# My junk food issues



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

I'm not a crunchy organic eater by any stretch. We don't drink soda or eat many processed foods, but my kids eat candy on holidays, homemade desserts, the free cookie they give you at the supermarket. So I think I"m pretty "mainstream" as far as it goes, but now that my DS is almost 5, I can't BELIEVE how pervasive junk food is!

He goes to preschool. They have a snack. Ok, they can't last 8am-12 w/o food, whatever, but it's chips--once it was "a yummy pop tart"--that's what the snack calendar said!--and "juice", which is something we rarely drink, and if we do, it's actually JUICE and not Capri Sun garbage. So I tell myself, well, it's 3x a week, he'll live, then we have T-ball--THEY have to have a snack--last week's was a "fruit" roll up and juice, both w/ artificial colors and corn syrup as one of the first 3 ingredients. Aghhhh!!!

What do you healthy eating mamas do? I don't mind *some* garbage, because I'm pretty pragmatic and hey, I like that free cookie! But I feel bombarded by all this sugary, carb-y JUNK and I know it's only going to get worse. At kindy round-up, the principal went out of his way to tell the kids about their cafe's selection of ice cream, chips and nacho. But he reassured the parents that they were guaranteed a daily hot meal--hamburger, hot dog or nachos.









I"m putting this here instead of healthy eating, b/c to me this is a parenting issue---do you stand your ground against our culture of horrible eating, and if so, how? I"m not talking about at home, that's easy, but in group settings like teams, schools, etc. Prior to now it's been easy to keep this stuff away from him--do you just have to give up at a certain age? I can live w/ that too, but I didn't expect the age to be 5!!!


----------



## MommaCrystal (May 25, 2006)

I'm having the same issue! Every where we go, if the snack isn't provided by me it is the sugary (as in high fructose corn syrup) juice and a cupcake or a donut or something like it.

DRIVES ME MAD!

I have NO solution!


----------



## Raine822 (Dec 11, 2008)

We don't run into this often yet but when we do we take fresh fruit for DD. She loves fruit and its still a sweet snack.

Probably will not work all the time but it may reduce the amount of junk.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Raine822* 
We don't run into this often yet but when we do we take fresh fruit for DD. She loves fruit and its still a sweet snack.

Probably will not work all the time but it may reduce the amount of junk.

May I ask how old your DD is? That strategy stopped working for us around 3. Like a birthday party--if I bring fresh fruit, DS isn't going to be happy if everyone eats red Costco frosting cake and he gets fresh strawberries. And the preschool--I guess I could drop off a bag of apples/oranges with him, but I'm not crazy about singling him out among the other kids, plus I worry that it'll just encourage him to sneak food and lie about it.

And there's the whole adult education thing (and now I"m venting, sorry!)--I specifically asked about snacks when I enrolled him in preschool and was assured they got "healthy" snacks. That apparently means if the bag of Fritos or Pop Tarts says "whole grains" or "no trans fats" it's healthy. I'm really not keen on explaining to an adult why a Pop Tart isn't a healthy snack for a 4 y/o. And if it's another parent (like at tee ball practice), then I run the risk of offending them, as I did last weekend. Some people take it as a comment on their parenting.

I only know of two people IRL who seem to avoid this. Their kids have never had fast food, never had food colorings or artificial flavors. But one just never takes her 3 y/o anywhere while the other does, but never leaves her kids alone (home schoolers) and brings Whole Foods with her wherever she goes. I don't have the money or energy!!!

Sorry for the vent.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommaCrystal* 
I'm having the same issue! Every where we go, if the snack isn't provided by me it is the sugary (as in high fructose corn syrup) juice and a cupcake or a donut or something like it.

DRIVES ME MAD!

I have NO solution!

Can I ask what you bring? After my tee ball snack of Froot Foot or whatever that disgusting plastic mess was called, I volunteered to bring the snacks. It was tough to find non-HFCS! I settled on Welch's juice boxes and Kashi cereal bars, which IMO is plenty junky w/ 9 grams of sugar. A kid complained! 4 y/o!! I guess it's lucky I didn't bring the oranges I wanted to, someone might have cried lol.

The crazy thing is I don't mind *a* doughnut, I love doughnuts. It's just every freaking event seems to be doughnut worthy.


----------



## NellieKatz (Jun 19, 2009)

Homeschooling.

OK, I am joking. But not by much.

The junk food is not the reason we decided to homeschool, but it's one of the reasons we would never consider turning back. Just ONE of the many reasons. There are so many negative influences out there that are sanctioned by the school and other organizations....I would go stark raving MAD if my kid were exposed to what you described. And because, quite reasonably, you don't want to be a dictator-jerk of a parent and have a strict, outright ban....you let your kid have it now & again, but then the continuous exposure to this junk just deadens your kid's taste buds so that natural sweet just isn't sweet enough any more. It's deliberate on the part of the "food" producing companies and their marketers.

Until the schools start waking up to what's going on and teaching HEALTH again (in all its meanings....i.e. kids as whole, healthy people), our kids are going to keep facing health problems.

I am sorry I have no solution and my heart goes out to you.


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

I know I'm in the minority here about this subject.

We just don't allow it. Even "not allowing" it, dd gets something really junky once a week at least. Brownies, playdate, the occasional after-school care, library events, camps, lessons. Even if you're vigilant, it still creeps in. IMO, "only 3 times a week", is more like "every day" in reality.

Most will say it will become "forbidden fruit". We've never had that problem and dd is 8. She has become accustomed to non-processed foods, so they don't even appeal to her. She will say, "they had Cheese-its at Brownies, and I ate a few to try, but they tasted like chemicals." She has the option of eating what they are serving, but I always try to remember to send her a healthy option. Now at 8, she always chooses the healthy option unless it's a party (and I don't even bother with a healthy option when it's a festivity... but these are less than once a month). We've never had power struggles over food, she doesn't sneak it, and she doesn't lie about it.

And yeah... we never eat fast food, but dd doesn't ask for it. We don't drink soda and dd has never asked for it. After about 5 yo, we did discuss how food is processed for fast-food places and we've even seen some of the methods on shows like Modern Marvels. She's never seen Food Inc. and such (I think those are a little too in-your-face for her age, yet), but we do talk about it and she understands ethical food standards. She has a very healthy attitude about food.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
I know I'm in the minority here about this subject.

We just don't allow it. Even "not allowing" it, dd gets something really junky once a week at least. Brownies, playdate, the occasional after-school care, library events, camps, lessons. Even if you're vigilant, it still creeps in. IMO, "only 3 times a week", is more like "every day" in reality.

Most will say it will become "forbidden fruit". We've never had that problem and dd is 8. She has become accustomed to non-processed foods, so they don't even appeal to her. She will say, "they had Cheese-its at Brownies, and I ate a few to try, but they tasted like chemicals." She has the option of eating what they are serving, but I always try to remember to send her a healthy option. Now at 8, she always chooses the healthy option unless it's a party (and I don't even bother with a healthy option when it's a festivity... but these are less than once a month). We've never had power struggles over food, she doesn't sneak it, and she doesn't lie about it.

And yeah... we never eat fast food, but dd doesn't ask for it. We don't drink soda and dd has never asked for it. After about 5 yo, we did discuss how food is processed for fast-food places and we've even seen some of the methods on shows like Modern Marvels. She's never seen Food Inc. and such (I think those are a little too in-your-face for her age, yet), but we do talk about it and she understands ethical food standards. She has a very healthy attitude about food.

I would think you'd be in the majority at MDC! Or you mean the whole "forbidden fruit" angle? Now I"m worried that I"ve ruined him--he's already tasted all this cr*p. He understands the nutrition of it (as much as a 4 y/o can understand), but it's hard when everyone else eats it--it's hard for me as a parent!

ETA so what would you do re: the preschool? Tell them they can't serve him the garbage everyone else eats? It's over this month, so no point in pulling him out. Always bring a snack to tee ball? Maybe I will do that--I can't believe anyone would buy, let alone eat that Froot Foot. And they wanted to give some to my 2 y/o!!!


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NellieKatz* 
Homeschooling.

OK, I am joking. But not by much.

Yes, my homeschooling friend feels the same way. I had thought I was going to h/s, then changed my mind...this is bringing back the other way again. It's very depressing that in the US you have to isolate yourself to get away from unhealthy food.


----------



## berry987 (Apr 23, 2008)

I don't have a solution either, just agreeing that it is really hard to raise a healthy eating kid in an environment that is totally ignorant about nutrition. I know very smart, thoughtful people who feed their kids that strawberry syrup in their milk because "it gets them drinking milk" and "it's loaded with vitamins." They actually think it's good for them. And that's the problem with letting food companies do as they please - they've convinced many people that cr*p is good for them.

My son is in preschool 3x a week and gets a snack (provided by parents on a rotating basis). It is usually pretzels or goldfish and juice (only 100% juice is allowed at the school)...so it's not that bad. Not my first choice, but whatever.

As long as they aren't getting frequent snacks/meals from outside sources, I still feel like I have some control over what they eat. We pack healthy lunches when we meet up with friends at the playground and my oldest son (5) will sometimes complain that he doesn't have doritos or a fruit roll up like his friends, but for the most part, he just eats and is used to what I serve.


----------



## NellieKatz (Jun 19, 2009)

Whoa! *newbymom05* I just wanted to clarify something so there was no misunderstanding. You said "you have to isolate yourself" and that is not what homeschooling is.

We just have a different circle that we travel in now. In fact we belong to a new, democratic free school (very small, just 6 kids, age 7 thru 14 all homeschooled kids learning together). Most of the families eat pretty healthy and we have vegans and vegetarians among us. So the kids in our group get exposed to a more balanced food scenario. We belong to many groups and have plenty of friends, too....but in all the things we're involved in, we have more of a voice in what's served, who we associate with (i.e. common values) etc.

Does that make more sense now? THanks.....can't say more now....gotta go run and tape Lost!


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NellieKatz* 
Whoa! *newbymom05* I just wanted to clarify something so there was no misunderstanding. You said "you have to isolate yourself" and that is not what homeschooling is.

Sorry, poor choice of cut/paste and my words. I didn't mean to offend, sorry if I did.







I meant in my own situation. I didn't expect a morning preschool or sports activity to include junk food, so what's my alternative, not attend? That was my sketchy thought process, not a comment on h/s. Maybe I've had too much HFCS.


----------



## Raine822 (Dec 11, 2008)

My DD is younger-almost 2. So far the fresh fruit is working but I'm sure that will change


----------



## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

I know the feeling although I'm pretty happy with my son's school.

Although I can think of a few strategies (feed on the way, don't add in any treat at home, try to avoid the juice) I think really the thing is...we do have to have these awkward conversations with people. As gently as possible. I think I might say to the teachers (since that's the easy place to start)...you know we don't eat these foods at home because of these concerns, and it is bothering me. Is there a way that we could work out different snacks for the class.

