# Other people spanking my kid



## LoveMyTwoBoys (Dec 14, 2007)

How do I handle this one? My sister has spanked my son on various occasions when I wasn't around. Tonight, my mom threatened to "spank his bare butt" if he jumped off the couch towards the dogs again. She got so mad at him. She has always let him jump off the couch at her house and this evening he got too close to one of her Pomeranians. Well, put the dog in the kitchen when we are there. Not that hard to avoid the conflict.

She has also been yelling at him when he messes with her Christmas tree and presents. Well, just don't put it up so early and wait until the night before to put out presents. They don't understand GD and aren't very open to new things.

DS is 2.75 and very spirited. They are going to break him down if they treat him like that. I hate leaving him there but sometimes I just need to. DH lives 70 miles away and once & a while I need to get something done (still have DS2 to care for even when DS1 is gone). Should I just really not let them keep him anymore? He is such a different kid there than he is at home. I love my family and do need their help. How should I handle this one?


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## LianneM (May 26, 2004)

oh my







I'm sorry, I would not let them keep him EVER without you there. I mean, really, if they are not willing to treat him respectfully as you would, there's no way. That is just awful, I am so sorry for you and your poor DS


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## mysticmomma (Feb 8, 2005)

"the next time you hit my child, I will be calling the cops and pressing charges for assault."

And no... do not leave him alone with them.


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## Kessed (Nov 28, 2007)

I would NEVER leave my child with someone who even thought that spanking was OK.

I would file assult charges against anyone who layed a hand on my child.

There is a HUGE difference between a parent deciding to spank their own child - and somene else doing it. Neither your sister or your mother have any business spanking your child.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kessed* 
I would NEVER leave my child with someone who even thought that spanking was OK.

I would file assult charges against anyone who layed a hand on my child.

There is a HUGE difference between a parent deciding to spank their own child - and somene else doing it. Neither your sister or your mother have any business spanking your child.









:

It is simply not acceptable. Anyone who would consider hitting my child is not a qualified caregiver.

-Angela


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## allgirls (Apr 16, 2004)

I agree with Angela..and while it is legal in most places for a parent to spank a child it's not legal for anyone else to do so.

If someone laid a hand on my child...

The thought has me livid...

probably shouldn't say anymore


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## onthemove (Aug 5, 2004)

wow! I would be so hurt and angry! My sister called me once and told me my mom and my step father thought that my youngest dd needed a spanking and I haven't left her alone with them since and that was well over a year ago. I am so sorry if this is your support system, I wish you the best.


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## Genesis (Jan 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mysticmomma* 
"the next time you hit my child, I will be calling the cops and pressing charges for assault."

And no... do not leave him alone with them.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kessed* 
I would NEVER leave my child with someone who even thought that spanking was OK.

I would file assult charges against anyone who layed a hand on my child.

There is a HUGE difference between a parent deciding to spank their own child - and somene else doing it. Neither your sister or your mother have any business spanking your child.


a big







: to both!!!! please protect your child from these people.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Yes I wouldn't allow them to care for him or have contact with him unless I was present and additionally I'd flat out tell anyone that threatens to hit my child that that won't be happening. Period. And I'd tell that to my child in front of the person too.

I had to do similar with my mom although not regarding hitting, my mom never threatened to hit dd. She has tried to manipulate her though in front of me and I nipped that right in the bud.

My dd knows in no uncertain terms that no one has the right to hit her and she isn't expected to just blindly do what anyone says.


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## yarngoddess (Dec 27, 2006)

While I agree with the PP, the reality of this situation is that the OP needs, NEEDS these people. I think that you need to tell them in no uncertain terms that they are to NEVER hit, or threaten to hit your children again. NEVER. They need to understand that you are the mom, and that they must abide by your rules, or face dire consequences. And you must be willing to follow through with what you say will happen.

Having been apart from mr DH on many occasions I REALLY feel for you, however you have to be strong for your DS's. These things will have a PERMANANT effect, and regardless of the reality of the situation, you must do whatever it takes to protect your children.


