# Dd's new friend is a super picky eater - WWYD?



## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

We are new to this area and I am thrilled that dd has this friend. She's a sweet girl and the family is lovely. But honestly I have never met a child as stubborn (or as rude) as this one is when it comes to food. When she is over at dinner time, she will ask what we are having and then inform me that she doesn't like whatever it is. And I am not talking about woo-woo crunchy organic stuff either, I'm just talking about regular stuff like hamburgers, corn on the cob, fried chicken, mushrooms, you name it. It's like "I don't like it" is her default setting. When I ask her if she's ever had it before, she'll say no but she doesn't like it.

Well I have tried my default setting of simply saying, this is what we are having so you are having it too, at least give it a try. Of course I also try to have the few things that I know she likes, like baked potato or carrots. Or if she is just staying for dinner and going home afterwards, I will let her eat what she wants (sometimes she eats nothing at all) and then let her mom know so her mom can get some food into her before bed. But like last night, she ended up spending the night rather unexpectedly and I didn't have "her" foods in the house. I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.

So I am sort of puzzling over how to deal with this in the long term. What would you do in this case? I guess there are two issues here: one is how to get her to eat when she is here (the best I can think of is to just be sure we always have potatoes and carrots in the house!) and the other is how to deal with my reaction to her. To me it is just really rude to go into someone else's house and refuse their food, basically expecting them to make something else for you. I have talked to her about it, asked her if she feels uncomfortable eating at someone else's house (sympathetic approach) and on another day letting her know that I feel hurt when she asks what we are having then says she doesn't like it even without tasting it (direct approach) but neither has done any good. I haven't talked it over with her mom yet, although I think I could with no hurt feelings. I'd just like to figure out a solution for myself if possible.

Oh, she and my dd are 8, they are not little ones. I wouldn't have as much of a problem if the behavior was coming from a 4 year old, YK?

Any advice?


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## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

Well I'd stop having her over for dinner.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

See, I've considered that but I really don't want to go there. Only having her over at non-meal times would significantly limit how much time she and my dd get to play, and as I said I am glad that dd has this friend. Dd is an only child and so really needs other kids around sometimes.


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## Twocoolboys (Mar 10, 2006)

I would not worry about it much. If she doesn't eat anything, it's her choice. She's 8, she's not going to starve from one missed meal. That just means she'll eat a hearty breakfast - lol.

And, I would ask her for a list of foods she likes in addition to potatoes and carrots and I would try to always keep at least one of those things on hand. I generally keep pretzels on hand for one of my ds's friends who is here often (though not at meal times). He likes to snack on them and doesn't usually like our other snack foods. He knows where we keep them and can help himself.


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

Quote:

I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.
I definitely would not do that. It's sort of mean.







I cannot imagine telling a guest in my house, "You have to eat a bit of everything that I'm serving!" I wouldn't do it to an adult, and I wouldn't do it to a kid.

My dd (5) has real sensory issues that make her an incredibly picky eater. She honestly can't help it (though we're getting OT and they'll work with her on this). You don't know why this girl doesn't eat a lot of different things, or why she won't try them. And even if it's simply that she doesn't want to, well, she doesn't want to! Don't force the issue.

Quote:

To me it is just really rude to go into someone else's house and refuse their food, basically expecting them to make something else for you.
I think you need to get over this feeling you have and just make it easy for everyone by, like the previous poster suggested, having her come up with a list of things she likes, especially no-cook things, and have those readily available with meals/snacks when she's visiting.

Then you simply serve the meal, have the "safe" food she likes available, and don't mention the issue. Everyone can sit down, eat what she wants and not eat what she doesn't want, and just enjoy each other's company.


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

I'd just find out what she likes and stock up on a few things that keep well.

My ds is a pretty picky eater. He wouldn't eat hamburgers, corn on the cob, chicken, or mushrooms, either (or potatoes and carrots). But it is likely you have something in his cupboard he would eat like pasta with parmesan cheese or crackers. It's also likely he'd not want to return if he was pressured into eating food he didn't like.

Helping him eat new foods and a more varied diet is my job, not something I want other people taking on. Other people "encouraging" him tends to backfire. I know when he is in a good mood, not tired, feeling adventurous enough to try something and not sensitive enough that he will have sensory issues with it.

But I do encourage him to just say "no thanks". Continued pressure might result in a less polite response, however. Sometimes he says something tastes like a dead mouse, lol, and I ask him how he knows what a dead mouse tastes like.









I wouldn't worry about having different rules for guests. That is a common enough occurrence. Just because it is a child guest doesn't mean she should be treated differently than an adult guest who is allowed to abstain from foods that aren't to their preference. It's more rude to make a guest eat a food than for a guest to not eat a food, IMO.


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## kriket (Nov 25, 2007)

DH is a picky eater, He either eats what I cook (I include things he likes) or he fiends for himself. So maybe you could have her mom send something with her? Single serve things? or "home foods" that she likes that way you aren't put out, and she still eats.

I do think it's rude that she won't eat. I had a greek and a southern friend, the foods they ate were _very_ different then what mom cooked. I still at least ate some and told them how delicious it was. but my grandfather is Italian, and not eating WILL GET YOU KILLED in an Italian family don't even play, they don't care if you're full or whatever, you're eating, and you're liking it.


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## veganf (Dec 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I haven't talked it over with her mom yet, although I think I could with no hurt feelings.

I think you definitely need to talk to her parents about it. If they are expecting her to be at your house during a mealtime and she won't eat anything that you offer, then she either needs to bring a packed meal of her own or not be there during mealtimes. Maybe if she knows why she can't be there at mealtime she want to be a bit more cooperative and try new things so she can stay, but if not, it shouldn't be your problem.


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

I'd try to have foods on hand that you think she'll like- maybe ask her mom or dad for suggestions of things the child likes that are easy to keep in the pantry or freezer.

It's not your job to make the child eat new foods- it's simply your job to offer food to her. The only thing I'd address with her directly is HOW she tells you she doesn't want it. If "I don't like it" seems rude to you, then teach her to say "no thank you" instead.

I'm wondering if the foods you prepare are VERY different from what she eats at home. Your "location" says that you're in Vietnam- and maybe hamburgers and corn on the cob aren't "basic normal food" there? Would she be more likely to eat a stir fry or a curry?


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

When my daughter's friends want to eat here, they first ask what I'm making and only want to eat here if it sounds good to them. If someone wanted to stay for dinner I'd probably warn them about what we were having to help them make their choice. So maybe you could do something like that? When she says she wants to stay, tell her what you're having and if she doesn't like it, suggest she stay another night instead.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.

If I were the friend's mom, I wouldn't allow my child back at your house if I found this out.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

I would definitely never insist a child eat something they don't like. Especially someone who is relatively new in your lives. You don't know if "don't like" is a way of saying "makes me sick to my stomach" or "allergic to" or whatever. To me, coercising someone to eat is as much a violation of their body as hitting them. This seems extreme but as someone who's parents regularly did both, I can assure you they feel very similar.

Also, I think its inevitable that you will have different rules when guests are present then when they aren't. So I wouldn't get hung up on that. In our house rules such as how much clothing you need on when out of your bedroom changes, as well as where it is OK to play.

I've had several of DSs friends to dinner (same age), and some of them don't eat very much or express dislike for what I serve. Mostly my strategy has been to plan on meals that are reasonably kid friendly, and make sure I have bread and butter and carrot sticks and ranch dip on the table (or something that I know most people will eat). Serve dinner -- without telling child first what is for dinner, unless its "we are having X, would you like to stay or should I call your mom to pick you up?" Don't worry about how much she eats. If she is rude about not liking it, stick to neutral information like "I'm sorry you don't like it but please don't spoil it for everyone else." If she's staying the night, offer a snack of something "safe". If she's not staying, tell her parent when they pick her up that she didn't eat much dinner so she might need a before-bed snack.

I put as much consideration into feeding a child guest as I do an adult guest, though maybe not as much fuss as a "special" guest. That, for me, is part of being hospitable, and that is important to me. If you aren't willing to do that, then I would really plan on playdates that didn't involve dinner as everyone will probably be happier.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

well I would stop having her over for meal time.

or tell her that is fine but you aren't going to make something special and she can eat when she gets home. (although I think this is kinda rude since you invited her over a meal time)

if those is not an option I would offer her a bowl of cereal or a peanut butter sandwhich. I would never insist an invited guest eat anything. they are after all a guest. if this was a child you were babysitting regularly, a family memeber who was over all the time it would be different. but this is someone yuou want at your house and it seems yuo think the pickiness is still worth it to have her over for dinner. So if you know she will be there I would either serve something she likes (like you would for your friends) or plan playdates when she won't need a meal or will be eating a meal where she is a little easier to accomodate.

Maybe for sleep overs have her mom drop her of after supper. Breakfast food is sometimes easier. or drop her off right after breakfast and have her bring a sack lunch. have your dd pack one too and they can have a picnic. or stick with a simple kind of sandwhich you know she likes.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

Just because it is a child guest doesn't mean she should be treated differently than an adult guest who is allowed to abstain from foods that aren't to their preference. It's more rude to make a guest eat a food than for a guest to not eat a food, IMO.
I don't really think the comparison to adults works because quite frankly if an adult came to my house at dinner, asked what we were having, and then announced that they didn't like it (and I mean almost.every.time) I simply wouldn't have that adult over to my house any more







.

I hear what you all are saying (and it's probably what I will end up doing, just having "safe" foods on hand so she doesn't get too hungry) but it's not sitting well with me yet. It is a matter of manners and house rules. If the rule at our house was that the kids go to bed at 9:00 and a friend came over and expected to stay up until midnight, I would say the same thing: these are the rules in our house, my daughter is expected to follow them and I expect you to follow them while in our house. I teach my daughter to do the same when she is at a friend's house. It is a matter of respect. I understand that y'all have different rules and may not agree with my rules, but when at someone else's house it is polite to follow their rules (as long as they are reasonable, naturally).

And just to be clear, I'm not expecting the child to eat an entire plate of something she doesn't like! Our general rule is that we all eat at least a little bit from the major food groups, which we define as protein, carbs, and veggies. If my daughter doesn't like broccoli I don't mind her substituting seaweed, for example. But if there isn't any seaweed then she has to eat a small amount of broccoli if that's what we have.

If this child is going to be over often (and it looks like it will, she hasn't been put off at all by the food issue and still wants to come over all the time, LOL) I'm trying to figure out how it is okay for her to follow different rules than my daughter. Maybe it is okay, but it doesn't feel like it to me.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
I'd try to have foods on hand that you think she'll like- maybe ask her mom or dad for suggestions of things the child likes that are easy to keep in the pantry or freezer.

It's not your job to make the child eat new foods- it's simply your job to offer food to her. The only thing I'd address with her directly is HOW she tells you she doesn't want it. If "I don't like it" seems rude to you, then teach her to say "no thank you" instead.

I'm wondering if the foods you prepare are VERY different from what she eats at home. Your "location" says that you're in Vietnam- and maybe hamburgers and corn on the cob aren't "basic normal food" there? Would she be more likely to eat a stir fry or a curry?

No, I just have to update my profile! We are back in the US now.

You make a good point, though. It is not my job to make her eat. The more I read this thread the more I realize that to me this is really more an issue of respect. So maybe working with her about how to express her preferences.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

I put as much consideration into feeding a child guest as I do an adult guest, though maybe not as much fuss as a "special" guest. That, for me, is part of being hospitable, and that is important to me. If you aren't willing to do that, then I would really plan on playdates that didn't involve dinner as everyone will probably be happier.
I do try to do this, thus the "kid friendly" foods like corn on the cob and hamburgers.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I hear what you all are saying (and it's probably what I will end up doing, just having "safe" foods on hand so she doesn't get too hungry) but it's not sitting well with me yet. It is a matter of manners and house rules. If the rule at our house was that the kids go to bed at 9:00 and a friend came over and expected to stay up until midnight, I would say the same thing: these are the rules in our house, my daughter is expected to follow them and I expect you to follow them while in our house. I teach my daughter to do the same when she is at a friend's house. It is a matter of respect. I understand that y'all have different rules and may not agree with my rules, but when at someone else's house it is polite to follow their rules (as long as they are reasonable, naturally).

You can insist that the child go to bed at 9pm per your 'house rules'... But you can't 'make' them go to sleep at 9pm. If a child, yours or a guest, wanted to lay in bed awake, not disturbing anyone until midnight - you couldn't stop them.

It's the same with food.

You can insist that she be polite about turning down food. You can insist that she sit at the table politely and visit while the family eats. But there is NO WAY that you should insist that she eat something.

Personally - I would make sure to have a snack I knew the kid liked and serve it long enough after supper that I didn't feel like it was a meal replacement. If the kid complained about being hungry - I would probably say that once the rest of us digested supper - we'd have a snack.

I don't openly 'cater' to children. But I sure do it secretly. Before my DD was drinking cow milk - we never bought it. But I would buy it when my sister came over with her kids because they refused to eat 'different' food and were absolute pains with nothing in their stomachs. But could quite nicely live off milk. So I'd make sure to have some on hand so that I didn't have to deal with their crappy behavior when they got hungry and refused to eat my food. I'm sure they would have also eaten icecream instead of supper - but that didn't feel right to me, so I bought milk instead.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I do try to do this, thus the "kid friendly" foods like corn on the cob and hamburgers.

