# "Just Plain Bad Luck"



## WeasleyMum (Feb 27, 2007)

... is how our RE/infertility doc described this most recent miscarriage (yesterday), when it showed up as a blighted ovum at our seven-week scan. He means that there was nothing they could have done or we could have done differently, it's not related to the other problems we have (low progesterone), etc. And I kind of see that: looking at our history one way, you could see three pregnancies that most likely aborted due to the hormonal problem, then this one that was anembryonic. But it really has me wondering, if for no other reason than me going, "'bad luck?' After THREE other miscarriages? Seriously?!"

Because if you look at our history another way, there is only one pregnancy out of four that had an embryo, for sure.

Pregnancy # 1: I could have SWORN this one was a blighted ovum, too. The nurse never used those words, but that could have been out of kindness/tact-- the ultrasound looked just the same as this one, (dark sac with nothing inside) and the terminology she used is suspicious: "I don't see an embryo here, how far along did you say you were?" etc.

Pregnancy # 2: the one with the heartbeat.

Pregnancy # 3: ended before we could even get an u/s, at 5 1/2 weeks. Could have been either way.

Pregnancy # 4: anembryonic.

The docs say that there aren't risk factors for anembryonic pregnancies, they "just happen", (hence the "bad luck"), but if there's a chance that I've had two or even three, would that indicate some deeper problem than just the progesterone deficiency? Do they "just happen" to some people a LOT?

My DH is telling me to stop second-guessing our experts, but if anyone has any experience or information they could share with me, I'd appreciate it greatly.

TIA

(x-posted because I accidentally put the first one in the wrong place)


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## heatherh (Jun 25, 2005)

Oh, Mara. I'm sorry this happened again. Lots of









From what I've gathered while wandering around here, blighted ovums seem to be the bad-luck-not-necessarily-a-bad-sign m/c. As with most things m/c, I don't have any hard and fast data to back that up.

From what I can tell, the only reason a m/c gets classified as a blighted ovum is because they can't *see* the embryo. So could we extrapolate that the very early m/c (even the ones that hang around until 12+ weeks) are the most likely to be classified as "bad luck?" Maybe there is some substance to that.


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## jmo (Mar 18, 2006)

oh, mara, I'm so so sorry you lost another one. It does seem just so completely unfair to have 4 in a row. I see what your dh is saying, but I think it's SO hard not to feel like they (those darn experts) are missing something and there must be a reason why it keeps happening. At least that's where I'm at after 3 m/c's. I hope someone on here has more info for you. Again, I'm so sorry for your loss. My heart just breaks for you.


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## forestrymom (Jul 13, 2006)

Have you read John Cohen's book "Coming to Term" . Its a wonderful read, and he goes into detail on how it really is just "bad luck" for some people. Women who've had unexplained m/c one after another for 10 or more times...and then a wonderful uneventful perfect pregnancy and even a second.

Of course, for me, reading that some women go through it that many times was devastating, because I feared it would be me (2 m/c, one of which was a blighted ovum, before my 2 perfect pregnancies). I hope you can find hope in this post--and if you are interested in the book, I will see if I can find it and I will send it to you ffs.


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## honeybunch2k8 (Jan 14, 2008)

WeasleyMum, you must be devastated. I"m sorry for all your losses.


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## heatherh (Jun 25, 2005)

I agree that Cohen's book is a good source of hope. I just read my copy again. Mara - if you want to borrow mine, I can mail it to you if forestrymom can't find hers (or if I'm closer - I'm in Oregon).


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## ~Mamaterra~ (Jul 5, 2006)

*


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## boysmom2 (Jan 24, 2007)

I just wanted to offer my







too. I'm so, so very sorry for all you're going through. I really don't have any information to offer I just wanted to agree that it's an awful "diagnosis" to get. I too have been told I have really bad luck after 5 mc. They haven't found anything wrong with me, and I have had 2 successful pregnancies, so I think they've just given up.

You'll be in my prayers, mama.


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## blueridgewoman (Nov 19, 2001)

Oh, WM, I am so sorry to hear this.







s I agree that the blighted ovums are the "not necessarily bad sign" sort of miscarriages, but I think that because I was told by the same doctors you're seeing (Dr B and Dr W, I assume), so.....

I think of you every so often and will continue to send you strong baby vibes. It is my fervent wish that this journey ends in a fulfilling and wonderful way for you.









