# running out of room (straps)on carseat (UPDATE POST 38)



## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

Okay so my daughter is 5 years 3 months. She weighs 38pounds. But she is running out of room (length) on the straps of the carseat. My understanding is that she has to stay in this seat until 40 pounds. I also want to mention she is wearing winter clothes....which take up room. It could take another year to gain 2 pounds....

Did I misunderstand the carseat guidelines?

I thought the infant seat was 22 pounds and at least one year old. BUT the other day I saw a 6 month old in a forward facing seat...both my daughters were well over a year old.

Alot of my friends have children the same age and they switched to boosters at 30 pounds.

I am in Canada.

Can someone clarify this for me????


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Which seat is your child riding in? She can stay in it as long as she's under 40 pounds (fully dressed) AND her shoulders are under the top slot AND her ears are contained within the shell.

Depending on which seat she's in she may have outgrown it by height a while ago.

Infant carriers generally are marked for 22-35 lbs depending on the brand and style.

Absolutely no six month old should EVER be forward facing.

And actually, neither should a one year old. Children need to remain in rear facing convertibles until they outgrow them (which is 3 to 4 years). Choose a convertible that easily accomodates an older child like the Graco My Ride (which will actually fits kids from birth) Sunshine Kids' Radians (also fits kids from birth) or the First Years True Fit.


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## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

Being in Canada affects the seats you have available to keep her as safe as possible.

Safe as possible means you'll have her, in order:
rearfacing (until the limits of the seat, and buy a new seat with higher limits if your child is under 3)

forward facing in a harness (until the limits of the seat, buy a new seat if she can't sit up straight consistently)

forward facing in a booster (until she can legally be in a seatbelt alone and passes the 5-step test)

using a seatbelt

That said, in your specific situation now, if her clothes are affecting how her seat fits, they're too bulky for using in the car. Get her some thinner insulating layers and just plan to take an extra 15 minutes to get into the car until winter's over so you can take off her poofy coat and sweaters before you buckle her in.

Your friend who turned her LO at 6months was criminally irresponsible.


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## bandgeek (Sep 12, 2006)

She may have outgrown the seat, like maedze said. We can help you pick out a new seat if you are interested.

And no, 6 month olds shouldn't be ff'ing ever. What you saw was very, very dangerous.

A child should only be switched to a booster once they are at least 4 years, 40 lbs and have the maturity to sit correctly in the booster for every ride. Most kids hit 30 lbs around 3 years, so if your friends are switching at 3 years and 30 lbs, that's also very dangerous.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

In Canada, it is not legal to use a booster for a child under 40#.


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## Spirit Dancer (Dec 11, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chickabiddy* 
In Canada, it is not legal to use a booster for a child under 40#.

This is not true. Each province has its own rules about carseat regulations so it depends where you live. Also each weight limit also has an age limit. In some provinces I know you are legally required to keep you child in a carseat till 4yrs OR 40lbs whichever comes first.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Unless I'm mistaken, Transport Canada has not certified any booster for use by children under 40#; therefore, it's not legal to use a booster for a child under 40#.


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## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

For Canadian laws though they also all have a proper use clause... and I don't believe that there are any boosters on the market that start lower than 40lbs. Which means using them below that would not only be unsafe but also illegal...


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

Thanks for the info. To my knowledge I can use this seat until she is 80 pounds with a seatbelt. But she is still in the five point harness. The straps are getting short.


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## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
Thanks for the info. To my knowledge I can use this seat until she is 80 pounds with a seatbelt. But she is still in the five point harness. The straps are getting short.

What seat is it? Where is her head in relation to the top of the seat? Where are her shoulders in relation to the harness straps?

Also what is she wearing in the car (when you said winter clothes)? Would taking her out of the jacket she is in and putting her in fleece work to free up some space?

The questions I asked were asked further up in the thread but I wasn't sure if maybe you hadn't seen them. They will impact the solution that can be offered to you


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Most combination seats (harness to 40#, booster to 80#) have very short harnesses. It is quite possible that a 5yo has indeed outgrown the harness by height -- this happens when the shoulders are above the top strap slots. If she has outgrown the seat by height, and she is 38#, and you are in Canada, then she needs a new harnessed seat. Knowing what seat she's in now and where her shoulders are in relation to the top strap slots will help us make recommendations for the next seat, if one is indeed needed.


