# Dorsal hood/chordee info/support?



## GutInstinct (Jan 5, 2008)

I need some guidance here.

DS was born in November, totally healthy. We opted against the Vitamin K shot after extensive research. Hospital wouldn't circ because of "possible blood clotting problems" because we declined Vitamin K. Fine by us, we thought.

Two or three weeks later, we visited a pediatrician who performs circs (not our ped, because he would have sent us to our original OB, whom we despise). So here we are at the special pediatrician, and he points out, "Whoa, there might be a possible hypospadias here. You need to see a pediatric urologist. I can't circumsize until he gets checked out."

[Insert a THANK GOD this didn't happen and it gave me more time to research and learn just why circs are bad!!!]

A few months after that, we arrive at the pediatric urologist. I am now EDUCATED about why circs are bad and will not be allowing it to happen. We're only there to check out this potential hypospadias. The doctor says it seems mild, but to come back when he's about 7 or 8 months. He says he does not want to circ DS until he's older and they can definitively check on the hypospadias.

Which brings us to today, and the pediatric urologist says, "Definitely no hypospadias. Everything looks great!"

[Yay!]

But, he also says, because he has a dorsal hood (think of a v-neck instead of a turtleneck!), it could lead to chordee.

[Ugh.]

So he then proceeds to tell us that he recommends surgery. This includes a circumcision where they pull back the skin, artificially force an erection, determine whether there is a slight bend to the penis. If not, they will cut the foreskin. If there is a bend, they will put "two small stitches" to help it not curve as he grows. And of course, all of this while he is under anesthesia.

Now, my "gut instinct" says to leave his penis alone.

But what if we do nothing and he has this little penis that bends and it interferes with his sex life later on?

Everything else is ok with him, health-wise. But do we leave his "unique" foreskin which might lead to a "chordee" condition? Or do we cut his "unique" skin and later find out there really WAS no chordee and we put him through all that for nothing? I guess the doc can't determine the chordee situation until he's in surgery. And I really don't want to circ anyway.

I guess we could wait til DS is 3 or 4 and check whether there is a curve. If not, then we don't have to do anything. If so, then we can determine what to do then. But honestly, I wish we didn't have to worry about this at all.

My head hurts.


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## Katerz2u (Jul 14, 2006)

I would leave him alone and let him decide when hes older.


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## perspective (Nov 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GutInstinct* 
I need some guidance here.

DS was born in November, totally healthy. We opted against the Vitamin K shot after extensive research. Hospital wouldn't circ because of "possible blood clotting problems" because we declined Vitamin K. Fine by us, we thought.

Two or three weeks later, we visited a pediatrician who performs circs (not our ped, because he would have sent us to our original OB, whom we despise). So here we are at the special pediatrician, and he points out, "Whoa, there might be a possible hypospadias here. You need to see a pediatric urologist. I can't circumsize until he gets checked out."

[Insert a THANK GOD this didn't happen and it gave me more time to research and learn just why circs are bad!!!]

A few months after that, we arrive at the pediatric urologist. I am now EDUCATED about why circs are bad and will not be allowing it to happen. We're only there to check out this potential hypospadias. The doctor says it seems mild, but to come back when he's about 7 or 8 months. He says he does not want to circ DS until he's older and they can definitively check on the hypospadias.

Which brings us to today, and the pediatric urologist says, "Definitely no hypospadias. Everything looks great!"

[Yay!]

But, he also says, because he has a dorsal hood (think of a v-neck instead of a turtleneck!), it could lead to chordee.

[Ugh.]

So he then proceeds to tell us that he recommends surgery. This includes a circumcision where they pull back the skin, artificially force an erection, determine whether there is a slight bend to the penis. If not, they will cut the foreskin. If there is a bend, they will put "two small stitches" to help it not curve as he grows. And of course, all of this while he is under anesthesia.

Now, my "gut instinct" says to leave his penis alone.

But what if we do nothing and he has this little penis that bends and it interferes with his sex life later on?

Everything else is ok with him, health-wise. But do we leave his "unique" foreskin which might lead to a "chordee" condition? Or do we cut his "unique" skin and later find out there really WAS no chordee and we put him through all that for nothing? I guess the doc can't determine the chordee situation until he's in surgery. And I really don't want to circ anyway.

