# Family refuses meal. What do you do?



## merpk (Dec 19, 2001)

So we're having our dinner. 'Round here folks eat something dinner-like at 2/3-ish, and then later on it's the little stuff.

So I made what I thought was a very yummy soup (carrots, celery, mushrooms, onions, garlic, and some other stuff chopped up small, little round cute "O" noodles, reasonably spicy spices, in a stock sort of thing, cooked for a couple of hours ...) and very yummy roasted potatoes (cut in chunks, olive oil drizzle with kosher salt, rosemaryh & garlic, bake till brown & crunchy-ish) ... I'm eating it very happily.

The kids are all complaining.

Except the one who usually never eats anything (DS#2). He loves it.

Well, let's be precise. Nobody was kvetching (complaining) until someone saw there was one piece of onion in it that was recognizable as onion (the rest having been totally chopped past recognition). Now no one will eat it. 3yo is seriously crying about it. 5yo ate his (aforementioned DS#2 ... but he is refusing to touch the potatoes







). 7yo is trying to pretend she's eating but not eating and whining a little. 9yo has an excuse ... he's sick ... but still, he's not eating it when I only made soup because he's sick.

So what do you do when this happens? Or does this only happen to me?

Would you make something different?

Would you ... what?


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## Momtwice (Nov 21, 2001)

I would definitely not make a second hot meal. But I'd let them eat something else healthy and simple with protein, a bowl of cereal and milk/soymilk, whole grain toast and PB, whatever is healthyish and quick. Children old enough (don't know about yours, you know them best) would get their own.

I would probably be getting upset and thinking "I shouldn't give this situation so much drama and power, I should just be calm, it's ok....."

Were the tears truly about dinner, or was the onion the last straw in a stressful day for that child?


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## JaneSmith1010 (Apr 22, 2007)

i would next time not make it with onions, but possibly with onion powder and for now tell them to eat it or not. kids will eat if hungry enough and they won't starve if they refuse dinner tonight.


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## 2xshy (Nov 27, 2007)

My 4 year old does that, and I simply let her know that food isn't always about taste, sometimes we eat because our bodies need it, to make us strong, and because we need different things from different foods. If she really fusses about it she can get up, but she eats the left overs for her next meal.
That said I don't make her food that I know she doesnt like. Eggs for example make her gag, so she never gets those. But everytime she eats french toast i make sure she knows its bread and eggs to let her know she does like them sometimes. And onions I let her pick out if she gets them on her plate.
Theres not too much of an issue with it, except after a weekend at her grandparents.hehe


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## Justmee (Jun 6, 2005)

I'll give you an answer if you invite me over to eat. That soup sounds soooo







:

I'm probably the wrong person to ask because I haven't been really cooking lately, but when I actually do cook (I also do the big meal at lunch) I serve that first and hope they actually try it (sometimes they won't, they are in a picky phase). Usually if they continue to refuse to eat it I'll fix something else fast, but I'm really trying to get into the habit of lunch is X and you are going to eat that unless it's a major problem. They are all into the frozen convient snitzels lately and we just can't afford that long term, so I'm trying to be better at cooking and encouraging them to eat. I think I'll try soup next week, mine usually eat soup, thanks for the great idea it sounds yummy


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

I'd offer to help them make sandwiches, cereal, fruit, a bagel/toast, oatmeal or etc. We could do it and then all sit and eat or I could eat my soup first and then I'd help them. We'd discuss it and go from there.









I like to keep things they can help themselves to available, but I also see that youhave a wee one that would likely still need your help anyway. So yeah, that's about it. There would be no hard feelings about them not wanting the soup. I think food is about taste as well as about nutrition. There's no way, unless I was truly starving and it was my only option, that I would eat something I didn't want to eat and I don't expect my kids to do it either.


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## 425lisamarie (Mar 4, 2005)

I make something simple, and next time I'd make it wihtout the biggest complaint part. I try to make stuff I know they'll eat, and if I make something for just me or DH i make sure there is something the kids love too. DD is the same way, I never know if she'll eat or not LOL!

DS loves eggs so if he doesn't like dinner I make him eggs any way he wants and some toast. That's his favorit meal anyways.

I notice sometimes we all go through picking spurts where no one actually wants a meal! I make sort of family type platters, put them in the center of the table, and everyone picks of it.

Also, if i notice the kids are getting bored of dinner time I put a huge sheet on the carpet and we have a picnic on the floor. We do this more than the table probably!


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## cloudswinger (Jan 24, 2005)

They say it takes kids a while to try something, so I let them refuse, but I also offer it again later. With my dd, sometimes she might not be in the mood for it. Plus I think with multiple kids, when one says something is yucky, others might say that just because. Or maybe the one kid likes it a little spicier? It's hard to say. If you have more, you can possibly use bread to dip in the soup. Or some other distracting yet fun way to eat.


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## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

I'd make 'em eat it, but I'm a meanie.


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## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

The 7 and 9 year olds I would probably tell them to eat it, especially if they were already eating and only stopped when they realized there was an onion in it. I'd let the 5 year old leave the potatoes behind. The 3 year old I would make something different for - something simple but healthy like a good cereal or oatmeal or something.


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

mine are 6, 7, and 7 and I'd make them eat some. they can pick around the onions,they can dunk bread in... but sorry - this is dinner and you're eating it.

I make things I *think* they'll like - and if they don't like it I likely won't make it again - but I was held hostage by their picky eating for too long and I finally said enough is enough.


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## JElaineB (Nov 12, 2005)

I always make sure to serve 3-4 (usually 5-6) items, with at least one thing DS is known to like. I tend to serve lots of side dishes, for example: bread and butter, raw or cooked vegetables, cut-up fruit, applesauce, cheese cubes or sticks, cottage cheese, olives, pickles, etc. So even if he doesn't like the main meal he has things he likes to eat on the table. I do not make something separate for him - if he doesn't eat he will get to eat at the next meal or snack time.


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## merpk (Dec 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flminivanmama* 
mine are 6, 7, and 7 and I'd make them eat some. they can pick around the onions,they can dunk bread in... but sorry - this is dinner and you're eating it.

I make things I *think* they'll like - and if they don't like it I likely won't make it again - but I was held hostage by their picky eating for too long and I finally said enough is enough.


