# Organic Diapers and Fabric? A fallacy?



## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Hi:

I'm a soon-to-be mom and I'm researching cloth diapers for my little one. One thing I'm extremely confused about is all this talk about "organic" fabric.

Based on the research I've done there is no such thing!

_Moderator's note: The quote portion of this post has been removed as it violates the MDC copyright policy._
http://www.mothering.com/mdc/copyright_concerns.html

Due to the above here is my paraphrase from the OTA site (108 words please forgive the extra 8 words!):
How can I label my finished product? OTA's standards include four label categories that are modeled after the standards for organic foods in the U.S. organic regulations: "100% organic," "organic," "made with organic," and listing of the individual organic components on the ingredients panel. However, in contrast to its system for labeling food, the USDA proscribed a system for labeling fiber products in the Final Rule that only allows one category. The preamble to the 2000 USDA rule said "goods that utilize organic fibers in their manufacture may only be labeled as a 'made with X' product; e.g., a cotton shirt labeled 'made with organic cotton.'

You can read the full text here: http://www.ota.com/AmericanOrganicSt...sforFiber.html

So it would seem that there is quite a bit of misinformation floating around - even on these forums where folks talk about thier "organic" diapers. What particularly interests me is all these folks claiming some moral high ground because they use what they call "organic" cotton.

I believe that the folks calling thier fabric "organic" probably mean that the fibers are grown using sustainable practices - which in itself is laudable. But from what I've read - even if you don't use pesticides on your cotton crop you still use VAST amounts of water to grow it.

I've also read that cotton fibers can harbor and even be a hospitable environment for the growth of bacteria.

I'd love to have a discussion on this - since clearly all of you know a great deal more about these things than I do.


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

:


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## leosmama20 (May 26, 2004)

You are correct in that all fabrics are treated to some extent, including the ever popular hemp. However, you will notice that most organic cottons are unbleached and undyed. There are environmentally friendly dyes (natural) out there. Many people are dying fabrics themselves. So, really, it comes down to trying to do the best possible. Many of us drive a car, and NO car is environmentally friendly, but some are friendlier than others if ykwim.

Just my take on it! I personally don't really care too much about organic cotton because its cost is out of my range most of the time, but I HIGHLY prefer unbleached cotton, and that makes organic appealing to me (since it is unbleached).

Emily


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## Guinevere (Apr 17, 2004)

Hi. I cd but do not own any OC dipes, so I claim no moral high ground, lol.

I'm curious about something you said:

Quote:

I believe that the folks calling thier fabric "organic" probably mean that the fibers are grown using sustainable practices - which in itself is laudable. But from what I've read - even if you don't use pesticides on your cotton crop you still use VAST amounts of water to grow it.
Is there a fiber suitable for diapering that _doesn't_ use large quantities of water to grow? And, even presupposing one uses _non_-organic cotton cloth for diapering, and it is therefore subjected to various non-environmentally friendly manufacturing methods, how could any of this possibly be worse for the environment than the manufacture and subsequent dumping into landfills of disposable dipes?

Just wondering where you're going with that statement...?

Guin


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Wouldn't cding, OC or not, still be a much better choice for the environment than sposies?


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

but sizing and, often, dyes that have to be used in making fabrics from fiber are not organic,
The major supplier of organic fabric that I know about uses cornstarch and steam to size their fabrics. The fabrics are also left natural or undyed color. Besides that I dont think I have seen anyone riding a horse around here because they use organic :LOL many mamas use organic simply because they have stinkiness and problems with hemp.









ETA : not to mention that organic cotton is probably the softest fabric I've ever felt... so its a natural choice for a cloth diapering fabric.


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## bratmobile (Jun 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Guinevere*

Is there a fiber suitable for diapering that _doesn't_ use large quantities of water to grow?


well, isn't that supposed to be one of the positives about hemp? that it really doesn't require much water to grow.


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Hi Guinevere:

I know that cotton is one of those crops that uses inordinate amounts of water to grow, wether it's organic or not. I guess if you grow it in a region where it rains daily it's not so hard on the water supply, but thats what I meant.

I'll see if I can dig up some unbaised studies on the historic impact cotton has on the environment.

No subtext here - I say what I mean and I mean what I say :-D


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

I do not mean to be disrespectful in anyway.

I am curious as to what the point of this thread exactly is.

Is it to educate moms who uses "organic fabrics" that they may not be getting what they think they are getting?

Is it to suggest they buy "regular" fabrics and save money?

Is it to tell that we are screwed either way environmentally?

I am just confused at the threads purpose.


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## Guinevere (Apr 17, 2004)

Hi again!

Sorry, didn't mean to suggest there was a subtext, I think I was more asking for clarification, lol.

I guess I'm extrapolating, but if what you're saying is that you don't find cotton to be a very environmentally-sustainable fiber, then what _would_ you hold up as a better alternative for people to use?

I have quite a few hemp dipes, fwiw, and they definitely have the advantage of being very absorbent, but can also get scratchy and stink terribly if not stripped periodically. Therefore, I easily end up using more water to keep them working well than I do my regular cotton dipes! Doesn't that sort of defeat the purpose of their being a less water-intensive crop to grow, lol?

I think most of us here try to do what is reasonable to tread lighter upon the earth. For me, that meant switching to cloth, even if cotton has its environmental issues, too; it's unquestionably a better choice that the sposies I was polluting the planet with!


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Glad to see it only took like 5 posts to have someone come on to a newbee like a ton of bricks.

Yikes, well I figured I might get flamed for this, just not so quickly







- and no I'm not trolling.

I want answers, and I figured this might be a good place to get them - here are the questions I thought I implied in a not-so-subtle way in my original post:

Can someone tell me if there is in fact a way to certify a fabric as organic? The way you can certify say an apple as such?

Based on a few other posts I've read it would seem that the alternative is the hemp/cotton blends - but I believe there are human rights issues in China - if you believe the mainstream press. Nevermind that there is cotton fibre content in the hemp stuff.

So you tell me -are we screwed either way? BTW I'm definately doing cloth, the question is what is more environmentally responsible - and in order to arrive at the answer I need to know if there is IN FACT any fabric that is truly organic that is suitable for cloth diapering.

