# Help finding/trusting an OB/Midwife Again



## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

After what I have been through, I am having a hard time allowing myself to trust or even goto an OB or Midwife (CNM) again. Even though they may not have been directly at fault, I cannot in good consciencious trust people who have utterly failed to tell me about a potentially serious condition during my pregnancy or even afterwords. I had to find out about it when I requested copies of my medical records.

We put our trust into these people, to care for ourselves and our unborn babies. But after that trust is broken how do you go about finding a new care provider or even allowing yourself to trust another one again.

Quick history - OB found at my Diagnostic US that my daughter had a 2 vessel cord. They completely failed to tell us about this, and then lied to us about why they wanted a fetal growth scan follow US. We knew the left hand was in a fist and they couldn't see if she had fingers or not, and that is the only reason they ever gave us for having follow up US's. I knew something wasn't right and even knew we "might" have this (I was reading the tech's notes and abbreviations as she was doing the first US scan). But when we were told everything is fine 2 times before the follow up scan, just wanted to check the left hand, we figured the OB saw something different than the tech. Again, even at/after the follow up scan we were never told, but again, the tech only found a 2 vessel cord.

As a result, I am having a huge issue with trusting a care provider again, to the point that I cannot even get up the nerve/courage to schedule my 6 week visit or to even find someone else (different OB or Midwife group) to goto to do it.

My husband suggests we make an appointment and just go talk to a couple of them, but I am not even sure what to ask or where to even begin. We want to try to get pregnant right away again. (More due to biological clock and the fact I also would like to start my career which has been on hold starting our family; and I am getting ancy to start working more now than what I have been). But I don't know or wouldn't even know what questions to ask. I know that any subsequent pregnancies are going to be extremely stressful and emotionally diffucult no matter what.

I have had two pregnancies after a 1st tri loss, and both of those pregnancies were hard during the first tri, especially the wait of not knowing if the baby was alive and growing. With the first one after the mc, they did an US and found the hb on fetal doppler at my first visit. With my second I had some spotting about a week before my first apt, and that brought a rush of negative emotions on, and I swore I was going to mc again. I was able to get in for an US (to confirm edd since I had irregular cycles at the time, and to see if everything was ok). But until I felt the babies move in those subsequent pregnancies I couldn't really get attached.

Imagine what I am going to be like, considering we lost our child while I was in labor...


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## lucsmama (May 6, 2004)

i cannot begin to know what you went through and are going through. i had/have some major trust issues with doctors and midwives as well. my baby was fine, but i was the one who got really sick, which i think they should have figured out before i went into labor. i asked my brother in law, who is a doc, how can i trust this new doctor. how do i know if they are going to listen to me or give me all the information so i can make an informed decision. he told me to just ask the question, this was my past experience, so now how do i know i can trust you. he said that a doctor who gets defensive and answers this question badly is probably one you want to avoid. but if you listen to their answer and they really consider your question, they should be able to make you feel a little more confident that they will give you all the information. i hope this helps! and i am so sorry for your loss.


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## Mindi22 (Jun 28, 2005)

khaoksat-
I'm so sorry for your loss. I did a little research this morning on the two vessel cord thing, and to summarize, this is what I found:
-it is often difficult to see on ultrasound, and I found one study that revealed a two vessel cord at one part of the exam, and a three in another... this makes me wonder if the first time it was spotted it was flagged for another look to find out if it was really there or not.
-there is inconsistant evidence that a two vessel cord is related to anomolies in the baby - the evidence seems to support this, but it doesn't always lead to problems. If that is the case, while I believe that they should have told you (especially after seeing it twice), perhaps they just didn't want you to be stressed out, knowing that stress can cause perhaps more harm to the baby than the two vessel cord? (again, I don't think that this was their decision to make, but I'm just trying to offer an explaination)
- I didn't see anything that directly related a two vessel cord to fetal death. So, while it could be a complication, it doesn't sound like it's the norm.

I agree with the pp who said ask lots of questions and see how they are about answering them. They absolutely should not have kept you in the dark about the cord issues, and for any subsequent pregnancy, I'd find a new provider. But for this, you should probably keep you 6 week appt with them, since they know the whole story and it might be too difficult to try to catch someone up. But that is a personal call, and I could totally understand if you try to find someone else. Just as another thought, perhaps finding someone else to read the records and get a second opinion from them might to a lot to settle some of the questions in your mind...

I hope this helps some. I'm so sorry again for your loss!

*hugs*
-Mindi


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

never mind


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

There is more to the issue of not being able to trust them, than just the 2 vessel cord.

