# Horrible Story at Rocky Mountain Chocolate Factory Update #52



## hollyvangogh

Just saw this story on The Consumerist. This kind of thing disgusts me. Is there no human decency in the corporate retail world?

http://consumerist.com/tag/worst-cus...-front-of-them

The link pretty much sums up the events.

I've already written the company:

"One of your locations recently refused a 5 year old girl whose mother asked if she could use the restroom. This little girl had diarrhea and your employees refused to give her access to the bathroom. The poor little girl was forced to humiliate herself by defecating on herself and her mother. When the mother finally got in touch with the manager of this store the manager treated her abhorrently. You should be ashamed of your employees. If this is company policy you should be even more ashamed. No company should have a policy which forces someone, especially a child, in an emergency situation to urinate or defecate on themselves. I am asking you to quickly issue a formal apology to this mother and child. You can be sure those of us who are outraged by this will be letting people know about the incident. "They" may say that even bad publicity is a good thing but I assure you, this will not be good for Rocky Mountain Chocolate Factory."

You can get contact information here if you'd like to do the same:

http://rmcf.com/CA/HuntingtonBeach50710/


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## Mama Dragon

If I remember correctly, places that have an employees only bathroom aren't allowed, by the health department, to let anyone, for any reason, use that bathroom. My DH's aunt had a fast food place and she would have been shut down if the health department found out we'd let any of the many kids and other people use the bathroom.

That said, they deserve a complaint - why couldn't someone help them?? I would have busted my butt finding a suitable bathroom in another store, something to help out.


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## mamalisa

As awful as it is there are reasons for rules like this. Stockrooms (where employee washrooms usually are) aren't exactly safe places for little kids to be in. Our stockroom had employee coats and belongings as well as our office where the safe and company records were kept, it wasn't a place a customer belonged. Insurance companies will not cover a customer accident in a employee only area. It sucks that this happened, but I'm surely not going to lose my job over letting someone use the bathroom. Is it right? No. Is it worth it to me personally to lose my job, insurance and a good reference? Heck no, I have a family to take care of.


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## neetling

I thought that certain types of businesses HAD to provide a public bathroom. In any case, that's so so horrible for that little girl.


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## littleaugustbaby

So, she had a kid who she claims was screaming "diarrhea, diarrhea!", asked to use the restroom, was denied, and stood there _arguing_? If my kid were that desperate, I would not argue, I would bolt for the nearest public restroom. She claims she then took her to the restroom, cleaned her up, threw away some of her clothes, and then went back to argue some more? Did she take her half-naked, humiliated kid with her when she went to prove her point?


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## tboroson

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Synthea™* 
If I remember correctly, places that have an employees only bathroom aren't allowed, by the health department, to let anyone, for any reason, use that bathroom. My DH's aunt had a fast food place and she would have been shut down if the health department found out we'd let any of the many kids and other people use the bathroom.









that: A common health code is that customers are not allowed through food preparation areas under any circumstances.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *neetling* 
I thought that certain types of businesses HAD to provide a public bathroom. In any case, that's so so horrible for that little girl.

It's commonly understood that you are required to have a bathroom if you have seats and tables for customers to sit and eat. Apparently in Pennsylvania, this is not state code - all you need is a place for customers to wash their hands. But it's part of the county codes in many counties. I've never seen a Rocky Mountain Chocolate Factory with indoor seating, so I wouldn't expect them to have a public bathroom.

I don't mean to sound argumentative. I feel for that poor little girl







But, I just don't think that the store had much choice. I suspect that the entire thing happened so quickly that it wouldn't have helped if the employees had helped to locate another bathroom. I've only ever seen RMCFs at malls and outlet centers, where there are public bathrooms nearby - it sounds like this poor kid couldn't even make it that far.


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## spero

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tboroson* 
I feel for that poor little girl







But, I just don't think that the store had much choice.









I used to work in retail and under no circumstances were we allowed to let customers use the bathroom. It sucks, but it's health code and you can get fined and even shut down for violating it - esp in a food place.


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## tanya1976

I'm sorry, but I smell (excuse the pun) a desired lawsuit. Who in the hell sits and argues while their child needs a bathroom? Shady!


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## hollyvangogh

I would think having poop all over your floor would also be a health code issue but at least letting the poor kid use the bathroom would be kinder. A lot of the comments on the story (on the original site) talk about the "not allowed to issue." Apparently some places have even passed laws which override that rule stating that in an emergency you have to let people have access to the restroom.

Besides...I'm a definite lover of rules (ask anyone who knows me and they'll tell me I'm a stickler for following them) but even _I_ think that there are _some_ rules that in _some_ cases NEED to be ignored. I think this was one of those scenarios.


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## spero

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hollyvangogh* 
_I_ think that there are _some_ rules that in _some_ cases NEED to be ignored. I think this was one of those scenarios.

I suspect that the employee who might risk their job to ignore the rules might disagree with you.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tanya1976* 
I'm sorry, but I smell (excuse the pun) a desired lawsuit. Who in the hell sits and argues while their child needs a bathroom? Shady!

Gotta agree with this. If her daughter was that desperate to get to a washroom she should have been hustling their butts out the door to find a public washroom as soon as possible.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hollyvangogh* 
Besides...I'm a definite lover of rules (ask anyone who knows me and they'll tell me I'm a stickler for following them) but even _I_ think that there are _some_ rules that in _some_ cases NEED to be ignored. I think this was one of those scenarios.

So what would you have done if the employee had lost his/her job for breaking health code violations?


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## tireesix

When I worked in a pet store, customers were not allowed to use our toilets, however, in emergencies, we always allowed it. They were accompanied by at least one worker (they got to use the loo in private, we just hung round the lockers outside).

If you gottta go, you gotta go and seeing as though we were a pet store, we had lots of kids in and out and rather than allow them to have an accident (which is pretty humiliating), we 'risked' the insurance.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tireesix* 
When I worked in a pet store, customers were not allowed to use our toilets, however, in emergencies, we always allowed it. They were accompanied by at least one worker (they got to use the loo in private, we just hung round the lockers outside).

If you gottta go, you gotta go and seeing as though we were a pet store, we had lots of kids in and out and rather than allow them to have an accident (which is pretty humiliating), we 'risked' the insurance.


But I would guess that retail stores would not have to follow the same strict rules that establishments that serve food would have to follow.


