# Suggestions for families and friends of grieving parents



## Ms. Mom

I think many of us find it hard when people around us don't understand (or try to understand) pregnancy and birth loss.

What do all of you think of writing a community letter that we can use as a sticky in this forum? This letter would be for people coming here trying to learn or for grieving momma's to print off and send to friends and family.

I'll start with some ideas. Everyone please post yours, and then we'll brainstorm together as a community.

Dear friend and family;

Someone dear to you has recently lost a child before birth. This is a very unique loss and many don't know what to say or do.

Hopefully this letter will answer some of your questions so that you can give the support that is needed.

_{Then we could maybe list some 'do's and don't to say like}_

*Do*
·Call the baby by name (if it was named) - this validates the parents and the love that they have for their child.
·Send a card, flowers or a note of support
·Call the couple and ask how they're feeling
·Bring up the baby - you won't cause them to be sad, they're already sad and need to talk about it.

*Don't*
·Say they have an angle in heaven - many parents wanted that angle here on earth
·Say it was 'God's will'. Even if the person is deeply spiritual, this can leave them feeling angry or questioning.
·Clean the babies room out without their permission - it's natural for family and friends to want to do this while the mother is healing, but the couple needs to do this together.
·Tell them the can just have another or at least they can get pregnant - comments like this really hurt! Even if they do have another baby, they wanted THIS baby and have the right to be sad and mourn the loss.

This is just a quick draft (I'm typing while making lunches). All comments and suggestions are welcome here!


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## SweetTeach

Ms Mom,
I think this is a great idea. It will also save us from having to re-type the same things over and over again.

I only want to add a thing or two for now and I'll add more later:

*Do recognize that the child that died was a person (even if s/he was not born).*

*Don't say anything to the grieving parents that you wouldn't say to someone who had lost an adult.*
For example- would you say to someone who's mom had died: "You can get another mom."

People mostly say "It was God's will. or "God has a plan." when they really don't have anything else to say or simply can't understand it. Besides the issues that Ms.Mom brought up, it also is not something people routinely say when other kinds of bad things happen to people. For example, my friend's parents nearly died in a fire in their house. Would that statement bring comfort to her? If someone gets hit by a car, do people say that to them? Obviously, not.

*Don't ask the person "what happened"? or badger them for specific details about their loss.*
Follow her lead and if she shares, listen, but don't ask for reasons that may not actually be there. For example:
Me: "My baby died while I was 9 months pregnant."
Person: "OMG. What happened?"
Me: "He just died. There was no cause found."
Person: "What??? You weren't sick? What did your doctors' say? There wasn't anything wrong all along?" etc etc etc.

This is such a timely thread for me. People need to freakin' GET A CLUE! (and hopefully people will, from this thread, but not the people who really need to hear it.)


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## OceanMomma

I think this is a wonderful idea. Some random thoughts from me too.

Could maybe put in something about how not to try to equate them losing their child to you losing your 90 yr old granny who has just died peacefully in her sleep. Well maybe not that extreme, but don't go telling them about all the other ppl you know who've had relatives die recently - especially other very young children or babies. The other thing is not to try to cheer the grieving parents up with statements like "well it would have been worse if he/she had died when they were 2". Definitely validate that the baby was a baby.

If it was relatively early on in the pg, like first or second trimester, don't ask them if they knew if the baby was a boy or a girl. They will tell you if they want.

Don't ask if they think they're going to try again.

Don't just pretend nothing has happened.

Do you think we could have a subsection for pregnant woman who have friends who they were pregnant with who lost babies as it will be an ongoing thing for them.

Do remember to keep asking how they are after the initial month or so after the loss.

Do remember birthdays/anniversaries of the loss.

Don't tell them at least they have other children, if they do.

re: what to send. I think I saw somewhere someone sells pregnancy loss gift hampers. That sounds really crass like that but it was things like a nourishing herbal tea, bath oils with soothing aromas etc. Maybe a rose or some other flower/tree that flowers seasonally when the baby died would be a nice present. If the baby was of sufficient age where you would have got momentoes(sp?) a special box to keep them in or a photo frame for pictures of the baby.


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## Ms. Mom

Excellent ideas! I'm excited now.

ST, I agree about not having to type it all out over and over. I've actually been thinking about this for a long time. I'll try to poke throught some past threads as well.

OM, beautiful ideas







where have you been! I was about to email you! I've missed you so much!!!


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## Arduinna

please don't say that it was all for the best as the baby probably had something wrong with it. or that this was natures way of keeping a less than perfect baby from being born.

the baby was still wanted even if it wasn't "perfect"


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## Ms. Mom

Arduinna, I completely agree









Catherine, great ideas. Yes, I think we should focus more on the 'do's' partly because most people are uncomfortable. They want to know what they 'can' do to help.

I also think talking to family and friends is an excellent idea. This will truly be a community effort.


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## KatherineinCA

Jacque, this is a great idea.

I'm concerned that our letter might have such a long list of "don'ts" that people will be overwhelmed by all the possible ways they could hurt the grieving parents, and not say anything.

Maybe we could focus on the general idea that expressing genuine concern is the best way to go, not ignoring it. I found that if friends or family were truly concerned, they could actually say some of the classic "don'ts" but it didn't hurt because I could feel their concern. What was so much worse were the people who said nothing and ignored my loss. We could have a nice, long list of "do's" so people will feel encouraged, like there are lots of things they can say that would be helpful. And maybe three or four of the major don'ts, which I would consider to be:

"It was God's will" (and all the variations, like "Jesus needed another angel" etc,)

"You have other children" or "You can have other children"

"I know just how you're feeling" (which I don't think is ever appropriate, even coming from someone who's lost a baby. Of course, I've noticed that I've never heard someone who's lost a baby tell me they know just how I feel, they just hug me and cry with me, because they know that's what I need...)

I'll try to think of more of the do's and post later...

