# LEAD in Melissa and doug toys!



## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

my dd had high lead levels a year ago and we did eveything we could, even hired a lead inspector and he found nothing in our house.but her levels werent going down.
then from something i heard somewhere and just an odd gut feeling i got rid of all our *MELISSA AND DOUG TOYS*. that is the only thing i changed and removed from our home. we went back in and her lead level dropped to 3







she was in the clear!!! i thought maybe it was just a coincidence but then my friend's dd had high lead levels, she too only removed melissa and doug toys from her home and VOILA! lead levels dropped to the safe/normal range.
NOW, a diferent friend of mine went to her local tv station b/c they had an expensive lead testing machine and she brought a few toys including MELISSA AND DOUG and what do you know- *trace amounts of lead were found!*
now knowing it's not just a coincidence I felt like I should let everyone know!!!

ETA:
my friend runs a local oy store and melisa and doug ere trying to get her to carry their toys. she questioned them aboutthe safety of their paint and all they said was "we've had no compliants"








also i called and e-mailed them at least 20 times and they neevr once got back to me


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## StrawberryFields (Apr 6, 2005)

: Some of ds' favorite toys are M&D and he had borderline high lead levels at his 1 year appointment. We, too, had no idea where that could be coming from. I am having him retested at a checkup in a few weeks. Thanks for the heads-up. I know home tests can be unreliable but we are going to get one right away and check up all of his toys anyway. Did you have a lot of M&D toys? Do you remember any of the ones that you tossed? I am sure that it can vary but maybe if we have some of the same ones I can keep an extra close eye on those. We have the Chomp & Clack Alligator Push Toy, the My First Vehicles truck, car and airplane, the Pound & Roll Ball Toy, the My First Animals magnetic book and the Rainbow Stacker stacking ring.

I had a bad feeling about M&D but I shook it off anyway because I thought I was being too difficult by expressing our preference for wooden toys and then turning my nose up at the ones that are widely available and affordable.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

i know what you mean mama















the store bought lead tests never found lead in my m&d toys







but maybe that's b/c the lead is underneath?








we had a decent amount of melissa and doug toys, a lot of them chipping







i can't rememebr them all off hand i do remember an abacus,shape sorter/stacker,jacobs ladder...


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## kyndmamaof4 (Jul 25, 2006)

Crap! My TRU just started carring these! I was so excited to send everyone there for easy Christmas shopping for the kids









What now???


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

i dunno







we stopped buying toys MIC and only stick with the natural unpainetd wooden ones like from www.threesisters.com


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## True Blue (May 9, 2003)

Did the tv station do an expose? I'd love to see someone publish results...


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

hmm i dunno actually.. lemme ask her







she's in another state.


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## StrawberryFields (Apr 6, 2005)

This is a great blog that has a lot of info about toys:

http://saras-toy-box.blogspot.com/

If you scroll down on the front page she talks about Melissa & Doug toys and also Plan Toys. We have some Plan Toys that are similar in price to the M&D but I think a much higher quality. The "paint" is actually a thin dye that doesn't flake off like the M&D paint does. You can see the wood grain through the paint and they are more attractive and seem to hold up better.

I think that I am going to be cautious going forward about the M&D, not buying it for ourselves and taking the precaution that she mentions in her blog of not keeping any M&D that is going to be mouthed. After this thread I am highly suspicious of our M&D ring stacker which was chewed on quite a bit by ds and ended up with flaking paint, especially on the red ring. I got rid of it a long time ago but I wonder if it was a contributor to his lead levels.

I'm so anxious to see what ds' levels look like right now.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *True Blue* 
Did the tv station do an expose? I'd love to see someone publish results...

The news station said they hope to have the full list of what came back safe & unsafe on the web within the week.

the website is: http://www.wbns10tv.com/

thank you for that blog!!


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## True Blue (May 9, 2003)

Thanks, I can't wait to see the results!!!


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## NoMariposa (Apr 14, 2005)

That does not surprise me. Melissa and Doug toys are cheaper than their competition equivalents and some are Made in China, if not all.
You can not trust anything made in China PERIOD. I would even go so far as to not buy any toys out of Asia as a whole.
Our desires as a nation for CHEAP, is Killing our Children SLOWLY.


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

So is plastic safer than wood with lead paint?


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## Leilalu (May 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NoMariposa* 
That does not surprise me. Melissa and Doug toys are cheaper than their competition equivalents and some are Made in China, if not all.
You can not trust anything made in China PERIOD. I would even go so far as to not buy any toys out of Asia as a whole.
Our desires as a nation for CHEAP, is Killing our Children SLOWLY.


So how do you propose to never buy anything made in China? This would include, you realize- teas, paints used on toys and other things, etc etc etc.


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## spsmom (Jun 19, 2004)

I am freaking out right now! I am a m/d retailer. I researched them and questioned them point blank about lead and they guarantee their products are safe. My aunt actually did get a reply from them when she emailed them about it and they told her the same thing. ya da ya da about outside inspectors, non-toxic dyes/paints. my local AP moms group are my best customers. So now I am dealing with this anxiety that I am poisoning their kids?

How do I go about getting my kids tested? About 75% of our toys are m/d. I already went through out toys and threw quite a bit away due to the recalls.

Seriously, I am freaking out! I have a sudden knot in my stomach just thinking about this.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NoMariposa* 
That does not surprise me. Melissa and Doug toys are cheaper than their competition equivalents and some are Made in China, if not all.
You can not trust anything made in China PERIOD. I would even go so far as to not buy any toys out of Asia as a whole.
Our desires as a nation for CHEAP, is Killing our Children SLOWLY.

yep we only buy made in usa, germany and canada stuff. any m&d we had was gifts.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spsmom* 
I am freaking out right now! I am a m/d retailer. I researched them and questioned them point blank about lead and they guarantee their products are safe. My aunt actually did get a reply from them when she emailed them about it and they told her the same thing. ya da ya da about outside inspectors, non-toxic dyes/paints. my local AP moms group are my best customers. So now I am dealing with this anxiety that I am poisoning their kids?

How do I go about getting my kids tested? About 75% of our toys are m/d. I already went through out toys and threw quite a bit away due to the recalls.

Seriously, I am freaking out! I have a sudden knot in my stomach just thinking about this.
























my dd was tested at her 1 year check up it was a routine thing.


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## NoMariposa (Apr 14, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Leilalu* 
So how do you propose to never buy anything made in China? This would include, you realize- teas, paints used on toys and other things, etc etc etc.

We are a China Free Home. So, yes, I realize exactly what that means.


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## Kleine Hexe (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spsmom* 
I am freaking out right now! I am a m/d retailer. I researched them and questioned them point blank about lead and they guarantee their products are safe. My aunt actually did get a reply from them when she emailed them about it and they told her the same thing. ya da ya da about outside inspectors, non-toxic dyes/paints. my local AP moms group are my best customers. So now I am dealing with this anxiety that I am poisoning their kids?

How do I go about getting my kids tested? About 75% of our toys are m/d. I already went through out toys and threw quite a bit away due to the recalls.

Seriously, I am freaking out! I have a sudden knot in my stomach just thinking about this.


Same here. I feel sick. I just called our Pedi and he will be writing a script for the boys to get tested for lead.


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## Kleine Hexe (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NoMariposa* 
We are a China Free Home. So, yes, I realize exactly what that means.

I would love to get a list of places you shop and such. So many things are from China.


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## Leilalu (May 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kleine Hexe* 
I would love to get a list of places you shop and such. So many things are from China.

exactly. How can you be sure that ingredients and paints and such are not manufactured in china?


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## nascarbebe (Nov 4, 2006)

That is too bad. A year ago I bought the pull stacking zoo and I was really disappointed how easily the paint chipped off the corners. There are so many other companies that are much better quality than M&D. I haven't bought M&D in over a year and don't plan on ever doing it again. My two favorite wooden toys companies are Plan Toys and Haba.


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## HipGal (Aug 16, 2006)

Ugh! How horrible. We don't have a lot of Melissa and Doug, but I have been disturbed by the paint chipping off the stuff we do have.


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## BoSoxMama (Feb 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Leilalu* 
exactly. How can you be sure that ingredients and paints and such are not manufactured in china?

And books? Most books are manufactured in China from what I understand.