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## Septagram

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hollyvangogh* 
I would think having poop all over your floor would also be a health code issue but at least letting the poor kid use the bathroom would be kinder. A lot of the comments on the story (on the original site) talk about the "not allowed to issue." Apparently some places have even passed laws which override that rule stating that in an emergency you have to let people have access to the restroom.

Besides...I'm a definite lover of rules (ask anyone who knows me and they'll tell me I'm a stickler for following them) but even _I_ think that there are _some_ rules that in _some_ cases NEED to be ignored. I think this was one of those scenarios.

You took the words right out of my mouth. I mean, seriously. How many times do you really think you'd see a child who was about to poop on themselves and turn them away? Rules or no rules, there is such a thing as decency and common sense.

Oh, and I would have argued with the employees. I would have told them what jerks they were. Probably a few other choice words not allowed by the UA.


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## mamalisa

Who gets to decide an emergency though? "Oh, but you have to let us in, it's an














_emergency_."

If they had let her use the bathroom and let's say a box fell on her then you've got people being fired for breaking rules, you have the insurance company refusing to pay costs because someone violated the rules and now the parents of the kid that had to poop suing because the company never should have allowed them in an unsafe enviroment.

Can't win.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Septagram* 
You took the words right out of my mouth. I mean, seriously. How many times do you really think you'd see a child who was about to poop on themselves and turn them away? Rules or no rules, there is such a thing as decency and common sense.

Oh, and I would have argued with the employees. I would have told them what jerks they were. Probably a few other choice words not allowed by the UA.

And in the process of agruing with the employees you would have made your daughter's urgent need for a washroom worse.

I'm sure that the employees felt bad for the little girl but probably were not in a position to risk losing their job over a health code violation.


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## aniT

Yea.. why stand there and argue? Find another bathroom. If you are in a shopping center there has to be another one nearby.

I remember once we were on a 700 mile trip. We stopped at a gas station and my 5 year old had to use the bathroom. Their public restroom was so filthy it was unusable. I asked if my 5 year old could use the employee bathroom and they refused telling me to use the one outside. I told them it was out of service and they said too bad. I had to give my 5 year old one of the babies diapers to pee in as we were in the middle of no where.









Also we used to have a computer shop. The building had one restroom and the owner wanted only "renters" to use it. He keep it locked. I always let children and pregnant woman use that bathroom anyway. You have to use a little common sense sometimes.


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## New_Natural_Mom

I emailed the store. Regardless of rules, insurance, whatnot, the manager's response was WAY out of line in my opinion. I have had to use the bathroom desperately before due to serious digestive issues. It is simply basic human decency to make an exception in emergencies.


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## Marsupialmom

I have walked in and asked if there was a bathroom and have been told no........I ask were is the closest one NOT ARGUE!! As an adult I know that not all places have bathrooms for the public. I don't wait for my options to be offered I ask.

If by codes they were suppose to have a bathroom for public then shame on them. If this is a ploy to a law suit I don't have much sympathy for mom. But reading the location description they are in the food court area. Most food courts in malls have public restrooms. Unfortunately the map doesn't state much about bathrooms (that or they only have 2 for the entire mall and there is none in the movie theater) http://www.bellaterra-hb.com/files/a..._Directory.pdf From what I see of the picture of the store and the mall this store might not have had a public restroom or one any more convenient. Many times in malls several business share bathrooms for employees or it is one small bathroom that isn't really safe to walk into. Plus if she did have diarrhea do we want to risk contamination of all the product? If anything it might be more the malls fault for not having more restrooms and/or restrooms clearly marked.

I would also think poop in the lobby would be better less product to have to throw out. Were as if you are in an area were food is openly prepared, stored, et....it all has to go.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *New_Natural_Mom* 
I emailed the store. Regardless of rules, insurance, whatnot, the manager's response was WAY out of line in my opinion. I have had to use the bathroom desperately before due to serious digestive issues. It is simply basic human decency to make an exception in emergencies.

Do we really know that's what the manager actually said, though? We're getting one side of the story, here. Also, I imagine that when the mother did call the manager, she wasn't using her friendliest behavior.


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## littleaugustbaby

Also, why did this get moved to activism? I hardly see this as an activist issue. It's kind of silly, really.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *littleaugustbaby* 
Also, why did this get moved to activism? I hardly see this as an activist issue. It's kind of silly, really.

I was wondering that too.


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## tboroson

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hollyvangogh* 
I would think having poop all over your floor would also be a health code issue but at least letting the poor kid use the bathroom would be kinder.

Board of Health codes are far, far more strict for the food prep areas than the front of the house. If she'd let loose on the floor in front of the counter, they would have needed to close down and clean up, sure... but they wouldn't have faced fines, been required to dispose of valuable product, had to submit for an inspection before they were allowed to reopen.

And people who are scraping by on a retail salary can't generally afford to stand on principle and break the rules out of sympathy. Sure, embarrassing yourself by crapping in your pants is awful for a half hour... but losing your job when you're living hand to mouth can destroy your life.


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## mamalisa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *New_Natural_Mom* 
I emailed the store. Regardless of rules, insurance, whatnot, the manager's response was WAY out of line in my opinion. I have had to use the bathroom desperately before due to serious digestive issues. It is simply basic human decency to make an exception in emergencies.

But at what cost? Because for most people a job is a necessity, not a luxury. I would never ask someone to risk their financial security for me.


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamalisa* 
But at what cost? Because for most people a job is a necessity, not a luxury. I would never ask someone to risk their financial security for me.


I agree. Clothing can be washed but if the employee loses his/her job the repercussions can be devestating. If the mom was truly that concerned about her child's immediate access to a washroom she woudn't have stayed there to argue while her child was still in desperate need of a washroom.


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## Marsupialmom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *New_Natural_Mom* 
I emailed the store. Regardless of rules, insurance, whatnot, the manager's response was WAY out of line in my opinion. I have had to use the bathroom desperately before due to serious digestive issues. It is simply basic human decency to make an exception in emergencies.

I can also sympathies with the manager because you don't know how many times in the last 9 mnths at my new job I have had to hear "I am going to sue." Our response is "That is your choice but our policy states --------". People find it is rude and want us to change at that threat. And what else can we say????????

My dd has reflux so her digestive issue is most likely the other way. I am prepared for those situation. My mom has issues with the other end and she is prepared for the worse possible situation also. There is also a little thing about teaching your child resiliency. Bad things happen (diarrhea in public place) but a good lesson to teach and help your child deal with is that the good thing is nobody she knew new! It is a learning moment on how to handle when things don't go your way.


