# Women of Color #12



## eilonwy

Two years is long enough, no?









Women of Color #11. If nothing else, it ought to be up for a record.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Two years is long enough, no?









Women of Color #11. If nothing else, it ought to be up for a record.









thank you! Happy New Year to you and yours


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## FroNuff

Happy New Year, everyone! I hope it's a happy, healthy and prosperous year for all.









Hey oyinmama! You've reminded me that I absolutely need some more Greg Juice. It's been way too long since I had some.









Congrats, boobmommi! Time to change your sig.


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## eilonwy

School starts again today. Break was at once too long and too short. Funny how that works.


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## Halfasianmomma

...except i'm only half colourful


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Halfasianmomma* 
...except i'm only half colourful









Welcome Halfasianmomma. It's perfectly okay with us that you are "only half colourful"!







:


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## splendid

That was the longest thread I ever started. *sniff*

Happy New Year ladies! My this year bring you all health and joy!


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## shayinme

Happy New Years ladies! I have been absent from this thread for a bit but hope to catch up soon.

Shay


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## JustKiya

Happy New Years Ladies!

Wonderful idea to start a new thread, Rhynna!


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## jeca

Jumping in while I still remember to do so.


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## Sugarshoc

Happy happy everyone!!!


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Halfasianmomma* 
...except i'm only half colourful

















I've got pictures on Facebook; I lean toward the pale myself.







I just can't wrap my head around a 'white' identity though, so colorful I am.







Welcome.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthymama2b* 
Wonderful idea to start a new thread, Rhynna!

It was marie's idea, actually; I just happened to be awake after midnight.







(So what else is new?







)


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## daricsmami

HAPPY NEW YEAR, everyone!









I haven't posted in a really long time (but I have been lurking), so I just wanted to say howdy!


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## Halfasianmomma

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Welcome Halfasianmomma. It's perfectly okay with us that you are "only half colourful"!







:

Whoohoo! I guess I'm just a big blender mix: mom's Québécois and Irish, dad's Viet and Mongolian...DH is French and gypsy, raised by a Norwegian father...baby's going to be a REAL mix


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## oyinmama

sub sub subbing ...


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
sub sub subbing ...

Are you the Oyin hairstuff lady, or does Oyin have an additional meaning I'm unaware of? And congrats on the babe to be!


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthymama2b* 
*Are you the Oyin hairstuff lady*, or does Oyin have an additional meaning I'm unaware of? And congrats on the babe to be!









:







:


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## oyinmama

heh - i am indeed. oyin means 'honey' and it's my online tradition to be 'honeychild' in forums, but that handle was already taken when i was registering here. i tried a couple of permutations and this was the first one that worked. it wasn't until after the fact that i realized i'd be 'outing' myself like that


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i'd be 'outing' myself like that










Hmm, I guess it's too early to be saying "discount".









Hey we were all thinking it.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Hmm, I guess it's too early to be saying "discount".









Hey we were all thinking it.


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
it wasn't until after the fact that i realized i'd be 'outing' myself like that









Heh - rock on!! I LOVEEEEEEE your stuff! Love. *Love*. Need to buy some more HH, since you have it in the big bottle now....

*wanders off feeling like she met a celebrity*


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## daricsmami

Oooh! I love Oyin! Congrats on the pregnancy.


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## oyinmama

thanks for the welcome, ladies! you know, there is always a discount code at the end of the latest podcast, which is good until the next podcast is posted. they're usually between 5 and 10%; the current one (podcast5holiday) is for 8% off. i know it's not the holidays anymore, but we're late recording our new year episode!









speaking of which, how was everybody's holiday? i know fronuff and boobmommi welcomed their new little ones - congratulations!! we just [endured] enjoyed a steady parade of houseguests and are thrilled to have survived. for two people who self-identify as utter hermits and had planned to videochat our way into far-flung family gatherings in between cuddling up and roasting chestnuts all alone, it was quite a stretch!









in other news, we're super excited abt the babe - the belly is on swole and he's kicking up a storm. we're about to join our local Y so i can swim for exercise... normally we take a 2 mile walk 2 or 3 times a week, but since it's gotten cold we've totally fallen off. i can feel myself becoming less fit than i was a couple of months ago and that scares me... i think part of me feels like i have to prepare for birth like i'm preparing for a marathon!


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## eilonwy

I'm irritated by the holidays. This year, for a change, it has nothing to do ith the inlaws.


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## JustKiya

We don't celebrate the holidays, which lends to a VERY peaceful season.... I certainly enjoyed the time off, though.


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## NishaG

Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthymama2b* 
We don't celebrate the holidays, which lends to a VERY peaceful season.... I certainly enjoyed the time off, though.









:

Hello, everyone! I'm kinda new here, and I mostly lurk. Just wanted to say hi from Cali!


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## purplegirl

Welcome NishaG. It's always nice to have new members









My holidays were awesome, if not a little exhausting. I recently moved into a new home so my abode was the designated place to do everything. I enjoyed every moment, got lots of help, but it just plain wore me out.
I love it but purchasing an older home comes with many travails and can cost lots of money trying to update it. We had the entire downstairs painted because frankly, it was butt ugly. We have at least put our flair on the lower level, but it will take a lot of time to get the upstairs in order. I still have boxes of crap that I need to sort through









My best to all of you.

I miss Ericka. I hope she'll check in soon!!


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## purplegirl

I forgot to say Oyin products rock!! I'll be placing an order soon.







: Congratulations on your little one mama~~how sweet


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## jeca

Our holiday was good. We decided not to anywhere so that made things very peaceful. I have nothing new going on, nothing exciting I feel so dull compared to the rest of you.







Other than battling a cold. If I'm the one that's sick why is he the one sleeping in?


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## eilonwy

Because men are such wusses when it comes to illness that the illnesses of *others* make them weak and tired?







:


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## heyitstwins

Hey Ladies!

I can't believe I've bypassed this. Subbing...

Kinda feeling like an outcast lately, so I've been fairly quiet on the boards.

Peace to you all and congrats on all the new babies!!!!!!


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *heyitstwins* 
Hey Ladies!

I can't believe I've bypassed this. Subbing...

Kinda feeling like an outcast lately, so I've been fairly quiet on the boards.

Peace to you all and congrats on all the new babies!!!!!!

Hey. I am so glad to see you over here







:! Don't worry about feeling like an outcast--most of us here have felt that way too


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## heyitstwins

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey. I am so glad to see you over here







:! Don't worry about feeling like an outcast--most of us here have felt that way too









Thanks!!!

I'm glad to be here. Oh, but to live in 2 worlds....









We have come close to perfecting this art!


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## oyinmama

welcome, heyitstwins!!!


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## eilonwy

Poor ChibiChibi is all over me about homeschooling again (still?). Even my sister seems to be getting fed up with things-- she told Chibi, upon hearing of one particular (girl) child who is irritating her, that she should punch her in the face. "It's only a two or three day suspension if they call you on it, and she'll probably leave you alone after that."







: I'm kind of flabbergasted by this, you know? All Chibi says is, "Please, just let me go home with Rynna, I'll do anything, I can pack my bag in five minutes, just let me go with her. . ."







No matter how unappealing I try to make it sound, she knows it'd be better than school and she's absolutely right.







BizzyBug's been having problems in school as well, but hers are more related to her autism than to other kids.







Like that's so much better.









Mike is still unemployed, and we still don't know where we're going to be living at the end of the month.







I don't like thinking about it.







: It makes my brain hurt. Oh, and SeaMonkey is trying to escape.














Silly baby! He needs to stay in for a few more weeks. At least.







:


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## libraleoloving

hi guys. i'm new in these parts but i thought a mommies of color post is a good place for me to get started. first, because i am brown and second, because my particular pregancy issues seem to be particular to "us".

we're waiting a week to confirm what my symptoms suggest. however, in the meantime i am looking for all the info/support i can find about fibroids and pregnancy.

you can see my mini-backstory here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...8#post10311748 eta: link fixt

any suggestions about books/websites/support groups/etc in my endeavor to not have a myoectomy and a full term birth and healthy baby?


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## JustKiya

Libra - your link seems to be broken....







and I'm sorry, I am of no help with the fibroids issue....


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## splendid

Wow Rynna, that is a lot. Do you guys want to stay in state or would you be willing to move where the work is. I hope things start coming together for your nieces and that baby stays in a little longer.


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## AndrewsMother

Hello,
I am so pleased to have found this thread! I generally do not have time to do more than read, but I hope to post more in the future. I am a full time work and student mom and wife. My time is not really my own. I do hope to post more in the near future.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Hello,
I am so pleased to have found this thread! I generally do not have time to do more than read, but I hope to post more in the future. I am a full time work and student mom and wife. My time is not really my own. I do hope to post more in the near future.


Welcome *Paid!* It sounds like you have a busy life but don't stay in lurkdom! We love having new members.

*Rynna,* how are you? I wonder if you've had your little one yet and how things are with your living situation.


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## eilonwy

You don't wanna know. But no, SeaMonkey's still a SeaMonkey.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







You don't wanna know. But no, SeaMonkey's still a SeaMonkey.


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## eilonwy

Still in the same place, only slightly more urgently now. No idea where we're going, but the lease is up on 31 Jan.







: I'm trying not to think about it...


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## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

Sorry it's been so long since I have posted here.
I have been a bit under the weather and I have kept my online "habit" down to the bare minimum.
But I am on the mend so hopefully I will be able to post here more often.
It is so nice to see some new members join us here as well as the return of some members that I hadn't seen around MDC forums that I frequent in a while.
Thanks to all that kept this thread going.
Unfortunately, I have my son calling me to give him a hand right now, so I will have to come back later to finish my thoughts.

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


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## ajv

We are an african american family. we are older parents, professionals, politically liberal and socially conservative. our biggest challenge is staying afrocentric in our white rural community and raising kids with positive self-esteems.

anyway, i went to barnes and noble two days ago while my husband was "in town" on business and bot myself a mothering magazine as a treat. of course, i have read it cover to cover. i had forgotten all about this message board...i am not sure i would have know what to do, if even i knew about it previously. i havent seen the magazine in years. i was pregnant when we moved to colorado from new mexico and overwhelmed with life--had no time for magazines. anyway. i have two kiddos age 2 ds and 6 months dd, we breastfeed, cloth diaper part time, we are more AP than our parents, but not as much as alot of others. we plan to home school. i just started using mama cloth. i am addicted to diaperswappers.com

(sigh) sorry to be so wordy.


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## purplegirl

Glad you made it over here!


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## shayinme

Welcome. More later but getting dd ready for bed. I will add that as a sista in Maine which is hardlly a hotbed of diversity I can relate to the need for a tribe.

Shay


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## oyinmama

welcome, ajv!


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## eilonwy

I've just had the craziest two weeks... but i think we're on the mend now. I *think*.







: It's a very long story, though, and i'm only posting it once... so it's going in the blog.







Hope all is well with you ladies!


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## ajv

i read your story, praise God you made it thru that. it is so good that your baby can nurse without problems, sometimes we forget to be thankful for the little things. i am going to be tonite glad to be alive.


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## JustKiya

Rhynna - amazing!

Random thought/question that ran through my mind tonight - how is your hair done, tonight?

Mine is up airdrying in five fat braids after a rather strenous washing & combing session.


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## eilonwy

My hair's just in a ponytail. I'm about to take it out so that I can sleep half-way sitting up, in a position that's slightly less uncomfortable than the others.


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## purplegirl

Hey Rynna, I have been keeping up with you via your blog. Big hugs to you mama and congratulations on your new baby boy!







I hope life is a little easier on you


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *earthymama2b* 







Rhynna - amazing!

Random thought/question that ran through my mind tonight - how is your hair done, tonight?

Mine is up airdrying in five fat braids after a rather strenous washing & combing session.

I have locs at the moment its in a ponytail, one big messy one.

Shay


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## oyinmama

hey rhynna - wow you have had a really rollercoaster few weeks!!

i'm glad to see things are settling down again, and big congrats on yr new little boy - he's born on my bday so already he's cool in my book.









my hair today is in a set of large cornrows that are quite fuzzy and have no business, really, still being in.


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## ajv

okay i need some help, can you tell me is there something i should be doing so i dont have to scroll down each and every time to view this thread. is there a way for the most recent posting to be first? i am not very tech savy, so keep your instructions basic...thanks. ajv

my hair is all over my head, i go to denver next month and will have my cousin (who is a beautician) cut it short--much like the old halle berry, but at 300 pounds...


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## Sugarshoc

Rynna,

Your birth story was like reading an adventure novel. Whoa!!! I am soooo happy you are doing much better. Keep well girl.


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
my hair is all over my head, i go to denver next month and will have my cousin (who is a beautician) cut it short--much like the old halle berry, but at 300 pounds...









Yesterday I held my ChunkityButt niece for a while, and she was pulling my hair, making noises at it. Of course this made me laugh, because my sister wears her hair very short, a la Halle Berry of old these days.







Chunkity was just fascinated by my hair because i've got a heck of a lot more of it than her mother.









Bear is so sweet! I'm smitten with him.







I'm planning a slow day today... meaning I'm not getting out of bed for anything more interesting than the toilet.







Wish me luck.


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## Kia74

I've been MIA for quite awhile but I'm so glad that I found you all!

For those of you who don't know me I live in a suburb of Atlanta and am mom to a daughter who will be 5 on Sat and 3.5 year old boy. We were seriously contemplating a move to FL but have decided to stay here but hopefully will move into a bigger house in our neighborhood.

We were traveling a lot the past 6 months, first b/c of the possible relocation and then b/c the kids weren't in pre school. Now that we are settled it's time to think about a third baby, in preparation I've lost about 35 lbs. I've gotten pregnant heavier than I am now but would really like to loose some more weight before conceiving again. My husband is on board and since he was my eating buddy that has made a world of difference. Of course I'm mad b/c we're doing the same thing and he's lost more










Congratulations to all the new babies. Eilonwy, I'd still like 4 kiddos so I'll have to read your blog so see how you are faring. And oyinmama, I'm another thrilled customer. Geographically, we've been all over the place and my hair looks like it. Now that we're home it's time for me to order some more of your fantastic products. And that's not empty flattery







, I'm 99% I raved about your goods here when I first found them. Am glad that you found us!

I hope you all write and let us know how you and your families are doing,

Take Care

Kia


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## eilonwy

My little Bear

Life is completely and totally insane. I'm horribly depressed and things are very very complicated. I suppose it's mostly my fault, I've always had a tendancy to complicate things. I don't even know what else to say... things are pretty damned screwy.







The baby is cute, though. They're all cute, actually, but the baby is warm and snuggly and delicious.


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## purplegirl

Hey Kia. It's good to hear from you! How is Joey? Please send her my regards if you speak with her.

I am doing well. It seems all I do these days is work. I gotta schedule some time to play cause this is getting tired!

Rynna, I'd love to see pics of baby Bear. I added you as a friend on Facebook.

My best to all.
~Lisa~


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
my hair is all over my head, i go to denver next month and will have my cousin (who is a beautician) cut it short--much like the old halle berry, but at 300 pounds...

What part of colorado do you live in right now?

Congrats on your birth Rynna, sorry I'm so late. DH had another surgery last monday to correct something they messed up last july







. He's been a baby and I've been bit%$y otherwise nothing new here.


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## ajv

i live near la junta, i hour west of kansas/colorado border. no mtns here, just farms and cattle. one good thing about "green acres" as my family calls it. is my hubby drives to work (14 miles) and we have only one car, so most of the time i am clueless regarding the rise in gas prices. in our old life, i filled up our suv each week and would practically faint or cuss every time. he fills up every 12-14 days. we have been church shopping, we have two more churches to visit then we decide. it will be nice to settle down.

congrats on your weight loss to the mama trying to conceive.


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## jeca

I live north of you in the Springs, plenty of mountains here very few farms. Technically I live on the base but same area.


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## barose




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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 









Welcome Barose! Glad to have you join us!


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## FroNuff

Hey Lisa and Shay, I just noticed y'all are now mods/granola ambassadors! Go on wit' your bad selves!









Hi Kia, I remember you. Glad to see you're doing well.









Jeca, I hope that's the end of the surgeries for your husband. How are you and your kiddos doing?


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FroNuff* 
Hey Lisa and Shay, I just noticed y'all are now mods/granola ambassadors! Go on wit' your bad selves!









Hi Kia, I remember you. Glad to see you're doing well.









Jeca, I hope that's the end of the surgeries for your husband. How are you and your kiddos doing?


Hey woman







Thanks for the shout out







Yes, I am all *modified!*


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## AndrewsMother

Are any of you all living in Houston, TX?


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## ajv

hi mamas,
i went to denver for a week. visited the relatives (which was completely BEARABLE--praise God--long story, boundaries work). got my cousin to give me the "old school" halle berry hair cut (she is a cosmotologist). My hubby was at a convention and i ran a lot of errands. we were looking forward to getting back to our cornfield after one week in the big city.







:
one thing we did do was go to the children's museum. they have a excellent playground set that is like a pirate ship. so i have to drag my 2 yo past the play ground equip to get to the museum. (he is kicking and screaming b/c he loves pirates) inside the museum it is $7.50 for him to enter--more for me, free for the baby. so i say to myself, why am i doing this...i turn right around (without paying) and let him play on the playground equipment for over an hour for FREE. it was a great day, there were lots of kids (schools, etc...) So if you are ever in Denver with a preschooler i highly recommend the playground IN FRONT OF the children's museum. lol.

we probably found a church, it is small, they dont have a pastor, but one of the members is an extended breastfeeder who homeschools. She has eight kids (one is AA, adopted), will leave in 1.5 years to be a medical missionary in the Sudan with her physician hubby, but my husband says since she and i are so compatible we have to go to that church. plus one other AA family attends and they probably have the most non white members of any other church we have attended--still only a handful. they have playground equipment in back of the church that my son liked. He is a late talker, but i am sure his vote would be for this church too.


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## shayinme

Ajv, glad to hear that you have found a possible church home. I have been looking for 6 years here in Maine and am really starting to get discouraged big time. In 6 years we have gone to 7 churches, only one was a one time deal.. Two of the 7 were churches we faithfully attended for over a year at one we started the process of becoming official members but stopped when I could no longer longer put off the nagginng feeling that most of the members were not receptive to me as a Black woman.







No one ever said anything but after being there a year through a pregnancy and birth, I never went beyond hellos at church, I would see people from church outside (our town is only 16K) and people would never say hello or ignore me.

Pretty much at every church except for the non-denominational turned Pentecoastal church this has been the issue. (left that church when it was clear it was Pentecoastal)

A church buddy of mine from the Pentescoastal church has just found a new church home and we have gone several times and its the same old crap, actually a few weeks ago we went and they had the say hello and shake a hand period and the woman next to me blatantly went out of her way to bot shake my hand







:







. I left mid way through the service.

Honestly I am pondering going to the UU church because I have done community work with the UU's and they at least seem decent, not like all the churches I have gone to here. The only problem is that I am a born again Christian so doctrinally a UU church doesn't quite meet my spiritual needs but I miss fellowshipping with others. My only other hope for possible local church home is the locall UCC congregation, I have met the pastor and he seemed real, not the usual lets tame the savage ***** vibe I get from my most church folks our here. (guess my locs my scare folks







) Honestly its pretty dang discouraging. So I sit at home on Easter Sunday wishing I had a church home but will do something here at home to mark the day.

On to other things, both kids are home this week, my son is on springbreak and came home from his Dad's and the little one is thrilled to have her big brother home. My son is once again stating he plans to finish high school living with me, so if all goes well this summer he will be moving in.. it will be a battle, his Dad really wants him to stay with him, but at 16 ds IMO has a voice.

Finally reached my WW goal, took off 40 lbs, down a bunch of sizes though I am convinced someone is tweaking the sizes, when I was this weight before I was a 8, now I am a 6, I ain't complaining though.

Hope everyone is well, been so bad about posting over here too busy in Politics.

Just wanted to say hey Kia, glad to see you around here again, hey to FroNuff, yeah we are diversifying the place







, or as my dh said its official you spend too much time online these days.

Shay


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Honestly I am pondering going to the UU church because I have done community work with the UU's and they at least seem decent, not like all the churches I have gone to here.


There is a very nice UU church here that I have been wanting to visit for a while. They are always involved with community projects and I have read a few of their services online and it seems nice. I have to say that I am really put off by their lack of minority members. I have been to a handful of AA churches and I just can't understand why we need to "church" from 1030-3. It's just too long for me. My mother really wanted to me to a service today but I refuse to be one of those people that skip church all year just to show up on Easter Sunday.

















: Doesn't feel at all like Easter here when I have snow in my backyard.


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## ajv

Shay,
i am so sorry you havent found a church home. if i lived in maine i would go to church with you.







reading your post reminded me to ask my husband if it is okay if we attend this church but never join. he said yes. we have made a commitment as a family to go to/visit an AA church whenever we are out of town for the sake of our kids. I will pray that you find a Christian church were you can feel you belong.
our church hopping consisted on going to all the churches we have been invited to by strangers and friends...i do have to admit that when i meet liberal minded people i ask them if they go to church and where (like the caucus, dr. ofc, etc). our plan "y" was to go to a presbyterian or episcopal church that has a woman as the pastor (there are two of them in town). they are so so boring, but at least their christian and must have somewhat of an open mind to have a woman pastor. "our plan "z" was to go to a mennonite or quaker church--at least they have a history of being anti-slavery. we arent pacifists, but thankfully we havent gotten that far...

we loved the united church of christ congregation that we visited, but i dont agree about not being able to praise God with musical instruments. so it slowly moved its way down our list. we will visit there tho.

if you do find a church let me kno, so i can stop praying.

congrats on your weight loss, i have yet to start my weight loss journey. i have started aerobics one day a week--all i can afford time wise. my hubby takes off work early to watch to kids for 1 hour. i have been doing it for 3 weeks now. its a start. i have about 100 pounds to lose...but who is counting









happy easter.


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## purplegirl

Happy Easter to all who celebrate.
I, too am struggling with finding a church where I feel comfortable. I had been attending services with The Friends--Quakers. I really enjoyed it but I moved further away and it just takes too much time to get there. I have pondered visiting the UU church in my new town but have procrastinated. My neighbors invited me to attend their United Methodist Church. It is predominantly white, but very liberal so that might be a good fit for me. It is also five minutes from my house.
Shay, congratulations on the impressive weight loss. I am working hard at taking off 40 pounds. So far, so good. I have a thyroid problem which makes it extremely hard to lose weight even if I were to starve myself, it would be a slow process. Nonetheless, I feel good about my progress thus far.

Blessings to all of you.
~Lisa~


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
There is a very nice UU church here that I have been wanting to visit for a while. They are always involved with community projects and I have read a few of their services online and it seems nice. I have to say that I am really put off by their lack of minority members. I have been to a handful of AA churches and I just can't understand why we need to "church" from 1030-3. It's just too long for me. My mother really wanted to me to a service today but I refuse to be one of those people that skip church all year just to show up on Easter Sunday.
















: Doesn't feel at all like Easter here when I have snow in my backyard.

I had to laugh when I read this, as a kid we never went to church but when I was 17 my Dad went to seminary and became a pastor. His church services were about an hour and a half tops which in Black church time is brief. I do recall attending my Granny's church and man, the service was hours long..you needed to eat breakfast and pack a lunch and that's no joke.

Yeah, I have always found the idea of just showing up on Easter a bit funny, even here in white churches, church is packed on Easter.

There is a AA church in Portland but I am not fond of the pastor since I know him because he used to be on the board of the agency I used to run so just on GP I refuse to go to his church. They do have good music though.

Ajv, its interesting that you mentioned the episcopal church as that is nother one I am interested in looking at, a local one that a friend attends at one one point had a Latino woman as an associate pastor but I have never made it over there.

You woukld think with tons of churches thar finding a church home would be easy but its sooo difficult. The funny thing is that I am contemplating applying to seminary yet have no church home








.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

I totally do not get the idea of spending half the day in church. I grew up in a Lutheran church that was white. We had services for an hour and I left feeling fulfilled. I would love to go to church with my mom (methodist) but when they finish at 1p.m. they consider that getting out early! Does staying in church longer equate with being more religious? I don't think so! lol


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## eilonwy

I'm back. Meh.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







I'm back. Meh.

Hey woman. How are you?


----------



## eilonwy

:


----------



## Southern_Belle

Hi All,

Just wanted to pop in. I've been meaning to introduce myself in this thread but never got around to it. Timely that your current topic of discussion is chruches...

I currently reside in NYC...grew up in the South in an AME Church, and recently visited a UU Church. Asie from the lack of minority faces, I truly enjoyed the service. DH and I discussed whether or not we would go back b/c of the lack of familiar faces, and we had to do take an internal inventory of the reasons we were seeking this particular type of church in the first place and the answer was already decided for us.

Our child to be (Septmber - yay!) will definitely see a plethora of familiar faces (we both did as young ones - both growing up in areas where we were practically the only color in a sea of everything but) - but what is important to us, is a specific foundation for their nuturing and development.

Not to jump into this thread and raise sand, but I do want to pose a question or two...As Moms and Moms-to-be, what is it you are seeking in a church or congregation that would keep you from attending? Or what is it that keeps you in an AA church, even when you are not 100% fulfilled.

Just curious. 'm really asking because I have to be in that mindset where it's not just about me, but about my family, and I'm still getting there. Perhaps you'll put forth some things I haven't given enough thought to.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Southern_Belle* 
Not to jump into this thread and raise sand, but I do want to pose a question or two...As Moms and Moms-to-be, *what is it you are seeking in a church or congregation that would keep you from attending?* Or what is it that keeps you in an AA church, even when you are not 100% fulfilled.

Just curious. 'm really asking because I have to be in that mindset where it's not just about me, but about my family, and I'm still getting there. Perhaps you'll put forth some things I haven't given enough thought to.

Personally I would like to feel like I am spritually being fed, to feel like I am growing spirtually is really the key for me. Practically I want to feel it works with having a rambunctious 2.5 yo, in other words is it kid friendly. Also I want to feek welcomed not tolerated, that is something I have struggled with for the past 6 years in all the churches I have attended. I don't really care about whether or not its an AA church but I am sick and tired of being in the place where I have gone to the same church for over a year and despite trying to make connections, it doesn't happen. That deep sense I feel like I really am not wanted here







, that I can no longer deal with and that is part of what is driving me as a born again Christian to consider a UU church.. at least the members there treat me like a human.

More later since I gotta get dd down for bed in a few.

Shay


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## oyinmama

hi, lovelies.

uhm...

what does UU stand for??

*ducking tomatoes*


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
hi, lovelies.

uhm...

what does UU stand for??

*ducking tomatoes*

Hey woman. Long time no see on MDC. I hope you are well. UU stands for Unitarian Universalist church.


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## oyinmama

thanks so much, purplegirl!

yeah i haven't been online so much lately; things have been hectic as heck around here!! our EDD is the 24th so we're in the home stretch, but it seems there's just more and more things to do - getting ready for the babe, as well as lots of life changes occurring - the closer we get to the end.

hanging in there...


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## jeca

The reason I have thought to try a UU(also known as Universal Unitarian) is generally they are more tolerable of different cultures, religions and lifestyle preferences. I attended what I thought was a very nice Church once and one sunday service they started spewing about gay's and what they are doing to our "christian society", I left. My children were in attendance at that service and I won't have them taught hate of anyone. I believe everyone has a right to their own religion and lifestyle preference and it is not my place to shame them and I don't want my children taught it is their place either. I also need a place that's child friendly( nursery or youth ministry is great) and that doesn't last all midmorning to afternoon. I know that many churches have a strong stance against gays or other religions but I don't think it has to be "taught" or preached at a service. SO I guess I'm just looking for a place with my own views of to each their own and your way doesn't mean that you or I am wrong. A place that feels like we don't need to "save" everyone.
I also want to find a place that touches me. You ever been to that one good service and before you know it you were crying and not really know why but you just felt like your heart was touched? I miss that I want to find that place again. Maybe I'm asking for to much.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
thanks so much, purplegirl!

yeah i haven't been online so much lately; things have been hectic as heck around here!! our EDD is the 24th so we're in the home stretch, but it seems there's just more and more things to do - getting ready for the babe, as well as lots of life changes occurring - the closer we get to the end.

hanging in there...









Good luck mama! I am excited for you. Please keep us posted and let us know when your little one arrives


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## Southern_Belle

Thanks for the replies ladies!

I can honestly say I really enjoyed the UU service that I went to, but in a perfect world, I would definitely want to see more brown faces.

I thought it was interesting that at the service I went to, one of the things they mentioned was a goal over the next few years was to increase minority membership. I had a 2 fold reaction - one, I thought it was nice that they were not some insulated, either close-minded or completely unaware community, but two - I didn't want to turn into some poster child...but I loved the feel and "character" of the congregation...

We'll see what develops.

*@ shayinme and jeca*, good points. Feeling welcomed vs tolerated is crucial. And your sentiments on being "touched" in a service hit home.


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## ajv

well, its a cultural base, idea. the gospel music, the "inside" jokes, seeing other AA families struggling and making it. Business connections. i like the idea of my kids seeing AA of all ages and walks of life who love God. It definitely affects their self esteem...when they can immulate the teenage boy/girl on the drill team or see the deacons at the men's breakfast. in new mexico we were in church ALL DAY and we complained constantly...now i miss it soo soo much.

Boy, no church is perfect but i would get my personal spiritual fulfillment elsewhere just to have that cultural foundation for my kids.


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## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

The past month or so has been a particularly trying time for me and my whole family.
I have been away from the list for a while and I wanted to explain why.
In late February, we heard about the passing of two really great family friends on opposite US coasts. And I would like to share a little about each of them here.

Willie Allen was one of the "rocks of fatherhood" in my life.
He was(is) a true example of what it is to be a loving and caring father, grandfather, husband and friend. He was always there for his family and the larger community in Seattle. His community development plans, ideals and contacts are still being used all around the city by a new generation of civic activists some 40+ years after he started his life's work in the 60's.
He is being mourned by all who knew and love him. I personally will miss his sound wisdom, wonderful conversations, his great encouragement and his friendship for the rest of my life.
And even though he personally was not an unschooler, he encouraged
all of the people that he knew to bring the best that they had to
offer to the table in our community and to make it work for all of
us.
He was always encouraging me to follow my passions and he was one of
the people in my life that really respected the fact that one did not have to have a certain set of "paper credentials" to be an active participant in finding and implementing solutions in community life and in ones personal life.

Lisa Heyman on the other hand, was a radical unschooler.
She lived her whole life as a seeker/inspirer of JOY!
The light that she shared with all that she touched(and many of the "touched" never had the pleasure to meet her in person)is thing of beauty.
She gave so much to the unschooling community, particularly here in
the NE.
I always felt that I was one of the lucky ones to have had her as "real life sisterfriend", one that I could count on for support when I needed someone who would not let me doubt myself and/or our unschooling journey as a family.
She truly touched me in a way that few in my life have, always challenging me to go further, trust more, live fuller and to be present in all that my life has to offer.
But what I will miss the most about Lisa is the laughter. She just had a way of spreading the joy of life that was truly remarkable.
Even when we were discussing matters of a serious nature(she was very ill for some time before she died), she was always able to find a moment of joy, something that would bring a smile to your face during the conversation.
And because she was so joyful, strong and positive, we that were close to her did not see her death as a possibility any time soon.
So it was quite a shock to get the call the day she crossed over.
Her funeral was one that I think I will never forget. So many family and friends were gathered to share with her husband and daughters their love, sorrow and yes great joy in having known such a remarkable woman.
We are all still trying to be there for her husband and daughters as they try to continue their family's unschooling journey without Lisa's physical presence.
And I would really appreciate it if you would include all of them in your thoughts and prayers.

I am truly blessed that I knew both Willie and Lisa as good friends.
In these two friends passings, I have been once again reminded how
unpredictable and precious life is. And also how important it is to
live life to the fullest.
Thanks for reading my tribute to two great friends.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


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## ErikaDP

Hello Again,

This is to All of the New Members here:








*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*









I hope to see many more posts from you!









Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ShiningStar

Just checking in after not being around. I don't think I would have found it without a subscription (maybe there's a new thread?). I'm bad about lurking around without posting, but I'm mostly in the Toddler and DDC sections of MDC.

How's everyone doing? I hope this thread becomes active again.


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## Bloomingstar

Hi!

I just found you all and I have to go back and read some of the thread now but I just wanted to pop in. I have been spending my time in TTC and now in the Dec 2008 and Jan 2009 DDC (still figuring that out). Glad to meet you all soon!


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## Bloomingstar

I read a few of the older posts and thought I'd chime in









I was raised Catholic in New Orleans, which is still definitely a black church experience down there. Fast forward a decade and I am now a much more happily practicing Buddhist within the Soka Gakkai, a lay Nichiren Buddhist organization that I know you're familiar with. If you've seen What's Love Got to Do with It, then you know a little bit about my practice. I chant Nam Myoho Renge Kyo as my main practice and there's more to it, but we also do a lot of events together as an organization. When I first started practicing I was really happy when I realized that a lot of our smaller meetings are organized on the neighborhood level, so most of the people I practice with herein Brooklyn are other people of African descent from all over the place. Our organization is really diverse and I appreciated that so much when learning about a new spiritual practice and getting to know a whole new group of people. I also really like that there are activities just for kids and that a lot of focus is placed on youth. I am only just now expecting #1, but it's good to know there'll be something meaningful there for my kids.


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## purplegirl

Hey everyone! Welcome to our new members


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## Bloomingstar

Thanks purplegirl!


----------



## oyinmama

hi all - just posting a happy birth announcement - i'm a mama!!

his name is osei fysher and me and the hubster are just swooning. he was two weeks old yesterday and is the most delicious little bundle.

birth story link cross-posted from my DDC: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=883150


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## shayinme

Welcome to our new members! Seems we have been quiet around here but hopefully we will pick up soon. I will try to post a little later, life is crazy right now with work and since I am self employed that means little demarcation between home & work.

Shay


----------



## nnaemeka

congrads Oyinmama (and hubby) on Osei Fysher!!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
hi all - just posting a happy birth announcement - i'm a mama!!

his name is osei fysher and me and the hubster are just swooning. he was two weeks old yesterday and is the most delicious little bundle.

birth story link cross-posted from my DDC: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=883150

Congratulations Oyin! Many blessings to your family.








Again, welcome new members. It is always a good thing when we have new family in our tribe.


----------



## Brown Lioness

*coming out of lurkdom*








Greetings everyone! I like to lurk in this thread because for one i hope to be a part of it someday, lol.

I just wanted to pipe in on the home church search discussion because hubby and I are currently going through this. Tomorrow morning, we are going to visit a church I found online in our area and im kind of apprehensive about it. We've been searching for a TRUE church HOME since we've married and haven't really found it (moving out of state twice didnt help tho







)

I think, some of that has been that we've been lethargic in our search but in other ways its been the churches we've found.

We too have that eerie deep down feeling that we're not welcomed or something....its almost like we are encroaching (sp?) on a family reunion or something. You walk in, smile and look for a place to sit (being careful not to sit too close to the front or any good access spots as for fear of "taking someone's seat"), while possibley being greeted and/or smile or peered at by the church family already there. Usually, you are greeted pretty aggresively by the welcoming usher team because you are obviously new and they want to make sure they greet you, give you all the information welcome packets for the church, ask you a few questions about how you found them and to generally "feel you out" i guess.

Then after church, you usually get greeted again, maybe ushered into a welcoming room for all first time visitors to get more information, ask questions, get refreshments, etc. Or, you just kind of awkwardly smile at passerby church family as you leave.

Sigh, i dunno what hubby and i are looking for really. I guess we want that family feel. We want to be greeted and not accosted, lol. Welcomed but not grilled, introduced and not passed around for inspection, lol.

Above all, of course, we want to be spiritually fed. To us, anything after that is really our preferences, lol. I agree a lot with ajv that i would LOVE to be in a predominantly black church so that our future children can see all kinds of black folk loving God, but im not willing to compromise with fakeness and the psuedo-family feel.

I hope tomorrow goes smoothly, sigh.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
*coming out of lurkdom*








Greetings everyone! I like to lurk in this thread because for one i hope to be a part of it someday, lol.

I just wanted to pipe in on the home church search discussion because hubby and I are currently going through this. Tomorrow morning, we are going to visit a church I found online in our area and im kind of apprehensive about it. We've been searching for a TRUE church HOME since we've married and haven't really found it (moving out of state twice didnt help tho







)

I think, some of that has been that we've been lethargic in our search but in other ways its been the churches we've found.

*We too have that eerie deep down feeling that we're not welcomed or something....its almost like we are encroaching (sp?) on a family reunion or something. You walk in, smile and look for a place to sit (being careful not to sit too close to the front or any good access spots as for fear of "taking someone's seat"), while possibley being greeted and/or smile or peered at by the church family already there. Usually, you are greeted pretty aggresively by the welcoming usher team because you are obviously new and they want to make sure they greet you, give you all the information welcome packets for the church, ask you a few questions about how you found them and to generally "feel you out" i guess.

Then after church, you usually get greeted again, maybe ushered into a welcoming room for all first time visitors to get more information, ask questions, get refreshments, etc. Or, you just kind of awkwardly smile at passerby church family as you leave.

Sigh, i dunno what hubby and i are looking for really. I guess we want that family feel. We want to be greeted and not accosted, lol. Welcomed but not grilled, introduced and not passed around for inspection, lol.* Above all, of course, we want to be spiritually fed. To us, anything after that is really our preferences, lol. I agree a lot with ajv that i would LOVE to be in a predominantly black church so that our future children can see all kinds of black folk loving God, but im not willing to compromise with fakeness and the psuedo-family feel.

I hope tomorrow goes smoothly, sigh.

I totally can relate especially the parts I bolded, I am tired of feeling like I am being inspected when I go to new churches. I think living in a state like Maine its even more obvious to mme that I am being inspected.. black woman with dreads, white man, biracial kids, its like people see us and they grill us.. nah, so not into that.

So this morning I am contemplating checking out either the UU church or the UCC church.. we will see what happens.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
*coming out of lurkdom*








Greetings everyone! I like to lurk in this thread because for one i hope to be a part of it someday, lol.

I just wanted to pipe in on the home church search discussion because hubby and I are currently going through this. Tomorrow morning, we are going to visit a church I found online in our area and im kind of apprehensive about it. We've been searching for a TRUE church HOME since we've married and haven't really found it (moving out of state twice didnt help tho







)

I think, some of that has been that we've been lethargic in our search but in other ways its been the churches we've found.

We too have that eerie deep down feeling that we're not welcomed or something....its almost like we are encroaching (sp?) on a family reunion or something. You walk in, smile and look for a place to sit (being careful not to sit too close to the front or any good access spots as for fear of "taking someone's seat"), while possibley being greeted and/or smile or peered at by the church family already there. Usually, you are greeted pretty aggresively by the welcoming usher team because you are obviously new and they want to make sure they greet you, give you all the information welcome packets for the church, ask you a few questions about how you found them and to generally "feel you out" i guess.

Then after church, you usually get greeted again, maybe ushered into a welcoming room for all first time visitors to get more information, ask questions, get refreshments, etc. Or, you just kind of awkwardly smile at passerby church family as you leave.

Sigh, i dunno what hubby and i are looking for really. I guess we want that family feel. We want to be greeted and not accosted, lol. Welcomed but not grilled, introduced and not passed around for inspection, lol.

Above all, of course, we want to be spiritually fed. To us, anything after that is really our preferences, lol. I agree a lot with ajv that i would LOVE to be in a predominantly black church so that our future children can see all kinds of black folk loving God, but im not willing to compromise with fakeness and the psuedo-family feel.

I hope tomorrow goes smoothly, sigh.


Hi there. I am glad you came out of lurkdom. I've seen you around the board and have always appreciated your perspective on many things. I think you summed up the experience of trying to find a worship center quite well! I have more to say but breakfast is ready so I'll be back in a few.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hi there. I am glad you came out of lurkdom. I've seen you around the board and have always appreciated your perspective on many things. I think you summed up the experience of trying to find a worship center quite well! I have more to say but breakfast is ready so I'll be back in a few.


Aw, thank ya kindly, purplegirl, it is very much likewise with you also!









Ah, shayinme, you are familiar with the inspection at church too, eh? Today, with the church we visited (more on that later), when they announced the church's welcome to visitors, how come the minister on stage giving the welcome was straight looking at us, like we were the ONLY visitors there or something lol? Gotta love it.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Aw, thank ya kindly, purplegirl, it is very much likewise with you also!









Ah, shayinme, you are familiar with the inspection at church too, eh? *Today, with the church we visited (more on that later), when they announced the church's welcome to visitors, how come the minister on stage giving the welcome was straight looking at us, like we were the ONLY visitors there or something lol? Gotta love it*.

Omg. That is crazy but too funny the way you are describing it


----------



## jeca

Just a jump in to say welcome Brownlioness and Bloomingstar and Congrats to Oyinmama


----------



## Brown Lioness

Thanks for the welcome, jeca!









Well, the church we went to today will most likely be our home church, so i think our search is over, lol. We really liked it, we felt welcomed without being grilled and we just genuinely felt like we were being fed truth there.

So we got there and the early morning service was letting out so the parking lot was packed with people leaving and socializing. That was a good sign to us that people were talking to each other and laughing and not just tryna get the heck outta dodge, lol. We parked and walked into the parking lot and hubby asked the church's traffic controller person where we should enter the church and she was this beautiful older lady (black, this church is predominantly black) and after she told us where to go, she gave us hugs! I love hugs! lol

So we make our way in and the opening service prayer had already started so we had to wait a second before entering the sanctuary. The santuary was nice, it wasn't pretentious or anything, it basically looked like a smallish theater, with a stage with a holligram of the church's name on the back wall, and the seating was like theater seating instead of pews or benches. Hubby loved the fact that the arms on the chairs could move up and down (he's a big man, so he was dreading the possible uncomfortable seating).

Praise and worship was GREAT! Not a whole bunch of people begging you to praise, if you praised fine, if you just clapped and smile, that was cool, if you sat and watched that seemed cool as well (hubby did have to sit, he has a bad back). The praise team as well as the church family were in everything from jeans and a shirt to a suit, it just seemed people were mad comfortable, which we really appreciated (i wore a summer dress and hubby had on a polo and jeans with some shell toes on). I felt so comfortable, i took off my crazy uncomfortable heels and noticed that a woman on the praise team on STAGE had done the same thing!

There were lots of folks with nappy hair, locks, perms, braids, low cuts, and fros. Lots of women AND men, young and fairly old and children too! They do televise the service, so you could sit in the overflow room if you didnt want to be filmed (we didnt care lol).

The sermon was on point and the altar call was very nice. Everyone was just generally cool! After service, of course we made our way to the visitors reception and that went nicely too. We filled out our lil info card and snacked on brownies and donuts, while one of the ministers (who had a nigerian accent) greeted us. The pastor came down and greeted us (he's cool as a fan, he used to have long locks like us, he has a bikers community group and was wearing jeans today, very cool in our eyes, lol) and welcomed us to the church. It did get a lil awkward after the initial hellos cause it was like "Uh, what do we say now?" type stuff, but thas cool, sometimes it gets that way when you meet a roomful of new people, lol.

All in all, hubby and i really liked the church and will probably go back next week. YAY for finding our possible church home!!









I pray everyone in the search for their church home much success.


----------



## eilonwy

Ironically, I think I've found a church home for myself as well. And when we move back to Lancaster, I'll be able to go to temple as well... and isn't that spectacular?







I'm feeling pretty satisfied on the spiritual front today.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Ironically, I think I've found a church home for myself as well. And when we move back to Lancaster, I'll be able to go to temple as well... and isn't that spectacular?







I'm feeling pretty satisfied on the spiritual front today.









*Rynna!!!!*


----------



## ajv

hi everyone, i have been mia lately.

first the good news. we decided to attend a church. they dont have a pastor, just lay ministers until they find one... so if they get a pastor that is "out there" we may change churches. I like the quote from the sister :

"I guess we want that family feel. We want to be greeted and not accosted, lol. Welcomed but not grilled, introduced and not passed around for inspection, lol." (i dont know how to put the quote in...the post without cutting and paste-ing..some tech help would be greatly appreciated.)

anyway we dont experience this mainly because my hubby is a physician and the multicultural family we befriended is also a physician family so they kinda protect us from this nonsense...so we get introduced as Dr. Perry's friends, alot...in fact they canceled the monthly potluck and asked the Perry's to notify us...which was thoughtful. My friend Elizabeth said, can i just give them your number...i said yes.

now the bad news, my mom has triple negative breast cancer and started her chemo today. i refuse to say just "breast cancer" because it is such a different animal --triple negative breast cancer --it almost should have its own category. it is more agressive, non responsive to new treatments, and affects minority women more often. anyway, we had this sad, sad, shadow over our mother's day because of it... we did go to church with my grandmother though and we were thankful to arrive late and stay 3 hours!














truly thankful! it was a large urban black baptist church--what a blessing.

congrats on your new baby! anyone here looking for a weight loss buddy? (greater than 50 pounds)


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
congrats on your new baby! anyone here looking for a weight loss buddy? (greater than 50 pounds)









I'm sorry to hear about your mom. That's got to be scary.









I could stand to lose 50 pounds, but in all honesty I'd be very happy to drop 35-40. I'm very 'dense,' so while 50 pounds would still leave me 20 pounds overweight, losing 40 would get me into a size 8... and for someone with bones as big as mine are, 8 is *tiny*.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
hi everyone, i have been mia lately.

first the good news. we decided to attend a church. they dont have a pastor, just lay ministers until they find one... so if they get a pastor that is "out there" we may change churches. I like the quote from the sister :

"I guess we want that family feel. We want to be greeted and not accosted, lol. Welcomed but not grilled, introduced and not passed around for inspection, lol." (i dont know how to put the quote in...the post without cutting and paste-ing..some tech help would be greatly appreciated.)

anyway we dont experience this mainly because my hubby is a physician and the multicultural family we befriended is also a physician family so they kinda protect us from this nonsense...so we get introduced as Dr. Perry's friends, alot...in fact they canceled the monthly potluck and asked the Perry's to notify us...which was thoughtful. My friend Elizabeth said, can i just give them your number...i said yes.

now the bad news, my mom has triple negative breast cancer and started her chemo today. i refuse to say just "breast cancer" because it is such a different animal --triple negative breast cancer --it almost should have its own category. it is more agressive, non responsive to new treatments, and affects minority women more often. anyway, we had this sad, sad, shadow over our mother's day because of it... we did go to church with my grandmother though and we were thankful to arrive late and stay 3 hours!














truly thankful! it was a large urban black baptist church--what a blessing.

congrats on your new baby! anyone here looking for a weight loss buddy? (greater than 50 pounds)

I am so sorry to hear about your Mama, I am aware of triple negative breast cancer, I will pray for your Mama and for your family.









Finding a church home is so hard, glad this one seems like a keeper though I know all to well that when they change pastors, thaty can change everything. Speaking of churches we went to the local UCC church for Mother's Day and I liked it.. a little lighter than I am used to as far as preaching style, but the folks were genuiunly warm and there were other POC there which where I live is a big deal. In fact a Black Dad immediately walked up to us after the service to see if we wanted to do a playgroup sometimes, since his dd was just a few mos older than mine.

Ajv, I don't need a weight loss buddy since I am at the end of my weight loss journey, I made lifetime on WW last month after 2 years on the program. I lost 41 pounds, so I just wanted to say you can do it..









Things here are ok, ton of home improvements that need to be done and as always not enough money, so trying to prioritize as far as what needs to be done versus what I want done. LOL

Shay


----------



## xochimama

Can I join?









I'm Latina, living in New Mexico with dh, dd1, and baby on the way...







And missing my network of progressive WOC...


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Can I join?









I'm Latina, living in New Mexico with dh, dd1, and baby on the way...







And missing my network of progressive WOC...

Hi There!







Of course you join us. I am glad you found us!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Can I join?










I'm Latina, living in New Mexico with dh, dd1, and baby on the way...







And missing my network of progressive WOC...

Of course you can.. welcome to the group!









Shay


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends!

First things first:
To All of the New Members here:







*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*








I hope to see many more posts from you!









And now for my update:
Wow, it has been a really hectic few months! I have been traveling quite a bit, had a lot of over night guests stay at my home, had another one of my children graduate from college and I had my mother, daughter and my walking(now running) 11 month old grandson visit me for a week(boy, were we sad to see them go back home to Seattle). I also got to spend my first mother's day as a grandmother with my daughter(her 1st as a mom!) and with my own mother-it was really great!
I am now gearing up for conference season and for camping season.
In a few weeks, we will be taking our fifth annual African American Unschooling camping vacation and this year's trip is a return to the Grand Canyon(site of the 1st trip). We are all really looking forward to the trip, but the task of how we get all of our camping gear on the plane is keeping me up at night! It might almost be cheaper to buy duplicate items and gift them to my sister and her family(they live in Phoenix)because of all of the bag limitations and fees that the airlines are charging now.
I also will be speaking at the NE Unschooling conference this weekend and I am really looking forward to that too.
On the home front, we had a very large tree fall on our garage's roof the day after mother's day and we were so lucky that no one was hurt! If it had happened at the same time the day before, someone could have very easily been killed. We all counted our blessings! So now I am dealing with the insurance company and trying to find a contractor to do the repairs. Wish me luck!
I have so much more that I could say but my computer time is up. And I won't be posting online much in the coming few weeks but I still hope to come here to read all of your posts at least a couple of times a week.
Here hoping that everyone has a safe and happy Memorial Day weekend!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## eilonwy

Oh wow...I can't believe your grandson is eleven months old, Erika! Time flies!

I'm going to Wickerman Thursday. I'm very excited about it, and strangely greatful to Bear (who is unable to nurse, which enables me to do things like this, which are not child-friendly







). Should be a good time.

We're trying to wrap up the school year; the spring has been kind of a mess, what with me being in and out of the hospital and all the depressive miseries. We're also trying to find a place to live. I'm trying not to think too much about it... because everything will befine. Right?


----------



## xochimama

Just to chime in on finding a church: this was tough for us, too. DH (white) grew up in the Episcopal church, but I grew up w/ Mexican Catholicism-twelve years of Catholic school, in fact. Theologically, the traditions aren't so far apart, but from a socio-cultural belief standpoint, ay, there are major differences.

I just don't identify with the social conservatism of the local Hispano Catholic parishes. But the Episcopal church that we ultimately chose is so overwhelmingly white...







I see it as a real problem, and our congregation has been so damn slow to really make it welcoming for Latinos.







: It is really frustrating. On the other hand, I love that our church is so involved in social activism, very left-leaning politically, welcoming of queer families, not pushy at all about religion... they just can't seem to diversify.

Someday I hope to find the right balance in a church family. Occasionally I go to a local Catholic service, bilingual. The ones at the small rural churches here in northern NM often have a couple of lone guitars, too: grizzled old Mexicanos whose guitars are out of tune, but they are singing their hearts out to God... makes me a little







: This experience more readily satisfies the cultural connection I have to worship, which I just don't always get singing the Anglican hymns.


----------



## purplegirl

Wow. It's so good to hear from long term posters and new members.
*Ajv*, let me first say how sorry I am to hear that your mama is struggling with cancer. I am an eternal optimist and believe that there is always hope. I promise to keep her and your family in my prayers.
I can sure use a weight loss partner. I have gained twenty pounds in two months







. I mean wth is going on with me?? I am back to walking 3 miles four times a week and being mindful of every thing I put in my mouth!

*Shay*, congrats on your weight loss. It is inspirational to me









*Erika,* it is always good to hear from you. I can't believe your grandchild is almost a year old. I am glad no one got hurt by the fallen tree. That is so frightening. Peace to you on your journeys.

*Xochimama,* I think a lot of us can relate to the struggle to find a spiritual home that feels like home--socially and culturally. "Traditionally black churches" have lost appeal to me because of the religious dogma and social conservatism. That said, I feel they are an important institution because of the important role they have and continue to play in black communities/history. The closest UU church to me is very homogeneous but welcoming. I feel most comfortable in the Friends Meeting House where there is tremendous diversity, social action and acceptance.


----------



## ajv

hey, i am feeling better today. i found a weight loss buddy on another thread, she is from missouri. she says she is doing the 1000 minute exercise challenge that is on one of these threads too... i havent had time to get over there. my mom shaved her head and is doing okay with chemo (she has triple negative breast cancer). thanks for your prayers.

my 1st cousins were here this past weekend, so it was good to catch up...we committed to having a family reunion now that we are all adults-- it is our own responsibility to keep track of each other.

i have bid on some montessori books on ebay, i figure my son will be 3 in a few months, maybe i should start some homeschooling preschooling...who knows? i feel peer-pressured to do so much with him...that is the challenge of parenting for me, not competing with the woman sitting next to me at library story time. (laugh)















here in new mexico do you live, i lived in Albuquerque for 16 years--i miss it, especially the food.







:

that grand canyon trip looked wonderful (i am a lurker on aa unschooling). i cant wait until my kids are old enough to go on those trips...i love traveling.

it is hard for me to keep track of everyone's names, i am going to make myself a cheat sheet to keep near the computer.









ajv


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 














here in new mexico do you live, i lived in Albuquerque for 16 years--i miss it, especially the food.







:
ajv

I live in Las Vegas, New Mexico (the REAL Las Vegas, as locals like to say







). I was just in ABQ yesterday-took dd to the Explora museum which was amazing! I had no idea that the QueQue had such a terrific children's museum. And free parking.









Well, you lived in NM longer than I have: I moved here in 1998--spent a year in Roswell before heading further north... And yea, the chile is great... My pregnant tummy can't get enough right now.














:

Cristina


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## purplegirl

I loved New Mexico when I visited years ago. It was super cool to, wake up to snow and by noon, it was hot. It is beautiful country for sure!


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## Arike

Hey everyone! I just found out that I am pregnant on 5/22/08 and I am due October 15th!









So yeah I spent half of my first pregnancy not even knowing I was pregnant. It's a boy and me and DP are pretty stoked about it among the feelings of anxiety, fear, etc...

I just wanted to say hey to all the mommies and mommies to be of color!


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## eilonwy

Welcome, Arike!









I have to ask... how does that happen?! I've got four kids and even the first time, I was pretty sure early on... with the other three, I knew before the pregnancy test.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey everyone! I just found out that I am pregnant on 5/22/08 and I am due October 15th!









So yeah I spent half of my first pregnancy not even knowing I was pregnant. It's a boy and me and DP are pretty stoked about it among the feelings of anxiety, fear, etc...

I just wanted to say hey to all the mommies and mommies to be of color!

Welcome Arike. I hope you will share your journey with us.
Hey Rynna. It's always good to hear from you. Hope everyone else is doing well.


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## xochimama

Welcome, Arike!









In case you haven't found it yet on these boards, check out your "Due Date Club" in the "I'm Pregnant" forum... lots of info and support to be had there.


----------



## Arike

Thanks purplegirl and xochimama for the greetings and welcome! I will defintely check out those suggested forums!


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

I haven't been online much in the last month or so(and won't be online much for the next month or so!)but I wanted to say howdy!








I hope that everyone is doing well.
I also wanted to say to Arike:







*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*








I hope to see many more posts from you!








Well, that's all that I have time for now. I hope to come back soon to write more.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Welcome, Arike!









I have to ask... how does that happen?! I've got four kids and even the first time, I was pretty sure early on... with the other three, I knew before the pregnancy test.









Thanks everyone for the greetings and congrats! It's very shocking and I feel like my world is turning upside down and inside out but so far mostly everyone is really excited and supportive so that's been good. Just to preface this, I have polycystic ovarian syndrome and normally it is VERY difficult for women with this condition to get pregnant. My primary care physician was shocked but really happy because me being pregnant means that my body is healthy. I had absolutely NO symptoms up until maybe 2-3 weeks ago. No morning sickness or nausea. I have only gained 5-6 pounds. I am not really showing that much, just a little poochy belly. The only symptoms I have now is a varicose vein, frequent urination and the occasional heartburn(which only happens if I eat too much in one sitting, I have learned that for me, eating only when I am hungry and just enough to be satisfied but not stuffed is the best for me). I have been working out 5 times a week at the gym, lifting weights, doing intervals of running on the treadmill and spin classes. I also was rehearsing with the dance company I am in and we just had a series of 5 shows the first week of June and I pulled some LONG hours. All of this happening at 5 months. CRAZY! Anyway, I am embracing it all and just diving in head first! I am 23 weeks and me and my partner were in the middle of planning a wedding for next year when we found out. We are planning on having a small ceremony with our close friends at city hall with a nice dinner to follow. Next year we want to have a renewal of vows ceremony the way we dreamed of having our wedding. I never pictured we would have a little one running around at the ceremony! LOL!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey everyone! I just found out that I am pregnant on 5/22/08 and I am due October 15th!









So yeah I spent half of my first pregnancy not even knowing I was pregnant. It's a boy and me and DP are pretty stoked about it among the feelings of anxiety, fear, etc...

I just wanted to say hey to all the mommies and mommies to be of color!









Arike and a big Congrats on the baby.


----------



## purplegirl

: Happy summer everyone!


----------



## eilonwy

The summer is... entirely insane.







I'm working on it, though, and mostly having fun. Life with four kids is really difficult, especially when one is fettered (as Bear is, by bottles which of course must be kept cold or unmade... meh!). Hopefully things will get easier as life goes on. They do get easier, right?


----------



## purplegirl

It's so good to "see" you Rynna.







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

I haven't been here in quite a while so I thought I would pop in and say hello!
Lately, I have been spending all of my MDC time in the Politics forums. And let me tell you, being there is not for the faint of heart(or the thin skinned).
The members who post there are informed, witty, funny and very serious about this election cycle. It is a great place to get information about what's going on in the world of US presidential politics and it is also a good place to get your political questions answered(or at least, pointed in the right direction for the answers).
And my public service announcement for the day is that I hope that everyone here is registered to vote and if you are not, go first thing next week and register.
I hope that everyone is having a great summer, we have been enjoying ours here in CT.
Well, that's all that I have time for now. I hope that everyone has a great rest of the weekend.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## eilonwy

I was actually kind of impressed that there were folks out registering voters in front of WalMart yesterday.







I mean, on college campuses you can nearly always find them, but WalMart's where they actually *need* to be, you know?









Anyway, I don't visit that forum because... well, I have a sensitive tummy sometimes.














I'd rather become informed without the spin, and I'd rather not get worked up and angry because it's bad for my karma.


----------



## chanibell

Hey sistahfriends,
Just popping into say hi. I haven't been active here in a long while. Just curious to find out if anyone has been watching the Blacks in America series they are doing on CNN and what your thoughts or opinions are on many of the topics raised. One that intrigued me was more AA women are opting to stay single and wait for the perfect AA man than go outside the race.
blessings ladies~


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Anyway, I don't visit that forum because... well, I have a sensitive tummy sometimes.














I'd rather become informed without the spin, and I'd rather not get worked up and angry because it's bad for my karma.









That is why I have left MDC off and on over the years. Sometimes I just can't stomach the place sometimes. Nothing new to report here DH is trying to finish his degree and it's stressing me out. If he's the one in school why am I always proof reading, typing and researching?







My grammatical skills are greatly lacking but he asks anyway.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Hey sistahfriends,
Just popping into say hi. I haven't been active here in a long while. Just curious to find out if anyone has been watching the Blacks in America series they are doing on CNN and what your thoughts or opinions are on many of the topics raised. One that intrigued me was more AA women are opting to stay single and wait for the perfect AA man than go outside the race.
blessings ladies~


I missed the first half hour,







but DP called me in when they were interviewing an older woman who is struggling to eat right living in a community where there is little to no access to healthy food.

I think each topic discussed can be broken down into separate two hour miniseries! Two hours was not enough time.

The one the struck me the most was the discussion about the HIV rate among AA women and that one in 20 AA in DC are HIV +







I really had no idea that the HIV rate is so high in our community. I feel so clueless that I didn't know.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Hey sistahfriends,
Just popping into say hi. I haven't been active here in a long while. Just curious to find out if anyone has been watching the Blacks in America series they are doing on CNN and what your thoughts or opinions are on many of the topics raised. One that intrigued me was more AA women are opting to stay single and wait for the perfect AA man than go outside the race.
blessings ladies~


Hey girl!














t is always good to see you.

I tivo'ed the show and can't wait to watch it. Just as a quick note, sisters need to be open minded when choosing a partner. I have so many beautiful, professional, intelligent single friends who are waiting on the perfect black man to come along.
*Heck* my sister is bugging me to get to the mall. More later.........


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey girl!














t is always good to see you.

I tivo'ed the show and can't wait to watch it. Just as a quick note, sisters need to be open minded when choosing a partner. I have so many beautiful, professional, intelligent single friends who are waiting on the perfect black man to come along.
*Heck* my sister is bugging me to get to the mall. More later.........

ITA. I would still be single if I didnt branch out.

Though it saddens me that we are losing our brothers.


----------



## eilonwy

I dont have cable. So... how long before you think the salient points will be on YouTube?







:


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







I dont have cable. So... how long before you think the salient points will be on YouTube?







:

Good question! I have to miss most of tonight's episode. I hope they at least to a rebroadcast.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
ITA. I would still be single if I didnt branch out.

Though it saddens me that we are losing our brothers.









It is very sad from a lot of perspectives.


----------



## eilonwy

I must say, I'm kind of conflicted about the whole thing. Anyone care to discuss? I'm sure that I'll rub people the wrong way, but that's not my intent... two parts of it would have to do with something that we discussed aaaages ago on this thread (the fact that most of this group consists of a very elite group of women, and the antagonism toward light-skinned black people), and those in and of themselves can be very sensitive subjects.

(I'm kind of paranoid about sensitive subjects these days, as I have been accused of harassment simply for asking questions ...I feel the need to walk on eggshells.







)


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I must say, I'm kind of conflicted about the whole thing. Anyone care to discuss? I'm sure that I'll rub people the wrong way, but that's not my intent... two parts of it would have to do with something that we discussed aaaages ago on this thread *(the fact that most of this group consists of a very elite group of women,* and the antagonism toward light-skinned black people), and those in and of themselves can be very sensitive subjects.

(I'm kind of paranoid about sensitive subjects these days, as I have been accused of harassment simply for asking questions ...I feel the need to walk on eggshells.







)

Can you explain what this means? I honestly dont know.


----------



## eilonwy

The majority of the women here are elite --they're part of a minority within a minority. Their experiences don't reflect a lot of the most common aspects of "black life."







:


----------



## barose

OK. I _think_ I understand what you mean now.









I admit I shied away from this thread for a while because I feared I wouldn't fit in. For some reason, I returned yesterday. Ill try to read several pages to get to know some of you better.


----------



## purplegirl

Posting on the go....
Colorism is still very much an issue in the black race and it goes both ways. I was so hoping that by the time I had children (yet to happen) or when my nieces and nephews got older, it would be passe. It is not and it is so frustrating.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
The majority of the women here are elite --they're part of a minority within a minority. Their experiences don't reflect a lot of the most common aspects of "black life."







:

I need things spelled out for me sometimes so I would prefer you just say what you mean. No grudges, promise.







Are you reffering to the fact that some mamas on here are not married to black men? I did not see the show I don't watch much television.


----------



## eilonwy

Oh, not that at all.







No, it's more like... the demographic here is decidedly upper middle class. At least. I remember a few years ago we discussed home ownership in the black community, for example, and I was the only person who was renting.







Someone (Erika?) had brought it up because they'd encountered a news article which asserted that home ownership was a relatively recent thing for most black homeowners, and that it was still not terribly common. Most of the women posting here have college educations, something else which doesn't reflect the majority of black women in this country. Being married *at all* doesn't reflect the experience of a significant proportion of black mothers. In any case, all those things might come into play if we were to take a serious look at the issue of black women (and men) marrying non-black folks.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Posting on the go....
Colorism is still very much an issue in the black race and it goes both ways. I was so hoping that by the time I had children (yet to happen) or when my nieces and nephews got older, it would be passe. It is not and it is so frustrating.
















:


----------



## barose

eilonwy - Thanks for spelling it out for me!









I consider myself middle class or some people would even consider me upper. But, we rent. Our rent is $2400/mo because of our location though.

We are not married but we don't have kids. I don't think we will rush off and make it "legal" if I get pregnant. Maybe we will, maybe we wont, but I'm not attached to the idea.

I think some statistics that state that many black mothers (or mothers in general) are single doesn't take into account many _do_ have partners/fathers in the home with them. They just haven't said "I do".


----------



## eilonwy

Cohabitation certainly happens... but I don't think that counting cohabiting and/or commited couples as married would change the statistic all that much. I watched the first episode of Everybody Hates Chris when it was on a few years ago. One of the things I remember most vividly was the scene where Chris' father says goodnight. "I'll see you in the morning," he says, and then there's the narration: My father was one of four fathers on the block. He was never one for huge shows of affection, but when he said, "I'll see you in the morning," he was saying "I love you."

In other words... it's by no means a "new" issue, you know? When you take into account that choosing not to be legally married while maintaining a committed relationship tends to be seen as a "white" thing, much like homeschooling, then you can see that the issue is, perhaps, one of concern. I"m not sure, though... It's complicated. I have a lot of thoughts on it.

As to not fitting in here...







I worried about it too, but this is definately one of the coolest threads around.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

In other words... it's by no means a "new" issue, you know? When you take into account that choosing not to be legally married while maintaining a committed relationship tends to be seen as a "white" thing, much like homeschooling, then you can see that the issue is, perhaps, one of concern. I"m not sure, though... It's complicated. I have a lot of thoughts on it.


Good point.

When older black folks find out that we are "living together" - they cringe. Even my family is pretty silent on the matter; they just don't want to talk about it. _His_ parents (who are in their '80s) are happy for us! They don't care that we are not married. They just want grandchildren before they pass.









My older brother is the same way. He's been an in relationship for years with the same woman, but they are not married - no kids. But he is not really apart of the black community himself. Avid biker, following the Tour de France as we speak, rock bands, etc. I feel like somewhere along the line, we broke away from our immediate peers.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I do not post much, but this conversation is quite interesting.

I do not really like the term elite, but I know exactly what you mean. At the current time I am wokring in an environment that makes me question that state of the black community. My job is located in a surburban area that ir primarily African American. The families are low to middle income and I would say not very educated. That is the case for some, but not all. The children appear to be severly affeected by many circumstances, but it is hard to point the blame in any one direction.

I am not very sociable so I have yet to meet other A/A who are similar to myself and it is quite maddening. We have been in Houston for almost a year and what I see of the A/A community is not comforting. While do know many successful A/A in Houston, this city is so different from Atlanta where there are many areas where successful A/A live.

I truly feel as if I will have to completely assimilate into another culture to provide the right type of environment for my son.

I hope that I made sense to someone other than myself.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Oh, not that at all.







No, it's more like... the demographic here is decidedly upper middle class. At least. I remember a few years ago we discussed home ownership in the black community, for example, and I was the only person who was renting.







Someone (Erika?) had brought it up because they'd encountered a news article which asserted that home ownership was a relatively recent thing for most black homeowners, and that it was still not terribly common. Most of the women posting here have college educations, something else which doesn't reflect the majority of black women in this country. Being married *at all* doesn't reflect the experience of a significant proportion of black mothers. In any case, all those things might come into play if we were to take a serious look at the issue of black women (and men) marrying non-black folks.









Ohhh ok, well now I feel silly.







I'm not sure I remember that discussion it might have occurred during one of my periods of abandonment of MDC. We are probably middle class on the lower end depending on what describes middle class nowadays. Dh makes about $60,000 a year and yes we are married but we do not own a home yet either. Dh is finishing up his degree which will give us an increase in income sometimes next year. I never finished my degree but I did attend college at Tuskegee University before we were married. I think it also depends on your own family dynamics sometime people follow what they know or get stuck in a never ending cycle. My AA friends(not that I have many) are all married and also middle class families as were their own families. My would have been SIL came from a bad family back ground alcoholic mother not around father and now she has 5 kids of her own a husband in and out of jail and is typically low income as was her mother before her.


----------



## eilonwy

barose said:


> When older black folks find out that we are "living together" - they cringe. Even my family is pretty silent on the matter; they just don't want to talk about it. _His_ parents (who are in their '80s) are happy for us! They don't care that we are not married. They just want grandchildren before they pass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And my situation is somewhat different, because my mother is a white Jew. One of the first things to go when governments were persecuting Jews was the legality of their marriages, so it was not uncommon to have a couple that was married by a rabbi but did not have a legal marriage; THe children, then, would be legally required to have the mother's name (which is how you get names like "Malkovich," which means "of Malka;" Malka is a female name). As far as my mother was concerned, Mike and I were married when we moved in together, regardless of the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean... I suppose that there are similarities, but the attitude is very different.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> My older brother is the same way. He's been an in relationship for years with the same woman, but they are not married - no kids. But *he is not really apart of the black community himself*. Avid biker, following the Tour de France as we speak, rock bands, etc. I feel like somewhere along the line, we broke away from our immediate peers.
> See... it would seem clear that he's not part of the majority of black folks in this country, and that his experience doesn't reflect the average... but the question is, does that invalidate his experience as a black man? (This is where my eyes start to spin around in my head...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *piad*
> I do not really like the term elite, but I know exactly what you mean.
> 
> I just can't think of a better word for it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> I truly feel as if I will have to completely assimilate into another culture to provide the right type of environment for my son.
> THat has to be heartbreaking. I feel as though I'll have to create a culture in order to provide one for my children.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> I hope that I made sense to someone other than myself.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 

I truly feel as if I will have to completely assimilate into another culture to provide the right type of environment for my son.

I hope that I made sense to someone other than myself.

Are you saying that because the black dynamics of the town are not in line with your own? Or do you simply feel a greater pull towards one than the other? I mean I understand because you want the right kind of environment for your own child to thrive in and I think it's hard when we can't find that in our own community. I am not very social myself and my closest friends do not live in the same state as me so while we share the same views and dynamics our children are not able to grow from each other.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







And my situation is somewhat different, because my mother is a white Jew. One of the first things to go when governments were persecuting Jews was the legality of their marriages, so it was not uncommon to have a couple that was married by a rabbi but did not have a legal marriage; THe children, then, would be legally required to have the mother's name (which is how you get names like "Malkovich," which means "of Malka;" Malka is a female name). As far as my mother was concerned, Mike and I were married when we moved in together, regardless of the law.







I mean... I suppose that there are similarities, but the attitude is very different.


Well, NOW I have an explaination for it! DP and his parents are also white Jews. They dont care if they never see a wedding again.









In terms of my brother and his experiences, they vary over the years. His personal interests and hobbies changed and so did his friends. Growing up in the black community and attending black schools, he was always the "cool guy". Never had issues with anyone never got in trouble - just "cool" naturally. There was some jealously from some of his peers: he was/is handsome, 6'1" by the age of 13 (didnt grow after that







) and dressed really well - but other than that, we was always well liked.

He just kind of broke away from the community as his friends didnt share the same interests, lifestyle, and many of them going to jail or having kids at a young age.

Regardless of how many boomerangs he makes and competitions he's won, how much he bikes, and how many white friends he has (because of similar interests), etc he's is still a black man and will always be treated like one - at least in this country.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Are you saying that because the black dynamics of the town are not in line with your own? Or do you simply feel a greater pull towards one than the other? I mean I understand because you want the right kind of environment for your own child to thrive in and I think it's hard when we can't find that in our own community. I am not very social myself and my closest friends do not live in the same state as me so while we share the same views and dynamics our children are not able to grow from each other.


I am saying that I have not found an enclave of young progressive blacks in the Houston area. I lived in Houston as a child and the only time that I saw other blacks was at church on Sunday. I thought that things would be different for my son. I am anti public schools, and during my tours of local private schools I have noticed that there is a lack of blacks students. When I asked the administration I was told that very few if any black parents applied. I took a series of courses at one school where my son is a prospective student and not once during the 5 months that I frequented the school did I see any other black prospective parents.

Yes I am looking at the best schools in the city, but that should not mean that there are few black students in attendance. The majority black areas of inner city Houston are not for us to live in and that saddens me. I want to live near other blacks, but only in a safe and asthetically pleasing section of town. The majority black suburban areas are not appealing either.

I lived my life straddling the fence I thought that things had changed, but I guess not.

I want to surround myself with other blacks who are educated (and having a college degree does not make one educated, have morals and values similar to mine and enjoy similar activities. I get the blank stare and the you must be crazy look from the few blacks that I have come across. I have even been told that I need to lower my standards. According to some I must have had a privleged upbringing, but I can assure I did not. My single parent school teacher mother struggled, but we lived a decent life.

I must leave work I will post more later.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I get the blank stare and the you must be crazy look from the few blacks that I have come across. I have even been told that I need to lower my standards. According to some I must have had a privleged upbringing, but I can assure I did not. My single parent school teacher mother struggled, but we lived a decent life.









Lowering your standards would be like settling and I don't think(and I know you don't think that either) we as parents period should do that when it comes to our children. as it stands right now I have no black friends wher we live, not a one. I hadtow but they moved and I just haven't found any like minded mamas since. DH says it's because I'm anti-social my sister says it's because I give off a "white" vibe whatever that means.







I know what it means I've heard it all my life but it still seems silly to me.


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## barose

Speaking of black friends, I have one. I met her by chance at an organic cafe over a years ago. We were drawn to each other and have similar interests (spiritual beliefs that are NOT Christian, volunteer, etc) and though we don't see each other much, we write to each other everyday on Facebook.

Before that, I had none - not since high school.


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## ErikaDP

Wow Sisterfriends,

A person goes away for a few days and the thread comes to life with some serious issues!
Unfortunately, it is 2am here and I must sleep(just came in from a lovely evening stroll)so I will have to come back here in the later AM with my reply. Sleep well everyone!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Wow Sisterfriends,

A person goes away for a few days and the thread comes to life with some serious issues!
Unfortunately, it is 2am here and I must sleep(just came in from a lovely evening stroll)so I will have to come back here in the later AM with my reply. Sleep well everyone!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

I'm looking forward to it!







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Again,

First things first: Welcome back to all of the long-time posters that I haven't seen around these parts in a long while! And a big Welcome to all of the new members here!
Now, to comment on one of the topics at hand:
Rynna, I think that you confused my posts with someone elses. I am not the one who said that home ownership is a recent trend. As a matter of fact, I have many generations of home/land ownership in my family history and one of the points that I have made here at MDC repeatedly is that one of the most tragic occurrences brought about by Hurricane Katrina was that many of the folks in New Orleans that lost their homes were in houses that had been in their families for many, many years.
I think that many Black families prior to the 1970's owned at least some land(even if it was a many years abandoned farm in the south), but because of the great Black urban migration to the north in the forties, the images that we associate with Blacks now are almost exclusively urban.
Sure, I grew up in a urban setting, but my mother, grandmother and her mother all lived in homes that they owned(most had a mortgage at one time). And many of my friends growing up had the same history(as a matter of fact, usually when I go to visit friends, we always end up at someone's "big momma's house"). So I tend to think of the Black renter as a stereotype that may be true for some, but certainly not for all(or even most) Blacks.

I would love to post about the skin color debate and about Black couples/Black women but I am out of computer time and I will have to come back later to talk about those topics.
But I will say as a Black woman many years married to a Black man(whose parents have been married for 50 years), I always find conversations about intra/interracial relationships(especially marriage and/or parenting) fascinating. I will return here soon.

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
The majority of the women here are elite --they're part of a minority within a minority. Their experiences don't reflect a lot of the most common aspects of "black life."







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Oh, not that at all.







No, it's more like... the demographic here is decidedly upper middle class. At least. I remember a few years ago we discussed home ownership in the black community, for example, and I was the only person who was renting.







Someone (Erika?) had brought it up because they'd encountered a news article which asserted that home ownership was a relatively recent thing for most black homeowners, and that it was still not terribly common. Most of the women posting here have college educations, something else which doesn't reflect the majority of black women in this country. Being married *at all* doesn't reflect the experience of a significant proportion of black mothers. In any case, all those things might come into play if we were to take a serious look at the issue of black women (and men) marrying non-black folks.









I don't have a lot of time but I did want to respond to these 2 comments, I guess they hit me on a visceral level. I may now be middle-class by virtue of education/income but I did not start life that way at all.

I was born in the county hospital aka the free hospital, my folks never owned a house, for the most part my folks were not middle class, they were times we were eating gubment cheese and butter. That said, like many Black families they always told us kids to stay in school, blah blah. While I did drop out of HS I did later go to college.

I say all this to say that for many Black folks that may seem "elite" many of us are one generation removed from poverty and know it well. One whole side of my family was raised on the most notorious housing projects in the US and still live in section 8 today.

For those like me, I see us a straddlers, one foot in the old world and 1 foot in this new middle class existence and at times its makes for a pretty schizophrenic existence.

I can't say that home ownership is new to Blacks, there have always been folks in my family with a piece of land, I think its been through urban migration that Blacks lost property.

More later...

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 

Speaking of black friends, I have one. I met her by chance at an organic cafe over a years ago. We were drawn to each other and have similar interests (spiritual beliefs that are NOT Christian, volunteer, etc) and though we don't see each other much, we write to each other everyday on Facebook.

Before that, I had none - not since high school.

I too have not had a friend since high school and neither she nor I had anything in common. We still communicate with one another today, but she and I are not close. Evenin high school I never told her my true feelings. Even today she will tell me that I am the smartest person that I know and that past mistakes do not matter, but we can't just sit down and reveal our inner self because she would not understand. My family did not approve of our relationship then and I know that they would not now. My family has a high standard of conduct that I sometimes feel as if I can't live up to.

As I type I can maybe realize why a black man with similar upbrining might have a hard time finding a black wife if I can't even find the right black friend. Interracial marriage is quite common in my family and I have never gievn it a thought until right now.

My husband is my best friend and to be honest he and I have very little in common. We are cohorts, but our childhoods were not similar in anyway. When I was younger my mother and other family members always cautioned us against being common. His family is exactly that. Fortunately he is open to change (more so than I) and ready to embrace a different lifestlye. There are times when I shake head in wonder. If he were not so loving and wonderful I would truly wonder if my family would look down on him because of his upbringing.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 







Lowering your standards would be like settling and I don't think(and I know you don't think that either) we as parents period should do that when it comes to our children. as it stands right now I have no black friends wher we live, not a one. I hadtow but they moved and I just haven't found any like minded mamas since. DH says it's because I'm anti-social my sister says it's because I give off a "white" vibe whatever that means.







I know what it means I've heard it all my life but it still seems silly to me.

I have heard both of the above comments all of my life. I am not antisocial, but I do exude an air of determination and self assurance that I have been told comes off as arrogance. I am very confident in my abilities and always have been. A friend in Atlanta tells me that I was one of those smart children who ran off friends because I knew too much. Perhaps she is correct. I do rememeber dumbing myself down once I entered public school in an attempt to garner friends. That I soon realized was nonsense, but not before my G.P.A declined and I realized that I was destined to be lonely for the rest of my high school career.

Please forgive all typographical errors. I have begun to post twice before and both times my 2 year old erased the screen. I am not being a parent today. He is sitting in my bed watching Annie for the 2nd time. I am tired, frustrated and stuck at home with no car in the hottest city in the world. Well atleast that is how it feels to me.

I truly hope to connect with someone here because an online friend or support network can be just as beneficial as a local relationship.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I don't have a lot of time but I did want to respond to these 2 comments, I guess they hit me on a visceral level. I may now be middle-class by virtue of education/income but I did not start life that way at all. {snip}

I say all this to say that for many Black folks that may seem "elite" many of us are one generation removed from poverty and know it well.









Very true, and very relevant. Thank you for making me feel less alone.














Personally, I think the awareness is very important, because it encourages us to cultivate identities which have nothing to do with economic status or even formal education. It does radically alter our perceptions, though-- not only where we are, but where we're coming from.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
My family has a high standard of conduct that I sometimes feel as if I can't live up to.

As I type I can maybe realize why a black man with similar upbrining might have a hard time finding a black wife if I can't even find the right black friend. Interracial marriage is quite common in my family and I have never gievn it a thought until right now.

My husband is my best friend and to be honest he and I have very little in common. We are cohorts, but our childhoods were not similar in anyway. When I was younger my mother and other family members always cautioned us against being common. His family is exactly that. Fortunately he is open to change (more so than I) and ready to embrace a different lifestlye. There are times when I shake head in wonder. If he were not so loving and wonderful I would truly wonder if my family would look down on him because of his upbringing.

Well, I am the product of an interracial relationship.







The little family history I have on my father's side indicates that it happened, but not constantly. My father himself... well, let's put it this way. When my grandmother was sober, my grandfather was the man she'd been married to when my father was born (tall, thin, very dark skinned black man). When she was drunk, he was a white fellow from a neighboring town.







My father has two older siblings who are both over six feet tall (his sister is 6'2") and fairly dark skinned. My father himself was 5'6", tops, had hazel-green eyes and light brown hair. His skin was probably three shades darker than mine.







Yeah, pretty much.









My husband is white. My brother's first wife was half mexican and half white (very very pale skin, very dark hair); His second wife is black. My sister has three children by two different men, both of whom were black. They're all "interracial relationships," though, unless we start dating each other (SO not happening







).


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## purplegirl

Just popping in before I take off for vacation. My family is traveling to Martha's Vineyard for the week--talk about the mecca of black upper middle class. I am enjoying this conversation but time doesn't allow me to write more. I will upon my return next Saturday!
Let's keep it going mamas!


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## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just popping in before I take off for vacation. My family is traveling to Martha's Vineyard for the week--talk about the mecca of black upper middle class. I am enjoying this conversation but time doesn't allow me to write more. I will upon my return next Saturday!
Let's keep it going mamas!

Interesting - because I have never been in the company of upper middle class AA before. Maybe at the SF Symphony, or opera but it was usually an older person or couple.

Strange, now that I think about it. It might because of my location: all of the places that we vacationed here in California: La Jolla, Sea Ranch, Big Sur, Santa Barbabra, it was pretty hard to find another black person there. When we went to Sea Ranch a few weeks ago, I was tickled pink to see TWO black _couples_ on two different occasions.


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## ishereal

I'm here ladies!!!!!!!!!


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## ErikaDP

I'm back! And I will use the following quote to re-start the conversation:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just popping in before I take off for vacation. My family is traveling to Martha's Vineyard for the week--talk about the mecca of black upper middle class. I am enjoying this conversation but time doesn't allow me to write more. I will upon my return next Saturday!
Let's keep it going mamas!

Interesting - because I have never been in the company of upper middle class AA before. Maybe at the SF Symphony, or opera but it was usually an older person or couple.

Strange, now that I think about it. It might because of my location: all of the places that we vacationed here in California: La Jolla, Sea Ranch, Big Sur, Santa Barbabra, it was pretty hard to find another black person there. When we went to Sea Ranch a few weeks ago, I was tickled pink to see TWO black _couples_ on two different occasions.









I read the above exchange and I thought to myself that I am on both sides of the conversation. We have been seen as elite by others in many situations and we have looked for more POC at cultural events/vacations/activities that we have participated in.
The funny thing about stepping out of one's "cultural" comfort zone is that someone will be the first/few to do so and at times, being the one who is doing it come with the price of feeling isolated.
But because of where I grew up, I don't feel as isolated as I might feel if I grew up in a more homogeneous area.
You see, my husband and I both grew up in Seattle in what would be called middle class neighborhoods(they are both now considered upper middle class neighborhoods)that had plenty of upwardly mobile people of color(both of the neighborhoods that we grew up in were/are very diverse). They both had/have solid tax bases, good schools and many local public/private services(banks, supermarkets, libraries, retail shops, etc). And after living on the East coast for 8+ years and seeing the great differences between the way that we grew up in Seattle and the way many areas in the east are so segregated by race/ethnicity and class, I now have come to recognize that we did grow up in a "elite" environment(although at the time, it didn't feel like it) and because of that upbringing we view the world in a very different way than many of the Blacks that we have met that have grown up here. And that difference sometimes makes it hard to connect with folks.
Because I grew up in a very diverse neighborhood, I participate in activities that aren't typically associated with urban Blacks(camping, snow skiing, hiking etc)and I have a very diverse palate(even though I am a very picky eater) so you will find me eating foods that come from many different cultural traditions.
I also have a comfort level around different people that makes many of my new friends here uncomfortable. They much prefer to keep certain folks at arms length, only getting to know them on a superficial level(many of my friends here had never been in each other houses)and for me, that would be unheard of.
I am pretty much a "what you see is what you get" kind of person with every one I meet and I don't have a "Black Erika" and a "Bland Erika" that I switch between and that is something else that makes some here think twice about me too.
And then I have to add that some of my Black friends here are first or second generation Americans so their perspective is even more complex.

Wow, just reading this post is making my head swim! I don't even think that it makes a lot of sense! I might have to come back and make some edits later, but for now I will leave it be.

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ajv

i havent posted in a while, plus i need to do some housework. i have only just skimmed the latests posts. i find it so so interesting that everyone is so apologetic about being elite. everyone has their "my life was hard before now" or "everyone in my family didnt have it this good" story.

well, i admit it. i am elite. forget my past, or my family's past. right now,TODAY i am elite. that is why i subscribe to this thread, b/c i am in need the company of some women who are also elite but not necessarily white. i thank God for what i have been blessed with, and i will tell you nothing to downplay my blessings. (not today anyway). i love my poor brothers and sisters (literally and figuratively), i try to identify with them, but i kno our lives are completely different.

we elite people need others of all social economic levels in our circles. my hubby is a physican and he was working with a nurse at a rural clinic (part of a large medical group.) she was a young woman from our church who went on to nursing school after high school. she said to him, "i used to dream about working with you when i was younger"...he was shocked, he didnt even kno she was interested in medicine or observing him. she has since gone on to become a nurse midwife. but my point is that we need a variety not just ethnic variety, but also economic variety so that we can all succeed.

it reminds me of that criticism of Obama earlier in the campaign--he was an elitist--well, of course, you dont go to Harvard law school to be a populist. Plus, i think he has been the poorest person running for president in quite a while...but i digress. i also tivo'd the cnn series and cant wait to see it.

aj in colorado


----------



## barose

ajv - I think for some people in some situations, they dont want to give the impression that something was "handed" to them, that they didnt come from "old money", had to pay for college and so on. Not that having anything handed to them is a bad thing either.

You're right, today is today and we should embrace what we have.


----------



## barose

So much to talk about here!

So yesterday, we threw my grandmother a surprise birthday party. We got together with relatives who I haven't seen in years or at all. We are a small family (40 at the MOST) but we are not very close. It was a nice small family reunion/b-day party.

Since most of my friends are not black, I don't experience this very often, but yesterday I was bombarded with "good hair" comments. I guess I'm the only one besides my grandmother who has 3b/3c (don't really know which - doesn't matter). I mean it was a HUGE deal.







Its 2008 and I was stunned that this is still an issue. Most of my family is college educated, half are entrepreneurs - there is a pretty wide range of lifestyles, but the "good hair" thing lives on even with the guys.

I don't even know how to respond. I guess I was in shock. I said "thank you" because my hair IS good, but not any better than my mother who has 4b hair. Its good in the way that ALL black hair or all hair for that matter is good as long as its healthy.

Does anyone deal with this? Does it bother you? How do you respond?


----------



## sunshinestarr

Oh, oh, I didn't know about this tribe!! I'd love to join!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Interesting - because I have never been in the company of upper middle class AA before. Maybe at the SF Symphony, or opera but it was usually an older person or couple.

Strange, now that I think about it. It might because of my location: all of the places that we vacationed here in California: La Jolla, Sea Ranch, Big Sur, Santa Barbabra, it was pretty hard to find another black person there. When we went to Sea Ranch a few weeks ago, I was tickled pink to see TWO black _couples_ on two different occasions.









My church life and my family life was made up of middle and upper middle class blacks and I miss the community. I delight in seeing successful Black Americans, it makes me proud of my race, proud to be me and it encourages me to push myself and my family harder.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
I'm back! And I will use the following quote to re-start the conversation







read the above exchange and I thought to myself that I am on both sides of the conversation. We have been seen as elite by others in many situations and we have looked for more POC at cultural events/vacations/activities that we have participated in.
The funny thing about stepping out of one's "cultural" comfort zone is that someone will be the first/few to do so and at times, being the one who is doing it come with the price of feeling isolated.
But because of where I grew up, I don't feel as isolated as I might feel if I grew up in a more homogeneous area.
You see, my husband and I both grew up in Seattle in what would be called middle class neighborhoods(they are both now considered upper middle class neighborhoods)that had plenty of upwardly mobile people of color(both of the neighborhoods that we grew up in were/are very diverse). They both had/have solid tax bases, good schools and many local public/private services(banks, supermarkets, libraries, retail shops, etc). And after living on the East coast for 8+ years and seeing the great differences between the way that we grew up in Seattle and the way many areas in the east are so segregated by race/ethnicity and class, I now have come to recognize that we did grow up in a "elite" environment(although at the time, it didn't feel like it) and because of that upbringing we view the world in a very different way than many of the Blacks that we have met that have grown up here. And that difference sometimes makes it hard to connect with folks.
Because I grew up in a very diverse neighborhood, I participate in activities that aren't typically associated with urban Blacks(camping, snow skiing, hiking etc)and I have a very diverse palate(even though I am a very picky eater) so you will find me eating foods that come from many different cultural traditions.

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

The neighborhood that you grew up in sounds wonderful. The neighborhood in which we currently reside is racially diverse except for the fact that there are very very very few blacks.

I have a friend who laughs at me because I seek out black doctors, black dentists, black optometrists, etc, etc, especially those that have nice practices. Maybe I am asking too much, but how hard would it be to have an enclave of professional blacks at my service.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
i havent posted in a while, plus i need to do some housework. i have only just skimmed the latests posts. i find it so so interesting that everyone is so apologetic about being elite. everyone has their "my life was hard before now" or "everyone in my family didnt have it this good" story.


I think that I don't like the term because the past few years of my life have not felt elite at all. Yes I will attend medical school within a few years and my family is comprised of individuals with college degrees. Most have advanced degrees. My greatgrandparents graduated from college and were not enslaved on one side of my family so I guess that they were considered elite. I feel so far removed from my family, that I just can't even feel elite. I have an Uncle is is always saying that "we did not come from junk, so don't forget that". Right now I really need to grasp a hold of his words and hold them dear.

You are right there is *nothing* wrong with being elite, I just got knocked off of my pedestal by life and I am working to get back there.

Sorry for rambling, but I have not had anyone to really talk to in a long time.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
[I don't even know how to respond. I guess I was in shock. I said "thank you" because my hair IS good, but not any better than my mother who has 4b hair. Its good in the way that ALL black hair or all hair for that matter is good as long as its healthy.

Does anyone deal with this? Does it bother you? How do you respond?

Wow!!! I had a child say that to me the other day and I was astounded. I have had those words directed towards me most of my life and it is quite embarrassing. I forget at times that people still use the term good hair and bad hair with regard to texture. I generally only hear the phrase when I visit family is Mississippi.

My hair is wavy/curly and somewhat thick, but very unmanageable. There is nothing good about my hair. My hair could not even be described as pretty because it does not behave and it draws up when exposed to humidity.

Now my cousin, she has good hair. It is thick and coarse and very healthy. When done in any style her hair looks magnificent.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Wow!!! I had a child say that to me the other day and I was astounded. I have had those words directed towards me most of my life and it is quite embarrassing. I forget at times that people still use the term good hair and bad hair with regard to texture. I generally only hear the phrase when I visit family is Mississippi.

My hair is wavy/curly and somewhat thick, but very unmanageable. There is nothing good about my hair. My hair could not even be described as pretty because it does not behave and it draws up when exposed to humidity.

Now my cousin, she has good hair. It is thick and coarse and very healthy. When done in any style her hair looks magnificent.

The crazy thing is, except for my grandparents, 90% of my family on my mothers side is born and raised in California. The rest was raised in Germany and Alaska (NONE from down south).


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
i havent posted in a while, plus i need to do some housework. i have only just skimmed the latests posts. i find it so so interesting that everyone is so apologetic about being elite. everyone has their "my life was hard before now" or "everyone in my family didnt have it this good" story.

well, i admit it. i am elite. forget my past, or my family's past. right now,TODAY i am elite. that is why i subscribe to this thread, b/c i am in need the company of some women who are also elite but not necessarily white. i thank God for what i have been blessed with, and i will tell you nothing to downplay my blessings. (not today anyway). i love my poor brothers and sisters (literally and figuratively), i try to identify with them, but i kno our lives are completely different.

we elite people need others of all social economic levels in our circles. my hubby is a physican and he was working with a nurse at a rural clinic (part of a large medical group.) she was a young woman from our church who went on to nursing school after high school. she said to him, "i used to dream about working with you when i was younger"...he was shocked, he didnt even kno she was interested in medicine or observing him. she has since gone on to become a nurse midwife. but my point is that we need a variety not just ethnic variety, but also economic variety so that we can all succeed.

it reminds me of that criticism of Obama earlier in the campaign--he was an elitist--well, of course, you dont go to Harvard law school to be a populist. Plus, i think he has been the poorest person running for president in quite a while...but i digress. i also tivo'd the cnn series and cant wait to see it.

aj in colorado

Hi Aj,

My only problem with the "elite"term is that it creates yet another barrier between folks. Just like the earlier terms "uppity" and "talented tenth" did. And I am all about bring down barriers!
But yes, my family is what many here would term elite-I am a SAHM unschooling my last child(a 15yr old DS), we live in a upper middle class suburban town in CT and my husband is employed in a white collar position that sustains our family.
We have 3 adult children who all pretty successful and we are at a point in our lives were we are thinking about our next big adventure-life after kids!
Even having said that, we still have economic worries, especially when it come to thinking about our children's futures. But I still know how truly blessed we all are.

So I'll finish this post by saying thank you for your perspective Aj! You had me think about how we should be "loud and proud" of our place in this life. Especially if it helps someone else see that there are many choices/chances to live any kind of life that you choose.

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hi Aj,

My only problem with the "elite"term is that it creates yet another barrier between folks. Just like the earlier terms "uppity" and "talented tenth" did. And I am all about bring down barriers!

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

I agree with this, I do feel terms like elite really do create barriers when especially as POC we don't need anymore barriers.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
ajv - I think for some people in some situations, they dont want to give the impression that something was "handed" to them, that they didnt come from "old money", had to pay for college and so on. Not that having anything handed to them is a bad thing either.

You're right, today is today and we should embrace what we have.

Exactly.







For me personally while I can't say nothing was giving to me, I had a lot of folks along the way who helped me but I also worked hard. I didn't come from old money, yes there are segments of my family with money but none really ever reached me. So personally I do like to make that distinction because 16-17 years ago I was on state benefits and its taken a lot to move from being a teenage mom/hs dropout to who I am now.

All in all though I do try to live in the moment.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

texting from my phone so it will be short-- you should visit the vineyard. it really is the place where upper middke to extremely wealthy black folk been coming for years! it is incredible. i am certain shay and ericka can speak more on it. i grew up in the black upper mid class and have lots of thoughts about that status.. cant go into it right no but i will later upon my return.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Interesting - because I have never been in the company of upper middle class AA before. Maybe at the SF Symphony, or opera but it was usually an older person or couple.

Strange, now that I think about it. It might because of my location: all of the places that we vacationed here in California: La Jolla, Sea Ranch, Big Sur, Santa Barbabra, it was pretty hard to find another black person there. When we went to Sea Ranch a few weeks ago, I was tickled pink to see TWO black _couples_ on two different occasions.


----------



## Valid28

Hi everyone, I'd like to join in here. I am a woman of color, married with one child. I often feel like I don't fit in anywhere. I went to college for two years but never did finish my degree. I have worked a regular boring job, so no career for me. But I love to mingle with people of all types. Most of my friends are professionals and I often feel like a bit of a loser because I didn't finish my degree. I don't feel like a member of the elite because of this. At the same time I fully own who I am as woc but hate that often I feel left out because my tastes and choices aren't always mainstream black America. I hope I made some sense. Anyway, I just wanted to join in the conversation.

Shanese


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Valid28* 
Hi everyone, I'd like to join in here. I am a woman of color, married with one child. I often feel like I don't fit in anywhere. I went to college for two years but never did finish my degree. I have worked a regular boring job, so no career for me. But I love to mingle with people of all types. Most of my friends are professionals and I often feel like a bit of a loser because I didn't finish my degree. I don't feel like a member of the elite because of this. At the same time I fully own who I am as woc but hate that often I feel left out because my tastes and choices aren't always mainstream black America. I hope I made some sense. Anyway, I just wanted to join in the conversation.

Shanese

Welcome!

A degree is not the be all end all. It HELPS and it is useful especially if you're going into a specialized field, but it's not the end of the world. I didn't finish mine and DP doesn't have one either. That doesn't keep us out of the middle class income bracket though. DP is self-made entrepreneur so that is very helpful because at age 50 without a degree, and haven't worked for anyone else in 20 years, who would hire him )no matter how youthful he is.







) He went to school for a while, but wasn't the college type and didn't finish.

We do feel like outcasts among our degreed friends, but its just a temporary feeling - especially when at parties. I felt a little left out yesterday when meeting with cousins who are in law and medical school. It's just not my path though.

You can always finish school now or later in life. I plan on finishing an undergrad degree at a certain point, but I'm in no rush to do it.

One thing about not having a degree is that you have to "make" yourself because depending on where you are, the job market can be pretty competitive. My motivation is all of the successful entrepreneurs out there do did not finish (or even start) college.

------------------

Thanks *purplegirl*! I will try to make it a point to visit next time we are on the east coast (going to NYC in the fall)


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Valid28* 
Hi everyone, I'd like to join in here. I am a woman of color, married with one child. I often feel like I don't fit in anywhere. I went to college for two years but never did finish my degree. I have worked a regular boring job, so no career for me. But I love to mingle with people of all types. Most of my friends are professionals and I often feel like a bit of a loser because I didn't finish my degree. I don't feel like a member of the elite because of this. At the same time I fully own who I am as woc but hate that often I feel left out because my tastes and choices aren't always mainstream black America. I hope I made some sense. Anyway, I just wanted to join in the conversation.

Shanese

Welcome.







I so love to see WOC here at MDC. Girl, you are not a loser because you didn't finish your degree. I have a BA & M.Ed and truth is I made more money when I had no degree, I have still yet to make more in a year since I got these degrees than when I was a sales rep. So sometimes I don't feel the value of the degree, I enjoyed school and my education has allowed me to craft a living in a rather unorthodox way but its not all that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Welcome!

A degree is not the be all end all. It HELPS and it is useful especially if you're going into a specialized field, but it's not the end of the world. I didn't finish mine and DP doesn't have one either. That doesn't keep us out of the middle class income bracket though. DP is self-made entrepreneur so that is very helpful because at age 50 without a degree, and haven't worked for anyone else in 20 years, who would hire him )no matter how youthful he is.







) He went to school for a while, but wasn't the college type and didn't finish.

We do feel like outcasts among our degreed friends, but its just a temporary feeling - especially when at parties. I felt a little left out yesterday when meeting with cousins who are in law and medical school. It's just not my path though.

You can always finish school now or later in life. I plan on finishing an undergrad degree at a certain point, but I'm in no rush to do it.

One thing about not having a degree is that you have to "make" yourself because depending on where you are, the job market can be pretty competitive. My motivation is all of the successful entrepreneurs out there do did not finish (or even start) college.

------------------

Thanks *purplegirl*! I will try to make it a point to visit next time we are on the east coast (going to NYC in the fall)

Ditto to these points. By the way if any of you ladies ever end up in Maine, you must look me up.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
So much to talk about here!

So yesterday, we threw my grandmother a surprise birthday party. We got together with relatives who I haven't seen in years or at all. We are a small family (40 at the MOST) but we are not very close. It was a nice small family reunion/b-day party.

Since most of my friends are not black, I don't experience this very often, but yesterday I was bombarded with "good hair" comments. I guess I'm the only one besides my grandmother who has 3b/3c (don't really know which - doesn't matter). I mean it was a HUGE deal.







Its 2008 and I was stunned that this is still an issue. Most of my family is college educated, half are entrepreneurs - there is a pretty wide range of lifestyles, but the "good hair" thing lives on even with the guys.

I don't even know how to respond. I guess I was in shock. I said "thank you" because my hair IS good, but not any better than my mother who has 4b hair. Its good in the way that ALL black hair or all hair for that matter is good as long as its healthy.

Does anyone deal with this? Does it bother you? How do you respond?

The infamous "good hair" topic. I don't know where to begin first off I wear my hair natural and I am 4b also. I consider my hair good, but I know that "good" in most other black peoples mind can mean anything from, long, curly, silky and etc. This has been imprinted upon us from childhood, we were taught to envy the light skinned wavy haired girls and looked down on the dark-skinned nappy head girls. No one had to verbally say it (although they did were I grew up) but how we were treated spoke volumes. A lot of it has its roots in slavery (I know most people don't want to talk about it) and we still have a lot of healing to do.............


----------



## ishereal

Did anyone see it?

p.s. I hope I fit here because I am by no means "elite", I have zero income and no college thus far







:


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
The infamous "good hair" topic. I don't know where to begin first off I wear my hair natural and I am 4b also. I consider my hair good, but I know that "good" in most other black peoples mind can mean anything from, long, curly, silky and etc. This has been imprinted upon us from childhood, we were taught to envy the light skinned wavy haired girls and looked down on the dark-skinned nappy head girls. No one had to verbally say it (although they did were I grew up) but how we were treated spoke volumes. A lot of it has its roots in slavery (I know most people don't want to talk about it) and we still have a lot of healing to do.............

Ditto.

My father tells me when he was growing up, his aunt (who raised some of his siblings) used to treat his light-skinned sister waaay better than the other dark and nappy siblings. Pretty sad.

I hope my future children are not subjected to this on either end of the spectrum.


----------



## shayinme

Good hair.. ugh.... I only have a second but I so hate to even hear that term brought up, it irks me to say the least.







: More later.

@Purplegirl, yes indeed I could go on about upper crust Black folk in Maine. A lot of the native Black Mainers are indeed of that ilk, I tend to have a interesting relationship with them. I write for a local publication, plus in my early days here when I was actively seeking us out, I used to attend things like First Friday..LOL. Talk about being a long way from the south side of Chicago. More later, family wants dinner. LOL


----------



## Jannah6

I don't think I've ever posted here before, so I'll introduce myself. I'm Jannah, SAHM of 5 DC with 1 on the way(total surprise).

ETA: I've ALWAYS hated the term good hair. As for college, I've been "working" on my degree since 1993, LOL.


----------



## princesstutu

I, too, dislike the term "good hair." I call ppl on it whenever the opportunity arises. I find hair texture interesting, but only b/c it gets me thinking about genetics and ethnic backgrounds.

"Black hair" encompasses all textures and lengths. I've taken to telling folks that oily hair isn't inherently better than dry hair. When I put it that way, they usually shut up.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Did anyone see it?

p.s. I hope I fit here because I am by no means "elite", I have zero income and no college thus far







:

Welcome and of course you do we are in no way upper middle class and I have been coming here for years.








I think we need to also remember that MDC is general is comprised of the "upper elite" as far as income. During the income polls majority of the poll answers were in a household income of $100,000.

I have received the good hair comments all my life. I admit though I don't wear it natural anymore. I have highlights and I love them.







: My girls have 3A and 3B hair and it irks me every time someone makes the comment oh now I don't have to worry about this or that. Yeah cause curly hair needs no maintenance it's just comb and go.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
i find it so so interesting that everyone is so apologetic about being elite.









It's funny, I just said something about elitism in another forum. The reason we're apologetic, by and large, is that egalitarianism is seen as being intrinsically superior to elitism in US society. It's a huge problem, if you ask me. The reason I brought it up, though, was that... well, we were talking about black issues in America, and as members of an elite group, we're *going* to have a different (or several different) take on things.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Since most of my friends are not black, I don't experience this very often, but yesterday I was bombarded with "good hair" comments. I guess I'm the only one besides my grandmother who has 3b/3c (don't really know which - doesn't matter). I mean it was a HUGE deal.







Its 2008 and I was stunned that this is still an issue. Most of my family is college educated, half are entrepreneurs - there is a pretty wide range of lifestyles, but the "good hair" thing lives on even with the guys.
...
Does anyone deal with this? Does it bother you? How do you respond?

I'm not sure what 3B/3C means (it rings a vague bell...







) but I understand "good hair."







: I think it's really sad and implies a level of self-hatred, but that it doesn't need to. "You have such good hair!" "All hair is good. I'm rather fond of mine, thanks." I say the exact same thing when someone tells me that I have "good babies."









That said... i love my hair.







:









Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
My only problem with the "elite"term is that it creates yet another barrier between folks.

I don't think so; I mean, the barriers exist, and I don't think that they're necessarily bad, in and of themselves. I have no problem putting myself into boxes, even if I have to create new ones; I'm different, and that's fine. Refusing to label something doesn't change the fact of it's existance, you know? I'd rather acknowledge it and move along.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Valid28* 
Hi everyone, I'd like to join in here. I am a woman of color, married with one child. I often feel like I don't fit in anywhere. I went to college for two years but never did finish my degree. I have worked a regular boring job, so no career for me. But I love to mingle with people of all types. Most of my friends are professionals and I often feel like a bit of a loser because I didn't finish my degree. I don't feel like a member of the elite because of this. At the same time I fully own who I am as woc but hate that often I feel left out because my tastes and choices aren't always mainstream black America. I hope I made some sense. Anyway, I just wanted to join in the conversation.

I must say, I'm loving the way that this conversation is pulling the lurkers out.
















Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
The infamous "good hair" topic. I don't know where to begin first off I wear my hair natural and I am 4b also. I consider my hair good, but I know that "good" in most other black peoples mind can mean anything from, long, curly, silky and etc. This has been imprinted upon us from childhood, we were taught to envy the light skinned wavy haired girls and looked down on the dark-skinned nappy head girls. No one had to verbally say it (although they did were I grew up) but how we were treated spoke volumes. A lot of it has its roots in slavery (I know most people don't want to talk about it) and we still have a lot of healing to do.............

Then of course, there's the flip-side: While light-skinned, wavy/curly haired girls tend to be treated better by older black folks, there's a fair contingent of younger ones who'll treat you like crap for no other reason. It's entirely understandable, but it still hurts, especially when you're a child. These attitudes most assuredly play into the interracial marriage issue: I think that there's a lot of antagonism toward light-skinned black people, and as a result of that many light-skinned black folks may be looking for someone much darker than they to have children. Quite the backlash, really. And it's all so muddled and befuddled. On one hand, light-skinned people almost certainly have things easier in a predominantly white society, but on the other... if you deliberately choose to have lighter skinned children (like, you marry a white person) then you're choosing not to raise healthy, self-loving, proud black children.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
p.s. I hope I fit here because I am by no means "elite", I have zero income and no college thus far







:









Elite can be defined in oh so many ways. You're online; That makes you somewhat elite in and of itself.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Welcome and of course you do we are in no way upper middle class and I have been coming here for years.








I think we need to also remember that MDC is general is comprised of the "upper elite" as far as income. During the income polls majority of the poll answers were in a household income of $100,000.

Very true.









Quote:

I have received the good hair comments all my life. I admit though I don't wear it natural anymore. I have highlights and I love them.







: My girls have 3A and 3B hair and it irks me every time someone makes the comment oh now I don't have to worry about this or that. Yeah cause curly hair needs no maintenance it's just comb and go.








Mine is natural these days. So... anyone care to explain the numbers to me?







Like I said, they're familiar but I can't remember what they mean at all.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

Mine is natural these days. So... anyone care to explain the numbers to me?







Like I said, they're familiar but I can't remember what they mean at all.



















Or would anyone be willing to show pictures of their hair and to list their hair rating.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Mine is natural these days. So... anyone care to explain the numbers to me?







Like I said, they're familiar but I can't remember what they mean at all.









http://www.curls.biz tells about different types of hair textures. I really like their products for my girls.

Here is the page on hair texture.
http://www.curls.biz/learn-about-cur...l#qhairtexture


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 









Or would anyone be willing to show pictures of their hair and to list their hair rating.


Its not down in these black & white pictures so it may be hard to tell:

Hair 1

Hair 2

And I have a _small_ pic in my signature, but my hair was pretty dry...


----------



## ajv

i need some reference or definition too...tho are we perpetuating this foolishness by finding out what this means...we will see...

i have had to deal with the good hair comments all my life. when i found out i was pregnant with my daughter i promised myself i would NEVER EVER have hair longer than hers. this became quite the challenge b/c she was born BALD (lol!!!) i knew she would be bald because i had ZERO heartburn. i mean zero. i got heartburn once, after eating two jalepenos during the entire pregnancy. so i had my cousin cut my hair super super short right before i had her, now both of our hair is growing, but mine is growing faster so i am always running around desperate to get my hair cut...granted the child will be only one in a few weeks, but i am committed that she will never feel badly about her hair because of me. i have a younger sister who was always desperate to have long hair like mine, i felt bad about it, but didnt kno what to do (we are 9 years apart).

also, how do you do that little cut a quote and paste it thing...where you put someone else's quote in your post.


----------



## ajv

okay, so i am a 3A and my daughter is going to be a 4B.


----------



## eilonwy

ops: Double post!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
i have had to deal with the good hair comments all my life. when i found out i was pregnant with my daughter i promised myself i would NEVER EVER have hair longer than hers. this became quite the challenge b/c she was born BALD (lol!!!) i knew she would be bald because i had ZERO heartburn. i mean zero. i got heartburn once, after eating two jalepenos during the entire pregnancy. so i had my cousin cut my hair super super short right before i had her, now both of our hair is growing, but mine is growing faster so i am always running around desperate to get my hair cut...granted the child will be only one in a few weeks, but i am committed that she will never feel badly about her hair because of me. i have a younger sister who was always desperate to have long hair like mine, i felt bad about it, but didnt kno what to do (we are 9 years apart).

also, how do you do that little cut a quote and paste it thing...where you put someone else's quote in your post.

I"m curious-- why would you make such a promise? I mean, I kind of understand that you might not want to make your daughter feel badly if her hair wasn't as long as yours, but cutting it for her sake? Isn't that just drawing attention to the fact that the two of you have different hair and you feel like she's in some kind of minority, that you don't want her to feel alone? I'm not articulating well here... I think I need to come back to this later.

The heartburn myth drives me batty. I had tons of heartburn with all but one of my kids, and they were all born in various stages of baldness. My sister had no heartburn at all, and my oldest niece was born with like, two inches of soft, silky, jet-black hair.

In the bottom right corner of every post are three boxes; The one in the middle has quotation marks. Click on that box for every post you want to quote, and when you hit "reply" all of those posts will appear in your box. Or, you could just type [ quote ]cut & pasted stuff you want to quote [ / quote], without the spaces.









Thanks for the link Jeca. I have that book somewhere.







I'm 3A, my kids are 1B, 2B, 2A and too young to tell.


----------



## barose

This has the meanings of the hair types
http://www.naturallycurly.com/hair-types
http://hair.lovetoknow.com/4a_4b_3c_Hair_Type

I only found it useful when I first went natural and had a hard time finding products for my hair ways of styling, combing, etc. Its also a good guide when I'm looking for someone to cut my hair (to describe over the phone to see if its worth going in for a consult) - though I havent cut it in ages.

Speaking of hair cutting, my family also have long hair fetishes







. They were constantly pulling my hair that was back in a tie down my back to check the length. Three of my cousins have sister locks and going natural, but that doesn't stop 'em.


----------



## ishereal

my pics are in my siggy!


----------



## ishereal

I see from some of you ladies sigs that you homeschool, that's very encouraging, I don't know any WOC irl that do.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
my pics are in my siggy!

you're so pretty!


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
you're so pretty!









:


----------



## ajv

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I"m curious-- why would you make such a promise? I mean, I kind of understand that you might not want to make your daughter feel badly if her hair wasn't as long as yours, but cutting it for her sake? Isn't that just drawing attention to the fact that the two of you have different hair and you feel like she's in some kind of minority, that you don't want her to feel alone? I'm not articulating well here... I think I need to come back to this later.

The heartburn myth drives me batty. I had tons of heartburn with all but one of my kids, and they were all born in various stages of baldness. My sister had no heartburn at all, and my oldest niece was born with like, two inches of soft, silky, jet-black hair.

Thanks for the link Jeca. I have that book somewhere.







I'm 3A, my kids are 1B, 2B, 2A and too young to tell.










i hope this works (the quotation thing), it is the length that is the thing. most people dont notice the different textures of short hair, it is hard to tell how curly/straight my hair is without the added weight of the length. so even tho we have different hair, it doesnt LOOK different due the same or similar length. yes, i dont want her to feel alone, and yes, she is in the minority she is an african american girl, i dont want everyone on tv AND her mama having hair longer than hers, my reasoning is that it will benefit her self esteem. hair length is a standard of beauty in the dominant culture.

i thot the heartburn thing was an old wives tale, then i saw a little blurb in some parenting magazine that said scientists linked the enzyme that creates hair in unborn children with heartburn for pregnant women...it was a strong correlative not a predictor. i cut it out and sent it to my mama just so she could tell me " i told you so..."


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
you're so pretty!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 







:









: Thank You


----------



## NishaG

Wow..I haven't been to this thread in a while. However, this convo is quite interesting. Let me re-introduce myself: My name is Nisha, I am 35, married (to a Black Man) and the mother of 2 sons. I also have PCOS. I grew up in the East Bay, but now live in a suburb of Sacramento (the eternal search for "good" public schools). I am TTC #3, and hope that, once I do conceive, I am able to have a homebirth with a midwife.

I'll just hit and miss a few topics: My DH is light-skinned, very much so, and, I really think it bothers him when/if people comment on it. His whole immediate family is light, and, they were kind of treated like "royalty" by their peers while growing up in Oakland. It may have also been the combination of them living in the "hills", having a mom who SAH and a dad that was able to support the whole family of 7.

I guess I would be considered elite: We own our own home, are educated, I'm more crunchy than not, and we are kind of removed from the lifestyle of I guess the "average" Black Family?

As far as friends go, I have more African-American friends online at soulcysters than I do in real life, and, the majority of them are college-educated, and I guess you would say elite, as most of them are TTC as well and in committed relationships.

Glad to meet you all.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
i hope this works (the quotation thing), it is the length that is the thing. most people dont notice the different textures of short hair, it is hard to tell how curly/straight my hair is without the added weight of the length. so even tho we have different hair, it doesnt LOOK different due the same or similar length. yes, i dont want her to feel alone, and yes, she is in the minority she is an african american girl, i dont want everyone on tv AND her mama having hair longer than hers, my reasoning is that it will benefit her self esteem. *hair length is a standard of beauty in the dominant culture.*

Right... that's the problem I have. It is a standard of beauty in the dominant culture, but by refusing to have your hair longer than your daughter's... well, don't you feel like you're perpetuating that standard? As to different textures, do you think your daughter won't notice that yours is different from hers?

My older nieces both have thick, "nappy" hair. When she was 18 months old my niece knew that her hair and my hair were different (in fact, her hair was very different from that of anyone in our family-- she's probably a 4A). She told me once that when she grew up, she was going to be just like me: She'd have big boobs, a big butt, and long, curly red hair.







I told her that it wasn't likely-- she was probably going to grow up to be be tall, slim, have a less-pronounced figure and that her hair would still be nappy when she grew up. She'd also be a beautiful girl and a wonderful human being.







: It's not that I have a problem with short haired women-- I've shaved my hair many times (in fact, I was entirely bald for about two years relatively recently), but it was my choice, and it was for myself. My nieces don't resent the length of my hair, and I don't resent the fact that they don't look bald and ridiculous in cornrows. I'm not going to send the message to them that there's something less beautiful about short hair or more beautiful about long hair by running in the opposite direction and denouncing the hair I was born with. I mean what would that possibly teach them about self-love, that it only applies or is necessary if you're a minority? Honestly, I think that self-hatred on the part of "majority" members causes at least as many problems for minorites as the lack of self-love within minority communities.

And.. I'm still not really buying the heartburn thing, not that it's relevant. I realize that the plural of anecdote is not data, but I can't think of anyone for whom it held true.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Right... that's the problem I have. It is a standard of beauty in the dominant culture, but by refusing to have your hair longer than your daughter's... well, don't you feel like you're perpetuating that standard? As to different textures, do you think your daughter won't notice that yours is different from hers?

My older nieces both have thick, "nappy" hair. When she was 18 months old my niece knew that her hair and my hair were different (in fact, her hair was very different from that of anyone in our family-- she's probably a 4A). She told me once that when she grew up, she was going to be just like me: She'd have big boobs, a big butt, and long, curly red hair.







I told her that it wasn't likely-- she was probably going to grow up to be be tall, slim, have a less-pronounced figure and that her hair would still be nappy when she grew up. She'd also be a beautiful girl and a wonderful human being.







: It's not that I have a problem with short haired women-- I've shaved my hair many times (in fact, I was entirely bald for about two years relatively recently), but it was my choice, and it was for myself. My nieces don't resent the length of my hair, and I don't resent the fact that they don't look bald and ridiculous in cornrows. I'm not going to send the message to them that there's something less beautiful about short hair or more beautiful about long hair by running in the opposite direction and denouncing the hair I was born with. I mean what would that possibly teach them about self-love, that it only applies or is necessary if you're a minority? Honestly, I think that self-hatred on the part of "majority" members causes at least as many problems for minorites as the lack of self-love within minority communities.

And.. I'm still not really buying the heartburn thing, not that it's relevant. I realize that the plural of anecdote is not data, but I can't think of anyone for whom it held true.









Your words were well said. I feel the exact same way except your way of writing is so much more eloquent than mine.

Ajv,

if for example you were of a fair complexion and your sister were of a dark complexion and grew up jealous of your skin tone would you have only sought out men of a lighter hue to marry in hopes that any unborn children would not be dark and perhaps feel inferior to you because of their skin color?

I am asking simply because a parent can possess many attributes that could possibly make their child(ren) feel inferior. My mother always gets what she wants, and at times I wish that I had that gift. compared to her I will forever be a shrill sparrow and she lioness.

Your daughter should learn to embrace whatever hair God has given here and not judge her standard of beauty against you or anyone else, just as I have learned to realize that I have far more diplomacy and wisdom than my mother may ever possess. It is our job as black women of this generation to break the ridiculous cycle that long hair and fair skin is the definition of beauty.


----------



## Barbamama

to introduce myself and to thank you all for such a great discussion in the past couple of days. It prompted me to start thinking about and talking with DH about how we will prepare DD to handle the "good hair, fair skin" foolishness when it rears its ugly head. My parents didn't do that for me, and while it wasn't the biggest deficit in my upbringing, it did take me a long time to become aware of all of the subtle ways that it informed my relationships, both inside and outside of our family.

DH is white, French, and sees nationality as a more defining characteristic than race, something I'm starting to understand better. But when he first told me, "Honey, I'm not white, I'm French" I looked at him like he had lost his mind. Just didn't compute for this African-American woman. And he's learning more of the subtle ways prejudices influence daily life in the US, including dividing people of the same race.

Which takes me back to the hair thing . . . . My thoughts are still pretty amorphous, so I won't share them just yet -- ya'll are such a smart, well-spoken group I feel like I need to pull them together a bit more. And the "Mama!!!" that DD just shouted over the monitor tells me that nap time has ended. Let the toddler games begin!

But again, thank you!! Hope you don't mind if I join in!!


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
to introduce myself and to thank you all for such a great discussion in the past couple of days. It prompted me to start thinking about and talking with DH about how we will prepare DD to handle the "good hair, fair skin" foolishness when it rears its ugly head. My parents didn't do that for me, and while it wasn't the biggest deficit in my upbringing, it did take me a long time to become aware of all of the subtle ways that it informed my relationships, both inside and outside of our family.

DH is white, French, and sees nationality as a more defining characteristic than race, something I'm starting to understand better. But when he first told me, "Honey, I'm not white, I'm French" I looked at him like he had lost his mind. Just didn't compute for this African-American woman. And he's learning more of the subtle ways prejudices influence daily life in the US, including dividing people of the same race.

Which takes me back to the hair thing . . . . My thoughts are still pretty amorphous, so I won't share them just yet -- ya'll are such a smart, well-spoken group I feel like I need to pull them together a bit more. And the "Mama!!!" that DD just shouted over the monitor tells me that nap time has ended. Let the toddler games begin!

But again, thank you!! Hope you don't mind if I join in!!


----------



## sunshinestarr

Ok this thread is way too active for me!







But I wanted to say that I'm lurking and enjoying, even if I can't really keep up.


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
DH is white, French, and sees nationality as a more defining characteristic than race, something I'm starting to understand better. But when he first told me, "Honey, I'm not white, I'm French" I looked at him like he had lost his mind. Just didn't compute for this African-American woman. And he's learning more of the subtle ways prejudices influence daily life in the US, including dividing people of the same race.

That's fascinating to me, as I've known a few French people of "mixed race" and they suffered a lot of racism in France b/c of it. I wonder if there is a strong urban vs. where ever element to French racism.

Hair, to me, is something we really need to stop worrying about. Right now, my hair is "relaxed." For about 8 years, I'd worn it natural (shaved, TWA, longer w/my spiral curls, etc.), but now...I straightened it. Sometimes, my hair is a political statement. Right now, it's not. I just like to switch it up a bit and I think it's good that our daughters also see hair as "just an accessory." Like earrings or anklets.

My older daughter has locs b/c she doesn't like to get her hair done. Period. I'm not trying to make a statement with her hair, altho I do looooove locs and I think they really add to her beauty. (Everyone loves her hair. It actually annoys her to get so many compliments. LOL) She _does_ want long hair and so, as her locs grow, she enjoys her hair more. I think the enjoyment is key.

My younger daughter rocks braids and puffs, b/c her hair wouldn't take locs when I tried them. She, too, hates to get her hair done. I don't like doing hair on the regular, so I've thought about shaving their heads, but their dad would have a fit. Not worth the hassle.

I can't remember where I was going with this, so I'll stop here.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
DH is white, French, and sees nationality as a more defining characteristic than race, something I'm starting to understand better. But when he first told me, "Honey, I'm not white, I'm French" I looked at him like he had lost his mind. Just didn't compute for this African-American woman. And he's learning more of the subtle ways prejudices influence daily life in the US, including dividing people of the same race.



Interesting! Because when I speak of a European (or any other nationality) I know, I usually say, "French woman" English man", "Dutch child" NOT "white" or "black" no matter what color their skin is. For Americans, we are only white, black, Asian, Latino or other - not just _American_.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
Sometimes, my hair is a political statement. Right now, it's not. I just like to switch it up a bit and I think it's good that our daughters also see hair as "just an accessory." Like earrings or anklets.


That's the thing, I don't think that hair is just an accessory. It is very much apart of who I am like my arm or leg and I choose not to alter it's natural texture. How you wear your hair does say something about you (wether it's true or not), choosing to wear your hair natural speaks volume and today is seen as a political statement. Chemical fire are dangerous and filled with tons of carcinogens.


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
That's the thing, I don't think that hair is just an accessory. It is very much apart of who I am like my arm or leg and I choose not to alter it's natural texture. How you wear your hair does say something about you (wether it's true or not), choosing to wear your hair natural speaks volume and today is seen as a political statement. Chemical fire are dangerous and filled with tons of carcinogens.

I think it can be both. My mother went natural seven years ago with her 4b hair and locked it. She didn't have a statement agenda, she was just sick of the fire cream and not being able to swim and sweat when she wants.

Her locks are in a short bob, and her hair is cute _and_ makes a statement to other Black women that even nappy hair (not just "good hair") can be natural. I feel like I can't really say anything to anyone about going natural because I have "good hair" so 'what do I know?"







: I've gotten crap about it when I stopped straightening my hair, so I don't open my mouth about it anymore unless asked.


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
How you wear your hair does say something about you (wether it's true or not), choosing to wear your hair natural speaks volume and today is seen as a political statement. Chemical fire are dangerous and filled with tons of carcinogens.

Meh. No offense, but I just don't totally agree. I know lots of ppl with locs who don't have the consciousness God gave a gnat. It's just a hairstyle. And, I've decided that that's not a bad thing. Hair is sometimes just hair.

I wouldn't make assumptions about a person based on his or her hairstyle anymore than I'd make assumptions based on skin darkness. Add to that the fact that non-WOC rock the "unnatural" hair all the time and no one gets on them about it and I just can't be bothered to care on that level, anymore.

I see your point, tho.

IMO, all hair is "good" hair. Bald is "good", too. Hair can be seen as a significant indicator, but that's a choice, really. I think how hair affects a person is highly individual and I know I went natural b/c I needed to work out my hair issues. (I didn't realize I had any until my dd was born.) People have to be confident and introspective enough to find their own truths. Hair for me...no big deal. Hair for someone else...big deal. And, that's okay. I like the sociological aspects of the discussion, but when it comes down to it...assumptions are not always the healthiest thoughts to rely upon.


----------



## eilonwy

I am not my hair.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
That's the thing, I don't think that hair is just an accessory. It is very much apart of who I am like my arm or leg and I choose not to alter it's natural texture. How you wear your hair does say something about you (wether it's true or not), choosing to wear your hair natural speaks volume and today is seen as a political statement. Chemical fire are dangerous and filled with tons of carcinogens.

I'm not really sure I agree with this, when I first went natural almost 9 years ago I felt the same way you do but the longer I am natural it really is just part of who I am as a person. Even my locs, I have been loced now 4 years and at first I had a lot of energy tied up in them but recently I realized its just hair.

I think as Black women we need to be careful about grouping folks by hair especially as being natural has become almost trendy, one only has to go to certain large hair boards and I have seen folks wanting locs without even being natural. For them locs is not deep, its not spiritual, its just hair. That said, I have known some deep sistas, my former advisor in college who opened my eyes in so many ways yet she was relaxed. There are some seriously deep sistas whp forever whatever reasons choose to relax. I agree its not the healthiest or the most natural thing but at this stage in my naptural journey I let folks be.

Shay


----------



## Barbamama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
That's fascinating to me, as I've known a few French people of "mixed race" and they suffered a lot of racism in France b/c of it. I wonder if there is a strong urban vs. where ever element to French racism.

From what I've been able to discern French racism has a fundamental anti-immigrant, (esp. recent immigrant) "where are you from" gloss to it. (Not that we don't have the same sentiments here in the US, but that's another thread altogether). In other words, are you French from continental France? Or from elsewhere? -- esp. North Africa. Also, it seems that interracial relationships (therefore perhaps "mixed-race" children?) aren't well received in certain regions, esp. the French Caribbean. Wonder if that was part of your friends' experience? DH has said that we wouldn't have an easy time of it if we were to move to Martinique or Guadeloupe in particular. I can only wonder what THAT's about. Guess we'll just have to make do with St. Barth's.









B/c DH isn't of African descent his perspective and experiences are, well, just his. (I'm dying to sit down with a few French ("from France" and "from elsewhere") sistas and get their perspectives.) That said, DH's circle of friends growing up was slightly more diverse than mine was; if adjusted to account for France's far more homogeneous population, he had a Benetton ad life compared to mine. Which of course could have been a result of cross-racial bonding over soccer. . . .

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Interesting! Because when I speak of a European (or any other nationality) I know, I usually say, "French woman" English man", "Dutch child" NOT "white" or "black" no matter what color their skin is.

And that's just the way that DH's family thinks. Funny story, slightly OT, but I'll share: DH's conversation with his (86 year old, hard-of-hearing, slightly senile) grandmother upon her seeing hospital pics of the baby and us went something like a cross-cultural Abbot & Costello "Who's on First":

GM: She's very tan! [speaking of me] Did you all go to the beach? [it was December, BTW]
DH: Well, she's African-American.
GM: Yes, American.
DH: African-American. Her ancestors are from Africa.
GM: But you said she was American.
DH: She is, but her family is from Africa.
GM: She's African?
DH: No, she's American. A Black American.

[extended exchange about who's on first, what's American]

Finally --

DH (a bit frustrated) : Her family is from Madagascar. (Which is true, but about 200 year-old news).
GM: Aaah! OK, she's Malagasy!
DH: Yeah, sort of . . . .

Apparently "African-American" doesn't translate well without reference to a specific African country of origin. And "Black" doesn't translate at all.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I'm not really sure I agree with this, when I first went natural almost 9 years ago I felt the same way you do but the longer I am natural it really is just part of who I am as a person. Even my locs, I have been loced now 4 years and at first I had a lot of energy tied up in them but recently I realized its just hair.

I think as Black women we need to be careful about grouping folks by hair especially as being natural has become almost trendy, one only has to go to certain large hair boards and I have seen folks wanting locs without even being natural. For them locs is not deep, its not spiritual, its just hair. That said, I have known some deep sistas, my former advisor in college who opened my eyes in so many ways yet she was relaxed. There are some seriously deep sistas whp forever whatever reasons choose to relax. I agree its not the healthiest or the most natural thing but at this stage in my naptural journey I let folks be.

Shay

Yes I know that wearing your hair natural does not = consciousness, trust me I have had a couple of rude awakenings. But I see natural hair as a step towards embracing who you are.... but that's just me


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I am not my hair.









I love her song brown skinned, love it love it!
I am NOT my hair. I have worn my hair several ways over the years but because of the "texture" it may not have been easily identifiable as "natural". So many people think natural they think kinky, wild, free that is the perceived look. Well I do not have "kinky" hair natural or not. If you were to see me on the street would my silken spirals still be perceived as natural or would you assume I'm a sister who sat under the dryer for ever. That is why I'm not comfortable with the hair as a statement because it's easy to misidentify. I don't think I'm making sense I feel very tired today.

OT. WHat do think of the trend that we as people tend to buy certain clothes. My mother for instance makes comments to me all the time on how I need to be DS(10)cool clothes and cool shoes. By cool she means things like FuBu or Jordan's which my son has never expressed an interest in and I have no desire to spend $80 on one pair of shoes when a pair of $30 sketchers is what he likes and works just fine. We live in a "white" area and she feels that he is being pulled into their style. I don't see why FUBU and Jordan's need to be identified as "our style" when it's not affordable for a lot black people. I'm rambling aren't I? It just makes me mad when she says things like this. I have no problem buying those items on sale, but I won't spend an entire school clothing budget on two outfits and one pair of shoes.







: So I took DS to the store and let him pick out the things he wanted it consisted mainly of t-shirts with different designs on them a few non name style polo shirts. If that is what he wants to wear I'm happy and my wallet is happy. My would have been SIL who is on various types of govt. assistance buys each of her oldest three kids Jordan's for school and then has to borrow gas money of can't get them the extra things like new socks and underwear. My niece rocks rocawear to school but can't take the ballet lessons she wants. What do you think do you feel we are obligated to buy more black owned company clothing or is that simply buying into yet another stereotype?


----------



## eilonwy

Clothing.







To preface this, my sisters' biggest problem with the way that I buy clothing is that I "allow" BeanBean to wear pink in public. My youngest sister (Chibi's mom) actually has decent taste in clothing; The girls wear clothing that fits well, and which is appropriate for their ages. Yeah, occasionally my sister will buy fancy Nikes or Baby Phat outfits for them... but she works three jobs, and it's her perogative. As far as making the girls "cool," I think she's probably given up hope with the older two.







They're too independant, both of them.







She once bought Bean a pair of G-Unit jeans... and she bought him a Ralph Lauren dress shirt (it was pink







) which he adores.

She doesn't spend ridiculous amounts of money, though... she gets these things at places like TJ Maxx. And like I said, I figure it's her perogative. She's not imposing her style on anyone else, really. When Chibi was little she (15!) bought some absolutely ridiculous things. Mom couldn't talk her into taking them back. I couldn't either, but I finally said, "Look, she'll have at least 30 years when that's appropriate, but she's only got two when she'll be at her most adorable in babydoll dresses and ruffle-butt bloomers," and the baby hoochie styles went back to the store.

Does she need to buy "black" clothing? I think that given the choice between two outfits of similar price and similar appropriateness, she'd go with the one by the black designer. No, I know she would. I probably would, too.







Bean's fairly easy to dress, but if I could find inexpensive Apple Bottoms for BooBah I'd be all over them (baby got back







). "Ghetto gap" is unattractive, regardless of the age of the person wearing the jeans.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
hat given the choice between two outfits of similar price and similar appropriateness, she'd go with the one by the black designer. No, I know she would. I probably would, too.l

That I could understand. If something is on sale at a great price of course I'd buy it but to pay $55 for a shirt just because it's suppose to be "For US By Us" just isn't it for me. I think it's out of a lot of peoples reach but they try to buy it anyway because that's the way it's suppose to be.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 

OT. WHat do think of the trend that we as people tend to buy certain clothes. What do you think do you feel we are obligated to buy more black owned company clothing or is that simply buying into yet another stereotype?


I often have the same thoughts. I for one do not like clothing by most black owned companies simply because I am not fond of the urban look. I purchase mostly conservative clothing and I have yet to find styles deigned by a black company that just don't look "hood" or over the top urban trendy.

I don't need embellishments or wording just plain simple Ann Taylor or Anthropologie type clothing. I love to spend my money within my race so why can't a black designer make clothing of a conservative style?

As for my son, I abhor Jordans and any clothing that looks urban athletic.


----------



## barose

I'm a clothing girl, but never been into the urban look myself. Marithe Francois Girbaud is as about as "urban" as it gets .







I prefer a more "street style" to and dressy approach and it would be nice if more black designers step out of the hip-hop box and realize that we have a variety of tastes in clothing and design.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
it would be nice if more black designers step out of the hip-hop box and realize that we have a variety of tastes in clothing and design.

This has been the cause of various discussions in my family as I don't wear urban wear either and neither does my children. My sister thinks it's like denying a piece of our culture.
Dh and I both have the same thought. We were in a store a few weeks ago and he was looking for something for his birthday. He gets more frustrated by the minute. Finally he turns to me and asks why is it that the only clothing in his size(about a 38-40) is all hip hopped out and graffitied up not to mention $80 for a pair of shorts as if thats the only clothing that "we" wear? He goes over to the "white style" section and points out that over here all they have is sizes 32-36's and their shorts are $30 for a pair. He left frustrated mumbling on how maybe he would like a damn pair of khaki's or something. They need to expand their style instead of trying to group everyone into that mold. M


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## Barbamama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
and it would be nice if more black designers step out of the hip-hop box and realize that we have a variety of tastes in clothing and design.

You know, when I thought about it, I couldn't come up with a single living black designer who didn't have his/her roots in the music industry. Patrick Kelly and Willi Smith, both long dead, are the only two who I'd *ever* heard of. (Until a quick Google revealed Tracy Reese, a sister who's "made it" according to my quick read.)

That's no accident. Cross-marketing between music and the urban/hip-hop clothing makes more money for an already popular artist, his/her record label and the company backing the clothing line; so long as the clothing comports with the genre/image of the music everybody's happy.

As for why blacks not affiliated with the music industry aren't more successful in fashion, one hypothesis off the top of my gourd: lack of access to capital. Biases about what appeals to whom come into play, and if those handing out the $$ can't conceive of a black designer's creations as having broad appeal, then those designers are not going to get the backing they need to get off the ground.







I know squat about financing in the fashion industry, so grain of salt recommended.

ETA: A little rant-y today, I am. Sorry. The thought that urban style and black peoples' style are co-terminus ticks me off a bit.


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## Draupadi

HI!
I was hoping this Tribe would be resurrected.








I'm Williamsmama, or Sheila if you prefer. I'm a 37 mom from New York City, 1/2 African American and 1/2 Korean, and currently a SAHM. I'll be going back to work in the Fall (I'm a teacher).
I'm glad to see you ladies here!
Sometimes I need some sistas to talk to...
Anyway...hair.
I stopped relaxing my hair back in the 90's. I went through a good 10 years or so of having strong, natural hair, but since I had my son, it's just been a mess.
It's sad that our hair is so political. Being 1/2 Asian, I've had friends' mothers say things like "Oh, you're lucky that you were born with a little help". When I stopped relaxing, those comments stopped.
My brother has locs down past his butt and I sometimes wished I had the patience to grow locs too. My DH prefers my hair natural and dislikes straightened hair. He generally believes black women look better with natural hair.
Anyway...that's my .02. Just really wanted to say hi!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I too have not had a friend since high school and neither she nor I had anything in common. We still communicate with one another today, but she and I are not close. Evenin high school I never told her my true feelings. Even today she will tell me that I am the smartest person that I know and that past mistakes do not matter, but we can't just sit down and reveal our inner self because she would not understand. My family did not approve of our relationship then and I know that they would not now. My family has a high standard of conduct that I sometimes feel as if I can't live up to.

As I type I can maybe realize why a black man with similar upbrining might have a hard time finding a black wife if I can't even find the right black friend. Interracial marriage is quite common in my family and I have never gievn it a thought until right now.

.

This is so interesting, Piad.
I consider myself lucky as I grew up in very diverse and somewhat lower to mid-middle class neighborhoods for most of my life.
Growing up, my friends were always such a mix, but my closest friends in H.S. (where I went to a specialized school) and now are mostly black.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
You know, when I thought about it, I couldn't come up with a single living black designer who didn't have his/her roots in the music industry.

Oh, that's not true. There are sports stars with clothing lines, too.









I hear you, though. I really wish there were more things which were... well, older.







I don't have a problem with the urban look, but I'm 30 years old and I have no desire to look like a teenager. I'd love to see more clothing designed to fit figures like mine-- the once-it-was-an-hourglass, big round booty and boobs to balance the effect figure.







I mean, I've met exactly two white people who had figures like mine in my entire life, but *dozens* of black ones. I'd love to be able to buy a nice skirt that was the same length over my behind that it is in the front.







:

I'm kind of curious about the Worthington line at JC Penney's; THeir clothing fits me relatively well. I think there's either a black designer or they've got a black size model for their petites, because things are quite round.







Too bad most of it looks entirely too old.









Welcome, Sheila! I had no idea there was a black mama/white baby smilie!







Your little man is *ADORABLE*!! He's almost as cute as mine.


----------



## Draupadi

Thanks, Eilonwy (sp?)!
Actually, I remember looking at your pictures a few days ago thinking my son is going to look the way your oldest son looks in a few years!








I found that smilie recently and started to use it. I didn't think the afro one quite fit me as well as this one.
My boy's got a nice tan going on so he looks more like me. I think before he got it, folks in my neighborhood were probably thinking I was his nanny.


----------



## princesstutu

re: clothing

I buy what's cute and cheap. Period. I buy thrift, I buy new. But, I won't buy expensive, unless it's a coat. FUBU isn't even owned by black ppl, anymore, so I'm not sure why that's an issue. I refuse to pay to walk around advertising for folks, as much as I can help it. Walking around with company names written on your clothes is just tacky to me and I won't participate or allow my kids to participate when they're with me.

I think Sean John is a pretty neutral line. Not too hip-hop/urban, whatever. Walks that fine line. It's expensive, tho. You know, you gotta help Puffy keep up his lifestyle.









For women, I guess it's harder, but I honestly don't look for black designers. I don't have an interest in designers at all.


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## jeca

I didn't know FUBU wasn't owned by black people anymore. I don't read up much on things like that so I'm always out of the loop. my best clothes have come from the thrift store.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
I refuse to pay to walk around advertising for folks, as much as I can help it. Walking around with company names written on your clothes is just tacky to me and I won't participate or allow my kids to participate when they're with me.

---
For women, I guess it's harder, but I honestly don't look for black designers. I don't have an interest in designers at all.









: to all of that. I find most of that stuff ugly anyway. I tend to not buy anything with any writing. I buy mostly from discount stores or The Gap.


----------



## AndrewsMother

princesstutu said:


> re: clothing
> 
> I think Sean John is a pretty neutral line. Not too hip-hop/urban, whatever. Walks that fine line. It's expensive, tho. You know, you gotta help Puffy keep up his lifestyle.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> QUOTE]
> 
> And/or his child support!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : to all of that. I find most of that stuff ugly anyway. I tend to not buy anything with any writing. I buy mostly from discount stores or The Gap.
> 
> Ugly is being nice.


----------



## ajv

we buy mostly from thrift stores, avoid writing/logos, ebay...we did like to buy the george foreman line at the big and tall men's store for my husband, but it isnt there anymore. sorry to hear about fubu, i was always happy to buy something from goodwill with their logo.


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## oyinmama

uhm, ok so how come i wander away from MDC for a few weeks and this thread gets jumpstarted in a major exciting way!??

hi beautiful mamas - i'm still catching up somewhere on page 8 but in some weird time-warpy way i feel the compulsion to post RIGHT!!! NOW!!! even though i'm not exactly chiming into a current conversation - just to say hi i'm here and i'm excited to be reading y'all.


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## xochimama

hola, mamas

interesting to read the hair & clothing discussions-- for Latinos I think the same toxic brew exists but not around those topics, it's all about language and speech mannerisms. So to be a "real Latino" you have to either speak Spanish or speak with certain Spanglish mannerisms. Or be "brown enough" for people to know that you are Latino.

And then, of course, there are race divides for Latinos: some of us have roots in the African diaspora (esp. Caribbean Latinos) but zero identification with AA history & culture. Some of us have very strong Mexican identification. Some have very strong Central Am identification, &c., and the intermixing gets even more heady... Latin Am is full of mixed races... throw class divide in the mix (and yes, "white" Latinos, historically, have fared better than "morenos") and ugh... it's a lot to take in.

Here's another thing that we are fighting over (







) : Latino versus Hispanic vs. Chicano vs. [insert country-specific]-American ie Mexican-American, Cuban-American, etc...

how is is that even among ourselves we manage to find things to pick apart...?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
hola, mamas

interesting to read the hair & clothing discussions-- for Latinos I think the same toxic brew exists but not around those topics, it's all about language and speech mannerisms. So to be a "real Latino" you have to either speak Spanish or speak with certain Spanglish mannerisms. Or be "brown enough" for people to know that you are Latino.

And then, of course, there are race divides for Latinos: some of us have roots in the African diaspora (esp. Caribbean Latinos) but zero identification with AA history & culture. Some of us have very strong Mexican identification. Some have very strong Central Am identification, &c., and the intermixing gets even more heady... Latin Am is full of mixed races... throw class divide in the mix (and yes, "white" Latinos, historically, have fared better than "morenos") and ugh... it's a lot to take in.

Here's another thing that we are fighting over (







) : Latino versus Hispanic vs. Chicano vs. [insert country-specific]-American ie Mexican-American, Cuban-American, etc...

how is is that even among ourselves we manage to find things to pick apart...?

















Good points about Latinos, I used to live in Chicago and it was no joke at how fast folks would get mad if you called a Mexican a PR or vice-versa. Then like you said for Latinos who do have roots in the African diaspora yet don't connect with AA culture.. we do create a lot of tensions for ourselves as times.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

I am back from vacation and exhausted. It is great to see this tribe active again. I'll be back when I am of sound mind to post more.
Peace.


----------



## Brown Lioness

YAY!, great to see this tribe active again! Im still here, lurking and all (but i think i'll post once i catch up), lol.


----------



## oyinmama

well, i really *really* have enjoyed catching up, and would like to say a welcome to all the new members and a hello to all the vets from a sporadic lurker!

so many things are interesting about what's been being said recently. (grammar police?) ...

*the 'elite' thing* - innnteresting. even though i hadnt known the class/demographics of the MDC board in particular, it is easy to understand how a board dedicated to self-educating about alternative childrearing practices would be a group full of people with a little more access to information, a little more health care choice, a little more free time than perhaps is normal in our society.

i was raised semi-granola (panafrican parents, natural hair, food co-op/health food store, semi-veg, home made clothes & toys, no/limited TV, emphasis on education, etc) in the 1980s and my parents had hardly any money. so, although i have always felt outside of the mainstream of african-american culture, i never thought of myself as 'elite' - just 'odd.'

that being said, i do consider myself an elite in that i am a member of a small sub-group: i'm a proud 'black nerd' (DH and i used to screenprint t-shirts that said 'BLACK NERDS UNITE'







) i consider myself VERY lucky to have many (like, half a dozen, LOL) really close, similarly cynical, outside-the-mainstream, nerdy black friends. to me who grew up a loner, this seems like a veritable BLOCK PARTY. in addition, my circle is full of smart and sexy black men who love and support (and marry!) their partners, support their families, homeschool and/or have a huge part in the daily rearing of their children, etc.

i am also firmly aware that elitism in the black community often means other things; although both of my parents are black, my family is cross-cultural in many ways. my mom's family is east coast traditional/historical black elite: the whole light skin, straight hair, professional/middle class, martha's vineyard, jack & jill type situation. my father's family is east coast classic: mid century migration from the rural south, blue collar roots. my siblings and i are among the lightest cousins on my father's side of the family, and the darkest cousins on my mother's side. quite grounding, IMHO.

*the hair thing* - that hair typing thing is a mess







but it does come in handy for descriptive purposes. politically, i do believe that when black women - or women of any race with curly/kinky hair - straighten our hair, we are helping do our tiny part to perpetuate a eurocentric patriarchal beauty standard; and are participating in the devaluation of our racial type by treating our natural characteristics as some sort of 'problem' in need of fixing.

personally, i have relaxed my hair for maybe 6 years out of my life, mainly during high school, and during that time i was magically transformed from 'that nappyheaded girl' to 'that lightskinned girl.' so i've seen the hair thing from both sides; choosing to straighten after being natural, and choosing to be natural after straightening. for the past 14 years that i've worn a fro, locks, and a fro again, it's become less and less dramatic a situation for me in my daily life. i don't rant or prostheletize about it, or look down on individual women who choose to straighten, and i do look forward to a time when it is 'just hair' and is not loaded with as much political/cultural significance. i understand that for some individuals that day may have already come, and in many ways it has arrived for me as well. but i don't think it's arrived in general in the larger community; i think hair is still a huge significator in african-american culture and we can't ignore the fact that it conveys meaning - even if it's not the meaning we may have intended or the one that resonates with us inside.

(example) michelle obama, our next first lady,







wears her hair in a demure, conservative, relaxed/straightened style not at all unlike that worn by condoleeza rice. when the new yorker did their [awkward/unfunny, imho - and does anyone want to talk about that?] 'satire' cover of the obamas the other week, what was the main change they made to their depiction of michelle? they gave her a huge, fluffy, kinky 'fro.' this is a hair style that i happily, sexily, lightheartedly rock on many occasions and guess what? i'm not a gun-toting militant radical who burns the american flag. but together with the other imagery that they selected for that cover, they selected kinky hair BECAUSE of the meaning it conveys. not because it is 'just hair.'

yknow?

*on fubu and 'urban' fashion* - meh. i am ITA with the PP who said she doesn't pay money for the right to advertise for others. i have never been into labels and i don't think a name brand is a valid substitution for style or quality.

*why am i rambling so long?* oh i dunno. it's late. hee hee!


----------



## Draupadi

oyinmama said:


> Quote:
> 
> *the 'elite' thing* - innnteresting. even though i hadnt known the class/demographics of the MDC board in particular, it is easy to understand how a board dedicated to self-educating about alternative childrearing practices would be a group full of people with a little more access to information, a little more health care choice, a little more free time than perhaps is normal in our society.
> ITA with this. I tend to think that this board (and not just the WOC board but MDC as a whole) is populated with women who are mostly highly educated and probably mid to higher income. I often marvel at the fact that some mamas on this board have posts in the 10s of thousands!
> 
> Quote:
> 
> that being said, i do consider myself an elite in that i am a member of a small sub-group: i'm a proud 'black nerd' (DH and i used to screenprint t-shirts that said 'BLACK NERDS UNITE'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) i consider myself VERY lucky to have many (like, half a dozen, LOL) really close, similarly cynical, outside-the-mainstream, nerdy black friends
> . .
> 
> In HS, my friends and I were outside the box and yes, we were nerds (although I don't think we would have admitted it back then). Going to a math and science high school and liking things like Star Trek helped.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> *the hair thing* - that hair typing thing is a mess
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but it does come in handy for descriptive purposes. politically, i do believe that when black women - or women of any race with curly/kinky hair - straighten our hair, we are helping do our tiny part to perpetuate a eurocentric patriarchal beauty standard; and are participating in the devaluation of our racial type by treating our natural characteristics as some sort of 'problem' in need of fixing.
> What you said.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> i don't rant or prostheletize about it, or look down on individual women who choose to straighten, and i do look forward to a time when it is 'just hair' and is not loaded with as much political/cultural significance. i understand that for some individuals that day may have already come, and in many ways it has arrived for me as well. but i don't think it's arrived in general in the larger community; i think hair is still a huge significator in african-american culture and we can't ignore the fact that it conveys meaning - even if it's not the meaning we may have intended or the one that resonates with us inside.
> I think it's unfortunate. It will be a long time before our hair is not an issue or a political discussion every time we bring it up.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> (example) michelle obama, our next first lady,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wears her hair in a demure, conservative, relaxed/straightened style not at all unlike that worn by condoleeza rice. when the new yorker did their [awkward/unfunny, imho - and does anyone want to talk about that?] 'satire' cover of the obamas the other week, what was the main change they made to their depiction of michelle? they gave her a huge, fluffy, kinky 'fro.' this is a hair style that i happily, sexily, lightheartedly rock on many occasions and guess what? i'm not a gun-toting militant radical who burns the american flag. but together with the other imagery that they selected for that cover, they selected kinky hair BECAUSE of the meaning it conveys. not because it is 'just hair.'
> 
> yknow?
> If Michelle Obama was rockin' a natural, I doubt Barack Obama would be where he is now. Her hair (to a lot of folks- not saying it's right or wrong) is reminiscent of Jackie Onassis. I mean, not only is Michelle Obama good looking, poised and smart (all scary traits for a black woman to have to some people!), but she's got a Jackie O thing going for her. Obama has a Kennedy aura too. A natural would scare the pants off of folks. Straight is mainstream...and acceptable.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
well, i really *really* have enjoyed catching up, and would like to say a welcome to all the new members and a hello to all the vets from a sporadic lurker!

so many things are interesting about what's been being said recently. (grammar police?) ...

*the 'elite' thing* - innnteresting. even though i hadnt known the class/demographics of the MDC board in particular, it is easy to understand how a board dedicated to self-educating about alternative childrearing practices would be a group full of people with a little more access to information, a little more health care choice, a little more free time than perhaps is normal in our society.

i was raised semi-granola (panafrican parents, natural hair, food co-op/health food store, semi-veg, home made clothes & toys, no/limited TV, emphasis on education, etc) in the 1980s and my parents had hardly any money. so, although i have always felt outside of the mainstream of african-american culture, i never thought of myself as 'elite' - just 'odd.'

that being said, i do consider myself an elite in that i am a member of a small sub-group: i'm a proud 'black nerd' (DH and i used to screenprint t-shirts that said 'BLACK NERDS UNITE'







) i consider myself VERY lucky to have many (like, half a dozen, LOL) really close, similarly cynical, outside-the-mainstream, nerdy black friends. to me who grew up a loner, this seems like a veritable BLOCK PARTY. in addition, my circle is full of smart and sexy black men who love and support (and marry!) their partners, support their families, homeschool and/or have a huge part in the daily rearing of their children, etc.

i am also firmly aware that elitism in the black community often means other things; although both of my parents are black, my family is cross-cultural in many ways. my mom's family is east coast traditional/historical black elite: the whole light skin, straight hair, professional/middle class, martha's vineyard, jack & jill type situation. my father's family is east coast classic: mid century migration from the rural south, blue collar roots. my siblings and i are among the lightest cousins on my father's side of the family, and the darkest cousins on my mother's side. quite grounding, IMHO.

*the hair thing* - that hair typing thing is a mess







but it does come in handy for descriptive purposes. politically, i do believe that when black women - or women of any race with curly/kinky hair - straighten our hair, we are helping do our tiny part to perpetuate a eurocentric patriarchal beauty standard; and are participating in the devaluation of our racial type by treating our natural characteristics as some sort of 'problem' in need of fixing.

personally, i have relaxed my hair for maybe 6 years out of my life, mainly during high school, and during that time i was magically transformed from 'that nappyheaded girl' to 'that lightskinned girl.' so i've seen the hair thing from both sides; choosing to straighten after being natural, and choosing to be natural after straightening. for the past 14 years that i've worn a fro, locks, and a fro again, it's become less and less dramatic a situation for me in my daily life. i don't rant or prostheletize about it, or look down on individual women who choose to straighten, and i do look forward to a time when it is 'just hair' and is not loaded with as much political/cultural significance. i understand that for some individuals that day may have already come, and in many ways it has arrived for me as well. but i don't think it's arrived in general in the larger community; i think hair is still a huge significator in african-american culture and we can't ignore the fact that it conveys meaning - even if it's not the meaning we may have intended or the one that resonates with us inside.

(example) michelle obama, our next first lady,







wears her hair in a demure, conservative, relaxed/straightened style not at all unlike that worn by condoleeza rice. when the new yorker did their [awkward/unfunny, imho - and does anyone want to talk about that?] 'satire' cover of the obamas the other week, what was the main change they made to their depiction of michelle? they gave her a huge, fluffy, kinky 'fro.' this is a hair style that i happily, sexily, lightheartedly rock on many occasions and guess what? i'm not a gun-toting militant radical who burns the american flag. but together with the other imagery that they selected for that cover, they selected kinky hair BECAUSE of the meaning it conveys. not because it is 'just hair.'

yknow?

*on fubu and 'urban' fashion* - meh. i am ITA with the PP who said she doesn't pay money for the right to advertise for others. i have never been into labels and i don't think a name brand is a valid substitution for style or quality.

*why am i rambling so long?* oh i dunno. it's late. hee hee!

Omg, you sound a lot like me in many ways. More later, I am in need of coffee!


----------



## AndrewsMother

A hair question for those that are natural and WOTH:

Do you straighten your hair for job interviews?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
A hair question for those that are natural and WOTH:

Do you straighten your hair for job interviews?

Nope. To be honest even before I loced 4 years ago I would just wear my hair the way I always wore it. My thoughts are that would I want to work at a place that had issues with my hair, probably not. Plus living in the whitest state in America, it would seem silly for me to straighten my hair anyway. I have been natural 8-9 years and aside from the year I stayed home after dd was born, I have always worked since being natural. I have never had issues with my hair, to be honest I sometimes wish folks would not comment on my hair, my hair is mid-back length and always folks around here comment, generally someone who has never seen locs and thinks they are braids. LOL

Oyinmama, reading about your family history reminds me of how diverse the experience can be within a Black family and how elistism plays out in Black families. Like you my folks were a mixed family, my Dad straight from the south, son of sharecroppers but my Mom's folks were racially mixed Black/Mexican and had a few coins and property. It was interesting to say the least anytime the whole family came together. My folks definitely had color issues since my Mom was the darkest person in her family, to the point her Dad's family questioned if she was really his







. My great-Grandma is fair with blue eyes, most of that side is Lena Horne color.. my Mom though was not and neither are me or my brother.

Its interesting to me that so many of the WOC who come here to MDC are a bit at times outside the box of how some would decribe Blackness yet we are still very much Black. I actually find that at a lot of Black boards I frequent, sistas who were the nerds in HS, or like me listened to white music back in the mid 80's.. I often wonder where ya'll were when I was a kid.









Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Nope. To be honest even before I loced 4 years ago I would just wear my hair the way I always wore it. My thoughts are that would I want to work at a place that had issues with my hair, probably not. Plus living in the whitest state in America, it would seem silly for me to straighten my hair anyway. I have been natural 8-9 years and aside from the year I stayed home after dd was born, I have always worked since being natural. I have never had issues with my hair, to be honest I sometimes wish folks would not comment on my hair, my hair is mid-back length and always folks around here comment, generally someone who has never seen locs and thinks they are braids. LOL

Oyinmama, reading about your family history reminds me of how diverse the experience can be within a Black family and how elistism plays out in Black families. Like you my folks were a mixed family, my Dad straight from the south, son of sharecroppers but my Mom's folks were racially mixed Black/Mexican and had a few coins and property. It was interesting to say the least anytime the whole family came together. My folks definitely had color issues since my Mom was the darkest person in her family, to the point her Dad's family questioned if she was really his







. My great-Grandma is fair with blue eyes, most of that side is Lena Horne color.. my Mom though was not and neither are me or my brother.

Its interesting to me that so many of the WOC who come here to MDC are a bit at times outside the box of how some would decribe Blackness yet we are still very much Black. I actually find that at a lot of Black boards I frequent, sistas who were the nerds in HS, or like me listened to white music back in the mid 80's.. *I often wonder where ya'll were when I was a kid.







*

Shay


I know, right? It would have made my teen years a lot easier and perhaps more fun. *sigh*

I definitely do not change my hair when I was going on job interviews, etc. My thing was, accept me for who I am or spare me the trouble and don't hire me.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
A hair question for those that are natural and WOTH:

Do you straighten your hair for job interviews?

No, although I do wear it back in a bun when I want to look conservative. I don't have locs, by the way.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I actually find that at a lot of Black boards I frequent, sistas who were the nerds in HS, or like me listened to white music back in the mid 80's.. I often wonder where ya'll were when I was a kid.









Shay

We were home listening to Duran Duran, reading sci fi novels.








Anyway, I guess my experience was a little different considering my mother is Korean, but on my father's side of the family, we come for a large family of very proud black folks. As in most black families, my aunts and uncles ran the gamut in terms of color (my grandmother was dark and my grandfather was almost light enough to pass). I never really noticed any colorism in my family growing up, although I am told that my grandfather, who died when I was about 2, really favored me and made comments about my "olive skin". Anyway,I come from strong, God-fearing, poor black folks who stressed education above everything. I am blessed.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
We were home listening to Duran Duran, reading sci fi novels.









I was a huge Duran Duran fan, all the albums and posters on my walls







. I got a lot of ribbing from family about my love of Duran Duran.


----------



## Valid28

Hey I am still reading the sci fi novels. We weren't supposed to stop where we?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
We were home listening to Duran Duran, reading sci fi novels.








Anyway, I guess my experience was a little different considering my mother is Korean, but on my father's side of the family, we come for a large family of very proud black folks. *As in most black families, my aunts and uncles ran the gamut in terms of color (my grandmother was dark and my grandfather was almost light enough to pass). I never really noticed any colorism in my family growing up, although I am told that my grandfather, who died when I was about 2, really favored me and made comments about my "olive skin". Anyway,I come from strong, God-fearing, poor black folks who stressed education above everything. I am blessed*.

Wow, reading that warmed my heart. I really wished that we would stop focusing so much on the differences that separate us, but look for the things that unify us. My mom tells me stories of how her extended family didn't want her to marry my dad because he was too dark. The irony is that my mom is darked skin! It changed when they thought he "came from money"







.
My mom's family is very haughty and believes that the light tone of their skin and educational status makes them "special". I sort of understand it in the context of racism and classism; what I don't get is why it is perpetuated in this day and age. My mom looks at her extended family and shakes her head in disgust,but was determined not to raise her children with such silly, self loathing beliefs!
I think black folks, in particular, continue to struggle for acceptance by the wider population, so we look for things that make us appear acceptable, ie hair, skin, style of dress, etc. Growing up, I bought into that, because I longed to be accepted by my white peers. As I got older and my world expanded, so did my sense of self. I was always a natural leaning, bohemian styled person, but I evolved the more I realized being a beautiful natural living and loving black woman was a great thing!
As some of you know, I just returned from "The Vineyard". It has a very long history of being the vacation spot for well to do black folk. However, there is also a distasteful history of discrimination amongst blacks who were darked skinned. If you didn't pass the "paper bag test", you were not accepted into the social gatherings. My granddad used to visit the vineyard back in the 50's. Ironically, he would have been allowed in homes that I, as a dark skinned person, would not have been. Weird, eh? It is no longer that way, well at least not obviously so. I thought about you all while I was there. I saw you in the faces of the black and multi racial women I passed on the streets. One very light skinned woman had her baby in a sling as her white partner held her hand. I remember a dark skinned woman rocking a head of huge natural hair, with her birkenstocks and scents of patcholi. There were spanish women from all over who were obviously proud of their banging bodies and style!! I was like, "dang--there are some pretty women here!"
I stayed up the street from one of the most beautiful homes I have ever seen and later learned that it was owned by the inventor of norton antivirus. His wife is a black woman! There were all types of family compositions in the "ink well". It is truly my happy place!!
Oh yeah, I saw Spike Lee who was rocking a Yankees flag in front of his home. Did I mention it is red sox territory!??! So typical Spike.
Anyway, that's my humble contribution to this great conversation


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Oh yeah, I saw Spike Lee who was rocking a Yankees flag in front of his home. Did I mention it is red sox territory!??! So typical Spike.
Anyway, that's my humble contribution to this great conversation









Spike is bold up here in Sox Nation.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Spike is bold up here in Sox Nation.










I overheard this guy with a very heavy Boston accent, talking about how much he hated Spike After seeing that Yankee's Flag, I totally got it!


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
A hair question for those that are natural and WOTH:

Do you straighten your hair for job interviews?

I wear a bun for interviews. My hair is about bra strap length so its pretty easy to wear it back.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I actually find that at a lot of Black boards I frequent, sistas who were the nerds in HS, or like me listened to white music back in the mid 80's.. I often wonder where ya'll were when I was a kid.








Shay


Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I know, right? It would have made my teen years a lot easier and perhaps more fun. *sigh*

mmmmmmm hmm!!









although, sometimes when i am feeling philosophical, i wonder how much the 'outsiderness' itself contributes to the experience. yknow? i went to a large, diverse HBCU center and most of the close friends i have now, i met then - i think there were finally enough of a concentration of black folks around for us to stumble across other 'alternablacks' like ourselves. but almost all of us had had that experience of being the 'only' - the only one in AP physics, the only one at the duran duran concert, the only one reading ursula k. leguin or octavia butler novels, whatever. and i think it is a big part of what turned us into the iconoclastic, individualistic people that we are. which, i wouldn't trade for the world, even though growing up was a little lonely at times.


----------



## oyinmama

@ purplegirl - thanks for the martha's vineyard stories... makes me smile. my great aunt used to run a guest house in oak bluffs so, even though my parents didn't have money, we used to go every summer when young children ... my mom or one of the cousins was always helping with the books and me and my sister would carry sheets and towels to the rooms or fill juice glasses at breakfast, LOL! it was a great time to see extended family and a wonderful, comfortable, homey vacation situation. i haven't been since she sold the houses when i was a teenager, but now that i have a little one maybe i'll think about reviving that tradition. . .perhaps next year when he'll be old enough to fit on the back of a bicycle.







when we were little it was a wonderful experience; the beach choked with black sunbathers @ the inkwell, walking by ourselves early in the morning to pick up apple fritters at the bakery, watching them make fudge and pull saltwater taffy in the window of the chocolate shop, making friends with enough of the neighborhood cops to get a little police pin @ the precinct, and of course catching the rings at flying horses. good stuff.

the tradition of MV is indeed an interesting one, proud and affirming, but not without certain embarrassments/conflicts for today's Progressive ***** around the history of color and class... i remember my grandmother (who looked and behaved like a foulmouthed lena horne) smoking her cigarette and bitterly complaining about MV's cliquishness. she'd be like, 'why would i want to go up there and be around the same idiots i can see down here?'







this is the same woman who, when the 'good hair' concept came up in conversation, would snap, "don't be ridiculous. if it grows out of your head it's good hair."

lol my grandma was the greatest









& LOL @ spike lee!! is brooklyn in the house??!!


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
In HS, my friends and I were outside the box and yes, we were nerds *(although I don't think we would have admitted it back then).* Going to a math and science high school and liking things like Star Trek helped.









LOL - so true! it's part of why me and the hubster had to make the t-shirts. so many years spent ashamed, hiding the nerdly truth!!









we had to take back the night.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
@ purplegirl - thanks for the martha's vineyard stories... makes me smile. my great aunt used to run a guest house in oak bluffs so, even though my parents didn't have money, we used to go every summer when young children ... my mom or one of the cousins was always helping with the books and me and my sister would carry sheets and towels to the rooms or fill juice glasses at breakfast, LOL! it was a great time to see extended family and a wonderful, comfortable, homey vacation situation. i haven't been since she sold the houses when i was a teenager, but now that i have a little one maybe i'll think about reviving that tradition. . .perhaps next year when he'll be old enough to fit on the back of a bicycle.







when we were little it was a wonderful experience; the beach choked with black sunbathers @ the inkwell, walking by ourselves early in the morning to pick up apple fritters at the bakery, watching them make fudge and pull saltwater taffy in the window of the chocolate shop, making friends with enough of the neighborhood cops to get a little police pin @ the precinct, and of course catching the rings at flying horses. good stuff.

the tradition of MV is indeed an interesting one, proud and affirming, but not without certain embarrassments/conflicts for today's Progressive ***** around the history of color and class... *i remember my grandmother (who looked and behaved like a foulmouthed lena horne) smoking her cigarette and bitterly complaining about MV's cliquishness. she'd be like, 'why would i want to go up there and be around the same idiots i can see down here?'







* this is the same woman who, when the 'good hair' concept came up in conversation, would snap, "don't be ridiculous. if it grows out of your head it's good hair."

lol my grandma was the greatest









& LOL @ spike lee!! is brooklyn in the house??!!










Omg. I love it







That's my kinda woman!!
You should definitely go back to the vineyard. You have a lot more history there than I do. The same charm is there but the diversity of folks has grown.

I discovered this art gallery called Feather Stone. It was magical and guess, what--a black woman is the executive director







. I spent hours there, walked the labyrinth and hiked the trails on the property. If you go next year, be sure to let me know!


----------



## shayinme

@Purplegirl & Oyinmama, all this talk about MV is making me think maybe next summer I should go down there. Its less than 2 hours from me and might make for a good close to home vacation.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
@Purplegirl & Oyinmama, all this talk about MV is making me think maybe next summer I should go down there. Its less than 2 hours from me and might make for a good close to home vacation.

Girl, what are you waiting for? From what I have gleaned, you'd love it and feel right at home! If you want to go, start planning now. It gets crazy busy and getting a ferry reservation for your car, becomes nearly impossible after Jan. I cannot recommend the place we stayed this year, but I certainly can vouch for the spot we previously rented. I can get you the info, if you'd like.







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Girl, what are you waiting for? From what I have gleaned, you'd love it and feel right at home! If you want to go, start planning now. It gets crazy busy and getting a ferry reservation for your car, becomes nearly impossible after Jan. I cannot recommend the place we stayed this year, but I certainly can vouch for the spot we previously rented. I can get you the info, if you'd like.







:

Please share your information with me too! I want to take DS to the beach for his 3rd birthday, but I was unsure as too which one. Since you spoke of traveling to MV I have looked up information on the island and contacted my cousin who visits the area frequently.

As for straightning my hair, I have not done so for interviews. However I do plan on straightning my hair when I take pictures for my med school aplications. Whichever pictures look best I will submit.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
A hair question for those that are natural and WOTH:

Do you straighten your hair for job interviews?

never!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
*Please share your information with me too! I want to take DS to the beach for his 3rd birthday, but I was unsure as too which one. Since you spoke of traveling to MV I have looked up information on the island and contacted my cousin who visits the area frequently.
*

As for straightning my hair, I have not done so for interviews. However I do plan on straightning my hair when I take pictures for my med school aplications. Whichever pictures look best I will submit.

PM me and I'll be glad to share with you all I know







:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
LOL - so true! it's part of why me and the hubster had to make the t-shirts. so many years spent ashamed, hiding the nerdly truth!!









we had to take back the night.










I almost got one of those shirts, I think, if you were the one selling them online!


----------



## purplegirl

Can I tell yall how excited I am to see this thread popping again







: It's also especially nice to see mamas that I have encountered on other parts of MDC join our tribe!!


----------



## User101

Hey mamas! I just wanted to pop in and say I am so sorry for unpleasantness that was on this thread earlier, and to thank all of you who reported/PM'd rather than trying to deal with the poster yourself. I wasn't sure whether to post this or not, but it really did make "clean up" easier. Thank you, thank you, thank you!


----------



## eilonwy

Well... i guess i'm glad i missed it.









I loaded videos of the oldest three kids to the net. The catch is that you have to be my Facebook friend to see them.







PM me if you can't find me and you'd like to do so.

The kids are discussing some mythical creature they refer to as "The Next Baby." I told them that no, there would be no more babies. "Oh, you might get one next year!" says Bean. "From where?" "From an egg," he says. "Inside your body, because you're a mammal."







: "There will be NO MORE BABIES in this house." "There might be... next year you can fertilize an egg and then we'll have another baby. I'd like to see another baby boy like Bear."








:














: Child's gone and lost his MIND.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Ok, im mad i missed the past few days convo (ive finally caught up), but im choosing not to misdirect the flow of the current chat to give my less than 2 cents about what was discussed, lol.

Only thing I want to comment on is,...I wish I would try to straighten my hair for a j.o.b. lol. Other than it being impossible to do (i have locks down to my butt), i think that if they have a problem with my hair during the interview, they just did me a huge favor, because not only are they interviewing me, im interviewing THEM and they FAIL my interview at that point and would promptly be dismissed as a possible employer.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Well... i guess i'm glad i missed it.









*I loaded videos of the oldest three kids to the net. The catch is that you have to be my Facebook friend to see them.







PM me if you can't find me and you'd like to do so.*

The kids are discussing some mythical creature they refer to as "The Next Baby." I told them that no, there would be no more babies. "Oh, you might get one next year!" says Bean. "From where?" "From an egg," he says. "Inside your body, because you're a mammal."







: "There will be NO MORE BABIES in this house." "There might be... next year you can fertilize an egg and then we'll have another baby. I'd like to see another baby boy like Bear."








:














: Child's gone and lost his MIND.









Ohh, I am one of your facebook friends so I gotta go take a look!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Ok, im mad i missed the past few days convo (ive finally caught up), but im choosing not to misdirect the flow of the current chat to give my less than 2 cents about what was discussed, lol.

Only thing I want to comment on is,...I wish I would try to straighten my hair for a j.o.b. lol. *Other than it being impossible to do (i have locks down to my butt)*, i think that if they have a problem with my hair during the interview, they just did me a huge favor, because not only are they interviewing me, im interviewing THEM and they FAIL my interview at that point and would promptly be dismissed as a possible employer.


Wow, those sound lovely mama!!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Well... i guess i'm glad i missed it.









I loaded videos of the oldest three kids to the net. The catch is that you have to be my Facebook friend to see them.







PM me if you can't find me and you'd like to do so.

The kids are discussing some mythical creature they refer to as "The Next Baby." I told them that no, there would be no more babies. "Oh, you might get one next year!" says Bean. "From where?" "From an egg," he says. "Inside your body, because you're a mammal."







: "There will be NO MORE BABIES in this house." "There might be... next year you can fertilize an egg and then we'll have another baby. I'd like to see another baby boy like Bear."








:














: Child's gone and lost his MIND.









That is too cute! How old is Bean?
I can't wait until my boy is talking. People say I'll regret saying that I can't wait for him to talk, but when I hear gems like that...!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *annettemarie* 
Hey mamas! I just wanted to pop in and say I am so sorry for unpleasantness that was on this thread earlier, and to thank all of you who reported/PM'd rather than trying to deal with the poster yourself. I wasn't sure whether to post this or not, but it really did make "clean up" easier. Thank you, thank you, thank you!

I guess it's a good thing that I didn't read the whole thread before I joined.







:


----------



## eilonwy

Bean's 5.5. He was born talking and hasn't stopped yet; You've missed such gems as "That smilie is just like me, he never shuts up!" (







) and "I don't love you, I'm just cold."







He's forever saying things that make me laugh or shake my head or have my eyes rolling around in shock and horror.









There will be no more babies. Bean's too short and skinny to ride without a carseat, so we can't fit another kid in the minivan anyway.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I almost got one of those shirts, I think, if you were the one selling them online!









LOL - what a small online world









@ eilonwy: i am *cracking up* at bean's plans for your future









i am certainly not in the 'can't wait' camp for our baby monster - i appreciate every stage, and am in no particular rush to leave this 3.5 month moment where he grins like crazy, babbles in martian, eats only one thing and can't run.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

Wow, those sound lovely mama!!


Aw, thanks lady!









Sometimes they can be more curse than blessing, but im still glad to have them. I just had the thought the other day that my next length "milestone" is to be able to stuff the ends in my pants pockets, lol I figure thas another 2 to 4 years if Im so blessed.


----------



## Draupadi

oyinmama said:


> Quote:
> 
> LOL - what a small online world
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you're the OyinMama I'm thinking of, then it must've been you! Love your stuff, btw (am I allowed to say that????).
> 
> Quote:
> 
> i am certainly not in the 'can't wait' camp for our baby monster - i appreciate every stage, and am in no particular rush to leave this 3.5 month moment where he grins like crazy, babbles in martian, eats only one thing and can't run.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Every stage brings its own wonderfulness (made-up word, I know!). I'm loving each and every one of them! I'm loving that the boy understands what I say now (and often chooses to ignore me!). I love that I can understand his needs now that he's finally signing back! I also am loving watching him dance. The kid was getting down to Sarah Vaughn today, and Apache Indian (anyone remember that from back in the day?) bhangra yesterday. It's all so beautiful and it just gets better, Oyinmama!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Aw, thanks lady!









Sometimes they can be more curse than blessing, but im still glad to have them. I just had the thought the other day that my next length "milestone" is to be able to stuff the ends in my pants pockets, lol I figure thas another 2 to 4 years if Im so blessed.

I'm often jealous of locs. When I see women with beautiful, gorgeous locs, I turn green with envy.







My brother has past-the-butt length locs too that he's been growing for over a decade. I don't know if I have the patience to grow them, and the fact is that now that I'm looking for a job, I'd have to wait anyway and keep it the way it is.


----------



## purplegirl

WilliamsMama said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *oyinmama*
> I*f you're the OyinMama I'm thinking of, then it must've been you! Love your stuff, btw (am I allowed to say that????).
> *
> 
> Every stage brings its own wonderfulness (made-up word, I know!). I'm loving each and every one of them! I'm loving that the boy understands what I say now (and often chooses to ignore me!). I love that I can understand his needs now that he's finally signing back! I also am loving watching him dance. The kid was getting down to Sarah Vaughn today, and Apache Indian (anyone remember that from back in the day?) bhangra yesterday. It's all so beautiful and it just gets better, Oyinmama!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> 
> Yes, Yes, yes!! We've had our love fest for her up thread! Hmmm, I think I need to place an order
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm often jealous of locs. When I see women with beautiful, gorgeous locs, I turn green with envy.







My brother has past-the-butt length locs too that he's been growing for over a decade. I don't know if I have the patience to grow them, and the fact is that now that I'm looking for a job, I'd have to wait anyway and keep it the way it is.









thanks, but i been locked 9 years next month and i STILL get lock envy frm looking at fellow lockers, lol. I also get fro, twist-out, braid-out, loose hair envy as well. It never ends, i suppose, lol.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Hi everyone!

I think I may have posted once on this thread way back when, but I just noticed that it's picked up again







:

I'm saying hi from nyc, originally from new orleans. I'm expecting my first little one in December and I'd love any wonderful advice you ladies may have to give about dealing with pregnancy. I'm almost 5 months and I'm feeling pretty clueless and stressed out and yet desperately hoping to stay away from the statistics for black women (low-birth weight babies, higher chances of stress leading to complications, etc. etc. etc.) I am planning a homebirth with a midwife and I'm starting my yoga classes tomorrow. I know I just need to calm down and keep eating more then i am now--I do well in the early part of the day but by then end I am so tired, a balanced meal just doesn't really happen for me. Any ideas?


----------



## ajv

congratulations, please sit down more and put your feet up...mama.

i understand the tired at the end of the day thing. so what i am about to say may be at the height of consumerism...do the milkshake/smoothie thing, buy TWO blenders, so that one is available while the other is in the dishwasher/dirty. or buy one blender and get another glass jar on ebay. drink a healthy dinner and call it a nite...that is my .02 ask your husband to join you to avoid sympathy weight...

if you cant eat anything else, make sure to eat your protein and try to sneak in some calcium...eating protein will help avoid preclampsia IMO...


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ajv* 
congratulations, please sit down more and put your feet up...mama.

i understand the tired at the end of the day thing. so what i am about to say may be at the height of consumerism...do the milkshake/smoothie thing, buy TWO blenders, so that one is available while the other is in the dishwasher/dirty. .

Or purchase the magic bullet or it's knock off at Macy's. I got our for $15.99 on sale. We have 4 to 6, I can't remember, individual blending jars that can be used for drinking. We prepare the blend cups the night before so that that we have to do in the morning is blend and go.

During my pregnancy I drank smoothies like a fiend because they made me feel good. I never knew that it was a trend or steeped in consumerism (laughing smily...too lazy to search), but then again I know nothing of what is going on in the world if it is not contained in a tex book.

Well anyway I had a terribly easy very basic too healthy pregnancy except for a placenta previa. I worked in autosales management so I never had time to sit down and eat any meals except for lunch. I actually lost pounds during my last trimester and ended up with a very healthy baby who was born one month early to spare my life, not because he needed to be delivered in any way.

Don't stress. Workout or walk/run if you can and live your life as you did before pregnancy. I am a glasss is half full type of person so I kept everything positive, except fot the fact that my baby bulge kept me from getting a goods night sleep.


----------



## Bloomingstar

great advice! thanks







somehow smoothies at night didn't occur to me but that makes total sense







: I'm still keeping up with some of my exercise--I dance in an afro-caribbean company so I can't do all of the things I'd typically do in a rehearsal but I still go and get some movement in or I just wouldn't feel right without it. And I am finding it a little difficult to figure out a comfy position for sleep. I keep waking up on my back but I know that's eventually not going to be so good, so I have been playing around with positioning pillows and my husband here and there. This week I think I've finally really started feeling the limitations in how I can move around and that's just interesting to me as a dancer and I'm trying to keep it on the "interesting" side and not let it slide over to infuriating, hehe.


----------



## AndrewsMother

My doctor told me to sleep however I could get mysleep because after the baby was born I would not get any. During the 2nd and thirs trimester I used DH as a pillow, but I always awoke flat on my back. Sleeping on my back felt wonderful and it kept tiny baby reet out of my ribs.

Wow an afro-caribbean dance company!!! How long have you been dancing with the company?


----------



## oyinmama

WilliamsMama said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *oyinmama*
> If you're the OyinMama I'm thinking of, then it must've been you! Love your stuff, btw (am I allowed to say that????).
> 
> hee hee, COOL!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw i love this smiley:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> Quote:
> 
> Every stage brings its own wonderfulness (made-up word, I know!). I'm loving each and every one of them! I'm loving that the boy understands what I say now (and often chooses to ignore me!). I love that I can understand his needs now that he's finally signing back! I also am loving watching him dance. The kid was getting down to Sarah Vaughn today, and Apache Indian (anyone remember that from back in the day?) bhangra yesterday. It's all so beautiful and it just gets better, Oyinmama!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> this made me grin like a crazy person. hooray for every moment! i was just looking at the monster semi-swaddled in the co-sleeper (we do a mini swaddle when it's hot that's like a little bolero, LOL) and i can't STAND how adorable he is and how much i love his chewy little face! can't stand it at all. we are so excited to be on this journey with him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks, but i been locked 9 years next month and i STILL get lock envy frm looking at fellow lockers, lol. I also get fro, twist-out, braid-out, loose hair envy as well. It never ends, i suppose, lol.
> 
> HA! so true. i had lock envy w/my first fro. then i had a bunch of happy locked years, and later developed fro envy to a nearly psychotic degree, such that i actually unraveled my 4-yr old locks. now i have a huge fro (especially after pregnancy, whoo hoo!) and am dealing with i-wish-i-had-time-to-play-in-my-hair-more envy.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar*
> great advice! thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> somehow smoothies at night didn't occur to me but that makes total sense
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : I'm still keeping up with some of my exercise--I dance in an afro-caribbean company so I can't do all of the things I'd typically do in a rehearsal but I still go and get some movement in or I just wouldn't feel right without it. And I am finding it a little difficult to figure out a comfy position for sleep. I keep waking up on my back but I know that's eventually not going to be so good, so I have been playing around with positioning pillows and my husband here and there. This week I think I've finally really started feeling the limitations in how I can move around and that's just interesting to me as a dancer and I'm trying to keep it on the "interesting" side and not let it slide over to infuriating, hehe.
> 
> 
> hey, hi bloomingstar, and congratulations, and welcome! what dance company, if i may ask?
> 
> re: the sleep positions issue. i have read that, as long as it's comfortable to be on your back, go ahead and sleep on your back - your body will let you know in no uncertain terms when it's no longer appropriate to sleep that way. when things started getting uncomfortable for me (had my first in april) a miracle foam mattress topper helped SO MUCH, as did one of those preggo pillows. i got the boppy, but there are even bigger ones out there if there's room for it in yr bed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for nutrition, one key for me was barilla PLUS pasta. part of the flour in it is flax seeds, part is chickpeas, so there is WAY much extra protein and fiber and omegas in it. also, i listened to a preggo podcast early on that listed walnuts and blueberies as pregnancy 'superfoods' so i would put pounded walnuts in EVERYTHING: multigrain pancake mix, pasta (with or without pesto, sometimes just as an additive), cereal, etc.
> 
> also, i released myself from the psychological need to have meals all the time, and dealt with the incessant hunger with healthy snacks. i craved lots of dairy, so it would be about, for instance, a sliced apple, sliced cheddar, and grainy crackers. or, yogurt and go-lean crunch (a high protein natural cereal). these things could be assembled almost instantly, and this was important b/c of how suddenly and strongly my hunger would come down. if i tried to cook all the time i might have gone crazy. or hungry.


