# I DREAD bed time



## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

He sleeps half his time in the night and half in the morning. I am exhausted. I feel so jealous when I am around other Moms & they just put their sleepy babe in the crib and they drift off to sleep and awake when they are ready. DS is totally opposite. For naps, he wakes up about 3 times and cannot put himself back to sleep. At night he will sleep for a few hours and then is awake and needs to be nursed back to sleep, then sleeps for roughly another hour or so and then he wants to be connected to me for the remainder of the night. I wouldn't mind him nursing at night but it kills my back and just recently, my hips have been hurting soooooooooo bad when I wake up.

I don't know what to do.

I've tried doing other things such as rocking/patting to get him to sleep. He cried for 15 minutes in my arms when I was trying alternative ways to get him to go back to sleep. He wont take a paci... Nothing works. I don't want to let him CIO but in the middle of the night I get so frustrated, I get so sad I just have to leave the room and gather myself to keep from going crazy and screaming. I'm fed up, I am tired and I am fixing to have to go back to school. I'll be taking 15 hours, I cannot do this when I am in school. Sleep time will be my study time, I need it for myself. What do I do? I am at a loss. People say "give him formula, it's the breastmilk." or "it's because he's too attached to you." or "just leave him alone to cry." I know none of that is true, and I do not feel comfortable letting him CIO but what else do I do? I cannot continue like this, it's taking a toll on me....

Please, any suggestions?


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## gaialice (Jan 4, 2005)

newmama8824, sleep has been one of the most difficult things for me with my kids... one thing that i wish I had tried when they were babies is this: http://www.awareparenting.com/comfort.htm
you mention that he cried for fifteen minutes in your arms ... who knows, he might need to cry to release stress.
I know many moms around here dislike CIA, I think it depends on the baby and it is easy to judge when you never had a baby who so strongly refuses sleep yet needs it so badly... Good luck to you, I hope things are better soon. Another thing you can try is see a chiropractor, and have him readjust your baby. or, you can drink some camomile tea in the evening, it will go in your breastmilk and hopefully calm baby a bit.
Just be reassured, it is not the breastmilk and he will not sleep any better with formula. Other kids sleep better, yes, but he is different. it is really not your fault.


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## MayBaby2007 (Feb 22, 2007)

Oh, my. I'm sorry mama.

This helped my babe when she was tiny and had trouble sleeping: If she wanted to be cuddled up with me, I took a shirt I had worn and let her cuddle it. She had the scent of mommy (and breastmilk







) all cuddled up to her and I could go do something else while she slept.

Do you co-sleep? Your siggy didn't say. If not, try that. I got a $20 air mattress and put it right on the floor. Being in mama's bed with the familiar scent might help. If the mattress is on floor, IF he falls out, he won't get hurt (you could even pad the floor around the bed).

Have you tried continuous music playing or white noise? My dd loves the fan we sleep with...really knocks her out.

Sorry, I have no other suggestions. Hopefully another mama will.


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MayBaby2007* 
Oh, my. I'm sorry mama.

This helped my babe when she was tiny and had trouble sleeping: If she wanted to be cuddled up with me, I took a shirt I had worn and let her cuddle it. She had the scent of mommy (and breastmilk







) all cuddled up to her and I could go do something else while she slept.

Do you co-sleep? Your siggy didn't say. If not, try that. I got a $20 air mattress and put it right on the floor. Being in mama's bed with the familiar scent might help. If the mattress is on floor, IF he falls out, he won't get hurt (you could even pad the floor around the bed).

Have you tried continuous music playing or white noise? My dd loves the fan we sleep with...really knocks her out.

Sorry, I have no other suggestions. Hopefully another mama will.









Yes, we do co-sleep and I've tried white noise, I've tried it all.... All I can think of anyways.

Thank you for your suggestions, both of you!


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## lisavark (Oct 27, 2007)

Do you swaddle him? I know he's kinda old for that but it's really helped with my four month old. She still wakes really often but at least she gets back to sleep faster.

Also, when you're side-lying nursing, do you put a pillow between your knees? Side nursing used to kill my hips until I started doing that, and that really helped. I also try really hard NOT to contort my body around the baby in order to get my boob in her mouth; she's more flexible than I am and it doesn't seem to bother her at all to twist her head up to get it.







I curl myself around her so *I'm* comfortable...that way my back doesn't hurt in the morning.

This goes totally against what everyone says about sleep







, but for me I've also found that DD sleeps better if I let her get tired first. I used to try to nurse her down (I've NEVER been able to "put her down" sleepy like some lucky mamas can!) as soon as she "showed signs of tiredness," but it would take her HOURS to fall asleep. I found that if I wait a while, even let her fuss a bit (not crying really, just kind of fussing) for a while before I take her to bed, then she falls asleep much faster and sleeps longer. All the sleep experts say not to do that, but it helps my baby.

