# help - playboy bunny on 12yo...



## Nursing_Nate (May 6, 2005)

I feel so helpless in this situation, but I seem to be the only one concerned! so I really want to do something. I was going to talk to my 12yo niece about rape, the effects of having sex early and such at a girls only sleep over at my house in 2 weeks...and just the other day she was over with her mother and on her belt was the playboy bunny! I causually asked, "what is that on your belt" and she was too embarrased to say...I said, "well, if you're old enough to wear it, then you're old enough to talk about it...what is it?" and she shyly came back with, "I didn't buy it...my mom did" !!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sorry, is it just me, or what is wrong with her mother!! The only messages (from family, TV, MTV, realworld....) is that sex is what you do whenever and with whomever you want. NO ONE is giving her a different message, like WAIT! at least until you're older! Her mother ran away when she was 16, was a druggie, had my niece out of wedlock, never finished HS, and lives on welfare...has no intention of moving out of the assisted living building she's in and I REALLY fear for the adverse effects this will have on both my niece and my nephew. They are such good kids, but with no guidance...I just seem to be the aunt that is nice, has them over to do cool things, but is way too on the opposite side of 'reality' as shown on TV and in thier present life situation...I know she is not my daughter, but I just feel like her mother would like her to end up like her so that it makes her feel better about herself and her life...like, "see, it even happens to nice girls"...I know the longterm adverse effects of rape and sexual abuse, and I'm sure that when a girl enters into sexual relations before she is TRUELY ready it's the same sort of thing. I just don't want this for her. I'm 36 weeks along and about to be too busy so I want to do something, anyting soon...any suggestions? Am I way too off course? Should 12yo's be wearing porn symbols such as the 'cute' playboy bunny??? showing thier mid-drif, wearing tight jeans? Hearing, "hey hot stuff" while walking home though her building?...







:


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

I think it's great that you are concerned for your niece and her wellbeing as she grows into a young woman. The best you can really do is try to voice your concerns in a non-preachy way though. Also, for some the Playboy Bunny isn't really a crisis, and for some Playboy is not really porn or hardcore anyway) so there is that to consider. A great thing would be for your niece to know that she is valuable and worthy beyond her looks. I know that you mentioned you are about to deliver soon, but when things settle a bit maybe you and your neice could go do some fun things together?


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## Kirsten (Mar 19, 2002)

I think it is nice you are concerned about your niece.

Is the "girls only sleepover" that you are hosting in two weeks just you and her? Or some other girls too? Because I think talking about sex ed kind of stuff with 12 year olds will get you in some hot water with their parents. Now with your niece I get the feeling that you are more concerned with her hopefully good future choices than her mom's opinion so you are ok there.

The Playboy belt.... well, I think that is a bit of a gray area honestly. We did just have Easter. It is not a naked woman on the belt buckle but the rabbit head. My mom (who was very mainstream, belonged to the Garden Club, made cupcakes for the bake sale, never went out without lipstick, gave me "the look" if I said "oh god!", etc.) put underwear with little Playboy bunny symbols on them in my Easter basket when I was ten or eleven. I didn't know they were the Playboy symbol then; I just thought they were cute because they had bunnies on them and it was Easter. Now I look back and am a bit surprised that MY mother did that but she did.

In your situation, I would try to be a good role model for your niece without getting too preachy/uncool about it. I know you have her best interests at heart. You said she considers you the "cool aunt". That is a good position to be in. She will feel she can come to you with issues later. But she may not if she feels too judged. It is a fine line to walk.

To me, a tee shirt that says "future playmate" with the bunny symbol - on a 12 year old - would be distasteful for sure. But the belt buckle with just the symbol is not quite as bad. Would I want MY almost 10 year old to wear it? No. I can see your point but would try to stay cool about it as much as you can.


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## EmmaJean (Sep 26, 2002)

Wow.....I definitely find giving a 12yo playboy bunny anything offensive. Kids know exactly what it is, and her being shy about it proves that. It's not a wholesome, totally innocent thing, although it couldbe worse, I agree. I remember when the playboy symbol was *everywhere*, people thinking it was so cool.....my parents were NOT cool w/ us picking up something and saying "Oh, that's cute!" if it had the bunny on it. I guess I just think it's important for the parents to be sending the right messages to the kids, ones that are clear and this is a bit blurry.

