# Updated pics, toddler rash getting worse...PLEASE help!!



## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

So DS's rash is getting worse and spreading.







The doc said he thinks it's just the after effects of a virus he had last week, but I'm sceptical.

The last 2 pics are from today. You can see how much worse it's gotten in just days.
(I had just slathered him in coconut before taking the pics today, that's why he's all shiney) It is itchy and red and raised and rough. It started as small red bumps over 2 weeks ago.

Any ideas?

http://public.fotki.com/NeedSleep/jakes_rash/


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## CrazyCatLady (Aug 17, 2004)

I have no ideas. But here's a bump for ya.


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## Autumn Breeze (Nov 13, 2003)

That's what I look like when I get poision ivy. I've gotten it from direct contact, my dh, and my cat. So, I'd suggest jewel weed tincture which you can use topically (I used it while pregnant after my mw gave it to me)

((hugs))


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## kaPOW! (Aug 15, 2006)

Does it blanch (turn white) when you press on it? If not, you need to take him to the ER right away as it might be meningococcal related, although he has had it for a while now... Either way, you should have it looked at since it's not getting better. It sure looks a lot like my babe's diaper rashes, though. I'd put triple paste on it.

I hope it's not bothering him too much!


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## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

That *really* looks like poison ivy to me. You said it's itchy, right? Perhaps he keeps brushing up against it, the oil from the plant can remain on things for a while, like if he got it on his carseat, shoes, etc. Mine starts out as a couple of bumps & continues to pop up for a week or so in different places. I don't think I keep getting reinfected, I think it just takes a while for it to pop up in different areas of the body.

That second to last one, where he's all shiny from the coconut oil *really* looks like it to me.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Hmmm..... wouldn't the doctor have recognized it as poison ivy? I took him Thursday (the first set of pics)

I've never had poison ivy, so I no idea what it looks like.

I called teh doc yesterday and told him it's getting worse, but he said to just continue watching it, that he thinks it's viral.

What would you do?? What would you put on it?? Where can I get jewel weed ?


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## kaPOW! (Aug 15, 2006)

They can miss Anything. I had chicken pox when I was 16 and the dr. misdiagnosed it.

Is there anyway you can email your dr. the latest pics?


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

I'm gonna call him in the morning and ask about emailing him a picture.


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## Mama Rana (Aug 18, 2004)

My first thought was poison ivy as well. Oatmeal baths feel really good on that. And I second the fact that the oils can stay on things (cats, clothes, etc.) for ages, and I'll also add that I'm not convinced that the seepage from the bumps can't spread the rash. Just my 2 cents. I just found poison ivy in my sister's front flower bed amidst her ground cover, right next to her front door. It's becoming a huge problem in some areas for some reason. And it's rather a nuisance plant (hard to get rid of). Good luck finding the source of his rash, and getting it cleared up.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

I guess I don't know if it's itchy. He grabs at it when he wakes up, but that's it.

(He's 2 btw) He's never been one to scratch at bug bites though, so I have no idea of it's itchy.


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## mama_b (Dec 14, 2004)

Looks like poison ivy to me. At least, that's what mine used to look like.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

I think I would insist on a culture to see what it is.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Well I'm now certain it's bothering him. He can't sleep ata ll tonight, been tossing and turning and slapping at his legs.

Guess the poor fella just hasn't learned to scratch yet. Guess that's a good thing really...

Gonna give him an oatmeal bath first thing tomorrow and then ork on drying this up instead of oiling it up as I have been.

Ugh, I'm so frustrated that I had no idea this could be poison ivy. I was making it crazy worse putting oils on it....


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## living_organic (Sep 25, 2006)

I don't know anything about poison ivy...but my nephew had a bad diaper rash like that and we followed grandpa's advise and put "Nupercainal" on it. I found it at Walgreens with the preperation-h, etc. It said not to use on kids under 2 but we didn't see that till after...anyway it seemed to give him releaf right away, then it cleared up within a day-day 1/2.
There's my 2 pennies!
Good Luck!


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

So it's not oozy or seaping or anything like that. Wouldn't poison ivy do that? (please forgive my ignorance!!)


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## Mama Rana (Aug 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Still_Learning* 
So it's not oozy or seaping or anything like that. Wouldn't poison ivy do that? (please forgive my ignorance!!)

Maybe, maybe not. Usually seeping occurs when blisters form on top of blisters. Any luck getting ahold of his ped?


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama Rana* 
Maybe, maybe not. Usually seeping occurs when blisters form on top of blisters. Any luck getting ahold of his ped?


Not yet, left him a message, you know how that goes, he'll call me about 5pm....