I guess we could wait til DS is 3 or 4 and check whether there is a curve. If not, then we don't have to do anything. If so, then we can determine what to do then. But honestly, I wish we didn't have to worry about this at all.

My head hurts.









What does circumcising him have to do with anything? From how you described it, it seemed they would check for chordee, and if it was present then they would put in two small stitches. I see no reason why the foreskin would need to be cut off to complete this surgery. Can you explain this a little more?


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## Claire and Boys (Mar 27, 2007)

Yeah, the urologist is definitely cut happy. There isn't a problem with his penis now, except for a mild cosmetic foreskin issue, that isn't interfering with urinating. I agree with pp, I'd leave it well alone and see what HE wants to do with it. I don't see that the surgery would be worth the risk of the anaesthetic when they don't even know if it is a problem yet or not.


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## GutInstinct (Jan 5, 2008)

He described it as the dorsal hood being "uneven" and that would lead to more crookedness as he matures. Or something like that. So they WOULD want to cut it anyway, but then again, I am so confused.

My gut instinct says to leave it alone...and see what happens in a few years.

Why mess with my perfectly healthy little boy? But even though I know these things, it's SO hard when you're the parent and the doctor is lecturing you. So hard. I could cry.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Of all the hypo cases with hooded foreskin I have heard of here I have never heard a dr say that having a hood might cause chordee. I think the Dr. was just blowing smoke.

If it does become a problem for him later on he can get it fixed. There is no need to do it now. Chordee is only a problem anyway if it is so severe that intercourse is compromised and I dont see how that will be a problem at all for your ds or you would see the bend without pulling on the skin.


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## Yulia_R (Jan 7, 2006)

AND with all those doctors involved, please make sure you read this

*A Warning For Parents of Intact Sons* http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=129378


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## PuppyFluffer (Mar 18, 2002)

Your gut instinct is THE thing I would listen to first and foremost. It is there for a reason. I cannot stress this enough.

I am guessing that with all the diaper changes in this child's future, you will be able to see an erection and see if there is bending of the penis.

Is it possible to locate information from European doctors on the dorsal hooded penis as they are not a cut happy culture and I suspect have a very different take on it.


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## Fellow Traveler (Jan 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GutInstinct* 
He described it as the dorsal hood being "uneven" and that would lead to more crookedness as he matures. Or something like that. So they WOULD want to cut it anyway, but then again, I am so confused.

My gut instinct says to leave it alone...and see what happens in a few years.

Why mess with my perfectly healthy little boy? But even though I know these things, it's SO hard when you're the parent and the doctor is lecturing you. So hard. I could cry.

I am not sure what to advice other than leave it be but you know if you want you could give NOCIRC a call and see if they can give you some advice or refer you to a recommended Dr for a second opinion.

ETA: I am also not sure what the foreskin would have to do with this. I'll be thinking about it and see if I can think of something more.


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## Night_Nurse (Nov 23, 2007)

My advice is to trust your gut and leave him alone. Then in around 6 months or so, you can find a completely new specialist and get a second opinion and go from there. It is always prudent to get a second opinion before any procedure, especially since doctors here love to circ (I'm assuming you're in the US).

Fwiw- I dated a man years ago who had a considerable bend to the left. It never hurt him physically and I had nothing to complain about either.









Good luck to you and your son!


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## Microsoap (Dec 29, 2005)

He's not even a sexual active adult and won't be for 18 years. This doctor has no idea if the penis will bend to a point where sex would be uncomfortable/impossible.

Remember: surgery = cutting nerve endings, cutting nerve endings = decreased sensitivity

What do you have to lose by leaving things as they are and dealing w/ a problem IF it happens? By doing surgery for "preventive" reasons, he'd be worse off than if you did nothing and only dealing w/ problems IF they happen. "Preventive" measures is the reasons stupid doctor/people advise circumcision.


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GutInstinct* 
But what if we do nothing and he has this little penis that bends and it interferes with his sex life later on?

