# THE Adrenal Fatigue Thread



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Our old thread was well over 2,000 posts!

Old thread full of good info.

Welcome fellow adrenal-healing old-timers & newbies as well!


----------



## FrannieP (Sep 11, 2007)

Subbing - thanks for strating the New Thread


----------



## linguistmama (Sep 25, 2006)

Subbing!


----------



## LBMarie9 (Jan 3, 2008)

still working through the other one---subbing here as well.thxs


----------



## lisasaurus (Aug 29, 2007)

Hi everyone!

I asked this question on another thread, but no one answered. I am currently taking zoloft for anxiety and depression. I had made a really good recovery, but everytime I try to go off the meds, my symptoms come back.

recently my naturopath discovered my cholesterol is really really low, so he suspects my adrenals are completely exhausted as well. I anticipate a lot more testing in the near future to see whats what.

for now i'm going back up on zoloft so i can function and take care of myself and my family.

I am just looking for some support to hear that I am not the only one who is using these medications. I feel very alone, and tend to beat myself up for it. I know it is a long process to heal the imbalances, so i'm trying to be gentle with myself. some comradery (sp?) would be nice though.

anyone out there like me?


----------



## hippiemom (Jan 7, 2002)

My BF takes antianxiety med too.. helps some with his insomnia that is part of his adrenal fatigue (he uses melatonin too). There is no one path, we are all individuals. Take it one day at a time honey, nurture, nourish, and be gentle with yourself.


----------



## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

I'm subbing. I'm pretty sure I have this, and was just googling for diet/supplement/life change recommendations.


----------



## hippiemom (Jan 7, 2002)

My dear BF has been dealing with adrenal fatigue woes for about 3 years now (though he has had it for much longer), in conjunction with hypothyroid. He is taking a good wholistic approach, but it has been trial and error, success and setbacks, and all daunting, scary, exhausting. A year ago he made a bold move to let himself remain laid off so he could focus completely on his health. (He had a lot of money saved up). Today he is still searching.

For me as his support person, I try to keep the faith that he will get better. He has recently, with my help, cleaned up his diet







Awesome b/c I think some of his bad eating habits were stressing his system further.
I am an herbalist, but he takes many things already, both meds and supplements... it is a lot. I have had my share of health issues as well and been successful treating them with natural ways and optimal nourishment, and happiness, so I do carry that optimism. I am trying to help him see that he must replace the stress he removed with inspiration, some joy, some light... it is not enough to take stress out, that space must be filled with something that nourishes.. yes?

For those of you dealing, what is the best thing your support people who love you can do?


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisasaurus* 
for now i'm going back up on zoloft so i can function and take care of myself and my family.


Zoloft is really not that bad, especially if it is helping you. I think finding out that your cholesterol is low is a good sign. You could start adding coconut oil to your food.

I was hear a year or two ago feeling so awful! I'm doing a lot better now thanks to the advice on this forum. You guys are wonderful.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisasaurus* 
Hi everyone!

I asked this question on another thread, but no one answered. I am currently taking zoloft for anxiety and depression. I had made a really good recovery, but everytime I try to go off the meds, my symptoms come back.

recently my naturopath discovered my cholesterol is really really low, so he suspects my adrenals are completely exhausted as well. I anticipate a lot more testing in the near future to see whats what.

for now i'm going back up on zoloft so i can function and take care of myself and my family.

I am just looking for some support to hear that I am not the only one who is using these medications. I feel very alone, and tend to beat myself up for it. I know it is a long process to heal the imbalances, so i'm trying to be gentle with myself. some comradery (sp?) would be nice though.

anyone out there like me?

I was on antidepressants a few years ago (ETA: plus a couple times previously, years ago), if it's making you functional, stick with it. There's no reason to beat yourself up about it, seriously. This whole thing, being sick and trying to figure out why _you_ are sick, vs anyone else here, is a lot of work, and the more other responsibilities you've got, the harder it is.

FWIW, for me, in retrospect, I can see that a lot of nutritional deficiencies were also involved in my depression. Not that I had any clue that I was depressed for any other reason than "it runs in my family," but it was later that things fit together. Have you done some/a lot/no nutritional supplementation? Things like zinc and mag, B vits of various sorts, some folks need omega-3s. I have no idea on dosages (though there's a thread in Postpartum that discusses this), I just stuck with meds. To fix my issues, I've been supplementing a lot of vits/mins at fairly high doses--I'm all for good food, and cutting out problematic foods (for me gluten and dairy) but pills helped me too.








You're fighting the good fight, just keep plugging away.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hippiemom* 
I am an herbalist

Oh good!







Do you know if it's okay for a nursing mama to take saw palmetto? Ds is 3.5 yrs old. I have very high androstenedione & saw palmetto is the only natural treatment I've been able to find.

Thanks Mama!


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisasaurus* 
Hi everyone!

I asked this question on another thread, but no one answered. I am currently taking zoloft for anxiety and depression. I had made a really good recovery, but everytime I try to go off the meds, my symptoms come back.

recently my naturopath discovered my cholesterol is really really low, so he suspects my adrenals are completely exhausted as well. I anticipate a lot more testing in the near future to see whats what.

for now i'm going back up on zoloft so i can function and take care of myself and my family.

I am just looking for some support to hear that I am not the only one who is using these medications. I feel very alone, and tend to beat myself up for it. I know it is a long process to heal the imbalances, so i'm trying to be gentle with myself. some comradery (sp?) would be nice though.

anyone out there like me?

I've never taken ssris or anxiety drugs (well, I did try one for 5 days for anxiety but found out I was pregnant with Dd2 & stopped.) I have also taken Xanax a handful of times before I started healing my adrenals to help with some really stressful & anxiety-causing moments. But I haven't taken it for a loooong time now.

BUT, there was a long period of time where I considered taking something for anxiety. I really suffered through some horrible, crippling anxiety for a very long time - since I was about 12 yrs old until a couple of years ago after I began treating my adrenals. I actually feel really bad sometimes about how I suffered, especially as a child - no child should cry themselves to sleep because of anxiety.







And trying to raise babies while being anxious & depressed is just...ugh.
My ND really wanted to try to get to the root of it (adrenal insufficiency), so I didn't start the meds. I asked him about it a couple of times & we worked through it using supplements. He agreed that in some situations, they're very useful & he's not against using them.

I'm with Tanya, if it makes you functional, I think it's a good thing. Simultaneously working on healing your adrenals will help you fix the root of the anxiety/depression.

I also agree that nutritional deficiencies & allergies can also cause anxiety & depression - as well as TONS of other problems. I've come a long way just by tweaking my diet. Eliminating gluten was a big help in my healing. I still have a long way to go though.

Don't beat yourself up about it mama. If your adrenals aren't functioning well, you literally CANNOT handle stress & end up with anxiety. When I realized this, I felt like giving myself a big bear hug & saying "it's not your fault!" So cut yourself a break & know that your body needs your help. Recognize that you need to avoid stressful situations - it's okay to not go to things that will cause you stress or anxiety. It's okay to let go of relationships that cause stress/negativity/anxiety. And it's okay to let the house go, skip some cleaning, etc.
You really need to nurture yourself & focus on healing.


----------



## lisasaurus (Aug 29, 2007)

Thanks ladies for all your supportive responses. It really means a lot to me.

I did an elimination diet last spring, and the only food sensitivity I could discern was Soy. So i've cut that out completely. Lately since my anxiety and insomnia have returned with such a vengence, I have been eating really well. All whole, fresh foods, as much healthy fat as I can, nuts, tons of protein. I am going to see a nutritionist at my naturopaths office for some good advice in that arena.

quick question: what are some ways to incorporate coconut oil into my diet? I snack on rice toast with coconut butter at least once a day, but thats obviously not enough.

As for supplements, I take a super powered multivitamin, iron, vit D, 5-htp at night, and just started DHEA. I'm hoping we do a saliva test soon so i can figure out specifically what needs attention first.

in the meantime, just trying to stay hopeful that I won't need antidepressants and sleep medication forever. I really want to help my body to heal.

<3


----------



## SandyMom (Mar 26, 2009)

Quote:

quick question: what are some ways to incorporate coconut oil into my diet? I snack on rice toast with coconut butter at least once a day, but thats obviously not enough.
Good ideas here:

Coconut Oil Thread


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lisasaurus* 
As for supplements, I take a super powered multivitamin, iron, vit D, 5-htp at night, and just started DHEA. I'm hoping we do a saliva test soon so i can figure out specifically what needs attention first.

in the meantime, just trying to stay hopeful that I won't need antidepressants and sleep medication forever. I really want to help my body to heal.

<3

If you feel up to adding something else, b complex would be helpful I think.


----------



## subtlycrunchy (Jul 29, 2006)

Glad to see the new thread. The other one was intimidatingly long, but SUCH a good resource. I wonder if it could be kept as a sticky? Or maybe combed through for posts with links and that could be stickied? Metasequoia -- D'oh!!! Just saw that you linked to the old thread in the first post.

Anyway, the health newsletter I subscribe to from Women to Women this past week sent me a REALLY awesome article about AF -- Adrenal extremes - could you be on your way to Cushing's or Addison's disease? -- If you scroll down about half way, there's a good chart stacking up symptoms of AF with Cushing's and Addisons.


----------



## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

I really need some guidance on what to eat. I'm just not very good at this nutrition thing.







I cut out the Turkey Hill Iced Tea cold turkey, and I'm feeling tired and unenergetic. Today I ate an egg and piece of toast for breakfast, and I had some tortilla chips and salsa/sour cream for lunch. To drink, I've just had about half a glass of water. I really hate water. I love tea. That's why I drink so much of it.

I know I sound whiny. I think it's because I'm hungry and thirsty, LOL!


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annettemarie* 
I really need some guidance on what to eat. I'm just not very good at this nutrition thing.







I cut out the Turkey Hill Iced Tea cold turkey, and I'm feeling tired and unenergetic. Today I ate an egg and piece of toast for breakfast, and I had some tortilla chips and salsa/sour cream for lunch. To drink, I've just had about half a glass of water. I really hate water. I love tea. That's why I drink so much of it.

I know I sound whiny. I think it's because I'm hungry and thirsty, LOL!

A nutrient dense, low carb diet is really supportive of the adrenals. People with adrenal insufficiency tend to have blood sugar problems that carbs/sugar further exacerbate. Try focusing on foods that are super nutrient dense, everything should count. The TF forum has a lot of ideas & there are some low-carb, grain-free & Paleo threads floating around - all of which would be helpful.

That's good that you kicked the iced tea habit, I'm sure that was draining your adrenals.

We also tend to need a lot of salt - good salt like Celtic salt (the best) or Real Salt.

Try to focus on pastured meats & veggies as your basis of meals. Fermented veggies will help too. Adrenal insufficiency can also result in a lot of food allergies, so pay attention to how foods make you feel. I had to cut out gluten & my cycles finally normalized & I haven't had PMS since. Grains in general tend to bother me.

Things to avoid are: sugar (of any kind), caffeine, chocolate if it stimulates you, foods lacking nutritional value (IE chips!)

Maybe you could replace the Turkey Hill iced tea with iced herbal teas sweetened with a dab of raw honey? We like mint iced tea a lot.

I consider cod liver oil a food. The only one that doesn't have synthetic vitamins anymore or Blue Ice *fermented* cod liver oil. It really helps with mood too.

You'll feel better once you've been off the caffeine for a week.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annettemarie* 
I really need some guidance on what to eat. I'm just not very good at this nutrition thing.







I cut out the Turkey Hill Iced Tea cold turkey, and I'm feeling tired and unenergetic. Today I ate an egg and piece of toast for breakfast, and I had some tortilla chips and salsa/sour cream for lunch. To drink, I've just had about half a glass of water. I really hate water. I love tea. That's why I drink so much of it.

I know I sound whiny. I think it's because I'm hungry and thirsty, LOL!

Having snacks always available was a biggie for me early on. And I know it was part of my overall health, but a really high fat diet worked well for me. For snacks, having nuts around (in my purse, for exampl, so I wouldn't sink into a puddle at the park) was essential, and filling stuff like meatballs helped--enough to be substantial when I needed food and didn't feel good or creative or motivated.

I had some food sensitivities, cutting out gluten and dairy really helped. And having a good amount of protein and fat with each meal/snack helped me as well. I've eaten more meat in the past two years than the previous five, and I've always been omni.

You may want more water if you up your salt intake. Depending on where you are in the adrenal fatigue process, your ability to hold onto sodium may be weak (there's an earlier stage when people do better on more potassium and less sodium). You can either actively salt to taste, or mix some sea salt into a little water and drink it like a shot. But within a day or two of doing that, I usually feel a bit more energetic and I notice myself drinking more water.

Giving up caffeine has been very, very difficult. I keep backsliding, but I _still_ feel the effort is worth it.


----------



## Kino (Jun 18, 2006)

How many milligrams of adrenal supplements are you guys on? I found out this week my dosage is probably way too low for my level of AF...


----------



## LessTraveledBy (Feb 9, 2005)

Please help...

I just got my saliva test results and it says I probably have adrenal fatique. (Not a surprise, as I am hypo and all that.)

Here are the results:

morning 0.78 (0.27-1.18)
midday 0.23 (0.10-0.41)
afternoon 0.15 (0.05-0.27)
*night <0.03 (0.03-0.14)*

DHEA 599 (71-640)
DHEA: cortisol ratio 768 (115-1,188)

I am pretty sure that my doctor will suggest h ydrocortisone. Someone here already told me it is only a bandaid... So what are my options and where can I find good information? I am in Europe and I am already going to the best possible doctor we have here...

As I have said here before, we have been suffering from secondary infertility for years. Mentally, I cannot deal with the idea of needing to wait two more years to TTC. However... from what I have read, it is rare to take hydrocortisone and not have to take it for at least a year...

I would appreciate any comments, as I am way too new to this and I will need to learn a lot to discuss with the doctor.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

From the reference ranges listed above, your cortisol seems to be in range. Your nighttime one is a bit low, but that's not so bad.

How do you feel?


----------



## LessTraveledBy (Feb 9, 2005)

On the second page it says: "This pattern suggests adrenal hypofunction of the zona fasciculata." THAT is what I am going by thinking I have a problem. Well, and that fact that the evening sample was too low to be measured.

I just looked at my mom's test and her afternoon, though within range, looked high for the rest of her pattern. Turns our she had slept for two hours in the afternoon before testing. Problem is, so did I, and mine is not elevated at all, which makes me think that that one might have been low also (even if not as low as the night one). I wish the instructions has mentioned sleeping... We did not think of it and were so tired without coffee/tea that day.

TBH, I don't know how I am feeling, as I may have been hypo since birth. I certainly have a TON more energy than I did before Armour. I have had some symptoms return, lately, and now my free T3 is above range and free T4 is a little lower than I would prefer, so it looks like I will need to take less Armour...


----------



## zjandosmom (Dec 13, 2004)

Just 'found' this thread...yea. I started taking 'Adrenal Support' 4 weeks ago per my Dr and WOW do I feel a difference. My energy is returning and I am feeling more myself every day. I was having hormone imbalance issues which my Dr felt stemmed from Adrenal issues. I am on Breast Health (supplement), Adrenal Support, and progesterone (last 2 weeks of my cycle) and feeling so so much better!

I got my adenal support and other supplement here www.emersonecologics.com if anyone needs a good place for supplements (My Dr rec them).


----------



## Adamsmama (Oct 24, 2003)

I think I have this. I was recently diagnosed as hypothyroid. I never had weight problems but I do have a lot of symptoms of hypothyroid (brain fog, slow thinking, very very tired, menstrual problems/irregular, lots of spotting, constipation...) this has been going on for years -- at least 10-15 years now (since I was a teenager). I started taking synthroid (levo) about a month ago and the only thing that is better is my constipation has vanished ... I mean it used to be a once a week thing and now it is every day or max every other. I can't believe that. However, I've been slowly gaining weight in the past month I've put on 5 pounds, which is odd, since my diet hasn't changed. I'm also very very fatigued, like I would wake up in the morning tired by 12 noon I had to take a nap and then even after the nap still feel a little tired ... by 6 pm very very tired, could go to bed again.


----------



## zjandosmom (Dec 13, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Adamsmama* 
I think I have this. I was recently diagnosed as hypothyroid. I never had weight problems but I do have a lot of symptoms of hypothyroid (brain fog, slow thinking, very very tired, menstrual problems/irregular, lots of spotting, constipation...) this has been going on for years -- at least 10-15 years now (since I was a teenager). I started taking synthroid (levo) about a month ago and the only thing that is better is my constipation has vanished ... I mean it used to be a once a week thing and now it is every day or max every other. I can't believe that. However, I've been slowly gaining weight in the past month I've put on 5 pounds, which is odd, since my diet hasn't changed. I'm also very very fatigued, like I would wake up in the morning tired by 12 noon I had to take a nap and then even after the nap still feel a little tired ... by 6 pm very very tired, could go to bed again.

You described what I had been feeling to a 'T'.....the things I listed above your post have helped with ALL of my symptoms. Including the weight gain. I had too much estrogen and too little progesterone which explained the weight gain (all in my middle) and other symptoms as well. Hope you can get some help. I cannot tell you how much better I feel since starting my new 'regime'.


----------



## chlobo (Jan 24, 2004)

Can someone look at my two adrenal tests and tell me if you think I've improved. In the first test my curve was a normal curve, except that it was below the reference range so the practitioner said we just needed to raise the whole curve.

Well clearly we didn't do that. I'm just curious if its really an improvement? I realize you can't totally compare b/c I didn't do the neurotransmitters this time but still.

first test:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...drenaltest.jpg

2nd test:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...drenaltest.jpg

Or am I just screwed up in a different way now.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chlobo* 
Can someone look at my two adrenal tests and tell me if you think I've improved. In the first test my curve was a normal curve, except that it was below the reference range so the practitioner said we just needed to raise the whole curve.

Well clearly we didn't do that. I'm just curious if its really an improvement? I realize you can't totally compare b/c I didn't do the neurotransmitters this time but still.

first test:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...drenaltest.jpg

2nd test:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...drenaltest.jpg

Or am I just screwed up in a different way now.

I can't see your results - it just shows the Photobucket home page.

I think stabilizing the curve is key. Mine was only slightly off at first but we got it to a normal rhythm fairly quickly. Now my cortisol levels are just low.

There are things you can do to try to even it out though.


----------



## chlobo (Jan 24, 2004)

Ok. I fixed the link but here are the #s:

First Test:

Cortisol
7:42am 4.4 (7am rr 7-10)
11:44am 1.1 (noon rr 3-6)
5:40pm .8 (5pm rr 2-4)
10:46pm .8 (10pm rr <1.5)

Second Test:

Cortisol
8:00am 7.7 (morning rr 7-10)
12:00pm 2.2 (midday rr 3-6)
6:00pm 1.3 (evening rr 2-4)
11:00pm 2.3 (night rr <1.5)

So I'm guessing, from what you are saying, that I'm worse off than before because before I had low cortisol but the curve looked like a normal curve just low.

Now, however, although I've raised my morning cortisol the rest sucks. Am I understanding correctly?

I've tried a bunch of different adrenal things. What have you found that works for you?


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Chlobo, I think you're getting better. DH was like your first curve, just low all the time, and I think raising evening cortisol above reference is working your way backwards towards good health, and the increase in morning cortisol is indicative of the same thing.

Take a look at this sequence of the 7 stages...
http://www.chronicfatigue.org/ASI%205.html

I think DH was sliding beyond 5, into 6 or 7 (hard to say, I think he was transitioning between stages when we tested, he didn't fit anything perfectly) but now you're looking more classic stage 5. Which isn't great, I think it's the worst I got and I felt pretty sucky, but I think you and DH were both worse.

My 2 cents anyway. (but the photobucket pics are showing up pretty small for me, too small to read given the paleness of the print).


----------



## chlobo (Jan 24, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
Chlobo, I think you're getting better. DH was like your first curve, just low all the time, and I think raising evening cortisol above reference is working your way backwards towards good health, and the increase in morning cortisol is indicative of the same thing.

Take a look at this sequence of the 7 stages...
http://www.chronicfatigue.org/ASI%205.html

I think DH was sliding beyond 5, into 6 or 7 (hard to say, I think he was transitioning between stages when we tested, he didn't fit anything perfectly) but now you're looking more classic stage 5. Which isn't great, I think it's the worst I got and I felt pretty sucky, but I think you and DH were both worse.

My 2 cents anyway. (but the photobucket pics are showing up pretty small for me, too small to read given the paleness of the print).

Geez. According to that I should be bed ridden.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chlobo* 
Geez. According to that I should be bed ridden.

That's what I've been trying to say, you REALLY DO feel bad! Feeling bad is hard enough, but feeling bad ABOUT feeling bad is just adding insult to injury and you've got reasons, that much lead and copper and I'm surprised you're not *actually* bedridden.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Jeez, I've never read those ASI charts on the Clymer website, TL. It says they rarely see patients in a zone 6. I haven't been able to get out of this zone 7 for years now, but I don't feel as dead as it seems I should feel. Don't get me wrong, I feel like crap much of the time & my muscles hurt constantly, but I'm not bedridden.

I think it affects everyone differently. Like Tanya said, whatever else one has going on (like lead or copper), can make things that much worse. So while I'm fully in zone 7, perhaps you feel worse in a zone 5. Just thinking out loud here.

It's tough to say how the body will heal. The cortisol pattern will change throughout the healing process. The first good sign we saw for me was that my pattern improved. My cortisols were always low, but throughout the day they were lower than in the evening, so I felt ramped up in the evening, even though my cortisol was almost non-existent at that time.
Things definitely felt better once it evened out.

The next obvious improvement was that my morning cortisol jumped quite a bit. At the moment, it feels too high because as soon as I wake up in the morning, I have that buzzy, ramped up feeling. Or perhaps I just need it to rise more throughout the day?

We're having trouble getting my DHEA to rise, it's still a 1 or 2.

But I feel better than I did 3 years ago, regardless of the very small changes in my test results. This is reeeeaally slow going. But as someone knee deep in zone 7, I can say it is possible to improve. I know there are things I could do that would help me heal MUCH faster, like removing more stress, but not all of it is possible to avoid, unfortunately.

Hang in there Mama, given the right tools, you're body will figure this out. Trust that it knows what its doing.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Meta, speaking of you, you HAVE been working hard and doing LOTS of good stuff, more than most folks. Have you considered an ongoing physical stress that's still working on you? Chronic lyme or epstein-barre, heavy metals (ever considered a hair test?), um, I'm sure there's other stuff as well. This has been a really long slog for you, and even with life stresses (some of them pretty rough), it still seems slow going. Money's always an issue, I don't know much about testing for chronic infections, but the hair test is about $85 from Direct Lab Services, and your doc could probably get it for you cheaper, he can order directly from Doctor's Data, and he'll get the cheap HCP price (he needs to get an account set up, but I think that's just some paperwork).


----------



## mama2j&t (Apr 26, 2004)

Hi!
I've been through the original thread but I'm too tired to go through it right now. It's finally "clicked" to me that DH is likely suffering from long term adrenal fatigue. I'd like to get his saliva tested on our own and then decide what type of Dr we want to follow up with based on the results. I thought I could order through Genova but I'm not sure how to do that on my own. Can anyone recommend a good lab to go though w/o Dr ordering it?

I'm pretty familiar w/ AF because I had a saliva test ordered by an ND in another state a few years ago and I was able to overcome some mild adrenal fatigue with dietary changes and Isocort. I'm not planning to do this all on our own but I feel like it's faster to just order the test rather than trying to find an ND/get in/get the test ordered....

Thanks!


----------



## Angelplum (May 27, 2005)

Is AF something that can kick in after pregnancy? I suspect that I might have it...but it really started after the birth of DD, now 4.5 years old.
Although I did have some problems since I was a teenager, like problem menstrual cycles.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

mama2j&t--I ordered for DH through Canary Club. Whatever you do, make sure to get a 4x/day saliva test, sometimes it's worded oddly and it's difficult to tell.

Angelplum--pregnancy is a big stress, and for me, I think my adrenals were slowly wearing down for almost 20 yrs, but it was my 2nd pregnancy that made it blatantly obvious that something was wrong. But I felt normal for me before that, so I didn't recognize that things weren't all okay.


----------



## Angelplum (May 27, 2005)

Yeah, I think it was the same for me...I was slowly feeling worse, but not enough to make me think it was something major. But since I had my daughter, I just feel exhausted, don't want to get up in the morning, start to feel better after 6 pm, gaining weight, etc. All symptoms of AF.