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## sbgrace (Sep 22, 2004)

This is so irritating to me.
All my boys play food is melissa and doug becuase I didn't want to do plastic...because of lead actually. I've called the company because of paint chips and my sons of course putting play food in their mouths and they assured me it was safe.
I can't afford to replace everything. I guess we need a lead test given that we had recalled trains too. Sheesh this makes me sick.
Books bother me too. Side note though. I had a book eater. He ate books because he was iron deficient. Iron deficient and lead go together. When I saw that the books he was eating were from China and we were having trouble getting his iron up we had a lead draw. He was normal lead wise. That part is reassuring to me. Though that test was a while back. So I'll probably ask them to re-test him next time he has a metabolic blood draw.
His twin was only tested at 12 months though and has done way more chewing on toys over his life. So I'll see if his ped. will order a draw.
This makes me incredibly mad.


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## beka1977 (Aug 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *counterGOPI* 
yep we only buy made in usa, germany and canada stuff.

How did you decide on these three countries? Why not some of the others that seem "safe" ?


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## Ygle (Mar 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *counterGOPI* 
NOW, a diferent friend of mine went to her local tv station b/c they had an expensive lead testing machine and she brought a few toys including MELISSA AND DOUG and what do you know- *trace amounts of lead were found!*

Geez... I thought these were safe considering they claim their products are all lead free, so much for that I guess.


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## Logan's Mom (Mar 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ygle* 
Geez... I thought these were safe considering they claim their products are all lead free, so much for that I guess.

I have no idea about this...but I'm wondering if not all companies claim their products to be lead free....


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## MommyErin (Jul 10, 2002)

Not to scare y'all but as I'm dealing with my DS high metal, including lead, levels, you should know that the standard blood test that pediatricians prescribe isn't really enough to determine whether your kids are in the "safe" range. Our metabolic doctor told us that lead only lives in the bloodstream for a short time and then moves to cells and such. Since DS blood test was well within the "safe" range, she had DS take an intensive urine test where he had to take a chelating agent and then we collected his urine for a six hour period and then sent a cross section of it to a lab. Turns out he's got *high* lead levels but the lead had been in his system for so long it was undetectible in the blood test. And, honestly, I recommend testing for all heavy metals, not just lead. My son tested high for mercury and arsenic as well. The test was only $99 if you paid up front and it was WELL worth it.

Unfortunately, it's likely that we're just at the tip of the iceberg. I'm freaking out about my DS M&D floor puzzles. Fortunately, they don't peel and he doesn't put them in his mouth but his hands touch the pieces a ton and then he touches himself, his mouth, his nose, etc. Does anyone know about the puzzles or is all the info available just about the wood toys?


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## sunnybear (Nov 18, 2004)

I just e-mailed them not long ago too and asked if they were having lead issues. Of course they said no. So disappointing, as my mom was going to buy a bunch of M&D toys for our son...I'll have to tell her this evening not to get any of those now.


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## sbgrace (Sep 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyErin* 
Not to scare y'all but as I'm dealing with my DS high metal, including lead, levels, you should know that the standard blood test that pediatricians prescribe isn't really enough to determine whether your kids are in the "safe" range. Our metabolic doctor told us that lead only lives in the bloodstream for a short time and then moves to cells and such. Since DS blood test was well within the "safe" range, she had DS take an intensive urine test where he had to take a chelating agent and then we collected his urine for a six hour period and then sent a cross section of it to a lab. Turns out he's got *high* lead levels but the lead had been in his system for so long it was undetectible in the blood test. And, honestly, I recommend testing for all heavy metals, not just lead. My son tested high for mercury and arsenic as well. The test was only $99 if you paid up front and it was WELL worth it.


An actual metabolic specialist (medical doctor) ordered a chelation test for metals?
What metabolic condition does your son have?
I'm really confused here. Chelation in any form would I think be dangerous for many kids with metabolic conditions.

I'm saying this as a parent of a child with a metabolic condition whose had every metabolic test imaginable I think and I've read a gazillion medical journals on metabolic conditions and I've never seen chelation and looking for metals mentioned. Nor have I ever seen this for lead testing from a traditional medical approach. I am not saying the doctor you saw isn't right for your child. I'm just really curious about a metabolic doctor ordering this type of testing and for what metabolic condition?


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## Mama2Bug (Feb 18, 2005)

This is bothersome. We have lots of Melissa and Doug toys. We try to avoid characters and plastic, so they were our most affordable option. I agree that the quality on some of the toys isn't great. The play food, for instance, chips very easily. Some of it, like the mailbox, has held up well.

On a more reassuring note, we had DD 's lead levels tested just a few months ago- right after the Thomas recalls- and her levels were perfectly normal. They weren't high at all. I was actually very surprised, because we live in a very old (rented) house and even had some of the recalled trains.

I am looking around and literally 70% of her toys are M&D. We have the play food, the piano, the mailbox, numerous puzzles, the firetruck, animals magnets, shape sorter, ring stacker.... So now I am completely torn. The toys haven't actually been recalled, right? DD's lead levels are good. The toys aren't plastic, but they aren't Grade A, top-of-the-line either. If I get rid of them, DD will lose every last one of her favorites. We can't afford to replace them.

AAARG! In fact, we recently got rid of the junky, plastic toy farm she loved and replaced it with the M&D folding one. We couldn't really afford that either. I used a gift card to pay for it.

Lovely.


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## sarah_bella1050 (Feb 19, 2005)

I think whats going on here is that there is SOME lead in most all painted toys, it is below the legal limit of .06, but still, there is some. The toys that are being recalles have something like .07 and are therefore over the legal limit. Melissa and Doug toys probably DO have lead in them, but since it's under the legal limit, they can claim that it's "safe". Now I don't know about everyone else, but I am sick and tired of our countries low standards for toxicity! Why do we allow things that in other countries are banned? Things like lead, phthalates, teflon, and genetically modified food. These things are not only in our system, but in our childrens, running through our breastmilk, in their mouthes under the guise of "baby safe" toys. It makes me so angy I could spit


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## rootzdawta (May 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
So is plastic safer than wood with lead paint?

Good question! I'd love to see an answer.

Shoot, at least the paint doesn't chip off the plastic toys I have.


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## almadianna (Jul 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NoMariposa* 
We are a China Free Home. So, yes, I realize exactly what that means.

that computer you used to get on the internet and made that reply was probably mostly made in china... so while i agree that we have to be careful about things MIC, i think none of us can really call ourselves china free.


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## almadianna (Jul 22, 2006)

i have stayed away from M&D toys because i really honestly dont trust them that much.
all of the toys that we have bought our babe were made in germany or the US and even then we get the natural stuff if possible. It is really impossible to not buy anything made in china but you do what you can...


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## Leilalu (May 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *almadianna* 
that computer you used to get on the internet and made that reply was probably mostly made in china... so while i agree that we have to be careful about things MIC, i think none of us can really call ourselves china free.

I agree. you would also have to avoid most shopping places,and restaurants, and cell phones of course, and computers, headphones, maybe even drawer knob pulls.

The point being- no one living in modern society can completely shun international trade.


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## mommajb (Mar 4, 2005)

The m&d toys are of varying quality but I wonder if this points to different factories in China with different sourcing methods. We had stacking rings that lost so much paint I took them away but some of the play food, while dented, has not chipped.

I know I won't buy anymore of these toys but wonder what I should do with what we have. I don't want it to stay around and harn my child but w/o more info it seems wasteful to dump it. Perhaps I should pack it up (especially the toy food since it does go in the mouth) and take a wait and see attitude.

What are you ladies doing with the M&D you have?


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## jauncourt (Mar 15, 2007)

My mom has the number clock (I had her keep a bunch of the toys when we were moved out here by the military) and she is stripping it with soy-based paint stripper (designed for safely stripping lead paints in house renovations) and repainting it with safer paints. Any painted wooden toy we have that tests positive is getting this treatment.

Maura


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## spsmom (Jun 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommajb* 
The m&d toys are of varying quality but I wonder if this points to different factories in China with different sourcing methods.

I am just having a hard time grasping this! I feel so betrayed! One of the factors that stood out for me with m/d when I became a retailer is that they "supposedly" own their own factories. and the people who make the toys in china are actual m/d employees working in m/d owned factories. they claim they do not outsource. i just don't know what i am going to do at this point. i was pretty much done Christmas shopping. we don't do a lot of gifts as it is, but basically all their toys are m/d sitting in a bin waiting to be wrapped for Christmas.


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## StrawberryFields (Apr 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
So is plastic safer than wood with lead paint?

You know, I have been thinking about this question all day and I think I would stick with the wooden toys over the plastic ones. Since most of the lead recalls are plastic toys you have a double whammy--plastic, AND lead paint. At least with the wooden toys you only have the lead paint to deal with.