See, there's the thing. I thought they'd like it.

(I _knew_ they'd like the potatoes, and DS#2, who refuses everything, loves them. And he's the one who ate the soup and rejected the potatoes. That's why I put in the scratching-head-guy smilie.







)

But to try and make something that no one will reject is just too much of a pain ... pizza or ice cream I think are the only choices for complete unanimity of love ... someone is going to kvetch about _something_ ...

When DH makes the soup they never refuse. He makes outrageous soups. Sigh. /envy

So we have several votes here for make new stuff/ let them make new stuff? Hmmmm ...


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## rainyday (Apr 28, 2006)

Well, for me the issue isn't whether you make them something else or not (I wouldn't, FWIW - if one eats the soup and no potatoes, but the others eat potatoes and no soup, they all get some food, and that would be fine with me). For me, the issue is the complaining. We finally instituted a no complaining about food rule. You can eat it, great. You can not eat it, that's fine. But you may not complain about it because that's rude and disrespectful to the cook.

I don't make something new for the same reason. I worked hard to cook this. I made sure there's something palatable for everyone and that I'm not serving something that is just absolutely horrifying to anyone (like I felt about chicken livers growing up!), and I don't think it's fair to the cook whether it's me or someone else to ask them to make something new.

It's hard to make something everyone will like. I shoot for one thing at each meal that everyone will eat. This does not have to be the same thing, so for one it might be bread, but for another it might be soup and so on. As long as there is something in the meal that I know the kids can eat and be happy with, I figure it's good.


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

amy though the pizza thing is what I mean by held hostage. I made nothing but pasta with cheese for YEARS and I finally got sick of it.

In october I started making a monthly meal plan. we have something specific each day of the week so they know what to expect (soup on M, mexican on T, meat on W, pasta or something else on Th, Chicken on F, Fish on Sat. Breakfast for dinner on Sun). if something doesn't go over well I won't remake it - like the pasta primevera was no go... but surprisingly the roasted root veggies with quinoa and veal sausage was a hit.

I have one child who Does. Not. Eat. but truthfully he's just going to have to figure it out. I was sick of it and I wasn't going to take it anymore.

yes, sometimes he cries, but thankfully that's been happening less and less. he still negotiates a lot - which he knows I hate - but I think that will stop soon too.

at a LLL meeting not long ago we went around the room to say what our biggest motherhood stress was and mine and one other moms was food.

also I like to cook. A lot. and I was sad that I never got to do that for my family. (dh works All. The. Time. so it's just me and the kids for dinner 5 nights a week)

and LOL I was worried that thjeir future wives were going to come to me and say it was my fault that they are such picky eaters haha


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rainyday* 
For me, the issue is the complaining. We finally instituted a no complaining about food rule. You can eat it, great. You can not eat it, that's fine. But you may not complain about it because that's rude and disrespectful to the cook.

I cross posted with you. I meant to say this too. - don't eat it, fine. but don't be mean. It just plain hurts my feelings.


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

I try to make every meal have at least one thing everyone would like. Dd, for example, eats no meat except ham and chicken nuggets.







: So if I roast a chicken, I'll make sure there's some rice and broccoli as side dishes because I know she likes those.

If, for some reason, the kids don't like anything I've made, they can always have a pb&j sandwich instead. Something quick and easy. They rarely choose this option.


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## mchalehm (Feb 5, 2007)

I would never make a child eat if he/she doesn't want to. However, you aren't a short-order cook! My general approach is, I offer. If my daughter doesn't want it (she's 16 months), she can either wait (if she's not hungry) or have a boring but okay food like Cheerios. I'm not going to offer her a bunch of different things; if she is hungry, she'll eat it. If not, well, she can have her Cheerios.

I figure, if she's hungry and needs food, she'll eat either what we eat or the Cheerios--if she rejects both, she's not hungry. And that's her choice.

I guess in your situation I would try not to engage in drama about the food. Eat it, offer it to them, and if they won't eat it, hand them something dull but healthy that won't be exciting to them. And save their leftovers for you, because it sounds delicious.

p.s. As an adult, I can understand how a child would feel if I made a meal they really didn't like--it's the way I feel at a party when the food options gross me out! So I agree about providing a few dishes and making sure (if you can) that you've included things they like. But kids are not predictable about this. A kid might LOVE bananas one week and then the next week, out of nowhere, say, "I'm not eating this, bananas are gross." So it's hard to be sure about that. I wouldn't make a whole meal centered around avocados, since my daughter hates them, but there's no way for me to know that what I make WILL be okay to her. So you can't always win that way.


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## BusyBeeMom (May 15, 2005)

I'm not a short order cook. My feeling is, "this is what's for dinner. Eat it or don't, but you're not getting another meal." There is a lot of value in learning to try new things. You don't have to love every meal you've ever had, and it's just plain good manners to eat what's offered (unless of course there's a true medical/religious reason why you can't) when you're a guest, so this is a good way to teach that skill.


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## kjbrown92 (Dec 13, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BusyBeeMom* 
I'm not a short order cook. My feeling is, "this is what's for dinner. Eat it or don't, but you're not getting another meal." There is a lot of value in learning to try new things. You don't have to love every meal you've ever had, and it's just plain good manners to eat what's offered (unless of course there's a true medical/religious reason why you can't) when you're a guest, so this is a good way to teach that skill.

I'm with you!







: That being said, I do make a variety. I always make two vegetables (mostly because one of my kids has multiple food intolerances, so I'll make something she can have - like cooked carrots or spinach, and then I'll make corn or peas too). Also, if there's something that I know isn't popular with all of them (like salmon), I'll put a fruit plate on the table too. I always tell them (my kids are 10, 7, 2) that if there's something they don't like, put it off to the side and don't eat it, but I don't want to hear about it and they can eat it or not, but that's dinner. I always offer crackers or bread with the soup, because it's a good way for them to get all the broth into their bodies! I do the "no thank you helping" that I was raised on, so they have to try it, and more often than not, they're pleasantly surprised and like it.
Kathy


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## mirlee (Jul 30, 2002)

We have a no pressure tactic when it comes to food. I don't make ds eat anything he doesn't want to. He can always have a peanut butter sandwich.

