# Alternatives to Girl Scouts?



## Turquesa (May 30, 2007)

I could post this in any number of forums, but I'll start here.

I was a Girl Scout and loved learning the skills that I did, especially the outdoorsy stuff. :grin:

With all respect to the Scouting parents out there, I don't like the direction that GS has taken, the Barbie stuff being just one example.

So I'm looking for an alternative. I don't care if it's co-ed or girls-only, but I don't want anything too right wing--in fact, the less driven by politics and ideology, the better. Does anyone have experience with some of the other alternative scouting organizations? Any recommendations?


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## Xerxella (Feb 6, 2008)

Check with the Y. I did Indian Princesses with my dad when I was a kid and loved it. Each Y runs it differently, but ours was all about dad and daughter and outdoorsy stuff.


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## DetroitMom (Apr 15, 2004)

Not sure of your location but you could try the 4-H club or FFA. Our Metro Parks have a kids club too.


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## stormborn (Dec 8, 2001)

If you're in the U.S. or Canada look up Spiral Scouts. It's not something we've tried yet (the times/locations never seem to work out) but a lot of our homeschooling friends are involved and it seems like fun.
I like that it's open to the whole family.


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## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Another obvious choice is Camp Fire. I second 4-H, but a lot of that depends on the leaders, again. That organization has an unmatchable breadth, in theory. A lot of that would have to be approached by the child and the family, because finding leaders for a particular project isn't as easy.

You might also have Maker scout-type groups in your area. I haven't checked on the site recently, but I know diy.org has an amazing array of badge projects.

I would say that a lot depends on the girl scout leaders. The new ones we have for my Junior and soon-to-be Cadette are more focused on outdoor skills and general connection between girls and less on badges. I also don't like the corporate partnerships, nor do I like the attempt to align the journeys (badge sets) with common core. We do sell cookies, but I don't like that cookie sales (and in some councils, "fall product" sales) are required for other fund raising.

But if in a pinch, remember that the only way you are supporting the national organization is through your registration dollars. Everything else is on the council level. Now, your council can be pretty shoddy (ours is FABulous) so again, it all depends...

Good luck!


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## Turquesa (May 30, 2007)

SweetSilver said:


> Another obvious choice is Camp Fire. I second 4-H, but a lot of that depends on the leaders, again. That organization has an unmatchable breadth, in theory. A lot of that would have to be approached by the child and the family, because finding leaders for a particular project isn't as easy.
> 
> You might also have Maker scout-type groups in your area. I haven't checked on the site recently, but I know diy.org has an amazing array of badge projects.
> 
> ...


I didn't know about the Common Core connection. CC is getting like high-fructose corn syrup . . . in everything!! :lol

I'm also concerned about scouting _culture_. I don't have the time, energy, or even money to helicopter parent my kids into those badges. :dizzy


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## Deborah (Dec 6, 2002)

I think this is only in Vermont, but it is a super program. My grandchildren have both participated and they love it!
http://www.earthwalkvermont.org/#!summer-camps-for-children/tomep

Apparently there are other programs


> EarthWalk's nature mentoring approach draws from and is inspired by the practices and principles documented in _Coyote's Guide to Connecting to Nature _by Jon Young, Ellen Haas and Evan McGowan. There are now over three hundred affiliate schools and programs around the world utilizing these mentoring principles, including EarthWalk Vermont.


The link to the book doesn't work, here is another program that has the book https://www.wildernessawareness.org/store/products/coyotes-guide-connecting-nature-2nd-edition

Anyone else have a program like this near them?


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## Turquesa (May 30, 2007)

It looks like Big Agra got a hold of 4-H.  Ugh. I guess we'll never fully escape undesirable corporate sponsorship. Maybe there is something more locally based.


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## teacozy (Apr 25, 2013)

I did Indian Princess growing up and loved it. Not sure what they're like now, but I don't recall religion ever coming into play when I was in it.


