# Which is harder, dogs or kids?



## saraann (Dec 1, 2006)

A childless couple that I know, and like very much, just got two dogs and they were talking to me about how hard it is to take care of them, housetraining, etc. They said that it was good preperation for having kids (I totally agree). They then told me that they had heard from lots of people that babies and kids are much easier then dogs and wanted to know if it was true, I resisted the urge to laugh and told them no that was definitely not my experience at all, kids are way harder(I have 2 dogs also). They seemd very surprised and said, "really, everyone else tells us dogs are way harder".
So what do you think, which is harder, dogs or babies?


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

How funny -- I was just discussing this on a dog board! We got our dog (Molly) first, and I'm so glad we did because it really is good training for having kids -- you have to consider someone else's needs every single time you make plans, etc.

Also, because we got Molly first, I think that getting her changed our lifestyle more than having our DS did. I know that sounds totally weird, and I'm sure that if we had had DS first and then gotten Molly I'd feel differently, but it's true! Babies aren't mobile for a good 8 months, but dogs start getting into stuff right away. I remember being a total wreck for a couple of weeks after we got Molly -- feeling like I'd become a parent overnight to this reckless, messy, destructive creature with no acclimation period.







:

Now that Molly is almost 4, she's very mellow, and now of course I'd say that my DS is "harder" (not that he's difficult, just that he requires more of my time and attention), but the dog was harder to adjust to initially.


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## katt (Nov 29, 2001)

i don't know. They each have their own special challenges and rewards.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.


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## sal42 (Feb 1, 2006)

First off, I have to say, I haven't posted since my daughter was born (8 months ago!), but I have been lurking around!








But I nearly laughed out loud when I read your post and felt the need to respond.
We have a vizsla, who is almost 6 years old, though people ask me all the time about my "puppy". He is VERY high energy, high spirited, and overly friendly and sometimes protective (of me and the baby) to the point he scares some folks. I do love him, but he does drive me nuts sometimes.
Like I mentioned, my daughter is 8 months old. She is generally a very happy baby. She naps mostly in my arms/in the sling, and I do wait to shower until my husband is home from work.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, I am somewhat tired at the end of the day, but our dog definitely causes more stress for me than our daughter. He is harder for me to handle.


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## Kewpie (Sep 21, 2004)

Had to







. Seriously there is no comparison. Kids are much, much harder! But rewards are 10x better too.


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## theatermom (Jun 5, 2006)

Well, I have three dogs (I had two of them long before having kids, and another one who was killed a few years ago; we got a puppy a year and a half ago), and while it was definitely good "training" to have the dogs, and I don't find it offensive when childless people compare having dogs to children, dogs are WAY easier than children overall.

Wrangling dogs and keeping them out of things CAN be harder at times, but really, when you think about the fact that most dogs, most of the time, can be left alone (or crated or kenneled) for at least short periods of time (small children obviously cannot), they are generally only fed once or twice a day, and trained to go out on a fairly regular and predictable schedule, there isn't really a lot of basis for comparison. All dogs have different personalities with varying reactions to stress and loneliness and food issues, but for the most part, as a group, they are far easier than children. And while I wouldn't do it except in the most extreme of cases, if you just can't handle what's going on with a dog, you do have the option of finding it a new home.

So, that's my two cents.


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## mamaduck (Mar 6, 2002)

I don't especially love dogs, so our dogs have been very hard for me simply to *tolerate.* I love my kids though, and find having them around is rewarding enough to balance the stress they create. Usually. So I guess I'm not a good person to ask. But purely in terms of work-load -- kids are harder. Dogs are mobile sooner, but they are also faster to grow up and a lot less trouble after the first year or so. Kids have more pressing needs all they way through. Also, you can put the dog in a crate when you want a break. You can't do that with a child! Or you shouldn't, anyway.


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## jeteaa (Jan 23, 2007)

kids are "harder" but dogs are more of a "inconvienece". I love both my dogs and kids. but there are so many restrictions for dogs, hotels, air travel, parks, city streets, rental cars, stores, etc. they can cost as much as kids, but you can't claim them as a dependant.


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## CalebsMama05 (Nov 26, 2005)

they are the same. I think once the kids get older tehy will be easier...dogs are like toddlers I think (with puppies of course being like babies)


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## Sharlla (Jul 14, 2005)

OMG my dog is a huge PITA, dogs are way harder.


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## Mountaingirl3 (May 21, 2005)

OMG







! Never heard that before.

I love dogs and kids (and dogs and kids playing together). But dogs harder than kids







:







: ?

Let's see, kids need to be nurtured in so many ways--from academic to spiritual. They need years of help to learn patience, responsibility, morality, inner-peace, perseverance and on and on. They need roots plus wings plus tons of life skills: drivers ed., home ec., managing money/the dangers of credit cards, social skills, swimming, biking, recycling etc. Then, there's the whole area of health education--preparing a person to be responsible for their own health, from nutrition to teeth-cleaning to sunscreen to safe sex and omg it's overwhelming . . .

This stuff is way harder, way more consequential, but also way more fulfilling than keeping dogs from chewing stuff up.


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## Ann-Marita (Sep 20, 2003)

We got our high-energy Siberian Husky, "Nikita", before we had our baby. She was very good training (especially for dh) for having a baby. She maintained her young, playful attitude well into old age. She would still get comments about "the puppy" when she was 15 years old! She died at 16.5,









While she WAS a lot of work, I'd have to say that having a child is more. You can't crate train a child (or, at least, that would be totally against our parenting style). We couldn't put the baby in a "kennel" for the duration of a vacation, or just leave her at home if we were going to be gone for a few hours. The dog had less frequent feeding and NO nursing. She house trained a lot faster than our dd potty trained. She couldn't get into cabinets, couldn't open bottles of cleaner and drink them, showed no interest in putting her "fingers" into electrical sockets, so household safety was less of an issue with the dog.

However, I feel that dogs mature to approximate a 2 to 3 year old child, in emotional terms at least. And that means that, as our dd matures, she has become less trouble than the dog. But it took her many years to get to that point.

So, I guess I'd say that the dog was less trouble than a baby or toddler, or even a young child. But that the dog was more trouble than an older child (in most ways).

(Gee, I miss Nikita! She was such a blessing in our lives.)


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## RedWine (Sep 26, 2003)

For me, dogs would be harder because I don't care that much for dogs. I wouldn't have the patience required to take care of them. I HATE dogs that continually sniff you in the crotch...it takes every ounce of self-control I have not to kick them away.







:

My kids, on the other hand, aren't a cakewalk...but they come from my husband and I. They are our beuatiful children. I can relate to them. They are PEOPLE -- I love and adore them.

So for me -- dogs are harder. But I'm not at all a dog person.


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## 2Sweeties1Angel (Jan 30, 2006)

Considering that I can kick a dog outside if it's getting on my nerves but I actually have to take care of a baby/toddler....I'm going to go with kids are harder.


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## Jessy1019 (Aug 6, 2006)

I'm going with dogs being harder and more annoying. I can take my kids anywhere I want to go, on a moment's notice. I don't have to drag them outside in the freezing cold/rain/wind/heat just so they can pee. After a few years, they're even able to get themselves food and water. And IME, they're easier to teach.

I'm not kidding. I think dogs are much more difficult and I know having one would be a much bigger inconvenience than my two kids.


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## teasdone (Jan 8, 2007)

Oh my gosh this thread cannot be for real. I seriously CANNOT FATHOM that a dog could be harder than a child. You're joking, right? This is blowing my mind. I just can't even wrap my brain around it.

