# Is a Bjorn really so bad?



## KLM99 (Aug 9, 2007)

I have an Ergo, a ring sling, and a wrap and I can't get any of them to feel comfortable with my newborn. The only thing that is comfortable for both of us has been the Bjorn. Now it's getting uncomfortable now that he's 13 lbs., but he's still not big enough for the regular Ergo carrier (which I adore with an older baby). Is the Bjorn really so bad to use while he's young?


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## bethanyclaire (Dec 17, 2004)

IMO, yes. I would never carry my baby in a Bjorn. Here are some reasons why:

http://www.continuum-concept.org/rea...nalStress.html

There is another good thread here about this... lemme see if I can find it. I'll check back in.


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## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

I don't think so. I wore my dd in a Snugli all the time, and my SIL used a Bjorn with all her kids.

I will point out that the linked article in the pp was written by a chiropractor. Why don't you search for some studies on the connection between spondylolisthesis and baby carriers, and see if you can find any reputable ones that prove a connection?


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## Mom to E and A (Jul 11, 2005)

I don't think there is anything TOO detrimental when done in moderation...that is why it is still sold. Most people only wear it for short periods of time once in a while. I would certainly advise against it if you were going to use it for naps or while doing housework or other things that may take more than an hour or more than once a week.
Logically, though, think about it, would you want to be dangled by your crotch...are you sure HE is comfy in there?
Also, personal preferance is a big factor, but I prefer MeiTais for all ages, very similar to the ergo...


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## bethanyclaire (Dec 17, 2004)

I couldn't find the exact link I was looking for... I think it is a pretty old one. It had some good points in it, though. If you search "Bjorn" on these forums you'll come up with lots of threads though, and some have good information.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Fuamami* 
I don't think so. I wore my dd in a Snugli all the time, and my SIL used a Bjorn with all her kids.

I will point out that the linked article in the pp was written by a chiropractor. Why don't you search for some studies on the connection between spondylolisthesis and baby carriers, and see if you can find any reputable ones that prove a connection?


For me personally, I'd rather not take the risk. My chiro, naturopath and pediatrician all say "no" to the Bjorn. That alone is enough to make me really question the safety of it. Combine that with the fact that I know *I* would be very uncomfortable being suspended by my crotch by a narrow strip of material and it pretty much seals the deal for me. The crotch is not designed to bear weight in that way. It isn't worth the risk... especially as someone with a family history of back and spine problems.


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## Ammaarah (May 21, 2005)

I don't think they're that bad if you don't use them too much. I had carpal tunnel or something that caused really bad pain in my wrists and hands in the early postpartum days and I could not make a ring sling or wrap work to save my life, so I used a Snugli for a bit. It was a lifesaver on days when my daughter was fussy but I had to do some stuff. I probably used it an hour tops on the days I'd use it, and DD's development has been totally normal.

The thing is, a 13-pound baby in a front pack can be pretty uncomfortable for you - so keep trying with the other carriers! Good luck.


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## GoBecGo (May 14, 2008)

I didn't follow the link above but i have read a study on spondylolisthesis in Alaskan Eskimo's whose normal way of carrying their babies also suspends them like the bjorn does by the crotch, and the incidence amongst those people is something close to 60%. It could be genetic, but i figured DD already had genetics of her own to deal with, and if i could spare her an environmental factor like this i would.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

I would not want to hang by my groin for any length of time. And they are so hard to get the baby out of once they doze off. With a sling... you can just ease the whole thing into the crib or bed.... no snaps, zippers or other paraphernalia.


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## tzs (Aug 4, 2009)

but doesn't a moby basically carry the same way?????
i'm so confused


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tzs* 
but doesn't a moby basically carry the same way?????
i'm so confused

Not at all. A Moby supports the baby under the buttocks and thighs in the "frog leg" position. Imagine holding a baby upright in your arms with your hand under their bottom or their bottom sitting on your forearm. That is more like the Moby carry.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

I think they're fine if they're used sparingly. We got one as a gift, and found it pretty useful. I used it mostly for quick errands when my babies were too small for the Ergo, and I didn't feel like dealing with tying a wrap or a mei tai. It was my husband's carrier of choice whenever he wore them. Best I can tell, they're both fine.


