# Would you pay for ER visit in this situation?



## Ornery (May 21, 2007)

AGH!







My oldest DS just turned 12 today and we had his b-day party. We had him and 4 other boys at our house. Before each boy's parents left, I told them we had a trampoline with an enclosure net and asked if it was okay for their child to jump on it. I let them know it had a net and that I would limit the number of boys to 2 at a time. All said it was fine. So after pizza, etc, the boys were playing in the backyard, with 2 jumping on the trampoline at a time. My DH was supervising. One boy jumped, crashed into another. Big surprise. His teeth went into his lip pretty badly. It stopped bleeding very quickly but looked VERY nasty. I called his mother within a few minutes, let her know what happened and asked her to come evaluate whether or not he should be taken to the ER for stitches. She came by and took him to the ER, which is where they are right now. AGH. This is why I NEVER let my son's friends play on the trampoline or if I do, they jump one at a time. I KNOW better, but my DS and DH talked me into it.

I say we should offer to pay for ER visit or at least the insurance deductible. The child was under our care. My DH says no way. They gave their permission for him to jump and kids get hurt all the time just playing. And we have little to no money, as always. If we were to pay for it, we would need to do it on a payment plan of some type as there is no way we could pay it all at once. But I still think we should pay. It feels like the right thing to do.

What do you think?


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## ledzepplon (Jun 28, 2004)

I think to offer is the gracious thing to do. It might even be covered under your homeowners insurance policy.

ETA: Trampoline injuries happen most often when more than one person is on at a time, when there is no net or cover on the springs, or when kids attempt dangerous tricks (like flips).


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## Ornery (May 21, 2007)

UPDATE: His mom just called from the ER. They think there might have been nerve damage.







He is going to have to see a plastic surgeon. I feel so badly. Nothing like this has ever happened to us before. I am always so careful with other people's children.


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## Maluhia (Jun 24, 2007)

Your Homeowners insurance might go up if you do pay for it - but that is one of the things you *might* be covered for.

My gut is to go with your DH - they gave permission and it was an accident. Offering to pay implies fault - this was bad luck but not your fault as you did not let more than you said you would on the trampoline at a time.

But if your gut says offer - then by all means offer - guts tend to be right.


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## MaShroom (Jan 25, 2003)

I am so sorry that happened.







I know you feel like crap and feel like you should do something but doo doo happens. It wasn't your fault.

My dd broke her leg on a friend's trampoline. I did not expect them to pay for it. My ds's arm was broken when a bigger girl literally ran over him at a friend's party. I didn't expect anyone else to pay for that either. Kids get hurt. Part of having kids, IME, is having some big huge medical bills. It sucks but you deal with it and move on.

Btw, not dissing at all because I know they're fun, but this is why we will never own a trampoline. The same trampoline that my dd broke her leg on was the same one that later my friend's dd had a terrible accident on which I will not go into detail about because it gives me the serious willies. I also used to have a friend who was an ER nurse at a children's hospital. After the stories she told me about trampoline injuries... They say you should never say never. Ha. "They" don't know about my trampoline phobia.

Good luck dealing with this situation. I hope the kiddo who got hurt makes a full and speedy recovery.


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## griffin2004 (Sep 25, 2003)

The child was under your care and supervision; you should pay for his injuries.

OT and IMHO, trampolines are disasters waiting to happen.


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## Mama Dragon (Dec 5, 2005)

I would never _let_ someone else pay a medical bill for my kids unless they were at fault.


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## MomInCalifornia (Jul 17, 2003)

If it were my child who was hurt, I would NOT expect you to pay for his injuries. You asked for parent permission, you told them no more than 2 on at a time, and you supervised.

How do the parents seem? Do you have the feeling they are angry with you?

It's a bummer it happened, but that kind of stuff just happens.


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## Ornery (May 21, 2007)

UPDATE: The other child's mom just brought him back. He seems to be fine. They were a bit worried about nerve damage but everything pinked up and he should be okay, although he will have a tiny scar on the bottom of his lip. Poor thing had to have stitches but he said it didn't even hurt.