I'm also in a somewhat stressful marriage. Not much I can do about it...leaving would be even more stressful.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
Meta, speaking of you, you HAVE been working hard and doing LOTS of good stuff, more than most folks. Have you considered an ongoing physical stress that's still working on you? Chronic lyme or epstein-barre, heavy metals (ever considered a hair test?), um, I'm sure there's other stuff as well. This has been a really long slog for you, and even with life stresses (some of them pretty rough), it still seems slow going. Money's always an issue, I don't know much about testing for chronic infections, but the hair test is about $85 from Direct Lab Services, and your doc could probably get it for you cheaper, he can order directly from Doctor's Data, and he'll get the cheap HCP price (he needs to get an account set up, but I think that's just some paperwork).

Ugh. Freaking out about Lyme is what got me here. Ds was 7 or 8 weeks old & Dd2 was 3 1/4 yrs, tandem nursing. I felt good for the first 8 weeks & then had some crazy symptoms pop up - like burning skin all over my scalp, neck & upper arms - felt like a really bad sunburn. Could barely walk because the bones in my feet hurt so much (felt like all of the padding was gone & I was walking on bones.) My knees hurt like crazy, I suddenly had more floaters in my vision. This was spring of 2006.

Then, I started Googling. Biggest mistake EVER. The only places my symptoms matched up were the Lyme boards (which are scary as hell) & the menopause board (Power Surge.) I found out Lyme could be passed through breastmilk.
Knowing what I know now, it probably makes sense that hormones (or a lack of) could explain my symptoms.
I weaned Dd2 in June at 3.5 yrs so I might not pass to her whatever was wrong with me (my Lyme obsession.) I wasn't ready, she wasn't ready & it was really painful, emotionally. I laid in bed & cried, nursing my newborn, hoping I wasn't passing Lyme on to him.
By fall 2006, I had *severe* muscle pain & weakness. It hurt to push a shopping cart & was nearly impossible to do so.

But I had so many good reasons for my symptoms - like, my knees & feet hurt because I wore my heavy Ds in a front carry all day every day & my body wasn't used to that.

My chiro did x-rays & my neck was a mess which could explain burning from a pinched nerve or something.

The only think I couldn't explain was the floaters. I've always had a couple, but it became like a spider web. My ND says it's from adrenal fatigue & I've found some info about it possibly being from low blood pressure, so maybe it is?

My holistic doc treated me for Lyme, 8 wks of Amoxicillin & during the last 2 weeks, we added Biaxin (which really messed with Ds' gut, but not mine.)
I didn't feel any different.

Then I paid $650 OOP for an IGeneX western blot & co-infection panel. It was overall negative with some suspicious bands. I saw a LLMD who said I didn't have Lyme. So I still don't really know the answer to this one, but I don't know if I can handle the stress of digging any more. I don't think I'd take abx for it since I would have had it for so long.

Sometimes I think, it MUST be Lyme. I used to be a garden designer & worked in tall grasses pulling weeds & planting. I was completely ignorant about the severity of Lyme & how debilitating it could be. I live in a HIGHLY endemic area, right up there with parts of NY state & CT.

But nothing is cyclical for me. Nothing. I still have the floaters & they seem to be worse when my adrenal symptoms are worse (like dizziness upon standing, feeling tired, stronger sensitivity to carbs). I still have the muscle pain & weakness, but it's hard to say, after 3 years, if it's gotten better or if I've just gotten used to it. This is also a symptom of adrenal fatigue.
So every time I remember that nothing is cyclical for me, nothing has gotten worse, I feel like it can't be Lyme. I have ZERO joint pain. My initial joint pain only lasted maybe 2 months or so & could easily be explained by wearing Ds in a front carry with crappy Birkenstocks (I'm really flat-footed & my ankles pronate inward without super arch support, which affects the knees & everything else.)

SOOOO...I feel like I can't beat that horse any more.

Heavy metals - I dye my hair, but that doesn't matter because I don't have to use head hair, right?








I am still nursing though. I think that will skew the results, no?

Is Epstein-barre a simple test? I think it often cross-reacts with the Lyme bacteria, making the diagnosis difficult. Do you know how that works?

I don't know. My ND isn't surprised that it's taking so long. I DO feel better than I did. I need to email him anyway, so I'll ask some questions. Part of me is feeling like I could use a new (professional) perspective. Not that I don't adore my ND & I think he's fabulous at healing adrenal fatigue, but sometimes a fresh perspective is useful. I've been thinking of TCM for a while.

Hey Tanya, have you read Primal Body, Primal Mind yet? I just finished the chapter on leptin & am very much intrigued. Turns out leptin is THE king of hormones, it controls *everything* - insulin, adrenals, ACTH, and everything on down. I have to read more, but this is interesting to me.

So, (big sigh), I don't know. You're absolutely right. I've been working hard at this, still have stressors (can I send exdp to the moon?) but I feel like I should be out of zone 7 by now.

Thanks for the perspective.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Wow, I'm surprised I fit that all in one post...I thought I'd have to cut it in half.


----------



## chlobo (Jan 24, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Metasequoia* 
Ugh. Freaking out about Lyme is what got me here. Ds was 7 or 8 weeks old & Dd2 was 3 1/4 yrs, tandem nursing. I felt good for the first 8 weeks & then had some crazy symptoms pop up - like burning skin all over my scalp, neck & upper arms - felt like a really bad sunburn. Could barely walk because the bones in my feet hurt so much (felt like all of the padding was gone & I was walking on bones.) My knees hurt like crazy, I suddenly had more floaters in my vision. This was spring of 2006.

Then, I started Googling. Biggest mistake EVER. The only places my symptoms matched up were the Lyme boards (which are scary as hell) & the menopause board (Power Surge.) I found out Lyme could be passed through breastmilk.
Knowing what I know now, it probably makes sense that hormones (or a lack of) could explain my symptoms.
I weaned Dd2 in June at 3.5 yrs so I might not pass to her whatever was wrong with me (my Lyme obsession.) I wasn't ready, she wasn't ready & it was really painful, emotionally. I laid in bed & cried, nursing my newborn, hoping I wasn't passing Lyme on to him.
By fall 2006, I had *severe* muscle pain & weakness. It hurt to push a shopping cart & was nearly impossible to do so.

But I had so many good reasons for my symptoms - like, my knees & feet hurt because I wore my heavy Ds in a front carry all day every day & my body wasn't used to that.

My chiro did x-rays & my neck was a mess which could explain burning from a pinched nerve or something.

The only think I couldn't explain was the floaters. I've always had a couple, but it became like a spider web. My ND says it's from adrenal fatigue & I've found some info about it possibly being from low blood pressure, so maybe it is?

My holistic doc treated me for Lyme, 8 wks of Amoxicillin & during the last 2 weeks, we added Biaxin (which really messed with Ds' gut, but not mine.)
I didn't feel any different.

Then I paid $650 OOP for an IGeneX western blot & co-infection panel. It was overall negative with some suspicious bands. I saw a LLMD who said I didn't have Lyme. So I still don't really know the answer to this one, but I don't know if I can handle the stress of digging any more. I don't think I'd take abx for it since I would have had it for so long.

Sometimes I think, it MUST be Lyme. I used to be a garden designer & worked in tall grasses pulling weeds & planting. I was completely ignorant about the severity of Lyme & how debilitating it could be. I live in a HIGHLY endemic area, right up there with parts of NY state & CT.

But nothing is cyclical for me. Nothing. I still have the floaters & they seem to be worse when my adrenal symptoms are worse (like dizziness upon standing, feeling tired, stronger sensitivity to carbs). I still have the muscle pain & weakness, but it's hard to say, after 3 years, if it's gotten better or if I've just gotten used to it. This is also a symptom of adrenal fatigue.
So every time I remember that nothing is cyclical for me, nothing has gotten worse, I feel like it can't be Lyme. I have ZERO joint pain. My initial joint pain only lasted maybe 2 months or so & could easily be explained by wearing Ds in a front carry with crappy Birkenstocks (I'm really flat-footed & my ankles pronate inward without super arch support, which affects the knees & everything else.)

SOOOO...I feel like I can't beat that horse any more.

Heavy metals - I dye my hair, but that doesn't matter because I don't have to use head hair, right?








I am still nursing though. I think that will skew the results, no?

Is Epstein-barre a simple test? I think it often cross-reacts with the Lyme bacteria, making the diagnosis difficult. Do you know how that works?

I don't know. My ND isn't surprised that it's taking so long. I DO feel better than I did. I need to email him anyway, so I'll ask some questions. Part of me is feeling like I could use a new (professional) perspective. Not that I don't adore my ND & I think he's fabulous at healing adrenal fatigue, but sometimes a fresh perspective is useful. I've been thinking of TCM for a while.

Hey Tanya, have you read Primal Body, Primal Mind yet? I just finished the chapter on leptin & am very much intrigued. Turns out leptin is THE king of hormones, it controls *everything* - insulin, adrenals, ACTH, and everything on down. I have to read more, but this is interesting to me.

So, (big sigh), I don't know. You're absolutely right. I've been working hard at this, still have stressors (can I send exdp to the moon?) but I feel like I should be out of zone 7 by now.

Thanks for the perspective.

Wow Meta. You sound just like me except you've been at it slightly longer and I haven't seen a LLMD yet. Where did you find one?


----------



## balancedmama (Feb 16, 2007)

Hi all. I could use any support/advice you have to give.

I think I suffer from adrenal fatigue. Many years ago I had some tests which supported this but not much was done about it. I was tested and my pregnenolone was almost 0. I took supplements for a few months and noticed no difference...then other things happened and it kind of fell off my radar.









Right before I got pregnant with my daughter, I went to a naturopath who said no doubt I had AF (didn't do any testing, said why bother because she was sure







) and then prescribed me a bunch of bovine hormones. Sigh.

I really need some help here. I am so extremely fatigued that I can barely function and it just seems to be getting worse. I'm happy to share any other details you need. But I just want to know where to start. I don't want to see another crappy doctor. I need help and I don't have any energy to help myself.

FWIW, I've also recently been to see a neurologist and was told I have possible MS. We are going to repeat a brain MRI in 6 months. So my fatigue could be related to that, but truly I think there is more to it.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chlobo* 
Wow Meta. You sound just like me except you've been at it slightly longer and I haven't seen a LLMD yet. Where did you find one?

LymeNet.org DON'T READ THE FORUMS!! They're very scary, at least to me. Go to "Finding a LLMD" post your general whereabouts & say you need a LLMD. Someone will PM you some names. It's done this way to protect LLMDs who lose their licenses for "overtreating" Lyme.









I have quite a few around here, but was only able to find one holistic one. I didn't see him because an appt was $300, no insurance accepted.

You should get some good responses on their.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *balancedmama* 
Hi all. I could use any support/advice you have to give.

I think I suffer from adrenal fatigue. Many years ago I had some tests which supported this but not much was done about it. I was tested and my pregnenolone was almost 0. I took supplements for a few months and noticed no difference...then other things happened and it kind of fell off my radar.









Right before I got pregnant with my daughter, I went to a naturopath who said no doubt I had AF (didn't do any testing, said why bother because she was sure







) and then prescribed me a bunch of bovine hormones. Sigh.

I really need some help here. I am so extremely fatigued that I can barely function and it just seems to be getting worse. I'm happy to share any other details you need. But I just want to know where to start. I don't want to see another crappy doctor. I need help and I don't have any energy to help myself.

FWIW, I've also recently been to see a neurologist and was told I have possible MS. We are going to repeat a brain MRI in 6 months. So my fatigue could be related to that, but truly I think there is more to it.

After I figured out what the symptoms are, I realized I didn't need to test. But the big things I've done are lifestyle changes (difficult, I'll admit, I still struggle with getting to bed on time--I'm Central time zone, so you can see that) and figuring out _why_ my body's been stressed and I have adrenal issues. I found out both at once, and with MS symptoms, I'd be looking into reasons for that, and considering that as a cause for both. One thing to rule in or out is mercury; mine came from my amalgam fillings. I've never had MS symptoms, I had other problems, but I understand some people have MS symptoms. I'm sure there are other causes, but with such serious symptoms, it's something to research--mercury's treatable.


----------



## Junegoddess (Apr 17, 2007)

I have read most (I think) of the old thread... and made some great strides toward improving my unproven AF about a year ago. I used Dr. Ron's dessicated adrenal, other good supplements, getting myself to bed sooner, lots of salt in my water, and always tried to get some zucchini when I could (I think TCM says zucchini is good for the adrenals.) I didn't give up coffee... but for a long while I cut back. The salt seemed to be my biggest helper, and the biggest clue that I was right about the AF. I basically declared myself all better, or at least better enough to get pregnant. I really thought I was fine.

Now I'm 32 weeks pregnant, and ever since I had the H1N1 flu in late September, I'm feeling progressively more AF-y. I think. Maybe it's something else. But I sure can hardly get enough salt. I'm also a bottomless pit for magnesium, which I've been pouring down my gullet to try to relieve my sudden-onset constipation. I've never really been constipated before... in my whole life. I always ran the other extreme, thanks to undiagnosed gluten intolerance. Since going gluten-free 2 years ago I've been enjoying being NORMAL. But, for the last 6-7 weeks I seem to be cycling through horrible nothings-gonna-move-without-tearing-something constipation. UGH.

I am also getting waves of... don't even know what to call it. Muscle exhaustion. I feel painfully tingly, as if I have danced too long because the music was that good.







But I haven't been dancing. I've been sitting. Or standing. Standing AND talking at the same time seems to be right out. But not always... sometimes I feel just fine. Yes, I know I'm pregnant, but I am not anemic and I've never been prone to weakness like this just because I'm gestating. When I feel good I feel better than ever. No joint pain, no back pain... my best pregnancy ever. But then I get whopped with the wave of Whatever, and it's like I'm holding my breath. I can, and am, breathing just fine. Baby is not squishing my lungs. But breathing doesn't seem to do me any good... still tingly and still exhausted, until the wave passes.

Does any of this sound familiar?? And... if this is my adrenals... what can I do about it while pregnant? I am dealing with a lot of stress... trying my best to chill out... but I am going to end up with a c-section that I do not want at a hospital that refuses (so far) to compromise on any of their protocols in order to make it family-friendly. I'm having a hard time with that.

I've read that one of the #1 things to avoid with AF is letting yourself get hungry. Well... I am required to let myself get hungry, and it's very possible that the worsening of these symptoms correlates to when I was diagnosed with gestational diabetes. I have to wait 2 hours after each meal in order to test my blood sugar, and sometimes, like now, I get hungry before it's testing time. Really hungry. I feel a little weak and cranky, and normally I would have munched some nuts 15 minutes ago. Not sure what I can do about that.


----------



## simplykate (Jan 11, 2009)

sorry for the lack of caps, nak!!
hi all, glad to find this thread. i recently sstarted seeing a great nd who diagnosed me with adrenal fatigue and hypothyroid, as well as a toxic level of copper in my system.
i'm wondering about a few things and i thought maybe some of you who have been dealing with this longer may have some insight.
the first is that i was really really sick when preg (currently five months pp)
it was completely debilitaing the first five months then got better but was still pretty bad fir the second half. i planned a homebirth but literally didn't dilate past 4 so after three days i had to have a c section.
i guess i'm wondering if any others have had a similar experience and/or could it be related to the af?
also wondering if anyone has had their copper levels tested? i've heard this can be related to af........

btw, junegoddess , what you're experiencing sounds similar to how i felt when pg, but maybe not as severe. it was so hard to describe but a totally awful feeling!


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

I get nauseous & throw up daily until 20-22 weeks every time. I was never pg & GF together though...I am curious.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Junegoddess, would someone be willing to test your B12? Wondering if that could be low and causing those odd symptoms. And I assume your vitD is good? It can do odd things too. Congratulations on your pregnancy by the way.

I don't know how to deal with the testing issue. Would 1.5 hrs and different cut-offs be a workable compromise with your doc, if you tell them that due to the expanding stomach, you can't eat at once (or whatever excuse you think they'll be ok with) and you're getting hungry/shaky/weak?

I don't suppose you could get in to see an acupuncturist? Pregnancy is draining on the adrenals, I didn't handle my last pregnancy well, so I don't have concrete suggestions except to be easy with yourself, go slow when you can, extra rest. The usual.







I think adrenal supps are fine while pregnant, we're using Allergy Research Group and Priority One. Read a bit, I know my HCP thought they were fine while nursing and she's pretty big on wanting adrenals well-supported during pregnancy--so I'm not sure if it's ok during pregnancy but it seems like it would be.

Simplykate--heavy metals can cause a lot of problems. For me it's mercury from my amalgams, I understand copper causes basically the same symptoms. But from my reading, it's also easier to normalize body levels of copper. You'd want to look into _why_ your copper levels are high, sometimes it's an odd environmental exposure, but sometimes something like gallbladder issues are involved. Our gallbladders, when functioning properly, can mostly regulate copper levels well, but if they're impaired, copper can build up. I like hair testing from Doctor's Data lab, the Hair Elements test, to look at metals. It's a good lab, the data's well-normed, repeatable, like that. What testing did you do?

FWIW, I've read a few places that liver function being impaired can cause prolonged morning sickness. Since the liver and the gallbladder work together, I'd investigate that. My morning sickness in my 2nd pregnancy was significantly worse than my first, and liver issues were involved for me.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Do you guys feel like it takes you forever to get over a cold? I had one two weeks ago, and I still feel tired a lot. I went to get some ginseng at gnc yesterday, but all they had was panax ginseng and siberian root. Is siberian root the same thing as siberian ginseng? I ended up just getting a kelp supplement instead and going outside all day. I think the sun coming out really helped me. The kelp supplement is 100% rda iodine. I think it is better than nothing until I read more about iodine supplementation. It seems very complicated. I'm plowing through the iodine thread now.


----------



## simplykate (Jan 11, 2009)

*l I think adrenal supps are fine while pregnant, we're using Allergy Research Group and Priority One. Read a bit, I know my HCP thought they were fine while nursing and she's pretty big on wanting adrenals well-supported during pregnancy--so I'm not sure if it's ok during pregnancy but it seems like it would b*e. [/B]

FWIW, I took adrenal extracts while I was pregnant as well as a physiological dose of cortisol and my baby girl is healthy as can be. I did it under the supervision of my day who's an M.D. It was the only think that made me at all able to function.
I was reading James Wilsons Adreal Fatigue book and he said that pregnancy usually makes you feel BETTER because the baby is producing extra adrenaline? Was that anybody's experience?

Simplykate--heavy metals can cause a lot of problems. For me it's mercury f*rom my amalgams, I understand copper causes basically the same symptoms. But from my reading, it's also easier to normalize body levels of copper. You'd want to look into _why_ your copper levels are high, sometimes it's an odd environmental exposure, but sometimes something like gallbladder issues are involved. Our gallbladders, when functioning properly, can mostly regulate copper levels well, but if they're impaired, copper can build up. I like hair testing from Doctor's Data lab, the Hair Elements test, to look at metals. It's a good lab, the data's well-normed, repeatable, like that. What testing did you do?*

It was a hair test, though I'm not sure what lab she sent it to. She did say that It's casing liver toxicity and some gallbladder problems, and I'm doing a cleanse right now.
Do you know of any reason why my copper level would be high? I've heard BCP's and copper IUD's but I've never used either. Could it be all the soy milk I drank growing up?

[*I]
FWIW, I've read a few places that liver function being impaired can cause prolonged morning sickness. Since the liver and the gallbladder work together, I'd investigate that. My morning sickness in my 2nd pregnancy was significantly worse than my first, and liver issues were involved for me.[/QUOTE][/I]
*
That makes sense, I never thought of that!

Thanks Tanya, your post was very helpful!


----------



## balancedmama (Feb 16, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
After I figured out what the symptoms are, I realized I didn't need to test. But the big things I've done are lifestyle changes (difficult, I'll admit, I still struggle with getting to bed on time--I'm Central time zone, so you can see that) and figuring out _why_ my body's been stressed and I have adrenal issues. I found out both at once, and with MS symptoms, I'd be looking into reasons for that, and considering that as a cause for both. One thing to rule in or out is mercury; mine came from my amalgam fillings. I've never had MS symptoms, I had other problems, but I understand some people have MS symptoms. I'm sure there are other causes, but with such serious symptoms, it's something to research--mercury's treatable.

Thank you Tanya. I have been tested for mercury and my levels were WNL. I was actually concerned about it because I played with mercury a lot as a child. Yep, you heard that right. My brother brought a jar of it home from a chemistry lab and I took it out of his drawer and had it for several months before he found out.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *balancedmama* 
Thank you Tanya. I have been tested for mercury and my levels were WNL. I was actually concerned about it because I played with mercury a lot as a child. Yep, you heard that right. My brother brought a jar of it home from a chemistry lab and I took it out of his drawer and had it for several months before he found out.

When you say tested, may I ask how? Some of us (like me and my parents and my daughter) don't excrete it well. I don't think my circulating blood level would've been unusual, it was all settled in various tissues causing problems, and for us, the amount in our hair was average/low.

http://www.mercuryexposure.org/index.php?article_id=133

This discusses the topic a bit, and it's been accurate for us. I got my amalgams out 1.5 yrs ago and have chelated Cutler-style since and am feeling much, much better.


----------



## Marnica (Oct 4, 2008)

Wow....this thread is so helpful.
The old one is Sooooo long...I have waded my way through about half of it so far.
I suspect I may have AF
Symptoms are:
(These I have had for a while now)
*feel tired most of the time
*hard time getting out of bed (even after 8 hrs of sleep)
*NO sex drive whatsoever (this preceded having my son who is now 18months old)...let me tell you this doesn't do my marriage any favors








*low tolerance to stress
*anger easily
*easily overwhelmed
*dark bags under my eyes
*bad skin
*moody

These sxs are more recent
*forgetful
*dizziness...weird feeling like I am floating or on a sky walk at the airport when i walk)
*Getting sick alot with colds etc
*skin is worse

I sleep fine, I have ok BP and my thyroid tests are normal (although I know this doesn't mean much)

Could this be AF that is getting worse now?? I will be talking to my ND about doing a saliva test at my appt on Friday. Also should I get my sex hormones tested as well??


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

bringing my constant stress, likely metals problems and sugar addiction to join the party


----------



## MyLittleWonders (Feb 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
bringing my constant stress, likely metals problems and sugar addiction to join the party









Shh ... if we never speak of those things, then maybe they will go away!


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MyLittleWonders* 
Shh ... if we never speak of those things, then maybe they will go away!









we need an ostrich emoticon


----------



## linguistmama (Sep 25, 2006)

simplykate, I had bad HG with both pregnancies. I'm hoping that by supporting my adrenals and thyroid, good diet and homeopathy I can avoid it next time. I saw a homeopath midway through my second pregnancy and it completely went away. I was able to get off the medication which was nice!


----------



## balancedmama (Feb 16, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
When you say tested, may I ask how? Some of us (like me and my parents and my daughter) don't excrete it well. I don't think my circulating blood level would've been unusual, it was all settled in various tissues causing problems, and for us, the amount in our hair was average/low.

http://www.mercuryexposure.org/index.php?article_id=133

This discusses the topic a bit, and it's been accurate for us. I got my amalgams out 1.5 yrs ago and have chelated Cutler-style since and am feeling much, much better.

Wow. I had no idea. I was only blood tested. I will read the article and see if I can get more testing. The amount of mercury exposure I had was tremendous.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *linguistmama* 
simplykate, I had bad HG with both pregnancies. I'm hoping that by supporting my adrenals and thyroid, good diet and homeopathy I can avoid it next time. I saw a homeopath midway through my second pregnancy and it completely went away. I was able to get off the medication which was nice!

Chalk me up as another one with HG, though I'd consider my case borderline/mild. I got a homeopathic about halfway through my last pregnancy and had very few problems following.


----------



## savvygrrl (Jun 9, 2005)

I've read through some of the posts on the forum and wondered if there was any update on people's experience getting rid of tinnitus and floaters in the eye? I'd love to hear some stories of success! Anything to hold out hope that it will all go away.

Also, has anyone tried Licorice to help the adrenals? If so, would love to hear that experience.

Thanks.


----------



## Junegoddess (Apr 17, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
Junegoddess, would someone be willing to test your B12? Wondering if that could be low and causing those odd symptoms. And I assume your vitD is good? It can do odd things too. Congratulations on your pregnancy by the way.

I'll check out some adrenal supplements. The dessicated adrenal from Dr. Ron's was really helpful, but also really expensive. I've spent SO much money on supplements... really good ones, and I believe they are worth it... but also spend so much money on food.

I have hemmed and hawed over testing of various kinds for so long. I always seem to get roadblocked by something. I had hair analysis done a year and a half ago, but apparently picked the wrong lab and the results can't be interpreted right and the chiropractor I went through decided that I'm secretly high in copper, but her reasoning made no sense to me... basically she decided I had to be high in copper because I had a copper IUD at the time, despite my symptoms not matching. UGH. It was discouraging. So... I've been timid to jump in and spend a whole lot more money on the really expensive stuff. I'd LOVE to... if I could feel like I wasn't wasting money. I'm overly fascinated with my own chemistry... LOL... so knowing exactly what amino acids I need and my B vitamin levels and whether or not I'm absorbing the zinc I take in... I'd love it.