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## diamond lil

This is terrible. My heart aches for that poor little girl. She will likely remember that incident and associate that business with pain and humiliation forever.

I've never worked in retail before, but I've allowed moms with little ones use my bathroom at a garage sale before. In my opinion, if it wasn't an emergency, they wouldn't have asked, kwim? I like to give people the benefit of the doubt.


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## prettypixels

I was always told we could let pregnant women and children use our bathrooms. And I would've regardless.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
For all of the pp talking about the Health Code Violations, please read the article.

_UPDATE: After reading some of the comments, I searched around some more to find out whether a place that serves food has to provide a bathroom to customers. As it turns out, Rocky Mountain Chocolate Factory may have violated existing California Code provisions. An organization called the American Restroom Association has a Uniform Plumbing Code that requires a "toilet facility for customers, patrons, and visitors of all mercantile and business establishments." The Uniform Public Code has been adopted by California, so it seems that there IS a requirement for businesses to provide restroom facilities for customers._

They broke the law. Simple. Period.

BTW, I own a restaurant and there is no such health code violation regarding outside persons, regardless of bathroom access or not.

And for what it is worth, let us not ASSUME that this mother had a long, protracted argument with the staff....OK









Eh, they didn't break the law. If that article is correct, and the code says that restroom facilities have to be provided, then as long as the mall provided a restroom that was accessible to the public, then the store isn't violating any code. And in any case, it would likely be the mall who was in violation if there weren't any restrooms available for customers, not the individual store.

Nobody's assuming that the mom had a long protracted argument. But FFS, if you know it's that desperate of a situation, you don't stand there and argue at all, which the mom admits to doing.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *diamond lil* 
This is terrible. My heart aches for that poor little girl. She will likely remember that incident and associate that business with pain and humiliation forever.

I wouldn't blame the business though, I'd blame her mom for making a huge deal of it. Kids have accidents. When I was 4, I had an accident in the grocery store. I'm almost 30 now and it's not like it's a traumatic experience for me to go grocery shopping, yk?


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *littleaugustbaby* 
I wouldn't blame the business though, I'd blame her mom for making a huge deal of it. Kids have accidents. When I was 4, I had an accident in the grocery store. I'm almost 30 now and it's not like it's a traumatic experience for me to go grocery shopping, yk?

Very true. If children associated every place they had an accident with pain and suffering the majority of adults would be able to go very few places. Accidents happen when you are little, no one is immune. I just don't see how the Rocky Mountain employees are responsible for this. The manager was quoted as saying that for insurance reasons they could not allow customers to use their washroom. If this is the case then I cannot fault the employees from following the rules given them. Most malls I have visited the only stores that have publis washrooms are the large anchor stores and restaurants, every other store utilizes the public washrooms. I can't imagine requiring every little store in a mall to have a public washroom.


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## Evan&Anna's_Mom

Um... Am I the only one that wonders why a mother would have a child with diarrhea at the mall to begin with? Sorry, but sick kids shouldn't be at the chocolate shop in the first place. This is, of course, assuming that this 4 YO would have used different language if this were just a sudden need to poop and that the story is accurate in its quotes. I know mine use different language for different types of bathroom needs.

While I believe that all stores should have restrooms for customers, not all do. If you have small children it is your responsibility to be prepared for their needs, not the store's. And if your child needs to use the toilet, any argument is too long because now you've put your need to argue above the child's need for a bathroom at that moment.

Accidents happen. My kids are 8 and 5 and I still carry extra clothes in the car. And I know where the bathrooms are in every mall in town and every store we frequent. I don't go back to stores where we were rudely turned away, but understand the rules as long as the employees were polite. That's my job as a parent.


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## tboroson

Says my husband the architect: "Interpretation of the code is under the jurisdiction of the local authority. They can do whatever they want." Code is not, strictly speaking, law. States, counties, municipalities can and usually do choose to interpret codes more leniently than they're written. That American Bathroom whatever-the-whosit isn't a law enforcement agency or a law making body. They are a private corporate interest that developed a set of ideas that hey! a bunch of states said, well, that sounds like a good starting place. So they took those ideas and put them into place as they would. That doesn't mean that California interprets them quite the way you do. Or that Oregon interprets them the way California does. Heck, it doesn't mean that San Fransisco interprets them the way Los Angeles does.


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
No where in the article does this state that this happened in a mall....that is your assumption. So, *if* it is an individual store, as it reads like it is, then yes, there was a law broken.

Actually it does say in the article that they were at the Bella Terra/Huntington Beach Rocky Mountain Chocolate which, based on the following statement from the Rocky Mountain Chocolate is in fact in a mall:

Quote:

We are located in the new Bella Terra Mall, a premier outdoor shopping center in Huntington Beach. We are located on the north side of the food court area, right next to Century Theaters.
I believe that another poster also referenced the layout of the mall as well.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
No where in the article does this state that this happened in a mall....that is your assumption.

Uh, it says so in the first sentence.


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## tboroson

Um, yes, it does say it was in a mall. The Bella Terre mall in Huntington Beach. Someone even posted a link to a map of the mall - the store in question was right in the food court. A food court. You know, one of those big open places with a dozen food establishments few of which have access to the back of the store, and public restrooms?

And, Mamaterra, you're in Canada. Maybe "code" works differently up there. No, I don't mean that as any kind of slight - seriously, maybe we're talking about two different ideas here. Here, "code" is kind of like law, but not quite. It's highly open to interpretation. Your code inspector is the ultimate authority, and he has a *lot* of leeway in how to interpret that code. We've been through it with building code (when we applied to build a straw bale addition to our home), I've experienced it with food/health code. Different counties and even cities are free to develop their own codes which are often more strict than those at the state or federal level. For instance, the FDA has their standard food code, but Pennsylvania modified it quite a bit when they adopted that. But we're subject to Chester County's health department inspector, who has his own set of rules. And in some places, there are municipal regulations too that may be more strict or lenient than those at the higher levels. The law says that the inspectors are charged with ensuring safety. Code gives them some general guidelines for accepted practices, but it's understood that there are infinite eventualities that can't be tidily summarized in law (buildings on the Historical Register, businesses dealing specifically in products that might be considered unsafe under other circumstances, like sprouts or smoked meats), so they're rules of thumb not hard and fast rules.


