go towards a zoo membership. Thanks for your understanding (not word for word but pretty close







)

Well, parties are over. My family did REALLY well! They never complained or anything and my Mom even said that she wished she wold have limited the toys that went into our house. Ds received a bunch of clothes, some art pencils, a clock, some cd's, and $$ for our zoo membership. Pretty good! Now dh's side was a totally different story..a toy gun







that has disappeared already, a ton of plastic cars and a giant plastic car to store them in, a bunch of plastic dollar store sippy cups, and a skateboard.


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## Aithne (Jan 8, 2008)

I've been lurking for a while and finally decided to sub. I agree with many of the posts that I've seen so far and while we won't be completely toy-free, I have been extremely selective of what toys have been (and will be) brought into the house. Although I do feel a slight luxury in being able to start with all of this before the first baby is born (due end of July) and not having to have toys "disappear".

I think the issues with excessive lead in kids toys is going to be my "in" point, at least with the in-laws. If I can use that as a justification for our choices (and reasoning) to them maybe they'll follow. However, these are still the people who gave both DH and I "things" for Christmas rather than the gift certs. that we had asked for (for our new house) because "it's no fun if you don't have things under the tree to unwrap"







. So we'll see how it goes.

I also really liked the idea for a toy-free party and I'm really impressed to see how well it worked out! I'll probably try that once the baby gets here too.







Thanks for the idea!


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

yeah, the lead issue is big with toys, and for clothes, talking about formaldehyde and stuff has been helpful. now everyone is 'on board' with the organics.


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mumkenna&lucas* 
..a toy gun







that has disappeared already, a ton of plastic cars and a giant plastic car to store them in, a bunch of plastic dollar store sippy cups, and a skateboard.

a gun and a skateboard!?! for a 3 year old? Yikes. Good to hear it worked out with one side of the family though - that's a start for sure! I'm going to keep your wording in mind when we have to deal with parties and family events... People know our preference for organics/natural fiber but tend to ignore it & justify with "but I couldn't find a natural material that was so easy to clean" or something ...

Well, my baby is *almost* 48 hours old and we're still toy free







Not exactly a huge accomplishment but we've gotta start somewhere


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Awww, congrats on your new little one!!!


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

xekomaya: How sweet! Congratulations!

Here are my recent thoughts . . .
(1) More than even my DC going along with at least LESS toys, I think it's important that your DP share your mindset. I feel like I might have to wake up in the middle of the night to get rid of what no one plays with so that even DH won't see!
(2) I brought some toys down to the basement for our upcoming garage sale. The kids found it the next day, and of course, wanted to bring it back upstairs. True to form, they played with the toys for a few MINUTES and that was that. It's going back down again and then out the door.
(3) DD got some high quality wooden toys (or at least expensive) from relatives for her b-day. Within the first week, 3 of the toys had some broken pieces! Ack. One piece was broken right out of the box, and my girls are not hard on toys at all when they do play with them. My relatives really do try VERY hard to buy the kids nice things when they buy, but I wish I could just say, seriously . . .no more.
(4) I look around our playroom and see that most of the toys we have are gifts. I wish I could go back to the giftgivers and give them the money back they spent.


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

What brand of toys were they? (The expensive broken ones.)


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

Mizelenius- my DH is the same way. I got him onboard with getting rid of a few toys that DS isn't interested in. I sorted out the toys while he was at work, and then mentioned to him that there was a pile of toys for goodwill. He suddenly decides these are perfectly good toys, and why would we get rid of them when DS LOVES them! LOL, he loves them for 10 seconds when you dangle it in front of his face. He loves anything for 10 seconds. So they are still going out, but under protest from DH.

I have a constant battle against DH about stuff in general. I don't know why (we both grew up poor) but DH won't get rid of anything that still has *some* use left in it- so he ends up with a closet full of junk tshirts with stains because he could always use them for yardwork. When we started dating he ahd hot pink gym shorts that his mom had bought for him that he ahd never worn (because you know, they were pink) but since they were _perfectly good_ he couldn't just throw them away.

That is totally off topic, but I have to fight through DH to get rid of DS's toys.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

We had a mom-2-mom sale last weekend and got rid of so many toys! It feels so great to have all of that stuff out of our lives. And now that there is less in her room, I see her playing much more "imaginatively" (I dont think that is a word.







) Lately, her favorite "toy" has been her flower hair clips.

Oh, and we are about to move across the state, so packing up her room has been a piece of cake!


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## gilamama (Aug 9, 2005)

hi. i like this thread. after reading a little i said to my dd lets go into your room and look for toys you dontplay with to give away she was all game but i thought of one doll and that was it. my kids play with what we have. which is much less than everyone we know in america but seems like more than everyone we know here in Israel.

the only thing ty really dont play with are their drawer of puppets and the puppet theater it is not such a big one to really take up space. bu they are such "creative" toys that i dont want to get rid of them. thoughts? they really hardly ever ever play with tham.

ETA did the OP ever come back? i read the first few pages and the last but not the middle.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gilamama* 

ETA did the OP ever come back? i read the first few pages and the last but not the middle.

Yes, I'm here, very grateful for everybody's insight and input, and still toy-free at four months!!!









I guess that's not technically true, since we still have the beautiful cherry wood rattle he doesn't use (yet) and I did some closet decluttering and realized just how much I had saved from my older kids' childhoods. Most of it wound up going to the dump this time around, largely because I don't want Terran to become a toy- addict but also because I was just plain ready to let go of it. I didn't see "Jeanita's orangutan" any more, I saw a worn piece of fake fur with stuffing falling out of it. THose aren't "Christopher's Power Rangers" at all and they never were; they're just hunks of plastic invisibly offgassing.

It's nice to have a less cluttered house and room in the closets for things we actually use.

I'll really be needing the support when I have to refuse gifts, but that hasn't happened yet. I do know that if I had kept the "memory boxes", I would have needed to rent a storage room by now and probably would have needed to put Terran in daycare to pay for it.


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

nak

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
Yes, I'm here, very grateful for everybody's insight and input, and still toy-free at four months!!!








.

yay!

We're doing okay here at 3 weeks. People are starting to give him lots of stuffed animals that need to find a new home along with the bottles & paci's from diaper cakes that showed up after he was born..

Does anyone ever struggle with liking a toy more than your child? Wyatt received a stuffed giraffe that is just so darn cute I'm having a hard time getting rid of it. I am going to, with the rest of them, but I know this isn't the last time this will come up. What do you do?


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

I am lucky that 2 friends of mine are pregnant, and I left the tags on a lot of the stuffed animals DS got, so they are being regifted! (I tell people when I regift- that way they won't feel bad about tossing them if they want to).

DS did get this really cute stuffed lion that a good friend of mine lovingly picked out, that he doesn't care for- what to do? I don't know.

I am really struggling right now with toys/animals from when I was a kid. My mom saved about 5 dolls and animals, and they are not in great shape (played with a lot) and I feel bad tossing them- but what are we ever going to do with my nasty looking plastic doll that feels sticky no matter how much I scrub at it? I wouldn't want DS playing with it. It is collecting dust on a shelf in his room right now. I guess I know the answer after reading what I typed- it all needs to go to either the trash or my mom's house if she wants it.


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## StoriesInTheSoil (May 8, 2008)

I'll join this! DS is due Aug. 1 and while we're not planning on being COMPLETELY toy-free, we have some pretty strict guidelines on what's allowed and what isn't.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

i'm starting to notice how gentle ds's hands are; he doesn't "bat at" toys or try to "grab" them, the way his agemates are described as doing. such violent words! since ds is more likely to touch something that has nerve endings than not, his developmental milestone is expressing itself as wanting to hold my finger, rub or gently pat my cheeks, or catch my braid and give it a light tug to get my attention.

i am finding that people just "don't get it" irl, so i'm going to have to come up with some stratgies for avoiding unwanted gifts. I was bragging about his gentle hands to a childless coworker who is particularly fond of him and mentioning that I thought it was because we don't do toys, and she rep[lied, incredulously, "But what about wooden ones? They're okay, aren't they?" and another friend who is definitely in the "toy light" camp was teasing me about "protecting him from the dangerous evil toys".

I'm used to being the weirdo by now. So far my little radical experiment is a success and my four month old is a delightful baby instead of a "consumer".


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## expat-mama (May 28, 2008)

I'm so fascinated to hear all of this... it's nice to hear about families making efforts to help our children avoid catching the consuming/materialism sickness that plagues us! I'm gonna join you in this movemenr as soon as my little one arrives.









subbing...