Well, if you were inviting your adult friends over to dinner, what would you do? I think you might think beyond "its adult friendly" to "what does X like to eat". At least, that's generally the way I approach cooking for friends. Of course, if they have dropped in unexpectedly, then its "we are having X, would you like to stay?" I don't do unplanned playdates, and certainly not ones that end in meals, so for me there is some planning time built in. If these are entirely, "oh, X is here and its dinner time, can she stay?" sorts of deals, I think all you can do is put a couple of safe, effortless choices out and hope for the best.

If, as you say, this is going to be an ongoing issue, I think your next step really needs to be a discussion with the child's mom about how she would like you to handle it. Basic playdate rules would dictate that you not do something that the other parent is opposed to, so I think you should go that route next. I will say that "forcing", no matter how gently and how little, my child to eat a food they didn't want would be a deal-breaker for me. In fact, my SIL did this to my son and it was the last time they have babysat him. I think you can say, "Our house rule is X, is that OK with you?" If she says no, then you can either work out an acceptible compromise or you can agree that child doesn't stay to dinner any more. But I think you are at the point where you need to involve the other parent.


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## baltic_ballet (May 17, 2007)

You are not a short order cook; if she dosn't like what your serving then she can miss out. I wouldn't be making a seperate meal just for her I don't have the time or energy.


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## aprildawn (Apr 1, 2004)

As the mom trying to figure out what to do, I'd say to do what I do with my own kids which is to offer them cereal or a quick PB&J sandwich if they don't like what I'm fixing for dinner.

As the mom of the kid who is a picky eater, I'd want to know about it so I could help coach my child in how to be gracious as well as adventurous in what she's willing to eat. My oldest DD is picky. She will eat a hamburger, but only one her daddy has grilled in the backyard. She will eat pasta but only certain kinds, etc. It's frustrating to cook for her. I wouldn't want a friend's mom to cook a separate meal for her, but I'd appreciate it if that mom would take into consideration what _my_ kid will eat, not just what kids _in general_ will eat, YK?


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kessed* 
You can insist that the child go to bed at 9pm per your 'house rules'... But you can't 'make' them go to sleep at 9pm. If a child, yours or a guest, wanted to lay in bed awake, not disturbing anyone until midnight - you couldn't stop them.

It's the same with food.

You can insist that she be polite about turning down food. You can insist that she sit at the table politely and visit while the family eats. But there is NO WAY that you should insist that she eat something.

Well I do insist that my dd eat certain foods, which I know may put me in the minority on these board. But I feel strongly that a varied diet is important. As I said before, I'm quite flexible about the particulars as long as she is getting a protein, a veggie, and a carb.

However your point is well-taken that she is not my kid and so I should be coordinating with her mother about what rules she should follow. I guess that is the next step.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evan&Anna's_Mom* 
Well, if you were inviting your adult friends over to dinner, what would you do? I think you might think beyond "its adult friendly" to "what does X like to eat". At least, that's generally the way I approach cooking for friends. Of course, if they have dropped in unexpectedly, then its "we are having X, would you like to stay?" I don't do unplanned playdates, and certainly not ones that end in meals, so for me there is some planning time built in. If these are entirely, "oh, X is here and its dinner time, can she stay?" sorts of deals, I think all you can do is put a couple of safe, effortless choices out and hope for the best.

If, as you say, this is going to be an ongoing issue, I think your next step really needs to be a discussion with the child's mom about how she would like you to handle it. Basic playdate rules would dictate that you not do something that the other parent is opposed to, so I think you should go that route next. I will say that "forcing", no matter how gently and how little, my child to eat a food they didn't want would be a deal-breaker for me. In fact, my SIL did this to my son and it was the last time they have babysat him. I think you can say, "Our house rule is X, is that OK with you?" If she says no, then you can either work out an acceptible compromise or you can agree that child doesn't stay to dinner any more. But I think you are at the point where you need to involve the other parent.

Yeah, so far these have been spur-of-the-moment things where the decision to stay for dinner is made at the last minute. I'm only just now giving it a lot of thought because we are looking at the summer break and I expect (and want!) this child to be over a lot. So you are right, I'll have to figure something out with her mom.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Well I do insist that my dd eat certain foods, which I know may put me in the minority on these board. But I feel strongly that a varied diet is important. As I said before, I'm quite flexible about the particulars as long as she is getting a protein, a veggie, and a carb.

However your point is well-taken that she is not my kid and so I should be coordinating with her mother about what rules she should follow. I guess that is the next step.

I will also choose to insist that my child 'try' things too. I'm not arguing that point.

But - I think that it isn't appropriate to make that kind of rule with someone else's kid.

Have you asked the kid what she does like to eat - and how she likes it prepared?

She's old enough that she may be able to think of a couple things that she's always willing to eat. And then I would try to incorperate those into meals when she was around.

Let's say she likes plain pasta. If you know that, instead of mixing the pasta and sauce in a pot - you can serve them separately. We had guests once who had a picky child. My parents, who were normally VERY militant about eating, made this concession







Except that my dad could not wrap his head around serving 'plain' pasta and sprinkled some dried herbs on them in the serving bowl... Their kid wouldn't touch them. :roll:


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Yes, I asked her what she likes the first night she was here when she told me she didn't like what we were having. It was all stuff that I don't know how to make, like chicken fried steak. To be honest at this point I don't think it would help to learn to make it because she probably won't like the way I make it, LOL. Last night (when she was spending the night unexpectedly) she asked what kind of toothpaste we have and when I told her we have a peppermint flavor she said she didn't like it. I asked what kind she likes, thinking maybe she liked the fruit kind. But no, she uses peppermint at home, she just didn't like our peppermint.

My kid can be really picky about some things, so I understand picky kids. I've just never seen one quite like this.

But hey, she does it potatoes and carrots, which are healthy foods. I'll talk to her mom, and lay in a stock of the above items.

I'm still trying to figure out how to explain this to my dd though. I do consider it bad manners to refuse to eat a token amount of food at a house where one is visiting (assuming one isn't allergic to it or has some other health problem) and quite frankly don't want her imitating her friend on this one. It is reasonable to me for a guest to put one's own preferences in second place and to eat what is served them so that the host doesn't feel bad or feel like they have to prepare something else. This is not to criticize anyone who feels differently; I get that many of you are coming at this from the perspective of children have autonomy over their own bodies. I'm coming at it from a different perspective, and from my perspective I don't know how to explain this to my daughter except to say, "look, we both love [X] but don't do what she does in this area".


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Yes, I asked her what she likes the first night she was here when she told me she didn't like what we were having. It was all stuff that I don't know how to make, like chicken fried steak. To be honest I don't see the point of learning to make it because she probably won't like the way I make it, LOL. Last night (when she was spending the night unexpectedly) she asked what kind of toothpaste we have and when I told her we have a peppermint flavor she said she didn't like it. I asked what kind she likes, thinking maybe she liked the fruit kind. But no, she uses peppermint at home, she just didn't like our peppermint.

She sounds just like my younger cousin. My grandparents once bought mini pizzas for us as a special treat. They got plain cheese because they knew that was all she ate. And still - she picked all the cheese off and wiped off the tomato sauce before replacing the cheese and eating. I was 8 or so - and I WAS HORRIFIED... I knew it was bad manners (because that's what my parents taught me). But I also learned something. My grandparents (who were not interested in raising us - but rather having a nice fun place for us to visit) were so patient and gracious. They ignored the behavior except to bring her a few more paper napkins and remove the ones covered in tomato sauce They knew they couldn't change her - so they didn't.

Quote:

My kid can be really picky about some things, so I understand picky kids. I've just never seen one quite like this.

But hey, she does it potatoes and carrots, which are healthy foods. I'll talk to her mom, and lay in a stock of the above items.
That's something. She won't starve on potatoes. You could even serve the exact kind she likes less when she's not there - so they're more of a treat for your family









Quote:

I'm still trying to figure out how to explain this to my dd though. I do consider it bad manners to refuse to eat a token amount of food at a house where one is visiting (assuming one isn't allergic to it or has some other health problem) and quite frankly don't want her imitating her friend on this one. It is reasonable to me for a guest to put one's own preferences in second place and to eat what is served them so that the host doesn't feel bad or feel like they have to prepare something else. This is not to criticize anyone who feels differently; I get that many of you are coming at this from the perspective of children have autonomy over their own bodies. I'm coming at it from a different perspective, and from my perspective I don't know how to explain this to my daughter except to say, "look, we both love [X] but don't do what she does in this area".
I personally agree with you - and on the approach I'll take with my own children.

But - your DD already knows that there are different rules in different circumstances. Think about any rule you have - not a major safety one - but one of the more minor ones. Is it the same at school? Is it the same if your DH is caring for the kids. For some things - the answer will be yes, and for others the answer will be no.

Let's take another eating related one. Let's say that you require that your DD sit properly in her chair while she's eating - so bum on the seat and feet on the floor. Let's say you were out for the evening and your DH was giving her supper. Is it possible that she might get away with curling a leg up underneath her? (My parents were BIG on the sitting properly rules...) I knew that at school no one cared less if I put my crusts in the garbage - but that would never fly at home.

But I do hear your concern... It SUCKED when we'd have a big family supper and I would have to eat "some" of everything offered and my cousin would have 1 thing on her plate. But I got through it. Although - I soon realized that my parents were actually much more relaxed about food rules when my cousin was around. I knew that it was a special 'treat' and it didn't impact how I behaved normally


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

I agree completely that you shouldn't try to fix what she says she likes, because no matter what you do it won't be "like mom's" and then you will end up feeling doubly resentful. Hence the suggestion of something other than the main dish that she can munch on instead. Something that takes little effort from you and that everyone can share -- not a special meal for her and not something that you don't want your child to eat as well.

Your child is old enough to understand "different families have different rules" AND "I don't like the way X handles this situation, I expect you do to Y instead when you visit X's family, or anyone else."

I think that 8 is also old enough to begin to learn the reasons for that. As I see it, the basic rule of hospitality to is make the other person as comfortable as possible, and to make them feel welcome and cherished. Thus, you are being a good host when you don't make a scene about what guest (child or adult) has or hasn't eaten. And in the reverse, you are being a good guest when you are open to new things and try something your host has prepared, even if you aren't sure you will like it. And unless you have eaten the food in question prepared by that person before, you never know if you will like it or not. And *that* is why you can have a different standard for a guest than for your own child *and* why your child needs to learn to be a good guest and try new things (or at least gracefully look like they are trying). Its a complicated peice of social nicety, but a good one for your child to learn. Of course, this leaves unsaid the fact that child guest hasn't learned this lesson. But you can certainly think it!


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
But like last night, she ended up spending the night rather unexpectedly and I didn't have "her" foods in the house. I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.


That wouldn't go over very well with my son, either, and frankly, I'd be annoyed that you tried to push your views of food on my child. I know it's incredibly frustrating, because I live with it everyday. You need to either not have her over to eat, ask her mom to send food her daughter will eat, or plan to have at least something she will like on the menu and let her eat as much or as little of what you're serving as she chooses. My picky kid is a light eater, and going to bed with just a few bites of food in his stomach probably wouldn't phase him.


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## jdedmom (Jul 11, 2006)

I'm a notorious picky eater. I have been all my life. My mom would force me to eat lots of stuff I hated. I would have to sit at the table for hours until I cleaned my plate. (Remember the scene in Mommy Dearest?) I vowed when I grew up an control what I ate I would not eat any of that stuff ever again. And I don't. Over the years I have gotten better and do try new things from time to time.

When I was little my brother and I were babysat by a Philipino family that served very traditional foods. I would not touch any of it. They did not give me an alternative but I was happy I had control over what I ate and I didn't care that I went hungry.

I don't make my children eat anything they don't like by I sometimes try and convince them to try something. Sometimes it works, sometimes not but at least it's not forced.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
. I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.

Oh, she and my dd are 8, they are not little ones. I wouldn't have as much of a problem if the behavior was coming from a 4 year old, YK?

Any advice?

Honestly? That was seriously GROSSLY inappropriate. How would you feel if you were a guest in someone's house and you were FORCED to eat food you didn't like?

Put the food in front of her. She's 8. If she's hungry she'll eat it. If she's not hungry enough, it really isn't your problem.

I know you didn't ask, but I wouldn't force your daughter to eat food either. It's a sure-fire way to create eating disorders later in life. (As an adult I have struggled with obesity all my life due to a similar mentality from my parents.)


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I get that many of you are coming at this from the perspective of children have autonomy over their own bodies.

I'm not coming at it from that perspective (though yes, I do think children have autonomy). For me, it's about anyone. I don't think that you're a good hostess when you expect everyone to eat some of everything - and then check to see that they do. The problem I'd have in this situation is the way the little girl is handling it. As an adult, if I don't like something (stuffed cabbage, for example), then I just don't get any on my plate. If the hostess (my MIL in cabbage example) asks, I just say, "I don't care for stuffed cabbage" and move on, ignoring all dirty looks. I would never say, "I didn't get any because it's disgusting. I'd NEVER eat cabbage" because *that* would be rude.

I think the difference is in expecting a guest to conform to house rules or bending house rules for the comfort of the guest, and I side with the latter as better manners. My MIL (all kidding aside) feels the former is more appropriate, so it's made for some uncomfortable situations over time (not just over food issues).