I really like the idea mentioned about stripped lead positive wood toys and refinishing. I keep a bucket of OSMO hardwax oil in the house and I believe that it states it is safe for toy finishing. That is a possibility I am going to explore and consider.


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## spsmom (Jun 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama2Bug* 
This is bothersome. We have lots of Melissa and Doug toys. We try to avoid characters and plastic, so they were our most affordable option. I agree that the quality on some of the toys isn't great. The play food, for instance, chips very easily. Some of it, like the mailbox, has held up well.

On a more reassuring note, we had DD 's lead levels tested just a few months ago- right after the Thomas recalls- and her levels were perfectly normal. They weren't high at all. I was actually very surprised, because we live in a very old (rented) house and even had some of the recalled trains.

I am looking around and literally 70% of her toys are M&D. We have the play food, the piano, the mailbox, numerous puzzles, the firetruck, animals magnets, shape sorter, ring stacker.... So now I am completely torn. The toys haven't actually been recalled, right? DD's lead levels are good. The toys aren't plastic, but they aren't Grade A, top-of-the-line either. If I get rid of them, DD will lose every last one of her favorites. We can't afford to replace them.

AAARG! In fact, we recently got rid of the junky, plastic toy farm she loved and replaced it with the M&D folding one. We couldn't really afford that either. I used a gift card to pay for it.

Lovely.









I'm in the same boat. I am thinking, if this is really true, someone has to report it. It is financially impossible for us to replace all our toys. i do plan on making appts to have dss levels checked and if they are fine, i will not worry about the m/d toys until there is more facts. but as a retailer I feel obligated to now inform my customers of my concerns. (i actually have temporarily closed my business and not taking anymore orders bc we are in the middle of selling our house and moving out of state, but iw ill definitely be keeping an eye on this story!)


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## Nature (Mar 12, 2005)

We live in an old apartment that we know has lead paint, have plastic MIC toys, had some of the dora recall stuff, and lots of M&D toys... but all my girls lead tests came back perfectly normal. I was surprised honestly.


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nascarbebe* 
My two favorite wooden toys companies are Plan Toys and Haba.

I don't know about Plan but I do know that many Haba products are made in China.

Honestly, I think that I will withhold condemning M&D until I see published independent test results showing what their lead levels are. There are many many factors that can contribute to high lead levels. the last few places I've lived, our homes were thoroughly tested for lead and the places where it was found was in the dirt outside the house and near the playground. If your children are being tested for lead and are found to have high levels, be sure to check the earth where your children play.


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## Leilalu (May 29, 2004)

I agree. And I also love haba and plan toys and selecta. I think we own more of those than anything really.

Be sure to be giving your kids green food if you suspect any problems. Greenfood supplements can take heavy metals out of the body. I know my kids and I have these drinks and supplemental powders often. I think they really help, even if just in a preventative manner.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gool0005* 
I don't know about Plan but I do know that many Haba products are made in China.

Honestly, I think that I will withhold condemning M&D until I see published independent test results showing what their lead levels are. There are many many factors that can contribute to high lead levels. the last few places I've lived, our homes were thoroughly tested for lead and the places where it was found was in the dirt outside the house and near the playground. If your children are being tested for lead and are found to have high levels, be sure to check the earth where your children play.

believe me we did check that and psent the $300 for our inspector to test EVERYTHING insdie and outside our home!


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## MommyErin (Jul 10, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sbgrace* 

I'm saying this as a parent of a child with a metabolic condition whose had every metabolic test imaginable I think and I've read a gazillion medical journals on metabolic conditions and I've never seen chelation and looking for metals mentioned. Nor have I ever seen this for lead testing from a traditional medical approach. I am not saying the doctor you saw isn't right for your child. I'm just really curious about a metabolic doctor ordering this type of testing and for what metabolic condition?

My son has been diagnosed on the Autism spectrum so he sees a practicioner who specializes in metabolic disorders (my son had leaky gut, a low functioning liver, and a dairy issue). She is a DAN! (Defeat Autism Now) doctor and all of this is part of the DAN! approach to curing or at least lessening autism. He's been on a casein free diet for a year now and on an extensive supplement regime as well. So now we're addressing the metals since his liver is functioning well now and the caseinmorphine is under control and his magnesium levels have returned to close to normal. So the test wasn't for the metabolic disorders. It was to address some other issues related to the metabolic disorders.

It's pretty cool. Most people can't tell my son is autistic anymore. He speaks well, is loving, responsive, and follows directions. He has also developed a killer sense of humor. Most people just think he has a communication disorder, as his speech is about a year behind his chronological age.

Weird and Wild Stuff ...


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## Sassenach280 (Sep 28, 2007)

I have a bunch of those Household Lead Check sticks and after seeing this thread, I tested my DD's Melissa and Doug toys and the tests came back negative for lead, so I don't know... I'm not too worried about it now. She just received the Melissa and Doug food for her birthday and has a bunch of puzzles and a train and according to the test sticks, they're all fine.


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## Tofu the Geek (Dec 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sassenach280* 
I have a bunch of those Household Lead Check sticks and after seeing this thread, I tested my DD's Melissa and Doug toys and the tests came back negative for lead, so I don't know... I'm not too worried about it now. She just received the Melissa and Doug food for her birthday and has a bunch of puzzles and a train and according to the test sticks, they're all fine.

Apparently the home lead test kits aren't reliable Someone posted these links in another thread

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml08/08038.html
http://www.thingamababy.com/baby/200...adtesting.html

From the first link

Quote:

Based on the study consumers should not use lead test kits to evaluate consumer products for potential lead hazards.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

: i was just about to say the same thing. i tested things i KNEW had lead with those thingsand they came back negative







:


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## dillonandmarasmom (May 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *counterGOPI* 
my dd had high lead levels a year ago and we did eveything we could, even hired a lead inspector and he found nothing in our house.but her levels werent going down.
then from something i heard somewhere and just an odd gut feeling i got rid of all our *MELISSA AND DOUG TOYS*. that is the only thing i changed and removed from our home. we went back in and her lead level dropped to 3







she was in the clear!!! i thought maybe it was just a coincidence but then my friend's dd had high lead levels, she too only removed melissa and doug toys from her home and VOILA! lead levels dropped to the safe/normal range.
NOW, a diferent friend of mine went to her local tv station b/c they had an expensive lead testing machine and she brought a few toys including MELISSA AND DOUG and what do you know- *trace amounts of lead were found!*
now knowing it's not just a coincidence I felt like I should let everyone know!!!

ETA:
my friend runs a local oy store and melisa and doug ere trying to get her to carry their toys. she questioned them aboutthe safety of their paint and all they said was "we've had no compliants"








also i called and e-mailed them at least 20 times and they neevr once got back to me









not too surprised. m&d is made in china. not all wooden toys are truly natural, kwim? i have several m&d items from my sis and mil. from what i understand, the trace amounts are below the 'allowable' according to u.s. guidelines. we've slowly weeded out anything made in china and what we do purchase new (other than legos) is typically unpainted & wooden. i stick to plan toys or selecta.
yeah, this whole lead discovery sucks, but it may also have a silver lining. i'll bet many mainstream folk will now look to safer, more natural products, too. that can't be bad.

sorry about your kiddo. glad you figured it out.


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## boheime (Oct 25, 2005)

We got rid of all of the painted M&D toys we had a long time ago because the quality just wasn't there. The only thing we kept was a set of standard unit blocks. Our oldest children are now 5 and 3 and needed more than the one set to build things. We bought a second set for dd's birthday so that they could have more blocks to build with. After we were playing with the blocks for a while, I saw what I thought was paint dripped on some of the blocks. On closer inspection, I realized that there were actually cuts into the blocks that had been filled with wood putty. I called M&D and was told it was fine. Um...I didn't pay for blocks that had been cut and filled in. I won't buy M&D again.


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

subbing... please post when the news station has results up

and, fwiw, I havent had a good feeling about MandD all along, their paint chipping so easy seems shoddy


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## wife&mommy (May 26, 2005)

ugh... not hat i wanted to hear!!


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## wife&mommy (May 26, 2005)

ugh... not what i wanted to hear!!


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## sora (Oct 7, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Good question! I'd love to see an answer.

Shoot, at least the paint doesn't chip off the plastic toys I have.

I have a Bee Bop band by parents. My baby was sucking on the drumstick and I thought it would be fine since it is just plastic. Later I found that the paint chipped off and she ate it! I was really upset. Do you know what's the impact on my baby's health? I'm still upset.

