# Believing in santa claus



## Kiddoson (Nov 19, 2001)

To me this seems like lying to my DD (she is 16 months), my mom says it is teaching her to believe in magic. DH doesn't say much exept, I believed & i'm ok







: What is everyone's take on this? Am I being silly?

Kim


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## heartmama (Nov 27, 2001)

Harmless fun, that is my opinion. Most children want to believe in this stuff. I don't go overboard at all, but I find that putting out cookies and making a wish list for Santa is all in good fun. I have always said that Santa is "Magic" and that everyone is a little part of Santa, we all have to be him (and leave little gifts for one another at christmas etc.).

When ds found his gifts in the closet last year, he was surprised, and I just added that all mommies and daddies are secret helpers, and I help the magic along by keeping presents here if Santa runs out of room. He was fine with that...and anyway...

WHO SAYS THERE ISN'T A SANTA???









Heartmama


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## SoHappy (Nov 19, 2001)

I love the idea of Santa. I just LOVED Santa as a kid. Not just because of the presents, but because he was kind and was nice to his worker elves and reindeer and lived in the snow (I lived in Hawaii) and got to fly across the sky and his wife made cookies and well, so much more. I still get excited and wave whenever I see a Santa. I don't even think about the fact that it's just somebody in a suit.

I don't feel like I'm lying when I talk about Santa. I feel like Santa is kind of a spirit that adopts each of us this season. I'm more than happy to let him occupy a small part of my soul to bring joy to our son.

I know some people don't want to take the focus off of Jesus, and I can respect that. I just really think Santa adds something to the celebration. There's always been something about Santa for me.


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## ComeOnLetsGo (Nov 19, 2001)

I think Santa, like the toothfairy and Easter bunny, adds a delicious sense of magic and wonder to childhood (and adulthood, for that matter!). When my oldest son was ready to stop believing in Santa and asked me point blank to tell him the truth, the first thing he said in reply was "Don't worry Mom, I will never tell (his brothers). I don't want them to miss out on a minute of believing". Now, at age 10, he has so much fun going along with all of the Santa stuff such as cookies and milk, helping his brothers write their letters to Santa,etc. I always think it is so sad when children aren't allowed to have this part of childhood. Just my opinion.


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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

After a Mothering boards discussion of this exact issue a few years ago, my SO and I sat down and had a long talk.

A little background:
My SO is from a large Catholic family and celebrated the holiday tradition with the aspect of S.C. when growing up. My dad comes from a large Catholic family and my mom comes from a big Jewish family. We celebrated several holiday traditions when I was growing up, and we did have the S.C. tradition mixed into our Christmas celebrations. My SO and I differ in how the S.C. aspect of Christmas manifested itself when we were kids, but we both have that in our history.

My sweetie and I agreed upon the following:

*We both enjoyed the S.C. aspect of Christmas growing up. It was really fun, even after we found out exactly what was going on.

*Even though we have different personalities, neither of us was traumatized at all when we found out the Santa who gave us presents was our parents

*We value imaginative play we can do with our kidos

*We don't want to lie to our children

Here's our agreed upon approach for the future that we came up after talking:

*We do the S.C. thing.

*We don't invent any elaborate stories about S.C., allowing imagination to take over for the kids. We all hang small stockings Christmas Eve, and they are filled over night. In the morning, these treats from Santa are enjoyed before we open presents under the tree from each other.

*Child is old enough to ask=child is old enough to know. If one of our future children happens to ask at a partciularly young age (3? 4?), we will try asking him/her what she thinks without actually answering the question ourselves, etc. However, if questions are persistant, regardless of age, we answer honestly.

*Our explanation (basically): There once was a real man who delivered presents to people, especially children, in celebration of Christmas. When this old man died, people wanted to carry on his tradition. To carry on the spirit of "old man Christmas," people play Santa for each other. It's all about fun and the spirit of giving (and the spirit of giving anonymously). There are traditions like this all around the world (which we can read about together as a family).

*Our older children are free to "play Santa" for eachother, if they want to get up in the night to leave presents in stockings. This is a fun game we can all participate in!

That's our solution







. It works, and it's fun.


