# I make other parents cringe...



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Recently a good friend of mine told me that my parenting style makes her cringe. She then went on to say my kids are great and somehow what we do works but in no way does she condone half the stuff that we allow or do. And that's fine, I get why she is so controlling over her kids. Her kids are also great little things and I love them dearly just as she loves mine. So this isn't a crap on her thing. Just me being aware that I do things differently.

I let my kids swear at home as long as it's not directed at other people.
I include them in our conversations. All conversations, if it can't be said around them then what's the point?
I don't spank, I rarely punish. You have to really do something BAD or dangerous.
I allow them to play hours of video games, hey I know they aren't in the backyard making weapons of mass destruction.
I let them run around barefoot.
They pick what they want to eat for dinner or lunch... even breakfast. Usually they sit in the kitchen while DH and I are cooking and let us know what they want as sides or they just choose something they can make themselves.
I never make them eat food they don't want or like.
I allow them to dress themselves when not going to school... DD2 is a sparkles kind of girl. DD1 loves her dads shirts. Looks like a dress with big arms.
I let them build forts all over the house.
I let them make mud pools in the back yard and jump around in them. ( they just can't get the clothes hanging to dry wet or muddy)
I let them sleep in our bed.
I let them run nude in the house and sometimes back yard depending on the weather.
I let them dig holes in the backyard ( can't dig in my gardens)
I let them eat where they want when they want. (just can't share with the dogs or leave it out)

I give them free reign over themselves just as long as they aren't imposing on others in a negative way. And yes for the most part they really are pretty great. And I can hold a conversation with my 8 yr old that would rival any conversation with most adults. We do have rules most of them are in the respecting others and nature category.


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## Dandelionkid (Mar 6, 2007)

Sounds good to me


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

That's the kind of parent I want to be.


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## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

Some of that would make me cringe. But I fully realize those are MY hangups. Like, I have never encouraged my kids to run around naked. Thankfully, they've never been the sorts of kids who wanted to be naked, so it's not been a problem. But when I go to friends' homes that house naked kids, I always wonder whose butt germs I'm touching on the chairs, and it skeeves me out.

Also, my kids and I have always talked a lot, but I definitely have not included them in every conversation. They didn't need to hear me venting about their dad when he was not following through on visitation and such. I also don't think they'd appreciate hearing about my perimenopausal menstrual changes or my sex life.


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## mamalisa (Sep 24, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2xy*
> 
> Some of that would make me cringe. But I fully realize those are MY hangups. Like, I have never encouraged my kids to run around naked. Thankfully, they've never been the sorts of kids who wanted to be naked, so it's not been a problem. But when I go to friends' homes that house naked kids, I always wonder whose butt germs I'm touching on the chairs, and it skeeves me out.
> 
> Also, my kids and I have always talked a lot, but I definitely have not included them in every conversation. They didn't need to hear me venting about their dad when he was not following through on visitation and such. I also don't think they'd appreciate hearing about my perimenopausal menstrual changes or my sex life.


I don't include my kids in all conversations and I'm not big on naked people. For the most part though, I don't understand why any of that bothers her? How does your kids digging in the mud or choosing their own food affect her?


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mamalisa*
> 
> I don't include my kids in all conversations and I'm not big on naked people. For the most part though, I don't understand why any of that bothers her? How does your kids digging in the mud or choosing their own food affect her?


It sounds like good natured ribbing on both parts. Look, how many threads do we see here complaining about those "mainstream" parents (whose choices DO NOT affect us in any way, like people who decide to use a baby carrier, or who allow their toddler to eat goldfish--the processed cracker kind, not the real ones; or those people who wean their kid at a year instead of self-weaning, ect.).

I kind of like to hear that two different people who parent differently can express that they are happy with their own style and don't want to adopt the others'--and yet STILL like/love each other. Instead of demanding that the other person adopt their style or get cut off because their sensibilities can only tolerate like-minded people.


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## kitchensqueen (Feb 20, 2006)

Nothing to cringe about if it works for your family. I wouldn't personally do all the stuff on your list, but none of it's dangerous, inappropriate or disrespectful. It takes all kinds to make a world, and I think that's a good thing.


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## Nicole730 (Feb 27, 2009)

All sounds fine to me. Not that I do all of them. The only one I might cringe at is the video games, but that's one I might feel differently about once my children are old enough to play video games.


