# Hostility towards strollers



## Harmony08 (Feb 4, 2009)

This thread is not what I intended it to be. I started it one night because I was upset after a person was nasty to me while I was at a festival with my family. A couple days prior I experienced something similar. I was upset and wanted to hear if this happened to other mothers. Some people were very supportive and made excellent points. I thank them.

Just to be clear, I don't have hostility towards strollers. I have experienced hostility towards my stroller.

If you haven't read the thread yet, I suggest you skip it. I hoped it would be removed.


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## Aquafina (Oct 2, 2006)

I find people to be both rude and nice.I get my mix of people letting the doors slam on me usually by teenagers or old people while trying to stroller inside a building.Hollister clothing store has gave me the evil eye by being a mom with a stroller in there store (there store is to strong with perfume anyhow)

Most of the time people are nice.

What rips me is stores not being stroller friendly.I get upset by shopping at shops that have racks ontop of each other or stuff in toddler reach lol.Not everyone has a nanny.My child thinks its fun to see what he can rip off the racks while strolling by. When I get him out of stroller I see a million clothes tags where he was sitting.


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## musikat (Oct 30, 2002)

I don't get that often, especially that I have a Maclaren single (doesn't take too much space). But I was in the mall recently with a friend who had a double stroller and as we were walking side by side down the main isle (not in a store) a lady mall walker told us as she went by 'single file ladies' in a very rude tone of voice! She had plenty of room to get by, so I don't know what her problem was. Grrrr.


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## LilyGrace (Jun 10, 2007)

I'll admit, I have a problem with strollers. Too many of them are 'cadillacs' - huge things that have shocks and off-road tires that don't belong in stores. And parents are careless with them. I love children, but if there's a double stroller in the middle of the aisle of a crowded restroom, I'm going to curse the parents under my breath.

If more people used smaller strollers that were a single person wide and didn't take up a good portion of close areas, I don't think there'd be much of a problem with it. But it's the behemoths that make people groan - especially during the busy shopping season and the already crowded areas.


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## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

It's not just strollers! Some people are just too rude and selfish to accomodate anyone else in a public place. I can't tell you the number of times people have shoved past me in a crowd when I'm wearing my son in the Moby wrap. It happened just today while shopping in a crowded store - a group of 3 college age kids cut right in front of me in an aisle, close enough they brushed my son. No "excuse me" or anything. The one that REALLY gets me is @$#% people in parking lots who zoom on by and don't yield to pedestrians. I'm always amazed - do they really need to get somewhere SO BADLY that they can't wait until I am done crossing their path with my son before driving past?

Anyways, sorry you're encountering this. I would totally hold the door for you if I could!


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## Aquafina (Oct 2, 2006)

Quote:

I'm always amazed - do they really need to get somewhere SO BADLY that they can't wait until I am done crossing their path with my son before driving past?


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

I was just reading an article about this, about two months ago, and it really stuck with me. I wish I remembered where I found it.

The article was basically about how traditionally women aren't allowed to take up space, and the animosity towards women with strollers is all about that. How if people see a guy with a stroller, they think "aw, what an awesome dad taking his kid out!" but a woman with a stroller is "taking up too much space" or "entitled." Because women should be in the kitchen, out of sight, and children should be invisible.

I dunno, it kid of struck a chord with me. Some very good points were made, I thought. On the surface it was kind of weird, but the more I think about it, the more I think maybe there's something to it.

I also never understand when people complain about how big strollers are. Hasn't anyone seen an old-fashioned pram, the kind common right up to the 1970s? Those things were friggin TANKS. The animosity towards large strollers is 100% class-based.


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
The animosity towards large strollers is 100% class-based.

interesting article, to be sure!
i will politely disagree with you on that last point though, i think the animosity toward large strollers is that they are large! they make navigating crowds difficult. there are lots of small strollers (umbrella strollers, for one that are cheap and aren't so huge.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *April Dawn* 
It's not just strollers! Some people are just too rude and selfish to accomodate anyone else in a public place. I can't tell you the number of times people have shoved past me in a crowd when I'm wearing my son in the Moby wrap.

true. but i also cant count how many times i have been bashed - not grazed, not bumped- bashed with a stroller. people in crowds sometimes use their stroller like a battering ram to get people out of their way.
not saying that glaring at a person with a stroller is ok, we could all use a little more compassion in our lives. maybe some of the hate comes from being bashed. (not saying you bash into people, OP!)


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## Purple*Lotus (Nov 1, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
interesting article, to be sure!
i will politely disagree with you on that last point though, i think the animosity toward large strollers is that they are large! they make navigating crowds difficult. there are lots of small strollers (umbrella strollers, for one that are cheap and aren't so huge.

First of all, I want to say that I normally agree with everything that you say







But I have to disagree with the umbrella stroller thing. When I was a Nanny I found it to be really uncomfortable. Maybe I am just too tall? I always had to hunch over to push it and the larger stroller was much more comfortable for me to use. It was fairly big but obviously I didn't buy it









ETA: Ours umbrella stroller did not adjust, so perhaps they make some that do, in which case, disreguard what I just said!


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bunnyflakes* 
First of all, I want to say that I normally agree with everything that you say







But I have to disagree with the umbrella stroller thing. When I was a Nanny I found it to be really uncomfortable. Maybe I am just too tall? I always had to hunch over to push it and the larger stroller was much more comfortable for me to use. It was fairly big but obviously I didn't buy it









ETA: Ours umbrella stroller did not adjust, so perhaps they make some that do, in which case, disregard what I just said!

fair enough! i've never actually used an umbrella stroller, but i was just using that as an example of a small stroller that isn't super expensive. i still dont think that a bias against large strollers is class based.


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## choli (Jun 20, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
true. but i also cant count how many times i have been bashed - not grazed, not bumped- bashed with a stroller. people in crowds sometimes use their stroller like a battering ram to get people out of their way.
not saying that glaring at a person with a stroller is ok, we could all use a little more compassion in our lives. maybe some of the hate comes from being bashed. (not saying you bash into people, OP!)

I have to agree, this is all too common. The attitude of "get out of my way, I have a stroller, I take precedence over everyone else. Too bad about your shins..."


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
interesting article, to be sure!
i will politely disagree with you on that last point though, i think the animosity toward large strollers is that they are large! they make navigating crowds difficult. *there are lots of small strollers (umbrella strollers, for one that are cheap and aren't so huge.*

true. but i also cant count how many times i have been bashed - not grazed, not bumped- bashed with a stroller. people in crowds sometimes use their stroller like a battering ram to get people out of their way.
not saying that glaring at a person with a stroller is ok, we could all use a little more compassion in our lives. maybe some of the hate comes from being bashed. (not saying you bash into people, OP!)

And they are pieces of crap. Every.. single.. umbrella stroller I have owned.. or family members have owned have had something funky happen to the front wheels so they don't work anymore within a matter of months.. sometimes weeks. I spend my whole time fighting with the stroller to go the direction I want becuase it will not steer anymore. I generally end up popping a wheely and my kids go around with the front wheels in the air. I hate those things and there is a reason they are cheap!!

However with my younger two kids.. after they grew out of being worn.. I have found decent smaller strollers that were not umbrella strollers. They still fit in the car... have cup holders, padding, and canopies that make a comfortable ride and do not take up too much space.

As for strollers not being able to get down isles cause stores have the racks too close. I have complied to a store before. Aren't they supposed to be handicap accessible? If I can't get a stroller down the isle how is a wheel chair going to get down the isle? I was shrugged at.

ETA: and I have never been rammed into by a stroller.


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *choli* 
I have to agree, this is all too common. The attitude of "get out of my way, I have a stroller, I take precedence over everyone else. Too bad about your shins..."

you'd be lucky to hear "too bad about your shins!"


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

I'll admit it. I'm a stroller hater too. Especially in places like Victoria's secret where there isn't really much room to walk.

Strollers have gotten massive over the last 15 years. They used to be easier to work around, but now it's not much smaller than pushing a full size shopping cart around the mall.

I'm not rude about it... but, I am annoyed.

Last night a woman had a giant stroller in Wal Mart... while also dragging a shopping cart and holding the baby (who was old enough to walk). THEN... she was parked next to my van, and put her cart behind my van while she unloaded her groceries into her car even though she knew I was trying to leave. It took a long time before she put the baby in the carseat........ then slowly folded her stroller up.........put it back in the trunk of her car......... then she moved her cart out of my way AND gave me a nasty look because I was in HER way. I have done that faster with four kids.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

If you want to experience stroller hostility try pushing the huge boxy double stroller at Disney (world -lands aren't bad) through crowded mainstreet.

and I agree that cheapie umbrella stroers are awful. We do have a nice, compact peg perego - but like maclarens they are $$$.


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## WC_hapamama (Sep 19, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
And they are pieces of crap. Every.. single.. umbrella stroller I have owned.. or family members have owned have had something funky happen to the front wheels so they don't work anymore within a matter of months.. sometimes weeks. I spend my whole time fighting with the stroller to go the direction I want becuase it will not steer anymore. I generally end up popping a wheely and my kids go around with the front wheels in the air. I hate those things and there is a reason they are cheap!!

The only umbrella strollers that I've owned that were comfortable for me to push (I'm 5'6"ish) cost more than those nasty, plasticky travel systems that some people love.

Those cheap umbrella strollers are only comfortable to push if you're a short person going a short distance.

If I'm going to use a stroller, dang it, it's going to be comfortable for both my child, myself and DH to use.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
As for strollers not being able to get down isles cause stores have the racks too close. I have complied to a store before. Aren't they supposed to be handicap accessible? If I can't get a stroller down the isle how is a wheel chair going to get down the isle? I was shrugged at.

In some stores, the racks are so close that you can't get the darned carts between them, let alone a stroller or wheelchair.


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## Happily Blessed (Feb 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *musikat* 
I don't get that often, especially that I have a Maclaren single (doesn't take too much space). But I was in the mall recently with a friend who had a double stroller and as we were walking side by side down the main isle (not in a store) a lady mall walker told us as she went by 'single file ladies' in a very rude tone of voice! She had plenty of room to get by, so I don't know what her problem was. Grrrr.

I would have had to asked her if we were still in high school.


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## annie2186 (Apr 13, 2009)

I just have to say that I HATE driving a stroller!! LOL

It seems like ESPECIALLY the malls are a pain in the arse to drive stollers around.............

That being said I have never been glared at (don't get out much, LOL) and I have never been run over by a stoller. BOTH of those things would make me pretty upset.

I have been run over by store carts however............I guess that's another story


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

I've never been rammed by a stroller either. That isn't to say that it doesn't happen, obviously, or that there aren't some really obnoxious people out there who happen to be mothers who happen to have children in strollers. But I think that there's a peculiar tendency for people to be eager about sharing their stories about obnoxious women with strollers, and then painting all mothers or even all women with that broad brush.

I mean, if I posted on this forum with a specific example that seemed to confirm a broader negative stereotype, I'm sure I'd be (rightfully) corrected by other posters, and perhaps even get into trouble with the mods. So why is it okay to hate on "large strollers" and use as the only evidence some anecdotes that are more about obnoxious people than about strollers?

I've been following the anti large-stroller trend with a lot of interest since it really started in full force about 5 years ago (back then it was 100% about the Bugaboo, now that there's a wider assortment of high end strollers it's expanded), and I really have to say that I think it's a subject heavily influenced by both misogyny and class. Both of which our culture supports criticizing, so people get away with perpetuating the stereotype of women with children in strollers as being bad females: taking up space, "entitled," and somehow automatically poor mothers.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nextcommercial* 
Last night a woman had a giant stroller in Wal Mart... while also dragging a shopping cart and holding the baby (who was old enough to walk). THEN... she was parked next to my van, and put her cart behind my van while she unloaded her groceries into her car even though she knew I was trying to leave. It took a long time before she put the baby in the carseat........ then slowly folded her stroller up.........put it back in the trunk of her car......... then she moved her cart out of my way AND gave me a nasty look because I was in HER way. I have done that faster with four kids.

Not to pick on you, because every anecdote in this thread and on every other message board I've ever read about this subject and in countless articles follows basically the same theme, so I'm just using it as an example. But while that is totally obnoxious (though I would like to say that it's very rare that I let my 2.5yo walk in a store like that, though she is more than capable of walking herself. And running. And picking things up off the shelf. And helping to rearrange the shelves.), that story doesn't really have much to do with strollers. It's just an obnoxious woman who happened to have a stroller.

Oh yeah, and another vote for umbrella strollers being awful. We have an expensive one at my parents', and have run through a string of cheap ones at our house, and they're uncomfortable and break easily. My parents were really enthusiastic about the real strollers we have, and went on at length about how when I was a baby all the strollers were awful umbrella strollers and they would have given their right arms for a stroller that was big enough to be comfortable to the kid and easy for the adult to push.


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## dogretro (Jun 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
As for strollers not being able to get down isles cause stores have the racks too close. I have complied to a store before. Aren't they supposed to be handicap accessible? If I can't get a stroller down the isle how is a wheel chair going to get down the isle? I was shrugged at.

ETA: and I have never been rammed into by a stroller.

I wonder that, too! If I can't get in there w/ my stroller, I darn sure couldn't get in w/a wheelchair or scooter!

We do have a large 3-tired stroller. Our city has many junky sidewalks, for one, and pushing anything less than an air-filled tire is a nightmare. Our stroller also converts into a double, so there is no way we are spending more than the staggering amount we spent on this (very much worth it) stroller we already own. We own one, the end. You are also able to store more things in a bigger stroller, like coats and bags. No way am I trying to push a usually crappy or overpriced umbrella stroller, carry my coat, diaper bag, and whatever I have purchased. It's just not practical, esp w/ more than one kid/baby in tow.

I have never been hit by a stroller, but I have hit many things! I am a bad navigator! I do apologize a lot, though! I always apologize when I bump into someone w/out a stroller, too. I try to be v polite, always saying, "Excuse us," when we are trying to get through


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## jsh7809 (Aug 7, 2009)

I'm pregnant with my first child, so no stroller experience yet, but I just thought I would chime in that people are also surprisingly unaccommodating to my big pregnant belly! I thought they would move out of the way to let me by in aisles, etc., at stores and so on - but I"m having to say "excuse me EXCUSE ME" multiple times and then somehow try to squeeze by... so I can only imagine strollers are much more difficult to navigate!


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

I never used a stroller, but I have had more than one encounter with the beasts to have formed a great dislike of them. Actually, I don't dislike strollers, it's most of their owners that are annoying.

It irks me to no end the lack of courtesy shown to others by so many stroller-pushing parents at the zoos we've visited!

2, 3 or 4 women (it's mainly been women) pushing double-or-triple-wide strollers, while chatting, at a slow pace and taking up entire walkways on the grounds. I understand, the zoo IS a nice, quiet place to take the munchkins. But, please, think about the other people that are trying to pass you, while you chat with each other, side-by-side!

And, when the sign, at the entrance to an exhibit, says "Please, Park Strollers Here", *DO IT*! Those nocturnal exhibits are difficult enough without having our toes stubbed or run over by a stroller that isn't supposed to be in there in the first place (especially when Mommy lets the toddler do the pushing







)

Quote:

What rips me is stores not being stroller friendly.I get upset by shopping at shops that have racks ontop of each other or stuff in toddler reach lol.Not everyone has a nanny.My child thinks its fun to see what he can rip off the racks while strolling by. When I get him out of stroller I see a million clothes tags where he was sitting.
Stores aren't meant to be stroller-friendly, nor are they supposed to be toddler-friendly. What does a nanny have to do with it? Stores are for selling products in a convenient manner, so that customers can help themselves to merchandise. Do you expect them to hang clothes so high that they are unreachable? Have everything behind a counter? "When I get him out of stroller I see a million clothes tags where he was sitting." Do you apologize to the clerks and offer to help them sort out which removed tag goes where??


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
\

Stores aren't meant to be stroller-friendly

Oh yes they are, because they should be wheelchair accessible, which happens to equal stroller-friendly as well.


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

OH yes! Last winter I was car-less/license-less and had to get everywhere by bus. I was also pregnant and had many appts which at times were for around rush hour (despite my begging and trying to reschedule). One day a woman complained loudly about how it wasn't very smart of me to take a stroller on the bus at rush hour. I replied "What's your phone number? I'll call you and ask for permission the next time I need to go out."

Honestly? I think it's hostility aimed at mothers & children and general, not just strollers. But maybe I've become a bit jaded...I do get that same sense of people not wanting to see or hear children/families....it's sad and really used to get to me in my early days of motherhood. Now it's like water off a duck's back and I've stopped feeling like I have to apologize for "being in people's way"...me and my children deserve to be out and about just as much as anyone else.


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LilyGrace* 
I'll admit, I have a problem with strollers. Too many of them are 'cadillacs' - huge things that have shocks and off-road tires that don't belong in stores. And parents are careless with them. I love children, but if there's a double stroller in the middle of the aisle of a crowded restroom, I'm going to curse the parents under my breath.

If more people used smaller strollers that were a single person wide and didn't take up a good portion of close areas, I don't think there'd be much of a problem with it. But it's the behemoths that make people groan - especially during the busy shopping season and the already crowded areas.

And for many of us, it's not practical to have a lighter stroller. I'm in a really cold place and it was the larger stroller that allowed me to weather proof, have a carseat handy for if I needed to cab it back with groceries and space for the groceries themselves! We had no car so it was really the most practical thing for us.

For the two seconds it might take to get around someone with a "behemoth", especially someone who might be struggling with more than one child, is it really worthy of the glares and nastiness that some moms get?


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## elus0814 (Sep 21, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
I never used a stroller, but I have had more than one encounter with the beasts to have formed a great dislike of them. Actually, I don't dislike strollers, it's most of their owners that are annoying.

It irks me to no end the lack of courtesy shown to others by so many stroller-pushing parents at the zoos we've visited!

2, 3 or 4 women (it's mainly been women) pushing double-or-triple-wide strollers, while chatting, at a slow pace and taking up entire walkways on the grounds. I understand, the zoo IS a nice, quiet place to take the munchkins. But, please, think about the other people that are trying to pass you, while you chat with each other, side-by-side!

And, when the sign, at the entrance to an exhibit, says "Please, Park Strollers Here", *DO IT*! Those nocturnal exhibits are difficult enough without having our toes stubbed or run over by a stroller that isn't supposed to be in there in the first place (especially when Mommy lets the toddler do the pushing







)

Stores aren't meant to be stroller-friendly, nor are they supposed to be toddler-friendly. What does a nanny have to do with it? Stores are for selling products in a convenient manner, so that customers can help themselves to merchandise. Do you expect them to hang clothes so high that they are unreachable? Have everything behind a counter? "When I get him out of stroller I see a million clothes tags where he was sitting." Do you apologize to the clerks and offer to help them sort out which removed tag goes where??