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## captain crunchy (Mar 29, 2005)

I am in the camp where I believe it is incredibly inappropriate to force the child to eat food. Seriously. I would be absolutely livid if someone did that with my child. House rules are one thing -- you must wipe your feet on the mat because we don't want mud tracked all over our house type things... but forcing a child to eat? I can't speak to your own child because she is yours and while I don't agree, you can parent her how you see fit within the realm of the law....

I would have foods the girl eats that take minimal effort (carrots/potatoes) like the pp suggested -- or discuss it with her mom and let her mom know you are more than happy to share your meals with her dd but since she has certain preferences, perhaps it would be easier for mom to pack something etc...

I honestly think that the idea that someone is being rude if they prefer not to eat something needs to be explored. What do I care if someone chooses not to eat something I was cooking anyway? Yes, it is a tad rude to plainly say 'I don't like it' -- but I have said to someone very nicely -- "I don't prefer peas thank you but the potatoes look wonderful!!" or whatever -- I don't believe someone should feel pressured/shamed into eating for the sake of niceties. It is their body, and if a host or hostess would prefer someone shove down something they don't want to eat just to appear polite, that is more rude (imo) than the person passing on a dish.

Just my opinion.

If the friendship is important to your dd and to you for her (and it clearly is!) I would drop this whole matter and keep some carrots in the crisper.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Oh, i should add, if I found out someone FORCED my child to eat something he didn't want, not only would that parent be getting an earful from me, I would be making sure to let everyone else in the community know about it...


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## OakBerry (May 24, 2005)

I would not buy special food for this child. Let her know what is being served, if she decides to stay, then she can eat it or go hungry. I'd also discuss it with her parents so they are aware of the situation.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

I don't force my child to eat anything. I never offer them so much as a substitution if they refuse to eat, but what they put in their mouth is their choice. I do encourage them to taste stuff. They are pretty good about this since I never force them to eat anything and they know if they don't like it that is that.

So i would be mad if you forced my kid to eat. I would not be mad if you sent her to bed without supper. (in a non punitive way. my point is don't worry about her being hungry.) although she will probably eat you out of house and home in the morning. i don't expect you to offer her a substitution but I do appreciate it (pb and j or cereal would be more then sufficient).

If this little girl is going to be over at your house a lot ask her mom how she would like you to handle it.

also my children are not forced to go over to anyones house for a play date. if they were forced to eat they would probably not ask to come over any more.

as for explaining things to your dd . . . .my kids know that as a good hostess you cater to your guests. and that their rules might be different than their rules. i do expect them to be gracious and try food at other peoples homes even if we don't have the rule for guests at our home. they get it.

I was by no means a picky eater as a kid but dinner at other peoples homes was just weird for me. I really had a hard time eating someone else's food even though they had invited me over. It was weird. but maybe there is more at play here pickiness.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *greeny* 
I definitely would not do that. It's sort of mean.







I cannot imagine telling a guest in my house, "You have to eat a bit of everything that I'm serving!" I wouldn't do it to an adult, and I wouldn't do it to a kid.

My dd (5) has real sensory issues that make her an incredibly picky eater. She honestly can't help it (though we're getting OT and they'll work with her on this). You don't know why this girl doesn't eat a lot of different things, or why she won't try them. And even if it's simply that she doesn't want to, well, she doesn't want to! Don't force the issue.

I think you need to get over this feeling you have and just make it easy for everyone by, like the previous poster suggested, having her come up with a list of things she likes, especially no-cook things, and have those readily available with meals/snacks when she's visiting.

Then you simply serve the meal, have the "safe" food she likes available, and don't mention the issue. Everyone can sit down, eat what she wants and not eat what she doesn't want, and just enjoy each other's company.

















:


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## gabysmom617 (Nov 26, 2005)

I'm also the mother of a child who has sensory issues when it comes to eating. He's extraordinarily picky. I was also picky when I was young.

My mom tried to graciously handle visits by allowing me to take food with me.

Personally, I can't imagine this 8 year old's mom not knowing her child is a picky eater.

And I think it is rude that the mother, IF she is aware of her child's picky eating, has not taken the initiative to come up with some sort of arrangement to help you out preterm, like allowing her to bring over something microwavable or something non-cook that she likes so you won't have to deal with it. I would not dream of sending my extra-picky eater to visit some one and not sending food along with him knowing how he is; I'd be doing it out of consideration to the person who's looking after him, because otherwise I KNOW that person would have a hard time with him, and I'd also be doing it out of making sure that the child is adequately nourished in my absence and not forced to eat something he don't want to (he'll throw it up if you make him) and would not have to go through the drama of having some one force food on him to get him to eat or sit there hungry while the person would be at a loss as to what to feed him.

Also, where I stand on the issue with making her eat a little bit of everything on the plate. I'm not comfortable with that.

BUT. If I was her mom, I couldn't sit and be mad about it because, it sounds like to me this mom never bothered to touch bases with you before about her eating situation, and hasn't bothered to send food with her to take that burden off of you. So you did the only thing you knew how to do to get adequate nutrition into this child while she was in your care, which was, treat this young girl the same way you would treat your own daughter. So while I'd be bothered with the methods, I couldn't get too bent out of shape about it because I'd feel like I hadn't done my job by putting forth the effort to adequately communicate with you on how to deal with and how not to deal with her eating issues.

That's just me though. I definetly think that you should talk to the mom. And if she is _that_ picky, I wouldn't expect you to keep food in the house specifically for her, I'd be compelled to send her foods with her when she visited. And I say that as a mom of a sensory pickey eater.

Just my $.02


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## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.

It is not your place to make someone else's child do this. I'm not at all surprised it didn't go over well. And guests can have different rules than family.

I remember being younger than her being babysat at my mom's friend's house. She insisted I eat semolina pudding (yes, I was forced to eat dessert) even though I told her I didn't like it. I dislike it so much, that as soon as it went down, everything came back up again, all over. And to add insult to injury, she sent me to bed for the afternoon. A freaking neighbour did this.

That was over 30 years ago, and my blood still boils to think about it, and I still won't touch semolina.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

I think there are four distinct issues here.

1. Do "house rules" include trying food? Personally, I don't think so. The reason is that it's not good hospitality/etiquette to force things on people. You can say that adults would know it's polite to try things but... I have met many adults who don't, and I would never badger them to eat. The host's role is not to broaden the palates of the guests, just to offer refreshment.

2. Will the lack of consistency about trying a bite impact on your daughter? Well I think if you present it to her as #1, good hosts don't force food on people, it's actually an opportunity for her to learn a new life lesson, and it won't weaken the first.

3. As for the visiting child's manners, I do think it would be fine to talk to her about not making it unpleasant for you. In an upbeat way I'd say "hey, it's fine not to eat, but we don't make comments about it - it makes the meal unpleasant." I speak from experience - I have a nephew who is not just picky, but whose mouth absolutely runs away with him. He doesn't like "sink water" (water from the tap), and once we ordered him his own special cheese-only pizza and he wiped the sauce off because it wasn't the right kind while telling us we didn't order it right. He's 8 too and he just is That Kid Without The Social Filters. He is working on it, but it will be more of a struggle for him I think. So I do mention it, but nicely - information for him about me, more than anything.

4. I guess myself I wouldn't worry about stocking special food for her. I might ask her mother if she would mind sending a snack along 'just in case," and I certainly would offer something like toast. But I wouldn't short-order cook, no, unless it were a sleepover or an extended period of time.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

I would fix dinner for your family. It's her choice to eat or not eat. If she's hungry before bed time, she can have a bowl of cereal for a snack.

Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about it. Her parents aren't that concerned, or they wouldn't allow her to stay for dinner (knowing that she won't eat it)

Kids need to be exposed to new food choices, and eventually they learn that they actually DO like it. Many parents just assume she won't like anything but her usual, and they don't give many new choices.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ThreeBeans* 
Oh, i should add, if I found out someone FORCED my child to eat something he didn't want, not only would that parent be getting an earful from me, I would be making sure to let everyone else in the community know about it...

You would go door to door telling everybody that the new neighbor made your daughter take one bite of corn?????

Seriously?

FORCED to eat food, would be to say "You can't leave the table until you eat this". That's hardly what the OP did.


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## Maggie05 (Jun 20, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nextcommercial* 
You would go door to door telling everybody that the new neighbor made your daughter take one bite of corn?????

Seriously?

FORCED to eat food, would be to say "You can't leave the table until you eat this". That's hardly what the OP did.

I was wondering the same thing. That reaction seems a bit extreme.


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## dubfam (Nov 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
I'm also the mother of a child who has sensory issues when it comes to eating. He's extraordinarily picky. I was also picky when I was young.

My mom tried to graciously handle visits by allowing me to take food with me.

Personally, I can't imagine this 8 year old's mom not knowing her child is a picky eater.

And I think it is rude that the mother, IF she is aware of her child's picky eating, has not taken the initiative to come up with some sort of arrangement to help you out preterm, like allowing her to bring over something microwavable or something non-cook that she likes so you won't have to deal with it. I would not dream of sending my extra-picky eater to visit some one and not sending food along with him knowing how he is; I'd be doing it out of consideration to the person who's looking after him, because otherwise I KNOW that person would have a hard time with him, and I'd also be doing it out of making sure that the child is adequately nourished in my absence and not forced to eat something he don't want to (he'll throw it up if you make him) and would not have to go through the drama of having some one force food on him to get him to eat or sit there hungry while the person would be at a loss as to what to feed him.

Also, where I stand on the issue with making her eat a little bit of everything on the plate. I'm not comfortable with that.

BUT. If I was her mom, I couldn't sit and be mad about it because, it sounds like to me this mom never bothered to touch bases with you before about her eating situation, and hasn't bothered to send food with her to take that burden off of you. So you did the only thing you knew how to do to get adequate nutrition into this child while she was in your care, which was, treat this young girl the same way you would treat your own daughter. So while I'd be bothered with the methods, I couldn't get too bent out of shape about it because I'd feel like I hadn't done my job by putting forth the effort to adequately communicate with you on how to deal with and how not to deal with her eating issues.

That's just me though. I definetly think that you should talk to the mom. And if she is _that_ picky, I wouldn't expect you to keep food in the house specifically for her, I'd be compelled to send her foods with her when she visited. And I say that as a mom of a sensory pickey eater.

Just my $.02

I couldn't agree more.

I think that the friends Mother is the one who made the mistake here. My son is also a very selective eater, and I ALWAYS make a plan for when he will be with someone else during mealtime. I send along alternative foods or try to feed him ahead of time. The other Mom has more responsibility in this scenario, IMO.

.


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## Kirsten (Mar 19, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
It is a matter of manners and house rules. It is a matter of respect. I understand that y'all have different rules and may not agree with my rules, but when at someone else's house it is polite to follow their rules (as long as they are reasonable, naturally).

I'm trying to figure out how it is okay for her to follow different rules than my daughter. Maybe it is okay, but it doesn't feel like it to me.

I respectfully disagree! It isn't about manners, house rules or respect. Well, it is about manners and respect - but I think you are in the wrong, not the child. She is a picky eater. Some kids (and adults) are. Would you make a left-handed child write with her right because your child does? No, because writing left-handed isn't rude. Neither is not preferring whatever certain foods. It isn't an insult to you; she is just a picky eater.

House rules are shoes off in the house or no jumping on the couch. I think it is perfectly reasonable to hold guests to these (reasonable) rules. I don't think it is polite to make a child (or adult) eat a bite of anything they don't like - and I don't find it a reasonable rule. If my child came home saying you made them eat something, I'd be calling you to see that you wouldn't do that again before sending my child again.

I was made to eat a brussel sprout (one) by my aunt. I threw up. I was in high school. I have never tried one again. I do however eat a lot of foods that I wouldn't as a kid - but not brussel sprouts! You are making backwards progress by forcing a child to eat something they don't like IMO.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
So you did the only thing you knew how to do to get adequate nutrition into this child while she was in your care.

If the girl didn't get a bite of vegie at this particular dinner, her health would be negatively impacted? A piece of toast with butter, apple slices, cold cereal even would do. Just something to keep her stomach from growling at night. I wouldn't make another meal, and I'd try to just have her eat more of whatever you're serving that did appeal to her - but if all else failed, a bowl of cereal is pretty easy to pull off.

Our ped always says to look at what kids eat at least a week at a time. What they eat - or don't - at any one meal is insignificant. Over the course of a week, did they get some fruits, some vegies, some protein, some carbs? Try to make them as healthy as possible, and call it good.

Dd1 has a friend who is a very picky eater. When they are here and hungry for a snack, I'll say "we have apples, grapes, yogurt, pretzels - what do you want?" If you give a decent number of basic options, they'll likely pick something. Once she (dd's friend) said she was thirsty. I offered her OJ, cran-grape juice, milk or water. That was what we had. She claimed she didn't like any of the options, so I got her a cup of water and walked away. Dd was having cran-grape. Friend is eyeing it. I asked if she'd tried it before. No, but she was sure she didn't like it. I poured a quarter glass for her and left it on the counter. Went to fold laundry. An HOUR later, she asks for more. She had four glasses before I cut her off, thinking she'd get a gut ache from all that juice. When her mom picked her up, she asked me to write down what type of juice we had so her mom could get some. Her mom was FLOORED that she tried it and liked it. I think it was because I didn't care one way or the other. I didn't make her; I didn't watch over her.