----------



## AndrewsMother

******Warning this is a hair vent******

If I posted yesterday my vent would have been full of vulgarities. I have calmed down a considerable amount, but never the less I am vexed. This vent could branch out in many directions but the first and foremost problem is my hair. My this curly/wavy/bushy/unmanageable/tangly mess of wonderful hair is GONE. Well not all gone, but if I were in grade school I might be called bald headed. I am not the type of girl that likes or looks good withshort hair. I have a rather large head that needs to be sufficiently covered. Over the past month I have cut at least 9 inches of hair from my ends. Since June my ends had become dry & damaged. Not just split, but straw dry and horribly damaged.

When I straightened my hair in April for a funeral my ends were NOTHING like they were yesterday. My hair was healthy when I left Atlanta after spending 6 weeks there until the first of June. Over the past two months the state of my hair has deteriorated so much that I was forced to cut it. Yesterday after removing all of my dead ends my hair when straight is chin length. Maybe. After wetting my hair it has coiled into a small afro that is just too tiny for my large head.

This miserable Houston heat damaged my hair. I already HATE it here and everything has gone wrong since I moved here, but to now lose my hair because of the climate I am livid. I even stopped washing may hair on a daily basis but maybe that would have helped it to retain some moisture.

Now my hair feels great, but I am unsure as to how long it will take before what remains is ravaged by the sun and heat. I have friends who have recently moved to the area and they too complain about hair damage that has occurred over the summer.

I use baby buttercreme, but I ran out after I returned from Atlanta so I used other moisturizers and I wonder if that had anything to do with the damage, but I doubt it. I have spent many summers in Georgia using nothing but hair oil without any type of hair damage so I am perplexed.....and angry.

*sigh*


----------



## shayinme

Sorry your hair is giving you the blues, you may not want to hear this but honestly I think everyone looks good in a low fro. Just throw some hoops and lipstick on and you will be good to go. Going from a lot of hair to a little can be a shock beleive me, when I decided to go natural amost 9 years ago, I was in one of Chicago's chi-chi salons and you could have heard a pin drop when I said take it all off. I am talking shoudler length and I walked out with a not even an inch on my head. Now I had asked for me but beleive me it took a good 2 weeks before I stopped going what have I done.

Maybe you can check out Nappturality and see what other sistas in your area do to deal with the sun and heat.


----------



## barose

Sorry about your hair issues.







Cutting my hair is my worst nightmare so I feel you. I do think a TWA or fro looks good on just about everyone. It may takes some time getting used to it, but I'm sure you'll love it in time. Think of the advantages.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







Sorry your hair is giving you the blues, you may not want to hear this but honestly I think everyone looks good in a low fro. Just throw some hoops and lipstick on and you will be good to go. Going from a lot of hair to a little can be a shock beleive me, when I decided to go natural amost 9 years ago, I was in one of Chicago's chi-chi salons and you could have heard a pin drop when I said take it all off. I am talking shoudler length and I walked out with a not even an inch on my head. Now I had asked for me but beleive me it took a good 2 weeks before I stopped going what have I done.

Maybe you can check out Nappturality and see what other sistas in your area do to deal with the sun and heat.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
Sorry about your hair issues.







Cutting my hair is my worst nightmare so I feel you. I do think a TWA or fro looks good on just about everyone. It may takes some time getting used to it, but I'm sure you'll love it in time. Think of the advantages.










I will check out Nappturality. Short hair is not much of a shock to me as I cut off all of my hair in 2002 went natural for the 2nd time and 2005 for the third time. I relaxed in August and by december I knew that I was done with relaxers for good. I am shocked at the quick deterioration of my hair. Two months is not a long time.

My hair grows quickly. When I cut my hair in spril of 05 it was shoulder less than one year later.

I am truly thinking of the advantages, but I just miss my hair. We are taking family pictures next month and I wanted to have bouncy curls. When I took pictures in 2005 my mother said that I looked like a lesbian and I have yet to recover from her remarks.







:

Maybe the real reason that I am upset is that my grandfather loved longhair on women. He hated to see me cut it ever. I decided a few years ago that I would not cut it again for him...because it made him happy. It really did. He died in April, I straightened my hair for his funeral. I only straightened my hair when I visited him, because I loved to see the look in his eyes. I guess I reaffirmed my vow after he died to never cut it. Yes I know that he is dead and will never know.....but my grandfather was my biggest supporter. Both mentally and finacially and there is that part of me that feels as if I have let him down.

Wow, maybe i need therapy!!









I don't look that bad. I am just upset how this all occured.

Thanks for the hugs. Hopefully my twist out will look okay when I take them down in the morning.


----------



## barose

I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather.







It sounds like you had a beautiful relationship. Your hair grows fast and it will be long again in no time as long as you take care of it and your body!









For what its worth, my hair is bra strap length and I have a phobia of cutting it myself.







I dream about those cute curly shoulder or chin length bobs but don't have the courage. It would be so much easier to swim if I did that though - the weight of my hair kills my neck.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather.







It sounds like you had a beautiful relationship. Your hair grows fast and it will be long again in no time as long as you take care of it and your body!









For what its worth, my hair is bra strap length and I have a phobia of cutting it myself.







I dream about those cute curly shoulder or chin length bobs but don't have the courage. It would be so much easier to swim if I did that though - the weight of my hair kills my neck.

Before yesterday it took me an hour to wash and comb my hair. I can only imagine how long it takes you to do the same.

Maybe this is all a blessing in disguise. Who knows? I am normally a glass is half full type of girl so I have found the positives. I just had to release the negative energy. My ROTC classes begin in the fall. I will have PT twice a week in hopes of earning a scholarship to med school in addition to 22 class hours and a 40 hour monday - friday work week. I am going to believe that God knows what is best because my time will be limited.


----------



## oyinmama

hi piad - what a great perspective you have come to about your hair and your upcoming time constraints. i hope that you find out some info at nappturality.com to help you avoid future heat/sun damage but let me share a few things that helped when i snowbirded in arizona one year -

1. a shower filter. go out and get one, like right now. water quality varies so greatly around the country and when i got to AZ my hair and skin INSTANTLY began to feel like straw. when i got a simle $20 shower filter from the hardware store, it INSTANTLY began to feel soft again.

2. protective styles. wear your hair 'in' not 'out' - i.e. styles that 'protect' your ends rather than have them flying in the wind and getting baked and split by the hot dry air. i'm talking twists, cornrows, a bun, bantu knots, individual braids, whatever.

3. moisture. even if you don't wash your hair every day, mist it between washes with some water, a spray bottle of water with a dash of conditioner shaken in, or water with a little glycerine... experiment until you find something that feels light and comfortable to you.

4. condition like crazy. maybe try conditioner-only washing half the time, if not all the time. if you don't use a lot of styling product, you may not need shampoo (most of which are detergent based an potentially stripping) to cleanse; you may be able to use condish, condish w/baking soda mixed in, or a soap-based cleanser.

enjoy your hair! and celebrate it (and what sounds like an amazing relationship with your grandfather) as you grow it back.

((hugs))


----------



## Draupadi

Aww, Piad. I feel you and your hair woes. I'm going through some myself and have finally decided to go get my hair done.
I've considered getting my hair chopped off as well but my gigantic forehead stops me everytime







:.
Since the birth of my son, I just have not taken care of my hair like I used to. It's a curly/kinky 3b/c and gets tangled if you look at it, so you can probably feel my frustration. For the past few months, I've been shedding hair like crazy, and when I comb my hair, clumps come out.







My DH finally convinced me to go get my hair done at a chi-chi salon (I've always done my hair myself and haven't cut/trimmed my hair in years. It's about the middle of my back in some places, but in some places it's just all over the place) and I'm going to let them style it. I never learned to properly care for my hair and am scared to death of getting it done.
Anyway, I just wanted to let you know that I totally sympathize.


----------



## purplegirl

Piad, you've gotten amazing advice from our sister-friends! My hair has been natural for a few years but darned if last month I didn't get an itch to perm it. Thank goodness, my sisters talked me down! My youngest sister who had a head full of hair, got the clippers out last week and shaved it all off!







I could.not.believe.it.! She looks gorgeous though. Her philosophy is that, "it is just hair and it will grow back".

I strongly agree with Oyinmama's advice. But more importantly, know that you are gorgeous no matter what!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Piad, i can relate, like oyinmama was saying, I used to live in AZ and it was SOOO HARD on my hair. Between the dust and debri flying, the harsh sun and the dry winds, i had to condition like I never conditioned before, lol. I tried to keep my hair under wraps when outside and i spritzed most days as well.

Just be careful with yourself and your hair and dont be hard on yourself about hair in relation to your grandfather. Condolences on his passing, but im sure he would want you to be happy and to see your smiling face. Don't stress sis, he's still a big part of you long hair or not.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
hi piad - what a great perspective you have come to about your hair and your upcoming time constraints. i hope that you find out some info at nappturality.com to help you avoid future heat/sun damage but let me share a few things that helped when i snowbirded in arizona one year -

1. a shower filter. go out and get one, like right now. water quality varies so greatly around the country and when i got to AZ my hair and skin INSTANTLY began to feel like straw. when i got a simle $20 shower filter from the hardware store, it INSTANTLY began to feel soft again.

This is a great idea. We are from a softer water area and I am sure that the water quality has made a difference.

2. protective styles. wear your hair 'in' not 'out' - i.e. styles that 'protect' your ends rather than have them flying in the wind and getting baked and split by the hot dry air. i'm talking twists, cornrows, a bun, bantu knots, individual braids, whatever.

I am chided for my standard old maid look of two braids parted down the middle and pinned together. I decided to try something new, allowing my hair to have an afro look more often. Perhaps the added exposure had a negative impact on my tresses.

3. moisture. even if you don't wash your hair every day, mist it between washes with some water, a spray bottle of water with a dash of conditioner shaken in, or water with a little glycerine... experiment until you find something that feels light and comfortable to you.

4. condition like crazy. maybe try conditioner-only washing half the time, if not all the time. if you don't use a lot of styling product, you may not need shampoo (most of which are detergent based an potentially stripping) to cleanse; you may be able to use condish, condish w/baking soda mixed in, or a soap-based cleanser.
I was a No Poo girl until recently as well. I washed my hair with shampoo because the heat caused my head to sweat more. I am beginning to realize what went wrong. Everything that you described above I did consistently in the past. I just got off track,

enjoy your hair! and celebrate it (and what sounds like an amazing relationship with your grandfather) as you grow it back.

My Grandfather was amazing. When I meet people who grew up with out grandparents I feel sorry for them, and when I meet people who had cold, distant grandparents I just can't relate.

((hugs))


Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Aww, Piad. I feel you and your hair woes. I'm going through some myself and have finally decided to go get my hair done.
I've considered getting my hair chopped off as well but my gigantic forehead stops me everytime







:.
Since the birth of my son, I just have not taken care of my hair like I used to. It's a curly/kinky 3b/c and gets tangled if you look at it, so you can probably feel my frustration. For the past few months, I've been shedding hair like crazy, and when I comb my hair, clumps come out.







My DH finally convinced me to go get my hair done at a chi-chi salon (I've always done my hair myself and haven't cut/trimmed my hair in years. It's about the middle of my back in some places, but in some places it's just all over the place) and I'm going to let them style it. I never learned to properly care for my hair and am scared to death of getting it done.
Anyway, I just wanted to let you know that I totally sympathize.









Thanks. I just learned to care for my hair once I went natural. Relaxed hair never worked for me. My hair no matter what the length always looks short because it coils into bouncy corkscews and z-curls. I never really know how long my hair is until I straighten it. Pressing my hair is somewhat like opening present on Christmas morning. I am always surprised. My family, well some of my family, most of my family, would prefer that I would visit chi-chi salons on a weekly basis but I have no desire. That and the thought of parting with well over $70 a week makes me cringe. My son could have a new pair of shoes a week and book!

How old is your son? Are you experiencing post partum hair loss. I thought that it was a myth, but my hair did shed a lot for about a week or so.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Piad, you've gotten amazing advice from our sister-friends! My hair has been natural for a few years but darned if last month I didn't get an itch to perm it. Thank goodness, my sisters talked me down! My youngest sister who had a head full of hair, got the clippers out last week and shaved it all off!







I could.not.believe.it.! She looks gorgeous though. Her philosophy is that, "it is just hair and it will grow back".

I strongly agree with Oyinmama's advice. But more importantly, know that you are gorgeous no matter what!









Indeed, I have received great advice! Even though I know that my hair will not thrive with a relaxer I sometimes envy the supposed ease of relaxed hair. Yes, the hair will grow back. I would have felt better about the whole cut situation if I cut my hair because I wanted to instead of because I had too.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Piad, i can relate, like oyinmama was saying, I used to live in AZ and it was SOOO HARD on my hair. Between the dust and debri flying, the harsh sun and the dry winds, i had to condition like I never conditioned before, lol. I tried to keep my hair under wraps when outside and i spritzed most days as well.

Just be careful with yourself and your hair and dont be hard on yourself about hair in relation to your grandfather. Condolences on his passing, but im sure he would want you to be happy and to see your smiling face. Don't stress sis, he's still a big part of you long hair or not.









I am definetly going to return to my every other day conditioning routine. Yes, my grandfather hated to see me scowl, and worked too hard to make sure I was happy.

Thank you for all of the phenomenal advice and support that I have be given!!


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Before yesterday it took me an hour to wash and comb my hair. I can only imagine how long it takes you to do the same.



It actually only takes me 5-10 minutes to comb it out.







I do a conditioner wash daily in the shower and shampoo (or do ACV/water) about twice a week due to my workouts (and sweating). That takes about 8 minutes.

Listen to oyinmama. She knows her stuff!


----------



## jeca

What's a "chi-chi salon"?

OT, what does everyone think of this?
http://gmy.news.yahoo.com/v/9240033


----------



## eilonwy

At least they had a black woman to talk about it.









Cameras are funny things. I can see easily how that effect might be achieved with even my cheapass digital camera; It probably took no work at all with the fancy schmancy camera they used to take those pictures. Makeup, haircolor, light, camera, voila! Beyonce is white.







I think that the folks doing the ad should have recognized that she looked a bit too white, and that someone was going to get their shorts in a twist. Other than that though... well, I guess it's cool that white people are a bit more aware than they have been.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:

How old is your son? Are you experiencing post partum hair loss. I thought that it was a myth, but my hair did shed a lot for about a week or so.
My son is 15 months old. I did lose lots of hair in the beginning, but I'm still shedding and my hair is tangly and brittle. It changed so much after I had him. I guess it's just a combination of natural changes and the fact that I haven't been as good to my hair as I was pre-pregnancy...It also grew really fast when I was pregnant, which made it much harder to care for after pregnancy.
And the things that I used on my hair just don't seem to work like they used to.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 
It actually only takes me 5-10 minutes to comb it out.







I do a conditioner wash daily in the shower and shampoo (or do ACV/water) about twice a week due to my workouts (and sweating). That takes about 8 minutes.

Listen to oyinmama. She knows her stuff!

















I have been meaning to pm Oyinmama to ask her more questions since I hear that she has the inside scoop on good products!



jeca said:


> What's a "chi-chi salon"?
> A chi-chi salon is one that is well appointed with specialty services and at times a more refined client base.
> QUOTE]
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama*
> My son is 15 months old. I did lose lots of hair in the beginning, but I'm still shedding and my hair is tangly and brittle. It changed so much after I had him. I guess it's just a combination of natural changes and the fact that I haven't been as good to my hair as I was pre-pregnancy...It also grew really fast when I was pregnant, which made it much harder to care for after pregnancy.
> And the things that I used on my hair just don't seem to work like they used to.
> 
> My hair changes textures constantly so I know exactly what you mean.
> 
> Just a random question........I am not open to the idea of random spankings. I have popped Andrews hands from time to time. He loves to run in parking lots. All of my black friends spank. They think that I am crazy and setting my son up for failure because I don't. Supposedly black children have to be spanked in oreder for them to thrive.
> What do you moms think about spanking and the necessity of it for black children?


----------



## purplegirl

piad said:


> I have been meaning to pm Oyinmama to ask her more questions since I hear that she has the inside scoop on good products!
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jeca*
> What's a "chi-chi salon"?
> A chi-chi salon is one that is well appointed with specialty services and at times a more refined client base.
> QUOTE]
> 
> My hair changes textures constantly so I know exactly what you mean.
> 
> Just a random question........I am not open to the idea of random spankings. I have popped Andrews hands from time to time. He loves to run in parking lots. All of my black friends spank. They think that I am crazy and setting my son up for failure because I don't. Supposedly black children have to be spanked in oreder for them to thrive.
> What do you moms think about spanking and the necessity of it for black children?
> 
> This is a forum that upholds gentle discipline, so discussions about the merits of spanking are not allowed. For the record, I don't believe that spankings are EVER the answer. I think we are setting our children up to continue to perpetuate the notion that they "must be spanked". I'd say to ignore your friends and do follow your gut!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

This is a forum that upholds gentle discipline, so discussions about the merits of spanking are not allowed. For the record, I don't believe that spankings are EVER the answer. I think we are setting our children up to continue to perpetuate the notion that they "must be spanked". I'd say to ignore your friends and do follow your gut!


Perhaps I should have worded my question differently because I am not looking for the merits to spanking because IMO there are none. I don't follow the advice of my husband when it comes to spanking so the advice or misgivings of friends is not even up for consideration. Spanking is not discipline but IMO is metted out by many parents out of frustration because of a lack of discipline.

What I want to know is why there is a myth that persists in the black community that spanking is necessary?


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 

Just a random question........I am not open to the idea of random spankings. I have popped Andrews hands from time to time. He loves to run in parking lots. All of my black friends spank. They think that I am crazy and setting my son up for failure because I don't. *Supposedly black children have to be spanked in oreder for them to thrive.*
What do you moms think about spanking and the necessity of it for black children?










That's the same reasoning that was used 150+ years ago during slavery.


----------



## oyinmama

i believe that in childrearing, as in house building and cuisine, you use the tools and materials you have, to shape the raw materials available to you.

we have historically treated our children with brutality because brutality was the lesson taught to us by the world. we thought we were preparing them, even protecting them. many of us still operate out of fear of the damage the larger world can (and often does) do to our children, and react with panic when our children get 'out of line.' because getting out of line in the wrong situation, goes the logic, could get our beautiful innocent minding-his-own-business baby son shot 50 times on his wedding night. for instance.

of course most (many?) of us as individuals are trying to create a better world, and to raise children with a well adjusted sense of entitlement, lol, but i think it is these old scars and fears that cause us as a community to persist in the thinking that children 'need' spanking.

i was never spanked as a child. my mom believes (and will dogmatically tell you, often whether you ask or not) that spanking a child is a failure of imagination, patience, and intelligence.

i mention the raw materials thing because i also think that different children have different needs and respond to different things; and different parents have different skills and capabilities. just like inuit people may build homes out of ice and cook with whale blubber, and ndebele people build homes out of brightly colored earth & clay paint, and hunt big game.

meh. my first child is not quite yet 4 months. what the heck do i know?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
meh. my first child is not quite yet 4 months. what the heck do i know?










Apparently quite a lot. That was one of the most insightful things I've ever read on the subject.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:

What do you moms think about spanking and the necessity of it for black children?
I think it's sad that people think it's a necessity for black children- as if black children are inherently unruly and undisciplined.
I personally believe that one can be strict without spanking. Before I had my son, I thought, "Of course, I'll spank him!" Now, I can't even imagine doing it. I was spanked, but now as a logical adult, I'm not sure I believe a child would be able to understand WHY he is being spanked or be able to make the connection between doing something he is not supposed to and the pain of getting hit. I don't want him growing up thinking that it's okay to hit, so I will not hit him.
I get down on his level, take both of his hands, look him in the eyes and say, "Don't do that!" At his age, it may take a long time until he actually gets it. He's a toddler with zero impulse control and he's not being bad- he's being curious. I do think he'll get it eventually, and I won't have to hit him for him to get it.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barose* 








That's the same reasoning that was used 150+ years ago during slavery.










:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 

i was never spanked as a child. my mom believes (and will dogmatically tell you, often whether you ask or not) that spanking a child is a failure of imagination, patience, and intelligence.


Your mom is a wise woman! I love that!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i believe that in childrearing, as in house building and cuisine, you use the tools and materials you have, to shape the raw materials available to you.

we have historically treated our children with brutality because brutality was the lesson taught to us by the world. we thought we were preparing them, even protecting them. many of us still operate out of fear of the damage the larger world can (and often does) do to our children, and react with panic when our children get 'out of line.' because getting out of line in the wrong situation, goes the logic, could get our beautiful innocent minding-his-own-business baby son shot 50 times on his wedding night. for instance.

of course most (many?) of us as individuals are trying to create a better world, and to raise children with a well adjusted sense of entitlement, lol, but i think it is these old scars and fears that cause us as a community to persist in the thinking that children 'need' spanking.

i was never spanked as a child. my mom believes (and will dogmatically tell you, often whether you ask or not) that spanking a child is a failure of imagination, patience, and intelligence.

i mention the raw materials thing because i also think that different children have different needs and respond to different things; and different parents have different skills and capabilities. just like inuit people may build homes out of ice and cook with whale blubber, and ndebele people build homes out of brightly colored earth & clay paint, and hunt big game.

meh. my first child is not quite yet 4 months. what the heck do i know?

























This is beautiful, it really I think gets at the heart of why spanking particularly brutal (go get your switch off the tree type spankings) ones have been so prevalent in the Black community. I can't even think of anything to add to what Oyinmama said.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
spanking a child is a failure of imagination, patience, and intelligence.

so.....may I give credit for this quote to Qyinmama's Mama.







:

meh. my first child is not quite yet 4 months. what the heck do i know?










Actually you have (your age here) years of experience. Parenting begins long before conception or even birth. Everything that you have done up until now has given you the life lessons needed to parent your child. Now you are able to put hone your skills.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i believe that in childrearing, as in house building and cuisine, you use the tools and materials you have, to shape the raw materials available to you.

we have historically treated our children with brutality because brutality was the lesson taught to us by the world. we thought we were preparing them, even protecting them. many of us still operate out of fear of the damage the larger world can (and often does) do to our children, and react with panic when our children get 'out of line.' because getting out of line in the wrong situation, goes the logic, could get our beautiful innocent minding-his-own-business baby son shot 50 times on his wedding night. for instance.

of course most (many?) of us as individuals are trying to create a better world, and to raise children with a well adjusted sense of entitlement, lol, but i think it is these old scars and fears that cause us as a community to persist in the thinking that children 'need' spanking.

i was never spanked as a child. my mom believes (and will dogmatically tell you, often whether you ask or not) that spanking a child is a failure of imagination, patience, and intelligence.

i mention the raw materials thing because i also think that different children have different needs and respond to different things; and different parents have different skills and capabilities. just like inuit people may build homes out of ice and cook with whale blubber, and ndebele people build homes out of brightly colored earth & clay paint, and hunt big game.

meh. my first child is not quite yet 4 months. what the heck do i know?










now that's knowledge and wisdom


----------



## purplegirl

Does anyone listen to "black radio"? I live near Philly and thus have access to lots of so called black radio. Can I tell you how much I can't stand the nonsense that some call entertainment. Steve Harvey is at the top of my list. I find his show offensive, not funny and frankly, a waste of air time. The things he/they say and get away with, are appalling. I find myself listening to Temple U's station and to NPR more regularly cause I can't take the lack of creativity that some of these on air personalities have!
Anyone else?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Does anyone listen to "black radio"? I live near Philly and thus have access to lots of so called black radio. Can I tell you how much I can't stand the nonsense that some call entertainment. Steve Harvey is at the top of my list. I find his show offensive, not funny and frankly, a waste of air time. The things he/they say and get away with, are appalling. I find myself listening to Temple U's station and to NPR more regularly cause I can't take the lack of creativity that some of these on air personalities have!
Anyone else?

Well here is my list:
Steve Harvey ( we could listen in Atlanta but not herei n Houston)
The Monique Show
Yolanda Adams
Tom Joyner has a few personalities that I don't care for at all.
Calvin Murphy (some ex basketball player with a local show here in Houston)

I don't like any of these shows or the personalities because they perpetuate too many of the stereotypes that plague the black community. I also don't like reverse racism and hate filled comments that are directed towards white America. No, I don't condone past behavior, I just don't think that degrading and insulting people of another race is the answer to the problems that persist in Black America.

I believe that my husband listens to the Monique show just to hear me rant. Everything that she says is laced with vulgarity and sex. There is nothing decent or classy about her, but she thinks that she is the epitome of big girl class. Ugggh









Then again I have also been told that I don't have a sense of humor.

I love NPR but the station is not clear in the car. My DH listens on the PC, but I can type and listen at the same time.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Well here is my list:
Steve Harvey ( we could listen in Atlanta but not herei n Houston)
The Monique Show
Yolanda Adams
Tom Joyner has a few personalities that I don't care for at all.
Calvin Murphy (some ex basketball player with a local show here in Houston)

*I don't like any of these shows or the personalities because they perpetuate too many of the stereotypes that plague the black community*. I also don't like reverse racism and hate filled comments that are directed towards white America. No, I don't condone past behavior, I just don't think that degrading and insulting people of another race is the answer to the problems that persist in Black America.

I believe that my husband listens to the Monique show just to hear me rant. Everything that she says is laced with vulgarity and sex. There is nothing decent or classy about her, but she thinks that she is the epitome of big girl class. Ugggh









Then again I have also been told that I don't have a sense of humor.

I love NPR but the station is not clear in the car. My DH listens on the PC, but I can type and listen at the same time.

Thank you! Amen to all of that!! I totally agree with what you have said. I just don't know how anyone could call that entertaining. I don't know why I torture myself by even turning it on in the morning; I think I do it just to hear what crazy stuff they are talking about. I always end up ranting to myself!!


----------



## Draupadi

So I finally sucked it up and decided to drop some money on getting my hair done. I went to Devachan in NYC where I live, a pretty chi-chi salon that caters to specifically women with curly hair (all kinds of curly hair). For the first time in years, I actually like my hair.








Anyway, just felt like bumping this thread, too!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So I finally sucked it up and decided to drop some money on getting my hair done. I went to Devachan in NYC where I live, a pretty chi-chi salon that caters to specifically women with curly hair (all kinds of curly hair). For the first time in years, I actually like my hair.








Anyway, just felt like bumping this thread, too!

Oh la la! Glad you like your hair mama!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So I finally sucked it up and decided to drop some money on getting my hair done. I went to Devachan in NYC where I live, a pretty chi-chi salon that caters to specifically women with curly hair (all kinds of curly hair). For the first time in years, I actually like my hair.








Anyway, just felt like bumping this thread, too!









: Pictures?

We've started school. It's *insane*.







I've been putting videos of the kiddles on Facebook.







That makes me ridiculously happy, to be able to do that.







And... well, life is busy. I'm going out of town tomorrow, so...







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So I finally sucked it up and decided to drop some money on getting my hair done. I went to Devachan in NYC where I live, a pretty chi-chi salon that caters to specifically women with curly hair (all kinds of curly hair). For the first time in years, I actually like my hair.








Anyway, just felt like bumping this thread, too!

i JUST went there today! I'm not good at keeping u with getting haircuts (my last one was in Dec 2007) but they're the only place I'll let touch my hair. When I went there the first time, it was really the very first time I felt like my hair was respected, rather than complained about or being fought into straightness or something else. I LOVE that lace and I love the way they cut my hair. just chiming in







:


----------



## Brown Lioness




----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: Pictures?

We've started school. It's *insane*.







I've been putting videos of the kiddles on Facebook.







That makes me ridiculously happy, to be able to do that.







And... well, life is busy. I'm going out of town tomorrow, so...







:









FACE BOOK! yay. I have a face book also!!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: Pictures?

We've started school. It's *insane*.







I've been putting videos of the kiddles on Facebook.







That makes me ridiculously happy, to be able to do that.







And... well, life is busy. I'm going out of town tomorrow, so...







:









Here's a picture:

__
https://flic.kr/p/2767726927

Must be exciting getting kids ready for a new school year. DS has only been with me so I have yet to have that experience.
Speaking of school...I'm a jobless teacher. LOL! I was allegedly going back to work this fall and but haven't found anything. I don't want to go back to the hellhole school that I taught in before my son was born. Now, I don't have anything at all.
I have Facebook too and am maybe too addicted to it!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Oh la la! Glad you like your hair mama!









Thanks! There's nothing like the feeling of being pampered.








My hair is not as tame looking as in the picture now, but I like it that way. DH went nuts for it, which is also a big plus.


----------



## ishereal

Nice Hair cut! I will pm you my facebook site


----------



## eilonwy

Your hair looks gorgeous!









Facebook makes me happy.







:

Bean is a cyberschooler, so "starting school" doesn't involve sending him anywhere... just a ton of workk for both of us. He kind of flies through material, so it gets kind of crazy, especially for the first few weeks.









My sister has decided that Bean has an anger problem. Never mind that he has much bigger problems with her than with anyone else; Never mind that SHE has major control issues where children are concerned (just ask my poor nieces, who are terrified of their aunt














. No-- this is all the fault of the five year old. He's at my mom's house so that I can go to the begining of Stones Rising (the intensive, which is less child-friendly) for a few days myself. He is the only boy in that house aside from Bear, who is 6 months old-- all of the other kids (there are five of them) are girls. Toss in both of my sisters and my mother, and it's easy to understand why a perfectly healthy little boy's energy might be seen as over the top.







: My instinct is to strangle my sister for this... but I won't. Instead, I'm going to cast at her. It's not nice, but it's been extremely effective in the past. She really needs to work on her own problems, rather than trying to take all her misery out on my little man.


----------



## daricsmami

Hi everyone!

I used to participate in WOC #11, but got pretty busy with school and work. I have to pick up the kid from school; I'll be back to reintroduce myself.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Here's a picture:

__
https://flic.kr/p/2767726927

Must be exciting getting kids ready for a new school year. DS has only been with me so I have yet to have that experience.
Speaking of school...I'm a jobless teacher. LOL! I was allegedly going back to work this fall and but haven't found anything. I don't want to go back to the hellhole school that I taught in before my son was born. Now, I don't have anything at all.
I have Facebook too and am maybe too addicted to it!


Ohhh, I love it mama!!


----------



## daricsmami

Alright, I'm back!

I'm daricsmami. Black Latina. Former Navy brat, so I'm from everywhere. Sociology student. Planning on getting my MSW pretty soon. Have a 5 year old who just started kindergarten. Hoping to move to sunny SoCal soon, but I might end up staying here. I have figured that out yet.... I think that's it.


----------



## gabysmom617

Hey yall.









Something that happened yesterday had me wondering. Have you ever been on the internet somewhere and your identity was somewhat neutral, and you get received a certain way, but as soon as you upload or link to a picture or something in connection with your identity that reveals you are a person of color, you get a subtle hint of a vibe that feels like you are being received a bit differently than when your identy was neutral? Perhaps slightly patronized? Or condescended against...something like that?

Does that makes sense? I'm open to the possibility that maybe I'm just completely paranoid and overly sensitive..I tend to be that way in pregnancy.

but in my defense, sometimes I would feel that vibe at times in certain places on the internet before I became pregnant..

Edit:
It doesn't even have to be the internet per se...it could be anywhere where your identity is neutral and no one knows or can "see" what you are unless you tell them. Have you ever experienced like...underhanded..undercover "oh geesh, in that case, this poor woman _can't_ know what she's talking about..." vibe after it is revealed what your racial status is?

Oh, and ftr, this occurrence that happened to me was not here @ MDC...it was elsewhere on the web.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 

Something that happened yesterday had me wondering. Have you ever been on the internet somewhere and your identity was somewhat neutral, and you get received a certain way, but as soon as you upload or link to a picture or something in connection with your identity that reveals you are a person of color, you get a subtle hint of a vibe that feels like you are being received a bit differently than when your identy was neutral? Perhaps slightly patronized? Or condescended against...something like that?

Does that makes sense? I'm open to the possibility that maybe I'm just completely paranoid and overly sensitive..I tend to be that way in pregnancy.

but in my defense, sometimes I would feel that vibe at times in certain places on the internet before I became pregnant..


I know exactly what you are talking, I used to just hang on predominantly Black sites like Nappturality and a few others. Then when I got pregnant with dd and started going to parenting style boards, I started experiencing exactly what you are talking about, it really annoys me to no end. There is a local board in my area for AP style Mamas and I used to try and make connections but I gout tired of that outsider feeling that took place.

While you are pregnant, I wouldn't discount your feelings at all.

Shay


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## Brown Lioness

I havent gotten that on the net JUST yet cause im not fond of posting my picture (tho i have, but mostly on predominently black websites), but I have gotten that AT WORK.

I make my living on the phone everyday and so obviously people cannot see what I look like. But when they do fly in to the corporate office where I work to do the "face to face" meet and greet and they finally get to see me, their reactions are hilarious. Ive gotten everything from surprised shock to just forced indifference.

Then after, they seem to "treat" me differently on the phone...like, they'll be way less personable and cooperative and just generally less willing to do small talk and commiserate about work stuff we experience.

I just mark the change and keep it moving.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall.









Something that happened yesterday had me wondering. Have you ever been on the internet somewhere and your identity was somewhat neutral, and you get received a certain way, but as soon as you upload or link to a picture or something in connection with your identity that reveals you are a person of color, you get a subtle hint of a vibe that feels like you are being received a bit differently than when your identy was neutral? Perhaps slightly patronized? Or condescended against...something like that?

Does that makes sense? I'm open to the possibility that maybe I'm just completely paranoid and overly sensitive..I tend to be that way in pregnancy.

but in my defense, sometimes I would feel that vibe at times in certain places on the internet before I became pregnant..

Edit:
It doesn't even have to be the internet per se...it could be anywhere where your identity is neutral and no one knows or can "see" what you are unless you tell them. Have you ever experienced like...underhanded..undercover "oh geesh, in that case, this poor woman _can't_ know what she's talking about..." vibe after it is revealed what your racial status is?

Oh, and ftr, this occurrence that happened to me was not here @ MDC...it was elsewhere on the web.


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall.









Something that happened yesterday had me wondering. Have you ever been on the internet somewhere and your identity was somewhat neutral, and you get received a certain way, but as soon as you upload or link to a picture or something in connection with your identity that reveals you are a person of color, you get a subtle hint of a vibe that feels like you are being received a bit differently than when your identy was neutral? Perhaps slightly patronized? Or condescended against...something like that?

Does that makes sense? I'm open to the possibility that maybe I'm just completely paranoid and overly sensitive..I tend to be that way in pregnancy.

but in my defense, sometimes I would feel that vibe at times in certain places on the internet before I became pregnant..

Edit:
It doesn't even have to be the internet per se...it could be anywhere where your identity is neutral and no one knows or can "see" what you are unless you tell them. Have you ever experienced like...underhanded..undercover "oh geesh, in that case, this poor woman _can't_ know what she's talking about..." vibe after it is revealed what your racial status is?

Oh, and ftr, this occurrence that happened to me was not here @ MDC...it was elsewhere on the web.

Hi Sonya,

It has happen to me, right here at MDC. Here's my story.
I had a more than a year long conversation with a mama here via pm and when she moved to my corner of the world we decided to meet for a play date at a local park. What a disappointment! She and her children just couldn't stop staring at me and my son and the conversation between us went no where(whereas online, we had so much in common and our sons liked many of the same toys/activities that we could not believe our good fortune in being able to have a real life friendship).
But the topper for me came when I got home.
My son said that the oldest boy kept asking him questions about why he(my son) looked the way that he did. And that he had never met/talked with anyone who looked like him. Well, needless to say, we never saw or heard from them again.
And when I came to MDC to talk about my experience, I got the usual lines of "you must have been mistaken" and "sometimes people aren't comfortable when they meet people in real life". I had to take a break for a while from MDC after that happened.
So Sonya, to make a long story short, yeah, I know what you mean!
(And it is also one of the reasons that I put the afro smilie in my siggy!)

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


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## gabysmom617

Ok, I was just wondering if I was crazy, that's all. So here's my story: And I'm also considering the possiblity that oversensitivities that come along with pregnancy may be screwing with my judgement, because I do have issues with that...

There is a website I love, having to do with sewing cloth diapers. I know a lot about wool and stuff, I cloth diapered my monkey-boy in wool for quite some time. I helped a lot of people get into wool, know what type of wool to get from the thrift stores, and so forth to sew into covers. Then, I posted his pic in my profile, and ever since then, I get..."corrected" a lot. (Wrongly corrected lots of times.) Often times by people who have no where near the experience with wool that I have....It's extremely subtle and hard to explain. But most of the people there are not like that, hence why I haven't backed off from there for the time being.

Anyhow, it's a small picture of him; he's light skinned, (It's in my sig, click on "G")and it's not a pic of me, so I'm wondering if people still wonder if I'm black or not because he does look like he could be mixed to some people.

Well, it was just very small comment made to me yesterday. I posted a pic of my 3D ultrasound because it is extremely amazing just how much my unborn kidlet looks like my husband. And I posted a pic of my husband for comparison. (I did this here @ MDC too, but I swear, it wasn't here. I was so amused at how much those two look alike that I basically posted the pics of them at all of my favorite web places...) My husband is black, with a prominant wide bridged nose, and my kid has his SAME nose,...to a tee, so far...

I mean, there is absolutely no denying the resemblance.

But I did get a comment paraphrased, along the lines of, "Oh darn, you missed again--you're not supposed to compare photos of kids to their parents until at least a year of age. Great try and great pics though!







"

I mean, does that comment sound a tad bit condescending, or is it just me? I mean now that I think about it, I could count off many reasons why this comment put me off, but I feel I could just be in a bad mood. It's not like I went off or anything. I didn't say anything, but just commented back that I'm well aware how much babies and kids' faces change as they grow, but that doesn't discount the resemblance between the two of them now, and left it like that. No snark or anything.

It's just one of those things that seemed to stick out ot me more and more as I thought about it...and then I noticed I get this kind of "well, actually, you're just a tad bit off" stuff a lot from this place a lot...and it's subtle, but I'm starting to notice it.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hi Sonya,

It has happen to me, right here at MDC. Here's my story.
I had a more than a year long conversation with a mama here via pm and when she moved to my corner of the world we decided to meet for a play date at a local park. What a disappointment! She and her children just couldn't stop staring at me and my son and the conversation between us went no where(whereas online, we had so much in common and our sons liked many of the same toys/activities that we could not believe our good fortune in being able to have a real life friendship).
But the topper for me came when I got home.
My son said that the oldest boy kept asking him questions about why he(my son) looked the way that he did. And that he had never met/talked with anyone who looked like him. Well, needless to say, we never saw or heard from them again.
And when I came to MDC to talk about my experience, I got the usual lines of "you must have been mistaken" and "sometimes people aren't comfortable when they meet people in real life". I had to take a break for a while from MDC after that happened.
So Sonya, to make a long story short, yeah, I know what you mean!
(And it is also one of the reasons that I put the afro smilie in my siggy!)

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

I recall this story Erika. If I am not mistaken, it's happened to another MDC moc. I purposely put a smiley in my siggy too, that represents who I am so there are no questions. Ugh, I wished it didn't have to be that way but I feel it protects my feelings from being hurt!


----------



## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hi Sonya,

It has happen to me, right here at MDC. Here's my story.
I had a more than a year long conversation with a mama here via pm and when she moved to my corner of the world we decided to meet for a play date at a local park. What a disappointment! She and her children just couldn't stop staring at me and my son and the conversation between us went no where(whereas online, we had so much in common and our sons liked many of the same toys/activities that we could not believe our good fortune in being able to have a real life friendship).
But the topper for me came when I got home.
My son said that the oldest boy kept asking him questions about why he(my son) looked the way that he did. And that he had never met/talked with anyone who looked like him. Well, needless to say, we never saw or heard from them again.
And when I came to MDC to talk about my experience, I got the usual lines of "you must have been mistaken" and "sometimes people aren't comfortable when they meet people in real life". I had to take a break for a while from MDC after that happened.
So Sonya, to make a long story short, yeah, I know what you mean!
(And it is also one of the reasons that I put the afro smilie in my siggy!)

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

I really appreciate you sharing your story with me. What a sad turn of events.







That's all I can really say on that, for fear I'd violate the UA agreement. Anyhow, it's good to hear/read that I'm not crazy for feeling the way I feel sometimes over the net...


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## JustKiya

*sigh*

No, I haven't gotten that, but it doesn't surprise me, all the same.

*sigh* It's so damn saddening, sometimes. Esp. because just a couple of people being like that can turn you off from a whole board of people - most of whom don't have that sort of reaction. *sigh*


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## jeca

Sonya your son is darling!
I may be way off base here but I have noticed especially when it comes to the realms of AP parenting or the "crunchy" side of living others treat me(as a WOC)like I'm not suppose to know these things and therefor need their help or corrections. It's like you can't possibly know anything about it because it's not statistically something "your" people do so let me help you. I have been on the receiving end a handful of times here and IRL. I remember telling a lady IRL that I nursed my youngest DD until she was two and the comment was something like "really, that long? Wow black women don't really breastfeed so its' good that you did although it was a bit of overkill I mean you only needed to go to 6 months to a year".








As far as the cloth diaper comment her beginning her sentence with "darn you missed again" seems to me like she was deliberately trying to be snarky.


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## gabysmom617

Thanks! He used to be in love with that box...

Just to be clear, though, she didn't word it exactly that way...very similarly, but I didn't want to direcly quote what she said....but that's pretty basically what she said. To be fair she didn't actually say, "Oh darn you missed again", but it was very much implied.

Yes, I get the same feeling amongst those who practice AP. And I think that's behind why I get a lot of "corrections" when giving out wool diapering advice and so forth. I couldn't possibly have "as much" experience as "others" there would....(Even though I remember welcoming the questions on wool from those same "correctors" when they first started asking about their newborn or unborn kid, and my kidlet was 2 and I had already been in the community and wool diapering for 2 1/2 years.







)

I haven't gotten much crap about breastfeeding yet. I'm warmly reminded of a black woman whom I met at a religious convention when my kid was a few weeks old, and she sternly told me to don't stop nursing that kid, and "don't let no one tell me nothing!"--and she warmly recalled her ..neice?..some one she knew who nursed her child till she was 5 years old and just to put the babe in the bed with me so I could get sleep. She encouraged me to be bullheadedly stubborn about ignoring people who would tell me to quit...and I must say I took her advice to heart.


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## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
*sigh*

No, I haven't gotten that, but it doesn't surprise me, all the same.

*sigh* It's so damn saddening, sometimes. Esp. because just a couple of people being like that can turn you off from a whole board of people - most of whom don't have that sort of reaction. *sigh*

I know exactly what you mean. One or two people like that makes you not really want to visit there anymore despite the couple of people there that I enjoy helping...to be honest though, those ones have been together for quite some time, and have become close and almost cliquish, and even though I joined them a long time ago, I still feel very much like an outsider.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I recall this story Erika. If I am not mistaken, it's happened to another MDC moc. I purposely put a smiley in my siggy too, that represents who I am so there are no questions. Ugh, I wished it didn't have to be that way but I feel it protects my feelings from being hurt!


I do the same thing with my sig as well for the same reason. On other boards I purposely use a screen name that makes it clear I am not white for the same reasons as well. I got tired of going to playgroups a few years ago and having that akward pause yet online we vibed well.


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## Brown Lioness

That is so sad to read.

*ponders putting dread smilie back into my sig*


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Sonya your son is darling!
I may be way off base here but I have noticed especially when it comes to the realms of AP parenting or the "crunchy" side of living others treat me(as a WOC)like I'm not suppose to know these things and therefor need their help or corrections. It's like you can't possibly know anything about it because it's not statistically something "your" people do so let me help you. I have been on the receiving end a handful of times here and IRL. I remember telling a lady IRL that I nursed my youngest DD until she was two and the comment was something like "really, that long? Wow black women don't really breastfeed so its' good that you did although it was a bit of overkill I mean you only needed to go to 6 months to a year".








As far as the cloth diaper comment her beginning her sentence with "darn you missed again" seems to me like she was deliberately trying to be snarky.

Sadly you are so right. I am dealing with some similiar issues right now in my life with some Mamas I know. There really is that undercurrent like I couldn't possibly know because I am Black







:.

Considering I am still nursing dd who is 3, I wish someone would try to say something to me, we aren't child led or anything but at this point I know I have statitistically nursed longer than a good chunk of American women regardless of race.

I am pretty much at the point that aside from being here at MDC I no longer seek out crunchy folks especially living in Maine. On the surface they seem cool initially but generally I find them to have more issues than mainstream folks. Its like our CSA, we have been members for several seasons, its safe to say I am the only sista yet I have never been able to connect and frankly I am tired of it. This season I did a half share with a friend who does the pickups to spare me the irritation of going to the farm. We went once this summer because dd wanted to see the chickens and that was enough for me.

On the other hand we go the farmers market every week and I find the non-organic farmers to be the coolest, now that's a trip.


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## oyinmama

wow - i am so sorry to hear about these disappointing RL and online experiences! like shay, i tended to keep my online community-building at black-focused sites at first (we actually met on nappturality, hi shay!







) and on mainstream sites like xanga where i blogged for years, i have always been very 'out' about my racial identity.

i live a pretty hermitish life IRL so haven't had the kind of experiences of attempting to find community with online mamas who might condescend to me, because in general i'm pretty protective of my space. also, i live in and was raised in such a crunchy granola black circle that (full disclosure, sigh) i actually find i have to watch myself to keep from potentially condescending to mainstream/white mamas about the whole AP thing. for instance, it kind of cracks me up that all the hubbub about babywearing and cosleeping and such is coming from/currently perceived as being within the sole purview of white women, when it is a traditionally african and third world practice. personally, it's a practice i was raised with and which my mama taught me; she actually saved the cloth she used to carry all 4 of us in, to give me when i had my own, and taught me how to use my lappas as both swaddle cloths and simple slings. breastfeeding has always been an assumption in my family, for multiple generations. i have a bunch of friends who homeschool. it's so natural and so not a big deal in my family and my friendship circles, that i find myself having to forcibly realize not EVERY white AP type out there is a 'new jack'







... that there are valid and vibrant circles of white crunchiness that have deep and respectable granola roots.









tangenting... i have similar feelings about the hotness of the 'green' movement in general and the way it's perceived in the mainstream right now. i feel like, traditionally and through necessity, poorer communities and people of color have recycled, reused, used public transport, carpooled, lived in urban areas, worked near where we live, used natural remedies, etc. - and plain old did without. talk about a reduced 'footprint'! yet, when 'green' hits the mainstream it's seen as the sole property of affluent and/or white people who can afford to buy new hybrid cars and spend $10 on reusable grocery sacks.









it's interesting, the politics of race and social movements and adaptation and public perception and such.


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
w i live in and was raised in such a crunchy granola black circle, it's a practice i was raised with and which my mama taught me; she actually saved the cloth she used to carry all 4 of us in, to give me when i had my own, and taught me how to use my lappas as both swaddle cloths and simple slings. breastfeeding has always been an assumption in my family, for multiple generations. i have a bunch of friends who homeschool. it's so natural and so not a big deal in my family and my friendship circles, that i find myself having to forcibly realize not EVERY white AP type out there is a 'new jack'







... that there are valid and vibrant circles of white crunchiness that have deep and respectable granola roots.









I think this is awesome. I was raised on the complete opposite end of the spectrum. I remember when I told my mom I was going to breastfeed she offered to buy my formula so I "wouldn't have to do that". Not just her though they were all like that. My grandma and my aunt woke me up one morning at 8 a.m just to give me a lecture on how nursing while I was pregnant was going to kill my unborn and poison my toddler.







My kid will run amuck if I don't give them a good "beating" every now and then. They are deprived because I don't let them eat the junk "normal" kids get to eat. They were never going to get out of my bed if I co-sleep (actually I was surprised how easy it was to get them out). Co-sleeping DH is responsible for though. I started out with a cradle beside the bed and about two weeks into it he says wouldn't it be easier to just sleep with us? Thank goodness for him as I was less sleep deprived because of it. I remember my mom visiting me and tore up my bathroom looking for baby lotion. I handed her the lotion I was using at the time and she ays" it's not johnson and johnson, I always used johnson and jonshon on you guys" I tell her all the icky stuff that johnson's has in it and after my little speil all she can say is" well how is he going to smell like a baby?"







I can say she was great about cloth diapering though. She did that with me so she thought it was cool and was really impressed with the AIO's they have now. ANd no one seems to get why my girls are still in carseats "at their age" while my neice who is four gets to ride "liek a big girl".
I have to say they have been a lot more supportive now though. I don't know if they just accepted that I'm going to do things my way anway or if the change of time is working in my favour. I think it would have been a lty less stressful for me had they been a little more into thinking outside the balck peopel do things this way and white peopel do thinsg taht way frame of mind. I am trying very hard not to install that in my kids.
This is long cause it's late and I don't sleep well at night so I'm rambling feel free to ignore me.







:


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## Draupadi

Like a lot of you, I use a WOC smilie just for this reason. I want no mistakes about who I am. I used to take part on a lot of other boards- a lot of them race relations boards- and I was also the owner of my own race-related discussion forum. When I got pregnant and started going on mainstream parenting boards, there were times when I felt not entirely comfortable for reasons ranging from the fact that I was more AP than mainstream and that I noticed that there was a sort of dismissive attitude toward some of the WOC on the board. There was also a clicque-ish high school thing going on that annoyed me to no end. Anyway, everyone on the boards always posted pics of their kids. One black woman started to do it too and I swear, folks were getting annoyed! It was really, really weird.
When I came here, I was happy to find an AP board. I'm not crunchy in the "hippy" sense, but I am AP. The thing is, I do notice that sometimes I feel...I don't know...ignored on this board. Sometimes I'll ask a question and no one will answer it. I mean no one. Or sometimes just one person will.
Yes, I have felt condescended to occasionally on here. A few months back someone posted an article on breastfeeding and seemed shocked beyond belief that one of the breastfeeding mothers was black.








Like Oyinmama, I grew up in a babywearing culture (my mom is Korean and she wore my uncle in a podegi when she was 12. She loves to wear my boy! She is a wiz with the mei tai!), breastfeeding was expected of me, and things like co-sleeping are no big deal since that's the way my mother grew up anyway. I know what Oyinmama means about being a bit amused by some of the hubub.
You get the idea. It seems sometimes that it's perceived that AP styles are the realm of white women only.
Anyway, I'm just rambling here...


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## AndrewsMother

I am just too tired to quote.

to Williams Mamma - Your new haircut is quite lovely.

to Eilonwily - Does your son participate in any sports activities. My son is a non stop ball of activity and I thought that he has issues myself when all that he really needed was an extra outlet for his energy.

to Gabysmom - well don't you know that we are not supposed to know anything!







I sometimes fool myself into thinking that I am accepted by all for who I am inside and out. When I am reminded it hurts. I understand how you feel.


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## princesstutu

I, too, grew up in an extended nursing, cosleeping, baby-wearing (and constantly holding when not wearing) household. It's my normal. I've never gotten the "good for you, cuz black women statistically don't breastfeed long" vibe from anyone, but that's probably b/c I've been in my community for 10 years and nursed my babies before I even knew any of the LLLers and granola women.

Or maybe I've just forgotten. Just as likely, really.







When I was active in the breastfeeding community here, ppl generally listened to what I had to say and I think it was mostly b/c I tended to offer an unconventional and empowering perspective on a routine basis. I've always been quick to suggest a woman follow her bliss and gut.

as far as being out as a WOC on message boards: I prefer to "come out" by making some remark about POC and then having ppl wonder if I'm being racist, etc. I think the new wave of posters is more gun-shy about racial presumptions and that's good, IMO.


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## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I know exactly what you are talking, I used to just hang on predominantly Black sites like Nappturality and a few others. Then when I got pregnant with dd and started going to parenting style boards, I started experiencing exactly what you are talking about, it really annoys me to no end. There is a local board in my area for AP style Mamas and I used to try and make connections but I gout tired of that outsider feeling that took place.

While you are pregnant, I wouldn't discount your feelings at all.

Shay

I too post on nappturality.


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## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Ok, I was just wondering if I was crazy, that's all. So here's my story: And I'm also considering the possiblity that oversensitivities that come along with pregnancy may be screwing with my judgement, because I do have issues with that...

There is a website I love, having to do with sewing cloth diapers. I know a lot about wool and stuff, I cloth diapered my monkey-boy in wool for quite some time. I helped a lot of people get into wool, know what type of wool to get from the thrift stores, and so forth to sew into covers. Then, I posted his pic in my profile, and ever since then, I get..."corrected" a lot. (Wrongly corrected lots of times.) Often times by people who have no where near the experience with wool that I have....It's extremely subtle and hard to explain. But most of the people there are not like that, hence why I haven't backed off from there for the time being.

Anyhow, it's a small picture of him; he's light skinned, (It's in my sig, click on "G")and it's not a pic of me, so I'm wondering if people still wonder if I'm black or not because he does look like he could be mixed to some people.

Well, it was just very small comment made to me yesterday. I posted a pic of my 3D ultrasound because it is extremely amazing just how much my unborn kidlet looks like my husband. And I posted a pic of my husband for comparison. (I did this here @ MDC too, but I swear, it wasn't here. I was so amused at how much those two look alike that I basically posted the pics of them at all of my favorite web places...) My husband is black, with a prominant wide bridged nose, and my kid has his SAME nose,...to a tee, so far...

I mean, there is absolutely no denying the resemblance.

But I did get a comment paraphrased, along the lines of, "Oh darn, you missed again--you're not supposed to compare photos of kids to their parents until at least a year of age. Great try and great pics though!







"

I mean, does that comment sound a tad bit condescending, or is it just me? I mean now that I think about it, I could count off many reasons why this comment put me off, but I feel I could just be in a bad mood. It's not like I went off or anything. I didn't say anything, but just commented back that I'm well aware how much babies and kids' faces change as they grow, but that doesn't discount the resemblance between the two of them now, and left it like that. No snark or anything.

It's just one of those things that seemed to stick out ot me more and more as I thought about it...and then I noticed I get this kind of "well, actually, you're just a tad bit off" stuff a lot from this place a lot...and it's subtle, but I'm starting to notice it.

What I would have said would have been every bit against the UA.


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## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think this is awesome. I was raised on the complete opposite end of the spectrum. I remember when I told my mom I was going to breastfeed she offered to buy my formula so I "wouldn't have to do that". Not just her though they were all like that. My grandma and my aunt woke me up one morning at 8 a.m just to give me a lecture on how nursing while I was pregnant was going to kill my unborn and poison my toddler.







My kid will run amuck if I don't give them a good "beating" every now and then. They are deprived because I don't let them eat the junk "normal" kids get to eat. They were never going to get out of my bed if I co-sleep (actually I was surprised how easy it was to get them out). Co-sleeping DH is responsible for though. I started out with a cradle beside the bed and about two weeks into it he says wouldn't it be easier to just sleep with us? Thank goodness for him as I was less sleep deprived because of it. I remember my mom visiting me and tore up my bathroom looking for baby lotion. I handed her the lotion I was using at the time and she ays" it's not johnson and johnson, I always used johnson and jonshon on you guys" I tell her all the icky stuff that johnson's has in it and after my little speil all she can say is" well how is he going to smell like a baby?"







I can say she was great about cloth diapering though. She did that with me so she thought it was cool and was really impressed with the AIO's they have now. ANd no one seems to get why my girls are still in carseats "at their age" while my neice who is four gets to ride "liek a big girl".
I have to say they have been a lot more supportive now though. I don't know if they just accepted that I'm going to do things my way anway or if the change of time is working in my favour. I think it would have been a lty less stressful for me had they been a little more into thinking outside the balck peopel do things this way and white peopel do thinsg taht way frame of mind. I am trying very hard not to install that in my kids.
This is long cause it's late and I don't sleep well at night so I'm rambling feel free to ignore me.







:

wow. Did we grow up in the same house??? Everyone in family when ever introducing me to someone always says "this is shay, she's natural" I roll my eyes, why can't I just be shay? I was criticized for wanting a natural birth noone believed I could do it and when I did the were dumbfounded and thought I was even more insane for not going to the hospital because my granny puts it " you should always have your first baby in a hospital, anything could go wrong" *sigh* They always patronize me by saying they "gone give my baby some real food", like my bm is not enough and he is a 20 solid pounds by mere chance lol. They never cease to amaze me.... but anyhow that is why I am grateful for online boards where I can connect with people that share some of my same values and look like me!!!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
I was criticized for wanting a natural birth noone believed I could do it and when I did the were dumbfounded and thought I was even more insane for not going to the hospital because my granny puts it " you should always have your first baby in a hospital, anything could go wrong"!

Good for you for standing your ground. I had all hospital births but never an epidural, my aunt told me I would die without one. Uh huh yeah. My first DS I had an overdose of Demerol as my pain relief choice bad mistake, lesson learned. I am happy to say my last two were at least drug free. I would love a homebirth though if DH can convince my to have another baby.

OT, I currently WOH very very part time for our outreach program. It's about 8 hours a week. Now that all my kidlets are in school full time I am getting the when are you getting a real full time job speech. I don't know what to say to this. I really haven't thought about it much but i have no desire to run out and get a full time job. People keep pointing out to me though that there's no point in me being home with the kids in school. So what do think of that? My babies are in K,2nd and 5th grade. I am PTO president and volunteer sometimes in addition to my eight hours a week. I haven't had a day just to myself yet despite the kids being in school it always seems like I have something else to do or DH will be home bothering me, lol. So what do you think, is it time for a job? DH doens't care either way.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Good for you for standing your ground. I had all hospital births but never an epidural, my aunt told me I would die without one. Uh huh yeah. My first DS I had an overdose of Demerol as my pain relief choice bad mistake, lesson learned. I am happy to say my last two were at least drug free. I would love a homebirth though if DH can convince my to have another baby.

OT, I currently WOH very very part time for our outreach program. It's about 8 hours a week. Now that all my kidlets are in school full time I am getting the when are you getting a real full time job speech. I don't know what to say to this. I really haven't thought about it much but i have no desire to run out and get a full time job. People keep pointing out to me though that there's no point in me being home with the kids in school. So what do think of that? My babies are in K,2nd and 5th grade. I am PTO president and volunteer sometimes in addition to my eight hours a week. I haven't had a day just to myself yet despite the kids being in school it always seems like I have something else to do or DH will be home bothering me, lol. So what do you think, is it time for a job? DH doens't care either way.

Yeah our society really does not put value in the cultivating of our children. They want us busy busy busy making "their" lives much easier....... that's another rant for another day.


----------



## gabysmom617

Ok, so I don't want to get into too many details because I don't want to violate the UA, but another "occurrence" happened today, and it's become clear that this is just one individual who seems to have a problem with me. Suffice it to say I called her out, and the only other mother of color on this website did make a placid statement of support which hinted to me that she must have felt it too. It's extremely difficult to discern because it's extremely subtle how it's done. And I'm a clueless person and stuff flies right over my head...and sometimes I see stuff that's not atctually there. My bullcrap filter is slightly shaky, I must say. But this obviously isn't just me.


----------



## Bloomingstar

every time I come back there are like 2 new pages of posts! Glad this thread is hopping!

Just to respond real quickly to gaby's situation: I think this happens A LOT online. It's happened to me in various places, online and IRL and it's frustrating. And I just added the







to my signature--I don't have locs but my hair is curly and it's close enough. And also with the "natural" and "green" stuff--like I think Oyinmama said, they don't realize there are whole countries of Black people (let alone a continent) that have been doing this stuff for forever. sigh.

But to buffer the frustration, did you all see Michelle Obama's speech at the DNC last night? I listened to what she had to say but even beyond the actual speech, it was just a sigh of relief to see people HAVE to listen to a black woman in that position. Because like you all were talking about earlier, too often people find it easy to be dismissive, condescending, and pull the "oh you don't really know what you're talking about" b.s. I was watching BET, of all channels (I can't stand BET generally but I wanted to hear someone other than Chris Matthews), right before and one of the women correspondents was talking about how much people have been trotting out the word "aggressive" to talk about Michelle Obama, but how as a black woman, she really just doesn't see where the term "aggressive" is coming from other than out of people's projected racism and sexism.

But it was great to see her up there, all of the political stuff aside. What did you all think?


----------



## purplegirl

Michelle was awesome. Her speech, which I heard was self written, was inspiring. She seems so real; so down to earth!


----------



## barose

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall.









Something that happened yesterday had me wondering. Have you ever been on the internet somewhere and your identity was somewhat neutral, and you get received a certain way, but as soon as you upload or link to a picture or something in connection with your identity that reveals you are a person of color, you get a subtle hint of a vibe that feels like you are being received a bit differently than when your identy was neutral? Perhaps slightly patronized? Or condescended against...something like that?

Does that makes sense? I'm open to the possibility that maybe I'm just completely paranoid and overly sensitive..I tend to be that way in pregnancy.

but in my defense, sometimes I would feel that vibe at times in certain places on the internet before I became pregnant..

I think I experience that more IRL than on the internet. Like job interviews: I could have a great phone interview and go in and get the feeling that I am not what they expected. My name is pretty "neutral" (whatever that is







) and my voice and the way I speak doesn't say much about my race.

Looking back, I have experienced some cold shoulderness here, but I always attributed it to the fact that I'm not a mother to a living child. But I _did_ notice it _after_ I posted my photo once.

The only AA only forum I ever been a part of was Nappturality (about 2-3 years) but kind of fell away a few years ago due to the fact that I'm over the 'new to nappy' stage and don't feel the need to talk much about it.









I only hang out at another social forum called The Fashion Spot and I never got the feeling that they gave a crap about race. It's a pretty diverse in terms of age, race, nationality and geography and about 55,000 members strong and as long as you're there to talk fashion, you're A-OK. Its actually probably the most supportive and less snarky forum I've ever been a part of.

The rest are internet/business/social networking sites and they dont seem to care either (and my photos are posted)


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Michelle was awesome. Her speech, which I heard was self written, was inspiring. She seems so real; so down to earth!

Yes it was. She's such a strong woman I think she would make a great first lady not just a sit in the background type person. I have a lot of respect for Michelle Obama.


----------



## shayinme

Michelle was awesome, I got choked up a bit especially at the end when the kids came out.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Michelle was awesome, I got choked up a bit especially at the end when the kids came out.









The girls are so darling!! I love their sense of self confidence!!


----------



## princesstutu

I didn't watch, but wanted to tell *jeca*:

Hey, if it works for you and your family, don't worry about it. We live in a society that pushes individuality, even at the expense of our kids. Obviously, you have a job. Several. If people don't like what you're doing, feel free to start asking them for money. Seriously. Next time someone claims you need a real job, tell them if they're that worried about your income (b/c that's got to be the only reason you'd need a real job), they can begin with a $100/week donation.

Obviously, I'm a smartass, but you know...it offsets the dumbassery.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
I didn't watch, but wanted to tell *jeca*:

Hey, if it works for you and your family, don't worry about it. We live in a society that pushes individuality, even at the expense of our kids. Obviously, you have a job. Several. If people don't like what you're doing, feel free to start asking them for money. Seriously. Next time someone claims you need a real job, tell them if they're that worried about your income (b/c that's got to be the only reason you'd need a real job), they can begin with a $100/week donation.

Obviously, I'm a smartass, but you know...it offsets the dumbassery.

I love this!!!


----------



## kimiij

Hi. I usually hang out in the NMY tribe but I saw this and I thought I'd come over and introduce myself. I'm a young professional in New Jersey and besides my "day" job I also do CBE and I run a very new doula agency. I've been lurking for a few days and I'm loving the conversation.

About me: I'm single and don't have any kids. Hopefully that will change at some point. In the meantime, I'm just living life









I used to hang out at Nappturality too, but like a pp said, I've been natural for a while now and don't feel a need to post as often anymore so my posting there is very sporadic. I still point friends/acquaintances towards the site though if they are even just thinking about going natural because I think it's a really great resource when you're just starting out.

I always wonder if people are suprised to see *me* after speaking to me on the phone or seeing my resume but I haven't ever knowingly had to deal with any ignorant people. I've had the afro pic in my sig for months now. I didn't put it there to "out" myself though- I put it there because it was the only smilie that really represented me. Most of the other smilies people usually use like the pregnant one, the babywearing one, the breastfeeding have nothing to do with my life at the moment. So, I stick to the afro.


----------



## oyinmama

lol - we should start a thread ON nappturality about how come none of us are posting at nappturality anymore!









like most of youse goiys, 14 yrs into the nappy game i do not share the same rush and thrill of discovery as most members of np. but will forever have a fondness in my heart for that site for helping educate me about proper hair care, helping me find some great online friendships which persist to this day, encouraging me to launch my product line (!!) and continuing to serve as a huge resource and community to so many. yay, nappturality! i point people there all the time.

@ kimiij


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
OT, I currently WOH very very part time for our outreach program. It's about 8 hours a week. Now that all my kidlets are in school full time I am getting the when are you getting a real full time job speech. I don't know what to say to this. .............. I haven't had a day just to myself yet despite the kids being in school it always seems like I have something else to do or DH will be home bothering me, lol. So what do you think, is it time for a job? DH doens't care either way.

what a wonderful position to be in! the whole world is open to you and you really can do whatever you like, with full support from your DH and family. so... what do you want to do? do you feel the desire to add [paying] work to what seems like an already full schedule? if so, go for it. if not, and you really just are looking for something to say to folks when they ask you... how about...

1. when i get some free time, maybe
2. if i get laid off of my current full time job; you know times are hard and i may get downsized at my kids' next board meeting
3. when you get out of my business.










Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
wow. Did we grow up in the same house??? Everyone in family when ever introducing me to someone always says "this is shay, she's natural" I roll my eyes, why can't I just be shay?

aww. ((hugs.)) it's because they are trying to get their heads around all the ways you do things that are different from how they do things. maybe them introducing you like that is an indication that they are starting to at least accept your difference, even if they may not understand it or agree with your choices to your face, they are 'explaining' you to outsiders and probably feeling a little bit of pride about you. at least that is the hope, no?

and this:

Quote:

They always patronize me by saying they "gone give my baby some real food", like my bm is not enough and he is a 20 solid pounds by mere chance lol.
oh.my.GOSH -- *20 pounds!!??* what a big boy! and i thought kaiju was big at 16!


----------



## Bloomingstar

I'm at work and I cannot focus to save my life! Maybe the so-called "pregnancy brain" is kicking in? I just keep surfing MDC. I bought a Bella Band online earlier today. I am trying not to update my registry...I need to be stopped!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 









Hi. I usually hang out in the NMY tribe but I saw this and I thought I'd come over and introduce myself. I'm a young professional in New Jersey and besides my "day" job I also do CBE and I run a very new doula agency. I've been lurking for a few days and I'm loving the conversation.

About me: I'm single and don't have any kids. Hopefully that will change at some point. In the meantime, I'm just living life









I used to hang out at Nappturality too, but like a pp said, I've been natural for a while now and don't feel a need to post as often anymore so my posting there is very sporadic. I still point friends/acquaintances towards the site though if they are even just thinking about going natural because I think it's a really great resource when you're just starting out.

I always wonder if people are suprised to see *me* after speaking to me on the phone or seeing my resume but I haven't ever knowingly had to deal with any ignorant people. I've had the afro pic in my sig for months now. I didn't put it there to "out" myself though- I put it there because it was the only smilie that really represented me. Most of the other smilies people usually use like the pregnant one, the babywearing one, the breastfeeding have nothing to do with my life at the moment. So, I stick to the afro.

Hey there. I've seen you on other threads. I'm glad you've joined our tribe!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
lol - we should start a thread ON nappturality about how come none of us are posting at nappturality anymore!









like most of *youse goiys*, 14 yrs into the nappy game i do not share the same rush and thrill of discovery as most members of np. but will forever have a fondness in my heart for that site for helping educate me about proper hair care, helping me find some great online friendships which persist to this day, encouraging me to launch my product line (!!) and continuing to serve as a huge resource and community to so many. yay, nappturality! i point people there all the time.

@ kimiij









Omgoodness did that crack me up. My sister and I always feign that New York/South Philly accent using those same words!!!







I am also a Napputurality graduate!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I'm at work and I cannot focus to save my life! Maybe the so-called "pregnancy brain" is kicking in? I just keep surfing MDC. I bought a Bella Band online earlier today. I am trying not to update my registry...I need to be stopped!









Relax. There's always tomorrow and trust me, the work will still be there!!


----------



## I-AM-Mother

ello ladies,

new to the tribe but not to the site...married to my very best friend of thirteen years...and together we have three wonderful children.


----------



## shayinme

: Another Nappturality grad here, did anyone post on the earlier Black Hair Care board? I beleive it pre-dated Dee's board, it was there for a while and then one day just disappeared. I am have been natural 8 almost 9 years so for the most part I don't talk hair.

Admittedly living in Maine, sometimes I juat wanna talk with sistas so I do check in at Nappturality.

Shay


----------



## I-AM-Mother

ummm...i'm "nappy" too.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
ello ladies,

new to the tribe but not to the site...married to my very best friend of thirteen years...and together we have three wonderful children.

Welcome, welcome!! Our little tribe is growing







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: Another Nappturality grad here, did anyone post on the earlier Black Hair Care board? I beleive it pre-dated Dee's board, it was there for a while and then one day just disappeared. I am have been natural 8 almost 9 years so for the most part I don't talk hair.

*Admittedly living in Maine, sometimes I juat wanna talk with sistas so I do check in at Nappturality.
*
Shay

Shay, you totally get a pass for Nappturality. If I lived in Maine, I'd be hanging out there on a regular







!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Yea, im on nappturality too....i cant say that im a grad, because i still like to post there, but usually not about hair, lol.


----------



## JustKiya

Hehe - I'm on NP too, but a very infrequent poster. Now that I've found the 'New Posts' button though, I might be on more often, wandering around the other sections. How's the parenting area?







: I'm hairmad, though, so I'm on most of the hair boards, I think.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Hehe - I'm on NP too, but a very infrequent poster. Now that I've found the 'New Posts' button though, I might be on more often, wandering around the other sections. How's the parenting area?







: I'm hairmad, though, so I'm on most of the hair boards, I think.









Eh, most of the time, the children and parenting section leaves something to be desired. But its cool. Right now, there is a lively thread on boys and circumcision.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Eh, most of the time, the children and parenting section leaves something to be desired. But its cool. Right now, there is a lively thread on boys and circumcision.

I saw that, and I've been avoiding it - it's so heartbreaking to me - how's it going?


----------



## Bloomingstar

YES WE CAN! YES WE CAN!







:

heh ok. I am again at work, and you're right, purplegirl, the work is still here! But what a great moment last night!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
But what a great moment last night!









Everytime I think about last night my eyes become a little misty.


----------



## ajv

i just wanted to relate a funny story about not being what others expect when they meet you. when i livee in new mexico, worked from home, i would do legal guardianships thru the mail and over the phone, when it came time for court, i would tell my clients (whom i had never met in person), "okay, i will see you at judge so and so's office, i am a large african american woman " and because it was new mexico, and i new all the other black attorneys, i was pretty confident i would be the only aa woman at the courthouse that day.

anyway, one time i said this to my client and she said "So, am I!" I was shocked, i said, so are you _what?_ she said, I am a large african american woman, too. I had no clue. WE had a wonderful time after that!!!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
I saw that, and I've been avoiding it - it's so heartbreaking to me - how's it going?










Its going, eh. Its about half and half, but to me, the OP seems to be swaying towards doing it, but at least she's informed, right?

ajv, I thought you were gonna say when your client arrived, there just so happened to be a large-african-american woman's group there at the same time so they went through the whole building asking each woman if they were you


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
YES WE CAN! YES WE CAN!







:

heh ok. I am again at work, and you're right, purplegirl, *the work is still here*! But what a great moment last night!









Told ya









Barack was awesome last night--very inspirational!


----------



## gabysmom617

I never EVER post pics of _me_. Feeling a crazy mood tonight, though, so here goes. My friend several states away keeps hounding me for belly pics, so I finally took some today.

Pardon the painty mirror and cans of paint around. Almost done with that room; so far it's the best room in the house for taking pics, and that's really sad considering it's condition...

http://s61.photobucket.com/albums/h5...ent=belly2.jpg


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
I never EVER post pics of _me_. Feeling a crazy mood tonight, though, so here goes. My friend several states away keeps hounding me for belly pics, so I finally took some today.

Pardon the painty mirror and cans of paint around. Almost done with that room; so far it's the best room in the house for taking pics, and that's really sad considering it's condition...

http://s61.photobucket.com/albums/h5...ent=belly2.jpg

omg. you are adorable!

eta: your boy is gorgeous too! sweettttt!


----------



## gabysmom617

Thanks. You made me blush.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
omg. you are adorable!

Had to pop in for a







:
Lisa, you have been around forever and I have never seen a pic of you. I think it's time you fixed that. BTW, I made it an entire season and still never tasted a strawberry.







:


----------



## User101

Mamas, we actually thought about this and wanted to give you a choice to stay in FYT or move to the multicultural forum. If you all could come to a consensus and PM me if you want to move, that would be great!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Had to pop in for a







:
Lisa, you have been around forever and I have never seen a pic of you. I think it's time you fixed that. BTW, I made it an entire season and still never tasted a strawberry.







:

Just because *you* asked
me!me!me!

Sorry about your attempt at growing strawberries


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
omg. you are adorable!

eta: your boy is gorgeous too! sweettttt!









:

I've had a very long week. I"m tired. WHen I got back here, I couldn't post to this thread.









The multicultural forum.... hm. Nobody knows it exists, first off. Secondly, I don't think that all of our families are, in fact, multicultural. Mine is, but a black woman married to a black man raising black children probably doesn't feel any more multicultural than a white woman married to a white man raising white children. Is "multicultural" a word that's supposed to mean "anyone who's not white?" That's kind of... off, in my opinion. Just my take on it, though, and I'm very tired so forgive me if I'm not articulating well.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







:

I've had a very long week. I"m tired. WHen I got back here, I couldn't post to this thread.









The multicultural forum.... hm. Nobody knows it exists, first off. Secondly, I don't think that all of our families are, in fact, multicultural. Mine is, but a black woman married to a black man raising black children probably doesn't feel any more multicultural than a white woman married to a white man raising white children. Is "multicultural" a word that's supposed to mean "anyone who's not white?" That's kind of... off, in my opinion. Just my take on it, though, and I'm very tired so forgive me if I'm not articulating well.









You summed up my feelings quite well! I vote for us to stay right here.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







:

I've had a very long week. I"m tired. WHen I got back here, I couldn't post to this thread.









The multicultural forum.... hm. Nobody knows it exists, first off. Secondly, I don't think that all of our families are, in fact, multicultural. Mine is, but a black woman married to a black man raising black children probably doesn't feel any more multicultural than a white woman married to a white man raising white children. Is "multicultural" a word that's supposed to mean "anyone who's not white?" That's kind of... off, in my opinion. Just my take on it, though, and I'm very tired so forgive me if I'm not articulating well.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 







You summed up my feelings quite well! I vote for us to stay right here.

I totally agree. I'm happy being a tribe. *nod*


----------



## shayinme

I want to stay here, for me the conversations that occur here are different than what might happen if we were placed in the multicultural section. Also there are women who post here who I know rarely if ever venture into the multicultural section because they are not multcultural nor are their families.

Shay


----------



## Bloomingstar

yeah, I agree that we should stay here. I agree with eilonwy 100%


----------



## AndrewsMother

Eilonwy's thoughts are the same as my own. I like it here in Tribes.


----------



## User101

Here you stay, then! No offense was meant, mamas-- we're just trying to make sure everyone is where they'll get the most traffic.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just because *you* asked
me!me!me!

Sorry about your attempt at growing strawberries
















I love your pic and the ear rings are HOT!!!


----------



## JustKiya

Oooh, are we sharing pictures??!??! That's my current favorite.







:

I realized today, that I struggle sometimes in not stereotyping black people.

I had a conversation today with someone who is a staunch McCain supporter - and even more so based on his VP pick - and it just blew my mind - I'm still having a hard time processing it. *lol*

But then, I had to pull back and remind myself of what I have to tell myself all the time - we are all different. Yeah, we share the same skin color, but the thoughts, hopes, wishes, dreams, beliefs and goals under that skin are all different......... *sigh* We are not, and have never been, a cohesive 'bloc' .... and - while that's a good thing (because blocs always create other) - it's - hard, sometimes to swallow.


----------



## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just because *you* asked
me!me!me!

Sorry about your attempt at growing strawberries
















Wow, nice picture! Very classy!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Oooh, are we sharing pictures??!??! That's my current favorite.







:

So is yours! I love your hair!


----------



## oyinmama

whoo hoo! pics. yall are cutiepies.

my favorite pic of the moment is the absolute opposite of classy









btw - what yall said about staying in FYT.

and also: baby boy rolled over yesterday!! my mom was in town and was right there to see it. she called us, and he obliged by repeating the performance... like nine times. he even got up on all fours and rocked!! when i fed him later, he rolled back and forth from side to back again and again and again. little showoff!


----------



## eilonwy

I fear the lens side of the camera.







:







:









Or... maybe I just fear Mike's pictures. He's like... not exactly artistic that way.


----------



## shayinme

Oyinmama, you love showing off how fab you look in that pic post-baby







. Seriously that is a great pic of you.

Me, I am photo adverse, rarely take pics, hate to be photographed as I take horrible pictures.

Both JustKiya and Purplegirl, ya'll are both adorably cute


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Oyinmama, you love showing off how fab you look in that pic post-baby







. Seriously that is a great pic of you.

Me, I am photo adverse, rarely take pics, hate to be photographed as I take horrible pictures.

Both JustKiya and Purplegirl, ya'll are both adorably cute









i agree. That is a nice pic Oyin!
Thanks for the compliments on my picture. As for the earrings--they are Lucky Brand. I love their jewelry!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Even tho the decision is already made, i also vote we stay here. I often forget the multicultural board is even there and while its nice to visit, I dont think it applies to our tribe here very well.

As for the pics....YA'LL ARE GORGEOUS!!!!! I am also very shy of the lens side of the camera, but there are some pics that I need to develop, so maybe i will post those here soon.

Baby feening over, as my siggy so tells, but its mainly because im in a real transitory place in my life....the proverbial crossroads if you will. Anyone else have experience in getting through that if you've btdt?

Again, I say, ya'll are friggin GORGEOUS and im jelly of EVERYONE's hair, lol.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg


----------



## rootzdawta

Hey Lovely Ladies!

I thought I was subscribed to the thread . . . but alas!!

I can't read through all the pages but I just wanted to say hey to everyone!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Even tho the decision is already made, i also vote we stay here. I often forget the multicultural board is even there and while its nice to visit, I dont think it applies to our tribe here very well.

As for the pics....YA'LL ARE GORGEOUS!!!!! I am also very shy of the lens side of the camera, but there are some pics that I need to develop, so maybe i will post those here soon.

*Baby feening over, as my siggy so tells, but its mainly because im in a real transitory place in my life....the proverbial crossroads if you will. Anyone else have experience in getting through that if you've btdt?*

Again, I say, ya'll are friggin GORGEOUS and im jelly of EVERYONE's hair, lol.









I don't have time to post more but I can totally relate. I'll post more later.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg


Oh goodness. You and your baby are so pretty


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hey Lovely Ladies!

I thought I was subscribed to the thread . . . but alas!!

I can't read through all the pages but I just wanted to say hey to everyone!!

Hi there rootzdawta. It is always so good to see *you*!


----------



## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg

Wow, what a beautifully done picture!

And hey, rootzdawta!!


----------



## shayinme

Piad, both you and your baby are cuties







.

Ladies, I am having hair woes today, just need to vent. I have been natural almost 9 years and locked 4, I been freeforming for most of the time I have been locked. My locs are long, to the middle of my back but they are not healthy. I am at that stage that I have the loc-fro plus I have buildup that I just cannot seem to get a handle on. Also the longer my locs get, I have ones that are dangling my not much. Most of the summer I have been keeping my hair wrapped and covered.

Now if I lived in a real city, I would get thee to a loctitian like yesterday, problem is in Maine, there is only 1 Black salon and girlfriend really don't know natural hair. So that leaves taking the train 2 hours to Boston, problem is I have been to the better loctitian in Boston and really they are only alright. Now I could go to NYC but that is long day trip or an overnight and honestly with the holidays almost upon us and winter heating season, that is a bit more cash than I can afford.

However my hair needs help, I am almost tempted to just do a big cut and go back to a TWA since I loved how easy a TWA is to handle. I was dreaming of just cutting off my babies and going to the local Aveda salon and getting a nice color job and being done. Problem is that I am sorta attached to having length and while I loved the ease of a TWA it was not the most flattering look for me according to family members. Granted I have lost a bit of weight since I last had a TWA almost 9 years ago.

Anyway I am just in a quandry at the moment and since I am PMS'ing, I know I better wait until my cycle ends before I do anything drastic but I admit times like this living in Maine sucks. Since ideally I could get some TLC for my hair from a loctitian and save my babies. Ugh...

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Hello Rootzdawta!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Oh goodness. You and your baby are so pretty










Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Wow, what a beautifully done picture!


Thank you!!!! My husband did take a wonderful picture!!! It is one of my favorites.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just because *you* asked
me!me!me!


I love the picture, and your top/dress. You look GREAT!!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Oooh, are we sharing pictures??!??! That's my current favorite.







:

I realized today, that I struggle sometimes in not stereotyping black people.

I had a conversation today with someone who is a staunch McCain supporter - and even more so based on his VP pick - and it just blew my mind - I'm still having a hard time processing it. *lol*

But then, I had to pull back and remind myself of what I have to tell myself all the time - we are all different. Yeah, we share the same skin color, but the thoughts, hopes, wishes, dreams, beliefs and goals under that skin are all different......... *sigh* We are not, and have never been, a cohesive 'bloc' .... and - while that's a good thing (because blocs always create other) - it's - hard, sometimes to swallow.

My family still can't believe that I voted for Bush.....and well Palin does look good on paper...minus the possible strong arming and her stance on sex education with an obviously pregnant daughter.......but I am so voting for Obama!!!! As for my family, they have just learned to love me as I am!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Piad, both you and your baby are cuties







.

Shay

Thank you very much, and as for your hair, I wish that I had advice or the money to send you to New York!!







The TWA does not look good on me at all and hopefully by the end of next week I will have two strand twists with extensions. Maybe something marvelous will happen with regard to your finances allowing you to take that trip!


----------



## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg


Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Piad, both you and your baby are cuties







.

Ladies, I am having hair woes today, just need to vent. I have been natural almost 9 years and locked 4, I been freeforming for most of the time I have been locked. My locs are long, to the middle of my back but they are not healthy. I am at that stage that I have the loc-fro plus I have buildup that I just cannot seem to get a handle on. Also the longer my locs get, I have ones that are dangling my not much. Most of the summer I have been keeping my hair wrapped and covered.

Now if I lived in a real city, I would get thee to a loctitian like yesterday, problem is in Maine, there is only 1 Black salon and girlfriend really don't know natural hair. So that leaves taking the train 2 hours to Boston, problem is I have been to the better loctitian in Boston and really they are only alright. Now I could go to NYC but that is long day trip or an overnight and honestly with the holidays almost upon us and winter heating season, that is a bit more cash than I can afford.

However my hair needs help, I am almost tempted to just do a big cut and go back to a TWA since I loved how easy a TWA is to handle. I was dreaming of just cutting off my babies and going to the local Aveda salon and getting a nice color job and being done. Problem is that I am sorta attached to having length and while I loved the ease of a TWA it was not the most flattering look for me according to family members. Granted I have lost a bit of weight since I last had a TWA almost 9 years ago.

Anyway I am just in a quandry at the moment and since I am PMS'ing, I know I better wait until my cycle ends before I do anything drastic but I admit times like this living in Maine sucks. Since ideally I could get some TLC for my hair from a loctitian and save my babies. Ugh...

Shay

I'm kinda in the same boat. I've been...er...basically neglecting (














my locs since pregnancy. I'm trying my best to hold off to cut them off until after the kid gets here to see if I still feel the same way. And short cuts don't really suit me either. And I dreamed of long beautiful locs when I started over a year ago, and I know I'll kick myself if I cut them cause if I keep cutting, I'll never get any real length.

I say do this: Treat yourself either to the stylist in Boston or NY if you can. Then, decide after that if you still want to cut. Give it some time. For me, if I _realllly_ want to do something with my hair, it don't matter how good I make it look in it's present state, I still want to do it. If you still want to cut it after fixing it up, then you can always still do it after letting it grow out some.

but that's all just what I would do, and how I work with my impulsive brain..other people's brains don't work like mine.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
So is yours! I love your hair!

Hehe! Thank you! The only reason I took the picture was *for* the hair, so that's a good thing.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Both JustKiya and Purplegirl, ya'll are both adorably cute









Thank you!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg

You look SO Familiar! *scratches chin*

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
My family still can't believe that I voted for Bush.....and well Palin does look good on paper...minus the possible strong arming and her stance on sex education with an obviously pregnant daughter.......but I am so voting for Obama!!!! As for my family, they have just learned to love me as I am!









I was talking to DH about it more, and I finally pinned down what - tweaks my nipples the most about it all - in my mind, a vote for McCain is a stamp of approval on the last eight years............ and I really do want to sit down and have a chat with those who think that the last 8 years have been good ones, so that I can understand (or at least try to understand) their perspective. Black republicans are cool.


----------



## rootzdawta

Shay, I know all about hair woes! Here are my suggestions--not saying they've worked for me yet but it's what I'm doing to try to keep my locks on head.
1. up your protein intake
2. up your intake or raw greens
3. take a B-complex supplement formulated for stress
4. wash hair with a protein shampoo and condition with protein conditioner (I'm using Aubrey Organics GPS Rosemary and Peppermint for now--wash weekly
5. do apple cider vinegar rinses-- 1 part ACV to 4 parts tea of rosemary and nettle
6. use light oils that are easily absorbed and don't weigh down the hair (jojoba and coconut are good choices)
7. fortify the locks--just find a really thin lock, grab some of the short loose hair around that lock with your left hand and wrap the thin lock around the loose hair. Don't do it too tight.at.all. You can latch the lock ONCE so it won't unravel as much

I just went to holistic loctician a few weeks ago out in Brooklyn (PM me for the name). She was really great but I can't say she gave me any more tips than the ones I already knew. She did suggest chondroitin as a supplement and also taking a regular liquid multivitamin. I would have loved to get my hair done but I couldn't swing the $$$ (not that it was soooo overly pricey) so I only had a consultation.

I hope you can save your hair!! I'm desperately holding on to mine. I really don't like how I look with a TWA (I look like my brother!). Oh and definitely see a loctitian first and don't do anything till you period is over and done.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Hehe! Thank you! The only reason I took the picture was *for* the hair, so that's a good thing.









Thank you!

You look SO Familiar! *scratches chin*








I was talking to DH about it more, and I finally pinned down what - tweaks my nipples the most about it all - in my mind, a vote for McCain is a stamp of approval on the last eight years............ and I really do want to sit down and have a chat with those who think that the last 8 years have been good ones, so that I can understand (or at least try to understand) their perspective. Black republicans are cool.









hmmm....by chance did you attend Mississippi State University? Did you ever live in Atlanta or Northwest Georgia?

I can understand why anyone would think/believe that a vote for McCain is a stamp of approval on the last eight years, because I feel the same, but I am one of those who has not had any decline in personal finances due to the economy or government in anyway. I will admit that I wear my blinders daily and I often fail to see what is going on around me. It would be to my advantage, maybe, to have my finger on the pulse of the nation, but what is going on in my own world is far more interesting and monopolizes most of my time.

Perhaps, I am not the only black American who is not attuned to the issues that many deem to be of importance. Or quite possibly they have a different level of economic progress, and we all do.

I do agree with your previous statement that is is a good thing that black americans are not a cohesive block, because I find our differences to beautiful.

Besides, someone needs to vote for McCain, because this Obamican and many others will not!!!

Oh, just thinking about Obama makes me giddy!


----------



## rootzdawta

Question: Is everyone African-American or are there any Caribbean or African Tribe members?

If so, how does where you're from influence how you understand/feel about American politics?


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
hmmm....by chance did you attend Mississippi State University? Did you ever live in Atlanta or Northwest Georgia?

*I do agree with your previous statement that is is a good thing that black americans are not a cohesive block, because I find our differences to beautiful.*

It is a wonderful and beautiful thing!!!









I lived in ATL from 95 until I graduated from Spelman in 2000....... Hrrrrm. Maybe I *do* know you!


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
It is a wonderful and beautiful thing!!!









I lived in ATL from 95 until I graduated from Spelman in 2000....... Hrrrrm. Maybe I *do* know you!

heeey! i graduated from spelman in 1997







:

yall are some beauties, and the babies whose pics were posted thus far look like absolute DOLLS.

and yes- shayinme - i loooove that pic, lol! looking at it makes me feel like a rock star, which is a fabulous feeling when in reality it just took me two and a half days to detangle my neglected hair which had languished past its comfort point in a set of two-strands and the resulting twistout. OUCH!

what do you guys do when you need to inject a little glamour or feel-good into your life? i always feel great when i do my hair - but that only happens like once every two or three weeks. (otherwise, it's ponypuffville)

other ideas: workout. get toes painted red. make a fabulous meal. thoughts?


----------



## oyinmama

@ shay - i don't know much about what locticians do, can you strengthen some of the locs that are dangling, by perhaps combining them or binding them together with a stronger neighbor?

i agree with rootsdawta that an ACV rinse seems a nice thing to try! she had so many wonderful suggestions.

have you thought about doing a steam to help loosen any buildup - homesteam = run a superhot shower, sit next to it, and read a magazine. and/or microwave a damp towel, wrap head, ditto with the magazine. after a while of steaming, then do a clarifying rinse - TB of two of baking soda mixed with a pint of hot water? work it through your locs, rubbing good near your scalp. rinse. repeat if desired. follow with ACV to balance the PH. separate @ the roots and twist lightly with EVOO and/or your fave hair oil or butter.

this all takes time, but if it's 'neglect' that caused your hair's current crisis, perhaps time is exactly what it needs to heal. i'm talking to myself here too - see above re: two weeks of tangling.

we can't give to our families, our communities, or our world, what we do not first nourish in ourselves. we *have to* nourish and protect ourselves! and not that i believe having healthy hair is the only way by which to do that, but i do think it's one way in which our self-neglect first shows, and often a fine symbollic way to reclaim our self-care.

and once it's right, you're gonna feel *so good!!*


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
whoo hoo! pics. yall are cutiepies.

my favorite pic of the moment is the absolute opposite of classy









btw - what yall said about staying in FYT.

and also: baby boy rolled over yesterday!! my mom was in town and was right there to see it. she called us, and he obliged by repeating the performance... like nine times. he even got up on all fours and rocked!! when i fed him later, he rolled back and forth from side to back again and again and again. little showoff!









cute pic oyin


----------



## ishereal

Beautiful pic PIAD !!!


----------



## I-AM-Mother

you guys all look really wonderful.

shay, i know nothing about locs.

my hair is just starting to grow back, but its still in the stage where i can't do much it except shower, moisturize and deep condition.

can't wait until i can twist it up


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 

what do you guys do when you need to inject a little glamour or feel-good into your life? i always feel great when i do my hair - but that only happens like once every two or three weeks. (otherwise, it's ponypuffville)

other ideas: workout. get toes painted red. make a fabulous meal. thoughts?

This summer my treat has been a monthly pedicure and eye brow wax at the local Aveda salon. That hour and half feels like heaven and my feet are so happy afterwards







:. Its a bit higher than the avearge nail joint but my feet have never looked so good and its worth it. I have been also eating more veggies and cooking more from scratch, in fact right now I am making fresh tomato soup for dinner







:. So these are the small ways I nourish myself.

I also am starting to read more, not as much as I used to but I am averaging a book a week which is good with a rambunctious 3 yo running around.

I will have to try the homemade steam, the hardest thing since dd's arrival 3 years ago has been finding the time to take care of my hair. Both the spousal unit and I work from home and you think it would be easy but time is the one thing we lack, but I know I must make time for me. Either that or make more money to take care of me







.


----------



## JustKiya

: for Spelmanites!







I was a comp sci major in the WISE program, so unless you were Comp Sci too, I most likely never met you.... they worked us HARD.









My 'feel special' treat is a massage. The local school offers 45 minutes for 15 bucks - it's wonderful, and leaves me feeling 12 pounds lighter, at least.

On a regular basis, doing my hair is actually my 'bodynourising' habit - but then, I'm hair mad.







Like, seriously. I've already told DH that once we have a little one, there will be weekly Daddy & Me days, when they leave the house, so that I can do. my. hair.







*sigh*


----------



## rootzdawta

I asked on another board but figured I'd ask here too . . . .

Okay, I'm not the most outgoing person--I'm pretty much an introvert/homebody but I'm not anti-social per se. I am having a heck of a time finding friends for my baby boy. And he's at the stage now when I can tell that he really wants friends. I'd just love to find him some buddies that are natural too, you know, locks, braids, twists, etc . . . and of color too but I'd really love for him to have a diverse group of fellows.

We're going to homeschool but this is really a concern of mine. I generally take him to the playground 2-3 times a week and story time at the library once a week. I've conside red driving to other towns for story time just to see if we can make a connection. Any suggestions of what to do? I've looked for homeschooling groups, joined meet-up.com. A lot of the time, the kids are very young--and playing with them causes my fully-able-to-speak 3 year old to start babbling and being silly. It seems like there are very few kids his age at the playground, library. Where are they???

Am I overlooking something?? How do you get out and socialize with your pre-school child??


----------



## JustKiya

Have you tried MochaMamas? *thinks* Swimming lessons? Sports?


----------



## shayinme

My dd is in daycare/preschool 3 days a week and outside of there she doesn't have any buddies her own age. I have friends who homeschool but the kids are all older like 5-6. Is there a storytime geared towards preschoolers in your area? I know at our library they have one for 0-3 and then one for 3-5.

Have you looked to see of there are any yahoo homeschooling groups in your area? We have one here, that I just joined since I am mildly interested in homeschooling. What about the tribal area here at MDC? I have met some local Mamas from being here at MDC, 2 of whom I am actually cool with, though as we sort of touched on before sometimes meeting AP style Mamas doesn't always work so well when you are a WOC. Dang, wish you lived near me.


----------



## AndrewsMother

An excellent MMO or preschool one or two days a week would be stimulating for him and a break for you????


----------



## I-AM-Mother

i had much better luck finding children for my daughter to play with when i lived in Ga, unfortunately i can't say the same since i've arrived in az. i met a few WOC living in ga, who were into AP parenting and we all clicked pretty well.

i prefer just heading out to the library for one of their plays or toddler readings. the parents generally let their children play together after wards.

depending on where you live, the children that your child interacts when you attend some of these activities may not be as diverse as you would like but you can make up for that in other areas, i think.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

btw, good luck! and hang in there!


----------



## purplegirl

Thank you sistas for the comments on my pic. I haven't been feeling all that great about myself lately so your words mean a lot








I get all giddy when I see new posts on this tribe







:. I garner so much from the wisdom all of you have!

I've been putting more effort into doing things to take care of myself. Last weekend I treated my sister and niece to a weekend in Philly. I am from there originally, but it was so nice to go back as a "tourist". We had tons of fun and are going to do it again in October. I am also going to the Green festival







: in D.C. in November. We will be staying at this hotel that is supposed to be very "zen". I am so looking forward to that.

The other things I do are: pedicures, sitting in my backyard burning incense and listening to music, doing more artistic things (paint, sew, etc). I also did some gardening, that didn't produce much, but rather helped to connect me to nature! That has been very peaceful. Many of you know we moved in to a new home last fall. I am so in love with this house. It is old, charming and it has been fun making it my own!

Rootz, I second the suggestion of "mochamoms". The chapter here is pretty active with some really nice people. My friends find it provides lots of opportunities for meaningful interaction for the children. Good luck!

Ok, back to work....will check in later!
Peace yall.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Beautiful pic PIAD !!!

Thank you. You all make me feel so pretty!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Where are they???

Am I overlooking something?? How do you get out and socialize with your pre-school child??

We do most of our socializing at church, but DS does not really have any friends that I totally approve of. I have a friend whose children he adores, but if we were not friends I WOULD NOT allow my son to consort with her children. At all. Period. They are nice children, but they just aren't nice. I have really given up on finding him an away from school friend since he adores his classmates so much.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
i had much better luck finding children for my daughter to play with when i lived in Ga, unfortunately i can't say the same since i've arrived in az. i met a few WOC living in ga, who were into AP parenting and we all clicked pretty well.


Where in GA did you live. I left my heart in GA last year in August.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am also going to the Green festival







: in D.C. in November. We will be staying at this hotel that is supposed to be very "zen". I am so looking forward to that.

Rootz, I second the suggestion of "mochamoms". The chapter here is pretty active with some really nice people. My friends find it provides lots of opportunities for meaningful interaction for the children. Good luck!

Peace yall.

Ohhh I am jealous. We were supposed to go to the Green Festival in SF...in fact I need to inform them that I can't volunteer. I am hoping....hoping....hoping that we can go next year.

Mochamoms....I contacted them a few months ago about joining and forgot to attend the meeting. I might try to connect with them.

Is anyone a member of Jack & Jill?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question: Is everyone African-American or are there any Caribbean or African Tribe members?

If so, how does where you're from influence how you understand/feel about American politics?

I guess that I am African-American. I don't like the term since Africa is such a huge continent, but I am learning to accept the term. I think.









The children of my maternal greatgrandmother were active during the 40's and the 50's urging other AA's to register to vote. I grew up listening to political discussions and watching my family take part in and assist others with the decision to vote. Because of them I understand American politics to be one of the major venues for African Americans to bring about social and economic change.

Politics is about what can, I/we do to make life better for our race, and for all races in America.


----------



## Brown Lioness

OH, i am SOOO with you on feeling neglectful towards locks, but not really wanting to cut them, shay. I know for a fact that i could take much better care of my locks and i have little excuse since I live in the DC Metro area and could throw a rock and hit the nearest loctician. I have locks "hanging by a thread" mostly in the back, a moody, flakey scalp, some scraggly and chewy ends and fly aways galore and have lost a lot of lock volume due to massive combining thus the sum of my locks are a lot thinner than I want.

However, I dont wanna pay the bucks, dont agree with the products a lot of locticians use and i dont twist, so there goes that, lol.

I am "from" Kentucky, so i know about the lack of locticians, thus I started and maintained my own from jump. I agree with the sis's above in that, dont make any hasty decisions, pamper yourself, pamper your hair and then see how you feel about cutting.

Looking at all these gorgeous women in this thread's hair makes me nostalgic for my own loose hair (even tho i have a NICE thick root bed, lol), but I know im not ready yet.


----------



## JustKiya

*sniffsniff* Ya'll making me miss my locs, now!!! Kinda sorta.








I've fallen head over heels for my own hair (for the first time, I actually know what I'm doing with it!) so I think reloc'ing might be reserved for my golden years.... *nod*


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just because *you* asked
me!me!me!

Sorry about your attempt at growing strawberries
















Sooo late to the convo, but I love your smile, Purplegirl. You look like family to me.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I fear the lens side of the camera.







:







:









Or... maybe I just fear Mike's pictures. He's like... not exactly artistic that way.









I'm also a cameraphobe. I just think I am the most unphotogenic person in the world- especially after having DS. I'll see if I can find a good one.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I don't know if I have shared a picture before, and if I have it was this picture or one similar to it. I have not been photographed recently except for at my cousin's wedding and do not look good in orange.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...Andrew/pp2.jpg

Beautiful picture. What a gorgeous little baby!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Sooo late to the convo, but I love your smile, Purplegirl. You look like family to me.









awww, thank you. can you see my braces?


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
awww, thank you. can you see my braces?









I didn't notice them.








You all are so photogenic!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I asked on another board but figured I'd ask here too . . . .

Okay, I'm not the most outgoing person--I'm pretty much an introvert/homebody but I'm not anti-social per se. I am having a heck of a time finding friends for my baby boy. And he's at the stage now when I can tell that he really wants friends. I'd just love to find him some buddies that are natural too, you know, locks, braids, twists, etc . . . and of color too but I'd really love for him to have a diverse group of fellows.

We're going to homeschool but this is really a concern of mine. I generally take him to the playground 2-3 times a week and story time at the library once a week. I've conside red driving to other towns for story time just to see if we can make a connection. Any suggestions of what to do? I've looked for homeschooling groups, joined meet-up.com. A lot of the time, the kids are very young--and playing with them causes my fully-able-to-speak 3 year old to start babbling and being silly. It seems like there are very few kids his age at the playground, library. Where are they???

Am I overlooking something?? How do you get out and socialize with your pre-school child??

I also have lots of trouble finding friends for ds to socialize with. I'm friendly with a mom in the apt building, but her ds is almost a year older than William and he really is more advanced in playing. My ds is still parallel playing at this point.
I live in a private community in NYC and there are lots of children, but not many moms. Most of the children are with nannies. While I am friendly with the nannies, none of them are really interested in making friends.
There are hardly any WOC who are moms where I live.
I also have trouble finding mamas who are AP in this area. I've seen a few babies in slings or mei tais, but not many. My neighbor that I mentioned above- she's not AP at all. She's cool and all and I like hanging out with her, but she looks at me like I'm crazy when I say we're co-sleeping or when I say that I haven't done CIO with William.
Anyway, I'm job searching now and when I do go to work, William will be going to daycare. I guess he'll make friends when he goes there. I'm a little sad that in all this time that I've been off with him, I didn't make any connections with any parents.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question: Is everyone African-American or are there any Caribbean or African Tribe members?

If so, how does where you're from influence how you understand/feel about American politics?

I consider myself to be African-American, yes. I don't mind the term but find it sad that our own histories were lost in slavery. It's a generic term but encompasses our collective experiences as African people in America.
That said, it certainly influences my understanding/how I feel about the state of American politics. African-Americans in this country have almost 500 years of systematic oppression. You can see it all over the place from the state of schools in the inner city to housing issues. People seem to forget that Jim Crow was really not all that long ago. I think that Caribbean and African sisters and brothers come from a different experience, but when it comes down to it, they are still Black and will be seen in America as just Black.
When Barack Obama







: first decided to throw his hat in the race, I remember reading an article by some Black conservative saying that because Barack Obama was part Kenyan and part white, he would be unable to understand African-Americans. This is faulty thinking. No matter what his background, Barack Obama walks his life as a Black man. No one is going to stop and ask him if his mother is white or if his dad is from Africa.
Does that make sense?


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question: Is everyone African-American or are there any Caribbean or African Tribe members?

If so, how does where you're from influence how you understand/feel about American politics?

There's a Caribbean tribe? I'm "African American." I can't decide whether to use the term or not, on any given day. I generally say I'm black. Growing up, everyone called me "Red" and it wasn't until I went to a predominately white college that I started getting called "African-American" by people who were afraid to say "people of color" for fear they'd revert to saying colored people...sigh. All that said, yes, I'm African-American and my husband is from the Caribbean. I have always had a, let's say, kind of surly view of American politics and this country's role in the world and being from New Orleans has certainly not bettered that







: but also now just having family (the ILs) in another country has expanded that view even more.

oh! any my turn my turn! here's me at 23 weeks busting a move









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e.../watertaxi.jpg


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
There's a Caribbean tribe? I'm "African American." I can't decide whether to use the term or not, on any given day. I generally say I'm black. Growing up, everyone called me "Red" and it wasn't until I went to a predominately white college that I started getting called "African-American" by people who were afraid to say "people of color" for fear they'd revert to saying colored people...sigh. *All that said, yes, I'm African-American and my husband is from the Caribbean. I have always had a, let's say, kind of surly view of American politics and this* *country's role in the world* and being from New Orleans has certainly not bettered that







: but also now just having family (the ILs) in another country has expanded that view even more.

oh! any my turn my turn! here's me at 23 weeks busting a move









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e.../watertaxi.jpg

I could have written that exact statement;that so describes my dh and his views on american politics. He is very conservative. I know he is voting for Obama, but he sure does like some of the things McCain has to say








He has a disdain for americans generally speaking, which can be most annoying at times--I mean come on now I am american!!








I can't view your pic now cause of filters at the school where I work! I will when I get home!


----------



## Bloomingstar

thankfully my DH is not conservative, and has probably been swept even farther left from hanging around me too long







And the disdain for Americans comes out every now and then from him but way more often from other people who are around (family, friends, etc.)


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
thankfully my DH is not conservative, and has probably been swept even farther left from hanging around me too long







And the disdain for Americans comes out every now and then from him but way more often from other people who are around (family, friends, etc.)

My MIL is bad too. However, she is especially "disappointed" by black americans.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Today my DH made another of his anti Obama comments. While I am use to them and I generally overlook what he has to say about Obama, the conversation went a little further since I enteratined his ideas. He wholeheartedly believes that black Americans love and following of Obama is a slap in the face to living black leaders such as Jesse Jackson and AL Sharpton. Hmmmm.... While I respect their opinions and who they are as individuals, I have never agreed with a majority of what they have to say. Mr Sharpton and Mr Jackson always seem so angry and ready to blame the majority for the problems that plague black America. I like that Obama wants for us to work within us to change problems that plague not just OUR community but the American community as a whole.

Yes, I know all to well the impact that slavery and Jim Crow and the negative majority have played in shaping our past and some of our future, but I despise the blame game.

Of course my husband disagreed and the conversation turned to how I am just so different....blah...blah...blah....

What do you all think is the difference between the publics reception to Obama versus Jackson and Sharpton.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Beautiful picture. What a gorgeous little baby!

Thank you. My mother thinks that I am too proud because I never wait for people to tell me that he is beautiful. I love him so much and I am totally won over by his charm, dimples and good looks.
We just knew that we were going to have a funny looking baby!!
God truly answers prayers!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 

oh! any my turn my turn! here's me at 23 weeks busting a move









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e.../watertaxi.jpg

Wow! I love hair, and you are quite pretty too!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Today my DH made another of his anti Obama comments. While I am use to them and I generally overlook what he has to say about Obama, the conversation went a little further since I enteratined his ideas. He wholeheartedly believes that black Americans love and following of Obama is a slap in the face to living black leaders such as Jesse Jackson and AL Sharpton. Hmmmm.... While I respect their opinions and who they are as individuals, I have never agreed with a majority of what they have to say. Mr Sharpton and Mr Jackson always seem so angry and ready to blame the majority for the problems that plague black America. I like that Obama wants for us to work within us to change problems that plague not just OUR community but the American community as a whole.

Yes, I know all to well the impact that slavery and Jim Crow and the negative majority have played in shaping our past and some of our future, but I despise the blame game.

Of course my husband disagreed and the conversation turned to how I am just so different....blah...blah...blah....

*What do you all think is the difference between the publics reception to Obama versus Jackson and Sharpton*.

I think we are in different times and people's expectations have changed. Jackson and Sharpton have had their day and in their own ways, made a difference. Their styles are different. Really there is no comparision. I know some black folks get caught up in allegiances, but I see Obama as a push forward. I don't think it mitigates the work of those who came before him.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
There's a Caribbean tribe? I'm "African American." I can't decide whether to use the term or not, on any given day. I generally say I'm black. Growing up, everyone called me "Red" and it wasn't until I went to a predominately white college that I started getting called "African-American" by people who were afraid to say "people of color" for fear they'd revert to saying colored people...sigh. All that said, yes, I'm African-American and my husband is from the Caribbean. I have always had a, let's say, kind of surly view of American politics and this country's role in the world and being from New Orleans has certainly not bettered that







: but also now just having family (the ILs) in another country has expanded that view even more.

oh! any my turn my turn! here's me at 23 weeks busting a move









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e.../watertaxi.jpg

Go head girl!! You look FANTASTIC


----------



## Bloomingstar

Thanks Ladies!


----------



## I-AM-Mother

piad,

i just moved from columbus, ga. my oldest daughter left her heart there last year as well.


----------



## nnaemeka

peace everybody,

i've been reading along, checking out all the lovely pics, cool blogs and decided to venture out of lurkdom and introduce myself.

i am a new mama to my daughter born in july. i'm haitian-american, hubby's from ghana. we live in VA though i lived in BK and SF previously.

i'm so happy and relieved to find this tribe on MDC!


----------



## eilonwy

Bloomingstar, you're just adorable!









Am I African American? I'm mixed-- like a bucket of paint.







I have AA roots, and I'm certainly "of color," but I have a hard time thinking of myself as "black," just as I have a hard time thinking of myself as "white" or "native American" or "Asian."







I don't really fit in-- I don't look like I am anything, I don't fit into any particular culture. Meh. In recent years, I have made a conscious effort to embrace this identity and "walk the line," as it were. I make an effort to look decidedly mixed; The way I wear my hair, the way I dress, etc is cultivated so as to deliberately confuse.







: I must say, it's a PITA in the summertime, because wearing my hair down or even in a ponytail is much less comfortable than just twisting it up behind my head (and when I do *that*, it looks straight).







I'm working on it.

Politics-- It's depressing. Honestly, (and I never thought I'd say this) I find myself liking a lot of what McCain has to say.







: I'm also disappointed, somewhat, in Obama-- I think Clinton would have made a better president.







: Don't get me wrong, I'll still be voting for Obama, but I'm really hoping that he gets his behind in gear with regard to education, for example. It's going to be a tight race, and I understand why.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace everybody,

i've been reading along, checking out all the lovely pics, cool blogs and decided to venture out of lurkdom and introduce myself.

i am a new mama to my daughter born in july. i'm haitian-american, hubby's from ghana. we live in VA though i lived in BK and SF previously.

i'm so happy and relieved to find this tribe on MDC!

Welcome Nnaemeka! I'm glad you've come out of lurkdom to join us!







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace everybody,

i've been reading along, checking out all the lovely pics, cool blogs and decided to venture out of lurkdom and introduce myself.

i am a new mama to my daughter born in july. i'm haitian-american, hubby's from ghana. we live in VA though i lived in BK and SF previously.

i'm so happy and relieved to find this tribe on MDC!

Welcome nnaemeka!!







Your user name is Igbo! How'd you come about it?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Welcome nnaemeka!!







Your user name is Igbo! How'd you come about it?


Rootzdawta, I've been meaning to tell you that your blog inspires me!. I've learned so much and thanks for the great recipes!


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question: Is everyone African-American or are there any Caribbean or African Tribe members?

If so, how does where you're from influence how you understand/feel about American politics?

Chicana here!









(we had a latina tribe going about a year ago, but it fell off. so I joined you...







...hm, maybe another one is going by now??...my mind has been elsewhere lately-- see siggy!!)

re politics-- more on this later...


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Rootzdawta, I've been meaning to tell you that your blog inspires me!. I've learned so much and thanks for the great recipes!









: Thanks!!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Rootzdawta, I've been meaning to tell you that your blog inspires me!. I've learned so much and thanks for the great recipes!

I know, I love reading her blog as well especially because there does seem to be a lack of homey sista blogs out there.


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## purplegirl

I read an article on her yesterday. She has five children! I had no clue. I always assumed she was a natural living and loving woman. I miss her music so much, but it seems she is content being a great mom and so who can be mad about that!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I know, I love reading her blog as well especially because there does seem to be a lack of homey sista blogs out there.

Thanks Shay!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I read an article on her yesterday. She has five children! I had no clue. I always assumed she was a natural living and loving woman. I miss her music so much, but it seems she is content being a great mom and so who can be mad about that!









You know, just a few weeks ago, I heard a radio personality (I think Wendy Williams) ragging on Lauryn. And I thought to myself . . . these folks know so little about her. Who are they to speak? She's got five kids, ain't asking nobody for a handout, raising them babies . . . more power to her. Who knows? She might feel just honored to be bringing Bob Marley's grandkids into the world? She might feel just honored to be the vessel through which _any_ children decided to come through!

I was thinking wouldn't it be great if she was a natural living mama!?! Cloth diapering, breastfeeding, the whole nine yards??? Now that's some gossip about L Boogie that I would LOVE to hear.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I read an article on her yesterday. She has five children! I had no clue. I always assumed she was a natural living and loving woman. I miss her music so much, but it seems she is content being a great mom and so who can be mad about that!









I read something recently about her as well, I know people are saying stuff about her that is not positive but from what I have read it just seems that she is in a season of life where she is about her kids. Honestly and I am not being sexist but having 5 kids it seems that considering she is probably well off financially I see nothing wrong with focusing on her babies. She is still a young woman and in several years when the kids are older, could easily make a transiition back to the music world. She is a mega talented sista.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace everybody,

i've been reading along, checking out all the lovely pics, cool blogs and decided to venture out of lurkdom and introduce myself.

i am a new mama to my daughter born in july. i'm haitian-american, hubby's from ghana. we live in VA though i lived in BK and SF previously.

i'm so happy and relieved to find this tribe on MDC!

Welcome, Nnaemeka!
My best girlfriend is Haitian-American, too! Sac Passe!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Bloomingstar, you're just adorable!









Am I African American? I'm mixed-- like a bucket of paint.







I have AA roots, and I'm certainly "of color," but I have a hard time thinking of myself as "black," just as I have a hard time thinking of myself as "white" or "native American" or "Asian."







I don't really fit in-- I don't look like I am anything, I don't fit into any particular culture. Meh. In recent years, I have made a conscious effort to embrace this identity and "walk the line," as it were. I make an effort to look decidedly mixed; The way I wear my hair, the way I dress, etc is cultivated so as to deliberately confuse.







: I must say, it's a PITA in the summertime, because wearing my hair down or even in a ponytail is much less comfortable than just twisting it up behind my head (and when I do *that*, it looks straight).







I'm working on it.

Politics-- It's depressing. Honestly, (and I never thought I'd say this) I find myself liking a lot of what McCain has to say.







: I'm also disappointed, somewhat, in Obama-- I think Clinton would have made a better president.







: Don't get me wrong, I'll still be voting for Obama, but I'm really hoping that he gets his behind in gear with regard to education, for example. It's going to be a tight race, and I understand why.







:

Eilonwy, I'm also mixed. I'm African American and Korean and I look very much the part. I look like a bigger and darker nappy haired version of my Korean mother.
I have no problem claiming both. It's just what I am. If someone asks me if I'm Black, I'll say yes, and if someone asks me if I'm Asian, I'll say yes too. I wouldn't be lying.








I'm quite comfortable in my skin, thanks to all the wonderful people who had their hand in my upbringing. I celebrate and embrace both cultures unabashedly.
I often wonder about one thing, though. The term "women of color" techinically applies not just to African-American women, but also to Latinas, Asians, Native NDNs, etc. There are lots of those here on MDC, but only some come here on the WOC tribe.
I wonder why that is.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Thanks Shay!









You know, just a few weeks ago, I heard a radio personality (I think Wendy Williams) ragging on Lauryn. And I thought to myself . . . these folks know so little about her. Who are they to speak? She's got five kids, ain't asking nobody for a handout, raising them babies . . . more power to her. Who knows? She might feel just honored to be bringing Bob Marley's grandkids into the world? She might feel just honored to be the vessel through which _any_ children decided to come through!

I was thinking wouldn't it be great if she was a natural living mama!?! Cloth diapering, breastfeeding, the whole nine yards??? Now that's some gossip about L Boogie that I would LOVE to hear.









Wendy Williams speaks very negatively. I can't listen to her and anything I say about her would be a UAV.
I think it's wonderful that Lauryn is focusing on her family- just what a lot of us would like to do.
I did read that she was working on music and getting ready for a comeback.
I'm not actually a huge fan (I liked the Fugees but was not big on her solo stuff), but I still expect her to do some good things. I wish her the best.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Chicana here!









(we had a latina tribe going about a year ago, but it fell off. so I joined you...







...hm, maybe another one is going by now??...my mind has been elsewhere lately-- see siggy!!)

re politics-- more on this later...

Hey mama! Welcome back and congratulations on the birth of your son


----------



## I-AM-Mother

i'm black. my father is black. my mother is Italian and creole. Her mother is Italian and her father was Creole.

the reason i consider myself black (although most of my family on my mother's side do not, they will list everything they are mixed with) is because growing up my mother's father side (creoles) had a lot of issues with people passing themselves off as white. they would deny any of their darker relatives, cut ties, etc. some of them married into families of extreme wealth and found the color black to be disgusting.

my grandfather (who married an italian woman, my granny) walked a fine line with his family because he spoke five different languages, and his skin was white but had a red undertone so he always looked like a white man with a tan, but that ended when his children with my Italian grandmother began dating "*******." he had to choose a side, and choose to support his children and their choices. from that day on, we were outcasts. my grandfather was very hurt by his families decision and no matter what he was not able to develop any kind of relationship what so ever with his family again.

so at a very young age, i saw how race and color could make and break families.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
i'm black. my father is black. my mother is Italian and creole. Her mother is Italian and her father was Creole.

the reason i consider myself black (although most of my family on my mother's side do not, they will list everything they are mixed with) is because growing up my mother's father side (creoles) had a lot of issues with people passing themselves off as white. they would deny any of their darker relatives, cut ties, etc. some of them married into families of extreme wealth and found the color black to be disgusting.

my grandfather (who married an italian woman, my granny) walked a fine line with his family because he spoke five different languages, and his skin was white but had a red undertone so he always looked like a white man with a tan, but that ended when his children with my Italian grandmother began dating "*******." he had to choose a side, and choose to support his children and their choices. from that day on, we were outcasts. my grandfather was very hurt by his families decision and no matter what he was not able to develop any kind of relationship what so ever with his family again.

so at a very young age, *i saw how race and color could make and break families*.

amen sister. i appreciate what you shared.


----------



## Arike

Hey ladies! I am stepping out of lurkdom to say hi. I am not a mommy yet, I am currently 34 weeks and 3 days. I have been following the thread though and enjoying everyone's input. Here is a pic of me at 33 weeks and 4 days.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o6ukgEsAJC...00_1087%5B1%5D

I also have a blog about my pregnancy because I actually didn't know I was pregnant until I was 19 weeks along so I have been documenting my "adventures in surprise pregnancy". You can PM me if you want to take a look. Anyway, hope everyone in the tristate area is staying dry from Hurricane Hanna!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies! I am stepping out of lurkdom to say hi. I am not a mommy yet, I am currently 34 weeks and 3 days. I have been following the thread though and enjoying everyone's input. Here is a pic of me at 33 weeks and 4 days.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o6ukgEsAJC...00_1087%5B1%5D

I also have a blog about my pregnancy because I actually didn't know I was pregnant until I was 19 weeks along so I have been documenting my "adventures in surprise pregnancy". You can PM me if you want to take a look. Anyway, hope everyone in the tristate area is staying dry from Hurricane Hanna!

Beautiful mama! glad to have you join us


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Beautiful mama! glad to have you join us









Thanks purplegirl! I am happy to be here!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies! I am stepping out of lurkdom to say hi. I am not a mommy yet, I am currently 34 weeks and 3 days. I have been following the thread though and enjoying everyone's input. Here is a pic of me at 33 weeks and 4 days.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o6ukgEsAJC...00_1087%5B1%5D

I also have a blog about my pregnancy because I actually didn't know I was pregnant until I was 19 weeks along so I have been documenting my "adventures in surprise pregnancy". You can PM me if you want to take a look. Anyway, hope everyone in the tristate area is staying dry from Hurricane Hanna!

Welcome, gorgeous Mama!
I see you're a fellow New Yorker!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies! I am stepping out of lurkdom to say hi. I am not a mommy yet, I am currently 34 weeks and 3 days. I have been following the thread though and enjoying everyone's input. Here is a pic of me at 33 weeks and 4 days.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o6ukgEsAJC...00_1087%5B1%5D

I also have a blog about my pregnancy because I actually didn't know I was pregnant until I was 19 weeks along so I have been documenting my "adventures in surprise pregnancy". You can PM me if you want to take a look. Anyway, hope everyone in the tristate area is staying dry from Hurricane Hanna!









Arike!

That's wild that you didn't know till 18 weeks!!!! No morning sickness? No excessive tiredness? No 50 million trips to the toilet?? LoL . . . in any case, Congrats!!!


----------



## rootzdawta

NY/NJ/CT WoC, do you all want to get together while the weather is still nice? We could do something free like walk around Central Park or go to lunch or something.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies! I am stepping out of lurkdom to say hi. I am not a mommy yet, I am currently 34 weeks and 3 days. I have been following the thread though and enjoying everyone's input. Here is a pic of me at 33 weeks and 4 days.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o6ukgEsAJC...00_1087%5B1%5D

I also have a blog about my pregnancy because I actually didn't know I was pregnant until I was 19 weeks along so I have been documenting my "adventures in surprise pregnancy". You can PM me if you want to take a look. Anyway, hope everyone in the tristate area is staying dry from Hurricane Hanna!

Welcome and congrats on pregnancy.

Shay


----------



## ~gilli~

Hey! It's not fair to have a gret together if you don't include Maryland peeps!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Hey! It's not fair to have a gret together if you don't include Maryland peeps!









Hey, if you want to come on up, come on up!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Hey! It's not fair to have a gret together if you don't include Maryland peeps!










And let's not forget us Delaware folks


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
NY/NJ/CT WoC, do you all want to get together while the weather is still nice? We could do something free like walk around Central Park or go to lunch or something.

I'm down!

Welcome Arike







BK!

I-AM-MOTHER my father's side of the family is Creole too but are very adamantly black--I think being in Louisiana for Jim Crow where people "know" you're black whether anyone else would guess it or not does something for you. In any case, I think some parts of the earlier generations (like in the 1800s heh and maybe a few of my grandfather's relatives in the 50s) of my family have similar stories to your family's. Have you read Bliss Broyard's book? It's called One Drop. I haven't read it yet but it's on my list


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I'm down!

Welcome Arike







BK!

I-AM-MOTHER my father's side of the family is Creole too but are very adamantly black--I think being in Louisiana for Jim Crow where people "know" you're black whether anyone else would guess it or not does something for you. In any case, I think some parts of the earlier generations (like in the 1800s heh and maybe a few of my grandfather's relatives in the 50s) of my family have similar stories to your family's. Have you read Bliss Broyard's book? It's called One Drop. I haven't read it yet but it's on my list









no i haven't, but it's on the list now. thanks for sharing that.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:

I often wonder about one thing, though. The term "women of color" techinically applies not just to African-American women, but also to Latinas, Asians, Native NDNs, etc. There are lots of those here on MDC, but only some come here on the WOC tribe.
I wonder why that is.
yeah i wonder about this too. i suspect that many other w.o.c.'s or poc's don't think of themselves as connnected to others poc's outside their racial or ethnic background. perhaps the women of color as a collective identity had its heyday in the "Bridge Called My Back" era of the 70's and 80's and it may be fading fast in the light of the "colorblind-ism" of today.

rootzdawta: i spent the afternoon checking out your blog--i dig it! do you sell your beautiful wares?

arike: congrads on the pregnancy ( though i can't believe you didn't know. i knew when i conceived!) your edd is my birthday---yeah libras!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
i'm black. my father is black. my mother is Italian and creole. Her mother is Italian and her father was Creole.

the reason i consider myself black (although most of my family on my mother's side do not, they will list everything they are mixed with) is because growing up my mother's father side (creoles) had a lot of issues with people passing themselves off as white. they would deny any of their darker relatives, cut ties, etc. some of them married into families of extreme wealth and found the color black to be disgusting.

my grandfather (who married an italian woman, my granny) walked a fine line with his family because he spoke five different languages, and his skin was white but had a red undertone so he always looked like a white man with a tan, but that ended when his children with my Italian grandmother began dating "*******." he had to choose a side, and choose to support his children and their choices. from that day on, we were outcasts. my grandfather was very hurt by his families decision and no matter what he was not able to develop any kind of relationship what so ever with his family again.

so at a very young age, i saw how race and color could make and break families.

i really respect this position/perspective. i always remember what Lisa Jones wrote in ber book "Bullet Proof Diva" which i read years ago. As the biracial (Af/Am and Jewish i think) daughter of Amiri Baraka aka Leroi Jones and Hettie Jones...she said that she would/could only identify with a mixed race identity that is thoroughly anti-racist, pro-Black and that was committed to a critique/disavowal of white supremacy. Until that was happening she would identify as Black.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
i really respect this position/perspective. i always remember what Lisa Jones wrote in ber book "Bullet Proof Diva" which i read years ago. As the biracial (Af/Am and Jewish i think) daughter of Amiri Baraka aka Leroi Jones and Hettie Jones...she said that she would/could only identify with a mixed race identity that is thoroughly anti-racist, pro-Black and that was committed to a critique/disavowal of white supremacy. Until that was happening she would identify as Black.

there is nothing like listening to another person in order to get a better understanding of yourself. i hope that makes sense. I am also going to be sure to check out her book. it sounds really interesting.

and welcome to MDC!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Welcome, gorgeous Mama!
I see you're a fellow New Yorker!

Yes I am! I see you are in the East village, I actually work in the West village!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 







Arike!

That's wild that you didn't know till 18 weeks!!!! No morning sickness? No excessive tiredness? No 50 million trips to the toilet?? LoL . . . in any case, Congrats!!!

Greetings rootzdawta! I had absolutely NO morning sickness! And I wasn't tired, I actually was in the middle of intense rehearsals for a dance performance with the company I am in when I got the positive test results. I thought I was still in my 1st trimester. Little did I know that I was well into my 2nd trimester, leaping and rolling around on the stage with a little boo already well formed inside me! I was going to the bathroom more frequently I think, but I thought I was just drinking more water!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
NY/NJ/CT WoC, do you all want to get together while the weather is still nice? We could do something free like walk around Central Park or go to lunch or something.

I am down for a tri-state get-together. That would be great! I only have one other friend who is a mom so it would be awesome to connect!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Welcome and congrats on pregnancy.

Shay

Hi Shay. Thanks!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 

Welcome Arike







BK!

Bloomingstar, are you in BK too?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
arike: congrads on the pregnancy ( though i can't believe you didn't know. i knew when i conceived!) your edd is my birthday---yeah libras!

Hi nnaemeka! I love libras! My DH is a libra too!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
NY/NJ/CT WoC, do you all want to get together while the weather is still nice? We could do something free like walk around Central Park or go to lunch or something.

That would be fantastic!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 

Bloomingstar, are you in BK too?









yup! I am, and I'm also a dancer, and pregnant right now too! I knew I was pregnant right away, and a few people in my company knew within a week of me knowing--they know my body, I guess







I've been taking it easy lately though. And I see you're planning a homebirth too! exciting! who's your midwife? or we can pm this since it's all public and such.


----------



## rootzdawta

Okay so so far, NY/NJ/Ct WoC tribe members are:

Arike
Bloomingstar
Rootzdawta
WilliamsMama

Did I miss anyone? Soon as I have all the names, I'll try to coordinate via PMs.







Oooh, I'm excited!!


----------



## shayinme

Sistas, can I just say I am a tad jealous that ya'll live close enough to get together..l would so love to hook up with some crunchy leaning sistas. Sure none of ya'll don't want to move to Maine







. Heck, even Boston is close enough to get together. LOL

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Sistas, can I just say I am a tad jealous that ya'll live close enough to get together..l would so love to hook up with some crunchy leaning sistas. Sure none of ya'll don't want to move to Maine







. Heck, even Boston is close enough to get together. LOL

Shay









that

I was just thinking of how I would love to live in New York. Maybe this would be an excellent reason to move.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Sistas, can I just say I am a tad jealous that ya'll live close enough to get together..l would so love to hook up with some crunchy leaning sistas. Sure none of ya'll don't want to move to Maine







. Heck, even Boston is close enough to get together. LOL

Shay


definitely that!!!


----------



## kimiij

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay so so far, NY/NJ/Ct WoC tribe members are:

Arike
Bloomingstar
Rootzdawta
WilliamsMama

Did I miss anyone? Soon as I have all the names, I'll try to coordinate via PMs.







Oooh, I'm excited!!









I'm in NJ. But, as a warning I'm not a mom yet


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey mama! Welcome back and congratulations on the birth of your son









Thanks, purplegirl!! I am on Cloud 9 these days. I had an absolutely incredible homebirth experience after much nay-saying coming from my family.







My little guy had his first bath tonight







and we are breastfeeding 'round the clock...









The sole distraction was my mother







:- won't get into the gorey details (ok, ONE detail real quick: when I called to tell her we needed her-i was 7cm and in labor, mind you-her response was, "I just sat down to dinner."


----------



## Sugarshoc

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay so so far, NY/NJ/Ct WoC tribe members are:

Arike
Bloomingstar
Rootzdawta
WilliamsMama

Did I miss anyone? Soon as I have all the names, I'll try to coordinate via PMs.







Oooh, I'm excited!!









I'm in Brooklyn, NY with my DD.


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I often wonder about one thing, though. The term "women of color" techinically applies not just to African-American women, but also to Latinas, Asians, Native NDNs, etc. There are lots of those here on MDC, but only some come here on the WOC tribe.
I wonder why that is.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
yeah i wonder about this too. i suspect that many other w.o.c.'s or poc's don't think of themselves as connnected to others poc's outside their racial or ethnic background. perhaps the women of color as a collective identity had its heyday in the "Bridge Called My Back" era of the 70's and 80's and it may be fading fast in the light of the "colorblind-ism" of today.

Am I the sole Chicana reading and/or posting here? I know there are more of us around this board because I tried to get a Latina tribe going last year. There was a little flurry of activity at first, but we never really got going. It was great cultural mix, too: Puerto Riqueñas, Chicanas, some South American mamas, Cubanas... so why did the tribe sort of...fade...









And why haven't other Latinas (and other WOC) joined here? Not sure...

Maybe there is some truth to what nnaemeka says about the fading collective identity...?... it is really unfortunate, if so. We need to support eachother as WOC if true progress is going to happen. IMO, this is what mainstream, Anglo, corporate culture has been so good at: effectively dividing communities of color and marginalized peoples such that everyone is scrambling and competing for limited resources. We have GOT to work together to demand progessive social change. We have GOT to organize collectively, yet still clarify and articulate the specific issues that are affecting our particular communities.

I'm also wondering if the "fading collective identity" is a generational thing. Do 20-something WOC still read "Bridge"? I don't know...I myself am fairly out of touch with younger WOC and what their cultural and social norms are. The few (Hispanic) young(er) women I know are fairly apolitical [is that what you mean by "colorblindism", nnaemeka?]. Course, that could be a symptom of where/how they grew up...

ok, I'm babbling now. All-night nursing is going to my brain...


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay so so far, NY/NJ/Ct WoC tribe members are:

Arike
Bloomingstar
kimiij
Sugarshoc
Rootzdawta
WilliamsMama

Did I miss anyone? Soon as I have all the names, I'll try to coordinate via PMs.







Oooh, I'm excited!!









Quoting myself to add names.


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends!

Wow! There's nothing like coming here to your tribe and having to read 8+pages to get caught up!
Well, first things first:
This is to All of the New Members here:







*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*








I am so happy to "see" so many new voices here!
Secondly, I live in CT and if you don't mind an "OLD" mama joining you for the tri-state tribe gathering, I would love to be included(my "baby" turns 16 on Saturday-where did the time go!).
Thirdly(that word looks/sounds odd in print







), I also have wondered why our tribe did not include more mamas from differing backgrounds. And I know of a lot of Black MDC members who don't post here either.(By the way, I prefer the term Black because I personally know so many Black folks in the USA who are not AA and it cuts down on confusion for me when describing myself or others)
Lastly(again, that just doesn't look/sound right to me!), I have been spending most of my MDC time in the Politics forum lately, neglecting my tribe here and that's not right! So I am going to try really hard to get into the conversation more often. Thanks to all of the members here who make sure that we have a lively, respectful and truly welcoming place for WOC here at MDC!
Well, that's all I have time to post. I hope to come back soon to post more!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
I am on Cloud 9 these days. I had an absolutely incredible homebirth experience after much nay-saying coming from my family.







My little guy had his first bath tonight







and we are breastfeeding 'round the clock...









Xochimama,

Congratulations on the birth of your son! I hope that your baby moon is full of happiness and bliss!









**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
ok, I'm babbling now. All-night nursing is going to my brain...









ok, so i'm gonna need you to not disclaim yourself, after writing such an intelligent and insightful post mmmkay??









i had gloria wade-gayles as a professor in college, and she was constantly exhorting us: "claim your space!" we were black women AT a black women's college, where a big part of our journey and the unwritten curriculum we were there to learn should have been confidence in our voices, right? yet many of us were still struggling with that socialization we get as women, as blacks that being smart and vocal is not cool/feminine/whatever. there would be tentativeness in the raising of hands. dr. wade-gayles was NOT having it. the minute you started talking she would be like, 'claim your space.' and it was amazing, how you could kind of SEE the imperceptible shift in the speaker, as she decided to do just that.

mm mm good. spelman days.

ANYWAY -







and congrats on the little ones who are on their way and just arrived!! whoo hoo!! i wish i was still in brooklyn and dancing, LOL - i've been 'abroad' between LI and AZ since the end of 2001 and am now in MD. and the most dancing im doing these days is yoga on wii fit









have fun at yr meetup, ladies!!


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so i'm gonna need you to not disclaim yourself, after writing such an intelligent and insightful post mmmkay??

point taken, mama


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Thanks, purplegirl!! I am on Cloud 9 these days. I had an absolutely incredible homebirth experience after much nay-saying coming from my family.







My little guy had his first bath tonight







and we are breastfeeding 'round the clock...









The sole distraction was my mother







:- won't get into the gorey details (ok, ONE detail real quick: when I called to tell her we needed her-i was 7cm and in labor, mind you-her response was, "I just sat down to dinner."










Congrats, Mama!!!

Did you post your birth story yet, I would LOVE to read it!

*birth story junkie here*


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Sistas, can I just say I am a tad jealous that ya'll live close enough to get together..l would so love to hook up with some crunchy leaning sistas. Sure none of ya'll don't want to move to Maine







. Heck, even Boston is close enough to get together. LOL

Shay

What you said! Heck I live in STL


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so i'm gonna need you to not disclaim yourself, after writing such an intelligent and insightful post mmmkay??









i had gloria wade-gayles as a professor in college, and she was constantly exhorting us: "claim your space!" we were black women AT a black women's college, where a big part of our journey and the unwritten curriculum we were there to learn should have been confidence in our voices, right? yet many of us were still struggling with that socialization we get as women, as blacks that being smart and vocal is not cool/feminine/whatever. there would be tentativeness in the raising of hands. dr. wade-gayles was NOT having it. the minute you started talking she would be like, 'claim your space.' and it was amazing, how you could kind of SEE the imperceptible shift in the speaker, as she decided to do just that.

mm mm good. spelman days.

ANYWAY -







and congrats on the little ones who are on their way and just arrived!! whoo hoo!! i wish i was still in brooklyn and dancing, LOL - i've been 'abroad' between LI and AZ since the end of 2001 and am now in MD. and the most dancing im doing these days is yoga on wii fit









have fun at yr meetup, ladies!!

hey oyin. did you ever find the right cloth to wrap your lil man? I remember a while ago when we were still prego you mentioned just getting some cloth to use.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i had gloria wade-gayles as a professor in college, and she was constantly exhorting us: "claim your space!" we were black women AT a black women's college, where a big part of our journey and the unwritten curriculum we were there to learn should have been confidence in our voices, right? yet many of us were still struggling with that socialization we get as women, as blacks that being smart and vocal is not cool/feminine/whatever. there would be tentativeness in the raising of hands. dr. wade-gayles was NOT having it. the minute you started talking she would be like, 'claim your space.' and it was amazing, how you could kind of SEE the imperceptible shift in the speaker, as she decided to do just that.
!!

Damn!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay so so far, NY/NJ/Ct WoC tribe members are:

Arike
Bloomingstar
Rootzdawta
WilliamsMama

Did I miss anyone? Soon as I have all the names, I'll try to coordinate via PMs.







Oooh, I'm excited!!









Maybe we can PM you our emails. It might be easier to work that way.
I'm excited about the prospect of meeting y'all!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
I'm in NJ. But, as a warning I'm not a mom yet









You don't have to be a mom yet!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Am I the sole Chicana reading and/or posting here? I know there are more of us around this board because I tried to get a Latina tribe going last year. There was a little flurry of activity at first, but we never really got going. It was great cultural mix, too: Puerto Riqueñas, Chicanas, some South American mamas, Cubanas... so why did the tribe sort of...fade...









And why haven't other Latinas (and other WOC) joined here? Not sure...

Maybe there is some truth to what nnaemeka says about the fading collective identity...?... it is really unfortunate, if so. We need to support eachother as WOC if true progress is going to happen. IMO, this is what mainstream, Anglo, corporate culture has been so good at: effectively dividing communities of color and marginalized peoples such that everyone is scrambling and competing for limited resources. We have GOT to work together to demand progessive social change. We have GOT to organize collectively, yet still clarify and articulate the specific issues that are affecting our particular communities.

I'm also wondering if the "fading collective identity" is a generational thing. Do 20-something WOC still read "Bridge"? I don't know...I myself am fairly out of touch with younger WOC and what their cultural and social norms are. The few (Hispanic) young(er) women I know are fairly apolitical [is that what you mean by "colorblindism", nnaemeka?]. Course, that could be a symptom of where/how they grew up...

ok, I'm babbling now. All-night nursing is going to my brain...









I have been pondering since you posted this mama. I come across many woc on this board and wonder why "they" haven't posted to this tribe. Sometimes I want to reach out and say "hey, did you know that tribe exists?" I think there are fears of joining with other women of color, based on previous negative experiences. I can't tell you how often I've heard WOC say, "I don't get along with other WOC"; "I don't fit in with other WOC". That is painful but I know very real for some folks.
Off to work, more later.........


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Maybe we can PM you our emails. It might be easier to work that way.
I'm excited about the prospect of meeting y'all!









That would work well!!


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I have been pondering since you posted this mama. I come across many woc on this board and wonder why "they" haven't posted to this tribe. Sometimes I want to reach out and say "hey, did you know that tribe exists?" I think there are fears of joining with other women of color, based on previous negative experiences. *I can't tell you how often I've heard WOC say, "I don't get along with other WOC"; "I don't fit in with other WOC". That is painful but I know very real for some folks.*
Off to work, more later.........

That has been my experience almost everywhere BUT here.







I rarely, rarely, rarely find WOC that I click with - I'm pagan, bisexual, hippie as hell, not nationalistic *at all*, and a lot of times I feel like an 'outsider' when it comes to todays 'black' culture - and while I can find those who match my internal culture just fine with non-WOC, then I stand out by virtue of my ever so lovely skin. It's - most interesting - and I've - I really don't think I can express how - soothing this thread is for me. Even if we don't always get (or agree) with each other - there is something - here.

So, yeah, I'm TOTALLY jealous of all ya'll fabulous mama's getting together to meet - anyone in the Deep South?


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Congrats, Mama!!!

Did you post your birth story yet, I would LOVE to read it!

*birth story junkie here*

I did! It's here.

When I first wrote it, I included all the stuff about my mom (she refused to provide the help we needed during labor, then cut her visit short, leaving me & dh on the day our son was born--the day I needed her the most







) But I decided to edit that part out in the public posting because somehow-through willpower and grace, I suppose-I did not let the drama interfere with the labor and birth experience.

Now that the four-day euphoria has passed, I am starting to process my anger and disappointment with my mother. I am protecting the sacred time and space that is between two states-of-being: the intense physical/spiritual experience of giving birth and the return to "normal." (of course, there is never a real return to normal, but the usual pace of life and activity will be upon me before I know it...!)


----------



## I-AM-Mother

i don't do "personal" too well with most people, race doesn't matter.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
I did! It's here.

When I first wrote it, I included all the stuff about my mom (she refused to provide the help we needed during labor, then cut her visit short, leaving me & dh on the day our son was born--the day I needed her the most







) But I decided to edit that part out in the public posting because somehow-through willpower and grace, I suppose-I did not let the drama interfere with the labor and birth experience.

Now that the four-day euphoria has passed, I am starting to process my anger and disappointment with my mother. I am protecting the sacred time and space that is between two states-of-being: the intense physical/spiritual experience of giving birth and the return to "normal." (of course, there is never a real return to normal, but the usual pace of life and activity will be upon me before I know it...!)









i read your story. it was beautiful and you look really well. if i didn't know you had just given birth i would have never known...it's your smile.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
That has been my experience almost everywhere BUT here.







I rarely, rarely, rarely find WOC that I click with - I'm pagan, bisexual, hippie as hell, not nationalistic *at all*, and a lot of times I feel like an 'outsider' when it comes to todays 'black' culture - and while I can find those who match my internal culture just fine with non-WOC, then I stand out by virtue of my ever so lovely skin. It's - most interesting - and I've - I really don't think I can express how - soothing this thread is for me. Even if we don't always get (or agree) with each other - there is something - here.

I feel the same way, except that when I find people who understand other aspects of myself, they tend to overlook my natural curls and the decidedly mixed color of my hair, and just assume that I'm white... and that I therefore don't have to deal with any of the issues that "those people" have to deal with (e.g. institutionalized racism).







: I've actually had people in relatively recent times ask why I don't just pass, or why I point out to them that I am not, in fact, white.







: Grrrr...

Ah, the plight of the beautiful but tragic mulatta.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
That has been my experience almost everywhere BUT here.







I rarely, rarely, rarely find WOC that I click with - I'm pagan, bisexual, hippie as hell, not nationalistic *at all*, and a lot of times I feel like an 'outsider' when it comes to todays 'black' culture - and while I can find those who match my internal culture just fine with non-WOC, then I stand out by virtue of my ever so lovely skin. It's - most interesting - and I've - I really don't think I can express how - soothing this thread is for me. Even if we don't always get (or agree) with each other - there is something - here.

So, yeah, I'm TOTALLY jealous of all ya'll fabulous mama's getting together to meet - anyone in the Deep South?









You sound just like me aside from the bisexual, pagan part! Although I have to admit, I sure did love the pagan camp that was hosted on MDC this summer. Maybe I am an undercover pagan and just don't know it yet!


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Maybe I am an undercover pagan and just don't know it yet!









hmmm...it's funny you should mention that. i've taken two different tests at two different times in my life and both results came back and the results were i was about 80-90% pagan/witch.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
hmmm...it's funny you should mention that. i've taken two different tests at two different times in my life and both results came back and the results were i was about 80-90% pagan/witch.

You should check out the pagan camp that was hosted here this summer. It was so cool. Wasn't it Rynna








When I get home, I'll post the links here but if you'd are interested, they are still in the spirituality forum


----------



## Bloomingstar

xochimama I just read your birth story and it is soo beautiful! congratulations!







:


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
I did! It's here.

When I first wrote it, I included all the stuff about my mom (she refused to provide the help we needed during labor, then cut her visit short, leaving me & dh on the day our son was born--the day I needed her the most







) But I decided to edit that part out in the public posting because somehow-through willpower and grace, I suppose-I did not let the drama interfere with the labor and birth experience.

Now that the four-day euphoria has passed, I am starting to process my anger and disappointment with my mother. I am protecting the sacred time and space that is between two states-of-being: the intense physical/spiritual experience of giving birth and the return to "normal." (of course, there is never a real return to normal, but the usual pace of life and activity will be upon me before I know it...!)









Awww!!!! What a beautiful birth story and what a adorable new son you have!! Your story is very touching and I can feel the love and sheer excitement and blissfulness of it all. I can only hope I get half that experience one day! Congrats again!!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
You should check out the pagan camp that was hosted here this summer. It was so cool. Wasn't it Rynna








When I get home, I'll post the links here but if you'd are interested, they are still in the spirituality forum









It was.









I think that there are a lot more Quakers and Chaos Mages out there than are currently aware of it.







Quaker Pagans happen a fair bit... and I'll be honest here and say that for a long time, I've had the distinct impression that Unitarian Universalism was for Pagans who wanted to be able to tell people that they go to church.







:


----------



## xochimama

nak

thanks, comadres, for all the love!


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
You sound just like me aside from the bisexual, pagan part! Although I have to admit, I sure did love the pagan camp that was hosted on MDC this summer. Maybe I am an undercover pagan and just don't know it yet!









*perks up* Pagan camp? I think that a lot of people are undercover pagans - it's - surprisingly easy to fall into, esp. if you're a hippie.

*sigh* That's one area in my life where I've ALMOST become used to being the raisin in the cream of wheat.







If I could ever find a strong, *drama-free*, not flufflybunny collective of black pagans (esp. in the South), I think I might cry.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
You should check out the pagan camp that was hosted here this summer. It was so cool. Wasn't it Rynna








When I get home, I'll post the links here but if you'd are interested, they are still in the spirituality forum









Oooooohhhh! *looks at clock* Might have found something to eat up my last hours at work! *sigh* Soulsucking in exchange for money is a dreadful thing. I was rather through with MDC for a while







: so I hadn't been forum surfing like I usually do.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
It was.









I think that there are a lot more Quakers and Chaos Mages out there than are currently aware of it.







Quaker Pagans happen a fair bit... and I'll be honest here and say that for a long time, *I've had the distinct impression that Unitarian Universalism was for Pagans who wanted to be able to tell people that they go to church.*







:









I totally agree with you there!!! UU's are the most Gnosticly Pagan Christians I've ever encountered - if DH ever does get esp. squirrely about our LO's going to church, that'll be where we take them.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I have been pondering since you posted this mama. I come across many woc on this board and wonder why "they" haven't posted to this tribe. Sometimes I want to reach out and say "hey, did you know that tribe exists?" I think there are fears of joining with other women of color, based on previous negative experiences. I can't tell you how often I've heard WOC say, "I don't get along with other WOC"; "I don't fit in with other WOC". That is painful but I know very real for some folks.
Off to work, more later.........

*sob*

this is as painful for me to hear as it is to hear women say, 'i don't have any female friends. i just don't get along with women.'

i too, understand how it can happen - growing up painfully 'other' and not making most of the friends i continue to love until i went away to college - but every time i hear it, it friggin' breaks my friggin' heart.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
hey oyin. did you ever find the right cloth to wrap your lil man? I remember a while ago when we were still prego you mentioned just getting some cloth to use.

yes indeed i did. my mom came for a while right after DS was born... she showed me how to tie a lappa so that it serves as a simple sling. (2 or 2.5 yards of printed cotton; tie opposite corners into a big knot. the size of this knot you will determine via practice, based on where you want yr babe to sit. this will give you a vaguely triangular garment, you slip the knot over your head and behind one shoulder, and then sit your baby in the pocket. adjust, adjust, and then once it fits, never untie it again. unless you have to wear it as a skirt, LOL. voila!

i also got 5 yards of semi-stretchy knit fabric from jo-anns, cut it in half to abt 24 inches, and use it to tie those front-cross carries suggested on the mobywrap-style sites. detailed instructions are at www.mamatoto.com ... i gave the other half to a friend - two wraps for $15! from there i also got the idea to cut the top off a small, pre-preggo t-shirt - right under the arms - and use the resulting band of fabric as a cross-body sling. it's great to stash inside my tiny changing wallet when i'm doing errands or something, in case i want to just pop inside somewhere and need an extra hand around DS's butt.


----------



## oyinmama

uhm. potential dumb question alert, borne of not having enough time to surf properly at the moment. was the pagan camp an actual retreat? or an online virtual-forum thingie?


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
uhm. potential dumb question alert, borne of not having enough time to surf properly at the moment. was the pagan camp an actual retreat? or an online virtual-forum thingie?

It looks like it was an online virtual forum thingie.....


----------



## purplegirl

This was hot







:
Pagan camp


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so i'm gonna need you to not disclaim yourself, after writing such an intelligent and insightful post mmmkay??









i had gloria wade-gayles as a professor in college, and she was constantly exhorting us: "claim your space!" we were black women AT a black women's college, where a big part of our journey and the unwritten curriculum we were there to learn should have been confidence in our voices, right? yet many of us were still struggling with that socialization we get as women, as blacks that being smart and vocal is not cool/feminine/whatever. there would be tentativeness in the raising of hands. dr. wade-gayles was NOT having it. the minute you started talking she would be like, 'claim your space.' and it was amazing, how you could kind of SEE the imperceptible shift in the speaker, as she decided to do just that.

mm mm good. spelman days.


word up to that!


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
I did! It's here.


oh. my. goodness.

what an amazing birthstory!! you must feel like a superhero!!!!









how wonderful that you were able to have such an empowered and empowering experience even with your mother's input not being what you needed at the time... if you want to unpack your feelings here about your mother's role in your birthing, feel free. there's so much loooOOoOOoove in this thread!


----------



## I-AM-Mother

taking a shower outside is always an option. i normally take them once my hub. gets home from work, and that happens to be right before the sun sets.


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
if you want to unpack your feelings here about your mother's role in your birthing, feel free. there's so much loooOOoOOoove in this thread!

oh mama, no sabes...you don't know what you're getting into...









yea, i'll unpack here soon. right now it's going into my journal. It's gonna be messy messy messy. I'm afraid that once I start, the poisoned pus will just keep oozing out...


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
oh mama, no sabes...you don't know what you're getting into...









yea, i'll unpack here soon. right now it's going into my journal. It's gonna be messy messy messy. I'm afraid that once I start, the poisoned pus will just keep oozing out...









i have always admired a woman who knew how to keep her poison to herself until she finishes processing everything. that is a rare quality.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
oh mama, no sabes...you don't know what you're getting into...









yea, i'll unpack here soon. right now it's going into my journal. It's gonna be messy messy messy. I'm afraid that once I start, the poisoned pus will just keep oozing out...









Sister, we got your back.








I also loved your birth story. You and your babe are just adorable!


----------



## ishereal

Has anyone read this it is a little alarming and I would not expect that from Alice Walker eh ......


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
yes indeed i did. my mom came for a while right after DS was born... she showed me how to tie a lappa so that it serves as a simple sling. (2 or 2.5 yards of printed cotton; tie opposite corners into a big knot. the size of this knot you will determine via practice, based on where you want yr babe to sit. this will give you a vaguely triangular garment, you slip the knot over your head and behind one shoulder, and then sit your baby in the pocket. adjust, adjust, and then once it fits, never untie it again. unless you have to wear it as a skirt, LOL. voila!

i also got 5 yards of semi-stretchy knit fabric from jo-anns, cut it in half to abt 24 inches, and use it to tie those front-cross carries suggested on the mobywrap-style sites. detailed instructions are at www.mamatoto.com ... i gave the other half to a friend - two wraps for $15! from there i also got the idea to cut the top off a small, pre-preggo t-shirt - right under the arms - and use the resulting band of fabric as a cross-body sling. it's great to stash inside my tiny changing wallet when i'm doing errands or something, in case i want to just pop inside somewhere and need an extra hand around DS's butt.









Hey Oyin, the link didn't work for me.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Has anyone read this it is a little alarming and I would not expect that from Alice Walker eh ......

Grain of salt--the Daily Mail in the UK is the print equivalent of FoxNews--tries too hard to be provocative and in the process loses a lot of facts and basic journalistic integrity.

That said, just from reading Baby Love by Rebecca Walker, it sounds like she had a rough time of it with her moms during the pregnancy and after. And you know, for what it is worth, sometimes people just have a lot of *stuff* between them that we just won't get to know, no matter how wonderful their public persona or the gifts they bring to the rest of the world are.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Has anyone read this it is a little alarming and I would not expect that from Alice Walker eh ......


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Grain of salt--the Daily Mail in the UK is the print equivalent of FoxNews--tries too hard to be provocative and in the process loses a lot of facts and basic journalistic integrity.

That said, just from reading Baby Love by Rebecca Walker, it sounds like she had a rough time of it with her moms during the pregnancy and after. And you know, for what it is worth, sometimes people just have a lot of *stuff* between them that we just won't get to know, no matter how wonderful their public persona or the gifts they bring to the rest of the world are.

*nod* Exactly. The fact is that there was/is an ugly rift between mother and daughter. What had to have gone on to push them both to such a place - *shudder* - I don't even want to know.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
*nod* Exactly. The fact is that there was/is an ugly rift between mother and daughter. What had to have gone on to push them both to such a place - *shudder* - I don't even want to know.

When a parent is a public figure, I think, it's very difficult on a child. Something is always lost. There's a always a feeling that you've been neglected or robbed of a parent. But as a parent, you can only do the best you can do while trying to play your public role. You can only hope the child understands. I totally understand the bitterness. On both ends.


----------



## purplegirl

Posting on the run..... but Rebbecca often writes on the travails of her relationship with her mom. Definitely check out _Baby Love_ or her daily journal on Roots.com.
More tomorrow.
Peace


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey Oyin, the link didn't work for me.

nak

sorry abt that - it's mamatoto.org


----------



## Bloomingstar

great site! I'll be haunting the fabric shops soon


----------



## Sugarshoc

Oyin,

Do you have a picture of the lappa/sling? I'm having trouble visualizing. I have tons of lappas at here and I want to try that.


----------



## rootzdawta

Here's a picture of me carrying my first son. The way I do it is the way it's done in most parts of West Africa. It's slightly different than what Oyinmama was describing in that instead of knotting the fabric, you tuck it.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Here's a picture of me carrying my first son. The way I do it is the way it's done in most parts of West Africa. It's slightly different than what Oyinmama was describing in that instead of knotting the fabric, you tuck it.

Awww you and the baby look so cute! I love the traditional, West African way of carrying but living in NYC, I just will feel more comfortable with the baby to the side or front. Especially on the subway.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
*Awww you and the baby look so cute! I love the traditional, West African* way of carrying but living in NYC, I just will feel more comfortable with the baby to the side or front. Especially on the subway.


Yeah that! So, so beautiful.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Here's a picture of me carrying my first son. The way I do it is the way it's done in most parts of West Africa. It's slightly different than what Oyinmama was describing in that instead of knotting the fabric, you tuck it.

Please teach me how to do it!!!!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Awww you and the baby look so cute! I love the traditional, West African way of carrying but living in NYC, I just will feel more comfortable with the baby to the side or front. Especially on the subway.









:


----------



## Sugarshoc

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Here's a picture of me carrying my first son. The way I do it is the way it's done in most parts of West Africa. It's slightly different than what Oyinmama was describing in that instead of knotting the fabric, you tuck it.

Beautiful!!!! I need to know how to do that.







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Thanks guys!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Awww you and the baby look so cute! I love the traditional, West African way of carrying but living in NYC, I just will feel more comfortable with the baby to the side or front. Especially on the subway.

I preferred the Moby wrap or the sling when I used to take the subway too. But then I only had one baby. Now that I have two, the back carry is much easier on the train because I have to get the stroller 9for the oldest) up and down stairs. I just usually stand by the door while holding my oldest's hand or the stroller so no one's behind me.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Thanks guys!!

I preferred the Moby wrap or the sling when I used to take the subway too. But then I only had one baby. Now that I have two, the back carry is much easier on the train because I have to get the stroller 9for the oldest) up and down stairs. I just usually stand by the door while holding my oldest's hand or the stroller so no one's behind me.

Do you feel like other subway riders were accommodating to you on the train? I.E. respecting your personal space and that of your little ones? I know that just being pregnant on the train, I get paranoid during rush hour because people just kind of shove, push and stuff themselves into the train. I usually take the A train, which lately has been okay since I now I have the unmistakable bump. But one time I was on the 4 train at evening rush hour and it was one of those heat wave days... I really thought I was going to fall out! The AC was barely on and there were so many people stuffed into that subway car. And of course people weren't trying to give up there seat for little old me. Serious eye aversion!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Don't get me started on the people on the train! I take the A train as well, and it's really hit or miss. I almost feel like the bigger I've gotten, the LESS accommodating people have gotten. In the beginning, older black women were the only ones who were giving me a seat. Every now and then a man will give up a seat, but a lot of times I end up standing up on my ride to work. And sometimes I even get dirty looks! I don't know if people think I am a teen mom (in which case, their behavior is EXTRA wrong as far as I am concerned--how rude to judge!) because I look younger than I am (I'll be 28 next month and every now and then get stopped by the cops for being truant from high school...) or what, but it's so rude! The eye aversion is not as bad as the people who give you dirty looks for getting a seat before them. there was one lady who took the one seat that was available, and I huffed and rolled my eyes at her. Someone else got up to give me a seat--the first lady took out a bible and then rolled her eyes at me before she began reading--I laughed in her face! People on the train can just be THE WORST!

But no, some of them are very nice, and sometimes I just let the trains go by in rush hour because I can't be getting pushed and shoved and crowded like that anymore. And people already feel like they can violate my space and take up parts of my seat anyway since I am small, pregnant or not.







:

(looks like somebody needed to vent














:


----------



## rootzdawta

Oh, Ladies, don't get me started about taking the train. The biggest pro to babywearing is that people will respect your space a little more and not touch the baby. They will also not give you as many stank looks for staying close to the door so that you don't have to fight your way out of a crowded train.

But when I was pregnant, I sometimes would prefer getting on the 101 Bus or the 6 train than dealing with the 4 or the 5 during rush hour. People were so rough. People just push and shove you out the way. One day someone jabbed me in the belly. Hard. And just looked at me like, What? Another day I had to get ornery on the train. It was hot and I was dizzy as hell. Can somebody please get up so I can sit my 9 month pregnant azz down. Good gracious.


----------



## oyinmama

(((hugs))) to the straphangers!! i remember how ENRAGED i used to get, watching full grown men sit there, legs wide, while pregnant women were standing. bellies right in their face. yuck. overcrowding can really bring out the jerk in some people.

i do love the back carry - so beautifully illustrated by rootsdawta - but have yet to get up the nerve to carry DS like that. i feel like i have to see him! and what if he slips!







no matter people have carried their babies like that for a thousand years. MY klutzy behind will be the one who drops him out on his little head









i was gonna do a blog post with the how-to for the triangle tie carry with the lappa, but i think that extra step is sligtly beyond my capacity today. here's the 'photo essay' version









http://gallery.me.com/exittheapple#100076


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Don't get me started on the people on the train! I take the A train as well, and it's really hit or miss. I almost feel like the bigger I've gotten, the LESS accommodating people have gotten. In the beginning, older black women were the only ones who were giving me a seat. Every now and then a man will give up a seat, but a lot of times I end up standing up on my ride to work. And sometimes I even get dirty looks! I don't know if people think I am a teen mom (in which case, their behavior is EXTRA wrong as far as I am concerned--how rude to judge!) because I look younger than I am (I'll be 28 next month and every now and then get stopped by the cops for being truant from high school...) or what, but it's so rude! The eye aversion is not as bad as the people who give you dirty looks for getting a seat before them. there was one lady who took the one seat that was available, and I huffed and rolled my eyes at her. Someone else got up to give me a seat--the first lady took out a bible and then rolled her eyes at me before she began reading--I laughed in her face! People on the train can just be THE WORST!

But no, some of them are very nice, and sometimes I just let the trains go by in rush hour because I can't be getting pushed and shoved and crowded like that anymore. And people already feel like they can violate my space and take up parts of my seat anyway since I am small, pregnant or not.







:

(looks like somebody needed to vent














:









:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh, Ladies, don't get me started about taking the train. The biggest pro to babywearing is that people will respect your space a little more and not touch the baby. They will also not give you as many stank looks for staying close to the door so that you don't have to fight your way out of a crowded train.

But when I was pregnant, I sometimes would prefer getting on the 101 Bus or the 6 train than dealing with the 4 or the 5 during rush hour. People were so rough. People just push and shove you out the way. One day someone jabbed me in the belly. Hard. And just looked at me like, What? Another day I had to get ornery on the train. It was hot and I was dizzy as hell. Can somebody please get up so I can sit my 9 month pregnant azz down. Good gracious.











I actually leave work about 15 minutes before 5pm to beat that big evening rush home. The A train is usually a lot emptier around 5pm than at like 5:10pm believe it or not. Lately women(mostly of color) have been happily giving up their seat for me. I've been thrilled!







I think I have only had a few men give up their seats for me. People have been really nice on the bus too lately. I've been pleasantly surprised! My friend observed that when she was pregnant, no one would give up their subway seat for her. But now that she has the baby, people are so helpful and volunteer to assist her with the stroller up and down stairs. I think that's kind of strange...









Yeah I think I have caught a few dirty looks from people when I get a seat. I am kind of like "Um....I am very pregnant, why are you hating?"


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
(((hugs))) to the straphangers!! i remember how ENRAGED i used to get, watching full grown men sit there, legs wide, while pregnant women were standing. bellies right in their face. yuck. overcrowding can really bring out the jerk in some people.

i do love the back carry - so beautifully illustrated by rootsdawta - but have yet to get up the nerve to carry DS like that. i feel like i have to see him! and what if he slips!







no matter people have carried their babies like that for a thousand years. MY klutzy behind will be the one who drops him out on his little head









i was gonna do a blog post with the how-to for the triangle tie carry with the lappa, but i think that extra step is sligtly beyond my capacity today. here's the 'photo essay' version









http://gallery.me.com/exittheapple#100076

Okay so I am about to bring back the carrier my friend bought me for a store credit! The photo essay totally cleared up the concept of the triangle tie carry! I am so excited to try this with my little baby when he makes his appearance next month!
Oh and BTW, you and your LO look so adorable!


----------



## oyinmama

aww thanks, arike! glad it was helpful.









for the triangle, it's most comfortable w/the knot in the small of your back rather than digging into your shoulder; and you can make it hang lower or higher depending on how much of a 'tail' you give the knot.

try it a bit before you bring back the carrier - i find different carriers useful for different occasions. it's helpful to have the loooong stretchy fabric for a front cross if baby is in a sleepy mood or i'm going out in public and want to shield him. i use our shower-gift chicco soft carrier or baby bjorn for if i have a lot of work to do with my hands; housework/laundry/mixtressing.

soon i'll get over my back-carry mental block and add that to the repertoire!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Oh and BTW, you and your LO look so adorable!









Yeah, that!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
(((hugs))) to the straphangers!! i remember how ENRAGED i used to get, watching full grown men sit there, legs wide, while pregnant women were standing. bellies right in their face. yuck. overcrowding can really bring out the jerk in some people.

i do love the back carry - so beautifully illustrated by rootsdawta - but have yet to get up the nerve to carry DS like that. i feel like i have to see him! and what if he slips!







no matter people have carried their babies like that for a thousand years. MY klutzy behind will be the one who drops him out on his little head









i was gonna do a blog post with the how-to for the triangle tie carry with the lappa, but i think that extra step is sligtly beyond my capacity today. here's the 'photo essay' version









http://gallery.me.com/exittheapple#100076

The *adorableness* is just too much


----------



## Brown Lioness

OMG, i shouldnt have come in here today (my baby lust is high, aunt flo is coming and i had a dream about babies last night), look at all the beautiful cocoa babies!!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
OMG, i shouldnt have come in here today (my baby lust is high, aunt flo is coming and i had a dream about babies last night), look at all the beautiful cocoa babies!!!!

I'm right there with you mama


----------



## AndrewsMother

I love baby wearing pics, does anyone else have pictures to share?

Rootzdawta and Oyinmama I love your cloth carries, I never had the courage to try them whem DS was young.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Here's a picture of me carrying my first son. The way I do it is the way it's done in most parts of West Africa. It's slightly different than what Oyinmama was describing in that instead of knotting the fabric, you tuck it.

Beautiful picture!
My mother used to carry DS that way, but only using a scarf!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Awww you and the baby look so cute! I love the traditional, West African way of carrying but living in NYC, I just will feel more comfortable with the baby to the side or front. Especially on the subway.

Me, too.
I still front or side carry DS (who is over 30lbs- yeah- my aching back!) whenever I get on the subway. I'm nervous about back carrying him on the subway because I can't see him and I hate hate hate the stroller on the subway. I'm going to start back carrying him, though.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Do you feel like other subway riders were accommodating to you on the train? I.E. respecting your personal space and that of your little ones? I know that just being pregnant on the train, I get paranoid during rush hour because people just kind of shove, push and stuff themselves into the train. I usually take the A train, which lately has been okay since I now I have the unmistakable bump. But one time I was on the 4 train at evening rush hour and it was one of those heat wave days... I really thought I was going to fall out! The AC was barely on and there were so many people stuffed into that subway car. And of course people weren't trying to give up there seat for little old me. Serious eye aversion!









I used to take the 3 train to Lenox Station every day (I worked on 148th and Adam Clayton Powell) when I was pregnant, and luckily I always got a seat going and coming back.
The L train is a different story. People went out of their way to avoid eye contact with my huge 9 month bump as I hobbled on the train. The only people to give up seats were some young women and black men around my age. God forbid some hipster give up his or her seat. I swear I could hear folks turning up their Ipods!
Other than that, I was the invisible woman. I stopped taking the L (it was a transfer) and switched to the bus because of that in my last trimester. for some reason, people are much more accomodating on the bus.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh, Ladies, don't get me started about taking the train. The biggest pro to babywearing is that people will respect your space a little more and not touch the baby. They will also not give you as many stank looks for staying close to the door so that you don't have to fight your way out of a crowded train.

But when I was pregnant, I sometimes would prefer getting on the 101 Bus or the 6 train than dealing with the 4 or the 5 during rush hour. People were so rough. People just push and shove you out the way. One day someone jabbed me in the belly. Hard. And just looked at me like, What? Another day I had to get ornery on the train. It was hot and I was dizzy as hell. Can somebody please get up so I can sit my 9 month pregnant azz down. Good gracious.










Sometimes you just have to get raw on folks for them to get the message.
I LOATHE the 6 train. Not only are people just rude and nasty on that train, but it just jerks and speeds like crazy. Totally dangerous for a pregnant mama.
When I was getting big, my coworker, a 6'7" gay man, would yell out on crowded trains, "How disgusting! No one has a seat for a pregnant woman???"


----------



## I-AM-Mother

gosh, my youngest is 2 1/2 and all of my photos (baby wearing) are long gone and have been replaced with more current ones.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I'm right there with you mama

















thanks







:


----------



## eilonwy

I have some random pictues of me with slings, I think. Very random.









I need to learn the back carry for Bear, though, because he's too tall for me to carry in front! I can't have him high enough without his head blocking my view, and if I wear him lower I ache horribly. I resent carrying him, it's awful.







: I've never had such a tall infant before. My next-largest baby was BeanBean, and Bear's about 4" taller than he was at seven months.









That said, all the adorable babies inspire nothing remotely like newborn lust in me. I'm very, very done. Overdone, perhaps.







:


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Hey, I didn't even realize there was a thread like this going on still.

Just subbing, I'll be back later to chit chat.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
That said, all the adorable babies inspire nothing remotely like newborn lust in me. I'm very, very done. Overdone, perhaps.







:

That makes 2 of us. My first baby is only a mere 17 mos from being a legal adult and dd is in her um interesting 3's which is driving me mad. Everything is a frickin negotiation







:. I have moments where I really want to yell "Do it because I said so, dang it."

I love looking at the new lil babies but no more for the kid.

Shay


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
That makes 2 of us. My first baby is only a mere 17 mos from being a legal adult and dd is in her um interesting 3's which is driving me mad. Everything is a frickin negotiation







:. I have moments where I really want to yell "Do it because I said so, dang it."

I love looking at the new lil babies but no more for the kid.

Shay

that makes three of us.


----------



## ~gilli~

What a great sling! I don't sew, and now I don't have to!!!







:


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
What a great sling! I don't sew, and now I don't have to!!!







:

That's what I love about wraps.


----------



## AndrewsMother

These are my three favorite baby wearing pictures. I meant to post these earlier, but Ike has me distracted.
Please excuse the unattractive but character filled tiny apartment that was our first home. I am some what ashamed of the vacumn in the background.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870025.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870024.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...080606-2-1.jpg


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
These are my three favorite baby wearing pictures. I meant to post these earlier, but Ike has me distracted.
Please excuse the unattractive but character filled tiny apartment that was our first home. I am some what ashamed of the vacumn in the background.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870025.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870024.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...080606-2-1.jpg

Great pictures and don't you dare excuse your home! If you could see mine now......


----------



## Sugarshoc

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
(((hugs))) to the straphangers!! i remember how ENRAGED i used to get, watching full grown men sit there, legs wide, while pregnant women were standing. bellies right in their face. yuck. overcrowding can really bring out the jerk in some people.

i do love the back carry - so beautifully illustrated by rootsdawta - but have yet to get up the nerve to carry DS like that. i feel like i have to see him! and what if he slips!







no matter people have carried their babies like that for a thousand years. MY klutzy behind will be the one who drops him out on his little head









i was gonna do a blog post with the how-to for the triangle tie carry with the lappa, but i think that extra step is sligtly beyond my capacity today. here's the 'photo essay' version









http://gallery.me.com/exittheapple#100076

Ms. Oy I thank you!! So easy. I'm going to do that most def. You two are beautiful.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
These are my three favorite baby wearing pictures. I meant to post these earlier, but Ike has me distracted.
Please excuse the unattractive but character filled tiny apartment that was our first home. I am some what ashamed of the vacumn in the background.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870025.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870024.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...080606-2-1.jpg


My first thought was, "She has my booty!!"







:

The second was, "Why be ashamed of a vacuum? At least she has one and the fact that it's out and the floor is clean suggests that she uses it, too."

The third was, "If that apartment's an embarassment, I can't imagine what she'd think of mine."














:

Adorable pictures.


----------



## purplegirl

Yall have to read this story on my dear great auntie.
http://www.aikenstandard.com/0914Passport


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:

Stephens worked in the public school system for nearly 40 years, owned her own business, voted, owned property and was married in the state, and somehow at 98 years of age, her birth records and citizenship were still coming under question.








That's just insane. Good for her.









My brother was issued a temporary PA driver's license a couple of weeks ago, because he looks like a terrorist. This in spite of the fact that he had expired/invalid licenses from *four states* (including PA!), a valid passport, and a valid, active duty U.S. military ID!







: Yeah. My brother sets off alarms because of his skin color and hair texture.







The sad part is that the first time it happened (when he got his first passport) was before September 11. Things have only gotten worse since then.








Yay Patriot Act.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
These are my three favorite baby wearing pictures. I meant to post these earlier, but Ike has me distracted.
Please excuse the unattractive but character filled tiny apartment that was our first home. I am some what ashamed of the vacumn in the background.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870025.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...w/92870024.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...080606-2-1.jpg

How did you like the Ergo? I had one and sold it. It was not comfortable at all for me. My breasts are pretty large (hope they go down to a normal size after nursing) and I just couldn't adjust the straps in a way that was comfy. Not mention that the way the straps buckled drew attention to "the ladies". What a disappointment! I went on to make a mei tei--that was actually my 2nd sewing project.

The pics look great, btw!!


----------



## rootzdawta

All Tri-State WoC!!!

Would you all please PM your e-mail addresses so that I can try to coordinate a meet-up? I am thinking maybe next week Friday, Sept. 26. We can work out the time and the activity/location via e-mail so as not to clutter our beloved thread. Sorry it's taken me so long to get it together.


----------



## Sugarshoc

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Yall have to read this story on my dear great auntie.
http://www.aikenstandard.com/0914Passport

That is the coolest story ever!!!! I can't wait to hear about her travels.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sugarshoc* 
That is the coolest story ever!!!! I can't wait to hear about her travels.

That woman is fierce! She has so much vigor in her that it doesn't surprise me she ended up getting that passport!


----------



## Sugarshoc

Rootz,

I tried the wrap on my DD with her on my back, African style. She didn't like it. I tried it on Saturday, Sunday and again this morning. This morning she calmed down some and went to sleep for like 15 minutes before she woke up and started crying to get out. I'm going to try again later or tomorrow. I figure if I keep doing a little everyday, she'll get used to it. I normally front carry her in a Babyhawk. She's only 7 weeks old. Do you think it'll change as she gets older or if I keep wearing a little everyday on my back?


----------



## I-AM-Mother

she has a beautiful smile and strong hands. i pray the gods see fit for me to live as long as she has. she's seen a lot, has some great stories too.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sugarshoc* 
She's only 7 weeks old. Do you think it'll change as she gets older or if I keep wearing a little everyday on my back?

Yeah, Sugarshoc, she's still a bit young. You want the baby to have really good neck control, like say around 14-16 weeks. She should like it much better then.


----------



## ~gilli~

What a great story Purplegirl! She reminds me of the women in my family. My mother is the granddaughter of former slaves.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yeah, Sugarshoc, she's still a bit young. You want the baby to have really good neck control, like say around 14-16 weeks. She should like it much better then.









my LO is a week shy of 5 months and i tried him like this yesterday.







: thanks for the inspiration rootzdawta. he did NOT fall out, and he seemed to be having a fine time during the time i spent in the mirror, making sure he wasn't falling out.







-- he was just looking up at the back of my head, and looking all around.

then he started sucking on my shoulderblades and i decided it was time to take him out and feed him.









i used too much cloth during my initial test - a 3yd piece instead of a lappa-sized piece. i'll try again when he gets up from his nap. yay!


----------



## oyinmama

OMG - purplegirl that story about your auntie made me smile sooooo big!! a 4-day passport turnaround... that is no joke







i hope she has an amazing trip. ((hugs))


----------



## Bloomingstar

what a great story!







: I'm glad she'll get to travel.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Awww, i love that story about your auntie, purplegirl!!! Im so glad she gets to go to Jamaica now!

My grandmother has no birth certificate either (she was born in South Carolina too). We dont know how old she is and she's never told (heck SHE might not know, lol), but we figure she's in her late 70's like my grandfather (they still married







).

I do have an older auntie named Ethel that is from and lives in South Carolina and she's in her mid 90's and she has no birth certificate either. But she dont care, all she wanna do is watch some "wrassling on tv", lolol.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Awww, i love that story about your auntie, purplegirl!!! Im so glad she gets to go to Jamaica now!

My grandmother has no birth certificate either (she was born in South Carolina too). We dont know how old she is and she's never told (heck SHE might not know, lol), but we figure she's in her late 70's like my grandfather (they still married







).

I do have an older auntie named Ethel that is from and lives in South Carolina and she's in her mid 90's and she has no birth certificate either. *But she dont care, all she wanna do is watch some "wrassling on tv", lolol*.


I ain't mad at her


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
dd is in her um interesting 3's which is driving me mad. *Everything is a frickin negotiation*







:. I have moments where I really want to yell "Do it because I said so, dang it."

OMG, This is us EXACTLY!!







I SWEAR my DD1 will either be a lawyer or an actress. She sure does have a flair for the dramatic







...


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I went on to make a mei tei--that was actually my 2nd sewing project.

I'm thinking about doing this. Do you have a pattern suggestion?

I wore DD1 in a Maya Wrap all. the. time. starting around 4 months. Before that, it just didn't work so well-- I'm thinking a mei tei would be better...

Once she hit around 20lbs. (18mo.ish) it became more difficult to carry her on one shoulder, which is when we switched to the Ergo, which worked pretty well for us, in spite of the dreaded uniboob...


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
That makes 2 of us. My first baby is only a mere 17 mos from being a legal adult and dd is in her um interesting 3's which is driving me mad. *Everything is a frickin negotiation







:*. I have moments where I really want to yell "Do it because I said so, dang it."

I love looking at the new lil babies but no more for the kid.

Shay

Jordan is almost 4 and still in that phase. It's about everything. What plate to use. What cup to use. Where to set his plate. How to turn the TV off (finger, toe, or remote)







at 36 weeks pregnant... the cuteness is definitely wearing off.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
I'm thinking about doing this. Do you have a pattern suggestion?

This is the one I used and it came out very well.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Great pictures and don't you dare excuse your home! If you could see mine now......










Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
My first thought was, "She has my booty!!"







:

The second was, "Why be ashamed of a vacuum? At least she has one and the fact that it's out and the floor is clean suggests that she uses it, too."

The third was, "If that apartment's an embarassment, I can't imagine what she'd think of mine."














:

Adorable pictures.









I was somewhat embarressed by the interior of my home. The outside was awesome. It was a victorian home divided into 4 apartments in a WONDERFUL part of town. I love older homes and communities. The apartment though left much to be desired. Now that we have moved out we miss our home dearly. Character a plenty and lots of windows that faced all four directions. If I win the lottery (no I do not play....yet) I am going to buy the house and make it my summer home.

Talk about missing my well.

Eilonwy, you have my booty? So what do you think about it? The rest of my lottery winnings are going to liposuction. My butt will have my in therapy one day!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
How did you like the Ergo? I had one and sold it. It was not comfortable at all for me. My breasts are pretty large (hope they go down to a normal size after nursing) and I just couldn't adjust the straps in a way that was comfy. Not mention that the way the straps buckled drew attention to "the ladies". What a disappointment! I went on to make a mei tei--that was actually my 2nd sewing project.

The pics look great, btw!!

I am a 34G and I love my Ergo. I also like my large breast, or maybe I like the way that my bra enhances them. LOL. My mover 30 lb son and I use it when the days are not too warm and he enjoys being carried. How old is yoru child. I did look wierd when I as a JJ cup, but I did not care. The Ergo was a God send for me. I liked the mei tei, but once I found the Ergo I was not wanting to purchase anythign else.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Jordan is almost 4 and still in that phase. It's about everything. What plate to use. What cup to use. Where to set his plate. How to turn the TV off (finger, toe, or remote)







at 36 weeks pregnant... the cuteness is definitely wearing off.


I slipped abd said because I said so yesterday. When does this phase end. I can't imagine 2 more years of this madness.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 

I slipped abd said because I said so yesterday. When does this phase end. I can't imagine 2 more years of this madness.

Girl, don't even feel bad. I have had a few moments when I did the same thing.







Sometimes this girl o-mine vexes me to no end especially when I am on my cycle







:. The past week has just been drama, though I realized I think she reacts badly to certain foods with red dye and stuff like that. Remember my eldest is almost 17 so back in the day, there was not so much info about kids eating junk and acting crazy, plus my son was just mellow.

Well I have been saying for months to dh that everytime dd gets a taste of junk she gets crazy, well dh finally realized it was not in my mind so we just tossed out her cereal, the goldfish, the freezepops (dang and I am mod here letting my kid eat this stuff







). We are back to only fruits/veggies and maybe once a week she can have a gummy worm (her new fav, havibg had her first true candy a few weeks ago). It seems to be helping but baby girl has a little cold so she is extra cranky.

Right now she gets mad and starts stomping all over the house like a little stompinator yelling leave me alone, generally I will but she keeps going half way up the stairs and yelling. Oy vey... she is a character







. Mostly its good but some days, not so good. I am starting to think 3 is way worse than 2.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Girl, don't even feel bad. I have had a few moments when I did the same thing.







Sometimes this girl o-mine vexes me to no end especially when I am on my cycle







:. The past week has just been drama, though I realized I think she reacts badly to certain foods with red dye and stuff like that. Remember my eldest is almost 17 so back in the day, there was not so much info about kids eating junk and acting crazy, plus my son was just mellow.

Well I have been saying for months to dh that everytime dd gets a taste of junk she gets crazy, well dh finally realized it was not in my mind so we just tossed out her cereal, the goldfish, the freezepops (dang and I am mod here letting my kid eat this stuff







). We are back to only fruits/veggies and maybe once a week she can have a gummy worm (her new fav, havibg had her first true candy a few weeks ago). It seems to be helping but baby girl has a little cold so she is extra cranky.

*Right now she gets mad and starts stomping all over the house like a little stompinator yelling leave me alone, generally I will but she keeps going half way up the stairs and yelling. Oy vey... she is a character







.* Mostly its good but some days, not so good. I am starting to think 3 is way worse than 2.

Shay, I am sorry cause I know you are dealing with a tough toddler stage, but this part made me giggle.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

my son just turned two April 3 and he loves books, reading, writing, pulling up weeds and showering/bathing outdoors. however, he always expects me to drop everything whenever he wants to do something and I usually do.and i have a real difficult time doing this when I am writing.

so, what he has started doing is going after everything on my desk. pens, pencils, paper, computer, eraser, sharpener. and if that does not work, he will try to move me. it's really just easier to just see what he wants, entertain him for a while, and then get back to my writing later.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Eilonwy, you have my booty? So what do you think about it? The rest of my lottery winnings are going to liposuction. My butt will have my in therapy one day!

I love my booty; It's that hideous flabby post-baby belly that I can't stand. I wouldn't say no to lipo on my inner thighs, but the tummy tuck is priority #1, followed by the breast lift (during which they reduce you a bit... aaaaah). Not that I expect to win the lottery any time soon, but a girl can dream.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I love my booty; It's that hideous flabby post-baby belly that I can't stand. I wouldn't say no to lipo on my inner thighs, but the tummy tuck is priority #1, followed by the breast lift (during which they reduce you a bit... aaaaah). Not that I expect to win the lottery any time soon, but a girl can dream.









I'm with you... but they can take some of the fat that's starting to accumulate at the TOP of my booty... lol


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Girl, don't even feel bad. I have had a few moments when I did the same thing.







Sometimes this girl o-mine vexes me to no end especially when I am on my cycle







:. The past week has just been drama, though I realized I think she reacts badly to certain foods with red dye and stuff like that. Remember my eldest is almost 17 so back in the day, there was not so much info about kids eating junk and acting crazy, plus my son was just mellow.

Well I have been saying for months to dh that everytime dd gets a taste of junk she gets crazy, well dh finally realized it was not in my mind so we just tossed out her cereal, the goldfish, the freezepops (dang and I am mod here letting my kid eat this stuff







). We are back to only fruits/veggies and maybe once a week she can have a gummy worm (her new fav, havibg had her first true candy a few weeks ago). It seems to be helping but baby girl has a little cold so she is extra cranky.

Right now she gets mad and starts stomping all over the house like a little stompinator yelling leave me alone, generally I will but she keeps going half way up the stairs and yelling. Oy vey... she is a character







. Mostly its good but some days, not so good. I am starting to think 3 is way worse than 2.

Well if 3 is worse than 2 , I am not ready at all.