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## Kiddoson (Nov 19, 2001)

After reading all your posts, it reminded me of how much fun it was to believe in santa, to come downstairs christmas morning & see all those presents under the tree, thinking he came to MY house!! The putting out cookies & milk.... gosh how could I have forgotten?Thank you ladies for the reminder, I am glad I posted this thread









Kim


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## Heavenly (Nov 21, 2001)

We are definately NOT teaching Santa. I won't go into all my reasons but basically I do not think my children need Santa to get the magic of Christmas. The meaning of Christmas is and will be Jesus in our family. We will focus on giving and helping the needy. We will give gifts because we love each other not because they expect them. We will also not be teaching the Easter Bunny, or the Tooth Fairy or what not. I DO think it's lying. To each their own but it is definately not for my family.


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## Kiddoson (Nov 19, 2001)

Heavenly,
I find your choice interesting, it is different than the thoughts I was having but the end is the same - no santa.
One question, do your kids have a hard time with all the other kids believing & talking about santa? Do they tell them he's not real?


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## lisamarie (Nov 19, 2001)

My ds is 5 years old and is so excited about Christmas! I too, have such fond memories of santa, tooth fairy & the easter bunny. I never felt let down when I "found out". But, we also bring the religious aspects into the holidays as well. Lighting the advent calendar during this time of year. We also have "resurection eggs" that countdown to easter and tell the passion story. Last night we wrote a letter to Santa. My ds has done this for the past two years. He never asks for anything, instead, he just tells Santa what has gone on in his life during the past year and this year, he asked for a Birthday Cake for me (my b-day is 12/14). That was the only thing he asked for. He has the meaning of christmas in his heart.


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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:

_Originally posted by lisamarie_
*But, we also bring the religious aspects into the holidays as well.*
Right, we celebrate the holiday with the religious stuff, and anything we do in addition is also such a celebration. Like I said in my posts, our explanation is that the original man in the story of Santa Claus is a man who did what he did _in celebration_ of Christmas, which as you pointed out, is about the birth of Jesus. I'm not sure how the meaning would be lost with another layer of celebrational tradition. Additionally, we've always been very into the idea of not giving out of obligation but out of a desire to share, and most of our holiday traditions (as well as day to day life) focuses on helping others. But that's just me. I think everyone does what works best for their own families, and that's kind of cool too







. I'm enjoying reading about all these different approaches.


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## BathrobeGoddess (Nov 19, 2001)

We do the Santa thing...I even do silly stuff Christmas eve like putting ash around the fireplace so it looks like Sants did it. My dd is sort of old to believe in Santa still but she is certain he is real. Kids tell her all the time that he's not and she just says she knows he is. The other kids sometimes change their minds!

Plus-Santa is fun for ME!! I get to do stuff that, as "mom", I wouldn't do! I love the magic involved, the planning, the enjoyment I get out of it! Ditto for the Tooth Fairy, Easter Hare, fairy rings, etc.

-This year I am putting reinedeer footprints around the yard (hopefully in snow) and sleigh marks!!!

I understand the problems people have with the idea that this is lying but to me it is just pretending and is so magical for dd. We all need a little magic now and then!


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

We don't do Santa. he doesn't bring presents, he doesn't come here and we don't leave cookies. We don't ban him either. He is a fun little part of Christmas, a character in a story. We tell her about St. Nick she get to sit on santas lap and tell him what she wants , we do stockings but she knows who really fills them. So, she doesn't believe but we do have fun with him. One of the reasons is because of how devistated I was when I found out he wasn't real. It really sucked, I felt so lied to. I don't htink it is right to lie to kids. Also we want tpo focus only at Jesus on the holidays and just glance at a few of the other things. We don't even do that much for presents.

We don't do easter bunny at all because of it's ties to idols. We have May baskets and whhile the kids get baskets with a few fun things but mostly focus on gving sweet things to others.

Tooth fairy on the other hand . . . Since she isn't barging in on God's spotlight we might let her stick around but do the crap about "if you don't believe she won't come. If we get busted oh well, kids still get money in the morning.


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## laurajean (Nov 19, 2001)

I am still on the fence about the Santa issue. I do not want to lie to my ds. But, I did enjoy the mysterious bearded man whose belly shook when he laughed like a bowl full of jelly, when I was a child.

I think what we will do is tell the story of Santa as a character in a story. And, not embellish. When my ds asks of the validity, we will turn the question around to him. And, when he finally requires the out right truth - we'll give it to him. I do not think we will right letters to Santa...Or, imply that the presents under the tree are necessarily from Santa.

I think we still have a few years to sort this out though...


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## m&m (Nov 20, 2001)

We don't do Santa per se, but we do talk about St Nicholas and how he gave presents to the good poor children and how the tradition still lives on.