Yes, it is rude for parents to block the path of others but are you really expecting parents to leave their stroller outside and carry the stuff they have in it while helping their kids around? People have strollers so they don't have to lug everything around.

Stores may not be specifically designed to be stroller friendly but they should be accommodating for all their customers who may be in wheelchairs or be pushing strollers. If racks were further apart then kids wouldn't pull on tags and parents would be more likely to spend more time and money in a store. So many stores pack racks in so closely that you can't even push a small stroller through without getting the wheels caught.

The nanny comment has everything to do with this. Not everyone has a nanny, babysitter, friend, mother, etc. to watch their kids while they are doing shopping that needs to be done. If I didn't take my kids shopping with me we wouldn't have had food or clothes that fit for the year my husband was overseas. Not everyone can shop without kids and strollers make it possible to shop with them.

Several people have mentioned how large strollers are. It is annoying to have to get around large strollers but maybe that parent really does go on dirt paths or has some other need for a very large stroller. When my two older kids were both under 16 months I needed to use a double stroller to shop. I didn't have the money right away for a regular double stroller so I used the stroller kit that came with my double bike trailer. It was huge but it held a lot of stuff plus my kids and that was what I had to use. I did get some looks but when you are a parent you do what is best for your kids, even if it makes others less than comfortable.


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elus0814* 

Several people have mentioned how large strollers are. It is annoying to have to get around large strollers but maybe that parent really does go on dirt paths or has some other need for a very large stroller. When my two older kids were both under 16 months I needed to use a double stroller to shop. I didn't have the money right away for a regular double stroller so I used the stroller kit that came with my double bike trailer. It was huge but it held a lot of stuff plus my kids and that was what I had to use. I did get some looks but when you are a parent you do what is best for your kids, even if it makes others less than comfortable.

Absolutely, what gets me is that even HERE somehow there is the expectation that a mother caring for her family should be putting the comfort/mild inconvenience of strangers first. IN this case it's about strollers, but it applies to having children in public places, nursing in public etc etc.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

If you have never had to use a stroller (Especially as a main mode of transportation - I recall many days walking to my neighborhood grocery store with two small children in a duoglider - b/c we needed milk) I wouldn't be so quick to be annoyed. I hate pushing a large, double-wide stroller myself b/c it is cumbersome and difficult - and luckily for me those days are gone - but no way was I going to not go to the store, or unload a bab and a toddler before going in to a public bathroom ( really, would I sit them on the floor so I could pee?)

as for the zoo thing, I suppose those sahm's should walk behind one another so their babies can't see each other and they can't socialize, even if that's the only adult conversation they've had in a long time. I can see how it might take up a lot of room, but come on. If you are a single 2 legged person (ie no stroller to push or child's hand to hold) is it really that difficult to weave in and out or speed up a bit to get by or pass the obnoxious stroller users?

See, I get being irrtated by having your foot ran over w/o a sincere apology - but parents pushing strollers have every right to take up space in public places. If it really annoys you, I would suggest staying home.

(my youngest is 2.5 and much prefers to walk so our stroller use is almost non-existent now, but having BTDT for several years, I would feel nothing but understanding when I saw a big akward stroller in my way.)


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## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

People who block whole aisles with their strollers would likely block them without strollers. Lots of people are just inconsiderate and oblivious to others. I work at a large mall, in a busy restaurant. (The people with big strollers are slightly less annoying to me than people who text while walking.)

My only real issue with big strollers is at work. Our restaurant is not set up to have strollers blocking aisles....it's considered a safety/fire hazard. So, strollers have to be left in a corner of the lobby or in the back hall near the rear exit. I simply don't understand why people in the parking garage load their baby up into a behemoth stroller just to walk the short distance into our establishment. Wouldn't it just be easier to carry the kid in?

Ugh...I just realized tomorrow is Sunday. There will be dozens of big strollers taking up half our waiting area at brunch.


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elus0814* 
Yes, it is rude for parents to block the path of others but are you really expecting parents to leave their stroller outside and carry the stuff they have in it while helping their kids around? People have strollers so they don't have to lug everything around.

If there is a sign outside an exhibit that says "No strollers inside", then yeah...I do really expect parents to leave the stroller outside, or just skip that exhibit or work something else out. I used a backpack to carry my stuff, which I then put in the stroller. I suppose I had never considered that people would just toss their stuff directly into the stroller and not a bag first.

I have nothing against strollers per se, but they don't give people carte blanche to act like inconsiderate UA violations. I too have been rammed by strollers without even a word of apology (could have been more related to the fact that mom was blabbing on her cell phone than the stroller itself). I have seen someone block the entrance to an exhibit because she decided that her stroller was too important to leave outside but obviously was not thinking too hard so it got *stuck* in the turnstyle which pretty much prevented anyone from getting in for awhile except for people limber enough to climb up and over the other side. I have seen people sideswipe a store display and keep going.

But it's not the poor strollers' fault. I have a feeling that no matter what they use or don't use some people are just intentionally or unintentionally rude or clueless. And I'd still rather be hit by a stroller than run over by a shopping cart.

When my twins were infants and my older DD was 17 months, I had to use a freakin' triple stroller and NEVER rammed anyone, picked up things I knocked off shelves, and when we went to the zoo I did NOT ignore posted signs--so either we didn't go in certain areas OR...yep, I left it behind. So I guess I don't see any excuse for bad behavior while using a stroller. If klutzy me can navigate a triple, most people should be able to use a single politely.

Generally there are reasons why some exhibits/areas restrict strollers. Most of the time it's a volume thing. One stroller might not be so bad, but when you have 25 people thinking that they deserve an exception to the rule, then it kind of makes everything a pain in the butt, and only perpetuates the idea that "Oh look at that, yet another person who thinks that because they have a fancy XYZ stroller the rules don't apply to them."

I guess whatever notion I had that people would extend chivalry to me when they would see some poor mom trying to get her shopping done with newborn twins and a toddler under two vanished as people constantly let doors slam in my face, honked at me when I was taking too long breaking down the stroller and leaving my parking spot, ect. I do the best I can to extend courtesy and kindness to others, though.

I have yet to see a stroller that is wider than an adult manual wheelchair, so if a store's aisles are not wide enough to accomodate passage then yes, the store is in violation because they should know to keep their aisles clear. However, having been married to someone who uses a manual wheelchair--let's just say that most stores don't really give a fig about people who use wheelchairs either. 

IME, it only takes one or two bad experiences for people to get grumpy about something, which is probably where the stroller hostility comes in. Maybe the OP and PPs have not seen it, but man, I have seen plenty of clueless and rude stroller users.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Swan3* 
OH yes! Last winter I was car-less/license-less and had to get everywhere by bus. I was also pregnant and had many appts which at times were for around rush hour (despite my begging and trying to reschedule). One day a woman complained loudly about how it wasn't very smart of me to take a stroller on the bus at rush hour. I replied "What's your phone number? I'll call you and ask for permission the next time I need to go out."

Honestly? I think it's hostility aimed at mothers & children and general, not just strollers. But maybe I've become a bit jaded...I do get that same sense of people not wanting to see or hear children/families....it's sad and really used to get to me in my early days of motherhood. Now it's like water off a duck's back and I've stopped feeling like I have to apologize for "being in people's way"...me and my children deserve to be out and about just as much as anyone else.

DH was coming home from work one day last year and got on the bus. He said a mother with a stroller was behind him and as she started to fold up her stroller to get on the bus the bus driver told her to wait until everyone else got on to get on with her stroller. Well by the time everyone else was on the bus, the bus was full. He simply told her to wait for the next bus. I think it might have been raining too.. but DH doens't remember. He did complain to the bus company but I am sure they didn't care.


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tigerchild* 
\
I have nothing against strollers per se, but they don't give people carte blanche to act like inconsiderate UA violations. I too have been rammed by strollers without even a word of apology (could have been more related to the fact that mom was blabbing on her cell phone than the stroller itself).<snip>
But it's not the poor strollers' fault. I have a feeling that no matter what they use or don't use some people are just intentionally or unintentionally rude or clueless.

yeah you said it more eloquently than i did, but yes. this.


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## Tigerchild (Dec 2, 2001)

There a lot of nice bus drivers out there...

But that being said, a lot of people will do what they can to avoid having people they perceive as more bothersome from getting on the bus. When I was married to my ex, I cannot tell you how many times even the accessible lift buses just passed us by because the driver did not want to bother to operate the lift (it takes some extra time, to be sure, but not THAT much). Some busses weren't equipped with lifts, so of course those guys had to pass us by, but one time we were passed by several times by accessible buses, and the one that did stop had the gall to offer me a ride but the driver "couldnt' spare the time" for my DH at the time.

So I could see the stroller story happening. Though I think it's less about the stroller and more about the bus driver being an ass. IMO.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tigerchild* 
So I could see the stroller story happening. Though I think it's less about the stroller and more about the bus driver being an ass. IMO.

The way they drive around here.. I think they are all asses. I can't count the number of times they have run me out of my lane, pulled into me from the side of the road.. and even pulled out in front of me on a 55mph country road. I had to slam on my breaks! Apparently they think they should be yielded to.. no matter what!


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## bits and bobs (Apr 7, 2008)

"who was old enough to walk" I loathe that attitude. You have no idea why that mother chose to have a stroller for her child. It is none of your business as to whether he/she could walk or not. DS has low muscle tone and while he could walk, he got tired very easily. I hate to think of people like you judging my decision to bring a stroller for my child just because YOU think he should walk.


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## bandgeek (Sep 12, 2006)

For every person who is bothered by strollers, there's a parent out there who is completely rude about theirs. I've never seen anyone give me the evil eye over a stroller, but I've been nearly rammed/run over by moms with strollers talking on their cell phones. And they give my son the evil eye because he's walking and sometimes slow (I do make sure he doesn't walk in the middle of the aisles).

You can't win either way.

But stores SHOULD be accessible to strollers, like a couple of pp's have said, because they should be for wheelchairs and few strollers are wider than a wheelchair. My DD's medical stroller is a beast and we have no problem most places we go.

And the rudeness isn't limited to strollers. I know plenty of mamas with SN kiddos who have people act completely inconvenienced by their kid's wheelchair. One mama I know says when she goes out with her typical DD in an umbrella stroller, people are very courteous and hold open doors, offer to help her ect, and when she takes her SN DS out in his wheelchair, she gets doors slammed on her, rude stares, ect.


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## WC_hapamama (Sep 19, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bits and bobs* 
"who was old enough to walk" I loathe that attitude. You have no idea why that mother chose to have a stroller for her child. It is none of your business as to whether he/she could walk or not. DS has low muscle tone and while he could walk, he got tired very easily. I hate to think of people like you judging my decision to bring a stroller for my child just because YOU think he should walk.

Ditto that here.

I don't drive, so I end up walking places with my kids a lot. Sure, most 2-3 year olds can manage to walk a few blocks to the park, but turn that distance into 2-3 miles, and it's a whole 'nother ball of wax.

You want to know my shopping pet peeve? People who hang out blocking an aisle talking on their cell phones or to friends they see in the store, blocking the aisles so I can't get past them with my cart or stroller. I'd much rather deal with another Mom with a stroller.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
as for the zoo thing, I suppose those sahm's should walk behind one another so their babies can't see each other and they can't socialize, even if that's the only adult conversation they've had in a long time. I can see how it might take up a lot of room, but come on. If you are a single 2 legged person (ie no stroller to push or child's hand to hold) is it really that difficult to weave in and out or speed up a bit to get by or pass the obnoxious stroller users?

Actually it usually is that difficult at a place like a zoo. I do think it's horribly rude to walk side by side slowly and take up the whole walking space. I go to the zoo fairly routinely with other moms with small children, and we all take strollers. We don't block the whole sidewalk; it isn't necessary to walk from one exhibit to the next, and our children get plenty of time to talk to each other as do the moms.

As Tigerchild said, though, some people are just rude, stroller or no. Yesterday we were in the grocery store with a woman in a wheelchair in front of us. She was going really slowly and stopping at each aisle to look down it. The people with her were lined up on either side of her, so they were blocking the entire walkway. Why??? It was just rude. There were ways to do that without blocking the whole area, but I'm sure those people would be rude in some fashion no matter what. Some people are just rude.

Ditto on the people stopped in the aisles on their cell phones. I've actually been a bit snippy with several of them before, especially when they're blocking the things I need, and "excuse me" isn't heard over their chatter.


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## MittensKittens (Oct 26, 2008)

When I saw the topic title, I thought the thread was about animosity towards strollers in the AP community, which does exist I think







. In any case, I do think strollers in malls and public places can be annoying, but I think trying to navigate a stroller around a public place can be more annoying still. On the few occasions I have taken my kids out in strollers, I was probably that person bumping into people. We all know that pushing a stroller with one hand while holding a toddler's hand with the other is not pain-free.

On the whole, I think people will complain about you if you are out with small kids, regardless of whether you babywear, have a stroller, or all kids walk. Society as a whole has become pretty intolerant of small kids, unless you are in a place like McDonalds, which I would rather keep my kids away from







.


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## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MittensKittens* 
people will complain about you if you are out with small kids, regardless of whether you babywear, have a stroller, or all kids walk. Society as a whole has become pretty intolerant of small kids


Sad but true. Some people complain about young kids making noise the minute the noise starts. I can see complaining if it's been going on half an hour. But complaining because a child screamed ONCE? I mean, little ones make noise! What are the parents supposed to do, never bring their kids out in public?

I also had someone complain to me once about a mom with a stroller... but the mom had three kids that all looked 3 or younger (two toddlers and newborn!). I don't think she had a choice about having a big stroller!


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## LilyGrace (Jun 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Swan3* 
And for many of us, it's not practical to have a lighter stroller. I'm in a really cold place and it was the larger stroller that allowed me to weather proof, have a carseat handy for if I needed to cab it back with groceries and space for the groceries themselves! We had no car so it was really the most practical thing for us.

For the two seconds it might take to get around someone with a "behemoth", especially someone who might be struggling with more than one child, is it really worthy of the glares and nastiness that some moms get?

I never said that it was worth rudeness, but implied that parents with strollers should make the effort to be as courteous as possible. If that were the case, I'm sure there'd be less of a problem with strollers. But like with anything else, it's the bad thumbs that stick out. Just reading this thread I found it ironic that one mom complained of stores not being stroller friendly because there is merchandise at the toddlers' level that he pulls off the shelves. A few posts later was a complaint that stores are not stroller friendly because the aisles are too narrow, making it hard to get a stroller (or more illegally, a wheelchair) into the space. So if stores are complying with the law and making it so that handicapped people can maneuver and reach items, the store still loses because mom complains that Junior can reach things, too.

There needs to be some sort of parental responsibility and extra awareness when you extend your space by 3ft. I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but it is very irksome to those of us who are trying to be courteous having it ruined by those who are not.


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## OkiMom (Nov 21, 2007)

I have been pretty lucky with taking my girls out. I don't have the option of not taking a stroller when we go on day trips because I can't carry a almost 40 pound 2 year old and a 25 lb one year old, my back would give out. So, only way to go out is to take my stroller which happens to be a double stroller (our single gave out on us right after we had DD2 so we got a double). However, its small enough to get through regular doorways and down ailse as long as they are wide enough for a wheelchair. People haven't closed doors on me anymore now than they did before. I don't know if its because we live in a military community but even the teens tend to go out of their way to open door and help when its obvious I need an extra hand.

I find a great hostility against children though when I visit the states or talk to people about having more children. I guess that people no longer think of children as an asset, they are more like liabilities now.


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## Straggletag (Dec 4, 2009)

I admit it. I loathe strollers and it is 100% about the amount of space they take up and the inconvenience they represent to me. I accept that, in some cases, they are a necessary evil, and I really only notice them if someone is being extra annoying about them. Since I don't have a problem with kids in slings, wearing safety backpacks, or sedately walking, even if they're going slow, nor do I have any problems with even the largest and slowest of pregnant women (been there!), I don't think for a second that it's about anything besides the inconvenience factor.

On the other hand, I'd hate having to use a stroller even more. I can't imagine the irritation of shlepping the beast all over the place! We cheerfully walk around our town and the neighboring city, without the benefit of a stroller. I've taken my older child on many multi-hour hikes and walks in a sling without trouble, even hauling groceries back. Now that we have a second kid, and the first has outgrown our little sling, we still hike with them in arms, in sling, on shoulders, or the older one walking alongside. No one has ever given us the stink eye for being in public with little ones, but I never failed to get glares when pregnant. I guess my kids are cuter than I am.


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## GranoLLLy-girl (Mar 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
If you want to experience stroller hostility try pushing the huge boxy double stroller at Disney (world -lands aren't bad) through crowded mainstreet.

.

NO! Not the "happiest place on earth"! LOL!!

I must agree with the person who wrote that navigating stores with strollers is a nightmare--and it's actually quite ironic: strollers these days are pretty much made for shopping (not running strollers, just strollers--I mean, where else do you go with them?) and yet some of the worst stores to navigate with strollers are places like Carter's clothing (for kids)! LOL!

What a world we live in...


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## ShadowMoon (Oct 18, 2006)

I never used strollers. Never had a need, though I completely see why they can be a necessity to others. I don't have a hostile attitude towards strollers themselves, but I definitely dislike inconsiderate people at the helm. I think i became a bit jaded from working in the zoo business for most of my life.







I have run into many people that ignore stroller parking signs, (some exhibits and buildings just can't accommodate them. It is a pain to unload everything, I know. But please understand that if a building says "NO Strollers" there is a reason for that. Many strollers are monstrosities and just because something is wheelchair accessible does not always mean your stroller will fit). People need to be aware of others when pushing (or standing around) with a stroller. I have had to ask many groups of parents to clear the way in front of an exhibit because they all stalled there to chat and no one else can fit to view the animal. (In these cases, the babes in strollers aren't even facing the exhibit and the parents aren't either).

People with strollers and people without all need to be more aware of each other. In this case it's definitely the bad, inconsiderate apples that are giving a bad name to the others.


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## Lolagirl (Jan 7, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Straggletag* 
I admit it. I loathe strollers and it is 100% about the amount of space they take up and the inconvenience they represent to me. I accept that, in some cases, they are a necessary evil, and I really only notice them if someone is being extra annoying about them. Since I don't have a problem with kids in slings, wearing safety backpacks, or sedately walking, even if they're going slow, nor do I have any problems with even the largest and slowest of pregnant women (been there!), I don't think for a second that it's about anything besides the inconvenience factor.

On the other hand, I'd hate having to use a stroller even more. I can't imagine the irritation of shlepping the beast all over the place! We cheerfully walk around our town and the neighboring city, without the benefit of a stroller. I've taken my older child on many multi-hour hikes and walks in a sling without trouble, even hauling groceries back. Now that we have a second kid, and the first has outgrown our little sling, we still hike with them in arms, in sling, on shoulders, or the older one walking alongside. No one has ever given us the stink eye for being in public with little ones, but I never failed to get glares when pregnant. I guess my kids are cuter than I am.