For sports I noticed that one of our local grocery stores has the official snack of FIFA or the World Cup or a team or something...they sell bowls of this snack for a whopping $8 and it is - orange sections. With the peels on. I had to LAUGH SO HARD at the price and the marketing but I was also glad to see a team getting behind something like fruit. So I wonder if there's a sneaky way to get a local fruit seller or farmer to sponsor the team's snacks or something (maybe have a farm visit?) or other cool ways of getting the 'official' snack of the team to be healthier.

Other than that I have nothing. We're not into a complete ban on junk but it really is pervasive.


----------



## NellieKatz (Jun 19, 2009)

You know what? I hate to say this, Raine822, but you are probably right. My son was sort of immune to the outside influences for a really long time, but gradually I have noticed, through just the exposure to sweets and/or junk on special occasions, holidays, grandma's house and of course even normal sweets that aren't artificial and full of HFCS, he has gradually come to want sugary things more & more and is suddenly starting to drop various fruits off his list of things he wants to eat....formerly favorite fruits.

It has gotten to the point that I am a militant psycho about some things, like people giving him sweetened fruits and sweetened peanut butter.....I lose my mind when Grandma does this, because for heavens sakes it is just so hard to get them to eat fruits and whole foods anyway (after they have been exposed to sugary stuff), to then go ahead and sweeten things that SHOULD taste good enough on their own....pretty soon the kid just won't eat a thing that has not got sugar added!

rant rant rant

Sorry I am a bit distracted right now, so if that was coherent it's going to be a miracle. I have to run along. The episode of Lost from tonight has me so rattled I can barely think. Time to put the little guy to bed.....


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
ETA so what would you do re: the preschool? Tell them they can't serve him the garbage everyone else eats? It's over this month, so no point in pulling him out. Always bring a snack to tee ball? Maybe I will do that--I can't believe anyone would buy, let alone eat that Froot Foot. And they wanted to give some to my 2 y/o!!!

Dd has been at the same school for 5 years now. She's in 2nd grade. I have packed a snack for her every single day since she started. I have packed her lunch every single day. But yeah, I just always make sure there is an alternative. If I know that there is going to be something particularly interesting, I'll make sure she has something interesting from home (for example, fruit leather isn't hard to make at home). Or a treat that is store-bought, but all-natural. For example, Motts makes these gummy treats that are all-natural. Fun shapes and colors, but they use natural flavors and colors with no additives or preservatives. I'd send some of those if I knew kids were going to get Jello. When it's a b-day party, dd can have anything and everything. Even then, she self-moderates because it makes her sick to eat much junk.

Also, she's not alone on this. Two of her best friends have food allergies and their mothers are even more careful than I am.

As I said, though, even being careful, something slips in routinely. She'll forget the snack for Brownies and end up eating a few processed crackers or she'll still be hungry after the snack I gave her and eat a yogurt (which is artificially colored and flavored). So, it does happen, just not as frequently as it would if I just gave up on trying. I really do think that overly-processed and chemical-laden foods is at the root of the health problems in kids and the younger generations of adults.


----------



## ChristyMarie (May 31, 2006)

I just don't worry about it.

He eats healthy at home and he just doesn't have a taste for [email protected]









Saturday we were at an event and the other family we were with grabbed some of the free snacks and gave one to DS. It was a bag of gummy candy things. I honestly don't know what they were. He took one bite and was done. I had pretzels with us and brought those out and he (and the other kids) ate those.

I think if you keep giving them healthy, REAL food at home they realize the other stuff tastes yucky.

And yes, sometimes he eats garbage. Eh, sometimes so do I. He inherited my weakness for all things donut and bbq chips.







But, we bought a bag of bbq chips to go with our cook out on Saturday (why do they not sell small bags anymore?) and we both had some and there they sit to be thrown out because we'll never finish them.

Don't forbid them but make healthy foods the main portion of their diet and they will naturally not care for the other stuff as much.


----------



## isabchi (Sep 14, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NellieKatz* 
Homeschooling.

OK, I am joking. But not by much.

The junk food is not the reason we decided to homeschool, but it's one of the reasons we would never consider turning back. Just ONE of the many reasons. There are so many negative influences out there that are sanctioned by the school and other organizations....I would go stark raving MAD if my kid were exposed to what you described. And because, quite reasonably, you don't want to be a dictator-jerk of a parent and have a strict, outright ban....you let your kid have it now & again, but then the continuous exposure to this junk just deadens your kid's taste buds so that natural sweet just isn't sweet enough any more. It's deliberate on the part of the "food" producing companies and their marketers.

Until the schools start waking up to what's going on and teaching HEALTH again (in all its meanings....i.e. kids as whole, healthy people), our kids are going to keep facing health problems.

I am sorry I have no solution and my heart goes out to you.

Same here!...

We're the parents. We want to decide how often and what junk my children gets .
Now is summer time and we like to eat ice cream once a week or so. By if somebody offer to my LO one big cookie once a day, they going to be addict to sugar in no time. They going to demand that cookie the day they skipped, not matter what!


----------



## MommaCrystal (May 25, 2006)

We go to church... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts - then candy or chocolates as a reward for good behavior. We go to playgroup at the family resource center.... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts. We go to gymnastics - juice boxes at the end. These are all places where I have not control over what is served unless I take a turn serving. But I've basically been asked not to because I provide water and trail mix, dried fruit, homemade fruit roll ups or the like. A lot of these places are adopting policies where only packaged food can be served. That makes it even harder!

We go to basketball - all the concession choices are junk (at least here I feel I can say no).

We stop at grandma's house... junk. We go to Mimi's house (other grandma) MORE junk. HUGE hurt feelings if I don't go along. I've had outright ARGUMENTS with family over the JUNK! It makes no difference. Then my kids view me as the huge bad guy because I said no to the treat grandma wanted to give them.

We go to a birthday party... junk junk junk.

I go to a meeting where childcare is provided.... JUNK!

This leads to 7 days a week of JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK! I'd say one snack a day is JUNK!

People get REALLY offended when you say no to what they serve.

What's worse it makes me MORE hyper vigilant at home! We can't enjoy a reasonable treat from time to time in our own house because every time we set foot out the door it is JUNK!


----------



## NiteNicole (May 19, 2003)

I hate to be the ranting "Back in my day" lady but - when I was a kid, we just didn't have all these snacks. We went to ball practice or played a game and then we were handed off to our parents. There were no snacks. There were no snacks for things that only took an hour or two. I don't even get the point of that. Kids are getting heavier and heavier so we've tacked a snack onto everything? And not some kind of filling snack, but just junk? You don't give a hungry kid a fruit roll up!

I really really dread this. My daughter isn't in a lot of activities yet, but she is somewhat overweight. I am so careful about what comes into our house, but I can not control the world. I am already seeing less of my family (we all tend to congregate at my mom's) because my mom leaves cookies, Sprite, and chips (things we don't even BUY) ON THE COUNTER and people just randomly hand things to her when she asks for them. She has a neurological problem that means she can't run (right now) and I've convinced them that "some people have found" that artificial sweeteners cause flare ups (this is actually true), I should have lied and tacked on HFCS while I was at it.

I really really worry about this kind of thing. I grew up in a home where both parents worked and my mom's solution was to fill the house with convenience foods. I and all three of my siblings have weight problems, self image issues, various bouts with eating disorders, and at the moment we are ALL overweight. I try so HARD to keep my child from going down this road and signing her up for activities would SEEM to be a good option but if they tack a freakin' snack on to every single one, how is that helping?

There are days I think I will go back to school and study nutrition, then become a crusader for children. I am worried that we well never be able to reverse this obesity situation. No recess, cutting PE at school, and now with every activity, a snack.

So much for my not ranting. Oops.


----------



## Tigeresse (Nov 19, 2001)

We did Montessori and Waldorf preschool when my oldest was little....one had a no sugar policy and the other was all homemade stuff. I remember checking out another preschool that had an only packaged food policy......no thanks. After that, we homeschooled, and have been ever since. I agree what the PP said, we are now in circles where healthy eating is the norm. Many people that are in are homeschool circles are also in our various food co-ops and CSA's...even those become social outlets for the kids.

That said, when we are out and about I don't restrict junk too much, we do the free cookie at the store, fast food when travelling, eat less-than-stellar at friend's houses that don't eat the way we do, that type of thing. It used to drive me nuts that in soccer the games had to capped off w/junk food. I would just let the kids have it but would always bring something healthier that was somewhat mainstream when it was my turn to bring snacks. I remember bringing a bowl of orange slices that the whole team devoured. I always hoped the rest of the parents would notice and start bringing fruit, never happened.

Now my kids are older and have a really good idea of what is and isn't junk. The 3 oldest definitely try to choose healthy for the most part (they are 18,14 and 10) and have told me they feel the difference when they eat crappy stuff. The youngest, well she has a sweet tooth. We're working on that!


----------



## InMediasRes (May 18, 2009)

OH gosh, I feel the same way and my little guy is only 3 so he's not even in that many activities yet.

It doesn't help that hubby is not totally on board with healthy eating. It makes me feel all alone AND like a total nut job for being this crazy about it.

I especially feel bad about telling our neighbor kids no when they bring stuff out for my DS. They always ask a million questions, and while I like that I have an opportunity to educate them, I don't want them to feel bad (or make their mom feel bad when they tell her!) that they subsist on Pringles and Chips Ahoy!


----------



## InMediasRes (May 18, 2009)

And I agree.... I don't remember having snacks with our activities when we were little. If we went to girl scouts, it was after dinner. It was always assumed that everyone should be full. Sports, you would always just be headed home for lunch afterward. They would hav a jug of water.... that's it.

Me neighbor kids don't even know what broccoli looks like.


----------



## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NiteNicole* 
I hate to be the ranting "Back in my day" lady but - when I was a kid, we just didn't have all these snacks. We went to ball practice or played a game and then we were handed off to our parents. There were no snacks. There were no snacks for things that only took an hour or two. I don't even get the point of that. Kids are getting heavier and heavier so we've tacked a snack onto everything? And not some kind of filling snack, but just junk? You don't give a hungry kid a fruit roll up!

I totally agree! I did soccer as a kid, and our parents brought water bottles and that was the only "snack" we had. Then we'd go home and have lunch.

I feel like so much of this is just because there's been such a backlash to the 70s style "neglectful" parenting (I say that semi-sarcastically, but almost everyone I know had plenty of childhood experiences that no way would pass muster as being either safe or sane in most any household today) that parents today want to be "involved." And bringing snacks seems like an easy way to be involved. It's totally ridiculous.