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## pixiepunk (Mar 11, 2003)

my DD1's orthopedic surgeon at Children's Hospital in DC also told me to avoid the Bjorn because of spinal and hip stress. she was impressed by my ring sling and mei tai, didn't have any concerns about those.

as others have said, it's the position the carrier puts the baby in, so that the weight of the baby is all falling to the crotch, putting undue stress on the spine and hips. most other carriers are wider at the base, allowing the child to be in a sitting position with the knees above the hips.


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## KLM99 (Aug 9, 2007)

OP here - thanks for the all the responses. We're going to keep trying with the other carriers (and I'm heading to a baby wearing class next week!). Since he's so small, he's not really hanging by the crotch in the Bjorn at this point. His crotch and upper thighs still fit in the bottom part, so it's sort of like the ergo carry. I think we only have a week or so of that left, so I'm going to work on the other carriers. Thanks again!


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## Adasmommy (Feb 26, 2005)

I'm glad to hear you're going to a babywearing class! I think you could learn to use your other carriers well and both be much happier!

While there are lots of babies who have been Bjorned and seem fine, I don't think that negates the fact that it is bad for a developing spine--whether there are noticable long term repercussions or not!

And, just as importantly, it's not okay for a carrier to cause you pain or discomfort or bad posture. Those all have potential long term effects as well! You deserve better!


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Adasmommy* 
While there are lots of babies who have been Bjorned and seem fine, I don't think that negates the fact that it is bad for a developing spine--whether there are noticable long term repercussions or not!

AFAIK, it's not a fact but rather a theory that the Bjorn is harmful to the developing spine. I would sincerely love to see any evidence that it is, but really I think the best anyone here can offer on the matter is an opinion.


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## pixiepunk (Mar 11, 2003)

OK, stealing from a previous post by HybridVigor, the entirety of which can be found in this thread here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...php?p=12008283

Quote:

Here is a link to a very long PDF about natural parenting. Page #107-108 have pictures of natural hip positioning. This dissertation is a really good one. If you have the time, please read it:
http://www.epjournal.net/filestore/ep05102183.pdf

Here are more links about correct ergonomic positioning:
http://www.storchenwiege.com/babycarrierresearch.htm
http://www.continuum-concept.org/rea...nalStress.html (<-- already referenced in a PP)
http://www.thebabywearer.com/article...ositioning.pdf
http://www.frogmama.com/articles.php?article=10


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## accountclosed2 (May 28, 2007)

I'd suggest a Manduca. It is similar to the Ergo, but comes with a newborn insert, in which the newborn can sit upright, just like in the Ergo, but with legs froggied inside the carrier instead of sticking out.


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bethanyclaire* 
IMO, yes. I would never carry my baby in a Bjorn. Here are some reasons why:

http://www.continuum-concept.org/rea...nalStress.html

There is another good thread here about this... lemme see if I can find it. I'll check back in.









I've tried several slings since having this baby and she didn't like any of them. IMO the ones that are soft with no support are worse on the baby as far as them just laying all scrunched up. My DD seemed so uncomfortable while in those slings when she was a newborn.







In fact, the only sling my baby has liked so far is the baby bjorn and I only use it when at the store or if she fusses while out and I would rather not hold her the whole time, otherwise she is held constantly. My now 8 yr old DD also prefered the bjorn and I wore her for many, many months in it and she is perfectly fine now.


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *philomom* 
I would not want to hang by my groin for any length of time. And they are so hard to get the baby out of once they doze off. With a sling... you can just ease the whole thing into the crib or bed.... no snaps, zippers or other paraphernalia.

I never have had a problem getting my babies in to their bed after they fall asleep in the bjorn. They have pins that slide out very easily on each side in the front and I make sure I'm holding my baby in a laying position before sliding them out and putting her in her bed.