I would have told the kids. Soup is what I have made. If they don't like it, they may make themselves a peanut butter sandwich. I would then return to enjoying the perfectly yummy soup. I would have driven all the way to NYC for that soup. It sounds delicious.


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## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mirlee* 
We have a no pressure tactic when it comes to food. I don't make ds eat anything he doesn't want to. He can always have a peanut butter sandwich.

I don't make my ds eat things he doesn't want to, but I do insist that he at least try things. I only have this issue with one of my boys - the others eat everything but the one 5 year old is unbearably picky and doesn't like to try anything. When I insist he try things he often finds new foods he likes.
It really was an eye opener for me because with the older ones they would just try stuff, no need to have a rule about it.

I use to let him just decide that he didn't want something and I would make him something else and then finally I couldn't do it anymore - I was sick of spending time making things I knew he would like only to have him not try them. So now we have a two bite rule - he needs to take two bites, if he still doesn't like whatever it is then he can have something else.


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

If I don't like something, I complain. Why can't my kids? I'd just make them something else.


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

No WAY would I make something else. Time and energy are limited for moms, and for most other people. You are not a short order cook. I totally agree with the posts that say eat it or not, but I will not cook a second meal. It is a boundaries thing, the way I see it, and kids will not learn appropriate boundaries if they can complain and make people jump and serve them. Life does not generally work that way. My job is to make the food, their job is to accept the food gratefully, no complaining, and just eat it unless they are not hungry. With four kids, I do my best to make all the meals nice, but gads, no way could I accomodate each little whim or caprice where food is concerned. And for me, the idea of saying, well go make yourself a sandwich, is not acceptable, because for one thing sandwiches cannot generally replace a full, just-cooked, nutritious meal, and for another, I think it teaches them an every-man-for-himself mentality rather than putting aside personal preferences for a common good, that common good being family and mealtime harmony. Also, when kids make sandwiches, they often end up needing some kind of assistance, or the kitchen needs cleaning again afterwards, and when I've just cooked a whole meal, I am not wanting to do MORE service. We have one child with multiple, severe food allergies, so we already have food restrictions, as those foods cannot be in the house. I have told the kids that we eat what is served, because I am not going to have picky eaters on top of an already restricted menu. We eat what is served, and do it with gratitude.


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## BusyBeeMom (May 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *freestyler* 
And for me, the idea of saying, well go make yourself a sandwich, is not acceptable, because for one thing sandwiches cannot generally replace a full, just-cooked, nutritious meal, and for another, I think it teaches them an every-man-for-himself mentality rather than putting aside personal preferences for a common good, that common good being family and mealtime harmony. Also, when kids make sandwiches, they often end up needing some kind of assistance, or the kitchen needs cleaning again afterwards, and when I've just cooked a whole meal, I am not wanting to do MORE service.

I'm so with you on this. DH's family had the "everyone can eat whatever they want" thing, and, IMO, some of the ill effects of it include being a fussy eater who is not game to politely try what is offered when one is a guest, KILLS the family meal, sets up poor nutritional habits, and also creates the potential for a "martyr" situation b/c unappreciated mom endlessly caters to XX # of people's whims.


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## Mary-Beth (Nov 20, 2001)

I would try to make stuff the way they will eat it...but that said, that isn't always possible or they change their minds about what they eat...so, I'd encourage them to try it and tell them they can skip the onion or whatever. I'd allow them to get something else like sliced turkey and carrot sticks...but I would not make another meal for them.


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## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

This happens to me almost every night.

I don't know what to do.


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Every night, huh. Well, I would make the meals as usual. You have done your part. It is THEIR problem if they skip it and are hungry until breakfast. I would make it clear that the food is there, that is what there is, period, and then change the subject. "Gosh, did you see the snowdrops blooming in the back yard?" or whatever. So often kids just become picky to get attention. And because we are all concerned about our cubs' health, a lot of time their strategy works!

No healthy child has ever voluntarily starved themself to death. They will eat when the payoffs or rewards for NOT eating (i.e. extra parental attention and service) stop happening.


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## lab (Jun 11, 2003)

Didn't read all the responses....

At the age of your kids - they would go hungry.....

Sorry! Flame away.....

But - it's not like you are asking them to eat meat when they are vegetarians. Or eat something disgusting like guts......

I have to tell you - I put choices in front of my kids. I might would make sure I had bread with the soup - but I digress......

I give them a variety of healthy food at each meal.. They eat it or they don't. But they are hungry at the next meal if they don't ....

my kids are 13, 12 and 10 and they are all great eaters.

I remember when my kids were around the age of yours and they complained and were really pretty rude to me (especially considering I stood up in the kitchen for hours so that they could eat!)..... I went OFF on them.

Never a problem since.....


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## lab (Jun 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *freestyler* 
Every night, huh. Well, I would make the meals as usual. You have done your part. It is THEIR problem if they skip it and are hungry until breakfast. I would make it clear that the food is there, that is what there is, period, and then change the subject. "Gosh, did you see the snowdrops blooming in the back yard?" or whatever. So often kids just become picky to get attention. And because we are all concerned about our cubs' health, a lot of time their strategy works!

No healthy child has ever voluntarily starved themself to death. They will eat when the payoffs or rewards for NOT eating (i.e. extra parental attention and service) stop happening.


Excellent post

My oldest eats collards and loves them.....

I applied this same idea and all three of my kids are super great eaters.....

I just don't have time for pickiness....


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## mamaverdi (Apr 5, 2005)

If I don't like something, I don't make it again. Or I don't make it that way. But unless it makes me vomit, I do eat it. And I don't complain if I'm at someone else's house.

We have a rule at our house that the boys have to try it before they can say they don't care for it, and they cannot comment on the food if it's in a negative way.

Also, I generally will not make other food for them afterwards if they did not attempt to eat at least the number of bites of their age.

I will also not make them eat things that make them actually gag, vomit, etc. But this is not known to them.








Amy.


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## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamaverdi* 
If I don't like something, I don't make it again. Or I don't make it that way. But unless it makes me vomit, I do eat it. And I don't complain if I'm at someone else's house.