I've also recently figured out that if she wakes up crying, that means she's not really done with her nap. If I go in right away and immediately stick my boob back in her mouth before she really wakes up and gets upset, then she'll go right back to sleep...otherwise she'll wake up but be grumpy and overtired and not be able to go back to sleep. I was already doing this at night but it's helping a lot now with daytime sleep. She used to only take 30 to 40 minute naps, but I figured out that was just her sleep cycle and she couldn't resettle herself; now I just keep nursing her back to sleep until she wakes up HAPPY and doesn't fall back asleep when I nurse her. Now she takes two hour naps (with just a five or ten minute nursing break in the middle).

I'm sending good sleep vibes your way...I feel your pain! My DD is getting better (well, sometimes) but I've hardly gotten any sleep stretches of longer than two hours since she was born. It's fine at first but after a while it does take a toll on you...I just keep telling myself that I'm paying my sleep dues now, so maybe my next baby will sleep ten straight hours at eight weeks!










One other thought...this would probably be a pain, but I've found that I can read a book while side-lying nursing, so maybe you could get some studying done while nursing if you absolutely have to? Not the best solution, I know. But better than not getting it done at all.

If you're going back to school, does that mean he takes or will be taking a bottle? Maybe someone else could take a nighttime shift and put him back to sleep with a bottle so you can get at least one longer stretch of rest?

Good luck to you...it's not the breastmilk or the attachment; it's just his personality!


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisavark* 
Do you swaddle him? I know he's kinda old for that but it's really helped with my four month old. She still wakes really often but at least she gets back to sleep faster.

Also, when you're side-lying nursing, do you put a pillow between your knees? Side nursing used to kill my hips until I started doing that, and that really helped. I also try really hard NOT to contort my body around the baby in order to get my boob in her mouth; she's more flexible than I am and it doesn't seem to bother her at all to twist her head up to get it.







I curl myself around her so *I'm* comfortable...that way my back doesn't hurt in the morning.

This goes totally against what everyone says about sleep







, but for me I've also found that DD sleeps better if I let her get tired first. I used to try to nurse her down (I've NEVER been able to "put her down" sleepy like some lucky mamas can!) as soon as she "showed signs of tiredness," but it would take her HOURS to fall asleep. I found that if I wait a while, even let her fuss a bit (not crying really, just kind of fussing) for a while before I take her to bed, then she falls asleep much faster and sleeps longer. All the sleep experts say not to do that, but it helps my baby.

I've also recently figured out that if she wakes up crying, that means she's not really done with her nap. If I go in right away and immediately stick my boob back in her mouth before she really wakes up and gets upset, then she'll go right back to sleep...otherwise she'll wake up but be grumpy and overtired and not be able to go back to sleep. I was already doing this at night but it's helping a lot now with daytime sleep. She used to only take 30 to 40 minute naps, but I figured out that was just her sleep cycle and she couldn't resettle herself; now I just keep nursing her back to sleep until she wakes up HAPPY and doesn't fall back asleep when I nurse her. Now she takes two hour naps (with just a five or ten minute nursing break in the middle).

I'm sending good sleep vibes your way...I feel your pain! My DD is getting better (well, sometimes) but I've hardly gotten any sleep stretches of longer than two hours since she was born. It's fine at first but after a while it does take a toll on you...I just keep telling myself that I'm paying my sleep dues now, so maybe my next baby will sleep ten straight hours at eight weeks!









One other thought...this would probably be a pain, but I've found that I can read a book while side-lying nursing, so maybe you could get some studying done while nursing if you absolutely have to? Not the best solution, I know. But better than not getting it done at all.

If you're going back to school, does that mean he takes or will be taking a bottle? Maybe someone else could take a nighttime shift and put him back to sleep with a bottle so you can get at least one longer stretch of rest?

Good luck to you...it's not the breastmilk or the attachment; it's just his personality!

Thank you. It's reassuring to know this IS normal & other babies are like this, too. My Grandma keeps saying, "What is wrong with him?!" like it's an issue that needs to be fixed & I think it makes it even more difficult.
& yes, I do swaddle him.


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## aschmied (Apr 22, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmama8824* 
Thank you. It's reassuring to know this IS normal & other babies are like this, too. My Grandma keeps saying, "What is wrong with him?!" like it's an issue that needs to be fixed & I think it makes it even more difficult.
& yes, I do swaddle him.

Oh geez. DD woke every hour or two until she was two, and still wakes several times a night often. Some kids just sleep better than others. Tell your grandma that the "problem" is that he's a curious baby who's loving learning about his world, so has trouble sleeping.


