# Can't find a place to live cos we're CO-SLEEPERS?



## VeezieTG (Nov 10, 2006)

ok. so this is so weird. my bf, and our 2 sons, live in a beautiful 3br, 2.5 ba townhouse with a fenced in yard and a big front room that we use as a play room. we're renters. so recently we decided to sell everything we own and move from here (fl) to california. we also decided that since we all sleep together, and the kids play with us in the kitchen and living room and never in the playroom, we would just get a 1 br, 1ba, and live all cozy and close (AND CHEAP!!) til we were ready to move to the other side of the country. well, we started looking at places and found that no one will rent to us!! i've been told its a code violation to have 4 heartbeats in 1 br. i've been told that they didn't want "child services" around. and i've been told "just don't tell me about the kids living here, i'll pretend i don't know." i've tried looking up some code violation for having 4 people living in a 1 br, but it seems like there's not really one. i mean, not one that says that 2 of those people can be kids. and what's more frustrating is people that say they're "ok" with us having 2 kids if we want to but then not showing us the place and just saying, "oh its way too small. you'd never get 4 people in there." its so frustrating!! even my bf has gotten to the point where he's just started looking for 2 brs. but i'm mad! why should i have to pay extra rent. i'm not going to use that other br! anyone have any trouble as a renter and a co-sleeper?


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## XanaduMama (May 19, 2006)

Yeah, I think that's totally bogus. Personally, I would try to avoid the issue altogether: maybe you could check out the place individually (ie, without kids) and then get a sitter when you sign the lease? Check out your rights as a tenant, too--I'm sure CA has plenty.


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## southernmommie (Jan 7, 2007)

It's not bogus. It is a code violation here in Cali. It is a big deal here. There can only be so many people per bedroom per square footage. So if it's a big bedroom, then maybe 2 or 3. If it's a tiny bedroom then maybe only 1. You're best bet is to go on Craigslist and rent from an individual and not an apartment that has to go through agents.


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## southernmommie (Jan 7, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *XanaduMama* 
Yeah, I think that's totally bogus. Personally, I would try to avoid the issue altogether: maybe you could check out the place individually (ie, without kids) and then get a sitter when you sign the lease? Check out your rights as a tenant, too--I'm sure CA has plenty.

I'm glad you think that the state building codes are bogus. She's not being denied because they co-sleep. She's being told that by the state they cannot let a certain number of people live per square footage. This kind of advice given without knowledge of the advice given is not wise.


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## _betsy_ (Jun 29, 2004)

It varies from town to town, too, I think, some are more strict than state laws.

It's to prevent 20 guys from sharing a 2 bedroom and 5 families living a 3 bedroom and stuff like that. Most have codes about how many un-related people can live in a certain amount of space as well, to help prevent overcrowded boarding room style living.


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## Leilamus (Jun 12, 2006)

It's a safety/liability issue for the landlord. We live in Maine and the last place we lived in had very strict wording that there be only 4 occupants in our two bedroom apt (all of the apts were 2 bdr in the building) and the children had to be under 18. Part of that (the age piece) was our landlord's personal issues with how she wanted to have all of her buildings appear but the number of people per apartment was a legal/fire risk issue, I asked.

That said you can totally get a two bedroom and then cosleep I believe. I don't think the landlord can say who can sleep in what bedrooms when but they can say how many of you can safely live in the size of the apartment they offer.


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

If they rent to you in violation of state/municipal codes, they're risking having you break the lease with no notice and not being able to do a thing about it because of the code violations.


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## riverside knitter (Jun 26, 2007)

A common methodology in local codes for determining the number of people allowed in a particular unit is 2 times the number of bedrooms plus 1. So, 3 people are generally allowed in a 1 BR unit and 5 for a 2 BR unit. It varies by jurisdiction, but this is the most common that I've seen.


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## tjjazzy (Jan 18, 2007)

i've heard that you can't have children of the opposite sex in the same room after a certain age. that's here though. i don't know what the rules are there but that could be part of the reason they told you that.


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

I do know that around here a child under 18 months doesn't count as a "person" when figuring how many people are allowed. We went through this when I found out I was having my twins. At the time we were living in a one-bedroom apartment.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I believe in CO it was 2 people per room with an infant under 12 months (or maybe it was 18) not counting. When we had 3 kids we were able to rent a two bedroom apartment but it was when the youngest was under a year. We stayed there over a year and the landlord talked to us about it but said she would let us stay in the two bedroom or we could switch to a 3 bedroom, our choice. She only cared about keeping the apartment rented, really. We stayed in the 2 bedroom and continued to co-sleep. My two kids that shared a room at that time were a girl and boy, but I had heard about same genders not being "allowed" to share a room after a certain age. That's odd to me. We ended up moving to another apartment complex and rented a bigger 3 bedroom before #4 came (he co-slept as well).


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## Satori (Jan 30, 2003)

yep, its true, law says you can only have X number of people per sq ft or bedroom. I believe its 3 people per bedroom becasue I know I can rent a 1 bedroom for myself 8 & 2 yr old. Would I? NO FRIGGIN WAY!!!!! We were in a 570 sq ft 1 bedroom apt on the upper level with no play place for 4 years and it was hell. Rent was only $375 is why we stayed but OMG, unless its that or homeless, no way will we go back to 1 bedroom. Right now we have a 2 bedroom and its ok but I'd love to have a 3 bedroom just so 2 yr old can have a room for her stuff becasue it causes a lot of battles between her and the 8 yr old sharing a room space for toys. Anyway, it may sound cozy but from someone who's actually done it? Don't.Do.It


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## MommaFox (Jul 21, 2008)

We've got 2 bedrooms and there are 4 of us. We feel a little crowded because we've got so. much. junk. I co-sleep with the lo. I understand it's frustrating not being able to find a place that'll take a family of 4 into a one-bedroom apt. But I used to live (3 in a one bedrom, when #1 son was born) next to a house that had no less than 23 people staying there. I'm not sure How many bedrooms the place had, but it was always crowded. The policies are in place to prevent situations like this, to keep up with fire code, for safety and I'm sure there's some lawsuit stuff involved too.


