# WWYD - Mom letting baby CIO in store?



## Seie (Jun 9, 2005)

The other day I went shopping for groceries and there was a woman in the shop with an infant in a stroller. There was a name and age "licence-plate" on the stroller that said the child was born in january 09 - so an infant.
And the little girl was screaming in a horrible "come help me mommy I neeed you NOW" way. The mother continued walking around the shop, casually picking (baby)stuff up and looking at it while pushing the stroller back and forth - seemingly to calm the unhappy baby. I couldnt leave - I just had to see her pick up that crying baby. Part of me wanted to walk right over there and tell her something along the lines of "arent you going to pick up your baby, she is really unhappy". Another part felt like - well its not like she is yelling or hitting or anything, so its really not my business.
Anyway I couldnt leave until I had seen her pick up the baby - which she did after probably 5 minutes (of baby screaming bloody murder)

WWYD? What would be appropriate to do? Could one in a non-confrontational, non-judgemental way tell her that babies crying like that need comfort?

Or am I being way too AP here - meaning was it really that horrible- she looked like a perfectly normal, well dressed new mom - and she did eventually pick her crying baby up - just not as fast as I would have done. Is it even appropriate to say anything at all?


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

I would have felt the same way you do but I doubt I would have said anything.







I "might" would have commented that "_ohhh someone wants to be picked up_" or something to that effect but I don't know. It would depend on the situation, what type of mom the mom looked like, stuff like that.







If the baby was born in January it would be on my BODY, not in a cart or stroller but that's JMHO. I'm extremely AP in that respect. I don't plan on going out of the house without my baby on my body anywhere I go when it's that young.

It always bothers me when I'm out and hear a baby or child crying or being neglected or treated badly. Makes me wonder what it's like at home if it's that bad in public.


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## OkiMom (Nov 21, 2007)

She might have been overwhelmed. DD1 cried ALOT when she was that age (so did DD2 bue less so) and there are times that I really didn't want to pick them up. I needed 2-3 mintues without holding a screaming baby. Maybe she needed a break too, it doesn't mean shes a bad mom.
If anything I might have said, "Cute baby, that age is trying at times isn't it?" If she wanted to comment she would, if not at least she knows someone understands.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I probably wouldn't have said anythimg, but if you wanted to you could suggest a baby carrier.

start off with one of the op's suggestion, saying to the baby "looks like somebody wants to be picked up!" then to the mommy "what a gorgeous little one you have there! I remember when mine was that age, my baby carrier was indespensible! Two free hands and a happy baby - have you tried one with your little one yet?"


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## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Baby could have been colicky/high needs.
My DD cried constantly for about the first 8 - 10 months of her life.

That being said, we'd usually carry her/wear her while screaming (and doing all the things you have to do to carry on with life - you know, work, shop, etc.), and just make the best of it.

But we still got looks & comments from "well-meaning" strangers. When you're carrying a screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants down/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the sling)". When you're not carrying the screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants picked up/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the baby bucket)".

If you feel like saying something, just please say it from a place of kindness & helpfulness, not a place of judgement.

The best comments I'd get were those where someone actually asked if I could use a hand - and then GAVE a hand (like carrying my groceries to the car, or trying to talk to my screaming baby instead of shooting me looks). THOSE folks were helpful, and I was grateful to them.


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## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

I don't think you're being way too AP, and that bothers me too, but IME people don't appreciate input, even if it's from a friend/family, let alone a stranger. I would let it go and say a private prayer for that baby.









I'm a non-confrontational person by nature, but in that situation I don't think any advice, no matter how clever, gracious, or well-meaning would have any long-term effect.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

It bothers me too when I hear a baby cry, but I try to give the parent the benefit of the doubt unless it is just some type of extreme circumstance.

You said she did appear to be trying to calm the baby by pushing the stroller back and forth so I wouldn't consider this CIO exactly. I remember when my daughter was tiny I thought that was a good way to try and soothe her when we were out. That was before I realized that some babies actually hate strollers and I wasn't confident enough to wear her when we were out yet and was still not comfortable NIP. I don't recall ever her letting her scream bloody murder for 5 minutes like you said this mother did, but it is all kind of a blur now so who knows.

As far as the pp wondering what goes on at home when they see a child "being neglected or treated badly" like that, well in my case things were so much better at home. She rarely cried at home and if she did put her in her sling or nursed her. But going out in public was really challenging for me for the first few months. I think I was a good mom though overall.

Anyway, if anyone had come up to me and said "arent you going to pick up your baby, she is really unhappy" they better have been prepared to deal with me crying too. That is a really judgmental and harsh thing to say to someone you know absolutely nothing about. Even saying "ohhhh someone wants to be picked up" is really shaming too IMO because it implies mom is doing something wrong. I think OkiMom's suggestion is great, "Cute baby, that age is trying at times isn't it?," or something along those lines because it opens up a dialog without criticizing or shaming.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Total agreement with K's mama.

Also, IMO the difference between an OK mama and a great one is mostly confidence to follow their instincts and their baby. Your criticism could do some serious damage. Try a smile and some eye contact- with the mother, not the kid.


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## nznavo (Aug 9, 2004)

What K's Mama and Riverscout said.

My baby was screaming in her carseat today when we got home. I pulled up into the carpark, went around to her, opened her door and sang to her while I was looking for my keys in my overfull bag. I had made the decision to let her cry while I found my keys, instead of picking her up and comforting her, then having to put her down in order to find my keys which would have started her off again anyway. I was searching for about 1 minute and got two comments from two people, one about my "poor baby being scared" because she was alone in a carseat (carseats aren't so common here, and I was less than 1 metre from her) and another about my "poor hungry baby needing to be fed". Honestly, it just pissed me off and frazzled me and was no help to my crying baby.


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## gbailey (Mar 10, 2009)

Everyone does things differently and if a stranger said something to me about my parenting style, I think I'd have something very unpolite to say. We never know why a person is doing what they are doing.


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## nznavo (Aug 9, 2004)

I didn't ever appreciate gentle suggestions to let my kids CIO, or that they were nursing too often or until my son was too old. I don't appreciate comments now about our nighttime parenting. I don't see why someone who has made her own parenting choices would appreciate the suggestions or gentle advice of a stranger to do things differently.

I am all for parenting by instinct and doing what feels right. Different things feel right to different people.


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## ginadc (Jun 13, 2006)

DS cried constantly (or at least it felt like he did) during his first 3 months, whenever he was not physically on me (and usually nursing). I literally had him on top of me almost 24-7. It was utterly exhausting. He also wasn't much for the sling--DD had loved it, but I can count on one hand the number of times I got DS to relax in one, and we tried a bunch of different styles.

I remember one day in particular, a warm day in early May, so he would've been about 2 months old. None of my clothes fit--maternity was too big, old clothes were too tight--and I was desperate for one new pair of jeans that I would have been comfortable in. I took DS in the stroller to town (about 3 blocks away--we live near a little villagey town center). He had nodded off, but the second we got within a few feet of the door to the Gap, he woke up and started crying. (This was after a full morning of nonstop nursing and cuddling.) I was just at my wits' end. I walked back and forth on the block, trying to get him to go back to sleep. He kept crying. Finally I gave up and went home.