-even paranoids have enemies


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
So it would seem that there is quite a bit of misinformation floating around - even on these forums where folks talk about thier "organic" diapers. What particularly interests me is all these folks claiming some moral high ground because they use what they call "organic" cotton.

um...as a non-new member, i can't recall ever seeing this? who claims moral high-ground? WAHMs offer organic fibers, mamas express a preference for them over other materials, maybe. sorry, i don't see where you're coming from here.

and to put it very simply, if you are a soon-to-be-mom then i welcome you to present a better alternative to either currently available fabrics (organic or non) or 'sposies cause you don't have much time!

like a PP said...it's a matter of picking what's best from the choices out there. some people like fabric less treated than others, some like the look, some the feel...if it were a perfect world, we'd have our perfect fabric here, just as we'd have realistic modes of transportation that don't cause pollution. hybrids aren't perfect but better than older alternatives, no? i still need to drive in either case just like i need to diaper my child. i pick the lesser of 2 evils, i guess. WITHOUT claiming any moral highground!

then again, you could always look into ECing...no worries of "bad" fibers there.


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## sparklemum (Jan 19, 2004)

the original post didn't mention moral high ground, just asked a pretty straightforward question...what does organic cotton mean? and is it really organic or just a nice way to market something that is, well, not exactly optimal?

frankly, i think it is fascinating...

how many of us have the research and information to back up our choices? is what we assume to be a lighter treading choice, always lighter treading?


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

I am not flaming you. Just confused how to answer the questions because I wasn't sure where you were coming from.

The original post sounded kinda like a public service announcement. I wasn't sure if you were trying to educate mamas or if you were asking if we knew the answers.

To be honest.....I do not know what is best. I can not afford OC. The best alternative for me has been to buy second hand and recycled diapering products. That way I feel I am making a difference by keeping sposies out of landfills and reusing cding items on multiple babies. I also suggest staying away from PUL. I use mostly recycled wool sweaters MDC mamas have made into covers and longies.

Sorry I am not of much help. Thank you for posting such a thought provoking topic. I look forward to learning more.


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
I want answers, and I figured this might be a good place to get them - here are the questions I thought I implied in a not-so-subtle way in my original post:

Can someone tell me if there is in fact a way to certify a fabric as organic? The way you can certify say an apple as such?

Based on a few other posts I've read it would seem that the alternative is the hemp/cotton blends - but I believe there are human rights issues in China - if you believe the mainstream press. Nevermind that there is cotton fibre content in the hemp stuff.

So you tell me -are we screwed either way? BTW I'm definately doing cloth, the question is what is more environmentally responsible - and in order to arrive at the answer I need to know if there is IN FACT any fabric that is truly organic that is suitable for cloth diapering.

-even paranoids have enemies









and i don't think you were being jumped on...i think it's possible your post comes off as a bit negative to those of us who CD. as if we just go ahead with any old choice, while still claiming superiority.

bottom line is, most of us are just everyday people, trying to do whats best from the choices we HAVE. i really can't focus on all the things NOT available to me or well, i'd just go nuts. it seems like this is a great subject for you to research since it concerns you so. asking HERE if we're just "screwed" is gonna get you some very honest replies! and you may not like them, hate to say. and i say that NOT jumping all over you!


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## Guinevere (Apr 17, 2004)

I didn't see the least bit in the way of flaming







, just posters reading a somewhat strident post by a newbie using phrases like "moral high ground," and then quite naturally questioning if you had an agenda and what exactly that might be...


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

the original post didn't mention moral high ground
Actually she did.... see quote:

Quote:

What particularly interests me is all these folks claiming some moral high ground because they use what they call "organic" cotton.

But to answer the OP's question - The organic trade association has something to do with declaring things organic i believe... or has a committee or something ... I cant remember now, LOL.







: But besides that there is quite a bit of info about organic cotton there -- just a few links:
http://www.ota.com/organic/environme...vironment.html
http://www.ota.com/organic/mt/organic_cotton.html
http://www.ota.com/AmericanOrganicSt...sforFiber.html

Hope that helps you in your research


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sparklemum*
the original post didn't mention moral high ground, just asked a pretty straightforward question...what does organic cotton mean? and is it really organic or just a nice way to market something that is, well, not exactly optimal?

frankly, i think it is fascinating...

how many of us have the research and information to back up our choices? is what we assume to be a lighter treading choice, always lighter treading?

actually, i quoted the OP direct so, yes, it did.

and yes, it is interesting, but again...i am a regular person, making everyday decisions and i guess i don't feel the need to back up my choices. i do what i think is best. it would be great if someone knew a definitive answer to this but i'm guessing it's mostly a matter of opinion, really.


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## stacey0402 (Aug 16, 2003)

I have a lot of respect for Lori at Fuzbaby. Here is a link to what she has to say about organic cotton: Why Organic? She takes all aspects into consideration when choosing fabrics for the diapers she makes. Aside form the fact that I believe organic cotton diapers to be the best choice environmentally, I feel that its softness and stability make it a superior choice. Sorry if you felt that we were coming down hard







Welcome


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Just as a point of interest - I wasn't the one that originally asked if "we were all screwed" I was paraphrasing another post. Anyway I'll continue to post whatever I find on the subject as time passes - maybe it'll help someone else at some point in the future - that is if they can wade through the recent ad hominem arguments...

Time to sleep.


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## sparklemum (Jan 19, 2004)

yes, i read too quickly - sorry about that










moral high ground was indeed mentioned


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## leosmama20 (May 26, 2004)

Well, quite frankly, yes, we are all screwed. I am sorry but human civilization isn't exactly great for the globe. So, the best thing to do is to make informed choices and do the best you can.

I think the point of your original post was more of, why organic cotton when it isn't perfect? I have often wondered, quite frankly, why people choose organic cotton with bleached and factory print knit outers and microfleece inners and plastic snaps? As a diaper manufacturer I can tell you, there is no perfect choice. No perfect system, no perfect fabric, no perfect labor.... but you just try to do your best. Of course, I am one of the few who admits, I in no way cloth diaper believing it is the best choice for the environment.

I would highly recommend unbleached prefolds, pins and wool covers if you are deeply concerned, although, I KNOW PETA has quite the bit to say on wool.

Emily


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## MissSugarKane (Jun 19, 2003)

:


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## stacey0402 (Aug 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leosmama20*
I have often wondered, quite frankly, why people choose organic cotton with bleached and factory print knit outers and microfleece inners and plastic snaps?

Well, I do have some organic cotton diapers that have knit print outers and plastic snaps (I pass on the micro-fleece). I choose OC because I love the feel of the fabric. I like how it gets better with every wash, and it doesn't get stinky the way hemp does. Bleached cotton diapers just don't feel the same to me. I guess I could just get unbleached (inorganic) cotton diapers, but why not choose OC if it is even just *slightly* more environmentally friendy? There really is no "pure" diapering choice, I just do what I can with what I have.