Edited to add: Now that I just re-read this thread, I agree with all the other "don'ts"--they're all so hurtful! Maybe we can get some input from friends and family members as to what type of letter would be most helpful for them. Would they be overwhelmed by too many "don'ts"?


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## shannon0218

This is a good idea, I had started a thread a while back asking what has helped or not helped, there may be more ideas there. Just a personal note on sending flowers... I was sent flowers after my first m/c and became horribly depressed when they died. It's hard to say because maybe it helped me process my loss. I like the idea of a live plant.
One thing on the do list. Ask the person if there is anything you can do. Offer to notify others. Bring a meal over. Take any children the mom may have out for the day. Offer to just come over and sit with them, let them know they don't have to talk if they don't want to.
On the don't list. I don't think it can be stressed enough to NOT use the "God's will" line. That is my MIL's favorite line, she used it again on me last weekend and I responded with if Steve (dh) or Ron (her dh) got hit by a bus and killed tomorrow morning, would you take comfort in knowing it's God's will?? At that point she admitted she hadn't thought of it that way.


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## Mom2baldie

Ms. Mom,

I dont have anything add, but wanted to say I think its a great idea and very sweet of you to do this.


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## iris0110

I wanted to add some things to.

Do remember the father has lost a child as well. Everyone focuses so much energy on the mother, and the mother needs it, but fathers also mourn the loss of their children. Dh was heartbroken when Arawyn died, and he was also so distraught over trying to care for me, that I don't know if his needs were ever really met. Even his own family concentrated more on comforting me. He really could have used more people asking how he was doing or just sitting and talking with him.

I also wanted to add some good gift ideas. I really like the star registry if the child was named, but also donations to special charities in the babies name are great to, maybe a stillbirth awareness organization or a childrens hospital. There are several sites that sell mementos such as birth certificates, and teddy bears designed for greiving parents so those might be good too. www.aplacetoremember.com has a full online store of memorial items for pregnancy and birth loss.

I would also like to reiterate the importance of using the baby's name if he or she was named. And never refer to the miscariage or still birth as an abortion even though that is the medical term, or the phrase I hate "that thing that happened to you."

I think thats about all I have.


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## shannon0218

Excellent point Shannon (other Shannon) I knew I was forgetting something.
I felt so badly for Steve during all of my m/c's, I was not strong enough personally to help him and everyone kind of ignored his feelings about it. I know he was devastated and frankly it didn't come out how devastated he was until we had a completely stupid fight one night and I finally figured out what had him so upset, he cried with me for over an hour and I feel so badly that he didn't feel he could grieve publicly earlier.
Anyone have ideas on a way to help the dads?


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## OceanMomma

I think we should maybe refer to the "father" as the partner as not all non-pregnant partners are male. But yeah. I was thinkng how the other partner who has lost a baby probably is in need of some tlc as well.

One other thing. If they have internet access, direct them to this board.


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## taradt

great idea...

my only comment would be to keep it short and to the point (ie. the top 5 things one can do to help). during my miscarriage i researched and sent my family a long list i found of do's and don'ts thinking it would help. i think there was too much there and it never really got paid attention to, and i think with the negatives listed first everyone was scared to do the wrong thing. so instead of it helping me to not deal with all the comments i got them anyways and was also pissed off by the fact that during my time of grief i did the work they should have done and all for nothing

tara


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## saturnine25

What a wonderful idea.....my ideas have already been suggested, so this will be a bit redundant, but here is my opinion:

DO definitely keep things short and to the point
DO say you're sorry for the loss
DO ask how my husband is feeling
DO tell me that my baby will be remembered and loved

DON'T try to act as though nothing happened
DON'T say you know how I feel unless you've been there
DON'T go on about how horrible this was to have happened
DON'T talk to my child about it without my permission and under my supervision


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## queencarr

Jacque,

What a great idea. We fortunately had very few don'ts, so I will add my do's that I especially appreciated:

DO offer to babysit, esp during labor/delivery and the funeral if there is one
DO keep a list of who brought meals, sent flowers, etc. so that the parents don't have to and thank you's are easier to write (This was a lifesaver for me--I got a neatly organized list of everyone who helped out even though I wasn't there to see who did it. It also reaffirmed to me how much I was loved







) when I needed it
DO bring meals with "comfort foods" and favorites if you know them
DO offer to make the phone calls
DO remember the two best things to say--I'm so sorry and I love you (followed by a hug and kiss if appropriate)
DO say it's okay to be mad/sad/feel like throwing things/jealous of pregnant women or those with newborns
DO offer to help with expenses if appropriate (our church donated the money for our 3 very expensive plane tickets as Samantha's burial was out of state)

and finally, I know different people have different reactions to this, but I got a lot of comfort from people telling me of their own losses. Particularly from some elderly friends--they were 85 at the time--who told me with tears in their eyes that they also lost their second child. It meant a great deal to me that they still remembered her after all these years and that they had survived it.


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## Katana

I just wanted to say I think this is a wonderful, wonderful idea.

And, even though it's already been said, for the do's, do hug and kiss and express words of love to the parents who have lost. I found it really nice to be held, and to feel loved. I felt so lost and like such a child myself, it was so nice to lean on someone stronger.


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## kamilla626




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## babycarrier

I agree with so many of the things already listed. Do remember the partners. I know my dh was mourning and my needs were more readily attended to.
Do know that an early loss is a loss.
It hasn't gone away in a week. Don't act like everything is life as usual.
Do offer to watch any other children and let the parents mourn and rest.
I received two cards. They were sweet and beautiful and validated my feelings. Hug and love the parents and say you are sorry for the loss. Short and sweet words are dear to my heart.
Thanks for starting this thread.


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## gonnabeamom

Do feel free to say

"I'm so sorry for your loss. I can only imagine that this is difficult for you"

"Please know you can talk to me at any time"

"Is there anything I can do? If you think of something later, let me know."