Yep, me too. I tell ya one thing that makes me firm on the fact that I will not allow my picky 5 year old to dictate his own menu every night is that my FIL is still like that to this day. He makes demands before he arrives at someone's house for dinner and if he doesn't like something he is very rude about it. Last time he was here for my son's birthday party my SIL was commenting about how wonderful the cake was that I had made, my FIL interrupted her to say that he didn't like it - it was "too chocolatey" for him.

We are having Holiday brunch here for the family on the 25th and my MIL has already called to make sure there is something planned that he will eat - when I got to pancakes that was approved. But she is bringing her own syrup for him because we only buy real maple syrup and he doesn't like that.







Wait until he finds out the pancakes are made with hemp nuts


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rmzbm* 
If I don't like something, I complain.

really? I can see complaining at a resturant of course but I'd never complain at my mom's house, at my in laws, at a guests or if my dh cooked. would you honestly complain if someone you loved went through the trouble of cooking for you?

again, yes at a resturant - but I am NOT a cook at a resturant.


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## BusyBeeMom (May 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *transformed* 
This happens to me almost every night.

I don't know what to do.










Keep making dinner and DON'T feel bad. If you stand firm, and make no apologies, they will quickly learn complaining is futile and you *can't* get anything you want, it's not Alice's Restaurant.

If they know they can get to you, create a ruckus, and maybe get chicken fingers (or whatever other prized dinner item they're after), they'll do it.


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## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

yeah and I know some kids who are older-like 10 yrs old-and the ONLY thing they will eat is chicken nuggets.

I do not want that to be my child.

I am trying to keep them healthy! And you cannot be healthy eating chicken nuggets at every meal.


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

transformed - you can do it. stand firm. NOW is the time. make a NY resolution and just do it.

look in the thread that tatooted mama started - also in this forum - it's just me and her talking now but we can support each other


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## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *transformed* 
yeah and I know some kids who are older-like 10 yrs old-and the ONLY thing they will eat is chicken nuggets.

Yep that's my nephew. Everytime he goes to someone's house he expects them to make him chicken nuggets too, I don't even buy the things so he's out of luck at my house.


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## tankgirl73 (Jun 10, 2007)

From my reading on BLW, I think the epidemic of 'picky eaters' is at least partly due to the modern standards of solids introduction for babies -- cereals, bland purees, etc. Kids learn that food is "supposed" to be not very spicy, not complex, etc. So they insist on bland pasta, cheese, peanut butter sandwiches (usually on bleached-white bread)... not to mention 'junk food'.

Not only is this not good eating habits, it's just not healthy, if this is 'all' they're getting.

With DS, we have something similar to the '2-bite' rule, though it's not set in stone... he has to try enough of it to satisfy me, which might be more than just 2 bites. I need to be satisfied he's given it an honest try, not just a gut-reaction-touched-the-tongue thing.

If after that he still doesn't like it, then he's free to get himself something, but I'm not making a 'second meal'. The furthest we'll go is to make a grilled cheese sandwich. Usually he'll get himself an apple and some yoghurt or something.

But I am becoming more insistent that he eats what he's given. He's old enough to understand things like world hunger, and there's that website I saw linked off MDC a few days ago -- pictures of "what the world eats". When you see the family somewhere in Africa with their meals for an entire week -- a couple small bags of rice, maybe a vegetable of some sort... That's very noteworthy. Pointing out that those kids would be happy with ANY food given to them might be 'playing dirty' but darn it, it's true.

So I play the 'we're well off so don't complain' card, and point out to DS that he should be happy that we have FOOD and not complain about details...

And, we're making progress. He's usually much happier to try things now (or, at least, less resistant), and has even discovered that he likes some things.

Oh -- the miracle worker -- ketchup! Half the things he doesn't "like", he'll eat with ketchup on them! So that's another option to consider... if they don't like something, try 'accessorizing'. Ketchup, BBQ sauce, salt&pepper, melted cheese, etc.

Anyway. Have you ever watched those TV shows with unhealthy, overweight families with horrid eating habits? This "guru" lady comes in and gives them a strict, healthy diet to follow. Almost invariably, the kids rebel. They've even gagged and puked at the new healthy food. Thrown tantrums, screamed, cried, refused to eat.

Then by the end of the 3 weeks or 2 months or whatever, they're happily eating almost everything, having successfully adapted to a better diet.

So it's totally possible to influence a child's eating habits, but if they already have bad habits it's not something that's going to happen "naturally".

OTOH, when kids are allowed to make healthy food choices from "real food" from the beginning, they are "more likely" to continue this way. Letting the 'child lead' works only if they've been leading all along, if there's been any interference in the natural progression of things then usually interference is required to reset things, IMO.

DD, now 1 year old, eats a more varied and "grownup" diet than her older brother. She eats lasagna and roast chicken and mashed potatoes and spicy salsa and her favourite food is curry, which DS won't even touch!! We've let her self-feed real food from the beginning, so we have much higher hopes for her dietary habits.

And for DS (fed as a baby on cereals and purees), we just keep on trying to 'reset' his diet. It's slow going, but it's working.


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flminivanmama* 
really? I can see complaining at a resturant of course but I'd never complain at my mom's house, at my in laws, at a guests or if my dh cooked. would you honestly complain if someone you loved went through the trouble of cooking for you?

again, yes at a resturant - but I am NOT a cook at a resturant.

Is that what we're talking about? Away from home? If so, I am sorry I missed that part. I meant if *I* made something, I wasn't thinking beyond that. If someone made a meal for us I would not complain unless it was physically making me gag...in which case I'd just say I'm not hungry.








As far as my kids go in that situation I think I would just have some "standard reply" on hand for if they didn't like it. I would not make them other food in someone else's home, but I'd leave as soon as I could & feed them.


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

no - I just mean in general - if someone prepares a meal for you, you ought to be polite. if my dh cooks I don't think it's nice to complain. likewise if I cook for my children I'd be upset if they complained.


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flminivanmama* 
no - I just mean in general - if someone prepares a meal for you, you ought to be polite. if my dh cooks I don't think it's nice to complain. likewise if I cook for my children I'd be upset if they complained.