So many tests seem so important, it feels impossible to decide which ones are most important.

Anyway, my vitamin D is good. 59 last time it was measured, about 3 months ago. I want it higher... 70 would make me happy.

I recently had my first non-stress test, and during the test I got a "wave" of the exhausted, tingly weirdness. And watched my son's heart rate drop 20 points the whole time. As soon as I felt better, his heart rate came back up. Definitely time to mention it to my docs... I just feel ridiculous describing anything as "tingly weirdness" and hoping for an answer. Seems way too vague for medicos.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *balancedmama* 
Wow. I had no idea. I was only blood tested. I will read the article and see if I can get more testing. The amount of mercury exposure I had was tremendous.

The part on testing is a bit buried, the 2nd post on this page explains how to order a hair test and then the interpretation is the same as my first link (also discussed below the info on testing).


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *savvygrrl* 
I've read through some of the posts on the forum and wondered if there was any update on people's experience getting rid of tinnitus and floaters in the eye? I'd love to hear some stories of success! Anything to hold out hope that it will all go away.

Also, has anyone tried Licorice to help the adrenals? If so, would love to hear that experience.

Thanks.

I never had tinnitus, but definitely floaters. I haven't been able to get rid of them, but I do think they're worse when I'm feeling worse - does that make sense?

I've used licorice. It's hard to say what helped me heal to the extent that I did so far. I like the licorice drink in Baschetti's directions (with raw milk.)


----------



## ipodlove (Dec 7, 2009)

Hi ladies -

So glad you started this thread. Thanks so much. It's very helpful to read other's experiences.

I was diagnosed with Adrenal Fatigue back in September, though I suspect it started much earlier than that. It all started with a lot of anxiety over my first business, and some situations that arose from that.

Anyway, this last 12 months have been quite something. First started with sciatica and inflammation for 8 months, that I suspect completely depleted my adrenal following business related stress. After that, I came down with pretty bad flu and various other unusual (for me) illnesses. Eventually, I had a rather severe anxiety attack, and my diet was all over the place. I then got plunged into a deep depression for 3 months. I've never experienced depression before in my life, and that alone was a shocking. I've always been a fighter...and never gave up. But, I guess life just got the best of me at this point (I'm 38). Fortunately, I had a very loving family around me and I spent time recouping on the beach.

I've been trying to get pregnant for a couple of years, but now with all this going on I wonder if that is such a good idea!

So, come September, as soon as I could manage, I made my way to a naturopath. I refused to take any allopathic meds. Instead I took homeopathic remedies, and I did the testing, of homones and of my cortisol levels. Sure enough, I was estrogen dominant and my cortisol levels were depleted. I was stage 2 adrenal fatigue.

My ND immediately started me on 5HTP, and Meta IC3, and chaste tree.

Then, come mid-October, she started me on all the adrenal herbs - which I can list a bit later in another post if it helps anyone.

But, High Potency Vitamin C and Magnesium are the cornerstones.

I've been taking everything religiously, do at least 20 minutes of walking everyday, and try not to argue with anyone. (In the past, I would have regular disagreements, but feel I am losing my 'voice' the stamp of my personality, which gets me down. But I try to remind myself that it's my health or my pride...take the pick. Inevitably, my health wins.) Also, I try to have rest whenever possible, and have changed my diet for more protein, less carbs, and ZERO sugar or caffeine.

My ND says that it takes time to recover. Months, or even a few years.

I do feel a lot better these days. I still get the odd bit odd depression or anxiety - but nothing like before. I notice depression/anxiety happens when i have too much on my plate, or am expecting myself to be perfect in work or to do too much. The whole experience has certainly knocked my confidence, and this is probably the hardest aspect to work with. I rarely charge ahead like I used to. I just hope I will get back to my normal self, with confidence - not too far in the future.

Any AF fatigue success stories?

Thanks so much for sharing!!


----------



## ipodlove (Dec 7, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Marnica* 
Wow....this thread is so helpful.
The old one is Sooooo long...I have waded my way through about half of it so far.
I suspect I may have AF
Symptoms are:
(These I have had for a while now)
*feel tired most of the time
*hard time getting out of bed (even after 8 hrs of sleep)
*NO sex drive whatsoever (this preceded having my son who is now 18months old)...let me tell you this doesn't do my marriage any favors








*low tolerance to stress
*anger easily
*easily overwhelmed
*dark bags under my eyes
*bad skin
*moody

These sxs are more recent
*forgetful
*dizziness...weird feeling like I am floating or on a sky walk at the airport when i walk)
*Getting sick alot with colds etc
*skin is worse


I hear you, and can identify with all this, with the odd bit of depression or anxiety. I've been diagnosed with AF...

the herbs are really helping though - especially the skin, which is soft and glowing. Vitamin B complex was very helpful too at the beginning.

It takes time.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

ipodlove


----------



## Beth F (Apr 19, 2006)

Where do I begin?

Two years ago, I was seeing a holistically inspired doctor who wanted me to take cortisol because my Dianos-Techs test showed that my morning free cortisol level was 3, noon was 1, and evening was 1, and night was less than 1. My pooled DHEA level was 2, stage 7.

I didn't take the cortisol because I was concerned that it would feed my yeast and was concerned about taking anything that I might pass on to my exclusively breastfed (her choice) 1yo dd. I didn't know my amalgams were already were already working on her.









Last night, I saw thishttp://www.drrind.com/therapies/meta...ymptoms-matrix chart that compares various adrenal and thyroid symptoms. I've got low platelets, low blood pressure, low cholesterol with very high HDL.

I wake after too little sleep that is always light and of poor quality. Lately, the quality has gotten even worse, and my parenting is suffering (which has finally prompted me to post here). My sleep degrades to almost no sleep right before my cycle starts.

My GI system is extremely fragile at this point. I can only tolerate select meats, overcooked green beans that have been frozen, overcooked and peeled asparagus, and peeled and well cooked zucchini. No grains, eggs, dairy, nuts....I only tolerate a few supplements. I've finally found a D3 that doesn't give me stomachaches. Cod liver oil, even Green's Pasture, does not agree with me. A drop of alcohol in a homeopathic remedy is way, way too much for me.

What do I do now? Do I do another Diagnos-Techs test? Just start taking pregnenolone on my own? Understandably, I'm overwhelmed and wish that there was a local health care practitioner who I could trust, would take my insurance, and recommend food based supplements.

Any suggestions?


----------



## balancedmama (Feb 16, 2007)

Popping in quickly to see if anyone has any recommendations for labs to get my saliva tested. TIA!


----------



## sarada2010 (Jan 13, 2010)

Hi,
I am new to this forum. Can anyone tell me a doctor who treats adrenals and thyroid in MD, VA and Washington DC area.
Recently I had ASI test and I don't know how can I interpret that.

Thank you


----------



## smeisnotapirate (Aug 24, 2007)

Subby.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *balancedmama* 
Popping in quickly to see if anyone has any recommendations for labs to get my saliva tested. TIA!

DH got tested through Canary Club, it's the 4x/day saliva test (they have a 1 or 2x test as well, but really, 4x is much more helpful), I think it's a bit less than $200 (so it's not the cheapest one).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sarada2010* 
Hi,
I am new to this forum. Can anyone tell me a doctor who treats adrenals and thyroid in MD, VA and Washington DC area.
Recently I had ASI test and I don't know how can I interpret that.

Thank you

I'd ask on the Finding Your Tribe forum (near the top of the page that lists all the forums), and expect to go to someone alternative, maybe an acupuncturist (I love acupuncture), or a chiropractor, an ND, not an endocrinologist. You probably want someone who will look at your whole health history--why do you have thyroid and adrenal issues? That would be ideal. But there should be a lot of people, you just need to find someone who's a good fit for you. Best of luck!

eta: check out this website for interpreting results, should've mentioned this at first...
http://www.chronicfatigue.org/ASI%201%20.html

Look through all 7 stages to see what fits best, lots of people seem to realize hey! I need help in stage 5, but it can vary (and some folks like my DH don't fit any stage well, I think there's some fuzziness as we're transitioning from one stage to another).


----------



## sarada2010 (Jan 13, 2010)

Thank you TanyaLopez. I posted it in Finding your Tribe forum.


----------



## sarada2010 (Jan 13, 2010)

I had my ASI and found out that I have high Cortisol. My results are below. He said that until now he did not seen this type Cortisol levels in his clinical studies and also said that my result is just na artifact









Free Cortisol Rhythm

06:00-8:00 AM 10 Depressed 13-24nM
11:00-noon 12 Elevated 5-10nM
04:00-5:00 PM 25 Elevated 3-8nM
10:00-Midnight 4 Normal 1-4nM

Cortisol Burden 51 23-42

DHEA 10 Normal 3-10ng/ml
Insulin 3 Normal
Progesterone 25 Normal
Total Salivary SIgA 12 Depressed Normal 25-60 mg/dl
Gliadin Ab,SIgA(Saliva) 9 Negative

My doctor gave me the following supplements. If ay of you used any of the following please let me know your experiences.

Pregnenolone
Choline Bitartrate
Florastor
Gymnema4g
Mellow-Tone(with Melatonin)
Any help is appreciated.

Thank you
Sarada


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Any one here use neuroscience? I used them for my saliva test through my ND it was covered my insurance so that was AWESOME! Anyway I'm taking their adrecor but not sure about it really. Jsut wondering thoughts on this. Also taking neurotransmitter support. Serotonin was really low









I'm feeling frustrated tho because even though I'm seeing an ND for my thyoid/adrenals I feel like I'm getting no where. It's hard finding an ND who has alot of experience treating adrenals







Can acupuncture help with AF?

Tanya are you still doing acupuncture?


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

I'm working long-distance with an acupuncturist, so while we talk about TCM stuff (seasons, foods, the way TCM categorizes these things and how they relate to different body systems), I don't actually get needles anymore. Loved it when I did though.

TCM sees adrenal issues as part of the kidney subsystem ("kidney" meaning not just the kidneys, which filter our blood and dump stuff into urine, but a broader system concept). If you read about kidney yin deficiency, it's what we would call adrenal fatigue. This pdf talks about it--so yeah, an acupuncturist should recognize what's going on, but depending on whether your stresses are in the past or are current, that factors into how quickly you start feeling better, and then getting all the way healthy.

http://www.mybodywisdom.net/pdf/Nutr...Kidney_Yin.pdf

mom61508--do you feel like you've got a good handle on _why_ your thyroid and adrenals are having trouble? That was key for me, and it turned out it was something that may not be peoples' first guess.

I think this part is key--if a stress is ongoing, then it can be an uphill battle to heal. Really looking at the chronology of my health history, plus my family health history, showed that I'd had a slow downhill progression for a long time. And for me, noting when my amalgam fillings were placed was important.

Cutting out gluten and dairy was really helpful for me--they weren't the original problem, but as part of my underlying problem gluten and dairy become difficult to digest. It seems like gluten in particular becomes problematic for different reasons for different people, so gf (or gfdf) is something to consider.

Sarada--I haven't used most of those, Florastor should be good for gut health, and I take melatonin every night, and give it to my kids. Love it, don't plan to use it forever, but it's well worth it to get good sleep for all of us.

The 4-5pm reading seems really, really high, I don't understand why, except some error somewhere. How do you feel in the late afternoon? Normal energy, a tired slump?

Low sIgA doesn't seem good, did your ND talk about that? I _think_ if total sIgA is low, then low gliadin antibodies aren't significant--gluten could still be an issue. Have you tried, or considered trying, gluten (and dairy) free? Do people in your family tend to have digestive issues? Always good to do a bit of reading and rule in/out the likelihood of celiac (digestive issues, autoimmune issues, type 1 diabetes can coincide, stuff like that). For us, based on family history and symptoms, it's not our issue, but it was helpful to think about it to know that DD just has garden variety gluten intolerance.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Any one here use neuroscience? I used them for my saliva test through my ND it was covered my insurance so that was AWESOME! Anyway I'm taking their adrecor but not sure about it really. Jsut wondering thoughts on this. Also taking neurotransmitter support. Serotonin was really low









I'm feeling frustrated tho because even though I'm seeing an ND for my thyoid/adrenals I feel like I'm getting no where. It's hard finding an ND who has alot of experience treating adrenals







Can acupuncture help with AF?

Tanya are you still doing acupuncture?

Yes - I did my testing through them and used 1 bottle of Adrecor. I absolutely hated the adrecor - too chemically. Made me want to vomit every time I got the capsules near my mouth. I've since switched to Metagenics' Adrenogen (?).


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
I'm working long-distance with an acupuncturist, so while we talk about TCM stuff (seasons, foods, the way TCM categorizes these things and how they relate to different body systems), I don't actually get needles anymore. Loved it when I did though.

TCM sees adrenal issues as part of the kidney subsystem ("kidney" meaning not just the kidneys, which filter our blood and dump stuff into urine, but a broader system concept). If you read about kidney yin deficiency, it's what we would call adrenal fatigue. This pdf talks about it--so yeah, an acupuncturist should recognize what's going on, but depending on whether your stresses are in the past or are current, that factors into how quickly you start feeling better, and then getting all the way healthy.

http://www.mybodywisdom.net/pdf/Nutr...Kidney_Yin.pdf

mom61508--do you feel like you've got a good handle on _why_ your thyroid and adrenals are having trouble? That was key for me, and it turned out it was something that may not be peoples' first guess.

I think this part is key--if a stress is ongoing, then it can be an uphill battle to heal. Really looking at the chronology of my health history, plus my family health history, showed that I'd had a slow downhill progression for a long time. And for me, noting when my amalgam fillings were placed was important.

Cutting out gluten and dairy was really helpful for me--they weren't the original problem, but as part of my underlying problem gluten and dairy become difficult to digest. It seems like gluten in particular becomes problematic for different reasons for different people, so gf (or gfdf) is something to consider.

Sarada--I haven't used most of those, Florastor should be good for gut health, and I take melatonin every night, and give it to my kids. Love it, don't plan to use it forever, but it's well worth it to get good sleep for all of us.

The 4-5pm reading seems really, really high, I don't understand why, except some error somewhere. How do you feel in the late afternoon? Normal energy, a tired slump?

Low sIgA doesn't seem good, did your ND talk about that? I _think_ if total sIgA is low, then low gliadin antibodies aren't significant--gluten could still be an issue. Have you tried, or considered trying, gluten (and dairy) free? Do people in your family tend to have digestive issues? Always good to do a bit of reading and rule in/out the likelihood of celiac (digestive issues, autoimmune issues, type 1 diabetes can coincide, stuff like that). For us, based on family history and symptoms, it's not our issue, but it was helpful to think about it to know that DD just has garden variety gluten intolerance.

Tanya- I don't feel like I have a handle on it at all! I can't look at my family history, I'm adopted so I have to look at my past which I have with my ND for the most part. I went gluten free for 6 weeks but didn't notice a difference. Was also dairy free before conceiving DD(also before my thyroid went crazy) for months but didn't notice anything. Would it be worth trying again you think?? I really appreciate your input









bluets- I TOTALLY AGREE! I hate taking it...the smell is awful! It was so expensive I feel like I should at lest finish the bottle. I think I'm going to go back to taking herbs. They just take so long to work so I was trying other things. How do you like the adrogen? I'm taking glutagenics for the gut by metagenics which doesn't seem to chemically.


----------



## sarada2010 (Jan 13, 2010)

Thank you somuch TanyaLopez.

*Sarada--I haven't used most of those, Florastor should be good for gut health, and I take melatonin every night, and give it to my kids. Love it, don't plan to use it forever, but it's well worth it to get good sleep for all of us.*

I also started using Melatonin,its good am getting enoogh sleep it seems. I need to start the Florastor.

*The 4-5pm reading seems really, really high, I don't understand why, except some error somewhere. How do you feel in the late afternoon? Normal energy, a tired slump?*

My doctor alsos said the same thing to me and did not believe my result. I feel ok in the late afternoon.

*Low sIgA doesn't seem good, did your ND talk about that? I _think_ if total sIgA is low, then low gliadin antibodies aren't significant--gluten could still be an issue. Have you tried, or considered trying, gluten (and dairy) free? Do people in your family tend to have digestive issues? Always good to do a bit of reading and rule in/out the likelihood of celiac (digestive issues, autoimmune issues, type 1 diabetes can coincide, stuff like that). For us, based on family history and symptoms, it's not our issue, but it was helpful to think about it to know that DD just has garden variety gluten intolerance.*

No, he did not.I am planning to go for GFDF diet and see what happens.None of my family members have the digestive issues as a matter of fact they don't have any issues. I have Hashi. I have requested to do the food allergy testing, not sure if he is going to write the test or not.

Thank you,
Sarada


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Tanya- I don't feel like I have a handle on it at all! I can't look at my family history, I'm adopted so I have to look at my past which I have with my ND for the most part. I went gluten free for 6 weeks but didn't notice a difference. Was also dairy free before conceiving DD(also before my thyroid went crazy) for months but didn't notice anything. Would it be worth trying again you think?? I really appreciate your input









That makes it harder to figure things out, but still doable. I cut out gluten and dairy at the same time, I think that was important for me--not sure if either alone would've helped. That said--my DH didn't feel better gfcf, but his body works differently. I think both are problematic for him, but just removing those wasn't enough. GFCF and lower carb (not truly low carb, but almost grain-free, lots of veggies and animal products, seems to be the trick for him), so there's some guess-and-check involved in this.

So many people with thyroid issues seem to have gluten issues as well, I'd really consider it. Here's a really cool blog that is well-cited, that discusses grains and gluten in particular, maybe something will jump out at you.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sarada2010* 

No, he did not.I am planning to go for GFDF diet and see what happens.None of my family members have the digestive issues as a matter of fact they don't have any issues. I have Hashi. I have requested to do the food allergy testing, not sure if he is going to write the test or not.

Thank you,
Sarada

Yeah, the funny thing is, I didn't have digestive issues either, and gluten was still a problem for me. Never would've guessed it without a HCP to tell me what was going on.

Just to throw it out there (not sure how far back either of you have read), my story is that it turns out that I don't deal well with the mercury in my amalgam fillings. It's not everyone's issue--my husband, for example, rocks at detoxification, he doesn't accumulate this stuff like I do. He had amalgams and they NEVER would've caused him the types of issues I was having. So my history of allergies, anxiety, depression, hypothyroidism, and general fatigue/ickiness was kicked off when my amalgams were placed when I was about 11yo. That's what I had to identify (full disclosure, I found a GREAT HCP who said "I know what's going on with you, Tanya") and start working on, and that helped with the other stuff.

Though nutrients IME were big for thyroid function--ithyroid.com is a great site to read about the nutrients our thyroids need to function--get low on them (zinc, selenium--an important one esp for Hashi's, iodine, extra B vits), and well, your thyroid won't make enough hormone. Ultimately figuring out _why_ you're low on these nutrients is important, but it helped put pieces together for me.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

I finally made an appt for the dr to get my thyroid rechecked. I am actually looking forward to it. I'd say in general my AF symptoms have improved, but in the past few weeks I feel like I"m slipping backward. I feel tired after lunch, then anxious all afternoon and evening until I can finally get my boys in bed and sleep for a good 9 hours. I'm hoping that adjusting my thyroid meds will help, but it does feel like AF.

I feel great allll morning. It is just the second half of the day that blows. I feel like I am ridiculously unproductive for a 28 year old. I just kind of do the bare minimum to get by in the afternoons. BUT I know that I do have some energy, and God would want me to be optimistic. I'm going to use the energy I do have to enjoy my family and try to help my area of the world the best I can. I really want to be able to fix dinner without feeling like it is sucking the life out of me, maybe one day get a part time job, and then maybe one day doing some humanitarian work.

Now it is 8pm, and all I feel like doing is reading in bed until maybe 9pm and then I'm sure I'll be asleep. very boring, but it will help me break this tired/anxious cycle I think.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

wow I slept until 8am. Hopefully this will help me feel better this afternoon. I'm going to try taking half my thyroid med this afternoon, too.


----------



## sarada2010 (Jan 13, 2010)

*Yeah, the funny thing is, I didn't have digestive issues either, and gluten was still a problem for me. Never would've guessed it without a HCP to tell me what was going on.

Just to throw it out there (not sure how far back either of you have read), my story is that it turns out that I don't deal well with the mercury in my amalgam fillings. It's not everyone's issue--my husband, for example, rocks at detoxification, he doesn't accumulate this stuff like I do. He had amalgams and they NEVER would've caused him the types of issues I was having. So my history of allergies, anxiety, depression, hypothyroidism, and general fatigue/ickiness was kicked off when my amalgams were placed when I was about 11yo. That's what I had to identify (full disclosure, I found a GREAT HCP who said "I know what's going on with you, Tanya") and start working on, and that helped with the other stuff.

Though nutrients IME were big for thyroid function--ithyroid.com is a great site to read about the nutrients our thyroids need to function--get low on them (zinc, selenium--an important one esp for Hashi's, iodine, extra B vits), and well, your thyroid won't make enough hormone. Ultimately figuring out _why_ you're low on these nutrients is important, but it helped put pieces together for me.*

Tanya, it is good know you have a great HCP. I will visit the ithyroid.com website. I take zinc, for selenium I take 1brazil nut everyday. I don't have any idea of what to take for B complex.

Thank you,
Sarada


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Thorne makes some nice multivits and B complexes with real folate (not just folic acid) and it's easy to buy online.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
That makes it harder to figure things out, but still doable. I cut out gluten and dairy at the same time, I think that was important for me--not sure if either alone would've helped. That said--my DH didn't feel better gfcf, but his body works differently. I think both are problematic for him, but just removing those wasn't enough. GFCF and lower carb (not truly low carb, but almost grain-free, lots of veggies and animal products, seems to be the trick for him), so there's some guess-and-check involved in this.

So many people with thyroid issues seem to have gluten issues as well, I'd really consider it. Here's a really cool blog that is well-cited, that discusses grains and gluten in particular, maybe something will jump out at you.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/

Yeah, the funny thing is, I didn't have digestive issues either, and gluten was still a problem for me. Never would've guessed it without a HCP to tell me what was going on.

Just to throw it out there (not sure how far back either of you have read), my story is that it turns out that I don't deal well with the mercury in my amalgam fillings. It's not everyone's issue--my husband, for example, rocks at detoxification, he doesn't accumulate this stuff like I do. He had amalgams and they NEVER would've caused him the types of issues I was having. So my history of allergies, anxiety, depression, hypothyroidism, and general fatigue/ickiness was kicked off when my amalgams were placed when I was about 11yo. That's what I had to identify (full disclosure, I found a GREAT HCP who said "I know what's going on with you, Tanya") and start working on, and that helped with the other stuff.

Though nutrients IME were big for thyroid function--ithyroid.com is a great site to read about the nutrients our thyroids need to function--get low on them (zinc, selenium--an important one esp for Hashi's, iodine, extra B vits), and well, your thyroid won't make enough hormone. Ultimately figuring out _why_ you're low on these nutrients is important, but it helped put pieces together for me.

Tanya-going to hit up that website you gave me about gluten. Maybe I should give it another go. Curious, Do you know a lot about Hashis? BTW the info you gave me was so intersting on the kidneys


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Tanya-going to hit up that website you gave me about gluten. Maybe I should give it another go. Curious, Do you know a lot about Hashis? BTW the info you gave me was so intersting on the kidneys









I don't know a lot, to me Hashi's doesn't seem that much different than plain ol' hypothyroidism except for the antibodies. There's a study that showed selenium supplementation, 200mcg/day, significantly reduced antibodies, so I have to wonder if, for some of us, the difference is how low we are in selenium (selenium's also key for converting T4 to T3, so if you took Synthroid and your bloodwork was fine but you felt crappy, supplemental selenium may help). Adrenal stress can also cause similar symptoms, and some people find that their adrenals get worse if they don't support them and they do do thyroid support--not everyone, but things to consider when thyroid supplementation doesn't have the desired results.

You'd want to consider other autoimmune stuff, celiac would be an obvious one, that could be contributing to immune dysfunction. If you've got other stuff going on that's strange, looking into other autoimmune possibilities would make sense, but if it's pretty straightforward hypo symptoms and adrenal symptoms, I'd probably go with extra selenium, and regular hypo and adrenal approaches.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
I don't know a lot, to me Hashi's doesn't seem that much different than plain ol' hypothyroidism except for the antibodies. There's a study that showed selenium supplementation, 200mcg/day, significantly reduced antibodies, so I have to wonder if, for some of us, the difference is how low we are in selenium (selenium's also key for converting T4 to T3, so if you took Synthroid and your bloodwork was fine but you felt crappy, supplemental selenium may help). Adrenal stress can also cause similar symptoms, and some people find that their adrenals get worse if they don't support them and they do do thyroid support--not everyone, but things to consider when thyroid supplementation doesn't have the desired results.