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

Eddie Bauer seat.

I will check the position next time we are out.

She wearing clothes and a winter jacket (until I posted this question....I had never heard of not wearing a jacket....and had never been told). She could not wear only a fleece in the car. She would freeze


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
Thanks for the info. To my knowledge I can use this seat until she is 80 pounds with a seatbelt. But she is still in the five point harness. The straps are getting short.

Please answer the questions I posed. I am concerned that she is in an old style 3-in-1 Dorel seat, in which case there is almost no way she fits safely in the seat.

The top most head rest position on that seat is for booster use only. It is NOT reinforced for harness use. Your child could be ejected in a crash. The manual clearly delineates this.

On the other hand, if she's in an Enspira, the topmost position is reinforced, but it's only 14.5" which means she also outgrew it...probably two years ago. Please update!

(For future reference, that seat does not make a safe booster)


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
Eddie Bauer seat.

I will check the position next time we are out.

She wearing clothes and a winter jacket (until I posted this question....I had never heard of not wearing a jacket....and had never been told). She could not wear only a fleece in the car. She would freeze










Being cold is a small price to pay for not sustaining a head injury which would leave her in a pediatric nursing home for the rest of her substantially shortened life. this is NOT a joke or a casual issue.

Your child has almost certainly outgrown that seat. She cannot continue to use it in harnessed mode and it makes unsafe booster. She needs a new seat...yesterday!

The Graco Nautilus is a great, not terribly expensive, choice for extended harnessing, and it turns into a SAFE booster after the harness is outgrown


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

If it is an Eddie Bauer seat (which one? there are several), you must check the manual and the back of the seat. Most of those seats do not allow the harness to be used in the topmost setting: the top headrest setting is for booster use only. If this is the case, you must check her shoulders in relation to the top USEABLE (second from the top) strap setting.


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

I will double check next time I am out...but I think it is this seat. It is good to 100 pounds.
http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/eddi...at-in-lakemont


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
I will double check next time I am out...but I think it is this seat. It is good to 100 pounds.
http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/eddi...at-in-lakemont

Ok, no, it is not 'good to 100 lbs'. The harness maxes at 40 lbs, but the harness HEIGHT maxes out at the second to-top position. There's almost zero way a kid her age fits in the harness by height. The harness is NOT going to remain in the shell of the seat in an serious impact. It's not designed to.

You need to switch the seat to booster mode and buy a new harnessed seat as soon as you can.

Also, even though it's rated to '100 pounds', no 100 pound kid is going to fit in it. It will also be outgrown in height at around 52-53", which is several years before a kid is safe to ride in a seatbelt alone. Because it doesn't even make a good booster, it's useless to you...she needs a good combination seat that converts to a safe booster when she's ready.


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## Spirit Dancer (Dec 11, 2006)

This will not be the most popular opinion on this board but if I were you and my child was 5 and 38 lbs I would not spend the money on a new harnessed seat. I would put her into a booster. She is safer in a good booster then an incorrectly harnessed seat anyway.
BTW, in Toys R Us and Walmart they sell boosters that are for 30 lb+. Not that it is a safe option but I would be totally comfortable in putting your child in a high back booster.
Just my 2 cents


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Spirit Dancer - In Canada there are NO boosters rated from 30lbs. They all start at 40. It is illegal for her ot use a booster for her daughter.


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## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

What boosters are you talking about? Not being snarky I'm serious because I checked both websites and in store for TRU and Sears an every single one off them says 40. Which again makes using them in this situation both unsafe and illegal.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

ToysRUs and Walmart, in Canada, sell boosters that Transport Canada has approved for use at 30#? I'm very curious about this. Which boosters are they?

I don't think a 5yo/38# child in a good highbacked booster is always a problem, but I do think it's not okay to use a seat outside of its certified use.


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maedze* 
Ok, no, it is not 'good to 100 lbs'. The harness maxes at 40 lbs, but the harness HEIGHT maxes out at the second to-top position. There's almost zero way a kid her age fits in the harness by height. The harness is NOT going to remain in the shell of the seat in an serious impact. It's not designed to.

You need to switch the seat to booster mode and buy a new harnessed seat as soon as you can.