See, as a mother of twins this sort of comment feels pretty unfair. The reality is that it's impossible for someone of my smaller size and stature to sling two toddlers for any serious distance, and forget about letting them both walk on their own, especially if I'm also trying to carry stuff like bags of groceries.

Until very recently, we lived in a crowded urban neighborhood and only had one car. My double stroller WAS my car, my only means of transportation to places like the doctor the park, or the grocery store, and the only means I had to haul things around and wrangle my very busy and energetic toddlers. I got abuse and glares from people every day, regardless of how courteous and observant I tried to be, regardless of whether I took care to not bump into people or get in the way and always apologized profusely if it happened accidentally. If I didn't have my stroller to get around we would have been stuck in our apartment every day and I suppose we would have gone hungry since I wouldn't have been able to accomplish things like grocery shopping without it.

Quote:

The article was basically about how traditionally women aren't allowed to take up space, and the animosity towards women with strollers is all about that. How if people see a guy with a stroller, they think "aw, what an awesome dad taking his kid out!" but a woman with a stroller is "taking up too much space" or "entitled." Because women should be in the kitchen, out of sight, and children should be invisible.
I do think our society expects women to be far more courteous and self-conscious about taking up space while out in public in a way that men never are expected to be. I think this expection is even greater when it comes to children, it's just more socially acceptable to complain when those children are in a stroller. Oh, and heaven forbid that stroller be at all expensive, then I'm an over-entitled rich lady who thinks I own the place (except, well that $500 stroller is still way cheaper than a second car would cost to own and operate.)


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## HollyBearsMom (May 13, 2002)

My biggest issue are those jogging strollers with big "all weather"wheels that don't have a turning radius. Hello. it is a JOGGING stroller not a meander around the mall/grocery store/etc stroller. At least some have improved and you can set the front wheel turn but even so they are impossible to navigate around. If you want to jog, gor for it but leave the monstrocity at home when you are out shopping.


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## Ldavis24 (Feb 19, 2009)

I haven't had time to read all the responses but I have to admit I have a thing against strollers at times. I have had my feet run over and literally been shoved aside on more tha one occasion by women who drive their strollers around like tanks with no regard for people standing around them.

I know not every mother is like this and I myself use a stroller once in a great while (like 4 times since DD has been born and she is 6 months old) and I always try to be really really aware of how I am moving it around. Honestly I get the feeling that some women think because they have a stroller they can pretty much push their way wherever they want to without thinking about it because it is the stroller pushing not an actual person elbowing you out of their way









Hmm so i guess that makes me a mom who has hostility toward strollers, yikes! Actually I have a hostility towards moms who act like their stroller gives them a free pass to be rude and pushy.
Once again not every stroller using mom is like this, I just find a stroller a pain in my butt usually and generally just sling DD around, although like the PP said with twins that isn't really practical.


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## MummaLitt (Feb 21, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HollyBearsMom* 
My biggest issue are those jogging strollers with big "all weather"wheels that don't have a turning radius. Hello. it is a JOGGING stroller not a meander around the mall/grocery store/etc stroller. At least some have improved and you can set the front wheel turn but even so they are impossible to navigate around. If you want to jog, gor for it but leave the monstrocity at home when you are out shopping.

I have one of those monstrocities. It's not a "jogging stroller" but it does have the "all weather wheels" and a pivoting front wheel. We got it when we lived in an area that had very bad sidewalks and I frequently would have to cut across a field rather then triple my distance by going around it. Once we moved to the city, it didn't really make sense to get rid of the "All Terrain Stroller". We couldn't afford a second, more "city-friendly" stroller. So we still have and use the big one. But I'm careful and try to be polite about using it when I'm in places like the mall. And I find my huge three-wheel stroller to be MUCH easier to navigate then most 4-wheel strollers. I've actually had more "accidents" with the stupid umbrella stroller because you simply cannot steer it with one hand.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bits and bobs* 
"who was old enough to walk" I loathe that attitude. You have no idea why that mother chose to have a stroller for her child. It is none of your business as to whether he/she could walk or not. DS has low muscle tone and while he could walk, he got tired very easily. I hate to think of people like you judging my decision to bring a stroller for my child just because YOU think he should walk.

Also many children look older than they are. Mine do. My DH's grandma told me that people would always complain to her that DH was immature and he should act his age.. She would say.. he is THREE and they would insist he was 5.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *LilyGrace* 
A few posts later was a complaint that stores are not stroller friendly because the aisles are too narrow, making it hard to get a stroller (or more illegally, a wheelchair) into the space. So if stores are complying with the law and making it so that handicapped people can maneuver and reach items, the store still loses because mom complains that Junior can reach things, too.

I have never complained that my child could reach things in a stroller but it is the law that stores be accessible to wheelchairs. If I can't get my stroller down the isle how is the wheelchair going to get down there? The store that I complained to about this was KB Toys too. You would think a TOY store would want to be accessible to parents with children.

Other than the accessibility issue and the issue DH had on the bus.. I have never experienced hostility towards strollers. I have four kids! I wonder if this is more of an issue further east.


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## moaningminny (Dec 31, 2007)

Umbrella strollers suck.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MummaLitt* 
I've actually had more "accidents" with the stupid umbrella stroller because you simply cannot steer it with one hand.

Pop a wheely and drive it on the back wheels. Thats the only way to get anywhere with those stupid things.


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## mammastar2 (Dec 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HollyBearsMom* 
My biggest issue are those jogging strollers with big "all weather"wheels that don't have a turning radius. Hello. it is a JOGGING stroller not a meander around the mall/grocery store/etc stroller. At least some have improved and you can set the front wheel turn but even so they are impossible to navigate around. If you want to jog, gor for it but leave the monstrocity at home when you are out shopping.


We had one of those, and used it until my daughter was 5, specifically for shopping, for the most part. We left it outside the store, with a bicycle chain locking it. Well, come to think of it, it wasn't a jogging stroller, but a bike trailer detached from the bike.

We didn't have a car. It was helpful beyond compare, and meant that we could go out walking for a couple of hours and get food for the week. Things other people do with their minivans. And yes, she was old enough to walk, but this worked better and gave us more flexibility. By the time she was 5, she was able to walk for up to an hour and a half at a grown-up pace, so I don't think it stunted her development.

I find that when people complain about other people having appurtenances and baby gear that isn't 'necessary,' often it's a failure of imagination. The speaker may have a life where they can't imagine needing a particular piece of equipment, but that doesn't mean that the thing in question never serves any purpose for anyone. (not a comment about you specifically, but a general observation - more imagination = good thing, leads to more compassion!)


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## Lillitu (Jan 19, 2009)

i have conflicting opinions on strollers:

1. many of them are just too big. i liken them to the "hummers" of baby gear- using way too much petroleum (to make the plastic) when a narrower, more efficient one would be just fine for most.

2. stores should accomodate strollers, period. if they do not, it also means that they are not accomodating wheelchairs, which is illegal.

3. people can be quite entitled and huffy and rude. this goes for not showing courtesy to parents with strollers, pregnant bellies, and many other things. i remember seeing a sociological study on TV about payphones a while back. if someone is waiting in line to use a payphone while someone else is using it, the person on the phone actually uses it statistically longer than if no one is waiting to use it. interesting insight, no?


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## possum (Nov 23, 2004)

I dislike strollers. My 2.75 year old 38 lb son took his first stroller ride at the zoo with my husband a couple of weeks ago while I was helping a friend who just had a baby. He's been walking for almost 2 years now but rarely gets a chance to when we are out since I usually wear him. It is the most convenient and appropriate solution to our need to navigate the market and streets and stores that we have in our area. I'll admit I don't go out of my way to accommodate people who take their siege towers (those tall travel systems with buckets on top), battering rams (long double strollers), and other big honkin' things into crowded spaces. When I'm hauling a 38 pound toddler and my groceries I feel I'm already doing my part to make the market run smoothly.
While I have had people wonder if I was comfortable and if my son was okay, I have only had positive comments about him and our carriers.
If people really think of their strollers like a vehicle - for hauling children and coats, bags, food, groceries, shopping bags, and the like, then why don't they park them outside like a car or a bike? When I drive to a store, I take my son out of his seat and we go in - without a huge collection of stuff. If I need to take a bag, I carry it. Although it would be more convenient for me, I have never considered driving my car or bike through the aisles of the grocery store to pick up a few items.


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## Chryseis (Jul 28, 2006)

I'll admit to having some stroller hate sometimes, primarily toward one particular all-terrain double stroller that is larger than my first car. It's a nice stroller, but it's a bit large for indoors (it takes up a whole library aisle). It's also the only stroller that has attacked my shins. But on the whole it's less the stroller than the person driving it. As has been pointed out earlier, people who are inconsiderate are going to be inconsiderate with or without a stroller.

I do think that strollers have gotten larger over the years, because we've added a lot of features that weren't on older strollers and carriages (larger baskets, drink holders, comfier seats, etc.). Because of this we use them more, and we use them longer. I also think double and even triple strollers have become much more common than they once were because they're nicer than they once were and people are keeping kids in strollers longer.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

It's weird but I can't recall strollers bothering me in a public place - it could just be that I don't get out much







but really, I think I just don't notice/don't care and have been lucky enough not to be truly inconvenienced by someone with a stroller. That and of course I have had to use a double stroller myself in the past, so it's likely that I have empathy - even if mom is on the phone and doesn't notice others -- it's just not something that would annoy me any more than a million other things random people do in public.

Someone mentioned grocery store aisles where people stop to chat and block the entire way - that does bug me if I am in a hurry and only have a short amount of time in the store before having to pick up my DS from preschool. But I, being me, just go around or wait patiently even if I am secretly a bit annoyed.


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## snuggly (Feb 9, 2009)

I would say to those that are upset that mamas with strollers don't get out of their way should re-study traffic and pedestrian laws: it is the responsibility of smaller and more nimble vehicles (and those passing from behind) to yield and go around the slower ones. Non-strollering folk should be grateful for their maneuverability and step around stroller families rather than grumble at the mamas who are doing the best that they can!

Also, to me it's just silly to debate what size stroller a family should use. You don't know their situation and besides it's a stroller and, in the end, it's going to take up some space. What's the big deal about going around it another 9 inches or so? We have one of the "monstrosities" (BOB revolution). We run to the store, shop, and run home. (It's a great workout running up hill with a stroller full of groceries!







) Perhaps I'm a tad selfish, but I would not give up a great time for my LO and the only exercise I get to give other shoppers a little more space. I also agree with a pp that the large quality stroller can actually be much easier to maneuver than smaller ones- so, a little more space taken, but no accidental rammings!

All that said, we never run into people or are rude with them in any way. I have also experienced mostly lovely and helpful people. Opening doors... running down the block to return a toy that was thrown overboard... Being sweeties in general. Thanks all! I love my town!


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## Lolagirl (Jan 7, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *possum* 
If people really think of their strollers like a vehicle - for hauling children and coats, bags, food, groceries, shopping bags, and the like, then why don't they park them outside like a car or a bike? When I drive to a store, I take my son out of his seat and we go in - without a huge collection of stuff. If I need to take a bag, I carry it. Although it would be more convenient for me, I have never considered driving my car or bike through the aisles of the grocery store to pick up a few items.

I would once again like to point out that for mothers of twins this is often a practical impossibility. Sure, as a parent of kids with staggered ages you may very well be able to trust the older child to walk while slinging the younger one. But with twins it's very difficult and unwieldy to sling them past a pretty young age, and if they are at all curious and energetic forget about letting them walk while the parent tries to do anything task oriented like grocery shopping.

So we then go back to my earlier point that without these types of strollers i would be left to sit at home with two bored kiddos and no means to achieve my daily errands. And please don't tell me that I should wait until my spouse is home to go do the errands, or ask why I don't arrange for childcare so that I can do these tasks sans kids. It's already assumed that I'm overentitled for thinking I can do these things with my kids in a stroller. Yet how does that explain my inability to afford childcare as we're already on a strict budget in order for me to continue being a SAHM? The simple fact is that it's pretty easy to make assumptions about other people's motivations and state of mind, and to thus be unsympathetic towards our fellow citizens as a result.

So next time, before you assume that I'm some overentitled yuppie housewife, please start from the assumption that I'm a mom with the same best of intentions that you have, trying to do the best she can for herself, her kids, and her neighbors.


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## pragmaticme (May 8, 2009)

Is this the hill people want to die on, bashing other moms for using strollers?

I have two double strollers. I have twins. I have one for shopping, a Phil and Teds with an attachment. And I have a Bumbleride for outings that don't require a small stroller. The Bumbleride is much more comfortable for the babies and has lots of storage space for me.

When the babes were 6 weeks old I made my first solo outing. I went to the local nurse run baby group. I live in a very progressive, crunchy, urban neighborhood. Most of the moms are dedicated baby wearers. I showed up with my big stroller and my tiny babies, re-arranged some seats so I could put the stroller right beside me, made a general nuisance of myself. You know what those women did? They gave me an all clap for getting out of the house. Many of them commented about how intrepid I was and how they admired my grace under pressure. I went to the baby group until they were about 4 months old, and every time the nurse and the other mothers all accommodated my big stroller, and went out of their way to help me any way they could - held a crying baby, helped me change a diaper etc etc. A true community of women supporting each other.

I hope we'd all be so gracious with other mothers out there in the real world.

I'm constantly apologizing for my stroller being in people's way, most people just stop and briefly admire the babes. I've only had one person ever harrumph me and it was an old man that looked like he had a terminal case of Grinchitis. And if I have ever tapped someone with my stroller by accident - forgive me Father for I have sinned.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *possum* 
If people really think of their strollers like a vehicle - for hauling children and coats, bags, food, groceries, shopping bags, and the like, then why don't they park them outside like a car or a bike? When I drive to a store, I take my son out of his seat and we go in - without a huge collection of stuff. If I need to take a bag, I carry it. Although it would be more convenient for me, I have never considered driving my car or bike through the aisles of the grocery store to pick up a few items.

You mean like this?

My mom remembers the line of prams outside the A&P when she was a kid in the 1950's. Of course, back then you left your kid in the stroller while you did your shopping. And don't tell me those giant prams are any smaller than the stroller I use right now, which is a large, expensive one. There was a brief period in stroller design history when strollers got small, but it turned out that small is not necessarily better when it comes to stroller designs.

I don't leave my stroller outside a store, because

someone might steal it
I want to keep an eye on the other shopping that's in the base
then I'd have a free-roaming toddler in a store while I was trying to hold the baby, and would thus be unable to actually do any shopping
Someone would complain about all the strollers littering the sidewalks
Strollers are made for walking around. People walk in stores. People includes women. Some women have children. Some of those children are in strollers. That's life.


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## HollyBearsMom (May 13, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *starling&diesel* 

ps. And you know what? Our puppy rides in the basket under the stroller ... and that usually brings a great big smile to pretty much everybody!

Be careful. The general concensus around her is that people abhore the fact that others bring their dogs everwhere, especially in public places! Now you are adding a stroller to the mix!!!


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## dido1 (Aug 12, 2004)

I do have stroller hostility, but I only have one child so I try to suppress it and be understanding. But the one time a lady rudely insisted my small child give up his seat on a packed bus so her stroller could have his space, I said no. I wasn't prepared to put my child's safety at risk so her EMPTY stroller could have it.


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mammastar2* 
I'm constantly apologizing for my stroller being in people's way, most people just stop and briefly admire the babes. I've only had one person ever harrumph me and it was an old man that looked like he had a terminal case of Grinchitis. And if I have ever tapped someone with my stroller by accident - forgive me Father for I have sinned.

I don't think anyone, and certainly not I, was talking about strollerin' mamas who don't try to use their stroller as a battering ram. You sound like a polite person who uses a tool in a well meaning, unselfish, conscientious way. And about "accidentally tapping" someone, I don't think thats what any one who has mentioned being rammed by a stroller is talking about. Usually those who ram accompany the ramming with a dirty look, not an apologetic glance or comment. And I'm pretty surprised by those who said they have never even seen that happen.
If I bump into someone, stroller or not, I will say sorry. Sorry for invading your personal space. Just as I would like someone to do the same if they bump into me. A little courtesy goes a long way.

I don't recall reading anywhere on this thread anyone who thinks strollers should be banned or that anyone who uses a stroller is evil.

I have read lots of accounts (on both sides) of rudeness and a general attitude of self-centeredness and thats where the problem is.


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## dido1 (Aug 12, 2004)

Don't get me wrong, I did have and occassionally used a stroller. All PEOPLe, not just mothers, are entitled to use one. Of course they are. But they are not entitled to be more rude or inconsiderate than other people. Their stroller is not allowed to disobey rules, displace other people on public transit, or violate safety rules by blocking aisles in restaurants.

ALL people should be considerate about how they exist in the world, even people who use strollers. I think that is where the annoyance at this particular parenting item comes from...some users use them poorly and think that they can inconvenience everyone else around them for their own convience.

I don't expect other people to change how they function or excuse me from considering others in order to accommodate my motherhood.


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## hottmama (Dec 27, 2004)

I do get irritated at people in public with giant strollers-- especially the ones with the infant carseat stuck on top. Honestly, is it that hard to carry your 10 lb. kid rather than taking up 5x as much space as a normal person? I can understand needing a stroller for multiples or children with disabilities, or for transportation (outdoors!), but otherwise they just seem unnecessary, and I do think it's rude to hog up that much space, and in crowded places I've been bumped into more than once-- and my children have been bumped into, as well. Leave the strollers outside and teach your preschoolers to walk and behave in stores.
And this is coming from a poor mom of more than one, who has been car-free, does not have a nanny, and has moderately severe scoliosis.


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## pixiekisses (Oct 14, 2008)

Yes, that and that.
People are, luckily, free to do what they want, and use whatever stroller they want (big, small, huge, double, triple etc.) if they want to use them.

But yes, people in general could be more polite, but that goes for most things.

I have to tell you about one time when I had our Bugaboo stroller on the bus during rush hour, I only had groceries in it, and baby in wrap and other kids by hand. But, there were two other strollers too, so the space in the middle for the strollers was packed, and it was hard to get past it for the other passangers. One old man came, squeezed past (us trying our best to make it as easy as we could), and as he did so, he said: "The future takes up some space" with a big grin.
He was so sweet about it, it really made us all smile.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hottmama* 
Honestly, is it that hard to carry your 10 lb. kid rather than taking up 5x as much space as a normal person?

Sometimes, yes. And it's not for you, or me, or anyone else to judge.

And that's all there is to it.


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## Boot (Jan 22, 2008)

This is kind of OT but since I've been using a stroller I have a lot more empathy for people in wheelchairs. It can be so hard to even find your way into some buildings, let alone negotiate your way around once you get in. At least I have the option for bumping up and down steps which wheelchair users don't. And I hate the way some stores leave boxes of goods littering the aisles. There's one health food store that I never use because it is so 'un- wheelfriendly'.