I'm sure if you'd seen me at that point you would have been appalled at the horrible way I was letting my son CIO. But that would have been a terribly incorrect assumption. And honestly, if someone at that point had said to me "Sounds like someone wants to be picked up" I would have probably taken their head off. I was exhausted, just recovered from a C-section, and had DS on me virtually 24-7. The last thing I would have needed was someone trying to suggest that I didn't know how to take care of my baby.


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## Southern_Belle (Jan 31, 2008)

I think it is impolite to suggest your own parenting style on someone else. Just as you see someone as not being AP enough, they may view you as too AP. Bottom line, to each his/her own. Your views and your lifestyle dictate your parenting style. Not to mention no one likes to hear advice from a stranger that knows absolutely nothing about them.


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## carfreemama (Jun 13, 2007)

I would have appreciated LOTS more tips on babywearing! I would see mommas wearing their apparently contented babies and wonder "how do they do that?" I thought I was SO informed about everything, but dd hated the soft carrier I had. I didn't know there could be a learning curve with carriers, as there can be with breastfeeding. Breastfeeding was SO smooth for us. I just didn't know that if one carrier, or just a few attempts, or whatever, didn't work, that didn't mean babywearing wouldn't work in general. Oh, how I wish someone had offered that advice! Dd had colic (I guess. She cried 24/7 for 3 months and then just stopped, literally, in the doctor's office one day).

I remember every.single.comment I got from people about my crying baby. They really were obviously not trying to help, though, at least as far as I could tell. But I was SO self-conscious all the time because the constant crying was NOT what I had envisioned with new motherhood. It's true what a pp said. Sometimes I just really needed not to have a crying baby in my arms for 2-3 minutes, no matter how distressing it might have been for dd or other observers. The ONLY comments that didn't make it worse were along the lines of, "my baby cried like that too and IT DOES END; or as another pp said, someone who offered concrete help in some way and said NOTHING about the crying.

With the next baby, though, I'm trackin' the baby wearers down for advice!!


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## CarrieMF (Mar 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gbailey* 
Everyone does things differently and if a stranger said something to me about my parenting style, I think I'd have something very unpolite to say. We never know why a person is doing what they are doing.

I agree. My youngest was a screamer. Picking her up would NOT have consolled her or made her stop crying.

Someone making a comment, no matter how well intended would have resulted in a berating for that person.

You have no clue, especially watching for a whole 5minutes, why that baby was crying, what the mom/caregiver had tried, what worked/didn't work for that baby, etc.


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## LilacMama (Aug 18, 2008)

"Looks like someone wants to be picked up" would seriously piss me off if I was that mom. I understood why that scene bothered you but its good you didn't say anything.

The ONLY possibly okay thing to say is, like someone else suggested "What a cute baby. That can be such a tiring age." If the mom has any desire to talk, then she will, but otherwise leave her alone.


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## soccermama (Jul 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I probably wouldn't have said anythimg, but if you wanted to you could suggest a baby carrier.

start off with one of the op's suggestion, saying to the baby "looks like somebody wants to be picked up!" then to the mommy "what a gorgeous little one you have there! I remember when mine was that age, my baby carrier was indespensible! Two free hands and a happy baby - have you tried one with your little one yet?"

I think that's a great idea!


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## Biscuits & Gravy (Jul 17, 2008)

As awful as it is to watch, there is no way I'd say anything. As others have said, I'd be ticked if a stranger made comments about my parenting. You just have to let it go.


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## Ceili (Nov 21, 2001)

I really try to not judge strangers in these situations. If I was looking to initiate contact, I'd go with a sypathetic smile and say something like "that age can be hard, huh?"


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

after reading some of the replies in this thread I think helping would be a great idea. I still think wiggling in a suggestion for a baby carrier might help, as it may work for her child. maybe he child cries no matter what, but its also possible her baby might not cry if being held, but the mama had a ton to do and just couldnt hold her baby constantly.

also, with babies who cry regardless of being held or not, I still try to hold them as much as I can as I feel crying in arms is better for baby then crying unattended. (not to say that a parent shouldn't take a break with babies like these - they should - I just don't look at it like "well my baby is going to cry no matter what I do so why bother - and I dont think anyone here thinks that way either) I wouldn't get into that with the shopper though, just try to find a way to help while there, and also a way to recommend an affordable baby carrier if she is interested. a lot of people see my baby carrier and say "thats so smart! they didnt have that when I was raising kids" or "where did you get that? ive never seen anything like that before!" some people just dont know about baby carrier, and would love to have one if they did.

i get parenting comments all the time... people call my daughter shy, which I hate because I don't want her to hear that, and im still working on a good approach for HER sake, not mine or theirs. I've also had people ask me in a RUDE way if my son was comfortable in his baby carrier. He's smiling or sleeping when they say this, and I wish to say "obviously!" but I just say "yes, very" and leave it at that. I could get pissed or annoyed, but I choose not to. and I also realize, I could just be misinterpreting their tone or intentions. and sometimes I wish to say "are you freaking serious" as they will ask me this after I just saw them smack their childs hand or yank them up by their arm... you are worried about is MY child is comfortable?! so yeah, I can see why some people get upset by others offering unwanted advice.


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## RunAround (Feb 12, 2009)

Seeing someone for 10 minutes in a store is not an accurate assessment of their child's temperament, the mom's parenting style, or even an indication of how AP/mainstream they are. There may have been 50 reasons why she didn't drop everything to pick her child up as fast as another mom might have.

Truly, these threads bug my socks off. (Not so good with analogies today...







) I mean, do people REALLY think that saying something about a carrier to a stranger is going to change the course of their parenting? Living by example - wearing your baby in a carrier and answering questions when asked - is more powerful. I know how many of us appreciate being told by "well meaning" friends and family to put the baby down so they can learn to soothe themselves.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

it may not change the course of their parenting, but if you arent wearing a baby carrier at the time and you have older children telling them about something they never heard of that was a life saver for you may make them look into it and realize it would be for them too. I dont see how that is a bad thing when approached kindly. i mean if I was outside cutting ym grass with scissors it mught be because i want to, but it also might be because I never heard of a lawnmower. on the chance of the latter, I wouldn't mind if someone said "hey you should try using a lawnmower, I love mine! they are on sale at home depot right now for 20 bucks!" or whatever.


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## cappuccinosmom (Dec 28, 2003)

As awful as that scene looked to you...

Maybe that baby was a cry-er, and mom was either used to it or didn't feel that picking her up sooner would be any help. My first son was a miserable wretch. I'm sure I looked like a terrible mom, because he cried *all* the time. I'm sure the neighbors wondered what was up-it was summer and we had the windows open and he screamed all.day.long.

Situation like you describe, I'd leave the mom well alone. You have no idea if she's a neglectful jerk or there's something else going on. And truthfully, she didn't cio. She did pick up the baby. Just didn't jump to it the same way you or I would.