I agree, and I wouldn't allow any complaining if someone else made a meal. I just don't personally care if they complain about MY cooking. I am more than willing to make other meals. I think it's ok if others aren't...the question was asked WWYD, and that's what *I* would do.


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## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

It is important that food tastes good. I am a foodie and totally into wine and food, so I understand that.

But there is another function of food that HAS to be taught to children---the fact that without the proper foods, our body will not function properly.

We have to emotionally detach a little bit from the foods we eat.

I ENJOY food THOROUGHLY and COMPLETLEY.

I also choke down some stuff I am not crazy about for the fuel.


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## gardenmommy (Nov 23, 2001)

I have 6 people to feed every day. It is just not practical to expect that everyone will be thoroughly happy with every meal we eat. My standard practice is to prepare food that most everyone likes, and that is nutritious.

I also think it is disrespectful to the cook to complain about what is served. However, my children know that if they truly dislike something, they are free to politely say that they dislike it.

As for fixing another meal, it isn't an option for us. We simply do not have the money to prepare multiple meals several times a day. We eat what is fixed, and are grateful to have it, even if it isn't our favorite. Our children know that they *never* have to eat that meal, but they won't have anything else until the next meal time. They have gotten to a point where they recognize that it is better to eat, even if you don't really like it, than to be hungry.

I'm sorry, but I think it breeds discontent when children have endless options available to them. In most parts of the world, people are happy with a fraction of what we take for granted. It is not harmful for children to know that "this is dinner, and this is it until the next meal". You learn to be grateful for what you have when you can't afford to be wasteful. It isn't mean, and it isn't disrespectful to the child.

I, too, know people who are rude and demanding about their food choices, who complain when it isn't just right (no matter who prepared the meal for them), and who will only eat a handful of foods. I think sometimes, you just need to get to the point where you say, "enough is enough. We will eat what we have, and be thankful for it!"


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Well said, Gardenmommy!!! I'm in total agreement with everything you wrote. And I have six people to feed every day, too. It's a LOT of people, and costs a lot of $$$. ANd all the other things you wrote. Exactly right on.


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## zen_monster (May 4, 2006)

IMHO, I did my job by cooking the meal. If they're hungry enough, they'll eat. I'm not setting a precedence, tho, of cooking another meal if they don't like the one I made.

I'm not too keen on cooking as it is so I definately won't be making 2 meals!!! Kitchen is closed if they choose not to eat!!!


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## tankgirl73 (Jun 10, 2007)

gardenmommy, you said what I was trying to, but much more eloquently than I did.


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## BedHead (Mar 8, 2007)

With my kids being older now, I tell them they either eat what I make or they get nothing for the meal. They still have to sit at the table though during the meal. Then they can get up and make themselves something else but it has to be healthy - not just a corn dog or something.

Oh, and if I've made something brand new they do have to try it.


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## kathywiehl (Dec 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Momtwice* 
I would definitely not make a second hot meal. But I'd let them eat something else healthy and simple with protein, a bowl of cereal and milk/soymilk, whole grain toast and PB, whatever is healthyish and quick. Children old enough (don't know about yours, you know them best) would get their own.

I would probably be getting upset and thinking "I shouldn't give this situation so much drama and power, I should just be calm, it's ok....."

Were the tears truly about dinner, or was the onion the last straw in a stressful day for that child?

That's what I do. If they really truly hate what I made I won't make them eat it. I certainly don't want to eat something I hate just because someone made it for me, but I'm an adult and would do it to be polite or I would make something myself depending who the meal maker was and how they'd take my refusal. With children you really can't expect them to suck it up and eat something they just don't like.

I'd tell them that they have a choice. They can eat what I made and sit nicely at the table with the rest of the family, or they can not eat but still sit nicely at the table or they can whine and cry but that will have to be done in their rooms or somewhere out of earshot because I'd like to enjoy the meal I've worked hard to make.

In any case, I'd be willing to make them something different but only after I'm finished enjoying my meal in peace and quiet with my dh or anyone else who can manage to sit nicely at the table for a family dinner.

I will not let children ruin mealtime for anyone else in the family by being rude, insulting my cooking, whining, or crying. I've sent my 13 year old to eat in another room with her food if she can't manage to keep her attitude in check and I've sent my 2 year old up to play in his room if he can't behave in a way that allows the rest of the family to enjoy a meal.

If all of the kids don't like their meals, then I will ask my teen to make pb and j for all of the kids. The catch is the alternative meal cannot require cooking or large messes and they all have to have the same thing.

Might sound mean, but that is what I do and it works.

ETA- If I make something that I know the kids usually love, like mac n' cheese (healthy kind, not Kraft, lol) or another one of their favorite dishes and they don't eat it just because they are crabby they cannot choose to eat another meal just because.


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## Messac888 (Jan 24, 2005)

I'm totally there with you! My kids aren't too picky, but each of them have very specific food preferences- ds & dh love meat, dd #1 and I are pretty much vegetarian, and the baby, dd #2, since she is not yet a year old, is currently vegan (we don't start ANY animal products in our home until 1 year of age). Baby loves tomato-based things, chopped olives, quinoa, raw chopped broccoli, museli and fruit, etc, but doesn't like veggie juices or anything like that. My dd #1 loves soups of almost any type, but especially loves cruciferous veggies and milk. Ds loves crackers, peanut butter, meat, cheese, basically anything high-fat and veggie-free, sigh... That said, I usually try to not feed them for about an hour and a half before dinner (exception being baby, of course) so they have a good appetite for the meal and are less likely to complain. Course, I also do a nice platter of finger-foods and hors-d'ouvres upon occasion (fruit, cheeses, veggies, crackers, nuts, etc, chased with a nice pitcher of water) as well as the "fend for yourself" meals- usually sandwiches of one's own choosing. It's virtually impossible to please everyone so I just try to please myself and my daughters because we, imho, have a healthier outlook on our food intake. My ds eats like dad and, well, dad's bas cholesterol is currently only 4 points lower than my TOTAL cholesterol so, well, time to eat like mom...







:

I understand how frustrating it can be when there's nothing you really want to eat, though. Today's Christmas and I'm ravenous, but I already ate breakfast and picked the meat out of everything (since there was meat in everything except the beverages) and I'm just not feeling well now. I need a really good veggie pasta salad or something. Maybe a nap, too. lol

Don't worry about pleasing everyone's tastes, but I agree with the others that it's a good idea to teach thankfulness for what's made, even if it's not the most palatable.