I did call my insurance company to see if it was covered under my policy. Of course, no one there could tell me but they will be calling me on Monday. I told the mother that I called them and she said not even to worry about it, that she didn't want to complicate things. I've known this family for about 4 years and they are really nice. Unfortunately, she also brought up the fact that we have been having a really hard time lately (we recently suffered a loss and I've had some major health problems) and she didn't want to add to it. So I will still see if it covers and if it doesn't I will definitely offer to pay for deductibles, etc. His safety was my responsibility and, although accidents happen, I feel so badly about it.

Thank you for your thoughts on this. They have definitely helped me organize mine.


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## tinuviel_k (Apr 29, 2004)

If my daughter had gotten hurt in that situation I would never expect someone else to pay for it. Trampolines carry risks, and the parent gave permission for her child to jump under the guidelines you set up. Accidents do happen, and you should not be required to pay for it.

I had a trampoline as a kid. Before ANY of my friends could jump on it my father gave a "permission slip" to each parent of my friends explaining the rules for the trampoline, the risks of trampoline use, and absolving my parents of any injury. The child could not jump on the trampoline unless the parents signed that form.


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## purslaine (Feb 20, 2006)

I would not offer to pay. The parents knew he would be on it and under what circumstances. How is this your fault?

Moreover, I am really happy he does not have nerve damage (because who wants that for a child?) but also because I was worried that if you offered to pay for the ER visit (which some may construe as admitting "fault") you could have been in big trouble money-wise for held responsable for nerve damage. Paying for the ER visit could turn into a slippery slope.

kathy


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

A lot would depend (IMO) on how the boys were playing on the trampoline. If they were getting overly rowdy and nothing was done to stop it, then yes, you should offer to cover the expense. If it was truly just one of those things that one could expect to happen, then probably not.

My son recently sliced his hand open on a low-hanging fan playing Wii at a friend's. Freak thing that one wouldn't expect to happen. Yep, needed an ER visit. Nope, I didn't ask nor expect the host's parents to pay for it. Having food and a (large) bottle of wine waiting for me when we got back was ample compensation.


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## <~*MamaRose*~> (Mar 4, 2007)

I agree with others that it was generous to want to offer but really not necessary. Oh and I also agree that in the end I think it may end up costing you more if you do.


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## NamastePlatypus (Jan 22, 2007)

If it were my ds tht was hurt, which it will be one day cause he has no fear







, I would NEVER expect youto pay but that is because you told me ahead of time look we have a tramp I only let two at a time on.... 12 is old enough for them to be responsiable for there actions, I know they think they know everything but they DO have the rational to know what will not be smart and there is a reason things are called 'accidents'.

I am sorry that you were but in this postion, hope it clears up.


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

It was an accident, period. The child's parents gave permission, but there was an accident. I don't see how it's your fault or why you should pay for his medical care, especially if you're not in a position to pay for it easily.

If my child was injured at a friend's houses, I'd never expect the other parents to pay for medical care.


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## Genesis (Jan 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Synthea™* 
I would never _let_ someone else pay a medical bill for my kids unless they were at fault.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
It was an accident, period. The child's parents gave permission, but there was an accident. I don't see how it's your fault or why you should pay for his medical care, especially if you're not in a position to pay for it easily.

If my child was injured at a friend's houses, I'd never expect the other parents to pay for medical care.









: I would let it go if I were you. You are not at fault here.


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## Ellien C (Aug 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kathymuggle* 
Moreover, I am really happy he does not have nerve damage (because who wants that for a child?) but also because I was worried that if you offered to pay for the ER visit (which some may construe as admitting "fault") you could have been in big trouble money-wise for held responsable for nerve damage. Paying for the ER visit could turn into a slippery slope.

The paranoid in me is with Kathy here. Does your insurance company even know you have a tramp? Could this raise your premiums?


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## KBecks (Jan 3, 2007)

I would not have called the ins. company because I feel they will raise your premiums because you have a trampoline.