Everything is I do it myself mommie, leave me alone, Daddy no, I don't like that song mommie, sing itsy bitsy spider mommie, whats that mommie, what happened mommie, I flatulated mommie, mommie pooopy in the potty....YAY mommy poopy. Mommie reapeat 15 times.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
my son just turned two April 3 and he loves books, reading, writing, pulling up weeds and showering/bathing outdoors. however, he always expects me to drop everything whenever he wants to do something and I usually do.and i have a real difficult time doing this when I am writing.

so, what he has started doing is going after everything on my desk. pens, pencils, paper, computer, eraser, sharpener. and if that does not work, he will try to move me. it's really just easier to just see what he wants, entertain him for a while, and then get back to my writing later.


Wow he and DS might be twins. You just described my son perfectly.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I love my booty; It's that hideous flabby post-baby belly that I can't stand. I wouldn't say no to lipo on my inner thighs, but the tummy tuck is priority #1, followed by the breast lift (during which they reduce you a bit... aaaaah). Not that I expect to win the lottery any time soon, but a girl can dream.









I just Spanx the transverse incision destroyed tummy and go. The booty and the thighs however add 1 to 2 sizes to my dresses requiring the top to under go alteration.

If I can just get my mind toegther and be a size 6or 8 or again I will forget about the liposuction.

I have had booty issues since the age of 8. Granted I had a wonderful shape until about 1 year before I gave birth and it has been a struggle ever since.


----------



## princesstutu

I've maintained that 3 is worse than 2 since I was a teenager. My kids did nothing to kick that opinion out of my mind.









My body and I are coming to better terms. I realize that most of my mental struggle with it is b/c I strive to been viewed as sexy to the opposite sex. Weeeell...that's, like, _never_ a problem. Once I really grasped that, I made progress with my body image. As flabby as my thighs and stomach are, I find that most men still think I'm beautiful. Even naked! The ones who don't certainly don't say anything. Hey! Maybe there _aren't_ any who don't.









The great thing about men is that they can't see the trees for the forest. I use that to my mental advantage. Most men aren't going to even notice my thigh-dimples and sagging ass. I'm comparing my body to what it was like pre-kids, but none of the men I know knew me back then. They're just appreciating what I've got _now_. I appreciate that reminder to do the same.

This body gave me four, wonderful babies. Like, they came _thru_ me. The cooch is still great, so what am I trippin' on? You know?

Gonna go listen to Lady Saw's _Pretty Pussy_, now. Peace.


----------



## shayinme

Can I just say I really enjoy talking to sistas, we just have a neat perpective on life. Living in Maine, a place where I have like 3 real life sista buddies, I really depend on the connections I make online to keep me sane.

That said and I have no issues with our white sistas but I love how we can casually intermix talk of babies with our booties.







Incidently I started calling Izzi's bum her booty which she now calls her dutty. LOL

I don't know after accounting for age and almost a 50 pound weight loss, my famous budunkadunk seems to be shrinking







:. I guess its ok since I ain't about to pay to buy some padding or nothing crazy but I am in need of some of this spanx I keep hearing of or a tummy tuck. I still got a tummy pooch and small lady with a tummy makes finding tops that fit a royal PITA.

Off to farmers market and breakfast I go.

Shay


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
This is the one I used and it came out very well.

Oooh, thanks! This worked for front carry too, right?


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Well as least you all have booties. I was diagnosed with that disease as a child: NO-ASS-AT-ALL.


----------



## purplegirl

Like Shay, this tribe is my favorite, safe haven on the web. I get so giddy when there are new posts or new members.
As for the booty--flat like my grandmama's was. My man would love it if I had more badunkadunk but my genes ruled that out. I got plenty of thighs and tummy though!


----------



## JustKiya

As I lose weight, I'm losing my butt too. I miss my juicy booty, but the smaller waistline/belly almost makes up for it.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Everything is I do it myself mommie, leave me alone, Daddy no, I don't like that song mommie, sing itsy bitsy spider mommie, whats that mommie, what happened mommie, I flatulated mommie, mommie pooopy in the potty....YAY mommy poopy. Mommie reapeat 15 times.

Granted I had a wonderful shape until about 1 year before I gave birth and it has been a struggle ever since.

LMBAO!!! Oh, my goodness, ya'll are killing me in here.

My son has to say Mommy 800 times a day. It is maddening!!!







:

And yeah, I try to push the thought out of my head but having kids really wreaked havoc on my figure. I used to have a tiny waist and full hips, your classic figure 8. Now, it is completely different and not in a good way. I was walking to the dentist's office today and caught a glimpse of myself in a window still looking 4 or 5 mos. pregnant.







I need to get up on some girdles or something just so my clothes look good. DH, bless his heart, loves it all. I can't stand it. I'm glad I was able to have them babies but the belly flab, I can do without.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Oooh, thanks! This worked for front carry too, right?

Yup, works well as a front carry.


----------



## oyinmama

i would just like to say three things.

1. this thread. could my love for it be any stronger? i do not see how.









2. big thanks to rootsdawta for helping me, through example, to get over my back-carry phobia. LO is happy back there, i'm happy with two free hands and a non-sore back!! yay







i love that i can just carry a lappa in my changing wallet and have so many options for a sling carry, back carry, playtime blanket, naptime swaddle, etc. yay!! again! for traveling light.









3. i've always been kind of lean/athletic/dancerish in build; this is fine for me, and as far as i knew, fine for the hubster. imagine my surprise when i grew a bootie and hips during pregnancy... and he started acting like i had brought home mr. wonka's golden ticket just for him!!







what a sweetie, to have gamely ignored my shortcomings in that department for ten years, LOL!!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
3. i've always been kind of lean/athletic/dancerish in build; this is fine for me, and as far as i knew, fine for the hubster. imagine my surprise when i grew a bootie and hips during pregnancy... and he started acting like i had brought home mr. wonka's golden ticket just for him!!







what a sweetie, to have gamely ignored my shortcomings in that department for ten years, LOL!!









: Have you ever seen that Malcom in the Middle episode that opens with Lois (hugely pregnant) saying, "I don't understand how I'm gaining SO MUCH weight..." and she's all sad and complaining, and then Hal gives her a plate of something and he's like, heaped all this extra stuff into it? She bends over and her butt is HUGE and he's there staring, eyes huge and licking his lips... it's *hilarious*.

My BeanBean was born with "nositall," as we call it. It was mindblowing, he really had nothing there... but somewhere between 18 months and 2 he grew a little tush.







The girls were both born with German birthing hips, and Bear has a little bit of a tush but not a ghetto booty like mine. Mike's got nothing at all. I mean, when he sits it looks like he just kind of bends somewhere at the bottom of his back. "What are you sitting on?!" "A chair."







Like that King of the Hill episode... I think they called it TPS?







:


----------



## Brown Lioness

Dude, forget about booty and bust, i want some HIPS!! I feel like i been robbed of some kind of birth right or something, lol. ALL the women in my family gots some hips yet here I am, ...straight up and down. Blah.

Maybe a baby will help spread me out, lol.

I agree, this tribe makes me feel safe.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i would just like to say three things.

2. big thanks to rootsdawta for helping me, through example, to get over my back-carry phobia. LO is happy back there, i'm happy with two free hands and a non-sore back!! yay







i love that i can just carry a lappa in my changing wallet and have so many options for a sling carry, back carry, playtime blanket, naptime swaddle, etc. yay!! again! for traveling light.

















:

You're most welcome Mama!!! Glad you've got you're hands back!

I too love just carrying a lappa and getting so many uses out of it.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i would just like to say three things.

1. this thread. could my love for it be any stronger? i do not see how.









2. big thanks to rootsdawta for helping me, through example, to get over my back-carry phobia. LO is happy back there, i'm happy with two free hands and a non-sore back!! yay







i love that i can just carry a lappa in my changing wallet and have so many options for a sling carry, back carry, playtime blanket, naptime swaddle, etc. yay!! again! for traveling light.









3. i've always been kind of lean/athletic/dancerish in build; this is fine for me, and as far as i knew, fine for the hubster. imagine my surprise when i grew a bootie and hips during pregnancy... and he started acting like i had brought home mr. wonka's golden ticket just for him!!







*what a sweetie, to have gamely ignored my shortcomings in that department for ten years,* LOL!!

That ish cracked me up


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 

3. i've always been kind of lean/athletic/dancerish in build; this is fine for me, and as far as i knew, fine for the hubster. imagine my surprise when i grew a bootie and hips during pregnancy... and he started acting like i had brought home mr. wonka's golden ticket just for him!!







what a sweetie, to have gamely ignored my shortcomings in that department for ten years, LOL!!
















It is interesting when your pregnant body starts expanding and you get parts you never had much of and discover that your spousal unit/partner actually really liked that missing part. For us it was the breasts... my goodness during pregnancy and up until the weight loss, I grew 38D's... the spousal unit was happy







:. Alas Mami is now a 34C







:, however cute bras are once again really cheap since I learned there are no nice pretty 38D bras for $7-8 at TJ Maxx or anyplace for that matter.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Like Shay, this tribe is my favorite, safe haven on the web. I get so giddy when there are new posts *or new members*.
As for the booty--flat like my grandmama's was. My man would love it if I had more badunkadunk but my genes ruled that out. I got plenty of thighs and tummy though!









(bolding: mine) seriously? well then, I think it might be time for me to come out of lurkdom







Plus, I have been enjoying this thread for a while now and I want to be part of it!

so a bit about my background: I have been on MDC since my little one was a baby and now she's two. My mother is somali and my father was yemeni. (he passed away this year).

Luckily, I have been blessed with a big butt too.









Anyway, I wish I could write more but I'm exhausted today.. so I'm gonna go cuddle with the baby and call it a night.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
(bolding: mine) seriously? well then, I think it might be time for me to come out of lurkdom







Plus, I have been enjoying this thread for a while now and I want to be part of it!

so a bit about my background: I have been on MDC since my little one was a baby and now she's two. My mother is somalian and my father was yemeni. (he passed away this year).

Luckily, I have been blessed with a big butt too.









Anyway, I wish I could write more but I'm exhausted today.. so I'm gonna go cuddle with the baby and call it a night.









I am especially glad to have *you* join us


----------



## nnaemeka

peace everybody!!

booties and carriers! nice topics:









did anyone's booty flatten during pregnancy? i heard this can happen and i keep looking at mine trying to see if its flatter now post-birth...i'm trying to keep da booty!

i have been struggling with carrying DD in a ringsling. i had no idea would take so much practice to get it right...argh. i've been checking out www.thebabywearer.com for tips and now i'm addicted to checking the hundred carriers and carry styles. a mama in yoga class today had her LO in an ergo. she said it was wonderfully comfy. i'd like to splurge on one of those some day soon. til then folding up my lappas is a great idea, so thanks oyinmama for the pics! i think DD's too little for the W.African back carry though i've seen women on the continent carry newborns confidently that way...i'm concerned her head will be flopping around back there.

anyway, i went to my first mommy&baby yoga class today. it was really nice. my DD fell asleep so i actually felt i got a bit of a work out. its been a looooong minute since i've done yoga, so it felt delicious. i'm about 7 weeks postpartum so i feel ready to work on shaping up. i hope to fit another class every week, but we'll see.

when/how do you ladies get your exercise?


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Have you ever seen that Malcom in the Middle episode that opens with Lois (hugely pregnant) saying, "I don't understand how I'm gaining SO MUCH weight..." and she's all sad and complaining, and then Hal gives her a plate of something and he's like, heaped all this extra stuff into it? She bends over and her butt is HUGE and he's there staring, eyes huge and licking his lips... it's *hilarious*.









: Yes! And if I remember correctly, he's dumping piles of SUGAR into her juice.

Well, I'm with you curvalicious mamas...







I lived in Mexico City for a few years after graduating from college. An absolute FAVORITE pastime for Mexicanos is to play with names and language. Everyone has a nickname, and it usually revolves around...*ahem*..."prominent" physical features. (or something humiliating that you've done, or an embarrassing habit)

Anyway, I NEVER had a nickname, or so I thought, until one of my coworkers (I managed a restaurant at night) said, OF COURSE you have un apodo! And I was like, "Well, what IS IT??!!"

Curvas Peligrosas














which translates literally to "dangerous curves" and is the sign that dots the old highways that have, well, dangerous curves!









Anyway...I've always had me these child-bearing hips so, meh, I've learned to love 'em!







Hopefully it won't take me TWO YEARS to lose the baby weight this time...sigh...mainly I wanna feel healthy, kwim?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:



Originally Posted by *shayinme*


:*love Can I just say I really enjoy talking to sistas, we just have a neat perpective on life. Living in Maine, a place where I have like 3 real life sista buddies, I really depend on the connections I make online to keep me sane. *
I don't know after accounting for age and almost a 50 pound weight loss, my famous budunkadunk seems to be shrinking







:. I guess its ok since I ain't about to pay to buy some padding or nothing crazy but I am in need of some of this *spanx* I keep hearing of or a tummy tuck. I still got a tummy pooch and small lady with a tummy makes finding tops that fit a royal PITA.

Off to farmers market and breakfast I go.

Shay


My husband just does not understand how happy I am to have found this tribe and the fact that it is active.

I found a wondeful salon for women of color, so now i have two strand twist with extensions. The 15% off post Hurricaine Ike special was wondeful too!

www.therootofyou.com

*I am a money deprived college student household, but I always have money for spanx. Spanx is GREAT.*

Quote:



Originally Posted by *purplegirl*


Like Shay, this tribe is my favorite, safe haven on the web. I get so giddy when there are new posts or new members. 
As for the booty--flat like my grandmama's was. My man would love it if I had more badunkadunk but my genes ruled that out. I got plenty of thighs and tummy though!










I am the only woman in my family with a butt, and what went worng with my genetics?

Quote:



Originally Posted by *rootzdawta*


LMBAO!!! Oh, my goodness, ya'll are killing me in here.

My son has to say Mommy 800 times a day. It is maddening!!!







:

And yeah, I try to push the thought out of my head but having kids really wreaked havoc on my figure. I used to have a tiny waist and full hips, your classic figure 8. Now, it is completely different and not in a good way. I was walking to the dentist's office today and caught a glimpse of myself in a window still looking 4 or 5 mos. pregnant.







I need to get up on some girdles or something just so my clothes look good. DH, bless his heart, loves it all. I can't stand it. I'm glad I was able to have them babies but the belly flab, I can do without.


I do not push the thought out of mind. he ruined my body, little stinker. But I love him still. Especially when he sees my scar and asks me "did it hurt mommy"? Whaddaya think?

Quote:



Originally Posted by *oyinmama*


3. i've always been kind of lean/athletic/dancerish in build; this is fine for me, and as far as i knew, fine for the hubster. imagine my surprise when i grew a bootie and hips during pregnancy... and he started acting like i had brought home mr. wonka's golden ticket just for him!!







what a sweetie, to have gamely ignored my shortcomings in that department for ten years, LOL!!


Husbands are so wonderful, aren't they?

Quote:



Originally Posted by *shayinme*
















It is interesting when your pregnant body starts expanding and you get parts you never had much of and discover that your spousal unit/partner actually really liked that missing part. For us it was the breasts... my goodness during pregnancy and up until the weight loss, I grew 38D's... the spousal unit was happy







:. Alas Mami is now a 34C







:, however cute bras are once again really cheap since I learned there are no nice pretty 38D bras for $7-8 at TJ Maxx or anyplace for that matter.


I am jealous of you and your $7 bras. May I please have one in a 34G. PLEASE

Quote:



Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira*


(bolding: mine) seriously? well then, I think it might be time for me to come out of lurkdom







Plus, I have been enjoying this thread for a while now and I want to be part of it!

so a bit about my background: I have been on MDC since my little one was a baby and now she's two. My mother is somali and my father was yemeni. (he passed away this year).

Luckily, I have been blessed with a big butt too.









Anyway, I wish I could write more but I'm exhausted today.. so I'm gonna go cuddle with the baby and call it a night.










Welcome!!

Quote:



Originally Posted by *nnaemeka*


peace everybody!!

booties and carriers! nice topics:









did anyone's booty flatten during pregnancy? i heard this can happen and i keep looking at mine trying to see if its flatter now post-birth...i'm trying to keep da booty!

i have been struggling with carrying DD in a ringsling. i had no idea would take so much practice to get it right...argh. i've been checking out www.thebabywearer.com for tips and now i'm addicted to checking the hundred carriers and carry styles. a mama in yoga class today had her LO in an ergo. she said it was wonderfully comfy. i'd like to splurge on one of those some day soon.

when/how do you ladies get your exercise?


It was worth the splurge. I actually purchased a used one in great condition for $65, and soon swapped up to a brand new Ergo because some one liked my black and I liked her butterfly print.

I do not get excercise. AT ALL. NONE. But we are joining the Y next month. YAY!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
My husband just does not understand how happy I am to have found this tribe and the fact that it is active.

I found a wondeful salon for women of color, so now i have two strand twist with extensions. The 15% off post Hurricaine Ike special was wondeful too!

www.therootofyou.com

*I am a money deprived college student household, but I always have money for spanx. Spanx is GREAT.*

*I am the only woman in my family with a butt, and what went worng with my genetics?*

I do not push the thought out of mind. he ruined my body, little stinker. But I love him still. Especially when he sees my scar and asks me "did it hurt mommy"? Whaddaya think?

Husbands are so wonderful, aren't they?

I am jealous of you and your $7 bras. May I please have one in a 34G. PLEASE

Welcome!!

It was worth the splurge. I actually purchased a used one in great condition for $65, and soon swapped up to a brand new Ergo because some one liked my black and I liked her butterfly print.

I do not get excercise. AT ALL. NONE. But we are joining the Y next month. YAY!!!


Luck was on your side!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
did anyone's booty flatten during pregnancy? i heard this can happen and i keep looking at mine trying to see if its flatter now post-birth...i'm trying to keep da booty!

This happened to my sister. I asked her about it when I got pregnant with Bean, because I'm just not built to look decent with a flat behind. She said that it only stays flat if you get fatter, because the booty can get sucked into the fat.







In any case, it was never an issue for me-- my big behind remained a big behind.

I like Curvas Peligrosas.







:

I've got to figure out a new carrying arrangement for Bear. He's just so much bigger than my other babies that I'm having a difficult time with it.







Like I said before, i can't keep him up high enough in front for my back to be comfortable... but I've always had a hard time getting babies on my back at all.







Is there some trick for short mammas of tall babies that I'm missing? Bella wasn't this tall until she was well over a year old...







:

As to bras, I had no trouble finding relatively inexpensive G-cups at TJ Maxx and such. It was the I/J/K range that made life impossible.


----------



## Draupadi

Unlike some of you, I wasn't blessed with a nice backside. It's alright and my DH likes it enough, but it could be a little more higher IMO. I attribute that to my Korean genes.







I'm not thin by any stretch of the word. I get my figure mostly from my father's side!
Right before I got pregnant, I was at the gym 3-4 times a week, looking good. Then I got morning sickness and was too fatigued to do anything.
After William was born, my 36Ds ballooned up to 40Es! We're still nursing so the sisters are about a 40D. They do tend to look down, though...
Anyway, I've always been jealous of sistas with nice, round butts since I've always been a little bit on the flabby side. I certainly could use some lipo on my thighs and belly, even though DH likes my post-baby jiggle...er...a lot!


----------



## AndrewsMother

hmmm.....
Does anyone else shop at Intimacy?

http://www.myintimacy.com/


----------



## AndrewsMother

A Vent
I don't know if I want advice or just an ear or would it be an eye?

Does anyone have friends whose children you just can't stand? I have never liked the phrase "slap the piss out of them" until yesterday when the urge ran through me. I have a very dear friend who has 8 children. Three biological and 5 were adopted. I love the older 5, but the last 3 I can't stand to be around. They are 5, 7 & 8 but they all act as if they are 3 or younger. She has had them all since they were much younger and they were in a stable foster home before adoption so I have no idea as to what is wrong.
is has
Now, my friend is not very educated (and this has nothing to do with colleged, because education can be obtained from a myriad of sources) or refined, but she is resourceful, works hard and takes care of her family and is TRUE friend to those that she loves. No I do not understanad her thought pattern or the fact that she thinks that the rich people have it easy, but I love her all the same. Her house is in an almost constant state of chaos, but I do visit maybe everyother week because alot of her friends stopped visiting because of her husband. He is a nice guy, but very crass. Gross at times even and always ready to provoke an argument with his wife.

My husband does not like going to her house, but he does, because like I said before she is a WONDERFUL person and she would give us her last. We had no power for 3 days so she gave us her foodstamp card to buy groceries. Yes we make probably 3 times what her family made last year, but she knows that our income is stretched since my DH did not work for almost a year.

BUT, her 3 youngest children are helping to corrupt my DS. well they all are. I am very careful of the words that I use at home, where as her children use the S words all of the time. Shut up and stupid. and the D word. Dumb. The f word. Fart. Her husband calls his children little shits, dumb shits, little turds, SHITS, turds etc etc.

We promptly leave when we here these words. Or when their household becomes rowdy, but I feel torn. Part of me never wants to step foot in their home again, but that would hurt her. I am going to pack up my son and leave whenever the situation becomes chaotic, but I feel so bad for her.

She will admit that her ways are not right, but at the same time she is not willing to change. Her oldest two children are in college and she knows the value of an education and wants the best for her children, but at the same time she prohibits them from receiving the help that they need. Counseling...therapy...etc etc.

Her 8 year old gave my son meat yesterday while I was int he restroom and I could have smacked her. Not because she did it, but because she thought that it was funny and gave me a ridiculous senseless answer. I know the girl is slow. SHE FAILED KINDERGARTERN, and so did her sister. But I am still annoyed to no end by her.

DS loves her children, but it annoys me that he wants to play with them. They are sweet children, just wild. I feel bad for them since they were abandoned by their 17 year old mother, but they annoy me.

Sorry for whining. I just grin and bare it, but the meat issue pushed me over the edge. Well that and the 12 year old telling me that I need to spank my son. I told her, in front of her mom, "that she was spanked quite often and that it did not seem to work. Yes my comment was not nice, but argggh.

Does anyone else like to pick and choose their children's friends?

I do feel much better after venting.


----------



## Arike

RE: bodies changing during pregnancy and after

My body hasn't changed AT ALL during my pregnancy. Except of course the belly!(No stretchmarks from the pregnancy though!) I thought my booty would round out and that I would for the first time in my life have an ample bosom... I think I may have gained a half cup size, my bras still fit, just a little bit more snug. I am just so worried about having a jelly belly after the baby. Has anyone sucessfully gotten rid of the postpartum belly?


----------



## eilonwy

Hm... I'm kind of torn, Piad.







I understand what you mean, but I swear a lot. I mean a LOT. My kids don't generally swear in public, but words slip from time to time. Mike almost never swears in front of the kids, though, and I can't remember the last time I swore in front of someone else's children (though it was probably a case of something dangerous, i.e. one of my kids runs into the middle of the street and I say, "Sh**!" while running to retrieve them). I also don't call my kids "little sh***" ever, nor do I swear at them (the closest would be the occasional "damn it!" or "That's not a f****** toy!"). I don't really expect most parents to be tolerant of that sort of language, so I don't use it in front of other kids and I rarely use it in public at all. And, truth be told, my children tend to be instigators rather than innocents being corrupted by other kids. BeanBean is a natural leader and very creative; BooBah is unbelievably resourceful and very sneaky. There's definately logic to all that they do, but sometimes their ideas are insane.

When ChibiChibi was three, she went to HeadStart and brought home some really obnoxious behaviors. Before going, she was one of the most polite children you could imagine, with one of the sunniest dispositions. She, like Bean after, was a natural leader and very charismatic, creative and full of "good" ideas, but she was never obnoxious, cruel, selfish or even rude. One afternoon she was behaving in a particularly ridiculous fashion and when I put her on time out she shouted, "You're not my friend anymore!" Once I'd quelled my silent laughter, I sat her down and we talked. I told her that I understood that some of the little girls at HeadStart were doing/saying these things, but that I couldn't care less about them. I loved her dearly, and had to live with her; I didn't want her to grow up to be a selfish little twit. If other little girls were nasty it was their problem, but I loved her too much to watch her behave that way when I knew she was capable of better.

It worked pretty well. We had to rehash that conversation in it's entirety once, and in short form a few times (usually after she'd spent the weekend with her cousins







) but it made an impression on her. Today she's eleven, and for an eleven year old girl she's remarkably level-headed and sweet.







(Please note here that I'm of the opinion that most eleven year old girls should be locked in closets until they're 20, and I've felt that way since I was about ten.







) So she wasn't corrupted for life.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am especially glad to have *you* join us









Aww, thank you. I swear, for the longest time I felt apprehensive about joining such a tight knit group.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 


Welcome!!




Thank you!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Does anyone else like to pick and choose their children's friends?
.​
​
​
You bet! Hey, my baby is no angel but age-approriate stuff aside, I will not tolerate meanness. period.
with that said, I know from experience, it's easier said than done.








A way to maintain the friendship with your dear friend might be just to approach her gently about how her kids' behaviour is negatively affecting yours.. And that because you care so much about your friendship, you are willing to help in any way you can. good luck!​


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
RE: bodies changing during pregnancy and after

My body hasn't changed AT ALL during my pregnancy. Except of course the belly!(No stretchmarks from the pregnancy though!) I thought my booty would round out and that I would for the first time in my life have an ample bosom... I think I may have gained a half cup size, my bras still fit, just a little bit more snug. I am just so worried about having a jelly belly after the baby. Has anyone sucessfully gotten rid of the postpartum belly?

Not me. but I know plenty of people who bounced back right away! And since your body hasn't stretched out to the max, I'm sure you'll have no problem!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
And, truth be told, my children tend to be instigators rather than innocents being corrupted by other kids. BeanBean is a natural leader and very creative; BooBah is unbelievably resourceful and very sneaky. There's definately logic to all that they do, but sometimes their ideas are insane.



Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 

You bet! Hey, my baby is no angel but age-approriate stuff aside, I will not tolerate meanness. period.
with that said, I know from experience, it's easier said than done.








A way to maintain the friendship with your dear friend might be just to approach her gently about how her kids' behaviour is negatively affecting yours.. And that because you care so much about your friendship, you are willing to help in any way you can. good luck!

Now don't get me wrong, DS is BAD. Well not bad, but Bad. He too is a natural leader and very creative and resourceful. If there is any disruption in the classroom my DS is at the helm. Just last week he had the whole class dino raring and stomping around the room while the teacher was helping another child use the restroom. DS is fun loving, sneaky, altruistic and just plain fun to be around. He also bites, hits, kicks and scratches. me mostly, rarely at school.

He will hit her children and I will correct my son because he is wrong. If her children were two or three and hit him back I would not care. I just can't imagine how a five, seven, eight and ten year old think that it is okay to hit back at a 2 year old child. As a child I would have never hit a baby so it is hard for me to fathom that any child would do such a thing.

I am not an overprotective parent, I just want for my son to retain his sunny loving disposition and to refrain from using ugly words.

People laugh at me, but I taught him to say flatulate instead of fart, be quiet please instead of shut up and ridiculous instead of dumb or stupid. Butt rolls off of my tongue now, but that was a bad word during my childhood.

Is wrestling normal for a 2 year old boy?


----------



## eilonwy

Okay. When Bella hits BeanBean, I redirect her-- "We don't hit, use your words." When BeanBean hits her back, I remind him that she's a baby and he knows better.

Bean is, not to put too fine a point on it, highly gifted. He speaks and very often behaves as a much older child. His personality is very strong, and he does not shy away from conflict. When older children antagonize him, he will keep escalating the situation because he does not have the emotional maturity to back down when someone else pushes him-- that is really the responsibility of the older child. When it's a little hoodrat who's "pushed" into action by Bean's response to antagonism, I have absolutely no problem intervening and reminding the other child that Bean is half his size (if not smaller).

My nieces occasionally antagonize Bean, and I have let Chibi know in no uncertain terms that it is her job as the older child and the more emotionally mature child to de-escalate the situation. If Chibi hits Bean because Bean hit her, Chibi is the one who needs to be sanctioned. BizzyBug's a different case; Though she's three years older, she does not have the emotional sophistication to de-escalate a situation. In other words, if BizzyBug and BeanBean start hitting one another, *both* of them require the same kind of intervention despite the age discrepency. I get that Bean has a great deal of presence, and that BizzyBug is a big girl for her age, but that emotional maturity is more relevant insuch a situation.

I guess what I'm saying is, I can see where you're coming from and I'd have a problem if other adults disagreed with my choice of intervention. I've never once had that trouble with Chibi & BizzyBug, because my mother inevitably agrees with me when I tell Chibi that she's old enough to know better and that she needs to de-escalate the situation. I'd do the same thing with any older child hitting a younger (and I have). If your friend is unwilling to intervene, do you think it would be a problem for her if you *did* intervene? I mean maybe she just doesn't have all the tools in her arsenal that you do, when it comes to dealing with these situations. She might be really greatful to learn a new way of dealing with little thugs.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Not me. but I know plenty of people who bounced back right away! And since your body hasn't stretched out to the max, I'm sure you'll have no problem!

I am hoping to bounce back! I am definitely fighting against genetics. The women in my family tend to "blow up" after kids. But I wonder how much of that is genetics versus poor diet and exercise habits in the postpartum period. I convinced my younger brother to do the "Couch to 5k" program with me in order to get back in shape after the baby. Hopefully we will run a 5k in December or January.
I have been reading a lot about weight loss and breastfeeding and they make it seem like you will not lose those final pounds until you wean your LO. Is that the excess breast weight or something? I plan on BF for at least a year.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am hoping to bounce back! I am definitely fighting against genetics. The women in my family tend to "blow up" after kids. But I wonder how much of that is genetics versus poor diet and exercise habits in the postpartum period. I convinced my younger brother to do the "Couch to 5k" program with me in order to get back in shape after the baby. Hopefully we will run a 5k in December or January.
I have been reading a lot about weight loss and breastfeeding and they make it seem like you will not lose those final pounds until you wean your LO. Is that the excess breast weight or something? I plan on BF for at least a year.

I think that genetics do play a huge part. A good exercise program, I believe, can do volumes to help you bounce back. My problem is that I cannot find the time to do any workout with consistency. FWIW, with baby #1, nothing really changed but my belly--but it was a really drastic change, i.e. flab, flab and more flab. Baby #2 really did a number, though and I feel like getting it back will be a real challenge. Oh, and for me, I did not get back to pre-preg weight until ds1 was about 15 mos. Soon after, I got pregnant with ds2 so that was very short lived. Some women, though, report losing all the weight due to breastfeeding so it depends very much on the person.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am hoping to bounce back! I am definitely fighting against genetics. The women in my family tend to "blow up" after kids. But I wonder how much of that is genetics versus poor diet and exercise habits in the postpartum period. I convinced my younger brother to do the "Couch to 5k" program with me in order to get back in shape after the baby. Hopefully we will run a 5k in December or January.
I have been reading a lot about weight loss and breastfeeding and they make it seem like you will not lose those final pounds until you wean your LO. Is that the excess breast weight or something? I plan on BF for at least a year.

I gained 22 pounds during my pregnancy and lost 16 before I ever left the hospital. The other 6 pounds came off. However I was quite bloated and swollen. I did not retain any fluid while pregnant, but I looked quite full for atleast 2 months after his birth. I even lost additional pounds from nursing I would guess. I gained weight AFTER my son was born. The company that I worked for went out of business, so I spent my days snacking and sleeping. I also gained.

I know quite a few women who gave birth around the same time as I. Except for those few with the slim and trim gene, all the women who worked out quickly regained their shape. The others took much longer to lose the weight and some even gained weight.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Is wrestling normal for a 2 year old boy?

i don't know how normal, but my son wrestles with us a lot. we are a family of wrestlers...at least once a week. so, he has been watching us "get it on" since he was born and now he jumps on backs, bite legs, pull hair and a whole lot of other wild stuff.


----------



## Bloomingstar

go away for one day and there's a whole new page and a half!









just chiming in on the pregnancy body thing...

so far, other people seem to think my butt has gotten bigger, but I think it has gotten flatter, and maybe my hips have gotten wider--make sense? or maybe I am a little deluded, hehe. So far, no stretch marks but if they come, they come--I'm only almost 26 weeks. I'm not sure what happens to the women in my family--some bounce back, some don't? I have a totally different body from my sister, who is also pregnant right now, with her third (and due the day before me







) so I am just waiting to see what happens, I guess. So far the biggest change is a jump from an A cup to a D cup--kind of alarming







And of course, the belly. But I'm pretty active in general, so I don't foresee a lack of exercise in my future









on another note--anyone here had their placenta dehydrated and encapsulated to take in case of PPD or just because? I'll check out some of the other forums, but I'd love to hear from you ladies if you have, how taking it worked out for you.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
So far the biggest change is a jump from an A cup to a D cup--kind of alarming







And of course, the belly.

Okay so I am kind of jealous of the A to D cup! I kind of wanted to know what it would feel like to have big breasts!









Oh and I plan on doing the placenta encapsulation. Actually my doula is doing it for me. I'll let you know how it works out!


----------



## purplegirl

It's a whirl wind in my life right now but I am so thankful that I have this tribe, my place of solace









I have never been pregnant so I can't speak to the body changes, etc but you all sound like incredibly beautiful women. I can't think of anything more perfect than a woman's body carrying a baby. I am working on my body to prepare for pregnancy. Many of you know my fertility struggles but, I am believing that it is going to happen and soon. I am eating an impecably healthy diet and walking miles every day! I have added many supplements to my diet to help me reach optimum health so I can be healthier when I conceive!

I have been so emotional lately. I am a child and adolescent therapist with a huge practice and it seems like half of my kids are in crisis. It is very unusual for this many to "pop" at the same time and it is wearing me down! I practice in nontraditional ways--when things are going well, it is great. When there is a crisis, it requires a lot of my time and energy! Thankfully, I am meditating, doing yoga and praying a lot these days.*sigh*

Yesterday, I was in the park and a text came through. I just knew it was from a parent; alas, it was my dh thanking me for being "me" and telling me he "loves me lots"







: He has no clue how much that meant to me and the timing couldn't have been more perfect. I started sobbing right there in the park probably looking a hot mess but I didn't care!!! Heck, I might just have to cook dinner for him this weekend








Bye for now.......


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
It's a whirl wind in my life right now but I am so thankful that I have this tribe, my place of solace









I have never been pregnant so I can't speak to the body changes, etc but you all sound like incredibly beautiful women. I can't think of anything more perfect than a woman's body carrying a baby. I am working on my body to prepare for pregnancy. Many of you know my fertility struggles but, I am believing that it is going to happen and soon. I am eating an impecably healthy diet and walking miles every day! I have added many supplements to my diet to help me reach optimum health so I can be healthier when I conceive!

I have been so emotional lately. I am a child and adolescent therapist with a huge practice and it seems like half of my kids are in crisis. It is very unusual for this many to "pop" at the same time and it is wearing me down! I practice in nontraditional ways--when things are going well, it is great. When there is a crisis, it requires a lot of my time and energy! Thankfully, I am meditating, doing yoga and praying a lot these days.*sigh*

Yesterday, I was in the park and a text came through. I just knew it was from a parent; alas, it was my dh thanking me for being "me" and telling me he "loves me lots"







: He has no clue how much that meant to me and the timing couldn't have been more perfect. I started sobbing right there in the park probably looking a hot mess but I didn't care!!! Heck, I might just have to cook dinner for him this weekend








Bye for now.......


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am working on my body to prepare for pregnancy. Many of you know my fertility struggles but, I am believing that it is going to happen and soon. I am eating an impeccably healthy diet and walking miles every day! I have added many supplements to my diet to help me reach optimum health so I can be healthier when I conceive!









:

I started seeing an integrative physician at the beginning of 2007. Almost every physician that I have had since probably I was a teenager told me it would be harder for me to get pregnant due to have PCOS. DH and I had even talked about what we would do if we were unable to conceive naturally, i.e. fertility therapy, IVF, adoption, etc... Just from being healthier (diet and supplementation) through the guidance of my new physician, I was able to conceive without even trying. (Yeah me and DH were like







when we found out!)
I guess I was subconsciously preparing my body for pregnancy all of 2007.

Sending baby dust your way!


----------



## purplegirl

Thanks for the hugs and baby dust! I am an emotional mess these days so the love is appreciated!


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am hoping to bounce back! I am definitely fighting against genetics. The women in my family tend to "blow up" after kids. But I wonder how much of that is genetics versus poor diet and exercise habits in the postpartum period. I convinced my younger brother to do the "Couch to 5k" program with me in order to get back in shape after the baby. Hopefully we will run a 5k in December or January.
I have been reading a lot about weight loss and breastfeeding and they make it seem like you will not lose those final pounds until you wean your LO. Is that the excess breast weight or something? I plan on BF for at least a year.

For me, personally, I actually gained weight while breastfeeding and am just starting to lose the weight and getting closer to my pre-pregnancy weight. While I was breastfeeding, I was hungry all the time and really sleep-deprived..
Now that she is no longer breastfeeding, we all get a lot of sleep. I'm also more active now.. what with an active toddler and a new job.

And I agree with pp's, Some of it is probably genetics. Although, my mother who had five kids never got a stretchmark or lost her figure. But everyone on my father's side completely changed. so, No matter how thin, I get I know I'm not going to lose the belly flab.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Now don't get me wrong, DS is BAD. Well not bad, but Bad. He too is a natural leader and very creative and resourceful. If there is any disruption in the classroom my DS is at the helm. Just last week he had the whole class dino raring and stomping around the room while the teacher was helping another child use the restroom. DS is fun loving, sneaky, altruistic and just plain fun to be around. He also bites, hits, kicks and scratches. me mostly, rarely at school.

He will hit her children and I will correct my son because he is wrong. If her children were two or three and hit him back I would not care. I just can't imagine how a five, seven, eight and ten year old think that it is okay to hit back at a 2 year old child. As a child I would have never hit a baby so it is hard for me to fathom that any child would do such a thing.

I am not an overprotective parent, I just want for my son to retain his sunny loving disposition and to refrain from using ugly words.

People laugh at me, but I taught him to say flatulate instead of fart, be quiet please instead of shut up and ridiculous instead of dumb or stupid. Butt rolls off of my tongue now, but that was a bad word during my childhood.

Is wrestling normal for a 2 year old boy?

Your post made me laugh.







Your ds sounds so adorable! but I completely relate to everything you just talked about. one of dd's cousins is like that but we don't see them very often.
and yes, wrestling is quite the rage at our house. I have a just turned 2 yo daughter!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
It's a whirl wind in my life right now but I am so thankful that I have this tribe, my place of solace









I have never been pregnant so I can't speak to the body changes, etc but you all sound like incredibly beautiful women. I can't think of anything more perfect than a woman's body carrying a baby. I am working on my body to prepare for pregnancy. Many of you know my fertility struggles but, I am believing that it is going to happen and soon. I am eating an impecably healthy diet and walking miles every day! I have added many supplements to my diet to help me reach optimum health so I can be healthier when I conceive!

I have been so emotional lately. I am a child and adolescent therapist with a huge practice and it seems like half of my kids are in crisis. It is very unusual for this many to "pop" at the same time and it is wearing me down! I practice in nontraditional ways--when things are going well, it is great. When there is a crisis, it requires a lot of my time and energy! Thankfully, I am meditating, doing yoga and praying a lot these days.*sigh*

Yesterday, I was in the park and a text came through. I just knew it was from a parent; alas, it was my dh thanking me for being "me" and telling me he "loves me lots"







: He has no clue how much that meant to me and the timing couldn't have been more perfect. I started sobbing right there in the park probably looking a hot mess but I didn't care!!! Heck, I might just have to cook dinner for him this weekend








Bye for now.......









. You are in my thoughts, purple girl, and I'm sending you lots of baby dust and peaceful







:


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
It's a whirl wind in my life right now but I am so thankful that I have this tribe, my place of solace









I have never been pregnant so I can't speak to the body changes, etc but you all sound like incredibly beautiful women. I can't think of anything more perfect than a woman's body carrying a baby. I am working on my body to prepare for pregnancy. Many of you know my fertility struggles but, I am believing that it is going to happen and soon. I am eating an impecably healthy diet and walking miles every day! I have added many supplements to my diet to help me reach optimum health so I can be healthier when I conceive!

I have been so emotional lately. I am a child and adolescent therapist with a huge practice and it seems like half of my kids are in crisis. It is very unusual for this many to "pop" at the same time and it is wearing me down! I practice in nontraditional ways--when things are going well, it is great. When there is a crisis, it requires a lot of my time and energy! Thankfully, I am meditating, doing yoga and praying a lot these days.*sigh*

Yesterday, I was in the park and a text came through. I just knew it was from a parent; alas, it was my dh thanking me for being "me" and telling me he "loves me lots"







: He has no clue how much that meant to me and the timing couldn't have been more perfect. I started sobbing right there in the park probably looking a hot mess but I didn't care!!! Heck, I might just have to cook dinner for him this weekend








Bye for now.......

your lovefulness really shines thru even here in cyberland!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
your lovefulness really shines thru even here in cyberland!


Awww







:Thank you mamas. You have no idea how your words warm my heart at such at time when I need it most.


----------



## eilonwy

It's the beginning of the school year, so I'm sure you're very busy, Lisa.







:


----------



## futurenunez2007

*Hi my name is Joy and I am new to the tribe just peeping my head in







*


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am hoping to bounce back! I am definitely fighting against genetics. The women in my family tend to "blow up" after kids. But I wonder how much of that is genetics versus poor diet and exercise habits in the postpartum period. I convinced my younger brother to do the "Couch to 5k" program with me in order to get back in shape after the baby. Hopefully we will run a 5k in December or January.
I have been reading a lot about weight loss and breastfeeding and they make it seem like you will not lose those final pounds until you wean your LO. Is that the excess breast weight or something? I plan on BF for at least a year.

I certainly lost a lot of weight in the first year of breastfeeding, but have since hit a plateau and haven't lost any more. William is 16 1/2 mo. and we're still going strong.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurenunez2007* 
*Hi my name is Joy and I am new to the tribe just peeping my head in







*

Welcome!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Thanks for the hugs and baby dust! I am an emotional mess these days so the love is appreciated!









:
Blessings to you...


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurenunez2007* 
*Hi my name is Joy and I am new to the tribe just peeping my head in







*


Hey Joy!Welcome to our tribe!!







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurenunez2007* 
*Hi my name is Joy and I am new to the tribe just peeping my head in







*









: Welcome to the group. Lisa, sending lots of hugs your way.

It seems my fall allergies are flaring up and once again the workload will be picking up over the next week or so, but I will still try to pop in. On the plus side, my neighbors were having a yard sale and I just scored a $300 Pier 1 coffee table for $20







:. Plus some other goodies, I love good yard sales. Anyone else into secondhand shopping?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: Welcome to the group. Lisa, sending lots of hugs your way.

It seems my fall allergies are flaring up and once again the workload will be picking up over the next week or so, but I will still try to pop in. On the plus side, my neighbors were having a yard sale and I just scored a $300 Pier 1 coffee table for $20







:. Plus some other goodies, I love good yard sales. Anyone else into secondhand shopping?


I LOVE second hand shopping girl. In fact, I just got home from doing some scouting in this old quaint town near me. They were having a neighborhood garage sale and a sista was all over that town looking for goodies!!


----------



## eilonwy

I have much better luck with most of the things I buy shopping clearance sales. Mom: "Why did you buy three of the same shirt?" "It cost 97 cents, that's why."









That said, books are easiest to find secondhand.







The chemistry book that Bean's been obsessed with for the past two months was on a "free" table at someone's yard sale.







I've scored some pretty good stuff that way.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I have much better luck with most of the things I buy shopping clearance sales. Mom: "Why did you buy three of the same shirt?" "It cost 97 cents, that's why."









That said, books are easiest to find secondhand.







The chemistry book that Bean's been obsessed with for the past two months was on a "free" table at someone's yard sale.







I've scored some pretty good stuff that way.









As far as clothes those are hit or miss when it comes to yard sales and thrift shops here. The maine thrift store is Goodwill and I am sorry but in this economy when I can go to the mall and get a brand new paid of DKNY jeans for $11 at Macy's why should I pay $7 at Goodwill and they stink?







: Though in Portland we do have 1 cool consignment shop that while its not cheap like a traditional thrift store they have really funky eclectic stuff..

However when it comes to household stuff the thrifting and yard sales are good, we got a new blender (one of the expensive kind) for $2 plus a new dresser for free. There was a lady at the yard sale on the way to the dump with a dresser she was clearing out of her Mom's house, gorgeous wood and she was like you want it??? Of course so this weekend has been a good haul.

Only thing is I need new clothes, last fall I was a 8 and now I am a 6 and I have all of 2 pairs of pants to wear but buying a whole new fall/winter wardrobe at one time is not gonna happen. So Mama is trying to shop $20-30 at a time, though an H & M is opening up her in a few weeks, they tend to be cheap so maybe I can luck out there as far as helping my fall wardrobe.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

I was an 8 when I met Mike. That's actually quite skinny for me, at 6 my knees are the same size as my thighs and at 4 they're bigger (my line between "skinny" and "too skinny.")







Man. I weighed 155-160 pounds, too.

Sometimes I really miss it... but mostly I don't.







I don't mind being the size I am now (about 14, 16 if it's cheap) at all. I'm not fond of the floppy belly, like I said-- I could easily wear a 12 if I didn't have all that flabbiness to cram into my pants-- but I don't feel "too big" or anything. If I thought that there were exercises which could get my boobs and belly into a not-so-floppy state, I wouldn't feel so miserable about them, either.









Pregnancy did strange things to my body. I was not tiny when I got pregnant, but I was built soooo differently than I am now. My boobs were big then, but they were *perky*. I had a giant booty and thick thighs, but I didn't have a big hanging mess of a belly. I had an hourglass figure once, but now my waist is mostly hidden. I mean it's there, but you have to really be looking for it.


----------



## Shy0717

Hey everyone.







Just wanted to introduce myself. I'm Shyana but friends call me Shy. I'm 25 and currently living apart from my fiance who's stationed OK with the Army (I'm in TX). So happy to have found this thread. We plan on getting married sometime in the spring and TTC sometime next year. I'm curious since fibroids are common with African American women if anyone has had any experience TTC and carrying a healthy pregnancy with them. I was recently diagnosed with having 2 fibroids. One is tiny and really insignificant and the other is about 3 cm and causing me a bit of discomfort. So far the research I've done makes me nervous and stressed since fibroids can lead to tons of complications in a pregnancy as well as an automatic c-section if they get too large. Would love to hear any info or person experience anyone has had. Thanks ladies


----------



## I-AM-Mother

love second hand shopping. love estate sales as well. true gypsy at heart here.

hi Shy0717.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shy0717* 
Hey everyone.







Just wanted to introduce myself. I'm Shyana but friends call me Shy. I'm 25 and currently living apart from my fiance who's stationed OK with the Army (I'm in TX). So happy to have found this thread. We plan on getting married sometime in the spring and TTC sometime next year. I'm curious since fibroids are common with African American women if anyone has had any experience TTC and carrying a healthy pregnancy with them. I was recently diagnosed with having 2 fibroids. One is tiny and really insignificant and the other is about 3 cm and causing me a bit of discomfort. So far the research I've done makes me nervous and stressed since fibroids can lead to tons of complications in a pregnancy as well as an automatic c-section if they get too large. Would love to hear any info or person experience anyone has had. Thanks ladies









Hi Shy! Welcome to the tribe.
Fibroids--the bane of my existence. I had huge ones. I mean I looked and measured 5 months pg. I know they were one of the causes of my infertility and thus I had them removed last year. I would not have been able to have conceived or carry a pg to term. Now conversely, I had a friend who conceived, carried to term a very healthy pg, all the time with a huge fibroid that was didn't even know she had.
Have you had an mri to determine the exact size, location and type? Don't rely on an ultra sound. The MRI will give you the best indications as to what is going on.
Again, welcome!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Anyone else into secondhand shopping?

Oh, I just







second hand shopping. I was just getting ready to blog about it! But yeah, recently, shopping for second hand clothes is really not a good look for me. DH, though, seems to be able to find really nice things and I don't have a problem finding clothes second-hand for the kids. For me? Pretty much everything is chewed up and I can't even understand why they'd waste their time trying to sell it! My local thrift store usually has a great selection of hand bags and since I used to be a real bag hound, it takes a lot for me to just.walk.away. I'm also really into kitchen stuff (pans, pots, knick-knacks). Today they had a whole set of cast-iron pans for like $10. I already have a set though.

Eilonwy, you sound just like me. I could be a size 12 sho' nuff if it weren't for the super ample jiggly belly of mine! Today, I had on my girdle and my size 12 skirt was practically falling off. I had to put on a belt. I get so embarrassed when ds2 tries to latch on to nurse at night and in the dark tries to latch on to my belly.







Good grief, son!









Welcome to all the new Tribe Members!







:


----------



## FondestBianca

soooo, what colors are welcome here?

don't mean that to sound flippant... serious question.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
soooo, what colors are welcome here?

don't mean that to sound flippant... serious question.

What does women of color mean to you? I'm not trying to be flip at all.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh, I just







second hand shopping. I was just getting ready to blog about it! But yeah, recently, shopping for second hand clothes is really not a good look for me. DH, though, seems to be able to find really nice things and I don't have a problem finding clothes second-hand for the kids. For me? Pretty much everything is chewed up and I can't even understand why they'd waste their time trying to sell it! My local thrift store usually has a great selection of hand bags and since I used to be a real bag hound, it takes a lot for me to just.walk.away. I'm also really into kitchen stuff (pans, pots, knick-knacks). Today they had a whole set of cast-iron pans for like $10. I already have a set though.

Eilonwy, you sound just like me. I could be a size 12 sho' nuff if it weren't for the super ample jiggly belly of mine! Today, I had on my girdle and my size 12 skirt was practically falling off. I had to put on a belt. I get so embarrassed when ds2 tries to latch on to nurse at night and in the dark tries to latch on to my belly.







Good grief, son!









Welcome to all the new Tribe Members!







:


I may now be a size 6 after taking off almost 50 lbs but I too still have a jelly belly, I suspect she ain't going nowhere but its all good.







(sure the gym would help but with work and kids my only consistent exercise is walking) When dd was small I remember her trying to latch onto my belly...too funny.

Yeah, our local Goodwill is pretty iffy on clothes. Though in Maine we have these cool surplus stores where you can get reasonable priced stuff, think Big Lots but a tad better IMO and with clothes. Columbia, Bean, that sort of stuff.

The secondhand stores are good for dd generally, last week I found the cutest red wool coat with velvet collar for her but when it comes to ds, while he is amenable to 2nd hand stuff at 6'2 with a size 12 foot, most of the stuff is crap. He is officially expensive to shop for, thankfully he has a job so that takes some pressure off me but he liked Urban Outfitters, Abercrombie







:, that suff is not expensive. I just gave him some money to get his homecoming outfit $130 but he found everything on sale at Ralph Lauren. He's a good kid though and if his only vice is clothes, I don't mind helping out.

Right now he's rehearsing for the lead in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest so he can't work as many hours so I am giving cash here and there since it would be too much if he worked more than 8 hours a week at the moment with everything going on.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
soooo, what colors are welcome here?

don't mean that to sound flippant... serious question.

Hi there. Generally because the board is predominantly white, this tribe has been for non-white women to have a space to connect since for many of AP/NFL is even more foreign in minority communities than in white communities.









Hi there Shy, welcome







:

Shay


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
What does women of color mean to you? I'm not trying to be flip at all.

when others say it I assume they mean, non-white (although we all have a bit of everything mixed in... including white)...

if I were to use the term (which I don't) I would simply mean indivuals of a human nature.

but, I figured I was the minority in my thought and is why I wanted to ask members.


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
.
Hi there. Generally because the board is predominantly white, this tribe has been for non-white women to have a space to connect since for many of AP/NFL is even more foreign in minority communities than in white communities.









.
Shay

*sigh* dissappointed. thank you for answering my question


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
*sigh* dissappointed. thank you for answering my question

Disappointed? Why?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
when others say it I assume they mean, non-white (although we all have a bit of everything mixed in... including white)...

if I were to use the term (which I don't) I would simply mean indivuals of a human nature.

but, I figured I was the minority in my thought and is why I wanted to ask members.

is this one of those deals where we fail the test for admitting that we're not 'colorblind?' if you're interested in debating the merits of "colorblindness" (as in, "can't you be enlightened enough that there's no need to separate yourselves like this?" which is, i suspect, what you're getting at) feel free to let me know via PM... because it doesn't belong in this thread.

if, on the other hand, you're interested in hanging out here and are concerned that you'll be ejected from the group for being "too white" or for having babies that are too white or for being non-white but not being black, either, then you've got no worries. I've got three pale-eyed babies myself.


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
is this one of those deals where we fail the test for admitting that we're not 'colorblind?' if you're interested in debating the merits of "colorblindness" (as in, "can't you be enlightened enough that there's no need to separate yourselves like this?" which is, i suspect, what you're getting at) feel free to let me know via PM... because it doesn't belong in this thread.

if, on the other hand, you're interested in hanging out here and are concerned that you'll be ejected from the group for being "too white" or for having babies that are too white or for being non-white but not being black, either, then you've got no worries. I've got three pale-eyed babies myself.









honestly, i don't much believe in colorblind. i mean that in a positive way of course. too many people refuse to talk about color or race or comment on it in front of their kids. I'm not the kind of girl I guess. I have no problem saying something like, "wow, she has pretty skin" to my 3 year dd while referring to, for example, a black woman in a public place.

the second paragraph you listed was more my hang up. I don't find myself "fitting in" to very many clicks or groups reguardless of race. I just had that sinking feeling when I read the title of the tribe because that was just a blatent, "we don't really want you or people who look like you coming around here", and it has nothing to do with your personality, views, family type, or life experience.... simply your genetic background. I'm white... as far as I know anyway (there was that random photo of a black guy in the family history book my 2nd cousin has however...?







). I guess I don't put much social weight on race because I'm married to someone who isn't white... meaning, my interaction with people of another race besides my own is pretty 50/50. My dd and future ds are mixed and when I thought about the fact that some places or groups would allow one of us but not the other unnerved me a bit. I'd never thought of it that way but, when I did I really hated the idea that my dd (or I) could be excepted somewhere but, the other could not. I've never really had to think about the idea of race seperation between dd and I.... nor dh and I. So, I guess that even though it's a friendly place it makes me uncomfortable that dd, dh, or future ds would "qualify" but i would not.

I took it there, I read it that way... but, none the less it's somewhere clearly telling me I don't add up. I don't know... I guess I'd like to think it were a place where people who deal with race related matters can go to hang out... not just people with certian race related matters.

but, I get it. It's a safe place for a certain type of people. Maybe I shouldn't have asked... I sort of knew what I was going to get for an answer. It wasn't my place to question, it's not my house. Sorry to drag it out. If anyone is unomfortable with my posts I will not be offened if a moderator removes them. My bad, I'll back out.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
the second paragraph you listed was more my hang up. I don't find myself "fitting in" to very many clicks or groups regardless of race. I just had that sinking feeling when I read the title of the tribe because that was just a blatent, *"we don't really want you or people who look like you coming around here",* and it has nothing to do with your personality, views, family type, or life experience.... simply your genetic background. .

arooo??

the bolded emphasis was mine, it just kind of jumped out at me as a pretty negative view to take of a group of people and their motivations, especially when it's based solely on the title of the thread!!

from the top of the forum:

Quote:

Finding your Tribe Finding Your Tribe is forum for like-minded people to come together. Originally began as a place to find the people in your geographical area, it has evolved into a place where parents who have commonalities not hosted elsewhere on the boards can come together and chat. Please take a few moments to review the forum guidelines before posting!
this forum is filled with dozens of titles that have nothing to do with me... 'hula hooping mamas' - 'modest dressing mamas' - 'industrial hemp' etc. i didn't go into the modest dressing thread with my tank top wearing self and get a sinking feeling like i was being excluded. i found a tribe that seemed to resonate with my self-conception and jumped in.

there is no paper bag test to join this tribe, it's just about if you feel at home here - it's cool if you don't, and i appreciate that you mostly owned your own issues around that. but we're not in here excluding anybody.

FWIW, the issues you mention and the race-based points you bring up sound like the things i see discussed in the 'multicultural families' forum here on MDC, perhaps you can check there for the discussion you crave?

and in other news, i checked your pictures, and wowza - you are doing things with your eye makeup of which it has not even occurred to me to dream. you should start a tribe around that!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
My dd and future ds are mixed and when I thought about the fact that some places or groups would allow one of us but not the other unnerved me a bit. I'd never thought of it that way but, when I did I really hated the idea that my dd (or I) could be excepted somewhere but, the other could not. I've never really had to think about the idea of race seperation between dd and I.... nor dh and I. So, I guess that even though it's a friendly place it makes me uncomfortable that dd, dh, or future ds would "qualify" but i would not.

You mean you've never thought about it in this direction (i.e. discrimination against you) or you've never thought about it at all? Because I have a really, really, REALLY hard time believing that it's never happened that you've felt comfortable in a situation and your DH hasn't. As in, unless he's beyond oblivious or he pretty much looks white it's most assuredly happened, regardless of your awareness or lack thereof. It's something that you have to train yourself to see a lot of the time, but it's definately there. My mother still feels it every time she goes somewhere with one of her children or grandchildren; It's become part of her everyday experience.

I've met people much darker than myself, with much curlier hair and more black features who call themselves "white." I've met people much lighter than myself with perfectly straight hair who call themselves "black." That works for them, that's fine. I'm mixed, and I don't really feel comfortable calling myself one thing or another for my own reasons (I inevitably feel like I"m passing for something I'm not), so I identify myself as "mixed" or "multiracial" if I'm feeling sensitive [to other mixed people-- I don't really give a hoot about political correctness]. When I got here, I asked a similar question-- is it okay to be here if you're not black? I was welcomed, started hanging around here and have been here ever since. These ladies are spectacular, and nobody's kicked me out for only managing to produce one child of four with brown eyes.







If you don't feel welcome here, that's on you-- as Oyin said, there are tribes here where I don't feel welcome, either. This one, as most, I'd wager, is not about exclusion but inclusion of a specific group of people. If you've never been to Hawaii but you love the culture and you've always been fascinated by hula, I doubt the hula dancing mamms would kick you out.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Thanks for the hugs and baby dust! I am an emotional mess these days so the love is appreciated!


Well here is another hug!


----------



## purplegirl

Fondest Biana, I think Shay, eilonwy and Oyinmama have addressed your concerns in a most diplomatic manner. I feel that your original inquiry was disingenuous. In my opinion you came here to reinforce some negative beliefs about women of color and perhaps your discomfort about "fitting in". To that end, I am asking, as a mod that you find a tribe that best fits your needs. It is not appropriate, nor within the guidelines of the UA to debate the existence of a tribe; that is an adminstrative function.
If you have specific questions about a tribe or other forums, please post them in Questions and suggestions.

Oh and for the record, NO ONE has ever been made to feel uncomfortable or not welcomed based on race, color or country of origin in this tribe. Women of color tend to be most accepting and loving people!


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Fondest Biana, I think Shay, eilonwy and Oyinmama have addressed your concerns in a most diplomatic manner. I feel that your original inquiry was disingenuous. In my opinion you came here to reinforce some negative beliefs about women of color and perhaps your discomfort about "fitting in". To that end, I am asking, as a mod that you find a tribe that best fits your needs. It is not appropriate, nor within the guidelines of the UA to debate the existence of a tribe; that is an adminstrative function.
If you have specific questions about a tribe or other forums, please post them in Questions and suggestions.

Oh and for the record, NO ONE has ever been made to feel uncomfortable or not welcomed based on race, color or country of origin in this tribe. Women of color tend to be most accepting and loving people!









:


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
You mean you've never thought about it in this direction (i.e. discrimination against you) or you've never thought about it at all? Because I have a really, really, REALLY hard time believing that it's never happened that you've felt comfortable in a situation and your DH hasn't. As in, unless he's beyond oblivious or he pretty much looks white it's most assuredly happened, regardless of your awareness or lack thereof. It's something that you have to train yourself to see a lot of the time, but it's definately there. My mother still feels it every time she goes somewhere with one of her children or grandchildren; It's become part of her everyday experience.

I've met people much darker than myself, with much curlier hair and more black features who call themselves "white." I've met people much lighter than myself with perfectly straight hair who call themselves "black." That works for them, that's fine. I'm mixed, and I don't really feel comfortable calling myself one thing or another for my own reasons (I inevitably feel like I"m passing for something I'm not), so I identify myself as "mixed" or "multiracial" if I'm feeling sensitive [to other mixed people-- I don't really give a hoot about political correctness]. When I got here, I asked a similar question-- is it okay to be here if you're not black? I was welcomed, started hanging around here and have been here ever since. These ladies are spectacular, and nobody's kicked me out for only managing to produce one child of four with brown eyes.







If you don't feel welcome here, that's on you-- as Oyin said, there are tribes here where I don't feel welcome, either. This one, as most, I'd wager, is not about exclusion but inclusion of a specific group of people. If you've never been to Hawaii but you love the culture and you've always been fascinated by hula, I doubt the hula dancing mamms would kick you out.









I have felt racism before, plenty. both toward myself, and toward my dh. Dh used to be very involved in and compete in a professional sport where white was VERY much the minority as were females. I ended up fully emersed in it and had to learn to deal with the blatent discrimination toward me (not from all by any means mind you... it was just a few indivuals but, they were frequently nearby). So yes, I've felt it. I've also noticed the dirty looks here and there when dh and I are together in public by those who don't agree with interracial relationships. I've had people make racist comments around me not knowing I was married to a person of the race they were making fun of, and Ive had people flat out tell me, "oh, be careful. you need to watch out for those X. you know how they can be". I've never overheard anyone saying anything to dh about me being white but, I don't doubt it has happened.

what I had never thought about was that there would be an actual club or organization where my dh or children may be accepted but I was not. Most places even for race related matters will at least accept a white person if they feel connected to the issue or the rest of their immediate family falls into the category of non-white. A person shouldn't assume I've never felt out of place or discrimination simply because I'm white. What about a white person who grew up in a prodiminatly black neighborhood or in a foreign country like Mexico? I did neither but, I still know what it feels like and I certainly know what it's like not to be accepted.

I do understand that such a place for those who feel the minority based on white to other race ratio should have a place to "hang out" I just don't see why whites who feel totally comfortable hanging there wihtout bringing all thier white friends along shouldn't be welcome.

I was told that if I was "lighter skinned" that was ok. Meaning, if I was of non white background but not very dark I was allowed. What if I'm light skinned but it's BECAUSE I'm white.

Does anyone feel offended or like they are being invaded if a white person hangs around the group? Are there any white people in the group?


----------



## I-AM-Mother

FondestBianca,

I couldn't help but notice that you now have 940 posts, is this your first time ever seeing the WOC tribe?


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Fondest Biana, I think Shay, eilonwy and Oyinmama have addressed your concerns in a most diplomatic manner. I feel that your original inquiry was disingenuous. In my opinion you came here to reinforce some negative beliefs about women of color and perhaps your discomfort about "fitting in". To that end, I am asking, as a mod that you find a tribe that best fits your needs. It is not appropriate, nor within the guidelines of the UA to debate the existence of a tribe; that is an adminstrative function.
If you have specific questions about a tribe or other forums, please post them in Questions and suggestions.

Oh and for the record, NO ONE has ever been made to feel uncomfortable or not welcomed based on race, color or country of origin in this tribe. Women of color tend to be most accepting and loving people!

gottcha. and as you have your assumptions about my willingness to accept I have mine as well. missed your comment before I made another earlier. But, if I'm making you uncomfortable then there is no way you will even allow yourself to see my POV and probably the same goes for me. I will back my way out as I dont' want to make anyone feel uncomfortable.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Fondest Biana, I think Shay, eilonwy and Oyinmama have addressed your concerns in a most diplomatic manner. I feel that your original inquiry was disingenuous. In my opinion you came here to reinforce some negative beliefs about women of color and perhaps your discomfort about "fitting in". To that end, I am asking, as a mod that you find a tribe that best fits your needs. It is not appropriate, nor within the guidelines of the UA to debate the existence of a tribe; that is an adminstrative function.
If you have specific questions about a tribe or other forums, please post them in Questions and suggestions.

Oh and for the record, NO ONE has ever been made to feel uncomfortable or not welcomed based on race, color or country of origin in this tribe. Women of color tend to be most accepting and loving people!









:

FondestBianca, i think you need to take your questions and concerns to the mods themselves at this point.


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *I-AM-Mother* 
FondestBianca,

I couldn't help but notice that you now have 940 posts, is this your first time ever seeing the WOC tribe?

I'll address this before I leave! no, it isn't... I've noticed it plenty of times. Just never felt it was something intended for me which always bothered me but, I guess I was just finally in a mood to go out on a limb and try to wedge my way into a group that I thought addressed many of my frustrations about race... but, I did also expect that being white would not allow me to be a part of the conversation. i'm one of the few people who will address race and not just push them under the rug BUT, there isn't much of a forum for that where white people will be taken seriously or included. I wasn't sure if this was somewhere to discuss racial issue we all face or somewhere for people to "get away" from race issues. I guess I have a better understanding of the group now...? Either way, I've made some feel uncomfortable so I won't address any further comment here and stay out of other's business.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
gottcha. and as you have your assumptions about my willingness to accept I have mine as well. missed your comment before I made another earlier. But, if I'm making you uncomfortable then there is no way you will even allow yourself to see my POV and probably the same goes for me. I will back my way out as I dont' want to make anyone feel uncomfortable.

Let me be clear, there is no way you could ever make me feel uncomfortable. I stand by my statement that you came here with assumptions about a group, rather than a sincere desire to want to bond and share commonalities. Again, you are most welcomed to stay *if* that is your desire, but this tribe will not be used for you to work through your issues with difference. Sorry, that is not our burden.


----------



## FondestBianca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 







:

FondestBianca, i think you need to take your questions and concerns to the mods themselves at this point.

already did. should have done that first. i understand the missplaced questioning on my part. Appology.

and I'm REALLY done now. promise. just wanted to address anything to me personally.

sorry ladies.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *FondestBianca* 
already did. should have done that first. i understand the missplaced questioning on my part. Appology.

and I'm REALLY done now. promise. just wanted to address anything to me personally.

sorry ladies.

you shouldn't have second guessed yourself. i noticed that you said in one of your previous post you sort of knew the answers you were going to get. one thing that most people will not do is disappoint, we are no different.


----------



## rootzdawta

Go on ----> Brush Your Shoulders Off.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Go on ----> Brush Your Shoulders Off.











Have we ever kicked someone out for being white? I can remember one or two white parents of multiracial kids popping in here to ask questions, but I don't think any of them stayed...









I get mistaken for white all the time, does that count?







: I still remember when I started posting pictures of the kids and Jeca asked, "I know we've been over this, but are you sure you're a MOC?" (See, that was back when we weren't politically correct and ASSummed everyone participating was a *mother*.) I only had BeanBean and a belly full of BooBah at the time, so it was before Bean's eyes had even turned green they were just pale blue, the way Bear's are now.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 









Have we ever kicked someone out for being white? I can remember one or two white parents of multiracial kids popping in here to ask questions, but I don't think any of them stayed...









I get mistaken for white all the time, does that count?







: I still remember when I started posting pictures of the kids and Jeca asked, "I know we've been over this, but are you sure you're a MOC?" (See, that was back when we weren't politically correct and ASSummed everyone participating was a *mother*.) I only had BeanBean and a belly full of BooBah at the time, so it was before Bean's eyes had even turned green they were just pale blue, the way Bear's are now.









: I'm sorry but that made me laugh. I have seen your pics and while you are definitely fair, I think I knew you were a WOC.

Seriously this is a great group but IMO if one wants to talk issues connected to raising multicultural kids or multicultural unions I think the multicultural forum is a better place.

On to other things, just got back from taking dd to her first trip to the railroad museum which included a ride on a old fashioned 20's style trolley car. Sigh... I miss city living so much. DD loved the ride and immediately was like I want to take the train again. LOL We really need to get into beantown soon.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Yeah, I didn't have any pictures of myself around but I had some cute ones of BeanBean. Bear is probably the whitest looking of all my babies, followed by Bean (which is ironic, because Bean looks most like me). BooBah looks decidedly mixed, despite her light brown/dark blonde hair and electric blue eyes, and Bella looks quite mixed as well though she looks like she's got a prettified version of Mike's head on the body of a very petite two year old girl.







I make a concerted effort not to look "white" or "black" or "Native American" these days. I think I do a pretty good job of it, because people are perpetually confused.









My kids have been to the Strasburg Railroad (it's not even a daytrip from the ILs or my mom's house) and absolutely loved it. MIL works at a tourist-oriented place in the county, so she's got good connections when it comes to that sort of thing. She also knows where all of the free fun things for kids to do are happening.







The Toy Train Museum is a ton of fun for kiddos.







Bean and BooBah had an absolute blast there last year.







And, as I recall, it's free.







:

BeanBean is going with his grandparents on their annual pilgramage to Colonial Williamsburg. Apparently they want to take a different kid every year, or take a different kid on different trips every year. I think that's actually quite cool of them, and with Bean cyberschooling we've totally got the flexibility to do that without even asking permission of anyone-- all I have to do is send along a few papers and ask MIL to keep track of how much time they spend doing what so that I can count it as school time.







Fantastic. It shouldn't be difficult at all, because Bean is quite small and I'm going to want to talk to him each evening.







I can get the hours then and just log them in. I hope he has a really good time.







: I've never actually been to Colonial Williamsburg, so I can't tell him what to expect.









I'd like to do more field trips and outings this year, but I can't see that happening as I don't know where I'm going to be living in a month.







: Ugh. I don't want to think about it, I just want to move.







:


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I get mistaken for white all the time, does that count?







: I still remember when I started posting pictures of the kids and Jeca asked, "I know we've been over this, but are you sure you're a MOC?" .

I've been MIA but had to jump in and say in my defense I only saw pics of her kids at that point.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I've been MIA but had to jump in and say in my defense I only saw pics of her kids at that point.









Well now missy, it's good to see you back round these parts!!







:


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Well now missy, it's good to see you back round these parts!!







:

Thanks! I have accomplished many things in my short absense so it was for a good cause. This thread has been jumping while I was gone that's good to see. Now I have to go read up.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Well, I like the tribes because they are more specific to my interests and identity. I can only speak for myself but I myself am still living and learning and trying to become more self-aware. I do not want to pass down the prejudices that were passed onto to me by my parents. so I learn and read, and reflect. I'm sort of mixed myself and so is my daughter but I know if I wanted to talk about how hard it is to be married to some one of a different race that I would just go over to the Multicultural forum. This is a forum where I just want to hang with other women of color..

because it is crucial to have a mirror every now and then and just relax. tiresome, otoh, to be the teacher, the token, the spokesperson or the person on the defensive (because one too many racially charged statements have been made in your presence and suddenly I'm the PC Police. ugh). (holy run-on sentence!).

just my 2 cents.









In other news, this weekend has been extremely relaxing around here. Overcast and a little rainy.







. I miss this weather so I'm making curry sauce, baked fish, and steamed rice. I can't wait till it's ready! and OH, I'm going to update my netflix.. Does anyone have any recs for a sappy, dramedy, yet intelligent movie?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Does anyone have any recs for a sappy, dramedy, yet intelligent movie?

The Holiday, The Baxter, Jersey Girl.

I've got this friend I've been chatting with online for about two years now (wow, has it been that long?!). He got really tired at one point of me not getting his movie references (I've been in a bit of a pop culture void since Bean's birth), so he made me a list of movies and said, "Put these into your Netflix queue."







I'm nearly at the end of his list, but I saw a lot of good things that way which I never would have pursued otherwise. The three movies above were all on his list, and they totally fit the bill as sappy dramedies, but are somewhat intelligent.







Oh! I loved Chocolat, I need to buy that one as soon as I have a few bucks to rub together.

In sorry news, a few weeks ago (maybe a whole month?) I bought the South Park movie because it was in the $5 bin at WalMart. It was a huge thing, because the little 17 year old girl at the checkout made me go to the car and get my ID-- apparently i don't look old enough to buy R rated movies. I mean I can almost understand getting carded buying booze but I do not for a minute believe that I look like I'm less than 17 years old... but I digress. The point is, I haven't seen the movie (or my ID







: ) since! I don't knwo where I put them!!







: I'm so miserable about this, I really wanted to watch it. Meh.


----------



## gabysmom617

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
The Holiday, The Baxter, Jersey Girl.

I've got this friend I've been chatting with online for about two years now (wow, has it been that long?!). He got really tired at one point of me not getting his movie references (I've been in a bit of a pop culture void since Bean's birth), so he made me a list of movies and said, "Put these into your Netflix queue."







I'm nearly at the end of his list, but I saw a lot of good things that way which I never would have pursued otherwise. The three movies above were all on his list, and they totally fit the bill as sappy dramedies, but are somewhat intelligent.







Oh! I loved Chocolat, I need to buy that one as soon as I have a few bucks to rub together.

*In sorry news, a few weeks ago (maybe a whole month?) I bought the South Park movie because it was in the $5 bin at WalMart. It was a huge thing, because the little 17 year old girl at the checkout made me go to the car and get my ID-- apparently i don't look old enough to buy R rated movies. I mean I can almost understand getting carded buying booze but I do not for a minute believe that I look like I'm less than 17 years old... but I digress. The point is, I haven't seen the movie (or my ID







: ) since! I don't knwo where I put them!!







: I'm so miserable about this, I really wanted to watch it. Meh*.

I dunno. I'd like to think I'd have been beaming from ear-to-ear for the rest of the day after that one, but it does sound annoying. Sorry you lost the items, though.

Found out last week I was anemic. In retrospect, I was tired and forgetful all the time. I lost my credit card somewhere along the way during that time. I can totally relate to losing stuff. My husband says I seem a bit more rejuvenated since I started iron pills.


----------



## eilonwy

Anemia is the bane of my existance.


----------



## Sugarshoc

You know, I need to see Chocolat. I've been wanting to see that movie for years and for some reason, I never get to it. I have a touch of anemia. I take Floradix Iron & Herbs supplement and I love it.


----------



## Brown Lioness

You know, every time ive been the doctor in the past few years, I ask if Im anemic because i have many of the symptoms and each time they swear up and down that im not anemic.
My mother does have thyroid problems too, so then I wonder if thas it, but then the doctors swear that my thyroid is fine too.

QUOTE=gabysmom617;12231432]I dunno. I'd like to think I'd have been beaming from ear-to-ear for the rest of the day after that one, but it does sound annoying. Sorry you lost the items, though.

Found out last week I was anemic. In retrospect, I was tired and forgetful all the time. I lost my credit card somewhere along the way during that time. I can totally relate to losing stuff. My husband says I seem a bit more rejuvenated since I started iron pills.[/QUOTE]


----------



## eilonwy

There are a couple different kinds of anemia; Mine is not usually from an iron deficiency, per se. Iron supplementation helps me, but not as much as it could... and if I go too far, I can get worse. I have to make things overly complicated.









Chocolat is a beautiful movie, I highly recommend it.


----------



## gabysmom617

My midwife's office called me and told me my hemoglobin was pretty low on the same morning I had a WIC appointment. And the WIC lady told me it was very low. She gave me all these food/meal recommendation papers about how and what to eat to get it up. It kind of shocked me because I had never been before, even with the last pregnancy, so i dunno. This pregnancy is very different. I'm swollen up all over the place. Unlike last time. At the same time I'm not throwing up every week-to every other day until the very end, unlike last time. It seems so odd to have such different pregnancy experiences for the same lady.


----------



## Draupadi

I'm pretty sure I'm anemic too (among other things). My diet's not the best all the time and I'm a vegetarian, so you know I need to get it together.
My tiredness...well, I get that from co-sleeping, but that's another story...


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
It seems so odd to have such different pregnancy experiences for the same lady.









They're all remarkably different. With Bean I had HG, I was on bedrest from about 25 weeks, in agonizing pain the whole time... It was *insane*. With BooBah, I felt so fantastic that I couldn't really believe I was pregnant until I started moving. I had contractions *once* during that pregnancy, and when I drank half a gallon of water and sat on my butt for an hour they went away. At one point I got a tension headache and asked for a massage, and I had to laugh-- it was the worst pain I'd had that pregnancy, and it was so minor that it wouldn't even have registered during the first. With Bean I was wishing desperately for the end of the pregnancy by 34 weeks; With BooBah, I got to 38w6d and thought, "I could easily do this for another month." If every pregnancy was like mine with BooBah, people would have 12-25 children all the time.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm pretty sure I'm anemic too (among other things). My diet's not the best all the time and I'm a vegetarian, so you know I need to get it together.
My tiredness...well, I get that from co-sleeping, but that's another story...

The veg diet is soooo hard for me.


----------



## rootzdawta

You know, I have tried for almost 6 years at vegetarianism until I finally accepted that I need to have some animal products almost daily it seems. 3/4ths of my hair has broken off--it's been doing this in cycles for the 6 years I was veg., my allergies are worse than ever, and my intestinal health is in the toilet. I can't tell you ladies how adamant and hard-core I was about vegetarianism and how I felt everyone should be vegetarian. It has been such a learning experience having to let go of something I felt so passionately about. I'm eagerly looking forward to regaining my wellness, though.

So if veg*nism is hard for you, don't push it. Do it little by little and take time to evaluate how you feel at every step. It works fabulously for some folks and for others, not so much.


----------



## eilonwy

I can't be a veg*an. I just can't manage it; I don't process artificial b-vitamins very well, and I'm a carrier for a genetic dealie which causes severe anemia, one which makes it very difficult (if not impossible) to live healthfully as a veg*an. In fact, it's not at all uncommon amongst AA populations (though I got mine from my mother







). Be aware of it-- some people really can't live on veggies alone!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
So if veg*nism is hard for you, don't push it. Do it little by little and take time to evaluate how you feel at every step. It works fabulously for some folks and for others, not so much.









: I tried the veg path many years ago and it was not for me, but what I did take from it was that I didn't need to eat nearly as much meat as I had previously consumed. I think for some folks its an easy path but for some like myself it was a struggle and when you have to struggle that hard, I think its important to get clarity on why you are doing it? Ethical reasons? Health? For me, I just assumed it would be healthier but actually it wasn't all all. My body works best with a small amount of meat and generally will let me know when I overindulge.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

I've dabbled in the veg*an lifestyle since I was a teen. I'm not a big fan of meat but every now and then, I crave it. Since I had fibroids, I have been significantly anemic and am going through a spell now. I consume lots of beans, kale and take feo sol daily. I hate taking iron supplements cause you know they cause, well you know. However, my hemo was so low that last time, I had to be transfused. I don't want to go through that again.
As for health issues, I have been sure to walk just about every day. I try to do 3 miles but sometimes fall short of that goal due to time limits. I feel so much better and my stress level has decreased. I tend to be pretty high strung and needed to implement something that would keep me grounded







. So far, the walking has helped. As the weather changes, I will probably go back to the gym and start weight training again. I detest winter but know I have to plan for getting exercise so I don't get into a funk


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: I tried the veg path many years ago and it was not for me, but what I did take from it was that I didn't need to eat nearly as much meat as I had previously consumed. I think for some folks its an easy path but for some like myself it was a struggle and when you have to struggle that hard, I think its important to get clarity on why you are doing it? Ethical reasons? Health? For me, I just assumed it would be healthier but actually it wasn't all all. My body works best with a small amount of meat and generally will let me know when I overindulge. Shay

like teddy riley use to say, "*yup,yup*."


----------



## Brown Lioness

I wish the misconception that veganism and vegetarianism (are those really words? lol) is automatically healthy would be broken (although i know many believe that eating meat is poison to your body not to mention the ethics of eating something that has feelings at one point). I have met plenty of vegans and vegetarians whose diets weren't healthy at all.

My husband thinks he wants to be vegetarian (right now he doesnt like eating beef or any meat off the bone) and I am willing to support him. However, i do think he wants to be vegetarian because he thinks it will help him lost weight. It could, but he's not put in the planning and preparation that it takes to be and stay a vegetarian. Hopefully, one day he can make that switch if it so pleases him, but for now, i think he's bought into the idea that any diet that drastically cuts what you eat will help him lose weight in reality, if he would only eat more often with better portions and move everyday, the weight will melt off.

I have fanstasies of becoming a pescatarian (veggies and seafood), but i doubt that will happen, lol.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

So if veg*nism is hard for you, don't push it. Do it little by little and take time to evaluate how you feel at every step. It works fabulously for some folks and for others, not so much.

I've been a veg*n for over 23 years now (I was 14 when I became one!) and I probably couldn't eat meat if I wanted to. The idea of it gives me the heebie jeebies so badly. For me, it's not so much a health thing as it is that the idea of eating meat is just repugnant to me.
Don't get me wrong- when I smell a burger or chicken, I sometimes think, "Wow- that sure smells GOOD!!!", but I just can't bring myself to eat it.
My DH keeps saying he's going to hire a hypnotist to make me eat meat. He thought I'd crave it when I was pregnant with William, but no such luck.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
I wish the misconception that veganism and vegetarianism (are those really words? lol) is automatically healthy would be broken (although i know many believe that eating meat is poison to your body not to mention the ethics of eating something that has feelings at one point). I have met plenty of vegans and vegetarians whose diets weren't healthy at all.

.









:
That would be me.
I love comfort food (butter, milk and cream, cheeses, and anything fried!). If it wasn't for my DH who is soooooo healthy, I'd be the size of a house.
I love veggies too, but I do tend to eat a little too much of the bad stuff.
Right now, I have a mild obsession with this artichoke pizza that they sell in a local pizza place. It's artichoke, spinach, cheese and some sort of creamy sauce that is just sooo addictive. It's a heart attack on a crust but oh-so-good!







I can only eat that once every week/every two weeks.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Since I had fibroids, I have been significantly anemic and am going through a spell now. (

Hmmm! I didn't know fibroids caused anemia. That could explain a lot.
When I was pregnant, they found a small fibroid during an ultrasound. I was told not to worry too much about it, but I'm starting to think that it may be the root of some issues I'm having.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hmmm! I didn't know fibroids caused anemia. That could explain a lot.
When I was pregnant, they found a small fibroid during an ultrasound. I was told not to worry too much about it, but I'm starting to think that it may be the root of some issues I'm having.

Yupper. They are like blook suckers. Make sure your medical practitioner keeps an eye on the fibroid. They can grow and you can "sprout" more.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Do OBs check for fibroids during pap smears and annual exams? Is that what they are checking for when they feel around on your lower stomach with the two fingers inside?

Now im 'noid I could have cysts or fibroids too. My mother recently found out she has an ovarian cyst even tho her doc told it is nothing to worry about.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Do OBs check for fibroids during pap smears and annual exams? Is that what they are checking for when they feel around on your lower stomach with the two fingers inside?

Now im 'noid I could have cysts or fibroids too. My mother recently found out she has an ovarian cyst even tho her doc told it is nothing to worry about.

I don't know that it is something that they check for. A doc might pick up on them in the examination if, they are growing on the outside of the uterus or if she can palpate them.

Normally a doc suspects fibroids because the patient is complaining about heavy periods, distended belly and being tired all the time. Fibroids are very common in black women so with those symptoms, the doc would certainly (or should) refer for an ultrasound and blood work. Fibroids are almost always benign and only a problem if they cause heavy bleeding, anemia, interfere with conception or cause pain. There are different types of fibroids that can only be determined by magnetic imaging. They can grow and some say are influenced by a woman's eating habits, etc. That's not been proved scientifically, but I strongly suspect that my coffee habit contributed to mine growing out of control. I tried everything to get them to shrink naturally all to no avail. If you decide to have them removed, do the research and find a really skilled, fibroid experienced doctor. Most doctors will tell you that you need to take lupron







or have a hysterectomy. Don't believe it. My ob/gyn told me that mine were too large and that if she tried to remove them, I'd bleed such that she'd have to do a hysterectomy. NOT! I searched and found an awesome reproductive endocrinologist who did not flinch when he saw how large mine were ( I have pics of them). He sucessfully removed them without any ill consequences! The man is the bomb!
My best to all who are dealing the the roids!


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
You know, I have tried for almost 6 years at vegetarianism until I finally accepted that I need to have some animal products almost daily it seems. 3/4ths of my hair has broken off--it's been doing this in cycles for the 6 years I was veg., my allergies are worse than ever, and my intestinal health is in the toilet. I can't tell you ladies how adamant and hard-core I was about vegetarianism and how I felt everyone should be vegetarian. It has been such a learning experience having to let go of something I felt so passionately about. I'm eagerly looking forward to regaining my wellness, though.

So if veg*nism is hard for you, don't push it. Do it little by little and take time to evaluate how you feel at every step. It works fabulously for some folks and for others, not so much.

Yeah. I have come to realize that a little bit of meat is ok. It is the fact that majority of us consume entirely too much of it. I believe balance is key.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 







:
That would be me.
I love comfort food (butter, milk and cream, cheeses, and anything fried!). If it wasn't for my DH who is soooooo healthy, I'd be the size of a house.
I love veggies too, but I do tend to eat a little too much of the bad stuff.
Right now, I have a mild obsession with this artichoke pizza that they sell in a local pizza place. It's artichoke, spinach, cheese and some sort of creamy sauce that is just sooo addictive. It's a heart attack on a crust but oh-so-good!







I can only eat that once every week/every two weeks.

See, for me I battle with dairy, because of how the cows are treated especially on factory farms. I hate the idea of knowing that the calf the milk was intended for did not get to nurse its mother. I mean the reason milk is produced is to feed its off spring not humans. So I'm still dealing with it mentally, its hard t give it up cold turkey because it is a "comfort" food. By the way did anyone hear about Ben and Jerry's breastmilk ice cream?


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
See, for me I battle with dairy, because of how the cows are treated especially on factory farms. *I hate the idea of knowing that the calf the milk was intended for did not get to nurse its mother. I mean the reason milk is produced is to feed its off spring not humans.* So I'm still dealing with it mentally, its hard t give it up cold turkey because it is a "comfort" food. By the way did anyone hear about Ben and Jerry's breastmilk ice cream?

what a way to put it out there...

then i started feeling real bad when i got down to the bolded part. here i am a certified nurser, dedicated to my child's health and well-being, but at the same time destroying the bond between another mother & child. (i wonder if it matters that it is a different kind of animal than i am)

what a way to word it.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
See, for me I battle with dairy, because of how the cows are treated especially on factory farms. I hate the idea of knowing that the calf the milk was intended for did not get to nurse its mother. I mean the reason milk is produced is to feed its off spring not humans. So I'm still dealing with it mentally, its hard t give it up cold turkey because it is a "comfort" food. By the way did anyone hear about Ben and Jerry's breastmilk ice cream?


I heard about Peta asking Ben and Jerry's to use breastmilk for their ice cream! I actually told DH that I was going to make ice cream from my breast milk and that he was going to eat it! He winced but I said "why do you have no problem drinking and eating products derived from a random cow's "breast"?" I had to fight him to make him buy the soy vanilla ice cream instead of breyers.

But in regards to vegetarianism and veganism, I have been all over the place with it. I was a strict vegan for awhile, then I moved to Paris and started eating meat again except beef and pork. Then I came back to the States and became veg again. I have also had a couple of stints with raw veganism... I think I was the thinnest I had ever been in my adult life last summer when I was raw vegan and training for a 10k race. Now I am all about moderation. Every body is different and I understand now that the perfect diet for me is not the perfect diet for another. I now incorporate fish into my diet from time to time, maybe a few times a month. I plan on raising DS mostly vegetarian but he will eat fish too. Dh is not veg, doesn't eat pork though. I stress with him health and quality of food sources. When I buy groceries for him, I'll get free range chicken fed organic grains for example. I am trying to get him to eat more fruit, he's such a meat and potatoes type guy! Bless his heart for trying to be veg once a few years back!


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I heard about Peta asking Ben and Jerry's to use breastmilk for their ice cream! I actually told DH that I was going to make ice cream from my breast milk and that he was going to eat it! He winced but I said "why do you have no problem drinking and eating products derived from a random cow's "breast"?" I had to fight him to make him buy the soy vanilla ice cream instead of breyers.

But in regards to vegetarianism and veganism, I have been all over the place with it. I was a strict vegan for awhile, then I moved to Paris and started eating meat again except beef and pork. Then I came back to the States and became veg again. I have also had a couple of stints with raw veganism... I think I was the thinnest I had ever been in my adult life last summer when I was raw vegan and training for a 10k race. Now I am all about moderation. Every body is different and I understand now that the perfect diet for me is not the perfect diet for another. I now incorporate fish into my diet from time to time, maybe a few times a month. I plan on raising DS mostly vegetarian but he will eat fish too. Dh is not veg, doesn't eat pork though. I stress with him health and quality of food sources. When I buy groceries for him, I'll get free range chicken fed organic grains for example. I am trying to get him to eat more fruit, he's such a meat and potatoes type guy! Bless his heart for trying to be veg once a few years back!









Totally understand. I am all about moderation, the hardest for me has been sugar *yikes*, I have an on going candida problem and sugar is the evil culprit.


----------



## eilonwy

*sigh* I love ice cream. I don't get much, but I love it and I want more.







:


----------



## Brown Lioness

MEE, i want some breast milk ice cream!!! I was a breastfed baby (not sure for how long tho) and so im not scurred, lol.

But ishreal DID break it down fa reals, got me lookin at my milk sideways now, lol.

Thanks for the heads up, purplegirl @the fibroids. Im glad you found a doctor willing to do what was healthiest for you! I pray that I dont have the 'roids (lol), but if I ever do, i pray i catch them early and find a doctor like yours to work with.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
See, for me I battle with dairy, because of how the cows are treated especially on factory farms. I hate the idea of knowing that the calf the milk was intended for did not get to nurse its mother. I mean the reason milk is produced is to feed its off spring not humans. So I'm still dealing with it mentally, its hard t give it up cold turkey because it is a "comfort" food. By the way did anyone hear about Ben and Jerry's breastmilk ice cream?

I know what you mean about dairy farms and all, but it's always been just too difficult for me to give up dairy. I just love cream and butter and cheese a little too much...


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I heard about Peta asking Ben and Jerry's to use breastmilk for their ice cream! I actually told DH that I was going to make ice cream from my breast milk and that he was going to eat it! He winced but I said "why do you have no problem drinking and eating products derived from a random cow's "breast"?" I had to fight him to make him buy the soy vanilla ice cream instead of breyers.

But in regards to vegetarianism and veganism, I have been all over the place with it. I was a strict vegan for awhile, then I moved to Paris and started eating meat again except beef and pork. Then I came back to the States and became veg again. I have also had a couple of stints with raw veganism... I think I was the thinnest I had ever been in my adult life last summer when I was raw vegan and training for a 10k race. Now I am all about moderation. Every body is different and I understand now that the perfect diet for me is not the perfect diet for another. I now incorporate fish into my diet from time to time, maybe a few times a month. I plan on raising DS mostly vegetarian but he will eat fish too. Dh is not veg, doesn't eat pork though. I stress with him health and quality of food sources. When I buy groceries for him, I'll get free range chicken fed organic grains for example. I am trying to get him to eat more fruit, he's such a meat and potatoes type guy! Bless his heart for trying to be veg once a few years back!









I'm not sure if I could do someone else's breastmilk. My own- yes.
I just don't think it would be possible for them to get that much breastmilk. Do you?
I mean, it seems to be so in-demand, doesn't it?
My DH is not vegetarian at all, but he eats what I cook and doesn't complain. Unfortunately, I think my vegetarian lifestyle has made him thinner than he was when we first met.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
*sigh* I love ice cream. I don't get much, but I love it and I want more.







:

Me, too.







:
I just love it soooo much.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm not sure if I could do someone else's breastmilk. My own- yes.
I just don't think it would be possible for them to get that much breastmilk. Do you?
I mean, it seems to be so in-demand, doesn't it?
My DH is not vegetarian at all, but he eats what I cook and doesn't complain. Unfortunately, I think my vegetarian lifestyle has made him thinner than he was when we first met.

Yeah other people's breast milk sounds weird to me. But my own, I could see myself using it in recipes. My DH LOVES my cooking and if I cooked all the time, everyday, he would probably be almost a complete vegetarian with the occasional fish thrown in there. But I am just too tired after work to cook all the time... Sometimes I feel bad about it but oh well. My DH has actually gained weight since we first met. I think his metabolism is slowing down...


----------



## eilonwy

You know... I don't think it would bother me once I got over the initial shock of the idea that I was consuming human milk from some strange woman. After all, drinking milk from cows is just plain weird. I say this as a person who would GLADLY drink two or three Starbucks mochas a day (venti/five shots/no whip/extra extra hot) if I had the disposeable income, and who would be very happy to have ice cream three or six times a week. I mean I thought of it ages ago-- there's nothing remotely natural or normal about drinking milk from a cow. It's odd. What kind of animal deliberately drinks another animal's milk? And as an adult, no less! You don't see grown up dogs trying to drink milk from goats, do you? Or adult guinea pigs trying to nurse from sheep? Of course not-- that'd be ridiculous. Humans drinking cow's milk is just as ridiculous.

It's delicious, though.







: I don't drink straight milk but if I had six bucks in my pocket it'd last long enough for me to get to Starbucks.







:


----------



## nnaemeka

hey ladies.

has anyone heard that fibroids may be linked to dairy consumption?
we are pesetarians (sp?) i.e. we eat fish no chix or other meats. my west african hubby loves fish and cooks it delicously several times a week. i was a vegetarian for years and for awhile there had very limited dairy. it felt great. i also was very into fasting a couple times a year as well treating myself to several colonics. i followed Queen Afua's fasting program and was feeling and looking great. but during my pregnancy i started eating what i craved. ice cream and pizza made quite a comeback. sigh. well, having the grad school blues before didn't help my gut either. so 2 months postpartum i'm attempting to get back on track again. i'm not trying that hard however







.

anyways, wishing health and happiness to you all!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
hey ladies.

has anyone heard that fibroids may be linked to dairy consumption?
we are pesetarians (sp?) i.e. we eat fish no chix or other meats. my west african hubby loves fish and cooks it delicously several times a week. i was a vegetarian for years and for awhile there had very limited dairy. it felt great. i also was very into fasting a couple times a year as well treating myself to several colonics. i followed Queen Afua's fasting program and was feeling and looking great. but during my pregnancy i started eating what i craved. ice cream and pizza made quite a comeback. sigh. well, having the grad school blues before didn't help my gut either. so 2 months postpartum i'm attempting to get back on track again. i'm not trying that hard however







.

anyways, wishing health and happiness to you all!

I've heard this, but not sure it has been proved scientifically . I don't consume much dairy. The most I have is a couple of teaspoons in my coffee--well, when I was drinking coffee. However, I am a believer that what we consume contributes to fibroids, with all of the hormone additives, etc, I would assume there's a link there.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I say this as a person who would GLADLY drink two or three Starbucks mochas a day (venti/five shots/no whip/extra extra hot) if I had the disposeable income, and who would be very happy to have ice cream three or six times a week. I mean I thought of it ages ago-- there's nothing remotely natural or normal about drinking milk from a cow. It's odd. What kind of animal deliberately drinks another animal's milk? And as an adult, no less! You don't see grown up dogs trying to drink milk from goats, do you? Or adult guinea pigs trying to nurse from sheep? Of course not-- that'd be ridiculous. Humans drinking cow's milk is just as ridiculous.

It's delicious, though.







: I don't drink straight milk but if I had six bucks in my pocket it'd last long enough for me to get to Starbucks.







:

Dude, don't worry once I can assure you I have drank enough Starbucks in my lifetime for you and Me. I am extra hot 180 degree mocha girl too, though as of late my drink is a misto with 2 pumps of mocha. I have gone from many Starbucks a day to 1 every 1-2 days. LOL

I gotta be honest ice cream made from breastmilk just would not be my thing. I am not a huge dairy person, only milk I drink comes from a local farm, its not raw but this milk is amazing, taste nothing like the mlk I grew up with and generally does not make me bloated like most milk when I drink it straight.

Our weekend plans (fall festival) have been rained out due to a weekend of rain, its gonna be a long weekend. Dh wants to take dd to Chuckie E Cheese, can I say I hate that place plus its gonna be packed due to the rain. Ugh..

Shay


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
hey ladies.

has anyone heard that fibroids may be linked to dairy consumption?
we are pesetarians (sp?) i.e. we eat fish no chix or other meats. my west african hubby loves fish and cooks it delicously several times a week. i was a vegetarian for years and for awhile there had very limited dairy. it felt great. i also was very into fasting a couple times a year as well treating myself to several colonics. i followed Queen Afua's fasting program and was feeling and looking great. but during my pregnancy i started eating what i craved. ice cream and pizza made quite a comeback. sigh. well, having the grad school blues before didn't help my gut either. so 2 months postpartum i'm attempting to get back on track again. i'm not trying that hard however







.

anyways, wishing health and happiness to you all!

All this talk about Fibroid tumors, I need to go get checked. Is there anything special they do?


----------



## Autumn C.

Hi,

I just found this forum and I hope it's O.K. that I jump right in with a topic.

I read an article in "ESSENCE" about triple negative cancer "TNC" (an aggressive form of cancer found most frequently in African American and Latina women) and it offhandely mentioned that BF'ing was a good predictor for NOT getting this.

Anybody heard about this? I've been able to find info on TNC but without mentioning the BFing issue.

http://www.cancer.org/docroot/NWS/co..._Ethnicity.asp


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Hi,

I just found this forum and I hope it's O.K. that I jump right in with a topic.

I read an article in "ESSENCE" about triple negative cancer "TNC" (an aggressive form of cancer found most frequently in African American and Latina women) and it offhandely mentioned that BF'ing was a good predictor for NOT getting this.

Anybody heard about this? I've been able to find info on TNC but without mentioning the BFing issue.

Welcome!
I can't comment on this particular disease but breastfeeding in general is said to reduce your risk for breast and cervical cancer. I can't remember the source but will try to find the link that says for x amount of years a woman nurses her risk of cervical cancer reduces by x percent. I will look for it tomarrow.
Welcome to everyone else I missed also.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Hi,

I just found this forum and I hope it's O.K. that I jump right in with a topic.

I read an article in "ESSENCE" about triple negative cancer "TNC" (an aggressive form of cancer found most frequently in African American and Latina women) and it offhandely mentioned that BF'ing was a good predictor for NOT getting this.

Anybody heard about this? I've been able to find info on TNC but without mentioning the BFing issue.

http://www.cancer.org/docroot/NWS/co..._Ethnicity.asp

Welcome AutumnC.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
All this talk about Fibroid tumors, I need to go get checked. Is there anything special they do?


Actually, there's no need to get checked unless you suspect you have them. The typical symptoms are: heavy periods, thickening around your middle, discomfort during sex and anemia. If you have any of these symptoms, ask your practitioner to check during your examination. If suspected, you will/should be sent for an ultrasound. If the ultrasound confirms the presence of fibroids, then get an MRI to determine exact size, location and type.


----------



## rootzdawta

Anyone into emergency preparedness vis a vis peak oil, impending economic collapse, etc.?

I'm trying to stay balanced about everything but also be realistic and prepare.


----------



## eilonwy

I've actually been somewhat obsessed with the idea of preparedness since I was a little girl. That said... we're fairly poorly prepared for any sort of disaster around here.







: I try not to think about it.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Actually, there's no need to get checked unless you suspect you have them. The typical symptoms are: heavy periods, thickening around your middle, discomfort during sex and anemia. If you have any of these symptoms, ask your practitioner to check during your examination. If suspected, you will/should be sent for an ultrasound. If the ultrasound confirms the presence of fibroids, then get an MRI to determine exact size, location and type.

ow lawd! *faint* I have had heavy periods since I first started. I went in for a pap and she felt around inside me........ one more thing to stress about.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Anyone into emergency preparedness vis a vis peak oil, impending economic collapse, etc.?

I'm trying to stay balanced about everything but also be realistic and prepare.

I need to get on this.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Anyone into emergency preparedness vis a vis peak oil, impending economic collapse, etc.?

I'm trying to stay balanced about everything but also be realistic and prepare.

I am not doing anything to prepare for what might be an economic collapse. I have some food on hand and will just play it by ear. I don't want to panic, lest it become a self fulfulling prophecy. I don't know if I'd feel this calm if I had children. It's just dh and myself so I feel we will find a way to survive should the worse case scenario occur. I have enough anxiety and don't need to worry about anything else


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am not doing anything to prepare for what might be an economic collapse. I have some food on hand and will just play it by ear. I don't want to panic, lest it become a self fulfulling prophecy. I don't know if I'd feel this calm if I had children. It's just dh and myself so I feel we will find a way to survive should the worse case scenario occur. I have enough anxiety and don't need to worry about anything else









yeah, i'm here and there. i had a mini-freak out on friday since wamu is (was) where i was banking so i was feeling the trickle down drama. but i didn't have any $ in there anyway so i had to chill







! but its exactly because i am a new mama that i am contemplating stocking up on canned goods, water, seeds etc. and its not just the economy that is frightful these days...


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
yeah, i'm here and there. i had a mini-freak out on friday since wamu is (was) where i was banking so i was feeling the trickle down drama. but i didn't have any $ in there anyway so i had to chill







! but its exactly because i am a new mama that i am contemplating stocking up on canned goods, water, seeds etc. and its not just the economy that is frightful these days...


Me and DH have been into the emergency preparedness for awhile but hadn't done anything yet. Now that we have a LO on the way, we are definitely going to be making our emergency packs with calorie dense bars, water, enough cash to sustain us for awhile, radiation pills, protective clothing from the elements, etc... That is for if we had to just get up in the middle of the night and go...kind of scary but I rather be prepared and scared. And then of course have stockpiles of food, and fresh water in the event of a crisis where businesses close down. I get shook when thinking about epidemics...that's my big thing. I want to be prepared in the event that the avian flu or something comparable makes the transition from animal to human transition to human to human transition. I want to be able to hold my family down for months in case we had to just stay in the house to avoid contracting a deadly disease/virus.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sugarshoc* 
You know, I need to see Chocolat. I've been wanting to see that movie for years and for some reason, I never get to it. I have a touch of anemia. I take Floradix Iron & Herbs supplement and I love it.

It's going on my list. Thanks for the recs mamas. I almost caught up with the second season of Heroes thru netflix this weekend. I just LOVE that show. One of the things I love so much about it is the diversity of people on there.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
It's delicious, though.







: I don't drink straight milk but if I had six bucks in my pocket it'd last long enough for me to get to Starbucks.







:

Ok, I feel guilty admitting this but ever since I started interning at the Dr's office, I'm Starbucksed-out. the pharma reps are always getting us coffee. it's so hard to say no to free starbucks!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
It's going on my list. Thanks for the recs mamas. I almost caught up with the second season of Heroes thru netflix this weekend. I just LOVE that show. One of the things I love so much about it is the diversity of people on there.

*Ok, I feel guilty admitting this but ever since I started interning at the Dr's office, I'm Starbucksed-out. the pharma reps are always getting us coffee. it's so hard to say no to free starbucks*!









I had to give up my coffee habit, but free starbucks---that would be mighty tempting


----------



## jeca

I'll come out of the closet and say it...............I have never drank coffeee.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'll come out of the closet and say it...............I have never drank coffeee.







:









Just kidding. I only got hooked a few years ago. however, once hooked, i was hooked. I am sad I had to give up it. It just made me feel so warm and cozy especially in the winter.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'll come out of the closet and say it...............I have never drank coffeee.







:









Never?!? How did you ever survive to adulthood?!

My head is spinning. Here I've been depressed that I haven't had any in several months.







:


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'll come out of the closet and say it...............I have never drank coffeee.







:

Don't feel bad, jeca. I dont like coffee. I didnt taste coffee for the first time until I was 24 and THAT was because I became a bookstore cafe barista and during training they MAKE you taste all the different concoctions (yea, that wasnt a great day for me).

I still hate coffee to this day and can only tolerate it if it is buried in a chocolate freeze of some kind.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







Never?!? How did you ever survive to adulthood?!
:

You know strangely enough I get more than a few starbucks gift cards given to me during the year.







I usually order a green tea latte when I have a gift card.


----------



## oyinmama

i heart the green tea latte. not much of a coffee drinker either - i don't like the taste much and take it SUPER light and SUPER sweet, really it's just a vehicle for sugar and cream, LOL. but because i drinkg it so rarely, it makes a super high impact on me when i do drink it. i like i totally feel hte BUZZZZZ. i drink it when i need to acheive a certain kind of productivity - like if i am programming, designing, coding. needing a bunch of quiet and intense energy.

we don't have much of anything in the way of investments in the markets, only deposits in banks that are FDIC insured. not panicing. but we do have bulk ingredients for our biz. just the regular amount of pantry food. we also have seeds, even though our yard is super shady. if worse came to worse, we could container-garden tomatoes basil and cucumbers while chopping down trees! - it would be a winter of pesto and pickles!









eta - seriously, it is a good idea to have water and fuel on hand, a packed bag with change of clothes, important docs. hmmm.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:

i heart the green tea latte. not much of a coffee drinker either - i don't like the taste much and take it SUPER light and SUPER sweet, really it's just a vehicle for sugar and cream, LOL. but because i drinkg it so rarely, it makes a super high impact on me when i do drink it. i like i totally feel hte BUZZZZZ. i drink it when i need to acheive a certain kind of productivity - like if i am programming, designing, coding. needing a bunch of quiet and intense energy.

we don't have much of anything in the way of investments in the markets, only deposits in banks that are FDIC insured. not panicing. but we do have bulk ingredients for our biz. just the regular amount of pantry food. we also have seeds, even though our yard is super shady. if worse came to worse, we could container-garden tomatoes basil and cucumbers while chopping down trees! - it would be a winter of pesto and pickles!









*eta - seriously, it is a good idea to have water and fuel on hand, a packed bag with change of clothes, important docs.* hmmm*.*

That is the part I agree with. I think basic preparedness is important, but not because some people think the sky is going to fall. That is the sentiment I hear these days







. I can't focus on that cause it will just raise my anxiety level! Of course my important docs are packed away and have been since I moved







: This might just be the incentive i need to unpack those boxes.


----------



## rootzdawta

Personally, I've thought for a long time that every great empire eventually comes to an end and the U.S. is no exception. Right now I'm trying really hard to stay level-headed. I think the first step is to stop reading so many alarmist things and just to prepare as best as I can. I figure over the next few weeks as I do my grocery shopping, I'll just pick up extra foods that store well (canned stuff, dry stuff, etc). I'm going to get some cases of bottled water too and make sure we've got some first aid supplies and all our important documents together.

I keep thinking about getting a gun (I'd have to take lessons to learn to use it) although DH is adamantly, adamantly opposed. He's much more faithful than I am (I tend to be faithless at times) and believes that God will take care/provide as always. Because of his calm (due to his faith) I wish sometimes I had that.

Other than that, I'm just trying to prepare mentally for whatever comes. Trying to remind myself that we as Black folks are survivors.


----------



## eilonwy

I kind of wonder what poor Mormons do, when it comes to preparedness.









I'm not in favor of buying a gun myself. There's no way in **** I want it in my house with these four wild baboons.







Sheesh. If it comes to it, we'll find a way to obtain a weapon... but I really don't think it'll be necessary. Besides, I'm terribly clever, and terribly clever people will be "useful" when the s*** hits the fan, right? I'd like to think that the folks carrying guns would rather have me alive and happy than otherwise.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
If it comes to it, we'll find a way to obtain a weapon... but I really don't think it'll be necessary.

This is what DH thinks exactly.

I think I'm going to chill out and try to see it that way.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Besides, I'm terribly clever, and terribly clever people will be "useful" when the s*** hits the fan, right?

You wouldn't happen to watch Dr. Who would you?


----------



## Bloomingstar

:

you all are great! I've been a little MIA lately--crazy things at work, general busy-ness--but have been keeping up with the thread and I love that it's suddenly turned to everyone's survivalist plans. I know at least SOME of you have read Octavia Butler's Parable of the Talents and Parable of the Sower (I never remember which is first). If you haven't DON'T read it right now--it will throw you over an edge! Wait until after the election, in which case you'll either be thrown over an edge anyway, so why not go further? or you'll be feeling a bit more optimistic.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
You wouldn't happen to watch Dr. Who would you?

Not recently, but that's only because I don't have cable. It costs money and it rots the baby brains.







Is the new show available on DVD yet? I'll Netflix them eventually... I loved Dr. Who back in the day.







Yeah, I'm a dork.


----------



## jeca

That phrase had him written all over it that's why I asked. I know I've heard him say that or something similar more than once.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:

I know at least SOME of you have read Octavia Butler's Parable of the Talents and Parable of the Sower (I never remember which is first). If you haven't DON'T read it right now--it will throw you over an edge! Wait until after the election, in which case you'll either be thrown over an edge anyway, so why not go further? or you'll be feeling a bit more optimistic.

Yeah...I've read both of those books and all I can think of is the main character, Lauren, having her survival backpack and cash buried in the yard... That part always stuck with me...


----------



## JustKiya

I don't even want to THINK about Parable of the Sower.... though I do wish I could get my hands on a copy of the books she was talking about listing Native American foods and how they processed them.







*sigh*


----------



## AndrewsMother

Well, ummmm I have done nothing to prepare for anything. Granted we do have about a month's worth of food in the pantry, but not enough to last beyond 5 weeks at most.

For everyone that is hoarding cash, my question is why? If the economy crashes the dollar will be worth just enough to purchase nothing. Maybe my thinking is skewed, but I don't understand the reasoning. Perhaps hoarding Euros, Yuans, or Yens, but not the American dollar.


----------



## benegesserit

Love, love, love octavia butler (RIP) & hope to be as strong as Lauren if things get to that point in this world.

-_God is Change_


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benegesserit* 
Love, love, love octavia butler (RIP) & hope to be as strong as Lauren if things get to that point in this world.

-_God is Change_


Hey there. Welcome!

I love Octavia Butler as well. She was a woman before her time!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
Well, ummmm I have done nothing to prepare for anything. Granted we do have about a month's worth of food in the pantry, but not enough to last beyond 5 weeks at most.

For everyone that is hoarding cash, my question is why? If the economy crashes the dollar will be worth just enough to purchase nothing. Maybe my thinking is skewed, but I don't understand the reasoning. Perhaps hoarding Euros, Yuans, or Yens, but not the American dollar.

I am not hoarding cash but I would like to have some liquidity on hand in the event of an emergency situation where the economy hasn't crashed but there is no longer access to ATMs/Banks. I could see how having Euros on hand could be good also.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am not hoarding cash but I would like to have some liquidity on hand in the event of an emergency situation where the economy hasn't crashed but there is no longer access to ATMs/Banks. I could see how having Euros on hand could be good also.

I agree.

In a hyperinflationary period, things will cost more, i.e. you physically need more money to function (think bags of money).


----------



## oyinmama

yeah i don't think hoarding yr savings in the mattress is necessarily the way to go... but right now, between my husband and myself we probably have about $18 in cash between us. we use our debit cards for almost everything. i don't have anything prepared either at this point, but when when i think about it, i imagine putting a change of underwear/jeans/chucks for everyone, a bunch of diapers, few bottles of water and packets of peanut butter crackers, our passports, and five or ten twenties into a backpack and keeping it in the closet. because $18 and a debit card might not take us very far if we ever had to pick up and go.

it's been a long time since i read the 'parables.' octavia butler is one of my all time favorite storytellers; and her pre? post? apocalyptic visions are so terrifying to me precisely because they are so down-to-earth and realistic.

all that you touch, you change.


----------



## Draupadi

The only Octavia Butler I've read is *Kindred*. It's definitely one of my favorite books ever.
Anyway, I've just been trying to stock up on some food, but I'm not going nuts about it. Things are tight as it is so it's difficult to shop anyway. Dh insists on organic which I prefer of course, but it does get expensive.
He thinks I'm a little nutty because I occasionally talk about stocking up on food and supplies just in case. I've been feeling that way more and more after natural disasters like Katrina and the tsunamis (and from watching post Apocolyptic films like "28 Days Later" one too many times). Better to be safe than sorry, right?I guess I get that from my mom who was dirt poor as a child and grew up in a warzone.


----------



## oyinmama

OMG - read more octavia!!









your mom's experience is a very good reason to feel that way. i have this book 'organizing from the inside out' and the author talks about the psychological underpinnings of clutter - the 'i can't let this go b/c it reminds me of XYZ' idea... the 'i want to always be prepared' idea, or 'i don't want to let go of the idea of myself that is represented by all this [craft materials i never use] or [old cookbooks] or whatever' idea. or 'i feel uncertain in the world and want to prepare for anything, save everything.'

in general, my issues with 'stuff' run the other way - having too much of it. or rather, having not enough time to deal with the daily life clutter that accumulates. my poor dining room table. it's covered with semi-organized piles of things that will be organized 'later' at some unspecified point in the future. i'm an 'i'll do it later' clutterbug, i feel like there's more work to do than time in the day.

to the convo - i think i might reluctant to take 'preparedness' seriously b/c... well i dunno. we lived in bkln at 9/11/01 and that was about the most disastrous thing any of us east coasters (who don't have to deal with hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, etc) ever had to deal with. perhaps i subconsciously learned that there's no way to ever really be 'prepared.' yknow? bc who could have expected that? and even if i had, what kind of packed bag would have helped me in that moment? it's not like living in a hurricane area and feeling prepared b/c i have plywood and flood insurance. i dunno.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
. perhaps i subconsciously learned that there's no way to ever really be 'prepared.' yknow?

Yeah, I am feeling like to a large extent, it's a crapshoot. So I try to pick up stuff to "stock up" and I feel like I have no idea if this will be useful or not because I have no idea what the emergency will be like. I can only guess.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Im sad to say that i am NOT up on Octavia Butler at all. I mean, i know her name and that she's recently passed, but thas about it.

*hangs head in shame and goes to order a couple of her most loved books to catch up*

As far as preparedness,...uh we are NOT prepared in the least. The thing that scares me the most is my husband's bad back. If we need to run or travel far distances, he cant go very far without being in excrutiating pain and that worries me (cause im not leavin his side, no way no how). I was also in DC during 9/11/01 and there was nothing to do but wait and watch tv. I would have been SOL had, say, a bio attack come along too cause i had no food in my dorm room (i was still at Howard), very little clothing, bottled water, etc, etc, etc. There was no preparing for that day at all.

I agree about hoarding money. For the past year, i been telling people the american dollar dont mean nothing, ya'll better get up on them Euros, or better yet, get up on that gold and silver (cause if our economy topples aint it good chance other western powers will too?), lol.

I do wanna hoard food, but i simply dont have anywhere to put it. We live in a one bedroom apt with a nice kitchen with NO cabinet space. Even if I wanted to hoard it, it would be piling up along the walls of my kitchen or some mess, lol.

I also never carry cash (which hubby hates). Hubby is always tryna stuff a twenty into my wallet and then i end up spending it a few days later, lol.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
to the convo - i think i might reluctant to take 'preparedness' seriously b/c... well i dunno. we lived in bkln at 9/11/01 and that was about the most disastrous thing any of us east coasters (who don't have to deal with hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, etc) ever had to deal with. perhaps i subconsciously learned that there's no way to ever really be 'prepared.' yknow? bc who could have expected that? and even if i had, what kind of packed bag would have helped me in that moment? it's not like living in a hurricane area and feeling prepared b/c i have plywood and flood insurance. i dunno.

1. Documents. Have your passports (if you have them.. heh, I don't), your wills, your legal documents (insurance policies, healthcare numbers, deed to your house/car, etc) all together in a safe and accessable place, ideally a small fireproof lockbox. Get the sort with a combination so that you don't have to worry about looking for a key. If you're like me and you wear your keys on your pants every day then the cheaper keyed-option will probably do what you need it to do.

2. A hand-crank and/or solar radio, and a likewise operated flashlight (or two).

3. While I don't advise hoarding medications (that's a scene that can get ugly in a hurry), it's not a bad idea to keep all necessary medications in a single basket. If your family is like mine and you've got someone who needs to keep medication refrigerated, keep a single box there as well so that you can just pull it out and run, if you need to.

4. Clean underwear. Okay, perhaps I'm a bit weird but even if I'm totally stank I'll feel a lot better about the world merely by changing underwear. Don't get me wrong, showers are better...







but in a pinch, the panties are what counts! If you're a cloth user, buy a pack of sposies to have on hand for an emergency. You'll be greatful for them if your kid gets rotavirus, too.
















5. Baby wipes.

6. Candles & lighters.

Short list, all of that stuff can fit into a very small bag. If you need to be evacuated from your home briefly or find yourself without electricity for a few days, those things will help.

As for me, I'm surely paranoid and planning obsessed, like I said... but I live in a crappy rental apartment.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
1. Documents. Have your passports (if you have them.. heh, I don't), your wills, your legal documents (insurance policies, healthcare numbers, deed to your house/car, etc) all together in a safe and accessable place, ideally a small fireproof lockbox. Get the sort with a combination so that you don't have to worry about looking for a key. If you're like me and you wear your keys on your pants every day then the cheaper keyed-option will probably do what you need it to do.

2. A hand-crank and/or solar radio, and a likewise operated flashlight (or two).

3. While I don't advise hoarding medications (that's a scene that can get ugly in a hurry), it's not a bad idea to keep all necessary medications in a single basket. If your family is like mine and you've got someone who needs to keep medication refrigerated, keep a single box there as well so that you can just pull it out and run, if you need to.

4. Clean underwear. Okay, perhaps I'm a bit weird but even if I'm totally stank I'll feel a lot better about the world merely by changing underwear. Don't get me wrong, showers are better...







but in a pinch, the panties are what counts! If you're a cloth user, buy a pack of sposies to have on hand for an emergency. You'll be greatful for them if your kid gets rotavirus, too.
















5. Baby wipes.

6. Candles & lighters.

Short list, all of that stuff can fit into a very small bag. If you need to be evacuated from your home briefly or find yourself without electricity for a few days, those things will help.

As for me, I'm surely paranoid and planning obsessed, like I said... but I live in a crappy rental apartment.

















:


----------



## purplegirl

Christmas celebrating mamas: Do you make homemade/crafted gifts? I am scaling way back on the gifts I give this year and would love to make some. I am thinking about knitting scarves and making assorted body/home care gifts. I took some nice pictures while on vacation and thought about enlarging some, framing and giving them away. Anyone else?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Christmas celebrating mamas: Do you make homemade/crafted gifts? I am scaling way back on the gifts I give this year and would love to make some. I am thinking about knitting scarves and making assorted body/home care gifts. I took some nice pictures while on vacation and thought about enlarging some, framing and giving them away. Anyone else?

My mother's side of the family decided to host a gift exchange for all memebers over the age of 18. The two children will receive multiple gifts as usual. I always tell myself that I will make presents, but I never do.

If I had real talent I might, but I doubt that anyone wants my 100% natural diaper cream to use as a lotion.

By chance do you knit wool diaper covers?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
My mother's side of the family decided to host a gift exchange for all memebers over the age of 18. The two children will receive multiple gifts as usual. I always tell myself that I will make presents, but I never do.

If I had real talent I might, but I doubt that anyone wants my 100% natural diaper cream to use as a lotion.

*By chance do you knit wool diaper covers*?









:Girl, I can barely knit scarves well! I might take a class though so I can increase my reportoire!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 







:Girl, I can barely knit scarves well! I might take a class though so I can increase my reportoire!


Gosh. I was about to place a few orders!!!


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 







:Girl, I can barely knit scarves well! I might take a class though so I can increase my reportoire!


















How about handknit washcloths, assorted colors? Easy, peasy and QUICK!


----------



## jeca

Well I guess it finally happened. After 31 years on this planet someone has finally called me a [email protected]@er to my face.







long story short since I typed the long version in TAO is my daughter came in and told me K said her that her mom told her she didn't want any black kids by her house. I went to talk to K's mom and ask her if she knew about it and she blew up at me. She yelled while I was still pretty calm and when Dh told me to let's go she yelled at me yeah go home [email protected]@er. More yelling then she called DH one and got in his face so I stepped between them nose to nose with her. Her Dh called the cops claiming that my Dh had "assaulted her" by touching her baseball cap that she was wearing when she was all in his face, which he did NOT. They came and tool statements from everyone plus the neighbors and kids that were outside. In the end they ended up arresting her for harassment. I am still upset over it.









I didn't want to offend anyone so I didn't type it just in case. I personally am okay with typing out the word though but I don't say it in any type of speech. It's late, I'm rambling, still mad and probably not being very clear, sorry.

FTR, I can't make anything so my frugal gift would probably really suck. I do buy on sale though.


----------



## Draupadi

Jeca







!!!!!!!!
I'm sorry this happened to you, and I'm especially sorry this happened to your daughter. You're a better person than me, though. I would've gotten arrested myself.
Good that UAV woman got arrested, though....


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
















How about handknit washcloths, assorted colors? Easy, peasy and QUICK!

Speaking of handknit washcloths, my mom makes knit "sponges" for dishwashing. I use them for cleaning up. They're much better than those disposable Magic Eraser things that are so popular these days (and of course, they're reusable!).
I have no skills like knitting. I'm sooooo not even handed when it comes to stuff like that.


----------



## Draupadi

Jeca- I don't see the thread in TAO. Maybe it hasn't been approved yet...?


----------



## Barbamama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
You're a better person than me, though. I would've gotten arrested myself.
Good that UAV woman got arrested, though....









:

And right about now I'd be kicking myself for letting my temper get away from me. Jeca, I'm not a frequent poster, but I couldn't read this and not send







your way. Here's hoping today is more peaceful . . .
and that the DA decides to press charges against her.


----------



## purplegirl

Wow Jeca. I am so sorry for all the craziness. What a tough experience for your beautiful daughter to have at such a young age. I am thrilled that charges were pressed against that woman. People can be so hateful and I'm afraid that in our current economy, it's only going to get uglier.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Wow Jeca. I am so sorry for all the craziness. What a tough experience for your beautiful daughter to have at such a young age. I am thrilled that charges were pressed against that woman. *People can be so hateful and I'm afraid that in our current economy, it's only going to get uglier.*









This. I think there's going to be a lot of irrational blaming going on.
Jeca, be careful.


----------



## MihrDanae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am not doing anything to prepare for what might be an economic collapse. I have some food on hand and will just play it by ear. I don't want to panic, lest it become a self fulfulling prophecy. I don't know if I'd feel this calm if I had children. It's just dh and myself so I feel we will find a way to survive should the worse case scenario occur. I have enough anxiety and don't need to worry about anything else









My husband and I have been very interested in becoming more prepared for a changing society. We have begun putting our plans/dreams of farming and homesteading into practice.. Its hard and not a straight line towards becoming self sufficient.

Since we are using a family members land, and I know this is not a reality for many, I would suggest that you lovely mamas align yourselves with your local farmers. When the economy fails and oil becomes harder to obtain, finding food will become priority. Stored food only lasts so long but finding ways to work with the seasons is a challenge and a joy.














:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Well I guess it finally happened. After 31 years on this planet someone has finally called me a [email protected]@er to my face.







long story short since I typed the long version in TAO is my daughter came in and told me K said her that her mom told her she didn't want any black kids by her house. I went to talk to K's mom and ask her if she knew about it and she blew up at me. She yelled while I was still pretty calm and when Dh told me to let's go she yelled at me yeah go home [email protected]@er. More yelling then she called DH one and got in his face so I stepped between them nose to nose with her. Her Dh called the cops claiming that my Dh had "assaulted her" by touching her baseball cap that she was wearing when she was all in his face, which he did NOT. They came and tool statements from everyone plus the neighbors and kids that were outside. In the end they ended up arresting her for harassment. I am still upset over it.









I didn't want to offend anyone so I didn't type it just in case. I personally am okay with typing out the word though but I don't say it in any type of speech. It's late, I'm rambling, still mad and probably not being very clear, sorry.

FTR, I can't make anything so my frugal gift would probably really suck. I do buy on sale though.









Hearing those words truly shakes you to your core. I have had the experience a few times and each time it left me speechless.







Sadly many think this sort of stuff doesn't happen anymore but unfortunately it does. I actually applaud you for staying calm, because I know how hard it is to walk away and not act on gut instinct which for me would have to be break a piece of my foot off....

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Wow Jeca. I am so sorry for all the craziness. What a tough experience for your beautiful daughter to have at such a young age. I am thrilled that charges were pressed against that woman. People can be so hateful and I'm afraid that in our current economy, it's only going to get uglier.










I agree with you. Thanks to the current climate in this country while there is a lot of hope,there are also a lot of folks who are taking their masks off too. I live in Maine and while most folks here are decent, I am noticing subtle shifts in behavior, folks looking a tad hard with not so nice looks on their faces.


----------



## eilonwy

Oh Jeca. I can honestly say that I've never been called the n-word, but I know my older niece at least has. BizzyBug is autistic and has sadly been called all kinds of names.







:

I'd love to knit presents for everyone. In fact, if I started in January and had a safe place to hide things, I could easily have sweaters knitted for everyone (Mike, the kids, myself, the ILs, & my mom-- everyone who'd appreciate it) well before October. I have to stick to smaller projects now, and I have to try to hide them, which doesn't always go well.







If we get this house we're trying to move to (please please PLEASE) I'll have a place to hide things and I think I'll try to like, knit wool socks for an etsy shop or something.







Socks are fairly easy, I can do all kinds of cute thigns with them and for nice wool socks in kid & toddler sizes I think people would pay $10-15 a pair, which would be well worth it. Diaper covers... I don't know, I never know how much to charge for them.







I've got quite a few self-designed patterns though, everything from wraps that secure with buttons/pins/Snappis to shorts to longies with feet.







If only I could find a way to do it reliably *now*. *sigh*


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Hearing those words truly shakes you to your core. I have had the experience a few times and each time it left me speechless.







Sadly many think this sort of stuff doesn't happen anymore but unfortunately it does. I actually applaud you for staying calm, because I know how hard it is to walk away and not act on gut instinct which for me would have to be break a piece of my foot off....

I agree with you. Thanks to the current climate in this country while there is a lot of hope,there are also a lot of folks who are taking their masks off too. I live in Maine and while most folks here are decent, I am noticing subtle shifts in behavior, folks looking a tad hard with not so nice looks on their faces.

yeah, its a epoch of transformation or at the very least there is a shift upon us...for better and for worse it seems.

jeca--that word uttered in all its historical ugliness can easily bring up blood memories of rage. good for you for remaining in control of your anger. i'm sorry your family had/has to deal with this. stay strong mama!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MihrDanae* 
My husband and I have been very interested in becoming more prepared for a changing society. We have begun putting our plans/dreams of farming and homesteading into practice.. Its hard and not a straight line towards becoming self sufficient.

Since we are using a family members land, and I know this is not a reality for many, I would suggest that you lovely mamas align yourselves with your local farmers. When the economy fails and oil becomes harder to obtain, finding food will become priority. Stored food only lasts so long but finding ways to work with the seasons is a challenge and a joy.














:

i'm right there with you. i've been thinking of learning some basic farming skills and other kinds of practical knowledge. i see you are in c'ville, perhaps we can link up...


----------



## jeca

Thanks everyone I feel better today. I know so many people are telling me I should have knocked her out but I have never been to jail and wasn't about to for this ignorant woman. Now if she had put her hands on me of course all bets would be off. I am thrilled that she was arrested. I need to find out what will happen next to her.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Thanks everyone I feel better today. I know so many people are telling me I should have knocked her out but I have never been to jail and wasn't about to for this ignorant woman. Now if she had put her hands on me of course all bets would be off. I am thrilled that she was arrested. I need to find out what will happen next to her.










What I find astonishing, is that all of this got started over two children wanting to play with another. Hate has to run deep in that woman; it's a pity


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Thanks everyone I feel better today. I know so many people are telling me I should have knocked her out but I have never been to jail and wasn't about to for this ignorant woman. Now if she had put her hands on me of course all bets would be off. I am thrilled that she was arrested. I need to find out what will happen next to her.

I have mad respect for your presence of mind. I can't say I would have been capable of that level of composure.

Sadly, I'm not at all surprised that it was precipitated by children playing together. While kids bring out the best in many of us, they also bring out the worst. Many people manage to go through life as undetected racists, and then they start having kids who don't know their "rules" and... well, chaos ensues. I still remember Chibi coming home in tears over another little girl's tears because she was forbidden to invite Chibi to her birthday party. The other child had a very hard time socially, and Chibi (who's always been extremely socially adept) was her only real friend.







:


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Well I guess it finally happened. After 31 years on this planet someone has finally called me a [email protected]@er to my face.







long story short since I typed the long version in TAO is my daughter came in and told me K said her that her mom told her she didn't want any black kids by her house. I went to talk to K's mom and ask her if she knew about it and she blew up at me. She yelled while I was still pretty calm and when Dh told me to let's go she yelled at me yeah go home [email protected]@er. More yelling then she called DH one and got in his face so I stepped between them nose to nose with her. Her Dh called the cops claiming that my Dh had "assaulted her" by touching her baseball cap that she was wearing when she was all in his face, which he did NOT. They came and tool statements from everyone plus the neighbors and kids that were outside. In the end they ended up arresting her for harassment. I am still upset over it.









I didn't want to offend anyone so I didn't type it just in case. I personally am okay with typing out the word though but I don't say it in any type of speech. It's late, I'm rambling, still mad and probably not being very clear, sorry.

FTR, I can't make anything so my frugal gift would probably really suck. I do buy on sale though.

















I could not NOT post and give a hug. I will repeat the pps sentiments that you were very calm and cool and did the right thing. I am also glad that woman got arrested. Cant say the same thing would have happened had it happened to hubby and me, lol.

Question for the tribe and i dunno if you've discussed this before, but i figured i'd ask. Do any of you eat a Traditional Foods diet? I have just "discovered" the Nourishing Traditions book and have ordered it and would like to try it. I also wondered how the recipes would jive with a traditional black southern diet or a west african diet. So far, from what ive read, a lot of it seems to deal in the traditional European diet and I wondered if I could incorporate others.

Anywho, if you eat this way, just would like to hear your experience of it and what you think about it.


----------



## xochimama

hugs, love and peace, jeca. For me, it's always a shock (although not always a surprise) to witness hate again. Yea, I would have been inclined to strike back-- kudos for staying cool...


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 

Question for the tribe and i dunno if you've discussed this before, but i figured i'd ask. Do any of you eat a Traditional Foods diet? I have just "discovered" the Nourishing Traditions book and have ordered it and would like to try it. I also wondered how the recipes would jive with a traditional black southern diet or a west african diet. So far, from what ive read, a lot of it seems to deal in the traditional European diet and I wondered if I could incorporate others.


You know, I delved into TF and it is not traditional for West Africans and, therefore, many Black people in the diaspora. It is heavily based on dairy (raw and fermented) and fermented veggies. Traditionally, at least in Nigeria, there's a traditional dish called garri which is fermented cassave and that's really about all I've been able to come up with in terms of eating according to TF. I'm always interested to learn more.

@Jeca, I so respect your self-restraint. (((hugs)))


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Jeca, I have to run to get ready for work but i just wanted to give you a








I'm so very glad she is in jail. maybe, this will give her some to reevaulate her demonstration of hatred in front of her own children. or not. but whatever. Kudos to you again, for being rational through this experience.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Thas what I was thinking too, that the fermented foods may not be traditional for everybody, but I do see how eating whole real foods instead of processed foods can help.

I found this brotha on youtube and he is PASSIONATE about his whole foods (in particular raw milk), thought i'd give him some shine and check him out:

www.undergroundwellness.com

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
You know, I delved into TF and it is not traditional for West Africans and, therefore, many Black people in the diaspora. It is heavily based on dairy (raw and fermented) and fermented veggies. Traditionally, at least in Nigeria, there's a traditional dish called garri which is fermented cassave and that's really about all I've been able to come up with in terms of eating according to TF. I'm always interested to learn more.

@Jeca, I so respect your self-restraint. (((hugs)))


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Thas what I was thinking too, that the fermented foods may not be traditional for everybody, but I do see how eating whole real foods instead of processed foods can help.

I found this brotha on youtube and he is PASSIONATE about his whole foods (in particular raw milk), thought i'd give him some shine and check him out:

www.undergroundwellness.com

Impressive. I'm going to have to read more about his services when I get home. I have overhauled my diet over the past couple of months but I know there is always something I could be doing better. I like that he offers telephone consultation.


----------



## Brown Lioness

OH, i didnt even peep that he offers phone consultations! I thought I was doing good just subscribing to his youtube channel, lol. Thas tight, lol

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Impressive. I'm going to have to read more about his services when I get home. I have overhauled my diet over the past couple of months but I know there is always something I could be doing better. I like that he offers telephone consultationl


----------



## AndrewsMother

Jeca,







s to you and your family.


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## eilonwy

So many foods are "traditional" for me that I wouldn't know where to begin.







I'm the only person I know aside from my mother and older brother who could eat borscht and kasha every day...







I love eating rice for breakfast, and before my rice cooker died I did that fairly often. I don't care for traditional sausages, so while Russian food ranks high on my list of extreme yumminess, Polish doesn't really do it for me.







I LOVE Israeli/ Mediteranian traditional foods, I could absolutely LIVE on olives and falafel.







Chinese? Absotrively.







I'm curious about traditional African and Native American foods. I'm totally intrigued by the idea.









Ladies, I don't know if I've mentioned it here, but my little Bear has been ill lately. It's not that each individual thing is typically serious on it's own, but that he comes down with what ought to be very minor illness and stays sick for weeks on end, getting much sicker than he ought to and just not fully recovering. He was hospitalized twice in September for dehydration related to diarrhea (he had the diarrhea for *three weeks*). He had a cold for just over two weeks (overlapping with the poops) and ended that with another round of poops and double ear infections. Today he's on a new antibiotic for the ears (he's either got a secondary infection or the first one hasn't gone away) and he's been running a fever, acting like a generally sick baby (lethargic, whimpery, etc). At this moment his fever is down, and he drank 4 oz of formula (bringing his grand total for the past 36 hours to 12 oz) so he's relatively happy and energetic, but he spent most of the day in obvious pain and very unhappy. In any case, if you could think some happy thoughts at him, I'd be appreciative. He's only eight months old and he's already been through too many illnesses.


----------



## rootzdawta

: to your little one. May he be completely healed.


----------



## purplegirl

Hey Rynna, sorry to hear about Bear. I hope he kicks this latest bout quickly and here's a hug for you cause I know it can only be stressful on a mama


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

sending get well







: to Bear and peace to you, mama!


----------



## Bloomingstar

to Jeca and







: to Bear!


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## Brown Lioness

: Bombarding heaven for his complete health restoration.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
So many foods are "traditional" for me that I wouldn't know where to begin.







I'm the only person I know aside from my mother and older brother who could eat borscht and kasha every day...







I love eating rice for breakfast, and before my rice cooker died I did that fairly often. I don't care for traditional sausages, so while Russian food ranks high on my list of extreme yumminess, Polish doesn't really do it for me.







I LOVE Israeli/ Mediteranian traditional foods, I could absolutely LIVE on olives and falafel.







Chinese? Absotrively.







I'm curious about traditional African and Native American foods. I'm totally intrigued by the idea.









Ladies, I don't know if I've mentioned it here, but my little Bear has been ill lately. It's not that each individual thing is typically serious on it's own, but that he comes down with what ought to be very minor illness and stays sick for weeks on end, getting much sicker than he ought to and just not fully recovering. He was hospitalized twice in September for dehydration related to diarrhea (he had the diarrhea for *three weeks*). He had a cold for just over two weeks (overlapping with the poops) and ended that with another round of poops and double ear infections. Today he's on a new antibiotic for the ears (he's either got a secondary infection or the first one hasn't gone away) and he's been running a fever, acting like a generally sick baby (lethargic, whimpery, etc). At this moment his fever is down, and he drank 4 oz of formula (bringing his grand total for the past 36 hours to 12 oz) so he's relatively happy and energetic, but he spent most of the day in obvious pain and very unhappy. In any case, if you could think some happy thoughts at him, I'd be appreciative. He's only eight months old and he's already been through too many illnesses.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Lots of love and get well wishes to Bear.


----------



## oyinmama

sending late (but no less heartfelt) hugs and admiration to JECA!!! and also sharing my outrage - arrghghgh!! what the heck, dude? people are crazy.

and get well vibes to baby bear


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## Draupadi

Big love to Bear.


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## rootzdawta

Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

I believe it is important to capitalize on the skills you already possess. Your knitting is impressive. Can you put that skill to use to bring in some extra dough? Also, what about tutoring? You can do that on your schedule and perhaps right in your own home.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.


If I recall you have an M.ED? What about looking for an adjunct gig at either a career college or community college? Last year I was offered a position teaching 6 hours a week (2 nights a week) at a Kaplan school and for a 8 week term it paid $1700. The class I was offered was like introductory computers, I ended up saying no because I didn't know Access as all otherwise I would have done it.

Also many adult ed departments look for instructors for courses and the time committment is minor.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

If you've got a masters in education, you *might* be able to get a job doing distance education.

You could try an Etsy shop, too... though I don't know how much money you can actually make with one of those.









If you think of anything that can be done with no degree and several little destruct-o-monkies, do let me know.


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

Are you looking for something you can do at home, in yr "free" time?


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

yeah. i second the etsy shop idea---i'd buy your wares! also what about selling your vegan baked goods? some restaurants might be interested...

i wish i still lived in BK cause i'm looking for babysitter right now and i'd hire you in a minute!

lastly, do check into teaching online classes and/or adjuncting at cuny.
GL mama!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

Bad economies are generally great times to teach. Unemployed workers return to school and often at the expense of the governements return to work programs. Community colleges with distance education programs might be ideal for you.


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## rootzdawta

:

Thanks ladies. Lots to think on.

Trying to remain calm and not panic.


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## Bloomingstar

How is everyone doing? I was having a meeting with some of the teenage girls I work with yesterday and a bunch of them were saying that all this stuff with the economy is stressing them out. And they're only 14-18 years old! It's definitely making me rethink a few things, like my desperate need to take 6 months off after baby arrives (I get 3 months from maternity leave, 2 paid, one unpaid, but I really just feel like I need to LEAVE but...) but how in the hell am I really going to be able to do that. DH and I have some fuzzy math to sit down with this weekend, again, to see if that's at all possible. I may need to just hang onto my job a bit longer than I want to









I'm also just a little freaked that I only have a little less than 3 months left before the baby is here! I don't have a stitch of baby clothes, haven't ordered my birth kit, haven't really made any headway with a registry...







:


----------



## eilonwy

Wow... you want some cloth diapers, cheap?
















Do you know if you're having a boy or a girl? I've been working hard to get baby clothing out of my house so I have no idea what's around...







I can let you know, if you like. You can have any baby clothing I've got around for shipping.









Friday check-in-- Bear is "healthy," by which I mean he isn't any sicker than he was. Bella is cute, BooBah is a doll, and Bean had a great time at ADO this morning. Now I'm waiting for Mike to pick the kids up to take them to his parents' house. I have a headache from fasting yesterday, and I'm feeling... a strong urge to climb into a cave for a while. As I haven't got access to a nice cave, I'm going to boil water and sit in the bathtub for a few hours when I get home.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.









:
I'm right with you.
I only intended to SAH for 1 year but couldn't find a job (I also have a MSEd)and William's still on the waiting list for daycare. I need $$$$, too, but I'm not really crafty at all.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

Have you heard of ChaCha? (www.chacha.com) It might not let you make the full 800, but it would give you a good start, at least.

Do you have any crafting skills? Can you do hair? Can you give blood? Do you have reliable transportation to do a delivery/paper route? Do you have room for chickens?


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## purplegirl

Hey Rynna, I hope Bear continues to improve. He is a such a cute little guy!
I think all of us are concerned about this economy. Every day seems to bring uncertainly and a downward spiral of the market. I am trying to keep my head up and think positively. That is a challenge for me!
Anyway, I have no plans for the weekend. I have a couple of client to see tomorrow and then back home for some fall clean up. I am actually glad to have a weekend of nothingness!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I need to raise $800 extra a month.

Can you help me brainstorm ideas?? I tried two work at home opportunities but they are not looking for anyone in my state. I put up an ad for babysitting on Craig's list and will put something up at the grocery store. You all know the deal . . . 2 small kids, no extra money at all for childcare so I can do part-time work outside the house.

If I don't think of something, I may just have to bite the bullet and try to go back to full-time teaching.







Who knows if that's even feasible in this economy.

I took a class at a local CC last year taught by a woman who lived 500 miles away and never set foot on the campus. I am not a fan of for profit universities, but I am sure that most of the staff at places like University of Phoenix live scattered about the country.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
I took a class at a local CC last year taught by a woman who lived 500 miles away and never set foot on the campus. I am not a fan of for profit universities, but I am sure that most of the staff at places like University of Phoenix live scattered about the country.

They do have staff scattered through out the country but having applied to U of Phoenix several times, I am guessing its hard to land one of their positions. I know they look for instructors would generally at least 5 years of experience in the area you would be teaching. That's why I suggested adult ed/community college as a starting point to build experience.

I have an M.Ed in Administration and Supervision which has translated to teaching business classes, which when I was teaching aside from the computer classes wasn't too hard at all.

Regarding the economy, I am worried but not freaking out if that makes any sense. Both my dh & I are self employed so I am worried in the sense that dh's clients are in the pharmaceutical and tech industries so I am worried about how the credit crisis will impact those clients.

I am keeping food in the house and a few extra dollars around but we aren't going crazy. I mean I live in Maine where huge snowstorms are the norm so it makes sense to be prepared. Reality for me is if I get too obessed thinking about this, I will just push myself into a panic attack and I am not trying to do that.

I grew up broke so my skills at surviving were fine tuned at a young age.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

I can't bring myself to think too hard about it. It's entirely too depressing.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I can't bring myself to think too hard about it. It's entirely too depressing.

This is how I feel about everything right now. If I think about anything remotely connected to money, I cry.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *piad* 
This is how I feel about everything right now. If I think about anything remotely connected to money, I cry.

I feel the same way however I am the CFO in the family since early in our marriage I learned dh was not so good handling the cash.

Right now I am in a financial pit, dealing with some health issues, no insurance (though I will next month to the tune of $300 for a 5K deductible plan







). Our car is on its last legs, it needs a minimum of a 1K in work and even then its still sketchy so it looks like we are going to have to bite the bullet and buy a newer used car







.

In Maine not having a car is not really an option since even living in town, most places still are only accessible by car and public transit here is not really a reliable option. Ugh.....

The past few weeks I have been in a funk, bills come, I open them and they are just piled on my desk. Things get paid but truthfully there are things like old medical bills, etc that if they aren't critical to survival, they gotta wait. I live a life of robbing Peter to pay Paul these days.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I feel the same way however I am the CFO in the family since early in our marriage I learned dh was not so good handling the cash.

Right now I am in a financial pit, dealing with some health issues, no insurance (though I will next month to the tune of $300 for a 5K deductible plan







). Our car is on its last legs, it needs a minimum of a 1K in work and even then its still sketchy so it looks like we are going to have to bite the bullet and buy a newer used car







.

In Maine not having a car is not really an option since even living in town, most places still are only accessible by car and public transit here is not really a reliable option. Ugh.....

The past few weeks I have been in a funk, bills come, I open them and they are just piled on my desk. Things get paid but truthfully there are things like old medical bills, etc that if they aren't critical to survival, they gotta wait. I live a life of robbing Peter to pay Paul these days.


You described our situation almost to a T as well. I mean, one of our tires decided to get a HUGE nail stuck in it this week when we have NO money for a new tire, so we got it patched up. I have no health insurance and wont even BEGIN to be able to afford it until Feb of 2009, our savings are MEAGER at best, we constantly rob Peter to pay Paul because right now, when we add up all our expenses vs our incomes, we pay out WAY more than we bring in. On top of that, I hate my job and its stressors keeps threatening to make me sick.

So, yea, im with ya'll, i do my best to NOT think of money and this economy...i just keep my head down, work and plan to make things better in the future for us and try to laugh to keep from crying.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 

So, yea, im with ya'll, i do my best to NOT think of money and this economy...i just keep my head down, work and plan to make things better in the future for us and try to laugh to keep from crying.

Yes.

And all these threads about stockpiling and all these damn "tips" people are giving on how to "save" and be "frugal" are pissing me off.


----------



## purplegirl

I am right there with you. As soon as the money comes in, it flies right back out the door. I was thinking more about the notion of stockpiling. Well, heck I am just trying to make it day to day. There is no extra to purchase extra!
I have been exhausted lately cause I can't freakin sleep. I toss and turn and by the time the alarm rings, I have to drag myself out of the bed.







: Sleepy time tea used to work like a charm but it has lost it's ability to coax me to sleep. Argh--talk about frustration!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I have been exhausted lately cause I can't freakin sleep. I toss and turn and by the time the alarm rings, I have to drag myself out of the bed.







: Sleepy time tea used to work like a charm but it has lost it's ability to coax me to sleep. Argh--talk about frustration!

Dang sis, we are in the same boat. I drink Sleepytime every night and lately it isn't doing a thing.







The past 3-4 nights I have had hardly any sleep since the car situation and my health is on my mind.

The scary thing about living hand to mouth is we are what is considered middle-class, our income even being lower than ever is still smack in the middle of what the US says is middle class.







: So what that means is when I tried to get SCHIP for the kids for insurance we were denied, income too high.







: I even tried to appeal the decision, talked to a supervisor who basically laughed at me.

They raised the limits for heating assistance but we still don't qualify, so we are in what I call that gray place. Too rich for help and too broke to afford anything. Really not a fun place to be, as I joked with a friend recently I almost wish I was broke so I could get some help. You know that is messed up when you wish you had food stamps or something to help out.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Too rich for help and too broke to afford anything. Really not a fun place to be, as I joked with a friend recently I almost wish I was broke so I could get some help.

Do you know that this has been haunting me all my life? It's the reason I ended up going to public college and not Yale.









"So, is it foolish to keep trying to do the SAHM thing?" I ask myself.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yes.

And all these threads about stockpiling and all these damn "tips" people are giving on how to "save" and be "frugal" are pissing me off.

Pretty much! Having something leftover for us means being able to put more than the minimum amount (if that) on a bill, lol.

I hear you about being "too rich" for help and "too poor" to pay for anything. I feel like we are lost in that gray area as well which makes us hesitant and SCARED as heck to try and have kids ANYTIME soon. We just can't even justify a dog right now, let alone kids.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

"So, is it foolish to keep trying to do the SAHM thing?" I ask myself.

well that's the question on my mind, but it's a question of starting to do it after baby arrives. it seems so piein the sky right now, given the looks of things, but maybe by the time I'll really really need to decide, things will look a little better. I don't know though. I'm happy for the weekend at least--no constant refreshing of the NYTimes webpage to see that the market has gotten even crappier.


----------



## jeca

I fourth the idea of trying to find a community college to teach at. ALso if your DH works a set schedule can you pick up a shift somewhere opposite him. It may not be anything in your field but a it could bring a few extra pennies in the house. Maybe even a paper route or night stocking at a grocery store, I know a few mamas who do that and it works out well.

I'm not in panic mode but some of our accounts have dropped pretty dramatically to make my stomach feel unsettled. When I go to the grocer on tuesday I am picking up a few extra things. I am pretty worried about my parents though. My dad brings home about $7000 a month but my they have such bad spending and shopping habits they hardly have any savings. I can;'t say anything really because they feel like they are older and know what they are doing because they have "life experience". The big thing we are trying to do right now is eliminate our current debt so that we have more of a cushion later. Easier said than done with my DH.









WE are not on the same page as far as finances go which makes things really hard.


----------



## eilonwy

I know it would cost more for me to go to work right now than it does for me to stay home. I also know that nobody wants to pay me to do anything I'm good at, because I haven't got a degree. But like i said... i don't want to think about it.

Bean's covered in a rash.







On the up side, Bear is feeling all right (he's been a cute, giggly, amazing flying baby all day) and Bella made it through last night without needing a breathing treatment (first time in two weeks!).







She's only coughed a little bit today.







: Now I just have to figure out what's up with the boy and hope that it doesn't get any worse.







:


----------



## jeca

Forgot to add if you have a YMCA or the like in your area you may check with the programs there. I work for an outreach program sponsored by our local Y very very part time. I work about 6-10 hours a week and I can bring my kids with me if needed. The childwatch at our Y also has a few mothers there that work two hour blocks and brings their kids to work. The only catch is because they have a two hour limit on childcare there you can only bring yours for two hours also. The two hour workers usually work everyday during the busy peak of the day. Something to look into. It's not great money, I think my last check was $148 for two weeks, but it's something and it's great not having to worry about finding someone to watch my kids. Mine are in school and I go to work after I drop them off and I am home long before they get out.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I feel the same way however I am the CFO in the family since early in our marriage I learned dh was not so good handling the cash.

Right now I am in a financial pit, dealing with some health issues, no insurance (though I will next month to the tune of $300 for a 5K deductible plan







). Our car is on its last legs, it needs a minimum of a 1K in work and even then its still sketchy so it looks like we are going to have to bite the bullet and buy a newer used car







.

In Maine not having a car is not really an option since even living in town, most places still are only accessible by car and public transit here is not really a reliable option. Ugh.....

The past few weeks I have been in a funk, bills come, I open them and they are just piled on my desk. Things get paid but truthfully there are things like old medical bills, etc that if they aren't critical to survival, they gotta wait. I live a life of robbing Peter to pay Paul these days.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
You described our situation almost to a T as well. I mean, one of our tires decided to get a HUGE nail stuck in it this week when we have NO money for a new tire, so we got it patched up. I have no health insurance and wont even BEGIN to be able to afford it until Feb of 2009, our savings are MEAGER at best, we constantly rob Peter to pay Paul because right now, when we add up all our expenses vs our incomes, we pay out WAY more than we bring in. On top of that, I hate my job and its stressors keeps threatening to make me sick.

So, yea, im with ya'll, i do my best to NOT think of money and this economy...i just keep my head down, work and plan to make things better in the future for us and try to laugh to keep from crying.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul? That sounds quite familar. We made one of the hardest decisons of our life and are in the midst of eliminating debt. I am worried, but not to worried about any future financial crisis because we are emerging from our own. DH did not work for almost a year and I was a SAHM, so our savings vanished and well we lost EVERYTHING. I feel as if I am losing my mind on even the best days.

I am working to help out but I hate my job with a terrible passion. DH kepps telling me to quit, but the economy has me worried. What if I quit and he loses his job because of the economy. We will be in the EXACT same situation. Or my other dilema is that I quit and DS is not offered a scholarship to Montessori and I we don't have the extra money to pay for his education.

I blame all of our financial problems on myself. If I had finished school years ago instead of taking a break only to do what I have wanted to do for years because I was uncertain as to what I really wanted to we would not be in this situation. I would not have to work around a school schedule, I would not have to stress over the fact that no med school will want a 30 year student with a baby, and how in the heck am I going to afford school anyway. I received a pell grant this year sinch DH was unemployed last year, but there is no way that I am eligible for next year. I want to transfer to a better school, U of Houston is NOT my idea of a quality education, but paying for it is another story.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Dang sis, we are in the same boat. I drink Sleepytime every night and lately it isn't doing a thing.







The past 3-4 nights I have had hardly any sleep since the car situation and my health is on my mind.

The scary thing about living hand to mouth is we are what is considered middle-class, our income even being lower than ever is still smack in the middle of what the US says is middle class.







: So what that means is when I tried to get SCHIP for the kids for insurance we were denied, income too high.







: I even tried to appeal the decision, talked to a supervisor who basically laughed at me.

They raised the limits for heating assistance but we still don't qualify, so we are in what I call that gray place. Too rich for help and too broke to afford anything. Really not a fun place to be, as I joked with a friend recently I almost wish I was broke so I could get some help. You know that is messed up when you wish you had food stamps or something to help out.

DH has insurance through his job and DS has Medicaid in another state that expires at the end of the month. I applied for it during an extended trip to visit family. I am waiting for the 90 waiting period to end at a job that I might not keep for another two weeks. I guess that they assumed DH and I were seperated? If I do leave my job we will have to get him a private hospital only policy. Office visits don't worry me, hospital fees do.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Pretty much! Having something leftover for us means being able to put more than the minimum amount (if that) on a bill, lol.

I hear you about being "too rich" for help and "too poor" to pay for anything. I feel like we are lost in that gray area as well which makes us hesitant and SCARED as heck to try and have kids ANYTIME soon. We just can't even justify a dog right now, let alone kids.


Children require so much. I have a semi hole in the bottom of my FAVORITE pair of shoes. Not a water in the shoe hole, but a small hole. I can't justify spending over $100 to replace them when DS needs so many things. I don't want to purchase new everyday shoes (I will wear a pair of shoes until the fall apart) only to experience a catastrophic event, or for the family to need something important. Even toys take precendence over my clothing and non food needs. I feel as if I made him so he should have EVERYTHING that he Needs and even some what he does not really need. Why should he have to suffer because I am not yet financially established.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
"So, is it foolish to keep trying to do the SAHM thing?" I ask myself.

Only if you find a job that you LOVE. Otherwise save yourself the stress and keep looking for odd or very part time employment.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I know it would cost more for me to go to work right now than it does for me to stay home. I also know that nobody wants to pay me to do anything I'm good at, because I haven't got a degree. But like i said... i don't want to think about it.

Bean's covered in a rash.







On the up side, Bear is feeling all right (he's been a cute, giggly, amazing flying baby all day) and Bella made it through last night without needing a breathing treatment (first time in two weeks!).







She's only coughed a little bit today.







: Now I just have to figure out what's up with the boy and hope that it doesn't get any worse.







:

I hope it doesn't get any worse either. You gotta love having kids . . . random rashes and what look like bug bites (you guess). . . great fun.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Forgot to add if you have a YMCA or the like in your area you may check with the programs there. I work for an outreach program sponsored by our local Y very very part time. I work about 6-10 hours a week and I can bring my kids with me if needed. The childwatch at our Y also has a few mothers there that work two hour blocks and brings their kids to work. The only catch is because they have a two hour limit on childcare there you can only bring yours for two hours also. The two hour workers usually work everyday during the busy peak of the day. Something to look into. It's not great money, I think my last check was $148 for two weeks, but it's something and it's great not having to worry about finding someone to watch my kids. Mine are in school and I go to work after I drop them off and I am home long before they get out.

I will look into that! The Y is about 5 mins walking distance from my house.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Only if you find a job that you LOVE. Otherwise save yourself the stress and keep looking for odd or very part time employment.

Oh, sis, I know from my first experience teaching that I don't love teaching (at least not in "inner city" public school). But it (handily) pays the bills. Lots of stress though and most of the day wishing I was home with the boys. I'm really earnestly looking for odd and part-time stuff only. But is it fair to DH who's currently passed out asleep after working two extra shifts on his weekend off? He says he doesn't mind but . . .

Meh, one big







to everyone here in our tribe. The times, they ain't easy. But if there's anything we WOC know how to do, it's survive. And even thrive.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

Children require so much. I have a semi hole in the bottom of my FAVORITE pair of shoes. Not a water in the shoe hole, but a small hole. I can't justify spending over $100 to replace them when DS needs so many things. I don't want to purchase new everyday shoes (I will wear a pair of shoes until the fall apart) only to experience a catastrophic event, or for the family to need something important. Even toys take precendence over my clothing and non food needs. I feel as if I made him so he should have EVERYTHING that he Needs and even some what he does not really need. Why should he have to suffer because I am not yet financially established.

I feel very much like you, for months I have needed to get my locs done, so even when I can squeeze out the money to go into Boston to get them done, I just can't do it. Seems my two kids always need and my eldest who turns 17 early next year is very very costly.

He was chosen to go to DC next summer to represent his school for this national debate thing, cost is $1100. It will be split between me and my ex (his Dad) but still he is at that age where its lots of hits like that. Right now I am trying to get his plane fare (he lives with his Dad in the midwest) for the holidays, he wants to be here with me for Thanksgiving and Christmas. Airfare for both trips is a hair over a grand







:, and that is not even talking about putting something under the tree for him. I know the only thing he really wants is a Blackberry (he has his own cell phone courtesy of me) but to get him a Blackberry will costs me $300.









Thing is at his age ain't nothing cheap, he wears grown man sizes so even shopping for clothes still cost a couple hundred for just a few pieces.

Plus I got the little girl and I swear she just grows like a weed. I am now scrambling to get her fall/winter wardrobe together. It seems like the older she is getting the thrift stores have worse stuff so trying to save by shopping 2nd hand for her may not be an option soon. Between these two kids, I stay broke.

So yeah, I always feel like I can't get jack which at times makes me mad. I worked my behind off to lose weight, went from a 14/16 to a 4/6, so ya know Mama be wanting to get her sexy on.







However since reaching my goal weight back in April, I have bought only the bare amount of clothes to function because my money goes to either the house or kids. Ugh...

Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 

So yeah, I always feel like I can't get jack which at times makes me mad. I worked my behind off to lose weight, went from a 14/16 to a 4/6, so ya know Mama be wanting to get her sexy on.







However since reaching my goal weight back in April, I have bought only the bare amount of clothes to function because my money goes to either the house or kids. Ugh...

Shay

Every time you say how much weight you lost, I am like wow. Congrats!!

I can only imagine how frustrating it is to not be able to buy the clothes that suit your new body!

And your hair . . . you know, before I cut mine off people were saying I should go get it repaired. No joke, folks were trying to charge $150 as the base charge for doing the job. So I can't even imagine how much the whole trip plus the repair would cost! Do the locks actually need repair or just some TLC? Could you get one of your girlfriends to help with it?

I don't know, as women it's important to at least look good to yourself. And so dang on infuriating when the things that would help are out of reach financially.


----------



## eilonwy

Bear, my youngest, is also my fastest grower. BeanBean is all right in the things he had last year, and BooBah's only gotten wider in the hips... so she's also all right in the things Bean had last year (







). Bella has hardly grown at all, she's barely a size bigger than she was last year... trouble is, BooBah was very hard on her clothing and she *also* wore everything for at least two years. When you throw in the fact that the colors which were so adorable on BooBah make Bella look positively ill...







: And of course there's Bear. I got rid of all of the little boy clothing in the house before he was born because Bella was the last baby.







: I didn't go shopping for him beforehand, and I'm glad I didn't because I've never had a nine month old who needed 18 month sizes before. In any case, he's got two blanket sleepers and a short-sleeved cotton pajama set. Everything else, his long skinny arms and legs stick out. He needs an 18 month super slim-- the same size Bean needed when he was two.









You know what's most irritating to me? The fact that I don't have my sewing machine. If I *did*, I'd have just hopped over to JoAnne's and bought some fleece, whipped up some "sweats" and jammies for him, and we'd be all good. But nooo... Bean had to disassemble the sucker.







Gah.

Honestly, I think the kids will be cheaper when I can sew and knit without worrying that the kids will take things apart.







: Of course, they'll eat more by then.


----------



## jeca

No kidding about the older my girls get the worse their clothes are. Some of the "styles" out for little girls nowadays is so raunchy makes me want to blush. I have had pretty good luck at the "upscale" thrift stores and consignments shops( read that as in going to the rich neighborhoods to shop). DS is 11, why is everything on his Xmas list over $60? The older they get the more expensive their stuff gets.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I hope it doesn't get any worse either. You gotta love having kids . . . random rashes and what look like bug bites (you guess). . . great fun.









I will look into that! The Y is about 5 mins walking distance from my house.

Oh, sis, I know from my first experience teaching that I don't love teaching (at least not in "inner city" public school). But it (handily) pays the bills. Lots of stress though and most of the day wishing I was home with the boys. I'm really earnestly looking for odd and part-time stuff only. But is it fair to DH who's currently passed out asleep after working two extra shifts on his weekend off? He says he doesn't mind but . . .

Meh, one big







to everyone here in our tribe. The times, they ain't easy. But if there's anything we WOC know how to do, it's survive. And even thrive.


I work with suburban children who have ghetto mentalities so I understand what you mean.

If your DH does not mind then working extra, then let him. No man wants for his wife to be in any situation that makes her unhappy, IMHO. If he wants to work harder to give you and your children what you all need and want, why take that right from him. I love men who work hard and sacrifice their time for their family. But make sure that you do all that you can to show him that you are grateful.

As for clothing......I have NOT had any luck in a resale/thrift shop since DS's birth. Last year I found two pairs of Ralph Lauren overalls for $8 total. If I am going to buy used I need name brands. We purchase Target,though the tag scare has me nervous about this year, and Ralph lauren for everyday wear, boutique clothing for church and Hannah Andersson undershirt and Gymboree socks.

I would love to have a girl, but Lelli Kelly shoes and smocked dresses and pinafores would have me homeless.

14/16 to 4/6! COngratulations. What is your secret!!!

I am skeptical about purchasing used shoes. If I have my way DS will only wear Primigi's.


----------



## JustKiya

Wow, ya'll are on what I've just been looking into.

I'm seriously (*seriously*) considering scalping the living daylights out of my so-called 'retirement' account, just to dig us out of the paycheck to paycheck pit (and to get our leaking roof fixed







: ) so that we can do something different than what we are doing now.

I feel like we are drowning in bills, and in the back of my mind there is a constant thought that TTC'ing is taking so long because we both know there is no way (right now) we can afford for me to stop working - and there's also no way I'd be _mentally_ okay with returning to work with an 8 week old in daycare.







: At least we don't have to have the ART discussion, as we just plain can't afford to even think about it - hell, we barely managed to pay the RE.

I'm scared (*scared*!) down to my bones about our finances, in a way that I've never been scared before. Thinking about them really makes me almost want to cry - it feels so - hopeless, sometimes. And I feel so - stupid - saying that, considering how much we make - it's more than we've ever made before, but it feels like so much less.

I'm starting to sew my own clothes, too. I haven't brought new clothes in - ages - and I'm loosing weight - and I have a hard time finding my 'style' at stores (and I'm still way too fat to thrift), so sewing is my option. I only hit up the stores for sales, and I try to pay less than 2.00/yard for everything.... got a sewing machine & table from the thrift store, so it's high time I put it to good use.


----------



## AndrewsMother

JustKiya said:


> Wow, ya'll are on what I've just been looking into.
> 
> I'm.
> 
> I'm scared (*scared*!) down to my bones about our finances, in a way that I've never been scared before. Thinking about them really makes me almost want to cry - it feels so - hopeless, sometimes. And I feel so - stupid - saying that, considering how much we make - it's more than we've ever made before, but it feels like so much less.
> 
> QUOTE]
> 
> I make less than before DS, but sooooooo much more than what we made last year, with fewer bills. Yes gas and food cost more, but there is something else too it. I have more money in my account at the end of the month than I have had in two years, but it nevers seems to be enough. I reaaly need to balance my checkbook, but the sight of going from 5 digits to 4 digits to 3 digits in front of the decimal takes my breath away and leaves me with tears in my eyes and sarcasm for DH.
> 
> As I prayed this morning, i felt a calm telling me that my money worries were nothing to worry about, that I would have what I eed and wanted. My faith is so thin I am unsure as to if that was God or my own hopeful subconscious. I am going to hope and pray that it was/is God.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

A We purchase Target,though the tag scare has me nervous about this year,

WHat tag scare? I only buy the name brand log lasting clothing when I shop thrift store, anything else is not worth it.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
WHat tag scare? I only buy the name brand log lasting clothing when I shop thrift store, anything else is not worth it.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=969216

Maybe it was a coincidence, but my DS had a constant rash on the back of his neck that left ugly scars.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
And your hair . . . you know, before I cut mine off people were saying I should go get it repaired. No joke, folks were trying to charge $150 as the base charge for doing the job. So I can't even imagine how much the whole trip plus the repair would cost! Do the locks actually need repair or just some TLC? Could you get one of your girlfriends to help with it?

I don't know, as women it's important to at least look good to yourself. And so dang on infuriating when the things that would help are out of reach financially.

Sadly living in Maine, I only have a few sista friends and only 1 who knows anything about locs and she offered to do my locs if I paid her







:. I was like no dahling...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Honestly, I think the kids will be cheaper when I can sew and knit without worrying that the kids will take things apart.







: Of course, they'll eat more by then.









Yep, they get big and they will eat and eat. My son is famous for waking up at 2-3 am and cooking his self a meal after eating a big dinner at 8 pm. Wake up in the morning to dishes where he has made some chili cheesefries or something.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
No kidding about the older my girls get the worse their clothes are. Some of the "styles" out for little girls nowadays is so raunchy makes me want to blush. I have had pretty good luck at the "upscale" thrift stores and consignments shops( read that as in going to the rich neighborhoods to shop). DS is 11, why is everything on his Xmas list over $60? The older they get the more expensive their stuff gets.









See, I need to hit the monied areas because my local Goodwill ain't all that good. Stuff there is high, I'm talking $7 for pants for me







, come on now I can go to the mall and for another $7 get some new pants since stuff is so cheap these days.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
As for clothing......I have NOT had any luck in a resale/thrift shop since DS's birth. Last year I found two pairs of Ralph Lauren overalls for $8 total. If I am going to buy used I need name brands. We purchase Target,though the tag scare has me nervous about this year, and Ralph lauren for everyday wear, boutique clothing for church and Hannah Andersson undershirt and Gymboree socks.

I would love to have a girl, but Lelli Kelly shoes and smocked dresses and pinafores would have me homeless.

14/16 to 4/6! COngratulations. What is your secret!!!

I am skeptical about purchasing used shoes. If I have my way DS will only wear Primigi's.

I don't really do used shoes either, gives me the creeps. Yeah, my Goodwill has like Old Navy and Target stuff, which come on that's not a deal used since everytime I have been to Ole Navy this year the stuff is on sale.

I lost weight with Weight Watchers, took 2 years but was worth it.

So since we are talking ducats/cash money. I am curious to know but does anyone else feel that living a simple frugal life looks different for women of color because of cultural differences?

I find that culturally its hard for me to totally not care about my looks. KWIM? Like this summer, I wore inexpensive sandals yet I still got a monthly pedicure. I don't have a drawer full of Vicky's Secrets anymore but I still gotta have drawers with a little splash.
















And the big one is my kids gotta look right, I can look like crap but neither of my kids is going out looking wrong. Stuff like this feels cultural to me at times. Same for food, I cannot stand to eat the same thing all the time, don't get me wrong, I eat leftovers these days but the idea of eating say pancakes every day because I planned it and its cheap would make me crazy.

I feel like despite the changes I have made to reduce costs that there is a cultural componet that is hard to break. Hopefully I am making sense.

Shay


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
So since we are talking ducats/cash money. I am curious to know but does anyone else feel that living a simple frugal life looks different for women of color because of cultural differences?

I find that culturally its hard for me to totally not care about my looks. KWIM? Like this summer, I wore inexpensive sandals yet I still got a monthly pedicure. I don't have a drawer full of Vicky's Secrets anymore but I still gotta have drawers with a little splash.
















And the big one is my kids gotta look right, I can look like crap but neither of my kids is going out looking wrong. Stuff like this feels cultural to me at times. Same for food, I cannot stand to eat the same thing all the time, don't get me wrong, I eat leftovers these days but the idea of eating say pancakes every day because I planned it and its cheap would make me crazy.

I feel like despite the changes I have made to reduce costs that there is a cultural componet that is hard to break. Hopefully I am making sense.

Shay









I don't know if that's really a *cultural* thing to want to get your nails done and look cute.









Personally - not really. I like eating the same thing for three or four days in a row - esp. if all I have to do is pull it out of the fridge and heat it up - and if it was cheap, that's a perk.









I really don't care about how my draws look - I've got *thinks* 3 sessy pairs that I pull out on special occasions, and otherwise - they are in good enough shape to cover my behind.

I literally cannot REMEMBER the last time I had a pedicure - I've got a foot spa, and I don't really like having painted nails as they chip, and I keep my nails cut close, so - meh.

As far as kidlings (which I don't have yet) - I want them to look clean and neat. No tears, no stains, (at least not when initially put on!) everything fits - that's about it. If they are picking out their own outfits, I don't even care if it matches.







. And that's just 'nice' outfits - ie, we are going to the store/library/someplace out. Going out to play/lounging around the house outfits are the stained/grubby looking ones, and the same for shoes (love having a big yard of our OWN, kidlings can be barefoot in the yard).

But then, I think it's more of a personal thing. I don't see the value of paying someone else to take care of my beauty - from my hair to my toes, I do it all myself. It's never been something relaxing for me, because no-one does me as well as I do me.

I've never been a fashion-plate in any way shape or form - clothes are to cover my body, shoes are to cover my feet, and as long as they are as inexpensive as possible and suit my personal style, I'm happy with them.

But then, I also *grew up* that way. I had a couple (maybe four/five?) nice outfits, and the rest of my stuff was kids clothes - a little beat up, and a little stained, but I could have fun and get dirty and not worry about clothes. Shoes were the same way - I had one or two pairs that were 'reserved', and another one or two pairs that were for playing in.
And heaven help me if I wore the 'wrong' outfit to play in!








I grew up eating the same meal usually three days in a row, if there were enough leftovers - for dinner the first day, for lunch the second, and usually a snack the third day - because there weren't enough leftovers for a full meal.

It'll be interesting seeing the other ladies responses.


----------



## rootzdawta

ITA Shay. I can look frumpy but thankfully, we've gotten enough *nice* hand me downs and great thrift store finds for the boys that they always look proper; always look handsome. I refuse to let them look busted no matter what. Folks will and do make all kinds of assumptions about you, your kidsand your treatment of your kids if they do not *always* look neat and more than presentable especially (I won't mince words) if he's the one Black face in a crowd of White faces.

Personally, it really hits my self-esteem hard to not be able to look as nice as I would like to look. I don't get pedicures but I am very serious about a fresh coat of nail polish on my toes, some kind of nail decal art to give it a "pedicure look", nice shiny topcoat, oiled feet and good shoes. My undies (bra and panty must be in tip top shop). when I did have locks, it just tore me up that they looked so raggedy--they had to go. I think that it is very cultural. Igbo people are quite (*quite*) concerned with appearances and this has shaped my whole life. Sometimes if I don't have anything nice to wear, I will avoid going to my parents' house altogether.

"I feel like despite the changes I have made to reduce costs that there is a cultural componet that is hard to break."

Yes. I often feel like a weirdo in my predominantly Black town because I have had to reduce the cost as much as possible. I mean, this sisters around her look hot. And I look, well, tepid. Like I said . . . a big hit to the self-esteem.

I'm wondering, though, is it the culture surrounding being a woman or the culture surrounding being a Black woman that complicates "thriftiness".

Looking forward to everyone's reply to Shay's question . . .


----------



## AndrewsMother

I don't know if it is cultural, but more of how you were raised. Getting dressed in the morning depresses me. I know that I should look better than I do on a daily basis, but facials and new clothes just are notin the budget. I own two pairs of jeans and a few shirts that I wear on a daily basis. I would much rather wear dresses cute shoes, but that is not my life right now.

I often look busten=d and DS looks the part of a little prince.

I did not grow up eating leftovers. In fact we ate out most days, The thought of cooking and cleaning the kitchen frustrates me. Why can't i eat out at a nice NON chain restaurant EVERYDAY. Is that too much to ask?
I try to plan inexpensive home cooked meals, but they lack panache. IMO cooking is just as expensive as eating out. I don't do frugal well, my expectations are too high.


----------



## Brown Lioness

I can relate. Right now, 95% of the time, i look like blah, lol. But I do find that when i pamper myself (be it on my own or paying for it, but mostly on my own lol), i FEEL so much better. I feel like im ready to conquer the world JUST by washing and styling my locks some sort of way. I FEEL like I can conquer the world when my legs are shaved, i exfoliate with my own brown sugar scrub, i do a face mask, do my eyebrows and my skin is clear. Im an extremely low maintenaince chick, but doing that makes me FEEL so much better. I call it loving on myself (of course there are many other ways to love on myself, but this is one of them). I also would love to update my wardrobe with things i love, instead of just having something to cover myself so i dont walk outside nekkid, lol. The clothes that ive been buying the past few years are the epitome of blah, i feel ashamed to go out in public in them half the time cause the fit is wrong and it doesnt represent me and i dont love 99.9% of my clothes. A BIG reason why i dont go out on the town with friends or hubby is because i LITERALLY have nothing suitable to wear....so i stay home. Sad, huh? But who has the money to buy clothing pieces that you love, right?

However, I do notice that when i dont do those things, i take in ALL KINDS of negativity and EVERYTHING affects me deeply. Im not as confident and assured. When im taking care of myself, i feel invincible. So, i dunno that its cultural, tho it could be in some aspects (black women not wanting to be caught "looking a hot mess"), but i think its more of a woman thing than anything.

ETA, on second thought, it could be cultural. I mean think about it. Wha was the first thing your mother told you when you went out in public with her? DON'T embarrass me. And I think that stays with us. My mother used to dress me like a lil doll, ALL day, EVERYDAY. A lot of mothers do this. Then as we grow up, we become representations of our families and better yet our "race"/skin color/ethnicity/etc. In a sea of white faces, do you REALLY wanna be the only sista there AND looking busted and disgusted? Do you really want your hair to look "off" so that someone can walk by and think "Mmm, look at that sista or black woman looking a mess?" . I mean, generally, you don't care, but sometimes you do.

I do think we unknowingly and unwillingly represent each other when we are out and about. And I think part of us, subconciously, keeps that thought in our minds all the time, so we try NOT to be "embarrassing" to our friends, family or skin. We want to be taken seriously in all aspects and appearance is most definitely one of them.

I know for me, that heightened even more when i pledged a sorority and so now i will rarely be caught with para on because i dont wanna be caught looking busted representing my sorority like that so people can say "Mmm, i TOLD you they be looking busted and disgusted." Now widen that to being black, latina, indian, chinese, japanese, south pacific, etc, etc, etc. Now widen that to being a woman period. I might be reaching, but i DO think thas a possibility and a reality for a lot of women of color.


----------



## eilonwy

If it is a cultural thing, it's something I must have missed being raised by a white woman.









Seriously though... I have never had a pedicure (I've only had two *manicures* in my entire life), and I dress cheap-- end of story. The kids, likewise, are dressed in what I could find on clearance and in hand-me-downs. When I buy, I buy quality (especially for them) but I don't buy all that often. I try not to care about my appearance too much because no matter what I do, I feel awful if I open my mouth (my teeth are a train wreck














. I guess I feel like dressing frumpily draws attention away from the fact that my teeth are a complete mess. Dressing nicely certainly doesn't help unless I don't speak, and then I just sit around being depressed and uncomfortable, so nobody notices whether or not my clothing fits.









As to eating out every day... you've got to be kidding me. I'd be stoked to eat out once a month. Before Mike lost his job, I used to order pizza for the kids and I once a month and that felt downright *luxuriant*. Maybe three or four times a year, we'd go out to eat instead of ordering pizza. Now?







Just not happening.

Ugh. This is seriously depressing me, ladies. I really, really, REALLY hate thinking about money right now.







:


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

I don't even want to think about money right now. I'm in the same boat as most of you. However, I just got hired on after my 5 week (unpaid







) internship. so, I'm very relieved that we'll have some money coming in.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I find that culturally its hard for me to totally not care about my looks. KWIM? Like this summer, I wore inexpensive sandals yet I still got a monthly pedicure. I don't have a drawer full of Vicky's Secrets anymore but I still gotta have drawers with a little splash.
















And the big one is my kids gotta look right, I can look like crap but neither of my kids is going out looking wrong. Stuff like this feels cultural to me at times. Same for food, I cannot stand to eat the same thing all the time, don't get me wrong, I eat leftovers these days but the idea of eating say pancakes every day because I planned it and its cheap would make me crazy.

I feel like despite the changes I have made to reduce costs that there is a cultural componet that is hard to break. Hopefully I am making sense.

Shay

About appearances, it might be cultural, might be the way I grew up, too, good insights, Shay. I HAVE to do mine and Amira's hair every day. and she, of course, has to be dressed right for the weather and for the occasion. and since I have been working, I don't feel confident if at least my nails aren't painted and my hair isn't somewhat tamed (I have crazy, moody hair, just like me).









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
ETA, on second thought, it could be cultural. I mean think about it. Wha was the first thing your mother told you when you went out in public with her? DON'T embarrass me. And I think that stays with us. My mother used to dress me like a lil doll, ALL day, EVERYDAY. A lot of mothers do this. Then as we grow up, we become representations of our families and better yet our "race"/skin color/ethnicity/etc. In a sea of white faces, do you REALLY wanna be the only sista there AND looking busted and disgusted? Do you really want your hair to look "off" so that someone can walk by and think "Mmm, look at that sista or black woman looking a mess?" . I mean, generally, you don't care, but sometimes you do.

*I do think we unknowingly and unwillingly represent each other when we are out and about*. And I think part of us, subconciously, keeps that thought in our minds all the time, so we try NOT to be "embarrassing" to our friends, family or skin. We want to be taken seriously in all aspects and appearance is most definitely one of them.

I know for me, that heightened even more when i pledged a sorority and so now i will rarely be caught with para on because i dont wanna be caught looking busted representing my sorority like that so people can say "Mmm, i TOLD you they be looking busted and disgusted." Now widen that to being black, latina, indian, chinese, japanese, south pacific, etc, etc, etc. Now widen that to being a woman period. I might be reaching, but i DO think thas a possibility and a reality for a lot of women of color.

(bolding: mine) You hit the nail on the head about "representing".

more later, gotta go, have dinner with the family!


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 

ETA, on second thought, it could be cultural. I mean think about it. Wha was the first thing your mother told you when you went out in public with her? DON'T embarrass me. And I think that stays with us. My mother used to dress me like a lil doll, ALL day, EVERYDAY. A lot of mothers do this. Then as we grow up, we become representations of our families and better yet our "race"/skin color/ethnicity/etc. In a sea of white faces, do you REALLY wanna be the only sista there AND looking busted and disgusted? Do you really want your hair to look "off" so that someone can walk by and think "Mmm, look at that sista or black woman looking a mess?" . I mean, generally, you don't care, but sometimes you do.

I do think we unknowingly and unwillingly represent each other when we are out and about. And I think part of us, subconciously, keeps that thought in our minds all the time, so we try NOT to be "embarrassing" to our friends, family or skin. We want to be taken seriously in all aspects and appearance is most definitely one of them.

I know for me, that heightened even more when i pledged a sorority and so now i will rarely be caught with para on because i dont wanna be caught looking busted representing my sorority like that so people can say "Mmm, i TOLD you they be looking busted and disgusted." Now widen that to being black, latina, indian, chinese, japanese, south pacific, etc, etc, etc. Now widen that to being a woman period. I might be reaching, but i DO think thas a possibility and a reality for a lot of women of color.

After reading your words and recalling what I told a coworker last week I might have to recant some of what I said earlier.

Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. She looked a hot busted ghetto mess and informed her that she was bringing down the race. before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.


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## rootzdawta

Ladies, I read an *excellent* blog this morning: The Obama Effect. I would love if you all would read it and comment here or there.


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. She looked a hot busted ghetto mess and informed her that she was bringing down the race. before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.

I'm sure she looked awful. I'm sure she *felt* awful too... but what makes you think she can afford anything else? Maybe she has other priorities right now. If it comes down to spending $3 on a new pair of shoes or spending it on a loaf of bread and a jar of peanut butter to feed my kids, you'd damn well better believe it's going to be the latter. As humiliated as you felt, I'm sure she felt a thousand times worse. I'm not saying that this particular woman has any excuse, but I'm much more inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

This is, in my opinion, one more thing that's wrong with our society. Where does anyone get off being angry with poor people? You *ought* to be angry with the CEO of Exxon Mobile, making money hand-over-fist on people who are trying to balance filling the gas tank to get to work with feeding their kids.







:


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## Brown Lioness

Um, this is my







post









I just wanted to celebrate that, here, in my most favoritest place to be on MDC.














:


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Um, this is my







post









I just wanted to celebrate that, here, in my most favoritest place to be on MDC.














:









: Congrats!







:


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I'm sure she looked awful. I'm sure she *felt* awful too... but what makes you think she can afford anything else? Maybe she has other priorities right now. If it comes down to spending $3 on a new pair of shoes or spending it on a loaf of bread and a jar of peanut butter to feed my kids, you'd damn well better believe it's going to be the latter. As humiliated as you felt, I'm sure she felt a thousand times worse. I'm not saying that this particular woman has any excuse, but I'm much more inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

This is, in my opinion, one more thing that's wrong with our society. Where does anyone get off being angry with poor people? You *ought* to be angry with the CEO of Exxon Mobile, making money hand-over-fist on people who are trying to balance filling the gas tank to get to work with feeding their kids.







:

But Eilonwy, wouldn't you agree that even poor people can make the effort to look put together? You don't have to be rocking designer clothes and shoes. Just clean (you can wash by hand and hang to dry) and neat looking. I mean, to care about your appearance as a reflection of how you feel about yourself and, unfortunately, how others perceive your race.

My dad grew up in Nigeria dirt poor but took great pride in pressing his one pair of shorts and one washing his one singlet (tank top) to go to school (shoeless).


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
After reading your words and recalling what I told a coworker last week I might have to recant some of what I said earlier.

Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. *She looked a hot busted ghetto mess and informed her that she was bringing down the race.* before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.









That might be me one day.

I refuse - refuse - and have from a very young age - to take on the responsibility of representing my race. No. I am *not* every black woman. I don't want anyone to think that my words, thoughts, dress, actions, or behavior represent every black woman/person - because it's a lie. And I've told people (including my momma) that straight up. I'm me. I'm Kiya. I am black, but that doesn't mean that there is another black person alive who would agree with me on everything - so why should I pretend that there is?

Why do we continue to propagate the idea that *one* of us should represent us *all* - and then get salty when others expect all of us to act/react/behave/talk/carry ourselves the same?

