# please remove



## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

"Content removed by Moderator/copyright concerns" awaiting her edit


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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

Um.. that deserved a CPS call that day.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Her parents need to call CPS yesterday!

CPS has the resources to investigate this. If the child has already told her mom this and mom has done nothing, it must go further.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Uhm, I'd call CPS, and I'm usually slow to recommend that. She might be traumatized by a foster home, but I'd give it a 95% chance she's being raped, based on that description. At least that's precisely how my dd would have described it at that age (I told her the real names for our parts but she called everything a "butt" for a long time). And it sounds like her mother isn't going to protect her. A random foster home would be preferable, IMO.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:

This happened tonight, I just got the e-mail. And is CPS going to put her in with some random foster family further traumatizing her?
Right now, it seems like the child is getting sexually abused by the boyfriend and her mother does not care or want to acknowledge it. The child will not go to a foster home if the grandparents can provide a safe environment for her (and are willing to keep her while this case is looked into).


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ToastyToes* 
If the mother is defensive about the BF, and the little girls says she's told her mom (so I assume that she at least tried to talk to her mom about it) I'd go straight to CPS. I think talking to the mom risks angering the mom and/or BF & putting the girl at further risk.

I agree. I _would not_ tell the mom that the little girl mentioned this.


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## Lisa1970 (Jan 18, 2009)

You need to call CPS. Sounds like the mother is not interested in giving up her boyfriend or the fringe benefits of for the sake of the child. Please please call.


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## Maeve (Feb 21, 2004)

Yes, please call. Right away. Since the mother doesn't seem to want to put her child first, someone needs to.


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

wow, that's brutal. Ideally the little girl would be able to stay with her grandparents at least until an investigation is carried out -- she should definitely be taken to see a child therapist who might know how to get more information out of her without traumatizing her, and possibly examined by a doctor who is also familiar with how to connect with children who have possibly been sexually abused -- I can't even imagine a child having to go through that.







I suppose the first step then is calling CPS? I do think I'd call CPS before the mama, in this case...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm one of the last on here to _ever_ recommend calling CPS...and I'd tell the grandmother right away that she should call - and probably look into the possibility of a placement with her, if that's how things go down.

What an awful thing to hear.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## chaoticzenmom (May 21, 2005)

I don't think I"d call cps first, I'd go straight to the police station with the girl and have her tell the police. This is not a cps investigation thing, it's a criminal thing. It needs to be dealt with by the police. Gramma should take the girl there right away and file a report.


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## katheek77 (Mar 13, 2007)

You call CPS. You tell them what you heard.

In the case of probable sexual abuse (and, honestly, in what context does a grown man put his "butt" against a 4 year olds where it hurts), you err on the side of caution, which means protecting the child. Quite frankly, she sounds like she's in a situation where she is being traumatized, whether by the boyfriend or someone else is for others to sort out, but, in the meantime, she needs to be protected.

You call CPS. End of story.


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## PlayaMama (Apr 1, 2007)

jeez.









i really hope that this little girl is kept safe. ugh, i feel sick. thank you for doing something about this.


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## Maeve (Feb 21, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katheek77* 
You call CPS. You tell them what you heard.

In the case of probable sexual abuse (and, honestly, in what context does a grown man put his "butt" against a 4 year olds where it hurts), you err on the side of caution, which means protecting the child. Quite frankly, she sounds like she's in a situation where she is being traumatized, whether by the boyfriend or someone else is for others to sort out, but, in the meantime, she needs to be protected.

You call CPS. End of story.


I completely agree. Honestly, I wouldn't count on the mom to do anything since she seems to not want to believe it.
I would not be able to live with myself if I thought something was going on and didn't try to do something about it.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## lalaland42 (Mar 12, 2006)

Let the professionals work this out. Unfortunately it sounds like this little girl is being sexually abused.







CPS and/or the police need to be informed immediately.


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## Maeve (Feb 21, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
I'm not in their state and don't even have their address info, so it would have to be my friend or the grandparents calling


If you have their full names, plus city, you can get their address. Plus, people can call CPS without knowing the address, so that shouldn't be a problem.
Or is it that you don't feel you shouldn't call?


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Maeve (Feb 21, 2004)

I understand, but my family has been forever damaged by sexual abuse so I guess I'm looking at it from the other side.


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## soso-lynn (Dec 11, 2007)

I agree with whoever said this was a case for the police, not just CPS.

I would advise your friend's grandarents to go straight to the police (or call them over) to open an investigation. The police will contact CPS to arrange a placement. If they have a camera or recorder they can even shoot a little video of the child explaining what happened if they think she will be too intimidated by police and other adults to talk to them.