Also, even though it's rated to '100 pounds', no 100 pound kid is going to fit in it. It will also be outgrown in height at around 52-53", which is several years before a kid is safe to ride in a seatbelt alone. Because it doesn't even make a good booster, it's useless to you...she needs a good combination seat that converts to a safe booster when she's ready.

Can you post any pictures of good seats? Make sure they are good in Canada....as any US seat is not good here.


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
Can you post any pictures of good seats? Make sure they are good in Canada....as any US seat is not good here.

Seats that would be great options for your daughter (and are available in Canada!) are the Graco Nautilus and the Britax Frontier.

I'd give links, but I'm not familiar enough with Canadian retailers to get it right...I'll let the Canadian members cover that one


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## Twinklefae (Dec 13, 2006)

Walmart and Sears both carry the Nautilus, for around $225. The Frontier isn't really worth the money - the only places that carry it here want almost $350 for it.

Another option here is the Evenflo Chase, which harnesses to 47lbs for $100 (but it makes a BAD booster), or something like the Truefit that harnesses to 65lbs for $150, but is a convertilble, so you'll need to buy a separate booster.


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maedze* 
Ok, no, it is not 'good to 100 lbs'. The harness maxes at 40 lbs, but the harness HEIGHT maxes out at the second to-top position. There's almost zero way a kid her age fits in the harness by height. The harness is NOT going to remain in the shell of the seat in an serious impact. It's not designed to.

You need to switch the seat to booster mode and buy a new harnessed seat as soon as you can.

Also, even though it's rated to '100 pounds', no 100 pound kid is going to fit in it. It will also be outgrown in height at around 52-53", which is several years before a kid is safe to ride in a seatbelt alone. Because it doesn't even make a good booster, it's useless to you...she needs a good combination seat that converts to a safe booster when she's ready.

I have more questions.....why does it say *the only carseat you will need* and good from 5-100 pounds*.

Also this new seat you have reccomended for $225....is that only good for my daugther from her current weight of 38 pounds to 40 pounds????


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
I have more questions.....why does it say *the only carseat you will need* and good from 5-100 pounds*.

Also this new seat you have reccomended for $225....is that only good for my daugther from her current weight of 38 pounds to 40 pounds????

It's a marketing ploy, but obviously not true. The seat won't fit most (if any newborns and does not last long enough for booster and makes a lousy booster.

The nautilus is a great seat for her age, weight, and height, and does make a good booster in most cases.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
I have more questions.....why does it say *the only carseat you will need* and good from 5-100 pounds*.

You'll have to ask them why they claim that. It certainly won't fit a 5# child (it'll probably fit most kids at about 12#-14#). It won't fit a 100# child. It won't get children to a safe age/size to use as a booster, and it's probably the worst booster on the market. It's advertising, just like other advertising -- not everything that claims to be delicious or healthy actually is, either.

The Nautilus will harness to 65# and stands a chance of getting many kids close to that weight before they outgrow it by height. It is a decent high-backed booster for kids who are large enough to have outgrown the harness and an excellent backless.


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## Maedze (Dec 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momtoS* 
I *have more questions.....why does it say *the only carseat you will need* and good from 5-100 pounds*.*

Also this new seat you have reccomended for $225....is that only good for my daugther from her current weight of 38 pounds to 40 pounds????

Because they're lying liars who lie









Seriously, it's an ENORMOUS disgrace. First off, despite being rated from five pounds, the bottom most harness position is too tall to fit a newborn. Babies really can't use them much before 6 to 9 months.

Secondly (on the old version which you have), the top harness usable harness position was so short most kids outgrew the seat by the third birthday (WAY too young to use a booster).

Thirdly, the booster portion of the seat fits kids so badly it just earned the IIHS 'worst bet' rating for booster safety the second year in a row.

Fourthly, the whole seat is so short it's outgrown by height about two years before a kid will fit safely a seatbelt alone.

Can you see why I hate it?









The seat that I recommended (The Graco Nautilus) has a harnessed weight of 65 pounds and a top harness height of 18". It would probably work for your daughter as a harnessed seat for several more years if you wanted to. Then it converts to a pretty good booster for most kids.


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## medicmama (May 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chickabiddy* 
Unless I'm mistaken, Transport Canada has not certified any booster for use by children under 40#; therefore, it's not legal to use a booster for a child under 40#.