She was a heavily pregnant woman, running out to get her check, wearing what she felt like wearing. Please don't expect her to 'represent' the black race, and please don't feel like her appearance would make your coworkers expect you to walk in the next day looking like who did what. I would think that the POC who have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race, did it so that any woman (or man) can step out of the house being who *they* are and representing themselves, not some image of what the rest of the world *wants* them to be. Tis most of the point of freedom, ain't it?

I'll have to check out that Obama link when I get home, as the workspot blocks blogspot addys.


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## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. She looked a hot busted ghetto mess *and informed her that she was bringing down the race.* before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.

Depending on what day of the month it is, I think I too might be humiliating my race.







I like my comfort clothes- what can I say. I have been known to wear my bleach stained sweats to the grocer.

How is this any different than going up to a woman who doesn't relax her and wears it natural? I have been given cards by hair dressers begging me to come in so they can fix my hair and I can be more presentable. Where does one draw the line what is acceptable presentation that represents an entire race?

I'm sure you were trying to help her by pointing out the error of her ways, but it might have had the effect of shaming her instead.


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## rootzdawta

FWIW, I don't think we should all be spending our lives trying to represent our race. I don't know about you all, but in a lot of circumstance I and my sons are the only Black people at events (if I leave my town). Even if I don't consciously do it, I feel it. Having to be a "good" representation. I might not have said anything to that woman but if she were walking into an all-White office looking that way, I would feel embarrassed. Involuntarily. Trust me, there have been times when I am the only Black person and when I open my mouth to speak and folks find out I'm educated, well, they just look plain surprised and I think to myself, "Well, good, I busted up another stereotype this person held." I find myself making damn sure they see my wedding ring.

And in terms of hair, believe it or not, I don't think White people are really all that hung up about our hair's naturally coily texture. I think Black people have more of a complex about it than White folks as I've never received a negative comment from a White person about my hair (usually either curious or complimentary) but Black people seem to always have some isht to say.


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
But Eilonwy, wouldn't you agree that even poor people can make the effort to look put together? You don't have to be rocking designer clothes and shoes. Just clean (you can wash by hand and hang to dry) and neat looking. I mean, to care about your appearance as a reflection of how you feel about yourself and, unfortunately, how others perceive your race.

Then I guess ya'll should be greatful that nobody can tell what race I am anyway. There's effort and there's effort. Me, nine months pregnant? Be greatful I'm wearing a shirt at all. I care about my appearance, but right now I'm a complete wreck. I cannot take a shower-- our ever-so-lovely landlord "fixed" the furnace so that it doesn't work. I have no hot water unless I spend an hour boiling it, pot by pot, on the stove. I'm wearing a fleece sweatshirt not because I'm cold, but because my two long-sleeved shirts are in the wash. Said sweatshirt is a complete wreck-- it's got two stains that never wash out, at least one visible spot of baby puke, and stains from lunch (courtesy of the two year old). We won't even get into my hair.

What if I had a busy morning, and needed to run to work to grab my check by X:00? Should I fail to collect the money that I earned just because I can't get all dressed up right this minute enough to impress someone else?









Quote:

My dad grew up in Nigeria dirt poor but took great pride in pressing his one pair of shorts and one washing his one singlet (tank top) to go to school (shoeless).
Yes, but if he had to keep those things nice for school and he didn't have anything else to wear when he *wasn't* in school, what then? Even poverty in America is expensive, and it's very different to be poor in a city in the US than in a village in Nigeria. There are some things which can be managed-- I can wash clothing in cold water in the bathtub (and heck yeah I've done it) but it's an inefficient process... washing a pair of shorts and a tank top for a child is very different from washing even a single outfit for everyone in a six-person family.

I think it's clear, though, that Andrew's Mother and I are are living in very different realities. I think that eating out once a day (anywhere!) is *extravagant.* I can't imagine thinking that it's some kind of divine right. I can count on one hand the number of Hanna Andersson items that have passed through our home, and that's including hand-me-downs.







It's just not my world. If my biggest money problem was that I could "only" afford to eat out once a week, I wouldn't *have* money problems.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
However, I do notice that when i dont do those things, i take in ALL KINDS of negativity and EVERYTHING affects me deeply. Im not as confident and assured. When im taking care of myself, i feel invincible. So, i dunno that its cultural, tho it could be in some aspects (black women not wanting to be caught "looking a hot mess"), but i think its more of a woman thing than anything.

ETA, on second thought, it could be cultural. I mean think about it. *Wha was the first thing your mother told you when you went out in public with her? DON'T embarrass me.* And I think that stays with us. My mother used to dress me like a lil doll, ALL day, EVERYDAY. A lot of mothers do this. Then as we grow up, we become representations of our families and better yet our "race"/skin color/ethnicity/etc. In a sea of white faces, do you REALLY wanna be the only sista there AND looking busted and disgusted? Do you really want your hair to look "off" so that someone can walk by and think "Mmm, look at that sista or black woman looking a mess?" . I mean, generally, you don't care, but sometimes you do.

I do think we unknowingly and unwillingly represent each other when we are out and about. And I think part of us, subconciously, keeps that thought in our minds all the time, so we try NOT to be "embarrassing" to our friends, family or skin. We want to be taken seriously in all aspects and appearance is most definitely one of them.


Sitting here nodding my head in agreement with you







. The part I bolded was what I was thinking about as a cultural piece. Growing up, my folks never had money but the attitude was instilled in me that when you leave the house make sure you got clean undies on (in case you dropped dead or something







) and that you were put toegther well. In my famaily that meant cleam ironed clothes. Do you know to this day, I still iron my clothes and I have even started ironing dd's clothes and she's 3.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
If it is a cultural thing, it's something I must have missed being raised by a white woman.










Actually I do wonder it being raised by a Black woman is different than being raised by a white woman







. I have known women who were biracial and raised by Black women and in many instances their outlook on life mirrored mine and I was raised by 2 Black parents. On the other hand women I know raised by white women, at times to me do appear to have a different perspective. Again, I do think culture plays a role.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. She looked a hot busted ghetto mess and informed her that she was bringing down the race. before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.

At times I feel the same way especially living in Maine. There are so few of us (folks of color) that sadly there are many that do see the few of us as representative of the entire race. No, its not fair but it happens. Heck, I am guilty on the flipside of judging white men in pick-up trucks with a negative lens based off the stupidity of a few, though I am working on it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I read an *excellent* blog this morning: The Obama Effect. I would love if you all would read it and comment here or there.

Girl, I swear we hang at the same sites and blogs







. She is on my daily hitlist of blogs, will comment there later.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I'm sure she looked awful. I'm sure she *felt* awful too... but what makes you think she can afford anything else? Maybe she has other priorities right now. If it comes down to spending $3 on a new pair of shoes or spending it on a loaf of bread and a jar of peanut butter to feed my kids, you'd damn well better believe it's going to be the latter. As humiliated as you felt, I'm sure she felt a thousand times worse. I'm not saying that this particular woman has any excuse, but I'm much more inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

This is, in my opinion, one more thing that's wrong with our society. Where does anyone get off being angry with poor people? You *ought* to be angry with the CEO of Exxon Mobile, making money hand-over-fist on people who are trying to balance filling the gas tank to get to work with feeding their kids.







:

True, she may have had other priorities but honestly showing up at her place of employment even on her off day dressed like that if its not the norm is not cool. The description sounds like less of a money issue and more like she didn't care.

Totally agree, right now we should all be mad at those Wall Street cats who have been living greasy for years and are now getting bailed out. Hello... where's my bailout? That's right average folk don't get one







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
But Eilonwy, wouldn't you agree that even poor people can make the effort to look put together? You don't have to be rocking designer clothes and shoes. Just clean (you can wash by hand and hang to dry) and neat looking. I mean, to care about your appearance as a reflection of how you feel about yourself and, unfortunately, how others perceive your race.

My dad grew up in Nigeria dirt poor but took great pride in pressing his one pair of shorts and one washing his one singlet (tank top) to go to school (shoeless).

ITA w/you. Poor does not mean you can't look put together.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Yes, but if he had to keep those things nice for school and he didn't have anything else to wear when he *wasn't* in school, what then? Even poverty in America is expensive, and it's very different to be poor in a city in the US than in a village in Nigeria. There are some things which can be managed-- I can wash clothing in cold water in the bathtub (and heck yeah I've done it) but it's an inefficient process... washing a pair of shorts and a tank top for a child is very different from washing even a single outfit for everyone in a six-person family.

When he wasn't in school, he generally wore his only other pair of shorts/briefs.









Are you saying it's more difficult to live in poverty in the U.S. then in Nigeria? Because when my father was growing up, the cold water in the bathtub was gotten by walking a couple of miles to the river to get it not by turning on the faucet. I always think that if looking neat was such a priority to him, I could whip out an iron from time to time.

I mean, I think, there's American poverty and then there's poverty in a third world nation. And while they're both awful, I don't think they compare.

And, FWIW, my grandmother when she was living with us abhorred washing machines as she was quite used to washing clothes for a family much larger than six people. By hand. And she did it quite efficiently. And my mom (oldest of eight), to save a couple of cents from the laundromat, when she was healthier, could also do a load or two by hand. Efficiently.


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## Arike

My granny came from rural Mississippi, DIRT poor. Literally like 5 dollars in her pocket when she migrated to a town right outside of Chicago. She worked a lot to support herself and my mom. And sometimes she didn't eat so that my mom would never go hungry. Yes, they were poor but my grandmother always looked neat, clean and put together. She made a lot of her clothes too. When I look at the pictures of her from back and the day, I am always amazed at how great she always looked. I mean really gorgeous from head to toe!
When I visited friends in Nigeria, I stayed in a village where people were not affluent at all. But everyone looked neat and clean. And not to dismiss the men, but the women looked amazing! But I guess maybe it is different having clothing made for the most part as opposed to buying from retailers...

I am currently pregnant and even though I could have the baby at any moment at this point, I still step out of the house looking together. I think one day I wore a matching sweat suit to the grocery store and I felt really dressed down and casual. I have been rocking cute dresses this whole pregnancy and please believe I am a bargain hunter and have no shame in shopping for 20-40 dollar dresses!


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
*I'm sure she looked awful. I'm sure she *felt* awful too... but what makes you think she can afford anything else?* Maybe she has other priorities right now. If it comes down to spending $3 on a new pair of shoes or spending it on a loaf of bread and a jar of peanut butter to feed my kids, you'd damn well better believe it's going to be the latter. As humiliated as you felt, *I'm sure she felt a thousand times worse*. I'm not saying that this particular woman has any excuse, but I'm much more inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

This is, in my opinion, one more thing that's wrong with our society. Where does anyone get off being angry with poor people? You *ought* to be angry with the CEO of Exxon Mobile, making money hand-over-fist on people who are trying to balance filling the gas tank to get to work with feeding their kids.







:

Feeling awful is not an excuse for failing to having pride in your appearance. I felt awful EVERYDAY of my pregnancy, but I always looked nice when i walked out the front door.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Um, this is my







post









I just wanted to celebrate that, here, in my most favoritest place to be on MDC.














:









:CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!







:


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
When he wasn't in school, he generally wore his only other pair of shorts/briefs.









Spectacular... but if you're in the US and you have two pairs of shorts for your child, that's considered inadequate. They can't take your kids for being poor, but they sure can make your life miserable.

Quote:

Are you saying it's more difficult to live in poverty in the U.S. then in Nigeria? Because when my father was growing up, the cold water in the bathtub was gotten by walking a couple of miles to the river to get it not by turning on the faucet. I always think that if looking neat was such a priority to him, I could whip out an iron from time to time.

I mean, I think, *there's American poverty and then there's poverty in a third world nation. And while they're both awful, I don't think they compare.*
Exactly my point. I never said it's more difficult (though I would argue that in some ways, it is)-- I said it's expensive to live in poverty in the US. The two are very different, and no, they *don't* compare. In other words, your father's situation growing up doesn't change the fact that my priorities have to be different. If I had no running water, what then? There is no river a couple of miles away for me to walk to, and if I made my five year old carry a bucket with me?







Looking neat could be a priority for him; Many days, it doesn't make my list.

Quote:

And, FWIW, my grandmother when she was living with us abhorred washing machines as she was quite used to washing clothes for a family much larger than six people. By hand. And she did it quite efficiently. And my mom (oldest of eight), to save a couple of cents from the laundromat, when she was healthier, could also do a load or two by hand. Efficiently.
Congratulations; I was raised by a woman who thought that her clothing magically reappeared in her closests in the morning after she'd thrown them on the floor in the evening. I've handwashed loads of laundry and I loathe it. These days, people look at you like you're crazy if you mention it-- *nobody* does that, do they?









And it still doesn't address the bathing issue. There's only so much you can do with cold water, and no matter who you ask or how you explain, it is time and labor intensive-- a hell of a lot moreso than stepping into a shower. I can bathe myself from top to bottom in a hot minute if I have access to hot running water and a shower. Hell, I can wash myself and all four kids in five minutes. Without it? Not a prayer. I can't put the baby in the water at all, I have to do it with a washcloth which I then have to hold and warm in my hands. Even then, the water is cold and he fusses and tries to escape my grasp. At best it takes ten minutes per child, and they're all usually screaming bloody murder by the end of it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother*
Feeling awful is not an excuse for failing to having pride in your appearance. I felt awful EVERYDAY of my pregnancy, but I always looked nice when i walked out the front door.

You misunderstand me-- I'm saying that she may very well have felt awful about the way that she looked, and probably did. You didn't need to make her feel worse. Believe me, 99% of people who walk out the door looking "a hot ghetto mess" are well aware of it and feel like crap already. I looked like crap throughout most of my pregnant days, because nothing fit right and I couldn't afford better/more. Someone throwing a fit at me because I wasn't wearing a neat, tidy Liz Lange outfit and a spiffy new pair of shoes would only have caused a scene as I disolved into hysterical hormonal tears, or exploded in retaliation asking if they were planning to give me a credit card any time soon. At the most polite, they'd get a sickly sweet smile followed by, "Thanks, I'd LOVE some new clothing. Here's my information, why don't you have that delivered to my door? Or you could just give me your credit card number and take care of the bills yourself..."







:


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 







That might be me one day.

I refuse - refuse - and have from a very young age - to take on the responsibility of representing my race. No. I am *not* every black woman. I don't want anyone to think that my words, thoughts, dress, actions, or behavior represent every black woman/person - because it's a lie. And I've told people (including my momma) that straight up. I'm me. I'm Kiya. I am black, but that doesn't mean that there is another black person alive who would agree with me on everything - so why should I pretend that there is?

Why do we continue to propagate the idea that *one* of us should represent us *all* - and then get salty when others expect all of us to act/react/behave/talk/carry ourselves the same?

She was a heavily pregnant woman, running out to get her check, wearing what she felt like wearing. Please don't expect her to 'represent' the black race, and please don't feel like her appearance would make your coworkers expect you to walk in the next day looking like who did what. I would think that the POC who have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race, did it so that any woman (or man) can step out of the house being who *they* are and representing themselves, not some image of what the rest of the world *wants* them to be. Tis most of the point of freedom, ain't it?

I'll have to check out that Obama link when I get home, as the workspot blocks blogspot addys.

Thinking that I am a representative how my race is a part of me and *my* culture, a source of pride. Why would I not want to be my best and work hard to uplift/represent my people?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Sitting here nodding my head in agreement with you







. The part I bolded was what I was thinking about as a cultural piece. Growing up, my folks never had money but the attitude was instilled in me that when you leave the house make sure you got clean undies on (in case you dropped dead or something







) and that you were put toegther well. In my famaily that meant cleam ironed clothes. Do you know to this day, I still iron my clothes and I have even started ironing dd's clothes and she's 3.









I was told to wear clean panties for the same reason. I was alson told to wear a slip so that if I had to undress I would not be naked. We dressed up to go shopping, not sunday dressed up, but we did not leave the house dressed in easy clothing. My shoes were always polished any my laces were always clean. The little things really do matter

I can't walk out of my house or sit around the house in wrinked clothing. I have ironed DS's clothing since day one, undershirts too if they are wrinkled.









Actually I do wonder it being raised by a Black woman is different than being raised by a white woman







. I have known women who were biracial and raised by Black women and in many instances their outlook on life mirrored mine and I was raised by 2 Black parents. On the other hand women I know raised by white women, at times to me do appear to have a different perspective. Again, I do think culture plays a role.

Your question remind me of Cara from the 6th grade. She was biracial, but her adoptive parents were white. Cara, wore faded shirts, grungy blue jeans and sported a tightly coiled afro. The two other black girls in my class and myself, while natural wore our combed in plaits, and dressed nicely everyday. We were three black girls one of the best private schools in the city, so we HAD to dress the part. We had no other choice.

At times I feel the same way especially living in Maine. There are so few of us (folks of color) that sadly there are many that do see the few of us as representative of the entire race. No, its not fair but it happens. Heck, I am guilty on the flipside of judging white men in pick-up trucks with a negative lens based off the stupidity of a few, though I am working on it.

Some of the nicest white men that I know dip snuff, drive pick up trucks and call *themselves* ********!









True, she may have had other priorities but honestly showing up at her place of employment even on her off day dressed like that if its not the norm is not cool. The description sounds like less of a money issue and more like she didn't care.
Sadly, she does not care. The day that she came in to pick up her check was the day that I chose to ask her why she presented herself on a daily basis in a similar manner.

Totally agree, right now we should all be mad at those Wall Street cats who have been living greasy for years and are now getting bailed out. Hello... where's my bailout? That's right average folk don't get one







:

ITA w/you. Poor does not mean you can't look put together.

I totally agree!


----------



## jeca

I think that we have cultural norms for us that may not be present in other races. We did not grow up poor and my mother made sure that when stepping out of the house we were "presentable", period. I make sure to do the same. I have friends who run to the grocer in their jammies with their in babies in tow with nothing but t-shirts and diapers on that's okay for them but I simply was taught not to do so.















Why am I the only black mama at my kids schools pushing a minivan? Everyone else has an SUV or a car if they don't have many kids. What is it with us and SUVs? I traded in my SUV( DH's precious navigator at that, lol) for the minivan and every mama of color I know has asked me why in the world did I do a thing like that? Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmm.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Thinking that I am a representative how my race is a part of me and *my* culture, a source of pride. Why would I not want to be my best and work hard to uplift/represent my people?

Ah, and to me, that proves the point I was trying to make. Despite us being the same _*color*_, we have huge *cultural* differences. Thus, how you think/expect others to think is very different from how I think/expect others to think.

I wouldn't accurately represent you, and you wouldn't accurately represent me, so why can't we just be individuals instead of a block that is expected to be homogeneously 'black'?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Spectacular... but if you're in the US and you have two pairs of shorts for your child, that's considered inadequate. They can't take your kids for being poor, but they sure can make your life miserable.

Not sure what this has to do with looking neat when going out. That means, then, that the average poor U.S. child would have more clothes than the average poor Nigerian child which = more opportunity to look neat in public. As far as I know, there are no thrift stores in Nigeria. Where I am, you can at least get cheap, decent clothes for your kids.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Exactly my point. I never said it's more difficult (though I would argue that in some ways, it is)-- I said it's expensive to live in poverty in the US. The two are very different, and no, they *don't* compare. In other words, your father's situation growing up doesn't change the fact that my priorities have to be different. If I had no running water, what then? There is no river a couple of miles away for me to walk to, and if I made my five year old carry a bucket with me?







Looking neat could be a priority for him; Many days, it doesn't make my list.

Looking neat when going out is not a priority to you. Many are saying that culturally, for them, it is.

And, more than likely, you have indoor plumbing if you live in the U.S., by default.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Congratulations; I was raised by a woman who thought that her clothing magically reappeared in her closests in the morning after she'd thrown them on the floor in the evening. I've handwashed loads of laundry and I loathe it. These days, people look at you like you're crazy if you mention it-- *nobody* does that, do they?









I don't really care if people think I'm crazy. I've cloth diapered both my boys and got more than a few sideways glances for mentioning it. If I had no access to a washing machine, you best believe I'd be busting down suds to wash my family's clothes and wouldn't care less what folks think. Looking clean, neat and presentable is a priority to me.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
And it still doesn't address the bathing issue. There's only so much you can do with cold water, and no matter who you ask or how you explain, it is time and labor intensive-- a hell of a lot moreso than stepping into a shower. I can bathe myself from top to bottom in a hot minute if I have access to hot running water and a shower. Hell, I can wash myself and all four kids in five minutes. Without it? Not a prayer. I can't put the baby in the water at all, I have to do it with a washcloth which I then have to hold and warm in my hands. Even then, the water is cold and he fusses and tries to escape my grasp. At best it takes ten minutes per child, and they're all usually screaming bloody murder by the end of it.

Actually, when I lived in a situation with no hot water, what we did was to boil two large pots of water on the stove. Fill a bucket halfway with cold and halfway with the boiled hot water, you have warm water for bathing. Use a small bowl, scoop water on yourself to wet yourself up, soap up/wash up, use the bowl to scoop water to rinse off. This is how we bathed when we visited Nigeria too except we boiled the water over a small kerosene cook-top.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
You misunderstand me-- I'm saying that she may very well have felt awful about the way that she looked, and probably did. You didn't need to make her feel worse. Believe me, 99% of people who walk out the door looking "a hot ghetto mess" are well aware of it and feel like crap already. I looked like crap throughout most of my pregnant days, because nothing fit right and I couldn't afford better/more. Someone throwing a fit at me because I wasn't wearing a neat, tidy Liz Lange outfit and a spiffy new pair of shoes would only have caused a scene as I disolved into hysterical hormonal tears, or exploded in retaliation asking if they were planning to give me a credit card any time soon. At the most polite, they'd get a sickly sweet smile followed by, "Thanks, I'd LOVE some new clothing. Here's my information, why don't you have that delivered to my door? Or you could just give me your credit card number and take care of the bills yourself..."







:

Eilonwy, it's not about new clothing. It's about doing the *best* you can do with what you have. If it's old clothing, at the very least make it clean clothing. I get that depression plays into it a great deal but we are talking about the culture surrounding looking our *best* when going out (as it is, I'd posit a direct reaction to the racism and discrimination in this society).


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Ah, and to me, that proves the point I was trying to make. Despite us being the same _*color*_, we have huge *cultural* differences. Thus, how you think/expect others to think is very different from how I think/expect others to think.

I wouldn't accurately represent you, and you wouldn't accurately represent me, so why can't we just be individuals instead of a block that is expected to be homogeneously 'black'?

Yes, there are cultural differences but there are common threads that underpin our various Black cultures.

It is not about being homogeneously black. We know that's not a reality.

It is about being Black in a racist society and the defense mechanisms that are culturally in place (across the spectrum) to counteract further "reasons" for why racism is justified.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think that we have cultural norms for us that may not be present in other races. We did not grow up poor and my mother made sure that when stepping out of the house we were "presentable", period. I make sure to do the same. I have friends who run to the grocer in their jammies with their in babies in tow with nothing but t-shirts and diapers on that's okay for them but I simply was taught not to do so.









See, that's why I wanted to have this discussion here rather than in the finance section because by and large my experience is that there is a cultural norm with WOC (specifically Black woman no matter where in the diaspora they hail from) around appearance.

To this day, I don't even run to the store unless I have showered and look halfway presentable. My dh who is white laughs about the fact that I won't even go to the farmers market unless I look decent. That might simply mean jeans and sweatshirt and some sneakers with some lipgloss on. Heck, even in labor, I had to make sure I had some earrings on LOL... My MW was laughing at how put together I was for a woman in labor, yet I see pictures of my Black friends and almost everyone, even in labor had earrings on, had either braided up their hair or had a scarf on (that's what I did). On the flipside with my white girlfriends, I haven't noticed that at all.

Then you add the issue of maybe being broke, yet I still see the cultural norms at play. Right now I only have a few pairs of pants and tops yet I match em well and still won't go out if I feel funky.

Now I know some of the younger sisters may feel different but at almost 36, most sistas I know are similiar to me.

Jeca, yeah I have buddies here who run out in jammies and shoot, I don't even like to be on my porch or my yard like that. Just not me.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yes, there are cultural differences but there are common threads that underpin our various Black cultures.

It is not about being homogeneously black. We know that's not a reality.

It is about being Black in a racist society and the defense mechanisms that are culturally in place (across the spectrum) to counteract further "reasons" for why racism is justified.

*sigh*

And I maintain, that just because your skin color is black, does not mean that you automatically share or buy into any of those 'common threads' of culture.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Ah, and to me, that proves the point I was trying to make. Despite us being the same _*color*_, we have huge *cultural* differences. Thus, how you think/expect others to think is very different from how I think/expect others to think.

I wouldn't accurately represent you, and you wouldn't accurately represent me, so why can't we just be individuals instead of a block that is expected to be homogeneously 'black'?


By no means are we a homogenous group, yet in many cases (not all) we have similarities. I find it fascinating that even in this small group, overall many of us have had similiar experiences despite class differences or being from different places in the diaspora. Again there will always be exceptions, that's to be expected.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 







Why am I the only black mama at my kids schools pushing a minivan? Everyone else has an SUV or a car if they don't have many kids. What is it with us and SUVs? I traded in my SUV( DH's precious navigator at that, lol) for the minivan and every mama of color I know has asked me why in the world did I do a thing like that? Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmm.

Well once we are ready to have another car note I am going straight to the Honda Dealership to purcahse a Odyssey Touring edition. Nothing else will suffice. The Honda Odyssey, while not my dream car, is the perfect minivan and I so want one. Van's have more leg room and and luggage space.

I did not want an SUV, but we paid $1700 dollars cash for a Ford Explorer so I will not complain. I have transportation!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Actually, when I lived in a situation with no hot water, what we did was to boil two large pots of water on the stove. Fill a bucket halfway with cold and halfway with the boiled hot water, you have warm water for bathing. Use a small bowl, scoop water on yourself to wet yourself up, soap up/wash up, use the bowl to scoop water to rinse off. This is how we bathed when we visited Nigeria too except we boiled the water over a small kerosene cook-top.

Right-- so go back and re-read my first response. You have to pick up your check by 2 p.m. and no later. You wake up and you've got a sick baby to deal with, followed by phone calls, followed by who knows what. You put a load of laundry in the wash and next thing you know it's 1:30 and you're 35 minutes away from work. Do you have time to boil water on the stove? No.

I'm just not a fan of the "no excuses" mentality. I mean where does it end? I don't think there's any excuse for a woman to weigh more than 250 pounds, I don't care if she's six feet tall and pregnant with quintuplets she should keep her ass smaller than a size 12. I don't think there's any excuse for illiteracy, I don't care if you're dyslexic and grew up being beaten by your alcoholic stepfather, if slaves could learn to read you can too.

I'd rather give people the benefit of the doubt. How does it help ANYONE to have people throwing fits at other people who "choose" to go out looking a complete wreck? It *doesn't*. It's more divisiveness, more resentment, and more unhappiness for the world. I'm not a fan.







I don't think it's cute or funny and I honestly can't relate. Yes, I have looked at people and thought, "My GAWD I can't believe she's going out in public looking like that!" but it would never occur to me to walk up to someone I didn't know very, very well and tell them that they looked "a hot mess" and to tell them that they were embarassing to me. Why should they care what I think about the way they're dressed? Why should I expect that they are willing or able to look "better," by my standards?

Quote:

Eilonwy, it's not about new clothing. It's about doing the *best* you can do with what you have. If it's old clothing, at the very least make it clean clothing. I get that depression plays into it a great deal but we are talking about the culture surrounding looking our *best* when going out (as it is, I'd posit a direct reaction to the racism and discrimination in this society).
Not new-- properly fitted. What if you don't have any? What if clean is relative, or very temporary? I've got a child with severe reflux; I can choose a) to wear a dirty shirt, b) to wear every single shirt that I own every single day regardless of fit or appropriateness or c) never to hold or carry my baby if I'm also planning to leave the house. That's just *one* example, but there are many more. I can think of lots of reasons that what you call the bare minimum for going out might not be a reasonable expectation to have of anyone else, let alone everyone else.

Honestly, I don't think that you'd care if the clothing was clean and pressed if it was a size 8 dress trying futilely to be wrapped around a size 14 body. You've got a whole series of expectations, then, and every last one of them would have to be addressed.

Yes, of course depression is a factor but I'm not even talking about that-- I'm talking about the actual *ability* to "look nice," and I'm telling you that there are *plenty* of perfectly valid explanations. I'm saying that the "no excuses" mentality is harmful not only to the people who really can't change things but to the people espousing it as ideal. It's just not helpful. I can't giggle over it. If I was in that office and overheard that "conversation," I'd feel a lot more embarassed by the person doing the yelling than the woman dressed like crap.







If you're that worried about the way she dresses, bring in a bag of your old stuff and offer it to her. Leave an anonymous envelope of cash at her desk. There are LOADS of things you could do to improve that situation for her and the one you perceive to be there for yourself without shaming her and embarassing yourself by acting a fool.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Not sure what this has to do with looking neat when going out. That means, then, that the average poor U.S. child would have more clothes than the average poor Nigerian child which = more opportunity to look neat in public. As far as I know, there are no thrift stores in Nigeria. Where I am, you can at least get cheap, decent clothes for your kids.
I don't really care if people think I'm crazy. I've cloth diapered both my boys and got more than a few sideways glances for mentioning it. If I had no access to a washing machine, you best believe I'd be busting down suds to wash my family's clothes and wouldn't care less what folks think. Looking clean, neat and presentable is a priority to me.

Eilonwy, it's not about new clothing. It's about doing the *best* you can do with what you have. If it's old clothing, at the very least make it clean clothing. I get that depression plays into it a great deal but we are talking about the culture surrounding looking our *best* when going out (as it is, I'd posit a direct reaction to the racism and discrimination in this society).


Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yes, there are cultural differences but there are common threads that underpin our various Black cultures.

It is not about being homogeneously black. We know that's not a reality.

*It is about being Black in a racist society and the defense mechanisms that are culturally in place (across the spectrum) to counteract further "reasons" for why racism is justified*.




shayinme said:


> See, that's why I wanted to have this discussion here rather than in the finance section because by and large my experience is that there is a cultural norm with WOC (specifically Black woman no matter where in the diaspora they hail from) around appearance.
> 
> *To this day, I don't even run to the store unless I have showered and look halfway presentable. My dh who is white laughs about the fact that I won't even go to the farmers market unless I look decent. That might simply mean jeans and sweatshirt and some sneakers with some lipgloss on.* Heck, even in labor, I had to make sure I had some earrings on LOL... My MW was laughing at how put together I was for a woman in labor, yet I see pictures of my Black friends and almost everyone, even in labor had earrings on, had either braided up their hair or had a scarf on (that's what I did). On the flipside with my white girlfriends, I haven't noticed that at all.
> 
> *Then you add the issue of maybe being broke, yet I still see the cultural norms at play. Right now I only have a few pairs of pants and tops yet I match em well and still won't go out if I feel funky.
> 
> Now I know some of the younger sisters may feel different but at almost 36, most sistas I know are similiar to me.
> 
> Jeca, yeah I have buddies here who run out in jammies and shoot, I don't even like to be on my porch or my yard like that. Just not me.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *shayinme*
> *By no means are we a homogenous group, yet in many cases (not all) we have similarities. I find it fascinating that even in this small group, overall many of us have had similiar experiences despite class differences or being from different places in the diaspora. Again there will always be exceptions, that's to be expected*.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
*sigh*

And I maintain, that just because your skin color is black, does not mean that you automatically share or buy into any of those 'common threads' of culture.

If you are a person of color, you deal with institutionalized racism and oppression. We all have that in common. All I am saying is that because of that commonality, whatever culture/set of beliefs you ascribe to as a person of color would have aspects of it that are a reaction to that. And those aspects, in my estimation, are similar (not exactly the same) across the board.

So while Igbo culture today might be different that AA culture today or Jamaican culture today, because we have all had a similar experience, the product (our current culture) will have similarities. Heck, amongst Igbo people, there are differences but there is _something_ holding us all together. All we are doing in this thread is speculating as to what those similarities might be and why it is.

I guess we have to agree to disagree.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Right-- so go back and re-read my first response. You have to pick up your check by 2 p.m. and no later. You wake up and you've got a sick baby to deal with, followed by phone calls, followed by who knows what. You put a load of laundry in the wash and next thing you know it's 1:30 and you're 35 minutes away from work. Do you have time to boil water on the stove? No.

Well to quell the last minute argument. She came for her check at 12 and was told that she could not have it until after 4. She left, went home and returned 4 hours later in the same clothes. Her oldest son was in daycare and she TOLD me that she got out of bed to come and pick up her check.

Yes, of course depression is a factor but I'm not even talking about that-- I'm talking about the actual *ability* to "look nice," and I'm telling you that there are *plenty* of perfectly valid explanations. I'm saying that the "no excuses" mentality is harmful not only to the people who really can't change things but to the people espousing it as ideal. It's just not helpful. I can't giggle over it. If I was in that office and overheard that "conversation," I'd feel a lot more embarassed by the person doing the yelling than the woman dressed like crap.







If you're that worried about the way she dresses, bring in a bag of your old stuff and offer it to her. Leave an anonymous envelope of cash at her desk. There are LOADS of things you could do to improve that situation for her and the one you perceive to be there for yourself without shaming her and embarassing yourself by acting a fool.

There wasn't any yelling, and at the time there were only two people present. People HAVE given her clothing, and I even offered to assist her with finding a car seat so that her oldest child would have one. On more than one level this girl just does not care. If you will strap your 19 month old into a regular seat belt and allow your drunk grandfather to drive your child to and from your job, do you really care? She always has 3 days worth of dirt under her nails, but her weave and tips are always done. I have extended my hand to help, everyone has. I work with low income people on a daily basis. The same resources that are offered to members of the community near my job were extended to my coworker.

She was given the opportunity to attend parenting classes that would provide her with maternity cothing and baby items, but she repeatedly failed to attend the classes because she did not want to go.

We are supposed to serve as a role model for the youth that we serve at our job and she is not able to do that. If she looks a hot mess, how can she tell impressionable teen girls how to dress? If the staff is not the standard for acceptable dress, who is. And yes she has worn the same ratty pants to work, why? Because they are comfortable.........







:


----------



## oyinmama

dang, i need to check in on this thread more often! my hugs and support goes out to all of you mamas who are dealing with financial troubles right now. we are finally financially stable after dealing with a 'private recession' of our own - an extremely scary span of about four years during which we dealt with collections activity, loss of jobs, extended unemployment, loss of our apartment, having to move in with family (which we felt as extremely humiliating.) in short, all our most horrific financial nightmares came true. during that time, there was lots of ramen, lots of thrifting, lots of handmade clothes/beauty treatments, and lots of little ways to feel special (for instance a long walk to the farmer's market and peaches on the way home). we had no children during this time, so our stakes were a little less high than they are now, but we definitely feel like it was a trial by fire for our marriage. we did survive. so will all of you and i'm sending you blessings and heavy good wishes for more abundant, more secure times in the very immediate future.







:

i was raised by very creative, very broke people. but i didn't know we were broke until sometime in my teens. my parents did a great job of teaching us about money and thrift in a way that just felt like the way things were, rather than like a big dramatic lack. there was always enough food, and i was a big child before i realized not everyone had homemade clothes or furniture or toys. i'm talking, stilts made from coffee cans, bikes assembled from parts, bunk beds tables and bookshelves made entirely from 2x4s and plywood. it was a cheerful, happy, creative, bookfilled house and i thank my parents for creating it for us. the only childhood memory i have that gave me an inkling that dollars were being stretched was one day when my sister and i woke up before my mother and wanted to make her breakfast in bed. (my mother doesn't even eat breakfast, LOL, but at 9 and 7 we hadn't yet noticed this) we made her an only-slightly-singed scrambled egg and toast, and when we presented it to her, i remember her surprise and then her disappointment - 'that egg could have made pancakes for all of us.' then she told us to go ahead and eat it, she wasn't hungry.

when i imagine now how heartbreaking that morning must have been from her side of the kitchen table, i am amazed.

anyhoo. holes in shoes? resoling them is less expensive than getting a new pair. need a facial? yogurt mask and sugar scrub. (doubles as breakfast tomorrow) there are great moneysaving tips out there.

my problem now, given my background, is a bizarro world problem. our work is nearly 24/7 and we do not have the time to be as creatively productive as we are used to - i haven't opened my sewing machine in more than a year b/c i do not have the time. we actually bought a halloween costume for the baby, and even though it is fun and adorable, i am kind of embarrassed to have *bought* a costume from the store. growing up, ours were always home made, and i feel bad that i haven't yet made any of my baby boy's clothes or toys. hopefully, as we get more efficient with the biz, we will be able to take time off to do more.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, I read an *excellent* blog this morning: The Obama Effect. I would love if you all would read it and comment here or there.

But, can we actually talk about his vision of "hope" without the delusions of living in a "postracial" society? The bottom line is no way, no how, is a "postracial society" going to come about after 400 years of slavery and Native American genocide, 70 years of legal racial segregation, and 30 years of legal desegregation and social resegregation. *When we can't face our history honestly, how can we envision a future realistically?*

DH and I have an on going conversation about the current racial situation. I am in denial, if I as an individual can't address my racial struggles, how can we as a nation.

Barack, if he wins, has a long road of him, but I am far from doubtful as to what we can accomplish.


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## purplegirl

woohoo. Our thread has picked up some steam. I grew up in what, some folks would consider, a 'privileged' background. I can't say it's all that it is cracked up to be. I never learned the value of a dollar and took being able to have whatever I wanted, for granted. It took a large part of my adulthood before I learned that I needed to respect money and financial matters. I was reckless and even as an adult, I knew I could count on my father to rescue me.every.time! UGH. I decided well into my 30's that I needed to take responsibility for myself and make better decisions. That was after jacking up my credit and being dirt poor.
My dh on the other hand grew up completely differently. He is a saver, resourceful and not materialistic at all. He likes nice things but is patient and won't jeopardize our financial well being for nothing. I have worked on my "gotta have it right now" ways and try to live below my means--ongoing struggle. I am self employed and make a seriously good salary. Why I am still struggling is beyond me. I mean I suppose if I were being honest, I am still not doing what I need to do to insure our financial solvency. Up thread, I mentioned struggling in this economy. As I examine myself closer, it doesn't have to be that way. My dh will not rescue me and I am glad about that!
I don't do thrift shops because I am short and trying to find clothes to accommodate my height is beyond frustrating. I wished I could. My dh does!! I have started taking my lunch, which is a big change for me. I thought nothing of spending 10 bucks a day or more on lunch. Since dh travels, I was also eating dinner out 5 days a week. Ridiculousness. I cook and take my lunch almost every day.

I'll address the cultural issues in another post cause at this point, I am rambling just a tad!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I don't know if it is cultural, but more of how you were raised. Getting dressed in the morning depresses me. I know that I should look better than I do on a daily basis, but facials and new clothes just are notin the budget. I own two pairs of jeans and a few shirts that I wear on a daily basis. I would much rather wear dresses cute shoes, but that is not my life right now.

I often look busten=d and DS looks the part of a little prince.

I did not grow up eating leftovers. In fact we ate out most days, The thought of cooking and cleaning the kitchen frustrates me. Why can't i eat out at a nice NON chain restaurant EVERYDAY. Is that too much to ask?
I try to plan inexpensive home cooked meals, but they lack panache. IMO cooking is just as expensive as eating out. I don't do frugal well, my expectations are too high.

I'm with you.
Things are so thin these days and it stinks. I own 2 pairs of jeans and 1 pair of pants that I wear regularly, and maybe 4 or 5 shirts that I rotate. My nursing bras are all a mess and not fitting right, and my some of my drawers are holey. I'm broke as all get out and it totally depresses me. Since we are a 1 income home right now, I feel guilty ask DH for money for myself.
I've never been a manicure/pedicure/salon person. These are luxuries I usually cannot afford. I've had one manicure/pedicure once in my life, and only then because someone paid for me. As for my hair, it took years of nagging by DH to finally get my hair done (which was only just a few months ago).
I don't have a problem asking for new stuff for DS, though. I'm a stickler about him looking clean and neat all the time.
Like someone else mentioned (Shay??), I live in a predominantly white area too and I'll be damned if anyone looks at my child sideways, thinking he's dirty.
Now don't get me wrong- I don't believe all white people believe this, but I won't have my child, often the only brown child in a sea of blond headed babies, looking unclean. My mother thinks I'm a little crazy because I insist that his clothes and face be spotless when he leaves the house.
I may not always be perfect looking, but DS must look clean.
Anyway, the bottom line is that I'm broke.







:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
After reading your words and recalling what I told a coworker last week I might have to recant some of what I said earlier.

Last week a pregnant coworker came to pick up her check. She looked a hot busted ghetto mess and informed her that she was bringing down the race. before she could speak I told her that pregnancy was not an excuse, as she uses it for EVERYTHING.

This girl walked out of her house in bleached stained tight yoga pants, a too small, dirty, wrinkled t-shirt, run over fake crocs (they cost $3. fake crocs should NEVER look run over),\ that did not match, dingy socks and an aunt jemima headreag. I was LIVID. Behind humiliated and ready to crawl under my desk.

I feel this way whenever I see WOC in public looking like the girl above, wearing slippers, robes, trashy clothing or around the housewear.

Too many POC alive and dead have worked and sacrificed far too much for the race so that this chick can sit anywhere on the bus with a doorag on her head.

When I was pregnant, I made a serious effort to look good and put together all the time. In fact, I don't think I ever felt prettier than when I was pregnant.
It's not that hard to look clean and neat, dammit.
There was a mother in the PTA at the school where I worked who was pregnant at the same time as me. I think she was wearing the same outfit your coworker was for the whole time she was pregnant...


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I don't do thrift shops because I am short and trying to find clothes to accommodate my height is beyond frustrating. I wished I could.









Short is difficult; short and fat (like myself) is impossible.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







Short is difficult; short and fat (like myself) is impossible.

Who you telling? I just left out the fat part







--impossible to find used clothes that fit!


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Who you telling? I just left out the fat part







--impossible to find used clothes that fit!









What's funny is that this has come up in another of my regular threads very recently. Perhaps we should start a "body doubles" tribe...


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## eilonwy

As an aside... fake crocs are at least $6. Doesn't sound like a lot of money, but it is twice what was posted and quite frankly, it can be a lot of money.


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well once we are ready to have another car note I am going straight to the Honda Dealership to purcahse a Odyssey Touring edition. Nothing else will suffice. The Honda Odyssey, while not my dream car, is the perfect minivan and I so want one.

I have a Honda Odyssey and let me say for a minivan it's very very nice.







:


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## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Actually, when I lived in a situation with no hot water, what we did was to boil two large pots of water on the stove. Fill a bucket halfway with cold and halfway with the boiled hot water, you have warm water for bathing. Use a small bowl, scoop water on yourself to wet yourself up, soap up/wash up, use the bowl to scoop water to rinse off. This is how we bathed when we visited Nigeria too except we boiled the water over a small kerosene cook-top











I remember doing this while in Nigeria. It didn't bother me at all. My mom on the other hand...she was the definition of a spoiled american!


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm with you.
Things are so thin these days and it stinks. I own 2 pairs of jeans and 1 pair of pants that I wear regularly, and maybe 4 or 5 shirts that I rotate. My nursing bras are all a mess and not fitting right, and my some of my drawers are holey. I'm broke as all get out and it totally depresses me. Since we are a 1 income home right now, I feel guilty ask DH for money for myself.
I've never been a manicure/pedicure/salon person. These are luxuries I usually cannot afford. I've had one manicure/pedicure once in my life, and only then because someone paid for me. As for my hair, it took years of nagging by DH to finally get my hair done (which was only just a few months ago).
I don't have a problem asking for new stuff for DS, though. I'm a stickler about him looking clean and neat all the time.
Like someone else mentioned (Shay??), I live in a predominantly white area too and I'll be damned if anyone looks at my child sideways, thinking he's dirty.
Now don't get me wrong- I don't believe all white people believe this, but I won't have my child, often the only brown child in a sea of blond headed babies, looking unclean. My mother thinks I'm a little crazy because I insist that his clothes and face be spotless when he leaves the house.
I may not always be perfect looking, but DS must look clean.
Anyway, the bottom line is that I'm broke.







:

I am laughing so hard, because your life sounds like mine. I own two pairs of jeans that I purchased fromt the evil empire (Wal-Mart) and maybe 3 shirts. I threw 2 away on Sunday because I refuse to even consider them as a possibility. I have had my hair done twice since DS was born, 11/06 and 9/08.
Until recently DS was the only brown child in his class, I spent my life being the only brown child in my class/grade/school the majority of my life. I know what it is like to be srcutinized on a daily basis, so DS HAS to look clean, neat and loved EVERYDAY.

I have spoken with childcare workers, teachers and nursing home staff and they all say in different ways that children/elderly who are taken care of by their parents/children often receive more attention and a higher level of care then of those with unconcerned families. This has stuck with me. Studies conducted in the past have shown that better looking people are chosen for jobs and other pursuits, so who is to say that this mentality does not carry over into the preschool classroom.

My DH is like your mom, he thinks that I am crazy too with regard to Andrew's appearance, but we were raised differently.


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## AndrewsMother

splendid said:


> How is this any different than going up to a woman who doesn't relax her and wears it natural? I have been given cards by hair dressers begging me to come in so they can fix my hair and I can be more presentable. Where does one draw the line what is acceptable presentation that represents an entire race?
> QUOTE]
> There is no comparison between clean combed hair of any style and dirty unkempt hair of any style. I am a natural hair pulled back in a bun type girl. Some might not like my look, but it is clean and presentable. Hair, like clothing should be worn to suit the wearer, but it should be clean and neat.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *eilonwy*
> I think it's clear, though, that Andrew's Mother and I are are living in very different realities. I think that eating out once a day (anywhere!) is *extravagant.* I can't imagine thinking that it's some kind of divine right. I can count on one hand the number of Hanna Andersson items that have passed through our home, and that's including hand-me-downs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's just not my world. If my biggest money problem was that I could "only" afford to eat out once a week, I wouldn't *have* money problems.
> 
> Well, perhaps I am wrong, but I thought that you, I and many other women in this forum share the same reality. WOC striving to make the most of their lives during uncertain times.
> Hanna Andersson might not be your world, but my desire for DS to have comfortable underclothing is no less real than your desire to cloth diaper. When I learned of the ease of cloth diapering it was an extravagance that I could not afford.
> 
> Simply because I am accustomed to more than the basics of life and find it hard to adjust to a frugal lifestyle does not mean that I don't have my share of sorrows. I posted earlier that my everyday shoes have have holes. They look good, so I will wear them until they are scuffed beyond repair. If that is not a large dose of reality, then I don't know what would be.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *purplegirl*
> Who you telling? I just left out the fat part
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --impossible to find used clothes that fit!
> 
> Being a size 12/14 makes it impossible to find nice clothing in a thrift store. I have not had any luck for myself size I was a S/M. Finding cheap clothes should be my motivation to lose weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *eilonwy*
> As an aside... fake crocs are at least $6. Doesn't sound like a lot of money, but it is twice what was posted and quite frankly, it can be a lot of money.
> 
> We live in Houston, Texas, land of heat, heat and more heat. Fake crocs are everywhere, Even the everything is $1 store.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jeca*
> I have a Honda Odyssey and let me say for a minivan it's very very nice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> The new body styles come out August 2009. Hopefully by August 2010, once the kinks are work out of the new styles I will be ready!!!
> 
> I worked for Honda, and any time that I could drive an Odyssey I did. I love the middle seats. Soooo comfy in leather.


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## rootzdawta

I agree. Tough to find 14/16 clothes at the thrift store. I have a lot of luck finding really nice things for the boys though.

And re: run over crocs. They're plastic. Even if you can't afford a new pair, you can certainly afford some soap and water so that they are *clean* run over crocs.

Eilonwy, I'd just like you agree/admit, that this particular part of the culture that many of us have said is a part that influences our daily lives has not influenced yours. That's not a problem. Many of us have said that *despite* being very poor, looking presentable, culturally, is quite important--a priority. No excuses. If it's not a priority for you, it's just not. It is not a judgment about you. It is what it is. It's been acknowledged that Black folk are not some homogenous whole. So that fact that you don't embrace what we are saying does not make you somehow less of a WOC. It's not a judgment against you.


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## jeca

I don't think it's just a cultural difference in disagreement with classism comes into play as well.

I saw the 2009 model on the internet and there's not much if any difference I can see from the 2008.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Until recently DS was the only brown child in his class, I spent my life being the only brown child in my class/grade/school the majority of my life. *I know what it is like to be srcutinized on a daily basis, so DS HAS to look clean, neat and loved EVERYDAY.*
I have spoken with childcare workers, teachers and nursing home staff and they all say in different ways that children/elderly who are taken care of by their parents/children often receive more attention and a higher level of care then of those with unconcerned families. This has stuck with me. Studies conducted in the past have shown that better looking people are chosen for jobs and other pursuits, so who is to say that this mentality does not carry over into the preschool classroom.


I feel the same way. I was another that spent most of my school days as a kid and later in grad school being the only POC and IMO we do get judged by a different standard. It may seem silly fretting over your kids appearance but my dd at 3 is in daycare/preschool and I find it curious that the teachers always comment on how well she is put together. Shouldn't be an issue but it is. Her teachers have commented on how involved we are, almost like they don't expect it







:. No appearances do matter and honestly I will look tore up from the floor up but my kids will not. My Mama was the same way, I remember as a child getting mad at how she insisted on combing/braiding my hair so it was always neat but now I get it. I remember as a kid wanting to wear my hair loose like my white girlfriends and she was like no... well I didn;t get it then but I get it now.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

Well, perhaps I am wrong, but I thought that you, I and many other women in this forum share the same reality. WOC striving to make the most of their lives during uncertain times.
Hanna Andersson might not be your world, but my desire for DS to have comfortable underclothing is no less real than your desire to cloth diaper. When I learned of the ease of cloth diapering it was an extravagance that I could not afford.

Simply because I am accustomed to more than the basics of life and find it hard to adjust to a frugal lifestyle does not mean that I don't have my share of sorrows. I posted earlier that my everyday shoes have have holes. They look good, so I will wear them until they are scuffed beyond repair. If that is not a large dose of reality, then I don't know what would be.

Being a size 12/14 makes it impossible to find nice clothing in a thrift store. I have not had any luck for myself size I was a S/M. Finding cheap clothes should be my motivation to lose weight.










I am laughing because when I was a 12/14 I couldn't find jack cheaply, now its the reverse when I am hitting the racks at Goodwill. Nothing for smaller folks. Dang, I wish you sistas were up here because ya'll would all be hooked up. I got a closet and barn filled with stuff that don't fit me anymore.

You make a great point about frugality which is again why I wanted to talk about it here because one of my challenges talking in a more mixed race group about frugality is that lack of cultural perspective. My white buddies with comparable income joke about how put together I look, they don't realize I am mixing and matching the same pieces. Or the fact that for me personally while I won't take the light money to buy clothes, if dd needs some shoes well the light company might get $25 less. Its the old rob Peter to pay Paul and at my age I have known and see sistas so it before me.

Thankfully being natural for almost 9 years now, I am no longer hooked on going to the salon but I do recall the days when I had the visit to the hair shop in the budget like a bill and would eat a long pot (as my granny used to call em) of beans in order to keep the hair done. Now I don't do that anymore though one week we might in order to get my locs done before they get anymore jacked up.

Shay


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't think it's just a cultural difference in disagreement with classism comes into play as well.

I saw the 2009 model on the internet and there's not much if any difference I can see from the 2008.

You are right, there might also be a class factor at play as well. I think its easy to forget that as WOC we tend to not want to see classism but it is a reality. I will try to be mindful of that in my posting, but I also think that even when you are having a discussion around frugality we are all coming from different places.

I know that my tough times while crappy to me might be perceived as good times to someone else. The best we can do is be mindful of those differences.

Ok, time to get off the computer for a bit.

Shay


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't think it's just a cultural difference in disagreement with classism comes into play as well.

I saw the 2009 model on the internet and there's not much if any difference I can see from the 2008.

Not the 2009 model which was available summer 2008, but in the summer of 2009 the 2010 models are available.


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## Bloomingstar

oh man, I'm so late coming into this conversation but I've enjoyed catching up with it! I've found myself nodding at different points throughout it all







so I won't belabor anything. I think it's cultural and class related and how we were raised and where we were raised and all of those things. I was raised by southern black people who grew up very poor--we ALWAYS had to iron and STARCH everything before we wore it. It was tiresome as hell to me growing up, but my parents did not mince words with me about why we had to do it. My DH was raised in the Caribbean (and when we go back to visit, we still heat the water on the stove and use a bucket and dipper if we want to bathe with hot water, and still a bucket and dipper anyway because the water pressure sucks) and he got similar messages. And I have no doubt I'll be slightly overboard with making sure the kid is as neat and clean as can be...









I get my haircut maybe once a year? That's barely true--I got my hair cut in August 08, and before that December 06, and before that Sept 2001. I have pretty wild curly hair and get tired of people wanting to straighten it and have figured out how to deal with it myself pretty well, so I avoid getting it "done" and it's not worth the money to me.

I have slipped on my bringing lunch to work game--need to get back on that. I food shop at a co-op, so DH and I both work a shift a month and it keeps food costs down some and is better quality than the crap grocery stores in the neighborhood where we anyway. I am planning on cloth-diapering for long-term cost cutting when the baby gets here. We're still doing pretty ok financially, though whenever I see Suze Orman on tv I feel a little panicked that I don't have 8 months emergency expenses put away (who does? no one I know, especially not at my age). I can think of probably 10 things we could do, easily, to save more money each month, especially living in blasted NYC--it's just expensive. But so far, we are doing pretty ok.







:


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't think it's just a cultural difference in disagreement with classism comes into play as well.

I agree.

How do you see classism playing into this convo?


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## eilonwy

Clearly there is a cultural disconnect. It's not about being raised not to care how I looked-- to the contrary, I was raised to wear slips and clean underwear, to make sure my clothing was clean and my hair was combed before I left the house. It's not that at all. No-- My problem is with _publicly humiliating and shaming someone when I don't know her entire life story._ I was taught that it was never, *NEVER* appropriate to embarass someone. Period. That's not a "white" thing, it's a Jewish thing-- if I recall correctly, the Talmud says that deliberately embarassing someone or slandering them is as bad as murder. I don't think it's cute, I don't think it's funny, and I cannot giggle and nod along-- I have to call that behavior out. As I said before, I find that behavior a lot more embarassing than the woman who would walk out in public wearing pants that are too small during a pregnancy.

And yes, I do feel like there's a judgement being passed on me as well-- the "Can't you admit that anyone, no matter their situation, could (and should!) make an effort to look clean at the very least?" mentality is just a hair uphill from the notion that everyone can and should pull themselves up by their bootstraps. That's a dangerous idea in my opinion, and it's based on uninformed, extremely limited ideas about poverty. I think it's self-righteous and unhelpful. It's just not cool in my eyes. You CANNOT know the entire story, but you can choose whether or not to pass judgement on someone else based on their appearance or even their behavior. I just can't justify the public humiliation of another person. Like I said, I have had those thoughts and I have occasionally vented to my family, but to shame someone in public and then to brag about it online? I'm never going to think that's cool.


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## rootzdawta

I would never humiliate anyone in public and nowhere have you seen me (or anyone else) condone that throughout this whole conversation. With the woman in question who did come in looking disheveled, I think, a lot of context has already been given that shows that it wasn't just randomly running up to some woman with absolutely no idea of her situation and berating her. I think we'd all agree that would have been a bit nuts. Lots and lots of context was given.

The point has always been that for many (_not all_) Black people, there is a cultural component that makes looking presentable (no matter what and sometimes at all costs) a priority. At the very minimum, bathed and clean. Simple as that. That is what we were discussing and feeling solidarity on.

If you don't see that and insist on arguing that it's the humiliation here that's the issue that's cool and you're entitled to that, sho 'nuff, I'd agree. There is a cultural disconnect.


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## jeca

I don't think anyone said public humiliation was cool. Maybe AnderwsMother personally knowing this woman felt comfortable enough to approach her about. Maybe that would not have been done with a complete stranger. I have to admit it bothers me when there are only a handful of us in a place and someone chooses to come in looking a mess. I think we are already stereotyped to be portrayed as less than low class and I hate it when people live up to those stereotypes. I have to go work a book fair so I'll be back later with how I think classism comes into play.


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## rootzdawta

Context:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
There wasn't any yelling, and at the time there were only two people present. People HAVE given her clothing, and I even offered to assist her with finding a car seat so that her oldest child would have one. On more than one level this girl just does not care. If you will strap your 19 month old into a regular seat belt and allow your drunk grandfather to drive your child to and from your job, do you really care? She always has 3 days worth of dirt under her nails, but her weave and tips are always done. I have extended my hand to help, everyone has. I work with low income people on a daily basis. The same resources that are offered to members of the community near my job were extended to my coworker.

She was given the opportunity to attend parenting classes that would provide her with maternity cothing and baby items, but she repeatedly failed to attend the classes because she did not want to go.

We are supposed to serve as a role model for the youth that we serve at our job and she is not able to do that. If she looks a hot mess, how can she tell impressionable teen girls how to dress? If the staff is not the standard for acceptable dress, who is. And yes she has worn the same ratty pants to work, why? Because they are comfortable.........







:


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I would never humiliate anyone in public and nowhere have you seen me (or anyone else) condone that throughout this whole conversation. With the woman in question who did come in looking disheveled, I think, a lot of context has already been given that shows that it wasn't just randomly running up to some woman with absolutely no idea of her situation and berating her. I think we'd all agree that would have been a bit nuts. Lots and lots of context was given.

*The point has always been that for many (not all) Black people, there is a cultural component that makes looking presentable (no matter what and sometimes at all costs) a priority. At the very minimum, bathed and clean. Simple as that. That is what we were discussing and feeling solidarity on.*

If you don't see that and insist on arguing that it's the humiliation here that's the issue that's cool and you're entitled to that, sho 'nuff, I'd agree. There is a cultural disconnect.









: I think Rootzdawta hit on what the point of this conversation was about. It most certainly is not to put anyone down or make anyone feel. Rynna, I am sorry that you took away that anyone here is trying to intentionally diss someone else







.

Shay


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## eilonwy

"informed her she was bringing down the race." I don't care how long you've been working with her, I'm never going to think that's cool. We'll have to agree to disagree on that, because I'm never going to get there. As to the so-called cultural standard, I disapprove of that as well.

A few weeks ago here I responded to a post about hair-- someone (I can't even remember who, I'd have to scroll back and look) asserted that she'd make sure her hair was never longer than her daughter's. I thought that was just propogating white standards of beauty, and self-imposing them. The idea that black people *need* to look nice all the time because people will judge *all* black people based on the way that one person looks at any given time is similar. By saying, "My child MUST be neat at all costs, even if it means that I only have one shirt and even if all the little white children are running around looking like they fell off the back of a pickup truck," you're propogating the idea that people SHOULD draw conclusions about all black children based on the way one child LOOKS. I don't think that's reasonable at all.

Yes, people who are clean are treated better than people who are dirty. Yes, people who are beautiful are treated better than people who are not. That doesn't make it right, and it doesn't mean that I feel the need to feed into those stereotypes. Like Kiya, I chose at an early age to reject that mentality. I actively fight against it-- it's part of the reason that I make a concerted effort to look mixed when I leave the house. I have no trouble telling people that we're *poor*-- I like to see the looks on their faces when they try to reconcile the reality of my poverty with the glaringly obvious reality of my intellect (after all, smart people are always rich and rich people are always smart, right?). I'd rather work to challenge stereotypes and encourage people to think of me and my children as individuals than allow them to stay shrouded in complacence while teaching my children that they're somehow representing everyone who looks like they do, or is their age, or their gender, or whatever.

And that's the last I'll say on this. I'm really bothered by the conversation on the whole, and the thought of continuing is aggravating my heartburn.

How are the leaves by you? We've still got a lot of green for the second week of October.


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## rootzdawta

Yup, I think it's best to drop this conversation here.


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## splendid

Thank you Rynna.









As for the leaves, I noticed this morning that the tree in our back is turning colors. I vowed last year, that this year I would make sure I raked so come spring I would not have to do a big yard clean up. I do wish we could drive up to my mom's house the lives are always beautiful.


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## Bloomingstar

leaves here tend to go from green to brown and die for the most part, but I have seen some nice reds and oranges here and there, particularly in the park when I've gone walking. We're planning to go apple-picking this weekend with my cousin (who is really the one with the plan), which is something I avoided at all costs when I went to college in New England but now think seems kind of fun and will get me out into some nature.

side note--any other buddhists in here? I know there's a buddhist tribe that got moved to spirituality...just wondering


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## Draupadi

Just wanted to add one thing: for me it's not a "black thing" or cultural thing.
It's a me thing.
I don't want people to think I'm neglecting my son because he is dirty or whatever. My son is pretty light brown (considering he's mostly white, it's not a surprise how light he is) but it's important to me to make sure he looks clean.
I was a teacher and used to have children come in to my classroom in such a horrendous state...and I'm not going to lie, right or wrong, I did think "What the hell is up with these parents for letting their kid come to school with food all over their clothes/hair undone/snot all over their faces?" etc.
And I don't want someone to think that of my son.


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## JustKiya

Thank you Rynna, for stating that so eloquently.









The leaves are actually starting to seriously fall here, which is amazing to me, as it feels like it's still a little too early in the year for that to be happening. We tend to not get colors here - just green/suddenly yellow/on the ground.

I love the look of the yellow and orange and occasionally red leaves on the ground against our grass. Makes me kinda sad when DH mows and returns everything to a simple green.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
leaves here tend to go from green to brown and die for the most part, but I have seen some nice reds and oranges here and there, particularly in the park when I've gone walking. We're planning to go apple-picking this weekend with my cousin (who is really the one with the plan), which is something I avoided at all costs when I went to college in New England but now think seems kind of fun and will get me out into some nature.


I'm up in Maine and apple picking is huge up here, I am almost appled out at this point. We have already had several crisps, pie and I am eating a couple apples a day. LOL

The foilage is gorgeous in Maine, though the leaves are starting to get a bit past peak, in fact tomorrow I have a ton of leaves to rake.

Shay


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## AndrewsMother

Every other night I am forced to wash nasty brown leaf crunchies out of DS's hair. The foilage in Houston turns from green to a nasty brown overnight. There aren't any spectacular autumn saffrons or rusts. Just nasty Houston brown.


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## oyinmama

i grew up in upstate new york and apple picking was an annual thing. one place in particular used to have a cider press and a DONUT MACHINE and made, yes, wait for it, apple cider donuts -- we would clamor for them. HOT, fresh apple cider donuts??? truly one of life's finer things.









right now the leaves are turning, but still green enough for the most vibrantly colored bright red or orange or yellow tree to really stand out beautifully. at the same time, we are having this weird spate of 80 degree days. lovely.

oh - and it looks like baby boy's first tooth is going to break through today. he's taking it like a champ. i can't believe 6 months have gone by so quickly!!


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## rootzdawta

It's strange. I think that generally by now, more leaves have changed colors and fallen off but I just really noticed the leaves on the ground 2 days ago. So glad DH takes care of the outside housework. LoL. When we go upstate on Sunday, I'm looking forward to the beautiful leaves we'll see.

Speaking of leaves, check this out: How to Make Roses from Maple Leaves. So pretty and really a cheap project if you think about it. I don't have a table that could use such a centerpiece but I was thinking if we get invited anywhere for Thanksgiving, I may try to tackle that lovely bit of craftiness.

Oh, I found that site via stumbleupon.com. You ladies have to check it out. Basically, it is a search engine except you select your preferences/interests and it finds sites that match. You download it as a toolbar to your browser. I've found sooooo many interesting and useful sites. I really love it and it's so addictive.









In other news, I just made the most bangingest chocolate chip cookies. I use Dreena Burton's Homestyle Chocolate Chip Cookie recipe (vegan, btw). The recipe is tried and true (and I've tried *many* chocolate chip cookie recipes). These are, perhaps, the best chocolate chip cookies I have had in my whole life, vegan or not! They are decadent and I don't make them often because they use so much maple syrup. But, oh my goodness!


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
right now the leaves are turning, but still green enough for the most vibrantly colored bright red or orange or yellow tree to really stand out beautifully. at the same time, we are having this weird spate of 80 degree days. lovely.

oh - and it looks like baby boy's first tooth is going to break through today. he's taking it like a champ. i can't believe 6 months have gone by so quickly!!

OMG . . . never had apple cider donuts but they sound divine!!

Congrats on the first tooth! I'm glad he's taking it in stride. Don't the months just fly by? DS2 has 4 teeth. And you know what? He grinds them! It's making me absolutely batty!!


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i grew up in upstate new york and apple picking was an annual thing. one place in particular used to have a cider press and a DONUT MACHINE and made, yes, wait for it, apple cider donuts -- we would clamor for them. HOT, fresh apple cider donuts??? truly one of life's finer things.









right now the leaves are turning, but still green enough for the most vibrantly colored bright red or orange or yellow tree to really stand out beautifully. at the same time, we are having this weird spate of 80 degree days. lovely.

oh - and it looks like baby boy's first tooth is going to break through today. he's taking it like a champ. i can't believe 6 months have gone by so quickly!!

There are some places up here that make apple cider donuts but I have yet to taste them, maybe this weekend we should go to the one the orchards that does those along with apple dumplings







:.

Yay for first tooth coming in







:. Time flies so much with kids.


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## purplegirl

The trees around here are starting to turn. It's bittersweet for me; I love the fall but do not like winter at all.
Congrats to baby boy on getting his first bud!







Babies look even more adorable when their teeth start to come in.


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## Brown Lioness

Woooooooooosaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

Destress ladies







This video is interesting (its about stress building in our bodies): 




I really love how fall unfolds. The trees, the fresh crispness of the air, the shorter days... it all just feels so comforting (even tho im with purplegirl, winter is NOT my favorite...im usually over it by Christmas, lol).

So, tomorrow is my birthday and im going home to Kentucky to visit my family for the first time in over 3 years. Im cautiously excited. Why? Because these are the same family members that i dont trust to know me or my personal business. Suffice it to say, we are not a close knit family, even tho we can miss each other (everyone has redeeming qualities, right?), my family can be very manipulative, catty, petty, and emotionally abusive. My visit will be brief, just tomorrow through this Sunday and im going alone (yea, they hate that im married). Im really going for my best friends, my godkids and my grandparents, staying at my mom's tho just to save myself the drama.

Just pray that I get through these next few days without stressing or getting pissed at anyone (including myself). I will be turning 29 years old tomorrow, but i feel like im fighting not to revert back to 5 years old once I walk through that door. Sigh, happy birthday to me


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## jeca

I don't want to talk about leaves, I live in colorado not much to talk about. These trees just can't compare to the big baeutiful trees of the south and other regions IMO.
I'm going to try the cookie recipe tonight. I need to bake for our school bake sale tomarrow. I only have regular chips though so it won't be vegan.







:


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## jeca

Okay I just checked I have everything except I have to use regular choc chips. But my molasses don't say anything about being blackstarpped just unsulphured so I hope that doesn't make a big differance, lol. Any other good recipes throw them at me. I will be baking all night and tomorrow since there aren't every many of us on the PTA.


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## rambunctiouscurls

so, I wanted to comment on the blog by the anxious black woman. I, honestly think it's a little too cynical. By fearing the worst, it may end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy. Even dangerous to even go there.

I"m a staunch Obama supporter although he may be a little too moderate for my political views but the fact that he is such a unifier is the clincher for me. It's 2008, it's sad that we have to fear institutionalized racism even more and blatant racism is already out in the open.

But, still, It's just never too early for change. Although, I have to hand it to her. She makes a strong case.

and the leaves are Gorgeous round these parts. green, bright reds, and oranges everywhere. I just love fall!


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## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
There are some places up here that make apple cider donuts but I have yet to taste them, maybe this weekend we should go to the one the orchards that does those along with apple dumplings







:.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
OMG . . . never had apple cider donuts but they sound divine!!

please please please try them if they are near you. they are my favorite seasonal treat ever. i actually made them one year - maybe i'll try again this year. here's a recipe; you can google others http://www.recipesource.com/baked-go...0/rec0022.html

yum yum yum!! @ jeca, i would recommend it for your bake sale, but donuts are best when fresh and hot - and FRIED (lol) not baked.







but yeah i encourage everyone to try them if possible.

@ purple girl i am with you on loving the fall but not the winter. i love this time of year but it is definitely bittersweet.







:


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## eilonwy

My mom's convinced that Obama will be assasinated if he's elected. It's quite depressing. Meanwhile, BeanBean has a great deal to say on the subject and will not be deterred. He's rather adorable about it.







It's an absolute riot to me to hear the things that come out of his mouth. This morning he noticed a new McCain/Palin sign across the street and groaned, "Oh no, not another one! I can't believe the neighbors aren't voting for Obama!"







The really funny part is that we don't discuss politics in his presence.









I think apple cider donuts are all right, but nothing to get terribly excited over.







: That said, I'm going to an orchard tomorrow.







Looking forward to some good apples and perhaps a nice squash.







The kids and I love butternut squash.







:


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## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I think apple cider donuts are all right, but nothing to get terribly excited over.







:


CULTURAL DISCONNECT!!!!

hee hee.

was that in bad taste??









seriously, it was intense up in here for a minute, and i don't want to stir anything up again so i won't weigh in on the issue; but do want to say that i was glad to see the members of this thread were able to disagree so intelligently and civilly.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Oh, I found that site via stumbleupon.com. You ladies have to check it out. Basically, it is a search engine except you select your preferences/interests and it finds sites that match. You download it as a toolbar to your browser. I've found sooooo many interesting and useful sites. I really love it and it's so addictive.










Stumbleupon is an evil addiction. I went once and refuse to return.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
at the same time, we are having this weird spate of 80 degree days. lovely.

oh - and it looks like baby boy's first tooth is going to break through today. he's taking it like a champ. i can't believe 6 months have gone by so quickly!!

In Houston 80 is marvelous fall weather.









Congratulations on the new tooth!!!! Are you sharing pictures??

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
So, tomorrow is my birthday I will be turning 29 years old tomorrow,

Happy Birthday and Goodluck prayers!!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
My mom's convinced that Obama will be assasinated if he's elected. It's quite depressing. Meanwhile, BeanBean has a great deal to say on the subject and will not be deterred. He's rather adorable about it.








It's an absolute riot to me to hear the things that come out of his mouth. This morning he noticed a new McCain/Palin sign across the street and groaned, "Oh no, not another one! I can't believe the neighbors aren't voting for Obama!"







The really funny part is that we don't discuss politics in his presence.

DS's first Obama phrase was: Barack Obama Flatulated.
He put it together on his on. Mommy talks about her love for Obama's ears incessently, and the word fart is NOT allowed in my hearing.

Also according to him Barack Obama and John Mcain are on the same tickets AND he chants his own little diddy over and over again.

Barack Obama, John McCain
Barack Obama, John McCain
Barack Obama, John McCain
Barack Obama, John McCain
Barack Obama rides the train

Two year olds.....you have to love them!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
CULTURAL DISCONNECT!!!!

hee hee.

was that in bad taste??









seriously, it was intense up in here for a minute, and i don't want to stir anything up again so i won't weigh in on the issue; but do want to say that i was glad to see the members of this thread were able to disagree so intelligently and civilly.

The conversation was so much more than a disagreement but an opportunity to understand differences. I know that I am a product of women and men who are long dead. I spent countless hours learning the past of my parents parents and I embrace and emulate the best of them. Of course because of that I don't have have the same POV as others my age, black or white male or female. My closest friends are over 40, they children my age or sligthly younger.

If everyone thought like me (or anyone else) this world would be a dull place.


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## oyinmama

frugal? but like fist-sized lemons and 3-foot long stemmed poppies and frozen organic pizza? lol

Save $5.00 at Whole Foods Market

Present our coupon at any Whole Foods Market in the U.S. to get $5 off any purchase of $25 or more. Valid from 10/15/08 to 10/22/08.

Download printable coupon in PDF format
http://www.wholefoodsmarket.com/pdfs/coupon_5off.pdf


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
CULTURAL DISCONNECT!!!!











(That smilie = poor taste.














) I won't argue culture when it comes to apple cider donuts, though, because everyone I know just *adores* them.


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## jeca

I've never had apple cider donuts.







:

I looked at the recipe, I think I will try to make them tomarrow. I am making gingerbread cookies right now. Since my mom bought me a KitchenAid for mother's day I have been on a baking streak.


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## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*The conversation was so much more than a disagreement but an opportunity to understand differences.* I know that I am a product of women and men who are long dead. I spent countless hours learning the past of my parents parents and I embrace and emulate the best of them. Of course because of that I don't have have the same POV as others my age, black or white male or female. My closest friends are over 40, they children my age or sligthly younger.

If everyone thought like me (or anyone else) this world would be a dull place.

what a beautiful way to put it and a great perspective. so true.

a tangent, inspired by your comment about your friends: do you find yourself making friends with people your own age, older, or younger? i always say that my DH aspires to be a grumpy old man, and funnily enough in the three years since we've moved here he's made friends with two 50-something year old men.







all my life i've found myself the youngest person in my group of friends but they're usually only 2-8 years older than i am.

do you find yourself in circles with people your own age? older? younger? do you think it says something about you and your mental 'age' ??


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## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I've never had apple cider donuts.







:

I looked at the recipe, I think I will try to make them tomarrow. I am making gingerbread cookies right now. Since my mom bought me a KitchenAid for mother's day I have been on a baking streak.

yumm, kitchenaid!!

if you do try the donuts, please let us know how they turn out. i dont bake that much, in part because of time, in part because i have a diabetic neighbor with a sweet tooth, who is constantly baking 7-up cakes and pineapple upside down cakes and such, and then eating a few slices and bringing the rest of the cake over so it won't be in his house.


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## jeca

Well my ginger cookies didn't turn out. Instead of big soft cookies I got flat hard cookies, nothing like the recipe.







I need to make something else I guess. I need something by noon tomarrow. Russian tea cakes are next on my list after that it's off to but a box of oreo's or something.


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## splendid

Did you leave an ingredient out?


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Thank you Rynna.









As for the leaves, I noticed this morning that the tree in our back is turning colors. I vowed last year, that this year I would make sure I raked so come spring I would not have to do a big yard clean up. I do wish we could drive up to my mom's house the lives are always beautiful.

And just where have you been mama??? I've missed you.


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## purplegirl

Any one bake their own bread? Jeca, I am totally jealous over the kitchen Aid mixer!!!


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## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
And just where have you been mama??? I've missed you.









I took my toys and setup shop elsewhere.









When I do come back here, I spend most of my time on some of the other quieter boards.

Quote:

Any one bake their own bread? Jeca, I am totally jealous over the kitchen Aid mixer!!!
I do, I stopped a few weeks ago though when we went out of town and I haven't gotten my groove back on. I love my KA- I bought it on sale a few years back.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Any one bake their own bread? Jeca, I am totally jealous over the kitchen Aid mixer!!!

Jeca, I've been making my own bread for some months now. I do have a KA mixer but before that, I could make it by hand. It is, admittedly, labor intensive and I'm not sure I would have the energy or time to make it by hand now. Anyway, I found my stand-by recipe here on MDC. I tweaked it a bit and posted the recipe on my blog. Here's the post link. For my next batch of bread, I have to use a recipe that doesn't require gluten because I'm all out but that particular bread is delicious and tall. I find it really satisfying and easy to make my own bread. I started when I cut out all soy from my diet to see if that was what was causing my repeated hair loss (most commercial bread has soy lecithin in it).

There's also no-knead bread that I've been interested in making for some time but haven't gotten around to it. There are some good tutorials on YouTube. I've heard really good things about it though and hope to try it one day. Right now, my grocery budget is really tight, though, and there's really no room for experimentation.


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## Arike

Fall Foliage: I grew up in New England so I SO miss all the beautiful fall foliage around this time. I am currently in the concrete jungle so I don't see all the wonderful colors of my childhood. DH and I want to move somewhere in New England because we love it there BUT we want kind of like a diverse, multi-cultural suburb with access to the arts and cultural institutions...oh and we want a house with a yard on a street our little boo can ride his bike on with no worries... We don't even know if this hypothetical town/community exists!

Baking/Cookies: Rootzdawta...I TOTALLY need to make those cookies! I have been wanting oven fresh cookies so bad lately but at the same time I don't have the energy or the patience really to do anything in the kitchen. This little dude in my belly is wiping me out! DH made these organic brownies from a mix the other day...they weren't so great...








: I am going to look at the recipe for the vegan choco chip cookies and see if perhaps I can get motivated to make them. I also plan on making a "birthday cake" for the baby while I am in labor but I have no idea what kind of cake to make... Something pretty simple and easy, not a million ingredients, you know? This chocolate bun in my oven is going to be ready any day now, so I need to figure that out!


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## eilonwy

I hate baking.

Actually, I hate cooking in general. I wouldn't do it if I didn't have to feed the kids on a fairly regular basis. For some reason, they get upset if you don't.









I'm pretty sure that being short is a big part of it. I mean, kitchens are uncomfortable places for me in general, but I noticed that when I wore heels into the kitchen, I felt a lot more comfortable being there.

Everyone else I know likes to cook. They find it relaxing and pleasant. Maybe I'm just really, really strange.. but I don't think it's fun.







Eating, now there's something I can get behind.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Fall Foliage: I grew up in New England so I SO miss all the beautiful fall foliage around this time. I am currently in the concrete jungle so I don't see all the wonderful colors of my childhood. *DH and I want to move somewhere in New England because we love it there BUT we want kind of like a diverse, multi-cultural suburb with access to the arts and cultural institutions...oh and we want a house with a yard on a street our little boo can ride his bike on with no worries... We don't even know if this hypothetical town/community exists!*

Baking/Cookies: Rootzdawta...I TOTALLY need to make those cookies! I have been wanting oven fresh cookies so bad lately but at the same time I don't have the energy or the patience really to do anything in the kitchen. This little dude in my belly is wiping me out! DH made these organic brownies from a mix the other day...they weren't so great...







: I am going to look at the recipe for the vegan choco chip cookies and see if perhaps I can get motivated to make them. I also plan on making a "birthday cake" for the baby while I am in labor but I have no idea what kind of cake to make... Something pretty simple and easy, not a million ingredients, you know? This chocolate bun in my oven is going to be ready any day now, so I need to figure that out!









I recall, while on my way to Canada, spending the night in Springfield, MA. It seemed to be a pretty cool place. The couple we stayed with were very progressive and earthy. They had a beautiful old home that they were renovating. The neighborhood seemed diverse, safe and was certainly pretty.
I also like parts of Boston. However, that city is expensive no matter where you live. Good luck.


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## Bloomingstar

I LOVE baking but haven't been doing it much, though I do plan to bake some cookies this weekend.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

I'm pretty sure that being short is a big part of it. I mean, kitchens are uncomfortable places for me in general, but I noticed that when I wore heels into the kitchen, I felt a lot more comfortable being there.


you know, that's so true! I'm 5'2" and I've gotten to the point where the belly is so big (7 months), it runs into the counter so I end up hunching trying to do the dishes or just reach the sink for things and having back pain...until a couple days ago when I figured out that I can stand on a phone book to reach it without hunching over









I have a couple of recipes to share but it'll have to wait til I get home tonight. One is a yummy vegan chocolate chip cookie recipe and the other is a vegan pumpkin chocolate chip cookie recipe--those are THE BEST! I use bittersweet chocolate chunks instead of chips and oh boy







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I LOVE baking but haven't been doing it much, though I do plan to bake some cookies this weekend.

you know, that's so true! I'm 5'2" and I've gotten to the point where the belly is so big (7 months), it runs into the counter so I end up hunching trying to do the dishes or just reach the sink for things and having back pain...until a couple days ago when I figured out that I can stand on a phone book to reach it without hunching over









I have a couple of recipes to share but it'll have to wait til I get home tonight. *One is a yummy vegan chocolate chip cookie recipe and the other is a vegan pumpkin chocolate chip cookie recipe--those are THE BEST*! I use bittersweet chocolate chunks instead of chips and oh boy







:

Girl!!! I can't wait to get those recipes!


----------



## JustKiya

Oh, I love to cook, and I'm married to a chef, so cooking is always an exciting time in our house.







I've been mulling over, myself, thoughts about the conversation on culture, and realized how - unique - our personal home culture is, esp. when I look at what we eat!, compared to most people of color that I know.







Ah well, different strokes is what makes the world go around, eh?

I tend to make friends 2-8 years older than me, as well. I find that I tend to be - impatient with people my own age, a lot of times - even in the same 'group' of people - I always gravitate towards the Crones instead of the Maidens.








DH is the opposite - he tends to gravitate towards people younger than he is.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I recall, while on my way to Canada, spending the night in Springfield, MA. It seemed to be a pretty cool place. The couple we stayed with were very progressive and earthy. They had a beautiful old home that they were renovating. The neighborhood seemed diverse, safe and was certainly pretty.
I also like parts of Boston. However, that city is expensive no matter where you live. Good luck.

That's funny, DH is from Springfield, MA...but not the nice part, the rough, hood part. Springfield has different sections, I think you were definitely in the nice part!







I went to school in Western Massachusetts, I loved it there but I felt like the places I really liked were predom white and I really crave that diversity I see here in NYC... But we have definitely considered settling down in Mass; we love NYC but I hate living on top of other people. I want my own walls and yard!


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## jeca

I cook and bake a LOT. Cutting out the junk snacks and so many HFCS products have made me need to cook and bake to make up for things that I don't buy. As a result I think my family has gotten a little spoiled when it comes to certain things. For example a few years ago I thought nothing of plopping as eggo in the toaster and calling it breakfast. It became one of the things I cut buying so I make my own waffles instead. As a result I get asked to make gingerbread waffles almost every other day, lol. When the kids come home from school the first thing they do is go in the kitchen to see what I made for snack. I cook dinner pretty much every single night. I make my own pizza dough, bread, mozzarella sticks, granola bars. I don't buy commercial cakes or cookies or box mixes. Not to mention with food prices going up over the past year I needed to find ways to stretch my budget a bit. I still buy some convenience products like turkey dogs, (I'll only eat hebrew national beef franks love them) chefboyardee sometimes. I can't say that I actually enjoy cooking though. I guess I don't mind it but actually love to do it I don't think I do. I like to bake at this point until something doesn't turn out and then I get discourages and won't touch anything for a while.
I don't think I left an ingredient out. I live at a high altitude the only thing I can thing of is that it needed to be adjusted and I didn't do that.
I don't really make friends. I'm kind of anti-social.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I cook and bake a LOT. Cutting out the junk snacks and so many HFCS products have made me need to cook and bake to make up for things that I don't buy. As a result I think my family has gotten a little spoiled when it comes to certain things. For example a few years ago I thought nothing of plopping as eggo in the toaster and calling it breakfast. It became one of the things I cut buying so I make my own waffles instead. As a result I get asked to make gingerbread waffles almost every other day, lol. When the kids come home from school the first thing they do is go in the kitchen to see what I made for snack. I cook dinner pretty much every single night. I make my own pizza dough, bread, mozzarella sticks, granola bars. I don't buy commercial cakes or cookies or box mixes. Not to mention with food prices going up over the past year I needed to find ways to stretch my budget a bit. I still buy some convenience products like turkey dogs, (I'll only eat hebrew national beef franks love them) chefboyardee sometimes. I can't say that I actually enjoy cooking though. I guess I don't mind it but actually love to do it I don't think I do. I like to bake at this point until something doesn't turn out and then I get discourages and won't touch anything for a while.
I don't think I left an ingredient out. I live at a high altitude the only thing I can thing of is that it needed to be adjusted and I didn't do that.
I don't really make friends. I'm kind of anti-social.

You are my hero! I hope to cook and bake a lot after the baby is here. Dh loves my cooking and I love cooking period. I actually love the cooking and the serving people part. It feels so good to give your family and friends food that you made from scratch with love.







I have definitely slowed down during the pregnancy; I get dizzy if I stand up for too long so poor DH has not had a homemade vegetarian lasagna in a couple of months...


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
That's funny, DH is from Springfield, MA...but not the nice part, the rough, hood part. Springfield has different sections, I think you were definitely in the nice part!







I went to school in Western Massachusetts, I loved it there but I felt like the places I really liked were predom white and I really crave that diversity I see here in NYC... But we have definitely considered settling down in Mass; we love NYC but I hate living on top of other people. I want my own walls and yard!

I love Western Mass too girl. Where did you go to school? Holoyoke, Smith, Williams, Amherst?? I have a good friend who grew up in Holoyoke. She's a sister. I think that part of Mass tends to be more liberal cause of all the universitys? Good luck!
BTW, my man is from the hood too! He grew up in a rough section of Brooklyn. What I absolutely adore about him is that he is highly intelligent, professional, with awesome taste, but still has a touch of the hood to keep him from being a techno geek








, which is his greatest fear! He is from another nation and spent younger years in England, but he is still my thug whom I adore!


----------



## jeca

Thanks!








Well I guess it's me then. The cupcakes I was baking just sunk in. I did have a maintenance guy here fixing my laundry room door and he was making a heck of a racket but I don't know if that did it. I am officially done. How weird when i need something to turn out nothing does.


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## splendid

LOL about the waffles. Last Christmas my husband bought me a waffle maker. I was making so many waffles, the poor machine died in May. I bought a new one, but I need to find the time to make bulk batches of the different flavours. And my boys are spoiled with the fruit toppings I make.

I like cooking (baking more). What I would really love to do is have a cooking party so I can make a lot of bulk things at once, but my closest friend is a few hours away.

I really want to start making sourdough bread.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I love Western Mass too girl. Where did you go to school? Holoyoke, Smith, Williams, Amherst?? I have a good friend who grew up in Holoyoke. She's a sister. I think that part of Mass tends to be more liberal cause of all the universitys? Good luck!
BTW, my man is from the hood too! He grew up in a rough section of Brooklyn. What I absolutely adore about him is that he is highly intelligent, professional, with awesome taste, but still has a touch of the hood to keep him from being a techno geek







, which is his greatest fear! He is from another nation and spent younger years in England, but he is still my thug whom I adore!

I am a proud Mount Holyoke College Alumna!







:

Yeah DH is from the hood and still has that in him but he can be such a nerd too! We are nerds and bookworms together!







I am the techie though..


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I love Western Mass too girl. Where did you go to school? Holoyoke, Smith, Williams, Amherst?? I have a good friend who grew up in Holoyoke. She's a sister. I think that part of Mass tends to be more liberal cause of all the universitys? Good luck!
BTW, my man is from the hood too! He grew up in a rough section of Brooklyn. What I absolutely adore about him is that he is highly intelligent, professional, with awesome taste, but still has a touch of the hood to keep him from being a techno geek







, which is his greatest fear! He is from another nation and spent younger years in England, but he is still my thug whom I adore!

I went to school in Western Mass too! That led me to moving to BK, because the area, Northampton specifically, was so not diverse--I was one of 25 black women in my graduating class of about 6 or 700. I didn't escape the bubble to get to Holyoke or Springfield very often, and I just cut all of my hair off to avoid the trauma of trying to get it done anywhere around there. It nearly drove me mad, literally, so I moved. But it _is_ very beautiful there, and that's probably what I miss most.


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## Bloomingstar

Oh, and Arike--

your due date was yesterday so you're within a few days or weeks of giving birth







: how are you doing?


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## purplegirl

Aww shucks now! We have some smart sisters up in here!







Even those of us who didn't complete or attend college are off the hook intelligent!

Nothing like a smart man from the hood!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I went to school in Western Mass too! That led me to moving to BK, because the area, Northampton specifically, was so not diverse--I was one of 25 black women in my graduating class of about 6 or 700. I didn't escape the bubble to get to Holyoke or Springfield very often, and I just cut all of my hair off to avoid the trauma of trying to get it done anywhere around there. It nearly drove me mad, literally, so I moved. But it _is_ very beautiful there, and that's probably what I miss most.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Oh, and Arike--

your due date was yesterday so you're within a few days or weeks of giving birth







: how are you doing?









Bloomingstar, you must have gone to Smith! I like Northampton, but like you said, it's not very diverse. I mean people are open minded and liberal but it's pretty homogeneous.

Yeah my due date was yesterday and we all really thought we would be looking at a bouncing little baby by now! I have had two false labor alarms so far. One time it was at the Apple Festival at the Queens Farm Museum. We rushed home, I laid down, drank lots of water and also had coconut water and the contractions ceased! So that was just dehydration/doing too much according to my midwife. The second time was this past Friday, I had been having regular contractions since that Thursday and when I woke up on friday morning after a fun night of contractions, I lost my mucous plug (sorry if that is TMI for anyone!







). So between the regular contractions and the mucous plug, me and DH really thought it was go time. We both stayed home from work and then lo and behold on Saturday, during the day, I had NO contractions. What a tease this little one is! I was all ready to meet him, see his little face and start my maternity leave! Now I am back at work, just trying to stay somewhat comfortable in my cubicle. Meanwhile, everyone and their mother are blowing up my phone, asking if the baby is here yet! I also love how when I told some friends I had been having contractions last week, they all felt the need to call me and ask me what contractions felt like. (I am the first of all my close girlfriends to have a baby) Some calls went straight to voicemail because I mean shoooooooooooot, I was having contractions!







:

When the little prince does make it on the scene, I will be sure to post a link to my birth story on this thread!







:


----------



## rootzdawta

LoL . . . this thread is moving so fast!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
so, I wanted to comment on the blog by the anxious black woman. I, honestly think it's a little too cynical. By fearing the worst, it may end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy. Even dangerous to even go there.

Well, DH always calls me a cynic. Obama's message of hope and unity has always seemed a bit contrived. But honestly and truly, I have very little in the way of hope that he will bring about change not because he doesn't want to but because really, the country is not ready. There are still people alive and walking who remember and enforced Jim Crow. There are too many examples even as I'm typing this of not-so-secret, dare I say, bold racism. Come to my town and I'll show you.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 

a tangent, inspired by your comment about your friends: do you find yourself making friends with people your own age, older, or younger? i always say that my DH aspires to be a grumpy old man, and funnily enough in the three years since we've moved here he's made friends with two 50-something year old men.







all my life i've found myself the youngest person in my group of friends but they're usually only 2-8 years older than i am.

do you find yourself in circles with people your own age? older? younger? do you think it says something about you and your mental 'age' ??

I do not have any friends my age at all. I'm 26 and no one ever believes me when I say so. I literally have to pull out proof. And still, I find, I'm a lot more serious than people 10 years my senior. I am an intense person (and I think that sometimes drives people away and I see it in my DS1 too) so it takes people who are very secure in themselves to deal with me and all too often, I find that this is not a characteristic of people in their 20s. I read (and think) quite a bit so while I can get along with most anyone, I tend to click with people approaching 40 even up into their 60s. And I tend to keep my age to myself because I've noticed that I could be having a great conversation with someone and once I disclose my age, they clam up and get all "Oh, you're too young to know anything." But, I know too, that I am an old soul--with recollections (especially when it comes to doing things with my hands) of many previous lives. So I radiate age/wisdom (although sometimes, I'm not the brightest, I won't front).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
DH and I want to move somewhere in New England because we love it there BUT we want kind of like a diverse, multi-cultural suburb with access to the arts and cultural institutions...oh and we want a house with a yard on a street our little boo can ride his bike on with no worries... We don't even know if this hypothetical town/community exists!

Baking/Cookies: Rootzdawta...I TOTALLY need to make those cookies! I have been wanting oven fresh cookies so bad lately but at the same time I don't have the energy or the patience really to do anything in the kitchen. This little dude in my belly is wiping me out! DH made these organic brownies from a mix the other day...they weren't so great...







: I am going to look at the recipe for the vegan choco chip cookies and see if perhaps I can get motivated to make them. I also plan on making a "birthday cake" for the baby while I am in labor but I have no idea what kind of cake to make... Something pretty simple and easy, not a million ingredients, you know? This chocolate bun in my oven is going to be ready any day now, so I need to figure that out!









Arike, that is *just* the town I've been dreaming of. When you find it, let me know and we can move together.







I absolutely hate the snow but if a town like that could be found here in the NE, I'd give up my dream of moving to Arizona and settle there.

The choc chip cookies are really easy, no lie. And there's my default chocolate cake that literally takes 10 mins to make. Just dump everything in a bowl, mix well, oil & flour a pan and bake. It makes the perfect birthday cake!!!









I can't wait to read the birth story!!!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

I'm pretty sure that being short is a big part of it. I mean, kitchens are uncomfortable places for me in general, but I noticed that when I wore heels into the kitchen, I felt a lot more comfortable being there.

Everyone else I know likes to cook. They find it relaxing and pleasant.

I'm short too (5'2")! But very comfortable in my own kitchen. The kitchen is really old though and hasn't been remodeled since the house was built except to add electrical appliances. I notice in newer kitchens, counters are much higher. When I re-do the kitchen, I'm going to keep that in mind.

I like to cook but I can't say it is relaxing and pleasant or fun. Same way for knitting and crochet. It gives me pleasure to do useful things as I'm a very practical person (which some say means I'm no fun). I enjoy reading way more.

LoL . . . I got all the way to the end of the post and forgot to quote some more folks.

I too cook most things from scratch and spend *quite* a bit of time in the kitchen (I often wish that it looked nicer for this one reason and may think about putting out a little extra money just to paint it a new color even if we can't renovate--right now it's throw-up yellow). I want to be a SAHM so it requires that I really, really pinch pennies. Cooking vegetarian food from scratch is indeed very cost effective. I've added a little salmon and tuna but I still find each meal to be about maybe $4 total to feed everyone in the family _for 2-3 days_. A happy side outcome is that we avoid MSG, HFCS and other "mystery" natural flavors. And I agree, the family is s.p.o.i.l.e.d. now . . . DH says he feels "weak" if I make him have "just cereal" for breakfast and DS1 specially requests "triangle waffles" (you know, a waffle that comes of a round waffle iron and splits into four "triangles") but no berries for him although I *must* put berries for dad. :LoL. You know three year olds and their commands.

Oh, and Jeca, how I know about needing something to turn out and it just won't! That chocolate cake I linked earlier in this post, thought it would be fool proof for a friend's aunt's wedding cake. Oh, my, God. I must have baked it 10 times to get it to come out correctly and generally speaking, I don't have to think and it will come out well.









Didn't mean to be so long! It's hard to keep up with you ladies!


----------



## shayinme

Ya'll know you want to move to Maine.







That way I would have some crunchy sistas to vibe with... seriously New England is gorgeous. I live in a lovely ole Victorian, 10 mins from the ocean and the local food is amazing. That said, I am seriously wondering where I may go next, the lack of diversity is maddening especially to a sista who spent almost 30 years in Chicago.

Thankfully I have a few sista friends here but only 1 is crunchy, but I am glad I have sista buddies here period since the first couple years I had no WOC in my life here.

Cooking.... I like cooking especially in colder weather. That said, I am not so big on eating which sucks but I love to bake and cook. This summer I really got into making soups from scratch, turned out some goood tomato and cream of brocoli soups. Cooking relaxes me, its the one traditional chick thing that I am pretty good at and it helps that dh is happy to clean after I cook, so that makes it all good.









Rootzdawta, girl I thought you were much older, I would have never guessed you were 26.

Jeca, you sound like you get down in the kitchen. Since I am not longer a SAHM I had to give up doing the granola making, so I stick to main meals and sweets.

Ok, baby girl is up from her nap.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Here is another interesting article about Barack.

http://www.tnr.com/toc/story.html?id...7-5cb761500092


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Arike, that is *just* the town I've been dreaming of. When you find it, let me know and we can move together.







I absolutely hate the snow but if a town like that could be found here in the NE, I'd give up my dream of moving to Arizona and settle there.

The choc chip cookies are really easy, no lie. And there's my default chocolate cake that literally takes 10 mins to make. Just dump everything in a bowl, mix well, oil & flour a pan and bake. It makes the perfect birthday cake!!!









I can't wait to read the birth story!!!









I need to keep that cake in mind! It sounds so easy! I just worry about frosting... For some reason I have no recollection of every making any. I guess I always made cakes that didn't need any! Yeah when I find that mythical town of mine, I will let you know! Oh and I ran to the store on my lunch break and got all the things I needed to make the cookies. I am going to go home and immediately march right into the kitchen and get busy. If I sit down or lay down first, it will NEVER happen! I told DH to meet me at the subway station so that he could carry the stuff for a "special treat".(the 5 pound bag of flour is killing me! I can't seem to carry anything heavier than like my water bottle these days!) You would think that he would be more than happy to considering I am carry our little "special treat" in my belly but he acted annoyed at the idea since he just got home like 20 minutes ago. So me being feisty as I am, I told him "Fine, forget I said anything. I will just make the special treat for me, myself and the baby! No treat for you!" And then I hung up the phone. I wonder if he will show up at the subway station anyway...LOL! It's been a long day.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
*Ya'll know you want to move to Maine.







That way I would have some crunchy sistas to vibe with... seriously New England is gorgeous. I live in a lovely ole Victorian, 10 mins from the ocean and the local food is amazing.* That said, I am seriously wondering where I may go next, the lack of diversity is maddening especially to a sista who spent almost 30 years in Chicago.

Thankfully I have a few sista friends here but only 1 is crunchy, but I am glad I have sista buddies here period since the first couple years I had no WOC in my life here.

Cooking.... I like cooking especially in colder weather. That said, I am not so big on eating which sucks but I love to bake and cook. This summer I really got into making soups from scratch, turned out some goood tomato and cream of brocoli soups. Cooking relaxes me, its the one traditional chick thing that I am pretty good at and it helps that dh is happy to clean after I cook, so that makes it all good.









Rootzdawta, girl I thought you were much older, I would have never guessed you were 26.

Jeca, you sound like you get down in the kitchen. Since I am not longer a SAHM I had to give up doing the granola making, so I stick to main meals and sweets.

Ok, baby girl is up from her nap.

Shay

It sounds lovely Shay. I don't like cold but I like natural beauty. What you've described sounds so nice!!

Rootz, I only knew your age because you mentioned it once in your blog. I gotta be honest, my mouth dropped open







because your wisdom is beyond your years! Actually, I have learned so much from all of you and I am an old woman in my 40's









To the expectant mama's: I am so excited for yall. I can't wait to hear that your little ones are earth side and warm in your arms.


----------



## Bloomingstar

*friends my age:

Most (as in about 4) of my close friends are my age or a couple years younger or a couple years older. That said, I have made it a point to always have people who are older than me be a regular part of my life, particularly women and gay men. My dance company covers a lot of that--at 28, I'm one of the youngest people there; everyone else is over 40! I grew up having a mix of ages around me and I think that's part of what drove me a little nuts in college--there weren't enough folks around who could give any different kind of perspective on things. I'm also used to people thinking I am MUCH younger than I am because of how I look (well maybe not right now...) which is what it is I guess.

Arike that's so exciting! I still have a couple months to go (whew!) but I am sending you happy vibes for all to go beautifully! and hey, get some rest!


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## jeca

HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS !!







:







:
















I ended up taking russian tea cakes to the bake sale. It was the only thing I knew would turn out sure fire. They were a hit, very similar to mexican wedding cakes if anyone has had those.
I went to Tuskegee University, Tuskegee Alabama but I didn't finish. Can I still be in the club?







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS !!







:







:
















I ended up taking russian tea cakes to the bake sale. It was the only thing I knew would turn out sure fire. They were a hit, very similar to mexican wedding cakes if anyone has had those.
*I went to Tuskegee University, Tuskegee Alabama but I didn't finish. Can I still be in the club?







:*

*
*

OHH, HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS







:

Jeca, you know good and well, you are in the 'club'







Seriously, I know so many smart women who either didn't go to college or who didn't finish. Attending/graduating college isn't a measure of intelligence at all!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS !!







:







:
















I ended up taking *russian tea cakes* to the bake sale. It was the only thing I knew would turn out sure fire. They were a hit, very similar to mexican wedding cakes if anyone has had those.
I went to Tuskegee University, Tuskegee Alabama but I didn't finish. Can I still be in the club?







:

Slurp, slurp. Are they made like the mexican wedding cakes? I love them


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Slurp, slurp. Are they made like the mexican wedding cakes? I love them









yes, almost to the T.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS !!







:







:
















I ended up taking russian tea cakes to the bake sale. It was the only thing I knew would turn out sure fire. They were a hit, very similar to mexican wedding cakes if anyone has had those.
I went to Tuskegee University, Tuskegee Alabama but I didn't finish. Can I still be in the club?







:

Of course you are in the club







. Russian tea cakes sounds good.

Happy Birthday Brown Lioness







:


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## nnaemeka

peace ladies!!!

happy B-day Brown Lioness. My Birthday was yesterday, I'm big ol'36 and feeling good. Arike how's your little Libra doing? no Scorpio vibes i hope!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace ladies!!!

happy B-day Brown Lioness. My Birthday was yesterday, I'm big ol'36 and feeling good. Arike how's your little Libra doing? no Scorpio vibes i hope!!!


Happy Birthday mama!! Mine is coming up in about 4 weeks.


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## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace ladies!!!
. Arike how's your little Libra doing? no Scorpio vibes i hope!!!

What's wrong with Scorpio vibes? I'm a Scorpio!!


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## eilonwy

Happy birthday to the Libra Sistas! My birthday is Saturday.









Hm. My friends all seem to be much older or much younger. I find that older teens/early twenties enjoy hanging out with me; I look like I belong with them, I'm comfortable there, but I have that grownup vibe going on, so they can ask advice of a real grownup who's still cool enough to speak with.







My niece is not the only eleven-year-old girl to look to me for advice, either. I think perhaps I'm something of a "cool aunt" to all of them.







The older folks love talking with me. They're always confused by my age, because I sound/act older than I am but I look younger.







It's all good. I'll be 31 on Saturday.

And my Bean will be *SIX* three weeks later!







: I can't believe how big "the littlest man" is!







:

Yes-- the newer a kitchen is, the more likely it is to be too tall for me. They redid the kitchen at the Farm (which was already too tall for me) and now it's just ridiculous. I can do a lot, but there are so many things that I'm just not able to handle because I've got short arms.







The sink, for example-- My boobs are *lifted* when I try to use it, and while I can reach the bottom in some places, I can't do so without getting my girls wet.







I can't even see what's in the warming ovens without standing on a milk crate, and when there are boxes on top of the fridges I have to stand back about 20 feet to even see them; Getting them down is out of the question without a kid (bigger than BeanBean) standing on my shoulders.









Arike-- losing a mucous plug, TMI on MDC? How long have you been here, girl?







You should search the DDC archives for the funniest thread *ever*. I believe it was the December '07 DDC, and it was about pregnancy funk. That thread had me in absolute hysterics even on some horribly bad days.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
What's wrong with Scorpio vibes? I'm a Scorpio!!


I knew there was a reason I loved you


----------



## Bloomingstar

Happy Birthday







: yay Libras! I'm a Libra too (Oct. 6th)

Ok, so here are the recipes







:

*(Vegan) Chocolate Chip Cookies*

1 C (margarine) butter
1 C sugar
1 C dark brown sugar
(cream together)

2 (egg replacers--I like ener-g egg) or eggs
2 tsp vanilla
2 tsp butter flavor (optional and sketchy but tasty







)
2 1/4 C flour
1 tsp salt
1 tsp baking soda
2 C chocolate chips (I like Bakers bittersweet chocolate chunks)
(optional) 1 C chopped pecans (I never use these because after growing up with my grandmother's pecan tree, I am just too resistant to purchasing pecans







)

mix, spoon onto baking pan, bake at 375 for about 10-15 mins. Makes about 2 dozen big cookies

*Vegan Pumpkin Chocolate Chip cookies*

I LOOOOOVE these cookies, found the recipe online somewhere. Makes about 4 dozen so cut it in half if you won't have many people hanging around to eat them.

2 C sugar
1 C margarine (or butter for non vegans)
1 can pumpkin or pumpkin pie mix
2 tsp vanilla
(cream together)
4 C flour
2 tsp baking soda
2 tsp cinnamon or cinnamon nutmeg mix
1.5-2 C chocolate chips or chunks

bake for about 20 mins at 350. These come out more cakey/spongy then crispy/crunchy and are excellent right out of the oven with some kind of milk (soy/almond/rice/cow, whatever you do)

enjoy!







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY BROWN LIONESS !!







:







:
















I ended up taking russian tea cakes to the bake sale. It was the only thing I knew would turn out sure fire. They were a hit, very similar to mexican wedding cakes if anyone has had those.
I went to Tuskegee University, Tuskegee Alabama but I didn't finish. Can I still be in the club?







:

Jeca, when did you graduate. I have a cousin and a friend who graduated from Tuskegee, in what year did you finish? What club? Am I missing something?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace ladies!!!

happy B-day Brown Lioness. My Birthday was yesterday, I'm big ol'36 and feeling good. Arike how's your little Libra doing? no Scorpio vibes i hope!!!









:Happy Birthday Nnaemeka & Brown Lioness







:


----------



## purplegirl

Happy Birthday to you too Rynna







:


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Jeca, when did you graduate. I have a cousin and a friend who graduated from Tuskegee, in what year did you finish? What club? Am I missing something?

I didn't finish. I was there 95-97. Everyone was talking about where they went to school and they all went near or around each other I just wanted to be part of the club too even though I didn't go to school near them, lol.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I didn't finish. I was there 95-97. I was talking about the WOC tribe, lol.

I think that they graduated in 2004 & 2005, so never mind.

I am at the University of Houston, but dreaming of attending Columbia in 2012, maybe then I can meet the NYC moms.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I think that they graduated in 2004 & 2005, so never mind.

Yeah I'm old.







:


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Yeah I'm old.







:









I started college in 95 as well.







Where's the geriatric smilie?


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
What's wrong with Scorpio vibes? I'm a Scorpio!!

nah, nothings wrong with scorpios! (as i run from poison stinger







)


----------



## xochimama

Sheesh, I started college in the late 80's...geriatric?!... I just had a baby!

**hugs and blessings to the expectant mamas here**

Re: Baking/Cooking: DH does the bread, including a beautiful challah. I do the pies and cookies.







And I eat







: We cook almost every night, eat out maybe once or twice a month. When we lived in Seattle, we ate out more often because there were so many great places to eat--lots of affordable Japanese, Korean, Thai, Indian, lots of seafood, you get the idea... That was over 10 years ago. Now living in rural northern New Mexico, there just isn't a whole lot to choose from. And nearly everything is overpriced, except for burritos, which get t.i.r.e.d. real fast.

The lack of culinary diversity is, not surprisingly, a symptom of the lack of ethnic diversity (lots of us Latinos, though!







) And this is why DH and I get nostalgic for hip, urban, artsy city life. I especially miss the artistic resources: indie movie houses, dance, theater, music-- all the freebie art stuff that happens in the summer in the city.

BUT the small town I live in has a very rich norteño culture, so there is usually a lot happening that is culturally specific to this place. And we have a small (albeit struggling) university that attracts some interesting and talented characters.

Anyway, I can't imagine living on the East coast again. I'm an east-coast university refugee







Well, maybe NY for a couple years just to recharge my professional batteries (painter, here).

Friends? Until I was in my mid-late 20's, most of my friends were in my age group. Then I went to graduate school and started spending more time with artists. Before I knew it, I had a lot of friends who were 10, 20, even 40 years older. DH's best man was 70, although you'd never guess...artists don't really age the same as the majority of the population I think. I'm hoping this works in my favor down the line!


----------



## rootzdawta

Don't know how ya'll feel about Beyonce but, ladies, she put it down in her video for Single Ladies. My thighs and calves hurt and I'm out of breath just _watching_ her dance! LoL. I can't wait to get back in shape.


----------



## xochimama

Re: The Obama Effect and the ABW blog

I agree with a lot of her conclusions, but I find the poor sequential logic to have gaping holes.

One thing I really agree with is that it is delusional to think we are living in a post-racial society. When I first heard the MSM using the word "post-racial" to describe our contemporary society, and specifically to characterize Obama and/or what he represents, I thought, "what the h*ll does THAT mean?"

Do they mean that Americans are beyond race? That somehow we have transcended racism? That divisions and inequalities based on race no longer exist? That is either ignorance, naivete, or a stubborn and willful blindness to reality.

So what exactly IS post racial? I found a related (and better written, IMO) article here about what ABW terms "The Obama Effect" and the specific problematics of his campaign and its close ties to corporate power.

Anyway, ABW is right: when Obama wins, the battle will have just begun.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







I started college in 95 as well.







Where's the geriatric smilie?

I'm downright ancient then.








I started college in 1988 and I'm a sagittarius.
Can I still be in the club?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace ladies!!!
Arike how's your little Libra doing? no Scorpio vibes i hope!!!

Well my little Libra will probably be a Scorpio if he waits another week to come! I did have my heart set on a Libra, DH is a Libra. But at the same time, I have a really close friend who is a Scorpio so I can dig it.







That stinger is no joke though! LOL!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Arike-- losing a mucous plug, TMI on MDC? How long have you been here, girl?







You should search the DDC archives for the funniest thread *ever*. I believe it was the December '07 DDC, and it was about pregnancy funk. That thread had me in absolute hysterics even on some horribly bad days.









LOL! Yeah I haven't been here too long, I guess losing a mucous plug isn't that deep! I am going to do a search for that thread! I need to laugh while I am sitting in my cubicle at work with an aching pelvis and bored to tears.







:

Oh and I made the chocolate chip cookie recipe that Rootzdawta posted the link to and out of a dozen, I only got to eat 2 and a half! LOL! DH ate the rest!







I think I may try using vegan buttery spread instead of oil next time. Anyway...time to get ready to go to work...


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
*I'm downright ancient then*.








I started college in 1988 and I'm a sagittarius.
Can I still be in the club?


My sister in the struggle!!!


----------



## Jannah6

I'm a sometimey here, but just want ed to add that I started college in 1993.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Don't know how ya'll feel about Beyonce but, ladies, she put it down in her video for Single Ladies. My thighs and calves hurt and I'm out of breath just _watching_ her dance! LoL. I can't wait to get back in shape.

Beyonce is HOT! She definetly has the plump gene, but works to keep it at bay. I am quite content with who I am, but IF i belived in reincarnation I would want to come back as Beyonce. I would change my name, but nothing else.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm downright ancient then.








I started college in 1988 and I'm a sagittarius.
Can I still be in the club?

Hellooooooooooooo Archer twin!!! November 29th and you?

If I may be honest and believe me, I lie about my age whenever asked. I began college in 1996 and left in december 1999 for two reasons. #1 I was too rich to be finacial aid poor, and my mother was having another child with aanother man so I was own my own. yes my extended family is very supportive, but I had issues with my mother that came to a head in college. Being away was not really about an education, just being away from my mother. (future therapy session, but oh well)

#2 I had no idea as to what I wanted to be when I grew up. I changed majors 6 or 7 times before realizing that I was jaded with the idea of figuring out what I wanted to do.

So here I am 9 years later a sophomore in college. Though my grades from before were okay, good actually, I wanted to start at the beginning and to do what I always wanted to do.

Being 31 years, 11 months and 12 days old in a college setting is humiliating to me as I should be so much more than I am now. If asked i subtract 10 years from my age or I let people guess. No one has ever guessed my age correctly, yet. Thank goodness.

Does anyone else experience age related insecurities?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Hellooooooooooooo Archer twin!!! November 29th and you?

If I may be honest and believe me, I lie about my age whenever asked. I began college in 1996 and left in december 1999 for two reasons. #1 I was too rich to be finacial aid poor, and my mother was having another child with aanother man so I was own my own. yes my extended family is very supportive, but I had issues with my mother that came to a head in college. Being away was not really about an education, just being away from my mother. (future therapy session, but oh well)

#2 I had no idea as to what I wanted to be when I grew up. I changed majors 6 or 7 times before realizing that I was jaded with the idea of figuring out what I wanted to do.

So here I am 9 years later a sophomore in college. Though my grades from before were okay, good actually, I wanted to start at the beginning and to do what I always wanted to do.

Being 31 years, 11 months and 12 days old in a college setting is humiliating to me as I should be so much more than I am now. If asked i subtract 10 years from my age or I let people guess. No one has ever guessed my age correctly, yet. Thank goodness.

Does anyone else experience age related insecurities?

Girl, don't feel bad at all. I dropped out of HS at 18 and ran off and got married and ended up pregnant with my son. Need less to say I was not in college during traditional college age. I did end up going to college at 25 and graduated 3 years later, taking classes year round. In my classes the funny thing is I thought I would be the oldest and there were lots of folks in their late 30's and 40's. When I went to grad school, I was one of the younger folks as well since the average age of my colleagues was closer to 40-45.

Frankly I think going to school as an adult has a lot of advantages, it made me serious about my studies in a way that frankly my little brother who was a traditional college student was not. I realized that almost all the folks I knew in HS who went directly to college, only a handful are where I am now professionally and these are folks who didn't juggle parenthood, marriage amd work so go ahead and do your thang.


----------



## jeca

I've gone to school off and on over the years. I guess I could have at least an Associates by now if I pursued it.

I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up.








And how come I'm not getting email updates on this thread?


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## eilonwy

Mike started college in '86.









It's stinky TMI. Be warned, you WILL laugh out loud. It's got to be one of the best threads *ever*. My DDC actually had a thread *about* this thread, we were the "fan club" in question.

ETA: I especially like "wild and ungroomed punani jungle." I mean it sounds like a place for an archealogical expedition!







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

hahahaha! I was reading some of that thread yesterday after you first mentioned it and it's funny as hell! I attempted some "grooming" last night and what a comedy that was







thank goodness for mirrors is all I have to say







:


----------



## eilonwy

Don't forget to read the fan club thread.


----------



## rootzdawta

Okay, so right now the budget it t.i.g.h.t. as it is with many of you.

The other day, I found a great deal on cotton tights and bought 2 "large to 170 lb." Well, today is a brisk day, the first day I attempted to put them on.

And would you believe? Would you believe? They don't fit.







:

My behind is way larger than a large.

They wouldn't even go halfway up my thighs.









And it is making me as irritable and depressed as ever. Poor DH. He doesn't even get it.


----------



## eilonwy

Tights are so strange. I never know what size to get because I usually fall into an area not covered by the little shaded boxes.







Toss in the fact that I'm smaller than my weight would apparently indicate, and you'll understand why I"m forever buying the wrong size of nylons. That's why I almost never buy them.







When I was in high school and working, Hanes came out with a line of petite pantyhose-- designed for short women. For the first (and only) time in my life, I had nylons that actually fit me and weren't baggy at the ankles. They stopped making them... and I"m too fat for the two sizes they had anyway.

Why the heck can't they make a slightly broader range of nylons? I'm fat, I'm not six feet tall, and contrary to what the boxes say one doesn't work for the other.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Tights are so strange. I never know what size to get because I usually fall into an area not covered by the little shaded boxes.







Toss in the fact that I'm smaller than my weight would apparently indicate, and you'll understand why I"m forever buying the wrong size of nylons. That's why I almost never buy them.







When I was in high school and working, Hanes came out with a line of petite pantyhose-- designed for short women. For the first (and only) time in my life, I had nylons that actually fit me and weren't baggy at the ankles. They stopped making them... and I"m too fat for the two sizes they had anyway.

Why the heck can't they make a slightly broader range of nylons? I'm fat, I'm not six feet tall, and contrary to what the boxes say one doesn't work for the other.










Oh my goodness. You just described my frustration to a "T". I love wearing tights but have vowed to never ever wear nylons again in life. Finding a size that doesn't stop at my crotch, making it impossible to walk or ones that don't roll down my belly, is futile!! When I find a pair that fit, I wear the heck out of them.







rootzdawta


----------



## rootzdawta

Been meaning to ask . . . did one of you lovely ladies DDDDC me??









Oh, and . . . what does it mean??


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Hellooooooooooooo Archer twin!!! November 29th and you?

If I may be honest and believe me, I lie about my age whenever asked. I began college in 1996 and left in december 1999 for two reasons. #1 I was too rich to be finacial aid poor, and my mother was having another child with aanother man so I was own my own. yes my extended family is very supportive, but I had issues with my mother that came to a head in college. Being away was not really about an education, just being away from my mother. (future therapy session, but oh well)

#2 I had no idea as to what I wanted to be when I grew up. I changed majors 6 or 7 times before realizing that I was jaded with the idea of figuring out what I wanted to do.

So here I am 9 years later a sophomore in college. Though my grades from before were okay, good actually, I wanted to start at the beginning and to do what I always wanted to do.

Being 31 years, 11 months and 12 days old in a college setting is humiliating to me as I should be so much more than I am now. If asked i subtract 10 years from my age or I let people guess. No one has ever guessed my age correctly, yet. Thank goodness.

Does anyone else experience age related insecurities?

first of all, i do have my own age related insecurities but as someone teaching college level courses in very all-American traditional university, i'd love to have some mature students in my classes. these lil kiddies sometimes drive me CRAZY with their sense of entitlement and general cluelessness. i wish i could tell some of them to work for a couple of years and stop wasting my time and mommy and daddy's money and come back to the university when they are truly ready LEARN and engage. anyway, i took me ten years, 4 schools and three majors, to get my BA and whatever. i enjoyed being in college in late 20-s and early 30's and now i'm working on my PhD at 36. i think my life experiences make a wonderful contribution to my scholarship. so PLEASE don't feel shy about being a so-called older student, i'm sure your professors and classmates appreciate all that you bring. BTW i'm still older than alot of my colleagues and they're always shocked to hear my age...

and when i was whining about getting older on my B-day, my sistahfriend told me how she was just chillin with a very dynamic 84 yr old friend and that i should keep in time there always somebody older than you, still dreaming, still livin. and that's real.









besides Erykah Badu is 37 and i'd take her fly bad azz self over Beyonce any day and Iman says 50 is the new 40 so trickle that down i'm only 26 and you 21!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay, so right now the budget it t.i.g.h.t. as it is with many of you.

The other day, I found a great deal on cotton tights and bought 2 "large to 170 lb." Well, today is a brisk day, the first day I attempted to put them on.

And would you believe? Would you believe? They don't fit.







:

My behind is way larger than a large.

They wouldn't even go halfway up my thighs.









And it is making me as irritable and depressed as ever. Poor DH. He doesn't even get it.

gurl, i was fingering some cute m/l tights the other day at Marshalls and couldn't buy into the trauma of a supposed m/l with this booty and postpartum belly. it ain't right. a Black woman needs to start a nylon line, it'll be like Carol's Daughter for tights..."My Mama's Thighs."


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
a Black woman needs to start a nylon line, it'll be like Carol's Daughter for tights..."My Mama's Thighs."









: You so need to copyright that and get to selling!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
first of all, i do have my own age related insecurities but as someone teaching college level courses in very all-American traditional university, i'd love to have some mature students in my classes. these lil kiddies sometimes drive me CRAZY with their sense of entitlement and general cluelessness. i wish i could tell some of them to work for a couple of years and stop wasting my time and mommy and daddy's money and come back to the university when they are truly ready LEARN and engage. anyway, i took me ten years, 4 schools and three majors, to get my BA and whatever. i enjoyed being in college in late 20-s and early 30's and *now i'm working on my PhD at 36.* i think my life experiences make a wonderful contribution to my scholarship. so PLEASE don't feel shy about being a so-called older student, i'm sure your professors and classmates appreciate all that you bring. BTW i'm still older than alot of my colleagues and they're always shocked to hear my age...

and when i was whining about getting older on my B-day, my sistahfriend told me how she was just chillin with a very dynamic 84 yr old friend and that i should keep in time there always somebody older than you, still dreaming, still livin. and that's real.









besides Erykah Badu is 37 and i'd take her fly bad azz self over Beyonce any day and Iman says 50 is the new 40 so trickle that down i'm only 26 and you 21!









That's awesome sis! I wish you all the luck and grace with obtaining your Phd!

I so agree on emulating Ms. Badu. That's one hot sister!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
My sister in the struggle!!!


















Sometimes I feel like I should be collecting social security when I'm on MDC. Seriously.
We're not that old, are we?


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah5* 
I'm a sometimey here, but just want ed to add that I started college in 1993.

You're just a spring chicken compared to my old self.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

Quote:

Hellooooooooooooo Archer twin!!! November 29th and you?
*December 7th- Pearl Harbor Day. A day that will live in infamy







*

Quote:

If I may be honest and believe me, I lie about my age whenever asked. I began college in 1996 and left in december 1999 for two reasons. #1 I was too rich to be finacial aid poor, and my mother was having another child with aanother man so I was own my own. yes my extended family is very supportive, but I had issues with my mother that came to a head in college. Being away was not really about an education, just being away from my mother. (future therapy session, but oh well)

#2 I had no idea as to what I wanted to be when I grew up. I changed majors 6 or 7 times before realizing that I was jaded with the idea of figuring out what I wanted to do.

So here I am 9 years later a sophomore in college. Though my grades from before were okay, good actually, I wanted to start at the beginning and to do what I always wanted to do.
*Being in college at an "older age" is nothing to be ashamed about, IMO. You're getting your education and there's nothing wrong with that. My BFF is 37 and has another 2 years before she graduates. I'm just proud of her that she finally decided to finish schooling.*

Quote:

Being 31 years, 11 months and 12 days old in a college setting is humiliating to me as I should be so much more than I am now. If asked i subtract 10 years from my age or I let people guess. No one has ever guessed my age correctly, yet. Thank goodness.








*Girl, 31 is NOT old! Not like my decrepit 37, at least!







Most people think I'm a lot younger than I am and I'm not hating them for thinking that, either.*

Does anyone else experience age related insecurities?
*I don't think I have age insecurities. I just can't believe I'm 37 sometimes. I mean I saw "Star Wars" in the theaters when I was 6, as well as "Saturday Night Fever". See. You aren't that old! At least not as old as me!*


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
gurl, i was fingering some cute m/l tights the other day at Marshalls and couldn't buy into the trauma of a supposed m/l with this booty and postpartum belly. it ain't right. a Black woman needs to start a nylon line, it'll be like Carol's Daughter for tights..."My Mama's Thighs."

Love it!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 








Sometimes I feel like I should be collecting social security when I'm on MDC. Seriously.
We're not that old, are we?









I am totally feeling you. There are a lot of youngins around here







But we're not ready for the nursing home yet!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Okay, so right now the budget it t.i.g.h.t. as it is with many of you.

The other day, I found a great deal on cotton tights and bought 2 "large to 170 lb." Well, today is a brisk day, the first day I attempted to put them on.

And would you believe? Would you believe? They don't fit.







:

My behind is way larger than a large.

They wouldn't even go halfway up my thighs.









And it is making me as irritable and depressed as ever. Poor DH. He doesn't even get it.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Tights are so strange. I never know what size to get because I usually fall into an area not covered by the little shaded boxes.







Toss in the fact that I'm smaller than my weight would apparently indicate, and you'll understand why I"m forever buying the wrong size of nylons. That's why I almost never buy them.







When I was in high school and working, Hanes came out with a line of petite pantyhose-- designed for short women. For the first (and only) time in my life, I had nylons that actually fit me and weren't baggy at the ankles. They stopped making them... and I"m too fat for the two sizes they had anyway.

Why the heck can't they make a slightly broader range of nylons? I'm fat, I'm not six feet tall, and contrary to what the boxes say one doesn't work for the other.










Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Oh my goodness. You just described my frustration to a "T". I love wearing tights but have vowed to never ever wear nylons again in life. Finding a size that doesn't stop at my crotch, making it impossible to walk or ones that don't roll down my belly, is futile!! When I find a pair that fit, I wear the heck out of them.







rootzdawta


Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
gurl, i was fingering some cute m/l tights the other day at Marshalls and couldn't buy into the trauma of a supposed m/l with this booty and postpartum belly. it ain't right. a Black woman needs to start a nylon line, it'll be like Carol's Daughter for tights..."My Mama's Thighs."

Spanx tights are worth a few squeezes in the budget. Check out the size chart.
http://www.spanx.com/product/sizeCha...goryId=3015182


----------



## jeca

I don't really think I'm old old, lol. Sometimes I do feel old. Example, all you sistas rocking "natural" hair, it will never be me. I have to get my hair dyed. My mom started to gray early around 26. Of course she passed it on to me. Yeah I think it looks good on some people sometimes but at 31 I don't want splashes of grey hair. Maybe when I hit my 40's I wouldn't feel so bad about having a few(although it's more than a few) but for now I dye them suckers. I wear my natural hair as in my natural curls but dying is something I don't think I will give up anytime soon without it I definitely feel old.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
You're just a spring chicken compared to my old self.










Well you look pretty good for your old self


----------



## shayinme

WilliamsMama, if you are decrepit then I am just a step behind you since I turn 36 in January.







Seriously I feel like I am getting better, I wouldn't want to be 20-something for anything in the world. I feel like with age comes wisdom.

The year I turned 30, I was all in a funk but then life dealt me one of the worse blows, my beloved Mama was 49 at the time got diagnosed with cancer and she died 6 weeks after my 31st birthday and 4 days after turning 50. Needless to say those experiences made me have a different view on aging, I pray that I live a really long time. Heck, I actually like the gray hairs creeping up in my locs, its my hope to get really gray.









Tights, I feel that idea that whoever makes em needs to make some for the sistas. Shoot even at 5'4 and in the 130's (fluctaute between 135-139), the hips and booty still make it hard to get a good fit with jeans and tights.









Spanx.... I so want some and as soon as I get some extra cash that will be in the budget. Speaking of money, I was offered a position as Executive Director of a community center that serves at risk kids in the town next to me. Its only part time but it will be nice to have an actual position though I will still have to keep up my consulting.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

yes, I feel some age insecurity because I tend to hang out with people older than me. 9 times out of ten, I'm the baby in the group. and lemme tell you, it's not always the fun place to be. Because, I do agree with Shay, with age comes wisdom. why do you think I hang out with folks older than me? so I can suck the wisdom out of them.









Furthermore, Since I didn't grow up in the U.S, there's a big cultural and generational gap.. but I can compensate that with the unique experiences I have had living in so many different parts of the world. I'm 24 and I'm petite and soft-spoken so if I don't have Amira with me, I sometimes can't help but feel like people think I'm a teenager. still, I'm in no rush to grow up. I'm enjoying childhood through Amira all over again and it's wonderful.

I too didn't finish traditional college and felt the time ticking because I had hoped to somewhat establish a career before motherhood. but you gotta start somewhere and I'm glad I did now, so I can take it slow and give myself time to learn and grow.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 

Spanx.... I so want some and as soon as I get some extra cash that will be in the budget. Speaking of money, I was offered a position as Executive Director of a community center that serves at risk kids in the town next to me. Its only part time but it will be nice to have an actual position though I will still have to keep up my consulting.

Congratulations!







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
WilliamsMama, if you are decrepit then I am just a step behind you since I turn 36 in January.







Seriously I feel like I am getting better, I wouldn't want to be 20-something for anything in the world. I feel like with age comes wisdom.

The year I turned 30, I was all in a funk but then life dealt me one of the worse blows, my beloved Mama was 49 at the time got diagnosed with cancer and she died 6 weeks after my 31st birthday and 4 days after turning 50. Needless to say those experiences made me have a different view on aging, I pray that I live a really long time. Heck, I actually like the gray hairs creeping up in my locs, its my hope to get really gray.









Tights, I feel that idea that whoever makes em needs to make some for the sistas. Shoot even at 5'4 and in the 130's (fluctaute between 135-139), the hips and booty still make it hard to get a good fit with jeans and tights.









Spanx.... I so want some and as soon as I get some extra cash that will be in the budget. Speaking of money, *I was offered a position as Executive Director of a community center that serves at risk kids in the town next to me. Its only part time but it will be nice to have an actual position though I will still have to keep up my consulting.*

*

Shay, congratulations!!







:
*


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
yes, I feel some age insecurity because I tend to hang out with people older than me. 9 times out of ten, I'm the baby in the group. and lemme tell you, it's not always the fun place to be. Because, I do agree with Shay, with age comes wisdom. why do you think I hang out with folks older than me? so I can suck the wisdom out of them.









Furthermore, Since I didn't grow up in the U.S, there's a big cultural and generational gap.. but I can compensate that with the unique experiences I have had living in so many different parts of the world. I'm 24 and I'm petite and soft-spoken so if I don't have Amira with me, I sometimes can't help but feel like people think I'm a teenager. still, I'm in no rush to grow up. I'm enjoying childhood through Amira all over again and it's wonderful.

*I too didn't finish traditional college and felt the time ticking because I had hoped to somewhat establish a career before motherhood. but you gotta start somewhere and I'm glad I did now, so I can take it slow and give myself time to learn and grow.*

*

*If you don't have to rush, don't. In some ways, I wished I had waited. I was so naive and lacking in life experiences as I treaded through undergrad and graduate school. While, I am glad it is all behind me, I feel like my experience would have been richer had I waited. You can do it mama. Do it on your terms and in your time!!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't really think I'm old old, lol. Sometimes I do feel old. Example, all you sistas rocking "natural" hair, it will never be me. I have to get my hair dyed. My mom started to gray early around 26. Of course she passed it on to me. Yeah I think it looks good on some people sometimes but at 31 I don't want splashes of grey hair. Maybe when I hit my 40's I wouldn't feel so bad about having a few(although it's more than a few) but for now I dye them suckers. I wear my natural hair as in my natural curls but dying is something I don't think I will give up anytime soon without it I definitely feel old.

I wear my hair in its natural texture(not in locs, though) but I still dye my hair too. Nothing wrong with that. I started getting lots of greys in my 20's. Now it's just out of control. It's one thing I do feel vain about.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah5* 
Well you look pretty good for your old self









Thanks!







I'm lucky. I hope I have slow aging genes like my mother. My mom is 66 but looks a lot younger than that. Here's my mom carrying DS in my mei tai. I hope I inherit her good geneswhen it comes to aging!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Thanks!







I'm lucky. I hope I have slow aging genes like my mother. My mom is 66 but looks a lot younger than that. Here's my mom carrying DS in my mei tai. I hope I inherit her good geneswhen it comes to aging!

What a pretty lady with beautiful skin.
My mom looks amazing for her age as well. Her side of the family is very slow to gray, unlike my dad's side, who all gray prematurely. My gray hair has been popping in like crazy, so I guess I inherited that gene from dad! I'm not going to color it though. I kind of like it. It is diffuse throughout my hair and I think it's pretty. I never thought I'd feel that way, believe me


----------



## eilonwy

Fantastic.









My mother's hair is still much, much more pepper than salt. She's nearly 60. She actually aged considerably over the summer of '07, when she spent a month in a coma... but she still looks pretty young. My grandmother was a smoker all her life, so she *almost* looked her age when she died at 83, but she still had a lot of black hair; She was about 70% gray. Her hair was nice and thick, too, but my mom's half bald.







It worries me, because my hair is actually quite thin. If it wasn't curly my hair would be really pathetic, body-wise. I'm really hoping I don't end up as bald as my mother, it's decidedly unattractive.







:

I'm going to be carded forever.







:


----------



## ishereal

Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.

I'm sorry







. It sounds like you're worried too.
What's the doctor's plan mama? My sister has them and is going to have them removed? She has a fair amount of discomfort but nothing that is unbearable? Are you worried about them being malignant? If so, most of the time, they are just fluid filled sacs that could resolve on their own. It can be painful if they burst though. I've not known anyone who has had them, have cancer. Is that your worry? Again, what is your doctor saying??


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I'm sorry







. It sounds like you're worried too.
What's the doctor's plan mama? My sister has them and is going to have them removed? She has a fair amount of discomfort but nothing that is unbearable? Are you worried about them being malignant? If so, most of the time, they are just fluid filled sacs that could resolve on their own. It can be painful if they burst though. I've not known anyone who has had them, have cancer. Is that your worry? Again, what is your doctor saying??

They are filled with fluid. I had two on my uterus but one ruptured. I am just confused, I had 2 ultrasounds while preg I just don't understand why no one saw it. I also have an enlarged uterine lining which is why I have heavy periods. My doc. said I can either retest in 4months or try a bc pill to see if it will shrink them, I opted to retest as bc pills and me do not agree. I have breakthrough bleeding which is what made me go to the dr. plus my mom has endomitriosis (sp?)


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.









I don't have any advice but send lots of good vibes and well wishes.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
They are filled with fluid. I had two on my uterus but one ruptured. I am just confused, I had 2 ultrasounds while preg I just don't understand why no one saw it. I also have an enlarged uterine lining which is why I have heavy periods. My doc. said I can either retest in 4months or try a bc pill to see if it will shrink them, I opted to retest as bc pills and me do not agree. I have breakthrough bleeding which is what made me go to the dr. plus my mom has endomitriosis (sp?)

The pg could have made it difficult for them to see them initially. Any fibroids? I would opt to see if they shrink on their own too vs taking the pill.
Good luck and keep us posted.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.









No words of wisdom but will keep you in my thoughts.

Shay


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
The pg could have made it difficult for them to see them initially. Any fibroids? I would opt to see if they shrink on their own too vs taking the pill.
Good luck and keep us posted.









No they didn't mention fibroids, I have no idea whats the difference between a fibroid and cysts they all scare me.....


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
No they didn't mention fibroids, I have no idea whats the difference between a fibroid and cysts they all scare me.....


Fibroids are more solid masses. Cysts are typically fluid filled. Don't be scared mama. You will get through this!


----------



## Draupadi

Hey, everyone. XPOSTED in Breastfeeding...
So I'm a fluey mess right now. I think my head's going to explode from snot build up.








It doesn't help that not only does DS have the flu, but DH does too. UGH.
Anyone have any ideas for flu relief?
I'm still breastfeeding and a vegetarian, if that helps.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.

Hugs, Ishereal.








Sending lots of good vibes your way.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
What a pretty lady with beautiful skin.
My mom looks amazing for her age as well. Her side of the family is very slow to gray, unlike my dad's side, who all gray prematurely. My gray hair has been popping in like crazy, so I guess I inherited that gene from dad! I'm not going to color it though. I kind of like it. It is diffuse throughout my hair and I think it's pretty. I never thought I'd feel that way, believe me









My mom is in the orange top. She's 69 years old!


Your mom looks HOT! Wow. I hope I look that good when I'm 69!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Your mom looks HOT! Wow. I hope I look that good when I'm 69!

Aww, thank you mama. I sure hope I do too








Sorry you aren't feeling well. I don't have any suggestions but remember to stay well hydrated. It will help.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I was offered a position as Executive Director of a community center that serves at risk kids in the town next to me. Its only part time but it will be nice to have an actual position though I will still have to keep up my consulting.









: Congrats!! That's totally fabulous!!

I get around never being able to find tights my size by never wearing them.







I always make outfit choices that equal no tights needed.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.

I have PCOS, which is Poly-Cystic Ovarion Syndrome, and ovarian cysts are - well, part of the package.









Cysts are formed on the ovaries every cycle, as part of the development of the egg that will be released that cycle. Normally, the cyst forms, it bursts (mittlesmirtz or ovulation pain) as an egg is released, and the cyst closes/heals itself, to repeat again the next cycle.

Somehow though - and it's often related to hormone imbalances, and is worsened by insulin resistance, cysts will form, and continue to grow larger, and never pop. Depending on the size, when they do burst, they can be incredibly painful. The risk also varies depending on what the cyst is full of. Blood cysts are more dangerous, but also, less likely. In very rare cases, they grow large enough to either disturb other internal organs, or to affect your fertility.

So. First, you need to find out more details about what the cysts actually are. The smaller that they are, the less you will have to worry about, as they may, over time, resolve themselves. Larger ones carry larger issues, and you'll have to do the reasearch and speak to your doctor to determine at what size you feel that you would want to intervene. If they are filled with liquid (and I can't remember the 'actual' name for it) then that gives you other options.

Second, I'd encourage you to get tested for PCOS. http://www.pcosupport.org/ has a fabulous self test so that you can see if you are experiencing any of the symptoms (somehow, I bet you have long cycles? Since he mentioned a thicker uterine lining - that often happens when you have 35+ day cycles), and they also provide a lot of information about what your doctor needs to test.

I was diagnosed when I went to an Reproductive Endrocrinologist for infertility issues, and my hormone levels were all out of whack. I'm currently on a low carb diet (to reduce the effect of my insulin resistance) and on Metformin, which is a drug that makes your cells less resistant to insulin as well, and I'm having 30ish day cycles on a regular for the first time in ages. Still not pregnant, but at *least* I've ovulating every month. Some women are able to control it via simply diet and various herbs, but I haven't done much research about that route yet.

I don't have any insight on the uterine cysts....

So, overall, it could be something minor, and you just got an ultrasound at a bad time. Or, it could be something more serious. It sounds like you recently had a babe? I believe that they also tend to show up during periods of hormonal shifts - so, postpartum would be a ripe time for them.








I hope that helped, some, I know I wrote a book!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Hey ladies, Im back home now!!!! Thank you all so much for the birthday wishes, I had a wonderful birthday and a wonderful trip! Everyone really missed me and it was really good to see my family and friends. I only turned into a 5 year old maybe once, lol.

Purplegirl, your mama is fierce!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hey, everyone. XPOSTED in Br
I'm still breastfeeding and a vegetarian, if that helps.

I've used this long ago. Also regular ginger root tea and peppermint tea. Vitamin C is fine to take. You can also try Hylands products as they are mostly homeopathic

1 tsp. bayberry bark.
1 tsp. grated ginger root.
½ tsp. cayenne powder.
1 cup of boiling water.
Let it sit for 20 minutes.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *justkiya* 







: Congrats!! That's totally fabulous!!

I get around never being able to find tights my size by never wearing them.







i always make outfit choices that equal no tights needed.

I have pcos, which is poly-cystic ovarion syndrome, and ovarian cysts are - well, part of the package.









cysts are formed on the ovaries every cycle, as part of the development of the egg that will be released that cycle. Normally, the cyst forms, it bursts (mittlesmirtz or ovulation pain) as an egg is released, and the cyst closes/heals itself, to repeat again the next cycle.

Somehow though - and it's often related to hormone imbalances, and is worsened by insulin resistance, cysts will form, and continue to grow larger, and never pop. Depending on the size, when they do burst, they can be incredibly painful. The risk also varies depending on what the cyst is full of. Blood cysts are more dangerous, but also, less likely. In very rare cases, they grow large enough to either disturb other internal organs, or to affect your fertility.

So. First, you need to find out more details about what the cysts actually are. The smaller that they are, the less you will have to worry about, as they may, over time, resolve themselves. Larger ones carry larger issues, and you'll have to do the reasearch and speak to your doctor to determine at what size you feel that you would want to intervene. If they are filled with liquid (and i can't remember the 'actual' name for it) then that gives you other options.

Second, i'd encourage you to get tested for pcos. http://www.pcosupport.org/ has a fabulous self test so that you can see if you are experiencing any of the symptoms (somehow, i bet you have long cycles? Since he mentioned a thicker uterine lining - that often happens when you have 35+ day cycles), and they also provide a lot of information about what your doctor needs to test.

I was diagnosed when i went to an reproductive endrocrinologist for infertility issues, and my hormone levels were all out of whack. I'm currently on a low carb diet (to reduce the effect of my insulin resistance) and on metformin, which is a drug that makes your cells less resistant to insulin as well, and i'm having 30ish day cycles on a regular for the first time in ages. Still not pregnant, but at *least* i've ovulating every month. Some women are able to control it via simply diet and various herbs, but i haven't done much research about that route yet.

I don't have any insight on the uterine cysts....

So, overall, it could be something minor, and you just got an ultrasound at a bad time. Or, it could be something more serious. It sounds like you recently had a babe? I believe that they also tend to show up during periods of hormonal shifts - so, postpartum would be a ripe time for them.








i hope that helped, some, i know i wrote a book!









thank you!


----------



## purplegirl

There was a sister who posted on here, a long time ago, who was living completely off the grid. I am wondering if she still lurks on here and if so, how things are going. If I recall, she was from Georgia. It's a lifestyle I am very curious about, so it was nice to see a sister living it. If you are still around, please pop in. I'd love to hear from you. Anyone else remember her?


----------



## jeca

I don't remember her. It may have been during one of my hiatus, sometimes I have to get away from MDC.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't remember her. It may have been during one of my hiatus, sometimes I have to get away from MDC.

yeah and we've had so many different threads over the years, it would be nearly impossible for me to go back through all of them. oh well. it was just so cool to hear about a sister living a life off the grid.


----------



## purplegirl

My girl cousins and I are very close and like to find any opportunity to get together. This year we are having a cousins craft day at my home. We are going to gather early one saturday in early November, have breakfast and teach each other crafts. I mentioned earlier that I making gifts to give for the holidays. I thought it would be fun to see what others are making and learn something new! I am going to teach soap making. Another cousin just checked in and she is going to teach journal making







: I'm excited!


----------



## gabysmom617

Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.

My water broke a little after 10 pm on Wednesday, I got the hospital at 5cm dialated. In about an hour I was 8cm dialated. But I was handling contractions so well, they were coming every 5 mins very steadily, nice break in between, that I thought I didn't need an epidural, plus @ 8cm it was already too late. I used the birthing ball, my midwife massaged my back. Then I did different positions.

Then all of a sudden, they lowered the bottom of the bed and lifted the top, so it was like I was sitting an all heck broke loose. And he basically shot here like a speeding bullet. My midwife is still confused that I didn't tear.

A quick pic link: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/inde...ageID=13631179

Anyhow, let me go, his highness is calling me. Sigh.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
I have PCOS, which is Poly-Cystic Ovarion Syndrome, and ovarian cysts are - well, part of the package.




















I am also a "cyster". I was diagnosed as a teenager and was always told that it would be more difficult for me to have children. Well, after 2 years under the care of an integrative physician, I am pregnant and me and my DH weren't even trying~







We really thought that we would have to go to a specialist when we were ready to have kids. We even thought we may just have to adopt.(which I still am interested in anyway)


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.

My water broke a little after 10 pm on Wednesday, I got the hospital at 5cm dialated. In about an hour I was 8cm dialated. But I was handling contractions so well, they were coming every 5 mins very steadily, nice break in between, that I thought I didn't need an epidural, plus @ 8cm it was already too late. I used the birthing ball, my midwife massaged my back. Then I did different positions.

Then all of a sudden, they lowered the bottom of the bed and lifted the top, so it was like I was sitting an all heck broke loose. And he basically shot here like a speeding bullet. My midwife is still confused that I didn't tear.

A quick pic link: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/inde...ageID=13631179

Anyhow, let me go, his highness is calling me. Sigh.

Amazing! Congratulations







:


----------



## splendid

Congrats Sonya on your new bundle!

Congrats Shay on the offer!

How did everyone spend there weekend?

I spent the weekend making and freezing soups for my dh and kids. I don't eat meat, so I wanted them to have things on the days I don't feel like cooking.

I think I am going to spend today making soups for me.







: I really want to make a corn type soup.


----------



## JustKiya

Cograts Sonya!! Welcome Earthside, Israel!!!

I spent my weekend in the woods with 200 or so other pagans - my last festival of the year, as even in the south, it's getting too dang cold to be outside that much!







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

Congrats Sonya and Shay! and







s ishereal

I spent Sunday apple picking. Now I have 20lbs of apples in my kitchen--any and all recipes are appreciated









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0630.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0621.jpg


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.

My water broke a little after 10 pm on Wednesday, I got the hospital at 5cm dialated. In about an hour I was 8cm dialated. But I was handling contractions so well, they were coming every 5 mins very steadily, nice break in between, that I thought I didn't need an epidural, plus @ 8cm it was already too late. I used the birthing ball, my midwife massaged my back. Then I did different positions.

Then all of a sudden, they lowered the bottom of the bed and lifted the top, so it was like I was sitting an all heck broke loose. And he basically shot here like a speeding bullet. My midwife is still confused that I didn't tear.

A quick pic link: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/inde...ageID=13631179

Anyhow, let me go, his highness is calling me. Sigh.

Congratulations!







: Welcome to the world Israel!

My girl is sick today, running a fever and generally feeling bad, so it will be a long day for me.

Shay


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Congrats Sonya and Shay! and







s ishereal

I spent Sunday apple picking. Now I have 20lbs of apples in my kitchen--any and all recipes are appreciated









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0630.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0621.jpg

Hands down my fav for apples is making a apple crisp, when I get a chance I will post my recipe.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Girl, don't feel bad at all. I dropped out of HS at 18 and ran off and got married and ended up pregnant with my son. Need less to say I was not in college during traditional college age. I did end up going to college at 25 and graduated 3 years later, taking classes year round. In my classes the funny thing is I thought I would be the oldest and there were lots of folks in their late 30's and 40's. When I went to grad school, I was one of the younger folks as well since the average age of my colleagues was closer to 40-45.

Frankly I think going to school as an adult has a lot of advantages, it made me serious about my studies in a way that frankly my little brother who was a traditional college student was not. I realized that almost all the folks I knew in HS who went directly to college, only a handful are where I am now professionally and these are folks who didn't juggle parenthood, marriage amd work so go ahead and do your thang.












nnaemeka said:


> first of all, i do have my own age related insecurities but as someone teaching college level courses in very all-American traditional university, i'd love to have some mature students in my classes. these lil kiddies sometimes drive me CRAZY with their sense of entitlement and general cluelessness. i wish i could tell some of them to work for a couple of years and stop wasting my time and mommy and daddy's money and come back to the university when they are truly ready LEARN and engage. anyway, i took me ten years, 4 schools and three majors, to get my BA and whatever. i enjoyed being in college in late 20-s and early 30's and now i'm working on my PhD at 36. i think my life experiences make a wonderful contribution to my scholarship. so PLEASE don't feel shy about being a so-called older student, i'm sure your professors and classmates appreciate all that you bring. BTW i'm still older than alot of my colleagues and they're always shocked to hear my age...
> 
> and when i was whining about getting older on my B-day, my sistahfriend told me how she was just chillin with a very dynamic 84 yr old friend and that i should keep in time there always somebody older than you, still dreaming, still livin. and that's real.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> besides Erykah Badu is 37 and i'd take her fly bad azz self over Beyonce any day and Iman says 50 is the new 40 so trickle that down i'm only 26 and you 21!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/QUOT]
> 
> yes I am more mature, but the knowledge does salve the wound. I won't go in to detail for fear of sounding whiny, but I can't wait until I being something to the table.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jeca*
> I don't really think I'm old old, lol. Sometimes I do feel old. Example, all you sistas rocking "natural" hair, it will never be me. I have to get my hair dyed. My mom started to gray early around 26. Of course she passed it on to me. Yeah I think it looks good on some people sometimes but at 31 I don't want splashes of grey hair. Maybe when I hit my 40's I wouldn't feel so bad about having a few(although it's more than a few) but for now I dye them suckers. I wear my natural hair as in my natural curls but dying is something I don't think I will give up anytime soon without it I
> definitely feel old.
> 
> I am natural, but my hair is dyed black. I don't have any grey, but I love the shine of black hair.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ishereal*
> Hey ladies, I have been lurking and decided to come out of hiding after recently being diagnosed with ovarian cysts and a cyst on my uterus, I'm kind of numb right now and don't know what to make of the situation, so if any of you have any experience with either of the two your input would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> I have had one cyst that I know of burst. Hopefully yours will too!
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gabysmom617*
> Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.
> 
> My water broke a little after 10 pm on Wednesday, I got the hospital at 5cm dialated. In about an hour I was 8cm dialated. But I was handling contractions so well, they were coming every 5 mins very steadily, nice break in between, that I thought I didn't need an epidural, plus @ 8cm it was already too late. I used the birthing ball, my midwife massaged my back. Then I did different positions.
> 
> Then all of a sudden, they lowered the bottom of the bed and lifted the top, so it was like I was sitting an all heck broke loose. And he basically shot here like a speeding bullet. My midwife is still confused that I didn't tear.
> 
> A quick pic link: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/inde...ageID=13631179
> 
> Anyhow, let me go, his highness is calling me. Sigh.
> 
> :joy:Congratulations!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JustKiya*
> Cograts Sonya!! Welcome Earthside, Israel!!!
> 
> I spent my weekend in the woods with 200 or so other pagans - my last festival of the year, as even in the south, it's getting too dang cold to be outside that much!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> I am too lazy/busy to google. If I may ask, what is a pagan, and what do they believe?
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *splendid*
> Congrats Sonya on your new bundle!
> 
> Congrats Shay on the offer!
> 
> How did everyone spend there weekend?
> 
> I spent the weekend making and freezing soups for my dh and kids. I don't eat meat, so I wanted them to have things on the days I don't feel like cooking.
> 
> I think I am going to spend today making soups for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : I really want to make a corn type soup.
> 
> I am making soup today too & homemade pimiento cheese.
> I cheated on the soup by using a dried bean mixture from Whole Foods!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Congrats Sonya and Shay! and







s ishereal

I spent Sunday apple picking. Now I have 20lbs of apples in my kitchen--any and all recipes are appreciated









http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0630.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0621.jpg


Look at my thread here

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...9#post12388119


----------



## splendid

I am so peeved. The place we go apple picking was robbed last weekend.







Someone picked ALL the trees in the orchard bare. So sad.


----------



## Brown Lioness

CONGRATULATIONS SONYA!!! Welcome Israel!!!







:







:







:


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.

My water broke a little after 10 pm on Wednesday, I got the hospital at 5cm dialated. In about an hour I was 8cm dialated. But I was handling contractions so well, they were coming every 5 mins very steadily, nice break in between, that I thought I didn't need an epidural, plus @ 8cm it was already too late. I used the birthing ball, my midwife massaged my back. Then I did different positions.

Then all of a sudden, they lowered the bottom of the bed and lifted the top, so it was like I was sitting an all heck broke loose. And he basically shot here like a speeding bullet. My midwife is still confused that I didn't tear.

A quick pic link: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/inde...ageID=13631179

Anyhow, let me go, his highness is calling me. Sigh.

Congrats Momma!


----------



## eilonwy

: Welcome, Israel!

I spent my birthday at the ILs celebrating SIL's birthday and her new son's birthday.







So we had two birthday cakes, for him and for her, and we'll have mine later (last year we ended up doing it in January). It was just very amusing to everyone that it was my actual birthday and that we were celebrating two others.







In any case, my new nephew will be 16 next week, and he's a nice kid. He's a bit of a math geek, so he likes talking to me (because I know what he's talking about, and have fun new ideas to introduce to him).







SIL is enjoying life as a married woman, which is very exciting to her; She's going to be 42 next week, and everyone (herself included) thought that she probably wouldn't get married so it's kind of cool. She's still adjusting to life with a husband and a teenaged son.









Bear is sick again, this time with a deep, yicky cough that I'm hoping is asthma despite the fact that he's running a low-grade fever.







: In any case, this means that he'll have to have an immunology workup, so maybe we'll learn that his immune system is normal and he's just suffering for the lack of breastmilk. (There's nothing to be done about that at this point, as he's on Neocate because he started vomiting blood while he was nursing.) Something *simple*, you know?

Lisa-- I remember the woman you're talking about, and I bet I could even find her post. She wasn't around terribly long, but that made an impression on me as well. If I recall correctly, she had two daughters and was unschooling...







I'll go look for it, I' have a pretty good idea of the timeframe. Plus, we were on one thread for two solid years, remember?









Splendid-- That's just awful! Why do people do these things?


----------



## shayinme

Could use a little advice here, its related to frugality and even though we decided to kill the last conversation that broke off, I feel more comfy asking this here rather than in the frugality area.

As I mentioned, I got a job offer, its director of a community center for at risk kids, a good part of the job is meeting with folks throughout the county and increasing our visibility along with raising funds. Typical executive director work.

Anyhoo, there is that pesky clothes issue, I literally have no real professional clothes in fact I wore my only non pair of jeans to the interview with a sweater. For the most part as a consultant I rarely have face to face meetings and when I did this summer, I had summer clothes to wear.

Well one of dh's slow paying clients paid today on a small editing gig he did months ago and while my initial thought was to include this money in the bill pot. I am now wondering if I should take this money and get some clothes to wear to the new gig. My frugal side is like no, my really practical side is like you got a job and you need clothes. Like I said earlier my trips to the second hand stores really are not netting what I need and this amount he was paid would definitely get me hooked up with enough wardrobe to last the winter if I catch sales at places. Clearly I will be earning money so even though this small sum could go to pay something, what I am earning is more than this sum plus its continous. I am feeling like the money answered my prayers about clothes but ya know how it is. I am thinking get the kis stuff, house stuff amything but Mama needs.









Any thoughts?


----------



## oyinmama

get the clothes shay. like you said, you can pay the amount back into the bills pot with your first check, and the checks will be ongoing thereafter. you have been needing clothes for your new bod for a long time, and putting it off b/c of funds. well now you need clothes for new bod + new job! clearly there is a need in your life and the universe is stepping in to help you fill it.

there are ways to still be frugal, while filling this need: you can get, say, one or two pairs of slacks and 3 or 4 tops, and mix & match for a few weeks until the checks begin coming. i remember getting a temp gig when i had been in grad school and had nothing suitable - i would wear a shirt on monday tucked into slacks, and then open over a t-shirt later in the week, as a jacket. or as a layer under a sweater. get solid colors and classic shapes and see if there's anything at all in your closet that you can incorporate. bigger shirts, unbuttoned, as jackets? or bigger sweaters as top layers?

ETA: check sales @ places like oldnavy.com - super inexpensive and they have basics like slacks, oxfords, sweaters. often you can get deals like 2 for $xx. might not be the best quality in the world, but if you are looking for bang for your buck, and need a number of pieces immediately to mix and match, that might be a good place to get started on this immediate, project-driven aspect of your new wardrobe. or if there is a marshall's or tj maxx near you?


----------



## oyinmama

welcome, israel! and congrats sonya on a healthy birth!!









ishereal sending hugs and i hope you continue to receive only the best possible news about your health. what great info has been posted here! i learned a lot reading the responses.

@ bloomingstar and justkiya - yay, apple picking! yay, festivals!!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I am feeling like the money answered my prayers about clothes

It's obvious to me that this was an answer to prayer!







:

1. You haven't be able to buy nice clothes to fit your new body
2. You need to look professional for this new job (also a new blessing)

Girl, go on ahead and get fresh.









Oh, and may the blessings keep on a-coming!


----------



## rootzdawta

Congrats Gabysmom!

Ishereal--sending support your way!!


----------



## rootzdawta

Oh question, ladies: skin care routine?

What's yours?

I'm interested in what you use to moisturize your face. Do you grease your scalp and if so, with what? Or do you just oil your hair?

I'm trying to decide if my skin care routine is aggravating a scalp issue I've been having. Trying to see if the oil I use (shea butter) is clogging my pores or not.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh question, ladies: skin care routine?

What's yours?

I'm interested in what you use to moisturize your face. Do you grease your scalp and if so, with what? Or do you just oil your hair?

I'm trying to decide if my skin care routine is aggravating a scalp issue I've been having. Trying to see if the oil I use (shea butter) is clogging my pores or not.

For my skin, I use Aveda products. I will look at the names later, but I use this purifying gel to cleanse, a liquidy thing to put on afterwards and then their mosturizing lotion. The stuff is not cheap, when I buy all 3 products is like $80-85 but it lasts like 4 months and I use the products 2x a day.

For my hair (locs) I use this oil that is made by a sista in Brooklyn. A friend hooked me up http://www.tabeel.com/index.htm. I love this stuff, I use that and Oyin's Greg Juice on the hair and that's it aside from shampooing. I mostly just put the oil on my hair not so much in my scalp but there is some spilliage at times.

In truly hard times I have been known to use just Noxema on my face and then some of Oyin's whipped pudding.









Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 

In truly hard times I have been known to use just Noxema on my face and then some of Oyin's whipped pudding.









Shay

LoL . .. I was just thinking I'd hit up the drug store for some Noxzema!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: Welcome, Israel!

I spent my birthday at the ILs celebrating SIL's birthday and her new son's birthday.







So we had two birthday cakes, for him and for her, and we'll have mine later (last year we ended up doing it in January). It was just very amusing to everyone that it was my actual birthday and that we were celebrating two others.







In any case, my new nephew will be 16 next week, and he's a nice kid. He's a bit of a math geek, so he likes talking to me (because I know what he's talking about, and have fun new ideas to introduce to him).







SIL is enjoying life as a married woman, which is very exciting to her; She's going to be 42 next week, and everyone (herself included) thought that she probably wouldn't get married so it's kind of cool. She's still adjusting to life with a husband and a teenaged son.









Bear is sick again, this time with a deep, yicky cough that I'm hoping is asthma despite the fact that he's running a low-grade fever.







: In any case, this means that he'll have to have an immunology workup, so maybe we'll learn that his immune system is normal and he's just suffering for the lack of breastmilk. (There's nothing to be done about that at this point, as he's on Neocate because he started vomiting blood while he was nursing.) Something *simple*, you know?

*Lisa-- I remember the woman you're talking about, and I bet I could even find her post. She wasn't around terribly long, but that made an impression on me as well. If I recall correctly, she had two daughters and was unschooling...







I'll go look for it, I' have a pretty good idea of the timeframe.* Plus, we were on one thread for two solid years, remember?









Splendid-- That's just awful! Why do people do these things?









Yes, Yes! That sounds like her. Thank you Rynna


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
:
I am too lazy/busy to google. If I may ask, what is a pagan, and what do they believe?

Funny! You are the second person in as many days to say that.








Well, it depends on which pagan you ask, most days. In general, pagans are those who follow earth based religions/traditional/polytheistic practices - but not always.
So, Wiccans are pagans, and *some* Witches are pagans - but some Witches are Catholic, because Witchcraft is an art, not a belief system. Some people who follow various Native American spiritualities consider themselves pagan, others don't. I'm on a Kemetic Reconstructionist path, but not all Kemetics consider themselves pagan.








It can be very self-defined, and once you toss the eclectics in the mix, it gets realllllllllly interesting.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
I am so peeved. The place we go apple picking was robbed last weekend.







Someone picked ALL the trees in the orchard bare. So sad.

That is so sad.







*sigh*

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Well one of dh's slow paying clients paid today on a small editing gig he did months ago and while my initial thought was to include this money in the bill pot. I am now wondering if I should take this money and get some clothes to wear to the new gig. My frugal side is like no, my really practical side is like you got a job and you need clothes. Like I said earlier my trips to the second hand stores really are not netting what I need and this amount he was paid would definitely get me hooked up with enough wardrobe to last the winter if I catch sales at places. Clearly I will be earning money so even though this small sum could go to pay something, what I am earning is more than this sum plus its continous. I am feeling like the money answered my prayers about clothes but ya know how it is. I am thinking get the kids stuff, house stuff amything but Mama needs.









Any thoughts?

Get the clothes, Shay.







You need them, and just at the time that you needed them, the money is there. If that's not a nudge, I dunno what is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh question, ladies: skin care routine?

What's yours?

I'm interested in what you use to moisturize your face. Do you grease your scalp and if so, with what? Or do you just oil your hair?

I'm trying to decide if my skin care routine is aggravating a scalp issue I've been having. Trying to see if the oil I use (shea butter) is clogging my pores or not.

I use red palm oil on my body, and I don't use anything on my scalp, at all. I oil my hair lightly with castor oil after I wash it, but I leave the scalp clean. Oil on my scalp feels - icky.







Straight shea butter is too heavy for me, period. I have to cut it with some sort of 'liquid' oil. Shealoe butter, on the other hand, is utterly dreamy.

I clean my face with a mix of castor, olive, and jojoba oil. I use soap about twice a month or so, or after I do something esp. grubby (like spend a weekend in the woods). I prefer to use LUSH soaps on my skin, but I'm not nearly as particular about my body skin as I am about my face/hair.


----------



## purplegirl

Shay, get the clothes! You can only sacrifice but so much without feeling totally resentful.
I use borage oil on my skin. I use it to clean it and as well as moisturize it. If it needs toning, I will use witch hazel with lavender or tea tree oil. I keep it very simple!


----------



## splendid

Shay. I would go out and buy some new things. Is there any kind of shopping complex that has various stores? Might be worth the drive, I have found I can get some really nice clothes on clearance at Kohl's, TJ Maxx and Penney's.

Skin care routine:
Morning and Night:
Wash my face with a Alba daily face wash
Use Rosewater or WitchHazel as a toner
Use a small amount of Oil of Olay (still trying to find something that won't clog my pores)

on Weekends I:
Sat Morning is the same as M-F routine on Sat Evening I:
Do an exfoliate wash (Queen Helene- exfoliating scrub)

On Sunday I:
Do a Mint Julep mask (Queen Helene Brand)

On my hair, I most where box braids so I have a moisture spray I made out of conditioner, castor oil and water. But when I have my hair out I have a whipped shea butter formula I use.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.









: CONGRATS!!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 

I spent Sunday apple picking. Now I have 20lbs of apples in my kitchen--any and all recipes are appreciated







]

I am jealous!


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hey, everyone. XPOSTED in Breastfeeding...
So I'm a fluey mess right now. I think my head's going to explode from snot build up.








It doesn't help that not only does DS have the flu, but DH does too. UGH.
Anyone have any ideas for flu relief?
I'm still breastfeeding and a vegetarian, if that helps.

Neti pot. Get a good one (metal) and it will reduce yr flu time by half.







Also up yr vit C, echinacea & zinc. I myself favor "Emergen-C Immune Support" which has 1000mg Vit C plus the other goodies.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gabysmom617* 
Hey yall; Just wanted to let the ones who don't know that my baby was born on Thursday. His name is Israel Abijah Leviticus, he weighed 7lbs. His birth extremely FAST.

Congrats, mama!! Welcome to the world, Israel!







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
*Neti pot.* Get a good one (metal) and it will reduce yr flu time by half.







Also up yr vit C, echinacea & zinc. I myself favor "Emergen-C Immune Support" which has 1000mg Vit C plus the other goodies.

Congrats, mama!! Welcome to the world, Israel!







:

Neti pot is a great suggestion. I just purchased one last week. It is ceramic .Why do you recommend a metal one?


----------



## Brown Lioness

Dude, my GRANDDADDY put me on to the Neti Pot this past weekend, lol. I mean, i knew about it before, but because we share the same sinus issues he showed me how to use it. I was impressed! Go head on crunchy granddaddy! LOL!


----------



## rootzdawta

I feel so slow. No matter how I try, I can't get the hang of the Neti pot! Is it because mine is plastic??


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Funny! You are the second person in as many days to say that.








Well, it depends on which pagan you ask, most days. In general, pagans are those who follow earth based religions/traditional/polytheistic practices - but not always.
So, Wiccans are pagans, and *some* Witches are pagans - but some Witches are Catholic, because Witchcraft is an art, not a belief system. Some people who follow various Native American spiritualities consider themselves pagan, others don't. I'm on a Kemetic Reconstructionist path, but not all Kemetics consider themselves pagan.








It can be very self-defined, and once you toss the eclectics in the mix, it gets realllllllllly interesting.









I'm a Chaos Mage. Some Chaotes are Pagans, and some are not.







There's a Pagan Mamas thread over in Spirituality. Go say hi.










I'm terrified of Neti pots, for some reason... but I am getting really desperate. My sinuses are driving me insane.







: They really are scary, though. I can't wrap my head around pouring liquid up my nose....







Is there a less-scary alternative?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Dude, my GRANDDADDY put me on to the Neti Pot this past weekend, lol. I mean, i knew about it before, but because we share the same sinus issues he showed me how to use it. I was impressed! Go head on crunchy granddaddy! LOL!

go on granddad wit yo crunchy self!!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I feel so slow. No matter how I try, I can't get the hang of the Neti pot! Is it because mine is plastic??

It takes some getting used to. I don't think it's cause you have a plastic one because I think they are made according to the same structure. The idea is to hold your head over the sink, look down into the sink, while slightly tilting your head to the side. Then slowly pour the contents of the pot into one nostril until the saline solution comes out of the other. Then blow your nose and then repeat on the other side!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







I'm a Chaos Mage. Some Chaotes are Pagans, and some are not.







There's a Pagan Mamas thread over in Spirituality. Go say hi.









I'm terrified of Neti pots, for some reason... but I am getting really desperate. My sinuses are driving me insane.







: They really are scary, though. I can't wrap my head around pouring liquid up my nose....







Is there a less-scary alternative?


You can use a saline solution that is in a nasal spray. All pharmacies carry them, ie ocean spray.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I feel so slow. No matter how I try, I can't get the hang of the Neti pot! Is it because mine is plastic??

I have a ceramic one, but I do think it takes some time to get the hang of it. I find I do one nostril really well but by the time I switch sides its not so good. In the past though, the more I use it the better I get. Reminds me with my allergies acting up, I really need to use mine again.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







I'm a Chaos Mage. Some Chaotes are Pagans, and some are not.







There's a Pagan Mamas thread over in Spirituality. Go say hi.









I'm terrified of Neti pots, for some reason... but I am getting really desperate. My sinuses are driving me insane.







: They really are scary, though. I can't wrap my head around pouring liquid up my nose....







Is there a less-scary alternative?

I felt the same way in fact I was really skeptical but it really does offer relief, of course my dh still thinks its all in my head as far as relief







on the other hand he's not the one with allergy/sinus issues either.


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I feel so slow. No matter how I try, I can't get the hang of the Neti pot! Is it because mine is plastic??

Nope. Think about it. You are pouring a liquid into your nose, brain is probably saying heck no. I know when I first did it, I had to fit the urge to breath in.

I can't wait till the boys are older, they have allergies and a neti pot will help them during seasonal transitions.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Nope. Think about it. You are pouring a liquid into your nose, brain is probably saying heck no. I know when I first did it, I had to fit the urge to breath in.

I can't wait till the boys are older, they have allergies and a neti pot will help them during seasonal transitions.


Exactly! And the key is to breathe through your mouth when using it.


----------



## AndrewsMother

DH purchased a plastic neti pot but returned it to purchase a ceramic model. I don't have sinus or allergy problems, but hopefully it will work for him.

*Wonderful Panties: I had to share.*

My mother purchased these for me and I LOVE them. No VPL and best of all no panty creepage, even after washing.

http://www.soma.com/store/browse/she...catId=cat20004


----------



## xochimama

We got metal because they are easier to sanitize and don't break if dropped.

It definitely takes getting used to. I actually ordered mine from some website where it came from India (surprisingly affordable & fast shipping, too!), and it came w/ plenty of instructions, including a dorky video







with instructions on "stage one" and "stage two" jalaneti, the latter being an even deeper cleanse of the nasal passages where you actually breathe IN during the cleanse. They recommend getting the hang of stage one first, though-- the front nasal passage cleanse.

Between jalaneti and acupuncture, I managed to squelch the chronic URIs I was getting It was pretty bad: every 6-8 weeks I was sick, congested then post-nasal drip, then sore throat, etc.... ugh...


----------



## xochimama

This is the website where we bought our neti pots. Both DH and I got our own, so we did "option 4" -- the DVD was very useful (or save some $$ with a crunchy granddad







)


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*Wonderful Panties: I had to share.*

My mother purchased these for me and I LOVE them. No VPL and best of all no panty creepage, even after washing.

http://www.soma.com/store/browse/she...catId=cat20004

hey, panties! i am a cotton-only girl, though. has anyone tried the new hanes wedgie-proof panties? i changed sizes three times during my pregnancy (LOL!) and am on the way back down now.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
hey, panties! i am a cotton-only girl, though. has anyone tried the new hanes wedgie-proof panties? i changed sizes three times during my pregnancy (LOL!) and am on the way back down now.

I don't think that I changed panty sizes, but it was during my prernancy that came to loathe cotton panties.

These were my favorite pre and post pregnancy panties until I discovered the soma panties.

http://www.hanes.com/Hanes/Products/...nes/HCIQ1.aspx


----------



## eilonwy

So several years ago on this thread, we had a discussion about booties (surprised? I know!) and panties of course came up. Jeca said something about thongs, and I said that I feared the walking wedgie and besides, I've got a giant ghetto booty which might terrify people if it's not contained.









Fast forward through several pregnancies, and much growth and shrinkage of the aforementioned ghetto booty and it occurred to me that the reason I hated underpants so much was that when my size changed, the butt part got all sad and saggy and left me miserable... and my butt changed size a lot! So this most recent pregnancy, I bought some thongs. They come in nice, normal, comfortable cotton now (for I, too, am a cotton panties kind of girl) and I figured I owed it to myself to try, ghetto booty be damned. Lo and behold, I was happy-- the bits which leak were covered (sorry for the TMI) and I could lose 20 pounds and still wear the same underpants without worrying about the dreaded baggy-butt.







:

What's really funny about this is that underpants came up on another regular thread. Perhaps I'm supposed to buy some new underwear...


----------



## AndrewsMother

I never cared for thongs, the fabric is too wide, but I love(d) g-strings. That being said, I have not worn sexy panties since shortly before DS's conception. DH could care less what I wear. I don't need to turn myself on so i switched to bikini panties.


----------



## I-AM-Mother

the only time i wear panties is when i am on my menstrual, other than that I don't wear any. that includes socks as well, although my breast are too big to let my girls hang.


----------



## nnaemeka

congrads Gabysmom and welcome to your little one.


----------



## rootzdawta

Yup, I used to wear thongs exclusively (very thin T type thongs) because every other type of underwear was just too wedgie fabulous. I switched to boy shorts when I was pregnant with my first and somehow, even though they are not comfortable, that's kinda of where I am *stuck* now with the panties. DH says my a** eats my underwear.







He thinks it funny and sexy. I can't wait to look for and buy some wedgie free drawers. I'm not opposed to thongs per se but these days, I think I like a little more, ummm ... coverage.







: I'm hoping to 1) lose some weight and 2) get some money together to buy some new undies. I think achieving #1 will help motivate #2.

As a side note, DH made a comment that Nigerian women (I guess Igbo women specifically) have "high" butts. That made me fall out with laughter. What is a "high" butt? LoL . . . I know when we went to Ghana last summer, he was having a time keeping his eyes, ummm . . . on the road and not on the rumps. LoL.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Girl, you aint never heard of a high butt? I gots me a high booty, its just a booty that sit up higher on your back than than most people, lol. Walk around looking lik e a hump booty, lol

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yup, I used to wear thongs exclusively (very thin T type thongs) because every other type of underwear was just too wedgie fabulous. I switched to boy shorts when I was pregnant with my first and somehow, even though they are not comfortable, that's kinda of where I am *stuck* now with the panties. DH says my a** eats my underwear.







He thinks it funny and sexy. I can't wait to look for and buy some wedgie free drawers. I'm not opposed to thongs per se but these days, I think I like a little more, ummm ... coverage.







: I'm hoping to 1) lose some weight and 2) get some money together to buy some new undies. I think achieving #1 will help motivate #2.

As a side note, DH made a comment that Nigerian women (I guess Igbo women specifically) have "high" butts. That made me fall out with laughter. What is a "high" butt? LoL . . . I know when we went to Ghana last summer, he was having a time keeping his eyes, ummm . . . on the road and not on the rumps. LoL.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
They come in nice, normal, comfortable cotton now (for I, too, am a cotton panties kind of girl) and I figured I owed it to myself to try, ghetto booty be damned. Lo and behold, I was happy--

I remember that thread! You were very adamant on not putting you big ol' butt, I think you said,in some thongs, lol. Good for you for trying them out! I can only wear the panties shown on this thread if I'm on my period otherwise I'm a thing, or pantyless kinda girl. The waist on most panties just bothers me.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Girl, you aint never heard of a high butt? I gots me a high booty, its just a booty that sit up higher on your back than than most people, lol. Walk around looking lik e a hump booty, lol

exactly! i got a high booty too. so whenever i go to a new yoga class, the(white female) teacher will inevitably try adjust me--thinking i'm sticking it out---and i'm like nope i'm just shaped like that! i do think it dropped a bit with the pregnancy though







.

Rootzdawtah: even i can't keep my eyes off the booties when i'm in Africa! i go to Ghana often, but South African sistahs definately win the bootylicious contest IMO!!!









why do always feel like i need new panties? i used to be panty-free when i used to have chronic yeast infections i stopped wearing undies and it cleared up. but i'm back to undies. i can't do the thong thing though, except when i'm celebrating or more correctly want DH to celebrate







.


----------



## AndrewsMother

oooooh, I have a high bottom too, well atleast it was high before DS. It is still higher than a bottom of the average girl, but droopy to me.

A possible TMI question for those who don't wear panties.......how do you contain moisture?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
A possible TMI question for those who don't wear panties.......how do you contain moisture?

Inquiring minds want to know . . .


----------



## jeca

I don't really have a big moisture problem right now. I use to be pretty drippy (TMI I know) but it has slowed down greatly over the last year thank goodness. If I'm wearing a skirt or dress then it doesn't really matter does it.








Back to the topic of facial care. I am currently using Kiss my Face lime chamomile moisturizer and It doesn't clog your pores. It's pretty light.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I don't really have a big moisture problem right now. I use to be pretty drippy (TMI I know) but it has slowed down greatly over the last year thank goodness. If I'm wearing a skirt or dress then it doesn't really matter does it.









So, did the moisture ever run down your leg? I tired it once (very briefly), and well that was my experience.


----------



## purplegirl

Hey Sheila. How are you feeling?
And do we have a baby yet









I'm also awaiting the moisture and panty issue response


----------



## shayinme

Just popping in, the little one has been running a fever since Sunday night







, its ranging between 101-103. Ugh... Anyway we have been giving her Motrin since she is miserable, so finally breaking down and taking her to the doctor in the morning.

To say her being sick hit at a bad time is a understatement, I am in the middle of writing up a strategic plan for a client that we have been working on since June, that I need done like yesterday since the final payment is subtantial. Coupled with the fact that dh is in the middle of his busy time with work. However its times like this that I am reminded of why dh is a good guy, he's taking her to the doc in the morning so I can work and he has been hanging with her as much as he can since I am also recovering from my own health stuff and bogged down in work.









So some healing vibes would be great.









As for going out san undies, I used to do it when I was younger but its not really my thing now. Even thongs don't feel substantial enough for me.

Regarding high booties, yeah I used to have one







, my Mom used to call it a badunkadunk long before I ever heard the word. Sadly its dropped and flattened a bit though no one would ever say I am booty less. LOL

Anyway time to finish my Sleepytime and go cuddle with the little one.

Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

Shay, so sorry to hear your little one is still under the weather!! Sending healing vibes her way.







: It's good to know DH is being super helpful!







:

LoL . . . I guess I've been under a rock or maybe just surrounded by folks with high booties so ain't nobody ever termed it. Since having kids, my booty I think has dropped a bit and spread a bit. But I think I can get it back to before if and when I start working out, at least I hope so.


----------



## Draupadi

Wow! It's the TMI thread.








I used to go pantyless years ago, before getting pregnant. After that, I keep it all contained.
And I don't mess with thongs. I find them really uncomfortable. For some really strange reason, I always get constipated when I wear them, or I end up with a yeast infection. DH likes regular cotton bikinis anyway, and I'm fine with that.
And as for bootys...it's not as nice as it used to be, unfortunately. Age and pregnancy haven't been nice to that area of my body. It's not bad but not as high as it once was.
Anyway, I'm still sick here.







I've been downing ginger, hot water, lemon and honey like it's going out of style and feeling a little better, but I'm still coughing and congested. Poor DS's nose is always running and snotty. This is some wicked cold/flu thing going around.


----------



## purplegirl

Sorry you're still struggling with not feeling well Sheila.









Shay, I hope your little one gets better soon. It's so hard to see them sick and not be able to do much to give them relief.









My preference for panties is pure cotton. Anything else cause all sorts of discomfort and sensitivites









As for high behinds, we used to tease my cousin that her butt was so high all she needed was to put a chair on her back and she could give her kid a ride everywhere. Mine is low and flat due to genetics and age


----------



## jeca

Not to brag but I have a great behind. It's my most complemented on feature from other black women.







As for the "running down the leg" yeah sometimes. Doesn't really bother me though. Usually I don't feel it or anything. I will just sit down to pee and notice it there. I always wore undies when I was in my "early"days now I'm like who cares.


----------



## eilonwy

Jeca, you crack me up!









I have been known to go without underpants... but only in times of sheer desperation. Like, all of my underwear is in the laundry desperation.







Maybe I'm just leakier than most people... but ICK. Too much.

I have no idea how high my booty is or isn't; I just know that my shadow looks like a fat Kim Kardashian.







:

Shay, I hope your little one feels better soon. Mr. Bear is sick again as well.









Hm. It's time to feed the hordes again. Meh.


----------



## Bloomingstar

hmm I've never gone without undies and I'd be very afraid of what would happen with that right now!







: and currently, I am most pleased with full coverage cotton that's not too big (stupid maternity panties) or too small (stupid thought they were sooo cute before I was pregnant panties). that leaves me with a few "just right" options in the drawer and a few more I'll tolerate, and a whole bunch I want to take the scissors to!


----------



## Shy0717

Quick question ladies. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that DF and I are expecting our first little one. I had a loss earlier this year and am on progesterone with this pregnancy and so far everything looks good. I was wondering is it ok to get relaxers while pregnant?? Everything I've read seems to steer clear of them but I haven't found a definite answer. It's not a big deal if I can't as I was going to go ahead and get my hair braided anyhow but was just curious. Thanks Ladies


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shy0717* 
Quick question ladies. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that DF and I are expecting our first little one. I had a loss earlier this year and am on progesterone with this pregnancy and so far everything looks good. I was wondering is it ok to get relaxers while pregnant?? Everything I've read seems to steer clear of them but I haven't found a definite answer. It's not a big deal if I can't as I was going to go ahead and get my hair braided anyhow but was just curious. Thanks Ladies









I don't think that relaxer use has proven to cause damage to the unborn. As with any chemical there is a chance for fetal damage. I would not use mainstream cleaners while pregnant nor afterwards because of the chemical smell. Sodium Hydroxide, the same chemical found in relaxers is the base of most household chemicals.

If you are wary of fumes from cleansing products, skipping the relaxer might not be a bad idea.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Just popping in, the little one has been running a fever since Sunday night







, its ranging between 101-103. Ugh... Anyway we have been giving her Motrin since she is miserable, so finally breaking down and taking her to the doctor in the morning.

To say her being sick hit at a bad time is a understatement, I am in the middle of writing up a strategic plan for a client that we have been working on since June, that I need done like yesterday since the final payment is subtantial. Coupled with the fact that dh is in the middle of his busy time with work. However its times like this that I am reminded of why dh is a good guy, he's taking her to the doc in the morning so I can work and he has been hanging with her as much as he can since I am also recovering from my own health stuff and bogged down in work.









So some healing vibes would be great.









As for going out san undies, I used to do it when I was younger but its not really my thing now. Even thongs don't feel substantial enough for me.

Regarding high booties, yeah I used to have one







, my Mom used to call it a badunkadunk long before I ever heard the word. Sadly its dropped and flattened a bit though no one would ever say I am booty less. LOL

Anyway time to finish my Sleepytime and go cuddle with the little one.

Shay

How is she now?


----------



## shayinme

Dh took the little one to the doctor, negative for strep and waiting for results from urine testing but doctor just feels its a bug that will go away on its own. This evening dd seems better, she has had no Motrin in hours and the fever seems to be gone







: and she seems lot more like herself which means into everything.

Tomorrow at her preschool they are taking a field trip to a local farm for hayrides and pumpkin picking, dd really wants to go, so knowing my strong-willed girl she is willing herself healthy.

Its been a long week, when the kids are sick, it seems like everything stops. Dh & I are both behind in work and neither of us have eaten much since with Izzi so sick, I was in no mood to cook.

Off to finish my evening tea and head to bed.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Dh took the little one to the doctor, negative for strep and waiting for results from urine testing but doctor just feels its a bug that will go away on its own. This evening dd seems better, she has had no Motrin in hours and the fever seems to be gone







: and she seems lot more like herself which means into everything.

Tomorrow at her preschool they are taking a field trip to a local farm for hayrides and pumpkin picking, dd really wants to go, so knowing my strong-willed girl she is willing herself healthy.

Its been a long week, when the kids are sick, it seems like everything stops. Dh & I are both behind in work and neither of us have eaten much since with Izzi so sick, I was in no mood to cook.

Off to finish my evening tea and head to bed.

Shay

I'm so glad she's feeling better. Lil mama didn't want to miss her field trip. bless her heart


----------



## Arike

Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!


----------



## AndrewsMother

:Congratulations!!!







:

I can't wait to read your birth story.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!









Yay! I'm glad he is here and both of you are doing well. What an awesome labor







: I can't wait to hear the birth story! congratulations mama







:


----------



## jeca

: CONGRATS

So no one wanted a November baby huh?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!

















:







: Congratulation!


----------



## Jannah6

: CONGRATULATIONS on the birth and joy of your LO


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I don't think that relaxer use has proven to cause damage to the unborn. As with any chemical there is a chance for fetal damage. I would not use mainstream cleaners while pregnant nor afterwards because of the chemical smell. Sodium Hydroxide, the same chemical found in relaxers is the base of most household chemicals.

If you are wary of fumes from cleansing products, skipping the relaxer might not be a bad idea.

I'd agree, but I'd also add that maybe it hasn't been proven to cause damage because studies of things that primarily impact more black women than anyone else aren't the studies that are most likely to get funded well anyway.







: And in general, there are the ethical issues with setting up studies of what happens to pregnant women and fetuses if we do x,y,z, although the studies can be done.

Arike! Congratulations!







:







:







:







:


----------



## JustKiya

Congrats Arike!!!!! Welcome Little One!!!







:







:







:


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!









Wow Arike Congrads!!! Enjoy your babymoon!!!!







:







:







:


----------



## I-AM-Mother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!









Congratulations! That's amazing!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I'd agree, but I'd also add that maybe it hasn't been proven to cause damage because studies of things that primarily impact more black women than anyone else aren't the studies that are most likely to get funded well anyway.







