# Lethargic baby - nursing too much??



## cozzensclan (Feb 10, 2005)

I'm hoping that maybe some of you moms have gone through this and have some advice. My baby was born 8-4-06, so she's a week old today. Right from the get go she's been a champion nurser, often nursing for 1 1/2 - 2 hours at a time. Since we came home from the hospital, she began sleeping through the night, and by that I mean 7 to 8 hours in one stretch. I'm kind of concerned because none of my other kids (she's #4) could go more than a few hours without nursing. I spoke to the doctor about it and he said she is tiring herself out with the long nursing sessions and to limit them to 20 minutes and to just let her cry if she wants to nurse more. My husband pointed out that crying would make her just as tired, if not more so, than nursing would without any of the benefits. So anyway she is now officially labeled lethargic and I have to bring her back to the doctor in 2 weeks so he can check on her again.

Now, I have no intention of timing our nursing sessions and letting her cry. But I need some idea whether or not this sleepyness is normal or something to be concerned about. I have tried waking her up after she's had several hours of sleep, but she just _won't_ wake up. I'm afraid there's something wrong with her, but she seems like the picture of health. She's gaining weight well, and in every other way seems like a perfect little girl. Please give me some advice!!!


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## lactivist (Jun 14, 2005)

Many babies sleep through the night early on. My rule of thumb is if the baby is gaining well and is getting back to birth weight there is no reason to wake baby up at night. My second child slept 9 hours a night from birth until three months when he started teething. I would jiggle him, try to latch him on, strip him etc and he just wouldn't nurse and wouldn't wake up. He regained his birth weight by about 6-7 days and was quite a chunk after that. If your baby is nursing well during the day, gaining weight and seems happy and satiated when she comes off the breast, just don't worry. Your baby isn't lethargic or abnormal. She just has her own pattern of doing things. You are doing a great job. Good work on following your instincts instead of the doctor's suggestion to cry it out. Crying is incredibly tiring and stressful and no baby should have to cry and wait for food. Hugs and congratulations!!!
Wendi


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## Pepperminx (Jan 1, 2006)

Oh, good to see I'm not the only one! Our dd sleeps a lot through the day too, not just night.

Our dd is almost 2 weeks today and she has been sleeping a lot as well. She nurses a lot too and has gained back her birthweight and then some (in less than a week!), plus it's been hot which might account for some of the sleepiness, but the amount of sleep I'm getting at night was worrying at first.

She seems happy though so we're trying not to worry and our midwife told us to try and breastfeed her more often at daytime instead of a few long nursings (I had a little dilemma with this - how do you wake a sleeping baby? It's darned difficult..) which I did by making sure to take the boob away once she starts nodding off (she will nurse while half asleep for quite a while if I let her) and it seems to work fine.

I hope it's the same for your dc and nothing serious.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

My dd slept through the night pretty much from the beginning also, BUT day time she was awake. If baby is sleepy and needs to be encouraged to nurse during the day I'd think about waking them at night. If they're happy and nursing like crazy through the day, then I wouldn't worry.

Watch the diapers and watch the weight gain and if all looks good- don't worry.

-Angela


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## Momtwice (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cozzensclan*
I spoke to the doctor about it and he said she is tiring herself out with the long nursing sessions and to limit them to 20 minutes and to just let her cry if she wants to nurse more.

I would seriously think about getting a second opinion from a doctor who has a clue about breastfeeding.

Crying too much means loss of fluids and possible dehydration.
A baby who gets too hungry or upset will have trouble nursing well.

Have you looked at http://www.kellymom.com for tips on waking a sleepy baby?

Have you talked to a la Leche league leader
http://www.lalecheleague.org

or a board certified IBCLC lactation consultant?


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## doula mary (Aug 28, 2002)

Your Dr. has no clue!

What has been the weight gain exactly?

I do NOT think you should be going 7-8 hours without nursing for the sole reason of your milk supply is just being established, night nursing increases prolactin. In a few weeks..yea...but not right now.