"I was looking forward to meeting your little one, I'm sorry that I won't get that privilege" (I wish someone had said this to me)

"I would like to . . .Take you to a movie next week if you are up to it ...Come for a visit if you are up to it. . .Bring dinner next Wednesday for the family. . .Take your children for the day so you can be alone with your partner if you'd like"

Sometimes it's hard to think of what you want, and an offer with an easy out might be the kindest thing you can do for someone in shock.


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## starfairy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
please don't say that it was all for the best as the baby probably had something wrong with it. or that this was natures way of keeping a less than perfect baby from being born.

the baby was still wanted even if it wasn't "perfect"

This has been SO true for us. We know that our son had severe deformities & that it is likely at least one of the other babies we lost earlier on did as well. It makes no difference AT ALL. We loved & wanted this baby (and the others) & he was beautiful to us despite it. Are we glad he was spared a life of pain? Yes. But we wish we could have been spared the pain of his loss as well. We cant understand why our baby had to be deformed. Why we had to lose our baby. Saying such things are no condolence at all.


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## Arduinna

I'm so sorry Starfairy


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## [email protected]

is it appropriate to send a sympathy card?

what can someone say in a personal note beyond "i'm sorry" ??


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## Ms. Mom

A sympathy card is certainly appropriate.

Speak from your heart. Let them know how much the baby meant and acknowledge their pain.


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## Breathless Wonder

Do acknowledge that the pain doesn't really go away. You just learn to deal with it over time.

Don't say, "Get over it!" or anything to that effect.


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## aja-belly

hey, i wanted to pop in here and say maybe you could add something about further along the line. like remember the birthday in future years, maybe be attentive to when the due date is and if the parents need some extra support then, too. also, remember on mothers/fathers day and other holidays that they may find them difficult and be sensitive to that.

aja


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## OneCatholicMommy

Definitely remember the due date. That was very hard for me.

Also, respect their need for privacy. I don't know if other mothers felt like this, but I just wanted to be left alone. I only wanted to talk to my husband and my mother. I didn't even want my in-laws to come over (and I hope I didn't hurt their feelings, because it turned out that they were very supportive and even paid for the burial costs)

I informed all my friends of the u/s results (no heartbeat at 22 weeks) by email. I just couldn't bear talking to anyone, like I said.

If the mother wants privacy, respect that.


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## jmundie

We just lost our son on Monday and received two very thoughful gifts that I will always cherish. One was a Snowbabies Christmas tree ornament with the year on it. It will be nice to remember our baby every year and to have an annual reminder for our other children and family members. We also received a beautiful keepsake box from the hospital for momentos of Alex, his u/s photos, and notes from friends and family. Prior to this experience, I couldn't imagine an appropriate gift for such a terrible experience. But I will never forget these two gifts and the loving people who gave them to our family.

Jennifer


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## ladylee

Even if a couple was actively trying to conceive prior to the loss, please don't assume they will continue to TTC after the loss. The loss may cause them to not want to try and conceive again.

When I was in the emergency room the attending physician made the "it's nature's way" and "it's sad that some who want a baby so badly loses it and someone that doesn't want one gets one" comments. Neither observation is helpful.


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## dolphinsdive

Please remember how you reacted before experiencing this loss. Before losing my baby I did not react appropriately and know my thoughts were just plain ignorant. It is important to remember, that unless you have had this experience you don't know what to say or react to feelings you have never experienced.
The most painful issue for me is that I feel plagued. Know one really talks to me about the situation. I really want and need to talk. All of the don'ts you have mention are at times painful, but the most painful comments are the ones that don't acknowledge your loss, ie you can try again, it's natures way, &#8230; I just want my loss to be acknowledge and someone to listen to my pain.


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## Storm Bride

I've had three miscarriages, and the single thing that helped most (aside from quiet hugs) was a gift from my friend after the first one. She managed to hit on something absolutely perfect for me - it was a bit of a surprise as she's never been pregnant and isn't ever planning to be.

Two days after I lost the baby, I met her for coffee after work (she's always been my main shoulder to cry on). As soon as I sat down, she gave me a soft stuffed dog, and said "I thought it might help you to have something to cuddle". I actually burst into tears in the restaurant, but it helped - a lot. And, it helped with the next two miscarriages, too.

I didn't get much of the "it's God's will", but I did get a _lot_ of "oh, well - at least you have one child already". It made me feel somewhat homicidal, to be honest.


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## Ms. Mom

What beautiful heart felt responses. It's so touching when someone close to us can reach out like that.

I was in an infertility group and got a lot of "at least you can GET pregnant". I know these women were feeling very lost, but they hurt me so deeply.


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## Storm Bride

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ms. Mom*
I was in an infertility group and got a lot of "at least you can GET pregnant". I know these women were feeling very lost, but they hurt me so deeply.

I spent over three years trying to get pregnant with my second baby, then lost it. I got pregnant again in six months, and was over the moon - then lost that one, as well. My next baby was with a different father, and I got pregnant the first time we had sex (bit of a shock, really - all the trouble I'd been having). Well, I lost that one, too. By that point, my first child was seven-years-old, and people giving me the "well, at least you know you can have kids" bit was a little hard to take!

I have a beautiful two-year-old, and am due again in July. But, you don't just "get over" losing your babies. It still hurts.


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## warriorprincess

I second a live plant. Every time someone has brought us cut flowers. My older kids say, "These are going to wilt and die, just like our baby".

And never, ever tell some one to be thankfuk for the kids they already have. Of course I am, but I wanted this one too.


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## coralsmom

My input is this...

If you see the woman (and/or their partner) this has happened to, make an effort to talk to her, in a private, appropriate place, take her hand, and look her in the eye, and let her know that you care about what has happened to her, her partner, and importantly, the baby. Say the baby's name!!! _Acknowledge_ the baby's place on this earth!!! Say how much the baby will be missed by you!