: And in general, there are the ethical issues with setting up studies of what happens to pregnant women and fetuses if we do x,y,z, although the studies can be done.


I agree with that too!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Awww, congratulations Arike!!!!!

*waits for the birth story like a fiend*








:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!


----------



## oyinmama

congrats congrats congrats arike and welcome to the new little one!!


----------



## xochimama

Congratulations Arike and welcome to your little guy!!







:







:







:


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shy0717* 
Quick question ladies. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that DF and I are expecting our first little one. I had a loss earlier this year and am on progesterone with this pregnancy and so far everything looks good. I was wondering is it ok to get relaxers while pregnant?? Everything I've read seems to steer clear of them but I haven't found a definite answer. It's not a big deal if I can't as I was going to go ahead and get my hair braided anyhow but was just curious. Thanks Ladies









Given that you've had a prior loss, you might be interested to know that women who work in the cosmetic industry have more losses than women in other lines of work. I'd completely skip the creamy crack if I was you.

That said... I only relaxed my hair once, and it looked HORRIBLE.







So maybe I'm not the best person to ask.







Feel free to toss my opinion to the bottom of the bin.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shy0717* 
Quick question ladies. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that DF and I are expecting our first little one. I had a loss earlier this year and am on progesterone with this pregnancy and so far everything looks good. I was wondering is it ok to get relaxers while pregnant?? Everything I've read seems to steer clear of them but I haven't found a definite answer. It's not a big deal if I can't as I was going to go ahead and get my hair braided anyhow but was just curious. Thanks Ladies









I've never heard anything about relaxers, but I know dye is considered a no-no. My friend stopped relaxing her hair as a precaution during her pregnancy but no one told her not to. It may be better to just play it safe than sorry (or as Eilonwy says, "Skip the creamy crack!").


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!









Congratulations! Welcome to the little man!







:


----------



## jeca

I received some interesting news today.
As some of you know I have had a part time job for the last two years. It's been great really. very flexible, great hours (no need for childcare since it's during school hours). For example today I worked from 9-130. Perfect for me since I wasn't looking for anything full time. It's not a lot, about 6-12 hours in a week. Well the city needs to cut 12 million dollars from their budget next year. Guess one of the things they are looking to cut? The program I work for! So no job for me next year if it gets approved, talk about a bummer.









I would skip the relaxer to be on the safe side.


----------



## xochimama

Any experienced seamstresses here?









I x-posted in the sewing forum:
DD asked for a "purple alligator monster" costume for Halloween. I found a dragon pattern, we bought purple fleece, etc. Sounds good, right? Except that I haven't sewn in TWENTY FIVE YEARS.

help!

What needle do I use for fleece? What do I use for costume satin?

What tension do I use for these respective fabrics?

eeks...what have I got myself into...??!! Anyone else doing custom Halloween costumes?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Any experienced seamstresses here?









I x-posted in the sewing forum:
DD asked for a "purple alligator monster" costume for Halloween. I found a dragon pattern, we bought purple fleece, etc. Sounds good, right? Except that I haven't sewn in TWENTY FIVE YEARS.

help!

What needle do I use for fleece? What do I use for costume satin?

What tension do I use for these respective fabrics?

eeks...what have I got myself into...??!! Anyone else doing custom Halloween costumes?

I would use a # 12-15 for fleece depending upon the weight of the fabric with a tension setting of 3.

Satin requires a smaller needle. Try a #9-11 once again depending upon the weight of the satin. The tension should be set to 5 or 6.

the link below should help with tension issues.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/SanDi...ive+Bundle+Mod


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I received some interesting news today.
As some of you know I have had a part time job for the last two years. It's been great really. very flexible, great hours (no need for childcare since it's during school hours). For example today I worked from 9-130. Perfect for me since I wasn't looking for anything full time. It's not a lot, about 6-12 hours in a week. Well the city needs to cut 12 million dollars from their budget next year. Guess one of the things they are looking to cut? The program I work for! So no job for me next year if it gets approved, talk about a bummer.









I would skip the relaxer to be on the safe side.

Sorry about your job, Jeca.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I received some interesting news today.
As some of you know I have had a part time job for the last two years. It's been great really. very flexible, great hours (no need for childcare since it's during school hours). For example today I worked from 9-130. Perfect for me since I wasn't looking for anything full time. It's not a lot, about 6-12 hours in a week. Well the city needs to cut 12 million dollars from their budget next year. Guess one of the things they are looking to cut? The program I work for! So no job for me next year if it gets approved, talk about a bummer.









I would skip the relaxer to be on the safe side.

Perhaps there is something better awaiting you!


----------



## purplegirl

Sorry about the job Jeca!








Andrewsmom, you are so resourceful.









Did yall hear about Jennifer Hudson's family? Her mom and brother were slain and her young nephew is missing. My heart is breaking for her. I can't imagine the pain she is in.


----------



## splendid

Jeca sorry to hear about your job.









Arike congrats on your new babe. Welcome to the world new baby!

Shy0717 congrats on your pregnancy. I would skip the relaxer for now, and maybe just wear braids or other protective styles.

Well it is the weekend. I'm thinking about baking cookies and freezing cookie doughs. What is everyone else doing?


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sorry about the job Jeca!








Andrewsmom, you are so resourceful.









Did yall hear about Jennifer Hudson's family? Her mom and brother were slain and her young nephew is missing. My heart is breaking for her. I can't imagine the pain she is in.









I've read the stories, apparently it was her sister that made the find.







Lot of healing thoughts to her. I hope they find her nephew well.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Jeca sorry to hear about your job.









Arike congrats on your new babe. Welcome to the world new baby!

Shy0717 congrats on your pregnancy. I would skip the relaxer for now, and maybe just wear braids or other protective styles.

*Well it is the weekend. I'm thinking about baking cookies and freezing cookie doughs. What is everyone else doing?*

*
*

I just got back from the dentist. The good news is that I have no cavities!!







Later, I am heading to my sister's. My family has an investment club, so we are meeting today to do a portfolio review







After that, it's back home to knit and make more soap. Tomorrow, I'll head up to Philly for a hot minute.


----------



## jeca

I need to clean up the stye today and bake something for a Halloween party later on.


----------



## eilonwy

I meant to do some knitting and laundry today; Instead, I've spent most of the day asleep. I've had a sinus headache all week and with nobody pulling my hair and insisting that I be awake, I couldn't roll out of bed. Ugh. I feel like I've wasted the whole day. The worst part is... I want to go back to sleep right now.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Andrewsmom, you are so resourceful.









Did yall hear about Jennifer Hudson's family? Her mom and brother were slain and her young nephew is missing. My heart is breaking for her. I can't imagine the pain she is in.









Purplegirl, you are very positive, and I like that. You always have wonderful things to say about forum members. Thanks, I love to make blankets and such.

I do hope that her nephew is found. Does anyone know if he is the son of the alleged muderer?

I just put enough dough to make 10 dozen cookies into the refrigerator to chill until tomorrow morning. Then I get to bake them.


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Purplegirl, you are very positive, and I like that. You always have wonderful things to say about forum members. Thanks, I love to make blankets and such.

I do hope that her nephew is found. Does anyone know if he is the son of the alleged muderer?

I just put enough dough to make 10 dozen cookies into the refrigerator to chill until tomorrow morning. Then I get to bake them.









The man they have in custody is the boy's step-father.


----------



## Arike

Thank you so much for all your congratulations and well wishes!







: I finally got around to posting my birth story on my blog!







: The baby has been sleeping well today so I finally got some time between feedings.







Feel free to leave feedback/comments!(i love that!







)

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*Purplegirl, you are very positive, and I like that. You always have wonderful things to say about forum members. Thanks, I love to make blankets and such.*

I do hope that her nephew is found. Does anyone know if he is the son of the alleged muderer?

I just put enough dough to make 10 dozen cookies into the refrigerator to chill until tomorrow morning. Then I get to bake them.

















. Right back atcha mama!


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I would use a # 12-15 for fleece depending upon the weight of the fabric with a tension setting of 3.

Satin requires a smaller needle. Try a #9-11 once again depending upon the weight of the satin. The tension should be set to 5 or 6.

the link below should help with tension issues.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/SanDi...ive+Bundle+Mod

nak

thanks, mama!








to jeca-- i hope everything falls into place for you

i was sorting & decluttering kids/maternity clothes today. it's one of those tasks that is alternately rewarding and maddening: I'm always left with more to do at the end-- consign, give away, repack for younger kid... blah... but we are bursting at the gills in our tiny little rental...

tomorrow we are going to a matanza







: and harvest festival at a friends' farm.









nighttimes are devoted to aforementioned purple alligator monster


----------



## Bloomingstar

I hope this works in your favor, jeca!

Feel better Rynna!

Arike I am scurrying over to read the birth story







:

I went to the farmer's market and co-op very briefly this morning and then came home and slept for a couple hours, which I didn't expect. I guess the third trimester sleepies are coming







This evening I baked an apple crisp, thanks to purplegirl and the link to your apple thread, and some pumpkin chocolate chip cookies. I only baked a dozen and put the rest of the dough in the fridge for later. And I'm probably going to bed pretty early tonight since I'm feeling pretty pooped again.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

wow, this thread moves so incredibly fast!







: My internet stopped working this week and I feel like I have missed so much.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Girl, you aint never heard of a high butt? I gots me a high booty, its just a booty that sit up higher on your back than than most people, lol. Walk around looking lik e a hump booty, lol









you are hilarious!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Not to brag but I have a great behind. It's my most complemented on feature from other black women.







As for the "running down the leg" yeah sometimes. Doesn't really bother me though. Usually I don't feel it or anything. I will just sit down to pee and notice it there. I always wore undies when I was in my "early"days now I'm like who cares.


















I have a complex about not wearing undies. I just feel so naked. and oh,My butt is my favorite feature too!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shy0717* 
Quick question ladies. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that DF and I are expecting our first little one. I had a loss earlier this year and am on progesterone with this pregnancy and so far everything looks good. I was wondering is it ok to get relaxers while pregnant?? Everything I've read seems to steer clear of them but I haven't found a definite answer. It's not a big deal if I can't as I was going to go ahead and get my hair braided anyhow but was just curious. Thanks Ladies









Congratulations!







:
I'm with Eilonwy too, "skip the creamy crack" lol.
I just know that it temporarily damaged my sister's perfectly healthy, beautiful hair the one time she used it. so, i don't recommend it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey ladies!

My little prince was born on October 22, 2008 at 4:19 am! He weighed in at 6 pounds 2 ounces and is 21 inches in length. And he has strong little muscles! He is long and lean! B and I are SO in love with this little boo. He's such a cutey! My birth was fast, I had less than 2 hours of active labor. After my midwife came over when we established I was in labor for real, she checked me and to the surprise of all of us, I was already FULLY dilated and ready to push. I was like "WTH???" I couldn't believe it! I pushed for about 29 minutes and then the baby arrived! I had the baby a little less than an hour after the midwife arrived. Usually first time mothers jump the gun with labor because they do not know the signs of imminent birth. I guess I was the opposite. My midwife thinks I was probably walking around partially dilated for days, maybe even weeks! I plan on posting an official birth story soon!









Congratulations! I'll read the birth story first thing in the morning. You are so blessed to have such a short labor and delivery! Enjoy your baby. and welcome to the world, baby prince!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I received some interesting news today.
As some of you know I have had a part time job for the last two years. It's been great really. very flexible, great hours (no need for childcare since it's during school hours). For example today I worked from 9-130. Perfect for me since I wasn't looking for anything full time. It's not a lot, about 6-12 hours in a week. Well the city needs to cut 12 million dollars from their budget next year. Guess one of the things they are looking to cut? The program I work for! So no job for me next year if it gets approved, talk about a bummer.









I would skip the relaxer to be on the safe side.

I'm so sorry to hear that jeca. I'm also certain there's something better to come for you. good luck!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

Did yall hear about Jennifer Hudson's family? Her mom and brother were slain and her young nephew is missing. My heart is breaking for her. I can't imagine the pain she is in.









no I didn't. I'm so out of the loop. that's incredibly heartbreaking!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
[/B]

I just got back from the dentist. *The good news is that I have no cavities!!







* Later, I am heading to my sister's. My family has an investment club, so we are meeting today to do a portfolio review







After that, it's back home to knit and make more soap. Tomorrow, I'll head up to Philly for a hot minute.

LUcky you! That is great news! I'm too afraid to find out if I do have any.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*Purplegirl, you are very positive, and I like that.* You always have wonderful things to say about forum members. Thanks, I love to make blankets and such.


I completely agree.

Andrewsmother, I wish I could be creative like you. I'm such a doofus when it comes to making stuff other than food.

so, tonight, I'm off to a halloween party. first one in a very long time. I'm wearing some trashy clothes too







goin' as a prison mate.
wish me luck!


----------



## rootzdawta

Arike, I posted on your blog but I also wanted to say







CONGRATULATIONS!!







here.

Everyone, I just finished reading a very interesting book called _The Shadow Speaker_ by Nnedi Okorofor-Mbeku. It's a futuristic/fantasy book (nothing scary or apocalyptic). It's geared towards 12 year olds and up but it was a good read. I have Octavia Butler's _The Parable of the Talents_ on hold at the library hoping to read that next.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Aww, what a glorious birth story!!! Congratulations again, mama Arike!

jeca, peace and blessings to you about your job.









I also heard about Jennifer Hudson's family tragedy...i could hardly believe it. I pray peace and strength to her family, because i cant even imagine the pain she is currently in.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Thank you so much for all your congratulations and well wishes!







: I finally got around to posting my birth story on my blog!







: The baby has been sleeping well today so I finally got some time between feedings.







Feel free to leave feedback/comments!(i love that!







)

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Thank you so much for all your congratulations and well wishes!







: I finally got around to posting my birth story on my blog!







: The baby has been sleeping well today so I finally got some time between feedings.







Feel free to leave feedback/comments!(i love that!







)

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html

Beautiful birth story!! WOW







blessings to all of you


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
the link below should help with tension issues.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/SanDi...ive+Bundle+Mod

hey, did you mean to send a different link? this one is unrelated


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Thank you so much for all your congratulations and well wishes!







: I finally got around to posting my birth story on my blog!







: The baby has been sleeping well today so I finally got some time between feedings.







Feel free to leave feedback/comments!(i love that!







)

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html

I loved your birth story. I am so thrilled that 'lil dude' is here, safe in his mama's arms









*Mommy2Amira*, I can't wait to hear about your Halloween party! I haven't been to one in years but the last one I attended, I had a blast.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Aww, what a glorious birth story!!! Congratulations again, mama Arike!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Beautiful birth story!! WOW







blessings to all of you


Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I loved your birth story. I am so thrilled that 'lil dude' is here, safe in his mama's arms










Thanks ladies! Being a mom so far has been a roller coaster ride. And I have had some weepy days, not postpartum depression or anything. I am having problems with breastfeeding due to a low milk supply caused by my polycystic ovarian syndrome. My doula has been so wonderful and is helping me with this issue. I am pumping to increase my supply and for now I am supplementing with formula. I just feel bad that my little prince wasn't getting all he needed from my breast this whole time. But I am relieved that now we know so we can help correct the situation. Last night I was in tears; me and the baby were crying together- he was hungry and I was frustrated. I called my mom at like 11:30 at night in tears. I thought I just sucked at breastfeeding and that I was being a punk. 90 minutes of breastfeeding on and off with only 40 minutes of rest in between?







: Poor babe wasn't getting enough so he just kept sucking for dear life for like up to 2 hours!







But now with the pumping and the supplementing, we are hoping to get him back up to birth weight within the next week. I get a little weepy thinking about the whole situation but at least now the baby is getting the nutrition he needs along with much needed rest.(He wasn't sleeping as much as a newborn should).

Anyway, thanks for all the good vibes you all have been sending through the net.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Thanks ladies! Being a mom so far has been a roller coaster ride. And I have had some weepy days, not postpartum depression or anything. I am having problems with breastfeeding due to a low milk supply caused by my polycystic ovarian syndrome. My doula has been so wonderful and is helping me with this issue. I am pumping to increase my supply and for now I am supplementing with formula. I just feel bad that my little prince wasn't getting all he needed from my breast this whole time. But I am relieved that now we know so we can help correct the situation. Last night I was in tears; me and the baby were crying together- he was hungry and I was frustrated. I called my mom at like 11:30 at night in tears. I thought I just sucked at breastfeeding and that I was being a punk. 90 minutes of breastfeeding on and off with only 40 minutes of rest in between?







: Poor babe wasn't getting enough so he just kept sucking for dear life for like up to 2 hours!







But now with the pumping and the supplementing, we are hoping to get him back up to birth weight within the next week. I get a little weepy thinking about the whole situation but at least now the baby is getting the nutrition he needs along with much needed rest.(He wasn't sleeping as much as a newborn should).

Anyway, thanks for all the good vibes you all have been sending through the net.









I'm sorry mama







. I think all of what you are feeling is completely normal. It sounds like you have a great doula and I hope she is able to help get you through this challenge.


----------



## Sugarshoc

Ooohhh, Congratulations Arike!!







:







:







:


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Last night I was in tears; me and the baby were crying together- he was hungry and I was frustrated. I called my mom at like 11:30 at night in tears. I thought I just sucked at breastfeeding and that I was being a punk. 90 minutes of breastfeeding on and off with only 40 minutes of rest in between?







: Poor babe wasn't getting enough so he just kept sucking for dear life for like up to 2 hours!







But now with the pumping and the supplementing, we are hoping to get him back up to birth weight within the next week. I get a little weepy thinking about the whole situation but at least now the baby is getting the nutrition he needs along with much needed rest.(He wasn't sleeping as much as a newborn should).

Anyway, thanks for all the good vibes you all have been sending through the net.









Hang in there, mama. The first couple weeks are INTENSE. I'm sure you are doing a great job! Keep pumping and definitely check in on the bfing forum for other supply-increase tips/ herbal supplements (fenugreek seems to be popular)-- I'm sure your doula knows all this. Also, it is considered "normal" for babies to take two weeks to get back to birth weight.






















you will make it!!


----------



## jeca

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081027/..._bodies_hudson








I think there's a pretty good chance it's him. I wonder what type of people are capable of things like that.


----------



## purplegirl

It just breaks my heart. What is this world coming to? I can't stop thinking about this family.


----------



## Jannah6

It's so so sad







. My heart goes out to Jennifer and her sister. How do you ever recover from something like this?


----------



## Bloomingstar

It really really is heartbreaking.


----------



## oyinmama

yeah i can't imagine the horror

it makes me both sad and angry and unbelieving and outraged and ...


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
yeah i can't imagine the horror

it makes me both sad and angry and unbelieving and outraged and ...

sick to my stomach


----------



## purplegirl

Honestly, I've thought about ever since this happened. I can't shake it; being a human being, there's something about this that shakes you to the core. How will they ever recover? I am a therapist and know about resiliency but this is way too much for anyone to process and come to peace with. I'm not sure time will heal these wounds. I suppose you go on living life with a piece of your heart forever missing.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
H. I'm not sure time will heal these wounds. I suppose you go on living life with a piece of your heart forever missing.









That's pretty much what you do. My own brother was killed a few years ago in a violent crime and no one has ever gotten over it not to mention the killer was never caught. I guess the only thing that helps(sometimes) is knowing that the person responsible is stopped from hurting other people. If the man in custody did do there is some small light in knowing he will NOt be treated well in prison.


----------



## purplegirl

My cousin was murdered when I was a teen. His killer was never caught. I still feel the anger and resentment. It was an extremely painful time in my life and if I think about it too hard now, it brings back those difficult feelings.


----------



## oyinmama

(((hugs))) to jeca and purplegirl! i am sending love and light to you and to your families.

you know. as horrific as jennifer hudson's situation is, i also was thinking about the fact that we know about it so quickly and in such detail because of her fame - but crime and loss touch too many people, too often.

my heart is just hurting.

i am just trying to remember that there are equal amounts of good news in any given day, and much much more normal every dayness going on - someone gave birth, some baby grew a tooth, somebody got an A on a test after studying very hard, someone got a C but will still graduate, etc. there is good in the world even when news of the horrific looms, or experiences of loss or horror eclipse our world.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
(((hugs))) to jeca and purplegirl! i am sending love and light to you and to your families.










Oyinmama said it nicely so I want to send even more your way!


----------



## purplegirl

Thanks for the love mamas.










I agree Oyinmama, there is still good in the world and for that, I am grateful.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

sending some your way too, purplegirl and jeca









I too agree, there is a lot of good in the world.. everytime, my daughter says "love you, mommy", I'm reminded just how truly blessed I am.

Arike, I definately agree with xochimama. Those first few weeks, hell, even the first year are just exactly what you described, one hell of a roller coaster ride. Those emotions you are experiencing are exactly what I went through. totally, and completely normal. I felt like a complete hormonal mess. crying one minute and euphoric the other all the while worried and stressed that I wasn't doing it right. You will find your groove. You gave birth to a wonderful baby! remember that.









and Oh, I didn't get my milk till day 5. Pumping and a great lactation consultant and La leche league helped. a great deal.

Purple girl, it was a lot of fun to dress up and hang out with friends. There were a couple Sarah Palins and Lumbar from Office Space that completely made my night. I just wished there was more music and dancing. I missed shaking my booty!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Hello Mommas!!!

Please take my survey that is cross posted in Safety and hopefully TAO.
I need imput from mom's of all races.

Hello Mommas,
Please take my survey about Child Safety Restraint Use. I want to make a correlation between economics and car seat use for a research paper.

Thank you.

http://www.zoomerang.com/Survey/?p=WEB228ERLWR29D


----------



## jeca

I took the survey. So will you post the results or your paper once you've finished, I'm curious to the results. My mother thinks it's crazy my kids are still in carseats/boosters. I say it's more common than not. Maybe the people she knows (including other family members)are just nuts.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I took the survey. So will you post the results or your paper once you've finished, I'm curious to the results. My mother thinks it's crazy my kids are still in carseats/boosters. I say it's more common than not. Maybe the people she knows (including other family members)are just nuts.










Only 100 people may take the survey since I used the free option. I should be able to post the results tonight.

No, I would say that we are nuts are the others are normal.







:


----------



## xochimama

Just back from hearing our future First Lady speak in our town plaza.

Can I just say























































































So eloquent and inspiring! Her speech was global and personal at the same time. She's probably given this, or a similar speech, hundreds of times in the last few months, but NOT ONCE did it sound rote or repetitive. It was as though she was speaking with a small group of intimate friends. Amazing!

We waited for over an hour to get into to the viewing/listening area, people were excited, talking, laughing (small town so easy to run into friends). Street-fair atmosphere. By the time she walked on the stage, everyone was ready to fall into their appointed role--waving signs, chanting O-BA-MA. It was as though we were ready to "play our part" of the pumped-up campaign crowd. TV cameras, radio hosts, journalists w/ their notebooks were all there.

But Michelle didn't succumb to the stumping-- she didn't suck up and just give us easy one-liners to cheer. She really SPOKE about the problems we are facing and how and why her husband is the man to lead us into a new era of dealing with these challenges. It was really incredible--her ability to quiet and connect with this large mass of people.























I was about 25 feet away from her, but had to sit through a lot of it to nurse the little guy. Poor little babe was overwhelmed by the noise-- every time the crowd cheered, his face puckered up with tears. Meanwhile, DD was sitting on DH's shoulders, waving a sign








.


----------



## JustKiya

Oh, aren't you lucky xochimama! That sounds like an utterly wonderful experience!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Just back from hearing our future First Lady speak in our town plaza.

Can I just say























































































So eloquent and inspiring! Her speech was global and personal at the same time. She's probably given this, or a similar speech, hundreds of times in the last few months, but NOT ONCE did it sound rote or repetitive. It was as though she was speaking with a small group of intimate friends. Amazing!

We waited for over an hour to get into to the viewing/listening area, people were excited, talking, laughing (small town so easy to run into friends). Street-fair atmosphere. By the time she walked on the stage, everyone was ready to fall into their appointed role--waving signs, chanting O-BA-MA. It was as though we were ready to "play our part" of the pumped-up campaign crowd. TV cameras, radio hosts, journalists w/ their notebooks were all there.

But Michelle didn't succumb to the stumping-- she didn't suck up and just give us easy one-liners to cheer. She really SPOKE about the problems we are facing and how and why her husband is the man to lead us into a new era of dealing with these challenges. It was really incredible--her ability to quiet and connect with this large mass of people.























I was about 25 feet away from her, but had to sit through a lot of it to nurse the little guy. Poor little babe was overwhelmed by the noise-- every time the crowd cheered, his face puckered up with tears. Meanwhile, DD was sitting on DH's shoulders, waving a sign







.

Lucky you mama







. Michelle is definitely a woman of substance and will make an awesome First Lady!


----------



## Brown Lioness

*is mad jelly of xochimama*

I LOVE me some Michelle Obama, she's rawks!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Just back from hearing our future First Lady speak in our town plaza.

Can I just say























































































So eloquent and inspiring! Her speech was global and personal at the same time. She's probably given this, or a similar speech, hundreds of times in the last few months, but NOT ONCE did it sound rote or repetitive. It was as though she was speaking with a small group of intimate friends. Amazing!

We waited for over an hour to get into to the viewing/listening area, people were excited, talking, laughing (small town so easy to run into friends). Street-fair atmosphere. By the time she walked on the stage, everyone was ready to fall into their appointed role--waving signs, chanting O-BA-MA. It was as though we were ready to "play our part" of the pumped-up campaign crowd. TV cameras, radio hosts, journalists w/ their notebooks were all there.

But Michelle didn't succumb to the stumping-- she didn't suck up and just give us easy one-liners to cheer. She really SPOKE about the problems we are facing and how and why her husband is the man to lead us into a new era of dealing with these challenges. It was really incredible--her ability to quiet and connect with this large mass of people.























I was about 25 feet away from her, but had to sit through a lot of it to nurse the little guy. Poor little babe was overwhelmed by the noise-- every time the crowd cheered, his face puckered up with tears. Meanwhile, DD was sitting on DH's shoulders, waving a sign







.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
*is mad jelly of xochimama*

I LOVE me some Michelle Obama, she's rawks!









: I got a mad crush on Michelle, shoot can I just be honest and say I probably like her more than Barack







. She is too cool for school!

Shay


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: I got a mad crush on Michelle, shoot can I just be honest and say I probably like her more than Barack







. She is too cool for school!

Shay

i know, right!?
a friend of mine made a teeshirt that said 'michelle obama is my first lady'


----------



## AndrewsMother

I think that Barack will strive to make the first term of his presidency a success, like many I am elated at the idea of him winning on Tuesday, but my cynical mind is unsure of life after November 4th. Yes, racism and prejudice are every day factors for many Black Americans, but at times I can imagine that I am truly everyones equal. Atleast in their minds.

Last night as we drove to the ATM I lamented to DH that I am afraid that if, Barack win Black Americans will experience an ugly awakening to the long thought dying racist sentiments of many white Americans. Perhaps I am overreacting.

Barack may have the countries best interest at heart, but will those who surround him on the Hill really want to see him succeed?


----------



## rootzdawta

Question Ladies . . .

Tribe defined.

I've been really thinking about this and I know the question has been asked by women who are not Black but . . .

In your opinion (as a woman of color), why is there a "Women of Color" tribe?

How would you feel about a "White Women" tribe?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question Ladies . . .

Tribe defined.

I've been really thinking about this and I know the question has been asked by women who are not Black but . . .

In your opinion (as a woman of color), why is there a "Women of Color" tribe?

How would you feel about a "White Women" tribe?

Well I think that the reason for this tribe is probably due to the fact that the majority of members are white here, for me its clear that in some cases parenting and NFL are often presented through the lens of whiteness. I think having this tribe allows women of color a space to maybe discuss issues filtered through our own lens of being WOC. Does that make sense?

As for the second question a white women tribe would take on a negative tone for me, after all most of the folks here are already white. Irs sort of like why things such as Black History Month exist (simple comparison, I know but I am pressed for time) because for many of we remember growing up when the history of anyone who wasn't white was just a passing mention.

Shay


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
How would you feel about a "White Women" tribe?

Pretty much majority of the threads here are "white woman" threads.








It really wouldn't be bother me if there was a "white women tribe" just as an "asian tribe", "jewish tribe" ,"Christian tribe". Some thing are outside my culture or norm and I see no reason why people in general shouldn't have a secure place to talk about things they feel they can personally relate to better than the general population.
if there is not a need or reason to have a WOC" tribe than there should be no reason for any of the tribes here. It's about finding your personal space where you may feel you best fit in or a more secure place for you to talk about things you think others may not understand. JMHO.


----------



## oyinmama

i think the MDC tribe definition is more appropriate for this discussion than the dictionary definition

Quote:

Finding your Tribe Finding Your Tribe is forum for like-minded people to come together. Originally began as a place to find the people in your geographical area, it has evolved into a place where parents who have commonalities not hosted elsewhere on the boards can come together and chat.
and i think there's a WOC tribe b/c we have found we 'have commonalities not hosted elsewhere on the boards.'

simple as that.

i don't think it means we think ourselves monolithic, or are hostile to the larger board. but i have found (i attended a women's HBCU) that it's possible to highlight and appreciate even more nuanced and subtle uniquenesses within a population when that population has a space to interact, seperate from the greater population. out in the world, we may find ourselves lumped together as 'WOC'. ironically, once we're in here, we find we are individuals with clear and obvious commonalities and just as clear and obvious differences in point of view and experience.

i don't know that a white women tribe would naturally occur b/c the population of MDC is primarily white, so that's a commonality that is hosted in plenty of places here.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Question Ladies . . .

Tribe defined.

I've been really thinking about this and I know the question has been asked by women who are not Black but . . .

In your opinion (as a woman of color), why is there a "Women of Color" tribe?

How would you feel about a "White Women" tribe?

A white woman tribe would not bother me at all, but the cynic in me thinks that the whole world IS their tribe.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Well I think that the reason for this tribe is probably due to the fact that the majority of members are white here, for me its clear that in some cases parenting and NFL are often presented through the lens of whiteness. I think having this tribe allows women of color a space to maybe discuss issues filtered through our own lens of being WOC. Does that make sense?

As for the second question a white women tribe would take on a negative tone for me, after all most of the folks here are already white. Irs sort of like why things such as Black History Month exist (simple comparison, I know but I am pressed for time) because for many of we remember growing up when the history of anyone who wasn't white was just a passing mention.

Shay

FTR, this is how I feel. I agree with you Shay.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Pretty much majority of the threads here are "white woman" threads.










if there is not a need or reason to have a WOC" tribe than there should be no reason for any of the tribes here. It's about finding your personal space where you may feel you best fit in or a more secure place for you to talk about things you think others may not understand. JMHO.

Jeca, do you mind elaborating on how they are "White Women" threads? I haven't gotten the overall sense that most threads are for and about White women. In fact, most times when I'm posting here my race is secondary to, say, my knitting.

And I'm not sure that just because a person is a WoC like me, that person would understand. I think we proved that a few pages ago in this thread (not to rehash un-pleasantries).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i think the MDC tribe definition is more appropriate for this discussion than the dictionary definition

and i think there's a WOC tribe b/c we have found we 'have commonalities not hosted elsewhere on the boards.'

simple as that.

i don't think it means we think ourselves monolithic, or are hostile to the larger board. but i have found (i attended a women's HBCU) that it's possible to highlight and appreciate even more nuanced and subtle uniquenesses within a population when that population has a space to interact, seperate from the greater population. out in the world, we may find ourselves lumped together as 'WOC'. ironically, once we're in here, we find we are individuals with clear and obvious commonalities and just as clear and obvious differences in point of view and experience.

i don't know that a white women tribe would naturally occur b/c the population of MDC is primarily white, so that's a commonality that is hosted in plenty of places here.

What are some of our commonalities aside from color?

I'm not asking to stir tension. I'm really trying to figure out if anything holds us together aside from our color. Anything real?? (I've been having these convos in real life both with folks who self-segregate and those who don't.)


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

What are some of our commonalities aside from color?

I'm not asking to stir tension. I'm really trying to figure out if anything holds us together aside from our color. Anything real?? (I've been having these convos in real life both with folks who self-segregate and those who don't.)

Well and not trying to assume too much but we strive to be or are crunchy WOC, in many segments of (another assumption but it seems most of the tribe is comprised of women from the African diaspora.. I know not everyone but most, so using that as my frame) the Black community in America crunchy and BLack don't always go together.

I know as a Black woman whose folks hailed from the south and working class, some of the ideas that I strive towards in life are looked at like what's wrong with that girl. I mean shoot, I am still nursing my dd who is 3 (granted we are trying to wean) yet the truth is I really don't feel I can share that with any Black folks in my day to day life. I am scared about when Thanksgiving comes and my Pops and brother are here and dd will be like "Mama, I need bickies". My dad is probably gonna be like are you crazy, yada yada...

Even with my RL Black girlfriends, I know they would be like "Shay, you lost your mind" yet its no biggie to my white friends because many of them have nursed longer than me. Yet a tribe like this I can drop that tidbit and feel relatively comfortable ya'll are not at the other end of the computers going that sista is crazy







.

How many of us here like eating healthy? Knitting? Behaviors that some may see as more "white"







even though we know that has nothing to do with nothing.

So I actually do see connections that are there because again a site like this promotes commonalities despite our differences.

I am PMS'ing and got fuzzy head so I really hope I am making sense.

Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

Thanks Shay.

What you're saying is _obvious_ at least when I read it.

Hmmm . . .maybe I'm over-thinking things.

Or maybe it's because we haven't had many convos about being "crunchy while Black" in a while . . .


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
FTR, this is how I feel. I agree with you Shay.

Jeca, do you mind elaborating on how they are "White Women" threads? I haven't gotten the overall sense that most threads are for and about White women. In fact, most times when I'm posting here my race is secondary to, say, my knitting.

And I'm not sure that just because a person is a WoC like me, that person would understand. I think we proved that a few pages ago in this thread (not to rehash un-pleasantries).

Maybe the threads were not designed to be for and about white women, but if mostly white women frequent the board in the minds of memebers those to who they are communicating are of the same race.
did that make sense.

A few weeks ago there were comments about WOC receiving less than cordial greetings at playdates and outings once they were discovered to be non white. This experience might not be the norm, but it does prove to a lesser degree than maybe WOC are not welcom by all non black members of MDC.

I did not come to MDC because of thw WOC tribe, but I certainly had a different perception about the forum in general after i began to post here.

What are some of our commonalities aside from color?

I'm not asking to stir tension. I'm really trying to figure out if anything holds us together aside from our color. Anything real?? (I've been having these convos in real life both with folks who self-segregate and those who don't.)


Based on that unpleasant conversation and reallife experiences I have learned that I have very little in common with the majority of black women with whom I come in contact. While I do share commalities with some white women my experiences growing up in southeast texas would never be experienced by a white woman.

Our color and how the world reacts to it is a lot of what we do share. I am sure that many of us have heard similar stories from elders about their plights growing up, we were cautioned to be the best that we could be because we were looked down on because we were black, we possibly watched our parents rise in their careers, but not as high as they could have because they were black.

Our color, while to many might appear to be such a trival issue, made us into the WOC that we are today for good and for bad.

I went to the same private schools and participated in activites with white girls, but it was I who was told no let....... or maybe next time....... or you can't use this whistle because your color might rub off.......

Times have changed, but not that much. I am able to relax just a little bit more with those that look like me.

please forgive my typos, I hate to edit if i am not receiving a grade.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Well and not trying to assume too much but we strive to be or are crunchy WOC, in many segments of (another assumption but it seems most of the tribe is comprised of women from the African diaspora.. I know not everyone but most, so using that as my frame) the Black community in America crunchy and BLack don't always go together.

I know as a Black woman whose folks hailed from the south and working class, some of the ideas that I strive towards in life are looked at like what's wrong with that girl. I mean shoot, I am still nursing my dd who is 3 (granted we are trying to wean) yet the truth is I really don't feel I can share that with any Black folks in my day to day life. I am scared about when Thanksgiving comes and my Pops and brother are here and dd will be like "Mama, I need bickies". My dad is probably gonna be like are you crazy, yada yada...

Even with my RL Black girlfriends, I know they would be like "Shay, you lost your mind" yet its no biggie to my white friends because many of them have nursed longer than me. Yet a tribe like this I can drop that tidbit and feel relatively comfortable ya'll are not at the other end of the computers going that sista is crazy







.

How many of us here like eating healthy? Knitting? Behaviors that some may see as more "white"







even though we know that has nothing to do with nothing.

So I actually do see connections that are there because again a site like this promotes commonalities despite our differences.

I am PMS'ing and got fuzzy head so I really hope I am making sense.

Shay











The Black people that I know talk about how we try to eat healthy and buy organics like it is a diease...or worse yet that we are uppity. Come on now, why would anyone condescend to a person who wants to do what is best for their family? I was looked at strangely because I would go out of my way to buy a healthy lunch instead of garbage, because I have high standards for me son.

But just as I don't share commonalities with white americans, the same can be said for many black americans


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
Hang in there, mama. The first couple weeks are INTENSE. I'm sure you are doing a great job! Keep pumping and definitely check in on the bfing forum for other supply-increase tips/ herbal supplements (fenugreek seems to be popular)-- I'm sure your doula knows all this. Also, it is considered "normal" for babies to take two weeks to get back to birth weight.






















you will make it!!










Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Arike, I definately agree with xochimama. Those first few weeks, hell, even the first year are just exactly what you described, one hell of a roller coaster ride. Those emotions you are experiencing are exactly what I went through. totally, and completely normal. I felt like a complete hormonal mess. crying one minute and euphoric the other all the while worried and stressed that I wasn't doing it right. You will find your groove. You gave birth to a wonderful baby! remember that.









and Oh, I didn't get my milk till day 5. Pumping and a great lactation consultant and La leche league helped. a great deal.

Thanks ladies! I am really trying to keep my head up. I am pretty emotional these days.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Thanks ladies! I am really trying to keep my head up. I am pretty emotional these days.









Mama







. Hang in there. I know things will get better. Do you have lots of support.

*thinking about rootzdawta's question and will be back with my response*


----------



## purplegirl

*warning--it's rambly*

I didn't come to MDC because of the WOC tribe but it is largely the reason I stick around. I have always been a natural leaning person but IRL, I didn't know many woc who were. Yes, I would run into sistas in the coop and we would exchange pleasantries but nothing beyond a hello. I had no one I could really connect with who would understand issues of natural hair, body care and holistic living. Part of the issue is where I live;however, I think that's the issue for many of us. I enjoy the camerderie that is often shared by women of color. I have also felt conflicted in groups of black women too because of stupid crap we sometimes put each other through.
I don't isolate myself to this tribe and I don't believe many of the women here do. I post all over this board. At the same time, i love vibing with my sistas who are pagan, jewish, biracial, multiracial,Latino, muslim blah,blah,blah!
I would be highly offended if there was a white women's tribe. Why is that necessary given that they live in the majority culture?
I have seen and experienced racism here. At times, it has been uncomfortable and ugly. I see this tribe as my safe haven. I have also met some wonderful women who are white and with whom I shared many commonalities. Still, I can't talk to them about not perming my hair, y/k?

I suppose this begs the question, is the NAACP still relevant? Would yall be okay with NAAWP?


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I h
I suppose this begs the question, is the NAACP still relevant? Would yall be okay with NAAWP?

They got that it's called the KKK.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
They got that it's called the KKK.







:

Yep. That's kinda my point.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
F
Jeca, do you mind elaborating on how they are "White Women" threads? I haven't gotten the overall sense that most threads are for and about White women. In fact, most times when I'm posting here my race is secondary to, say, my knitting.
.)

Most of the community here is white so most of the threads are written by white women. I'm not saying that they are written for specifically for white women but that's what this community is made mostly of. There have definitely been "undertones" here.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
They got that it's called the KKK.







:

Well, actually.

When I started in college, I was in a combined B.A./M.D. program that was supposed to be specifically for "underprivileged, lower income" folks and since it was funded by a BW initially, it was initially understood that there should be a focus on recruiting students of color. What started to happen was that the program became mainly the children of Eastern European immigrants who to me were White but were considered minorities. You better believe they had a group/club. It annoyed me while I was there but then I realized that they were entitled to have their group based on their similar cultures.

I don't assume that all White folks have things in common. Why have I been assuming that all Black people _have_ to have at _least_ one thing in common that we _all_ can connect on beside our color? Shay pointed out (reminded me) what it is that the WoC in this tribe have in common, but do commonalities extend further than that? I joined one group for WoC who SAH and I was just struck by how little I shared in common with these women. I wondered why I'm always trying to connect with WoC if really, there's no connection except that we happen to share the same color.

There are sometimes undertones of racism at MDC . . . a reflection of real life. But even if MDC were all Black it wouldn't be like there would always be peace and harmony and no prejudice.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

I don't assume that all White folks have things in common. Why have I been assuming that all Black people _have_ to have at _least_ one thing in common that we _all_ can connect on beside our color? .

Well actually all people have things in common no matter the color it's an innate part of being human. So chances are we do have one or more things in common. Not to mention most of us are already considered different to our AA families or friends(or maybe that's just me) because of the AP path we have chosen or various other reasons. So I guess I don't see the big deal.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Well actually all people have things in common no matter the color it's an innate part of being human. So chances are we do have one or more things in common. Not to mention most of us are already considered different to our AA families or friends(or maybe that's just me) because of the AP path we have chosen or various other reasons. So I guess I don't see the big deal.

I guess it's not a big deal.

I'm not AA, btw.

Not being AA but living in America, I've always really tried to find ways to connect to AAs though. Sometimes, I don't think I'm very successful.

This is more of a self realization for me than anything else, i.e. not to _expect_ that just because someone is a PoC that there will actually be substantive things that connect us/similarities. I actually think I agree with folks who were taking offense when the topic was about something that "Black folks do" or something I assumed "Black folks do". My real life experiences and my online experiences (here on MDC and on blogs etc) are showing me that.

And while I like to talk about lots of things, I guess within the WoC Tribe I'd like to see us more focused on NFL/AP within the context of being a WoC (or issues relevant to being a WoC on MDC).


----------



## eilonwy

It's not that WoC necessarily have a great many things in common, but that as minorities we have something in common-- that minority status. I'm not AA any more than I am NA or white, but I am quantitatively different from the majority. It's not just about hair or bootyliciousness. I mean, wearing my hair natural isn't a huge issue. I can find natural haircare products which are perfectly suitable for my hair type in a grocery store or even WalMart. Still, I understand why and how natural hair care can be a huge issue for WoC. It's familiar to me, even if it's not my own issue.

I think what brings us together here is that we're all outsiders at least twice-- outside of majority (white) American culture, and outside of mainstream parenting/living culture.

Do we have anything else in common?







We're women, we're outsiders, we're not white... for several years and twelve threads, it's been the basis of conversation for us. I don't see a lot of WoC at LLL meetings (haven't been to one in a while.... not since Bear was born :cry), and very few at cyberschool events (like, I can count on one hand the number of *kids*), but I know that I can mention both nursing a toddler/preschooler and homeschooling/cyberschooling here without getting funny looks.

If I want to chat about kashering my kitchen, I'm going to post to the Yiddishe Mammas tribe. If I want to chat about homeschooling, I'll post in Learning at Home and Beyond. If I want to discuss getting my kids "out there" more and exposing them to more diverse populations, I'll ltry the Multicultural Families forum. Where else, though, can I think about ways to support my niece as a black child who's looking to save the environment, starting with her own hair? Where else can I say the words "ghetto booty" without someone asking what I mean?


----------



## rootzdawta

LoL, Rhynna, I know what a "ghetto booty" is but honestly, I can't stand the term and wish you'd stop using it. That whole booty conversation we had was cool but I won't say I didn't feel a bit awkward because I really was expecting someone to jump in and say, "Oh, wait now, not _all_ Black women have big ole' booties" and get annoyed at the suggestion.

But I get what you're saying about your niece and how this tribe would help with that situation.

A few pages ago in this long long thread, there was a discussion about spanking and how as a Black attached parent, you run into conflict with other Black folks who believe in spanking, particularly family.

Certainly this is the case for me. I struggle with my own DH about this topic.

So has anyone found ways to properly handle it when people say, "Oh, that boy needs a beating" or insinuate that your kids are out of control and spoiled because you don't hit?

Anyway, a while back I posted this in the GD forum when it probably would have been more fruitful here.

I didn't mean to rock the boat too much ya'll. Just really trying to sort out what the point and purpose of our tribe is.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
LoL, Rhynna, I know what a "ghetto booty" is but honestly, I can't stand the term and wish you'd stop using it. That whole booty conversation we had was cool but I won't say I didn't feel a bit awkward because I really was expecting someone to jump in and say, "Oh, wait now, not _all_ Black women have big ole' booties" and get annoyed at the suggestion.

But I get what you're saying about your niece and how this tribe would help with that situation.

A few pages ago in this long long thread, there was a discussion about spanking and how as a Black attached parent, you run into conflict with other Black folks who believe in spanking, particularly family.

Certainly this is the case for me. I struggle with my own DH about this topic.

So has anyone found ways to properly handle it when people say, "Oh, that boy needs a beating" or insinuate that your kids are out of control and spoiled because you don't hit?

Anyway, a while back I posted this in the GD forum when it probably would have been more fruitful here.

*I didn't mean to rock the boat too much ya'll. Just really trying to sort out what the point and purpose of our tribe is*.

It's perfectly okay to rock the boat. What I find ironic is I don't hear the Jewish mamas, for example, questioning their existence. Nor have I ever seen anyone question the relevancy of their existence, like we did a few pages ago. Using the Jewish mamas again as an example, they are as diverse a group as any. Yet, they relish the commonalities and appreciate the differences. I lurk on that thread a lot because I am fascinated by the religion/culture. The same is true for the pagan mamas.
I am , in part, thinking out loud and examining my beliefs.

And I don't want to just focus on NFL and AP issues. There are things that happen IRL for me that I need to process with others who might be able to help me with a different perspective or validate what I am experiencing.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.

Congrats on your new arrival. I loved the birth story and she is scrumptious. I love her cherry red lips


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Congrats on your new arrival. I loved the birth story and she is scrumptious. I love her cherry red lips

















thank you


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.

Congratulations on the new arrival! All of your children are beautiful.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
LoL, Rhynna, I know what a "ghetto booty" is but honestly, I can't stand the term and wish you'd stop using it. That whole booty conversation we had was cool but I won't say I didn't feel a bit awkward because I really was expecting someone to jump in and say, "Oh, wait now, not _all_ Black women have big ole' booties" and get annoyed at the suggestion.


I would have never thought to say that not all women have big ole booties, because I assume that as WOC we already know that. Maybe in this thread the obvious is not stated because there aren't any outsiders who might sterotype black women and their backsides.

I am the exception in a family of ironing board flat WOC, but I would not interject with that fact when the discussion is round brown behinds.

I don't like the word Ghetto Booty either, mainly because I don't want the word attached to me in anyway. Yes, it is a stereotype, but sterotypes come from somewhere. Why can't anyone here praise or lament about their bodies as they wish? Perhaps Rhynna does in fact have a ghetto booty?


----------



## rootzdawta

Well, then the convo goes to other words that we can use on ourselves, to describe ourselves, but that others can't and that convo has been beaten to death. I'm not the language police. Just expressing how I felt about the phrase. Feel free to use it at will.

I have lived all of my life amongst Black people (Latino, AA, Caribbean and African), going to school with them, working with them, doing business in exclusively Black environments. At this stage in the game, and again, maybe it is a class issue, I'm just seeing clearly that just because someone is a PoC, don't expect there to be some automatic, magical connection and realizing how inane it is to continue to try to connect automatically. Our histories, our experiences, our understandings, our perspectives are often different and sometimes polar opposites. So while I like the idea of joining groups specifically for WoC and always have, for me, it's just been a realization that I have to actively work to find things to connect on and not rely on color alone.

Somehow I see being of a certain faith (like being Christian) or culture (Jewish) as different from being Black. You choose faith. Culture is specific and can be pinpointed (i.e. I can clearly point out things that are inherent to Igbo culture). Being Black is neither or those. So while I feel this group is relevant and necessary, I'm making sure I know why. Because all of us being Black, to me, is just not enough. But as I've been reminded, the connection in this tribe is really being a minority amongst Black people in general by practicing NFL/AP (and maybe that's not true for me because I do have a few friends, people of color, who are indeed homebirthers, extended breastfeeders, cloth diaperers, non-vaxers, non-circers, homeschoolers, etc. so I don't necessarily feel isolated) and being a minority population on MDC.

Anyway, back to your regularly scheduled programming. Sorry to derail.

JeDeeLenae, congrats!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Well, then the convo goes to other words that we can use on ourselves, to describe ourselves, but that others can't and that convo has been beaten to death. I'm not the language police. Just expressing how I felt about the phrase. Feel free to use it at will.

I have lived all of my life amongst Black people (Latino, AA, Caribbean and African), going to school with them, working with them, doing business in exclusively Black environments. At this stage in the game, and again, maybe it is a class issue, I'm just seeing clearly that just because someone is a PoC, don't expect there to be some automatic, magical connection and realizing how inane it is to continue to try to connect automatically. Our histories, our experiences, our understandings, our perspectives are often different and sometimes polar opposites. So while I like the idea of joining groups specifically for WoC and always have, for me, it's just been a realization that I have to actively work to find things to connect on and not rely on color alone.

*Somehow I see being of a certain faith (like being Christian) or culture (Jewish) as different from being Black.* You choose faith. Culture is specific and can be pinpointed (i.e. I can clearly point out things that are inherent to Igbo culture). Being Black is neither or those. So while I feel this group is relevant and necessary, I'm making sure I know why. Because all of us being Black, to me, is just not enough. But as I've been reminded, the connection in this tribe is really being a minority amongst Black people in general by practicing NFL/AP (and maybe that's not true for me because I do have a few friends, people of color, who are indeed homebirthers, extended breastfeeders, cloth diaperers, non-vaxers, non-circers, homeschoolers, etc. so I don't necessarily feel isolated) and being a minority population on MDC.

Anyway, back to your regularly scheduled programming. Sorry to derail.

JeDeeLenae, congrats!


Not to go o/t but I know a lot of Jews who would strongly argue against this assertion.


----------



## eilonwy

Heh, Lisa, I was just about to go there. Judaism is a faith, yes, but it's a faith into which you can most assuredly be born. I practice Chaos Magick; I'm still most assuredly a Jew. It doesn't go away. There are, in fact, black Jews (and I don't just mean my nieces!







).

What I meant about the bootyliciousness is that there were bound to be people on this thread who knew what I was talking about. I don't have 4A/4B hair, but I grok those issues and I don't see that coming up on other threads. In a discussion about haircare here I can understand, even if I can't exactly relate.

Hm. Kids are in the candy. Gtg.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Survey Results

The data below is rough data. Over the next few weeks I will have detailed statistics from this survey and others.








:Thank you for your help!







:

1. What is your yearly household income?

under $20,000
12 11%
$20,001 - $40,000
27 25%
$40,001 - $60,000
24 22%
$60,001 - $80,000
20 19%
$80,001 - $100,000
14 13%
$100,001 - $150,000
7 7%
$150,001 - $200,000
3 3%
over $200,000
0 0%
Total 107 100%

2. Are you a parent or a guardian?

parent
107 100%
guardian
0 0%
Total 107 100%

3. What brand of child safety restraint(s) do you own?

Britax
44 41%
Chicco
3 3%
Combi
1 1%
Compass
0 0%
Cosco
19 18%
Evenflo
25 23%
Graco
44 41%
Mia Moda
0 0%
Peg Perego
2 2%
Recaro
0 0%
Safe Guard
0 0%
Safety First
10 9%
The First Years
2 2%
Other, please specify.
View Responses
18 17%

4. How many people reside in your household.

2
0 0%
3
39 37%
4
42 40%
5
17 16%
Other, please specify
View Responses
8 8%
Total 106 100%

5. Do you have a car seat for every child in your household as required by local regulations?

yes
106 100%
no
0 0%
Total 106 100%

6. Are your child safety restraints current? Meaning are they within the expiration date stamped on the side of the seat?

yes
104 99%
no
1 1%
Total 105 100%

7. Were your child safety restraints professionally installed?

yes
24 22%
no
79 74%
wow, that service is available?
4 4%
Total 107 100%

8. What influenced or will influence your car seat purchases?

Price
47 44%
Safety
86 80%
Design
29 27%
Size
31 29%
Ease of Installation
32 30%
A friend
7 7%

9. Would you purchase a used child safety restraint from a friend?

yes
36 34%
no
71 66%
Total 107 100%

10. Would you purchse a used childe safety restraint from a stranger?

yes
5 5%
no
102 95%
Total 107 100%

11. How much do you spend on average per child safety restraint?

under $40
3 3%
$40 - $60
13 12%
$61 - $100
14 13%
$101 - $200
40 37%
$201 - $300
36 34%
$300 or more
1 1%
Total 107 100%

12. What type of automobile do you drive as your primary vehicle?

Ford-Chrysler-GMC- Chevrolet- Jeep- Pontiac
57 53%
Honda-Toyota-Nissan-Mazda
43 40%
Acura-Lexus-Infiniti-Volvo-Volkswagon
5 5%
Porsche-Mercedes Benz-BMW
2 2%
Total 107 100%

13. What type of car is your primary vehicle?

Car
40 37%
Van
28 26%
SUV
34 32%
Truck
5 5%
Total 107 100%

14. How much did you pay for your primary vehicle?

Under $5,000
19 18%
$5,000 - $10,000
11 10%
$10,000 - $15,000
15 14%
$15,000 - $20,000
23 21%
$20,000 - $30,000
22 21%
$30,000 - $40,000
10 9%
$40,000 - $50,000
5 5%
$50,000 - $70.000
0 0%
$70,000 or more
2 2%
Total 107 100%

15. Which answer best describes the age of your primary vehicle.

0 to 2 years of age
25 23%
2 to 4 years of age
26 24%
4 to 6 years of age
23 21%
6 to 10 years of age
18 17%
10 years of age or older
15 14%
Total 107 100%

16. Does your vehicle have LATCh?

Yes
68 64%
no
31 29%
I don't know
7 7%
Total 106 100%

17. Did you purchase your primary vehicle new?

yes
40 38%
no
66 62%
Total 106 100%

18. Have you ever installed a rear facing infant seat/bucket seat/ baby seat/ in a facing forward so that you could see or reach the baby?

yes
3 3%
no
104 97%
Total 107 100%

19. Have you ever placed a rear facing car seat in the front seat while the vehicle is in motion?

yes
4 4%
no
102 96%
Total 106 100%

20. Have you ever driven a child under the age of 4 in your primary vehicle that was not restrained in a car seat or booster seat?

Yes
13 12%
no
94 88%
Total 107 100%

21. When should you place a baby in a forward facing car seat?

On the child's first birthday
2 2%
When the child weighs 20lbs
2 2%
Once the child is over the age of 1 and 20lbs
46 43%
Once the child is over the age of 1 and/or 20lbs
9 8%
When the parent thinks that the child is ready to face forward?
0 0%
When the child has exceeded the weight of their rear facing seat?
47 44%
Total 106 100%

22. When should you move your child to a booster seat?

after their first birthday
0 0%
once they reach 40lbs
95 90%
I would never use a booster seat, my child will use the regular seat belt once he/she outgrows their forward facing car seat.
10 10%
Total 105 100%


----------



## JustKiya

Interesting. Are those stats primarily from MDC?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Interesting. Are those stats primarily from MDC?

I'm interested to know this too.

I agree that folks at MDC are way more concerned about car seats and their proper usage than the people I know IRL.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.









:

Congrats on your little one.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

I have lived all of my life amongst Black people (Latino, AA, Caribbean and African), going to school with them, working with them, doing business in exclusively Black environments. At this stage in the game, and again, maybe it is a class issue, I'm just seeing clearly that just because someone is a PoC, don't expect there to be some automatic, magical connection and realizing how inane it is to continue to try to connect automatically. Our histories, our experiences, our understandings, our perspectives are often different and sometimes polar opposites. So while I like the idea of joining groups specifically for WoC and always have, for me, it's just been a realization that I have to actively work to find things to connect on and not rely on color alone.

Somehow I see being of a certain faith (like being Christian) or culture (Jewish) as different from being Black. You choose faith. Culture is specific and can be pinpointed (i.e. I can clearly point out things that are inherent to Igbo culture). Being Black is neither or those. So while I feel this group is relevant and necessary, I'm making sure I know why. Because all of us being Black, to me, is just not enough. But as I've been reminded, the connection in this tribe is really being a minority amongst Black people in general by practicing NFL/AP (and maybe that's not true for me because I do have a few friends, people of color, who are indeed homebirthers, extended breastfeeders, cloth diaperers, non-vaxers, non-circers, homeschoolers, etc. so I don't necessarily feel isolated) and being a minority population on MDC.

Anyway, back to your regularly scheduled programming. Sorry to derail.

JeDeeLenae, congrats!

gosh. i feel like i missed an important conversation.
oh well. i'd just like to add that _"feeling"_ connected might be all we've got. with whatever group we choose to identify with---the faith and feeling of connection might all we can humanly have.

i often think how grateful i am for this thread and i wish you all lived around the corner or a couple blocks away. and i don't feel that way about phd mamas thread folks, yk? and i _am_ blessed with Black woman friends who are like-minded==and general black population that feel i fit in with to some degree==i call us the black bohemian crowd...brooklyn, bay area, atlanta etc.

anyway, rootsdawta i read your blog today and i feel like one major reason why i visit it and appreciate it is because you are a Black woman/mama/wife going thru life changes of a sort that i can overstand as Black woman/mama/wife.

i think there _are_ shared histories, stories, longings, hurts, dreams amongst Black people but we don't respond to them and/or articulate them or live them out in identical ways. and that's okay. but when older Black ladies smile at me as i breastfeed my daughter i feel something lovely and proud that is tied to all those stories.

more particularly, this tribe is important to me b/c also as you mentioned with disciplining issue there are issues amongst the AP general population that have diff't nuances and resonances for PoC and black folks more specifically. if i homeschool my babes, racial politics def has something to do with it for example. or i'm anti-mainstream medicine in large part b/c of the reality of medical apartheid in this country and b/c i know my Haitian grandmamas were(are, sak pase 93 yr old grandmere!) healing themselves with some roots and teas and wasn't about shiny things at wholefoods but just the way we did/do things. i also dig that we can talk about everything from loving Michelle Obama to staying away from the "creamy crack." lol.

anyway, i felt compelled to share.

congrads to the new mamas! (JadeeLenae the pics of you laboring with the pillow on yr head and then in the pool all set and ready for a water birth---priceless!)


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I
Not being AA but living in America, I've always really tried to find ways to connect to AAs though. Sometimes, I don't think I'm very successful.
.

I'm black and most of the time I'm not successful.







we have talked about many AP practices or NFL here from time to time. If you want to start a discussion feel free. We have no problems jumping into a conversation.

For example carseats/boosters. Okay I get that MDC is more conscious of carseats than most people I know IRL but is it really that strange of a concept to keep your kid in a carseat or booster until no longer needed? Do you mamas here have kids still in carseats? My mom feels that any kid over three is "old" enough" for a seat belt no matter what their size is, it drives me nuts.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
gosh. i feel like i missed an important conversation.
oh well. i'd just like to add that _"feeling"_ connected might be all we've got. with whatever group we choose to identify with---the faith and feeling of connection might all we can humanly have.

i often think how grateful i am for this thread and *i wish you all lived around the corner or a couple blocks away*. and i don't feel that way about phd mamas thread folks, yk? and i _am_ blessed with Black woman friends who are like-minded==and general black population that feel i fit in with to some degree==i call us the black bohemian crowd...brooklyn, bay area, atlanta etc.

anyway, rootsdawta i read your blog today and i feel like one major reason why i visit it and appreciate it is because you are a Black woman/mama/wife going thru life changes of a sort that i can overstand as Black woman/mama/wife.

i think there _are_ shared histories, stories, longings, hurts, dreams amongst Black people but we don't respond to them and/or articulate them or live them out in identical ways. and that's okay. but when older Black ladies smile at me as i breastfeed my daughter i feel something lovely and proud that is tied to all those stories.

more particularly, this tribe is important to me b/c also as you mentioned with disciplining issue there are issues amongst the AP general population that have diff't nuances and resonances for PoC and black folks more specifically. if i homeschool my babes, racial politics def has something to do with it for example. or i'm anti-mainstream medicine in large part b/c of the reality of medical apartheid in this country and b/c i know my Haitian grandmamas were(are, sak pase 93 yr old grandmere!) healing themselves with some roots and teas and wasn't about shiny things at wholefoods but just the way we did/do things. i also dig that we can talk about everything from loving Michelle Obama to staying away from the "creamy crack." lol.

anyway, i felt compelled to share.

congrads to the new mamas! (JadeeLenae the pics of you laboring with the pillow on yr head and then in the pool all set and ready for a water birth---priceless!)

Absolutely mama









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'm black and most of the time I'm not successful.







we have talked about many AP practices or NFL here from time to time. If you want to start a discussion feel free. We have no problems jumping into a conversation.

For example carseats/boosters. Okay I get that MDC is more conscious of carseats than most people I know IRL but is it really that strange of a concept to keep your kid in a carseat or booster until no longer needed? Do you mamas here have kids still in carseats? My mom feels that any kid over three is "old" enough" for a seat belt no matter what their size is, it drives me nuts.

Here's another







cause I often feel the same way.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 







:

Congrats on your little one.


Hey mama. Don't try to sneak in with out getting a hug







and warm welcome







: I hope you'll stick around!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'm black and most of the time I'm not successful.







we have talked about many AP practices or NFL here from time to time. If you want to start a discussion feel free. We have no problems jumping into a conversation.

For example carseats/boosters. Okay I get that MDC is more conscious of carseats than most people I know IRL but is it really that strange of a concept to keep your kid in a carseat or booster until no longer needed? Do you mamas here have kids still in carseats? My mom feels that any kid over three is "old" enough" for a seat belt no matter what their size is, it drives me nuts.

Yep, dd is **** in a 5 point car seat at 3, she is on the small side so she will be in it for a while. Yeah, I do think MDC folks are more concious about car seats, my girlfriend was over the night with her 2 boys (she's Black) and her boys are 6 and 8. So I asked if the boys were still in carseats, she looked at me a tad crazy. Now her 6 yo is huge but I thought he still needed to be restrained and oh by girl is a cop so she knows the laws.

Congrats Autumn C







, come back and hang with us... we don't bite.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Interesting. Are those stats primarily from MDC?


Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm interested to know this too.

I agree that folks at MDC are way more concerned about car seats and their proper usage than the people I know IRL.

Yes, my first survey was conducted on MDC &via my personal email list, but most of the participants hailed from MDC. My personal email list is not vast by any means. My next few surveys will take place amonsgt a wider population, I want different perspectives from different groups of people.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I'm black and most of the time I'm not successful.







we have talked about many AP practices or NFL here from time to time. If you want to start a discussion feel free. We have no problems jumping into a c my onversation.

For example carseats/boosters. Okay I get that MDC is more conscious of carseats than most people I know IRL but is it really that strange of a concept to keep your kid in a carseat or booster until no longer needed? Do you mamas here have kids still in carseats? My mom feels that any kid over three is "old" enough" for a seat belt no matter what their size is, it drives me nuts.

My son rearfaced until he was 30 or 31 pounds. I would have kept him rearfacing until he was 33lbs, but I needed his boulevard to use in a car that would not accomodate the Regent that I purchased for my Aunt's car. He was barely large enough for the Regent, but he was only to use it 1 days a week when my Aunt picked him up from school and for emergencies. We ended up using the Regent for everyday. I would rather that he still rearface, but oh well.

I guess to answer your question, plenty of people told me that he needed to forward face for a plethora of ridiculous reasons: he can't see, he is too large, forward facing is safer. I never really argued the point with them. I would generally reply that I have done my research and I know what is best for my child. In my mind I was thinking that I know what is best for your child too, but I kept my mouth shut.

I have a link in my email about rearfacing, well I did until I replaced with this link Why car seats are Important
http://www.kvue.com/news/local/stori...2f5a9221.html#

so people left me alone when they realized that I could care less about their opinions with regard to car seats. In general, people who know me don't question what I do. I have a reputation for not really caring about what others think is best for me once I have made up my mind. The assumption is false, but I don't care to challange it.

So yes, people think that I am loopy because I am a loyal Britax customer who will keep her child restrained until he outgrows the Frontier at 100 pounds. My job is to feed, love, clothe, educate my son and to keep him safe. We might not ever experience a vehicle collision, but I refuse to take the chance.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Hi JeDeeLenae and congrats on your little one!! Your pics are lovely! That is another reason why I like this tribe so much is because pretty much ALL the other women of color I know IRL and on my other online haunts are nowhere near as...hmm...well-read on natural issues in pregnancy, birth and parenting as the mothers in this tribe. Its quite isolating, really. Especially since I dont have any watoto to compare with, lol.

Anywho, ive missed another good convo, blah, lol. Also, Hey there Autumn C!!! You are most welcome here!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Even though I don't post here much, I read a lot of this thread and it's sooo nice to her of other people with simiar issues in day to day life. I'm the only one in my family that breastfeeds, uses cloth diapers, WISHES she could buy organic food, limits TV time, plans to homeschool, babywears, etc. I won't even think of telling my family about family cloth, nursing past 2, not vaxing, co-sleeping, etc.

When visiting friends or family, I'm such an outast. People in my parents neighborhood say I'm "acting white" or "trying to be white" because I knit, crochet, use cloth, etc.

This tribe, usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.

Congratulations, JeDeeLanae! Gorgeous pictures!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Congratulations, JeDeeLanae! Gorgeous pictures!









:







:

Hey have any of you all spent an extended amount of time in your adult lives living outside the U.S., in the Caribbean specifically? If so, and even if it was somewhere else outside the U.S. but not the Caribbean, what was it like for you, particularly as a mom? Why were you there? What did you do? We're thinking (again) about packing it up and moving out sometime in the next year or two.


----------



## jeca

I spent most of my childhood living outside the U.S and it was a BIG culture shock when we moved back to the states as a teen. I haven't lived any adult years out of the U.S though.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I guess to answer your question, plenty of people told me that he needed to forward face for a plethora of ridiculous reasons: he can't see, he is too large, forward facing is safer. I never really argued the point with them. I would generally reply that I have done my research and I know what is best for my child. In my mind I was thinking that I know what is best for your child too, but I kept my mouth shut.

Yup, this is my story as well. Everyone who knows me knows that I read incessantly so if I say my decision is well-researched, they stop with all their "reasons". But still, I would get these looks like I was torturing my son because his legs were folded while sitting rear facing.









I don't know what it is about carseats that people IRL don't get. I mean, I spent countless hours researching the last carseat I bought. Some of my friends just went by which one was cutest or had the nicest pattern or was free from someone else. Others would use bundle-me's and other after-market products *even* though the manual clearly said not to. I used to think the carseat issue had something to do with education but even some of my better educated friends still misuse them. I feel like there needs to be more aggressive dissemination of information, maybe accompanied by visual aids because I don't know that pamphlets and stuff really make an impact. I had to *hunt* for the one person at the police station who could inspect my car seat and I was totally unable to get to him. He was always at lunch or off. I doubt anyone who isn't looking would even know this dude exists.

Anyway, I'm seen as the ever-obsessive, worry wart all the time so I even feel a little hesitant to bring up obvious problems with car seats (although I often still do).


----------



## Autumn C.

Thanks for the warm welcome.

I spend a lot of time lurking in here. Seriously, this thread moves sooo fast I can't keep up.

But I'll chime in my 2 cents more.

I promise.









BTW, I met IRL another WOC who crochets and has _some_ natural living leanings. I was so excited I literally came home and did a little happy dance.







:


----------



## Autumn C.

Oh, and about the carseat...

My 9 year _just_ came out of it. He's a slim little man and reaching 60 pounds was verrry slow going. Boy, did I catch it for that. But I think mostly people just roll their eyes and shake their head at me they know I "lost my damn mind" a long time ago.

Can I say that? Will I get in trouble? Is there some acronym I should use so the MDC police don't come after me?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:







:

Hey have any of you all spent an extended amount of time in your adult lives living outside the U.S., in the Caribbean specifically? If so, and even if it was somewhere else outside the U.S. but not the Caribbean, what was it like for you, particularly as a mom? Why were you there? What did you do? We're thinking (again) about packing it up and moving out sometime in the next year or two.

I found this and thought it might be helpful
http://www.blogher.com/expat-moms-ch...oreign-country


----------



## Heathen Mama

Hey sistas.

I'm loving the intelligent discussion here... so much so much to learn though.

I'll weigh in when I can add something. Except- this tribe is sorely needed. I am hoping to someday write a book on the topic about the fact that little brown babies in this country need gentler parenting.

I preach to the choir here because the mamas reading and posting here tend to be more interested in learning and considering ways of mothering other than "My mama did it and I'm a do it too." The mothers of color here are interested in being part of a community of women who support parenting tactics that unfortunately are foreign to most of our ppl, and I love being able to talk or read about a RANGE of things from a non-white perspective.

o/t Here's a shout out to JDLenae (I'm on DiaperSwappers too with the George Carlin avatar)


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Oh, and about the carseat...

My 9 year _just_ came out of it. He's a slim little man and reaching 60 pounds was verrry slow going. Boy, did I catch it for that. But I think mostly people just roll their eyes and shake their head at me they know I "lost my damn mind" a long time ago.
?

Sounds like my mom, does she know you? I bought my girls each a Graco Nautilus because it went to 65 pounds in a five point harness. They are tiny and I plan to keep them in a harness or booster as long as they are so tiny.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Yup, this is my story as well. Everyone who knows me knows that I read incessantly so if I say my decision is well-researched, they stop with all their "reasons". But still, I would get these looks like I was torturing my son because his legs were folded while sitting rear facing.









I don't know what it is about carseats that people IRL don't get. I mean, I spent countless hours researching the last carseat I bought. Some of my friends just went by which one was cutest or had the nicest pattern or was free from someone else. Others would use bundle-me's and other after-market products *even* though the manual clearly said not to. I used to think the carseat issue had something to do with education but even some of my better educated friends still misuse them. I feel like there needs to be more aggressive dissemination of information, maybe accompanied by visual aids because I don't know that pamphlets and stuff really make an impact. I had to *hunt* for the one person at the police station who could inspect my car seat and I was totally unable to get to him. He was always at lunch or off. I doubt anyone who isn't looking would even know this dude exists.

Anyway, I'm seen as the ever-obsessive, worry wart all the time so I even feel a little hesitant to bring up obvious problems with car seats (although I often still do).

Before i began my project I would look at children who were not properly restrained and simply shake my head. Now, I am compelled to say something.

Based on my experiences, away from MDC, atleast 80 to 85 percent of the women with whom I come in constant contact posess at the minimum a bs/ba degree. Many times they know the facts, but chose to ignore them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Oh, and about the carseat...

But I think mostly people just roll their eyes and shake their head at me they know I "lost my damn mind" a long time ago.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
Hey sistas.

I'm loving the intelligent discussion here... so much so much to learn though.

I'll weigh in when I can add something. Except- this tribe is sorely needed. I am hoping to someday write a book on the topic about the fact that little brown babies in this country need gentler parenting.

I preach to the choir here because the mamas reading and posting here tend to be more interested in learning and considering ways of mothering other than "My mama did it and I'm a do it too." The mothers of color here are interested in being part of a community of women who support parenting tactics that unfortunately are foreign to most of our ppl, and I love being able to talk or read about a RANGE of things from a non-white perspective.

o/t Here's a shout out to JDLenae (I'm on DiaperSwappers too with the George Carlin avatar)
















elcome







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
Hey sistas.

I'm loving the intelligent discussion here... so much so much to learn though.

I'll weigh in when I can add something. Except- this tribe is sorely needed. I am hoping to someday write a book on the topic about the fact that little brown babies in this country need gentler parenting.

I preach to the choir here because the mamas reading and posting here tend to be more interested in learning and considering ways of mothering other than "My mama did it and I'm a do it too." The mothers of color here are interested in being part of a community of women who support parenting tactics that unfortunately are foreign to most of our ppl, and I love being able to talk or read about a RANGE of things from a non-white perspective.

o/t Here's a shout out to JDLenae (I'm on DiaperSwappers too with the George Carlin avatar)


Welcome mama. Welcome







. I hope you'll stick around and join our discussions.


----------



## splendid

Here the car seat law is 8 yrs old, the only people that think we are crazy are our in-laws and my mom. My oldest is 7 and turning 8 in January, and I don't think we are going to pull the seat out. He is really light and I'm not comfortable with the though.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
Hey sistas.

I'm loving the intelligent discussion here... so much so much to learn though.

I'll weigh in when I can add something. Except- this tribe is sorely needed. I am hoping to someday write a book on the topic about the fact that little brown babies in this country need gentler parenting.

I preach to the choir here because the mamas reading and posting here tend to be more interested in learning and considering ways of mothering other than "My mama did it and I'm a do it too." The mothers of color here are interested in being part of a community of women who support parenting tactics that unfortunately are foreign to most of our ppl, and I love being able to talk or read about a RANGE of things from a non-white perspective.

o/t Here's a shout out to JDLenae (I'm on DiaperSwappers too with the George Carlin avatar)

Hey there!! Welcome!!









And thank you for all the congrats!


----------



## JeDeeLenae

OK, so I was watching CNN and David Alan Grier was on there. He was promoting his new show on Comedy Central called "Chocolate News." So, I like DAG, figured I'd watch it. And I was literally disgusted by the show. There were some parts that made me laugh, but overall, it was a host of stereotypes and exactly what I wish wasn't being portrayed to America.

http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/c...ws/index.jhtml

There's the link to the show and I'm sure you can see more on YouTube. What do you ladies feel about this show?


----------



## rootzdawta

Cassie, I watched and was not surprised at all. I find DAG to be hilarious, though, and the clips I saw were funny, I won't front. It's true, it is shucking and jiving to an extent but it seems that for Black comedians either that is all they are willing or able to do or that is all that will actually land them a show. I tend to think it's the latter more often than the former. DAG's way funnier thanso totally not funny D.L. Hughley who's getting to be so obnoxious that even seeing his face offends me. At least DAG is intelligent with his comedy.

I cringe though, because the audience is not exclusively Black so I just don't think I'll ever be completely comfortable with this type of comedy.

That Be Cool, Black People . . . okay, there were some stereotypes but, I had to agree. Be cool.

Fat black Mama Syndrome . . . wack.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
OK, so I was watching CNN and David Alan Grier was on there. He was promoting his new show on Comedy Central called "Chocolate News." So, I like DAG, figured I'd watch it. And I was literally disgusted by the show. *There were some parts that made me laugh, but overall, it was a host of stereotypes and exactly what I wish wasn't being portrayed to America.*

http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/c...ws/index.jhtml

There's the link to the show and I'm sure you can see more on YouTube. What do you ladies feel about this show?

Yeah that. And like Rootz, I am a bit sick of D.L. too.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Cassie, I watched and was not surprised at all. I find DAG to be hilarious, though, and the clips I saw were funny, I won't front. It's true, it is shucking and jiving to an extent but it seems that for Black comedians either that is all they are willing or able to do or that is all that will actually land them a show. I tend to think it's the latter more often than the former. DAG's way funnier thanso totally not funny D.L. Hughley who's getting to be so obnoxious that even seeing his face offends me. At least DAG is intelligent with his comedy.

I cringe though, because the audience is not exclusively Black so I just don't think I'll ever be completely comfortable with this type of comedy.

That Be Cool, Black People . . . okay, there were some stereotypes but, I had to agree. Be cool.

*Fat black Mama Syndrome . . . wack*.

And so not cool


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Cassie, I watched and was not surprised at all. I find DAG to be hilarious, though, and the clips I saw were funny, I won't front. *It's true, it is shucking and jiving to an extent but it seems that for Black comedians either that is all they are willing or able to do or that is all that will actually land them a show*. I tend to think it's the latter more often than the former. DAG's way funnier thanso totally not funny D.L. Hughley who's getting to be so obnoxious that even seeing his face offends me. At least DAG is intelligent with his comedy.

I cringe though, because the audience is not exclusively Black so I just don't think I'll ever be completely comfortable with this type of comedy.

That Be Cool, Black People . . . okay, there were some stereotypes but, I had to agree. Be cool.

Fat black Mama Syndrome . . . wack.

I admit I am not bothered by shows that play into stereotypes because in many cases stereotypes are based in some truth. However we can go overboard. That said, I think you only have to look to a filmmaker like Spike Lee to see that Hollywood and the media in general is quite happy to have us in roles that do not show our full potential. How many films has Spike had to jump through hoops to get made because the studios don't want to finance more thoughtful projects.

However taking it back to comedians, Chapelle was an intelligent comedian who did not rely on tried and true formulas, look where he is now? He had to walk away because the push was to turn him into a traditional minstrel performer. I think about Paul Mooney, that brotha is amazing, yet most younger folks didn't know who he was until Chapelle brought him back into the game. Mooney should be further ahead yet he is the kinda performer who again is not into the minstrel show so guess what, no show for him.







:









Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I admit I am not bothered by shows that play into stereotypes because in many cases stereotypes are based in some truth. However we can go overboard. That said, I think you only have to look to a filmmaker like Spike Lee to see that Hollywood and the media in general is quite happy to have us in roles that do not show our full potential. How many films has Spike had to jump through hoops to get made because the studios don't want to finance more thoughtful projects.

However taking it back to comedians, Chapelle was an intelligent comedian who did not rely on tried and true formulas, look where he is now? He had to walk away because the push was to turn him into a traditional minstrel performer. I think about Paul Mooney, that brotha is amazing, yet most younger folks didn't know who he was until Chapelle brought him back into the game. Mooney should be further ahead yet he is the kinda performer who again is not into the minstrel show so guess what, no show for him.







:









Shay

Excellent points Shay.
I am just uncomfortable with stereotypes being played out before mixed audiences. The Fat black mama syndrome really struck me as one that gets played out often in the the movies for wider audiences.. Eddie Murphy is the king of these. I find it insulting to black women.


----------



## Brown Lioness

I like the new show Chocolate News with DAG ( i like calling him that lol). Do i think its drop down funny with tons of quotables like Dave Chappelle's show was? NO, but hey, its comedy. It moreso reminds of me of a more edgey In Living Color, but that may be because thas all I remember DAG from.

I think it does tend to make people feel uncomfortable when playing these stereotypes in mixed audiences. Is it because we think that the non-black folks viewing these shows will play into the stereotypes or believe in them even more and think its ok to emulate or make fun of them with us? I dunno. I think thas a viable fear that a lot of folks could have. I think its somewhat from the whole notion that we need to "behave" and "act right" in front of white folks. Don't act up and embarrass US, you know? I'm sure Richard Pryor, Eddie Murphy and Chris Rock probably got the same complaints.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

For me, there were certain things like when he said "tone down the coonage" or said the high school prom girl should keep her "monkey ass" home. There are people that don't know the history of those words, and might think it was OK now to use them. I'm just not looking forward to the resurgence of those terms.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
Hey sistas.

I'm loving the intelligent discussion here... so much so much to learn though.

I'll weigh in when I can add something. Except- this tribe is sorely needed. I am hoping to someday write a book on the topic about *the fact that little brown babies in this country need gentler parenting.*

Excellent point and a book that is very needed IMO.


----------



## Autumn C.

Maybe its just me but I've never found DAG all that funny. Haven't watched Chocolate news though, maybe I'll change my mind.


----------



## eilonwy

Bean's going to be six next Saturday and his 48 pound booty is still in a five-point harness. I need to adjust the carseats, actually... It's on my list of things to do.









As to the show, I haven't seen it but I will say that I absolutely love The Boondocks... and it sure plays up stereotypes. Speaking of which, if you've got half an hour to kill I'd love to hear your opinions on this episode in particular. The Boondocks is um... how do I put this? I'm an open-minded, anti-censorship sort of person and one of those horrible mommies who thinks it's kinda cute when her kids swear, but I don't let them watch The Boondocks.







So be warned, if things like foul language make you uncomfortable, you're probably not going to want to spend time on this.


----------



## Sugarshoc

I am in love with the Boondocks. I love every single episode. Mr. McGruder is simply brilliant!!!!!!!!


----------



## Sugarshoc

Oooohh, I have to say we are hardcore Chappelle/Mooney fans in our house. The intelligence behind the humor is so deep. Love love love!!!!


----------



## xochimama

This thread moves so fast, so I'm coming a little late here, but...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
What are some of our commonalities aside from color?

For me, being a woman of color is not just descriptive. It also lays claim to a social and political *stance* that includes feminism from a POC's point of view, questioning of authority, self-awareness as being outside the cultural norm, and a progressive, sometimes radical critique of white America's subtle and pervasive way of excluding us.

Self identifying as a woman of color is a way for me to find common ground with women who have, like me, either been stereotyped or judged or insulted because of our surname, or the way we talk, or the color of our skin.

But there are plenty of Hispanic women who neither self-identify as Chicana nor as women of color as I do. They do not necessarily share my stance, my critique, my personal politics...

Heck, I can't think of any other place on this board where I could even DISCUSS this stuff, kwim?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
At this stage in the game, and again, maybe it is a class issue, I'm just seeing clearly that just because someone is a PoC, don't expect there to be some automatic, magical connection and realizing how inane it is to continue to try to connect automatically. Our histories, our experiences, our understandings, our perspectives are often different and sometimes polar opposites. So while I like the idea of joining groups specifically for WoC and always have, for me, it's just been a realization that I have to actively work to find things to connect on and not rely on color alone.

So while I feel this group is relevant and necessary, I'm making sure I know why. *Because all of us being Black, to me, is just not enough.* But as I've been reminded, *the connection in this tribe is really being a minority amongst Black people in general* by practicing NFL/AP (and maybe that's not true for me because I do have a few friends, people of color, who are indeed homebirthers, extended breastfeeders, cloth diaperers, non-vaxers, non-circers, homeschoolers, etc. so I don't necessarily feel isolated) and being a minority population on MDC.

I'm not Black, I'm Chicana.

And FWIW, I completely identify with those sisters here who lament not having other Black women with whom they can connect IRL about xtended bfing (or bfing at all), cloth diapering, co-sleeping, gd, and other choices that characterize "natural family living."

Only recently have I connected with another Latina IRL whose parenting, social, and political values are closely aligned with my own. It's a special bonus that we can whisper in Spanish, and share gossip and family recipes and understand a *little* more of where the other is coming from. We also share having married white men-a problematic all its own that we've been able to connect on...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
This tribe, *usually has someone that can relate to having your very being questioned or denied* because of choices like the above. I can't seem to find other WOC that have experienced that around me. I don't think I've ever met a WOC that had similar ides to me.

well said. (And congratulations on your new little one!







)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Hey have any of you all spent an extended amount of time in your adult lives living outside the U.S., in the Caribbean specifically? If so, and even if it was somewhere else outside the U.S. but not the Caribbean, what was it like for you, particularly as a mom? Why were you there? What did you do? We're thinking (again) about packing it up and moving out sometime in the next year or two.

Yup, but not the Caribbean. I lived in Mexico City for nearly three years after graduating from college. I wasn't a mom at that time, so no perspective to offer there.

I LOVED it. I loved living in Spanish. I loved getting to know my extended family better. I loved the thrill and challenge of being in a foreign country, of being an "outsider" and finding ways to be inside.









It's too late at night for me to go into the WHYs...that'll have to wait for another post









goodnight, everybody


----------



## AndrewsMother

Paul Mooney, I love, but DAG & Chapelle are not funny to me. We own the Chapelle Show CD's and to this day I can't stand to watch them for longer than 5 minutes. Out of all the discs, I laugh at three episodes. The black KKK member, the reparations $40K award, and the racial draft. I will admit I don't have much of a sense of humor so my thinking is biased. I don't like the idea of us laughing at us much less the realization that others are laughing at our perceived stereotypes.

As for the Boondocks, they are one of the reasons I am glad that we do not own a television.


----------



## AndrewsMother

What are you Thanksgiving Traditions?
I will come back and post mine later, I hear DS calling me from the next room.


----------



## rootzdawta

How I should have asked the question I asked was:
When you join groups for people of color (IRL or online), do you join with some expectations/assumptions about the group? In my own real life, I noticed that I was doing that and, I don't know, for some reason I'm realizing (again) how bad making assumptions _based on anything_ even an obvious commonality such as skin color can be.

Because, yes, xochimama, I completely agree with you on what it means to be a woman of color. That's what it means to me. But it might not mean that at all to another woman of color who may take offense at my "trying to saddle her with old baggage". We may not even be able to agree that there are still ways that America excludes us (which I assumed every person of color could agree upon). We may not share the experience of being discriminated against based on our skin color or name (some folks just don't feel like they've ever felt that).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
For me, being a woman of color is not just descriptive. It also lays claim to a social and political *stance* that includes feminism from a POC's point of view, questioning of authority, self-awareness as being outside the cultural norm, and a progressive, sometimes radical critique of white America's subtle and pervasive way of excluding us.

Self identifying as a woman of color is a way for me to find common ground with women who have, like me, either been stereotyped or judged or insulted because of our surname, or the way we talk, or the color of our skin.

Anyway, Rhynna, I thoroughly enjoy The Boondocks. I think it is right on point 99% of the time. I love that it is irreverent and McGruder has said things I've always thought about even making fun of the "conscious brutha", and Rev. Al "Comb it Straight Back" Sharpton. Genius. My sister, on the other hand, is embarrassed by The Boondocks and doesn't know why anyone would waste their time.

Oh, and I completely agree about the roughness used to raise Black children. I grew up with the saying "A hard head makes a soft behind" and a slipper used for spankings called "Mr. Do-good". I'm determined to raise my boys gently even if people think I'm spoiling them or (I'm not kidding--this is a quote I've heard) raising them like White kids.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Oh, and I completely agree about the roughness used to raise Black children. I grew up with the saying *"A hard head makes a soft behind"* and a slipper used for spankings called "Mr. Do-good". I'm determined to raise my boys gently even if people think I'm spoiling them or (I'm not kidding--this is a quote I've heard) raising them like White kids.

LOL, I grew up with "A hard head makes a soft behind" too. That said, while my mere presence at MDC should signal that I strive to be gentle on my parenting, I do it within a cultural context that feels good for my family. We can be gentle parents yet at the same time give them what they will need to function in this society. More later, I am still waking up.

Shay


----------



## splendid

Quote:

How I should have asked the question I asked was:
When you join groups for people of color (IRL or online), do you join with some expectations/assumptions about the group? In my own real life, I noticed that I was doing that and, I don't know, for some reason I'm realizing (again) how bad making assumptions based on anything even an obvious commonality such as skin color can be.
IRL I do not join groups of color, I just don't- if anything I freely admit I run the other way because I am always, always the odd person out. And I have come to a point in my life that I am just tired of trying to "belong".

Online, I tried and still I find myself running in the opposite direction. I left this group a few months ago because I felt like I could not connect. I return (like I always do) because I like there are other square pegs out there. I like knowing there is a lifeline for square pegs that look like me that we can swim to each other on days where it seems we are all alone.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
How I should have asked the question I asked was:
When you join groups for people of color (IRL or online), do you join with some expectations/assumptions about the group? In my own real life, I noticed that I was doing that and, I don't know, for some reason I'm realizing (again) how bad making assumptions _based on anything_ even an obvious commonality such as skin color can be.

Because, yes, xochimama, I completely agree with you on what it means to be a woman of color. That's what it means to me. But it might not mean that at all to another woman of color who may take offense at my "trying to saddle her with old baggage". We may not even be able to agree that there are still ways that America excludes us (which I assumed every person of color could agree upon). We may not share the experience of being discriminated against based on our skin color or name (some folks just don't feel like they've ever felt that).

Anyway, Rhynna, I thoroughly enjoy The Boondocks. I think it is right on point 99% of the time. I love that it is irreverent and McGruder has said things I've always thought about even making fun of the "conscious brutha", and Rev. Al "Comb it Straight Back" Sharpton. Genius. My sister, on the other hand, is embarrassed by The Boondocks and doesn't know why anyone would waste their time.

Oh, and I completely agree about the roughness used to raise Black children. I grew up with the saying "A hard head makes a soft behind" and a slipper used for spankings called "Mr. Do-good". I'm determined to raise my boys gently even if people think I'm spoiling them or (I'm not kidding--this is a quote I've heard) raising them like White kids.

Rootzdawta, I appreciate the questions you raised earlier. I did some introspecting on my experiences as a woc and my relationships with other woc. I feel so safe in this tribe.I've been in other sister circles and haven't felt as safe and trusting. Again, it's the feeling of being an outsider in a group where one assumes there are commonalities. I have some awesome sista friends with whom I don't discuss my natural lifestye. My assumption is that they will either chide me for trying to 'be white' or they will just not get it. My bff is one materialistic, conspicious consuming, wasteful chick. We grew up together and I love her to pieces so we will be friends for life. We have little in common in terms of how we live.

As for being gentler with brown children---CAN I GET AN AMEN!! I grew up in a house where my dad used the belt to whack us. I hated it. Fortunately, it didn't happen often but I recall feeling so horrible and worthless every time it happened. Talking to my dad now, he regrets that he used this form of discipline. However, he is honest is saying, it was all he knew.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

As for being gentler with brown children---CAN I GET AN AMEN!! I grew up in a house where my dad used the belt to whack us. I hated it. Fortunately, it didn't happen often but I recall feeling so horrible and worthless every time it happened. Talking to my dad now, he regrets that he used this form of discipline. *However, he is honest is saying, it was all he knew*.

I am not condoning the violence that often is passed for discipline in many Black homes, but the older I get, I do think its important to remember that for many of our parents and grandparents this way was all they knew.

Growing up, my Pops was heavy-handed with the belt and for years I was mad but I am at a stage in life that when I look at the larger picture I see he did the best he could. My dad was one of 16 kids, his parents, my grandparents were sharecroppers in rural Arkansas, life was tough and I suspect there was not a lot of time for gentleness. So he grew up and used the same ways that were modeled for him, I am thankful though that times have changed and information is available and that I can change things.

I have made mention that I am an ex-spanker, I was 19 when my son was born and early on I spanked because that was all I knew though I knew it didn't feel right. Last time I spanked my son he was 4, I made the choice to never do it again and at 16, my son will tell you I kept that promise.

So while many of us may feel like outcasts in predominantly Black settings, I think with regards to our parenting ideas, we are at the forefront of change in our communities. I hang out with a sista here in Maine who is more tradtionally Black in her parenting yet I feel that I have been able to give her some ideas for change. At the same time she serves as my compass when I am leaning so far into gentle parenting/AP ideas that I start feeling like a floor rug waiting to get walked on by my dd.

Shay


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
IRL I *do not join groups of color, I just don't- if anything I freely admit I run the other way because I am always, always the odd person out. And I have come to a point in my life that I am just tired of trying to "belong".*

Online, I tried and still I find myself running in the opposite direction. I left this group a few months ago because I felt like I could not connect. I return (like I always do) because I like there are other square pegs out there. I like knowing there is a lifeline for square pegs that look like me that we can swim to each other on days where it seems we are all alone.


May I ask what makes you feel like the odd person out? I know what it is for me, but I am curious about others' experiences.
For the record, I love being around other woc and try to focus on commonalities. Depending on the circle, sometimes it's not always possible so I keep it moving. I have a great respect for difference, but sometimes cultural and frankly, class issues get in the way. Please don't read that as me being classist, because I am not. I have friends that range along the socio economic strata. I simply can't get down with certain types of behaviors, values, etc.


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## eilonwy

By the by, there's no h in my name... anywhere.

A few years ago, a white woman who had two or three black foster children in her home posted to ask about a list of "requirements" that she'd been given regarding the kids. It had ridiculous things about how they had to shower two or three times a day, how their hair had to be combed, etc... things that just made no sense at all. She didn't think it made any sense, and really nobody else did either, but it seemed to boil down to the fact that the kids' mother didn't want her children with a white foster family, and wanted them to feel stupid for even trying to take care of these kids because white people wouldn't even know "the basics" of black hair & body care or something like that. The entire thing was absolutely ridiculous, but it wasn't the first time I'd heard such things. As someone here mentioned when.. Shay? brought up the "black children need to be spanked" issue, it was one of those things that was used to justify slavery back in the day. It was all quite messed up... but I know that there are black people *today* who still believe these kinds of things. Relatively young ones, too.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
*By the by, there's no h in my name... anywhere.*

A few years ago, a white woman who had two or three black foster children in her home posted to ask about a list of "requirements" that she'd been given regarding the kids. It had ridiculous things about how they had to shower two or three times a day, how their hair had to be combed, etc... things that just made no sense at all. She didn't think it made any sense, and really nobody else did either, but it seemed to boil down to the fact that the kids' mother didn't want her children with a white foster family, and wanted them to feel stupid for even trying to take care of these kids because white people wouldn't even know "the basics" of black hair & body care or something like that. The entire thing was absolutely ridiculous, but it wasn't the first time I'd heard such things. As someone here mentioned when.. Shay? brought up the "black children need to be spanked" issue, it was one of those things that was used to justify slavery back in the day. It was all quite messed up... but I know that there are black people *today* who still believe these kinds of things. Relatively young ones, too.









I was wondering when you were going to speak up about that!

I think it was Andrew'smother who brought up the issue of black children needing to be spanked based on a convo with a friend of hers. I agree. It stems from slavery and is all kinds of messed up. Thankfully, we are questioning practices that were handed down and making different choices for our lives and children!


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
By the by, there's no h in my name... anywhere.

Ooops! Sorry Rynna . . . that's strange that I've been adding the h!! Btw, what's the pronunciation of your name? Long or short I sound? I think I may have been pronouncing it in my head with a long I and that's why the H got in there. Sorry again.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
As someone here mentioned when.. Shay? brought up the "black children need to be spanked" issue, it was one of those things that was used to justify slavery back in the day. It was all quite messed up... but I know that there are black people *today* who still believe these kinds of things. Relatively young ones, too.

That wasn't me. I don't believe kids need to be spanked at all, I do think however there are cultural differences that need to be taken into consideration when raising kids. That is rooted more in how society views POC versus white people though. As a Mama raising a boy (really manchild now








) its the realization that he always has be more mindful that society will not extend the same courtesy to him that it does a white boy of his age.

Many months ago I mentioned my son's first encounter with the police, long story short my son was stopped because he fit the description of some kid trying to break into cars in the area. Well turns out the kid was white and short, my son is tan and tall... Cop basically treated him like crap, forced him to ride in the back of the squad car and they brought him home. Cop ended up apologizing but it was a case where if my son had gotten vocal, he may have ended up in a diffrent circumstance. These are the type of differences I am alluding to.

However I do believe that the roots in why spanking is still so prevalent is rooted in slavery. Blacks were brought here and abused, our ancestors used those same harsh methods with our own kids not realizing the abuse factor. Yet I do believe the cycle is being broken and we are starting to realize we don't need to use our hands and physical punishment to discipline our kids.

Shay


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## Bloomingstar

whew! just caught up again!

Thanks everyone for the responses re:living outside the U.S. (and purplegirl for the blogs--I've got the link bookmarked







)

I definitely agree that there needs to be gentler parenting of black and brown kids while also finding the ways to teach them the survival skills they'll need to deal with things like what Shay's DS just went through. My stepmother was definitely of the "a hard head makes a soft behind" school, though my father really wasn't, and after one particular incident with my sister (who is really "red" as we say growing up in new orleans) which involved the librarian calling the child protection folks, that was a done deal







My sister does not hit her kids, clearly, and I have no intention of doing so either. My DH, I'm still working on, though I think he spends more time joking about it than taking it seriously. He was raised in the caribbean and there's much the same story in terms of the history and the whys of spanking--it's what folks knew/know to do, it is a vestige of slavery, all the things you all have said already.

But I'd add in even the way people talk to our kids can use some work. My stepmother was extremely verbally and emotionally abusive (though now she has somehow rewritten history in her own mind







: ) and there are things she said to my sister and I that I would never even consider uttering to another human being.







Heck, I wouldn't utter it to another living being period, not a animal or a plant either.

So I'm glad, also, to have a space to talk about these things. IRL my communities and so forth are just about all pocs, but most of my friends are also around my age (mid to late 20s), queer, and not parenting so while they're all excited to learn about cloth diapering and such right along with me--which I greatly appreciate and I'm kind of the test case for everyone anyway







, they don't have much in terms of first hand experience with a lot of the parenting stuff.


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## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
This thread moves so fast, so I'm coming a little late here, but...

For me, being a woman of color is not just descriptive. It also lays claim to a social and political *stance* that includes feminism from a POC's point of view, questioning of authority, self-awareness as being outside the cultural norm, and a progressive, sometimes radical critique of white America's subtle and pervasive way of excluding us.

Self identifying as a woman of color is a way for me to find common ground with women who have, like me, either been stereotyped or judged or insulted because of our surname, or the way we talk, or the color of our skin.










:

and for what it's worth, I cannot stand the cartoon of the Boondocks--I think a lot of it is the voices but in general it bothers me, though I appreciate the comic strip. I've never paid attention to DAG one way or the other and I generally prefer Chris Rock to Dave Chapelle, and I like what I know of Paul Mooney. I think some of my reticence is tied up in the questions of who is watching and what joke, exactly, is it that they think they get, which is kind of what Dave Chapelle, in the end (on Oprah) said made him walk away from his show.

And I just wonder why CNN felt the need to put a black comedian, versus say a black philosopher or "public intellectual" or author or whoever in a timeslot at this political moment. Are we not allowed to say anything unless we're joking about it, otherwise we're just hateful and too radical (not that DL is the least bit radical).


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## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
By the by, there's no h in my name... anywhere.











I had to laugh at this because I am CONSTANTLY correcting the spelling of my name! I am Cristina (the Spanish spelling) and have fought my whole life for people to not spell it Christina or worse, Christine. Both are beautiful names, but not me. I hate it when people anglicize me.







:

It is especially annoying when this happens in work situations and then when I politely correct people, they act like I'm some uppity Chicana with something to prove.







And it happens on email all.the.time. I just don't get it. What is so difficult about Cristina??!!


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## rootzdawta

Just wanted to say that my folks (and many Igbo people I know) were not enslaved (although colonialized) but also believe in spanking so while it may have some roots in slavery, what else do you think could be a reason why it's so common among Black folk? I was reading a blog (I'll try to find it) that basically asserted that Black folk in general are kinder to people who are not their own and *brutal* to ourselves.

And Shay, I remember that about your son. I think for Black boys especially, I feel a real pressure to let them know that what is acceptable for your White counterpart often times won't cut it for you. Sometimes the pressure is so strong, I think, you feel like you need a strong hand to drive that point home.

There's a thread here on MDC I'm participating in about allowing a toddler to be at the playground completely naked. In my heart of hearts I know that to have my little beautiful brown babies running around the playground naked would basically be like me putting a big sign on my head that my kids are "abused and neglected--please take them away" but it might be seen simply "oh, that's odd" by anybody else not a PoC. No matter how much my ds would like to be naked, just not acceptable even if another child who's white could get away with it. While my mother would have popped me sure enough for arguing with her about putting on my clothes as a toddler, I do argue with my son and then basically say no clothes = no going out or try to strike some kind of compromise with him. But we _both_ had to get the same thing accomplished--the clothes on to go out. The pressure is there. There is a huge double standard.

Yup, Shay, DH is the one who pulls me back at times so I don't feel walked all over by my kids. Oh, and while I don't hit, I do holler (rather sparingly), have perfected speaking through gritted teeth and I do cut a wicked look if I say so myself (thanks Mom for showing me how to do that right).

Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
And I just wonder why CNN felt the need to put a black comedian, versus say a black philosopher or "public intellectual" or author or whoever in a timeslot at this political moment. Are we not allowed to say anything unless we're joking about it, otherwise we're just hateful and too radical (not that DL is the least bit radical).


You know, this is something that bothers me, too. As Dave Chappelle put it, "The only way I could say what I really think is if I had some pretty white girl sing it..." I'd love to see a black intellectual or a philosopher or really anyone who wasn't obviously a) trying to entertain or b) preaching be given a space to stand up and speak. Hm. I bet NPR would be down with that...

But the portrayal of black people in media is something that frequently rubs me the wrong way. I'm a huge science fiction fan, and I absolutely love a show called Stargate SG-1. One of the lead characters of this show is a strong, intelligent black man. That's a good thing, but here's the trouble: He's an alien. That's right, he's from another planet. He's "permitted" to be a strong, intelligent black man and to explore his sexuality, his spirituality, all of those things which are generally ignored in black men, but I'm pretty well convinced that it's only because he's not from Earth. I LOVE Teal'c, don't get me wrong, but it bothers me that in order to be a strong black man with a strong mind and a heart and a spirit, he has to be from Chu'lak. Why can't he be from Denver?







I've seen every episode of the show and I've looked for them and the ONLY strong black men are from other planets.

I saw an interview with LeVar Burton about Star Trek, in which he talks about the fact that they explore the sexuality of the android more than "this black man," and he was absolutely correct (duh). It was something I'd noticed myself, and it's subtle but I guess that's exactly why it bothers me. Why can't we see a strong, intelligent black man from Earth? Why can't we see a strong, intelligent black man who is a multifaceted individual and who isn't deliberately and actively separated from the group? I mean they covered Geordi's eyes, for crying out loud! It's not that different from putting a big old tattoo on his forehead and a worm in his belly.

Hm. I don't have TV so I watch DVDs for the most part... forgive me for sticking to sci fi, but it's the genre I know best.


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## purplegirl

I think, in part, black culture is built upon respect. I still call my parents' friends, Miss so and so, etc. I have some children of the majority culture with whom I work, who call me by my first name. I always correct them and say "miss lisa".







It's so ingrained in me and it will take me a long time to get used to children calling me simply by my first name. Perhaps the spanking is part of maintaining the authortarian position and 'respect'?? I'm not sure.

I chose my usename based on how much I am in love with the color *purple.* I am a freak for the color and always have been--it's not deep or complicated!


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
There's a thread here on MDC I'm participating in about allowing a toddler to be at the playground completely naked. In my heart of hearts I know that to have my little beautiful brown babies running around the playground naked would basically be like me putting a big sign on my head that my kids are "abused and neglected--please take them away" but it might be seen simply "oh, that's odd" by anybody else not a PoC. No matter how much my ds would like to be naked, just not acceptable even if another child who's white could get away with it. While my mother would have popped me sure enough for arguing with her about putting on my clothes as a toddler, I do argue with my son and then basically say no clothes = no going out or try to strike some kind of compromise with him. But we _both_ had to get the same thing accomplished--the clothes on to go out. The pressure is there. There is a huge double standard.

For what it's worth, I would never allow my toddlers to run naked at a playground, and they look pretty damned white. Fear of CYS drives me.







All of my kids run naked at Four Quarters if they please, but there are naked people everywhere.









Quote:

Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?








When I first started using the internet for communication outside of email, I was also playing a lot of roleplaying games and I named my characters with a very simple convention: After a character in my most recently finished book. Before the first time I logged into a talker, I had finished The Chronicles of Prydain, so I logged in as "Eilonwy," she being the only female character of note. I've used the name often since then, but it's usually taken (although if one Googles "eilonwy" I come up an awful lot). I was quite shocked that it wasn't taken here.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Yup, Shay, DH is the one who pulls me back at times so I don't feel walked all over by my kids. Oh, and while I don't hit, I do holler (rather sparingly), have perfected speaking through gritted teeth and I do cut a wicked look if I say so myself (thanks Mom for showing me how to do that right).

Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?









LOL, yeah we have our days when the little Miss makes Mama raise that voice, think Kimora Lee talking to her kids. Look, I ain't hitting my child but after 2-3 times of repeating myself in patient Mama voice, sometimes I gotta let a little bass come out so she knows the time for playing is over. My girl like many kids loves to test the limits, sometimes its ok but sometimes its not. I always want her to feel free to express herself, like right now she loves eating boogers







:, as a kid, my Dad spanked me for doing that, now its not that serious here. But I do express that I think its gross and would prefer that she not do it.

My username is boring, Shay is my childhood nickname that has evolved into what everyone calls me except my family, the gubment and bill collectors. Oh and my oldest friend still calls me by my given name which at this point I really never use. I just added inme, because it means Shay in Maine which is where I live








. I just couldn't think of anything more exciting that I would remember.

Shay


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
:
I think it was Andrew'smother who brought up the issue of black children needing to be spanked based on a convo with a friend of hers.

I have to field the spanking question from the vast majority of my acquaintances. Spanking=discipline and I am doing my son a grave injustice.







: Just two weeks ago at a church dinner I felt like the worse mother in the world because I chose to agree to disagree. I have plenty of faith in my convictions, but not enough to disrupt dinner after church.

I wanted to ask, "so if you hit your wife because she did not follow your command would you be guilty of abuse or discipline?"

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
By the by, there's no h in my name... anywhere.


I have to remove the H from your name before I push the submit button. In my mind I pronouce your name RHEN-NA. What is the correct pronouciation?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 

But I'd add in even the way people talk to our kids can use some work. My stepmother was extremely verbally and emotionally abusive (though now she has somehow rewritten history in her own mind







: ) and there are things she said to my sister and I that I would never even consider uttering to another human being.







Heck, I wouldn't utter it to another living being period, not a animal or a plant either.

I would agree. My own experiences have led me to believe that mental abuse is by far more damaging and enduring than physical abuse, but both are equally wrong.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:

and for what it's worth, I cannot stand the cartoon of the Boondocks--I think a lot of it is the voices but in general it bothers me, though I appreciate the comic strip.

The comic strip is quite funny, but the vulgarity of the animated characters is too much for me. I also don't care for any type of dialogue that could be construed as reverse racisim or prejudice.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 









I had to laugh at this because I am CONSTANTLY correcting the spelling of my name! I am Cristina (the Spanish spelling) and have fought my whole life for people to not spell it Christina or worse, Christine. Both are beautiful names, but not me. I hate it when people anglicize me.







:

It is especially annoying when this happens in work situations and then when I politely correct people, they act like I'm some uppity Chicana with something to prove.







And it happens on email all.the.time. I just don't get it. What is so difficult about Cristina??!!

If, and only if I ever have a girl her middle name is to be Cristina.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
There is a huge double standard.

Yup, Shay, DH is the one who pulls me back at times so I don't feel walked all over by my kids. Oh, and while I don't hit, I do holler (rather sparingly), have perfected speaking through gritted teeth and I do cut a wicked look if I say so myself (thanks Mom for showing me how to do that right).

Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?









There is a definite double standard that I am up against on a daily basis. I want for DS to develop into an altruistic, loving, God fearing, responsible, educated young, woman loving young man, but I refuse to beat him into that mold. There has to be a better way, but at the same time I don't want to fail to my child because I was too lenient. He is only 2 1/2, there is plenty of time to teach him the ways of the world, but I don't want to make a mistake that can't be undone.

I lack creativity. At first I was Piad, my name and my last initial. I did not like the moniker so I changed my username to AndrewMother. It is who I am, but the name just does not sound right.


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## purplegirl

I have been thinking about you and wondering how things are going. I hope the nursing has gotten easier for you and your LO.


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
IRL I do not join groups of color, I just don't- if anything *I freely admit I run the other way because I am always, always the odd person out. And I have come to a point in my life that I am just tired of trying to "belong".*

Online, I tried and still I find myself running in the opposite direction. I left this group a few months ago because I felt like I could not connect. I return (like I always do) because I like there are other square pegs out there. I like knowing there is a lifeline for square pegs that look like me that we can swim to each other on days where it seems we are all alone.

*sigh* Yeah that. I'm tired of trying to pretend that I fit in because we share the same skin color, even though my mind and my spirit is not in line (or, sometimes, very appreciative of) the attitudes/expectations/assumptions of the others in the group.
And to have to constantly, constantly, constantly, explain what you mean/why you feel that way/how you think - sometimes (a lot of times) it's just easier to explain my *color* and the repercussions there-of to curious/nonjudging white folks than it is to explain/defend all of *me* to dismissive/judgmental black folks. Esp. when there is often a subtle (or blatant) undercurrent of judging my 'blackness' because of what I do and don't do/believe/accept.

That's just been my experience, and it might be largely rooted in the fact that most of the time where I've made the attempts to join largely AA-centric groups, I've been in the South.

I'm still going to try to join some of the local AA groups once we have little ones, though - even though I doubt that I'll fit in very well (or at all), or that I will be able to endure the constant and casual violence that a lot of black parents inflict on their children in the name of discipline. *shudder*

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
There's a thread here on MDC I'm participating in about allowing a toddler to be at the playground completely naked. In my heart of hearts I know that to have my little beautiful brown babies running around the playground naked would basically be like me putting a big sign on my head that my kids are "abused and neglected--please take them away" but it might be seen simply "oh, that's odd" by anybody else not a PoC. No matter how much my ds would like to be naked, just not acceptable even if another child who's white could get away with it. While my mother would have popped me sure enough for arguing with her about putting on my clothes as a toddler, I do argue with my son and then basically say no clothes = no going out or try to strike some kind of compromise with him. But we _both_ had to get the same thing accomplished--the clothes on to go out. The pressure is there. There is a huge double standard.

Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?









I wouldn't allow my toddler to be in a public place totally naked, period. At home, fine. In our yard, fine. In a nudist setting, possibly fine (with pagan friends, it comes up quite a bit). At a friends house, fine. In public, and a playground, with who knows what cameras/strangers/nassy folks around? I so most definitely think *not*. I need to be able to vet who sees my child naked.









My name used to be earthymama2b. At the year mark of TTC'ing, I realized that if I continued - even in subtle ways - to focus on that aspect of myself in lieu of everything else fabulous about me - well, down that path lied danger.
So, I changed it to JustKiya. Just me, as I am, and as I change, I'll still be, JustKiya.


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## eilonwy

It's RIN-ah, short for kah-RIN-ah. Most people want to make it "Karyanna" or "Ryanna" for some reason, but others have made it "Rhynna" before.







I don't know. It's not all that hard, but people do it even aafter they've heard me say it out loud.


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## Brown Lioness

My name is my own creation....at times I wish I could change it now (mods, how does that work anyway?). But i figured since I had a mane of locks and my skin is brown and I like pretty lil brown, chocolate things and that I could be a Brown Lioness.


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## splendid

splendid was the first thing that popped in my mind. After I realized there were to many mommyg-s on the site. Plus it is such a happy word.


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
My name is my own creation....at times I wish I could change it now (mods, how does that work anyway?). But i figured since I had a mane of locks and my skin is brown and I like pretty lil brown, chocolate things and that I could be a Brown Lioness.

Since you are a senior member, I think you can get one namechange for free. I think.....that might just be for premium memberships. I had to pony up 2 bucks for mine.... the details are up there under Rules or FAQ, I think.....


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## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Since you are a senior member, I think you can get one namechange for free. I think.....that might just be for premium memberships. I had to pony up 2 bucks for mine.... the details are up there under Rules or FAQ, I think.....

Your first title change is free (the one that says senior member at 1000 posts)), but the name change and subsequent title changes carry a fee of $2.50 .

Here is the link:
http://www.mothering.com/mdc/senior_...mechanges.html


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## rootzdawta

Rootzdawta . . . well, at one time I thought of myself as a root--steadfast, unmovable, deep, reliable. But I am changing so much these days I think I identify more with the leaves--growing every spring, changing colors, falling off, returning back to the earth to help nourish something new. As part of the spiritual path I was on, am on, am on my way back to (I'm sorting things our right now), there's an emphasis on getting back to the root (Africa) and being a child of the Most High (dawta or daughter). So the name encapsulated all that. I've thought of changing it but honestly, I can't think of any thing clever.


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## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Since you are a senior member, I think you can get one namechange for free. I think.....that might just be for premium memberships. I had to pony up 2 bucks for mine.... the details are up there under Rules or FAQ, I think.....


Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Your first title change is free (the one that says senior member at 1000 posts)), but the name change and subsequent title changes carry a fee of $2.50 .

Here is the link:
http://www.mothering.com/mdc/senior_...mechanges.html


Oh ok, thanks ladies!


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Just wanted to say that my folks (and many Igbo people I know) were not enslaved (although colonialized) but also believe in spanking so while it may have some roots in slavery, *what else do you think could be a reason why it's so common among Black folk?* I was reading a blog (I'll try to find it) that basically asserted that Black folk in general are kinder to people who are not their own and *brutal* to ourselves.

I've often wondered this myself. How would one research this, I wonder?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh, and while I don't hit, I do holler (rather sparingly), *have perfected speaking through gritted teeth and I do cut a wicked look if I say so myself (thanks Mom for showing me how to do that right).*

I'm not much for yelling. But the speaking through gritted teeth I could do a lot less of. Sometimes, it's not because whatever happened has upset me that much but because the force of trying not to duplicate my mother creates lots of tension that finds its home in my jaw.


----------



## Heathen Mama

Where did my name come from?

I'm just lettin my freak flag fly! I'm an Atheist and I am a mama... My grandmother, Momma, could out-cuss any sailor around, and she'd use the same parting curse for anyone who ticked her off.

The word "heathen" figured prominently, and I just chuckle every time I type it.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
*sigh* Yeah that. *I'm tired of trying to pretend that I fit in because we share the same skin color*, even though my mind and my spirit is not in line (or, sometimes, very appreciative of) the attitudes/expectations/assumptions of the others in the group.
And to have to constantly, constantly, constantly, explain what you mean/why you feel that way/how you think - sometimes (a lot of times) *it's just easier to explain my color and the repercussions there-of to curious/nonjudging white folks than it is to explain/defend all of me to dismissive/judgmental black folks.* Esp. when there is often a subtle (or blatant) undercurrent of *judging my 'blackness'* because of what I do and don't do/believe/accept.


These were all the points I was going to say too. It sounds so much like me that it's not even funny. I stopped trying to belong to MANY Black groups because I got sick of the "you talk, walk, act" white comments. I remember being made fun of because I didn't use slang (wasn't allowed in my house) or say ain't (also not allowed) or finished words with ING rather than IN.

When I introduced my sister to cloth diapers, one of her friends said it was a stupid idea and I only did it "trying to be white." And it doesn't help that my husband is white. My father admitted that he always knew one of his kids would marry a white person, and I wonder of it was a goal of his or if he thought that because he faced the same thing growing up having his AA status questioned.

As for my name, they are my middle names.


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## purplegirl

Morning. I am up bright and early to go to the polls. They open at 7a.m. here but I am not risking long lines.
I have a weird nervous, excited feeling brewing inside.







:
Good luck with voting mamas!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
These were all the points I was going to say too. It sounds so much like me that it's not even funny. I stopped trying to belong to MANY Black groups because I got sick of the "you talk, walk, act" white comments. I remember being made fun of because I didn't use slang (wasn't allowed in my house) or say ain't (also not allowed) or finished words with ING rather than IN.

When I introduced my sister to cloth diapers, one of her friends said it was a stupid idea and I only did it "trying to be white." And it doesn't help that my husband is white. My father admitted that he always knew one of his kids would marry a white person, and I wonder of it was a goal of his or if he thought that because he faced the same thing growing up having his AA status questioned.

As for my name, they are my middle names.









Just yesterday, my secretary said "lisa you act white". I asked for explanation and she had none that made sense. In fact, I think she tried to swallow back the words when she realized how ludicrous it sounded. I thought that type of thinking was becoming obsolete.


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Morning. I am up bright and early to go to the polls. They open at 7a.m. here but I am not risking long lines.
I have a weird nervous, excited feeling brewing inside.







:
Good luck with voting mamas!

That was my plan (polls opened at 6am) we got up and sat in bed at 5:30am to see a stream of cars driving by. We live only .25 miles away from the polling place. I told dh to go without me. He let me know that cars we parked on our street and the line was wrapped around the block.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just yesterday, my secretary said "lisa you act white". I asked for explanation and she had none that made sense. In fact, I think she tried to swallow back the words when she realized how ludicrous it sounded. I thought that type of thinking was becoming obsolete.

Nope. People think it and say it.


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## purplegirl

I voted







: There was a line when I got there but once they opened the doors, it went very quickly. I was in and out in about five minutes tops.
A side note: I live in such a crunchy neighborhood that no one flinched as a woman did her complete yoga routine while we waited in line. I was the only one looking at her out the corner of my eye


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
How I should have asked the question I asked was:
When you join groups for people of color (IRL or online), do you join with some expectations/assumptions about the group? In my own real life, I noticed that I was doing that and, I don't know, for some reason I'm realizing (again) how bad making assumptions _based on anything_ even an obvious commonality such as skin color can be.

We may not share the experience of being discriminated against based on our skin color or name (some folks just don't feel like they've ever felt that).


I join groups for people of color expecting to find atleast one person with whom I am able to connect. I have friends/associates, but not one person in my life who does not think that I am odd. I am tired of my thougts and actions being dismissed, because that is just, Pia. Perhaps my tenacity will reward me, but with each passing year I lose heart.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
*sigh* Yeah that. I'm tired of trying to pretend that I fit in because we share the same skin color, even though my mind and my spirit is not in line (or, sometimes, very appreciative of) the attitudes/expectations/assumptions of the others in the group.
And to have to constantly, constantly, constantly, explain what you mean/why you feel that way/how you think - sometimes (a lot of times) it's just easier to explain my *color* and the repercussions there-of to curious/nonjudging white folks than it is to explain/defend all of *me* to dismissive/judgmental black folks. Esp. when there is often a subtle (or blatant) undercurrent of judging my 'blackness' because of what I do and don't do/believe/accept.

That's just been my experience, and it might be largely rooted in the fact that most of the time where I've made the attempts to join largely AA-centric groups, I've been in the South.

I'm still going to try to join some of the local AA groups once we have little ones, though - even though I doubt that I'll fit in very well (or at all), or that I will be able to endure the constant and casual violence that a lot of black parents inflict on their children in the name of discipline. *shudder*

I wouldn't allow my toddler to be in a public place totally naked, period. At home, fine. In our yard, fine. In a nudist setting, possibly fine (with pagan friends, it comes up quite a bit). At a friends house, fine. In public, and a playground, with who knows what cameras/strangers/nassy folks around? I so most definitely think *not*. I need to be able to vet who sees my child naked.










Your words echo my sentiments exactly. I was born and raised but hopefully will not die in the South. All of my younger family memebers have migrated east and love it.

I have contemplated joing Mocha Moms, but their meetings are too far from my home. There is a North Houston chapter and a South Houston chapter, but nothing centrally located.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
These were all the points I was going to say too. It sounds so much like me that it's not even funny. I stopped trying to belong to MANY Black groups because I got sick of the "you talk, walk, act" white comments. I remember being made fun of because I didn't use slang (wasn't allowed in my house) or say ain't (also not allowed) or finished words with ING rather than IN.

This mentality that existed when I was a child continues to persist in our community and it is sickening. My mother's experience was similar to mine, but I want so much for my son to not feel less than what he is by people of his own race because he chooses a different if not better path.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Just yesterday, my secretary said "lisa you act white". I asked for explanation and she had none that made sense. In fact, I think she tried to swallow back the words when she realized how ludicrous it sounded. I thought that type of thinking was becoming obsolete.

No, not at all, and it exists all over this great land of ours.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
This thread moves so fast, so I'm coming a little late here, but...

For me, being a woman of color is not just descriptive. It also lays claim to a social and political *stance* that includes feminism from a POC's point of view, questioning of authority, self-awareness as being outside the cultural norm, and a progressive, sometimes radical critique of white America's subtle and pervasive way of excluding us.

Self identifying as a woman of color is a way for me to find common ground with women who have, like me, either been stereotyped or judged or insulted because of our surname, or the way we talk, or the color of our skin.

And FWIW, I completely identify with those sisters here who lament not having other Black women with whom they can connect IRL about xtended bfing (or bfing at all), cloth diapering, co-sleeping, gd, and other choices that characterize "natural family living."


Nicely said.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
A side note: I live in such a crunchy neighborhood that no one flinched as a woman did her complete yoga routine while we waited in line. I was the only one looking at her out the corner of my eye

















That's fantastic. I still want to try yoga. I need to find a "yoga for the fat and uncoordinated" class.









In any case, I won't be voting for at least another hour or so; Bean's got a conference with his teacher this morning, and I was concerned that I'd miss it if I tried to vote earlier (a valid concern, given our neighborhood's morning turnout). So the littles & I are having breakfast and after that and Bean's conference, we'll head for the polls. Bean's so adorable about it. Yesterday he told me, "You know what? I think Barak Obama's really going to win this. I heard that he's way ahead of John McCain in the polls."


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## eilonwy

While I have occasionally been told that I "act white," the more common statement is that people thought I *was* white.







: What's most unbearable to me about it is the way that they inevitably think that they're giving me a compliment-- like I was trying to pass and succeeded admirably.







:









I guess that's something else that I look for in groups of WoC-- people who understand why such a notion is offensive to me, and who will "assume" that I'm not white when I enter the room. I mean I've been doing a better job of looking mixed since I've been conscious of the issue, but there are still days when I really "look" white and I get really tired of the "you pass well" comments.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
While I have occasionally been told that I "act white," the more common statement is that people thought I *was* white.







: What's most unbearable to me about it is the way that they inevitably think that they're giving me a compliment-- like I was trying to pass and succeeded admirably.







:









I guess that's something else that I look for in groups of WoC-- people who understand why such a notion is offensive to me, and who will "assume" that I'm not white when I enter the room. I mean I've been doing a better job of looking mixed since I've been conscious of the issue, but there are still days when I really "look" white and I get really tired of the "you pass well" comments.









I can understand why you would take offense to the comments, because you seem to embrace all of who you are. However I sometimes wish that I had the opportunity to be of the majority when it suited me. Yes, I am proud to be black, but I would like to know what it is like to be white. What are their struggles and how does it feel when you might think that every black person believes that you or your ancestors are the reason behind all their societal ills.

When I am upset I want to be an angry woman and not an angry black woman.


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I mean I've been doing a better job of looking mixed since I've been conscious of the issue

I can see where the frustration comes in, honestly. FWIW, I can see that you're a woman of colorI'm curious as to how you could make yourself look more like a WoC/mixed?

Interestingly enough . . . you remember learning about Plessy v. Ferguson in high school? Here's a picture of him. I never imagined he was so light since most of the pictures in my text book looked like http://us.history.wisc.edu/hist102/w...02/plessy2.jpg. I was reading an article that basically asserted that since he was so light/so mixed the issue actually went a lot deeper than "separate but equal" because genetically, you couldn't separate out what Plessy was.

Yeah, AndrewsMother . . .I joke with DH than in my next incarnation, I want to come back as a wealthy, WASP man.


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## Jannah6

"The fact that Homer was 7/8 white and 1/8 black". Just curious, what does 7/8 white and 1/8 black mean?


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
FWIW, I can see that you're a woman of colorI'm curious as to how you could make yourself look more like a WoC/mixed?

Yeah, AndrewsMother . . .I joke with DH than in my next incarnation, I want to come back as a wealthy, WASP man.

I have long thought the same as Rootzdawta, but I did not want to say so. In both of your pictures you have features that look nothing less than of African descent.

I tell DH the same thing, that or married to the right one. WASP males do appear to have the whole world in the palm of their hand.


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## Jannah6

Also curious, how far you WOC are able to trace your ancestry?


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
"The fact that Homer was 7/8 white and 1/8 black". Just curious, what does 7/8 white and 1/8 black mean?

If one parent is half black and half white and the other black you are 3/4 black.

If one parent is black you are half black.

If one parent is 1/2 black and one parent white you are 1/4 black

If one parent is 1/4 black and the other is white you are 1/8 black also once known as an octoroon.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Also curious, how far you WOC are able to trace your ancestry?

My grandmother's side of the family is from Ethiopia and are mostly free persons living in the south according to census records compiled by my great aunt. The first person to come to American worked on a ship in exchange for passage to America.

My grandfather's side of the family was enslaved in central Mississippi. I am not close to my grandfather's side of the family, and therefore know very little about them.


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## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
If one parent is black you are half black.
If one parent is half black and half white and the other black you are 1/4 black.

If one parent is 1/4 black and the other is white you are 1/8 black also once known as an octoroon.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

Oh, this gives me a headache. Anything with numbers does


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Oh, this gives me a headache. Anything with numbers does









I confused myself and had to make corrections are reading what I initially typed.


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## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I confused myself and had to make corrections are reading what I initially typed.

Wow, that's great that you can at least trace your ancestry back to Ethiopia







. The best I can do is trace my great-great-grandparents to Charleston South Carolina. The census says they were born in SC, but according to my great-grandmother my g-g-grandparents came over on a boat







.

My DH who is Eastern European can trace his ancestry for 9 generations. I'm happy for him, but so so sad for myself and my family


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My DH who is Eastern European can trace his ancestry for 9 generations. I'm happy for him, but so so sad for myself and my family









I can definetly empathize. Granted we know from where they came, but there is not a direct lineage that connect us with family. I often feel as if we have no authentic roots to tie us into our real culture. I don't even consider myself to be African American, because I am not. I am 100% American.
I look at Indians, Africans, Asians and other immigrants out celebrating with groups of people in similar dress and I would like to have similar connection to my history, culture and people.


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## Bloomingstar

I voted! The polls opened at 7 here and I didn't want to be there so early. I went at 9, hoping to beat the rush. I vote at a public school a couple blocks away from my apartment. I DID NOT beat the rush, which I was actualy really happy about. I saw a few neighbors and some families with their kids, which was also nice. I'm 8 months pregnant so no one wanted to let me stand in line either







: A lady near the front of the line told me to skip her, but to take a seat (it was in an auditorium) so I didn't endure what looked like probably at least an hour and a half to 2 hour or more wait. It still took me about 45 minutes. A couple friends have been texting me--they've been in line for 3 hours now, and this is just in Brooklyn--imagine being in a swing state! Well my sister is, and it took her an hour, but she went at 7am and the polling site is in her apartment complex. They had coffee and water and snacks there too, just to keep people there.







:

And as for tracing family ancestry, I haven't a clue about my mother's side of the family, but my father's side is generations deep in Louisiana and so far we've gotten the tree back to the 1800s in Haiti and France, but still not back to the continent, and that's just my father's father's side. Louisiana records are so convoluted after a certain point anyway since a lot of the stuff is in French







: But my dad has worked on it for some years and recently handed off a lot of stuff to me, so somewhere in my spare time







: I'll get to work on it.


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## Autumn C.

I voted!

I took my kids with me wanting to expose ds who is 9 to the democratic process. He thought I was a little crazy for being so darned excited to vote but my hope is that when he is older he will remember it and have a smigen of excitment when he votes.

History is in the making!


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## eilonwy

I can absolutely understand wishing for the ability to pass for white, and have in the past made deliberate efforts in that direction (it's been years). I, for example, would wear my hair differently when I was driving a small vehicle in Lancaster because I wanted cops seeing me from a distance to assume I was white.







It's a heck of a lot easier in entirely too many circumstances to be white than it is to be anything else.









That said, learning to embrace myself as I am has included learning to embrace all of my heritage all the time-- not just when it's "convinient" or "cool" not to be white. As a result, I wear my hair curly more often than not. If I must pull it back, I try not to pull it back with any pressure (it straightens right out if I do) or when it's wet (because again, it ends up straight). Clothing-wise, my style could best be described as "mom in a hurry" but I do my best to remain neutral, not wearing a lot of logos or tags or whatever. I rarely wear makeup of any kind, but when I do I try to choose colors that play up the browns in my lips and eyes. I also try to draw attention to my lips, and I do not try to distract attention from my nose (which is, again, fairly "neutral" in terms of racial features). For the most part, though, it's the hair-- I wear it curly, and if I dye it I go for something close to my natural color (which is a weird, decidedly mixed color) or darker. If I'm feeling really ambitious, I might twist the front up a bit... but twists or short cornrows, rather than just a straight, swoopy style. I don't know, it's difficult to explain but the effect is very different and I look much less white that way.









Oh yes-- I voted, too.







:


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## JeDeeLenae

I voted!! I woke up 3 hours earlier than normal without any type of alarm! There was no line, just walked in and voted. Too bad my DH can't make it to vote today. Who schedules Dish Network installs for today?!?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
While I have occasionally been told that I "act white," the more common statement is that people thought I *was* white.







: What's most unbearable to me about it is the way that they inevitably think that they're giving me a compliment-- like I was trying to pass and succeeded admirably.







:









I guess that's something else that I look for in groups of WoC-- people who understand why such a notion is offensive to me, and who will "assume" that I'm not white when I enter the room. I mean I've been doing a better job of looking mixed since I've been conscious of the issue, but there are still days when I really "look" white and I get really tired of the "you pass well" comments.









My DH thought I was white before meeting me in person. I was the dispatcher for the company and lived in a different city. He finally asked me because he said he just couldn't tell.


----------



## xochimama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Btw . . . about names. How did you come by your username here on MDC? Was it thoughtful? Does it have a meaning? Was the name you really wanted already taken?









I am so uncreative when it comes to user names! My daughter's middle name is Xochitl (means _flower_ in Nahuatl), hence xochimama.


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## nnaemeka

peace ladies:

how's everyone doin?

this thread does move fast!

i just wanted to chime in:

i voted today too. i actually paused and considered voting for Cynthia McKinney and Rosa Clemente. have any of you heard of them? they're running on the Green Party ticket and are really progressive and would if ever possible transform this country if elected. Cynthia McKinney is a Black woman politician who was congresswoman reppin Georgia who famously after 911 did NOT support the invasion of Afghanistan or Iraq. Rosa Clemente is a self identified Afro-Latino and i know her from grassroots organizing in NY. powerful women, not corporately sponsered...really committed to CHANGE...i'm so ready for a real 3rd party in this country ...

but then i realized i'm in VA so i better vote for Obama cause if McCain.....







.

my user name comes from Obioma Nnaemeka a Nigerian scholar of gender studies and literature that i admire very much. i briefly considered naming my daughter Nnaemeka round time i signed up here, i love the spelling and i'm pretty sure its pronounced like "nya-mecca".

anyway,why is my baby awake and just staring at me at 11pm?!!!?
time for the bubby...good night!


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## splendid

I have read up and really really liked what the green party had to say. I wish when it came to elections people would think outside of the 2 party system. The continuing "if I vote for them, I'm throwing away my vote" is what continues the same old same old. But I left a place where we had a different electoral system.

Let me be one of the first to say, so begins a new chapter.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace ladies:

how's everyone doin?

this thread does move fast!

i just wanted to chime in:

i voted today too. i actually paused and considered voting for Cynthia McKinney and Rosa Clemente. have any of you heard of them? they're running on the Green Party ticket and are really progressive and would if ever possible transform this country if elected. Cynthia McKinney is a Black woman politician who was congresswoman reppin Georgia who famously after 911 did NOT support the invasion of Afghanistan or Iraq. Rosa Clemente is a self identified Afro-Latino and i know her from grassroots organizing in NY. powerful women, not corporately sponsered...really committed to CHANGE...i'm so ready for a real 3rd party in this country ...


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## jeca

OBAMA BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes I voted and yes he won!!! woo hoo







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## JustKiya

Yes! Yes! Yes!







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## jeca

Wow, some of the people are really freaking out. Crying and talking about moving to Canada, crazy.
I woke up this morning without a voice for no reason at all. I saw it as a sign.







:


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## splendid

But Canada is the socialist debil they think the US would be turning into?

On side I'm a peeved at the results me we are over racism. Really? I think Obama put forth an honest and truthful campaign. He gave promise when there was none. But, his election is not the pass everyone is making it out to be.

But this is a conversation for another day.

To a new era.


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## rootzdawta

Nnaemeka, it's pronounced En-nah-ay-may-kah and it means "The Father has done it".

We're listening to all the excitement on the radio. Man, some of these radio personalities are doing all they can to not scream "Damn it! I can't believe that N***** won!"


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## AndrewsMother

:







:







:







: Barack Obama, our president elect!







:







:







:







:



nnaemeka said:


> i voted today too. i actually paused and considered voting for Cynthia McKinney and Rosa Clemente. have any of you heard of them? they're running on the Green Party ticket and are really progressive and would if ever possible transform this country if elected. Cynthia McKinney is a Black woman politician who was congresswoman reppin Georgia who famously after 911 did NOT support the invasion of Afghanistan or Iraq. QUOTE]
> 
> As a true Georgia girl, I would never vote for Cynthia McKinney based upon her actions after 911, her uncomely behavior with Capitol police in 2006 and simple oversights of Georgia Law during elections in which she was on the ballot.


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## JeDeeLenae

For the first time, I looked at my kids and thought, "yep, you could be President" and really felt that way.


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## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Nnaemeka, it's pronounced En-nah-ay-may-kah and it means "The Father has done it".

We're listening to all the excitement on the radio. Man, some of these radio personalities are doing all they can to not scream "Damn it! I can't believe that N***** won!"

thanks for the info on the name. its really a beautiful sound.

so now, i'm up just thinking (and pumping). . . wow Obama....my friends and family in Haiti called... this is really a global thing...amazing....i'm just trying to keep my cynical thoughts at bay.

i still dig McKinney but i know i felt the same way about Hillary Clinton after living in NYC.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
For the first time, I looked at my kids and thought, "yep, you could be President" and really felt that way.

I can tell me son, the he too can one day be president, and know that I am not lying.


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## Draupadi

Good morning?







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There was much celebration on the streets of NY last night, and lots of tears in this house.
We had friends over to watch the returns. We watched CNN for most of the evening and when we turned it to the Comedy Central and Jon Stewart said, "Barack Obama is now the President of the United States!", my knees buckled under me and I fell to the ground!
I am just awestruck!
It felt so wonderful to see that gorgeous family walk on that stage!


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## purplegirl

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I AM SO HAPPY THIS MORNING! I was up late hanging with a friend on the phone. It was so worth it!








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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Good morning?







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:
There was much celebration on the streets of NY last night, and lots of tears in this house.
We had friends over to watch the returns. We watched CNN for most of the evening and when we turned it to the Comedy Central and Jon Stewart said, "Barack Obama is now the President of the United States!", my knees buckled under me and I fell to the ground!
I am just awestruck!
*It felt so wonderful to see that gorgeous family walk on that stage*!


I am still emotional. They are gorgeous. Those girls


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## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends!

I know it has been a while since I have posted here, but I just had to come here and say, Yes We Did!
I am so amazed at the power of a positive national candidate and campaign!
I don't have much time this morning to post much more, but I wanted to share a quote that a good friend sent to me this morning:

Rosa sat;
so Martin could walk;
so Obama could run;
so our children can fly.

Have a great day everyone!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


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## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hello Sisterfriends!

Rosa sat;
so Martin could walk;
so Obama could run;
so our children can fly.

COLOR][/B]

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

Beautiful!

I have thought of you often.


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## shayinme

:







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:

I'm still tearing up, this is an amazing day.


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## jeca

I actually told my son that he was next. I feel that the path has truly been open for my kids now and I can say that with all open honestly.
And my voice is back(mostly) go figure.


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## Bloomingstar

:







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:

oh wow. There was definitely celebrating in Brooklyn last night but of course, where I live, that somehow meant sirens and helicopters--I have NO CLUE what was going on outside though.

I just called my 90 year old grandmother to see if she'd heard the news yet. She was born in 1918 in Louisiana, picked cotton, is the oldest of 16 children and one of two still living. Her health is not good and she has to have round the clock home health care--talking to her on the phone is kinda heartbreaking now, I always tear up. But she has a memory better than most 20-somethings I know and is completely lucid all the time. But when I told her Obama won, she said "Oh cool! I was really hoping he would!" I could hear her smiling.

I called my parents last night, who'd both grown up in Jim Crow Louisiana (long after it'd been outlawed, of course--me dad desegregated his high school in 1964, for example) and they were just so happy.

I know this is not the end of all racism and all that but I'm really glad that so many older people in my life who went through so much get to see this.

And me too!







: and my baby, when s/he gets here!









And YES, people started calling us from Trinidad and Tobago pretty quickly. My MIL called at 6:15 this morning (the whole family is up with the sun, I don't get it but I accept it







: --luckily I was up getting a snack--and she was pretty excited too.


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## Bloomingstar

where did everybody go?


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
where did everybody go?









I am right here.







:
Is anyone feeling like they are riding an emotional wave? I'm overjoyed, concerned, angry about some nasty comments I heard today from McCain supporters (IRL).


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## shayinme

Girl, we are too tired from staying up all night. I feel like I have a hungover and I haven't had a drink, but I couldn't even sleep.







:


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## JeDeeLenae

I'm here. I was over on diaperswappers and there are people that are so upset about this. They truly feel the US is going down... way down... because he is President. The fear is outrageous. And now the same people who were saying "race has nothing to do with it" are saying "I wish people wouldn't have voted for him because he was young, Black, and cool." Someone implied that because 94% of Black people voted for him and it couldn't have been more than because he was Black. Seriously, people are showing a side of themselves that I wish I'd never seen.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I'm here. I was over on diaperswappers and there are people that are so upset about this. They truly feel the US is going down... way down... because he is President. The fear is outrageous. And now the same people who were saying "race has nothing to do with it" are saying "I wish people wouldn't have voted for him because he was young, Black, and cool." Someone implied that because 94% of Black people voted for him and it couldn't have been more than because he was Black. Seriously, people are showing a side of themselves that I wish I'd never seen.


I was in a local store today. The guy in front of me was a middle aged white man. He turned to the cashier, who was a young white guy, and said 'it's a sad day in America'. To which cashier replied, I feel sorry for you; today is the beginning of something new and refreshing! I gave the guy a high five. Lots of folks have this baseless fear that I can only believe has to do with Obama being black--different.


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## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I was in a local store today. The guy in front of me was a middle aged white man. He turned to the cashier, who was a young white guy, and said 'it's a sad day in America'. To which cashier replied, I feel sorry for you; today is the beginning of something new and refreshing! I gave the guy a high five. Lots of folks have this baseless fear that I can only believe has to do with Obama being black--different.

My mom feels the same way.


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## Sugarshoc

I was home all day today with my little baby catching up on sleep. At times when I was awake, I found myself crying all day from being completely overjoyed. As I type this, I'm feeling like crying again. We are soooo blessed to experience this and I am sooooo grateful to be a part of this transformative moment. We will spend the rest of our lives talking about the many levels this beautiful 44th president, President Barack Obama, has climbed. Our ancestors did not die in vain. On my wall in my house, we have a picture to hang of this leader. I am so proud. I am bursting. I have something even more special to teach my daughter, that the sky truly is the limit. It is a new day!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I'm here. I was over on diaperswappers and there are people that are so upset about this. They truly feel the US is going down... way down... because he is President. The fear is outrageous. And now the same people who were saying "race has nothing to do with it" are saying "I wish people wouldn't have voted for him because he was young, Black, and cool." Someone implied that because 94% of Black people voted for him and it couldn't have been more than because he was Black. Seriously, people are showing a side of themselves that I wish I'd never seen.

Sadly I have seen these sentiments in many Mama blogs I visit







, the reasons people are scared don't even seem rooted in reality, just fear.

Ok, my feet are almost back to earth today, the shock has almost worn off.

Shay


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## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I'm here. I was over on diaperswappers and there are people that are so upset about this. They truly feel the US is going down... way down... because he is President. The fear is outrageous. And now the same people who were saying "race has nothing to do with it" are saying "I wish people wouldn't have voted for him because he was young, Black, and cool." Someone implied that because 94% of Black people voted for him and it couldn't have been more than because he was Black. Seriously, people are showing a side of themselves that I wish I'd never seen.

This is a problem I encountered yesterday as well. This was a local homeschool list which hurts even more because these are women who I have met with in the past. And women I will probably see again







. But it is okay...they aren't talking about me. I'm "different", its just all those other people who voted because of race...


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I'm here. I was over on diaperswappers and there are people that are so upset about this. They truly feel the US is going down... way down... *because he is President*. The fear is outrageous. And now the same people who were saying "race has nothing to do with it" are saying "I wish people wouldn't have voted for him because he was young, Black, and cool." Someone implied that because 94% of Black people voted for him and it couldn't have been more than because he was Black. Seriously, people are showing a side of themselves that I wish I'd never seen.

Maybe I should insert the







: smiley right here.

I don't share in the euphoria. In fact, I'm hardly excited that Obama is now president. In my real life, I am hardly sharing that with anyone for fear of getting beat up. Literally.

The main reason why is that I don't think that the mindset of White America has really changed at all. I know it hasn't. Comments like the one you posted show me that clearly. I think folks of color just outnumber the racists in this country.

How can you even get it together in your mind to say that the country is going down _because_ Obama is president? Will racism keep you from even acknowledging that it has been going way down long before Obama put in his hat?

So, try as I might, I haven't been able to get excited. I'm so skeptical and worried.

But it's not that I'm not happy and I wish I could get folks around me to understand that. I can't wait to get a poster of the presidents and there, #44, is a Black face. I recognize how huge that is. How historic. But I'm still very very worried. And maybe it's just my personality--the worry is not allowing me to be euphoric.


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## eilonwy

I don't want to worry at this point. I overthink things in general, and much of my life blows chunks. If I think too hard about any of it, I'll end up curling up under a blanket and trying to sleep for the rest of my life. Therefore any worries I have must remain on the surface, and any joys must be thoroughly embraced. YAY OBAMA! It's a great day for America, and not just because he's a black man (though I'll freely concede that it doesn't hurt!) but because _the better candidate actually won._ It's a great day for democracy. I now have a tiny candle-flicker of faith in the system once again. We've demonstrated that it can work-- Obama didn't just win, he won by a LANDSLIDE. The better man won, and America has hope again. I'm absolutely stoked.







:


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## Bloomingstar

:

I figured everyone was nearly passed out from exhaustion from lack of sleep (or a hangover--most of my friends were suffering from one or the other yesterday, and so was I







)

I have been somewhat happily insulated from a lot of that--I guess I just don't talk to a lot of people! I have 3 co-workers and I work at a social justice organization so everyone was pretty damned excited. But out of the 4 of us, I am the only Black woman and I think it definitely has a different meaning for me than for them. My sister wrote a blog about feeling that night the same way she did when Katrina happened (we're from new orleans): completely numb with disbelief. Strangely enough, that was what I felt right at the moment too. But I'm still also moving through it all.

After he won and gave his acceptance speech, I was watching like ok please get off the stage before I have a heart attack!

Rootzdawta, I feel you, but I also agree with Rynna--if I really spend too much time in that place of worry and fear about ALL of the problems, I might just get in bed and try to sleep forever too







So I have to stay in the place of seeing the good


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## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Maybe I should insert the







: smiley right here.

I don't share in the euphoria. In fact, I'm hardly excited that Obama is now president. In my real life, I am hardly sharing that with anyone for fear of getting beat up. Literally.

*The main reason why is that I don't think that the mindset of White America has really changed at all. I know it hasn't.* Comments like the one you posted show me that clearly. I think folks of color just outnumber the racists in this country.

How can you even get it together in your mind to say that the country is going down _because_ Obama is president? Will racism keep you from even acknowledging that it has been going way down long before Obama put in his hat?

So, try as I might, I haven't been able to get excited. I'm so skeptical and worried.

But it's not that I'm not happy and I wish I could get folks around me to understand that. I can't wait to get a poster of the presidents and there, #44, is a Black face. I recognize how huge that is. How historic. But I'm still very very worried. And maybe it's just my personality--the worry is not allowing me to be euphoric.

Me. Too. Oh my gods, so me too! The only reason I'm excited is because his election - to me - indicates that a majority of Americans voted that we at least TRY something - different. Something new. Something we ain't done before - and that goes beyond his color, into his message, and his demands that WE be part of the process.

I've been saying it everywhere - a LOT of racists voted for Obama - please don't get it twisted that him being elected has suddenly ushered a new sunny world of race relations into this country.

Well, maybe it has. But it's going to be preceded by a LOT of people letting all of their racism hang out, and maybe that's what we *really* need. Maybe that's going to be how the transformation will happen - with people actually vocalizing their fear/racism, and having other people who *look like them* challenging them and (sweet jesu!) maybe even making them think a little.

And maybe, just maybe, black people will start to examine and challenge themselves, as well. Maybe, trying to be smart and getting an education and not getting caught up in the madness that is 'black cool' will be considered 'trying to be like Barack' instead of 'trying to be white'.

Who knows.

Really, his election gives me a wee bit of hope, and for my cynical self, that's saying a lot. Little bubbles of hope, that if sustained and encouraged by stuff actually changing, will transform into some sorta joy.


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
And maybe, just maybe, black people will start to examine and challenge themselves, as well. Maybe, trying to be smart and getting an education and not getting caught up in the madness that is 'black cool' will be considered 'trying to be like Barack' instead of 'trying to be white'.

This is something that I'd really like to see. "Black cool" has meant not bothering with higher education because, "It won't really make a difference anyway." Black children have grown up believing, *knowing*, that they'd never really do anything important, they'd never really be able to be president... and now they know differently. YES WE CAN! Sweet. No, it's not the end of racism in America but it is, I hope, the beginning of the end of black self-hatred in this country.


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## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
This is something that I'd really like to see. "Black cool" has meant not bothering with higher education because, "It won't really make a difference anyway." Black children have grown up believing, *knowing*, that they'd never really do anything important, they'd never really be able to be president... and now they know differently. YES WE CAN! Sweet. No, it's not the end of racism in America but it is, I hope, the beginning of the end of black self-hatred in this country.

yeah, i feel ya. the psychological impact of this on the Black psyche worldwide will be great, i'm sure. a gorgeous Black family in the White House, amazing. i hope my daughter will be empowered by seeing Michelle and her daughters being regarded as confident, smart and beautiful.

but politically this still imperialist/capitalist/racist America. and now we've got a Black man representing it...ironic... perhaps brilliant?

so i'm feeling quite ambivalent, the tears of joy have dried up. and i still haven't found a space to really express my thoughts---even amongst some friends who are busy screaming yes, we did! i'm happy he won, absolutely but, many Black folks i feel are thinking myopically and somewhat superficially---what about the rest of the world where Black folks continue to bear the ugly brunt of Western domination? can folks in the Congo really breathe a sigh of relief because of Obama? what about women and children in Dafur? what about the political prisoners still in jail in _this_ country? what about the people getting tortured in Guantanamo? what about the "corporatization" of everything!????!! hmmmmm...the world goes round and round.

i'll leave it at that cause isn't the spot to set down my political soapbox







----i know i'm waaaaay left of center and i'm not seeking to convert y'all just speaking my truth and i hope that's okay.

anyway, there's a post-election discussion tonight at school sponsored by the Black studies institute, i hope to check it out. i can say this: this election has inspired me to put my activist shoes back on, i've been so disempowered by the sick apathy and violence of the Bush years. i just settled in domestically and haven't really been active in years. but now, i'm down for working to make sure that the change in the air is real and felt in our communities worldwide! MLK and Ella Baker did the work outside of the system y'all...so back to the grassroots meetings, with baby on hip!

p.s. have you ladies seen the film "life & debt?" and/or "500 years later"? definitely worth watching.


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## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 

but politically this still imperialist/capitalist/racist America. and now we've got a Black man representing it...ironic... perhaps brilliant?

so i'm feeling quite ambivalent, the tears of joy have dried up. and i still haven't found a space to really express my thoughts---even amongst some friends who are busy screaming yes, we did! i'm happy he won, absolutely but, many Black folks i feel are thinking myopically and somewhat superficially---what about the rest of the world where Black folks continue to bear the ugly brunt of Western domination? can folks in the Congo really breathe a sigh of relief because of Obama? what about women and children in Dafur? what about the political prisoners still in jail in _this_ country? what about the people getting tortured in Guantanamo? what about the "corporatization" of everything!????!! hmmmmm...the world goes round and round.

i'll leave it at that cause isn't the spot to set down my political soapbox







----i know i'm waaaaay left of center and i'm not seeking to convert y'all just speaking my truth and i hope that's okay.










:

I'm right there with you.


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## rootzdawta

Me too!

I have watched Life & Debt--a few times. I highly recommend it to everyone.

I'd like to check out the other title.


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## JustKiya

I'll have to check out Life&Debt and 500 Years later - I assume they are available online?

And have ya'll seen this: http://www.change.gov/ (Office of the President-Elect)

Interesting stuff there. I'm very curious as to where all the money is coming from, though.

We shall see.


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## jeca

My entire post got eaten. But basically this..
I look at it this way. Even if every capable black person voted for him it wouldn't be enough. Throw in the other minority votes and still not enough. For him to have taken such a commanding lead we had to have a large number of white votes without which a win wouldn't have been possible. For every time you hear the negative think of those that stood and voted beside us. So yes, while the mindset of white america as a whole may not have changed it certainly is changing.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
My entire post got eaten. But basically this..
I look at it this way. Even if every capable black person voted for him it wouldn't be enough. Throw in the other minority votes and still not enough. For him to have taken such a commanding lead we had to have a large number of white votes without which a win wouldn't have been possible. For every time you hear the negative think of those that stood and voted beside us. So yes, while the mindset of white america as a whole may not have changed it certainly is changing.

I agree with you 100%. Heck, I live in Maine this is the 2nd whitest state in the country, yet Maine and all of New England voted for Obama. So while I still have my moments of ok, what next, I do believe there are some folks out there who are interested in shaking things up.

Speaking of shaking things, had my first encounter with someone who was less than happy about his win







. It was someone on my local AP board whp basically feels he is a baby killer and long story short the conversation went nasty real fast. Ugh...

Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

I'm wondering . . .

Do you think people voted for Obama or against McCain? There's subtle shade of difference that I think is important.

I didn't necessarily support Obama throughout the election but I knew inside me that he would have to take office. That the only way the Repubs could stay in the White House would be to steal it. Because the times are hard. And people were ready for something new. Do you think they voted for "something new who happened to have a Black face"?


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## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm wondering . . .

Do you think people voted for Obama or against McCain? There's subtle shade of difference that I think is important.

I didn't necessarily support Obama throughout the election but I knew inside me that he would have to take office. That the only way the Repubs could stay in the White House would be to steal it. Because the times are hard. And people were ready for something new. Do you think they voted for "something new who happened to have a Black face"?

I think a lot of people voted for something different. Someone that may not have fully been in line with their views, but overall they felt would do the better job. I was excited that he won, because I voted for him and his policies. Him being Black was just a bonus.


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## eilonwy

Honestly, I think it was the other way around-- people voted against Obama rather than for McCain. One of my Facebook friends (a parent from Bean's school) posted a note about how, despite the fact that she'd have a bad taste in her mouth and tears in her eyes while she did it, she'd be voting for McCain because... well, basically because Obama was a baby killer. I have another friend who voted for McCain because "Obama is a socialist." I can think of many others who didn't like McCain at all, or who LOATHED Sarah Palin, and voted for him anyway because they didnt' want Obama to win. I think that the overwhelming majority if folks who voted for Obama voted FOR him, rather than against McCain, but the opposite appears to be true amongst those who voted Republican.


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## purplegirl

I have the same mixed feelings. Yesterday, I was an emotional wreck. I went from elation to disbelief to fear. I think his win means something, but conclusions are hard to figure out. Actually, I'm not totally sure it can be thoroughly analyzed yet. In part, I think he has mass appeal because he is intelligent, charismatic and fresh. On the other hand, I also agree that a lot of racists people voted for him because they, too are suffering from the ill effects of the Bush regime. However, did you note the 'world' reaction? That was most touching IMO. But I'm not sure what it means either. Is the world tired of the imperialistic ways of this country and looking to Barack to be more of egalitarian leader?
I've heard sentiments that have been pure evil. I have learned to keep my mouth shut because I am way too emotional about this.

Bloomingstar, I had the same funny feeling in my tummy when he was giving his speech. Yes! Yes! yes!, now get off the stage now, please.


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## AndrewsMother

While I do believe that the best man won, I will still hold my breath. I live, worked for a short time, shop, eat, send my son to school, and basically exist is BushLand. George Bush senior lives less than one mile from our apartment, so Obama supporters are a rarity. When I stepped into a store or a restaurant before November 4, I was mildly aware that I or we were the only blacks in the room. Now, I truly feel as if I have interrupted a Klan gathering.

Entering Starbucks, and visiting the dentist the day after the election left me with chills from the icy stares that I encountered. Perhaps I am blaming normally sour expressions on Obama's victory, but I can't believe that every white American who glowers at my son does so because they are just have a temporariily bad day. My beautiful, bubbly son is admired by white Americans if no one else. So why now is he stared at with contempt and anger?

Since I was old enough to know the difference between white and black I have felt the division and experienced the face of injustice. I am not naive to the fact, though I have tried my best to radiate into the world the type of treatment that I want to receive (I refuse to even accept mild revers racisim), but I am fearful that the hearts of too many are still frozen to true racial change and acceptance. Bush was given a 2nd chance, another term but Barack will truly have to be better than the rest, as blacks who want to be taken seriously in the country have always had to do, for history to record that he was even an okay president.

I have faith in Barack that he will work to unite this country, but I don't have faith that this country as a whole will try to meet him half way.

My husband laughs at me, but I know that in that graveyard in Detroit, some old racist is digging up the N word and breathing life into it right now. No, it never truly went away, but the word will soon make a fierce public comeback.

~ these are just my late night thoughts

Purplegirl & Bloomingstar....I felt the exact same way.


----------



## Heathen Mama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
the psychological impact of this on the Black psyche worldwide will be great, i'm sure. but now, i'm down for working to make sure that the change in the air is real and felt in our communities worldwide! MLK and Ella Baker did the work outside of the system y'all...

I wanted to be an activist, but I was so completely discouraged because of the 2000 elections I completely changed career paths... There was more education I needed and I chose not to enroll in the necessary schooling- what was the use? I have been DEEPLY lost careerwise- it's funny now, but it wasn't far off from, "Well I'm a be a ventriloquist then!"

So having the baby this year made me reassess- I need to be able to model for him that following his passions and staying true to himself is the only compass he needs to follow. AND NOW THIS!!!!!







:







:

I was trying to explain to DH how profoundly the Obama win affected me- I'm thinking of enrolling in the classes I need, I'm thinking of going back to the career I abandoned. (So _that's_ why I maintained all those contacts and sometimes temp at the agency I want to go back to!) And he does.not.get.it. Not one little bit. He was like "So now since Obama's president you think that means something to you somehow?" I was crushed. I still feel the same way about picking up my dashed dreams and breathing life into them, but my hubby so deeply disappointed me. I can't even talk to him about it and it's hurtful to me that I do believe this is an issue of race that divides us. DH is Caucasian, and he didn't want to vote Obama 'cause of his "inexperience" but hates the Bush status quo and the continuation that McCain would have been.

He came back to me later with some BS about "Well if you think Obama being in office is enough to make you feel... um... the way you... say you do... um... well... um... Good. That's nice. I like it when you're happy."

I can't even explain it. Guess I just needed to vent.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
I was trying to explain to DH how profoundly the Obama win affected me- I'm thinking of enrolling in the classes I need, I'm thinking of going back to the career I abandoned. (So _that's_ why I maintained all those contacts and sometimes temp at the agency I want to go back to!) And he does.not.get.it. Not one little bit. He was like "So now since Obama's president you think that means something to you somehow?" I was crushed. I still feel the same way about picking up my dashed dreams and breathing life into them, but my hubby so deeply disappointed me. I can't even talk to him about it and it's hurtful to me that I do believe this is an issue of race that divides us. DH is Caucasian, and he didn't want to vote Obama 'cause of his "inexperience" but hates the Bush status quo and the continuation that McCain would have been.

He came back to me later with some BS about "Well if you think Obama being in office is enough to make you feel... um... the way you... say you do... um... well... um... Good. That's nice. I like it when you're happy."

I can't even explain it. Guess I just needed to vent.

Reading what you wrote shocked me, I am married to a white man, have been for 11 years and he totally understood what this means as far as me personally and our kids. If I may ask do you and your dh talk race in general?

If nothing else he should be getting this because of your child, I'm sorry that your partner is not able to support you at this time.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
I wanted to be an activist, but I was so completely discouraged because of the 2000 elections I completely changed career paths... There was more education I needed and I chose not to enroll in the necessary schooling- what was the use? I have been DEEPLY lost careerwise- it's funny now, but it wasn't far off from, "Well I'm a be a ventriloquist then!"

So having the baby this year made me reassess- I need to be able to model for him that following his passions and staying true to himself is the only compass he needs to follow. AND NOW THIS!!!!!







:







:

I was trying to explain to DH how profoundly the Obama win affected me- I'm thinking of enrolling in the classes I need, I'm thinking of going back to the career I abandoned. (So _that's_ why I maintained all those contacts and sometimes temp at the agency I want to go back to!) And he does.not.get.it. Not one little bit. He was like "So now since Obama's president you think that means something to you somehow?" I was crushed. I still feel the same way about picking up my dashed dreams and breathing life into them, but my hubby so deeply disappointed me. I can't even talk to him about it and it's hurtful to me that I do believe this is an issue of race that divides us. DH is Caucasian, and he didn't want to vote Obama 'cause of his "inexperience" but hates the Bush status quo and the continuation that McCain would have been.

He came back to me later with some BS about "Well if you think Obama being in office is enough to make you feel... um... the way you... say you do... um... well... um... Good. That's nice. I like it when you're happy."

I can't even explain it. Guess I just needed to vent.

Perhaps your husbands thinks that you have transcended your blackness because you married outside of your race? Maybe he thought that the struggles of your race were no longer yours? Perhaps in his mind Barack is a symbol for only oppressed Black Americans: those with limited incomes, limited education and limited everything else.

Have you told your husband how you truly feel? Does your husband believe that because his children are the product of two races that they might never identify with one race over the other, that they pain of racism will never be theirs?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
If nothing else he should be getting this because of your child, I'm sorry that your partner is not able to support you at this time.

Me too . . .


----------



## Heathen Mama

DH is confounding me on this one... Our son looks like a little white boy- not even a tan little white boy. He got NONE of my color at all. DH asked me "What color is DS?" and I explained that any baby I bear is and will always be Black. And he said, "But DS *IS* white... Look at him!"

I totally didn't get that we would have these issues- we talked race. We talked culture. I didn't know that DH does not "get" it. And I'm mourning that.

But yeah- this Obama thing upsets me. I am seriously empowered and vindicated in his victory, and DH could care less. I'm supposed to be the master of my own destiny, and if I changed jobs and now want to go back, it's all on me- I can't be inspired by anyone else to do it. I'm so hurt. I can't even express it.









Total Off topic- does it tick anyone else off that Mothering spell check STILL doesn't get Obama is not a typo?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
DH is confounding me on this one... Our son looks like a little white boy- not even a tan little white boy. He got NONE of my color at all. DH asked me "What color is DS?" and I explained that any baby I bear is and will always be Black. And he said, "But DS *IS* white... Look at him!"

I totally didn't get that we would have these issues- we talked race. We talked culture. I didn't know that DH does not "get" it. And I'm mourning that.

But yeah- this Obama thing upsets me. I am seriously empowered and vindicated in his victory, and DH could care less. I'm supposed to be the master of my own destiny, and if I changed jobs and now want to go back, it's all on me- I can't be inspired by anyone else to do it. I'm so hurt. I can't even express it.









Total Off topic- does it tick anyone else off that Mothering spell check STILL doesn't get Obama is not a typo?









My ex-husband (who was also white) was like your dh, when our son was born, he was really pale, so much so that I was often assumed to be the nanny.







: My ex hated talking race, thought it didn't matter and that us being together was proof that things had changed and this was back in 92-93

Anyway race was one of many hurdles we faced that lead to the demise of the relationship, I swore if I ever got with another white man he had to be able to talk openly about race.

Honestly, you are in a hard place, do you have some real life support? I think its critical to have a safe space to talk race especially during these times.

Another thing, I don't know how old your son is but sometimes babies/toddlers darken up, my son did, no one would ever say he is a full Black man but he is dark enough that you know he is biracial. My son also self-identifies as Black because at almost 17 he understands that the same societal privileges that extend to his white father do not extend to him.

I have always been upfront about race, heck we talk about it alot here on the other hand being a Black woman is part of my identity.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
DH is confounding me on this one... Our son looks like a little white boy- not even a tan little white boy. He got NONE of my color at all. DH asked me "What color is DS?" and I explained that any baby I bear is and will always be Black. And he said, "But DS *IS* white... Look at him!"

I totally didn't get that we would have these issues- we talked race. We talked culture. I didn't know that DH does not "get" it. And I'm mourning that.

But yeah- this Obama thing upsets me. I am seriously empowered and vindicated in his victory, and DH could care less. I'm supposed to be the master of my own destiny, and if I changed jobs and now want to go back, it's all on me- I can't be inspired by anyone else to do it. I'm so hurt. I can't even express it.









Total Off topic- does it tick anyone else off that Mothering spell check STILL doesn't get Obama is not a typo?

Heh. My kids are pretty white looking too. Interestingly the blue eyed one with the lightest hair looks "blackest" of any of my children.







In any case... I haven't discussed the racial impact of Obama's election with Mike. It just hasn't come up yet.







I think I'd be upset if he didn't "get it," though. After all the time and energy I've spent beating it all into him, he ought to understand!


----------



## Bloomingstar

:

my baby turned!







I'll be 33 weeks on Monday and so far, everything is great! baby finally turned head down and will most likely stay there. whew!

Found out this morning that we have to move--like now. Our building is all condos, some of the owners live there, some rent. Ours is a rental, went into foreclosure, we thought about buying it but changed our minds and so have to move by Jan 1 or thereabouts, which to me means Dec. 1 because baby is due Dec. 29th and I have no interest in moving with a newborn...sigh. But we need more space so I am looking forward to it, though it'll be a crazy 3 weeks ahead!


----------



## Heathen Mama

One the one hand, I'm tempted to say, It's not that bad... but on *this one issue*, it is.

We also have a MAJOR age difference- think Katie Lee Joel and Billy. I guess him being an egalitarian, hippy-lover-of-all, doesn't fix my hurt.

I just feel so POWERFUL and CAPABLE and INSPIRED. I just can't stand not being able to share in that.


----------



## jeca

A late







and







to Heathen Mama.
My parents sent me $100 for my birthday and I am trying very hard to buy myself something and not spend it on the kids.







Maybe I will just tuck it into my E.F for a bad day.
I'm going to ask this question here because I would like a more intimate answer than the whole board. We have been following Dave Ramsey for a bit now and on the whole I have done okay not great but okay. I have paid off at least one of Dh's cards. I always buy Xmas credit card free and have not used our credit cards since starting the program but I admit that we still have a way to go with our debt, not too bad but it's definitely still there. Okay that said. There is something that I want. Not a need but a want I admit. We can put it on layaway for 120 days which will have it off right around the time of our Anniversary. It's pretty expensive admittedly and pure fluff. If we put it on layaway though it won't hurt us financially. But thats a good chunk of change that can of course go towards paying off some of our debt which I guess is what makes me feel a bit bad about even considering it. I don't know what I'm asking. I guess I need someone to say either "you know better and should put it towards paying off your debt sooner" or "it's okay if it's not going to hurt your budget go for it" or" that really depends on what it is and exactly how much your talking about".







: so lay it on me.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
A late







and







to Heathen Mama.
My parents sent me $100 for my birthday and I am trying very hard to buy myself something and not spend it on the kids.







Maybe I will just tuck it into my E.F for a bad day.
I'm going to ask this question here because I would like a more intimate answer than the whole board. We have been following Dave Ramsey for a bit now and on the whole I have done okay not great but okay. I have paid off at least one of Dh's cards. I always buy Xmas credit card free and have not used our credit cards since starting the program but I admit that we still have a way to go with our debt, not too bad but it's definitely still there. Okay that said. There is something that I want. Not a need but a want I admit. We can put it on layaway for 120 days which will have it off right around the time of our Anniversary. It's pretty expensive admittedly and pure fluff. If we put it on layaway though it won't hurt us financially. But thats a good chunk of change that can of course go towards paying off some of our debt which I guess is what makes me feel a bit bad about even considering it. I don't know what I'm asking. I guess I need someone to say either "you know better and should put it towards paying off your debt sooner" or "it's okay if it's not going to hurt your budget go for it" or" that really depends on what it is and exactly how much your talking about".







: so lay it on me.

As of this week we are beans and ricing it because of Dave Ramsey. Literally.
I want a new computer, and I just purchased a new notebook in February, so we will probably have to remove beans from our diet for a few weeks to compensate for the loss of money.

I would say buy what you want, tomorrow is not promised, BUT make cuts somewhere else, because tomorrow is looking rather bleak.

Happy Birthday Jeca!!!


----------



## Jannah6

*Heathen Mama* my DH is White too and I would never expect o hear things like this from him, and our main focus at home is religion not race. I think that you guys need to have a talk. The color of your child's skin doesn't determine his race. What happens if you have a child who is darker? Will your husband want to exclude himself from that child?
I'm curious, is your DH White American?


----------



## purplegirl

happy birthday jeca







:
posting on the run back later..........


----------



## nnaemeka

okay if being pro-choice makes Obama a babykiller, dropping bombs over Vietnam makes McCain a what??? a hero!! that's right, silly, this is america.

and, dang, Andrewsmama where do you live???? (be careful!)

wow, biracial white/black couples in America esp, it takes alot of honesty and tears to keep it real/healthy. some white folks want stay wrapped up in their privilege despite loving a person of color--seems so contradictory, but look at Thomas Jefferson! whatever the case, Heathen Mama, i'm glad you are feeling inspired again too. don't minimize your empowerment to make hubby feel "safe." but remember being strong and on purpose can be intimidating to our loved ones, no matter what color, change can seem disorienting.

who's Dave Ramsey and why do i get the feeling i don't wanna know







:

happy B-day jeca!! i say life is short, buy the special thing but be wise on the everyday vibes! enjoy!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
okay if being pro-choice makes Obama a babykiller, dropping bombs over Vietnam makes McCain a what??? a hero!! that's right, silly, this is america.

and, dang, Andrewsmama where do you live???? (be careful!)

wow, biracial white/black couples in America esp, it takes alot of honesty and tears to keep it real/healthy. some white folks want stay wrapped up in their privilege despite loving a person of color--seems so contradictory, but look at Thomas Jefferson! whatever the case, Heathen Mama, i'm glad you are feeling inspired again too. don't minimize your empowerment to make hubby feel "safe." but remember being strong and on purpose can be intimidating to our loved ones, no matter what color, change can seem disorienting.

who's Dave Ramsey and why do i get the feeling i don't wanna know







:

happy B-day jeca!! i say life is short, buy the special thing but be wise on the everyday vibes! enjoy!

I live in Houston, TX near Post Oak/The Galleria.

Dave Ramsey is a financial guru with a tried and true get out of debt plan. Listen to him on the radio or check out your web page. He is not about getting rich, but being financially sound. Dave's plan works to eliminate debt so that you may increase your savings not live pay check to pay check like so many Americans.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
I was trying to explain to DH how profoundly the Obama win affected me- I'm thinking of enrolling in the classes I need, I'm thinking of going back to the career I abandoned. (So _that's_ why I maintained all those contacts and sometimes temp at the agency I want to go back to!) And he does.not.get.it. Not one little bit. He was like "So now since Obama's president you think that means something to you somehow?" I was crushed. I still feel the same way about picking up my dashed dreams and breathing life into them, but my hubby so deeply disappointed me. I can't even talk to him about it and it's hurtful to me that I do believe this is an issue of race that divides us. DH is Caucasian, and he didn't want to vote Obama 'cause of his "inexperience" but hates the Bush status quo and the continuation that McCain would have been.

He came back to me later with some BS about "Well if you think Obama being in office is enough to make you feel... um... the way you... say you do... um... well... um... Good. That's nice. I like it when you're happy."

I can't even explain it. Guess I just needed to vent.

Is it even remotely possible that this is not only about your DH being white but him being a "dude?" (Sorry, california word.) What I mean is - is your DH particularly aware of emotions on a regular basis and its just this emotion that illludes him. Or, is he a little slow on the uptake where emotions are concerned regularly?

My dh who is biracial (white and Hispanic), was almost as emotional as I was when we started to talk about how it would be for our Littlest only know a world where this was possible. But, that's how he is. His heart is huge. And even if he doesn't understand all my girl emotions he always understands that I have them.

And I too woke up the next day feeling like I can. do. better. And frankly, I was/am surprised that I felt that way. I have had opportunities and my family has made opportunites and we're doing OK. I can only imagine what it must be like for someone, anyone, that has had a _lifetime_ of struggle with the basics. My struggle with the basics was, thankfully, short lived.


----------



## eilonwy

Don't get me started on the pro-war anti-abortion folks. I just got done ranting about that on Facebok.









My teeth are bugging me today, and I've got a headache. I think I'm going to bed "early" tonight.


----------



## Draupadi

I'm also in an IR marriage (DH is Scottish/Assyrian).
We try to have honest discussions about race and made a point of doing so before we even got married. I'm fortunate in that DH "gets it". He understands white privelege and he also understands that he is a product of it. He did not question my tears on election night because he sort of understands how important and monumental the moment was for me. He shed tears, too. He worked really hard campaigning for Obama, listened to his Republican dad rant about "Hussein" and got temporarily "disowned" by his Uncle for adding the name "Hussein" to his Facebook profile.


----------



## rootzdawta

So I was reading my blogs last night and read this one called Michelle, Ditch the Baseball Cap. Now, I know I'm a bit old school but calling her "Michelle" annoyed me.








Anyway, When I first saw the image, my initial reaction was, "Why are you out like that Mrs. Obama?" And then on second thought I commented "I hope Mrs. Obama makes the role of first lady fit her and not the other way around. I hope she breaks down all expectations and standards and like Mrs. Roosevelt of past, makes substantial and real difference. She can do that in a baseball cap or in stilletos. I don't care."

I've been thinking about it in relationship to my teaching and realizing that (I don't know if I was making it up or if it was real) the days I went in to teach dressed professionally (business business), I think the students responded a lot better. But I was work. Now . . . is Mrs. Obama expected to be "at work" all the time because she's first lady? Is that a fair expectation?

(Not to change the subject guys . . . just thinking).


----------



## shayinme

Frankly I think the fact that Michelle Obama comes across as a real human is part of what makes her and Barack so fascinating to me. Who of us here has not jetted out to the store, etc with a cap or scarf on?

Let me get real, Michelle Obama is an accomplished woman in her own right and if the sista just wants to meet with the kids teachers in her real clothes, I see no problem with it. I feel like folks want to judge her according to white standards and that's just wrong IMO.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

I don't like the baseball hat at a parent teacher conference look. The President's wife should always look put together when out in public, she does have a standard to up hold.


----------



## rootzdawta

Just finished Octavia Butler's _Parable of the Sower_, ya'll.







:


----------



## eilonwy

I think it's interesting that most of us just accepted without question the notion that Barack Obama will have to do everything better than anyone else because he's black, but we balk at the idea of expecting Michelle Obama to do the same. I'm glad that they're human beings... but in all honesty just being black makes them seem more "real" to me than the middle-aged white folks who've held the position before. Having younger kids helps, too.







So... yeah, I think that Michelle Obama is going to have to look well constructed even for parent teacher conferences and trips to the grocery store. Business casual at the very least, unless she's at the gym-- in which case, she can look very well put together and maybe even a little sweaty.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm wondering . . .

Do you think people voted for Obama or against McCain? There's subtle shade of difference that I think is important.

I didn't necessarily support Obama throughout the election but I knew inside me that he would have to take office. That the only way the Repubs could stay in the White House would be to steal it. Because the times are hard. And people were ready for something new. Do you think they voted for "something new who happened to have a Black face"?

I'm one of those who voted against McCain. I wasn't going to vote in this election, but decided to the day of.


----------



## purplegirl

I have no problem at all seeing Michelle Obama dressed casually in a baseball cap. It makes her seem all the more familiar. That said, since she is now First Lady, she will be judged by everything she does--right or wrong. She'll have to be mindful of that.


----------



## jeca

I think it's cool she's not letting being the first lady ruin or change who she is as a person. I don't see anything wrong with what she's wearing especially considering what she is doing. It wasn't politic related so why the big fuss?
Anyway I came across this and thought it was interesting.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...-not-know.html

I decided not to get it. Yes I wanted it but it was pure fluff and not something I needed at all. It was an Effy Hematian necklace an original piece or so I was told. It suited me very very well shaped in a crescent diamond moon, oh am I drooling again? Seriously gorgeous piece but I made the right decision I guess.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Honestly, I think it was the other way around-- people voted against Obama rather than for McCain. One of my Facebook friends (a parent from Bean's school) posted a note about how, despite the fact that she'd have a bad taste in her mouth and tears in her eyes while she did it, she'd be voting for McCain because... well, basically because Obama was a baby killer. I have another friend who voted for McCain because "Obama is a socialist." I can think of many others who didn't like McCain at all, or who LOATHED Sarah Palin, and voted for him anyway because they didnt' want Obama to win. I think that the overwhelming majority if folks who voted for Obama voted FOR him, rather than against McCain, but the opposite appears to be true amongst those who voted Republican.

If Barack had not been in the race, I don't know which candidate would have earned my vote. I would have never voted for McCain, because of Sarah Palin.

So many of my non black friends back home voted not for McCain, but against Obama for a myriad of reasons, but mostly because Barack is a liberal.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Just finished Octavia Butler's _Parable of the Sower_, ya'll.







:

Love Octavia Butler! She is the only science fiction writer I read.

Next time you read it (and you will read it again) you'll get even MORE out of it.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think it's cool she's not letting being the first lady ruin or change who she is as a person. I don't see anything wrong with what she's wearing especially considering what she is doing. It wasn't politic related so why the big fuss?
Anyway I came across this and thought it was interesting.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...-not-know.html

I decided not to get it. Yes I wanted it but it was pure fluff and not something I needed at all. It was an Effy Hematian necklace an original piece or so I was told. It suited me very very well shaped in a crescent diamond moon, oh am I drooling again? Seriously gorgeous piece but I made the right decision I guess.

Thanks for sharing that article. It was interesting. So Santita Jackson is his daughter's godmother? I find that ironic given Jesse Jackson's crude remarks about Obama during the campaign.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Thanks for sharing that article. It was interesting. So Santita Jackson is his daughter's godmother? I find that ironic given Jesse Jackson's crude remarks about Obama during the campaign.

My husband believes that the Jesse Jackson fiasco was staged, but once I saw Jesse's tears at Grant Park on the night of the election I began to wonder if my DH was right. It was a great tactic to distance Barack from the radical civil rights reformers.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
My husband believes that the Jesse Jackson fiasco was staged, but once I saw Jesse's tears at Grant Park on the night of the election I began to wonder if my DH was right. It was a great tactic to distance Barack from the radical civil rights reformers.

I think he said it in a fit of jealousy.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think he said it in a fit of jealousy.

That was my initial thought, then I forgot about it until election night when I saw Jesse crying and DH made his remarks.

No matter what was said, I do believe that Mr Jackson is proud of Barack.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think he said it in a fit of jealousy.

I absolutely agree. I think his tears were those of a guilt ridden conscience!


----------



## Bloomingstar

:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I have no problem at all seeing Michelle Obama dressed casually in a baseball cap. It makes her seem all the more familiar. That said, since she is now First Lady, she will be judged by everything she does--right or wrong. She'll have to be mindful of that.









:
I don't care about her wearing a baseball cap. It makes her seem more human, IMO. It's just not that big a deal.
Now if she was wearing a rag on her head, I'd worry.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

hey ladies! My mom is visiting until the 18th, so I've been staying off the computer lately. I'm enjoying the visit, and wishing I could do more shopping, but some day.


----------



## purplegirl

Hey mamas. Just checking in. This has been a crazy week. I am having a birthday party on Saturday







: I decided to throw caution to the wind and celebrate another year of life! My actual bday is next Tuesday. If I remember, I'll take pictures and share them with yall.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I live in Houston, TX near Post Oak/The Galleria.

Dave Ramsey is a financial guru with a tried and true get out of debt plan. Listen to him on the radio or check out your web page. He is not about getting rich, but being financially sound. Dave's plan works to eliminate debt so that you may increase your savings not live pay check to pay check like so many Americans.

Could you share some more info on Dave Ramsey? We've been 'trying' to get out of debt for - what feels like freaking ever, and yet we aren't out, yet. I'm - somewhat reluctant to sign up and pay for it, esp. if it's just going to tell me the things that we are already doing - snowballing payments, limiting expenses, paying extra, etc, etc.









Basically, is he talking something new, or just budgeting better?


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey mamas. Just checking in. This has been a crazy week. I am having a birthday party on Saturday







: I decided to throw caution to the wind and celebrate another year of life! My actual bday is next Tuesday. If I remember, I'll take pictures and share them with yall.

yes, pictures please!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Could you share some more info on Dave Ramsey? We've been 'trying' to get out of debt for - what feels like freaking ever, and yet we aren't out, yet. I'm - somewhat reluctant to sign up and pay for it, esp. if it's just going to tell me the things that we are already doing - snowballing payments, limiting expenses, paying extra, etc, etc.









Basically, is he talking something new, or just budgeting better?

Other than purchasing two backs on half.com we have not spent any money. I don't think that Dave is a new approach, but his step by step process is simple and realistic.

When participants call the radio show, they sound like average middle income American's. Dave's advice is solid and straightforward.

DH read the books, not I but he is a firm believer in the program and suggest that you check out the books from the library before you spend $14 buying them for yourself.

http://www.daveramsey.com/radio/home/


----------



## JustKiya

Thanks AndrewsMother - that helps. I tried listening to his show, and just no.







I'll have to make peace with the library, then, or see if a friend has a copy.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Some worship centers offer the courses free of charge.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey mamas. Just checking in. This has been a crazy week. I am having a birthday party on Saturday







: I decided to throw caution to the wind and celebrate another year of life! My actual bday is next Tuesday. If I remember, I'll take pictures and share them with yall.

Birthday parties are a good thing. I ought to have one.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Birthday parties are a good thing. I ought to have one.










I love birthday parties--especially my own







You should most certainly throw one for yourself. When is your birthday Rynna?


----------



## jeca

I really need to buckle down with the Dave Ramsey thing but with Xmas around the corner I can't see it. I would like the kids Xmas to be simplistic so they have to think very hard on what they really really want this year. My mom ordered them electric scooters. Yeah that's a great gift in the middle of a colorado winter.







I'm suppose to look for a Wii, can I just say why?
And what's my 20 year old sister getting from dear mom and dad this year, a freaking laptop that I have to find. I admit to being just a bit jealous. Since she's the only one at home and has been for years that grown child gets some crazy stuff. That's just her big gift. Mom also bought her two Dooney and Burke bags along with her entire list that she pins to the fridge every year. The laptop is the "surprise" gift.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Jeca, how old are your children? What is your idea of a simple Christmas?

I love holiday talk!


----------



## Bloomingstar

I love holiday talk too! I am currently not even able to think about the holidays until I get resettled. We are still looking for a new apartment, hopefully to move in Dec. 1st. My due date is Dec. 29th and it is all a little much for me right now, especially since we just found out we need to move and DH is out of town from yesterday to Sunday. I'm haunting craigslist and emailing and calling people, and seeing places all weekend. But it's making me feel a little crazy!


----------



## shayinme

Birthday parties are indeed a good thing, that said I have only had 2 in my entire life. Though I do have a birthday coming up in January so I might think of throwing a party for myself.

I haven't been around much this week, just started my new gig as director of a community center that serves low income kids. Truthfully I have only been there a second and already I am sad.

As an AP Mama, its hard for me to see kids whose parents in many cases just don't care, my predecessor was filling me in on some of the kids and its just heartbreaking stuff







. I didn't realize how emotional it would make me in this environment. Already I have only been there 2 days and when I came in yesterday one girl just gave me a huge hug. Its so hard to process not being involved in your kids life. Even though I was only 19 when my eldest was born, that Mama Bear instinct was there albeit not like it is now.

So I am here, reading but between learning the ropes of the new gig and my consulting clients, my online play time will be reduced which in many ways is a good thing. I spend way too much time online.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

My birthday was a couple of weeks ago. I'm 31. A real grownup!









I'm not thinking about holidays.







All I want is to move, and I have little hope of that happening. Mike's hours got cut, and we're pretty much screwed. The kids will probably get one small thing each. I don't know, though; we need to get the dryer fixed.







Meh, I say! Meh.

I've got a really horrible headache today. I'm trying to get motivated to do schoolwork with the boy and I just don't have it in me.







: I need a sick day...


----------



## nnaemeka

purplegirl: have fun planning and playing b-day girl at your birthday party. i love b-day parties too. my plan is to have big bash for my fortieth which is (thankfully) a couple years away.

for the holidays? we don't really do the holidays and my baby won't know the difference. i try not to caught up in the hype/consumerism but i do admit that i tend to feel anti-holiday before and after and nostalgic and sappy on the day of







. my mama wants us to come for xmas we'll see about that, we might just do a post holiday trip. i did announce that i'd like to start celebrating Kwanzaa in earnest this year and make it a tradition my LO can grow up experiencing. my DH is from Ghana so Kwanzaa is foreign to him and i didn't grow up with it at all but i'd like to have some ritual in my child's life and Kwanzaa reflects my beliefs to some degree so... there's a film called "The Black Candle" all about Kwanzaa that's coming out soon, i saw the trailer and its really moving...i hope it will solidify my commitment to celebrating this year.

i do like to celebrate and reflect on the new year.


----------



## Jannah6

*Shay* you are doing a great service







. My aunt and I were thinking about an after school program in our community. Not so much for the HW, more for the hot meals for the children.

I had a friend who wasn't working and she would leave her DD in an after school program until 5 0r 6pm







. It's so sad


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Shay* you are doing a great service







. My aunt and I were thinking about an after school program in our community. Not so much for the HW, more for the hot meals for the children.