I love your idea, but you do need to have the girls' moms'/parents' permission first.

I'm glad your neice has you in her life! You obviously love her a lot, and kids need all of that that they can get!


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## Alkenny (May 4, 2004)

Have you talked to her mother about any of this? Just because she had her as an out of wedlock teen and lives in housing doesn't mean that she isn't concerned with her daughter's well-being. Not attacking you on this one, just concerned that you're putting them both in a box.

Your niece is lucky to have someone as concerned as you on her side, whether or not her mom is or isn't, it's good to have strong female role models.


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## kalisis (Jan 10, 2005)

I agree with Alkenny, you should voice your concerns to her mother first. Perhaps it wasn't truly an 'on purpose' thing with the belt - I don't know, I've done some absentminded stuff in my time too and only later realized how off base it was.

I also wonder about talking to a 12 yo about rape? In those words? I think that your intentions are good in trying to give her some education and give her another side to the mainstream bombardment of 'have as much as sex as you want as often as you want', but I'm not sure I agree with your understanding that having sex too early is equal to rape. As a survivor myself, I don't think that I would carry around nearly as much trauma as I do had I made the choice to have sex instead of having it forced upon me. Not that there probably isn't trauma with having sex too early, just wow, what a way to marginalize all those rape survivors out there.

Here's where I think you might go with this: do some roleplaying with her and/or talk over situations that could come up and then go over how she could react in them. My aunt did this with me when I was about 12 and I can't tell you how often I actually used those scenarios to figure out what I should do. You know, she's in a dark parking lot at night, how does she keep herself safe? She's coming home alone late at night, what does she need to watch out for? A guy propositions her for sex and she's not ready, what does she say? She is supposed to catch a ride home from a friend who's been drinking, who does she call, what does she do instead?

Then it's more of a general safety lesson and not just sex focused.

I just have to say though that I read so much judgement in your post (on so many levels). If you want to be effective and have a lasting impact on your niece and her life (which I think is admirable and you *should*), then I'd try really hard to be as even keeled and non judgemental as possible. The choices that her mother made do not reflect one bit on this girl and I'm sure she's trying to do the best she can in a situation she did not choose. You should give her the benefit of the doubt and maybe cut her mom some slack too, if you really want to help.

Just my .02.


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## Nursing_Nate (May 6, 2005)

Ok, I am judgmental towards her mother. I agree. She's not easy to talk to and that side of the family relies heavily on gossip instead of actually talking TO that person about what you are concerned with. I have gotten her permission to talk to my niece about all this stuff long ago - I just haven't had time/courage to do it. And I will just have to get up my courage to talk to her mother about my concerns too. (No one ever talks to her because she lashes out at people, very ragefull, and won't let you talk to her kids. She's treated with 'Kid gloves' is what I think the term is) I guess I'm just afraid of her like everyone else that I resort to gossip instead of true communication.

I myself am a rape victim and I was equating early sex to being traumatic 'like' rape because when you are that young you really aren't ready mentally/emotionally and can be 'talked into' it so easily that later you might feel that it wasn't what you wanted but didn't know how to get out of the situation. You feel trapped and feel that you have to go through with it. It might not be rape persay, but it's non-consensual sex, which is in the same category. I got a cool 'magazine' from the rape crisis center in San Diego that is written for girls 12-18. It's great and I offered it to her mom to do the talk, but she didn't want to do it. It's just going to be me and my neice...just have to get my DH and my DS out of the house for an hour or two!...

I'm just out of my element a bit because on my side of the family the message is 'wait' and basically (aside from rape) we've all waited...on my DH's side of the family, the message is 'have sex, it's natural, and do it soon, have a baby soon, and MOVE OUT!' very odd to me, but all the women in the family have had children in thier teens so that they could move out of their parents home...to me that's crazy, but I don't want to 'judge' them for their beliefs....I just don't want them pushing my niece into thinking this is the only avenue to take... she wants to go to college, but already since mom is on assistance she is starting to believe that that will never happen even though she could have the whole thing paid for! It's just every time I see her she seems a bit more 'beaten down'. I think she is just now realizing 'where' they live and it's having an adverse effect on her. Like, this is the life I 'have' to live...I don't want her to be beaten down so much that she takes the road most taken just from lack of support...KWIM?

To me, the playboy bunny is soft porn, and has no place on a 12yo...but it's oh, so cool!! why not!?!??!