Back on topic, the most hostility toward strollers I have ever encountered is here on mdc. There seems to be a almost militant attitude amongst some mamas. An 'If I can carry a 30lb toddler, a diaper bag, library books and grocery bags for a 2 mile round trip then so can you' kind of attitude'. I think that everyone should just do what is right for their own family but accept that other people have different situations.


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## tayndrewsmama (May 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
Sometimes, yes. And it's not for you, or me, or anyone else to judge.

And that's all there is to it.

I totally agree with this.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Boot* 
This is kind of OT but since I've been using a stroller I have a lot more empathy for people in wheelchairs. It can be so hard to even find your way into some buildings, let alone negotiate your way around once you get in. At least I have the option for bumping up and down steps which wheelchair users don't. And I hate the way some stores leave boxes of goods littering the aisles. There's one health food store that I never use because it is so 'un- wheelfriendly'.

It's the lack of curb cuts that get to me! I never noticed it before I have a stroller. Even if there IS a curb cut (which oftentimes there isn't), half the time it's not even anywhere near the crosswalk. I mean, whose brilliant idea was it to make a person in a wheelchair go way out of their way when they need to cross a street?


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## pragmaticme (May 8, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
And about "accidentally tapping" someone, I don't think thats what any one who has mentioned being rammed by a stroller is talking about. Usually those who ram accompany the ramming with a dirty look, not an apologetic glance or comment. And I'm pretty surprised by those who said they have never even seen that happen.
If I bump into someone, stroller or not, I will say sorry. Sorry for invading your personal space. Just as I would like someone to do the same if they bump into me. A little courtesy goes a long way.

I have yet to see a case of stroller rage in my neighborhood. And I live in an urban setting, but in Canada, so maybe we're more polite.









I use a stroller, I am a courteous person by nature - as are most human beings. I believe people generally mean well. And most likely that harried, beleaguered mother that accidentally bumped you didn't mean to.

If you go out into the world looking for offense you will surely find it.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pragmaticme* 
I have yet to see a case of stroller rage in my neighborhood. And I live in an urban setting, but in Canada, so maybe we're more polite.









I use a stroller, I am a courteous person by nature - as are most human beings. I believe people generally mean well. And most likely that harried, beleaguered mother that accidentally bumped you didn't mean to.

If you go out into the world looking for offense you will surely find it.

I have never seen it either and I live in the same state has the poster you quoted.







Apparently the world is a much different place on the other side of the mountain since we have never agreed on anything.


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## oiseau (Mar 30, 2008)

I'm with the PP who sees strollers as a necessary evil. I don't really notice strollers most of the time and I have no problem stepping aside so someone pushing a stroller can get by. I make a point to hold the door for parents with strollers. That being said, I do get a bit hostile towards strollers when I get bumped into (with no apology) by them or pushed out of the way by someone with a stroller or if someone blocks an aisle with their stroller when they could easily have parked it towards the side so someone could pass (this applies to grocery carts as well). It's not really an issue with the stroller itself....more of an issue with the inconsiderate person pushing it. Just because you have a stroller, that doesn't mean you're automatically exempt from common courtesy in public places.
Personally, I really dislike using strollers and hope to never have to use one. That's just me though. I don't begrudge anyone the right to use a stroller, so long as it's used courteously.


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## pragmaticme (May 8, 2009)

Oh and you'll probably never hear more "sorry sorry excuse me sorry sorry" coupled with sheepish smiles than when two moms with strollers meet up in a tiny aisle at our local grocery store. And then of course we go admire each others babies and move on with our day with a smile.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oiseau* 
I'm with the PP who sees strollers as a necessary evil. I don't really notice strollers most of the time and I have no problem stepping aside so someone pushing a stroller can get by. I make a point to hold the door for parents with strollers. That being said, I *do get a bit hostile towards strollers when I get bumped into (with no apology) by them or pushed out of the way by someone with a stroller or if someone blocks an aisle with their stroller when they could easily have parked it towards the side so someone could pass (this applies to grocery carts as well).* It's not really an issue with the stroller itself....more of an issue with the inconsiderate person pushing it. Just because you have a stroller, that doesn't mean you're automatically exempt from common courtesy in public places.
Personally, I really dislike using strollers and hope to never have to use one. That's just me though. I don't begrudge anyone the right to use a stroller, so long as it's used courteously.

OK I often put my cart or stroller in the middle of the isle. Otherwise my toddler pulls everything off the shelf. I am sure people aren't trying to purposely block your way but rather prevent the big mess a two or three year old can make with things he can reach on the shelf.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Oh mine was beautiful as a two year old. As a three year old.. not so much. The other day we walked down the bulk isle and he pulled every single scoop out of the holder and let them dangle on to the floor on their little bungy thingies. I followed him putting them back (they didn't hit the floor) and told him to stop. He stops and looks at me and says, "What mom? It's funny!" Oh yes.. he is his fathers child! I get the same response when I tell him not to push the cans over on the shelves. (something I had to break DH of in his 20s!! But long before DS was born.)


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pragmaticme* 

If you go out into the world looking for offense you will surely find it.

I think this is what it boils down to









Really, I can't see complaining unless you are inconvenienced by strollers on, like, a daily basis or have been 'rammed' into a dozen times. Otherwise, get over it. I have had my foot run over by shopping carts, yet I don't have hostility issues with them.

How about, stay out of the way of strollers and don't waste any more energy thinking bad thoughts about them. They aren't going anywhere, and hey, maybe they'll get even bigger in the years to come









I have always been considerate with my stroller pushing, and as I said before haven't had an issue with others who use them -- but I'm sure there have been outsiders who gave me a glare I didn't noticed or grumbled b/c it took me a few more seconds to hold the door open for myself to pull the stroller all the way through. That sounds like their problem, though, not mine.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
I have always been considerate with my stroller pushing, and as I said before haven't had an issue with others who use them -- but I'm sure there have been outsiders who gave me a glare I didn't noticed or grumbled b/c it took me a few more seconds to hold the door open for myself to pull the stroller all the way through.

I have always backed out of doors when I have the stroller, then hold the door with my foot as I pull it through. It's much easier than trying to wrestle a stroller through it forwards.


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## nia82 (May 6, 2008)

I have never been rammed by a stroller nor did I ram anyone.
I have a large stroller and I love it (Teutonia). It is safe and sturdy and necessary here in Wyoming. A plastic umbrella stroller could never navigate through the snow and mud here.
All stores have aisles wide enough to accommodate it. Nobody ever complained to me, instead I get comments on how comfy DS looks and how nice the stroller is.
I wore DS until he got too heavy to me, which happened quickly. I have a travel stroller from Europe which is prolly considered a big stroller here. Both the travel stroller and the Teutonia fit just fine in my Explorer with plenty of space for groceries.
I once used the Maclaran travel stroller, my SIL's, and I found it uncomfy for both DS and me. I'm only 5'6" and had to bend down, my back hurt terribly! And it was bad for DS's back as well.
As I said, I only ever get friendly comments and no mom ever used her stroller as a weapon against me. When I was in Germany in May though, people routinely treated me horribly for having a baby. Slammed doors, pushed me out of the way, annoyed glares for taking him to a restaurant (where he wasn't crying, but happily babbling in the high chair). I'm German and know well that Germans aren't exactly children friendly... But so far Americans have always been so friendly and wonderful towards kids.


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## quantumleap (Apr 13, 2006)

We have a behemoth (a Chariot). We have it because we were living in the North when dd was born, and, well, good luck getting anywhere without those wheels to deal with mounds of snow on unpaved sidewalks and unplowed streets, or without the ability to weatherproof dd's environment in -40C. And, we wanted a bike trailer, and the Chariot converts with a simple click. They are a hazzard, in many ways. But, a person can be courteous and careful with it, or not.

I've definitely experienced "Stroller Animomsity", but I've also experienced people going out of their way to hold a door, etc. Often, the people most keen to help are teenaged boys, much to my surprise. One of the trail heads in our area isn't regulation size, and our stroller only fits through with much careful calculation and some enthusiastic pushing, and one day a young man came upon me in the middle of the whole process and just politely picked up the whole stroller and deposited it on the other side for me. And then he was mortified when I thanked him. But he melted my heart a little.

Anyway, I'm only posting because I think this issue touches on a much bigger and more important issue that I *never* noticed until I was trying to get around with a stroller: wheelchair accessibility. Holy. Awful. At our local mall, you can go in the front door and access half of the building, you then have to go down a huge flight of stairs, or turn around, go back out the front door, walk around the block and then enter in through the back door in order to access the other half of the building. It's ridiculous. No power assist buttons on doors to shops or service buildings, aisles a stroller doesn't fit down, etc, etc. Lucky for me, I can just rock my stroller backwards and sort of ease my way down stairs, or I can park dd two feet away while I grab something out of an inaccessible ailse, but a person in a wheelchair, or even needing crutches/walker/etc would be totally screwed! So, I think the hostility is often manifested in a simple refusal to make life accessible to anyone not of "average" mobility.


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## possum (Nov 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
You mean like this?

No. I don't leave my son unaccompanied/out of my sight in the car or on the bike. I have a bike lock when we leave the bike unaccompanied.


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
I have never seen it either and I live in the same state has the poster you quoted.







Apparently the world is a much different place on the other side of the mountain since we have never agreed on anything.









For the record, i have only lived in this state for a year and a half, so everything i talk about isnt necessarily reflective of the other side of the mountains









Quote:


Originally Posted by *pragmaticme* 
If you go out into the world looking for offense you will surely find it.

not sure if you meant me, but since you quoted me earlier, i assume you did.
i agree with you, if you assume you are being victimized, you will see hostility in every squint. i dont assume all stroller people are malicious. heck, i have three strollers that we sometimes use. but that still doesnt mean that some people dont use their strollers irresponsibly. just as some people might use their shopping carts irresponsibly (though i will admit that i have never been rammed with a shopping cart) or any other thing.
i have been hit with people's backpacks or luggage (think plane or bus situation) but that doesnt mean that i assume that everyone with a backpack, or stroller for that matter, is going to hit me with it. but it happens, and when it does, I do expect an apology, not a glare like it was my fault I was innocently standing or walking in their path. share the road.. it goes both ways.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
For the record, i have only lived in this state for a year and a half, so everything i talk about isnt necessarily reflective of the other side of the mountains









Well I can only hope you are from the east cause a lot of it is not really reflective of the west coast in general.


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## mama1803 (Mar 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
And they are pieces of crap. Every.. single.. umbrella stroller I have owned.. or family members have owned have had something funky happen to the front wheels so they don't work anymore within a matter of months.. sometimes weeks. I spend my whole time fighting with the stroller to go the direction I want becuase it will not steer anymore. I generally end up popping a wheely and my kids go around with the front wheels in the air. I hate those things and there is a reason they are cheap!!

However with my younger two kids.. after they grew out of being worn.. I have found decent smaller strollers that were not umbrella strollers. They still fit in the car... have cup holders, padding, and canopies that make a comfortable ride and do not take up too much space.

As for strollers not being able to get down isles cause stores have the racks too close. I have complied to a store before. Aren't they supposed to be handicap accessible? If I can't get a stroller down the isle how is a wheel chair going to get down the isle? I was shrugged at.

ETA: and I have never been rammed into by a stroller.









to everything you said!


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## MadiMamacita (Jan 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
Well I can only hope you are from the east cause a lot of it is not really reflective of the west coast in general.









what is not reflective of the west coast in general? are you still talking about strollers?

I have lived in 5 different states all over the US and two different countries, plus a territory, plus spent a year traveling to 33 different countries. So I feel like I have had pretty broad experiences with all sorts of different folks.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
what is not reflective of the west coast in general? are you still talking about strollers?

I have lived in 5 different states all over the US and two different countries, plus a territory, plus spent a year traveling to 33 different countries. So I feel like I have had pretty broad experiences with all sorts of different folks.

comments from previous threads..and yes strollers. I have just never seen this animosity towards strollers anywhere I have been in the Bay Area, the Central Valley, the "wine country" BFE California, when we went to Seattle, or in PDX. I have never seen it in my life. So I am wondering if this is more of a regional thing.


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## pragmaticme (May 8, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MadiMamacita* 
not sure if you meant me, but since you quoted me earlier, i assume you did.
i agree with you, if you assume you are being victimized, you will see hostility in every squint. i dont assume all stroller people are malicious. heck, i have three strollers that we sometimes use.

I mean "you" in the general sense.


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## WC_hapamama (Sep 19, 2005)

People who complain about how strollers are unnecessary and that people should just wear their babies have probably never had to cross a busy street or parking lot carrying a baby, holding a preschoolers hand AND having to carry a purse/bag and monitor older children. For me it requires being a contortionist.

As a mom of many (4 soon to be 5), as much as I like babywearing, sometimes a stroller is essential.

Those cheap, crappy umbrella strollers are only comfy when it's a 1-2 year old riding it in, and it's being pushed by someone between 4'8" and 5'2"... and heaven forbid should you need to push it over something that isn't perfectly smooth.

My preschooler can walk, and yes, my preschooler can behave in stores, but sometimes it's less stressful for all involved for me to just have him ride in the stroller. Especially in stores. I can't tell you how many times my kids have been nearly hit by shopping carts pushed by someone on a cell phone.


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
comments from previous threads..and yes strollers. I have just never seen this animosity towards strollers anywhere I have been in the Bay Area, the Central Valley, the "wine country" BFE California, when we went to Seattle, or in PDX. I have never seen it in my life. So I am wondering if this is more of a regional thing.

Seriously?? There is huge stroller animosity in the Bay Area! Especially San Francisco. I've lived in Napa, Sonoma, San Francisco, Silicon Valley and, as a side note, Oregon. Of these the only place I have not seen it is Ashland. San Francisco is renowned for being one of the most child unfriendly cities in the country. Stroller or not people glare at you if you dare take your child out to eat (much like a previous poster experienced in Germany), or really anywhere in the city at all. I have friends who have had people hiss "breeder" at then while they were pregnant or with children. And heck, I have stroller animosity myself...I hate my stroller with a passion!


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## Shannie77 (Jan 16, 2007)

I am not a huge fan of strollers. I don't feel comfortable using them anywhere but outside. I was lucky enough to be able to wear DD until she could walk and once she was walking that is what she would do at the mall/ stores. That was my comfort-zone, and sometimes I wondered why more women didn't opt for that since it just seemed so much easier then lugging a big stroller around. I am sure for some women (or men for that matter), wearing their baby wasn't an option, but it seems like a lot of people don't even know it is an option which is too bad.

What really gets me is people with bad stroller, shopping cart or just generally bad manners. Someone mentioned the blockade of strollers at the Zoo. I have seen that happen and the people don't budge or let you around. I have also seen people who are aware of their surroundings and let people past. It is like there are people who shop at the grocery store and will leave their cart (without a small child) in the middle of the isle so no one can get past simply because they don't have the courtesy to move it over. There are people on scooters who drive them with common sense and other people on them who will literally run into you if you don't hop out of the way.

I am certainly not hostile to all stroller users, but bad manners and lack of common sense is something that gets my back up.


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## felix23 (Nov 7, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hottmama* 
I do get irritated at people in public with giant strollers-- especially the ones with the infant carseat stuck on top. Honestly, is it that hard to carry your 10 lb. kid rather than taking up 5x as much space as a normal person? I can understand needing a stroller for multiples or children with disabilities, or for transportation (outdoors!), but otherwise they just seem unnecessary, and I do think it's rude to hog up that much space, and in crowded places I've been bumped into more than once-- and my children have been bumped into, as well. Leave the strollers outside and teach your preschoolers to walk and behave in stores.
And this is coming from a poor mom of more than one, who has been car-free, does not have a nanny, and has moderately severe scoliosis.

Right after my c-section, nope, I couldn't carry my little 5 lb baby around while I shopped and tried to keep up with a three year old. And plus, why should I wake her up and make her scream for the whole trip when I can leave her in the infant carrier/stroller and she will sleep happily the whole time?


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## Eeyore35 (Aug 2, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LilyGrace* 
I'll admit, I have a problem with strollers. Too many of them are 'cadillacs' - huge things that have shocks and off-road tires that don't belong in stores. And parents are careless with them. I love children, but if there's a double stroller in the middle of the aisle of a crowded restroom, I'm going to curse the parents under my breath.

If more people used smaller strollers that were a single person wide and didn't take up a good portion of close areas, I don't think there'd be much of a problem with it. But it's the behemoths that make people groan - especially during the busy shopping season and the already crowded areas.

If you don't have a car, you NEED a troller with huge whees to get thru snow to the store.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bunnyflakes* 
First of all, I want to say that I normally agree with everything that you say







But I have to disagree with the umbrella stroller thing. When I was a Nanny I found it to be really uncomfortable. Maybe I am just too tall? I always had to hunch over to push it and the larger stroller was much more comfortable for me to use. It was fairly big but obviously I didn't buy it









ETA: Ours umbrella stroller did not adjust, so perhaps they make some that do, in which case, disreguard what I just said!

I"m uder 5' tall,and I find umbrella strollers uncomfy to push.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HollyBearsMom* 
My biggest issue are those jogging strollers with big "all weather"wheels that don't have a turning radius. Hello. it is a JOGGING stroller not a meander around the mall/grocery store/etc stroller. At least some have improved and you can set the front wheel turn but even so they are impossible to navigate around. If you want to jog, gor for it but leave the monstrocity at home when you are out shopping.

Agin,if you odt hve car, you need a stroller thtcan get you to hte store.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *possum* 
I dislike strollers. My 2.75 year old 38 lb son took his first stroller ride at the zoo with my husband a couple of weeks ago while I was helping a friend who just had a baby. He's been walking for almost 2 years now but rarely gets a chance to when we are out since I usually wear him. It is the most convenient and appropriate solution to our need to navigate the market and streets and stores that we have in our area. I'll admit I don't go out of my way to accommodate people who take their siege towers (those tall travel systems with buckets on top), battering rams (long double strollers), and other big honkin' things into crowded spaces. When I'm hauling a 38 pound toddler and my groceries I feel I'm already doing my part to make the market run smoothly.
While I have had people wonder if I was comfortable and if my son was okay, I have only had positive comments about him and our carriers.
If people really think of their strollers like a vehicle - for hauling children and coats, bags, food, groceries, shopping bags, and the like, then why don't they park them outside like a car or a bike? When I drive to a store, I take my son out of his seat and we go in - without a huge collection of stuff. If I need to take a bag, I carry it. Although it would be more convenient for me, I have never considered driving my car or bike through the aisles of the grocery store to pick up a few items.