If they want to be taken seriously, they need to react in proportion to the situation. In this case, calling the police is definitely more appropriate than waiting, even if she is safe for now.

The reason I would not call the mother first is that she might get angry and decide to come pick up her daughter immediately (maybe even with the boyfriend). That would really complicate things if the mother then does not want to cooperate.


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## lalaland42 (Mar 12, 2006)

Can you call your friend and talk to her over the phone about calling CPS?








I am so sorry that you were a victim of CPS, however, I would say it is most likely true that this little girl is being raped and her mom is turning a blind eye. She needs someone to protect her. Beyond the immediate need for getting away from this man, she needs to have someone backing her up and not minimizing. At some point she will be an adult and that future adult needs to know everyone did their damnedest to protect her.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *soso-lynn* 
If they have a camera or recorder they can even shoot a little video of the child explaining what happened if they think she will be too intimidated by police and other adults to talk to them.

While I think that calling the police is reasonable option, PLEASE do not have the grandparents get the child to tape anything. IF there is abuse going on (and that's an open question right now), the grandparents don't want to be in a position where they're accused of leading the child in questioning. A good defense lawyer could make mincemeat of the video tape and IF (and it is an if) the guy is guilty, he could walk free.

The police should have access to people who are TRAINED to do this.


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## Learning_Mum (Jan 5, 2007)

You need to do something. Sure, give the family a couple of days, but if they decide to leave it you need to call someone.

This poor little girl is begging for help, and everyone is shutting her down. So far all the adults in her life have given her the impression that what is being done to her is OK.

How will she feel when she's older, and realises that lots of people knew and no one helped. What is going on now is damaging. Not only is she possibly being molested but the people that she loves and trusts and that she is turning to for help aren't doing anything.

Please don't sit by and do nothing.


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## SquishyKitty (Jun 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
I don't know the names of the grandparents other than the last name. I didn't think about trying to look up the info, they have a very common last name. As it is, the girl is safe for this week, I think it would be appropriate to at least give the family time to act on this.

My family was destroyed by a CPS call from a stranger ten years ago, so I am wary just for that reason, yes.. and I am hearing this filtered through several people as well. If the girl were in imminent danger tonight, I would probably do my best to find out their info and report, but that is not the case here.

When it comes to sexual abuse, you don't take a wait and see approach. CPS exists to help out children like this little girl. She needs their intervention. And you need a professional child psychologist to question the child, not grandparents or emotionally involved family members who will ask very leading questions. Get some impartial people involved now, or get the grandparents to do the same.


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## doctormom (Nov 11, 2005)

I'll second (third?) the PP who said - the grandparents should not question the child further about this incident. If she brings it up, they should listen neutrally, but not ask leading questions. They should write down what she says, using the exact words of the child, and dating all written records. A notebook for this purpose would be ideal. They will want to provide those to CPS.

A trained interviewer will be able to elicit the most accurate, appropriate information - and will be the most believable witness for the court system, should a criminal or custody case arise. There are some excellent child psychologists who are trained to do skilled interviewing in a developmentally appropriate way that is not traumatic or fearful for the child. The ER or the police in the community will know who to contact.

Calling CPS is appropriate given the information you have shared. The adults responsible for protecting this little girl need to take steps to protect her, and it is sad that her mother has been unable or unwilling to do so. I wouldn't confront the mother - she may threaten or coach the child to change her story - just encourage your friend to call CPS and enlist some professional help.


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## Freefromitall (Sep 15, 2008)

I'd call CPS ASAP.
They *may* place her in a kinship placement, if the grandparents are willing. But I don't know that for sure, it's just that its a possibility.

ETA: This 4yr old has asked for help AT LEAST twice now. Her mother has already let her down. Please encourage your friend to report what was said to her!


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## Bellabaz (Feb 27, 2008)

I read the op. DId the gm ask the girl to point to where her "butt" is? If so was it her genital area or butt, there fore indicating molestation or rape? DId she give anymore setail about how the man hurt her? B/c I think this is serious and should absolutley be treated as such but I also am not clear from the details that the little girl is meaning rape.


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## Freefromitall (Sep 15, 2008)

rape or molestation, I think the response should be pretty much the same. A phone call tothe police or to CPS


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## LaffNowCryLater (May 2, 2003)

Cps needs to be called....like yesterday!


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## prothyraia (Feb 12, 2007)

I've seen folks on MDC respond with "call cps" for many many things that I don't think warrant that kind of action.