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## allgirls (Apr 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *yarngoddess* 
While I agree with the PP, the reality of this situation is that the OP needs, NEEDS these people. I think that you need to tell them in no uncertain terms that they are to NEVER hit, or threaten to hit your children again. NEVER. They need to understand that you are the mom, and that they must abide by your rules, or face dire consequences. And you must be willing to follow through with what you say will happen.

Having been apart from mr DH on many occasions I REALLY feel for you, however you have to be strong for your DS's. These things will have a PERMANANT effect, and regardless of the reality of the situation, you must do whatever it takes to protect your children.


I wonder..I think there may be a different solution..maybe she needs help but maybe they can do something for her instead of actually taking care of the kids so she can do it.

My dh is a long haul truck driver, gone night and day for up to 2 weeks at a time, then home for a weekend maybe..I have 4 kids....someone has to go to emergency, we all go, someone has to go to the dentist, we all go.

It would be nice to be able to have help with these things...if I had help I would take it. It would make things so much easier for me.

But I would never leave my kids alone with someone who might assault them.

I guess the only way would be if I ended up in the hospital and had no say in who had them.

There are usually options..I don't know what they are in the OP's situation but if it's a "need" vs it's just "easier" to leave them with these people I would be curious as to what that "need" is. Because I can't imagine it myself.


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## tubulidentata2 (Aug 6, 2006)

I agree that this is not a safe environment for your DS. You say you need this family in your life. How do you think they would handle it if you confronted them about this issue? Perhaps you could explain that you know they love your DS and only want the best for him, but that he is your child and you make the decisions in how he is disciplined, whether in your home or theirs. You could let them know that you feel incredibly sad about what has happened to DS, and that he will not be visiting unattended anymore. However, you could let them know that you would be willing to discuss with them why you feel spanking is so harmful to DS, and if they are open-minded, even offer to supply them with some reading material on alternative ways of handling him.

I say this because, before having a child, I was *very* far from AP-leaning. I thought children should be controlled just for the sake of "putting them in their place". Then my baby was born, and the first question I asked was, "what age is too old for spoiling, because I don't want to stop!" I embraced attachment parenting, gentle discipline, and recently, non-coercive parenting. I am so thankful that I never followed my planned path!! I am happy to be stopping the bad cycle that started a few generations back in our family.

I don't know your family, but I know that I would want a chance to learn from my mistakes and change. Of course, you would need to approach them gently if you hope for them to be open-minded. This may take some skill!

Perhaps they would be open to reading Connection Parenting. I think it is a good book that says, "this is how we should treat children, but this is how we were likely to treat children due to our culture, and we shouldn't feel guilty about what we did before we knew a better way." My mother and I have discussed this book a lot and done a lot of healing, understanding why she did some of the things she did when raising us.

Good luck!


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

It really sucks when you have no one you can leave your kids with. And it can seem so overwhelming. I'm sorry you feel you have to use your mom and sis to babysit. But it is not worth your kids being abused. Nothing you need to get done is that important. I'd sooner let my kids eat microwave popcorn for dinner than subject them to being hit.


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

It sounds like you need their help right now.

How about this:

"Thank you very much for helping take care of ds. Dh and I want to raise kids to be non-violent. It's too confusing to a child to have people spank him and then have us tell him that he can't hit us. So, we don't spank. Instead, we teach him in other ways.

1. Don't ever hit my child again. Don't even threaten to hit him.
2. If he's getting into things that you don't want him to get into, then move him to somewhere that he can't get into those things. Remember to tell him what you want him to do, not what he's not supposed to do.
3. If you feel he's acting up too much for you to handle, call me immediately and I'll come get him!"