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## stellimamo (Jan 9, 2006)

How bout impetigo? My dd has a rash JUST like that and that is what the DR dx it as. We had to use antibiotics to clear it up... but now its back. The Dr thinks dd harbours the basteria in her nose or on her bum. It started as poison Ivy and then went on to become impetigo.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Doc says I can bring him back in if I want, but he really feels it's viral.

That just doesn't make sense to me....viral rashes strat on your torso,this is on his legs. Plus, it's getting worse 2 weeks after he had the virus.

I just don't know.

I almost bout some poison ivy stuff for 40 bucks, but it said not recommended for rashes that weren't poison ivy, so I decided to wait...

I'm gonna try and take him to a naturopath and see what he says....


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## thriftyqueen (Mar 2, 2006)

Could it be scarlet fever? That is a rash on the torso and can spread to the legs. Seems like that can sometimes come on after a cold (virus). I had it once when I was in high school, but I can't remember the details of it.

I would definitely try a naturopath.


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## siennaflower (Aug 31, 2004)

Looks like my daughters Roseola rash. This generally comes a week after the virus.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FlutterBee* 
Looks like my daughters Roseola rash. This generally comes a week after the virus.


See, I was wondering if it could be that. (hoping really) It's just so odd that it's on his legs instead of his torso.

I'm going to give it a couple more days to see what happens....


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## Autumn Breeze (Nov 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Still_Learning* 
So it's not oozy or seaping or anything like that. Wouldn't poison ivy do that? (please forgive my ignorance!!)

My poision ivy never oozes or seeps, that's usually poision oak or sumac. However I get PI very badly when I get it. It gets on me from one spot, and even if I wash it right away, I get it EVERYWHERE.

I have had the best luck with Cortizone creams, but if it's in a high contact area, I end up applying about 10 times a day.

Jewel Weed Tincture - which my midwife gave me while I was pregnant. I used it topically. I gave some to my dad about a week later and for both of us it was cleared up by day 3 of use. You can use this on bug bites or other itchy rashes too. You can also ingest it, though I don't remember how much my MW suggested for it. And she mentioned that if I had taken it orally, that I would become "immune" to poision ivy. I managed NOT to get it this year though, so I won't be able to test that until next year.

I'm not sure what you looked at in the drug store, but there is another good product called "Technu" which you can use both immediatly after contact, or after the rash has developed. Use it as a soap. Rinse the area, rub the technu on it for about 2 minutes, and rinse off. Careful not to scratch. They also have a itch relief product but I can't remember the name of it.I got it in a 2 pack (technu wash and the topical stuff)

I hope your Ped has called you back!


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Thanks so much everyone.

Ped did call back and said to just keep wathcing it and suggested cortisone cream.

I gave him 3 oatmeal baths today and kept Calimine lotion on it. Although it is still spreading, it's looking a bit less angry.

I have a sample of the jewelweed on the way!!


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## Sijae (May 5, 2006)

That looks exactly like something my DD had when she was about a year old! It started with little red bumps and then they filled in to make a raised, red and rough rash. It changed in appearance as the days went by and spread all over her torso but I wasn't that worried. My husband insisted we see the Ped. I predicted he would tell us it was unexplained dermatitis and that's exactly what he said and to use cortisone cream









Anyway it eventually went away and didn't come back. I wouldn't freak out about it if she has no other symptoms that would indicate a larger problem. Sometimes kids just get mysterious little illnesses and their bodies take care of it on their own.

Laura


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## mammom (Aug 13, 2004)

Hi Mama, I had poison ivy for the first time this summer and used apple cider vinegar on it - it stung a little at first, then it cleared up a couple of days later. My rash was on my forearem and was much smaller than your little guy's. I would try that. I've seen ACV recommended here several times for chicken pox (that it dries up the sores), so I thought I would try it and it worked great. I only used it once. You might need to use it a few more times since his rash is a little bigger. Mine stoped itching very soon after I applied it.

I agree with you that it's probably not viral - it should've started on his torso, or at least spread there by now!

Good luck!








Melissa

ETA - I agree with Laura in the post above mine that kids get odd things every now and then. I find the less intervention, usually the better. My ds is 2 1/2 and had two or three rashes last winter (I think they were all viral). I finally took him to the doc (D.O.) after the last one just to make sure it wasn't anythink I should worry about. That time it was roseola...


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

I know how scary it can be with unknown rashes, they seem like a symptom of everything.

I had impitego, it was more crusty and yellow/pussy, (sorry, TMI I know).

I am not a doctor, but I *believe* mennengococcol (sp?) is more bruised looking.

