# Ok this might make you so mad



## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

My Dh was telling me today that last night at a football game his friend was telling him that they have put their 6 month baby in their basement b/c the mom wants to stop nighttime feeding. So she doesn't want to hear the baby cry at night so they put him in their basement all by himself. All alone. I almost started to cry when I heard this. Why would a mom do that? How could a mom do that? And why is she stopping feeding him at night? He is not a big baby I think he still needs to eat at night. Of course she is the same mom telling me that they feberized their baby and maybe we should think about it. Does this make anyone else mad hearing this?


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## terrordactyl (Jul 19, 2006)

thats horrible. i started tearing up. basements are scary that child is going to have some nightmares later in life from that


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## afishwithabike (Jun 8, 2005)

And people wonder why teens hold so much angst. UGH.


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## kat85 (Apr 12, 2006)

Is she crazy or what. Putting a child in the basement where who know what can crawl over him. How long will she do this to a baby if he dont stop crying soon. Maybe you should tell your husband or you need to tell her that a not a good idea, it bad mothering. And if her husband is telling people then someone might call CPS on her.


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## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

Her husband just told my DH that "she has read a lot of books" Whatever books say to do this should be taken off shelves and burnt. My DH didn't even no what to say he was in shock. He actually thought that the husband was joking.


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## wombatclay (Sep 4, 2005)

Is there any chance that the basement in question is a finished basement, set up as a guest room maybe? Not that that explains the behavior, but it makes it a bit better.










Perhaps your husband could bring them a copy of the Dr. Sears book, or the Dr. Gordon "Good Nights" book (that one was actually really popular with my DH...for some reason he loved reading all the celebrity endorsements and seeing who among the rich and famous co-sleep), or the NCSS?

Calling CPS is a drastic step and if the child isn't in actual physical danger then it's not a step to be taken (I know, I know, the thought of that babe cio in a basement is turning my stomach, but cio is not in and of itself child abuse by the laws of this country)...but I agree that if the husband is telling a lot of people they could get into a sticky situation.

Perhaps it was a sort of "cry for help"? Looking for BTDT advice from your husband? Could you invite them over for coffee and casually discuss your sleep solutions? It sounds like the mama is totally sleep deprived and hasn't found books that support a more loving/gentle sleep philosophy. Maybe if you can share some other alternatives she'll be happy to give those a try?


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## BelovedK (Jun 7, 2005)




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## oneKnight (Aug 4, 2006)

I was thinking more like wombatclay, my parents basement is a copy of the upsatirs, except underground - Kitchen, fireplace, bathroom, bedrooms, garage even, I lived down there when I was home from college (before I married). Still, it's cool and damp, and the house upstairs makes all sorts of unfamiliar noises, so even the best of basements is not a fun place to be all alone!!!


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## arlecchina (Jul 25, 2006)

oh my GOD how horrible!

she doesnt want to hear him cry so they put a 6 month old alone in the BASEMENT?


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## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wombatclay*
Is there any chance that the basement in question is a finished basement, set up as a guest room maybe? Not that that explains the behavior, but it makes it a bit better.










Perhaps your husband could bring them a copy of the Dr. Sears book, or the Dr. Gordon "Good Nights" book (that one was actually really popular with my DH...for some reason he loved reading all the celebrity endorsements and seeing who among the rich and famous co-sleep), or the NCSS?

Calling CPS is a drastic step and if the child isn't in actual physical danger then it's not a step to be taken (I know, I know, the thought of that babe cio in a basement is turning my stomach, but cio is not in and of itself child abuse by the laws of this country)...but I agree that if the husband is telling a lot of people they could get into a sticky situation.

Perhaps it was a sort of "cry for help"? Looking for BTDT advice from your husband? Could you invite them over for coffee and casually discuss your sleep solutions? It sounds like the mama is totally sleep deprived and hasn't found books that support a more loving/gentle sleep philosophy. Maybe if you can share some other alternatives she'll be happy to give those a try?


No this isn't a "cry for help" this is who they are. All they care about is their sleep not what is best for the baby. She isn't sleep deprived. Her baby actually sleeps good. She is very opinionated so she won't listen to the books I suggest anyways. They want to do the cio method. I have talked about Dr Sears and NCSS and she just blows it off.


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## Mama Poot (Jun 12, 2006)

I'd like to see the basement for myself. If its anything like our basement, NO ONE should be sleeping down there.....sounds borderline abusive IMO


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## forthebest (Jun 19, 2006)

Some people are just too selfish for words, this basement/cio 'method' may backfire on her, 6 m is just a wee baby!! Expected to behave like an adult already, odd behaviour.


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## Ivan's Mom (Jul 10, 2006)

I am crying. People are so cruel. This is unbelievable. People who are not willing to devote 24 hours a day to their baby should not have babies!


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

If people *are* going to do CIO they should at the very least have to listen to the crying.

The cynical, evil part of me thinks that if the baby dies from this that you should make sure your local paper gets the story.

The nicer me hopes that the baby is totally fine, but leaves home at 18 to have a wonderful life and his parents end up in dismal nursing homes alone.

The optimistic but futile me is praying for a change of heart on the parents part. Illness tends to change people, maybe the baby'll get pneumonia and be saved and they'll realize how important he is to them and they'll go on to advocate for the evils of leaving your baby alone? I mean it'd be better if they just changed their minds without that sort of impetus, but that's one way it might happen. Maybe they could just read a really heart-wrenching true story of another baby who's life was at risk?


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## familylove (Mar 14, 2006)

I'm sorry. I know it stinks to hear this kind of stuff b/c then you just imagine that poor babe crying away in the basement.