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## swiftwords (Jul 7, 2008)

My 3 month old just started sleeping for more than one or two hours at a time. He was also having problems napping. We found out he had reflux, which was keeping him awake. As soon as I laid him down, he would wake up because stomach acid was moving back up his esophagus. You might try googling reflux and seeing if your child shows any signs of it; if he does, you can have your doctor check it out. Now that we know he has reflux, we've elevated the head of his co-sleeper (you can do this to the family bed, too), and I hold him upright for about a half hour after nursing (we can't side nurse at all







). We also rarely lay him down flat on his back. Just those simple changes have made a big difference. He's been sleeping longer, and only getting up about twice to nurse in the night, and taking a lovely 2 hour nap each afternoon, as well as catnapping in the morning. Might be worth checking out.

Do you have anyone to help you? My son sleeps well on my husband's chest, so on the weekends he hangs out with Dad while I nap. Sometimes he'll sleep for 2-3 hours like that.


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## H & J's Mom (Jun 1, 2008)

After the first few weeks we noticed our son going to bed for his long streatch around the same time. We would start getting him ready for bed about an hour before that time. He'd have a nice quiet bath, the TV was turned off, no lights on, and then I'd nurse him while we rocked. He was still awake enough to nurse and once finished he was almost always asleep. If he wasn't asleep it was a matter of rocking him for a few moments. I kept the same blanket with us whenever we nursed and he slept with that as well.

When he woke at night I didn't talk or turn on lights (changed his butt in his room with the hall light on, just couldn't leave him in a wet diaper like everyone suggests) and I nursed him while we rocked the same as at bedtime. If he wasn't asleep when he was done (rare) then he went back to his bed awake. He almost always fell asleep cooing to himself shortly after. If he cried I would get him up again and rock him, no talking, TV, lights, etc. I always made sure he knew nighttime was quiet, sleeping time. I also always made sure he burped (hard when he was asleep), if he didn't burp he almost always woke up with gas or spit up and cranky.

We did the same with my daughter, she slept through the night at 2 months and my son slept through at about 6 months. Both were on breast milk only, no formula or solids and neither of them have ever cried it.

I think a big part of it is certainly the child's own tempermant. But I do think you can help them settle with a regular routine and a calm environment.

Sleep is sacred in my house. I just don't function well as a mother, wife, human without it. My husband doesn't sleep well at all and works 12hr shifts so any interuption ruins his night most times. I find my kids are also much happier after a good night's sleep or a good solid nap.

Funny though, I loved getting up at night with newborn babies, it was kinda the best part of having a newborn, that sleepy, need mommy, breastfeeding, special time .... I kinda miss it sometimes.

Sorry to babble, I hope you find something that works for your little individual


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## La Sombra (Sep 27, 2007)

I agree with H & J's Mama, above, that baby's temperament plays a big part. Which is kinda good news AND bad news, if ya think about it. It's a relief, I think, to realize that your baby sleeping badly isn't because of any failing on your part. Yet it's also tough, because there's not necessarily one magic thing you can do to change your baby's sleeping habits.

Yet I think it can be done. I am a student mamma, too, and my HEART GOES OUT TO YOU. I know it's not the most practical advice as far as addressing the heart of your issue, but remember that even though this seems impossible that it's just a passing phase and you WILL GET THROUGH IT.

Good luck!!


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmama8824* 
At night he will sleep for a few hours and then is awake and needs to be nursed back to sleep, then sleeps for roughly another hour or so and then he wants to be connected to me for the remainder of the night. I wouldn't mind him nursing at night but it kills my back and just recently, my hips have been hurting soooooooooo bad when I wake up.

When you say that you co-sleep, I assume you mean that you are sharing a bed? One of the "benefits" of bed-sharing is baby is, of course, much more aware of your presence, but that also means that mom and baby are both _much lighter sleepers_. In your case, I would definitely put the baby in a side car or crib next to the bed or even, if you really need the sleep, further away from you (in a separate room, if need be) to get him to sleep a little more deeply. He will still awaken at night (and yes, you will have to get out of bed to go get him







) but not every hour as he does now once his principal REM sleep has finished.


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
When you say that you co-sleep, I assume you mean that you are sharing a bed? One of the "benefits" of bed-sharing is baby is, of course, much more aware of your presence, but that also means that mom and baby are both _much lighter sleepers_. In your case, I would definitely put the baby in a side car or crib next to the bed or even, if you really need the sleep, further away from you (in a separate room, if need be) to get him to sleep a little more deeply. He will still awaken at night (and yes, you will have to get out of bed to go get him







) but not every hour as he does now once his principal REM sleep has finished.

Well, I've tried this. He has a crib next to my bed that he slept in for maybe.... one night. It was an hour of putting him in the crib, him waking up. So finally I just put him in my bed because it wasn't working. He wanted to pacify and he would wake up every time he was unlatched. He NEVER has unlacthed himself from my breast.


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newmama8824* 
Well, I've tried this. He has a crib next to my bed that he slept in for maybe.... one night. It was an hour of putting him in the crib, him waking up. So finally I just put him in my bed because it wasn't working. He wanted to pacify and he would wake up every time he was unlatched. He NEVER has unlacthed himself from my breast.