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## Enudely (Jul 2, 2005)

dh and I were talking about doing a sweep and getting rid of most of our toys, or at least putting them in boxes in the garage at first. They just clutter up our house and dd barely plays with them! She mostly plays with her dollhouse, tea set and stuffed animals


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

Limiting toys is a great first step. You will be surprised at how much of your money and time you have spent on toys - thinking about them, worrying about safety, stepping on them, picking them up, arguing about appropriateness (with older children/grandparents/spouses), finding places to put them away, organizing, etc.

This is all time you could spend with your children.

I had different reasons coming into this than the op but her posts have been very thought provoking.


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## eccomama (Oct 6, 2005)

i struggle cuz at my place we only have wooden toys or soft things to play with. lots of outdoor play and she attends montessori. ocassional dvd's, no tv, no movies in theater. but at her dad's house it's a free for all so it's hard to keep it under control especially when he sneaks crap into her backpack.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i'm really happy with our minimalism.

i still haven't purchased a single thing for the baby. so far, we have one onsie and one gown thingy. our baby shower is on Sunday, and most of whta i chose were only the things that i wanted. I don't know what i'm going to get, but i think it's going to work out well.

as far as i can tell, no one has purchased any toys at all.







so, that's great.


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## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

I know someone IRL who literally has NO toys and boys ages 13,8,6,2. They are the most imaginitve creative boys I have ever met.

They spend their days in the garden leaarning about worms, and composting, and growing....playing with sticks (there is NO limit with sticks!) and making little toys out of paper and modeling clay.

I have honestly never met such happy kids in my life.

I am seriously considering going "no toy"

Not sure if I will be 100% yet but who knows! I plan to let it evolve, as it already has begun.

The other day my ds made a "web" in the backyard with a roll of string I gave him, he is 5. He also has started findign wood to play with in the garagge.


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

When we were little, we made spider webs with yarn all the time! Once that was the main activity at my birthday party. All the kids loved it.

Our neightbor biys (elem. school) have a really nice play structure, and 90% of the time they play with sticks. Waste of 1000$ there.

I am still having a really hard time getting rid of toys that were gifts from people I care about. I know how much money they spent and I just can't do it! Ahhh.... I may just box them up. That way I don't have the guilt of throwing them out.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Now that we are out in the country, I see how absolutely IN LOVE with nature my little girl is. Every walk we go on, by the time we get home, we have a bag full of pine cones, flowers, rocks, sticks.... at 27 months olds, my daughters talks about dandelions, daisies, lupins, buttercups, lilacs, forget me nots, and "the pretty orange flower" that we dont have a name for yet. Oh, and the "peach flower" because it smells like a peach.









We still have most of her toys packed away from the move. She has started an obsession with Care Bears and Ponies that we have found second hand. I dont mind them as much, because its not that she has seen them on TV, or any advertisements. She just loves animals, and for some reason, has taken a special liking to these.

But the nature thing is really cool. I cant wait to get into our place so we can have a "nature table" set up some place. I bet that will absolutely thrill dd.


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## Anodyne (Jan 31, 2006)

I am interested in limiting or no toys. My problem really comes down to me. I got rid of more then half our toys and then just replaced them with more expensive natural toys. I think I have a materialistic problem. I don't want to pass it on though. I really would love to have dolls and building materials and a little kitchen and call it good. But then I go out and buy cars and airplanes and picnic baskets. Anyways maybe a tribe like this will help me break the toy habit.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Well, Terran's five months old now.

Since we never even started buying toys and pushing him to "play" with them , it feels very natural to me to just keep on living and I am quite jarred by seeing pictures of other kids his age surrounded by brightly coloured plastic. I'm even more annoyed by mainstream web pages about child development where every other word seems to be "toy" and found a very resonant article at the natural child project (scroll down to where he talks about consumerism) that describes my own experiences, as a downwardly mobile adult with an upper-middle class whitebread suburban background.

I mentioned upthread how gentle my son's hands are compared to other kids his age. I have seen this intensifying over the past month as he gains fine motor control. His favourite game now is to gaze lovingly into my eyes, put one hand gently on either side of my face, and bring it towards him for a "big wet sloppy baby kiss". He will do this spontaneously and also (usually) when I ask him, "Can I please have a big wet sloppy baby kiss?"

I still find myself ridiculed or misunderstood whenever I bring toy-freeness up or brag about him irl and I still find myself having difficulty keeping my mouth shut about how successful my "little experiment" is going so far. Since I do work outside the home, it is SO NICE not to have to spend time away from my baby while I pick up his toys, shop for toys, etc.

I'm still wondering how I'm going to react the first time somebody shoves a piece of plastic or cheap polyester fur in his face and starts squealing "Look at the BUNNY! The BUNNY wants you to play with it! LOVE the bunny! HUG the bunny! HUG the bunny!"

Will I reframe and rename the situation? Will I use words like "pillow", "Polyester", and "foam rubber" to describe stuffed animals? Will I change the focus to the positive intent of the person, i.e. "Susan seems really excited about that pillow. She must really like you to want to share her pillow with you. Do you think she would like a big wet sloppy baby kiss?"

Will I say something offensive and "weird" or will I cave and find myself buying a power rangers action figure every week again to keep another seven year old from throwing another tantrum in another store?

Will I tell the dentist ahead of time that we don't do toys so Terran won't be needing his "goodie bag" after his cleaning? If I'm open about this (or if we get caught) will CPS be called? If so, how will they react?

How can something so simple as not buying a consumer product be so revolutionary?


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## Theia (Oct 30, 2007)

Hi NOS. Subbing. Will have to come back later to read up on this. Thanks!


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

Thanks for the update noordinaryspider.

Your reasoning and journey is so thoughtful I am following attentively.

Have you looked at Committee for a Commercial Free Childhood? (CCFC) I know you are doing no toys but the way the marketing pervades and invades a child's life is incredible.


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## patrickq (Feb 8, 2008)

noordinaryspider, you are an inspiration, thanks for keeping us updated.

It is fascinating how one can change one's views, just a case of trying to make sure one doesn't get stuck with an opinion for no valid reason. As I've read more about toys in the last 3 months, I've found my feelings shifting and really don't like the idea of 'toys', but sometimes wonder if it makes me some kind of weird authoritarian parent ... the answer, of course, is 'no', it is a case of following what I/we believe to be the best for our little one (due in a few weeks!), despite the fact that it is contrary to general practice.

It is fascinating to hear developments you have noticed so far, so please keep posting about Terran's toy free world


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
I'm still wondering how I'm going to react the first time somebody shoves a piece of plastic or cheap polyester fur in his face and starts squealing "Look at the BUNNY! The BUNNY wants you to play with it! LOVE the bunny! HUG the bunny! HUG the bunny!"


This happened to us at 6 weeks..I was sorting through some gifts and making a return pile, and my mom thought the placement of a stuffed bear must be a mistake. I said that it wasn't, that he didn't need it.. she feigned shock, asking him if he wanted it and waved it in his face. I wasn't sure how I'd react myself - wondering if I'd feel angry at some innocence lost - but in the moment it just felt so sad. It was really tragic to watch a tiny newborn trying to make eye contact with his grandmother, while she did everything she could to distract him from her.

In the future, I plan to stop those situations by explaining that it is better for W to learn about the person. I would tell them that he'd rather get to know them as a person, their face, their movement, their voice - and suggest they make some faces, sing a song, etc. I do recall that it can be hard for people who haven't been around children in a while to remember what can draw a smile, and I want to be sensitive to the fact that they may not know how to interact without props.

Very interesting article btw, thanks for posting. I really liked this:

Quote:

Perhaps there will come a time when the early years of motherhood will be regarded as an enlightened and proper endeavor for a woman to engage in full time for a period in her life. Perhaps there will come a time when a woman will be viewed as a better person for having experienced the total nurturing of her infant and toddler. We have already experienced a similar shift in perception toward the college student. An individual going to college for a number of years is no longer thought to be opting out of the system or buckling under it; such an individual is now perceived as moving toward the betterment of his or her capacity to earn money, to become a more widely educated person, to become a better contributor to society.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

we were given only 4 toys for the baby's shower a couple of weeks ago. well, we were given two more, but those are right out into the donation pile. i can return the others--though i was given two lovely wooden toys that we'll keep (grabbing toys/rattle).

so far, we're doing well. my husband and i have our own toys, which we are going to 'give' to the baby. it's not many, but we do have a few stuffed animals and of course my husband has his action figure collection, which are not really 'toys' to him.


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## Mizelenius (Mar 22, 2003)

Neat idea . . .

My DD went to Camp Invention and loved it . . .she does that kind of thing on her own at home, but there she had a far wider range of tools. Anyway, it just so happened that my sister gave me an article showing how to set up an idea lab at home. I suggested we turn our playroom into this (as I said, the girls rarely play w/toys), but DH doesn't like that. So, I'm going to do it in our basement. It's just what you'd think-- pegboards on the walls, work table, tools, recycled items, etc.