I have a good friend that I hadn't talked to in a long time. We were talking about sleeping habits and she told me that she *had* to let her little boy (right around 12 mos) CIO. Only she couldn't *stand* all of the crying so she went and stayed with friends for a few days until he was *trained*. Her DH told her that their DS cried nearly all night the first night, making himself vomit. The second and third nights were 2 hours and 45 minutes of crying respectively. And they have a 3rd child on the way







And, FTR, her other children, including the DS that CIO, do not currently have stellar sleeping habits.

If you have to leave the house b/c you can't endure your babe CIO, you really need to question exactly what you are doing!

Sad, sad, sad.


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

It's like these people are so screwed up that instead of asking "what's wrong with people who can let their babies cry?" they're asking "what's wrong with me that I can't bear to hear my baby cry?"

I mean, I know I'm intensely empathic*, but there's got to be some sort of psychological issue with people who don't have their hearts torn out by their own babies cries. Maybe they need prolactin injections?

*As in, I can easily picture myself in a given situation, sometimes this helps me understand people better, sometimes I think they're looney bonkers because they react completely differently than I would. I'm working on that second part.


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## JeDeeLenae (Feb 5, 2006)

I can understand that she doesn't want to hear him cry, but putting him in the basement is horrible. What if he's screaming in pain and she can't even hear him?? What a nut!


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## Selesai (Oct 26, 2005)

I actually think this abusive and should be reported. What if the baby were sick? And he needs to eat and be changed during the night regardless.


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## BelovedK (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Selesai*
I actually think this abusive and should be reported. What if the baby were sick? And he needs to eat and be changed during the night regardless.

ITA


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## Ivan's Mom (Jul 10, 2006)

The more I think of this, the worse I feel for that baby. I have talked about it with my mom and my husband. We really think these people need to be reported to the child protection services. What if the baby strangled or the crib collapsed and crushed her.....or anything really. It is not right and I feel it is our duty to speak for the voiceless and protect the defenseless.

How dare these people do this.










They should be sterilized and they make me want to uke


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## EVC (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:

Perhaps your husband could bring them a copy of the Dr. Sears book, or the Dr. Gordon "Good Nights" book (that one was actually really popular with my DH...for some reason he loved reading all the celebrity endorsements and seeing who among the rich and famous co-sleep), or the NCSS?








:

Especially the No Cry Sleep Solution.


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## bamamom (Dec 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Selesai*
I actually think this abusive and should be reported. What if the baby were sick? And he needs to eat and be changed during the night regardless.

CALL CPS!!

We all feel bad now, but what if something happens to the baby?? If it vomits and aspirates and dies? I hope CPS could scare some sh!t out of them







:


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## nancyw (Jul 8, 2005)

next time this mother is crying, upset, feeling lonely, out of sorts, having a hard time falling asleep, needing someone to talk to, feeling sick, hungry, or just generally wanting to be comforted by another human being.....

you see where Im going with this.

maybe your DH should tell her DH to go ahead and implement their current strategy----see if it fixes whatever her problem is at the time.

(and I agree. Im thinking cps. or have a serious discussion with the family telling them that you feel compelled to report this---that this is just inhumane.)


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## ChristieB (Jun 17, 2003)

I agree about calling CPS, but maybe first try talking to them (both of you and both of them) about your concerns re: the baby's safety. Maybe they haven't thought about that?? It's hard to imagine that they haven't, but then it's hard to imagine that they'd even consider doing this. Anyway, if they don't change things after that, then call CPS. I just don't think it's safe or humane what they're doing (even by CPS-type standards). For one thing, if the basement isn't finished, then it's not fit for habitation, most likely. For another, if they can't hear the baby, then they don't know if something major happens (of course, in my mind, anything a baby cries about should be taken seriously, but I'm talking more about the things that have been mentioned, like vomiting, etc.). That is not safe, by anyone's standards.

And here I was feeling sorry for the baby I saw yesterday at a birthday party. He was bottle-fed, and the only time I saw his mom hold him was to feed him. Otherwise he was in his stroller or a friend (9 mos. pg, and with a child of her own -- prolly felt sorry for him) was holding him. Who knows what his home life is like, but what I saw is nothing compared to what you describe.

Christie


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

poor baby.


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## Tonia80 (Jun 10, 2006)

That is absolutly irresponsibe. I sleep with my kids and cannot imagine not being able to hear them at night! What about teh stories you hear of children being kidnapped right out of thier beds? The parenst would not even KNOW! What if he managed to climb and fall out of the crib or get his leg caught in the bars and be screaming for pain???? What if he spit up and was gagging and choking???? So many what ifs run though my mind. I think it is selfish if nothing else. You do NOT stop being a parent just because the sun sets. I think a babe that young still needs to eat at night but even if she disagrees with that logic, how about if he has a poopy diaper? she would make him lay in that for god knows hwo many hours through teh night???? I just feel awful forthat babe. I don't care if its a dark damp wet basement full of rats or a cozy warm nightlight lit nursery upstairs, the fact of the matter is babies need to knwo they are loved and safe no matter when it is.


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## Attached Mama (Dec 4, 2005)

that is so sad and emotionally abusive! i would not be friends with them anymore and would tell them why. maybe that would give them cause to rethink!!!! what if the baby got upset and choked on it's saliva?? maybe that would make them think if you suggested it


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## Hollin (Jun 26, 2005)

My mom did that exact thing with me at 7 months. She is not selfish or irresponsible nor was she a bad, uncaring parent. She was an exhausted mom of two young children who didn't even realize a family bed was an option. She literally felt like if she didn't get some decent sleep she would be a danger to herself and her children. My advice is for you or DH to talk to the couple about other options to banishing baby to the basement. Most likely they're not doing it because they hate their baby and don't care about his/her needs.