I also tell my kids - and other people's kids - that they can try a bite of anything they aren't sure about, and spit it discreetly into a napkin if they don't like it. No big production with "YUCK! OMG!" etc. I have gotten more kids to eat more things they don't think they'll like by giving them an out - a way to try it but not be forced to eat it if they hate it. Because I remember being a picky eater, and how stressful it was to go to another house for dinner, not knowing what I'd do if I didn't want to eat something - I always tell child guests "You don't have to eat anything you don't like. It won't hurt my feelings at all." Rarely do kids not eat what I serve. But when they do, I honestly don't care a bit. It is no reflection on my cooking or their manners; it is simply personal preference for certain foods and not others.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evan&Anna's_Mom* 
I think that 8 is also old enough to begin to learn the reasons for that. As I see it, the basic rule of hospitality to is make the other person as comfortable as possible, and to make them feel welcome and cherished. Thus, you are being a good host when you don't make a scene about what guest (child or adult) has or hasn't eaten. And in the reverse, you are being a good guest when you are open to new things and try something your host has prepared, even if you aren't sure you will like it. And unless you have eaten the food in question prepared by that person before, you never know if you will like it or not. And *that* is why you can have a different standard for a guest than for your own child *and* why your child needs to learn to be a good guest and try new things (or at least gracefully look like they are trying). Its a complicated peice of social nicety, but a good one for your child to learn. Of course, this leaves unsaid the fact that child guest hasn't learned this lesson. But you can certainly think it!

This is an excellent point, thank you.


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## ChristaN (Feb 14, 2003)

I haven't read the whole thread, but are this child's parents aware of how picky she is in terms of food? My dd has a friend who is much like this in terms of food. When she was younger, she'd put food in her mouth and then spit it out. Now, she just tells me that she doesn't like virtually everything or licks it and then won't eat it. It drives dh crazy b/c he hates to see food wasted and when someone licks food and then won't eat it, it is basically ruined and no one else will eat it either.

We just have the child's parents send over her own food whenever she is going to be here for a meal. I have some items she will eat, but if my bread or crackers are the wrong brand and are just going to get licked and left on the plate, she can bring over something of her own to eat IMHO.


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## gabysmom617 (Nov 26, 2005)

Quote:


If the girl didn't get a bite of vegie at this particular dinner, her health would be negatively impacted? A piece of toast with butter, apple slices, cold cereal even would do. Just something to keep her stomach from growling at night. I wouldn't make another meal, and I'd try to just have her eat more of whatever you're serving that did appeal to her - but if all else failed, a bowl of cereal is pretty easy to pull off.

Yeah, your quote was taken out of context with what I was trying to say.

I was saying that I wouldn't automatically expect the OP to know how to deal with a picky eater. Heck, *I'M* just starting to learn how to deal with one, and I"m his mother. The OP said that it was a last minute situation that the child was in her care for a period, and she felt it important to get some food into the child.

Now, we can all sit here and say, "no, it's not that important, she'll eat when she's ready". and "No, it's not important to get a bit of everything on the plate into the child, just give her a little something to hold her over until whenever".

But as the mother of the child who is a picky eater, I wouldn't expect those things to be obvious common knowledge to the OP. She doesn't have to deal with a picky child on a very regular every single day basis. How was she supposed to know exactly the right thing to do at the time? She just did what she thought best.

Now she's learned a bit probably about how else to deal with a picky child, but at the time she did the best she could, with absolutely no instructions or input from the child's mom, is all I'm saying.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

Because I remember being a picky eater, and how stressful it was to go to another house for dinner, not knowing what I'd do if I didn't want to eat something - I always tell child guests "You don't have to eat anything you don't like. It won't hurt my feelings at all."
This is really good perspective for me too. I was raised with the 3 bites rule (3 bites of every dish or you don't leave the table) and it didn't damage me in the least, I'm weight-height proportionate, have a healthy relationship with food, and adore my parents. However I also have a pretty easygoing personality. I can imagine it would be different for someone with a different personality.

As I said earlier, the girl doesn't seem to be stressed by this much because she still asks to come over all the time, but I think I will "bend the rules" as y'all are suggesting just to avoid the friction at mealtimes and make sure she feels comfortable. I will also talk to her mom for suggestions and give her (the daughter, not the mom, LOL) some polite ways to say she doesn't want to eat something!


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## ~Megan~ (Nov 7, 2002)

Just make what you are making and she can eat it or not.

Or, don't invite her to dinner.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
You make a good point, though. It is not my job to make her eat. The more I read this thread the more I realize that to me this is really more an issue of respect. So maybe working with her about how to express her preferences.









:

I would have no qualms about someone telling my child that what they had just said was rude and it hurt their feelings when they did that. I would have issues if they made my child eat something of everything at the table.

I have a husband and a son with sensory issues and we absolutely do not insist on kids even trying things. It can lead to real food aversions.

If my kids don't like broccoli and it's the veggie served, then the next time they'll eat the carrots or whatever else it is and I don't sweat it. My kids need a balanced DIET overall, NOT a balanced meal at every single meal.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nextcommercial* 
You would go door to door telling everybody that the new neighbor made your daughter take one bite of corn?????

Seriously?

FORCED to eat food, would be to say "You can't leave the table until you eat this". That's hardly what the OP did.

No, that's not what I said, is it?

If someone said to me, do you know so and so? I would say, "yes, I know her. She forcefed my kid."

Seriously, what the OP is so disrespectful that I would want to make sure that no one else unknowingly sent their poor kid into that situation


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## olliepop (Jun 26, 2007)

Quote:

I insisted that she eat a little of everything we were having (that is the rule in our house I don't think it is fair to dd if her friend gets a different set of rules, not to mention she did need to have some food in her tummy before going to bed!) and it really didn't go over very well.
What do you mean by "it really didn't go over very well." What was her reaction? Did she cry? Was she visibly upset?

If I were in your shoes, I would probably offer her a small plate of what we're having and if she wanted no parts of it, find out what her default meal is (PB&J/mac & cheese) and have it on hand.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

In reading through and thinking about picky eaters, it's also occurred to me that perhaps the mom doesn't know she's like this. Perhaps she isn't at home. I had a friend as a child whose house smelled odd to me. Her parents were much, much older, and it smelled like "old people." As an adult, I have no idea what the smell really was, but I couldn't eat there. Something about it made my stomach turn, but I wasn't like that in general. Perhaps there's something else going on besides just a picky kid.


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## StephandOwen (Jun 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
And just to be clear, I'm not expecting the child to eat an entire plate of something she doesn't like!

Even one bite is too much! If I found out another person was forcing my ds to eat something I would be LIVID and would probably seriously reconsider letting him go over there. I know that would suck for your dd, because it sounds like she likes this girl, but there you go.

Owen has a lot of issues around food so this is a close one for me. Even foods he does like, he won't eat anywhere other than his familiar places. He'll eat at our house, my car (







), DP's parents house, my mom's house, my dad's house, his cot at daycare and his stroller. Other than that, he rarely eats at other people's houses. At daycare (he's been there for 7 months) he still won't eat lunch there (either the lunch they prepare or a lunch I bring for him). He will eat the lunch I bring for him if I offer it to him at naptime on his cot (he has to see me taking it out of the bag we packed in the morning). If I offer it to him at lunch time at the table he rejects it.

I would suggest you talk to the parents and either A) make sure you have something she will eat in the house or B) ask the parents to send over her meal when she plans on staying for dinner.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ThreeBeans* 
No, that's not what I said, is it?











Yes. It kindof is. You said you would make sure the community knew that the new neighbor forced your child to eat.

When the OP only said she told the girl "We try a little bit of everything". That isn't the same thing as "You WILL eat this".

In actuality, if the child was even remotely polite and either kept her mouth closed, or said "no thank you" this mom probably wouldn't even have an issue. But, the child says "What are you making?" "Ewww... I don't like that".

I was very picky too, and I didn't eat a lot. But, I would have never even DREAMED of saying "What are you making?" or "I don't like that" to a parent. Especially at the age of 8. An eight year old has enough social skills to know this is not o.k.

I also think spreading gossip that would potentially destroy this kid's chances of making new friends is overkill, immature, and would most likely backfire.


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## grniys (Aug 22, 2006)

If she won't eat what you made then she obviously isn't that hungry. I wouldn't fix something else for my kids, so I wouldn't for her, either. I would not offer her cereal, pb&j or other things. If she won't eat, she won't eat. I wouldn't treat her special because she's picky.


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## 2cutiekitties (Dec 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *baltic_ballet* 
You are not a short order cook; if she dosn't like what your serving then she can miss out. I wouldn't be making a seperate meal just for her I don't have the time or energy.









:


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## aprildawn (Apr 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
If she won't eat what you made then she obviously isn't that hungry. I wouldn't fix something else for my kids, so I wouldn't for her, either. I would not offer her cereal, pb&j or other things. If she won't eat, she won't eat. I wouldn't treat her special because she's picky.

I think offering a child something they don't like or nothing at all is extreme. How hard is it to make a bowl of cereal? The kid was rude. She needs some manners, but forcing her to eat something she doesn't like or go hungry isn't teaching her anything. It only will serve to frustrate her.

Eat this or eat nothing is mean, IMO. I don't buy the idea that "she must not really be hungry" either. I don't eat pork. If someone offered me a pork chop and potatoes covered in pork gravy I'd decline the food whether I was hungry or not. I just don't eat it. I don't like it. I've never liked pork. Even as a kid it grossed me out, but my mom would force me to eat a certain amount of it and I'd gag all the way through it.

Not taking a child's food preferences, no matter how picky, into consideration isn't very gentle, IMO.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nextcommercial* 
When the OP only said she told the girl "We try a little bit of everything". That isn't the same thing as "You WILL eat this".


Actually, the OP said

Quote:

I insisted that she eat a little of everything
"Insisting" isn't telling the child what your house rules are. "Insisting" implies a demand - at least it does to me, and I would think that it does to most people who took issue with what the OP did.

OP, thank you for reconsidering how to deal with this, and taking the criticism of other posters on this thread well.


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## Phoenix~Mama (Dec 24, 2007)

Or the kid may not be a picky eater and just rude or moody. *shrugs*

Honestly the OP didn't force the child to eat.







She said we at least try things in this house... and I honeslty don't see anything wrong with that.

We have DSD try things too... A lot of times she just likes to say she doesn't like things, just to say it I think, or to try to control the situation in some way. She eats chicken all the time... but sometimes when we make it and she asks what's for dinner and we tell her, she says, " I don't like that"... um, yes you do, you eat it all the time, try it... she tries it... "I like this!"

Now I know it's a little different between a 4 y/o and an 8 y/o... but my neice is 8 y/o and she can be the same way...

Best course would be to talk to the girl's Mom and get her take on it... maybe she will be upset with her daughter for being a brat.


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## ceilydhmama (Mar 31, 2003)

I would simply have a quick chat with the girl's parents, "Jr seems to go hungry every time she's over for dinner and I was wondering how you wanted me to manage it. Our house rule is 'try everything' but if it is better I can do x,y or z. Just let me know...."


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## sacredmama (Dec 27, 2007)

Have you talked to the parent(s) yet? I'm curious to know what they say. I have a very picky eater. When he is going over someone else's house I always send snacks and let the caregiver(s) know that he may not eat what they are having and he can eat this if he wants. I wouldn't expect them to go out of their way to make something different for my child.

Because I have a picky eater, when I have other kids at my house I always ask what everyone wants before I cook.


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## grniys (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aprildawn* 
I think offering a child something they don't like or nothing at all is extreme. How hard is it to make a bowl of cereal? The kid was rude. She needs some manners, but forcing her to eat something she doesn't like or go hungry isn't teaching her anything. It only will serve to frustrate her.

Eat this or eat nothing is mean, IMO. I don't buy the idea that "she must not really be hungry" either. I don't eat pork. If someone offered me a pork chop and potatoes covered in pork gravy I'd decline the food whether I was hungry or not. I just don't eat it. I don't like it. I've never liked pork. Even as a kid it grossed me out, but my mom would force me to eat a certain amount of it and I'd gag all the way through it.

Not taking a child's food preferences, no matter how picky, into consideration isn't very gentle, IMO.


If it were one or two things here or there, ok. But I wouldn't let my kids have cereal for dinner instead of dinner. It's not a food allergy. It's being picky. If the mom wants to send snacks and such so the kid can eat that instead, fine. I wouldn't demand the child eat, but I also wouldn't set an example that would make my kids think they can eat something else instead of dinner because so and so does. It's not forcing the kid to eat. It's giving them an option. And I know most people don't agree with me. That's their choice. But in my house if the kid doesn't want to eat what I've served then that's fine but don't expect me to offer something different.


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## katt (Nov 29, 2001)

I would offer food to the guest the same as for my kid(s).
This is dinner, I'm not making anything special for 1 person. I'll do my best to have at least 1 thing they'll like and will eat. But, if they don't want to eat, i'm not going to force them.


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## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
It's not a food allergy. It's being picky.

In my dd's case, it WAS a food allergy (gluten). It just manifested itself in extremely picky eating. Don't discount it.


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## Thalia the Muse (Jun 22, 2006)

Here's a few possibilities:

Don't have her for meals
Let her not eat the meal if she doesn't like what you have -- surely there'll be something like bread an butter if she really wants it. And if she's not staying overnight, she can always eat when she gets home.
This is going to sound crazy, but my daughter's one ultra-picky friend's parents will send food for her that they know she'll eat, so we just heat that up. Would I want someone to do that for my kid? No! But she's a great kid and we like her parents and that's how they've decided to handle it.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

I haven't been able to talk to the mom yet, but I will before the little girl comes over for a meal again. She will be with her father for the next few days though, so it may not be 'til next week. I will tell the mom what happened and apologize (I think that is appropriate) but I honestly don't think she will consider it a big deal. From what I've seen they are much less AP than we are and probably have more "traditional" (I don't know what to call it?) expectations of the kids.

