# Happy Second Birthday, November '05 Babies!



## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

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*Happy birthday month, November '05 Mamas and babies!!!!!*

Here is last month.

Here's the list of birthdays.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

*Happy Birthday Neela, and Happy Birthing Day, Mel!!*






















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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Drat, you beat me to it









Happy birth day, Mel and Neela!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Happy Birthday, November toddlers!

Just quickly subbing here, we're going out today and running errands. What's everyone else doing for their kiddo's birthday this month? We're (finally! after 6 months!) painting Ellie's room a light purple which will look soooo much better than the faux wood paneling in there now, adding butterfly stickers to the walls, making butterfly curtains, and I'm sewing her a butterfly quilt. She loves butterflies, obviously! Oh, and I'm getting her a trunk for her dress-up clothes since she loves to dress up! So, I suggested to grandparents that dress up clothes would be a good birthday present for her, which is so convenient since her birthday is a couple weeks after Halloween!







Last year I was good and made pumpkin muffins for her birthday, but I think I'll do a chocolate cake this year because she adores chocolate.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Thankfully I have another month to wait for Winter's birthday. I am so not ready for him to be 2.

I am so amazed we have all remained so close after all this time together.

Happy birthday Neela!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

I'm excited and sad all at the same time. Jacob's party is November 10th. I have gone all out once again. I love planning and preparing parties. His birthday is November 18th. I CAN"T believe my baby is turning 2.







: I am shocked at how fast time is flying and how much he is growing and learning.

Here's the long update on us right now...

We are downsizing in a huge way in our apartment and our lives.

We are selling/getting rid of our TV, most of our furniture and a ton of stuff we just don't need or want anymore. We are doing this mainly because we are moving in June and don't want to lug a bunch of junk across the country *well across a few states* We have started a list of places for Adam to put in applications and what state(s) we are most interested in. We have it narrowed down to two pretty neat looking areas both in Colorado right now. But the Seattle area and Flagstaff aren't completely ruled out yet.

We are going down to one income in January which scares the crap out of me because 3 months later I go on maternity leave and we are going down to my income for about six months which is not a fun concept considering it's going to be cut by 1/3 while I am out. Adam starts his field work for teaching in January and we decided it would be better for him not to get a second job while he is doing that. The good news on that though, is that we will stay a one-income family after that with this my last year teaching in a public/paid setting.

We have decided I'll be homeschooling our kids *yay* I've always felt that was the reason I have a teaching credential to begin with but now with Adam working in the public school system he is starting to seriously agree with me. I will be able to do a better job teaching our kids than the school system...and I'll LOVE it!! We are talking about spacing the next child 5 years after Leah...but we will just have to see how it goes. It is so hard for me to be nursing Jacob and pregnant with Leah and for me weaning is not an option.

Jacob is doing amazingly. He's growing by leaps and bounds! His daycare lady loves the crap out of him and dotes on him so much. He's so polite it's uncanny. Always saying please, thank you and excuse me! His newest thing, which just melts my heart, is "Mama, doing???" He will run up to me and say "mama? Doing?!?!" and I will answer him "I'm ______" doing dishes, folding laundry, talking to dadi, making dinner.....whatever it is. He will then run away again, only to be back 30 seconds later to ask again. When I do answer him he gets the most mischievious grin on his face before he runs away. It's adorable!!!

His newest obsession, well besides ANYTHING outside, is Blue's Clues. He runs around yelling "a clue, a clue" and tells us EVERYTHING is "right there" while pointing to it.

He adores babies and always informs me when he hears someone crying. I can only imagine what the first few weeks will be like with him telling me every time Leah cries.

He's a mama's boy to the extreme!!! He has started pushing Adam away at night when he gets it in his mind that he only wants mama...and now...thank you very much. I can tell it hurts Adam...but we keep talking about how it's not something to take personally...he knows that Jacob loves him....it's just hard for him to see it right now.

I'm looking forward to Thanksgiving and Christmas and a time to relax and be home as a famliy. We are travelling for Thanksgiving...but I'm hoping it will still be relaxing. Christmas we are staying home...just our family and I am so excited about it. I've started a Christmas Traditions book I'm writing for our family that I hope to pass down...I may have to make more than one copy that will have stories and pictures of our family traditions for the holiday season.

Besides all that I'm pregnant and hormonal. I am counting down the days till I hit 29 weeks. I turned 29 weeks exactly when my water broke with Jacob and I spent 5 weeks on hospitalized bedrest scared to death every day that I would lose him. I vividly remember the meltdowns I had at least once a week because I wasn't allowed to get out of bed for ANYTHING without a doctor's order. I had to have doctor's orders for a shower (once a week if I was lucky), to use the bathroom (and that not until the second week I was there), to go outside (twice in the 5 weeks for a total of about an hour) it was horrible. Jacob was then born at 34 weeks and spent a week in the NICU. I don't want to do that again. Praying that Leah develops fully inside and that my body functions correctly to keep her there....I want to be 40 weeks and miserably pregnant...I'd take that anyday over the anguish of being discharged from the hospital after being stuck there for 5 weeks and having to leave my son there. The pregnant and hormonal part is hard on Adam too...he is an amazing husband and has picked up the slack where I just can't do it anymore soooo well! I







him.

AND...today I was violated in a way that I still can't shake...Ugh. I hate middle school kids sometimes...

I had a student come into class and refuse to sit down. He then undoes his belt and unzips his pants. I asked him to sit down. He responded rudely and defiantly "I'm fixing my pants." I repeated my request for him to sit down. He responded "Why you looking?!?! You like this or something?!" I then changed my request for him to leave the classroom. He looked at me and said "F*ck you!" and walked out.

I wrote the referral. We are required before we can actually send a referral to the office to contact the parents. So I called home. No answer. I called dad at work. The secretary answered. "Is this an emergency. We don't allow personal calls." I told her it was up to her whether she connected me through or not and that his son was doing/saying inappropriate things at school. She transferred me through. I spoke to the dad's supervisor who was unable to get the dad on the phone. I was hoping the office would accept that so I (thank goodness I had a teacher's aide this period) took the student up to the office....As we walked in the secretary said the dad was on the phone for me. I spoke to him. His answer...."What do you want me to do about it!??!" Seriously?!?

I am having a very difficult time seeing these urchins as people...I know they need a patient, understanding adult in their lives...but I sure as anything don't feel equipped to be that for them.

I feel gross and nasty...that a child would speak to me that way. Ewww. Ugh. I want to go home.

*hugs* to all the mama's out there and Happy Birthday Month to our gorgeous kiddos!!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Happy Birthday Neela!

Wow. 2 years old. Hard to believe... this morning I picked Rowan up and she felt so heavy! I had a sudden flashback to her at about 3 weeks, with me bouncing her up and down on my exercise ball to calm her, and how I would hold her under her arms and support her head at the same time, and I realized in a very physical way how much she's grown!

We're not doing anything superfancy for her birthday - I'll have a couple of her little friends over one morning (probably the day after her birthday) and I'm sure my MIL will have a little family party for her.

Alicia, that's horrible about that kid at school.







. You kind of have to wonder what sort of home life that kid has, that he would even consider doing that. Although with the dad's response, you don't really have to *wonder*, it's pretty obvious. Sigh.

Gotta go flip my calendars over.







Happy November everyone!

Oh, here are some of our Hallowe'en pics!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kaspirant. Steve had a pupil last week (same age as your lot) ask him in detail if he knew about "rumping" and getting as explicit as she could. She then hugged him goodbye at the end of class :barf Just- no. Don't go down the "blame the parents" route though huh? Mothers are the underdogs of the universe anyhow atm.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

I have a two year old...

We opened some birthday gifts from family in bed this morning and she loved the paper tearing. We got her a xylophone and some maracas, and a beautiful coat made by a local woman from a recycled sweater. I'm supposed to be working tonight and we're doing post punk kitchen vegan cupcakes tomorrow with some neighbours. And on saturday we're going to a belated hallowe'en party with DH's classmates, and sunday I'm hosting a baby shower for a co-worker (which has Neela doubly excited- it's in the community room, which she adores, and it's for someone who "has a baby in her belly")

Hallowe'en went over better than expected. She decided that it was okay to be a baby bumblebee afterall (we had a meltdown about the lack of a baby elephant costume over the weekend), since her friends were going trick or treating and she happily got costumed and took off. I was working, but she and DH had a great time. The imaginary horse that lives in our bedroom dressed up as a peacock, according to Neela.

Neela has been making up funny nicknames for people recently. I'm bubby (a cross between buddy and baby, I think), and also mamba jamba.

*Amy* I went looking for the list of questions that I think you posted for our babies first birthdays, but I couldn't find it... I thought it would be cool to check in again about our kiddos if anyone knows where it is...

Kaspirant~ It sounds like you guys have made a lot of exciting decisions. Wishing you all the best with your move preparation (and hitting the ever exciting 29 weeks upright!!!).


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Ewww about the middle school kids. I have serious issues with that age group. I can only hope I am doing the right things and my kids won't become little hellions like that.







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: I am excited and anxious at the same time about the whole 2nd birthday thing. I just don't feel like celebrating. It makes me sad. Gabriel has completely taken quite a turn around these past two weeks or so. He's sooooo in the *terrific* twos stage already (hear my sarcasm?). Throwing himself down on the floor tantrums (which are much easier to dissipate than Willem ever was), and having a destructive mind of his own top the list of things that make your exhausted pregnant mother even more exhausted. On top of everything, I spoke too soon last month when I said no one was getting sick here. Willem has been feverish with a raspy, mucousy cough all week. He got so exhausted after walking half the block last night







But he was a man on a mission with candy as his goal







He keeps asking for me to get his candy out and I keep explaining that it will only make him sick longer and then he agrees to wait unitl he's feeling better to have some. He forgets to spit after he coughs so he's been "throwing up" mucus. Gross. I actually had to wake dh up to look at it last night (check for blood or pus) because it turned my pg stomach. So I'm exhausted from staying up with him etc.

I have yet to figure out what to do for Gabriel's birthday. It'll probably just be us, celebrating as a family. I'm so not a party planner. It's been on my mind for, seriously, the past month and a half but I'm clueless. I am proud of myself for getting a list together of possible birthday gifts (if it doesn't get on a list these days I forget and it doesn't get done). I'm sending a copy to my mom tomorrow and having dh email one to his mom tomorrow.

OT but the boys were soooo cute last night. They got so many ooos and aahhh's as the Tinman and the Cowardly lion. One of our neighbors (whose kids are all grown up now) was almost in tears she thought they were so cute. Willem was so thankful that I made his costume for him, despite how
'out of it' he felt.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Halloween pictures!


Ellie the ladybug, who LOVED opening suckers to take one lick and then discarding them. (see the pile on the table?)

Officer Killy

We put this picture on a Halloween card and sent out to family. Aren't they just too cute?


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
*Amy* I went looking for the list of questions that I think you posted for our babies first birthdays, but I couldn't find it... I thought it would be cool to check in again about our kiddos if anyone knows where it is...

Oh yeah, I remember that! Those questions may not be as appropriate now (I remember some were like, what is the hardest part of being a mom, etc.) so why don't you do the honors and make us a new list of questions!??


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

thanks for starting this HAPPY BIRTHDAY thread, amy! it came upon me so quickly that ezra will be two in less than a week! we've been saying for a while, "she's almost two" when people ask how old she is but still, can you believe we are already here at another birthday? brynn is so fab in her girlasouras outfit!

since we just got back into the country and our house and it is TRASHED, we are having ezra's party at the science museum. we get a room for an hour and then the guests get into the museum for free all day. there is a butterfly house and lots of other fun outdoor stuff in addition to the regular museum exhibits. our local LLL had a 50th anniv celebration in the same room so that's where i got the idea. not too much clean up for us, lots of entertainment with nothing for me to plan and fun for lots of different ages. plus, yeah, not having to host which would be impossible with the state of our house and yard right now. not to mention the embarrassment of the broke down car up on cinder blocks in our driveway!!!







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ezra's birthday is tuesday nov 6th and the party is on saturday, nov 10th so her older friends can come. we usually throw a huge halloween chili cook off with a keg but not this year. we usually dress up fully but not this year at all. ez sad she wanted to be puss in boots, dad to be shrek and me to be donkey. at first, i was to be princess fiona but then, depending on how you look at it, i was demoted or promoted to being a donkey. donkey is her fave character, perhaps b/c it's the only cartoon she has seen. we watched it in bali a couple of times and she loved it. guess there are worse cartoons to like.

QoC- those kids are so cute and so are their costumes!

we are also fixing up a room for ezra. she's getting a bed of her own! not sure how often she'll use it but she slept in the extra bed if we had two beds in our hotel room. and, she seems to be weaning. woo hoo! i am sure she'll start up, again when she sees her lil sibling.

alicia- i am so sorry about the kid doing that to you. i am glad that you get to leave that enviro soon. i hear you about wanting to be 40 weeks and miserable. my story doesn't compare to what you went through but with ez 3 weeks early and barely 5 pounds born at home, i was a nervous wreck that she would not get enough milk from me and it would be all my fault. i wanted to go to the hospital and get her an IV or whatever. dh was the voice of reason, along with my doula and midwife. thankfully we had lots of support to keep my mind straight as i was riddled with anxiety that first week. ugh. i want this one to stay in and be healthy. i will think of you, too whenever i get nervous about it and say prayers to keep our babes in. are you drinking Red Rasp Leaf tea?

sarah- love the pics, esp the chasing bunnies one!

mel-a xylophone would be a great gift! we bought one for christmas last year and it fell apart. they are everywhere in bali and the kids learn to really play them starting at age 5 or so. i bet ez would love one; she liked playing the huge ones there.

ez has this funny sense of humor recently where she likes body humor jokes. do you all know the "signing times" silly pizza song? they list different gross things on pizza like, "i like cereal on my pizza" or bread or ice cream. the other night, she was singing it and laughing hysterically barely got the words out, "i like boogies on my pizza." where did she learn this? once i figured out what she was saying, we spent the next five minutes laughing and repeating it and me saying, "gross" which would get her laughing all over, again!

monique- i hear you about already being the stereotypical two year old. ez says "no" ALL. THE. TIME. and, we have worked so hard to respond to her in different ways her whole life with words other than no. and she throws things. does not want to get dressed. or wear a diaper to bed; i have a gash on my thumb from struggling with that stupid snappi the other night. and, leaving places like a store or the park has become very challenging. she cries in her carseat once we finally get her into it. it's taking a lot of patience from both dh and i to not strong arm her into the carseat. we try to wait or give her a toy, book, chips, anything and i sit with her in the backseat when it's especially hard and just hug her as she cries in the carseat. thankfully, i have somehow had my supermom powers increased ten fold b/c i can manage the patience to do this without pulling my hair out recently. let's hope this doesn't last an entire year, esp with our new babes coming.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

happy birthday mel and neela!!! and any other birthday babes and mommas.

its november! i can't believe it.. all of our babies will be 2 soon! i feel like im going to miss my baby, but i guess ill have another one sooner than later









and Its snowing!!! i love snow. its the first of the season and its pretty exciting. we arent ready. no snow tires..no proper boots for the kids.. i dont have a jacket that fits over my belly







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but its beautiful and our house is cozy and warm with the wood stove.

im totally into knitting these days after a looong time it seems.. my MIL and i did a craft sale across the street from our house a last weekend and i sold some of my knitting and baking. it was great fun.

and halloween in our small town was wonderful. we had a HUGE bonfire (like 14 feet tall) in the hall parking lot and everyone went trick-or-treating together (all 12 or so kids in town) elwynn was a cowboy (his choice, not mine







) and ngaio a ladybug (she was supposidly the cutest kid in town)
elwynn and i made halloween sugar cookies and cupcakes for the party and there was all sorts of other warm drinks and food. and even a fairly impressive fireworks display. i met a bunch of folks from town that i havn't seen before, so yeah...all in all it was pretty lovely.

im stressing a bit about this baby in my belly. i had this scare about baby being soo huge then had an ultrasound and now they are saying its way small.. i feel like since that appt with my midwife my BP has been high and ive just been worried. im not sleeping well and im really regreting all of it..i was so happy UPing and now im freaking out. i tend to have anxiety about medical stuff and so its really been hard. im trying to say a lot of possitive affirmations, drink lots of RRL tea, nettle and alfalfa and ive been taking some tinctures when my nerves really get out of control. im trying to rest more and boond with baby more too which is helping me because she sure moves, kicks and flips a lot in there. she sure doesn't feel tiny!
im not sure for another midwife appt for another 2 1/2 weeks which is kind of a good thing because i know she is going to want me to have another US, which i dont want to do.. ak. i cant believe after 2 so perfect pregnancies that im going through this. it really sucks. and the worst part is that at the beginning i really didnt know if i wanted another baby and i havn't been as caring for myself and baby as i probably should be (im trying to be better now to take my vitamins and get rest and not do so much) and now i feel like its my fault if something is wrong.







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wish i could be here more..

fern


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Fern. Did you see my baby belly cardigan? I want to go make you one to keep you warm and snug and cosy and feel like we're all hugging you, but by the time I've finished you'll probably have had the baby and be back to normal- so I won't. I wonder if the scan was meant to tell you something about your decision to UP- but then, your instincts were telling you to get help with this pregnancy







We're here for you whenever you need us.

Oh- I will sort out swap partners, btw. Sorry it's taken so long.

Oh, and Halloween stinks. Walmart and Tescos have just completely trashed every UK Halloween tradition EVER and instead the shops are covered with this horrible plastic tat and pumpkins and other foreign muck. Yuck. Apparently it's about looking scary and getting sweets (direct quote from my adorable 7yo.) Well, not in MY house it's not. Just- yuck.
It's anarchist day (aka Guy Fawkes Day) next week though and we have firework displays to go see this weekend, so I'm happy. The builders start the extension on Monday as well, which will be- erm, bracing. To say the least.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

I'm pretty sensitive to middle-aged children being called "urchins" or "hellions," too. And I don't think that blaming parents is good for anyone, either.

A seasoned teacher and professor of mine once asked me to remember that parents send to school the best they've got. Our little two year olds will be there some day, and if they're not, if we are privileged enough educationally and economically to home school them, send them to private schools, or live in neighborhoods zoned for the "good" schools, then we would be wise to show them with our actions and tell them with our words that not everyone is born so lucky, and that with that luck comes the responsibility to treat every single person with empathy and respect and to give something back to the world.

I know that Alicia's experience was particularly disturbing, but I think of my middle schoolers, especially the troubled ones, and want so desperately for them to get a fair shot, to not get stereotyped or treated harshly for bad choices that have so much to do with their age and their being ill-equipped emotionally and socially for much of what this world presents them with. The system mostly sucks and adolescence mostly sucks, but I think it's all of our job to demonstrate what a society _could_ look like to get the change moving in a positive direction.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Nice post, Honeytree.


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
I'm pretty sensitive to middle-aged children being called "urchins" or "hellions," too. And I don't think that blaming parents is good for anyone, either.

A seasoned teacher and professor of mine once asked me to remember that parents send to school the best they've got. Our little two year olds will be there some day, and if they're not, if we are privileged enough educationally and economically to home school them, send them to private schools, or live in neighborhoods zoned for the "good" schools, then we would be wise to show them with our actions and tell them with our words that not everyone is born so lucky, and that with that luck comes the responsibility to treat every single person with empathy and respect and to give something back to the world.

I know that Alicia's experience was particularly disturbing, but I think of my middle schoolers, especially the troubled ones, and want so desperately for them to get a fair shot, to not get stereotyped or treated harshly for bad choices that have so much to do with their age and their being ill-equipped emotionally and socially for much of what this world presents them with. The system mostly sucks and adolescence mostly sucks, but I think it's all of our job to demonstrate what a society _could_ look like to get the change moving in a positive direction.

You're absolutely right and I should be more careful with my words







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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Teenagers terrify me, you know? I look at my sweet and innocent (ha) boys and at the teenagers I know and they seem totally different species: and then I bear in mind the fact that to the mums of Skye's friends, my loud, boisterous hoydens are just- horrible. Unimaginably awful, and their children will never turn out like that.

Preggo mamas, does anyone else find it a bit surreal sitting here reading the nov05 birthday thread with another baby kicking in your belly? It's just- a bit weird. Y'know?


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 








Teenagers terrify me, you know? I look at my sweet and innocent (ha) boys and at the teenagers I know and they seem totally different species: and then I bear in mind the fact that to the mums of Skye's friends, my loud, boisterous hoydens are just- horrible. Unimaginably awful, and their children will never turn out like that.

Hence the horrible issues I have with those age groups. I never was "allowed" to develop through those years normally and so I'm terrified of my kids getting to that age , kwim?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Preggo mamas, does anyone else find it a bit surreal sitting here reading the nov05 birthday thread with another baby kicking in your belly? It's just- a bit weird. Y'know?

yes!!!!!! it makes it feel like it was so long ago.

I haven't shared pics in a while... don't even know if I am doing it right (I haven't used photobucket in FOREVER).
Tinman & the Lion
Lion & Kitty mama
I got tandy!!!
Sick AND tired
Shocket tookies!!!
Pumpkin farm 1
Pumpkin farm 2


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Winter's entire life flashed before my eyes yesterday. A quick trip to the grocery store began on a very scary note. I was getting the kids out of the car and Gabriel opened both doors on my mom's truck. I couldn't get through to help him as he tried to get Winter out by himself (bless his sweet little helping heart) because there was a car next to us. He set Winter down beside the truck and went to shut the door. He broke his nail off below the quick and started crying...Not noticing that Winter had taken off running into the street. I'm running around the front of the truck because I'm blocked in by the door, screaming Gabriel's name and I see Winter run right in front of a speeding minivan. The fifth time I screamed Gabriel's name he finally heard me and ran and caught Winter JUST. IN. TIME. It was seriously close BY INCHES.

I sat down on the ground and just hugged him. I was still shaking for an hour afterwards and I'm still feeling very shaken by it. I never want to go to the grocery store ever again.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

DID. I'm glad you're all safe.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Monique, those Halloween pictures are just precious. And look at your bump! You made an adorable pregnant black cat







.

Did, how utterly terrifying. I'm so sorry that happened!

So I have read about this, but I'm curious to know if others' toddlers do it. Woody sometimes re-enacts scary things. For example, sometimes when he falls, if he gets hurt, a few minutes or even hours later, I will see him in the same spot falling--on purpose--in slow motion and kind of talking himself through it. Or if he whacks his elbow on the wall, he'll kind of gently hit it again right afterward and say "I hit my elbow! Ow! On the wall!" I know that kids in trauma situations do this as a coping strategy, but do any of your kids who aren't necessarily traumatized







do it?


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

DiD, I am so glad everyone is ok - that is unbelievably terrifying!

Tree - yes, I have seen that with my girls, in varying ways. My middle daughter especially, not so much re-enacting, but she has a great need to talk out things which hurt or disturb her, (sometimes far beyond my tolerance!) and it always seems to me like how one pokes at a loose tooth; it hurts, but you can't keep your tongue off it, you just have to poke it again! I try to really just let her talk it out, to be a source of comfort and reassurance while she sorts through it.... My '05 babe also talks about, rather than re-enacting, say, for instance, when she fell off the chair, for a long time when she was on a chair she would say "fall boom, bonk head" and we would say yes, if you aren't careful it can happen, but we are here, we won't let you fall...
You know, I read once something about the way the brain forms memories, that if one has a memory that is painful and avoids thinking about it, it actually forms a stronger memory, something about the neurons and pathways....that it is better to revisit and think things through, that the brain somehow then can sort of tame down that memory. I wonder if our babes are just trying to process their own "trauma" in a healthy way?

ETA: I love everyone's pics! Jen, your kids are adorable. willemsmama, I second HoneyTree's "love your bump!", and your boys look so cute! E talks the same way as your titles, I had to laugh.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

DiD - I'm glad Winter's ok. I hope your poor nervous system recovers.










Teresa, Rowan talks about *everything* so I haven't really noticed her talking about traumatic stuff specifically. Mind you, nothing traumatic has happened lately. I'll keep an ear open for that though.

Willemsmama, LOVE the pics. Adorable! Yours too Jen









Fern, lovely to hear from you. I wish you were still closer. And I am envious of your snow. No sign of anything remotely close to snow here yet I'm afraid!

Rowan's started picking up phrases from books we read and trying them out on us. For a while she was saying "I got a good idea! I put on my coat and go to cafe and get ice cream!" I was all, wow, we haven't had ice cream in like, forever, nor have we been to a cafe, and good planning with the coat - then I realized that it was a line from "The Tiger Who Came To Tea". Lately it's been "don't be angry with me Daddy! Don't be angry with me Mummy!" which was a bit disturbing until we realized that it's just a transposed line from "Rainbow Fish". But, she does know what "angry" means! She thinks it's hilarious, probably because she's never really seen (or recognized) mama or dada angry. Her sense of humour is pretty well-developed, and surprisingly she totally understands the concepts of "kidding" and "for real". And she's started on the potty humour already. If you ask her what something eats and she doesn't know, she'll answer "monkey poo!" No idea where she got THAT from.

She's also started "reading" on her own. She'll pick up books like "One Fish Two Fish" and "read" the first couple pages. Or she'll pick up one of my novels and make up words for it (usually "Once there was a girl called ROWAN and a dog called DAISY" and then it sort of peters out.)

Anyway, she just gets more and more fun every day. You can almost see her little brain chugging away. And now I have to go brush her teeth. Later!


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## 3.14_Opal (Aug 27, 2006)

My little Piper is going to be two on the 18th- I can't believe how big she's getting


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

oh, ladies,

ezra has not nursed since oct. 30th or 31st, if i remember correctly.

how do i feel about this?

STOKED! woo hoo!

allright, and a little bit like she's so grown up now. but, the break from being on call to nurse constantly is so needed! i am just really relieved that it has been an easy adjustment for her b/c i thought she would NEVER be okay with not nursing; she was sooooo attached to the milka. she still holds "the milkas" every once in a while throughout the day or at night or to nap. and, we get mad snuggles in the bed. and, honestly, i do not think she is really done b/c as soon as she sees this new babe nursing, she will probably want to join right in. i am totally okay with that and kinda looking forward to that bond for them to share and for me to reconnect with ez in that way. i think i will be more comfortable with her nursing, again by then. but, where oh, where have our lil november babies gone?


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

They're still there. There's just a big layer of independence and toddlerdom over them, but that cute ball of fluff (oooh, the fury when I referred to Alex like this earlier







) remains. There's always days when they just want to curl up in a ball with mummy. Or mamma, whatever floats your boat.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Helen, is Guy Fawkes Day celebrated for his capture or for his martyrdom? I've never been sure...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
Oh yeah, I remember that! Those questions may not be as appropriate now (I remember some were like, what is the hardest part of being a mom, etc.) so why don't you do the honors and make us a new list of questions!??









Some questions- if anybody wants to play









*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?

What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?

Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?

How is sleep now?

What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?

If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?
*

Feel free to add questions...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

And I'll start...

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
How fun and funny she is. And how she is so verbal and communicates so well that I feel like we can have amazing conversations and I have such a window into what she's thinking and imagining. And as she becomes more independent she comes back for awesome cuddles now, too.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
Honestly, it's still the sleep deprivation. On nights when I get decent sleep, I'm a much nicer mama the next day. Being a WAHM and working evening shift just compounds this challenge.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
She still nurses a lot- usually at least 5 or 6 times in 24 hours, and more when I'm not working. We're finally seeing a slowing of her hollow leg appetite and a bit of toddler pickiness, but mostly she eats a wonderful variety of solids. And over the past year she has begun to tolerate more foods, with only dairy still being a problem.

*How is sleep now?*
See above... We're not co-sleeping full-time anymore- she starts the night in her own room in a toddler bed. We have had a few great nights with only one waking- but mostly she still wakes two or four or six times







:

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*
She loves playing outside, anything musical (singing, dancing), and drawing. And her tricycle is probably her fave "toy" and mode of transportation.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

Back one year I would tell myself that life will get better. We were just off major transition in our lives, and I was feeling pretty isolated and insecure. I'd tell myself about how much better things would be by now









I don't know about back two years (can't remember my response last time, either). Maybe just to relax and enjoy babyhood as much as possible, since they change so fast.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
I feel like I'm really starting to get to know her, as a person. I look forward to doing things with her, like kitchen projects, or going to a particularly fun store (like the charcuterie, with all its pigs hidden everywhere), or foraging for herbs or mushrooms... she's good company, not just an appendage anymore. And I love her sense of humour and her compassion and caring and the way she tells me "I love you mummy SO much" all sleepily as she detaches from a boob and goes to sleep. I love watching her run and play and seeing how graceful and self-assured she is. And to be completely shallow, I also love the really cute toddler clothes she has right now









*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
Finding things OTHER than the TV to entertain her while I cook dinner and have a shower. So far the dinner challenge has been successful - she is learning to cook right along with me! She especially likes to wash kale. But some days, if she's tired and cranky, nothing but the TV will do. And some mornings I just don't *get* a shower if I'm not willing to turn on the TV for 15 minutes. Also, dealing with things she wants to do but is physically unable, like using the chucker to throw a ball for the dog. That's always a meltdown, we just don't use the chucker for the dog anymore.









*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
Yup, she's still on the boobie. I don't produce a whole lot of milk anymore, but I pumped the other day when she was away for the whole day and discovered that my milk has gone from separating into about 10% cream and the rest skim to being 95% cream and only a teensy bit of watery stuff, so I suspect she's getting almost as much nutrition from it as she was before I went off the domperidone!

She eats people food really well too, and likes a wide variety of foods from every food group. I occasionally complain because she doesn't like some things that I really do, like squash, but really I don't have much cause for complaint, because I know not everyone's two-year-old will happily scarf swiss chard. Her favourite foods are seafood - salmon and prawns. She loves all meat, most fruit, but isn't a huge fan of grains, although she's starting to like bread more and the pumpkin muffins I made the other day went down pretty well. Oh and she'll eat oatmeal quite happily if it's topped with yogurt and honey.

*How is sleep now?*
Meh. Could be better, could be worse. I am letting her nurse at night at the moment because she's off dairy for a bit due to a rash that we suspect is dairy-related, but if I can get her back on yogurt at least then no more night boobies for her.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*
Reading books would have to be #1, and running and playing outside, playing with her toys... she has such a good imagination though, I could give her a couple rocks to play with and she'd be happy for hours. She loves slides, she heads straight for them every playground we go to.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

Back one year... I'd say find some way of getting out of going back to work. I really wish I'd had all that time with her, to really watch her learn her first words and become more physically proficient.

Back two years... I'd tell myself not to stress so much about the breastfeeding, but in a way I'm glad I DID because in the end it led to a very successful breastfeeding relationship. But I wish I hadn't been so hard on myself and hadn't gotten so anxious... there is so much of the first few months that I can't remember at all.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
Helen, is Guy Fawkes Day celebrated for his capture or for his martyrdom? I've never been sure...

That would depend on whether you ask the anarchic MDC member or everyone else... technically, it's for his capture and for the victory of authority over rebellion. Because Guy Fawkes was from Yorkshire, I grew up the next county up and there's a lot of sympathy for him up there. Oppposing the London tyrants and all.
I have a digger and the builders driving past my window. It's quite distracting, but I just keep focussing on how much fun it's going to be to have a big kitchen when we're finished.