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## pixiepunk (Mar 11, 2003)

it never ceases to amaze me that people can't differentiate between something being potentially harmful and it causing harm to everyone. "my child escaped unscathed" is an argument i hear all the time for all kinds of things that are less-than-ideal or potentially harmful (formula feeding, starting solids too early, turning your baby's carseat forward facing at a year, whatever). Just because it didn't affect *your* child's spinal or hip development doesn't mean it isn't true that it can have a detrimental effect. Just as it's true that plenty of kids thrive on formula, while some fail to.

For me, I want to do what's ideal for the development of my child. Why use something that has the potential to do harm when there are hundreds of other, similarly-priced options that don't have that potential?!?! i seriously don't get it.


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## Oliver's Mama (Jun 28, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pixiepunk* 
it never ceases to amaze me that people can't differentiate between something being potentially harmful and it causing harm to everyone. "my child escaped unscathed" is an argument i hear all the time for all kinds of things that are less-than-ideal or potentially harmful (formula feeding, starting solids too early, turning your baby's carseat forward facing at a year, whatever). Just because it didn't affect *your* child's spinal or hip development doesn't mean it isn't true that it can have a detrimental effect. Just as it's true that plenty of kids thrive on formula, while some fail to.

For me, I want to do what's ideal for the development of my child. Why use something that has the potential to do harm when there are hundreds of other, similarly-priced options that don't have that potential?!?! i seriously don't get it.











I had a knock-off bjorn last time that I plan to replace with a buckle mei tai. It's not necessarily because the news hype swayed me- that only got me thinking that perhaps I should research my options. With my first baby, I thought my only options were whatever was on the shelf at babiesrus. In looking at the mei tais, it just looks like common sense design- the structure looks more comfortable and properly supportive for both me and my baby. As a layman, I could clearly see that a SSC, or wraps as well, would of course be better- just the logisitics of it. No scientific data or expert opinions needed. Now that I know there are better options, I'm changing carriers.

Sure my baby turned out fine and developed walking and running skills by 8 months, and he slept in the bjorn with ease, but that didn't mean he was comfortable. He probably couldn't tell if it hurt because it cut off circulation to his legs.. poor chubby blue stumps. It didn't look natural to have a baby dangling out in front of me, and it killed my shoulders. Reason enough for me to suspect that this was not our best option.


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## momo7 (Apr 10, 2005)

This is an interesting thread....

I have a friend who uses an Bjorn....I use an Ergo.

Please tell me the difference because when we are standing side by side I don't see the difference in how her baby sits or how mine sits.....Please tell me what makes these two carriers different. The only reason I didn't like the
Bjorn was because it looks to tight when she wears it. I have never worn a Bjorn.

Can anyone help me with this?


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## Adasmommy (Feb 26, 2005)

The ergo has a wide seat under the baby's bottom, so that your baby can be seated and supported under the thighs and bottom. This is illustrated by the fact that the baby's knees are raised higher than his bottom--just like when you pick a kid up on your hip and they naturally pull their knees up around your torso.

The bjorn has a more narrow crotch so that instead of being seated, the baby is supported only through the crotch, with legs hanging down. This puts all of the baby's weight on the base of his or her developing spine.

Which sounds more comfortable anyway: seated, or dangling by crotch?!


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## goldfinches (May 15, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momo7* 
This is an interesting thread....

I have a friend who uses an Bjorn....I use an Ergo.

Please tell me the difference because when we are standing side by side I don't see the difference in how her baby sits or how mine sits.....Please tell me what makes these two carriers different. The only reason I didn't like the
Bjorn was because it looks to tight when she wears it. I have never worn a Bjorn.

Can anyone help me with this?

Is it because with the Bjorn, people typically face baby out, thus the "crotch" comments? Because, if the baby is facing towards mom, he isn't being "crotched", imo.


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## Keria (Sep 27, 2008)

Bjorn is what mainstream parents use so it has to be evil, truth is if the baby is facing in there is no dangling by the crotch if baby is facing out they are hanging by the crotch I have seen babies hanging by the crotch in a Moby while facing out.