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## Jennifer3141 (Mar 7, 2004)

I'd have given the mom a, "Been there, did that, got the soundtrack!" smile and pointed out the beautiful baby to my kids. But that's about it. Sometimes, that leads to more conversation, sometimes it doesn't. And I'd have mentally tossed some love off to the family on my way down the aisle.


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## choli (Jun 20, 2002)

I always assume that another parent will appreciate parenting advice from an outsider about as much as I do - which is not at all







: So I refrain from pushing my parenting ideas onto other people, and am happy when they do the same.


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## phrogger (Oct 16, 2006)

i had a screamer like that, and picking him up made it worse. He hated to be touched, only wanted to be fed and put down. If someone came to me about a sling or carrier I probably would rip her head off out of frustration since we tried jsut about everything and he just hated being touched (which is funny since at 9 now he wants to be on my lap all the time). I think the ONLY thing that I would have accepted would be a mom coming and saying "hang in there, they can't cry forever, when they are 18 they might stop". I might have started laughing or crying, but it is true, it WILL stop.

Now if she was yelling at her infant or being really rough, then I might say something, for the baby's sake, but other then that, especially after having a special needs kid myself now and getting TONS of dirty looks, I wouldn't say anything other then maybe words of support or an I'm sorry look.


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## HotJabanero (Aug 21, 2008)

For me personally I get out of the store *asap*. I get a very strong physical reaction near vomiting when I hear a baby crying that hysterically.

However I had a screamer and I pushed myself to the edge of a physical and mental breakdown during her first year because I couldn't ask for help and almost no one offered and I never put her down. I got a lot of CIO advise and bad looks....

I wish so badly there were resources for moms that have screamer babies when they need a break. I know some people have supportive families but most either don't or live too far away from good help. So heartbreaking.


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## pokeyrin (Apr 3, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Baby could have been colicky/high needs.
My DD cried constantly for about the first 8 - 10 months of her life.

That being said, we'd usually carry her/wear her while screaming (and doing all the things you have to do to carry on with life - you know, work, shop, etc.), and just make the best of it.

But we still got looks & comments from "well-meaning" strangers. When you're carrying a screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants down/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the sling)". When you're not carrying the screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants picked up/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the baby bucket)".

If you feel like saying something, just please say it from a place of kindness & helpfulness, not a place of judgement.

The best comments I'd get were those where someone actually asked if I could use a hand - and then GAVE a hand (like carrying my groceries to the car, or trying to talk to my screaming baby instead of shooting me looks). THOSE folks were helpful, and I was grateful to them.









It is soo hard to parent without judgment these days from both mainstream and AP sides.


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## Jennifer3141 (Mar 7, 2004)

I was thinking back to one time when my close AP friend and I were shopping together with our first babies in our slings a few years ago. We had BFing down pat, we had our gorgeous cloth diapers and wet bags with us. We were GOOD and we knew it.

We passed a mama with a screaming baby in her car seat in the cart and we both looked at each other and kind of smirked. Until we both stopped and looked at each other. So when we passed the mama in the next aisle, we smiled at her. And she burst into tears!!

It turns out that her mama had died that morning and she was just trying to hold it together through the grocery store to get healthy snacks for their emergency roadtrip when her son got home from school. My friend ended up holding the mama while she cried and I ended up trying to juggle three babies while we all wept in Meijer's.

The mama was disconnecting from her baby at the time so she'd just keep it together long enough to get through her public routine.








Of course my friend and I blew that plan all to hell but it was a sad and neat moment for mamas to come together. I always hoped those hugs helped her through what must have been a horrific day for her.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
also, with babies who cry regardless of being held or not, I still try to hold them as much as I can as I feel crying in arms is better for baby then crying unattended.

Unless, of course, you are fighting the horrible urge to shake or otherwise harm your baby. I sometimes felt like the most horrible monster ever have a baby, but there were times when the only way I would not harm my screaming baby was not to have him in my hands. There were times when it was probably lifesaving for DS that I would let him cry without trying to hold him because I really couldn't trust myself not to do something terrible to get him to stop crying.

You never know what the other parent's deal is. Maybe they just don't care, maybe they are doing what they think is best for the baby even if you disagree (that's true for a lot of CIO types -- they honestly believe its in the best interest of their child and there are lots of "experts" out there that preach that), maybe they are physically unable to pick up child or do something you think they should do, maybe what they are doing is the best possible answer given the circumstances...


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

which i addressed in another part of my post by saying a parent needs a break too - that would be one of the times a parent needs a break obviously!!!


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## Novella (Nov 8, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riverscout* 
You said she did appear to be trying to calm the baby by pushing the stroller back and forth so I wouldn't consider this CIO exactly.

Exactly! Making an (unsuccessful) attempt to soothe a baby is _not_ CIO.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riverscout* 
Anyway, if anyone had come up to me and said "arent you going to pick up your baby, she is really unhappy" they better have been prepared to deal with me crying too. That is a really judgmental and harsh thing to say to someone you know absolutely nothing about. Even saying "ohhhh someone wants to be picked up" is really shaming too IMO because it implies mom is doing something wrong.

I totally agree with posters who mentioned that suggesting the baby needs to be picked up or suggesting she should try a baby carrier comes off as hurtful, rude, and intrusive.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ceili* 
I really try to not judge strangers in these situations. If I was looking to initiate contact, I'd go with a sypathetic smile and say something like "that age can be hard, huh?"

If you must say something, this is the *only* way you can go. The mother is probably already embarrassed and on-edge that her little one is crying. She's probably just trying the best she can to get her things done and get out of the store, or get the baby through a characteristic fussy period before baby falls asleep and she can continue with her shopping errands.


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## ginadc (Jun 13, 2006)

Yes, but it's not "giving that parent a break" to say something like "Sounds like someone needs to be picked up" or, even with the best of intentions, advise them as to what you think they should do, such as use a sling. That's just interfering. You don't know what the mom/parent's situation is.

I really think the only "helpful" thing someone can do in a case like that is to smile in warm and genuine sympathy, as Jennifer described. At most, saying something like "It can be so rough when they're that young" or "Hang in there, this too shall pass" is supportive and can also open a door in case the mom in question really is feeling in need of a supportive and sympathetic ear.


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## One_Girl (Feb 8, 2008)

I wouldn't say anything. Maybe she just really needed a break so she put her baby in the stroller where she would be safe. She was pushing the stroller back and forth to try to calm the baby. Sometimes parents don't talk to their kids when they do this because they are at the end of their rope and they worry that they will snap if they are talking and it does nothing. I never realized how much normal babies actually fuss until I had a baby and I was sometimes very drained from the constant nursing and holding. I needed a few minutes sometimes to keep my sanity and a person coming in and judging me for that would have increased my already sky rocketing stress level and made things worse instead of better.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
which i addressed in another part of my post by saying a parent needs a break too - that would be one of the times a parent needs a break obviously!!!