I do think my mom regrets the basement thing. She talks about one night when I was really crying and she ignored it. The next morning I had a high fever. Maybe if the couple thought about possibilities like that they would bring baby back closer to them.


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## BlueStateMama (Apr 12, 2004)

That's not "sleep training", that's neglect.







:


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## E&Gmommy (Mar 23, 2006)

That's so sad and crule. My nephew's biological father did this to him (in a closet straped in his carseat) when he was a tiney baby and now even at 10 years old he has a fear of closets. Not there's-a-monster-in-there-fear, really scared hyperventalating type. I really believe that those two things are connected. I honestly would call cps. It may be extream but maybe they can at least help them.

~Michelle


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## DandK (Apr 11, 2005)

OMG That's horrible! Yes our nursery is going to be in the basement BUT we have a really nice basement and dd's crib is literally 5 feet from my bed! Not that I see her using her crib much anyways. I couldn't imagine putting her in the basement by herself while I was on another level of the house but to leave her cry the entire night just to teach her to sleep denying her basic needs is just digusting!

I say talk to them and then get cps involved.


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## pookel (May 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kat85*
Putting a child in the basement where who know what can crawl over him.

OK, not that I'm defending leaving a child alone to cry, but I have a hard time imagining why people would assume a basement is a cold, dark place where things can crawl over you at night. Is it really like that where you live?

This is our basement:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...orbinslide.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y229/lythe/Booze.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...e/DSCF0015.jpg


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## ndunn (Mar 22, 2006)

what if the child cried so hard it vomited and then aspirated on it?


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## mommyofboys (Jul 16, 2005)

That is just so awful- I can't believe that.


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## ChristieB (Jun 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pookel*
OK, not that I'm defending leaving a child alone to cry, but I have a hard time imagining why people would assume a basement is a cold, dark place where things can crawl over you at night. Is it really like that where you live?

This is our basement:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...orbinslide.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y229/lythe/Booze.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...e/DSCF0015.jpg

Someone asked the OP and she said that the basement is unfinished. Of, course that doesn't mean there are things there that can crawl on the baby, but most likely, legally, it is not an inhabitable space.

The bigger issue, though, is that they can't hear the baby crying there! And we DO know that, since that is the whole point of them putting him there.

Nice basement, btw. It must be a daylight basement on a hill, since there are windows. It looks like it's a nice, comfortable addition to your living space. Unfortunitely, we know that the basement where this baby is sleeping (well, maybe, but prolly mostly crying) is not as nice as that.

Christie


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## pookel (May 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ChristieB*
Someone asked the OP and she said that the basement is unfinished. Of, course that doesn't mean there are things there that can crawl on the baby, but most likely, legally, it is not an inhabitable space.

Well, OK, maybe not everywhere is like my town, but around here, "unfinished" probably means that there are some bare pipes showing or the floor has rugs set down on it instead of real carpeting, or whatever. I have friends who have their bedrooms in unfinished basements.

To me, the real issue with the basement is that you can't hear the kid crying from a floor away - it would be just as bad to put him on the second floor if you're on the main floor, or whatever. (Unless this really is one of those dark, damp, horrible basements. But even then, I think if I were a baby, I'd care more about being near my mommy than what the room looked like.)


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## ChristieB (Jun 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pookel*
Well, OK, maybe not everywhere is like my town, but around here, "unfinished" probably means that there are some bare pipes showing or the floor has rugs set down on it instead of real carpeting, or whatever. I have friends who have their bedrooms in unfinished basements.

You're right that they vary, and we can hope that in this case it's a "nice" unfinished basement (I agree with you, btw, that that isn't the issue for the baby, but some unfinished basements are cold and damp, which isn't comfortable or healthy). My point with saying it's probably not legally inhabitable was not to put down people who use unfinished basements but to say that CPS would probably have a problem with it. I'm highly aware of the issue (not CPS, but areas that are inhabitable or not) right now, since we're adding on to our house and we won't be able to legally use the addition until it's completely finished and has been permitted for habitation. (Fortunitely they're pretty lax about it here, so we can virtually finish parts of it while still working on the rest, and we probably won't be given a hard time about using those areas.)

Quote:

To me, the real issue with the basement is that you can't hear the kid crying from a floor away - it would be just as bad to put him on the second floor if you're on the main floor, or whatever. (Unless this really is one of those dark, damp, horrible basements. But even then, I think if I were a baby, I'd care more about being near my mommy than what the room looked like.)
Exactly! And I think that's the biggest concern for most of the other posters as well. Personally, my babies sleep with me, and I wouldn't have it any other way. If they stayed upstairs, I would, too. In fact, our 5 yo son is sleeping in the living room now (no bedroom until the addition is finished), and is only about 10 ft. from us. I actually worry about him being in his own room when he has one. We will be about twice the distance from him! He'll be older then, so maybe I won't worry so much. And our new baby will be here by then, so I'll have a distraction.

Christie


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## Rmeg (Jul 8, 2005)

Oh my dear God. That's just awful. What would those parents feel if that baby suffered a cot death?