What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?

Oooh. I love that she talks. I love that she's so phenomenally affectionate. I love how talented she is, the beautiful arts and craftsy stuff she makes and her scribbles.

What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?

Tantrums. Her language isn't yet fully comprehensive and in particular, she doesn't have any sad or cross words. So we were watching fireworks and she got scared, and she was shouting up,up, happy, happy, happy, up, no. The words just didn't match the behaviour, y'know?
AND, on a more mundane issue, she wants to have a dummy, but keeps on chewing them. It's getting very expensive.

Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?

Heh- once every 2-3 days, maybe? She's eating much better now than she was- she'll eat a full range of vegetables as well as the bread and meat she started off obsessed by, but not raw fruit.

How is sleep now?

Hard to get to, but longlasting once it happens.

What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?

Painting, gluing, sticking ,scribbling. Her baby doll goes everywhere.

If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?

I don't know that there's anything I'd have changed, actually. We had some really tough times with Skye's intense- erm, sod it. She was clingy as all heck, and it really knocked my confidence and made me wonder if we were doing something wrong. Well, now she seems to have grown out of it. She has her comfort objects, like the dummy and baby, and obviously still needs that security to be able to move away from me, but she's doing it and we're doing it and we're all working together.


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Helen, my best friend here is a direct descendent somehow (according to her family history) of Guy Fawkes - I guess her relative had to leave England, changed their name to "Fowkes"..... had you heard anything that might support that? Anyway, it always made us love anything to do w/Guy Fawkes Day. Not that most Americans know much about it....

Back at naptime to answer questions!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Just quickly popping on to say Happy Birthday to all the November Babies!!!!

I don't have time to post, but I'm here, reading along, comforted by the virtual company of all you mamas, during this milestone month.

I have LOVED seeing pictures (willemsmama and QofC and Amy...hope I'm not forgetting anyone), and of course have LOVED seeing those questions and answers about our toddlers.

More soon, and hope everyone is having a lovely start to the week!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I haven't heard of the change of spelling, gingerstar, but it wouldn't surprise me. Part of my family tree went from Burns to Burn to Hepburn to Burn, for no terribly obvious reason. I'm not related to either Audrey or Katherine, as far as I know


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

But you've got their class and spirit!


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
The hugs and kisses, without a doubt. It's really fun too when he starts using new words









*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
Sleep, or the lack of. We still cosleep and he wakes (most nights) at least ever two hours. I feel like I am constantly tired!

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
Yup, I think Keagan will probably nurse until he leaves for college








He doesn't eat well most of the time, but in this last week he has started eating "meals" more consistently, so perhaps that is a sign of a change coming. . . soon I hope!

*How is sleep now?*
Hah! See above.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*
Keagan loves balls, duplos, and books. He thinks dolls are to throw and mommy's knitting is for him to unravel







:

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*
I'm not really sure what I would change. Well, at least how I would do it anyway. I'd love for him to not have bitten all the time or now for him not to hit. I know logically that it is simply his frustration with not being able to communicate what he wants to but it is still hard.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Oh, and Lydia, I'm so glad that Winter is okay!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

I will get to the questions sometime later!

Yesterday we went to Amy's housewarming party, so I will report firsthand that 1) it did take place despite the previous week's basement adventures, and 2) they have done a lot of work on the place, and although I didn't see the house itself before I did get a glimpse at the "before" pictures yesterday and it is certainly a heck of a lot better!!! I have been requested to say hello to everyone on here from Amy, because they are having computer problems and aren't online right now.

Nothing major happening here today. I made some pumpkin chocolate chip muffins this morning, from a recipe I found online but adapted significantly enough that I think it's now a new recipe! They turned out really yummy, luckily I am a very good scientist in the food regard and so I kept careful tabs on my changes so I could replicate them again if they turned out well, or know what went wrong if they didn't! So Ella and I are eating muffins this morning. The heating/cooling company came to do the fall maintenance on the furnace, so it's nice to know that all is running well there. And I'm glad that it's over with, because it was one of those "between 12-4" deals where you could very well be trapped in the house waiting all day long, but they came slightly after noon. So now I'm unexpectedly free the rest of the afternoon and I guess I should figure out what I'm doing.

We are trying to figure out the general outlines of major events for the rest of the year. Namely, the first thing is what we are going to do for Ella's birthday which is on Thursday, then what we are doing for Thanksgiving, then if we are going to go to India and if so, when.







: Personally I don't want to do a major birthday party, and I do want do make Thanksgiving dinner at home, and I really am not enthused about going to India but that's the same old story.

gotta accompany someone to the potty . . . .


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

I nearly have the beads ready to post. Just a few finishing touches and they will be out the door.

I've been struck down by the most horrific autumn cold. I took today off work and it was a relaxing quiet day, but I sure do miss my little pumpkin who went to daycare when DH went to work. It's been too quiet around here.

Jacob's birthday party is Saturday and I am going crazy trying to get everything done. I know it will be perfect even if *everything* doesn't get done, but being one of those perfectionist types and loving the entertaining that birthday's allow me to do will help with getting all the last minute things done.

i've decided to start blogging again. It's been over a year since I stopped and I am realizing I miss it a lot. There was a lot of drama when I ended my blogging days before and since then the *drama* people are no longer a part of my life. It's an exciting thing to go back again. It was neat to sit and read past posts that I've written.

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
Is EVERYTHING!!! an option.?!?! I love his kisses and the way he holds my hand. The look on his face as he runs to me when I get there to pick him up from daycare. The bear hugs I get for no good reason. His "I love you's" and his "Miss you's". The joy and adoration that just emanates from him. His curiousity and the way he explores everything about the world around us. "Feeling" the grass with him and watching his joy at the little things....

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
Being pregnant again. I swear there is nothing really *challenging* per se about Jacob or where he is right now. I mean he is in the normal stage of communication not being where his needs/desires need it to be but I think I could handle it so much better if I wasn't so crazy hormonally pregnant. Somedays I wonder who is this insane woman in my home. *sigh* there is an end to this insanty. If that isn't a proper answer...then I'd have to say the gulf between his ambition and his communication ability.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
OMG yes. All day long and all night long and all the times in between. I can't imagine what I'd be doing right now if I wasn't a CLW advocate or willing and interested to tandem. Does he eat...haha...I joke that he's my garbage disposal. This boy can eat. He has just picked up a new thing that when he doesn't *like* something, he says "LIKE" at the top of his voice and spits it OUT. It's cute now..ask me again in a few weeks.

*How is sleep now?*
Sleep? What's that?!?! We sleep okay...we co-sleep.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?
*
Anything and everything OUTSIDE. Blue's Clues, Signing Time, reading books, balls, sticks, pinecones, bikes, monsters, animals, water, trains, running, jumping, climbing, dancing, singing, slides, drawing, colors, shapes, books, books, books, telling mama and dadi what to do.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say?*
Get out of California, QUIT your job!!!

*Back two years?*
You don't need all that *stuff* everyone is telling you you need. Don't bother ..save yourself the trouble later!! Treasure every second. Marry that man...he's a keeper!!!!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Did I tell you guys about my amazing week of revisiting the past?

Last weekend my ex mentioned that he'd finally tracked down a friend of ours who we'd both lost contact with- his best man, came out to see Alex when he was only days old, that kind of friend. He mattered to us. I got sent an email address and finally figured out what Facebook does.
Monday, I found my best friend from school (yes, I know I'm crap at keeping in touch with people) on Facebook, as well as aforementioned best man.
Tuesday Steve gets a letter through, telling him that some shares he bought in a company that had crashed that he'd written off as a loss nearly a decade ago have brought him some kind of big lump sum payment







He's actually made a profit








Wednesday, I find a comment on my blog from the third person I've been trying to track down recently- apparently she found me via MDC whilst googling biblical homosexuality. I spoke to her last night, and DH is sulking cos I spent an hour on the phone. So I'm happy


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

helen, what a great week the past has brought you! i love catching up with old friends but haven't used facebook. i do have a myspace account though that was originally dh's but i kinda highjacked it. how is the kitchen re-model going? we want to gut ours, too but we better find income first!

Lydia- i never got to reply about your parking lot scare. i am so sorry that happened to you, mama. i am so glad that everyone was okay. i saw a speeding car almost hit my friend's child (ezra's boyfriend, actually) on halloween and my hert rate went through the roof. i mean, speeding in suburbia on halloween with a million kids around? geesh. i hope that you have pleasant grocery store experiences from now on. and, keep giving those of us about to have two kids some tips on how to manage! i need that.

teresa- ez like sto re-tell a story about getting hurt. we fell down the stairs back in bali and she always points to her leg where she had a big scratch and says, "fell into a tree" and other tidbits. she'll even say, "it hurts." about her leg and it's totally healed. she will point ot the other leg and say, "this one okay." so, we listen and talk with her about it.

fern- so jealous about the snow. wishing you all the best as you process this pregnancy and the upcoming labor and birth. i have struggled a bit myself with this pregnancy and now my sacred homebirth space was defiled by renters. so, i am really trying to get mentally over it. we've talked about UC and about having the MW here who caught ez. not sure. i can understand and wish you healing thoughts and a gentle process as you prepare over the next few months.

sarah- i was so surprised to be reading a book along with ez last night and she began saying the words before me. like, wow, even though it's memorized, what a great memory! ps uhm, she has never seen either of you angry? how does that happen? i get so angry sometimes and ez has certainly seen dh and i have a talk while i was upset. do you think i need way more self control b/c it's damaging for ez to see me like that? just curious if you are super peaceful kind of person or if you have tips on how to manage kids not seeing it. either way, i need help in that area! ez sings, "i like boggies on my pizza!" and knows it's gross humor!

my birthday babe just woke up surprisingly early so we're going to open gifts!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
sarah- i was so surprised to be reading a book along with ez last night and she began saying the words before me. like, wow, even though it's memorized, what a great memory! ps uhm, she has never seen either of you angry? how does that happen? i get so angry sometimes and ez has certainly seen dh and i have a talk while i was upset. do you think i need way more self control b/c it's damaging for ez to see me like that? just curious if you are super peaceful kind of person or if you have tips on how to manage kids not seeing it. either way, i need help in that area! ez sings, "i like boggies on my pizza!" and knows it's gross humor!

Happy Birthday Ezra!!!!

In answer to your question, Gunter - yeah, me & DH are pretty mellow. We never fight, we do argue sometimes but it's more nattering than heated argument. I've never raised my voice to DH and vice versa. Anger just isn't a part of our lives, either of us, and we're pretty lucky to have found each other







I have no idea how to manage kids not seeing it







.

Although - yesterday I caught the dog eating the cat's food and I had to put on a super-stern voice and "bad dog" her a lot, that's usually effective for, like, a couple years on any given infraction. Rowan was a little weirded out by that but I talked to her and explained that Daisy could only learn that way (which is unfortunately true) and I had to put on a special voice to talk to her when she did something she really, really musn't do. I didn't touch Daisy, and I was calm throughout, but I did need to almost yell. Rowan handled it pretty well, and later on I caught HER "bad dog"-ing Daisy, I forget what for, but she doesn't have an authoritative voice yet so the dog was happily ignoring her.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Okay I've been a slacker at keeping up with this thread. Here is my go at the questions:

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*

He says and does the silliest things. This morning he said "Good morning mama!" and I about cried it was so cute.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*

He's very explosive and demanding. He wants things when he wants it and not a moment later.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*

He nurses 3-4 times a day. He is a very good eater, and actually makes less of a mess eating than my 4 year old.

*How is sleep now?*

Great. He's been sleeping through the night for about a year and a half now and he still takes a good 2-3 hour nap during the day.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*

He loves to scribble with crayons, dance to music and watch Blue's Clues. It's terrible, the kid is an addict.







His favourite things are his little stuffed purple dragon that he absolutely cannot sleep without, and his daddy.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

Take more pictures. I wish I had more pictures of him from the last two years.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
Lydia- and, keep giving those of us about to have two kids some tips on how to manage! i need that.

I can hardly remember what it was like to only have 2 kids. Life was a lot simpler back then. Co-sleeping, breastfeeding, etc. certainly made things easier on me and made for less work. When Kolaiah was a baby I just carried him in the Maya wrap all the time. As he got bigger and started playing on the floor with Gabriel, they really started to bond as siblings and now that Kolaiah is 4, they play together constantly. Of course sometimes they fight, but Gabriel is so fiercely protective of him. One time Gabriel almost took on a group of about 5 or 6 kids at the park because they were making fun of Kolaiah and pushed him down. I have a picture somewhere I'll have to post.

Going from having one child to having two is definitely a learning experience. It's all about balancing everyone's needs. You will have a few moments, I'm sure, when you'll feel so overwhelmed you can't possibly go on another minute, but then you'll hit your stride, find your new "normal" and then suddenly you won't be able to remember what it was like to only have one child.

You can do it!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Hey everyone! It was so fun to see all of the Halloween pictures. What awesome costumes, *Monique*!! And *Jen*, Ellie and Killie looked adorable as always.

*Happy Birthday today Ezra!!*

*Fern*, it's good to hear from you as always. Sorry to hear about your U/S uncertainty. Your post reminded me of a friend whose daughter was measuring extremely small (like 2nd percentile) in her 3rd trimester and she was freaked the hell out. Turns out her baby was perfectly normal, big if I remember right, and the U/S was totally wrong. Try not to feel guilty, Mama; you went with your instincts and they haven't been wrong before!

*Alicia*, good luck on your return to blogging! I am so glad I started doing it, and just told my BFF that she needs to start one now that she *finally* has a digital camera! It's so much fun to go back and re-read them and see the pictures. I love it!

*Helen*, how fun! I love finding friends from the past. I have hooked up with so many high school friends through MySpace.









Well, let's see....things are finally settling down a bit here. I've been really exhausted the past week or so and finally hit the wall on Saturday and started crying about everything - the house, moving away from our friends, the price of tea in China.







It was good to get it all out, though, and our party on Sunday was kind of like a re-awakening for me. I've done a lot of introspection and have had to face up to the face that I am really bad at pacing myself. I tend to go as hard as I can for as long as I can without a break until I totally burn out, and then I'm bushwacked for like a week and can't to anything. Not to mention I turn into an irritable cranky mess.

So I've been letting our Waldorf experiences (and readings) inspire me to a new daily rhythm that includes indulgence/rest time for myself during Brynn's nap (no more working while she sleeps!) and a to-do list of only ONE project per day. I think it will be really nice if I can keep myself to it.









This is turning into a really long post so I will just add the little survey and be off for now.

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
Gosh....that is hard. She's just so fabulous to me; so beautiful, and smart, and funny. She talks ALL. THE. TIME. And says the sweetest things. She just cracks me up. Her imagination is amazing, so we have fun playing, or I will just listen to her play with her "friends."

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
I guess for me it is having enough energy to balance her need for my attention, and my own need to have some rest.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
She's still nursing! We went through that phase where I really wanted to wean, but I'm happy that we made it through that and we are doing fine as always. She is still kind of inconsistent on the eating, but she will almost always eat chicken, pasta, bread, or corn if offered. She's really broadened her horizons on what she likes though, so I feel like she's getting a pretty balanced diet overall.

*How is sleep now?*
Ugggh. Well...since we moved, she's been back in bed with us which has its pros and cons. On the pro side, she has really turned into quite the snuggler, which she never was before, so I am getting LOTS of cuddles at night, which I love. On the con side, she regressed to waking every 1-2 hours to basically latch back on so she could sleep with my nipple in her mouth, and I finally had to put an end to it and begin night-weaning. It's going well so far and she's already sleeping A LOT better.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*
Dinosaurs, dinosaurs, dinosaurs. Seriously, that's pretty much want she wants to do 24/7. "Mommy, should you play with stegosaurus?" (It's always "should," not "would.") Imaginative play and role-playing are the big things with her. She also LOVES to color and draw....dinosaurs.







But she does have other "friends" that she hauls around the house with us: a big stuffed armadillo (Angus), a Little People zebra and camel, and a stuffed animal frog (Hopkins). She doesn't really seem interested in baby dolls yet.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*
One year? I would definitely tell myself to ease up a bit, stop trying to do it all, and take time every day to relax and do something purely for my own enjoyment!! Two years...probably the same thing!


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

Subbing- will be back later!

So much fun to look at our birth announcement thread







Those were the days







I don't see us on the list, but I did post further down the thread originally. Ezra's bday is the 18th- does anyone else share his same birthday? Just curious!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Awaken* 
Ezra's bday is the 18th- does anyone else share his same birthday? Just curious!

Jacob does!!! Crazy at it all seems since he was due Jan 2, 2006...but yeppers we are an 18th family too.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?
Oh, just her adorable personality! She's so sweet and funny, and is so calm and well-behaved most of the time, but occasionally gets a little devil in her and beats up her brother and says naughty things her brother taught her ("Poopy diapers!" seems to be the preschool equivalent of "Oh, Sh!t!").

What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?
The "no!"s and the random laying down in parking lots. Why must toddlers do that?!

Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?
Still nurses probably 6+ times a day, sometimes I'd guess closer to 12+. She eats great! Not too much of a breakfast person, but eats a really good lunch and a great dinner. Not picky at all, will try most things. Probably her favorite non-treat-type food is beans, the girl loves them! Will pick them out of any dish to eat first!

How is sleep now?
She goes to be about 7-8pm, sleeps through till about 4am when she comes to our bed and then nurses mostly non-stop till we get up at about 7am. If I have trouble sleeping through her nursing, I just lay there and think about all the calories being burned! lol

What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?
She loves play-doh with a deep passionate love that I can't even explain. She plays with it several times a day, every day. She also likes to draw, she's do a little scrible and then tell me what it is ("draw Killy!" "draw Ellie!" etc). She loves being read to, also.

If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?
Um, brace yourself because you'll still be tandem nursing a year from now. lol Actually, I'd probably just reassure myself that Killy and Ellie would grow to be friends. I was worried that they'd never do more than fuss, but they're becoming good friends. It just melts my heart that whenever Killy talks about Ellie he calls her "my Ellie." I'd also reassure myself that we'd make it through our move just fine and that the kids would be sooo thrilled to be close to grandparents, and that David and I would finally have a chance to go out on date-nights and such more often!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Jen, that is great that they are getting along so much better now. I know most people with two children say it is really hard in the beginning, but just gets easier and more joyful every day!

And finally, I have posted pics of the house! You have to go to my latest blog for the link. I hope you enjoy them!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Wow, Amy! I am amazed at the difference! We've been doing a little bit of work on our house, too, but just of the painting variety. Anyone want to explain to me who actually likes faux wood paneling? NOT ME! And, to get rid of it is either ripping it down and having drywall installed, or priming and painting over it. We went with the cheapie method, but I actually don't mind the way it looks once its painted. I keep telling myself its kind of a french country home style... But, back to the point - I cannot imagine doing all you have, Amy, with a toddler in tow! We've been here six months and still have one room to paint, one wall to paint, and a basement to put flooring in. Oh, well... the painting will be done in the next week or so, but who knows when we'll get around to flooring. (right now its a cement floor with lots and lots of rugs!)


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

amy- your house looks fabulous!!! congrats to you on accomplishing all that hard work. we have the same couch and chairs as you all, same soap pump and similar colors on our walls. knew we were like minded but it was really neat to see such similar stuff. enjoy relaxing now! did you have someone install a new door for you or did you do that yourself? We need a new front and back door so i am just curious how difficult they would be to hang.

we had a really fun birthday yesterday. it started with ez opening the gifts from my mom which she sent to us. they were a big stuffed penguin about the size of ezra, almost and a stuffed globe. two totally perfect gifts for ez. she loves that penguin and is already saying, "come on penguin" and pulling it around by the hand. it ate dinner next to her and came to bed with us while we read books. ez insisted that it have a diaper and pajamas just like here so we put one of dh's shirts on the thing and all snuggled in the bed. she had the penguin actually holding the book at one point as she "read" to us.





















we called dh's mom and our good friends in indonesia so they could all wish her a happy birthday. We spent the morning at the park with her friends, accompanied by homemade vegan scones from our co-family (aka her boyfriend's mom). then, we had soup at panera with the same friends and another fam joined us. then, we played in the bookstore and saw another fab family who is very sadly leaving our town for tx next week! but i got to snuggle her 6 week old and ez held him. the second babe she's ever wanted to hold! she napped on the ride home and in the van. we played some more and had dinner. we called my mom, then bath, teeth, books with a penguin and peaceful sleep. she feel asleep with her arm around my neck which was a little bit uncomfortable but i was so wrapped up in her love that i didn't mind.

we never got around to reading the mother's blessings like we did last year or making a necklace with the leftover beads. i guess my bead stuff isn't really set up to work with, yet. i want to make that happen soon. we're still figuring out where to put everything now that some rooms are changing roles.

thank you all for being my mama support over these past almost three years. i would not have wanted to do it without you all! i love mothering with you each. it's an inspiration to talk with you all and read about how you make life work. thank you!


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

If it's the last thing I do, I will post on this thread today!!

I can't believe the birthdays are happening! Glad to hear Ezra and Neela had happy birthdays!

Loved the halloween pics, everyone! Thanks for posting!

Kaspirant- what tough situation. It's sad to think about what kind of home life these kids must have to have. I hope you finish out your time there without any other major incidents.

Gunter- that sounds like a fabulous party idea! I'd love to do something like that, but couldn't get it together in time.

Amy- happy housewarming! I'm glad it went well!

I don't think we are going to have a party







Dh has planned a visit to his parents over Thankgiving, so we will be driving 10+ hours with the kids, and have to pack and get ready on Sunday, his actual bday. I am pretty sad about it b/c that whole week is special to me, when I had Ez and our first Thanksgiving with him, and just remembering our first days together. The IL's will be hectic, noisy, crowded, and they aren't the type to just take the kids and give us a break like most grandparents.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

I am taking a little break right now waiting for DH to finish masking off the walls in Ella's room--I am painting and decorating her room for her birthday. One day before her birthday. Her birthday, tomorrow, when I am having about ten people over for pizza and cake at 6 pm.







: Um, what was I thinking again??!!!!

Seriously though, I am really excited--it is going to look really nice. I had bought curtains before, but I finally just made up my mind and picked out a curtain rod and holdbacks that will go with the decor. So I'm painting the room really fun and nice colors and should hopefully be able to finish the painting tonight, and then put up the curtains by tomorrow. I am also being very good about asking for and receiving help, and not being such a control freak about all the little birthday details--once I decided to do the room, I decided to give in to a rare attack of good sense and realism and abandon my plans of baking her an elaborate cake myself (from scratch of course) and decided to not only get one from the store, but actually let DH pick it out and buy it! And I'm getting some other help as well, so I will not end up spending her birthday in a perfectionistic frenzy working my butt off and can actually enjoy the day!


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

I'm really anxious about Winter's birthday. It's 4 days after the wedding and we are going to be so freaking broke. Poor babe.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Amy, the house looks amazing! Are you always that tidy?














ait, don't tell me. I'm just going to pretend that you, like me, only post pictures when your house is clean!







Seriously, though--it's beautiful. You must be so incredibly glad to be done with all that work!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

DID- if it makes you feel any better, my babe did not get any real birthday gifts from us this year. i was so thankful that my mom's gifts arrived the day before so she could have the nostalgia of opening something that morning! we did buy a table and chair set, books and will get a bed next week for her new room. she helped us pick out the table and chairs and we called it the "happy birthday table". but, nothing to unwrap that morning if it matters.

we had a playdate at the park that i just sent an e-mail to ur friends asking them to come then we had soup at panera b/c she really likes it. and, then we walked on over to the bookstore with her friends. no biggie. we are having a birthday party at the science museum on saturday but i am not doing much for that either. i just have so much going on right now with our house and now our dog has fleas!

but i still want her and her friends to have a fun time. i am helping my best friend bake a cake and we're making it look like the shape of a penguin which is ezra's favorite thing in all the world right now. letting kids go crazy at the science museum means entertainment without much planning from me and no clean up! yay!

we do have 7 containers of organic soy ice cream in our freezer that taunt me to eat them though. must. wait. until. saturday.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Kavita, good for you for asking for help and not trying to do it all yourself! I'll be down that way after Brynn's nap so let me know if I can pick anything up on our way.

Thanks for all the kudos on the house! Honeytree, I have to say I am a very tidy person usually, but yes - the house was especially spotless for photos!







Oh and someone asked about the doors (Jen?) and no, we didn't do that ourselves. Our neighbor is a trim carpenter, so he sent his crew over to fix our front door; it had been kicked in so it needed a new frame, but we kept the actual door.

This week has been *really* nice for us. I've gotten into a new daily rhythm that is working out beautifully for me and Brynn, with the added benefit that I'm not exhausted and cranky by the time DH gets home. I'm really proud of myself for easing up on myself and remembering that life is about love and enjoyment too!

DiD, your post reminded me of a great idea for gifts that I'm going to implement this year with our friends and family. For either Christmas or Brynn's birthday, since they are so close, I am going to ask (but really, insist, in the nicest way possible) that our friends and family members write her a letter telling about someone in our family (her, me & DH, grandparents, anyone we're related to). Then I'm going to find some nice way to bind them, or put them in a beautiful box, and keep them until she's old enough to appreciate reading them. I'm even going to ask my older brother to go visit my grandma (my only living grandparent) and interview her with a tape recorder about her family. We have native american distant relatives (my grandma's grandma, I think) and I'd love to know all about that and be able to pass that information down to Brynn. So anyway, I'm *really* excited about this and thought that even though it's not really something to "open," DiD, you could ask your friends and fam to do the same for Winter!

OK gotta go eat breakfast. Later, Mamas!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

DiD









FWIW, our family is all having lean birthdays this year. We didn't have much money back in August, so Steve and Isaac didn't have huge amounts of stuff to open (well, Steve hardly had anything.) So I feel bad about spending money on Alex and Skye, so we are frugalizing birthdays. I'm currently at the point where I'm trying to decide whether or not it is skanky to give your child a reconditioned art easel for a birthday present. Opinions are welcome- I'm doing the reconditioning, btw. I think handmade is a viable alternative.
We had a huge haul at the scrap store recently- a new doll and clothes, the easel, some paint, a HUGE mound of scrap paper and a huge piece of blue felt, so Skye is in glue-and-stick heaven at the moment. Bless her, she never seems as happy as when she's covered in mess.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Helen, I think the easel sounds awesome! What is wrong with a used one?

Hey did y'all see this? I get more and more furious about this all the time.


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
Hey did y'all see this? I get more and more furious about this all the time.

OMG!!!!!!! That's some seriously scary stuff!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

I finally have my voice back!!!! Sort of. Homeopathics are amazing if you take the right one. Euphrasia cleared up Gabriel's painful, burning pinkeye and mercurius cleared up my sore (understatement!) throat. Anyway, just trying to keep up with the thread here.

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?* His voice. The way he asks for things politely and sing-songy, especially when he asks for his vitamins, his cuddly personality and the way he greets me in the morning (all hugs and smiles, sometimes whining for a banana or cereal or a muffin).

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?* Having the patience and mental creativity to deal with his headstrong ideas.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?* No we stopped because it was causing such severe sleep deprivation for me I thought I was going crazy. He's all meat, eggs, and dairy. He'll eat grains and veggies too, and all around I think he's a pretty good eater, but if there's no meat he freaks out.

*How is sleep now?* Beautimous. He falls asleep easily by just walking him around for a few minutes then stays asleep all night most nights. If he wakes up in the middle of the night, he usually comes across the hall and crawls in bed with us. My favorite nights are the ones when the boys fall asleep, arms draped over each other.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?* Sometimes it is hard to tell because he's always following his older brother. He loves turning the lights on and off (so is constantly asking for me to pick him up so he can reach the switches). He loves keys, especially keychains that have our car keys (and the remote lock buttons). He loves vacum cleaners and spray bottles. And painting on huge rolls of paper on the floor. He loves Mater, Lightening McQueen, firetrucks, Bob the Builder characters, wrestling with daddy and Willem, yarn monsters, marnerstins (willem's made up word that explains whatever), cheese, plain yogurt, and bananas.

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?* Two years? To give dh have time alone with Gabriel (maybe switch off who did bedtime routine with Willem when Gabriel was an infant), to not always have to be the one with the baby. I feel I sort of inhibited their bonding because I was always with Gabriel and would hand Willem off to dh when he came home. I also should have gotten a double stroller a LONG time ago (like before baby #2 was born). And spent more time outside. And allowed myself to meet other moms, even if they mothered differently than myself.

Thanksgiving is so soon! Gabriel's birthday is in a week and I have not done ANY prep yet! I went out shopping today and was so lost. Couldn't find anything on my list of possible birthday presents. We plan on celebrating as a family, at home, with chocolate zucchini cake! I want to do ballons and streamers and have him wear a birthday hat. Maybe we'll all go out to the plate painting shop after cake and make a birthday plate for him. Dh thinks he might be a bit young for that so maybe we'll paint a Christmas ornament with each of the boys.
Then for Thanksgiving, we're going up to my parents and will see my brother and his wife and three kids. Chris and I decided we're going to cook the majority of Thanksgiving dinner because after living with my parents for those two months in the beginning of the year we know my mom's cooking all to well - everything sort of thrown together at last minute, bland, overcooked and blah. Of course it's too late to reserve an all natural turkey







:. So my next two weeks are going to be pretty full!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

I have just washed the dishes, started dinner prep, cleaned the bathroom (including discovering that bathtub crayons are much more washable if you don't keep the masterpieces for several days) filed 50 bits of paperwork, and am allowing myself a much deserved MDC break. Then back to filing...I'm missing an important little bit of paper that I'm convinced is in our office if I can only get the paper piles under control







:

I'm also enjoying an afternoon with Neela at daycare and me NOT working, and amazed at how much I can accomplish without toddler "assistance".

*Amy* I thought your girlasaurus Brynn might enjoy Neela's latest new song (to the tune of frere Jacque). She learned it at daycare and came home and taught me:
Stegosaurus, stegosaurus/ In the swamp, in the swamp/ Spikes on his tail, sharper than a nail/ Stomp stomp stomp, stomp stomp stomp (and imagine good stomping actions to accompany it).

*Kavita* Good luck with the party- have fun!

*DiD* I can't believe your wedding is sooo close! Are you getting totally excited?!

*Helen* I think a refurbished easel sounds delightful. What a great score.

*Gunter* The science museum sounds like so much fun. And seven containers of ice cream? Are you having a huge party?

*Monique* I'm glad you're feeling better. Neela and I did plate painting for my MIL for mother's day, and she did fine. I was nervous about her breaking stuff in the display area, but once we settled at a table it was great. They even had a highchair so she didn't have to stand on her chair.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
*DiD* I can't believe your wedding is sooo close! Are you getting totally excited?!

Um, not exactly. More like freaking out and hyperventilating.







:


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

just bumping us up from the third page







:


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Mel, I sang Brynn the dinosaur song this morning and she LOVED. IT. I wish you could have seen the look on her face - it was like she'd opened a wonderful present. It was priceless.


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## zjande (Nov 4, 2002)

I'm late for the 2nd birthday thread! I had totally meant to participate in this month's b-day thread from the beginning. But, I did just read every word posted so far, and I want to say
HAPPY BIRTHDAY NOV05 BABIES!