Of course. Sorry--didn't mean that to be directed to you, just using your comment as a springboard for my mini-rant. Apologies. I really should just stay away from these threads. Probably especially when I'm mid-morning into a bad work day!


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

Jennifer, many blessings on your and your friend for genuinely opening your arms and hearts to that other mama, instead of looking down your nose at her or "feeling sorry" for her or "wanting to show her a better way"!

No matter what her parenting style is, at least you gave her a few moments of feeling LOVED and CHERISHED by other women, other mamas.

I think if someone is not open to loving and cherishing the mama, regardless of their kneejerk assumptions of her, then they have no hope of "helping" the child.


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## La Rune (Sep 19, 2008)

When DD was 3 weeks old, my husband had just gone back to work (meaning he was GONE, not coming home nights!), I was still healing from my c/s, she was incredibly high-needs, and we desperately needed groceries.

The only way I could do it was park next to a cart corral and swing her bucket seat into it. I could not carry her. She hated the seat. I was in pain and sleep-deprived.

She slept until I was maybe halfway through my list ... but when she woke up she was SCREAMING. I shushed, I rocked the cart, tried covering her with a blanket, tried uncovering her in case she was hot. I gave pacifiers and toys, I even gave a bottle I had pumped. She wanted none of it. She wanted me to hold her but I couldn't do it. I couldn't bend, or stretch, or reach without being in horrible pain.

Everyone was giving me dirty looks and finally one woman said "She doesn't want all that, she wants you!"

I broke down in tears in the middle of Wal-Mart and started screaming at her. I must have looked like a lunatic! I yelled "I CAN'T! I just had a c-section and I CAN'T hold her! I haven't slept in 3 weeks, she cries all the time, she won't latch right and she's always hungry, my boobs hurt (yes I yelled this in Wal-Mart








), my husband is gone and I CAN'T DO IT ALL!"

And then I just stood there crying with DD still screaming in the carseat.

In the end she apologized and helped me finish finding the stuff on my list. She shopped for me while I sat on the bench in the front of the store with DD, and loaded my groceries for me while we nursed in the car. She ended up being an angel, but that judgement, that was meant to help DD ... it hurt me so badly. I already felt like a failure as a mother and here were all these perfect strangers shaking their heads and saying "Tsk tsk, I can't believe she lets her baby cry! Just pick her up!" It devastated me and made me feel worse.

I say if you have to do something about the situation, smile and say something like "Being a mom is hard sometimes" or "Oh, that's a difficult stage". And then ask if there's anything you can do. It would have made such a difference if someone had just validated what I was going through and then actually offered to give me a hand. I felt so alone. If she's to the point where she's done and down and needs help, she'll probably accept it and remember you forever. If she's not, she'll just think you're a slightly weird but kindly stranger, and go about her day.


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## demottm (Nov 15, 2006)

I say leave the woman alone. She was pushing the stroller back and forth so she definately heard the baby, and then picked her up after 5 minutes. What did she do wrong? She didn't pick up the baby fast enough? Focus on yourself and what you could be doing better and leave that perfectly capable mother alone.


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## daytripper75 (Jul 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Baby could have been colicky/high needs.
My DD cried constantly for about the first 8 - 10 months of her life.

That being said, we'd usually carry her/wear her while screaming (and doing all the things you have to do to carry on with life - you know, work, shop, etc.), and just make the best of it.

But we still got looks & comments from "well-meaning" strangers. When you're carrying a screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants down/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the sling)". When you're not carrying the screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants picked up/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the baby bucket)".

If you feel like saying something, just please say it from a place of kindness & helpfulness, not a place of judgement.

The best comments I'd get were those where someone actually asked if I could use a hand - and then GAVE a hand (like carrying my groceries to the car, or trying to talk to my screaming baby instead of shooting me looks). THOSE folks were helpful, and I was grateful to them.


YES! That was us too. My first cried non-stop. Nothing worked. Too many people commented, not enough helped.


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## texmati (Oct 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Biscuits & Gravy* 
As awful as it is to watch, there is no way I'd say anything. As others have said, I'd be ticked if a stranger made comments about my parenting. You just have to let it go.


I agree. If the mummy was really in distress (I was in a plane with poor woman who literally started crying because her little one was crying) I would offer a hand, or some support. But other than that I'd really try and keep it to yourself.


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## Norasmomma (Feb 26, 2008)

MY SIL's 2nd DD was colicky and cried incessantly for nearly 6 months. I'm not saying that's what this was, but it does happen.

FWIW-the only thing that did calm her remotely was rocking her in a stroller.


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## Kappa (Oct 15, 2007)

I usually assume the baby has colic. If you go out, and your baby has colic and is hollering, I think you have just as much right to be out and about in public, with your hollering baby, as anyone, and not be judged. I think it's a stretch to call a 5 minute delay CIO, for whatever reason, I think of CIO means that the baby and parent are separated, and the parent is avoiding having to parent the child (either to sleep or otherwise). I would not see that in a mom and baby in public, with baby in stroller and mom shopping, even if the delay seemed long. It may not have seemed long to the mom at all, especially if the baby cries inconsolably for hours and hours.


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## tbone_kneegrabber (Oct 16, 2007)

Sometimes I let ds cry in his stroller (yes I babywear A LOT and ds is 31 lbs so that's a lot of baby) and sometimes I think he'll fall asleep soon and if I just keep the stroller moving enough he'll sleep and everyone will be happier.

And most of the time it works.

You don't know this woman, you don't know this baby, you don't know their realtionship or routine,

maybe the baby only ever falls asleep in the stroller
maybe the baby is colicky
maybe the mom is tried of holding the screaming baby
and maybe you should just mind your own business!


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## TinkerBelle (Jun 29, 2005)

I don't get where this is any of anyone else's business. I mean, really. Maybe this mom was "touched out", or maybe she doesn't care.

Bottom line, no one knows.

Unless she is leaving the child alone in the cart and walking off for a long period of time, or beating the child senseless, or some other form of obvious abuse, then IMHO, I would mind my own business.


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## Calee (May 10, 2008)

In the circmustance described, I would most definitely mind my own business, unless their was something I could actively do to help (like carry groceries or something)


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

im glad to read so many responses here, gives some great insight. It's good to know how most people would prefer to be helped (or left alone). I am the type who doesn't mind if someone says something. If I think they say something ignorant, which I often do, it gives me something to talk about with some close friends later, you know giggling about how my son must be SOOO uncomfortable sleeping in the baby carrier!


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## accountclosed2 (May 28, 2007)

My DD is high needs. And she hated the baby carriers, she loathed the cradle position, and couldn't stand having her body restricted in any way. And after about 4 weeks she would no longer fall asleep in my arms, or feed to sleep at all in the daytime. She was miserable. The push chair was our life saver. As long as we moved, she was MOSTLY calm in there, although it always took almost an hour to settle her to sleep, but sometimes she just screamed until she fell asleep. Picking her up then would often make it worse, although I found it really difficult not to (I felt like I was going crazy, I was a terrible mother, and I had a beautiful wrap sling I had been convinced I was going to wear my baby in all the time!). So I would try to keep my mind on other things, concentrate on shopping, for example, and just try to get through it.