Thought the members on this thread would appreciate the idea!


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## zoshamosha (Apr 15, 2006)

Subbing here!

I love the idea. I don't think I will go totally toy-free, there are some toys around here that get lots of use, but not many!

But I have a couple questions for you toy-free people:

1) Are your kids on board with being toy-free? Clearly, they must notice that other kids have toys and that toys exist. Do they not bug you to the point of death?

and

2) When you are invited to a b-day party and gifts are expected, what do you bring? Before I was enlightened, I gave people junky plastic toys sometimes, but now never. What are your thoughts?


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TeresaZofia* 

1) Are your kids on board with being toy-free? Clearly, they must notice that other kids have toys and that toys exist. Do they not bug you to the point of death?

and

2) When you are invited to a b-day party and gifts are expected, what do you bring? Before I was enlightened, I gave people junky plastic toys sometimes, but now never. What are your thoughts?


Well, we were in the same DDC (with my first) so neither of these have really come up yet..

1) We intend to home school and keep ds TV free. I want to try and keep his childhood as commercial free as possible, and educate him on advertising very early as my parents did for me. We made a game of analyzing commercials that we did see and talking about how they tried to make you want the item, and that kinda killed the "i want that" bug. I don't really remember begging for much that I wouldn't let Wyatt have. I do remember begging for sporting equipment, paints and later, books - as well as to do stuff like go to the park and ride bikes or play basketball.

2)Probably the same things I give to nieces & nephews now. Art supplies, soccer balls.. I'm blanking but I know I find acceptable things to give them at Christmas that are not exactly "toys"

I've been thinking a lot about the value of a "toy" lately, and I'm having a lot of trouble spitting out what I'm trying to say...

I think kids need an abundance of raw materials for imaginative play. It doesn't matter if its all the sticks, leaves and rocks they can find outside, the pots & pans in your kitchen, your clothes. I've been wondering if the whole abundance of toys developed with people being afraid to let kids play with "their" things.

Its so much more useful for kids to experience real life objects - what intrinsic value does a buzz lightyear have? But you can learn so much about your environment by interacting with real life objects, and that experience can help gradually transition to real life skills. It lets you take ownership in your world and adjust better as person.

In some sense, if you're practicing cooking in a fake kitchen, your imitation is essentially wasted when you try and use the real kitchen, but if you're sitting on the floor with a real mixing bowl and spoons, when it comes time to bake a cake there is very little you haven't practiced....

Its so much more than that but I just can't find words. I wish I could find a way to get it out so I'd have an easier time explaining it to people. Anyone see where I'm going & have any thoughts? I guess the two big concepts I want to identify are "yours vs. ours" and the additional developmental value of using "real" objects rather than being confined to "toys"...


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## LauraReaux (Oct 21, 2006)

It has taken me entirely too long to read this entire thread, but I love it! My husband and I definitely feel like less is more more than we ever did. Last week we actually got rid of over half of our kids' toys (I already purge toys at least 3x a year) and the kids are noticeably playing more. I think they were overwhelmed with what they had everywhere. We organized what we do have now, and only one is electronic (my oldest loves it & uses it a LOT - to learn spelling). I'm still hoping to get rid of a few sets over the next few months.

Within the next few days I'm going to email family and close friends who will be invited to the kids' birthday parties. My oldest 2 share a party & it's in 3 months. So I want to give them a fair warning that we don't want traditional toys. We're going to give alternate ideas: zoo or children's museum membership, book store gift cards, books, & my personal favorite - shop on etsy! We would LOVE any handmade gift from etsy. We order things from there all the time... love that it's homemade, love that you can get great natural/organic/vegan items and that we're supporting small businesses.

I love this thread. It feels so great to "meet" other Moms who have similar views to mine.


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## mum21andtwins (Nov 8, 2007)

subbing to read when babies are asleep Thanks for starting this!


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

I have subbed to this thread and even posted a few times but it has been awhile since I have read anything. I need to go back and read all the wonderful ideas for birthday parties and such. Jacob has a birthday in sept and would love to use some of these ideas he is three and a half will be four so my ? for you moms is how do you make it fun for a four year old whose mom wants to go toy free. How do we do that. He loves dinosaurs so for christmas we got him dino books and movies and clothes would that be a good idea for birthday too. (oh and some still got him toys but that was before I could get to them and talk to them that we didnt want toys at all this year) I do love the membership idea and there is a science museum but I think that might be a little advanced for him right know. The zoo here is free but I think you can still be a member by donating money to the zoo hmmm these are great ideas. I will have to go back and readall the post again. Wish me luck it might take awhile.







:


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## Lovin' It (Jun 7, 2006)

I'm with you all on this one. I limit what we have not so much b/c it's a toy, but too many are overwhelming to my dd. If it gets to be too much it seems nothing gets played with.

As far as birthdays for her have gone toys haven't been a problem mainly b/c we haven't thrown her parties. She thinks of birthdays/anniversaries to be time to spend with family. This last birthday (3 yo) we took her on a sea animal tour, it was her first time on a boat. We went pretty far out and saw a pod of about 50 dolphins. Mamas, papas, and babies. We took lots of pictures and put them in her album. We also went to the aquarium afterwards. My dh was working across the country and flew in just for the occasion so it was all super special. We tend to make our wed anniv a family event day too. I figure as she gets older she'll want parties and to spend the times with friends, so why not get in all the family time I can in now?

Holidays we buy one big "toy". The 1st year after turning 1 was a red wagon. The next year was a nice wooden children's table and chairs set that has cubbies and will last for a long, long time. This past year, b/c of financial reasons we just gave her alot of books. I got a killer deal so there were actually quite a few. She instisted each book be read upon opening so we opened presents in shifts b/c it took all day. She actually spent more time reading that day than checking out any of the toys her grandparents gave her.









Her favorite toys are babies (I am so thrilled when she nurses and comforts them!) and kitchen stuff (my mom bought her a set of pans/accessories that are made of the same material the real stuff would be just smaller). Although she has been cooking from a very early age (dh is a chef) and loves doing the real thing she also likes to make pretend food in her "kitchen" (usually the coffee table) with her tools that are just her size. "This is my size!" comes out of her alot. Oh and how could I forget the tea set. Uses that more than anything. Throws tea parties daily.

She has been given more toys than I'd like, so I am always decluttering (some days I feel like chucking the whole lot knowing it will all accumulate again), but I'm proud to say that when I look around her room that I can count on one hand the toys we've purchased. Which the money we've saved has enabled us to do the event days and "big toy" purchases. My family knows I'm picky and for the most part has chosen wisely in their gifts to her. My MIL has a doctorate in child dev which sometimes is super irritating, but as far as toys goes is a good thing.

This year I've become a SAHM







: so we'll be asking for gymnastic/dance class money and museum memberships since we no longer can afford them and they mean so much to her.

Sorry, I just read what I wrote and it's sooooo long.







Oh well.


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## zoshamosha (Apr 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xekomaya* 
I think kids need an abundance of raw materials for imaginative play. It doesn't matter if its all the sticks, leaves and rocks they can find outside, the pots & pans in your kitchen, your clothes. I've been wondering if the whole abundance of toys developed with people being afraid to let kids play with "their" things.


This is a really interesting point. DD has (all gifts btw) toy cell phones, plastic Barbie high-heeled shoes (and earrings and tiara, ugh), even a toy "purse" that comes with a toy stuff (wallet, hankie, etc...) you can rummage through. None of those things are fun at all, because the whole point when you're a kid is to learn about your parents' stuff, not cheap knock-offs.

I get that it can be frustrating to find your LO making calls on your cell phone or tearing through your wallet, but I don't think handing them a talking Dora phone is really going to squelch that desire to get their hands on your stuff anyway.


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

Miz:

Thanks for the link. i love the idea of having space to simply create and invent.

----

_1) Are your kids on board with being toy-free? Clearly, they must notice that other kids have toys and that toys exist. Do they not bug you to the point of death?_

my child is still in utero, and therefore doesn't know that toys exist.

growing up, i had a lot of toys, but not as many toys as many of my friends. in discussing this with my mother for a bit, she pointed out tht we were more likely to simply play outside or just do creative activities (art, reading, etc), instead of play with toys.

there were toys that we wanted, but not many. so, i think it is possible to have a kid who doesn't consume.

_
2) When you are invited to a b-day party and gifts are expected, what do you bring? Before I was enlightened, I gave people junky plastic toys sometimes, but now never. What are your thoughts?_

personally, i bring home made creative gifts. for example, i'll put together ingredients in a jar for cookies or soup or something like this that can be a project. i also like to give art supplies.

i prefer things that are consumable, and i tend to think that children like projects. i could be wrong, but it's gone over big with parents at a least.

of course, i'm not often invited to children's parties at this time--just a few family friends and most of those children are under 10.