For those of you who were wondering what actually happened, yes, I did insist that she have some vegetable although I gave her a choice of veggies. Earlier times I did not do this, I just let her eat what she wanted, but those were times I knew she was going home and her mother could attend to her nutrition if she felt it necessary. This time the little girl was staying the night and somehow that made it different to me.

She wasn't crying or upset, just way more stubborn than I anticipated because, as I said, I have never met a kid like her. Her mom was coming over to drop off her overnight bag so I basically said we would let her mom decide the issue. Before her mom came, though, she took a little bite and we called it good.

In retrospect, and in response to the kind responses on this thread, I've decided that I was wrong to insist that she eat a veggie. The whole hospitality thing makes sense to me. At the time I was looking at it from the perspective of feeling responsible for her, that I will probably have this kid at my house often over the summer, almost like she is one of the family and so I have the responsibility/right to see to it that she is well fed. I know many people on this board don't agree with that but it is how I feel about my daughter. But now I see that I should not go there unless I have talked to the mother first.

And yes, as I have reflected on the incident, I realize that I am also put out by the rude way she deals with dinner. I like her and want her to play with my dd but I sort of inwardly groan when I know I have to feed her. Honestly if she didn't ask and then say she doesn't like it every.single.time even after I gently told her it hurts my feelings, I may not have done that. I don't know. It's not an excuse because she is a kid and I am (supposed to be) the responsible adult. In the future I will simply focus on the rude behavior and forget about any power struggle over food.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nextcommercial* 
Yes. It kindof is. You said you would make sure the community knew that the new neighbor forced your child to eat.

When the OP only said she told the girl "We try a little bit of everything". That isn't the same thing as "You WILL eat this".

In actuality, if the child was even remotely polite and either kept her mouth closed, or said "no thank you" this mom probably wouldn't even have an issue. But, the child says "What are you making?" "Ewww... I don't like that".

I was very picky too, and I didn't eat a lot. But, I would have never even DREAMED of saying "What are you making?" or "I don't like that" to a parent. Especially at the age of 8. An eight year old has enough social skills to know this is not o.k.

I also think spreading gossip that would potentially destroy this kid's chances of making new friends is overkill, immature, and would most likely backfire.

Thank you, nextcommercial. Honestly I think it is reactions like 3Beans that give AP a bad name. I can understand a mom being appalled that I insisted her kid eat something they didn't want to, because different families do things differently and I shouldn't have assumed that right (I wouldn't be appalled if my friend insisted my dd eat something but that is our family culture). However I don't understand instantly demonizing a mom that did what you don't like. Basically assuming that the mom is evil, will never change her ways, and other children need to be kept away from her clutches.

I would hope that if something like this happens, the aggrieved mom would tell the other mom how much they disagree. If that mom were me, I would apologize and promise to never insist the child eat again. I would keep that promise. And, as my response to the kind posts on this thread have shown, I might even learn something.









A "one strike you're out" mentality like 3Beans only serves to make people feel defensive and more entrenched in their opinions. It turns people off to AP rather than turns them on. And honestly I don't think it sets a good example of gentle conflict resolution for kids.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
li

And yes, as I have reflected on the incident, I realize that I am also put out by the rude way she deals with dinner. I like her and want her to play with my dd but I sort of inwardly groan when I know I have to feed her. Honestly if she didn't ask and then say she doesn't like it every.single.time even after I gently told her it hurts my feelings, I may not have done that. I don't know. It's not an excuse because she is a kid and I am (supposed to be) the responsible adult. In the future I will simply focus on the rude behavior and forget about any power struggle over food.


Yes, this









You do not have to tolerate being treated in a rude and hurtful manner.

If she doesn't like what you are serving and expresses it in a rude way, simply say, "I don't like it when you're rude to me. It hurts my feelings. If you can't use your manners you won't be allowed here for dinner."

This doesn't mean she must eat what you've offered her, just that she has to be respectful and considerate in declining it. I.e. she can't say, "Ew, that's gross!" but she can say, "No, thank you."


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Thao - I think its great that you have explored what happened and decided to modify your approach. Not everyone who starts threads like this is so gracious or so open. I think you've just demonstrated how this board is "supposed" to work.

And I think you absolutely have the right to say to the child that the rudeness is a problem. Gently and respectfully, of course. But "Its OK if you don't like it but please just say "no thank you" is really good information for a child to have. Whether or not she eats really doesn't impact you, but how she treats you *does* and thus you should coach a more acceptable response.

In general...

I suspect that how each of us intrepretted "insisted on trying" has a lot to do with our own style and that of our parents. My parent's idea of "insisting" I try something was truly horrid (literally involving force, beatings and/or being tied to the chair until I ate whatever). So naturally my picture was probably very different than someone who's parents "insisted" by say "Eat your peas or no dessert".

In general I think host parents need to tread very lightly on the line of disiplining other's children. I think verbalizing things is fine, but anything involving their body is over the line. And getting into a power struggle with any child other than my own isn't appropriate -- if it gets to that point its time to send the child home for everyone's sake!


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## roxyrox (Sep 11, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Thank you, nextcommercial. Honestly I think it is reactions like 3Beans that give AP a bad name. I can understand a mom being appalled that I insisted her kid eat something they didn't want to, because different families do things differently and I shouldn't have assumed that right (I wouldn't be appalled if my friend insisted my dd eat something but that is our family culture). However I don't understand instantly demonizing a mom that did what you don't like. Basically assuming that the mom is evil, will never change her ways, and other children need to be kept away from her clutches.

I would hope that if something like this happens, the aggrieved mom would tell the other mom how much they disagree. If that mom were me, I would apologize and promise to never insist the child eat again. I would keep that promise. And, as my response to the kind posts on this thread have shown, I might even learn something.









A "one strike you're out" mentality like 3Beans only serves to make people feel defensive and more entrenched in their opinions. It turns people off to AP rather than turns them on. And honestly I don't think it sets a good example of gentle conflict resolution for kids.









My ds is a really fussy eater - I really dont mind my friend telling him (and her dd) "you try everything on your plate before I clear it.". That is the rules in her house. "Trying" a food only involves a lick btw







He actually eats/trys a lot more there than he does at home. Likewise at nursery he eats things he doesn't at home because all the other children are. I would talk to the Mom - if she doesn't mind you telling her that, it could be beneficial to the child in the long run!

I am really not into power struggles with meals - like "you can't leave the table until you have eaten x" and at home we don't actually have any rules. It is just lately I have noticed my ds eats a lot better in the company of other children and moms who are "stricter" than me. Honestly, lately I can see the benefits. I really want my ds to try a wide range of foods and at home, he doesn't because he knows he can have fruit/crackers or something if he doesn't eat dinner.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

I got hung up on the whole to eat or not to eat thing.

as for the rudeness . . .i would address that in short order.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Thank you, nextcommercial. Honestly I think it is reactions like 3Beans that give AP a bad name.

Did you just SERIOUSLY say that? Seriously?


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

My parent's idea of "insisting" I try something was truly horrid (literally involving force, beatings and/or being tied to the chair until I ate whatever).








: I'm so sorry.

Yeah, I know that people come at stuff from their own experiences. I was approaching the whole thing from MY experience of having to have 3 bites before we left the table (yes, we HAD to stay at the table until we had 3 bites) and it not being a problem. My brothers and I just ate the 3 bites of whatever it was we didn't like and went on with our lives. I came away from that with a very easygoing attitude about food and have the idea that I should try everything once to see if I like it or not. Of course, it's a chicken-or-egg thing; I don't know if I am easygoing because my parents forced me to try all foods, or if I was able to handle being forced to try all foods because I am naturally easygoing. As with most things in life, it's probably a combination of nature and nurture. I was probably born with an easygoing personality but it was reinforced in terms of food by my parents making it clear that our food preferences were second priority to certain other things.

So I appreciate you realizing that I wasn't beating my child's friend! I will also try to keep in mind that not all children are like I was and for some forcing them to eat something they don't like would be a terrible violation.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

I am really not into power struggles with meals - like "you can't leave the table until you have eaten x" and at home we don't actually have any rules. It is just lately I have noticed my ds eats a lot better in the company of other children and moms who are "stricter" than me. Honestly, lately I can see the benefits. I really want my ds to try a wide range of foods and at home, he doesn't because he knows he can have fruit/crackers or something if he doesn't eat dinner.
Yeah, that's a tough call. I think being open to a wide variety of foods is a value worth teaching, but that's just a personal opinon. And I'm sure it's not possible for some people. My dh is the picky type. He has a really sensitive nose and just can't stand certain smells. He was forced to eat foods he didn't like as a child and while he doesn't have any particular bad feelings about it towards his parents he also definitely is NOT an adventurous eater, so it didn't help him be more open to foods.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 







: I'm so sorry.

Yeah, I know that people come at stuff from their own experiences. I was approaching the whole thing from MY experience of having to have 3 bites before we left the table (yes, we HAD to stay at the table until we had 3 bites) and it not being a problem. My brothers and I just ate the 3 bites of whatever it was we didn't like and went on with our lives. I came away from that with a very easygoing attitude about food and have the idea that I should try everything once to see if I like it or not. Of course, it's a chicken-or-egg thing; I don't know if I am easygoing because my parents forced me to try all foods, or if I was able to handle being forced to try all foods because I am naturally easygoing. As with most things in life, it's probably a combination of nature and nurture. I was probably born with an easygoing personality but it was reinforced in terms of food by my parents making it clear that our food preferences were second priority to certain other things.

So I appreciate you realizing that I wasn't beating my child's friend! I will also try to keep in mind that not all children are like I was and for some forcing them to eat something they don't like would be a terrible violation.

Of course I realized that this wasn't what you were suggesting or doing! But, what if that was what the little girl was experiencing at home? It doesn't sound like it, but you never know... I would love to think that no child today will experience what I did as a child. But I also know that there are families out there that have a really lousy way of disciplining, so I am always doubly careful about how I approach child guests. There are three boys who frequently live with their grandparents down the street from us. When they are there, they mostly spend the day at our house. The first time one of them heard me get stern (I doubt I was even yelling), he went and hid in the closet. I found him sobbing that he didn't want me to hit him. I was floored. Later I realized that he has all sorts of scars on his back, so he must have been badly beaten at some points! I an now doubly-careful around them to not frighten them and to demonstrate that there are other ways.

Three bites to an easy-going child probably wasn't too bad. But my guess is that you were an easy going child to start with, not that the three bites rules made you that way. People have really different approaches to food and kids, as this thread has demonstrated. And kids have vastly different reactions to food, as you have discovered. My kids are great about trying just about anything, which I would *like* to think is due to my very laid back approach to family meals. But the reality is probably a combo of my approach, my kid's temperament, the fact that we all enjoy cooking and eating, and maybe the fact that I've never served liver (to this day I can't even be in the room with it without a total psychological meltdown). Who knows!? As you say, probably some long complex combination of stuff, all the way down to how many taste buds each of us has.


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## sacredmama (Dec 27, 2007)

I am pretty laid back about my picky DS trying foods these days. I tried being stern about what he ate, but it became this huge power struggle and one time he even puked.







He's just as stubborn as I am.







I remember not trying new foods and there was nothing anybody could do until I decided for myself that I might be missing out on some things in life. The more I dig in, the more DS does, and it's not pretty. He just eats what he knows and someday he'll try new things when he's ready. It does bother me because when we go to people's houses I have to make sure I have food with me, it's not a pretty sight if he doesn't eat. And it's kinda embarrassing.









The one thing that has gotten him to try veggies is growing a garden. He'll eat anything that we grew!! Today he actually ate spinach for the first time!


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## bwylde (Feb 19, 2004)

I babysat a girl like that last summer and I just asked what she did like. I'm used to making a variety of food since I have two picky eaters, but this girl was way beyond that and what some would consider rude about it (she critisized my housekeeping and constantly complained she was bored; I was SOOOO glad when I was done babysitting her







). I just tried to find some common ground before preparing a meal so I wasn't make too many different things (besides, leftovers are good







)


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## MCR (Nov 20, 2001)

I'd ask her parents, does she have any allergies or sensory issues which would stop her from eating any regular foods you prepare. Then if you know nothing is wrong, I plonk a plate of what we are having in front of her, I usually try to have one food that the fussy child will eat, even if it's only dinner rolls. If she eats she eats, if not she can wait till the next meal or snack. She won't starve to death.
Ds has a friend who won't eat anything without a side of mustard







He has been here when all I had was Gray Poupon, he won't touch that, he picked at dinner and ate a bit, but he survived, and it didn't harm the friendship. He's been back since. His mom hates that he's so picky, but she buys into it and lets her three boys all be picky, so each night she is a short order cook. I refuse to go there.


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## Sopho (Jun 12, 2008)

If you don't want to make something for her, tell her to bring her own food, that's what we do for the kids that come over, as we're vegetarians and we're not cooking anything special for their non-vegetarians friends.

My dad would have said "No" to the hamburger and the fried chicken of course.