And all the time I felt (quite unreasonable) like everyone was looking at me, accusing me of being a bad mum, wondering why I wasn't cuddling hat beautiful poor little girl in a sling! I wanted to scream that I couldn't, that I would have carried here everywhere if I could.

If someone had approached me and gently suggested a baby carrier, I would probably have burst into tears!


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Babies have different cries. What sounded like bloody murder to you could have been a milder cry for that baby. My #1 was a cryer - she sounded like she was being hurt in the worst way imaginable over nothing. But when she was REALLY angry she would get kind of choked up and it was actually quieter. Anyway, you don't know the baby so don't assume anything and don't worry about it. It isn't neglectful or abusive to try to calm a baby by rocking the stroller.


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## AliveMama (Mar 20, 2009)

I guess, I would think that there were 2 main possibilities.

1) She cares and is trying her "best". If that's the case then a friendly smile and maybe "How old? She's so cute" maybe followed by some commiserating on how hard it can be with little babies would help.

2) She doesn't care and is into things like CIO. At that point, nothing you say as a stranger is going to help. So I'd still offer a freindly smile and a comment about how cute her baby is.


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## Shelsi (Apr 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Baby could have been colicky/high needs.
My DD cried constantly for about the first 8 - 10 months of her life.

That being said, we'd usually carry her/wear her while screaming (and doing all the things you have to do to carry on with life - you know, work, shop, etc.), and just make the best of it.

But we still got looks & comments from "well-meaning" strangers. When you're carrying a screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants down/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the sling)". When you're not carrying the screaming baby, people say, "oh looks like someone wants picked up/is tired/is hungry/doesn't like that thing (the baby bucket)".

If you feel like saying something, just please say it from a place of kindness & helpfulness, not a place of judgement.

The best comments I'd get were those where someone actually asked if I could use a hand - and then GAVE a hand (like carrying my groceries to the car, or trying to talk to my screaming baby instead of shooting me looks). THOSE folks were helpful, and I was grateful to them.









:

I couldn't have said it better myself. I don't think anyone truly "gets it" unless you've had a child like that. When my dd was like that she was usually in the carrier and I got all sorts of remarks. The thing was she would just scream her head off for like 10 mins and then conk out for a short while. If I tried feeding her, changing her, holding her differently, etc, it just prolonged the whole process and wasn't what she wanted at all and upset her even more.


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## sewchris2642 (Feb 28, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AislinCarys* 
My DD is high needs. And she hated the baby carriers, she loathed the cradle position, and couldn't stand having her body restricted in any way. And after about 4 weeks she would no longer fall asleep in my arms, or feed to sleep at all in the daytime. She was miserable. The push chair was our life saver. As long as we moved, she was MOSTLY calm in there, although it always took almost an hour to settle her to sleep, but sometimes she just screamed until she fell asleep. Picking her up then would often make it worse, although I found it really difficult not to (I felt like I was going crazy, I was a terrible mother, and I had a beautiful wrap sling I had been convinced I was going to wear my baby in all the time!). So I would try to keep my mind on other things, concentrate on shopping, for example, and just try to get through it.

And all the time I felt (quite unreasonable) like everyone was looking at me, accusing me of being a bad mum, wondering why I wasn't cuddling hat beautiful poor little girl in a sling! I wanted to scream that I couldn't, that I would have carried here everywhere if I could.

If someone had approached me and gently suggested a baby carrier, I would probably have burst into tears!

Me, too. Except I'd would have been more apt to just give Erica to them. Let them deal with her for a day or 2.


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## EviesMom (Nov 30, 2004)

The baby might well have been colicky, or the mother was probably giving it five minutes to see if the baby would fall asleep. If the baby could see her, I don't really see how that is CIO. They're not abandoned in a crib to scream until they give up thinking that the parent will never return.


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## pauletoy (Aug 26, 2007)

For some reason, I get comments from people quite a bit when I am out. Especially, when I have all 4 with me. I absolutely hate it. I don't care how "helpful" people think they are being, I just wish they would mind their own business. These people don't know me, they don't know my kids, they don't know how I choose to parent, they don't know what goes on in our house.

DH and I have a saying:

Unsolicited advice is just plain meddling!


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## goodheartedmama (Feb 1, 2007)

I think it's just a situation where you need to mind your own business. I hate seeing crying babies not being comforted--I've seen it several times and it takes all I have to not scream for them to pick up their baby already. But what they're doing is legal, it's not how I parent my child and it's not how I want other people to parent their children, but when it comes down to it--it's really not for me to decide.


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## Boot (Jan 22, 2008)

I think there's a fundamental difference between a baby crying and a baby cio.


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## dubfam (Nov 4, 2005)

nak

I have not read the entire thread, but here is my opinion.

It sucks to listen to a baby cry and want to help them yet not be able to. I have suhc a hard time with that. I hate it when I see a baby crying in the store and th parent wont pick them up.

I also understand that the parent may be at the end of their rope...or maybe the baby screams themselves to sleep. I have a friend whose baby was that way, even though she is very much into AP. Maybe the lady was hoping the baby would go to sleep, then finally gave up and picked the babe up. I try to give the parent the benfit of the doubt. It is a struggle, though, and it is always tough to witness it. I can't STAND the sound of a crying baby, (I always wanna make it better!!) even my own.

I see stuff all the time that makes me cringe as an AP parent. It is hard because many parents are not into AP, and are harsh with their children.


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## Breeder (May 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jennifer3141* 
I was thinking back to one time when my close AP friend and I were shopping together with our first babies in our slings a few years ago. We had BFing down pat, we had our gorgeous cloth diapers and wet bags with us. We were GOOD and we knew it.

We passed a mama with a screaming baby in her car seat in the cart and we both looked at each other and kind of smirked. Until we both stopped and looked at each other. So when we passed the mama in the next aisle, we smiled at her. And she burst into tears!!

It turns out that her mama had died that morning and she was just trying to hold it together through the grocery store to get healthy snacks for their emergency roadtrip when her son got home from school. My friend ended up holding the mama while she cried and I ended up trying to juggle three babies while we all wept in Meijer's.

The mama was disconnecting from her baby at the time so she'd just keep it together long enough to get through her public routine.








Of course my friend and I blew that plan all to hell but it was a sad and neat moment for mamas to come together. I always hoped those hugs helped her through what must have been a horrific day for her.

That's amazing.


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## Breeder (May 28, 2006)

In response to the OP, it really, REALLY sucks to hear a baby cry and be unable to soothe it. It breaks my heart to hear an upset little one.

However, I would hate to be judged at one of my worst moments and for all we know this mama could have been at a very low point.


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## Emzachsmama (Apr 30, 2004)

I wouldn't say anything at all because really it's not any of my business IMO. I might have given the mom an 'I've been there' kind of smile but thats it.


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## krabigirl (Dec 10, 2006)

It's none of anyone's business, and the baby was not being abused. I would not say anything. If anyone had said something like that to me, while cluelessly trying to calm down my colicky DD, I think I would have gone off on them.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sewchris2642* 
Me, too. Except I'd would have been more apt to just give Erica to them. Let them deal with her for a day or 2.