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mamalisa*
> 
> For the most part though, I don't understand why any of that bothers her? How does your kids digging in the mud or choosing their own food affect her?


Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Tigerchild*
> 
> It sounds like good natured ribbing on both parts. Look, how many threads do we see here complaining about those "mainstream" parents (whose choices DO NOT affect us in any way, like people who decide to use a baby carrier, or who allow their toddler to eat goldfish--the processed cracker kind, not the real ones; or those people who wean their kid at a year instead of self-weaning, ect.).
> I kind of like to hear that two different people who parent differently can express that they are happy with their own style and don't want to adopt the others'--and yet STILL like/love each other. Instead of demanding that the other person adopt their style or get cut off because their sensibilities can only tolerate like-minded people.


Theoretically, the people complaining or cringing are worried about the long-term (or sometimes short-term) well-being of the kids. I mean, just because they're not our own offspring doesn't mean we don't care if they're miserable, right? Some people video games are harmful, or at least if the kid is allowed, they will play such ridiculous amounts that it becomes harmful. Some people think spanking is just plain pointless and mean, if not abusive.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Sounds pretty normal to me, this is how I compare:

I let my kids swear at home as long as it's pragmatically appropriate. In other words, if you drop your pencil, I suggest you find another word. If you drop a book on your foot, swear away!
I include them in our conversations. Most conversations. Sometimes dh and I do want to converse without being interrupted by the plot summaries of the latest A.N.T. Farm or random baseball/football/basketball/soccer facts. Dh and I don't talk about stuff our kids shouldn't hear unless we're alone (dd has amazing 'hearing' and will pick up on the slightest thing.)
I don't spank, I rarely punish. You have to really do something BAD or dangerous, or MEAN. (e.g., Dd has been getting bullied by ds' friend down the street, and we have threatened to take a break with the friend if ds doesn't start telling his friend that he's being mean to dd. He can't make the friend stop, but he can point out when he's being unfair or taunting her.)
I to watch TV and play computer games.
I let them run around barefoot.
They can pick what they want for breakfast and lunch. We have family dinners, and I'm not a short order cook. But, we take their preferences and tastes into account, and if they ask for a dish before I've started dinner, I can usually accommodate them.
I do ask them to try a bite of a new food, but don't force them to eat things they don't like. (This backfired on dh's parents in a major way!)
I allow them to dress themselves, even when going to school. There's just a few pairs of dress up shoes dd is not allowed to go out of the house with (think stiletto heels bought at Goodwill).
I let them build forts all over the house.
I let them make mud pools in the back yard and jump around in them. They just have to strip in the bathroom and hang up the clothes to dry.
I used let them sleep in our bed until they got too tall. Now they sleep next to our bed (ds some nights, dd every night).
I have let them run nude in the house and sometimes back yard depending on the weather. (I did this too until they developed modesty around age 8.) I even let them run nude in the front yard once or twice.
They have pretty free reign over snacks. One of ds' primary food groups is Nutella. (He's a 12 slim with the adjustable waists pulled in. Until he gets to be not a slim, he's got free reign over the Nutella). Dd tends toward cheese, turkey and yogurt. (I don't buy Doritos because she'd sell her soul for those, and they aren't good for her on so many levels.)
I don't care what they read, except that if it's keeping dd up because it's too scary, then she needs to put it away and read it in the daylight.
OK, I don't let them eat where they want.
I insist on family dinners.
I make them do chores (15 minutes a night, plus ds has to unload the dishwasher; next year, when he's 11, he'll have to load it too).
I personally cringe at the amount of TV/games sometimes, but right now there are other battles/skills that we're working on. The video games are only Wii sports (must be rated E) and the computer games tend to be things like Roller Coaster Tycoon, which is mildly educational.

Actually, the only odd thing I find is that your friend tells you that your parenting makes her cringe. I know some people who don't see eye to eye with me on parenting stuff, but I try really hard not to pass judgement (or more accurately, when I do pass judgement, I try really hard to keep it to myself!) Everybody's kids are different. Every parent is different.


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyllya*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> Theoretically, the people complaining or cringing are worried about the long-term (or sometimes short-term) well-being of the kids. I mean, just because they're not our own offspring doesn't mean we don't care if they're miserable, right? Some people video games are harmful, or at least if the kid is allowed, they will play such ridiculous amounts that it becomes harmful. Some people think spanking is just plain pointless and mean, if not abusive.


