# is itnormal for a 14 year old boy who gets plenty of sleep to be tired most of the time?



## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

He wakes up tired and often has coffee (I let him as we don't medicate his ADD and it seems to help). Then he plays some video games (20 minute limit until he has equal time playing outdoors, doing chores, or getting exercise, then he can have a minute of screen time for every minute of exercise or chores). Then he gets started with work and usually goes at his chores and schoolwork pretty well and then he just wants to lay around the rest of the day. Often he'll even tell friends he doesn't want to play, because he'd rather lay around and read or listen to books on cd.

We've talked about getting him into a sport but none interest him, and they are expensive to join. I've asked him for more ideas and the screen-time equivelency is all we've come up with. A lot of time his exercise is just walking the dog, or doing exercises with wii fit.

I sure would welcome any input on how to help him be healthier. He eats pretty well, but craves sugar and eats as much of it as he can find. We were at a restaurant with my parents last night and he had a large hot chocolate and a lemonade, and barely touched his nutritious meal. This is not atypical of my guy.

-Dancy


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Are you sure he's actually tired, rather than just wanting to read?


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## AtYourCervices (Feb 22, 2009)

Besides the tiredness is he having other symptoms? Is he achey?

Two thoughts came to mind: Mono or Lyme Disease

You have a dog, which could bring in ticks from a walk. Lyme Disease causes tiredness & depression. Also, Lyme Disease can mimic ADD.

Good luck!


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## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MusicianDad*
> 
> Are you sure he's actually tired, rather than just wanting to read?


He says he's tired often. And in a way, this has been going on for years. If I let him, he would spend most of his time playing video games. I remember his kindergarten teacher saying that he doesn't have a lot of muscle tone - that he felt "floppy" like a rag doll, and he always did poorly on those fitness tests in school. (He's homeschooling this year only.)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AtYourCervices*
> 
> Besides the tiredness is he having other symptoms? Is he achey?
> 
> ...


He doesn't complain about aches, although I could ask. Lyme is a scary thought, because I'm not sure how one would determine that or treat it after all this time. It's been going on too long to be mono, I think, and when I asked a dr. to test for it, he said there was no reason to because there was nothing they could do to treat it. Do you know whether one can test for Lyme and if so can it be treated after a long time?

I have to say, I am feeling rather desperate for support with this kid because I love him so much and I so want to do right by him, and the people around me don't like the low-key way I raise - giving him too much freedom for some people's taste, and demanding too much of him for other people's. I don't feel I can talk to anyone anymore about my concerns so I am grateful to be able to get some feedback here. Thank you.

-Dancy


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## mirlee (Jul 30, 2002)

Have you thought about Depression? I would seek a counselor who specializes in working with Teens. Maybe there is something else going on.


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## whatsnextmom (Apr 2, 2010)

How much is "plenty of sleep?" Teens are supposed to get about 10 hours a night but I don't know any that actually do. I found out my 13-year-old was staying up late texting and on facebook. Even if she went to sleep initially at 9, her friends were texting her until 1 and she'd wake up to respond thinking all that broken sleep was the same as actually sleeping through the night. Basically, she was denying herself REM sleep and that is what you can't live without. I now have her put her computer and phone outside her door at 10pm each night and things are better. She's still has days she just drags. She has to get up at 5:30 for school... I'd have to put her to bed at 7:30 or 8 for her to truely get enough sleep. That's just not realistic at all unfortunately. So on weekends, she'll sleep 12 hours a night and I allow it.

Sports are the only activities for boys. Do you guys have any sort of interest based clubs in your area? Model trains or something like that? How about leaning tech at a local youth or community theatre? Lots of teens get really into that.

Depression can display itself as exhaustion but like I said, the teens we know are generally exhausted. It's also not unusual for a teen to want to lounge around. My kids are in school so that's not much a possibility during the school year but on breaks, they do sit around reading, on the computer, turning down social outings because they want to veg.


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## 34me (Oct 2, 2006)

Do you know that when he sleeps he is getting good quality sleep? Does he snore at all? Kiddos with sleep apnea often have symptoms of ADD and are tired an awful lot.


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## AtYourCervices (Feb 22, 2009)

Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The tests for Lyme Disease are highly inaccurate, especially if you have a case that's gone untreated for a long time.. There's a huge controversy regarding the proper treatment for long term Lyme Disease, too, so even if he does have that you may have difficulty finding somebody who would treat it properly (IV antibiotics for at least a few months).