Take the initiative- if you don't know if there is a specific place to send a donation, choose your own and tell the parents, or make an action in memory of the baby and then tell the parents... a friend from out-of-state wrote to tell me she had planted spring bulbs in honor of Coral- I know she did it, and I think Coral knows too! It meant so much to me.

If you send a sympathy card, write something that is specific to you- make it sound meaningful and meant for especially for them- mention the baby!!

We appreciate and appreciated any card, conversation, gift, etc. no matter how small or generic- but the ones that really meant the most were the ones that were said with meaning. We felt the difference in our hearts.


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## kaspar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OneCatholicMommy*
Also, respect their need for privacy. I don't know if other mothers felt like this, but I just wanted to be left alone. I only wanted to talk to my husband and my mother. I didn't even want my in-laws to come over (and I hope I didn't hurt their feelings, because it turned out that they were very supportive and even paid for the burial costs)

I informed all my friends of the u/s results (no heartbeat at 22 weeks) by email. I just couldn't bear talking to anyone, like I said.

If the mother wants privacy, respect that.

i second this emotion. one of the original "do's" was "Bring up the baby - you won't cause them to be sad, they're already sad and need to talk about it" and all i could think on reading that was no!! i don't want to talk about it, or if i do i'll choose when and with who. there's nothing worse than being badgered about how you "need to talk" about things when you don't want to.

sorry, that sounded a little angry... it's a sore point with me. in my experience, the people who push you to talk about any particular difficult experience are the people who know the least about it. so if the parents want to talk, then talk; if they don't, please please please respect that too...


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## jukebox

No matter how much you feel that the circumstances of the pregnancy weren't ideal, "You should've had an abortion anyway" is never okay.

That should really be obvious, but I got that at least three or four times after I lost my sons.


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## relatta

I just wanted to thank all of you for sharing what was helpful/hurtful in your grieving process. One of my dearest friends just lost her little twins, Carynne and Lucas, at 24 weeks gestation. When I was feeling concerned about what to send her, I knew I could come to mothering.com to find advice from wonderful, loving mamas.

My heart goes out to all of you. And thank you again for taking the time to share your experiences so that others like me could be more supportive for their loved ones during such a painful time.

-Rachel


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## HoosierDiaperinMama

I wanted to add to this thread. I was going to post something elsewhere about this very same thing b/c of something that happened to me at a birthday party last night. I don't know if this has already been posted, but it bears repeating.

People who have lost a child and are grieving need to be spoken to. We are humans and should not be made to feel like outcasts. Do not walk by us with your head down, smile, and say nothing. Acknowledge us. More importantly, SPEAK! Say anything. You could compliment us on a shirt we have on or maybe you think we've lost weight. You don't have to ask about our loss, but simply speaking to us is enough.


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## PennyRoo

Thank you for this thread. Reading many of your thoughts brought me to tears. I have never experienced this type of loss but my sister (older, first pregnancy) recently did and I have watched helplessly as she has battled the anguish and pain she feels. Her due date is coming up fast and I would like to do something special to mark it. I do not know the gender of the baby nor whether she has named it - she has a very difficult time discussing it at all, which, obviously I have respected while telling here I am here to listen if she needs me. If any of you mamas have thoughts about what I could do to mark the date in a special, but not presumptuous or cheesy, way, I would really appreciate it. She lives far from me and is not big on discussing the loss, so I'm envisioning sending her something in the mail. Thanks in advance -I am so sorry for all of you who have lost little ones.


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## asoulunbound

I am grateful for this thread... I am so confused right now. My friend lost her baby Julia at 5 months (first preg). My friend was in a car accident and was born that night, I don't know the details. Anyway, she was a single mama and young (18 like me), and Julia lived in the NICU for about a week and a half, two weeks tops. I have fallen out of touch with this friend in the last year or two, but I was really excited for her when she told me. We were going to throw her a shower next month if she made it that far because she had some spotting early on and a lot of pain. We thought she had a miscarriage, but then Julia survived! I was so excited for her! Her family history is full of eventful births, I understand.
It's so hard for me, because I am not extremely close to her (but I'd like to try to be close to her again).
I am also scared because my mother had several miscarriages and one baby (Paul) that was a preemie with trisomy 13 and died at two months in my mum's arms when I was young (3 yrs). I am not married, but I'm so scared of losing a baby already... so my friend losing her baby brought all that back up for me.
I know she must be hurting, but I don't know how to respond without overshadowing her grief with mine. I already had a good cry for her when we thought she miscarried, and another one for her when Julia died.
I want to get in touch with her, but I'm feeling such guilt over not talking to her more before this happened, and then not ever going to see Julia in the NICU or anything, and then not calling her since then (we mainly keep in touch over myspace).
Any thoughts?


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## grooveemom

THis is a great idea. Part of me wanted to get so angry with people, thinking how stupid they are because they would say and do such dumb stuff. Another part of me realises that they don't actually know what to say or do and are rather awkward with the whole thing.

I agree with everything everyone has said so far.

I would also say to those wanting to offer words of comfort ...... rather be honest that you don't know what to say. Or that you feel awkward. Instead of talking absolute rubbish and saying something that as a grieving parent one would find hurtful or upsetting.


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## Grieving Sister

Hello. I have been reading all of the messages and I see that this is a site for grieving parents or how to help grieving parents for pregancy and birth loss, but I am desperate for help. 6 weeks ago my 35 year old brother was diagnosed with a rare form of Cardiac Sarcoma that has spread to his brain, stomach and liver and he has been given a few months to live. My dad is devastated. He is forever changed, obviously. As I was reading the postings other members have left, I can relate to some of the "don'ts". I can't tell you how many people told my family that , "God has a plan". I understand that people don't know what to say, but this just infuriated me. What kind of God takes people so abruptly and painfully?