You'd want to consider other autoimmune stuff, celiac would be an obvious one, that could be contributing to immune dysfunction. If you've got other stuff going on that's strange, looking into other autoimmune possibilities would make sense, but if it's pretty straightforward hypo symptoms and adrenal symptoms, I'd probably go with extra selenium, and regular hypo and adrenal approaches.

I took armour then naturthroid then went off the meds because I swung into hyper. I'm definitely not celiac but sensitive maybe but like I said I cut gluten out for 6 weeks and didn't notice a difference so that makes me hesitant to try again. The thing that's strange is I have no hyper symptoms except irregualr heartbeat but have had that since I was 16. I know my adrenals really suffering. But can't seem to get anywhere with my ND







Don't want to get to into thyroid here but the thyroid thread isn't very hoppin


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I took armour then naturthroid then went off the meds because I swung into hyper. I'm definitely not celiac but sensitive maybe but like I said I cut gluten out for 6 weeks and didn't notice a difference so that makes me hesitant to try again. The thing that's strange is I have no hyper symptoms except irregualr heartbeat but have had that since I was 16. I know my adrenals really suffering. But can't seem to get anywhere with my ND







Don't want to get to into thyroid here but the thyroid thread isn't very hoppin

It's actually really typical to get "hyper" symptoms when you start/take Armour or it's alternatives- ESPECIALLY if your adrenals aren't up to par. All of the thyroid meds state explicitly that you should not take them if your adrenals aren't functioning appropriately (or something similar, can't remember the exact quote).
Some of the thyroid symptoms seem to jump the fence as they "feel" like it too. I believe there are some women in the thyroid thread who've experienced rapid heartbeat from hypo.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
It's actually really typical to get "hyper" symptoms when you start/take Armour or it's alternatives- ESPECIALLY if your adrenals aren't up to par. All of the thyroid meds state explicitly that you should not take them if your adrenals aren't functioning appropriately (or something similar, can't remember the exact quote).
Some of the thyroid symptoms seem to jump the fence as they "feel" like it too. I believe there are some women in the thyroid thread who've experienced rapid heartbeat from hypo.

Isn't it typical when you have Hashis to swing from hypo to hyper tho?? My heartbeat rarely feels rapid. It's skips beat though. It's done that for years. I won't go on naturthroid again that's for sure although it did help for a short time. What are you doing for your adrenals/thyroid?I think I remember that you have hashis? I like to hear what others are doing.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Isn't it typical when you have Hashis to swing from hypo to hyper tho?? My heartbeat rarely feels rapid. It's skips beat though. It's done that for years. I won't go on naturthroid again that's for sure although it did help for a short time. What are you doing for your adrenals/thyroid?I think I remember that you have hashis? I like to hear what others are doing.

Yes, I do have Hashi's. I'm on Armour/desiccated thyroid (was Naturethroid for a while, now compounded thyroid) as well as Adrenal Support supplement, B complex, prenatal, vitamin D, cal/mag supp, selenium (helps to decrease antibodies) and a bunch of others... Also gluten (there are studies saying it may increase antibodies), dairy, soy/goitrogen, and other free or limited usually.
My heart was the same way. It's adrenal related.
I've heard it is, but I'm still waiting for a hyper period nearly 2 years post-dx.








At this point, I'm trying to optimize my nutrition (through supplements for now but working on dietary changes again as well), get sufficient rest and reduce/manage stress.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

I used to have skipped beats, since I was a kid/teens (don't remember exactly), it's gone away now that I've supplemented magnesium a while. I also had periodic racing episodes, but I didn't know about them except for a doc finding them with testing, so I don't know if they're gone.







But I'm wondering if they were a different mag deficiency related weirdness. But I didn't feel panicky or anxious or anything, so I'm not sure it's the same. But most everyone could use more magnesium, particularly the people who post to threads in H&H.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
I used to have skipped beats, since I was a kid/teens (don't remember exactly), it's gone away now that I've supplemented magnesium a while. I also had periodic racing episodes, but I didn't know about them except for a doc finding them with testing, so I don't know if they're gone.







But I'm wondering if they were a different mag deficiency related weirdness. But I didn't feel panicky or anxious or anything, so I'm not sure it's the same. But most everyone could use more magnesium, particularly the people who post to threads in H&H.









dh had a racy heart (even in the middle of an echocardiogram)... anxiety... panic attacks... all went away when he (a) cut back on caffeine (b) cut back on junk food (c) added a whopping magnesium supplement and (d) started working on his adrenals (he uses Adrenergize). of course, he's in a pretty high-stress job and our work is always teetering on the edge of "are we going to exist next year or not?" so he doesn't see himself going off the adrenergize any time soon.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
Yes, I do have Hashi's. I'm on Armour/desiccated thyroid (was Naturethroid for a while, now compounded thyroid) as well as Adrenal Support supplement, B complex, prenatal, vitamin D, cal/mag supp, selenium (helps to decrease antibodies) and a bunch of others... Also gluten (there are studies saying it may increase antibodies), dairy, soy/goitrogen, and other free or limited usually.
My heart was the same way. It's adrenal related.
I've heard it is, but I'm still waiting for a hyper period nearly 2 years post-dx.








At this point, I'm trying to optimize my nutrition (through supplements for now but working on dietary changes again as well), get sufficient rest and reduce/manage stress.

Which adrenal supplement are you taking? I'm taking adrecor but I'm not crazy about it. I don't like taking synthetics really. I love herbs but they take so long to work for adrenal issues. I'm going to be cutting out gluten again once we get settled. Are you just taking brazil nuts for your selenium? Thanks for being cool with my 20 questions


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
I used to have skipped beats, since I was a kid/teens (don't remember exactly), it's gone away now that I've supplemented magnesium a while. I also had periodic racing episodes, but I didn't know about them except for a doc finding them with testing, so I don't know if they're gone.







But I'm wondering if they were a different mag deficiency related weirdness. But I didn't feel panicky or anxious or anything, so I'm not sure it's the same. But most everyone could use more magnesium, particularly the people who post to threads in H&H.









I did mag(natural calm) for awhile but didn't notice a different in my heart. But man did that stuff make me nauseas!!!


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Which adrenal supplement are you taking? I'm taking adrecor but I'm not crazy about it. I don't like taking synthetics really. I love herbs but they take so long to work for adrenal issues. I'm going to be cutting out gluten again once we get settled. Are you just taking brazil nuts for your selenium? Thanks for being cool with my 20 questions









I take Vital Nutrients' Adrenal Support. DS2 reacts to nuts through bm so I don't eat nuts (except for pine nuts) so I also get selenium through Vital Nutrients. I take a LOT of supplements.







If I could replace the selenium with brazil nuts, I'd be ecstatic.








I like the VN Adrenal supp. It's not something I realize is "working" until I stop taking it, iykwim. It's a glandular though, so if that's against your beliefs or whatever, it wouldn't work for you.
One thing that really reduced stress for me, in hindsight, was adding milk thistle, vitamin E and magnesium- I'm not sure which one's to "blame" for sure though because I added them all at the same time.

eta: that link is just the first one I found for VN's Adrenal Support and I'm in no way affiliated with it.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
I take Vital Nutrients' Adrenal Support. DS2 reacts to nuts through bm so I don't eat nuts (except for pine nuts) so I also get selenium through Vital Nutrients. I take a LOT of supplements.







If I could replace the selenium with brazil nuts, I'd be ecstatic.








I like the VN Adrenal supp. It's not something I realize is "working" until I stop taking it, iykwim. It's a glandular though, so if that's against your beliefs or whatever, it wouldn't work for you.
One thing that really reduced stress for me, in hindsight, was adding milk thistle, vitamin E and magnesium- I'm not sure which one's to "blame" for sure though because I added them all at the same time.

eta: that link is just the first one I found for VN's Adrenal Support and I'm in no way affiliated with it.









Thanks for the info. I'm actually all for glandulars BUT since I'm in a hyper state my ND advised against it. I'm taking milk thistle now as well but not E or Mag. I wonder why ND's don't tell you to take these vitamins and minerals it's so frustrating! I'm currently doing acupuncture sowe will see how that goes. Do you take iodine?


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Thanks for the info. I'm actually all for glandulars BUT since I'm in a hyper state my ND advised against it. I'm taking milk thistle now as well but not E or Mag. I wonder why ND's don't tell you to take these vitamins and minerals it's so frustrating! I'm currently doing acupuncture sowe will see how that goes. Do you take iodine?

This is an _adrenal_ glandular not thyroid.
I just started very low (75 mcg/day) iodine supplementation bc we don't use iodized salt and don't eat much for sea food. I don't trust that we're getting the RDA from food sources and think we need more than that to flush out halides from everyday exposure while supplying what our body needs for normal use anyway.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
This is an _adrenal_ glandular not thyroid.
I just started very low (75 mcg/day) iodine supplementation bc we don't use iodized salt and don't eat much for sea food. I don't trust that we're getting the RDA from food sources and think we need more than that to flush out halides from everyday exposure while supplying what our body needs for normal use anyway.

Oh yes I know it's a adrenal glandular that's what she said she didn't want me taking..hmmmmm We eat seafood moderately but only use sea salt. What kind of iodine are you using?


----------



## Tumble Bumbles (Oct 15, 2009)

Question for you wise ladies: I am begining to have hyper symptoms, despite being on the same dose of Armour for about 6 months. Could my thyroid be 'kicking into gear' again, so to speak, because I am treating my (suspected) adrenal fatigue? I am going to the doc Thursday for testing of my TSH, free T3 and free T4. Is there anything else I should have him test?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tumble Bumbles* 
Question for you wise ladies: I am begining to have hyper symptoms, despite being on the same dose of Armour for about 6 months. Could my thyroid be 'kicking into gear' again, so to speak, because I am treating my (suspected) adrenal fatigue? I am going to the doc Thursday for testing of my TSH, free T3 and free T4. Is there anything else I should have him test?

Thanks in advance.

What symptoms are you having? I went into hyper state while on naturthroid as well and I stopped the med which my ND told me was a wise idea. I knew I went into a hyper state because my thyroid would pulsate and started to enlarge again. Do you have hashis?


----------



## Tumble Bumbles (Oct 15, 2009)

I am having anxiety and insomnia mostly, feeling 'on edge' and jittery, with no known cause or trigger. This has been happening for about 3 days. I see my doctor Thursday.

I was wondering if taking care of my adrenals over the last several months (and praying for healing/visualization) has somehow sent a message to my thyroid to start working again?

What exactly would I have tested to see if I have Hashis? I don't believe I do (I've had tests out the wazzoo for this, my doc is not just a TSH'er), but maybe we missed something.

I know thyroid meds are not indicated if one has adrenal fatigue or stressed adrenals, and that is where my doctor seems somewhat mainstream. He didn't address AF (and to be fair, at the time I had not explored it yet either).

Thank you for your help!


----------



## Tumble Bumbles (Oct 15, 2009)

You know what, reading up in the thread, it just occured to me: we ran out of epsom salts a week or two ago, and I may be lacking in magnesium! That could be causing the anxiety/jittery feeling. Time to go to the store and get some more!


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tumble Bumbles* 
I am having anxiety and insomnia mostly, feeling 'on edge' and jittery, with no known cause or trigger. This has been happening for about 3 days. I see my doctor Thursday.

I was wondering if taking care of my adrenals over the last several months (and praying for healing/visualization) has somehow sent a message to my thyroid to start working again?

What exactly would I have tested to see if I have Hashis? I don't believe I do (I've had tests out the wazzoo for this, my doc is not just a TSH'er), but maybe we missed something.

I know thyroid meds are not indicated if one has adrenal fatigue or stressed adrenals, and that is where my doctor seems somewhat mainstream. He didn't address AF (and to be fair, at the time I had not explored it yet either).

Thank you for your help!

The test you would get is thyroid antibodies but I'm not sure the EXACT name. I hope your thyroid is working again







Would you mind telling me what your taking for your AF?


----------



## balancedmama (Feb 16, 2007)

Ack, I just typed out all of my saliva results and then accidentally closed the window.









Okay, here I go again...

Free Cortisol Rhythm
Morning *19* Normal (13-24 nM)
Noon *10* Normal (5-10 nM)
Afternoon *17* Elevated (3-8 nM)
10:00pm *5* Elevated (1-4 nM)

Cortisol Burden: *51* (23 - 42)

DHEA
Pooled Value *13* Elevated
Adults (M/F): 3-10 ng/ml

Insulin
Fasting *<*3 Normal: 3-12 uIU/mL
Non-Fasting *<3* Depressed Optimal: 5-20 uIU/mL

P17-OH 17-OH Progesterone *75* Normal
(Optimal: 22-100 pg/ml
Borderline: 101-130 pg/ml
Elevated: >130 pg/ml )

Total Salivary SIgA *6* Depressed
(Normal: 25-60 mg/dl
Borderline: 20-25 mg/dl)

Gliadin Ab, SIgA (Saliva) *12* Negative
(Borderline: 13-15 U/ml
Positive: >15 U/ml)

Any thoughts?


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Which adrenal supplement are you taking? I'm taking adrecor but I'm not crazy about it. I don't like taking synthetics really. I love herbs but they take so long to work for adrenal issues. I'm going to be cutting out gluten again once we get settled. Are you just taking brazil nuts for your selenium? Thanks for being cool with my 20 questions









FWIW, I took Adrecor as well and felt no huge benefit.







No improvement with straight rhodiola (one of the ingredients in Andrecor) either. hth.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dhammamama* 
FWIW, I took Adrecor as well and felt no huge benefit.







No improvement with straight rhodiola (one of the ingredients in Andrecor) either. hth.

ya I think I'm going to stop it and try a different adrenal supp. Just not sure which one I should start? I was thinking of adrenal balance by NewMark


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *balancedmama* 
Ack, I just typed out all of my saliva results and then accidentally closed the window.









Okay, here I go again...

Free Cortisol Rhythm
Morning *19* Normal (13-24 nM)
Noon *10* Normal (5-10 nM)
Afternoon *17* Elevated (3-8 nM)
10:00pm *5* Elevated (1-4 nM)

Cortisol Burden: *51* (23 - 42)

DHEA
Pooled Value *13* Elevated
Adults (M/F): 3-10 ng/ml

Insulin
Fasting *<*3 Normal: 3-12 uIU/mL
Non-Fasting *<3* Depressed Optimal: 5-20 uIU/mL

P17-OH 17-OH Progesterone *75* Normal
(Optimal: 22-100 pg/ml
Borderline: 101-130 pg/ml
Elevated: >130 pg/ml )

Total Salivary SIgA *6* Depressed
(Normal: 25-60 mg/dl
Borderline: 20-25 mg/dl)

Gliadin Ab, SIgA (Saliva) *12* Negative
(Borderline: 13-15 U/ml
Positive: >15 U/ml)

Any thoughts?

Missed this, saw your other thread... thoughts working backwards...

Negative to gliadin isn't significant if sIgA is low, I believe, and low sIgA needs to be considered and addressed, it's an important part of the immune system. I'd be thinking about problem-solving digestive stuff, but also immune system stuff, you can start with basics like vitamin D (tested recently? supplementing? the vitamin D council website is a good place to read, they've got a quick getting-going page), zinc, anything that's odd along these lines to use to problem-solve.

I know next to nothing about insulin/blood sugar stuff.

Progesterone I assume is okay, the cortisol pattern seems to follow the general shape here (but DHEA doesn't fit, I don't know why that would be...)

http://www.chronicfatigue.org/ASI%203.html

Look through the other stages, the 7-stage model seems pretty helpful to me, stage 1 is normal/healthy and stage 7 is barely able to function.

From your other thread, it sounds like you feel pretty crappy, is that a fair assessment? If I can give a guess, and it's only a guess, maybe your adrenals are starting to go downhill, but something else is off, because that cortisol pattern doesn't seem severe enough on its own to make you feel really bad. Had thyroid labwork done recently, with TSH and free-T3 and free-T4? Any autoimmune stuff in the family, or in your history? Possibility of celiac?

That's my best guess, but I'm just a recovering sickie.









I'll copy/paste this over, just in case.


----------



## Deefodil (May 25, 2009)

I know nothing about adrenal fatigue, but it was suggested by a member that I come check it out, due to my many symptoms that I am currently attributing to depression.









I'll start reading at the beginning now.


----------



## mellowjello (Jul 22, 2008)

I am STILL trying to finish THE Adrenal Fatigue Thread! But in the meantime would appreciate any advice. I posted this as a question in the H&H forum too.

I know I have adrenal fatigue, but have not been able to do a recent test because I wake up at 1:00AM and can't go back to sleep, and you're supposed to collect the first saliva after waking, which is supposed to be about 6-7 AM. So my Dr. said don't worry about the test right now, let's just start you on some supps because it's clear you need it, and then test later.

For several months I had an extremely exaggerated startle response to anything, just dropping a spoon on the floor, would make me startle and sweat under the arms. Then that stopped. I think my adrenals went ka-put.

I tried taking 25mg DHEA and felt pretty good, then stopped it because I wanted to be clear for the adrenal test, and felt more horrible coming down from the DHEA than I have for a long time.

Prior to taking the DHEA, I had horrible cravings for eggs. I would be happy eating a dozen a day. My cholesterol is not low, it's high normal. My iodine is super super super low. I started taking Iodoral.

Dr. prescribed Cortef, but I am really worried about taking something that could suppress immune function because I am fighting a parasite infection and my body is already having a tough enough time fighting the parasite even while on Alinia and parasite herbs at the same time.

Does DHEA suppress immune function too?

I am also concerned about starting DHEA and Cortef and not being able to get off of them, especially if we want to try for another baby, although I know I can't do that until my adrenals are healed anyway. Actually I wonder if I am better off taking the hormones so I can heal faster, thus making it possible to get off them and conceive sooner than if I try to heal via the natural route. I would rather go the natural route, but I just don't know what is best.

Getting rid of the chronic infection is key to healing my adrenals, I think, but it's a chicken-egg thing because my immune system is weak (from low adrenal function? is that possible?)


----------



## mellowjello (Jul 22, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hippiemom* 
He has recently, with my help, cleaned up his diet







Awesome b/c I think some of his bad eating habits were stressing his system further.

That is great! I have found the GAPS diet really helps my adrenals. But I still have a long way to go.


----------



## mellowjello (Jul 22, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TanyaLopez* 
When you say tested, may I ask how? Some of us (like me and my parents and my daughter) don't excrete it well. I don't think my circulating blood level would've been unusual, it was all settled in various tissues causing problems, and for us, the amount in our hair was average/low.

If a urine porphoryns test comes back WNL, then does that mean you do not have a mercury problem?


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mellowjello* 
If a urine porphoryns test comes back WNL, then does that mean you do not have a mercury problem?

What's WNL? I've read that, using many labs, urine porphyrins test have false negatives due to handling issues. There's a lab in France and I read that now there's one in the US that is doing it consistently well (I think the inconsistency is the problem at most labs) but I forget the name. We discussed it in the Allergies forum several months ago, if you search the forum for porphyrins, you'd get hits.

If you wanted to read more on the pluses and minuses of hair tests (specifically the Hair Elements Test from Doctor's Data, because there is a large body of data that can be used to interpret the results) the frequent dose chelation yahoo group and/or the autism mercury yahoo group would be places to read.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Mellowjello, I wish I knew more about immune function and adrenal function. Anecdotally, people with adrenal issues seem to get sick when a stress is removed from them and their adrenals start doing less (at the beginning of healing). But I think little kids get sick with high cortisol levels, so I'm not sure what's going on.

Not ignoring you, just too ignorant to help.

My HCP recommended DHEA for relatively short time periods (how long? not really sure, I didn't feel different taking it so I just stopped). Cortef is replacement cortisol, right? Actual cortisol? I hear it's very difficult to wean off and neither DH nor I has gotten to the point of needing that.

I'm assuming that, at least for me, immune system stuff is caused by something else, and that something else is stressing me and making my adrenals wear down. So they're both happening due to a third, underlying cause rather than one being the result directly of the other. Don't know a lot about dealing with parasites though, so I don't want to overstep my understanding.

I don't know if Cortef suppresses immune function. Lots of don't-knows here.


----------



## mellowjello (Jul 22, 2008)

Thanks Tanya! I appreciate your posts!


----------



## StrongBeliever (Apr 24, 2007)

Bumping! I just want to keep track. Working it all out right now and learning. Thank you all so much who contribute to these awesome educational threads!


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Glad to see this thread is still active. I need to get back into focusing on my adrenals since they're back in the dumps. From what I remember last time I suffered a major, life-changing stress, I was able to recover more quickly - I'm hoping with some TLC, that'll be the case this time as well.

I think my last biggest stress was when my Dad had some heart attacks here at home back in October of 2008 with a heart cath and then bypass surgery following. The week between when he refused to go to the hospital was one of the most stressful times of my life - and then the surgery. But I recovered and things were better.

As many of you long-timers know, we share a home with my parents. My Dad died suddenly and unexpectedly on 2/15. As expected, the adrenaline kept me chugging away with the necessary things for about a week and then the constant lightheadedness set in. Now I'm exhausted all the time, achey, dizzy and super sensitive to sugar/carbs.

In a way, I think that I feel a certain relief in that I don't have to wait for his health to decline, kwim? No more anxiety about when he'd have a heart attack or something. But OTOH, I am dealing with trying to figure out finances for my Mom, taxes, SS, all kinds of stuff. At least I know that once I get everything figured out, it'll get easier and more routine.

I need to do a supplement order since I'm running low on everything. I think I'm going to get a super B5 complex rather than just a broad B-complex. I really like Thorne brand. I actually used my Seriphos to get through my Dad's service and it really took the edge off.

A friend made us a lovely meal and sent along a book about Heartmath. I'd heard of it before and knew to recognize the feeling that I describe as your heart bursting with love and trying to achieve that feeling more often, but reading through the book (it's about handling stress) has been super helpful.
There's a chapter on adrenal health/stress hormones and it says that supplements don't really get to the root of it because it boils down to emotional outlooks. It makes sense because you really have to learn to change the way you interpret things from the outside world. Learning to deal with stress is key to healing adrenals. I've always looked at it like: healing your adrenals is the key to being able to deal with stress, but I suppose turning that around makes sense.

The book is called: Transforming Stress: The Heartmath Solution For Relieving Worry, Fatigue, And Tension I highly recommend it for everyone, but especially people who need help healing their adrenals.

I think I'm due for another ASI soon - this will be my fourth annual ASI. I feel like I'm STILL going to be in Zone 7, after what's gone on recently. But, I am still anxiety-free (not including recent health anxiety that began after my Dad died - which I think is a perfectly normal, and temporary response.)


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Metasequoia* 
Glad to see this thread is still active. I need to get back into focusing on my adrenals since they're back in the dumps. From what I remember last time I suffered a major, life-changing stress, I was able to recover more quickly - I'm hoping with some TLC, that'll be the case this time as well.

I think my last biggest stress was when my Dad had some heart attacks here at home back in October of 2008 with a heart cath and then bypass surgery following. The week between when he refused to go to the hospital was one of the most stressful times of my life - and then the surgery. But I recovered and things were better.

As many of you long-timers know, we share a home with my parents. My Dad died suddenly and unexpectedly on 2/15. As expected, the adrenaline kept me chugging away with the necessary things for about a week and then the constant lightheadedness set in. Now I'm exhausted all the time, achey, dizzy and super sensitive to sugar/carbs.

In a way, I think that I feel a certain relief in that I don't have to wait for his health to decline, kwim? No more anxiety about when he'd have a heart attack or something. But OTOH, I am dealing with trying to figure out finances for my Mom, taxes, SS, all kinds of stuff. At least I know that once I get everything figured out, it'll get easier and more routine.

I need to do a supplement order since I'm running low on everything. I think I'm going to get a super B5 complex rather than just a broad B-complex. I really like Thorne brand. I actually used my Seriphos to get through my Dad's service and it really took the edge off.

A friend made us a lovely meal and sent along a book about Heartmath. I'd heard of it before and knew to recognize the feeling that I describe as your heart bursting with love and trying to achieve that feeling more often, but reading through the book (it's about handling stress) has been super helpful.
There's a chapter on adrenal health/stress hormones and it says that supplements don't really get to the root of it because it boils down to emotional outlooks. It makes sense because you really have to learn to change the way you interpret things from the outside world. Learning to deal with stress is key to healing adrenals. I've always looked at it like: healing your adrenals is the key to being able to deal with stress, but I suppose turning that around makes sense.

The book is called: Transforming Stress: The Heartmath Solution For Relieving Worry, Fatigue, And Tension I highly recommend it for everyone, but especially people who need help healing their adrenals.

I think I'm due for another ASI soon - this will be my fourth annual ASI. I feel like I'm STILL going to be in Zone 7, after what's gone on recently. But, I am still anxiety-free (not including recent health anxiety that began after my Dad died - which I think is a perfectly normal, and temporary response.)