Initially I wanted to buy only natural toys, but I decided that we really can't get away from plastics in our living. I ended up having so many plastic toys and I'm paying the price for it!


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## BookGoddess (Nov 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gool0005* 

Honestly, I think that I will withhold condemning M&D until I see published independent test results showing what their lead levels are. There are many many factors that can contribute to high lead levels. the last few places I've lived, our homes were thoroughly tested for lead and the places where it was found was in the dirt outside the house and near the playground. If your children are being tested for lead and are found to have high levels, be sure to check the earth where your children play.









:

We have several M&D wooden puzzles. I'm going to hold onto them until I get more information. DD has been tested for lead twice and each time she tested in the normal range.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BookGoddess* 







:

We have several M&D wooden puzzles. I'm going to hold onto them until I get more information. DD has been tested for lead twice and each time she tested in the normal range.

i am just sending out my message ladies to everyone so that you don't have ot go through what we went through, take it as you will.







: if you wish to ignore it so be it.

ETA: i don't mean that in a neagtive way,im preggo and hormonal sorry! i just can't fathom trusting such a company upon hearing my news, especialy since they come out of china and have questionable labor in the 1st place.


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## almadianna (Jul 22, 2006)

I think that waiting to condemn something until we get independent test results is part of that "oh well it messed up a whole lot of people now lets do something about it" trend. THe same trend with pharmacueticals, with toys, with everything.

If we waited for test results on the benefits of breastfeeding I wouldnt have been breastfed as most of the kids who are over 15-18 years of age.

I thank the OP for posting this info and trying to warn us on something that many of us have already thought true for a while.


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## pradiata (Jul 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
So is plastic safer than wood with lead paint?

I think the answer is "NO".

I've been reading lately that there are some loopholes regarding safe lead levels in plastics. Some plastics will have many times the safe levels of lead in them because the toys were tested for "migration" levels (how much lead seeps out of the plastic simply by being in surface contact with something, often vinegar for the tests) rather than "total lead tests" (where they scrape the plastic, melt it down and see how much actual lead it contains). When tested for total lead many more toys fail toxicity testing, such as Mega Blocks as discovered recently in Canada.

Lead is used to color red and yellow plastics. It's cheaper than safer alternatives, so I imagine that very high quality plastic (oxymoron!) would be less likely to have lead in it. It seems like Legos and Playmobil may be safer because of their higher quality, but I would like to know more.

Plus plastics have all their own nasty stuff in addition to whatever lead may be there. In one way, at least lead is in a somewhat natural form and it's toxicity is known and understood, where as all the bizarre side effects of plastic exposure are only just starting to be understood.

Toys don't have to be lead-free to be considered non-toxic, they just have to have low levels of lead (600 parts per million). So if our children have many toys with low (ie, "safe") lead levels, doesn't it seem like that could eventually all add up to toxic levels?

I think I'm going to ditch everything that isn't made of untreated natural materials in our home! I spend a fortune on organically grown food just to have my child poisoned by TOY manufacturers?







: Are these people monsters?


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## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

our m&d puzzles say made in taiwan. so you think they still might have lead in the paint?

sarah


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## Radhanuga (Jun 22, 2004)

oops i just posted on wrong thread, lol. That's what happens when i have too many windows opened







:


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## quelindo (May 11, 2005)

Oh, man, we have a TON of M&D toys. Here I thought we were being so "pure" not having too many plastic toys. I LOVE the natural wood toys (NOT made in China, where you can see the wood grain) but they're so pricey. Now I wish we'd bought my son fewer toys but better quality.

If the home lead-testing kits are not accurate, does anyone know how you could make sure something is safe? We "inherited" blocks my DH had as a kid. I used the home test kit when we first got them and thought that would be enough.

I did have my son's lead levels checked when he was a year. I may have them checked again. I'm going to see a naturopath in a few months and may talk to her about doing hair testing for heavy metals.


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## Adamsmama (Oct 24, 2003)

Ughh...this whole thing makes me sick. Why can't they just stop using this junk in children's toys.


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## sora (Oct 7, 2006)

How could you possibly totally stay away from plastic toys?
I go to playgroups at the family center more than 3 times a week and most of them are all plastic or M&D type of puzzles. You guys never go out for a playdate?


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## sora (Oct 7, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pradiata* 
I think the answer is "NO".

I've been reading lately that there are some loopholes regarding safe lead levels in plastics. Some plastics will have many times the safe levels of lead in them because the toys were tested for "migration" levels (how much lead seeps out of the plastic simply by being in surface contact with something, often vinegar for the tests) rather than "total lead tests" (where they scrape the plastic, melt it down and see how much actual lead it contains). When tested for total lead many more toys fail toxicity testing, such as Mega Blocks as discovered recently in Canada.

Lead is used to color red and yellow plastics. It's cheaper than safer alternatives, so I imagine that very high quality plastic (oxymoron!) would be less likely to have lead in it. It seems like Legos and Playmobil may be safer because of their higher quality, but I would like to know more.

Plus plastics have all their own nasty stuff in addition to whatever lead may be there. In one way, at least lead is in a somewhat natural form and it's toxicity is known and understood, where as all the bizarre side effects of plastic exposure are only just starting to be understood.

Toys don't have to be lead-free to be considered non-toxic, they just have to have low levels of lead (600 parts per million). So if our children have many toys with low (ie, "safe") lead levels, doesn't it seem like that could eventually all add up to toxic levels?

I think I'm going to ditch everything that isn't made of untreated natural materials in our home! I spend a fortune on organically grown food just to have my child poisoned by TOY manufacturers?







: Are these people monsters?

How are children exposed to toxins from plastic toys. By mouthing them? or even by touching? If the are old enough not to toys in the mouth, is it safe to give them plastic toys?


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## miss_sonja (Jun 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *counterGOPI* 
i dunno







we stopped buying toys MIC and only stick with the natural unpainetd wooden ones like from www.threesisters.com

The correct link is: http://www.threesisterstoys.com/

Great stuff there!


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *almadianna* 
I think that waiting to condemn something until we get independent test results is part of that "oh well it messed up a whole lot of people now lets do something about it" trend. THe same trend with pharmacueticals, with toys, with everything.

If we waited for test results on the benefits of breastfeeding I wouldnt have been breastfed as most of the kids who are over 15-18 years of age.

I thank the OP for posting this info and trying to warn us on something that many of us have already thought true for a while.

Well, I know all it takes is a shocking headline to get people's attention and the substance of the matter may well be true, it may also be a misunderstanding or it may be an outright falsehood and I'm NOT saying that anything that counterGOPI has gone through is fabricated, I totally believe what she has written happened to her and am very happy that her children's lead levels are down. What I am saying is that there is a possibility that there was some other factor at play, something that could have been overlooked if it isn't an obvious source. What I'm saying is that if these toys were tested and were found to have lead in them, that appropriate authorities should have been contacted in addition to consumer interest groups that have the funding to get things pushed into the national media's attention and that independent tests should be administered.

To do any less would be far too similar to a witch hunt, we've all read _The Crucible_ right?

So, I ask, who else has been notified of these test results showing lead in these toys? EWG? CPSC? ANSI? WATCH? USPIRG? Local & Federal Lawmakers? I know there are more people to contact but that's all I can think of right now. For anyone who has concerns about these toys and aren't satisfied with what the company tells you, should you be taking the next step and contacting one or more of these groups to press for answers?

ETA: One of the ladies from my playgroup was having lead problems with her kids and tested all over the place and her doctor even order her breastmilk to be tested and guess what? High lead levels in her breastmilk.


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## sweetieberlin (Mar 30, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gool0005* 
I don't know about Plan but I do know that many Haba products are made in China.

Honestly, I think that I will withhold condemning M&D until I see published independent test results showing what their lead levels are. There are many many factors that can contribute to high lead levels. the last few places I've lived, our homes were thoroughly tested for lead and the places where it was found was in the dirt outside the house and near the playground. If your children are being tested for lead and are found to have high levels, be sure to check the earth where your children play.

ALL of HABA wooden toys are made in germany... the only HABA toys MIC are puzzles and stuffed toys...


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## sdm1024 (Sep 4, 2006)

I only have a food set from them and a puzzle.