:

Hope this wasn't too preachy/judging...I just am trying to convey what the situation is like. And the fact that EVERYONE is concerned but no one will dare say a darn thing to anyone for fear of sounding 'uncool' or being yelled at by the mom...but I'm really concerned...so I'm just going to do it. No one ever did it for me, telling me what rape was and it took 3 years for me to realize what had happened...and then 14 years to loose the fear of being judged to report it...that's a lot of crap to carry around and I just don't want that for my niece. I just love her so much that I am scared for her. I don't want her to have to deal with what I've had to...ok, now I'm crying...hormonal prego mom here!


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## joesmom (Nov 19, 2001)

For some reason, when my sisters & I were about 13, 11, & nine, my mom got us all nightgowns with the playboy bunny on them. They were modest nightgowns, cotton, basically long tshirts- & there was matching underwear. We knew that it was the playboy symbol- maybe the 9 yo didn't- but that was the extent of it. My family is pretty conservative & modest in that respect so it was strange for Mom to have bought those things for us but at the same time it did not make us want to pose for playboy, it did not make us sexually promiscuous, it did not make us dress provocatively...

Keep an eye on her if you feel you need to but there may be nothing to be concerned about...


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## papayapetunia (Feb 6, 2006)

I think the real concern is how your niece thinks of herself. From what you've described, she may very well grow up to subliminally believe that all she has to offer the world and a man is sex. But what can you do about that?

From you've said about her mom, she would probably be offended if you brought your concerns to her attention.

If you make the sleepover into a "learning lesson" instead of a fun party, your words will forever be lost on your niece.

I think the best route you could take is to take the same route that Playboy advertisers take. Subliminally brainwash her to believe that she is smart, funny, talented, etc. Just start telling her all the time how amazed you are that she is who she is, and that you are excited to see what great things she will do with her life. Tell her every time you see her.

She's reaching an age where she'll need someone like you to confide in. Don't be too preachy or condescending toward her, or she'll find her confidante elsewhere.

One of the scariest things about teenagers is that they're going to do what they want to do, and adults just have to hold their breaths and cross their fingers. All you can do is be positive as a role model, and as a supporter.


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## 1growingsprout (Nov 14, 2005)

a definate NO NO if you ask me. while im sure 12 yr olds are aware of playboy IMHO they should not be purchasing that type of trash or having it purchased for them. yes yes i know im probalby way too conservative with my kids etc however 12 yrs old is still elementary school in many places. it sounds like her whole living situation is less then conservative. Im struggling with my 8 yr old niece who just came to live with us. I have a feeling her life was similar to you 12 yr old nieces. i do not allow 'hot pants' belly shirts etc. and my rule has always been , even when they came over years ago was in MY HOUSE we are dressed appropriately... i would keep proper clothing for them, even if it was just basic sweats. my other concern would be her influence on my kids, i have 3 under 5 and since are expecting, she should be setting a good example for you DC.

yes there is a wide variety of fashion out there and it is our job to lead our kids in the right direction.

good luck and maybe when she comes over you guys can go shopping and get a NEW BELT?


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## UnschoolnMa (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1growingsprout*
while im sure 12 yr olds are aware of playboy IMHO they should not be purchasing that type of trash or having it purchased for them.

There is a huge difference between a belt buckle or logo and the actual magazine. Just a thought...

Quote:

and my rule has always been , even when they came over years ago was in MY HOUSE we are dressed appropriately... i would keep proper clothing for them, even if it was just basic sweats.
So you are deciding for other peoples' children what is appropriate attire? That's reachng a little IMO. Would you change your clothing at your friend's house if she said she found it to be inappropriate? Sharing concerns about certain clothing choices makes perfect sense to me, but demanding they change into something else like sweats seems disrespectful of them to me.


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## joesmom (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UnschoolnMa*
So you are deciding for other peoples' children what is appropriate attire? That's reachng a little IMO. Would you change your clothing at your friend's house if she said she found it to be inappropriate? Sharing concerns about certain clothing choices makes perfect sense to me, but demanding they change into something else like sweats seems disrespectful of them to me.

I completely agree with this. I can't think of a situation where I'd feel comfortable asking someone in my home to change clothes- well, my nephews after they play with the hose in the middle of winter, maybe...







Asking her to remove a belt because of the bunny buckle- seems counter productive to me. She will tell her mom, etc...