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## falconry-fan (May 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCR* 
I'd ask her parents, does she have any allergies or sensory issues which would stop her from eating any regular foods you prepare. Then if you know nothing is wrong, I plonk a plate of what we are having in front of her, I usually try to have one food that the fussy child will eat, even if it's only dinner rolls. If she eats she eats, if not she can wait till the next meal or snack. She won't starve to death.
Ds has a friend who won't eat anything without a side of mustard







He has been here when all I had was Gray Poupon, he won't touch that, he picked at dinner and ate a bit, but he survived, and it didn't harm the friendship. He's been back since. His mom hates that he's so picky, but she buys into it and lets her three boys all be picky, so each night she is a short order cook. I refuse to go there.

She lets him be picky? How do you know that?

Is it because he will occasionally try other foods in your home? That's pretty common for kids to at least try an unfamilar food in a home other than their own, peer pressure partly playing a part.

I wouldn't presume she was allowing him to be picky, considering the stories I've read from so many mamas here about their picky eaters and how their kids would really rather starve than eat certain foods, their parents have tried various means to get them to eat with little result so I think it's rather judgemental and unfair to accuse her of letting her kids be picky eaters.

Back to the OP for a moment. I'd have no problem with you politely telling my child that he/she is being rude, criticising your food, I agree that is rude and unacceptable.

However I would be furious if you insisted my child try a bit of everything on their plate, asking is fine, insisting is most certainly not.

I'd just stick with having one or two 'safe' foods and making sure she has some of those on her plate and not worry too much about her going hungry, she'll make up for it the next day.

I'm not a picky eater but there are some foods I couldn't and wouldn't possibly try if they were on my plate, even if my host thought I was being rude, not that I'd comment on it, just push it to one side.
Coleslaw being one of those, not even an incentive of money could make me put a forkful of it to my lips.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
It's not a food allergy. It's being picky.











A lot of people have sensory issues that manifest themselves in the form of "pickiness."


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCR* 
lets her three boys all be picky, so each night she is a short order cook. I refuse to go there.











Heaven forbid that AP parenting include taking your children's wishes seriously.

My picky eater literally throws up anything he seriously doesn't like ........including chives and any carbonated drinks.

As long as I am blessed/fortunate enough to have a wide variety of food in the house, my children (and their friends) will be given choices as to what to eat.


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## gabysmom617 (Nov 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 









A lot of people have sensory issues that manifest themselves in the form of "pickiness."









:


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## dubfam (Nov 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 









Heaven forbid that AP parenting include taking your children's wishes seriously.

My picky eater literally throws up anything he seriously doesn't like ........including chives and any carbonated drinks.

As long as I am blessed/fortunate enough to have a wide variety of food in the house, my children (and their friends) will be given choices as to what to eat.

























.


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## grniys (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 









A lot of people have sensory issues that manifest themselves in the form of "pickiness."

Fine, but it's not the OP's job to get the kid in to see a dr. Until there's a diagnosis I'm going off the assumption that the kid is picky. Not every child that is picky has another issue, such as an allergy or sensory issue. And I wouldn't bend over backwards due to an unfounded assumption.


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## gabysmom617 (Nov 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
*Fine, but it's not the OP's job to get the kid in to see a dr*. Until there's a diagnosis I'm going off the assumption that the kid is picky. Not every child that is picky has another issue, such as an allergy or sensory issue. And I wouldn't bend over backwards due to an unfounded assumption.

I sort of agree with that too, at least with the bolded part. I think it's the child's mother's responsibility to deal with her food issues, tell the OP how she wants them dealt with, and send over food if it's necessary with the child.

I get a feeling from the OP's comments that the child's mother seems oblivious to her child's eating issues, or is ignoring them, or doesn't care? I think it is the child's mother who is not taking this child's eating issues seriously enough.

Or, maybe the child doesn't do this in her own house. (Somehow I doubt that, though.) and is unaware of the problems the OP is having with the child. In which case, as the OP said she plans to do, the mother needs to be informed and requested to deal with it, or asked how she wants it dealt with when the child is visiting.

FTR, my child has sensory issues with eating and he hasn't seen a doctor yet. (We're going to though.) It's obvious how he reacts with food or something foreign in his mouth.

I don't think it's fair for the default assumption for a child with eating issues be that it's just a naughty-picky-eating habit. All other possibilities of issues involving problems eating should be explored and researched by a parent before coming to that conclusion. But as you say, that's not the OP's job, it should be the child's mother's job to look into that.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
Fine, but it's not the OP's job to get the kid in to see a dr. Until there's a diagnosis I'm going off the assumption that the kid is picky. Not every child that is picky has another issue, such as an allergy or sensory issue. And I wouldn't bend over backwards due to an unfounded assumption.

Semantics. I call it being polite to offer your guest a variety of food choices. You call it "bending over backward." Whatever.

So what if the kid is picky. Most of us (being Americans or Canadians or whatever) have an abundance in our lives; why not share that with guests?

If it were a situation of "I truly don't have another thing in this house to offer you" then I would explain that.

If not, then I see it as the host being "picky" about what to serve.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grniys* 
Fine, but it's not the OP's job to get the kid in to see a dr. Until there's a diagnosis I'm going off the assumption that the kid is picky. Not every child that is picky has another issue, such as an allergy or sensory issue. And I wouldn't bend over backwards due to an unfounded assumption.

Well some current research shows that pickiness may be genetic in origin - in other words, those kids are "wired" that way. Forcing variety on those kids can just result in bigger issues down the road. For me, the problem really only starts if junk food becomes the go-to meal for those kids. As long as what they do eat is relatively healthy and they are getting nutrients - hey. There is no magic in "not being picky."

My wild theory about pickiness is that it's a survival adaptation - it probably helps to have people in the tribe who will try new additions to the diet, but also good to have a "picky component" that won't all fall ill when the new food turns out to have bad consequences.


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

Funny how a doctor's diagnosis makes things legitimate.


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## onlyzombiecat (Aug 15, 2004)

1. I would speak to the child's mother about what foods her dd will eat and what their rules are. I think she should be in on the discussion of solutions. Maybe she will send food or have another idea to make things better.

2. I would speak to the child about saying "no thank you" in your house if she doesn't want/like something. That is reasonable. If she refuses a food politely then let it go.

3. I would stop worrying about if she is eating a food from all the groups that are important to you when she is at your house. It isn't your job to make and enforce food rules for another child who is there to play. If she'll only eat potatoes or carrots then fine. Her stomach won't be empty.

4. If she is going to be there pretty often I would keep on hand a few foods that you know she likes but wouldn't buy or serve food everyone else in your house dislikes or you don't know how to prepare just to accommodate this child. If her preferences disagree so much then maybe she shouldn't be there at a meal time.

I have an 8 year old picky eater. She eats differently at other people's homes- sometimes more, sometimes less. Sometimes she is rude in the way that she refuses things. We work on both issues at home but she slips up. I wouldn't mind her being reminded to use good manners but I would mind her being pressured to eat something if she doesn't want to. I would appreciate being communicated with if there is an issue.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

It's irrelevant whether or not the child has a medical problem. The only relative issue is how a host should treat a guest.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

GuildJenn - I love that theory!









I must say I am surprised at how many people are saying that food is such an issue for them. It just isn't for me at all. I can - and have - eaten just about anything (and I mean truly disgusting stuff like duck blood pudding, a Vietnamese delicacy!) So many people are saying that we would never force an adult guest to eat a dish, which is true, but in my world I would absolutely expect the adult guest to try a dish I served to be polite. It is what I do. If I don't like it, no biggie, I take a bite or two and that's that.

So obviously we are coming from very different cultural assumptions about food and what is necessary to be polite. And we're all Americans. In other cultures, Vietnamese for example, your hosts will place in your bowl any dish that they see you are not eating and this is considered polite of them. Of course then you have to eat it or you are impolite.

Most of us override our children's preferences to some extent when we teach about manners, or hygeine, or a whole host of issues. We just draw our lines in different places. For example, when it comes to the area of respecting a child's physical integrity, I don't have a problem requiring a child to eat certain foods (assuming they don't have a physical issue). However I would never require a child to hug or kiss someone they didn't want to, to me physical contact goes over the line. My dh disagrees with me on this, he draws the line someplace else. He is not evil, he comes from a different culture. So I think that boiling it down to a simple, black and white statement like "you are not respecting the child's preferences!" doesn't do justice to the complexity of the issue.

As for whether children are being picky or have physical issues when they refuse food, well the answer obviously is both. Depends on the kid. Grniys has gotten responses chastizing her for assuming a kid is picky - but it seems the default assumption on this thread is that any kid who is picky must have a physical issue, so isn't that doing the same thing?. Some kids really are just picky and would benefit from the "eat what I serve or go hungry" approach. Others have physical issues and that would absolutely not be appropriate. It's complicated. At least to me it is.









ETA: these are just musings about food and social mores in general, not intended to relate to my situation with my dd's friend. I'm talking about how people deal with their own children, not children who are guests in their home.


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## gabysmom617 (Nov 26, 2005)

On this paragraph:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
are being picky or have physical issues when they refuse food, well the answer obviously is both. Depends on the kid. Grniys has gotten responses chastizing her for assuming a kid is picky - *but it seems the default assumption on this thread is that any kid who is picky must have a physical issue, so isn't that doing the same thing?*. Some kids really are just picky and would benefit from the "eat what I serve or go hungry" approach. Others have physical issues and that would absolutely not be appropriate. It's complicated. At least to me it is.









Yeah, I agree that it is complicated.

On the bolded part, I'm not sure how I feel about if it's the same or not, and if I am, it's difficult for me to articulate right now......But for the most part, I don't think it's the same to assume a child has "issues" when it comes to food as it is to assume a child is just picky...

LIke you say, it's complicated. I personally think it's more respectful of a child's body to listen to his cues on food issues than it is to ignore them, figure it's just picky eating, and treat it as such. Sometimes children have a hard time expressing themselves when it comes to their eating aversions, and all we can go off of is their behavior, their cues, and the little hints they tell us..I think many people here are more apt to considering therer are other problems at play than simple stubborness when it comes to picky eating because this board caters moreso to the rights of the child, listening to a child's cues, attachment parenting, and so forth.

In my opinion, to assume a simple (no other problems) picky eating child has some sort of sensory or allergic issues and treating them as such and ending up being wrong is the lesser evil when compared to assuming a child who manifests eating issues is just picky, treating them as such, and ending up being wrong about that.

Issues of respectfully declining aside, I think that the consequenses of forcing/insisting a child who has true sensory issues or allergic reactions to foods are worse than allowing a truely "simply" picky eating child a bit more leeway as to what he or she will eat... So many people who are "just" picky eaters and are allowed to be, eventually grow up a bit, learn they are missing out, and simply start trying more stuff. Whereas a sensory/allergic/other child who is forced to eat may be scarred for life by the ordeal.

Anyhow, those are my jumbled garbled musings, anyway.


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## NaomiMcC (Mar 22, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I don't really think the comparison to adults works because quite frankly if an adult came to my house at dinner, asked what we were having, and then announced that they didn't like it (and I mean almost.every.time) I simply wouldn't have that adult over to my house any more







.









:

Quote:

If the rule at our house was that the kids go to bed at 9:00 and a friend came over and expected to stay up until midnight, I would say the same thing: these are the rules in our house, my daughter is expected to follow them and I expect you to follow them while in our house. I teach my daughter to do the same when she is at a friend's house. It is a matter of respect. I understand that y'all have different rules and may not agree with my rules, but when at someone else's house it is polite to follow their rules (as long as they are reasonable, naturally).








: And I expect the same thing when our son goes over to his friend's houses. Their house, their rules. You follow 'em.

Quote:

And just to be clear, I'm not expecting the child to eat an entire plate of something she doesn't like! Our general rule is that we all eat at least a little bit from the major food groups, which we define as protein, carbs, and veggies. If my daughter doesn't like broccoli I don't mind her substituting seaweed, for example. But if there isn't any seaweed then she has to eat a small amount of broccoli if that's what we have.








: (again LOL!) And the same goes if our son goes over to a friend's house for dinner. If he doesn't like it - tough. Zip your lip about it and just try a little bit of everything. It's not going to kill you. (no...he doesn't have any allergies...so really, it won't kill him....)

Quote:

If this child is going to be over often (and it looks like it will, she hasn't been put off at all by the food issue and still wants to come over all the time, LOL) I'm trying to figure out how it is okay for her to follow different rules than my daughter. Maybe it is okay, but it doesn't feel like it to me.
I agree. I don't think you should have to make her something separate at all. You're not a restaurant. And if she still doesn't like it...go home for dinner and come back later.


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## Astoria (May 27, 2004)

Rules of a house are boundaries for behavior and I think you can ask the child to not insult your cooking. Saying something like, "please don't say you don't like the food or its yucky, just say 'no thankyou.'" is appropriate.

However, rules of a house do not involve forcing children to put things in their mouths that they don't want to. I don't think it should in anyone's house, but it is certainly an inappropriate way to relate to someone else's child. That's a confrontational and upsetting situation that should not be put on a kid whose parents are absent.