My heart goes out to you. I hope things are getting better for you. Thanks for the book rec...sounds like a great resource. Are you still seeing the same Doc from the start of the thread? FYI acupuncture has been very helpful for me with balancing the body and dealing with stress. And I too would say anxiety after a loss is perfectly normal.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Meta. So sorry for your loss.


----------



## lissybeth74 (Sep 14, 2004)

So sorry to hear about your loss.









I've been an adrenal patient of Dr. Neville's for years, and absolutely adore him. And while the supplements, and visits there have been SO beneficial to my healing, I believe the biggest help has been to change my thinking. Like you said, "you really have to learn to change the way you interpret things from the outside world." This is soooooo true. I've noticed that when it comes to stress, or life in general, attitude is everything. The things we tell ourselves all throughout the day get processed internally, and there is a physiological reaction that takes place for every thought we have, whether helpful or not. I've had to do a lot of practicing to change some of the things I was telling myself (alot like cognitive behavioral therapy). I don't always do a great job at it, but I'm more aware of how I "think" about everything I encounter in my day (stress and all). And I have noticed a big difference in how it makes me feel (adrenal-wise).

Thanks for the book recommendation. I will definitely be checking it out.


----------



## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Mesa, sorry to hear about your sudden and unexpected loss. How jolting! I know you have been very concerned with your father's health situation.









That book sounds revolutionary and progressive. It is fascinating how our emotions effect our health, and the other way around, inseparably. Have you considered homeopathy or flower essence for support? I have found these to be amazing tools to help me find the less reactive place and allow my adrenals to heal.

I found your 'adrenaline followed by lightheadness' a familiar experience. Happened this week, out of the blue. And it exactly was *how* I was processing, rather than *what* was happening. I was able to recognize that my thoughts and my interpretation of the events was amping me up, more than the actual event could effect me. I had to walk away and talk myself down, refocus on the bigger picture, rather than the angst about the minutia. I wonder how much of that perfectionist thinking damages us, ironically. Thanks for the reminder to observe for that.

Again, sad about your loss. It feels profound. We're coming up on a year since my mom died suddenly and it is much easier than it was in the midst of it.

Pat


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

I feel so fortunate to have this community - even if it is online. The ideas we share help so much, and the sympathies and understanding go a long way toward healing.

Thanks guys.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WuWei* 
Again, sad about your loss. It feels profound. We're coming up on a year since my mom died suddenly and it is much easier than it was in the midst of it.

It goes so quickly and yet so slowly. I'm having a hard time to believe this will be the 3rd anniversary for my father.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Can I ask those of you who've lost parents how your outlooks changed and if they ever dissolved? I think I'm feeling a bit down lately. Right after my Dad died, people said I'd go on adrenaline for a bit, then get sad, then angry, then depressed. I know that this pattern can't be the same for everyone (I know a lot of men who skip right to anger and stay there a while.)
I don't tend towards depression, but sitting here, going through all of his stuff, just tears me up - especially realizing how much he struggled with debt. What angers me the most is that he paid out the wazoo for health insurance and yet STILL struggled with medical debt. This really, REALLY makes me feel angry. I don't know how to turn that anger into something less....toxic, because I feel like it's justified.
And then the other debt, and ALL of the credit card offers and credit card checks - it just infuriates me how creditors prey on people in financial distress.
And then there's the guilt, that if I'd known of his financial stress, I could have DONE something, could have made a difference, but I never knew the extent of it.

I think a lot of this is just me feeling overwhelmed with everything I have to get through - and some of it with a deadline, like taxes. ugh.

I guess I want to know if everything was "tainted" with death for a while for you? It sounds terrible, but I look at my Mom and think "It's just a matter of time...wonder how she'll go?" And I look at pictures of my Dad when he was a chubby, healthy little baby or toddler and I quickly think of my babies, how fast time goes by and how I don't want them to ever suffer any of the stress or health issues that my Dad dealt with.
And I think of myself - this one is hard - the health anxiety is hard to tame. I think that at 33, my arteries could be seriously diseased. I think of my sensitivity to sugars and carbs and wonder if I'm pre-diabetic. I think of my weak adrenals and wonder if I'm doomed to heart disease caused by stress.

I just feel so deeply immersed in all of this and I must get through all of this, but it's so hard to lose your perspective.

At least the seasons are on my side - if it was October, I don't know how I'd get through this.


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

i haven't read the whole thread yet but just wanted to join and give my story. about 1.5 years ago i went to the endo with my 24-hr salivary cortisol test (and other hormones) showing mild adrenal fatigue. she said the tests were unreliable because 90% of her patients would have the same results (uh, where else would they go? the dentist?). anyway, she said from my symptoms that i might be developing hashimoto's. blood tests at the time came back OK.

since then, i've gotten worse. more anxiety, more panic attacks, and my thyroid has now swollen much larger than normal on the right side and has developed bumps. she's diagnosed me as having developed hashimoto's thyroiditis, started me on synthroid, and is having new blood work done at the end of the month.

i kind of feel like i would not have developed the hashi's if she had adequately addressed my adrenal issues. so, since she doesn't believe in adrenal fatigue (until it becomes addison's), and didn't want me to try Lugol's iodine, i'm doing everything on my own.

so far i've added in sodium ascorbate (about 4000 mg/day), B5 (1500 mg/mcg? per day), magnesium (400-600 mg/day), B-complex, D3 (6000-8000 IU/day), iodine/iodide from Lugol's solution (currently at 1 drop every other day; next week i'll try 1 drop every day and see how it feels. i had tried 2 drops at a time and it made me feel sick for days afterwards), potassium (99 mg/mcg?), selenium (have to refill) (200 mcg/day), tulsi tea, and occasionally licorice root tea, but it makes me feel kind of edgy. anything else i should be taking?


----------



## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

i am pretty sure my DH has adrenal fatigue. recently he was put on effexor by the doctor for anxiety and anxious-depression. he had a horrible reaction to it and despite being off of it for almost 4 weeks he is still having daily episodes of shakes, sweats, muscle aches and sore throat. they call this "flu syndrome." it's a somewhat common side effect to SSRI withdrawl.

however, the doc says it's not in his body anymore, and why his CNS is acting like it is is unknown.

i suspect AF. any thoughts, suggestions, advice? the doc he is seeing now (as of this week) is more open to complementary meds/treatment. but not particularly well versed. i did email her to see if their is a blood test DS can take. she already wants his vitamin D levels checked and so i was hoping she could just add something on to the form.

i am really confused about how to proceed.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

umami_mommy,
I would suggest posting to The Iodine Thread. Most anti-depressants contain fluoride, a powerful neuro-toxin, which can have side-effects very similar to what you're describing. Iodine/iodide, being in the same "family" of chemicals, may be of help.


----------



## academama (Sep 26, 2008)

So, I have been reading this thread and the earlier thread but I am really overwhelmed by all the info. I also don't know whether I fit here or not. But I guess to a certain degree, I know something is wrong, and my endocrinologist ordered a saliva test; apparently it came back with elevated levels of cortisol. I don't know how elevated, since I haven't seen her yet--I'm doing several other tests first and then going back for an appointment.

Anyway, I'm having a hard time figuring out just what high cortisol actually means. Unless it means Cushing's disease, but I think I'd be really sick if I had that. So, I'm just reading and absorbing.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

You guys, I know we are supposed to avoid caffeine, but I just CANNOT give up my cup of green tea in the afternoon. I am reading that it is a better choice for us than coffee so I'll justify it that way!


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
You guys, I know we are supposed to avoid caffeine, but I just CANNOT give up my cup of green tea in the afternoon. I am reading that it is a better choice for us than coffee so I'll justify it that way!

I drink a half cup of half-caf every morning.


----------



## Katica (Jan 13, 2008)

subbing..


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

I'm a little disappointed...I had to drink even more caffeine today just to make it through the day. I did work on setting limits with my kids a little bit. I also ordered some b5 to take in addition to my b complex. How much b5 do you guys take?

It's weird...I need the coffee more for the stress than to stay awake. It helps me deal for some reason.

I've been taking lots of supplements and getting plenty of sleep. I guess it just takes time to get better. I would say I'm only in stage 2 or 3 of adrenal fatigue, but it still sucks to feel like crap!!


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

I was reading a blog from someone who overcame adrenal fatigue and she said she stopped oversleeping as one of her steps to getting better. What do you guys think about this? See this link. It explains the idea behind it.

http://a-sleep.com/33/how-to-stop-oversleeping/


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
I'm a little disappointed...I had to drink even more caffeine today just to make it through the day. I did work on setting limits with my kids a little bit. I also ordered some b5 to take in addition to my b complex. How much b5 do you guys take?

It's weird...I need the coffee more for the stress than to stay awake. It helps me deal for some reason.

I've been taking lots of supplements and getting plenty of sleep. I guess it just takes time to get better. I would say I'm only in stage 2 or 3 of adrenal fatigue, but it still sucks to feel like crap!!

I'm wondering how much extra B5 to add to my B's as well. I think I read somewhere to take 500 mcg right at bedtime...maybe??? I totally feel you too we spent 3 weeks in a hotel, drove 13 hours to another hotel, stayed 3 nights there, then went and got an apartment to live in for at the longest 6 months but we could be in another state at any moment. So that has really taxed my adrenals because I've been unusually tired all day everyday. On top of that when you travel it's really hard to eat right that's the hardest part for me. I have been drinking a little more coffee(latte) than usual


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

I thought I would post this (since for me at least) it's nice to have something to look at that reminds me what I should be doing dietary wise for my adrenals. although I'm not to sure glandulars are for everyone









http://www.foodrenegade.com/your-adr...eys-to-health/


----------



## Cascadian (Jan 28, 2009)

I haven't read all of the posts here, but can someone tell me if they've successfully used green smoothies to help overcome AF? If it has been discussed, please say yes and I'll go back and search. Thank!s


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cascadian* 
I haven't read all of the posts here, but can someone tell me if they've successfully used green smoothies to help overcome AF? If it has been discussed, please say yes and I'll go back and search. Thank!s

I don't think so but it's been awhile since I read the whole thread. I think green smoothies are beneficial for sure but I wouldn't think that green smoothies alone would treat the adrenals imo. Read my link above, it talks about diet that helps adrenals.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I thought I would post this (since for me at least) it's nice to have something to look at that reminds me what I should be doing dietary wise for my adrenals. although I'm not to sure glandulars are for everyone









http://www.foodrenegade.com/your-adr...eys-to-health/

Nice article.

I'm loving my b5!!! Today has been great and I didn't have to rely on caffeine!


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
Nice article.

I'm loving my b5!!! Today has been great and I didn't have to rely on caffeine!


How much you taking and what brand did you get? Are you taking it at bedtime?


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
How much you taking and what brand did you get? Are you taking it at bedtime?

I bought 100mg from Vitamin Shoppe. It was only five dollars so I figured why not try it.

I have been taking 2-3 with meals. Some adrenal support supplements have over 1000mg B5 in them. I tried just taking one, and it just took the edge off how I was feeling. Hopefully one day I will be healed and can stop taking it.

I would really like to exercise again one day! I think that has been part of my problem. I tried to start back exercising too soon. I should stick to yoga, walking, playing tag with my kids, etc.


----------



## onlygirls (Mar 16, 2008)

I think I have AF. My problem is the constant stress in my life over time has caused me to feel like EVERYTHING is a big effing deal. I am driving my husband crazy and not being nice to my family. The light bulb moment for me was reading about being tired in the morning, even if you got sleep and being able to stay awake with a second wind at night. I thought that was normal for being a Mom.

I don't have the money for a $200 saliva test. Insurance doesn't pay for it?

I have not been to the doctor since my daughter was 6 weeks and she will be 2 in June. Well, acupuncture and chiro, but not a physical. I think it is time.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *onlygirls* 
I think I have AF. My problem is the constant stress in my life over time has caused me to feel like EVERYTHING is a big effing deal. I am driving my husband crazy and not being nice to my family. The light bulb moment for me was reading about being tired in the morning, even if you got sleep and being able to stay awake with a second wind at night. I thought that was normal for being a Mom.

I don't have the money for a $200 saliva test. Insurance doesn't pay for it?

I have not been to the doctor since my daughter was 6 weeks and she will be 2 in June. Well, acupuncture and chiro, but not a physical. I think it is time.

Insurance covered my saliva test. We have Aetna. You can at least do some supps for your adrenals now. A B-complex perhaps? Nettles, vitamin C??? Thorne makes a good B with extra B5 that I like. Holy Basil, Ashwaganda and Siberian Ginseng are great adaptogens for stress







No caffeine eat lots of good fats! Fats was the biggie for me. Try some melatonin at bedtime.


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

I definitely have severe Adrenal Fatigue. I started taking Rhodiola tincture a few weeks ago and have seen *amazing* results from it! Unfortunately, I need to stop taking it because we are TTC this month and I've read that it isn't safe while pg or nursing.

Is there something else I can take that is safe that I can expect similar results from? I've heard of Ashwaganda, Shatavari, and a couple other adaptogens, but would like to hear from other mamas dealing with AF as to which ones they've found to be effective that are also safe during pg/nursing.


----------



## accountkilled (Jan 20, 2010)

*https://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested*


----------



## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicole_marie* 

6. *No computer or TV or technology at least one hour before bed and for the first hour every morning.*



















Everything else sounds amazing!









Pat


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WuWei* 
















Everything else sounds amazing!









Pat

so that's what my problem is! (the computer and then the late nights probably too)


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicole_marie* 
I just started to work on healthy adrenals about 2 weeks ago and I feel AMAZING!!! I haven't had energy in YEARS. I created a morning and evening routine for myself.

1. In bed BEFORE 10pm. Every. Single. Night. No. Exceptions. <---- This is huge for me...I was a night owl. It has been the #1 thing that has helped my energy levels and mood. I take an epsom salt bath at 9pm while drinking chammomile tea with a dash of honey. I put a few drops of lavender essential oil in the bath to help me relax.

2. No caffeine. None. Zip. Zilch. Nada. After I read that caffeine contributed to adrenal burnout, I was ON IT.

3. Ginseng tea (double strength) every single morning. <---Can you say ENERGY?! lol

4. A huge glass of freshly squeezed lemon water first thing in the morning. HUGE glass!









5. 5 minutes of looking in the direction of the sun every single morning (even if the sun is not there). Today was rainy and cloudy, so I stood in the porch @ the full glass door drinking my tea and water.

6. No computer or TV or technology at least one hour before bed and for the first hour every morning.

7. Vitamin D supplement.

8. No sugar. (gulp). This is hard for a sugar addict and I haven't been perfect, but pretty stinkin close.

Good luck to all of you! Glad to see this thread!!!









Which ginseng tea are you using? How does it taste? That's great btw!


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I definitely have severe Adrenal Fatigue. I started taking Rhodiola tincture a few weeks ago and have seen *amazing* results from it! Unfortunately, I need to stop taking it because we are TTC this month and I've read that it isn't safe while pg or nursing.

Is there something else I can take that is safe that I can expect similar results from? I've heard of Ashwaganda, Shatavari, and a couple other adaptogens, but would like to hear from other mamas dealing with AF as to which ones they've found to be effective that are also safe during pg/nursing.

Siberian ginseng is ok to take I *think*. I take ashwaganda daily but I'm not sure about that one during pregnancy. What about B vitamins for you?


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Siberian ginseng is ok to take I *think*. I take ashwaganda daily but I'm not sure about that one during pregnancy. What about B vitamins for you?

There is ashwaganda, cordyceps and eleuthero in Vital Nutrients Adrenal Support and I took it through my pregnancy (whenever I was able to, anyway







).


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
There is ashwaganda, cordyceps and eleuthero in Vital Nutrients Adrenal Support and I took it through my pregnancy (whenever I was able to, anyway







).

Good to know! did you notice a difference?


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Good to know! did you notice a difference?

i notice a difference if i miss it.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
i notice a difference if i miss it.

I'm thinking I need to add something. The mornings have been very rough for me lately. I feel completely dead(it's a struggle to lift a finger) when DD wakes me up and she's even been sleeping in till 830-9. I want coffee so bad in the AM but I'm trying like heck to avoid it! This AM I'm sipping on a warmed cup of nettles


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
Siberian ginseng is ok to take I *think*. I take ashwaganda daily but I'm not sure about that one during pregnancy. What about B vitamins for you?

Thank you! I'm currently taking large doses of B5, B12 and folic acid in addition to a B-100 complex (all but B5 are for TTC). In my supplements alone, I'm getting 127mg B6 (6,350%), 5,606mcg B12 (93,433%), 4,600mcg Folic Acid (1,150%), and 1,725mg B5 (17,250%). I'm also supplementing Vit C, Calcium, Magnesium, Iron and taking Cod Liver Oil as well as Nettles infusion. The supplements help, but the Rhodiola made things even better.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
There is ashwaganda, cordyceps and eleuthero in Vital Nutrients Adrenal Support and I took it through my pregnancy (whenever I was able to, anyway







).

Thanks so much. I'll look into this.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I'm thinking I need to add something. The mornings have been very rough for me lately. I feel completely dead(it's a struggle to lift a finger) when DD wakes me up and she's even been sleeping in till 830-9. I want coffee so bad in the AM but I'm trying like heck to avoid it! This AM I'm sipping on a warmed cup of nettles









It might help but it takes a while (few weeks) and it's subtle.
I've been feeling the same way recently.

Sihaya, what form of folic acid are you taking? In a certain subset of the population (which makes up about 30%), folic acid can't be converted to a usable form. The best forms to take are folinic acid and methyltetrahydrofolate (5-MTHF) which are forms that have already been converted (and are what is found naturally occurring in foods but isn't the form they use in fortified foods or most supps). There's also speculation that the reason for increased cancer rates in some folic acid studies is due to this subset. Just an FYI.
Oh, the subset has a gene mutation called MTHFR (methyltetrahydrofolate reductase) mutation if you want to ask your doctor about it.
I don't have links for it but I'm pretty sure that whoMe and WuWei do.


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
Sihaya, what form of folic acid are you taking?

Most of it (3800mcg) is folic acid. The 800mcg in my prenatal (New Chapter Perfect Prenatal) is unspecified folate. It is supposedly food-based, but I can't be certain whether it's folic acid or not.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
In a certain subset of the population (which makes up about 30%), folic acid can't be converted to a usable form.
<snip>
There's also speculation that the reason for increased cancer rates in some folic acid studies is due to this subset. Just an FYI.
Oh, the subset has a gene mutation called MTHFR (methyltetrahydrofolate reductase) mutation if you want to ask your doctor about it.

I was aware of everything quoted above from WuWei's thread in I'm Pregnant. However, all I took from it was that folate from non-food sources = bad and that I should just be eating foods high in folate. There was no mention in what I read (I rarely click through to outside links, so I just read what was in the thread itself) of any way for me to get the megadoses of folic acid that are recommended to women suffering from recurrent miscarriages outside of taking plain old folic acid. I certainly can't get 4-5*mg* folate from upping my intake of leafy greens (especially since I'm avoiding goitrogenic foods due to my thyroid). Also, even if I switch my folic acid supp to a natural kind, I'll still be getting 1600mcg from other sources because my prenatal, B-complex, and iron supp all have 100-200% folic acid each in them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
The best forms to take are folinic acid and methyltetrahydrofolate (5-MTHF) which are forms that have already been converted (and are what is found naturally occurring in foods but isn't the form they use in fortified foods or most supps).

Thank you so much! This info is completely new to me. If you have brand recommendations for supps of this kind that provide 1-3 mg at a time, I would greatly appreciate it.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Most of it (3800mcg) is folic acid. The 800mcg in my prenatal (New Chapter Perfect Prenatal) is unspecified folate. It is supposedly food-based, but I can't be certain whether it's folic acid or not.

I was aware of everything quoted above from WuWei's thread in I'm Pregnant. However, all I took from it was that folate from non-food sources = bad and that I should just be eating foods high in folate. There was no mention in what I read (I rarely click through to outside links, so I just read what was in the thread itself) of any way for me to get the megadoses of folic acid that are recommended to women suffering from recurrent miscarriages outside of taking plain old folic acid. I certainly can't get 4-5*mg* folate from upping my intake of leafy greens (especially since I'm avoiding goitrogenic foods due to my thyroid). Also, even if I switch my folic acid supp to a natural kind, I'll still be getting 1600mcg from other sources because my prenatal, B-complex, and iron supp all have 100-200% folic acid each in them.

Thank you so much! This info is completely new to me. If you have brand recommendations for supps of this kind that provide 1-3 mg at a time, I would greatly appreciate it.

If it's food based, chances are that it's the "proper" form.
I know that Thorne produces it (because my prenatal is half folinic and half 5-MTHF and it's Thorne). The extra folate I'm taking at present is from a company called LifeExtension- it's 1000 mcg of 5-MTHF and I order it from iherb. I believe there's another brand called Metagenics which also produces a 5-MTHF supp.
It drives me a little bit crazy that they seem to throw it in everything a woman takes prenatally. Never mind the food supply. Ah well. Anyway. I hope those sources will help.







eta: And I'm sorry for the losses you've experienced.


----------



## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I'm thinking I need to add something. The mornings have been very rough for me lately. I feel completely dead(it's a struggle to lift a finger) when DD wakes me up and she's even been sleeping in till 830-9. I want coffee so bad in the AM but I'm trying like heck to avoid it! This AM I'm sipping on a warmed cup of nettles









Nettles infusions.









steep overnight and energize in the am.

Pat


----------



## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Most of it (3800mcg) is folic acid. The 800mcg in my prenatal (New Chapter Perfect Prenatal) is unspecified folate. It is supposedly food-based, but I can't be certain whether it's folic acid or not.

I was aware of everything quoted above from WuWei's thread in I'm Pregnant. However, all I took from it was that folate from non-food sources = bad and that I should just be eating foods high in folate. There was no mention in what I read (I rarely click through to outside links, so I just read what was in the thread itself) of any way for me to get the megadoses of folic acid that are recommended to women suffering from recurrent miscarriages outside of taking plain old folic acid. I certainly can't get 4-5*mg* folate from upping my intake of leafy greens (especially since I'm avoiding goitrogenic foods due to my thyroid). Also, even if I switch my folic acid supp to a natural kind, I'll still be getting 1600mcg from other sources because my prenatal, B-complex, and iron supp all have 100-200% folic acid each in them.

Thank you so much! This info is completely new to me. If you have brand recommendations for supps of this kind that provide 1-3 mg at a time, I would greatly appreciate it.

You don't need 3-5 mg of FOLATE. The recommendation of mega doses of folic acid is due to the poor conversion of folic acid to a usable form. The recent/historical belief had been that folic acid was equivalent to FOLATE. New research indicates this is not the case. Furthermore, synthetic folic acid blocks the receptors for real food FOLATE.

You only need to consume approximately 2-3 cups (total per day) of greens, beans, legumes or liver to get adequate food FOLATE.

I would not supplement with megadoses of folic acid during pregnancy.

Pat


----------



## deditus (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Thank you so much! This info is completely new to me. If you have brand recommendations for supps of this kind that provide 1-3 mg at a time, I would greatly appreciate it.

I agree with JR's rec for Thorne products but I wanted to mention that I love Megafoods BloodBuilder for iron and their B-Complex, which also contain folate (food form).


----------



## liqzierda (Nov 15, 2007)

Can I recover from severe adrenal fatigue without seeing a medical doctor?

I'm pretty sure adrenal fatigue is what is going on with me. The only time I can function like a normal human being is when I'm on prednisone which has happened all too frequently in the last five years, including being on it for an extended period of time when I was pregnant with my second child. Even with prednisone, having a halfway decent energy level doesn't last long. I could write a novel-length post on the causative factors over the last eight years, but the most significant was severe sleep deprivation and stress over having an extremely ill child who didn't eat or sleep for six and a half years and then a second child with PDD. First I thought it was just my thyroid but now with that taken care of, I've got brain fog to beat the band and a whole litany of miseries which boil down to exhaustion and zero motivation. I continually feel like a 100 watt bulb on a dimmer switch to about 10 watts.

I need a new PCP but I don't even have the energy at this point to find someone who isn't going to tell me that anti-depressants are the solution to any and all problems. Money, too, of course, is an issue in terms of not having it to pay a lot out of pocket to a doctor who doesn't take insurance. I'm taking adrenal glandulars and they help a little and I've just ordered herbal supplements.

Also, anyone want to weigh in on adrenal glandulars with hormones present versus those without? How do the ones without hormones manage to still retain enzymes?


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WuWei* 
You don't need 3-5 mg of FOLATE. The recommendation of mega doses of folic acid is due to the poor conversion of folic acid to a usable form. The recent/historical belief had been that folic acid was equivalent to FOLATE. New research indicates this is not the case. Furthermore, synthetic folic acid blocks the receptors for real food FOLATE.

*You only need to consume approximately 2-3 cups (total per day) of greens, beans, legumes or liver to get adequate food FOLATE.*

I would not supplement with megadoses of folic acid during pregnancy.