This is not one of those times. *I can't think of anything that matches the description the little girl gave other than rape.*

I also don't think that you can know for sure that the girl is not in imminent danger. Depending on how the conversation with her mother goes, she may *not* end up spending the rest of the week with her grandmother.

You need to make sure that the authorities (CPS, police) are made aware of this as soon as possible. Ideally, the girls mother would have contacted them already by now. If she has, great, you or your friend won't be telling anyone anything new. If she hasn't- SOMEONE needs to. *YOU* need to make that happen, for her sake.

My husband works with abused children. This girl needs to have someone with the proper training listen to her and figure out what's going on.


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## mamarhu (Sep 12, 2004)

I am both a foster parent and a custodial (kinship) grandparent. I know the System with all its flaws, but this is really a case to intervene! Please do whatever you can to encourage the grandparents to call CPS.

And update us if you can. Thank you for getting involved.


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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## caro113 (Aug 25, 2008)

I just found this thread but I'm going to ask the mean question now. Why exactly did her grandmother allow that child to go back to that home? If she suspected abuse, the last thing she should have done was allow that child to go back there. I certainly hope she reports it herself, as that will look very suspicious to the authorities.
I certainly hope that little girl is okay. Please give us an update as soon as you hear anything more. People who abuse little children that way are true evil and deserve to rot forever in jail. Hopefully it's nothing more than just inappropriateness, like the two of them co-sleeping butt to butt with him ramming into her at night.
Let us know! You and M are in our thoughts!


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

I'm with everybody else. CPS needs to be called, as soon as possible.

I am so glad to read in the update that it sounds like this is going to happen, and happen very soon.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chaoticzenmom* 
I don't think I"d call cps first, I'd go straight to the police station with the girl and have her tell the police. This is not a cps investigation thing, it's a criminal thing.

As a small point of clarification, CPS or the police can take a report, and either way, one is going to report to the other in almost every place in the U.S. with something like this. Because even if where you are, CPS deals only with immediate-family abuse (this is true in many regions), the mom is failing to protect.

Rest assurred, even if this is taken to CPS first, this will be taken to the police, and it will become a criminal case.

CPS may be able to keep things a little more "child-friendly" than the police, but that varies a lot from place to place.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maeve* 
I understand, but my family has been forever damaged by sexual abuse so I guess I'm looking at it from the other side.

And this is sooooooooo important to really hear.

Finally, I want to second:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LynnS6* 
While I think that calling the police is reasonable option, PLEASE do not have the grandparents get the child to tape anything. IF there is abuse going on (and that's an open question right now), the grandparents don't want to be in a position where they're accused of leading the child in questioning. A good defense lawyer could make mincemeat of the video tape and IF (and it is an if) the guy is guilty, he could walk free.

The police should have access to people who are TRAINED to do this.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *doctormom* 
I'll second (third?) the PP who said - the grandparents should not question the child further about this incident. If she brings it up, they should listen neutrally, but not ask leading questions. They should write down what she says, using the exact words of the child, and dating all written records. A notebook for this purpose would be ideal. They will want to provide those to CPS.

A trained interviewer will be able to elicit the most accurate, appropriate information - and will be the most believable witness for the court system, should a criminal or custody case arise. There are some excellent child psychologists who are trained to do skilled interviewing in a developmentally appropriate way that is not traumatic or fearful for the child. The ER or the police in the community will know who to contact.


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## reece19 (May 21, 2008)

I'm glad her aunt is going to make a report.

Let her know not to be too surprised if the police won't take a report and tell her to go to CPS first. Most cops know better than to interview a child about sexual abuse and will defer to a forensic investigator. Just take whatever advice they give and make a CPS referral.


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

I do not forsee that visit going smoothly, but my fingers are crossed that the mama will not feel so defensive that she can't do the right thing... good for your friend for taking immediate action!!


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## caro113 (Aug 25, 2008)

Okay, good. I am soo glad that she is still with the grandparents. That really concerned me for a bit there.
I've heard in cases of sexual abuse, the child will have a personality change or something like that. Has anyone noticed anything?


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caro113* 
I've heard in cases of sexual abuse, the child will have a personality change or something like that. Has anyone noticed anything?

My sister, both female cousins and I were all sexually abused as children. Only one of my cousins showed any signs of it in the short term, although there were some long-term effects of one kind or another for all of us. Unfortunately, the one cousin who did manifest any visible signs already had a challenging personality and nobody picked up on it. (Mind you, this was over 30 years ago, and people weren't anywhere near as aware of this as they are now.)