I'd suggest you look up the symptoms of Lyme Disease, and if his symptoms match up, try to find a Lyme Literate Doctor. They may even treat him for Lyme Disease based on symptoms alone. Warning, though, if it is Lyme Disease his symptoms will become even more severe during the first few weeks of treatment. That is an expected reaction and would verify that it is Lyme Disease.

Even if you don't recall having seen a bullseye rash on him, that doesn't mean he doesn't have it. Not everybody gets the rash. I never did.

http://library.lymenet.org/domino/file.nsf/bbf2f15334c1f28585256613000317cc/eee9f15bfb66a105852567c700120022?OpenDocument

I have late stage Lyme Disease, untreated. I consider myself "in remission" right now because I'm not nearly as bad as I once was. I still have some of the symptoms, though. I know that the Lyme could come back with a vengeance at any time, though. Currently my symptoms include:


occasional pain, difficulty chewing
hearing loss (and oddly occasional sensitivity to noise)
occasional light sensitivity
sore throat, swollen glands
headaches, petit mal seizures, I've had meningitis twice, stiff neck, burning, tingling & prickling sensations, hyperreflexes, loss of coordation, MS like syndrome
Occasional nausea & vomiting
Weakness, dizziness, irregular heartbeat, palpitations, fainting,
Muscle & joint pain/inflammation
Mood swings, irritability, poor concentration, cognitive loss, memory loss, depression, disorientation, sleep disturbances
Rashes

Wow. Typing that all out it seems like a lot! Though at one time I experienced all those symptoms at the same time, and the symptoms were intense, now I'm able to live with it. You get used to it after awhile, and it just becomes how life is. If I got sick when I was really young, I would have probably thought this is normal to feel like crud all the time. I mean, I can function right now, so I'm not really sick, right? I don't experience all those symptoms at the same time now. Right now my main complaints are a sore throat, swollen glands (which could just be a cold but it's been going on for a month), headaches, tingling & prickling sensations, weakness, joint/muscle pain, and all of the neuropsychiatric symptoms. I've found some over the counter medicated creams that gets rid of the rashes. But the symptoms aren't really bad right now. The symptoms are quite mild and I can ignore it for the most part. Looking at me, you wouldn't realize I was sick. I don't think either of us would realize I was still sick unless I was prodded to tell you what symptoms I experience. Until I wrote this out, I figured I was a-okay. Typing out my symptoms, though, I know I'm still sick. Just because I'm not as bad off as I once was doesn't mean I'm cured.

See, that can be the problem with late stage Lyme Disease. He might not even realize he has these symptoms unless you ask him. His symptoms may be so mild, or he could be used to it, that he doesn't even know anything is wrong.


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## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mirlee*
> 
> Have you thought about Depression? I would seek a counselor who specializes in working with Teens. Maybe there is something else going on.


I think this is possible but I'm not willing to go there yet. There are other things that make me think this is not depression, thank G-d. I do appreciate the input, though.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *whatsnextmom*
> 
> How much is "plenty of sleep?" Teens are supposed to get about 10 hours a night but I don't know any that actually do. I found out my 13-year-old was staying up late texting and on facebook. Even if she went to sleep initially at 9, her friends were texting her until 1 and she'd wake up to respond thinking all that broken sleep was the same as actually sleeping through the night. Basically, she was denying herself REM sleep and that is what you can't live without. I now have her put her computer and phone outside her door at 10pm each night and things are better. She's still has days she just drags. She has to get up at 5:30 for school... I'd have to put her to bed at 7:30 or 8 for her to truely get enough sleep. That's just not realistic at all unfortunately. So on weekends, she'll sleep 12 hours a night and I allow it.
> 
> ...


whatsnextmom, this is a good reality check and I appreciate it. He does not go to sleep right away, although he has less trouble lately because a doctor recommended melatonin, and he's finding it really helps. I make him leave his i-pod away from his room at night, but I do let him listen to books on tape/cd at night since he really find them helpful for falling asleep or back to sleep. Thanks for the activities ideas too - they are great.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *34me*
> 
> Do you know that when he sleeps he is getting good quality sleep? Does he snore at all? Kiddos with sleep apnea often have symptoms of ADD and are tired an awful lot.