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## tboroson

I don't mean to imply that a business owner herself has the freedom to defy code at will. But she is bound to the code *as interpreted by her inspector*. If my building code inspector chose to allow me to do something against code because he felt it was reasonably safe and in the best interest of the community, that would be on his head, not mine - I did my due diligence by working with him and doing what he told me. And inspectors do take a *lot* of liberty - both on the liberal and the conservative side - of the code.

Technically you're right, the article itself doesn't mention the word "mall". But it's discussed very shortly into the comments section after the article, and that information was easily found by googling the associated words. Plus I've never seen a RMCF outside a mall.

It was in fact an outdoor mall. Not a strip mall kind of deal, though. There aren't many like it north of about Virginia, too cold for too much of the year. But I see them when I visit Arizona. And they resemble some of the luxury outlet centers that are starting to pop up around here. Even though it's open air, it is 100% mall, not "shopping center". The entire complex is protected from the parking lot, there's no traffic in the interior of the complex. The stores are close together, the aisles between stores are no wider than those at a regular mall. There generally are not large anchor stores, or if there are they will be on the periphery rather than in the center so they don't make it difficult to walk the premises and window shop.


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## uptowngirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evan&Anna's_Mom* 
Um... Am I the only one that wonders why a mother would have a child with diarrhea at the mall to begin with? Sorry, but sick kids shouldn't be at the chocolate shop in the first place. This is, of course, assuming that this 4 YO would have used different language if this were just a sudden need to poop and that the story is accurate in its quotes. I know mine use different language for different types of bathroom needs.

While I believe that all stores should have restrooms for customers, not all do. If you have small children it is your responsibility to be prepared for their needs, not the store's. And if your child needs to use the toilet, any argument is too long because now you've put your need to argue above the child's need for a bathroom at that moment.

Accidents happen. My kids are 8 and 5 and I still carry extra clothes in the car. And I know where the bathrooms are in every mall in town and every store we frequent. I don't go back to stores where we were rudely turned away, but understand the rules as long as the employees were polite. That's my job as a parent.

That's exactly what I would have written. She should have been home.


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## riverscout

This just adds to my anxiety about starting potty learning with my daughter.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tboroson* 
It was in fact an outdoor mall. Not a strip mall kind of deal, though. There aren't many like it north of about Virginia, too cold for too much of the year. But I see them when I visit Arizona. And they resemble some of the luxury outlet centers that are starting to pop up around here. Even though it's open air, it is 100% mall, not "shopping center". The entire complex is protected from the parking lot, there's no traffic in the interior of the complex. The stores are close together, the aisles between stores are no wider than those at a regular mall. There generally are not large anchor stores, or if there are they will be on the periphery rather than in the center so they don't make it difficult to walk the premises and window shop.

Most of the malls here (Southern California) are like this, especially the newer ones. It's pretty rare to find an indoor mall here, unless it's an older one. Though now we are starting to get a lot of malls where the shops are all on actual streets, and you can park on the street in front of whatever store you want to go in...similar to how cities were set up years ago. Some of the newer places are even set up to resemble the downtown areas of cities in the 1930's and 1940's.


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## ~Mamaterra~

*


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## Ellien C

so, I looked at the map - you can blow it up bigger if you have a PDF reader.

The restrooms are tucked over by Kohls and the shop in question appears to be number 57 - in the top corner - the blowout of "the Village"

Given the distance - lets' see the little red marks are "cart vendors." That's probably a regular-sized mall cart. It looks like you need to dash by 14 carts worth of space to get out of the amphitheatre, about the same to get to the amphitheatre and about twice as many to get to the rest rooms. OK - so everyone picture yourself running past 56 mall carts to get to a rest room with a kid with diarrhea, assuming you even knew where you were going. Not pretty.

Even so, I'm thinking arguing with the employee might not have been the best course of action.

I'm frequently reassuring to my 5 yo on potty runs. "You can wait - you can do it, I know you can." Then as we dash into the rest room she gets fascinated by the mirror or a new kind of sink and it's not such an emergency. Now granted, diarrhea (Sp??) is a bit different but a mother can always be reassuring. It's OK, clothes wash, we'll get you cleaned up. We're in a mall - we'll buy you new clothes if we have to. Credit cards are for JUST these kinds of emergencies. This sort of thing happens to a lot of people.


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## Demeter9

You know, this has actually happened to me.

But it never occured to me to make...uh...a big stink about it.

I was annoyed, frustrated, upset, and a bit embarassed. But things happen. Even to adults. This is one of those glamour moments of Motherhood we all dream about. But it does happen.


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## hotmamacita

I read this...

Quote:

I explained she had diarrhea and couldn't hold it and told them she was about to go on the floor. They refused again and never offered me any alternatives. I begged them to have a heart and that she was 5 but by that time she had lost it all over herself and me.
...as the mom pleading and panicked but not arguing and calloused of her daughter's plight.

I guess I just see this as happening so fast. Then on her way out, she got names and numbers and called management later.

I imagine this could have been the first time that's ever happened to her. I've never been refused a bathroom for my kids in an emergency but then again we didn't/don't go out to malls or restaurants much during my kids' younger years.

I have met many mean people who assume the worst and who go out of their way to make your life difficult so I personally wonder if this mom ran into one of those types and felt she needed to complain on principle.

Who knows.


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## Doodlebugsmom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Mamaterra~* 
Sometime, against our best laid plans or intentions, "shit happens"!









If I have had the runs at the drop of a hat, without being sick, I am sure it can happen to others.


Seriously! I can't even count the number of times I've been out somewhere, feeling as fine as can be, then cramping and diarrhea came on in seconds. There's no way I could've made it home to use the bathroom! One time when it happened, a business (convenience store) with just an "employees restroom" allowed me to use it. The dude could tell I was in distress (I was probably white as a sheet and sweating like crazy) and told me to absolutely go ahead. A little embarrassing for a 22 year-old lady to have to ask a similar-aged guy, but my other choices would've been dropping my pants outside in a suburban area or going in my pants and having to walk into the hotel with diarrhea running down my legs. (I was wearing a dress!)

So, I definitely sympathize with the mom here, but I also understand business codes that prevent the use of private restrooms to the public. I can't fault the employees here, but I think there should be common-sense exceptions to the law.


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## hollyvangogh

Here's an update:

http://consumerist.com/tag/rocky-mou...their-bathroom

Whether you think the mom should have argued or not...I think that it's clear she's not just looking for a lawsuit. When corporate offered her free product she declined. I guess you could say she's doing that so a lawsuit will be easier...but I'd like to give her the benefit of the doubt.