Your friends say it is breastmilk/formula issue. It's not that at all. It's the breast itself. Your breast is his pacifier. You have to decide whether you want that or not. If you don't, then you need to find him an alternative - he needs to suck and that need is going to continue. Will he take a pacifier (although this has its own problems)? Will he find his thumb? Can you get him used to another soft object?

If you prefer him to use your breast rather than another object as a pacifier, then I'm afraid there is not a simple resolution to your problem, apart from moving him in another room so that maybe he just senses your presence less (although it sounds like he needs to suck, and since your breast is his pacifier, maybe even that won't work...)

Good luck.


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
Your friends say it is breastmilk/formula issue. It's not that at all. It's the breast itself. Your breast is his pacifier. You have to decide whether you want that or not. If you don't, then you need to find him an alternative - he needs to suck and that need is going to continue. Will he take a pacifier (although this has its own problems)? Will he find his thumb? Can you get him used to another soft object?

If you prefer him to use your breast rather than another object as a pacifier, then I'm afraid there is not a simple resolution to your problem, apart from moving him in another room so that maybe he just senses your presence less (although it sounds like he needs to suck, and since your breast is his pacifier, maybe even that won't work...)

Good luck.

If he would take a pacifier I would gladly give it to him. I guess I will just have to keep trying...


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## anewmama (Feb 25, 2007)

Don't know the age of your child but at 14 months we just CLUED into the VALUE of a pacifier! We co-sleep but DD is still waking. And until recently, I was nursing her all night. She would sleep attached. Pitch fits when separated.

So, to back up, my DD is in daycare. I supplied them with a pacifier when she started to go at 4 months as I wanted her to be able to suckle something as she was so young. It was always in her cubby when I went to nurse her at lunch and DD always had this other one with her or in her crib. Well, after about 9 months, one of the care takers finally made a comment to me about how DD doesn't like the one I supplied and will ONLY take the one the school supplies. So, of course I noticed it, but never connected that they didn't use the one I supplied because she likes the other better. So....

Off I went to the store to get a orthodontic newborn sized pacifier. And now, when I know she is done nursing, I ease her off and push the pacifier off. She will sometimes fuss but I just keep at it until she accepts it. And then we ALL go to sleep.

Ever since I am using the pacifier at night, she wakes ALOT less. She still nurses, especially towards morning. And if she really is not into the pacifier, her fussing is alot more demanding and I know no urging to take the pacifier will work so I just nurse.

I just wish I had clued into WHICH one she likes. It's a definite shape and even other like brands I have tried, she spits out. But now both DH and I have a way to sooth her.

I understand that new babies who are learning to nurse and establishing the routine shouldn't have a pacifier. That's why I never really tried earlier on. But boy, is it a sleepsaver for me now at 15 months. I was getting SO irritated having her suckle on me all night. I fall asleep nursing so don't even know she is there until I realize she is STILL there an hour later and I am all uncomfortable from contorting to accommodate her.

I probably could have tried it alot earlier as she easily switched from nursing to expressed milk in a bottle from 3 months on. So I think the "no pacifier" rule is really something that you need to address with each baby.


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## anewmama (Feb 25, 2007)

I just saw your comment above about him taking a pacifier. Like I said, my DD is VERY picky about which ones she likes. Even though she is 15 months, I use the newborn size. That is probably softer and more like MY nipple. She spits out even some kinds of orthodontic (is that righ?!) ones so it's not just all of them... a specific one is all she will take.

Try other ones until you find the right shape and size. And she hates latex ones so I stick to the silicone.


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## MommyDOK (Jan 9, 2003)

hang in there momma....my second didn't sleep all night until she was 24 months old.
When they're crying and the boob puts them to sleep, then I would use it.


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## KCMommy (Jun 24, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisavark* 
I've also recently figured out that if she wakes up crying, that means she's not really done with her nap. If I go in right away and immediately stick my boob back in her mouth before she really wakes up and gets upset, then she'll go right back to sleep...otherwise she'll wake up but be grumpy and overtired and not be able to go back to sleep. I was already doing this at night but it's helping a lot now with daytime sleep. She used to only take 30 to 40 minute naps, but I figured out that was just her sleep cycle and she couldn't resettle herself; now I just keep nursing her back to sleep until she wakes up HAPPY and doesn't fall back asleep when I nurse her. Now she takes two hour naps (with just a five or ten minute nursing break in the middle).

I don't want to hijack but this was interesting to me. My baby only sleeps 45 min stretches too, during daytime naps or at night. At night, she needs me to BF her back to sleep every 40 - 50 minutes. For naps, I have been just getting her up when she wakes after 45 min or so. But I think I may try nursing her back to sleep more, after reading this. It is very difficult for me, though, because I have a very attached 3 y/o too, who will rarely let me step into another room by myself to quietly nurse her sister back to sleep.