In theory, I guess--but in practice, let's be honest here...it's really about looking down one's nose at people, claiming psychic powers (really, because someone is parented differently than what you're doing now, they MUST be *miserable*?) of truthful projection, and oneupsmanship.


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## rubidoux (Aug 22, 2003)

I have to admit a little cringe when I read the video game one, but that is only because we have video game issues here. I make Milo stop when he cries or gets angry over it. I try to stop him when I think he might soon cry or get angry, but sometimes I miss the cues. I have mixed feelings about video games because I think he's actually gained a lot from them, especially confidence that he can master something that's hard. And there are times that he wants to play for hours on end, but there are other times that he doesn't think of playing for weeks. So, I'm hoping in the end there's more good than bad there.

Other than that I can't see why anyone would have issues with your parenting. And as far as the butt cooties go, that would never cross my mind. lol

I have been thinking lately that a lot of people would cringe over our recent addiction to Phineus and Ferb (sp?). I can't bring myself to sit down and watch an episode, but whenever I walk through or look up from my book or computer, I see something fairly unique.

I'm happy, btw, to see that other people have older children co-sleeping. I feel like when I go into the night-time parenting (or whatever it's called) forum here, everyone's asking about how to get their 2 and 3 yo's to sleep in their own rooms. And then I start wondering if we're the only ones...


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

I can see how video games make people a bit uncomfortable. It's an MMO and she has to read a ton of crud before she can do anything. She uses an on line dictionary since some of the words are out of her normal vocab. Both girls don't know how to sit still and this is the only time I know they are not cutting off the dogs hair, making instruments of death or finding ways to catapult to the top of the house. I'm pretty sure I have Bebe's kids.

I like that her and I are so different and we're aware of it. I know when my DD's go to her house to remind them of what is allowed there, and her kids know when they come to my house it's circus fun. I do follow her rules when it comes to the kids wearing shoes or not letting them in the front yard without me sitting out there with them. I think we know what works for us and we are able to adapt. I didn't feel like she was looking down her nose. I've told her things before, like I thought is was a little much that she won't let her 13 yr old walk home from school or that the kids are allowed to eat and drink so much junk. We're still friends and have been for 8 yrs.


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## FarmerBeth (Mar 9, 2011)

I've got a friend with way different parenting habits, too and we're great friends, and everyone is turning out fine! I got a kick out of the original post because our family started morphing that way, organically. We were very typically AP, with kids in the bed and running around digging holes and making forts, not forcing to eat foods, not spanking, etc, a commonality already. But like lots of "crunchy" parents, we restricted video games (like none before starting school), TV, and exposure to adult conversations. The thing is, it was fine for preschoolers, but as they aged I realized they had to live in this world, and I'd rather they got used to it now. They do use the computer a lot, and sometimes it's a real bonding tool because they play multi player with each other, my husband and their God father, and actually there's tons of reading in what they play (World of Warcraft, but chat controls in place except for people on the list, and lots of fantasy and strategy games). I like sharing TV viewing with my kids, even though a lot of people would say CSI is inappropriate, but we enjoy it together. And the joy of children growing is the great, sometimes "adult" conversations you can have with them. I think we gradually moved away from a "this is the right or wrong way" approach to parenting to a "let's use what just works or feels right for this situation" approach. Basically, three kids and 11 years down the road later, it's so much easier and fun to be laid back.


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## peainthepod (Jul 16, 2008)

Some of that isn't my style but it's working for your family, so why sweat it? I won't bother listing the ways I parent differently because it really doesn't matter. If your child is healthy, happy, and whole, you're doing it right.









If your friend wasn't just teasing you and genuinely cringes because of your different choices, it could be that she feels somewhat insecure about her own. I find that the more confident I am in my own parenting, the less I care about other people's (nonviolent) methods.


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## coffeegirl (Jan 1, 2008)

I'm with the poster who said that the oddest thing about the list was that someone actually told you that your parenting makes them cringe. Unless any of that affects her directly, not sure why she'd care. And the only one that jumps out at me that I could see *might* affect her/other people is the "including them in ALL conversations" thing. Now does that mean you don't shy away from talking about anything and everything, even sensitive or disturbing things, around them? Or that you let them get involved in any and every conversation you have?