:







:






























I wish I didn't know what you mean, but I do. They do grow out of it eventually, though.


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## mrspineau (Jan 15, 2008)

yeesh, only five minutes? I mean it is a baby, and babies do cry, and maybe she thought that the baby was getting ready to fall asleep and she always fusses right before falling asleep or maybe her baby sometimes fusses but it doesnt usually last as long as it did that day. I guess I would be just worrying about my own children and not so much about other people "CIO" in public (especially when your definition of crying it out is letting your baby cry for five minutes while you are right there beside the baby pushing the stroller back and forth.


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## EviesMom (Nov 30, 2004)

If you MUST say something, and the kid is a baby, really only a kind "It's so hard when they're so young" or comment on how cute the baby is can possibly be appropriate. There are people who advocate talking to the kid when you think there's abuse, but even if you think that's the case, smiling down at the baby and saying positive things in a positive tone is about all you can do in that setting IMO.


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## Delicateflower (Feb 1, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Seie* 

WWYD? What would be appropriate to do? Could one in a non-confrontational, non-judgemental way tell her that babies crying like that need comfort?


I would smile a big warm smile at her, and say something like "tough, isn't it?"


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## ernalala (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EviesMom* 
If you MUST say something, and the kid is a baby, really only a kind "It's so hard when they're so young" or comment on how cute the baby is can possibly be appropriate. There are people who advocate talking to the kid when you think there's abuse, but even if you think that's the case, smiling down at the baby and saying positive things in a positive tone is about all you can do in that setting IMO.

Actually, the WORST someone could do when I occasionally had a crying baby (note 'crying' baby, not abused baby!) in the stroller with me, was talk to my baby and think you would be 'comforting' him. It would overstimulate him even more and NOT HELP at all. DS2 would sometimes be oversensitive to crowds/sound suddenly (oh yes, of course whie shopping) and when in the sling, he would be best crying in my sling, and when in my arms, in my arms, and when in the stroller, in the stroller (he really had a period like this). Trying all different 'techniques' to 'stop him crying' or taking him out of the position he was in would make matters worse and make the upset long long lasting instead of better. The stroller would better be moving too or he would scream even louder. And when it happened I just left asap when I sensed he just wouldn't be comfortable, ıt has happebned that I went home without even having got us fresh bread







.
I'd almost fling myself at ppl who would interfere lol.
And every time we had an upset baby issue, there were actually one or more ppl who had to come and bother us!, and no they were not helpful, instead of me tryng my best to deal with my child gently while adressing his needs in correspondence whit an approach that his personality needed, I would start to fume inside because inside of other ppl's unwanted 'advice' or interference.
At least dh was able tpo have ppl back of at a few occasions, because it's hard enough to have a baby upset.

I do not think there was anything wrong in the situation you described, imo.


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## OkiMom (Nov 21, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ernalala* 
Actually, the WORST someone could do when I occasionally had a crying baby (note 'crying' baby, not abused baby!) in the stroller with me, was talk to my baby and think you would be 'comforting' him. It would overstimulate him even more and NOT HELP at all. DS2 would sometimes be oversensitive to crowds/sound suddenly (oh yes, of course whie shopping) and when in the sling, he would be best crying in my sling, and when in my arms, in my arms, and when in the stroller, in the stroller (he really had a period like this). Trying all different 'techniques' to 'stop him crying' or taking him out of the position he was in would make matters worse and make the upset long long lasting instead of better. The stroller would better be moving too or he would scream even louder. And when it happened I just left asap when I sensed he just wouldn't be comfortable, ıt has happebned that I went home without even having got us fresh bread







.
I'd almost fling myself at ppl who would interfere lol.
.

DD2 is like this as well. She gets really overstimulated if we are out to much during the day and if someone looks/talks to her when shes overstimulated its a headache for me. She will start screaming and crying. She really would just prefer if people would stop looking, talking, touching her when shes out (well, people other than me,)


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## MonAmiBella (Sep 30, 2007)

My youngest was/is a screamer. She would scream in the stroller, she would scream in the sling, she would scream if you picked her up and scream if you put her down. At some point we decided we couldn't hole up at home and not take our older two out because she was such a difficult one. She has severe GERD which was part of her problem, if we were out she was propped in her car seat with special wedges or in the colic hold.

I had one person comment on her screaming, but he was making a general comment not knowing it was mine. By the time I was done with him his jaw was on the floor and his manager (at Hollywood Video) knew how displeased I was that his employee was making rude comments about a child. He'll never forget the words colic and GERD, that's for sure!

I'm sure we had moms making comments behind our backs, but I'm past the point of caring. I'm too AP for some, not AP enough for others, but my family works - screaming child and all.


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## Marsupialmom (Sep 28, 2003)

Really depends on the situation.

I would offer help first.

I do know one situation while working in a mall that one of my coworkers took off her name badge and said something to her. It was 30 minutes of crying that could be heard across a large department store. There was no effort.


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## SquishyKitty (Jun 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RunAround* 
Seeing someone for 10 minutes in a store is not an accurate assessment of their child's temperament, the mom's parenting style, or even an indication of how AP/mainstream they are. There may have been 50 reasons why she didn't drop everything to pick her child up as fast as another mom might have.

Truly, these threads bug my socks off. (Not so good with analogies today...







) I mean, do people REALLY think that saying something about a carrier to a stranger is going to change the course of their parenting? Living by example - wearing your baby in a carrier and answering questions when asked - is more powerful. I know how many of us appreciate being told by "well meaning" friends and family to put the baby down so they can learn to soothe themselves.









What she said. I see more and more of these threads lately. It makes no sense to me.


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Baby could have been colicky/high needs.
My DD cried constantly for about the first 8 - 10 months of her life.

That being said, we'd usually carry her/wear her while screaming (and doing all the things you have to do to carry on with life - you know, work, shop, etc.), and just make the best of it.

But it's a little different when the mother is actually wearing her baby or appears to be 'trying' to soothe it.









My feeling is that when out in public it's good to do something to try and soothe the baby. If it doesn't work then it doesn't work but just all out ignoring the child looks bad in others eyes and I wouldn't want to appear as that kind of mother. I'd at least show that I was _trying_ to make an effort.

I definitely know what it's like to have a hard child as my last child was colicky the first 10-12 months of her life and had to be held or worn in order to be happy, didn't sleep most nights for more than an hour stretch and was overall very hard to please....so I know what it can be to get stressed and frustrated and so dog tired that I would love to ignore my baby and shop while it cries it's head off, but my personality wouldn't let me do that. I went shopping "alone" a lot the first year after she was born. My husband was home and he stayed with my child so I could have some alone time out of the house which did me a lot of good.







I see nothing at all wrong with that. It gave him time with his children alone without me around for a bit and gave me time to unwind and rejuvenate myself so I could be a better mom. Perhaps that's what that mother should have done.