My other thought is this: maybe the more logical thing would have been to not argue and hurry off to somewhere more customer friendly but...when I've had bathroom emergencies thinking logically is the last thing I'm capable of. You just panic, kwim?


----------



## Kinguk

I don't buy at Rocky Mtn. Chocolate Factory because they don't use fair trade chocolate. And then there's the diarrhea incident... Yeah, not really a company I want to support...

www.HolisticMamma.blogspot.com


----------



## fork

I really don't understand how it is so hard to understand the concept of no public bathrooms. These people were in a mall, for all the time they spent begging about a bathroom they could have walked to a public one. None of the malls I've ever worked in even had an employee washroom for each store, there was one off of a service hall, and the store and employee would have caught all sorts of hell for taking customers back into a service hall. I also worked at a small convenience store. We had one restroom for employees that was in back where extra product was shelved. We made no exception to our "no public restroom" rule. I've turned away pregnant ladies, old men, kids, teens, pretty much every type of person. Not once did someone spend time arguing with me about it, they just hurried off. I have IBS, I know that the feeling can come on suddenly, and I've dropped my shopping basket and ran out of more than one store in order to find a restroom. I certainly don't get all bent out of shape and waste time arguing with someone who isn't going to let me use their toilet. Most stores have public restrooms these days, so it really doesn't take too much time to find one.


----------



## icesk8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *littleaugustbaby* 
I wouldn't blame the business though, I'd blame her mom for making a huge deal of it. Kids have accidents. When I was 4, I had an accident in the grocery store. I'm almost 30 now and it's not like it's a traumatic experience for me to go grocery shopping, yk?


I also had an accident at Target when I was 4 and really not a big deal. I am not traumatized by going back to Target I haven't even thought of it until I read this an remembered it. I think it was worse for my mom though because she was the one that had to deal with it and she was the one that had to wsh my dirty clothes. But I work in retail and we are not allowed to let people use our bathroom. Yeah it makes people mad, but hey its the rules. They put public bathrooms in malls for a reason.


----------



## Septagram

If you look at a reply on this thread there was a PP who worked out how far the closest restroom was. It was NOT close to the store in question.


----------



## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Septagram* 
If you look at a reply on this thread there was a PP who worked out how far the closest restroom was. It was NOT close to the store in question.

But if the mall is responsible for providing the public washrooms then it is not Rocky Mountain Chocolates fault that the nearest public washroom was a long walk. Honestly, even if you are at a Super Target or Costco store it can be quite a haul to the nearest washroom. What if she had been driving on the expressway and the nearest exit was a few miles down the road? Accidents happen sometimes. Chances are the child in question has moved on with her life and is suffering no ill effects of her mall accident.


----------



## Tangled Hill

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kinguk* 
I don't buy at Rocky Mtn. Chocolate Factory because they don't use fair trade chocolate. And then there's the diarrhea incident... Yeah, not really a company I want to support...

www.HolisticMamma.blogspot.com

That, and they don't pay their employees (even managers) well *at all*. Dh had an interview for a management job at a local one, and it was astounding how little they paid. So, they're definitely not getting cream of the crop workers at Rocky Mountain. Given that, the manager's behavior doesn't really surprise me all that much.


----------



## TefferTWH

I still don't see how this is the employee's or manager's fault. Your child's diarrhea is your problem, and I wouldn't expect someone to risk their job for it.

As for the PP who let someone use her bathroom at a garage sale, I did this recently and the kid crapped diarrhea ALL over my bathroom and didn't bother to clean it up or send his parents back with an apology and mop (and that was necessary). I'm sure he was upset, but I certainly was too at having someone literally sh*t all over my kindness. I'll NEVER do that again.


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## thebarkingbird

i don't think that it's horrible they refused use of the bathroom. you read what the employees boss said. how she spoke to a customer! maybe that person really needed a job. if i ever have to choose between paying my bills and letting a child have an accident sorry but you're kid's gonna need a new pair of pants.

the really horrible thing was how the woman was treated after. i mean, how bad can your customer service skills be?! even if you don't care you have to fake it as the manager. the proper response isn't "sucks to be you" it's "i am so sorry that this happened. we just really can't because ..." i'll tell my staff that should this ever happen again there's a public restroom nearby. what the hell kind of business manager doesn't know to be a bit diplomatic?


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## DahliaRW

Why was a child with Diahrrea out in public anyways? Keep your kid home if they're sick! JMO.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thebarkingbird* 
the really horrible thing was how the woman was treated after. i mean, how bad can your customer service skills be?! even if you don't care you have to fake it as the manager. the proper response isn't "sucks to be you" it's "i am so sorry that this happened. we just really can't because ..." i'll tell my staff that should this ever happen again there's a public restroom nearby. what the hell kind of business manager doesn't know to be a bit diplomatic?

Who ever said "it sucks to be you" anywhere to the woman?


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## Doodlebugsmom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DahliaRW* 
Why was a child with Diahrrea out in public anyways? Keep your kid home if they're sick! JMO.

This was discussed on the last page. Having diarrhea doesn't always mean that you're sick. I have IBS, so diarrhea can come on quickly anytime, anywhere. It has all my life. The child wasn't necessarily sick with a virus or anything.


----------



## Zach'smom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DahliaRW* 
Why was a child with Diahrrea out in public anyways? Keep your kid home if they're sick! JMO.

The child may not have been sick when they left home. Once Ds threw-up all over the place at the grocery store. He showed no signs of being sick when we left to go to the grocery store. He threw-up there and then was sick for two days afterward.


----------



## elisent

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evan&Anna's_Mom* 
Um... Am I the only one that wonders why a mother would have a child with diarrhea at the mall to begin with? Sorry, but sick kids shouldn't be at the chocolate shop in the first place. This is, of course, assuming that this 4 YO would have used different language if this were just a sudden need to poop and that the story is accurate in its quotes. I know mine use different language for different types of bathroom needs.


She might not have had any problems until that minute and it was probably the first time that day.

My entire childhood I never had a normal bowel movement. I remember being out sightseeing on vacation once when I was maybe 14 and out of nowhere the cramps and sharp stabbing pains in my stomach started. I knew I had a matter of minutes to get to a bathroom. My mother had to take me to four different stores before we found one with a public bathroom and the entire time I was terrified I wouldn't make it. A similiar thing happened to me once when driving across the state during the night. The first three gas stations we stopped at were closed and the fourth said they didn't allow the public to use their bathroom. Luckily I was able to use the pregnancy card and change their minds. I did not want to have liquid poop on the side of the road!