Lisavark, ave you thought about a way to get her to resettle herself without nursing? I am trying to figure this one out, myself. I get so little sleep and have no support.


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## srs (Nov 8, 2007)

Does he sleep on top of you? Not that you want to do this all night, but when she was little (maybe until 4 months) my DD slept best on my chest. It worked particularly well when she woke up in the middle of the night. We would start the night with her on her back, and then I would prop me up and put her on my chest (tummy to tummy) from about 5am to 7am. It wasn't great sleep, but the alternative was to be up trying to put her down for two hours in the middle of the night. Even at 15 months she will occasionally fall asleep on my chest if she's having a rough time. And I agree about temperament - some babies are just more to deal with in every way - I think the term in vogue now is "spirited".
FWIW, I still dread bedtime and naptime. I can't wait until my DD stops napping. I was thrilled when she went from two naps to one - it's made things a lot easier.


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## tpintsch (Jun 26, 2008)

Oh mama







. I just wanted to let you know that you are definantely not alone. I think its mostly a urban myth that a mother can lay her drowsy baby into the crib for it to sleep peacefully all night. This time will pass and everything will eventually work out. I hope you find a good solution for your own sanity.


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## amaayeh (Jan 26, 2008)

I wanted to give you a







as well. I have a difficult sleeper as well and she is 3 now. We still struggle every night. It's not you, not your approach, not something CIO or any less attached would help. He really needs you at night and that is very difficult because most of us need our sleep. It WILL get better, but you do have to let go of the 'sleepy baby in a crib' myth. I just don't think that exists.


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amaayeh* 
I wanted to give you a







as well. I have a difficult sleeper as well and she is 3 now. We still struggle every night. It's not you, not your approach, not something CIO or any less attached would help. He really needs you at night and that is very difficult because most of us need our sleep. It WILL get better, but you do have to let go of the 'sleepy baby in a crib' myth. I just don't think that exists.

I'm sorry but I really have to disagree. From what the OP describes, her baby is using the breast as a pacifier. That is NOT something that every mother wants or can deal with and we should not be telling the OP that this is a situation that she should just learn to accept. There are ways of getting a baby to suck on something other than the breast for comfort. We should be offering advice in this regard, not telling the OP that she just has to live with the baby sucking on her boob all night while she lies awake.


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## Bromache (Jan 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
I'm sorry but I really have to disagree. From what the OP describes, her baby is using the breast as a pacifier. That is NOT something that every mother wants or can deal with and we should not be telling the OP that this is a situation that she should just learn to accept. There are ways of getting a baby to suck on something other than the breast for comfort. We should be offering advice in this regard, not telling the OP that she just has to live with the baby sucking on her boob all night while she lies awake.

Please give us some other suggestions, then, but not the pacifier thing -- it doesn't work with many babies. Something else that doesn't involve sucking at all would be great!


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bromache* 
Please give us some other suggestions, then, but not the pacifier thing -- it doesn't work with many babies. Something else that doesn't involve sucking at all would be great!

Babies need to suck. Period. Some more than others. If you offer nothing but the breast ALL the time, even when the baby clearly only needs to suck and is not hungry, well, you are telling the baby that he should use the breast as a pacifier. Offer something else instead. If there is a willing father or partner, get the father or partner to stay with baby in a separate room for a few nights. DP can always bring the baby to mom every three to four hours or whatever for real nursing (as in, because baby is hungry). DP can offer a pacifier or a soft cloth or stuffed toy or DP little finger turned upwards to suck on. The baby needs to be away from the breast for chunks of time to get used to sucking on something else.


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## Bromache (Jan 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
Babies need to suck. Period. Some more than others. If you offer nothing but the breast ALL the time, even when the baby clearly only needs to suck and is not hungry, well, you are telling the baby that he should use the breast as a pacifier. Offer something else instead. If there is a willing father or partner, get the father or partner to stay with baby in a separate room for a few nights. DP can always bring the baby to mom every three to four hours or whatever for real nursing (as in, because baby is hungry). DP can offer a pacifier or a soft cloth or stuffed toy or DP little finger turned upwards to suck on. The baby needs to be away from the breast for chunks of time to get used to sucking on something else.

Dude, I'm trying to tell ya I TRIED this -- all of it -- over and over, many different types of paciifers, etc., and NONE of it worked. I'm assuming the OP did too. I'm not sure about anyone else, but you're making me feel a little insulted by the insinuation that I never thought of having him suck something else. Besides, midwives and other sources tell you NOT to offer "dummies" or "false nipples", AKA pacifiers. I followed their advice. Do I regret it? Yes! Just as I regret not introducing bottles earlier too, 'cause he won't take those either. The point is, how about some other suggestions that don't involve sucking at all? Because that would be helpful.