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## prothyraia (Feb 12, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
She's going to tell A exactly what the girl said to their mother. If A refuses to take the girl to police to file a report, then my friend and the grandma are going to give her the ultimatum and *will* contact the authorities. So, no matter how angry and bitter A might possibly get, she is going to have no choice and we figure she will opt to report this herself rather than having her sister or mom have to do it for her.

I'm glad it sounds like this girl is going to get the help (or at least, the investigation) she needs.

I hate to be pessimistic, but I have to point that it's possible her mother will *say* she'll go the police just to get grandma/your friend off her back, and then not follow through. I would suggest to your friend that she contact the authorities after giving the mother a chance to report first- even *if* the mother says she will. At the end of the conversation, something like "I'm going to contact the authorities on Saturday and tell them what I heard, but I wanted to talk to you and give you a chance to call them first."

Good for you for following through on this!


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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *prothyraia* 
I hate to be pessimistic, but I have to point that it's possible her mother will *say* she'll go the police just to get grandma/your friend off her back, and then not follow through. I would suggest to your friend that she contact the authorities after giving the mother a chance to report first- even *if* the mother says she will. At the end of the conversation, something like "I'm going to contact the authorities on Saturday and tell them what I heard, but I wanted to talk to you and give you a chance to call them first."

That's a good suggestion, for a sound reason.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## mamarhu (Sep 12, 2004)

Please call yourself. You really must. This kind of denial is so common. And it is all so sad.


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## ~Boudicca~ (Sep 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamarhu* 
Please call yourself. You really must. This kind of denial is so common. And it is all so sad.









I will







: all day long. To not do anything and possibly risk continuing abuse...it's unthinkable.


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

And the call needs to be made before the little girl goes back home, if she isn't back already after that conversation -- her mom sounds like she is in major denial if she is saying her dd "made it up" -- if my kid said something like that about my dh, I would not think they made it up, even though I KNOW there is no possibility of abuse, but I would wonder what they meant by it, yk? I'd wonder "ok, what is that little brain of theirs shifting to make it sound like that?" and I would gently ask them what they meant by it, and get more information, not write it off as a made up story. even if it is something that can be explained (and I don't know what that could be...) an investigation is 100% necessary, by people who know how to question kids in an entirely unbiased way.

for the record, I do "get" how kids can say things that seem wierd -- when my dd was about 18 months old, she and my mom and I were staying in a hotel for a wedding and my dd said "daddy's penis ouch" -- when the tension in the room was just totally unbearable, I explained that she had started grabbing dad's floaty bits in the bath and he told her "that's dad's penis, you can't grab it, it hurts" (because what else do you tell your 18 month old when they grab your bits?)... I am glad my mom believed me, but if she had felt compelled to call CPS, we would have cooperated fully, having nothing to hide.

the fact that this mama is TOTALLY dismissing this is an awful sign!!


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## sharon.gmc (Nov 17, 2008)

You should have the child checked by a doctor. I think a child her age will not make up any stories. . .


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## Mimi (Oct 8, 2008)

please do call, this is so terrible, that poor little girl! children don't make this sort of thing up without a reason,
& if there is a perfectly normal reason, like for the "daddies penis,ouch" then the mother could have explained it or would not just lie & say he never is alone with the little one!


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

Wow, saying prayers for this little girl and for mama's eyes and heart to open up and stop denying.

I hope that everyone gets through this situation and that all can heal. It would never occur to me to think my DD is making something up, why why why won't people listen with open hearts to their own children?


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## MadameXCupcake (Dec 14, 2007)

This is heartbreaking. Why is no one protecting the little girl. The mom should of called, the grandparents, your friend, or you.







This happens to way too many children and no one helps them.

The grandparents should not have gone to the mom, it should have been CPS or the police that night.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

Heartbreaking. Please, call yourself Mama. Call CPS and tell them what you have told us. Mom is in total denial and is obviously not going to protect that girl. A 4 year old does not make up stuff like that .. I've got a butt/fart obsessed 6 year old and he's never said anything close!!

Also, I'm sure the boyfriend is alone with her. It's nearly impossible to live together and not have your partner be alone with your child. A quick run to the store, walking the dog, there are a million times for them to be alone. It would actually be hard, and odd, to be so vigilant that they were never alone together.

Alarms going off everywhere ... please call CPS yourself, someone needs to protect this little girl!


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## Freefromitall (Sep 15, 2008)

ITA that if they've been living together for 3yrs it would be INCREDIBELY unlikely that he's never alone withthe girl.
I hope that if your friend won't call, that you will.


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## Dr.Worm (Nov 20, 2001)

Wow, this sucks so bad for the sweet little girl...updates?


