# Toddler on a motorcycle strapped to daddy?



## riaketty (Jul 26, 2007)

My DH is insane. We have three vehicles, my car, his bike, and a run down work van with unreliable - at best - brakes. DH wants to go to town (about 5 miles away) on Wednesday for an event, but I'll have the car all day and he's watching DD.

So he was looking up laws about having toddlers on bikes... and helmets, etc.
What he wants to do is use my mei tai either on chest or back, wrap kidlet up in long sleeves/pants and with a DOT approved helmet, and take DD on the bike with him into town. He promised he'd never go over 30mph and take back roads.

He's very responsible on his bike, and he's never had an accident and he's been riding for about 7 years now. The roads out here are very slow and rarely traveled, since we're in the middle of nowhere. Ohio doesn't have any laws against this, there's no age limit, etc.

I'm of two minds. On one hand, I feel it is safer than the van with no brakes. Especially with her all wrapped up. But on the other hand, my mommy-brain is going "WHAT!??!?"

Thoughts? Considering the distance, options, and background, would you allow your 13-month-old to go with daddy? Why or why not?


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## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

I wouldn't to the motorcycle or the van with bad brakes. Because both are unsafe for your child imo. I'd get the brakes fixed if at all possible but if not then I think dad shouldn't go.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

over my dead body


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## toddlermama16 (Jun 21, 2005)

No way.


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## Jasmyn's Mum (May 24, 2004)

From my cold dead hands!! I would never feel comfortable with that but that's just me.


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## maliceinwonderland (Apr 17, 2005)

Does he think he'd be able to do something if the mei tai started getting loose?

I'm just as torn as you are..trying to find a way to make up my mind.


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## CariOfOz (Jun 30, 2005)

Wow... I can't believe he would even consider that... Either way, I'm fairly sure it's probably ILLEGAL. And if not, well it bloody should be. Think dh would just have to miss his 'event' Or call a cab & keep the carseat at home.

ETA: ok I see he has even researched this.. and that is is unbelieveably NOT against the law. The world truly has gone to hell in a handbasket.


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## Lit Chick (Aug 15, 2007)

How about a nice 5 mile walk? Or perhaps a pedal bike ride? Or, have a friend pick everybody up. Or maybe you can drop them at the event? Or, get a babysitter.

Otherwise, ABSOLUTELY NOT. It is NOT safe. And there are a million reasons it is not safe.

Daddy's fun time should never _never_ take priority over a child's safety.


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## treemom2 (Oct 1, 2003)

We see that all the time here in Japan, but the speed limit on most roads is 40kph and most cars are used to seeing motorbikes and avoiding them. I might be okay with it if the child wears a helmet, it is only 5 miles away, on streets that aren't busy. . .not too much traffic (but I'm sure my living in Japan is really influencing my view here).


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## riaketty (Jul 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *maliceinwonderland* 
Does he think he'd be able to do something if the mei tai started getting loose?

I'm just as torn as you are..trying to find a way to make up my mind.









He said if anything felt loose or slipping, he'd stop immediately and re-tighten. He's also used the mei tai numerous times and is comfortable with how it feels, etc. He knows when it's on right, when it's tight, how it feels when it loosens, etc.


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## CariOfOz (Jun 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lit Chick* 
How about a nice 5 mile walk? Or perhaps a pedal bike ride? Or, have a friend pick everybody up. Or maybe you can drop them at the event? Or, get a babysitter.

Otherwise, ABSOLUTELY NOT. It is NOT safe. And there are a million reasons it is not safe.

Daddy's fun time should never _never_ take priority over a child's safety.









: Brilliant suggestions.


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## maliceinwonderland (Apr 17, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riaketty* 
He said if anything felt loose or slipping, he'd stop immediately and re-tighten. He's also used the mei tai numerous times and is comfortable with how it feels, etc. He knows when it's on right, when it's tight, how it feels when it loosens, etc.

I dunno. I mean, I know how careful my SO is. He wouldn't even suggest something like that unless he was comfortable doing it. And if he was going slow on roads that weren't busy..

And like treemom said, it is normal in other countries.


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## earthmama369 (Jul 29, 2005)

If baby's strapped to Daddy and Daddy goes flying, Daddy lands on baby and squishes baby. Bad scene.

There's a reason we drop our babies when we're falling, and it's not to put our hands out to save ourselves. A doctor told me this one after I fell and dropped my 4-month-old dd in the process. I was distraught that my instincts hadn't taken over and had me clutching her tight, even as I fell. That's what I felt should have happened. And he said: If I hadn't been able to separate her from me, 150 pounds of me, plus speed and gravity, would have come down on 16 pounds of her. Bad. Bad. Bad.

