# Booster VS. Five point harness car seat questions



## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

I know that there is conflicting information regarding the use of a five point harness seat vs. belt positioning booster seat. I am confused







: and do not want to do anything that might compromise my son's safety. Please educate me. My son is currently 3 years 1 month old. He's 30 lbs and 38" tall. We have a Cosco Alpha Omega Elite that was manufactured about 2.5 years ago. We have it installed, forward facing, in the middle of the backseat using the car (1999 Toyota Camry) seatbelt. We don't have LATCH. It has worked fine for us, but I always wish that I had purchased a Britax. The Cosco can eventually be converted to a booster, but it is getting sort of old, and I'm thinking about buying a Britax booster for ds. Does anyone have any experience with these? The specifications say for 38"-60" tall or 30-100lbs. I am thinking that it might be best to wait until ds is older (like 4 or 5) before moving to a belt-positioning booster....DH disagrees with me and thinks it would be fine. What would you do? Would you keep the Cosco and buy a booster later? Would you upgrade to a Britax Convertable and have a new five point for a while, then convert it to a booster when ds is older? Or would you just buy a Britax booster? Thank you so much in advance for your insight. I know many of you are very knowledgeable about carseats, so I really appreciate any input.


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## hottmama (Dec 27, 2004)

It would be extremely unsafe to put a 3 yr. old in a booster seat. They should be in a 5 pt. harness until at LEAST 4 yrs. and 40 lbs., but beyond that is highly recommended. There are many seats available that will harness beyond 40 lbs.
For a 3 yr. old that is only 30 lbs. and 38", I would want a rear-facing seat. The Britax Boulevard, Sunshine Kids Radian, or Recaro Como could keep your son rear-facing to 35 lbs. and then harnessed to 65 lbs./about 48-52" tall/6-7 yrs., when he would be ready for a high-back booster.
If you don't want to put your son in a rear-facing seat, you could buy a Britax Regent, which harnesses to 80 lbs./20" torso (ie, a LONG time-- ~8 yrs. old for your son) the Britax Frontier (out soon) which harnesses to 80 lbs., but not quite as long height-wise as the Regent, and then converts to a booster, or the Graco Nautilus, which harnesses to 65 lbs. and converts to a booster.

My sons are:
5 yrs., 45", 45 lbs. in a Britax Regent
2 yrs., 36", 32 lbs. in a rear-facing SK Radian

Personally for a convertible, I prefer the Britax or Radian because they have rear-facing tethers, which I think are an important safety feature. For a forward-facing only seat, I'd go with the Britax Frontier if money is no object (it costs almost twice as much as the Graco). If money is an issue (which it is for me), the Nautilus is a really good seat and will keep kids harnessed for a good length of time and is a decent high back booster.

If your current carseat rear-faces to 35 lbs. (which I think it does), I'd leave him in it, rear-facing, until 35 lbs. and then go with the Nautilus or Frontier. If your carseat only rear-faces to 30 lbs., I'd go with a Radian now.


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## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

He is not enough old, weigh enough, or mature enough to sit in a booster yet. At that age, I personally wouldn't buy one of the Britax 65lb seats (bvld, marathon, decath) unless you plan on having another child to pass it down to. You would get more for your buck to get a Radian 65, Recaro Como/Signo, Britax Regent, Britax Frontier (I think these are coming out in May?), or a Graco Nautilus. All of those harness to greater heights then other seats, the Frontier and Nautilus turn into boosters later.

The Radian can be a tricky install with seltbelts so it's best to try it out in person if possible, same with the Regent. The Recaros install easily, as well as the Graco Nautilus, and no one knows yet about the Frontier. There are some rumors that it requires a tether in your car, as the Regent does as well.


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## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

Thank you both for your detailed answers. Our car does not have a place to clip a tether







. Perhaps I need a new car too. I am going to go research all of these, but my main question has been answered definitively...thank you very much.


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## hottmama (Dec 27, 2004)

You can get a tether installed in your car-- call the dealership and ask. I drive a '93 and I put a tether in myself.
Also, the Radian definitely doesn't require a tether. However, for rear-facing, I'd highly recommend it, and I'm positive you could find something to tether it to (it comes with a strap to wrap around basically any metal part in your car, then hook the tether clip to it).