Many nutritionists think exposure to foods with a relaxed and non-stressful environment is the best way to encourage picky eaters to expand. If the child eats over repeatedly, she may decide to try new foods. It may take more than 15 times of seeing your family eat a particular food before she tries it, and she may never try it, but she might. That will not happen if you stress or pressure her or make her feel singled out. A child at a house where the food being served is distasteful to her is uncomfortable, and you should respond with empathy. You don't have to cook something else for her! But you can offer a piece of fruit or crackers if she's still hungry after the meal. Above all it sounds like you need to just ask the child's mother for guidance. Struggling with a picky eater is a real parenting issue just like any other confusing or stressful parenting issue. Ask her how to handle her daughter's pickiness at your house. Ask her to remind her daughter not to insult your food, and what to offer if she won't eat dinner. You could have a positive influence on her exposure to a wide range of foods if you are a trusted and nurturing adult influence and not bullying her to put things in her mouth she doesn't want to.


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## Viola (Feb 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
We are new to this area and I am thrilled that dd has this friend. She's a sweet girl and the family is lovely. But honestly I have never met a child as stubborn (or as rude) as this one is when it comes to food. When she is over at dinner time, she will ask what we are having and then inform me that she doesn't like whatever it is. And I am not talking about woo-woo crunchy organic stuff either, I'm just talking about regular stuff like hamburgers, corn on the cob, fried chicken, mushrooms, you name it. It's like "I don't like it" is her default setting. When I ask her if she's ever had it before, she'll say no but she doesn't like it.

This is in danger of becoming a rant, but I have to say I feel your pain. My 9 year old has a 9 year old friend and she ends up being over here for meals often, and I get the "I don't like that" accompanied by this tone that triggers me big time. I smile and say OK, you don't have to eat it if you don't like it, there is fruit, there is string cheese, there peanut butter or I can take you home right now. I cannot tell you how absolutely frustrated I am with the whole meal situation, and the conflicting things I read from the AP front. No, you can't tell children that if they are hungry enough they will eat it, but god forbid you feed your children the crap they will eat. It's not AP NOT to feed your kids healthfully, but somehow if you've done the whole AP thing right, they will only want healthful foods. I wish I never had to cook for kids again!

And honestly, I don't want my child going over to someone's house and telling the host that she hates the food and wants something else. I would not do that, and when my daughter did that at one friend's house, I left with my children. If I couldn't stand the food, I wouldn't eat, and would eat later when I got home. This is what my husband does, frequently, because he is such a picky eater. I think by 8 or 9 they are old enough to understand that they are not guaranteed delicious food every time they want to eat some.

Part of the problem, at least for me, is my children have foods they will eat, they will tell me they are hungry, I will have planned something for dinner that I know they like and I like, and then I get the "I'm not in the mood for that." Then, "I'm hungry, but I don't want that." And when I mention 3 or 4 options instead that they can have an fix themselves, I get No, No, No, No. OK, we're done. But I'm hungryyyyyyyyyy! No, I really don't believe that.


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

This is as far as I've gotten so far...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
If the rule at our house was that the kids go to bed at 9:00 and a friend came over and expected to stay up until midnight, I would say the same thing: these are the rules in our house, my daughter is expected to follow them and I expect you to follow them while in our house.

You haven't had a lot of sleep-overs, have you?


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mtiger* 
This is as far as I've gotten so far...

You haven't had a lot of sleep-overs, have you?

Love the assumptions! :LOL

Sure I have. If it's a weekend night, I pretty much let the kids stay up as late as they like. If it's a school night, it's bedtime by 9:30. I haven't had any problems with the kids settling down and going to sleep, but if they did refuse to settle down (giggling, playing and whatnot) I would probably park myself in their room with a book to enforce the rule. I'd consider it an abdication of my parental duties to send a neighbor's kid to school the next day with inadequate sleep. But that's just me.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:

In my opinion, to assume a simple (no other problems) picky eating child has some sort of sensory or allergic issues and treating them as such and ending up being wrong is the lesser evil when compared to assuming a child who manifests eating issues is just picky, treating them as such, and ending up being wrong about that.
This is a really good point. I'm thinking about it...


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Love the assumptions! :LOL

Sure I have. If it's a weekend night, I pretty much let the kids stay up as late as they like. If it's a school night, it's bedtime by 9:30. I haven't had any problems with the kids settling down and going to sleep, but if they did refuse to settle down (giggling, playing and whatnot) I would probably park myself in their room with a book to enforce the rule. I'd consider it an abdication of my parental duties to send a neighbor's kid to school the next day with inadequate sleep. But that's just me.









Okay - so your rule is NOT 9pm bedtime, period. It's 9:30 school nights, whenever weekends. Sorry for making assumptions based on what you posted. (edit - sorry - I missed the IF your rule was 9pm.)

However, personally speaking, I don't know a single parent who allows sleepovers on a school night.


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## oceanbaby (Nov 19, 2001)

I'm coming in on page 5 and haven't read most of the responses, so this might already have been discussed.

For me, there are rules of the house, and then there are rules of the body. Rules of the house include stuff like when the lights go off, if you can jump on the couch or not, no swearing, or whatever floats your boat.

But rules of the body stay with the person, and that includes what they choose to eat. I don't surrender the right to control my own body when I walk into someone else's house. I would never expect a child or adult to eat something at my house if they didn't want to, not even a single bite. If having this girl over is a problem, just call the mom and say "Hey, I notice that your dd doesn't like most of our food, so to make sure she doesn't go hungry, would you mind sending some of her favorite food over with her." I don't see why it's that big of a deal.

I am not a picky eater - I like almost everything. But the things I don't like I really don't like, and I am not going to try even one bite. Sometimes I really don't want something that I normally do like - my stomach is feeling sensitive, or whatever. If that hurts someone's feelings, then that's too bad, but it's my body, and I will get physically ill if I eat something that my body is telling me not to. I've never understood why people get offended if someone doesn't like a particular food. I don't care how great a cook you are, I am not eating anything with goat cheese. Why is that offensive?

I would be horrified if I found out that the parents of one of ds's friends forced him to try a bite of something he didn't want. In fact, this is one of his main fears about spending the night at someone else's house - that he won't like the food they are serving. I've always told him that he can simply say "no thank you," that he never has to eat anything he doesn't want to.

Honestly, I think you're making way too big a deal out of it. If she doesn't want what you're serving, then she doesn't eat. She won't starve to death without dinner one night. Let her help herself to whatever is in the fridge or cupboard. I'm sure she can find some crackers or an apple or whatever. And if not, well, no biggie. She can eat a big breakfast when she gets home.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oceanbaby* 
For me, there are rules of the house, and then there are rules of the body. Rules of the house include stuff like when the lights go off, if you can jump on the couch or not, no swearing, or whatever floats your boat.

But rules of the body stay with the person, and that includes what they choose to eat. I don't surrender the right to control my own body when I walk into someone else's house.

I like this division. To ME (acknowledging that food is a big hot button for me due to past abuse), *having* to put something into my mouth because of coercion feels similar to having someone touch me against my wishes. Of course it would be grossly inappropriate for me to force my fingers into a guest's mouth -- it would be just as inappropriate to force food there.

For a guest, it doesn't matter why they won't eat something (allergy, sensory, "just picky"). They deserve the body autonomy to decide. Equally obviously, you may decide that for your own children in your own home you have different rules. You may decide that its appropriate to stick your fingers in their mouths (for example, when brushing teeth for a reluctant brusher). You may decide that requiring a child to eat something in particular is appropriate. But you can't do that for a guest.

It doesn't matter why a child, or adult, is picky, unless that child is yours and you decide that its important. I have worked out a system for feeding my family and rules for meals that I am 110% comfortable with. While I love my approach and think its pretty wonderful and that everyone should have a similar approach (as I think most of us do), I also fully understand that different people have different approaches, different rules, and different comfort levels with these issues. As my children grow to an age that they are encounter other's approaches without my guidance, I can only hope they have already learned enough manners to not be insulting to their hosts. And that the hosts respect their body integrity enough to let it go at that.


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## worldmama (Jun 15, 2008)

I'd ask her mom what she likes.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GuildJenn* 

My wild theory about pickiness is that it's a survival adaptation - it probably helps to have people in the tribe who will try new additions to the diet, but also good to have a "picky component" that won't all fall ill when the new food turns out to have bad consequences.

Great theory!


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Viola* 
and the conflicting things I read from the AP front. No, you can't tell children that if they are hungry enough they will eat it, but god forbid you feed your children the crap they will eat.


It's a fallacy to believe that "picky" always means "crap." (Certainly not for my ds.) Generally it just means a more limited variety of (good) food than what other people would prefer.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *StephandOwen* 
Even one bite is too much! If I found out another person was forcing my ds to eat something I would be LIVID and would probably seriously reconsider letting him go over there. I know that would suck for your dd, because it sounds like she likes this girl, but there you go.

.









:


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
It's a fallacy to believe that "picky" always means "crap." (Certainly not for my ds.) Generally it just means a more limited variety of (good) food than what other people would prefer.

I think that often, although not always, parents of picky eaters seem to end up finding something fast and easy that their kid will *always* eat. And more times than not - that ends up being crap food. Like the kids who live on chicken nuggets and tater tots.

My BIL will only eat 'crap' salad. That mean iceberg lettuce with some other veggies he can pick out. Iceberg lettuce is the only kind of 'veggie' he will eat. (sometimes he'll eat baby carrots). Once his mom found that he'd eat that - she bought copious quantities of it.

My cousin was VERY picky. So she ate a HUGE amount of the same frozen fish sticks. She had them for supper maybe 4 nights a week.

One of my good friends growing up little sister was really picky. She ate plain pasta with butter on it as her ONLY food probably 80% of her lunches and supper. I would say that was crap. But her mom would cook up big post and freeze it in baggies - and then those could be microwaved in a few minutes after she decided she didn't like the fresh food.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kessed* 
I think that often, although not always, parents of picky eaters seem to end up finding something fast and easy that their kid will *always* eat. And more times than not - that ends up being crap food. Like the kids who live on chicken nuggets and tater tots.

.

Yeah, for some people. But there are other versions of picky, too. My ds, for example, has vegetarian tendencies and hates most meat. That's "picky," since I can't always feed him what we're having for dinner, but he'll eat almost all vegetables and fruits.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
Yeah, for some people. But there are other versions of picky, too. My ds, for example, has vegetarian tendencies and hates most meat. That's "picky," since I can't always feed him what we're having for dinner, but he'll eat almost all vegetables and fruits.

And many parents will respond to that by buying a bunch of veggie hotdogs and feeding their kid nothing but those.

And even the good veggie dogs are still full of 'junk' stuff - that's part of why they taste good.

You may work hard to make sure that your DS gets good nutritious balanced food, even though what he eats differs from what you do. But many parents will just buy frozen quick foods to 'substitute' into their normal meal plans for picky or restricted eaters.

I mean - mushroom burgers are tasty once in a while - but they don't fill the same dietary needs as a meat patty. Rice milk doesn't actually substitute for cow milk.


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kessed* 
My BIL will only eat 'crap' salad. That mean iceberg lettuce with some other veggies he can pick out. Iceberg lettuce is the only kind of 'veggie' he will eat. (sometimes he'll eat baby carrots). Once his mom found that he'd eat that - she bought copious quantities of it.

Or *maybe* BIL grew up at the same time I did. When iceberg lettuce was the ONLY sort of lettuce you could get at any price AND a very inexpensive veg to get. It's easy to call it "crap" when you have lots of other choices. 10-15-20 years ago? It was that or nothing. So it's what a lot of people grew up with and are used to. No need to judge them for it.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mtiger* 
Or *maybe* BIL grew up at the same time I did. When iceberg lettuce was the ONLY sort of lettuce you could get at any price AND a very inexpensive veg to get. It's easy to call it "crap" when you have lots of other choices. 10-15-20 years ago? It was that or nothing. So it's what a lot of people grew up with and are used to. No need to judge them for it.

Or maybe he ate iceberg lettuce while the rest of his family ate things like asperigus and other veggies.

And regardless of price - iceberg lettuce has virtually no nutritional value. It is water and cellulose. I happen to like it - but that doesn't make it not "crap"...


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

I'm not entirely sure why you're determined to make every picky eater a "crap" eater.

I'll give more specific examples. My ds likes hard-boiled eggs, but he doesn't really like them scrambled. That's picky. But eggs are still healthy (for most people.)

He wouldn't eat much chicken, but now he's decided he'll eat it if he can have pesto to dip it in. (And I certainly didn't force trying pesto--I just offered it to him one day while offering him chicken.)

So, every time we eat chicken, he has his pesto to dip it in. That's picky, but chicken and pesto is certainly a healthy meal!

He likes toast (wheat bread--we never have white bread in the house), but his toast has to be _very lightly_ toasted. If it gets toasted too much, he won't eat it. So that's picky, but he's eating wheat bread.

I'm the same way. I eat healthy foods, but perhaps a more limited variety (or in a more limited way) than other people. Steak has to be extremely well-done for me, for example. My chicken has to basically be overcooked. My dh considers that picky.

So, my long, drawn-out point is that people can be healthy eaters and still be picky. So, I dispute the notion that there is a necessarily a conflict between catering to your child's food interests and feeding them good, healthy foods.

For those of you who have children who don't like vegetables, you may want to try a garden. Children can get involved in planting, weeding, and watering those vegetables, and they take a more personal interest in what those foods may taste like. For example, you haven't _*really*_ tried peas until you've tried a fresh organic one straight out of your own garden. YUM!!


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## MCR (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *falconry-fan* 
She lets him be picky? How do you know that?

