# 4.5 Year Old Really Doesn't Like Her Britax Marathon, What Should I Get?



## BeingMe (Oct 25, 2006)

I want the safest carseat, and one that will last her a while. Preferably one she can't adjust because it's a battle with her loosing her marathon all the time to the point it's not safe. She's about 36lbs and around 41-42" tall.

Thanks


----------



## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

Why doesnt she like it?


----------



## BeingMe (Oct 25, 2006)

She has been saying the tags itch her, but now she says she doesn't like it at all. Personally it's easy to install my only issue, and it's a big one, is that she can adjust it. She loosens it really loose and I can't find a way to make her stop.


----------



## BeingMe (Oct 25, 2006)

I have seen good reviews for the Britax Frontier 85, but also have read that a combo booster isn't as safe as one that doesn't change. I have also read some good things about Sunshine Kids Radian XT and the others, but to be honest I'm kinda lost. Any advice?


----------



## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

There is no point in getting a convertible for a forward facing only child unless you plan on passing it down to a younger child.

Combination seats (ie ones that go from harness to booster) are just fine, its the '3 in 1" seats that rearface/forwardface/booster are the ones that make awful boosters.

I'd look at the graco nautilus, britax frontier and the evenflo maestro. The nautilus I think has the tallest harness slots, 3 of my ds's friends have them and they all really like them, and I know its a highly recomended seat. The frontier is equally as good, and the maestro is the cheapest of the 3 for HWH seats. All 3 make good boosters as well.

If she is loosening the harness, Britax makes a thing that prevents this, if you call them they send it to you. I forget what they call it though.

ETA: my ds rides RFing in a sunshine kids radian XTSL, and I really like the seat, but remember it doesnt turn into a booster, its just a convertible for rearfacing and forward facing only


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

My youngest rides in both a Apex and a Graco Nautilus - the Nautilus he can't get undone by himself (he complains when riding in my car, but it sounds it might be good for your DD). Both of our seats harness to 65 lbs and can be used as boosters later on. My kids outgrew the Marathon when they were 4/5 - by height.


----------



## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

A combo seat is your best bet. At 4.5 she probably is getting close to outgrowing the MA anyways.

Someone mentioned the Apex. Ok seat, but doesn't make a good booster for most kids because it is super super wide.

Your best bets if you want to never buy another seat again are the Britax Frontier and the Graco Nautilus. The Frontier has the highest top slots and lasts longest in hbb mode, but it is a lot more expensive. I've owned a nautilus and loved it. Really nice seat for the price.

You could also do an evenflo maestro and then buy a dedicated booster later. The maestro does work as a booster, but it's very short and outgrown in harnessed and booster mode around the same time. The plus side is the maestro + turbobooster later on is the same price or less than the cost of a nautilus, which is good to know if you plan on handing down seats.


----------



## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BeingMe*
> 
> I have seen good reviews for the Britax Frontier 85, but also have read that a combo booster isn't as safe as one that doesn't change. I have also read some good things about Sunshine Kids Radian XT and the others, but to be honest I'm kinda lost. Any advice?


There is absolutely no reason to believe that a combination seat, used properly, is any less safe than a convertible seat. It is a perfectly safe and appropriate choice for a forward-facing 4yo.


----------



## BeingMe (Oct 25, 2006)

Thanks everyone for the help. I feel better knowing that the britax frontier 85 is a safe seat as that's the one I was leaning towards. Plus she loved the cupholders. If there isn't any reasons I should go with that one, then that's the one I will get.

Thanks!! You have made my crazy world less crazy. And that is huge right now. THANKS!!


----------



## Danielle283 (Jun 7, 2005)

We have the Frontier and love it!


----------



## jessica_s (Feb 22, 2007)

We recently bought the Frontier, actually found one on the shelf at Target that was an online return, not opened, for about $50 cheaper than normal retail! We tried out all the seats at Babies R Us and that's the one our son thought he liked the best. I needed something that had a high seated height for the harness, he's tall! I've been really happy with it so far.


----------



## Lisa1970 (Jan 18, 2009)

My son loved his Nautilus and I bought it for him when he was 5.