Turns out that I am apparently allergic to meat. Try explaining that to people! I didn't figure it out until I decided to become vegetarian and things were suddenly normal for the first time in my life.


----------



## elisent

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hotmamacita* 
I read this...

...as the mom pleading and panicked but not arguing and calloused of her daughter's plight.

I guess I just see this as happening so fast. Then on her way out, she got names and numbers and called management later.

I imagine this could have been the first time that's ever happened to her. I've never been refused a bathroom for my kids in an emergency but then again we didn't/don't go out to malls or restaurants much during my kids' younger years.

I have met many mean people who assume the worst and who go out of their way to make your life difficult so I personally wonder if this mom ran into one of those types and felt she needed to complain on principle.

Who knows.

Yeah, I read it as going fast, too. I think the employees could at least have pointed her to the nearest store that did have a public restroom. They are probably more familiar with the nearby businesses than she was.


----------



## Doodlebugsmom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elisent* 
She might not have had any problems until that minute and it was probably the first time that day.

My entire childhood I never had a normal bowel movement. I remember being out sightseeing on vacation once when I was maybe 14 and out of nowhere the cramps and sharp stabbing pains in my stomach started. I knew I had a matter of minutes to get to a bathroom. My mother had to take me to four different stores before we found one with a public bathroom and the entire time I was terrified I wouldn't make it. A similiar thing happened to me once when driving across the state during the night. The first three gas stations we stopped at were closed and the fourth said they didn't allow the public to use their bathroom. Luckily I was able to use the pregnancy card and change their minds. I did not want to have liquid poop on the side of the road!

Turns out that I am apparently allergic to meat. Try explaining that to people! I didn't figure it out until I decided to become vegetarian and things were suddenly normal for the first time in my life.

I could've written this entire post! Since becoming vegetarian and cutting out HFCS, I don't think I've had an episode.


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## highlandmum

When you see another human in need, you help. It is as simple as that. It is illegal to jaywalk, but if I saw a child croosing the street about to be hit, you can bet I would dash out to grab her. I am just amazed that all people don't feel the need to help one another, even if it breaks a rule or two. I would rather be the kind of person that wants to help others (even if it meant losing my job-seriously) than the kind of person who wouldn't. I just wouldn't be able to live with myself.
Sometimes ppl do take advantage, like another poster said, but i'd rather that happen once ina while and me still be a kind person than give up on kindness altogether.

** I edited my post b/c I thought it was a bit more inflammatory than I meant it to be***


----------



## Evan&Anna's_Mom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mallieandjoolsmum* 
When you see another human in need, you help. It is as simple as that. It is illegal to jaywalk, but if I saw a child croosing the street about to be hit, you can bet I would dash out to grab her. I am just amazed that all people don't feel the need to help one another, even if it breaks a rule or two. I would rather be the kind of person that wants to help others (even if it meant losing my job-seriously) than the kind of person who wouldn't. I just wouldn't be able to live with myself.

I think this is true for most of us, but each of us have a limit. I would certainly risk my job, and a good deal more, to help someone in a life-or-death situation. But in this case, the consequences to the girl and mother really weren't that severe. OK, she was probably embarrassed and needed some cleaning up. It didn't kill her, it didn't leave lasting scars (physical or psychological), or even cause physical pain. I'm sorry, not worth risking my family's security over. This wasn't a child about to get run over by a car. It was a child who, potentially, was going to poop her pants. Not worth getting fired over, maybe not being able to feed my child, or pay the rent or whatever. I work with people looking for jobs -- they are not easy to come by for many people right now -- even food service.


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## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mallieandjoolsmum* 
When you see another human in need, you help. It is as simple as that. It is illegal to jaywalk, but if I saw a child croosing the street about to be hit, you can bet I would dash out to grab her.

It's not illegal to rush out into the street to grab someone who's in danger. Nobody's gonna get prosecuted for doing that. But an employee and a company could face serious repercussions for letting customers into an area where food is being prepared.

For all of the people who think that the customer should have been allowed to use the restroom, I wonder, have you ever been inside a RMCF? With the way that they're set up, in order for a customer to get to the restroom, they would have to go behind the counter and into the food preparation area, which makes it potentially unsafe for other customers. If the employee had let the child behind the counter and into the back to use the restroom, then the child most likely would have had an accident in the food preparation area, which is a huge health risk, and most likely would have resulted in a financial loss for the company and for employees.


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## nwmamas

Hi, I didn't read all the responses. I was just pretty shocked that so many people here would err on the side of the rule rather than the side of kindness. This certainly does seem like an instance that would leave psychological scars, and that's really not even my line. It is sad to know that when in public, you can't count on anyone to be gentle because doing so would endanger their jobs and hence their families. That's a hard world to navigate alone, let alone with little ones in tow. I don't think the way to solve this essential problem is to defer to the original rule.


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## runes

i prefer my chocolate WITHOUT diarrhea particles, thankyouverymuch.

there is a reason why there are health codes on these kinds of things.


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## sha_lyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *fork* 
*I really don't understand how it is so hard to understand the concept of no public bathrooms. These people were in a mall, for all the time they spent begging about a bathroom they could have walked to a public one. None of the malls I've ever worked in even had an employee washroom for each store, there was one off of a service hall, and the store and employee would have caught all sorts of hell for taking customers back into a service hall.* I also worked at a small convenience store. We had one restroom for employees that was in back where extra product was shelved. We made no exception to our "no public restroom" rule. I've turned away pregnant ladies, old men, kids, teens, pretty much every type of person. Not once did someone spend time arguing with me about it, they just hurried off. I have IBS, I know that the feeling can come on suddenly, and I've dropped my shopping basket and ran out of more than one store in order to find a restroom. I certainly don't get all bent out of shape and waste time arguing with someone who isn't going to let me use their toilet. Most stores have public restrooms these days, so it really doesn't take too much time to find one.

ITA..... Having worked in a mall before, it is very likely that the chocolate store didn't even have its own bathroom, but a shared employee bathroom for all the food court vendors.


----------



## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kidspiration* 
i prefer my chocolate WITHOUT diarrhea particles, thankyouverymuch.

there is a reason why there are health codes on these kinds of things.