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## 1growingsprout (Nov 14, 2005)

in our home, but i dont think i explained fully, the extra clothes were for when they stayed with us for a prolonged period of time, not just a couple hours but overnight etc.

imho there is not much difference between a belt buckle and a magazine. its a symbol and logo for something our family does not agree with.

we try to raise our children a certain way and keep certain things out of our home, no matter how strange or rude it may seem...

sorry


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joesmom*
I completely agree with this. I can't think of a situation where I'd feel comfortable asking someone in my home to change clothes- well, my nephews after they play with the hose in the middle of winter, maybe...







Asking her to remove a belt because of the bunny buckle- seems counter productive to me. She will tell her mom, etc...


Children in my home MUST be dressed appropriately. But I have a home daycare. I do not allow revealing or sexy clothing.


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## joesmom (Nov 19, 2001)

How many of your daycare kids would WEAR clothes that are sexy or revealing, though??


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Quote:

I was equating early sex to being traumatic 'like' rape because when you are that young you really aren't ready mentally/emotionally and can be 'talked into' it so easily that later you might feel that it wasn't what you wanted but didn't know how to get out of the situation. You feel trapped and feel that you have to go through with it.

ok but not all teen sex is like that. In fact I don't think that most is like that. Yes it happens. The way for it not to happen is to raise a child to believe that what they think and feel is important. Scare tactics aren't the way to teach that lesson.

Pesonally I think you are out of line, even if you have good intentions. From what you have posted the mom gave you the ok "a long time ago" that sounds like she gave you some general ok to talk to her daughter but it wasn't anytime recently. I'm not sure that the mom fully knows what you plan to talk to her daughter about, now.


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## MamaTaraX (Oct 5, 2004)

haven't read comments, just discovered this forum








This wouldn't bug me. HOwever, my husband has been a Playboy collector for overa decade, so I have a slightly different take on Playboy than most.
nifty forum.
Namaste, Tara


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## Shann (Dec 19, 2003)

I personally don't see anything wrong with a 12 y/o wearing a Playboy rabbit head! It's an image! I think this is overreaction.


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## newmomtoteen (May 1, 2006)

h


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joesmom*
How many of your daycare kids would WEAR clothes that are sexy or revealing, though??

I've sent MANY girls home in the begining. Tight short shorts with the curve of their butt cheeks showing if they even bend over a teensy bit, short navel shirts, high heeled sandles. Though the shoe part of my dress code is more for safety, kids can't run and play in 3 inch heels. There is a little girl that is 4 1/2, been here since she was 18 months old, and for the first 2 years it was a constant fight with her mother. I eventually bought some used ultra baggy sweats and put her daughter in them at my house. Mom finally decided she'd rather her daughter look cute in public than wear my sweats and started dressing her appropriately. This little girl even has knockers (pony tail holders with big beads) that say SEXY on them. I've had this problem with many many parents.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shann*
I personally don't see anything wrong with a 12 y/o wearing a Playboy rabbit head! It's an image! I think this is overreaction.


It is just an image if you were to live in another country where no one has ever seen it. In America, its a symbol.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

You send your daycare kids home for not having "acceptable" clothes according your standard, um ok.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
You send your daycare kids home for not having "acceptable" clothes according your standard, um ok.

I have to ask, does Moondiapers not have the right since it is her business? Also, can I assume you think its ok for pre-school children to wear things that say "sexy" and have their bits-and pieces showing? To do so puts alot of unwanted attention on a child. Sex is for consenting adults-not to be associated with children- nor should a child be inspiring thoughts of it...all politically correct arguments aside.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

you can assume anything you want, that doesn't make it accurate though.

As far as rights, I'm not arguing rights. I don't agree with sending preschoolers home from a home day care because of what the parents chose to dress them in though. And did you see anyone here advocating that preschoolers should be having sex? Your comment is truly mind blowing that you would even entertain the idea that anyone here would advocate that preschoolers should be having sex.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *smsipp*
nor should a child be inspiring thoughts of it...all politically correct arguments aside.

one more thing, your comment above smacks of blaming the victim. Children do not "inspire" thoughts of sex based on their clothes. Especially offensive in light of the fact that your post was talking about preschoolers. Pedophiles are sick individuals and to attempt to blame the victims of child molestation based on the clothes that their parents may have dressed them in is soo offensive that what I want to say would be against the UA fo this board.