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bromache* 
Dude, I'm trying to tell ya I TRIED this -- all of it -- over and over, many different types of paciifers, etc., and NONE of it worked. I'm assuming the OP did too. I'm not sure about anyone else, but you're making me feel a little insulted by the insinuation that I never thought of having him suck something else. Besides, midwives and other sources tell you NOT to offer "dummies" or "false nipples", AKA pacifiers. I followed their advice. Do I regret it? Yes! Just as I regret not introducing bottles earlier too, 'cause he won't take those either. The point is, how about some other suggestions that don't involve sucking at all? Because that would be helpful.

Here, here!


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## MommyDOK (Jan 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
I'm sorry but I really have to disagree. From what the OP describes, her baby is using the breast as a pacifier. That is NOT something that every mother wants or can deal with and we should not be telling the OP that this is a situation that she should just learn to accept. There are ways of getting a baby to suck on something other than the breast for comfort. We should be offering advice in this regard, not telling the OP that she just has to live with the baby sucking on her boob all night while she lies awake.

I tried w/ both my dd to get them to use a paci, their thumb, a blankie---anything!! They both refused. My older one, I didn't try until she was 6 weeks old. My younger one, I tried right away. Would have nothing to do w/ it.


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## waiting2bemommy (Dec 2, 2007)

What position does he sleep in? I discovered when ds was about 2 days old that he slept better on his stomach. he's been doing it ever since. He sleeps MUCH longer on his stomach. Another thing that has worked for me is to pu ds in the stroller (we have a maclaren that reclines), tuck a light blanket all around him, even over his head (no, he really doesn't smother lol) and push him around really fast on a bumpy surface, like the street, or the kitchen tile floor. It has been known to work in as little as 2 minutes. It looks (and sounds) much worse than it really is. I think he just needs all the stimulation taken away, and the motion to soothe him to sleep. HTH!


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## lisavark (Oct 27, 2007)

My DD also uses me as a pacifier. I chose that because I really wanted to establish a good nursing relationship and a good milk supply. Now she's almost twenty weeks old and I still get engorged every two hours...







...so I'm open to other pacifiers!

We offered her a pacifier the first time when she was three months old because we had to take a really long car trip. She hated it; we tried a couple brands; we finally found one (Nuk) that she would kinda chew on and it would distract her, but she never really used it for sucking until...uh, I dunno, two nights ago maybe? Now suddenly she'll *sometimes* actually suck on it to meet her sucking needs--and she even fell asleep with it once. So I think that's something that might change. I'm hoping to get her to fall asleep with it at night...might work to keep her asleep longer, except of course that the one time she did fall asleep with it, it fell out of her mouth...









But yeah, maybe those babies who won't take a paci might consider it eventually as they get older? Just a thought. Course mine is still very young and not at all set in her ways.


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bromache* 
Dude, I'm trying to tell ya I TRIED this -- all of it -- over and over, many different types of paciifers, etc., and NONE of it worked. I'm assuming the OP did too. I'm not sure about anyone else, but you're making me feel a little insulted by the insinuation that I never thought of having him suck something else. Besides, midwives and other sources tell you NOT to offer "dummies" or "false nipples", AKA pacifiers. I followed their advice. Do I regret it? Yes! Just as I regret not introducing bottles earlier too, 'cause he won't take those either. The point is, how about some other suggestions that don't involve sucking at all? Because that would be helpful.

At this point, the only thing you _can_ do make yourself unavailable for most of the night. That means sleeping in another room (with earplugs, if possible) and leaving your baby to sleep with your DP. And you would have to accept the fact that during the night, your baby will be on a feeding schedule (one that you design and that you think is suited to your baby - be it feeding every 3 hours, 4 hours, or not until morning - but nonetheless a schedule). Your DP should comfort baby when she cries, offer baby an object to suck on, do whatever else it takes to get baby to sleep, but he cannot bring the baby to you except at designated feeding times. At feeding times, DP brings the baby to you in your room. You nurse _sitting up_ and when nursing is done, the baby goes back to bed with DP.

Of course, it might sound silly, but I think that you should explain to your baby beforehand that mommy is very tired, needs sleep, and will not be sleeping with baby for a few nights.

This absolutely does work. But you have to be willing to go through with it. And your DP has to be willing to suffer though one or two sleepless nights.







My DH would never have done it.


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## MommyDOK (Jan 9, 2003)

I wouldn't leave a baby to cio, even w/ dad until they're over 18 months old. Night waking/nursing is absolutely developmentally appropriate for such a young baby. They don't have object permanence to about 1 year. I'm actually surprised by the advice to do cio on this board. A good book on the studies behind NOT doing cio is "A Secure Base" by Bowlby.

http://www.amazon.com/Secure-Base-Pa...6042321&sr=8-1

Trust me, I feel for you. My oldest didnt' sleep through until 15 months. ANd my other one was 24 months. I started trying to let then sleep w/ dad around 15 months. W/ my older, I found she had dairy intolerance, and that did help her sleep longer stretches. But then every time she got a tooth, we were up every other hour all night long. I tried to put her w/ dh and she would scream bloody murder.

