# Gripe water and Zantac?



## ChasingPeace

I was wondering if any mamas with babes with reflux know if it's OK to give baby gripe water when he's on Zantac. Our DS is 10 and 1/2 weeks old and is on Zantac for reflux, but he's still often fussy when nursing, especially in the evening. He'll suck for a few sucks, pull off the breast, pant or cry, sometimes arching back, then start sucking again, and repeating the process. Last night he eventually refused to continue nursing and we had to give him formula.







My husband swears that gripe water would help him. Is it safe to give gripe water when taking Zantac? We asked our DS' dr and he didn't know what it was.
Thanks!


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## Tupelo Honey

I know several reflux-baby-mamas who are advised by their ped that gripe water will not interfere or react with prescription reflux meds. It's basically just ginger, fennell, and a little baking soda--no drugs or anything like that. IME it works very well for reflux babies.


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## USAmma

Could he be having a stomach motility problem? My baby (3 mos. old) fed just as you described. It was hell to feed her, I used to dread it and she never seemed satisfied. We tried Zantac and it helped a bit, but she was still fighting the feedings. Finally I got a new ped and he asked the right questions and said that her stomach was probably not emptying fast enough, so it would back up during feedings and be refluxed out, even as she was still trying to get food in. He put her on Reglan and within 24 hours she is now eating peacefully most of the time. It's made a huge difference! Really saved our sanity!

But to answer your question I sometimes give my baby home-made fennel tea made from boiling the seeds and it seems to help with gas, but not with reflux.

Darshani


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## CherylE

Gripe water is fine with Zantec. We use both here and the ped said it was fine. Try also to nurse him somewhat sitting up (him sitting up) rather than lying down. It helps for reflux.


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## wendy1221

What kind of formula did you give him? My sister's ds has bad reflux. Her pediatrician told her that there is a lot of new research suggesting it's related to a milk/dairy allergy/intolerance. She told my sister to completely eliminate all dairy from her diet and definitely not give him any formula. He improved within 2 weeks and the Zantac has been enough help since then. He did the arching and trying to nurse but arching away too much thing too. It gets better. Also, you might ask if they can up his Zantac dosage a little. Often they start you out on the lowest dose, and babies grow so fast, he might just need a slightly larger dose. HTH! Good luck!


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## Periwinkle

I used Gripe Water (and chamomile tea) safely while dd and ds took Zantac.

As for the Reglan, I just want to add that it is a very potent medication that has never been tested in children and is famous for rather scary side effects... unlike Zantac, which is basically as safe as it gets and has been rigorously tested in infants. Plus, the American Academy of Pediatrics recommends against the routine use of Reglan since there is no evidence that its benefits outweigh its risks. USAmma, I know it works for some moms and of course I am really glad that your little one isn't in pain anymore and it clearly worked for you -- I hope my posting this other point of view doesn't offend you in any way, I just wanted to point out that Reglan is a fairly controversial, off-label treatment of routine GERD in infants.

This is the AAP's (excellent IMO) position paper on the diagnosis and treatment of GERD (Reflux) in infants and children, and contains information on all the different drugs, surgeries, as well as behavioral techniques. It really helped me a lot:

http://www.aap.org/policy/gerd.html

Other things we did, besides Zantac which helped tremendously:

* No propping! (no baby seats, no baby bouncers, no propping up with pillows after a feeding, no baby swings, etc etc) - this causes the stomach to compress and actually makes reflux worse (best position - wear your baby







but make sure she isn't crunched over in the sling)

* Elevate mattress at least 20 degrees.

* Consider allowing baby to sleep on her stomach (best) or on her left side (second best). The back is the worst position for reflux (obviously needs to be balanced against concerns or actual risks of SIDS). My babies were in the NICU (most preemies have reflux) and ALL of the bassinetts there were elevated at a 30+ degree angle and put to sleep on their bellies to stop reflux. (Granted, all babies in a NICU are on monitors so no baby there is going to stop breathing without an alarm going off.)

* Breastmilk only if at all possible. Nursing is best, EBM from a bottle is second best. Breastmilk clears the stomach a lot faster, meaning less to spit up.