I have nothing against a snack at preschool, because that's largely a socialization thing. The kids learn to sit still and eat in a group, not snatch their neighbor's snack, they usually help pass things out and clean up, they make conversation. There's probably at least one kid somewhere in the class who has never eaten a meal sitting at a table instead of in front of the TV. But the amount of food in question is usually so small that there's absolutely no excuse in not having it be something healthy!


----------



## BarnMomma (Dec 12, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommaCrystal* 
We go to church... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts - then candy or chocolates as a reward for good behavior. We go to playgroup at the family resource center.... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts. We go to gymnastics - juice boxes at the end. These are all places where I have not control over what is served unless I take a turn serving. But I've basically been asked not to because I provide water and trail mix, dried fruit, homemade fruit roll ups or the like. A lot of these places are adopting policies where only packaged food can be served. That makes it even harder!

We go to basketball - all the concession choices are junk (at least here I feel I can say no).

We stop at grandma's house... junk. We go to Mimi's house (other grandma) MORE junk. HUGE hurt feelings if I don't go along. I've had outright ARGUMENTS with family over the JUNK! It makes no difference. Then my kids view me as the huge bad guy because I said no to the treat grandma wanted to give them.

We go to a birthday party... junk junk junk.

I go to a meeting where childcare is provided.... JUNK!

This leads to 7 days a week of JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK! I'd say one snack a day is JUNK!

People get REALLY offended when you say no to what they serve.

What's worse it makes me MORE hyper vigilant at home! We can't enjoy a reasonable treat from time to time in our own house because every time we set foot out the door it is JUNK!

This is how I feel. I feel that if we leave the house it's a battle to keep the junk away and frankly, DS is 3 and his body is growing and he does not need junk in his little system at all.

DS takes an art class...great class, but at the end is snack time. WTF? WHY does there have to be a snack? And why can't it be reasonably healthy instead of oreos? We've had to start leaving early just to avoid the stupid snack. Sometimes in order to avoid the hassle I have to stoop to lying about food allergies which I hate to do.

Heck, sometimes I insist on throwing massive parties for our huge family that I have neither the energy or time for just because I can avoid the junk that way. I bake my own cakes, cookies, bread, and make my own ice cream. I feel at least DS knows what a cookie is, but I can control the ingredients.

And to be perfectly honest DS is attending a Waldorf school in September just because it's the only school around that will make an organic snack...like soup or fresh bread. So I'll be driving 45 minutes for PRESCHOOL because I feel that strongly about the junk that is in most foods these days and the horrible addictive and social influences it has on our kids.

Maybe I need to lighten up but think about it, food is just not food anymore. There is so much junk added to practically everything that "just a little bit" "now and then" adds up so quickly that it's a lot and daily.

And yes as a parent I have nightmares about how to help DS fit in down the line when he's older but still keep his diet as clean as possible and how to teach him about food and what's in it(he knows quite a lot already because we talk about it and we grow lots of things and visit lots of farms) so that when he's older he'll make smart choices.

Sorry, rambling here but I feel so overwhelmed sometimes by the "food" that is available today.


----------



## kavamamakava (Aug 25, 2004)

I'm the annoying mom who talks to the school about the snacks and gives ideas of snacks they could use that aren't so junky. We are vegetarians so I have to do this anyway because I don't want them handing out rice krispy treats to my kids or gummy worms with gelatin. Sometimes I supply the snacks like Late July cheese crackers or pretzels or jolly beans.


----------



## Raine822 (Dec 11, 2008)

I know the family fight well. My mother insists on giving DD not just junk but the worst possible junk. Things that we don't allow DD AT ALL. If I say no she sneaks it behind my back and tells DD that I said no but grandma will give it to you anyway. (My mother is no longer in our lives due to this and MANY other reasons).

We also try to compromise by allowing DD some sweets but ones that we feel are better. DH has diabetes so I have learned to make less sugary snacks that still taste good.


----------



## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BarnMomma* 
DS takes an art class...great class, but at the end is snack time. WTF? WHY does there have to be a snack? And why can't it be reasonably healthy instead of oreos? We've had to start leaving early just to avoid the stupid snack. Sometimes in order to avoid the hassle I have to stoop to lying about food allergies which I hate to do.

Maybe my priorities are really off, but this annoys me if only because I'm paying for an ART class! If I'm paying for an hour of art, I want an hour of art, darn it. If I want to pay for my kids to eat, I'll take them to a restaurant after the art class, thank you. I would be really annoyed if only for that reason...


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

This has been a scary thread. I do remember the junk being awfully prevalent in ds1's elementary school. But, there have been policy changes since then. (Some of them actually don't thrill me that much, even though I agree with the reasoning behind them.) I always sent ds1 with a sandwich and a piece of fruit or chopped veggies, and he was free to drink as much water as he liked at school...both because I felt it was the best thing to drink, and because I was pretty broke. But, many of his classmates had lunches packed with candies and stuff. It kind of blew my mind, as I only ever remember kids having candy at school during the week right after Halloween or Easter...a single piece of Halloween candy or a small chocolate egg. A lot of ds1's classmates used to buy pop in the vending machines at school all the time, too. Those machines are gone. There's been progress...but there are still vending machines serving "Milk 2 Go"...which comes as plain milk, but also in chocolate, strawberry, vanilla, orange and banana. *sigh*

The snacks at activities described in this thread blow my mind, though. My kids never did soccer, but my oldest nephew did. The snack (during the break at the middle) was _always_ orange wedges. DS2's preschool has a "healthy snacks" rule, as did ds1's kindergarten. (DS2 usually gets a couple small slices of cheese, plus some fruit or veggie. DS1 used to take chopped veggies most of the time...he loved green peppers and broccoli back then.) The kindergarten class talked about the snacks and why each one was good for you and things like that. I can't even begin to imagine ds2's preschool teacher/director handing out fruit roll-ups!

I like candy as much as anyone else - more than most, if we're going to be honest - but I don't understand this push to give kids candy and sweets _all the time_. It's so messed up.


----------



## Raine822 (Dec 11, 2008)

Some people have tried to tell me that fruit snacks/fruit roll ups are healthy because they are made from fruit. WHAT?


----------



## naismama (Oct 28, 2005)

This thread is scary...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 

ETA so what would you do re: the preschool? Tell them they can't serve him the garbage everyone else eats? It's over this month, so no point in pulling him out. Always bring a snack to tee ball? Maybe I will do that--I can't believe anyone would buy, let alone eat that Froot Foot. And they wanted to give some to my 2 y/o!!!

And everytime I see "froot foot" in print it makes me giggle, it's so ridiculous.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Raine822* 
Some people have tried to tell me that fruit snacks/fruit roll ups are healthy because they are made from fruit. WHAT?

I know several people who think that way. IMO, they're candy, pure and simple.


----------



## MommaCrystal (May 25, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I know several people who think that way. IMO, they're candy, pure and simple.

MY fruit roll ups are healthy! I puree fresh fruit in my food processor and dry it in my food dehydrator. No sugar or anything added. But because it doesn't come from a package people think it is weird. It is DELICIOUS! And with this packaged only food policy I keep hitting every where because so many children have allergies these days... UGH!


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Dried fruit snacks aren't quite the same as fruit rollups, though. You can even buy reasonably healthy dried fruit snacks (not as good as homemade, though). I give those to my kids sometimes. Fruit rollups are a whole other...thing...


----------



## MommaCrystal (May 25, 2006)

So WHAT do we do about this?

My church doesn't have a packaged food only policy. I think I'm going to just start bringing a bag of grapes or the like every week. I think they'll use it and even be grateful. I'll grab a gallon of water too. That will help there. I think part of the issue is the woman who teaches that has two children who she says will absolutely not eat fruits and vegetables no matter what she does. She can't believe my kids do. She must not think ANY kids do. So she doesn't serve it.


----------



## r&mmommy (Oct 25, 2009)

Quote:

I hate to be the ranting "Back in my day" lady but - when I was a kid, we just didn't have all these snacks. We went to ball practice or played a game and then we were handed off to our parents. There were no snacks. There were no snacks for things that only took an hour or two. I don't even get the point of that. Kids are getting heavier and heavier so we've tacked a snack onto everything? And not some kind of filling snack, but just junk? You don't give a hungry kid a fruit roll up!
I agree. I don't remember snacking quite as much as children do now (even my own







)
BUT, Has anyone tried to point out to their child's teachers that they could perhaps serve better things? I have been happy with my DD's preschool - the snacks are *mostly* fresh fruits, water to drink. But I would have no problem making an objection to things like Cheese Doodles, Chips, etc.
I've always been an "everything in moderation" kind of gal, but like the OP I'm beginning to realize that even moderation adds up.


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
Dried fruit snacks aren't quite the same as fruit rollups, though. You can even buy reasonably healthy dried fruit snacks (not as good as homemade, though). I give those to my kids sometimes. Fruit rollups are a whole other...thing...

No, homemade fruit leather looks pretty much like fruit rollups. Before dehydrated, it's a thick liquid, then when it's dehydrated, it's in a sticky sheet like a fruit roll up. Nutritionally it's like dried fruit, though.

Dd used to like it, but has kind of outgrown (?) it. Anyway, she doesn't ask me to make it anymore, thank goodness... took forever!


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommaCrystal* 
So WHAT do we do about this?

My church doesn't have a packaged food only policy. I think I'm going to just start bringing a bag of grapes or the like every week. I think they'll use it and even be grateful. I'll grab a gallon of water too. That will help there. I think part of the issue is the woman who teaches that has two children who she says will absolutely not eat fruits and vegetables no matter what she does. She can't believe my kids do. She must not think ANY kids do. So she doesn't serve it.

I am loving these responses!







But of course it is depressing, too, lol. LIke this--we have been lax about attending church and haven't put DS in Sunday school yet--are you telling me that I have to worry about that too?!? And your church lady's attitude--that is it in a nutshell. People buy the junk "because that's what kids like." I don't know how to combat that w/o offending someone. Either you're saying they're a lazy parent (not able to say no) or ignorant (not understanding basic nutrition) or both.

I also never had snacks as a part of school or church activities, and certainly not sports activities. And in my tee ball example, it's a 50 minute game in the afternoon. 50 minutes!!! These kids can't go an hour w/o mainlining sugar? I bought some fruit leather--actual fruit--today and I'm going to trade the cr*p he gets this weekend for it. I'm not going to fight the fight w/ the other parents. If they don't care or know any better (more likely), so be it.

I'm already dreading kindy next year. I taught high school and the soda machines were a big, big fund raiser--that can't possibly be the case in elementary school. Can it??? And that milk thing--I consider ultra pasteurized milk to be a small step above a Sprite. Oh, that's another rant--Froot is good because it's from fruit, and Sprite is ok for a toddler b/c it doesn't have caffeine. I've had these arguments w/ people! Insane!!!

It's no wonder kids are fat. And today's health headline is about the increase in stomach cancers among 20-45--I'm guessing nitrate related. Bring on the hot lunch hot dog!