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## mwherbs (Oct 24, 2004)

limit access- discuss/outline your choices without getting into what has happened in the past -- and do it before it comes up again--
you could say something like DH and I have decided to do gentle discipline and we don't- hit/spank... and we are asking that you respect our choices-- really really don't get into cases or history ---- if it is threatened leave- take your child and leave, don't even argue about it. and it sounds like you are going to need to make other arrangements for care until you see that your family has developed new skills in dealing with children in a GD way-- it took years for my family to accept my choices , part of why I chose to GD was because I was abused as a child and did not want to carry that on. So I could not trust them to be alone with my children--- actually over the years they did learn and my kids get along ok with them now, but I did have to listen to all sorts of complaints and complaints and stories about how terrible my children were going to be-- I just had to develop a deaf ear- and try to example when possible-- I also talked with my kids before we would go to visit- that grandma has special rules and we need to be respectful and try to keep her from getting upset- later we will go to the park and you can run around and .... I would bundle up and go outside or find a "safe" room to visit in that did not have things that attracted the kids -- my mom was infamous for slapping hands rather than moving something- so I moved things up out of the way-- as soon as I walked in the room--
take care


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Do not leave them in their care. I say that as a single mother, so I know about needing care. But you don't need it that badly. Take your son with you to get stuff done, figure out how to fold him into your life so you can do what you need to do while he is with you. Do NOT leave him with relatives who hit him.


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## Imogen (Jul 25, 2006)

How open do you think your Mother & Sister would be to you providing them articles or books on the subject of spanking?

There are plenty of resources/articles/book titles available on MDC for you to pass on to your relatives if need be.

The difficulty is transcending the knowledge that they have ingrained within them regarding spanking children and opening them up to the new knowledge of the dangers of spanking and Gentle Discipline.

*Plain Talk About Spanking*
http://www.nospank.net/pt2007.htm

*Ten Reasons Not to Hit Your Kids*
http://www.naturalchild.org/jan_hunt/tenreasons.html

Also, Alfie Kohn's
*Unconditional Parenting*
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Unconditiona...8412409&sr=1-2

Peace


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## BeanyMama (Jul 25, 2006)

I remember when I was pregnant with my first, my Mom's husband said something about keeping him in line with spankings when they were watching him. I made it very clear that would not be acceptable, he seemed surprised but it never was an issue after that. I wonder if you stated that they won't be touching him like that or there would be no more visits with DS they might understand how important it is to you to respect your parenting choices?


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Just because it's legal for a parent to spank his/her kids doesn't mean it's legal for someone else to spank your kids against your wishes. Find out what the law is, and if it's illegal, inform them of that.


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## UUMom (Nov 14, 2002)

You can never leave him there ever again.


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## chfriend (Aug 29, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *UUMom* 
You can never leave him there ever again.









:

Can you make a list of other ways your family can help you that aren't child care?


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## IndyNanny (Sep 20, 2007)

What about having your family take care of your DS at your home? That way he'd be in his own environment with all of the thing that he can play with and touch.


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## Dragonfly (Nov 27, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LoveMyTwoBoys* 
Should I just really not let them keep him anymore?

Yes. It's incredibly hard to be the sole care provider for a child, but if it's the only way to keep him safe, then that's what you have to do.

You could certainly have a talk with them and let them know your decision. They may be willing to work on their behavior so that they can still spend time with him. In the meantime, though, there is no way he should be left in an environment like that. Not only is he being physically mistreated, it sounds like he's constantly being given the message that there's something wrong with him. Children shouldn't experience that.

This sounds like a good time to seek out connections with others who share your values, too. Time to build a network, maybe.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

*No babysitter would hit your child. Why would people who "love" him hit him?*

Nurture a babysitter, have her come to your home, visit while you are there, and you run your errands close to home. See your family when you can be fully present and protect your son. I told our family emphatically and calmly, "NO ONE WILL EVER PUNISH OUR CHILD. HE WILL NOT BE HIT, SPANKED, SMACKED, SHAMED, THREATENED, FOR ANY REASON, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES WHATSOEVER, NOMATTERWHAT."

Pat


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## jul511riv (Mar 16, 2006)

why not just express to them your wishes and see if they can agree to cut out spankings or any other nonsense?


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Noone who ever hit my kid would be with them again. No exceptions. And I would threaten assault charges as well. Huge deal.


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jul511riv* 
why not just express to them your wishes and see if they can agree to cut out spankings or any other nonsense?

Because it's not fair to force a child to be alone with someone who has already asaulted them. No second chances.