I never said I would judge a mother that would be like the OP described, but I probably would wonder why she would just ignore her child in public, just depending on the situation and I've been there/done that.







I'm just being honest.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *darcytrue* 
But it's a little different when the mother is actually wearing her baby or appears to be 'trying' to soothe it.









My feeling is that when out in public it's good to do something to try and soothe the baby. If it doesn't work then it doesn't work but just all out ignoring the child looks bad in others eyes and I wouldn't want to appear as that kind of mother. I'd at least show that I was _trying_ to make an effort.

I definitely know what it's like to have a hard child as my last child was colicky the first 10-12 months of her life and had to be held or worn in order to be happy, didn't sleep most nights for more than an hour stretch and was overall very hard to please....so I know what it can be to get stressed and frustrated and so dog tired that I would love to ignore my baby and shop while it cries it's head off, but my personality wouldn't let me do that. I went shopping "alone" a lot the first year after she was born. My husband was home and he stayed with my child so I could have some alone time out of the house which did me a lot of good.







I see nothing at all wrong with that. It gave him time with his children alone without me around for a bit and gave me time to unwind and rejuvenate myself so I could be a better mom. Perhaps that's what that mother should have done.

I never said I would judge a mother that would be like the OP described, but I probably would wonder why she would just ignore her child in public, just depending on the situation and I've been there/done that.







I'm just being honest.

Did you see the part about pushing the stroller back and forth? Also, the woman couldn't really win either way since some people would see her wearing a crying baby and think the baby was uncomfortable and needed to be put down in a stroller. Honestly, I think it is absurd that mothers are expected to put on a show in public to appease busybodies rather than just do what is best for her and the baby at the time.

Also, it s a bit presumptuous to assume the mother in this case had a husband to leave the baby with or had one that was willing or available at the time. It's great that you have that option, but not everyone does. Maybe she is single. Maybe her husband is serving in Iraq. Maybe he is just a jerk and wouldn't give her a break.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I have gotten a lot of insight from this thread, though I must say I dont see the harm in saying
"do you need a hand, I know how tough that age can be"
the person can just say "thank you" or "no thank you"

or the harm in talking to the baby
"aren't you just the cutest little thing"
the person can just say "thank you" or "she gets overstimulated very easily with new people"

or the harm in recommending a stroller or baby carrier
the person can just say "oh, I never thought of that. where can I get one? or "I tried that, but this works better for us. he/she is just really colicky, unfortunately"

but I guess the general consensus is to leave the person alone. I offer these things because I would want them offered to me. If something I didnt want offered to me was offered I wouldn't choose to be offended or see it as a big deal. I think this is why I don't see anything wrong with offering, which is why this thread offered great insight to me to realize that even though I wouldn't mind it obviously others do. thanks for the insight ladies!


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I have gotten a lot of insight from this thread, though I must say I dont see the harm in saying
"do you need a hand, I know how tough that age can be"
the person can just say "thank you" or "no thank you"

or the harm in talking to the baby
"aren't you just the cutest little thing"
the person can just say "thank you" or "she gets overstimulated very easily with new people"

or the harm in recommending a stroller or baby carrier
the person can just say "oh, I never thought of that. where can I get one? or "I tried that, but this works better for us. he/she is just really colicky, unfortunately"

but I guess the general consensus is to leave the person alone. I offer these things because I would want them offered to me. If something I didnt want offered to me was offered I wouldn't choose to be offended or see it as a big deal. I think this is why I don't see anything wrong with offering, which is why this thread offered great insight to me to realize that even though I wouldn't mind it obviously others do. thanks for the insight ladies!

I think some people made some very good suggestions on how one could offer to help or open up a dialog without criticizing or offering unsolicited parenting advice.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I agree, I just also saw some people saying how they might not appreciate even those approaches, it goes to show how different everyone feels, and how even though I wouldnt mind and would probably even appreciate those approaches, there are some people who just want to be left alone, where as I never had the confidence to say anything anyway, I realize now its probably for the best. I say "I offer these things" I realize, though I have never actually offered those things lol. but more so that I offered those ideas here because I wouldn't mind if someone said that to me.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I agree, I just also saw some people saying how they might not appreciate even those approaches, it goes to show how different everyone feels, and how even though I wouldnt mind and would probably even appreciate those approaches, there are some people who just want to be left alone, where as I never had the confidence to say anything anyway, I realize now its probably for the best.

To be honest I think some of the strong reactions and advice to just MYOB was a reaction to the judgmental tone of the OP and some other threads like it. I seriously doubt the majority of mothers out there would be pissed off by a friendly smile and a little commiseration from another mom or an offer to help get the cart to the car or whatever.


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## guestmama9904 (Jul 6, 2002)

this happened to me just the other day at whole foods. i was wearing my sleeping baby in the sling and heard this blood-curdling cry coming from what appeaered to be a newborn (like less then 6 weeks) infant in a carseat/grocery cart thing. the mom was just casually pushing her cart back and forth, i assume in some sort of attempt to soothe her baby. to me his crys sounded hungry and it just hit me, you know? the whole societal crap we deal with. moms are shy to nurse hungry babies in publi, if they nurse at all, so babies are suffering and quite frankly I was suffering hearing this baby cry, it just hits my core when i hear babies cry, i believe it is instinctual. but i said nothing because i didnt want to make the mom feel bad and ultimately its not her fault that we have such a screwed up culture that tells us to ignore the crys of our babies and that tells us we need to be super secretive about feeding a human infant ect.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

i have had let downs from hearing other babies cry lol... well if im being honest here, I have let downs sometimes just thinking my baby might be hungry soon haha


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## sewchris2642 (Feb 28, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I have gotten a lot of insight from this thread, though I must say I dont see the harm in saying
"do you need a hand, I know how tough that age can be"
the person can just say "thank you" or "no thank you"

or the harm in talking to the baby
"aren't you just the cutest little thing"
the person can just say "thank you" or "she gets overstimulated very easily with new people"

or the harm in recommending a stroller or baby carrier
the person can just say "oh, I never thought of that. where can I get one? or "I tried that, but this works better for us. he/she is just really colicky, unfortunately"

but I guess the general consensus is to leave the person alone. I offer these things because I would want them offered to me. If something I didnt want offered to me was offered I wouldn't choose to be offended or see it as a big deal. I think this is why I don't see anything wrong with offering, which is why this thread offered great insight to me to realize that even though I wouldn't mind it obviously others do. thanks for the insight ladies!

Yes, any of those suggestions would have been useful but I wouldn't be in any condition to consider them. I would have been way too stressed out, even if I didn't look like it.