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## texmama (Jun 4, 2005)

Yes, please call and give as much info to CPS as possible, your friends name, the grandparent's name, anything - they should be able to give you advice on what you can do to get someone to help this child. If the mother wasn't sensing abuse, why would she try to make sure the bf was never alone with the child in the first place?


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## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

How long is this family planning on waiting to protect this child







? This little person is asking for help. If my niece said anything like that to me I would act instantly. Not wait to bring it up to her mom after a movie. And if the mother isn't willing to take possible rape seriously, then how can she be relied on to tell the truth that the bf never bathes her daughter or is alone with her. Like pp's have said, it is impossible that they are never alone. Will somebody please call CPS? If not the family then you. I am seriously doubting that a four year old would make up rape, and that is exactly what it sounds like.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

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## mamachandi (Sep 21, 2002)

good luck you are doing the right thing. be sure to keep copies of all the emails that were sent to you.


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## prothyraia (Feb 12, 2007)

It's terrible that you have to deal with all of this because the people who SHOULD be taking care of this little girl are ignoring her. Thank goodness you, at least, care enough to intervene on her behalf.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

I'm so relieved SOMEONE is going to do the right thing here. I know this is hard, but you are taking the steps to protect this little girl when no one else is, and that is awesome.


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## flowers (Apr 8, 2004)

oh my. this is very sad, but I am glad you are involved. I'd go as far to say that you are involved for a reason, b/c no one else in this little person's life is able to protect her. I know it sucks. I know you don't want to do this, and I am the last person to recommend CPS, but this is the reason CPS exists. If there is no problem, then it won't be a problem. This girl is already traumatized.


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## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

You are doing the right thing. Better they hate you, than the little girl still suffering.


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## Rosehip (Dec 30, 2007)

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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

Somehow my friend or the grandparents forwarded her sister the link to this site and she read my update and is now supposedly on some rampage threatening to kill herself and is driving to pick up the girl now. I didn't realize when I cut and paste some posts from this site to show my friend, that the links were still working.

I won't be updating here anymore for this reason.


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## Mamafreya (May 13, 2004)

Elephantine, I am so so sorry that you have to deal with this but you really are doing the right thing. I am very disappointed in your friend.









Please do not let yourself feel bad or guilty for calling. I am sorry if your friend won't see this and gets mad at you but that's your friends problem. You are doing nothing wrong here. That little girl needs help and it really does sound like she's being abused. I've read the whole thread and not once did I have a doubt that calling authorities would be jumping the gun. You wouldn't be able to live with this if you didn't call and found out later that this guy really has been doing this all along. That would be much worse than losing a friend.









Maybe you should also keep a hard copy of the emails just in case you need them to prove that you have a legitimate concern.


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## Poogles0213 (May 18, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
I talked to my friend earlier this day and she told me she was going to call her mom one more time and then call CPS afterward. She seemed determined to do what is right.... but I just received an e-mail saying that she talked to her dad who is also telling her not to report... I responded saying M has told her first hand she has been raped and this horrible crime must be reported now.

So she wrote back saying that she can't go against her mother and father.. that they are going to handle it and get P out of their lives either way.

This, of course, is not good enough.







I can't believe I have to do this. I'm privy to this and there is no way for me to just wash my hands of it. I'm over 37 weeks pregnant and a hormonal wreck... I'm just angry that I have to be that random stranger that they are all going to hate for the rest of their lives. Why can't these people do what is right?? They already hate this boyfriend of A for other reasons, how can they be trying to cover this up???

And what if P escapes and violates more children?? The grandma is saying that "isn't her problem".

My friend suffers from clinical anxiety and depression as it is and her parents are telling her everything from this is going to cause A to commit suicide, to causing their divorce, to completely destroying their family. She's paranoid her sister is going to kill her b/c she has a key to her apartment. Her parents are being very manipulative and forbidding her to do this.

I'm just sick and angry... I am going to try to look up the address information for all the parties involved then I am going to call. I guess I will be losing a friend of 10 years... but this is soooo not my fault and soooooo not the little girl's fault.









There are tears streaming down my face as I type this. I would personally like to thank you for being brave enough to make the call. If this little girl is being abused (and I am in the camp that has a hard time believing it can be anything else) then you may very well be her savior. You can't imagine how much difference it makes to a survivor of sexual abuse to know someone cared enough to help them (or at least try). When noone helps or protects the child even when they've reached out for help it sends the message that _they don't matter_ and they should be _ashamed_...and there is devastating and lasting damage from that as the child begins to internalize these messages, coming to believe they are not lovable, not worthy of love or protection, they are dirty and are to be ashamed and secretive of what happened to them. They also almost always believe it was somehow their fault.