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## peacelovingmama (Apr 28, 2006)

We don't have family in the area and we don't currently have a sitter, so I know how hard it is to be the sole caregiver. But it's hard for me to imagine any errand being so critical that it would be worth subjecting my child to violence.

If it were me, I'd set aside money for a babysitter or take DS with me on errands. As long as they hit him, he cannot be left there. If you feel that you can reach them and get them to stop the violence, then by all means do that, but if not, I say no unsupervised contact.


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## ~Megan~ (Nov 7, 2002)

I wouldn't keep him there. Find a nice gentle mama to babysit him instead. Perhaps you could work out a trade so that you don't have to pay.

Look to your local LLL for references.


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## swellmomma (Jan 1, 2004)

Even as a mom who has spanked my kids I do not and will not tolerate someone else doing it. My mom did it a couple time when ds 1 was under the age of 2. We cut off contact for a while and it was almost 2 years before she was allowed one on one time with him again. I wam a single mom, I need my family's help sometimes too but I refused to let them spank my child. It made it very tough on me for a while, but they have never tried to do it again.


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## madskye (Feb 20, 2006)

I don't think you can leave him, or your other child, alone with your relatives anymore. I don't think there's any way around it. Sorry, because I know what it is like to need help, but I don't see how you can drop him off there, knowing that at some point he'll probably act like a 2 year old, and get a spanking because of it.


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## GooeyRN (Apr 24, 2006)

I wouldn't leave him again. I would hire someone to watch him that would follow your wishes regarding dicipline. No one should ever spank another persons child without the parents permission. (well, they never should spank in my opinion, but I know others aren't against spanking) Definately hire a baby sitter. Only let your parents see your ds while you are there to supervise.


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## mamaduck (Mar 6, 2002)

I would not leave him unsupervised with them again. Its not an acceptable or safe environment.

I understand about needing support. I think you owe it to him (and yourself) to build and nurture that support elsewhere. Hang out where other mom's hang out -- talk to them and get to know them. Schedule playdates, and try to build a circle of friends with whom you can swap kids now and then.

And/or --

Find a part-time preschool so that you can have blocks of time a few times a week to get errands down. In fact, preschool is a good place to build those other mom connections.

I know people who believe in spanking, who spanked their own kids, and who would never dream of laying a hand on someone else's kids. My family included. Its one thing to open your support circle to include people with ideas and beliefs that diverge from your own. But its a whole different story to open your support circle to include people who push those practises on your children.

I suppose it may be worth a conversation with your family first -- to see if they might cooperate with your wishes that your kids not be hit. But, ugh, I don't see how you would know for certain that they are complying. To me, it would not be worth the risk.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *yarngoddess* 
While I agree with the PP, the reality of this situation is that the OP needs, NEEDS these people. I think that you need to tell them in no uncertain terms that they are to NEVER hit, or threaten to hit your children again. NEVER. They need to understand that you are the mom, and that they must abide by your rules, or face dire consequences. And you must be willing to follow through with what you say will happen.

Having been apart from mr DH on many occasions I REALLY feel for you, however you have to be strong for your DS's. These things will have a PERMANANT effect, and regardless of the reality of the situation, you must do whatever it takes to protect your children.

I agree with this.

You do need your family. There must be a way to make sure they understand how you feel about spanking and hitting. They probably think you just thought this whole theory sounded good, and it was easier for you, but you CLEARLY don't know what is best for your son. Let them know that you DO indeed know what is best, and you chose gd after much thought.

But, if they are going to do things your way, you need to give them the right tools to help you. If all they know is what they CAN'T do, they are just going to say to each other "Well, I guess he gets to do whatever he wants". They'll shrug their shoulders and assume that he is a lost cause.

He shouldn't be jumping on dogs. Even if they don't want to put the dogs away, he doesn't need to jump on or near the dogs. At his age, he is old enough to understand "look before you jump".

people aren't going to live their lives differently because you have a pre-schooler. So, if locking their dogs up isn't an option, then you need to make sure he doesn't jump on them. If they want to have their house decorated for Christmas, then they just need to help keep him out of the gifts. Redirection and keeping him occupied works fine.