How often is she nursing 2 hours at a time..every feed?

Mary


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## Shahbazin (Aug 3, 2006)

When my baby was newborn, she was very sleepy (& quite small, under 6 lbs) - she'd nurse A LOT, but only if awake, so I'd just wake up every 2 hours, take all her clothes off & change her diaper to wake her up, then feed her until she went back to sleep. Even now, at 3 months, she doesn't cry to be fed, just wakes up & wiggles & kicks, maybe sucks on her hands. I hear her, & feed her at 1 & 4 AM, so am waking 2x night now.


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## DaryLLL (Aug 12, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Momtwice*
I would seriously think about getting a second opinion from a doctor who has a clue about breastfeeding.

Crying too much means loss of fluids and possible dehydration.
A baby who gets too hungry or upset will have trouble nursing well.

Have you looked at http://www.kellymom.com for tips on waking a sleepy baby?

Have you talked to a la Leche league leader
http://www.lalecheleague.org

or a board certified IBCLC lactation consultant?

What was her birth weight and what is it at one week? Has she regained her birthweight? Is she jaundiced? What day did your milk come in?

You say you have 3 other kids. Are you able to tend to the baby and take care of yourself? Is the baby with you most of the day or do the other kids and relatives/helpers take over?

"Lethargic" means being limp and unresponsive all the time, not alert and actively nursing during the day and sleeping at night.

I second what Momtwice said. It is unusual for a baby to sleep that long at night at this young of an age. But if she is gaining and *actively* nursing and peeing 6-8 cloth diapers and at least 3 good sized poops a day, she is probably OK. For your own comfort, you could try and wake her once at night anyway-- don't you get engorged?

Kellymom has the tips on how to wake a sleepy baby.

Nursing for 1-2 hours straight, is this what we call cluster feeding? Happens in the evening hours when your supply is lower, but higher in fat (hindmilk). Nurse for a while, nap 10 mins, wake and nurse again, fuss a little, nurse some more, etc.

OTOH, a baby that nurses "all the time" might not be nursing well, and may need some help with latchon or suck training. Do you hear her swallowing? Do you see her jaw moving all the way to her ear? Is there any clicking when she swallows?

Do you have a large supply and overactive letdown? This can sometimes cause a baby to get almost overfull and not need to nurse as often as usual.

All these questions and their answers could be addressed to a good LLL Leader or IBCLC. Drs are not trained in lactation or infant nutrition, so anything they say should be taken with a large grain of salt. His opinion and advice (nurse 20 mins only and CIO so she can "rest") is not good at all in this case.


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## cozzensclan (Feb 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *doula mary*
Your Dr. has no clue!

What has been the weight gain exactly?

I do NOT think you should be going 7-8 hours without nursing for the sole reason of your milk supply is just being established, night nursing increases prolactin. In a few weeks..yea...but not right now.

How often is she nursing 2 hours at a time..every feed?

Mary

She has just about gained back to her birth weight. She is nursing for long periods at just about every feeding. She will nurse on one side, then the other, then back to the first side. She only stops when she needs to burp, which is when I switch sides. I have PLENTY of milk, so that's no problem. Well, it is a problem, because my boobs are about the size of my head by the time she wakes up and I can finally nurse her again.


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## cozzensclan (Feb 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DaryLLL*
What was her birth weight and what is it at one week? Has she regained her birthweight? Is she jaundiced? What day did your milk come in?

You say you have 3 other kids. Are you able to tend to the baby and take care of yourself? Is the baby with you most of the day or do the other kids and relatives/helpers take over?

if she is gaining and *actively* nursing and peeing 6-8 cloth diapers and at least 3 good sized poops a day, she is probably OK. For your own comfort, you could try and wake her once at night anyway-- don't you get engorged?

Do you hear her swallowing? Do you see her jaw moving all the way to her ear? Is there any clicking when she swallows?