Setting up a situation where your dh CAN'T separate your toddler from his body in a fall would be criminally stupid. Taking a kid on a motorcycle -- well, everyone's going to have their own opinion on that. But if that's a choice you make as a family, at least have the child in a separate seat so they have SOME chance of surviving an accident, you know?


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## Calidris (Apr 17, 2004)

His being a safe driver is not the point. If that made a difference, we wouldn't use carseats, we'd just drive more carefully. He can he as safe as he wants, there risk is with the idiot out there who decides _today_ is a good day to break the back road speed record.


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## riaketty (Jul 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *maliceinwonderland* 
I dunno. I mean, I know how careful my SO is. He wouldn't even suggest something like that unless he was comfortable doing it. And if he was going slow on roads that weren't busy..

And like treemom said, it is normal in other countries.

In Alaska, it's normal to see babies wrapped up tight against their parents chest on a snow-mobile, which I think is much more dangerous. Ice and show and slickness. But it seems like such a faux pas down south here. I don't... quite get it. What if it's the only way to get around?

And of course if something happened to DD, this is how he would get her to medical care. Ambulances don't run out here. And the hosp. is a good twenty miles.


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## frog (Jun 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Calidris* 
His being a safe driver is not the point. If that made a difference, we wouldn't use carseats, we'd just drive more carefully. He can he as safe as he wants, there risk is with the idiot out there who decides _today_ is a good day to break the back road speed record.

Yes. This.


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## Amila (Apr 4, 2006)

No. No. No.

I used to work as a deputy coroner.

No. No . No.


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## Selesai (Oct 26, 2005)

I cannot imagine an event so important as to require this mode of transportation.
I see what you are saying, OP. But I usually evaluate such situations (and much more minor ones) as: "If something happened to DC because of this, would I be able to forgive myself?"

Besides, it's different when you take your kid to the ER (read:emergency) compared to just going to town for fun. And it is NOT the only way to get around.

I think your DH should use a regular bike, with a proper child seat and child helmet, or not go.


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## CariOfOz (Jun 30, 2005)

You live only 20miles from a hospital, but ambulances dont run there?? And recreational snowmobiling with a baby attached isn't something I EVER saw during the 3yrs I lived in Alaska honestly. And I saw a lot of snowmobilers. In places in AK where it WOULD be common, it would be because there is no other possible mode of transport which makes it more a subsistence thing. Dad wanting to go to an 'event'.. well really doesn't compare to the snowmobile trip to the only place near your remote community to get food/medicine etc etc.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

No freakin' way.

-Angela


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## riaketty (Jul 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Selesai* 
I cannot imagine an event so important as to require this mode of transportation.
I see what you are saying, OP. But I usually evaluate such situations (and much more minor ones) as: "If something happened to DC because of this, would I be able to forgive myself?"

That's a great way to think about it. And the answer is no... so, we'll figure something else out. Thanks for the input, guys.


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## CariOfOz (Jun 30, 2005)

Good call mama... There are a lot of other ways for him to get there that wouldn't be so risky!


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

No. And my dh is a very experienced motorcycle rider and there's no way in hell I'd let my toddler ride on a road like that. It doesn't matter that he's safe, its all the other people out there. Do you know how many motorcycle/vehicle crashes there are? People don't see motorcycles as well as cars, they just don't. And even with a helmet, there's absolutely no protection.

I would never allow that. Ever.


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## menomena (Jun 14, 2007)

Oh my. No.

No, no, no, no. no.

Sorry mama. I'm sure your DH is super safe. But accidents are accidents and can happen to the safest of safe drivers.

In your heart, you know what the safest option is: it's not the flaky break van or a baby strapped to daddy on a motorcycle. My vote is for staying at home.


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## kmeyrick (Aug 30, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riaketty* 
He said if anything felt loose or slipping, he'd stop immediately and re-tighten. He's also used the mei tai numerous times and is comfortable with how it feels, etc. He knows when it's on right, when it's tight, how it feels when it loosens, etc.

When you are driving you are distracted and that thing could slip in a nano-second. Consider the attitude of the cop the pulls him over when he sees a baby strapped to his chest on a motorcycle.

No.


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## GooeyRN (Apr 24, 2006)

Have dh give you a ride to wherever it is going and pick you up later in the day. Or rent a car if the event is that important. I would not be comfortable with a kid on a motorcycle in a mei tai.