It is NEVER O.K to hit someone elses child. When you tell them, use the word "hit" because people don't associate spank and hit as the same thing.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

How can the OP trust that they actually won't hit her children even if she talks to them?


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna* 
How can the OP trust that they actually won't hit her children even if she talks to them?

Yeah, really. And making kids be alone, as I have said, with someone who's already hit them - how could anyone do that?


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rmzbm* 
Because it's not fair to force a child to be alone with someone who has already asaulted them. No second chances.

Well, since spanking is 'acceptable' in many families, if the mom wasn't clear that it WASN'T acceptable to her and her family, her relatives may have just assumed they could discipline with spanking.

If she'd already been clear that she doesn't spank and won't tolerate spanking, then yes, I agree, no second chances. But I didn't get that feeling from this post.

I would raise the issue. Have a heart-to-heart and then if they agree to no spanking give them a second chance. Certainly everyone deserves a chance to learn. If they do it again, then I agree, absolutely no more one-on-one. But I think there's room for learning on all sides: The OP needs to learn to be much clearer about her boundaries (and possibly about where she allows her family to babysit) and her extended family needs to learn to not spank.


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## Equuskia (Dec 16, 2006)

The family can learn all they want, but not at the expense of my child. And you don't know if the next time you leave your child there, they use a belt on him, or rap him over the head with knuckles or pop him across the mouth. Violence can escalate very quickly, especially with young children who are just acting their age, and adults who don't understand normal child development.


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## rmzbm (Jul 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Equuskia* 
The family can learn all they want, but not at the expense of my child. And you don't know if the next time you leave your child there, they use a belt on him, or rap him over the head with knuckles or pop him across the mouth. Violence can escalate very quickly, especially with young children who are just acting their age, and adults who don't understand normal child development.











It is NEVER under ANY circumstances ok to _assume_ hitting anyone else's child is ok!

No excuse, no second chances. You hit my kid, you BLEW it.







:


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## kikidee (Apr 15, 2007)

No. I'm sorry, I would not leave my child w/ anyone, even family, if they even *threatened* to spank DD.

There has to be another solution. Nothing is worth someone abusing your child.


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## Krystal323 (May 14, 2004)

another vote for NEVER. your poor ds


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## KBecks (Jan 3, 2007)

I would not let your sister watch DS again.

I would tell your mom that you don't want DS spanked and you don't want spankings to be threatened. I'd probably offer that she can give him a warning and a time out as an alternative.

As for the tree, etc. It's her house, her rules. So if she doesn't want DS touching the tree, she will have to manage that. I would check her on her tone though, if she is correcting that's OK, but yelling I'd talk with her about. KWIM? It is OK to teach a child to respect other peoples things, in fact that's good. I'd talk with your mom though about how to enforce boundaries in ways that are acceptable to you.


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## MindfulBirth (Mar 3, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LoveMyTwoBoys* 
Tonight, my mom threatened to "spank his bare butt" if he jumped off the couch towards the dogs again.

If she can make this threat with no hesitation in front of you..chances are, she has already followed through on this threat on other occasions.

I hope you can find other child care soon.


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## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

I would never, EVER leave my son with anyone who thought spanking was ok.

I make my views on discipline crystal clear to anyone who is going to be watching my son. Usually that's my Mom who is totally on board with GD. But the two babysitters he's had I make it clear how we do things and that discipline is not their job, call me if there is a problem. Their job is to play with him and help him have a wonderful time while we are out.

In your situation I'd consider sitting those family members down, telling them very clearly how you feel spanking is assault and that if they ever hit your child ever again you will press charges.


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## MrsAprilMay (Jul 7, 2007)

I understand the need to have help. Both DH and I have family nearby who would love to watch our daughter so I could work more or who want to help after the baby arrives.
The problem is that I have seen several of these people hit their children or grandchildren on several occasions.
So, even though it's much harder, we don't leave our child with them.

OP, you said that you take care of your youngest while your mother watches your oldest. Would it be possible for your mother to come to your house to help you? Or run errands with you? If you are going a place that you can take one child, but feel overwhelmed with two why can't your help come with you? At least in your house, your son will have acceptable toys to play with and know the limits already. And you can be nearby to protect him.