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## delicious (Jun 16, 2003)

i never make my kids eat food they don't want to eat. they do try new things, on their own terms. i think they should listen to what their bodies tell them, not what i tell them. it's their stomach.

we usually keep easy things around that they can go grab if they are not happy with whats on the table. carrots and hummus, whole wheat tortillas with cream cheese, etc.

i would not go cook another meal, but that's not what i'm saying here. they are 6 and 3 and can make sandwiches, etc, without my help.


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## krankedyann (May 28, 2005)

I haven't read all the responses, but in my house if I fix a meal they don't like, they're required to eat a small portion of it anyway. My kids are 5 and 3. We don't allow complaining or ungratefulness. They're allowed to say something isn't their favorite, but they're not allowed to call it 'yucky' or 'gross.' The adults also model good behavior in front of them by eating foods that aren't our favorites, either. My husband really doesn't like lima beans, but my kids love them, so he eats them anyway. I'm not wild about black-eyed peas or brussels sprouts, but I eat them anyway.

If they choose not to eat, they may wait until the next meal to eat again. I don't make them something else to eat, and they don't get the next scheduled snack, either. If they complain in an unacceptable way, they receive a warning. The second time, they leave the table and wait until the next meal. It's rare that we have a problem at the dinner table, and my children aren't shy about trying new foods.


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## lerlerler (Mar 31, 2004)

In our home, I make sure that I serve bread or crackers with dinner.

Don't want to taste it? I'll offer ketchup or a condiment to "
drown" the flavor. I NEVER insist that they try it... I think that's rude. There are weird things that would make ME gag and I don't think that's right... (the smell of bananas make me retch! I'd be LIVID if someone insisted I eat them.)

But THAT'S all you get. just eat crackers, or bread, or nothing. You don't need to eat... .you also do not get to whine or complain... if you do, you WILL leave the table so I can enjoy my meal.

So far? so good...

My 3 year old eats brussel sprouts... and rarely whines about food (only whines when she is SO TIRED she can't sit)


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## NaomiMcC (Mar 22, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *freestyler* 
No WAY would I make something else. Time and energy are limited for moms, and for most other people. You are not a short order cook. I totally agree with the posts that say eat it or not, but I will not cook a second meal. It is a boundaries thing, the way I see it, and kids will not learn appropriate boundaries if they can complain and make people jump and serve them. Life does not generally work that way. My job is to make the food, their job is to accept the food gratefully, no complaining, and just eat it unless they are not hungry. With four kids, I do my best to make all the meals nice, but gads, no way could I accomodate each little whim or caprice where food is concerned. And for me, the idea of saying, well go make yourself a sandwich, is not acceptable, because for one thing sandwiches cannot generally replace a full, just-cooked, nutritious meal, and for another, I think it teaches them an every-man-for-himself mentality rather than putting aside personal preferences for a common good, that common good being family and mealtime harmony. Also, when kids make sandwiches, they often end up needing some kind of assistance, or the kitchen needs cleaning again afterwards, and when I've just cooked a whole meal, I am not wanting to do MORE service. We have one child with multiple, severe food allergies, so we already have food restrictions, as those foods cannot be in the house. I have told the kids that we eat what is served, because I am not going to have picky eaters on top of an already restricted menu. We eat what is served, and do it with gratitude.


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## 425lisamarie (Mar 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *krankedyann* 
I haven't read all the responses, but in my house if I fix a meal they don't like, they're required to eat a small portion of it anyway. My kids are 5 and 3. We don't allow complaining or ungratefulness. They're allowed to say something isn't their favorite, but they're not allowed to call it 'yucky' or 'gross.' The adults also model good behavior in front of them by eating foods that aren't our favorites, either. My husband really doesn't like lima beans, but my kids love them, so he eats them anyway. I'm not wild about black-eyed peas or brussels sprouts, but I eat them anyway.

If they choose not to eat, they may wait until the next meal to eat again. I don't make them something else to eat, and they don't get the next scheduled snack, either. If they complain in an unacceptable way, they receive a warning. The second time, they leave the table and wait until the next meal. It's rare that we have a problem at the dinner table, and my children aren't shy about trying new foods.

Holy. Freakin. Wow. I have never heard something so frightening in my life. This is the converstion I totally detest. I mean ya, don't make something else complicated. But purposely starving a child to teach them a lesson, eat or die? Now THAT is gross


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## kathywiehl (Dec 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *425lisamarie* 
Holy. Freakin. Wow. I have never heard something so frightening in my life. This is the converstion I totally detest. I mean ya, don't make something else complicated. But purposely starving a child to teach them a lesson, eat or die? Now THAT is gross

How are they going to die? This isn't starving a child. If they are starving they will eat. If they choose not to eat then sure they will be hungry when the next meal comes but they certainly won't die or starve, lol!

Starving a child would be not offering food at all. That isn't the case here.


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## Ravin (Mar 19, 2002)

I would just tell them that was dinner, period. Anyone who doesn't eat and complains of hunger later gets the same thing served up again for the rest of the evening (except if dessert is planned, they get their usual serving of dessert like everyone else, but no chance of dessert seconds or other snacks).

Or, there's what my mom does. She has teenaged foster kids and sometimes they'll refuse meals for whatever reason. Ex: E won't eat anything she knows has lamb in it, even though she'll eat all other meat and has enjoyed several dishes that contained lamb when she didn't know that was what was in it. If she refuses a meal she thinks has lamb, or my niece who often eats with my mom refuses something because of the dread onion perception, she offers up a plain dry bologna sandwich. She's obligated to feed them at every meal, has yet to have one who didn't like bread or bologna, and when fosters have complained to caseworker it's pointed out that all she's obligated to do is serve them 3 meals a day that average out to balanced nutrition. It's up to them whether or not to eat something, knowing the fallback is always a bologna sandwich, plain and dry. She doesn't have to be a short order cook.

And neither does any mom.