I should have known...they are MIC.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gool0005* 
Well, I know all it takes is a shocking headline to get people's attention and the substance of the matter may well be true, it may also be a misunderstanding or it may be an outright falsehood and I'm NOT saying that anything that counterGOPI has gone through is fabricated, I totally believe what she has written happened to her and am very happy that her children's lead levels are down. What I am saying is that there is a possibility that there was some other factor at play, something that could have been overlooked if it isn't an obvious source. What I'm saying is that if these toys were tested and were found to have lead in them, that appropriate authorities should have been contacted in addition to consumer interest groups that have the funding to get things pushed into the national media's attention and that independent tests should be administered.

To do any less would be far too similar to a witch hunt, we've all read _The Crucible_ right?

So, I ask, who else has been notified of these test results showing lead in these toys? EWG? CPSC? ANSI? WATCH? USPIRG? Local & Federal Lawmakers? I know there are more people to contact but that's all I can think of right now. For anyone who has concerns about these toys and aren't satisfied with what the company tells you, should you be taking the next step and contacting one or more of these groups to press for answers?

ETA: One of the ladies from my playgroup was having lead problems with her kids and tested all over the place and her doctor even order her breastmilk to be tested and guess what? High lead levels in her breastmilk.

no witch hunt here. for sure!

and myself,my dh and my BM was tested too


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## talia rose (Sep 9, 2004)

i am not all that surprised. i had questioned them about formaldehyde in thier toys which are made from plywoods and particle boards - all which contain formaldehyde. (they did say they do not use formaldehyde free plywoods) thier response was that thier toys were tested and met american standards. american standards basically let poisons run rampant in just about anything.
i believe haba toys are safe. german toys do have much stricter controls over toxic ingrediants. and i don't think everything from china is bad. we have an eco home store and there are many fair trade green companies out there who to keep costs down manufacture in china. but they are conscious companies whose first goal is not profit. the company who sets up the factories over there is responsible for what componants are used. Unfortunately profit is the only motive for most of these companies.


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## jenerationx (Nov 3, 2006)

Anymore info on the M+D toys? I went to the news website and didn't see anything there.


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## RachelS (Jul 21, 2006)

This completely upsets me.....


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## christy005 (Mar 5, 2007)

great....i bought my son quite a few M&D toys for Christmas...thinking those would be the toys I would have to worry least about...







wonderful..







: I'm so tired of this crap.


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## Mama2Bug (Feb 18, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *talia rose* 
...there are many fair trade green companies out there who to keep costs down manufacture in china. but they are conscious companies whose first goal is not profit. the company who sets up the factories over there is responsible for what componants are used. Unfortunately profit is the only motive for most of these companies.

I totally get the gist of what you're saying here, but







I have never heard of a company whose first goal wasn't profit. If your goal isn't profit, why go into business in the first place? I don't know of any companies who, if no profit was made, would stay in business just for the love.


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## famousmockngbrd (Feb 7, 2003)

I saw someone mention awhile back the idea of stripping the toys and refinishing them. I don't think this is a good idea because you might leave little pieces of stripped paint lying around where they could do more harm than if it was just left intact on the toy. It seems like removing the paint safely would be too difficult to be worth it.


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## jauncourt (Mar 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *famousmockngbrd* 
I saw someone mention awhile back the idea of stripping the toys and refinishing them. I don't think this is a good idea because you might leave little pieces of stripped paint lying around where they could do more harm than if it was just left intact on the toy. It seems like removing the paint safely would be too difficult to be worth it.

*This is a good point*. Anyone considering this option should make sure to use a stripper _specifically designed_ for safe removal of lead-based paints.

The type of stripper my mom is using (soy strip) is intended for safe, non-airborne stripping of lead paint in home remodelling - it comes off in a soft sheet, can be easily transferred to a disposal container even when used on large surfaces, and is disposed of as a toxic substance (you normally have to call a local hotline for disposal of old paint and other toxic substances, and this is no different). Properly done, for removal of finishes and paints from individual pieces, it is done on a dropcloth and the dropcloth is used for nothing else and disposed of with the residue that is removed. Of course, gloves, and a paint respirator are worn during the process. It isn't going to be done anywhere that my sons will be playing in the future (it will be done in the garage), and anyone else who does this should also take those, or simliarly careful, precautions.

Once it is stripped, it will be painted and then _sealed_ for maximum safety. My mom is an artist and house restorer, so this not an unknown process for her, and she is looking forward to making the number clock a personalized artistic keepsake that my sons will enjoy.

However, if you have no experience in refinishing old furniture safely, I'd also suggest forgoing the process, unless you are willing to invest in the various materials and equipment necessary.









Maura


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## Maggi315 (Aug 31, 2003)

subbing...we seemto have so many of the toys that are testing postive for lead...it'svery disheartening, idon't know what to buy anymore.

And for those with older children, how do you get away with not getting the popular toys? I think I'm starting to worry more about all the electronics my kids are exposed to...computers, ipods, nintendos, gameboys (heck, even my amish have gameboys and nintendos now), cellphones, and then when we go out there are tons of electonics everyone we go, even when ordering food sometimes! That "electrosmog" is starting to bother me as much as lead in my kids toys.

Add that to the chemicals, dyes, additives in food and seriously, its enough to drive you mad. I think that sometimes we can also become so obsessed it reminds me of an eating disorder or something with a contant dwelling, thinking, obsessing, researching, etc. And I am totally including myself here.

I have been thinking of taking my kids to a DAN doctor, but truthfully not really sure we have what it takes to go on a GFCF diet (although we aretrying) along with everything else. I can keep up with one, maybe two, plus my own health problems, but then it falls apart when i add everyone else in.

I don't know if I'm ready to get rid of all my lead toys, wouldn't itbe OK to just seal them with something? I'm afraid I'll get rid of everything, buy new stuff, only to find out that has a problem too!!!


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## talia rose (Sep 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama2Bug* 
I totally get the gist of what you're saying here, but







I have never heard of a company whose first goal wasn't profit. If your goal isn't profit, why go into business in the first place? I don't know of any companies who, if no profit was made, would stay in business just for the love.

my company organic grace was not begun for profit. first and foremost i am a doula and a mother and my main purpose was and still is to get babies off poison mattresses and offer alternatives to toxic products. while i would like to be able to support my family from our business, i have no wish to get rich and would drop it all in a hot second if i had to take a chance on poisoning a child for profit. i also belong to co-op america where there are hundreds of other like minded business owners. it is possible to be in business and have health and well being the prime motivation and profit a nice and necassary benefit that does not require harming others.


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## Meksmama (Jun 15, 2006)

I don't know what lead me to this thread but I am glad I read it... There goes more out of dd's room...


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## meganne79 (Jul 15, 2007)

This is just so frusturating! I want dd to have toys she enjoys but we are on a budget. It is so hard to find safe toys that are priced ok for us.


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## tangozulu (Jun 8, 2004)

99% of our toys are M&D...I thought I was doing right by my kids by getting them









I agree with some of the PPs who said some of them seem to be made better than others. I can't see, for example, the piano causing a problem or even the kitchen set that folds out. But some things like the magnetic number/letter sets which my ds LOVES to chew on...ugh...







:

I just ordered 3 of their toys for DS's bday which is Sat. yesterday. If I keep them out of the baby's hands, do you think they are OK? I mean, my 3 year old isn't putting the pieces in his mouth. IDK... I can't decide if I should try to cancel my order and get some HABA or something for him. There is one store near us that carries HABA, but they don't have nearly the selection that M&D does (at the store), seems like mostly toys for baby ds.

This is really a bummer.


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## Radhanuga (Jun 22, 2004)

M&D passed all the tests in France, and the standards there are higher than the US for lead and other.

Also , FYI, many of Haba's soft and wooden toys are partially made in China.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tangozulu* 
99% of our toys are M&D...I thought I was doing right by my kids by getting them









I agree with some of the PPs who said some of them seem to be made better than others. I can't see, for example, the piano causing a problem or even the kitchen set that folds out. But some things like the magnetic number/letter sets which my ds LOVES to chew on...ugh...







:

I just ordered 3 of their toys for DS's bday which is Sat. yesterday. If I keep them out of the baby's hands, do you think they are OK? I mean, my 3 year old isn't putting the pieces in his mouth. IDK... I can't decide if I should try to cancel my order and get some HABA or something for him. There is one store near us that carries HABA, but they don't have nearly the selection that M&D does (at the store), seems like mostly toys for baby ds.

This is really a bummer.









I know exactly what you mean mama









I definately would never allow another m&d toy near any of my kids or friends kids no matter what they may try to say about, how 'safe' their toys are _I_ know the truth. Nevermind the fact that most of thier toys aren't even real wood!! they are mostly particle board (which is glued together with formeldahyde) or filled wood







uke: nd again their working conditions, slave labor etc. i'd much rather know 100% my kids aren't exposed to anything bad to them by making my own toys and only buying from companies that can be trusted like spiel and holz, ostheimer, kinderkram etc and of course wahm companies etc you can talk to the person actually making the toys like willowtoys. (love them!)