* Frequent, small feedings. As frequent and as small as possible. Note: Ideally you can demand feed. BUT... if you've been truly demand feeding (and responding instantly to middle-of-the-night feeding cues) and you have found that your baby is feeding too seldom and too much at a time so that she just throws up all that milk and writhes in pain, then you MAY need to take more control of baby's feedings. For about 2 months, I had to keep dd and ds on a schedule of nursing every 1-2 hours. Otherwise, they'd go more like 2 to sometimes 4 hours, and would nurse til they each emptied a breast and just throw most of it up.







It went against my values to schedule their feedings, but it helped my babies feel so much better and kept them from learning to associate nursing with pain. By the time they were 5 months old, they were completely back to exclusive demand feeding.

HTH. I hope your baby is feeling better soon.


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## USAmma

Periwinkle those are all excellent points! Elevating the cosleeper was helpful to our little one.

ChasingPeace, be aware that Zantac sometimes causes constipation. Shouldn't be a problem in breastfed babies but just in case the bm's start looking more solid you'll know why.

Darshani


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## ChasingPeace

Thank you for your replies and support!!!! Darshani, I'm not sure what a stomach motility problem is. Is it something that would be discovered by an upper GI?

Wendy, we give DS Alimentum (hypo-allergenic) formula. It was my hope to exclusively give him breast milk, but I work and can't pump enough for him. I give him what breast milk I can, but have to supplement with formula. I suspect there's something going on with dairy. I had eliminated it, but the specialist told me to reintroduce it for 4 weeks (







) to see if the Zantac worked. Two days back on dairy was enough to convince me it had to go. I know Alimentum is supposed to be hypo-allergenic, but it has casein in it. I'm not sure what other option I have.

Periwinkle, thanks for the suggestions.


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## Clarity

The stomach sleeping is true, I forgot to mention that the last time Darshani was asking about reflux...if you really look past the "back to sleep" campaign literature, AAP recommendations include reflux as the main condition where belly sleeping is more appropriate for newborns. Some docs forget in the midst of the SIDS issues but chronic illness and discomfort from reflux does make belly sleeping appropriate so discuss it with your doc.


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## USAmma

I don't mean to steal this thread, but just wanted to ask for prayers and thoughts. My baby is in the hospital. Decided yesterday it hurt too much to eat and refused all attempts to feed her. She was dehydrated when she was admitted. The good news it that we are no longer messing around with the HMO peds! She is under the care of a good pediatric GI specialist who suspects that her esophogus is burned by acid and that's why she's not eating. The doctor observed her eating and said she has classic reflux symptoms. She's still refusing to eat so I think they are going to tube-feed her this morning through her nose. :-( She will probably be sedated tomorrow for a GI scope.

But they assured me that she would not be released until she's all better and eating well. Her fat folds are thin according to the doctor, so she's been basically living off her own fat. I'm just so angry that it's taken this degree of pain and suffering for them to take me seriously. I could smack the first ped who said it was colic.

The other thing that makes me sad is the baby is mad at me and won't smile at me and stiffens when I try to hold her. This is because she associates me with pain and nasty tasting meds. She was responding so well to the nurses but then would look at me and frown. I feel sooo bad about this. They said they'd take over all her feedings and meds so I can heal the bond between us.

Dh is there at the hosp. with her now so I can care for my 3yo, who, by the way, was diagnosed with ear infection, sinus infection, and probably pneumonia yesterday morning at urgent care. Luckily she's acting just fine other that the obvious symptoms.

So if you all could keep our family in your thoughts and prayers, I'd appreciate it.

Darshani


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## Periwinkle

Oh Darshani









That is awful. I hope and pray that under the care now of a suitable GI specialist, they will be able to pinpoint her exact problem and treat it swiftly. Reflux is so underdiagnosed it's scary. As soon as she's feeling better again, she'll forget all about this. Please don't feel guilty or worry about a permanent attachment issue - you are such a good mama and she'll bounce right back.


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## Messy Nessie

Darshani-

I am very new to MDC, but I wanted to send you my thoughts and prayers. My DD went thru a very similar thing two months ago. At the time, it seemed like our darkest moment, my DD refused to nurse and it seemed as though she had an aversion to me... it mad me very sad.

We pushed and pushed until our ped finally gave us a referral to a GI specialist. We kept trying different meds until we found one that worked. The Zantac was awful and it made my DD very sleepless (a little know side effect). We finally settled on Prevacid in the solutab form. I highly recommend asking about them. Iti s a very new form of the medication, not all doctors are aware of...