The birth, the nursing, the CONSTANT NONSTOP wakeups, the tantrums, the worries, the fears, the interruptions (mom?mom?mom? hey, um, mom?), the chauffering, the bedtime routines, the bathing, the diapers, the activities, the teaching, the sticky relationship issues, the cost, the cooking, the cleanup, the pre-planning, the plane-rides, the car-trips -- seriously, SERIOUSLY: Easier than a dog? THAN A DOG???? Have you people LOST YOUR MINDS????








OK, maybe I'm just having a hard day with the kids!?!


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Kids are way harder... I don't really get how anyone could think otherwise. Maybe I'm just being obtuse.

After a year or so, a dog knows the house rules and most everything... you don't really have to worry about that too much anymore, other than some behavior problems sometimes.

With a child, it's just constant, ongoing and ever changing. I mean, dogs don't change their entire personality from 1 year to the next... dogs don't require you to constantly change the way you parent... dogs don't require you to have to reinvent all of your rules all of the time.

That said, I had dogs before I had kids and I do feel it's good preparation, AND I do feel it's kind of like having kids.

I think people who find it "offensive" that someone would say that probably consider humans to be superior beings to the other creatures on our wonderful earth.


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## mamaduck (Mar 6, 2002)

Quote:

I think people who find it "offensive" that someone would say that probably consider humans to be superior beings to the other creatures on our wonderful earth.
Oh -- no, I don't think so. I think its just that the parent:child bond is a much more intense and significant kind of thing than a owner: pet sort of bond. I'm sure that a mother dog and her puppy have something as unique and powerful as a human mama and baby... but a companionship between a dog and a person is not in the same realm as the mother:child relationship.


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## osker (Dec 4, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sal42* 
First off, I have to say, I haven't posted since my daughter was born (8 months ago!), but I have been lurking around!








But I nearly laughed out loud when I read your post and felt the need to respond.
We have a vizsla, who is almost 6 years old, though people ask me all the time about my "puppy". He is VERY high energy, high spirited, and overly friendly and sometimes protective (of me and the baby) to the point he scares some folks. I do love him, but he does drive me nuts sometimes.
Like I mentioned, my daughter is 8 months old. She is generally a very happy baby. She naps mostly in my arms/in the sling, and I do wait to shower until my husband is home from work.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, I am somewhat tired at the end of the day, but our dog definitely causes more stress for me than our daughter. He is harder for me to handle.


You mean it doesn't get better?














We have an almost 3yo Vizsla and are hoping to soon add a munchkin to the mix. Everyone told us they calm down after about four years! We've been waiting for him to calm down!
Seriously though, as a long-time nanny I can say that adjusting to a puppy was much harder than adjusting to someone else's baby. We'll see how it plays out when it's our baby and a Vizsla!!!


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## Moochie Mamma (Jan 23, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *2Sweeties1Angel* 
Considering that I can kick a dog outside if it's getting on my nerves but I actually have to take care of a baby/toddler....I'm going to go with kids are harder.









:

This thread makes me laugh- dogs easier than kids














:


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## jkpmomtoboys (Jun 1, 2004)

Honestly - what?!?!?!

I don't have to tend to my dog's emotional maturity; I don't have to worry that my dog is or isn't getting enough sleep; I don't have to manage my dog's social development, I don't have to help her maneuver through her educational experience....

And I have an Australian Kelpie so I know about high maintenance dogs...

Honestly, this thread has to be some kind of a JOKE...

Or maybe it's just a joke for those of us with older kids...


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## primjillie (May 4, 2004)

If dogs are so easy, and kids are soooo much harder, why do people get rid of their dogs and not their kids?? lol I think overall...........they are both hard!


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## oceanbaby (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.

Thank you. I agree entirely. I find it incredibly insulting. I've had dogs and I love dogs. There is no comparison.


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## BedHead (Mar 8, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kewpie* 
Had to







. Seriously there is no comparison. Kids are much, much harder! But rewards are 10x better too.

I agree entirely.


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## jillmamma (Apr 11, 2005)

Depends on the dog and kid.









My greyhound is definitely easier. She is content to run around the yard a few times a day, have her food, and then lay on the dog bed most of the day. Of course, she is always up for a walk too. She is awesome with my kids and tolerates more than she should. We adopted her as an adult (at 3 years old) after she had finished racing, so most of the training her (housebreaking, walking on a leash, being around humans, etc.) was already done.


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## jaxinsmom (Jul 24, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jillmamma* 
Depends on the dog and kid.










Exactly.

We adopted jojo (lab/collie) when ds was 18months. jojo was a year and we figured it would be an easy transition.

ummm.....







:

She (jojo) is a nervous wreck. She needs a doggie shrink. We don't have the $$







. Seriously, people come over (or walking in the street, if she can see them from the window, driving in the car) and she barks like she's going to kill them. We can't leave her with ppl ~ after barking she runs upstairs and hides. Then, when she's really scared she pees and her legs shake.

My son sleeps through the night, but the dog (who MUST be in our bed) will start scratching her collar and wake me up, or the clicky-click of her nails on our hardwood wakes me up.

My son can be left alone to watch TV or play with his toys...my dog must be attached to my freakin hip (shes under the computer desk right now).

If we want to get away for the weekend we can go to a hotel with ds, not our dog ~ and we can't leave her with ppl because of her fears... (example ~ dh is going to a confrence next month for a weekend, my first thought was "great I'll take ds and go visit my mom" ~ but I can't b/c who's going to look after jojo?







)

Im not a dog person, dh is so this has been a huge challenge for us. I think it would have been better if we had gotten her before ds came along, it would have made the transistion to parenthood easier, IMO.

As for ppl saying that being a dog owner is similar to parenting... I think the comparison is about the "loss of freedom" that comes with both. Obviously ppl who have pets do not have the SAME responsibilities as parents, but the 'lifestyle change' is similar.
-loss of mobility
-having to put someone/somethings needs ahead of your own
-learning to have patience
-unconditional love

So, every situation is different ~ our dog is nuts and Im sure not the ruler with which to measure most in this situation, but she is a lot more work than ds...seriously.


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## SquishyKitty (Jun 10, 2005)

Our jack russell was like a toddler, even when full grown. Very needy, energetic, and mischevious. Of course, human babies grow out of that stage so maybe they are easier


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## sal42 (Feb 1, 2006)

osker: You mean it doesn't get better? We have an almost 3yo Vizsla and are hoping to soon add a munchkin to the mix. Everyone told us they calm down after about four years! We've been waiting for him to calm down!

osker, while our vizsla has obviously chilled out over the years, it's only noticable to those of us who have known him since his $50 bill-eating, knocking-down-Christmas-tree- puppy days. after growing up with cocker spaniels i was quite astonished by our dog's energy level. i kept thinking after a year he'll chill out, i started thinking okay, maybe after 2 years. 3 years? i've now come to to accept him for who he is: a dog who knows what he wants and isn't afraid to go out and get it, whether that be a stick of butter on the counter, a good run in the rain, a spot on the bed, or a seat in your lap. if it helps- they are great with babies and kids!


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## Nicole77 (Oct 20, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saraann* 
They seemd very surprised and said, "really, everyone else tells us dogs are way harder".









:







:







:







:







:







:

That is the funniest thing I have heard in a long time.