Then as an adult he can have it fixed. This isn't a problem till he is ready to have sex by then the area will be larger; he will be able to have erections without a Dr manipulating things, so it will be easier to evaluate; they may have developed new and better surgical techniques.

IME most penises bend a little one way or another (atleast 3 out of the 4 adult ones I've...TMI.) A slight bend isn't a problem.

If you want to see if it is bending, then open his diaper early in the morning before he wakes up males are almost always erect at that time of day.


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## Super Pickle (Apr 29, 2002)

I would DEFINITELY Leave it alone!

I don't know, the whole thing sounds so weird. It almost sounds like you have run into penis-obsessed doctors who are conjuring up problems so they can get in there and operate and create their idea of the "perfect penis" for your child.

You should also be aware that circumcision itself can _cause_ bent penis.


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## Frootloop (Aug 10, 2007)

Please trust your gut here







It's screaming "leave it alone" for a reason.
Don't let the cut-happy doctors sway you. They're attempting to talk you into a purely cosmetic surgery before they even have concrete evidence that it's even needed. *Not ok.*

I completely agree with previous posters who have said to re-evaluate the situation when he is older. If the *possible* bend is even likely to cause serious issues in the future, it will surely reveal itself as your little one grows.







And like other PP, I also don't understand what this even has to do with the foreskin to begin with..?

I hate to get TMI here, but my DH's penis has a bend to it and it has _never_ once been an issue! In fact, it's been a uhhhhh.... blessing... at certain times.







:

So, who knows, your son may even LIKE the bend (*if* he even ends up with one). Please leave it alone and let him decide when he's older. If he's urinating without problems, there *IS* no issue to deal with at the moment!


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## SleeplessMommy (Jul 16, 2005)

There is a young man who posts here who had hypo surgery as a toddler. He is pretty unhappy about the hypo surgery, the loss of foreskin and the lack of information on what was done and why.

Quote:

it could lead to chordee.
Your son has a foreskin issue that _one_ doctor has said _might_ lead to chordee. I urge you not to have your infant undergo general anesthesia for a surgery that probably is not even necessary. You son's penis will be much larger after he reaches puberty ... making it easier to tell if there is chordee and if it will interfere with intimacy (probably it won't). In the unlikely event that surgery is needed, it will be easier on a fully grown penis anyway, with a better cosmetic result and better pain control during recovery. And easier to keep clean since there will be no diapers involved.

Right now, your baby needs his penis just to pee. And it sounds like the peeing is going just fine.


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## mommyswenn (May 23, 2004)

First of all,







I know where you are at, mama.

My ds was born with third-degree (penoscrotal) hypospadias, as well as chordee. You can definitely have one w/o the other, but you do often see them together.

In my son's case, the chordee was quite severe. There was a very definite bend to his penis and you could actually see the skin pulling at times. It became more pronounced as he grew older (and by that I mean from the time he was 2 weeks old when we saw the first ped. uro. to around 6 months or so).

Because his hypo and chordee were so severe, we opted for the repair. It was two separate surgeries -- the first addressed the chordee, the second one addressed the hypo. They did NOT have to circ him to do the chordee repair, in fact they used part of his foreskin in the hypo repair, so circ'ing would have been the last thing they would have done!

Ds also had a dorsal hood, but after the chordee repair he no longer did. The uro. moved the foreskin around so that it circled the penis like it typically would (glans were still exposed, though).

IF ds's condition were simply cosmetic, we would have left things as they were. Unfortunately that wasn't the case.









You are doing nothing wrong by taking a "wait and see" attitude. I'm sure, as your son grows, the chordee will either start to become more pronounced or it won't. It doesn't hurt to get second opinion, either. The first urologist we saw (when ds was 9 days old, and again at 6 months) told us the surgery was merely cosmetic. Dh and I asked for a referral to our nearest Children's Hospital, and I'm sure you can imagine our shock to find out how severe ds's hypo really was. Farthest thing from cosmetic there is.







:

Okay, sorry, I went off on a tangent there...

Back to the topic at hand, from what I recall the foreskin actually has nothing to do with the chordee. They had to (graphic, sorry)

basically peel the skin off of ds's penis, so that they could get to the base of it and clip the connective tissue so that the penis could straighten. Again, it has NOTHING to do with the foreskin!