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## amygabrielle (Jun 25, 2006)

Dd1 LOVES old wallets, cell phones, purses, and keys. Dh and I give her any old cards we don't need any more, like the discount cards from grocery stores. She gets tons of play out of them. Pair the wallet and purse with a pencil and a very small notebook for writing "notes" and she's in heaven.


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## zoshamosha (Apr 15, 2006)

What do you guys think about costumes/dress up stuff?

DD is obsessed with dress-up--mainly tutus and princess dresses. She does not love the lovely dresses we buy her, she loves the plasticky cinderella dresses from Target and the Halloween Superstore







They are awfully unattractive, but she looooooves them. They seem to be toy-ish in nature, but they also serve a utilitarian function in that they are actual clothes that she wears. She also loves fairy wings

Since she is such a girlie-girl, people do buy her a lot of actual toy dress up stuff that drives me insane--plastic Tiaras and fake clip-on earings, etc... It is hideous. These are actually not beloved at all, thank god!

Lately, however, she's become interested in "making" her own dresses out of blankets and playsilks that she ties around her body. She also loves trying to wear my clothes and jewelry. For her birthday I'm going to get her a trunk-full of shiny, sparkly, fabulous fabrics to tie on herself. I can also help her sew the fabric into home-made skirts and dresses (nothing too fancy, I can't really sew







).


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i think the idea of getting various fabrics is really fun. kids love to make costumes, and that's a good way to do it. it's live action role playing, similar to using dolls.


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## amygabrielle (Jun 25, 2006)

dd1 LOVES playsilks and any kind of dress up dresses. I think it's a great form of imaginary play.


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

My most beloved dress up clothes growing up were my mom's old bridesmaid dresses.


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## accountclosed2 (May 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
NOS:

as a new, first-time mom (20 weeks pg tomorrow!), i'm curious to know what you have and use for your baby during these first months. i really only want to purchase (or have purchased for me) that which i will use.

most of my friends and such assert that they have a lot of stuff, most of it not used, and some of it even turned over to consignment unused! that's such a waste of time, money, and space to me!

so, if you could let me know, that would be awesome.









Zoebird, this is what we have used so far for our 20 week old:

Toys:

- Nothing before 3 mths
- Small stuffed sheep
- 2 teddybears (not much use yet)
- plain wood rattle
- "Horton hears a who" boardbook (favourite toy!)
- Books

Clothes:

Much less than we thought and what anyone suggested! Used more tops once she started slobbering, but that's all. Lots of dribble bibs. And disposables. For a lot of reasons we have ended up using them, despite not thinking we would. (we do EC anyway). Lots of nappy squares for everything except nappies!!! And BabyLegs legwarmers are great in a sling! We use Storchenwiege wrap, which is fantastic. Also using the Mountain Buggy much more than expected(it was given to us second hand, but my daughter sleeps in it every day). Carseat (it is illegal not to use appropriate carseats for under-5's here). And an old-fashioned bouncer, as LO hated being on the ground for the first 3 months! The best advice (if it was us) would be get some disposables (Tushies, Moltex etc are eco-friendly, and good for baby), and maybe a few clothnappies, maybe different types, to try. We have loads of nappies that we'll never use, because they just didn't work for us, an enourmous waste of money! Also get some kimono tops, some socks, a matinee coat and hat, and a night gown. That got us through the first month!

I have just ordered a few teething pegs and a couple of playsilks, but I think she needs more, as she is into everything.

Any ideas anyone? We want to keep plastic out as much as possible, and I really don't like the musical toys that do all sort of things for you (the worst ever: a plastic tractor with trailer. with farmer and three farm animals, which would play Old Macdonald had a Farm when the characters where pushed down in it, or yell something about the animals, but worse, would suddenly, if left for an hour or so, call out "Where is everybody?"). We have concerns about phtalates and BPA in plastic anyway. Also careful with paints on wooden toys etc. What about bath toys?


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## clothmumma (Jun 25, 2008)

Hi everyone, I want to join in! We have toys, but 99% given to us, and what we have bought is wooden, and buildable. We dont buy toys for birthdays or xmas, we buy real life things, such as brooms, household items etc


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

welcome clothmumma it is great you found this thread. I know I have enjoyed it.

Ladies last week we went to the zoo and had lots of fun but we also picked up membership info for Jacobs birthday and adopt an animal for the kids too for either birthdays or christmas. I am getting Evan a library card for his sixth birthday. Jacob will have to wait till he is six. I just thought that wold make great gifts for them.


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## clothmumma (Jun 25, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *clothdipemomof2boy* 
welcome clothmumma it is great you found this thread. I know I have enjoyed it.

Ladies last week we went to the zoo and had lots of fun but we also picked up membership info for Jacobs birthday and adopt an animal for the kids too for either birthdays or christmas. I am getting Evan a library card for his sixth birthday. Jacob will have to wait till he is six. I just thought that wold make great gifts for them.

I was thinking about getting a year pass to one of the animal sanctuarys near me too....might actually do this


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## foodmachine (Jul 17, 2008)

Great stuff. DD is 6 months old and I need the support NOW to keep the commercial stuff at bay. We don't have TV and already my MIL is saying I'll have to get TV for DD "of course". It is so easy to get sucked into thinking LO's "need" stuff.

But what about backyard swings, climbing stuff, slides etc? I figure if we have these things DD's friends will come here rather than she going else where?
Will our kids want to play at so and so's because so and so has TV, lots of toys, etc?

And we are all obviously on our computers part of the day. What about computer games?

There's so much to consider.

Btw what is a "Bilibo" and what does "MIC" stand for?


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## foodmachine (Jul 17, 2008)

forgot to sub


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *foodmachine* 

Btw what is a "Bilibo" and what does "MIC" stand for?

Welcome!

Billibo and MIC = Made In China


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

_But what about backyard swings, climbing stuff, slides etc? I figure if we have these things DD's friends will come here rather than she going else where?_

we don't have a yard and we do have a community park, so that's where i am. if i do have a yard, i'm fairly certain i wouldn't have this equipment anyway and would go to a park or whatever.

growing up, i didn't have those things (or a lot of things that others had) and yet my friends tended to like to come to our house more. i think it was because of how cool my mom was as well as how we could just play and be creative without being hounded by toys and such.
_
Will our kids want to play at so and so's because so and so has TV, lots of toys, etc?_

i n ever did really. i mean, i would go to others homes to play with toys and what not, but TV and computer games and what not were not really fun for me with my friends. i found a lot of "kiddie" TV to be really boring and would rather be outside on my bike or whatever!
_
What about computer games?_

i dislike computer games. beyond using the internet as a learning tool (includin gmessage boards!), i don't see the computer as an 'entertainment' vehicle. it's a tool.

i use it mostly for work, as does my husband, and there are times when we are really *done* being on the computer!

i've never been one much for computer games of any kind, and DH agrees that we won't have games here.


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

:


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## foodmachine (Jul 17, 2008)

Hi, how are things in toy-free world? I have my eye on some wooden blocks (by Brio) and maybe the shape shorter for DD. Will try to get them used though. I guess I'm toy-critical as opposed to toy-free








Someone bought her an xylophone at her "release party" but pointed out that it's a tool not a toy. That made me smile. Music is BIG part of our lives.

I'm not falling into stuff abyss am I? My brother's house looks the toy r us giraffe throw up.


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## wife&mommy (May 26, 2005)

I'd like to dwindle our supply a lot. We have WAY WAY WAY too many. Our biggest problem is little cars like hotwheels. DS LOVES and I mean LOVES them. And a majority of the ones he has are DH's from when he was little. We have so many. Oh and trains. Cars and trains are so huge around here. I don't even know where to begin with those. He knows each one and the make/model some of them the year. It's a slight obsession with both him and DH. :sigh:


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## SuzyLee (Jan 18, 2008)

WRT outside toys: We have a yard with random crap in it (like the old owners leftover landscaping rocks) that our neighbor kids like to play with. We built this year a "playhouse": with branches that got blown out of our trees in a storm. We planted climbing vines around it to grow up the playhouse and cover it. The only commerical toy we plan to get is a slide.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

Dont get me wrong, I love my MIL immensely! She is a wonderful woman and has so much to help us in these last few months. But before we moved here, I made it a point to get rid of DD's toys by about 75% or more. It was great!! But since moving here in May, MIL has brought that toy stash back up to pretty much where it was before!

And what to do about my DD's obsession with My Little Ponies and Care Bears? She is 2 1/2. She looooooves animals. SO MUCH! And so I gave her my old Care Bears from when I was little. She took a liking to them, and then before I knew it, she had 12 of them! Same with the ponies. She had, maybe, 2... but then people keep finding them for her at yard sales and thrift stores, and now we have 10.