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## 2Sweeties1Angel (Jan 30, 2006)

As someone who had a baby who would cry so hard he would literally burst all the blood vessels in his face and force himself to vomit, I cannot even begin to imagine leaving a baby all alone at night. Especially not in the basement. Someone was always with DS at night (not me--long story that spawned my hatred of CPS), meaning he was either in bed with someone or in his crib next to the bed, and he would still do this. He was traumatized very early in life









Which brings me to my next point. My son was permanently scarred when he was an infant. His twin brother died and the State tried to charge DH and I with murder, despite the fact that he died from a vaccine reaction. They didn't care. We were young and they thought they could get away with it. So they took DS away and placed him in foster care--3 days with strangers, 7months with my grandparents, then on to my parents for awhile before coming home with me. That is traumatic for an infant and he's never gotten over it. He's 5 now and I don't think he ever will get over it. I know I won't. What kind of a parent would traumatize their own child ON PURPOSE by locking him in the basement all alone? I've seen what severe emotional distress during the formative years can do and it kills me. Are they even thinking about that?


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## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

Here is my other thing that we need to clarify with our friends is if they are putting him in the basement to not hear him cry BUT they still have a monitor with him then what is the difference then having him in his room which is just down the hall and no monitor. Either way you can hear him cry. If he is in the basement without a monitor then what if he chokes or vomits or anything. That is what I am scared of. My dh is going to call his friend and find out if he is serious and talk to him. I saw the mom today and I was so mad I didn't even want to talk to her. We weren't in a place to talk about this issue otherwise I would of brought it up. But I agree we need to talk to them.

About there basement, it is finished but I haven't seen it since they finished it so I don't know what it looks like.


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## ChristieB (Jun 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kdf*
About there basement, it is finished but I haven't seen it since they finished it so I don't know what it looks like.

Oops, sorry for mis-quoting you. I guess I misunderstood something you said.

Christie


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## Aura_Kitten (Aug 13, 2002)

this makes me want to go hug my children.









honestly, it really is neglect and ought to be reported. and people wonder why children are so screwed up these days??


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## Ivan's Mom (Jul 10, 2006)

I could not sleep last night thinking about that little baby all alone and probably scared. Please do something quick and let us know how it turns out. I kept thinking I wanted her to be all safe and snug in bed with us.









Even if nothing physically happens to her, the mental aspect is just as traumatic. Babies need their Mama and Dada to be close by and responsive to them.


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## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

Ok so my dh called the husband and he basically asked for some clarification on what they are doing. So here it comes, the baby sleeps in his crib upside until midnight then the mom feeds him then they put him in the basement in a room all bundled up for the rest of the night. They do have a monitor with him. If he crys more then 10-15 mins they go check on him , the feber method. Why they are doing it is b/c she is going back to work in a month and she can't be waking up 3 times a night. Why he is in the basement is b/c he was crying so much that he was keeping them awake and keeping the husband's sister( who is living with them) awake. First IMO tell the sister to go to the basement, second you still have a monitor on him so you still hear him cry so what is the difference if he is upstair or downstairs. The mom wanted to ferberize him and put him on a bottle at the same time. But the dad said only one at a time. Personally I would of put him on a bottle that way the dad ( since he will be at home with the baby) could get up at night and the baby won't have to cry and be by himself. The husband did jokingly ask my dh if he was going to call CPS on him. My dh said no but we were very concern with their method. I don't agree with it at all. So that is the scoop with them. Maybe they will think about their method now that we are questioning it.


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## *caitlinsmom* (Jul 21, 2006)

I really hope they do reconsider the horrible, selfish things they are doing. I am just about to cry sitting here thinking about that poor child! If the mama is so concerned with getting enough sleep she should not have had a child!

My dd has just started waking very frequently at night (she's trying to learn to walk!) and do think I would do something like that? No, never! She's still sleeping with me and DH and we are just cuddling her and dealing with the deprivation!
How horrible!


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## Starlitlexy (Nov 11, 2005)

Ugh that's horrible. People wonder why kids are afraid of the dark and have night terrors. That makes me so upset. I can hardly imagine having an upset child alone in a room because they're hungry and afraid


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## ACsMom (Apr 21, 2006)

my sister used to strap her dd into her high chair on the ground floor so they couldn't hear her crying but knew she'd be "safe." She honestly sees nothing wrong with this. It just doesn't seem to occur to some people that babies are people.


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## Sijae (May 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Starlitlexy*
Ugh that's horrible. People wonder why kids are afraid of the dark and have night terrors. That makes me so upset. I can hardly imagine having an upset child alone in a room because they're hungry and afraid









FWIW, nightmares and night terrors are different things. My son had severe night terrors from under 1 year old (starting out every night) and gradually tapered off around 8 years old. He was held all the time, exclusively breastfed and co-slept from birth. Not only that but he had a trauma-free homebirth and no immunizations or illnesses.

Now nightmares are another story.

Obviously I can't even imagine doing something so very disconnected from my baby. I think society in general and our birth culture are a huge part of people disconnecting from their children enough to cause them emotional and physical harm. It's easy to say this mom is just selfish (and maybe she is) but I see people like this as being severely disconnected from their emotions, their own true needs and especially their babies.

Laura


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## pookel (May 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kdf*
Why they are doing it is b/c she is going back to work in a month and she can't be waking up 3 times a night.











My 16mo still wakes up a couple of times a night and I've been working full-time since my maternity leave ended at 12 weeks. Mind you, I'm a zombie at work some days, but better that than leaving him to cry.

I have to admit that I have some friends who used a variation of sleep training that worked







: but in those cases it was more like "leave him whining for a couple of minutes, then come back and cuddle him, then leave again," which I don't think is *that* terrible.