Well, you do understand strollers don't lock right? It just isn't like a car in that way. I have one kid, Ad now that she is 4,I no onger use a stroller,but man do I miss it. It made life soooo much easier. She was a runner,so letting her walk wasn't an option. She does't run off on me now, or yeah, she'd be in a stroller.

I don't think I' ve ever been ru into by a stroller, or seen rude stroller bahaviour.

and as for the bus thing,if my daughter wants to sit in a space where a stroller can fit, I tell her that if someone in a wheelchair,using a walker, or pushing a stroller gets on,we are moving.


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## erinsmama (May 13, 2009)

Well, not exactly a stroller story, but I was at the mall yesterday with my 2 year old dd & we we were in the elevator at JC Penney's (she was in a stroller). An older gentleman looked right at my dd (who was happy as can be & was a honey all day) and said "You should be at home napping!"

I just said, "actually she's in a great mood!"

Then later I heard some woman yell at a dad who just finished giving his little infant a bottle - and I mean yell across the way. "She just spit up all over!" Hmmm I think he saw that. I don't know if she thought she was being helpful in some way... I turned to the dad & said "Some people feel the need to comment on everything." He just agreed & shook his head.

Weird day at the mall yesterday.


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## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

I have two children, with one on the way. You bet your butt I take our stroller to the mall. My daughter (5) can walk long distances and has for at least 2.5 years. My son (almost 3) can walk and run long distances but doesn't give a damn about staying close by to mommy, so the stroller it is. We have a Joovy Caboose Sit-N-Stand that I will be using with the infant seat and ds standing on the back. He'll also have on a harness (oh, the horrors!) just in case he decides to bolt.

Babywearing doesn't work for me. I lose a lot of blood when I give birth and feel like sh!t for a couple of months and then my babies are to big to be carried. I have a bad back and hips so it's not an option.

If you don't like strollers, fine, don't use them. But leave everyone else alone.

I also have never seen people purposly ramming other shoppers with their strollers. I have seen accidents when someone walking in front of someone with a stroller stops unexpectedly, but chances are even if the person didn't have a stroller, they would have run in to them anyway.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pragmaticme* 
I have yet to see a case of stroller rage in my neighborhood. And I live in an urban setting, but in Canada, so maybe we're more polite.









I'm in Toronto and I was reading this thread thinking the same thing. I've never gotten irritated at a mum with a stroller, although I did get bumped into once...in my entire life, that I remember.

I don't remember getting dirty looks with mine, although I know there's one brunch place that has banned them and Toronto Life did a story on it.

I'm reminded of a conversation I had with someone who was seriously upset that two old people had slowed him down at the supermarket. Sometimes I think we just have a really crazy society when people expect that they should be able to go at top speed with no one ever blocking them all the time. Of course courtesy is a two-way street. But really, if you're frothing at the mouth because someone was reading the soup ingredients and you wanted at the soup? Maybe your life is just a little out of control (and I say that warmly 'cause I have been there).

Just to geek out on strollers, I had three. A travel system I was given with my first child, that was wicked for groceries and library trips and cat food - it had a great basket. Also picnics. A jogging stroller with almost no storage on board that was so amazing over terrain and snow, and I also thought I might jog (cough). And a Maclaren for going on public transit and general popping about. Of course my son ended up mostly liking the Ergo, but then I had a back injury... anyways.

I was really, really grateful for anything that made me mobile and less trapped, in a healthy way. I also live in an area of Toronto where stores are all about 20 minutes away to walk to - even to get milk it's at least 10-15 min. So having a stroller was really nice.


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## gcgirl (Apr 3, 2007)

I'm with you, OP. I don't get the hostility either. There are rude people with strollers and rude people without strollers. The rest of us non-rude people (with or without strollers) just have to put up with it.


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

I was once rammed into in London (UK, not Ontario) by a man pushing a stroller, but that's the only stroller trouble I've ever had! I like strollers.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
ya know, I was just thinking perhaps some of the people who have been rammed into by a stroller weren't paying attention to their surroundings, or stopped abruptly to stare at something. Maybe, just maybe, it's not always the stroller pushers fault.

I was sort of thinking this too but didn't want to say anything. I live in a rather upscale area, where people tend to be kind of arrogant and entitled. And where everyone has giant double or triple strollers that probably cost more than my first car. So I would think that if anyone in the world were likely to be the stroller-ramming type, it would be the sorts of women around here. But I have to say that I have never, ever been rammed or pushed or even really aggressively grazed by someone else's stroller.

However, I can't even count the number of times that someone has walked right into my stroller, totally not looking where they're going. And this seems to happen more when my stroller is stopped then when I'm actually walking with it! At least when I'm moving, I can get out of someone's way.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chamomile Girl* 
Seriously?? There is huge stroller animosity in the Bay Area! Especially San Francisco. I've lived in Napa, Sonoma, San Francisco, Silicon Valley and, as a side note, Oregon. Of these the only place I have not seen it is Ashland. San Francisco is renowned for being one of the most child unfriendly cities in the country. Stroller or not people glare at you if you dare take your child out to eat (much like a previous poster experienced in Germany), or really anywhere in the city at all. I have friends who have had people hiss "breeder" at then while they were pregnant or with children. And heck, I have stroller animosity myself...I hate my stroller with a passion!

And I have lived in Santa Rosa, Rohnert Park, Cobb, (near Clear Lake) and Manteca (an hour south of Sac.) And now near Portland. I didn't say San Fransisco I said the Bay Area.. I am not sure we have been to SF with a kid in a stroller... but I as I said before.. I have never ever run into this attitude ANYWHERE I have been. And I have never heard of SF as being "renowned for being one of the most child unfriendly cities in the country." Is this something that has happened in just that last 5 years??


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## urklemama (May 4, 2003)

SF is crazy child-unfriendly, it has been for more than a decade.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *urklemama* 
SF is crazy child-unfriendly, it has been for more than a decade.









. Well then maybe it's that I just don't see this stuff and don't care what others think. I grew up 2 hours away.. granted my parents took us there once... but I have never heard this before nor have I run into it in the North Bay.


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## bscal (Feb 13, 2006)

I've only read page 1 and I feel that it's my 'duty' to post in defense of large stroller mamas everywhere! I use a large stroller, got 2 of them in fact, and yes it is sometimes inconvenient I strive to be polite at all times. Then again, that's my personality... perhaps not everyone out there with a large stroller has manners!

We have 'the beast' which is the mega huge double stroller. You know, the kind that you can put 2 infant carriers onto b/c it's just.that.big. It's heavy and bulky but it certainly gets the job done. I use it quite often when I meet my mommy friends to go mall-walking. With the combined weight of that stroller and my 2 kids I get a good workout too!

We also have the side by side umbrella stroller type double. No cool features on this one but it comes in handy on trips and such. I have had problems getting through stores with it, but as my uncle is a double amputee and in a wheelchair I am pretty confident talking to a manager and informing them that if I cannot fit through with the stroller then a someone in a wheelchair would be unable to as the stroller is 1/2 inch smaller in width than a standard wheelchair.

Oh, and yes, my kids are old enough to walk. BUT I have wild little ones who will (and have) taken off running from me in a store. Sometimes when DH is out of town and errands need to be taken care of it's better for their safety (and my sanity) to let them ride in the stroller.

Beth


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## bebebradford (Apr 4, 2008)

In my town there are some stores that prohibit strollers.. I don't have much of an issue with it.I just go when I can have someone watch my little ones or don't go at all. I have had tons of strollers.. double side by side.. large strollers with the carseat attaching ability, etc.. but my FAVORITE is my umbrella stroller.. It's super basic, and cheap.. BUT I can get it in and out of any place. It also fits really well in the floorboard of my SUV.. I don't have to unlock the back to get a big stroller out.


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## baltic_ballet (May 17, 2007)

I don't have hostility towards the majority of stroller users but I do towards some rude people who use them - many times I have been rammed into or had someone cut across me suddenly which hurts my ankles and knees to stop suddenly.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bebebradford* 
In my town there are some stores that prohibit strollers.. I don't have much of an issue with it.I just go when I can have someone watch my little ones or don't go at all. I have had tons of strollers.. double side by side.. large strollers with the carseat attaching ability, etc.. but my FAVORITE is my umbrella stroller.. It's super basic, and cheap.. BUT I can get it in and out of any place. It also fits really well in the floorboard of my SUV.. I don't have to unlock the back to get a big stroller out.

I wouldn't go to a store that didn't allow strollers just out of principal. I hate dogs but we didn't ban them from our shop. We knew doing so would alginate some of our customers who might not come back.

If they wanna ban strollers thats thats their prerogative but I am not going to shop there.. period.


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## bebebradford (Apr 4, 2008)

Awww.. seriously don't sweat what people think. I always try to be polite to others in stores,etc... but if I stress them out over having my kids/stroller/etc.. that's just their tough luck. You'll never see them again anyways. So just smile and forget about them.


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## bebebradford (Apr 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
I wouldn't go to a store that didn't allow strollers just out of principal. I hate dogs but we didn't ban them from our shop. We knew doing so would alginate some of our customers who might not come back.

If they wanna ban strollers thats thats their prerogative but I am not going to shop there.. period.

Well I'm an antique collector.. those were most of the stores I was referring to. All the antique shops in town prohibit them.. and I totally understand why. It's funny though because some moms around here have gotten into such a tizzy over it..


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bebebradford* 
Well I'm an antique collector.. those were most of the stores I was referring to. All the antique shops in town prohibit them.. and I totally understand why. It's funny though because some moms around here have gotten into such a tizzy over it..

I would rather a child come into my store contained in a stroller than running loose. I don't think they are using common sense unless they ban children all together.. which ... wouldn't make me any more likely to shop there.


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## PGTlatte (Mar 7, 2004)

I received the same reaction from people when I was on crutches with a broken leg, whenever I went anywhere crowded; I also experienced it when taking myself through a crowded airport in a wheelchair (due to the broken leg). Annoyed looks, people shoving past me, etc. I think a lot of people are very self-centered and get ticked off at anything that inconveniences them in the least. It can be quite heartless.

But the people who went out of their way to be nice to me, and to help me in those situations....they were like stars on a dark night...and I appreciated it so much !!!! The whole experience was a great lesson about empathy, and how much a bit of kindness and consideration can mean to someone who is struggling.

Anyway, I don't think the people who react that way have anything particular against children or strollers. I think those people would probably react in a similar way to someone on crutches or in a wheelchair.

BTW I use a stroller, for my 4yo, and it's not a small one either. It's easier for _me_ to keep him contained than to have him running off. I don't care at all what others think of it - if they see it as inconveniencing them, it's a problem of their own perception. They are welcome to get over it when they are ready.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Harmony08* 
Has anyone else experienced this?

Why do people glare at you like you don't deserve to live when you are trying to navigate a crowd with your stroller? It has always surprised me how unhelpful most people can be (not holding doors, not moving out of the way) but this just outright hostility, like how dare you think I should move aside an inch to let your stroller through. I guess it is just another symptom of our strange society like... "it is your problem if you decide to have children, I don't want to see them, hear them, smell them, or let them through in their strollers".


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I had no idea strollers were so controversial. I generally use the sling, however I do have two strollers - a big one that cost a bit, and an umbrella stroller I got from a garage sale for almost nothing that probably didn't cost much in the first place. I prefer the umbrella stroller, and it's lasted 7 years and two children without breaking, but if I'm going to be outside for like a whole day, I need to carry a lot of stuff with me, and the big stroller is a huge help. I've never gotten glares or anything but politeness. Nor have any ever hit anyone. I have also never been hit by a stroller. I can't recall having people block my way with a stroller, either. I suppose if that's ever happened, just saying "excuse me" must have solve the problem, or I'd probably remember.

I don't have much to add except that I've never had any of the problems other people have had with strollers or the people who use them.


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## tankgirl73 (Jun 10, 2007)

I've been on both sides of this.

When DS was a baby and a toddler, I used a stroller. Not a behemoth, but not an umbrella. I had a Snugli carrier and used it occasionally, but found it difficult to use and uncomfortable. We were carless, so the stroller got used a lot. On buses. On sidewalks. In busy malls and grocery stores.

It was a love/hate relationship. It was necessary, but often inconvenient, or a hassle... but the lesser of the evils. I didn't often get glared at or anything, as I recall, in fact folks on the buses were generally very kind about it (we're in Canada eh), though I did _feel_ terribly in the way.

Years later, I have DD. By this point, I'm aware of slings and want to try them. I try them, I never look back. She was never even in a stroller for her first year at all... and has only been in one a handful of times since, and those were all cases of going for walks from home, not going in a car or to the store. I've done the stroller, and I've done the sling, and for me, the sling was BY FAR the easier option in 99% of situations. She's almost 3 and I still use the sling when she can't walk.

Having said this, I know darn well that it's not the easier option for ALL parents ALL of the time. Of COURSE there are situations were strollers will be the more convenient, or only possible option. Many of those cases have been described here -- parents of multiples, parents with bad backs, logistical problems, etc.

However, those are INDIVIDUAL reasons... they are people who use a stroller out of necessity and in all likelihood would use a sling if it were the better option for them at a particular time (for instance, there are many who babywear for some situations and use a stroller for others).

The problem that I now have with strollers is not about the INDIVIDUALS who use them. It's about what they represent as the SOCIETAL attitude as to how we should schlep our kids around. It's about the majority of parents who are using strollers not because they have weighed the options and decided that the stroller is the better choice for them in this particular situation -- they're just using them because that's how babies are carried, period. There are those who even look down on babywearing because it fosters "too much" attachment.

There are also the great many parents (a majority? I don't know, but a great many) who schlep their infant in the car seat all. the. time.... put it in in the house, carry it to the car, plop it in the stroller, back to the car, back to the house, leave the sleeping baby in there for its nap... etc. These poor kids hardly ever get human contact. Now before anyone jumps on my, I KNOW that sometimes it's more convenient (cold weather, etc). Again, I'm talking about a general societal attitude, not individual circumstances. These parents either don't realize that they'r depriving their children of essential physical contact, or else they honestly believe that this is better for them (developing independence). They're also very often not at all aware of the research about the dangers of babies sleeping in car seats (cutting off airways, not to mention flat heads), or issues of lack of stimulation.

I try not to be judgmental when I see an individual parent with an individual child in a stroller -- even when it's one of these behemoth travel systems. This could be an individual case of the best option given their specific circumstances.

But when we're out at a park or a store or wherever, and there are 100 parents with babies and toddlers, and 98 of them are in strollers and only 2 are in slings, then as a GENERAL view I can fairly safely deduce that MOST of them were NOT carefully decided in that manner... they were just stuck into strollers because babywearing (or other options) is just not on their radar. Kids BELONG in strollers, where you don't have to interact with them as much.

I'm sure someone's going to jump on me for saying that, so I'm going to try to clarify once more... I KNOW that this is not the case for most mommas here on MDC. It's not the case for every momma pushing her baby in a stroller. But it is very often the case. So it's not the strollers themselves that irk me... it's the fact that their EXTENSIVE USE such as we see today is indicative of the lack of attachment parenting in society in general.

It makes me sad that so many parents are unaware of the options available to them. Many parents HATE their strollers but honestly aren't aware of their choices, or have been led to believe that the other choices (eg slings) are unsafe or inappropriate or just for hippies or whatever. This is not the parents' fault per se. But it still makes me sad.

I've been to Marineland as an example... where strollers are not allowed in certain areas. And there is a FOREST of strollers in the stroller parking zones. And the poor parents are befuddled and confused, how the heck am I supposed to actually CARRY my kid through here? They're just not accustomed to it. Then you see the families walking through the park -- not in anyone's way, in this case -- but walking along, pushing 2 empty strollers while their kids walk or are carried. I wonder if the thought even crosses their mind about how inconvenient it is for them. Again, I KNOW that it COULD be that this INDIVIDUAL has weighed their options and yes, accepted it as the most convenient option. But most of the time, I doubt that this is the case.

If we lived in a society where babywearing whenever possible was the norm, then the occasional stroller would be more understood, I think, that this was a case where the stroller was the better option, rather than just the _default_ choice. Then the anti-stroller hate MIGHT be more understanding? I dunno. I just know that for me, it's the sheer NUMBER of strollers in use all the time... even in situations where babywearing would be way, way easier for most parents, the ratio is way off.

So once again, for me it's not about the existence of strollers in the first place... it's the fact that their prevalence is indicative of the societal rejection/ignorance/etc for babywearing and the blind following of what-everyone-else-does that plagues a large number of parents.

Side story, somewhat related. About the only negative comment I ever heard over babywearing was in a mall, DD was in a front carry in a mei tai. Some snippy teenager told his girlfriend as they passed by me, "you know, I remember when parents actually _carried_ their babies." He totally missed the fact that most parents "carry" their babies in strollers, which is _more_ removed from actual "carrying". I very much doubt he ever said anything snippy about them.

The implication of this comment, I think, is that babies in strollers is so normal that people don't even question it. It's hard for me to explain... but there's a blindness around them.

Of course they're useful and necessary in many situations, just like nearly all baby gear. It's the ubiquitousness of them that bugs me, the unquestioning, the default, the status quo. I don't know if I've stated this clearly or if I'm going to get attacked by someone for their own _individual_ need for a stroller... *sigh*...


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 
And I have lived in Santa Rosa, Rohnert Park, Cobb, (near Clear Lake) and Manteca (an hour south of Sac.) And now near Portland. I didn't say San Fransisco I said the Bay Area.. I am not sure we have been to SF with a kid in a stroller... but I as I said before.. I have never ever run into this attitude ANYWHERE I have been. And I have never heard of SF as being "renowned for being one of the most child unfriendly cities in the country." Is this something that has happened in just that last 5 years??

Umm...ok. I think its more likely that you haven't noticed...which honestly is great. By Sonoma I meant Sonoma County; so Santa Rosa, Cotati and Petaluma specifically. Right now I live in Santa Clara, which is an interesting case because there is a culture clash between the tons of mommies and the youngish techies (who are always in such a *&^% hurry!). There are also sooooo many kids here! I am actually excited that I will be raising my son somewhere with a young population...but I digress.

Lets look again at the original posting shall we?:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Harmony08* 
Has anyone else experienced this?

Why do people glare at you like you don't deserve to live when you are trying to navigate a crowd with your stroller? It has always surprised me how unhelpful most people can be (not holding doors, not moving out of the way) but this just outright hostility, like how dare you think I should move aside an inch to let your stroller through. I guess it is just another symptom of our strange society like... "it is your problem if you decide to have children, I don't want to see them, hear them, smell them, or let them through in their strollers".

OP I know that you were looking for solidarity here, but that seems sort of naive and misguided when looking at the very hostile tone of your posting. Perhaps this is just an irony considering the direction this thread has taken. I think the moral of the story here is rudeness sucks, politeness gets you far and nobody should expect special treatment because of their stroller (but appreciate it when you get it!).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeanine123* 
You haven't kept your dislike or irritation to yourself, you've posted it on a public message board for anyone and everyone to read including those who use strollers on a daily basis for a variety of reasons.