It's interesting that it seems to be a ring around his leg, was this by chance a cuff of a pair of shorts or can you think of anything that came in contact with that area of his leg?

This website goes through a number of questions/diagnosis about rashes, but I couldn't find one that fit your little guy. http://familydoctor.org/545.xml.

This is another good site I like: http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/e...cle/003220.htm. You can find "rash" under "R". From what I've read and the pics, it really seems like poison ivy/oak/sumac. I sometimes give antihistamine (children's Benadryl) for allergic reactions. It can apparently calm the itch if it is an allergic reaction of some sort. I hate giving medication, but if your child needs sleep, it can help.

Skin rashes can also be as a result of an allergic reaction to medication - did he take medication when he was sick?

Good luck mamma, keep us posted!
Kathy.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Thanks









He took Motrin a few times when he was sick, but nothing else.

I took him back to the ped today because he woke up with a small petechiae are (about the size of a quarter).

Doc still thinks it's nothing to worry about and will go away on it's own.
He said that since DS isn't scratching, he doesn't think it's poison ivy or an allergic reaction.

I told him that DS woke up and asked me to take his pants off last night. That I've never seen him scratch ANYTHING, even bug bites, so he's not one to scratch.

I just don't know.

It has spread to his underarm, belly and calves on both legs.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

So monkeybum has got me thinking.

Could this be a reaction to the Motrin?? He's had it in the past, but never 2 nigths in a row.


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## ~Megan~ (Nov 7, 2002)

My best bet is Fifth's Disease. That's what it looks like to me. Perhaps set an appointment with a dermatologist and see if you can get in ASAP.


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## rabrog (Dec 20, 2005)

I'd get in to a naturopath ASAP....maybe a dermatologist in the meantime. You may need a referral to get you in to a derm in a decent amount of time, BTW.

Jenn


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

I'm going to call both a dermatologist AND a naturopath first thing Monday morning.

He woke up this morning at 5 am and couldn't go back to sleep because it was itching. It's so odd, the itching only nothers him when he's trying to sleep, he never scratches otherwise.

Yesterday the ped said "if he was scratching it I'd diagnose it differently" . Of course the morning after, he starts scratching...


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## kaPOW! (Aug 15, 2006)

Poor babe. I hope he gets some relief soon.







At least it hasn't been bothering him all day, I guess.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

So another BAD night last night. He woke up at midnight and was up until 4 scratching.

I can't wait until tomorrow morning when I can call the dermatologist. Sure hope they can get us in ASAP. Surely a pediatric dermatologist is used to fitting people in??


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## kittywitty (Jul 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Still_Learning* 
See, I was wondering if it could be that. (hoping really) It's just so odd that it's on his legs instead of his torso.

I'm going to give it a couple more days to see what happens....

Roseola blanches, isn't that shiny, and is usually fainter and more spread. Looks like poison ivy or oak to me. It could just be a viral rash, though. DD#1 has had several odd ones, but never looking like that.


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## kittywitty (Jul 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamao'two* 
My best bet is Fifth's Disease. That's what it looks like to me. Perhaps set an appointment with a dermatologist and see if you can get in ASAP.

Fifth's is usually on the bum, and has a slapped cheek look. I had fifth's not too long ago, and it usually is more spread.

http://images.google.com/images?q=fi...m=10&hl=en&lr=

Roseola:

http://images.google.com/images?q=ro...m=10&hl=en&lr=

Usually when I would get ivy, it would not blister and weep. Only rarely. And mostly if I scratched.

Is there usually a lot of pressure where his rash is? i.e. pant cuffs, dipe pressure, laying on that part more. Because that would be why it is concentrated. I know hives tend to concentrate where there is pressure. Does the rash move around at all or change?

I would be suspicious of the Motrin and mention that to the doc. Hope the appt. goes well.


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

(sorry, don't know why this triple posted)!


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

(sorry again!)


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

I would definitely get into a Naturopath and Dermatologist as soon as you can. Poor little guy!

Is he in good spirits, normal behaviour etc otherwise? Does he have any other symptoms? I would be more concerned if he also had a fever or puffy eyes for example, or if the rash was turning to blisters.

Tell your Dr. he is scratching at home, don't down play it. I would like to hear what he would diagnosis it as! Maybe even go to a walk-in clinic if you can and see what another Dr. would say.