ETA: I'm not advocating that kind of method either, I just wanted to point out that I think there's a wide range of forms CIO can take, and there's a big difference between letting the kid fuss a little while you stand at the door, and putting him to sleep in the basement so you can't hear him cry for long periods of time. I know people who did that, and without a monitor, too - so the kid cried for HOURS.


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## Delacroix (Aug 4, 2005)

That is so horrible, I don't even know what to say. How could anyone do such a thing to a child?


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## EastonsMom (Oct 24, 2005)

We know a sick sad family who actually made fun of us because we 'baby' E too much







: I didn't know being an attached attentive parent was babing your child but these are the same people who 'forgot' to turn on there monitior one night ( there son was 10 WEEKS!!!!







) and joked about how it was a mircale that he 'slept throught the night'







We stopped hanging out with them because 1. they are iggnorant 2. they are bitchie 3. they made fun of me and called me a tree hugging hippie because we CD and are organic and AP. Better off with out them. I would consider that abuse. What she has a fever and sick, or teething, or has her arm caught in a slate and breaks her shoulder and arm trying to get it out? I would ask authorities what the law says about it to give you and that poor speechless child peace of mind.


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## GavinSophieMama (May 7, 2006)

UGH! There are SO many people out there that would love to have babies and can't and then...there's people like this. That poor baby!


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## mfp02 (Jan 5, 2005)

Ugh. I felt like puking when I read this.










My almost two year old still wakes at least once a night if not 2-3x for something to eat and a cuddle (on the couch.. can't be in bed.. lol). I can't imagine denying her that!


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## punkinsmommy (Apr 28, 2006)

I don't think I'd call CPS, but those people wouldn't be my friends anymore.


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## Faithful Mommy (Jun 7, 2006)

I'm sorry to say... but I would be the first one to call child services... actually I'm not sorry!!







: How can someone do such a thing and call themselves a mother? I freak out when my ds falls asleep at night in his crib (in his nursery) and that's only down the hall!! I would ask if she atleast has a monitor just incase the baby crys for so long and can't breath... but that would be a stupid question because she obviously doesn't want to hear her. My stomach is turning right now!! That behavior is disgusting!! This is a huge







if you ask me!!









If that were my friend (and thank God she's not) I would print out all of these comments and give them to her... maybe it'll knock some sense into her!!


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## shoefairy3 (Jun 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Faithful Mommy*
I'm sorry to say... but I would be the first one to call child services... actually I'm not sorry!!







: How can someone do such a thing and call themselves a mother? I freak out when my ds falls asleep at night in his crib (in his nursery) and that's only down the hall!! I would ask if she atleast has a monitor just incase the baby crys for so long and can't breath... but that would be a stupid question because she obviously doesn't want to hear her. My stomach is turning right now!! That behavior is disgusting!! This is a huge







if you ask me!!









If that were my friend (and thank God she's not) I would print out all of these comments and give them to her... maybe it'll knock some sense into her!!











Poor wee little baby...makes me cry

I'd defo call cps...give a voice to the voiceless


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## guestmama9916 (Jun 24, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kdf*
Why they are doing it is b/c she is going back to work in a month and she can't be waking up 3 times a night.

I hate it when moms use work as an excuse to treat their babies this way. There's plenty of us that work and refuse to CIO sleep train and find other ways to cope with night wakings.

Kim


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## Enudely (Jul 2, 2005)

That sounds like child abuse to me


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## blsilva (Jul 31, 2006)

Oh, God, that poor little baby! My heart hurt just reading this. I'm sorry, but there is no excuse for doing that to a little one.


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## mccelticmom (Aug 6, 2006)

I hate to say it, but CPS will probably do absolutely nothing. I have a friend who use to work for them.

Anyway, I can't help be think about growth spurts. A child goes through a growth spurt and needs nurishment. Is this couple even feeding this child enough before bedtime (oh, and I bet bedtime is a certain time each night)...my brother and SIL went through this whole thing about baby should sleep in crib..they got some crazy idea about a vacuum cleaner running and to this day, their daughter runs from the vacuum cleaner and she's 4 yo!

This is sad. All you can do is talk to them and offer advice...you'll know whether they want to hear it or not, because you'll never see them again if they don't agree.

I say..send the Sis down stairs...in the basement, she's old enough to take care of herself.

I have a friend who is preggo right now..she says that as soon as babe starts sleeping through the night, she's taking her upstairs...I have a feeling that they are going to be really detacted...makes me sad and I just may loose a friendship over it...

I wish all those parenting books about crying it out, sleeping through the night would just disappear....

I'm sad.


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## jaye_p (Mar 12, 2005)

OMG. That is child abuse! I'm sorry, but even though peds tell you that at 6 months a child doesn't "need" to nurse & can "sleep through the night" without waking or taking any food, putting your child in the domestic equivalent of the DUNGEON so that you don't have to hear his/her hungry and/or frightened cries is just wrong in so many ways.


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## SugarAndSun (Feb 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Selesai*
I actually think this abusive and should be reported. What if the baby were sick? And he needs to eat and be changed during the night regardless.

Could she have ppd? How old is the baby? She may need help.


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## kdf (Nov 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SugarAndSun*
Could she have ppd? How old is the baby? She may need help.

No I don't think that is it. She doesn't have ppd. Her baby is 6 months. I think this is a run in the family type thing, her sister and husband were letting their baby CIO at 6 weeks. So that is where I think she is getting some of her advice. I think she just wants her sleep and that is all that matters. I know it is really sad.


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## catgirl1007 (Feb 9, 2005)

that brought tears to my eyes. poor little baby.


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## maya44 (Aug 3, 2004)

............