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

yeah i hear that haba is havign some things made in china now too







thats stinks. we don't really have anything of theirs anyways but still...


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## JesseMomme (Apr 6, 2002)

This is thoroughly depressing.

The only wooden toys that were widely available that I could afford to get for my kids were M&D.









Now what about all the wooden stuff (lincoln logs, busy bead thingie) that I got at places like Target? or the Imaginarium company? Or the huge pile of building blocks that I have no idea what the Co. name was?

I feel like the world's biggest idiot for assuming if it was made out of wood then it was more than likely safe. I didn't even think about the paint on wood.







:

Ironically my niece (who is 6) was over this weekend and decided to "help" pick up toys upstairs. She picked up some pieces of ripped paper to throw in the garbage and that was all I saw was her throwing paper away in the garbage. I look closer in the garbage later on and there's toys in the garbage too!







I wasn't totally happy at the time taking the time to fish out "the good toys" - the wooden ones, the safe ones, the ones that are supposed to last - (think she could have tossed a broken one at least? noooo LOL)

what a difference a thread makes.


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## donttrustthesystem (Jul 26, 2007)

I'm really glad to read this thread...thank you for the information about how the paint chips so easily on M&D toys! Those prices are a little too good to be true.

I went to my dear friend's house who has a 3 year old. She had hellllla M&D toys...I mean they were all over the place!! Lots. She just did a hair sample on her DD and the lead level was .3, meaning almost nothing. That led me to deduce that M&D did not have lead.


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## lindberg99 (Apr 23, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JesseMomme* 
This is thoroughly depressing.

The only wooden toys that were widely available that I could afford to get for my kids were M&D.









Now what about all the wooden stuff (lincoln logs, busy bead thingie) that I got at places like Target?

Lincoln Logs are made in China. My DH found some generic ones at Wal-mart that are made in the US though. I think you just have to read the box to find out where stuff is made. I was at the toy store the other day and found a Thomas puzzle for DS that was made in the US (I think Ravensburger brand) and then I picked up another Thomas puzzle right next to it but made by a different company and that one was made in China.


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## cchrissyy (Apr 22, 2003)

OMG.

OK guys, I hope I can help. here are my crednentials:

1) my DS had heavy metal toxicity to lead, mercury, and arcenic.

2) we've particpated in studies and lots of testing and Dr meetings on this issue

3) I retail toys, including a little M&D

OK, so I wish I'd seen this post sooner to correct two of the OP's biggest misconceptions- first, home lead test kits are VERY innacurate. Google it, they are practically useless because they give tons of false positives AND false negatives
second, blood lead levels fall NATURALLY. You could remove any random thing in your house, wait a while, and levels should fall. that's because blood levels only detect recent exposures, and as time passes, some is excreted, and some latches onto your organs to cause permanent damage, but either way it's not free-floating in the blood anymore.

I blogged my ideas here re: what to do with the toys you already have, what to buy, how worried to be.
http://blog.tendercargo.com/personal...-recall-storm/

I promise, I'm not just spouting opinion here. we are enrolled in the Childhood Autism Risks in Genetics and the Environment study at the UCD MIND institute and being perosnally involved with metal toxicity as a mom and a shop owner, I take this stuff very seriosuly.

edit:
if you don't follow my link, *please* at least hear this.

"Our case doesn't have a simple answer- we have NOT owned any recalled toys and we have no obvious exposures in our environmental history. Presently we are looking for genetic differences, such as an inability to metabolize and reject the toxins that we all encounter in modern life. I don't worry about his toys, I worry about the times he teethed on my key chain, on my cell phone, or even maybe the pesticides on our food or the dyes on his Made in China pillowcase or WalMart sippy cups. I wonder about when we lived right next to the freeway or how I got amalgam fillings while still nursing him. My message to parents is to NOT live in fear of any of these things, because you can't possibly live a life escaping every one, and it may be years before science proves which things actually harmed us and which prove safe."


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## JesseMomme (Apr 6, 2002)

After I got done reeling, I decided to calm down and keep the MD toys that I do have and not "bar" the kids getting them for Christmas. I do still have to weed through the toys though.







: I will of course be more diligent about checking labels in the future.


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cchrissyy* 
OMG.

OK guys, I hope I can help. here are my crednentials:

1) my DS had heavy metal toxicity to lead, mercury, and arcenic.

2) we've particpated in studies and lots of testing and Dr meetings on this issue

3) I retail toys, including a little M&D

OK, so I wish I'd seen this post sooner to correct two of the OP's biggest misconceptions- first, home lead test kits are VERY innacurate. Google it, they are practically useless because they give tons of false positives AND false negatives
second, blood lead levels fall NATURALLY. You could remove any random thing in your house, wait a while, and levels should fall. that's because blood levels only detect recent exposures, and as time passes, some is excreted, and some latches onto your organs to cause permanent damage, but either way it's not free-floating in the blood anymore.

I blogged my ideas here re: what to do with the toys you already have, what to buy, how worried to be.
http://blog.tendercargo.com/personal...-recall-storm/

I promise, I'm not just spouting opinion here. we are enrolled in the Childhood Autism Risks in Genetics and the Environment study at the UCD MIND institute and being perosnally involved with metal toxicity as a mom and a shop owner, I take this stuff very seriosuly.

edit:
if you don't follow my link, *please* at least hear this.

"Our case doesn't have a simple answer- we have NOT owned any recalled toys and we have no obvious exposures in our environmental history. Presently we are looking for genetic differences, such as an inability to metabolize and reject the toxins that we all encounter in modern life. I don't worry about his toys, I worry about the times he teethed on my key chain, on my cell phone, or even maybe the pesticides on our food or the dyes on his Made in China pillowcase or WalMart sippy cups. I wonder about when we lived right next to the freeway or how I got amalgam fillings while still nursing him. My message to parents is to NOT live in fear of any of these things, because you can't possibly live a life escaping every one, and it may be years before science proves which things actually harmed us and which prove safe."

thank you for posting mama but you must have misread my OP.
i *KNOW* that the home lead tests don't work that why we hired a professional to come out.

i also know number rise and fall naturally. believe me we dealt with dd's high lead levels for a year, we are not uneducated when it comes to lead levels. dd's levels stayed up unti lthe toys we removed a year later. same goes for my best friends child. please re-read my OP and any posts that follwed so you know where I am coming from







thank you for your input though!


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

I can't get on this site yet, it's so busy but they did toxin testing on M&D toys and have the results here:
http://www.healthytoys.org/product.s...a%20%26%20Doug
I haven't seen it yet, am waiting for it to load

ETA:
They tested one M&D toy, the shape sorting cube with wooden blocks:
http://www.healthytoys.org/product.d...p?getrecno=289
results were in the green (LOW) with arsenic detected in the yellow pentagon (2 ppm). Lead, Cadmium, Chlorine/PVC, and Mercury tested for 0 ppm in every toy component.


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

what interesting, after exploring that site for a bit, is that lots of the safest toys are Made In China and the thing that tested highest for lead was made in Italy. It's so often assumed that Made in China = not safe and Made In Europe = safe and that's clearly not the case.


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## BennyPai (Jul 22, 2005)

: So much information to process. Oy.
I did wonder about M&D's low prices, but our budget is tight and I was more than willing to accept it.







:


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## melissa17s (Aug 3, 2004)

On the topic of lead... did you see this article on the Motherings main page about pvc toys and lead? http://www.mothering.com/sections/ac...ember2007.html


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## counterGOPI (Jan 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *melissa17s* 
On the topic of lead... did you see this article on the Motherings main page about pvc toys and lead? http://www.mothering.com/sections/ac...ember2007.html

i know scary isn't it, i rember hearing about that when dd was about 3 months old and thats when i first made the switch to be plastic free with her items and within the home.


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

That healthytoys.org looks like a great link! I'm not done looking at it yet, but it looks promising!


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

another Melissa & Doug toy was tested by the people I linked to above and was found to be good enough to make their "Best Toys" list here:

http://www.healthytoys.org/product.least.php

You can request specific toys be tested and then vote for that toy to be the next tested. I think that if you have a specific concern, they have the capabilities to do real actual cold hard scientific testing.