I suppose you also blame rape victims for getting raped too since they "asked for it" for dressing sexy.


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## sphinx (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *smsipp*
...and have their bits-and pieces showing? To do so puts alot of unwanted attention on a child.

I'm confused... I think it's extremely distasteful for a young child to dress like a pop singer (i think it's usually distasteful for the pop singers too







) - but does it primarily bring unwanted attention to the child, or is it just that fearful or suspicious thoughts creep into the _adults'_ tainted minds -- do the kids themselves have a concept that the clothes are considered "sexy"? Do most adults see these clothes & the children in them as "sexy"? I guess I just don't look at naked little kids or preschoolers with "revealing" clothing and think of them in sexual terms or as manifesting "sexuality" in the way we think of adult sexuality. I think the playboy bunny is ugly, and that aunts should tread carefully when talking about sensitive topics, but i'm just wondering out loud about this idea of tiny people as overtly sexual.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sphinx*
I'm confused... I think it's extremely distasteful for a young child to dress like a pop singer (i think it's usually distasteful for the pop singers too







) - but does it primarily bring unwanted attention to the child, or is it just that fearful or suspicious thoughts creep into the _adults'_ tainted minds -- do the kids themselves have a concept that the clothes are considered "sexy"? Do most adults see these clothes & the children in them as "sexy"? I guess I just don't look at naked little kids or preschoolers with "revealing" clothing and think of them in sexual terms or as manifesting "sexuality" in the way we think of adult sexuality. I think the playboy bunny is ugly, and that aunts should tread carefully when talking about sensitive topics, but i'm just wondering out loud about this idea of tiny people as overtly sexual.

Ok, that was my point exactly. I quoted Arduinna (who has an amazing ability to twist words) who questioned Moondiapers reasons to send a child home from her daycare because she was dressed inappropriately. No, I dont think its a childs fault if she gets molested by the way she is dressed. But in todays SICK world- if I owned a daycare where a parent brought in a child with earrings that said sexy and clothing that showed her behind, etc then I would not only question the parent (and what was going on in their head) but also send them home before they stepped foot in my house. What does the description "sexy" mean? I dont want that word anywhere near my child- AND WHY WOULD YOU PUT IT ON YOUR PRESCHOOLER? No, most adults (thank God) would not see a child as sexy, but I am *scared to death* of the ones who would -therefore I question it. Arduinna, your comment on Moondiapers reasons for sending a child home sounded like you were saying you did not agree with it. My comment was questioning your comment. I thought this was a place of discussion. And did I say someone was advocating that pre-schooolers have sex? *Please*- before you put words in my mouth, read what I wrote, at least quote it, my gosh. You have offended me to the core!!!


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## Yoshua (Jan 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
one more thing, your comment above smacks of blaming the victim. Children do not "inspire" thoughts of sex based on their clothes. Especially offensive in light of the fact that your post was talking about preschoolers. Pedophiles are sick individuals and to attempt to blame the victims of child molestation based on the clothes that their parents may have dressed them in is soo offensive that what I want to say would be against the UA fo this board.

I suppose you also blame rape victims for getting raped too since they "asked for it" for dressing sexy.










couldnt agree with your 2 posts more..... putting blame on a victim no matter what your reasons is wrong.

I am sorry, if I see a playboy bunny on a kid my first instinct is to chuckle, the second is to forget about it coz it doesnt really phase me..... no sexual thoughts.... you may say to yourself

'but sir! you are a man! you see a bunny you must think of sex!.....'

But the reality is I see a child, usually I see their smiles first and clothes second. I do not see a sexual object.

Oh, and btw.... sexual predetors could care less about what a child is wearing and more about how close the nearest parent is......

As for weather I think a kid 'should' wear a bunny, or if a kid wearing it should be chastised in any way. That is up to the kid for the most part, as long as there is no words that I don't agree with, then the image itself I could care less about.....

i bow out now. nothing to really add to the conversation, but personally I wouldn't make a child feel bad about what they choose to wear. if my kid decides he likes trench coats i am not going to automatically assume he is in the market for a gun.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

I suppose you also blame rape victims for getting raped too since they "asked for it" for dressing sexy.







[/QUOTE] You put more words into my mouth!!!


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
you can assume anything you want, that doesn't make it accurate though.