If you scroll through this board, you will see you are not alone. This is completely normal. I know it's hard. Can you get a mother's helper to come in so you can take a nap during the day?? I assure you, it won't last forever. Your baby is still really young and needs mama and nursing. I lived on this board. I had two priorities for my day---be fed and feed my kids. That's it. We pared down everything. The house was an absolute mess and I took no outside commitments. I don't do well w/out sleep.

Dh and I consulted w/ a psychologist and he told us that if he has parents come in and say, "My child sleeps through the night at 6 months," that he tells them that is not normal. I know some moms don't do cio and get that, but usually it is from cio.

Have you tried a chiro for your back? Maybe the chiro can adjust your baby too and see if that helps.


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## RomanGoddess (Mar 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyDOK* 
I wouldn't leave a baby to cio, even w/ dad until they're over 18 months old. Night waking/nursing is absolutely developmentally appropriate for such a young baby. They don't have object permanence to about 1 year. I'm actually surprised by the advice to do cio on this board. A good book on the studies behind NOT doing cio is "A Secure Base" by Bowlby.

http://www.amazon.com/Secure-Base-Pa...6042321&sr=8-1

What I have described in my post is not CIO. The baby is not being left alone to cry. Unless of course you think that a child's father should not be considered an adequate caregiver.

Yes, periodic night waking is completely normal at that age. _Staying awake all night_ (and keeping mom awake while you're at it) is not.


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## Daniel's Kitty (Nov 18, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tpintsch* 
Oh mama








. I just wanted to let you know that you are definantely not alone. I think its mostly a urban myth that a mother can lay her drowsy baby into the crib for it to sleep peacefully all night. This time will pass and everything will eventually work out. I hope you find a good solution for your own sanity.

Gotta be a myth! I thought I was failing when ds1 wanted to cuddle and nurse all day long. And so many people lectured me for carefully nursing him down and then rocking when he stopped nursing.


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## H & J's Mom (Jun 1, 2008)

I thought maybe you would have gotten a few more encouraging stories &#8230; I can't believe my babies are the only ones who go to sleep on their own and sleep all night before 6 months without ever crying it out









I know what worked for my children will not work for everyone but I wanted to tell you again that it can happen. I have two very different children temperament/personality wise and the consistent bed routine along with their special blankies really worked for both of them.

My son now goes and gets blankie when I say it's nap time or night night time and brings it out for rocking/story time. I've gone in at night when he's stirring and watched him search for it in his sleep and when he finds it he hugs it into himself and settles back to sleep, too cute to watch









Also important, I think, is to give baby a moment to try and settle himself before you intervene. I know sometimes I jump too soon when he is stirring in his sleep or cries out with a gas pain or something and I end up waking him. It doesn't take long to figure out when he needs mommy and when he doesn't.

Sorry so long winded, I'm very passionate about sleep, so important mentally and physically for everyone in my household. I really hope you find something that works for your family. Once it happens all of those sleepless night will seem so distant, sometimes now I even enjoy it the when my son wakes through the night the odd time (sick, teething) ... never thought I'd say that


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## ChelseaW (Jul 14, 2008)

I definitely feel for you. My DS didn't sleep through the night until he was 7 months old, and like yours he was waking up multiple times at night and unable to go back to sleep without nursing. I had so many people tell me to let him CIO but that didn't feel right to me. I started noticing that when he would wake up it was very sudden, and his whole body would be tense. He was also very gassy. I tried an elimination diet (I was still exclusively BFing, no solids or formula) and the first thing I eliminated from my diet was dairy. Two weeks later, DS was a different baby and sleeping for 6-7 hours at a time without stirring.

So in my experience, it WAS my breastmilk - but it was an easily fixable problem (I BFed exclusively for the first year, and didn't wean until he was over 2.) Pay attention to your baby's cues and you will find out what will work best for both of you! I'm SO glad I didn't listen to those who told me to let him CIO, because he was trying to tell me he was in pain.


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## jillmamma (Apr 11, 2005)

One thought...by your siggy he is about 6 months old, right? Could he be teething? Both of mine when getting teeth got up more to nurse in the night as nursing seemed to help soothe teething pain. Giving a dose of Motrin or Tylenol before bed seemed to help get a good long stretch of sleep before waking up if teething was the cause.

Another thing...both of mine still go to sleep better and sleep longer if we do some outside time during the day. Just going around the block for a walk in the stroller or sling could help, or put a blanket out in the yard with some toys on it.

If he is already 6 months, have you started solid foods yet? If so, trying giving a good solids meal about an hour or so before bedtime to help tank him up, then a good long breastfeeding right before bed to help with hunger.