----------



## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

I don't remember having snacks at school but my mom says I did. I do remember having them at girl scouts after school and dh always had orange slices and water after soccer games.

With our kids, we kind of just let it be and roll our eyes at eachother. Dd knows what is healthy snacks and what isn't. There are 11 kids in her class and we all bring snack once a month. The other days the kids get crackers and water. It seems a lot of the families bring in cookies even when it's not their birthdays (I don't care about birthday celebrations, bring whatever you want!) But when I ask what dd wants to bring (her snack day is this Monday) she says "apples and cheese, or banana, apples and cheese, or bagels with cream cheese." So obviously it's no totally corupting her. As for lunch, she's allowed to buy twice a month, every other day she takes her lunch. Most of this is for cost reason, but has the added bonus of being healthier.

That said, many MDC'ers would consider my diet mainstream unhealthy (but "mainstreamers" would call it healthy.)


----------



## LauraLoo (Oct 9, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *r&mmommy* 
BUT, Has anyone tried to point out to their child's teachers that they could perhaps serve better things? I have been happy with my DD's preschool - the snacks are *mostly* fresh fruits, water to drink. But I would have no problem making an objection to things like Cheese Doodles, Chips, etc.
I've always been an "everything in moderation" kind of gal, but like the OP I'm beginning to realize that even moderation adds up.

My dd's K class asked for $20 from each student for the school year and then the teacher would purchase the snacks to get away from the junkie type of snacks that often are donated. I thought it was a great idea.

I quiz my dd each day on what she had for snack. They get graham crackers, cereal (Trix, Lucky Charms, Frosted Cheerios), pretzels, a wide variety of crackers, popcorn, tortilla chips, cookies (presumably packaged store bought,) and then they get candy & other treats for holidays and special events as well as birthday treats brought in by the parents which is about 2 or 3 times a month. On the surface, this is probably much better than what it could be, but I dislike a lot of the food dyes, preservatives and sugar content in a lot of those snacks. Not once has fresh fruit or veggies been offered. I think my idea of a healthy is much different than the teacher's. The nice bus driver also hands out suckers on a regular basis.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LauraLoo* 
My dd's K class asked for $20 from each student for the school year and then the teacher would purchase the snacks to get away from the junkie type of snacks that often are donated. I thought it was a great idea.

I quiz my dd each day on what she had for snack. They get graham crackers, cereal (Trix, Lucky Charms, Frosted Cheerios), pretzels, a wide variety of crackers, popcorn, tortilla chips, cookies (presumably packaged store bought,) and then they get candy & other treats for holidays and special events as well as birthday treats brought in by the parents which is about 2 or 3 times a month. On the surface, this is probably much better than what it could be, but I dislike a lot of the food dyes, preservatives and sugar content in a lot of those snacks. Not once has fresh fruit or veggies been offered. *I think my idea of a healthy is much different than the teacher's.* The nice bus driver also hands out suckers on a regular basis.









THis, totally. Today's my DS1's snack was peaches. To me, peaches in a plastic cup is a treat, but to them, that's mega healthy. They'll do peaches and water, crackers and juice, etc. They think b/c it's not Rice Crispy Treats it's great, and it certainly is better, but I wish they'd charge the extra $$ and give them a cheese stick and an apple. But OTOH, they don't have a refrigerator, so all the snacks have to be non-perishable. I guess it could be worse--Lucky Charms would send me around the bend. I guess that'll be next year's rant.


----------



## BarnMomma (Dec 12, 2008)

But you're not even safe with fresh fruits and veggies! Apples and peaches and grapes for example are HEAVILY LOADED with pesticides if they're not organic. Same for peppers and celery- so a veggie platter isn't a sure bet either. I won't touch most non-organic produce.

And milk? I agree with the poster who said it's no different than a sprite- I actually might go for the sprite first over the hormone ridden, pasteurized, homogenized, science project most "milk" is these days.

Can't even take a sip out of a drinking fountain unless you want flouride, chlorine, lead, and a cocktail of flushed RX drugs in your body. I really hate that even friggin tap water is tainted.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
No, homemade fruit leather looks pretty much like fruit rollups. Before dehydrated, it's a thick liquid, then when it's dehydrated, it's in a sticky sheet like a fruit roll up. Nutritionally it's like dried fruit, though.

Dd used to like it, but has kind of outgrown (?) it. Anyway, she doesn't ask me to make it anymore, thank goodness... took forever!

hmm....I've seen homemade fruit leather and I didn't think it looked anything like a fruit rollup - about as thin, but totally different appearance and texture. Plus, I tried to rull up my piece (for walking out to the van) and it cracked.


----------



## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

Tell me about it. My non-daycared, non-Mainly-Musiced-anymore-because-I-got-lazy, hardly-ever-has-playdates 2-year-old DD goes to the church creche every week on Thursdays while I have Bible study. MSG-laden chips and crackers, marshmallows, lollies. She LOVES salty things and will eat chips and crackers indefinitely. The food could be worse - sometimes it at least includes apple, not that she chooses it over crackers, and the kids drink water, not juice. But still, I was just reading up on the evils of MSG, so the thought that she gets a dose every week doesn't thrill me! I guess I should bring snacks, but it's a pain because I already bring baking for the adults in the Bible study.

We are planning to homeschool, and yep - one of the reasons (minor in the grand scheme, but hey) is that she won't feel bad about eating healthy food while her classmates get a packet of chips and a yoghurt-coated muesli bar every day! I used to get so jealous of my friends' junk food...







DH works from home, and it'll be great for us all to keep sitting down to homemade soup and bread or toasted sandwiches or egg foo yung for lunch every day.







But what I'll do about the extracurriculars, I don't know... Yipes!


----------



## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Raine822* 
Some people have tried to tell me that fruit snacks/fruit roll ups are healthy because they are made from fruit. WHAT?

You can get non candy ones. Sun-rype makes some, they are just fruit.


----------



## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

Whew, I never realized that this problem existed on this scale. DD was in Montessori-based daycare until she was two and now is in a Pre-K - 8 Montessori school. In both places we were/are required to bring all of her lunches and snacks. In fact, both places have a no-sharing policy. Some of this may be due to the fact that both places were comprised of diverse groups of kids. At her current school, there are kids that observe kosher and Halal dietary laws, and there are a lot of vegetarians. Another factor is the food allergy issue. Aside from that, most of our friends/family have the same dietary habits that we do, so it has never really been an issue for us. DD does get sweets at home or when we're on trips, but DH and I pretty much take a balance approach.

One thing that has helped is that DH and I have spent a lot of time figuring out how to make DD's lunches and snacks appealing so that she is less inclined to be jealous of other kids' snacks. We also have this game now with one of our puppets: the puppet has no teeth and feels incredibly tired and sick all the time. Why? Because all she eats is junk! It has been a good learning tool because DD will actually point out "junk" when she sees it. I mean, she sees kids eating "junk" when we simply walk down the street. Embarrassingly, she'll loudly point it out sometimes. It has been a challenge keeping her mind focused on eating healthy stuff, but constant reinforcement seems to have worked thus far.


----------



## mamaw/two (Nov 21, 2005)

My oldest dd is in 2nd grade and I am astonished at the amount of junk they try to give the kids at school. I try to eat healthy, but we do still eat out once in a while. I really don't want it piled on my growing dd everyday though. What I have done is send snacks to school with her and pack her lunch everyday. She has serious behavior problems when she eats artificial food colorings, so we can tell if they gave her something. We also offer lots of healthier alternatives, so that she doesn't feel like she's not getting a treat when others are (for example- all fruit popsicles, fruit juice sweetened lollipops, pure chocolate bars, and homemade deserts). It takes work in communicating with the teachers and also alot of talking about health and nutrition with dd. She is very happy with the way things are and can't believe all the gross stuff the other kids at school have to eat at lunch (chicken nuggets, corn dogs, bbq "ribs", and the list goes on and on). We are also very lucky that the school allows us to bring her lunch into the fridge in the morning and they heat it up for her at lunchtime, so she gets a hot meal most days.


----------



## NellieKatz (Jun 19, 2009)

A great resource to read if you care about this issue is anything by Michael Pollan. "Food Rules" I think is the name of a little book where he boils it all down to some basic rules to keep yourself out of trouble, foodwise.

On another topic, I was listening to a story on NPR today about soda pop and they said, regarding soda machines in schools, that the soda companies don't make that much money on them, but it's the SCHOOLS that make the money off the vending machines.

So imagine how twisted that is if it is the cash-starved schools that want the stupid junk machines in there! (sigh)

As with everything, follow the money. Big corporate money on the one hand and under-funded schools on the other. The well-being of the kids gets put to the side.


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
hmm....I've seen homemade fruit leather and I didn't think it looked anything like a fruit rollup - about as thin, but totally different appearance and texture. Plus, I tried to rull up my piece (for walking out to the van) and it cracked.









Here's a good example the way we make fruit leather and how it looks pretty much like a fruit roll up when done. You must do it much differently than I do because mine is very pliable and a little bit sticky and rolls up perfectly.


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Duplicate


----------



## ewe+lamb (Jul 20, 2004)

Here in France they have - in general stopped all snacks at school because of the terrible diet habits of some of the families, the kids go into school at 8.30 and finish at 11.30 we then have lunch and then there is nothing until 4.30 when the kids come out - therefore the choices of the parents are exactly that, our kids get fruit, a homemade cake or biscuit and water, we never buy soda and our dd at 8 really doesn't enjoy soda or juice of any kind - except cranberry, and will eat chocolate but only dark - she doesn't like things if they are too sweet - thank heavens, unfortunately ds has a much sweeter tooth than dd and it's more of a problem but we're getting round it still with fruit and if I make some biscuits in dinosaur shapes, - sugar IMO in just a flavour so you can add or take away as much as you like most of the time it's not essential to a recipe so with most of the recipes I use I will half the amount of sugar - at least; as with school the activities that they partake in outwith school doesn't allow any snacks during or after the activity - there's a huge drive here to encourage folk to eat minimum of 5 fruit or veg a day - some never make it, but on the tv etc they are really pushing the healthy eating programmes with top chefs so to encourage folk to change their habits! Some of the stuff the schools have been serving up to kids is really frightening.


----------



## Joyster (Oct 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Irishmommy* 
You can get non candy ones. Sun-rype makes some, they are just fruit.

My kids loooove those. Heck, so do I. I nearly died of shock one time when my trainer who was insanely strict offered me one as a treat.

I'm starting to feel pretty lucky with our experience. The only time my kids get junky juice is at church, I'm not going to begrudge since church doesn't have a lot of money. School is healthy snacks (except for special days, like yesterday the ice cream truck came), cookies are at my discretion, playdates have all sorts of goodies, but nine times out of ten, the kids all seem to go for some pita or fruit or cheese and that's about it.