Anyways, I know MIL usually does a great job of finding fun, unique toys for DD, but I dont want them to take over our house again like they had done before! It is just ridiculous, and unneccesary.

I dont want a materialistic family. Absolutely not. So besides the obvious limiting stuff, what else can we do? Is it inevitable?


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i think that you just have to tell them that you want to control the clutter and reduce the amount of toys that the child has.

also, my mother would help us by purging what we didn't play with when we were little, and then when we were older, we had to purge with her.

and this makes me a life-long purger (married to a toy collector no less!).

i just counted our current baby's toys: two wooden rattles, one wooden pull toy, three stuffed toys. so far, so good.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

I think once we get moved in, Im gonna take a lot of the stuff down to the consignment store.... at least maybe I can make some money off of it and put it towards something useful. A swim class, or a toddler tumbling class...


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## foodmachine (Jul 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AislinCarys* 
I have just ordered a few teething pegs and a couple of playsilks, but I think she needs more, as she is into everything.

Any ideas anyone? What about bath toys?

I think we have to just make our homes safe so the "everything" they get into is ok. I don't think the answer is to buy stuff. They'll want the "everything" else anyway








But DD is only 7 months so I'll let you know...

But speaking of bath toys, my friend has the coolest giant rubber duckies. I think DD needs rubber duckies...or maybe that's me again








DH just bought some nice colored containers from a kitchen store for pouring (he called to ask first







). They are plastic (BPA-free) - wood in the tub doesn't really work.


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## glendora (Jan 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TeresaZofia* 
Lately, however, she's become interested in "making" her own dresses out of blankets and playsilks that she ties around her body. She also loves trying to wear my clothes and jewelry. For her birthday I'm going to get her a trunk-full of shiny, sparkly, fabulous fabrics to tie on herself. I can also help her sew the fabric into home-made skirts and dresses (nothing too fancy, I can't really sew







).

http://kiddley.com/2007/02/06/no-sew-tutu/


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

that is one of the cool things that my ILs, parents and i discussed recently--the idea of giving experiences rather than objects.

when i talked to them about some examples such as paying for rock climbing lessons and memberships or dance classes or music classes, i noted that these things were quite expensive and that it would be great if those were the 'gifts' that the grands were giving to the kids.

they also liked the idea of giving supplies for these activities, as well as giving things such as season passes to the local children's theater or what have you.

so, they are on board. they get where we're coming from!


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Hi all,

Im still pregnant with our 1st child but, as all you mommies know, when you have a baby everyone tries to give you STUFF! I'm grateful for everything we are given because everything helps but sometimes I think "wow this is excessive!". My baby registry was so small because I didnt need the Diaper genie, refills, legions of toys, accessories, etc. I certainly puzzled a lot of the excess I see. I find stores like Babies R Us overwhelming because I look through all the aisles and think "Dont need that, dont need that, dont need that".

Anyway! As far as toys, I have been given a lot of toys for the baby already and he isnt even born. Im thinking I should have established some simple toy rules before I started receiving gifts. Not to be ungrateful but we dont have a lot of space, we dont a lot of extra money to keep replacing batteries endlessly. What would all you mom's suggest toy-wise for a minimalist new mom who wants to keep life simple when it comes to her baby on the way? Anything I can make myself would be wonderful too!

Spider... Thank you so much for creating this tribe!

Safigee


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Persephone* 
I hate it that so many people treat babies as objects, and not PEOPLE.







: My MIL commented as dd got older, "Oh, she's turning into a real person now!" Um, she was a real PERSON before!









oh my goodness! I love this thread. I completely relate! My MIL doesnt say "Hello Greer! Everyone Greer is here" when we arrive anymore. She says "My grandbaby is here!" or "How is my grandbaby doing?" "I love my grandbaby". And I think "what am I? Chopped Liver? OH WAIT, Im the incubator!" haha! I think to some people babies are objects or playthings or novelties to parade around. Its sad really


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mumkenna&lucas* 
Thanks for those tips! We are encountering our first "selective" toys birthdays! And I am having a hard time deciding what to do about this! We are only having a VERY small party for my ds's 3rd birthday. Only close family members, I was trying to think of ways to "word" it kindly that we would enjoy a zoo membership for ds much more than any toys!

Did you figure out what to say? Im worried about this because when my husband's cousin's child (the first grandchild) had his first birthday party, there was this MOUNTAIN of toys. Im not kidding, when we walked into the house we were faced with the den and then shuffled through to the living room. The den was completely packed with presents, toys and a life-sized miniature pony! There was no more space to put anything. My jaw had to be scooped up off the floor. This little boy had no interest in the toys, and spent the day happily playing with the wrapping paper. I was just stunned and my worry is that when our little boy has his first birthday/christmas/etc, it will be a repeat situation. How DO you request restraint politely? I know they all mean well and all want to spoil the baby but, being that Im already the black sheep to my in laws, I wouldnt know how to put it kindly.


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
so, i ordered a set of catalogues for both families, so they can have them. my mom said she would use them, even if they're less fun, because afterall, she can't just go and buy things and "taht's frustrating."

Zoe... which catalogues are your favorites to shop from or refer family to?


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## accountclosed3 (Jun 13, 2006)

i can't recall right now. i believe it's somewhere early in the thread. . .one of the mother mama's mentioned it.

----

and, i'm the incubator too in my ILs house. it's really kind of weird. they don't even know that they're doing it.

other than saying "how is the baby?" when they "greet" me, that's all they say. seriously, that's it. they'll completely ignore me for two or more hours, having asked how the baby (in utero) is doing.

then, there was the "cake incident" of june, wherein we wanted a cake with a certain decoration and no words/lettering. my MIL was going to order the cake, and because she was basically ignoring me, i gave the info through my husband.

she wrote back saying "i ordered the cake that said 'Welcome Baby DH's Father's Nick Name based on his Last Name.'"

now, i never changed my name when we were married, so i still have my own Last Name, adn the child will be named Name MyLast Name HisLast Name.

i was livid, because it was as if i didn't even exist in this whole baby thing anymore. my husband noted that it seemed that everything was focused on them and the baby--to the point that my husband doesn't even relate to his father's nick name, and he was wondering where either of us fit into this picture.

they didn't even know that they were doing it. but it's so annoying.


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Oh wow... are you sure we don't have the same IL's? LOL they sound the same! The cake incident made me laugh but sounds just like what happens when we go visit the IL's. I know my DH can empathize but he is SO scared of my MIL and she so much as flinches and everyone comes running to do her bidding. So... I have to tread carefully. (BLAH!)
I didnt change my name either when we got married. One of the recent IL discussions about my inappropriateness as a wife has been centered around the fact that my OBgyn has my last name on my medical records. So, for every ultrasound or picture that we get and my poor MIL has to show to her friends, it has my last name on it. So she has to explain to everyone "They are married I promise. She just hasn't changed her name yet which I think is so strange. The baby will be so confused!". I stare at the ceiling and count to 10!

----
This thread has really got me thinking about toys I played with as a child. I do remember the odd Barbie or two given by relatives. But what really sticks out to me were the things my mother made for us. I grew up in South Africa and we never had money. There was never a giant selection of toys available and that was good because it cut down on the amount of toys we had. I remember being overwhelmed visiting some wealthy cousins and wading through the armies of Barbie's, Barbie's various houses and cars and pools. And there I was clutching my one precious Workout Barbie!
Anyway my mother would make us such gorgeous toys but only one or two at a time. She made us these little clowns when we were babies. They were made from scraps tied together and trimmed with bells and beads and buttons. We did watch limited tv a little as kids so my mom would make us things that were related to our favorite shows. She made us each a Winnie the Pooh, complete with red tshirt. We also liked the Thundercats so she made these necklaces out of clay with the thundercat logo on it and we would spend hours playing "Cats" outside with them. Even Winnie the Pooh became a game ("I'll be Pooh!" "I'll be piglet!"). She would also make us dressup clothes from our older clothes and again, we would spend hours playing. As my mom tells me, we spent more time playing in the yard or swimming in the pool sans toys more than anything else. My sister and I had our favorite games. (Mermaids was the favorite to play in the pool)
When we were older, my mom made a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle shell for my little cousin (of the army of barbie cousins) who loved them. He played "turtles" in his little costume far more than any of the other toys he owned. He was so cute. We had very few toys, but tons of books. I was never bored, never not stimulated or imagining or playing and I had a happy childhood. I hope to do the same for my son. If he is anything like his mom and dad he will have a big imagination.