Neither of mine slept through consistently till close to 2 years old, but the good thing is by 9 or 10 months we were down to just 1-2 wakings a night to nurse. And when he is 5.5 like my DS, and sleeping all night, going potty by himself, dressing himself, about to go to K, and no longer wanting to hold my hand, you will wonder where did the time go?


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## newmama8824 (Jul 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jillmamma* 
One thought...by your siggy he is about 6 months old, right? Could he be teething? Both of mine when getting teeth got up more to nurse in the night as nursing seemed to help soothe teething pain. Giving a dose of Motrin or Tylenol before bed seemed to help get a good long stretch of sleep before waking up if teething was the cause.

Another thing...both of mine still go to sleep better and sleep longer if we do some outside time during the day. Just going around the block for a walk in the stroller or sling could help, or put a blanket out in the yard with some toys on it.

If he is already 6 months, have you started solid foods yet? If so, trying giving a good solids meal about an hour or so before bedtime to help tank him up, then a good long breastfeeding right before bed to help with hunger.

Neither of mine slept through consistently till close to 2 years old, but the good thing is by 9 or 10 months we were down to just 1-2 wakings a night to nurse. And when he is 5.5 like my DS, and sleeping all night, going potty by himself, dressing himself, about to go to K, and no longer wanting to hold my hand, you will wonder where did the time go?









Yep. He got his teeth, still not sleeping though! I think I may just keep offering the pacifier. I have also started patting him while nursing him to sleep, so when he wakes up at night sometimes I can just pat him and he goes back to bed! Not for long, but it's still nice.

Thanks everyone!


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## D_McG (Jun 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RomanGoddess* 
What I have described in my post is not CIO. The baby is not being left alone to cry. Unless of course you think that a child's father should not be considered an adequate caregiver.


Agree 100%

To the OP: I did the 'pantley pull off' (from NCSS) around 3 mos and this helped my son to fall asleep and stay asleep without nursing. Now he still woke frequently (VERY frequently at 6 mos! hourly probably) but he would nurse briefly.. unlatch and fall back to sleep. It helped with my sanity.

We did motrin for teething pain.


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## GooeyRN (Apr 24, 2006)

Both of mine are crappy sleepers, I know it sucks!!!!! DD who is almost 3 doesn't always sleep through yet. I still have to lay with her to get her to sleep, after a long routine. She is a very intense child, though. My 7 month old never makes it longer than 2 hours at night, I don't even want to talk naps, they are just awful... Nothing but nursing puts him to sleep, and he wont let go of my boob all night. Its really causing problems here. (I am/was a night shift worker, I cant go back to work b/c of this, causing some financial issues) I also have ZERO time to dtd with dh. The thought of sex with a baby sleeping on my boob just doesnt get me in the mood...... I do have to do something about this before it destroys my marriage and we lose our house.....


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## hipmummy (May 25, 2007)

Your baby is totally NORMAL. Nothing wrong there. Your child will turn out to be the more adjusted one than the plop the kid inthe crib crew. Believe me ds was and is still not a good napper and sleeper. BUt he is teh HAppiest little boy you will ever meet and is so pleasant and soOOOO independant. He rarely lets me hold him other than to nurse. CIO is not and is never the answer. My SIL cio's and her kids are the biggest whiny,clingy children you have ever met. She is always remarking at how well ds does on his own and how he does not fuss or cling. Give a lot now and your job will be much easier in the future


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## mytwogirls (Jan 3, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GooeyRN* 
I also have ZERO time to dtd with dh. The thought of sex with a baby sleeping on my boob just doesnt get me in the mood

Oh man I hear ya there. I have a two year old who REFUSES to sleep in her own bed and we have to be sneaky about the sex thing. It sucks really bad. I have no idea what to do either. I have tried it all.


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## skeegan23 (Apr 28, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bromache* 
Dude, I'm trying to tell ya I TRIED this -- all of it -- over and over, many different types of paciifers, etc., and NONE of it worked. I'm assuming the OP did too. I'm not sure about anyone else, but you're making me feel a little insulted by the insinuation that I never thought of having him suck something else. Besides, midwives and other sources tell you NOT to offer "dummies" or "false nipples", AKA pacifiers. I followed their advice. Do I regret it? Yes! Just as I regret not introducing bottles earlier too, 'cause he won't take those either. The point is, how about some other suggestions that don't involve sucking at all? Because that would be helpful.

Um, YES! Lol, dd is same age as OP's baby, but anyay, she got nipple confusion from being given a paci too early, took us weeks to get breast feeding situated and now, she won't even think about taking a paci or bottle or.... anything of the sorts. I've come to the conclusion that dd is just very particular, lol. Anyone who says, "if they get hungry enough they will take a bottle" have CLEARLY never been in this situation or had a lo like this.... easier said than done.


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