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## lpmeadows78 (Oct 5, 2004)

Okay, I am going to try to say this as straight as I can this late and this tired, but yes not all "organic diapers" are organic. I can't tell you how many times I have seen certified organic diapers with neon colors and patterns all over them. Just because a wham uses 1 organic fabric in a diaper that is mostly conventional fabric doesn't make it organic. I try to caustion buyers to that all the time. If an organic diaper is 100% organic you can ask for their or there fabric distributers certification and recieve it without any hesitation. If there is any delay there is a problem 99% of the time. If you would like to know more about 100% organic diapers feel free to pm me and I will explain further.
I am so sorry that there are people out there that are so missinformed that they fraugently sell organic when it really isn't. True organic fabric is plain vanilla colored often with brown flecks, and has absolutely no smell. If you smell a chemical it has chemicals in in. Hemp is not organic. There is no hemp being produced that isn't blended with chemically loaded conventional cotton. There are very reputable companies on line that claim to sell organic hemp. I am sorry it is fraud. Basicially Buyer Be Ware. Organic cotton is real, but most people will take you for a ride, because they don't know any better. Ask questions, ask for certification, and research the company you buy from. I have and I know the difference!


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lpmeadows78*
Okay, I am going to try to say this as straight as I can this late and this tired, but yes not all "organic diapers" are organic. I can't tell you how many times I have seen certified organic diapers with neon colors and patterns all over them. Just because a wham uses 1 organic fabric in a diaper that is mostly conventional fabric doesn't make it organic. I try to caustion buyers to that all the time. If an organic diaper is 100% organic you can ask for their or there fabric distributers certification and recieve it without any hesitation. If there is any delay there is a problem 99% of the time. If you would like to know more about 100% organic diapers feel free to pm me and I will explain further.
I am so sorry that there are people out there that are so missinformed that they fraugently sell organic when it really isn't. True organic fabric is plain vanilla colored often with brown flecks, and has absolutely no smell. If you smell a chemical it has chemicals in in. Hemp is not organic. There is no hemp being produced that isn't blended with chemically loaded conventional cotton. There are very reputable companies on line that claim to sell organic hemp. I am sorry it is fraud. Basicially Buyer Be Ware. Organic cotton is real, but most people will take you for a ride, because they don't know any better. Ask questions, ask for certification, and research the company you buy from. I have and I know the difference!

If you know of any dipes that are organic, will you pm me please.


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## DreamingMama (Apr 18, 2003)

Gosh another thing to worry about now!!!


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## Mami (Mar 19, 2004)

What concerns me somewhat is that if there are people selling supposed OC that is not really OC but charging the price of organic and we are paying those prices then someone is being taken for a ride and ultimately it's the consumer. Of course, I doubt that WAHMs would purposely trick people but possibly they are being taken for a ride too... interesting points.


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mami*
What concerns me somewhat is that if there are people selling supposed OC that is not really OC but charging the price of organic and we are paying those prices then someone is being taken for a ride and ultimately it's the consumer. Of course, I doubt that WAHMs would purposely trick people but possibly they are being taken for a ride too... interesting points.









My main concern as well.


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## sweetfeet (Jan 16, 2003)

Quote:

There is no hemp being produced that isn't blended with chemically loaded conventional cotton.
Um as of winter of 03 wasn't the hemp jersey, hemp fleece, etc that wahms get from places like hemp traders 55% hemp and now 45% organic cotton? I read something a long while back about they switching to the organic cotton. Does anyone remember that? Tiffany?


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Yeah... hemp traders was saying at one point that all hemp was being made with "organic cotton" but it wasnt certified yet which is why they didnt officially announce it. I do know that all the hemp we have gotten recently was MUCH softer than it used to be... but who really knows if it is or not -- someone would have to call and ask hemptraders









as for wahms selling organic cotton diapers.... almost every wahm i know gets their organic cotton from one place... which sells it as organic cotton... you can buy it retail yourself from http://www.organiccottonplus.com/ --- I dont know why there would be reason to doubt that its organic cotton, the mill that it comes from is a very large business. Seems they would get in trouble for selling it as organic if it wasnt? But eh.. what do i know, LOL... I just like the stuff cause its soft & would pay the higher price just because of that







:LOL


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## sweetfeet (Jan 16, 2003)

Thanks for the answer Tiffany. I hope it didn't put you on the spot but I thought it was you that told me. Anyhow yeah I would think that there would be negative results if you sold something as organic when it wasn't. Aren't there guidelines though that something has to be only a certain percent organic to be called organic. That could be only cosmetics though. :LOL
Very interesting thread. Though I haven't seen anyone act like they are better than anyone else for using organic diapers. I know some people (hi Letia







) are concerned with using only organics and they won't budge on what they want. I don't think that I've seen what you describe happening here though.


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## Yummymummy74 (Jun 7, 2004)

RE .. organic..

(Caveat..I purchase organic anything when possible ..)

There remains a few key issues surrounding the cultivation and harvest of "organics" and as consumers wanting these products we are wise to demand more prudent and rigorous standards to define what is organic..

For instance....

Its not clearly defined what constitutes organic..so people can play with the label for their own profit. It was recently mentioned to me that some associations or farmers groups will demand that 50% of crops be organic for the label to qualify as organic...some other associations or groups may say only 30%!!! and you can call yourself organic. So some growers will go for the absolute minimum and grow 30% of the crops organic and find that 100% won't work for them due to cost or disease, then they resort back to "traditional" methods of spraying..BUT because they reached that min quota of 30% the product can still be sold as "organic"...to further add fuel to the fire, there is no one specific government appointed agency that has jurisdiction over this.. just different associations for different regions.

In theory anyone could set up a tomato grow operation in their yard and call it the "XYZ organic tomato grower's association" and there is nothing to stop them.. so yes at the moment there is ALOT of grey area here... and questioning the current marketing trends on organic is absolutely laudable.

I was very unaware of the above facts until a very wise friend shared the above information with me, my inital reaction was rather angry.. but upon further reflection I realize getting mad is not the answer as consumers we need to demand more accountability.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Marsupialmuma*
So some growers will go for the absolute minimum and grow 30% of the crops organic and find that 100% won't work for them due to cost or disease, then they resort back to "traditional" methods of spraying..BUT because they reached that min quota of 30% the product can still be sold as "organic"

Where do you get your information?? My understanding is that a product may only be labeled organic if there were no chemicals involved in its growing or processing. In fact, if it has been grown chemical-free for less than 3 years, it can only be labeled "transitional." The ground that it is grown in has to be chemical-free for at least 3 years before the organic label can be used. There are very strict standards. If a farmer is spraying half of his crops with chemicals, but using organic farming methods on the other half, only the organically grown crops can be sold as organic. The chemically sprayed crops are not legally allowed to be called organic.