Yep.

Also, I would never expect an employee to risk their job so that my child can go to the bathroom. A bathroom accident lasts a short while yet a lost job can affect a person/family for much much longer.


----------



## Tangled Hill

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
ITA..... Having worked in a mall before, it is very likely that the chocolate store didn't even have its own bathroom, but a shared employee bathroom for all the food court vendors.

Did I miss this? Was the RMCF actually _*in*_ the food court? The one at our outlet mall isn't.


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## sha_lyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tangled Hill* 
Did I miss this? Was the RMCF actually _*in*_ the food court? The one at our outlet mall isn't.


post number 39

Quote:

Um, yes, it does say it was in a mall. The Bella Terre mall in Huntington Beach. *Someone even posted a link to a map of the mall - the store in question was right in the food court. A food court. You know, one of those big open places with a dozen food establishments few of which have access to the back of the store, and public restrooms?*


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## Tangled Hill

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
post number 39

Okay, yeah - that does seem a little weird.


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## TefferTWH

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nwmamas* 
Hi, I didn't read all the responses. I was just pretty shocked that so many people here would err on the side of the rule rather than the side of kindness. This certainly does seem like an instance that would leave psychological scars, and that's really not even my line. It is sad to know that when in public, you can't count on anyone to be gentle because doing so would endanger their jobs and hence their families. That's a hard world to navigate alone, let alone with little ones in tow. I don't think the way to solve this essential problem is to defer to the original rule.

I think the balance between being kind and feeding your kids is one that would tip in the favor of feeding the kids. You really cannot think that letting the child use the bathroom instead of losing it in her pants is better than the employee who allowed her violate health codes losing his or her job, can you? I mean we are talking about one bad day on the part of the child versus perhaps the ruin of a family and you'd advocate the employee potentially losing her job?


----------



## nancyw

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nwmamas* 
Hi, I didn't read all the responses. I was just pretty shocked that so many people here would err on the side of the rule rather than the side of kindness. This certainly does seem like an instance that would leave psychological scars, and that's really not even my line. It is sad to know that when in public, you can't count on anyone to be gentle because doing so would endanger their jobs and hence their families. That's a hard world to navigate alone, let alone with little ones in tow. *I don't think the way to solve this essential problem is to defer to the original rule*.

















so very very true.


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## nancyw

the 'original rule' is not child friendly, family friendly, community-caring, community-building. 'health codes' may be the reason _given_, but the rule essentially protects businesses (and allows them not to have to financially participate in this very real, very normal community need/problem), and it protects business interests more than it ever protected mine or my child's health.

Im not begrudging anyone concerned about their job. Im concerned about the bigger picture.
It really is a rather strange situation we have set up that for the most human of bodily needs, we have _vastly_ disproportionately met this need with far too few freely accessible public restrooms. it used to be easier to find a phone.....though thats changing because of cell phones. who knows, maybe they'll come up with a 'cell-potty.'


----------



## littleaugustbaby

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TefferTWH* 
I think the balance between being kind and feeding your kids is one that would tip in the favor of feeding the kids. You really cannot think that letting the child use the bathroom instead of losing it in her pants is better than the employee who allowed her violate health codes losing his or her job, can you? I mean we are talking about one bad day on the part of the child versus perhaps the ruin of a family and you'd advocate the employee potentially losing her job?

And aside from the employee losing his/her job, there's also the health issue. If the child has an accident, or even has diarrhea in the employee restroom, someone is going to have to clean it up. And there's a chance of spreading infection to the employee who is in charge of cleaning up the mess, which in turn means that infection can be spread to that employees family or roommates, and to any customers who eat food handled by the employee.


----------



## nancyw

Quote:


Originally Posted by *littleaugustbaby* 
*If the child has an accident, or even has diarrhea in the employee restroom*, someone is going to have to clean it up. And there's a chance of spreading infection to the employee......and to any customers who eat food handled by the employee.

but restaurant employees clean the 'public' restrooms in restaurants, also. same employees, same risks, same potential little girl needing a quick route and having difficulty........and this is the case every single day everywhere there are eat in restaurants with bathrooms. as far as I know, the only real difference is that places that allow public access (thankfully!!) simply put their bathrooms in an accessible place--for both employees and patrons.


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## BethSLP

they should have let the little girl use the bathroom, PERIOD. 5 year olds don't typically crap their pants in public. That's humiliating. Especially when you've made an effort to go to the bathroom and some jerk tells you no repeatedly. I can't imagine how that little girl felt.

I honestly do not understand the health code things you guys are bringing up. If employees can poo in there without breaking code, the little girl should be able to. They could have just told the mom "I'm breaking the rules here, please be sure any messes are cleaned up."

We were at a Marble Slab a few months ago and DD suddenly had to pee. They totally let us use the bathroom (even though it was otherwise not for the public). Kids should always be the exception to the "no bathroom" rule.

And ITA with what others have said. The response was horrible. Snide comments and so on. It shows me that the motivation was not a health code.

XOXO
B


----------



## BethSLP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *littleaugustbaby* 
And aside from the employee losing his/her job, there's also the health issue. If the child has an accident, or even has diarrhea in the employee restroom, someone is going to have to clean it up. And there's a chance of spreading infection to the employee who is in charge of cleaning up the mess, which in turn means that infection can be spread to that employees family or roommates, and to any customers who eat food handled by the employee.

I'd rather she have diarrhea in the toilet or bathroom than in the middle of the restaurant where people are eating. Cleaning that floor would be WAY worse.

XOXO
B


----------



## OhMeOhMy

Why can I read the complaint, but not the follow up? Is there another link?


----------



## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BethSLP* 
I'd rather she have diarrhea in the toilet or bathroom than in the middle of the restaurant where people are eating. Cleaning that floor would be WAY worse.

XOXO
B

But this isn't a restaurant in that there is nowhere in the store for customers for sit & eat. It is just a store where you purchase candy and ice cream to eat outside or in the food court. For the child to get to the bathroom they would have to walk behind the counter past the place where the fudge/chocolate dipping station/ice cream cooler to get to the bathrooms (I checked it out this past weekend when we were at our local Rocky Mountain). If a child were to have an accident on the floor behind the ounter the store would most likely have to dispose of all of the food in the area for sanitary reasons.