----------



## Geist (Jan 27, 2010)

Quote:

I hate to be the ranting "Back in my day" lady but - when I was a kid, we just didn't have all these snacks. We went to ball practice or played a game and then we were handed off to our parents. There were no snacks. There were no snacks for things that only took an hour or two. I don't even get the point of that. Kids are getting heavier and heavier so we've tacked a snack onto everything? And not some kind of filling snack, but just junk? You don't give a hungry kid a fruit roll up!
And you've hit the nail on the head. I don't get it either why no matter what people do these days, there has to be a snack. When my nephews go to soccer games on the weekends, it's at say 10 to 12. They eat breakfast beforehand, play, and then afterward, you'd think they'd just go straight home for lunch. But no! First a snack because NO ONE CAN GO MORE THAN 3 HOURS WITHOUT EATING, I guess. So, they eat 300 calories worth of caprisun and rice crispy treats and then aren't hungry for lunch. The crap calories crowd out the good.

It's the same thing with adults, unfortunately. My husband has noticed this at work that someone is always bringing in snacks and one of the ways the company shows it appreciates its employees isn't through raises (no one's gotten one in years) but by bringing in some sort of treat and putting it in the breakroom. My husband (who is from Finland, btw), has reached the conclusion by observing his co-workers that most Americans eat about one meal a day, it just lasts the entire day. People think he's weird because he rarely snacks but then eats quite a bit at lunch ("like a horse!" one co-worker described it) and they're always giving him snacks which he periodically brings home and dumps on us.

Why is it we can't do anything these days without food being involved? I myself can't remember the last time I got together with my friends without food being involved somehow.


----------



## MaterPrimaePuellae (Oct 30, 2007)

I love this thread. It makes me feel a little less crazy.

The nursery in the church we attended before we moved served CORN POPS as the snack in the 1-2 year old nursery. Puffed corn w/ corn syrup on top.







I had actually just finished reading In Defense of Food and I was horrified when I realized what they were handing out to the children. (In their defense, they had some children w/ wheat allergies, so the snack options were limited... but seriously, then, just don't give snacks!)

We also have the family situation. Thankfully, our families are mostly supportive (even when they think I'm being a little nutty), but I feel like I'm imposing on them by making "demands," especially w/ my in-laws. My MIL is SO, so sweet, but she grew up very poor on a farm in the Ozarks. They raised their own chickens, her mom made lots of things from scratch-- so, for her, "packaged" food still seems superior and like a luxury item (she can't even stand the taste of free range chicken eggs and won't eat even conventional brown eggs!) The worst part is that she buys things I don't like DD to eat (like, nitrate-containing bacon) and says, "Oh, I know, just let her have a little piece!" Bacon w/ nitrates is not a "treat," and I don't want DD to think that it is!

I have found that it is very, very hard to practice moderation in this area. As soon as I caved and let DD have one of the cheap-o lollies from the drive through ATM, she wanted one *every time* and came to expect it. As soon as I said, "Oh, sure, let her have the goldfish crackers" (not so bad in the grand scheme, but not an organic cheese stick, either!) it because a "special thing" that my mom always buys for her when she visits. She wants a free cookie every time we go to the grocery. She says, "But mommy, I _like_ artificial colors!"


----------



## madskye (Feb 20, 2006)

DD goes to a school where I have to pack snack and lunch--at first I was overwhelmed but now I really like it. Still, she likes her gogurts--and still she probably has one junky snack a day--but I feel like it could be a lot worse and I'm happy to have some control over what she's fed all day.

Birthday parties are tough--I just take my lumps and plan the rest of the day around it. I know we'll have junk and cake etc--so I plan a healthy breakfast and dinner and push water the rest of the day.

OP, you are right about 3 being a tough age and a "slippery slope"...


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
Here's a good example the way we make fruit leather and how it looks pretty much like a fruit roll up when done. You must do it much differently than I do because mine is very pliable and a little bit sticky and rolls up perfectly.

oops - I don't make it - I had someone else's. It looked like the stuff in the link, but it cracked a little when I rolled it. The fruit leather in the link looks yummy.

I think we just have a different take on what a fruit rollup looks like.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Geist* 
And you've hit the nail on the head. I don't get it either why no matter what people do these days, there has to be a snack. When my nephews go to soccer games on the weekends, it's at say 10 to 12. They eat breakfast beforehand, play, and then afterward, you'd think they'd just go straight home for lunch. But no! First a snack because NO ONE CAN GO MORE THAN 3 HOURS WITHOUT EATING, I guess. So, they eat 300 calories worth of caprisun and rice crispy treats and then aren't hungry for lunch. The crap calories crowd out the good.

It's the same thing with adults, unfortunately. My husband has noticed this at work that someone is always bringing in snacks and one of the ways the company shows it appreciates its employees isn't through raises (no one's gotten one in years) but by bringing in some sort of treat and putting it in the breakroom. My husband (who is from Finland, btw), has reached the conclusion by observing his co-workers that most Americans eat about one meal a day, it just lasts the entire day. People think he's weird because he rarely snacks but then eats quite a bit at lunch ("like a horse!" one co-worker described it) and they're always giving him snacks which he periodically brings home and dumps on us.

Why is it we can't do anything these days without food being involved? I myself can't remember the last time I got together with my friends without food being involved somehow.

I think the frequency of snacks is connected to how frantic a lot of people's lives are. There isn't time for three sit down meals each day, so they just grab something and go.

And, honestly...I don't think there's any inherent problem with snacking a lot, and not eating "square" meals. The problem is that so many snacks contain no nutrients and are just full of calories. It's also harder to keep track of how much one is eating, but it can be done.


----------



## velochic (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
oops - I don't make it - I had someone else's. It looked like the stuff in the link, but it cracked a little when I rolled it. The fruit leather in the link looks yummy.

I think we just have a different take on what a fruit rollup looks like.









May be. I've only seen fruit rollups in ads on TV.







Mine doesn't crack, though... it's pliable. And yummy according to dd. And so much healthier than the commercial stuff.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velochic* 
May be. I've only seen fruit rollups in ads on TV.







Mine doesn't crack, though... it's pliable. And yummy according to dd. And so much healthier than the commercial stuff.

Oh - I wish I'd only seen them on tv. They look like plastic, imo. They're _really_ gross, and I find it hard to believe that real fruit is involved in any part of their manufacturing.

The stuff I had sounds like yours...maybe she dehydrated it a little longer or something. It was sticky, yummy, fruity goodness. I'm getting hungry just thinking about it.

If I can ever get my kitchen clutter reduced, I'll get my dehydrator back from my mom's house. I'd like to try making homemade fruit leather. (At my current rate of decluttering process, I should be doing that in time for my grandkids to try it out...maybe.)


----------



## half-pint (Oct 27, 2007)

Our life is a 24 hour constant battle with the food-laden obstacle course that every day life has become. My son has Prader-Willi Syndrome, with the hallmark feature being an insatiable hunger and drive to eat. He is nearly 4 and the food-seeking behavior is not full blown yet but it is there. His metabolism is much slower and many people with PWS can only consume around 800-1000 calories a day, which is a starvation diet. One little donut does "hurt" quite a bit on this type of diet.

Ugh. Food is EVERYWHERE as I my son and I are now painfully aware. His daycare is actually pretty good with the snacks they provide but I would raise a stink if they served crap like pop-tarts and chips on any day, let alone a few times a week. For us, we have a medical excuse to make a fuss but it boggles my mind that schools (esp preschools) and their directors don't see how wrong it is to give a 3 year old a donut for a snack.

And the CONSTANT grazing!! Why does every activity have to include a snack (and usually an awful one at that) The NY Times had a article on this very subject which was great http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/20/dining/20gusti.html

So,I feel your pain, times 10. May is National Prader-Willi Awareness Month so this is my small plug. If you watch TV, you can see a family with PWS on Extreme Home Makeover airing on Mother's Day.


----------



## NiteNicole (May 19, 2003)

I am really really worried about how we're handling food (and how it's grown, made, and sold) in this country. It's so hard to turn something around once it's this deeply entrenched and I feel like I'm down here bailing out my sinking ship with a Dixie cup. Or maybe siphoning it off with an Oreo Sipahh.


----------



## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

Quote:

won't eat even conventional brown eggs!
Um... she does realise brown eggs aren't healthier than white, right? They're not "wholemeal" eggs... just from different coloured chickens..? I mean, my sister used to refuse to make meringues with brown eggs because meringue is white so she figured the eggs should be too... but she was, like, eight. That is one of the oddest food hangups I've come across.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NiteNicole* 
I am really really worried about how we're handling food (and how it's grown, made, and sold) in this country. It's so hard to turn something around once it's this deeply entrenched and I feel like I'm down here bailing out my sinking ship with a Dixie cup. *Or maybe siphoning it off with an Oreo Sipahh.*


I don't watch much tv so I had to Google that. Oh. My. God. Yet another reason why I can't let my children watch commercial tv.How can the people who develop these products sleep at night?


----------



## SaoirseC (Jul 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Geist* 

Why is it we can't do anything these days without food being involved? I myself can't remember the last time I got together with my friends without food being involved somehow.

I love that part about being with friends- we all makes one or two things and share. BUT we all know each other's dietary quirks, and everything is home made (one close friend is paleo, some are gluten free, others are vegetarian, etc). On the other hand, it does bother me when I go to a social function (that isn't held with others who are sensitive to health) and everything is CRAP! No, I don't want my kids hyped on artificial colors or HFCS, or GMO grains... grr, that part does bother me.


----------



## Geist (Jan 27, 2010)

Quote:

I love that part about being with friends- we all makes one or two things and share. BUT we all know each other's dietary quirks, and everything is home made (one close friend is paleo, some are gluten free, others are vegetarian, etc).
Yea, usually it is just something that friends do together, but after thinking of all the activities that people have where food ends up being involved, it dawned on me with a kind of horror that, wait, it's not just kids! When we go over to a friend's house after dinner, we always bring snacks, usually sweet (sure, homemade, but still!) and then there's the traditional roasting on peeps over the fire...everything we do involves food, even if we aren't hungry!


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Geist* 
Yea, usually it is just something that friends do together, but after thinking of all the activities that people have where food ends up being involved, it dawned on me with a kind of horror that, wait, it's not just kids! When we go over to a friend's house after dinner, we always bring snacks, usually sweet (sure, homemade, but still!) and then there's the traditional roasting on peeps over the fire...everything we do involves food, even if we aren't hungry!