And... I hope you don't think this is pushy, but if you ever need to talk to someone, there is a great therapist who works with women facing fertility challenges. She really pulled me through during the hard time I had. Feel free to PM me if you'd like her name and number.


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## forestrymom (Jul 13, 2006)

I'm sorry if I'm mistaken, but doesn't it in the end say there really hasn't been a lot of research out there that confirms the efficacy of treatments for recurring m/c? And he DOES talk about a lot of circumstances where women who were once fertile and carried babies to term, now can't stay pregnant? And the mothers who can't carry over and over again getting pregnant with NOTHING changing at all? Its been a long time since I read the book (had my last m/c in 12/04 and read it right after), so I could be wrong.

In either case, I think its a great read for mothers who have suffered a miscarriage.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
First off







.

Secondly, I disagree with the above statement. I am currently re-reading the Jon Cohen book and no where does he say that things are just bad luck.

What he does describe in Chapter 6 "The Cycle of Life", is a thorough explaination of the hormonal influences that regulate our cycles. Of particular interest to you, is the explaination of luteal phase deficiency and the resulting "blighted ovums" due to implantation happening at the wrong time because of ovarian neglect from a diminshing corpus luteum.

He examines the efficacy of progesterone suppositories (which he writes that the medical community has concluded to be ineffective) and the other hormones required for trophoblast implantation. He compares the results of differing uterine testing for luteal phase deficiency and the effectiveness of these tests in diagnosis.

Finally, I have got that "bad luck" crap spewed to me too and I have come to the conclusion that it is just out of pure laziness that they aren't investigating any further, so I am taking matters into my own hands and researching, researching, researching. (hence my re-read of Coming to Term).

Much love and hope for you on this journey.


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## railyuh (Jun 29, 2005)

I am reading a book by Dr. Alan Beer (is your body baby friendly). He is (was actually, he passed a few yeasr ago) a reproductive immunologist. I am only a few pages in, but he takes a wildly different approach to losses and infertility than I've seen everywhere else. He really feels that these things happen for a reason. He even feels that people should have testing done after their first loss, not waiting for multiple losses. He says the reproductive system is overbuilt for success, so when there isn't success there is usually something going on to inhibit that. He has taken a lot of patients that couldn't be helped anywhere else and has a very high success rate.

Anyway, I would recommend looking into his book or at least reading around on the Alan Beer Center website:
http://repro-med.net/

It seems (from my own experiences and those I've talked to) that a lot of OBs and even REs will dismiss losses as bad luck. I know my OB told me that it is possible to roll the dice 3 times and come up with a bad roll every time (in refererence to my 3 losses). He totally dismissed my concerns when I asked for testing. After pushing him for some tests he finally agreed to run one blood panel for my "peace of mind"--lo and behold something did come up on the test and now I am waiting to see an RE. Sometimes I get so angry, wishing someone had tested me after my first or at least my second loss--and what if I hadn't insisted on testing? I'd probably be well on my way to another loss
















mama, I hope you find some answers or a doctor that takes your losses seriously!


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## ~Mamaterra~ (Jul 5, 2006)

*


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## heatherh (Jun 25, 2005)

I was wondering if that was the same dr from the book.

Mamaterra is right. You sometimes have to look out for your own good. Something I wonder if I should be taking to heart now. Testing, no testing, some testing... ugg.


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## WeasleyMum (Feb 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
First off







.

Secondly, I disagree with the above statement. I am currently re-reading the Jon Cohen book and no where does he say that things are just bad luck.

What he does describe in Chapter 6 "The Cycle of Life", is a thorough explaination of the hormonal influences that regulate our cycles. Of particular interest to you, is the explaination of luteal phase deficiency and the resulting "blighted ovums" due to implantation happening at the wrong time because of ovarian neglect from a diminshing corpus luteum.

He examines the efficacy of progesterone suppositories (which he writes that the medical community has concluded to be ineffective) and the other hormones required for trophoblast implantation. He compares the results of differing uterine testing for luteal phase deficiency and the effectiveness of these tests in diagnosis.

Finally, I have got that "bad luck" crap spewed to me too and I have come to the conclusion that it is just out of pure laziness that they aren't investigating any further, so I am taking matters into my own hands and researching, researching, researching. (hence my re-read of Coming to Term).