Because here's what came to my mind: I know some parents who have the policy of including their children in all conversations. But in practical terms what this means is, when I'm having a conversation with the mother, say, the kids will interrupt every few minutes wanting to bring the conversation back to themselves or to add some nonsensical story or something, or to ask when it will be "their turn" to talk, etc. THAT can be frustrating. And the mom just goes along with it, and will frequently interrupt me (or whoever else is speaking) to address whatever the child interrupted the conversation with, and sometimes to engage them in further conversation about whatever it is. And then the original conversation is just , like, gone, and you end up feeling like you've just been kicked aside. It gets to the point where I feel I can't have any real conversations with them (aside from light smalltalk, or talk about the kids) until the kids are in bed or on any other rare occasion when we're there and the kids aren't.

Not sure at all if that applies to you, but it's the first thing that jumped out at me.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Ah by discussing everything I mean that we don't shy from conversations that may be over their head. We don't talk about sex with them but they know about it through questions and we don't bother with politics or what war is going on because we don't care to. However if we're discussing theories then of course they can discuss with us. I don't kick them out of the room, I share all my time. If it's not meant for them to hear. As in it might worry them like job issues or monetary issues then I won't bring it up.


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## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Haha the video game part makes me head explode...but as the wife of a MMO lover, I get it....and some games can actually be very very fun, in depth and well made...with awesome stories and many cool things to learn about. Very artistic. Still makes my head spin to imagine kids playing...I just can't stand video games for kids!!

But everything else you said sounds pretty cool. I do insist on family dinners...but it's not something that I have to force, it just happens. Plus the cooking thing...I cook three large meals a day from scratch, so it's important to me that everyone eat the same thing. I encourage trying to new things, but I don't fight about food. They do LOVE helping to cook, so we spend that time together.

I know a lot of people in my life who really don't get my style...the fact that our kids free range a lot is a big eyebrow raiser. But we live in the middle of the woods with no one around, so there aren't cars and things like that to consider...so, I don't know...we have really, very very happy kids who do cool things and we respect them and are honest with them and I think it's good.

I still love my friends who don't get me...they don't mean to be judgy, they love me too...they just remark at and sometimes laugh about, my "loosey goosey" ways!


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## coffeegirl (Jan 1, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Ah by discussing everything I mean that we don't shy from conversations that may be over their head. We don't talk about sex with them but they know about it through questions and we don't bother with politics or what war is going on because we don't care to. However if we're discussing theories then of course they can discuss with us. I don't kick them out of the room, I share all my time. If it's not meant for them to hear. As in it might worry them like job issues or monetary issues then I won't bring it up.


Ok, well....no cringing then.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Some of those make me cringe too. Most don't, but a few.

I wouldn't allow cussing. I don't include kids in all conversation. I don't allow them to eat where ever they want. In the kitchen, or not at all.


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## MoonlessNightx (Oct 4, 2011)

You sound exactly like me!


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

i think if a CL mama posted her what she allows in her house, many posters here would cringe.


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## freestylemama (Apr 8, 2009)

The video games, cussing and food stuff make me cringe. I'm not a huge fan of publicly naked kids, but it doesn't really make me cringe.

I don't think unlimited screen time is healthy for anyone and I have serious issues with violent media and children.

As an adult, I've had a difficult time making sure my language is appropriate, so I would rather my kiddos not start a bad habit.

I am very involved in healthy eating decisions. My mom let me "free range" and it essentially led to some major health problems and an eating disorder. I seek DD's opinions about her food preferences and never say no to fruit or veggie requests at the store, but I don't think a free range approach to food works for most families. We expect our kids to be open to a wide array of food choices and don't do "kid food" at our house. We all eat healthy meals and suppers are all the same.


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## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> As in it might worry them like job issues or monetary issues then I won't bring it up.


That's kinda where we are. We talk openly about a wide range of topics in front of and with our kids, but when we knew that we would be moving because daddy's job was going away and didn't know where we would be going, we didn't drop a hint of it to the kids. It would have stressed them out unnecessarily. We waited until there was a plan.

We do talk openly about politics, religion, pop culture, etc. Everything is open game and they are encouraged to have their own opinions.