To the OP: I don't know where you get your information either, but, yes, there really is a difference between organic and non-organic cotton. Non-organic cotton is one of the most heavily sprayed crops in the world, if not THE most heavily sprayed crop (it's in the top 3 at any rate). Organic cotton is grown and processed without chemicals. There is a strict certification process and it is illegal to label a product organic if it does not meet the standards. I know that there is a difference between organic cotton and non-organic cotton, because I can FEEL it. I have chemically sensitive skin, and non-organic cotton irritates my skin and makes me itch all over. When I put organic cotton next to my skin, all I feel is softness. Organic cotton really is better for the environment and healthier for people.

To whoever said "why buy an organic cotton diaper with plastic snaps?" the answer is that there isn't much choice. Of all the organic diaper makers, there is only a handful that will make them with metal snaps. But I really don't understand why a healthy/environmental choice has to be an all-or-nothing thing? If you're concerned about fat and the store is out of skim milk, do you buy 1% or do you say "well I might as well buy whole?" If you're making a meal for your family and you aren't able to make it 100% healthy, you don't say "screw it" and just feed them all candy. The idea is to be as healthy/environmentally friendly as possible.


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## ~Megan~ (Nov 7, 2002)

If all things were equal based on environmental impact with cloth and disposables I'd still use cloth on my child because they are healthier for my child.


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## leosmama20 (May 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
To whoever said "why buy an organic cotton diaper with plastic snaps?" the answer is that there isn't much choice. Of all the organic diaper makers, there is only a handful that will make them with metal snaps. But I really don't understand why a healthy/environmental choice has to be an all-or-nothing thing? If you're concerned about fat and the store is out of skim milk, do you buy 1% or do you say "well I might as well buy whole?" If you're making a meal for your family and you aren't able to make it 100% healthy, you don't say "screw it" and just feed them all candy. The idea is to be as healthy/environmentally friendly as possible.

Um, yes, I do know that! LOL I was playing devil's advocate there a bit. I think you will see from the rest of my post (car analogy) that I agree with you 100%.

Emily


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

If you're making a meal for your family and you aren't able to make it 100% healthy, you don't say "screw it" and just feed them all candy.
crap... you dont? I've been doing it wrong alll this time .....








:


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

I was responding to this

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leosmama20*
I have often wondered, quite frankly, why people choose organic cotton with bleached and factory print knit outers and microfleece inners and plastic snaps?

I don't see a car analogy in your post?

Ok, I just went back and found the car analogy in your earlier post.


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
The chemically sprayed crops are not legally allowed to be called organic.

To the OP: I don't know where you get your information either, but, yes, there really is a difference between organic and non-organic cotton.

Can you link us to the law that you're quoting?

And I simply mentioned that cotton, wether or not it's organic is one of the most irrigated crops in the world. PERIOD. Need links? I can provide them if you'd like.


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## kblue (Jan 26, 2004)

I have *not once* seen someone on this board claim moral high ground for using organic fabric. I have, however, seen posters in THIS thread make rather sarcastic/condescending comments about others who choose that fabric.







:

IMO, OC is much softer than hemp and doesn't have stink issues. That is the main reason I choose OC over hemp when given the option. I have a feeling that is why a lot of mamas here choose OC, not because they claim to be morally right.


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## radish (Sep 19, 2002)

Execllent post Sustainer.

Teddypuffs,
I think the most environmentally-friendly thing to do is EC w/ OC prefolds when neccessary.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
Can you link us to the law that you're quoting?

It is illegal to misrepresent a product. The word "organic" has a strict definition. I will try to find you a link.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
And I simply mentioned that cotton, wether or not it's organic is one of the most irrigated crops in the world.

Um, that's not the ONLY thing you said.


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## wildthing (Feb 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
And I simply mentioned that cotton, wether or not it's organic is one of the most irrigated crops in the world. PERIOD. Need links? I can provide them if you'd like.

Just curious, aside from using elimination communication 100% of the time, do you know of a viable alternative? Hemp, sure, but the hemp fabrics used for diapers still have almost an equal amount of cotton. I guess I am also puzzled as to the purpose of your post? If just for disucssion, great.







A good thought-provoking discussion is always welcome. I haven't seen anyone on any high ground either, although for whatever reason, some people have a preference as to what they will or will not use.

I hope you don't think you were being flamed....you asked a very direct question, and people were asking and answering back in the same manner. At least it seemed so to me.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Found a link

http://www.utexas.edu/centers/nfic/n...997.nat.htm#rr


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## radish (Sep 19, 2002)

Quote:

Just curious, aside from using elimination communication 100% of the time, do you know of a viable alternative? Hemp, sure, but the hemp fabrics used for diapers still have almost an equal amount of cotton. I guess I am also puzzled as to the purpose of your post? If just for disucssion, great. A good thought-provoking discussion is always welcome. I haven't seen anyone on any high ground either, although for whatever reason, some people have a preference as to what they will or will not use.
Excellent post.

Teddypuff
If you are *that* concerned about environmental impact of cotton, even OC, then it seems to me EC is your only option.


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## lpmeadows78 (Oct 5, 2004)

I think it is very sad that people sell organic diaper for organic prices that are not 100% organic. If you would like more information on the actual letter of the law in organic please visit www.ota.com They have all the latest information, and they are working on legislation that will define the amount of organic used in a garment. Much like what you see when you buy organic foods. With a list of ingrediants or percentage of materials used. This way all of this 100% certified organic diapers will really be 100% certified organics. Also, someone asked where they can get organic diapers. I recommend having them custom made and buying the organic matterials yourself, so, that you can be sure of the fabrics used and the company that sells it. I also wanted to add that yes many of the WAHM's order from the same organic companies, there aren't that many to speak of, but they don't always use only organic materials to complete a diaper. I have even bought some that were organic that contained soakers made of conventional material, and I was livid pissed. After all organic woven terry is very expensive and that is what you are paying for when you buy an organic diaper. Buyer be ware!


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kellieblue*







I have *not once* seen someone on this board claim moral high ground for using organic fabric. I have, however, seen posters in THIS thread make rather sarcastic/condescending comments about others who choose that fabric.