As far as rights, I'm not arguing rights. I don't agree with sending preschoolers home from a home day care because of what the parents chose to dress them in though. And did you see anyone here advocating that preschoolers should be having sex? Your comment is truly mind blowing that you would even entertain the idea that anyone here would advocate that preschoolers should be having sex.

WOW! I said nothing of the sort!!!! This is amazing! I apparently am in the wrong board if a parent would let their kid where a playboy bunny out in the world. All I wanted to do was share my opionion. Wow..Yes, I first see their smiles too, but I dont want anyone to see that symbol on my innocent little girl. You all have officially kicked me out of this argument.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *smsipp*
can I assume you think its ok for pre-school children to wear things that say "sexy" and have their bits-and pieces showing? To do so puts alot of unwanted attention on a child. Sex is for consenting adults-not to be associated with children- nor should a child be inspiring thoughts of it...all politically correct arguments aside.

I already quoted part of this in my previous post. You are the one that mentioned preschoolers and sexy clothes and inspiring thoughts as a result.

Which is exactly what my post was referring to. Not sure how I supposedly twisted your words. They look pretty clear to me.


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## Yoshua (Jan 5, 2006)

hey people, seems a lil heated, might be wiser to step away from the thread and let it kool down a bit.

not saying just sayin.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Yoshua, you are right. I can see what I said that was wrong and pushed some buttons. I will try to be the adult I am teaching my child to be! I dont retract my opinion in the slightest. BUT between the 2 comments I should have added:
"can I assume you think its ok for pre-school children to wear things that say "sexy" and have their bits-and pieces showing?" *If I am wrong in this assumption I apologize. I feel wearing this type of clothing* "puts alot of unwanted attention on a child."
So- sorry for offending anyone, it wasnt my intention. I simply wanted to jump in the discussion. Sorry Arduinna for stepping on toes.


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## smsipp (Apr 14, 2006)

Funny enough, I dont know how I got routed to this discussion!!!!I apologize- I am new....


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

You didn't step on my toes, I was just shocked at what I read. I'm glad to know that you didn't mean it the way it came out.

And FTR I don't necessarily agree with playboy bunny icons on kids. But I also wouldn't send kids home from my house because of it, nor would I make them change their clothes. My dd is a teenager and her friends have come over at times in things that to me weren't best choice of clothing. But I'm not their parents. And my daughter knows that different families have different rules and beliefs. I'd surely not shame a child by sending them home.


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
you can assume anything you want, that doesn't make it accurate though.

As far as rights, I'm not arguing rights. I don't agree with sending preschoolers home from a home day care because of what the parents chose to dress them in though. And did you see anyone here advocating that preschoolers should be having sex? Your comment is truly mind blowing that you would even entertain the idea that anyone here would advocate that preschoolers should be having sex.

The parents sign a contract agreeing to my dress code when they sign up with my daycare. It comes down to what I'm willing to allow in my home. I don't let the children watch sexy television shows, I don't want my children constantly exposed to it first hand either. Their home should be a haven, a place that is safe for them, with safe experiences and influences. They see enough revealing clothing out in the real world, they don't need it at home too.


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
You didn't step on my toes, I was just shocked at what I read. I'm glad to know that you didn't mean it the way it came out.

And FTR I don't necessarily agree with playboy bunny icons on kids. But I also wouldn't send kids home from my house because of it, nor would I make them change their clothes. My dd is a teenager and her friends have come over at times in things that to me weren't best choice of clothing. But I'm not their parents. And my daughter knows that different families have different rules and beliefs. I'd surely not shame a child by sending them home.

I think the difference is that your daughter's friends are guests, and the children that come to my home are here to learn from me and be taken care of by me. Most of them are with me for more waking hours than they are with their parents. They also aren't all preschoolers. I have children from 6 months to 10 years currently enrolled. My daycare program is educational, I teach kindergarten readiness, and as a privte educational program, I share my values with the children here.


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## Nursing_Nate (May 6, 2005)

thanks for all the advice and help on my issue...sorry all the other 'heat' entered in on this thread. I think I'll just do as one momma suggested and be a positive aunt and subliminally get her thinking of herself as worthy in other areas of her life


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

moondiapers, you are clearly doing what you want to with regards to your daycare. But the fact that people pay you does not change my opinion. So I guess we will have to agree to disagree.