:







:

I cannot believe it's been 2 years!! I LOVE going back & reading in our old DDC. I've done it many times just for fun, & have especially enjoyed reading things I wrote during each week of my pregnancy & comparing it to this pregnancy (it is mind boggling how *exactly* the same they are). In fact, I have so many moments that feel like such deja vu because here I am with a belly full of baby, dealing with everything related to that, and chatting with my Dec07 ddc & I feel over & over like "Whoa. Wasn't I JUST saying/doing/thinking/living this with Xeowyn like yesterday??" Time flies.







:

There's like 84million things I want to respond to that you guys have mentioned. I wish I'd gotten on our darn thread earlier in the month! I love reading your updates- Xeowyn is so similar to your munchkins in so many ways! It'd be SO fun to see all our Nov05 ddc kids together.

We're going to have a small party for Xeowyn on his actual birthday, the 26th. I'm going to take him to the party store & let him pick out some themed plates (I'm sure it will be Elmo, Bob the Builder or Blue's Clues), get some matching balloons, & bake him some sort of yummy thing. We're giving him finger paints, books for toddlers about potty learning, home made playdough, & puzzles.









Last year his bday was a big deal because our whole family was already here visiting for Thanksgiving, but this year they're all saving their trip until Christmas, when our baby's due!









Things will always be so crazy for us this time of year - Thanksgiving, then Xeowyn's birthday, then Christmas AND/or the new baby's birthday, then my bday Jan 16th, & our wedding anni Jan 29th. Craziness I tell ya!

I apologize for being so very lazy at the moment, I don't want to go fishing around for pictures to post.







But, you can scroll through the pages of my blog linked in my sig & you will come across many, many pictures of us all.









So is everyone going to post pictures from their shortlings 2nd birthday parties like we did with their firsts or what???





















:


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## zjande (Nov 4, 2002)

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*

The way he makes me laugh! And fills me heart with happy fuzzies!







He is just so darn adorable & clever & loving & hilarious. He makes us all smile 99999.999 times per day.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*

That's easy! Two things: 1. The temper tantrums he throws in public. Here I am nearly 34 weeks pregnant, trying to peel my screeching & wildly kicking toddler off the parking lot pavement while a truck sits there waiting for me to do so. Or leaving a store with bags over my arm & my wailing toddler decides to lay on the floor in the door way.







Oy that's frustrating.

2. He throws EVERYTHING! All. The. Time. Anything he can get his hands on, food, painfully heavy blocks, groceries on the shelf at the store - & hucks them across the room. If I am lucky, they don't land against my poor 9 yr old's forehead.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*

My son is still quite the booby barnacle. He's on the boob this very moment. He still bfeeds many times per day & night. My milk dried up when I was 14 weeks along, but he hasn't seemed to notice.







I can't wait to see the look on his face when my milk comes in after this baby!

*How is sleep now?*

Well, my being so ginormously pregnant subtracts from my sleep far more than Xeowyn does.







He's co-sleeping completely with us now that I can't lean over to put him in or out of the pak n' play at the foot of our bed. He still wakes to nurse maybe 3-6 times a night. It might be less if my getting up to pee every hour didn't disturb him.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*

Boob. He calls it "boo-ah". He adores his family, loveslovesloves his dada, playing with his siblings & just being on our laps whenever we're doing anything interesting. He also loves videos more than I wish he did. I limit them but he has at least a couple tantrums per day because I won't let him watch Bob the Builder AGAIN. He loves coloring, asking us to draw things for him (today he handed me a crayon & told me to draw "poop! poop!"







So I drew little poops behind the rabbit he'd already asked me to draw), playing in the kitchen sink, reading books, & playing outside. And he loves every one of the stereotypical BOY things- he's always carrying cars around, balls, monsters, making anything remotely shaped like a gun into one, duplos. He throws the dolls I offer him across the room & then runs up & kicks them over & over like they're a football.














(I DO hope he responds better to his new baby brother/sister!!







)

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

You know, I just can't think of anything.







My life is fabulous. I'm so grateful I get to live it.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Pah. For a moment, Zjande, I thought that was a birth announcement... good to hear from you though







Alex had no time for baby dolls either (he bit his dolls penis off














 but has always been pretty good with animals and was pretty good with Isaac. Funny, I was thinking about you the other day, because Spark (remember that thread?) is pregnant again








Sorry, I need to get some pictures uploaded to photobucket, and I know that. I'll do it though.
Monique, I'm sorry you've been feeling so poorly. You've somehow electronically shared it though: Wednesday night I went to yoga and felt fine and made the mistake of using the words "easiest pregnancy I ever had..." Don't EVER do that. EVER. Anyone.
Thursday, I popped my symphsis pubis joint out of place, so now all three joints are hypermobile and grinding against each other. It's not as bad as it sounds (yet) but from experience, I know that this has the potential to get a lot worse. And my family spent the whole day shouting at me for being so weepy and cranky and irrational








Friday I got out of bed to discover my nose was a bit stuffed up, I'd added another 4inches on my waistline, waddled when I walked and was having major Braxton Hicks. I have constant rivers of snot running down my face. And Isaac just asked what that icky green stuff on the TV screen (six foot away on the other side of the room) is.







: This is just FOUL.


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

Just wanted to say, all these things are still making me laugh everytime I think about it!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zjande* 
He loves coloring, asking us to draw things for him (today he handed me a crayon & told me to draw "poop! poop!"







So I drew little poops behind the rabbit he'd already asked me to draw),


Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Alex had no time for baby dolls either (he bit his dolls penis off














but has always been pretty good with animals and was pretty good with Isaac.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
the other night, she was singing it and laughing hysterically barely got the words out, "i like boogies on my pizza." where did she learn this? once i figured out what she was saying, we spent the next five minutes laughing and repeating it and me saying, "gross" which would get her laughing all over, again!
















:

Helen, really, really,really hope things get better soon.


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

Hey girls, popping in to say hi. Getting all nostalgic around this time...and if there's an off-mothering list still going on, can someone let me know? I am trying to ramp off discussion boards, but would like to still chat with y'all.

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*

He is very funny, as funny as a toddler can be with a vocabulary under 200 words. He gives a lot of hugs and kisses and isn't as crazy as I thought he was going to be. I think things are going on inside his head (I hope so), but he's a low-talker, very much in the telegraph stage.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*

That whole no-talking thing -- very different from his sister. He wants to do everything his sister does, I mean everything. He freaks out when we have to leave her at school, he wants to look at her Pokemon cards, he wants to eat whatever she's eating. I fully expect him to wear dresses and tights in the coming years.

He's also shy. What's up with that? That doesn't work well with my lifestyle!

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*

He nurses to sleep; and he eats a lot, but at random times. He'll have a big breakfast, and live on air for the rest of the day.

*How is sleep now?*

Hahahaha. I remember sleep. It used to happen a long, long time ago. He refuses to nightwean, which adds to my suspicion that he is secretly a vampire baby. I mean that in a good way.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*

Maisy the Mouse. Isabelle. When dad comes home. Library storytime. Music. Maisy. Jumping. Maisy. Did I mention Maisy? Also Ernie and Susan and Tom and Pippo. He is totally obsessed with all of them. Also, puzzles -- which bucks the family puzzle-hating trend. Get that Sudoku away from me, bah!

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

Second children can be very, very different from first children...surprise!

And, EC rocks, will work out very well (he was completely PT by 18 mos) and save you lots of money. So don't cry over wet diapers.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Today was the second birthday party...you can read about it on the blog! Pictures coming soon.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*

She is very, very sweet and affectionate and loving. She is very confident and sociable and can charm the pants off of people in public. She is hilariously funny. She is very polite, says please and thank you for things, which I really appreciate. She bursts out with some new word or song or concept almost every day, often multiple times per day. She is really sensitive to the feelings of others. Her memory is insanely, unbelievably good. She is learning so many things, and enjoying it so much. She talks so much and is able to really communicate tons more. She is left handed, and holds a pen or pencil just like an adult and draws with it, and gets this very serious and pensive look on her face--I just like the left handed part because it's another way she's like me and something we have in common, but she looks so much older when she "writes", and I can almost imagine her as her older self. She is just cute and beautiful as can be. I also appreciate the fact that her world is starting to broaden and that she is able to really enjoy some time without me or her dad--she has a couple of babysitters that she really loves and she is seems as happy to be rid of me sometimes as I am to have a little break from her, so that's a nice part of this stage as compared to her earlier infant/toddler days.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*

The tantrums and the "no no no!" The boundary testing and being oppositional--she is into trying to run down the driveway toward the street because she knows it will get me to chase her. She is so curious and is into absolutely everything--nothing can go untouched or unexplored. Which is good, but can drive me crazy in, say, the grocery store, or trying to handle breakable items. She has to walk everywhere--hates the stroller and the ergo now, won't ride in a grocery cart without a major fight. The pickiness--she is sooooo picky about every.little.thing. Everything has to be what she wants, when she wants it, the precise way she wants it. If I try to put the "wrong" shirt on her, she throws a fit. She is very particular about everything these days, and has definite ideas about what she wants and doesn't want. It makes it very hard to manage her and get through the day--sometimes she really tests my patience and I find myself getting angry, and sometimes I just feel like I don't know the right way to handle some situations and I doubt/second-guess myself. So I don't always feel like a very skillful parent.

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*

She still nurses, variable times per day. Sometimes it's just morning nap and bedtime, sometimes it's more often during the day or she'll wake up more at night. Overall, she's slowing down but she still is quite attached to the "num-nums", especially if she's sick or teething or just not feeling right. She eats fairly well in terms of solid food, but not as well or as much as she did from 6 mos.--about 18 months. I think part of it is her overall pickiness, and part of it is her growth slowing down somewhat.

*How is sleep now?*

Sleep is fairly good. It sometimes takes forever to get her to sleep and I have to nurse her to sleep, but generally once she's asleep she's down for most of the night until about 5 am when she starts to sleep more lightly and begins the morning nurse-a-thon. Often when I don't sleep well it's my own fault for staying up too late to have extra "me-time." She has started being much more able to go to sleep on her own with Daddy or even babysitters, and I'm working on letting her nurse but then just snuggle and sing songs and such to fall asleep and that's going okay.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*

She loves the park, especially the slide. She loves buses and gets really excited when she sees a bus on the street. She loves my cell phone, talking to grandma or daddy on the phone, drawing and coloring especially if it's a grownup pen, tapping away on the computer and pushing keys, she loves her doggies. Lately she likes grabbing our one dog (the one who will let her, lol) by the collar and walking her around the house saying "c'mon! c'mon!" She loves the zoo and really likes the elephants and the gorillas and monkeys especially. She also has a thing for turtles. She likes stickers, and playing with stickers. She likes climbing up on everything. She loves being read to and lately will sit and read her books to herself, or just look at the pictures. She likes me to sing to her. She really likes to play outside, and do bubbles. She also really adores our elderly next door neighbors, and likes spending time with them. She really loves water, and will play at the bathroom or kitchen sink forever if I let her. She is into wearing bracelets and necklaces, especially if they are mine and I'm trying to wear them! She also likes wearing hats. She talks about her friends Brynn and Noah Sage a lot!

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*

Hmmm. This is a tough one. Sometimes I wish I had been better about trying the whole "Pantley pull-off" thing and not let her get so used to nursing to sleep all the time--that has been difficult for me sometimes. It also might not have been so terrible to have a crib that she could sleep in from time to time, for instance, when putting her down for naps. I think I would tell myself to be a bit more disciplined about setting a routine for her and myself, and also to exercise and get back into better shape sooner after she was born when I still had a good excuse for being out of shape!! Back one year, I would tell myself to find some babysitters that she likes and use them more often--she will enjoy playing with someone new and you will be way less stressed if you have some help and some time to yourself to get done the things you need to do, especially with the upcoming cross-country move.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kavita.

OK, I've been thinking over and over about this in my head and can't come to a quiet place in myself: and I know Amy and Gunter have been somewhere similar with having homes that just don't feel clean anymore.
The story: Thursday, the floor for the extension was laid. It was a horrible day over here, raining, miserable, everyone was cranky. Friday, we got a phone call from our contact at the council confirming that we have the full grant that we're entitled to,and in the course of conversation it came up that the subcontractor who had been doing the groundwork for our extension was arrested on Thursday night for murdering his wife. Right now I'm falling to pieces and having nightmares about the rape and Rowan's birth all those years ago, plus some of the nastier moments with my ex. We don't know too many details, btw, but all the neighbours are gossiping- he's the kind of chap who knew a lot of people.

So yeah. That's been my week, with the addition of a bad cold and the third joint in my pelvis going. Right now, I don't want this extension, I just want it all to go away and for me not to have to think about it. And I am just really freaking out because one day, my gorgeous, beautiful, innocent little girl is going to come up against the reality of violence against women- against her, or one of her friends- and the chances are that in another 18-20 years time, nothing will have changed







Really fed up today.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Helen - I'm so sorry. What an awful week!

I have to post really quick before I head off to church... we finished Ellie's room! The difference is absolutely unbelievable! I'm so happy its done! By the way, I made the valences and both quilts in the room.









Ellie's "new" room!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Wow, Jen! That is amazing! You did a fantastic job. What is the quilt fabric? I couldn't quite see it?

Helen, sorry you are feeling so down. It sounds like an avalanche of bad feelings. I hope that you can tunnel your way out soon.

I have loved reading all of your musings about the toddlers. Aren't they so much fun? We finally decided today that we're going to have a really informal get-together at the zoo for Brynn's birthday. It might be a little on the cool side, but the idea of having a house full of toddlers?







: No thanks! The party is actually the day before her birthday, so for the actual big day, I think we're just going to have a day of doing something special and fun just for her, and make her favorite dinner and let her watch a Baby Einstein DVD.









Oh, Honeytree, I was thinking of your post (about my tidyness) yesterday and cracking up: yes, my house is usually really tidy. But my car??














: It is like the Pit of Despair!!!

I was giong to tell y'all something else but I don't remember what.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Thanks, Amy! Both quilts are butterfly themed. Here's a link to my album of quilts I've made, there are sub-albums with bigger pictures of both: Ellie's quilts. The one on the bottom bunk is really busy and scrappy looking (more so than I had planned), so I went the opposite direction with the quilt on the top bunk and did really big simple blocks with big butterflies.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

I'm glad painting the paneling worked out Jen! It looks nice! Definitely a lot brighter and lighter.

We're still working on Ella's room. And by "working on" I mean that, everything from her room is out in other parts of the house, the room is painted but nothing else has been accomplished yet! I had high hopes of getting a few more things done in her room before the birthday party, but of course we got a little behind schedule, part of which was my fault because I didn't start the painting until too late the night before, but part of which was because my babysitter who was going to come watch Ella and help with some part prep the afternoon of her bday was sick. So that set things back a little bit. I think things happenned more or less on the schedule that I had planned with the party itself though, so that went well. We were just so exhausted after that that we didn't do much, and maybe we'll get some of the rest of it done (curtains hung, furniture back in) today or this week. The painting, anyway, is done and I'm happy with it, so that's the bulk of the work!

This morning I made some pumpkin chocolate chip muffins (which DH is in love with) and Ella actually seemed to really enjoy helping stir, dump ingredients in, etc. It's kind of good to know that she may actually be developing the patience and interest to help (or rather, "help") because parents are coming to my place for Thanksgiving. I had this dreamy vision of hosting my family and having my parents and sister and her family come down here for Thanksgiving this year, now that we're living within a reasonable driving distance (it's about 6-7 hours.) So I brought it up months ago, and my sister was sort of unsure, and then my mom was sort of unsure, and the next thing I knew my parents had hotel reservations as of Thursday! So they are coming, but my sister is probably not. I love Thanksgiving, and I actually really like cooking for it, and so I'm now in the planning stages. I hope I can still get a natural turkey ordered/reserved now!! It might be a little late in the game for that, but I'm not sure how things go around here.

On that note, has anyone read Barbara Kingsolver's book, "Animal, Vegetable, Miracle" ?? I just finished it--I had to wait several months with it on reserve at the library, but my time finally came and I did enjoy it. She talks a lot about turkeys, in particular naturally breeding heirloom breeds, which is what makes me think about it right now . . . .

Helen--sorry to hear about your contractor, that sounds really icky. Hope you feel better, physically, mentally and spiritually, soon.

Amy--birthday party sounds fun!

Kaspirant--Glad you survived the big birthday bash! I haven't checked out the pics yet but I will soon.

Zjande--wow, you're getting close to having a new little one!!!! I'm actually starting to get all excited now!!! I think you're leading the pack of the new crop of Nov. 05 babes' younger siblings! (Of course there is another younger sibling or two out there, but yours will be the first of a whole bunch coming close together!)

Mel--Glad you had some time to get some things accomplished! I love having the house to myself for a little while to get stuff done, without having to constantly be guarding both life and property!!!!

DiD--what the actual wedding date again?

Willemsmama--glad to hear you're all on the road to recovery!

Well, I'm off to try to accomplish something today!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
I'm glad painting the paneling worked out Jen! It looks nice! Definitely a lot brighter and lighter.

It works great as long as you prime it very well first with primer designed to go over wood paneling. Its a huge pain in the butt, but the results are so worth it. We've been painting over wood paneling since we moved here six months ago, and its finally ALL GONE!

Cooking with toddlers - welcome to my life! I do a lot of cooking, and especially with how our house is set up now (the kitchen and family room are open, and the couch is backed up against the kitchen counter where I do all my cooking prep, so the kids stand on the couch and help with everything). Its such good practice counting, measuring, mixing, etc... but I'm always nearly ready to pull my hair out after all the "help!" Now, instead of muffins taking me 10 minutes to make, its a 30 minute ordeal with another 20 minutes of clean up afterward...







: I shouldn't complain, though, I know the kids love it.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kavita, what happened about your trip to India in the end? I was just remembering that with Zjande leading the pregnancy epidemic, you'd been thinking out loud about maybe trying after you went to India- which was going to be last month???

Jen, I love the quilts







I have no idea how you find the time- or the patience, though. I know you can't just drop a sewing machine whilst you chase after a rambunctious 2yo, at least not so easily.

Thanks for listening to me grumble: I just feel all up in the air about this (and Sunday night is phone-call-from-the-ex night, which never helps.) I know I should just be taking this as a reminder of how blessed I am in my life right now, but I'm having a hard time getting back to my happy place.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Ah, the cooking with toddlers... Rowan helped me make bread this morning, which was kind of fun because she thinks the stand mixer is HILARIOUS and giggled the whole time the bread was kneading. (I held her up so she could see it while it thumped the bread around.) Then I gave her a bit to play with, and I took another little bit and made her a bread bird. Then she got a bit frustrated with her bits and DH swooped in and made the CUTEST little bread bunny. Truly, he has unexplored talent in decorative pastry.







They baked up a little lopsided but I'm sure Rowan will enjoy them when she wakes up.

Helen - BIG







.





















. I hope next week goes better for you.

Zjande -







enjoy the last bit of your pregnancy!

Jen - FABULOUS job on Ellie's room! Makes me wish Rowan HAD a room to decorate... she doesn't have her own space at all. Honestly we don't really feel the lack, except I go to other mama's houses and see all their toys confined to one room and I admit I am a little jealous. But our place is nice in other ways. Sort of.

Kavita - yes I read Animal Vegetable Miracle and I LOVED it. Especially the turkey sex bits.









After reading everyone's responses to the questions I feel like Rowan is a bit... I don't know, like there's some element of frustration with life in general that she's kind of missing. I mean, she gets frustrated, and sometimes whines a bit if she's singing a song and it doesn't sound like she thinks it should (bit of Daddy's perfectionism already I think - "mummy I can't sing! I can't sing that song!" and really, she's got all the words and maybe loses the tune a bit here and there) but she's never actually thrown a tantrum. She always responds to comfort or distraction. Theoretically this is a good thing, it certainly makes my life easier, especially shopping, than many of you - but it doesn't seem quite normal, kwim? Although, according to my mom, I was like that, and was just a really mellow kid. A blessing, probably - except the next kid will probably be like DH when he was a child and be just a walking sulking tantrum.

Yes, I said next kid. We're starting to think in that direction but my IUD is still firmly in place. I'd like to lose at least 20 lbs before we start trying, I don't think I'd be very comfortable pregnant with my weight the way it is now. So that'll take a few months, but we definitely want to have another one before Rowan is 4.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

i am So sorry i have been so behind this month!
i've been reading along almost daily, but haven't had the right circumstances, or time or energy to write. i'm with you all in spirit, and will share my two-year thoughts as soon as possible.

for now, i wanted to pop on and say hi and send big hugs to everyone, especially the mamas needing it right now.

finley turned two yesterday. it was a really beautiful, calm, fun day. i had rehearsal in the morning, then came home, baked a cake, and we had a little celebration with balloons, some presents, my sister in law, and our next door neighbors who have a little boy 18 months old. finley got a choo choo train, his true love and passion and obsession these days, and was deeply intensely and quietly ecstatic about it, sitting by his new train, pulling it along or watching it for, literally, hours.

we had the pleasure of seeing kaspirant and her man and her little boy, and it was so nice to catch up and see them again, finally, after trying for so long. jacob is a ball of light and energy and joy and action. finley is quite shy and sensitive with new people...the two were just about opposites. it's too bad we don't live closer, or else the two boys might be able to get used to each other and start playing together...maybe one day.

i took a bajillion pictures of our day yesterday, which you can see on the link below.

http://web.mac.com/hillarybaack/iWeb...thday%202.html

i'll be in touch, probably not til later this week, with comments to everyone, and the answers to the 2 year questions. this is my big week with the abc showcase happening on wednesday, so for the next three days, my life is going to be crazy crazy.

you're all in my thoughts! how grateful i am to have you all through this mothering journey, and on this two year milestone, how clear and strong that blessing is. thank you all!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Ah, the cooking with toddlers... Rowan helped me make bread this morning, which was kind of fun because she thinks the stand mixer is HILARIOUS and giggled the whole time the bread was kneading. (I held her up so she could see it while it thumped the bread around.) Then I gave her a bit to play with, and I took another little bit and made her a bread bird. Then she got a bit frustrated with her bits and DH swooped in and made the CUTEST little bread bunny. Truly, he has unexplored talent in decorative pastry.







They baked up a little lopsided but I'm sure Rowan will enjoy them when she wakes up.

Helen - BIG







.





















. I hope next week goes better for you.

Zjande -







enjoy the last bit of your pregnancy!

Jen - FABULOUS job on Ellie's room! Makes me wish Rowan HAD a room to decorate... she doesn't have her own space at all. Honestly we don't really feel the lack, except I go to other mama's houses and see all their toys confined to one room and I admit I am a little jealous. But our place is nice in other ways. Sort of.

Kavita - yes I read Animal Vegetable Miracle and I LOVED it. Especially the turkey sex bits.









After reading everyone's responses to the questions I feel like Rowan is a bit... I don't know, like there's some element of frustration with life in general that she's kind of missing. I mean, she gets frustrated, and sometimes whines a bit if she's singing a song and it doesn't sound like she thinks it should (bit of Daddy's perfectionism already I think - "mummy I can't sing! I can't sing that song!" and really, she's got all the words and maybe loses the tune a bit here and there) but she's never actually thrown a tantrum. She always responds to comfort or distraction. Theoretically this is a good thing, it certainly makes my life easier, especially shopping, than many of you - but it doesn't seem quite normal, kwim? Although, according to my mom, I was like that, and was just a really mellow kid. A blessing, probably - except the next kid will probably be like DH when he was a child and be just a walking sulking tantrum.

Yes, I said next kid. We're starting to think in that direction but my IUD is still firmly in place. I'd like to lose at least 20 lbs before we start trying, I don't think I'd be very comfortable pregnant with my weight the way it is now. So that'll take a few months, but we definitely want to have another one before Rowan is 4.


I've previously tried cooking with Ella, but she hasn't had interest for more than about 2 seconds until today. I'm excited! I have a learning tower, and like I was telling Amy the other day, I bought it because I had these beautiful fantasies of baking wholesome things with her by my side in the learning tower kneading bread or stirring or what have you, but until this point she's mostly used it (the learning tower) for dragging around the kitchen to reach things she's not supposed to reach and get into and do things she's not supposed to do. Like once I walked out of the room for a moment and came back and found she'd climbed out of it up on top of the dishwasher and was hurling onions from a high shelf into the sunroom.







:

flapjack--the India trip keeps getting put on hold for one reason or other. We were thinking of going over xmas but as it turns out it will likely be more like January or so, because there is some business that has come up that can't be put off that will prevent us from going in December. As far as our reproductive plans, they are indefinitely on hold. The idea of a two year spacing between giving birth and getting pregnant again seemed acceptable as a sort of vague theoretical construct. But now that that time has drawn closer and finally rolled around, I have realized that I am just not ready to be pregnant again or have another baby right now. And that I should not rush it based on an idea that my fertility is declining, because in all likelihood I will only have two children, and so I want to really be able to enjoy the pregnancy and the baby which will most probably be my last, which means waiting.

And part of that, like you spughy, means losing some weight first. I actually only gained about 20-25 lbs with Ella and I lost it all within two weeks of giving birth. Unfortunately, I have gained some of that back, so I am not only above my prepregnancy weight, I have the unfortunate distinction of also being above my postpartum weight!!







: Right now I am just really annoyed with myself about the whole thing. I want my pregnancy to be filled with belly pictures and cute maternity clothes--right now I would be headed for 9 months of muu-muus and incontinence!







Just sayin' . . . .

So spughy--wanna motivate each other?


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Helen, what a horrible thing, I am so sorry you are having to deal with this; pg hormones are not making it any easier, I am sure. Sending you peaceful, centering vibes









barcelona, what a sweet beautiful boy you have - and your pictures are amazing. If you decide to stop acting, I am sure you can make a living with photography! Although I'm sure part of it is your darling subject!

FSM - so glad you stopped by for a chat!

Jen, you are amazing. You are Supermom, that is all I can say!









Sarah, Rowan just seems like such a special girl, I would love to meet her!
(Actually, I would love to meet each and every one of you and your DC!!)

Kavita, I am coming to your house for Thanksgiving!







Now I have to bake some pumpkin choc chip muffins, too.... mmmmm

DiD - happy wedding day, mama! (whenever it is...) Hope it all comes together for you.

zjande, I always love reading your posts, you are so up, enthusiastic, and cool! I love your awesome bump, you are one beautiful mama!

Ok, I think I finally have time for this...

*What do you enjoy most about your toddler right now?*
This is just such a fun age, she is learning and growing and just fun to be with! She is an intriguing mix of baby and child, has her own ideas and plans, and then will want to be on my hip like a little one.... She has gotten quite independent for the most part, but is pretty easy going for two.

*What is the most challenging thing about this age/stage for you?*
Communication can be tricky sometimes - she talks well, but there is much she says I have to work at understanding. I have never had that trouble with my other two, but sometimes she is trying to tell me something, and we both get frustrated. She can be very singleminded - once she is set on something, she will get it come heck or high water....

*Does your kiddo still nurse? How "well" does he/she eat?*
Oh, my, yes.... 3 - 6 times at night, and often the morning marathon, when I would really like to pee. But there is nothing sweeter than her little voice in the night, when I ask if she wants to nurse, saying "Yes peese Mommy!" During the day varies, always to nap unless she naps in the car, but still pretty frequently. She is quite a good eater, sometimes I am amazed at how much she will eat.

*How is sleep now?* Well, if we weren't cosleeping it would suck, since she nurses frequently, but mostly it is fine.

*What are your toddler's favourite activities? Favourite things?*
Being outside, music, dancing, and of course her sisters are her fave, and everything they do, she has to be part of. She is quite the Daddy's girl, too. She loves to play with little animals and people, she will bring me a piggy, or a tiger, and say "Pway wif?" How could I possibly say no? She loves to color and "write" - we are working on the minor detail that those need to be done on paper....







She loves purses (mine, or her sisters play purses) and will sling one over her shoulder and say "Bye Mommy, see ya soon!"

*If you could go back one year and give yourself advice, what would you say? Back two years?*
One year, that she would come un-Velcro'd eventually....Two years, that it would be alright - my DH was still gone, and I was so worried about her not really knowing her Daddy. I needn't have worried.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

My wedding date is December 1st. 20 days from today (Sunday)

I am so wrapped up in the Holiday Helper it's making it impossible for me to obsess over the wedding. Which is so good for me, because I was stressing so bad about it.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 

And part of that, like you spughy, means losing some weight first. I actually only gained about 20-25 lbs with Ella and I lost it all within two weeks of giving birth. Unfortunately, I have gained some of that back, so I am not only above my prepregnancy weight, I have the unfortunate distinction of also being above my postpartum weight!!







: Right now I am just really annoyed with myself about the whole thing. I want my pregnancy to be filled with belly pictures and cute maternity clothes--right now I would be headed for 9 months of muu-muus and incontinence!







Just sayin' . . . .

So spughy--wanna motivate each other?

Hell yeah! It's always good to have someone to be 'accountable' to! I actually posted on my blog, and I do have one friend who IM's me every once in a while to say "hey how's the diet?" like I asked all my readers to, but I think I only have about 3 readers and 2 of them don't care, or secretly want me to be fat.







So yes it would be wonderful to have a motivational buddy! I'll PM you.









But I should warn you - and what the heck, I'll make this public - I have 40 lbs to lose. ALL of it is post-partum, since I was back to my pre-preg weight (a semi-healthy 130) within days of giving birth. If you'll recall from our DDC days, I only put on about 17 lbs during my pregnancy, which I was very happy about. Now, I am actually almost 15 lbs heavier than my all-time high PREGNANCY weight, at about 36 weeks (149 lbs) and at my heaviest, I was 20 lbs above it. I've dropped about 6 lbs off that weight, but I'm still around 163 which is just NOT healthy for someone only 5'0" tall. Post-partum depression is a b*tch, if one tends to self-medicate with food and avoid exercise like the plague because it dropped my milk supply. The worst was when I went back to work, when I was sad, desk-bound, and had easy access to a vending machine and a snack lady. I put on 10 lbs in the first month back. Since I quit work I lost a couple lbs without trying, just from not sitting in a desk all day, and since putting some effort into it I've lost a couple more, but it's going to be a long slow battle, since I can't focus on myself single-mindedly like I did before Rowan came along.

Anyway, enough "bellyaching" as my dad used to call it... Kavita and anyone else, I'll be happy to nag you via e-mail or whatever else you want for motivation as long as you return the favour!


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

Dude, I am so in on any weight-loss motivational work. I don't just visit the snack lady, I AM the snack lady.

I've gained 15, almost 20 (!) lbs since June (when I started writing for reals). It's just me, the laptop, and my hand in the brownies/cakes/pizza. I do exercise 3-5x a week, but apparently burning 200 calories at the gym does not erase the 500 cals I down in one sitting. Funny, huh.

Also, I really like to eat. A LOT. I think you and I may have that in common, Spughy. It's difficult to be a skinny foodie.