So we give a gift to the poor picked out by our dd - she loves it

As for the guys at the malls etc. She thinks it is just a big dress-up game for them - she laughs and thinks it is nice game

We exchange stockings but everyone knows it is not from Santa

When i was little I could not understand why Santa could afford to give really cool things to some kids, but not much to the poor kids - seemed reverse to me.


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## Forest Sage (Nov 22, 2001)

I felt truly betrayed when I discovered that my parents were lying to me about Santa. When I was little I did not understand that my parents did it so I could experience the joy and spirit of Santa, I just felt alot of anger over having been taken for a ride. Ever since then I wondered whether I would perpetuate the Santa myth. Having my son believe in Santa would go against every instinct I have, so my husband and I decided we would be honest with him. There is enough beauty and magic in the story of Christ's birth. Overemphasis on consumerism and getting presents spoils the season. We also teach our son to respect the fact that other kids love to think about Santa coming to their house.

Peace,
Amie


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## Pom (Nov 20, 2001)

Hi There - I find this all very interesting and enlightening, especially since I and my DD are Jewish, but DH was raised Catholic, and we are struggling with what to do here with Santa (and the tree, and Jesus, etc).

But can someone please help me get my brain around the idea that the Tooth Fairy can be problematic? I am honestly baffled, and would love to hear the rationale behind not allowing it.

Thanks~


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## rsps (Nov 20, 2001)

We'd planned not to play the Santa game. But I think the kids pick it up by osmosis.

Then ds (3 1/2) asked if santa was real (he had heard that song grandma got run over by a reaindeer) and I said no. He said "he has to be real SOMEONE has to come down the chimmny"

We sort of left it at that then latter he asked and I compared it to Harry Potter. that Santa was made up just like harry pooter but it was fun to pretend they we're real.

That's where we are now, so we'll see how it goes.


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## warriorprincess (Nov 19, 2001)

We don't do Santa, because I felt betrayed when I found out my parents had lied to me. I don't want to do that to my kids.


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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

Pom, it sounds like you and I have a little in common, in mixing Catholic and Jewish traditions. P.M. me sometime if you feel like it.


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## SoHappy (Nov 19, 2001)

Wow. I had no idea so many people felt betrayed by finding out there's no one true physical being named Santa Claus. In our family, once we figured it out, we were somehow taught that Santa is a feeling and a magical part of childhood, and parents help spread the feeling and share the wonder. I never felt betrayed, just honored that I was in on the secret and able to help Santa stay alive in the eyes of younger kids.
This is interesting!


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## Willow Tree (Nov 19, 2001)

Iam still a little bit confused about how to celebrate the whole December Holiday Situation as a whole~~
My Dh and I were both brought up with Santa and Jesus. In fact I remember at some point thinking they were related??? however, after embarking on this spiritual journey were all sharing, we choose a very different spiritual path then we had grown up with, we feel most connected with Winter Solstice and choose to celebrate that with all of our closest friends (fellow tribies) and their children. We do a huge winter (Vegetarian) feast and decorate the altar each family adds things and all the kids get presents from everyone mostly crafty handmade simple things.and their all from the winter fairy. which is what it is no real hype goes into it just a way to be anymous
SO the problem is the rest of the family celebrates Santa along with the birth of christ and since Solstice falls before Christmas we usually go share the holidays with the Grandma's -who want to share CHRISTmas with her. I do share a connection with Jesus and plan on sharing that with her,but not in this way, I dont want her to think what she sees (X-mas=over consumtion, materialism) is what its about I remember as a child the kid who lived across the street from me who was a complete bully and overall mean kid come out Christmas morning sporting more toys then anyone on the block- and i remember trying to understand why! We do have to remember that is is not the most black and white issue in the world. Part of the whole christmas thing for children is showing off what you "got" to other kids, and i wish we were a big mothering dot commune in real life but unfortunatley we all have to live with the rest of society who doesnt always teach that its all about LOVE and that Givin IS Livin! ( * So I feel to a point I owe it to Lily to put things in perspective!
at this point i feel thankful shes only 2 and I plan on not dealing with it more heavily until next year!!