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## VeezieTG (Nov 10, 2006)

thanks for all the input.

yeah, i kinda knew it was some sort of fire code/building code thing, and i know why its in place. i've seen those places too, with the like 15 ppl in a 2 br. BUT i still feel exception could be made for us, given that our kids are so small and we all sleep in 1 bed. maybe the code wording should be changed or something. maybe its just me that thinks that. but you know, if we get a 2br its like $200 more a month, at minimum, and the whole point is to save money for our big move, not spend money on a whole other br that we will not use. we've been selling all of our stuff so we're down to like bare minimum stuff as it is. and we're short-termers. we only need a place, tops a year... ugh! just frustrated... and yeah, i think to some extent some people hear "we sleep in the same bed" and not knowing or caring about the codes really themselves go "wait, you can't do that"...

we wish we could get out looking by ourselves, sans kids, but it just isn't possible. i guess we'll just have to keep on truckin and find that one guy with his one br that says, "ok, eff it... here's your key."









thanks for the info and advice everyone!


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## tbone_kneegrabber (Oct 16, 2007)

Well I am part of a non-profit landtrust housing group (the non-profit ones 7 properties and we collectively run them etc) and these are HUGE victorian house, we are are taking 6-8 bedrooms! And most (with the exception of one I think) are zoned Single-Family which means no more than 5 unrelatd adults living there. So that's not even several people per-bedroom.

(however, if you are "related" to each other it changes things)

Just sharing


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## IloveAllMyBabies (Nov 1, 2008)

when i was 8 months pregnant me and hubby were going to move to a nicer 1 bedroom apt and we were told by the complex that we had to rent a 2 bedroom cause i was going to have a baby and the baby couldnt share a room with us

i laughed and said soo u expect me to put my new born baby in another room by his self when he will wake up every 2hrs to eat and she said yes

i walked out and went somewhere else

the sec place i went too we ended renting a 1bedroom with office the lady told me that i can not use the office as a 2nd bedroom and if i did that then i would be asked to either leave or rent a 2 bedroom and i said noo problem i wont be doing that anyways lol we lived there for 2 yrs

right now we live in a 3 bedroom condo that we own and we only use 1 bedroom one room is storage the other is the play room which my 2yr doesnt play in and we all sleep in master bed room

i say go without ur kids to rent an apt that way u can just say it us for u they dont ever go by checking up on who acually lives there lol and if they do come by to fix something u can just say the kids r visiting if they ask noo big deal


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## amlikam (Nov 19, 2008)

Best to keep it honest... I'd hate to see you get up in legal issues later on because you misrepresented yourself.
IMO... anyhow.

Good luck!


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## funkymamajoy (May 25, 2008)

I did property management in CA and AZ for a long time.

The standard occupancy rules are 2 people per bedroom plus 1, so a max of 3 people in a 1-bedroom apartment. The management and property owners have to apply this rule to everyone; roommates and families, no matter how old everyone is.

Now, its not the management's business where anyone sleeps. They can't require that the kids sleep in another room.


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## Sheal (Apr 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tjjazzy* 
i've heard that you can't have children of the opposite sex in the same room after a certain age. that's here though. i don't know what the rules are there but that could be part of the reason they told you that.

Untrue. I've had several social workers tell me it is an "unofficial" non state legislated (or provincial in Canada) rule at the age of 12 and up. I asked specifically after this. Officially there is no law against it state or province wise. In Canada, there isn't even city level laws either.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amlikam* 
Best to keep it honest... I'd hate to see you get up in legal issues later on because you misrepresented yourself.
IMO... anyhow.

Good luck!

yup, that's what I was thinking. I would not lie about how many kids you have just to get into less bedrooms. When they find out they could very well kick you out for breaking your lease. Can you imagine if your search now included a past eviction on your rental history?

good luck finding either a 2 bedroom you can afford or a landlord that breaks the rules (though, this would make me wonder what else is going on). Definitely list your children's name and ages on any applications.


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## abharrington (Jun 30, 2007)

so how does all of this apply to owning a home? are you forced to sell after having a certain number of children?


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## funkymamajoy (May 25, 2008)

As far as I know, it only applies to rentals, not to home ownership. Although I'm sure some HOA has or will try to implement some occupancy standards.


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## bri276 (Mar 24, 2005)

the type of landlord who is more likely to say "f it" about this type of thing is the same one likely to say "f it" about a lot of things you don't want him to...like lead testing, fixing the gas leak (thank you slum lord), etc. I'd really give up on this one and make a new plan.


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## milkybean (Mar 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bri276* 
the type of landlord who is more likely to say "f it" about this type of thing is the same one likely to say "f it" about a lot of things you don't want him to...like lead testing, fixing the gas leak (thank you slum lord), etc. I'd really give up on this one and make a new plan.

I agree.


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## Ruthie's momma (May 2, 2008)

I can understand your frustration. During my pregnancy, we moved from our 2 bdrm rented home to a larger 1 bdrm rented apartment. The apartment manager tried to prevent us from renting a 1 bdrm, both at move-in and renewal. Afterall, I was pregnant at move-in and had a 6 mo at renewal...we _needed_ two bdrms!


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## urchin_grey (Sep 26, 2006)

I was just complaining about this the other day. No one would rent a 1br to me (and its just DS and me!) because I'm not "allowed" to have a child over the age of 1 in my bedroom.







:

PUH-thetic.


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