So you use a stroller on a daily basis...so what? Does that mean nobody is allowed to hold irritated thoughts in their head about it around you? Sheesh.


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## Lolagirl (Jan 7, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I was sort of thinking this too but didn't want to say anything. I live in a rather upscale area, where people tend to be kind of arrogant and entitled. And where everyone has giant double or triple strollers that probably cost more than my first car. So I would think that if anyone in the world were likely to be the stroller-ramming type, it would be the sorts of women around here. But I have to say that I have never, ever been rammed or pushed or even really aggressively grazed by someone else's stroller.

Or maybe they have the expensive double stroller because not only does it have the kind of features an urban parent needs to get around on a daily basis but because it also takes the place of having a second car. I used to live in one of those upscale neighborhoods too, even though we weren't very posh, I did have a fancy double stroller that was pretty spendy. BUT, it's still a far more economical and green alternative to owning, operating and parking a second vehicle in said upscale neighborhood (that's also closer to work so that spouse can either walk or take public transit to work, thus also decreasing our carbon footprint.)

Once again, I ask that we all as mothers and neighbors not automatically jump to negative conclusions about the mindset or motivations of one another. Life is much happier when I work from the assumption that pretty much every one else out there is trying just as hard as I am to get through the day with minimal upsets or disruptions for myself or others. Just because I or someone else may happen to live in a fancy zip code does not mean that I feel over-entitled or arrogant about my circumstances, and the same is true even though I may have happened to invest in an expensive double stroller for getting around with my twins.

Oh, and I don't think the OP was asking for special treatment because she happens to push a stroller around sometimes, I think she was wondering why some people act so openly hostile towards her when she is out and about with her kids. I mean really, is it that unreasonable to hope once in a while that someone will offer to hold a door open for you instead of shutting it in your face or hurling insults at you for daring to have children in the first place? (That's kind of a rhetorical question, but I've encountered enough unpleasant people since becoming a mother myself that some will still insist it is in fact unreasonable to even hold such hope...)


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## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

This thread is too weird! I live in a very child-centered, child friendly area and have never noticed any dirty looks. 95% of the time people will open the door for me w/o my asking. I love my stroller at the mall--it's great to carry packages, kind of like the crib is great to hold clean clothes.







I've gotten way more looks from baby wearing, ie "Is he comfortable like that??"







I'm very easily irritated and strollers don't bother me, maybe b/c I use one. The only feelings I've ever had is stroller envy.

I do feel sorry for the crying infant/kid strapped in the stroller while mom ignores him and shops. Of course there may be something I"m unaware of; I just hate to hear anyone cry.


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lolagirl* 
I mean really, is it that unreasonable to hope once in a while that someone will offer to hold a door open for you

I think courtesy is nice when it happens but it cannot be expected unfortunately. And I'm ok with that.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
The only feelings I've ever had is stroller envy.










me, too!

There are so many nice, cool strollers out there - I'm always checking them out and asking the pushers questions. I also get compliments on my P3 b/c the frame is white in a sea of mostly black/navy strollers.

Even though I don't have 2 stroller-age LO's, I always get envious when I see a phil and teds E3. and hey, bonus that they don't take up as much room as most doubles









anyway, going off topic since I know this may now turn into a babywearing vs strolling conversation. But I had to comment.

ETA: and don't worry, I have baby carrier envy, too. And almost always stop the wearer to comment on their beautiful mei tai, sling, or SSC. Doesn't matter if I own 11 of them myself, there are still plenty to drool over. And BTW, I do see lots of babywearers in my area - at DS's preschool alone I see several each day.


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## pragmaticme (May 8, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tankgirl73* 
But when we're out at a park or a store or wherever, and there are 100 parents with babies and toddlers, and 98 of them are in strollers and only 2 are in slings, then as a GENERAL view I can fairly safely deduce that MOST of them were NOT carefully decided in that manner... they were just stuck into strollers because babywearing (or other options) is just not on their radar. Kids BELONG in strollers, where you don't have to interact with them as much.
.

This sort of smacks of "if you were as well informed as me...you would do as I do". I think it's great people babywear - we sometimes wear the girls when my husband and I have the luxury of being able to go out for a walk together. I'm not sure why anyone cares how other people transport their babes. Strollers are great, babywearing is great. Two options, equally valid, in fact there are probably other options that haven't even occurred to me. Do what suits you.

This is all so reminiscent of that hilarious scene in "Away We Go"...if you've seen the movie you know the one.


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chamomile Girl* 
Umm...ok. I think its more likely that you haven't noticed...which honestly is great. By Sonoma I meant Sonoma County; so Santa Rosa, Cotati and Petaluma specifically. Right now I live in Santa Clara, which is an interesting case because there is a culture clash between the tons of mommies and the youngish techies (who are always in such a *&^% hurry!). There are also sooooo many kids here! I am actually excited that I will be raising my son somewhere with a young population...but I digress.

Cotati, Rohnert Park.. whats the difference? I spent a lot of time in the Plaza with a stroller and never had a problem with anyone giving me rude looks. Farmers Market? No problem! And I always saw moms taking their babies for walks on the streets of RP.







No one has been anything but friendly to me and my babes in Sonoma County.

And on the same token, I have never been run down by run away strollers and moms on cell phones. I have never had moms with strollers block isles in the store (and as a pp said.. if I did it wasn't important enough to remember as an excuse me probably remedied the situation.)

I go on my merry way..and ignore everyone else. I have had a few rude comments by elderly women in the store lately but those have been directed at my walking 3 year old. Everything is fine and dandy when he is in a stroller or a cart.

So in short.. I think if you go looking for animosity.. you are going to find it. No matter what side of the argument you are on. And trust me... I am good at animosity but this is one issue I just don't see what the big deal is about.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Yeah, I've never really noticed much of anything either way about strollers either. I've never seen anyone get intentionally bashed a stroller (people really do that?!), and nearly all the stroller users and non-stroller users I've ever encountered have been polite to each other.

Lots of times people hold doors open for me when I have the stroller (and when I don't, as I frequently do for others with and without strollers), but I don't expect it and don't think that it's difficult to open a door for myself while pushing a stroller. Just ... no stroller drama whatsoever for me so far, luckily.


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## lonegirl (Oct 31, 2008)

I love, love, love our strollers! When Tyr was an infant (if I wasn't wearing him) we used his infant seat on the stroller...this was much more convenient than unwrapping a sleeping baby to put him in a carrier in Northern Ontario frigid winter air. I regularly wore him until about 18m. But we also had/have a BOB Revolution that I love. I could push it one handed through snow and easily steer it in the stores. We also have a Combi umbrella type that was great but as he is heavier it is much more cumbersome to move...yesterday we picked up the City Micro (Baby Jogger). At 3 he still rides in the stroller (unbuckled for in and out ease) so he can nap if he wants. We are out and about all the time and no way am I carrying a sleeping 3y/o around while shopping.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

honestly I just don't shop places that involve people with strollers. it is impossible to get to what you need around those things. I had a stroller but it was considerably smaller than whay most people are pushing.


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## Swan3 (Aug 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *felix23* 
Right after my c-section, nope, I couldn't carry my little 5 lb baby around while I shopped and tried to keep up with a three year old. And plus, why should I wake her up and make her scream for the whole trip when I can leave her in the infant carrier/stroller and she will sleep happily the whole time?









:


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## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lilyka* 
honestly I just don't shop places that involve people with strollers. it is impossible to get to what you need around those things. I had a stroller but it was considerably smaller than whay most people are pushing.

Where do you shop then? Also, do you avoid places with shopping carts? I find those much more difficult to navigate around then any stroller I've come across.


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## urklemama (May 4, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *aniT* 







. Well then maybe it's that I just don't see this stuff and don't care what others think. I grew up 2 hours away.. granted my parents took us there once... but I have never heard this before nor have I run into it in the North Bay.

That's cause the North Bay is where all the normal people who don't hate children moved to!

I would just like to state that this thread has inspired me to go shopping for the most SUV-like double stroller possible for when the next baby makes her appearance.


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## Bellabaz (Feb 27, 2008)

I do not own a stroller any more. BUt with dd1 we did for awhile. I think it is more of a case of people just being generally obnoxious. If you won't move over for a stroller you probably wouldn't even if i was by myself and needed to get by. Same thing if you have a stroller and run over my foot, etc.


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## Teenytoona (Jun 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I was just reading an article about this, about two months ago, and it really stuck with me. I wish I remembered where I found it.

The article was basically about how traditionally women aren't allowed to take up space, and the animosity towards women with strollers is all about that. How if people see a guy with a stroller, they think "aw, what an awesome dad taking his kid out!" but a woman with a stroller is "taking up too much space" or "entitled." Because women should be in the kitchen, out of sight, and children should be invisible.

I dunno, it kid of struck a chord with me. Some very good points were made, I thought. On the surface it was kind of weird, but the more I think about it, the more I think maybe there's something to it.



I haven't read the rest of the thread, but I totally think this is the case.

Even before kids, I had this problem. For example, sitting next to a slender man on an airplane. I'm not a small woman. He's there taking up all this space and I'm doing my best to not feel like I'm a spilling over right. IN that experience, I decided to play like he does, and spread my legs out wide and took up as much space as I can. And you know what, that freaks people out, a woman taking up space as if she's entitiled to the space she's in (or worse, she thinks she's as entitled as the nearby man! gasp shock horror!)!

Phooey on the haters, seriously. Sometimes you need a stroller.


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## kittywitty (Jul 5, 2005)

I have never been glared at. But I only very rarely take a stroller anywhere. I have one, but I usually babywear or totally forget to throw it in the car.

Maybe it's just my experience, but younger people-middle school to college age are actually the nicest when it comes to kids. I can guarantee they will hold a door, give a smile while I'm bf instead of a glare, or be alright when my kid falls on them. Maybe it's location? Though I don't see how that'd be different. The middle generation seems to be rudest about things.

And I have been rammed with strollers, before. I just don't think many stores are very stroller or wheelchair accessible. That's the only times I've gotten weird looks in stores. Especially Target and Walmart-you can't even get through the clothes sections with a cart!!!


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## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

I'm going to be the odd one out here and say: I love umbrella strollers! DD is three and we're on our third, and probably last one. We don't have a car and navigating subways and buses can be challenging with anything larger than an umbrella (although I do see people doing it).

We wore DD in a carrier as long as we could, but DH and I are both lightweights and it got to the point where we just couldn't carry DD anymore. My only issue with huge strollers is when I literally have to jump into the street as one of the SUV stroller moms/dads comes plowing towards us. This is especially prevelant in some of the higher income parts of the city.

Personally, I find there is a huge intolerance of children in general...whether they are walking or in a stroller. The other day, DD and I were in a subway station and I was trying to keep DD from touching the dirty ground. Some lady with cane from across the platform shouted at me: "You should teach her not to come near to people with canes!" We weren't even near her. In irritation (and probably inappropriately) I mumbled back that she should focus on the muggers, rapists and murderers who were probably scoping her out. Bad, I know....but tired of the unsolicited advice and abuse!


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## WC_hapamama (Sep 19, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *pragmaticme* 

Quote:

Originally Posted by tankgirl73
But when we're out at a park or a store or wherever, and there are 100 parents with babies and toddlers, and 98 of them are in strollers and only 2 are in slings, then as a GENERAL view I can fairly safely deduce that MOST of them were NOT carefully decided in that manner... they were just stuck into strollers because babywearing (or other options) is just not on their radar. Kids BELONG in strollers, where you don't have to interact with them as much.
This sort of smacks of "if you were as well informed as me...you would do as I do". I think it's great people babywear - we sometimes wear the girls when my husband and I have the luxury of being able to go out for a walk together. I'm not sure why anyone cares how other people transport their babes. Strollers are great, babywearing is great. Two options, equally valid, in fact there are probably other options that haven't even occurred to me. Do what suits you.

I agree.

I like babywearing, but there are definitely times when the stroller is a better option for me... like those days when it's 104 degrees outside, when I have a baby in a "grabby" mood, or when I know I'm going to be carrying stuff other than the baby or chasing after one of my older kids.

And who says that you don't have to interact with babies if they're in a stroller? I'm going to venture to guess that the parents that wouldn't interact with a baby in a stroller wouldn't interact with one in a sling either.


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LilyGrace* 
I'll admit, I have a problem with strollers. Too many of them are 'cadillacs' - huge things that have shocks and off-road tires that don't belong in stores. And parents are careless with them. I love children, but if there's a double stroller in the middle of the aisle of a crowded restroom, I'm going to curse the parents under my breath.

If more people used smaller strollers that were a single person wide and didn't take up a good portion of close areas, I don't think there'd be much of a problem with it. But it's the behemoths that make people groan - especially during the busy shopping season and the already crowded areas.

This.

I used a stroller for walks in the park or around my neighborhood, but wouldn't have wanted to inconvenience others by trying to bring them in the library or shopping stores. If it annoys me, I imagine it annoys others. And I didn't mind carrying dd or stinking her in a sling. Now she can walk holding my hand or sit in a store provided cart or I will still carry her, and yes, she is H.E.A.V.Y., but the alternative just doesn't appeal to me.

How-ever, I would never say anything to a person with a stroller or let the door slam on you, how rude!
I actually find the opposite of what the OP is talking about, I find this entitled feeling often times from stroller users, like, "get out of my way, can't you see I have this _stroller_ with a _child_ in it!"


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HollyBearsMom* 
My biggest issue are those jogging strollers with big "all weather"wheels that don't have a turning radius. Hello. it is a JOGGING stroller not a meander around the mall/grocery store/etc stroller. At least some have improved and you can set the front wheel turn but even so they are impossible to navigate around. If you want to jog, gor for it but leave the monstrocity at home when you are out shopping.











I have one of those! And I take it to the grocery store all the time....usually on our way home from walking to the park. I don't have a vehicle during the week, so this stroller is it for me and my 2 yo. I can assure you it takes up no more space than a shopping cart









I would LOVE a fancy, more space efficient stroller with a pivoting front wheel, but this is the one I got at the thrift store for $15. Would you like to buy me something more appropriate for the grocery store?


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## St. Margaret (May 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I was just reading an article about this, about two months ago, and it really stuck with me. I wish I remembered where I found it.

The article was basically about how traditionally women aren't allowed to take up space, and the animosity towards women with strollers is all about that. How if people see a guy with a stroller, they think "aw, what an awesome dad taking his kid out!" but a woman with a stroller is "taking up too much space" or "entitled." Because women should be in the kitchen, out of sight, and children should be invisible.

I dunno, it kid of struck a chord with me. Some very good points were made, I thought. On the surface it was kind of weird, but the more I think about it, the more I think maybe there's something to it.

I also never understand when people complain about how big strollers are. Hasn't anyone seen an old-fashioned pram, the kind common right up to the 1970s? Those things were friggin TANKS. The animosity towards large strollers is 100% class-based.

WORD. That totally makes sense, I just hadn't made the connection to the women/space thing.


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## Trinitty (Jul 15, 2004)

Hello,

I have not read the entire thread yet, but it seems that this issue really strikes a chord with people.

We do not have a car; we walk or take public transit everywhere.

We own two strollers, one almost umbrella stroller that folds in half and is very small.... and not suitable for long rides.

The other is an Emmajunga Viking model from the 1980s... we got it mint and used and were very lucky.

The Viking is amazing. All metal and leather and canvas, very sturdy, and reversible. It has a flat basket under the seat where I can stash groceries. I walk everywhere with it and we have never had a glare from anyone in a store or on a sidewalk.

All of this considered, it is _narrow._ It fits through even the trendiest of check-outs, while still being sturdy enough to carry all of the gear.

Still, it is longer than the folding stroller and I have never taken it on a bus. I see the dirty looks everyone gets when they bring strollers on to the bus, taking up three seats (only one more than a mother and child would take up anyway!) and I just don't want the fight. I would probably not like the person I would become if I got attitude from someone about it, and strollers on buses have become an issue in my city.

So, I wear my 20 month old in a sling and carry all of my groceries in a backpack and two large fabric bags. It is a major pain. I would not be able to do it with two children, and anyone with a weaker back would not be able to manage.

So, when I see a mother with two children and a massive plastic stroller full of groceries get on to the bus, I flush with anger when I hear the grumbling coming from people.... they obviously don't know what it is like to attempt to do this. Sadly, the grumbling is almost always from our senior citizens, and I don't know why.

These women are often immigrants, working poor or perhaps young single mothers..... So I have wondered if it is more about the type of person behind the stroller, than the stroller itself.

But, on the other hand, I have seen dozens instances of people pushing double-wide bike trailers, containing one child, two abreast down narrow sidewalks in the swankiest sectors of the city - and doing so quite aggressively. Or, worse, parked while passing by each other, and talking. Completely blocking the sidewalk for other pedestrians, and not caring a fig about it. I have been banged into by people pushing these strollers.

This issue was raised in our local paper and it caused months of letters on all sides, pro, con and reasonable.

So, in the first example, of the typical mother with a stroller I see on a bus or in a mall, I would agree that it could be an issue of class.

However, the second example I mentioned was so strong and maintained, that I find the argument either falls apart or fragments.

The women pushing the bike trailers were from the highest income bracket, while those on the buses were from the lower end of the scale.

Both have gotten strong negative reactions in my city, and class can't be blamed for both.

**Interesting note: My husband is home with our daughter during the week, and whenever he needs to take the bus anywhere, he uses the small folding stroller and doesn't give it a second thought. He has never had a dirty look, either.**

I think some other posters had good points. I think that most of the time, it is all about the person pushing the stroller. They could be rude with a stroller or a shopping cart, but strollers seem to be much more personal and controversial, so people react more strongly.

On the low income / bus issue, I think there is something specific about mothers and children and the animosity towards them.... but I can't put my finger on it.

Since, in my experience, the anger usually comes from our senior citizens, is it the standard "I had it harder in my day, these women are given too many breaks" bitterness? Or "I raised 12 children without taking a bus on a stroller" mentality? I am not certain... but it really bothers me. I think that our age groups are becoming so stratified that it is nearly impossible to relate to each other any more.... I fear that kindness is ebbing.

Trin.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
This.

I used a stroller for walks in the park or around my neighborhood, but wouldn't have wanted to inconvenience others by trying to bring them in the library or shopping stores. If it annoys me, I imagine it annoys others. And I didn't mind carrying dd or stinking her in a sling. Now she can walk holding my hand or sit in a store provided cart or I will still carry her, and yes, she is H.E.A.V.Y., but the alternative just doesn't appeal to me.