But, I need advice on how to help my dad. We would talk a few times a week about life (he lives 1200 miles away). Now, when we talk, it's a very short and sweet phone call. I don't know what to say to him. I feel guilty if I have something good to tell him about my 1 year old son. I could really use some advice on how to help him and also deal with my grief as well.

Thank you
Grieving Sister


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## oregongirlie

I once brought a grieving friend a dessert she loves and she said it helped a lot.


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## Organicavocado

Two girlfriends of mine pitched in and bought me a beautiful little wood box with the babe's initials engraved on it. I put in my pregnancy tests, ultrasounds, medical stuff, sympathy cards, OPKs, everything, it gives me something physical to hold


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## YinYang

So a really good friend of mine just lost a baby about 36 hours after the birth. She said that she had nothing left but God... I said, you also have your husband and your two beautiful girls. I said this along with plenty of other conversation about her darling son and his loss (so I wasn't ignoring that).

That said, I've read all over this thread about NOT saying anything about the other children. I've not been in this position before but I still feel that it was alright to mention the husband and other children when she felt that she had nothing but God.

Would you all let me honestly know if this is still NOT a good way to mention the other children? No matter what, i won't beat myself up --- I do come from a position of love here. But I would like to understand better the idea of not mentioning the other children.

I whole-heartedly understand NOT saying "well at least you have the other children" and I whole-heartedly (to the best of my ability) understand not diminishing the baby's death but I guess that aside from this, I'm not understanding why we shouldn't bring up the other children.... Please help educate me to be more sensitive to my friend's needs.

Thanks in advance.


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## Chug-a-Pug

What kinds of things would be appropriate to do when the due date arrives? Especially the first time (as in, not an anniversary but the actual day, month, and year that the baby was supposed to be born).

If you haven't said anything after a friend had a m/c, would it be appropriate to send something for the anniversary a few years later? Honestly, I'm scared of "opening up the wounds" that may have begun to heal over. But having been blessed with nothing but live, healthy children, I don't know. What do you suggest?

By the way, these are two different people I'm talking about. One whose baby died last month and one whose baby died 2 years ago.


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## Chug-a-Pug

Anyone care to answer my and a few other posters' questions?


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## Chug-a-Pug

Anyone?


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## SweetTeach

Quote:

That said, I've read all over this thread about NOT saying anything about the other children. I've not been in this position before but I still feel that it was alright to mention the husband and other children when she felt that she had nothing but God.

Would you all let me honestly know if this is still NOT a good way to mention the other children? No matter what, i won't beat myself up --- I do come from a position of love here. But I would like to understand better the idea of not mentioning the other children.

I whole-heartedly understand NOT saying "well at least you have the other children" and I whole-heartedly (to the best of my ability) understand not diminishing the baby's death but I guess that aside from this, I'm not understanding why we shouldn't bring up the other children.... Please help educate me to be more sensitive to my friend's needs.
First of all, what was her response when you said that to her? You don't mention it here. Honestly, I would imagine that right now she truly feels as if she wants to die and it doesn't matter to her that she has a husband or other children. It is a truly unbearable pain to have your child die and if you try to keep reminding her about the other things/people she has in her life, she probably feels like she can't be honest with you about how she feels. It probably makes _you_ feel better to keep reminding her that she has other people in her life, though.

She knows this on an intellectual level, but she has to go through this very deep emotional abyss that frankly, no one can understand unless they've gone through it themselves. So, if I were in your shoes, instead of trying to refute was she's saying, I'd listen and say something like: "I can imagine why you feel that way. This is a horrific tragedy to endure. I will stand by your side and listen to you as you try to find your way through this." And someone needs to step in and try and help her with her other children so she can find some kind of space to grieve.

Thanks for caring and taking care of her.


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## SweetTeach

Quote:

If you haven't said anything after a friend had a m/c, would it be appropriate to send something for the anniversary a few years later? Honestly, I'm scared of "opening up the wounds" that may have begun to heal over. But having been blessed with nothing but live, healthy children, I don't know. What do you suggest?
A card or note expressing your regret for not acknowledging it sooner and that you are thinking about her at this time? Then, she can respond if she chooses to or not.

HTH.


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## Chug-a-Pug

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ST* 
A card or note expressing your regret for not acknowledging it sooner and that you are thinking about her at this time? Then, she can respond if she chooses to or not.

HTH.

Thanks, great idea!


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## Avena

I'm so grateful for finding this right now, my dear friend just gave birth and the baby passed on, I'm in shock.....


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## GreenAmber

Everyone is afraid of saying the wrong thing. So often we don't say anything when something tragic happens to a friend.

I did what people to acknowledge the baby's due date. A card or flowers or a dessert or even a "Hey, I was thinking about the baby that you lost. He would have been born around this time, right?" A general "how are you doing" to too vague unless you really are just asking to be polite. I want people to bring up the miscarriage. I can't do it. I want my friends with babies to say, "I can see this is hard for you right now. Is it difficult for you to sit here with me and my baby? You know I care about you and our friendship." When nobody says anything is the worst.

I don't think it is too late to say something like, "you know when you had your miscarriage 2 years ago, I didn't respond very well to you. I just wanted to say that I haven't forgotten your loss. How are you doing now?" Cause every anniversary brings it up anyway. The only difference is that no one else remembers but the parents.


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## PrayinFor12

I have a particularly odd one:

"Don't question whether it really happened." OR "Do believe every detail."

(I have this one b/c my loss was very early on and I never took a HPT. I have no "proof.")


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## Girlprof

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chug-a-Pug* 
What kinds of things would be appropriate to do when the due date arrives? Especially the first time (as in, not an anniversary but the actual day, month, and year that the baby was supposed to be born).

If you haven't said anything after a friend had a m/c, would it be appropriate to send something for the anniversary a few years later? Honestly, I'm scared of "opening up the wounds" that may have begun to heal over. But having been blessed with nothing but live, healthy children, I don't know. What do you suggest?