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## Mountaingirl3 (May 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KristiMetz* 
That said, I had dogs before I had kids and I do feel it's good preparation, AND I do feel it's kind of like having kids.

I think people who find it "offensive" that someone would say that probably consider humans to be superior beings to the other creatures on our wonderful earth.









Maybe they feel that way. I don't consider it offensive to say that having dogs is a small hint of what living with babies or toddlers is like. But, to me, it IS offensive to say that parenting kids is just like owning dogs. We're helping our children to grow up (for 20 some years), to be healthy and to contribute in this great big world. They're our equals and will be separate people, free to make any possible argument or choice. How is this like having a pet?


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## teeny_bean (Jul 27, 2006)

This question seriously boggles my mind. Is it easier to build a friendship and relationship with an animal whose nature is very different from ours, and to communicate with one who is mostly incapable of understanding human language or interactions, and will spend its entire life in a state of dependency? Or is it easier to spend 20 years raising a human, who needs intense amounts of care, socialization, and moral guidance, but who is capable of understanding and relating to you and eventually grows up and becomes self-sufficient? Raising kids involves a far greater demand on time, emotion, and parental resources and has far greater repercussions over a far greater timeline; raising dogs involves teaching things like patience, social skills, and manners to an animal who most likely doesn't understand your attempts at communication and is capable of biting your arm off, if they feel like it.

Honestly, they're two very separate experiences, and there's simply no comparison. To me, it's not a matter of whether one is more difficult. They're just different.

I do find it really... well... thoughtless, I suppose, when people say that dogs are like starter kids. Um, yeah, whatever. The "dogs are just kids in fur suits" idea ticks me off pretty badly, to be honest.


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## siobhang (Oct 23, 2005)

what bugs me most about the question is that pets are optional and are treated by our society as such - getting rid of an unwanted pet is fairly easy - far too easy, frankly, and I am saddened by the thousands and thousands of unwanted pets abandoned by owners or born because a thoughtless owner refused to spay it. And the standards for care for a pet are MUCH lower than for a child - unless you are actually beating the animal or refusing it food, there are no requirements for how you treat your pet.

However, pets are optional. My dh and I feel no compulsion to have a pet. We have no pressure from our family to have a pet. We don't feel like a pet adds to our community in the same way a child does. In fact, we feel strongly that it would be best if we didn't own a pet, mainly because we are unwilling to put in the level of work we feel a pet deserves.

However, when children are equated with pets, children take on that air of "optional" - kids are a luxury item that people choose to have. No one gets government support for the care of their pet. When we start equating children with pets, it seems to beg the question why our government is supporting (though child tax credits, public schooling, WIC, etc) parental choices.

Any accomodations parents request to support their children are viewed in the same light as accomodations to support dogs or cats - we get "child free zones" and "adult only" venues.

Basically, children are humans. Dogs are not. Does this mean we can abuse or mistreat dogs? Of course not. However, as future adults and members of our human community, children require higher standards of care than dogs do - who will never be running a local business, elected to government, or raising future humans.


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## LeftField (Aug 2, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.

Ditto this! Sometimes, it's said in an overly optimistic way and then I think, "Wow, that person's going to be knocked on their butt when they have to feed a real human baby 6 times a night and carry it around all day long." Sometimes, it seems to be said in a genuine but childish desire to bond, almost like a kid playing house. Like, if I'm on the phone and I'm having a hard time with one of my kids in that moment, the person says, "Ugh. Fluffy is SO needy when I'm on the phone too!" In the latter case, it highly offends me that they are putting their pet on the same level of sophistication as my kid. I find the whole thing silly and annoying.


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## LeftField (Aug 2, 2002)

I don't think humans are superior, btw. I just don't see how owning a dog is like parenting a child. To use this train of logic, it would be elitist to say that parenting a human being is not the same as owning a pet gecko or a tarantula. It's just not the same!

I mean, a dog will not:
-be breastfed
-be fed 6 times a night
-be carried around and jounced on one's body all day long
-wear clothes, soil the clothes multiple times a day and require changes
-talk
-ask questions
-imitate human behavior, both good and bad
-learn how to read

I could go on. I'm not saying humans are inferior. But yeah, let's be honest. Dogs are not as sophisticated as human children. And they don't have a fraction of the same needs and wants. Sorry.


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## WeasleyMum (Feb 27, 2007)

I find it hard to believe that anyone could even compare the two. I guess, if all you are talking about is "basic training" and keeping the kids/dogs reasonably safe, then sure, there's some room for overlap and comparison.

For example if we are just talking about the first year of raising a puppy versus the first year of raising a baby, then perhaps we could compare house-breaking to diapering, whining to crying, etc.

But there is so much *more* to raising children. With a dog, after the first year or few years, they are fully grown and the "teaching" is pretty much done. By the time your dog is 3 or 4, you have a mature, adult animal that only requires basic care-- feeding, walking, etc.

Raising children takes forever, right? At what point can you look at your kids and say, "Right, well, we're finished teaching that one!" At the very least when they're old enough to finish high school, right?

As parents we teach our kids more than not to potty on the floor or chew stuff up. We are responsible for teaching them manners, morals, responsibility, empathy, everything. How can that compare to leash-training a puppy?

I have a dog that I love whole-heartedly. I call her my baby, keep her picture in my wallet. But I do not believe in any way that raising her has somehow prepared me for parenting a human baby.


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## yaM yaM (Nov 9, 2003)

Oh, yeah, sure -

A mainstay in this mama's household whenever I need a break has always been to confine the kids to the laundry room with a bowl of food on the floor. Works like a charm!

NOT!!

Ugh.







:


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## bobandjess99 (Aug 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.

Ya, that!


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## bobandjess99 (Aug 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *May May* 
Oh, yeah, sure -

A mainstay in this mama's household whenever I need a break has always been to confine the kids to the laundry room with a bowl of food on the floor. Works like a charm!

NOT!!

Ugh.







:


So...are you saying...i shouldn't lock dd in the laundry room with a bowl of food and access to the toilet?


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## Dov'sMom (Jan 24, 2007)

When I brought my son with me to school when he was 2 weeks old, my professor told me, "Oh, he's soooo cute! I know exactly how you feel about him -- I have two cats, and I just love them to pieces!"

I smiled and nodded and walked away shaking my head. Now, I've never had any pets (allergies), but I'm glad to find others in this thread who have had pets agreeing with me!


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## starlein26 (Apr 28, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saraann* 
So what do you think, which is harder, dogs or babies?

I hope this isn't a serious question...


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## LiamnEmma (Nov 20, 2001)

LOL at above post.







Babies are much harder than dogs, and it really isn't up for debate IMO.

That said, now that my babies are young children, and even moving into just being child moving toward adolescence, the dog is more difficult. I can take my kids anywhere (that I want to go anyway, except work) and it's all good. If we go on vacation though, what do we do with our dog? So she's become the more difficult one in that sense. But only in that. Otherwise, well, when you compare an animal to your child, well, it's a bit like comparing your furniture to a human isn't it? I certainly don't worry about daycare settings for that, or what school, or how much money the eventual therapy might cost (just kidding!), etc., etc.

People who say that are just ignorant. Not necessarily in a bad way. They simply don't know and so they talk out of their butts. In those instances I just laugh in a ho-HO kind of way while I think not-nice thoughts in my head and I move on. What's the point of going down that insane road?