There were other issues of care, that I believe fell below the standard of care that should be provided to pregnant women. For instance, letting a women who is in ther 4th pregnancy, 3rd to term, walk around for 3+ weeks breech with just the comment that they would deal with her being breech if/when I went into labor and came into L&D. Oh, did I mention also along those lines I have a history of fast labors with my children. DS1, once I was given an epidural because I couldn't deal with the pitocin pain any longer after 18 hours of it, was born approximately 2 hours after it was administered. At the time it was administered (epi that is) I was only 2 CM dialated and 70% effaced.

With DS2, we realized I was in labor around 2:30 a.m. By the time I got to the hospital, it was 3:30 a.m. and he was born at 4:00 a.m.

With my stillbirth, I never realized I was in true labor, till I started timing contractions and they were 2-3 mins apart, but only lasting 30 seconds. But for the fact she was breech, I wouldn't have made it to the hospital. They believe I was between 9-10 CM when I got there (nurse said 10, OB said 9).


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## tenecwalker (Jul 24, 2005)

I have also questioned the care I received from them at the end of my pregnancy with Ryan. I don't plan on going back to them for another pregnancy. I'm planning on checking out Good Sam and the midwives/doctors there. A friend of mine is a nurse there and I like what I have heard so far. That being said the midwives will no longer be at that office or FB after Jan 1, 2007.

Good Luck finding a new office! Let me know if you find anyone you like. I've heard good things about Dr. Horlacher. I started seeing him at the beginning of my preg. with Ryan, but switched during the Bradley classes, because everyone recommended the midwives.


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## coralsmom (Apr 1, 2005)

you may look into a care provider that specializes in 'high risk' pregnancies. they are experienced in all kinds of issues and are on the lookout for any problems that might arise- meaning, they are going to treat your pregnancy not as a given, but as a pregnancy to be monitered, carefully scrutinized, and generally more intervened than a more hand's-off approach.

for me, i want both, somehow! i want the hand's-off, intervention free feeling, but with the back up of anyone and anything that will help me grow and birth a living, healthy baby.

it is so important to be as open and communicative as you can muster when you are talking to your potential care provider. you are paying them to care for you, and you can tell them how you want it done. if you want to know EVERYTHING!!!, tell them how important this is to you and WHY. you have lost your child, and you are different than their average client.

if you have any hesitation, keep looking. and, something to keep in mind, you can use 2. you can simultaneously see a wonderful caring gentle midwife while at the same time be monitered and inspected by a specialized mainstream ob/gyn (who hopefully will also be caring and wonderful and gentle...).

hth. its good to see you back here khaoskat. i've thought about you these past weeks and hoped that you were doing alright...


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## goodcents (Dec 19, 2002)

i am so sorry that you feel betrayed and hurt. i went through something similar and honestly it took lots of work to get over it. i went to therapy, worked through birthing from within book a few times, went to a acupunturist who specialized in psychospiritual work with women, and i changed my care providers at 32 weeks during my 2nd pregnancy because the first ones just didn;t "feel" right.

unless you are planning a UC, it is time you start to interview people. i wouldn't bring your past history into the first conversation until you select a care provider. i say this because i think it will automatically put the person on the defensive, and you on the offensive. it will not lend itself to an open and conversation where you can really let your intuition guide you. once you select the person i think it is important you are candid with them so that you can feel comfortable....otherwise you will just be carrying around a secret that really shouldn't be one.

good luck!


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tenecwalker* 
I have also questioned the care I received from them at the end of my pregnancy with Ryan. I don't plan on going back to them for another pregnancy. I'm planning on checking out Good Sam and the midwives/doctors there. A friend of mine is a nurse there and I like what I have heard so far. That being said the midwives will no longer be at that office or FB after Jan 1, 2007.

Good Luck finding a new office! Let me know if you find anyone you like. I've heard good things about Dr. Horlacher. I started seeing him at the beginning of my preg. with Ryan, but switched during the Bradley classes, because everyone recommended the midwives.

I had Nathan at Good Sam, and most of the nurses there are not friendly to Bradley types of birth. They really do prefer you be stuck to the monitors and in bed like a good little patient.

Now t hat being said. When Molly left Huey and Weprin's office (or when we were informed), we did look at going with the Midwifes at Good Sam, but stayed with H&W because Molly was going to have privs to what my 42 week date was. We really did like the Midwifes there. After Nathan was born, they stopped in our room and talked to me for a bit the next morning. Except for the bad experience with the hospital itself, I would switch to them in a heartbeat.

I knew the midwifes were leaving the practice, I heard it from someone when I asked about something else. I will see if I can find the e-mail, because some of the stuff we discussed was rather interesting . The only complaint I had about Dr. Horlacher was that when I found out I was pregnant right after my miscarriage, the stuff wasn't really sensative. I could have just caught them on an off day though, but a lot of people have told me wonderful things about him (including nurses).