This is a really helpful suggestion also! Thank you for posting it. I will check with his roomie (older bro.).

AtYourCervices, we had a friend who had to have the intravenous antibiotics - what a difficult disease. My heart goes out to you for what you are living with. (I can see how you can go forward not even realizing how much impact it's having on your life until you write it down.) I talked it over with ds and heand I don't think he has Lyme, thank G-d., although it is something to be aware of and I appreciate the info.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AtYourCervices*
> 
> Quote:
> The tests for Lyme Disease are highly inaccurate, especially if you have a case that's gone untreated for a long time.. There's a huge controversy regarding the proper treatment for long term Lyme Disease, too, so even if he does have that you may have difficulty finding somebody who would treat it properly (IV antibiotics for at least a few months).
> ...


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## purslaine (Feb 20, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *whatsnextmom*
> 
> Sports are the only activities for boys. Do you guys have any sort of interest based clubs in your area? Model trains or something like that? How about leaning tech at a local youth or community theatre? Lots of teens get really into that.


My son takes drama. Following any passion helps.

I would encourage him to go out with his friends, though, or let them in to play video games. Socially isolating himself is not good. It can be hard, because vegging is easy and habit forming, but somewhat habit forming, so he should be encouraged to get out and about. I would talk to him about balance and how friendships have to be nurtured to thrive.

Good luck,

Kathy


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## Marsupialmom (Sep 28, 2003)

I agree with you finding activities HE LIKES verses what he is suppose to like. Not all boys are into sports. At this age this can create emotional issues because there is sooo much pressure to be.

I would get his thyroid check.


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## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kathymuggle*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


Kathy, I like your idea about talking to him about friendships needing to be nurtured. I have tried to get him to think about and say what his interests are, and he doesn't have many past video games, humorous movies, and exciting stories. He does like to write a lot so he does some of that every week day.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marsupialmom*
> 
> I agree with you finding activities HE LIKES verses what he is suppose to like. Not all boys are into sports. At this age this can create emotional issues because there is sooo much pressure to be.
> 
> I would get his thyroid check.


I think a thyroid check is a good idea - thank you. I don't think ds feels a lot of pressure to be in sports - certainly not from his family, except to the extent that we'd like him to find something that he can really enjoy and get exercise at the same time.


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## sewchris2642 (Feb 28, 2009)

Along with a thyroid check, have the dr check his iron as well. Low iron can also cause tiredness. Teens biological clock is also off-set so while they need up to 9 hours of sleep a night, it starts around 11 pm to midnight and goes to 8-9 am the next day. http://kidshealth.org/teen/your_body/take_care/how_much_sleep.html Try other group activities, not just sports. Chess club, CCG groups, teen reading clubs at the library, etc. Since he craves sweets, have that checked out as well by the dr.


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## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sewchris2642*
> 
> Along with a thyroid check, have the dr check his iron as well. Low iron can also cause tiredness. Teens biological clock is also off-set so while they need up to 9 hours of sleep a night, it starts around 11 pm to midnight and goes to 8-9 am the next day. http://kidshealth.org/teen/your_body/take_care/how_much_sleep.html Try other group activities, not just sports. Chess club, CCG groups, teen reading clubs at the library, etc. Since he craves sweets, have that checked out as well by the dr.


Chris, thank you for these ideas. Any idea what I'd ask the dr. to check for re: craving sweets?

Also, looking at your signature, I'm wondering what AP-ing and CLW are?

-Dancy


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## sewchris2642 (Feb 28, 2009)

Off the top of my head--hypoglycemia and diabetes. http://www.ehow.com/facts_5151409_hypoglycemia-children.html All of my kids are hypoglycemic (not diabetic) and so is at least one of my grandkids.

AP= Attachment Parenting

CLW=Child Led Weaning


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## 122320 (Oct 13, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sewchris2642*
> 
> Off the top of my head--hypoglycemia and diabetes. http://www.ehow.com/facts_5151409_hypoglycemia-children.html All of my kids are hypoglycemic (not diabetic) and so is at least one of my grandkids.
> 
> ...


o.k. - thank you! And now I get AP and CLW - I was definitely an attachment parent also - so sweet. I miss having a little one falling asleep with his cheek against my neck! Now with a 14 and 17 year old, I'm a "letting them go on their lead, trying not to hold them back for my own selfish love of their company!" parent.


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