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## hawkfeather (Jan 18, 2005)

i knew a couple that moved theri baby into a closet because she would get out of bed and come want to nurse.. than she figured out how to open the closet door so they put a chair in front of it












































these poor babies!


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## JeDeeLenae (Feb 5, 2006)

Quote:

i knew a couple that moved theri baby into a closet because she would get out of bed and come want to nurse..
I watched a House Hunters (HGTV) episode where the closet was the baby's room too. There was a playpen at the back and this was a small skinny closet. Very sad.


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## lurable (Jul 23, 2006)

I could never imagine doing this to a child..... wouldn't something inside of you scream that it was wrong?


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae*
I watched a House Hunters (HGTV) episode where the closet was the baby's room too. There was a playpen at the back and this was a small skinny closet. Very sad.

I see nothing wrong with this for an older child to have a space of their own in a larger family. Just so long as any locks are on the *inside*. For a baby, well, that's just silly, babies should be in their parent's room.


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## dawncayden (Jan 24, 2006)

I would call CPS if I was in your position...you can call anonimously (sp!) and then it's their decision if its abuse or not.
I'va called them on an old friend of mine and they visited her and didn't find anything, but I felt better, because at least the situation got checked out.

Dawn


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## amwww (Dec 13, 2004)

something obviously needs to happen here, for that poor baby's ske, but i just wanted to ask, has anyone actually ever seen cps do a single good for anyone? i mean, i'm sure there's some crackhead somewhere whose kids don't miss her(most likely because cps doesn't do anything and they're still living there) (a joke). in my state more kids are snatched by cps per capita than any state in the us (nebraska), and the governor and cps are under multiple lawsuits for the abuse kids suffer in the foster care system. my g-ma said she worked for foster care for hhs for like 2 years before she had to quit because of what she was seeing. the last straw for her was when a 13 yo girl was raped by her foster father.... obviously this doesn't happen every single time, and it kind of sh*ts on the options for the baby we are talking about.... the treat of calling cps might be good, if it gets the parents into therapy or something.


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## ledzepplon (Jun 28, 2004)

It's already been said, but how can you give birth to a precious, innocent child, and then put him or her in the basement!?!?!? I'm so sad for that baby. It's bad enough that the kid's needs for affection/comfort/clean diaper/food/security are going completely ignored. But what if the poor thing was sick or hurt?







Duh, babies cry because we're SUPPOSED to take care of them. And they don't come with time cards that we can punch out at 7 p.m. when we're done with them!!!


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## dawncayden (Jan 24, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amwww*
something obviously needs to happen here, for that poor baby's ske, but i just wanted to ask, has anyone actually ever seen cps do a single good for anyone? i mean, i'm sure there's some crackhead somewhere whose kids don't miss her(most likely because cps doesn't do anything and they're still living there) (a joke). in my state more kids are snatched by cps per capita than any state in the us (nebraska), and the governor and cps are under multiple lawsuits for the abuse kids suffer in the foster care system. my g-ma said she worked for foster care for hhs for like 2 years before she had to quit because of what she was seeing. the last straw for her was when a 13 yo girl was raped by her foster father.... obviously this doesn't happen every single time, and it kind of sh*ts on the options for the baby we are talking about.... the treat of calling cps might be good, if it gets the parents into therapy or something.

From what I've heard, I think cps is a little different here in Canada.


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## JeDeeLenae (Feb 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sapphire_chan*
I see nothing wrong with this for an older child to have a space of their own in a larger family. Just so long as any locks are on the *inside*. For a baby, well, that's just silly, babies should be in their parent's room.

This baby was about 6 mos old and an only child. The parents had a HUGE bedroom with plenty of room, then they cut to a little closet with a playpen and clothes in it. It was sad.


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## freya6903 (Sep 22, 2005)

That is so horrible.

Apparently, when my dad was a baby his dad was away at war and he was home with my grandma. When my grandad came home he didn't like my grandma feeding him at night anymore so they left my dad to cry in a crib in another room all night long. My poor grandma had to listen to it but her husband wouldn't let her resond to the crying. My dad thinks he is a "loser" because of it, and he blames that experience on his lack of confidence (my dad is NOT a loser, but you couldn't convince him of that)

When my mum told me I was so upset, I didn't realise people could actually do that. Doesn't a person's protective instinct take over?







:







:







:


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## muckemom (Jun 26, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ivan's Mom*
The more I think of this, the worse I feel for that baby. I have talked about it with my mom and my husband. We really think these people need to be reported to the child protection services. What if the baby strangled or the crib collapsed and crushed her.....or anything really. It is not right and I feel it is our duty to speak for the voiceless and protect the defenseless.

How dare these people do this.









They should be sterilized and they make me want to uke

Then report them... no harm can come of it. But to only talk about it with other people isn't helping that baby... or those people come to think of it. They obviously need parenting help and I think you would be doing them a favor by reporting this behavior. It is your responsibility as a person to doing something to stop this neglectful and hurtful cycle.

And in repsonse to PP asking if CPS has ever really done anything to help, yes. I have a friend who was always yelling at her children and smacking them.. her husband had left her with three kids under 5... I called CPS after my friend would't listen to me... they did not take the children, rather, my friend recieved counseling and parenting classes... and a "helper" (thats what the kids thought the social worker was) came by once a week, unannouced to check in. It is not the goal of CPS to rip apart families and "snatch" children... but to create more cohesive family units... and I think thats something everyone here can be on board with.


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## angelpie545 (Feb 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *freya6903*
That is so horrible.