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

honestly I was more worried about my son dying from malnutrition (seriously - not exagerating) before I finally grew a backbone and insisted he eat what we are eating. the boy is almost 8, weighs 40 pounds, and never ate protein, veggies or fruit.

so eat or die. yeah. I really think I was being pretty compassionate by insisting and offering no alternatives.


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## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flminivanmama* 
honestly I was more worried about my son dying from malnutrition (seriously - not exagerating) before I finally grew a backbone and insisted he eat what we are eating.

yeah I hear you. I am worried about my picky son's nutrition at this point which is why I've started getting much more serious about him eating the prepared food then I use to.


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## neveryoumindthere (Mar 21, 2003)

OK so I'm really planning to get serious/consistent with meal times. I like the idea of having a 'rule' of try it (which we have that rule but I often give up and dd knows this now and will fight it like crazy) but if you don't want it that's fine. No complaining.
BUT, here's where I turn to a jellyfish. She *needs* protien, when she doesn't get it she is a complete out of control child. No one wants to be around her, including myself which is HORRIBLE to say but it's really that bad. When she doesnt eat dinner (which I always include protein), she causes a ruckus at the table, and then asks for an apple or pear or some other fruit in the fridge. I *know* this is a healthy snack but it REALLY drives me up the wall that instead of dinner, she's just eating a fruit, because inevitably, after she's to be in bed, she comes up saying she's hungry and will stay up late negotiating for food and honestly I am NOT about to cook at 10 or 11pm.
I will not 'get over' not having them eat nutritious meals(which for me is protein and at least some vegetables in the week..older dd currently eats NO vegetables WHATSOEVER and not getting proper sleep)
Help me develop a backbone! Generally she's ok with rules if they are written and *as long as I am consistent every time.*
advice?


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## neveryoumindthere (Mar 21, 2003)

also, wanted to add, that all day long they snack on fruit. Ask me a MILLION times a day to cut this or that fruit and when I don't they eat part of it and then leave it in some random place to brown/rot and/or they throw the skin of the fruit all over the carpet.
By dinner, I'm sure they are not famished, but how do I say no to fruit. dd can open the fridge and get it so it's not like i'm in 'control' of the fridge.
UGH. i hate this.


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## HarperRose (Feb 22, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *merpk* 
So I made what I thought was a very yummy soup (carrots, celery, mushrooms, onions, garlic, and some other stuff chopped up small, little round cute "O" noodles, reasonably spicy spices, in a stock sort of thing, cooked for a couple of hours ...) and very yummy roasted potatoes (cut in chunks, olive oil drizzle with kosher salt, rosemaryh & garlic, bake till brown & crunchy-ish) ... I'm eating it very happily.

....

So what do you do when this happens? Or does this only happen to me?

Would you make something different?

Would you ... what?


Honestly, to me, it sounds completely disgusting and revolting. NO OFFENSE!!! I realize I am probably in the minority. But I also know none of my 3 brothers would eat it and neither would my kids. My DH, my mom, and my dad would be all over it, though!

Onions make me throw up, mushrooms are hit or miss, and warm mushy celery is just gross.









That said, I've made stuff my kids won't eat, also. I tell them they need to try 2 bites just to see if thy like it. After that they're free to make themselves a sandwich. I refuse to make 2 meals.


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## BusyBeeMom (May 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *neveryoumindthere* 
also, wanted to add, that all day long they snack on fruit. Ask me a MILLION times a day to cut this or that fruit and when I don't they eat part of it and then leave it in some random place to brown/rot and/or they throw the skin of the fruit all over the carpet.
By dinner, I'm sure they are not famished, but how do I say no to fruit. dd can open the fridge and get it so it's not like i'm in 'control' of the fridge.
UGH. i hate this.

I would limit/eliminate snacks in the 2 hours before dinner, so they are hungry at dinner.

Just say no to fruit. Even if it's healthy, it doesn't mean we eat it all the time. "This is what's for dinner, we're not eating pears right now." How old are the kids? My grandmother used to say "kitchen's closed," and that was that.


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## Ellien C (Aug 19, 2004)

I have 2 perspectives on this.

1) I was a REALLY picky, picky eater. My mom did all of the right things you were supposed to do. We had family dinner every night, she made what she made and if you didn't like it tough (we were free to pick things out etc). I went hungry a bit. I peeled the skin off hotdogs. It was really a texture thing. *I don't think my mother could have done anything differently to make me turn out less picky.*

2) I do the same "right" things that my mom did and DD tries pretty much everything. Christmas eve it was Fondue (though we had to call it Fondue sauce and not cheese because she "only likes orange cheese). She turned out not to like it, but definitely imitated us by spearing the bread and apples and dipping it in.

It's not always about the mother and the family and how she serves food and what mealtimes are like. Sometimes it's just how the kid is made-up. DD takes after her father, not me!

PS - would your apple-eater consent to some peanut butter or cheese along with the apples? Glass of milk or yogurt? Those all have protein.


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## kathywiehl (Dec 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *neveryoumindthere* 
also, wanted to add, that all day long they snack on fruit. Ask me a MILLION times a day to cut this or that fruit and when I don't they eat part of it and then leave it in some random place to brown/rot and/or they throw the skin of the fruit all over the carpet.
By dinner, I'm sure they are not famished, but how do I say no to fruit. dd can open the fridge and get it so it's not like i'm in 'control' of the fridge.
UGH. i hate this.

Well, you can have scheduled snack times and meal times. My younger dc have a habit of asking for a snack, eating only part of it, then wanting another snack in 30 minutes. It drives me crazy! So now, we eat bfast at wakeup time, then roughly 2.5 hrs later we have snack. That is usually around 9:45-10am. If they don't eat bfast they can wait for snack time to come and if they don't eat snack they can wait for lunch and so on. This way they are hungry enough to eat all of what they ask for, they are eating at the table and less likely to leave something rotting in a random place in the house, and they aren't filling up on fruit, so they will get some protein at regular meal times.

Oh, and you are in control of the fridge. You are the mama, if you say no opening the fridge that is a rule your dd must follow. It's not mean, you are doing it to avoid wasting your money on food that will be half eaten and then left to rot on the carpet.