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## Pom (Nov 20, 2001)

Hey Sierra - I've tried to PM ou a couple times but your mailbox is full ;-)


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## sleepies (Nov 30, 2001)

you have to do what you think is best

santa is one of my fondest memories.

i love love love christmas and santa and rudolph....nestor...etc

i love it.

but, it is really something for everyone to decide.

i dont feel there is a right or wrong answer


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## pie (Apr 7, 2006)

hey sleepies, did you come back or is this an old post?
Anyway, I thought my parents so nice to go through all that trouble to stay up late and put together toys and then give all the credit to some imaginary elves! However, it was, I guess, a lie and I can see being hurt by that. I still plan to do Santa, etc. but when ds asks will give him Santa is real in your heart like parents gave to me. And like someone else said, he will not be used as a threat and will not be given godlike superpowers!


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## Ruth (Nov 19, 2001)

My almost-4-year old does NOT like Santa, never has. Well, once she did. It was a big 20 foot tall Santa in front of a tall office building waiving at her from across the street. She thought it was so nice.

We tell her the truth, that some people believe that Santa Clause brings gifts to children all over the world. We don't tell her that we grew up poor and sometimes Santa missed our house COMPLETELY!

I had a male employee once who told, "I don't tell my children that some white man is giving them gifts once a year. I am black and I want them to know that I worked HARD all year to buy them special things." I couldn't have said it better.


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## pie (Apr 7, 2006)

Ruth, that is exactly why I come here. Not that I won't srill do Santa, but I will remember your post for the rest of my life. Thank you for the reality check.


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## Holistic Momma (Nov 20, 2001)

Ruth, thank you for sharing that. It made me think "why on earth should parents buy a really cool present and give all the credit to Santa Claus?"

*I* want the credit for the present that will give my daughter the biggest smile.







So maybe I'll have Santa bring socks! Heeheehee

So yeah, we'll be doing the whole Santa Clause thing. Shoot, that's why I had a child to begin with! Just so I could do all the neato kiddie stuff.


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## peggy (Nov 19, 2001)

LOL Holistic Momma. I love those 4 stages of life!

We do Santa for better or worse.

peggy


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## boston (Nov 20, 2001)

I lost a lot of trust in my parents (didn't have much to begin with) when I found out santa claus wasn't a real person.
So when I demanded to know if Santa was real, my mom told me the truth and then went on about how the spirit of Christmas is giving, and how Santa is a symbol for that, and yada yada yada.
For me it did absolutely no good to hear that. Maybe because up until that moment, Christmas was about GETTING PRESENTS.

That's all. We didn't celebrate Jesus or any of that. We were brought up without any faith. So christmas was just a time of the year when we got presents. I felt like I had been putting all this focus on an imaginary person for no reason. When I found out Christmas was about giving, I was angry. Not only because I didn't get to have the belief in Santa any longer, but also because I suddenly was more aware of how much deeper other families were, and how much I had missed out because our family was unable to talk about what Christmas really meant. My parents instead just focused on the man in the red suit. The whole jesus in the manger thing was a mystery to me. I still dont really have any sense of connection to that story.

My instinct is to tell my daughter the truth when the time comes. That there is no person named santa claus flying around the world in a sled on Christmas eve. I want to talk about giving and being thankful as a tradition, but I dont have any interest in mr. claus. We wont focus on Jesus cos we're not Christian, but we will recognise the time of year as Christmas time and try to make it special some how. It's gonna be different though, since I also don't like christmas trees because of the sacrifice the trees must make to become a decoration in millions of homes. we're gonna just have to reinvent the whole shabang somehow. Good thing she's only 4 months old.


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## pie (Apr 7, 2006)

If, when she's bigger, she does want a tree, you can either make one that hangs on the wall or buy a potted, living one and then plant it somewhere after Christmas. Or not!







i am so not pushing Christmas, it is just a thought.


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## rosebudsmom (Nov 19, 2001)

In our home we celebrate everything! All fun aspects of many religions, we feel that any celebration is what brings joy to life and we want to respect all religions and all people. So we do the Samta thing because not only is it fun but it helps us to remember not to take life so seriously. We honor the blessings that Buddah, Jesus. Mohamed and Moses ( to just name a few), have taught us to appreciate. Its alot of fun to talk to our dd about how everyone around the world celebrates the season and how we are all linked by a common giving heart. I want my dd to enjoy any and all things during the holidays and throughout the year. We are always honest with her if she asks about Santa or the toothfairy or whatever. She contiues to believe in the magic even after that anyway. I am so glad she does, cause this life is short and any thing that lifts her heart into that kind of playful place is great. I will always do what ever I can to nurture that in her. I wish it could be that easy for us all to just understand the reality then effortlessly be able to enjoy the magic that life has to offer. I love all the stuff everyone does to help create the scene for Santas arrival! You guys are so funny, your kids must have a blast!!!