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## KatWrangler (Mar 21, 2005)

No! No way.


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## ananas (Jun 6, 2006)

No way in hell. Motorcycles scare the crap out of me anyway, but with a baby? No no no. No matter how responsible and safe he is, there are elements he has no control over- drunk drivers, animals in the road, etc.


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## LittlePeanut (Aug 11, 2006)

Hell NO! PP posters have pretty much said what I feel.

LP


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## tboroson (Nov 19, 2002)

When I was a toddler, my dad would take me on his bike strapped to his chest with a bungee cord. I think a mei tai is an improvement on that.


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## phathui5 (Jan 8, 2002)

Several answers come to mind:

Not a snowball's chance in hell.

Never ever.

No way.

It's not worth the risk for me. You would be safer putting the toddler in a car with no car seat because then at least if someone else hits you, there's your car between toddler and the road.


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## Getz (May 22, 2005)

Nope. No way. Maybe he is a safe driver, but who knows about the other drivers?

I am a safe driver and was still hit head on by another driver. There was nothing I could have done to avoid her, it just happened.

Is the event that important that he can't find a safer way to get into town?


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## MillingNome (Nov 18, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riaketty* 
That's a great way to think about it. And the answer is no... so, we'll figure something else out. Thanks for the input, guys.



















I ride a motorcycle and still can't imagine taking a baby wrapped to me on it. Since my kids are older now, we're thinking of getting a sidecar because the kids might think it's fun. But no way would I consider an infant, legal or not.


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## frog (Jun 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tboroson* 
When I was a toddler, my dad would take me on his bike strapped to his chest with a bungee cord. I think a mei tai is an improvement on that.


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## guest9921 (Nov 3, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna* 
over my dead body

.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

I just wanted to mention that at 13 months, your toddler's head still very much is large for the muscles in her neck. (This is one reason bicycle carriers are not recommended under a year of age, and the reason rear facing is safer).

With a helmet on, her head will be even heavier, even with the lighter weight DOT helmets (which of course are essential). Going over bumps could cause injury, and a slip or an accident could result in spinal cord damage - this is why it's important to keep the straps tight in a carseat; young children's necks have a very hard time with whiplash. I don't think a mai tai is going to support her neck.

And not to add smarmy advice or anything, if this is really the route to the hospital - in case of, say, head injury or back injury or even vomiting - it's really not in my opinion doable. I think getting the brakes fixed on the van needs to be a priority (easy to say from the outside, I know).


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## lalaland42 (Mar 12, 2006)

Some (not motor) bike shops will rent bikes and bike trailers for the day. Five miles isn't that far for Daddy to walk or bike himself.

I recently saw the immediate aftermath of a helmetless motorcyclist versus car at 30 mph. It was the car's driver's fault (she was making a U turn and didn't see the motorcycle) but it didn't really matter since the motorcyclist was dead.







Count me in the no way in hell camp.


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## mama2toomany (Oct 17, 2005)

I know you probably have seen all the responses you want to but I figured I couldn't read and not reply.

Umm.. NO way!

I lost an uncle to a motorcycle accident, and he had his 12 yr old son with him. Luckily the son lived because he was behind my uncle. But he will never walk again.

Why not take a bus, bike ride, or even easier! Call a Cab!

Good Luck!


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *iamthesmilingone* 









I ride a motorcycle and still can't imagine taking a baby wrapped to me on it. Since my kids are older now, we're thinking of getting a sidecar because the kids might think it's fun. But no way would I consider an infant, legal or not.

Me, too. I'm a biker girl, all my life. But no way would I let my little ones on one unless in a sidecar! My sons were 5 or so before I let them hold on and go for a very slow ride around the (very private and small) block.

IF he got hit, dumped the bike or other tragedy, a 13 month old strapped to his chest has pretty much no chance of escaping.


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## starshine1001 (Feb 16, 2008)

ACK! NO! I've seen some crappy stuff in my days as a nurse that were the product of motorcycle accidents. Not good. Like really yucky not good. Go with those awesome momma bear instincts that you have and give him the big ole' negatory on that one.


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## Elowyn (Nov 3, 2003)

Yeah, have to go with the others here. Worlds of no. I don't care how good/responsible he is - there are way too many other morons out there (drunk/oblivious/whatever) and I've seen far too many car vs motorcycle wrecks to ever want a toddler involved in one.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthmama369* 
There's a reason we drop our babies when we're falling, and it's not to put our hands out to save ourselves. A doctor told me this one after I fell and dropped my 4-month-old dd in the process. I was distraught that my instincts hadn't taken over and had me clutching her tight, even as I fell. That's what I felt should have happened. And he said: If I hadn't been able to separate her from me, 150 pounds of me, plus speed and gravity, would have come down on 16 pounds of her. Bad. Bad. Bad.