There's an interesting article in this month's Atlantic on obesity and one of the things it mentions as part of our obesity culture is the fact that it's now socially acceptable to eat at any time, which wasn't the case 50+ years ago. I've asked my mom what snacks she ate as a child in the 50's and the question surprised her. She said they ate 3 meals a day and that was it, she didn't remember ever eating a snack at home other than popcorn on a weekend night. Now we eat at school, at church, at work, while shopping--you can stuff your pie hole 24 hours a day and no one will think anything of it until you're a candidate for bariatric surgery. Like grocery carts with a drink holder--you can't grocery shop w/o a soda or coffee!?! I had to explain the cupholder to my 5 y/o the other day--at Bass Pro Shop. And yes, we ate a box of popcorn while we were there!


----------



## Sara Badger (Jul 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
I would think you'd be in the majority at MDC! Or you mean the whole "forbidden fruit" angle? Now I"m worried that I"ve ruined him--he's already tasted all this cr*p. He understands the nutrition of it (as much as a 4 y/o can understand), but it's hard when everyone else eats it--it's hard for me as a parent!

ETA so what would you do re: the preschool? Tell them they can't serve him the garbage everyone else eats? It's over this month, so no point in pulling him out. Always bring a snack to tee ball? Maybe I will do that--I can't believe anyone would buy, let alone eat that Froot Foot. And they wanted to give some to my 2 y/o!!!

I did do this! I told them he will bring his own, and he has. Unless it's fresh fruit or veggies he eats his own. we struggled about it for about a week and now he's happier! Plus no more sugar crashes when he gets home. We hav now gone gluten free for him and that made it easier to explain to the teacher and school. He's my kid and I have to be the one to stick up for him.


----------



## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
There's an interesting article in this month's Atlantic on obesity and one of the things it mentions as part of our obesity culture is the fact that it's now socially acceptable to eat at any time, which wasn't the case 50+ years ago. I've asked my mom what snacks she ate as a child in the 50's and the question surprised her. She said they ate 3 meals a day and that was it, she didn't remember ever eating a snack at home other than popcorn on a weekend night. Now we eat at school, at church, at work, while shopping--you can stuff your pie hole 24 hours a day and no one will think anything of it until you're a candidate for bariatric surgery. Like grocery carts with a drink holder--you can't grocery shop w/o a soda or coffee!?! I had to explain the cupholder to my 5 y/o the other day--at Bass Pro Shop. And yes, we ate a box of popcorn while we were there!
















I'm not sure I totally believe that there was never any snacking in the olden days, though. On old sit coms and in old books, the kids have a snack every day after school. My mother told me that when she was a kid (in the 50s), all of the mothers on the block would get together for coffee and coffee cake every afternoon after their chores were done and the older kids had gone back to school from lunch. They'd move down the street, at one house the first day and the house to the right the next day and so on. And whoever had hosted the day before was in charge of bringing the coffee cake. Personally, having a slice of coffee cake every day sounds like more snacking than I do now!

I definitely agree that there is much more snacking than there used to be. But I think that social occasions have always included snacking. If you read old magazines there are always suggestions for what to serve at your weekly bridge game and so on. In old books, there's always a cake or cookies in the pantry for unexpected guests. Providing food has ALWAYS been a part of hosting any sort of event.

I think the difference is maybe that we do more social events than in days past, especially if you include every youth soccer game as a "social event." That's definitely something that wasn't the case 50 years ago! Maybe the difference is that these kid events weren't seen as social events akin to adults entertaining one another, but one of the signs about the waning existence of childhood in our culture is that we're imposing adult societal norms on children's events.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I'm not sure I totally believe that there was never any snacking in the olden days, though. On old sit coms and in old books, the kids have a snack every day after school. My mother told me that when she was a kid (in the 50s), all of the mothers on the block would get together for coffee and coffee cake every afternoon after their chores were done and the older kids had gone back to school from lunch. They'd move down the street, at one house the first day and the house to the right the next day and so on. And whoever had hosted the day before was in charge of bringing the coffee cake. Personally, having a slice of coffee cake every day sounds like more snacking than I do now!

I definitely agree that there is much more snacking than there used to be. But I think that social occasions have always included snacking. If you read old magazines there are always suggestions for what to serve at your weekly bridge game and so on. In old books, there's always a cake or cookies in the pantry for unexpected guests. Providing food has ALWAYS been a part of hosting any sort of event.

I think the difference is maybe that we do more social events than in days past, especially if you include every youth soccer game as a "social event." That's definitely something that wasn't the case 50 years ago! Maybe the difference is that these kid events weren't seen as social events akin to adults entertaining one another, but one of the signs about the waning existence of childhood in our culture is that we're imposing adult societal norms on children's events.

True, but snacking/eating is soooo ingrained into our every waking moment now. The whole coffee klatch thing didn't emerge until the suburbs did--and I never noticed June Cleaver partaking; then again, she was a size 2--but even that was a structured activity, not something mindless or spontaneous. And the kids walked home from school, ate and walked back--if only! Now it's drive off campus, load up on trans fats, drive back, and lucky if that's all your teens are doing.









Today we don't need an excuse to eat, social or otherwise. I don't think it was as socially acceptable, even expected, to eat while shopping, while at work, while driving--heck, there weren't drive-throughs or a reason to go to them nightly ie both parents working/over-scheduled children.

I also don't think people are more likely to congregate socially now, far from it--do any of us belong to something like a weekly-meeting bridge group? How many of us do anything regularly socially that isn't kid-related? I know I don't, nor do most of my friends. Who's got the time? Most 50's moms didn't work outside the home and certainly didn't spend their time driving their children hither and yon in search of enriching activities.

And portion size, holy moly. I saw some old movie on TCM and the couple was in the theater eating popcorn--sharing this little itty bitty bag and taking out one kernel at a time to eat. The "children" popcorn you can buy now is 3x larger!

Re: the children's events becoming more like adult events, that is such an interesting observation, but I really see it more as food as a reward, or food as love and attention. A bunch of moms sitting around sharing a snack and coffee is a social event, but a bunch of kids standing around slurping down juice boxes and eating Froot Foot before scattering seems to me more about rewarding them for the game, or implying that the parents love them enough to give them a "treat"--I put it in quotation marks since the treats are so ubiquitous any specialness is destroyed.

I dunno, the point of my ramble is that all this eating has become the new normal and IMO it's a contributing factor as to we're so much fatter than we were 50 yrs ago.


----------



## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

About after-game snacks - could you bring watermelon? I have yet to meet a child so jaded it doesn't think watermelon's a treat. It's not just another boring fruit, you know? I'm not a fruit fan myself, but I love it...


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sara Badger* 
I did do this! I told them he will bring his own, and he has. Unless it's fresh fruit or veggies he eats his own. we struggled about it for about a week and now he's happier! Plus no more sugar crashes when he gets home. We hav now gone gluten free for him and that made it easier to explain to the teacher and school. He's my kid and I have to be the one to stick up for him.

I sent an email yesterday requesting the snack menu so I could provide a healthier alternative on days I disagreed with. Haven't heard back so my battle will continue next week.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smokering* 
About after-game snacks - could you bring watermelon? I have yet to meet a child so jaded it doesn't think watermelon's a treat. It's not just another boring fruit, you know? I'm not a fruit fan myself, but I love it...

That's a GREAT idea! But I've decided I'm going to broach the idea for NO snacks--I mean, give me a break, it's a 50 minute game after lunch and they all have water bottles, surely they can go home and have a snack, right? I'm going to start the vanguard against mindless 24/7 snacking. Or I'll be the mean freak mom, lol.


----------



## phathui5 (Jan 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
Sorry, poor choice of cut/paste and my words. I didn't mean to offend, sorry if I did.







I meant in my own situation. I didn't expect a morning preschool or sports activity to include junk food, so what's my alternative, not attend? That was my sketchy thought process, not a comment on h/s. Maybe I've had too much HFCS.









Could you help the school work on setting up a healthier snack list?

Talk to directors of sports activities about the importance of nutrition for the kids?


----------



## Geist (Jan 27, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I think the frequency of snacks is connected to how frantic a lot of people's lives are. There isn't time for three sit down meals each day, so they just grab something and go.

And, honestly...I don't think there's any inherent problem with snacking a lot, and not eating "square" meals. The problem is that so many snacks contain no nutrients and are just full of calories. It's also harder to keep track of how much one is eating, but it can be done.

And all of this is part of the problem. Really, I don't think it's a matter of not having time to sit down to eat three meals a day, it's not making it a priority. When I was an exchange student in Germany, both my host parents worked full-time, my host mom worked more than full time running her own insurance angency and doing all the housework on top of that. Every morning she got up at 5 to start ironing, eat breakfast with my host dad and host brother before they left for the day, and then sit at the table with my host sister and me when we got up because she didn't want us to eat alone! As an American who always ate breakfast alone, I thought this was crazy, but it's a priority for them that you eat meals together, as a family. Other than the three meals a day, snacking was rare: an occasional yogurt here and there and on Sundays we had Coffee and Cake around 3 or 4.
Somehow, I can't help but think a culture that values grabbing a pastry and coffee from Starbucks on the drive to work and then snacking all morning because the pastry didn't give you the nutrients you needed, then a microwaved frozen meal followed by more snacking followed by fast food over eating an actual good meal with family is sick.

And about controlling the amount of calories, well really that's the problem. It's damn near impossible and most people don't bother. Aside from the fact that people chronically underestimate their caloric intake, I tried this in college eating "6 small meals a day" and religiously measured everything I stuck in my mouth to keep with my calorie range to lose weight. It sucked. I never felt satisfied and eating was a burden. I didn't go over because it was so rigid, but it's no wonder most people can't do this.


----------



## hollytheteacher (Mar 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommaCrystal* 
We go to church... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts - then candy or chocolates as a reward for good behavior. We go to playgroup at the family resource center.... juice (Capri Sun) and doughnuts. We go to gymnastics - juice boxes at the end. These are all places where I have not control over what is served unless I take a turn serving. But I've basically been asked not to because I provide water and trail mix, dried fruit, homemade fruit roll ups or the like. A lot of these places are adopting policies where only packaged food can be served. That makes it even harder!

We go to basketball - all the concession choices are junk (at least here I feel I can say no).

We stop at grandma's house... junk. We go to Mimi's house (other grandma) MORE junk. HUGE hurt feelings if I don't go along. I've had outright ARGUMENTS with family over the JUNK! It makes no difference. Then my kids view me as the huge bad guy because I said no to the treat grandma wanted to give them.

We go to a birthday party... junk junk junk.

I go to a meeting where childcare is provided.... JUNK!

This leads to 7 days a week of JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK JUNK! I'd say one snack a day is JUNK!

People get REALLY offended when you say no to what they serve.

What's worse it makes me MORE hyper vigilant at home! We can't enjoy a reasonable treat from time to time in our own house because every time we set foot out the door it is JUNK!