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## johannasonja (Aug 15, 2006)

They have to weigh 15 kg, our daughter was a little over 3 years old, we ve got her a Britax which i accidently broke recently trying to clean it, anyway now we bought the new model of Compass 550 (i think that was the nmr.) anyway it is so much better than the britax. they have changed a lot because we looked at it 1,5 years ago and it wasnt half as good as it is now. And the part what holds the shoulder belt in is so much better than britax.

Johannasonja


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## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

Moving to Family Safety, home of all car seat threads.


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## lightheart (Jul 2, 2005)

Sounds like you got your question answered but wanted to toss out there that the Regent I have (a year old) says that the tether needs to be used if your child weighs more than 50lb. I'm lucky in the fact that our new car has the tether spots but our old car which we still have and use for farm stuff and hubby does not have the tether spots. Contacting the dealer is on my list of things to do so this thread has been a nice reminder that I need to do that!


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *johannasonja* 
They have to weigh 15 kg, our daughter was a little over 3 years old, we ve got her a Britax which i accidently broke recently trying to clean it, anyway now we bought the new model of Compass 550 (i think that was the nmr.) anyway it is so much better than the britax. they have changed a lot because we looked at it 1,5 years ago and it wasnt half as good as it is now. And the part what holds the shoulder belt in is so much better than britax.

Johannasonja

May I ask what country you are in? 3 year is not considered any where near old enough for a belt positioning booster, but I realize some countries have no harnessing options for over 40 lbs, unfortunately.


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## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

Thanks for the additional information everyone







I wasn't aware that you could have a tether installed. Does anyone know.... If I was to have one installed, would it be ok to use the tether strap on the seat we currently have if it is not used in conjunction with LATCH? It seems to me that it would just offer another level of protection.


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Yes you can use the top tether with a seat belt install


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *an_aurora* 
Yes you can use the top tether with a seat belt install

















: Actually, you should always tether forward facing seats if at all possible, it reduces head excursion.


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## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

I called the Toyota dealership and will have the tether anchor installed this week. It will only be $5.00 and I feel so stupid for failing to do this earlier. So, I would like to have the new seat before I go to the dealership because they have a certified car seat installer there, and I would like to have them do it for me. My two top choices are the SK Radian 80, Graco Nautilus and the SafeGuard. Cost is not an issue, I just want the safest seat that will work the best in my car. Any suggestions on which one is the better choice. I'm leaning toward the Radian 80 and GN because of the higher weight limit, but the SafeGuard seems really good too.


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

I don't know anything about the Safeguard, and I know a little about the Nautilus. IIRC the top slots on the Nautilus are the same as on the Radian, plus you get a booster. The Nautilus would offer more bang for your buck. Also, when considering a Radian, the top slots on the 65 and 80 are the same. Most children outgrow their seat by height before weight so you could probably get by with a 65. The downside to the Radian is that it can have install issues, especially in Toyotas.


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

The Nautilus actually has higher top slots than the Radian. As Lisa said, there is really no advantage to getting the Radian80 over the 65, unless you have very short, heavy children.


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *an_aurora* 
The Nautilus actually has higher top slots than the Radian. As Lisa said, there is really no advantage to getting the Radian80 over the 65, unless you have very short, heavy children.

Thanks, I thought it might, but I wasn't 100%. Not to hijack, but while we're on the subject, is it true that you can use the Radian with the shoulders up to 1" above the top harness slot for FFing?? I keep hearing this, but it doesn't sound right to me.


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alysmommy2004* 
Thanks, I thought it might, but I wasn't 100%. Not to hijack, but while we're on the subject, is it true that you can use the Radian with the shoulders up to 1" above the top harness slot for FFing?? I keep hearing this, but it doesn't sound right to me.

Yes, the manufacturer has ok'd the use of the seat with the shoulders one inch over the top slots. I'd be pretty hesitant to do so, and while we have a Radian I will be discontinuing use once she is even with the top slots. Other people are fine with it, though, so really it's just a parental decision. I saw pictures of a kiddo who was an inch over the top slots of the Radian, but still had an inch of room in the Nautilus.