Good luck to all of you planning weddings and babies and all that good stuff. I am a little behind, obviously. Too busy eating.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, I'm aiming to drop 100lbs once baby is safely earthside. I did a fair amount of self-medicating with food since Skye was born, and put on 4 stone (that's close on 60lbs) that took chubby to obese. My weight's been constant since I've been pregnant, but shifting the extra is my project. In an ideal world, I'd like to be in a normal range by age 33: 32 would be better.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Not to interrupt the weight-loss discussion, but I just wanted to share one of the most heart-melting moments I've ever had with Brynn. Pretty much all of yesterday she was *really* cranky - crying to the point of screaming (Kavita, you witnessed this the other night) at the drop of a hat. I still don't really know what her deal was, but by 8:00 last night, I was really close to losing it with her. She and I were in the kitchen and I was trying to clean up the dinner dishes, and she started flipping out about somehting, so I asked if she was hungry. She said yes, so I sat her at the table with a bowl of Gorilla Munch and some raspberries, and she munched happily and QUIETLY for a good 10 minutes. DH came into the kitchen to help with the dishes, and he and I were having a semi-whispered conversation about how irritable she's become the past few days, and how hard it is for me to be a good parent to her after having dealth with it all day. Out of nowhere, in the sweetest and most sincere voice, she says, "Thank you Mommy and Daddy. Thank you everyone." Jason and I looked at each other, and he said, "What are you thanking us for Honey?" and she said, "Thank you Mommy for giving me a bowl of Gorilla Munch and some berries."














: I don't know where it came from , but the timing couldn't have been better. I think it's one of those moments I'll store in my Bank Account O'Love to remember next time she's screaming and throwing her dinosaurs at me.

barcelona, those pictures are beautiful. I love the ones with Finley's hands in his pockets!!









Well, we're off to knitting circle. Later Mamas!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

I ate three pieces of cake in less than 24 hours yesterday.

Ezra's science museum party was lots of fun. i will post pics to my blog soon so you all can see how cute her vegan penguin cake was before we devoured it. we only used 4 containers of the 7 soy ice creams. they weren't like gallon tubs or anything but i totally should have eaten more of them! we gave them to a friend with lactose intolerance since we were spending the rest of the afternoon roaming the museum and the butterfly house and outside. we never even made it through the museum b/c we all wanted to play outside! We had about 40 people come and i felt like i didn't get to talk to everyone as much as i would wanted. it was also the first time we saw most people since our return from being abroad the past 4 months.

okay, i gotta go read and catch up with you lovelies! Happy November Birthdays!!! Happy Labor Days, mamas!

amy- i just read the article you linked to and wow~ i am reading more from other links just to that one story. we were in bali when the recalls happened so are just getting caught up on all that info. we've known about toxicity of certain plastics and tried to avoid those. avoiding cartoon characters has helped us avoid exposure to many of the lead painted toys, it seems. off to read up some more and alert the grandparents!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

all stamped, sealed and ready to mail.







Post office is closed today so DH will take them tomorrow.

Yay!

Thank you all for being so incredibly patient with me.







: I can't believe it has taken me this long. I guess we can pretend they are two-year birthday beads


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

KeaganRae's birthday was yesterday. We had a pretty good day. After he opened all of his presents from Grandma we went to the local kid's museum and played for about 2 hours. The hardest part was when Grandma called the grocery store to order him a birthday cake on Friday night. . . about 2 hours after I told her how excited I was to make his birthday cake for him. I was really tempted to be ornery as hell toward her but I was good








Keagan had his first bite of cake too - and promptly spit it out. I almost laughed but I held it in









Helen - I hope you are doing a bit better. I have a hard time thinking about the world that our children will grow up in as well. Sometimes it is enough for me to know that I am doing the best I can and I am bringing up my babe to know what is right and do what is right. Sometimes though, well, it is just not enough.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Happy Birthday Keagan Rae!

It is crazy stormy here right now. It's like huge buckets of water are getting hurled at the house, which is rocking back and forth alarmingly. Welcome to November on the west coast... Rowan is sleeping through it. Oh and I think something is starting to leak somewhere - I hear dripping.

But I did get a whole 2 hours at the gym this morning... things just all worked out. It was loooovely. I didn't miss any body parts in my workout and did a really good strength session and then 35 minutes of nice cardio. Then I used the sauna for the first time in years and had an icy cold shower to finish. WOOO that woke me up! Good times.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Happy birthday, Keagan Rae!

Spughy, you go!!

Hey y'all, could you take a look at this real quick and let me know if you have any recommendations? Thanks!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Happy birthday, KeaganRae! Susannah, thanks for the hugs. I'm feeling a bit calmer- as I type, the daylight is being excluded from our window as the extension goes up outside







: (literally.) AND our main builder went to a lot of trouble to get us the perfect bricks to go with the extension.

Spughy, happy workout day!

Amy, I posted to the other thread, but you might want to look at WABA as well.

Gunter, I admire your reserve


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Well I guess we were all busy little bees today, too busy to post!

We had an ok day - DH's PhD convocation was today. Rowan and I didn't go - it was right at her nap time, and he only got 3 tickets so his parents and his grandma went. But, Rowan and I made him Portuguese custard tarts (his favourite thing in the whole world) puff pastry and all (yeah, I made it from scratch, am I the best wife in the world or what?!?!) and then we took him out for dinner with surprise guests - our next-door neighbours, and really good friends, who have observed the PhD saga from, well, relatively nearby. It was fun. But Rowan's been a bit cranky, I think her molars are bugging her a bit.

Question for you all though - does anyone else have a toddler who is totally into the imaginary play yet? I'm surprised to get this so early, but Rowan regularly plays with imaginary food ("Mummy I caught a fish! Cut it up and cook it mummy!") and now has moved on to seeing an imaginary baby moose, who can be a bit scary. Like, seriously - tonight I was fixing her bottle and she came running up to me and glommed on to my leg and wanted to be picked up because "baby moose is little bit scary". Half a minute later she was playing with the baby moose, pushing it around the living room. (It's not like she's calling some other object a baby moose. It's empty air, as far as I can tell







) Is this normal, for a 2 year old? I'm a little worried her imagination will start to get ahead of her and start frightening her more.

Oh and we gave her a real haircut! She is definitely one of the cutest things on the planet now. I'll post pics as soon as we get the computer thing sorted out - DH has to move all his stuff onto my laptop because his was a loaner from the comp sci dept. at the university, and now he's all done with that


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Is this normal, for a 2 year old? I'm a little worried her imagination will start to get ahead of her and start frightening her more.

Hmm, it's normal in my house, if that makes you feel any better. Probably not.

But, one thing we really emphasized from the start with both kids is real and pretend. Yah, call me a stick in the mud. I talk about how things are real, or if they're "play." So, "play" food or "play" moose, versus the real thing. I play along, "cute baby moose!" but I try to emphasize how this is pretend and it's sooo fun...but just pretend.

I think it's helped with managing fears and other undesirable side-effects of active imaginations. Not eliminated them completely, but it helps.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Please forgive my lack of posting. It's not that I'm not reading...it's just this Holiday Helper thing is kind of taking up all my spare time and brain power.

Need sleep. Or caffeine. Sleep would be better.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, I can't believe you made puff pastry from scratch, and I don't know whether to take my hat off to you or tell you you need more children. I fed my tribe last night on a ready meal from Tesco, and Skye headed off into the kitchen to eat dog food instead, it was that bad.








This is what I get for being ill, I guess, but I figured it would be better than a takeaway. I was wrong.
Skye's verging on make-believe, too, but because she isn't as verbal as Rowan it isn't as obvious. There's a lot of pretend play though. I wouldn't worry, just be glad she knows what a baby moose is









DiD, good luck with the wedding and holiday helpers


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Spughy, congrats to DH on becoming an "official" PhD!! What an accomplishment.









Oh, and happy due-date to you, Spughy.







I was just looking at the birth announcements thread and saw that this was your EDD with Rowan. Do you still have special feelings about this date? I know November 24th will always feel kind of special to me!

As for the imagination thing, Brynn's been very much in the world of her own imagination for months now. She's always picking me pretend flowers, and eating/making pretend food, and she has great wonderful two-sided conversations with her animals & dinosaurs (complete with special voices for each!). But you know, I don't recall that she's ever imagined anything scary to this point (or at least, she hasn't told me about it if she has). I like FSM's approach though; just maybe clarify "real" vs. "imagined" to help distinguish. Or if she does say something is scary, ask her to tell you what is scary about it. Maybe she's using imaginary play to work out some of her real feelings.

Back to the weight loss topic, I have noticed something interesting lately. Our scale ran out of batteries a couple of months ago and I never replaced them so I haven't weighed myself in probably 2 months. Interestingly, I've noticed that my body image has improved dramatically even though I may have only lost a few pounds recently (if any at all). I kind of want to weigh myself to see, but I also kind of don't, because I like this feeling of relative body acceptance that I've been feeling lately and don't want it to evaporate if I see I haven't lost anything at all!

My other little bit of news is that a good friend of mine (a professional artist) agreed to do a gesture sketch of a nursing photo of me and Brynn (I don't think I have it uploaded anywhere, so I can't share it right now). Anyway, he just emailed me and told me it's finished, and how much he loved doing it. He does nudes, but he's never done a mama/baby pair before, and he said he felt that he is a part of my life "in some small way" and that he hopes that someday Brynn will love the sketch of the two of us. He lives in St. Louis, and he's mailing it to me, so I can't wait to see it!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

sarah- congrats to you! ez has surprised me, too with some of that imaginary play happening. she was pretending to diaper her penguin this morning. now that she is not nursing







, she has really taken to nursing her babes. she walks around quietly for what seems like a good stretch of time just focused on nursing them. it's precious.

Re: weaning. I am more sad about it now that i was a week ago. here is how it happened...she didn't nurse for four days or so. then, she nursed once on the day before her birthday. then she nurse don her birthday (last tuesday nov 6). she has not nursed since then, really. she asks for milka and puts her mouth on my shirt and pretends to nurse then giggles like crazy. today, she tried on both sides for less than 30 secs but didn't seem to find anything worth her interest. so, she stopped and said, "this one's for buxton.", which is what we're calling the babe-in-womb.

it just seems she is soooo much more independent from me now that she's not nursing. we still get mad snuggles and cuddles. she'll sit in my lap and let em read four or five books to her. i love that time so much. and, we eat way more food at the table together now. but not nursing coupled with more independent play and sleeping in her own bed is making me miss her. dh feels the same way. OTOH, it's nice to have a physical break for my boobies before this next babe comes. reallllllllly nice. and, it's nice to have so much more space in the bed for a few months, too. she's slept in her own room in her own bed since last friday night. if she cries, i go in to help her settle. it's going so well; i am so shocked and surprised. it's just all happened so quickly and so easily that i am only beginning to realize it, i guess?

anyone else go through this?


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

OMG Helen why did you have to remind me? The wedding is in 17 days! PANIC!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Don't panic, Lydia, life is too short for that.

Gunter, I'm right there with you. Skye is so fiercely independent now, and so self-contained, almost: bedtime, she trundles off to bed, says nightnight, rolls over and that's it. Naptime is heading the same way and I just don't know if I'm ready for this,y'know? (saying that, she went to bed at 6 tonight because she hadn't napped.)


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

We get to go hear Alfie Kohn speak tonight!!! I'm so excited!

yep that's all.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kaspirant* 
We get to go hear Alfie Kohn speak tonight!!! I'm so excited! yep that's all.

oh, i am so jealous! anyone have his dvd that i could borrow? i should probably get my own copy, eh? i have only read "unconditional parenting" and bits of "punished by rewards" by i vibe with his ideas, totally.

in other news, i am so sick and crappy feeling that i never got dressed or showered today. my head is stuffy and my nose is so dry it hurts. complain, complain, sorry.

lydia- it will all come together. chant amy's siggy a few times when you start hyperventilating!









helen- don't you just miss her? aren't we glad to have another little snuggler coming along?


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kaspirant* 
We get to go hear Alfie Kohn speak tonight!!! I'm so excited!

Man!! I am so jealous too! He rocks.

Gunter, y'all crack me up. I mean, I don't mean to make light of your sadness about it, but just how a couple of months ago you were all, Get OFF. MY. BOOBS.







You'll have a booby barnacle again soon, Mama.

And Sarah, Brynn must have been channeling into your vibe because TWICE today, she told me she was "a little bit afraid" of something (1. Roomba - it was eating her toes; and 2. A book.







). What up with that?


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

OMG, I am so behind on the thread. I've been going to bed entirely too late and not getting enough rest so I've been pretty much useless these past few days. Of course with no sleep comes roller coaster emotions so I had a bit of a hormonal meltdown today but was able to sit down, talk to dh and reconnect so I'm feeling better now.

Of course, then I decided to edit Gabriel's birth video (and download a clip to the yahoo group) and am a sobby mess all over again. Helen, we need to have a heart to heart. Watch the video first.

So tomorrow is the big day. We'll be spending time as a family. I'll take pics and hopefully post them soon.

*Gunter* -







I know when Gabriel weaned I experienced one of the greatest heartaches I've ever known. He was so over it while I was so sad.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Weaning, weaning, weaning... Ellie's no where close to weaning, but I think Killy might have weaned himself. Its been at least three days since he asked to nurse. I'm feeling pretty at peace with it, 3 years and 5 and a half months is a pretty good run.







I'm sure its also softened by the fact that Ellie still nurses a ton. Of course, now that I've written this, he'll probably wake up and ask to nurse tomorrow morning! I thought maybe he'd weaned a couple weeks ago when he went two days without asking, but then he asked again. He's been on and off since then, but hasn't asked since the weekend this time. He comes and gets in bed with us during the night, and in the morning he asked to cuddle, and then asked for cereal.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 

Oh, and happy due-date to you, Spughy.







I was just looking at the birth announcements thread and saw that this was your EDD with Rowan. Do you still have special feelings about this date? I know November 24th will always feel kind of special to me!










I totally forgot about the date. I was bedridden with hemorrhoids, hoping she'd stay in until they got a bit better. So, not so much with the special feelings.









Off-topic, does anyone have any ideas for dairy-free icing that doesn't involve some sort of nasty processed vegetable oil product (ie margarine, vegetable shortening)? I was going to try coconut oil whipped with honey. A couple of Rowan's little friends are dairy-free and their moms are saying "oh they don't need icing" and I think that's just mean







They're getting whole wheat no-refined-sugar carrot muffin "cupcakes" - yeah, they need icing.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, I did write a post that implied you'd missed the obvious by not just doing a lemon glace icing; but then I saw the no refined sugar bit. I, personally, would drizzle with honey 5 minutes before I took them out of the oven, but somewhere is a recipe for a tofu-based icing. (pureed soft tofu and something else, I think.)
Monique, heart-to-hearts work for me, but I'll warn you, I'm not making much sense these days.
And, guess what? Today is 2 days past my due date with Skye, 16 days past my due date with Alex and yet again I'm having irritating and infuriating Braxton Hicks. Boy, this sounds familiar


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

We're nowhere close to weaning, but I'm at a place now where I see how it might one day be possible. We have some days where she nurses in the morning and then not again until naptime, but more often another once or twice inbetween. And again all night long. I'm contemplating trying nightweaning again, or partial nightweaning. Since the begging not to chew off mamas nipples in her sleep is once again not working







:

Neela gets scared by her imaginary things sometimes, too. We talk about them being pretend, and also work on asking them if they want to be friends. There is an imaginary horse in our bedroom that has been there for weeks now (it's the same one that dressed as a peacock for hallowe'en) that she used to be afraid of but is now "buddies" with.

She has also been reading books to us so much. I can't believe how quickly she remembers stories- she retold a rather long book this morning that we just got from the library last week. My current favourite is the runaway bunny, which is so adorable I want to squish her to pieces.

Monique, did the video bring back memories or were things different than you "remembered" (if that makes any sense). I guess what I'm asking is if you remembered his birth in the same way as it was on video, or if there were things that were different. Part of my decision not to photograph or video Neela's birth was a desire to just remember and be, rather than document. But I bet there are things you notice watching it again... Feel free to ignore me if this is unhelpful. Big hugs.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
Monique, did the video bring back memories or were things different than you "remembered" (if that makes any sense). I guess what I'm asking is if you remembered his birth in the same way as it was on video, or if there were things that were different. Part of my decision not to photograph or video Neela's birth was a desire to just remember and be, rather than document. But I bet there are things you notice watching it again... Feel free to ignore me if this is unhelpful. Big hugs.

You know, I couldn't stand watching the video of my wedding because it wasn't like I remembered it in my head and I didn't want to have another perspective messing up what I remembered.







I got upset and had to leave the room when we tried to watch it a few months after our wedding. At that moment (years before I ever got pregnant) I knew that I did not want to have my births videoed. We took a few pictures during early labor with Killy and a lot right after, and Ellie's birth was so fast that we didn't any until after she was born - and I'm fine with it. I'll always remember it perfectly!

I'm so happy - it snowed today for the first time this year! On my birthday!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Happy Birthday, Jen!!!!!

Mel, we have mostly officially night-weaned, and it went really easily for us. I just felt like we were both ready. It took about a week of *crying* at 4:00am and one of us getting up to get cow milk, which was usually refused, but now she will nurse before bed, and then sleep in her own bed til around midnight, come to our bed *without even asking for milkie*, and then sleep til around 4:00. She still wakes up almost every night around 4:00 and will sometimes ask for milkie, and when she does I just tell her it's not morning yet, and she will cuddle back to sleep. Then she will usually wake up between 5:00 and 6:00, and then I do nurse her, and we sleep (lightly) til around 7:00. It's been working really well so far, and I've been really enjoying sleeping with her now that she cuddles so much! I love it!

Monique, are you having negative feelings about your birth experience? I have to tell y'all, especially with Brynn's birthday approaching, I still have a lot of grief about our birth experience as well. I still go through the same things in my mind, ask myself the same questions, get mad at myself all over again...not to mention that I still have pain and numbness around my incision area! So, yeah....I can understand where you're coming from.









We're leaving for Texas tomorrow so I'd better get off my butt and keep on packing. It's so annoying though because it's going to range in temperatures from lows in the 40s to highs in the 80s....so I have to pack pretty much everything we own.







:


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

We're four day's past the EDD and still 14 days to the birthday! Oh yea, I remember this time two years ago QUITE well, and I have the stretch marks and pitocin-worry lines to prove it!

This is from a few pages back, but I love cooking with Woody. His dad's a big cook, so when one or the other of us is in the kitchen working (which is most of the time), Woody's up on a chair "chopping" (with a butter knife and already-cut veggies) or stirring (flour in a metal bowl) or grinding salt or "washing dishes" (water, dishes, cloth, soap, but not so much the _cleaning_) or especially kneading dough. I'm baking two loaves of bread almost weekly now, so we always make Woody buns along with it.

And as far as the imaginary play goes, that is by far my most favorite thing now. He makes pretend fires in the backyard with sticks, even breaking them into smaller pieces and warning us not to step in the "hot fa-ya." He makes pretend food. He puts pretend things in a bag and carries them around. He pretends that he's a dog or a frog or a bus or a "big truck." I play along; we haven't veered into the unsettling pretend yet.

Helen, I was reading your upset posts and just feeling so sorry for you. It's the pits being stuck in a bad place and watching the negative energy pile on top of you. I'm glad things have been looking on the up and up lately.









Amy, you inspired me; this past weekend I painted my bathroom. Our walls have been white and mostly unadorned for 11 months, and it was time for some color!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

just wanted to wish you all happy nov birthday and a happy labor day for the mamas.

this will sound funny given i am now starting my six month of pregnancy...we have our first visit with the midwife at noon today. she's the same one who caught ezra and we've e-mailed some while i was abroad so it's not news to here or anything. i am stoked to see her! ez wants to tell her, "i want to help catch buxton" "when his head come out...and placenta". precious.

last night as she fell asleep (in our bed for the first time in a week), she told me, "buxton is in mama's uterus". why, yes, buxton is, you little midwife baby!

I am still fighting off a cold which has led to much online surfing for organic clothes and a few TP purchases over the past 24 hours. Uh-oh, gotta get better just to save some money.







:


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

I am just reliving everything this week...it's the 16th, and this was the week, 2 years ago, that I had quit my job for good (HA! So I thought!!) and had the only job-free week of my life since I was 14. It was awesome. I did all kinds of fun errands, had a pregnancy massage, took myself out to eat and to the book store, went out to the movies with Matt. I had no idea if the baby would be coming that day, that week, or weeks from then! And 2 days from then....BAM! He barreled out. I think we had just decided on his name a couple days before, too.

And, it was such a fun time in our DDC- watching the posts daily for baby announcements!

Amy-


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Monique, heart-to-hearts work for me, but I'll warn you, I'm not making much sense these days.

Yeah? Neither am I. Well. I guess I am... I'm just out of sorts. I guess I can open up to everyone here. I feel safe enough to.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 

Monique, did the video bring back memories or were things different than you "remembered" (if that makes any sense). I guess what I'm asking is if you remembered his birth in the same way as it was on video, or if there were things that were different. Part of my decision not to photograph or video Neela's birth was a desire to just remember and be, rather than document. But I bet there are things you notice watching it again... Feel free to ignore me if this is unhelpful. Big hugs.

Oh, yes. Definitely. It was even different than what I remember watching last year or even the first time I watched it after Gabriel was born. I remember being so, so, so tired during labor and just wanting to quit (I know, transition... but I felt like that throughout). After all the "I think it's my time" misfires and prodromal labor I was just wasted emotionally and I remember thinking that I just didn't **want** to do it. So very different from the first time where I stayed with it and just let the labor take me where it needed to. I felt more centered (much more snappy to everyone around me) in my first birth than I did last time.
I'm glad we videotaped it. I noticed funny things like me yelling at the mw to not push the baby back in!!!! and asking if I needed a hot compress (to which she replied, no, you're *in* a hot compress). I guess I just have these perfectionistic ideas about birth, you know, the ones where the woman remains strong and is able to breathe through the surges and then has a huge smile on her face in the moment of birth etc etc. Not that I expect that to be my story everytime. I just felt so helpless. So out of control. And even though I expected to be out of control I still wanted to be able to go with it. I saw how focused I became when my mw locked eyes with me and just kept repeating affirmations over and over. And when my body started to shake (with the last contraction or two) she got my attention and did it again and it just calmed me. It really irritated me how annoyingly clingy I was emotionally and so pulsitilla-like in nature. And how much my voice sounded like my own mother (who moaned and cried just about everyday of my childhood... she's needed psychological and emotional therapy all her life and has never gone). I think maybe part of my clingy, needy actions were just a part of my hidden fears of abandonment and rejection mostly surrounding the lack of relationship with my mother.
So yeah, there's fear now that it will be more intense this go around. I remember exactly how I felt during those contractions. I kept catching my breath in sobs as I listened to my voicing through them. Like partly in awe of the power of birth but partly afraid for myself that I won't be able to do it again. I really thought I wouldn't make it last time. And I'm afraid that I won't have the support I want (even though dh was LOADS more supportive during my second birth as opposed to my first where he was more the bystander). I realized that we WILL NEED someone to be here with the kids (I was kind of hoping to skip that and just have it a family affair). I have someone in mind but it so goes against the intimate UC I have in my mind... that darned perfectionistic idea that I can't shake, not because it feels right but because I feel like I've come short if I do less. How can I feel this way after two beautiful and peaceful homebirths. It's all about perspective, isn't it?
Granted, I'm comparing myself to an iconic standard of who knows what. I don't really have a realistic idea about what birth really is like apart from birth in my own home. And all the UC stuff I've read has made me feel less than in terms of feeling like I want and need the emotional anchor that only another woman can provide. I was in birthing heaven last time, what, with dh supporting me physically in the tub/birth position, one midwife keeping track of baby's heartbeat and holding pressure on my sacrum, and one bobbing around here and there, making sure I was anchored emotionally. And yet I acted like a freaking wimp. And that's what really ticks me off. How I acted. I wanted to give birth and be able to stand on my own and get out of the tub on my own and **help** myself rather than need to be helped. It was that part of it all that caught me off guard and disempowered me.
There's also fear in the part after the actual birth where I'm in the tub, holding Gabriel, leaning back on Chris and my head sort of starts bobbing up and down and my eyes start closing and I can hear just enough edge in my mw's voice to know that it wasn't a good sign to them. I was in a hormonal high (but not feeling too good about it) for quite a while and I just wanted out. I drank and ate a TON afterward (as soon as I birthed the placenta and urinated) and kept it up for about three days. I couldn't stop the hunger. The actual postpartum time was so special. I slept skin to dewy skin with Gabriel that first night. He was such a good nurser. and so peaceful. Such a little bundle of peace.
I just feel like I need some perspective on all of this because I just don't feel ready this time.

Plus.. and I feel okay saying it here... I don't have the support I did in our ddc with this new one. I'm there enough to know the regular posters etc but I just don't feel the wonderful feminine mothering energy of Fern, or the sage advice of Helen and Kavita, or the animation and fun of Aubrey, or the bright happy energy of Amy and Honeytree, or the sweetness of Awaken, or the levelheadedness of picnicbear, or the go-get-'em ness of Gunter and samsmama... (please no one feel left out if I didn't name you) I could go on and on. I'm glad there are a couple of us in the new ddc together but there's no real kinship goin' on. just blugh. I'm awful aren't I????


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Queen of Cups* 
You know, I couldn't stand watching the video of my wedding because it wasn't like I remembered it in my head and I didn't want to have another perspective messing up what I remembered.







I got upset and had to leave the room when we tried to watch it a few months after our wedding. At that moment (years before I ever got pregnant) I knew that I did not want to have my births videoed. We took a few pictures during early labor with Killy and a lot right after, and Ellie's birth was so fast that we didn't any until after she was born - and I'm fine with it. I'll always remember it perfectly!

I'm so happy - it snowed today for the first time this year! On my birthday!

happy belated birthday!!

I get pissed off when I watch my wedding video. It totally messed up my perspective of what I thought was the most beautiful and perfect time.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Monique







Not ignoring you, just got to get some sleep right now and I need time to string a sentence together. I'll be back in the morning, 'kay?
Loves to everyone.


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

Hey Monique, you do remember that during my second birth, I asked the MW if she could just pull him out, right? Everyone laughed at me, even at that point. His head was halfway out, I just wanted to quit. Whattya mean, midwives don't bring along forceps and a vacuum? What kind of two-bit operation is this?

That was a low point. I think I would be very, very uncomfortable watching a video of it.

Buuuut, when I was pregnant, I did watch a labor video produced by Penny Simkin, showing the wide variation of ways women labor. It was very reassuring, because it went beyond the duality of loud out-of-control TV screaming and silent suffering. There's such variance in vocalization, what people say, what makes them feel better.

Trolling for article help again: Did anyone here have an unusual baby shower? Something really different (even if you swiped the idea from someone else)?

Or know someone else who did? We're a creative bunch, I'll bet someone has a few good ideas...

Amy, inspired by you, I am trying to night-wean again. I am withholding judgement until at least a week goes by...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flyingspaghettimama* 
Trolling for article help again: Did anyone here have an unusual baby shower? Something really different (even if you swiped the idea from someone else)?

Or know someone else who did? We're a creative bunch, I'll bet someone has a few good ideas...

I love the fill the freezer with postpartum meals shower idea. Especially when you're trying to avoid all of the baby "stuff". Plagio (now PicnicBear?) who used to be in our DDC had a cloth diaper shower.

Monique, a smattering of thoughts for you (and myself, too)... I don't think the UC ideal of independence and self-sufficient birthing is the right thing for everyone. It may seem ideal, but I found the ability to ask for and receive support to be one of the huge challenges for me as a "strong independent woman" in motherhood, and needing and being able to receive support in labour was a wonderful initiation and step towards the growth that I needed to be a better mother. Do you think that feeling like your mother in labour helped you to grow as a mother (as a mother very unlike her, I must add)? Or served some other purpose?

FWIW, I think you seemed very strong in the video. Accepting support *is* powerful. And my other very disjointed pondering- do you think you would have been more centered and independent without the support around (as in you needed them because they were there), or would you have felt more alone and abaondoned because you didn't have the support you wanted/needed?

And like FSM, I'm really glad that I don't have reminders of the things that I said/yelled during transition and birth. (I wasn't very mind over matter about my perineum yelling about delicate parts of my anatomy and how I thought they were going to tear, that's for sure).

And we're doing another attempt at some kind of night-weaning again, too. We bought two pairs of "magic pajamas" today that help Neela sleep without nursing. I'll report back


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *willemsmamma* 
Oh, yes. Definitely. It was even different than what I remember watching last year or even the first time I watched it after Gabriel was born. I remember being so, so, so tired during labor and just wanting to quit (I know, transition... but I felt like that throughout). After all the "I think it's my time" misfires and prodromal labor I was just wasted emotionally and I remember thinking that I just didn't **want** to do it. So very different from the first time where I stayed with it and just let the labor take me where it needed to. I felt more centered (much more snappy to everyone around me) in my first birth than I did last time.
I'm glad we videotaped it. I noticed funny things like me yelling at the mw to not push the baby back in!!!! and asking if I needed a hot compress (to which she replied, no, you're *in* a hot compress). I guess I just have these perfectionistic ideas about birth, you know, the ones where the woman remains strong and is able to breathe through the surges and then has a huge smile on her face in the moment of birth etc etc. Not that I expect that to be my story everytime. I just felt so helpless. So out of control. And even though I expected to be out of control I still wanted to be able to go with it. I saw how focused I became when my mw locked eyes with me and just kept repeating affirmations over and over. And when my body started to shake (with the last contraction or two) she got my attention and did it again and it just calmed me. It really irritated me how annoyingly clingy I was emotionally and so pulsitilla-like in nature. And how much my voice sounded like my own mother (who moaned and cried just about everyday of my childhood... she's needed psychological and emotional therapy all her life and has never gone). I think maybe part of my clingy, needy actions were just a part of my hidden fears of abandonment and rejection mostly surrounding the lack of relationship with my mother.
So yeah, there's fear now that it will be more intense this go around. I remember exactly how I felt during those contractions. I kept catching my breath in sobs as I listened to my voicing through them. Like partly in awe of the power of birth but partly afraid for myself that I won't be able to do it again. I really thought I wouldn't make it last time. And I'm afraid that I won't have the support I want (even though dh was LOADS more supportive during my second birth as opposed to my first where he was more the bystander). I realized that we WILL NEED someone to be here with the kids (I was kind of hoping to skip that and just have it a family affair). I have someone in mind but it so goes against the intimate UC I have in my mind... that darned perfectionistic idea that I can't shake, not because it feels right but because I feel like I've come short if I do less. How can I feel this way after two beautiful and peaceful homebirths. It's all about perspective, isn't it?
Granted, I'm comparing myself to an iconic standard of who knows what. I don't really have a realistic idea about what birth really is like apart from birth in my own home. And all the UC stuff I've read has made me feel less than in terms of feeling like I want and need the emotional anchor that only another woman can provide. I was in birthing heaven last time, what, with dh supporting me physically in the tub/birth position, one midwife keeping track of baby's heartbeat and holding pressure on my sacrum, and one bobbing around here and there, making sure I was anchored emotionally. And yet I acted like a freaking wimp. And that's what really ticks me off. How I acted. I wanted to give birth and be able to stand on my own and get out of the tub on my own and **help** myself rather than need to be helped. It was that part of it all that caught me off guard and disempowered me.
There's also fear in the part after the actual birth where I'm in the tub, holding Gabriel, leaning back on Chris and my head sort of starts bobbing up and down and my eyes start closing and I can hear just enough edge in my mw's voice to know that it wasn't a good sign to them. I was in a hormonal high (but not feeling too good about it) for quite a while and I just wanted out. I drank and ate a TON afterward (as soon as I birthed the placenta and urinated) and kept it up for about three days. I couldn't stop the hunger. The actual postpartum time was so special. I slept skin to dewy skin with Gabriel that first night. He was such a good nurser. and so peaceful. Such a little bundle of peace.
I just feel like I need some perspective on all of this because I just don't feel ready this time.