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
moondiapers, you are clearly doing what you want to with regards to your daycare. But the fact that people pay you does not change my opinion. So I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

Even though they read my contract and agree to my terms? They don't have to sign it or use my services. There are lots of childcare providers in my town. You don't have to agree with me, but it would be nice if you could understand. My dress code is a lot more lenient than the local schools. I just don't want the kids going around showing off the parts that would normally be covered by a bathing suit KWIM? I only require that butt cheeks not hang out of shorts or bellies out of shirts, lol. The schools require that shorts be almost to the knees and don't allow belly shirts AT ALL, they don't even wants bellies to show when the kids raise their arms up in the air. I also require bike shorts or reg. shorts under skirts if the girls want to hang upside down from the monkey bars. I do keep extras of these on hand for girls who forget to wear them, then want to hang upside down.

The great thing about being in business for myself and working at home is that I get to set the rules and decide what I allow in my home. This is why we were homeschoolers until recently too, and why I stayed home with my children, so that they could learn our family values and morals before being sent out into the world. I want children to come dressed appropriate for the weather, and come dressed appropriately to roll around in the grass and play, finger paint, ride trikes, bake, make mud pies etc. without showing off their bits.

I guess my point is, when you choose a private school you choose one that's in keeping with your beliefs. Home daycare is a type of private school. I don't let babies cry, I love it when parents want me to use cloth diapers, I welcome breastfeeding moms with open arms, I don't plop children down in front of the TV.....and I require modesty in children past potty learning. Parent's know ALL of this before choosing me. I feel it's disrespectful to sign my contract, agree to it, know my rules about modesty, and STILL bring children dressed with their bits hanging out. It's breaking the contract. If they don't agree with the way I do things they shouldn't bring their kids to me.


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## joesmom (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moondiapers*
I want children to come dressed appropriate for the weather, and come dressed appropriately to roll around in the grass and play, finger paint, ride trikes, bake, make mud pies etc. without showing off their bits.

I can't imagine kids young enough to ride trikes & make mud pies even wearing clothes that show off their "bits." It just seems so unlikely to me...


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## Proud Wife And Mom (May 3, 2006)

I hate the way some people let their kids dress these days,







:


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## moondiapers (Apr 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *joesmom*
I can't imagine kids young enough to ride trikes & make mud pies even wearing clothes that show off their "bits." It just seems so unlikely to me...

I've had it happen quite a few times, it's the reason I even have a dress code. Everything in my contract or parent handbook is there because someone's done it, lol. It used to only be one page. I really don't get the 3 inch high heeled flip flop craze either







: What 3yo can run and play in those things? Not a single one that's come to my house, they all go home with scabbed toes and knees.....so now I ask parents to either send them in athletic shoes or to leave a pair here that they can change into.


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## angelpie545 (Feb 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna*
ok but not all teen sex is like that. In fact I don't think that most is like that. Yes it happens. The way for it not to happen is to raise a child to believe that what they think and feel is important. Scare tactics aren't the way to teach that lesson.

Pesonally I think you are out of line, even if you have good intentions. From what you have posted the mom gave you the ok "a long time ago" that sounds like she gave you some general ok to talk to her daughter but it wasn't anytime recently. I'm not sure that the mom fully knows what you plan to talk to her daughter about, now.

I agree with this. Not all teen sex is like that, in fact, most isn't. Most teens are simply *horny* if you will. The problem lies when we do not prepare our sons and daughters for the feelings that they will have, and educate them about sex. Yes, I feel it is important for them to learn that it is better wait, however, we have to be realistic about the fact that most won't. I think it's ideal to give them pros and cons, realistic pros and cons(i.e. not influenced by your own feelings), about waiting and not waiting. It is also absolutely essential that we instill healthy self-esteem in our girls, and let them know it is okay to say no, and to be aware that some boys will try to guilt trip them into sex, and prepare them for this. It is our responsiblity as parents to also educate our boys about how to treat girls, and to instill in their minds it is NEVER okay to force anyone to do anything sexual against their will.