Apparently, when my dad was a baby his dad was away at war and he was home with my grandma. When my grandad came home he didn't like my grandma feeding him at night anymore so they left my dad to cry in a crib in another room all night long. My poor grandma had to listen to it but her husband wouldn't let her resond to the crying. My dad thinks he is a "loser" because of it, and he blames that experience on his lack of confidence (my dad is NOT a loser, but you couldn't convince him of that)

When my mum told me I was so upset, I didn't realise people could actually do that. Doesn't a person's protective instinct take over?







:







:







:

If that were my husband, he'd be out in the shed with divorce papers!







:
HA! I'd lovvveee to have someone try to stop me from responding to a crying baby! Not on your life, buster!

And about what those parents are doing to that baby, it borderlines if not is child abuse. I personally consider it abuse, but I'm not sure how state agencies would consider that. Children that young and often still in need of night feedings, as baby's sleep schedules and feed schedules are so different from adults, something some parents an even some peds don't seem to get. Babies need fed on demand, when they are hungry as a general rule. Yes, sometimes there are rare health issues that sometimes are exceptions to that rule (rare obesity and certain metabolism problems) but for a baby that young he needs to be fed. Cutting of the child from important caloric intake could possibly have a very negative effect on the his growth, not to mention his mental development. Also, I believe as a safety precaution sleeping infants always need to be within earshot of a responsible adult. There are just to many variables for them not to be.


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## blsilva (Jul 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *angelpie545*
If that were my husband, he'd be out in the shed with divorce papers!







:
HA! I'd lovvveee to have someone try to stop me from responding to a crying baby! Not on your life, buster!









:
I love my husband, but there is no way he could stop me from responding to my child. Not that he would- he'd probably be there before me- he's a faster runner!


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## schellie (Oct 24, 2005)

I just cant believe people are like that. I could never put my child anywhere that I cant hear them. It was hard enough when my daughter decided she wanted to sleep on the top level of our house. We have a monitor to hear her. We live in an old farm house, that was a duplex, and we reconverted it this year to a single family house. She wanted more room for all her stuff, and a place to kinda get away. We have our play room up there, and a small office etc. Anway, Im getting off topic. How can people want to feel so unconnected to their child. What if something hapened? What if he got too hot or cold? What if he was sick or just wanted someone to hold him?> What if he got hungry? If she wanted to get away, why dont she sleep down there so someone else could tend to his needs? It just saddens me how people can treat their children with such disrespect.


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## lucidity (Jun 1, 2006)

This is one of the saddest things I have ever heard... especially with all the other stories about closets, etc.
On a related note, my mom said that my uncle (through marriage) used to be left outside to play as a baby with a playpen turned upside down on top of him like a cage. His parents were abusive and alcoholic. 50+ years later, he is abusive and alcoholic too. So sad.


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## Enudely (Jul 2, 2005)

I wish there were people out there who protect babies by law who we could report this stuff to. If someone was doing this to anyone else (elderly, disabled, etc) and just letting them scream, unattended, it would be considered abuse and subject to the law. I don't know why babies dont get the same laws applied to them.


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## Aliviasmom (Jul 24, 2006)

That's dispicable!


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## mamacatsbaby (Jul 27, 2005)

I keep thinking about that little baby and I want to







. Our place is on the small side. My DS fell asleep a bit ago in bed so I went in the next room to start dinner. About 15 minutes later I heard him cry that "Mama, where'd you go, I'm scared 'cause I don't see you!" cry and I dropped everything and immediately went to him. Once I cuddled him back into sleep I just put him on the floor in our little padded play area so that if he woke up again he could see me. How could you not go to your crying baby? That I-need-to-go-see-about-my-baby-NOW response is there for a reason. I keep checking on this thread hoping against hope that something has changed.







:


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## jet1295mamajenn (Jul 21, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amwww*
something obviously needs to happen here, for that poor baby's ske, but i just wanted to ask, has anyone actually ever seen cps do a single good for anyone? i mean, i'm sure there's some crackhead somewhere whose kids don't miss her(most likely because cps doesn't do anything and they're still living there) (a joke). in my state more kids are snatched by cps per capita than any state in the us (nebraska), and the governor and cps are under multiple lawsuits for the abuse kids suffer in the foster care system. my g-ma said she worked for foster care for hhs for like 2 years before she had to quit because of what she was seeing. the last straw for her was when a 13 yo girl was raped by her foster father.... obviously this doesn't happen every single time, and it kind of sh*ts on the options for the baby we are talking about.... the treat of calling cps might be good, if it gets the parents into therapy or something.

I have to speak up a little in defense of CPS. My husband served as a caseworker for a about a year in southwestern Penna and for a year in central NY. I know that he is not evil, he is not heartless. He had to go into HORRID situations of filth, neglect and abuse. There are real situations that take place, not just with crackheads. Those with dirty homes do not instantly lose their kids. They are given time to get the place inhabitable, but removal was a last resort. Obviously, if the child is in apparent danger, something has to be done. In many cases they try to work with the parents with counseling and other services, but if bad situations remain unchanged something HAS to be done. Most caseworkers go into the field because they want to help children. And let me tell you, it is an ungrateful, low-paying job.

My husband hated having to do what he had to do sometimes. He also hated nonsense reports coming from ex-spouses in custody disputes or ex-friends trying to hurt their former friends because it kept he and his fellow caseworkers from helping those children who really needed help. He didn't last a whole year the first time, not because he was so upset by what he had to do, but because of the awful circumstances he witnessed for the children. So, yes, CPS does good, and there are also many, many caring, loving foster parents who just want to help kids. There *are* those awful people who are just looking for the money, but there are many who truly care.