Right now it is a choice between Dr. H and Good Sam Midwifes. I do want to see if they have changed their minds/practices on Natural Birth there. They have, from what I heard, increased the number of rooms with labor/birthing tubs.

The fear is now that the midwifes are going FB is going to fall by the wayside, and Good Sam is going to become very popular. They don't have a lot of room. I think they have like 10 L&D rooms and about 20 Post Partum rooms, with one of the L&D rooms being triage.


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## tenecwalker (Jul 24, 2005)

If you want I can get you in contact with my friend that is a nurse at Good Sam. She has told me that they are very pro natural birth (perhaps it has changed). She also said that the rooms have jacuzzi tubs so you can labor in the water and/or have a waterbirth. There is a good chance I will have to be induced in another pregnancy (if I develop a condition, I believe I had with Ryan) and that they will even let you in the water if induced.

I don't see how they will keep FB open, if Dr. H is the only person using it, but that is a whole other discussion.

I can send you a link to the local attached parenting yahoo group I belong to. They may have some ideas for caregivers for you. They are all very nice and helpful.


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

I thought WSU physicians were still going to be using it as well. I know Dr. G (you probably didn't see him since you were at the St. E's office, and he has his office up North) is the head of FB. I cannot see him not delivering there any longer.

I think there is also another group that goes there as well. I think it is Dr. Banis. We did the refresher CB class (just for a quick review of the procedures and policies, and CB stuff at FB) and one couple was using his practice. Two of the OB's there will do Water Birth, but the other two will not.

It does sound like things have changed, but than again, I know the Midwifes there push the envelope a bit more. I was induced with Nathan, and they refused to let me even get into the shower. But then again, that was almost 4 years ago. I might just have to look into them again, although I would love it if they had a room or two set up like FB and if you could go home within 24 hours of birth or less.

I would love that link for the attachment parenting group.

Good luck with things.


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

Ok, when did you have your first Angel, or did you just loose twins? I didn't realize you have suffered a loss previously.


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## tenecwalker (Jul 24, 2005)

I think Dr. Guy is the only ob out of the wsu group that uses fb. I love dr. guy. If I could be guaranteed he would be my ob I would stay at wsu, but there are quite a few obs there I don't like. It was the midwives at GS that she was talking about, so perhaps they are more natural minded than the obs. I'll send you the link through email.

I had a m/c before Ryan in 2/04 and then the one now in 11/06


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

Thanks, I got the e-mail and just went to join.

I am sorry about your previous loss. I had a loss between Aidan and Nathan as well.

Dr. Po up there is not bad either. He is the one who did everything within his power at MVH to prevent me from having to go through a c-section to delivery Isabella when she was breech.

The others I could probably care less for with the practice. I didn't realize Dr. Guy was the only one who would deliver there.

I am just wondering what is going to happen to FB now that there will be no Midwife's left. It is funny, because from like Sept - Oct, they were either always full, or had at least one patient in there like every day.


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## tenecwalker (Jul 24, 2005)

It definitely weird. Dr. Ventolini ended up delivering Ryan and I don't care for him very much. I also saw Dr. Bernard (I think) at one time and she wasn't all that great.

Right now I'm seeing the RE Dr. Amesse and I really really like him a lot, but he doesn't deliver babies.


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

I wonder if Lisa might go with Lifestages. I remember when I was prego with Aidan that she was going to leave the practice and go with them doing some project or something different than prenatal.

I have no clue what is going to happen to Margie. I know that Greene Memorial is gone now as well (happened back in August). I think those midwifes went into a clinic setting (ie MVH's low income clinic, or some of the other clinics/resources available for low income/no insurance families).

For Midwife care where we live, we almost now have to go with homebirthing.


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## tenecwalker (Jul 24, 2005)

So true. Someone on the yahoo group just had a homebirth. It sounded wonderful. I had thought about a homebirth before. Everyone thought I was nuts. I don't know if it will ever be possible for me though.


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## khaoskat (May 11, 2006)

When I was 20 weeks with Isabella I had actually found and talked to one of them. My problem was I could never get my husband to be home and talk with them with me, to see if he liked the person or not. So in the end, I ended up with FB transferrred to hospital.

I am still so tempted with our next pregnancy to do it. But after the loss, I amnot sure I could emotionally handle it. I have already told hubby I am purchasing a hand held fetal dopplar off e-bay next time we get pregnant so I can listen to the HB anytime I want to and re-assure myself. I swear I will go nuts next time. I was that way with both Aidan and Isabella till I could feel them moving after my mc.


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