Actually, you and I parent a lot a like, and it does bother a few people I know. They think my children should be horrid, but instead they are quite calm and mature. No body in my house wants to run around naked, but the kids have tons of freedom.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

My reason for allowing cussing? If you just need to let it out, then do it and get it over with.

Food choices are based on what is available to them. Unhealthy does not reside in our home
I suffered with anorexia because I was told I was fat, forced to eat all that was on my plate and no e of it was healthy. I took control of myself by not eating. Something I still suffer with

Playing online games includes half the family at ant given time. DD 2 increased her reading comprehension by two grade levels this summer. Also we had over 60 days of above 100degree weather. Playing outside wasn't always a safe option.

Since the weather change we're forcin g the girls inside for bathes. And bedtime.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

Thanks for inspiring me mama, a breath of fresh air is your post, i feel so much better just knowing there are other people out there like this.... (have my kids been wathcing too much star wars?)

Have more to say, later....


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## FarmerBeth (Mar 9, 2011)

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Imakcerka* 

My reason for allowing cussing? If you just need to let it out, then do it and get it over with.
Food choices are based on what is available to them. Unhealthy does not reside in our home
I suffered with anorexia because I was told I was fat, forced to eat all that was on my plate and no e of it was healthy. I took control of myself by not eating. Something I still suffer with
*Playing online games includes half the family at ant given time. DD 2 increased her reading comprehension by two grade levels this summer.* Also we had over 60 days of above 100degree weather. Playing outside wasn't always a safe option.
Since the weather change we're forcin g the girls inside for bathes. And bedtime.



> We have the same experience with the games. We have friends from DS's former Waldorf-y independent school who just cringe about the gaming, but it really is a family activity, and one thing my husband really enjoys doing with the kids. And both boys really improved their reading through game play (DD is a book worm, anyway, ut she loves her game time, too.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah and as different as we are... my friend just called to ask me or DH to pick her kids up on friday and keep them til late in the evening. She has other choices. Her kids just like coming here just as mine love to go there. Mostly because they have snacks we don't have and her kids apparently love losing to me in a friendly game of horse... Ok I cheat sometimes.


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## FarmerBeth (Mar 9, 2011)

Those are the great friends, the ones that can be very different and everyone still loves being together. I think kids get so much great exposure from being friends with people whose families have different ways. It's such a great big world with so much excitement and if we all avoided people who were different or stuck a sock in our mouth and didn't mention differences just to avoid conflict, the world would get pretty boring.


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## beenmum (Nov 29, 2010)

LynnS6, you sound just like me.


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## Tonia Starr (May 14, 2011)

OP: I wish you were MY mom.


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## Maggie05 (Jun 20, 2003)

I can't agree with including kids in every conversation.

I have a friend who allows her 10 year old son to sit with us for every visit and participate in the conversation. I'm sorry, but sometimes I want to have girl talk with my friend. Alone. I want to talk about politics without having to explain it to a ten year old or hear his opinion. I want to vent about my husband, or share how my son (his friend) is having a hard time in school. Those topics are not ones that I want him to have any input in or knowledge about. Often I have to tell him to go find his friend and play, because this is an adult conversation.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm not talking about conversation that don't include family members. Sometimes conversations between two people are somewhat confidential. That's different and understood in our house. They don't listen into my phone conversations with my friends and I don't listen into their conversations with their friends. Even though the tidbits I get now and then are pretty darn cute.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Maggie05*
> 
> I can't agree with including kids in every conversation.
> 
> I have a friend who allows her 10 year old son to sit with us for every visit and participate in the conversation. I'm sorry, but sometimes I want to have girl talk with my friend. Alone. I want to talk about politics without having to explain it to a ten year old or hear his opinion. I want to vent about my husband, or share how my son (his friend) is having a hard time in school. Those topics are not ones that I want him to have any input in or knowledge about. Often I have to tell him to go find his friend and play, because this is an adult conversation.