I had a friend who wasn't working and she would leave her DD in an after school program until 5 0r 6pm







. It's so sad









Yeah, that's what the deal is at our program. Most of the Mamas are at home, they just have their kids dropped at our place and we walk them home. The cool thing is they get a nutritious snack, plus we have games and other programming that we offer.

I do think its a great program but its also a reminder that there are so many kids out there whose needs are just not being met and its basic needs, not parenting philosophies.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

I am having so much fun with this bday party. It's not a milestone birthday but I just needed to create some fun in my life. I work hard and needed to have something to look forward to. Shay, throw yourself a party girl! There's nothing like celebrating your life and giving thanks for seeing another year!

I agree with Jannah6; it sounds like you are providing a very important service to children. IMO, there's nothing more gratifying but difficult at times. It's particularly hard when children are in difficult situations. I had a scary and difficult situation in my office last night with a child that resulted in me having to call the police for her safety







Hang in there Shay. You are making a difference even when you feel you aren't.

Bloomingstar, I wish you the best of luck in finding another residence. There are lots of changes happening in your life mama! I wish you all the best and can't wait to hear more about the birth transition!!

I *love* the holidays! This year though I am focusing on simplicity. I am making most of my gifts. I have been in a very spiritual way and my focus has been on being appreciative. I'm no martyr, but I'd would much prefer to do without than to see others go without. To that end, I have adopted a family for the holidays. It is a grandmom who is raising her two granddaughters. When I tell you they have nothing.....







She's a really good woman who has been through hell. I am buying them their entire Thanksgiving dinner and purchasing whatever the girls want for Christmas.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Oh gosh, I hate to be a debbie downer after having been gone for so long but I really need to get it out and maybe get some ideas on how to fix this situation I am in, that is if its fixable at all.

Well, here's the deal. My paycheck at this new clinic I started working at bounced. yes, I can still hardly believe it myself. so here I am, looking desperately for jobs while my bank drowns me in overdraft fees and it's not looking likely that I'll ever be paid back from the employer as they tell me the money's coming blah blah blah but that they just don't have it yet. and to hang in there.







: .and I'm not sure I'm ever going to get that money or the money that's due to me for the 2nd pay period (in which I worked almost overtime).

I know I need to file a report with the employment bureua but does it mean I'll get paid before I lose a small fortune in fees?. sigh.ok, end of vent









wish me luck in finding a job?

Well, anyway, Happy Birthday Purple Girl. Yes, I think its very important to celebrate birthdays.







:

Bloomingstar, goodluck to you!

eilonwy, here's a







to you.

I too am dreading the holidays. Its centered so much around commercialism and visiting families... I don't think we can afford that at all. simple sounds good but I'm hardly creative so I'll probably look for used books or something. everyone's gotta love books right?


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I *love* the holidays! This year though I am focusing on simplicity. I am making most of my gifts. I have been in a very spiritual way and my focus has been on being appreciative. I'm no martyr, but I'd would much prefer to do without than to see others go without. To that end, I have adopted a family for the holidays. It is a grandmom who is raising her two granddaughters. When I tell you they have nothing.....







She's a really good woman who has been through hell. I am buying them their entire Thanksgiving dinner and purchasing whatever the girls want for Christmas.

Purplegirl, You are amazing. that is all. but I've said that before already, I know.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Purplegirl, You are amazing. that is all. but I've said that before already, I know.









Awww, thank you mama







But I think we're all an amazing group of women!







:

I just saw your other post. Omgoodness, that is horrible. Can you call your bank and explain the situation? They are often more forgiving than not. Perhaps they can give you back some of the fees and stop charging you so you don't accrue more. I wish you the best in finding another job mama


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

thanks purplegirl. I feel like a humongous loser. How could I have been duped into taking a position at a company like that?

and nope. I went to the bank and they flat out said, they won't waive the charges as it is a "non-bank" error. I bank with Wells Fargo. Nuff' said. And get this, they said they will keep charging me..

In the five years I have banked with them, they have never cut me a break. ever. I will try and talk to somebody at another branch. however, I did get an email from them stating that so I can file it along with the wages claim after much pleading on my part.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
thanks purplegirl. I feel like a humongous loser. How could I have been duped into taking a position at a company like that?

and nope. I went to the bank and they flat out said, they won't waive the charges as it is a "non-bank" error. I bank with Wells Fargo. Nuff' said. And get this, they said they will keep charging me..

In the five years I have banked with them, they have never cut me a break. ever. I will try and talk to somebody at another branch. however, I did get an email from them stating that so I can file it along with the wages claim after much pleading on my part.

That just sucks and is terrible customer service. Are you able to close your account with them? Please don't feel like a loser. The same thing happened to me years ago when I was hired as a consultant to this foster care agency. They wrote me a large check that bounced. However, their bank was very kind to me, gave me a number to call so I could find out when they had funds in the account. Once I learned they had funds in the account, I ran to the bank and cashed the check. They were mad at me but by then, I had quit!








Better days are coming. I have so been there and know that bad times don't last forever.


----------



## Autumn C.

I hope to start off on the Dave Ramsey thing too. Maybe we can "keep each other honest" as we work through it with our families.

My birthday is ...

Tommorrow Nov 14th. I will be 21....for the 11th time.

And about the holidays, all I can say is...bah freakin humbug.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
I hope to start off on the Dave Ramsey thing too. Maybe we can "keep each other honest" as we work through it with our families.

My birthday is ...

Tommorrow Nov 14th. I will be 21....for the 11th time.

And about the holidays, all I can say is...bah freakin humbug.









*
HAPPY BIRTHDAY MAMA!*







:


----------



## Autumn C.

Aw, thanks.

Truthfully, I would have forgotten about my birthday if it wasn't for my dh. It'll probably be like every other day. Oh well, I can be thankful that I have another day to live it!


----------



## rootzdawta

mommy2Amira. I know it will work out all right.

Autumn C, I second the notion: Happy 21st Birthday for the 11th time!!
















:

I have a question Ladies . . .

I have never really been into makeup but I want to start as a part of a complete Rootzdawta overhaul. I want natural makeup (no animal products, mineral oil, etc . . . you know the deal), a foundation and some lip tints/colors--I just want a light, natural kind of look. My skin is deep chocolate so I generally have a tough time finding my match. Any recs? Thanks!!


----------



## JustKiya

Have you looked into the Bare Minerals-type products, RootzDawta? I've heard nothing but good things about them....


----------



## shayinme

I just started using Bare Minerals and its great. I have the combination foundation powder as well as one of their lipsticks. The powder/foundation is light and as someone with super sensitive skin, in over a month of wearing I have had no breakouts. I am cocoa colored and they had colors for me and that's up here in Maine







. I highly recommend Bare Minerals.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I just started using *Bare Minerals* and its great. I have the combination foundation powder as well as one of their lipsticks. The powder/foundation is light and as someone with super sensitive skin, in over a month of wearing I have had no breakouts. I am cocoa colored and they had colors for me and that's up here in Maine







. I highly recommend Bare Minerals.

Shay

Yeah that!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I love holiday talk too! I am currently not even able to think about the holidays until I get resettled. We are still looking for a new apartment, hopefully to move in Dec. 1st. My due date is Dec. 29th and it is all a little much for me right now, especially since we just found out we need to move and DH is out of town from yesterday to Sunday. I'm haunting craigslist and emailing and calling people, and seeing places all weekend. But it's making me feel a little crazy!









A new year, new baby and a new apartment! You are truly fortunate.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Birthday parties are indeed a good thing, that said I have only had 2 in my entire life. Though I do have a birthday coming up in January so I might think of throwing a party for myself.

I haven't been around much this week, just started my new gig as director of a community center that serves low income kids. Truthfully I have only been there a second and already I am sad.

As an AP Mama, its hard for me to see kids whose parents in many cases just don't care, my predecessor was filling me in on some of the kids and its just heartbreaking stuff







. I didn't realize how emotional it would make me in this environment. Already I have only been there 2 days and when I came in yesterday one girl just gave me a huge hug. Its so hard to process not being involved in your kids life. Even though I was only 19 when my eldest was born, that Mama Bear instinct was there albeit not like it is now.

So I am here, reading but between learning the ropes of the new gig and my consulting clients, my online play time will be reduced which in many ways is a good thing. I spend way too much time online.

Shay

Working with low income children can be depressing, but the connections that you will make with the children and the joy that you all will bring to each others lives is amazing.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Shay* you are doing a great service







. My aunt and I were thinking about an after school program in our community. Not so much for the HW, more for the hot meals for the children.

I had a friend who wasn't working and she would leave her DD in an after school program until 5 0r 6pm







. It's so sad









If I lived nearby, i would help you you.

Don't be too hard on your friend, not all mothers are passionate about spending exyended hours with their children, but that care for them deeply.
Some might think less of me because I could easily pick up my son before noon, but I enjoy my three hours of solitude.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

Bloomingstar, I wish you the best of luck in finding another residence. There are lots of changes happening in your life mama! I wish you all the best and can't wait to hear more about the birth transition!!

I *love* the holidays! This year though I am focusing on simplicity. I am making most of my gifts. I have been in a very spiritual way and my focus has been on being appreciative. I'm no martyr, but I'd would much prefer to do without than to see others go without. To that end, I have adopted a family for the holidays. It is a grandmom who is raising her two granddaughters. When I tell you they have nothing.....







She's a really good woman who has been through hell. I am buying them their entire Thanksgiving dinner and purchasing whatever the girls want for Christmas.

You are truly amazing! I wish that I had the financial resources to help you do more. I am so happy that you are helping a family to have a Merry Christmas. Yes, Christmas is commercialized, but the Holiday is what we make of it. Giving to those that don't have, inviting the lonely to dinner, visiting the elderly helps to reinforce the values that are easily overlooked.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Oh gosh, I hate to be a debbie downer after having been gone for so long but I really need to get it out and maybe get some ideas on how to fix this situation I am in, that is if its fixable at all.

Well, here's the deal. My paycheck at this new clinic I started working at bounced. yes, I can still hardly believe it myself. so here I am, looking desperately for jobs while my bank drowns me in overdraft fees and it's not looking likely that I'll ever be paid back from the employer as they tell me the money's coming blah blah blah but that they just don't have it yet. and to hang in there.







: .and I'm not sure I'm ever going to get that money or the money that's due to me for the 2nd pay period (in which I worked almost overtime).

I know I need to file a report with the employment bureua but does it mean I'll get paid before I lose a small fortune in fees?. sigh.ok, end of vent









wish me luck in finding a job?


Are you eligible to apply for unemployment until you secure a new position?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
thanks purplegirl. I feel like a humongous loser. How could I have been duped into taking a position at a company like that?

and nope. I went to the bank and they flat out said, they won't waive the charges as it is a "non-bank" error. I bank with Wells Fargo. Nuff' said. And get this, they said they will keep charging me..

In the five years I have banked with them, they have never cut me a break. ever. I will try and talk to somebody at another branch. however, I did get an email from them stating that so I can file it along with the wages claim after much pleading on my part.

Call customer service, cry if you have too. I have made a few error in my past and BOA is generally good at refunding NSF charges. Recently I purchased gas on credit on Tuesday, money was deposited into my account on wednesday and the charge did not appear as pedning until Thursday but I was still assessed an NSF fee that no one would remove. I am guessing that the economy is partly behind their unwillingness to reduce charges. Credit cards payments, loans and mortgages are not being met so banks are holding on too any and all revenue.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
I hope to start off on the Dave Ramsey thing too. Maybe we can "keep each other honest" as we work through it with our families.

My birthday is ...

Tommorrow Nov 14th. I will be 21....for the 11th time.

And about the holidays, all I can say is...bah freakin humbug.










A Dave Ramsey support group would be nice!

MY Birthday is Novemeber 29, and I am 21 for the first last and only time.









Happy 21st Birthday Autumn!!!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I have been thinking about you and wondering how things are going. I hope the nursing has gotten easier for you and your LO.









Hi Purplegirl! I have been in my mommy vortex for the past 3 and a half weeks. It's been a challenge trying to get meals in, let alone go online! Don't even get me started on trying to run to the bathroom with this little guy. By the way, his name is Ari.







: Nursing is a little better, I still have to supplement but I am taking herbal formulas to help increase my supply. I am hoping to have success with that and begin breastfeeding him exclusively. Okay now I am going to try and catch up on this thread, I have like 7 pages to read!







Thanks for thinking of me.


----------



## nnaemeka

hi Arike and Ari!!! I'm glad you're both doing good. I know all about not even be able to run off to the bathroom! my babysitter came this morning for a bit and though i'm supposed to be writing at every chance i get, i instead cleaned the kitchen with the Roots blaring and then took a long shower and actually put a cute outfit together. jeez, it felt so luxurious!

hmmm, now i'm very tempted to check out bare minerals. they just opened a new sephora in town and i was in there getting giddy with the rest. and i don't barely even wear make-up. but since i've been post-parturm i've had the urge to be more femme and to spend more effort in the attempt to look good, kwim?

happy birthday purplegirl and autumn c!!!!!! enjoy your celebrations!







!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

You are truly amazing! I wish that I had the financial resources to help you do more. I am so happy that you are helping a family to have a Merry Christmas. Yes, Christmas is commercialized, but the Holiday is what we make of it. Giving to those that don't have, inviting the lonely to dinner, visiting the elderly helps to reinforce the values that are easily overlooked.


wow, purplegirl that is truly Spirit in action. Andrewsmother you are right! you have both inspired me to be less anti and to instead be proactive in creating the spirit i feel is lacking from the hype of the holidays. give thanks for the reminder!!! maybe we will visit my mama for xmas and kwanzaa, she'd be soooooo happy to squeeze her grandbaby.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hi Purplegirl! I have been in my mommy vortex for the past 3 and a half weeks. It's been a challenge trying to get meals in, let alone go online! Don't even get me started on trying to run to the bathroom with this little guy. By the way, his name is Ari.







: Nursing is a little better, I still have to supplement but I am taking herbal formulas to help increase my supply. I am hoping to have success with that and begin breastfeeding him exclusively. Okay now I am going to try and catch up on this thread, I have like 7 pages to read!







Thanks for thinking of me.










It's so good to hear from you. I am glad nursing is going better for you all. I love his name


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
wow, purplegirl that is truly Spirit in action. Andrewsmother you are right! you have both inspired me to be less anti and to instead be proactive in creating the spirit i feel is lacking from the hype of the holidays. give thanks for the reminder!!! maybe we will visit my mama for xmas and kwanzaa, she'd be soooooo happy to squeeze her grandbaby.

I have been anti Holidays before, but when DS came along I wanted to recreate my past for him. Yes, I did receive a mountain of presents, and I looked forward to them, but what I anticipated most was spending two weeks with my grandparents, cousins, aunts uncles and family friends.

Driving the 15 miles from my Aunts home, after her annual Christmas eve party complete with Black Santa and spiced cider, to my grandmothers house was magical. The fields were glzaed with ice that sparkled in the moonlight, silent night played on the radio and my gleaming eyes searched the sky for a premature arrival from Santa.

Someone read the story of Jesus' birth often during the celebration to remind us as to why we gathered. We spent Christmas day driving around to visit friends that we sometimes saw only once a year. dropping of plates of food and gifts to those that might not have been as fortunate.

Nnaemeka, the sharing of your child with your mom on Christmas is the best gift that you could give to her. Not to mention, it is free!!!


----------



## jeca

Mommy2Amira;12606669
Well said:


> http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif[/IMG]: .and I'm not sure I'm ever going to get that money or the money that's due to me for the 2nd pay period (in which I worked almost overtime).
> 
> I too am dreading the holidays. Its centered so much around commercialism and visiting families... I don't think we can afford that at all. simple sounds good but I'm hardly creative so I'll probably look for used books or something. everyone's gotta love books right?










I hope things work out for you soon. I'm not creative either I can't even think of anything that I could make that would be presentable to anyone.








Simplistic. I want the kids to be grateful for our time together. I want to them to get a few things they truly want and that they will keep for a long time. I don't want them to be overloaded with crap(thanks grandma) that will eventually be donated somewhere else. I want a nice Christmas breakfast and us playing some games. I want our family to stop asking us to drive 18-30(depending on which family)hours to be with them for the holidays. We are the ones with the small kids why are we always the ones asked to give up our holidays driving?
I would like to get my family a few "green" gifts for the holidays.
I should say I do want to see everyone but we can't afford to fly and the drive is just awful on my nerves and my wallet. Plus both sides want to see us so it will cause drama.
Purplegirl as already stated you rock as do you Shay. A job like that must be hard but rewarding at the same time. I can't imagine not getting attached to those kids.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
By the way, his name is Ari.







: Nursing is a little better, I still have to supplement but I am taking herbal formulas to help increase my supply. I am hoping to have success with that and begin breastfeeding him exclusively. Okay now I am going to try and catch up on this thread, I have like 7 pages to read!







Thanks for thinking of me.









Congrats on your LO. Ari is a wonderful name. I'll send good nursing vibes your way. It can be a lot of work in the beginning but it is sooo worth it. Congrats for sticking with it. Keep up the good work!

--

You know, I've been looking for makeup too. I recently tried a mineral product that I had a little too much of that "ashy" look when I put it on. My complexion is in serious need of help. It is the one thing, next to my hair (whole other story) that I would spend enormous amounts of money on...if I had enormous amounts of money.

Thanks for all the birthday wishes. It actually turned out to be a really nice day.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Thanks for all the birthday wishes. It actually turned out to be a really nice day.









Shoot! I knew I forgot something. Happy Birthday.








There was a bareminerials demo at this thing I went to last year. I was very interested but knows nothing about makeup so the girl said she would give me a demo. I ended up looking like a drag queen.







She had my face so dark as opposed to my neck and check that it just looked silly. A few women standing around were actually laughing at me. She said it was because my face was varies colors and she had to pick a tone. I think she just wasn't use to doing a woman of color which would have been find if she had just said so.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Shoot! I knew I forgot something. Happy Birthday.









I think she just wasn't use to doing a woman of color which would have been find if she had just said so.

Thanks jeca!

That's another thing, finding people who are knowledgeable about WOC skin tone is difficult. It's a pain in ther arse to have to mix 3 different shades for one little ol me.

BTW, love your sig.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
A new year, new baby and a new apartment! You are truly fortunate.

Thanks! That's how I am trying to think of it, rather than as a nerve wrecking nuisance--the having to move part. I'm really looking forward to having more space.

Happy Birthday Autumn C.







:

And Arike I am glad you are in the swing of things! I'll be joining you in a few weeks.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Shoot! I knew I forgot something. Happy Birthday.








There was a bareminerials demo at this thing I went to last year. I was very interested but knows nothing about makeup so the girl said she would give me a demo. I ended up looking like a drag queen.







She had my face so dark as opposed to my neck and check that it just looked silly. A few women standing around were actually laughing at me. She said it was because my face was varies colors and she had to pick a tone. *I think she just wasn't use to doing a woman of color which would have been find if she had just said so.*

*
*

I agree. I don't do the in store makeovers for that very reason.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Tommorrow Nov 14th. I will be 21....for the 11th time.

You know, I wonder about this sort of thing. Why does anyone feel the need to lie about their age? I could have turned 21 for the tenth time this year... but I turned 31, and I liked that better. A few weeks ago I got a call to do one of those surveys for an ad firm or something. They asked about this anti-aging product, was it something I'd buy, was it something I liked, how did I feel about it? I said that I resented it, I didn't like the idea of being told that I NEEDED to look younger and I hate the fact that women are trained to lie about their ages. If this society made any kind of sense, a woman with grey hairs and laugh lines would be HONORED, she shouldn't be torturing herself trying to look sixteen and act twenty.

Sorry. Pet peeve.







:

I'm still not thinking about the holidays.







:

I have the same trouble with makeup colors. They inevitably want to make me much darker or much lighter than I actually am. That said, with the newer colors it's pretty easy to match me-- I'm the lightest of the medium shades or the darkest of the light shades, and neutral.


----------



## jeca

Perhaps we're not all ready to accept aging as gracefully as you Rynna. I don't see a problem with witholding your true age. Why is it anyone's business anyway? It's part of the mystique of being a woman.


----------



## AndrewsMother

A woman who will reveal her age will reveal anything.









Grey hair and wrinkles don't prompt me to subtract years from my age, but my belief that I am too told to be where I am in life does. If withholding or adjusting age makes a woman feel better, why not?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
A woman who will reveal her age will reveal anything.









Wow, that's really beyond harsh. All I said was that I don't understand it, and resent being told that I NEED to pretend to be younger than I am. I get the "why not" argument, but I want to know the why of it-- why do so many women feel more comfortable pretending to be younger than they are? Why do so few women feel proud to have achieved however many years they have? Why the subterfuge, dying hair, wearing different makeup, having surgery-- why not just enjoy the age that you are? Why does our society so highly prize youth? I mean you couldn't pay me to be sixteen again, and most women agree on that point. Why do so many feel the need to try to look like they are?


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
[/B]

I agree. I don't do the in store makeovers for that very reason.

I make one exception to that rule. The M.A.C. store, every single time I have had a man work on my face it has been fabulous. The women have been hit and miss.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Wow, that's really beyond harsh. All I said was that I don't understand it, and resent being told that I NEED to pretend to be younger than I am. I get the "why not" argument, but I want to know the why of it-- why do so many women feel more comfortable pretending to be younger than they are? Why do so few women feel proud to have achieved however many years they have? Why the subterfuge, dying hair, wearing different makeup, having surgery-- why not just enjoy the age that you are? Why does our society so highly prize youth? I mean you couldn't pay me to be sixteen again, and most women agree on that point. Why do so many feel the need to try to look like they are?


I really get what you are saying. Unfortunately, getting older isn't valued in this society. As I approach another birthday, I almost dread the question of 'how old are you?'. It's not so much that i am ashamed of my age, but rather I don't feel like dealing with the rather inappropriate questions, ie, 'you don't have any children yet?'
I also hate it when people dismiss my concerns about say, health to 'oh, you're just getting older.'

I love that Halle Berry is 42 years old (and a new mommy). It really does bring some value to being older yet maintaining beauty and fertility. I almost dread getting pregnant because I am really going to take a licking with comments from my less than enlightened circle of people.


----------



## Autumn C.

Elinowy,

I think you make a solid point. No one should feel that have to pretend they are other than they are. For me, it's a bit of a joke. If I really wanted to conceal my age I could have. When I say for the 11th time, you know exactly how old I am. It's no secret. But I do think it's my perogative to keep it to myself if I so choose, ykwim?

---

IRL, I rarely have this problem because, like many WOC, I am aging quite well if I do say so myself.

And I look forward to the day when my wrinkles give my face a permanent smile and my eyes speak depths of wisdom.

But that day aint today.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I really get what you are saying. Unfortunately, getting older isn't valued in this society. As I approach another birthday, I almost dread the question of 'how old are you?'. It's not so much that i am ashamed of my age, but rather I don't feel like dealing with the rather inappropriate questions, ie, 'you don't have any children yet?'
I also hate it when people dismiss my concerns about say, health to 'oh, you're just getting older.'

I can certainly appreciate not wanting to deal with inappropriate questions and the like... but young people are dismissed a lot, too and this is another one of those cases where I really feel like we're perpetuating problems rather than working on solving them. I mean... society doesn't always value breastfeeding as much as it should; Does that mean we should justify it when we're asked to leave public spaces, or to cover up and hide it and act like we're ashamed? We're never going to make it normal unless we do it in public... and "society" is never going to appreciate age unless we stop caving to the media and we stand up and be proud of who we are. No games, no subterfuge, no shame. People ask inappropriate questions or make inappropriate requests and I very quickly, calmly, and effectively shut them down.


----------



## JustKiya

Interesting conversation.

My take on age - I'm either older, or I'm dead, and as for the years I've lived - there's not one I would sacrifice, and there's not one I'm willing to deny.

I have to admit, I haven't dealt with rude age related questions - or if I have, it was minor enough that it didn't register as a logical reason to start concealing my age.







Maybe ten years from now, I'll revisit this.....but then, I do so much *else* in my life that people can be inappropriate about, and I handle that with grace, so maybe age will fall into the same catergory.


----------



## Brown Lioness

*jumps in before bed*

I agree with both points of view, but i relate better to Rynna's. I am FINALLY approaching 30 and I CANNOT WAIT to be in my 30s'. I LOVE the wisdom and the self-assuredness that women in their 30's carry (not to say that it comes automatic, but its those years of experience that seems to season their persona that i love).

Funnily, i still get mistaken to be 10 years younger than I am. A coworker came into the breakroom while I was having lunch and asked if I was old enough to vote! I was tickled and laughed out loud and told her that Im 29 years old. Her eyes proceeded to pop out of her head and she blushed.

I am very proud of my age and all that comes with it. I look forward to the day that I have visible wrinkles, more than just a few precious gray hairs (seriously, i PAMPER my TWO gray hairs..they are my babies, lol), and some motherly battle scars (read: stretch marks due to pregnancy- cause i already have growth spurt stretchmarks, but they are very light-, changed boobs due to pregnancy and breastfeeding, etc, etc, etc). Let my family tell it, life doesnt START for you fa real until you are in your 30's, lol.

I come from the train of thought that there are MANY people that would have wished to make it to be up in age, but due to...whatever, their lives ended early. Im living for them. Im living for my ancestors and they cherished aging. Im like that new commercial (i forget what its for at the moment) with the song that says "When I grow up, I want to be an old woman!"


----------



## rootzdawta

Well, people mistake me to be at least 10 years older than I am. At times I feel complimented because it feels like they're saying I behave and reason like an older woman but other times I wonder if I just _look_ old. Now, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with looking older but looking old to me equals looking worn down and tired. And there are many older women who don't look old, iykwim. Anyway, that's the reason why I'm making a renewed effort to overhaul my look starting with my skin care regimen. I really want to be in my 40s and folks hardly believe me. It's not that I don't appreciate what it means to be 40--all the wisdom, hard work, etc . . . I'll gladly share but I want to look good.

Oh, and purplegirl, I totally hear you about people making all kinds of asinine comments about where you should be in life in relation to your age. If I hear one more person say, "Oh, you're 26 and you have two kids _already_" I might have to bust that person upside the head.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
All I said was that I don't understand it, and resent being told that I NEED to pretend to be younger than I am.

Who ever told you that? Someone actually told you you need to pretend to be younger?well that's silly isn't it. I'm not saying pretend or act younger than you are. I don't think many of us would wish to still be wearing belly shirts in our thirties. Just as you ask why the need not to tell your age I ask why the need to tell? There are many things I don't just volunteer it's not limited to my age.
I started getting more than a few greys at age 23. Should I have embraced them as "wisdom grey" when that's not what they were. I don't fake the funk like that. My family greys prematuraly there is no wisdon involed. No it doesn't look "good" on me. It actually makes me look older than I am. I have seen some absolutly regal looking women with the salt and pepper look. I am not one of them. The next question would probably be "why do you care about you looks?" Well because they're my looks and I won't pretend that I don't like to look nice.
I don't mind my age at all if thats' what the idea is. I'm smarter, stronger braver and more kick ass at this stage in my life than I ever was in my youth. I'm proud of that.
I think we also need to take into account when a woman feels younger than what she is. Maybe your turning 45 but you feel 30 all over again. Is there something wrong with that?


----------



## eilonwy

Society on the whole tells us that we "need" to be younger than we are-- to lie about how old we are, to dye our hair, to wear makeup, to dress "younger." Not belly shirts necessarily, but not "granny clothes" either.

I, too, am someone who looks younger than she is. Less than two months ago I was carded trying to buy an R-rated movie (you have to be *seventeen*). People are horrified that I "already" have four kids and they most assuredly ask inappropriate questions about "the father" (or "the babydaddy," as the case may be).







: In fact, each time I've been pregnant at least one person has asked what I plan to do with the baby, because apparently I'm too young to have kids in the first place.







: I still don't like society's focus on age, and I don't want to do anything to conceal it. I'm looking forward to my first gray hair, though I don't expect it will show up until some time in my late 40's. And I'll never lie about my age. I want to be a real grownup, darnit!


----------



## jeca

I have never lied about my age, ever. I simply choose to withhold it on occasion. I think there's a difference. My age isn't a secret by the way I know most of you know what it is.
That's a bit contradictory isn't though. "Society" wants you to be "younger" yet are "horrified" when they think you have too many kids for your age. That's why society as a whole can kiss my butt and mind their own business.

I also think we need to stop using "society" as the reason why we do things. It's insulting. To say that a woman couldn't possible want to dye her hair or dress a certain way without society's influence makes us all mindless sub humans being pulled by a master higher than we can see. I agree that there are some like that. Some look at the magazines and think "oh I wish I looked like her." Then there are those that look at the coat she's wearing and says, " I would look kick ass in that". Not the same thing. I am annoyed every time I read something that suggests that because I wear this or buy that is only because the powers that be want me to. That is simply not true for most of the strong intelligent woman I know the women on this thread included. Society is not my master or my power I am. I can make up my mind what looks good on me without anyone's help and I am insulted every time I read otherwise.


----------



## jeca

I got sidetracked on why I came here. So today is the day I find out what happens to the program I work for. I have a meeting this morning to see if the city cut it or not. I kind of conflicted on what I want to happen. If they kept this program but cut others I will still be upset. Plus maybe something better is out there for me and this will help me make it happen. Ugh.
Edited to add I got a reading saturday night during this event I went to. The first thing out his mouth was I see a career change. Mind you it wasn't actually a "career" I mean it was only a few hours a week but still. Ugh. conflicted.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I have never lied about my age, ever. I simply choose to withhold it on occasion. I think there's a difference. My age isn't a secret by the way I know most of you know what it is.
That's a bit contradictory isn't though. "Society" wants you to be "younger" yet are "horrified" when they think you have too many kids for your age. That's why society as a whole can kiss my butt and mind their own business.

I also think we need to stop using "society" as the reason why we do things. It's insulting. To say that a woman couldn't possible want to dye her hair or dress a certain way without society's influence makes us all mindless sub humans being pulled by a master higher than we can see. I agree that there are some like that. Some look at the magazines and think "oh I wish I looked like her." Then there are those that look at the coat she's wearing and says, " I would look kick ass in that". Not the same thing. I am annoyed every time I read something that suggests that because I wear this or buy that is only because the powers that be want me to. That is simply not true for most of the strong intelligent woman I know the women on this thread included. Society is not my master or my power I am. I can make up my mind what looks good on me without anyone's help and I am insulted every time I read otherwise.


I hear that hot ish( a friend of mine says that when i say something on pointe)! Yet, I do feel the pressure of what this society says. I don't let it define me or my choices but something I have to deal with, particularly in this country. I certainly wouldn't be trying to have a baby at my age if I truly cared what others thought. I just wished people would keep their comments to themselves. I hate coming out of myself to put others in their place but I will if I have to









Where my dh is from, women have babies in their 40's all the time so it is valued and acceptable.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Like BrownLioness, I am often assumed to be about 10 years younger than I am. I'm short, I'm small, and I work with teenagers so I also tend to blend in with them. I'm the Program Director at my job, yet people always assume I am one of the kids or an intern--it can be pretty frustrating, though older women always tell me when I hit 40 I'll appreciate it! In the beginning of my pregnancy, I got a lot of disapproving looks from the little old ladies in the neighborhood and I REALLY wanted one of them to dare say something to me, which is probably why they didn't







: now that I am waddling around at 8 and a half months--and also since I cut my hair about a foot shorter--most people seem to be assuming that I'm at least in my 20s and not a teenager. Pregnancy has definitely made my body more "womanly"--I was a size 2 and an A cup--so I think that may have "aged" me a bit and that's cool for me.

In general, I think there's tons of pressure to look a certain kind of young, but little respect for young people.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Thanks for all the support, everyone. I appreciate it so much.
I'm optimistic that it's just one of those, It's darkest before dawn moments in my life. Although, I have indulged in self-pity, purple girl, you are absolutely right. That clinic was a challenge to me and I wanted to make a strong impact. There's no way I could have predicted they weren't going to pay me.

*Happy Belated Birthday Autumn C*!







:

It's good to hear Bare Minerals actually works for most of you. I might have to try that as I have sensitive skin as well.

Interesting discussion on age.. I'm eager to read your thoughts more.. I think both sides make great points.

Purple girl, you are so right. I don't want to _have_ to fight trivial battles every day. It's a burden. sigh.

I generally dislike the critique of people who strive to improve their appearance. When I feel I look good, i feel I can conquer the world. It's just a simple, self-empowering move for me. and yes, I dye my hair to make it blacker every so often with funky highlights, and I love make-up. I love having the tools to express my mood in my looks.. Besides I'm only a certain age once.. might as well make the best of "me" of it.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Wow, that's really beyond harsh. All I said was that I don't understand it, and resent being told that I NEED to pretend to be younger than I am. I get the "why not" argument, but I want to know the why of it-- why do so many women feel more comfortable pretending to be younger than they are? Why do so few women feel proud to have achieved however many years they have? Why the subterfuge, dying hair, wearing different makeup, having surgery-- why not just enjoy the age that you are? Why does our society so highly prize youth? I mean you couldn't pay me to be sixteen again, and most women agree on that point. Why do so many feel the need to try to look like they are?

I wasn't being harsh, that is how I feel about revealing age. I know quite a few other women who feel that way. My age along with other facts is my business alone.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I really get what you are saying. Unfortunately, getting older isn't valued in this society. As I approach another birthday, I almost dread the question of 'how old are you?'. It's not so much that i am ashamed of my age, but rather I don't feel like dealing with the rather inappropriate questions, ie, 'you don't have any children yet?'
I also hate it when people dismiss my concerns about say, health to 'oh, you're just getting older.'

I love that Halle Berry is 42 years old (and a new mommy). It really does bring some value to being older yet maintaining beauty and fertility. *I almost dread getting pregnant because I am really going to take a licking with comments from my less than enlightened circle of people.*

My mother had my sister at 42, and I think that it is a wonderful age to become a parent. My mother colors her grey hair, wear make up and will bark at anyone who adds an age to her years, but she KNOWS that she is a much better parent due to maturity and age earned wisdom than she was when she gave birth to me 18 years and 9 months earlier. She is content with her age, but not ready to look 55.

Only those who as you say are less than enlightened have something to say to her.
In fact I receive comments from those who know my age as to why I had my DS so young.







:

This life is too short to please anyone other than yourself.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Well, people mistake me to be at least 10 years older than I am. At times I feel complimented because it feels like they're saying I behave and reason like an older woman but other times I wonder if I just _look_ old. *Now, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with looking older but looking old to me equals looking worn down and tired.* And there are many older women who don't look old, iykwim. Anyway, that's the reason why I'm making a renewed effort to overhaul my look starting with my skin care regimen. I really want to be in my 40s and folks hardly believe me. It's not that I don't appreciate what it means to be 40--all the wisdom, hard work, etc . . . I'll gladly share but *I want to look good.*

Oh, and purplegirl, I totally hear you about people making all kinds of asinine comments about where you should be in life in relation to your age. If I hear one more person say, "Oh, you're 26 and you have two kids _already_" I might have to bust that person upside the head.

There can't be anything wrong with wanting to look good. When I visit my grandparents hometown I see men and women my age that I have known my whole life, but they look 10 to 15 years older. WHY??? I have no desire to look as if the world or society has beat me down and run over me.

I care about what I put inside my body, I eat right to feel young, so why can't i be just as concerned with the outside?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Society on the whole tells us that we "need" to be younger than we are-- to lie about how old we are, to dye our hair, to wear makeup, to dress "younger." Not belly shirts necessarily, but not "granny clothes" either.

I, too, am someone who looks younger than she is. Less than two months ago I was carded trying to buy an R-rated movie (you have to be *seventeen*). People are horrified that I "already" have four kids and they most assuredly ask inappropriate questions about "the father" (or "the babydaddy," as the case may be).







: In fact, each time I've been pregnant at least one person has asked what I plan to do with the baby, because apparently I'm too young to have kids in the first place.







: I still don't like society's focus on age, and I don't want to do anything to conceal it. I'm looking forward to my first gray hair, though I don't expect it will show up until some time in my late 40's. And I'll never lie about my age. I want to be a real grownup, darnit!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I can certainly appreciate not wanting to deal with inappropriate questions and the like... but young people are dismissed a lot, too and this is another one of those cases where I really feel like we're perpetuating problems rather than working on solving them. I mean... society doesn't always value breastfeeding as much as it should; Does that mean we should justify it when we're asked to leave public spaces, or to cover up and hide it and act like we're ashamed? We're never going to make it normal unless we do it in public... and "society" is never going to appreciate age unless we stop caving to the media and we stand up and be proud of who we are. No games, no subterfuge, no shame. People ask inappropriate questions or make inappropriate requests and I very quickly, calmly, and effectively shut them down.

Why do you care about what society says. I do me, and I do me only, and quite well I might add. Based on the media and the current state of the world society is screwed up so why would I or any other rational human take their cues from society.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I have never lied about my age, ever. I simply choose to withhold it on occasion. I think there's a difference. My age isn't a secret by the way I know most of you know what it is.
That's a bit contradictory isn't though. "Society" wants you to be "younger" yet are "horrified" when they think you have too many kids for your age. That's why society as a whole can kiss my butt and mind their own business.

I also think we need to stop using "society" as the reason why we do things. It's insulting. To say that a woman couldn't possible want to dye her hair or dress a certain way without society's influence makes us all mindless sub humans being pulled by a master higher than we can see. I agree that there are some like that. Some look at the magazines and think "oh I wish I looked like her." Then there are those that look at the coat she's wearing and says, " I would look kick ass in that". Not the same thing. I am annoyed every time I read something that suggests that because I wear this or buy that is only because the powers that be want me to. That is simply not true for most of the strong intelligent woman I know the women on this thread included. Society is not my master or my power I am. I can make up my mind what looks good on me without anyone's help and I am insulted every time I read otherwise.









:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I got sidetracked on why I came here. So today is the day I find out what happens to the program I work for. I have a meeting this morning to see if the city cut it or not. I kind of conflicted on what I want to happen. If they kept this program but cut others I will still be upset. Plus maybe something better is out there for me and this will help me make it happen. Ugh.
Edited to add I got a reading saturday night during this event I went to. The first thing out his mouth was I see a career change. Mind you it wasn't actually a "career" I mean it was only a few hours a week but still. Ugh. conflicted.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Thanks for all the support, everyone. I appreciate it so much.
I'm optimistic that it's just one of those, It's darkest before dawn moments in my life. Although, I have indulged in self-pity, purple girl, you are absolutely right. That clinic was a challenge to me and I wanted to make a strong impact. There's no way I could have predicted they weren't going to pay me.


Jeca and Mommy2Amira, something good is bound to come to both of you. Just keep on smiling!!!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I hear that hot ish( a friend of mine says that when i say something on pointe)! Yet, I do feel the pressure of what this society says. I don't let it define me or my choices but something I have to deal with, particularly in this country. I certainly wouldn't be trying to have a baby at my age if I truly cared what others thought. I just wished people would keep their comments to themselves. I hate coming out of myself to put others in their place but I will if I have to








.

I hate that idea that we would make the best mothers at this age or that. No, you make the best mother when you truly want to be a mother in my book.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I hate that idea that we would make the best mothers at this age or that. No, you make the best mother when you truly want to be a mother in my book.









:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I hate that idea that we would make the best mothers at this age or that. No, you make the best mother when you truly want to be a mother in my book.

Dayummm straight!







I really believe this.


----------



## shayinme

Interesting discussion ladies. I remember looking at turning 30 as this huge thing, figured I'd be like a real adult. Granted I had already been a Mama since I was 19. Well 30 most certainly did age me, it was the year my Mama got terminal cancer and died 6 weeks after I turned 31.

Needless to say I truly did grow up, as my Granny told me when Mom died "When you lose your Mama, you are really an adult". I gotta say personally that is true, no going back to Moms.

As far as visual signs of age, most folks don't think my son is my son, I still look like I am 25 instead of almost 36. Granted I got a serious gray patch of hair that started right after my Moms died, haven't dyed it though I am thinking about it. Then again I just like coloring my hair in general, its more about being fun.

Its funny because I look younger but sorry I feel my age, lets just say I could handle a 3 yo better at 22 then at 35. This chile wears me out.







I doubt I would ever do anything drastic to maintain a youthful appearance but at the same time I don't necessarily look old, admittedly I can be a smidge vain at times.









Shay


----------



## jeca

Well it was as I expected. The program will end in December.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Well it was as I expected. The program will end in December.









Dang girl. How are you feeling about it ending? Was your reading correct?


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Dang girl. How are you feeling about it ending? Was your reading correct?

I feel.....conflicted. During my reading one of the first thing he said was I see a career change. I told him that the program was in jeopardy and he told me it wasn't in jeopardy it was over. he also said it was fine because now I could concentrate on what I am suppose do be doing. The outreach program has been in this community for nine years. It's crazy to me that it's over. I use to come to the program when I was pregnant with my second. I hate to see it gone. I mean it wasn't a lot of hours but it's kind of hard to think I won't be seeing these people and some of these kids again. I'm also not really sure what's next. Do I take up something different? Go back to school? Enjoy some alone time for a bit? WHat? What's now?


----------



## Draupadi

I'm actually on Eilonwy's side with this (not that we're choosing sides!).
I'll be 38 in less than a month. I feel a little apprehensive about it, but it doesn't bother me that much. I wouldn't want to go back to being in my twenties for anything. I am a much wiser, more settled and happier person now that I'm in my late 30's.
I do sometimes wish I had DS when I was younger because I want to haveat least one more, but I think I'm a much better mother because I'm older.
I am lucky that I look younger than I am, I guess, despite the greys (I call them "Paulie Walnuts" because I get greys on the sides like Paulie on "The Sopranos") and I do dye my hair, but otherwise, I'm pretty cool with my age.
Compared to some of you, I'm downright geriatric.


----------



## rootzdawta

I, for one, hesitate to tell my age especially IRL because as soon as I tell someone in their thirties or forties that I'm in my twenties, the level of respect falls dramatically. Like, one minute ago when you thought I was 36 you were willing to talk to me like an equal. Now, you know I'm 26 and you're all like "Oh you wouldn't understand" or "you'll come to find out about these things".









I've learned that age doesn't necessarily equal wisdom nor vice versa. Also that there are misconceptions and stereotypes abounding for each and every age group you find yourself in.

And I just really don't understand how 38 in comparison to 28 is geriatric. I know it's a joke and it's kidding but somehow I think it contributes to the whole "It's all downhill from here" nonsense that we all are resisting against. If 38 year olds could lend there learning and 28 year olds their "youth", without self-deprecation, without judgment, without assumptions, I think we as women especially could do so much more.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

And I just really don't understand how 38 in comparison to 28 is geriatric. I know it's a joke and it's kidding but somehow I think it contributes to the whole "It's all downhill from here" nonsense that we all are resisting against. If 38 year olds could lend there learning and 28 year olds their "youth", without self-deprecation, without judgment, without assumptions, I think we as women especially could do so much more.

I said that because I am perplexed by the fact that so many of the sisters here under 30 are complaining about "getting old".








The way I hear it, I MUST be geriatric. I passed 30 eight years ago.
I am quite comfortable in my age and I don't think it's "downhill from here". I certainly don't think I'm old.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I said that because I am perplexed by the fact that so many of the sisters here under 30 are complaining about "getting old".








The way I hear it, I MUST be geriatric. I passed 30 eight years ago.
I am quite comfortable in my age and I don't think it's "downhill from here". I certainly don't think I'm old.

Oh, I see.

Well, actually, I don't really get the sense that anyone here under 30 is complaining about getting old.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm actually on Eilonwy's side with this (not that we're choosing sides!).
I'll be 38 in less than a month. I feel a little apprehensive about it, but it doesn't bother me that much. I wouldn't want to go back to being in my twenties for anything. I am a much wiser, more settled and happier person now that I'm in my late 30's.
I do sometimes wish I had DS when I was younger because I want to haveat least one more, but I think I'm a much better mother because I'm older.
I am lucky that I look younger than I am, I guess, despite the greys (I call them "Paulie Walnuts" because I get greys on the sides like Paulie on "The Sopranos") and I do dye my hair, but otherwise, I'm pretty cool with my age.
Compared to some of you, I'm downright geriatric.

I think you kind of missed the point. No one here says they want to be young again. That wasn't actually the discussion. It was why hide your age? Almost everyone here is "fine with their age" that's not an issue. Going back to my twenties? The only way I would go back is if I could have the head I have now.


----------



## jeca

Some kind of way I got talked into going on a hike later this morning. We are going to hike this.







:
http://www.manitouincline.net/
That path in the mountain is all stairs. If you don't see me on later this afternoon. Send someone for me. I want to just sleep in today so why am I torturing myself instead?


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Some kind of way I got talked into going on a hike later this morning. We are going to hike this.







:
http://www.manitouincline.net/
That path in the mountain is all stairs. If you don't see me on later this afternoon. Send someone for me. I want to just sleep in today so why am I torturing myself instead?

wow that looks amazing!







be careful on the way back down--that's the part I'd be concerned about! and plan something relaxing for afterwards. It might be a good opportunity to get some thinking done about your next steps since the program is closing soon.

have fun







:


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think you kind of missed the point. No one here says they want to be young again. That wasn't actually the discussion. It was why hide your age? Almost everyone here is "fine with their age" that's not an issue. Going back to my twenties? The only way I would go back is if I could have the head I have now.









:

My point is mostly that I really don't appreciate being told "A woman who will reveal her age will reveal anything." It didn't come across as an expression of opinion, it came across as saying... well, as an absolutely obnoxious insult. It's possible that I read too much into it, but I asked half a dozen other people and they all got the same message from it that I did. I think it was an extremely inappropriate response, and I'm really freaking pissed about it. I'm taking a break from this thread for a while.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I don't have any qualms with my age, only what I have accomplished thus far in life.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Some kind of way I got talked into going on a hike later this morning. We are going to hike this.







:
http://www.manitouincline.net/
That path in the mountain is all stairs. If you don't see me on later this afternoon. Send someone for me. I want to just sleep in today so why am I torturing myself instead?

Whoa! It is beautiful and many props to you for hiking it! Can't wait to hear about it!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I think you kind of missed the point. No one here says they want to be young again. That wasn't actually the discussion. It was why hide your age? Almost everyone here is "fine with their age" that's not an issue. Going back to my twenties? The only way I would go back is if I could have the head I have now.

I didn't miss the point.
I'll leave it at that.
Sheesh.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I feel.....conflicted. During my reading one of the first thing he said was I see a career change. I told him that the program was in jeopardy and he told me it wasn't in jeopardy it was over. he also said it was fine because now I could concentrate on what I am suppose do be doing. The outreach program has been in this community for nine years. It's crazy to me that it's over. I use to come to the program when I was pregnant with my second. I hate to see it gone. I mean it wasn't a lot of hours but it's kind of hard to think I won't be seeing these people and some of these kids again. I'm also not really sure what's next. Do I take up something different? Go back to school? Enjoy some alone time for a bit? WHat? What's now?

wow.. that's interesting about the reading. I am sure the answer as to what's next will come to you.









The hike looks wonderful. Enjoy yourself!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







:

My point is mostly that I really don't appreciate being told "A woman who will reveal her age will reveal anything." It didn't come across as an expression of opinion, it came across as saying... well, as an absolutely obnoxious insult. It's possible that I read too much into it, but I asked half a dozen other people and they all got the same message from it that I did. I think it was an extremely inappropriate response, and I'm really freaking pissed about it. I'm taking a break from this thread for a while.











Rynna, I don't know what to say. What you find to be an obnoxious insult is a truth by which I live. If you or anyone were to ask me my age to my face, that would be one of many answers that I might choose to give.

I find it amusing though that you are annoyed with my outlook on aging. My post was not directed towards you, but to the conversation in general.

If my random comment freaking p&^%$d you off perhaps there is something else that is bothering you. My desire was not to push anyone into a WOC hiatus, but if that brings you peace, then I look forward to your return.


----------



## purplegirl

I wasn't offended by the comment either. I read it as more tongue in cheek and while I might not agree with it, I found it amusing. Rynna, I hope you won't go away because of it. Lots of stuff that is said on the internet can be misinterpreted because it isn't the most optimal means of communicating.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Lots of stuff that is said on the internet can be misinterpreted because it isn't the most optimal means of communicating.

















:

I was just having a conversation with a friend yesterday about how it can sometimes be hard to read people's tone when chatting or posting on the internet, especially if you don't know them up close and personal.

On another note, how did you all choose names for you little ones? We don't know the sex of the baby--we're waiting for the surprise--and we have a few names in mind that we've batted around (and aren't telling) but I feel like I don't have enough options, and we wouldn't decide on a name before the baby comes out anyway. We want to see who this little being is first, you know? But what kind of process did you all go through--did you use names that've been in your family, look up names, have a dream, what?


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I didn't miss the point.
I'll leave it at that.
Sheesh.

I'll drop it since I'm too tired to ask what the sheesh was for. What you said wasn't what we were discussing so I though you misunderstood.
Sheesh.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:

I was just having a conversation with a friend yesterday about how it can sometimes be hard to read people's tone when chatting or posting on the internet, especially if you don't know them up close and personal.

I definately agree. I'm naturally a very sarcastic person who likes to tease my favorite friends. And, I have to be very careful on the internet because goddess knows, I have offended (inadvertently) many women whom I admired in writing..

I think most of you know how old I am... I personally can't imagine hiding that but if some one chooses to, I can absolutely see the validity in that. Because not only am I young, I also LOOK young, so I've had my share of being treated like a child. Like at halloween when a woman gave me candy as well as my dd, saying, "here's one for you. You are a kid too, aren't you"







:
Of course, I replied with "OH no! This is my kid but I'll take the candy, thank you!"
There's enough age discrimination on both sides..
So, in sum, I completely understand.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I hate that idea that we would make the best mothers at this age or that. No, you make the best mother when you truly want to be a mother in my book.

Amen, sister!


----------



## purplegirl

Jeca,

So how was the hike?? Don't leave us in suspense


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I wasn't offended by the comment either. I read it as more tongue in cheek and while I might not agree with it, I found it amusing. Rynna, I hope you won't go away because of it. Lots of stuff that is said on the internet can be misinterpreted because it isn't the most optimal means of communicating.









I agree with this, sadly jokes and or sarcasm don't come across well online at all. I hold back quite a bit online because IRL I am known for being a smart-ass







and I have learned it doesn't translate well at all. I also took Andrew's Mothers comment as being tongue in cheek as well, oddly enough I had someone ask me my age the other day (was being interviewed for local paper because of my new position) and I actually said my age is irrelevant, lets just say I am old enough.







I am not ashamed of my age but at 35, some would say I am young to be running an agency that is well known and established and I hate the youngin comments.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:

On another note, how did you all choose names for you little ones? We don't know the sex of the baby--we're waiting for the surprise--and we have a few names in mind that we've batted around (and aren't telling) but I feel like I don't have enough options, and we wouldn't decide on a name before the baby comes out anyway. We want to see who this little being is first, you know? But what kind of process did you all go through--did you use names that've been in your family, look up names, have a dream, what?

I knew I was having a girl, we came up with some names but I waited until dd was born before we named her. One name I loved was Soledad, well that name is so not my girl. I wanted to see who she was before we named her, she was 4-5 days old before we settled on her name. Its got a lot of energy but it fits her perfectly.

Her first name is hers but she has two middle names, since both my and dh's mother's passed away before dd was born, her middle names are their first names. Which is a kinda family tradition as both my son and brother have 2 middle names and they are both for relatives that passed on.

Shay


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







:

My point is mostly that I really don't appreciate being told "A woman who will reveal her age will reveal anything." It didn't come across as an expression of opinion, it came across as saying... well, as an absolutely obnoxious insult. It's possible that I read too much into it, but I asked half a dozen other people and they all got the same message from it that I did. I think it was an extremely inappropriate response, and I'm really freaking pissed about it. I'm taking a break from this thread for a while.

eilonwy,

sorry you feel you need a break from us!

i've been following the discussion. i too have felt the pressure to hide my age or even lie about it. i'm 36. so far i've never lied. i'm proud of my life with all its triumphs and disappointments. i also love bday parties so i seem to have public disclosures of my age every year or so. anyway, for what its worth it annoys me too when women over 30 suddenly are cloaking their age. yes, its a personal decision but like so many personal choices it does add to the idea that aging is a problem or a hinderence to excitement, health and beauty. as i approach 40 this really bugs me. but what's really offensive is a culture that makes women feel washed up by 35. its absurd, ridiculous and hurtful.

but on another note, there are certain cultures where exact age is a powerfully personal piece of info that can be used against an individual so many folks do not tell their exact age to most people. for example, in haiti and ghana, this often the case. so my DH, for one, hardly tells anyone his real age.

still, i get what rootzdawta was talking about---i do often feel like that with my under 30 friends. i'm guilty of saying: "you'll feel me when your such and such age." i'm sure its annoying, but it comes from a real place. the grown up i was at 26 is not the same grown up woman i am at 36. on the other hand, i sometimes feel like my younger more ambitious friends judge me like they'll be more "successful/happy/rich" by the time their my age.

so this age thang is a trip.

i do however respect mamas at any age---cause three months into this, i'm exhausted (and in awe and very sensitive to this little being







).

lastly, though, what's up with the plastic surgery every where i look? check jada pinkett-smith on the cover of essence magazine this month--- is her face reconstructed or what??? this is what's disgusting me these days. i know they are celebrities in a celebrity informed world but sheesh it'd be nice to have more black women, and all women, in the limelight age gracefully and publicly---with their god given body parts!!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 

On another note, how did you all choose names for you little ones? We don't know the sex of the baby--we're waiting for the surprise--and we have a few names in mind that we've batted around (and aren't telling) but I feel like I don't have enough options, and we wouldn't decide on a name before the baby comes out anyway. We want to see who this little being is first, you know? But what kind of process did you all go through--did you use names that've been in your family, look up names, have a dream, what?

Before we found out that DS was a boy we tossed around names for a child of both genders. From an early age I knew that I wanted to name my son William and my daughter Emily or Lauren. DH was set on Khadijah for a girl, but I don't like that name at all.

Once we learned that I was expecting a boy I came up with the name William John Bradley XXXXXX. William for my father and his father, john for my grandfather and Bradley is DH's mother's maiden name. DH did not want to name our so after family so he suggested William Jefferson. Nooooo, way! I never cared for Bill Clinton so William Jefferson was not an acceptable choice.

We tossed around a few names, but our choice was perfect. His first name means man or warrior and his second Nathaniel means gift of God.

I called him Andrew from the day we discovered his gender and upon his birth the name fit perfectly.


----------



## purplegirl

I don't have children so I haven't experienced the naming ritual







But I love the name Soledad, Shay. Of course I have a major crush on Soledad O'brien so that easily explains that!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Jeca,

So how was the hike?? Don't leave us in suspense









i wanted to go for a hike on a nearby mountain past weekend--but i was feeling too lazy to get it together! colorado? i love mountains. i love breathing up there. so how was it?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
still, i get what rootzdawta was talking about---i do often feel like that with my under 30 friends. i'm guilty of saying: "you'll feel me when your such and such age." i'm sure its annoying, but it comes from a real place. the grown up i was at 26 is not the same grown up woman i am at 36. on the other hand, i sometimes feel like my younger more ambitious friends judge me like they'll be more "successful/happy/rich" by the time their my age.

so this age thang is a trip.


What you wrote really resonated with me, I never try to be condescending towards my younger friends but at the same time like you, where I was 10 years ago seems a life time ago. By the time I was almost 26, I had been married, had a baby, divorced and remarried so from sheer life experience I was pretty advanced for my age.









However since entering my 30's and now that I am creeping up on 40, it seems like I have undergone an emotional and spiritual growth that is hard to explain. I definitely feel like when I turned 35, there was some sort of line in the sand thing that happened that despite looking younger, I just knew I was getting older. Yet its not a bad thing, with age can come come some amazing wisdom. Heck, I see my gray hair as a sign of wisdom and considering my own Mama died at 50, I look forward to getting really gray and hopefully wise, though I hope my spirit always stays youthful.









You also mentioned the whole by the time I get XYZ age I will be successful thing, its funny because I remember being in my 20's and setting these goals which I did make. The biggest goals were getting my BA and Masters, and wanting to land my first director level position by 30. Well I was 31 when I became an Executive Director the first time, 32 when I got my Masters. Funny that in the end those things were not nearly as meaningful as I thought they would be.

Now I pray and strive to be a good and Godly mother and wife, my goals are spiritual rather than based off some arbitrary symbol of outside success. The older I get the more aware I am that are time here is limited, so I am not striving to obtain things since as my Dad who is a preacher used to joke, when is the last time you saw a moving truck attached to a hearst? Very true, we bring nothing with us when we enter this world and we can't take anything either. So to focus on stuff that doesn't last is no longer important, it took getting a bit older for me to really get that.

I figure if I wake up every day, and me and my kids and hubby are healthy, have a roof over our heads and food, then its all good.









Shay


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I called him Andrew from the day we discovered his gender and upon his birth the name fit perfectly.

I love Andrew.. definately a timeless, handsome name.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I don't have children so I haven't experienced the naming ritual







But I love the name Soledad, Shay. Of course I have a major crush on Soledad O'brien so that easily explains that!

Ooo Soledad meaning solitude? I really like it. Of course, I'm not having any more babies so I won't be "stealing" it from you
















My dd's middle name is Lauren.. (of course, it was my dh who chose it) and Amira (meaning princess, prosperous). It was just one of the first names on the list and when she came out, she totally looked like an Amira.

So far, she really has lived upto her name.







as in very feminine yet very much a "fixer".. very sweet, polite, and just generally adorable. Ok, I'll shut it.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
I love Andrew.. definately a timeless, handsome name.

Ooo Soledad meaning solitude? I really like it. Of course, I'm not having any more babies so I won't be "stealing" it from you
















*My dd's middle name is Lauren.. (of course, it was my dh who chose it) and Amira (meaning princess, prosperous). It was just one of the first names on the list and when she came out, she totally looked like an Amira.

So far, she really has lived upto her name.







as in very feminine yet very much a "fixer".. very sweet, polite, and just generally adorable. Ok, I'll shut it.*









Beautiful mama..just beautiful


----------



## Jannah6

My children attend a predominately Arab school, it's a private Muslim school. It seems that my 4 year old DD has been teased about her braids







:







. The same thing happened to my 7 year old DD last year, so I called her teacher and she had a talk with the students on 'being different'. I am so freakin MAD and fed up with this CRAP!!!
I angry that DH really doesn't get it. He has bis ears and a big head














. and equates being teased about his ears/head with being teased about ones hair. I don't think it's the same thing since being teased about your hair can be a racial thing. Do you ladies think that I'm right on this?

I think my DD is very cute in her braids and she has never had problem with wearing them. http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z129/Jannah5/004.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...nah5/003-1.jpg

The other day she said that she didn't like braids. When DH picked her up from school she was wearing her hood. When he asked her why, she said that someone teased her about them. So he explained that everyone had differences and pointed out people in the street. He also told about his stories of being teased as child about his ears.
So, I have to have yet another talk with a teacher







. Yet another reason for me to wish for a boy this time around


----------



## rootzdawta

Jannah, I don't know if it's different than having big ears or something. I went to school with predominantly African-American and Latino kids. Many of the AA kids wore their hair in cornrows. It was an acceptable style. I used to wear my hair in a traditional African style where thread is used to wrap the hair. I endured endless teasing and begged my mother to just cornrow it. She did. Now later on in life, the pressure was to straighten it which I also begged my mother to do. She did. By doing these things, she confirmed that what I had was actually defective . . . not on purpose but we know actions speak louder than words.

That being said, you can try an non-braided style one day to see what the reaction would be. I know that might be a royal PITA but you'd be able to gauge if they are making fun of her hair or the style.

It seems to me that along with school comes a certain amount of teasing. Even if you tell the teacher to do something about it, he's not there every moment to monitor what is being said to your child. As such, I think it's so very important to 1) expose her regularly to other children who look like her and 2) to speak to her about her beauty every day, caress her hair lovingly and strongly counteract whatever is going on in school.

FWIW, my DH doesn't understand how damaging teasing about the physical attributes of a girl can be. This society does not place as much emphasis on how a man looks. For girls, though, the pressure is on.

I'd certainly speak to the teacher again but if I were to keep my daughter in that school, I'd do more speaking to her.

You can tell your lovely daughter that you showed her picture with her cornrows here online and the folks thought she was absolutely stunning. Because she is.


----------



## Jannah6

This thread really moves fast, doesn't it.

*Rootzdawta* thank you very much for your input and for the beautiful comment you gave my DD. I spoke to my DD about how much I loved her braids, but she just frowned








I'll speak to the teacher and leave it at that. You know I thought about unbraiding her hair and blow drying it, but I'm not going to. I don't want to send my DD the message that something is wrong with having braided hair.

As for the *eilonwy* situation, something similar happened to me a few years ago. I was on a yahoo group with about 5 other women. I made a comment and ended it with a smiley face, but the women I directed it to was offended. I explained myself and even apologized, to no avail. In fact another woman on the group took the opportunity to become more of an UAV, then she already was. Needless to say I left the group, something I should have done sooner.
That being said. I'm 33 and never lie about my age. Shooo, I like it when people tell me I look good for my age







.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My children attend a predominately Arab school, it's a private Muslim school. It seems that my 4 year old DD has been teased about her braids







:







. The same thing happened to my 7 year old DD last year, so I called her teacher and she had a talk with the students on 'being different'. I am so freakin MAD and fed up with this CRAP!!!
I angry that DH really doesn't get it. He has bis ears and a big head














. and equates being teased about his ears/head with being teased about ones hair. I don't think it's the same thing since being teased about your hair can be a racial thing. Do you ladies think that I'm right on this?

I think my DD is very cute in her braids and she has never had problem with wearing them. http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z129/Jannah5/004.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...nah5/003-1.jpg

The other day she said that she didn't like braids. When DH picked her up from school she was wearing her hood. When he asked her why, she said that someone teased her about them. So he explained that everyone had differences and pointed out people in the street. He also told about his stories of being teased as child about his ears.
So, I have to have yet another talk with a teacher







. Yet another reason for me to wish for a boy this time around









Jannah, your daughter is beautiful! What do her classmates say about her braids?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
This thread really moves fast, doesn't it.

*Rootzdawta* thank you very much for your input and for the beautiful comment you gave my DD. I spoke to my DD about how much I loved her braids, but she just frowned








I'll speak to the teacher and leave it at that. You know I thought about unbraiding her hair and blow drying it, but I'm not going to. I don't want to send my DD the message that something is wrong with having braided hair.


Did your daughter like her braids before being teased. I never liked braids as a child because they did not have a fresh look to them each and every day. I also never thought that I looked like a girl when my hair was braided. Two ponytails with coordinating ribbon at the base of the ponytail and small barrettes at the bottom was my favorite style. Did your daughter have a preference before?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My children attend a predominately Arab school, it's a private Muslim school. It seems that my 4 year old DD has been teased about her braids







:







. The same thing happened to my 7 year old DD last year, so I called her teacher and she had a talk with the students on 'being different'. I am so freakin MAD and fed up with this CRAP!!!
I angry that DH really doesn't get it. He has bis ears and a big head














. and equates being teased about his ears/head with being teased about ones hair. I don't think it's the same thing since being teased about your hair can be a racial thing. Do you ladies think that I'm right on this?

I think my DD is very cute in her braids and she has never had problem with wearing them. http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z129/Jannah5/004.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...nah5/003-1.jpg

The other day she said that she didn't like braids. When DH picked her up from school she was wearing her hood. When he asked her why, she said that someone teased her about them. So he explained that everyone had differences and pointed out people in the street. He also told about his stories of being teased as child about his ears.
So, I have to have yet another talk with a teacher







. Yet another reason for me to wish for a boy this time around









Your daughter looks so cute and can I just say I wish I could braid my girl's hair that well. My girl wants braids but my skills are lacking, she gets what I call dookey braids to sleep in at night and during the day I do 2 braids but they inevitably come apart halfway through the day.

That said, when I was little, my Momma always braided my hair and I hated it because for starters I was the only speck of color in the class and I just wanted my hair to be straight like the other girls.







That said I am more likely to agree with you as far as the teasing issue. Yeah, boys are so much easier to deal with as far as hair.

I have been having the darndest time with dd and her hair, there is another biracial girl in her class at daycare whose Momma does amazing braids and dd wants me to do her hair like that and it aian't happening. It seems dd is tired of my preferred pony puffs we were doing every day before she started on the braid kick. It doesn't help that dd's hair is a loose curl texture so its not at all like my hair which means I have even less ideas of how to handle. However my son has the same texture and with him when he was little, it was just a matter of taking him to the barber.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 

I have been having the darndest time with dd and her hair, there is another biracial girl in her class at daycare whose Momma does amazing braids and dd wants me to do her hair like that and it aian't happening. It seems dd is tired of my preferred pony puffs we were doing every day before she started on the braid kick. It doesn't help that dd's hair is a loose curl texture so its not at all like my hair which means I have even less ideas of how to handle. However my son has the same texture and with him when he was little, it was just a matter of taking him to the barber.

Shay, go to www.naturallycurly.com . If your girl's a curly, then her hair requires special treatment. There is a forum there specifically for parents of curlies.







One thing I can tell you right off is to finger comb her hair with conditioner gently (avoid anything with a 'cone- dimethicone, for example) and don't use harsh shampoos on her hair. If you do use shampoo, use something sulfate free. Shampoos strip the hair of moisture which also destroys the curl. Anyway, take a look at Naturally Curly for more info. It may help!
My DS has curly, curly hair in the back and a loose wave in the front. My own hair is 3a/b/c. The back of that head is always tangly! I just detangle his hair every morning with a little water and use my fingers to form curls.

*Jannah*, your little girl is a beauty! So gorgeous!
I think it's best to reassure her of the beauty of her own hair, and to maybe expose her to other children with similar hair and hairstyles. It's tough for young African American girls when they see other African American women who are famous with straight hair, weaves and wigs.








Before anyone jumps on me, I'm not putting down anyone who straightens their hair. Your hair- your business. I do think that it would be nice for children to see women with their hair it's natural state as beautiful.


----------



## shayinme

I remember naturallycurly, I used to go there years ago but stopped. I'm more of a nappturality sista, however I may need to pay them a visit and get some useful tips for managing the little misses coif.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Jannah, I don't know if it's different than having big ears or something. I went to school with predominantly African-American and Latino kids. Many of the AA kids wore their hair in cornrows. It was an acceptable style. I used to wear my hair in a traditional African style where thread is used to wrap the hair. I endured endless teasing and begged my mother to just cornrow it. She did. Now later on in life, the pressure was to straighten it which I also begged my mother to do. She did. By doing these things, she confirmed that what I had was actually defective . . . not on purpose but we know actions speak louder than words.

That being said, you can try an non-braided style one day to see what the reaction would be. I know that might be a royal PITA but you'd be able to gauge if they are making fun of her hair or the style.

It seems to me that along with school comes a certain amount of teasing. Even if you tell the teacher to do something about it, he's not there every moment to monitor what is being said to your child. As such, I think it's so very important to 1) expose her regularly to other children who look like her and 2) to speak to her about her beauty every day, caress her hair lovingly and strongly counteract whatever is going on in school.

FWIW, my DH doesn't understand how damaging teasing about the physical attributes of a girl can be. This society does not place as much emphasis on how a man looks. For girls, though, the pressure is on.

I'd certainly speak to the teacher again but if I were to keep my daughter in that school, I'd do more speaking to her.

*You can tell your lovely daughter that you showed her picture with her cornrows here online and the folks thought she was absolutely stunning. Because she* is.










I agree with all that you have said, especially the bolded part









My bff has a lovely young daughter and insists on reinforcing the message that she has 'bad hair'. The child's hair is thick, long and healthy. She frequently takes her child to the salon where she gets her hair straightened. Then and only then does this 8 year old feel pretty. Every opportunity I get, I point out children who look like her and have similarly textured hair and remark on how beautiful they are. This child is in a school where she is the only child of color. I understand the pressure she feels to have straight blond hair but it takes the strength of a parent to reinforce that her hair is fine just the way it is.
I am posting on the run but this is an issue that is very emotional to me having grown up hating my looks but especially my hair.
Back later.............


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I agree with all that you have said, especially the bolded part









My bff has a lovely young daughter and insists on reinforcing the message that she has 'bad hair'. The child's hair is thick, long and healthy. She frequently takes her child to the salon where she gets her hair straightened. Then and only then does this 8 year old feel pretty. Every opportunity I get, I point out children who look like her and have similarly textured hair and remark on how beautiful they are. This child is in a school where she is the only child of color. I understand the pressure she feels to have straight blond hair but it takes the strength of a parent to reinforce that her hair is fine just the way it is.
I am posting on the run but this is an issue that is very emotional to me having grown up hating my looks but especially my hair.
Back later.............

This is so sad to me.
There was a teacher who I used to work with when I taught a few years ago who had serious identity issues. She has 3 sons. Her youngest son, who was in my class, was half white with sandy hair and fairly light skin. She used to make him grow his hair long, take the poor boy to a salon and have his hair relaxed and blown straight. He was 7.







: The other kids in the school (the school was predominantly black, with some Arabic and some Hispanic children)used to tease him. I'm sure he probably would've been happier fitting in with his peers by not being taken to a beauty salon to get his hair permed.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I remember naturallycurly, I used to go there years ago but stopped. I'm more of a nappturality sista, however I may need to pay them a visit and get some useful tips for managing the little misses coif.

Shay

I used to visit nappturality myself, but found that "Naturally Curly" was a better fit. I'm not that nappy.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Did your daughter like her braids before being teased. I never liked braids as a child because they did not have a fresh look to them each and every day. I also never thought that I looked like a girl when my hair was braided. Two ponytails with coordinating ribbon at the base of the ponytail and small barrettes at the bottom was my favorite style. Did your daughter have a preference before?

I really like this suggestion.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Jannah, I don't know if it's different than having big ears or something. I went to school with predominantly African-American and Latino kids. Many of the AA kids wore their hair in cornrows. It was an acceptable style. I used to wear my hair in a traditional African style where thread is used to wrap the hair. I endured endless teasing and begged my mother to just cornrow it. She did. Now later on in life, the pressure was to straighten it which I also begged my mother to do. She did. By doing these things, she confirmed that what I had was actually defective . . . not on purpose but we know actions speak louder than words.

That being said, you can try an non-braided style one day to see what the reaction would be. I know that might be a royal PITA but you'd be able to gauge if they are making fun of her hair or the style.

It seems to me that along with school comes a certain amount of teasing. Even if you tell the teacher to do something about it, he's not there every moment to monitor what is being said to your child. As such, I think it's so very important to 1) expose her regularly to other children who look like her and 2) to speak to her about her beauty every day, caress her hair lovingly and strongly counteract whatever is going on in school.

FWIW, my DH doesn't understand how damaging teasing about the physical attributes of a girl can be. This society does not place as much emphasis on how a man looks. For girls, though, the pressure is on.

I'd certainly speak to the teacher again but if I were to keep my daughter in that school, I'd do more speaking to her.

You can tell your lovely daughter that you showed her picture with her cornrows here online and the folks thought she was absolutely stunning. Because she is.









This is great advice too and I absolutely agree with the last part!









Jannah,







to you and your daughter. Unfortunately, I don't have any hair advice but your daughter is beautiful!

On a related note:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Shay, go to www.naturallycurly.com . .

whoa!! how did I not know about Naturally Curly before? Thank you! Thank you! I cannot tear myself away from that site now.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
I really like this suggestion.

This is great advice too and I absolutely agree with the last part!









Jannah,







to you and your daughter. Unfortunately, I don't have any hair advice but your daughter is beautiful!

On a related note:

whoa!! how did I not know about Naturally Curly before? Thank you! Thank you! I cannot tear myself away from that site now.









I learned a lot about hair care from that site, and my hair has never been healthier.


----------



## Bloomingstar

I've never been to nautrallycurly but I will check it out. Mostly trial and error on this end, with some help from the people at the hair salon I finally found to get a decent haircut from. It's the people who make the devacurl stuff.

Thanks for the naming stories ladies









I think we may have found an apartment last night--fingers crossed that we'll get it!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Good luck Bloomingstar.

As for hair, I just cut the rest of mine. It is VERY VERY short as opposed to being short. I am going back to my tired and true products. Suave conditoner, coconut oil and black gel.

No matter what the experts say my hair thrives when it is conditioned daily(no poo method) moisturized with coconut oil and defined with black gel. I have heard that black gel flake and makes the hair hard but I never had that problem.

Hair, whew!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I've never been to nautrallycurly but I will check it out. Mostly trial and error on this end, with some help from the people at the hair salon I finally found to get a decent haircut from. It's the people who make the devacurl stuff.

Thanks for the naming stories ladies









I think we may have found an apartment last night--fingers crossed that we'll get it!

I got my hair done at Devachan (the Deva people!) . They really, really know curly hair. I love 'em. Thanks to them, after 37 years of working against my hair, I'm finally working with it.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Good luck Bloomingstar.

As for hair, I just cut the rest of mine. It is VERY VERY short as opposed to being short. I am going back to my tired and true products. Suave conditoner, coconut oil and black gel.

No matter what the experts say my hair thrives when it is conditioned daily(no poo method) moisturized with coconut oil and defined with black gel. I have heard that black gel flake and makes the hair hard but I never had that problem.

Hair, whew!

I no'poo too, and condition every day. I do cleanse my hair once a week with Devacurl's No Poo cleanser, but that's it. It's definitely the best thing I've ever done for my hair. What's black gel?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I no'poo too, and condition every day. I do cleanse my hair once a week with Devacurl's No Poo cleanser, but that's it. It's definitely the best thing I've ever done for my hair. What's black gel?

My anti frizz miracle: Black Gel or protein gel. Based on my observations it only flakes on coarse hair. A little goes a long way to keep a pull back styled smooth.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
My anti frizz miracle: Black Gel or protein gel. Based on my observations it only flakes on coarse hair. A little goes a long way to keep a pull back styled smooth.

I like the black gel. It never flakes or makes my hair crunchy either. I'll try the no-poo method. but my current regime is to slather my hair in amla oil. then, I wash it with shampoo and condition it and brush it in the shower with a wide tooth comb. I let it air dry and while its damp, I'll sometimes use the black gel and go. I'd like to wean myself from the gel and try a good leave-in though. just because, I don't think my hair is all that healthy. I'm still fighting frizz and breakage though. The black gel is not as long-lasting for me.. The weather around here of course makes everything hard.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
I like the black gel. It never flakes or makes my hair crunchy either. I'll try the no-poo method. but my current regime is to slather my hair in amla oil. then, I wash it with shampoo and condition it and brush it in the shower with a wide tooth comb. I let it air dry and while its damp, I'll sometimes use the black gel and go. I'd like to wean myself from the gel and try a good leave-in though. just because, I don't think my hair is all that healthy. I'm still fighting frizz and breakage though. The black gel is not as long-lasting for me.. The weather around here of course makes everything hard.

Do you comb out the gel or wash it out. combing it out will break off your hair if it is dry. I mixed the coconut oil and black gel to prevent dryness


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Do you comb out the gel or wash it out. combing it out will break off your hair if it is dry. I mixed the coconut oil and black gel to prevent dryness

yeah, I brush it out but it's almost always damp.. hmm, I've never tried the oil combo with the gel. wouldn't that make your hair greasy?

I always put the amla oil in my hair before I wash it out so I can retain the moisture but it gets rid of most of it and keeps it non-greasy.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
yeah, I brush it out but it's almost always damp.. hmm, I've never tried the oil combo with the gel. wouldn't that make your hair greasy?

I always put the amla oil in my hair before I wash it out so I can retain the moisture but it gets rid of most of it and keeps it non-greasy.

I don't use a lot. maybe a quarter size amount of both for my whole head. I had to experiment to find the right combination. My hair is not dry, but it is prone to dryness so oil is easily absorbed.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
I like the black gel. It never flakes or makes my hair crunchy either. I'll try the no-poo method. but my current regime is to slather my hair in amla oil. then, I wash it with shampoo and condition it and brush it in the shower with a wide tooth comb. I let it air dry and while its damp, I'll sometimes use the black gel and go. I'd like to wean myself from the gel and try a good leave-in though. just because, I don't think my hair is all that healthy. I'm still fighting frizz and breakage though. The black gel is not as long-lasting for me.. The weather around here of course makes everything hard.

Mind if I suggest something?
When you put any styling product in your hair, put it in while your hair is soaking wet.
This is what I do:
1. using a lot of conditioner (make sure it doesn't have any ingredients that end in "cone"- these build up on your hair and create dullness, dryness and frizz), condition my hair and detangle with my fingers, section by section, only. I don't use a comb or a brush ever as a brush creates frizz.
2. after rinsing my hair (I leave a little conditioner in) and my hair is soaking wet, I hang my head forward (upside down) and apply product by scrunching it in. I use Fantasia Hair Gel and Curly Q Custard. I try not to disturb the curl at all so I only scrunch. I don't comb it in or rake it through my hair.
3. finally, I blot my hair dry with a microfiber towel (you can use an old t-shirt)or I wrap my hair in the microfiber towel to get it even more dry. Terry cloth towels are frizz makers! Never rub your hair with a towel, either!
4. when I take my hair out of the towel, it's usually a little damp. If it's too wet, I either blow dry it using a diffuser with my head upside down or I sit under a hood dryer.
5. when my hair is dry, I either scrunch it again with my head upside down to get the crunch out of my curls. Usually, my hair isn't that frizzy when I'm done at all.
This method was taught to me at Devachan, a salon that caters specifically to curly hair.
Keep reading that website. You'll find lots of great ideas on how to take care of your hair.
Hope that helps a little.


----------



## Jannah6

Thank yo ladies or the replies and the compliments. I asked my DD about the responses that she got from her classmates about her hair. She said that 1 girl said that she didn't like the braids. My DD likes to tell TALL tales, so I don't know if the classmate was that blunt about it.

I'm not a hair person, I cut mine about every 2 years. My niece actually braids my 2 DD's hair. As for pony tails, I was mostly doing them for DD before she started school. I just don't have the time to do that every day. Especially since her hair gets fuzzy easily. I use curly q's for the girls and curls products for myself.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...sponyTails.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...uhammedNia.jpg


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Mind if I suggest something?
*When you put any styling product in your hair, put it in while your hair is soaking wet.*
This is what I do:
1. using a lot of conditioner (make sure it doesn't have any ingredients that end in "cone"- these build up on your hair and create dullness, dryness and frizz), condition my hair and detangle with my fingers, section by section, only. I don't use a comb or a brush ever as a brush creates frizz.
2. after rinsing my hair (I leave a little conditioner in) and my hair is soaking wet, I hang my head forward (upside down) and apply product by scrunching it in. I use Fantasia Hair Gel and Curly Q Custard. I try not to disturb the curl at all so I only scrunch. I don't comb it in or rake it through my hair.
3. finally, I blot my hair dry with a microfiber towel (you can use an old t-shirt)or I wrap my hair in the microfiber towel to get it even more dry. Terry cloth towels are frizz makers! Never rub your hair with a towel, either!
4. when I take my hair out of the towel, it's usually a little damp. If it's too wet, I either blow dry it using a diffuser with my head upside down or I sit under a hood dryer.
5. when my hair is dry, I either scrunch it again with my head upside down to get the crunch out of my curls. Usually, my hair isn't that frizzy when I'm done at all.
This method was taught to me at Devachan, a salon that caters specifically to curly hair.
Keep reading that website. You'll find lots of great ideas on how to take care of your hair.
Hope that helps a little.










I also use to put the oil and gel in my hair soaking wet. I also put conditioner on dry hair then let it set 30 minutes or so before I washed when my hair was extra tangly. I add a little conditioner after I have no-pooed my hair.

I don't know why I changed my routine, but I am paying for it now.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Thank yo ladies or the replies and the compliments. I asked my DD about the responses that she got from her classmates about her hair. She said that 1 girl said that she didn't like the braids. My DD likes to tell TALL tales, so I don't know if the classmate was that blunt about it.

I'm not a hair person, I cut mine about every 2 years. My niece actually braids my 2 DD's hair. As for pony tails, I was mostly doing them for DD before she started school. I just don't have the time to do that every day. Especially since her hair gets fuzzy easily. I use curly q's for the girls and curls products for myself.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...sponyTails.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...uhammedNia.jpg

Jannah, your girls are beautiful. I can imagine that combing hair everyday day takes up a too much time.


----------



## rootzdawta

Are the terms curly and nappy interchangeable?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Are the terms curly and nappy interchangeable?

I think so, with the difference being how tightly coiled the hair is.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I've never been to nautrallycurly but I will check it out. Mostly trial and error on this end, with some help from the people at the hair salon I finally found to get a decent haircut from. It's the people who make the devacurl stuff.

Thanks for the naming stories ladies









I think we may have found an apartment last night--fingers crossed that we'll get it!

Woohooo. Fingers crossed for you mama







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I think so, with the difference being how tightly coiled the hair is.

Cool. Just wondering if I missed a convo or something and we're not supposed to use "nappy".


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Cool. Just wondering if I missed a convo or something and we're not supposed to use "nappy".

My hair is undoubtedly, unquestionably nappy. Up close, it is tightly, very tightly, curly


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
My hair is undoubtedly, unquestionably nappy. Up close, it is tightly, very tightly, curly









LoL . . . I hear that. I just call mine "coily"!! Well, it was. Right now, I'm rocking a dark caesar so it's barely there.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
LoL . . . I hear that. I just call mine "coily"!! Well, it was. Right now, I'm rocking a dark caesar so it's barely there.

My sister just did the same thing and she looks amazing. Rock it girl


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
My sister just did the same thing and she looks amazing. Rock it girl









Folks have been telling me that, too.







Instead of saying "yeah right" like I used to I agree and say, "Don't I though?" LoL . . . if you know me, you know that is a *huge* change from how I used to be.

Funny enough . . . I've had at least 3 White ladies say, "Oh, white women can't wear their hair like that" and, ummm, I kinda agree. LoL.


----------



## jeca

Bloomingstar I hope you got the place.

The hike was very intense. The most intense physical activity I have done in years. I hiked the continental Divide before with kids I thought hey this couldn't be so bad. WRONG! I was not physically nor mentally prepared and it wiped me out. I am pleased to say that I did finish it. It took an hour and 20 minutes but I did finish. I actually sat down and cried at one point and begged them to turn around but those mean hefas wouldn't do it. I have a few pics that I will get posted tomarrow. I've been recovering. The next day I was so sore still am. My butt, thighs, knees, calves, and ankles hurt. I didn't even know your ankles could get sore. Then we were running short on time thanks to my slow behind so we had to jog the three mile trail down. As I was not going back down the way we came up that would have been too dangerous for my own out behind. What fun.

Funny note. At the bottom of trail there's a sign. It reads something like. There's a chance you will encounter a moutain lion on this trail. Do not panic and don't run. Make yourself tall and pick up any children as they may panic. Talk to the lion in a clear calm voice while backing away slowly.
Since when did they start understanding us? Anyway we got a kick out of it. Not to mention if I had seen the sign before we went up I probably would have stayed in the truck.


----------



## Jannah6

*Rootzdawta* I so wish that I had the courage to do that, but my head isn't the cutest. I cover my head when I go out, so it would just be my family that would see the cut, but still







. I usually cut my hair into a 2 inch fro every 2 years. You look very good with the cut









Just curious, is everyone in this group AA?


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Funny note. At the bottom of trail there's a sign. It reads something like. There's a chance you will encounter a moutain lion on this trail. Do not panic and don't run. Make yourself tall and pick up any children as they may panic. Talk to the lion in a clear calm voice while backing away slowly.
Since when did they start understanding us? Anyway we got a kick out of it. Not to mention if I had seen the sign before we went up I probably would have stayed in the truck.









:, Wonder why they have the sign at the end of the trail


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Bloomingstar I hope you got the place.

The hike was very intense. The most intense physical activity I have done in years. I hiked the continental Divide before with kids I thought hey this couldn't be so bad. WRONG! I was not physically nor mentally prepared and it wiped me out. I am pleased to say that I did finish it. It took an hour and 20 minutes but I did finish. I actually sat down and cried at one point and begged them to turn around but those mean hefas wouldn't do it. I have a few pics that I will get posted tomarrow. I've been recovering. The next day I was so sore still am. My butt, thighs, knees, calves, and ankles hurt. I didn't even know your ankles could get sore. Then we were running short on time thanks to my slow behind so we had to jog the three mile trail down. As I was not going back down the way we came up that would have been too dangerous for my own out behind. What fun.

Funny note. At the bottom of trail there's a sign. It reads something like. There's a chance you will encounter a moutain lion on this trail. Do not panic and don't run. Make yourself tall and pick up any children as they may panic. Talk to the lion in a clear calm voice while backing away slowly.
Since when did they start understanding us? Anyway we got a kick out of it. Not to mention if I had seen the sign before we went up I probably would have stayed in the truck.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Rootzdawta* I so wish that I had the courage to do that, but my head isn't the cutest. I cover my head when I go out, so it would just be my family that would see the cut, but still







. I usually cut my hair into a 2 inch fro every 2 years. You look very good with the cut









Just curious, is everyone in this group AA?

Bloomingstar, I'm keeping my fingers crossed too!

Jeca, seriously, madd props to you for doing it! You did it. It sounds so intense. I wish you a speedy recovery so that you can . . . do it again!









That mountain lion bit is funny but I've heard that all animals are naturally afraid of humans. So that if you don't react nervously or do anything that makes it think you're going to attack it, they will just back away. But that is hella funny that they had the warning at the _end_ of the trail. Like, oh, btw . . .









You know, Jannah, I cut it more out of necessity than courage but I'm finding that I definitely have to have courage to pull it off. Thanks for the compliment!









I'm not AA in the traditional sense. I'm the first generation born in the U.S. to Nigerian parents.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Are the terms curly and nappy interchangeable?

Hmmm, I'm not sure.
I'm not nappy, but I'm definitely curly. I know women who are nappy and curly, too.


----------



## Draupadi

DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







:, Wonder why they have the sign at the end of the trail
















Some people use it as a regular trail to go up the mountain if they don't want to use the incline. But if you use the incline to go up the mountain than most use the trail to get back down.

I'm AA or black whichever you prefer. I woke up tis morning much much better. They're actually going back today but I have to go to work thank goodness.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hmmm, I'm not sure.
I'm not nappy, but I'm definitely curly. I know women who are nappy and curly, too.

Hmmm, I didn't think that they were interchangeable. I I'definitely think that one can be both nappy and curly. I'm nappy, the only curly part of my hair is in the very bottom & back of my head. Funny thing is, with my DC, that's where their nappy area is.

*Rootzdawta*, or someone else who knows. How do I do more than 1 quote in a posting?


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.































to you and your DS. I hope he gets well soon.


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Hmmm, I didn't think that they were interchangeable. I I'definitely think that one can be both nappy and curly. I'm nappy, the only curly part of my hair is in the very bottom & back of my head. Funny thing is, with my DC, that's where their nappy area is.

*Rootzdawta*, or someone else who knows. *How do I do more than 1 quote in a posting?*

You see the little button next to the quote button, but before the feather button? That's the multi-quote. Click it for each post you want to quote, and it'll turn orange. Once you get to the end of the thread, hit the 'post reply' button, I think it is, and all of the posts will be quoted for you to reply to.

I'm African American, and I consider nappy to equal very tightly curled hair, so to me nappy is just a descriptor of a type of curly hair. My hair is nappy.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.









Oh Mama . .. I hope he feels better soon. Sending some healing vibes your way!


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Mind if I suggest something?
When you put any styling product in your hair, put it in while your hair is soaking wet.
This is what I do:
1. using a lot of conditioner (make sure it doesn't have any ingredients that end in "cone"- these build up on your hair and create dullness, dryness and frizz), condition my hair and detangle with my fingers, section by section, only. I don't use a comb or a brush ever as a brush creates frizz.
2. after rinsing my hair (I leave a little conditioner in) and my hair is soaking wet, I hang my head forward (upside down) and apply product by scrunching it in. I use Fantasia Hair Gel and Curly Q Custard. I try not to disturb the curl at all so I only scrunch. I don't comb it in or rake it through my hair.
3. finally, I blot my hair dry with a microfiber towel (you can use an old t-shirt)or I wrap my hair in the microfiber towel to get it even more dry. Terry cloth towels are frizz makers! Never rub your hair with a towel, either!
4. when I take my hair out of the towel, it's usually a little damp. If it's too wet, I either blow dry it using a diffuser with my head upside down or I sit under a hood dryer.
5. when my hair is dry, I either scrunch it again with my head upside down to get the crunch out of my curls. Usually, my hair isn't that frizzy when I'm done at all.
This method was taught to me at Devachan, a salon that caters specifically to curly hair.
Keep reading that website. You'll find lots of great ideas on how to take care of your hair.
Hope that helps a little.









thank you! Your advice mirrors a lot of what I've been reading on nc.com. I'll keep reading it for sure! I have been stalking the fotkis of people I consider my "hair twin" which is soo odd. I don't think I have seen anyone with exactly my kind of hair until dd was born. so, I am getting ideas on how to get along with my hair who seemingly always wants to do her own thing








and I'll be checking out the salons that teach the deva method because most stylists are always commenting on how my hair is just "wild". I'm like, "yeah, tell me something I don't know"









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Bloomingstar I hope you got the place.

The hike was very intense. The most intense physical activity I have done in years. I hiked the continental Divide before with kids I thought hey this couldn't be so bad. WRONG! I was not physically nor mentally prepared and it wiped me out. I am pleased to say that I did finish it. It took an hour and 20 minutes but I did finish. I actually sat down and cried at one point and begged them to turn around but those mean hefas wouldn't do it. I have a few pics that I will get posted tomarrow. I've been recovering. The next day I was so sore still am. My butt, thighs, knees, calves, and ankles hurt. I didn't even know your ankles could get sore. Then we were running short on time thanks to my slow behind so we had to jog the three mile trail down. As I was not going back down the way we came up that would have been too dangerous for my own out behind. What fun.

Funny note. At the bottom of trail there's a sign. It reads something like. There's a chance you will encounter a moutain lion on this trail. Do not panic and don't run. Make yourself tall and pick up any children as they may panic. Talk to the lion in a clear calm voice while backing away slowly.
Since when did they start understanding us? Anyway we got a kick out of it. Not to mention if I had seen the sign before we went up I probably would have stayed in the truck.

Oh my gosh!







@ the mean hefas. That sign sounds hilarous and oh so scary at the same time.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Rootzdawta* I so wish that I had the courage to do that, but my head isn't the cutest. I cover my head when I go out, so it would just be my family that would see the cut, but still







. I usually cut my hair into a 2 inch fro every 2 years. You look very good with the cut









Just curious, is everyone in this group AA?

I'm not American. My mother is African (from Somalia) and my dad was Arab (yemen).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.









Awwww.. I hope he feels better and you both get some rest.







: to you both.

and Oh, on another note, I think your vibes may have been working. I interviewed at a clinic that justs seems too good to be true yesterday. and another one that pays better but seems a bit stale. so we'll see.. I'm hoping I get the first clinic, of course.. They cater to women and babies. and they have midwives, lactation consultants, family docs', acupuncturists, and so much more.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.









I hope that William Feels better soon.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 

and Oh, on another note, I think your vibes may have been working. I interviewed at a clinic that justs seems too good to be true yesterday. and another one that pays better but seems a bit stale. so we'll see.. I'm hoping I get the first clinic, of course.. They cater to women and babies. and they have midwives, lactation consultants, family docs', acupuncturists, and so much more.

More good vibes for your first choice!

I don't like the term nappy, and I take offense if anyone uses it to describe my hair.

African American is not a term that I will use by choice. I am American. African American is okay, but I would rather say that I am of Ethiopian- unknown -unknown- Native American descent.

I guess that I could say that, but I don't know anything about the other side of my family. Yes, at times the continent is used to identify race, but most people list their country of orgin. Why must I be African American when others are able to be Irish-German-Turkish American.

Until then, I am an American.

African American is just to broad of a term


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
You see the little button next to the quote button, but before the feather button? That's the multi-quote. Click it for each post you want to quote, and it'll turn orange. Once you get to the end of the thread, hit the 'post reply' button, I think it is, and all of the posts will be quoted for you to reply to.

*I'm African American, and I consider nappy to equal very tightly curled hair, so to me nappy is just a descriptor of a type of curly hair. My hair is nappy*.

Yeah that!

I am black/african american. I know I have mixed heritage (don't all of us?) but it does not show itself upon me. I am a black woman living in America and there is no question that anyone sees me other than that. I think all racial descriptors are broad, but I don't see this society moving away from them any time soon. Oh well, it is what it is.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

I don't like the term nappy, and I take offense if anyone uses it to describe my hair.

African American is not a term that I will use by choice. I am American. African American is okay, but I would rather say that I am of Ethiopian- unknown -unknown- Native American descent.

I guess that I could say that, but I don't know anything about the other side of my family. Yes, at times the continent is used to identify race, but most people list their country of orgin. Why must I be African American when others are able to be Irish-German-Turkish American.

Until then, I am an American.

African American is just to broad of a term

Why don't you like the term nappy, do you view it as deragatory?

Personally, I don't use the term African American, I almost always say Black. AA isn't a term that I grew up using, so I guess I'm used to saying Black


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 

I'm African American, and I consider nappy to equal very tightly curled hair, so to me nappy is just a descriptor of a type of curly hair. My hair is nappy.

This pretty much sums me up though I am cool with being called Black too.







As for my hair, well its nappy and as I love to say I am happy to be nappy







, nappy for me is tightly curled hair and that's what I got.









Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Why don't you like the term nappy, do you view it as deragatory?

Personally, I don't use the term African American, I almost always say Black. AA isn't a term that I grew up using, so I guess I'm used to saying Black











Nappy hair often equates to bad hair and I don't believe in bad hair based on texture.

I grew up saying Black too, and even today I still use the word Black, but when asked my ethnicity I say American.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
DS woke me around 4:30am. Then he started puking up breastmilk.
Not fun.
In May when we went of vacation, DS got gastroenteritis (sp?) and was so ill. The doc where we were (in the UK) told me not to breastfeed DS for 24 hours. You can imagine how fun that was. I had to buy a breastpump and pump as I listened to DS calling for me.
So now he's throwing up again. He seems in good spirits and is perfectly happy, but the only problem is that he pukes after I nurse him. I've heard from mamas here that you should nurse thru stomach viruses, but DH is not buying it. He thinks we should follow the dr.s advice of not breastfeeding and only giving pedialyte. Easy for him to say. He doesn't have the great fun of listening to DS scream and cry for Mama.
So I'm having a fun day.









DO NOT STOP NURSING. Seriously. Meh.

Is the baby puking blood? Is there anything else going on (i.e. fever, diarrhea, "limp" baby? Is he acting sick in any other way? No? Then you're probably looking at a reaction to something that you ate; Most likely dairy, but it could be damn near anything. Pay attention to when it happens, and unless the baby starts looking dehydrated (dry around the lips, sunken fontanel, etc) and/or refusing the breast, do not replace your milk with pedialyte.







: That's really something that comes after the baby is clearly and obviously sick... and they're usually unwilling to nurse at that point anyhow.

Yes, I'm still around. World hasn't quite ended, and I feel better.

No, I'm not African-American-- I'm mixed, like a bucket of paint. I could say I'm African-American, but I feel it'd be just as disingenuous as saying I'm NA or white or whatever... and just as confusing to people. Mixed (or something ubercool like "transethnic") is pretty much all I can say without people going, "Hrm?"
















In my opinion, nappy is a degree of curliness. All nappy hair is curly, but not all curly hair is nappy. You know, like squares and rectangles.







Mine would be curly but not remotely nappy. In fact, I have had to explain to someone recently that my curls were natural-- when they are "behaving," they are perfectly organized spirals and they look entirely fake.







Now, if you get (and remember) that I'm mixed, the natural curls are entirely understandable. It's only if you "forget" that I'm not white that the question comes up.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*Nappy hair often equates to bad hair and I don't believe in bad hair based on texture.*

I grew up saying Black too, and even today I still use the word Black, but when asked my ethnicity I say American.

The term has been reclaimed by black women and in many circles, no longer means 'bad hair'. Most of the women I know who use it do so to raise the consciousness against that mentality.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
The term has been reclaimed by black women and in many circles, no longer means 'bad hair'. Most of the women I know who use it do so to raise the consciousness against that mentality.

I am not that enlightened yet!!!









I am quite the fuddy duddy, very old fashioned.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*I am not that enlightened yet!*!!









I am quite the fuddy duddy, very old fashioned.

Naw, I am not believing that at all.

Old fashioned isn't bad either.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

so, I wasn't offered a position with my first choice however, I did get the 2nd one which has better pay(the only pro, so far). so I did accept it. At this point, beggars can't be choosers and I'll make the best of it. Hopefully, they WILL pay me.


----------



## AndrewsMother

More money is ALWAYS a plus IMO.








:Congratulations!!!







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
so, I wasn't offered a position with my first choice however, I did get the 2nd one which has better pay(the only pro, so far). so I did accept it. At this point, beggars can't be choosers and I'll make the best of it. Hopefully, they WILL pay me.









Congrats mama. I hope it works out for you and that you find more positives once you start


----------



## AndrewsMother

I just put DS on a plane to Atlanta, and I already miss him.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Thank you, sistahs!

AndrewsMother,









WilliamsMother, I'm ITA with Eilonwy: I would continue with the nursing.
It definately has even more benefits during an illness.

Have you all heard this song by India Arie, I'm not my hair
I love India. she's been my role model for as long as I can remember. Anyway, this conversation about hair reminded me of the song.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
DO NOT STOP NURSING. Seriously. Meh.

Is the baby puking blood? Is there anything else going on (i.e. fever, diarrhea, "limp" baby? Is he acting sick in any other way? No? Then you're probably looking at a reaction to something that you ate; Most likely dairy, but it could be damn near anything. Pay attention to when it happens, and unless the baby starts looking dehydrated (dry around the lips, sunken fontanel, etc) and/or refusing the breast, do not replace your milk with pedialyte.







: That's really something that comes after the baby is clearly and obviously sick... and they're usually unwilling to nurse at that point anyhow.

Yes, I'm still around. World hasn't quite ended, and I feel better.

No, I'm not African-American-- I'm mixed, like a bucket of paint. I could say I'm African-American, but I feel it'd be just as disingenuous as saying I'm NA or white or whatever... and just as confusing to people. Mixed (or something ubercool like "transethnic") is pretty much all I can say without people going, "Hrm?"
















I*n my opinion, nappy is a degree of curliness. All nappy hair is curly, but not all curly hair is nappy. You know, like squares and rectangles.







Mine would be curly but not remotely nappy*. In fact, I have had to explain to someone recently that my curls were natural-- when they are "behaving," they are perfectly organized spirals and they look entirely fake.







Now, if you get (and remember) that I'm mixed, the natural curls are entirely understandable. It's only if you "forget" that I'm not white that the question comes up.







:


yeah, i agree with this.


----------



## Autumn C.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I just put DS on a plane to Atlanta, and I already miss him.

Hugs to you mama.

-----

I'm curious with all this hair conversation what do you think about "kinky" as a term to describe one's hair. Is it derogatory? Is it different than nappy or curly?

-----

Mommy2Amira

Yes, I'm familiar with that song. Didn't she come out with that when she shaved her bead cue ball bald? That is some _serious_ self confidence in my book.


----------



## jeca

My middle DD has a head full of very thick very curly springy hair that I don't consider nappy at all so I don't think of the two as interchangeable. Her hair is super easy to wash and combs through with no problems and no detangler is needed. I have had great success with Curls products on her hair.
When I think of nappy I tend to think of hair that you have a hard time with. I guess when I think of kinky I think of hair that may be curly but differently natural with a "harder" texture.

I am going to spend tomarrow making an attempt to declutter this place before we move. For some reason I am a paper packrat and my desk always has a ton of paper work on it. It needs to go. I need to declutter the kitchen where every draw is a "junk" drawer. I need to get rid of those jeans that I know I can't fit anymore but am holding onto just in case. The ugly sweaters my grandma keeps sending me that I don't wear. I need to get of my butt and do something. It's going to be hard since I'm on my monthly for the second time this month.







but I want to do it so I can try to enjoy the week that my kids are off from school.


----------



## Draupadi

Damn computer just ate my long post!
Anyway, thanks for all your well wishes, everyone. William is doing much, much better today. He only threw up one more time after my last post yesterday morning and then he was good to go. I continued to nurse him on demand and he was happy. Luckily, my mom came to help out, and since he adores her, he was even happier.
It must have been a fluke or just some 24 hr virus because he seems great today. He woke up, gave me a big kiss on the mouth, and smiled.








I'm thankful that it it wasn't the horrible virus he (and DH, MIL and MIL's sister) all got when we were in Scotland earlier this year. Now that was a vicious bug- lots of vomitting and diarrhea. Ever seen "28 Days Later"? It seemed like it was spreading THAT fast.
Anyway, thanks again, everyone, and thanks *Eilonwy* for your advice. I think we (as mothers) know instinctively that the best way to make our babies feel better is to nurture them in the best way we know how. Men don't get that. DH thinks I spend too much time here on MDC anyway, and that getting advice from the internet is not as valid as info from a doctor. I try to remind him that Drs. usually are not breastfeeding experts so they know pretty much nothing about it (advice like "Don't breastfeed for 24 hours" just isn't that easy, is it???? I had to pump and dump almost 20 bags of milk).


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
so, I wasn't offered a position with my first choice however, I did get the 2nd one which has better pay(the only pro, so far). so I did accept it. At this point, beggars can't be choosers and I'll make the best of it. Hopefully, they WILL pay me.









Wonderful! Congratulations, Mama!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Hugs to you mama.

-----

I'm curious with all this hair conversation what do you think about "kinky" as a term to describe one's hair. Is it derogatory? Is it different than nappy or curly?

-----

Mommy2Amira

Yes, I'm familiar with that song. Didn't she come out with that when she shaved her bead cue ball bald? That is some _serious_ self confidence in my book.









I think that words like "kinky" and "nappy" are not exactly bad, but it does depend on how they're used. Remember just recently, Don Imus called that women's basketball team "Nappy Headed Hos"? Yeah, that was derrogatory.







I'm sure there are people who use it in a bad way when talking to their children ("I can't do anything with all this nappy hair!"), but for those who want to reclaim these words into something positive, these words can sound like something beautiful. There are sites like www.nappturality.com and salons like Kamut Kinks that embrace nappy/kinky hair. This is a good thing, IMO.
Like Eilonwy, my hair is definitely curly but in no way could it be described as nappy.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Thank you, sistahs!

AndrewsMother,









WilliamsMother, I'm ITA with Eilonwy: I would continue with the nursing.
It definately has even more benefits during an illness.

Have you all heard this song by India Arie, I'm not my hair
I love India. she's been my role model for as long as I can remember. Anyway, this conversation about hair reminded me of the song.

I love that song.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I think that words like "kinky" and "nappy" are not exactly bad, but it does depend on how they're used. Remember just recently, Don Imus called that women's basketball team "Nappy Headed Hos"? Yeah, that was derrogatory.







I'm sure there are people who use it in a bad way when talking to their children ("I can't do anything with all this nappy hair!"), but for those who want to reclaim these words into something positive, these words can sound like something beautiful. There are sites like www.nappturality.com and salons like Kamut Kinks that embrace nappy/kinky hair. This is a good thing, IMO.
Like Eilonwy, my hair is definitely curly but in no way could it be described as nappy.










Yes! context, context, context! The Imus example is a perfect one. And yes, even some black folks use it when describing what they consider 'bad hair'.
I've been thinking about this a lot. I remember when I was growing up, I thought I had 'bad hair'. It was thick and tightly coiled. I permed the hell out of my hair. When I got older, a hairdresser told me I have a very soft textured hair that does not need to be permed







. She made me examine my hair up close to see that it gets kinda springy curly when wet and is soft as cotton







. That also meant that it could not keep a good style!!
Yet, it is still what I consider nappy because it is tightly coiled. Since that time, I've learned to embrace my natural hair. I haven't had a perm in years. I love that I can appreciate it's nappiness without feeling the need to alter it in any way. Mostly I wear it in braids, but currently I have it in a protective style because my thyroid issues have caused it to fall out in places. Ya'll should see the wig my hairdresser made for me









I do agree that curly hair is not necessarily nappy or kinky a la Rynna and Sheila!

Sheila, I am glad your baby boy is doing better!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
so, I wasn't offered a position with my first choice however, I did get the 2nd one which has better pay(the only pro, so far). so I did accept it. At this point, beggars can't be choosers and I'll make the best of it. Hopefully, they WILL pay me.










Yes, being paid is definitely a +









*ETA* I'm cool with both nappy and kinky. Funny thing, my IL's use the term nappy as well. You should see what they call nappy, it's far from. When I was growing up the term nappy was definitely deragatory. It's only within the past, maybe 5 years that I've viewed it as o.k term to use.
If you ask me, I think Imus is a little nappy himself









*Sheila*, happy to see that William is feeling better.
On my end, seems like I'm going to have to wean 14 month old DS. I had some monsterous contractions last night because his nursing pull is super strong. I know it's going to be heck weaning him, he's very attached and NOD.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
On my end, seems like I'm going to have to wean 14 month old DS. I had some monsterous contractions last night because his nursing pull is super strong. I know it's going to be heck weaning him, he's very attached and NOD.

I know it's easier said than done, but try drinking more water. You don't have that much longer to go, you'd probably be having BH now in any case.









Rynna, who has nursed through three pregnancies


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I know it's easier said than done, but try drinking more water. You don't have that much longer to go, you'd probably be having BH now in any case.









Rynna, who has nursed through three pregnancies

I've nursed throughout pregnancies too, but I've never had a nurser like him







. Or a very attached child for that matter. I drink plenty of water, he just likes to suck. You know what I'm doing? I'm not nursing him on the nipple, he seems content to suck on the side of my breast







. I'm fine with that, but I don't feel good about having him drink regular milk


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Autumn C.* 
Mommy2Amira

Yes, I'm familiar with that song. Didn't she come out with that when she shaved her bead cue ball bald? That is some _serious_ self confidence in my book.









Yep!








I love that most of her songs are not only about self-acceptance but also self-love. After growing up with a very critical mother, she helped me to not be so down on myself. I particularly love video girl as well.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
My middle DD has a head full of very thick very curly springy hair that I don't consider nappy at all so I don't think of the two as interchangeable. Her hair is super easy to wash and combs through with no problems and no detangler is needed. I have had great success with Curls products on her hair.
When I think of nappy I tend to think of hair that you have a hard time with. I guess when I think of kinky I think of hair that may be curly but differently natural with a "harder" texture.

I am going to spend tomarrow making an attempt to declutter this place before we move. For some reason I am a paper packrat and my desk always has a ton of paper work on it. It needs to go. I need to declutter the kitchen where every draw is a "junk" drawer. I need to get rid of those jeans that I know I can't fit anymore but am holding onto just in case. The ugly sweaters my grandma keeps sending me that I don't wear. I need to get of my butt and do something. It's going to be hard since I'm on my monthly for the second time this month.







but I want to do it so I can try to enjoy the week that my kids are off from school.

I pretty much classify hair like that too. Its interesting how diverse hair can be. My sister and I have similar hair except she has tighter curls and mine are bit wavier. Her hair has major shrinkage and mine doesn't. Growing up, my mom would cut my hair off and braid my sister's. When my sister wanted a haircut, she told her she got that "bad" hair that would cause a 'fro.







:









Yes, lots of self-hate issues amongst POC. It's taking a lot of unlearning and a lot of critical thinking to get over these issues. My sister now straightens her hair (not chemically) but still, I think she looks so much lovelier with her natural curly hair. Of course, its only been a few months since I stopped straightening my hair too.. but it was purely out of laziness. slowly but surely, I hope to pass genuine love for curly hair to my daughter but it has to come to me first. and I'm workin' on that!









Decluttering and Organizing sounds like a good plan. I'm gonna have to do that this weekend myself too. I'm not only hanging onto my pre-pregnancy clothes but also Amira's baby clothes. I've so much sentimental value attached to things. gosh.. I can't see myself getting rid of them. I'm also kind of superstitious. I am afraid that if I toss DD's clothes, I'll get pregnant. which is NOT the plan. and if I get rid of my clothes, I'll gain more weight. Yes, I'm crazy like that.








to you about the monthly. I keep getting them frequently too. And I PMS like crazy. Is St. John Warts the only way to keep the blues away during that time? I don't know if its a mind thing, but it never works for me. I'm always a teary, irritable mess during that time. And mostly stable as soon Aunt Flo leaves.


----------



## JustKiya

I consider my hair kinky too.







I consider my hair a lot of things, except for straight - heck, sometimes it's even wavy, depending on how I handle it.








Imus is a lil nappy, isn't he? And once again, it's a insult culled from the black community, that we use to denigrate ourselves. It's amazing - sometimes I wonder how things would change if we treated ourselves the way we expect other people to treat us? Hrm.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I call my hair fluffy, fuzzy, bushy, tightly curled or thick.

I talked to my DS today, and he does not even miss me. His EE and Grammy are spoiling him to no end, and I am sure that he is full of HFCS, hormones, dye and everything else, but he is HAPPY!

Nothing is sweeter than hearing I love you mommy from a 2 year old!!


----------



## Bloomingstar

my, you all are speedy!

Congrats on the job, Mommy2amira!







: I'm also glad William is feeling better









And where else did I want to chime in? Yes, I don't really call myself African American--I grew up black, "red" to be specific







and didn't turn "African-American" until I got to college. I always wondered what people even thought they meant by that? I preferred it over people trying to stammer out "people of color" and ending up saying "colored people."

My hair is curly. I dunno how I feel about "nappy"--it's not something I say myself to describe my or anyone else's hair because I grew up with people using the word so negatively.

And.....

We got the apartment! Yay!







: We can sign the lease and move next weekend, so this week I'll be happily packing. And I am sure I can get this baby to agree to settle in for awhile longer until we're settled into the new place--I'm 35 weeks already!


----------



## oyinmama

dannnnnnnng i am behind. happy moving, bloomingstar! off to catch up on the past nine hundred pages.


----------



## JustKiya

: Yay Bloomingstar!! It's a wonderful feeling to have the place you want - have you already been putting things in their place in your mind? And what perfect way to spend your nesting time!?


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *justkiya* 
s. It's amazing - sometimes i wonder how things would change if we treated ourselves the way we expect other people to treat us? Hrm.

*ditto*

Happy moving *Bloomingstar*. I don't know about you, but I'd definitely rather move while pregnant, then after the baby. BTW, we may have our DC in the same month







.


----------



## Draupadi

Congratulations on your new apartment, Bloomingstar. I hope you have an easy move.








Well, I had another rough evening. William woke up around 1:30am and seemed upset. He threw up a little again and just sat on my lap and nursed pretty much for the next 2 1/2 hours, moaning "Mama" every once in a while. When he finally fell asleep around 4 or so, I got about 1 hour's worth of sleep when I was woken up by DH's moaning. He had chills and was feeling nauseated. God forgive me, but I was just wishing he'd shut up so I could go to sleep.







:Then he started throwing up so of course, I was back up again.
What a fun night- again.








William seems happy this morning, but he has no appetite for anything but nee-nees.
Me- not feeling all that happy because I'm so unbelievably tired from lack of sleep.
Anyway...


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
my, you all are speedy!

Congrats on the job, Mommy2amira!







: I'm also glad William is feeling better










And where else did I want to chime in? Yes, I don't really call myself African American--I grew up black, "red" to be specific







and didn't turn "African-American" until I got to college. I always wondered what people even thought they meant by that? I preferred it over people trying to stammer out "people of color" and ending up saying "colored people."

My hair is curly. I dunno how I feel about "nappy"--it's not something I say myself to describe my or anyone else's hair because I grew up with people using the word so negatively.

And.....

We got the apartment! Yay!







: We can sign the lease and move next weekend, so this week I'll be happily packing. And I am sure I can get this baby to agree to settle in for awhile longer until we're settled into the new place--I'm 35 weeks already!


Fantastic! I'm happy for you mama







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Congratulations on your new apartment, Bloomingstar. I hope you have an easy move.








Well, I had another rough evening. William woke up around 1:30am and seemed upset. He threw up a little again and just sat on my lap and nursed pretty much for the next 2 1/2 hours, moaning "Mama" every once in a while. When he finally fell asleep around 4 or so, I got about 1 hour's worth of sleep when I was woken up by DH's moaning. He had chills and was feeling nauseated. God forgive me, but I was just wishing he'd shut up so I could go to sleep.







:Then he started throwing up so of course, I was back up again.
What a fun night- again.








William seems happy this morning, but he has no appetite for anything but nee-nees.
Me- not feeling all that happy because I'm so unbelievably tired from lack of sleep.
Anyway...

Sheila, I am so sorry







. If your dh is anything like mine when he's sick, you have my condolences


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I got about 1 hour's worth of sleep when I was woken up by DH's moaning. He had chills and was feeling nauseated. *God forgive me, but I was just wishing he'd shut up so I could go to sleep.*







:Then he started throwing up so of course, I was back up again.
What a fun night- again.








.

I swear that we are married to the same man!!! I am LMBBO!!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
my, you all are speedy!

Congrats on the job, Mommy2amira!







: I'm also glad William is feeling better









And where else did I want to chime in? Yes, I don't really call myself African American--I grew up black, "red" to be specific







and didn't turn "African-American" until I got to college. I always wondered what people even thought they meant by that? I preferred it over people trying to stammer out "people of color" and ending up saying "colored people."

My hair is curly. I dunno how I feel about "nappy"--it's not something I say myself to describe my or anyone else's hair because I grew up with people using the word so negatively.

And.....

We got the apartment! Yay!







: We can sign the lease and move next weekend, so this week I'll be happily packing. And I am sure I can get this baby to agree to settle in for awhile longer until we're settled into the new place--I'm 35 weeks already!

Congratulations!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
I consider my hair kinky too.







I consider my hair a lot of things, except for straight - heck, sometimes it's even wavy, depending on how I handle it.








Imus is a lil nappy, isn't he? And once again, it's a insult culled from the black community, that we use to denigrate ourselves. *It's amazing - sometimes I wonder how things would change if we treated ourselves the way we expect other people to treat us? Hrm*.


Amen, but especially to the bolded part


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sheila, I am so sorry







. If your dh is anything like mine when he's sick, you have my condolences










If he's anything like mine, you have another DC on your hands.







to you, I hope that this bug doesn't hit you.


----------



## jeca

Congrats Bloomingstar!! Definitely better to move now than post baby. Are you nesting yet? If so that should help.







:


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Congratulations BloomingStar!







:

Happy nesting and smooth moving vibes!

WilliamsMother, I hope you all get some much needed rest today!

AndrewsMother, that's too cute about your baby.
I'm glad you feel that way about g-ma spoiling the babe..









We are all under the weather today too. go away sickies.. and come back when we are on vacation or something. geez. I have to start working tomorrow.







:









Thanks for the congrats, ladies. I am glad my hard work in aggressively looking for jobs has paid off.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Congrats Bloomingstar!! Definitely better to move now than post baby. Are you nesting yet? If so that should help.







:

Thanks everyone! As for nesting, I have been having fits and starts of frustrated nesting for the past couple weeks, which was tough given the apartment situation. But I am SO looking forward to moving and getting to just settle in and get on with it! I'm less excited about packing everything up for the first part of things, but it is a necessary evil, a means to an end I suppose. And since we have no plans for thanksgiving--DH has never celebrated it since he's not american and all of my family is too far away anyway--i think it'll be a great day to really make some progress since I won't be at work that day or the day after.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 

Thanks for the congrats, ladies. I am glad my hard work in aggressively looking for jobs has paid off.

I guess I need to start aggressivly doing....something. It's hard to do since I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up.







: Since I know I will have no job come january you'd think I would be doing something about it anything but I just haven't, I don't know what's wrong with me. I guess I'm really not that worried about it yet.

Well it's not completely true I have a inkling of what I'd like to do I guess it would just be hard for me, the Queen of Procrastination, to follow it through.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I guess I need to start aggressivly doing....something. It's hard to do since I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up.







: Since I know I will have no job come january you'd think I would be doing something about it anything but I just haven't, I don't know what's wrong with me. I guess I'm really not that worried about it yet.

Well it's not completely true I have a inkling of what I'd like to do I guess it would just be hard for me, the Queen of Procrastination, to follow it through.

I took two years off to think about what I wanted to do after dropping out of school because what I was majoring in wasn't really my passion.
You are doing the right thing by giving yourself some time.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sheila, I am so sorry







. If your dh is anything like mine when he's sick, you have my condolences









It's like having two toddlers in the house.
He knew that I hadn't slept in hours but what was I awakened to in the wee hours of the morning? Him moaning loudly and dramatically. Oh, and did I mention that my DH is a former actor?







I got up and got him a basin to puke in and a blanket, but he was still moaning and groaning. I reminded him that he was going to wake William so he got out of bed and went to the couch. By that time, I was wide awake and he was puking in the basin. Oh, the drama!








And here I am again. I've been up for almost an hour now (it's 3:30am) because DS now has a miserable cold and was coughing for most of the night.







I don't know how I'm going to manage Thanksgiving...

Quote:

I took two years off to think about what I wanted to do after dropping out of school because what I was majoring in wasn't really my passion.
You are doing the right thing by giving yourself some time.
Mommy2Amira, I totally agree. It's good to give yourself time before you decide what to do.
I have found during this time as a SAHM that I don't want to teach anymore. After spending all that time and money in grad school, I just don't want to do it. During this time with DS, I really thought about it and decided teaching is not for me- at least not the way I was doing it for the NYC Dept of Education. I worked in a HORRENDOUS school and unfortunately, it's hard to get a position in a better school. Luckily, I extended family leave until next September so I have some time to think about it before I actually have to resign from the Dept. I'm secretly hoping I get pregnant again so I can SAH a little longer.







:

Quote:

I swear that we are married to the same man!!! I am LMBBO!!!
Andrewsmother, it's ridiculous.
One time before DS was born, we went out for dinner and then to a New Year's party where DH drank himself silly. The next morning, he was walking around the apartment carrying a plastic bag, hunched over like Quasimodo. He insisted that he must have food poisoning because he just couldn't understand why he was throwing up so much. I guess it had nothing to do with all that whiskey, beer and red wine he drank all night long.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I have found during this time as a SAHM that I don't want to teach anymore. After spending all that time and money in grad school, I just don't want to do it. During this time with DS, I really thought about it and decided teaching is not for me- at least not the way I was doing it for the NYC Dept of Education. I worked in a HORRENDOUS school and unfortunately, it's hard to get a position in a better school. Luckily, I extended family leave until next September so I have some time to think about it before I actually have to resign from the Dept. I'm secretly hoping I get pregnant again so I can SAH a little longer.







:

Wow Sheila . . . this is my story *exactly*.

I was hired to teach in an awful school in the Bronx (after sending out over 35 application letters and using that stupid site--who said finding a job as a teacher is easy?). I have grad school debt and no desire whatsoever to go back to teaching. I keep thinking I could go back if I could find a better school but the better districts don't hire new teachers. I resigned altogether (developed hives and almost had a nervous condition) so I don't know what will happen when it's time to go back. Actually, I'm thinking about going back to school for a doctorate. I'm thinking teaching at the university level is more compatible with my desire to maybe homeschool the boys. I just don't know.


----------



## Jannah6

*Rootzdawta & Sheila*, I'm in Brooklyn. I grew up in Brooklyn and the Bronx. I forgot who said they worked at a school in the Bronx, what area was it?
I was going to school for ECE, but after having my DC I decided that there is no way that I'm going to teach in a NYC school and then come home to my DC. So when I *FINALLY* finish school(I have 113 credits







), I think I'll do something involving social services.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Wow Sheila . . . this is my story *exactly*.

I was hired to teach in an awful school in the Bronx (after sending out over 35 application letters and using that stupid site--who said finding a job as a teacher is easy?). I have grad school debt and no desire whatsoever to go back to teaching. I keep thinking I could go back if I could find a better school but the better districts don't hire new teachers. I resigned altogether (developed hives and almost had a nervous condition) so I don't know what will happen when it's time to go back. Actually, I'm thinking about going back to school for a doctorate. I'm thinking teaching at the university level is more compatible with my desire to maybe homeschool the boys. I just don't know.

NYC Schools are such a mess.







I know EXACTLY what you mean about sending out dozens and dozens of resumes and going on their internal job site and still getting nothing. Last March, I went on the Open Market Transfer System for teachers already in the system, applied to about 50 positions and got NOTHING. When August rolled around, I got very nervous and just started faxing out my resume and calling places. I got one interview. One. And when they told me after the interview that they were looking for someone who would "fit in", I kind of knew they weren't going to hire me. The school was in Tribeca. The thing is, I'm an experienced teacher. I taught for five years in a place that could be easily described as the 3rd ring of Hell, and I promised myself that I would never work in a place like that again. The things I've seen...I'm sure you've seen similar since where you taught actually made you ill.







Anyway, I know what you mean- I think I'd be better suited to higher education as well, but I think that's a way down the road. DH is trying to get into law school so everything else is pretty much on hold.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Rootzdawta & Sheila*, I'm in Brooklyn. I grew up in Brooklyn and the Bronx. I forgot who said they worked at a school in the Bronx, what area was it?
I was going to school for ECE, but after having my DC I decided that there is no way that I'm going to teach in a NYC school and then come home to my DC. So when I *FINALLY* finish school(I have 113 credits







), I think I'll do something involving social services.

Jannah, I do not blame you one bit. In my five years teaching (I taught in Harlem), I've had a student diagnosed as psychotic, reported at least 3 child abuse cases, testified in a sex abuse case, been called everything but a child of G-d, had a parent try to jump on me, seen a friend and co-worker get knocked unconcious and the student who did it stayed in the school while the teacher was reprimanded, been knocked down and injured from students kicking through hall doors only to have my dear principal call up my husband and lie to him about it. That's just some of the things I dealt with in that school. When I got pregnant my final year there, I told myself that I would never go back there or work in a place like that ever again. The thing is, there are lots of better schools but of course, no one wants to move out of those schools.


----------



## Jannah6

WilliamsMama said:


> seen a friend and co-worker get knocked unconcious and the student who did it stayed in the school while the teacher was reprimanded.QUOTE]
> 
> This sounds like what happened to a friend of a friend. She(the teacher) eventually got the police involved, which backfired. Turns out that the principal had family ties with someone in the local police department. It was a total mess.
> I've known teachers who've had to retire because they've become mentally and physically sick because of the job. My X did subbing and the stories that he came home with shocked me.
> I'm not at all surprised by your experiences. I feel saddened and sickened by what I see and here from parents and children in my neighborhood. The foul language, parents cursing children out, children cursing each other out. Parents hitting and smacking their children. No one has any shame, I say if this is what they are doing outside, I can't imagine what's going on inside their homes. It seems that each generation is getting worse
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We bought a house in Edison NJ and were there for 4 years, I loved it. Moving back to NYC was easier because of my DH job and the children went to school in NY. We didn't really weant to come back to Bed-Stuy, but this is the home that I grew up in, plus try finding a decent affordable place with 5children
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Thank God I live on one of the nicer blocks.


----------



## purplegirl

I'm a consultant in the local schools here; they can be a very difficult place to be at times. My mom and sister were teachers and both say you couldn't pay them enough to go back into the public schools. I have so much respect for teachers because it is not an easy profession. I work with the children who have emotional/behavioral challenges and it wears me out. I couldn't imagine having to try to teach and manage a classroom under some circumstances.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Jannah I'll bet you and I live pretty near one another! I'm only moving about 12 blocks from where I am now--same train stop, just in the other direction. Now we're in Crown Heights but I guess crossing Fulton will put us in Bed-Stuy? It's hard to tell







with the way brokers change the names of things every 2 weeks--I mean, what on earth is "upper clinton hill?" anyway.

I second all the talk about NYC public schools! I'm not a teacher (you couldn't pay me enough, ever, to work in a NYC public school) but I work with high school girls so I have to go into the schools to do recruitment and whatnot and my goodness! I've been to many high schools in all 5 boroughs and there are such huge disparities! It's really disheartening.


----------



## Jannah6

*Bloomingstar* I live near the G train and I'm within walking distance to the A & C at Fulton and Nostrand.

I guess Upper Clinton Hill to distinguish from the lower class in Lower Clinton Hill


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Bloomingstar* are you saying that you're moving to Clinton Hills? If so, that's one of the neighborhoods right over from me. I live near the G train.

I guess Upper Clinton Hill to distinguish from the lower class in Lower Clinton Hill









no no we're moving to Bed-Stuy, near the A. Clinton Hill is tooooo expensive. I lived in Prospect Heights near the Museum about 5 years ago, until I got priced out. It looks like a totally different neighborhood now.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
no no we're moving to Bed-Stuy, near the A. Clinton Hill is tooooo expensive. I lived in Prospect Heights near the Museum about 5 years ago, until I got priced out. It looks like a totally different neighborhood now.

I read your post while I was dealing with DS. I edited my post when I realized you were saying that you're moving to Bed-Stuy







.

I'm going to deliver at Lutheran, which is a switch for me. All of my DC were born in Columbia Pres or its anex, Allen Pavillion. I delivered in NY, even when I lived in NJ







.
Who are you homebirthing with? I wanted a HB, but was too chicken. Now I've missed my opportunity


----------



## Bloomingstar

Ah, I see the edit









I'm having a homebirth, which is why it was an even bigger deal to me, aside from the big deal it already was, to get the apartment issue squared away. and yes, we're within walking distance of one another! my current and my future apartment are at that A train stop


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Ah, I see the edit










I'm having a homebirth, which is why it was an even bigger deal to me, aside from the big deal it already was, to get the apartment issue squared away. and yes, we're within walking distance of one another! my current and my future apartment are at that A train stop










Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Bloomingstar* I live near the G train and I'm within walking distance to the A & C at Fulton and Nostrand.

I guess Upper Clinton Hill to distinguish from the lower class in Lower Clinton Hill









Looks like easy play date distance to me!!!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
I consider my hair kinky too.







I consider my hair a lot of things, except for straight - heck, sometimes it's even wavy, depending on how I handle it.








Imus is a lil nappy, isn't he? And once again, it's a insult culled from the black community, that we use to denigrate ourselves. It's amazing - sometimes I wonder how things would change if we treated ourselves the way we expect other people to treat us? Hrm.

Well, saying that we're "Black" people is the same to me as saying I'm "nappy" because the word Black carries a whole lot of negative connotations too. I know growing up calling somebody a Black [insert any insult here] made the insult 10x's worse. So the same way I don't bristle at saying I'm Black, I don't really bristle at saying I'm nappy. I don't see it as denigrating in the context I use it in.

I can say, "Oh, I'm blind as a bat" if I don't see something or overlook it (which I really can't see that well without my glasses so it's kind of true). But if _you_ say, "Oh, Rootz, you're blind as a bat", it's just not acceptable. It's insulting.

ETA: I just watched 500 Years . . . one of you lovely ladies (I forget who) recommended it. It was good but it just reminded me of the term "Black" and why when applied to our people it's not necessarily positive.


----------



## Bloomingstar

okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:

Omg, you are adorable!!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:

Oh you are just too adorable!!!! And for what it is worth, I say boy! Why......because you don't look pregnant from behind and your stomach is nice and round.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:

you both are toooo cute!!!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Well, saying that we're "Black" people is the same to me as saying I'm "nappy" because the word Black carries a whole lot of negative connotations too. I know growing up calling somebody a Black [insert any insult here] made the insult 10x's worse. So the same way I don't bristle at saying I'm Black, I don't really bristle at saying I'm nappy. I don't see it as denigrating in the context I use it in.

my thoughts too, i'm Black and nappy!

i'm glad you enjoyed the flick 500 years later. i was put off by the dvd cover at first, but overall impressed with the film. its nice to see the UK Black community, over and beyond the Af American, centered as the voice of the diaspora.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Hey ladies, just trying to get caught up and back in the groove of things. My mom came to visit for 2 weeks then both she and my DH left the same day, so it's been just me and all 3 kids. DH comes back tomorrow, and we prepare for the holidays.


----------



## rootzdawta

Bloomingstar, you _are_adorable.







: I put my bid in that it's a boy. You are carrying how I carried with my first. And he was a boy. But then again, I carried totally wide with my second. And he was a boy.
















I can't believe it ya'll. I'm going to my parents' house for Thanksgiving. There has been so much tension between us over the years that it's surreal that I'm even going. I have to pack all our own food because we eat a different diet than they do but I think it's worth the effort. I sure hope I feel that way after the day is done.

Nnaemeka, you're right. The cover for 500 Years was off-putting to me too and kept me from watching it until about 3 hrs when I had to return it to the library! I'm glad I did watch it though and I really appreciated the perspective of the UK Black folks!


----------



## purplegirl

I am going to make an effort to get and watch 500 years--perhaps while I am off this later this week.
Rootz, good luck with your visit to your parents.









JeDeeLenae, how are things going with your little one?


----------



## Jannah6

*Rootzdawta*, I hope things go well at your parents. I'm not close to my mom, she didn't raise me. I'm very close to my aunt who raised me, we actually share a Brownstone. There was a period that our relationship was strained(she thought that I was sideing with DH over her







). Anyway that period was just terrible. I hope everything works out well with you and your parents.

I read this portion of your blog:
Wednesday, November 19, 2008
Not So Hidden Racism
*WOW*, what a UAV this woman is.

*ETA:* I have a cousin named ChiChi









*Bloomingstar*, I never try to guess the sex based on the shape and size of someones belly. I've had 6 pregnancies and I always carry the same way. This pregnancy is the first one that I'm not finding out the sex. DH and I say we think it's a boy based on the ultrasound pic, LOL. BTW, you do look very cute







. Now I know what you look like, so don't be surprised if I approach you one day on the street


----------



## Bloomingstar

Thanks ladies!







: and yeah, most people say it's a boy, except my stepmother who insists it's a girl, just because. My sister is having a girl this time--and I'm guessing that even though our due dates are only a day apart, she'll go first.







And Jannah, please do say hi! I've slowed down considerably so I won't breeze past you on the street if you are trying to get my attention


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Bloomingstar* I live near the G train and I'm within walking distance to the A & C at Fulton and Nostrand.

I live in the same area! G train to Bedford/Nostrand avenues or the A/C at Nostrand! I have probably seen some of you out and about. I live right near the Bedford YMCA, which is a great facility by the way.


----------



## Bloomingstar

:

How goes it, Arike? The Bedford Y is literally around the corner from where I am moving to!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:

Wow Bloomingstar, you look beautiful! You almost make me nostalgic about my pregnancy...almost. It got a little intense around week 40, LOL! Welcome to the neighborhood! And I am sending you good vibes for your homebirth!







:


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I can't believe it ya'll. I'm going to my parents' house for Thanksgiving. There has been so much tension between us over the years that it's surreal that I'm even going. I have to pack all our own food because we eat a different diet than they do but I think it's worth the effort. I sure hope I feel that way after the day is done.


Wow, i feel for you with the tension with your parents Rootz. My mom and I have had issues for years and this week I am staying with my parents with my little one. Last night my mom decided to tell me everything she thinks I have done wrong in the past year. Needless to say, 1 month postpartum, I am still emotional and hormonal so it didn't take long for the waterworks to begin.







I mean seriously, I am still adjusting to motherhood and all, I really am not in the mood to be criticized for my choices and lectured. But anyway,
hope things go well for you at Thanksgiving.


----------



## splendid

Hugs to Arike, its rough that first month when the ones you look to for support and love drop the ball.

I have spent the last week celebrating my birthday and preparing for Thanksgiving. My phone is dying/dead and the phone company is not sending someone out until December.














: Thanksfully I have a cell phone for emergencies.

Is anyone else staying home? Or if you are going where are you going.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







:

How goes it, Arike? The Bedford Y is literally around the corner from where I am moving to!

wow! I think we will probably bump into each other since we are both near the Y! I am fine a little Ari is doing just fine too. Congrats on the new apartment! Oh and people would randomly tell me on the street when I was pregnant "That's a boy!", gesturing towards my stomach. Complete strangers!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Is anyone else staying home? Or if you are going where are you going.

We're staying home but not for lack of anyone trying to get us to come. It's just too far. I don't want to spend this break sitting in a car for 18-28 hours(depending on where go). It would have been nice but I'm just not up for the drive and I can't afford for all of us to fly. On the plus side someone gave us a turkey. so I didn't have to buy that woo hoo! I don't want to drive for Xmas either. Speaking of which it's almost December. I need to sit down and make my Xmas budget asap.


----------



## Brown Lioness

*peeks in* Dude, you are CAH-YUTE!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Wow, i feel for you with the tension with your parents Rootz. My mom and I have had issues for years and this week I am staying with my parents with my little one. Last night my mom decided to tell me everything she thinks I have done wrong in the past year. Needless to say, 1 month postpartum, I am still emotional and hormonal so it didn't take long for the waterworks to begin.







I mean seriously, I am still adjusting to motherhood and all, I really am not in the mood to be criticized for my choices and lectured. But anyway,
hope things go well for you at Thanksgiving.

I am so sorry your mom wasn't more sensitive. Like you need to hear that right after giving birth. Stay strong mama and when you're feeling like you need to vent, we're here for you


----------



## purplegirl

Brooklyn's in the hoooouse







:

I am finished work until next Monday--I need this break badly. We are staying local and going over to my folks house for Thanksgiving. My friend is coming 'home', so I'll visit her and my god children at some point. It will be low key here and I am thankful for that!


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am going to make an effort to get and watch 500 years--perhaps while I am off this later this week.
Rootz, good luck with your visit to your parents.









JeDeeLenae, how are things going with your little one?

Things are going really good. She's such a good baby. It's the two boys that drive me crazy!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Thanks ladies!







: and yeah, most people say it's a boy, except my stepmother who insists it's a girl, just because. My sister is having a girl this time--and I'm guessing that even though our due dates are only a day apart, she'll go first.







And Jannah, please do say hi! I've slowed down considerably so I won't breeze past you on the street if you are trying to get my attention









I never guess based on size and how you carry. After the first one, unless you've got good stomach muscles, they all seem to hang out pretty far... and low.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I can't believe it ya'll. I'm going to my parents' house for Thanksgiving. There has been so much tension between us over the years that it's surreal that I'm even going. I have to pack all our own food because we eat a different diet than they do but I think it's worth the effort. I sure hope I feel that way after the day is done.

I hope things go well for you. I get along with everyone in my family, except my dad. He cheated on my mom and still says it was just me being silly and not knowing what I was talking about. Um... I was 24, I think a text message from a woman with explicit language and referring to you by name means something.







Anyway, I hope it's worth the effort for you.


----------



## oyinmama

ok so it took me days, and i know i can never respond to everything, but hello! what great belly pictures! and yall brooklyn mamas are making me nostalgic!









happy holiday to you all! we are definitely planning to stay at home - i will make mac and cheese b/c that's my favorite dish; i did cornbread stuffing the other day since i happened to have leftover cornbread but in general i think we're gonna just eat nothing in particular, enjoy the day off and each other, watch movies and play rock band or something. LOL!! i can't wait. i feel like we'll be playing hooky.

baby boy is crawling! he just started like yesterday and today. it's SO cute. and now i'm terrified abt all the potential hazards in our house. so we'll probably do some babyproofing in there sometime during our holiday off.


----------



## oyinmama

oh i wanted to say to the bklnites - check out "still hip" a thrift/trade store on grand near gates - i THINK i'm getting the intersection right but might not. it's near danny simmons' corridor gallery. great resource for inexpensive baby and maternity clothes and gear. & a great place to get rid of yours once you're done!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I live in the same area! G train to Bedford/Nostrand avenues or the A/C at Nostrand! I have probably seen some of you out and about. I live right near the Bedford YMCA, which is a great facility by the way.

Hey, my train stop can be either Bedford and Nostrand or Myrtle and Willoughby







My son goes to school a fews blocks from the Y. He also takes swimming lessons there, which my aunt takes him to. One of my former professors works at the Y, I think she teaches yoga or swimming. DH wants to join the Y, but with DC tuition PAST due we can't afford it







.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Wow, i feel for you with the tension with your parents Rootz. My mom and I have had issues for years and this week I am staying with my parents with my little one. Last night my mom decided to tell me everything she thinks I have done wrong in the past year. Needless to say, 1 month postpartum, I am still emotional and hormonal so it didn't take long for the waterworks to begin.







I mean seriously, I am still adjusting to motherhood and all, I really am not in the mood to be criticized for my choices and lectured. But anyway,
hope things go well for you at Thanksgiving.
















to you Arike, and CONGRATULATIONS on your LO.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Brooklyn's in the hoooouse







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
oh i wanted to say to the bklnites - check out "still hip" a thrift/trade store on grand near gates - i THINK i'm getting the intersection right but might not. it's near danny simmons' corridor gallery. great resource for inexpensive baby and maternity clothes and gear. & a great place to get rid of yours once you're done!

I've been to Still Hip for a babywearing demo, unfortunately my DC suckered me into buying them some toys that they played with for like 2 minutes









*ETA:* I don't usually take pregnancy pics because I'm never cute during pregnancy







. I took this one for my MDC due date club. Here's me yesterday at only 29 weeks, my 11 yr old DS took the pic







. I always gain so much weight. So I often get the questions about twins or triplets*eyesroll*

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...ey=09khglOlBbA


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I've been to Still Hip for a babywearing demo, unfortunately my DC suckered me into buying them some toys that they played with for like 2 minutes









*ETA:* I don't usually take pregnancy pics because I'm never cute during pregnancy







. I took this one for my MDC due date club. Here's me yesterday at only 29 weeks, my 11 yr old DS took the pic







. I always gain so much weight. So I often get the questions about twins or triplets*eyesroll*

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...ey=09khglOlBbA

Rock it mama







! You are too adorable with that beautiful smile!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

*ETA:* I don't usually take pregnancy pics because I'm never cute during pregnancy







.

Girl, please, you _are_ too cute while pregnant! I want to pinch your cheeks!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Did anyone see Beyonce on The Today Show? She was hawt!!!


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Did anyone see Beyonce on The Today Show? She was hawt!!!

For some reason I don't like her, music or acting wise. I can't pinpoint it. But with that, she can is such a beautiful woman.


----------



## eilonwy

Splendid, I've got a "thing" about Beyonce, too. It's... complicated and rather rude, I'm afraid. That said, I've managed not to pass my complex on to my kids, as evidenced by my son's love for her music (though he prefers Rihanna-- he really prefers dark hair to light :sheepish: ).

Jannah, I think you look a lot better than I did during my pregnancies. I get horrible acne all over my face and look like a fifteen year old someone's blown up with an air pump.







Seriously, I've been stopped for curfew and truancy during pregnancies; It's not cute.







I also tend to get huge in a hurry despite having decent (read: unseparated) stomach muscles-- I'm short, so I've got no place to grow but straight out in front of me.







I lose a lot of weight in the beginning, but that just accentuates the pregnancy and by the time I'm five months, I can't even pass for not pregnant... even though I look about five months pregnant most of the time (like right now







).

Here's a set I took for Bear's DDC: 33w 1d. I actually like the ones that are just of the belly. Would you believe it took until baby #4 for my fat ass to develop stretch marks?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Did anyone see Beyonce on The Today Show? She was hawt!!!

I missed it . . . well, I never watch tv during the day so . . . maybe I can find it on youtube.

Found a link for anyone who's interested.

Awww . . . I miss my figure. Sheesh.

Oh, my, Ms. Sasha Fierce certainly lives up to her name!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I've been to Still Hip for a babywearing demo, unfortunately my DC suckered me into buying them some toys that they played with for like 2 minutes









*ETA:* I don't usually take pregnancy pics because I'm never cute during pregnancy







. I took this one for my MDC due date club. Here's me yesterday at only 29 weeks, my 11 yr old DS took the pic







. I always gain so much weight. So I often get the questions about twins or triplets*eyesroll*

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...ey=09khglOlBbA

Weight gain, where? All that I see if baby, you look great.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Did anyone see Beyonce on The Today Show? She was hawt!!!

Nope, but I LOVE Beyonce. One day I WILL have liposuction and have her waist.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I missed it . . . well, I never watch tv during the day so . . . maybe I can find it on youtube.

Found a link for anyone who's interested.

Awww . . . I miss my figure. Sheesh.

Me too! Thank God for Spanx. Girdles period.

Thank you for the link Rootzdawta.


----------



## jeca

I only have a handful of shows that I actually watch and the Today's show isn't one of them so I didn't see it. All the pregnany pics are making me nostalgic. Dh is still trying to convince me to have another. I just can't see it. I mean I could but I can't know what I mean?

Is anyone braving the early morn to go after Thanksgiving Day shopping?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I only have a handful of shows that I actually watch and the Today's show isn't one of them so I didn't see it. All the pregnany pics are making me nostalgic. Dh is still trying to convince me to have another. *I just can't see it. I mean I could but I can't know what I mean?*

Is anyone braving the early morn to go after Thanksgiving Day shopping?

I abhor crowds, so I do not shop the day after Thanksgiving.

I know exactly what you mean about not being able to have another. I just had this conversation with a close friend. My 2nd child would CIO while drinking formula in her crib in her OWN room and would be in childcare 10 hours a day 5 days a week.

That would be unfair, so I am happy with one, but the pregnancy pictures so bring about strong feelings of nostalgia.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

That would be unfair, so I am happy with one, but the pregnancy pictures so bring about strong feelings of nostalgia.

We already have three which feels like a lot of kids. Maybe they're just bad so it feels that way, lol. He wants a fourth. For some reason he thinks that will even things out.


----------



## eilonwy

I've got four and yes, things are balanced. Two boys, two girls, all done.







Four really isn't much more work than three, to be honest.







In fact... despite #3 being the most difficult baby, I'd say that the hardest step was from one to two.







In any case, I like knowing that I'm finished, and that in five years I'll have four school-aged kiddos and I'll be able to do things like knit and sew without worrying about someone pulling the needles out or burning the house down. I'll still be young enough to get my groove on!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
okay I'm a total ham







I have a few new pictures of the belly to share! I keep hearing all sorts of things--people always have a comment:

"you're carrying small, it's a girl"
"you're pointy, it's a boy"
"he baby is low, it's ready to come out now"
"you're huge!"
"you're tiny!"
"you haven't gained any weight!"

blah blah blah!

I think people just don't really know what they're talking about but fel the need to mouth off anyway.

Here they are!

34 weeks, 4 days: back view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0778.jpg

34 weeks, 4 days, side/front view:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0777.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0793.jpg

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0791.jpg

and saturday at a wedding--Clothes can make a BIG difference in how big the belly looks:

http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/e...s/IMG_0831.jpg








:

You look beautiful, Mama!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I've been to Still Hip for a babywearing demo, unfortunately my DC suckered me into buying them some toys that they played with for like 2 minutes









*ETA:* I don't usually take pregnancy pics because I'm never cute during pregnancy







. I took this one for my MDC due date club. Here's me yesterday at only 29 weeks, my 11 yr old DS took the pic







. I always gain so much weight. So I often get the questions about twins or triplets*eyesroll*

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...ey=09khglOlBbA

You're kidding, right?
You're too cute.
I can't take it! I wanna be pregnant too!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
For some reason I don't like her, music or acting wise. I can't pinpoint it. But with that, she can is such a beautiful woman.

I'm with you on that, too.







: I don't think she sings very well. Now, Aretha? Chaka? Those sisters can SING!
I think I get tired of the trying-so-hard-to-be-sexy thing all the time and it turns me off.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

Here's a set I took for Bear's DDC: 33w 1d. I actually like the ones that are just of the belly. Would you believe it took until baby #4 for my fat ass to develop stretch marks?










Rhynna, you look great in these. I am always in awe of big preggo bellies. Ain't nothing wrong with that!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I'm with you on that, too.







: I don't think she sings very well. Now, Aretha? Chaka? Those sisters can SING!
I think I get tired of the trying-so-hard-to-be-sexy thing all the time and it turns me off.

I NEVER said that Beyonce could sing!







, but I love her look. She can carry a tune, but I would never compare her to Aretha Franklin or Etta James for that matter. There is SINGING, and then there is singing. Beyonce does that latter.


----------



## AndrewsMother

If that brown eyed, curly haired angel ever comes up missing, he is at MY house.
I just want to eat him up.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
We already have three which feels like a lot of kids. Maybe they're just bad so it feels that way, lol. He wants a fourth. For some reason he thinks that will even things out.










Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 









I've got four and yes, things are balanced. Two boys, two girls, all done.







Four really isn't much more work than three, to be honest.







In fact... despite #3 being the most difficult baby, I'd say that the hardest step was from one to two.







In any case, I like knowing that I'm finished, and that in five years I'll have four school-aged kiddos and I'll be able to do things like knit and sew without worrying about someone pulling the needles out or burning the house down. I'll still be young enough to get my groove on!









I wanted seven until I had #1.


----------



## rootzdawta

I think Beyonce, like Michael Jackson (you know, Black in the day Michael







) is a performer/entertainer more so than a singer OR actor.

Now this sista, Jazmine Sullivan, new on the scene, I'm feeling her singing.

I think I'm good with 2 although if I had more resources, I'd go for 3 or even 4. I can do for 2 far above the minimum and that's what I want my kids to have--a quality childhood. Music classes, trips, 100% of their mama, etc.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Girl, please, you _are_ too cute while pregnant! I want to pinch your cheeks!!!









I totally agree!









And I saw Beyonce on The Today Show (I watch it every morning but haven't quite figured out why yet







) I have a definite love/hate thing with her--I think she's just kind of vapid, ultimately, and has worked so hard and been groomed so hard to be this entertainer person that she doesn't have a lot of the other kinds of depth you find in other regular people and in artists that gives them a more human quality. But she can be entertaining and I have had that Single Ladies song stuck in my head for the past week anyway!

As for the holiday, I hope we can get it together enough this evening to get some boxes so that we spend tomorrow packing! And every year I watch the parade on tv--since I moved to NY I've toyed with the idea of actually going to it since I live here now but...it's too cold for all of that. And standing up in a crowd? no thanks! And there's NO WAY I'm going shopping the day after, either. I just bought my niece and nephew's presents online--Toysrus.com has free shipping on orders over $49, which covered two wooden puzzles for the 2 year old and a Leapfrog game for the soon to be 8 year old, so I'm pretty much done. I send out holiday cards to people, usually, because I don't really get into gift buying and I don't think anyone expects me to this year anyway







And I don't think we're even cooking anything special tomorrow, which is cool with me. SIL is going out of town tomorrow so we'll just be happy to be by ourselves for the weekend


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 









I've got four and yes, things are balanced. Two boys, two girls, all done.







Four really isn't much more work than three, to be honest.







In fact... despite #3 being the most difficult baby, I'd say that the hardest step was from one to two.







In any case, I like knowing that I'm finished, and that in five years I'll have four school-aged kiddos and I'll be able to do things like knit and sew without worrying about someone pulling the needles out or burning the house down. I'll still be young enough to get my groove on!









See my youngest in school full time this year. If they were closer in age maybe but I don't want to have three in school full time and start over again with another. I mean my youngest would be in the fifth grade by the time another baby would even hit kindy yikes! So I'm done. Going from one to two wasn't bad for me. Going from two to three was a BIG adjustment. My girls are only 18 months apart so I'm sure that had something to do with it.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Awww, you all look beautiful! Thanks for sharing your pictures. It's so nice to put faces to people I've been talking to.

Bloomingstar, you look amazing! Jannah, I don't really see any weight either. you look great!

Rhynna, I love your pj pics. you are all beautiful women









And as far as Beyonce, I really do not care for her either. but then again, I like people with depth and talent like India Arie, Erikah Badhu, Lauryn Hill etc..

And I completely hear the "trying really hard to be sexy" thing is so annoying.
Sorry AndrewsMother, can you tell I've been waiting a long time to vent about a celebrity I don't like?









Yeah, I too loved being pregnant but you couldn't pay me to get pg.








My kiddo is pretty easygoing too and we still have our hands full.


----------



## splendid

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I only have a handful of shows that I actually watch and the Today's show isn't one of them so I didn't see it. All the pregnany pics are making me nostalgic. Dh is still trying to convince me to have another. I just can't see it. I mean I could but I can't know what I mean?

Is anyone braving the early morn to go after Thanksgiving Day shopping?

I would love to have another (or 2) but I think my dh is done. I was sick for both pregnancies that I think he is scared of losing me.

My dh is working on Friday and since we only have one car I might stay home and cyber shop. There is a Kohls around town and they open at 4 so I might go there for some much needed linens, towels, and toddler pants.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Awww, you all look beautiful! Thanks for sharing your pictures. It's so nice to put faces to people I've been talking to.

Bloomingstar, you look amazing! Jannah, I don't really see any weight either. you look great!

Rhynna, I love your pj pics. you are all beautiful women









And as far as Beyonce, I really do not care for her either. but then again, I like people with depth and talent like India Arie, Erikah Badhu, Lauryn Hill etc..

*And I completely hear the "trying really hard to be sexy" thing is so annoying.
Sorry AndrewsMother, can you tell I've been waiting a long time to vent about a celebrity I don't like?







*

Yeah, I too loved being pregnant but you couldn't pay me to get pg.








My kiddo is pretty easygoing too and we still have our hands full.











My DH has to listen to me vent about Lauryn Hill and Jill Scott. Lauryn Hill can't carry a tune in a bucket IMO, but I do like her style. She seems to be a good mom, and her figure, since she has a tribe of children, is far better than Beyonce's. Maybe not aesthetically pleasing in the same manner, but GREAT to have been stretched over and over again. I don't look that great after 1 child.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I NEVER said that Beyonce could sing!







, but I love her look. She can carry a tune, but I would never compare her to Aretha Franklin or Etta James for that matter. There is SINGING, and then there is singing. Beyonce does that latter.









. Yeah that! She is a good entertainer and attractive. She knows how to sell "it".


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
If that brown eyed, curly haired angel ever comes up missing, he is at MY house.
I just want to eat him up.


When I first read this I was thinking, what is she talking about? Then I remembered that other pics could be viewed. Thanks, that my youngest DC. BTW, I can PM you my address so you'll know where to pick him up









Thank you ladies for the compliments. I never feel too good about myself when I'm pregnant. I miss the old me







. When I married my DH 8 yrs ago I was 119 pounds. After pregnancy I can't seem to get below 150(mostly gut), I'm only 5 ft 1.

As for Beyonce, I don't think she's that great of a singer. To tell you the truth, I'm tired of seeing her butt shaking. Other than that, it seems like she's a nice person.


----------



## shayinme

Mommy2Amira said:


> And as far as Beyonce, I really do not care for her either. but then again, I like people with depth and talent like India Arie, Erikah Badhu, Lauryn Hill etc..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : Beyonce is alright, she is interesting to watch from a performance standpoint but musically I am a Jill/India/Erykah kinda gal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That and Cassandra Wilson who is not properly appreciated IMO.
> 
> Anybody into Zap Mama? I really dig them as well.
> 
> Bloomingstar, you are too cute for words.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You too Rynna and Jannah, some cuties up in here.
> 
> Shay
Click to expand...


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
When I married my DH 8 yrs ago I was 119 pounds. After pregnancy I can't seem to get below 150(mostly gut), I'm only 5 ft 1.

I'm 5'2" and about 170 lbs. right now.







We'll get the weight off.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:









: Beyonce is alright, she is interesting to watch from a performance standpoint but musically I am a Jill/India/Erykah kinda gal.







That and Cassandra Wilson who is not properly appreciated IMO.

Shay








I agree about Ms. Wilson. I also dig N'dambi (who used to sing back up for Erykah and is also underrated).

I find myself listening mostly to older folks these days: Ella Fitzgerald, Gladys Knight, and especially Nina Simone. I like a lot of the new music that's around in that it's catchy, light and fun to dance to but it doesn't speak to me like the music of these women.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:









: Beyonce is alright, she is interesting to watch from a performance standpoint but musically I am a Jill/India/Erykah kinda gal.







*That and Cassandra Wilson who is not properly appreciated IMO.*

Anybody into Zap Mama? I really dig them as well.

Bloomingstar, you are too cute for words.







You too Rynna and Jannah, some cuties up in here.
Absolfreakinlutley!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 







I agree about Ms. Wilson. I also dig N'dambi (who used to sing back up for Erykah and is also underrated).

I find myself listening mostly to older folks these days: Ella Fitzgerald, Gladys Knight, and especially *Nina Simone*. I like a lot of the new music that's around in that it's catchy, light and fun to dance to but it doesn't speak to me like the music of these women.


I am so in love with Nina Simone. My sister is named after her as my dad is a major fan. I grew up listening to her!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm 5'2" and about 170 lbs. right now.







We'll get the weight off.

YES WE CAN







From what I read on your blog you're probably mostly booty. As for me, I'm booty challenged







Growing up my friends used to tease me for having no butt.

I love the pics of your baking. If I could make baklava my Dh would request it every other day. I'm also loving your pics of the items you knitted and crocheted. Do you sell what you produce?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
YES WE CAN







From what I read on your blog you're probably mostly booty. As for me, I'm booty challenged







Growing up my friends used to tease me for having no butt.

I love the pics of your baking. If I could make baklava my Dh would request it every other day. I'm also loving your pics of the items you knitted and crocheted. Do you sell what you produce?

I am bottom heavy but right now I'm carrying the weight all over--even on my face and at the nape of my neck.

Thanks! I love to bake. Balkava is actually one of the easiest baked dishes. It's basically phyllo dough, a simple spiced syrup and crushed up walnuts.

I was going to try to sell what I make at one point but I realized that only folks who appreciate handmade would be willing to pay what I would have to charge. For example, a cotton tam for dreadlocks knit or crocheted with a fine/thin yarn would have to cost about $50 in terms of my time and materials and work. You can get something similar, machine made for $10. So it's difficult to sell what you make unless you're willing to really put 110% of yourself into making it profitable.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Is anyone braving the early morn to go after Thanksgiving Day shopping?


Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I abhor crowds, so I do not shop the day after Thanksgiving.

i have never, never, ever in life been shopping the day after thanksgiving. i am allergic to crowds, and normally shop on random tuesday mornings, LOL. but i am actually considering it this year b/c this clean/classic/modern/low bed we want from ikea is on sale. we've been wanting it; right now we just have our box spring and mattress up on a frame, AND the frame up on risers so we can have lots of storage underneath. now we've got a way-more-mobile baby boy and feel like it's time to take the whole assembly down a foot or two.

BUT. dang. maybe it's worth that extra $100 just to avoid the drama. we'll see what friday morning brings.

cassandra wilson's blue light till dawn, and zap mama's sabsylma are two of my favorite albums. also LOVE: all of the 'verve remixed' albums. they take classics from the verve catalog (old jazz label) by etta james, nina simone, billie holiday, etc, and they are remixed by amazing house/electronica music producers. i think they're up to 3 or 4 volumes by now. SICK, i tell you. there's a version of 'whatever lola wants' by sarah vaughn that makes me want to dance screaming into the night.

also, i'm currently loving how itunes "genius" feature will make playlists of related songs. i was habitually a 'put it on shuffle and rock' kind of chick so this just takes that tactic to the next level. it's like pandora-fiying your own music collection. nice.

add me to the nostalgic for pregnancy crowd. with alla yall cuties posting pictures!! and i was just pregnant like five minutes ago!! sigh. i got the fever, yall.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I wanted seven until I had #1.

laughup

When I was a kid, I swore I'd have about 6, too. I want one more and then I'm done.


----------



## Draupadi

Hope everyone has a good day filled with lots of food!
Anyone else cooking?
I'm doing some vegetarian side dishes, but MIL is bringing the turkey for the carnivores and my bff Amy is making a delicious "unturkey" roast.
Should be fun!
Enjoy, everyone!







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I am so in love with Nina Simone. My sister is named after her as my dad is a major fan. I grew up listening to her!

I grew up listening to Nina Simone too, I love her voice. My favorite song was 'To Be Young Gifted And Black'.
I don't really listen to music anymore. I'm not even familiar with some of the people that you ladies have mentioned


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
laughup

When I was a kid, I swore I'd have about 6, too. I want one more and then I'm done.


I have a friend who wanted 12, she stopped at three


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hope everyone has a good day filled with lots of food!
Anyone else cooking?
I'm doing some vegetarian side dishes, but MIL is bringing the turkey for the carnivores and my bff Amy is making a delicious "unturkey" roast.
Should be fun!
Enjoy, everyone!







:


I don't do Thanksgiving. We have a holiday coming up in December. I think I'll make a turkey with all of the side dishes on this holiday







:.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:

there's a version of 'whatever lola wants' by sarah vaughn that makes me want to dance screaming into the night.
Oyinmama, that cracked me the heck up







. I love it when music moves one to do wild and crazy things.

Are ya'll familiar with Amp Fiddler? He's is funky. I'd like to add Dwele to my list of gotta haves too.
Zap Mama rocks--one of my favorites is Sweet Melodie









I am not cooking a thing this for thanksgiving. My party wore me out. So later on, I am headed to my folks and have been charged with bringing the wine. I can do that!

I don't like crowds either. I will not be in the madness on Friday. I might...might hit a store today. Lots are open for pre-black Friday sales.

Anyone decorated for Christmas(those who celebrate)? I have some things that I put up for my party. However, I am going to get my tree next weekend to finish things off. I was suckered into hosting a family affair on Dec. 6th so I want to have my house in full effect by then!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Hope everyone has a good day filled with lots of food!
*Anyone else cooking?*
I'm doing some vegetarian side dishes, but MIL is bringing the turkey for the carnivores and my bff Amy is making a delicious "unturkey" roast.
Should be fun!
Enjoy, everyone!







:

No, I am not yet adult enough to cook on Thanksgiving. If I were in Atlanta it would be my job to garnish the turkey platter. Cooking in my family is for those well over 50, almost 60 and over.


----------



## shayinme

Well some friends invited us over but I am still doing a scaled down dinner here so we have our own leftovers







. The turkey is on, I am doing southern style string beans (no smoked meat so cooking ole skool style in fatback), oyster dressing and candied yams.







: I also baked 2 pumpkin pies yesterday so Mama ain't doing no cooking for a few days.


----------



## Jannah6

My aunt and I share a Brownstone, I smell her cooking Turkey downstairs







:







:







:. The house is so peaceful. 3 of my DC had school today, my oldest DS has off. Oldest DS took my youngest DS downstairs, and DH is sleeping on the sofa. So I have PEACE. I guess it is Thanksgiving for me


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My aunt and I share a Brownstone, I smell her cooking Turkey downstairs







:







:







:. The house is so peaceful. 3 of my DC had school today, my oldest DS has off. Oldest DS took my youngest DS downstairs, and DH is sleeping on the sofa. So I have PEACE. I guess it is Thanksgiving for me









Enjoy your peace mama


----------



## rootzdawta

I cooked a few things to take to my parents' so we have something to eat: vegan mac & cheese, roasted potatoes, collard greens with cabbage & okra, bbq seitan and a sweet potato pie. I hope to have lots of leftovers.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Well some friends invited us over but I am still doing a scaled down dinner here so we have our own leftovers







. The turkey is on, I am doing southern style string beans (no smoked meat so cooking ole skool style in fatback), oyster dressing and candied yams.







: I also baked 2 pumpkin pies yesterday so Mama ain't doing no cooking for a few days.

Shay, that sounds soooo good girl! I haven't had fatback since I was a child but trust and believe, if I was there, I'd be tearing up it up









Quote:

rootzdawta I cooked a few things to take to my parents' so we have something to eat: vegan mac & cheese, roasted potatoes, collard greens with cabbage & okra, *bbq seitan* and a sweet potato pie. I hope to have lots of leftovers.
*slurp* *slurp*! It all sounds good!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I cooked a few things to take to my parents' so we have something to eat: vegan mac & cheese, roasted potatoes, collard greens with cabbage & okra, bbq seitan and a sweet potato pie. I hope to have lots of leftovers.

Sounds good. I've never cooked collard greens with cabbage & okra all together. I have to try it.

*I recently tried my hand at cooking CooCoo/Fungi. It came out alright. My aunt, uncle and DH loved it, but I've tasted better. Do you, or any other Mama's have a good recipe for it?*


----------



## AndrewsMother

I have never eaten BBQ seitan or coo/coo, but the recipes that I googled look tasty.

I have eaten collard greens, cabbage and okra together, it sounds yummy. We normally eat a mixture of chard, kale and mushrooms or cabbage with carrots, peppers and onions.

I am going to grill turkey parts tomorrow to eat after church on Saturday, perhaps I will make cabbage to accompany the meat.

I feel like a hypocrite, we never purchase meat to prepare at home, but someone gave me a coupon for a whole free turkey. It is not organic or free range, but GOSH...it was a free turkey.

Does anyone else have any concerns with the U.S. food supply since melamine was found in formula. My thoughts are, what next.


----------



## oyinmama

i was gonna do a live kale salad (beets & carrots & scallions&garlic, lemon juice aminos and sesame oil) but didn't start it in time for the marinade to take. now maybe it'll be a warm kale salad and i'll put it in the crock pot to warm slowly while i prepare mac & cheese.

that's all we were gonna have, but last night friends were surprised by a turkey in the mail from their mom, and invited us over to help them eat it. LOL. so we'll bring our 'sides and wine' dinner over there and combine!


----------



## jeca

All my family lives hours and hours away and DH's lives across the water so yeah we're eating here. I'm almost done cooking. I baked the Ham last night. Baked a pumpkin cake (very yummy). The Turkey is in the oven. We're also having jellied cranberry sauce. Smothered Cabbage. Cornbread. I still have to bake some sweet potato pie using my Daddy's recipe which is famous in our family, lol. Some deviled eggs for appetizers and my friend's macaroni and cheese recipe which I can't imitate but can get close. Oh yeah and some pasteles. I wonder if I'm forgetting anything?








We're going to use my china for the "feast" as the kids call it. Now that they're older I think it would be nice and they are looking forward to it. DH was about peeved about not getting any collard greens this year but oh well.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Happy Thanksgiving!


----------



## Jannah6

Well, my aunt wasn't cooking turkey, she was cooking sausages. She said that she won't be cooking the turkey until Saturday.
It's a good thing that I had planned on cooking dinner anyway. Like I said before, I don't do Thanksgiving, but I did have sort of a feast







. I made bbq short ribs, curried cabbage with halal italian sausages,collard geens, and yams. For dessert I made my DC cupcakes with chocolate icing







:

*Andrewsmother*, I'm not anymore concerned about the food supply, than I am when I hear about samonila outbreaks. I'll tell you this, if I were formula feeding I definitely would not feed my child any of those formulas that tested positive.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Andrewsmother*, I'm not anymore concerned about the food supply, than I am when I hear about samonila outbreaks. I'll tell you this, if I were formula feeding I definitely would not feed my child any of those formulas that tested positive.

Yeah except when you think about how many mamas get their formula from WIC and they won't change it. It's really sad. That's why I wish the breastfeeding rate amongst our women were higher. I am an advocate and spread the word whenever I can but all I get met with are excuses it just makes me sad. I am the only mama in my family that breastfed. The last one was my great grandma. I don't want to use the current scare to push my nursing agenda but I would love to reduce the AA's woman's dependancy on WIC among other things.
I guess that was a bit OT.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Yeah except when you think about how many mamas get their formula from WIC and they won't change it. It's really sad. That's why I wish the breastfeeding rate amongst our women were higher. I am an advocate and spread the word whenever I can but all I get met with are excuses it just makes me sad. I am the only mama in my family that breastfed. The last one was my great grandma. I don't want to use the current scare to push my nursing agenda but I would love to reduce the AA's woman's dependancy on WIC among other things.
I guess that was a bit OT.


It may have been OT, but you hit the nail on the head. It is really sad that more AA women don't breastfeed







I have 2 sisters, 1 didn't breastfeed any of her 4 DC. My sister that has 6 DC breastfed her last 2 DC, I think being married to an Antiguan had something to do with her decision to breastfeed. My mom didn't breastfeed any of her DC.
You know I didn't think about the WIC scenerio, some people won't have a choice about changing brands







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
It may have been OT, but you hit the nail on the head. It is really sad that more AA women don't breastfeed







My mom didn't breastfeed any of her DC.
You know I didn't think about the WIC scenerio, some people won't have a choice about changing brands







:

You ladies are so right. I've actually kind of given up trying to win Black folks over to breastfeeding. I think I've heard every blessed excuse in the book with some even suggesting that it's gross. At this point, I know it sounds mean, but the information is out there--a lot of Black women know it is better to breastfeed but choose to formula feed most of the time, I think, out of convenience. I notice that with White women who are not breastfeeding, they often follow up with a reason why they couldn't or feel like they have to defend their decision to bottle feed. Many Black women who aren't really don't seem to feel any way about not doing it. Oh, I know formula is pushed and often more socially acceptable but I just wish our people, especially with scares like this, would dig a little deeper and make some kind of change however small.

My mother is a nutritionist for WIC and she knew so little about breastfeeding (didn't breastfeed any of us). She went to a workshop to learn and was all excited like, "Wow, the baby has such an excellent latch!" and I'm like







, just please teach your clients and TELL THEM THEY CAN GET A BREAST PUMP instead of formula. Why is it that for every 5 folks I know on WIC, exactly 1 or sometimes 0 know that??

BTW, I had a *great* time at my parents' house yesterday. My uncle an his wife with their 5 kids and my other uncle with his two older twin boys came and I can't believe I enjoyed myself. For once, I didn't feel judged, awkward or excluded.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Yeah except when you think about how many mamas get their formula from WIC and they won't change it. It's really sad. That's why I wish the breastfeeding rate amongst our women were higher. I am an advocate and spread the word whenever I can but all I get met with are excuses it just makes me sad. I am the only mama in my family that breastfed. The last one was my great grandma. I don't want to use the current scare to push my nursing agenda but I would love to reduce the AA's woman's dependancy on WIC among other things.
I guess that was a bit OT.

I don't think that you are off topic, and I feel the same way and mentioned something about WIC an a post about the tainted formula in the News and Current Events Forum.

I am one of the oldest of my generation, #3 to have a child, the first to breastfeed, I think. My family was very supportive and understanding as were friends of the family. I can't recall anyone saying anything unkind or ridiculous. I might have been the first, but I know that I won't be the last.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
You ladies are so right. I've actually kind of given up trying to win Black folks over to breastfeeding. I think I've heard every blessed excuse in the book with some even suggesting that it's gross. At this point, *I know it sounds mean, but the information is out there--a lot of Black women know it is better to breastfeed but choose to formula feed most of the time, I think, out of convenience.* I notice that with White women who are not breastfeeding, they often follow up with a reason why they couldn't or feel like they have to defend their decision to bottle feed. Many Black women who aren't really don't seem to feel any way about not doing it. Oh, I know formula is pushed and often more socially acceptable but I just wish our people, especially with scares like this, would dig a little deeper and make some kind of change however small.

My mother is a nutritionist for WIC and she knew so little about breastfeeding (didn't breastfeed any of us). She went to a workshop to learn and was all excited like, "Wow, the baby has such an excellent latch!" and I'm like







, just please teach your clients and TELL THEM THEY CAN GET A BREAST PUMP instead of formula. Why is it that for every 5 folks I know on WIC, exactly 1 or sometimes 0 know that??

BTW, I had a *great* time at my parents' house yesterday. My uncle an his wife with their 5 kids and my other uncle with his two older twin boys came and I can't believe I enjoyed myself. For once, I didn't feel judged, awkward or excluded.









You don't sound mean, IMO. Sometimes I feel as if some black women, not all, don't really care to do what is best for their children. Not they don't care, but they don't want to sacrifice their resources to do something different, something better. Even if something is killing the black community or not improving upon it, we are slow to change and will fight, somewhat, to uphold archaic denigrating ways, beliefs or traditions.

There is too much easily available literature that attests to the benefits of breastfeeding. Medicaid will cover visits with lactation consultants and WIC does have breastfeeding resources. Women just have to ask.

Rootzdawta, as for your family....people do change and maybe yours are doing so for the better!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
You know I didn't think about the WIC scenerio, some people won't have a choice about changing brands







:

Maybe some children with excellent pediatricians will write a prescription that will enable them to have a different formula.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Well, my aunt wasn't cooking turkey, she was cooking sausages. She said that she won't be cooking the turkey until Saturday.
It's a good thing that I had planned on cooking dinner anyway. Like I said before, I don't do Thanksgiving, but I did have sort of a feast







. I made bbq short ribs, curried cabbage with halal italian sausages,collard geens, and yams. For dessert I made my DC cupcakes with chocolate icing







:

*Andrewsmother*, I'm not anymore concerned about the food supply, than I am when I hear about samonila outbreaks. I'll tell you this, if I were formula feeding I definitely would not feed my child any of those formulas that tested positive.

I normally would not care, and I am not concerned about the food in my home, but we eat out. A lot sometimes. Salmonella is something that could easily happen, but chemically tainted food , IMO, is different.


----------



## Jannah6

ooops


----------



## eilonwy

I have four kids who are/have been on WIC. The baby is on formula right now.

No, I'm not concerned about the US food supply *or* about the trace amounts of melamine found in infant formula. Firstly, the amounts found in China were *significant*, they could not in any way be construed as trace amounts. I know that the news has reported that 3-5 babies died, but that's far from the truth: The truth is, China hasn't got a free press and many, many, MANY more babies have become ill and/or died drinking that Sanlu powdered formula. A doctor in Shanghai tried to sound an alarm *over a year ago* about the high numbers of children coming in with kidney stones. Kidney stones are very rare in infants and toddlers, and for dozens, later hundreds and thousands of *babies* to be developing large, bilateral kidney stones suggested, to him, a problem with formula. Nobody listened. There are families all over China who have lost babies to kidney stones and who have been suffering for *a year*, and they never knew why... until now. It's *horrible*, but the problem is/was a lot more widespread than most people realized.

Why am I not worried about American formula? Because if American babies were developing kidney stones at that rate, particularly large, bilateral stones (as in the cases of those poor babies in China) then we would know about it. It would be considered an epidemic, and the press would be reporting it because the government isn't telling them not to.

I've got an issue with scare tactics, so I don't think I could bring myself to say, "Your baby's going to die like those babies in China if you don't breastfeed!" but maybe that's just me.









Oh, in the interests of full disclosure-- All of my kids were breastfed initially. Three of them have self-weaned at ages 4.5, 15 months, and 18 months. The baby is on Neocate due to serious GI issues. I doubt that his formula tested positive for melamine, simply because cursory tests screen melamine as a protein... and Bear's formula has no protein in it (that's kind of the whole point of an amino acid-based formula). We get the Neocate through WIC and Medicaid (and thank Goddess for it, as we couldn't begin to afford the stuff-- $140 for a case of four cans-- that lasts a bit less than one week). I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who didn't need it, as the poop is HORRIBLE and... well, the stuff is *obscenely* expensive and difficult to get. It's not like you can walk into a grocery store or pharmacy and buy it, you have to special order the stuff and if you run out you're pretty much screwed.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

No, I'm not concerned about the US food supply *or* about the trace amounts of melamine found in infant formula. Firstly, the amounts found in China were *significant*, they could not in any way be construed as trace amounts. I know that the news has reported that 3-5 babies died, but that's far from the truth: The truth is, China hasn't got a free press and many, many, MANY more babies have become ill and/or died drinking that Sanlu powdered formula. A doctor in Shanghai tried to sound an alarm *over a year ago* about the high numbers of children coming in with kidney stones. Kidney stones are very rare in infants and toddlers, and for dozens, later hundreds and thousands of *babies* to be developing large, bilateral kidney stones suggested, to him, a problem with formula. Nobody listened. There are families all over China who have lost babies to kidney stones and who have been suffering for *a year*, and they never knew why... until now. It's *horrible*, but the problem is/was a lot more widespread than most people realized.

Why am I not worried about American formula? Because if American babies were developing kidney stones at that rate, particularly large, bilateral stones (as in the cases of those poor babies in China) then we would know about it. It would be considered an epidemic, and the press would be reporting it because the government isn't telling them not to.

I've got an issue with scare tactics, so I don't think I could bring myself to say, "Your baby's going to die like those babies in China if you don't breastfeed!" but maybe that's just me.









Oh, in the interests of full disclosure-- All of my kids were breastfed initially. Three of them have self-weaned at ages 4.5, 15 months, and 18 months. The baby is on Neocate due to serious GI issues. I doubt that his formula tested positive for melamine, simply because cursory tests screen melamine as a protein... and Bear's formula has no protein in it (that's kind of the whole point of an amino acid-based formula). We get the Neocate through WIC and Medicaid (and thank Goddess for it, as we couldn't begin to afford the stuff-- $140 for a case of four cans-- that lasts a bit less than one week). I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who didn't need it, as the poop is HORRIBLE and... well, the stuff is *obscenely* expensive and difficult to get. It's not like you can walk into a grocery store or pharmacy and buy it, you have to special order the stuff and if you run out you're pretty much screwed.


It's not that I'm concerned about kidney stones, but what are the effects of trace amounts? If I were formula feeding I wouldn't be comfortable with feeding my DC trace amounts


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
It's not that I'm concerned about kidney stones, but what are the effects of trace amounts? If I were formula feeding I wouldn't be comfortable with feeding my DC trace amounts

This is where I start to part ways with the super crunchy set. It is damn near impossible to live and eat in America without ingesting trace amounts of something yucky on a very, very regular basis. You'd pretty much have to grow your own food on land that's been in a bubble for the past 50 years. We do the best we can, I'm sure, but there are places where you have to draw the line. Our food and water have been contaminated and will continue to be contaminated until our economy and pretty much everything else changes for the better. That's not to say that we shouldn't try, but to get super tense about trace amounts of a chemical that _we have all been ingesting in trace amounts for our entire lives_ strikes me as counterproductive.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
This is where I start to part ways with the super crunchy set. It is damn near impossible to live and eat in America without ingesting trace amounts of something yucky on a very, very regular basis. You'd pretty much have to grow your own food on land that's been in a bubble for the past 50 years. We do the best we can, I'm sure, but there are places where you have to draw the line. Our food and water have been contaminated and will continue to be contaminated until our economy and pretty much everything else changes for the better. That's not to say that we shouldn't try, but to get super tense about trace amounts of a chemical that _we have all been ingesting in trace amounts for our entire lives_ strikes me as counterproductive.


WOOOO, for the record I'm not super crunchy, nor would I be considered to be a little crunchy. Yes we do the best we can. So in doing the best that I could I would choose not to feed my DC those formulas. We consume things in our everyday lives that we shouldn't, but if given the choice people would decide not to. How does that seem counterproductive or super tense?
I don't think that parents who are alarmed are overreacting at all, we're talking about their DC and a chemical that the FDA previously said was not good in any amount.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

You don't sound mean, IMO. Sometimes I feel as if some black women, not all, don't really care to do what is best for their children. Not they don't care, but they don't want to sacrifice their resources to do something different, something better. Even if something is killing the black community or not improving upon it, we are slow to change and will fight, somewhat, to uphold archaic denigrating ways, beliefs or traditions.

There is too much easily available literature that attests to the benefits of breastfeeding. Medicaid will cover visits with lactation consultants and WIC does have breastfeeding resources. Women just have to ask.


I hear what ya'll are saying and while I agree to a certain extent I believe there are issues unique to the Black American experience that make it so that we are less apt to make choices that appear obvious.

I mean the medical industry as a whole has never been quite upfront with us, statistically even college educated middle class Black folks die off sooner than others. Let's go back and look at Tuskgeegee and countless other medical atrocities that have been committed towards Black folks. So yeah, I get why some of us are not jumping on the bandwagon to breastfeed.

Instead we are a culture that leans heavily on the wisdom of the elders, we listen to our aunts/granny's and so on in far greater numbers than we listen to white folks. So that's where I think our efforts will yield fruit eventually when maybe the younger generation says I remember so and so breastfed and will seek you out.

Let's also remember that while we have access to knowledge, there is still a disproportionate number of Black folks in the US who lack access to the internet in a meaningful way. Really, if you only can get online 10-20 mins at the public library that is not enough time to do the research, some of us still live in areas with underfunded libraries, so good books are not available.

Rootzdawta mentioned her Mom is a nutritionist at WIC yet didn't know that much about breastfeeding, well how many sistas go to WIC and maybe don't get good information.

Yes, there may be some Black woman who don't get it and never will but lack of true info stands in the way in many cases.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

What I love about my WIC program is that they REALLY promote breastfeeding. They had a breastfeeding walk and a free breastfeeding banquet with games, awards, and gifts. I was really impressed. For those of you Bed-Stuyers who might be interested, it's the WIC office that is across from Restoration Plaza. Oh, they also have free cooking classes.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
We consume things in our everyday lives that we shouldn't, but if given the choice people would decide not to. How does that seem counterproductive or super tense?

I disagree. Many, many people routinely consume things that they KNOW they shouldn't. I've known hundreds of smokers and not one of them has said, "I think smoking is good for me" or even, "I don't think smoking is bad for me." Every last one of them knew full well that what they were doing was detrimental to their health. This is not even getting into the millions of products into which people have done no research, and the "scares" that don't catch on outside of limited groups of self-informing individuals-- I'm talking exclusively now about things that people KNOW are bad. See if you can find five McDonald's regulars (did you know they call them "heavy users?!") who think that McDonald's food is nutritionally sound. Most people will tell you that it's junk food and then continue on their merry little way through the drive thru.

Quote:

I don't think that parents who are alarmed are overreacting at all, we're talking about their DC and a chemical that the FDA previously said was not good in any amount.
Well, I can't find that... but I did find this. Yes, we are talking about children so it's understandable that parents will overreact... but yeah, I still maintain that they *are* overreacting.

As to the WIC issue... well, breastfeeding was very heavily "pushed" at both of the WIC offices I've been to. Damn near everyone was exclusively breastfeeding at four months and a good many were still nursing at 6-12. They worked really hard on it, and please note that even if you're getting formula, you can get a breastpump (it's not one or the other)-- a hand pump, a battery-operated pump, or even an electric pump if you're working or in school full-time. If you've got a baby for whom you're exclusively pumping, for whatever reason, you can borrow a hospital-grade double pump. In any case, I feel really sorry for women who don't have WIC centers that are better staffed with informed breastfeeders. I kind of wonder why there's no LLL outreach at WIC in those cases.







Dunno. But WIC is not pure evil, "Let's put all these babies on formula all the time;" at least not around here.

When Bear was on Similac (and then Similac Sensitive... and Alimentum.. and finally the Neocate) the first person who talked to me was very... I don't know, she was borderline condescending about "Why aren't you breastfeeding?" The second woman who came in explained to the first (a new hire) that the spiel wasn't necessary for me, because I was, in fact, a breastfeeder-- all she was doing was making me feel badly about something well beyond my control. She knew perfectly well that my intent was to get Bear back on the boob as soon as possible, and didn't make me listen to the speech and sign up for breastfeeding support counseling before printing out the checks.

I don't know. Maybe WIC is different around here?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I have four kids who are/have been on WIC. The baby is on formula right now.

No, I'm not concerned about the US food supply *or* about the trace amounts of melamine found in infant formula. Firstly, the amounts found in China were *significant*, they could not in any way be construed as trace amounts. I know that the news has reported that 3-5 babies died, but that's far from the truth: The truth is, China hasn't got a free press and many, many, MANY more babies have become ill and/or died drinking that Sanlu powdered formula. A doctor in Shanghai tried to sound an alarm *over a year ago* about the high numbers of children coming in with kidney stones. Kidney stones are very rare in infants and toddlers, and for dozens, later hundreds and thousands of *babies* to be developing large, bilateral kidney stones suggested, to him, a problem with formula. Nobody listened. There are families all over China who have lost babies to kidney stones and who have been suffering for *a year*, and they never knew why... until now. It's *horrible*, but the problem is/was a lot more widespread than most people realized.

Why am I not worried about American formula? Because if American babies were developing kidney stones at that rate, particularly large, bilateral stones (as in the cases of those poor babies in China) then we would know about it. It would be considered an epidemic, and the press would be reporting it because the government isn't telling them not to.

*I've got an issue with scare tactics, so I don't think I could bring myself to say, "Your baby's going to die like those babies in China if you don't breastfeed!" but maybe that's just me.







*

Oh, in the interests of full disclosure-- All of my kids were breastfed initially. Three of them have self-weaned at ages 4.5, 15 months, and 18 months. The baby is on Neocate due to serious GI issues. I doubt that his formula tested positive for melamine, simply because cursory tests screen melamine as a protein... and Bear's formula has no protein in it (that's kind of the whole point of an amino acid-based formula). We get the Neocate through WIC and Medicaid (and thank Goddess for it, as we couldn't begin to afford the stuff-- $140 for a case of four cans-- that lasts a bit less than one week). I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who didn't need it, as the poop is HORRIBLE and... well, the stuff is *obscenely* expensive and difficult to get. It's not like you can walk into a grocery store or pharmacy and buy it, you have to special order the stuff and if you run out you're pretty much screwed.

I don't think that anyone is telling women in the U.S. that their children will die if they don't breastfeed.

I have issues with the FDA changing their stance on what levels of Melamine are safe. Our laws, policies and statements should not mirror anything similar to the actions taken in George Orwell's, 1984. Double speak and a vacuum tube culture should not exist in our government. What the FDA spoke about China should hold true in the U.S., but of course it will not because our financial interests are at stake.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I hear what ya'll are saying and while I agree to a certain extent I believe there are issues unique to the Black American experience that make it so that we are less apt to make choices that appear obvious.