----------



## Evan&Anna's_Mom

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nancyw* 
the 'original rule' is not child friendly, family friendly, community-caring, community-building. 'health codes' may be the reason _given_, but the rule essentially protects businesses (and allows them not to have to financially participate in this very real, very normal community need/problem), and it protects business interests more than it ever protected mine or my child's health.

Im not begrudging anyone concerned about their job. Im concerned about the bigger picture.
It really is a rather strange situation we have set up that for the most human of bodily needs, we have _vastly_ disproportionately met this need with far too few freely accessible public restrooms. it used to be easier to find a phone.....though thats changing because of cell phones. who knows, maybe they'll come up with a 'cell-potty.'

I completely agree that the larger issue -- convenient, accessible public restrooms in or near all public places -- needs to be addressed. I think all businesses should be required to have a public restroom within a few yards of the business. And would happily vote for such a law. And that is what it would have to be -- a political movement.

But its not the place of a restaurant employee to fix the larger problem. They are constrained by the rules in place. And even a manager here is probably just a higher (not highly) paid hourly employee. They shouldn't be asked risk their security to break a rule in a specific instance like this.

Of course, there is simply no excuse for being rude about it. You can stick to the rule and be sympathetic at the same time -- most of us parents do it every day!


----------



## runes

sanitation/health code issues aside, what is this mother modeling to her child?

"when sh!t happens, find someone to blame."

not a very positive attitude to go through life with. how about a little personal responsibility?


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## SheepNumber97245

(i can't read all the responses..... i'm falling asleep)

I just wanted to say I wrote them through their website and told them i would be boycotting the company and telling others.

*Also I want to add, when I had a job, we had an employees only resteroom and it was through some doors, in the back, past the office, waaaay past anything customers should see. But when there were emergencies (twice while i worked there) that's just it. It's an emergency. You escort the customer to the bathroom. Period. Unless you want an even bigger problem on your hands.*


----------



## TCMoulton

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SheepNumber97245* 
*Also I want to add, when I had a job, we had an employees only resteroom and it was through some doors, in the back, past the office, waaaay past anything customers should see. But when there were emergencies (twice while i worked there) that's just it. It's an emergency. You escort the customer to the bathroom. Period. Unless you want an even bigger problem on your hands.*

So what would be a bigger problem - the child having an accident or you losing your job?


----------



## sha_lyn

Why couldn't the mother just take her kid to the food court bathroom? Probably closer than any bathroom the employess could access through the back.


----------



## lovingmommyhood

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nwmamas* 
Hi, I didn't read all the responses. I was just pretty shocked that so many people here would err on the side of the rule rather than the side of kindness. *This certainly does seem like an instance that would leave psychological scars,* and that's really not even my line. It is sad to know that when in public, you can't count on anyone to be gentle because doing so would endanger their jobs and hence their families. That's a hard world to navigate alone, let alone with little ones in tow. I don't think the way to solve this essential problem is to defer to the original rule.

You know what, everyone has pooped their pants at one time or another. She's not going to be scarred for that. It's part of life. You know what probably did scar her?? Her _mother_ making a public spectacle in a food court where nobody in their right mind thinks they should be allowed to go behind the counter to use the toilet!


----------



## sha_lyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lovingmommyhood* 
You know what, everyone has pooped their pants at one time or another. She's not going to be scarred for that. It's part of life. You know what probably did scar her?? Her _mother_ making a public spectacle in a food court where nobody in their right mind thinks they should be allowed to go behind the counter to use the toilet!

Maybe I should sue my grandparents estate for having a bedroom door that got stuck. I ended up pooping all over myself when I was about 6 because I couldn't open the door in time.


----------



## Cherry Alive

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
Maybe I should sue my grandparents estate for having a bedroom door that got stuck. I ended up pooping all over myself when I was about 6 because I couldn't open the door in time.

Probably a little different than going all over yourself in a small crowded store. It probably also depends a lot on the kid, too.


----------



## sha_lyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Red_Lil_Mamma* 
Probably a little different than going all over yourself in a small crowded store. It probably also depends a lot on the kid, too.


What small crowded store? From my understanding it was a counter at a food court that sells chocolates/sweets.


----------



## icesk8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
What small crowded store? From my understanding it was a counter at a food court that sells chocolates/sweets.

Idk about the RMCF that this took place in, but the one in the mall I work at is a small store. The mall is an outdoor mall and we do not have a food court I also don't think they have a public restroom, but it is next to a starbucks that DOES have a restroom, so since there are many bathroom options I don't understand what the big deal is. In my store when people have kids that have to go they give us their items they are buying to put behind the counter and they run with the kid because we don't have a public bathroom. No. Matter. What.


----------



## lovingmommyhood

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Red_Lil_Mamma* 
Probably a little different than going all over yourself in a small crowded store. It probably also depends a lot on the kid, too.

Wouldn't have went "all over herself" (more like all down her legs) at the store if her mother had just ran her to the nearest PUBLIC bathroom.


----------



## Kyamo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evan&Anna's_Mom* 
I completely agree that the larger issue -- convenient, accessible public restrooms in or near all public places -- needs to be addressed. I think all businesses should be required to have a public restroom within a few yards of the business. And would happily vote for such a law. And that is what it would have to be -- a political movement.

But its not the place of a restaurant employee to fix the larger problem. They are constrained by the rules in place. And even a manager here is probably just a higher (not highly) paid hourly employee. They shouldn't be asked risk their security to break a rule in a specific instance like this.

Of course, there is simply no excuse for being rude about it. You can stick to the rule and be sympathetic at the same time -- most of us parents do it every day!









:


----------



## savvybabygrace

Come on...I'm sure the mom wasn't standing there thinking "Hey, my kid is gonna spray this place with poo in a few moments, let me slyly work out a plan to be able to sue this place...".

NOT TO MENTION the fact that it's incredibly presumptuous to assume that everyone in this situation would be able to think quickly on their feet. I know that sometimes when I'm in a stressful situation my logic and reasoning go out the window. And if I was angry enough I sure as h*ll would have marched back to give them a piece of my mind! Where did the article say the girl was half naked? Nowhere! Give this mom a break! Why all the snarkyness about her?


----------



## lerlerler

See, I think the practical solution would work in this case...

we had a similar issue (not poop but a 3 year old with an urgent need to pee)
in an outdoor mall like that one...

the employee said "I'm not allowed to let customers back there... but the store next door is fairly lenient... Want me to hold your shopping bags while you RUN?" and then he opened the door for us and pointed the way...


----------