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## CherryBombMama (Jan 25, 2010)

maybe she said that because she feels guilty for feeling that way and just had to say something to get it off her chest?

my *favorite* cousin once got a car she loved. no idea the make or year. she talked on and on about it on the phone. when i finally saw it, she was so happy and it took all my might to not say anything negative. finally at the end i blurted out, "well as long as you like it..." and made a face. it just came out. i didnt know what to say, i couldnt keep my mouth shut, i instantly regretted saying it...

im glad you have such a good friend and you can look past parenting styles


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## justclaire (Oct 10, 2011)

Honestly, I agree with pretty much everything on your list. I allow my DD (10) the freedom to use whatever language she feels is appropriate -- she rarely chooses to curse, but if she does, she is free to say whatever she'd like. She also understands that such language is not always appropriate, and that discretion should be used when out with friends, at school or with certain members of our extended family. I also allow her to paint her nails any color she chooses (even black, which is her current favorite), choose what she wants to wear (as long as it's weather-appropriate and/or doesn't make her look like a hobo), and (mostly) self-regulate what she chooses to watch on TV. I'm sure many parents with different parenting styles would cringe knowing that my DD has a TV with Netflix and a Wii in her room, and that we do not restrict what she watches, because she has never given us a reason to. She has very specific tastes in movies and TV shows, and I have never had to ask her to not watch something that she's chosen to watch. I'm sure the day will come when she will choose something inappropriate, and I will step in at that point, but for now she has a good grasp on whether a movie or tv show is something that would interest her, so I let her choose. The exception to this is that she is really into Manga and Anime, and a lot of the series that seem age-appropriate are actually not, so she always needs to check with me or DH before reading a new series. Other than that, I encourage her to be independent and make her own choices, even if some of them end up not turning out how she'd planned -- valuable lessons learned


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Definitely. And how do they know what they really like if we make all their choices for them. I know kids who never once got to choose what they could listen to and what they could watch. Or read for that matter. Then one day the see read or hear something that they never knew existed. Obviously there are things I won't allow in my house due to the fact that I don't find it appropriate for myself . LIke Techo... Kidding. Though I still can't stand that stuff. I've tried. One of my best friends will torture me on car rides with it.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Much of your list does make me cringe. I wouldn't want my kids in a house where hours of video games are the norm. I don't think unlimited screen time is a healthy thing. Nor do I want my kids around other kids and adults who curse and believe it's ok. I think profanity is tacky and vulgar and while I'm first to admit I slip up and use it, I always make it clear that I shouldn't have. I don't think kids need to be included in everything I'm discussing with my friends. Our whole family eats the same healthy food. I don't make special orders, and they don't get to eat what they want, when they want (or it would be chocolate for breakfast). And with a pre-teen boy, running around nude when guests are over is definitely not appropriate. My kids get to make plenty of choices, including input when I plan meals. They are not deprived of freedom. But based on your list, yeah, we wouldn't be hanging out at your place.

However, I don't think your friend accomplished anything by telling you that your parenting style made her cringe. In her shoes, I would simply have let the friendship die a natural death.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Uh... we've been friends for 8 years. We watch each others kids often. Maybe you think that allowing your kids to pick what is good and not good for themselves can be dangerous because inherently they will pick wrong? Well what is wrong is subjective. Based on experiences and choices. DD1 spent weeks playing a game and in the end realized she missed way too many fun things outside with her friends. I haven't seen her on the computer in months. She tried to stay up super late all summer and again missed a lot of fun that was going on in the mornings with her friends. She decided it was best to go to bed early and get up early so that she can be part of the fun. So she learned from these experiences. I know people in their 20's that still do stuff like that. She's 8. Swearing... I'm not the word police.

You know what? Why bother. You'd obviously forgo a friendship over pettiness. I won't. I know we're different. However we make pretty good friends, I respect her choices she respects mine. Amazing we've been friends for so long?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zinemama*
> 
> Much of your list does make me cringe. I wouldn't want my kids in a house where hours of video games are the norm. I don't think unlimited screen time is a healthy thing. Nor do I want my kids around other kids and adults who curse and believe it's ok. I think profanity is tacky and vulgar and while I'm first to admit I slip up and use it, I always make it clear that I shouldn't have. I don't think kids need to be included in everything I'm discussing with my friends. Our whole family eats the same healthy food. I don't make special orders, and they don't get to eat what they want, when they want (or it would be chocolate for breakfast). And with a pre-teen boy, running around nude when guests are over is definitely not appropriate. My kids get to make plenty of choices, including input when I plan meals. They are not deprived of freedom. But based on your list, yeah, we wouldn't be hanging out at your place.
> However, I don't think your friend accomplished anything by telling you that your parenting style made her cringe. In her shoes, I would simply have let the friendship die a natural death.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Hey, we all have different values. If it works for you, great.