Plus.. and I feel okay saying it here... I don't have the support I did in our ddc with this new one. I'm there enough to know the regular posters etc but I just don't feel the wonderful feminine mothering energy of Fern, or the sage advice of Helen and Kavita, or the animation and fun of Aubrey, or the bright happy energy of Amy and Honeytree, or the sweetness of Awaken, or the levelheadedness of picnicbear, or the go-get-'em ness of Gunter and samsmama... (please no one feel left out if I didn't name you) I could go on and on. I'm glad there are a couple of us in the new ddc together but there's no real kinship goin' on. just blugh. I'm awful aren't I????


Monique, I'm going to address this on here because you're posting it on here.

first of all, give your new DDC a bit of time--I don't remember really feeling our DDC come together until later (toward the middle-end of the 2nd trimester) until then I was sort of still getting to know people and actually kind of missing the relationship I'd established with the TTC forum onethread!

I am going to be frank about this--I have real difficulty understanding your perspective about birth. Partly, I guess this is because I've attended so many births, and there are so many different ways it goes that I kind of don't have the same sort of attachment to any sort of way of being or acting. to me, it's all part of the wonder and mystery and individuality, so there is not the same "Kodak moment" in my imagination that is from someone else's birth story or Spiritual Midwifery or the UC forum or whatever. In my mind, it's kind of like trying to look a certain way or behave a certain way when you're having sex/ having an orgasm . . . the difference between spontaneous authentic sexual expression and being a porn star is that in one you're in your body, emotions, and experience, and connecting with another person, whereas in the other you're worrying about it making it *look* like you're feeling a certain way, because that's the way you have it that it's "supposed" to feel and look, because of some external or internalized concept of what's sexy. So, that said-- How much of your feeling about your birth is about how you felt it "from within" at the time and remember, and how much of it is how it looks on video as opposed to how you think it "should" look, how you "should" have behaved? You've mentioned things before about feeling upset by having emotional needs or being needy in labor or depending emotionally on your midwives. (in this post and elsewhere) And of considering that you want to UC but not feeling sure about it, and then feeling upset with yourself for not feeling sure or maybe wanting someone there. I mean, I guess I think that your idea of how you "should" feel is really based in somewhat of a fantasy. Or maybe it's a slice of reality, but it's not everybody's reality, the same way, every time. And that there is an alternate, natural birthing and also a UC'ing propaganda which is an equal and opposite reaction to a different propaganda. (Ie, "women should be totally powerful and completely independent in birthing" is a sort of reaction to the medicalized birth climate of "women are helpless in birth and need someone else to deliver their babies". I think both of these oversimplify and don't really express the very complex and multilayered truths about the experience of birth. Anyway, the whole "triumphant fabulous natural birth story" has turned into some sort of genre of its own which is by nature sort of skewed--people who are inclined to write their birth stories especially somewhere like MDC or in Spiritual Midwifery or in UC circles or whatever have specific agendas about birth and about changing cultural biases about birth, and so there is a tendency to sort of gloss over some of the ideas that are bad PR for their preferred method of birth. there is a reason for writing a birth story (to create meaning from your experience, to remember it) but there is also another reason or motive entirely behind sharing it, some of which can simply sometimes be to tell something, but sometimes it's to prove a point. And the medical model of birth is that it's something done to you by other people (doctors) so the antithesis of that is that it's something that you do entirely by yourself, so there can be overemphasis on that value that gets brought out in some birth philosophies and some birth stories-- it's kind of a reaction to the other extreme. I don't know if that makes sense, but I don't know how to say it any differently. Now, obviously I'm a midwife so I am biased in favor of having a knowledgable, skilled and supportive attendant in birth. At this point I don't really believe in UC for a number of reasons, which I would prefer not to debate on this thread. However, I will point out that ideas of the "ideal birth" are somewhat rooted in particular other assumptions and involve some other cultural assumptions--for instance, the roles and relationships between husband and wife, etc. Yes, historically in many societies women have birthed alone or with only the husbands there, but in most of the research I've done I've realized that much of the time this was not in fact by choice--women have generally preferred to have other close women around (mother, sister, friend, neighbor women, etc.), if only for the company and reassurance of other people who are there who have done it before and gotten through it! Just because we could do it alone or only with a husband, doesn't mean that we necessarily *should*, or *have to.* Sure, that's one way to do it, but why is that the "best" way? I guess what I wonder is, what do you think you have to prove by birthing in this particular way, and who do you have to prove it to? I have no doubt that you could have birthed your baby on your own--the baby would have come out, whether your midwives were there or not, and whether you were freaking out or not. If you needed to get out of the tub and there wasn't anyone to help you, you would somehow have summoned the strength to do it. But my point is, you didn't *have* to, and it doesn't make you needy or weak or wimpy! As I'm writing this I'm thinking of that movie where Tom Hanks is stranded on a desert island for several years after the plane he's on crashes, and everyone thinks he's dead and has given up looking for him, and at some point he develops a toothache that is so horribly desperately painful that he knocks his own tooth out, using the blade of an ice skate that's washed up on shore as a wedge and a big rock as a hammer. He basically whacks his tooth out and then passes out from the pain. Now, if you or I were in the same position, I really think that we could or would be able to do that. But by the same token, I wouldn't do that by choice, just to prove that I *could.* You know, I don't remember who said it, but someone said that courage is not the absence of fear, it's feeling the fear but doing it anyway. I think birth by it's very nature is inherently fraught with fear, anxiety, and doubt. Different philosophies of birth have different ways of viewing this and different strategies for managing this reality, but I think that at its core we encounter a very basic and primal aspect of our mortality and physicality when we give birth, and it's enough to really scare the crap out of anyone. Physically, I can't think of many more sensations that are as terrifying as having that kind of power moving through your body through no volition of your own. You can try to deal with that reality by anesthetizing that feeling away (as about 90 % of the US population is currently doing with epidurals) or you can choose to acknowledge that and feel it and birth through that anyway. (sort of side note here on this is that Michel Odent has noted that a surge of fear or anger are characteristic of the phase of "about to push a baby out." I watched your birth video and I have read your words and I remember a bit about how that time was for you and I see someone who was exhausted and worn out from the events before going into labor and many weeks of prodromal contracting and false starts and mothering a toddler, who was really worried about her DH being there to support her in labor and birth (and I think you noted while pregnant with Gabriel that your DH was sort of being, well, kind of jerky when Willem was born, did you not?). Seems to me that at the time of birth, you were deeply in "laborland" and on the precipice of giving birth, and in the sort of dreamy druggy "out of it" mental state that most women experience at that stage of labor to some extent or another, and being physically pulled back by your body back into the physical pain of , sort of like when a kid has a helium balloon on a string and lets it float up and away, and then suddenly jerks on the string and the balloon moves down suddenly. I've seen lots of women experience something similar, and it's pretty challenging to be on that sort of roller coaster. it's very disconcerting to experience that. That's a slice of the real, true nature of birth. Just as it's not all screaming and blood and doctors, it's also not all candles and aromatherapy and intimacy and being either this serene smiling madonna or xena warrior princess kicking some birthing ass, or the venus of willendorf, or Sexy Orgasmic Birthing Lady, or some mythical tribal woman somewhere going off into the field/forest/hut somewhere to squat and have a baby no muss, so fuss and get on with life. Those are all just as partial and distorted and incomplete as the medical stereotypes and archetypes of birth and birthing women and we shouldn't hold them as our truths either, because they can't begin to define or contain the vastness of the reality that is birth. And you know, as far as having midwives/other women attendants present, sometimes it takes more courage and strength to be open, to let somebody in and help you, than to try to do everything by yourself. Especially when you've learned to get through in life and be okay primarily by not depending on other people to take care of you, not having to trust or depend on other people, and not letting other people in emotionally. That's not wimpy and needy and weak and clingy--there is strength in being able to allow yourself to be vulnerable and open, allowing others to help you and you to be helped. And if you need some mothering from someone because of your own lack of being mothered when and how you should have been, then good for you for finding someone who can do that for you when you need it! That's not being needy, that's being that's smart and healthy and in tune with yourself and your own reality. The only thing that I find is disturbing me is why you are bashing and critizing yourself now--it's like you're being a bit mean and abusive, to your Self, for feeling some pain and fear and letting yourself be helped and supported. There's just a sort of lack of compassion toward yourself there. Stop picking at yourself, or holding yourself up to some sort of externally imposed or internalized ideal! Be as kind and gentle to yourself as you would be toward your kids, or your friends, or a patient! Give yourself some credit--a lot of credit actually!

And on a practical note, even if you decide to UC, I think it would be a big, big, huge mistake to not have someone there for the kids. They are too little to be expected to handle it on their own and be supportive/helpful participants, and you really can't be expected to be attending to them while you're in labor, and your DH really can't be in three places at once (with you and with each of them. to say nothing of himself.) Even practically, you just can't leave them unsupervised enough at these ages to really labor, and it might be really scary for them and/or inhibiting for you. It would really not be fair to them, or yourself, or even your DH.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Yuck. Two bad nights with Skye on the trot, with nasty dreams, and I've lost the knack of cosleeping with her. It doesn't feel right having her in my personal space with her arms wrapped right round my neck and her fingers in my ponytail any more, and I feel like crap about that







: Am I really bad because I want to snuggle my beanbag instead of my daughter?

Monique: I started a thread down in UC thinking about this. What I know is that from the point that my early labour started, I cycled again, and again, and again through the excitement/seriousness/selfdoubt cycle of emotions. They're not just words: it's the common experience of how our minds are programmed to cope with labour. The UK still doesn't have a concept of prodromal labour, but there is an acknowledgement that some women have a really tough time getting to the magic 3 with regular ctx. There's still no real body of evidence on what women go through those last few weeks where they're contracting and working hard, but have nothing to show for their efforts. My overwhelming memory of transition was not that it was hard, that I couldn't do it: my first thought was that because I wasn't contracting, I wasn't having a baby. It was a false alarm, and I'd put my family through all that, held Isaac out that little bit longer to get him to the doctor, called for help with the kids for no reason. It was total clear clarity that what I had felt was wrong and that the reality was that I was not in labour and that my baby was not coming today. THAT was my self-doubt moment. Prodromal labour seriously, seriously messes with the head when you have it that intensely. If you go and read the Nov 07 threads, Kontessa had something very similar this month, and her thread in HB is both heartbreaking and so,so, so,so familiar to what we went through. 2bluefish is doing it now in UC (I love you so much, I came and posted here before I went to see if she had her baby yet) and the self-doubt creeps in occasionally, though she's mostly in the excited phase. This is hard, serious stuff, and we are hard-wired to respond negatively emotionally to labours that begin in this way. Three/four weeks of feeling like a fool, like you can't do it, versus a few hours of the real stuff that gets the endorphins going? What's the brain- and the body- going to remember more?
Now, at 29 weeks, my BH have moved up a gear and have already moved to their "turning" pattern of trying to get baby head down, coming regularly at 5 mins apart at times, and frankly, I'm scared of going through that again. I can do it though.
You've seen from my birth story what a surge of adrenaline can do to a labour. I think you need to figure out what you're going to do if the worst happens and one of your kids needs emergency medical attention when you're in active labour. As long as you have a contingency plan and you can get help if you need it, I think you're going to be fine.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Monique, I can only say that I really relate to what you said about knowing on one hand that a perfectionist ideal of birth is not helpful to have, and on the other hand feeling like that ideal is EXACTLY what you want. I had--and still do have--in my mind that picture of an ecstatic birth from _Spiritual Midwifery_. Honestly now, who's NOT going to want THAT birth, given all the choices? I tried hard to love the birth I did have, and especially the person I was in that birth, and maybe Kavita's right--maybe my love for myself was conditional on my reaching a certain cultural expectation. All I know is that I still struggle with it.

On a bad day, I feel like I could never do a homebirth again, that I couln't bear to face the same birth team, that my husband and everyone who was there must think I didn't do very well, etc.

On a good day, I recall the little mantra, uttered by some sage mama on this very DDC (lamentably, I've forgotten who!), and which I copied onto a slip of paper and had taped onto the mirror in my bathroom for weeks:

"This birth is not a test of my grooviness."

Many, many







s, mama. And incidentally, I was, and am, so thankful for YOUR presence on our DDC, too, for your groundedness, amazing knowledge, and incredible support!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

I **am** being very unrealistic and hard on myself... I know I am. Kavita, thanks for setting me straight. I think that most of you know the issues I've had to deal with in terms of overcoming an overly religious, perfectionistic, and restrictive childhood environment. So how I feel about how I birthed is really me dealing with some of that. I'm glad I was able to post what I did and get feedback (and feedback from others is welcome as well). I don't like feeling like I have unresolved/unaddressed issues (in any part of life). I had a long talk with Chris about it this morning and he basically came to the same conclusion. He thought I was strong, that I was awesome, and a sexy birthing goddess. And how seeing me so vulnerable and open just made him love me in new ways over and over again. He's always telling me I need to allow myself to just experience things for what they are and not what I think they should be or what I want them to be. My brain was hardwired to view life negatively and like I said, I still deal with that.

I liked that you affirmed that my expectations of how I acted ARE unrealistic. When I talked to my mw about it at the last apt (actually, it was my first prenatal too) she just pftt it off and said you can act or do or curse or cry however you want or need to. That's why I'm here. I also think that there is a lot of glossing over but it could be due to the stark difference of medicalized birth vs homebirth. I can't imagine what a VBAC mama would feel, not only going into the birth but afterwards as well. You know, I just remembered this too... I have this memory of my mom watching births on TV and commenting about what wimps those women were (for moaning or doing whatever it is THEY needed to do). Of course, when she saw my birth videos she sobbed and cried and thanked me for not letting her be there (because she wouldn't be able to handle it). Hmmm... the power of a mothers' words







. ANYWAY.

And I like that you recognized that there is a lot of reactionary birth propoganda out there. I am proud of myself for making the decisions I made concerning my births. I guess I just had that thought so strong in my mind during that 3rd stage... the thought that I NEVER wanted to do *this* again. I just wanted to be able to explore these feelings because now that I'm pregnant again I'm gonna hafta.







I've reached my halfway point and from here on out it's all about preparation, getting bellyliscious, and preparation.
C
hris and I talked about this upcoming birth (we hadn't really had a specific conversation about it until now) and we decided this morning that yes, the midwife will be called (and in time for her to get here... and she already knows my prodromal history and is very much okay with coming over and hanging out with me even if I'm not in active labor and just need emotional support), and yes, we will have to line up help for the children. I've already started reading books to them and talking to them about birth, and Willem was fascinated by the video of Gabriel's birth. A little concerned at first, but totally fascinated by it all and asked lots of questions. I have two people in mind that I may ask to be here for the kids (one for sure and one as a backup in case the first can't make it). I just haven't approached them yet. And I've gotten to know some moms in the area and I'm pretty sure that if the childcare backup person were here and the kids really needed to be someplace else, there are a couple kid-friendly homes in the neighborhood they could go hang out at. So we've got that plan in place.

So... I'm not the only one that felt that birthing power and got freaked out by it despite all the mental prep I'd done??? This is something just about every woman goes through? That feeling of a class 5 hurricane roaring down from the crown of my head and out through my perineum is NORMAL you say??? Gotcha.









Like I said these issues are partly from baggage from the past, partly from images of birth that are not my own but somehow I feel they should be, and partly from the WTF feeling I had when my mw gave me the pulsatilla. And I asked her what it was for and she said "for weepiness." I guess in that moment, though I was grateful for the homeopathic, I also felt a little judgement. And that started me on the whole "how I'm acting" tangent. But you're right, I was totally and completely exhausted. There is nothing I could have done differently to change that. It's just how it was.

And Helen







. I am so sorry you feel you are going to go through this again. I hope you don't. I honestly hope that you believe that every birth can be different and that you bask in the light of this precious birth no matter how it happens (there I go with my iconicism







)

*Now back to our regular scheduled birthday thread!!!!







:*


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *willemsmamma* 
So... I'm not the only one that felt that birthing power and got freaked out by it despite all the mental prep I'd done??? This is something just about every woman goes through? That feeling of a class 5 hurricane roaring down from the crown of my head and out through my perineum is NORMAL you say??? Gotcha.









[/B]


Heh heh heh--I remember very seriously telling DH at some point in labor that I was very sorry, but there would be a change in plans and this baby was going to be an only child or we'd have to adopt, because I was NEVER DOING THIS AGAIN, EVER!!!!







Trust me, there is no planning or preparation that can prepare you completely for giving birth! Helping over a hundred women having babies naturally at home helped me in some way (I had a lot of skills that I'd used to talk other people down from the ledge, that I used to talk myself down from the ledge internally!) but it certainly didn't make it a purely ecstatic experience without any fear or anxiety or doubt or pain. I think actually one of the overwhelming things I felt in labor was just a sort of pervasive sense of dread and apprehension, of what was coming next, whether I'd be able to do this, why the heck I wasn't dilating, fear of how fast things were moving and how overwhelming the sensation was when I *did* start dilating and the baby started moving down so fast. And I've seen women having their 10th baby and they aren't necessarily any better off in that regard, they are crying and freaking out just the same. I really feel that fear is not the enemy in labor/birth--it's just what fear can make us do that can be the problem (ie avoid labor, avoid pain ,etc.) I think you have to sort of acknowledge the fear, let it be, accept it, and work around it in birth. We can deal with our fears without denying them or suppressing them, we can work with it.

It's kind of a matter of perspective whether you can integrate the fact that you had fear and pain and cried and pooped and yelled and whatever into the concept of having a birth that was in fact powerful and beautiful! I think the story you are telling yourself about what happenned is probably way worse for your self concept than what actually happenned, iykwim. Kind of reminds me of the Woody Allen movie where he and Diane Keaton are in marriage counseling separately and they are talking about how often they have sex, and they show her saying, "Oh, we have sex all the time--probably about twice a week" and then it shows him saying, "We hardly ever have sex--probably only twice a week." It's all about perspective.







Okay, enough movie metaphors from me.

Sorry that last post from me was so long and rambling and repetitive--I wrote and rewrote, Ella was running amok and DH was sort of pressuring me to get off the computer and deal with her so he could go to bed, and it was hard to really write coherently. I tried to edit after she went to sleep but then windows shut down on my for some stupid update.







: So I'll leave it as is and move on.

Oh, and BTW honeytree, that was me who posted that.







:


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

I think the video I saw was "Comfort Measures for Childbirth," but I'm not sure, in case anyone wanted to see it.

There were women crying, moaning, whining (lots of whining, made me feel better), chanting, grunting, yelling or whooping. One of the things Simkin points out is that whatever we do, it's often rhythmic in some way, and that vocalization of some sort is very reassuring and normal.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

i have so much catching up to do on some important discussions it seems. give me a bit and i will be back to love on you all some.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

OK, that sealed it, Kavita. Next birth, I'm camping out in your backyard so you can talk me through it and catch my baby!

And Mel, I meant to post this earlier, too: What you said about how hard it was to ask for and receive help during birth really resonated with me, too. I'm glad you posted about that being a personal/mama skill that began with birth; I think that's a really good way to think of it!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
OK, that sealed it, Kavita. Next birth, I'm camping out in your backyard so you can talk me through it and catch my baby!


Now THAT sounds like a GREAT idea!!!!!!!!!!!









BTW, honeytree, you've got an INCREDIBLE memory!!!!! Sheesh. Either that or you are going back and rereading stuff.









And FSM, no I don't remember you saying that but it's kinda ironic because I told my midwife to NOT push the baby back in (when she was checking). Too funny.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Has anyone seen the threads about whether it's possible to consider a homebirth/ other normal birth traumatic, btw? Just wondering....


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Has anyone seen the threads about whether it's possible to consider a homebirth/ other normal birth traumatic, btw? Just wondering....

no... where are they? I think you definitely can. I feel so traumatized over all my prodromal labor I just sort of made myself forget how bad it really was.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I'll dig up links for you- there isn't a battle about it going on atm, but give it five minutes.
I managed to get myself into a circ discussion on ravelry and actually got the thread pulled







WTH made me think it was a good idea????







:


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Wow y'all, things have gotten so intense here the past few days, but I love it. I couldn't read all of the new posts, but I will try tomorrow. Just wanted to send love to you all.


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

I have not done a decent job at keeping up with this thread at all this month. I'm still trying to get caught up, but thought I'd pop in to say hi and give a quick update on last week. On Sunday while dh was at work over an hour away Joseph decided to stick a sucker stick in his ear. From what I could see through the blood at the time he jammed a hole through his ear drum. By the time dh got here and we could get in to see the on call clinic hours his ear drum was too crusted over with blood to be seen. Thankfully we got a decent ped then who just gave us some ear drops that are like neosporin and said to not even bother if they hurt him. Other then that it was keep water out of his ear and he gets it checked during his check up on Tuesday. We will also have to take him for a hearing test, but probably not until after the new year. I also had testing and an us on Thursday as I'm big enough for at least twins at this point. Good news from that is there is only one little boy in there. Beyond that they wouldn't tell me a thing although they wrote down about a million measurments to send to my mw. I go see her on the 30th and will find out what's up then.

Today we are going to be celebrating Joseph's birthday so we have plenty of family time together. Trying to make things happen in the evening after work and school just makes everything a mess when he falls asleep in his dinner. I found a new ball for him yesterday to go with the couple new trucks, big crayons and coloring books he is getting. I'm still trying to get out of him what he would like for dinner, but I don't think he really cares.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Two years ago today, I held my son in my arms for the very first time.
Two years ago today, I became a mother.
Two years ago today, you breathed your first breath; cried your first cry; felt your first kiss.

Two years ago today, you were born a small bundle of joy and promise.

Today you are two, I held you in my arms.
Today you are two, I love being your mother.
Today you are two, your breath, your cries and your kisses are all things I cherish.

Today you are two years old.
You are quickly growing and learning so many new things.
Everyday you are finding new ways to grow.
You never cease to amaze me
I have loved watching you grow into the boy you are today.
I cherish every day we have to grow and learn together.

I love you Jacob!
Happy Second Birthday!!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

happy birthday joseph!

happy birthday jacob!

still reading to catch up on all the birth talk...


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
OK, that sealed it, Kavita. Next birth, I'm camping out in your backyard so you can talk me through it and catch my baby!

Oh you really don't want to do that, it's Dog Poop Central back there!







However, I do have a guest room and a lot of birth supplies.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
And Mel, I meant to post this earlier, too: What you said about how hard it was to ask for and receive help during birth really resonated with me, too. I'm glad you posted about that being a personal/mama skill that began with birth; I think that's a really good way to think of it!

I swear you said it first; in fact I hesitated when writing it because I remember you saying almost the exact same thing about practicing assertiveness after you transferred









Happy birthday Jacob!!

Kristina, I hope Joseph's ear is okay- how stressful. And big congratulations on the new baby BOY!!!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Oh, Kristina, how awful! I hope Joseph's ear heals ok. Poor little guy. Poor little you!

I'm finding the birth trauma stuff interesting. I think despite all the interventions and whatnot I needed, I wasn't traumatized so much by the birth as the low-milk-supply aftermath. I know the two are connected; I'm sure my low supply was related to postpartum anemia thanks to my horrific blood loss and a bit of retained placenta, but the birth itself feels more like a kind of awesome war story than a trauma. I guess the difference is that in the end, I had an hour of power-pushing that made me the only person I know to get past a "failure to progress" diagnosis to a successful vaginal birth - in retrospect, even though I did have to have an epi and a pit drip, I still feel a bit heroic, if not goddesslike, about the birth. And the whole part where I burst a blood vessel in my nose and squirted blood everywhere kind of appeals to the tough-girl humour in me. I know I was very disappointed that I didn't have a peaceful birth, but for my personality and psyche, a heroic dramatic birth was a pretty good second option. It was the aftermath that I have difficulty with, that I feel betrayed by my body - it's like my body gave everything it had to get Rowan out and then kind of gave up after that.

Actually, it was Helen who helped me to understand what really happened - I think - during my labour, with the shakes and the inability to walk around to get my labour going... she mentioned that sometimes that happens when women don't eat enough carbohydrates before and during labour and go into ketosis and when I heard that it was like DING! of course... I had zero appetite at the end of my pregnancy, my stomach was the size of a walnut and frankly I was pretty impressed at my ability to NOT put on weight. Also, as I recall, I was trying to eat more protein at the time. So, yeah, carb deficit. Makes sense. And, my own stupid fault, which for some reason makes me feel better. I don't know if I'd still have had the postpartum problems if I'd managed to get through the labour medication free, but I feel better with the thought that there isn't something intrinsically wrong with me that made me unable to give birth naturally.

Anyway, back to the birthday thread! Rowan is totally aware that next week is her birthday, and keeps saying "I have a birthday coming up! My friends coming over! I eat cake!". Cute. Thanks to her uncle, she's also started "phoning Santa Claus".







: I think we're going to have to start indoctrinating her into the real meaning of the upcoming season - DH is Catholic so she'll learn about the whole Jesus thing and I sort-of observe the solstice so we'll talk about that a bit, and maybe try to downplay the whole "presents" thing. I'm making all my presents this year, except for a couple bottles of wine I'll buy for my mom & sisters, so Rowan will get to help with a lot of that. "Help" being a relative term... we were in the fabric store yesterday looking for handkerchief material, and Rowan kept finding little tiny "monsters" everywhere.







Of course I had to "come take a look" at all of them.

And happy birthday Jacob!!!


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

Oh no! Poor Joseph. I hope he's doing better! What a scary thing, Kristina!

Happy birthday to Jacob! Hope you are having a wonderful day.

Ezra is 2 as of noon today!





















:














: We have had a very nice day. I didn't want a huge houseful of people and stress on my special day, so we had just our group of lovely neighbors over, I got some cupcakes from an awesome bakery, and we had a very sweet low key party and a relaxing day. The day outside is gorgeous, too. I feel like it was just right. He is such an incredible child- enjoyable at every stage so far. We got a lot of really cute pics, too. I'll see if I can get it together to post some!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Awaken* 
Oh no! Poor Joseph. I hope he's doing better! What a scary thing, Kristina!

Happy birthday to Jacob! Hope you are having a wonderful day.

Ezra is 2 as of noon today!





















:














: We have had a very nice day. I didn't want a huge houseful of people and stress on my special day, so we had just our group of lovely neighbors over, I got some cupcakes from an awesome bakery, and we had a very sweet low key party and a relaxing day. The day outside is gorgeous, too. I feel like it was just right. He is such an incredible child- enjoyable at every stage so far. We got a lot of really cute pics, too. I'll see if I can get it together to post some!

happy birthday to my fellow nov ezra!!!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Kristina, how awful with Joseph's ear!!!!! I hope he's able to heal quickly!

Happy birthday Jacob and Ezra!


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

Happy be-lated Birthdays to jacob & joseph

and Happy birthday ezra!!!
and to the mommas and papas! i hope that the days were full of much love and laughter.

i still have a few days to enjoy this amazing almost 2 year old...although i think she is already 2 in some ways (my edd was november 13th...haha














she is so mature and talks so well... and i'm sure she is teething her 2 year molars. yikes. she is as sweet as anything then BAM. she's monster baby. oh well. its all love anyways.

i cant read everything. im at MIL's and just made home made pizza which is out of the oven now..so i wanted to say hi and love and im thinking about you all so much this november. 2. wow.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Ellie's birthday is technically tomorrow, but we had her party today. Here's my blog post about it with lots of pictures!
Happy Birthday, Ellandra!
I even included a somewhat cheesy comparison of a picture taken a few minutes after Ellie was born with one taken tonight... it almost makes me a little teary to see the difference two years can make.

I'm sooooo tired! I stayed up late last night baking a dark chocolate pumpkin cake, banana muffins, icing (my first time making it from scratch, actually) and then decorating Ellie's cake. Then I got up at 7am this morning and cleaned house, put dinner in the crockpot (though that was a bust eventually), took the kids to church, had lunch at my parent's house, came back and hosted the party. We only had immediately family (my parents, the in-laws, my grandmother, my sister, and DH's sister and her husband) but it felt like a houseful! After all the cake and pizza I ate today I really, really should be working out, but I think I'm going to go straight to bed.


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Happy Birthday to all these precious two-year-olds!!

Jen, Ellie is just beautiful! (And you, too!) And what a great cake! Any chance you want to share the recipe? Dark chocolate pumpkin, mmmmmm......

{{Kristina}} what a terrible thing! I hope your poor little guy heals fast, and has no long-term trouble.

Helen, you mustn't get banned from Ravelry!









kaspirant, your tribute to your Jacob brought tears to my eyes!

Amy, I was poking around in our old thread reading birth stories, etc, just feeling all nostalgic, and saw Brynn's birth pictures - O.M.G. the one alert pic of her, she looks exactly like herself! That is so amazing! Honestly, just give her longer hair, and she is exactly the same. Incredible!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

kristina--that sounds super scary! Hope he recovers fast! Hope you get the US results fast and that they are reasurring--it's annoying to have to wait for stuff like that!

Happy birthday Ezra and Jacob!

Okay, now I am starting to freak out about Thanksgiving. My parents were planning on coming down, and I'm doing the dinner. So I had things planned out accordingly, got my turkey, etc etc. Then this afternoon DH decided that he would, after all, like a vegetarian entree. Okay. I'd specifically asked him before if he wanted a turkey substitute or other veg main dish, two weeks or so ago when I was making the menu and the plans, and he had said no, the other dishes (mashed potatoes, stuffing, sweet potatoes, vegetable dishes, corn, rolls, pumpkin pie, etc.) would be enough for him.







: So this led to a little, er, "discussion." Anyway, afterwards I changed the plans to include a couple of stuffed portabello mushrooms for him, since he didn't like Tofurkey or any other fake meat or turkey substitute. Off I went to purchase a gravy boat and a roasting pan and the final groceries. Then, I called my sister to talk with her. My sister wasn't planning on coming--but then she asked if it would throw everything off if they ended up deciding to come at the last minute after all. She, BIL, the two kids and their dog, who's never met my two dogs.







: I told her that of course they could come and that they could stay with us. However, I was not really prepared to have to do the last minute stuff for people staying with us (washing linens, setting up the other room, etc.) and also for that many people for dinner. Especially with three kids and three dogs running around. And I'm a little worried about my turkey--it's a heritage turkey so it's not injected with crazy chemical solutions--which is good, but it also means that overcooking it and having a leathery dried out turkey is a real possibility! Oh well, it will work out! Right now I'm busy trying to catch up on the laundry, and get the kitchen in order for the cooking and baking marathon that will soon commence! I am actually doing a little extra organizing of my cupboards, so I'll have an orderly kitchen and can find the things I need.