I mean the medical industry as a whole has never been quite upfront with us, statistically even college educated middle class Black folks die off sooner than others. Let's go back and look at Tuskgeegee and countless other medical atrocities that have been committed towards Black folks. So yeah, I get why some of us are not jumping on the bandwagon to breastfeed.

Instead we are a culture that leans heavily on the wisdom of the elders, we listen to our aunts/granny's and so on in far greater numbers than we listen to white folks. So that's where I think our efforts will yield fruit eventually when maybe the younger generation says I remember so and so breastfed and will seek you out.

Let's also remember that while we have access to knowledge, there is still a disproportionate number of Black folks in the US who lack access to the internet in a meaningful way. Really, if you only can get online 10-20 mins at the public library that is not enough time to do the research, some of us still live in areas with underfunded libraries, so good books are not available.

Rootzdawta mentioned her Mom is a nutritionist at WIC yet didn't know that much about breastfeeding, well how many sistas go to WIC and maybe don't get good information.

Yes, there may be some Black woman who don't get it and never will but lack of true info stands in the way in many cases.

Shay

I agree Shay and cut Black folks a lot of slack (and the issue of lack of breastfeeding I've noticed also affects Black people who are not AA because no other woman in my family--the Nigerian side breastfeeds). My mom was _willfully_ ignorant about breastfeeding--she's got two master's degrees, one in nutritional science and the other in education and only took time to learn because her job required it. There is misinformation abounding indeed and that contributes greatly to the fact that so many don't breastfeed. But what I do notice is that when it comes to things like the latest hair weave techniques or coolest tech gadget, somehow that knowledge is common. I live in a town where the library is crapola and it's obvious. So I basically do inter-library loans on everything and try to tell folks about it--very rarely do they seem to care. They'll bring their kids for story time and walk out without a book or anything. And also, Black people do seem to trust their doctors because if I have to tell one more borderline diabetic in my family that they need to stop drinking soda and "fruit juice" and they say, "My doctor didn't tell me that" I'm going to flip. And I, for one, wish that I could get more information out of my elders but they too just don't seem to know.

So you're right . . . maybe when _we_ become elders the tide will turn.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 


Well, I can't find that... but I did find this. Yes, we are talking about children so it's understandable that parents will overreact... but yeah, I still maintain that they *are* overreacting.






This statement was issued October 3, 2008.

Quote:

AFETY/RISK ASSESSMENT FOR INFANT FORMULA

FDA in collaboration with the Food Safety and Inspection Service (FSIS) of the Department of Agriculture, and in consultation with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) developed a TDI (Tolerable Daily Intake) for melamine and its analogues during the pet food contamination event of 2007.* It was based on results from animal studies with melamine and cyanuric acid administered alone. We designated 0.63 mg/kg bw/d as the tolerable daily intake, or TDI. The TDI is defined as the estimated maximum amount of an agent to which individuals in the population may be exposed daily over their lifetimes without appreciable health risk.[c]

This TDI was used to provide the basis for the safety/risk assessment in FDA's May 2007 Interim Melamine and Analogues Safety/Risk Assessment for food products from animals fed feed containing melamine compounds. In the present exposure event, the potential risk for toxicity from consumption of infant formula contaminated with melamine and its analogues is far higher than last year's risk of toxicity to humans from consumption of animals that had been inadvertently fed contaminated feed.

The previous assumptions that US FDA made in the 2007 risk/safety assessment regarding the pet food contamination episode cannot be applied to the current situation because the contaminated product represents the totality of caloric exposure for most of these infants; the exposure is chronic over months; the persons ingesting the products are infants and toddlers whose renal systems are not yet fully developed; and the exposure is not mitigated by previous passage through the digestive system of an animal. Moreover, several significant gaps in our scientific knowledge about melamine and its analogues toxicity regarding infants exist, including:

1. The impact of the presence of more than one melamine analogue which has the potential to increase the toxicity of the adulterated infant formula.
2. The consequences of continuous use of these infant formulas as sole source of nutrition.
3. The possibility that these formulations can be fed as the sole source of nutrition to premature infants with immature kidney function and even greater intake of infant formula per unit body weight for a longer time period than term infants.

Thus, the US FDA cannot establish a level of melamine and its analogues in these products that does not raise public health concerns.[d]*
*
*


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I agree Shay and cut Black folks a lot of slack (and the issue of lack of breastfeeding I've noticed also affects Black people who are not AA because no other woman in my family--the Nigerian side breastfeeds). My mom was _willfully_ ignorant about breastfeeding--she's got two master's degrees, one in nutritional science and the other in education and only took time to learn because her job required it. There is misinformation abounding indeed and that contributes greatly to the fact that so many don't breastfeed. *But what I do notice is that when it comes to things like the latest hair weave techniques or coolest tech gadget, somehow that knowledge is common.* I live in a town where the library is crapola and it's obvious. So I basically do inter-library loans on everything and try to tell folks about it--very rarely do they seem to care. They'll bring their kids for story time and walk out without a book or anything. And also, Black people do seem to trust their doctors because if I have to tell one more borderline diabetic in my family that they need to stop drinking soda and "fruit juice" and they say, "My doctor didn't tell me that" I'm going to flip. And I, for one, wish that I could get more information out of my elders but they too just don't seem to know.

So you're right . . . maybe when _we_ become elders the tide will turn.

The bold sentence is why I can't cut the majority of Black America slack. Forget about the internet, what did people do 15, 20 or 45 years ago before the internet was easy source for information? People learn what they want to know. Breastfeeding is not an archaic are that is *known* to only a small percentage of the nation. Maybe in practice, but not in knowledge. I don't now and never will accept the idea that information must be forced into minds.

You know what you WANT to know.


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## eilonwy

Quote:

Thus, the US FDA cannot establish a level of melamine and its analogues in these products that does not raise public health concerns.[d]
Okay. That's not exactly the same as saying "There is no safe threshold of melamine in food products." It's quite a mess of... well, double-speak. The US FDA can't establish a level of alcohol consumption for pregnant women that doesn't raise health concerns, either, but that doesn't mean that all alcohol consumption during pregnancy is cause for alarm. I'd be astonished if the overwhelming majority of Americans of all ages weren't consuming melamine in trace amounts every single day. That's what I'd like to see-- studies of melamine & byproduct levels in *people.*


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I don't think that anyone is telling women in the U.S. that their children will die if they don't breastfeed.

I have issues with the FDA changing their stance on what levels of Melamine are safe. Our laws, policies and statements should not mirror anything similar to the actions taken in George Orwell's, 1984. Double speak and a vacuum tube culture should not exist in our government. What the FDA spoke about China should hold true in the U.S., but of course it will not because our financial interests are at stake.


*YES to this







* and this too *"But what I do notice is that when it comes to things like the latest hair weave techniques or coolest tech gadget, somehow that knowledge is common."*


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## jeca

I actually hadn't heard from any "white" source how great or best breastfeeding was so I don't cut a lot of slack to that excuse. Yes we as a whole can be mistrusting to our white doctors or such but what about or own bodies? We can't really say we think the milk comes in just to leave in a few days. . I have seen quite a few actually try but they usually get hard if the going gets too tough or have that ready can of formula. I haven't been on WIC since my oldest was a baby so I'm not sure about how big the efforts are here but I have noticed this. I recently befriended three AA women. The mean hefas who killed me on the hike. Of us four only one did not breastfeed. She agrees that it was best but she just couldn't do it. She is also the only one of us on WIC. I think the ready availability of knowing that you have free formula hinders the effort a lot. It's pretty common where I live to see a big rift in who nurses and who doesn't. I'm only saying that for where I live.
As far as scare tactics that's just a TV show I don't use that to advocate anything in real life as it's mean and it will just get meet with defensiveness. Plus it's silly to try to advocate anything to someone who is already FF. That's like walking up to a mama who circ'd and telling her she is wrong. Well it's too late now.
What I think this current "scare" does show is how polluted our environment and society for that matter has come. Chemical additives are being put in just about everything for the cheapness and profit of it no matter the expense.


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## jeca

OT. I didn't get the laptop I went out to get in the wee hours of the morning. They were handing out pink tickets to those that wanted them at no telling what time. S I call my mom and tell her it's a no go. COme home get online to find out I could have just stayed home and ordered it online.







Then I couldn't even do that as the supply had dwindled and they didn't know what the next ship date would be. I should have just stayed in bed. That was the only place I went. There were some good deals out there but since I still wasn't sure exactly what I was getting these kids it made no point to go. Last year I was done by now.


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## rootzdawta

Ladies, my youngest's doctor just called me to tell me that his lead level is elevated (Class II-A) and that he's anemic--which usually go hand in hand. I feel . . . nervous, scared, worried. Our house is old. We did renovations just before he was born and in the first 6 weeks he was here not because I didn't want it done before he was born but because we got stuck with a loser contractor. I thought we cleaned up pretty well. Maybe I should have done better.

The health dept. is supposed to contact me. The kids are not vaxed. Should I get rid of all their toys? They've got wooden blocks with paint--pretty sure made in China . . . I have to be more diligent about him putting stuff in his mouth.

He's also a sickle cell trait carrier so they want me to have his blood redrawn to do a different, more specific kind of count. Then the recommendation is that I give him iron drops. He doesn't really eat solids because, you know, I'm laid back about it but . . . I guess I need to. He's not getting enough iron via breastmilk. Maybe I should supplement myself again? I don't know. I'm just nervous and worried. And I think DH is pissed off.


----------



## jeca

I would increase iron fortified foods in my own diet along with supplements if I needed to if he is not big on eating solids. How old is your baby again?
As far as toys some things carry higher lead levels than others. if we're talking about a room full of things then you may want to invest in an iron kit. If you only have a handful then tossing them out is not a bad idea. Is the health dept. going to tell you how to reduce the lead level in your house? I'm not really sure how that works. Throwing out his toys if there's lead in the paint on your walls won't be productive. That sounds scary.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I would increase iron fortified foods in my own diet along with supplements if I needed to if he is not big on eating solids. How old is your baby again?
As far as toys some things carry higher lead levels than others. if we're talking about a room full of things then you may want to invest in an iron kit. If you only have a handful then tossing them out is not a bad idea. Is the health dept. going to tell you how to reduce the lead level in your house? I'm not really sure how that works. Throwing out his toys if there's lead in the paint on your walls won't be productive. That sounds scary.









Yes, I'm going to start doing the Floradix again and blackstrap molasses. He's 11 months tomorrow.

It has to be the renovations. The fact that they didn't do any lead abatement or anything.


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## Bloomingstar

That's scary rootz! You just reminded me to go take my Floradix and blackstrap molasses for the day. Hopefully the doctors and inspectors can help you get together a plan to clean out the lead from the house and the baby







s:

As for yesterday, DH and I did absolutely nothing! We didn't cook a thing, didn't go anywhere...and it was suprisingly fine. I have to admit I am a bit jealus of anyone who got dressing and gravy (mmmm gravy














but I can remedy at least a part of that when I go back to work on Monday and get the sandwich I had for lunch on Wednesday again: turkey, dressing, and cranberry sauce on a roll. SOO. GOOD.

DH is out getting boxes right now so the packing will commence this evening, we get the keys tomorrow, and everything gets moved on Sunday.







:

And I'm not sure about the breastfeeding thing in my family. I know my sister is quite militant about it and has nursed both her kids (one til 2.5, an the second til 18 months when she couldn't take it anymore because she's pregnant and it was too much and he was pretty much done anyway) and will nurse this next one too. She supplemented with formula for both, I think, because her supply was low? I dunno. And as far as my friends go, I think they're pretty much watching to see what I'll do since I'm the first one in our little circle to have a baby. I'm definitely looking forward to breastfeeding and have a little list of people to call if I run into trouble!

And I have to say, even though I'll be 36 weeks on Monday, I am not in the least bit done with being pregnant and I wish people would stop telling me "any day now!" or "that baby looks like it's ready to come out!" No it is not any day now and no it is not ready to come out!







I swear I'm going to thrash the next person who says something.

Granted, I may be singing a different tune a couple weeks from now, but you know, maybe not. People just don't know what to say to pregnant women, but never seem to make the choice to just shut up







:

/rant


----------



## eilonwy

Before you start throwing toys away, go to Home Depot and get some of those swab-thingies you can use to test for led. You're probably right about it being the renovations; Is there a chance that you have lead paint flakes/dust in your carpeting and such? Old windows are another thing, every time you open or close one you're sending bits of lead into the air. Also candles with metal wicks-- there was a big hullaballoo about them a few years ago and now many are lead free, but not all.

With sickle cell trait, iron supplementation may not help; Sometimes the abnormal hemoglobin just won't do right, regardless of what you do. I'd research it a bit first. Good luck.







.


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## JeDeeLenae

Breastfeeding in my family is rare too. I'd like to say it was just not knowing, but my aunt BF her 3 kids and she's the 3rd oldest amongst the kids, so she obviously knew, and they all had kids around the same time, so if they didn't know before she started BFing, they knew after.

My sister chose not to BF because her boyfriend at the time said he was uncomfortable with her doing that. So, she stopped after 1 day, saying it was too hard. She let that man control her life, and I'm SO happy he is in jail and away from my niece (and not her father either).

I do have one cousin that nursed her 5 kids. Even a set of twins. Her youngest nursed past 2. When she went to tell me about it, she said, "And you'll probably find this crazy, but I nursed him until he was almost 3." I wanted to hug her. lol

But, overall, what I've heard in the AA community about BFing is that:
1. It's nasty.
2. Why should they when formula is free (WIC).
3. It spoils babies.
4. It's like I'm trying to be white.
5. It's too much work, formula is easier.

So, that's what I've run into within my family. I even have offered to be their doula during birth and help with BFing afterwards, but they're just not receptive to my "white ways."


----------



## oyinmama

ok, so BFing has gotten a bad rap as something 'white' and i understand that as a function of current market share and intergenerational disconnect.

but formula easier than BFing?? that, i do NOT get. what could be easier than rolling over and feeding yr babe? oh, that's right. getting up out of a nice warm bed, mixing formula, checking the temperature of water, making sure there are always clean bottles and nipples.

aroo?


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so BFing has gotten a bad rap as something 'white' and i understand that as a function of current market share and intergenerational disconnect.

but formula easier than BFing?? that, i do NOT get. what could be easier than rolling over and feeding yr babe? oh, that's right. getting up out of a nice warm bed, mixing formula, checking the temperature of water, making sure there are always clean bottles and nipples.

aroo?

Well, honestly, most of the other AA ladies I know from when I was in school are STILL regular clubbers, etc. So, BFing and clubbing really don't mix, though you'd have some really nice breasts.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so BFing has gotten a bad rap as something 'white' and i understand that as a function of current market share and intergenerational disconnect.

but formula easier than BFing?? that, i do NOT get. what could be easier than rolling over and feeding yr babe? oh, that's right. getting up out of a nice warm bed, mixing formula, checking the temperature of water, making sure there are always clean bottles and nipples.

aroo?

Umm and not to mention cheaper







That's what I don't get. Cheaper and healthier always rank pretty high in my book!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, my youngest's doctor just called me to tell me that his lead level is elevated (Class II-A) and that he's anemic--which usually go hand in hand. I feel . . . nervous, scared, worried. Our house is old. We did renovations just before he was born and in the first 6 weeks he was here not because I didn't want it done before he was born but because we got stuck with a loser contractor. I thought we cleaned up pretty well. Maybe I should have done better.

The health dept. is supposed to contact me. The kids are not vaxed. Should I get rid of all their toys? They've got wooden blocks with paint--pretty sure made in China . . . I have to be more diligent about him putting stuff in his mouth.

He's also a sickle cell trait carrier so they want me to have his blood redrawn to do a different, more specific kind of count. Then the recommendation is that I give him iron drops. He doesn't really eat solids because, you know, I'm laid back about it but . . . I guess I need to. He's not getting enough iron via breastmilk. Maybe I should supplement myself again? I don't know. I'm just nervous and worried. And I think DH is pissed off.































to you and your DS. I went through a similar situation this past summer with my youngest DS. Because of a fire we were in the mist of renovations, which were suppossed to be done before we moved back in. DS tested at level 19. His Ped called me and advised me to clean with Cascade dishwashing powder. The Health Dept came to our house(3 agents on seperate occassions). An agent came to the house and tested the lead level, certain areas tested positive. So these areas had to be fixed. During that time we stayed in a safe house, whic was provided free of charge through the Pratt Area Community Councel.
Should you and your DH be unable to have the lead abated, there is financial aid available. Unfortunately my aunt and uncle did not qualify, but they knew someone who does lead abatement and he gave them a good price.
I really hope that your DS gets well soon and everyone else is free of lead. As for the iron supp, my DS refused to take it. I would advise you to increase your iron intake and maybe make him some greens.

*ETA* The health Dept can check your toys for lead if you like. They will give you a list of toys that have tested positive for lead, there's also a website on the paper they will give you.

Also, do you have a backyard where you grow your own veggies and fruits? I was told by the Health Dept that there is a high concentration of lead in the soil in NYC, but especially in Brooklyn.


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## purplegirl

Rootz, I totally missed your story. I have no advice but here's a hug







. It sounds like you are getting some good guidance from others who have been through this.


----------



## Jannah6

I like coming to MDC, it's my most frequented site







. But some MDCer's really







: me, and I'm not irked easily. It's almost as if some people just make comments just to get a rouse out of others


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I like coming to MDC, it's my most frequented site







. But some MDCer's really







: me, and I'm not irked easily. It's almost as if some people just make comments just to get a rouse out of others


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I like coming to MDC, it's my most frequented site







. But some MDCer's really







: me, and I'm not irked easily. It's almost as if some people just make comments just to get a rouse out of others









Sometimes I feel like that too.









I realize that I was lucky with breastfeeding. It was super easy for me with no latch or supply issues. I know it doesn't come as easy to everyone else so I try to give props to those who at least try.

Today is date day for DH and I. I have a coupon from restaurants.com where I got a $25 certificate for $2 and we will probably go see a movie after lunch. Then I'm going to make him stop by Tuesday Morning which he doesn't know yet but oh well, lol. Any good movies out?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Ladies, my youngest's doctor just called me to tell me that his lead level is elevated (Class II-A) and that he's anemic--which usually go hand in hand. I feel . . . nervous, scared, worried. Our house is old. We did renovations just before he was born and in the first 6 weeks he was here not because I didn't want it done before he was born but because we got stuck with a loser contractor. I thought we cleaned up pretty well. Maybe I should have done better.

The health dept. is supposed to contact me. The kids are not vaxed. Should I get rid of all their toys? They've got wooden blocks with paint--pretty sure made in China . . . I have to be more diligent about him putting stuff in his mouth.

He's also a sickle cell trait carrier so they want me to have his blood redrawn to do a different, more specific kind of count. Then the recommendation is that I give him iron drops. He doesn't really eat solids because, you know, I'm laid back about it but . . . I guess I need to. He's not getting enough iron via breastmilk. Maybe I should supplement myself again? I don't know. I'm just nervous and worried. And I think DH is pissed off.









Rootzdawta, I hope that your youngest has a speedy recovery!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
But, overall, what I've heard in the AA community about BFing is that:

*5. It's too much work, formula is easier.*

So, that's what I've run into within my family. I even have offered to be their doula during birth and help with BFing afterwards, but they're just not receptive to my "white ways."

I nursed and supplemented with formula, and in a way, it is easier. Part of my hesitation to have another child is because nursing was a constant PITA. Perhaps that is because for the first 6 months I worked out of the home. I felt as If instead of just sitting and holding my son I was inflicting pain upon myself and keeping him hungry. I was constantly attached to him or the double pump, and I could not sleep more than 4 hours straight.

Nursing was truly hard, for me. I laugh when I hear moms talk about how they can sleep through night nursings, as I could not, and it took me forever to fall asleep after he was done.

I was determined to nurse DS and I did so, until he self weaned, but I do believe that formula feeding was easier.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Sometimes I feel like that too.









I realize that I was lucky with breastfeeding. It was super easy for me with no latch or supply issues. I know it doesn't come as easy to everyone else so I try to give props to those who at least try.

Today is date day for DH and I. I have a coupon from restaurants.com where I got a $25 certificate for $2 and we will probably go see a movie after lunch. Then I'm going to make him stop by Tuesday Morning which he doesn't know yet but oh well, lol. Any good movies out?

Have fun!!!!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Rootz, I totally missed your story. I have no advice but here's a hug







. It sounds like you are getting some good guidance from others who have been through this.

nak

i too have no advice but sending you and your family healthy healing vibes:







:

you know i've thinking about the whole black women don't breastfeed thing for awhile. so many older black ladies have asked me if i'm bfing and they are pleased when i say yes. so hopefully bfing is on the rise in our communities. i think black folks are generally skeptical of doctors but generally compliant/obedient to the norms of western medicine. so i do think its a lack of info and real support. i always knew i'd breastfeed my babies but i was ignorant on how challenging it could be. i assumed my muma had breast fed us but it wasn't until i was pregnant that she told me that my sister--her 1st--had a poor latch so she feeling overwhelmed gave her forumla. this was in haiti mind you. with my bro and i my muma was back to work in 6 weeks so we too were formula fed. i think this a major reason black women ff---short or hardly existent maternity leave. pumping is hard/awkward, not to mention its an expensive investment upfront and so many work places are not prepared to deal w/ a pumping mamas' needs.

also real support for bfing is slim in spite of the discourse. when my baby was losing weight at 3 days the hospital appointed ped was over my bed telling me that i might have to supplement if dd to didn't gain oz immdeiately. and this was in a pro bf hospital with lc coming to visit daily. but the ped had power (white male dr) so my muma and dh were getting worried that my milk wasn't enuf. those first weeks when dd was crying up a storm my "lack" of milk was blamed. but my milk was/is right on time and dd has always had a good latch but if i hadn't been esp informed and determined i would have weakened under the pressure.

i love bfing but i can see why women give up. its challenging, it certainly tempers my mobility. i know dh would have to step up with more childcare if i could hand him a bottle of formula and go handle my business. but since dd is bf i have a greater responsibility to be home. i do take her with me but that's not always appropriate. and the reality for me is sometimes pumping does not produce consistent results. last month, i had a crucial meeting/presentation and though i had pumped not much was coming out. i knew dd would be a bit hungry but i had to go, and no she couldn't come along. my older friend from kenya, with 2 kids of her own, watched her but by the time i rushed home she was suggesting dd should be fed organic millet since my milk isnt coming. i was so irritated but i know she meant well, and she's pro-bf! of course the next pumping session ounces were flowing...

so i say all that to say i'm not so quick to diss the ffing mamas anymore. i'm committed to bfing my lo and i do wish more women were as well, but what i thought was easy and natural has its own set of challenges. i'm back to teaching in jan and i know it'll be tough sometimes. info is one thing but sistas also need real support to bf.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Sometimes I feel like that too.









I realize that I was lucky with breastfeeding. It was super easy for me with no latch or supply issues. I know it doesn't come as easy to everyone else so I try to give props to those who at least try.

Today is date day for DH and I. I have a coupon from restaurants.com where I got a $25 certificate for $2 and we will probably go see a movie after lunch. Then I'm going to make him stop by Tuesday Morning which he doesn't know yet but oh well, lol. Any good movies out?

that's so nice, have fun. what's Tuesday Morning?

me and Dh could so use a date day/night or some kinda romance. he keeps giving me the look







. but i'm so not up for a quickie with dd always a second away from crying for bubby. i want some real grown up time with tlc, so i get into the mood and not feel like i'm just doing it to fulfill my wifely duties, kwim?


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## jeca

It's like a discount store for all kids of things. They have a lot of little cute stuff not found in regular stores and the stuff they do have from regular stores are at better prices.

Okay drop off is at 2 so I guess I better go do something to my head.


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## splendid

Rootz, does your son have any Doug and Melissa toys?

re: breastfeeding. Everyone in my family does it. They are Jamaican and it all comes second nature. If anything, they (members in my family) stop breastfeeding at 6 months and introduce porridge and soft solids. Exnted breastfeeding in non existent.


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## eilonwy

I wonder if this isn't another case of black women and white women getting different advice from doctors?

There are some things about formula feeding that are easier. I can go anywhere I like without Bear, and not have to worry about when I get back. That said, going anywhere WITH Bear is a LOT more work than it was with my breastfed babies, once they were nursing easily and well. I could grab three diapers and a sling and be prepared to spend the entire afternoon out of the house with BooBah; To do the same with Bear I have to take the aforementioned diapers & sling along with at least one bottle, a bottle of water and a can of Neocate. I can change a baby's diaper without putting the kid down, but in order to prepare a bottle of formula I need to have some sort of place to put *something* down-- at least one thing, often two.

So I suppose it's all in how you look at things. In terms of being with your baby, it's tons more work to artificially feed. In terms of being without your baby, breastfeeding requires more work and planning. Just goes to show that in the natural order of things, mothers are meant to be with their babies.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
It's like a discount store for all kids of things. They have a lot of little cute stuff not found in regular stores and the stuff they do have from regular stores are at better prices.

Okay drop off is at 2 so I guess I better go do something to my head.










Hope you have fun







. I am going out tonight as well. There's a really nice Asian restaurant in my neighborhood, that I find any excuse visit







. I'm tired but looking forward to a change of scenery.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I can change a baby's diaper without putting the kid down, but in order to prepare a bottle of formula I need to have some sort of place to put *something* down-- at least one thing, often two.

Just goes to show that in the natural order of things, mothers are meant to be with their babies.


I definitely agree! I don't believe that it was ever meant for women to have careers equivalent to those of a man.

See, I could hold the baby and make a bottle of formula or expressed breast milk without having to out anything down, where as nursing for the first 3 almost 4 months did not work well unless I was in drivers seat of my car, and it was not like I could drive while nursing him!!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
ok, so BFing has gotten a bad rap as something 'white' and i understand that as a function of current market share and intergenerational disconnect.

but formula easier than BFing?? that, i do NOT get. what could be easier than rolling over and feeding yr babe? oh, that's right. getting up out of a nice warm bed, mixing formula, checking the temperature of water, making sure there are always clean bottles and nipples.

aroo?

I totally agree. Because of my PCOS condition, my milk supply is too low to breastfeed exclusively. So while I am working on upping my supply with some herbal tinctures and pumping when I can, I have to supplement with formula. It pains me but I know it is necessary for now. It is such a pain in the arse to get up, make formula, warm it, feed him and then clean the bottle and nipple. Especially at like 3am. I rather just whip out my boob and let him have it! Luckily my little one loves breastfeeding so if/when I get my supply to an acceptable level it shouldn't be a problem. Sometimes he won't go to sleep unless I do some sidelying breastfeeding with him. I am hoping my supply increases...I feel sad and guilty giving him formula.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 





















to you and your DS. I went through a similar situation this past summer with my youngest DS. Because of a fire we were in the mist of renovations, which were suppossed to be done before we moved back in. DS tested at level 19. His Ped called me and advised me to clean with Cascade dishwashing powder. The Health Dept came to our house(3 agents on seperate occassions). An agent came to the house and tested the lead level, certain areas tested positive. So these areas had to be fixed. During that time we stayed in a safe house, whic was provided free of charge through the Pratt Area Community Councel.
Should you and your DH be unable to have the lead abated, there is financial aid available. Unfortunately my aunt and uncle did not qualify, but they knew someone who does lead abatement and he gave them a good price.
I really hope that your DS gets well soon and everyone else is free of lead. As for the iron supp, my DS refused to take it. I would advise you to increase your iron intake and maybe make him some greens.

*ETA* The health Dept can check your toys for lead if you like. They will give you a list of toys that have tested positive for lead, there's also a website on the paper they will give you.

Also, do you have a backyard where you grow your own veggies and fruits? I was told by the Health Dept that there is a high concentration of lead in the soil in NYC, but especially in Brooklyn.

Sis, thanks so much for your response. I've been feeling pretty upset and worried and mostly alone and guilty. I am going to the HFS tomorrow to pick up floradix for myself and I've been feeding him green smoothies. I also wiped down all the walls and his toys with soapy water (Dawn). I'm keeping him off the floor as much as possible and waiting for the Health dep't. I found some lead encapsulating paint and wipes--but I don't want to do anything without clear directions. We cleared land for a garden . . .I'll have them check for lead. Thanks because I did not think of that. I'm also washing his hands much, much more.

The boys have some M&D and some other wooden puzzles. I'm keeping them away from the baby. There are also some M&D cardboard floor puzzles but he doesn't touch those.

Thanks for the support and well wishes everyone.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Sis, thanks so much for your response. I've been feeling pretty upset and worried and mostly alone and guilty. I am going to the HFS tomorrow to pick up floradix for myself and I've been feeding him green smoothies. I also wiped down all the walls and his toys with soapy water (Dawn). I'm keeping him off the floor as much as possible and waiting for the Health dep't. I found some lead encapsulating paint and wipes--but I don't want to do anything without clear directions. We cleared land for a garden . . .I'll have them check for lead. Thanks because I did not think of that. I'm also washing his hands much, much more.

The boys have some M&D and some other wooden puzzles. I'm keeping them away from the baby. There are also some M&D cardboard floor puzzles but he doesn't touch those.

Thanks for the support and well wishes everyone.









I know that you probably have a sick feeling inside. Don't be too hard on yourself, you're doing all of the right things for your DS.





















. You did the right thing by having his blood tested(and all the things you are doing now). I've heard a lot of women say that they didn't want to have their DC's blood drawn. It's tough to see, but in the end it's worth it.
It's going to be a tough few weeks ahead, especially if you have to relocate. Don't keep things bottled up inside, be sure to share your feelings with your DH. Hoping for all the best for you







.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Sis, thanks so much for your response. I've been feeling pretty upset and worried and mostly alone and guilty. I am going to the HFS tomorrow to pick up floradix for myself and I've been feeding him green smoothies. I also wiped down all the walls and his toys with soapy water (Dawn). I'm keeping him off the floor as much as possible and waiting for the Health dep't. I found some lead encapsulating paint and wipes--but I don't want to do anything without clear directions. We cleared land for a garden . . .I'll have them check for lead. Thanks because I did not think of that. I'm also washing his hands much, much more.

The boys have some M&D and some other wooden puzzles. I'm keeping them away from the baby. There are also some M&D cardboard floor puzzles but he doesn't touch those.

Thanks for the support and well wishes everyone.









*Rootz,* you sound like you are blaming yourself. This is so not your fault. Though, I can only imagine how you feel. It sounds like the lead issue can be addressed and possibly abated. The iron sounds like a health issue that you are taking care of as well. I hope this settles down soon for you and that your baby boy is restored to perfect health!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I totally agree. Because of my PCOS condition, my milk supply is too low to breastfeed exclusively. So while I am working on upping my supply with some herbal tinctures and pumping when I can, I have to supplement with formula. It pains me but I know it is necessary for now. It is such a pain in the arse to get up, make formula, warm it, feed him and then clean the bottle and nipple. Especially at like 3am. I rather just whip out my boob and let him have it! Luckily my little one loves breastfeeding so if/when I get my supply to an acceptable level it shouldn't be a problem. Sometimes he won't go to sleep unless I do some sidelying breastfeeding with him. I am hoping my supply increases..*.I feel sad and guilty giving him formula*.









Sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do. Please don't beat up on yourself for things that are out of your control. It sounds like you have tried and ran into constraints due to medical issues. In the end, if your baby is thriving and gaining weight, that is what is important.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am hoping my supply increases...I feel sad and guilty giving him formula.

















Me too, mamma. My milk has dried up, but I occasionally think... "You know, with the right herbs and enough time and help, I could probably nurse Bear... I'd be willing to eat nothing but crackers and rice and lamb chops if that's what it took..." Meh.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







Me too, mamma. My milk has dried up, but I occasionally think... "You know, with the right herbs and enough time and help, I could probably nurse Bear... I'd be willing to eat nothing but crackers and rice and lamb chops if that's what it took..." Meh.









I am willing to do whatever it takes too. I have 6 weeks more of maternity leave(for a total of 12 weeks) So I am going to start pumping every 2-3 hours like it's my job and continue to take my herbal tinctures. My babe loves breastfeeding and I put him on the breast often, especially in the sidelying position. I love co-sleeping for that reason. We breastfeed and take naps together and cuddle. I am determined to get him exclusively on breastmilk. I am so jealous of women who can pump like 6 ounces for their LO. The most I have pumped is probably 1-1.5 ounces in a 20 minutes. I want to be able to leave breastmilk in bottles for my little guy once I return to work. It would be awesome to be able to have a reserve of frozen breastmilk too but for now getting him off formula would be good enough.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do. Please don't beat up on yourself for things that are out of your control. It sounds like you have tried and ran into constraints due to medical issues. In the end, if your baby is thriving and gaining weight, that is what is important.

thanks.







I still breastfeed my LO. I still have hope that I can turn this situation around and stop using formula.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do. Please don't beat up on yourself for things that are out of your control. It sounds like you have tried and ran into constraints due to medical issues. In the end, if your baby is thriving and gaining weight, that is what is important.


*ita*


----------



## rootzdawta

Arike,









I know how frustrating it is when the reality of the situation doesn't match up with your ideal for the situation. I agree with Purplegirl, the game is about surviving and then thriving. So you do what you have to do. I'm trying hard not to beat myself up too bad and I hope you do too.


----------



## Jannah6

*oyinmama* I went to the beginning of this thread and found out that you are THE Oyin. I'm checking out your site, gotta get some of your products







. Mind if I pick your brain for some skin/hair care assistance?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*oyinmama* I went to the beginning of this thread and found out that you are THE Oyin. I'm checking out your site, gotta get some of your products







. Mind if I pick your brain for some skin/hair care assistance?


I can attest to their products being 'da bomb'! Be sure to check out the pod casts on their site--chock full o information and knowledge


----------



## Jannah6

I'm contracting, ever 10 minutes, with pain/cramping in my stomach and back. I don't want to go to the hospital. During all of my pregnancies I've had to go to L&D due to pre-term contractions. Please recommend something that I can do at home, thnx.

*ETA:* Now they are 7 minutes apart and I'm debating on waking my DH and calling the Dr.


----------



## eilonwy

Drink plenty of water. If you're not averse to it, you could have a glass of wine to help you relax... but you'll need even more water then. I didn't really have a lot of preterm contractions except with BeanBean (when I ended up going to the hospital a lot) and Bella (who was born at 36 weeks after an extremely stressful pregnancy) but when I did, water & calm helped.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I'm contracting, ever 10 minutes, with pain/cramping in my stomach and back. I don't want to go to the hospital. During all of my pregnancies I've had to go to L&D due to pre-term contractions. Please recommend something that I can do at home, thnx.

*ETA:* Now they are 7 minutes apart and I'm debating on waking my DH and calling the Dr.

I don't have any recommendations but it sounds like Rynna has made some good suggestions.
How are you now?


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Drink plenty of water. If you're not averse to it, you could have a glass of wine to help you relax... but you'll need even more water then. I didn't really have a lot of preterm contractions except with BeanBean (when I ended up going to the hospital a lot) and Bella (who was born at 36 weeks after an extremely stressful pregnancy) but when I did, water & calm helped.


Thanx, I'm doing the water. I'll give it another hour or so.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I don't have any recommendations but it sounds like Rynna has made some good suggestions.
How are you now?

Yes, how are you??

Have you tried saying some affirmations? Affirming the outcome you want??


----------



## AndrewsMother

A warm bath always slowed my contractions. DS was born by c-section @ 35 1/2 weeks, but I believe that resting in warm water go us that far.


----------



## nnaemeka

yep, my doula advised plenty of water and to lie on my left side and relax. my pre term contractions settled down with that.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

So I suppose it's all in how you look at things. In terms of being with your baby, it's tons more work to artificially feed. In terms of being without your baby, breastfeeding requires more work and planning. J

Totally agree.

No advice on the pre-term labor. Just relax as much as possible and stay off your feet for a bit.

Rootz and Arike









ETA: I keep seeing mention of cyber monday deals everywhere. I have never even heard of that before.


----------



## rootzdawta

If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??

It is offensive--two pages about her rear and a mere mention of her accomplishments. I don't need the author to idealize her, but she couldn't find anything else to focus on other than Ms. Obama's butt?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??

Yeah, I read that garbage.







: I don't see how the author thought that was compliementary in any way especially considering how Black woman are objectified in this country.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??

What a tacky article. The author probably thought she was being cute.







:


----------



## Draupadi

Jannah, how are you?


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I can attest to their products being 'da bomb'! Be sure to check out the pod casts on their site--chock full o information and knowledge









I







the "Greg Juice"!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I







the "Greg Juice"!

Greg Juice is a staple for me, works well on my locs and I use it to detangle my dd's hair as well.

Jannash, hope you are doing well....thinking of you.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
thanks.







I still breastfeed my LO. I still have hope that I can turn this situation around and stop using formula.

You can do it, Arike. I did.
I'm still breastfeeding my almost 19 month old.








If you want, PM me.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??

I could not read past the fourth paragraph.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I realize that I was lucky with breastfeeding. It was super easy for me with no latch or supply issues. I know it doesn't come as easy to everyone else so I try to give props to those who at least try.

yes yes yes! i think most of you guys got what i meant with my wonderment about BFing getting a bad rep - but soon after i wrote it i immediately realized that (1) yes there are circumstances in which it would be easier to FF, and (2) it might be possible to read my statement as dismissive of the very real challenges that some people work through when trying to BF. i never want to seem that way and i'm sorry if anybody took offense or felt judged.

arike your comments broke my heart b/c you are doing THE BEST for little Ari and don't need to be feeling guilty. ok? please. your baby is getting nutrition and nourishment from your milk, extra nutrition from formula supplementation, AND the nurturing of your caring and concern and commitment to doing what's best. lucky little thing.

nnaemeka and williamsmama and eilonwy thank you for sharing your BF stories and challenges. i swear, the heights of nurturing i see on this thread is humbling. nnaemeka - when i have to pump a lot i get good results from malta (it's the hops i think? my mom via her grandmother suggested a nightly sip of guinness but i am not a fan. malta goya works just as well, and tastes way better to me.)

jannah! how are you doing honey?

roots - i am sending good vibes to you and your family with the abatement!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
So I suppose it's all in how you look at things. In terms of being with your baby, it's tons more work to artificially feed. In terms of being without your baby, breastfeeding requires more work and planning. Just goes to show that in the natural order of things, mothers are meant to be with their babies.

this makes sense to me.

yknow, there is a lot i feel is unequal between men and women because of the Evil Patriarchy, but this is one thing that is unequal because of Simple Biology. DH is a diaper changing, baby wrangling dude (& more and more as the baby gets more independent) but we couldn't share the work of the gestating or birthing or feeding...

makes me wonder a 'chicken and egg' sort of question about division of labor and social roles assigned because of gender, etc. i know there's a lot of thought and scholarship around evolutionary gender roles, that whole hunt/gather, nurture/nest dichotomy.
if the nurture/nesting jobs were given fair importance and appreciation - i wonder how the world would be different.

i know part of what put me off of wanting kids for a long time was what i saw as a built in unfairness in how much of the responsibility and work was the woman's. and i roll with feminist guys, of the daddying sort. but the biology itself... i mean!

ok i'm rambling. i'm gonna stop now.


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*oyinmama* I went to the beginning of this thread and found out that you are THE Oyin. I'm checking out your site, gotta get some of your products







. Mind if I pick your brain for some skin/hair care assistance?

hey, sure! pm me or post yr questions here and i'd be happy to help in any way i can, but there are a bunch of folks in this thread who are really knowledgeable - there was an exchange about hair cutting and conditioner washing and product applying a little while back that i just sat back and read whilst eating popcorn!









& thanks for the GJ love, guys!


----------



## Jannah6

Thanks for your concern ladies







. Yesterday morning, after drinking some water I laid down on my left side and got an hours rest(well off and on). I was so surprised that DS3 let me sleep for an hour







:. When I woke for good the contractions were gone, but I was sore(I guess from the contractions).
Then things were back to normal. I cooked for my DC, mediated, etc. While DH SLEPT







:







. The day before he drove to a conference in Philly and didn't get home until after 3:30a.m, he went to sleep at 4:30a.m and didn't get up until 4:30 p.m







:. He interacted with the DC while I did laundry, baths, and dinner. Then he was off to play basketball. I didn't even bother telling him that I had been having contractions. Sometimes he really gets to me. I was upset with him when he got home after 3:30a.m. He didn't call once to see how things were at home, and he knew that I had been having back pain. Which by the waay is worse now.

I read a little of what the author wrote, but I had enough. Did anyone see her site?
http://www.erinaubrykaplan.net/bio.htm

*Oyinmama*, remember when you were a little girl and you had 1 or 2 friends with light spots on their cheeks? I think everyone knew someone like that, right? Well my DS has developed light spots, is there any cream that I can use to even out his complexion?

Also, both my DD's have very dry ends, which Oyin product do you recommend?

I have dry cracked heels







, do you think that I should use anything else besides shay butter?


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Then things were back to normal. I cooked for my DC, mediated, etc. While DH SLEPT







:







. The day before he drove to a conference in Philly and didn't get home until after 3:30a.m, he went to sleep at 4:30a.m and didn't get up until 4:30 p.m







:. He interacted with the DC while I did laundry, baths, and dinner. Then he was off to play basketball. I didn't even bother telling him that I had been having contractions. Sometimes he really gets to me. I was upset with him when he got home after 3:30a.m. He didn't call once to see how things were at home, and he knew that I had been having back pain. Which by the waay is worse now.

We must have been married to the same guy yesterday. I had plans to go to this event which I told him about and he knew about but swears he didn't. Anyway with school the next day I gave the girls a bath and wanted to have dinner ready. A neighbor that was riding with me came by and asked about the time we were leaving etc, we discussed this right in front him. I'm running around like a crazy person trying to get things done before I left and comb out the girls wet hair and he just sat his [email protected]@ on the couch the entire time. I finally ended up calling her very loudly and telling her I will be late because I am trying to do a million things alone. after banging around the kitchen he finally gets up and asks what's wrong.







Then when I tell him he could have offered to do something he says why didn't I just tell him because he didn't even realize I was going anywhere. Are you freaking for real? Why do I have to always ask? Why can't he offer to help or take the initiative and I'm sorry but he knew I was getting ready for something. If he was that absolutely clueless why didn't he ask what I was rushing for?
Ugh, anyway. I'm not speaking to him today. Yes it's very childish but I'm doing it anyway. Vent over.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
We must have been married to the same guy yesterday. I had plans to go to this event which I told him about and he knew about but swears he didn't. Anyway with school the next day I gave the girls a bath and wanted to have dinner ready. A neighbor that was riding with me came by and asked about the time we were leaving etc, we discussed this right in front him. I'm running around like a crazy person trying to get things done before I left and comb out the girls wet hair and he just sat his [email protected]@ on the couch the entire time. I finally ended up calling her very loudly and telling her I will be late because I am trying to do a million things alone. after banging around the kitchen he finally gets up and asks what's wrong.







Then when I tell him he could have offered to do something he says why didn't I just tell him because he didn't even realize I was going anywhere. Are you freaking for real? Why do I have to always ask? Why can't he offer to help or take the initiative and I'm sorry but he knew I was getting ready for something. If he was that absolutely clueless why didn't he ask what I was rushing for?
Ugh, anyway. I'm not speaking to him today. Yes it's very childish but I'm doing it anyway. Vent over.









to you. Oh, I remember the few times that I had girls night out. I would have to do some much for my DC before I left







: One time I was so exhausted that I didn't want to go. Oh course DH was all, ''No, you should go, you need time for yourself'' Whatever!!! DH is totally helpless in some ways, I can thank his mothe for that. I definitely don't plan to raise my sons to be that way.

IMO, not speaking is not childish. I used to do this a lot, it was either that or he would have seen the Lisa in me







(my given name is Lisa)


----------



## Bloomingstar

whew! I can hardly believe it but we actually managed to get 3/4ths of it all done yesterday! All of the big stuff is in the new apartment and all that's left at the old place is the kitchen stuff and a bunch of random things that can easily be moved with our car. Yesterday was UHaul day. DH, one of his good friends, my cousin and her girlfriend, and our friend's 12 year old son (she volunteered him














packed everything in and moved everything out and up. I was busy cleaning, possibly more neurotically than usually but not by much: scrubbing barely visible fingerprints off door jambs, sweeping, then swiffering, then spot mopping, scrubbing dust off of light switches and outlets...and I'm still not done.







The cat was less than pleased for the first few hours--we brought her over after the stuff had been moved in--but spent the night roaming around and seemed to be doing better this morning. I'm hoping that by the end of the week, we'll be out of boxes and more settled in, but we're off to a good start. whew!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
whew! I can hardly believe it but we actually managed to get 3/4ths of it all done yesterday! All of the big stuff is in the new apartment and all that's left at the old place is the kitchen stuff and a bunch of random things that can easily be moved with our car. Yesterday was UHaul day. DH, one of his good friends, my cousin and her girlfriend, and our friend's 12 year old son (she volunteered him














packed everything in and moved everything out and up. I was busy cleaning, possibly more neurotically than usually but not by much: scrubbing barely visible fingerprints off door jambs, sweeping, then swiffering, then spot mopping, scrubbing dust off of light switches and outlets...and I'm still not done.







The cat was less than pleased for the first few hours--we brought her over after the stuff had been moved in--but spent the night roaming around and seemed to be doing better this morning. I'm hoping that by the end of the week, we'll be out of boxes and more settled in, but we're off to a good start. whew!

















: Congratulations on your new place. Happy that things are going well.

*BTW*, I noticed the dread lady in your siggy. Did you used to have them or are you wanting to grow them?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Does anyone know of any natural depression remedies. Do they exist?


----------



## Bloomingstar

thanks! No dreds here, Jannah, but I was picking between the afro lady and the dred









The most common natural remedies I know for depression:

*st johns wort, which is an herbal supplement
*upping intake of Omega oils, so taking fish oils
*checking your vitamin B levels, especially if you're a vegetarian or vegan, and especially vit B12. deficiencies can lead to irrational anger and sometimes depression. (this made total sense to me when I learned about it--I definitely fit the bill when I was a vegan and then vegetarian)
*in wintertime, taking a 15-20 min walk when the sun is highest, even if it is cloudy, can help with depression, especially if it is seasonal
*in wintertime, having a nutrient rich, high carb snack to raise your seratonin levels in late afternoon/early evening, if it is seasonal depression
*exercise

I've also heard 5HTP works--another supplement. I've tried all the other methods and they've worked well for me when I have dealt with depression.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

I've tried 5HTP, didn't work for me, but doesn't help to try, right?


----------



## purplegirl

I second ramping up your omega fatty 3 intake. Get a good quality vitamin to use as well. Exercise will help too.
I should be following my own advice. Winter time is not fun for me









ETA: You can also do journaling. It has an amazing effect on one's mood if you do it 15 minutes a day. Yoga poses help as well. I can't do yoga since discovering a hernia. Once that is repaired, I will be back at it.
Meditation is a great tool as well. It will calm the mind and allow the brain to heal from depression.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
thanks! No dreds here, Jannah, but I was picking between the afro lady and the dred









The most common natural remedies I know for depression:

*st johns wort, which is an herbal supplement
*upping intake of Omega oils, so taking fish oils
*checking your vitamin B levels, especially if you're a vegetarian or vegan, and especially vit B12. deficiencies can lead to irrational anger and sometimes depression. (this made total sense to me when I learned about it--I definitely fit the bill when I was a vegan and then vegetarian)
*in wintertime, taking a 15-20 min walk when the sun is highest, even if it is cloudy, can help with depression, especially if it is seasonal
*in wintertime, having a nutrient rich, high carb snack to raise your seratonin levels in late afternoon/early evening, if it is seasonal depression
*exercise

I've also heard 5HTP works--another supplement. I've tried all the other methods and they've worked well for me when I have dealt with depression.










I don't think that my depression is seasonal, but situational, I love fall and winter. well at least I did in Georgia. I will try walking between 11-1 and look into having my B and B12 levels evaluated.

We have fish oils lying around so I will begin that tomorrow.

Did you take St. Johns Wort, Omega Oils, B, B12 and 5HTP at the same time?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I've tried 5HTP, didn't work for me, but doesn't help to try, right?

No, it does not hurt to try!!! Was your depression, seasonal, situational or

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I second ramping up your omega fatty 3 intake. Get a good quality vitamin to use as well. Exercise will help too.
I should be following my own advice. Winter time is not fun for me









ETA: You can also do journaling. It has an amazing effect on one's mood if you do it 15 minutes a day. Yoga poses help as well. I can't do yoga since discovering a hernia. Once that is repaired, I will be back at it.
Meditation is a great tool as well. It will calm the mind and allow the brain to heal from depression.

I have attempted to Blog/JOurnal for over a year, perhaps I will give it another attempt. Hmmmm Yoga....when I took weekly yoga classes and worked out daily I was in a much better frame of mind........Meditation...I never really thought of meditating....hmmm

Thank you for the suggestions.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Does anyone know of any natural depression remedies. Do they exist?

Do you feel like your in an actual depression or more or a situational funk. I don't think I have ever been depressed but I have definitely been in some funks before where it seemed nothing was going right and I didn't have the ability or the energy to do anything about. Usually just a slight change to the situation would help or make me feel better. Okay I think I'm rambling. Off to bed with me.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
thanks! No dreds here, Jannah, but I was picking between the afro lady and the dred









The most common natural remedies I know for depression:

*st johns wort, which is an herbal supplement
*upping intake of Omega oils, so taking fish oils
*checking your vitamin B levels, especially if you're a vegetarian or vegan, and especially vit B12. deficiencies can lead to irrational anger and sometimes depression. (this made total sense to me when I learned about it--I definitely fit the bill when I was a vegan and then vegetarian)
*in wintertime, taking a 15-20 min walk when the sun is highest, even if it is cloudy, can help with depression, especially if it is seasonal
*in wintertime, having a nutrient rich, high carb snack to raise your seratonin levels in late afternoon/early evening, if it is seasonal depression
*exercise

I've also heard 5HTP works--another supplement. I've tried all the other methods and they've worked well for me when I have dealt with depression.









Do you think these remedies would also work for severe PMS, which is what I suffer from? Or do you know of any other remedies?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
You can do it, Arike. I did.
I'm still breastfeeding my almost 19 month old.








If you want, PM me.

Thanks.







I am going to PM you.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
yes yes yes! i think most of you guys got what i meant with my wonderment about BFing getting a bad rep - but soon after i wrote it i immediately realized that (1) yes there are circumstances in which it would be easier to FF, and (2) it might be possible to read my statement as dismissive of the very real challenges that some people work through when trying to BF. i never want to seem that way and i'm sorry if anybody took offense or felt judged.

arike your comments broke my heart b/c you are doing THE BEST for little Ari and don't need to be feeling guilty. ok? please. your baby is getting nutrition and nourishment from your milk, extra nutrition from formula supplementation, AND the nurturing of your caring and concern and commitment to doing what's best. lucky little thing.

Aww, you are sweet Oyin. I didn't take your statements as dismissive at all. I am hoping to increase my supply, pumping is my new job.







Everything went so well with my pregnancy and labor/delivery, there was bound to be a little bump in the road at some point. I am feeling positive though, because the fact that I have some milk and the baby enjoys breastfeeding are both good signs. And I have a professional grade pump and 6 more weeks of leave to try and improve my supply. Oh and my mom told me beer does help with milk supply. I am more of a wine drinker but I could try Malta and/or blueberry beer.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I am more of a wine drinker but I could try Malta and/or blueberry beer.









Others can confirm or deny this, but I've heard the darker the beer the better, which is why people suggest Guiness. Have you ever tried Brooklyn Brewery's Black Chocolate Stout? I







it. hehe

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Do you think these remedies would also work for severe PMS, which is what I suffer from? Or do you know of any other remedies?

Hmm, it's possible. I think also for PMS it can sometimes be dietary, Generally, having a lot of soy, sugar, caffeine, and dairy in the two weeks or so before your period shows up can make for a tougher time, depending on how sensitive your body is to those things, with PMS symptoms like mood swings and cramps. Of course those are some of the yummy things we want right before then--go figure.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I don't think that my depression is seasonal, but situational, I love fall and winter. well at least I did in Georgia. I will try walking between 11-1 and look into having my B and B12 levels evaluated.

We have fish oils lying around so I will begin that tomorrow.

Did you take St. Johns Wort, Omega Oils, B, B12 and 5HTP at the same time?

No, it does not hurt to try!!! Was your depression, seasonal, situational or

I have attempted to Blog/JOurnal for over a year, perhaps I will give it another attempt. Hmmmm Yoga....when I took weekly yoga classes and worked out daily I was in a much better frame of mind........Meditation...I never really thought of meditating....hmmm

Thank you for the suggestions.

I didn't try them all at once but I wish I had! It would've been much more effective, probably, for alleviating some of what I was going through, which ws a serious depression that lasted a couple years. I was also in therapy, and have been journaling for the past 14 years, which helped a lot then and also is a good stress relief and a nice thing to do now.

I started the St. John's Wort first when my therapist suggested I try that after I gave her the "don't even suggest medication to me" look in one of our sessions







But I was also vegan then (not enough B12 given how I was doing, and I wasn't nutritionally sound then in general because I had an eating disorder) so it probably could have been more effective had I had the rest of myself in order. but even with all the other stuff, it helped so I think that's a good thing. I took it for a few years, then stopped when I went on the pill for a year because it's contraindicated--will make the pill not work









But once I recovered from the e.d., and gradually got more nutritionally sound again, and then started eating meat again sometimes, and taking the fish oil (this has been a looooong process), I've found that even my mild seasonal depression (Im sorry, I just hate the cold dark winters in the northeast but new york beats new england) has been alleviated.

Just like with some of the strong medications out there, it may take some time and tinkering to find the right combination of things that work best for your personal body chemistry.

Sorry for the long winded answer but i have had enough of a process with depression and also have spent some time studying holistic health and nutritional methods of healing different things so I tend to go on and on with this topic.


----------



## Jannah6

Last night when I went out to the supermarket I was listening to the radio, which is the only time I listen to the radio. I caught a few minutes of Michael Baisden's talk radio and I was so saddened by the HIV/AIDS in the Black community.
I was shocked to hear that 60% of new cases of HIV are among African American *teens.* NYC,Atlanta,North Carolina,Washington DC, and one other State that I forget, are among the top States with new cases of HIV. The leading cause of death among Black women ages 24-42(I think this is the right age bracket) is AIDS. There were some other stats, but I can't remember them. You know after he gave this info, the radio station played a song. Of all of the songs they could have chosen(TLC's WQaterfalls comes to mind), they chose to play Naughty By Natures OPP














:, how stupid of them. I think I'll write them a letter telling them how disappointed I am.
When I got home and I was putting away the groceries I had to stop for a minute because I was feeling really sad. I said to myself, why am I feeling like this? Then I thought back to the info that Michael B. gave, it just makes my heart so heavy.


----------



## purplegirl

Bloomingstar has given some excellent and on pointe suggestions for alleviating depression. I cannot underscore the importance of evaluating your diet and making changes as appropriate. Sugar and other refined foods are evil
I might also suggest *Natural Calm by NOW*. It is for stress and anxiety, but it also contains amino acids that have a positive effect on the brain chemistry. It can be enormously helpful with PMS too.
I drink a lot of teas and so I suggest doing some research on the ones that can be beneficial in the alleviation of depression and PMS symptoms. Fish oil is awesome stuff. Just be careful that you are using a high quality one. I suggest Nordic Naturals.
Although I work in the field, I am not an advocate medication unless all other means have been tried first. While extremely effective in most cases, the side effects can be a bear to deal. It is also hard to get off those meds, with most of them having withdrawal issues.
Hugs to anyone struggling with depression of any sort!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Last night when I went out to the supermarket I was listening to the radio, which is the only time I listen to the radio. I caught a few minutes of Michael Baisden's talk radio and I was so saddened by the HIV/AIDS in the Black community.
I was shocked to hear that 60% of new cases of HIV are among African American *teens.* NYC,Atlanta,North Carolina,Washington DC, and one other State that I forget, are among the top States with new cases of HIV. The leading cause of death among Black women ages 24-42(I think this is the right age bracket) is AIDS. There were some other stats, but I can't remember them. You know after he gave this info, the radio station played a song. Of all of the songs they could have chosen(TLC's WQaterfalls comes to mind), they chose to play Naughty By Natures OPP














:, how stupid of them. I think I'll write them a letter telling them how disappointed I am.
When I got home and I was putting away the groceries I had to stop for a minute because I was feeling really sad. I said to myself, why am I feeling like this? Then I thought back to the info that Michael B. gave, it just makes my heart so heavy.

I believe the other state would be PA. There are so many variables for why the HIV rate is skyrocketing amongst our women--black and latino. I have nieces whom I hope are getting the message about how to protect themselves yet, it still concerns me. Perhaps a discussion here on the topic would be enlightening for others.

That said, I take Michael B. with a large dose of 'whatever'! He has the potential to disseminate important information ,but he does it with a level of goofiness that gets on my nerves. The example you gave above is one such example of it! I get that he is a radio personality, but a little bit of judgement goes a long way. He is now campaigning for his listeners to go meatless for 30 days. That's great, but give them alternatives so that they're not depleting themselves of important nutrients!


----------



## splendid

re: Depression

I have suffered with depression (and now anxiety) of an on for a decade. Along with many of the suggestions I see here. May also suggest getting your body moving outdoors for a minimum of 30 minutes a day. I know its hard but getting my body moving really helped on the days I felt hopeless.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
That said, I take Michael B. with a large dose of 'whatever'! He has the potential to disseminate important information ,but he does it with a level of goofiness that gets on my nerves.

*ITA*
*BTW*, are the numbers of HIV/AIDS cases also high for Latino women?


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Last night when I went out to the supermarket I was listening to the radio, which is the only time I listen to the radio. I caught a few minutes of Michael Baisden's talk radio and I was so saddened by the HIV/AIDS in the Black community.
I was shocked to hear that 60% of new cases of HIV are among African American *teens.* NYC,Atlanta,North Carolina,Washington DC, and one other State that I forget, are among the top States with new cases of HIV. The leading cause of death among Black women ages 24-42(I think this is the right age bracket) is AIDS. There were some other stats, but I can't remember them. Y*ou know after he gave this info, the radio station played a song. Of all of the songs they could have chosen(TLC's WQaterfalls comes to mind), they chose to play Naughty By Natures OPP














:, how stupid of them. I think I'll write them a letter telling them how disappointed I am.*
When I got home and I was putting away the groceries I had to stop for a minute because I was feeling really sad. I said to myself, why am I feeling like this? Then I thought back to the info that Michael B. gave, it just makes my heart so heavy.

A local station did something similar, and I wrote them a scathing email - they were playing Snoop's 'Sensual Seduction' and bleeped out the line about having a 'packet of Magnums'.

Why, in the name of all that is holy, would you play a song celebrating and encouraging sex, and then BLEEP OUT the part suggesting that you have SAFE sex? WTF?







*sigh*

It's truly sad, it is.

Completely unrelated, but I have a question out of curiosity - how do ya'll feel about men crying?


----------



## rootzdawta

I'm very uncomfortable about men crying. I've never seen my husband cry and I don't know how I'd react if I did. My father was a "man's man" . . . stoic as ever. Never showed any emotion other than anger. So, I grew up feeling very strange if a guy was like weeping. Now, one Denzel Washington in Glory tear, I don't think would bother me so much. But outright boo-hooing . . . I just don't know. FWIW, I don't really like to see women crying either. I hate that I cry when frustrated/angry.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*ITA*
*BTW*, are the numbers of HIV/AIDS cases also high for Latino women?

Yes indeed. While Black women are disproportionately infected at higher rates, the rate is still very high for Latino women vs. white women


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Completely unrelated, but I have a question out of curiosity - how do ya'll feel about men crying?

It depends on the situation and how they look







. For example, one of my brothers is totally mushy and used to cry at the drop of a hat, it's kind of annoying







(but I feel the same way about my 4 yr old DD).
My DH on the other hand is hard as nails. Somethimes I wish he would cry more or show some sensitivity. One of the few times I've seen him cry was during the Katrina disaster, I must say that he completely surprised me.
I think my 11 yr old DS will be a crier, he looks pretty goofy when he cries. I'm hoping that as an adult he won't do it much.

*ETA: rootzdawta
* I hate to cry too, it makes me feel like I'm not in control and I feel very vulnerable.


----------



## purplegirl

I am alright with a man crying--just not too often. My dh is pretty sensitive and will cry at appropriate times. I find it touching.
I grew up thinking that men did not have feelings, thanks to my father who was pretty unemotional, aside from angry. It took me until I was well into adulthood to realize that they, too ,have feelings, and the expression thereof is normal. I don't like a whiny person, so frequent crying would put me further over the edge








I don't cry often, but I did on Thanksgiving. That's a whole 'nother story though


----------



## splendid

I cry, not a lot but I do. I like to cry alone. I have found the years I went without crying my depression/anxiety were at a peak, I realized that crying was like a pressure release for me. I do find if I am happy and I cry, I get a horrible migraine. Like my mind can't figure out why I am crying if I am happy.

Men crying, doesn't bother me. I would rather know that a man can cry then never ever showing any emotion whatsoever. I don't do robot men- one of my older brothers was like that- freaked me out.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I believe the other state would be PA. There are so many variables for why the HIV rate is skyrocketing amongst our women--black and latino. I have nieces whom I hope are getting the message about how to protect themselves yet, it still concerns me. Perhaps a discussion here on the topic would be enlightening for others.


I used to be the director of an HIV prevention agency that worked with people of African descent. Its been a number of years so my info may not be as up to date but I feel and there was a belief that the whole down low thing plays a role in why HIV rates are so high among Blacks. So many of our men are incarcerated and during that time engage in unsafe same sex relations yet refuse to disclose that info. Many of us are not asking that info of our sexual partners. I think in the Black community we are not as open to talking sex and its killing us literally.









You read the E Lynn Harris books and you can see how these scenarios easily play out in real life.

Regarding men crying, like Splendid I would rather see a man release his emotions. When my Mom died, my Dad did not cry he was ice cold, that is not healthy at all. On the other hand I am a crier, I find crying to be therapuetic.

Shay


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
yes yes yes! i think most of you guys got what i meant with my wonderment about BFing getting a bad rep - but soon after i wrote it i immediately realized that (1) yes there are circumstances in which it would be easier to FF, and (2) it might be possible to read my statement as dismissive of the very real challenges that some people work through when trying to BF. i never want to seem that way and i'm sorry if anybody took offense or felt judged.

arike your comments broke my heart b/c you are doing THE BEST for little Ari and don't need to be feeling guilty. ok? please. your baby is getting nutrition and nourishment from your milk, extra nutrition from formula supplementation, AND the nurturing of your caring and concern and commitment to doing what's best. lucky little thing.

nnaemeka and williamsmama and eilonwy thank you for sharing your BF stories and challenges. i swear, the heights of nurturing i see on this thread is humbling. nnaemeka - when i have to pump a lot i get good results from malta (it's the hops i think? my mom via her grandmother suggested a nightly sip of guinness but i am not a fan. malta goya works just as well, and tastes way better to me.)

jannah! how are you doing honey?

roots - i am sending good vibes to you and your family with the abatement!

this makes sense to me.

yknow, there is a lot i feel is unequal between men and women because of the Evil Patriarchy, but this is one thing that is unequal because of Simple Biology. DH is a diaper changing, baby wrangling dude (& more and more as the baby gets more independent) but we couldn't share the work of the gestating or birthing or feeding...

makes me wonder a 'chicken and egg' sort of question about division of labor and social roles assigned because of gender, etc. i know there's a lot of thought and scholarship around evolutionary gender roles, that whole hunt/gather, nurture/nest dichotomy.
if the nurture/nesting jobs were given fair importance and appreciation - i wonder how the world would be different.

i know part of what put me off of wanting kids for a long time was what i saw as a built in unfairness in how much of the responsibility and work was the woman's. and i roll with feminist guys, of the daddying sort. but the biology itself... i mean!

ok i'm rambling. i'm gonna stop now.

oyin, thanks for your words. i was feeling like my post was whiny but i think i'm feeling a general accumulative exhaustion. this is partly due to my feeling like my DH takes advantage of the natural unbalance of childcare due to BFing--that you speak of. he's not hands off but he could do more just to give me a break sometimes. sheesh.

and partly the winter blues is settling in. so i hear ya ladies on fish oil, b vits etc. i do need to get out of the house for a walk and what i wouldn't do for a yoga class.

does anyone use progesterone cream? my sister, who has suffered from depression in the past and has been known to have a crazed PMS, says its been very helpful to her.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I used to be the director of an HIV prevention agency that worked with people of African descent. Its been a number of years so my info may not be as up to date but I feel and there was a belief that the whole down low thing plays a role in why HIV rates are so high among Blacks. So many of our men are incarcerated and during that time engage in unsafe same sex relations yet refuse to disclose that info. Many of us are not asking that info of our sexual partners. I think in the Black community we are not as open to talking sex and its killing us literally.









You read the E Lynn Harris books and you can see how these scenarios easily play out in real life.

Regarding men crying, like Splendid I would rather see a man release his emotions. When my Mom died, my Dad did not cry he was ice cold, that is not healthy at all. On the other hand I am a crier, I find crying to be therapuetic.

Shay

I managed a program(in Philly) back in the early 90's, that provided services to people affected by HIV. At that time, it was still largely a white, gay and male disease, but I saw the handwriting on the wall. Just as I was preparing to leave that agency, I saw an influx in Back and Hispanic women coming in who were infected by their husbands.

I agree Shay, a large part of the problem is us not taking responsibility for ourselves and remaining silent on the issue of sexuality and past history. There is also the 'down-low' issue. Black people tend to be conservative where homosexuality is concerned and therefore, a lot of black men aren't comfortable in being open about their sexuality. They become involved with women and don't disclose they are having sex with men as well.

There is also the issue of men not wanting to wear condoms and women not insisting on it. I heard so many stories from Latina and Black women who said they were afraid to ask their men to wrap it up, for fear _they'd_ be accused of being unfaithful. I knew of a couple of women who got beat up behind that. We spent a lot of time educating women about how to deal with these issues.

Currently, I work part time, in a high school health center. I can't tell you how many girls (mostly) come in wanting a test for STD's. They are not asking their partners to wear condoms. I don't know off the top of my head the rate of infection for non HIV std's, at this school but I can tell you it is high. This is not a city school but rather one in the burbs.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother*
No, it does not hurt to try!!! Was your depression, seasonal, situational or

I think it was a mix of both. We were in Chicago, and it was cold and gray out almost every day. And I think it snowballed from there... for some reason I thought having another baby would brighten things... totally forgot about morning sickness. Fortunately, once the season changed, I was back to normal and have been ever since.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

wow. once again, I'm playing catch-up!
I have started working full-time at the new clinic and I'm loving it.







:
needless to say, I've been incredibly busy.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I totally agree. Because of my PCOS condition, my milk supply is too low to breastfeed exclusively. So while I am working on upping my supply with some herbal tinctures and pumping when I can, I have to supplement with formula. It pains me but I know it is necessary for now. It is such a pain in the arse to get up, make formula, warm it, feed him and then clean the bottle and nipple. Especially at like 3am. I rather just whip out my boob and let him have it! Luckily my little one loves breastfeeding so if/when I get my supply to an acceptable level it shouldn't be a problem. Sometimes he won't go to sleep unless I do some sidelying breastfeeding with him. I am hoping my supply increases...I feel sad and guilty giving him formula.









Arike, you are being the best mom you can be to your baby. I'm glad your baby loves to breastfeed. Remember, it's not an all or nothing deal. My Sil bf'ed and ff'ed and she is still bfing way past I did for my exclusively bf'ed baby.

breastfeeding was really tough for me. I had a relatively ok start but boy, did I not get any sleep for the whole first year. It was a great, wondrous experience but absolutely the hardest year of my life.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Sis, thanks so much for your response. I've been feeling pretty upset and worried and mostly alone and guilty. I am going to the HFS tomorrow to pick up floradix for myself and I've been feeding him green smoothies. I also wiped down all the walls and his toys with soapy water (Dawn). I'm keeping him off the floor as much as possible and waiting for the Health dep't. I found some lead encapsulating paint and wipes--but I don't want to do anything without clear directions. We cleared land for a garden . . .I'll have them check for lead. Thanks because I did not think of that. I'm also washing his hands much, much more.

The boys have some M&D and some other wooden puzzles. I'm keeping them away from the baby. There are also some M&D cardboard floor puzzles but he doesn't touch those.

Thanks for the support and well wishes everyone.









Rootz, I don't have much advice but I also wanted to offer a








I think you are doing all the right things so please don't beat yourself up over it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
If you hang in the blogosphere, you can't have missed the Salon.com article "First Lady Got Back". Here the author defends what she wrote (read the article and listen to the podcast if you like).

Like many others, I was *quite* disgusted at the article. Not only was it stereotypical (and coming from a Black woman at that), it was also just poorly written and silly and so offensive to Mrs. Obama. I would hate to think that when I reach the pinnacle of my life, what people would like to talk about is my derriere. Sheesh. I just don't understand the author's argument or even her point. It just doesn't hold water. And I don't believe had Mrs. Obama been White and the talk been about her body parts, it would be tolerated. It would be soundly condemned. Haven't you ever noticed how First Lady's are treated like saints, royalty, queens? The way they romanticize Mrs. Kennedy? Where's the romance for Mrs. Obama??

ewww. that was horrible and just unbelievable. wow.







:
I totally agree that she is perpetuating the objectification of women with that article. and I think she knows what she's doing. she wrote the article to provoke not enlighten and that's what pisses me off.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
whew! I can hardly believe it but we actually managed to get 3/4ths of it all done yesterday! All of the big stuff is in the new apartment and all that's left at the old place is the kitchen stuff and a bunch of random things that can easily be moved with our car. Yesterday was UHaul day. DH, one of his good friends, my cousin and her girlfriend, and our friend's 12 year old son (she volunteered him














packed everything in and moved everything out and up. I was busy cleaning, possibly more neurotically than usually but not by much: scrubbing barely visible fingerprints off door jambs, sweeping, then swiffering, then spot mopping, scrubbing dust off of light switches and outlets...and I'm still not done.







The cat was less than pleased for the first few hours--we brought her over after the stuff had been moved in--but spent the night roaming around and seemed to be doing better this morning. I'm hoping that by the end of the week, we'll be out of boxes and more settled in, but we're off to a good start. whew!









Yay! sounds like you made major progress. Have fun, making your new place home.


----------



## purplegirl

Bloomingstar, I forgot to say congratulations on your move and getting settled in! Go on girl; I am impressed.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
Completely unrelated, but I have a question out of curiosity - how do ya'll feel about men crying?

I am more comfortable around a man who is willing to cry than one who thinks he needs to be "hard". I think it's healthy to show emotions and sometimes when you don't, at least for some men I have known, when you don't your frustrations or emotions manifest in other ways that may not be as healthy. Plus i want to know that a man can relate to what I'm saying or feeling and not just stand there like stone. I think that applies to everyone though men and women at least when it comes to my life. So I guess I should have just said I'm comfortable with men who can cry.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I am more comfortable around a man who is willing to cry than one who thinks he needs to be "hard". I think it's healthy to show emotions and sometimes when you don't, at least for some men I have known, when you don't your frustrations or emotions manifest in other ways that may not be as healthy. Plus i want to know that a man can relate to what I'm saying or feeling and not just stand there like stone. I think that applies to everyone though men and women at least when it comes to my life. So I guess I should have just said I'm comfortable with men who can cry.

well said and I completely agree.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
I am more comfortable around a man who is willing to cry than one who thinks he needs to be "hard". I think it's healthy to show emotions and sometimes when you don't, at least for some men I have known, when you don't your frustrations or emotions manifest in other ways that may not be as healthy. Plus i want to know that a man can relate to what I'm saying or feeling and not just stand there like stone. I think that applies to everyone though men and women at least when it comes to my life. So I guess I should have just said I'm comfortable with men who can cry.

ditto!

i should say that when a man cries it can be heartbreaking. but on the other hand, i know my DH cried when we watched Ray---his eyes welled up---it was heartwarming...awwww boo,







.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Others can confirm or deny this, but I've heard the darker the beer the better, which is why people suggest Guiness. Have you ever tried Brooklyn Brewery's Black Chocolate Stout? I







it. hehe

Hmm, it's possible. I think also for PMS it can sometimes be dietary, Generally, having a lot of soy, sugar, caffeine, and dairy in the two weeks or so before your period shows up can make for a tougher time, depending on how sensitive your body is to those things, with PMS symptoms like mood swings and cramps. Of course those are some of the yummy things we want right before then--go figure.

I didn't try them all at once but I wish I had! It would've been much more effective, probably, for alleviating some of what I was going through, which ws a serious depression that lasted a couple years. I was also in therapy, and have been journaling for the past 14 years, which helped a lot then and also is a good stress relief and a nice thing to do now.

I started the St. John's Wort first when my therapist suggested I try that after I gave her the "don't even suggest medication to me" look in one of our sessions







But I was also vegan then (not enough B12 given how I was doing, and I wasn't nutritionally sound then in general because I had an eating disorder) so it probably could have been more effective had I had the rest of myself in order. but even with all the other stuff, it helped so I think that's a good thing. I took it for a few years, then stopped when I went on the pill for a year because it's contraindicated--will make the pill not work









But once I recovered from the e.d., and gradually got more nutritionally sound again, and then started eating meat again sometimes, and taking the fish oil (this has been a looooong process), I've found that even my mild seasonal depression (Im sorry, I just hate the cold dark winters in the northeast but new york beats new england) has been alleviated.

Just like with some of the strong medications out there, it may take some time and tinkering to find the right combination of things that work best for your personal body chemistry.

Sorry for the long winded answer but i have had enough of a process with depression and also have spent some time studying holistic health and nutritional methods of healing different things so I tend to go on and on with this topic.

I will try as many of these together as I can afford. I will go to Whole Foods tomorrow and see what I can find. Thank you for the suggestions.

I have been in a mood for about a year now, maybe longer, and I am not happy at all. I just want to go to bed and look forward to tomorrow. I am tired of faking it and acting as if I am happy when I am not. I want to smile and mean it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Last night when I went out to the supermarket I was listening to the radio, which is the only time I listen to the radio. I caught a few minutes of Michael Baisden's talk radio and I was so saddened by the HIV/AIDS in the Black community.
I was shocked to hear that 60% of new cases of HIV are among African American *teens.* NYC,Atlanta,North Carolina,Washington DC, and one other State that I forget, are among the top States with new cases of HIV. The leading cause of death among Black women ages 24-42(I think this is the right age bracket) is AIDS. There were some other stats, but I can't remember them. You know after he gave this info, the radio station played a song. Of all of the songs they could have chosen(TLC's WQaterfalls comes to mind), they chose to play Naughty By Natures OPP














:, how stupid of them. I think I'll write them a letter telling them how disappointed I am.
When I got home and I was putting away the groceries I had to stop for a minute because I was feeling really sad. I said to myself, why am I feeling like this? Then I thought back to the info that Michael B. gave, it just makes my heart so heavy.


The stats in Texas are are quite high for black women as well. I am bothered by the advertisement for HIV/AIDS treatment that I often hear on the radio. Yes, infected people should be able to lead normal lives, but the ads , IMO, tell young people, that it is okay if you contract AIDS, you probably will not die, You can lead a normal life.

I don't like that. I want for people who do not have HIV/AIDS to fear the disease so much that they practice safe sex or abstain, not know that AIDS is easily treatable.

The ads just sound too sunny and promising.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Bloomingstar has given some excellent and on pointe suggestions for alleviating depression. I cannot underscore the importance of evaluating your diet and making changes as appropriate. Sugar and other refined foods are evil
I might also suggest *Natural Calm by NOW*. It is for stress and anxiety, but it also contains amino acids that have a positive effect on the brain chemistry. It can be enormously helpful with PMS too.
I drink a lot of teas and so I suggest doing some research on the ones that can be beneficial in the alleviation of depression and PMS symptoms. Fish oil is awesome stuff. Just be careful that you are using a high quality one. I suggest Nordic Naturals.
Although I work in the field, I am not an advocate medication unless all other means have been tried first. While extremely effective in most cases, the side effects can be a bear to deal. It is also hard to get off those meds, with most of them having withdrawal issues.
Hugs to anyone struggling with depression of any sort!









I do suffer from what I think is anxiety. When something is wrong, I can't relax and my every nerve is on edge. My body is so tight if I were to sneeze I might injure myself.

My son takes Nordic Natural's vitamins so I am familiar with the brand. I will look for their fish oil tomorrow. I don't want to take medication at ALL. I want to find a way for my body to heal itself naturally. Thank you

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
re: Depression

I have suffered with depression (and now anxiety) of an on for a decade. Along with many of the suggestions I see here. May also suggest getting your body moving outdoors for a minimum of 30 minutes a day. I know its hard but getting my body moving really helped on the days I felt hopeless.

I have spent more than an hour outside each day this week. Fall and winter are mild here, so outside time should not be a problem.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
A local station did something similar, and I wrote them a scathing email - they were playing Snoop's 'Sensual Seduction' and bleeped out the line about having a 'packet of Magnums'.

Why, in the name of all that is holy, would you play a song celebrating and encouraging sex, and then BLEEP OUT the part suggesting that you have SAFE sex? WTF?







*sigh*

It's truly sad, it is.

Completely unrelated, but I have a question out of curiosity - how do ya'll feel about men crying?


My DH cried before he was my DH, I provoked him, MIL issues, I was stunned humbled, and I felt awful. He never shows any emotion and the one time that he does, he cries.

I guess that I like it, just as long as they don't cry once a year or more often than that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I think it was a mix of both. We were in Chicago, and it was cold and gray out almost every day. And I think it snowballed from there... for some reason I thought having another baby would brighten things... totally forgot about morning sickness. Fortunately, once the season changed, I was back to normal and have been ever since.

The sun shines 11 months out of twelve here, so weather is probably not the problem. I actually prefer cold gray days. If I were to find out that I was pregnant I would have to seek professional help, I would be at a loss. I somewhat know what my problem is, but I can't do anything to change it, so I feel helpless. I am out of sugar for my lemonade, so I have to make some changes, no matter how small.


----------



## Jannah6

*Andrewsmother:* I hope that you find some comfort soon








I went through a depression as a teen(mother issues) and talking to a therapist helped.


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## JeDeeLenae

Andrewsmother~







I hope you change comes soon for you.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Andrewsmother:* I hope that you find some comfort soon








I went through a depression as a teen(mother issues) and talking to a therapist helped.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Andrewsmother~







I hope you change comes soon for you.

Thank you!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm very uncomfortable about men crying. I've never seen my husband cry and I don't know how I'd react if I did. My father was a "man's man" . . . stoic as ever. Never showed any emotion other than anger. So, I grew up feeling very strange if a guy was like weeping. Now, one Denzel Washington in Glory tear, I don't think would bother me so much. But outright boo-hooing . . . I just don't know. FWIW, I don't really like to see women crying either. I hate that I cry when frustrated/angry.

It doesn't bother me to see a man shed a tear, really. I've seen DH cry twice- when we thought I might be going into labor at 27 weeks and when his dear uncle passed away. It was just a few tears and not real "boo-hoo"-ing. I don't know.
I saw many men crying on 9/11, though. People sat in the courtyard near my building and wept.
I cry pretty easily, myself. I was just crying this morning listening to the news of a young teen getting shot. His whole family was on television and his mama looked heartbroken. So sad...
I get choked up whenever I hear about a child getting harmed.
*Andrewsmama*, hugs to you.
I suffered thru lots of depression for years and even came very close to sealing the deal, but for some reason, it went away.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Hopefull too, mine will just go away.

On a lighter note, coconut oil and the no poo method is what my hair needs. I don't know how, when or why I changed to something else, but my hair looks and feels great. Some mornings I just rinse without using conditioner.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

*Oyinmama*, remember when you were a little girl and you had 1 or 2 friends with light spots on their cheeks? I think everyone knew someone like that, right? Well my DS has developed light spots, is there any cream that I can use to even out his complexion?


my dd has those light spots too and dry spots on her face. i think its eczema but thankfully a rather mild case. i've been putting a bit of shea and coconut oil on her face intermittently...if you find anything good for your LO let me know!


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

andrewsmother,


----------



## oyinmama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Oyinmama*, remember when you were a little girl and you had 1 or 2 friends with light spots on their cheeks? I think everyone knew someone like that, right? Well my DS has developed light spots, is there any cream that I can use to even out his complexion?

i'm not sure what you mean, but it sounds like nnaemeka does. if it's mild eczema, we've gotten good reviews about childrens' eczema being helped by our whipped pudding, which is a shea based dense cream w/aloe vera gel, and whipped shea butter, which is, well, shea butter whipped with other nutritious oils - coconut, black seed, rice bran, avocado, olive, jojoba. without knowing what it is i hesitate to 'prescribe' anything, but pure aloe vera, olive and shea are pretty easy to come by and always nutritious for the skin. those might be a good place to start.

Quote:

Also, both my DD's have very dry ends, which Oyin product do you recommend?
burnt sugar is great on dry ends, and so is pure castor oil. (there's a whole heck of a lot of it in the burnt sugar







) it's a thick rich oil that's actually a humectant, and helps draw moisture to your hair. i love putting it on the ends of my wet braids after i've detangled with conditioner. seals the ends right up!

like andrewsmother, i'm finding a simplistic routine quite nice these days. HH conditioner washes and castor oil? whoo chile. if i wanna glam up i'll add shine&define and burnt sugar and walk around smelling like a sugar cookie.









Quote:

I have dry cracked heels







, do you think that I should use anything else besides shay butter?
exfoliate or pumice regularly and sleepy with moisturizer slathered on under socks. my fave is our belly bar - it's full of calendula infused olive oil, and can help skin heal itself. when i was pregnant and could hardly see my feet, it healed my cracked heels more than once.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i'm not sure what you mean, but it sounds like nnaemeka does. if it's mild eczema, we've gotten good reviews about childrens' eczema being helped by our whipped pudding, which is a shea based dense cream w/aloe vera gel, and whipped shea butter, which is, well, shea butter whipped with other nutritious oils - coconut, black seed, rice bran, avocado, olive, jojoba. without knowing what it is i hesitate to 'prescribe' anything, but pure aloe vera, olive and shea are pretty easy to come by and always nutritious for the skin. those might be a good place to start.

burnt sugar is great on dry ends, and so is pure castor oil. (there's a whole heck of a lot of it in the burnt sugar







) it's a thick rich oil that's actually a humectant, and helps draw moisture to your hair. i love putting it on the ends of my wet braids after i've detangled with conditioner. seals the ends right up!

like andrewsmother, i'm finding a simplistic routine quite nice these days. HH conditioner washes and castor oil? whoo chile. if i wanna glam up i'll add shine&define and burnt sugar and walk around smelling like a sugar cookie.









exfoliate or pumice regularly and sleepy with moisturizer slathered on under socks. my fave is our belly bar - it's full of calendula infused olive oil, and can help skin heal itself. when i was pregnant and could hardly see my feet, it healed my cracked heels more than once.











*Oyinmama*, thanks for the advice







. I'll get to working on these things.


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## shayinme

Just wanted to say that for dry cracked heels, Burts Bees also makes this great salve stuff for feet, its got a great peppermint scent. I tend to use this stuff in winter when I am not getting a regular pedicure.

Shay


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## splendid

Eczema is sometimes worse in the dry months of winter. I watch a little one during the week and he has horrid eczema. I keep telling his mom to get him tested for allergies, but I'm the weird hippy lady from across the street. You might also want to check on your dd's diet to see if there is also something you can do internally to help with the problem.


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## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Eczema is sometimes worse in the dry months of winter. I watch a little one during the week and he has horrid eczema. I keep telling his mom to get him tested for allergies, but I'm the weird hippy lady from across the street. You might also want to check on your dd's diet to see if there is also something you can do internally to help with the problem.

good point. we woke this morning and dd's eczema is looking worse and she a few tiny scratches from her fingernails cutting her cheeks. i have a baby bliss cream that has borage oil, evening primrose and calendula in it. i put that on her and its less red but i'm def considering cutting my intake of dairy to see if she's reacting to that. i don't eat much of it but that might help. also i've read soy can irritate baby via breast milk as well. anyone have experience with this? this would be harder for me to give up as i love bbq tofu and put soymilk in my tea quite regularly.


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## Bloomingstar

man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.

That is awesome. Nothing like great, loving and giving friends. You so deserved it mama!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.

Awww, that sounds beautiful. What's more beautiful is that you have a 92 year old grandmother


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## oyinmama

@ bloomingstar, yaaaaay for a wonderful shower!!


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## rambunctiouscurls

Bloomingstar, that's so wonderful! I'm so glad you had so many loving people around you and be with you on your shower.









I'm curious as to what the women said about motherhood and keeping an identity outside of that. Was there anything said that really resonated with you?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.

Sounds awesome! I am glad you had a wonderful time!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.

wow, wonderful. i was just remembering my shower today...







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
@ bloomingstar, yaaaaay for a wonderful shower!!

















So glad you enjoyed yourself so much. I remember my shower too and at the time, I didn't think anyone was going to do anything for me. DH organized the whole thing and delegated responsibilities and I was so overwhelmed and touched by how many people came to show me love.









I too would like to hear some of the words of wisdom for keeping yourself and not becoming totally consumed as "MOTHER".


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## AndrewsMother

Bloomingstar, out of all your presents, which excited you the most?
I am glad that you had such a wonderful experience.







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







man I love my friends







I got home a little while ago from the best shower I've ever been to, and it was mine heehee







: It was decorated beautifully, lots of different people from my life were there (work, college, my buddhist organization, random friends, people I've danced for/with,my midwife) and I just felt really special and really well-loved and they put so much effort into it and it was just great! YAY!







: There was a sweet moment when they had arranged for some of the women in my life who are mothers to say a few things to my about motherhood and keeping their identity as people outside of motherhood, their first experience with becoming mothers etc. and they had my sister call in and talk on speakerphone since she's in Ohio and also pregnant and due the day before me. That totally got the waterworks going but then (my cousin was part of the planning--they called themselves "Team Hot Mama" haha) when they got my 92 year old grandmother on the phone--who decided that she'd talk to me about this stuff later hehe--that really just got me all teary! Good thing the lights were dim and I had my hair down--I hate getting teary even though I do it all the time, even when it's called for. All of that was really sweet, and I got many wonderful gifts and just felt really great!

Now I am trying to wind down so I can go to sleep.









: What an amazing sounding shower. As someone who has been parenting almost 17 years now (well it is 17 if you count the 9 mos spent gestating elder child LOL) I agree its important to talk about maintaing your identity.

In some ways I have spent all my adult life juggling the two since I got pregnant at 18 and had baby boy at 19, never was there any just me time as an adult.

My son was home for the holidays and I was hit wiith cold water about how fast the babies grow up. It feels like a blur, one day they are babies, next minute toddler and then one day you are looking up at a young adult.

I must admit that at times I wonder if there are cultural differences when it comes to maintaining your identity when raising babies especially if you take the AP path. I say that because when I was pregnant with dd, I had 4 other sista friends who were pregnant and we all were interested in AP, our kiddos are all 3-3.5 now and its interesting because we all work yet seem to walk that line between being attentive parents but realizing its ok to take care of us and even our partners. On the other hand I have white girlfriends who do seem to have a harder time of things as far as maintaining the other connections in their lives. Just sort of thinking out loud here...

Shay


----------



## Bloomingstar

Thanks everyone!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
Bloomingstar, that's so wonderful! I'm so glad you had so many loving people around you and be with you on your shower.









I'm curious as to what the women said about motherhood and keeping an identity outside of that. Was there anything said that really resonated with you?

A few things really struck me: one big one was when one of my friends talked about keeping a sense of humor and told a story about coming home from a 9 hour work day and her dear loving child said "look mommy! look what I did!" and handed her a handful of poop.







she went on to also talk about just knowing that you may always be getting to know the woman that you are becoming because motherhood is tremendous change. My boss spoke about how motherhood brings out all the other places of power within you. my midwife said how becoming a mother makes you an activist in your heart. my sister talked about how when she first became a mother, she had many worries about whether she'd be a good mother, etc. (many of which came from our experiences with our mother and stepmother) and she said I was the one who kept telling her that of course she would be--she already had all the things she needed within her. So she gave my back my own advice. They ALL said that I had to rely on my own intuition and good sense because so many people will try to tell you one thing or another about what you're not doing right, etc. And they also talked about not isolating yourself from community, since you need people too. And just hearing my grandmother on the phone was enough without her saying anything at all about being a mother









Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 







So glad you enjoyed yourself so much. I remember my shower too and at the time, I didn't think anyone was going to do anything for me. DH organized the whole thing and delegated responsibilities and I was so overwhelmed and touched by how many people came to show me love.









I too would like to hear some of the words of wisdom for keeping yourself and not becoming totally consumed as "MOTHER".

The great thing about all of the women who spoke was they they're all incredibly talented and driven women who are passionate about many things in their lives, and they just talked about--and I can also just see--how their "mother" selves are involved in other parts of their lives and vice versa. They're whole people.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Bloomingstar, out of all your presents, which excited you the most?
I am glad that you had such a wonderful experience.







:

Thanks! I think I got the most excited about this little white teddy bear hoodie with ears on it that someone gave me--it's sooo cute! I love having ears on things and have been known to sit around at home wearing antlers or smiley face ears or rabbit ears on my own head, so of course I'll be the woman who puts her child in clothes with little ears from time to time. And also the breast pump and the Pack'n Play contraption are essential and great.

And I am still hobbling through the cold to work! I have to actually decide when I am going to stop working, baby here or not. Probably the week of Christmas, or at least switch to working from home then in case this LO decides to take a leisurely path to joining us.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Thanks everyone!

A few things really struck me: one big one was when one of my friends talked about keeping a sense of humor and told a story about coming home from a 9 hour work day and her dear loving child said "look mommy! look what I did!" and handed her a handful of poop.







she went on to also talk about just knowing that you may always be getting to know the woman that you are becoming because motherhood is tremendous change. My boss spoke about how motherhood brings out all the other places of power within you. my midwife said how becoming a mother makes you an activist in your heart. my sister talked about how when she first became a mother, she had many worries about whether she'd be a good mother, etc. (many of which came from our experiences with our mother and stepmother) and she said I was the one who kept telling her that of course she would be--she already had all the things she needed within her. So she gave my back my own advice. They ALL said that I had to rely on my own intuition and good sense because so many people will try to tell you one thing or another about what you're not doing right, etc. And they also talked about not isolating yourself from community, since you need people too. And just hearing my grandmother on the phone was enough without her saying anything at all about being a mother









The great thing about all of the women who spoke was they they're all incredibly talented and driven women who are passionate about many things in their lives, and they just talked about--and I can also just see--how their "mother" selves are involved in other parts of their lives and vice versa. They're whole people.


wow, that was absolutely an inspiring evening... give thanks for sharing those nuggets! my eyes are watering just reading about the advice/affirmations you received!!! you are blessed to have amazing reflections of your beauty and strength all around you. i too i determined to live fully as a mama---its been a challenging era, so i truly appreciate their words of wisdom, i needed the reminder







.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Thanks everyone!

A few things really struck me: one big one was when one of my friends talked about keeping a sense of humor and told a story about coming home from a 9 hour work day and her dear loving child said "look mommy! look what I did!" and handed her a handful of poop.







she went on to also talk about just knowing that you may always be getting to know the woman that you are becoming because motherhood is tremendous change. My boss spoke about how motherhood brings out all the other places of power within you. my midwife said how becoming a mother makes you an activist in your heart. my sister talked about how when she first became a mother, she had many worries about whether she'd be a good mother, etc. (many of which came from our experiences with our mother and stepmother) and she said I was the one who kept telling her that of course she would be--she already had all the things she needed within her. So she gave my back my own advice. They ALL said that I had to rely on my own intuition and good sense because so many people will try to tell you one thing or another about what you're not doing right, etc. And they also talked about not isolating yourself from community, since you need people too. And just hearing my grandmother on the phone was enough without her saying anything at all about being a mother









The great thing about all of the women who spoke was they they're all incredibly talented and driven women who are passionate about many things in their lives, and they just talked about--and I can also just see--how their "mother" selves are involved in other parts of their lives and vice versa. They're whole people.
--snip---

Wow. thanks for sharing that. There is a LOT of wisdom in everything they said, especially the "keeping a sense of humor" part. Life around here can go from "I wanna tear my hair out and run through the streets naked" to rolling on the floor, laughing hysterically in just 5 minutes. and yes, it's hard when one has mom issues and not exactly the ideal model for parenting. I worried about that, particularly. Would I have the patience or impulse control as my mother lacked both?

and you know, so far, so good. My kiddo tells me, she loves me spontaneously and gives kisses abudantly. I guess, we are doing something right.







cuz I could never do that to my own mother.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: What an amazing sounding shower. As someone who has been parenting almost 17 years now (well it is 17 if you count the 9 mos spent gestating elder child LOL) I agree its important to talk about maintaing your identity.

In some ways I have spent all my adult life juggling the two since I got pregnant at 18 and had baby boy at 19, never was there any just me time as an adult.

My son was home for the holidays and I was hit wiith cold water about how fast the babies grow up. It feels like a blur, one day they are babies, next minute toddler and then one day you are looking up at a young adult.

---snip---

Shay

I love your sig, first of all! Thank you for sharing your perspective on this.
DD is only 2 but I'm AMAZED at how fast the two years have gone and now she is speaking in full sentences.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I must admit that at times I wonder if there are cultural differences when it comes to maintaining your identity when raising babies especially if you take the AP path. I say that because when I was pregnant with dd, I had 4 other sista friends who were pregnant and we all were interested in AP, our kiddos are all 3-3.5 now and its interesting because we all work yet seem to walk that line between being attentive parents but realizing its ok to take care of us and even our partners. On the other hand I have white girlfriends who do seem to have a harder time of things as far as maintaining the other connections in their lives. Just sort of thinking out loud here...

Shay

Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??


Oddly enough the first sista I met here in Maine is AP/very NFL, single Mama but until recently didn't work ft. I do know some sistas who don't work but I suspect the reason we see less WOC as SAHM's is more rooted in economic inequality (MOC make less than white men, etc).

I do have sista-friends that while they work strive to be AP/NFL and seem to have a good balance, one sista is like me in that we are both still nursing our 3 yo's and she works and often travels for work bringing her child with.

I do wonder how many WOC are less apt to share our AP leanings for fear of having to deal with other's crap.







: I think I have said before none of my RL BLack friends except one knows I still nurse yet all my white friends do.

More later...

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??

I can't even think of a nice way to describe my friends/associates who work, and think that I should work full time.

As I think about it, most of my WOC friends do not work, but the ones who do love to ask when I plan to return to work.


----------



## AndrewsMother

My dear cousin in VA was due to deliver her first child at a birthing center towards the end of the month. Her blood pressure increased and the doctors have begun to induce labor. I am hopeful that she will have the experience of a vaginal birth.

Please keep her in your thoughts and prayers.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
My dear cousin in VA was due to deliver her first child at a birthing center towards the end of the month. Her blood pressure increased and the doctors have begun to induce labor. I am hopeful that she will have the experience of a vaginal birth.

Please keep her in your thoughts and prayers.

How scary. I will say a prayer for you cousin and the baby.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
My dear cousin in VA was due to deliver her first child at a birthing center towards the end of the month. Her blood pressure increased and the doctors have begun to induce labor. I am hopeful that she will have the experience of a vaginal birth.

Please keep her in your thoughts and prayers.


Will do.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??


*NAK*
I've neveer thought about it. Most WOC that I know are Muslim and SAHM and do some sort of AP parenting.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Will do.

ditto


----------



## AndrewsMother

Well she arrived at 9:29am via caesarean birth. Even though she is exactly three weeks early the LO only weighs 4lbs 8 ounces. She is not in NICU and is breathing on her own. Baby girl has an excellent set of lungs!!!

Thank you for the good thoughts.

We are all super excited.


----------



## Bloomingstar

: That's awesome that she is doing well and breathing on her own! I hope your cousin is also doing well after the birth.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well she arrived at 9:29am via caesarean birth. Even though she is exactly three weeks early the LO only weighs 4lbs 8 ounces. She is not in NICU and is breathing on her own. Baby girl has an excellent set of lungs!!!

Thank you for the good thoughts.

We are all super excited.

That is awesome! Go baby girl go







:


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??

The same has been my experience. The few WOC I know just have to work. Or, as in my case working outside the home provides just the right balance to staying mentally stimulated outside of home and also, being present for my daughter when I'm home.

And as far as AP, many of the Ap-practices such as cosleeping, breastfeeding, and baby/toddler wearing is pretty much a cultural phenomenon in the African/Arab culture. However, corporal punishment is also unfortunately something that everybody just does.

eta: Generally, I have noticed that POC have the extended family enmeshed with the nuclear family making childcare something that's readily available therefore providing more time for mamas and dads to get that "break" just for themselves. IME, it just prevents burn-out and promotes the sense of identity that can sometimes be lost when it's personal needs are ignored in favor of the family's.

just my two cents.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well she arrived at 9:29am via caesarean birth. Even though she is exactly three weeks early the LO only weighs 4lbs 8 ounces. She is not in NICU and is breathing on her own. Baby girl has an excellent set of lungs!!!

Thank you for the good thoughts.

We are all super excited.

That's wonderful! Congratulations to your cousin and you. Welcome to the world, little one!








I'll be keeping them in my thoughts as well.


----------



## AndrewsMother

We are all excited as she is the first girl born of her generation. While I secretly wanted to be the first to have a girl, I am happy for them. My cousin has always been my pet, and watching her accomplosh milestones over the past few years has been nothing but phenomenal.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well she arrived at 9:29am via caesarean birth. Even though she is exactly three weeks early the LO only weighs 4lbs 8 ounces. She is not in NICU and is breathing on her own. Baby girl has an excellent set of lungs!!!

Thank you for the good thoughts.

We are all super excited.









: Congratulations!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
eta: Generally, I have noticed that POC have the extended family enmeshed with the nuclear family making childcare something that's readily available therefore providing more time for mamas and dads to get that "break" just for themselves. IME, it just prevents burn-out and promotes the sense of identity that can sometimes be lost when it's personal needs are ignored in favor of the family's.

just my two cents.







:


I think this is a great point, I know when I had my son 17 years ago and my Mom and Granny were alive, getting me time was never an issue. If they were both still alive, I know that they would happy to lend a hand, with my son he still talks fondly of the time he spent with his Grandma and Granny.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 







: Congratulations!

I think this is a great point, I know when I had my son 17 years ago and my Mom and Granny were alive, getting me time was never an issue. If they were both still alive, I know that they would happy to lend a hand, with my son he still talks fondly of the time he spent with his Grandma and Granny.

I definitely grew up that way, spending plenty of time with many other members of the family, and it was great and my Dad definitely needed all the help he could get as a single father/widower. I think it gets harder to manage to have that kind of set-up when you live away from family (like I do). Although I definitely have plenty of chosen family around.


----------



## jeca

Sadly I just don't know enough WOC to contribute to this part of the conversation. The few I befriended at the gym I really don't know much about their lives yet. I know they are SAHM's and they both have older kids (9-16). My neighbor that I do know a few things about recently quit her job. She is now a SAHM and is not handling it well. Her daughters are still going to daycare.

Congrats to your cousin AndrewsMother.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hmmm . . .I'd like to explore this more.

Most women of color I know do not do the SAHM thing . . . there is an expectation that you work. I don't know about the AP thing though . . . any thoughts??


Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Oddly enough the first sista I met here in Maine is AP/very NFL, single Mama but until recently didn't work ft. I do know some sistas who don't work but I suspect the reason we see less WOC as SAHM's is more rooted in economic inequality (MOC make less than white men, etc).

I do have sista-friends that while they work strive to be AP/NFL and seem to have a good balance, one sista is like me in that we are both still nursing our 3 yo's and she works and often travels for work bringing her child with.

I do wonder how many WOC are less apt to share our AP leanings for fear of having to deal with other's crap.







: I think I have said before none of my RL BLack friends except one knows I still nurse yet all my white friends do.

More later...

Shay

I have been thinking of somethings somewhat along the lines of this... Having a child has changed the way I view life tremendously. In our society we (women) are expected to work 8 hours a day and place our babies in the care of someone else, and heaven forbid if your like me and in school! So if you do the math 5 days a week or more you wake up at 6:30am to get to work by 8 and get off at 4 or 5, get home by 6 spend a few hours with your child/children, (don't forget dinner). I mean when the hell am I suppose to parent my child, don't get me wrong I am not saying that women should be at home barefoot and pregnant, but for those women that have a desire to be more hands on, I feel our society should offer a lot more help.... * steps down off of my soap box*


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well she arrived at 9:29am via caesarean birth. Even though she is exactly three weeks early the LO only weighs 4lbs 8 ounces. She is not in NICU and is breathing on her own. Baby girl has an excellent set of lungs!!!

Thank you for the good thoughts.

We are all super excited.









:







:







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
I have been thinking of somethings somewhat along the lines of this... Having a child has changed the way I view life tremendously. In our society we (women) are expected to work 8 hours a day and place our babies in the care of someone else, and heaven forbid if your like me and in school! So if you do the math 5 days a week or more you wake up at 6:30am to get to work by 8 and get off at 4 or 5, get home by 6 spend a few hours with your child/children, (don't forget dinner). I mean when the hell am I suppose to parent my child, don't get me wrong I am not saying that women should be at home barefoot and pregnant, but for those women that have a desire to be more hands on, I feel our society should offer a lot more help.... * steps down off of my soap box*

I totally agree.
When I was pregnant with my 5th child I was working full time and going to school full time. We left our house in NJ(still payed mortgage) and were staying with my aunt and uncle, so my aunt helped out ALOT. I missed out on so much with my DC. I didn't have to work or go to school, I just happened to get pregnant and didn't want to quit work or school. If I were put in that position again I'd definitely quit, but that's just me


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
I have been thinking of somethings somewhat along the lines of this... Having a child has changed the way I view life tremendously. In our society we (women) are expected to work 8 hours a day and place our babies in the care of someone else, and heaven forbid if your like me and in school! So if you do the math 5 days a week or more you wake up at 6:30am to get to work by 8 and get off at 4 or 5, get home by 6 spend a few hours with your child/children, (don't forget dinner). I mean when the hell am I suppose to parent my child, don't get me wrong I am not saying that women should be at home barefoot and pregnant, but for those women that have a desire to be more hands on, I feel our society should offer a lot more help.... * steps down off of my soap box*

word. I have been going over and over this point in my mind for months! I don't want to have a baby just to give it to someone else to spend all its time...







: I get three months off, DH gets three months off, and then what? I guess daycare. financially it seems nearly impossible for me to quit, though maybe I could get away with part-time work...we'll see how it goes. But I'd definitely like to spend at least part of the child's early years as a SAHM.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
word. I have been going over and over this point in my mind for months! I don't want to have a baby just to give it to someone else to spend all its time...







: I get three months off, DH gets three months off, and then what? I guess daycare. financially it seems nearly impossible for me to quit, though maybe I could get away with part-time work...we'll see how it goes. But I'd definitely like to spend at least part of the child's early years as a SAHM.










I feel the same way but unfortunately financially being a SAHM would not work for our family.







I wish my Granny lived closer so she could take care of my DS. I wish I could work part-time with full-time pay! LOL!


----------



## Sugarshoc

Ishereal,

I feel the same way!!


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I feel the same way but unfortunately financially being a SAHM would not work for our family.







I wish my Granny lived closer so she could take care of my DS. I wish I could work part-time with full-time pay! LOL!

It won't work for mine either! Just thought I'd vent a little.


----------



## Kappa

Sorry to just jump in here, but I just wanted to comment on the SAHM thing in the Black community. My mom was a SAHM, so I didn't realize growing up that this is apparently a Big Deal. I took off the last 3 months of my pregnancy and the first 6 months of my DS's life here on this earth, and I got the







from many women. Most people assumed I worked. I don't know why exactly, but I've come to the conclusion that they don't think that my husband can/should support me. Yes, we have the "surburban lifestyle" that everyone says requires 2 incomes, but no one wants to believe that perhaps my husband makes double the average person (he doesn't have an obvious profession such as doctor or lawyer, he's just a techie). Or perhaps they don't think he should support me, because I am somehow unworthy (I'm not Betty Crocker or Martha Stewart, KWIM?). Or sometimes I think people look at you and see that you are pregnant, and believe it is your responsiblity to work MORE to support this "expensive" child you are about to bring into the world.

I'm having a hard time getting this sorted out, I don't desire to be a SAHM, but I want to take off 6-12 months with each child that I have. If I did not have that time off, I would rather just refrain from getting pregnant again, it's that important to me. I think it is a strange culture that minimizes a mother's primary job of mothering her children, and tosses it aside to say that she should be doing something else when it is not required.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
I have been thinking of somethings somewhat along the lines of this... Having a child has changed the way I view life tremendously. In our society we (women) are expected to work 8 hours a day and place our babies in the care of someone else, and heaven forbid if your like me and in school! So if you do the math 5 days a week or more you wake up at 6:30am to get to work by 8 and get off at 4 or 5, get home by 6 spend a few hours with your child/children, (don't forget dinner). I mean when the hell am I suppose to parent my child, don't get me wrong I am not saying that women should be at home barefoot and pregnant, but for those women that have a desire to be more hands on, I feel our society should offer a lot more help.... * steps down off of my soap box*


Until October 29, I worked and attended class full time. I decided to quit my job and until I finish school I have no desire to return to work, unless my son is accepted at one of two schools and I will have to work to pay his tuition.

Yes, money is tight, but my life is not as stressful. DS attends preschool three days a week, so I am able to study and attend class.

I was tired of working 12-8 and taking 6 classes a semester, and taking care of DS and DH. I need me time.

Even if my mom were closer, she would not help. My dear mother is pushing at the gate to 60, but still believes that she is too young to be a grandmother. She buys wonderful presents, but Mom is not babysitting. Period.


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
I'm having a hard time getting this sorted out, I don't desire to be a SAHM, but I want to take off 6-12 months with each child that I have. If I did not have that time off, I would rather just refrain from getting pregnant again, it's that important to me. I think it is a strange culture that minimizes a mother's primary job of mothering her children, and tosses it aside to say that she should be doing something else when it is not required.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
Sorry to just jump in here, but I just wanted to comment on the SAHM thing in the Black community. My mom was a SAHM, so I didn't realize growing up that this is apparently a Big Deal. I took off the last 3 months of my pregnancy and the first 6 months of my DS's life here on this earth, and I got the







from many women. Most people assumed I worked. I don't know why exactly, but I've come to the conclusion that they don't think that my husband can/should support me. Yes, we have the "surburban lifestyle" that everyone says requires 2 incomes, but no one wants to believe that perhaps my husband makes double the average person (he doesn't have an obvious profession such as doctor or lawyer, he's just a techie). Or perhaps they don't think he should support me, because I am somehow unworthy (I'm not Betty Crocker or Martha Stewart, KWIM?). Or sometimes I think people look at you and see that you are pregnant, and believe it is your responsiblity to work MORE to support this "expensive" child you are about to bring into the world.

I'm having a hard time getting this sorted out, I don't desire to be a SAHM, but I want to take off 6-12 months with each child that I have. If I did not have that time off, I would rather just refrain from getting pregnant again, it's that important to me. I think it is a strange culture that minimizes a mother's primary job of mothering her children, and tosses it aside to say that she should be doing something else when it is not required.

My Mom was also a SAHM and like you I really never knew just how strange it was until I got older, in fact when my Mom passed several years ago, my childhood best friend came to the memorial service and commented how my Mom was the only Mom she ever knew that stayed home and baked stuff.







For me not being a SAHM was revolutionary because my Mom had been home, I was in HS when my Mom finally started working. Funny thing is she actually wanted to work sooner but my dad wanted her to be a SAHM.

I didn't stay home at all with my oldest, then again his Dad and I split when he was a toddler so being a SAHM was not an option. This second time around I was able to be a SAHM for dd's first year and then I started teaching pt as an adjunct. Even now I work but not 40 hours, which does allow me the balance I need though admittedly I do lose out financially but its ok.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Do you all have any plans for the holidays (christmas and new year's)? I know not everyone here is Christian--I'm not--but do you end up doing things around the holiday anyway? Anyone celebrate kwaanza?

I'm not Christian but I was raised Catholic and am now a practicing Buddhist but I still love decorating things and being festive and holiday music and Silk Nog make me pretty cheerful anyway. Growing up it was always a big family time, so I miss that still. This year I'll be either hanging out with a newborn or waiting for it to arrive still, so I don't have any plans. If I can even get anything that's already there put away in a proper place in the apartment, I will consider decorating just a little bit. And I'm not getting anyone any gifts except my nieces and nephews.


----------



## purplegirl

I love Christmas. I am in the throws of decorating and planning like a mad woman







: My only fear is gaining back the weight I've lost. I have received several party invitations and am planning an open house here.







: I'm a tad overwhelmed as I am making most of the gifts I plan to give.
It has been a difficult week as I learned of three families with whom I work, where the children aren't getting anything due to lack of money







I am going to try and purchase some gifts for them; it just breaks my heart and there are limited resources in social services. So while I dance around and do my thing, it's never far from my heart that this is a difficult time for many.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

well, staying at home isn't for everyone. It certainly isn't for me. I stayed home with dd for the first year and a half before I realized, I desperately missed the professional life. I was really depressed. Now, that I'm working, I've lost the baby weight, I'm happier and even more confident as a mom.

I'm not having any more dc's because I realize my limits and I just could not devote another year of breastfeeding full time and staying at home for another child.

Anyway, I'm excited about Christmas. I have done any shopping yet but I plan on getting started tomorrow! Dd's having professional christmas photos taken.








We are not christians either. I didn't even grow up celebrating Christmas. but I like the opportunity to exchange gifts, and just generally being joyous.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I love Christmas. I am in the throws of decorating and planning like a mad woman







: My only fear is gaining back the weight I've lost. I have received several party invitations and am planning an open house here.







: I'm a tad overwhelmed as I am making most of the gifts I plan to give.
It has been a difficult week as I learned of three families with whom I work, where the children aren't getting anything due to lack of money







I am going to try and purchase some gifts for them; it just breaks my heart and there are limited resources in social services. So while I dance around and do my thing, it's never far from my heart that this is a difficult time for many.

Well despite having turkey day with friends who are caterers, I did not gain weight







: and I ate like a pig. In fact when I did my monthly check in with WW, I had lost a little







:. This year we have been doing holiday stuff with folks so definitely more food around, I do plan ahead for the splurges, eat sparsely,but allow myself a day to indulge but get back on track the next day. Don't worry and enjoy.

I hear you on the families, so many families they use our program are in need, some are being sponsored by local groups but I have one last family where a local school said they wanted to sponsor a family hasn't called me back yet and I am worried. I already talked to the Mom to see what they needed and if this group doesn't sponsor them I feel like I need to do something personally. I like my new job but am overwhelmed at the need, just the other day one of the kids asked to take his treat home so he would have something at home







, its so hard and yet there is not much I can do.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Well despite having turkey day with friends who are caterers, I did not gain weight







: and I ate like a pig. In fact when I did my monthly check in with WW, I had lost a little







:. This year we have been doing holiday stuff with folks so definitely more food around, I do plan ahead for the splurges, eat sparsely,but allow myself a day to indulge but get back on track the next day. Don't worry and enjoy.

I hear you on the families, so many families they use our program are in need, some are being sponsored by local groups but I have one last family where a local school said they wanted to sponsor a family hasn't called me back yet and I am worried. I already talked to the Mom to see what they needed and if this group doesn't sponsor them I feel like I need to do something personally. I like my new job but am overwhelmed at the need, just the other day one of the kids asked to take his treat home so he would have something at home







, *its so hard and yet there is not much I can do*.

The feeling of helplessness is so hard to deal with. I can't afford to personally help all that I know in need. I spent a few sleepless nights this week thinking about the teen who revealed he was homeless and cried like a baby in my office. Yes, I helped him get into a shelter but still........ I have another family where there are 15 living in 2 bdrms. As a therapist, I was trained to maintain some emotional distance, but I'd be one cold person if I didn't feel deeply for the pain of these children.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

purplegirl and Shay, You have done more than you can imagine by just giving them an ear and just being an awesome resource. I know it feels like there should be more that you _should_ do but just remember, that charity begins at home and with yourself. Be good to yourself, ok?


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
purplegirl and Shay, You have done more than you can imagine by just giving them an ear and just being an awesome resource. I know it feels like there should be more that you _should_ do but just remember, that charity begins at home and with yourself. Be good to yourself, ok?

















:


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
well, staying at home isn't for everyone. It certainly isn't for me. I stayed home with dd for the first year and a half before I realized, I desperately missed the professional life. I was really depressed. Now, that I'm working, I've lost the baby weight, I'm happier and even more confident as a mom.

I agree. At the same time neither is working a full time job with small kids. I can never see myself working a full time 9-5 type job. I have before and I hated it. I felt physically, emotionally and mentality drained always. I felt that DS was not on the level that I thought he should be. I quit when he was 18 months old and never went back to full time working. I think he missed out on a lot of things that the girl did like co-sleeping and extended nursing. I've done odd jobs here and there but that's about it. Our household is just a lot less stressful when I'm not boggled down with 5 different things. DH is not the type to help as he should so ALL responsibilities fall on me. The part time job at the community center was perfect because of the hours but sadly since it's ending I just don't know that I will seek anything else out. Well that's not true I've looked. No one is wants to hire be for school time hours only which is what I really need.
I'm happier when there is a working balance and I still have some me time. Being at work is not a me time is a job time. I want some time to myself also.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
well, staying at home isn't for everyone. It certainly isn't for me. I stayed home with dd for the first year and a half before I realized, I desperately missed the professional life. I was really depressed. Now, that I'm working, I've lost the baby weight, I'm happier and even more confident as a mom.


i feel the same way. i'm excited about returning to work next month--dd will be 6 months-- though i know it'll be hard at times. i've always known i'd be a working mama as i feel i have contributions to make via my profession. for me its about fulfilling my purpose(s) and sharing my passions. my gig is not 9-5 so that's very helpful, no doubt. but i could never do the 9-5 thing or the traditional 40 hour work week, pre or post-baby. anyway, all the women (except the elders) in my family, mamas or not, work for wages. its about the joy of work/learning, independence, planning for the future and the necessity of contributing $$$ to take care of the family.

its funny, not too long ago, a sista friend and i were joking about how great it would be if our dhs made enuf $ so we could be fulltime SAHM/Ws. but honestly i think both of us wouldn't be happy. and its not about having a
"career like man." shooot, most brothers i know aren't interested in having a "career like a man" either, lol!


----------



## Jannah6

I don't see myself being a SAHM until my children are all grown up, especially since we do private school. But I could never go to work while I had a 6 month old. I EBF and I don't pump enough milk. The only person that I would trust to watch my babywould be my aunt. The youngest I've ever left a child was at 9 months, and that was to go to school part time in the evenings(it was one of the hardest times of my life). I plan on going to work when this unborn baby is old enough to go to school, so in about 4 years








I remember when my sister had her last child, she had to go back to work when he was only 3 weeks


----------



## rootzdawta

Being a SAHM is not necessarily an ideal for me. I think the perfect situation would be working a regular (not here-and-there) part-time job with my children in a child-care situation that I'm comfortable with, i.e. someone I trust will a) feed them what I ask them too b) limit t.v./music c) be holistically minded and gentle.

I feel like I need a regular break from the kids that I can count on where I am interacting with other adults and making a career for myself. It just doesn't seem, though, that I can find that any where but in academics but I don't have the resume to get a foot into the academic fields (except to teach like continuing ed stuff like crochet/knit, etc). Right now any job I take related to my degree/that I'm qualified to do would be all or nothing.

So I'm a SAHM for now. On the books, it doesn't look like DH makes enough to make staying at home possible. But he works lots of overtime and we scrimp and sacrifice a whole lot so that I can be able to do it. Life would be 10x's more comfortable with my salary. The challenge now is trying to decide if the children would benefit more from me homeschooling them (and continuing to SAH or going back for doctorate--all basically unpaid work) or going to work and sending them to school (our school district is not the greatest at all so I would need to spend a lot of time filling the gaps--would I have time to do that if I'm working too?) or try to apply for scholarships to private school (they'd be more likely to get that if we applied with only DH's income--we couldn't afford private school right out even with both our incomes).

Long and short, being a SAHM allows me to be the kind of mom I want to be to my kids but it's not a perfect situation because I feel like I have to put me on hold for a minute. Just a minute though.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mommy2Amira* 
purplegirl and Shay, You have done more than you can imagine by just giving them an ear and just being an awesome resource. I know it feels like there should be more that you _should_ do but just remember, that charity begins at home and with yourself. Be good to yourself, ok?










I really needed to hear that. I have to accept my limitations and focus on what I am able to do. Thanks for that wisdom--couldn't have come at a better time.


----------



## AndrewsMother

At this time of my life I have no desire to work a job that not appeal to me. I am at a point in my life were going to a job everyday that fails to challenge me is not worth my time. I am sure that I could find acceptable full time employment, but I don't want to work a job that will require me to give more of myself than I have to share. School is more important than work.

I could easily find a job that might require fewer demands, but none that will meet my salary requirements. My time is valuable.

At the same time I have no desire to be a SAHM. DS is in school 3 days a week and would go 5 if we could afford it. I am not the homeschooling type, and I know that he does more at home than I am capable.

My ideal situation is DS in school 5 days a week, I would take classes 3 days a week and have Tuesday and Thursday to myself. Saturday and Sunday I would devote to DS since DH works weekends.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I am at a loss. We are applying to a school for DS and I can't seem to write an effective Parent Statement.

this is what the school wants

Quote:

PARENT STATEMENT
Parents of applicants to the Preschool and Lower School (grades PK3 - 5th) : On a separate sheet of paper, please provide any
information regarding your child that you believe would be helpful to the school.
this is what I have written thus far.

*Andrew is a precocious, physically and mentally adroit child who enjoys the world around him. Even though he is but 2 ½ Andrew enjoys engaging others in conversation, not prone to shyness he eagerly greets friends and strangers alike.

Playing with friends of all ages is one of Andrew's many hallmarks. His ability to recognize the varying levels of development characteristic to his playmates, Andrew is gentle and patient with younger toddlers, rambunctious with older boys and simply enjoys himself with cohorts.

Andrew thrives when challenged and faced with new experiences. He loves to sing, dance, laugh, but most importantly he is a loving, hugging, altruistic he boy.*

I am also cross posting this in the learning forum. Please be honest, the above is an unedited rough draft.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Long and short, being a SAHM allows me to be the kind of mom I want to be to my kids but it's not a perfect situation because I feel like I have to put me on hold for a minute. Just a minute though.

I felt like this for a bit. Then the magic day came when they all went to school. Our kids go to a good school so I don't feel the need to homeschool. Pus I think it's for me. We pay for our youngest to go to all day kindy. I feel so much better now. I feel like I have time to explore what I really want to do and not just go grab a random job.I enjoyed working part time at the community center. I am also very involved in volunteer activities which I enjoy in addition to the spinning and pilates classes I take. I know what I would like to do career wise but I don't have the drive or focus to make it happen yet.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I am at a loss. We are applying to a school for DS and I can't seem to write an effective Parent Statement.

this is what the school wants

this is what I have written thus far.

*Andrew is a precocious, physically and mentally adroit child who enjoys the world around him. Even though he is but 2 ½ Andrew enjoys engaging others in conversation, not prone to shyness he eagerly greets friends and strangers alike.

Playing with friends of all ages is one of Andrew's many hallmarks. His ability to recognize the varying levels of development characteristic to his playmates, Andrew is gentle and patient with younger toddlers, rambunctious with older boys and simply enjoys himself with cohorts.

Andrew thrives when challenged and faced with new experiences. He loves to sing, dance, laugh, but most importantly he is a loving, hugging, altruistic he boy.*

I am also cross posting this in the learning forum. Please be honest, the above is an unedited rough draft.

I love it. It gave me a vivid description of your little guy. Do you have any concerns that you think would be helpful to share with the school? Other than that, I think it's a good statement.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I am at a loss. We are applying to a school for DS and I can't seem to write an effective Parent Statement.

this is what the school wants

this is what I have written thus far.

*Andrew is a precocious, physically and mentally adroit child who enjoys the world around him. Even though he is but 2 ½ Andrew enjoys engaging others in conversation, not prone to shyness he eagerly greets friends and strangers alike.

Playing with friends of all ages is one of Andrew's many hallmarks. His ability to recognize the varying levels of development characteristic to his playmates, Andrew is gentle and patient with younger toddlers, rambunctious with older boys and simply enjoys himself with cohorts.

Andrew thrives when challenged and faced with new experiences. He loves to sing, dance, laugh, but most importantly he is a loving, hugging, altruistic he boy.*

I am also cross posting this in the learning forum. Please be honest, the above is an unedited rough draft.


i'm not familiar with the parent statement format







but imho it reads nicely and describes your son very positively. i like the flow...nice beg and conclusion. only a few grammatical errors/typos to fix and you're good.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I love it. It gave me a vivid description of your little guy. Do you have any concerns that you think would be helpful to share with the school? Other than that, I think it's a good statement.

Thank you!

The only concern that I have is waiting until admissions decisions are mailed in March.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
i'm not familiar with the parent statement format







but imho it reads nicely and describes your son very positively. i like the flow...nice beg and conclusion. only a few grammatical errors/typos to fix and you're good.

I corrected the errors!









Thank you.


----------



## JustKiya

It's very interesting reading about all of you current mama's who have little to no interest/desire to SAHM - I've been planning/looking forward to that day for years - years! - because it seemed to be the only way that I would be *able* to get some 'me time' and still be the kind of mother that I want to be to my children. That's been based on the examples I've seen from the women/mothers I grew up with, as well as the working mamas that I'm currently friends with - that chunk of eight hours a day takes a lot out of a woman.

I'm slowly coming to the very depressing conclusion that it might not be financially possible, and it's actually making me second-guess/rethink TTC'ing at this point in time. I know I don't have much more 'wiggletime', esp. if we want to have more than one child, but - *sigh* - I really don't want to be a working mother, at *all*.


----------



## Bloomingstar

: 38 weeks and counting! not much has been happening. I think I had a few BH yesterday--I felt a teeny bit of tension and the belly was hard--and some twingy feelings but nothing major. I think being a dancer makes you (and by you I mean me hehe) super aware of what's happening in the body but at the same time gives you a great capacity to notice without paying much attention to random discomforts and sometimes mild pain. Maybe this will be helpful soon 









the SAHM conversation is interesting, and just got more potentially possible for me--details later. But let's just say I have some new developments to consider and numbers to crunch and I am feeling good about possibly being able to be home with baby for a full year, if we can swing it, and I think we can.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Being a SAHM is not necessarily an ideal for me. I think the perfect situation would be working a regular (not here-and-there) part-time job with my children in a child-care situation that I'm comfortable with, i.e. someone I trust will a) feed them what I ask them too b) limit t.v./music c) be holistically minded and gentle.

I feel like I need a regular break from the kids that I can count on where I am interacting with other adults and making a career for myself. It just doesn't seem, though, that I can find that any where but in academics but I don't have the resume to get a foot into the academic fields (except to teach like continuing ed stuff like crochet/knit, etc). Right now any job I take related to my degree/that I'm qualified to do would be all or nothing.

So I'm a SAHM for now. On the books, it doesn't look like DH makes enough to make staying at home possible. But he works lots of overtime and we scrimp and sacrifice a whole lot so that I can be able to do it. Life would be 10x's more comfortable with my salary. The challenge now is trying to decide if the children would benefit more from me homeschooling them (and continuing to SAH or going back for doctorate--all basically unpaid work) or going to work and sending them to school (our school district is not the greatest at all so I would need to spend a lot of time filling the gaps--would I have time to do that if I'm working too?) or try to apply for scholarships to private school (they'd be more likely to get that if we applied with only DH's income--we couldn't afford private school right out even with both our incomes).

Long and short, being a SAHM allows me to be the kind of mom I want to be to my kids but it's not a perfect situation because I feel like I have to put me on hold for a minute. Just a minute though.

LoL . . . it's making me giggle to quote myself.







Anyway . . .

I think I sounded a bit, ummm, disgruntled when I wrote that. I actually do enjoy being a SAHM. But it gets insanely intense sometimes and I wonder what the heck I'm doing. And that's where I was when I wrote that.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: 38 weeks and counting! not much has been happening. I think I had a few BH yesterday--I felt a teeny bit of tension and the belly was hard--and some twingy feelings but nothing major. I think being a dancer makes you (and by you I mean me hehe) super aware of what's happening in the body but at the same time gives you a great capacity to notice without paying much attention to random discomforts and sometimes mild pain. Maybe this will be helpful soon









the SAHM conversation is interesting, and just got more potentially possible for me--details later. But let's just say I have some new developments to consider and numbers to crunch and I am feeling good about possibly being able to be home with baby for a full year, if we can swing it, and I think we can.

Oh







:!! I do think being a dance will help you! I hope it does.

Can't wait to hear how you might swing the SAHM thing.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
It's very interesting reading about all of you current mama's who have little to no interest/desire to SAHM - I've been planning/looking forward to that day for years - years! - because it seemed to be the only way that I would be *able* to get some 'me time' and still be the kind of mother that I want to be to my children. That's been based on the examples I've seen from the women/mothers I grew up with, as well as the working mamas that I'm currently friends with - that chunk of eight hours a day takes a lot out of a woman.

I'm slowly coming to the very depressing conclusion that it might not be financially possible, and it's actually making me second-guess/rethink TTC'ing at this point in time. I know I don't have much more 'wiggletime', esp. if we want to have more than one child, but - *sigh* - I really don't want to be a working mother, at *all*.

I don't think working has to be an all or nothing sort of thing. I work probably 30 hours a week with 12 of those beibg on-site, because I consult and do the rest of my work at home it does allow for greater flexibility.

I think a lot depends on what type of work you so....I must admit I am taking a hit financially working like this but with no extended family or close friends to help out this schedule allows for the uneexpected that comes up with kids.

It was hard working 40 hours weekly when my son was little because when he would get sick or daycare was closed the boss was not understading. Its one of the reasons I left the for profit sector, IMO the non-profit sector is a tad more family friendly but the catch is salaries are low.

Shay


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I really needed to hear that. I have to accept my limitations and focus on what I am able to do. Thanks for that wisdom--couldn't have come at a better time.

Oh, I'm so glad to hear that.








I think we all need reminders at times when we want to do it all for everyone but don't realize just how much we have done already. and we end up not taking care of ourselves..

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I am at a loss. We are applying to a school for DS and I can't seem to write an effective Parent Statement.

this is what the school wants

this is what I have written thus far.

*Andrew is a precocious, physically and mentally adroit child who enjoys the world around him. Even though he is but 2 ½ Andrew enjoys engaging others in conversation, not prone to shyness he eagerly greets friends and strangers alike.

Playing with friends of all ages is one of Andrew's many hallmarks. His ability to recognize the varying levels of development characteristic to his playmates, Andrew is gentle and patient with younger toddlers, rambunctious with older boys and simply enjoys himself with cohorts.

Andrew thrives when challenged and faced with new experiences. He loves to sing, dance, laugh, but most importantly he is a loving, hugging, altruistic he boy.*

I am also cross posting this in the learning forum. Please be honest, the above is an unedited rough draft.

I think this is great. He sounds like an amazing kid!









___________________________________________

*Bloomingstar* Yay, I'm so excited for you. and I definately agree that being a dancer will help a lot!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: 38 weeks and counting! not much has been happening. I think I had a few BH yesterday--I felt a teeny bit of tension and the belly was hard--and some twingy feelings but nothing major. I think being a dancer makes you (and by you I mean me hehe) super aware of what's happening in the body but at the same time gives you a great capacity to notice without paying much attention to random discomforts and sometimes mild pain. Maybe this will be helpful soon









the SAHM conversation is interesting, and just got more potentially possible for me--details later. But let's just say I have some new developments to consider and numbers to crunch and I am feeling good about possibly being able to be home with baby for a full year, if we can swing it, and I think we can.

woohoo! You're getting closer. I hope things work out so that you can stay home as long as you'd like!!


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## rambunctiouscurls

Oh my goodness.. It's snowing over here







:
has been since sunday. It's gorgeous, but we are so not used to snow around here. We used to maaaybe get one day of snow every other year.. and around January, definately not before christmas, and not for a whole week! waaah!

Still, It was great to stay home today after a very busy weekend.. but I'm nervous about driving to work tomorrow. I might just take the bus, actually. I'll freeze my butt off but I'll be safer.
and it's only for a couple of hours of work.

still rambling...









We still have a ton of christmas shopping to do..but we got our family pictures taken this weekend and we have a few christmas cards with our pictures on it. I'm really excited about giving them away this year







:

So, speaking of Christmas, For those of you that do celebrate christmas, what do you tell your kids about santa? So far, we don't make a big deal about santa at all. I feel wierd about the guy, anyway.. and the whole "making it up" thing.

Plus, we are not religous.. so we are definately not celebrating for those reasons.








We just like it because it's tradition (in my husband's family) and I really don't need much of an excuse to eat good food, and drink good wine and make the little one's happy by showering them with love and presents.


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## eilonwy

Mike grew up not doing Santa. Thank goodness.







BeanBean would never have gone for it anyway; He's the kind of kid who was always confused by the whole "pretend that it's a real ____ and not a guy in a suit" deal.







Anyway, Santa falls into the realm of "random Christmas things," i think. I don't know, I'll ask the kids what they think.


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## jeca

I didn't want my kids to be that obnoxious little brat growing up who would go around telling everyone who would listen that there was no Santa so we do and we don't. I never pushed or introduced Santa but as the kids got older and asked questions I told them that Santa is real for those who need him to be. They know that their gifts come from us and our family and that we can have nice Christmases without "Santa's" help and that Santa is around for many reasons for many people. I told them the story of Saint Nicholas and Christkindl (or Kris Kringle but I grew up in Germany so this what we called him). I have also told them of the origins of Christmas. My older son knows more details such as the conversion of Pagan holiday's into Christian Holidays with the take over of Christianity. That we celebrate the birth of Christ during this month although he may not have been born this time, okay rambling but you get my point. I try to be open and honest without crushing their little imaginations if that makes sense.

Shopping nope not done but should be. My mother and MIL put a damper in my sinple Xmas palns. My mother sent two electric scooters here for my oldest two and ordered a Ryan's room dollhouse for my youngest. Then my MIL sent $300 and wants me to go shopping for the kids for her.







I bought DS clothes with his. I will get the girls some more brio tracks and trains and clothes with the rest. I am sticking to my no crap rule no matter how hard they try to break me. I am making a list tomarrow and finishing this weeks since it's the last week of school. Someone come and help me before I pull my hair out. Plus







has decided to make an appearance........again. Should I be having periods twice a month? I think not.


----------



## jeca

I killed the thread.







:


----------



## nnaemeka

no you didn't!!!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
It's very interesting reading about all of you current mama's who have little to no interest/desire to SAHM - I've been planning/looking forward to that day for years - years! - because it seemed to be the only way that I would be *able* to get some 'me time' and still be the kind of mother that I want to be to my children. That's been based on the examples I've seen from the women/mothers I grew up with, as well as the working mamas that I'm currently friends with - that chunk of eight hours a day takes a lot out of a woman.

I'm slowly coming to the very depressing conclusion that it might not be financially possible, and it's actually making me second-guess/rethink TTC'ing at this point in time. I know I don't have much more 'wiggletime', esp. if we want to have more than one child, but - *sigh* - I really don't want to be a working mother, at *all*.

I personally love being a SAHM. It happened quite by accident and will end by next September, so it's not a permanent thing, but I love it. I love being home with DS all day, taking him for walks, cuddling with him all the time...love it!
I certainly don't miss all the drama that goes with my line of work, nor do I miss gossiping coworkers. But that's just me.
I don't want to be a working mother either!!


----------



## Draupadi

DS is still too young to understand "Santa", but I do want to do it with him. When I was little, I LOVED Santa and would like DS to enjoy the feeling as I did. I don't think there's anything wrong with it, personally.


----------



## splendid

We don't do Santa. My son did that math and couldn't account for everyone on the planet being gifted by one man. So I told him that everyone has a little Saint Nicholas in there heart and some people choose to use Santa as that symbol. He knows that some people take it more seriously than others and he knows not to tell others "Santa isn't real".


----------



## Bloomingstar

you didn't kill the thread jeca! hehe.

I don't remember ever really believing in Santa. I knew he and my dad had the same handwriting and that just didn't add up







But it was ok for me anyway--I still enjoyed all the pagentry of it.


----------



## Jannah6

Bloomingstar;12803192the SAHM conversation is interesting said:


> :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
LoL . . . it's making me giggle to quote myself.







Anyway . . .

I think I sounded a bit, ummm, disgruntled when I wrote that. I actually do enjoy being a SAHM. But it gets insanely intense sometimes and I wonder what the heck I'm doing. And that's where I was when I wrote that.


I totally get you 100%


----------



## futurmama8

my name is Rianne (pronounced ryan







) I am 20 y/o in college for my BSN at the University of Cincinnati, no chillren yet and I am au natural. I have been a lurker on this thread for some time, I've been nervous to come out of the woodwork but I am here now







: Just wanted to say hello to all you beautiful women.

P.s. I was reading the thread a while back and you were talking about the "good" hair thing. When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 







my name is Rianne (pronounced ryan







) I am 20 y/o in college for my BSN at the University of Cincinnati, no chillren yet and I am au natural. I have been a lurker on this thread for some time, I've been nervous to come out of the woodwork but I am here now







: Just wanted to say hello to all you beautiful women.

P.s. I was reading the thread a while back and you were talking about the "good" hair thing. When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family









Hey and welcome Rianne. I'm glad you came out of lurkdom!







Don't stay quiet. We love fresh input!







:


----------



## ishereal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 







my name is Rianne (pronounced ryan







) I am 20 y/o in college for my BSN at the University of Cincinnati, no chillren yet and I am au natural. I have been a lurker on this thread for some time, I've been nervous to come out of the woodwork but I am here now







: Just wanted to say hello to all you beautiful women.

P.s. I was reading the thread a while back and you were talking about the "good" hair thing. When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family









Hello Rianne!!


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Welcome Rianne!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 







my name is Rianne (pronounced ryan







) I am 20 y/o in college for my BSN at the University of Cincinnati, no chillren yet and I am au natural. I have been a lurker on this thread for some time, I've been nervous to come out of the woodwork but I am here now







: Just wanted to say hello to all you beautiful women.

P.s. I was reading the thread a while back and you were talking about the "good" hair thing. When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family

















Rianne, and *LOL* to "*When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family"*


----------



## JustKiya

Rianne!


----------



## futurmama8

awww thanks you guys yal are so sweet!! But I will try to keep up with all you intelligent women purplegirl.


----------



## xochimama

saludos, everyone. long time, no post...! busy month here, and now just back from a week in mexico. ahhhh...

happy holidays, hope you all are well. i won't try to catch up on the thread, just been thinking of you...


----------



## jeca

Mexico sounds really nice right about now.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xochimama* 
saludos, everyone. long time, no post...! busy month here, and now just back from a week in mexico. ahhhh...

happy holidays, hope you all are well. i won't try to catch up on the thread, just been thinking of you...


I was thinking about you and wondering where you had been! Bienvenido mamacita!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Mexico sounds really nice right about now.







:

Yes, it does


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 







my name is Rianne (pronounced ryan







) I am 20 y/o in college for my BSN at the University of Cincinnati, no chillren yet and I am au natural. I have been a lurker on this thread for some time, I've been nervous to come out of the woodwork but I am here now







: Just wanted to say hello to all you beautiful women.

P.s. I was reading the thread a while back and you were talking about the "good" hair thing. When people say, oohh gurrl you got good hair







, I say thanks you know I got african in my family









Hi, Rianne! Welcome!


----------



## oyinmama

welcome, rianne - and welcome back xochimama!

i'm not a SAHM but we've got a come-to-work baby. we're all together all the time, and we also get to pay our bills, which works great for us all around.

this time of year is really hectic and stressful for us with work, so i've turned into an awful, last minute gift giver in the past few years.

we're heading to one grandmother's for christmas (also seeing aunts uncles, cousins), and then have to find the time at the top of the year to visit the other grandmother and my siblings. one is a 4 hour drive, the other is a 5 hour flight. i'm loading digital picture frames with baby pictures for each of the grandmothers' holiday gifts. we're always emailing them pictures, now they'll have a way to display them. i'm excited! i can't wait for them to get them, i think they'll like them.

i was still at a loss for a gift for my baby (25 yr old) brother until TODAY! then i thought he might like 'the watchmen' graphic novel. i loved it - and he's an artist and tattoo artist and likes graphic novels; and since the movie is coming out in the spring i thought it would be a nice gift. luckily amazon.com will gift-wrap it for me and send directly there. the rest of the remote-holiday family will have their gifts expressed on monday. whew! under the wire.









we're not doing any gifties for the babe, and have never really done gifts for each other. not bah humbug-y about it, just casual and dismissive of holidays in general - we'll get gifts for each other or ourselves whenever the mood strikes, and on holidays like to just focus on relaxing. but this year we feel like, we'd better enjoy this last casual holiday season - our kid is 8 months now and in the future we're going to have to make a policy decision about it one way or another.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I say thanks you know I got african in my family









Welcome, and I love the response!!!!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 







Rianne!

Indeed, welcome!!

Haven't been as active on our thread but just wanted to say today's my birthday. I wish I could muster up some more







: but I am grateful for another year added to my life.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Indeed, welcome!!

Haven't been as active on our thread but just wanted to say today's my birthday. I wish I could muster up some more







: but I am grateful for another year added to my life.










Happy birthday sweetness.


----------



## shayinme

Life is crazy right now with work, thankfully the center will be closed for the holidays so I can get a break soon, but the next few days are hectic. Donations are down and now I have a family with no gifts, so I am personally hitting up my friends since the next option is spending my own money, family is in need of coats and boots and the social service agencies here are swamped.









Welcome Rianne and Happy Birthday Rootz







:

Oyinmama, good plan as far as the baby, he is too young to care about gifts and believe me once they get older, they will be in your pocket. This year we lucked out Granddad actually splurged and got baby girl the wooden kitchen I have been wanting to get for the past year







:, so coupled with the stuff we got her she is all set.

My son though is just getting cash and a few odds and ends (ties...kid like ties) but with SAT's and ACT's plus a summer trip to DC (he is debating this summer) he knows he is in my pocket so its a lean Christmas for him. The hubby and I only give token gifts, he is taking me to the MAC counter this week so I can get some new makeup







.

Hope everyone is well, we are expecting more snow up here







.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

*Happy Birthday Rootzdawta*


----------



## Jannah6

It's nice to see that everyone is in a good mood, but I'm feeling very funky right now. Mostly because my husband is a clueless inconsiderate person, and it's not my pregnancy hormones talking. Right now I can't stand the sight of him







:







.
It's so hard dealing with a person that constantly has excuses for their behavior, is inconsistent, and shows no ownership for what they do. I'm fed up with him. I'm not looking forward to my c-section. thnak God for my aunt, if she weren't here I'd have to depend on him.
The worse part of it all is that I've been screaming at my children lately





















My patience is almost at zero. My 7 year old DD is not doing well in school or at home because of her ADHD. To top it off, I found out that I have gestational diabetes. I just feel like I'm going crazy.
I think I could handle a lot of what os going on, but my husbands behavior is driving me nuts. Thanks for listening to my vent ladies.


----------



## Draupadi

Jannah,







.
I'm sorry you feel so overwhelmed at such a stressful time. And GD...ugh.
I know what you mean about having a clueless DH. Sometimes I wonder if I should stick a fork in him to get him to pay attention to what a UAV he's acting like. I'm sure it doesn't help that you are pregnant, either.
Anyway, I just wanted to send you a hug.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
It's nice to see that everyone is in a good mood, but I'm feeling very funky right now. Mostly because my husband is a clueless inconsiderate person, and it's not my pregnancy hormones talking. Right now I can't stand the sight of him







:







.
It's so hard dealing with a person that constantly has excuses for their behavior, is inconsistent, and shows no ownership for what they do. I'm fed up with him. I'm not looking forward to my c-section. thnak God for my aunt, if she weren't here I'd have to depend on him.
The worse part of it all is that I've been screaming at my children lately





















My patience is almost at zero. My 7 year old DD is not doing well in school or at home because of her ADHD. To top it off, I found out that I have gestational diabetes. I just feel like I'm going crazy.
I think I could handle a lot of what os going on, but my husbands behavior is driving me nuts. Thanks for listening to my vent ladies.

No advice. Just lots of








and







:


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I think I could handle a lot of what os going on, but my husbands behavior is driving me nuts. Thanks for listening to my vent ladies.









Vent away. We all have our moments of near insanity. I have been pretty ho-hum this Holiday season. For some reason I just can't get into the spirit. My last day of work was friday and I haven't processed my feeling from that yet I guess. I was offered a job somewhere else but it has a few pros and a lot of cons so I really need to think about it. I think when I have more time I'll post about it here and see what you ladies think. DS has a birthday party to go to right now so I'll bbl.


----------



## futurmama8

: Happy birthday to you, happy birthday to you, happy birthday rootzdawta! Happy birthday to you!







:








Jannah6. Men can be pretty inconsiderate but keep your head up pretty lady. Is there a way you can maybe get some me time for a couple hours?? May go see a movie with a friend and take a nice long bath?? GD can be hard to deal with but I wish you the best


----------



## nnaemeka

HAPPY BIRTHDAY ROOTZDAWTA!!!!! i hope you have a great day and may your new year be filled with BLESSINGS!!!!!!







:
my beloved bestfriends are having a Capricorn/winter solstice gathering in Bed-Stuy as we speak. so i know all about you brilliant, crafty, witty, grounded goatfishes!

peace to xochimama and welcome futurmama8/rianne!!!
rambunctious curls: nice name--hope everything is okay.

Jannah6: sorry your DH is driving you crazy. so is mine







: i started off my Sunday morning p'd off but i vented--quite passionately---and he apologized for his cluelessness so now we're good.









Oyinmama: your holiday plans sound very exciting. have fun with the fam!

i totally feel you on the casual/dismissive vibes for the holidays. we don't really celebrate either but we're going to see my mom---the new grandmama--and my sister for XMAS. i'm excited---my sister hasn't met the baby/her niece yet, she's thrilled and of course (grand)mama is beside herself--getting a xmas dress for the baby and everything. lol. i'm looking forward to some good food though. we're bringing some kenke and pepper sauce with us. kenke is like a kind of fufu----yummmy---so we'll saute some fish and voila, Ghanaian delights for all.

Shay: yeah to mac counter treats!!! i used to be quite a mac-customer in my diva days. well actually my sister was the mac diva i'd borrow a lipstick here or there!!! yes, i was (am?) the bratty little sis! anyway, thats so cool your son is on debate team. my hs didn't have one but i always admired debating as a skill and an art form.

anyway, i too am enjoying the holidays with a tiny one with no requests--the pockets are still little hand-free, sort of! we are going to do some celebrating of Kwanzaa, that's a tradition i'd like to set. i bought some Kwanzaa cards to send out and we're going to a community gathering on dec 31. besides that, i don't have the candles or anything, i really should get Kwanzaa accessories and do it right.

oooh, i bought an Ergo carrier for our trip---from a mama on thebabywearer.com, i pray it comes by tuesday, or i'll be quite grumpy! we're flying xmas eve early morning i hope all goes smoothly. i love traveling but i don't really like flying too much. though in pre-mommy days on long international flight i like to drink wine, get cozy and watch movies







. this will be a short flight, nonstop, but the first airport experience/plane ride with baby so i'm a bit jittery.

ya know, the sun is out today for the first time in dayzzzzz, and i'm in such a better mood than i have been in all week.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Jannah,







, I have no advice either but vent away, mama. Hope he comes around.








:




























:







: Happy Birthday, Rootz! I know you are not exactly jumping off the walls but hope you have a wonderful day, nonetheless!

I changed my name cuz I got paranoid about work because I used to be a regular on the cannabis tribe. I just don't want my new acquantances to be able to find me and really know me. I have been thinking about the change for a while and it just seemed like the right time plus I thought of a username that I really like. thanks nnaemeka.









We have been snowed in and stuck in the house for the past week.. so not much festivities preparation going on around here. A lot of holiday parties have been cancelled and we haven't been able to shop (cuz we waited till the last minute) so, we have just been organizing around the house and watching movies. I'm feeling stir crazy.. gaah! but it's been a nice bonding time.


----------



## purplegirl

to the mamas who are going through. I've learned that marriage, like most relationships, has its seasons. I pray you get through this rough season soon. It can suck really badly when you feel your partner is not meeting your needs.

I love hearing how others are celebrating the holiday season. Mine, in a most unusual form, has kicked off with a series of parties. While I am enjoying the socializing, it is wearing me out. I also hate the temptation of delicious, but fattening food. I've learned to load up on healthy, low fat stuff before going though.









I wish you all the best, as the dawn of a new year surfaces. Peace

ETA: I am going to host a Kwanzaa like affair on Dec. 27th. I am opening my home to family and friends. We'll have good food, drinks and I've made gifts for everyone. This year I haven't planned any specific Kwanzaa activities, because my good friend whom I used to do this with, moved back to Detroit. This year we will be thankful for the time together and be thankful for each other!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY ROOTZDAWTA!!!!! i hope you have a great day and may your new year be filled with BLESSINGS!!!!!!







:
my beloved bestfriends are having a Capricorn/winter solstice gathering in Bed-Stuy as we speak. so i know all about you brilliant, crafty, witty, grounded goatfishes!

peace to xochimama and welcome futurmama8/rianne!!!
rambunctious curls: nice name--hope everything is okay.

Jannah6: sorry your DH is driving you crazy. so is mine







: i started off my Sunday morning p'd off but i vented--quite passionately---and he apologized for his cluelessness so now we're good.









Oyinmama: your holiday plans sound very exciting. have fun with the fam!

i totally feel you on the casual/dismissive vibes for the holidays. we don't really celebrate either but we're going to see my mom---the new grandmama--and my sister for XMAS. i'm excited---my sister hasn't met the baby/her niece yet, she's thrilled and of course (grand)mama is beside herself--getting a xmas dress for the baby and everything. lol. i'm looking forward to some good food though. we're bringing some kenke and pepper sauce with us. kenke is like a kind of fufu----yummmy---so we'll saute some fish and voila, Ghanaian delights for all.

Shay: yeah to mac counter treats!!! i used to be quite a mac-customer in my diva days. well actually my sister was the mac diva i'd borrow a lipstick here or there!!! yes, i was (am?) the bratty little sis! anyway, thats so cool your son is on debate team. my hs didn't have one but i always admired debating as a skill and an art form.

anyway, i too am enjoying the holidays with a tiny one with no requests--the pockets are still little hand-free, sort of! we are going to do some celebrating of Kwanzaa, that's a tradition i'd like to set. i bought some Kwanzaa cards to send out and we're going to a community gathering on dec 31. besides that, i don't have the candles or anything, i really should get Kwanzaa accessories and do it right.

oooh, i bought an Ergo carrier for our trip---from a mama on thebabywearer.com, i pray it comes by tuesday, or i'll be quite grumpy! we're flying xmas eve early morning i hope all goes smoothly. i love traveling but i don't really like flying too much. though in pre-mommy days on long international flight i like to drink wine, get cozy and watch movies







. this will be a short flight, nonstop, but the first airport experience/plane ride with baby so i'm a bit jittery.

ya know, the sun is out today for the first time in dayzzzzz, and i'm in such a better mood than i have been in all week.

The Ergo is my best friend when we fly. This is my other friend.


----------



## jeca

Oh yeah I forgot.







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

: rootz!!! Many blessings in your new year of life!








Jannah

Welcome Rianne!

Hope you have a great trip when you head out nnaneka!

Welcome back xochimama!

I just caught up again.







: Things are coming along here. Got the room painted last week and the curtains up today. Still some more arranging of things to do in the apartment, but really all we need to do is get a couple sets of sheets and do some laundry (baby clothes, cloth diapers that got here in the mail, and our stuff) and I will feel pretty settled with baby coming whenever s/he wants to. I also kinda feel like that now, though--SOMEONE could take care of the laundry if we really needed them to.

At my appointment yesterday my midwife said that since nothing has been really going on and the baby--contrary to popular belief--has not, in fact, "dropped," I probably have at least a week or so--fine with me! The cat has gotten pretty clingy lately, which is funny. And I'll be working from home this week, which is great--I don't have to count it in my leave time.

Everything else is pretty good. We went grocery shopping Saturday morning and DH swears the if a storm wants to come, it should come now because I went, perhaps, a bit overboard so we'd be pretty prepared







But I'll be home all day, all week, so I feel like it's fine.

Yesterday was the holiday event for m job and they totally surprised me--somehow, my co-workers had gotten a lot of the kids and some of the former staff to write things to the baby and they made a book, complete with binding and pictures called "What we learned from your mom" for the baby! It it the sweetest thing ever and is super touching--I keep looking at it and smiling.







:

And my sister (boy this is getting long- guess thats what sitting inside all day will do to you), who is also pregnant, and I keep calling each other and joking "are you in labor yet?" since everyone we know does that whenever they call us or we call them--annoying. She's due the day before me, hoping for a VBAC but her baby is insisting on staying transverse (sideways). The OB scheduled a c-section delivery for 8am 12/31 if she hasn't turned by then--3 days past her due date--so the clock is ticking over there. I hope she turns! either way, my sister is okay with whichever outcome but would really prefer a VBAC over another surgery.

ok, I'm done rambling







Stay warm ladies!


----------



## Jannah6

I want to thank all of you for your hugs,well wishes, and kind words. *Blomingstar*, what an awesome gift your co-workers presented you with







. I know your child will love reading it when s/he gets older.
Has your sister tried turning the baby? There is some good advice on MDC about getting the baby turned. My c-section was due to transverse positioning









*nnaemeka* , I have an ergo that you can borrow if yours doesn't arrive in time.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I want to thank all of you for your hugs,well wishes, and kind words. *Blomingstar*, what an awesome gift your co-workers presented you with







. I know your child will love reading it when s/he gets older.
Has your sister tried turning the baby? There is some good advice on MDC about getting the baby turned. My c-section was due to transverse positioning









*nnaemeka* , *I have an ergo that you can borrow if yours doesn't arrive in time.*


That's the spirit of sisterhood that I really appreciate.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I want to thank all of you for your hugs,well wishes, and kind words. *Blomingstar*, what an awesome gift your co-workers presented you with







. I know your child will love reading it when s/he gets older.
Has your sister tried turning the baby? There is some good advice on MDC about getting the baby turned. My c-section was due to transverse positioning









*nnaemeka* , I have an ergo that you can borrow if yours doesn't arrive in time.

Yeah, she's been on the spinning babies website and trying all sots of things for weeks! But the baby seems to turn and then turn back, but she's also no sure which end is up so she's hoping the OB will make that clear at her visit this week.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Yeah, she's been on the spinning babies website and trying all sots of things for weeks! But the baby seems to turn and then turn back, but she's also no sure which end is up so she's hoping the OB will make that clear at her visit this week.

Bloomingstar, I am so excited for you. It sounds like you have a lot of people around you who love and appreciate you.

If your sister, is open, hypnosis works very well with helping to get babies to turn. It doesn't take long and is very effective!


----------



## rootzdawta

I know a few women who have had success with chiropractors who turned the baby around.


----------



## Arike

to you Jannah I totally know how you feel in regards to your DH. I had a few meltdowns with my DH while I was pregnant because I felt like it was pulling teeth to get him to do things for me, like the dishes!

I haven't been on the thread that much lately because I have been preparing for my LO's first airplane trip. We are going to visit extended family and staying with my granny. She is so thrilled to finally meet her great grandbaby!









Happy belated b-day Rootzdawta!

Anyway, I am going to try to get in a nap before we have to start getting ready to leave. Squeezing in a weight watchers meeting before the car service comes to bring us to the airport. It is SO cold outside!







: And it's even colder in Chicago, where we are headed. It is currently 2 degrees but with the windchill it is MINUS 9 degrees!







:

Happy Holidays to everyone!


----------



## Jannah6

Have fun Arike. I'm so happy for your grandmother, what an honor to be a great grand mother. I keep saying, in 7-8 years I could be a grandmother. I know it sounds crazy, but I can't wait to enjoy my grandkids.

*ETA:* DH came home for about 30 minutes acting like everything was alright, but I'm still being chilly towards him


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

*ETA:* DH came home for about 30 minutes acting like everything was alright, but I'm still being chilly towards him









Lol I do the same thing to my bf.


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

It has been such a long time since I have posted here! I have been up to my eyeballs in activities that don't leave a lot of time for MDC.
In the last few days, I have posted in the political forums here so I decided it was time to come here and post.
I have been under the weather for the past few days(I caught that nasty stomach bug that is going around) so I have been laying low in my house.
But I have to get out today to finish up all of the last minute food shopping for the big annual gathering that we have at our house on the first night of Kwanzaa(it also happens to be my wedding anniversary!), so wish me luck!
Here hoping that everyone here has a Happy & Healthy Holiday Season!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Oh, and one more thing,

This is to All of the New Members here:







*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*








I hope to see many more posts from you!









**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## Jannah6

: Happy Anniversary







: Erika


----------



## purplegirl

Happy Anniversary Ericka!

Merry Christmas to all who celebrate!







:


----------



## splendid

I hope to those who celebrate at this time of year, that you are all having a good time with family and friends.

We are having a good time, my dh is off of work until next week so we may visit some friends. It is nice to have him home, without hime being in his work cave.

How is everyone doing?


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

We had a wonderful christmas. The snow







: kept us indoors, so there was no stress which for me, always accompanies when visiting mil every year. I get that christmas is all about families coming together. but let me tell you, there are very few people I do not get along with in my life and dh's family is one of them.

Anyway, Fil came over for christmas dinner and we had a wonderful time. I worried for nothing! I wish we could have christmas at home every year. I tried to approach dh from the angle that FIL (who is divorced from mil) spends christmas alone when we visit mil who has tons of family members around her. So, we should stay at home and have him over. Plus,Amira was over the moon with fil being here. She absolutely loves her grandpa.







She even cried when he left. She doesn't even like mil because she totally gets the vibe that mil cares more for her other grandkids. she's a smart, intuitive kid. So, this is the one issue (and a major one) that we do not see eye to eye, and it has caused a huge rift between us.

I was telling my friend this over the phone last night and he was yelling in the background that I should watch what I say about HIS family. Ugh. How embarrassing. I was telling her that this was the best christmas ever, too. I'm still annoyed.

Anyway, we are just hanging out today. The snow is melting







: and Bil and his family are stopping by on their way home.

Hope you all are having a great holiday. With the quiet around this tribe, I'm guessing y'all are having a busy, exciting holiday.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rambunctiouscurls* 
We had a wonderful christmas. The snow







: kept us indoors, so there was no stress which for me, always accompanies when visiting mil every year. I get that christmas is all about families coming together. but let me tell you, there are very few people I do not get along with in my life and dh's family is one of them.

Anyway, Fil came over for christmas dinner and we had a wonderful time. I worried for nothing! I wish we could have christmas at home every year. I tried to approach dh from the angle that FIL (who is divorced from mil) spends christmas alone when we visit mil who has tons of family members around her. So, we should stay at home and have him over. Plus,Amira was over the moon with fil being here. She absolutely loves her grandpa.







She even cried when he left. She doesn't even like mil because she totally gets the vibe that mil cares more for her other grandkids. she's a smart, intuitive kid. So, this is the one issue (and a major one) that we do not see eye to eye, and it has caused a huge rift between us.

I was telling my friend this over the phone last night and he was yelling in the background that I should watch what I say about HIS family. Ugh. How embarrassing. I was telling her that this was the best christmas ever, too. I'm still annoyed.

Anyway, we are just hanging out today. The snow is melting







: and Bil and his family are stopping by on their way home.

Hope you all are having a great holiday. With the quiet around this tribe, I'm guessing y'all are having a busy, exciting holiday.









Hey sis. This is drive by post. Glad your holiday was great! I like it when things turn out better than expected. Mine was great too. I am having a small open house tonight








Blessings and peace to all of yall!!
Lisa


----------



## shayinme

Happy Anniversary Ericka







:, good to see you around here.

Hope everyone who celebrates this time of year had a great holiday, me...I am just relaxing and recovering from a busy past week with work. Thankfully since the schools are on vacation it means we are closed too though I will have some work to do. Right now I am chilling, been eating way too much so gotta get back on my game come tomorrow but I figure once a year I can eat







.

Anyway just wanted to say hello since its been quiet here.

Shay


----------



## Bloomingstar

hi! still here, still pregnant







I think we have gotten almost everything done...or done enough for me to feel ok with whenever baby decides to make her or his entrance. I'm 39 weeks, 5 days--we'll see. So far, I haven't gotten any action labor-wise. People keep asking if I am sick of being pregnant but I'm ok. I know that one way or another, I'll be meeting this baby really soon!









I hope you all are having a wonderful holiday time/time off/time with family and friends.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Indeed, welcome!!

Haven't been as active on our thread but just wanted to say today's my birthday. I wish I could muster up some more







: but I am grateful for another year added to my life.

















:Happy Belated Birthday Rootzdawta!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hello Sisterfriends,

It has been such a long time since I have posted here! I have been up to my eyeballs in activities that don't leave a lot of time for MDC.
In the last few days, I have posted in the political forums here so I decided it was time to come here and post.
I have been under the weather for the past few days(I caught that nasty stomach bug that is going around) so I have been laying low in my house.
But I have to get out today to finish up all of the last minute food shopping for the big annual gathering that we have at our house on the first night of Kwanzaa(it also happens to be my wedding anniversary!), so wish me luck!
Here hoping that everyone here has a Happy & Healthy Holiday Season!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:









:Happy Belated Anniversary Ericka!







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rambunctiouscurls* 
We had a wonderful christmas. The snow







: kept us indoors, so there was no stress which for me, always accompanies when visiting mil every year. I get that christmas is all about families coming together. but let me tell you, there are very few people I do not get along with in my life and dh's family is one of them.

Anyway, Fil came over for christmas dinner and we had a wonderful time. I worried for nothing! I wish we could have christmas at home every year. I tried to approach dh from the angle that FIL (who is divorced from mil) spends christmas alone when we visit mil who has tons of family members around her. So, we should stay at home and have him over. Plus,Amira was over the moon with fil being here. She absolutely loves her grandpa.







She even cried when he left. She doesn't even like mil because she totally gets the vibe that mil cares more for her other grandkids. she's a smart, intuitive kid. So, this is the one issue (and a major one) that we do not see eye to eye, and it has caused a huge rift between us.

I was telling my friend this over the phone last night and he was yelling in the background that I should watch what I say about HIS family. Ugh. How embarrassing. I was telling her that this was the best christmas ever, too. I'm still annoyed.

Anyway, we are just hanging out today. The snow is melting







: and Bil and his family are stopping by on their way home.

Hope you all are having a great holiday. With the quiet around this tribe, I'm guessing y'all are having a busy, exciting holiday.









What is it with in-laws? I hope that you and your DH will come to a holiday decision on which both of you agree.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
hi! still here, still pregnant








I think we have gotten almost everything done...or done enough for me to feel ok with whenever baby decides to make her or his entrance. I'm 39 weeks, 5 days--we'll see. So far, I haven't gotten any action labor-wise. People keep asking if I am sick of being pregnant but I'm ok. I know that one way or another, I'll be meeting this baby really soon!









I hope you all are having a wonderful holiday time/time off/time with family and friends.

Get all the rest that you can. All that I wanted to do was play with DS when he was born, or watch him as he slept.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
hi! still here, still pregnant







I think we have gotten almost everything done...or done enough for me to feel ok with whenever baby decides to make her or his entrance. I'm 39 weeks, 5 days--we'll see. So far, I haven't gotten any action labor-wise. People keep asking if I am sick of being pregnant but I'm ok. I know that one way or another, I'll be meeting this baby really soon!









I hope you all are having a wonderful holiday time/time off/time with family and friends.

I was thinking about you and am waiting with bated breath to hear of the birth of your little one.


----------



## jeca

Why am I just now hearing about this? Anyone else seen it?

http://video.google.com/videosearch?...-revision&cd=2

Wow, just wow.








http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/...ion=cnn_latest


----------



## AndrewsMother

And people wonder why Michelle made the comment about feeling pride in her country.......we have too many magic ***** moments.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Why am I just now hearing about this? Anyone else seen it?

http://video.google.com/videosearch?...-revision&cd=2

Wow, just wow.








http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/...ion=cnn_latest









:


----------



## shayinme

Yeah, I heard about it a few days ago







:.


----------



## Jannah6

That's just sad and ridiculous on so many levels


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
And people wonder why Michelle made the comment about feeling pride in her country.......we have too many magic ***** moments.


yeah that! I've heard reports of people trying to justify the video--it was a parody







give me a break!


----------



## Bloomingstar

oh WOW. people are just...







:

no action yet, although I think baby was definitely wiggling down further during the night. My sister is having her baby right now! Or she should've had her by now--her c-section was scheduled for 8am so I figure I'll hear from her or my BIL sometime this afternoon, or at least that's what she guessed last night.


----------



## Jannah6

*Bloomingstar*, I hope your sister has an easy recovery and is able to fully enjoy her LO.
Wishing you the labor that you desire


----------



## AndrewsMother

Bloomigstar, best wishes to your sister. I may be the only person who will ever say this, but I enjoyed my C-section recovery and I wish that I had taken advantage of it. I wanted to rush back into life. C-sections are not pleasant, but it was a wonderful time to enjoy my little one as I healed. All that I could do was walk and sit with him cuddled on my lap.

and as for you.....any day now!!!







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Bloomingstar*, I hope your sister has an easy recovery and is able to fully enjoy her LO.
Wishing you the labor that you desire









Thanks! Just got the call from BIL







: everything went well, mom and baby are doing gret. She's another one of their clone children--the other two look EXACTLY alike, although the 2 year old is starting to grow into his own face a bit. Baby Neliah is 7lbs, 7oz, 18in long and has a full head of hair, according to the proud papa. I'll probably talk to my sister later on this evening.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Thanks! Just got the call from BIL







: everything went well, mom and baby are doing gret. She's another one of their clone children--the other two look EXACTLY alike, although the 2 year old is starting to grow into his own face a bit. Baby Neliah is 7lbs, 7oz, 18in long and has a full head of hair, according to the proud papa. I'll probably talk to my sister later on this evening.







:

Sweet!







Congrats to the parents and you Auntie!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Congratulations to your sister!!!


----------



## jeca

Congrats to you sister!









Do you ladies have plans to ring in the new year? Dh and I would love to go somewhere as a couple. I don't think we have been out together for New Year's Eve since I was pregnant with my now five year old. I've been looking around but it seems like the same old club scenes are having their same over priced get togethers. Then when I do find something that looks really nice like some of the Hotel Celebrations they are way beyond budget. Oh well, anyone else?


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Congrats to you sister!









Do you ladies have plans to ring in the new year? Dh and I would love to go somewhere as a couple. I don't think we have been out together for New Year's Eve since I was pregnant with my now five year old. I've been looking around but it seems like the same old club scenes are having their same over priced get togethers. Then when I do find something that looks really nice like some of the Hotel Celebrations they are way beyond budget. Oh well, anyone else?

We were going out with one of DH's friends and his partner, someplace to ring it in, but as DH just lost his job today, those plans (and the cab rides involved) might have to be pushed to the back burner - we might just stay home, and whoop it up there.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
We were going out with one of DH's friends and his partner, someplace to ring it in, but as DH just lost his job today, those plans (and the cab rides involved) might have to be pushed to the back burner - we might just stay home, and whoop it up there.









I'm sorry to hear that.


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

Thank you to all for the well wishes! We had a wonderful anniversary/first night of Kwanzaa party and we are looking forward to New Year's Eve, spending it with friends(and all of their kids too!) playing games and eating good food at a gathering that we are hosting. I wish that you all lived closer, because I would love to have you all come too!








Bloomingstar, congratulations to your sister!







: And count me in as one more here who can't wait to hear your birth story!








About the RNC "parody"







:, I find it quite interesting how little press this particular story is getting considering how much play Michelle's and Rev. Wright's comments got earlier this year. Can you say "double standard" anyone?








But I believe that this type of story needs to serve as a reminder that we still have quite a ways to go as a nation toward our goal of racial equality here in the US. Because while Obama's election signals the great progress that we have achieved as a nation, the campaign also exposed many of the areas where that progress has not yet happened.
I hope that you all have a safe and happy New Year's!







:
**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JustKiya* 
We were going out with one of DH's friends and his partner, someplace to ring it in, but as DH just lost his job today, those plans (and the cab rides involved) might have to be pushed to the back burner - we might just stay home, and whoop it up there.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 







I'm sorry to hear that.

Me Too!!














:







:









**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## purplegirl

Oh Kiya.







I am so sorry!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Kiya I am sorry about your DH's job loss. Hopefully something better is around the corner.


----------



## Jannah6

Kiya, I'm so sorry that your DH has lost his job







I hope he finds something really soon.


----------



## JustKiya

Thank ya'll for the well wishes. It's a - cyclical thing, until he finds the right restaurant/chef/kitchen to work in - it's a lot of bouncing around, for a while.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Kiya, I'm so sorry that your DH has lost his job







I hope he finds something really soon.

I second that!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Bloomigstar, best wishes to your sister. I may be the only person who will ever say this, but I enjoyed my C-section recovery and I wish that I had taken advantage of it. I wanted to rush back into life. C-sections are not pleasant, but it was a wonderful time to enjoy my little one as I healed. All that I could do was walk and sit with him cuddled on my lap.

and as for you.....any day now!!!







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sweet!







Congrats to the parents and you Auntie!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Congrats to you sister!










Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Bloomingstar, congratulations to your sister!







: And count me in as one more here who can't wait to hear your birth story!









Thanks everyone! My sister gave us all a scare last night--she had to go back in for surgery because she kept bleeding and couldn't even lift her legs for her doctor to try to just do an exam to check things out. They weren't sure at first if it was that there was still a bit of placen left or what, but it turned out to be that there was just some uterine lining that wouldn't detach and she wasn't clotting...so a blood transfusion and some rest later, she is doing and feeling much better, baby is still nursing like a champ, and we can all calm down again.









As for New Year's, I dunno! Last year I was attending a friend's birth as her doula...maybe 2009 will start off with another birth


----------



## jeca

Ugh, I'm so annoyed. I woke this morning to find my kids trampoline mangled and torn apart in my neighbor's yard.







I really hate living here sometimes. When they say high wind warning the they are not kidding.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Ugh, I'm so annoyed. I woke this morning to find my kids trampoline mangled and torn apart in my neighbor's yard.







I really hate living here sometimes. When they say high wind warning the they are not kidding.


Sorry mama. We've had high winds here today, but nothing like you've described.


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends,

Well because of the weather(lots of snow overnight-and still falling)we are having to cancel our New Year's Eve party.(







I was really looking forward to it too!)
Hopefully, everyone can make it here tomorrow after they clear the roads around here and we will celebrate then instead(and it will still be New Year's!







)
Here's hoping that you all have a safe and happy New Year's celebration!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-








-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## purplegirl

Happy New Year to all of your wonderful women.
We didn't get any snow but the winds are very high. I have been invited to a party but still on the fence as to if I am going. I'd much rather chill with my dh in front of the fireplace and enjoy the stillness.
Please be safe!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Happy New Year everyone!







:

I, for one, am starting the new year off by refusing to answer my phone. If one more person who I interact with on a regular basis calls me to ask if I have had the baby yet because they didnt get a call so they were just wondering...







: clearly I am wearing a prosthetic belly just to play with people's minds.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Happy New Year everyone!







:

I, for one, am starting the new year off by refusing to answer my phone. If one more person who I interact with on a regular basis calls me to ask if I have had the baby yet because they didnt get a call so they were just wondering...







: clearly I am wearing a prosthetic belly just to play with people's minds.









LoL . . . good move girl!!








Wishing everyone a very happy, prosperous and fulfilling new year!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Happy New Year everyone!







:

I, for one, am starting the new year off by refusing to answer my phone. If one more person who I interact with on a regular basis calls me to ask if I have had the baby yet because they didnt get a call so they were just wondering...







: clearly I am wearing a prosthetic belly just to play with people's minds.










sooooooooooo....has the baby arrived?

J/k









Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Ugh, I'm so annoyed. I woke this morning to find my kids trampoline mangled and torn apart in my neighbor's yard.







I really hate living here sometimes. When they say high wind warning the they are not kidding.


were you able to salvage the frame?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Happy New Years everyone!!!


----------



## JustKiya

Happy New Year, Ladies!!!


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
were you able to salvage the frame?

No unfortunatly the frame and the safety netting took the bulk of the damage.
DH and I were child free so we decided at the very last minute to go out. We ended up at a club downtown that I didn't know we were going to or I would have dressed differently. This is teh first time we went out dancing together in at least 2-3 years and we haven't been out on New Year's in about six so it was nice. I did feel very out of shape though as the night progressed and I started getting leg cramps and a stitch in my side.







Other wise we had fun. Stopped got something to eat, fooled around a bit and didn't get to bed till 3:00 It was nice.


----------



## futurmama8

happy new year ladies







:


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Happy New Year everyone!







:

I, for one, am starting the new year off by refusing to answer my phone. If one more person who I interact with on a regular basis calls me to ask if I have had the baby yet because they didnt get a call so they were just wondering...







: clearly I am wearing a prosthetic belly just to play with people's minds.









Yeah, everyone and their mother was calling me when my due date came and went! It's so annoying! I would be having contractions on and off, and people were calling me asking me if I had the baby.

Anyway, Happy New Year everyone!


----------



## oyinmama

@ bloomingstar - ahhh, those 'is s/he here yet' calls!







our LO came a week early so i didn't get too many, but they did start drifting in during the whole last month. luckily, our friends are family are WELL trained to the fact that we don't answer our phone... and that we check voicemail once a week or so







- i highly recommend cultivating such an awareness in your loved ones!

happy new year, ladies!!

wishing everybody prosperity, joy, health and love in the new year, and peace peace peace to the world.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Happy New Year!







:

Bloomingstar, , but I do remember how exasperating the (is the baby here yet phone calls- were. NOt answering your phone or better yet, letting them know YOU will call once the baby arrives just might be worth a try.


----------



## Sugarshoc

Happy New Year ladies!!!!







:







:







:







:







:


----------



## Autumn C.

Happy New Year all!

I know I haven't been posting lately but I've been lurking just too sleep deprived and busy with holiday-ness to post but I hope everyone is well.


----------



## purplegirl

Happy New Year! I'm almost melancholic as the holiday season comes to an end. It was a whirlwind of parties, friends, family and I loved every minute.
Yet, I'm tired and happy to have some solitude in my home. I've set some goals for this new year, though I'm hesitant to call them resolutions. I'm working on things that I have been putting off and finally, I am slowing down to assure completion!
I send love to all and second Oyinmama's call for PEACE!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Happy Monday! I'm 41 weeks today. I actually went back to work because sitting at home was making me too stir crazy and it'll take my mind off things. And it means my leave hasn't started yet.







I have stopped answering the phone (texts, emails, and facebook comments) asking if the baby is here. I've also put the word out to a few key people that everyone had better damn well stop calling me--when there's news, you'll get it! We had a pretty funny moment yesterday, though. DH was calling his mom, who lives in the Caribbean, to ask a question about making coconut oil. She answered the phone REALLY excited: "YEEEEEEEEEEEES?" hahahaha. she was not amused when all he said was "I have a question about making coconut oil."







We feel like we can't even call anyone just to say hello or ask a question now--they're all way too expectant







:


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Happy Monday! I'm 41 weeks today. I actually went back to work because sitting at home was making me too stir crazy and it'll take my mind off things. And it means my leave hasn't started yet.







I have stopped answering the phone (texts, emails, and facebook comments) asking if the baby is here. I've also put the word out to a few key people that everyone had better damn well stop calling me--when there's news, you'll get it! We had a pretty funny moment yesterday, though. DH was calling his mom, who lives in the Caribbean, to ask a question about making coconut oil. She answered the phone REALLY excited: "YEEEEEEEEEEEES?" hahahaha. she was not amused when all he said was "I have a question about making coconut oil."







We feel like we can't even call anyone just to say hello or ask a question now--they're all way too expectant







:

this is too funny! my muma was just watching my EVERY move before i had my dd. i couldn't get up to pee without her in my grill. annoying then, funny now!!! yeah, i stopped calling and answering the phone. of course this made folks certain i had had the baby and just hadn't called! which led to more drama and hurt feelings...i went 41 1/2 weeks...and i was very grumpy those last weeks. working probably would have done me good. hugs to you Bloomingstar!!! its such an exciting and beautiful time, remember to enjoy your last mama-free moments!

anyway, HAPPY NEW YEAR to all!!! peace, prosperity and love to world!
any resolutions folks want to share??? i have a handful but my most important intention is to start my day with prayerful mindfulness each morning. time to re-center in spirit...


----------



## JustKiya

Argggh, Bloomingstar, I feel for you, I do. This is why I fully plan on lying about my due date, and giving myself 3 weeks of padding







By the time they start with that, I'll be at 40 weeks, already.









My only resolution this year was Change.


----------



## Jannah6

*Kiya*, I didn't know that you were pregnant, congratulations. When are you due


----------



## Bloomingstar

I guess my new year's resolution is to have a baby? haha. Still hanging on over here! I had the biophysical profile tests today and baby is doing well. I am hoping the full moon on Friday will draw her or him out


----------



## Jannah6

*nak*









Bloomingstar I was just thinking about you. Glad to see everything is alright. Because of my gestational diabetes I'll be having my weekly NST's and BPP starting tomorrow







. I don't want to know the sex of the baby so I hve to be sure not to look at the screen.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I guess my new year's resolution is to have a baby? haha. Still hanging on over here! I had the biophysical profile tests today and baby is doing well. I am hoping the full moon on Friday will draw her or him out

















:


----------



## purplegirl

My intentions for this year are to do more of the things I love: reading more, watching more films and traveling. I lost 15 pounds and am exercising on a regular basis--not part of my new year plan but more of a life plan.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
My intentions for this year are to do more of the things I love: reading more, watching more films and traveling. I lost 15 pounds and am exercising on a regular basis--not part of my new year plan but more of a life plan.

Congratulations on the weight loss!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Congratulations on the weight loss!









:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*nak*









Bloomingstar I was just thinking about you. Glad to see everything is alright. Because of my gestational diabetes I'll be having my weekly NST's and BPP starting tomorrow







. I don't want to know the sex of the baby so I hve to be sure not to look at the screen.

Have you always waited until birth to discover the gender of the child?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I guess my new year's resolution is to have a baby? haha. Still hanging on over here! I had the biophysical profile tests today and baby is doing well. I am hoping the full moon on Friday will draw her or him out









Hang in there Mama, both my kids arrived between 41-42 weeks so I know how annoying it is when you reach that point you just want to meet your baby.

Congrats Lisa on the weight loss and changes!

Sorry I have been MIA, just tired...my son went back to his Dad's which is always emotional but this time the reality that he is almost an adult hit me hard.







In a few weeks he will be 17, right now he is getting ready to take his ACT and SAT and diligently looking at colleges. He is already talking about our summer plans since as he put it this is his last summer to be a kid, which I agree since next summer he will need to work before he starts college.

I swear they grow up so fast. Where does the time go. Also he is in love







, his girlfriend took him to the airport when he came out here so I realized this is the first real love. Again I am happy but sad. My baby is almost a man...sigh

Plus back to work this week, so much need and resources are so limited. Even the food pantry has been unable to provide food for our program as they have done for years because they are out







. The kids come to the program and they are hungry, one day a little boy was saving oranges to eat at home. In my almost 2 mos at the new job I have been buying stuff out of pocket but dh just had his second largest client start scaling back so its tight at my house. Yet I have almost 20 kids a day who are in need of food, etc. Ugh...

Shay


----------



## JustKiya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Kiya*, I didn't know that you were pregnant, congratulations. When are you due









Hah. I'm not.







I've been TTC'ing for almost two years now, so I've had a lot of time to plot, and plan about things that most first timers only figure out when they are pregnant with the second.









Shay - do you have an AngelFood Ministries near you? It does cost, but it's cheap, and it might be able to give the kids at least a little something....


----------



## purplegirl

Thank you ladies. I'm quite pleased with my progress--slow and steady.

I totally feel you on struggling with the lack of resources in spite of growing needs. I have no answers or suggestions either, but I know I can't keep going in my pocket lest I end up in the poor house. I've been soliciting assistance from friends, community leaders and churches. Surprisingly, I've gotten pretty positive responses, with people contributing what they are able to. I also found a local church that has a store where they sell dented, bruised products from COSTCO, for little to nothing. I go there often to see what I can pick up for my patients and keep it stored in my office.
The schools where I do consulting, have been a surprising resource too. You might want to check with your local schools to see what they have available for children.
It's tough out there and Mr. Obama just prophesied that it might get dramatically worse before it gets better







:

Thinking about you Bloomingstar!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I totally feel you on struggling with the lack of resources in spite of growing needs. I have no answers or suggestions either, but I know I can't keep going in my pocket lest I end up in the poor house. I've been soliciting assistance from friends, community leaders and churches. Surprisingly, I've gotten pretty positive responses, with people contributing what they are able to. I also found a local church that has a store where they sell dented, bruised products from COSTCO, for little to nothing. I go there often to see what I can pick up for my patients and keep it stored in my office.
The schools where I do consulting, have been a surprising resource too. You might want to check with your local schools to see what they have available for children.
It's tough out there and Mr. Obama just prophesied that it might get dramatically worse before it gets better







:


Sadly we are funded by local churches,a grant from the town and United Way and giving from the churches have been down greatly. Most folks in our area are aware of our organization but it seems the economic downturn is hitting everyone







. The food pantries and food rescues generally supply our food but their donations are down and the need is up.

I am actually hoping to talk to a few local places like Starbucks and see if they might donate some items to us. Our budget is so tight that we really don't have the money to buy food long term though I have been hitting places like Big Lots.

These are really scary times.

Shay


----------



## jeca

to Lisa and Shay. It breaks my heart reading about what you have to see everyday. I hope some better things come about in '09 I know I read th eopposite but I'm hopeful anyway. And congrats on your weightloss Lisa. Your still my she-ro









Nothing new here.


----------



## eilonwy

Hi everyone. I should have my computer back Monday. I've missed it. Hope all is well.


----------



## ambylove

I just want to pop in and say 'hi'. I'm new to finding a tribe, and to the forum actually, but I am a woman of color (or at least half) and looking forward to getting to know everyone. I don't have any children yet, but I am looking forward to starting a family soon.

=D

I hope everyone had a beautiful new year!


----------



## Jannah6

Amber


----------



## nnaemeka

peace and welcome Ambylove!

how are you Bloomingstar







?

Shay and Purplegirl, give thanks for doing the WORK! what about hitting up some local bakeries and even restaurants...i used to work in food service and i know tons of food gets thrown out at the end of the night







. a couple of months ago, some friends went to a Panera at closing time and came out with a duffel load of bagels and pastries. perhaps discussing it with a manager? or doing the dumpster drive? (in my Cali Food Not Bombs days we used to do this and eat well!)

greetings Eilonwy, its been awhile!

where's everybody at? how's 2009 treating you so far?

i'm back to work this coming week. i know we discussed SAHM vs WOHM and all...and while i'm excited, i'm freaking out on how i will find the balance between teaching, writing and family life. i know its possible but quite a challenge.

sending you all affirmations of abundance and fortitude!


----------



## eilonwy

They're actually really nice at Panera; Around here, they all send the end of the day bread to a food bank. If it's a holiday and nobody from the food bank is coming and you show up at closing, they'll give you whatever you ask for. I remember being there on the 4th of July one year at closing, because my mom was in the hospital (she was... well, quite literally at death's door) and I walked out with bagels and cookies and danish and all kinds of stuff. It was very nice because my sister and brother hadn't eaten all day. But yeah... no need to dumpster dive there, at least. A lot of places are like that.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ambylove* 
I just want to pop in and say 'hi'. I'm new to finding a tribe, and to the forum actually, but I am a woman of color (or at least half) and looking forward to getting to know everyone. I don't have any children yet, but I am looking forward to starting a family soon.

=D

I hope everyone had a beautiful new year!


Whoa. How did I miss all of the new posts









Welcome Ambylove







:

Shay, it's hard to stay motivated in the face of such difficulties, but I try to find hope by empowering my clients. I have always been a resourceful person, so when I 'join' with a client and we are able to connect the dots, it is an awesome experience. It sounds like you do a terrific job of that!

nnaemeka, the best as you combine motherhood with working









Rynna, I had forgotten about Panera's generosity. Thanks for the reminder! I might try and use them to feed some of the girls at the alternative school where i do consulting


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace and welcome Ambylove!

how are you Bloomingstar







?

Shay and Purplegirl, give thanks for doing the WORK! what about hitting up some local bakeries and even restaurants...i used to work in food service and i know tons of food gets thrown out at the end of the night







. a couple of months ago, some friends went to a Panera at closing time and came out with a duffel load of bagels and pastries. perhaps discussing it with a manager? or doing the dumpster drive? (in my Cali Food Not Bombs days we used to do this and eat well!)

greetings Eilonwy, its been awhile!

where's everybody at? how's 2009 treating you so far?

i'm back to work this coming week. i know we discussed SAHM vs WOHM and all...and while i'm excited, i'm freaking out on how i will find the balance between teaching, writing and family life. i know its possible but quite a challenge.

sending you all affirmations of abundance and fortitude!