Also, again, I'm no doc, but I believe petechiae are small pin-head like tiny broken blood vessels, (sometimes from straining, severe coughing, vomiting - I have done much research on this b/c I have had them all over my torso since my first delivery). When you said he woke up with a small petechiae "the size of a quarter", did you mean one big one, or a cluster of small ones? If it's one big one the size of a quarter, that sounds more like Purpura, which can be a symptom of something much more serious. Purpura are larger areas of bleeding under the skin, (i.e. bigger than 5mm). If he has Purpura and a fever, I pesonally would take him to Emerg. Not to alarm you, but Petechiae that appear during illness, particularly with a fever can be a sign of infection in the blood, which can escalate quickly and could mean Meningococcus. Sudden onset of Purpura are not normal.

Note: if it's petechiae, (the small ones - 1-5mm) it's less serious, and this apparently can also be caused by an allergic reaction.

Interesting, taken from Motrin's website on allergic reactions to Children's Motrin.
_Allergy alert: Ibuprofen may cause a severe allergic reaction, especially in people allergic to aspirin. Symptoms may include:
hives
facial swelling
asthma (wheezing)
shock
skin reddening
rash
blisters_

From Healthsquare.com, on Motrin (I added bolding):
_What side effects may occur?
Return to top

Side effects cannot be anticipated. If any develop or change in intensity, inform your doctor as soon as possible. Only your doctor can determine if it is safe for you to continue taking Motrin.

More common side effects may include:
Abdominal cramps or pain, abdominal discomfort, bloating and gas, constipation, diarrhea, dizziness, fluid retention and swelling, headache, heartburn, indigestion, *itching*, loss of appetite, nausea, nervousness, *rash*, ringing in ears, stomach pain, vomiting

Less common or rare side effects may include:
Abdominal bleeding, anemia, black stool, blood in urine, blurred vision, changes in heartbeat, chills, confusion, congestive heart failure, depression, dry eyes and mouth, emotional volatility, fever, hair loss, hearing loss, hepatitis, high or low blood pressure, *hives*, inability to sleep, inflammation of nose, inflammation of the pancreas or stomach, kidney or liver failure, severe allergic reactions, shortness of breath, skin eruptions or peeling, sleepiness, stomach or upper intestinal ulcer, ulcer of gums, vision loss, vomiting blood, wheezing, yellow eyes and skin_

Kathy.


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## oliversmum2000 (Oct 10, 2003)

it looked like my sons eczma till the last 2 pictures

could it be an allergic reaction to something?


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Thanks again everyone.

It was a small area of petechiae, tiny cluster of red dots. That has gone away thankfully.

The doc did look at that Friday and said it doesn't look like meningococcus.

It continues to spread. I have been using Calmine lotion on it and it helps the look of it, but it continues to spread.

I'm calling the pediatric dermatologist first thing in the am and begging them to see him tomorrow.

Right now I suspect an allergic reaction or poison ivy.

I have a feeling this is going to be a loooong road to a diagnosis.


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## oliversmum2000 (Oct 10, 2003)

how frustrating


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## Autumn Breeze (Nov 13, 2003)

Wow, mama, I'm sorry your still dealing with this.

Even when my scratching was at it's worst, and the worst case of Posion Ivy I ever had, it was getting better by 7-10 days. Still spreading into some very small patches (which would last another 7-10 days for me) but the large patches were drying up, and scabbing over (from scratching). Thoes unopend, would just kinda of dissapear on their own after about a week.

I hope you can get into the derm. tomorrow.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

So tomorrow will be 3 full weeks. I noticed the rash developing on the 11th....

I'll let you all know if I get an appt in the morning.


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Ugh. The dermatologist can't see him until teh 17th and the naturopath is closed on Mondays.....


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

I called the only other pediatric derm in the area and they can't see him for 2 weeks either. WTH are people supposed to do????


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## chevy974 (Jan 6, 2002)

My dd had a rash on her hands last yr and she ended up with a petechia like rash on her fingers. We seen everyone and my wait to get into a Derm was crazy I threw a fit lol. need less to say the rash went away and never really know what it was i am thinking it was a chemical reaction and ezcema I can post pictures to you ifyou want it might help you

amy


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## menudo (May 21, 2002)

What about scabies? My (30+yo) sister just got DX with them-sounds like what you are describing! (She got them from her Doc BF who MISDIAGNOSED them! lol)

Not many other rashes of this type last so long either. Look it up online and see if it is a possibility! Good luck!


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## Max'sMama (Apr 3, 2004)

I looked at your pictures and then at my own body, I would say it's poison ivy. I have PI right now. And if we compared pics they would be practically identical. I haven't found relief with the cortisone creams, I am actually waiting for the Lactation Consultant to call back with the classification of a few antihistimines for the itch. I have tried 'everything' The only thing that has worked so far (that I can safely take while nursing) is to slather the ivy rash with cool water, then make a baking soda paste on top of it. That has really helped the itch. I agree that the oil from the plant can get everywhere. My husband actually got a couple spots on him from our bedding. Not cool. I would really be careful.