----------



## snowgirl (Aug 2, 2007)

I have a Frontier, love it for harnass, HATE it for booster. It is so freaking wide that it is impossible for dd to buckle herself. And I have a big car. So my car isn't the issue.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Actually, I need to get the link for this article, but we have Frontiers, so I was intrigued by something I read. When crash tests were done with the Frontier in booster mode, the children who were in the booster w/o the top tether, just the seat belt, sustained more severe head damage than without the booster. I can see this, too, because the Frontier is sooo heavy. The point of the article was informing people that the top tether has a weight limit, which most people don't know. Britax informs parents to use the top tether at all weights, but the manufacturers actually impose weight limits similar to the lower LATCH anchors. So the debate was whether or not to use the top tether on weights outside the limits in booster mode. And, like I said, they actually found the dummies sustained serious head injuries. I will try to find the article and link it.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chickabiddy*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/babies-kids/baby-toddler/booster-combination-car-seats/higher-weight-limit-seats/index.htm

Scroll down about halfway, to "From Our Own Testing," particularly the second bulleted point. Hth!


----------



## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

It's speaking about using the seat not tethered, but I believe the tether is mandatory after 50 pounds anyway.

Also, I put zero stock in Consumer Reports's car seat testing.

ETA: here is the exact quote:



> In our tests of the Britax Frontier toddler booster seat, installed with a lap belt and without the top tether, and tested with a harnessed 52-lb., 6-year-old hybrid III dummy, the dummy's head exceeded the limits for head excursion that would be allowed by the standard test. That means the head moved forward more than the federal standard for child seats allows. Additional forward head movement in a real crash can potentially expose a child's head to injury. When we tested the same seat with the top tether installed, and with a 3-point safety belt, the head excursions were within the limits. Based on those results and recommendations from the Britax manual, we would not recommend use of the Britax Frontier for older vehicles that have only a lap belt for installation and lack a top-tether anchor.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Completely agreed about the tether, but I do need to stress that there *is* a weight limit for the top tether, which Britax fails to inform consumer's about. So, *technically speaking,* you shouldn't be tethering the booster past 50#. Personally, I regret buying the Frontier for booster use past the harness. It has been a major PITA.


----------



## devon (Jun 29, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thandiwe*
> 
> Completely agreed about the tether, but I do need to stress that there *is* a weight limit for the top tether, which Britax fails to inform consumer's about. So, *technically speaking,* you shouldn't be tethering the booster past 50#.


Where are you getting this information? I don't see anything about it in our car manuals (2006 Odyssey and 2004 Corolla) or the manual for our Sunshine Kids Monterrey Booster, which you can tether/latch. I was under the impression that you can still latch/tether a booster that allows it past the 40 lbs or whatever since the seatbelt is being used to restrain the child, and the tether is just to restrain the seat.


----------



## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devon*
> 
> Where are you getting this information? I don't see anything about it in our car manuals (2006 Odyssey and 2004 Corolla) or the manual for our Sunshine Kids Monterrey Booster, which you can tether/latch. I was under the impression that you can still latch/tether a booster that allows it past the 40 lbs or whatever since the seatbelt is being used to restrain the child, and the tether is just to restrain the seat.


This is absolutely correct.


----------



## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devon*
> 
> Where are you getting this information? I don't see anything about it in our car manuals (2006 Odyssey and 2004 Corolla) or the manual for our Sunshine Kids Monterrey Booster, which you can tether/latch. I was under the impression that you can still latch/tether a booster that allows it past the 40 lbs or whatever since the seatbelt is being used to restrain the child, and the tether is just to restrain the seat.


Yes, you are correct.

Faulting the Frontier for being used against the manufacturer's explicit instructions is not fair, IMO.


----------



## Twinklefae (Dec 13, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thandiwe*
> 
> Completely agreed about the tether, but I do need to stress that there *is* a weight limit for the top tether, which Britax fails to inform consumer's about. So, *technically speaking,* you shouldn't be tethering the booster past 50#. Personally, I regret buying the Frontier for booster use past the harness. It has been a major PITA.


If there is it is more than 65lbs - all forward facing harnessed seats in Canada are required by law to have the top tether attached.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

In the article cited.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devon*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Actually, the manual states you don't *have* to use the tether WHEN the booster mode is employed. The top tether above the weight is REQUIRED in harness mode. And I faulted the Frontier because it is a big pain. Personally, it was a waste of money. A lot of it too. I regret it. I am trying to stress this for the op, because I'd hate to see anyone else make this mistake. They have fabulous convertibles; that's all we use. But it was a waste of money buying the Frontier for belt positioning purposes.