How-ever, I would never say anything to a person with a stroller or let the door slam on you, how rude!
I actually find the opposite of what the OP is talking about, I find this entitled feeling often times from stroller users, like, "get out of my way, can't you see I have this _stroller_ with a _child_ in it!"


just curious - what would you do if you had more than one little one. Do you realize it's not always possible to safely contain 2 or more children in a store if you don't have one in the cart and one in a carrier - so stores w/o shopping carts often mean a stroller is necessary, and then there's the whole fact that many people simply don't have a sling. Of course it depends on the kids and all that. But that's the point. Anyone who is annoyed or says they wouldn't bring a stroller in a public place, likely hasn't had a need to do so like many other mamas do.

I still don't get the annoyance. So, if strollers stress you out -- when you see one, go the other way.









This all reminds me of the last time I did use my stroller (which, really is infrequently b/c DS is 2.5). Anyway, he was sleeping, we were at an outdoor shopping area which would have been difficult to get around if he was awake in the time-frame we had before having to pick up my other child -- anyway, I was able to transfer him sleeping from the carseat to the stroller and get my shopping done while he took his nap. That meant going into Borders and Gymboree (where there wasn't much room) but you know what? I navigated just fine, didn't get in anyone's way, had nothing but smiles and help to open doors and it was a very pleasant and relaxing trip for me. With four kids, that's about as close to shopping alone as it gets. If I had not had the stroller and had to wake up DS, he would have cried, been tired, likely pulled on the clothing racks or screamed in the bookstore. Honestly, even if I did piss someone off along the way, that sounds like their issue since I was doing what I had to do to get through the day.

And I do think I will throw the stroller in the car today b/c I have to go to my campus bookstore. Chances are that DS would do just fine walking (he has before, and everyone is super friendly there) but it will make it easier to run in and out quickly if he is contained and on wheels. Why the heck make things more difficult for yourself just on the off chance that some stranger is going to be annoyed?


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

lach said:


> I've never been rammed by a stroller either. That isn't to say that it doesn't happen, obviously, or that there aren't some really obnoxious people out there who happen to be mothers who happen to have children in strollers. But I think that there's a peculiar tendency for people to be eager about sharing their stories about obnoxious women with strollers, and then painting all mothers or even all women with that broad brush.
> 
> I mean, if I posted on this forum with a specific example that seemed to confirm a broader negative stereotype, I'm sure I'd be (rightfully) corrected by other posters, and perhaps even get into trouble with the mods. So why is it okay to hate on "large strollers" and use as the only evidence some anecdotes that are more about obnoxious people than about strollers?
> 
> ...


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## St. Margaret (May 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 









I have one of those! And I take it to the grocery store all the time....usually on our way home from walking to the park. I don't have a vehicle during the week, so this stroller is it for me and my 2 yo. I can assure you it takes up no more space than a shopping cart









I would LOVE a fancy, more space efficient stroller with a pivoting front wheel, but this is the one I got at the thrift store for $15. Would you like to buy me something more appropriate for the grocery store?










Yeah, I see how people would want me to have a little umbrella stroller, but we have ONE stroller. Our neighbors all seem to own five or so. Seriously. I bought a BOB revolution used off craigslist (had to troll for weeks to catch one) so I could use it for everything-- exercising, hauling stuff to the beach, shopping, etc. And I can push it with one hand easily... I dunno, I hardly ever use it. We babywear even when we go to Disneyland for the day. (Now I DO own several carriers







) So when I am using it, I feel like I really needed it (and I sometimes forget when it would have been a good time to use it!), and I want it to be comfy for me and DD. And when we're BWing, we totally get pushed past, people hitting DD's legs... UGH! That just sets off my mama bear... Don't hit my baby!

And yes! I get looks in the grocery store, but I WALKED there, right past all the Cadillac SUVs in the parking lot







(very chi chi area). I need the good stroller just to make it down the crumby sidewalks and through the dirt/grass we cut through.


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
Why the heck make things more difficult for yourself just on the off chance that some stranger is going to be annoyed?

I guess that's one way to look at it, but certainly not the way I want to manuever through life. I mean I feel like we live on a planet with others and it is certainly my job to consider other people, plus _for me_ it is not an inconvenience to carry dd or to have her walk(at 2 yrs old.) To me I don't feel like I _am_ making things more difficult on myself.

And I have taken more than just my dd out several times without a stroller, in fact the idea of taking several children out _and_ pushing a stroller seems like the impossibilty to my brain!

It boils down to a fundamental difference of opinion and I am fine with that. I don't believe, or have a need, to convince anyone that I am great without a stroller. I just don't personally like them and that is fine!

The question in the OP was about why people don't like them and I have answered that for myself


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Trinitty* 
So, in the first example, of the typical mother with a stroller I see on a bus or in a mall, I would agree that it could be an issue of class.

However, the second example I mentioned was so strong and maintained, that I find the argument either falls apart or fragments.

The women pushing the bike trailers were from the highest income bracket, while those on the buses were from the lower end of the scale.

Both have gotten strong negative reactions in my city, and class can't be blamed for both.

I think that there can be class-based resentment towards women on both class extremes. Our society resents wealth, especially that which we see as unearned wealth. Which is what many people automatically assume if they see an upper class woman out with an expensive stroller in the middle of the day: she must live a life of leisure while her husband supports the family. Sure, it also holds wealth on a pedestal, and yes it's a huge contradiction, but there you go. Politicians fall over themselves to prove who is the poorest for a reason.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *St. Margaret* 
I bought a BOB revolution used off craigslist .











I met a family recently with a fabulous BOB stroller. I had such stroller envy, and then I remembered that this family (low-middle income) lives in the city and _has no car_. They deserve that stroller!


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## major_mama11 (Apr 13, 2008)

I love strollers, and I also love babywearing. I tend to use whatever works best at the time. Often, now that I have two kids, it's both. I will wear my son and push my daughter in a stroller. She CAN walk just fine, but when she gets tired, she turns into a limp noodle and collapses on the ground, and I just don't quite have the energy to attempt to carry a 4YO and a 22-pound baby.

My main stroller isn't a monstrosity, but it does have a decent-sized basket underneath, which sure is convenient for shopping bags or library books or snacks. I just don't see the point in making going places with kids harder on myself than it already is, and I don't think I'm terribly inconveniencing anyone, as long as I don't block or ram people, which I wouldn't do anyway, with or without a stroller.

I have experienced all kinds of rude behavior with shopping carts (running into me, blocking aisles, etc), but I have yet to be run into with a stroller. They take up less space than most grocery shopping carts, so I have yet to be irritated by someone taking a stroller into any store that is spacious enough to allow shopping carts.

ETA: I find the idea of this being partially about women traditionally not being allowed to take up space very interesting, and I think there is definitely some truth to this.

Also, I wonder how much of this is regional? I live in the Midwest, pretty rural/suburban area, so I think everything (stores, sidewalks, libraries) obviously tends to be less crowded, bigger aisles, etc here than it would be in an urban area.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
It boils down to a fundamental difference of opinion and I am fine with that.

More accurately, it is a difference of reality. Not everyone has the same situation and needs, kwim?


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## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Trinitty* 
Since, in my experience, the anger usually comes from our senior citizens, is it the standard "I had it harder in my day, these women are given too many breaks" bitterness? Or "*I raised 12 children without taking a bus on a stroller"* mentality? I am not certain... but it really bothers me. I think that our age groups are becoming so stratified that it is nearly impossible to relate to each other any more.... I fear that kindness i]s ebbing.

Trin.

That would be a neat trick.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Here's an idea: How about the next time you see a parent with a stroller in say, the post office, instead of thinking smugly to yourself "grrr, that huge stroller takes up half the line" why not give them the benefit of the doubt?

It's quite possible that the stroller pusher is doing you, the public, a favor by containing their kid in a stroller. Maybe the alternative is a screaming, tantruming, grabby, bolting, flailing kid. One who would surely annoy others and make life more difficult for the 10 minutes it takes to mail a package.

You have no idea what their day has been like, how much sleep mom or child has gotten in the past week, what circumstances led the parent to decide to use a stroller for that outing. It might mean you have to walk around the stroller, or wait a few seconds until they get in the door - but really, maybe that's a lot better than the alternative.

And don't say well, she could have wore the kid on her back -- because not everyone lives in a AP-fantasy world, they live in the real world.

This is quite a bizzare thread - I had no idea people found strollers so inconvenient. In fact, I would assume most people, especially those who have raised children, think they are quite handy at times.


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## felix23 (Nov 7, 2006)

I'm getting ready to go to the PO and I have to use the stroller. How else am I supposed to carry the baby (who refuses to get into a sling/wrap without screaming), hold the big package, hold my purse, and keep my four year old from wandering off and touching all the cool looking stuff there? I stick them both in my double stroller, stick the package at the back of the stroller and everyone is happy (well, maybe not everyone, apparently there are people who wil get offended at the sight of my stroller).

I can understand hating rude people, but I just don't get the stroller hate.


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## hibiscus mum (Apr 6, 2009)

I haven't experienced any of the stroller hostility mentioned here, or maybe I've just never noticed. I like babywearing, but it's not always convenient. I also have a bum ankle that tends to turn on itself without warning. I had DS in a sling when he was around 10 days old and we all went for a walk (me, DS, DD, and DH). My ankle gave out and I fell down. How I managed to protect DS's little head is beyond me. It came very close to being bashed hard on the sidewalk. Luckily, my knees took the worst of it.

I also have one of those monster double strollers. It's a Graco Quattro Tour, so I can put the carseat in the back. I got it used on Kijiji and have to say that it really saved my sanity. I joined a local moms group and we went for long walks twice a week. DD walked too slowly at the time to keep up, so she sat in the front of the stroller, quite happily. DS was in the back and if he fussed I would pick him up and put him in the Beco. So I guess I'm a fan of the healthy combo of stroller and carrier use.

Pushing the double stroller in stores was a bit of a learning curve. I'm pretty sure I bashed into something almost every time I turned a corner at first. Never a person, though.







If anyone noticed i would say something like, "I really need driving lessons and a special license for this thing." I've been amazed at how many people hold doors for us.


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hibiscus mum* 
I had DS in a sling when he was around 10 days old and we all went for a walk (me, DS, DD, and DH). My ankle gave out and I fell down. How I managed to protect DS's little head is beyond me. It came very close to being bashed hard on the sidewalk. Luckily, my knees took the worst of it.









Oh man that is so scary. I fell down the stairs with my kid in the Ergo the other day...somehow managed to fall _backwards_, but my back took the brunt of it.

Of course if I had been in the stroller I would have taken the elevator!

Seriously folks...its ok if people are annoyed by your stroller. People get annoyed. Its not ok if they let you know by shooting dirty looks or bashing on you. Its great if they smile at you and hold open doors...but its really not fair to expect such treatment. Simply enjoy it when it happens.


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## lovingmommyhood (Jul 28, 2006)

I find it ridiculous to complain about the size of strollers. Lots of things take up space. Some people for instance are larger. When I go out in public with my aunt we get the same glares because she is extremely overweight, takes up way more space than my larger stroller. Is she not allowed to be in Victoria's Secret now either? Or how about wheel chairs? Power scooters? I just don't get why people can't get over themselves a tiny bit and just be friendly. Nobody is more entitled to the space than anybody else--live and let live, ya know??


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## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

I really am confused at those of you are so offended by strollers in stores. Carts take up WAY more space then a stroller.


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## Trinitty (Jul 15, 2004)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trinitty
Since, in my experience, the anger usually comes from our senior citizens, is it the standard "I had it harder in my day, these women are given too many breaks" bitterness? Or "I raised 12 children without taking a bus on a stroller" mentality? I am not certain... but it really bothers me. I think that our age groups are becoming so stratified that it is nearly impossible to relate to each other any more.... I fear that kindness i]s ebbing.

Trin.

That would be a neat trick.
LOL. Yeah, I spell checked, but missed that one. Think Johnny Carson.

Trin.


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## Luckiestgirl (Nov 10, 2004)

Haven't read all the replies, but:

1. I have used a double stroller;

2. The umbrella stroller I received for a gift was unsafe (tippy) and uncomfortable (too low to push);

3. I think our society is becoming anti-children. Really. I'm not anti-daycare, but I do think the prevalence of daycare has contributed to this attitude. People don't see as many moms out with kids during the day as they did a generation ago, so it's like, hey, why are these kids here? I've encountered this at the dentist, restaurants at lunchtime, stores, etc.


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I think it's about judging other people, who might have any unknown circumstance or set of circumstances, based on your own circumstances. We don't know why people are using strollers, if they often use slings as well, if their child will do better at that particular store/location in a stroller than a sling, if the mom's back isn't doing well, if the mom has lots of other stuff to carry as well, etc. We just don't know what all is involved, so to judge a mom for using a stroller when we don't know what all is going on seems simply unfair. And, sure, the same is true for a lot of things.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

For me, the irony is that our stroller helps me be more NFL! We walk to the park (1 mile, along busy roads) instead of drive _because we have a stroller_. We walk to the grocery store (.3 mile, but no sidewalk for half of it and one busy road to cross) _because we have a stroller_. Wearing a nearly 3 yo is out of the question for me and my nearly 3 yo (although we were huge babywearers when he was younger).


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## kalimay (May 25, 2005)

My two year old was knocked down by a stroller trick or treating on Halloween. Was it the strollers fault? No but it did make me question bringing a big stroller to a crowded neighborhood to push kids up to each house so they could hold out their bags for treats. I would imagine it could be done without incident but it seems like the person pushing the stroller would have to be really careful and this person was not. My feeling is that when you are walking you can sense where others are but when you are pushing something like a stroller it is on the person with the stroller to be extra cautious about everyone around them and that is hard to do, at least for me when I am pushing a stroller or a shopping cart for that matter, I feel like I have to be hyper alert. I have been bumped many times at farmers market, not by people being rude or obnoxious but by what seemed like carelessness or lack of attention being paid to navigating a wheeled object though a group of people.


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *felix23* 
What I don't really understand is the judging of all mothers with strollers. I can understand judging rude people with strollers. I judged the rude babywearing mother at Toys R Us who screamed at dd1 and made her cry because she claimed she was standing too close to her and might bump into her baby. But I don't extend that judgement to the rest of babywearers, just the rude one. I like strollers better then babywearing, but my personal preference doesn't make me judge all babywearers because they don't share my preference.

I just don't understand what is to judge.

I just don't love strollers. To me it's a lot of contraption for such a little being. In my mind I'm thinking right now about what I don't like about strollers, personally, and I guees to me they are _not_ more convenient. To me they add another step to getting out of the car or the house and all for what? To put my child on wheels, I guess. It's like a roving playpen with less room for dc to move about.
Of all the children I watch and have watched as a nanny/babysitter what I have learned for myself is that if they are not going to be happy where we are going outside of the stroller, they are not going to be more happy inside the stroller. If they are going to want to run around where ever we are going then they more than likely are not going to want to be strapped into a stroller instead.
I have never had a 3yo that actually wanted to be in a stroller.

These are my reasons for not loving strollers.

As I have said many times in this thread, I am never rude to a person using a stroller, I would of course hold the door for a stroller user(or anyone for that matter) and I have friends who use strollers as a rule and would never say a word to them about it.

I just don't love them and that's pretty much all there is to that.

And I have experienced rude stroller users and that adds to the annoyance.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *felix23* 
I just don't understand what is to judge.











You don't have to personally like them to understand that others have legitimate reasons to use them.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
I just don't love strollers. To me it's a lot of contraption for such a little being. In my mind I'm thinking right now about what I don't like about strollers, personally, and I guees to me they are _not_ more convenient. To me they add another step to getting out of the car or the house *and all for what?* To put my child on wheels, I guess. It's like a roving playpen with less room for dc to move about.

(bolding mine)

Transportation! Really, it is just a transportation tool. It gets us there quicker and safer than walking hand in hand, and safer than driving.

Also, after spending 1-2 hours at the playground, my little guy is _super_ happy to ride home in the stroller rather than walking! He's tired. So am I! I'm seriously not wanting to carry him (35#) the 1 mile home at that point.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

welllll, I am kicking myself for forgetting the stroller today. After a 45 minute drive into the city, of course my little guy was fast asleep. Wonderful, b/c I had exactly 1 hr to get in and out and BACK to my town to pick up my other son from the bus stop. SO, after driving around for what seemed like forever to find a parking spot (one that was pretty far away, I might add) I am stuck, in the freezing cold, having to pee like a mother, trying to convince a sleeping 30+ lb 2.5 yr old to squeeze into the ergo -- all so I can shlep 3 heavy textbooks and my purse all the way to the campus book store.

BRRRRR! (okay, so bringing a coat would have been a good idea, you can judge me for that







) Then of course, I had the ordeal of waiting in line, finding a bathroom to use with said 2 yo on my back, and getting all the way back to my car to rush back up to my kid's bus stop (45 min away, remember). What would have made this trip a kazillion times easier, of course, would have been my trusty, not too bulky, beloved stroller. If you can't understand that, or even worse, are judgemental about it - I have no idea what to say to convince you that yes, sometimes strollers make life go a little bit smoother. Otherwise they wouldn't be selling like they do.

I suppose one could say I could have chose a better time to go (ha! you don't know my life) or hey, maybe that moms shouldn't be trying to go to school - problem of using a stroller on campus, solved, right? funny, though... we saw 2 other women there with children who looked older than my DS, who were happily riding in their comfy stroller.

and by you, I mean general you who don't care for strollers and don't understand how on earth they could be useful. What the heck is not to understand? Maybe someday you will have say, twins and a toddler at the same time and see things a bit differently.


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## urklemama (May 4, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
I guess to me they are _not_ more convenient.

OK, to you, a person who clearly doesn't have a bad back, plantar fascitis, or live in a city where strollers are banned from public transport. I broke my foot when my baby was 4 months old. What was I supposed to do? Sling her while wearing my walking cast?


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## madskye (Feb 20, 2006)

I don't like strollers, and I didn't babywear. Not sure what that makes me! We had a stroller I used infrequently, and a bjorn that I hated. Maybe a sling would rocked my world but I didn't have one.

Once DD could walk she was pretty much done with her stroller--which I realize would not work with everyones lifestyle. She walked and when she got tired I picked her up and carried her for a while. If we lived in a city, I'd probably would have been more comfortable with her safely contained in a stroller.

I totally crack up when I see people strollering 5+ year olds, but that is just me being judg-y and I try not to actually manifest it. I certainly hold the door and am polite to pretty much everyone in my path--but I just don't get why people are so dependent on them, and I find them particularly infuriating in crowds.


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## felix23 (Nov 7, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
I just don't love strollers. To me it's a lot of contraption for such a little being. In my mind I'm thinking right now about what I don't like about strollers, personally, and I guees to me they are _not_ more convenient. To me they add another step to getting out of the car or the house and all for what? To put my child on wheels, I guess. It's like a roving playpen with less room for dc to move about.
Of all the children I watch and have watched as a nanny/babysitter what I have learned for myself is that if they are not going to be happy where we are going outside of the stroller, they are not going to be more happy inside the stroller. If they are going to want to run around where ever we are going then they more than likely are not going to want to be strapped into a stroller instead.
I have never had a 3yo that actually wanted to be in a stroller.