Another thing if you are worried about nutrition is to forget the notion that they must eat protein at every meal, but try to sneak it in throughout the day during snack time. Insist that a protein must be eaten with fruit. Some protein foods that my kids like include hummus, hard boiled eggs, slices of lunch meat (roll it up with a dab of cream cheese and a spinach leaf), pbj sandwiches (a fave for bfast around here), protein smoothies, yogurt, cheese sticks, apples or carrots dipped in pb w/ a drizzle of honey, granola bars with lots of nuts, and edamame. Make snack time really count when it comes to nutrition so when meals roll around and they don't' want to eat you don't have to worry about malnutrition because they've gotten their fill of protein and veggies throughout the day's snacks.

Some of my other tricks for adding veggies are to add pumpkin and spinach to everything, lol! I make pancakes, muffins and other goodies with pumpkin, carrots or zucchini added. Spinach can be added to meatloaf, lasagna, pasta sauce, mac n'cheese, mixed in with eggs, etc.

I still offer veggies on the side at dinner but if they refuse I don't' worry so much that they aren't getting enough because they just ate it and never knew it.

Making bento boxes also motivates my kids to eat what I give them. I put little party picks in them and cut their sandwiches in cute shapes and the love it!


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## flminivanmama (Nov 21, 2001)

neveryoumindthere - come join us in tattooed mama's overhaul our eating thread - we're giving each other support there


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Neveryoumindthere---Ummmm, yes you ARE in control of the fridge. You are the PARENT, and they are the CHILDREN, and no matter how "democratic" you want to play it at your house, children need guidance and that is that. You must say NO to the things that ruin their appetites & blood sugar. You must say YES to the healthy choices, and good meals are a healthy choice! I personally would begin by getting rid of ALL the fruit and refined carbs and simple sugars....anything with a high glycemic index and lots of carbs/sugar. Because yeah, fruit is great, but darn it, it is still sugar, and there are plenty of kids, especially those with touchy blood sugars (like my oldest) who will just crave and go after ANY sugar source they can. Bravo to you for having at least chosen fruit instead of, say, Twinkies! But nevertheless, it is still sugar, and if you don't want them to gorge themselves on it and screw up their appetites, just get the heck rid of it, totally rid of it, and ditto for anything else like it. This is not permanent, just a temporary means of getting a little control of meals and healthy eating. They can deal with this, believe me.

I had to do this at one point when my kids were just going after the fruit out of boredom and restlessness while dinner was not quite ready yet. I could not stand it anymore. We got rid of it for a week or two, and then started back with a one-piece-of-fruit-after-lunch rule. Then after a while, it was two pieces a day, as long as it was after meals. Now they do about three pieces a day, and are not at all out of control about it anymore. They needed some limits. Kids really really really need limits and boundaries.


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## JElaineB (Nov 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *neveryoumindthere* 
also, wanted to add, that all day long they snack on fruit. Ask me a MILLION times a day to cut this or that fruit and when I don't they eat part of it and then leave it in some random place to brown/rot and/or they throw the skin of the fruit all over the carpet.
By dinner, I'm sure they are not famished, but how do I say no to fruit. dd can open the fridge and get it so it's not like i'm in 'control' of the fridge.
UGH. i hate this.

I agree with the PP, you are in control of the fridge. You just say no and shut the door.

For anyone having trouble with picky eaters, kids snacking all day when you don't want them to, or almost any other feeding problem I recommend reading one of Ellyn Satter's books, such as _How to Get Your Kid to Eat...But Not Too Much_, and implemeting her techniques. It took a leap of faith for me to start using her techniques but we have seen a huge improvement in DS's eating behavior in the few months we have been following her advice.


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Put a padlock on the fridge if you have to!


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

I'd make them something else, but I refuse to insist that a child eat something they don't like, my parents did that crap to me and I won't do it to others.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Wow, I'm just shocked at the power tripping over kids, and here at MDC.







I think rules about raising kids gentle applies here Effective discipline presumes that children have reasons for their behavior and that cooperation can be engaged to solve shared problems.


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Yeh, except the discussion is not about Effective Discipline. It is not about discipline at all. If the discussion were to mix discipline and food, then THAT would be power tripping and would lead to eating disorders and associated problems. This discussion is about guiding---gently or firmly, but guiding---and helping children to make healthier eating choices when they are too young to always, consistently do so on their own. Sure, there is the ultra-permissive, let your kids do and eat whatever the heck they want extreme, and a LOT of parents are into that. But that is not right---kids need guidance and kids need parents to guide them. Otherwise nature would not have equipped kids with parents at all---they would just shoot out of the womb straight into the world, all equipped to make their own decisions with no help from anyone. They could feed themsleves balanced meals and stay away from excessive carbs and candy and they could do it perfectly, every day, day after day.

Power tripping? Damn, I'm glad my parents didn't see it that way! I got a good balanced diet growing up, and yes, they said NO to snacks right before dinner, and other things like it.


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## gardenmommy (Nov 23, 2001)

Freestyler, you said it very well. Not only that, it isn't about power-tripping on my kids in this area. It is about making good use of our food dollars. We just simply cannot afford for everyone to eat separate meals, for us to throw away perfectly good food because someone doesn't "feel" like eating, or "love" the particular food being served. As I said in an earlier post, it is wasteful and disrespectful for a child to not eat what is prepared, to demand a separate meal. Sure, there are foods that we just don't eat because no one likes them. However, most of the time, we eat what we eat because that is what we have. So please get off your moral high horse and stop accusing me of going off on a power trip on my children. Walk in my shoes for a couple of miles, and you will better understand my situation.


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Woooo hoooo Garden Mommy! Well said!


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## heket (Nov 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna* 
Wow, I'm just shocked at the power tripping over kids, and here at MDC.







I think rules about raising kids gentle applies here Effective discipline presumes that children have reasons for their behavior and that cooperation can be engaged to solve shared problems.









: I don't see why that's limited to just one forum.


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## HealthCareQueen (Dec 30, 2007)

i would use a soup blender so that your kids can't find pieces in the soup to complain about, and soups come out good that way anyway


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## freestyler (Jan 28, 2005)

Mmmm, that's a good idea. Also, it's OK to give them a sandwich every so often, especially if it's something like a club sandwich when it is loaded with protein and veggies and with whole grain bread. Just be sure they don't throw all the veggies on the floor.


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