By the way, these are two different people I'm talking about. One whose baby died last month and one whose baby died 2 years ago.

I'd be thrilled if anyone remembered. Flowers or a card would be great. For a recent loss, a prepared meal would be fantastic. Even just a hand squeeze and recognition of the date over a cup of coffee would be super. I'm not far enough out to see if the problem of opening up the wounds would actually be relevant, but I sort of doubt it.

Sarah


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## normajean

I think grief is different for everyone. I know that for each of the three babies I've lost, the feelings and extent of grief were different. I've had different ways of coming to understanding of what happened, and that acceptance varies on the day, even years later.

I had some mixed feelings about whether to post about this, but finally decided it might be helpful for me to explore my feelings about what has helped, and what has hurt in the past. And with how many people have called or written saying "I don't know what to say, I wish I did,"

What to Say
Saying you don't know what to say is one of the best things you can say. There is no inherent judgment, no trite platitudes, nothing insensitive about admitting you just don't know and don't understand how they are feeling. It's not something that words can express even for those who are going through it.

Listening rather than talking is a good idea. For me, hearing stories of others' experiences with pregnancy loss is also helpful.

What not to Say
Questions about the physical process can feel invasive of both the physical and emotional experience of losing a child. If I want to share, I will. If I don't, I'd rather not be asked and have the awkward experience of trying to politely get out of the question, or feel I have to share something personal with someone I'm not comfortable with. If I want to talk about it, listen. If I don't bring it up, don't you bring it up either, please.

Don't question choices about medical care. Since I chose an "alternative" venue to have my baby, and ultimately, my miscarriage, I inevitably hear comments about whether I should really go to the hospital, "just to make sure" or raised eyebrows that I'm taking herbs instead of pain killers and sedatives. I'm a big girl, I can take care of myself & take responsibility for my choices. Without doubt the quality of care I've had has been better than when I miscarried in the hospital and was forced to sign a paper acknowledging I'd had an "abortion" and grief counseling that entailed a pamphlet being shoved in my face. My ability to accept the death of my child lies in my ability to trust my body, God, and the natural processes of life and death. Being in an institution with wires in my arm just doesn't compare to being in the arms of those that love me, and being treated by my midwife as if I am the only person in the world.

Don't compare the physical experience of a miscarriage and recovery to recovery from having a baby. This brings up the intense feeling of loss, because there's not a baby anywhere around. Giving birth is surrounded by euphoria that colors memory of what birth & recovery is like. Labor and delivery of a dead child, or one who is known won't survive, is acutely painful, without the excited endorphins and "feel good" hormones associated with birth.

Don't use trite platitudes. Don't say it was God's will, or that its better to happen now than a year from now. (If God said he was going to take your child, but you had the choice of now or a year from now, which would you choose? Would you rather give up your younger child & keep your older child?)

Don't say that she is young or that she can always have another baby. This is not always the case, and even if she is young and fertile, it's a baby, not a new car.

Don't marginalize her feelings. Whether she was 6 weeks along or 26 weeks along, she has suffered a loss.

Don't tell her that God needed her baby more or that it's a blessing in disguise because the baby would have had special needs.

Don't bring politics into it. She does not care where you stand on the issues of abortion or fetal rights or at what point life begins. Do not tell her that her baby was not a "real" baby.

Don't send a Get Well card. She is not sick. She has lost her baby. If you do want to send something, a short note expressing your sympathies and prayers is appropriate.

Don't play the guilt card. The vast majority of miscarriages have nothing to do with anything the mother did, and speculating about whether she should have had that latte or not will not help her heal.

Don't tell her to move on. Everyone grieves differently, and if it takes her a week, a month or a year, it's her own business.

Don't question her judgement when it comes to her treatment or recovery or when it is OK to start trying for another baby. Those are decisions better left to the mother and her doctors.

Don't pretend nothing has happened. Even if you don't know what to say, acknowledge her loss.

Don't say "at least you have other children," or "You can try again." One child does not replace another! Having other children also carries the responsibility of being sure those other children are coping & cared for during the entire ordeal, it doesn't necessarily make things easier.

What to Do
Understand that Dad & the kids are upset too and need support, phone calls, and listening ears. And since Dad and the kiddos are also grieving, mom needs extra support because those closest to her are working to resolve their own emotions.

Offer to pick things up at the store, watch children, and deliver older children to and from school or extracurricular activities. When mom is able to get up and around, invite her to things so she can get out of the house.

Get the word around about what has happened. There's nothing worse than 2 months after losing a baby having someone ask you how the pregnancy is going. Help the family out by spreading the news that the baby has been lost. This spares the family from awkward questions at church or in the community.

Offer to make phone calls. Offer to call the church to schedule meals, offer to call the school to let teachers know why a child may be upset or absent. Offer to call friends & family as breaking the news can be very hard for the family to do themselves.

What not to Do
Don't cry, at least not in front of the grieving family. This places the burden of your grief on them, and puts them in the position of comforting you. We are dealing with so many emotions, having those of others projected onto us is upsetting and difficult to deal with. Getting a little misty is one thing, walking in the door sobbing is another. Don't visit until you can compose yourself enough to be a true source of support.

If your offers of help aren't accepted, don't be offended. Often friends & family are very upset too, and try to resolve dissonance over this by helping. Don't make offers of help that are based on your own grief--don't offer to do something because it will help you feel better. Genuine offers of help & support are welcome, cathartic help for you should be oriented toward a community cause like volunteering at a hospital or a rest home. If you feel you need to help so that you will feel better about what has happened this comes through in your offer. And sometimes help isn't wanted simply because we want to get back into the groove of our lives. While someone does my work, I'm left to sit there with nothing to do but think. Sometimes mundane chores help you not think when you want a break from your thoughts.