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## FarmerBeth (Mar 9, 2011)

Quote:
Originally Posted by *zinemama* 

Hey, we all have different values. If it works for you, great.

I wasn't going to comment, but I came back because this was irking me. I get having different parenting values, but what I want to know is whether you are consciously passing on the value of not maintaining friendships with those you disagree with. We have friendships with people of all faiths (and I mean all, Christian, Atheist, Muslim, Buddhist, don't care, you name it), with and without children, permissive to strict parents. I love having real conversations with these people, and modelling respectful debate, looking at things from other people's point of view while maintaining your own values, etc. Wouldn't it be boring if we only ever agreed when talking? And if a friend modifies the household atmosphere when the kids are visiting, isn't that enough? If your value is not tolerating differences in friends, that's fine, I'm just wondering if you consciously realized you have this value or if you just avoid confrontation out of fear.



> What was great about this post was seeing how two very different people can be great friends and how their children can learn about the wide range of diverse family values.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

FarmerBeth, I couldn't get the quote to work on what you wrote, but of course I have friendships with people who have different opinions from me. Heck, I served in the Peace Corps for three years, I get being around people of different backgrounds, and I belong to a very minority faith.

However, I think what you are talking about is very different from what the OP is describing. I'm very happy to be friends with someone who holds different views. But I don't want my kids hanging out with kids who've been taught that cursing is A-ok and do it routinely. Of course, if they modified that behavior around my kids, that would be fine. I didn't see that mentioned in the OP (and haven't read the entire thread). I'm not going to take my 11yo boy somewhere that other kids routinely run around naked. But sure, if they don't do that when pre-teen boys are around, that wouldn't prevent me from hanging out, either. I didn't see that in the OP, either. I think there's a big difference in maintaining friendships with people of other _opinions_, vs. not wanting your kids around people who exhibit certain _behaviors_. Big difference.


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## FarmerBeth (Mar 9, 2011)

OK, get that. If you read the whole thread, you'd probably get my context. I can see the distinction between views and behaviors.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Hey the point is that there are people who simply don't like my style of parenting. And that's cool. How you do it in your own home and how comfortable you'd feel with your kids around mine are all up to the parent. We teach respect. If someone else would feel uncomfortable with nudity. It wouldn't be respectful to flaunt your wares. And swearing... that's understood that others don't appreciate it.


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## Adia (Oct 13, 2011)

No advice here, just a lot of support. I'm very similar, radical unschooling and all, and it's tough to find friendships where parenting style isn't a tension. Even when I try not to even mention it, or ignore it when they do, there inevitably comes a point where I can't take being picked at about it, or having my children 'tested' in various ways to see if they have any hidden freak in them, since after all, it must be in there somewhere with the horrible parenting they receive. And then it becomes an issue, then it becomes a big spiral of unhappy. And then the friendship either just fades away or it's a big blow uppy thing. None of it good.

I understand what you're going through. Been there. There aren't any easy answers. My only advice is that when the friendship becomes more stresses than joys, it's time to let it go. Until or unless that happens, just keep her at arm's length on parenting style and enjoy the things you love about her.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Thanks Adia,

However the point is she doesn't really care. She told me she can't imagine allowing half the stuff I allow. We do respect each others wishes though. When her kids are out somewhere with me. Even though they're older than mine. I follow her rules. Most of her rules are based on fear. Her 10 year old daughter is not allowed in a public bathroom by herself so I'll gather all the kids sans the boys and go in the bathroom with her. Boys standing outside the door. I don't for one minute want her to think I don't feel her points are not valid. ( a little over the top sometimes) When my kids are with her, she will gently remind them that swearing is not okay at her house and will give them different words for when they fall of the trampoline and such. She knows my kids eat mostly health foods and will ask me in advance if they can have what they're having for dinner. I always say yes because to them it's exciting to eat at their house. And for some reason her kids think it's great to eat at mine. One ate a whole pan of granola once and though it was AWESOME!

Now aside from her, I do have other people to deal with that are actually difficult. I don't get into spanking debates and I won't be goaded into other conversations that just don't jive with my views amongst friends. Being in the military for so long you run into so many different people. So many different views.