I can only hope that CPS is able to intervene and protect her.


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## Freefromitall (Sep 15, 2008)

Oh honey, add me to the list of those crying over this situation. I'll be praying for courage and safety for you, and for this little girl. You ARE doing the right thing, though it is hard.
I just wish this poor little girl's family were more concerned with protecting her from this monster, than they are with her mother's feelings.


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## lovingmommyhood (Jul 28, 2006)

I am so sorry elephantine. You should not let them stop you from posting here. The mother of the little girl is the one with the problem and that little girl has NOBODY to advocate for her. You are an amazing person to not sweep this under the rug. You know that kids do not make these things up. My heart is BREAKING for this baby. That mother needs a huge wake up call. She has to ask herself why she's even with a man that she doesn't supposedly allow to be alone with her daughter. I pray that this mother comes around and I pray that you will get that little girl the help she deserves.

God bless you!


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## Poogles0213 (May 18, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
Somehow my friend or the grandparents forwarded her sister the link to this site and she read my update and is now supposedly on some rampage threatening to kill herself and is driving to pick up the girl now. I didn't realize when I cut and paste some posts from this site to show my friend, that the links were still working.

I won't be updating here anymore for this reason.

Well, then, allow me to say that if the mother of that little girl happens to come back here and read this again: YOUR CHILD NEEDS YOU! NOTHING is more important than your child's safety, NOTHING! Even if you think there is a chance she is making it up, you are committing the worst kind of betrayal by dismissing it and not considering that there may be some truth. The message you send to her is that you love your BF more than her, that she is not worth it, that she is wrong to feel that she has the right to her own body. Chances are she will grow up to resent you, for never helping her. She may also grow up to repeat the pattern by either abusing others herself, or going from relationship to relationship with abusive men.

Please, I am begging you, as someone who has suffered through this, PLEASE talk to your daughter, PLEASE take her seriously, and PLEASE protect her!! I have spent the last six years of my life trying to pick up the pieces myself and I'm still not there yet. And the abuse your daughter may be suffering sounds even worse than what I went through.

What will you say to her, after she has grown and comes to you asking "WHY didn't you help me? WHY did you let him hurt me like that, when I told you it was happening?? How could you?"


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## JavaJunkie (Jan 16, 2009)

I hope that if these family members are reading this thread, that they take to heart all of these posts. That they realize that the little girl needs the adults in her life to step up and save her. My heart aches for this girl. She is going to need so much love and understanding to come through this. I hope she gets the help that she needs, poor baby.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Elephantine...I'm so sorry this is blowing up in such an ugly way. I was already concerned about the little girl, but the mom's denial is so blatant that I'm more convinced than I was that she's being sexually abused. It's bad enough that she's accusing her dd of making this up, and refusing to take it seriously. It's horrifying that she's claiming her boyfriend is never along with her daughter...because, if she believes that it's not safe for her dd to be around him, after he's lived with them for 3.5 years, then she shouldn't be with him at all. And, if she doesn't believe that (and hence is _not_ being hyper vigilant in the way that would imply), then she's flat out lying. That poor little girl.









I understand why the mom doesn't want face the possibility/probability that someone she's been intimate with is a pedophile. I truly do. I went through something similar with my ex and it was the most disturbing experience of my life. Fortunately, in my case, there was no concern of him actually having hurt anybody irl, _and_ I found out after the breakup...but it was still really upsetting. However, in _this_ case, the safety of her daughter is at stake, and she's going to have to face the ugly truth.

You might want to advise your friend to change her locks if she really is that worried about her sister potentially getting into her home and harming her or her family. In some ways, it sounds far out, but we all know people can be really irrational.


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## MittensKittens (Oct 26, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elephantine* 
I'm just angry that I have to be that random stranger that they are all going to hate for the rest of their lives.

At least one person will be grateful to you - the little girl


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## Sierra (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Poogles0213* 
Well, then, allow me to say that if the mother of that little girl happens to come back here and read this again: YOUR CHILD NEEDS YOU! NOTHING is more important than your child's safety, NOTHING! Even if you think there is a chance she is making it up, *you are committing the worst kind of betrayal by dismissing it and not considering that there may be some truth*. The message you send to her is that you love your BF more than her, that she is not worth it, that she is wrong to feel that she has the right to her own body. Chances are she will grow up to resent you, for never helping her. She may also grow up to repeat the pattern by either abusing others herself, or going from relationship to relationship with abusive men.

That's what I want to say as well (emphasis mine in the quote).

I can't believe that this poor child is being raped, being molested, and people are standing by doing nothing...worse than that, that this mother is allowing it to happen.