:

IMO, OC is much softer than hemp and doesn't have stink issues.

uuuum, you're missing the point - the point is the organic labeling - the fact that I've encountered Moms that feel that they are more righteous than others because they use what they call organic diapers is what i was talking about. Did I mention WHERE I'd encountered said Mamas? Noooooooooo. I didn't - that coupled with the fact that it was my first post ever might lead some folks on this board (although not clearly all) to surmize that I did not encounter said persons HERE. Anyway, I digress.

Re: codescending comments? LOL! Do you actually READ these boards? Condescention seems to be par for the course for some here. :-D

What's all this talk about hemp being stinky? I have a girlfriend who uses some sort of hemp/cotton blended fitteds on her 9 month old and has since day one - she has never reported and stinkiness - could the alleged stinkiness be due to the way some folks do thier washes?

That my story and I'm sticking to it!


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Not a link to the law - just a link to someone's paper sponsored by Agricola Partners "Agricola Partners is a consulting firm focused on the sustainable agriculture and food industries." and James Raymond Vreeland http://pantheon.yale.edu/~jrv9/ some dude at Yale that is an asst professor in Political Science?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
Found a link

http://www.utexas.edu/centers/nfic/n...997.nat.htm#rr


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## wildthing (Feb 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*

What's all this talk about hemp being stinky? I have a girlfriend who uses some sort of hemp/cotton blended fitteds on her 9 month old and has since day one - she has never reported and stinkiness - could the alleged stinkiness be due to the way some folks do thier washes?

Yes, it absolutely *could* be the wash routine. It could be the type of water in a given city, it could be the particular ph balance of any individual child. It could be due to any number of factors. I had smell problems with my hemp for a while, but I don't anymore. I don't know exactly what made it stop, several things changed all around the same time, but it was real. Now, I have no stink issues at all, but that doesn't mean 100 other mamas don't. One person's experience over 9 months is not enough to say something is alleged. I have used hemp for 3 years, and I know of others who have used it much longer.

So, I still am wondering about your intent? Are you getting the answers you are looking for? Is it just to provoke thought and discussion? Or is there a hard and fast answer you are looking for?


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## Undercover Hippie (Sep 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
What's all this talk about hemp being stinky? I have a girlfriend who uses some sort of hemp/cotton blended fitteds on her 9 month old and has since day one - she has never reported and stinkiness - could the alleged stinkiness be due to the way some folks do thier washes?

Staying out of this debate, just wanted to say that mamas with hard water often develop a problem with hemp getting stinky, and if you do a search for "hemp stink" you will probably see about a billion threads that can further inform you.









Tara


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

"Condescention seems to be par for the course for some here." Quote from previous post...

Depends on the forum you are in. If you go into media/war/politics you can find some sassy debating. I do not find this to be the case throughout MDC.

For the most part it is a community of mamas who want the very best for their babies. We are all learning from eachother. Offering advice, wisdom, and a hug. Sometimes disaproval. We all want to do things better, more eco concence, and be more loving to our children and our surroundings.

Rarely do you find anyone with their nose in the air. We ALL have along way to go on the journey of NFL.

I think this thread has been met with some fistiness due to the tone of the original post.

I am still confused exactly on the purpose of the thread. Is it to gather info or debate???

I am always up to becoming more educated. Debating is not really my cup of tea right now.


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## Mami (Mar 19, 2004)

Just wanted to add that I have had stink issues with OC. You can have stink with hemp, OC, plain cotton flannel, whatever, it's a build up issue and organic fabrics are not immune. I agree that OC is softer than most other fabrics and I wouldn't even consider using it if it didn't have similar absorbency to hemp, so it's functional too.


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## kblue (Jan 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
So it would seem that there is quite a bit of misinformation floating around - even *on these forums where folks talk about thier "organic" diapers*. What particularly interests me is all these folks claiming some moral high ground because they use what they call "organic" cotton.

I'm sorry that I assumed you were talking about the mamas here.









Yes, hemp can stink. It can certainly be because of wash routine. It can also be because of the type of water which we have no control over. Therefore, some people choose OC because of that.


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wildthing*
So, I still am wondering about your intent? Are you getting the answers you are looking for? Is it just to provoke though?









My intent was to start a discussion. And yes now it's to provoke thought.

There are some facts that do bear discussion:

Can anyone name ONE legally labeled organic diaper that they own?

I mean if you're going to call your product organic it should be organic, no? Not 90% organic, not 99% organic - 100% organic - no? It's misleading for someone who is a newcomer to the scene. Some would call this disingenous - it's false advertising. Had I not done a weebit of research I would've just bought blindly and assumed my dipes were organic. Does that not bear discussion?

I figured that this would be a great forum to have an open discussion on the subject. Some folks clearly just don't like thier little worlds disturbed - I think I'm seeing some of that here.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

When someone mentioned hemp stinking, you used an example of one person to illustrate that, in your experience, hemp does not stink.

You mentioned organic diaper users acting self-righteous/morally superior, so someone used an example of a whole message board full of people to illustrate that, in her experince, organic diaper users do not act self-righteous/morally superior.

Anyway...

What kind of link are you asking for? A link to the text of the law that states that it is illegal to misrepresent a product?

Did you read the link I provided?

Quote:

Simply stated, organic cotton is grown without the use of synthetic chemical fertilizers, pesticides, growth regulators, or defoliants.

Quote:

Certification agencies monitor on-farm cotton production to verify and guarantee that it meets organic certification criteria and government regulations. Upon compliance with organic standards and certification, participants are entitled to label and market their cotton and cotton byproducts as certified organic.

Organic certification standards and labeling are regulated by federal law.
The link also contains a more specific definition of "organic," as well as information about who defines the standards.

I thought that was the kind of information you were looking for.


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
uuuum, you're missing the point - the point is the organic labeling - the fact that I've encountered Moms that feel that they are more righteous than others because they use what they call organic diapers is what i was talkign about. Did I mention WHERE I'd encountered said Mamas? Noooooooooo. I didn't - that coupled with the fact that it was my first post ever might lead some folks on this board (although not clearly all) to surmize that I did not encounter said persons HERE. Anyway, I digress.

Re: codescending comments? LOL! Do you actually READ these boards? Condescention seems to be par for the course for some here. :-D

What's all this talk about hemp being stinky? I have a girlfriend who uses some sort of hemp/cotton blended fitteds on her 9 month old and has since day one - she has never reported and stinkiness - could the alleged stinkiness be due to the way some folks do thier washes?