OH as a contrast to our situation, my other aunt who is incredibly wealthy and could give her kids a whole house of toys, followed a very strict toy policy. For her little one's 5th Christmas we were at her house. He only got one present that year which was a tool kit. Nothing elaborate but it was a smaller version of his daddy's. He spent the entire day taking his wrenches and trying to fix everything. He had the best time. I think he still has the tool kit too and uses it! In fact her philosophy is still going. Her two boys just started their own business (at 7 and 12). They have a couple of beehives on their property and the boys collect honey, spin it, bottle it and even make little labels for them. They sell the honey for pocket money. And she didn't fund the business at all. They did odd jobs to earn the money for the bottles, they made their own little spinner, they made their own labels. Its adorable! But those boys are learning so much. I admire her for having all that money but using restraint. That is so rare these days and her kids are SO wonderful.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Wow, every time I start to feel just a little bit sorry for myself for never having found a supportive dh, you married folks cheer me right up again with the truth! The grass really isn't greener, it's just different grass.










Anyway, Terran is seven months old today so I guess this is as good a time as any for an update. He is still 100% toy free!








:

I'm not sure how much I should advertise that fact, because I cringe whenever I read a sensationalized abused-child-rescued-by-cps story that mentions the poor thing not even knowing how to hold a teddy bear or the neglectful parent locking the child in a closet without any toys at all.

However, I'm doing a bit of catch-up reading about pthalates and bpas (not an issue before since Terran doesn't use bottles either and really doesn't have any plastics in his mouth) and am simultaneously horrified and relieved that toy safety has been a nonissue.

He's growing up and becoming more aware of the world around him, but is still very people-oriented and i get a lot of positive comments about it. There have been a couple of incidents where I was embarassed: a coworker who was busy/ignoring him was treated to a very loud "HEY YOU!!!!!" that was intelligible to the whole room and there have been a few times in the grocery store when he has picked out a person he wanted to "talk" to and been a bit pushier about it than what I consider "normal".

Considering that our society thinks nothing about people my age or older walking up to strange babies and expecting them to be thrilled to interact with them, I don't think my son's behaviour is "rude" or something to be discouraged or distracted away with "Looik at the BUNNY! Hug the BUNNY love the BUNNY!" or jangling my car keys at him.

I have made an effort to stop saying "Hey you." to him quite as much and have identified my coworker as "Kaitlin. Her name is Kaitlin. Kaitlin is an easy word to say. Pretty soon y0ou'll be able to say Kaitlin." but that's another story for another thread; I already have support for precocious verbal development elsewhere.









Terran has cut two teeth with no meds other than an amber necklace and no plastic teething rings. I'm proud of our accomplishment! It has occured to me to wonder why we see teething rings as "toys" and therefore precursors to mountains of stuffed animals, x-boxes, and yachts instead of hygeine tools that are precursors to toothbrushes, dental floss, and braces, of course.

Another poster has mentioned rattles as musical instruments, and although we are no longer a musical family (I haven't performed since damaging my vocal cords in 2000 and the older kids don't play anything any more, although dd is a dancer) I would like to dust off my guitar when Terran can sing lead and provide him with whatever tools he needs for musical exploration--but no frustrating "toys" that can't stay in tune!

I'm thinking about a kalimba (african thumb piano) as a possible first instrument but a recorder might be a good choice as well, since they are inexpensive and safe.

I also had the opportunity to turn down the gift of a stuffed animal for the first time and I think I did okay. I do need more practice and next time I will give one reason instead of three or no reason at all, just "How very sweet of you, but I thin we'll pass this time."

I have some upcoming challenges in the next month and it's great to have this thread for support and even better that it has taken on a life of its own and doesn't need me to monopolize it.


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TeresaZofia* 
What do you guys think about costumes/dress up stuff?

**Sorry for my disjointed replies- Im reading through the whole thread and answering as a thought occurs to me. Eventually I will keep up**

I personally think dress up stuff is very valuable. Probably more valuable than toys, movies, video games or any of the other things kids today are given. BUT kids don't always need the full fancy costume and sometimes a lot of things can be picked up at thrift stores and consignment. And I agree with what others have said about "real" things sometimes being more fun for them than the plastic child versions. Real "mommy" shoes instead of the pink plastic barbie shoes. And sometimes just a cape or a hat or a mask is enough to start a game that lasts the whole day.

If there is anything I will ever allow myself to "collect" toy wise for my children, it will probably be dress up stuff. I'm naturally a pack rat and I fight it every day. Maybe thats where this determination to stay minimalist with my children comes from. I don't want them to be like me! So, even if I collect costumes, I will still limit what comes in, monitor what comes in and go through and purge regularly I think.


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

NoOrdinarySpider--- I think you are so inspiring with how you are raising Terran. I have really enjoyed reading about his growth and progression. Personally I think the "Hey You" is rather sweet because he sounds like such a brave, open boy!

As I said before, I have this horrible pack rat tendency that I fight against every day. And its not that I like keeping things, or need to, a lot of the time I don't realize I do it. But then I open a closet and its full of junk. Its incredibly overwhelming and the chaos upsets me. Luckily, Ive learned how to purge and let go. I've become completely ruthless and learned that the only way to stay free of STUFF is to not bring it into the house in the first place. I find your decision to stay completely toy free with Terran so inspiring. You must feel such freedom! I would probably still keep some around because its hard for me to let go of that last little thing... I'm just not there yet. But the thought of being completely free of STUFF in my life, oh wow.... thats pure freedom in my eyes. Its a very admirable thing and I'm sure Terran is going to thrive.


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## safigee (Aug 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AislinCarys* 
Zoebird, this is what we have used so far for our 20 week old:

Toys:

- Nothing before 3 mths
- Small stuffed sheep
- 2 teddybears (not much use yet)
- plain wood rattle
- "Horton hears a who" boardbook (favourite toy!)
- Books

Clothes:

Much less than we thought and what anyone suggested! Used more tops once she started slobbering, but that's all. Lots of dribble bibs. And disposables. For a lot of reasons we have ended up using them, despite not thinking we would. (we do EC anyway). Lots of nappy squares for everything except nappies!!! And BabyLegs legwarmers are great in a sling!

AislynCarys, I love your advice to Zoebird and Im going to keep it in mind for myself as well. Im pregnant with our first child as well (32 weeks+5) and we are trying not to BUY all and sundry for him. We have bought incredibly little in fact. But I find I am completely clueless as to what I will really need and not just want. We have been given almost everything we have for him, including clothes blankets disposables (which Im keeping on hand but wont plan on using). What I do want to purchase however are books. We dont have any books yet and no-one has thought to give us any so...Im going to start scouring secondhand bookstores and yard sales for books.

You mentioned the type of sling you have for your dd. Do you prefer that sling over others you have tried? I havent heard of it before but then all slings are just lovely to me. Im restraining myself from buying more than one of them. My mother gave us one and I find myself falling in love with some gorgeous homemade ones on Etsy but...Im trying to restrain! Ha ha!


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *safigee* 
What I do want to purchase however are books. We dont have any books yet and no-one has thought to give us any so...Im going to start scouring secondhand bookstores and yard sales for books.

Just wanted to mention - People may give you books after the birth, and you really don't need any for at least a few months if not longer. Wyatt loves his book, but gets overstimulated if he looks at it too long or looks at all the pages so we can only play with it in small doses and I'm not even sure its worth it yet. Whats better for us right now is showing him the covers to books DH & I are reading, and different packages. His favorite is the package to the dehydrated apple crisps I eat.

So I guess all I'm trying to say is, it might want to take a wait and see approach. You'll have MORE than enough time to buy books before you need them.

ETA: Oh yeah and disposables: I thought I'd never want a 'sposie to touch his precious bum, but at 4 weeks old we took a 4 day trip to Canada. I had no interest in trying to wash diapers on such a short trip, and/or fly dirty dipes back home with us so they were put to good use. The rest I gave away as he out grew them.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Yea, Terran has kind of an abnormally long attention span for books (perhaps because I was tutoring a functionally illiterate 14 year old during my pregnancy and we read aloud a LOT, me to Stephen at adolescent interest level and Stephen at his own comfort level reading "to the baby") but we do best with one fairly long picture book at a sitting and sometimes we put it down in the.middle and pick it back up again later.

Also, going to the public library is and should be a special event in a baby's life. I find that my own books can sit around unread because "I can always read them later" while I make time to read the library books that have to be back the day after tomorrow.

That said, I am totally a pack rat when it comes to books, and books are one of the things I worry about CPS or nosy neighbours warping around into "the baby has no toys because this inhuman monster spends all the money on books!"


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## xekomaya (Apr 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
That said, I am totally a pack rat when it comes to books, and books are one of the things I worry about CPS or nosy neighbours warping around into "the baby has no toys because this inhuman monster spends all the money on books!"









That really got me. How screwed up is our society when there is even a touch of reality to that statement?