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## Guestmama 9919 (Nov 20, 2001)

Wow, these postings are all so interesting and helpful!

I'm a stepmom of a 7 year-old girl and hoping to have another child along the way before too long. My stepdaughter's dad and mom definitely do the Santa thing and so I have done it too (this will be the third Christmas I've spent with my stepdaughter).

My question is: when and how does it stop? She still seems to believe in Santa and the tooth fairy. I don't remember how my mom handled this when I got older or when. At what age have your kids figured it out and how did they do it and how did you respond?

I find I am HUGELY ambivalent about this Santa thing (and the tooth fairy too). My mom was an athiest, so Christmas wasn't about Jesus for us: it was about a time to love friends and family and to experience the joy of giving to people you know and people you don't know. And to anticipate the coming of a new year.

I don't remember any bad feelings about finding out that there was no Santa. Right until my mom died when I was in my twenties, some of the presents from her would say from "Santa" and some were from "mom." It became a formality that nonetheless was a fun, tender reminder of being a little kid. And I think she did it to be consistent for the young nieces and nephews in the house.

BUT: in my own experience playing Santa now, I have to say that the Santa thing does FEEL to me like lying. And in retrospect, I think the "MAGIC" of Christmas or other mythic occasions for me wasn't mostly because of the magical person or fairy who supposedly brought the gifties, but because there were gifties at all and decorations and special food and family coming together and a time to think about how we connect to the wider world.

I'm really not anti-Santa. It's more that I'm struggling with how inauthentic it feels to ME (not to speak for anyone else because this is clearly a personal experience thing) to sneak around with special Santa wrapping paper and special Santa handwriting and special Santa presents (not to be confused with presents from parents) in order to fabricate a mythology that just isn't true.

Pretend to me is a really different thing because in pretend games all the "players" understand that we're pretending. In this case, the kids don't know the rules of the game.

And if it's the spirit and story of Santa that's delightful (and I agree it is!), then it seems like celebrating it as a spirit and story is closer to the truth than pretending it's the truth. I say this partly because I think I WISH I didn't feel like I was lying.

Honesty is such a tangly and important issue...as a kid (in other ways besides Santa) I was often unsure in my family what the "rules of the game" were and as a result I wound up with more self-doubt and lack of trust than is useful to have. I wonder if pretending about Santa could in any way contribute to kids doubting about the veracity of other things we tell them? I really don't know, just wondering out loud.

Maybe this is something that starts to feel weirder and weirder when a kid gets past say four years old. At that young, kids themselves developmentally aren't all that sure the difference between reality and dreams and pretend, right?

Anyway, I find this conversation really helpful!


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## Pumpernickle (Dec 3, 2001)

I loved waking up on Christmas morining and sitting by the tree opening presents. I never felt like my parents were lying to me when I asked if Santa was real and they explained to me he wasn't. For those who have said that they lost trust in your parents when they found out he wasn't real, could their had been more behind it, then Santa not being real. Some other issues?


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## m&m (Nov 20, 2001)

I know I already replied, but I had something more to say...

Children are very smart, they themselves question the Santa myth - why else would they ask so many questions about him like: how does he get into our house? how can he fly around the world? how does he know exactly what i want if i do not tell anyone but mom? Why is he at all the malls? Why does he not seem to age? etc...

Even my almost 3 year old asked those questions last year! We told her the truth - that it is a way of pretending to be the saint that gave presents to the poor anonymously to bring them happiness.

The whole reindeer pulling flying sleigh thing is very hard to believe - as it should be - it is not true.

Yes, that is the "magical" part, but why does it have to be focused on?

Keep the tradition if you want, but trust even your youngest child to be questioning things... and then tell them the TRUTH - don't just say you don't know, or give some silly answer - THAT is when the hurt can happen.


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## Ruth (Nov 19, 2001)

I agree that probably people get hurt when they find out Santa isn't real when they keep asking their parents and the parents insist he is real.

I try not to lie to my child. Even if I told her the Santa story as if it were fact, if she started doubting the story, I would tell her the truth: that it is just a story.

But I do know parents that keep insisting that Santa is real, even when the kids figure out he isn't real. I think THESE parents have issues. I remember finding the gifts hidden away and thinking, hm, just what I figured. But I never felt betrayed.


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