Pat

I would slightly disagree, in that, for people who've got a backlog of need for folate, I'd go with a folate supp (the Thorne supps are easy to buy online, and affordable) as well as food sources. I wouldn't rely just on food sources in that pre-TTC/TTC/early pregnancy phase. I'm not sure what the recs would be if someone looked at people with MTHFR issues taking real folate, maybe 2x the RDA in supplemental folate? That's just a guess, really.

But that's not why I popped in here... I think my blood pressure is going up! I'm starting to get readings that are around 100/65 or 100/70... I hope it's not just a fluke, but hey, even if it is, I haven't seen BP that high in, well, a few years now. I've been stuck in the range of 85/55 or 90/60 -ish for quite a while now, and it just wasn't budging.

Progress! Woo-hoo!

And I haven't even been doing the things I should--I've been skipping my chunks of liver (those help with energy, I like them, and the flavor is a LOT better than I anticipated), I've been seriously slacking on my nettles infusions (can't tell if those help so much, but they are strangely appealing), and I've slipped back onto the caffeine bandwagon again.

But now I'm feeling inspired to change all that, and get to bed early--I think I may be on the verge of feeling like a normal person (if I take a lot more care of myself than normal people have to).


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *liqzierda* 
Can I recover from severe adrenal fatigue without seeing a medical doctor?

I'm pretty sure adrenal fatigue is what is going on with me. The only time I can function like a normal human being is when I'm on prednisone which has happened all too frequently in the last five years, including being on it for an extended period of time when I was pregnant with my second child. Even with prednisone, having a halfway decent energy level doesn't last long. I could write a novel-length post on the causative factors over the last eight years, but the most significant was severe sleep deprivation and stress over having an extremely ill child who didn't eat or sleep for six and a half years and then a second child with PDD. First I thought it was just my thyroid but now with that taken care of, I've got brain fog to beat the band and a whole litany of miseries which boil down to exhaustion and zero motivation. I continually feel like a 100 watt bulb on a dimmer switch to about 10 watts.

I need a new PCP but I don't even have the energy at this point to find someone who isn't going to tell me that anti-depressants are the solution to any and all problems. Money, too, of course, is an issue in terms of not having it to pay a lot out of pocket to a doctor who doesn't take insurance. I'm taking adrenal glandulars and they help a little and I've just ordered herbal supplements.

Also, anyone want to weigh in on adrenal glandulars with hormones present versus those without? How do the ones without hormones manage to still retain enzymes?

I don't think many here are seeing medical doctors. I am working with an acupuncturist, she's helped me figure out my issues--why I have adrenal issues, working on healing those problems while supporting my adrenals, like that. The better you can figure that out, the easier it'll be to heal, but it sounds like you've got a good start.

I am not actually taking adrenal glandulars anymore because, well, I didn't notice a big difference with or without. Probably wasn't taking a high enough dosage but I just muddled through working on my underlying issues and I think I'm healing (would do better if I got to bed on time each night).


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tanyalynn* 
I would slightly disagree, in that, for people who've got a backlog of need for folate, I'd go with a folate supp (the Thorne supps are easy to buy online, and affordable) as well as food sources. I wouldn't rely just on food sources in that pre-TTC/TTC/early pregnancy phase. I'm not sure what the recs would be if someone looked at people with MTHFR issues taking real folate, maybe 2x the RDA in supplemental folate? That's just a guess, really.

But that's not why I popped in here... I think my blood pressure is going up! I'm starting to get readings that are around 100/65 or 100/70... I hope it's not just a fluke, but hey, even if it is, I haven't seen BP that high in, well, a few years now. I've been stuck in the range of 85/55 or 90/60 -ish for quite a while now, and it just wasn't budging.

Progress! Woo-hoo!

And I haven't even been doing the things I should--I've been skipping my chunks of liver (those help with energy, I like them, and the flavor is a LOT better than I anticipated), I've been seriously slacking on my nettles infusions (can't tell if those help so much, but they are strangely appealing), and I've slipped back onto the caffeine bandwagon again.

But now I'm feeling inspired to change all that, and get to bed early--I think I may be on the verge of feeling like a normal person (if I take a lot more care of myself than normal people have to).










That's great Tanya! I don't notice a difference with Nettle infusions either but I'm continuing them. If only I went get to bed early now


----------



## happydance (May 9, 2010)

I probably have adrenal fatigue. I was referred here from my personal growth thread.

I do not feel like I have the energy or the cognitave state to tackle it though.

I had a million blood teste taken by a professional who is a friend as a favor but I couldnt read them and i feel like she didn't completley tell me what my tests said due to liability.

I wonder if you could help me understand how you take the journey when you have such severe symptoms?


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

*happydance*, I don't mean to be flippant, but you do it one tiny baby step at a time.









The first things I did were read the first post of the original Adrenal Fatigue thread and read this article (I know it's long and the fonts are aggravating, but just read it a little at a time - I think it took me three days to get through it) and then implement changes based on those things. I also started taking my temp three times a day as outlined here (and linked in that long article).

These are all mentioned in what I linked to above, but this is what I did right away:

I made immediate changes to my schedule:

In bed from 10pm to 9am even if you can't sleep the whole time. Since this isn't possible for everyone, at least try very hard to be in bed at 10pm. If you have to get up early, a morning nap between 7-9am can be very restorative. If you do wake up during the night, don't get on the computer or watch tv! Either lay in bed or do a non-screen-related activity like reading or taking a bath or something else you find relaxing.
Eat something upon waking, then every 2 hours until 2pm. Dinner by 6pm. Bedtime snack if you think you need it. See below for food guidelines.
Lay down to rest (pray, meditate, read, do sudoku or crossword puzzles, etc) for 30 minutes (or as long as you can if you can't do the full amount) after breakfast, afternoon snack, and dinner.
And also to my diet:

Mix 1tsp salt in a cup cold water. Drink one upon waking and again at 2pm. This gave immediate results the first day I did it.
Cut out sugar (except honey and maple syrup) and chocolate (had already cut caffiene/coffee years ago, but recommend it if you haven't)
Limit grains and foods high in potassium (bananas are a big one)
Make sure to have generous amounts of protein and fat at every meal
Don't eat a high-grain breakfast (no pancakes, muffins, oatmeal, etc.) and limit fruits to lunch and dinner only, and in small portions.
My lunch is usually a huge salad with lots of veggies and some kind of good fat as a dressing (olive oil or cream-based is good). I sprinkle kelp and dulse flakes for sodium and trace minerals. For protein/fat, I either have hard-boiled eggs or avocado in or with the salad. If you wanted to add chicken, tuna, or fish, that would work, too.
Between 4-5pm when it's been a while since my 2pm snack and it's still a ways until dinner but I'm not exactly hungry, I drink a cup of Nettles infusion. I see a _huge_ difference in my energy level and mood if I miss this drink and it gives me an excuse to sit down for a few minutes in between my 'scheduled' rest times to sip and relax.
These initial measures were helpful enough that I had the energy to get my house under control, read more of the thread, check out some books from the library, find some articles online and research supplements as well. I am self-treating for the time being so I didn't want to start taking random supplements or doing things that wouldn't be useful for the stage of fatigue I'm in, but I really did need to see immediate results or I wouldn't be able to do the work necessary to heal.


----------



## happydance (May 9, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*happydance*, I don't mean to be flippant, but you do it one tiny baby step at a time.








.

Thank you for your post.









I need immediete results also - when I read "it takes 1-5 years to heal" I think "Wth?" How would anyone who is suffering with af even go a WEEK on any kind of plan - let alone 5 years! LOL.

I will be checking out those threads since I am on a carb binge and my period and I am pretty much rendered useless today.

(Oh and that sleep schedule sounds FABULOUS but I have 3 small children so its pretty much not going to happen.) I need to go to bed WITH them but I also feel a need to have time to myself - always weighing those options.


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

I completely understand. I have a little one who weaned ~6 months ago and stopped napping at the same time. He goes to bed when I do and usually wakes me up in the morning. It is a struggle to try to get done in 13 hours what most women have 16-18+ to do, but I've decided that my health is paramount and every other thing that can budge (by which I mean housework, hobbies, socializing, etc., NOT kids' needs or spousal relationships) needs to be dropped for the time being. If your 3 all nap or at least will do quiet time while the littlest one(s) do, I would try to nap at least once a day.

ETA: When I started the 10pm-9am schedule, I was *not* sleeping 11 hours. I was lucky to fall asleep by 11pm and then ended up waking frequently and not being able to get back to sleep for hours. I was getting only 5-6 hours of sleep even if I was laying in bed for 11 hours. If you don't have the trouble falling/staying asleep, as much good solid sleep in a row as you can get will be good for you.


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
ETA: When I started the 10pm-9am schedule, I was *not* sleeping 11 hours. I was lucky to fall asleep by 11pm and then ended up waking frequently and not being able to get back to sleep for hours. I was getting only 5-6 hours of sleep even if I was laying in bed for 11 hours. If you don't have the trouble falling/staying asleep, as much good solid sleep in a row as you can get will be good for you.

how long did it take for you to be able to stay asleep?


----------



## happydance (May 9, 2010)

my kids wake me up at least once - usually many x every night.


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *meandk0610* 
how long did it take for you to be able to stay asleep?

Until I found a sleep remedy that worked for me. And I went through *a lot* of trial and error first!

I cut off computer and tv starting at 8pm; instituted an hour-long bedtime routine including epsom salt bath, reading, listening to soft music, and writing in my journal; took Rescue Remedy Sleep; took Hyland's Calms Forte; tried the "Hibernation Diet" 1-2 tbsp raw honey before bed; drank Chamomile and Lemon Balm teas separately and together; bought an eye mask and earplugs; tried Valerian tincture; tried Skullcap tincture when I ran out of Valerian before grocery day.

What works for me is 40 drops of Valerian tincture before bed and relaxing (even if that means tv or computer) for a while before going to bed. I don't usually need the eye mask or earplugs to fall asleep, but when I wake up in the middle of the night, they help me fall asleep again much more quickly (We live in the country and cover all windows with heavy blankets at night, but I still need even blacker darkness to sleep well). Every other thing I tried has since been dropped because it either didn't do much one way or the other, or (in the case of the honey) made things worse.

ETA: I never tried melatonin. I'm not comfortable supplementing hormones without a doctor's input and am already supplementing progesterone, but I would recommend most people with AF or serious problems sleeping look into it because I have heard that it can be extremely helpful.


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I definitely have severe Adrenal Fatigue. I started taking Rhodiola tincture a few weeks ago and have seen *amazing* results from it! Unfortunately, I need to stop taking it because we are TTC this month and I've read that it isn't safe while pg or nursing.

Is there something else I can take that is safe that I can expect similar results from? I've heard of Ashwaganda, Shatavari, and a couple other adaptogens, but would like to hear from other mamas dealing with AF as to which ones they've found to be effective that are also safe during pg/nursing.

Hi Shiya--

I used rhodiola for almost a year with minimal return, but have had _great_ luck with ashwaganda. I'm not sure why, but the results were so quick and palpable it's hard to trust them, lol. I started several months back, I still take it and still feel it works for me. The brand I use is "Avesta" and it's a pill,not a tincture.

hth









eta: sorry for misspelling your name Sihaya!!


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Until I found a sleep remedy that worked for me. And I went through *a lot* of trial and error first!

ETA: I never tried melatonin. I'm not comfortable supplementing hormones without a doctor's input and am already supplementing progesterone, but I would recommend most people with AF or serious problems sleeping look into it because I have heard that it can be extremely helpful.

I use a very low dose of melatonin on occasion (a 300 mcg peppermint chewable from Trader Joe's) and find it very effective. I need to take it by 8 or 9 pm-- any higher dosage or later dosing time and I'm dopey for much of the next day. Chamomile/ Valerian sleepy type teas also help me, as does magnesium, either orally or in an epsom bath.

(I also try my best to practice all the sleep hygiene ideas listed here, esp when I first started adressing my adrenal issues.)

ETA: using my progesterone cream at night also helps me relax.


----------



## Sihaya (Jul 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dhammamama* 
Hi Shiya--

I used rhodiola for almost a year with minimal return, but have had _great_ luck with ashwaganda. I'm not sure why, but the results were so quick and palpable it's hard to trust them, lol. I started several months back, I still take it and still feel it works for me. The brand I use is "Avesta" and it's a pill,not a tincture.

hth









Thanks for your input! I started Ashwaganda the same day as progesterone for TTC so I don't really know whether it's working or not yet. I took my last dose of progesterone for this cycle last night so I'll know soon if the Ashwaganda really helps or not.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dhammamama* 
ETA: using my progesterone cream at night also helps me relax.

When I am on progesterone for TTC (200mg Prometrium inserted vaginally), I don't need to take my sleep remedies, or be as strict with my diet, schedule, or other supplements. I can't wait until I'm pg again because I remember feeling just fabulous when I was pg with DS (due to extra progesterone and probably also stealing cortisol from the baby







)


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*happydance*,

And also to my diet:
 Mix 1tsp salt in a cup cold water. Drink one upon waking and again at 2pm. This gave immediate results the first day I did it.






Fabulous post and I concur with everything.









I did want to say I do salt dosing a little differently cos I found this way was hard for me. I dissolve the salt in a small amount of water (1/8- 1/4 c), take it quickly, and follow it with a big glass of plain water. The other way made me a little sick to my stomach. I do use sea salt, but I don't honestly know that it matters.

And I agree-- immediately I feel better.


----------



## happydance (May 9, 2010)

salt - why salt? Does it need to contain iodine? Or just straight sea salt? blech - I will do it like you dham. LOL. shudder. sugar? I can do. Salt? ewww.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *happydance* 
salt - why salt? Does it need to contain iodine? Or just straight sea salt? blech - I will do it like you dham. LOL. shudder. sugar? I can do. Salt? ewww.

I would do a high quality sea salt for sure.

Quote:

It may be of additional benefit that patients add salt to their diet, especially upon rising and at least a half-hour before their lowest energy point of the day. (Preferably, 1/8 to 1/2 teaspoonful of sea salt, Celtic salt, or sea salt w/kelp powder added to an 8 oz glass of water). In adrenal fatigue, one should not follow the USDA's Food Guide Pyramid, as these patients tolerate fewer carbohydrates and need more protein.
The addition of nutritional supplements may also offer additional benefits to patients experiencing adrenal fatigue. They should consider the addition of:

Vitamin C 2,000-4,000 mg/day Sustained Release
Vitamin E w/mixed tocopherols 800 IU/day
Vitamin B complex
Niacin (125-150 mg/day) - as inositol hexaniacinate
B-6 (150 mg/day)
Pantothenic acid (1200-1500 mg/day)
Magnesium citrate (400-1200 mg)
Liquid trace minerals (zinc, manganese, selenium, chromium, molybdenum, copper, iodine)- calming effect
If depression is present - Add SAM.e 200 mg bid; DL-Phenylalanine (DLPA) 500 mg bid
OOOpppss here's the link http://www.projectaware.org/Resource...lfatigue.shtml


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

From where is that quote, mom61508?


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
From where is that quote, mom61508?

There ya go


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
There ya go


















Thanks!


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I would do a high quality sea salt for sure.

OOOpppss here's the link http://www.projectaware.org/Resource...lfatigue.shtml

The link doesn't seem to work for me...help?


----------



## lissybeth74 (Sep 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *liqzierda* 

First I thought it was just my thyroid but now with that taken care of, I've got brain fog to beat the band and a whole litany of miseries which boil down to exhaustion and zero motivation. I continually feel like a 100 watt bulb on a dimmer switch to about 10 watts.

Also, anyone want to weigh in on adrenal glandulars with hormones present versus those without? How do the ones without hormones manage to still retain enzymes?

I can totally relate to the light bulb reference. I've been taking glandulars for a while now, but after ds' birth (3rd) it took me agonizingly long to recover. So exhausted, ALL DAY. My ND suggested I increase my glandulars from one tab 3x/day to two tabs 3x/day. This is just my own experience with it, but it helped tremendously! It took a few weeks to get here but I finally have some energy back. No longer wanting to sleep all day. I think it also helps that I am eating less sugar/refined junk, and have started healing my gut w/fermented foods, etc. I've been on this AF roller coaster for 8 years, and I honestly didn't think it would make such a big difference to double my daily dose. FWIW...

What glandulars are you taking right now?


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dhammamama* 
The link doesn't seem to work for me...help?

That is so weird I just tried it and it took me to a ocean site









I'll try to link a different article then maybe you can find the article I posted.

Try this
http://www.project-aware.org/DocsCorner/index.shtml


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
That is so weird I just tried it and it took me to a ocean site









I'll try to link a different article then maybe you can find the article I posted.

Try this
http://www.project-aware.org/DocsCorner/index.shtml

you missed the dash in your first link.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

http://www.amazon.com/Dandelion-Root...6004440&sr=8-1

I am thinking about trying this. What do you guys think? I feel like maybe I need more iron.

I've been feeling pretty good lately. I would say that I'm improving. BUT I find that it helps for me to eat often and it drains me to exercise. I'm a little said b/c I think I'm gaining weight.

I've been taking the extra b5 with my complex and I would say this has made a world of difference. I've been setting some limits to avoid getting run down. I was invited to go somewhere today and I wanted to take my kids to the library for their book club. I decided I needed to pick one or the other. I was also able to sleep in until 7:30 today! I really wanted to get up and work out before my kids woke up, but I decided to skip it. Maybe I'll chase them around the yard later and then follow up with a high protein snack.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
you missed the dash in your first link.









Weird I just copied and pasted.

Thanks


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
http://www.amazon.com/Dandelion-Root...6004440&sr=8-1

I am thinking about trying this. What do you guys think? I feel like maybe I need more iron.

I've been feeling pretty good lately. I would say that I'm improving. BUT I find that it helps for me to eat often and it drains me to exercise. I'm a little said b/c I think I'm gaining weight.

I've been taking the extra b5 with my complex and I would say this has made a world of difference. I've been setting some limits to avoid getting run down. I was invited to go somewhere today and I wanted to take my kids to the library for their book club. I decided I needed to pick one or the other. I was also able to sleep in until 7:30 today! I really wanted to get up and work out before my kids woke up, but I decided to skip it. Maybe I'll chase them around the yard later and then follow up with a high protein snack.

What kind of work out are you doing?


----------



## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

My doctor thinks I should start some Adrenal Support (my numbers were 'normal' but at the very edge of the range) so I picked up the bottle today (Gaia brand) and it says Not to be used while pregnant or lactating. Well I'm BF'ing my 16mo & TTC (two week wait) so I'm not sure if this is safe!! I posted in BF'ing (http://www.mothering.com/discussions...8#post15500508) but figured I'd check in with you knowledgeable ladies as well!!

Also do I have to take all these supplements for a long time? I just spent $100 on supplements, and I don't think they'll last more than a moth or two, I can't afford that every month! *sigh* I'm trying to read back in this thread and my head is spinning, I'm too worn out to focus and my body is just falling apart on me so I really don't even know where to begin.


----------



## smeisnotapirate (Aug 24, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchy_mommy* 
I'm trying to read back in this thread and my head is spinning, I'm too worn out to focus and my body is just falling apart on me so I really don't even know where to begin.









:


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchy_mommy* 
My doctor thinks I should start some Adrenal Support (my numbers were 'normal' but at the very edge of the range) so I picked up the bottle today (Gaia brand) and it says Not to be used while pregnant or lactating. Well I'm BF'ing my 16mo & TTC (two week wait) so I'm not sure if this is safe!! I posted in BF'ing (http://www.mothering.com/discussions...8#post15500508) but figured I'd check in with you knowledgeable ladies as well!!

Also do I have to take all these supplements for a long time? I just spent $100 on supplements, and I don't think they'll last more than a moth or two, I can't afford that every month! *sigh* I'm trying to read back in this thread and my head is spinning, I'm too worn out to focus and my body is just falling apart on me so I really don't even know where to begin.

I don't know for sure..sorry. If you look on the previous page in thread there's some great info on supporting adrenals like thru diet so that's not expensive. I found the biggest things to help with my adrenals is a lot of good fat! Butter has been especially helpful, not sure what your diet restrictions are.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
What kind of work out are you doing?

I tried some stuff that is really bad for my adrenals like dribbling the soccer ball while my kids play in the back yard for some cardio, squats, lunges, etc. I just keep gaining weight in my thighs ewwwwwwwww.

Today I'm just doing some walking and yoga. I know those are more gentle, but sometimes I just want more results.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
I tried some stuff that is really bad for my adrenals like dribbling the soccer ball while my kids play in the back yard for some cardio, squats, lunges, etc. I just keep gaining weight in my thighs ewwwwwwwww.

Today I'm just doing some walking and yoga. I know those are more gentle, but sometimes I just want more results.

If you're having problems with the thigh area, you might want to try malasana (garland), garudasana (eagle) or baddha konasana (bound angle). Supta virasana (reclining hero) and vrksasana (tree) are other poses I've found helpful for thighs. And, ime, it's not so much "weight gain" in the thigh area as it is muscles not being as toned as they once were.


----------



## Beppie (Oct 24, 2005)

Can it be adrenal fatigue if, during the end of my last pregnancy, my blood pressure was high?

I found out I was hypothyroid 4 years ago. I'm taking 90 mg Armour every day. I'm bedsharing with a 6-month-old and am not getting good sleep. We are experiencing stress lately from DH's job, applying for new jobs, and considering moving to a new state (exciting for us but stressful too)... so there is stress in our life. Right now I'm exhausted sitting at the computer, feeling like I could fall asleep at 2:30 in the afternoon. This morning a friend was over and said out of the blue "you look really tired!"

I'm drinking Nettle Tea and wondering if my adrenals have anything to do with this fatigue. Any input on the high-blood-pressure-during-pregnancy question?


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Beppie* 
Can it be adrenal fatigue if, during the end of my last pregnancy, my blood pressure was high?

I found out I was hypothyroid 4 years ago. I'm taking 90 mg Armour every day. I'm bedsharing with a 6-month-old and am not getting good sleep. We are experiencing stress lately from DH's job, applying for new jobs, and considering moving to a new state (exciting for us but stressful too)... so there is stress in our life. Right now I'm exhausted sitting at the computer, feeling like I could fall asleep at 2:30 in the afternoon. This morning a friend was over and said out of the blue "you look really tired!"

I'm drinking Nettle Tea and wondering if my adrenals have anything to do with this fatigue. Any input on the high-blood-pressure-during-pregnancy question?

I would vote yes on adrenal fatigue. Most with thyroid issues will have adrenals issues as well. You need adrenal support along with your thyroid support. On top of pregnancy(very stressful on adrenals), not sleeping well and the job thing your adrenals have to struggling. As far as blood pressure It's low blood pressure that's associated with adrenal fatigue however mine has always been normal. I'm not sure if that could be different for pregnancy.

Nettle infusions are good for adrenals along with some C,B vits, and good fats







Can you nap when baby naps?


----------



## Beppie (Oct 24, 2005)

I'm not able to nap with baby, unfortunately, because there is also a 2-year-old and 4-year-old in the house. Sometimes the 2-year old takes naps, but not always. Things here seem crazy, and I often feel very irritable ... maybe another sign of adrenal fatigue?


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Beppie* 
Things here seem crazy, and I often feel very irritable ... maybe another sign of adrenal fatigue?

Yep and sleep deprivation.


----------



## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I don't know for sure..sorry. If you look on the previous page in thread there's some great info on supporting adrenals like thru diet so that's not expensive. I found the biggest things to help with my adrenals is a lot of good fat! Butter has been especially helpful, not sure what your diet restrictions are.

Hmm I'm not totally convinced I have AF. I have all the symptoms but there are so many other issues I can't keep track of it. But I already do most of those dietary things so I'm even more confused because obviously they're not helping me... except taking salt & I'm reluctant to take salt. Ahhh so confused. And I can't seem to find much info on Adrenal Support & BF'ing, seems like it's not proven dangerous but there are no studies showing it's safe either. *sigh* I wish I was a research scientist


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchy_mommy* 
Hmm I'm not totally convinced I have AF. I have all the symptoms but there are so many other issues I can't keep track of it. But I already do most of those dietary things so I'm even more confused because obviously they're not helping me... except taking salt & I'm reluctant to take salt. Ahhh so confused. And I can't seem to find much info on Adrenal Support & BF'ing, seems like it's not proven dangerous but there are no studies showing it's safe either. *sigh* I wish I was a research scientist









I wouldn't be reluctant on salt If It's high quality like celtic sea salt. I would think Vit C, B vits and nettles would be fine while BF. I think the thing with adrenal herbs would be to make sure they don't dry up your milk but other than that I think herbs are pretty safe but I'm very comfortable with herbs. Even If your not convinced that you have AF I think it would be wise to still support you adrenals because it sounds like you are having some health issues and adrenals are usually a big part of health issues you know? My 2 cents


----------



## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

But would the salt cause high blood pressure?