As the article linked cites, there is a weight limit for top tether, which is good to know. OBVIOUSLY in reading the article and manual, it is more adventageous to use the top tether, but it severely limits usage of the Frontier in my van, and perhaps in other peoples vehicles. For this reason, it's a major pain and waste. My husband is grabbing our Britax manual, so I can quote Britax regarding usage of the tether being mandatory....

And here it is. It is important to note that it's not required by Britax in booster mode. Page 13 of the manual, child seat features overview: "When using the child seat *in harness mode*: -Britax recommends that the tether be used at all times when installing the child seat... -Always use the Versa-Tether for children weighing 65-80 lbs [weight limit for harness mode]." Immediately prior to this are details about the seat/tether/LATCH which also do not state it is explicitly required in booster mode. I've read the whole manual looking for this, and it never states that. In fact, on page 36, "Booster Mode: Positioning Your Child Seat," it says: "Position forward facing only in a seating position with a lap-shoulder belt. Use only the vehicle's lap and shoulder belt system when securing a child in booster mode. Never secure a child with a lap belt only in booster mode. In booster mode, this child seat *can be* positioned to the vehicle seat using LATCH. It the LATCH anchors in your vehicle prevent proper vehicle belt fit across your child you *cannot* use LATCH to position this seat in booster mode." That's it; nowhere does that state it is *required.* Clearly, the manual, in two different places, states that (while we all *know* it's better to use Versa Tether) it's not required in booster mode but rather in harness mode from 65-80#.

Sooooo... The point I was *trying* to make, coming right from the manual, before we got into who's right, was that it would seem as a parent reading the manual that you can use the booster without the tether. HOWEVER, the article I cited states that dummies sustained greater brain damage than would be safe without the tether. I, once again, stated that I can see it because the thing is so friggin' heavy. Therefore, unless you really want a pain in the butt, don't buy it for booster mode. I have been very limited in usage of the booster since I have to use tether when in booster mode.

Whew.

EDITED: Here's another spot: p. 20, General Information: "Always use the Versa-Tether for children weighing 65-80 lbs in harness mode." No reference on the entire page to tether being required in booster mode.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *an_aurora*
> 
> Yes, you are correct.
> 
> Faulting the Frontier for being used against the manufacturer's explicit instructions is not fair, IMO.


----------



## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Is the upper tether even ALLOWED in booster mode? LATCH is different than tether, usually, in manuals like that.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Yes, the tether and LATCH are both allowed in booster mode, provided it doesn't interfere with the seatbelt.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DahliaRW*
> 
> Is the upper tether even ALLOWED in booster mode? LATCH is different than tether, usually, in manuals like that.


----------



## Melanie_7773 (Mar 22, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thandiwe*
> 
> Sooooo... The point I was *trying* to make, coming right from the manual, before we got into who's right, was that it would seem as a parent reading the manual that you can use the booster without the tether. HOWEVER, the article I cited states that dummies sustained greater brain damage than would be safe without the tether. I, once again, stated that I can see it because the thing is so friggin' heavy. Therefore, unless you really want a pain in the butt, don't buy it for booster mode. I have been very limited in usage of the booster since I have to use tether when in booster mode.


But the Consumer Reports testing didn't address booster usage without the top tether. They tested harnessed usage without a top tether, and booster usage with a top tether.

"In our tests of the Britax Frontier toddler booster seat, installed with a lap belt and *without the top tether*, and tested with a *harnessed* 52-lb., 6-year-old hybrid III dummy, the dummy's head exceeded the limits for head excursion that would be allowed by the standard test. ... When we tested the same seat *with the top tether* installed, and *with a 3-point safety belt*, the head excursions were within the limits."