That my story and I'm sticking to it!

again, this is a DIRECT quite from your original post (which now seems to have been edited):

Originally Posted by teddypuffs
"So it would seem that there is quite a bit of misinformation floating around - even on these forums where folks talk about thier "organic" diapers. What particularly interests me is all these folks claiming some moral high ground because they use what they call "organic" cotton."

so yeeeeeeeessss, ya sure do mention WHERE you've encountered said mamas. and saying "these" forums means...well, THESE forums. MDC forums. AKA: the people you're asking this question to. if you didn't mean that, it would probably serve you well - if you're actually interested in having a "productive" conversation rather than coming off offensively - to mention where you're getting this attitude from. because apprently, a lot of us read your statement to mean "WE" were taking moral high ground, using and raving about OC fibers. side note: posting about OC and saying you LOVE it isn't the same as saying, "i'm better than you are unless you use it too!" this is just where we come to say, "look what i got and like a lot!"

again, you're just not gonna get the friendliest responses if your first set of posts here says things like, "Re: codescending comments? LOL! Do you actually READ these boards? Condescention seems to be par for the course for some here." it makes me think you don't actually like this community and weren't serious about a respectful discussion anyway. seems like you had an axe to grind. if we're all condescending in your mind then i guess it makes sense to you to post your 1st time in a condescending manor.

and finally, re: hemp stink. mama, you can stick to your story all ya want. wait till you diaper that baby day in and day out and overnight. then follow up with us about your "unscented" hemp. and wash routines that we seem to have somehow missed. i can't tell ya all the things my friends failed to report about parenthood that...amazingly...i still somehow encountered! hemp stink is no myth, just like colic or rashes or thumb sucking or the MILLION other things that vary from one parent to another. and you just can't understand till you're in those shoes.

so, being concerned about if fabrics are really "organic" when they claim to be is a valid concern. your methods...well, obviously you're free to post as you wish (as mods see fit, that is) but if your true purpose is to get meaningful answers, try contructive methods rather than insulting ones.


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## kblue (Jan 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*

I figured that this would be a great forum to have an open discussion on the subject. Some folks clearly just don't like thier little worlds disturbed - I think I'm seeing some of that here.

Thought provoking discussions are great. They are received much better without the condescending remarks.


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
My intent was to start a discussion. And yes now it's to provoke thought.

There are some facts that do bear discussion:

Can anyone name ONE legally labeled organic diaper that they own?

I mean if you're going to call your product organic it should be organic, no? Not 90% organic, not 99% organic - 100% organic - no? It's misleading for someone who is a newcomer to the scene. Some would call this disingenous - it's false advertising. Had I not done a weebit of research I would've just bought blindly and assumed my dipes were organic. Does that not bear discussion?

I figured that this would be a great forum to have an open discussion on the subject. Some folks clearly just don't like thier little worlds disturbed - I think I'm seeing some of that here.

I am seeing more condescetion in your posts than I have seen in a long time.

It is not that we do not like to have our "litttle worlds disturbed"
I believe that you are presenting your info as though we are in an agruement. It is coming across very crass and slightly sacrastic.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
Can anyone name ONE legally labeled organic diaper that they own?

All of my diapers are organic, and as far as I know none of them are illegally labeled. I tend to assume that people are obeying the law unless I have some kind of proof that they are breaking the law. I also give the certification agencies the benefit of the doubt that they are doing their job.


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
I mean if you're going to call your product organic it should be organic, no? Not 90% organic, not 99% organic - 100% organic - no? It's misleading for someone who is a newcomer to the scene. Some would call this disingenous - it's false advertising. Had I not done a weebit of research I would've just bought blindly and assumed my dipes were organic. Does that not bear discussion?

finally...i haven't ever bought an organic "diaper". i HAVE bought diapers made with organic cotton. maybe that's your big hang up. that a diaper with other materials present isn't 100% organic. i don't know of any WAHMs that claim "100% organic DIAPERS". yes, many will sell diapers made with some organic fabrics but that's the extent i've seen of their "claims". there's nothing misleading about it. if you don't understand that a diaper made with an OV topped soaker isn't necessarily a 100% organic diaper, that's a matter of your own lack of understanding. as consumers, we have responsibilities too. just like if i buy a fruit bar "made with 100% organic apples" it's really up to me to understand that what's wrapped around that fruit isn't 100% organic.

stick around and i think you'll find no one is trying to pull the organic wool over our eyes here. WAHMs don't equal SCAMS!


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## wildthing (Feb 16, 2003)

There is hostility in your posts. All caps at time, making insulting comments. I am wondering if you have a particular problem with a particular person that spurred this whole discussion. There are more diplomatic ways to approach a group of people.


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## wildthing (Feb 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jennyriver*
finally...i haven't ever bought an organic "diaper". i HAVE bought diapers made with organic cotton. maybe that's your big hang up. that a diaper with other materials present isn't 100% organic. i don't know of any WAHMs that claim "100% organic DIAPERS". yes, many will sell diapers made with some organic fabrics but that's the extent i've seen of their "claims". there's nothing misleading about it.

Yes, I was going to add that too.







Some WAHMs do offer 100% organic materials in their products, some don't.


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jennyriver*
your methods...well, obviously you're free to post as you wish (as mods see fit, that is) but if your true purpose is to get meaningful answers, try contructive methods rather than insulting ones.

Sure am







- sorry if I violated some unspoken rule. And BTW the original post was modified by a MOD not me. Your comment about my modifying the OP seems to be some sort of veiled way to question my integrity - is THAT constructive?

Wow I've learned a ton so far. So far I've had my intentions questioned several times, my choice of words has been criticized and my reason for editing the OP has been used to impugn my integrity. I think there have been maybe 5 posts that actually had some good information in them out of how many?

Wow, seems like I'm getting really good at snarky comments. I was hoping for a cogent discussion. Not gunna happen.

Thanks for everything "mamas"!

I'm off to more important things like picking lint out of my navel.


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## binxsmom (Jun 14, 2004)

i'm so pissed!!!!!!!!! i just realized that my organic dipes are not sewn with organic thread! i think i've been misled by a community of coniving, vicious wahms. i need a lawyer!


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

finally...i haven't ever bought an organic "diaper". i HAVE bought diapers made with organic cotton. maybe that's your big hang up. that a diaper with other materials present isn't 100% organic. i don't know of any WAHMs that claim "100% organic DIAPERS". yes, many will sell diapers made with some organic fabrics but that's the extent i've seen of their "claims". there's nothing misleading about it.