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## oceanbaby (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:

I think people who find it "offensive" that someone would say that probably consider humans to be superior beings to the other creatures on our wonderful earth.
I find if offensive not because I believe humans are superior (although they are higher up on the chain of command, two different things in my book), but because it belittles the relationship between parent and child. Like I said, we always had dogs growing up. They were a part of our family. We loved them and treated them very well. But in no way do my feelings for my pet compare to my feelings for my child. It has nothing to do with feeling superior, it is biological. I don't think it would be natural to attach to another being more than to your own offspring. (Not that it's not possible, I'm sure it happens. But I would think that Mother Nature pretty much intended for our strongest attachment to be to our own children, otherwise many of them would be thrown out of the proverbial window.)

Also, like many have pointed out here, the level of care they require is entirely different. When's the last time you put a bowl of food on the floor for your toddler, closed the doggie gate and went to dinner? When's the last time you held your crying dog because she was picked on at the playground? When's the last time you had to seriously weigh whether or not to allow your dog to go on the overnight trip they are begging for? When's the last time you had to deal with your dog's broken heart? When's the last time you had to worry about a potential doggie-phile?

No matter how much you love your pet, it's just not the same, and implying that it is is insulting, at least to me. And it's not something I'm going to feel bad about or apologize for.


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## Jessy1019 (Aug 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamaduck* 
Oh -- no, I don't think so. I think its just that the parent:child bond is a much more intense and significant kind of thing than a owner: pet sort of bond. I'm sure that a mother dog and her puppy have something as unique and powerful as a human mama and baby... but a companionship between a dog and a person is not in the same realm as the mother:child relationship.

I think that's part of why I honestly think a dog is harder than a child. You have a naturally intense, loving connection to your children, and I think that makes them easier to cope with through the more difficult stuff (while it would be very easy to resent a dog for being an inconvenience). At least IMO.


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## Izzy's Mom (Apr 15, 2002)

I have three dogs and there's barely even a comparison in my books. I mean housetraining wasn't easy, but it was a lot easier than dealing with a 2.5 year old who doesn't want to poop on the potty. And I absolutely love my dogs but it is so not the same as the deep, overwhelming, awe-inspiring love I have for my children. With my dogs I just worried about socializing them a bit, teaching them not to chew everything in site and as they age I worry about their health. But again, not anything like the million worries a parent has about their children.


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## littlehawksmom (May 22, 2005)

I have travelled hundreds os miles with 8 dogs in a van (and 6 people) and lived in a house with 13 dogs. Also have owned a wolf.
My 2 kids are soooo much more challenging. (although the wolf was challenging as well....)
nak


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## RedWine (Sep 26, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jessy1019* 
I think that's part of why I honestly think a dog is harder than a child. You have a naturally intense, loving connection to your children, and I think that makes them easier to cope with through the more difficult stuff (while it would be very easy to resent a dog for being an inconvenience). At least IMO.

Yes, those are my thoughts exactly. You deal with the hardships of children with intensity and love, therefore dogs are harder (because they are DOGS, there isn't that intense bond you have with your children).


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## RedWine (Sep 26, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teasdone* 
Oh my gosh this thread cannot be for real. I seriously CANNOT FATHOM that a dog could be harder than a child. You're joking, right? This is blowing my mind. I just can't even wrap my brain around it.

The birth, the nursing, the CONSTANT NONSTOP wakeups, the tantrums, the worries, the fears, the interruptions (mom?mom?mom? hey, um, mom?), the chauffering, the bedtime routines, the bathing, the diapers, the activities, the teaching, the sticky relationship issues, the cost, the cooking, the cleanup, the pre-planning, the plane-rides, the car-trips -- seriously, SERIOUSLY: Easier than a dog? THAN A DOG???? Have you people LOST YOUR MINDS????








OK, maybe I'm just having a hard day with the kids!?!










Yes, all that happens with kids (and I have a VERY high-needs daughter).

However, I love my children with an immense passion. Of course I'll deal with the difficulties, they're my kids!

Dogs...? Having a dog continually try to sniff my crotch, or having a big dog continually jump up on me -- I don't LIKE dogs, that is way harder for me to deal with for 5 minutes than an entire difficult day with my kids. Seriously, I have to withstrain myself with every ounce of will power with my friends dogs. I truly want to shove them across the room or even kick them. I wouldn't, I don't really want to hurt them. But dogs are so friggin' annoying to me!!!!!


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## suzysprite (Jul 18, 2004)

I don't have children yet, but I have to say that when people scoff at the love that I have for my pets, it hurts a little bit. I firmly believe that as someone who yearns to lavish love on a child, I've transferred some of those same types of feeling to my pets. I don't know if anyone who hasn't been both infertile and a pet lover would really understand where I'm coming from on this. If I vocally compare my pets to children, I'm usually joking (I have a dry sense of humor, so it's not always obvious), and it's a way of participating in a parenting conversation without having to talk about my struggle to get pregnant. I'm quite sure that it's harder to take care of a human child than it is to raise dogs, but I don't see anything offensive in looking at our pets as substitute children. It's how many of us childless people get by.


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## BusyMommy (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LiamnEmma* 
Otherwise, well, when you compare an animal to your child, well, it's a bit like comparing your furniture to a human isn't it?

People who say that are just ignorant. Not necessarily in a bad way. They simply don't know and so they talk out of their butts.

I actually find that a little offensive.







I have kids and I have dogs. I would never ever compare my pets to furniture. I suppose, though, that if I had that attitude, I would choose not to be around animals and would certainly never have pets in my family.

Please be aware that many people love their pets and consider them to be family. I think we need to respect that we're all different and that's okay.


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## DevaMajka (Jul 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *suzysprite* 
I don't have children yet, but I have to say that when people scoff at the love that I have for my pets, it hurts a little bit. I firmly believe that as someone who yearns to lavish love on a child, I've transferred some of those same types of feeling to my pets. I don't know if anyone who hasn't been both infertile and a pet lover would really understand where I'm coming from on this.

I do think that kids are much more work than dogs. lol. A LOT. I have two dogs and one kid (but my dogs are adults and are super easy







)
The ONLY thing that I can say is easier about kids is that they can go with you anywhere. Dogs have to stay home. But then...dogs can stay home while you go out...lol
And dogs don't ask "why?...Why mom?...Why?..." etc etc etc. lol. That in and of itself is enough to make me wonder if my head might explode the next time I hear the word "why?" hehehe
I would probably tolerate more from my ds than I would from a dog, but there's really not anything to tolerate from my dogs. The only annoying thing they do is bark sometimes.

BUT I've never been offended by anyone comparing kids to dogs, or to saying their dogs are their kids, or whatever.
I ttc'ed 20 mos, and I was part of an IF board, and it seemed pretty common that those women thought of their dogs as their furry babies.
My aunt can't have kids, and her dogs are her babies. I don't even think twice when I'm talking about Keagan and she adds something about her dog. Why would I be offended? She knows that dogs aren't kids. But that doesn't change the way she feels about her dogs!!
Imo, it would be really rude to dismiss her feelings for the only "children" she can have.


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## suzysprite (Jul 18, 2004)

Thanks, Becky.


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## tiffer23 (Nov 7, 2005)

Honestly, everyone I've ever known that treated their pets like their "babies" completely changed after having a child. Yes, they still loved and cared for their pets, but "that feeling" towards their pets was gone. *shrug*

Kids are harder. No question what so ever!


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## MommytoTwo (Jun 20, 2004)

Dogs are high maintenance, sure, but you just cant compare being a dog-owner to being a parent.