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## NiteNicole (May 19, 2003)

I have been involved with GS with my daughter for almost six years (this will be our sixth) and a leader for five of those and every year I try to find something for our girls that is better than GS. My co and I just looked into some of our badge requirements for our Juniors (this is their second year) and they are things like "Laundry is fun!" and "Go shopping to learn independence!" and I am just D-O-N-E.

Diy.org looks amazing. I would love for my GS to disband and just meet to talk about this.


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## rzberrymom (Feb 10, 2005)

Not sure if anyone mentioned this one, but Baden-Powell Scouting is a fantastic alternative. https://www.bpsa-us.org

They're like scouting used to be--outdoor skills, instead of coding and shopping.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

teacozy said:


> I did Indian Princess growing up and loved it. Not sure what they're like now, but I don't recall religion ever coming into play when I was in it.


I teach classes at a YMCA and the program is now "Adventure Guides" for both genders at most Ys and "Adventure Guides and Princesses" at a few holdouts. The level of religion depends on the Y. Mine is fairly heavy on the C part of the YMCA, but I am in the Bible Belt. Many are more secular.


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## runlikeafoxstar (Jun 29, 2012)

Girls on the Run! I'm a coach for this program and LOVE IT! It's a youth development program and running is the vehicle used to teach the lessons but it's not a running program. Each session has a lesson which teaches girls to appreciate what makes them unique, they learn to be a good teammate, and to serve their community. The season ends with a celebration 5k. This program is perfect for young girls, even non-runner. Wish I had it growing up. 
girlsontherun.org


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## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Turquesa said:


> It looks like Big Agra got a hold of 4-H.  Ugh. I guess we'll never fully escape undesirable corporate sponsorship. Maybe there is something more locally based.


No surprise here. Sponsorships at all levels are an everyday thing in 4-H, from the local feed store, to the local butcher, to Payback offering both feed for fair. Big Ag courts promising 4-H-ers. You know that industry practices inform what is being taught in the curriculum-- IF you used the curriculum and most leaders I know don't.

But this is far more transparent than private partnerships in Girl Scouts. 4-H is a government program funded by the government. Funding and influence by outside partners is probably less insidious that the influence it has on government itself.

The backbone of both organizations, though, again, are the leaders. The leaders are what make it great, or what make them horrible. This would happen for any organization. I would rather have good leaders in an organization that has corners I disapprove of (and you can't prove to me we are supporting them by being involved in scouts or 4-H) than I would bad leaders in more "pure" organizations. The takeaway from all of these is in the *people*.

As far as helicoptering badges, you often find the opposite-- leaders who go out of their way to exclude parents. Again, a good leader will cover all the necessaries, and troop money-- whether from dues, which are agreed upon and set by the troop leaders and go solely to the troop, or from cookie or fundraising sales-- should cover all the badges. Some troops even forgo the vests. There are no rules about this. Our Council has a stellar financial aid program (that just so happened to pay for my daughter's camp this last week).

Unlike Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts offers near full autonomy to troops and troop leaders. Councils offer a few basic rules (and a lot of safety guidelines you must follow for activities), then the rest is up to the troop. As far as what the troop does or doesn't do, there is no checking back with councils to approve badges for to approve not working on badges, or how precisely those badges are earned. There is no oversight outside the troop, except for Silver and Gold awards.

Personally, and not to disrespect the concerns about corporate partnerships, etc, or to take the focus off Scout alternatives, but I think the connection here is overblown. Girl Scouts is forward-thinking and inclusive (religion, race, gender identity, sexual orientation), and while it does have its difficulties, it's not as if things like corporate partnerships aren't uncriticized by those in the organization. National is slow and sluggish, but more than anything, it is trying to adapt to the needs of girls. I've been in Girl Scouts for 5 years now, and I truly believe that is what I'm seeing. It's not ideal, but it is ubiquitous and the women I've met, and quite a few of the men, are people I want my girls to be around. That's the bottom line for me.


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