I would also make sure that your family knows that you are not ok with hitting. By saying nothing, you are telling them that it's ok.


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## Mom2Joseph (May 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rmzbm* 
Noone who ever hit my kid would be with them again. No exceptions. And I would threaten assault charges as well. Huge deal.


I totally agree with this.


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## ramama (Apr 13, 2007)

Regardless of whether the parents chose to spank their children, it would be absolutely inappropriate for an aunt or grandparent to spank your child. I just can't imagine the irreparable harm that would cause to the grandparent/grandchild relationship. My parents spanked me and their parents spanked them, but if my grandparents even threatened to spank me that would have absolutely crushed me. My grandparents were like gods and goddesses to me. Just that your family thinks that they should even be allowed to make the choice on whether to spank or not spank your child totally baffles me. I see that as so far out of their realm of authority that it shouldn't even be considered. My mother would never even think to spank my children. Never. And I would never lay a hand on my nephews, and my SIL would never spank my children. Such a physical violation would change my relationship with my nephews forever and I wouldn't want that at all. They think I'm the cool mom. LOL!

Perhaps, if you feel that you really need your family's help, you should talk to your mother and express concern over what spanking could do to her relationship with your son, or even threatening to spank could do. If she cares at all, she should see what you're talking about. If not, I guess you know not to let her watch your son.


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## jul511riv (Mar 16, 2006)

I agree that hitting another persons child IS unacceptable, but this is her FAMILY. Not something to take lightly either, depending on where you come from in the world of family involvement.

I think that grandmom or aunt might think that this is part of being loving and responsible and if mom didn't make her wishes known then they might feel that they are acting on behalf of the mother since she is, after all, FAMILY. It's different. It's not like a babysitter. It's your own MOTHER and so forth.

SO I DO think that grandmom and aunty (maybe) should get a second chance or at least should have a heart to heart with mom where she can better educate them about GD and try to get them on board. If there is any confusion or uneasy feelings, then of course she should not leave her son with them, but parents don't know and they can sometimes change ,yk?

My mil tried to hide meat in my daughters food. This is a BIG no no for me. But what am I gonna do? Not let her feed her anymore?I mean, when we visit for the weekend, what, not eat dinner?

We had a heart to heart. We talked about her feelings and mine. We spent a trial period where I would only feed food to my daughter that I PERSONALLY SAW HER prepare with my own eyes, yk? And then, after a while, once I felt that the point was made (and taken) I've given her another chance. Could she do it again? Sure. Do I think she will? Well, if/when I do, we will go right back to monitoring everything she makes or just not visiting anymore.

As for those who are commenting that a threat to spank will quickly become pulling out a shotgun and shooting the kid in the leg (G-d Forbid) or drawing blood or whatever (okay, Im exagerating a bit, of course), well I totally disagree. I don't think that someone who has been conditioned to believe that spanking children is a necessary evil, is necessarily someone who is out of control violent and will quickly escalate violence to dangerous levels (physically dangerous). I just don't buy that. I think there are many MANY parents who spank but would never dream of hitting knuckels or drawing blood ro whathave you.

jmho.


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## swampangel (Feb 10, 2007)

I think navigating the conversation with family members is very individual and unique for any particular family. Whether you do that and how is totally up to you and your relationship with those folks.

I may have missed a post, but I think the issue being brought up about a threat turning into something more is simply that it would turn into an actual spanking/hitting. For many of us, that is considered violence. To me, the fact that the threat would even come up would have me very concerned that there might be follow through...which would totally and completely mortify me if it were my child. That's just me. I have close friends who have spanked. They would probably feel differently about this situation.

Good luck with it...what a tough situation. My MIL lives near us and has shown us that we can't trust her alone with our kids. She bullied our oldest right in front of us and it was totally shocking. She thought she was being helpful, but it was horribly shaming and upsetting to all of us. We weathered it but it drove the point home that we can't rely on her for childcare. It's a bummer but the way it is.


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