Do you have a large supply and overactive letdown? This can sometimes cause a baby to get almost overfull and not need to nurse as often as usual.


She was 8lbs. 15oz. at birth, 8lbs. 8oz. at 1 week. My milk came in on the second day after her birth. She was jaundiced slightly, but that cleared up relatively quickly & she's fine now. As for the kids, they are with me all day, but my in-laws live next door so they go over there to play for a few hours everyday. That gives me a break to just rest with the baby. Also, my husband is a champion dad who helps with everything as soon as he gets home from work.

Diapers - we're using about 8-10 cloth diapers everyday, so I know she's getting enough when she does nurse. I do hear her swallowing when she nurses - even when she's been going at it for an hour. Sometimes I wonder that she doesn't explode!







I do have A LOT of milk, but she seems to need it all when she does nurse; it's just that in between I get really engorged.


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## jul511riv (Mar 16, 2006)

could be the heat and she's just gettin gher fluids

could be cause she's not nursing at night shes making up for it in the day.

Could be that she's just hungry during daylight hours and wants to sleep at night.

what is she like when she's awake? Can you find a doc that you trust to see her?

Look at your diet...are you still taking an iron suppliment? Look into floradix. Keep eating a very well balanced diet. Up your vitamins and minerals in whole foods. Support your immune system with foods high in vit c, and if it doesn't bother your dd, garlic. If you eat meat, try chicken soup. Just support your body.

Also, did you have any drugs at birth? She could still be processing those out of her system. Could be making her tired and could also explain her desire to "flush" her system by having a lot of fluids.

Is she dressed to warm? This could make her want to drink more and make her sleepy. If it's 105 degrees, she probably doesnt need mittens, booties and a hat. That sort of thing. LOL.

I would keep an eye on this over the course of the next few days and weeks, but I also wouldn't be SO concerned about it.

Maybe post this on the doula midwife page...?


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## rozzie'sma (Jul 6, 2005)

Well I have not read through the other replys but first thing I thought is that she is possibly flutter sucking at the breast. It appears that they are nursing but they are not milking the breast effectively, therefor they nurse for long periods of time getting relatively little milk, this can cause lethargy, slow weight gain, etc. Have you had a LLL leader check out your latch. Are you flattening the breast behind the areola to make a breast sandwich and getting her pulled well onto it, with more of the bottom jaw that the top. Do her ears wiggle and her jaw move while she is nursing, these are signs of good latch.


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## DaryLLL (Aug 12, 2002)

rozziesma, we addressed those ideas.

Any updates from the OP? You could tell yr dr (if you keep going to him) all the stuff you've told us here. Weight gain good, lots of dirty diapers, you hear swallowing, baby really tanking up during the day.

I am just concerned for you b/c you get engorged overnight. If you can't wake her to nurse, you should try and pump a little to relieve the pressure. Or you might get a plugged duct or even mastitis.


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## cozzensclan (Feb 10, 2005)

Thanks everyone for the reassurance. She is still going strong with nursing during the day and sleeping at night, although the last 2 nights she did get up for a (very short) nursing session. She is getting nice and chunky now, so I'm not so concerned as before. Also, I'm thinking maybe because she sleeps between my husband and I that she may be picking up on our sleep patterns. This happened with our boys, just not so soon after being born. With each of our kids, I worry so much about SIDS. I guess because you hear so much about it when you're pregnant & then the lovely brochures they give you at the hospital that leave you wondering how your child is actually still surviving despite all the terrible things that could happen to them. I think I kind of gave in to the stress and pressure of these negative thoughts & got a little too worried.

As for the doctor, despite his old-fashioned ideas, I really like him & trust his judgement. I know he's not always happy with our choices on breastfeeding, co-sleeping, vaccinations, etc. but he is willing to work with us and adapt his treatment of our kids to conform to our beliefs. Many doctors have the "my way or find a new doctor" attitude, so I'm happy to stay with him and just take his parenting advice with a grain of salt.


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