Uhh that doesn't sound right at all.

I fell when DD2 was about 10 months. There was a hole in the grass at DD1's school that was ankle deep and I stepped in it. (hidden by the grass being even with the hole) As I went down I twisted to the side so that DD would land on top of me. I f'ed up my ankle in the process. The school got a chair with wheels and wheeled me to the car strapped the babe in her seat.. and I drove to DH's work to take me to the doctor. (It was my left ankle.)

I also fell down several stairs when my youngest was a few months old again I rolled so he would land on top.

OP, I would not be comfortable with that at all. But it could be worse, my brother remembers his dad stuffing him in the saddle bags (fiberglass ones) of his motorcycle to take him to the babysitter. (5 blocks) He couldn't have been more than a year old since my mom divorced him before my bro was 2.


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

My mom-instinct would be screaming no, but...

I rode on the motorcycle with my dad from the time I was a toddler. I still ride with him when I visit.


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## SleeplessMommy (Jul 16, 2005)

At what age is it considered safe(er) to have a child on the back of a motorcycle or scooter ... assuming a safe experienced driver, daylight hours, no alcohol involved, not highway driving, etc?

Any link to statistics?


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

NO WAY.

It's not about your dh being a safe driver, it's about who else might happen to be out on the road that day .. you just never know, and it's a huge risk.

A few months ago my uncle was sideswiped by a drunk driver. It was 7am! And on a rural, rarely used road. You never know who is going to be out on those roads, and 13 months old? So much could happen with just the slightest fall off that motorcycle.


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## Think of Winter (Jun 10, 2004)

Never.

I'm sure you don't want to think about what would happen to your child if they fell off the bike while it was moving, but maybe your dh should.

Motorcycles are called "donor mobiles" by transplant teams.

ETA: Good for you!! Just saw your follow-up.


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## TiredX2 (Jan 7, 2002)

Another "no".

I didn't even know DOT helmets came in toddler size, though. DS is almost 7 and takes a child's medium, DS is 9 and wears a child's large. I can't imagine a 13 month old able to safely wear any motorcycle helmet (so heavy and big).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SleeplessMommy* 
At what age is it considered safe(er) to have a child on the back of a motorcycle or scooter ... assuming a safe experienced driver, daylight hours, no alcohol involved, not highway driving, etc?

Any link to statistics?

No statistics. Both my kids have ridden a couple times on the back of DP's cycle. Long pants & shirts, sweatshirts, boots and full face helmets. That was to go around the neighborhoood







Before they can go out of the neighborhood DP wants them to have full gear (pants, jacket, gloves).


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## Kristine233 (Jul 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthmama369* 
There's a reason we drop our babies when we're falling, and it's not to put our hands out to save ourselves. A doctor told me this one after I fell and dropped my 4-month-old dd in the process. I was distraught that my instincts hadn't taken over and had me clutching her tight, even as I fell. That's what I felt should have happened. And he said: If I hadn't been able to separate her from me, 150 pounds of me, plus speed and gravity, would have come down on 16 pounds of her. Bad. Bad. Bad.

Really? I've never heard of this. I'm extremely klutzy and have fallen a TON while holding my kids. Even fell down stairs. I've never dropped them. I've screwed up ankles, wrists, tons of blood etc all from protecting my kids in falls. Dh even fell out of his big truck while holding our DD (when she was a baby) and he got pretty banged up but he held onto and protected her.

Dh even has a video of me falling while babywearing, its pretty hysterical. (All parties were uninjured)


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## onlyzombiecat (Aug 15, 2004)

No. That really doesn't seem like a safe set up to risk even if it isn't illegal.

If there was a accident I'd think the child would have little chance of avoiding serious injury or death even with a helmet. I would think being strapped to a heavy adult body would be seriously dangerous.

If you can't have dp drop you off and use your car that day or get the van brakes fixed or get child care for the event then I think Dad should miss the event.


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## Papooses (Dec 20, 2006)

Being ejected from a vehicle = 4 times the risk of death







Being ejected from a motorcycle is obviously much more likely than being ejected from a car.... It might also be illegal in some states.

My kid's dad would be sleeping on the porch for even asking in the 1st place.


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## lucky_mia (Mar 13, 2007)

No, never, not ever, wouldn't even entertain the thought.