I *loved* my pets before I had kids, really I would go into a burning building for them without a thought. I was a vet tech and my whole life was animals. And it all changed when I had kids. Sure I still love my pets but they are a far far distant second to my children.


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## woobysma (Apr 20, 2004)

This thread is totally cracking me up!!









When I read the OP, I thought, "well, duh, kids are harder", but now that I think about it, I'm not so sure. We have 2 dogs and they are a lot of work, but not nearly as all-consuming as the kids, not by a long shot.
BUT - I'd have to say that, while the kids take more work, I find them *easier*, actually. The bond I have with my kids makes the work easier to handle, if that makes any sense.

When the dogs come running in, tracking mud all over the house and smelling like death warmed over from rolling around in some unknown filth outside, I get much more agitated than when DS2 does the same thing, yk? (DS doesn't routinely roll in filth, but you get the picture







)

Plus, neither of my kids take dumps in public or spread last weeks garbage all over the yard


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## theAustrianchick (Mar 24, 2007)

Quote:

She knows that dogs aren't kids. But that doesn't change the way she feels about her dogs!!
Imo, it would be really rude to dismiss her feelings for the only "children" she can have.
That's why I wouldn't find a remark like the one in the post at the beginning of the thread offending. The emotional involvement for childless petowners certainly compares well to that of parents.

As to the work... I'd have to say kids. While my lab mix can be a handful (at 7 he still acts like a puppy in many ways... temperament wise), and unfortunately somewhat of a convenience in certain situations, he's also extremely easy to get his basic needs met (including the cuddling and such). With kids there IS so much more to do both physically and emotionally, and that doesn't really change as they get older.


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## 2tadpoles (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ann-Marita* 
I guess I'd say that the dog was less trouble than a baby or toddler, or even a young child. But that the dog was more trouble than an older child (in most ways).









:


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

Well your friends comments gave me a good laugh for the day.


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## 2tadpoles (Aug 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *theAustrianchick* 
While my lab mix can be a handful (at 7 he still acts like a puppy in many ways... temperament wise), and unfortunately somewhat of a convenience in certain situations, he's also extremely easy to get his basic needs met (including the cuddling and such).

I do think the answer depends upon the sort of dog and the sort of kid.

My kids are older. My 11yo is waaay high maintenance. He needs a lot of social interaction. His 15yo brother is the complete opposite. We just leave food out for him.









I grew up with big old Golden Retrievers, and they are pretty much like Labs when it comes to temperament. Not difficult at all, IMO. My current pooch is a middle-aged Chihuahua, and boy is he needy! If you look in the dictionary under "lap-dog," his picture should be next to the definition. If I'm walking around cleaning house and such, he's right next to my ankles about to get stepped on. If I sit down and he's not already in my lap, he stands there, staring and shivering, with this very quiet, anxious whine. He's also extremely finicky about food and has food allergies, as well.

He's definitely harder to deal with than my kids, most of the time.


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## Sanveann (Mar 19, 2007)

Our baby isn't born yet, so I can't answer with any sort of authority ... but I would say that unless you have a particularly nightmarish pooch, they've got to be much easier than kids, LOL! (At least judging from the ones I've babysat ...)


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## Mama Poot (Jun 12, 2006)

My sister and her husband have two dogs, no kids. They say its preparation







But the dogs might be the only "kids" they ever have .My sister has a heart condition that could make pregnancy very dangerous. She is scared to TTC and they are not planning to any time soon. Honestly I'm gonna say kids are easier. I had a miniature pincer who would not housebreak and demanded to be let out at 5am every morning. My 7 month old sleeps longer than she did! Whenever my dad and stepmom visit they always say "well we better get back home, doggies need to be let out". At least you can potty train a child. Scooping up doggie doo out of the yard, well- stinks! I'd rather be washing diapers


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## StrawberryFields (Apr 6, 2005)

We have a dog and a baby. I think that there are unique challenges and frustrations in taking care of my dog, and unique challenges and frustrations in raising my son. Is one more difficult than the other? I don't know. There are things that are easier to do with my ds, and there are things that are easier to do with my dog. But I do think that making a lifelong commitment to a companion animal, standing by him/her during illness, training, teaching, feeding, washing, brushing, etc., etc., while not comparable to the level of love and dedication you have for your child, can open your eyes to what it is like to be responsible for the nurturing and care of a being other than yourself.

One could argue that if actions speak louder than words, I have apparently decided that a dog is harder than a baby since this will be our last dog for a looong time, while we do intend on having at least one other child.







And I would never have a puppy again.


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## mamadawg (Jun 23, 2004)

Babies, hands down.


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## LiamnEmma (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:

Please be aware that many people love their pets and consider them to be family. I think we need to respect that we're all different and that's okay.
I guess that makes us even, because I find this offensive.

I have a dog. A very well loved and well cared for dog. So well loved and cared for that, oh forget it, I'm not going to justify myself.

My point with the comparison was to say that there is no real analogy in comparing caring for an animal and caring for a human being. I was not saying that a dog is akin to a piece of furniture. In fact, a more careful read of the remaining bit of my post in theory would have let a person know that I don't think this is the case since I talked about worrying about my dog.


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## amitymama (Nov 17, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *suzysprite* 
I don't have children yet, but I have to say that when people scoff at the love that I have for my pets, it hurts a little bit. I firmly believe that as someone who yearns to lavish love on a child, I've transferred some of those same types of feeling to my pets. I don't know if anyone who hasn't been both infertile and a pet lover would really understand where I'm coming from on this. If I vocally compare my pets to children, I'm usually joking (I have a dry sense of humor, so it's not always obvious), and it's a way of participating in a parenting conversation without having to talk about my struggle to get pregnant. I'm quite sure that it's harder to take care of a human child than it is to raise dogs, but I don't see anything offensive in looking at our pets as substitute children. It's how many of us childless people get by.

I can completely empathize with that, I know people who have had fertility issues and weren't able to have children. Their pets became their 'kids'. And that is completely okay by me. They've latched on to their love for their pets because they desperately want to care for and 'raise' another being, to feel that they have brought up a well-mannered and pleasant animal (human or canine) that brings them, and others, joy. So I understand where you're coming from.

The thing I don't understand, however, is how those who are adamantly childfree, bordering on child haters, also have pets and refer to them as their 'kids'. It doesn't make sense to me! I thought their whole line of reasoning for not wanting kids is that they're too expensive, time-consuming, needy, etc.. but yet they treat their pets as 'kids' and lavish all kinds of attention and money on them and reschedule their lives around their pets. It boggles my mind that they don't see the irony in that!







:


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## maxsmum (Nov 29, 2006)

my dog is harder, so much harder...


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## becoming (Apr 11, 2003)

DOGS. (Assuming the dogs live inside the house.)

We got a puppy around Christmastime that we were going to keep in the house, and I literally cried every day for three weeks before deciding she HAD to go outside. It was infinitely more stressful dealing with a dog than with my children.

Of course, the role of parenting an actual human being is much greater than the responsibility of taking care of a pet, but on a day-to-day level, dogs are much more stressful, at least in my opinion/experience.


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## Sanveann (Mar 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *becoming* 
DOGS. (Assuming the dogs live inside the house.)

We got a puppy around Christmastime that we were going to keep in the house, and I literally cried every day for three weeks before deciding she HAD to go outside. It was infinitely more stressful dealing with a dog than with my children.