To the OP, I am so glad you are calling CPS. So glad. Someone has to be sane here.


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## MadameXCupcake (Dec 14, 2007)

I am sorry all of this has blown up in your face, but I think the reason you were included in being told is because you are the one who is going to save this little girl.

I wish someone would have saved me[not sexual abuse] and I know DH wishes the same. You are an amazing woman.


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

my heart goes out to you elephantine, and I'm so sorry this is taking you down this path, but YOU ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING!!!









The police need to be contacted immediately, if this mama is threatening to harm herself AND wanting to have her child with her -- that is an ugly combination, and under no circumstances should she be alone with that little girl right now!!! I am thinking I would actually call 911 at this point, if you have the address of the mom or the grandma's house, if she's making suicide threats, that's an immediate danger to her and her little girl, and the grandparents don't seem to be taking this seriously enough. If they don't report what they've heard about P, how will they manage to keep the little girl, or other kids safe?


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

I understand that you might not want or be able to give details, but will you at least let us know, if you get a chance, if the little girl is safe?

by the way, you have done nothing wrong in posting this -- you didn't include names or locations or anything else, so don't feel guilty about posting your concerns and questions here...


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## Frootloop (Aug 10, 2007)

I am sitting here bawling my eyes out right now.






















I literally want to throw up.

To the mother of this sweet baby girl, if you are reading this.. if ANY of the people who are turning your head in denial are reading this.. *HEAR ME NOW!!!!!!*

I am a woman who was molested by a family member repeatedly over a course of 8 years and NOT ONE PERSON would believe me - "he just wouldn't do such a thing".. I can honestly say, it messed me up for years. Hell, I'm STILL messed up in many ways. The betrayal I feel for my family members who knew about this and wouldn't help me.. I just can't even put it into words. That pain will never EVER go away. How could they do that to me? How can *you* do this to that baby? *HOW???* To turn a blind eye to what this child is telling you.. it's evil. YOU ARE FAILING TO PROTECT HER.

Sexual assault is ugly. It is. And I can't even begin to imagine finding out that someone I love is hurting my child in such an intimate way. It would kill me. But do you know what would kill me even more? Knowing that I didn't protect my baby from a monster when my baby was telling people that she was being hurt. I am begging you to listen to that baby. Please please please stop her from being hurt. *PLEASE*.

OP, I am immensely sorry that you are being put into this position. I can can only imagine that you are going through hell right now. But thank you. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for stepping in and trying to protect this child while her family, the people who should love and want to protect her the most, turn their heads. Please know that you are doing the right thing. You have done nothing wrong whatsoever.


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## punchy (May 26, 2006)

"I'm just angry that I have to be that random stranger that they are all going to hate for the rest of their lives."

Try the sentence out this way instead." I'm just glad that I can be that random stranger that one little girl will be grateful to for the rest of her life."

You are a fine woman indeed. Trust yourself, mama, and be courageous for that little girl.


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## donnaworkingmomto4 (Oct 26, 2008)

*


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## Mamafreya (May 13, 2004)

Mama, you did the right thing. You have done all you can and now just try to nurture yourself a little right now. Take a bath or something and decompress. Maybe veg out and watch something dumb on tv and eat some ice cream.

I believe that sending positive thoughts toward that little girl is a very powerful thing to do. Just imagine her happy and healthy and safe. I'll also be doing the same.

Thank you for trying to help that child.


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

I would keep making CPS reports, anonymously.


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## Dandelionkid (Mar 6, 2007)

Wow- you are so courageous. You did the right thing. This family is in denial- they are not reacting rationally!


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## Mimi (Oct 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Amylcd* 









I would keep making CPS reports, anonymously.









:


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

you did the right thing, and if the family had not been covering this all up the whole time, you wouldn't have had to do anything at all. I understand that the grandparents felt they could handle the situation on their own, but that guy NEEDED to be reported, investigated, and then dealt with accordingly. If he is innocent (which fleeing does not seem to indicate) then he has nothing to worry about.

big hugs to everyone who is trying to protect that little girl, but half-measures are not good enough!! sweeping it under the rug is NOT protecting her!!


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## prothyraia (Feb 12, 2007)




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## Mamafreya (May 13, 2004)

Just thought I would mention that if this is being monitored by one of family members of the little girl then it's really not going to be anonymous. Frankly, it shouldn't be anyway. They are in the wrong and Elephantine is only doing what any of us would do. I was just thinking that maybe this could cause her unnecessary stress by adding fuel to the fire so to speak.

I feel worried for you Elephantine. I hope you are doing okay.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

You did the right thing. I would continue making calls, too







.