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## BeckC (Nov 27, 2006)

No way on God's green Earth.

I would do anything other than that - skip the event, ask a friend, call a taxi, walk... Anything besides strap a baby to my body and go driving down the road with nothing but hope and a helmet for protection from the asphalt.


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## Papooses (Dec 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SleeplessMommy* 
At what age is it considered safe(er) to have a child on the back of a motorcycle or scooter ... assuming a safe experienced driver, daylight hours, no alcohol involved, not highway driving, etc?

Any link to statistics?

There aren't any statistics re: kids on motorcycles that I can find. The standard answer is simply that motorcycles aren't really safe to begin with so no one who is too young to be driving it _should_ be on it.









Here's a helpful Motocycle Safety resource > http://www.trafficsafety.org/worklif...ycle/main.html

Quote:

Motorcycles are the most dangerous type of motor vehicle to drive.

*Motorcyclists were 35 times more likely than passenger car occupants to die in a crash ** in 2006, per vehicle mile traveled, and 8 times more likely to be injured.

Although motorcycles account for only 2% of vehicles on the road, they make up more than 10% of all crashes.
That being said, as a grown adult I might enjoy a ride once in a while assuming the bike is properly cared for & with a skilled, defensive driver.... I would never allow my child to ride *at least* until she were old enough to begin learning the proper care & safe driving skills herself. Even then, it would be extremely rare & well monitored.

*** _car crashes are the leading cause of death for kids to begin with







_


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## aaronsmom (Jan 22, 2007)

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. Not.Ever.
One day DH asked me if he could ride 2.5 yo DS around on the ATV in the yard. With a helmet. At 5 mph. And obviously no other traffic. But I said no.
Call me a worry wort but if I wouldn't let him do that there's no way in hell I'd let DH ride him on the motorcycle.


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## MommyJoia (Oct 31, 2007)

while I am aware that OP has decided against this, I just wanted to chime in that all the baby carriers/mei tais/slings I have bought come with safety disclaimers stating to NEVER wear your baby in a moving motor vehicle. I think that would include a motor cycle.

and, no, I would not allow it.


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## Papooses (Dec 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyJoia* 
I just wanted to chime in that all the baby carriers/mei tais/slings I have bought come with safety disclaimers stating to NEVER wear your baby in a moving motor vehicle.

That is good to know & yes I would say a motorcycle counts


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riaketty* 
That's a great way to think about it. And the answer is no... so, we'll figure something else out. Thanks for the input, guys.









Glad to hear it. ;-)

If he was online right now, I'd ask a friend of mine who uses a motorcyle as his main transportation and has been in a bad motorcycle accident (sideswiped by a pickup that didn't see them). He also is "uncle" to his girlfriend's toddler, and isn't going to Burning Man because he can't find a way to ride a (non-motor) bike on the playa with the LO in tow that meets with his approval for convenience and safety.

*Before* he was in the accident, he took a motorcycle driver's course, got the special M-class driver license, and wouldn't dream of going anywhere without not just his helmet, but also jeans and a leather jacket. I heard him speak quite disdainfully of folks riding down the highway in shorts and a t-shirt. Since almost losing his leg (massive compound fracture, four months until he could get out of a wheelchair... doctor looked at the x-rays the next day and said "Wow, great work! Usually with that much tissue damage, they just amputate!"), he wears body armor every time he rides. Doesn't matter if it's 90 degrees out; he gets fully suited up.

They don't make body armor in size 12-18 months, I'm guessing. I can't see him taking little V out on the motorcycle (though I bet... ok, I _hope_... it's illegal here in Cali).


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## justKate (Jun 10, 2008)

I have an acquaintance who has his motorcycle rigged specifically to accomodate his 5 year old. Special supports BEHIND him, set of handlebars for the kid BEHIND him, and an attachment sort of contraption that keeps the kid from tipping off. Kid has his own leather and helmet. Even with this, he only rides on the military base (where the speed limit is (no kidding) 15mph.

Not something I would do, but I guess there are ways to "accomodate" kids _somewhat_ more safely on motorcycles....


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

I can't imagine it here in my town. But up in a small town North of the valley, parents do it all the time. Especially on Quads.

SO. Honestly? I think it depends on what the roads are like, and how fast he plans to drive.

I couldn't be comfortable with it. But, maybe if I lived where you live, I might think it's safe.


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## boatbaby (Aug 30, 2004)

When I was a baby my dad rode me around in his motorcycle... I was in a canvas army backpack on his back!







:

And to answer the OP's question, no freaking way!


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