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## NicaG (Jun 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KLM99* 
I have an Ergo, a ring sling, and a wrap and I can't get any of them to feel comfortable with my newborn. The only thing that is comfortable for both of us has been the Bjorn. Now it's getting uncomfortable now that he's 13 lbs., but he's still not big enough for the regular Ergo carrier (which I adore with an older baby). Is the Bjorn really so bad to use while he's young?

I was in the same situation--had an Ergo for my older son, but couldn't use it for my newborn, couldn't deal with the Moby wrap, etc. I used a Bjorn for the first few months until dd was big enough for the Ergo. I don't know. It worked for us, and I didn't feel like dd was "hanging from her crotch" as is the complaint (she was only facing inward). Why would they allow this product to remain on the market if it were really causing profound harm?


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## tamrajo (Nov 18, 2009)

We used the bjorn for my daughter until she was about 5 or so months old and I started sewing Mei Tais. She loved it, and even more importantly (to me anyway) was that DH would wear her with it too. Now that we have a 3.5 month old son, DH a stay at home dad wears him all of the time with it. He doesn’t like the “newborn” hold with the ergo and he’s still too little to spread his little legs around my torso, but too big to crunch them up either. I’m sure there are worse things that we could do than to put our baby in an bjorn.


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## momo7 (Apr 10, 2005)

Thanks for answering my question about the Bjorn vs. Ergo. I can definitely see the wide seat and upraised legs as being better than the "dangling" posture of the Bjorn. My friend's Bjorn never looked that comfotable for her baby anyway...he always looked so squished in it.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

All I can say is that every single friend I had used the Bjorn and our kids are all healthy and active nine years later. Slings just didn't work for any of us. That said, I was very happy to switch my kids to the Tough Traveler backpack at around 7 months when they could sit up. I was able to get so much more done with them on my back.


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## SolaSola (Mar 4, 2009)

Thank you for the discussion. My baby (4 weeks) screams in the moby, hates the sling, hates the ergo and is only happy in a bjorn. She does not like to feel squished. I only wear her facing me, but if it weren't for the bjorn, I could not wear her. I do put her sleeping self in the moby and do household chores, but I could easily just let her sleep in the cosleeper. As soon as she wakes up she is unhappy and wants out.


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## Ahappymel (Nov 20, 2001)

I may be oversimplifying here....but if it works for you, baby seems comfortable, I say go with it


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## Bokonon (Aug 29, 2009)

I have a Mei Tai that I absolutely love, and wear DD facing in. We have a hand-me-down Bjorn that DH wears DD in, front-facing. It's not every day, but it is fairly frequent, and they both really enjoy it (DD just laughs and laughs in it, and sometimes falls asleep, so she doesn't seem uncomfortable). It's a pretty special thing for them, and DH definitely likes wearing her around the house. I know he won't use the Mei Tai, but what kind of carrier is similar to the Bjorn that baby can ride front-facing? FWIW, DH is a really big guy. TIA!


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## onelilguysmommy (May 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Fuamami* 
I don't think so. I wore my dd in a Snugli all the time, and my SIL used a Bjorn with all her kids.

*I will point out that the linked article in the pp was written by a chiropractor.* Why don't you search for some studies on the connection between spondylolisthesis and baby carriers, and see if you can find any reputable ones that prove a connection?

Wouldn't a chiro be a good person to ask for advice on hip/spinal issues?


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## Sk8ermaiden (Feb 13, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bokonon* 
I have a Mei Tai that I absolutely love, and wear DD facing in. We have a hand-me-down Bjorn that DH wears DD in, front-facing. It's not every day, but it is fairly frequent, and they both really enjoy it (DD just laughs and laughs in it, and sometimes falls asleep, so she doesn't seem uncomfortable). It's a pretty special thing for them, and DH definitely likes wearing her around the house. I know he won't use the Mei Tai, but what kind of carrier is similar to the Bjorn that baby can ride front-facing? FWIW, DH is a really big guy. TIA!

Guys tend to like the Ergo - you might look into that?