In the us they have seats that say 30#. It doesn't mean you should put a 30# 1 year old in it. They do it all the time.


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## Spirit Dancer (Dec 11, 2006)

Hmmm seems like most booster seats in Canada do say 40+. Still since she is already 5 and only 2 lbs lighter I would still put her in a booster. You can get a good one for like $70 that would last her till she does not need a booster anymore. regardless of what you do I would do it soon as she is not safe in her currant seat.


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## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Spirit Dancer* 
Hmmm seems like most booster seats in Canada do say 40+. Still since she is already 5 and only 2 lbs lighter I would still put her in a booster. You can get a good one for like $70 that would last her till she does not need a booster anymore. *regardless of what you do I would do it soon as she is not safe in her currant seat*.

I very very much agree with you on the bolded.

But advising someone to use a seat that has not been tested to pass at that weight isn't safe (or legal) either.


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## mommyto3girls (May 3, 2005)

I can't comment of US vs Canadian laws, but we LOVE our Nautilus seats here







We have 6 of them! Our oldest is 7 years old, 48 inches tall, about 46-48 pounds, and happily rides harnessed. She still has a good 1 1/2-2 1/2 inches of butt-shoulder growth (so figuring 3-5 inches total height) till she outgrows the top harness slots.


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## lunita1 (May 12, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *triscuitsmom* 
What boosters are you talking about? Not being snarky I'm serious because I checked both websites and in store for TRU and Sears an every single one off them says 40. Which again makes using them in this situation both unsafe and illegal.

Illegal, yes. Unsafe? I'm not sure. The Graco Turbo booster (high back and belt positioning) is sold in Canada (I just saw it on the Canadian Tire and Toys R US Canada websites.) It's the same Turbo Booster sold in the U.S. with a label that says 30- Having a Canadian label on it doesn't make it automatically less safe for a kid who otherwise fits in the seat and is mature enough to use a booster. My oldest was the same size at age five and occasionally rode in a turbo (in the US) at that age. Her main seat, incidentally, was a Graco Cargo (which just expired this month. I liked that seat), which I used for three kids past the U.S. weight limit of 40 lbs. because I knew it had a Canadian weight limit of 48 lbs. so it had been tested and proven to withstand that weight.

edited to add: I wholeheartedly agree that a Nautilus is a *better* choice than a turbo booster (I have two kids in Nautiluses right now), but for a child her age a high back belt positioning booster is a good, safe, affordable choice.


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

Did you have the Cargo top-tethered? In order to pass testing in Canada, it needed to be tethered.

Using a seat outside of its labeling is illegal.


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## lunita1 (May 12, 2008)

Yes, I did always use the top tether.







I'm sure I heard about the Cargo in about 2004/2005 from a CPST who recommended it as an affordable option for extended harnessing in the US (before there were other good options like the Nautilus, and at a time when keeping a child harnessed forever and a day in a Regent was viewed as the ultimate in safety).


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## chickabiddy (Jan 30, 2004)

A CPST who recommended that you use the seat beyond its stated limits was doing a disservice to you, and risking her own certification.


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## lunita1 (May 12, 2008)

I'm sure she did it in a hypothetical, "well, if you felt comfortable with it, knowing that this seat had been tested as safe with a top tether up to 48 pounds in another country, you might consider it as an alternative to keep your kids harnessed longer at an affordable price...." kind of way. I made the judgement call on my own and I still feel like it was a good call. It kept a child from using a lap belt. Different labeling or crossing an international border doesn't change the actual physics and performance of the safety seat.

What I really came back to post is that I just noticed that Sears Canada still sells the Graco Ultra/Platinum Cargos. Since it IS labeled to 48 lbs. in Canada it would be a decent choice for keeping the five year old in a five point harness a couple of years longer for $100 less than a Canadian Nautilus. It's a good choice for slim kids (which I assume a 38 lb. 5 year old is) and will probably work for a couple of years. They would probably outgrow it by height before weight. I'd get a different seat once they outgrow the harness on that one, but a cargo+turbo together would still cost less than a Nautilus at Canadian prices.


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## momtoS (Apr 12, 2006)

UPDATE:

I bought the Graco Nautilas for my daughter. Thanks for the info


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## Twinklefae (Dec 13, 2006)

That's great news!


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Awesome!!


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