Don't overstay. For me, those people I want around know who they are-because I called them myself and asked them to come. I appreciate visits from others, but I don't want to play hostess. I have no interest in feeding people, worrying about whether there's shampoo in every bathroom, or providing entertainment. An hour or two is plenty. Leave at dinner time. Call before you come. The family needs alone time and privacy to grieve, no matter how close to them you are.

What to Send
Meals for a day or two are welcome and appreciated. Food always tastes better when someone else cooks it, even if its just a grilled cheese sandwich. It's a good idea when you send a meal, to send it in disposable dishes so they don't have to be returned. It's hard to keep track of whose pan is whose, so label everything you want back!

Emails are really nice, because they can be read and either kept or deleted easily. And if they are unintentionally deleted, they can be brought back from the trash. It's nice to be able to move on when you want to, or save things that were particularly special.

Flowers are nice because they fade out and die gradually, just as the pain of grief lessens over time. Potted plants are nice because they live on, just as the love for the one you lost lives on.

Letters & greeting cards are something to be careful with. Beware of cards that have platitudes about God's will-it may be something we have to come to terms with, but not because a card told us to do it! Consider what you say in a note just as you would what you would say in person, if not more so because its harder to throw away a card or letter, and finding one years later can bring back a lot of pain.


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## dara00

I asked if my friend got to hold her baby who was just recently delivered very early and did not make it - not sure whether it was ever alive after the delivery - and she got very upset at me and said I should not badger her with inappropriate comments or questions. Was I wrong to ask that question? (obviously she didn't want to answer, but was it really inappropriate?)


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## youthpastormama

Here's another what not to say:

"Well, you're much older now and it's not as easy."

I know how old I am. And being ten years younger wouldn't make me miss my baby any less.


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## two_sets_of_twins

I know others have said it, but I am so grateful for this sticky. My cousin lost her baby on her due date today (in utero) and I'm having a terrible time processing it. We were not extremely close, but I work as a birth doula and childbirth educator so I see birth on a regular basis; I knew I would eventually grieve with someone, I just had NO idea it would be so hard! I had tentatively planned on attending her birth, but she wanted to keep the birth private.

I appreciate your list and am compiling and emailing or printing it for family and friends close to them. Thank you so much for sharing your emotions regarding your loss. I take comfort in having some idea of how I can help them.


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## Mommy of Izzy

A hard comment for me was to hear that "Everything happens for a reason". Everything doesn't happen for a reason, there is never a reason for loosing your baby.

Thank you for putting this together. I think this is a great idea. Simply put, there really isn't any right thing to say.


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## Nora_SEA

I was glad to find this thread tonight. A friend of mine just lost her baby boy 45 minutes after delivery 2 nights ago. I was so looking forward to meeting him and cannot imagine the pain her and her husband are in. I'm going to visit her tomorrow...and know what I will most certainly NOT say. Thanks.


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## mamacita angelica

when i lost my daughter, my beautiful amazing sil sent me a package from earth mama, angel baby. i cried when i received it; it was just so thoughtful. my package had votive candles, no more milk tea, the healing heart hot pack, and seeds of hope.
http://www.earthmamaangelbaby.com/pr..._baby_loss.php

particularly, the no more milk tea was an awesome gift. it acknowledged that i still had a baby, and was postpartum. i brewed a cup every two hours for the two weeks, and i kept the healing heart on my contracting uterus for a couple of days. i am still keeping the votives going in my house for my daughter. i have been thinking about and planning lucia's garden for the spring. anyway, just an idea if you want to send something to a good friend or loved one.


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## mamareads

Don't know if this has already been mentioned, but my friend said she found comfort in this community:

http://www.glowinthewoods.com/


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## TTC Catholic

Good morning,

It's been almost six months since DH & I lost our baby, Aiden Taylor Cortez. We knew to be prepared for people saying the wrong things, not knowing what to say, etc. What blindsided us was a group of former friends of ours (a family and a friend of theirs, who is estranged from his own family & leeches on to this family because he doesn't have anyone else in his life).

Within days of the miscarriage, it started. I was chastised by a woman in this family for the name my husband & I chose for our baby. Then, over the next couple of months, she and her husband, sister-in-law, brother-in-law, mother-in-law, and the friend of theirs who leeches on to their family sent e-mails verbally attacking my mom, my sisters (including a deceased sister), the baby I lost, and of course, me. They took the tragedy of my child's death and turned it into a mockery, as well as a source of entertainment, as they used it to feed their need for gossip, drama, and self-righteousness.

Their harassment & threats became so bad that I had to report it to the police. The only person in this family who had not been a problem is one of the brothers in this family, whose son was my godson. He & his wife, who were very close to my family, shut us out of their lives. In fact, this man called me and had the audacity to scold me like a child for reporting his sister, brother-in-law, and leech of a friend to the police. I reported them because they posed a threat to my family, as well as to myself. Protecting my family trumps adhering to their wishes.

Although I was protected by my local PD, I had no way to protect anything they did online. These people posted painful things surrounding my miscarriage on Facebook (and they do have public profiles, so anyone who wants to read about it is able to do so). Although I blocked these people from my e-mail, Facebook, and MySpace, they have still posted terrible things about my family & me, mainly on Facebook. I have e-mailed Facebook administrators about the situation & asked them to remove such slander from these pages, but since everything is automated, I have been unable to get that issue resolved.

I have learned that the tragedy of a miscarriage can bring out the worst in some people, even those you think would be the last people to hurt you. My mom gave me a book called Silent Grief by Clara Hinton. It is an amazing resource for anyone who has been through child loss. In reading this book, I learned that it is actually not that uncommon for people to not only not understand or know what to say, but to be unbelievably cruel following such a loss.

I realize the blessing in disguise in all of this is that I learned these people's true colors and found it was best to dis-associate from these people and their toxic behavior.