Of course, the role of parenting an actual human being is much greater than the responsibility of taking care of a pet, but on a day-to-day level, dogs are much more stressful, at least in my opinion/experience.

What was she doing that was so stressful? Anything she could possibly outgrow or get training for? Living outside really is not idea for dogs ... they need to be with their "pack," and some can get pretty neurotic when isolated.


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## artgoddess (Jun 29, 2004)

No one is ever going to hand the keys to the car to their 17 year old Labrador retriever tell them to have a nice evening an be a nervous wreck all night long, waiting to hear them open that front door and be home safe and sound.


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## LotusBirthMama (Jun 25, 2005)

I had to chuckle when I saw this thread. I was just thinking back to my premarital counseling sessions. We spent the whole five weeks arguing about how we treated the dogs (no kids yet). I would just sob because he wasn't as patient and as loving as I was...

I imagine our therapist thought we were nuts...

As to which is harder..I think it depends on the dog and the baby. My dog was much easier to handle then my DD...my sister's dog was more difficult then her babe...


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## 2bluefish (Apr 27, 2006)

Puppies are harder than infants (I can't nurse them when they whine, infants don't destroy most things when they chew on them, I don't have to potty train a baby). But children are harder than dogs (assuming you taught your puppy well).


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## Daffodil (Aug 30, 2003)

I'm surprised anyone would say kids are easier. I used to have a border collie. She was a super high energy dog with some quirky fears who was obsessed with playing fetch - not an easy dog by any means. But she fit into my life easily. Having a baby dramatically changed my day-to-day life in a way no dog ever could. There are all kinds of things I love that have become nearly impossible for me ever to do since having kids. I can't leave the kids in the house alone while I go rollerblading or visit a bookstore, or leave them with relatives while I travel overseas, or take them along on wilderness backpacking trips, the way I used to do with my dog.


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## PrennaMama (Oct 10, 2005)

Haven't read many of the posts...
I think it's a tie, in some respects...

Dogs are harder on the household, physically, for longer, I think, & can do more damage; big dogs being especially difficult just on a an immediate level. Ex: putting the dog out before guests arrive so she doesn't wake the baby barking when the bell rings, making sure the house is DOG proofed and/or kennel training, house-breaking, etc... all of these things required for me a bit more energy than raising my babe does. But _long term_ the dog kinda learns, and that's that, she goes on auto pilot, I don't have to make adjustments to my style, maintain a secure attachment by tweaking my practices throughout the years, and adapt my life around her changing personality the way we do with kids... dogs are dogs, and past puppy-hood, it's much easier to manage the doggy status quo.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

I used to hang out at a lot of dogs park before ds was born.

I have yet to hear anyone mention how their libido just isn't what it used to be before adopting their pet, because they are too tired and feeling touched out by the end of the day.

Yea, I'd laugh if someone told me that. No disrespect to animal lovers. Our dog is part of our family too. But he's never made my nipples bleed, or had me to the brink of insanity with sleep deprivation.


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## Diane B (Mar 15, 2004)

This thread brings to mind the following story, which I hope that someone besides me finds funny...our childless neighbors adopted an Akita last year from a rescue organization. They had to provide SIX letters of reference. When we adopted our daughter, we were only required to have THREE.

They do seem to be very good "parents" to their dog, by the way...


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## Lady Madonna (Jul 2, 2004)

Really, it depends on when you ask me ... there are moments when I swear the dog will be the death of me! But generally, kids are harder. If nothing else, you can go out and leave a dog home alone. Not so much an option with the kids, you know?


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## Shahbazin (Aug 3, 2006)

I think they're each difficult in their own way; dogs can be pretty intense for the 1st couple of years, & they'll always be dependant on you, whereas kids have a much longer dependency period, yet eventually grow up









FWIW, I was there for the entire birth process of each of my current 3 personal dogs (DH's was a "foundling"), taking their dams to the fertility clinic for cooled semen AI (sires were out of state), did CPR on puppies born limp, slept by the whelping box for about 3 months, was constantly washing dirty bedding, mixing baby cereal & goat's milk for weeks to supplement (& wiping it off 8-10 big fuzzy puppies), was up at every squeak to make sure mamma didn't roll on one (100 lb mom - 1 1/2 lb pups), walking momma dog evey few hours through the night (the metabolic rate is incredible, & right after birth, you're not only wiping lochia off the mom, she often has loose stools), soaked my & visitors' footwear in bleach to avoid Parvo virus, screened homes, kept in touch w/new owners, worried about health screening results, chauffered pups to obed. class & conformation class 2x/week (after work, an hour's drive each way, for at least a year), trained daily (rain or shine) for 1st 2 years, took them to matches or shows on weekends (often hours away, sometimes on plane flights), emergency vet bills, hurrying home after work to take care of them, DH & I never went on trips together (because someone had to stay & take care of the pets); not exactly like children, but certainly good preparation, I think


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## Needle in the Hay (Sep 16, 2006)

Go easy on childless couples & their "babies". My DS was born just before our dog turned 2. Before that, our dog (lab mix) was our baby. The thought of her dying one day was too much to bear and it was hard to imagine loving a child more (even though I knew I would I just couldn't imagine what it would feel like). At the time she filled our hearts and she was good preparation for having a child. We were already used to planning our lives around someone besides ourselves and that is probably one of the biggest adjustments when having a child that we didn't really have to make.

My DS as a baby and toddler was harder than my dog as a puppy but both were enjoyable. At this point I think getting a cat would be more trouble than having another baby! My DS loves cats (and I do too) and would love it if we got one, but they don't travel well and we take our dog almost everywhere we go. I'll take being up with a baby over trying to arrange cat care every other weekend & constantly worrying about the cat getting out any day!


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## Calidris (Apr 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *artgoddess* 
No one is ever going to hand the keys to the car to their 17 year old Labrador retriever tell them to have a nice evening an be a nervous wreck all night long, waiting to hear them open that front door and be home safe and sound.

Thank you Art - I was just reading thru this thread shaking my head in confusion.







:


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## GranoLLLy-girl (Mar 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeteaa* 
kids are "harder" but dogs are more of a "inconvienece". I love both my dogs and kids. but there are so many restrictions for dogs, hotels, air travel, parks, city streets, rental cars, stores, etc. they can cost as much as kids, but you can't claim them as a dependant.

I agree with this. I can't take my dogs to public places but I can take my kids (although some folks would argue children shouldn't be in certain public places either). It's much harder to find a place for the dogs when it comes to vacations (usually they end up at grandma's and that is an entirely different issue)--of course, the kids are harder _during_ the vacation with us! LOL!
In the end, it would depend on the nature and temperment of the dogs, kids and adult owner/parent as well as the lifestyle.


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## Hazelnut (Sep 14, 2005)

ITA. I thought I loved my cat til I had kids. If you have both and want to offer up that opinion, that it's the same amount of involvement or love, then I don't really care. (although without the need for daycare or a sahp, you'd have trouble convincing me







) But I really hate when people who don't have kids make the comparison and then get all whipped up when people with kids tell them how offensive that is. I'm not telling you you don't love your pet and that they're not a lot of work But ime it's always the pet people making the comparison in some effort to justify their pet love, and I find it a pointless and even offensive comparison.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.


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## Mountaingirl3 (May 21, 2005)

Maybe it's all in people's definition of "harder". I took it to mean "a greater spiritual challenge, a bigger responsibility, deeper and ever-evolving committment". Others are thinking of "more hassle, more frustrating".