(emphasis mine)

Neither of these tests conclude anything at all about the safety of the seat in booster mode without the tether. It does suggest that the Frontier *may* not be safely used in harnessed mode above a car manufacturer-imposed top-tether weight limit, but that doesn't seem to be the topic of discussion here.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Yes, perhaps you're right. I still stand by my fact that the booster is a big pain in booster mode. I have spent a lot of time researching *exactly* how to safely use the booster, and the manual is a pain. Britax, and even here in the Consumer Report, don't make it any easier to figure out what is/isn't allowed. Obviously if you have some education on carseats you know the tether is safer, but not everyone does. I have been very disappointed with how Britax handled this entire carseat/booster combo and even their manual. All of this just goes to prove that it's difficult to discern exactly what to do, or rather what is allowed/safe. If I could do it again, I would not have spent the money on the Frontier (times two for us).

I stand by Britax for their convertible carseats; they are very awesome carseats.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Melanie_7773*
> 
> But the Consumer Reports testing didn't address booster usage without the top tether. They tested harnessed usage without a top tether, and booster usage with a top tether.
> 
> ...


----------



## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

The Frontier just seems like an odd duck for Britax. I haven't seen the 85 version (it's not in any stores in AK) and only briefly played with the original, but it just seemed out of place with the rest of their seats. Hard to install, etc. I don't doubt that it's a PITA to use!


----------



## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

I actually don't see how the tether would help excursion in booster mode, since the body moves more with the 3 point belt that is not anchored to the seat. It seems entirely different than the 5 point harness. I would think the main function of the tether in booster mode would be to help the seat stay in position.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Just my educated guess, but have you picked one up? They weigh a ton. I *think* the premise is that because the seat is such a heavy mass, it would help propel the body even further since it increases the body weight and it's a separate mass that's not secured to the seat. By securing the booster, it seems like it would then assure that the body doesn't get propelled forward with even greater mass?? Don't know if that makes sense, but it kind of does to me. As for the head excursion separately? Maybe not so much. Either way, it can't be good in an impact.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DahliaRW*
> 
> I actually don't see how the tether would help excursion in booster mode, since the body moves more with the 3 point belt that is not anchored to the seat. It seems entirely different than the 5 point harness. I would think the main function of the tether in booster mode would be to help the seat stay in position.


----------



## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thandiwe*
> 
> I *think* the premise is that because the seat is such a heavy mass, it would help propel the body even further since it increases the body weight and it's a separate mass that's not secured to the seat. By securing the booster, it seems like it would then assure that the body doesn't get propelled forward with even greater mass??


Yes, that's one theory. It does make sense. From what I have seen, LATCH & tether-ing a booster doesn't make that much difference safety wise, but is handy as it secures the seat when empty so it's not a projectile.


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

As a side note, this is one issue I never realized on my own until a female state trooper pointed this out to me once checking my carseat before my firstborn arrived. She told me to be sure anything I kept loose in my car was something I was willing to throw at my baby's face with great force. Whew. Really struck a nerve. To this day, I still strap my purse, bookbag, anything down so it doesn't slap the kids in worst case scenario. I think every parent should be told that, because sometimes you just don't think of those things.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *an_aurora*
> 
> ...but is handy as it secures the seat when empty so it's not a projectile.


----------



## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thandiwe*
> 
> Just my educated guess, but have you picked one up? They weigh a ton. I *think* the premise is that because the seat is such a heavy mass, it would help propel the body even further since it increases the body weight and it's a separate mass that's not secured to the seat. By securing the booster, it seems like it would then assure that the body doesn't get propelled forward with even greater mass?? Don't know if that makes sense, but it kind of does to me. As for the head excursion separately? Maybe not so much. Either way, it can't be good in an impact.


That's what I meant by holding the seat in place. But I don't see how that would affect head excursion. Overall body movement, yes, but I don't see how it make a difference just for the head. And that would be my primary concern.

On a side note, I often wonder if latching a booster could actually be bad. In the sense that you want the seat to move with the child to offer the protection of the shell around the child. If latched, then at some point the booster stops moving and the child is probalby still moving beyond that...


----------



## Thandiwe (May 14, 2007)

Oh no! I hadn't thought about that!!  One more thing to worry about.... Alas that is the one facet of the booster I was holding onto, the shell with the "true side impact protection". Again. Not happy with this booster for booster purposes. I love, love, love it for the harnessed and extended harnessing features. But one more thing to worry about for my son! 

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DahliaRW*
> 
> On a side note, I often wonder if latching a booster could actually be bad. In the sense that you want the seat to move with the child to offer the protection of the shell around the child. If latched, then at some point the booster stops moving and the child is probalby still moving beyond that...


----------