We had our own CYS issue a couple months ago and I admit I was freaked out until I learned what it was about. Our old school district in central NY called us in to the CYS here where we are now because they didn't get a hold of us for the paperwork we were supposed to turn in. We have lived here for just about a year now...how stupid is that? Anyway, we were thankfully able to provide documentation of our son's education, and the caseworker was really great and it was all unfounded, case closed. But I remember freaking out because of the negative reports I've heard. It really hurt my husband because he really WAS a good caseworker.

Anyway...just wanted to step in.

The issue here is this poor baby. I agree with PPs who have said that the sister should move to the basement. She can handle it. The baby is a BABY, and should be close to them.

JET


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## littlemama06 (Oct 29, 2005)

I am in tears,holding my sweet baby. She has never been more than three feet from me.I cant imagine anyone putting their baby in a basement.


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## mariamaroo (Aug 15, 2004)

I absolutely think someone should call CPS. Putting the baby where they can't hear him cry is unsafe, and certainly sounds like child endangerment to me. Even without worrying about the emotional damage being done to the poor baby left to cry all alone in the basement with no hope of help from his parents, the physical risks are real. Freak accidents happen and this baby's parents would never know if something fell on him, if he somehow fell or climbed out of the crib, got stuck between the bars, etc.


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## Jaydens_mom (Aug 12, 2006)

I can understand wanting you wean your child away from feeding during nights, i haven't read the whole thread to see if you posted how old the child was, but as far as i am concerned a child over 1 doesn't need to be feeding during the night. THIS IS MY OPINION however, and i don't expect people to agree with me.

On the other hand putting your child in the basement is a VERY unlogical way of going about it. If she can't stand the crying then maybe SHE should sleep in the basement. That way the dad can hear if the child starts choaking, or if anything else goes wrong while the child is sleeping, as it is unlikely they will be able to hear this if the BABY is in the BASEMENT.


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## ndunn (Mar 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jaydens_mom*
as far as i am concerned a child over 1 doesn't need to be feeding during the night. .


So at the magical age of 1 children suddenly lose their nighttime needs? All of a sudden they just magically mature into this independent creature? Sounds a bit outlandish to me. Every child is different, some children would need to night nurse until 3, who cares, they are individuals. Perhaps that child has allergies, growth issues, or comfort needs. Or perhaps *GASP* the mother is still enjoying those nighttime nursing moments with her fast growing little babe! Heaven forbid.....


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

And I thought this was about a six-month-old anyhow...


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## ndunn (Mar 22, 2006)

Ya, I know, I was just saying....







:


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

I know, I totally agree with you, btw.


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## Ivan's Mom (Jul 10, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *muckemom*
Then report them... no harm can come of it. But to only talk about it with other people isn't helping that baby... or those people come to think of it. They obviously need parenting help and I think you would be doing them a favor by reporting this behavior. It is your responsibility as a person to doing something to stop this neglectful and hurtful cycle.

And in repsonse to PP asking if CPS has ever really done anything to help, yes. I have a friend who was always yelling at her children and smacking them.. her husband had left her with three kids under 5... I called CPS after my friend would't listen to me... they did not take the children, rather, my friend recieved counseling and parenting classes... and a "helper" (thats what the kids thought the social worker was) came by once a week, unannouced to check in. It is not the goal of CPS to rip apart families and "snatch" children... but to create more cohesive family units... and I think thats something everyone here can be on board with.

Hi Muckemom,

I think you were a bit confused with this post. You directed your comment towards me and my post as if I started this thread. I did not. I cannot report these people because I do not know who they are. Believe me, nobody gets by with abusing, neglecting or harming a child on my watch. I have a big mouth and I am a huge butinsky.







No offense to the thread starter...we all deal with situations as we see fit.


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## CrunchyMamaOf3 (Apr 7, 2006)

This is making me ill! My heart is breaking for that poor baby








My littlest one is 8 months old and has only been seperated from me for about a grand total of less than two hours in her entire exsistence! I don't know how that Mama sleeps at night knowing her baby is crying for her in a basement! Sick sick!


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## Ivan's Mom (Jul 10, 2006)

Hi,

What has happened with this little baby? I still think of her even though the post was on the third page today.







I think of her each night when getting ready for bed with my precious baby who still loves to have a little mommy milk and snuggles in the family bed at 14 months old.


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## Imogen (Jul 25, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kdf*
My Dh was telling me today that last night at a football game his friend was telling him that they have put their 6 month baby in their basement b/c the mom wants to stop nighttime feeding. So she doesn't want to hear the baby cry at night so they put him in their basement all by himself. All alone. I almost started to cry when I heard this. Why would a mom do that? How could a mom do that? And why is she stopping feeding him at night? He is not a big baby I think he still needs to eat at night. Of course she is the same mom telling me that they feberized their baby and maybe we should think about it. Does this make anyone else mad hearing this?

That's absolutely shocking









What does feberized mean?


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## muckemom (Jun 26, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ivan's Mom*
Hi Muckemom,

I think you were a bit confused with this post. You directed your comment towards me and my post as if I started this thread. I did not. I cannot report these people because I do not know who they are. Believe me, nobody gets by with abusing, neglecting or harming a child on my watch. I have a big mouth and I am a huge butinsky.







No offense to the thread starter...we all deal with situations as we see fit.









Whoops... you're right!!! I was confused.. my bad!!

Sincerely,
A fellow-butinsky!


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## Enudely (Jul 2, 2005)

I still think about her too, in fact, I think dh is getting tired of hearing about it. It just breaks my heart







: Is the little babe o.k. now? (I know, probably not!)


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