In related news, we had a really awesome day yesterday--we drove out to a farm about 75 miles east of here to pick up our turkey from the farm. The farm we bought the turkey from is run by a couple who retired here from AZ, actually, which is ironic since that's where we moved from. They raise pastured Bourbon Red heritage turkeys, chickens, and horses. I'd called them up and ordered the turkey and made arrangements to come pick it up rather than having it shipped--the shipping is really about as expensive as the turkey which is already pretty pricey, and since I have a tiny Hyundai I figured I could actually get it for cheaper if I drove out to get it directly, and also it just seemed like it would be a really fun little day trip to take a drive and see the fall colors, check out some stuff in Lexington, etc. I was secretly hoping that they would be able to show us around the farm a little bit, and it turned out to be even better than I expected. Ella got to pet the horses, and we all walked out to the huge turkey pen (sort of a very large enclosed area of pasture) and walked around with the turkeys. Ella had the expression on her face that kids have in TV commercials when they open their presents on Xmas morning--she was so thrilled and excited to be on a farm! She has somewhere picked up this little verbal tic of saying, "Oh! Oh!" when she gets excited, and so when we got her out of the car and the farmer agreed to show us around the farm, she was trotting down the path at the farm saying, "Oh! Oh! Farm!!!! Farm!!!! Pet horses!!! Look, look!!! Turkeys!!! bobble bobble bobble!! Chickens!! (signing chicken) Pecking the ground!!!" It was great! Then afterward, we went into Lexington and had dinner at a South Indian restaurant that I'd heard about and wanted to try (DH is from South India but most of what people in the US know as Indian food is from North India--South Indian food is rather different.) Dinner was soooooo good and very reasonably priced too for the variety, quality and amount of food we got, so we were very happy.

So that's the update here!

What is everyone else (with due apologies to our "foreign correspondents" in Canada and the UK) doing for Thanksgiving?


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Kavita, lots of luck with your turkey day!! Very cool about the farm.

We have a turkey farm just outside town, a family I know, actually, and we always get our turkey there. They aren't heritage, sadly, but they are pasture raised and humanely treated, and the family does so much for our town I feel it is my civic duty to buy from them.







It does help that they are delish!!
We are having it here, but it will just be us, my mom, and my IL's. My sister and BIL will come down from WI Friday night and we will celebrate Ella's (Friday) birthday on Saturday. I have been telling her that she will turn "Two", and she just looks at me and says "NO!" How two is that!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Just quick - Kavita: BRINE YOUR TURKEY!!!! One part salt to one part sugar, dissolve in boiling water then add cold water until it's dilute enough that you could *almost* swallow it if you had to. Immerse the turkey the night before you cook it - probably your best bet is to stick it in a cooler, in the brine, and throw a bag of ice in and leave it outdoors or someplace cool. The brine temp should be no more than 38F. The turkey must be completely submerged - put a weight on top of it if necessary.

For cooking, assume 25 minutes per lb + 30 minutes, at 325F and DO NOT STUFF IT!!! Do your stuffing on the stove. Stuffing MUST be cooked to at least 165F, and for the heat to penetrate it to get it to that point, the meat will definitely be overcooked, dry and nasty. Put a couple quartered onions, some bay leaves and some sage in the cavity instead, just loosely. Rub butter and herbs all over the skin before roasting, and baste frequently after juices start to appear in the pan. Let the whole bird rest, tented with foil, for at least 30 minutes after removing from the oven, before carving. And use a thermometer in the thickest part of the thigh to make sure it's done, or do the leg test - if the leg wobbles easily, it's done. (Although, I find sometimes by that point it's a little past done, but I never eat the breast so I don't care quite so much as I should
















Good luck!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

i'm so sorry i've been so horribly out of touch this month.
as always, i have been reading along, just unable to write.
happy birthday to all the adorable november babies!
i love seeing pictures!

i did my showcase on wednesday, and it could not have gone better. since then, i've been recovering, coming back into myself, into my life, the quieter life, that is, as mama and wife. i am both relieved, and i miss it.

i'll be shooting one episode, probably hardly any lines, for my first episode with the show next week (after thanksgiving), and i am ecstatic. once the writer's strike is over, they said they have plans for me to be in another three episodes. i am hoping and praying this strike won't last long. it is devastating for this whole town, for everyone involved in the tiniest way in the industry. i still feel like i need to wait and not share the name of the show yet, b/c if anyone lurked and saw it, they could potentially spoil a big plot point, and i'd be in BIG trouble. as soon as i think it's safe, i'll share.

tomorrow, we are flying to orlando to see my family for thanksgiving. it'll be a whirlwind, we have so much family coming into town. i'm looking forward to seeing everybody, especially my brother and sister in law, who i haven't seen in a year. i think the full house will be better for us in the long run, in terms of avoiding uncomfortable conversations and the tense looks and energy that runs through the rooms when my parents meet me and alexander. we'll return saturday.

i'm in constant awe of all of you, as you discuss birthing and mothering...you are all such goddesses! i feel like i don't know that much about birth to contribute to that intense conversation. i am dying to write out my birth story and share it with you all. hopefully, in the coming weeks, i'll have some time to do so.

sorry i don't have any individual love-comments at the moment, but you're all in my heart and on my mind! more soon, dearies!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, try sticking a quince in your turkey instead







I had a quince-stuffed pheasant the other week and it was, frankly, amazing. You're absolutely right about the brining though, it makes such a difference.

barcelona,







and happy working! I'm glad this is making you feel so happy.

Fern







to you too, mama. Come back and post a big update soon, OK?









Kavita, happy cooking to you. Oh, if anyone has a recipe for a pumpkin pie made from scratch, I'd love to read it. I have far too much pumpkin stuff around.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

12 days.

I still need ties. Someone tell me where to buy 3 ties for grown ups and 3 for little boys, in a lovely shade of purple.

Freaking out over the blasted ties.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Walmart for the grownups, not sure about the kids.


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
12 days.

I still need ties. Someone tell me where to buy 3 ties for grown ups and 3 for little boys, in a lovely shade of purple.

Freaking out over the blasted ties.

they aren't that hard to make... or at least they don't look so.







: You could take apart an old one for a pattern or get a pattern from the fabric store (they usually have a special occaision section in the pattern books). Then they'd be matching and you could pick out your own color.

As if you have the TIME do sew ties!!!!!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

This is what we did last year... and are doing again this year. Simply amazing. Alton Brown (I love him) has a good how to on food network.com.
We stuff sage and a bit of thyme and parsley food processed with butter under the skin. we put our turkey in at 500F for 30 min and then turn it down to... oh shoot I forget if it's 325 or 350 - but with foil covering the top (breast part). Then cook until it's 161F - it still cooks while the meat is resting. It browns up nicely, the meat is moist and falls off the bone. Simply amazing.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Just quick - Kavita: BRINE YOUR TURKEY!!!! One part salt to one part sugar, dissolve in boiling water then add cold water until it's dilute enough that you could *almost* swallow it if you had to. Immerse the turkey the night before you cook it - probably your best bet is to stick it in a cooler, in the brine, and throw a bag of ice in and leave it outdoors or someplace cool. The brine temp should be no more than 38F. The turkey must be completely submerged - put a weight on top of it if necessary.

For cooking, assume 25 minutes per lb + 30 minutes, at 325F and DO NOT STUFF IT!!! Do your stuffing on the stove. Stuffing MUST be cooked to at least 165F, and for the heat to penetrate it to get it to that point, the meat will definitely be overcooked, dry and nasty. Put a couple quartered onions, some bay leaves and some sage in the cavity instead, just loosely. Rub butter and herbs all over the skin before roasting, and baste frequently after juices start to appear in the pan. Let the whole bird rest, tented with foil, for at least 30 minutes after removing from the oven, before carving. And use a thermometer in the thickest part of the thigh to make sure it's done, or do the leg test - if the leg wobbles easily, it's done. (Although, I find sometimes by that point it's a little past done, but I never eat the breast so I don't care quite so much as I should
















Good luck!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Kavita, happy cooking to you. Oh, if anyone has a recipe for a pumpkin pie made from scratch, I'd love to read it. I have far too much pumpkin stuff around.

have you made pumpkin bisque? celery carrots and onions sauteed then cooked with chicken stock, bay leaf, a touch of nutmeg, (curry powder if you want to go that way), salt, pepper, paprika, pumpkin puree, a enough heavy cream to get it tasting how you want. Top with yogurt or sourcream and an apple-raisin-red onion-acv relish with a sprinkling of cayenne.
Yum.
I keep promising Willem we'll make a pumpkin pie... maybe today!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

when we were in bali, i craved they typical thanksgiving sort of foods like mashed potatoes, fluffy rolls and stuffing with mushroom graving. i would drool just thinking about them. since we are vegan, we don't do the whole turkey bit but we never seem to miss out b/c of all the other yummy dishes. and, we've dubbed it "thanksveganing"!

still reading to catch up on all the great birthy talk that was happening over the past week. it will probably be old news by the time i reply!

in my birthy world, the great news is that i had my first appt with the mw who will attend our homebirth here in nc. before you get worried that i had my first pre-natal at 25 weeks, remember that i was volunteering at a birth center and got lots of great pre-natal care with the midwives there! so, two great pieces of news about my body's wonderfulness is that i am finally gaining weight (about 5 pounds) and that my babe is growing well...measuring 3 weeks ahead! I always measured behind with ezra and was measuring one to two weeks behind this time, too. i am so grateful to not have to worry right now about this babe being small or not getting nutrients or anything. with ez's low birth weight (5 lbs then down to 4 and half), i was pretty freaked out last time and really want to have a bigger one this time around. doubt that there are many wishes out there for a bigger babe.







but it would be one less thing to worry about!

happy labor and birthdays to you mamas and babes this week!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Pumpkin pie:
1 scant cup pumpkin (more on that later)
1 scant cup sugar
2 eggs
2 cups whole milk
1 tsp cinnamon
1 tsp ginger
1/2 tsp nutmeg
dash salt
1 pastry crust (homemade)

Cook down pumpkin on low heat for about an hour before measuring. (It will thicken and dry out some.) Mix sugar and eggs well. Add pumpkin and spices and mix. Add milk and mix. Put light flour dusting into pastry crust, spoon in filling. Bake at 400 degrees 10-15 minutes, then turn down to 360 degrees for 20-30 minutes. Cool before refrigerating.

Note--this is my mom's recipe, and she usually makes it with canned pumpkin, but cooks it down as above. It makes it much more smooth and custardy and dense and pumpkiny, rather than the sort of watery pies you sometimes find. I haven't made this with fresh pumpkin puree--check with me in a day or two for results on that!!!!!









Now for a recipe that I have made, and to great acclaim around here--pumpkin chocolate chip muffins. I modified these from a recipe I found online so this is my modified version which is different enough to be its own recipe now, iykwim.

Pumpkin Chocolate Chip Muffins:

3/4 cup lite brown sugar
1/4 cup melted butter
2 eggs
1 1/2 cup pumpkin puree
1 tsp vanilla extract
1/4 cup milk
1 1/2 cup whole wheat flour
3/4 tsp. baking powder
1/2 tsp. baking soda
1/4 tsp. ground cloves
1 1/2 tsp ground cinnamon
1/4 tsp salt
3/4 tsp. ground nutmeg
1/2 cup semisweet chocolate chips

Directions: Preheat the oven to 400 degrees F (200 C.) Lightly oil muffin pan (mine is nonstick) or use paper liners.

Mix sugar, butter, eggs, vanilla. Add pumpkin and milk. In a separate bowl mix together the everything else except the chocolate chips. Add the wet ingredients, mix, and stir in chocolate chips.

Fill muffin cups 2/3 full with batter. Bake in a preheated oven for 20-25 minutes.

These are some really yummy muffins!


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *willemsmamma* 
they aren't that hard to make... or at least they don't look so.







: You could take apart an old one for a pattern or get a pattern from the fabric store (they usually have a special occaision section in the pattern books). Then they'd be matching and you could pick out your own color.

As if you have the TIME do sew ties!!!!!

Uhhhh....yeah probably not. I found some on Amazon that almost match, but I'm a little worried about buying them online and having them arrive on time. I won't be able to buy them until the 24th. So I'm not sure what to do. I looked all the department stores but they're either totally out of my price range or totally not the purple I was looking for. Sigh.


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Yum.. thanks for the recipies Kavita! We pressure cooked a bunch of pumpkin up today, made pumpkin bisque, toasted pumpkin seeds, and I'll probably make pie and muffins and maybe even bread when I come back from dropping the kids off at my parents tomorrow.

Gunter - so are you saying now that you are in the states and now that it's not thankveganing you aren't craving the foods you were? Glad your mw apt went so well. I had my first at 20 1/2 wks. I totally doubt anyone thinks down on you for waiting until now. I'm measuring small, which is different (along with a whole list of other pg symptoms) than my last two pregnancies. Very different. How true is the whole gender of the baby and pregnancy symptom correlation? Sigh. I don't want to "know" but I do, but since I'm not having an ultrasound it doesn't even matter. OTOH, if I was having a girl, I'd soooo be into knitting girly stuff right now.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

New toddler behaviour alert!!! (And advice welcomed...)

Neela has a new phrase when she's feeling angry or frustrated "I feel like being mean" or "I want to be mean to you now". It ususally happens when we're transitioning between things: when dad comes home, if a friend arrives, when we first get somewhere, etc.

I'm so proud of her for recognizing the feeling and naming it (and for warning us!), but kind of at a loss for dealing with it. My usual "time in"-type reaction of sitting down with her and talking about what's happening, how she's feeling, what she can do to deal with it seems to get her more worked up. Yesterday when I tried to talk with her she told me "I'm going to push you away". Again, amazing self-control to warn me instead of just shoving. But mean Neela is kind of scary- she yells it and gets a really intense look.

My instinct is to ask her to go to be by herself until she isn't feeling mean. Not in a punitive time out kind of way, but just to give her space to be mean in a safe place where nobody gets hurt. In the same way that we hit and throw pillows instead of hurting people. Any other suggestions?


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Mel, have you tried asking her what she needs to not feel mean anymore? I don't have any experience with this but I think that's what I'd do if Rowan told me she was feeling mean. And yeah, wow that's a lot of self-control for a 2-year-old!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Mel-
i've just frankly replied something like that if you feel you need to be mean, be mean to your pillow, not to mommy. It's okay to hit certain things, it's never okay to hit people.
I'll also just reaffirm that I understand they are experiencing emotions they don't understand, and by reassuring them that those emotions are normal it helps them deal with them: "I feel like being mean too sometimes. That's when I need a minute to myself. " or "you're feeling frustrated. I get frustrated too sometimes."
We do a lot of "it's okay to feel ____, it's not okay to act _____ when you feel like that. Here's something else we can do" It didn't really "work" at first but Willem is finally getting to a stage where we'll be able to briefly talk through whatever is bothering him. If I let him know what he says and feels is important we can avoid a meltdown. It's taken a while to get to that place.
HTH, but I think I just gave you a bunch of examples of stuff you're probably already doing. I know that we went through a (long) stage where it worked, then it didn't, now it's working again.

Have you tried talking to her about it when she's feeling fine? give her ideas as to why she feels mean when she does? Transitioning seems to be triggering it. Maybe she wasn't ready to move on to the next thing when she did (or someone came in and changed the environment she was quite comfortable in).


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Wow, Mel, Neela is an amazing child! Wish I had advice for you....

Monique, my pg with Ella was very different, obviously she was still a girl like them, but she is quite a different girl. I had ms all day, for quite a long time with her. I went right to my EDD, where my two older girls were both a couple weeks early. My mom insists I carried her differently. My co-worker was so certain I was going to have a boy (she even dreamed it) that when my mom called to tell her Ella was born, my mom said "Sharon had a girl!" and my friend said "Oh no!"







So you just never know.....

Kavita, thanks for sharing - now I must bake!!









Spughy, we just do a breast, since we are only a few, can I still brine it?

DiD - wishing you purple ties! Hope all your planning goes smoothly....


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Yup Sharon, breasts are much, much juicier and tastier when brined. TURKEY breasts. Won't do much for yours.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Mel, do you have to say anything if Neela tells you she feels mean? Can't you just acknowledge it with a gentle uh-huh, or repeat what she's said so that she knows you've listened to her? Telling you that she feels like being mean is a bit different from sticking a fork in your hand, y'know?


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Mel, do you have to say anything if Neela tells you she feels mean? Can't you just acknowledge it with a gentle uh-huh, or repeat what she's said so that she knows you've listened to her? Telling you that she feels like being mean is a bit different from sticking a fork in your hand, y'know?

My gentle acknowledgment resulted in her getting in my face and saying it louder- like she really, really needed me to pay more attention. I talked with her about it last night when she was not feeling mean, and she told me that she feels very shy. Which makes sense for a lot of the situations where she's said that. We talked about some strategies for dealing with shyness, so hopefully it helps. And it makes sense to me, since she's totally quit the face burying shy behaviour that she used to do, but has been known to yell "Don't say hi to me" to random friendly strangers. Somehow she has the idea that she needs to respond to everyone who speaks to her, and she's usually pretty extroverted. I'm teaching her that ignoring strangers that talk to her is totally okay, and that when new people/friends arrive that it's fine to take some time before talking to them.

*Susannah* are you okay?


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
*Susannah* are you okay?

I do hope so!!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Happy Birthday to my little Rowan-bug! I can't believe she's 2. Well I can, she acts quite a bit older than my "in my head" version of 2 most of the time. But she's REALLY 2! DH said to me this morning, "does it feel like 2 years?" and it most certainly does not. This last year especially has flown by.

And... we made it to 2 years nursing! I feel very proud of us. I am even managing to lose weight now - and I know my supply has dropped some more - but she still loves her boobies. (I put on pants yesterday that I haven't worn in about a year, and they fit. More or less.







) I got a little tear in my eye this morning, while I was nursing my 2 year old, thinking back to the panic and horror I felt when my milk didn't come in, and the pain and suffering (and cruel irony) of the many bouts of mastitis, and that biting phase, and now all the stress of nursing is officially gone - 2 was my "magic" age - as in, as long as I can nurse her til she's 2 I'm ok with it - and I can just treasure every nursing session. Except those ones at 5:35 am (seriously, it's like she's got a digital clock implanted in her brain) when her little hands wiggle back and forth under my armpit and I find that I didn't trim her nails as perfectly as I thought.

DH and I put together a homemade playdough set for her - we bought cookie cutters, but scavenged an old small rolling pin and I made some playdough. (So easy! Why do people (and I'm guilty of this too) buy the stuff???) Last night I made carrot cake cupcakes for her too, to have at grandma & grandpa's today (to forestall grandma making something nasty from cake mix). And one of her aunts sent a toy that is plastic and battery-operated but actually really, really cool, and the g'parents and her uncle got her lots more books, and I just picked up a parcel from my mom for her and I don't know what's in it yet. She's an excited little girl today, but the REAL treat apparently is the ice cream we picked up at the store this morning. (Yeah, I should have made some myself... jeez I'm such a slacker







)

Anyway, we are having a little party tomorrow for a couple of her friends and I need to clean up and get some dinner happening.

Susannah - hope everything's all right? Drive-by deleted posts always worry me.







in case you need it!

Oh and Helen, WHY couldn't you have posted the tip about the quince a few days earlier when I had a roasting chicken in the fridge????







. I've had a couple quinces sitting on my counter having an argument about whether or not they want to be jelly, and looking for a destiny more interesting... in the end all but one ended up in the cupcakes as carrot substitute.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Re: ties - when I needed to find a perfectly "Caronlina Blue" tie for Killy for a wedding last spring I found one at Burlington Coat Factory - they actually had a huge selection and were quite inexpensive. Good luck!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Mel: gotcha, she's doing an Isaac, but with considerably more maturity and EQ than he possesses. If it gets bad enough that you don't feel happy about riding it out, it could be worth taking a look at the Chicory profile from the bach flower remedies: it's helped Isaac take his edge off a lot.

Susannah









Spughy, you know what the single best use for a quince is? A pomander. Seriously. They're good in crumbles and jellies, but the single most fantastic thing you can do with it (apart from sticking it in a bowl in your living room and letting it rot, which makes the whole house smell gorgeous) is pomanderising it. And nobody else will have one









Happy Birthday Rowan!!!


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

I just remembered that there is a children's formalwear shop in the mall. Yeah! So now all I have to do is A) Go there. and B) Find a place to buy ties for Jim and his two guys.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Happy Birthday Rowan!!! and congrats on the weight loss Spughy . . . I swear I will catch up one of these days! (when I stop my insane Thanksgiving cooking frenzy!)


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

We're off today! Yay!

I'm loving this holiday food discussion. Two of my students are doing their semester projects on the 100-mile diet, which has inspired me to be more vigilant about getting locally grown food, so our Thanksgiving is heavy on squash. Of course, there are a lot of persimmons, too, and that's pretty delicious. Though the toddler eats them two at a time several times a day, so poopy diaper changes have tripled in the past week. Oh, AND, this morning I discovered that a handful of discarded fava beans have sprouted in my compost pile; I have not idea what to do with fava beans, but I went ahead and lifted them and replanted them in the garden, so we'll see what becomes of that.

It's back to sunny and warm here. So much for sweater weather.


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Kavita - how'd your pumpkin pie go? I made mine from fresh pumpkin (steamed in the pressure cooker then cooled in the fridge, drained, and cooked down on the stove) and I substituted half the sugar for sucanat and half the milk for light cream (because I only had reduced fat milk). I also used an arrowhead mills granola crust (but only because the cranberry upside down cake - I substituted a few healthier ingredients- and the bavarian apple torte I made had lots of butter in them). I had leftover pie filling so I mixed it into a package of organic cornmeal muffin mix, added tangerine zest and dried cranberries and made muffins too!

Besides the desserts I'm making this for the kids and their cousins to enjoy!!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *willemsmamma* 
Kavita - how'd your pumpkin pie go? I made mine from fresh pumpkin (steamed in the pressure cooker then cooled in the fridge, drained, and cooked down on the stove) and I substituted half the sugar for sucanat and half the milk for light cream (because I only had reduced fat milk). I also used an arrowhead mills granola crust (but only because the cranberry upside down cake - I substituted a few healthier ingredients- and the bavarian apple torte I made had lots of butter in them). I had leftover pie filling so I mixed it into a package of organic cornmeal muffin mix, added tangerine zest and dried cranberries and made muffins too!

Besides the desserts I'm making this for the kids and their cousins to enjoy!!


That turkey thing looks so cute!!!!

Whaddya mean, how "did" the pie go--it's still going! AAACK! I didn't get as much done yesterday and today as I'd hoped thus far, so my pumpkins are still cooking in the oven as we speak and the crusts are not done. I'm currently in Culinary Panic Mode, so of course, as I got onto the computer to look up a recipe for one of the things I'm making, I'm procrastinating by getting on MDC.









It'll all work out in the end!


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
*Susannah* are you okay?

Yes, sorry about the drive by posting. Thanks for the love and hugs, mamas.







:

The truth is I visited our group right after DP said something really hurtful, so I was in a bad mood. Something I read here bothered me and I posted a response and then quickly decided that I admire and value the mama who I was responding to so much, and I wasn't really responding to her post but to my anger at DP. Make sense? It's okay if it doesn't make sense, I already know I'm crazy









Thanks again so much, you gals just made my day







:


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Susannah


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Susannah.

FWIW, if it was me that made me mad, my suggestion came out wrong. I'm just feeling conscious, sometimes, of the fact that I tend to wind my kids up by overtalking something.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Dh and I just made an obscene amount of food for three people, only two of whom have full-sized stomaches! I blame it all on him; he loves to cook, and gets all nostalgic about holidays, so we have squash casserole, sweet potato casserole, green bean casserole, cranberry-apple sauce, deviled eggs, and a pumpkin pie. He was being restrained by making only a half dish of the green bean casserole! One day his taste for cooking and my taste for entertaining will match up...







The pie is the last thing in the oven now, and the house feels warm and smells wonderful.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

yesterday was such a fabulous day for me. I have been dreaming of eating the typical thanksgiving food since july b/c i didn't think that i would get to this year. we had planned to be in asia during november. anyway, since we can home early, we had a grand "thanksveganing" with our co-family. my belly was ready to stretch for me, unlike how most of this pregnancy has been...me eating like a little bird. soooo yummy!

happy belated birthday to rowan!

anyone else not buying anything today? i am trying to restrain from using all those damn crafty store coupons i got in the mail yesterday. there's a great Craft Market at the bead shop downtown that i will meet friends at tomorrow. the bead shop is run by a fellow breastfeeding, earty birthy mama. hey, i gotta support my peeps.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
We're off today! Yay!

I'm loving this holiday food discussion. Two of my students are doing their semester projects on the 100-mile diet, which has inspired me to be more vigilant about getting locally grown food, so our Thanksgiving is heavy on squash. Of course, there are a lot of persimmons, too, and that's pretty delicious. Though the toddler eats them two at a time several times a day, so poopy diaper changes have tripled in the past week. Oh, AND, this morning I discovered that a handful of discarded fava beans have sprouted in my compost pile; I have not idea what to do with fava beans, but I went ahead and lifted them and replanted them in the garden, so we'll see what becomes of that.

It's back to sunny and warm here. So much for sweater weather.

Did you read that book, "plenty"? I was bit fascinated with the locavore thing for a good bit. I also read "animal, vegetable, miracle" but that one was really hard for my vegan heart.

We did buy local squash, too but it was an odd experience. The lady who was selling them said, "you ever see a kid you just want to wack?" as a yelling toddler walked by. Uhm, what?! The kid's dad was close by and we were outside not even in a crowded area or anything. Total great place to yell, if you ask me. At first, i thought the kids was laughing. It took DH and I a minute to register that she has actually said that out loud. We were paying for our squash and left without saying anything. We talked about it in the car and DH wasn't sure he had heard her right b/c it was such a ridiculous thing to say! Anyway, no more buying from her. But i was a bit disappointed in myself for not saying anything in response to her.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
anyone else not buying anything today? i am trying to restrain from using all those damn crafty store coupons i got in the mail yesterday. there's a great Craft Market at the bead shop downtown that i will meet friends at tomorrow. the bead shop is run by a fellow breastfeeding, earty birthy mama. hey, i gotta support my peeps.

Yes, we're celebrating Buy Nothing Day. Adbusters is Vancouver-based, so I'm used to seeing more celebration for it- free swaps and events, etc. And the Plenty authors are from Vancouver, too- we used to follow their updates on The Tyee, which is a pretty cool online paper (and that I shamelessly promote for friends who freelance for it).

And thanks for the Bach tip, Helen.

We all have colds here, and I'm tired. Night-weaning is going pretty well, except the 5 am wake-up where she insists on going to the living room and sitting on the couch. She falls back asleep and I usually do, too, but if I even think about moving back to bed she wakes again. So other than the seriously kinked neck from couch (actually love-seat) sleeping, I'm actually getting more rest than before.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Doh, I missed Buy Nothing Day. Unfortunately I had to do a bunch of grocery shopping, as this is the day that the farm I shop at has the most vegetables and the eggs come in to the bulk store. Usually it's also the day for pastured chickens at the little grocery next to the bulk store but that didn't happen today it seems. And we have guests coming over for tonight so I couldn't really do some sort of default dinner and wait til tomorrow to go shopping. But, all I bought was food and all I'm going to buy is food.

DH put Rowan to bed last night and she slept from 9 until 6 the next morning, then didn't even want a boobie then, she just went back to sleep with a cuddle for another hour or so. So nice. Except DH still hasn't got the hang of how to put a diaper on so it doesn't leak







: and she was a little damp this morning. Sigh.

Gotta go make pies...


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

We don't do buy nothing day. We do "crap, I need to put together a fantastic party picnic" day instead







:
My baby turns 9 tomorrow. HTH did that happen?


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

i'm so out of the loop.. i didn't even know about buy-nothing-day







:... i bought red raspberry leaf, nettle and alfalfa from the health food store (im in vancouver seeing family and midwife for 9 days..woohoo) and bought groceries and pants for elwynn and tights and winter boots for ngaio.. definately not a buy nothing day for us...but a lot of the time where we live we don't buy anything.. its like once a week plus sometimes milk and or eggs from the store down the street..so i dont feel so bad. plus we are SO poor right now. im lucky that my family are all giving christmas and birthday gifts to my kids because im pretty much penniless right now. its hard having 2 birthdays and christmas and new baby all happening in a timespan of a month or two..







:


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

We just got back from visiting dh's brother whose family of five was staying at a house at a nearby beach. I so love that Woody has an extended family. He threw the football with his cousins, played in the sand, helped me find shells, and had a grand time going up and down the boardwalk. He spent the whole ride home listing off all the people he'd just seen and then moved on to all the people he knows. It feels so good to me that he understands what a community is by experience.

Fern, I feel the same way about Woody's birthday this month--relatives are already sending the presents, and we're planning on "re-gifting" a tricycle that we got him a few months ago but that was too big for him. (We immediately disappeared it to the closet, so he'll doubtless be excited to see it, but hopefully will be tall enough to USE it now!) That and a pair of hand-knit socks will probably be the extent of our presents.

Oh, one thing I wanted to ask y'all: What are/did you do for a cake? I want to bake something, but rich foods have not been agreeing with my boy lately, so I was thinking some sort of sweetbread or muffin. Any ideas?


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

i'm going to make a carrot cake i think (shaped like a snail..her favorite thing right now) i have a great simple recipe that uses apple sauce and maple syrup for sweetner, plus it has lots of eggs in it so its pretty healthy and not so sweet... she may or may not eat any of it..she has been off most foods lately. but it will still be fun to make a cake.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

I did carrot cake for Rowan too. She didn't think much of it, but all her little friends gobbled it right up (cupcake format) and their parents were grateful for the lack of refined sugar and the fact it was ice-your-own and the icing was out of reach


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

We're doing an angel cake with strawberry icing. Alex has a victoria sandwich







His request. a WHOLEMEAL victoria sandwich cake, as well, bless his little cotton socks. I can't believe he's 9 already- well, in an hour's time. This time 9 years ago I was sitting on the toilet whinging about how much I needed a poo. Blasted castor oil. He seems very taken with everything, and we've just got back from Cadburyworld It's quite freaky, really, but the stuff about the Bournville village was fascinating.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Okay, here's the update from today for anyone who has been following the saga of my psychotic seamstress.

My sister and I went out to her house. She was pulling out of her driveway as we arrived. She stopped and got out and gave me this "OMFG what are you doing here?" look. This is after I called her, I sh** you not, 16 times since 10am Friday telling her I was coming.

She says "I HAVE to go to the store right now." and gets in her car and leaves. My sister and I stand there, dumbfounded, in her driveway. She comes back in 18 minutes and we follow her inside.

Her house once again was disgusting. Filthy, reeked of pee, her two older kids were downstairs cleaning the bathroom, poor things. Her sewing room was trashed, her baby cried the whole time we were there and my boobs were leaking like faucets.

But she fitted my sister for her dress, typed up an invoice for the remaining balance and I about sh** myself when she said I owed her another $120. But at this point, it's 7 days until my wedding, WTF else am I gonna do? I fork over the cash, she says to come on Monday at 12:30 for my final fitting and I'll be able to take all the dresses then.

Monday at 12:30 this nightmare will be over.

I hope.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

I just got back from visiting my family in Florida and being away from the computer for a week...I have OH so much to catch up on, but just wanted to pop in and say that I hope everyone (in the US) has had a lovely Thanksgiving week, and that all is well. I'll be catching up with you all in the next few days!


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

First, happyyyyy birthdayyyy to all the babies! Two years, whoo-hoo.