There is nothing illegal or wrong about selling diapers made with organic cotton and stating as such. I do not know of a single WAHM who is claiming certified organic diapers because thats likely to be impossible because of elastic, snaps, thread, etc - which are usually NOT organic in material. So what? If a mama is seriously concerned with buying a 100% organic cotton diaper they will ask those questions. As has been stated in a previous post... many mamas choose diapers made from organic cotton simply because they like the fabric better, not because its organic.


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## ChattyCat (Sep 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*
i'm so pissed!!!!!!!!! i just realized that my organic dipes are not sewn with organic thread! i think i've been misled by a community of coniving, vicious wahms. i need a lawyer!









:
At least something about this thread brought a smile to my face!


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## radish (Sep 19, 2002)

Quote:

inally...i haven't ever bought an organic "diaper". i HAVE bought diapers made with organic cotton. maybe that's your big hang up. that a diaper with other materials present isn't 100% organic. i don't know of any WAHMs that claim "100% organic DIAPERS". yes, many will sell diapers made with some organic fabrics but that's the extent i've seen of their "claims". there's nothing misleading about it. if you don't understand that a diaper made with an OV topped soaker isn't necessarily a 100% organic diaper, that's a matter of your own lack of understanding. as consumers, we have responsibilities too. just like if i buy a fruit bar "made with 100% organic apples" it's really up to me to understand that what's wrapped around that fruit isn't 100% organic.
ITA! When I see a diaper described as OC and PRR outer I KNOW it is not 100% Organic. WAHMs that do use organic elastic or NO lycra/elastic say so.


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## jennyriver (Jul 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
Sure am







- sorry if I violated some unspoken rule. And BTW the original post was modified by a MOD not me. Your comment about my modifying the OP seems to be some sort of veiled way to question my integrity - is THAT constructive?

Wow I've learned a ton so far. So far I've had my intentions questioned several times, my choice of words has been criticized and my reason for editing the OP has been used to impugn my integrity. I think there have been maybe 5 posts that actually had some good information in them out of how many?

Wow, seems like I'm getting really good at snarky comments. I was hoping for a cogent discussion. Not gunna happen.

Thanks for everything "mamas"!

I'm off to more important things like picking lint out of my navel.

feel free to go back and quote MY post directly...i never indicated YOU edited your own post to take out that comment. i (and everyone else) can plainly see that the mods edited your post. i simply stated the orignal post was edited, in case anyone was to go back and say, "gee...i dont see that statement here". it was just to clarify where everyone was coming from, reading your "moral highground" statement that no longer appears in the original post. you're WAAAAY off base here - i made no such insinuation about YOU modifying. check the posts.

and again, as i said, you're free to post as you will - again, i'm not a mod but i meant as long as it DOES follow WRITTEN guidelines, it's your right - just as it's ours to post in response to the tone of your thread. are we violating some unwritten rule by responding to you as we wish? you clearly aren't fond of the attitudes of people here (unless being "condescending" is a positive characteristic to you).

it seems to me that when people tried to answer your original question, you just battled everything anyone has had to say. you ask, find me a link or quotes...people do and you dismiss it. you question attitudes and when people respond, you are mystified when we defend them.

i think we've all learned a lot from this thread and it's all how ya take it and look at it.

and steph, :LOL


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## radish (Sep 19, 2002)

Teddypuffs
I am wondering what the intent of your OP is. Is it to inform new CD mamas? To impelemet stricter labeling on diapers?

If so, I think it (both) can be done.

Your OP was a bit harsh and didn't convey a message of concern or question, YK?

Maybe it is a good idea for WAHMs to be more specific in their product descriptions. Although, I think most are doing a good job (most describe each layer of a diaper).


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

That is why I was confused about the "why" of the thread.

It seems that regardless of how anyone answers it sparks a rude and snarky response.

I am sorry if you feel you are being ganged up on. I just think your tone is a tad rude and self rightious.


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## Yummymummy74 (Jun 7, 2004)

Ok now I have to ask! am I weird because I have been using hemp on 2 kids for 2 plus years and I have never had a stink problem?????







:

Sorry I don't get the stink thing..... :LOL


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## Trishy (Oct 15, 2002)

First let me make it clear that the only portion of the OP's post that has been edited by me was that I removed a lengthy post that violated our copyright concernes policy in that it did not provide a link to the source and was over 100 words long.
http://www.mothering.com/mdc/copyright_concerns.html
The only alternative to this would have been to either remove the entire OP or to remove the entire thread. I did not think many of you would agree with this so I removed the quote only.

Second, I realize that some things have been said in this thread that have some of you understandably irked. I wanted to retierate some portions of the MDC User Agreement so that this discussion can continue within the UA and remain on the board:

Quote:

You are expected to avoid the following when you post:
1. Posting in a disrespectful, defamatory, adversarial, baiting, harassing, offensive, insultingly sarcastic or otherwise improper manner, toward a member or other individual, including casting of suspicion upon a person, invasion of privacy, humiliation, demeaning criticism, namecalling, personal attack, or in any way which violates the law.
7. Posting to discuss the statements or behavior of a member or members on the board, or to criticize another discussion on the boards. Such issues should be directed to the moderator or administrator privately and not made a subject of discussion in a thread.
http://www.mothering.com/mdc/mdc_useragreement.html

I appreciate the restraint and thoughtfulness that has been put into your replies and would like for this conversation for to continue and not be removed.


----------



## kblue (Jan 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Marsupialmuma*
Ok now I have to ask! am I weird because I have been using hemp on 2 kids for 2 plus years and I have never had a stink problem?????







:

Sorry I don't get the stink thing..... :LOL

I don't have stink.







But, I do know of many others who have! And while I was on vacation, I had to use a front loader and a few of my dipes that have NEVER stunk, did. I probably used too much detergent. But, I think it is definitely a real problem for some people - as well as stiff hemp.


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## wildthing (Feb 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *trishshack*

I appreciate the restraint and thoughtfulness that has been put into your replies and would like for this conversation for to continue and not be removed.









I agree Trisha, for the most part it has been a relatively restrained thread. I do think, however, that the OP is looking to rile people up for some reason. Unfortunate, but I do love a provoking discussion.

For the record, I have had mamas ask if I use organic thread and elastic, and even recommend places to get such materials. I appreciate the questions from them. Nothing wrong with asking.


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## lpmeadows78 (Oct 5, 2004)

The diapers I use are 100% certified organic and I made them myself. I have even visited the farm where the cotton was grown. It is close to my home town where I visit relatives. So, yes they can exist.


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## MissSugarKane (Jun 19, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wildthing*
I am wondering if you have a particular problem with a particular person that spurred this whole discussion.