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## Manonash (Jun 2, 2006)

Quote:

Melissa and Doug toys probably DO have lead in them, but since it's under the legal limit, they can claim that it's "safe". Now I don't know about everyone else, but I am sick and tired of our countries low standards for toxicity! Why do we allow things that in other countries are banned? Things like lead, phthalates, teflon, and genetically modified food. These things are not only in our system, but in our childrens, running through our breastmilk, in their mouthes under the guise of "baby safe" toys. It makes me so angy I could spit
Geeesh! When will this stop? Honestly, I don't know what is safe and what is not anymore







:


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## Neth Naneth (Aug 11, 2006)

The HealthyToys.org site is great. We only had the one M&D shape sorter and I remove the yellow blocks. Thanks for sharing the link.


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## MommyErin (Jul 10, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cchrissyy* 
<SNIP>
second, blood lead levels fall NATURALLY. You could remove any random thing in your house, wait a while, and levels should fall. that's because blood levels only detect recent exposures, and as time passes, some is excreted, and some latches onto your organs to cause permanent damage, but either way it's not free-floating in the blood anymore."

This I know to be true. DS blood test came back at a safe level but his URINE test that followed a *chelating agent* showed his levels of mercury and lead to be through the roof as well as high arsenic levels. If the blood tests continue to show high levels, then the exposure is ongoing. So in that sense, the OPs story makes sense -- the blood levels didn't drop until the point of exposure was removed.

And on that note, does anyone else feel like moving to the most remote area you can find and holing up there forever?


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## ILuvMyBaby (Feb 24, 2004)

this is so sad


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## reducereuserecycle (Jan 16, 2007)

i really don't trust that new HealthyToys website. As mentioned a lot on MDC, there are many different lots of toys that are made. Just by testing one toy (or even several different ones) does not mean that all of that toy that is produced is safe.

i prefer to not give dd any M&D and i took away the ones she already owned. I'm not going to take away the Haba toys that she already has, but I'm not going to buy anymore.


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## Katheda (Jun 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *reducereuserecycle* 
i really don't trust that new HealthyToys website.

So you don't trust this group to give accurate info?

http://www.EcoCenter.org/about/about.php

Who do you trust then? They are an independent environmental group that has been around for over 30 years that saw a need for testing toys and filled it. I really appreciate it and will be adding them to my list of charitable contributions.

They are the same people who did the expose on toxins in cars and car seats. Cool! Will definitely support them in their efforts to keep us informed.

http://www.EcoCenter.org/publication...blications.php


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## Mama2Bug (Feb 18, 2005)

What I think is saddest is that this topic is just more fuel for the "Mommy Wars" fire. Now we have one more thing to judge other mothers for- the standards they hold for their kids toys. There's a new hierarchy of qualifications.

"I only allow my kids to have handcrafted, wooden toys made in the USA."

"I can't afford to replace their toys so we have to go on a case-by-case basis."

etc.

So now we (collectively) are judging each other based on which organizations we trust to test toys, what we can afford/are willing to replace, how we dispose of toys deemed not suitable....

I just feel like saying "Keep your hands in your own toy box!" I mean,







but seriously. Everyone here loves their kids and is trying to do their best by them. We all have different comfort levels. We're arguing over toys that *haven't even been proven dangerous.* Let's allow each other the freedom to make our own choices without being snarky. We have bigger fish to fry, right? Like CIO or spanking, or a million other things that actually _warrant_ judgement. No need to tear each other down over whether one wooden toy is safer than another.


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## sweetieberlin (Mar 30, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama2Bug* 
What I think is saddest is that this topic is just more fuel for the "Mommy Wars" fire. Now we have one more thing to judge other mothers for- the standards they hold for their kids toys. There's a new hierarchy of qualifications.

"I only allow my kids to have handcrafted, wooden toys made in the USA."

"I can't afford to replace their toys so we have to go on a case-by-case basis."

etc.

So now we (collectively) are judging each other based on which organizations we trust to test toys, what we can afford/are willing to replace, how we dispose of toys deemed not suitable....

I just feel like saying "Keep your hands in your own toy box!" I mean,







but seriously. Everyone here loves their kids and is trying to do their best by them. We all have different comfort levels. We're arguing over toys that *haven't even been proven dangerous.* Let's allow each other the freedom to make our own choices without being snarky. We have bigger fish to fry, right? Like CIO or spanking, or a million other things that actually _warrant_ judgement. No need to tear each other down over whether one wooden toy is safer than another.

Well said!!!


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## cloudswinger (Jan 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyErin* 
And on that note, does anyone else feel like moving to the most remote area you can find and holing up there forever?









Well, since lead and arsenic and any number of toxins can occur naturally in soils, where in the world would you think that would be? I dunno, there might be a reason it's unpopulated.


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## mercy589 (Jun 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *reducereuserecycle* 
i really don't trust that new HealthyToys website. As mentioned a lot on MDC, there are many different lots of toys that are made. Just by testing one toy (or even several different ones) does not mean that all of that toy that is produced is safe.

i prefer to not give dd any M&D and i took away the ones she already owned. I'm not going to take away the Haba toys that she already has, but I'm not going to buy anymore.

Understandable! I think they may mention this on the site, that there are many different factories, lots, etc and the testing doesnt mean your particular toy is safe or unsafe. Its a great start though to get people's eyes opened to all the junk that can be in toys. Arsenic in a teether??? I dont care how many ppms it is, its still unacceptable!!! I'm appalled!


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## calebsmama03 (Feb 6, 2004)

I know there is some question as to the validity of the testing done on the healthytoys website and whether it is extensive enough but I wanted to point out that they have a system where by you can vote for toys that have been nominated for testing - they test the most voted for itesm. The M&D cutting food set is listed and is currently in the top 10. Would be great if lots of MDC mamas voted for it to at least get SOME outside, independent testing of M&D. I have always been suspicious of M&D due to the MIC and mass-production issues but as it is so affordable ad readily available we've been given a TON from family members.

To the OP and others who've been dealing with lead-injured children


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## SleeplessMommy (Jul 16, 2005)

For whatever its worth, I looked at some M&D toys in a store today. Three different products were made in Vietnam. Not all of their production is in China.

When healthytoys.org has more data (for example 10 or 100 toys tested from each company) it will be a very useful site.

There is no "controversy" about the accuracy of XRF testing - it is accurate and reports what elements are inside the item, down to a certain depth. Some of the companies with lead in the products are claiming that if the lead won't leach out, its not a problem -that is where the controversy is.


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## calebsmama03 (Feb 6, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SleeplessMommy* 
For whatever its worth, I looked at some M&D toys in a store today. Three different products were made in Vietnam. Not all of their production is in China.

When healthytoys.org has more data (for example 10 or 100 toys tested from each company) it will be a very useful site.

There is no "controversy" about the accuracy of XRF testing - it is accurate and reports what elements are inside the item, down to a certain depth. Some of the companies with lead in the products are claiming that if the lead won't leach out, its not a problem -that is where the controversy is.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. The controvery I was referring to was not over whether XRF is accurate or not, ITA 100% that I don't care if it passes a leachability test or not I want NO LEAD in my kids stuff (see post under the laptop lunches discussion). Rather it's the issue you bring up in your post initially - more toys from each brand need to be tested. Still I think getting the cutting food set on their radar to test will be a good start, then more sets can be nominated/voted on to get the more representative sample to determine whether a problem exists.


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## Luke2:51b (Jul 18, 2007)

I just want to cry!
(or scream....)


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## MommyErin (Jul 10, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cloudswinger* 
Well, since lead and arsenic and any number of toxins can occur naturally in soils, where in the world would you think that would be? I dunno, there might be a reason it's unpopulated.


















I guess we're all just screwed.









In all seriousness, keeping your point in mind, it's more important than ever to cut out any unneccessary sources from our homes. And that, my friends, is becoming a frightful challenge!


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## SillyLilStinkweed (Jul 9, 2007)

Ladies,
Not to scare you. Because I know what it's like to be obsessive, in this world! But furniture, carpet, mattresses and carseats are treated with fire retardant and formaldehyde!!