Feel free to PM me if you want to talk.


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## DocsNemesis (Dec 10, 2005)

Yep, I'd leave it alone. I'd leave anything alone that wasnt causing medical problems.

Here is another thought-I have seen a couple of guys who had a curve to their penis. They LIKED it, because they felt like it made them better in bed. Who knows if it does, lol. But the point is, you dont know how he will feel about it, you dont know how severe it would be, you dont even know that there IS an issue. So dont risk your little dude, nor his foreskin, just for something that will most likely never be an issue. And if it is, chances are he will understand why you waited and appreciate it. I know I was happy my mom waited on having my tonsils out-it became my decision and I was able to judge it for myself. And when I made the decision to have them out, I was also plenty old enough to deal with the associated pain and take care of myself properly. On the other hand, my dd had hers out at 4, due to severe apnea, and she had a horrible time of it. There was a big difference, just because of age. Its not the same but there are still parallels.

Let him decide, if and when it becomes an issue.


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## Yulia_R (Jan 7, 2006)

You can also contact Doctors Opposing Circumcision and ask their advice http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...t/contact.html


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## Microsoap (Dec 29, 2005)

I don't know if it helps you any, but I'm an intact male and my penis very slightly curves to the left and it hasn't caused me _any_ problem for urinating, masturbating and sex. There's this amateur picture posting website that has men I'd say mostly circ'd w/ incredible bends (like almost "U"-shape up) and they have sex just fine and seem to be proud of their bent penis.


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## GutInstinct (Jan 5, 2008)

I don't have time for proper replies to everyone right now, but I wanted to swing by and send out a collective THANK YOU to everyone who weighed in on this. I can't tell you how much it's helped me. The funny thing is, my user name is GutInstinct. Normally, I'd be telling everyone "leave him alone!" but when it's MY kid and the doctor is talking to ME and my head starts hurting and I realize that I'm the mommy and it all comes down to my good/bad decisions, well, that gut instinct gets a little thrown off track.

Anyway, I'll be back soon with more!







:


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## GutInstinct (Jan 5, 2008)

I'm back with a semi update to this drama.

And first, I want to say that if this was me reading a post from you, I'd be the first to say, "Don't cut!" and I'd sure as hell say "NO WAY to surgery!" but it's really, really hard and weighs on you when you realize you're the mama and could do wrong.

But anyway, right now I feel like I'm doing _right_ by not rushing into anything, just simply researching and learning.

Last week we went to his ped appt. (general checkup), and we talked about his previous month's visit to the urologist. Even my ped seemed to be pro-surgery. He looked and said, "I see a slight bend!" Argh.

How can he see a bend? Even the urologist said he wouldn't be able to see anything til surgery!

Then I asked him, *"What do they do in countries that do not circumcise? What do boys with chordee do in those countries? Either live with potentially bent penises? Or cut the foreskin, which seems unlikely in a country that doesn't believe in circumcision?"*

The doc just gave me a blank stare and said, "I don't know."

*Next up:* find a non-American pediatric urologist who can explain alternatives to surgery. And whether he even thinks surgery is necessary, etc. Do you guys have any tips on how to find this magical person? I'll travel anywhere and spend anything. It's my son's immediate health and long-term health on the line. No pressure, right?


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## Microsoap (Dec 29, 2005)

A bend how? Did your son have an erection already? Did the doctor manipulate your son's penis to obtain an erection (I doubt it, but it's possible)? I don't see how a doctor can look at a baby boy's penis and determine that he has a bend.


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## Night_Nurse (Nov 23, 2007)

I'm not sure but maybe check the phone book or go to your insurance website and see if you can locate a name that sounds foreign possibly? I know my son's pedi is from India and they don't circ where he's from (he told me that). And never once has our pedi suggested a circ (we've also never had any problems that would warrant a circ suggestion).

You might also contact DOC - http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...DOC/links.html - and see if they can suggest a doctor in your area.

Lastly, maybe the AUA can help you locate a doc in your area - http://www.auanet.org/patients/


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## Fi. (May 3, 2005)

I'd let him decide as an adult.

I would however ask this doctor how uneven skin leads to a crooked erection.


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