I know EXACTLY what you mean. It makes me feel so sad that I feel like *I* can't occasionally offer ds a really fun total junk food item just for a fun treat now and then...but i don't /can't because I feel like grandparetns/kid events/bday parties/ etc. sort of ruin it for us. He gets more "sometimes" foods than I'd like...and even then i don't think the ppl giving them even realize. like they think he hasn't had enough junk or something...it's sooo weird and i hate it and it makes me sad that ppl give their very young children soda and junk food


----------



## Polliwog (Oct 29, 2006)

What is Froot Foot? Are you talking about Fruit by the Foot? Either way, it's gross but I was wondering what you were talking about.


----------



## karemore (Oct 7, 2008)

"What's worse it makes me MORE hyper vigilant at home! We can't enjoy a reasonable treat from time to time in our own house because every time we set foot out the door it is JUNK! "

That drives me nuts too! I feel like I can't buy my own daughter a small valentine candy, or a chocolate easter bunny because she gets SO MUCH JUNK from both sides of our family and every event we attend.

I am thinking about pulling my daughter out of Sunday school because of all the junk they serve there. Donuts in the fellowship hall with something from a powder mix to drink, and then cookies or candy during sunday school.


----------



## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

I'd consider the snacks your ds's preschool serves to be a breach of contract. They promised "healthy snacks" when you agreed to pay his tuition there, they need to do that or give you a refund.

As for sports snacks, what I'm used to seeing for adults who are doing sports all day (okay, 8-12, lunch then more casually 1-4) is orange wedges, pickles, pretzels, and water. And the lunch is usually protein heavy, both the offered lunch and the lunches people pack for themselves.

Honestly, if the kids aren't running around enough to crave salts and water, they aren't running around enough. Craving sugars after physical activity means you aren't moving enough.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Geist* 
And all of this is part of the problem. Really, I don't think it's a matter of not having time to sit down to eat three meals a day, it's not making it a priority. When I was an exchange student in Germany, both my host parents worked full-time, my host mom worked more than full time running her own insurance angency and doing all the housework on top of that. Every morning she got up at 5 to start ironing, eat breakfast with my host dad and host brother before they left for the day, and then sit at the table with my host sister and me when we got up because she didn't want us to eat alone! As an American who always ate breakfast alone, I thought this was crazy, but it's a priority for them that you eat meals together, as a family. Other than the three meals a day, snacking was rare: an occasional yogurt here and there and on Sundays we had Coffee and Cake around 3 or 4.
Somehow, I can't help but think a culture that values grabbing a pastry and coffee from Starbucks on the drive to work and then snacking all morning because the pastry didn't give you the nutrients you needed, then a microwaved frozen meal followed by more snacking followed by fast food over eating an actual good meal with family is sick.

Well, when I was eating all the time, I didn't have time to eat. If I'd gotten up at 5 am to make breakfast, etc., then I'd have been down on even more sleep. Right now, ds2 has to be at preschool at 12:30, and one day a week, we go straight from there to dd1's ballet. That means we have breakfast, have an early lunch (have to be finished by about noon to be out the door on time), then get home no earlier than 4:45, to start making dinner. Yes - I could reschedule dd1's ballet, or ds2's dance class...but the available times would all push dinner back. I really don't think a meal at 8:00, another meal at 11:30 and then dinner at 6:30 or 7:00 makes a lot of sense, yk? My kids need a snack in there somewhere.

The culture is sick, but there's space between grabbing a pastry and coffee from Starbucks and sitting down to eat an actual meal with your family. I don't have sit down breakfasts (and have never been able to stomach big meals first thing in the morning, in any case), but I eat a couple of hardboiled eggs, and some fruit and/or yogurt...not a pastry.

Quote:

And about controlling the amount of calories, well really that's the problem. It's damn near impossible and most people don't bother. Aside from the fact that people chronically underestimate their caloric intake, I tried this in college eating "6 small meals a day" and religiously measured everything I stuck in my mouth to keep with my calorie range to lose weight. It sucked. I never felt satisfied and eating was a burden. I didn't go over because it was so rigid, but it's no wonder most people can't do this.
Where have you heard that most people can't do this? I know several people who do very well on weight management through six small meals or all day "grazing" eating patterns. They don't track calories or measure...they're just _aware_ of what they put in their mouths. It's not like "6 dates at 10:30, a cracker at 11:10, half a cup of yogurt at noon" - more like "I had those dates, and a cracker...maybe I'll have some yogurt now". Where I think people run into trouble is when they completely _forget_ about the dates and the cracker, and think the yogurt is all they've eaten in three hours.

I'm interested in the talk about the 50s. My mom grew up in the 50s, and while she's never suggested food was _everywhere_, she certainly snacked. I always had an afterschool snack every day, as did most of my friends, in the early 70s.

There is a lot more snacking going on these days, but I still think the bigger problem is the quality of the snacks. IMO, there's a big difference between some oranges with water to drink (standard snack at my nephew's soccer games), and Fruit by the Foot with Capri Sun or pop, yk?


----------



## Happiestever (May 13, 2007)

I remember having orange slices and water for snack at soccer games. I remember a friend crying to her dad that she wanted soda in her water bottle and dad was adamant that she have water in her WATER bottle. I still think about this all the time.
I wish fruit lasted long enough for me to take it outside with us. The kids gobble it up at an alarming rate.

However we went to a farm this morning and got about 20 lbs of oranges so at least we will have those for a while- they might even last a whole week if I'm lucky.


----------



## verde (Feb 11, 2007)

Wow. Just read through this thread. Like the OP my DD has occasional junk food but it's rare. One variable that has not been brought up yet (unless I missed it, apologies if I did) is the effect of TV. My DD does not watch cartoons on TV. She does watch some Vids/DVDs but not commercial TV. When we had the blizzards in Feb I allowed her to watch cartoons on Saturday morning and was AMAZED and HORRIFIED by the number of junk food commercials. Junk food is pushed nonstop on TV to children and adults. Some of the jingles say it all -- being FULL, big is good, "mansized" meals. If you watch lots of TV then you will be flooded with thousands of ads for junk food.

My DD really does not know about lots of the junk food and or sugared cereals and, so far, she has not asked for it. She's still asking for fruit when we go out. I'll try and keep that going for as long as possible...


----------



## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

There is a lot more snacking going on these days, but I still think the bigger problem is the quality of the snacks. IMO, there's a big difference between some oranges with water to drink (standard snack at my nephew's soccer games), and Fruit by the Foot with Capri Sun or pop, yk?
I agree with this. I truly believe it is not about the frequency or system by which you put food into your body, but the type of foods you consume. We're 100% grazers here. We don't have the traditional three meals in our family, even though DH and I both grew up that way. We eat when we're hungry and we usually eat raw vegetables, fruits, nuts and something with protein. I can't remember the last time we had a traditional meal in our family. We're all very thin and we always have been. Now, if our grazing included McDonald's fries and potato chips or some other food that qualifies as junk, I can guarantee that we'd have issues. I sort of shrug when people attack "snacking" but like the PP said, the bigger problem is the quality of the food. I think that the whole square three meals a day idea was based on an agricultural model - people needed a big breakfast in the morning so that they could work in the fields all day, and would come home famished. Plus, cooking from scratch required a good deal of time and people did not have access to "convenience" foods that we have now - even stuff like crackers. If you reach back in time when people foraged for their food, I imagine that they ate when they could find food and ate all day long if food was in abundance. Now, people can sit down and eat one danish and possibly consume half or more the calories they need in one day before 9 am. For me, the problem is over-consumption of useless calories, not snacking. I'm not attacking the three-square-meals-a-day philosophy, but I think its unfair to blame the frequency of eating rather than what is actually being eaten.


----------



## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CatsCradle* 
I agree with this. I truly believe it is not about the frequency or system by which you put food into your body, but the type of foods you consume. We're 100% grazers here. We don't have the traditional three meals in our family, even though DH and I both grew up that way. We eat when we're hungry and we usually eat raw vegetables, fruits, nuts and something with protein. I can't remember the last time we had a traditional meal in our family. We're all very thin and we always have been. Now, if our grazing included McDonald's fries and potato chips or some other food that qualifies as junk, I can guarantee that we'd have issues. I sort of shrug when people attack "snacking" but like the PP said, the bigger problem is the quality of the food. I think that the whole square three meals a day idea was based on an agricultural model - people needed a big breakfast in the morning so that they could work in the fields all day, and would come home famished. Plus, cooking from scratch required a good deal of time and people did not have access to "convenience" foods that we have now - even stuff like crackers. If you reach back in time when people foraged for their food, I imagine that they ate when they could find food and ate all day long if food was in abundance. Now, people can sit down and eat one danish and possibly consume half or more the calories they need in one day before 9 am. For me, the problem is over-consumption of useless calories, not snacking. I'm not attacking the three-square-meals-a-day philosophy, but I think its unfair to blame the frequency of eating rather than what is actually being eaten.

Even though we are a 3 squares family, I agree with everything you are saying here.


----------



## JL83 (Aug 7, 2009)

This discussion seems so bizarre to me.

If you browse the various forums on this board and someone posts about how their 1/2/3/10yo is having meltdowns, the first suggestion is to make sure the kid has more snacks. "Is he hungry?" people ask. I've seen suggestions to have snacks waiting in the car when picking kids up from school so they can eat on the drive home.

And yet, when the "mainstream" world want to have snack available, that's suddenly a "bad" thing?

I run an inhome daycare. We eat every 1.5 to 2 hours. Otherwise the kids go crazy. Breakfast at 8am, snack at 9:30/10am, lunch at 11:30/12. Then snack after naps at 3:30 and some crackers while waiting for parents at 5.

I also remember from the first year I played soccer as a 4yo that we had oranges at half time. Every soccer game I played as a kid had that sugar pick me up half way through. There were schedules sent home saying which game which family had to bring oranges to.

I also ski raced, and our team had the "hot chocolate mom" who's job it was to take the team thermos thing and bring hot chocolate to all the meets so we didn't all have to buy it. That was offered once in the morning and once in the afternoon (and we were expected to eat breakfast at home, buy/pack a lunch and then go home for supper).

If the problem is the quality of the snacks, then make that the issue. I think it's ridiculous to dump all over the idea of snacking.


----------



## peaceful_mama (May 27, 2005)

I agree with the "It's not snacking, it's *what* the snack is"...AND somewhat with the "what's up with the *constant* snacking anyway?"

I can see the snack and lunch *both* provided at my son's preschool, even though he is only there from 9-12:15. It's integrated with HeadStart. There might be children in his class who literally do not have food to eat for breakfast before they come to school. So there's the snack when they come in. And there's lunch before they go. (also some kids ride the bus for an hour, and some come from daycare--their last meal could've been a couple hours before school at that rate and probably a quick piece of toast and fruit or something...if it wasn't processed, packaged, grabbable junk.)

I also get after-school programs serving a snack--it's been a good 3 hours since lunch by the time they get there, and 2-3 before they will go home, where someone will have to cook the dinner, if they don't go through the drive-through.