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
If you're having problems with the thigh area, you might want to try malasana (garland), garudasana (eagle) or baddha konasana (bound angle). Supta virasana (reclining hero) and vrksasana (tree) are other poses I've found helpful for thighs. And, ime, it's not so much "weight gain" in the thigh area as it is muscles not being as toned as they once were.

Ok i will work on those! Thanks!

Today I totally overdid it with errands and chores, and I had a low blood pressure attack despite snacking with some very balanced snacks including protein, carbs, and salt. I had to chug a dr pepper b/c I was so queazy.

I'm going to go to bed early and take it easy tomorrow. Tomorrow I'm going to get my brother from nyc! yay! The great thing is that I have a babysitter (wonderful WONDERFUL mil) and can just relax up the road while dh drives.


----------



## nichole (Feb 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crunchy_mommy* 
But would the salt cause high blood pressure?

Adrenal fatigue can cause low blood pressure. I really struggle to keep mine up if I don't have enough salt, snacks, and rest.

As far as I know you just have to get yours checked, right? There are a lot of places you can get it checked for free...like drug stores. I really don't like how I feel when my top number gets below 110 or so. Although drs think it is just awesome b/c most people have the opposite problem.


----------



## crunchy_mommy (Mar 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nichole* 
Adrenal fatigue can cause low blood pressure. I really struggle to keep mine up if I don't have enough salt, snacks, and rest.

As far as I know you just have to get yours checked, right? There are a lot of places you can get it checked for free...like drug stores. I really don't like how I feel when my top number gets below 110 or so. Although drs think it is just awesome b/c most people have the opposite problem.

Hmm my doctor seemed concerned about me taking anything that might cause high blood pressure, I don't know if it's because of my heart issues or that's just a general concern he has for patients. I always felt my bp was low (and when I check it in stores it's gone as low as 90/50 or something like that) but in the doctor's/hospital/etc. it is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS 120/80. Very weird.


----------



## nataliachick7 (Apr 3, 2007)

Could i benefit from DHEA or Pregnenolone if my level is 192? (reference range 71-640)

My cortisol is all "within range" but low in my opinion and i know the test is not entirely accurate.
I have all the symptoms of adrenal fatigue.
thanks


----------



## ILoveMyBabyBird (Sep 2, 2006)

okay mama's i am really beginning to think that i suffer from this, so what should i talk to a dr. about? And what type of dr. to see? I described my symptoms to an ask a nurse hotline and she said i should see an obgyn, basically because i am ttc and i find my symptoms are worse around the time of my period. I am reading the symptoms on another website, i am surprised how many i have. I was vegan for a while, but have stopped that to see if adding more protein and animal fats may help my energy levels.

I am taking 660 mg of kelp w/iodine, rainbow light multi, nature made bcomplex and 500 mgs of maca, just started the iodine a few days back but the rest i have been on for a couple months.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ILoveMyBabyBird* 
okay mama's i am really beginning to think that i suffer from this, so what should i talk to a dr. about? And what type of dr. to see? I described my symptoms to an ask a nurse hotline and she said i should see an obgyn, basically because i am ttc and i find my symptoms are worse around the time of my period. I am reading the symptoms on another website, i am surprised how many i have. I was vegan for a while, but have stopped that to see if adding more protein and animal fats may help my energy levels.

I am taking 660 mg of kelp w/iodine, rainbow light multi, nature made bcomplex and 500 mgs of maca, just started the iodine a few days back but the rest i have been on for a couple months.

I personally would see a Naturopath. Get a rec in finding your tribe or check out their websites to see what they specialize in. Most offer a 15 min free consult so you can see If you mesh well.


----------



## ILoveMyBabyBird (Sep 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I personally would see a Naturopath. Get a rec in finding your tribe or check out their websites to see what they specialize in. Most offer a 15 min free consult so you can see If you mesh well.

thanks i'm going to try a chiropractor that specializes in thyroid issues/adrenal fatigue that my insurance will cover.


----------



## RubyWild (Apr 7, 2004)

Hi, I was a bit surprised by my Diagnos-Techs Salivary Cortisol test results which were:

8 a.m. depressed
noon depressed
4:00 Normal
12am depressed.

I was expecting a different pattern because I usually have either energy (relatively speaking) in the a.m until after lunch, then sort of crash. Or, I have tons of anxiety, racing thoughts, etc in the morning, which calms down over the a.m.

My NP/DC is giving me bioidentical cortisol in the a.m. and a smaller dose at noon.
I'm also supposed to eat using The Zone Diet (which is fairly close to what I already do.)
2 DSF formula 2x per day
Has anyone seen the test result pattern such as mine before? Any thoughts about that or my treatment plan?

ETA: I'm concerned that this will cause me to gain weight, terrified, actually.


----------



## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

OK I have a question for all of you about testing... my ND offers saliva cortisol (24 hour collection, 4 points) testing and also urinary cortisol (24 hour collection) testing.

I know the urinary is much cheaper, but I have no idea if it would be as accurate. Does anyone know?


----------



## nataliachick7 (Apr 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *triscuitsmom* 
OK I have a question for all of you about testing... my ND offers saliva cortisol (24 hour collection, 4 points) testing and also urinary cortisol (24 hour collection) testing.

I know the urinary is much cheaper, but I have no idea if it would be as accurate. Does anyone know?

you want salivary.


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *triscuitsmom* 
OK I have a question for all of you about testing... my ND offers saliva cortisol (24 hour collection, 4 points) testing and also urinary cortisol (24 hour collection) testing.

I know the urinary is much cheaper, but I have no idea if it would be as accurate. Does anyone know?

My saliva/urinary test was $400 but was covered by my insurance.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nataliachick7* 
you want salivary.


----------



## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
My saliva/urinary test was $400 but was covered by my insurance.

Unfortunately we don't have insurance besides OHIP right now and OHIP doesn't cover nonallopathic doctors so my ND appointments and anything she orders are up to me to pay out of pocket right now.

I have another question. Is this going to be accurate considering I'm 31 weeks pregnant? I'm considering doing the urinary now because although not as accurate from what I read it will give you a picture of all day (as opposed to specific points for the curve of all day). And then paying for the more expensive test after I'm not pregnant anymore. Any thoughts?


----------



## mom61508 (May 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *triscuitsmom* 
Unfortunately we don't have insurance besides OHIP right now and OHIP doesn't cover nonallopathic doctors so my ND appointments and anything she orders are up to me to pay out of pocket right now.

I have another question. Is this going to be accurate considering I'm 31 weeks pregnant? I'm considering doing the urinary now because although not as accurate from what I read it will give you a picture of all day (as opposed to specific points for the curve of all day). And then paying for the more expensive test after I'm not pregnant anymore. Any thoughts?

I see. Well I'm not 100% sure If It's accurate while pregnant but I'm thinking it wouldn't be. Can you ask your ND? BTW do you know what are you having?


----------



## triscuitsmom (Jan 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mom61508* 
I see. Well I'm not 100% sure If It's accurate while pregnant but I'm thinking it wouldn't be. Can you ask your ND? BTW do you know what are you having?

A third boy


----------



## colleentara (Aug 12, 2008)

Hi-- I'm looking for ideas to deal with adrenal fatigue while pregnant. I'm in my second trimester. I am a teacher and have to go back to work this week and am feeling extra stressed about that. It is our only income, so I can't quit until the baby is born...even though I need to for my health.
I'm barely getting sleep. I've done the Diagnos-techs saliva test to find cortisol levels elevated at all points, especially at the 10 pm and 8 am collection.

What I'm doing now (and have been for a few months):
acupuncture & chinese herbs
yoga/exercise
Drenamin (adrenal supplement)
Magnesium at night
increasing protein
therapy

I'm feeling desperate. I need sleep. I have a toddler too... My pregnancy is healthy except for this








Any suggestions are appreciated.
Thanks!


----------



## Climbergirl (Nov 12, 2007)

subbing. Need to re-read this whole thing again and the other one so I can work on my suspected adrenal fatigue.


----------



## sharkysmom (Aug 27, 2009)

Hello there ladies, I am hoping I will get responses even though this thread seems to have died down a bit.
I am almost positive I have AF, I recently got James Wilson's book, did the self tests and came up with a moderate to severe score.
I have made an appt with a gyn that seems to be holistic minded and familiar with adrenal issues, she also has an accupuncturist on staff. She of course does not take insurance and is expensive. I made an appt with my pcp and would like to get her to send me for all the bloodwork/tests so that I can go prepared to the other Dr. and hopefully be able to get solutions rather then her sending me for tests and having to go back.
So my queston is what do I ask my pcp to test for? I havent had any bloodwork since I was pregnant, ds is 15mth and I have no idea what that bloodwork looked like. I would like to look at everything that would either indicate issues in other areas and/or point in the direction of Af or not.
So far I think the 4X cortisol saliva test and also test for DHEA levels, other then that I am clueless.
TIA


----------



## MoonlightFaerie (Aug 18, 2010)

Hello everyone... Newbie here!









I have had symptoms of AF for as long as I can remember, but I was diagnosed with it about a year ago. At the time, my systolic blood pressure was running in the low 80s and my heart rate was THROUGH THE ROOF trying to compensate for my low BP. I was put on Florinef and Zebeta to get me functioning again. I am still taking the 2 meds, along with a thyroid med. I just took a salivary ASI test about 2 weeks ago and am awaiting the results. Although my symptoms are better, I am still not even close to where I used to be. I have made some lifestyle and dietary changes... and I also take a TON of vitamin/mineral supplements. At the time I was diagnosed, my doctor recommended trying Pregnenolone and hydrocortisone. Frankly, at the time, I was uncomfortable trying them, but am thinking about giving Pregnenolone and DHEA (in low doses) a try. I have had my DHEA tested and it is on the lower end of normal.

*Has anyone taken Pregnenolone and/or DHEA?* Please share your experiences!








LAUREN


----------



## MoonlightFaerie (Aug 18, 2010)

*Sharkysmom*: I would have a thyroid panel drawn, as adrenals and thyroid are closely connected. Also, I would test iron levels and ferritin, have an electrolyte panel (potassium, sodium, etc) drawn and test for Vit D and B-12 deficiencies. These are all blood tests.


----------



## CliffRose (Apr 19, 2010)

Hi,
I tried going through the whole thread, as well as the other, but I can't seem to focus enough to read it all









At this moment, I have no insurance and can't afford going to a doctor to get tested, but I'm pretty sure that I have adrenal fatigue. What could I do on a daily basis to help my body heal? I'm slowly going off wheat, am off caffeine (except for one 12-16oz of homemade low-caf kombucha daily, before noon), and go to bed early.


----------



## Sativarain1 (Feb 27, 2003)

I can't get thru the whole thread either. I'd also like to know what the 'basic' day to day things that could help with af.


----------



## dhammamama (Mar 30, 2008)

Post number 163 has a great summary of ideas. HTH!


----------



## CliffRose (Apr 19, 2010)

Thanks Dhammamama!
I never feel good if I have a high-grain breakfast, and love adding salt to my food, now it makes sense!
I always have nettle in my herb&spice cabinet, I'll try that too. I'm big on herbal teas. I've already cut out chocolate from my diet, and most caffeine. I do drink kombucha, but I'm going to experiment making it with maple syrup and green/white tea instead of black. I guess that in the fermentation process about half of the caffeine disappears.


----------



## babybirkel (Apr 1, 2009)

hi, i was just diagnosed with adrenal fatigue. this really did not come as a surprise at all, in fact i would have been surprised if my levels had come back normal. i am pretty sure my adrenals have needed support since like...high school. college for sure. and then mothering a high-needs non-sleeping kid pretty much did me in. then i got pregnant again and i think i about died.

here are my test results, for those so inclined:
8am: out of range 2.2L (range being 3.7-9.5)
noon: out of range 0.9L (range being 1.2-3.0)
4:45pm: in range 1.0 (range being 0.6 to 1.9)
10:00pm: in range 0.4 (range being 0.4. to 1.0)

this explains why i feel so terrible in the morning and then in the evening i feel more awake than i have been all day (like right now).

i have hypothyroidism, too...only ever so slightly (TSH 4.5). i am on armour thyroid 30 mg. my levels have been normal since i have been pregnant and on armour.

low vitamin D levels, too.

i have horrible insomnia and anxiety and depression and body aches and blah. i am on lexapro (5mg a day) just to keep me functioning and still married. heh.

i am 20 weeks pregnant. i take more supplements than a nursing home patient...all trying to support my adrenals. magnesium and coQ10 to help with the (annoying) heart palps and sleep, vitamin C, B complex 50, vitamin D (6000 IUs a day), blood builder (whole foods iron supplement), prenatals, spirulina.

my NP who gave me my test results wants to put me on cortisol, but it makes me nervous being pregnant. it sounds scary to "shut off my adrenals so they can rest." she said that i need to up my dose until i feel better, but it sounds very labor-intensive and she also said that it can be bad if i forget a dose or two...and let's face it, people, i can barely remember to take my prenatals 3x a day. and what happens after the baby is born? i barely remember to eat. so i am more inclined to heal my adrenals through herbs and vitamins and whatnot.

but i thought i'd ask: has anyone treated adrenal fatigue with cortisol while pregnant? what else can i do to help my adrenals...i need to go to bed soon, it's already past 10pm.

anyone dealt with adrenal fatigue while pregnant?

i'm all ears. i love MDC...i wouldn't have even considered adrenal fatigue unless i lurked here, and i am glad that i found out about it and had myself tested.


----------



## colleentara (Aug 12, 2008)

Hi Babybirkel-- I'm so sorry-- I know how you feel. I am 27 weeks pregnant and my adrenals are shot. My cortisol levels measured extremely high at night and in the a.m. especially....so I've go the insomnia and the heart palpitations too. I even considered going on an anti-depressant to help.
I have been going to acupuncture --and I think it helps. I have to work a stressful job (no option to quit) and have a 2 year old so the sleep has been a real issue. I tried sleeping pills for a week to try to get me on a sleep rhythm--but not much success (fall asleep but wake up crazy early)

Another Chinese Medicine dr. has me on an adrenal supplement: Standard Process: Drenamin, but she said that we can't do the really strong herbs she usually does to regulate cortisol (until after pregnancy/nursing).

She recommended that I try a Qigong workshop last weekend. She said that she bets practicing qigong could regulate my cortisol-- I'm willing to do anything at this point-- so I did it and have been practicing daily for a week. It definitely helps and I can see that it can only get better. website: www.chicenter.com
I recommend going to a class or workshop first before getting a DVD b/c it's kind of difficult to pick up without initial instruction from a teacher.
I actually felt happy, unstressed--joyous even!-for a couple days (all day) this week after practicing in the morning. Sleep issues aren't healed yet--- but I'm hopeful.
Good luck!


----------



## Goddess3_2005 (Oct 20, 2004)

I have been suffering with AF for years. Simple things to do..
NO Sugar, that means every little fruit as well.
NO grains or startches.
Mild exercise daily. Walking helps me.
B12 and folic acid shots
Good multi vitamin
Fish oils
Adrena Cort
Vitamin D supplement
Adernal Cortical Extract or Hydrocotisone (which I don't like )
Lots of water
Lots of salt, ok not lots, but use a good sea salt liberally.

This is what I do in a nu shell and it keeps me functioning. Really lots of rest is important too, sleep when you are tired.You body needs to rejuventate and no hard exercise. HTH


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)




----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Anyone else have this? I get bloated if I don't eat *enough* salt... my guess was that it was related to the AF issues I'm having, but I'm curious if anyone else gets this?


----------



## corysmilk (Jan 2, 2004)

can anyone help me? I do not understand something I read. I am looking into getting dp and myself healthy. I suppect we both have A F. anyway I was reading this:

What is so interesting is that the herpes virus and cytomegalovirus are both inhibited by the antimicrobial lipid monolaurin; but monolaurin is not formed in the body unless there is a source of lauric acid in the diet. Thus, ironically enough, one could consider the recommendations to avoid coconut and other lauric oils as contributing to the increased incidence of coronary heart disease.

what does it mean? do not take the coconut oil if you have herpes? or take it cause it helps??

I feel a little dumb, but alot of those words I don't understand


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

it appears to be linking herpes and cytomegalovirus to heart disease in a round about way (I'm not sure why... don't know a lot about herpes). But basically it says EAT MORE COCONUT OIL


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
it appears to be linking herpes and cytomegalovirus to heart disease in a round about way (I'm not sure why... don't know a lot about herpes). But basically it says EAT MORE COCONUT OIL









are there any other sources of lauric acid? i'm allergic to coconut and react to the oil as well.


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Lauric acid is a saturated fat. I'm pretty sure it's in beef and such, too. Lemme look around.


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Ok... looks like coconut oil and breastmilk are the most abundant sources, but looks like palm kernel oil is good for lauric acid, too. I remember reading about it "real food", but I can't remember all she said about it.


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
Ok... looks like coconut oil and breastmilk are the most abundant sources, but looks like palm kernel oil is good for lauric acid, too. I remember reading about it "real food", but I can't remember all she said about it.

Yes, we were looking at it for some reason not too long ago in the Allergies forum as well, and it seems that the only good sources for it are breastmilk and the palm oils (coconut, babassu, cohune, murumuru, tucuma seed and palm kernel oils, but not red palm nor palm shortening).

Saw palmetto has about half what is contained in the palms listed above.


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JacquelineR* 
Yes, we were looking at it for some reason not too long ago in the Allergies forum as well, and it seems that the only good sources for it are breastmilk and the palm oils (coconut, babassu, cohune, murumuru, tucuma seed and palm kernel oils, but not red palm nor palm shortening).

Saw palmetto has about half what is contained in the palms listed above.

well, dang. i guess i'll have to see if it's sold in supplement form. thanks for checking!


----------



## lil_miss_understood (Jul 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *meandk0610* 
well, dang. i guess i'll have to see if it's sold in supplement form. thanks for checking!

I should specify that this was saw palmetto oil. I'm not sure about the dried herb.


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

i was reading on some of the recommended links (for example, http://www.drlam.com/articles/adrena...gue.asp?page=1) and noticed that it keeps repeating that it's not safe or effective to deal with adrenal fatigue on your own. has anyone had any experience, either good or bad, dealing with it on your own? my endocrinologist doesn't believe in AF and my PCP is pretty clueless about it; she wanted to put me on paxil for stress (coming out of an abusive relationship and going through the divorce right now). i'm a little worried going ahead on my own but i'm unable to pay for a doctor outside of my network. i currently have insurance under my husband and i've just gotten dd and i on the state healthcare because my husband has already said, many times, that he's quitting his job as soon as we get everything settled (no insurance, no child support







).

ideas and experience appreciated!


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

The "Adrenal Fatigue: the 21st century stress syndrome" book seems to encourage people to deal with it themselves because he acknowledges that it's difficult to find doctors who will admit that it exists, I guess.


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
The "Adrenal Fatigue: the 21st century stress syndrome" book seems to encourage people to deal with it themselves because he acknowledges that it's difficult to find doctors who will admit that it exists, I guess.

that's encouraging! now to just wait for my mypoints account to get high enough to order an amazon.com gift card.


----------



## GoddessKristie (Oct 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *meandk0610* 
i was reading on some of the recommended links (for example, http://www.drlam.com/articles/adrena...gue.asp?page=1) and noticed that it keeps repeating that it's not safe or effective to deal with adrenal fatigue on your own. has anyone had any experience, either good or bad, dealing with it on your own? my endocrinologist doesn't believe in AF and my PCP is pretty clueless about it; she wanted to put me on paxil for stress (coming out of an abusive relationship and going through the divorce right now). i'm a little worried going ahead on my own but i'm unable to pay for a doctor outside of my network. i currently have insurance under my husband and i've just gotten dd and i on the state healthcare because my husband has already said, many times, that he's quitting his job as soon as we get everything settled (no insurance, no child support







).

ideas and experience appreciated!


I've been treating my AF on my own for 18 months. I suspect I've had it for a very long time (more than 10 years), but it got really bad after a particuarly stressful time in my life and that's when I learned what it was. I have had a number of very bad experiences with doctors in the past who only want to treat the symptoms and not cure the cause, so I was not open to adding to those bad experiences. I feel like I am an intelligent woman and though I'm not a doctor, I was confident I could educate myself and at least help my condition naturally.
So that's exactly what I did. This forum was my first stop and I got a lot of great book recomendations here. I read everything I could get my hands on about the endocrine system and how it works and anything I could find that was specific to the adrenal glands.
I ordered a blood and saliva test through CanaryClub.com and when I got my results there was a write-up by a doctor interpreting my results that confirmed that my adrenals were to blame.
At that point I put into work all the information I had found and started on a huge regimine of dietary suppliments. At that point I was unable to get out of bed and in and out of sleep all day and night. When I could get out of bed I could do no more than basic personal care for myself and my baby. I was taking 32 pills a day.
Within about 6 months I was out of bed, but still needing a 2-4 hour nap every day. At that point I started looking to herbs for some additional support. My moods were out of control and my high evening cortisol was causing a lot of disruption in my family relationships. I found an adrenal support herbal suppliment that I liked and that evened out my moods and reduced my stress response.
At a year I no longer needed a nap, but wasn't able to sleep at night. I was now taking 34 pills a day with the herbal suppliment added in. I tried supplimenting DHEA for a while, but it didn't help at all, so after about 2 months I stopped taking it. I continued to slowly feel better during the day.
Now, at 18 months since I started treating my adrenals I am down to taking 11 pills a day plus my herbs, which are now different. I am now sleeping at night! I am usually in bed by 10 and sleep until 9am (luckily I'm a SAHM). I still don't need a nap during the day, and I am able to do all of our cooking and some cleaning. Normal exercise is still out of the question (though I try regularly), but my moods are normal and I feel about 85% normal on most days. Stressful situations and overexertion still make me really tired for the next two days, but I'm really glad about the progress I've made and it makes me feel good that I was able to do it on my own. I'm looking forward to seeing the progress I'll make in the next 6 months and we're hoping to get pregnant in 2011!
Real healing can be done, and if you have no help you can make it happen on your own!


----------



## meandk0610 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GoddessKristie* 
I've been treating my AF on my own for 18 months. I suspect I've had it for a very long time (more than 10 years), but it got really bad after a particuarly stressful time in my life and that's when I learned what it was. I have had a number of very bad experiences with doctors in the past who only want to treat the symptoms and not cure the cause, so I was not open to adding to those bad experiences. I feel like I am an intelligent woman and though I'm not a doctor, I was confident I could educate myself and at least help my condition naturally.
So that's exactly what I did. This forum was my first stop and I got a lot of great book recomendations here. I read everything I could get my hands on about the endocrine system and how it works and anything I could find that was specific to the adrenal glands.
I ordered a blood and saliva test through CanaryClub.com and when I got my results there was a write-up by a doctor interpreting my results that confirmed that my adrenals were to blame.
At that point I put into work all the information I had found and started on a huge regimine of dietary suppliments. At that point I was unable to get out of bed and in and out of sleep all day and night. When I could get out of bed I could do no more than basic personal care for myself and my baby. I was taking 32 pills a day.
Within about 6 months I was out of bed, but still needing a 2-4 hour nap every day. At that point I started looking to herbs for some additional support. My moods were out of control and my high evening cortisol was causing a lot of disruption in my family relationships. I found an adrenal support herbal suppliment that I liked and that evened out my moods and reduced my stress response.
At a year I no longer needed a nap, but wasn't able to sleep at night. I was now taking 34 pills a day with the herbal suppliment added in. I tried supplimenting DHEA for a while, but it didn't help at all, so after about 2 months I stopped taking it. I continued to slowly feel better during the day.
Now, at 18 months since I started treating my adrenals I am down to taking 11 pills a day plus my herbs, which are now different. I am now sleeping at night! I am usually in bed by 10 and sleep until 9am (luckily I'm a SAHM). I still don't need a nap during the day, and I am able to do all of our cooking and some cleaning. Normal exercise is still out of the question (though I try regularly), but my moods are normal and I feel about 85% normal on most days. Stressful situations and overexertion still make me really tired for the next two days, but I'm really glad about the progress I've made and it makes me feel good that I was able to do it on my own. I'm looking forward to seeing the progress I'll make in the next 6 months and we're hoping to get pregnant in 2011!
Real healing can be done, and if you have no help you can make it happen on your own!

that is so awesome and inspiring! would you mind listing what you were taking? i'm especially interested in the supplement that evened out your moods and made you respond less.

also, did you have any experience about increasing/new food allergies and them either going away or stabilizing (eg. not getting any more new ones)? i'd like to stop that slide while i still have a few things i can eat safely.


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

ugh... I had been doing so much better but the past 3 nights or so i've been up with insomnia. It's 4 am right now, and here I am... awake.







my anxiety seems to have kicked up, too.

I'm nursing a 7 month old, though. Anyone have any ideas for how to deal with this?


----------



## Mrs.aLifeofReilly (Oct 12, 2006)

Hi all. I've been reading through this and the past thread. Just got my test results back. I think I pretty much understand the cortisol and DHEA levels and correlation, but I'm a bit stumped on the SIgA and insulin and quite surprised by the gliadin (maybe so low because I've been gluten-free for a year already?)