Although these people feel they are incapable of any wrongdoing and will never think in their minds that they did anything wrong, and thus will never apologize, I have found through much prayer to slowly let go of the anger and hurt these people have tried so hard to inflict upon me, especially since they tried to take advantage of a painful situation in my life to do so.

I have found the best way I can handle how these people have treated my family and me is praying for them and praying for the ability to forgive them. Forgiveness is incredibly powerful, yet very humbling at the same time.

I apologize for venting, and I appreciate you listening to my story. When you deal with such a devastating loss, you expect those who supposedly care for you to be there for you. And aside from this group of people whose behavior has been absolutely ugly and simply despicable, I have had plenty of family, true friends, and even people I hardly know (i.e., online friends, friends of family, friends of friends, etc.) show me tremendous love, prayer, fellowship, and support during this painful time.

Sadly, when dealing with child loss, you almost have to expect the unexpected and be prepared to see the true colors of certain people whom you never thought would turn on you. I hope and pray that is not the case, and I sincerely don't mean anything negative. You will also find it can bring out the best in those who truly love you.

If you are dealing with a difficult situation regarding how others react or treat you when you are going through such a painful time, I am more than happy to listen to you, offer up prayers for you, and help you in any way I can. You are welcome to send me a Private Message here or send me an e-mail to [email protected].

Take care, and God bless you,

~ Kristin Cortez


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## Mrs. Treffinger

My husband and I recently lost our first child at 8 weeks...

The phone calls were the worse. All day long, how are you? How are you feeling? It will be ok. God has a plan. It just wasn't your time. There was probably something wrong with the baby. At least you know you can get pregnant. You are young, it will happen when the time is right.

All of these are terrible things to say to a couple who has just lost the child they wanted so bad. You need to remember that the heart begins to beat a few weeks into a woman's pregnancy and that child is alive and growing and we feel that beautiful life forming inside of us.

Suggestions:
I received many cards that just said "We love you" and that was absolutely perfect. I also received flowers from an out of town friend with a card that said they were just a phone call away and they loved us. Hugging someone and just being silent says more than words. Let her speak to you if she wants to and just listen. Your words can be so hurtful, especially to a woman with raging hormones. Simply be comforting and not expressive. Thank you.


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## Rhiannon09

Don't compliment someone on her "cute baby bump" if you know she's having a miscarriage.

Not likely to to make her feel better.


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## pink gal

When we lost our son a dear friend who had also lost a son gave me a cd of "comfort music" and a figurine of a baby sleeping on a cloud. One of the best things was that she also brought a small gift for my 6 year old DD, a dot to dot book and some pretty hair clips. It gave her something to do and a reminder that it was okay for her to enjoy herself again even when we were all grieving.

But the best thing of all was that she just hung out with us and listened. She didn't try to fix anything or cheer us up. She just was present with us while we grieved.


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## anne-girl

Do: admit it if you have no idea what to say. "I'm so sorry; I don't know what else to say" may seem dumb to you, but it's more honest and real than trying to come up with a comforting platitude that might not comfort. Besides, sometimes there really isn't anything to say. (Although my best friend saying over the phone "I wish I could hug you right now" was lovely, I must admit!)

Do: recover if you think you've said something insensitive. The first week I was back at church, a friend who hadn't heard came up with a grin and said "You don't even look pregnant!" I was surprised how calm I was when I said "That's because I'm not anymore." She burst into tears, gave me a hug, and apologized for saying something so insensitive; then she proceeded to tell me how her twins had been triplets, but she had lost one early on. It was such a helpful connection that the blunder didn't hurt at all.

Do: offer to help spread the word, especially if you have a lot of mutual friends/family connections. Announcing your pregnancy is great fun; announcing your loss sucks. It's much harder to tell someone than to acknowledge what someone else told them.

Do: offer concrete help. Not "let me know if I can help" but "Can I bring dinner over for you next Wednesday?" (and make it clear you won't stay long). If it's easier to say yes, people won't feel guilty for accepting the help.

Do: let them know you're listening if they want to talk. Don't badger, but tell them that whenever they need to talk, you're willing to listen.

Do: try to find out if flowers and plants will cause allergy problems. My DH was sick for weeks, and we didn't realize what the issue was until we tossed the last of the flowers. If we'd received any plants he might have stayed sick. You can't know until you try, but they may already know what flowers they can or cannot handle. If you're not sure, avoid common culprits (anything heavily fragranced, like orchids or lilies).

Do: send a gift in lieu of flowers/plants. I got a Willow Creek figurine from colleagues; I normally am not crazy about those, but it was perfect. We also got this silly motorized dog that flops its ears and plays "Sugar pie honey bunch" when you press its paw (from an aunt and uncle for Valentine's day). Sometimes laughter is a welcome break. We also got tix to a hockey game from a colleague who had lost two children; mindless entertainment was a great distraction. Grieving is hard work, and a break from it is a good thing now and then (provided the couple is receptive to it--there's no harm in asking).

Do: consider whether they would appreciate a book regarding pregnancy/infant loss. If you think they might, it's a good idea to get a recommendation from a friend who has been through it. I got books on loan from the funeral which were immensely helpful; a few people recommended some helpful titles as well. Keep in mind that not everybody wants to work through their grief in that particular way, though.

Do: let them know, months later, that you're still thinking about their loss (or praying for them if that's your background). It seems more real when you know that people realize it's still hard a long while later.


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## justKate

I just came to this forum to look for how to deal with a difficult work situation. I'm a referee in unemployment appeal hearings. I'm often told personal things during the course of the hearing, but am not permitted to give any response that could give the appearance of impropriety or a preference for one party over the other. Today a woman told me she was upset at work because she had just lost her baby, and I didn't know what to say. I told her that I was sorry for her loss, and that I couldn't imagine how hard it must be for her. The words didn't seem like enough, but I was afraid to say too much. After reading all of your posts here, I think I have a better idea of how to respond.

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts on something so personal. I'm really sorry that you've lost your children.


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