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## Sk8ermaiden (Feb 13, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TropicalGirl* 
Bjorn is what mainstream parents use so it has to be evil, truth is if the baby is facing in there is no dangling by the crotch if baby is facing out they are hanging by the crotch I have seen babies hanging by the crotch in a Moby while facing out.

This is true too - I have always felt that the Moby facing out is just as bad as the Bjorn.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Facing out, in any carrier, isn't ideal for baby anyway.


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## GoBecGo (May 14, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NicaG* 
Why would they allow this product to remain on the market if it were really causing profound harm?

Really? Cigarettes? Alcohol? Sports cars which can go 120% faster than the speed limit?

NO, i am not saying the risk is comparable, i am just (hopefully) illustrating that "it's available to buy" is NOT the same as "it is definitely safe/harmless".

I agree, facing a baby out in any carrier which carries under the crotch are isn't the best. My DD rode facing out inthe sling with her little legs froggied and crossed and always seemed comfortable/happy.

Also my DD screamed in the wrap and sling initially, it took a decent walk to settle her the first few times. After about a week just the smell of the wrap sent her off to sleep - everything is unfamiliar when you're 5 days old, sometimes crying in a sling doesn't mean they "don't like it" but that they don't know it, have some other issue going on (my XP hated wearing DD in the wrap because he would put her in it when she was crying to calm her down, and then say "she doesn't like it, she's crying" - well, yeah, she was crying before you put her in there!) or need a minor posture adjustment to feel good.


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## daisymommy (Dec 13, 2003)

Well, I've worn both of my previous babies in slings. Then with this newest babe, I was having trouble feeling like he was secure enough in there was I was bending up and down emptying the dishwasher, laundry, etc.
So, I bought a Bjorn on Ebay (silly, silly me







), wore it 2-3 times and then promptly made an appointment for myself at the chiropractor...and no, I am not joking. I sold it back on Ebay the very next day.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *goldfinches* 
Is it because with the Bjorn, people typically face baby out, thus the "crotch" comments? Because, if the baby is facing towards mom, he isn't being "crotched", imo.

I would respectfully disagree with this. I have seen many babies facing inwards in Bjorns and none of them have their legs supported at all, let alone to the knee. I don't know how it would even be possible in the Bjorn, the fabric is too narrow to spread that far, even on the littlest baby.

I just had a look at the Bjorn website and all the babies have dangling legs. The fabric seems to go about as far down their legs as a disposable nappy from what I can tell.


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## npl (Nov 29, 2008)

I'm interested in this thread, and wondering whether any other mainstream carriers are better than the Bjorn for supporting baby.
I have the Kelty Kangaroo that works differently to hold baby in than the Bjorn. You wrap the bottom part up around baby and velcro to create a snug pouch that cradles the pelvic area, with legs sticking out, and then the whole thing is buckled to the parent portion at the shoulders and the bottom.
I never felt that baby was "hanging", more like coccooned.
I tried googling a decent image to show what I mean, but I can't find one that shows the way the baby is cradled!


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## Sk8ermaiden (Feb 13, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *npl* 
I'm interested in this thread, and wondering whether any other mainstream carriers are better than the Bjorn for supporting baby.
I have the Kelty Kangaroo that works differently to hold baby in than the Bjorn. You wrap the bottom part up around baby and velcro to create a snug pouch that cradles the pelvic area, with legs sticking out, and then the whole thing is buckled to the parent portion at the shoulders and the bottom.
I never felt that baby was "hanging", more like coccooned.
I tried googling a decent image to show what I mean, but I can't find one that shows the way the baby is cradled!

There is a picture down on this page. TBH, it doesn't look much better. To be ergonomically correct, the baby's knees need to be as high or higher than its bottom. Most mainstream carriers honestly suck. I really don't think they're going to do harm with average use, but if you wore your baby as much as some parents here (me included) I think the risks would go up. Some of the slings you can find at stores are OK, and thankfully, Moby, Beco and Ergo along with others are showing up more and more places!