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

So I talked to my MIL about Christmas and birthdays. She was very gracious and made jokes about how, yea, she buys too much stuff for Scarlett. So we agreed on a dollar amount for books, and then if she feels she needs to spend more money, put it towards a class in the Spring/Summer. That should work well for now.

As Scarlett gets older, I really want her to take personal responsibility and learn how to earn the things she wants.


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## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

Hi there! In the interest of limiting FYT to subjects not hosted elsewhere on the board, we have moved your tribe here. You're still a tribe, which means you're still support-only. If you have any questions about the move, please do not discuss it on the boards. Rather, contact an administrator or start a thread in Questions and Suggestions. Thanks, and happy posting!


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

I'm not sure if this is the tribe for me, but....
I have an almost 4yo, and I'm quite happy with the way we have handled toys. He has enough, but probably much, much less than many children in middle-class households. He has both high-quality toys and also a case of MIC hotwheels.

In the living room we have two med-sized square baskets, one filled with wooden blocks made by a friend ( I treasure these), and the other filled with misc items. There is also a small container of instruments for him to use, an antique wooden rocking horse (old but functional), and a wooden farmhouse on a table. It all fits nicely into the living room so it is obvious a child lives and plays here but does not by any means dominate the space.

In his room are books, stacks of puzzles, a basket for his Brio trainset, a basket of legos, a small basket of lincoln logs, and a little suitcase of hot wheels. In the closet is the giant tub of tinkertoys and his easel. Art supplies all fit nicely into a small cabinet in our computer room.

I guess this does sound like a lot!! But I feel we've done a pretty good job weeding things out and keeping it under control. For Christmas he gets one big Santa gift, and a couple smaller items. Last year he got a wooden sword and shield from Santa, and mostly homemade things and books from me. In his stocking we put things like bubble baths, fun toothbrushes, fruit leather, etc.

The other day he found a Buzz Lightyear doll at a resale shop. He had already seen this doll at a festival where a little girl had one. It was love at first sight. I could see how happy he was when he saw it at the shop and for 5 bucks it was his. It is a plastic doll that talks, and for the last 3 days this nightmare of a toy has made my child ridiculously happy. So I am not hardcore, and I will follow his lead on toy choices sometimes.

I loooooove toys. I am already planning his bday and Christmas gifts! Because we don't acquire them year round (except books), it makes the special occassions so much fun. Probably an abacus for bday and a marble run for Christmas.

So maybe I fit here, i dunno


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## mama_daba (Dec 7, 2004)

i would like to join although we are not toy free. we are pretty selective about what toys we do buy and well a lot of his "toys" are actually wooden spoons he plays with while i cook or wash dishes so maybe they don't count?

i want to be more selective and buy fewer toys and have fewer toys around as he gets older. the one toy i will not be really limiting is wooden blocks but thats because i love building with them and right now he is playing with those as they seem to be his favorite toy as well.


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## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

for those who seek.


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## accountclosed2 (May 28, 2007)

Safigee[/QUOTE]You mentioned the type of sling you have for your dd. Do you prefer that sling over others you have tried? I havent heard of it before but then all slings are just lovely to me. Im restraining myself from buying more than one of them. My mother gave us one and I find myself falling in love with some gorgeous homemade ones on Etsy but...Im trying to restrain! Ha ha![/QUOTE]

I like the wrap-style sling. For one thing, they are so versatile! And I find, with a good tie, it's great for my back! The Storchenwiege sling is organic. The other thing I like about it is that it is woven (and therefore works with an older child as well) rather than stretchy, but it has a bit of "give", which means it the weave can be pulled sidewise to fit snuggly around a newborn.

We didn't plan to use disposables, but DD was tiny and didn't fit the newborn cloth nappies we got (they fit now!). She also hated the wetness, and it would wake her up. Disana knitted cloth nappies really do fit any size baby, but they do take some folding and arranging (prefolds and nappy squares didn't work at all on our daughter's tiny bum, wees would run down her legs...).

We started reading to DD when she was only days old. She has really loved it since she was about 2 months old, and can stay interested for at least 15 min.

DD's interest in toys, apart from being read to, is limited to sucking on them - and her favourite is still the boardbooks, although she likes her little sheep, and any towelling type fabric item (bibs, wash cloth, towel). Her "toys" now includes 2 empty kleenex boxes, sometimes she likes them, and a tiny porcelain cup (just like ours!).


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## ema-adama (Dec 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
*that is one of the cool things that my ILs, parents and i discussed recently--the idea of giving experiences rather than objects.*

when i talked to them about some examples such as paying for rock climbing lessons and memberships or dance classes or music classes, i noted that these things were quite expensive and that it would be great if those were the 'gifts' that the grands were giving to the kids.

they also liked the idea of giving supplies for these activities, as well as giving things such as season passes to the local children's theater or what have you.

so, they are on board. they get where we're coming from!

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, but I am so enjoying the bit that I have read!







:

I keep being told that family can buy the gifts they want to as it is THEIR gift and they want to give things they like. Anyway, I am not interesting in PSII, DVD's, computer games, plastic junk, etc that IL's just L O V E! And while DS is still a baby all the Baby Einstein stuff.

So, I have been worrying and worrying about how I am going to address this with IL's in a positive way- still allow them to have a relationship with their grandchild, but also keep things sane in our house.
The idea of giving experiences is just absolutely BRILLIANT! And so simple. And has me really rather like this







:

I'm going to be reading over this and finding a ton of ideas I am sure

Thanks NOS - excellent tribe you started


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

So dd has been loving her 60-piece wooden block set. I want to get her another set, because the castles she builds at 2.5 amaze me! Its very abstract and asymetrical, but just so cool. I want to live in a castle like that! She could occupy herself for hours with those blocks, and I can just envision all of the neurological connections being made in her brain.

In case I hadn't mentioned this already, MIL was very receptive when I talked to her about no more toys. She went out yard saling yesterday and only got DD a puzzle! She even went down to the dance studio to find out about their dance classes for little ones! Wahoo!


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## ohiomommy1122 (Jul 7, 2006)

IM SO gl;ad I FOUND THIS TRIBE

we have recently ( the last year) cleared out hundreds of boxes, okay so Im exaaggerating but TONS of boxes of toys and just like super nanny said when you lklimit toys they will actually play and take care of what they have.

We have been doimg well at getting rid of more and more toys each month that they do not playu with my rule is if they havnt played w/ it on a months its gone and we donate to charity unless its a nice wood toy we have been doing this to weed out plastics and made in China toys. I'm thankful this scare came out about toxic plastic toys and lead because now it help re direct my MIL's need to buy a bunch of CRAP shje means well really but my kids just don';t play with toys

She was poor when DH was a kid so she buys the Grandkids EVERYTHING I keep trying to re direct her gift giving to fun classes and such, sop hopefull this year will be better around the holidays if I can stop MIL from slurging to much she thought I was aweful whjen _said the kids were getting only 4 gifts for x- mas and bought the kids so much stuff she had to bring it over in 2 car loads SERIUOSLY and I onl;y have 3 kids shes insane!

So I'm so glad i found you mamas I_


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## clothdipemomof2boy (Nov 29, 2005)

Just wanted to say that we had Jacobs Bday celebration today and very little toys were given by the gammy. She gave him dinosaurs that he loves to learn with such as he learned that allosaurus starts with an A and that he is the dinosaur that Godzilla is based off of. Pretty cool for a four year old I think. He got clothes and books too so We are literrally depleting the number of toys. Oh and we didnt buy a cake either we made it this year. Maybe sometime I will be able to post a pic of it.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

We did some reorganizing and clearing out a few things again on Friday. There wasn't much to clear out so it made me realize we do only have the essentials for ds to play with.

I did start to get the heebie jeebies realizing that bday and Christmas is coming up and the bagloads of craptastic stuff are going to roll in from family. Specifically MIL. I think she is getting it though, the only thing she has mentioned is that she wants to crochet him something







:

Meanwhile, I made a wish list for ds and put it on the fridge for dh to tell anyone in his family if they asked. They don't have enough $$ for memberships. I would love to hear ideas about decent things that are available at mainstream places like Target. Trust me, no one in our family is going to be shopping at Nova Naturals anytime soon.

So far I have:

CandyLand
Floor puzzles
Books
Large balls
Markers/paint/ stickers and basically any expendable art supply

Any more ideas? He needs winter pj's, but the no flame retardant rule would be too difficult for them. Clothes won't work either b/c they tend to buy him really stiff denim things from Wal Mart.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

Oh, and just to clarify, is this literally a toy-free tribe, or just a toy minimalist tribe? Because we are definitely not into being toy-free, I think kids need to have their own stuff (he has already broken too many things we let him play with and thought he couldn't break. Like our binoculars







). Just want to make sure I'm in the right place!