I'd love those of you who are familiar with testing result to lend your views/opinions! Thanks!

*Free Cortisol Rhythm*
06:00 - 08:00 AM 27 (elevated) 13-24 nM
11:00 - Noon 5 (normal) 5-10 nM
04:00 - 05:00 PM 4 (normal) 3-8 nM
10:00 - Midnight 6 (elevated) 1-4 nM

*Cortisol Load*: 42 (normal 23-42nM)

*DHEA* Borderline 3 Adults (M/F): 3-10 ng/ml

Zone 4 - Maladapted phase II

*Insulin*
Fasting <3 Normal: 3-12 uIU/mL
Non-Fasting <3 Depressed Optimal: 5-20 uIU/mL

- could this have anything to do with usual diet? I ate some cornchips and juice for the non-fasting as they 'added up' to the right carbs and calories but we eat rather low-carb in general (primal-ish)

*Progesterone*

29 Normal

Optimal: 22-100 pg/ml
Borderline: 101-130 pg/ml
Elevated: >130 pg/ml

- this is on the low end of normal, but I am breastfeeding my 16 month old round-the-clock.

*Total Salivary SIgA*

<5 Depressed

Normal: 25-60 mg/dl
Borderline: 20-25 mg/dl

*Gliadin Ab, SIgA (Saliva)*

5 Negative

Borderline: 13-15 U/ml
Positive: >15 U/ml

-gluten-free for a year (mostly, have it here and there out of the house but never in the house because of my son. Whenever I have it I get awful stomach pains and GI upset that lasts a week +)


----------



## GoddessKristie (Oct 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *meandk0610* 
that is so awesome and inspiring! would you mind listing what you were taking? i'm especially interested in the supplement that evened out your moods and made you respond less.

also, did you have any experience about increasing/new food allergies and them either going away or stabilizing (eg. not getting any more new ones)? i'd like to stop that slide while i still have a few things i can eat safely.









I'll do my best! I had a card that said everything I was taking in the begining on it, but I just decided last week that I should get rid of it.

Multi (Rainbow Light Prenatal One)
Calcium plus (magnesium, D, Copper, zing and manganese)
Chromium
B Complex
Additional Panto
Additional B-1
Biotin
Zinc
Adrenal Caps
5-HTP
Papaya Enzyme
Vitamin E
Selenium
Vitamin C
Adrenal Caps
The herbal: Dr. Lorna Vanderhaeghe's Adrenasmart
each capsule has:
100mg rhodiola rosea
100mg eleuthro
80mg schizandra
80mg ashwaghanda
Recomended dosage on bottle: 1-3 caps daily

I took two of these with lunch unless I was having a particularly stressful day (and around hormonal adjustments with my menstrual cycle which are particularly difficult for me).

I'm now taking:
Multi (same)
Vitamin C
Vitamin E
B complex
Additional Panto
Zinc
Magnesium
Adrenal Caps
Eleuthro (410mg)
Astragalus (470mg)
Alfalfa (405mg)
Schisandra (480mg)
Royal Jelly (500mg)
I take the herbs with lunch every day.
This is a new combination that I chose based on my specific needs. I just started it on Wed after going off of Gaia herbs' System Support Adrenal Health. I took that for a month, but it stopped my period (Holy Basil) and seemed to give me a hair trigger temper, so I went off of it on Tuesday and got my period today. As I mentioned earlier this is a rough time for me, so I can't say how my new herbs are doing yet.

I hope that helps. I think the former list is complete, but if I think of anything else I will edit it in later.


----------



## Goddess3_2005 (Oct 20, 2004)

I really need so advice. My adrenal symtoms have gone from bad to worse.I know its because I am trying to get my business going and I am working full time with 6 kids. I don't know what to do. My doc says I need to quit my job, but DH has been without work for a long time and we need the money. But I feel so very sick, at the point of colapse. I am very lethargic, stuttering over words, my body is numb in parts, I ache like crazy in my joints, I'm dizzy if I stand too long. What can I do? Help>>>


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Make sure you're getting lots of salt in your diet... it should at least help w/the dizziness.... I can tell you what I'm taking... vit c (to bowel tolerance then back off by a few hundred mg as my daily dose), 100 mg of b 5 and b6, 100 mg of magnesium, and lots of salt. I also take a "glandular" I got from my naturopath. Also, try to be in bed by 10... and get 8+ hrs of sleep a night.

Anyway, that's what I do, but really you should go see a naturopath if you can... they'll be able to be more specific to your needs.


----------



## twinkletoesmomma (Jun 26, 2009)

Hi,
I'm coming out of lurkdom again to ask you all a question. I have adrenal fatigue. 18 months ago, I was at a stage 7, but still with my days and nights opposite. I now have a regular circadian rhythm, but my cortisol levels are still very low. I am barely into the stage 4. I am definitely feeling better and off the couch more now, but my stamina and energy are still very low.

My main question is about the herb Rhodiola. Would this be a good thing to try? I don't want a quick fix. I am functioning enough where I wouldn't want to take anything that would give me energy, but in the long run not give my adrenals a chance to rest. If I have a lot of energy, I may not be able to read my body's signals enough and take it easy. I am so worried about overworking my adrenals and not getting fully better, but then I read that this could balance everything out and actually heal me. I also read that it is better for high cortisol which I don't have.

I am so confused. would anyone like to share some insight about this? thanks so much.


----------



## Goddess3_2005 (Oct 20, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
Make sure you're getting lots of salt in your diet... it should at least help w/the dizziness.... I can tell you what I'm taking... vit c (to bowel tolerance then back off by a few hundred mg as my daily dose), 100 mg of b 5 and b6, 100 mg of magnesium, and lots of salt. I also take a "glandular" I got from my naturopath. Also, try to be in bed by 10... and get 8+ hrs of sleep a night.

Anyway, that's what I do, but really you should go see a naturopath if you can... they'll be able to be more specific to your needs.

Thank Jenna. I have been seeing a naturopath. I have lots of supplements that I take, Multi, Adreacort, Vit E, Fish oils, Vit C( I'm taking over 15000 MG a day!), cal/mag, Aderenal Cortical Extact. I eat tons of salty foods. I was feeling so bad that night I was worried I was heading twards a trip to the hospital, but DH came home and gave me a B12 shot which really helped a bunch, so with a little rest I was feeling better by today. Sigh, I need a miracle, so I can quit my awefull job, I'm only getting 4-5 hour s of sleep a night right now.


----------



## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Goddess3_2005* 
Thank Jenna. I have been seeing a naturopath. I have lots of supplements that I take, Multi, Adreacort, Vit E, Fish oils, Vit C( I'm taking over 15000 MG a day!), cal/mag, Aderenal Cortical Extact. I eat tons of salty foods. I was feeling so bad that night I was worried I was heading twards a trip to the hospital, but DH came home and gave me a B12 shot which really helped a bunch, so with a little rest I was feeling better by today. Sigh, I need a miracle, so I can quit my awefull job, I'm only getting 4-5 hour s of sleep a night right now.

any chance you have something else going on beyond the adrenal stuff?

Sorry, I'm not much help.







What about licorice or other herbs that are supposed to help?

Hope you're feeling better soon!


----------



## Goddess3_2005 (Oct 20, 2004)

Its possible I may have picked up a bug and the symtoms were exaggerated because of the adrenal thing maybe.

I take AdrenaCort, http://www.rockwellnutrition.com/Adr...na_p_1027.html

Which I was told is really good. ;0)

I am feeling better, thanks. I am just sick and tired of being sick and tired.


----------



## Goddess3_2005 (Oct 20, 2004)

OH geeze. So I think I might be pregnant. Last time I was preggers with Adrenal fatigue I was in bed al most the whole pregnancy. Anyone have suggestions?


----------



## mimi! (Aug 27, 2004)

Glad I found this thread, as I've been working on my adrenals for a few months now.

I think after all the years of night wakings and breastfeeding, I totally crashed over and over.

I'm here to rebuild myself, especially since my night time breastfeeding days are over.

I've found ashwaganda and eleuthro tincture helpful, and really, really love







the Sisu brand Rhiodola.

Within in three days it chilled me out!


----------



## gardenmom (Apr 9, 2003)

Hi all,

Subscribing to this thread. I am slowly reading through the old thread and will go through this one, but have an odd question. Is it possible to have high blood pressure and still be in some kind of Adrenal stress or fatigue?

I have felt like I am burning adrenaline lately (particularly with any kind of stress/distress, even mild stuff that I feel shouldn't bother me), then I race for a while--mind/anxiety/heart--followed by an exhausted crash. My blood pressure has always been normal, but is now on the verge of high, in particular when I go to the doctor (I have horrible white coat syndrome-super high bp when at the dr for anything non routine) or have any kind of fear/anxiety/stress. I am also hypotyroid and taking Armour 30mg daily, am in need of a thorough re-evaluation of that after a while at the same dose--wondering if I should lower the dose.

Anyhow, would love to know if anyone who has adrenal problems also has high bp, or is this just out of the realm of possibility?

Thanks.


----------



## tanyalynn (Jun 5, 2005)

gardenmom--yes. The low BP thing is typical, but not required. My DH had borderline high BP for who knows how long and his adrenals were really shot. You'll need to be careful of herbs that are commonly used for adrenal issues, several (and I don't know which ones) can raise blood pressure which you'd clearly not want. For DH, he needs more magnesium, and we could get his BP down to normal either with mag glycinate 2x/day (fairly high doses) or with dietary changes--stuff , for him, like low carb, because for him that took stress off his body and reduced his need for magnesium (it's not really that his mag intake changed, I don't think, but he didn't run low on mag so easily). I'm guessing other diet or even lifestyle changes could do the same thing for other people, but that was just what worked for him.


----------



## jihan (Jan 19, 2011)

Hi,

I'm kinda new here and I've recently uncovered that I may have AF. I also may be hypothyroid but right now my AF is caused by a 16 month old marathon nurser who has never slept through the night, working FT, being primary caregiver and housekeeper and homemaker. I'm tired. 

My big question is around a supplement my doctor just suggested I try - Gaia's Adrenal Health. I'm nursing and I can't find a definitive answer in the thread on whether it's ok for me to take. I also just took one pill yesterday as a trial run and I became CRAZY wired, like I had just had a triple espresso and some methamphetamine. I had a lump in my throat and it seemed like my eyes were being held open. I also woke up at 2am with a ringing in my ear and was - BAM - wide awake for two hours. Does this sound familiar to anyone?

Thank you, thank you, thank you


----------



## Katc8910 (Dec 17, 2008)

I had the same response to Thorne's Adrenal Cortex. After two days, I stopped taking it. I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts for why this happened.


----------



## sparkprincess (Sep 10, 2004)

I just finished the thread and wanted to pop in and say hi and ask a couple of questions.

First off, my ND told me I have AF, sluggish thyroid, and low progesterone. She had me on various supplements for 8 weeks and her current recommendations are:

Digestive enzymes

Probiotics

Whole food vitamins

Suma root

Bupleurum Liver Cleanse

Iodine drops

Evening Primrose Oil/Flaxseed oil (two weeks of one, then two weeks of the other, back and forth)

My cycles seem to have evened out and my hair stopped falling out...oh, and I do have more energy. My biggest, lasting issue, is that I still cannot lose weight. I know it's early still, but I'm a bridesmaid in my little sister's wedding and I'd like to just go down one dress size.









Here are my questions: 1. What role does carbs play in AF? Years ago, I went on the South Beach diet and felt great and lost weight. Loved it. I've tried the diet again over these past few years and didn't lose weight and didn't feel better. Then, one year ago, I started the whole family on the GAPS diet. GAPS doesn't have to be low/no carb, but it was for us. I still didn't lose weight and 6 months into the diet my hair started falling out. (had lots of benefits from the diet, though). Turns out a lot of GAPS people have had the same experience and there's some guy out there, Matt Stone, who asserts that low carb can be very stressful on adrenals and large amounts of carbs are needed to help heal. Any thoughts?

2. What kind, if any, exercise is acceptable for those with AF? I have read that exercise should be avoided, but my ND was skeptical of that. She pointed out that exercise can be great for relieving stress and releasing endorphines, etc. What do you all think?

Thanks in advance!


----------



## bayosgirl87 (Dec 6, 2010)

Ugh. The forum ate my text THREE times. I'm not sure what's going on...Copying and pasting from Word just in case.

I'm starting to realize I have chronic AF. It started in 2002; I was a freshman in high school and fell from a horse, sustaining a "mild" concussion. There was nothing mild about it for me. I went from being a typical energetic, bright teenager to chronically depressed and exhausted. Since then, I've spent literally thousands of dollars out of pocket trying to get better-I've never had insurance because my parents own their own business and I was too sick to work full time. I even tried neurofeedback. All my blood work has come back "normal". Except the last time, the doctor told me I have the "adrenals of an eighty year old." Verbatim. Yet this "renowned" physician at the Ohio State University couldn't tell me how to fix this problem. He just recommended some vitamin/mineral supplements and said to avoid gluten because I'm allergic, which I suspected. I'm way beyond vitamins at this point. I've eaten a clean, organic diet since shortly after I became sick. I was desperate to get well and smart enough, even at 16, to know that nutrition is paramount to health. It hasn't helped me much. Yes, I'd be bedridden on the Standard American Diet, but I'm not much better now. I'm angry at all the doctors who didn't help me, and especially the last one, who clearly KNEW my adrenals are fatigued and didn't tell me what to do. He could've prescribed cortisol temporarily, knowing my case is severe. Now I have to rely on Adrenal Cortical Extract, which I've heard mixed things about. I can't afford to keep going to doctors and not getting adequate help. Might as well try the ACE and see if it helps; if it doesn't, I'll see about finding a new doctor. It is beyond frustrating to be so young and yet so tired. Doctors tend to not take me seriously because of my young age and because I don't "look" sick. I have a history of depression in my family so it's easy to blame that (Hello?! Maybe they were depressed because they had low adrenal function, or other endocrine issues!) I don't see how clinical depression could be my primary diagnosis when, in spite of feeling like crap day after day, I'm still full of hope and have goals for the future. It's easy to write a script for an antidepressant, but it's a lot harder to sit with a patient and actually evaluate their symptoms and labwork in-depth...you know, what a GOOD doctor would do! Anyway.. didn't really mean to turn this into a rant. I'll be coming back to this thread for ideas, and posting my progress. Good luck to all who suffer from chronic faigue-you're not alone.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

I can't believe this thread is still going...well, actually I can because really, who doesn't have crappy adrenals these days?

@bayosgirl87, I wonder if you damaged your pituitary gland (or even hypothalamus) during your fall? The pituitary sends hormones to the adrenal glands while the hypothalamus is the link between the brain and the pituitary--so you see why damage to either of these glands could cause adrenal issues.

@sparkprincess, I think you have to try out exercise and see how you feel - but give yourself a few days or so to see. Last spring/summer I was taking loong walks (like 12 miles) and even though they were at a leisurely pace and I felt SO good (emotionally, spiritually, mentally, etc.), after a few days, I felt physically awful. For months I was feeling the physical effects of those walks. But sitting around doing nothing isn't healthy either. this spring, I'm going to start out reeeaally slow and just do 1/2 mile or something and give myself a few days to see how my body reacts and increase from there. I've read about runners taxing their adrenals because the body sees it as a stress... But we're definitely designed to walk, so I'm going with that.

As for supps, how about some glandulars? And as for the weight, you're supposed to notice things as you come up from a lower zone of adrenal fatigue. For example, I'm in zone 7, way down low. I have almost no cortisol. As I come up, I'll go through a phase where I switch to having more cortisol and for some reason, I may feel worse as I heal and I might gain weight (I'm pretty slim at 5'9 and 125lbs.) Have you done an ASI? Perhaps you have high cortisol which is the beginning stages of adrenal fatigue and contributes to weight gain. It's helpful to know where you are on the ASI. At some point, if stress continues and your adrenals don't heal, cortisol goes from being high to being depleted.

@jihan, I took that Gaia supplement as a sample for a week or so and I really liked it but I've read that rhodiola can be a stimulant for some people. It's the only ingredient that jumps out at me as possibly being the explanation for what you felt.

My ND started me out on pregnenolone at slowly increasing amounts of 3mg and I worked up to 30mg/day - and it helped. Then I didn't see him for a while and another doc put me back on pregnenolone and I started out taking 100mg a day and I began to feel INSANE. On the final day when I felt like I was going to jump out of my own skin, I had to run outside and throw myself on the grass just to feel grounded enough to breathe. i then looked at the new supplements I was taking and decided that the huge dose of pregnenolone was to blame so I stopped taking it and felt normal again. I don't know what my body was doing with it, but it wasn't happy.

The way the body works is, it makes pregnenolone from cholesterol (so pregnenolone is at the top of the hormone cascade.) From there, things are directed to the most vital needs of the body, the adrenals being at the top so prenenolone is directed to cortisol production to support the adrenals and the other hormones are neglected.

Some of the last few posts list supplements but not food... Eating liver (and other organs) is huge for healing the adrenals (which will heal the thyroid and raise progesterone, as well as other sex hormones.) My ND said that diet played a HUGE part in healing the adrenals and he was a big fan of the WAPF diet (minus the grains) and keeping blood sugar/insulin levels low and steady because blood sugar swings will further tax the adrenals since they're "in charge" (in a way) of regulating blood sugar. One of my fears has been developing diabetes because my adrenals are so tanked. So IMO, eating a diet that isn't high in carbs/starches/sugar is important for adrenal healing. As uncomfortable as blood sugar spikes and the resulting insulin dumps followed by low blood sugar is, I'm glad I can feel it because it alerts me as to which foods my body does not like. If I eat white rice cooked in water, I feel surreal and like the insides of my body are shaking, but if I cook white rice in bone broth with lots of raw butter on top, I feel completely fine. So I think the way you prepare food can have an effect on how your body processes it as well.

I've recently begun drinking strong nettles infusions because nettle is supposed to be wonderful for all of the glands, particularly the adrenals. I've also read about maca but haven't tried it yet. Has anyone else? Has it helped?

I focus our diet here on pastured animal meat/eggs/dairy/fat and lots of fresh, organic, local veggies and fermented vegetables. I try very hard to eat seasonally because I think eating, say, almonds or apples or strawberries all year long isn't what nature intended. We eat A LOT of fat because that's the raw material needed to make hormones, and kids especially need all of the best raw material (food) to have healthy hormone systems (girls tend to need more fats for hormones while boys tend to need more protein for building muscle.) Lots of butter (both raw from 100% grass-fed cows as well as organic pasteurized from grass-fed cows), lots of lard from pastured pigs (awesome source of vit. D!), super high quality olive oil, coconut oil and lots of full-fat raw 100% grass-fed dairy. TONS of eggs from organic, pastured chickens, mostly beef for protein from 100% grass-fed cows and some poultry (also organic, pastured), and a little bit of pork (also pastured.) We join a CSA every year and buy from the farmers' market during the winter (and grow some.) We do eat potatoes and sweet potatoes as well as winter squash and occasionally some legumes in chili.

We haven't eaten seafood since Fukushima because I just don't know how much radiation contamination there is at this point.







But that's another huge issue for every living thing on this poor planet which is showing up as an increase in low thyroid function which doesn't help the adrenals either. My doc gave me a list of supplements for our family to take to protect ourselves from the radiation but so far I've just had my head in the sand because I don't have the money to buy all of it (or the adrenal function to face it.)  The list was: pectin (from fruit or supplements), fulvic acid from a company called Mother Earth, zeolite and magnescent iodine.

I've read that miso prevented workers from developing cancer after a nuclear disaster in Asia and it's so good for your gut health anyway... Nearly three years have gone by and I'm still trying to wrap my brain around the extent of this radiation crisis and what to do about it.

Well, that conversation didn't help my adrenals.







Goddess, it's so hard to stay positive sometimes.

As far as adrenal supplements, I think I mentioned what my ND gave me in the first post of the thread. I've been taking Dr. Ron's adrenal capsules instead of Mil-Adregen and I like it. I can get the B vitamins and vitamin C from other sources. I haven't been taking pregnenolone but I probably should. I was recently told (not by my ND) that I have mercury in my thyroid that is causing my thyroid not to function optimally and that even if I were to take dessicated thyroid, it wouldn't help because I'd still have the mercury issue. My doc assured me that it would be okay to take IMD to detox the mercury while nursing my 3 yr old, but my mama instincts say not to (and so does the website.) It's pretty frustrating because I love nursing my toddler and neither one of us is ready to wean but I'm spending money trying to heal myself when I've been told the mercury is just sitting there. AND, I just turned 37 and I'm not sure that I'm finished having babies. The pressure is on but my body isn't healthy enough to grow another healthy human right now and I'm not sure when I'll be able to squeeze in a heavy metal detox.

I know it's immensely controversial, but EMF and microwave technology is also something to look into. I know I'm sensitive to both and I don't use a cell phone and I won't let my kids near one. We don't have wireless internet and our land-line phones are all corded and I have a sign on our electric meter stating that we don't consent to having a smart meter installed on our property.  And we have a couple of giant cell towers nearby and hey, a nuclear power plant and a superfund site, too! Woot! At some point, you have to step back and accept that you can't get away from everything, but it ain't easy.


----------



## sparkprincess (Sep 10, 2004)

Thanks for replying! I haven't had an ASI done, that I know of?? and I'm probably not going to simply because my naturopath isn't one for lots of tests and I really don't want to go back to the MD. I'm going to keep on keeping on and see how I feel.

So glad to hear your diet recommendations. That's how I prefer to eat anyway, but I obviously don't want to do more harm to my body. My ND has me on a couple of new things and then I'll see her again in March. We'll see how it goes. I am sleeping better at night and my constipation is ebbing so I feel like I'm headed in the right direction.

Thanks again for all of the good advice!


----------



## bayosgirl87 (Dec 6, 2010)

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Metasequoia*
> 
> @bayosgirl87, I wonder if you damaged your pituitary gland (or even hypothalamus) during your fall? The pituitary sends hormones to the adrenal glands while the hypothalamus is the link between the brain and the pituitary--so you see why damage to either of these glands could cause adrenal issues.


Could be. I've read about the HPA axis. If the pituitary and/or hypothalamus is involved, would the treatment be any different?

I've been on Adrenal extract (Pure Encapsulations brand) for about a week, taking Redmond salt in water 2x a day, going to bed before 10:30 when I can, avoiding caffeine mostly because my EBF baby doesn't tolerate it--and I think I'm noticing a slight change, so that's hopeful.









By the way, found my bloodwork from the last doc from last year. Here are my adrenal-related values:

Cortisol (range 3.09-22.40): *5.40*
ACTH (range 9.0-50.0) : *7.0 (L)*

DHEA-Sulfate (range 35-430): *44*

If it makes a difference, these were taken when I was two months pregnant. I'm not sure how pregnancy affects the adrenals; I know it makes thyroid results slightly better.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

At 2 months gestation, I don't know if you'd be pulling from the baby yet but a lot of people feel better (thyroid/adrenal-wise) while pregnant because they pull from the baby's adrenals/thyroid.  I think you can be REALLY good about adrenal care while pregnant and possibly spare the baby's adrenals but I don't know about thyroid; I think perhaps you'd have to take dessicated thyroid (or synthetic) in order not to pull from the baby.


----------



## bayosgirl87 (Dec 6, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Metasequoia*
> 
> At 2 months gestation, I don't know if you'd be pulling from the baby yet but a lot of people feel better (thyroid/adrenal-wise) while pregnant because they pull from the baby's adrenals/thyroid.  I think you can be REALLY good about adrenal care while pregnant and possibly spare the baby's adrenals but I don't know about thyroid; I think perhaps you'd have to take dessicated thyroid (or synthetic) in order not to pull from the baby.


Thank you. Fortunately my son seems fine; he is extremely healthy and high energy. I took care of myself as much as possible during pregnancy, lots of rest and good food and whole food prenatals. So hopefully he won't suffer any ill effects. I definitely want to make sure I'm completely healed before I get pregnant again though.


----------



## Metasequoia (Jun 7, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bayosgirl87*
> 
> Thank you. Fortunately my son seems fine; he is extremely healthy and high energy. I took care of myself as much as possible during pregnancy, lots of rest and good food and whole food prenatals. So hopefully he won't suffer any ill effects. I definitely want to make sure I'm completely healed before I get pregnant again though.


Mine have all been happy, healthy babies/toddlers too (also extremely high energy!) My oldest, who just turned 14 on Monday, started to show signs of adrenal insufficiency as she approached the teen years. That's when I first began to have symptoms of adrenal insufficiency too. I think it's common to first feel adrenal issues as puberty approaches. We're long-time WAPF eaters leaning towards Paleo/Primal and try to eat the most nutrient-dense food possible so I hope this counts for something.


----------