I was thinking that too.It almost seems as if the OP has been around here awhile and maybe made a new user name to bring up this topic.I am not saying that is the case but just the feeling that I get.This whole thread is just very strange


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Strange indeed!!!


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## binxsmom (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MissSugarKane*
I was thinking that too.It almost seems as if the OP has been around here awhile and maybe made a new user name to bring up this topic.I am not saying that is the case but just the feeling that I get.This whole thread is just very strange

















i thought the same thing. hmmm......maybe it's pam anderson.


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## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*







i thought the same thing. hmmm......maybe it's pam anderson.

Who the hell is Pam Anderson? I suppose you don't mean Tommy Lee's ex - right?


----------



## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Yup her!

It could be....


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Hmmmmmmm....


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## kblue (Jan 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*







i thought the same thing. hmmm......maybe it's pam anderson.


----------



## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

:


----------



## stacey0402 (Aug 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teddypuffs*
I figured that this would be a great forum to have an open discussion on the subject. Some folks clearly just don't like thier little worlds disturbed - I think I'm seeing some of that here.

Well, I tried to be nice, even gave a link to some good info. Now I am getting that "don't feed the troll" feeling. But I'm ignoring it :LOL

Exactly why would somebody with a differing opinion live in a "little" world? That's the kind of comment that makes me think you've got something little too









FTR...I loved the milk analogy and the healthy food/candy one. I was trying to find a way to express that idea and you mommas did a lovely job







Nobody is trying to fool anybody into thinking they've purchased a 100% organic diaper. If I insist that a diaper be 100% organic I own the responsibilty of making sure it is.

Here's my question/concern: Hemp requires much less water and that makes it an attractive alternative to cotton, but what about all the resources used in bringing it to the U.S.? Am I right in assuming all hemp is imported? I always get stuck on that issue.


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## 2much2luv (Jan 12, 2003)

Strange indeed.....


----------



## teddypuffs (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *stacey0402*
Nobody is trying to fool anybody into thinking they've purchased a 100% organic diaper.

Ok, so I guess that there are so many posts on the forum that include the words "organic diaper" just means that folks are using the term loosely, but that they actually understand that the diaper is not organic?

I invite everyone to search the forums using "organic diaper" as your search term - the quotes simply means you search for the phrase exclusively.


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## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

I would assume that they were using the term loosely.


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## radish (Sep 19, 2002)

I second that they use the tern loosely.

And I vote for Julia Roberts...we KNOW she is a regular


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## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

Ok, so I guess that there are so many posts on the forum that include the words "organic diaper" just means that folks are using the term loosely, but that they actually understand that the diaper is not organic?
They are talking of diapers made or organic fabric. Obviously plastic snaps, polyester serging, microfleece inners, etc are all things that would make that diaper obviously not 100% organic. IMO 99% of those who use the term "organic diaper" are just looking for diapers made from organic cotton fleece/terry but still expect it to have plastic snaps, thread, etc.


----------



## PatchyMama (Dec 6, 2002)

Quote:

And I vote for Julia Roberts...we KNOW she is a regular
:LOL and she is always causing trouble too







:LOL


----------



## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

I probably use the phrase "organic diaper" more than anyone else on the board, and when I say it, what I mean is "a diaper made with organic cotton." I also go about saying that I eat "organic food," meaning that I eat food containing at least 90% organic ingredients. I am not going to start going about saying "a diaper made with organic cotton" nor "food that contains at least 90% organic ingredients." When I want to convey the idea of a diaper made with organic cotton, organic thread, organic elastic, etc, I will say "a 100% organic diaper."

I am not trying to mislead anyone. When a diaper is made of organic cotton, I really do consider it an "organic diaper," even if it's not made with organic thread etc, and I think it would satisfy the official definition of "organic diaper," too, if there were one. After all, food containing 90% organic ingredients can legally be called "organic." Maybe you do not consider such food organic.


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## GeorgiaGalHeidi (Apr 16, 2004)

On the 100% organic diaper points--

Yes, it does matter to me, but I am really thinking of covers as we don't use fitteds. HOwever, I always ask because you can usually tell from looking at the cover that it may not be totally organic(i.e., variegated serging, foldover elastic). For us, it is important to have the serging be oc because of my son's eczema. In an effort to provide him with non-irritating covers, I have begun making them for him. The only oc covers that I have seen without the poly or nylon thread is the stacinator, that does not have serging, lambkin(wool binding)and I believe sweettoot had some serged with oc at one point? I have seem some organic covers with non-oc bindover elastic, poly and nylon serging, etc. After switching to undyed/untreated and org wool, it became clear that the artificial serging was bothering my son. So, to me, that stuff taints it. I mean, I am buying oc cause it is less irritating and then there is that irritating elastic and poly or nylon thread! I cannot wait to get my oc thread to make some oc serged covers!







So, yes, as the mama of a super sensitive baby, that stuff matters. You pay for it too-I do not want to pay for an oc cover that is just as irritating as an undyed/untreated wool cover w/ irritating serging! I don't think WAHM are being intentionally misleading. I just looked online for some oc prefolds, and I found a site calling prefolds oc although they had a hemp insert. To me, that makes them not org. But, I don't think the WAHM is dumb or misleading us, cause, as evidenced here, alot of you all would still consider that org. I guess we should just be proactive ourselves if it matters, and ask!


----------



## Spark (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*







i thought the same thing. hmmm......maybe it's pam anderson.

Whew. nope not Pam. Whew. This thread tires me out.

not that I'll add anything new to the discussion... but goodness! I see a big difference between my OCPF and my non-OCPFs. I like the OC!


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## lpmeadows78 (Oct 5, 2004)

Me too!


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## supersarahmommy (Jun 22, 2004)

wow! I never really thought about organic diapers before..

I recently bought some for a friend because she asked for some for a baby shower. And I must say... it was the softest fabric I have EVER felt.

Most people who subscribe to Mothering.com (I'm a newbie and this is what i have experienced) are usually people who have researched (on vaxs, babywearing, etc.) and are not ones to just buy the party line. I think of stereotypical wealthier people buying "organic" items because its trendy.

However, if anything, this post--I believe--will make people think twice when they hear the phrase "organic diaper."

Something I thought also to mention... We talk a lot about what is enviromentally friendly; but, what about whether or not fabric and/or diapers is fair trade (socailly responsible)? Just another thought.... because both issues are equally important to me. Others don't have to agree, but I just thought it would be another thing to think about as we make our buying decisions.

(sorry for the grammar errors--i'm super tired.)


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