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## hippiemum21580 (Jul 14, 2007)

This was actually me at the store yeasterday with my colicky 2 month old. I was in the store grabbing some much-needed stuff and he was crying in the stroller. I was being as fast as i could. I do not have a car so for me to pick him up would have meant I could not feasibly carry my items, push thestroller and hold him all at once. I also knew he was not hungry nor wet. He just simply wants to be held all of the time. And my toddler had spilled juice all over all 3 of my slings earlier so he HAD to be in the stroller. From an outsiders point of view it looked like I was ignoring him.
though internally I was having that panicky feeling all nursing moms get when thier baby cries...... Nontheless, a woman stopped me and lectured me on hwo babies need to be held and how bad strollers are for babies. Ugh. I am sure she made all sots of assumptions. What woudl I say...."Hey I have 4 other kids and am a STRONG supporter of AP and rarely use this stroller but I had no choice...."? I owe this woman no apologies.
If you feel the need to say something, hwo about try commiserating with the mother? say something like "My son ALWAYS cried alot at that age. The only thing that worked for me was a sling! It REALLY helped me stay sane!" That way you are being understanding and not judgmental.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sewchris2642* 
Yes, any of those suggestions would have been useful but I wouldn't be in any condition to consider them. I would have been way too stressed out, even if I didn't look like it.

this is what I mean. I never considered this. Thank you for your honest insight because it really did put things into perspective for me


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## mama2elisabeth (Mar 15, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arismama!* 
this happened to me just the other day at whole foods. i was wearing my sleeping baby in the sling and heard this blood-curdling cry coming from what appeaered to be a newborn (like less then 6 weeks) infant in a carseat/grocery cart thing. the mom was just casually pushing her cart back and forth, i assume in some sort of attempt to soothe her baby. to me his crys sounded hungry and it just hit me, you know? the whole societal crap we deal with. moms are shy to nurse hungry babies in publi, if they nurse at all, so babies are suffering and quite frankly I was suffering hearing this baby cry, it just hits my core when i hear babies cry, i believe it is instinctual. but i said nothing because i didnt want to make the mom feel bad and ultimately its not her fault that we have such a screwed up culture that tells us to ignore the crys of our babies and that tells us we need to be super secretive about feeding a human infant ect.
























This is totally why it's so great for those of us who aren't embarrassed or put off by society's views to BF and BW in public as much as possible. The more others see us do it, the less likely they are to feel self conscious about it







!


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## jeevee3 (Mar 7, 2009)

I suppose the OP was well-meaning in her request for advice on how to perceive this situation, but there was a time I would have felt extremely bitter and resentful knowing that everytime I go out, I've got moms all around me, judging my every move. I mean, I find it to be the same sort of lines and as insulting as people walking along the beach privately saying to themselves "Huh, who told her _she_ could wear a bikini? Yuck!" Or maybe something like "I can't believe she's letting her kid eat that!"

It's heartbreaking that a mom's worst enemies are *other moms*!!

And _women's worst enemies are other women!_

This is messed up. This is not how it should be!! But you all know what it's like: If you work, you've abandoned your kids. If you don't work, you've submitted to a subordinate tradition woman's role. You have too many kids, not enough kids, etc. If you let your kid cry, you're a bad mom, if you don't breastfeed, you're a really TERRIBLE mom, etc. It goes on and on and on and on and on..... and for what?

How sad is this?

Please stop judging! You don't need to do anything or say anything other than accept than babies cry, and that you can never know what is going on in someone else's world. If you are feeling the need to say somthing, I suggest you thoroughly examine WHY. _What_ is the purpose? Is it to make YOU feel better or to make someone else feel better? What is the goal? WHO will gain? Unless she is completely frazzled and seems to be looking around for help, then I can only assume anything you do would be for self-serving reasons. Not good enough reasons IMO.

Personally, when I'm out, I don't care what you think. You aren't me. That isn't your kid. I will wear my baby when I feel like it or I will plop him down in the shopping cart if I have a tired back that day. And none of it makes me a better or worse mom than you, or _superior_ or _inferior_ to anyone else. And by the way, I'll wear a bikini if I want to, fat or not... you (the proverbial stranger) are not the one whose opinion I value.

So please, can we all stop looking around at each other and making assessments about what everyone is doing wrong and instead start seeing and appreciating everything that is right?!?!!? Look for the good. In your own life as well as others'.


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## MonAmiBella (Sep 30, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I have gotten a lot of insight from this thread, though I must say I dont see the harm in saying
"do you need a hand, I know how tough that age can be"
the person can just say "thank you" or "no thank you"

or the harm in talking to the baby
"aren't you just the cutest little thing"
the person can just say "thank you" or "she gets overstimulated very easily with new people"

or the harm in recommending a stroller or baby carrier
the person can just say "oh, I never thought of that. where can I get one? or "I tried that, but this works better for us. he/she is just really colicky, unfortunately"

but I guess the general consensus is to leave the person alone. I offer these things because I would want them offered to me. If something I didnt want offered to me was offered I wouldn't choose to be offended or see it as a big deal. I think this is why I don't see anything wrong with offering, which is why this thread offered great insight to me to realize that even though I wouldn't mind it obviously others do. thanks for the insight ladies!

To offer unsolicited advice to random strangers is rude, IMO. To get parenting advice is worse, to me it implies that they're not capable of raising/dealing with their own child(ren).

I was "offered" BFing advice by a stranger in Target when my youngest was little, I was upset and offended by it. She was on bottles due to several reasons, it was the hardest thing for me to do but it was the right thing for *my* child. To have someone come up to me and tell me she would be healthier and happier if I would just BF was enough to toss me over the edge.

Eye contact and a smile is enough for me, I don't need someone who doesn't know me or my children telling me what I should or shouldn't be doing with them.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

jeevee - when I do say something its not to make myself feel better - those this is not the kind of thing I speak up about - I do speak up against child abuse though, and it doesn't make me feel better it makes me feel afraid and really crappy. I start shaking and crying and I start to feel sick. It's not about how I feel, I would feel bad whether I walked away or whether I tried to stop the abuse. but in the event I might stop the abuse I can send the message to the child that they don't deserve to be abused. im not judging anyone in these scenarios - im way to upset to judge! in these times its not about me or the other parent. its about the child... and maybe the parent is wonderful and having a bad day, but if thats the case then I think they would appreciate someone stopping them from abusing their child.

in cases like in the OP though I see its best I just keep my mouth shut even if I'm trying to be nice in a way that I wouldnt mind someone being nice to me.


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## TinkerBelle (Jun 29, 2005)

I couldn't BF my third for reasons I am not going to explain again on here. However, if someone had seen me bottle-feeding him or buying his formula and decided to give me a lecture about how formula is "the devil" or poison, or some other such nonsense, I would have given Nosy Nellie the tongue-lashing of her/his life. Same with strollers, or what-have-you.

They would have thought twice about doing it again, I bet.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

i definitely don't understand the lecturing a person for formula feeding - how is that going to help them, and how do you know they didnt try? I can understand giving advice to a mother to be on breastfeeding if they are debating their options, but it makes me sad when those who did their best to breastfeed are basically told they didnt try hard enough. how terrible - often those mothers are already greiving the fact they weren't able to breastfeed. As for offering them ideas for future children, I'd wait until they were expecting again and wanting to try again and looking for ideas on what they could do different that time around - which to be honest is sometimes nothing. I think sometimes lactivists forget that there really ARE some people who can't breastfeed. Or that there really ARE some people who need c-sections. etc


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