To me, the offensiveness of the dog/child comparison is NOT about the love or the bond or the nurturing. It's about the recognition that children should never, in any way, be owned or subjected to the inherent and permanent inequality of a person/pet relationship.


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## Daffodil (Aug 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mountaingirl3* 
Maybe it's all in people's definition of "harder". I took it to mean "a greater spiritual challenge, a bigger responsibility, deeper and ever-evolving committment". Others are thinking of "more hassle, more frustrating".

By either of those definitions, I see kids as way harder.


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## sunbaby (Sep 30, 2002)

i find it offensive when people who dont have kids compare having a dog to having a kid, because there is no way they could know. even if they have babysat for five million hours, it is not the same as having your own kid.
i dont think id be very bothered by someone who has kids saying their dog is harder, because they are speaking for themselves, and thats ok with me. but really, i have never known anyone irl who has kids and claims their dog is harder.
and i honestly dont think its about a deeper bond with child/parent vs. animal/human. i had a really deep bond with a cat for 17 years, and y'all are going to think i've gone off the deep end, but i'm not sure i loved him less than i love my kids. but kids are way more complex, and their lives will last longer and have a greater impact on the world than any other animal i can think of. and stuff like, a cat i can leave with my mom for a year, and he might really miss me, and i him, but i think once i return, he will be the same cat he ever was. not so with a kid. those kind of choices shape them forever, and they are my resonsibility, and will effect my grandkids, and their grandkids,etc. hmm, maybe that is the deeper bond pp mentioned. not exactly just a love bond, but a biological bond, too. yep. way harder.


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## Hazelnut (Sep 14, 2005)

That is the best sig I've seen all day.


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## queenjane (May 17, 2004)

Most dogs i have had have been harder than my child (who is 10 now) at any point in his development. Esp when he was a baby....soooo easy to tote him around in a sling, nurse, etc, i didnt really find it much of a challenge at all. Toddlerhood/preschool age was a lot more challenging than his babyhood, but in retrospect it was because i wasnt parenting him properly (didnt really respect his high energy "spirited" ways)...now, at age 10...i would say its very easy.

I found housebreaking a dog, having to be home at a certain time each day to make sure it got walked, keeping the dog from getting into the trash or eating the couch, coping with the crying if the dog wasnt crate trained and i was trying to do that, peeing on the carpet, etc etc.....just so much harder than anything i've had to do as a parent.

Honestly, i read on an email list recently (for hopeful adoptive parents), someone wrote "Whether its a bio child or an adopted one, parenting is hard..." and i was scratching my head. I dont find it hard at all. Maybe if i was juggling several children spaced closely together or something...ok i could see that....but as it is now, no. Not hard. And i'm a single mom too!

Katherine


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## Mountaingirl3 (May 21, 2005)

I could be wrong--you might find more kids just as easy--but I'm going to say that easy parenting stops with the second pregnancy or second adoption process. (ftr, I personally found just one child challenging, but she was high-needs and I got pg when she was 10 months.)

I have a friend who doesn't get why I have no left-over energy, or why my life with three kids isn't as organized and Zen as her life with one. I asked her to imagine all the time, thought, effort, concern and nurturing she puts into her daughter and then triple it!


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## 2bluefish (Apr 27, 2006)

1 high need kid is enough to break anybody. At least I can put the dog outside.


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## PrennaMama (Oct 10, 2005)

I gotta say, Prenna's God Mother is The Dog Lady... she works for the county and does animal rescue (I don't just mean rescue from neglect or homelessness, girl is trained to rappel (sp?) down a cliff to rescue a dog/cat/goat...) and has a "pack" of five dogs, 2 ferrets, a cat and a bird. And she has had more trips to the vet e.r. in the 2 years that dd has been alive than any parent I know, with puntured eyes, torn ears, etc.... She stayed up all night "nursing" her husky pups with bottles (their mother, I think, had been killed, orphaning them) for weeks, and then was still up all night, trying to kennel train and poopie train, etc, for months. She regularly has to take some of them, or all of them in to work with her, if it's gonna be a long day, (the doggie version of day care while she's on calls...) and loses more sleep than I do, worrying about them if there's trouble, or whatever. She is definitely a Dog-Mom, and I think she'd chaff at anyone suggesting that her job as Dog-Mom is easier or less rewarding or less valid than being a Baby-Mom. (I smirk sometimes, inside, when she talks about how she doesn't intend to have children, seeing all the animals she sincerely mothers...)

Granted, as *artgoddess* put it (I think) she's not goona be giving any of the "pack" the keys to the car, etc... but I don't think she worries less than I do... just differently.


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## UUMom (Nov 14, 2002)

I find my children far more challenging than my dogs.


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## colobus237 (Feb 2, 2004)

Um, babies. The level of total responsibility for a human being with 24hour needs doesn't compare with having a dog at all. But I certainly do believe humans are superior to dogs by any measure that I find significant, and though we have pets whom we care for conscientiously, I don't consider them to be 'family members' let alone equivalent to my children.


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## lolalola (Aug 1, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ccohenou* 
Um, babies. The level of total responsibility for a human being with 24hour needs doesn't compare with having a dog at all. But I certainly do believe humans are superior to dogs by any measure that I find significant, and though we have pets whom we care for conscientiously, I don't consider them to be 'family members' let alone equivalent to my children.

ITA with this.


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## North_Of_60 (May 30, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.

Huh. How weird. What part of it is disturbing and offensive?









I have three dogs, two of which are Jack Russells, and to anyone who knows the breed, I don't need to elaborate. But for those who don't, they are never ending balls of inquisitive energy. To say "oh yeah but you can crate them and leave them alone for a little while".. HAHAHAHA!! That's funny. Um, no you can't. This is NOT a breed that can simply be crated and left alone. Reliably. They need constant supervision, and to be left alone they need to be well fed, well exercised, well trained, and well stimulated.

My two jack russells are by far harder then having a child. When Rhino was an only Jack I wouldn't have thought so, but two of them.. oh my word!

I can communicate with my child now. I'll NEVER be able to communicate with my dogs. My daughter will eventually be potty trained. I will ALWAYS have to walk my dogs in the rain, both of them tangling me up and tripping me, in the middle of the night. Their life expectancy is 15 years. I'd rather change a diaper that takes all of 3 minutes, instead of walking down the side of the road in the pissing down rain until Rhino finds the "perfect spot" to have a dump, then get down with the flash light, find it, bag it, then carry it back while trying to manage two small, and FAST dogs on a leash while holding a bag of warm crap. Potty training with kids happens around what, 2? 3? Um, yeah, I have 12 years of poop patrol left. Sorry you're offended by that.
















ETA: And, my daughter is high needs. Has slept a handful of times on her own, nurses every 2 hours still at a year old, always wants me with her, etc, and I STILL think my dogs are hard work. This is saying a lot about my dogs if I think they are harder then my baby.


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## bri276 (Mar 24, 2005)

After reading this thread, I'm sure glad I have cats. And only one child.


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## jkpmomtoboys (Jun 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *North_Of_60* 
Huh. How weird. What part of it is disturbing and offensive?









I have three dogs, two of which are Jack Russells, and to anyone who knows the breed, I don't need to elaborate. But for those who don't, they are never ending balls of inquisitive energy. To say "oh yeah but you can crate them and leave them alone for a little while".. HAHAHAHA!! That's funny. Um, no you can't. This is NOT a breed that can simply be crated and left alone. Reliably. They need constant supervision, and to be left alone they need to be well fed, well exercised, well trained, and well stimulated.