Also, to help the healing (my DD was 3 mos when diagnosed, so she had a lot of damage) we were prescribed Carafte. It coats the esophagus, stomach and valve, to allow healing. It improved our feedins immeadiately. They use it on ulcer patients when they have a flare up.

I am a very non-medical person. I hesitate to even give her Motrin or Tylenol during teething, so I do not recommend these meds lightly. As you know reflux is so serious and in FTT situations it is almost essential do use some meds for a period of time. My DD is now 5 months and things are so much different and better now. Give it time, she will heal and it won't harm your attachment at all.

Please let us know how things progress! I will be thinking of you.


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## ChasingPeace

Darshani! I pray that the problem will be resolved soon. And I'm sure that the bond btw you and your dd will remain strong. Surely she can feel your intense love for her, and that will be what she remembers once she feels better. I know you've been through so much, Darshani, with your little one--I pray that things will improve now.


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## wendy1221

Darlene, I was just talking to my sister and mentioned this thread. She asked if you had an overactive let-down. Do you? We both had problems w/ oversupply and overactive let-down. It was a nuisance for me, my boys would choke a little, but for her 2nd ds is was horrible! She finally started nursing in this weird position where she was kinda slumped in her seat so that he was higher than her breast while he nursed. THat seemed to help a lot. I've also heard of people pumping just until their milk lets down before nursing as it's just the initial let-down that causes the problems. I understand about working and pumping. I've been having problems pumping enough at work, too. My babysitter has a can of Alimentum in Jake's cubby just in case. Luckily, she hasn't had to open it yet. I have to pump before and after work as well as during to keep up. The pump just isn't as efficient as the baby. And the casein in the Alimentum is partially broken down, so if usually fine for babies w/ milk allergies. My sister also suggested most of the things Periwinkle already posted, so I won't repeat them. She also has a small folded towel under one end of her changing table pad to elevate it. Andshe seconded talking about upping his dosage of Zantac if your ped is willing to see if that makes a difference.

Darshani, your family is in my prayers.

Wendy


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## cj'smommy

*Darshani* BIG







s!! I'll be thinking about all of you and please keep us updated!!

Please try not to worry, your relationship with her will heal. Connor had un-diagnosed Reflux and MSPI (milk soy protein allergy) for about 2 months. The MSPI caused his intestines to bleed







He associated me with pain as well and it tore me up terribly. Once we figured out what was wrong, I cut dairy and soy and he was on Mylanta and then Zantac - it got MUCH better! It didn't take long for him to lose that negative association. In fact, he's still nursing at 17 months.

Try to hang in there!

*ChasingPeace* There is a perscription formula called.....SHOOT! I'm drawing a blank right now! :mad I know I'll remember it and get back to you. Anyway it's not based on cow's milk and doesn't contain whey or cassien. Thankfully I was able to breastfeed Connor, but if I would have had to put him on formula this would have been our only choice since his intestines were so inflamed already.

Got it! It's Neocate


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## ChasingPeace

Wendy, how would I know if I had an overactive let-down? I don't think I do but I don't know--I don't feel the tingling reflex you read about. I don't think I have an oversupply--I'm pumping on the days that I work and can't pump enough for ds' needs. But I know that the amount pumped is not a good indicator of what baby can get from the breast, so I just don't know.

cj'smommy, I'll talk to the specialist about Neocate if ds doesn't get better. I've been off dairy again for 4 days and already there seems to be an improvement. We'll see...


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## cj'smommy

Remember it can take up to 3 weeks for the dairy to get out of your system. Glad to see that after 4 days it's better already!







After a two weeks we noticed a difference in Connor and at 3 weeks he was a different baby.


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## wendy1221

A way to tell if you have an overactive let-down is if your milk will spray everywhere if the baby lets go at the beginning of a feeding. Like they cough or pull away and you milk is spraying everywhere. A little spray is normal, but a spray that gets everywhere or sprays really far is over-active. It's common in the very beginning, during the engorgement days before your supply regulates, but some women continue to have it. HTH!

Oh, and like I said, I have problems with OVERsupply and I'm not able to pump enough. I pump sometimes and only get 3 oz total and am engorged an hour later. It really sucks. I hope both of us get the hang of pumping. This is my second time pumping for a baby. I didn't have any of these problems with my first. It's so strange. I think I just need to relax more when I'm at work. I'm also thinking about getting a Whisper Wear pump to use while I'm driving to and from work. And I can also use it at home I guess. It's so hard to find time to pump at home!

Wendy


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