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## onlyAngil (Jan 17, 2008)

I just got rid of most of my DS toys.

I never though that Sent. would make me fell like a good maymay, but it is true, I do. We got rid of them, and I do not want them back!!! He had to many thing that he could not think about what it is he wanted to do, would get everything every were and never get them back put away. Now he goes gets what he wants, plays with it, puts it back (sometimes), and when I do have to clean up there is hardly anything to do. It is all very simple. There are few of his "toys" that I see as toys any longer, rather he has real things, for his size. His shirts and pants are not toys, but rather just the right sizes for him. Why then when a puzzle, flash light, drum is his size it is a "toy". This just how I look at it.








Wish the holidays coming I know little extra support would help!

It is wonderful to find you guys, and I cant wait to see how it all goes.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hoopin' Mama* 
Oh, and just to clarify, is this literally a toy-free tribe, or just a toy minimalist tribe? Because we are definitely not into being toy-free, I think kids need to have their own stuff (he has already broken too many things we let him play with and thought he couldn't break. Like our binoculars







). Just want to make sure I'm in the right place!

For pete's sake, i hav
e an EIGHT MONTH OLD!!!! most people here seem to be toy minimalist (Terran loves his yoga ball and his stack of cardboard boxes and our wrap style carriers dounle as playsilks) so your input is definitely welcomr!

he also loves keyboards, which isn't helping my typing much, but this has been a challenging month for me so i might come back later today for my update and to get some ideas/advice even though he wom't really be 8 months until the 18th


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## onlyAngil (Jan 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
For pete's sake, i hav
e an EIGHT MONTH OLD!!!! most people here seem to be toy minimalist (Terran loves his yoga ball and his stack of cardboard boxes and our wrap style carriers dounle as playsilks) so your input is definitely welcomr!

he also loves keyboards, which isn't helping my typing much, but this has been a challenging month for me so i might come back later today for my update and to get some ideas/advice even though he wom't really be 8 months until the 18th

GO MAMA GO!







:


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## cera (Dec 6, 2006)

:


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## Twinklefeet (Mar 19, 2008)

I'm not quite through all ten pages of this *terrific* thread, but man-oh-man count me in!!! I thought I was all alone out there in this big materialistic world, but I see that I'm not, and i'm so glad to have so many posts to read for ideas on how to make this work for us! We are having our first baby, and we live in a little bitty house, and I refuse to be overwhelmed with what I consider baby _JUNK_. My niece, who is almost 3 and who I have watched grow and change since day one, has been living proof for me that you can buy a kid 9000 toys, and what they'll really want to play with is your car keys, your cell phone, wooden spoons, or the simplest of toys in "the pile"(ball, hoop, bucket, etc)... I am trying to learn from watching her grow and save myself and my husband the hassle of receiving and sorting all the stuff to begin with! Anyway, thanks again for this great thread, and I look forward to reading the rest of the posts.







:


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *onlyAngil* 
GO MAMA GO!







:

Thank you! I needed encouragement SO MUCH. I've got a little crawler now. I have some appropriate carriers for back carries, which has helped a lot, but he is still a pretoddler and he still needs floor time.

"toe-eaze" are touted as the solution to every challenge that arises in parenting a pretoddler. Becomes hysterical in his car seat? Give him a toy! Pulls your hair during back carries? Give him a toy! Need to keep him safe while you throw together some winter pants? Give him a toy!

I was seriously eyeing some nice wooden spoons at the store the other day.

When I first noticed him happily batting at the yoga ball and exploring his cardboard box tower, i would stop what i was doing immediately and play with him, but now i'm not so sure that i want to interfere with his explorations of the world of inanimate objects.

I am finding myself questioning the common disciplinary tactic of distracting toddlers from dangerous and fragile items. This may be more appropriate for the consensual living thread, but i've been working on a very toxic relationship with my mother and trying to explain in a nonjudgemental tone how it makes me feel when that same technique has been used on me in my 20s, 30s, and 40s.

Quote:

"Mom, I'm really scared. Things didn't go well in court today and I'm beginning to think that dd1 may never come home again!"

"Don't be ridiculous. I sent your lawyer a check and he should get it next Tuesday. Is your cat friendly and purry when company comes over or does she go pfft pfft pfft and scoot out the window to hide in the back yard?"

"Mom, I'm really scared. This George Bush guy is running the economy into the ground. A lot of my friends can't find any work at all and my resume has a large gap in it from being a SAHM."

"Don't be ridiculous. Sometimes Republicans win elections and other times Democrats do. Maybe we'll have a Democrat in the white house next time. If you would brush your cat every day, she wouldn't shed so much and your house would be cleaner. "
I know I'm not likely to engage an eight month old in a calm discussion about the pros and cons of sticking a fork in an electric socket or putting a plastic bag over his head, but Iove him and I don't want to make him feel the way I feel when distraction is used as a technique to control my behavior!

This post has turned into more of a rant than an update. My little boy is continuing along the same path as a human-centric, delightful, easygoing person and I want to keep going, I just need to do a better job of not falling into the "everybody else does it so it must be the right way" mentality that I did with his siblings.

It's a funny perspective I have, with all of my regrets and might-have-beens from the older kids existing simultaneously with the idealism and hope of all new parents.

Terran will be meeting his grandmother next month. Sadly, I don't think she knows how to relate to babies without buying them "toe-eaze" so I will explain as best I can and will probably still need to make a trip to the consignment store or the donation site for the rescue mission thrift store after she leaves.

Christmas is another challenge looming on the horizon. I'd just skip it if my almost seventeen year old didn't love it so much.

It's so great to see this thread being revived but please, I don't want to be alpha dog here, I am trying to find some like-minded people for support, bouncing ideas off of, and to learn from.

Oh, and I hope it's not a UAV to congratulate Zoebird on the birth of her son.








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## bright_eyes (Dec 7, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
i
i am finding that people just "don't get it" irl, so i'm going to have to come up with some stratgies for avoiding unwanted gifts. I was bragging about his gentle hands to a childless coworker who is particularly fond of him and mentioning that I thought it was because we don't do toys, and she rep[lied, incredulously, "But what about wooden ones? They're okay, aren't they?" and another friend who is definitely in the "toy light" camp was teasing me about "protecting him from the dangerous evil toys".

Noordinaryspider, I just read through all 10 pages of this thread, and really enjoyed reading it. I am wondering what inspired your desire to be toy-free? What makes toys so evil? I am not asking to critisize, btw, I am just wanting to understand more, as I am fascinated by it. I've met people that are against plastic toys, battery operated toys, but I've never met anyone that is against all toys.

So I am wondering what it is that toys do to kids that you do like? Why not mimimal toys, why completely toy-free?

I was also wondering how you define toys, when you say toy-free? Are toys just things that have been labelled toys, or do objects like pots and pans, sticks, ect. count? You mentioned you want him to be humancentric, what do you mean by that?

I hope you don't mind the questions, I am just intriqued by it all!


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## Periwinkle (Feb 27, 2003)

I am SO subscribing to this... I posted something almost like this a week or so ago that I have serious doubts about the value of toys. How funny to see a thriving tribe! My kids have a playroom - an entire room of our home dedicated to... to.... things.







The past few months it's really been hitting me that this is literally 180 degrees opposite the values we work so hard to teach our kids. I am lucky they - shockingly - aren't really "toy" kids anyway, and are very outdoors and make-believe focused. But I'd like it to stay that way.
Anyway.... subbing







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## ema-adama (Dec 3, 2007)




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## delfin (Jul 11, 2007)

hi!!
i identify a lot with this thread...not many people understand why i don't buy toys for Indi, but the truth is that he doesn't need them. Well, i'm looking for a cloth book for him, 'cause he likes books and also lokes to chew on them and more than one time i get pieces of cardboard from his mouth! he also has a ball and two stuffed creatures I made for him. I'm also looking for a kalimba or some other simple musical instrument.
NOS was mentioning about letting her child explore...i really like this, many times Indi is manipulating something small like a piece of paper, or my mala beads, or a rock, like an amethyst or a quarz and i just let him, watching carefully for safety but not interrupting him. This is something very detrimental that sometimes adults do, unnecesary interventions in children's play and we become obstacles more than facilitators in our children's development (this is something Maria Montessori wrote about). He loves to manipulate tiny things, paper, and of course, wooden spoons!you can see his focused expression, like a meditation, and he withdraws from the world to put all his attention in this sacred task.
What do you mamas do when you go to someone's house and the first thing they do is bring a big box full of stuff to your curious baby?When we go to my cousin's Indi wants to watch and interact with her DD and my cousin just sends her to bring MORE TOYS, and the TV is on and there's just so much stimulation that Indi gets overwhelmed and hides between my legs! How do you handle this?


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