My two jack russells are by far harder then having a child. When Rhino was an only Jack I wouldn't have thought so, but two of them.. oh my word!

I can communicate with my child now. I'll NEVER be able to communicate with my dogs. My daughter will eventually be potty trained. I will ALWAYS have to walk my dogs in the rain, both of them tangling me up and tripping me, in the middle of the night. Their life expectancy is 15 years. I'd rather change a diaper that takes all of 3 minutes, instead of walking down the side of the road in the pissing down rain until Rhino finds the "perfect spot" to have a dump, then get down with the flash light, find it, bag it, then carry it back while trying to manage two small, and FAST dogs on a leash while holding a bag of warm crap. Potty training with kids happens around what, 2? 3? Um, yeah, I have 12 years of poop patrol left. Sorry you're offended by that.
















ETA: And, my daughter is high needs. Has slept a handful of times on her own, nurses every 2 hours still at a year old, always wants me with her, etc, and I STILL think my dogs are hard work. This is saying a lot about my dogs if I think they are harder then my baby.


Your post reminds me of earlier when I said that no one with older kids would say that dogs are harder than kids. They may be harder than your baby but wait until your baby gets older...no comparison.


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## Sylith (Apr 15, 2002)

Wow, I must be doing something wrong, because I have two dogs and two kids, and there is just *no* comparison. Every day I go to lengths for my children that I would never tolerate for a pet.


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## BelgianSheepDog (Mar 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hazelnut* 
ITA. I thought I loved my cat til I had kids.

Word. But I say this to my friends who haven't had kids yet, but plan to--and who are big time cat people--and they look at me like "omg...she's actually satan, and we never knew." It's seriously like sacrilege to suggest to them that they will not always hold Fluffy in the same regard.

I found that I got (possibly too many) cats as a baby substitute. Now they are way lower on my totem poll. Of course I still feed them, love them, and put up with their infuriating antics, including a raging turf war at the moment. But they are nowhere NEAR as important. When I was pregnant I would stress about what I would do if I had to choose between the pets and my baby. What if she has horrible cat allergies, what if there's a fire...I cringe to think I ever thought it was an issue. My child wins, hands down, every time. Sorry, kitties.

The dog still holds a softer spot in my heart, but still NOTHING like the massive, flaming love and protectiveness for my daughter.

As for ease, phhhhbt. Wow. My dog has never once had a three alarm poop on my sweater at three am while running a fever and biting my nipples and trying to crawl off the end of the bed. We taught her all the commands she knows in less than a month and we can leave her for 8 hours with a water bowl and some toys.


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## Silvercrest79 (Jan 20, 2004)

Dogs are a total PIA but not nearly as much work as my kids.

My dogs are loved but they are just dogs and if push came to shove I could find them another loving home. My kids are human and will demand from me everything I have until the day I die and I could and would never give them up.


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## mamallama (Nov 22, 2001)

The question "which is harder, dogs or kids?" is ambiguous. If the question is who has greater needs, obviously, it's the kids. In that sense, kids are "harder."

If the question is "whose needs are more difficult to meet?" My answer is the dog's--thus dogs are "harder."

Everyone I would trust to care for my dogs, I would also trust to care for my kids. There are many people I trust with my kids, but I'd never leave my dogs in their care.

My mom is an excellent example. She's a fabulous grandmother. She takes great care of my kids. Her dog has only left his backyard chain a handful of times in the past decade. There's no way I'd ever ask her to care for my dogs.

I know so many people who have dogs who shouldn't (like my mom.) I know lots of people who parent differently than I do, but I wouldn't say that any of them shouldn't have had children.

What I'm saying is that its pretty easy to put the needs of a child in an appropriate place in the household heirarchy. Obviously, the kids deserve a high rank. It's much more difficult for some folks to provide appropriate care for a dog. Afterall, it's just a dog.







:


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## feminist~mama (Mar 6, 2002)

Okay, I didn't read all six pages of posts.

Dogs never grow up. You always have to feed them. You always have to clean up after them. They never learn to bathe themselves.

I'm not a pet person, can you tell? My DP came with 3 dogs. It's been an adjustment.


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## Snowdrift (Oct 15, 2005)

A childless friend of mine, when DD was tiny and I was having a hard time getting schoolwork done, he tried to advise on the basis of his 11 years of cat ownership. I was not amused.


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## Finch (Mar 4, 2005)

: <--- my response to the couple mentioned in the OP.

My dog can be put in her kennel when she misbehaves or is not associating well with visitors in our home. My dog can be sent to the vet's for a week if we are going on vacation and it would be too difficult to take her along. My dog feeds herself, all I have to do is set down the food and she eats it. My dog is potty trained, all I have to do is open the door and let her outside and she does her business. My dog listens consistently when I say "no," and generally does as she is told. When my dog is tired, she curls up on her bed and goes to sleep.

My son...well....let's see. When he is misbehaving or not dealing well with visitors in our home, we have to deal with the tantrum and misbehavior head on, we cannot simply lock him in his room for the duration of the visit or until the misbehavior ends. When we go on vacation, we cannot send my son to the pediatrician's office to be boarded for a week. My son cannot feed himself. My son is not potty trained. My son does not listen to "no" consistently, and he most certainly doesn't do as he is told all the time







. When my son is tired, he cries/whines/is generally crabby and needs me to hold him and rock him down in a very specific environment, and must sleep with a special blanket in a dark room with white noise.

If my kid were as easy as my dog, I'd have had at least 2 more kids by now. LOL.


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## jtbuko (Sep 28, 2006)

I stopped reading after a few pages, but just have this vision of nursing a puppy...

=
dogs & kids are equally, but differently destructive (dog ate mattress, kids broke window)
both have ways of taking over your bed

dog harder
can't bring on subway
health insurance not covered by work
shorter lifespan means grieving over dead dog likely every 1-2 decades if you always have one. that sucks.

kids harder
nurse all day as babes
can't be left home alone for at least a decade
colic, colic, colic

end comparison, really must get some things done!


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## North_Of_60 (May 30, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jkpmomtoboys* 
Your post reminds me of earlier when I said that no one with older kids would say that dogs are harder than kids. They may be harder than your baby but wait until your baby gets older...no comparison.

Good point. So let me rephrase that... right NOW my dog*S* are harder.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamallama* 
The question "which is harder, dogs or kids?" is ambiguous. If the question is who has greater needs, obviously, it's the kids. In that sense, kids are "harder."

If the question is "whose needs are more difficult to meet?" My answer is the dog's--thus dogs are "harder.":

Very well said. I guess in actuality there are certain aspects of each that are easier. And harder. And like you very clearly illustrated, the needs of each are very different, and very difficult to compare.


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## Crisstiana (Jan 18, 2007)

Ok, here's my comparison of my unruly Humane Society hound dog and my 6-month old twins:

Barfs on the floor: Both dog and both babies
Barfs on me: Dog (once), babies (often)

Knows where to go to the bathroom: Dog
Has gone to the bathroom on the floor: Both
Has gone to the bathroom on me: Babies

Whines: Both
Cries: Both (dog howls when babies cries)
Barks: Dog and son

Understands basic commands: Dog
Follows basic commands: None of them

It's a pretty close race but the babies outnumber me while the dog is a fair fight: babies are harder.


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## woobysma (Apr 20, 2004)

Crisstiana....


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## lovingmommyhood (Jul 28, 2006)

Kids are much harder.


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