My parents were very conservative, and the only thing they taught me about sex was not to do it. Everything I heard about sex was negative. It hurts, boys will talk you into it, nice girls don't have sex. I was not allowed to talk to boys on the phone, or to have them over at my house, nothing. I couldn't even associate with them in a group of friends. My parents did not trust me at all, never. They didn't even give me a chance. I was told to abstain and that's it. Where did that get me? Well, at first I was afraid of boys, and couldn't talk to them. Finally, when I got over that, all I could think of was sex, and couldn't talk to anyone about it. So I had sex, and I liked it, but when I told my mom, she started crying and said, you've been taken advantage of! I told her no, that I wanted it, and I DID NOT get taken advantage of. She then thought I was a slut, cause "nice girls didn't have sex". I got pregnant at 17 and was thrown out of the house. My mom wanted me to give up my child. I was lucky that one of my friends moms took me in. I rented a room from them, worked my butt off, and gave birth to a healthy baby girl. I had a good job, and saved my money. I was and still am a darn good mother. Just because you have a baby out of wedlock does not mean you have to live on the dregs of society. Instead of alienating me, my parents could have been more supportive and things would have been much less strained.

I'm sorry, I've gone on and on about this, and I didn't mean to. This is simply a subject I feel so strongly about. As far as the playboy bunny on the 12 year old, I think the belt buckle is okay, but anything more, like on a shirt or something, questionable.


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## IchelA (May 6, 2006)

WOW - this one got heated!
i don't have time to read it all. I am the parent of a 13 year old & my daughter comes home all the time & tells me about who is pregnant at her middle school or who was being talked about for giving oral sex, etc.

Auntie - invite your neice over to have one on one sex talk ASAP! Believe me, she already knows what it is so you can skep the basics & get right to the morals & evils in the world. Encourage her to believe in herself, show her the "other side of life" - not public housing & how hard it is for young moms, who 9 times out of 10 end up being single moms. Show her the alternatives in life besides being stuck in the projects full of negativity. There is a whole world out there waiting to explore & if she is strong & confident she can do anything SHE wants, & not fail as she is expected to do (by society & family?).









empower her!


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## Yoshua (Jan 5, 2006)

.... i don't want to hi-jack.....

i have not so good things to say. not to the OP.... not to anyone SPECIFIC....

but just..... sex is not morally wrong, teens will experiament no matter what you say or do, and acting as though they should abstain not only goes against human nature, it causes them to go introvert for fear of being yelled at when they actually do go through with the act.

A bunny is one thing.... have a sex talk is completely different.... I can see how a bunny 'can' offend someone and imply that someone supports an industry that not everyone does.

But talking about how morals and evils collide with a healthy sexual and monogomous relationship is beyond me.....


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## MissAbbyRosesMamma (Apr 28, 2006)

i agree with angelpie545...not really sure what having a child out of wedlock has to do with ANYTHING! my beautiful baby girl is sleeping in the next room over and regardless of the fact that i am not married she is happy, healthy, fed, clothed, has a roof over her head, and not counting when shes seriously drooling, is clean and dry.

i never wore the bunny, i never had open parents, i never had any talks with anyone until AFTER i got pregnant but it was a choice i made to open my legs-sorry for the harsh wording! but its true. talk all you want and be a supportive aunt because shell need it! i didnt know how many supportive aunts and uncles i had that i could talk to about ANYTHING until i was pregnant. not that i think it would change things, looking back, but it would have made my life a whole lot easier, in a lot of ways, not just sex related


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

You have got to be kidding me. Yes I wasn't married when I had my dd at the age of 25, by choice. Yes I did have some times of struggle, but we don't need to demonize people that took public assistance and i can't even believe someone used the term "the projects" here as if having sex w/o being married = a life of poverty.


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## mommy68 (Mar 13, 2006)

I feel that whatever you think is what you think but you can't push that on her. She isn't your child so it's none of your business. If you want to try and tell her what is right as far as sex goes then do it but you can't expect her to listen to you if her own mother doesn't care.

It's sad too because teenagers are already in the peer pressure and under so much stress to have sex early on and having a parent that could care less about them makes it so much easier to make that choice at a young age.


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## AlexsMom (Jun 3, 2006)

Wow! you got all that out of a bunny on a belt buckle?

OK on the one hand you could tell her that the symbol on her belt is the logo of a magzine that could be like wearing a sign that says "slut"

on the other hand she may just view it as a feminine looking motif without really understanding where it came from.

If you wish to embarass her go ahead and point out what it really means and by all means do it in front of others. but if you want to do the right thing, whisper in her ear and explain what the logo really means and let her decide what to do.

I have a feeling either way she may rethink her wardrobe. If not then perhaps it is already too late. Ultimately it is between her and her mother.


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