These are my reasons for not loving strollers.

As I have said many times in this thread, I am never rude to a person using a stroller, I would of course hold the door for a stroller user(or anyone for that matter) and I have friends who use strollers as a rule and would never say a word to them about it.

I just don't love them and that's pretty much all there is to that.

And I have experienced rude stroller users and that adds to the annoyance.

I still don't understand the judgement for all people who use strollers. Personally, for me, slings/wraps/mei tais are very inconvenient. I would have to get the sleeping baby out of her carseat, causing her to scream, and try to calm her down in the sling, that would never happen, so she would just scream the whole time. And then there would be a post on MDC about the horrible mother with the screaming baby who ruined other people's shopping trip.

And my four year old loves the double stroller. She walks when she wants, and when she gets tired she can ride. Or like today when we had to wait in line at the PO, she brought books and toys so she could sit and play with them.


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## User101 (Mar 3, 2002)

Returning and reopening.









Please keep the User Agreement in mind when posting, and be respectful to one another. You're more than welcome to engage in polite debate while discussing the topic at hand; you are not welcome to call each other judgmental, engage in namecalling, post to discuss other members' behavior on the thread, or personally attack/take issue with other members.

That said, carry on.


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## ~pi (May 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
I have never had a 3yo that actually wanted to be in a stroller.

My 3 yo is totally happy to get in the stroller partway into regular 7-10 mi walks with multiple playground stops along the way. He is also happy to get in the Ergo halfway through mountain hikes, despite being otherwise adamantly opposed to the idea.

My experience: Get a child tired enough and that child will be happy to ride in whatever conveyance s/he is offered.

I understand the no-stroller idea. We didn't even buy a stroller until DS was almost 18 months old. We borrowed a ten year old pram/stroller from a neighbour when DS was a baby, but with one child, in a city, I found it easier to get around on public transportation with him in a carrier of some sort. We mostly used the pram for walking to the grocery store, because we could then use the basket to carry groceries home more easily. As DS got older, we found the pram more and more useful.

A stroller can be incredibly useful and convenient, _especially when you walk a lot of places_. Necessary? Maybe not. Convenient and can replace driving? Yes.

I'm sure that some people have children who have walked 20 miles daily from the time they could toddle. And they do it without complaining. Uphill both ways. Just because that's what was expected of them.

Sadly, I wasn't smart enough to build that particular model.


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## Altair (May 1, 2005)

Didn't see the actual link to the article a PP wrote about-- mother's and children taking up space. it was on salon.com and written by a mother in my neighborhood. (park slope brooklyn)

http://www.salon.com/life/feature/20...ate/index.html

to give a little background, park slope is on one hand the single most child friendly neighborhood in the country, IMO. Coffee houses filled with nursing toddlers, babies/children in every restaurant/bar (at least the lounge-y bars with sofas and food... and remember, no smoking in nyc bars), green children's toy stores on every block, etc. at the same time, there is a great backlash to mothers in general in this neighborhood, which quietly simmers and then erupts every so often, and often strollers and all they represent are the flash point. a neighborhood bar frequented by mothers during the day (again, very comfy quiet sofa type place, looks much more like a coffee house) banned strollers a few years back and the UPROAR from both sides was deafening!

Yes, babies in bars are a whole other issue. But it sure makes urban parenting nice!

I have never cared my entire adult life if a person pushing a stroller is in my way. People are in my way often, I live in NYC. If someone is in my way, I say "excuse me." Solves the problem pretty fast. If they don't hear me, I say it again until they do!

Most of the time I babywear. But living in the city means traveling all day without the break of putting baby in the carseat, so a good stroller is nice to have. I think the Bugaboo Bee is the perfect mix between not too big but still soooo easy to move around.

And I love that high school aged kids (who moments before were cursing loudly and trying to look tough to their friends) are the ones most likely to help me pull the stroller down the subway stairs, as the 20s and 30s and 40s able bodied men rush by. Ha.


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## ~pi (May 4, 2005)

Good article, thank you for linking!


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## Latte Mama (Aug 25, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamazee* 
I think it's about judging other people, who might have any unknown circumstance or set of circumstances, based on your own circumstances. We don't know why people are using strollers, if they often use slings as well, if their child will do better at that particular store/location in a stroller than a sling, if the mom's back isn't doing well, if the mom has lots of other stuff to carry as well, etc. We just don't know what all is involved, so to judge a mom for using a stroller when we don't know what all is going on seems simply unfair. And, sure, the same is true for a lot of things.

I agree, we can't know what someone's situation is. I used a sling and Mei Tei when DS was younger but there is no way I can wear him for very long now. I have 3 herniated discs in my lumbar spine and wearing him for more than 10 minutes or so causes serious pain in my back and hips.

I have a medium sized stroller and I don't use it often. On short outings DS walks. If we have a longer journey planned I have no qualms about using the stroller and I sure don't ram anyone with it. I've had plenty of people offer help up and down stairs







and I've never noticed anyone giving the stinkeye.


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## Harmony08 (Feb 4, 2009)

Light and love to you all!


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## Needle in the Hay (Sep 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~pi* 
A stroller can be incredibly useful and convenient, _especially when you walk a lot of places_. Necessary? Maybe not. Convenient and can replace driving? Yes.

I'm sure that some people have children who have walked 20 miles daily from the time they could toddle. And they do it without complaining. Uphill both ways. Just because that's what was expected of them.

Sadly, I wasn't smart enough to build that particular model.










And the other thing about a 3 or 4 year old riding in a stroller is naptime. I know some 3 and 4 year olds no longer take naps, but my son napped until he was just about 5 and having a stroller along meant we didn't have to be slaves to naptime every single day. I remember a couple of times him falling asleep on public transport and I didn't have a stroller. Try carrying an almost 4 yr old uphill for 15 minutes, all the while trying not to wake him because you know he hasn't slept nearly enough and if he wakes up he won't go back to sleep.


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## tireesix (Apr 27, 2006)

I don't hate strollers, its the people behind them that irritate me.

If people want to use a stroller, thats fine. I have one, a teeny small one for going into town, I used to have a huge thing as well for long walks. The huge stroller NEVER went into town, the small stroller did.

I mean, unless you need a large stroller for like a disabled child or for twins etc, so be it, otherwise use some sense. I wish more women would carry their babies (I know that isn't always possible).

There have been numerous times I have been late (I am not allowed to drive due to health/medication) because some selfish woman on the bus has taken up the whole push chair space and will not move at all in order to accommodate my pushchair (thats if their is enough space left at all even after moving it). That really irritates me, a lot of the time I am tired and in pain and just want to get to where I am going without having to wait hours at the bus stop with my child just because people won't move in the bus.

Two disabled people got on a crowded bus once, nobody moved including the mum in the disabled spot, didn't adjust her stroller and within earshot of the disabled people said 'its not like they are old or anything'. They were trying to navigate their way to empty spots with their crutches all over the place. I felt awful for them.

Obviously this isn't the case all the time but I have had a lot of bad experiences with other mums and push chairs and it really bugs me.


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## KirstenMary (Jun 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *felix23* 
I'm getting ready to go to the PO and I have to use the stroller. How else am I supposed to carry the baby (who refuses to get into a sling/wrap without screaming), hold the big package, hold my purse, and keep my four year old from wandering off and touching all the cool looking stuff there? I stick them both in my double stroller, stick the package at the back of the stroller and everyone is happy (well, maybe not everyone, apparently there are people who wil get offended at the sight of my stroller).

I can understand hating rude people, but I just don't get the stroller hate.

I don't hate rude people, but they sure as heck bug me.







And I don't get the stroller hate either, but usually when I go shopping, the stroller ends up holding my packages and not my children.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Luckiestgirl* 
Haven't read all the replies, but:

1. I have used a double stroller;

2. The umbrella stroller I received for a gift was unsafe (tippy) and uncomfortable (too low to push);

*3. I think our society is becoming anti-children.* Really. I'm not anti-daycare, but I do think the prevalence of daycare has contributed to this attitude. People don't see as many moms out with kids during the day as they did a generation ago, so it's like, hey, why are these kids here? I've encountered this at the dentist, restaurants at lunchtime, stores, etc.

I agree with the bolded. We can have our children - as long as no one sees them and as long as they inconvenience no one. We must remember that children should neither be seen nor heard.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamazee* 
*I think it's about judging other people, who might have any unknown circumstance or set of circumstances, based on your own circumstances.* We don't know why people are using strollers, if they often use slings as well, if their child will do better at that particular store/location in a stroller than a sling, if the mom's back isn't doing well, if the mom has lots of other stuff to carry as well, etc. We just don't know what all is involved, so to judge a mom for using a stroller when we don't know what all is going on seems simply unfair. And, sure, the same is true for a lot of things.

Yes.

Let's just stop judging, people! Come on! We are all mamas! We are all trying to do our best to raise our children as best as we can. Strollers have their need, their use, and their place, and no matter how much we think we know what goes on in the lives of strangers, we.just.don't. If you don't like my stroller, then for Pete's sake, look away! But to sit back and judge me for it is tantamount to the grouchy old man judging me for openly breastfeeding my son at the local Applebees.

Can't we all just get along???


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tireesix* 
If people want to use a stroller, thats fine. I have one, a teeny small one for going into town, I used to have a huge thing as well for long walks. The huge stroller NEVER went into town, the small stroller did.

I mean, unless you need a large stroller for like a disabled child or for twins etc, so be it, otherwise use some sense. .

How many strollers do you expect people to buy?

If you _need_ a stroller for transportation, you need a bigger one with bigger wheels (think jogging stroller). Not everyone has the resources to buy and store different strollers for different situations.

I don't remember ever having a problem with another parent+stroller. I have, however, had many, many annoying situations with other people and their cars, but I don't blame the cars


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## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

And I love that high school aged kids (who moments before were cursing loudly and trying to look tough to their friends) are the ones most likely to help me pull the stroller down the subway stairs, as the 20s and 30s and 40s able bodied men rush by. Ha.
So true! I'm very impressed with the young people in this city. They are incredibly helpful and actually make conversation with DD! It is like they have a less biased view of the world or something.

Quote:

I'm sure that some people have children who have walked 20 miles daily from the time they could toddle. And they do it without complaining. Uphill both ways. Just because that's what was expected of them.

Sadly, I wasn't smart enough to build that particular model.
DD walks a lot for her age (3), but even in the best of circumstances, and especially in the afternoon, she gets tired and cranky and needs a nap. Home seems PAINFULLY far away with a snoring 3-year-old on your shoulder, especially if you're walking. It is more about me than her.


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## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

I hate strollers for myself, they are a pain to use, ds wants in and out constantly, they take up too much room, and Im not good at steering!

Ds likes to walk most of the time, sometimes I put him in a carrier, he used to be in one all the time when he was smaller. At theme parks we bring the wagon, it holds more 'stuff' (which is what its for anyway), plus he can climb in and out eaiser. We only own a stroller b/c my parents take him for a walk sometimes and wanted one, but they are the only ones who use it, and Im planning on getting rid of it soon.

I dont care weather other people use strollers or not, as long as they arent running into my heels, tripping me, crashing into me or leaving it right where everyone is supposed to be walking. (I have seen all of this!)
I also think its weird when someones kid like lives in the stroller, I've seen people that never let there kid out to look at anything/run around or whatever, seems boring for the kid.


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## childsplay (Sep 4, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *elmh23* 
I really am confused at those of you are so offended by strollers in stores. Carts take up WAY more space then a stroller.

I was just thinking the same thing!


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## childsplay (Sep 4, 2007)

For me it's all about safety. Shopping with two or three babies/toddlers is a regular occurance for me. I'd be crazy without a double stroller. Especially with my bolters, my wanderers, my non-walkers.
I've encountered hostility on occasion, but don't let it bother me as I know I have just as much right to be in the mall as Mr or Mrs. Crankypants, I'm a paying customer, and I'm polite (too polite sometimes).

Plus we're(or I'm) thinking safety here. My kids are safe in the double stroller, so who gives a hoot what anyone else thinks?


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## StephandOwen (Jun 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leighi123* 
I also think its weird when someones kid like lives in the stroller, I've seen people that never let there kid out to look at anything/run around or whatever, seems boring for the kid.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *sisteeesmama* 
I have never had a 3yo that actually wanted to be in a stroller.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *madskye* 
I totally crack up when I see people strollering 5+ year olds, but that is just me being judg-y and I try not to actually manifest it. I certainly hold the door and am polite to pretty much everyone in my path--but I just don't get why people are so dependent on them, and I find them particularly infuriating in crowds.

Wow. So much judgement.







My ds is 6 and still uses his jogging stroller sometimes. Why? Because he has autism and oftentimes it's near impossible for him to be out in public without having a meltdown. But, you know what? I still have to go shopping. I still have to live life. If having his stroller (and some books, his blankie and some noise blocking headphones) helps my son cope with life- why shouldn't I allow that? To some people I'm sure that looks like I'm taking the lazy way by not having him walk or that he's spoiled or whatever. I don't care. It gets us through the day and, you know what? If I didn't have that stroller for him and made him walk and he freaked out in the middle of the store- complete with head banging, screaming and, often- running away.... what would you think then? Of course I would be judged as a horrible mom. Either way I do it (stroller or no stroller) I'm being judged every single day by people who has NO IDEA what I deal with every day and every night.


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leighi123* 
I hate strollers for myself, they are a pain to use, ds wants in and out constantly, they take up too much room, and Im not good at steering!

Ds likes to walk most of the time, sometimes I put him in a carrier, he used to be in one all the time when he was smaller. At theme parks we bring the wagon, it holds more 'stuff' (which is what its for anyway), plus he can climb in and out eaiser. We only own a stroller b/c my parents take him for a walk sometimes and wanted one, but they are the only ones who use it, and Im planning on getting rid of it soon.

I dont care weather other people use strollers or not, as long as they arent running into my heels, tripping me, crashing into me or leaving it right where everyone is supposed to be walking. (I have seen all of this!)
I also think its weird when someones kid like lives in the stroller, I've seen people that never let there kid out to look at anything/run around or whatever, seems boring for the kid.

Yes. This is what I'm saying.


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *StephandOwen* 
Wow. So much judgement.







My ds is 6 and still uses his jogging stroller sometimes. Why? Because he has autism and oftentimes it's near impossible for him to be out in public without having a meltdown. But, you know what? I still have to go shopping. I still have to live life. If having his stroller (and some books, his blankie and some noise blocking headphones) helps my son cope with life- why shouldn't I allow that? To some people I'm sure that looks like I'm taking the lazy way by not having him walk or that he's spoiled or whatever. I don't care. It gets us through the day and, you know what? If I didn't have that stroller for him and made him walk and he freaked out in the middle of the store- complete with head banging, screaming and, often- running away.... what would you think then? Of course I would be judged as a horrible mom. Either way I do it (stroller or no stroller) I'm being judged every single day by people who has NO IDEA what I deal with every day and every night.

I really think that what I was trying to say is being taken out of context, here. I said that _I_ have never experienced personally a child older than three that wanted to be in a stroller. That is _my_ experience.
If that works for you then by all means thats just whats going on and my experience is not important at all. I feel like I can have my experience and you can have yours and they don't have to be the same and we don't have to agree and you still get to use your stroller for your child as long as you want to and there should be no problem.
I mean, in my experience as a mom I have made _plenty_ of choices that other people, even my _best_ friends didn't always agree with or understand, but I still made them because they were what I felt was right for me at the time.
And you know what, even here, on MDC, other moms would not _at all_ agree with some of the choices I have made, but I still get to make them because I am the mom and ultimately it's not about everyone validating me and telling me that if it works for me then it's great, it's about me doing what I feel like is right for my kid, or my family or myself. I have realied along the way that I am not going to get that validation from everyone, y'know?

Do what you feel, Mama, you're the boss when it's your kid, I don't have to agree and it's still ok!


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## sisteeesmama (Oct 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~pi* 
My 3 yo is totally happy to get in the stroller partway into regular 7-10 mi walks with multiple playground stops along the way. He is also happy to get in the Ergo halfway through mountain hikes, despite being otherwise adamantly opposed to the idea.

My experience: Get a child tired enough and that child will be happy to ride in whatever conveyance s/he is offered.

I understand the no-stroller idea. We didn't even buy a stroller until DS was almost 18 months old. We borrowed a ten year old pram/stroller from a neighbour when DS was a baby, but with one child, in a city, I found it easier to get around on public transportation with him in a carrier of some sort. We mostly used the pram for walking to the grocery store, because we could then use the basket to carry groceries home more easily. As DS got older, we found the pram more and more useful.

A stroller can be incredibly useful and convenient, _especially when you walk a lot of places_. Necessary? Maybe not. Convenient and can replace driving? Yes.

I'm sure that some people have children who have walked 20 miles daily from the time they could toddle. And they do it without complaining. Uphill both ways. Just because that's what was expected of them.

Sadly, I wasn't smart enough to build that particular model.

To me, and again, this is just for me, I wouldn't want to push the dang thing all around waiting for the time when my kid might want to get in it. Esp. not miles! I really must be too tall for the common construct, but I find them very very uncomfortable to push and even with our schwinn jogger that my hubby found in the trash while at work, I still haven't found a real use for them.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *CatsCradle* 
So true! I'm very impressed with the young people in this city. They are incredibly helpful and actually make conversation with DD! It is like they have a less biased view of the world or something.

It may have to do with the people who want moms and babies/children to disappear being the same people who think teenagers should be kept in a cage. The teens probably have some sympathy with the general vibe.

I like living in Vancouver. I've never felt that I shouldn't be out and about with my kids, whether I'm babywearing, carrying a carseat, pushing a stroller, or just generally wrangling a bunch of crazy little people.


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## isign (Jan 17, 2008)

This is one of the craziest things I've read in a long time. I had no idea strollers were offensive to some (not saying members, just people in general). My 2 are 27m and 13m, and while I do use my wrap at places that have buggies - like wal-mart -I do take my double stroller when I take them both out. It fits through a single door (unless I'm having navigation issues), and is not very bulky. I follow the 'rules of the road', sticking to the right and I walk at a fairly decent pace. My 2 year old is a runner, and so very curious. As much as I love him, I do not trust him to walk unless I can focus all my time on him, and then he must be holding my hand. If someone is offended by me doing what I need to keep my sanity and my children safe, then it's their issue, not mine.


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## lovingmommyhood (Jul 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~pi* 

I'm sure that some people have children who have walked 20 miles daily from the time they could toddle. And they do it without complaining. Uphill both ways. Just because that's what was expected of them.

Sadly, I wasn't smart enough to build that particular model.











Wow, that made my day. Hilarious. I wasn't either, and I had three tries! *facepalms*


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