BUT. Here is the but. My son's school doesn't do this...but some of you are saying your schools do. The thing is, if you are seriously serving a snack because you think the kids do not get to eat before they come, serve FOOD. Serve a mini-meal. Do *not* serve a donut/cookie/processed sweet snack, and juice.
My son's class has cereal and milk on Mondays. (low-sugar, non-colored) One other day a week is *usually* veggies with dip and some sort of cracker. (this to me needs a protien, but PB is out, and I think cheese is out due to fat b/c of the ranch dip, according to their rules) Other snacks include a muffin or baked bar (not pre-packaged) and fruit, a cheese stick with crackers, cheese sandwich, graham cracker and fruit...mostly some decent stuff. (other than the pre-mentioned lack of protein sometimes, but they have milk with their snacks quite a bit, so there's at least some there.)

One of my kids' fav. snacks is cheese and crackers and fruit. Easy, and I don't know too many kids who would *not* eat that....that is what I think *most* after-school snacks should look like. Some sort of protein, fruit/and or veggie, treats occasionally.

I agree too with the "what's up with the CONSTANT snacks?" I can see it for a soccer game, the oranges and water. Lots of fluids. But junk juice and junk snacks? NO! just seems to send the wrong message about health with the activity.
And it shouldn't be a family financial cost thing....it's *got* to be cheaper, or equal to provide a big bag of oranges, sliced, and water. Even if you buy ind. bottles!

I don't think *everything* needs a snack...we didn't do this when I was a kid either---the vacation bible school thing I went to had a snack, but it was 3-4 hours long. A 2 hour meeting involving kids occuring after lunch should not need a snack unless it is something like Girl scouts getting a cooking badge, or somebody brings a treat because it's their b-day or whatever.

I don't think kids need to *expect* to be fed whereever they go...I think it teaches somewhat that it's OK to not eat what's served because you'll get something better in an hour or so...
AND I think it contributes to obesity...because....like a PP said, you don't hand a hungry kid a fruit-roll-up. (or some candy fruit snacks, or whatever) It will not fill them up. It will give them extra sugar, and an extra bunch of calories. (and in the end, they will probably eat more calories overall than if they'd just gone home for lunch without it)

While we are on the subject of snacks and food....most of this processed junk too requires little effort to eat it, chewing, etc. I think that too might be part of the obesity epidemic....I read somewhere that foods that require more chewing--think even a steak, not just salads or raw fruits and veggies, the chewing actually adds to our sense of how full we are....and we're satisfied sooner.
So...by this theory, people will eat more of the foods that require less chewing, and they also tend to pack more calories....which of course make us fatter.
Score another point for fruit slices and veggie sticks over Twinkies....


----------



## Triniity (Jul 15, 2007)

Sorry, I didn´t have the time to read the whole discussion, just my thoughts here:
I actually made them change the food they serve at childcare.







I went to the parents meeting (and - yeah was a little stared at - having a sling and kids in organic cotton and stuff) - but we discussed food, and I asked about chemicals in there and they were like: Everybody eats ready-made-meals and the stuff is in there as well - I answered: Actually no, we don´t. And my kids shouldn´t have to.
And they actually started to think about it. A couple of month later, (me being the head of the parents group by then







) the offered a different provider for the food. It´s not all organic yet, but it´s all regional, fresh food, freshly cooked, no preservatives, no food colours, no other nasty stuff. And the kids actually like it!
One of the caregivers actually congratulated us for bring the best snack box ever for our kids, I try to put fancy food in there, like fancy cut up stuff, apple "crowns" and star carrots and stuff, cut out sandwiches and no sweets. except dry food and stuff.

At the moment it works _


----------



## Bellabaz (Feb 27, 2008)

This is one of our reasons why we left the US. Complete lack of common sense on teeh part of *adults* when it comes to food. Here is not perfect but I don't worry about what dd1 eats in preschool (because I wouldlove to eat what she gets-a 3 course meal everyday!). I feel like you, the occasional treat at a special occasion like a birthday party etc., is fine. But pastries, cakes, cookies, 4 days a weeks is not okay. I bring healthy snacks that can at least compete with the others. For instance dd loves choc flavored yogurt, nuts, granola bars for her are like cookies, etc. It works better than fruit when your up against doughnuts. Or I make a deal like you can have half that cookie and half your yoghurt or something similar. We have also started to discuss what teh different foods do to your body. She is still young for it but I feel its better to lay the ground work now.


----------



## Bellabaz (Feb 27, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *verde* 
Wow. Just read through this thread. Like the OP my DD has occasional junk food but it's rare. One variable that has not been brought up yet (unless I missed it, apologies if I did) is the effect of TV. My DD does not watch cartoons on TV. She does watch some Vids/DVDs but not commercial TV. When we had the blizzards in Feb I allowed her to watch cartoons on Saturday morning and was AMAZED and HORRIFIED by the number of junk food commercials. Junk food is pushed nonstop on TV to children and adults. Some of the jingles say it all -- being FULL, big is good, "mansized" meals. If you watch lots of TV then you will be flooded with thousands of ads for junk food.

My DD really does not know about lots of the junk food and or sugared cereals and, so far, she has not asked for it. She's still asking for fruit when we go out. I'll try and keep that going for as long as possible...

This is extrememly true. Both I and my French teacher as well as some others in my class have found this to be true. So important to be aware of commercials and their effects.


----------



## Geist (Jan 27, 2010)

Quote:

when I was eating all the time, I didn't have time to eat. If I'd gotten up at 5 am to make breakfast, etc., then I'd have been down on even more sleep.
Please, don't think I was talking specifically about you, I don't know you and didn't mean you or anyone specifically.. There's no way I can peer into your house and know your family's habits or how well they do or do not work for you. What I can see are the habits of the people I know: my family, my friends, in the US and abroad. And what I see is that Americans all snack more than the Germans I know, the Ukrainians I know and the Finns I know, who tend to eat more square meals. To make matters worse, the vast majority of snacking involves junk food: overly processed crap.

Quote:

Where have you heard that most people can't do this? I know several people who do very well on weight management through six small meals or all day "grazing" eating patterns.
Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. I also know a few people who do graze all day without being overweight, but they are the exceptions rather than the rule. Read this: Why Are Americans So Obese?
The pertinent points are that 90 percent of the increase in calorie consumption in men in the United States since 1977 has come from between-meal eating. For women, it's 112 percent and that calories from meals have actually gone down. Additionally, "The average number of snacks increased by 60% over this period, thus more snacks per day -- rather than more calories per snack -- account for the majority of the increase in the calories from snacks."
In otherwords, permasnacking!
Sure, studies have been done that show that people who eat 6 small meals a day have a faster metabolism and lose more weight than people who don't, but this is under controlled laboratory conditions. None of us actually live in laboratories and those of us who are grazers and not overweight can happily pat themselves on the back because the are exceptions to the rule.

Now regarding other countries: Snacking and Obesity in China
And a very interesting article regarding the US:
OUr National Eating Disorder


----------



## MJB (Nov 28, 2009)

Wow, we just haven't run into this. Maybe because we live in Ann Arbor?
My 4 yr. old has a snack at preschool, and all the parents take turns bringing it. Today he had Annie's cheddar bunnies and strawberries. Yes, cheddar bunnies are glorified goldfish crackers, but I don't object to them. I know the snack one day last week was pretzels and pears. Usually it's popcorn/crackers/pretzels and some sort of fruit. If it's a birthday, it's cupcakes and some sort of fruit. Otherwise he eats at home, and I let him have moderate amounts of cake/juice/candy when it comes up at parties and holidays.
My 7 yr. old eats school lunch every day and while it isn't the healthiest, it's not terrible. Today they are having turkey hot dogs, baked beans, and apples. They offer a selection of milk but I don't allow him to get chocolate or strawberry. He gets water instead. He mostly does sports through the Y which doesn't do the snacks. When he's played on school teams that have snack, I usually just try to set a good example by bringing healthy snacks and water. However, even the least healthy snack has been cheez-its and 100% juice, which is okay once a week IMO.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Geist* 
Please, don't think I was talking specifically about you, I don't know you and didn't mean you or anyone specifically.. There's no way I can peer into your house and know your family's habits or how well they do or do not work for you. What I can see are the habits of the people I know: my family, my friends, in the US and abroad. And what I see is that Americans all snack more than the Germans I know, the Ukrainians I know and the Finns I know, who tend to eat more square meals. To make matters worse, the vast majority of snacking involves junk food: overly processed crap.

I didn't think you meant me, in particular. I just mean that it's been documented that most Americans (Canadians, too) are sleep deprived. It's not just me. People are running on empty, and trying to keep going at a ridiculous pace. It's not about whether they/we WOH, or not - it's about the overall pace.

Quote:

Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. I also know a few people who do graze all day without being overweight, but they are the exceptions rather than the rule. Read this: Why Are Americans So Obese?
The pertinent points are that 90 percent of the increase in calorie consumption in men in the United States since 1977 has come from between-meal eating. For women, it's 112 percent and that calories from meals have actually gone down. Additionally, "The average number of snacks increased by 60% over this period, thus more snacks per day -- rather than more calories per snack -- account for the majority of the increase in the calories from snacks."
In otherwords, permasnacking!
Sure, studies have been done that show that people who eat 6 small meals a day have a faster metabolism and lose more weight than people who don't, but this is under controlled laboratory conditions. None of us actually live in laboratories and those of us who are grazers and not overweight can happily pat themselves on the back because the are exceptions to the rule.

Now regarding other countries: Snacking and Obesity in China
And a very interesting article regarding the US:
OUr National Eating Disorder
How many grazers who are eating _real_ food have this problem? My guess is that it's not very many. People who are snacking on crap between meals are suffering blood sugar spikes and crashes, and messing up their hormones, so that they don't feel satisfied. (I can never remember the name of the satiety hormone, but it is affected by a crappy diet.) It's really not because they're snacking or grazing - it's because of what they're snacking on. If people are eating a snack that pretty much guarantees they'll be hungry again (because their blood sugar has crashed and they ate not fats/protein), then they'll snack again in an hour, instead of in 2 or 3...but the _type_ of snack is the root problem.

I have serious problems with sugar addiction. My bff used to try to eat "low fat", and messed herself up badly. We're both grazers...and we both eat fewer snacks when we're not stuffing ourselves with crap. It's not because we count calories or keep track that much better. It's because snack number one doesn't leave us craving snack number two 45-60 minutes after we eat it.

There's also the "mindless snacking" problem. There's a _huge_ difference, ime, between sitting down at the table with a handful of nuts and an apple, and standing at the pantry doors, eating potato chips/cookies out of the bag. (I do both, sadly.) I'll remember sitting down and eating the apple and nuts...the chips or cookies will pass out of memory as soon as I'm done.


----------