Has anyone in your neighborhood been burning brush lately, if they had any in their pile, the oil could have become airborne and made it into your yard.

Good luck. I second the pp's about getting a second opinion. Is there a walkin clinic you could visit. I went to one over the weekend and the D.O. there was great.


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## IansMommy (Jun 14, 2005)

Any update on the rash?


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

I don't know. It looks like PI but it would be getting less right now and not getting worse.

It doesn't seem like an allergic reaction either.

Man, I hope your family gets some relief soon!


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

Still Learning, how is your little guy doing?

Kathy.


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## hookahgirl (May 22, 2005)

That looks like yeast to me.
Hope you get a result soon!!
hugs!


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## Autumn Breeze (Nov 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Max'sMama* 
I am actually waiting for the Lactation Consultant to call back with the classification of a few antihistimines for the itch. I have tried 'everything' .

Jewel Weed Tincture!!

And OP







:

I'm so sorry mama!


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Thanks everyone for sticking with this.

I'm more confused than ever.

Rash, still spreading, although doesn't look as bad now that I'm using calamine lotion instead of moisturizers.

We saw a holistic doctor on Tuesday. He said if it's not gone in 2 weeks, to come in again (seems like 2 weeks is a magic number with doctors...)

I just put a call in to him this morning and am waitin to hear back. I now have a itchy rash on 2 of my fingers.

I do have some jewelweed salve I've been putting on a few of DS's spots and haven't seen a great improvement, but it's only been a day of use.









I feel like it's poison ivy, but am doubting myself because TWO doctors failed to diagnose it ....


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## menudo (May 21, 2002)

And it is NOT scabies? They last long, often start between toes and fingers, etc.

Worth a try to get checked!


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Holistic doc called back and said he really doesn't think it's poison ivy. Said it just doesn't look like it. hmm..

There are none of those red lines they say you have with scabies.

Where in the world would he have gotten scabies?? He's with me 24/7...

A possibily I will look into for sure!!


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## CallMeIshmael (Sep 12, 2004)

Hey Still:

Where exactly did your son's rash start? And what areas are involved now? Is there any rash in his hip flexor/groin area or armpit?

Wondering about something called "Asymmetric Periflexural Exanthem of Childhood," which usually starts in an armpit, but can start in a groin crease or leg as well. It causes an itchy, spreading rash that lasts several weeks and is mostly on one side of the body. Nobody knows what causes it (probably some kind of virus) and it goes away on its own:

http://www.jfponline.com/Pages.asp?AID=1919&UID=
http://www.emedicine.com/derm/topic942.htm

I'd also by thinking about pityriasis rosea (another mysterious itchy rash probably related to a virus). It's usually more symmetrically distributed, however:

http://www.aafp.org/afp/20040101/87.html


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## Still_Learning (Jan 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CallMeIshmael* 
Hey Still:

Where exactly did your son's rash start? And what areas are involved now? Is there any rash in his hip flexor/groin area or armpit?

Wondering about something called "Asymmetric Periflexural Exanthem of Childhood," which usually starts in an armpit, but can start in a groin crease or leg as well. It causes an itchy, spreading rash that lasts several weeks and is mostly on one side of the body. Nobody knows what causes it (probably some kind of virus) and it goes away on its own:

http://www.jfponline.com/Pages.asp?AID=1919&UID=
http://www.emedicine.com/derm/topic942.htm

I'd also by thinking about pityriasis rosea (another mysterious itchy rash probably related to a virus). It's usually more symmetrically distributed, however:

http://www.aafp.org/afp/20040101/87.html

Thank you!! Although the rash looks abit different, those are the most similar symptoms to his that I've seen!!

I have much more confidence that the doctors are right about it being a virus after reading those. THANK YOU!!!! He may have one a bit different, but seeing the similarities really puts me at ease.

The first doctor mistakenly told me it would be cleared up in 2 weeks. When I called the holistic doctor he also told me that a virus wouldn't cause a rash to last this long. BUT, they both said it's a virus. So naturally, I was a bit confused.

I am very relieved after reading those links. They both said that the rash will resolve by 6-8 weeks. We're approaching his 4th rashy week, so maybe the end will be soon...

How in the word did you find that info??

THANK YOU SOOOOOO MUCH!!!!!


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## monkeybum (Jan 1, 2005)

Hey Stillearning, how is your son doing? Did they get to the bottom of it?
Kathy.


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