I also would not offer to pay for the ER or urgent care visit. You are sweet to think to offer, but you are not responsible for it and should not over extend yourselves to make an offer like that.

I would consider getting rid of the trampoline.


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## Naless (Apr 9, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla* 
It was an accident, period. The child's parents gave permission, but there was an accident. I don't see how it's your fault or why you should pay for his medical care, especially if you're not in a position to pay for it easily.

If my child was injured at a friend's houses, I'd never expect the other parents to pay for medical care.









:


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## SusanElizabeth (Jun 2, 2006)

Accidents happen. I also would not be comfortable accepting money from another family for my child's accident.

Last year my daughter was smacked in the face with a field hockey stick during a game at school. She was taken to the emergency room and needed a plastic surgeon to stitch it up (because they said otherwise she would have a huge scar across her face.) I have never thought about this -- but the school never admitted any liability for what happened. (and it didn't occur to me that they should.) It was an accident, and they felt badly about it.


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## loriforeman (Aug 18, 2007)

i don't know where you are...but here, by law, you are responsible. regardless of whether his parents gave permission or not...it's YOUR house, so it's your responsibility.

(doesn't mean i agree with that, just saying that's how it would be treated here.)


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## loriforeman (Aug 18, 2007)

http://injury-law.freeadvice.com/inj...s_property.htm


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## purslaine (Feb 20, 2006)

Still...by offerring to pay, she is planting the idea she is at fault.

Kathy


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## momuveight2B (Mar 17, 2006)

I'm sure you must feel terrible, I know I would. I would call and make sure he is OK and ask mom how you can help. Depending on the insurance there may not be any co-pay at all. I would not expect you to pay if it were my child but I would appreciate the offer.


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## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

If I was the one whose visiting child got injured under such circumstances (i.e. I'd given permission for the activity) I absolutely would not expect the hosts to pay any part of the medical bills. I wouldn't expect them to feel one second of guilt, either.


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## Megs Mom (Mar 19, 2002)

{{{HUGS}}} How scary and stressful!


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## Tigeresse (Nov 19, 2001)

Well if it was revealed where the accident took place I would think the injured's insurance co. will sue op's insurance. I know this has happened to us each time we have had our kids in the ER for an injury. Our insurance tried to find someone else to pay the bill, even when it happened at a park or onour own property. If the injured kid's family says it happened at their own home, it should be OK. Then the op can decide between her family and the other family whether or not they want to help pay. I'd be very careful about involving insurance co's.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

If it was my child that was hurt I wouldn't expect you to pay. You were watching them and got permission. Accidents happen and there was no negligence from what I can tell.


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## MOM2ANSLEY (May 19, 2003)

B/c the othe mom said don't worry about it I would let it go , at this point If _she_ feels you should be responsible she should ask JMO


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## BusyMommy (Nov 20, 2001)

I agree, it was a simple accident and the parents accept responsibility for that possibility.

Now, this came up on my other board...I'm sure the hosp asked how it happened and it went down on the form as a trampoline accident. Will that ins. co. follow up and ask YOU for payment? I don't know. But, I have heard that this could happen and that your homeowners rates could be raised b/c you have a pc of "dangerous" equipment. But, maybe that is diff. for each state?


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## mtiger (Sep 10, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SusanElizabeth* 
Last year my daughter was smacked in the face with a field hockey stick during a game at school. She was taken to the emergency room and needed a plastic surgeon to stitch it up (because they said otherwise she would have a huge scar across her face.) I have never thought about this -- but the school never admitted any liability for what happened. (and it didn't occur to me that they should.) It was an accident, and they felt badly about it.

Actually, in that situation I WOULD expect the school to be responsible. My daughter plays FH, and high sticking is a penalty. I would've gone after the other team for compensation.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *griffin2004* 
The child was under your care and supervision; you should pay for his injuries.

OT and IMHO, trampolines are disasters waiting to happen.









: to both statements. I was at a trampoline party when I was about 12. I sprained my ankle, and a little while later another girl broke hers so badly the bone came jutting through the skin.