We were in Victoria BC this weekend and picked up some yummy cakes today for Emmett. He was so happy with the candles and everything (we didn't talk about his b'day so much until tonight). He kept saying, "Happy Two Birfday, Baby." (He calls himself baby)

Last night we had yummy pies and dinner over at Spughy's house and DAMN she is a fine cook. My diet days would be destined for failure if I lived in Victoria and showed up at her house for dinner every night...and because we were in Victoria, yesterday we celebrated Buy Face Cream from Lush day. But that's why I love Victoria for US Thanksgiving, we get to skip the mad rush for the malls. Here there were malls opening at MIDNIGHT with bands playing and everything. Why would someone go shopping at 2 AM?!? And the poor people working...

OK, if you've had an unconventional baby shower (or know someone else who had one) --- please please please e-mail me. Big rush! Even if you have an idea for one.

Kavita, I know this was a while ago, but I would also say that kids at 2 tend to try on phrases. Has she heard you use similar words before? I think it's great that she says it -- but I would also (personally) not get too responsive or feed it; and just say something like, "oh yes, I see that you feel so angry. Uh huh." And if she's amenable, try distracting her with something else to see if it was an attention-getting device or if she was deeply, deeply upset. Pretty soon they have fun saying things like, "I hate you, mommy, you suck," just for kicks. It's good to practice the nonchalant, accepting attitude now...


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

i am working on finishing up my final exam for doula certification. it's kinda lame that i haven't finished yet when i did the training back in january and have been to 26 births this year. ugh. it's just so long...and i don't know if i am writing too much or not enough. here on mdc, the scoop is to be thorough vs. brief or it will get sent back to me to re-do. i would love to have this thing knocked out today...just needed a break.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

FSM, just curious: which face cream? I was a die-hard Afterlife fan until I found something that works even better.
DiD,







. It's not too late to come to Gretna


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Hey ladies! We're back from our Texas trip so I just wanted to post a quick hello. Looks like it's going to take a solid week of reading to catch up with y'all!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flyingspaghettimama* 
Kavita, I know this was a while ago, but I would also say that kids at 2 tend to try on phrases. Has she heard you use similar words before? I think it's great that she says it -- but I would also (personally) not get too responsive or feed it; and just say something like, "oh yes, I see that you feel so angry. Uh huh." And if she's amenable, try distracting her with something else to see if it was an attention-getting device or if she was deeply, deeply upset. Pretty soon they have fun saying things like, "I hate you, mommy, you suck," just for kicks. It's good to practice the nonchalant, accepting attitude now...


I had to search the last couple pages of posts to check, but I'm pretty sure that I haven't said anything that hasn't related to food in the last week or so and that you are mixing me up with MelW. Of course, I am honored to be mistaken for such a fine individual!









Life here: My parents left this morning. My sister and her family didn't end up coming after all, so it was just us and my parents. My dad started feeling yucky on the way here and basically ended up sick with a cold, nothing terribly serious so far but enough to just make us all just hang around the house for the most part except for going out to eat once or twice. Anway, Ella is now sick and I'm not feeling so great either, but overall we're decent--she isn't seriously sick, just really congested and with a goopy eye and a little cough but still fairly perky.

Thanksgiving went pretty well. However, it was seriously grueling--my parents didn't get there when expected, so there was no child-entertaining Wednesday night, and then we ended up going to see them at their hotel and grab a bite to eat with them at about 9:30 pm because they were dying to see Ella but not feeling well enough to come over to our place, so the upshot is that I was out till late, then had a hyped up kid, then ended up finishing two different kinds of pie until an insane hour of night and didn't end up sleeping until about 6 am. Then getting up to cook. So I was really tired and got a little bit of a later start than expected in the morning and sort of had to get right to it and then was sort of doing one thing after another after another and never ended up getting to really sit down. And I was too exhausted and busy to really brine the stupid turkey.

The turkey . . . it didn't go so well. :-( In fact, I think it was the only bad turkey I've ever cooked! First of all, they are not kidding about it being natural and minimally processed. I took out the directions and it seriously took me a while to get it ready for the oven. There were a few black spots under the skin, which I poked and prodded and discovered were actually quills and I think bloody spots, which exuded a gritty brownish sludge when expressed. I spend about half an hour searching for and pulling out some remains of feathers with my Leatherman multitool pliers, not how I expected things to go! I wished I'd had time to brine it if only so I'd have seen this before and not when I was in a rush to get the darn thing into the oven. Then, I followed the directions of all not to cook it too hot--I got it to 168 in the thigh and then let it rest for half an hour, while I got everything else ready and everyone else got ready to eat. Then my mom and I started trying to carve the darn thing and it was seriously not cooked. As in, the breast seemed done but the rest of the turkey was kind of bloody and rare. We ended up cutting the breast off, eating that, and then throwing the rest of the hacked up carcass back in the oven. I took it out sort of randomly about halfway through the meal and abandoned it on top of the stove when I determined that it was no longer raw--I didn't really like the taste of this turkey and everyone was really done eating and I was too tired to care anymore!!!! It is all currently in the fridge, awaiting its fate as doggie snacks! To be fair, the breast did turn out to be acceptable in terms of being relatively juicy and tender--not as tender as a factory raised bird but that's to be expected with a bird that actually has had the chance to run around outdoors, they are more muscular. But it did have a very intense meaty turkey-ish taste that was way more gamey than I am accustomed to, and maybe having a pretty visceral experience with preparing the darn thing didn't help, so I had a couple of bites and that was that. However, there was tons of other food and everyone else liked everything and we had a good time, so that is what counts! Next time I will make sure to brine and marinate and flavor and everything else!!!!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Most of the beads are being sent tomorrow. Let me know when you get them.

Spughy and MamaFern...I need addresses to send yours. check your PM's


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Kavita - that's a bummer about the turkey.







I don't like "real" turkey flavour either. I've no idea why the entire continent persists in eating them, they're really nowhere near as tasty as geese and ducks.

kaspirant - I PM'd you back









FSM - it was fabulous seeing you guys again. Your children really are lovely and it was *wonderful* talking to you. I wish we lived in the same city. I promise I wouldn't feed you too much









I had an extraordinarily productive day - without Rowan, of course. DH took her to his parents while I checked out the flea market and interviewed a bunch of people for an article I'm writing, had coffee and a walk with friends & the dog, then came home and completely organized our bedroom, did all the laundry, cleaned the kitchen, made a pot roast, made bread, steam-cleaned the floors, and made mashed potatoes and fried brussel sprout tops and bacon to go with the pot roast. The house is the tidiest it's been since DH moved in, the laundry is all done (one basket left to be put away), and there is plenty of food made for the next few days. I feel like a decent domestic goddess for once.


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

Kavita: In the words of my idol, Monsieur Simpson: "D'oh!"

Flapjack: Celestial cream. Oh, it's yummy. And with my sensitive skin, it's the only thing I can use without my rosacea getting out of control, making me look all embarrassed all the time.

Spughy: You know, there are lots of nice tech jobs down here, and we are so very nice and crunchy too! Or we can both move to the Vancouver area...


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Kavita, I remember not liking the taste of wild turkey when I was growing up. And hearing about the dark spots under the skin... ugh... reminded me of pork skin soup my dad made me eat when we visited Ecuador (the dark spots in that skin were from the hairs shaved but still lodged in the follicles).
Gag.

Dh brined our turkey and stuffed the skin with herbs and it was very tasty. Note to self, taste the turkey drippings from a brined bird before making gravy! I didn't and the gravy turned out a bit on the salty side. Which made up for the bland food my mom made.

Our thanksgiving was so-so. Nice to see my brother and his wife and kids but stressful with my self-centered, drama queen of a mom and whipped, doting dad. Gabriel got vapor rub rubbed on his face and into his eyes when my mom left the jar (within reach and not tightly closed) of his two year old cousin who wanted to play "mommy." My mom still hasn't apologized (I wasn't there at the time) and actually believes that when she had kids all she had to do was expect them to leave things alone and we did. hah. This coming from the woman who had a stroke at age 46 with a resulting personality change, and who forgets most of the details of my childhood, glossing it over and pretending like she was the best mother of all time.







He's fine now but I am so heartbroken that I wasn't there to comfort him when he was terrified and screaming his poor heart out







:

It's four am and I'm still not sleeping and it's going to be a LONG day!







:


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Monique. May the naptime fairy visit you today with synchronised napping, and you and your mum come to a happy place.
Well, my baby girl turns 2 today. Ironically enough, she did an enormous wee right in the middle of our bed yesterday as well, so it was almost like old times







I'm revisiting her birth story, and finally having the confidence to believe that it wasn't an intrinsically fast and scary birth, what made it that way was the sheer amount of adrenaline and worry-hormones floating through my system. Story here...
I'm still strongly planning this birth, with at LEAST 20 minutes pushing. My pet vulval varicosity can take that much stress without bursting, yeah?


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
and you and your mum come to a happy place.


<snort>









Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
I'm still strongly planning this birth, with at LEAST 20 minutes pushing. My pet vulval varicosity can take that much stress without bursting, yeah?


ouch


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Happy Birth Day, Skye and Helen!!!!

I hope everyone is resting and recovering from their respective sleepless Thanksgiving weekends.

We had a very sleepless night last night with Neela's cold, which she mostly redeemed by coming and resting her chin on the edge of the bed as I tried to get a few minutes more sleep. "Mummy, I have a question... Can I tell you a secret?" Then whispered the sweetest "I love you" in my ear :heart

I also have a crazy photo that I should post soon of my 146 week belly shot. Neela asked to climb back in my belly and actually managed to stretch my sweater enough to get most of herself in it









Spughy, isn't it amazing how much one can accomplish in a day without a toddler?


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

happy birthday skye!


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 







Susannah.

*FWIW, if it was me that made me mad, my suggestion came out wrong. I'm just feeling conscious, sometimes, of the fact that I tend to wind my kids up by overtalking something*.









I have tried and tried and tried to figure out what you are talking about but I have no clue







and anyway, it's okay. I'm over what it was about anyway







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
Monday at 12:30 this nightmare will be over.

I hope.

This nightmare will be over and you will have a beautiful wedding








BTW your DDDDC cracks me up!

Oh, and happy birthday Skye/happy birthing day Helen!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

happy birthday, skye!!! happy labor day, helen!!!

kavita- sorry that ella is sick. we were sick here the week before thanksveganing but just runny noses and coughing a ton. ez didn't really get it, thankfully. and, i spent way too much time on the TP while laid up in bed resting! it's frustrating when plans go crazy and then we get so tired trying to catch up. i really hate that sort of thing. being vegan means we get to skip any potential turkey fiascoes and that is so less stress for us. maybe by next year i will use all my vegan powers of conviction to brainwash you into not having one, in an effort to help you avoid any potential stress?
















uhm, spughy, exactly how much coffee did you drink before doing all of that? that's more than i could get done in a month. way to get after it! maybe you and FSM and I can all move out to bellingham one day; i loved visiting that place. hate that we didn't get to meet up though.

monique- my mil ate dinner with us the other night, homemade pizzas. they were very messy for even the adults. she told me about how she was used to seeing kids eat more neat (than how ez was eating her pizza). dh just wasn't "that messy". he also climbed up on the potty at age 1 all by himself when she was in another room. right. she talks about him like he's so much more of a golden boy since i became a mom...before we had ezra, she already raved about how he did everything "right" and was so advanced. we've seen through it all but it's just so ridiculous at times. used to kids eating neatly, my ass.

i am off to orientation with a HB MW and her other assistants. she caught ez and we hired her for this babe, too. i am really stoked to begin working with her on a regular basis. i got to doula with one of her clients earlier this year. i am not heading for a CPM or anything just want to attend HBs with her. I don't want to do hospital doula stuff while preggo. i finished my ALACE certification exam and e-mailed it off today. woo hoo! kinda silly that it took me so long to even start that exam. just glad it's over now.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

So, gunter, am I remembering right that you are in North Carolina? Because I'm in Southwest Virginia - maybe we could meet up sometime!

Okay, totally off-topic, but does anyone have any advice about cats peeing in the house? Our cats have NEVER had accidents, until we moved to our current house 6 months ago. I am actually beginning to hate my cats because at least once a week they pee in a clean basket of clothing or on my quilting stuff. I try to keep my quilting stuff closed off in the sewing room, but every once in awhile I leave the door open and they always pee on my stuff! I am beyond angry about this, and DH just doesn't think its that big of a problem - because he doesn't do the laundry! I'm so freaking sick of re-washing clothes. Am I just being cosmically punished for not always putting clothes away immediately after taking them out of the dryer?


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## gingerstar (Jun 10, 2005)

Jen, I had that issue with my oldest cat - he was my "baby", when I lived alone, with just him, I used to carry him around, he slept with me, etc.... Fast forward to married w/kids, he was a very jealous and pi$$ed off kitty, and showed it by peeing on things..... my leather jacket, set on the floor for like two seconds; my DD's school backpack; the changing table - you get the idea.
Sometimes it can be a comment on the state of the litter box; my vet advised me to have as many boxes as cats, and they all need cleaned daily. In my case, it was a comment on our lifestyle, and his need for attention; he was not pleased to come a distant second to the girls.
In my case, we actually put him on anti depressants,







: and it helped.
HTH!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

So, while Finley napped and nursed, I had the joy of reading the several pages of our thread and catching up. What an impressively domestic group of mamas this is!

Spughy, I cannot believe all that you did in one day...like Gunter said, that would take me about a month, with no toddler, to accomplish. Whew! Sounds like Rowan's birthday was adorable, too.

Helen, Happy Birthday Day, and Skye, Happy Birthday!!! Hope the rest of the day, after the big wee in the bed, was delightful. How's the baby in your belly feeling? Or you, that is







I'm going to read your birth story when I get another chunk of time.

Monique, I hope you got some sleep today! And I'm so sorry to hear about your mom and your trip with your family. Sounds similarly stressful to mine.

QofC, sorry about the cats! I know it was ages ago, but your pictures of Ellie's birthday are just adorable!!!

Susannah, I'm glad you are feeling better,

And Mama Fern, I'm glad you're getting help from family and friends, financially. What an exciting time this is for you..so soon!

Amy, how was Texas? Your house is stunning...I'm so impressed by how quickly and elegantly you turned your house into such a lovely home.

Mel, Neela sounds too cute for words!

Kavita, so sorry about your turkey. Sounds like everything else was really delicious, though. I hope you and Ella feel better soon!

DiD, did you find ties? Did you get your dress fitted? Sorry you are dealing with these added stresses. Soon, the big day will be here, and it will be beautiful, and your new life together with your beloved is all that will matter.

Kaspirant, how are you guys? This week is crazy and then I'll be in touch to try to meet up again.

I'm surely forgetting someone, and my apologies! I'll be back in the loop, and can catch up further.

So we just got back from FL Saturday night, and the actual travelling wasn't so bad actually. Finley was so calm and happy in the airport and in the plane. And he actually slept on both trips, so that was a blessing. As for being in FL, he was great, too...just, again, not thrilled to be left with my parents, so we didn't leave him with them for more than 20 minutes. He loved playing with them, though, when they were interested in playing with him, and while we were around.

We have not been forcing manners on him, and he has, on his own, learned to say "Thank you" almost every time it would be deemed, and it's completely heartfelt and voluntary and full of meaning. He hasn't caught on so well with "please", and I just haven't pushed the issue, trusting (and hoping) that he'll catch on in time. Does anyone else go this route? I just have a hard time hearing moms constantly telling their kids, "what do you say?", and "say please", etc, etc (hope I am not offending anyone here) but it somehow rubs me the wrong way. And perhaps it's also connected to my own upbringing, where I was ignored until/unless I said "Yes, Ma'am", "No, Sir"; manners were a HUGE part of my life, in a very forced unnatural sort of way. At the same time, especially when I'm around my family, I cringe a bit when Finley doesn't say please (which is most of the time), and with his limited verbal skills, he sounds so demanding. Anyone have any input/assurance here?

As for my experience at home, it was pretty awful. But the good thing is that I feel like I have come to yet another level of clarity about my parents, who they are, and what they are in my life...what our relationship is, the reality of it, and being okay with that, or trying to be....and another level of growth for myself. I found myself feeling pretty angry a lot of the time, and having a hard time covering it, and that was hard for me to even accept in myself. I hate that I do feel anger, but I suppose I have to just feel it in order to move past it. The anger is subsiding, though, into something more of a processing nature, and just a reaction, that I think is carrying me through and above it.

That little rant probably made no sense at all! But, for those of you who remember, I've had a continuous struggle with my parents, each trip causing quite a bit of pain. And this last one seemed to go to a new level, that gave me a new perspective and clarity. One thing is for sure: I really am the black sheep of the family.

On a sort of MDC note, each trip to my parent's, I'm more aware of something in their lifestyle, which used to be the norm to me, all I knew, and is becoming stranger and stranger to me, as I strive to become more and more natural and green in my lifestyle, although I have very far to go. For example, I can barely tolerate any of the food my mom has or prepares (all fake food, really just "edibles", nothing organic, etc). This last time, I was painfully aware of how often they use papertowels (I have been consciously trying to use them scantly at home, relying almost always on cloth), and the food was even more intolerable to me. I'm relieved to be home and eating (relatively) well and real food again.

And Gunter, you'd be proud to know, I have barely touched meat in the past few months, only about five times, and I feel like I am closer and closer to becoming an official vegetarian. I don't know if I can make the leap to vegan







:, but I do admire it, and am learning more and more...how cruel even the dairy industry is to animals. I'm just taking things one step at a time.

Ok, that's enough rambling from me at the moment!

Thinking of you lovely ladies, and so glad you all had such good thanksgivings, for the most part.

PS--The best part of our trip was the wonderful news that my brother and SIL are expecting a wee one!!! Finley will have his first cousin!

PPS--I'm 28 tomorrow. It feels so OLD, this one.
PPPS--I'm shooting the one episode that was written before the strike on Wednesday...only have two lines for this first episode, but am ecstatic nonetheless!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Happy Birthday Skye! (a bit late, but my internet was broken for most of today)

Barcelona, way to do an update! I'm glad things are sorting themselves out with your parents and you're coming to some peace with your relationship with them. And ugh about the "edibles". I feel for you, I do. On the vegetarianism though - before you go that route, maybe take a look at the traditional foods movement. It stresses ethical, natural treatment of animals and recognizes the health benefits of eating meat. Not hormone-saturated factory-farmed meat, that's not good for your body or your soul - but meat from cows, chickens and other animals living on pasture the way they were bred/evolved to do, being happy chickens and cows and living contented lives, then slaughtered in a non-stressful, humane manner and processed carefully and respectfully. I know Gunter will have a different point of view, but I think real change is going to come to the dairy and meat industries when people start spending money on the high-quality competition and growing a market for ethically, naturally raised animal products rather than just avoiding them entirely. JMHO. Check out www.westonaprice.org for more info.

Jen, a friend of mine has problems with peeing with her cats. With one of them, it's partly health-related, partly emotional (mostly because her health gets bad when she gets uprooted, she doesn't eat enough or something) and with the other it's totally health-related, and happens when he has a UTI. You might want to take them to the vet just to rule out any health issues - peeing is one of those early signs that if it IS related to urinary problems, it's much much better to catch early on.

Nothing new here. The weather is miserable and it's getting dark so early that it's a real challenge getting the dog walked after Rowan's nap. I'm going to have to start working out some other way to do it, but the only way I can think of would mean walking the dog before lunch, which would push Rowan's nap later, which is probably not going to work that well either. Sigh.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Jen, Amy did this a LOT in the last few months before she died, which was a few weeks after Skye was born. The vet treated her for a UTI, but also prescribed walnut flower essence for her- seeing as it could be your moggies reacting to the stress of the move, the walnut could be worth a try.
Barcelona, good to hear from you







We've never pushed for pleases and thankyou's at this age either (at 5 or so, otoh, the boys tended to get some pretty dirty looks if they overlooked their ps and qs) and all three kids used them spontaneously- I think we got thankyou, you're welcome, sorry and please in that order. Belly babe and I are huge, thankyou for asking (someone who hadn't realised about the miscarriages looked at me the other day and reminded me that you get no medals for going post-dates) - but he's head-down and staying there so far and I'm not in contraction hell yet, which is always a good thing.








: to everyone else.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Ladies, I have BIG NEWS!

*BRYNN SLEPT THROUGH THE NIGHT LAST NIGHT!!!!!*








:







:







:







:







:







:







:







:

For the first time ever! She went to sleep (on her own) at 9:00,and I didn't hear from her again until 5:07 (!!!!!), when I heard her toddling groggily down the hall, saying, "May I have milkie?" Bless her little cotton socks, as Helen would say.

I think the combination of night weaning and gradually moving her back into her own bed has really helped...and maybe it's that she's almost two? I don't know, but I will tell you that I am in celebration mode today!

I have to go get breakfast but will be back later today to respond to everyone's posts. (I read for over an hour yesterday to catch up!)


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

MelW;98 We had a very sleepless night last night with Neela's cold said:


> http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif[/IMG]


these are two of the most precious things ever. how fun for her to climb into your sweater, too!

barcelona- HAPPY BIRTHDAY to you!!! Hope you have a fabulous day and everyone celebrates you! PS I am almost two years older than you. Got the big 3-0 coming up on Jan 30th. but hey, it's my "golden year", too so it can't be that bad turning 30. I can understand some about parent visiting and how difficult it can be. It sounds like you grew a lot after this visit though. If things cannot be all mended then at least, we can be happy with our own growth and acceptance, right? i have had to come to that place, too. i still get angry though.

jen- we should definitely get together. i live in durham, where duke university is...near raleigh and chapel hill. I am not far from the interstate. my mom is in richmond and we have good friends in lynchburg. we used to live in northern virginia but were really unhappy there. i do NEED an ikea trip soon though. of all the things i want online, none of them are available for shipping.

sarah- i don't entirely disagree with you. i think everyone can make changes in their diet to improve their health and the lives of those affected by what they consume. i struggle to not eat cookies every single day. i like them, A LOT. when i am not busy eating sugar, i am totally drawn to the locavore diet. for some people, that would rely more heavily on dairy consumption. i think that progress is to be more aware of what we consume. we should all count the cost of what we consume, mainly b/c we have such privilege of available food. that's what is most important to me, awareness.

amy- that's so awesome! here's to many more sleep full nights for you all! it's still so weird for me that ez is sleeping on her own, in her room, in her bed all through the night. she may wake up and need to get settled on her own or with a little cuddle. but, DH and i look at each other around 9-10pm like, "What should we do now?" It's like she's a teenager on her own or something; that's how different it feels for us.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

*Amy* said:


> I think the combination of night weaning and gradually moving her back into her own bed has really helped...and maybe it's that she's almost two? I don't know, but I will tell you that I am in celebration mode today!
> QUOTE]
> 
> No, I can tell you what it is--she and Ella have switched places, a la "Freaky Friday" style. Last night Ella woke up all.freaking.night. After a nice 2 1/2 hour nap in the afternoon, I couldn't get her to sleep until around 2 am!!! Then she woke up a couple of hours later but I think I managed to get her back to sleep by patting her. Then she woke up at 8, suddenly pounced on me and said "phone, phone, grandma!" latched on and went back to sleep. I managed to detach myself to go to the bathroom a while later and then she stayed asleep while I came into the living room and checked email, and then she woke up about 45 minutes later and came out crying and jumped into my lap and is nursing and snoozing again. Oy. Between her being sick and her top molar starting to pop through, it's going to be a looooong day!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kavita. I hope she feels better, and sending you the strength to stay sane.








: Amy!!!!!!







: Sod cotton, if she makes a habit of it I'll knit her cashmere socks. Is that our last sleepless bub letting her mama sleep for at least some of each night?


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

it's good to be back and connected again








i'm going to do some reading on diets and figure out what i am going to do, what path i will take. thanks for the link, spughy. gunter, is it alright if i PM you about your diet, too? and thanks for the birthday wishes!

amy, CONGRATULATIONS!!!! what joyous wonderful news! i hope this is the new nightly pattern for brynn!

on a sleep note, finley went down for his nap yesterday at 2:30, and proceeded to sleep through the night til this morning!!!!!!!!! i tried waking him, short of picking him up, music on, in his face talking gently to him, lights on, etc, but he kept on a'sleeping. i think he just needed to catch up on sleep from the exhaustion and jet lag and loss of sleep from our FL trip.

off to get a birthday breakfast with my boys, and then hope i didn't gain tons of weight over thanksgiving to go in for my costume fitting!!!

hugs to you all!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Just quick, but YAY AMY AND BRYNN!!!! That's so awesome. Rowan's been pretty consistent lately with sleeping from bedtime til about 5 or 6, but sometimes she is glommy at night and then I don't sleep so well, because every time she moves I kind of wake up. I think this weekend I will put my foot down and insist that we go to Sleep Country and pick up a twin bed for her - which we will put between our bed and the wall, and she will learn to sleep in it. Getting her to go to sleep on her own is still an upcoming challenge for us, too.

Hilary, you can totally PM me anytime you like about anything you like







Or bug me on facebook, that's ok too. Oh, and speaking of which, Helen I can't figure out which Helen N. you are on facebook - can you please look me up on there and make me your friend?

And Gunter, I totally agree - awareness IS the most important thing, and I try to eat as local as possible too (which is also pretty dairy-centric here, but we have awesome local veg all year round which helps. No grains though.)


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I can, spughy, but you need to tell me what your surname is first







I haven't looked to see how many Helen N's there are, but I have my lovely husband Steven and plagio on my list of friends, which you can see before befriending people...


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Oh, it's Pugh. Sorry I thought you knew! And barcelona is on my friend list so you can hook up with her too. (If she'll have you. You never know about these famous american types in show biz and all.







)


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

I found ties, at the mall, and paid a pretty penny for them. My final dress fitting is later on this afternoon and I should be able to bring them all home.

Does anyone have any good, natural ways to polish silver? I was gifted a cake serving set and toasting glasses but the silver has tarnished a bit in the box.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Happy Birthday barcelona!!!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Of course, I'll be friends with Helen, or any of us, anytime! Besides, I wouldn't say I was quite IN showbiz just yet...a foot in the door, maybe. I looked for you, Helen, on Spughy's friends list, but didn't see you yet. I don't know your surname at all, so am pretty clueless. I'll be looking for you, and you look for me, and we can be friends on facebook! Yay. (my surname is baack)

I've had a lovely day, and we all lay down for a nap, but when Finley woke needing to nurse, I haven't been able to go back to sleep. My mind is racing. I'm going to yoga at 6, so that will be good for my busy mind.

DiD, so glad you found some ties!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Barcelona, happy birthday! Twenty-eight is such an awesome age. It's when my life really started coming together. Things just keep getting better and better, too!







As for the family issues, it is really hard. One thing that helps me get through is to remind myself that I create my own experience with my family members - well, one in particular, we'll call her "MOM" for short. Anyway, my life now is about making sure that *I* am the adult and that my family is happy and healthy, so who gives a crap about the other stuff. I went through all the stages of grief with my mom though, and have finally reached acceptance, albeit with a lot of eye rolling!














Not to bring up a sensitive topic or offend you, which I would never want to do, but is part of it that you are Deaf? Please don't answer that if it is none of my business!

Kavita, sorry to hear about your turkey!







I hope you were able to laugh about it a little later. Kinda like how I spent last Thanksgiving in bed, puking my guts out with rotavirus. Good times! Sorry to hear you got Sleepless Baby last night, and sick to boot. I hope she recovers soon -- well unless that means Brynn goes back to her sleepless ways. In that case, you can keep Bizarro Ella!









Mel, that is interesting that Neela is going through the "mean" phase, and articulating so well about it. Brynn is going through something similar; sometimes when I tell her I love her, she will say, "You don't! You don't love me so much!" And she has such malice in her voice...it's kind of shocking sometimes. Usually it ends up with me saying, "I do love you!" and she says, "You just love me a little bit." And then she starts laughing about it. So I guess it's a game now, just like how when I kiss her, she says, "I wiped that kiss off!" The first time she said it, I was so hurt, but decided not to show that, so I said, "You can't wipe it off! It already went inside of you and now it's in your heart!" So that's pretty much the routine every time I kiss her! I always wondered how I would react to her saying things like that (I know a lot of kids say they hate their parents, etc.) but man, I wasn't expecting it so soon! So anyway. If it were Brynn saying that she felt mean, I guess I would go with the advice to say "sometimes I feel like being mean, too, and I _____." Empathy usually goes a long way.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gingerstar* 
Amy, I was poking around in our old thread reading birth stories, etc, just feeling all nostalgic, and saw Brynn's birth pictures - O.M.G. the one alert pic of her, she looks exactly like herself! That is so amazing! Honestly, just give her longer hair, and she is exactly the same. Incredible!

Isn't it incredible? Sometimes I think she has changed so much (she no longer looks like Johnny Cash, as Melia said!) but she's still herself!

Oh and speaking of pictures - Jen, Ella looks adorable as always! Thanks to everyone for sharing pictures.

And happy belated birth days to Jacob, Joseph, Ngaio, Skye, and anyone else I may have missed. There are just a handful of us left now, eh DiD?

I have to go get my baby bunny in bed now. Am I even going to hope for a repeat of last night? Nah.









Oh, and I posted pictures of our trip to Texas, if anyone is interested. You can click here to see them.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Oh, and Spughy, just wanted to give you a sincere round of applause for reaching the 2-year breastfeeding milestone with Rowan. You are amazing, and you have much to be proud of!


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
...just like how when I kiss her, she says, "I wiped that kiss off!" The first time she said it, I was so hurt, but decided not to show that, so I said, "You can't wipe it off! It already went inside of you and now it's in your heart!"

Ha! I used to tell this to my dad, only he would tell me that I did not indeed wipe it off, but actually rubbed it in, which infuriated me at the time but is kind of funny in retrospect...


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm so glad that my little bunny hasn't decided to be THAT independent yet! Today while I was cooking dinner she came up beside me, got on her stool, and gave me little kisses on my arm. And while she doesn't always want a cuddle, she never objects THAT much.

The other cute thing from cooking dinner today - she'd just woken up and I was in the middle of some time-sensitive cooking, so I sort of hurried her out of bed and I was holding her in the kitchen, talking through what I was doing... "and we stir our vegetables, then we add some booze - oh, that booze is empty. Let's get some different booze from the fridge. Here we go, glop glop -" interrupted by "mummy what's THAT booze called?" Heh. And then not 5 minutes ago she dove into her toy box, started flinging stuff out, then looked at it and said "Oh my god!" Which, I must say, she totally did NOT get from me, because I never saying that, being alternately an atheist and a goddess-worshipping pagan.

(And thanks for the applause, Amy. It means a lot. I know a lot of people are like "get this thing off my boob" at this point, and I'd be lying if I said I've never ever thought that, but if I'd known, 2 years ago, that I'd still be nursing happily at this point, I'd have felt ever so much better.)


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

spughy, for some reason I always thought that was your maiden name. Doh







:

Happy Birth Day Fern and Ngaio!!!!

DiD, I'll check my jocasta innes book for you. Tarnished silver isn't a big problem for me, for some reason.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
Ha! I used to tell this to my dad, only he would tell me that I did not indeed wipe it off, but actually rubbed it in, which infuriated me at the time but is kind of funny in retrospect...