Is it because he will occasionally try other foods in your home? That's pretty common for kids to at least try an unfamilar food in a home other than their own, peer pressure partly playing a part.

I wouldn't presume she was allowing him to be picky, considering the stories I've read from so many mamas here about their picky eaters and how their kids would really rather starve than eat certain foods, their parents have tried various means to get them to eat with little result so I think it's rather judgemental and unfair to accuse her of letting her kids be picky eaters.

Back to the OP for a moment. I'd have no problem with you politely telling my child that he/she is being rude, criticising your food, I agree that is rude and unacceptable.

However I would be furious if you insisted my child try a bit of everything on their plate, asking is fine, insisting is most certainly not.

I'd just stick with having one or two 'safe' foods and making sure she has some of those on her plate and not worry too much about her going hungry, she'll make up for it the next day.

I'm not a picky eater but there are some foods I couldn't and wouldn't possibly try if they were on my plate, even if my host thought I was being rude, not that I'd comment on it, just push it to one side.
Coleslaw being one of those, not even an incentive of money could make me put a forkful of it to my lips.

She lets them be picky are her words, it makes her crazy, but she feels guilty and doesn't do anything about it, they do not practice AP they are very mainstream parents. With the youngest boy she watched him start to copy the older boys and went along with it, I've seen her encourage it by saying no to foods they "don't like" and substitute a food they do.
Middle son (same age as my Ds#2) went to science camp and ate everything offered after being told, sorry we don't serve junk, it was an organic/vegetarian cook.
If children aren't encouraged to eat and try other things they'll never do it, and she never gives them the opportunity to try at home.
My oldest is picky to the point of never eating veg but they are there and if he wants to try he can, I don't cater my meals to his choices if he eats he eats, if he doesn't then he waits for me to cook the next meal, he isn't starving and is healthy. he also has other sensory issues, but even a sensory issue kid doesn't need to dictate meals. I make sure there is one item I know they like, other than that, they eat what I cook or wait till the next meal.

Oh and you couldn't pay me to eat Cole Slaw either, so there are things I like/dislike too, but I try to keep it varied.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

I'm surprised how long this thread has gone on. People are really passionate about food!

There does seem to be a resistance on the part of many that some kids (I said *some*, okay?) are picky just because they can be.

I'm a firm believer that the truth usually lies in the middle rather than on either extreme. Just as it would be wrong to assume that *every* picky eater is doing it from sheer stubborness, I think the default assumption that picky eaters are *always* motivated by physical issues is also wrong.

Can we agree on that?









Gabysmom is right that if the kid is not our own, i.e. we do not know the child intimately, then more harm could be caused by assuming the child is "just being picky" than could be caused by assuming the child has physical issues.

But as far as I am concerned, I would tend to trust parent's judgements (on the assumption they know their child better than anyone else) as to what is motivating their child's pickiness and how it should be dealt with.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
Some kids really are just picky and would benefit from the "eat what I serve or go hungry" approach.

Perhaps this is true, but it wasn't your initial point. You told the child she *had* to try everything, and that is the opposite of an "eat or go hungry" philosophy. That's a "you will eat whether you like it or want it" approach. I don't have a problem with not fixing something else for the child, though I have done it for my nephews in the past. My children are much younger, so we don't have the issues with friends yet. When other kids are over, I generally try hard to see what it is they do like and then make plans around it.

One of the things I've gotten from this post is that I will be more aggressive in telling my children that they can refuse what another adult tells them to do and ask to call home immediately. I've seen quite a few instances that have enforced that idea with me, and this is one of them. If anyone ever told my children they had to eat anything, I'd prefer the kids call me to pick them up rather than sit at the table in a battle of wills with an adult. I wouldn't allow my children back there, so I wouldn't have any worries about the consequences of such a decision. Of course, it's also now added to my list of questions to ask other parents before the kids visit.

As the mom of a food allergy kid, though, I realize this problem is bigger for parents of finicky eaters. I'm very clear that my son isn't to eat anything I haven't approved because of the allergies. In fact, I generally try to keep him away from the need to eat with other people because it's such an ordeal. It may be bigger for my daughter, though, because it's not something I would necessarily address beforehand about her - ie, that I'm not supportive of telling her she's required to eat anything.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Thao* 
I'm surprised how long this thread has gone on. People are really passionate about food!

There does seem to be a resistance on the part of many that some kids (I said *some*, okay?) are picky just because they can be.

I'm a firm believer that the truth usually lies in the middle rather than on either extreme. Just as it would be wrong to assume that *every* picky eater is doing it from sheer stubborness, I think the default assumption that picky eaters are *always* motivated by physical issues is also wrong.

Can we agree on that?









Gabysmom is right that if the kid is not our own, i.e. we do not know the child intimately, then more harm could be caused by assuming the child is "just being picky" than could be caused by assuming the child has physical issues.

But as far as I am concerned, I would tend to trust parent's judgements (on the assumption they know their child better than anyone else) as to what is motivating their child's pickiness and how it should be dealt with.

The thing is, I think you (and some other posters) are putting a value judgement on "being picky" with regards to food. Think of it this way - if a child were sleeping at your home and you gave them a wool blanket to sleep with, would you be upset or offended or call the child "picky" if they said "wool is scratchy, I can't sleep with that" ? Would you even consider insisting that they ue the blanket? I doubt it. I suspect you would either say "I'm so sorry - That's all we have. Maybe I can call your mom and ask her to bring your blanket from home." Or "No problem! I'll get you a different blanket!" Why are these values connected to food preference? I don't get it.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eclipse* 
The thing is, I think you (and some other posters) are putting a value judgement on "being picky" with regards to food. Think of it this way - if a child were sleeping at your home and you gave them a wool blanket to sleep with, would you be upset or offended or call the child "picky" if they said "wool is scratchy, I can't sleep with that" ? Would you even consider insisting that they ue the blanket? I doubt it. I suspect you would either say "I'm so sorry - That's all we have. Maybe I can call your mom and ask her to bring your blanket from home." Or "No problem! I'll get you a different blanket!" Why are these values connected to food preference? I don't get it.

The reason why it is an issue is because food usually has to be prepared, which involves time and effort on the part of the host or parent. There aren't always quickie foods on hand that don't require preparation, at least not healthy ones. There are also issues of politeness that have been mentioned upthread. It's not really comparable to just fetching a different blanket.


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## Thao (Nov 26, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BrandiRhoades* 
Perhaps this is true, but it wasn't your initial point. You told the child she *had* to try everything, and that is the opposite of an "eat or go hungry" philosophy. .

Okay, I should have said the "try a little of everything" approach. To be sure you understand, if you've read the entire thread you will see that I've decided I was wrong about that and have moved on to more philosophical musings since. The comment you quoted is in response to a different issue, the issue the assumptions on this thread. I do tell my child she *has* to try a little of everything. I shouldn't have done that to someone else's child, because I don't know the child or the family well enough, but I know my daughter and am comfortable in our approach to food. I'd hate to feel that I was being judged for that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BrandiRhoades* 
One of the things I've gotten from this post is that I will be more aggressive in telling my children that they can refuse what another adult tells them to do and ask to call home immediately. I've seen quite a few instances that have enforced that idea with me, and this is one of them. If anyone ever told my children they had to eat anything, I'd prefer the kids call me to pick them up rather than sit at the table in a battle of wills with an adult. I wouldn't allow my children back there, so I wouldn't have any worries about the consequences of such a decision. Of course, it's also now added to my list of questions to ask other parents before the kids visit.

I agree, if this is an important issue for you then you absolutely should let the other parent know! If it ever happens, though, I'd hope that before you'd decided to not allow your children back to the house that you'd talk to the parent. If they are unapologetic then you shouldn't let them go back since the parent obviously won't respect your family's choices. But, as I've also said upthread, If that parent were me I'd apologize and respect your wishes in the future. I don't understand the mentality that a parent who does this is so irredeemably evil that they must be shunned rather than engaged. I can assure you that I am not evil







. Just as you are, I am coming at the issue from my own set of experiences and priorities, which I have also talked about upthread. I made a decision at the time, recognized it didn't work well, sought advice and learned some new things. That learning would never take place if you simply decided I was evil and shut me out.


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## EXOLAX (May 22, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 









Heaven forbid that AP parenting include taking your children's wishes seriously.

My picky eater literally throws up anything he seriously doesn't like ........including chives and any carbonated drinks.

As long as I am blessed/fortunate enough to have a wide variety of food in the house, my children (and their friends) will be given choices as to what to eat.

I think in each instance we need to define what 'picky eater' means. My picky eater gags, and would throw up if she continued to eat certain things(fwiw, so do I), both of us obviously have sensory issues with food (texture surely, sense too- potaoe chips send her into dry heaves). If my picky eater threw up every time she tried something she serisouly didn't like we'd probably have her in the hospital on an IV, thankfully our issues aren't as severe as that.

We do cater to her and meals pretty much cycle through foods we know she will eat. But, not only are the reasons for pickiness different, be it a control issue (a strong possibilty in many cases), sensory issues, allergies, etc., the foods they will eat vary from child to child. My picky eater loves tofu (but only from a specific restaurant), soba noodle soup, shrimp, pasta/pasta/pasta, pizza, home-made steamed dumplings, almost anything sweet, broccoli with shredded cheddar cheese, homemade vegetable juice (apple/carrots/zuchini only). I get bored eating the same things over and over, so I cook off her list of edible foods and we always ask her to try new things. I wouldn't say we force her, she's 7 now and knows she might like something no matter how it looks. She tried fresh raw spinach yesterday and decided she liked it enough to eat it a small handsfull worth, happy day! We do offer her an alternative, one she can get herself. She won't eat peanut butter so most days she eats cheese and egg quesadillas.

But, our DD's issues have extended beyond texture/smell and also fall into the realm of expectation issues. When our DD was younger she was at a family members house who knew her issues, they ordered cheese pizza because they did not have any of her preffered foods on hand (how nice of them!) and when she was served it she promptly refused it because it was cut into squares and not triangles.

I think it needs to be noted that there are many different degrees of picky, many different reasons, and times when no matter how much food is in the house a line needs to be drawn based on all these things. We can offer choices, but sometimes it might just come down to 'you eat the square pizza, or you eat something from the fridge' even though we already know you don't want anything in there. I believe we can be AP, offer choices and include limits while teaching appreciation for what others have done for us.

The rudeness factor is something we specifically addressed with our own picky eater. She has an appreciation for the time/work/effort/money that goes into any meal.


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## jeca (Sep 21, 2002)

I guess I would be a rude host. I would not go out of my way to keep food she likes on hand just so she can eat. If she's that picky her parents know it and can send her with something or expect her not to eat. If you had a few things great but not stock up just for this child who refusing to try anything else.I guess I just wouldn't sweat it too much unless she is over a lot during meal times.


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## tuscaloosa37 (Jul 30, 2008)

I wouldn't want the other mom to send food over with her kid unless I knew that it would be something unexciting. If she sent for her kid brownies, chips, lunchable meal with candy, etc, then it wouldn't be fair to my kid. Just something to consider before you ask her to send food.

I would never force a child who was not my own to eat, with any degree of coercion, but I do insist my own child try things. He's laid back and a naturally easy going eater, so I realize how easy I have it (there's no actual force involved, of course). I honestly do believe most picky eaters are made, not born, and I see a lot of parents in my community who I think don't challenge their children enough with new foods, especially vegetables.


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## lindberg99 (Apr 23, 2003)

My 10 yo is picky. I don't worry about it when she goes to someone else's house for dinner. I figure she'll either eat what they have, make herself a PB & J, or not eat. Missing one meal isn't going to kill her, even if she is staying overnight.

This thread is pretty old so OP, what have you decided to do when the girl comes over for dinner?


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## Purple Cat (Jun 8, 2008)

I would just ignore it and try to give it as little attention as possible. Eating or not eating can become a huge control issue for children (and adults). Not eating can also become a major attention-getting device.

Personally, I would try to set aside expectations that she eats what you cook. I also would try to set aside judgments of her behavior as rude, etc. It's not directed at you personally. She's universally a picky eater and apparently has struggled with eating a variety fo foods for a long time. Why or how should she magically be ended of this once she eats at your house? I cannot imagine that feeling a pressure to eat helps.

I was EXTREMELY picky eater as a child. New foods scared me. I also received a tremendous amount of attention for NOT eating, which I think fueled my food refusal. Sensory issues can make children very picky eaters. Textures feel really uncomfortable. Preemies or children who have had feeding tubes can be very picky eaters or have food refusal issues. Some kids simply are phobic/fearful of new foods.

I would just try to include a few items she likes and offer her some of the regular food you serve.


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## Doodlebugsmom (Aug 1, 2002)

I wouldn't say my kids are picky, but we are vegetarian. I would hate for someone to try to force meat on them because that happened to be a rule of the house. They also have very sensitive stomachs. Dd has thrown up from _seeing_ me eat oatmeal. Ds threw up all over in a restaurant very recently because he _smelled_ some beet salad I had been eating. (Oh, what a wonderful experience that was!







)I can easily see them throwing up if they ate food with an unappealing taste or texture. So, I don't think forcing anyone to take a bite of anything is a good idea. At least not around my house.









I would suggest the little girl pack her own food to eat. I would do that for my kids if they were visiting a non-veg family for a meal. I would actually insist on doing it.

ETA: I didn't realize this thread was so old! I'd love to know if you've talked to the parents, and if they offered to bring food for their dd.


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