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *an_aurora* 
Yes, the manufacturer has ok'd the use of the seat with the shoulders one inch over the top slots. I'd be pretty hesitant to do so, and while we have a Radian I will be discontinuing use once she is even with the top slots. Other people are fine with it, though, so really it's just a parental decision. I saw pictures of a kiddo who was an inch over the top slots of the Radian, but still had an inch of room in the Nautilus.

Thank you! I'm planning on getting one as a back up seat and I think it's still going to be my best bet.


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## hottmama (Dec 27, 2004)

I'd get a Radian 65 if you can try it out in your car first. Your son has 5 lbs. of rear-facing left, which is a big deal. The Nautilus is forward-facing only, so while it might last longer than the Radian, I think that little bit (what's the harness height on it, anyway? Isn't the Radian 18"?) is less important than what is basically a year of rear-facing. Or, if your son still fits in the AOE rear-facing, I'd leave him in that until he outgrows it and then go with a Nautilus or the Britax Frontier (out in April or May?).
But since you might have install problems with the Radian and your Toyota, I'd only buy it if you can try it out first.


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## thepeach80 (Mar 16, 2004)

I don't think I've met a tech yet who is o.k. w/ using the Radian over the top slots. I will not use mine that way. I really like the Graco Nautilus, it does have higher slots than the Radian. At 3yo and 30#, I would be o.k. having a ffing child if you are buying a new seat. The safest thing will be to keep him rfing of course, that's how my 39.5 mos old rides.







He will ride that way till he just can't weight wise (which should be around 5 or so), but he has ridden ffing before.


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## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

Thank you everyone. I ordered the Nautilus yesterday...I was a little hesitant just because it is so much less money than the others, but after all of the good reviews I've read, I decided that it will probably be a very good seat.


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## 2 in August (Jan 6, 2006)

We just got a Nautilus last week for my dd and we really like it. She's a bit older (6.5yo) but still a light weight at only 40lbs so it will last us a long time. It's so comfy that she actually fell asleep in it which she hasn't done in her old seat since she was a preschooler.


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## glorified_rice (Jun 5, 2005)

That's good to hear. I would love it if ds would fall asleep in the car. I'm hoping the Nautilus will be much more comfortable for him.


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## indie (Jun 16, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thepeach80* 
I don't think I've met a tech yet who is o.k. w/ using the Radian over the top slots.

Can somebody explain why in detail? If the choice is between going over the slots or going to a booster for a child who won't sit properly in one is it really best to go to the booster even though it has supposedly been tested to be ok to continue in the Radian? My children have extremely long torsos and I have three seats in a row in a sedan so the chances of getting a higher harnessing seat to fit are slim.


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

I think people are worried about spinal compression. Personally, I think that's less likely than a serious injury if a child cannot sit properly in a belted booster, kwim? But it's your call as a parent if/when the time comes.


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

Yes, it's because of spinal compression. Personally, I am still getting one as a travel seat (even though it's heavy) b/c my DD has a looooong torso and it doesn't leave me with too many options. She'll be under the harness slots for a little while still, but seeing as she's only 4yo and not ready for a booster I'll use it over the top slots only for travel if I really have to. It's not something I want to do, but I'd rather not put her in a booster.


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## thepeach80 (Mar 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *indie* 
Can somebody explain why in detail? If the choice is between going over the slots or going to a booster for a child who won't sit properly in one is it really best to go to the booster even though it has supposedly been tested to be ok to continue in the Radian? My children have extremely long torsos and I have three seats in a row in a sedan so the chances of getting a higher harnessing seat to fit are slim.

Neither of those is a safe choice IMO. You should look into a travel vest like the EZon Pro ones in this case. AJ moved into the top slot of his Radian right before he turned 3, I don't expect him to outgrow the seat now till just after he turns 6. He's grown not even an inch in torso in the past 2 yrs while he's grown over 4" total. Suuposedly SKJP tested the seat w/ a dummy checking for spinal compression, but there are no guidelines for it. The Radian is not the only thing you can do to keep a child harnessed in a tight spot.


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