That is funny! So do you remember *why* you told him that? Did you hate being kissed, or did you hate your dad?







She's been this way since birth, but Brynn is just SO not-affectionate, either on the giving or receiving side. Well, with people, that is; she hugs and kisses her "friends" (stuffed animals, dinosaurs, etc.) all the time. I will tell you honestly, it does hurt my feelings...but what can I do? I know what it feels like to be hugged and kissed when you don't want to be (it sucks), so I really try hard not to do that to her. I think I get a spontaneous hug or kiss like once a month, and that's not an exaggeration. I keep hoping she will grow out of it, or maybe once she's weaned she will crave more affection. I dunno.

So, unrelatedly, I was looking through all of my old photos on Shutterfly last night because of gingerstar's post, and went through my pregnancy pictures. Take a look at this one, if you are so inclined; it was me almost exactly 2 years ago. Looking at it last night, I was shocked at how HUGE I was - I honestly don't remember being that big and I was so annoyed at people saying, "Wow, you are huge!" Now I see why!







But I also thought, I was really beautiful.







I remember telling Jason while I was pregnant and uncomfortable, "I hope I look back and think that I was a beautiful pregnant woman," and I defintely do. Have any of you looked at your pregnancy pics lately? It's surreal.

Oh and this is also unrelated, but a question I wanted to put out to the group. Have you heard that if you measure your child at 2 years and double that amount, that will be their adult height? I'm just wondering how big all of our kids will be! Brynn is right around 34" now, so that means that she should be 5'8" - 3" taller than me! Someone also said you can take the dad's height, subtract 4", and then average that number with the mother's height. Given that, Brynn would be closer to 5'7". Either way, I'm sure she'll be taller than me! And how much are your kids weighing these days? Brynn is somewhere around 24-25 pounds (according to the luggage scale at the airport). I'd love to hear about where your kids weigh in!


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

welcome back, amy!

i am just reading along this morning. Couldn't sleep last night and ez may have had a nightmare or something b/c she woke up screaming and was inconsolable. I totally nursed her for a bit and she hasn't done that in weeks. i couldn't think of anything else that would comfort her. it worked, thankfully.

ez is about 28.5 inches tall and maybe 21 pounds. she's a string bean, for sure. she eats well for the most part. she eats healthy foods and like most toddlers has days where she chows down and days where she doesn't eat a whole lot. her hair is growing so much and in her eyes if i don't pull it back but i don't really want to cut it yet.

So, does anyone here run an etsy shop? i am thinking of opening one for pregnancy and birth jewelry that i make. it's seems pretty easy and straightforward and i wouldn't have to create my own website and shopping cart. thought i could take that sort of risk with less investment in case it's a total flop.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Gunter, I'm looking at etsy too, but tbh, if you're looking at pregnancy and birth jewellery I'd go to hyenacart. There's a lot of women who shop hyenacart specifically because they want to support mothers/ families, whereas etsy tends to be the craftster brigade. For spinning stuff, though, I think etsy is a more logical home for me.
Amy, I heard that the best height predictor is to take dad's height, subtract 3 inches and find the average with mum


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
Ladies, I have BIG NEWS!

*BRYNN SLEPT THROUGH THE NIGHT LAST NIGHT!!!!!*








:







:








:







:







:







:







:







:









: and would you please ask Brynn if she'd send some of that keagan's way?







:

Happy birthday, barcelona!

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
And how much are your kids weighing these days? Brynn is somewhere around 24-25 pounds (according to the luggage scale at the airport). I'd love to hear about where your kids weigh in!

keagan's at about 29 or 30 pounds. i have no idea exactly what though since he won't stand or sit still enough for that long







i have to weigh the two of us together and then subtract what i *think* i weigh.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 

Happy Birth Day Fern and Ngaio!!!!



thanks helen!







i can't believe that she is 2 years old. *sigh*
but its a joyous day too because she has grown to be such an amazing little person. i feel totally blessed


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Hm, I always heard that if you double your child's height at 2.5 years that will be their adult height. (according to that, Killy will be about 6'4", not unthinkable since DH is almost 6'2") I'm not sure how tall Ellie is, but she weighs about 26 lbs I think. She seems to have my build and has been at about the 50th percentile for height (or less) since birth, so I'm guessing she'll be closer to my height (5'4") than DH's. I saved my debutante gown and my wedding gown, even though I felt a little silly doing it since DH's so much taller, I just assumed there was no chance a daughter of ours would be able to wear them - but maybe!

Oh, and Amy, I think I can outdo in pregnancy HUGENESS - this was me two years and two weeks ago. Amazing the difference 50+ lbs make, huh?







I think I was cuter when I was hugely pregnant with Killy, though. I was a youth group leader at the time and my kids jokingly accused me of just having a basketball under my shirt, my belly was so perfectly round and cute! With Ellie was more of a watermelon!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Rowan is almost exactly the same size as Brynn - maybe half an inch shorter, but the same weight. We have an electronic scale that she's figured out how to use and she regularly weighs herself. Of course, it depends on what she's wearing, when I last changed her diaper, etc. And no matter what method I use to come up with her adult height, she's between 5'5 1/2" and 5'6". Which is what I would have figgered anyway. Given the whole "regression to the mean" concept in statistics, it was always extremely unlikely she's be anything BUT taller than me!

Last night she was so sweet. She woke up at some point and I was thinking, oh no, here we go with the "I want boobies" at an inappropriate hour - but no, she just kissed me very sweetly and snuggled up and went back to sleep without saying anything. Sometimes (very sometimes) I do love sleeping with her.







: Of course, the effect was spoiled by subsequent squirming until her feet were in my stomach, followed by kicking as if to shove me over.

Happy Birthday barcelona! I don't remember 28. I don't think anything exciting happened that year. Hmmm... no, wait, it was a dreadful year - 2001. All sorts of bad things happened just after my birthday. So, I hope you have a much better 28 than I did.









Amy - whoa you were totally huge! And splendidly gorgeous too! Here's me a few weeks before I popped. So NOT huge, unlike now. I weighed less then than I do now, sadly. This picture was taken on my last day of work, Hallowe'en 2005. (I was a very cute pregnant lady.)


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
And how much are your kids weighing these days? Brynn is somewhere around 24-25 pounds (according to the luggage scale at the airport). I'd love to hear about where your kids weigh in!


Jacob weighs 32 lbs *tears...means I can't keep him rearfacing ANY longer* and is 36 inches tall.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Woody's 36 inches and 32 lbs., too. And he'll be 2 tomorrow! Egad. I remember going to sleep on Monday night (November 28, 2005) hoping so much I'd either be able to sleep or actually HAVE the baby, but my contractions were too strong to sleep through and not strong enough to push my baby down. That part, I remember, sucked! Also the throwing up.

We're having a birthday circle at my school for him. It's really sweet--on each child's birthday, the whole school sits in a circle around the person and sings an Earthday-Birthday song, then the birthday child walks in a circle around a candle for each year he or she is old, then the other children raise their hands and share memories or appreciations. It makes me happy every time.









We're struggling so much with the night waking and nursing. It's many times a night, and long nursing, and waking up again if I gently break his latch after he's dozed off.







: Mornings are a blur, and in the evenings I can't keep my eyes open. If I were a better planner-aheader, I could go to bed early to make up for it, but when Woody goes down is when I do my lesson plans and read papers. I gotta say, I've definitely been in the get-this-kid-off-my-boob camp these past weeks, also the being-a-working-mom-is-impossible camp.

Golly, I didn't mean to end on such a downer as that. Hmmm. What else can I share? Oh! We're going to my midwife's farm this Friday as a field trip; she's going to teach the kids how to make pesto and tend goats!

And Amy, I think really I was just not such a touchy-feely kid. And I grew up to be not such a touchy-feely person, though without issue about it. I consider myself to be a warm individual, just not someone who likes to be touched a lot or who is particularly cuddly!


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Just checking in...

I feel huge. I know I still don't look it but I feel it. And this baby is so darn active I sometimes wonder if there's more than one in there. I don't remember ever feeling movement in four places at once!!! OTOH there are four limbs so I guess that explains it. I thought I was a beautiful pregnant woman but didn't really ever like any of the pictures of myself. Except for the ones in the pumkin patch.

Interesting on all the different height predictor calculations. I have no idea how tall Gabriel is right now. Or how much he weighs.

QoC-- I remember that exact picture of yoU!!!!

off to watch Bionic woman (and see if it's getting as boring as I predicted).


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Chiming in with the weight height thing (and Amy, I heard about the double their height at 2 years old, too, and my dad kept insisting that was semi-accurate, and he's a doctor, so he thinks it's gospel, even though I know better).

Finley is 28 pounds and about 35". I think he's gonna be pretty tall, since I have such tall genes in my family (My dad is 6'6", and I would have been ab out 5'8" or 5'9" had I not had problems with my legs, etc, etc...) DH and his family are on the short side, though (he is only 5'7", if that)

More soon!
Exhausted and off to sleep...


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

:*Happy birthday Woody and HoneyTree!!*







:


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

happy birthday, woody! happy labor day, teresa! are you all working on night weaning? ez would cry if i tried to not nurse her unless dh really worked to soothe her and even then...well. it was much harder than the day for us. guess that may be true of everyone? anyway, hope that it gets better and you get some sleep. i totally understand about getting stuff done once the babes fall asleep when really, i should just pass out with her!

happy birthday, ngaio! happy labor day, fern!

amy- all through our pregnancy, i thought you were so beautiful! you are just as beautiful now and perhaps more so with your babe by your side!

helen- i have only browsed on hyena cart's jewelry section and it seemed confusing and overwhelming to be. i like the niche audience part of it, though.

it seems like all you babes are so much bigger than ezra. are you all making straight cream while i lactated skim milk?







she's been tiny from the beginning, only 5 lbs at birth and down to 4 and a half. i am just so thankful that she's healthy and happy!!! kwim? it's too easy to compare how small she is and worry, well i don't worry so much anymore but i did that first year or so.

i was so huge when preggo with her. when i got preggo with ez, i was about 15 lbs heavier than when i got preggo this time. and, i just kept packing the pounds on with her unlike this time where i lost a ton down the toilet in the first 3 months. as of two weeks ago, i have finally gained back that lost weight from morning sickness! as someone recovering from years of disordered eating and image, it feels so funny to say (and believe) that i am happy to be gaining weight. it feels so free, like i defeated something in my head that kicked my ass for so many years. woo hoo!

we're going to richmond, finally to see my mom and sister. and, hopefully get up to ikea for a few goodies.


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

I've just read through 3 pages and all I've retained is the height/weight thing. I swear my brain has turned totally to mush. On the height/weight thing we have conflicting reports. He has been in the ped's and ER too much lately with his ear, then a checkup and most recently croup. He is somewhere around 32-33lbs and at least 36" tall. It would be a good guess to say he will probably be at least 6' based just on genetics. He will also probably stay a big guy just like his daddy, one uncle and grandpa for starters.

He also did pretty decent with sleep last night. He went to sleep in our bed, but was moved to his with no problems. He stayed there until around 5:30 and was very proud of himself for having been in his bed all night. However he was totally soaked which meant stripping and changing him at 5:30.

As for me in addition to having mush for brains I am huge. As in my mw wouldn't look right at me while checking things last month and I got a scan to make sure there is only one. I see her again tomorrow so hopefully there will be an easy explanation for the hugeness.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Oh, Kristina, you've got a ways to go yet! Here's hoping it's just an early growth spurt...?

Not much to say, just that I updated the pic of Rowan linked in my sig so you can see her new hairdo. No more mullet!


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

i finally have a picture of my hugeness (33 weeks 5 days..not a great picture but the camera was dying)







and some recent ones of ngaio and elwynn..

i decided to go all out and make her a fancy butterfly birthday cake (organic cake) with coloured icing (not organic at all) and candies and everything. it was a big hit







:especially the jelly beans.

the link is www.picturetrail.com/babyngaio in the album "belly bean"


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *s_kristina* 
I swear my brain has turned totally to mush.

mine too when it comes to memory!!!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Fern, you look beautiful! Of course, that's kind of how I always think of you anyway.







I'm so happy you shared pictures with us.

Kristina, I hope everything checks out OK.

Gunter - awww, thank you.







: That's so sweet.

OK y'all. I have this good friend from high school who is a professional artist, and he agreed to do a gesture sketch of a picture of me & Brynn nursing. I just got the finished product in the mail today, and I saw that he also posted it to his web gallery. I really love it, although in the photo it does look a tiny bit like I'm frowning (in real life it doesn't, so I guess it's a pixelation issue?). Anyhoo, if you want to see it, click here. It's the upper-left most image.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kristina, I'll point out here that you, Fern and Monique are all complaining about being huge this time and you're all pregnant with your thirds. Coincidence? I don't think so.
Happy birthday to Woody!

Gunter, I know what you mean about hyenacart being big and scary and maybe not hugely userfriendly. Have you posted down in WAHM for advice?


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Amy, the picture is beautiful! But I gotta say, it... uh... stands out a little bit thematically from the rest of his portfolio!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HoneyTree* 
Amy, the picture is beautiful! But I gotta say, it... uh... stands out a little bit thematically from the rest of his portfolio!

















Yeah, a little! Well I'm portrayed as naked, so I guess it's somewhat close.


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Gunther, to answer your question, we're not night weaning, but I will say that with this new nursing pattern, I have started to say "no" sometimes. This seems to exacerbate rather than alleviate the issues; he'll wake to nurse, nurse for 15-20 minutes, doze off, wake again, nurse again, doze off, then if he wakes again, I--totally and utterly exhausted, muttering curses at the universe under my breath, already formulating my letter of resignation (feeling that there's no possible way I could wake up in ___hours to teach and care for 19 kids)--say to Woody, "No, no more nursing tonight." Then he begins to scream. Then he won't nurse. He'll just scream. Eventually he'll calm down, and then we'll begin the nursing pattern again. Dh can soothe him maybe one of the two or three times per night that this happens.

It's pretty awful. And I was about to say, but not as awful as I'm making it sound, but in the middle of the night, it is exactly that bad. I'm trying hard not to link it with my job--I love what I do, and it's a fabulous place for Woody to be--but (and who would have guessed this) I am finding that motherhood, at least the way that is right for me, takes over to some degree every single aspect of life, and that's pretty hard to compromise on or negotiate with.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Kristina, I'll point out here that you, Fern and Monique are all complaining about being huge this time and you're all pregnant with your thirds. Coincidence? I don't think so.

i'm so not complaining! i love being huge with child...


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

: i know, i know.. i just posted. i just wanted to say that i miss my nov.ddc.. i mean not you guys but the jan ddc that im in im just not that connected with and i was re-reading posts from like 39 weeks on with ngaio and man, we were a tight group. it totally made me cry reading some of the posts..i guess im having the day after birthday sillies.. but what an amazing time we all had. *sniff* so... thanks.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Teresa, please forgive me if this too much meddling, but have you tried sleeping in a physically different space from your DH and Woody? When I first started trying to get Rowan to not nurse every hour at night, I tried just saying no, and it was exactly as you describe with the hollering and making it worse, and having DH there to comfort her didn't seem to do much good. Then when I went back to work, I needed my brain a lot because my job was very intellectually intensive - I would have been useless enough to actually fire on less than 6 hours of sleep. So I told DH that he just had to deal with it, and I went to sleep on the couch. 3 or 4 nights later, Rowan wasn't crying at all. She'd still wake up, but she'd snuggle up to DH and go right back to sleep with no fuss. 6 months later I was able to go back to sleeping with her without her pitching a fit when I said "no" to boobies. To be honest, we only did it out of absolute necessity, but it sounds like you might be approaching that point too. (Although, IIRC, Amy tried doing something similar with Brynn and I don't think it did work - Amy please correct me if I'm wrong?)


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Awww, Fern!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Teresa, please forgive me if this too much meddling, but have you tried sleeping in a physically different space from your DH and Woody? When I first started trying to get Rowan to not nurse every hour at night, I tried just saying no, and it was exactly as you describe with the hollering and making it worse, and having DH there to comfort her didn't seem to do much good. Then when I went back to work, I needed my brain a lot because my job was very intellectually intensive - I would have been useless enough to actually fire on less than 6 hours of sleep. So I told DH that he just had to deal with it, and I went to sleep on the couch. 3 or 4 nights later, Rowan wasn't crying at all. She'd still wake up, but she'd snuggle up to DH and go right back to sleep with no fuss. 6 months later I was able to go back to sleeping with her without her pitching a fit when I said "no" to boobies. To be honest, we only did it out of absolute necessity, but it sounds like you might be approaching that point too. (Although, IIRC, Amy tried doing something similar with Brynn and I don't think it did work - Amy please correct me if I'm wrong?)

Both of my kids mostly night-weaned by themselves once they moved to their own bed and DH went in to comfort them if/when they woke up during the night. Ellie goes to bed at 7-8pm and doesn't nurse again till about 5-6am when she comes into our bed. It so cute, she gets up and knocks on her door until one of us come to get her - she's not tall enough to open the door by herself!









Speaking of weaning... Killy still hasn't quite weaned himself. But for the last month or so, he's only nursing every 4-5 days. So, I'll think he's weaned himself and get a little emotional about it, then he nurses the next morning. You know, I remember a discussion awhile back about "don't offer, don't refuse" and I think that must have wildly different effects on different kids. I haven't offered nursing to Killy in over 18 months! I'm not really offering to Ellie, either anymore, but she still nurses a ton. (My goal has been to get each child to at least two years of nursing, and then let them wean themselves. I'll admit, though, that I did finally put some limits on Killy's nursing frequency after he turned three.) I'm finding it easier to be patient with Ellie's nursing with only one child nursing regularly.

Amy, that's interesting that Brynn's not very affectionate physically. My guess would be that since she's still nursing a lot that's how she gets the physical contact/closeness/comfort she wants/needs. I know that since Killy cut down so much on his nursing, he's much more of a cuddlebug. When he gets upset (when he would have asked to nurse a year ago), he'll say, "Mommy! I need you to cuddle me!" and its just sooo cute.

Ellie has started this funny thing where when I ask her to do something, or not to do something, she'll say, "O-kaaaaaay!" in this really snotty voice. Its really funny, though! I try not to laugh, but its really hard!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Amy, I think the sketch of you and Brynn is beautiful!
And yes, my deafness does have something to do with the problem with my parents. I think more than anything, though, they just have a different idea of who I am, have an idea of who I am, instead of actually knowing me, or wanting to. And then when I don't fit their idea, or into their mold of a daughter, it pisses them off. I think that is it in a nutshell. And, as awful as it sounds, I don't think they actually care about me. Again, they care about the idea of their relationship with their daughter, but not me.
As for my deafness, I have handled it differently than they raised me to, sort of, so it has been a point of tension.

If you don't mind my asking, what is the source of your mom's issues? Do you even know?

Fern, you look Beautiful!!! Thank you for sharing the pictures. It made my day.

I forgot who asked, but we are still nursing at night, and the thought of nightweaning is daunting. I have been trying to get Finley to snuggle back to sleep, and if I"m awake and in bed, it works. But most of the time, if I"m asleep, for some reason, it doesn't really work, and he insists on nursing, and if I try to hold off, the screaming begins, and I just don't want to go there, want to go back to sleep, so I give in. Some nights, though, he doesn't nurse at all til morning, and others, it's frequent. For now, I'm just riding it out, hoping the non-nursing nights become more and more frequent until they become the norm.

Q of C, Ellie and Killie sound so adorable!

Oh, and Spughy, Rowan is beautiful and so cute!!! I love her hair, the little flip









Finley is so lovable these days...full of "I love you Mommy"'s and hugs and kisses. We had a lovely day today, including a trip to the Farmer's Market, which was delightful.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

I have been cleaning like a mad person today. It's like nesting in preparation for labor. I am so freaking antsy. In 30 minutes it will be the day before my wedding.
Jim met my dad's mom and aunt and uncle today. They all got along smashingly, it was so much better than I expected it to be. My kids were a little unruly but thankfully my grandmother had three boys so she knows what it's like. Everyone was totally enamored with the baby though, of course.








I wish I could go to sleep but I am totally amped. I guess I'll go clean some more.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

DiD, it's the day before your wedding here now. I'm sending you total love, and support. Everything is set now, and really, the big thing that matters is that you and Jim can celebrate your love and your life together and the child that you made (and the children yet to come) and it's all going to be blessed and wonderful. So don't sweat the small stuff.
Fern, I miss you too







. I'm still incredibly excited about being pregnant at the same time as you, though (to the extent that I even post in January sometimes), and whenever I see you post about your belly bean I do go and look to see what you've had to say. The bond with us isn't broken, y'know? As we move out of our new-mother role and find our feet a bit more, we just get spread more evenly throughout the boards.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

I love reading about all of the growing pregnant mamas! We're going to have some exciting new baby threads around here soon









I've heard the doubling of the two year height estimate, but also heard that it's at 18 months for girls. Either way, she'll probably outgrow my 5'2"- according to our nurse she's 37 3/4 inches tall. Neela was measured lying down, so I think it's a bit generous- but she is at least 37" tall. And 28 pounds- turning into a bit of a lanky toddler.

And hugs to the sleepless mamas. We seem to have successfully night-weaned this time. I talked with Neela about it during the day, when I was calmer and less desperate, and we bought new magical help her sleep without nursing pajamas. There was no more than very brief complaining, unlike other times when I tried to not nurse during the night and she would SCREAM! She's getting really good about asking for help to get back to sleep "sing a song/read a story/rock me" etc. And I LOVE our new bedtime routine- I didn't plan on stopping nursing to sleep, but it just kind of happened. Even a month ago I don't think it would have been possible without tantrums, so I'm a true believer in the "when they're ready" school of thinking.

Off to deal with some poop...


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## 3for3hb (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaFern* 
i know, i know.. i just posted. i just wanted to say that i miss my nov.ddc.. i mean not you guys but the jan ddc that im in im just not that connected with and i was re-reading posts from like 39 weeks on with ngaio and man, we were a tight group. it totally made me cry reading some of the posts..i guess im having the day after birthday sillies.. but what an amazing time we all had. *sniff* so... thanks.

I feel exactly the same way, Fern!!!! You look so belly-liscious! I love it.

And *I* **am** complaining about how I feel... I just popped an old stetchmark further and now it's red. What's it going to be like in four months??? Open? Ouch!

HoneyTree - Willem was like that. And it was so bad because I was pregnant too. He was totally inconsolable. After a while Dh would get so pissed about it and just would not understand.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kaspirant* 
Jacob weighs 32 lbs *tears...means I can't keep him rearfacing ANY longer* and is 36 inches tall.

I could definately be wrong but I *think* a Britax can rearface longer.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barcelona* 
And yes, my deafness does have something to do with the problem with my parents. I think more than anything, though, they just have a different idea of who I am, have an idea of who I am, instead of actually knowing me, or wanting to. And then when I don't fit their idea, or into their mold of a daughter, it pisses them off. I think that is it in a nutshell. *And, as awful as it sounds, I don't think they actually care about me.* Again, they care about the idea of their relationship with their daughter, but not me.

I don't really know what to say other than I have been in "that" space before, and I'd like to send you a cyber









Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
I have been cleaning like a mad person today. It's like nesting in preparation for labor. I am so freaking antsy. In 30 minutes it will be the day before my wedding.

Eeeeeek - you're getting married tomorrow!!!! I hope the day is everything you have wished for!


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Carseats yuck! We turned Joseph around a month or so ago because he was too tall to be rf in the Scenera although it goes to 35lbs rf. He is also around 33lbs which is the limit for rf in the Britax seats so that wouldn't be a big help for him. On the other hand he will be too tall for the Scenera ff soon too which means a new seat altogether. Plan currently is a new seat for him and new guy in the Scenera. Annoying that even though the Scenera has very high slots for a 40 lb seat he is still almost too tall for it at 2 years old. I'm just glad we knew that would happen when we bought it or it would be far more upsetting.

I had my mw checkup today and I'm not measuring so far ahead now which was nice to hear. I hadn't worried about how big I was before she started me worrying at the last visit! I'm going to go with the early growth spurt and just being pg with #3 thing. Sounds good to me. I'm not overly concerned about a big baby either. One of the nice things about being on #3. Other then nasty high bp that was likely due to a headache from the weather things are looking good.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Susannah M* 
I could definately be wrong but I *think* a Britax can rearface longer.

We have a Britax and the RF limit is 33 lbs, fully clothed. Which he now is







(

But they are longer than most so that's good.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Btw, a forward facing 5-pt harness seat that will last a long time with BIG kids is the Costco Apex 65. Kids can stay in the harness till they hit 65 lbs and some ridiculously tall height. Then it converts to a booster. Killy's been in it since he outgrew his rear-facing seat at about two years. He's over 40 inches and still has tons of room in the harness. Its hard to find in stores, but the Target website has it and some BRU stores carry them. Whenever Ellie outgrows her convertible seat we'll get her one, too. I do have her forward facing already, though - due to her terrible carsickness. She's thrown up twice in the last two weeks! UGH!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Rowan's FF in our Britax now because her legs are really long and she was quite uncomfortable RF. Also, when we went to Europe, all the seats we had there were FF and she got used to it








I would have liked to keep her RF longer but it would have been a major struggle. Fortunately we don't use the car daily so I don't feel quite so bad about it.

I just got my hair cut and all the colouring that was in it is now GONE! I am officially on the path to going grey gracefully. I feel very liberated.







The new 'do is very short, but I like it.

DiD - happy wedding day tomorrow! Stop fretting and enjoy it.







Yay married!!!

Mel - holy schmoly, Neela is a tall girl! I noticed that when you were here in the summer but it sounds like she's been springing up even more since then. Wow!

Happy birthday (late - sorry) to Ngaio!

Rowan had a little friend over this morning who kind of reminded me a bit of Ngaio. Her hair, mostly







and her "i'll do it MY way thanks" attitude. Lovely little girl, she and Rowan got along very well, mostly because they're both a little reticent and very non-agressive. It was nice. I think I like this age, where you can pick and choose their friends.







I'm sure THAT doesn't last. But fortunately - OH so fortunately! - all the mamas I'm friends with IRL have pretty awesome kids. Not a grabber or a pusher in the bunch. My closest mama friend has a little boy 6 wks younger than Rowan and they love each other. They even ask to phone each other. THAT is just a whole pile of cuteness.

Gotta go, laundry calling.

Oh, and I posted this in another thread but it was so cute I have to post it here - yesterday we were walking home from the dog park, very early because Rowan had an early nap, and I told her that because it was still so early, we could make popcorn when we got home. She said "Yay! Popcorn goes pop! Like a weasel. Only different." I couldn't help but laugh. I wonder what she thinks a weasel IS???


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## HoneyTree (Apr 5, 2005)

Thanks for the wise words and sympathy about the night nursing. It's Friday, so I have two days to be able to sleep in with him and catch up! Dh already has a single bed in "Woody's" room, so maybe we'll take turns sleeping in there until this frequent waking thing plays out.

Spughy, Horray for going grey! I'm probably 10 % grey here a month shy of 30. I am quite fond of it!

And your post about picking Rowan's friends was so timely for me. The parent who watches Woody and another teacher's 1 y.o. for two hours a day at school (while I teach writing and math) has offered to take on another teacher's 2 1/2 y.o. for the whole day. This other child has had problems at previous daycares with body boundaries--"bulldozing" other children, throwing them on the ground, and all around playing really rough. Woody is really mellow, and is totally NOT a boisterous or aggressive or physically-communicative kid, and he and the 1 y.o. girl get along really well on a very gentle level.

I'm trying to withhold most worrying until a problem arises, trying not to put negativity into the universe, and knowing that other children are and will be part of his world, but I'm a little sad that the gentle dynamic between Woody and the 1 y.o. is going to be challenged.

Is anyone else struggling with this? What do you do?


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

we spent the whole day at ikea which was pretty fun, surprisingly. it was great to have my mom along to play with ezra the whole time and hold her or push her or whatever. even though i have been to that particular ikea a bunch of times, i never noticed the little houses for kids to play in around the stores. they were great for ez!

got into a bit of a heavy talk with my mom on the ride back to richmond about growing up stuff. (basically, she was a horrible mom and my dad was worse, at times. she's asked me to forgive her and i have. we have a great relationship now which i NEVER thought would happen. i swore that if i ever did have kids, she woudl never see them.) anyway, it was hard to hear some of the stuff she said and it's hard for her to face a lot of it, too. but it was healthy and healing even though it was difficult to get through the conversation calmly. she loves ezra so much and is soooo good to her. it's so great for me to see my mom love on her (and me, and dh). i think ezra's love for my mom helps motivate her to be a healthier person.

rowan's hair is so cutie. your whole family is beautiful, btw. i have always thought that about you all! can we see a new picture of your new do, too? i have a friend going grey as she's barely 25. looks great on her though. she started when she was like 21.

hey fern- i saw you over int he burt's bee co-op. i am stoked to get some of their stuff but had to take it easy as both dh and i are currently unemployed. ngaio and her cake are soo cutie! ezra had one in the shape of a penguin (but i never posted pics of it; i need to do that). her hair looks way blonder then i remember but maybe i just haven't seen pics of her lately. i used to check up on your blog but hadn't seen any recent updates. ellwyn is as adorable as ever. you look great, too! you get to meet your babe in just a moth or two, how exciting! i have to wait until the end of feb but am growing steadily after months of no weight gain and lots of throwing up. it feels good to be getting bigger...until i catch my breath going upstairs! ps i don't feel nearly as connected with my feb ddc as i did/do with this nov ddc! it's weird, eh? it's really nice that helen and strawberry fields are there with me! there are some other moms of nov 05 babes but they don't post in this thread.

amy- can i get a copy of that? is that weird that i want one? sooooo beautiful!!!

helen- i did post asking for advice on etsy shops in wahm. i got so stoked talking about it this weekend. my mom is super crafty and has been selling her stuff locally in virginia for years. it's so encouraging being around her and knowing she has done it and i can do it. she's not doing as much as she wants to right now though and that makes me sad for her.

oh, teresa, i totally remember ez just screaming when i tried to say, "can you wait a minute. we're not nursing right now" or whatever i said. it was hard, for sure. i really hope things improve for you both, as plain as that sounds. ITA about how it affects the rest of life and directly affects work when you don't get sleep. it was hard for me to not resent nursing when it was hard like that and i was tired and so sore in the nips. i can barely believe she's not nursing anymore. it doesn't seem real. she does say that she'll nurse, again after buxton is born!

barcelona- sorry about your parent stuff. i don't have a relationship with my dad at all these days so i certainly don't think he cares much about me. i felt that way about my mom my whole life pretty much (that she didn't know me or care about me) and that F N sucked!







this for you and lots of healing vibes sent your way. so jealous imagining all the goodies still available at your farmer's markets out there! we have soem still going on just are limited. did you ask about pming me about diet? you are sooo welcome to do that. i don't have an ideal diet or think mine is the "right" way or anything though.

neela sounds more like ezra's body type than the other babes but ez is still a bit smaller at 28.5 inches and 21 pounds. lanky babe, here, too though!

DID- perhaps you are married now! wooo hoo!!!









kristina- mind if i ask how far ahead you are measuring? i was measuring 2 weeks small last month and now i am measuring 3 weeks ahead! two different people measured me though so it could be a little off b/c of that.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I started a new thread...


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