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## npl (Nov 29, 2008)

Thanks!
That image is the box front - which I have but didn't spot on google!
Since my newbie carrying days, I've since branched out, and much prefer my maya wrap sling for most uses, though I'm intrigued by the moby for a newborn - I think it would combine the good parts of the kangaroo and the maya wrap.
Definitely a huge change in what's widely available since I started parenting 10 years ago!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Throwing out one suggestion, a UK carrier: www.wilkinet.co.uk It carries the baby froggied up and has the benefit of letting you put baby on your back at a relatively young age, which the bjorn doesn't. Plus you can face them outwards, should you choose to let them crotch-dangle.


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## StoriesInTheSoil (May 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pixiepunk* 
it never ceases to amaze me that people can't differentiate between something being potentially harmful and it causing harm to everyone. "my child escaped unscathed" is an argument i hear all the time for all kinds of things that are less-than-ideal or potentially harmful (formula feeding, starting solids too early, turning your baby's carseat forward facing at a year, whatever). Just because it didn't affect *your* child's spinal or hip development doesn't mean it isn't true that it can have a detrimental effect. Just as it's true that plenty of kids thrive on formula, while some fail to.

For me, I want to do what's ideal for the development of my child. Why use something that has the potential to do harm when there are hundreds of other, similarly-priced options that don't have that potential?!?! i seriously don't get it.

My sentiments exactly, Pixie!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NicaG* 
I was in the same situation--had an Ergo for my older son, but couldn't use it for my newborn, couldn't deal with the Moby wrap, etc. I used a Bjorn for the first few months until dd was big enough for the Ergo. I don't know. It worked for us, and I didn't feel like dd was "hanging from her crotch" as is the complaint (she was only facing inward). *Why would they allow this product to remain on the market if it were really causing profound harm?*

Wouldn't it be nice if we could trust manufactures to do the right thing and not follow the money, continuing to make unsafe products? Cigarettes have been mentioned but what about things like, oh, Infant Formula? When used in the way that it is marketed, breastmilk substitute can cause profound harm. What about situations like Dorel's (car seat company) refusal to recall certain car seats even after they had caused multiple seriously bad injuries? Or the continued sale of overhead-sheild car seats when they'd been proven to be dangerous? Infant "walkers" and "jumpers" have been proven to cause harm and are still available at most major retailers.


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## marimara (Jan 31, 2008)

I just saw this post on the homepage and don't normally post in babywearing since my dd is 3 but I did carry her for 2 years. Anyways, I did use the Bjorn (and a Snugli and a Hotsling, and a ring sling and a mei tai) when she was small. The hotsling when she was newborn and the Bjorn when she was about 2-3.5 months. She did like it facing out sometimes, but we didn't often wear her like that because she soon fell asleep in it. The thing is about the Bjorn is that you can only use it for such a short time. I was very conscious to make sure her hips were even and she was comfortable and all that. But around 3.5 months her legs became too chunky in the thigh and she became too heavy. One day in Target I was carrying her in it and looked down and her legs were blue. I immediately took her out and never put her back in. In my opinion, they are too expensive to use for such a short time. Looking back I would have wanted a ring sling for the newborn, bfing, and hip sling carries. And then I would get a Beco or something similar that can be used for longer than the Bjorn. Bottom line, I didn't think it was that *bad* just not useable for very long. And not worth the $ and not nearly as cute as the Becos


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## Altair (May 1, 2005)

But with the Moby facing out you can frog the legs and kind of make the baby sit, leaning back, with a curved lower spine. At least that's how I used it a few times. Though that's not how they show it in the directions.


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## NickisDiapers (Nov 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Altair* 
But with the Moby facing out you can frog the legs and kind of make the baby sit, leaning back, with a curved lower spine. At least that's how I used it a few times. Though that's not how they show it in the directions.

There is a wrap carry called the Buddha by some -- you can actually do it in a ringsling or pouch as well -- where the baby is sitting froggied facing out.


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## Altair (May 1, 2005)

Right, but with the Moby I have the legs out forward facing, but still with a curved lower back and the knees up. So like after you do the criss cross and pull up the horizontal strap, then you readjust the baby to pull his butt down lower and his knees up higher so he's leaning back further into you.


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