I put a thick quilt on my couch as some sort of barrier. I have washed my carseat covers.... carpet, well, not much you can do. Maybe shampoo it? I have also gotten my son the cheapest organic mattress I could find, but it's not comfortable at all! So I have a memory foam topper on top, which defeats the whole purpose.! I wanted to get a natural foam bed, but now have learned that it has naturally occurring toxins and isn't recommended for children because it's a high allergen. So.... after the holidays, I'm going to make a millet topper and millet pillows with wool batting, myself, with my sewing machine. When I get my tax refund, I will buy a double size bed for my daughter and I, but will make a double size topper until then. This will be so CHEAP compared to buying something organic. We spend a huge chunk of our lives sleeping. So by having an organic bed, you can cut down your exposure. UGH.. I just picture my little ones, breathing right up against the mattress all night with nothing but a sheet and mattress pad in between. I'd rather cover the entire bed in PLASTIC. Maybe I am obsessive. Organic mattresses are expensive. I've spent so much time worried about my kids beds, I hate to pass it on, but maybe I should.


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## Radhanuga (Jun 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SillyLilStinkweed* 
Ladies,

I put a thick quilt on my couch as some sort of barrier. I have washed my carseat covers.... carpet, well, not much you can do. Maybe shampoo it? I have also gotten my son the cheapest organic mattress I could find, but it's not comfortable at all! So I have a memory foam topper on top, which defeats the whole purpose.! I wanted to get a natural foam bed, but now have learned that it has naturally occurring toxins and isn't recommended for children because it's a high allergen. So.... after the holidays, I'm going to make a millet topper and millet pillows with wool batting, myself, with my sewing machine. When I get my tax refund, I will buy a double size bed for my daughter and I, but will make a double size topper until then. This will be so CHEAP compared to buying something organic. We spend a huge chunk of our lives sleeping. So by having an organic bed, you can cut down your exposure. UGH.. I just picture my little ones, breathing right up against the mattress all night with nothing but a sheet and mattress pad in between. I'd rather cover the entire bed in PLASTIC. Maybe I am obsessive. Organic mattresses are expensive. I've spent so much time worried about my kids beds, I hate to pass it on, but maybe I should.

My baby sleeps on an organic cotton crib/toddler size futon, no foam or latex or anything. It might not be the most comfortable according to western standards, but Japanese people have been sleeping on them for centuries and are fine.
I'm going to order a twin size one for my son soon.


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## melissa17s (Aug 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SillyLilStinkweed* 
Ladies,
Not to scare you. Because I know what it's like to be obsessive, in this world! But furniture, carpet, mattresses and carseats are treated with fire retardant and formaldehyde!!

I put a thick quilt on my couch as some sort of barrier. I have washed my carseat covers.... carpet, well, not much you can do. Maybe shampoo it? I have also gotten my son the cheapest organic mattress I could find, but it's not comfortable at all! So I have a memory foam topper on top, which defeats the whole purpose.! I wanted to get a natural foam bed, but now have learned that it has naturally occurring toxins and isn't recommended for children because it's a high allergen. So.... after the holidays, I'm going to make a millet topper and millet pillows with wool batting, myself, with my sewing machine. When I get my tax refund, I will buy a double size bed for my daughter and I, but will make a double size topper until then. This will be so CHEAP compared to buying something organic. We spend a huge chunk of our lives sleeping. So by having an organic bed, you can cut down your exposure. UGH.. I just picture my little ones, breathing right up against the mattress all night with nothing but a sheet and mattress pad in between. I'd rather cover the entire bed in PLASTIC. Maybe I am obsessive. Organic mattresses are expensive. I've spent so much time worried about my kids beds, I hate to pass it on, but maybe I should.

Did your child specify that they were uncomfortable on the organic mattress or do you assume it because it is uncomfortable to you? I only ask because most children's mattress are designed for little bodies and adults should find them uncomfortable.


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## SillyLilStinkweed (Jul 9, 2007)

Melissa, interesting. He never complained, it was uncomfortable for me! Thanks for getting me thinking. Hmmmm. And yes it is designed for a kid, but has no pillow top. Is very firm.

Rdhanuga, I went to a kids bday party. They were very crunchy all natural types and their 5 year old son slept on a futon mattress on the floor.


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## mamadelbosque (Feb 6, 2007)

We have a simple "no toys made in China" rule in our house... I'm a fan of Haba (wooden only) & Selecta, and feel like Plan Toys are pretty safe and OK too. Holtzinger, Heros are also on my lists of OK toys... I feel much better about toys that are made in Europe where they have strict quality control and the workers aren't paid slave wages... For me not buying MIC as much as humanly possible is as much safety as it is ethics. I simply can't justify buying stuff that is essentially made with slave/sweat shop/child labor (which is what chinese goods are made with - 1-4 inspections, annouced 6 months in advance don't assure me of safety or ethical standars being up held).


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## mommymarliah (Jun 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SillyLilStinkweed* 
Ladies,
Not to scare you. Because I know what it's like to be obsessive, in this world! But furniture, carpet, mattresses and carseats are treated with fire retardant and formaldehyde!!

I put a thick quilt on my couch as some sort of barrier. I have washed my carseat covers.... carpet, well, not much you can do. Maybe shampoo it? I have also gotten my son the cheapest organic mattress I could find, but it's not comfortable at all! So I have a memory foam topper on top, which defeats the whole purpose.! I wanted to get a natural foam bed, but now have learned that it has naturally occurring toxins and isn't recommended for children because it's a high allergen. So.... after the holidays, I'm going to make a millet topper and millet pillows with wool batting, myself, with my sewing machine. When I get my tax refund, I will buy a double size bed for my daughter and I, but will make a double size topper until then. This will be so CHEAP compared to buying something organic. We spend a huge chunk of our lives sleeping. So by having an organic bed, you can cut down your exposure. UGH.. I just picture my little ones, breathing right up against the mattress all night with nothing but a sheet and mattress pad in between. I'd rather cover the entire bed in PLASTIC. Maybe I am obsessive. Organic mattresses are expensive. I've spent so much time worried about my kids beds, I hate to pass it on, but maybe I should.

I hear ya, I actually do have the kids mattress wrapped in plastic (the thick bag it came in in fact). Its so scary that we are inhaling all those toxins all night! I told DH we have to get an organic mattress for our bed when we get a new one and that any other new ones need to be.

So are futon matresses safe? Maybe I should just get the kids a funton matress instead...wonder if Icould cut one in half to make two twin size bed matresses....


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## melissa17s (Aug 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommymarliah* 
I hear ya, I actually do have the kids mattress wrapped in plastic (the thick bag it came in in fact). Its so scary that we are inhaling all those toxins all night! I told DH we have to get an organic mattress for our bed when we get a new one and that any other new ones need to be.

So are futon matresses safe? Maybe I should just get the kids a funton matress instead...wonder if Icould cut one in half to make two twin size bed matresses....

Leaving it wrapped in plastic sounds more toxic than airing out the mattress. Leave it for a couple of days unwrapped in a well ventilated place or outside. Plastics off-gas as much or more than mattresses.


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## Subhuti (Feb 18, 2005)

Another great reason to NOT buy things made in China:

for the last fifty years the Chinese government and army has been carrying out a literal genocide in Tibet. I recently started doing a lot of reading about Tibet, for spiritual reasons, and discovered this hidden, ongoing problem.

China invaded Tibet in the late fifties and killed over one million people. They destroyed six thousand monasteries. They still use torture (yes, we are not the only ones) in prisons. They enforce sterilization of tibetan women in their twenties. For simply going to a demonstration, people are thrown into prisons for decades. decades. Within, they are starved and used as slave labor.

It is religious and cultural and human destruction. When I finally realized all this about a month ago, it really helped me to STop buying MIC toys.

Liz


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## tbone (Dec 17, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CatskillMtnMama* 
Another great reason to NOT buy things made in China:

for the last fifty years the Chinese government and army has been carrying out a literal genocide in Tibet. I recently started doing a lot of reading about Tibet, for spiritual reasons, and discovered this hidden, ongoing problem.

China invaded Tibet in the late fifties and killed over one million people. They destroyed six thousand monasteries. They still use torture (yes, we are not the only ones) in prisons. They enforce sterilization of tibetan women in their twenties. For simply going to a demonstration, people are thrown into prisons for decades. decades. Within, they are starved and used as slave labor.

It is religious and cultural and human destruction. When I finally realized all this about a month ago, it really helped me to STop buying MIC toys.

Liz

I agree Liz, the lives of millions of Tibetan people have been ruined by the Chinese gov't. I spent some time in Dharamshala, HP, India were the Tibetan Gov't in exile is located. The refugees forced out of there homeland, many just children had to travel through rugged mountains and harsh weather to escape Chinese persecution. These children, if they survive the journey, are then alone without parents in a foreign country and work to provide for themselves. From my experience, Tibetans as a whole are so warm, generous, kindhearted, and peaceful people. It's so sad how such a wonderful culture be so viciousally (sp?) attacked.


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