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## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Now aside from her, I do have other people to deal with that are actually difficult. I don't get into spanking debates and I won't be goaded into other conversations that just don't jive with my views amongst friends. *Being in the military for so long you run into so many different people. So many different views.*


That's interesting, and perhaps I have a lot to learn. I always had this idea that military folks had one world view. I'd be interested in hearing more.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

No you'd be amazed. Since they all come from so many different walks of life they all have different views. Breastfeeders, homeschoolers, foster parents, writers, teachers, gentle parents and of course mainstream parenting. I was taught about breastfeeding and the importance from a Male Sgt in the Army. Gentle parenting from a gaggle of ladies during PT and homeschooling was talked about often. The stay at home dad was becoming big as I was getting out. Quite a few military members are there for college and are working on their Masters or Second BA. They do their job and go about their lives. I have 4 former AF friends big into the music industry now. Two are straight out of SA and the other two have moved around. The two in SA and getting bigger and it's quite exciting to see them go for their dreams. Quite a few are writers and I just recently got one in the mail from Amazon and I'm excited to read it and give him my take on his writing. I think I've found more people that were in the military work harder to make their dreams come true. They know there is so much out there and being in the military was a great push to help them find themselves and meet so many great people.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CatsCradle*
> 
> That's interesting, and perhaps I have a lot to learn. I always had this idea that military folks had one world view. I'd be interested in hearing more.


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## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Since they all come from so many different walks of life they all have different views.


One of the women I was in yoga teacher training with was active duty army and just back from 18 months in Iraq. She practices yoga every day as a way of staying sane. She did half her teacher training with us, and had made arrangements to do the second half with a different yoga school half way across the country were her next post was. Amazing woman. She also said there isn't a military type, people end up for all different reasons and the military is as diverse as the rest of the country.

The yoga teacher I had who encouraged me to go to teacher training was retired air force.

Neither of them were what one would stereo-type as "military."


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

check out Veteransforpeace.org


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## sharon71 (May 27, 2005)

OP I love the freedom you give your girls I pretty much parent the same way. As far as the cussing goes I have 2 teens who I allow to cuss with exceptions those are not around other children,their teachers other school officals,employees,police,clergy,other adults,Grand Parents,etc.I'm not naive and I know that they will cuss around their peers no matter what.With that said my youngest does not cuss and knows those words are for older people.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

I do think it teaches a good lesson for them to understand that outside the house there are certain things that really are not acceptable. And to be fair and respectful of others. I don't know I havent heard a swear word in weeks I think DD2 is over it.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharon71*
> 
> OP I love the freedom you give your girls I pretty much parent the same way. As far as the cussing goes I have 2 teens who I allow to cuss with exceptions those are not around other children,their teachers other school officals,employees,police,clergy,other adults,Grand Parents,etc.I'm not naive and I know that they will cuss around their peers no matter what.With that said my youngest does not cuss and knows those words are for older people.


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## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Well you know the screen time and food make me cringe, haha! But I understand what you are doing and I know a lot of people who parent like you and have really engaged, responsible kids. My kids free range pretty hard (easy, as we're in the middle of the woods) and have an extremely unstructured day...the homeschooling we're doing so far with my DD is extremely light, conversational and directed by her. I believe in and practice similar principles as you, but it's different because my kids are still so little.

I really like what you said about not assuming that, given the choice, kids will choose wrong. I feel like a lot of people make that assumption. So many of the important things in life, the TRULY important things which mark the difference between good, happy, loving/respectful people and unhappy, rude, selfish people...are incredibly self evident. Kids aren't stupid. When they are allowed to use their guts and feel their way through things, they can decide. It's a well supported idea, that children learn best (and really, isn't this true for most people?) through experience driven exercise. I think that, when it's not forced on them and they feel like autonomous and empowered human beings, children will confidently navigate situations and concepts as they arise and will choose good, respect, love, sharing, curiosity etc....if that's what is being modeled at home. (and sometimes even when it's not!)

The screen time, the food, swearing, etc....these are lifestyle choices, they are not adjectives. They do not describe a persons character. If left alone and given honest guidance in how they view the world...I believe a child is capable of deciding most limits for themselves, of deciding what kind of person they want to be, and can become highly successful people in their social and practical lives as a result.


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