They are damn dangerous.


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## lab (Jun 11, 2003)

I wouldn't ask you to pay or expect you pay. I think most people understand that accidents happen.

But legally - you are responsible.










FYI - if my kids go to someone's house and they have a trampoline - I let the parents know that my child is NOT allowed on it.


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## <~*MamaRose*~> (Mar 4, 2007)

Question for those of you that think she should pay for the visit~

Would you expect compensation for any and all accidents that may happen while your dc is at a friends house? If yes, does this include doc visits or just ER visits?

This is a legit question as it isn't soemthing we have to worry about because hospital and doc visits here are covered.


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## LastBestPlace (May 22, 2007)

Under common law, offering to pay someone's medical expenses after some sort of mishap is not considered an admission of liability and is inadmissible as evidence of wrongdoing. The reason for this is that we (as a society) don't want to discourage people and insurance companies from offering to help out in this way because they are afraid it will be held against them if the matter ever goes to trial.

That being said, whether offering to pay medical expenses may put the idea of liability into someone's head is a separate matter.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 







: to both statements. I was at a trampoline party when I was about 12. I sprained my ankle, and a little while later another girl broke hers so badly the bone came jutting through the skin.

They are damn dangerous.

I'm assuming that you and the poster you quoted would not have given permission for your kids to go on the trampoline, so that particular situation wouldn't be an issue for you guys.

But are you saying that if you *had* given permission for your child to participate in a given activity at a friend's house and your child was injured, you'd expect the friend's parents to pay?


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## Stinkerbell (Aug 11, 2005)

yes this was not a case of your negligence...it was a simple accident. offering to split the copay is a nice gesture, but i dont think it's necessary. really.

i'm that mean mom who said "NO" when my kid wanted to jump on someones trampoline. as an ER nurse, we averaged SOOOO many injuries on those things. they scare me.


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## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

Trampolines scare me too... I have a friend who split his skull open on one at the age of twelve and nearly died. He still has a scar shaped like a sideways V that goes _around his eye_... very scary!

Anyway, I agree with the don't-payers. You explained a situation which the parent accepted; therefore, she accepted the risks. Obviously, as kids aren't puppets, she would have known you couldn't control every single movement they made while on the trampoline!

On the other hand, maybe a gift in the form of a nice homebaked batch of cookies or something would be a nice gesture?


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## griffin2004 (Sep 25, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limabean* 
But are you saying that if you *had* given permission for your child to participate in a given activity at a friend's house and your child was injured, you'd expect the friend's parents to pay?

Getting a marble up your nose is significantly different than knocking noggins on a trampoline. Jumping on a trampoline, especially 2 at a time, is inherently dangerous; playing marbles is not.

That would be a distinction for me: while she is under your care and supervision, is the activity you're offering my child inherently dangerous?


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## jeca (Sep 21, 2002)

I honestly don't think you are at fault since they agreed to let their kids play on it. They could have said no. If they considered it dangerous then they should have declined.


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## oregongirlie (Mar 14, 2006)

Totally OT (as in pretty much derailing), but it's too bad that this is even a topic, you know? If we had universal health coverage and a less litigious society, these worries wouldn't merit so much discussion. Annoying fears we deal with around here. I wonder how it would all play out in Europe?


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## momof2boys1girl (Nov 7, 2006)

Offering to pay is very kind of you. I how ever would not expect a parent to pay if my child got injured and it was because my child was playing. The injury was not malicious or purposely caused by you and by offering to pay is saying it is your fault.
If the parent gave permission there is nothing you need to worry about.
Glad it was not serious and he was able to come back.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

What nobody on this thread seems to understand is that you are going to be paying for it whether you offer or not.

The health insurance is going to deny the claim and the hospital is going to bill you, period, which will go through your homeowner's insurance.

If you have a clause exempting trampolines in your insurance (which most insurance companies do, ours outright forbids us to have them), the insurance company will sue them and you for the cost of the treatment incurred.

You will also likely see raised rates on your HI policy and you may be dropped, unfortunately.


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