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## Mimi (Oct 8, 2008)

it's a shame how _doing the right thing_ seems to be so very unusual these days. hope you are doing alright, you are one very courageous mama.
(& obviously doing what's best for this poor baby.)


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## flowers (Apr 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Amylcd* 









I would keep making CPS reports, anonymously.

yes. please keep reporting to CPS. I feel like they would take it more serious than the police.


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

Prayers for you and that little girl. You are brave for doing what you did, and you can have a CLEAR conscience! The fact that the BF fled says it ALL to me, and although it seems bleak right now...I'm sure authorities have noticed (as well as the GF - she's gotta live with herself).

You did the ONLY right thing there was to do here, speak up for an innocent child who was being ignored.

If they are monitoring this, they should know that their denial has harmed the family more than you trying to heal it.


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## lalaland42 (Mar 12, 2006)

I am sorry that the family is more worried about images than protecting an innocent girl.







You did the right thing.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

I would report to CPS, they will take you more seriously.

You have not done ANYTHING wrong. You did not report names or locations. This family is SO wrong for trying to brush this under the rug, putting that incompentent Mother's feelings above this innocent little girl's wellbeing. It's sick, it's awful, and they need a full CPS investigation.

I'm just so outraged at the stupidity of this family!!! What on EARTH are they thinking??!

Regardless, YOU have done what any sane person would do. Don't feel bad, you are the only life line for this little girl, her only chance of getting help. Please muster up the strength and call CPS, they will listen to you. They will investigate. And it so badly needs to be done ... it's painfully obvious no one is going to protect this little girl without it.


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## Frootloop (Aug 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mistymama* 
I would report to CPS, they will take you more seriously.

You have not done ANYTHING wrong. You did not report names or locations. This family is SO wrong for trying to brush this under the rug, putting that incompentent Mother's feelings above this innocent little girl's wellbeing. It's sick, it's awful, and they need a full CPS investigation.

I'm just so outraged at the stupidity of this family!!! What on EARTH are they thinking??!

Regardless, YOU have done what any sane person would do. Don't feel bad, you are the only life line for this little girl, her only chance of getting help. Please muster up the strength and call CPS, they will listen to you. They will investigate. And it so badly needs to be done ... it's painfully obvious no one is going to protect this little girl without it.

This. All of it.







:
I'm also not a huge fan of CPS, but there are times when they really do help children. This is one of those times. Again, OP.. you have done absolutely nothing wrong whatsoever.









I didn't sleep much last night because I couldn't stop thinking about that poor little girl. It was the first thing that popped into my head this morning. My heart completely breaks for her. I was only 1.5 yrs older than her when my molestation began. And I still remember that first time like it was yesterday.

To this child's family.. What do you believe that sweet girl is being taught right now? I'll tell you what.. the same things that **I** was taught. "Why tell anyone that it's happening? What's the point? They don't care. It doesn't matter what is being is being done to me.". Eventually, the thought process will develop into "It's not *MY* body. It belongs to someone else.". If she is one of the lucky ones, she won't have lifelong self esteem issues, she won't turn to drugs, she won't allow men to treat her like the piece of garbage that she believes she is at the time, and she won't have lifelong trust issues.
This isn't about YOU. This isn't about trying to tear family and friends apart. This is about protecting something so very precious. The fact that the man fled speaks VOLUMES. Why can't you see that? No one is worth defending over a helpless child who has been hurt.


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## isaoma (Dec 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Frootloop* 
To this child's family.. What do you believe that sweet girl is being taught right now? I'll tell you what.. the same things that **I** was taught. "Why tell anyone that it's happening? What's the point? They don't care. It doesn't matter what is being is being done to me.". Eventually, the thought process will develop into "It's not *MY* body. It belongs to someone else.". If she is one of the lucky ones, she won't have lifelong self esteem issues, she won't turn to drugs, she won't allow men to treat her like the piece of garbage that she believes she is at the time, and she won't have lifelong trust issues.
This isn't about YOU. This isn't about trying to tear family and friends apart. This is about protecting something so very precious. The fact that the man fled speaks VOLUMES. Why can't you see that? No one is worth defending over a helpless child who has been hurt.









I also want to add that she is going to forget about the rape. Her memories might fade or become repressed, but that feeling of being violated will be with her until she works it out. PLEASE, PLEASE get her some help.


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## tiffani (May 17, 2002)

sorry if I shouldn't still be posting on this thread, and will be happy to remove this post if you want me to, but any update on this situation that you can share? I hope all is moving in a positive direction for that little girl, and has blown over for you...


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