Much love and hope for you on this journey.

Thanks all of you, for your information and support. Mamaterra, this is kind of what I was looking for; some link between my "progesterone deficiency"/ luteal phase deficiency, and having blighted ovums. I'll definitely check out that book, and the other one mentioned. The two books I have on infertility right now are crap.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *blueridgewoman* 
Oh, WM, I am so sorry to hear this.







s I agree that the blighted ovums are the "not necessarily bad sign" sort of miscarriages, but I think that because I was told by the same doctors you're seeing (*Dr B and Dr W, I assume*), so.....

I think of you every so often and will continue to send you strong baby vibes. It is my fervent wish that this journey ends in a fulfilling and wonderful way for you.









And... I hope you don't think this is pushy, but if you ever need to talk to someone, there is a great therapist who works with women facing fertility challenges. She really pulled me through during the hard time I had. Feel free to PM me if you'd like her name and number.









, how did you know? They can't be the only infertility docs in the area! I really like them though, and hope they know what they're doing... They both seemed pretty confident about the progesterone treatments. I don't know if I'm ready for therapy yet or not, but thanks for the suggestion-- I'll definitely keep it in mind.


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## RainbowEarthFaerie (Oct 11, 2006)

Mara.


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## Sioko (Feb 3, 2007)

My 3 losses, none of them showed any signs of fetal tissue. 1st loss - blighted ovum, 2nd loss - ectopic (pathology report - no fetal tissue found), 3rd loss - 2nd ectopic (pathology report - no fetal tissue found). It's possible that somehow baby just got "lost" in there, or that my body reabsorbed each one before they could be "found" but on paper, I didn't make a baby 3 x's in a row.

I'm sure someone somewhere thinks they know exactly why, they prolly have lots of evidence to support their findings, but it doesn't make it not have happened. It still sux.

I'm sorry mama







s

Fourth times a charm for me, I pray your next is your charm too!


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## guestmama9922 (Aug 2, 2006)

i'm so sorry to hear you news.


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## Aurora (May 1, 2002)

I am so, so sorry.


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## blueridgewoman (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WeasleyMum* 







, how did you know? They can't be the only infertility docs in the area! I really like them though, and hope they know what they're doing... They both seemed pretty confident about the progesterone treatments. I don't know if I'm ready for therapy yet or not, but thanks for the suggestion-- I'll definitely keep it in mind.

In my experience, and unfortunately, there was quite a bit, they DO know what they're doing. When I was being treated by them, though, I did think "WHY DON'T THEY HELP ME-- DO SOMETHING!!!" a fair amount, but in retrospect, I realize that they were professional, attentive, and incredibly good at what they do. I know a lot of folks who have been treated there and no one has anything bad to say.

You have my thoughts.


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## lolalapcat (Sep 7, 2006)

After my 1st m/c, my doctor was willing to refer me to an RE. I have Hashimoto's thyroiditis, which puts me at higher risk of m/c, which is why I think the early referral was done.

RE #1 said we were young and healthy, to go try again. So we m/c baby #2 a couple of months later.

So we got referred to RE #2, who did a whole battery of blood tests, an HSG, laparoscopic surgery, and removal of endometriosis. After all of that, m/c #3. That RE was done looking for problems, and told us to 'keep plugging away'.

So I did some research, and found a doctor specializing in recurrent m/c. He had me chart cervical mucus, and did a month long battery of blood tests and ultrasounds to see if I had hormonal/luteal phase issues. Everything was okay, so he did another laparoscopic surgery including a hysteroscopy and endometrial biopsy.

He found I had a uterine infection (chlamydia), which can cause m/c. He used laser instead of cautery to re-remove endometriosis, which can cause m/c. And he put me on T3 thyroid medication to bring up my body temp, which has always been low. I spent 8 long months on antibiotics to clear up the uterine infection.

I'm now 13 weeks pregnant, which is 5 weeks further than I've ever been. And all tests are normal and the baby is developing normally, which hasn't happened before. I'm on natural progesterone injections, as insurance.

Moral of the story? I really think finding the right doctor made the difference. He was willing to look where other doctors weren't.

I still don't have a baby out of this, but for the first time in 3 years, we have real hope.

So my humble opinion is, you haven't yet found the right doctor. You are not over reacting, he is under reacting.

Good luck.


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