Welcome, Amber!

I'm doing.

Still pregnant--41 weeks, 5 days. getting a little weary. hoping the full moon will bring baby out. I'll have to go back to the hospital for another biophysical profile on Monday (went on wednesday and got a 10 out of 10







) if I don't have baby tonight or tomorrow







Baby is doing just fine though, which is great, so I am holding on over here


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
My intentions for this year are to do more of the things I love: reading more, watching more films and traveling. I lost 15 pounds and am exercising on a regular basis--not part of my new year plan but more of a life plan.

Those are wonderful goals. Mine includes reading more too. I just finished Revolutionary Road by Richard Yates. great book, I totally recommend it, if you are into the examining of married life in the suburbs. I cried by the end of it. I can't wait to see the movie. I hope it's almost as good as the book.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Hang in there Mama, both my kids arrived between 41-42 weeks so I know how annoying it is when you reach that point you just want to meet your baby.

Congrats Lisa on the weight loss and changes!

Sorry I have been MIA, just tired...my son went back to his Dad's which is always emotional but this time the reality that he is almost an adult hit me hard.







In a few weeks he will be 17, right now he is getting ready to take his ACT and SAT and diligently looking at colleges. He is already talking about our summer plans since as he put it this is his last summer to be a kid, which I agree since next summer he will need to work before he starts college.

I swear they grow up so fast. Where does the time go. Also he is in love







, his girlfriend took him to the airport when he came out here so I realized this is the first real love. Again I am happy but sad. My baby is almost a man...sigh

Plus back to work this week, so much need and resources are so limited. Even the food pantry has been unable to provide food for our program as they have done for years because they are out







. The kids come to the program and they are hungry, one day a little boy was saving oranges to eat at home. In my almost 2 mos at the new job I have been buying stuff out of pocket but dh just had his second largest client start scaling back so its tight at my house. Yet I have almost 20 kids a day who are in need of food, etc. Ugh...

Shay

Ooo, that is so exciting about your son. So bittersweet that they grow up so fast, though.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 







to Lisa and Shay. It breaks my heart reading about what you have to see everyday. I hope some better things come about in '09 I know I read th eopposite but I'm hopeful anyway. And congrats on your weightloss Lisa. Your still my she-ro









Nothing new here.









:







to you both

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ambylove* 
I just want to pop in and say 'hi'. I'm new to finding a tribe, and to the forum actually, but I am a woman of color (or at least half) and looking forward to getting to know everyone. I don't have any children yet, but I am looking forward to starting a family soon.

=D

I hope everyone had a beautiful new year!










what's your other half, if you don't mind me asking.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Welcome, Amber!

I'm doing.

Still pregnant--41 weeks, 5 days. getting a little weary. hoping the full moon will bring baby out. I'll have to go back to the hospital for another biophysical profile on Monday (went on wednesday and got a 10 out of 10







) if I don't have baby tonight or tomorrow







Baby is doing just fine though, which is great, so I am holding on over here









awww.. Amira came at a week and a half too. I know everybody probably is full of advice but I gotta throw mine in there.. have tons of sex! If anything, it helps pass the time.








We've been doing great over here. The snow is finally gone, so life's back to normal around here. nothing new to report.
hope everyone's having a lovely weekend.


----------



## Jannah6

*Bloomingstar*, hoping something happens for you soon


----------



## Brown Lioness

Hi ladies, I'm still here, mostly lurking, but Ive been bopping all around MDC.

Technically, 2009 is the year hubby and I agreed to TTC our first. BUT, i don't think we are QUITE ready just yet. Hubby and I want to be a wahm family, sigh, so yea, we been workin on that.

I wish you all a Happy New Year and many blessings to you and yours! I will try to be better at posting in here, I do miss you ladies









Oh and Welcome Ambylove!

*commencing babywatch for Bloomingstar*


----------



## Jannah6

*NAK*

Hello *Brown Lioness*







, I don't think we've met.

Ladies, I'm going to go to the library and checkout some books on hair for my DD's. I'm thinking about Happy To Be Nappy and I Love My Hair. Any other suggestions?


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*NAK*

Hello *Brown Lioness*







, I don't think we've met.

Ladies, I'm going to go to the library and checkout some books on hair for my DD's. I'm thinking about Happy To Be Nappy and I Love My Hair. Any other suggestions?

Hey there lovely woman Jannah6, how are you? I've seen you around MDC, but ima shy booty, so i prolly haven't said hello yet, lol.


----------



## Marisgirl

Joining the group.....


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*NAK*

Hello *Brown Lioness*







, I don't think we've met.

Ladies, I'm going to go to the library and checkout some books on hair for my DD's. I'm thinking about Happy To Be Nappy and I Love My Hair. Any other suggestions?

I love _I Love My Hair_; I bought it for my niece when she was little.







There's another book called Nappy Hair which is really cute.







It's not exactly PC but I think it's a great book.


----------



## Sugarshoc

Welcome Maris!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Marisgirl* 
Joining the group.....

Welcome!







:


----------



## Bloomingstar

Welcome Marisgirl!

So I am still hanging in there at 42 weeks and 1 day. My NST yesterday went well--great fluid, movement, breathing, etc. and I finally started having contractions I could feel then too!







: who knew I'd be thankful for contractions? I feel like this baby may actually finally come out and I won't be pregnant forever.







And thank goodness for netflix watch instantly! I might've gone completely out of my mind without it. I've watched seasons 1-3 of the Office and am now on season 4.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Welcome Marisgirl!

So I am still hanging in there at 42 weeks and 1 day. My NST yesterday went well--great fluid, movement, breathing, etc. and I finally started having contractions I could feel then too!







: who knew I'd be thankful for contractions? I feel like this baby may actually finally come out and I won't be pregnant forever.







And thank goodness for netflix watch instantly! I might've gone completely out of my mind without it. I've watched seasons 1-3 of the Office and am now on season 4.










*sends smooth labor vibes*







:







:







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Welcome Marisgirl!!!

Come on Baby Bloomingstar!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Welcome Marisgirl!

So I am still hanging in there at 42 weeks and 1 day. My NST yesterday went well--great fluid, movement, breathing, etc. and I finally started having contractions I could feel then too!







: who knew I'd be thankful for contractions? I feel like this baby may actually finally come out and I won't be pregnant forever.







And thank goodness for netflix watch instantly! I might've gone completely out of my mind without it. I've watched seasons 1-3 of the Office and am now on season 4.









woohooo! come on baby







:


----------



## Jannah6

Yes, *Come on* Baby







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Yes, *Come on* Baby







:


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Welcome Marisgirl!

So I am still hanging in there at 42 weeks and 1 day. My NST yesterday went well--great fluid, movement, breathing, etc. and I finally started having contractions I could feel then too!







: who knew I'd be thankful for contractions? I feel like this baby may actually finally come out and I won't be pregnant forever.







And thank goodness for netflix watch instantly! I might've gone completely out of my mind without it. I've watched seasons 1-3 of the Office and am now on season 4.









Do you generally have long cycles? Your babe might just need more time to cook. That said,







: I hope the little one is on their way OUT!


----------



## purplegirl

Thinking about you Bloomingstar.

I have been enjoying the time of my last the past two weeks (as my face book girls know). My dh has been planning these awesome and romantic evenings. Most of you know he travels quite a bit for his job, so we decided that when he is home, we will make the most of the time together. It's been very nice and allows us to reconnect in a meaningful way. Last night started off with him reading poetry to me. It was so freakin sweet







I returned the favor by dancing


----------



## Jannah6

Sounds like a nice night







I'm on facebook too, can I add you as a friend?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Sounds like a nice night







I'm on facebook too, can I add you as a friend?

absolutely!I am a facebook addict. pm me and i will give you my govermental so you can add me!


----------



## eilonwy

Yay Facebook!

Have you ladies seen this?! I'm so obsessed with it right now.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I am a facebook fan. It is my newest past time.


----------



## Jannah6

*NAK*








AndrewsMother your DS is the cutest


----------



## AndrewsMother

NAK???? what does that mean.

Thank you Jannah I love to squeeze him. PM me your facebook info If you would like.


----------



## Jannah6

NAK= nursing at keyboard.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I never had that skill.


----------



## eilonwy

: It's the real reason they invented slings.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Slings made it worse. My son would not nurse unless it was at the perfect angle. We spent many days sitting in the car for meals. The front driver's seat offered the best position.

However I did PAK.

PAK=Pump At Keyboard.


----------



## Bloomingstar

: I had my baby! contrary to my momentary belief that I'd be pregnant forever (and I even came to that conclusion during my 36 hours of labor).
Lamine Amir was born at home at 9:56am on Friday, Jan 16, 9lbs, 3 oz and 22.5 inches long! birth story to come eventually. Mama is TIRED! (yet wired







)







:


----------



## eilonwy

Yay! Congrats, mama! Welcome, Lamine!







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: I had my baby! contrary to my momentary belief that I'd be pregnant forever (and I even came to that conclusion during my 36 hours of labor).
Lamine Amir was born at home at 9:56am on Friday, Jan 16, 9lbs, 3 oz and 22.5 inches long! birth story to come eventually. Mama is TIRED! (yet wired







)







:

Congratulations!!!!







:







:







: Isn't it weird how you can be bone tired but wired all at the same time after giving birth.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: I had my baby! contrary to my momentary belief that I'd be pregnant forever (and I even came to that conclusion during my 36 hours of labor).
Lamine Amir was born at home at 9:56am on Friday, Jan 16, 9lbs, 3 oz and 22.5 inches long! birth story to come eventually. Mama is TIRED! (yet wired







)







:

Sweet. Congratulations


----------



## Brown Lioness

Congratulations, Bloomingstar!!







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: I had my baby! contrary to my momentary belief that I'd be pregnant forever (and I even came to that conclusion during my 36 hours of labor).
Lamine Amir was born at home at 9:56am on Friday, Jan 16, 9lbs, 3 oz and 22.5 inches long! birth story to come eventually. Mama is TIRED! (yet wired







)







:









: That is great news!! What a big, healthy baby!! I was supposed to have gone to bed five minutes ago but I said let me just peek in on MDC and look what I found! Oh, congratulations mama!! Happy Babymoon!! And I can't _wait_ to read the birth story!!


----------



## Jannah6

:







:







:*CONGRATULATIONS* Bloomingstar







:







:







:

I've been thinking of you. I can't wait to hear your birth story and see some pics


----------



## nnaemeka

congrads Bloomingstar!!!!!

Welcome Lamine Amir!!!!!







:







:







:


----------



## wiksty

Hello all! I am new to mothering.com and looking for a tribe.

Congrats to...Bloomingstar, was it? On your homebirth and new baby!

I have one child, a daughter, born 7/07. My next baby is due at the end of March and we're planning a homebirth. I'm excited!

I'm tired and should get some sleep...but wanted to say hello and give a tiny intro...hopefully I'll be posting often and getting to know you all better.

P.S. It has been hard for me these past few years...I am "strange" to my family for having the lifestyle I've chosen (the cloth diapering and not vaccinating and breastfeeding for "so long"...they tell me that I'm "too attached" to my child and...so many other things i've looked past because I feel I'm doing the best for myself and my family).

I am also in an interracial marriage. I am Black and my husband is White. Is anyone else in a similar relationship? I was just wondering...not as if this makes the basis for everything, but cultural and nurturing differences have surely impacted our relationship. I was hoping to find advice and maybe some better ways of understanding myself through this tribe, as a mother, wife, woman, and human being.

Nice to meet you all!

~Wiksty


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Hello all! I am new to mothering.com and looking for a tribe.

Congrats to...Bloomingstar, was it? On your homebirth and new baby!

I have one child, a daughter, born 7/07. My next baby is due at the end of March and we're planning a homebirth. I'm excited!

I'm tired and should get some sleep...but wanted to say hello and give a tiny intro...hopefully I'll be posting often and getting to know you all better.

P.S. It has been hard for me these past few years...I am "strange" to my family for having the lifestyle I've chosen (the cloth diapering and not vaccinating and breastfeeding for "so long"...they tell me that I'm "too attached" to my child and...so many other things i've looked past because I feel I'm doing the best for myself and my family).

I am also in an interracial marriage. I am Black and my husband is White. Is anyone else in a similar relationship? I was just wondering...not as if this makes the basis for everything, but cultural and nurturing differences have surely impacted our relationship. I was hoping to find advice and maybe some better ways of understanding myself through this tribe, as a mother, wife, woman, and human being.

Nice to meet you all!

~Wiksty

Welcome.







: I am Black and my dh is white, we have been married 11 years, together 13. We have also weathered cultural differences that at times have threatened our very relationship....its hard. Is there anything specific that you are dealing with?

Shay


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: I had my baby!

Oh WOW!! Congrats Mama!!







: Now I want to hold a baby.









And Welcome Witsky.


----------



## kimiij

I've been absent from posting here but I'm going to try to keep up this time!

Congrats on the baby Bloomingstar!!! I know you were wondering when that baby was going to make its way out!









This is off-topic but does anyone here have locks? I wear my hair natural and I am considering locking my hair. This is something I started thinking about a few months ago and then I forgot about it and then that "what to do with my hair: cut or lock" thread in TAO got me thinking about it again.

Does anyone have any resources? I have no idea where to start.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Welcome.







: I am Black and my dh is white, we have been married 11 years, together 13. We have also weathered cultural differences that at times have threatened our very relationship....its hard. Is there anything specific that you are dealing with?

Shay

Thanks for the welcome









Unfortunately, our troubles have a lot more to do with his character than our cultural differences. But I am always trying to figure out the whys and how did this become type stuff. I just wish I could've made it work...

I figured it was possibly that I just didn't understand where he was coming from. We grew up in starkly different environments and experienced life very drastically on both ends. I thought that two intelligent, studious, open-minded people could make anything work. I guess not, but I still do not quite understand.

I'm being vague...sorry. I'm dealing with the fact that our divorce is inevitable right now. Even his mother doesn't have hope for him ever changing. Is that not sad or what? Sigh. I thought we could overcome anything, and I'm sure that it's more than cultural barriers, because not being ignorant solves a lot of that...but I'm stuck asking myself, what could I have done? And all of that nonsense...

I wont ramble on any longer...I'll go to the single parenting board, lol.


----------



## jeca

Wiksty







I am black DH is Puertorican. We have had some cultural differences but not too bad as our cultures are pretty similair. We did have pretty different backgrounds growing up though and that made for some interesting parenting challenges. All I can say is that marriage is a challange period and everyone in it has to be willing to adjust.









you can also try partners forum for advice.


----------



## Heathen Mama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
P.S. It has been hard for me these past few years...I am "strange" to my family for having the lifestyle I've chosen (the cloth diapering and not vaccinating and breastfeeding for "so long"...they tell me that I'm "too attached" to my child and...so many other things i've looked past because I feel I'm doing the best for myself and my family).

I am also in an interracial marriage. I am Black and my husband is White. Is anyone else in a similar relationship?

Hey ~Wiksty! We're separated at birth. I do vax, reluctantly, but I live in DC Metro and we plan to travel internationally with DS, so it's the choice we've made. I also have left my precious son intact, and I am MILITANT about anyone who gives me lip about that.

Anyhow, I just wanted to check back in here 'cause I have been away for awhile. Life. It's so wonderful... but so tiring sometimes!


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Wiksty







I am black DH is Puertorican. We have had some cultural differences but not too bad as our cultures are pretty similair. We did have pretty different backgrounds growing up though and that made for some interesting parenting challenges. All I can say is that marriage is a challange period and everyone in it has to be willing to adjust.









you can also try partners forum for advice.

Thanks for the advice







Marriage IS a challenge. Unfortunatley, I don't think I can adjust anymore without breaking in two.

***off topic but***
Do you ever get that "OMG your kids are SOOOO beautiful!" thing?! Not just because they are, but because they're of mixed races? I cannot stand that...grrrr. Though...I suppose that's a little better than the "Whose child is that?" When it's just my daughter and I walking around the store together, but she favors her father in skin tone.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Heathen Mama* 
Hey ~Wiksty! We're separated at birth. I do vax, reluctantly, but I live in DC Metro and we plan to travel internationally with DS, so it's the choice we've made. I also have left my precious son intact, and I am MILITANT about anyone who gives me lip about that.

Anyhow, I just wanted to check back in here 'cause I have been away for awhile. Life. It's so wonderful... but so tiring sometimes!

Nice to meet you! Although I hope we're not too similar, but only because soon hubby and I will be divorced (long story). How do you like DC? I've never been there, but I've heard great things about it.

If you don't mind my asking, where overseas are you traveling? And how old is your son? That's going to be so much fun I'm sure. I understand vaxing for that reason, I've thought about having to vax if we travel...but so far it hasn't become an issue.

My husband is still on the foreskin removal train, but it's a no go. If we have a boy this time around (I'm 30weeks) he will be intact. I don't care...no cosmetic surgery on my baby boy! He is totally crunchy on everything else, just not the fact that his son's penis will look different than his. Men!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Thanks for the advice







Marriage IS a challenge. Unfortunatley, I don't think I can adjust anymore without breaking in two.

***off topic but***
Do you ever get that "OMG your kids are SOOOO beautiful!" thing?! Not just because they are, but because they're of mixed races? I cannot stand that...grrrr. Though...I suppose that's a little better than the "Whose child is that?" When it's just my daughter and I walking around the store together, but she favors her father in skin tone.

Welcome Wiksty! I love the name Amara. It's my sister's name and one that I would have liked to name a daughter if I had had one. In Igbo it means "grace". How did you come to choose it?

You know, Ne-yo, the singer just got into trouble because he expressed that sentiment--that a child is sooooooooooo beautiful because they are mixed race. My perspective, as a first-generation born American is that there's a lot of psychological stuff that goes along with that. Growing up, it was really bad to be African and worse to be Haitian. Everyone aspired to be mixed or part-Indian because that was what was considered beautiful--not straight Black. I don't have biracial kids but I can imagine how challenging it is to impart a healthy, realistic and balanced self-image to a mixed child with these messages/ideas floating around.


----------



## Jannah6

: Welcome Wiksty. My DD2 middle name is Amala







. I'm Black and DH is White. We have faced *ALOT* of challenges in our marriage. I think those challenges arose because of DH cultural upbringing(he's Albanian) and his personality.

Just last year I was ready to call it quits. He saw how serious I was and he prayed hard and made some positive changes. I'm hoping that your DH will come around and divorce is taken off the table







s.


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Thanks for the advice







Marriage IS a challenge. Unfortunatley, I don't think I can adjust anymore without breaking in two.
.

No advice more of a marraige is hard and I can relate.
Yes I hear that my kids are beautiful but it doesnt bother me because they are beautiful. I don't like for people to tell them so much though. I should say though DH is just as brown as me so most people just assume he's black. My kids are brown but my youngest is on the lighter side. Besides the "hair" thing though you can't tell. So I know it's not because everyone assumes they are mixed though most do just assume.
OT
DS is also intact and the older gets the more people start to comment on it. Like he's reaching that age where kids are going to tease him about it when they find out or something, weird. Or this guy told me the other day "oh they did that back then?" umm, he's eleven not fifty yes people did not circ' back then.


----------



## eilonwy

:







:







:HAPPY INAUGURATION DAY!!!!







:







:







:


----------



## eilonwy

Post #2009= New President, New Hope.

I'm STOKED! And I love that I get to witness this historic moment live online. It's just coolness upon coolness!


----------



## Jannah6

*rootzdawta* I've been meaning to ask how everything went with the lead issue? How's your DS doing? I hope everything is going smoothly.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*rootzdawta* I've been meaning to ask how everything went with the lead issue? How's your DS doing? I hope everything is going smoothly.

Oh, thanks sis!







We're going to re-test in another month. We've been doing the iron drops faithfully as well as millet, green smoothies and prune juice. We've been cleaning the place and keeping him out of (or in his pack and play in) rooms that haven't been painted recently. He's doing well and I hope the levels have gone down when we re-test. Either way, we'll paint (with lead encapsulating paint) in another month or so.


----------



## ~gilli~

Good morning sista friends!
It has been awhile since I posted, due to some crazy medical crap while pregnant. I *think* I might be in labor, but who knows. I live in Baltimore, and just have had moments of tears today seeing all the people going to see Obama get sworn in. What a great day for the great granddaughter of slaves.







:







:


----------



## wiksty

rootzdawta said:


> Welcome Wiksty! I love the name Amara. It's my sister's name and one that I would have liked to name a daughter if I had had one. In Igbo it means "grace". How did you come to choose it?
> QUOTE]
> 
> I was looking for a nature name. I looked through meanings first, then it had to sound great with Lynn in the middle (hubby's family tradition for the first female). In Greek it means "unfading and eternal" and in Spanish it means "she will love." I will have to write the Igbo meaning down as well. I love her name more and more everyday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And...pardon my ignorance, but who speaks Igbo?
> 
> Yes...regarding the beautiful mixed babies issue, it truly does have a lot to do with the psychological. I hope that things will start to change; it's hard enough to be a strong woman these days without that nonsense. I just don't want her to ever feel...not sure how to put it to words...mama needs to get some sleep (I work nights) lol.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







: Welcome Wiksty. My DD2 middle name is Amala







. I'm Black and DH is White. We have faced *ALOT* of challenges in our marriage. I think those challenges arose because of DH cultural upbringing(he's Albanian) and his personality.

Just last year I was ready to call it quits. He saw how serious I was and he prayed hard and made some positive changes. I'm hoping that your DH will come around and divorce is taken off the table







s.

Thanks for the welcome







I wish my hubby would make the changes that need to be made for our progression...maybe if he wasn't an athiest I could get him to have faith in...anything.

I'm glad things worked out for you and your hubby though! OMG, almost six children?! That must be so wonderful. Good luck with your birth







Hope your heart doesn't explode from loving so many people soooo much!


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
DS is also intact and the older gets the more people start to comment on it. Like he's reaching that age where kids are going to tease him about it when they find out or something, weird. Or this guy told me the other day "oh they did that back then?" umm, he's eleven not fifty yes people did not circ' back then.









Lol. It still shocks me that people are so ignorant to a lot of things.


----------



## futurmama8

Hello everyone!! I haven't posted for a while, school just started back and I am actually in clinical (nursing school) at Shriners hospital for children with burns. It is amazing I never thought I could like it but I do.

Congrats bloomingstar







: on the new edition to your family

Welcome wiksty I am glad to see more women joining MDC. My friends child is mixed and her name is Amaya!! On the topic of about complimenting on mixed children I have a girl I go to school with and she is mixed (white and hispanic) but looks every bit of white. She always says that the most beautiful babies are black and white mix and she doesn't care what anyone says. I told her that it is offensive because she is mixed (but she never thought about it like that because she obviously sees herself as white). I told her so you are telling me that I am not beautiful because my one half of me is not white? I told her my children will be just as beautiful as any other kid not because of their race but because they are children and they will be beautiful people. She of course had a dumb look on her face.

That was pretty long winded but my main point is that you have to tell people it is ignorant to comment on a child race as what makes them beautiful. I hope everything goes well with you and your husband.


----------



## rootzdawta

QUOTE]

And...pardon my ignorance, but who speaks Igbo?

[/QUOTE]

I'm Igbo. Don't speak fluently but understand very well.


----------



## purplegirl

Welcome Wiksty! You've joined a group of wonderful women!
I've been so caught up in the inaugural stuff that I haven't been on MDC in a couple of days







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
QUOTE]

And...pardon my ignorance, but who speaks Igbo?


I'm Igbo. Don't speak fluently but understand very well.[/QUOTE]

I think that she meant what people speak Igbo......or perhaps I misread Wiksty's post.


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Congratulations Bloomingstar







:
I can't wait to hear your birth story and look forward to pictures.
Enjoy babymooning! and make sure to ask for tons of help so you can cuddle with your precious baby!








Wiksty. My dd's name is Amira.









I'm sorry to hear about your marriage ending.







I too am in an interracial relationship. We annoy each other in a lot of other ways. For us, it's more of a gender thing.







I'm more of an emotional, communicative sort of person (stereotypical female) and he's quiet and unemotional..

I'm all too familiar with the whole fascination about beauty in terms of race. sadly, some people forget that they are talking about people and not dog breeds.









I'm sooo glad to hear you are sticking to your guns so to speak about the circumcision issue. kudos to you for protecting your potential son's right to a whole body.

and Happy Inauguration to you too! It really is an amazing day!


----------



## AndrewsMother

I don't know how I missed the birth, but congratulations Bloomingstar.







:







:







:

Welcome Wiksty!!!


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Thanks for the advice







Marriage IS a challenge. Unfortunatley, I don't think I can adjust anymore without breaking in two.

***off topic but***
Do you ever get that "OMG your kids are SOOOO beautiful!" thing?! Not just because they are, but because they're of mixed races? I cannot stand that...grrrr. Though...I suppose that's a little better than the "Whose child is that?" When it's just my daughter and I walking around the store together, but she favors her father in skin tone.

hey what's up Wiksty!!!

yeah, my DD gets that oh so beautiful thing. she is a beauty but i think some people "notice" her more b/c she's a bit lighter...i imagine it would be worse if she were biracial looking...i'd flip if someone asked if she was my offspring or thought i was the nanny







. i'm dark (Haitian) and my DH is African from Ghana but kind of fair, reddish really. anyway, some people are simply colonized mentally. i'm def conscious of it and plan on educating my dd to appreciate all kinds of beauty across various skintones, esp within in the black community. for better or worse, i am pretty sensitive to color issues.

anyway, Igbo people speak Igbo, a large ethnic group in Nigeria i.e. Chinua Achebe--writer of Things Fall Apart-- for example.

@Gilli: i hope your labor is progressing smoothly and baby is happily on his/her way!!!

@Bloomingstar: speaking of baby names, i had a sweet and very intelligent student named Lamine from Ivory Coast. i like that name Lamine Amir, very nice choice, mama.

oh yeah, happy inauguration day. i pray this change is meaningful in real tangible ways esp for those in need of justice, food and peace.

where's the sis asking about locs/locks/dreads? well, i can't find your post right now but many have found tips and support on the nappturality forum. i have dreads, this my 10th year and i'm still loving it. though my hair could use some more TLC, i do maintain them myself. also, my sister is a sisterlocks expert and she has beautiful sisterlocks and a zillion customers in love what she does for them! that's an lovely option too, there's a sisterlocks website too.

welcome to all and welcome BACK to those returning from MIA!!!







.


----------



## Heathen Mama

How to explain my feeling about living in DC? Let's see, GO STILLERS!!!!
I'm probably the ONLY Black woman in DC who would much rather be anywhere but Chocolate City!

The vaxing... I can see both sides... but I'm a journalist, so I plan to do most of Western Europe when DS is about 1, but I may be going to parts (unknown to me yet) of Africa. I imagine Kenya and Nigeria are possibilities, but Cameroon, Mali or S Africa are possible. I'm working on a project now that I don't know when it's ending and my application to a program in Africa will be dealt with then... so the countries I mention are those that will likely be available at my estimated enddate. ANYWAY...

As far as the genital mutilation of my DS, now 7.5 months, (and that's how I always refer to it) I told DH that if he did anything to DS's genitals that I didn't want, I'd do something with my genitals that DH didn't want. And while I was at it, we'd have to renegotiate my part of the monogamy clause of the marriage... I mean, if DS wouldn't remember his genital experience, how could I be expected to remember anything of mine? DH didn't like that reasoning at all, but DS is intact.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
This is off-topic but does anyone here have locks?

Hi Kimiij! I have worn locks for the past 8 years. PM me if you have any questions or just wanna chat about locking.

CONGRATULATIONS BLOOMINGSTAR!







: I can't wait to hear your birth story.









I have been MIA for a bit but I am back now because I am back at work. I have mixed feelings about having to work but I am just going to be grateful that I have a job (also that I even HAVE a job!) that allowed me 3 months PAID with DS and that me, DH and DS all have medical insurance. I know we are blessed.

About vaxing, I plan on traveling the world with DS so I felt like I needed to get him vaxed. The pediatrician we go to uses a delayed schedule. When I take DS to Machu Picchu that he only comes home with lovely memories and not pertussis! I live in Brooklyn and vaccination compliance is only 60% here so herd immunity does not apply.


----------



## JustKiya

Welcome Lamine! Congrats Bloomingstar!!!







:







:







:

I'm a facebook lover, as well - Kiya Black, on there.


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## eilonwy

Unless you've got two more names, I can't find you.


----------



## JustKiya

I do indeed have two more names....


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning sista friends!
It has been awhile since I posted, due to some crazy medical crap while pregnant. I *think* I might be in labor, but who knows. I live in Baltimore, and just have had moments of tears today seeing all the people going to see Obama get sworn in. What a great day for the great granddaughter of slaves.







:







:









Hey Gilli







: Long time no see. I was thinking about you the other day. I hope your labor is coming along well! Keep us posted.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I am actually in clinical (nursing school) at Shriners hospital for children with burns. Welcome wiksty I am glad to see more women joining MDC...my main point is that you have to tell people it is ignorant to comment on a child race as what makes them beautiful. I hope everything goes well with you and your husband.

WOW. You work at one of the Shriners'!? That's so awesome. Well, I know you're doing your clinicals, but still. Are you going for RN? LPN? or something else? I don't know that I could ever do that...I work in an Emergency Room as a nursing assistant. It's so exciting, so many things happen and there's always so much energy around (not always positive energy, but...).

I've only seen a few burn victims though, and I always get a little weak over them, especially when they're children. Our hospital doesn't specialize in burns and we always have the pt flown to St. Louis' burn center, but the few I've seen were...enough. You must be loving your experience!

Anywho...thanks for including the bit about schooling your friend on children's beauty based on thier race(s). I feel the same way. It seems easier, though, when the person is a friend, or my peer. I had a friend's mother come over with her new grandchild and compare beauty and skin tone to my daughter's(the baby's mother and the grandmother are White, and the baby's father is Black). The grandmother actually said "OMG, Mikayla (her grandchild) is pretty, but Amara is BEAUTIFUL!" Right in front of her daughter! But only after mentioning the fact that my daughter's skin is lighter, hair silkier, and all around that Amara appeared more European. It was my first time dealing with something like that as a mother. I felt sickened, but responded as cordially as I could with things like, "Oh, thank you. I think Mikayla is beautiful too." But the woman went ON and ON and ON about it, I couldn't believe it!!! Sigh.

Thanks for the well wishes for my marriage. I am homebirthing Baby #2 soon (EDD March 31st) so I hope that all is at least peaceful by then. I cannot handle such immense stress right now!


----------



## wiksty

[/QUOTE]I'm Igbo. Don't speak fluently but understand very well.[/QUOTE]

Ah! I thought that maybe it was a language spoken in Haiti, but I thought they spoke creole. I asked my best friend, who is Haitian, and she figured it was African, but didn't know which country. So I googled it, and found that it is "one of the official languages of Nigeria that is also spoken in Equatorial Guinea". Lovely!

~*gilli*~ I hope that all is well with you and your birth and your baby! I may come to join you in Baltimore soon (Fall 2009, I applied to UBalt for graduate school!!!).

And also, to futurmama8, purplegirl, AndrewsMother, rambunctiouscurls, and nnaemeka; thanks for the warm welcome







:

@rambunctiouscurls: the dog breeds comment had me







! Thanks for the no circ support. I def. feel like I'm doing the right thing...and now it seems as though hubby wont be around to "not look like him" anywho. Sigh. Maybe if I wasn't the typical perfectionist virgo, and he the egocentric gemini...but alas *small smile*

@nnaemeka: I've gotten the nanny thing more times than I care to mention. The first time I almost cried inside, but responded well. I know that my daughter is beautiful for many reasons, but I'm def. going to make sure she understands not just why and how she is beautiful to mama, but why others will think she is as well, and prepare her to deal with ignorance...best I can.

and last but not least...

@Arike and nnaemeka: I want to lock my hair SOOOO badly! I've wanted to for years, but...I couldn't settle on the decision. I've always wanted to wait until graduate school, which (cross your fingers, pray, meditate---whichever you do---I just finished applying) begins Fall of this year!!! My hair has been natural since...2004 now. No relaxers at least. I still flat iron it about once every two or three weeks. But I either make my shampoo or buy organic brands, and I only use Jojoba oil, olive oil, and tea tree oil in it. Any suggestions on preparing my hair for locking? I really don't think I can do it alone (and no one down here locks hair, I'd have to go to STL)...I'm 30weeks pregnant now and so low on energy...maybe I'll wait until the Baby is around 2 months old or so? Not sure...but what can I do to prepare for locks until then?

Thanks everybody! I'll stop yapping for awhile...maybe get some laundry folded. Most def staying in the house today, it's awfully







: our there!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
I've been absent from posting here but I'm going to try to keep up this time!

Congrats on the baby Bloomingstar!!! I know you were wondering when that baby was going to make its way out!









This is off-topic but does anyone here have locks? I wear my hair natural and I am considering locking my hair. This is something I started thinking about a few months ago and then I forgot about it and then that "what to do with my hair: cut or lock" thread in TAO got me thinking about it again.

Does anyone have any resources? I have no idea where to start.

I have been locked 5 years this April, I am a freeformer which for me means I wash and seperate at this point. I think it was already mentioned but check out nappturality, they are a great resource.

Shay


----------



## Bloomingstar

thanks everyone







:

whew! Today I went outside for the first time in a week--only to take the baby to his first Dr.'s appointment. Im not a glutton for the punishment of this weather, and really wasn't sure how I'd even feel abou getting outside--I'm still feeling so IN IT, if that makes any sense. I haven't even been able to bring myself to take a proper shower yet--just been cleaning up, I guess, but...

so yes, I haven't written my bith story yet and may not for awhile but I will share that I am so glad I was at home! And I love my midwife so dearly. nd my husband is like some kind of supeman to me now--and he tells everyone he talks to that I am a badass and his hero an he thought harriet tubman was a badass but not as bad as me! haha.

I was in labor for 36 hours from water breaking to placenta coming out. I am glad I had no sense of time--I just noticed the light and snow coming and going. It was the most challenging thing I've ever done, and the most exhausting and most wonderful...oh man! I pushed for 4.5 hours--not all of it the real grrrr kind of stuff but yeah. Pushing was great! It felt awesome, and I managed it without a single tear or skidmark, no swelling...whew! And baby boy is big--9lbs, 3oz! I cried, of course--I could hardly believe that he'd actually FINALLY come out. After all that, I was sooo tired, and a bit dizzy. At some point I passed out for just a second and came to with DH, midwife, and doula talking to me and demanding that I drink this now! There was some tea, and a bunch of floradix, emergen-c...and then my damn placenta refused to leave. We waited, let the cord stop pulsing, tried some visualizations, I couldn't really stand up without getting extremely dizzy so we tried some pushing with slight tugs of encouragment from MW and finally, I guess an hour? a couple hours? I dunno! We decided that my midwife would go in and get it. THAT had to be the craziest part of the whole experience for me, and it was not at all pleasant but she was able to do it and I had a beautiful, intact placenta at the end of it.

And since then I have been resting and DH has been doing all sorts of everything--I feel like I'm in a little lovebubble







I've had the weepies a bit for a couple days about this and that but overall, I feel so ridiculously happy







I am also so glad to have my sister to call anytime--she has talked me through many things these past 5 days







I am gonna meet with a lactation consultant tomorrow maybe to help me figure a few things out--baby had a diaper yesterday that looked like the pictures they show you of "dehydrated diaper" and I freaked







I was also so ridiculously engorged and Lamine sometimes just likes to yell at my nipples instead of latching on that I was convinced I was somehow killing him







Fortunately, my DH is not in hormone soup and my sister has 3 LOs, including a two week old so I believe what she says so they helped me settle down. I spoke to the LC on the phone this morning, also and today has been a much better day. And Lamine was 9lbs today at the pediatrician's, so yay, I am not killing him









Wow, that was long. Thanks for listening to my rambles
















And it took us about a day to name him--we'd always been considering the name Lamine and Amir just somehow followed. It seems to fit him more every day. And I'll be back with pictures soon


----------



## wiksty

Lamine!

Congrats Bloomingstar!!!







:


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## purplegirl

Blooming, you are one badass sista! What a great story. I also know a Lamine who is a bright and wonderful young man!
Blessings upon all of you..............







:


----------



## Arike

Yay Bloomingstar! Great story. 36 hours of labor? You are a rockstar!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Blooming, you are one badass sista! What a great story. I also know a Lamine who is a bright and wonderful young man!
Blessings upon all of you..............







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Yay Bloomingstar! Great story. 36 hours of labor? You are a rockstar!



















Rock on sister!! Your birth story sounded so loverly!!


----------



## rootzdawta

How do ya'll feel about the media (specifically Huffington Post) calling Sasha Obama "sassy"?

My take: I must be missing something and that's why I'm not understanding the problem. HP also calls Piper Palin "sassy" (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/1..._n_143784.html). What is wrong with being described as sassy? Websters Dictionary gives three definitions. 1 : impudent 2 : vigorous , lively 3 : distinctively smart and stylish Never have I seen HP describe S.O. as impudent but to me she does seem to fit #2 and #3. I'm the oldest sister and I've always been described as "mature" and "serious" while my younger sister, who is more outgoing, smiles more readily and is overall more bubbly than me has been described as sassy. Generally speaking, this is how it is with big and little sisters.

It just seems that some of us are being overly sensitive. I agree that we should be vigilant about how the media treats the first family and I'm certainly not giving HP an A+ in this area but in this particular matter, especially when they are not saying anything negative about M.O. and none of the pictures of S.O. have been captioned negatively, I'm inclined to just be cool about it.

Is there some AA cultural or historical thing I'm not getting? Sassy has never been an insult to me. It means "flavor", "distinctive style" and a little bit of attitude (in a good kind of way, like, I know I'm flyy and no one can bring me down).


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Is there some AA cultural or historical thing I'm not getting? Sassy has never been an insult to me. It means "flavor", "distinctive style" and a little bit of attitude (in a good kind of way, like, I know I'm flyy and no one can bring me down).

It may very well be a AA thing. Truthfully in my family, being sassy was the sort of thing that earned you a whooping







. It was seen as getting too big for your britches, so as a kid I would not have wanted to be called sassy. That said, as an adult, I have no issue with it, heck mini-me is definitey sassy and I am fine with it.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
It may very well be a AA thing. Truthfully in my family, being sassy was the sort of thing that earned you a whooping







. It was seen as getting too big for your britches, so as a kid I would not have wanted to be called sassy. That said, as an adult, I have no issue with it, heck mini-me is definitey sassy and I am fine with it.

Shay


Yeah that. In my family, being sassy was equivalent to being 'fresh'.

It's not a term I think to use but I like the definition of it to mean: distinctive style, in which case it certainly describes Sasha and I ain't mad at her







Those girls are just darling!


----------



## eilonwy

Sassy as a way of complementing a child seems to me something akin to complimenting a grown woman by calling her "exotic." I've got issues with it. I've always said that "exotic" has, in my experience, meant one of two things: "You're not white and I want to sleep with you" or "You're not white and I strongly suspect/know that my SO wants to sleep with you." Sassy seems to me to convey the same sense of "otherness," of exotification if you will, only in a manner befitting a child.

I guess what I'm saying is, I don't really think it's cute.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Congrats Bloomingstar! Lamine is such a cutie! And I love the name.

I think sassy can be taken too many ways, which might be why some take issue with it. I remember being told not to "sass" someone, so if I was being sassy, I was being bad.

As for "exotic" I think people like how that sounds... just say unique, different, special, or whatever... exotic always reminds me of animals.

kimiij: I'm on yr 2 with locs. I started mine simple. 2 strand twists and then twisted the roots as they grew out. Worked great and I love my locs. I cut all my hair off in the summer of 06 and had an afro until my mom said I needed to do something with it... I guess a hairband wasn't enough? Anyway, in March 07 I started the twists, so it's almost been 2 years. I was scared at first, but honestly, I wouldn't change a thing now.

First cut

Big afro

My twists

Thanksgiving Me... in need of some rootwork.

I tried nappturality, but didn't really click with the group, so I just go off of trial and error...


----------



## Draupadi

Congrats, Bloomingstar! Lamine is beautiful!







:

In other news, I've been out of the loop and been without internet access forever. Glad there's not too much drama but a bit sad that I didn't get to share in Inauguration Day with you all.


----------



## Draupadi

JeDeeLenae, I HATE being called "exotic". The word always made me feel like a piece of fruit or a Turkish rug or something.







:


----------



## kimiij

Thanks JeDeeLenae, your locks look really nice. I am still mulling over the idea. I am not sure I want something so permanent but I am tired of having to do my hair (I mainly twist it and do twist-outs). Were there any specific websites you visited? I used to visit Nappturality often but that was when I first went natural (almost four years ago!). I went there a few days ago to visit the dreadlocks forum but it just wasn't very helpful to me. I love looking at blogs and pictures to see how people actually did it.


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## JustKiya

Sassy, to me, is a feminine version of spunky. I don't get it, either.


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## AndrewsMother

Sassy or sass is something that colereds were not supposed to do to whites in the south until recently. Correcting a white person was considered sass, answering to quickly could be considered sass. This is probably why black children my age and older were smacked for being sassy. Slavery roots still have a strong hold in our culture. sad, but true.


----------



## eilonwy

I guess what bothers me is this: If Sasha Obama was white, would they call her "sassy?" No, they'd call her "sweet."


----------



## AndrewsMother

She is definetly definitions 2 & 3, but the word sassy applied to a black girl has the wrong connotation.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I guess what bothers me is this: If Sasha Obama was white, would they call her "sassy?" No, they'd call her "sweet."


Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
She is definetly definitions 2 & 3, but the word sassy applied to a black girl has the wrong connotation.

Huffington Post also calls Piper Palin sassy.

But I understand now why folks are bristling at it. I use the word regularly though. My next door neighbor, a girl of about 11 I call sassy (affectionately) all the time. I think at one point in my life, I aspired to be sassy as it seemed sassy girls didn't get teased.

ETA. The way HP talks about S.O., I disagree with, i.e talking about her like she is an adult and not a little girl. After reading this, I think HP knows why they continue to use the word and I don't like it.

" Sasha Obama didn't tell anybody off. The youngest first daughter is brimming over with sass, and she COULD HAVE spent the day adorably demanding that people talk to her tiny hand or shaking her hips defiantly at every photo op, but she chose to reign it in. Incidentally, Secret Service have already changed her code name to "The Little Handful." Huffington Post"

This is problematic.

Oh, and another reason why initially I thought folks were over-reacting was because they don't say anything about Malia. I think because Malia is more laid-back.


----------



## AndrewsMother

I hope to one day have a Sassy daughter myself!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Huffington Post also calls Piper Palin sassy.

But I understand now why folks are bristling at it. I use the word regularly though. My next door neighbor, a girl of about 11 I call sassy (affectionately) all the time. I think at one point in my life, I aspired to be sassy as it seemed sassy girls didn't get teased.

ETA. The way HP talks about S.O., I disagree with, i.e talking about her like she is an adult and not a little girl. After reading this, I think HP knows why they continue to use the word and I don't like it.

*" Sasha Obama didn't tell anybody off. The youngest first daughter is brimming over with sass, and she COULD HAVE spent the day adorably demanding that people talk to her tiny hand or shaking her hips defiantly at every photo op, but she chose to reign it in. Incidentally, Secret Service have already changed her code name to "The Little Handful." Huffington Post"*

This is problematic.

Oh, and another reason why initially I thought folks were over-reacting was because they don't say anything about Malia. I think because Malia is more laid-back.


Wow, so this is how they are describing a little girl? Give me a break. One of the things I've found most charming about the Obama girls is their sense of confidence. I forgot how some white americans have a difficult time processing self confidence in black women/girls. In this instance, I'm offended by the choice of descriptor; it takes me back to my initial response in that sassy is the equivalent of 'fresh'.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Wow, so this is how they are describing a little girl? Give me a break. One of the things I've found most charming about the Obama girls is their sense of confidence. *I forgot how some white americans have a difficult time processing self confidence in black women/girls.* In this instance, I'm offended by the choice of descriptor; it takes me back to my initial response in that sassy is the equivalent of 'fresh'.

What I bolded in your post is what I think is a greater issue and I say that as someone who deals with this on a regular basis. Self confident Black women are not something that others often know how to deal with and I think its problematic.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
" Sasha Obama didn't tell anybody off. The youngest first daughter is brimming over with sass, and she COULD HAVE spent the day adorably demanding that people talk to her tiny hand or shaking her hips defiantly at every photo op, but she chose to reign it in. Incidentally, Secret Service have already changed her code name to "The Little Handful." Huffington Post"









: The kid is *eight years old*. I'd slap anyone who described my eight year old that way. Have these people forgotten that "little" Jenna and Barbara Bush (aged *18*) decided that the best way to celebrate their father's inauguration as president was to buy booze with fake IDs and go on a bender? Talk about "sass."







: Clearly the Secret Service needs a lesson in child development, and what can reasonably be expected of young children. Here's a hint: An eight year old who is "a handful" is probably overstimulated, tired, and/or hungry. Simple removal from the situation to a quiet place with a healthy snack will often correct the "problem." Here's another: An 18 year old should be expected to behave appropriately in public without explicit instructions (i.e. you shouldn't be doing things that are AGAINST THE LAW). An eight year old should be expected to provide for their immediate safety, but not much else (i.e. you shouldn't run into traffic).


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: The kid is *eight years old*. I'd slap anyone who described my eight year old that way. Have these people forgotten that "little" Jenna and Barbara Bush (aged *18*) decided that the best way to celebrate their father's inauguration as president was to buy booze with fake IDs and go on a bender? Talk about "sass."







: Clearly the Secret Service needs a lesson in child development, and what can reasonably be expected of young children. Here's a hint: An eight year old who is "a handful" is probably overstimulated, tired, and/or hungry. Simple removal from the situation to a quiet place with a healthy snack will often correct the "problem." Here's another: An 18 year old should be expected to behave appropriately in public without explicit instructions (i.e. you shouldn't be doing things that are AGAINST THE LAW). An eight year old should be expected to provide for their immediate safety, but not much else (i.e. you shouldn't run into traffic).

I politely disagree.

I see a different side to calling a child "a handful". My almost three year old is a handful because he is playful, spunky, independent and oh so intelligent. He has friends however who are a breeze to in comparison. When I have heard the term used it is to describe a child who is full of vigor and life.

When ever I use the term, "a handful" it is meant as a compliment.

I often said to myself that Sasha is a handful.

I would expect my 8 year old to behave appropriately in certain settings.
I have read that the Obama's do not spank, but Michelle is a no none sense disciplinarian. I am quite sure that those girls were informed and instructed in what to do and what not to do in public long before their father announced his bid for the presidency. It is obvious that they are not victims of laissez faire parenting. Piper Palin, was all impudent sass especially the middle finger that she flipped a few times, I would think is.

If his daughters has Piper's Sass or the Bush twins odious traits (the seemed to dull to emanate sass) I doubt that Barack would have been held in the high esteem that he was. If a black man can't run his home, can he run the world?

At the age of 8 I KNEW not to act up in public. period. That was not something that was allowed. If I wanted to act up I needed to save it for the car....after we pulled away from the curb.....or home.

But I guess that our views reflect our different opinions as to what is a handful.


----------



## Jannah6

Hello Ladies,

I've read all of the recent posts and will try to respond later. Just wanted to letyou know that I had my DD Safiyyah Aisha on 1/20/09, a day before my birthday







:. She was 37 weeks and 2 days. She's a very sleepy baby and was having some latching on problems, so she lost a bit of weight.

She was born 7 lbs 8 oz and when we left the hospital 4 days later she was 6 lbs 14 oz. I'm taking her to the Ped today and hopefully she has gained some weight. I also have some other concerns to mention to the DR. I'm so happy to have Safiyyah here, but I think that she may have some health issues. I don't know if it's because she's a 37 weeker, I just hoping and praying that she's alright.

I'll try to post about her birth later(c-section) and what the Dr told me about my own health. You ladies can see a pic of her in my siggy and I'll try to upload pics later.

Miss you ladies, take care


----------



## rootzdawta

Jannah6, congratulations on the birth of that beautiful baby girl! What a lovely name.







:
1praying: that she's okay and that she gets the hang of nursing and starts to put on weight very soon.
Sending all positive energy and light your way!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Hello Ladies,

I've read all of the recent posts and will try to respond later. Just wanted to letyou know that I had my DD Safiyyah Aisha on 1/20/09, a day before my birthday







:. She was 37 weeks and 2 days. She's a very sleepy baby and was having some latching on problems, so she lost a bit of weight.

She was born 7 lbs 8 oz and when we left the hospital 4 days later she was 6 lbs 14 oz. I'm taking her to the Ped today and hopefully she has gained some weight. I also have some other concerns to mention to the DR. I'm so happy to have Safiyyah here, but I think that she may have some health issues. I don't know if it's because she's a 37 weeker, I just hoping and praying that she's alright.

I'll try to post about her birth later(c-section) and what the Dr told me about my own health. You ladies can see a pic of her in my siggy and I'll try to upload pics later.

Miss you ladies, take care









I pray that Safiyyah's health is good. I have a friend whose 5 pound son lost a pound before leaving the hospital. He too was a sleeper and not an eater. Even now he is tiny compared to the other boys his age because he eats so little. As a baby his parents had to wake him as he would sleep 5 hours straight as a newborn with no desire to eat. At almost two he is healthy and vigorous.

Hopefully Safiyyah just values her sleep


----------



## ~gilli~

Jannah6, congratulations on the birth of that beautiful baby girl!
My ds was a sleepy baby, and we would strip him down to his onesie to nurse. I understand how tough this can be. Hang in there!







:


----------



## purplegirl

Jannah







. I hope your sweet baby girl is alright. Please keep us posted on your health as well. She's beautiful.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

I hope Safiyyah is perfectly healthy. Congratulations on your birth!!

As for the description of Sasha, I think it's a bit too much. But then again, if she's behaving like she's the queen, it just shows how much esteem she's held for the first family in previous years.


----------



## Bloomingstar

:







: Congratulations Jannah! Many blessings to you and beautiful little Safiyyah Aisha (her middle name is my first name







) and the whole family. And best wishes for your health and hers, and her nursing. It seemed to take Lamine a few days to not sleep through nursing, but now he's nursing way more. Please get the rest you need and I hope you have lots of help right now


----------



## Draupadi

Congrats, Jannah! Safiyyah is gorgeous!
All these beautiful babies...


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## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
WOW. You work at one of the Shriners'!? That's so awesome. Well, I know you're doing your clinicals, but still. Are you going for RN? LPN? or something else? I don't know that I could ever do that...I work in an Emergency Room as a nursing assistant. It's so exciting, so many things happen and there's always so much energy around (not always positive energy, but...).

I've only seen a few burn victims though, and I always get a little weak over them, especially when they're children. Our hospital doesn't specialize in burns and we always have the pt flown to St. Louis' burn center, but the few I've seen were...enough. You must be loving your experience!

Anywho...thanks for including the bit about schooling your friend on children's beauty based on thier race(s). I feel the same way. It seems easier, though, when the person is a friend, or my peer. I had a friend's mother come over with her new grandchild and compare beauty and skin tone to my daughter's(the baby's mother and the grandmother are White, and the baby's father is Black). The grandmother actually said "OMG, Mikayla (her grandchild) is pretty, but Amara is BEAUTIFUL!" Right in front of her daughter! But only after mentioning the fact that my daughter's skin is lighter, hair silkier, and all around that Amara appeared more European. It was my first time dealing with something like that as a mother. I felt sickened, but responded as cordially as I could with things like, "Oh, thank you. I think Mikayla is beautiful too." But the woman went ON and ON and ON about it, I couldn't believe it!!! Sigh.

Thanks for the well wishes for my marriage. I am homebirthing Baby #2 soon (EDD March 31st) so I hope that all is at least peaceful by then. I cannot handle such immense stress right now!

I am getting my bsn and only four quarters left!! I actually didn't expect to love working with burned children but I do. I thought I would be all emotional over seeing them burned but you realize quick that they aren't burned children but children with burns, BIG difference!

That's horrible that the little girls grandmother was comparing even comparing her to your daughter. I would bet that both children are beautiful and that is all that matters and congrats on the baby you don't have much time left.


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## futurmama8

: congratulations Jannah on your little one, she is so freaking beautiful!!


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## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 







: congratulations Jannah on your little one, she is so freaking beautiful!!

















:








:







:







:


----------



## shayinme

Sistas, I just got a message from a friend of Jannah's....Safiayyah is in the hospital with jaundice, if folks can send healing vibes and prayers it would be appreciated.

Shay


----------



## JustKiya

Many swift healing vibes for Safiayyah!!


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## purplegirl

Sending prayers and healing energy to Safiayyah and Jannah.


----------



## futurmama8

:


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Hello Ladies,

I've read all of the recent posts and will try to respond later. Just wanted to letyou know that I had my DD Safiyyah Aisha on 1/20/09, a day before my birthday







:. She was 37 weeks and 2 days. She's a very sleepy baby and was having some latching on problems, so she lost a bit of weight.

She was born 7 lbs 8 oz and when we left the hospital 4 days later she was 6 lbs 14 oz. I'm taking her to the Ped today and hopefully she has gained some weight. I also have some other concerns to mention to the DR. I'm so happy to have Safiyyah here, but I think that she may have some health issues. I don't know if it's because she's a 37 weeker, I just hoping and praying that she's alright.

I'll try to post about her birth later(c-section) and what the Dr told me about my own health. You ladies can see a pic of her in my siggy and I'll try to upload pics later.

Miss you ladies, take care

















:







:







:







:


----------



## rainbowsweetmama

Sorry for the quick post.
Hi!
I had trouble figuring out where to post this or find this information elsewhere on the web. My son is showing interest in braids, and so we're in the early stages of his hair growing out as a school-aged child. (He's "6 3/4".) He will also be in a very short play tomorrow, playing President Obama! So, I would love any advice you might have on how to do coils and begin the move into braids when his hair is long enough. Thanks!















:


----------



## Buddhamom

Please forgive me for butting in on your tribe, but I am desperate. My 3 yr. daughter was adopted at three days old and she is full AA and my husband and I are caucasion. Well, she has bumps all over her body. They literally look like constant goosebumps. They itch in some areas but they don't appear to be red. I took her to the pediatrician and she said looked like an allergic reaction and told me to give her benadryl and bring her back if it didn't go away. So then 3 days later I took her back because the itching was so bad and the pediatrician that was on call said it was a virus he had seen in another child and it should go away in a few days. She has had this for 1 week and I am getting concerned. They did a strep test which was neg and it is efinitely not chicken pox. I am really worried. She eats fine and has no fever and there is no oozing or concentrated area, like I said it just looks like she has evenly spaced goosebumps all over. She eats an organic vegan diet so it isn't food and we use seventh generation soap so it isn't due to laundry soap. It is weird because she fell asleep for a nap and woke up like that. I have searched high and low and can't find anything and i thought perhaps i was taking care of her skin wrong and would greatly appreciate if anyone could help me.


----------



## rootzdawta

Buddhamom, I don't really know what it could be! Maybe you could try a different kind of soap, something that isn't drying like Dove moisturizing bar. Although I'd rather stick to more natural stuff, Dove seems to be the only thing that helped my oldest when he was younger during the long dry winter months.

I hope you find a solution soon.









Btw, your daughters adorable.


----------



## Jannah6

*NAK*
*Shay*, thank you for posting about Safiyyah. Thank all of you for your well wishes, prayers, and goodvibes.







s to you all. We spent 3 days in the hospital. We originally went to the Dr because of a weight issue with Safi(she's gaining now, I wake her every 2-2 1/2 hrs).
I thought she was a little jaundiced, turns out she had very high levels. We went straight from the Ped to the ER and were admitted to the hospital. we stayed in our own private room and I was able to breastfeed and care for all of safi's needs.
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...heHospital.jpg

When I came home I had the babyblues. I told my aunt and I'm trying to be upbeat. I'm welcoming visitors(something that I . When my DH goes back to work I plan on spending time with my aunt who I share the brownstone with.

My cloth dipes came for my 16 month old DS and Safi, so I'm all







:







:







:

*Buddhamom*, is it possible for you to post a pic? My 6 year old DS had something similar to what you describe.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Buddhamom* 
Please forgive me for butting in on your tribe, but I am desperate. My 3 yr. daughter was adopted at three days old and she is full AA and my husband and I are caucasion. Well, she has bumps all over her body. They literally look like constant goosebumps. They itch in some areas but they don't appear to be red. I took her to the pediatrician and she said looked like an allergic reaction and told me to give her benadryl and bring her back if it didn't go away. So then 3 days later I took her back because the itching was so bad and the pediatrician that was on call said it was a virus he had seen in another child and it should go away in a few days. She has had this for 1 week and I am getting concerned. They did a strep test which was neg and it is efinitely not chicken pox. I am really worried. She eats fine and has no fever and there is no oozing or concentrated area, like I said it just looks like she has evenly spaced goosebumps all over. She eats an organic vegan diet so it isn't food and we use seventh generation soap so it isn't due to laundry soap. It is weird because she fell asleep for a nap and woke up like that. I have searched high and low and can't find anything and i thought perhaps i was taking care of her skin wrong and would greatly appreciate if anyone could help me.

Hey buddhamom







. Sorry to hear of your pretty little one's skin ailments. I have no suggestions but hope it gets resolved soon.

Jannah, I am glad your baby girl (love, love the name) is doing better. It sounds like you have been through some challenges







. I'm glad your auntie is there for you! You need pampering girl!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rainbowsweetmama* 
Sorry for the quick post.
Hi!
I had trouble figuring out where to post this or find this information elsewhere on the web. My son is showing interest in braids, and so we're in the early stages of his hair growing out as a school-aged child. (He's "6 3/4".) He will also be in a very short play tomorrow, playing President Obama! So, I would love any advice you might have on how to do coils and begin the move into braids when his hair is long enough. Thanks!















:


Hi and welcome. Most of the mama's refer to nappturality.com when questions arise about natural hair styles, care etc. I love seeing little boys with coils.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Buddhamom* 
Please forgive me for butting in on your tribe, but I am desperate. My 3 yr. daughter was adopted at three days old and she is full AA and my husband and I are caucasion. Well, she has bumps all over her body. They literally look like constant goosebumps.

AA skin is very often more sensitive than caucasian skin. Given the winter weather, it could just be that her skin is very dry. Make sure she's getting enough water (difficult with any child) and enough sunlight (to make vitamin D-- darker-skinned people need more sunlight than lighter ones for this to happen). If it's not possible to have more skin exposed to sunlight (very hard for most of us in cold weather!) you'll want to give her a vitamin D supplement. After that, it's just a matter of finding the right skincare regimen. I'm rather fond of Nivea cream myself, but that's force of habit as much as anything. There are other mammas here who will have more natural suggestions for you.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Buddhamom* 
Please forgive me for butting in on your tribe, but I am desperate. My 3 yr. daughter was adopted at three days old and she is full AA and my husband and I are caucasion. Well, she has bumps all over her body. They literally look like constant goosebumps. They itch in some areas but they don't appear to be red. I took her to the pediatrician and she said looked like an allergic reaction and told me to give her benadryl and bring her back if it didn't go away. So then 3 days later I took her back because the itching was so bad and the pediatrician that was on call said it was a virus he had seen in another child and it should go away in a few days. She has had this for 1 week and I am getting concerned. They did a strep test which was neg and it is efinitely not chicken pox. I am really worried. She eats fine and has no fever and there is no oozing or concentrated area, like I said it just looks like she has evenly spaced goosebumps all over. She eats an organic vegan diet so it isn't food and we use seventh generation soap so it isn't due to laundry soap. It is weird because she fell asleep for a nap and woke up like that. I have searched high and low and can't find anything and i thought perhaps i was taking care of her skin wrong and would greatly appreciate if anyone could help me.

Is it eczema? My mom cured my little brothers eczema by giving him baths in oatmeal and keeping him in until he got really wrinkly and then she used a medicated cream and you could try that or some shea butter because its very good for the skin. And can I say she is absolutely beautiful! I can't wait for puffs to get like hers. Goodluck mama


----------



## rambunctiouscurls

Jannah6, Congratulations on your baby girl. She's beautiful. Sending her lots of healing vibes.

and another







for the baby blues. Been there, make sure you get lots of help so you can focus on resting and baby-mooning.








to the new members!


----------



## Buddhamom

Jannah, my little one Drihan was 4 weeks early and had severe jaunduce too and I know how wourried you are. I remember when we picked her up her eye whites were as yellow as the center of an egg. I wish you much peace and harmony though this all.

Well, this is the best picture I could get from Drihan. If you look close you will see the tiny bumps all over. The best ways I can explain it is like goose bumps or almost like a toas skin. And these bumps cover her entire body except palms and soles of feet so it isn't just something in one area. And she is itching so bad. We put shea butter on and it had no affect, then tried cetaphil and still no luck and I think it made it a bit worse actually. She oes have a food allergy and excema, but they haven't been an issue since we cut out the foods and put her on probiotics a few years ago. Yeah sun exposure has been difficut since it is a sheet of ice outside and we have had frigid temps because we are in New England.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...mmel/007-3.jpg


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Buddhamom* 
Jannah, my little one Drihan was 4 weeks early and had severe jaunduce too and I know how wourried you are. I remember when we picked her up her eye whites were as yellow as the center of an egg. I wish you much peace and harmony though this all.

Well, this is the best picture I could get from Drihan. If you look close you will see the tiny bumps all over. The best ways I can explain it is like goose bumps or almost like a toas skin. And these bumps cover her entire body except palms and soles of feet so it isn't just something in one area. And she is itching so bad. We put shea butter on and it had no affect, then tried cetaphil and still no luck and I think it made it a bit worse actually. She oes have a food allergy and excema, but they haven't been an issue since we cut out the foods and put her on probiotics a few years ago. Yeah sun exposure has been difficut since it is a sheet of ice outside and we have had frigid temps because we are in New England.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...mmel/007-3.jpg


I like your DD name, what does it mean? My DH little brother is named Dritan







.
I'm sorry that your DD is suffering with this







. I can't offer any advice, although the bumps look similar to when my oldest DS had scarlet fever. I hope you find out what's going on and it can be cured soon.


----------



## Draupadi

Buddhamom, you should take her to a dermatologist or an allergist. My guess is that if it's itchy, it's probably an allergy. Have you tried Zyrtec?
My DS had an allergy to *something* that we never quite figure out when he was about 6 months old or so. The Zyrtec really seemed to help.
Btw, your DD is gorgeous!


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## Draupadi

Jannah, healing to your sweet baby. William was jaundiced at birth and for a couple of weeks too, but we were lucky it didn't get so bad. He was born in the Spring so it was easy to expose him to lots of sunlight.
Saying a prayer for your little beauty.


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## AndrewsMother

Jannah, how is your DD.

Buddhamom, has your pediatrician written a a perscription for hydrocortisone?

My DS had allergies and eczema. Hydrocortisone always cleared up the type of bumps that you described.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Jannah, how is your DD.

She looks a little yellow. The Ped is going to call with the results from Friday's testing. Hopefully the level has gone down. If I have to spend another day in the hospital I think that I'll go MAD.
Thanks for asking







, I'll keep you updated.


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## Bloomingstar

Jannah--hope things are going well with you and Safiyyah









no advice on the skin care issues but it sounds like there's some good advice here.

Lamine and I are doing well







: he's gained weight (now 9lbs, 14 oz!) and is nursing well though sometimes he gets fussy but it's only been a little over 2 weeks--we're still learning







I weighed myself at the pediatrician's office and I've lost 35 of the 50lbs I gained--unexpected but great







I probably lost some of it in my labor marathon







I'm still getting used this being what it is--sleeping, nursing, pooping. I've been making sure I get in a shower--I washed my hair on Friday for the first time since a couple days before the birth







I happily am getting plenty sleep and my DH has been so great--cooking, cleaning, 3am diaper changing--and very thankfully my baby blues crying jags ended last week. I am looking forward to getting outside soon, though it looks like the weather is about to get crappy again







: But I'm hoping we can maybe get to the museum this week--once I really figure out this wrap. And netflix watch instantly is still my best friend.

I have a bunch more pictures to share once I get them uploaded


----------



## jeca

Oh bloomingstar he's gorgeous!!


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
Oh bloomingstar he's gorgeous!!









Indeed . . . so cute!


----------



## Jannah6

Bloomingstar, I've been wondering how you and Lamine are doing. Lamine is sooo cute







:. Look at all that hair, he doesn't even look like a newborn.


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## Bloomingstar

: thanks ladies! I finally got a bunch of pictures organized so the grandmas can settle down. enjoy!


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## Jannah6

I think that Lamine looks like both you and your DH.

We got the call from the Ped and Safiyyah's jaundice levels are up again. We have to go to the Dr tomorrow and repeat the test


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Jannah--hope things are going well with you and Safiyyah









no advice on the skin care issues but it sounds like there's some good advice here.

Lamine and I are doing well







: he's gained weight (now 9lbs, 14 oz!) and is nursing well though sometimes he gets fussy but it's only been a little over 2 weeks--we're still learning







I weighed myself at the pediatrician's office and I've lost 35 of the 50lbs I gained--unexpected but great







I probably lost some of it in my labor marathon







I'm still getting used this being what it is--sleeping, nursing, pooping. I've been making sure I get in a shower--I washed my hair on Friday for the first time since a couple days before the birth







I happily am getting plenty sleep and my DH has been so great--cooking, cleaning, 3am diaper changing--and very thankfully my baby blues crying jags ended last week. I am looking forward to getting outside soon, though it looks like the weather is about to get crappy again







: But I'm hoping we can maybe get to the museum this week--once I really figure out this wrap. And netflix watch instantly is still my best friend.

I have a bunch more pictures to share once I get them uploaded

Oh, Bloomingstar, he is GORGEOUS!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I think that Lamine looks like both you and your DH.

We got the call from the Ped and Safiyyah's jaundice levels are up again. We have to go to the Dr tomorrow and repeat the test









*prayers going up for Safiyyah*

I am requesting prayers, vibes, good thoughts, hubby just got laid off a couple hours ago.







:


----------



## purplegirl

Lamine is just adorable








Prayers for sweet Safiyyah

Brown lioness, I am sorry to hear of your husband's misfortune. Hardly anyone is immune from these current economic times. Keep your head up and prayerfully something else will come along soon.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
amine is just adorable








Prayers for sweet Safiyyah

Brown lioness, I am sorry to hear of your husband's misfortune. Hardly anyone is immune from these current economic times. Keep your head up and prayerfully something else will come along soon.

Thank you, purplegirl. We keepin the faith over here


----------



## Jannah6

*Brown lioness*, I'm so sorry to hear about your DH







s Hopefully he'll find something better soon. Was he expecting a layoff?

Thank you for your well wishes.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Brown lioness*, I'm so sorry to hear about your DH







s Hopefully he'll find something better soon. Was he expecting a layoff?

Thank you for your well wishes.

Eh, yes and no. Something in his "bones" didnt feel right about the job starting from about Thanksgiving-ish. Then work started to slow down after the first of the year and he felt the axe about to fall. So yesterday they announced that they were freezing all raises and that they had lost about $1.3 million in revenue recently. About a few minutes later, they called him into a meeting and let him go. Its a small company and it was the first lay-off they have ever had to do.

So he was expecting it, but not so soon, lol. He's been "laid off' before, only, by the time they did it, he had another job lined up. This time, he doesn't.


----------



## futurmama8

I was wondering how do you ladies feel about saying the word "n***a" around your children? Or how would you feel if they started to use it. I find that my family says it a lot (mostly the guys). Even though I mostly say dude or bra I catch myself saying it sometimes.

Whats your view on this??


----------



## shayinme

Prayers needed for Jannah and Safiyyah, I just got a message that Safiyyah is in the hospital again







, if I hear anything else I will post.

Shay


----------



## futurmama8

hope you are doing ok jannah and safiyyah.


----------



## Brown Lioness

:







:







:


----------



## purplegirl

Wow. I am so sorry Jannah and Safiyyah are going though this. Many prayers and hugs to them.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Eh, yes and no. Something in his "bones" didnt feel right about the job starting from about Thanksgiving-ish. Then work started to slow down after the first of the year and he felt the axe about to fall. So yesterday they announced that they were freezing all raises and that they had lost about $1.3 million in revenue recently. About a few minutes later, they called him into a meeting and let him go. Its a small company and it was the first lay-off they have ever had to do.

So he was expecting it, but not so soon, lol. He's been "laid off' before, only, by the time they did it, he had another job lined up. This time, he doesn't.

Many many







s to you


----------



## Jannah6

Thank you all very much. We are back from the hospital and I'm about to pull my hair out from the root. If I never see another hospital again, it will be too soon. Every time they stick Safiyyah and she howls it just hurts my heart to the core. Not only did they draw blood twice, they also put in a catheter







Her jaundice level is still up a bit, but they let us go home.
We have to go back to the Ped on Thursday to redo the test. I don't even want to take her, but I know it's for the best. The Dr's suspect that she has breast milk jaundice. I'm still breastfeeding her because when she was given formula she vomitted it all up. I'm hoping and praying that the next test results will be much better.
I'm sitting here holding her while she sleeps and I don't want to put her down. I look at her little face and I just want to protect her from any pain. During my pregnancy I felt like something was going to go wrong. I'm not saying that I'm psychic, but I think I've always had sort of a sixth sense. I was told that my great-grandmother had one too.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Jannah







s to you.

I have the sixth sense thing too, except sometimes I wonder if I am psychic!

Bloomingstar I keep looking at pictures of Lamine, he is so adorably plump.

Brown Lioness







s to you!


----------



## JustKiya

I'm so sorry you & Saffiyah are going through this! Have you been exposing her to sunlight on a regular? Is she under the bili lights at the hospital? And - if I remember correctly 'breastmilk jaundice' isn't actually caused by breastmilk - I'm sure you are doing your own research independent of the doctors, and I hope ya'll can figure out a way to help her little body process through it faster.....


----------



## Kappa

I am posting this here because I don't know where else to post it.

Over this past weekend, I traveled for a close friend's baby shower and brought my 10 mo old. She had some friends over w/ baby's of all ages and there was a little girl 2 weeks older than my son. We're Black, everyone there was Hispanic or White. The little girl kept trying to pet/grab my Sweetum's hair!!! It was funny to me (actually hilarious), but the Momma was a bit embarassed.

My baby's hair has been an "issue" for everyone except for me. I get comments often from Black family/friends that I should just get it cut (it's long, but he's only 10 mo!!!). When White people comment, they say it is "cool." I get that mostly from parents of bald babies, I'm sure they are only saying something because their babies are bald.

Of course when he was born it was bone straight, soft and thick. As that hair fell and his real texture came in, it has become clear that he has my hair, which is fine/tangly/kinky and dry and mats rather quickly. It does not have a curly appearance at all, I want you guys to "get" what style/texture of hair I am talking about. I comb his hair out every other day because I don't want the matting to turn into (spontaneous) locs, which I experience and they are not pleasant to have to unravel. I am being criticized because people (family/close friends) are saying that I don't comb/grease/groom my baby's hair. I don't know what to do, I treat it as I did when my hair was natural, washing or wetting it every other day with a moisturizing/detangling shampoo or conditioner, combing it out, and adding oil. By the morning it appears dry and matted in the back (what can I do, that part gets slept on?). I keep telling those people that he has exactly my hair, and it looks the way it does because he gets it from me. I refer to it as "the truth" because I have relaxed hair, but my baby's hair shows what I have up under my chemical (which I use for convenience and I really need to transition back to natural). I am not uncomfortable with my hair texture, or my baby's hair, I didn't wish for a "better grade" but apparently everyone else is somewhat disappointed he doesn't have DH's biracial curly hair. I like the fact that he has my hair, because it feels familiar, kwim?
How are your babies' hair? Any troubles? Any random petting from innocent babes?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
When White people comment, they say it is "cool." I get that mostly from parents of bald babies, I'm sure they are only saying something because their babies are bald.

My babies have "white baby hair;" While they're not bald, by comparison to my nieces they may as well be. They do get a bit of random petting by the cousins, but only because it's different. ChunkityButt was flabbergasted by Bear's [relative] baldness for a long time.







In any case, I do think your son's hair sounds cool... and yes, it's in part becuase my babies are bald, but not entirely. I'd love it if my girls had hair that I could actually comb and style before they were four or five.







Bella's hair would be about halfway down her back now at nearly three if her sister hadn't cut it, but it's so fine and straight that pouring water over it to rinse her in the bathtub really takes any necessity of combing away. Meanwhile Chunkity had fun, combable, styleable hair by the time she was six months old, and at 20 months has as much entertainment on her head as a barrel of monkeys.







You can *do* things with it. Braids, cocoa puffs, ponytails, doorknockers-- if you can imagine it being done with hair, it can be done with hers! Bella's? You can maybe get two little puppy ears, if you fight with it.

In any case, I'm sorry I don't have any advice for you, just thought I'd offer another perspective from a not-white mamma of relatively-white babies.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Thank you all very much. We are back from the hospital and I'm about to pull my hair out from the root. If I never see another hospital again, it will be too soon. Every time they stick Safiyyah and she howls it just hurts my heart to the core. Not only did they draw blood twice, they also put in a catheter







Her jaundice level is still up a bit, but they let us go home.

Jannah-- do you know if your daughter has been tested for G-6-PD deficiency? It is less common in girls than in boys (it's a sex-linked recessive) but it's one of those things that can happen and can be easily overlooked (especially in a girl). The test is easy, it's just a drip on a card like they do for PKU. It's also relatively common in African American populations... and it should be noted that up to 30% of hemizygotic female carriers are symptomatic. It's definately worth looking into as a cause of jaundice.


----------



## rootzdawta

Jannah, I keep checking to see if there's an update. Mama, you're in my heart today and I am hoping everything will be just fine as she adjusts to being in the world. (((hugs)))) and more (((hugs)))

Kappa, at this point I don't care what anyone thinks about my kids' hair although I have cared deeply in the past that folks would look at their hair and make all kinds of assumptions including neglect especially coupled with the fact that they were vegetarian (and still mostly so), not vaxed and will probably be home-schooled.. Their dad is a Rastaman so he has organic locks well past his behind. To take care of my kids hair, I wash, condition, oil and separate. No combing or any other type of "grooming". Their hair is locking now and yes, at times I get strange looks and strange comments. But God help the person who pets my child, though, I must say. I wouldn't necessarily mind someone saying their hair is "cool" because it is cool that our highly textured hair locks so easily and naturally and that they do, in fact, have so much hair ("serious 'fros"). So, Kappa, what I'm trying to say is that if it's not an issue for you personally, don't let others make it an issue. Ignore stupid comments. Address truly interested questions with grace, poise, intelligence and a smile. And then the haters are just gonna have to hate.


----------



## Kappa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
that folks would look at their hair and make all kinds of assumptions including neglect

That's the part of it that sucks, my baby is clean, his hair smells good, it's lint free and food free. They ask "What are you going to DO about his hair?" Do? They are asking me to do one more, make it aesthetically pleasing for the mainstream, and no I'm sorry but that is not a priority for me, especially since that would involve torturing him with a comb or clippers.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
That's the part of it that sucks, my baby is clean, his hair smells good, it's lint free and food free. They ask "What are you going to DO about his hair?" Do? They are asking me to do one more, make it aesthetically pleasing for the mainstream, and no I'm sorry but that is not a priority for me, especially since that would involve torturing him with a comb or clippers.

My son is almost 3 and I have cut his hair into a smaller afro twice twice, Once a year since birth to keep it manageable for my sake, and no one else. I too receive the comments from my family as to when we are going to cut his hair low. While I am not ready to cut his hair low I understand why they desire that I cut his curly fluff. I understand and I agree, but I am not ready to trim his curls.

I braid my sons hair at night and apply oil to it. He slept on a satin sheet as a baby, and I really should make him a satin pillow case, but I don't have the time. (must make time)

If you are content with his hair, why care what others have to say?

I am annoyed, because I know that my family is right.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
I am posting this here because I don't know where else to post it.

How are your babies' hair? Any troubles? Any random petting from innocent babes?

My DS is multiracial (I'm biracial and DH is Assyrian/Scottish) and he has a mix of wavy-ish curly in the front and tighter ringlets in the back. My hair is very curly, and my DH has coarse, wavy hair.
As for DS- his hair tends to get matted when he sleeps on it or if he wears his winter hat because it's kind of long. I usually detangle his hair everyday. I use a spray bottle with conditioner (just a tiny bit) and water and detangle with my fingers. I find this is the most gentle way of doing it since a comb tends to rip hair out. It usually does the trick.
I'm getting pressured from all around to cut his hair, but I really don't want to. I love his curls and want it to grow big.








Mostly adults comment on his curls.


----------



## Draupadi

Jannah, I'm so sorry things are so difficult for you. Sending out my prayers to you and your lovely baby.


----------



## Jannah6

Well ladies I'm home from the Ped. Safiyyah got her little heals stuck and squeaked again







I'm hoping that her levels are down. Thank you everyone for your well wishes and advice. There was a lot of sunlight today. So I placed Safi on the sofa in the sunlight.
*eilonwy* I read the info that you provided. If the levels don't go down I'll suggest that Safi's Dr does testing.

*Kappa*, i'm sorry that people are being so rude. I'm really surprised that they want you to cut your DS hair. I thought that it was sort of an unspoken rule in the AA community that you don't cut your sons hair until he's 1. 2 of my DS have curly hair and it can get matted. As for the random petting. That has never happened with children, but 1 of my SIL's used to like to run her fingers through my childrens hair. I was never annoyed by it, especially since her DH is Black and I know she doesn't have a prejudice bone in her body.
Oh, my DH cousins girlfriend did ask to feel my oldest DD hair. She didn't have any Black friends and I guess she just wondered what kinky hair felt like???? I wasn't offended, especially since she asked first.
Are these children petting or pulling your DS hair? I know that children often do this. Since your DS has a full head of hair I guess these children are kind of in awe.


----------



## purplegirl

Continued prayers for sweet Safiyyah


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Wow. I am so sorry Jannah and Safiyyah are going though this. Many prayers and hugs to them.

sending my prayers too.


----------



## Joyster

I'm sorry for butting in, I just didn't know where else to post.

I've got a new one. I was recently in a discussion with a white social worker who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.

Now it's been a while since I've been out of school, and I've only been a parent for 3 years, but is there an "African American standard" parenting handbook that I've missed?

This whole discussion just reeks of the whole "noble savage" thing. But maybe I have indeed missed something.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
I'm sorry for butting in, I just didn't know where else to post.

I've got a new one. I was recently in a discussion with a white social worker who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.

I'm wondering what this means, did she elaborate







As far as I knew African Americans belong to a Western Society. I'm wondering just how many AA women she knows????

I have my own *WTH* situation. I had to delete my DH little sister from my facebook page. She took a pic and posted it to her FB. In the pic her lips looked full. Apparently her friends thought she looked Black(she's White).
One of her friends commented, "So this is what ******s look like".
I couldn't believe my eyes. Then there was a whole exchange between at least 3 people. ****** this and that, then DH sister referring to a classmate as a Black Bitch. While I was reading this I was fuming














:
So I sent SIL(who I've never met in RL) a message telling her why I had to delete her as a FB friend. Her response to me, "I'm sorry, some of my school friends are so immature" WTH, I just don't get it. She should have deleted those comments, but apparently she's fine with them and the Black Bitch comment was made by her.
DH has wanted to make an effort to see his younger siblings more often(they are from his deceased dad), but now I really don't want to be involved with the youngest sib.

Ladies I want to thank you again for all of your well wishes. Safiyyah had her blood drawn on Thursday. Dr called on Fri, but the results couldn't be read because there wasn't enough blood in the sample







: The lab is going to redo the test in "limited" form. So we have to wait until Mon for the results


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
I'm sorry for butting in, I just didn't know where else to post.

I've got a new one. I was recently in a discussion with a white social worker who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.

Now it's been a while since I've been out of school, and I've only been a parent for 3 years, but is there an "African American standard" parenting handbook that I've missed?

This whole discussion just reeks of the whole "noble savage" thing. But maybe I have indeed missed something.

My internet connection is spotty this weekend so I can't type a long reply but I will say that on the surface I would not necessarily be offended by that statement as a Black woman. There are many ways to take it, context in this case would be important before I decide to get bugged by it.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
My internet connection is spotty this weekend so I can't type a long reply but I will say that on the surface I would not necessarily be offended by that statement as a Black woman. *There are many ways to take it, context in this case would be important before I decide to get bugged by it.*
Shay

Very true


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
I'm sorry for butting in, I just didn't know where else to post.

I've got a new one. I was recently in a discussion with a white social worker who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.

Now it's been a while since I've been out of school, and I've only been a parent for 3 years, but is there an "African American standard" parenting handbook that I've missed?

This whole discussion just reeks of the whole "noble savage" thing. But maybe I have indeed missed something.

I didn't know there was an 'african-american' standard for parenting but like shay and jannah said, context is everything. i get a tiny bit miffed when black women are idealized into being 'strong' and all sacrificing.


----------



## ~gilli~

Good morning all! Jannah6 I hope all is well, and that Safiyyah is doing better.
I finally had my little one on his due date, but his birth was drama filled! But I have my sweet boy, and really what else matters?
My dc are biracial and I get the hair comments all the time. They have ringlet curls and people want to touch them. I makes me feel some kind of way, because I would NEVER just walk up to someone's child and touch them. KWIM? For your viewing pleasure Jackson Ethan!

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...b&id=526071719


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
I'm sorry for butting in, I just didn't know where else to post.

I've got a new one. I was recently in a discussion with a white social worker who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. *Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.*

.

What does that even mean?
It sounds so condescending.
She probably thought what she was saying was flattering.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

I have my own *WTH* situation. I had to delete my DH little sister from my facebook page. She took a pic and posted it to her FB. In the pic her lips looked full. Apparently her friends thought she looked Black(she's White).
One of her friends commented, "So this is what ******s look like".
I couldn't believe my eyes. Then there was a whole exchange between at least 3 people. ****** this and that, then DH sister referring to a classmate as a Black Bitch. While I was reading this I was fuming














:
So I sent SIL(who I've never met in RL) a message telling her why I had to delete her as a FB friend. Her response to me, "I'm sorry, some of my school friends are so immature" WTH, I just don't get it. She should have deleted those comments, but apparently she's fine with them and the Black Bitch comment was made by her.
DH has wanted to make an effort to see his younger siblings more often(they are from his deceased dad), but now I really don't want to be involved with the youngest sib.


Jannah, I'm sorry that happened.
You know, sometimes I think when non-people-of-color say dumb, ignorant crap like that, they don't think they're really being offensive because they don't mean you (or in their little minds, they don't think they do).
One of my brother's white friends once said to me, "You guys aren't like real black people. You're just like me!"








Obnoxious.


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## rootzdawta

Dunno . . . last I checked, AAs are part of Western society. The comment doesn't make any darn sense and I'd be inclined to ask what the writer meant.

All my life I've been told (snidely) by Black folks that Black folks don't do what I do and been greeted with surprise by White folks because Black folks don't do what I do. I'm tired of it.

Congrats Gillian!!







: He's a sweetie!!


----------



## Jannah6

:~Gillian~







:CONGRATULATIONS. I think you were in my DDC


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Jannah, I'm sorry that happened.
You know, sometimes I think when non-people-of-color say dumb, ignorant crap like that, they don't think they're really being offensive because they don't mean you (or in their little minds, they don't think they do).
One of my brother's white friends once said to me, "You guys aren't like real black people. You're just like me!"








Obnoxious.


I totally get where you're coming from.


----------



## ~gilli~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







:~Gillian~







:CONGRATULATIONS. I think you were in my DDC

Sure was!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







:~Gillian~







:CONGRATULATIONS. I think you were in my DDC









:







: CONGRATULATIONS Gillian







:







:
I was in that DDC too


----------



## ~gilli~

Bloomingstar, Lamine is so cute!


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## Kappa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
who mentioned that the "African-American standard" of mothering is so empowering. Largely because it doesn't require as much sacrifice as the western societies.

.

Sounds to me like she was saying that White mothers actually have to work to take care of their children while Black women just let their progeny run wild.







:
I don't think "sacrifice" is the word she wanted to use, maybe "guilt" is more along the lines. I think we tend to mother without guilt.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
*Sounds to me like she was saying that White mothers actually have to work to take care of their children while Black women just let their progeny run wild*.







:
I don't think "sacrifice" is the word she wanted to use, maybe "guilt" is more along the lines. I think we tend to mother without guilt.

It sounded like that to me too.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
I think we tend to mother without guilt.

This is a statement that I would agree with at least for me personally as well as my other sister-friends. When I was pregnant with my 3.5 yo dd, there was a a group of us all pregnant at the same time. I was the only one who stayed home long term (went back to work pt when dd was 13 mos) and everyone else went back around 4-6 months. That said, there was little of the angst that I seem with my white friends around working and parenting.

Yes, if our lives were different many of us would be home or at least then but it wasn't so we accepted it. I rarely feel guilt around my parenting because in the end I do the best I can at any given time. Even down to the fact that I used formula with my 17 yo....I was 19 when he was born, and I did the best I could. It would be silly to feel guilty or that he was cheated from nursing when i nursed his sister 3 years.

So yeah I think that while we may have our twinges of guilt as a whole we don't let guilt drive our parenting.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

I would have never equated the guilt to race......maybe because I am consumed with guilt as to how I raise my son.....hmmmm.......


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## Joyster

Thanks everyone for your two cents, it's definitely given me food for thought. As much as I wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt, I had just finished asking her about her generalizations of Indian people, so I think it came from a "I like black people, they know how to dance and play basketball" perspective. But now that it's talking about mothering, it's all the more "enlightened" because we're revering how entire groups of race parent...if there is such a standard. It got my Spidey sense tingling.


----------



## Draupadi

Tonight, I'm going to try to convince DH to have another baby.
Some background: DH wants to have another child, but he is quite intent on adopting. He believes in zero population growth and also just believes that there are plenty of children out there who need good homes. While I agree with him in some ways, I just can't get over the feeling that I biologically want to give birth one more time. I almost have a physical need to have a baby. I'm sure some of you get me, being mothers and all.








I used to want to adopt, too, but I have always known in my heart that I wanted to birth at least two of my own.
Timing is starting to become crucial on all fronts. I'm 38 and not getting any younger. If I want to conceive again, I should do it now. I'm currently not working so it would be ideal for me to get pregnant now, have the baby, and go back to work next fall (I'm a teacher). I also would like William to have a younger sibling while he's young, too. Does that make sense?
Anyway, it's certainly a complicated issue and I've been wanting to talk to him about it for some time.
So...wish me luck?


----------



## futurmama8

Good luck williamsmama. I hope he understands


----------



## Kappa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Tonight, I'm going to try to convince DH to have another baby.
Some background: DH wants to have another child, but he is quite intent on adopting. He believes in zero population growth and also just believes that there are plenty of children out there who need good homes. While I agree with him in some ways, I just can't get over the feeling that I biologically want to give birth one more time. I almost have a physical need to have a baby. I'm sure some of you get me, being mothers and all.








I used to want to adopt, too, but I have always known in my heart that I wanted to birth at least two of my own.
Timing is starting to become crucial on all fronts. I'm 38 and not getting any younger. If I want to conceive again, I should do it now. I'm currently not working so it would be ideal for me to get pregnant now, have the baby, and go back to work next fall (I'm a teacher). I also would like William to have a younger sibling while he's young, too. Does that make sense?
Anyway, it's certainly a complicated issue and I've been wanting to talk to him about it for some time.
So...wish me luck?

Good luck! And I might be out of line for even suggesting it, but could you "accidentally" get pregnant? Also, even if you have another child, it does not mean that your husband could not continue believing what he believes, you would not have done anything inconsistent with his beliefs. 2-3 children would be a replacement birth rate, right? And having another child certainly wouldn't preclude you from adopting down the line. I'm not sure you wanted all that commentary, but I'm saying all this to say that I hope everything goes well.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Tonight, I'm going to try to convince DH to have another baby.
Some background: DH wants to have another child, but he is quite intent on adopting. He believes in zero population growth and also just believes that there are plenty of children out there who need good homes. While I agree with him in some ways, I just can't get over the feeling that I biologically want to give birth one more time. I almost have a physical need to have a baby. I'm sure some of you get me, being mothers and all.








I used to want to adopt, too, but I have always known in my heart that I wanted to birth at least two of my own.
Timing is starting to become crucial on all fronts. I'm 38 and not getting any younger. If I want to conceive again, I should do it now. I'm currently not working so it would be ideal for me to get pregnant now, have the baby, and go back to work next fall (I'm a teacher). I also would like William to have a younger sibling while he's young, too. Does that make sense?
Anyway, it's certainly a complicated issue and I've been wanting to talk to him about it for some time.
So...wish me luck?











Wishing you luck!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
Good luck! And I might be out of line for even suggesting it, but could you "accidentally" get pregnant? Also, even if you have another child, it does not mean that your husband could not continue believing what he believes, you would not have done anything inconsistent with his beliefs. 2-3 children would be a replacement birth rate, right? And having another child certainly wouldn't preclude you from adopting down the line. I'm not sure you wanted all that commentary, but I'm saying all this to say that I hope everything goes well.

I've been hoping for an "oops" for a while now. We don't use any bc at all and occasionally he's not "careful", so I was hoping something would've happened by now. I was going to wait another month to speak to him about it (I actually asked an online baby psychic what she saw for me and she said she saw Dec. 2009 as a DD) but he mentioned adopting last night and I had to give him an (abbreviated!) version of how I felt.
I was thinking of mentioning the replacement birth rate thing to him, too, and also perhaps adopting after having another baby.
And thanks so much for the commentary. It's helping me organize my thoughts.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 









Wishing you luck!









Thanks, Arike!
It's been something I've been obsessing on for over a year now.


----------



## Kappa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I've been hoping for an "oops" for a while now. We don't use any bc at all and occasionally he's not "careful", so I was hoping something would've happened by now. I was going to wait another month to speak to him about it (I actually asked an online baby psychic what she saw for me and she said she saw Dec. 2009 as a DD) but he mentioned adopting last night and I had to give him an (abbreviated!) version of how I felt.
I was thinking of mentioning the replacement birth rate thing to him, too, and also perhaps adopting after having another baby.
And thanks so much for the commentary. It's helping me organize my thoughts.









What online baby psychic? You can pm me if you want!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Tonight, I'm going to try to convince DH to have another baby.
Some background: DH wants to have another child, but he is quite intent on adopting. He believes in zero population growth and also just believes that there are plenty of children out there who need good homes. While I agree with him in some ways, I just can't get over the feeling that I biologically want to give birth one more time. I almost have a physical need to have a baby. I'm sure some of you get me, being mothers and all.








I used to want to adopt, too, but I have always known in my heart that I wanted to birth at least two of my own.
Timing is starting to become crucial on all fronts. I'm 38 and not getting any younger. If I want to conceive again, I should do it now. I'm currently not working so it would be ideal for me to get pregnant now, have the baby, and go back to work next fall (I'm a teacher). I also would like William to have a younger sibling while he's young, too. Does that make sense?
Anyway, it's certainly a complicated issue and I've been wanting to talk to him about it for some time.
So...wish me luck?


Sheila, you know I am pulling for you. My prediction is for july. If it doesn't happen then, I am done trying








Good luck talking to your dh. Be honest about your thoughts and feelings and trust the rest will fall in place. Blessings.


----------



## Draupadi

I've actually mentioned this to Arike (who I was lucky to meet a few months ago!).
Are there any of you here on the WOC tribe interested in doing a playdate or meeting up?
I must say that since William was born, I've felt pretty isolated. I thought I would make more friends on the playground and other mommy spots, but I haven't made any connections. I have one- ONE!- friend that I see every other week or so and our boys play together, but that's it.
I'd be a liar if I said I didn't feel my skin color had something to do with it.
I live in a predominantly white neighborhood with next to no diversity (I grew up here) and, despite the fact that I smile at people, try to start conversations, whatever, I haven't seemed to make any connections at all. Sometimes I'll see mamas that I met previously and say hi to them and they just sort mumble a "hi" back at me.







:
More than a few times, some of these women thought I was my son's nanny.








I would love for William to see a more diverse set of children sometimes too.
Anyway- is there anyone interested in doing playdates on the odd occasion? As it gets warmer, you all can come and bring your kids to the playgrounds where I live. They're safe and clean.
I can go travel to different places by subway, but I don't have a car so I can't go too, too far.
Sorry I'm rambling, but this is another thing that's been on my mind.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Sheila, you know I am pulling for you. My prediction is for july. If it doesn't happen then, I am done trying








Good luck talking to your dh. Be honest about your thoughts and feelings and trust the rest will fall in place. Blessings.










Back at ya, Sis. I've been praying for you, too!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
What online baby psychic? You can pm me if you want!

I pmed you!


----------



## Brown Lioness

Sending my good wishes that the talk goes smoothly.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Tonight, I'm going to try to convince DH to have another baby.
Some background: DH wants to have another child, but he is quite intent on adopting. He believes in zero population growth and also just believes that there are plenty of children out there who need good homes. While I agree with him in some ways, I just can't get over the feeling that I biologically want to give birth one more time. I almost have a physical need to have a baby. I'm sure some of you get me, being mothers and all.








I used to want to adopt, too, but I have always known in my heart that I wanted to birth at least two of my own.
Timing is starting to become crucial on all fronts. I'm 38 and not getting any younger. If I want to conceive again, I should do it now. I'm currently not working so it would be ideal for me to get pregnant now, have the baby, and go back to work next fall (I'm a teacher). I also would like William to have a younger sibling while he's young, too. Does that make sense?
Anyway, it's certainly a complicated issue and I've been wanting to talk to him about it for some time.
So...wish me luck?


----------



## rootzdawta

WilliamsMama . . . good luck.

Re the playdate, I live pretty far from Brooklyn but I'm down when the weather improves.


----------



## Bloomingstar

I'd like to meet up! I'm in Brooklyn also. Good luck with the talk!

Also, since you all have such a wealth of knowledge and advice...

I am really trying to figure out how to motivate myself to get out of the apartment with the baby by myself. He'll be a month old on Friday and so far we have done 2 trips to the pediatrician and on Sunday we had our first big outing to the black history month event at the Buddhist culture center I go to. All of these were also car trips with DH--I don't know how to drive







(yeah it's on my list of things to do). The weather has been really too cold for my liking, up until this week, and I'm still healing and Lamine is still so young and all of that but...I just wanna o outside! And while I just wanna go outside, even if it is just a walk around the block and back, it seems so daunting.







I am guessing this is maybe normal? When did you all first start getting outside with your babies? And I will say again: I hate winter!


----------



## wiksty

Just dropping by to say hello to everyone and hope that all is well...been busy busy lately, what with DD at 19months and Baby2 due in less than 7 weeks! I'm so excited and all plans for our homebirth are still underway *winks*

DH left a few days ago (we're separated for now...possibly divorced soon...sigh). I'm doing alright, I suppose. Been nesting a bit and getting things in order...trying not to stress too much or think or do too much. But there's so much to get done (if you know what I mean).

Anywho...hope that everyone is doing well. Keep your fingers crossed for me, I should be hearing back soon from my prospective grad schools on whether or not I'm accepted (NYU, UBalt, and Emerson).

Love







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I'd like to meet up! I'm in Brooklyn also. Good luck with the talk!

Also, since you all have such a wealth of knowledge and advice...

I am really trying to figure out how to motivate myself to get out of the apartment with the baby by myself. He'll be a month old on Friday and so far we have done 2 trips to the pediatrician and on Sunday we had our first big outing to the black history month event at the Buddhist culture center I go to. All of these were also car trips with DH--I don't know how to drive







(yeah it's on my list of things to do). The weather has been really too cold for my liking, up until this week, and I'm still healing and Lamine is still so young and all of that but...I just wanna o outside! And while I just wanna go outside, even if it is just a walk around the block and back, it seems so daunting.







I am guessing this is maybe normal? When did you all first start getting outside with your babies? And I will say again: I hate winter!

One after I was given the go ahead to drive, I drove into Atlanta and had lunch with my sister, a cute guy who is in the NFL, a close friend and my DS. I had to throw the NFL player part in because I felt like such a frumpy mommy. I had just given birth less than 5 week previous, I was still flat and looked plump and here I was sitting next to one of the highest NFL draft picks. I felt awful.

Before I was able to drive I would call the courtesy driver at my job and have him cart me around town. I had my hair pressed when DS was about three weeks. Yes, my stitches still hurt, but my hair looked bad.

I was ready to go out by myself about two weeks before I could drive, but I did not.

Girl, just plop him in your carrier and go. You don't even need a diaper bag to go around the block or to the corner store. Just walk and talk to your Lamine.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Just dropping by to say hello to everyone and hope that all is well...been busy busy lately, what with DD at 19months and Baby2 due in less than 7 weeks! I'm so excited and all plans for our homebirth are still underway *winks*

DH left a few days ago (we're separated for now...possibly divorced soon...sigh). I'm doing alright, I suppose. Been nesting a bit and getting things in order...trying not to stress too much or think or do too much. But there's so much to get done (if you know what I mean).

Anywho...hope that everyone is doing well. Keep your fingers crossed for me, I should be hearing back soon from my prospective grad schools on whether or not I'm accepted (NYU, UBalt, and Emerson).

Love







:

Good luck with your acceptances, and God knows that I believe that women need men, but you don't need him if he would walk out on you at a time like this.

You are an awesome Momma!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Just dropping by to say hello to everyone and hope that all is well...been busy busy lately, what with DD at 19months and Baby2 due in less than 7 weeks! I'm so excited and all plans for our homebirth are still underway *winks*

DH left a few days ago (we're separated for now...possibly divorced soon...sigh). I'm doing alright, I suppose. Been nesting a bit and getting things in order...trying not to stress too much or think or do too much. But there's so much to get done (if you know what I mean).

Anywho...hope that everyone is doing well. Keep your fingers crossed for me, I should be hearing back soon from my prospective grad schools on whether or not I'm accepted (NYU, UBalt, and Emerson).

Love







:

I am sending you hugs and positive energy. I hope things work out the way you want them to. this may be a challenging time but you can do anything.


----------



## Jannah6

I'll try to answer everyone. I subscribe to this thread via instant email, but somehow I missed quite a few postings







.

*wiksty* I'm sorry that you are going through this right now.







s and







to you.

*WilliamsMama*, I'll be up for a playdate in a few weeks. DS who is 16 months could definitely use a playmate ot two. Next week DH is starting his MTA training for train operator. So, I have to start dropping/picking my DC up from school in a couple of weeks. Once I'm out of the house I don't want to come back,, so I'll be looking for things to do.








to all the Mamas who are looking forward to having babies.

*Bloomingstar* I second what one of the mamas said about strapping Lamine in to his carrier and just going. Do you feel up to walking to Fulton St and taking the bus back home? Or maybe you have some mail you need to send off and you can walk to the mail box?
With my first DC I was out and about when he was three weeks old. Of course I had old school moms waving their fingers at me, but I couldn't stand looking at my four walls anymore.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Good luck with your acceptances, and God knows that I believe that women need men, but you don't need him if he would walk out on you at a time like this.

You are an awesome Momma!









:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I'd like to meet up! I'm in Brooklyn also. Good luck with the talk!

Also, since you all have such a wealth of knowledge and advice...

I am really trying to figure out how to motivate myself to get out of the apartment with the baby by myself. He'll be a month old on Friday and so far we have done 2 trips to the pediatrician and on Sunday we had our first big outing to the black history month event at the Buddhist culture center I go to. All of these were also car trips with DH--I don't know how to drive







(yeah it's on my list of things to do). The weather has been really too cold for my liking, up until this week, and I'm still healing and Lamine is still so young and all of that but...I just wanna o outside! And while I just wanna go outside, even if it is just a walk around the block and back, it seems so daunting.







I am guessing this is maybe normal? When did you all first start getting outside with your babies? And I will say again: I hate winter!

You've probably gotten tons of advice, but here's mine. Just put Lamine in a carrier or his stroller and go for a walk. Maybe it'll just be for 15 minutes- anything you do will be beneficial for you both.







Fresh air can work wonders!


----------



## Draupadi

Okay, ladies, let's plan something again. If you'd rather, we can wait until the weather gets a little bit warmer and more predictable.









Anyway, we didn't have our talk last night. My friend came by with her baby and we couldn't find the time to talk. So...I'll try again tonight. I feel so anxious about it all.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Just dropping by to say hello to everyone and hope that all is well...been busy busy lately, what with DD at 19months and Baby2 due in less than 7 weeks! I'm so excited and all plans for our homebirth are still underway *winks*

DH left a few days ago (we're separated for now...possibly divorced soon...sigh). I'm doing alright, I suppose. Been nesting a bit and getting things in order...trying not to stress too much or think or do too much. But there's so much to get done (if you know what I mean).

Anywho...hope that everyone is doing well. Keep your fingers crossed for me, I should be hearing back soon from my prospective grad schools on whether or not I'm accepted (NYU, UBalt, and Emerson).

Love







:

Good luck on all fronts. You have a lot on your plate but you sound like you're handling it!


----------



## Bloomingstar

: Thanks everyone! the weather is really beautiful today so we went outside. I'm still getting used to the only carrier I have--moby wrap--but he likes the kangaroo hold and stays asleep in it so we took two short walks--one to the grocery store which is just down the block and around the corner, then another a little while later(we went to fulton st Jannah







) that was about ten blocks away and back. It was great! I even put on earrings, which I'm sure I'll have to abandon again in the near future.







the fresh air was great! he slept until we were coming up the stairs after the second walk. success!


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
I am really trying to figure out how to motivate myself to get out of the apartment with the baby by myself. He'll be a month old on Friday and so far we have done 2 trips to the pediatrician and on Sunday we had our first big outing to the black history month event at the Buddhist culture center I go to. All of these were also car trips with DH--I don't know how to drive







(yeah it's on my list of things to do). The weather has been really too cold for my liking, up until this week, and I'm still healing and Lamine is still so young and all of that but...I just wanna o outside! And while I just wanna go outside, even if it is just a walk around the block and back, it seems so daunting.







I am guessing this is maybe normal? When did you all first start getting outside with your babies? And I will say again: I hate winter!

I didn't get my license until BeanBean was three months old. Here's something you'll hopefully find amusing: When Bean was little I found it very difficult to get out of the house. That persisted until he was about five months old (he was born in November and it was FREAKING COLD that winter). When BooBah was born, it WAS impossible to get out of the house. I did it a few times and I hated every minute of it, and felt completely inadequate to the task. When Bella was born, Mike went back to work after a week. He came home from work and called me, frantic, wanting to know where I was and if everyone was okay. I'd gone to the grocery store-- we were out of milk and cereal.







Things were different with Bear because i was so sick right after he was born, but the salient point is this: There's about as much trauma involved in me getting four kids washed, dressed, and into the car as there was getting one ready to go. I take almost the same amount of crap with me to take all four kids to the state park for the day that I did to take just BeanBean on a 40-minute walk around town.







The only difference would be that Bear is artificially fed (my older three were all exclusively breastfed in the beginning, and nursed for at least 15 months) so I have to plan trips accordingly (formula = paraphernalia; impossible-to-buy-in-a-store formula = additional planning).

It will get easier. Right now, though, you should relax. This business of mothers hopping up and running around immediately after birth is a very modern, very Western one and it's not at all healthful or appropriate. Did you know that there are places in the world where a new mother doesn't get out of bed for several months after the birth of a child? Fresh air is nice, I'll admit it, but if you're desperate you should feel great about opening a window and sitting next to it.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: Thanks everyone! the weather is really beautiful today so we went outside. I'm still getting used to the only carrier I have--moby wrap--but he likes the kangaroo hold and stays asleep in it so we took two short walks--one to the grocery store which is just down the block and around the corner, then another a little while later(we went to fulton st Jannah







) that was about ten blocks away and back. It was great! I even put on earrings, which I'm sure I'll have to abandon again in the near future.







the fresh air was great! he slept until we were coming up the stairs after the second walk. success!









So glad you got out and about! In the early days after I had Ari, I was a hermit and craved being outside. I would get so excited about just walking around the neighborhood, even if it was just to fulton street. And on a sidenote, I think the Moby Wrap is the most amazing thing ever. My LO falls asleep in the Hug Hold so quickly.


----------



## futurmama8

I think the winter makes me crabby and I actually walked outside because it was actually 64 in cincinnati in February! Its weird so I took full advantage of it.

Had any of you heard of people or family members CIO? I have never heard of it until I came here and I am shocked even my most mainstream friends didn't like to have their baby crying. I don't know if it isn't as prevalent within the black community or not, maybe I just don't know get out enough lol


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

It will get easier. Right now, though, you should relax. This business of mothers hopping up and running around immediately after birth is a very modern, very Western one and it's not at all healthful or appropriate. Did you know that there are places in the world where a new mother doesn't get out of bed for several months after the birth of a child? Fresh air is nice, I'll admit it, but if you're desperate you should feel great about opening a window and sitting next to it.

















thanks--I appreciate that a lot--there is something to be said for simply opening the window


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Okay, ladies, let's plan something again. If you'd rather, we can wait until the weather gets a little bit warmer and more predictable.









Anyway, we didn't have our talk last night. My friend came by with her baby and we couldn't find the time to talk. So...I'll try again tonight. I feel so anxious about it all.

You know I am down for a get-together. I get really lonely too as a mom. I am the first one out of all of my friends to have a baby so I feel like I kind of live in a different world now. I really want to get to know more moms. I thought maybe I would make a few friends in the waiting room of my pediatrician's office but I feel sort of like an outsider there; it's like high school all over again!







I mean I definitely get people telling me how cute my baby is but after that initial convo, radio silence. I have had lots of different types of friends throughout my life but since I moved to New York in 2004, I feel like despite the diversity of the city, people here live very separate, segregated and polarized lives. Not as bad as Chicago or Boston, but still, I don't understand why I should be looked at like an alien in a city with so much diversity. And on another note, why are groceries more expensive and of less quality in the hood???!!! But I digress, let's meet up, please, pretty please!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I think the winter makes me crabby and I actually walked outside because it was actually 64 in cincinnati in February! Its weird so I took full advantage of it.

Had any of you heard of people or family members CIO? I have never heard of it until I came here and I am shocked even my most mainstream friends didn't like to have their baby crying. I don't know if it isn't as prevalent within the black community or not, maybe I just don't know get out enough lol

I think some of my Korean cousins did CIO with their children, but I don't know about my Afr. Am. side. It seems to just be the advice that pediatricians give, unfortunately. My mom kept telling me to do it with DS. DH and I decided loooooooong ago to never do it with DS. I'm in the midst of getting him to sleep without nursing right now and people keep mentioning CIO to me, which is NUTS considering he's 21 months old!
One of my friends does/did CIO with both of her children. Her ped. keeps telling her that her 7 mo should be sleeping thru the night by now. She let that baby CIO for 2 hours more than a few times. Ugh.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
You know I am down for a get-together. I get really lonely too as a mom. I am the first one out of all of my friends to have a baby so I feel like I kind of live in a different world now. I really want to get to know more moms. I thought maybe I would make a few friends in the waiting room of my pediatrician's office but *I feel sort of like an outsider* there; it's like high school all over again!







I mean I definitely get people telling me how cute my baby is but after that initial convo, radio silence. I have had lots of different types of friends throughout my life but since I moved to New York in 2004, *I feel like despite the diversity of the city, people here live very separate, segregated and polarized lives.* Not as bad as Chicago or Boston, but still, I don't understand why I should be looked at like an alien in a city with so much diversity.

YES! I know we discussed this before, but ITA. I feel like I live in a high school movie sometimes. There a cliques all over the playgrounds here, and yes, it's definitely segregated. I'm rent stabilized where I live but in an increasingly market rate neighborhood, a lot of the diversity is being pushed further and further out of the area.

Quote:

And on another note, why are groceries more expensive and of less quality in the hood???!!! But I digress, let's meet up, please, pretty please!








I notice this too. There also seems to be less of a variety and as a result, less healthy choices. I used to work on 148th and 7th (Harlem, near the projects for those non-NYers) and would buy lunch at the supermarket sometimes. Sometimes even buying a can of healthy soup was difficult.


----------



## Kappa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 

Had any of you heard of people or family members CIO? I have never heard of it until I came here and I am shocked even my most mainstream friends didn't like to have their baby crying. I don't know if it isn't as prevalent within the black community or not, maybe I just don't know get out enough lol

I had never heard of it before this board, I don't think it is prevalent in the Black community. I'm sure some do it on accident, or out of desperation but not as a part of a formal planned "sleep training program." I don't think anyone in my family does it. The only sleep advice I've gotten so far from family, in 11 mo, was from my somewhat unstable uncle who said to put him in a walker and let him run around until he's so tired he passes out.







There's is a really strong "Don't spoil 'em" streak in my family, but that pretty much doesn't amount to anything in practice, people just say that. Everyone, at the very least, rocks or pats their babies to sleep and gives them a bottle, even well past 2 years old.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Had any of you heard of people or family members CIO? I have never heard of it until I came here and I am shocked even my most mainstream friends didn't like to have their baby crying. I don't know if it isn't as prevalent within the black community or not, maybe I just don't know get out enough lol

Actually CIO was the norm where I came from...I had my first child in 92 and that was definitely the advice I got







. Maybe its a class issues but coming from working class roots, I would say it is and was the norm.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
You know I am down for a get-together. I get really lonely too as a mom. I am the first one out of all of my friends to have a baby so I feel like I kind of live in a different world now. I really want to get to know more moms. I thought maybe I would make a few friends in the waiting room of my pediatrician's office but I feel sort of like an outsider there; it's like high school all over again!







I mean I definitely get people telling me how cute my baby is but after that initial convo, radio silence. I have had lots of different types of friends throughout my life but since I moved to New York in 2004, I feel like despite the diversity of the city, people here live very separate, segregated and polarized lives. Not as bad as Chicago or Boston, but still, I don't understand why I should be looked at like an alien in a city with so much diversity. And on another note, why are groceries more expensive and of less quality in the hood???!!! But I digress, let's meet up, please, pretty please!









I wish I lived close by, I live in Maine so as you can imagine being a Black woman up here does make you standout. Thankfully I do have a few sista friends here but its hard. I am originally from Chicago so I understand what you mean about the segregation. I did live on the northside so it wasn't so bad but when I lived on the southside of Chicago, it was crazy.

Shay


----------



## wiksty

WilliamsMama, Jannah6, purplegirl, and AndrewsMother--- thanks for your support









The situation is so...complicated and untimely, but I think I'm handling things rather well. I couldn't possibly stress my poor unborn child anymore than I have up til now and expect a successful homebirth, so I'm trying to relax.

Hubby left because "I made him," he didn't just desert me...but making him leave has made me a lot happier than having him here (thus far). We've been having problems for a long time now, and...things are just so...far from progressing. I really don't think it's just the hormones. I know it's not actually.

Sigh. Anywho...I'll be glad for nicer weather coming up here soon. Wish I lived on the east coast, sounds like I'm going to be missing all the playdates! Soon enough I hope, if I'm accepted (though I'll probably defer my admission for a year...to get used to life as a single parent and let the babes grow a bit, etc).


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 







: Thanks everyone! the weather is really beautiful today so we went outside. I'm still getting used to the only carrier I have--moby wrap--but he likes the kangaroo hold and stays asleep in it so we took two short walks--one to the grocery store which is just down the block and around the corner, then another a little while later(we went to fulton st Jannah







) that was about ten blocks away and back. It was great! I even put on earrings, which I'm sure I'll have to abandon again in the near future.







the fresh air was great! he slept until we were coming up the stairs after the second walk. success!

















:*Bloomingstar*







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I think the winter makes me crabby and I actually walked outside because it was actually 64 in cincinnati in February! Its weird so I took full advantage of it.

Had any of you heard of people or family members CIO? I have never heard of it until I came here and I am shocked even my most mainstream friends didn't like to have their baby crying. I don't know if it isn't as prevalent within the black community or not, maybe I just don't know get out enough lol

My BIL's wife(Who is Black) plans to CIO. She said her mom did it







..... I plan on working on her, especially since she just found out that she's pregnant. I do think that it is done in the Black community, but it wasn't given a name or a 'method', ie the Ferber method.
My DH sister used the Ferber method and it makes me sick just thinking about it









I didn't realize that there were so many NYC mamas on this board. I just found out that there are *free* baby and Me classes, children music classes, adult knitting/crochet classes offered in Bed-Stuy and two other areas, which I can't remember offhand. I don't have the info handy, but if anyone is interested in attending let me know. When Safi is a little older I definately want to join.
Also, for you Brooklynites the WIC program at Restoration Plaza has some awesome programs, like cooking healthy. In the Spring they have a Breastfeeding awareness brunch which is super awesome. It is a nice opportunity to talk to mothers-to-be and encourage them to breastfeed.

Here's some news from Brooklyn's Still Hip maternity/childrens resale shop:
*Still Hip*
*The funky Clinton Hill children's resale boutique hosts its annual bag sale - buy a bag for $15-$18 and fill with clothing, toys and gear.
When: Sun. 2/15, 12-3pm.
Where: 283 Grand Ave. (off Lafayette), Brooklyn, 718-398-0008, stillhipbrooklyn.com.*

*
BTW*, wanna know a secret??? I'm nervous about meeting you mamas IRL


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My BIL's wife(Who is Black) plans to CIO. She said her mom did it







..... I plan on working on her, especially since she just found out that she's pregnant. I do think that it is done in the Black community, but it wasn't given a name or a 'method', ie the Ferber method.
My DH sister used the Ferber method and it makes me sick just thinking about it









I didn't realize that there were so many NYC mamas on this board. I just found out that there are *free* baby and Me classes, children music classes, adult knitting/crochet classes offered in Bed-Stuy and two other areas, which I can't remember offhand. I don't have the info handy, but if anyone is interested in attending let me know. When Safi is a little older I definately want to join.
Also, for you Brooklynites the WIC program at Restoration Plaza has some awesome programs, like cooking healthy. In the Spring they have a Breastfeeding awareness brunch which is super awesome. It is a nice opportunity to talk to mothers-to-be and encourage them to breastfeed.

Here's some news from Brooklyn's Still Hip maternity/childrens resale shop:
*Still Hip*
*The funky Clinton Hill children's resale boutique hosts its annual bag sale - buy a bag for $15-$18 and fill with clothing, toys and gear.
When: Sun. 2/15, 12-3pm.
Where: 283 Grand Ave. (off Lafayette), Brooklyn, 718-398-0008, stillhipbrooklyn.com.*

*
BTW*, *wanna know a secret??? I'm nervous about meeting you mamas IRL







*


Love your honesty mama. I'm willing to bet that you're not the only one. I would love to meet all of you IRL. I don't have kids so it might seem kind of weird but I love meeting new people particularly women with whom I share things in common


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
My BIL's wife(Who is Black) plans to CIO. She said her mom did it







..... I plan on working on her, especially since she just found out that she's pregnant. I do think that it is done in the Black community, but it wasn't given a name or a 'method', ie the Ferber method.
My DH sister used the Ferber method and it makes me sick just thinking about it









I didn't realize that there were so many NYC mamas on this board. I just found out that there are *free* baby and Me classes, children music classes, adult knitting/crochet classes offered in Bed-Stuy and two other areas, which I can't remember offhand. I don't have the info handy, but if anyone is interested in attending let me know. When Safi is a little older I definately want to join.
Also, for you Brooklynites the WIC program at Restoration Plaza has some awesome programs, like cooking healthy. In the Spring they have a Breastfeeding awareness brunch which is super awesome. It is a nice opportunity to talk to mothers-to-be and encourage them to breastfeed.

Here's some news from Brooklyn's Still Hip maternity/childrens resale shop:
*Still Hip*
*The funky Clinton Hill children's resale boutique hosts its annual bag sale - buy a bag for $15-$18 and fill with clothing, toys and gear.
When: Sun. 2/15, 12-3pm.
Where: 283 Grand Ave. (off Lafayette), Brooklyn, 718-398-0008, stillhipbrooklyn.com.*

*
BTW*, wanna know a secret??? I'm nervous about meeting you mamas IRL









I'm a lil nervous too!







but I'm sure we'll play nice







I definitely wanna check out this shop on Sunday--we'l see if it happens.

regarding CIO, I have no idea what my family does as I'm pretty far from them--my sister doesn't, not sure bout the cousins. I was told that I was a pretty fussy baby--cried a lot but what 8 month old wouldn't if their mother just died?--and that people (whichever family member was watching me at the time) let me cry and cry by myself. I don't remember this, of course, but it sounds horrid and I am probably still resentful of the family member who told me this story







:


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
You know I am down for a get-together. I get really lonely too as a mom. I am the first one out of all of my friends to have a baby so I feel like I kind of live in a different world now. I really want to get to know more moms. I thought maybe I would make a few friends in the waiting room of my pediatrician's office but I feel sort of like an outsider there; it's like high school all over again!







I mean I definitely get people telling me how cute my baby is but after that initial convo, radio silence. I have had lots of different types of friends throughout my life but since I moved to New York in 2004, I feel like despite the diversity of the city, people here live very separate, segregated and polarized lives. Not as bad as Chicago or Boston, but still, I don't understand why I should be looked at like an alien in a city with so much diversity. And on another note, why are groceries more expensive and of less quality in the hood???!!! But I digress, let's meet up, please, pretty please!









I know what you mean because my college is in the hood and they have cases and cases full of jus pork. If you love pork you would love this store. I couldn't even find some quality fish in there. Then the vegetable section is in the back corner of the store and has the basics. I understand its supply and demand but come on this why people in the urban low income areas have so many health problems. I don't know I guess it doesn't cost as much either but it makes me so frustrated.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kappa* 
I had never heard of it before this board, I don't think it is prevalent in the Black community. I'm sure some do it on accident, or out of desperation but not as a part of a formal planned "sleep training program." I don't think anyone in my family does it. The only sleep advice I've gotten so far from family, in 11 mo, was from my somewhat unstable uncle who said to put him in a walker and let him run around until he's so tired he passes out.







There's is a really strong "Don't spoil 'em" streak in my family, but that pretty much doesn't amount to anything in practice, people just say that. Everyone, at the very least, rocks or pats their babies to sleep and gives them a bottle, even well past 2 years old.

Yeah I agree that its not used as a sleep training program. I am actually surprised to see so many of my mainstream friends with kids actually co sleep because their babies sleep better with them. My godson finally went into his own room when he was 3 and he did because he decorated it himself with spiderman lol. So maybe parenting is very different within the black community.

I am so jealous that I don't live in New York. I don't have any babies but I would also like to meet WOC with like minded views. Cincinnati is very conservative and the only crunchy friend I have is caucasian and its great having at least 1 around. I hate the cold so I can't even see myself moving to New York. You guys are so lucky to have each other though.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

I didn't realize that there were so many NYC mamas on this board. I just found out that there are *free* baby and Me classes, children music classes, adult knitting/crochet classes offered in Bed-Stuy and two other areas, which I can't remember offhand. I don't have the info handy, but if anyone is interested in attending let me know. When Safi is a little older I definately want to join.
Also, for you Brooklynites the WIC program at Restoration Plaza has some awesome programs, like cooking healthy. In the Spring they have a Breastfeeding awareness brunch which is super awesome. It is a nice opportunity to talk to mothers-to-be and encourage them to breastfeed.

Here's some news from Brooklyn's Still Hip maternity/childrens resale shop:
*Still Hip*
*The funky Clinton Hill children's resale boutique hosts its annual bag sale - buy a bag for $15-$18 and fill with clothing, toys and gear.
When: Sun. 2/15, 12-3pm.
Where: 283 Grand Ave. (off Lafayette), Brooklyn, 718-398-0008, stillhipbrooklyn.com.*

Um did you say FREE classes in Bed Stuy? I am so there. Can you PM me the info? Also, I would love to go to the WIC programs too, am I allowed to go even if I don't receive WIC benefits? I need to visit Still Hip.







That sale sounds awesome.

ETA: I am sorta nervous about meeting IRL too.


----------



## jeca

One again I haven't received any email notices updated me on this thread









I'm jealous that so many of you live so close.


----------



## wiksty

Hello All







My 19mo. old daughter has the cutest curls, but I need a new set of products for her hair.

Thus far, I have made her shampoo, skipped conditioning, and only put jojoba oil in it in between washes. Her shampoo is a mixture of organic olive oil, tea tree oil, jojoba oil, and Dr. Bronner's Baby Mild pure castille soap. This has worked wonders on her all her life, until now.

I'm noticing her curls getting drier faster and the shampoo cleaning well, but not really leaving her hair looking healthy. Any ideas? I am Black and DH is White, her hair is a good mix of us two, but more on the European side. It gets frizzy and tangles easily, but with water and/or oil its always soft and silky.

HELP! I'm going to make shampoo for Baby 2 when he or she is a newborn as well, but I need something else for my toddler girl. Have any of you tried Curls? The brand of hair care products I mean...or heard good things about it? I use Giovanni on my hair, it's an organic brand that both hubby and I can use, we love it, but I think it'd be too strong for her.

Any ideas? I hope you have some! I don't want to ruin her hair by not giving it the nutritious upkeep it deserves. Thanks in advance Mamas!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Hello All







My 19mo. old daughter has the cutest curls, but I need a new set of products for her hair.

Thus far, I have made her shampoo, skipped conditioning, and only put jojoba oil in it in between washes. Her shampoo is a mixture of organic olive oil, tea tree oil, jojoba oil, and Dr. Bronner's Baby Mild pure castille soap. This has worked wonders on her all her life, until now.

I'm noticing her curls getting drier faster and the shampoo cleaning well, but not really leaving her hair looking healthy. Any ideas? I am Black and DH is White, her hair is a good mix of us two, but more on the European side. It gets frizzy and tangles easily, but with water and/or oil its always soft and silky.

HELP! I'm going to make shampoo for Baby 2 when he or she is a newborn as well, but I need something else for my toddler girl. Have any of you tried Curls? The brand of hair care products I mean...or heard good things about it? I use Giovanni on my hair, it's an organic brand that both hubby and I can use, we love it, but I think it'd be too strong for her.

Any ideas? I hope you have some! I don't want to ruin her hair by not giving it the nutritious upkeep it deserves. Thanks in advance Mamas!

My DS has curly hair. It is silky, but has some thickness. I don't use any shampoo on DS either homemade or mild as any soap is drying to curly hair, IMO. I massage conditioner into his dry hair, then rinse, repeat. After I blot his hair dry, I apply coconut oil.

I have tried all kinds of conditioner, organic, natural, etc, etc, and what works best for us is Suave.

You might try putting a cap on her head after your DD has fallen asleep.

I also use the same products on my hair which has improved tremendously since I experimented with different products over the summer.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
My DS has curly hair. It is silky, but has some thickness. I don't use any shampoo on DS either homemade or mild as any soap is drying to curly hair, IMO. I massage conditioner into his dry hair, then rinse, repeat. After I blot his hair dry, I apply coconut oil.

I have tried all kinds of conditioner, organic, natural, etc, etc, and what works best for us is Suave.

You might try putting a cap on her head after your DD has fallen asleep.

I also use the same products on my hair which has improved tremendously since I experimented with different products over the summer.


Thanks! Which type of Suave do you use? Is there an organic version of their normal stuff? And do you use satin/silk caps? I tried to make her some before (not caps, but sheets) because until she's old enough to tell me that something is bothering her I'd hate to be causing her pain (I cannot deal with anything being around my head without getting a migraine, it took me years to find a cap that I don't rip off during the night, lol).

I def. think she's ready for a conditioner of some sort. Guess I'll have to just start trying things out, same as I had to do when going natural with my hair. It took a ton of different washes to figure out what worked and what didn't, but I'm happy and healthy headed now







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Thanks! Which type of Suave do you use? Is there an organic version of their normal stuff? And do you use satin/silk caps? I tried to make her some before (not caps, but sheets) because until she's old enough to tell me that something is bothering her I'd hate to be causing her pain (I cannot deal with anything being around my head without getting a migraine, it took me years to find a cap that I don't rip off during the night, lol).

I def. think she's ready for a conditioner of some sort. Guess I'll have to just start trying things out, same as I had to do when going natural with my hair. It took a ton of different washes to figure out what worked and what didn't, but I'm happy and healthy headed now







:

No Suave does not have an organic version, I wish that they did! I put my cap on him at night, it does not cause my head to hurt (and I have a large head) so it should not cause him any pain. I purchased it from the evil empire(wal-mart).

This is the cap that I use.

http://store.goldenmartbeautysupply....nsacabosa.html

Could you braid her hair and secure the ends with a snag free rubber band. Maybe 4 or 5 loose braids. This too will protect the hair from the drying effects of cotton sheets.


----------



## rootzdawta

Wiksty, folks have had good results with Oyin Handmade hair products


----------



## Jannah6

I use curly q's(curls) products for my DD's and I really like them. I gave a friend a sample and she liked it it for her DD's too. I use the adult curls products for myself.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
Hello All







My 19mo. old daughter has the cutest curls, but I need a new set of products for her hair.

Thus far, I have made her shampoo, skipped conditioning, and only put jojoba oil in it in between washes. Her shampoo is a mixture of organic olive oil, tea tree oil, jojoba oil, and Dr. Bronner's Baby Mild pure castille soap. This has worked wonders on her all her life, until now.

I'm noticing her curls getting drier faster and the shampoo cleaning well, but not really leaving her hair looking healthy. Any ideas? I am Black and DH is White, her hair is a good mix of us two, but more on the European side. It gets frizzy and tangles easily, but with water and/or oil its always soft and silky.

HELP! I'm going to make shampoo for Baby 2 when he or she is a newborn as well, but I need something else for my toddler girl. Have any of you tried Curls? The brand of hair care products I mean...or heard good things about it? I use Giovanni on my hair, it's an organic brand that both hubby and I can use, we love it, but I think it'd be too strong for her.

Any ideas? I hope you have some! I don't want to ruin her hair by not giving it the nutritious upkeep it deserves. Thanks in advance Mamas!

I would actually stick to the conditioner and use the shampoo less. I'm a curly head myself (as is my son . I'm 1/2 Af.Am/Korean and have very curly hair) and I wash my hair very, very rarely, and then only with castile soap (Dr. Bronner's, very little of it). Curls crave moisture and shampoo just strips moisture out. Use a mild conditioner (Giovanni is supposed to be very, very good) with no silicones in it on her hair and only finger comb her hair since using a comb destroys curls. For daily maintenance, put some conditioner in a spritz bottle with water (like a 1:4 ratio) and finger comb her hair. Her curls will look great!
I've used Curls and thought it was okay. It's a bit expensive to use for a child. I would stick to just a good, rich conditioner and water. The jojoba is probably great, too.
Go to www.naturallycurly.com and check out their discussion boards, too. They have a section for moms of curly kids. People on there are OBSESSED with their curls so you'll definitely find a product that suits your need.


----------



## Jannah6

*Arike*, it was nice meeting you today. Sorry that I had to run. My brain wasn't working right either, I couldn't even remember PM, LOL. The baby was in the car with my aunt and she started to cry, plus I don't do well with crowds like that. So I was a little overwhelmed.
I totally didn't expect a crowd like that. If I had known I would have been there very early. I was actually there at 12 pm, but there were at least 15 people waiting outside for the store to open.
I have some things for your DS. Do you drive, if not I can drop off. PM me your # and I'll try to get you the things this week.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
No Suave does not have an organic version, I wish that they did! I put my cap on him at night, it does not cause my head to hurt (and I have a large head) so it should not cause him any pain. I purchased it from the evil empire(wal-mart).

This is the cap that I use.

http://store.goldenmartbeautysupply....nsacabosa.html

Could you braid her hair and secure the ends with a snag free rubber band. Maybe 4 or 5 loose braids. This too will protect the hair from the drying effects of cotton sheets.

I wish! Maybe once i deliver Baby I'll have the strength to do what it'd take in order to braid her hair. I have a hard enough time getting her to let me brush it *sigh* Aaugh! I loathe the evil empire...but that's where I get my hair caps as well, lol. Thanks!

@*rootzdawta* thanks for the link, I'll check it out









@*Jannah6* thanks...I think I'll try it first...then other products as needed.

@*WilliamsMama* thank you as well. Which conditioner would you suggest? I figured Giovanni would be too strong for her...do you know of a children's version? Thanks for the link to the discussion board and tip for daily moisturizing. I've been so distraught over this issue as of late because I know her curls could be so much healthier and I feel like I'm ruining her hair!

Off Topic: Still jealous I don't live on the east coast, as all you mamas get to meet up and have playdates and such!







but still waiting on grad school letters...and all are east coast schools...so maybe within a year! Keeping my fingers crossed.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Wiksty, folks have had good results with Oyin Handmade hair products

OMG, I just checked the site...I'm salivating! Lol...I think I'll try them on MY hair!

Oooh, I'm so excited now







:


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
I wish! Maybe once i deliver Baby I'll have the strength to do what it'd take in order to braid her hair. I have a hard enough time getting her to let me brush it *sigh* Aaugh! I loathe the evil empire...but that's where I get my hair caps as well, lol. Thanks!

@*rootzdawta* thanks for the link, I'll check it out









@*Jannah6* thanks...I think I'll try it first...then other products as needed.

@*WilliamsMama* thank you as well. Which conditioner would you suggest? I figured Giovanni would be too strong for her...do you know of a children's version? Thanks for the link to the discussion board and tip for daily moisturizing. I've been so distraught over this issue as of late because I know her curls could be so much healthier and I feel like I'm ruining her hair!

Off Topic: Still jealous I don't live on the east coast, as all you mamas get to meet up and have playdates and such!







but still waiting on grad school letters...*and all are east coast schools.*..so maybe within a year! Keeping my fingers crossed.

Why are all of my top choices on the east coast? The east coast is magic compared to the rest of the U.S.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
OMG, I just checked the site...I'm salivating! Lol...I think I'll try them on MY hair!

Oooh, I'm so excited now







:

I can attest to their products as well.







Enjoy!


----------



## jeca

Witsky I use http://www.curls.biz/ on my girls hair with great success. They do not contain parabans or SLS.
I have not tried thier babyline though but the regular children's line and adult shampoo is pretty gentle. My girls are black and hispanic. My youngest hair takes very much after the hispanic side and my oldest is a 50/50 mixture.
I also use Jason's biotin shampoo if I am out of curls products. It lathers pretty well for a SLS free shampoo and I think it works pretty well also haven't tried the conditioner though.


----------



## wiksty

has anyone every tried this one?

http://www.puristusa.com/conditioner...entedwheatfree

it's a bit pricey...but has wonderful ingredients!

@*jeca* Thanks







I may try it...most def. a cheaper buy than what I've listed above. I am concerned about a few of the ingredients in the curls products though and will have to investigate a little deeper first.


----------



## Jannah6

NAK

Is anyone familiar with http://chocolatebrides.com/. If so, what do you think about it? My sister told me about it a few yrs ago. I became a member, but just a luker.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
OMG, I just checked the site...I'm salivating! Lol...I think I'll try them on MY hair!

Oooh, I'm so excited now







:

Oyin stuff is just delicious! I personally love Greg Juice.

For William, I use any cheap conditioner I have on hand (right now, I've been using Herbal Essences Hello Hydration for myself) and mix it with water (about a 4:1 or conditioner /water:conditioner or even less) and spritz his hair with it. I've found you don't need to use an expensive conditioner to do the trick, you know? Even White Rain conditioners work well. Anything else is just too heavy for his hair. I only finger comb his hair. HTH!


----------



## Jannah6

I have to try the Oyin products. I think I'll order this week, the girls are out of school and def. need their hair done


----------



## Draupadi

So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

Congratulations







: Are you going to start taking vit. or eat differently? We've never TTC, but I know some women do these things when they are TTC.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Congratulations







: Are you going to start taking vit. or eat differently? We've never TTC, but I know some women do these things when they are TTC.

I never actually tried either.







William was a surprise (and a very pleasant one). I will be keeping an eye on ovulation, though. I'm still taking a prenatal vitamin since I'm still breastfeeding William, but other than that... I don't know! We want a girl. I know one is more likely to conceive a girl in the fertile days before ovulation or something like that.
Hoping for the best, of course!


----------



## ~gilli~

I have never TTC either, Jannah6. I have just happened to get pregnant 4 times, lol. Lucky shot I guess!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Oyin stuff is just delicious! I personally love Greg Juice.


Greg Juice is great, I use it on my locs but can also use it to help detangle dd (who has looser curl pattern) hair. All Oyin products are amazing.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

Congratulations!!!







: I did start taking folic acid when I was TTC but I was pregnant within a month of stopping BC.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
I have never TTC either, Jannah6. I have just happened to get pregnant 4 times, lol. Lucky shot I guess!









I know what you mean


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

Whoa nelly! That is great news Sheila.







: I just know it's going to happen!


----------



## eilonwy

I TTC once.







BooBah was planned from beginning to end, including girly bits.








If I had it to do over... I'd have waited six more months.







: We wanted her birthday to be in late spring or summer, though, so there she was.














:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Whoa nelly! That is great news Sheila.







: I just know it's going to happen!

Crossing my fingers.
I think I have one more cycle after this one to see if my prediction will come true.








I personally was surprised how easy it was to convince him. I think since I convinced him that I wasn't against adoption, he was more open to having another.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I TTC once.







BooBah was planned from beginning to end, including girly bits.







If I had it to do over... I'd have waited six more months.







: We wanted her birthday to be in late spring or summer, though, so there she was.














:

How'd you plan for a girl?
Did you do the Shettles Method thing?


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Arike*, it was nice meeting you today. Sorry that I had to run. My brain wasn't working right either, I couldn't even remember PM, LOL. The baby was in the car with my aunt and she started to cry, plus I don't do well with crowds like that. So I was a little overwhelmed.
I totally didn't expect a crowd like that. If I had known I would have been there very early. I was actually there at 12 pm, but there were at least 15 people waiting outside for the store to open.
I have some things for your DS. Do you drive, if not I can drop off. PM me your # and I'll try to get you the things this week.

I didn't get anywhere on Sunday







I will eventually check that place out though.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!









: that's awesome


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
How'd you plan for a girl?
Did you do the Shettles Method thing?

We just scheduled it to be four days before I was supposed to ovulate. My cycles were like clockwork, though, so it was ridiculously easy. I could point to the dates every month that I'd ovulate. It ended up taking four of my cycles because the best dates were all Fridays & Saturdays, and we were always at his parents' house. I finally told him that I was never going to get pregnant if we kept doing that, so we stayed home one weekend and voila! Enter Miss BooBah.


----------



## Jannah6

How would you ladies feel about meeting here (http://www.mamalunyc.com/)one day in the future? We could meet on a sunny day, there is also a nice park right across the street. For the Bed-Stuy non drivers I'd be willing to pick up







. Or if you have something more local that you'd like to suggest, please do.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
So we had the talk...finally.

We've decided to both TTC#2 AND adopt!







: It wasn't even a long argument, but the bottom line is that we're getting what we both wanted. He seems ok with it and is already asking me what we should do to start tracking my ovulation so we can try for a girl.









I feel so relieved, but now I'm anxious! We're starting this cycle so I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

Congrats!







If me and DH decide to have another we are trying for another boy. I'll need to track my cycles, they are so unpredictable. I don't want a girl because mothers and daughters in my family have ISSUES! My cousin said I could break the cycle but I don't want to tempt fate.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
How would you ladies feel about meeting here (http://www.mamalunyc.com/)one day in the future? We could meet on a sunny day, there is also a nice park right across the street. For the Bed-Stuy non drivers I'd be willing to pick up







. Or if you have something more local that you'd like to suggest, please do.

That place looks nice! Could we do it on a weekend? I am a working mommy.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
That place looks nice! Could we do it on a weekend? I am a working mommy.

I'm willing to meet on a weekend


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
How would you ladies feel about meeting here (http://www.mamalunyc.com/)one day in the future? We could meet on a sunny day, there is also a nice park right across the street. For the Bed-Stuy non drivers I'd be willing to pick up







. Or if you have something more local that you'd like to suggest, please do.

Jannah, that place looks great! Let's do it!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Congrats!







If me and DH decide to have another we are trying for another boy. I'll need to track my cycles, they are so unpredictable. I don't want a girl because mothers and daughters in my family have ISSUES! My cousin said I could break the cycle but I don't want to tempt fate.









It might take a while before your cycles become regular. It hasn't been that long for me, and now I'm on a 25-26 day cycle when I used to be on a 28 day one.
I'm dying for a girl. I love my boy, but I've always wanted a girl.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
It might take a while before your cycles become regular. It hasn't been that long for me, and now I'm on a 25-26 day cycle when I used to be on a 28 day one.
I'm dying for a girl. I love my boy, but I've always wanted a girl.









I felt the same way when I was pregnant the 2nd time....I was so emotional the day we had the ultra-sound and I discovered she was indeed a girl. I love both my babies but having a girl as a woman is really cool. Its strange because my son is 17 and at that age where I am aware that one day soon he will fly away. Yet I feel like and maybe its because I was super close with my own Mom that my girl and I will always be tight. Its hard to explain.


----------



## eilonwy

I love my girls and my boys, but I admit to remaining fascinated by the idea of being pregnant with a boy. (And no, I am not having any more. Contrary to what you may read elsewhere, I am not that crazy.) It really drives home for me the fact that we're making new people who didn't exist before. In some ways, a girl in utero feels a bit like an extension of myself, but having a boy living and growing inside of my body... it's entirely foreign! It's quite the head trip to me. Then they come out and they're definately boys, very different, fascinating little people... and I get to wrap my head around the fact that they lived and grew inside of me before the came out all over again. It's one of those incredible mysteries to me that there's someone who is, in every conceivable way, a stranger growing inside of your body... a strange *person*. A person who can't relate to the most fundamental detail of who I am in even a cursory way. Weird.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I felt the same way when I was pregnant the 2nd time....I was so emotional the day we had the ultra-sound and I discovered she was indeed a girl. I love both my babies but having a girl as a woman is really cool. Its strange because my son is 17 and at that age where I am aware that one day soon he will fly away. Yet I feel like and maybe its because I was super close with my own Mom that my girl and I will always be tight. Its hard to explain.


AWWWWW









*Arike* , you definitely could break the cycle.

Speaking of cycles, I think my menses will be here soon


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
AWWWWW









*Arike* , you definitely could break the cycle.

Speaking of cycles, I think my menses will be here soon









Well try for #7! It is the perfect #.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well try for #7! It is the perfect #.

this totally made me cackle! Jannah, how is Safiyyah doing? that place looks great


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Well try for #7! It is the perfect #.

*NAK*
You're kidding, right







:







I'll try for 7 when you try for 3









*Bloomingstar*, she's doing much better, thanks for asking. She's not as sleepy and wants me to hold her all the time. Guess I'll be wearing her all day. I'm really trying to enjoy her. She's such a little lady








How's Lamine doing? Any new pics to share?
*
BTW* Lisa, I'm loving the pics of that house that you posted on FB. I totally need that space for my DC. Was that in PA?

*ETA*, Ladies talk to me about probiotics.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
AWWWWW









*Arike* , you definitely could break the cycle.

I think I could perhaps break the cycles. I mean the fact that I am aware that there is one already helps alot. My mother said something interesting about daughters versus sons:

"A daughter is a daughter for life. A son is a son until he takes a wife." I am not sure if I necessarily agree with that. But I feel like I have more contact with my parents on a regular basis than my brother.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I think I could perhaps break the cycles. I mean the fact that I am aware that there is one already helps alot. My mother said something interesting about daughters versus sons:

"A daughter is a daughter for life. A son is a son until he takes a wife." I am not sure if I necessarily agree with that. But I feel like I have more contact with my parents on a regular basis than my brother.










I was thinking the same thing. Knowing/Acknowledging that a problem exists is the first step to change.

I don't agree with this statement "A daughter is a daughter for life. A son is a son until he takes a wife." I actually think that this line of thinking helps to set up a failed relationship between MIL & DIL.

I see that a few mamas here have had HB. I've never had one, too chicken. Did you post birth stories or take pics?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I see that a few mamas here have had HB. I've never had one, too chicken. Did you post birth stories or take pics?

My birth happened SO quickly, we didn't have time to take pictures.







I guess that's a good and bad thing.







But I have a very detailed birth story on my blog:

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html

I







homebirth! If I do have another baby, I definitely want it to be homebirth and this time I KNOW to have the videocam and the still camera ready! I also wanted to have a waterbirth and my doula was going to bring the pool the next day after I delivered! But everything went smoothly, even though I had to give birth "on land", LOL! I love my midwife and my doula. I am actually friends with my doula now. We even had a combo birthday party since our birthdays are 2 days apart. But I digress, it felt awesome pushing out a baby and then falling asleep in my own bed with my husband and the new baby nestled in between us.







And I got to eat my own food and give birth on my own terms. I wasn't really hungry during labor, just very thirsty. Afterwards I had an apple, some almond butter and some cheese. Then I had some slightly burnt waffles.(DH tries!)
My family was very against my homebirth. Mainly my mom and my grandmother. My grandmother told me over the winter vacation that she didn't eat for 2 days and her hair fell out because she was so stressed out about my homebirth. Mind you, I hadn't planned on telling her about the homebirth until AFTER it happened but my mom told her. She knew what she was doing. She probably thought I would reconsider the homebirth and go the hospital instead just to appease my grandmother... Oh well, my body, my baby, my choice.


----------



## Jannah6

*Arike* I'll have to read your blog when the children settle down and my mind is clear







. I'm feeling a lot better thanks to the pain med.
My DH just started a new job yesterday. We'll be getting new health insurance that my current Ped doesn't accept







. Can any of you recommend a Ped in Brooklyn who is comfortable with delayed/selective Vax?


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Arike* I'll have to read your blog when the children settle down and my mind is clear







. I'm feeling a lot better thanks to the pain med.
My DH just started a new job yesterday. We'll be getting new health insurance that my current Ped doesn't accept







. Can any of you recommend a Ped in Brooklyn who is comfortable with delayed/selective Vax?

I take Ari to Tribeca Pediatrics in Boerum Hill. They do Vax on a delayed scheduled. They seem pretty open to selective although I plan on getting most of the vax for Ari and separating the MMR. I plan on traveling abroad alot with Ari and I know some of the countries we will go to still have problems with diseases like pertussis, polio, etc... If I just planned on staying in the US, I would have probably opted not to get certain ones.

ETA: Can anyone tell that I am in the procrastinating mood at work today???


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I take Ari to Tribeca Pediatrics in Boerum Hill. They do Vax on a delayed scheduled. They seem pretty open to selective although I plan on getting most of the vax for Ari and separating the MMR. I plan on traveling abroad alot with Ari and I know some of the countries we will go to still have problems with diseases like pertussis, polio, etc... If I just planned on staying in the US, I would have probably opted not to get certain ones.

ETA: Can anyone tell that I am in the procrastinating mood at work today???









Thanks for the info.
I thought you were on the PC a little more than usual







, but I like the company.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I was thinking the same thing. Knowing/Acknowledging that a problem exists is the first step to change.

I don't agree with this statement "A daughter is a daughter for life. A son is a son until he takes a wife." I actually think that this line of thinking helps to set up a failed relationship between MIL & DIL.

I see that a few mamas here have had HB. I've never had one, too chicken. Did you post birth stories or take pics?

I have a bunch of pictures! we didnt really plan to take them but now I'm so happy to have them! I was looking at them a coupl days ago and re-realizing that I just had a baby (even though he's right here all the time







) I know I posted a bit of a story somewhere in this thread but I eventually want to really write one. I am SO GLAD I was at home. With all the stuff I had going on--vomiting the whole way through, being pretty whiny







, and it generally taking forever, along with the placenta issue and passing out for a second--had I been in the hospital it would've been ten million times more dramatic and would've actually been frightening. At home, in the hands of a great midwife, I was able to just do what I needed to do, and rest and recover, all on my own terms. I think it's not all rosy and so forth, but it doesn't have to be. And I love love love my midwife--and my doula and I were friends already









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
My birth happened SO quickly, we didn't have time to take pictures.







I guess that's a good and bad thing.







But I have a very detailed birth story on my blog:

http://lildudeinmybelly.blogspot.com...-my-belly.html

I







homebirth! If I do have another baby, I definitely want it to be homebirth and this time I KNOW to have the videocam and the still camera ready! I also wanted to have a waterbirth and my doula was going to bring the pool the next day after I delivered! But everything went smoothly, even though I had to give birth "on land", LOL! I love my midwife and my doula. I am actually friends with my doula now. We even had a combo birthday party since our birthdays are 2 days apart. But I digress, it felt awesome pushing out a baby and then falling asleep in my own bed with my husband and the new baby nestled in between us.







And I got to eat my own food and give birth on my own terms. I wasn't really hungry during labor, just very thirsty. Afterwards I had an apple, some almond butter and some cheese. Then I had some slightly burnt waffles.(DH tries!)
My family was very against my homebirth. Mainly my mom and my grandmother. My grandmother told me over the winter vacation that she didn't eat for 2 days and her hair fell out because she was so stressed out about my homebirth. Mind you, I hadn't planned on telling her about the homebirth until AFTER it happened but my mom told her. She knew what she was doing. She probably thought I would reconsider the homebirth and go the hospital instead just to appease my grandmother... Oh well, my body, my baby, my choice.

yeah I had some family members tell me afterwards how "terrified" they were, especially since he was 2.5 weeks late and turned out so big and I'm pretty small--5'2". I totally agree with Arike--"my body, my baby, my choice."

on another note--
have any of you all seen the film "Orgasmic Birth?" because with all the challenges before and after, pushing was the most awesome time for me


----------



## Bloomingstar

to quote jeca a few pages back,

I killed the thread!







:


----------



## Jannah6

No you didn't Bloomingstar







. I haven't looked at "Orgasmic Birth?" yet, but I will.

How's Lamine doing? What's his sleeping and eating patterns like?
*I noticed that there are a few Mama's here that were born in late January, GO US







*


----------



## purplegirl

Nope, you didn't kill the thread mama!
I actually went to view "orgasmic birth" and got distracted. I intend to view it tonight after running errands!
I hope you all enjoyed the weekend


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*I noticed that there are a few Mama's here that were born in late January, GO US







*

I was born in late January! the 28th! Go us!







Oh and Ari is four months today!







:


----------



## Jannah6

:*Ari*







:


----------



## shayinme

I'm January 23.


----------



## Draupadi

Happy Belated Birthdays, January Mamas!


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
No you didn't Bloomingstar







. I haven't looked at "Orgasmic Birth?" yet, but I will.

How's Lamine doing? What's his sleeping and eating patterns like?
*I noticed that there are a few Mama's here that were born in late January, GO US







*

Lamine is doing well







thanks for asking. He eats all day! well about every couple hours, more frequently in the morning, then usually falls asleep. He has a coupe times of the day when he's just up and alert and looking around. one of these times is about 6:30 AM







he'll just be there giggling and wiggling around--it's too cute for me to be salty about it







he sleeps ok at night--wakes after 3 hours, then every 2 or 3 to nurse. and he's starting to be able to stay asleep somewhere other than on me if i put him down to go grab a snack or something. so far, so good







I'm glad my stepmother isnt coming until the edn of march--I needed time to figure out a little of what I'm doing before she comes around plying know it all


----------



## purplegirl

Happy Birthday to all you caps and Aquarius women


----------



## Jannah6

Thanks Purplegirl & Sheila. I'm Jan 21st and Safiyyah is the 20th, but you guys probably already know that









Well I guess I have to edit my siggy cuz DS is officially weaned


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Well I guess I have to edit my siggy cuz DS is officially weaned









Sorry. Speaking of weaning, it looks like dd is weaned, after 3.5 years I will be honest though and say I was tired and am now







:. Long story short my insomnia was getting worse so I decided to start taking melatonin so I told dd she couldn't nurse anymore. I must admit she took it well.

I just feel proud of the fact that considering my firstborn was not nursed and honestly I only planned to nurse a few months, the fact we made it 3.5 years feels great especially as a WOC. It may be a cultural thing and be honest and say I couldn't do CLW....I thought I could but my brain just couldn't hang.

On the other side though I have actually been sleeping pretty well.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

I plan on doing CLW with Safiyyah because I know she's my last







DC. Shay did you try anything else for your insomnia?


----------



## eilonwy

I was thinking of trying magnesium for mine. Another mama posted that it's really helped her little boy get to sleep earlier... so what can it hurt?

In nursing news, it's been nearly a year since Bear last nursed (and, indeed, this time last year he was not nursing) and I still feel weird about it.







: I'm the only person I know who's oldest child was her longest nurser.


----------



## shayinme

I had been reducing my caffiene intake as well as doing a nightly dose of Sleepytime tea and while I could fall asleep, I just wasn't staying asleep. Up until last week, I had probably only had 5 maybe 6 times where I slept longer than 5 hours. It was reaching the point where I was always tired and grumpy. The thing is dd had long stopped nursing at night but since ,y ;ast trimester with her sleep had just been plain lousy.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I plan on doing CLW with Safiyyah because I know she's my last







DC. Shay did you try anything else for your insomnia?


----------



## purplegirl

I really load up on the magnesium when I am having problems sleeping. It's hard to get too much because it doesn't get stored in your body fat. Sleepy time tea helps me some as well.


----------



## Jannah6

Have you ladies visited the nocturnal mamas tribe


----------



## AndrewsMother

Happy Thursday!!!


----------



## purplegirl

Indeed AM!

How is everyone?


----------



## AndrewsMother

I am wonderful, just suffering through Algebra.


----------



## Jannah6

s Andrewsmother.
This thread is a little slow, huh? What's going on ladies, you guys too busy


----------



## Brown Lioness

Im still here









Im a lurking booty, lol.


----------



## Arike

I have been lurking too.







Working and dealing with the LO has been draining me. I don't remember the last time I slept well. Plus I have some anxiety because my job ends in August; it is a grant position. My office wanted to create a new position for me but the company does not want to spend the money. Boooooooooooooo!







So now I am currently in the midst of a very aggressive job search. This economy is so sucky.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I have been lurking too.







Working and dealing with the LO has been draining me. I don't remember the last time I slept well. Plus I have some anxiety because my job ends in August; it is a grant position. My office wanted to create a new position for me but the company does not want to spend the money. Boooooooooooooo!







So now I am currently in the midst of a very aggressive job search. This economy is so sucky.

I am guessing since you said your position is grant funded that you work in the non-profit sector? I am the Executive Director of a small non-profit and these are rough times. My own position is underfunded meaning I work way more hours than I am actually funded for because of a budget decrease last year due to less giving.









Speaking of work, I have been somewhat quiet due to a stressful work situation. My site manager is going to be out another month on sick leave which means another month that I have to wear 2 hats, that as director and that of running the after school program. Its really hard because while I like kids and have my own, its very different when you must oversee up to 27 kids and plan activities.

The job is stressing me out as evidenced by my 4 lbs weight gain since taking the job in November, the weight gain started right when the site manager took ill. Ugh...

Just happy its Friday and weather outside is mild (almost 50). Though the next few days will be emotional, today would have been my Mom's 55th birthday and next week marks 5 years since she passed. No longer do I break down dramatically when this time of year comes but its still sad....never stop missing my mama.

Shay


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







s Andrewsmother.
This thread is a little slow, huh? What's going on ladies, you guys too busy









Been a little under the weather myself and haven't had time to be online. How are you all?


----------



## Draupadi

, Shay.
You never really stop missing loved ones who've passed. It just feels not as painful.
Heck, my father died when I was 6 and I still miss him- 32 years later.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I am guessing since you said your position is grant funded that you work in the non-profit sector? I am the Executive Director of a small non-profit and these are rough times. My own position is underfunded meaning I work way more hours than I am actually funded for because of a budget decrease last year due to less giving.









Speaking of work, I have been somewhat quiet due to a stressful work situation. My site manager is going to be out another month on sick leave which means another month that I have to wear 2 hats, that as director and that of running the after school program. Its really hard because while I like kids and have my own, its very different when you must oversee up to 27 kids and plan activities.

The job is stressing me out as evidenced by my 4 lbs weight gain since taking the job in November, the weight gain started right when the site manager took ill. Ugh...

Just happy its Friday and weather outside is mild (almost 50). *Though the next few days will be emotional, today would have been my Mom's 55th birthday and next week marks 5 years since she passed*. No longer do I break down dramatically when this time of year comes but its still sad....never stop missing my mama.

Shay

thinking about you, Shay















for your mom


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I have been lurking too.







Working and dealing with the LO has been draining me. I don't remember the last time I slept well. Plus I have some anxiety because my job ends in August; it is a grant position. My office wanted to create a new position for me but the company does not want to spend the money. Boooooooooooooo!







So now I am currently in the midst of a very aggressive job search. This economy is so sucky.

I hate to scare you but I have yet to have a good night's sleep since William was born.








Good luck on your job search. I'll be doing that soon, myself.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Just happy its Friday and weather outside is mild (almost 50). Though the next few days will be emotional, today would have been my Mom's 55th birthday and next week marks 5 years since she passed. No longer do I break down dramatically when this time of year comes but its still sad....never stop missing my mama.

Shay









for Shay

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
I hate to scare you but I have yet to have a good night's sleep since William was born.









ARE YOU SERIOUS???







Oh boy....LOL!


----------



## AndrewsMother

[ARE YOU SERIOUS???







Oh boy....LOL!







[/QUOTE]

DS is almost three and I only sleep through the night when he is out of town. He wakes up looking for me, the pacifier or both of us. Even though he sleeps through the night, technically, he disturbs my slumper. Some nights he wakes up wanting water and can't find the sippy in or under his bed.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







s Andrewsmother.
This thread is a little slow, huh? What's going on ladies, you guys too busy










This thread is very slow. This is the first semester in 2 years that I have had to study. Taking Chemistry Microbiology and Algebra plus two other classes and DA and DH keep me busy.

I also returned to work, but only 12 hours a week. I am mentoring at risk high school students to attend colleges. So if any of you all know college advisers who would love to recruit students from Texas, let me know. Many of these students are willing to leave, but they need to know what is out there.

So yes, my plate is full. My GPA is bad, good to most, but horrible to me) thanks to two C's and 1 D last year(I am not good at dealing with death during the middle of a semester). I need a 4.0 to recover. I am trying to give up MDC, FB and one other site for the rest of the semester, but I keep lurking, which wastes valuable time. I need HELP!!! LOL ! I asked DH to change my password and not tell me, but he won't.







:

Shay,


----------



## eilonwy

Been chasing kids and thinking about lawyers and moving and all kids of doo. I may be explicitly named in a lawsuit in a few weeks; Ain't that fun? BeanBean is trying to get me to teach him algebra (I haven't got time, so I throw things at him and send him off), Bella is trying to get me to teach her to read, Bear is trying to see how many bruises he can get on his face before I manage to get his picture taken, and Mike is ...well, he's Mike.

On the up-side, I've been doing Atkins and really enjoying it. Yes, I live on eggs, but I actually feel pretty decent.







You've got to love a diet that says it's perfectly fine to eat whipped cream as long as it's actual cream.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 







for Shay

ARE YOU SERIOUS???







Oh boy....LOL!









Um, my daughter will be 4 in July and still has issues with sleep. Only reason I get anything reasonable for sleep is that dh handles nightime parenting. Hopefully you won't have to go years without sleep but until she night-weaned at almost 2, I was still up every few hours.


----------



## eilonwy

Don't let them scare you. Only one of my four *wasn't* sleeping through the night at six months. Granted, she still gets up at 35 months... but the other three all sleep through the night beautifully, and I have never night-weaned a child.


----------



## Jannah6

*Shay*, many many







s.

*Arike*,







I hope you find something to replace this job. As for DC, my 2 DD don't sleep through the night. Yesterday morning my DD was up at 5am eating chips and drinking juice while watching t.v







:
My oldest DS who is 11 still wakes up during the night, but not every night.


----------



## purplegirl

I just realized a few days ago that I am scheduled for, yet another surgery on March 12. I had been in a bit of denial until the hospital called to confirm. Those of you who have been a part of this tribe for awhile, know that my health has been an issue for a minute. I've had three major surgeries in the past two years and am facing another. This one won't be too serious, (I hope) but I have to have a hernia repaired. The hernia occured as the result of a previous surgery. I'm scared and not looking forward to any of it. Supposedly, it is a one day thing but my luck with medical stuff almost predicts I'll be there overnight. I will be out of work for about two weeks with complete healing in four weeks.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Shay*, many many







s.

*Arike*,







I hope you find something to replace this job. As for DC, my 2 DD don't sleep through the night. Yesterday morning my DD was up at 5am eating chips and drinking juice while watching t.v







:
My oldest DS who is 11 still wakes up during the night, but not every night.

You know, it's not abnormal for adults to not sleep through the night, you know? I think it's just how we're wired, really.


----------



## Draupadi

*Eilonwy,* good luck with your lawsuit issue. I hope everything works out and you don't get named.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
You know, it's not abnormal for adults to not sleep through the night, you know? I think it's just how we're wired, really.

Well my mom never slept through the night. I never slept through the night either, especially since the birth of my first child.

*Purplegirl*, I didn't know about your past surgeries. Many big







s to you. Hoping for a speedy recovery and an end to your surgeries.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I just realized a few days ago that I am scheduled for, yet another surgery on March 12. I had been in a bit of denial until the hospital called to confirm. Those of you who have been a part of this tribe for awhile, know that my health has been an issue for a minute. I've had three major surgeries in the past two years and am facing another. This one won't be too serious, (I hope) but I have to have a hernia repaired. The hernia occured as the result of a previous surgery. I'm scared and not looking forward to any of it. Supposedly, it is a one day thing but my luck with medical stuff almost predicts I'll be there overnight. I will be out of work for about two weeks with complete healing in four weeks.

healing vibes to you Purple.

hugs to Shay!

and a good night's rest to all tired but awake Mamas--myself included. i've been stressed, tired and more tired. i should go to sleep now but i do enjoy the quiet once dd finallllllly goes down. dh is working the nightshift and it feels good just to be "alone."

its been awhile ladies and i've been lurky, so i've noticed some of our crew is mia well if you're lurking too---peace!







:


----------



## Jannah6

*nnaemeka* , sorry that you've been feeling stressed








I totally know what you mean by the alone time, I cherish it


----------



## purplegirl

Thank you for the healing vibes ladies. I'm feeling calmer and less worried about the impending surgery.

Nnaemeka, the ups and downs of life can be wearing on a person. I try to enjoy the reprieves between the stressful times, but sometimes it feels like the reprieves are further and further apart. I pray you get more rest and increased peace









I've noticed we had some MIA too. I pray yall are alright and will check in when you get a chance.

I'm anticipating no work for the next couple of days, as the prediction of a major snow storm is upon us







: I hate snow







but since I work in schools, it almost always guarantees a day off!! Of course, when I don't work, I don't get paid but hey, money isn't every thing, right?







So I am off to the coop, post office and then my folks. Today is my mama's birthday so after she gets home from church, I'll spend some time with her.


----------



## Barbamama

Lurkin' mama checking in. I've been keeping all of you in my thoughts, but I don't post b/c I'm usu. a week or so behind in reading the thread; nothing more irritating than someone who's on a different page (literally) chiming in all late and stuff.

I've been overwhelmed with going back to work and getting used to having a different flow to our life since my husband's death. Along with the usual, dishes, laundry and (ugh) preschool applications for DD. The preschool admissions scene here is obscenely competitive, time consuming, and anxiety provoking. Its taken a lot of meditation for me to keep some perspective and sense of humor about it all.

That said, I'd truly appreciate all the good vibes y'all can muster -- the lottery for my top choice preschool is tomorrow. It's affiliated with the Smithsonian and their curriculum is unbelievable--there's a museum and gallery component to each unit. DD loves the space, the teachers and director are professional, warm and loving. Three slots available, preference to Smithsonian employees (which I'm not).







:
But I figure we're due for a lucky break!

Purple, we're getting snow here







: maybe it's on the way to you. I so want to curl up and snuggle with DD, but I gotta run a couple of errands first. Sigh.

Love and light to all!

Mary-Helen


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I just realized a few days ago that I am scheduled for, yet another surgery on March 12. I had been in a bit of denial until the hospital called to confirm. Those of you who have been a part of this tribe for awhile, know that my health has been an issue for a minute. I've had three major surgeries in the past two years and am facing another. This one won't be too serious, (I hope) but I have to have a hernia repaired. The hernia occured as the result of a previous surgery. I'm scared and not looking forward to any of it. Supposedly, it is a one day thing but my luck with medical stuff almost predicts I'll be there overnight. I will be out of work for about two weeks with complete healing in four weeks.

Aww, Honey...








You're in my thoughts...


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
Lurkin' mama checking in. I've been keeping all of you in my thoughts, but I don't post b/c I'm usu. a week or so behind in reading the thread; nothing more irritating than someone who's on a different page (literally) chiming in all late and stuff.

I've been overwhelmed with going back to work and getting used to having a different flow to our life since my husband's death. Along with the usual, dishes, laundry and (ugh) preschool applications for DD. The preschool admissions scene here is obscenely competitive, time consuming, and anxiety provoking. Its taken a lot of meditation for me to keep some perspective and sense of humor about it all.

That said, I'd truly appreciate all the good vibes y'all can muster -- the lottery for my top choice preschool is tomorrow. It's affiliated with the Smithsonian and their curriculum is unbelievable--there's a museum and gallery component to each unit. DD loves the space, the teachers and director are professional, warm and loving. Three slots available, preference to Smithsonian employees (which I'm not).







:
But I figure we're due for a lucky break!

Purple, we're getting snow here







: maybe it's on the way to you. I so want to curl up and snuggle with DD, but I gotta run a couple of errands first. Sigh.

Love and light to all!

Mary-Helen









to you too. I hope everything works out in your favor.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
Lurkin' mama checking in. I've been keeping all of you in my thoughts, but I don't post b/c I'm usu. a week or so behind in reading the thread; nothing more irritating than someone who's on a different page (literally) chiming in all late and stuff.

I've been overwhelmed with going back to work and getting used to having a different flow to our life since my husband's death. Along with the usual, dishes, laundry and (ugh) preschool applications for DD. The preschool admissions scene here is obscenely competitive, time consuming, and anxiety provoking. Its taken a lot of meditation for me to keep some perspective and sense of humor about it all.

That said, I'd truly appreciate all the good vibes y'all can muster -- the lottery for my top choice preschool is tomorrow. It's affiliated with the Smithsonian and their curriculum is unbelievable--there's a museum and gallery component to each unit. DD loves the space, the teachers and director are professional, warm and loving. Three slots available, preference to Smithsonian employees (which I'm not).







:
But I figure we're due for a lucky break!

Purple, we're getting snow here







: maybe it's on the way to you. I so want to curl up and snuggle with DD, but I gotta run a couple of errands first. Sigh.

Love and light to all!

Mary-Helen

HEY MAMA. I'm glad you came out of lurkdom! Welcome to our little corner of the world.
Sending you and your dd mad vibes for getting in the preschool







:

It's snowing here so I'm getting my pj's ready and preparing to hang out at home tomorrow







:

Happy Sunday night to all of you.


----------



## Jannah6

*Barbamama* , welcome







.







s on the loss of your husband







.
Hoping that your DD gets chosen for the preschool







.


----------



## Jannah6

The children are home from school today and I'm kinda glad. I had a full day yesterday and didn't really feel like getting them up and out this morning.


----------



## purplegirl

snow days are great







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
snow days are great







:

Even when you have 6 kids???
*JK*


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Even when you have 6 kids???
*JK*









you are the woman!


----------



## Jannah6

Actually 4 of the kids went downstairs to visit/bother my aunt


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Been chasing kids and thinking about lawyers and moving and all kids of doo. I may be explicitly named in a lawsuit in a few weeks; Ain't that fun? BeanBean is trying to get me to teach him algebra (I haven't got time, so I throw things at him and send him off), Bella is trying to get me to teach her to read, Bear is trying to see how many bruises he can get on his face before I manage to get his picture taken, and Mike is ...well, he's Mike.

On the up-side, I've been doing Atkins and really enjoying it. Yes, I live on eggs, but I actually feel pretty decent.







You've got to love a diet that says it's perfectly fine to eat whipped cream as long as it's actual cream.









Hey Rynna, I'm just seeing this. I hope things work out with the lawsuit and that you're not named.

Good luck on your eating plan. I have a friend who swears by atkins and has lost a lot of weight.


----------



## Arike

Hello everyone! I am just at work slaving away and also looking for new jobs on the sly.







Ari has been a roller coaster ride. One night he will be so fussy and up every couple of hours and then the next he wakes up once during the night. Like last night he slept really well and ironically enough I had insomnia.







I have so much anxiety right now, it keeps me up at night. With the jobsearch and DH also looking for employment in this economy, I am freaking out.







On a lighter note, my parents came to visit Ari on Saturday and it's great seeing them interact with him. My mom said she is going to have to get a part-time job because everytime she is out, she buys something for Ari. She is so in love.







: Anyway, let me get back to work so I don't get fired!







That's the last thing I need.







:


----------



## Jannah6

Oh Arike, I hope that your DH finds something soon and I hope that you find a new job that suits you







s
Let me know if there is anything that I can do.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Oh Arike, I hope that your DH finds something soon and I hope that you find a new job that suits you







s
Let me know if there is anything that I can do.

Thanks Jannah. I had an interview last week and I have another one this Thursday. Part of me is not that enthused about these prospective jobs because it would mean a longer commute BUT I have to do what is necessary to provide for my family.
I have also been contemplating getting another master's degree or starting a phd program but I just feel like I need to just focus on full-time work and being a mommy.


----------



## rootzdawta

Don't know where to jump in here guys . . . but I just wanted to give a big hug to everyone. You guys are in my thoughts.









I've been writing ya'll. Just writing and writing and writing. Journals, stories, blogs . . . so I haven't been participating as much. I'm well though all things considered.


----------



## Bloomingstar

hi everyone!







sounds like everyone has something going on that deserves







I've been just spending my days and nights getting to know Lamine and trying to figure out what the things he does mean. I got an email from work reminding me that I've had 8 weeks of leave already--today starts my 9th and lat paid--and by law I can take 3 more (unpaid) for a grand total of 12.







: I cannot imagine going back so soon. I've been at my job almost 5 years. it's at a non-profit. before I left my boss said she'd lay me off if I wanted (as opposed to me quitting and getting no unemployment money) if I was just ready to leave, wanted more time with the baby, etc. etc. So I think--and this feels positively nuts in light of the economy but--I am calling this week and asking too be laid off. I have been thinking about it for months on end, even before the offer, and i just don't want to go back to work with him being so young. I don't have family around here and I just need to do this, so we'll figure out how to make it work. I am actually really excited about it. I don't want a career in the field I've been working in and want time to really figure out something else. My job takes so much energy and attention, even when the workday is over, there's little time or space in my head for the kind of thinking I'd like to do. So it's a scary but exciting thing, and a relief.

Yesterday we had a 4 hour outing--I think our longest yet! Lamine was great, he nursed and slept and looked around and smiled, with ony one tiny freakout when I changed his diaper. We went to a film screening my midwife helped organize. I missed the first, which I've seen a million times anyway (The Business of Being Born) but the second was great. It was about black midwives in the south. There were a few midwives there, and some mom and babies, and a panel discussion after. It was nice







and I'm glad we got out. Friday we went to the Brooklyn Museum but not for lng because 'm still a bit of a chicken about us being out for long, but I'm getting there









Any of you cloth diapering without having a washer/dryer at home? I'd like to switch. I got some cloth diapers but I have to sell them and get bigger ones. I didn't know the baby would be this big. I used them once one day when we ran out of the others and it was ok. but I'll have to figure it out with going to the laundromat and all, so he can wear cloth at least part time.








for everyone


----------



## Jannah6

*Bloomingstar* , I'm happy that you'll be able to stay home with Lamine







:. I couldn't leave my DC with a sitter, I think I'd have a panic attack. The trade off is that I never have money for myself







I have done babysitting in the past, but whatever money I made I spent on my DC.

I did CD without the use of a washer & dryer, it was exhausting.

*rootzdawta*, what did you mean by "all things considered". I hope everything is alright with you and your DC.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
hi everyone!







sounds like everyone has something going on that deserves







I've been just spending my days and nights getting to know Lamine and trying to figure out what the things he does mean. I got an email from work reminding me that I've had 8 weeks of leave already--today starts my 9th and lat paid--and by law I can take 3 more (unpaid) for a grand total of 12.







: I cannot imagine going back so soon. I've been at my job almost 5 years. it's at a non-profit. before I left my boss said she'd lay me off if I wanted (as opposed to me quitting and getting no unemployment money) if I was just ready to leave, wanted more time with the baby, etc. etc. So I think--and this feels positively nuts in light of the economy but--I am calling this week and asking too be laid off. I have been thinking about it for months on end, even before the offer, and i just don't want to go back to work with him being so young. I don't have family around here and I just need to do this, so we'll figure out how to make it work. I am actually really excited about it. I don't want a career in the field I've been working in and want time to really figure out something else. My job takes so much energy and attention, even when the workday is over, there's little time or space in my head for the kind of thinking I'd like to do. So it's a scary but exciting thing, and a relief.

Yesterday we had a 4 hour outing--I think our longest yet! Lamine was great, he nursed and slept and looked around and smiled, with ony one tiny freakout when I changed his diaper. We went to a film screening my midwife helped organize. I missed the first, which I've seen a million times anyway (The Business of Being Born) but the second was great. It was about black midwives in the south. There were a few midwives there, and some mom and babies, and a panel discussion after. It was nice







and I'm glad we got out. Friday we went to the Brooklyn Museum but not for lng because 'm still a bit of a chicken about us being out for long, but I'm getting there









Any of you cloth diapering without having a washer/dryer at home? I'd like to switch. I got some cloth diapers but I have to sell them and get bigger ones. I didn't know the baby would be this big. I used them once one day when we ran out of the others and it was ok. but I'll have to figure it out with going to the laundromat and all, so he can wear cloth at least part time.








for everyone

*jumpin in here*

I dont think you're nuts in the slightest. As a matter of fact, for us, its the prolly THE BIGGEST reason hubby and I are waiting to have kids is because we do not want to work outside of the home and have to send our kids to outside care after a puny maternity or paternity leave. It just doesn't follow in line with what we want for our family.

So, right now, hubby and I are plotting and planning on ways to create our own multiple streams of income so that 1) we can move down south where we wanna be and 2) we can finally begin the babymaking with peace of mind in that area lol.

A lot of it, for me, has to do with the way I was brought up. My mother worked very hard to provide for me and my brother, but as a result, i have no relationship with her and resent a lot of my childhood (but most of it has to do with my mother personally, rather than her working outside the home). I would like to provide something different for my children. I just think its crucial that the way you make a living gel well with your family.

So now, good economy, bad economy, I say do what YOU feel is best for you and your family. I think you will be just fine and I pray blessings to you and yours.








for everyone


----------



## JeDeeLenae

I'm still here, just been very busy. DH was sick for a while and I was really worried about him. He has type 1 diabetes and all of a sudden he lost about 25 lbs! He's only 160 usually, so that big of a drop was scary. Then, the boys were sick. Then, I got sick and have been for the last 2 weeks, while Jason has been out of town. I'm just coping. Not to mention, I've done very little participating in online communities lately, except for Facebook occasionally. I really just needed to concentrate on my family, my house (and we're buying a new one!), and myself.

The great news is I can get SO much more done now than I could ever before!


----------



## Jannah6

s Cassie for all the suffering that your family has been going through. I was looking through your blog photos and my DS2 thought the pic of your DS holding your DD was of him holding my DD2(does that make sense







)
Here's a pic of DS2 holding DD2, he was 2 and she was a few weeks old.
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...5/88520022.jpg

Oh, and CONGRATULATIONS on your new home







:

*ETA*: What do you think about this statement? 'I think that some people have such a self hatred that they marry into another race so that their children will not look like them'. It's my response on another thread.

I get so sick and tired of peoples self hatred, especially Black people. If I have to hear another, "My Great-Great Grandfather on my half cousins mother side was Irish", I'm going to scream.
You know when I lived in NJ a lady contacted me(she got my # from my aunt) and wanted to hook up because we had something in common. We both had White DH







, WTH. At the time I was pregnant with number 5 and she had no DC. Yeah, I could really see us hooking up.
No lady, you and I are *NOT* in the same club, nor do I want to be!

Vent over


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*ETA*: What do you think about this statement? 'I think that some people have such a self hatred that they marry into another race so that their children will not look like them'. It's my response on another thread.

I get so sick and tired of peoples self hatred, especially Black people. If I have to hear another, "My Great-Great Grandfather on my half cousins mother side was Irish", I'm going to scream.
You know when I lived in NJ a lady contacted me(she got my # from my aunt) and wanted to hook up because we had something in common. We both had White DH







, WTH. At the time I was pregnant with number 5 and she had no DC. Yeah, I could really see us hooking up.
No lady, you and I are *NOT* in the same club, nor do I want to be!

Vent over









I think there are some folks with self hatred issues who choose to date and marry outside their race. I have been interrcially partnered for 18 years between my ex and my current dh and over the years I have met many folks who assumed I had self hate issues. I will be honest when I married the first husband at 18, there were some issues....but by the time we divorced I swore off white men said I would never date one again.

Guess what? After a great relationship with a Black man that fizzeled, I meet my now dh who low and behold is white. I almost did not go out with him because he is white thankfully I did and the rest is history.

All that to say especially living in Maine, I have met folks who assume that I live in a white state, married to a white man, must not like Black folks







:...um, no darling don't get it twisted.

So yeah, I feel you.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Well, being mixed like a smoothie or a bucket of paint, the only person I could date who is "my race" would be my brother. I'm not really down with that, go figure.







I will say that I am at times disappointed that my children don't look more like me. Not one of them even has curly hair.







:

Do they think that white women who date black men have self-hatred issues? Or that white men who date black women do? What about light-skinned black/mixed women who only date very dark skinned men, hm? *mutter*

It's almost certain I'll be named in the lawsuit, as they'll officially have my name by the end of the day.







: We all need a lawyer, and badly. We need to put it in terms of a countersuit; The lawyer will more than recoup his fees if he files countersuit... *mumble*


----------



## purplegirl

The issue of self-hatred---grrrrrr. It really sticks in my crawl. Sadly, I feel that it is increasing and even with the election of Pres Obama, folks continue to struggle with issues of colorism and racism.
I know a woman who is so entrenched in self hatred that she rejects anything that reeks of 'black' culture. She'd much rather celebrate St. Patty's day than black history month. She will not hesitate to tell you that white men are far more superior than black men. I watch her trip over white folks to accommodate them and hold them in high regard even when they've not earned it. She is sweating this man, whom she has deemed as 'the one' not because he has proven anything, but because he is white. She believes he can offer her a better life and 'pretty children'. She doesn't get that he treats her like crap and is very disrespectful to her.
It is not about preference for her, but rather a deep seeded sense of unworthiness. I find it abhorable and sad because she was born of black parents and grew up in a black community.


----------



## Joyster

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 

*ETA*: What do you think about this statement? 'I think that some people have such a self hatred that they marry into another race so that their children will not look like them'. It's my response on another thread.

I get so sick and tired of peoples self hatred, especially Black people. If I have to hear another, "My Great-Great Grandfather on my half cousins mother side was Irish", I'm going to scream.
You know when I lived in NJ a lady contacted me(she got my # from my aunt) and wanted to hook up because we had something in common. We both had White DH







, WTH. At the time I was pregnant with number 5 and she had no DC. Yeah, I could really see us hooking up.
No lady, you and I are *NOT* in the same club, nor do I want to be!

Vent over









It was a response to something I posted in multicultural families and was misunderstood. I have since posted a clarification and have apologized for being really unclear. Your comment was really uncalled for as far as I'm concerned. If you're concerned about my self hatred, please feel more than free to address me directly. However do not make assumptions about why I married my husband, had my children or live my life, because if you have read my clarification, you couldn't be more off the mark.

Honestly...


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

Do they think that white women who date black men have self-hatred issues? Or that white men who date black women do? What about light-skinned black/mixed women who only date very dark skinned men, hm? *mutter*


Who is they? I don't know if these people have self hatred and personally I don't care(well I'd care if it filtered down to their DC).
People of color have been brainwashed into thinking that lighter skin and straighter hair is the be-all end-all. So when I see a person of color searching for that White Knight or White Princess it pisses me off.
My DH is attracted to Black woman and at first I had an issue with that. I couldn't understand it because I thought it was a self hatred, mainly because of my experiences in the Black community. He and I had a long talk and I know his preference isn't a self hatred. I'm cool with a person being attracted to someone because of XYZ. I'm just not ok with folks hating the skin/features/hair that they were given because society says it's ugly.

*BTW*, I was just looking at a pic of Tyra Banks. Her hair and eyes are getting lighter and lighter







. Dang, does anyone ever get darker and their hair thicker???


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
It was a response to something I posted in multicultural families and was misunderstood. I have since posted a clarification and have apologized for being really unclear. Your comment was really uncalled for as far as I'm concerned. If you're concerned about my self hatred, please feel more than free to address me directly. However do not make assumptions about why I married my husband, had my children or live my life, because if you have read my clarification, you couldn't be more off the mark.

Honestly...

You're right, it was in response to something that you wrote. My response was called for as far as I'm concerned. I don't have to address you directly, I'd rather address the issue. I did not make an assumption about why you married your DH, had your DC, or live your life. I did not assume at all. I will read your clarification and be back to post again, thank you









Truthfully...
*
ETA* Joyster, I never said or implied that you married your DH so you could have White children. I was talking about people who do this because of their own self hatred.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
*jumpin in here*

I dont think you're nuts in the slightest. As a matter of fact, for us, its the prolly THE BIGGEST reason hubby and I are waiting to have kids is because we do not want to work outside of the home and have to send our kids to outside care after a puny maternity or paternity leave. It just doesn't follow in line with what we want for our family.

So, right now, hubby and I are plotting and planning on ways to create our own multiple streams of income so that 1) we can move down south where we wanna be and 2) we can finally begin the babymaking with peace of mind in that area lol.

A lot of it, for me, has to do with the way I was brought up. My mother worked very hard to provide for me and my brother, but as a result, i have no relationship with her and resent a lot of my childhood (but most of it has to do with my mother personally, rather than her working outside the home). I would like to provide something different for my children. I just think its crucial that the way you make a living gel well with your family.

So now, good economy, bad economy, I say do what YOU feel is best for you and your family. I think you will be just fine and I pray blessings to you and yours.








for everyone

thanks so much for this! I read it (and read it again) right before I called and it helped boost my confidence. I was pretty nervous







It went really well, and I feel really relieved even though we still have lots to discuss since I've run our biggest program for the past 3 years, and we just need a proper goodbye and all that. And of course they want to see the baby







so that's a load off my mind. sort of









congrats on the new home JeDeeLenae! and I hope you all start feeling better.

sorry about the lawsuit Rynna


----------



## bajamergrrl

Hi all, I'm a lurking mom-to-be who's finally getting around to introducing herself. You all have great discussions in here and eventually I'll get around to jumping in.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
You're right, it was in response to something that you wrote. My response was called for as far as I'm concerned. I don't have to address you directly, I'd rather address the issue. I did not make an assumption about why you married your DH, had your DC, or live your life. I did not assume at all. I will read your clarification and be back to post again, thank you









Truthfully...
*
ETA* Joyster, I never said or implied that you married your DH so you could have White children. I was talking about people who do this because of their own self hatred.

I got exactly what you were saying that other thread and here. My aunt had kids with white men so her children would come out light and with the "good hair" and those are her words. I think its ridiculous marry or be with someone for your own issues. Maybe that someone who responded has a guilty conscious







:

Lol, eilonwy I am one of those light skinned women who is with a dark skinned guy. I have no problem dating just about anyone though. But man o man its something about the chocolate that gets me weak in the knees







:. You just don't know what I would do to Dijmon Hounsou







http://www.dyfuse.com/?q=node/1372 I could tell you but I would most likely get kicked off this board









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Joyster* 
It was a response to something I posted in multicultural families and was misunderstood. I have since posted a clarification and have apologized for being really unclear. Your comment was really uncalled for as far as I'm concerned. If you're concerned about my self hatred, please feel more than free to address me directly. However do not make assumptions about why I married my husband, had my children or live my life, because if you have read my clarification, you couldn't be more off the mark.

Honestly...

What made you think she was talking about you from her comment?? I am not really understanding..


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
You just don't know what I would do to Dijmon Hounsou







http://www.dyfuse.com/?q=node/1372 I could tell you but I would most likely get kicked off this board



















He's off limits and spoken for. You didn't hear? He's waiting to become my second husband. I just have to convince the first.









Seriously, that man is just too luscious.














:


----------



## rootzdawta

Oh, Jannah6, thanks for asking . . . life is humping along. I thought I wasn't really feeling this whole recession business but dh is pulling another overtime shift today. All day long. And another trip to the grocery store easily busted the budget. Just tired. Really.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 









He's off limits and spoken for. You didn't hear? He's waiting to become my second husband. I just have to convince the first.









Seriously, that man is just too luscious.














:









:

I am so not a fighter but for him I throw down for him and I am not willing to share, I just want to kidnap him and take him someplace no one would ever know


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Oh, Jannah6, thanks for asking . . . life is humping along. I thought I wasn't really feeling this whole recession business but dh is pulling another overtime shift today. All day long. And another trip to the grocery store easily busted the budget. Just tired. Really.









I'm there with you, once again went over budget but only got the necessities.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bajamergrrl* 
Hi all, I'm a lurking mom-to-be who's finally getting around to introducing herself. You all have great discussions in here and eventually I'll get around to jumping in.









welcome beautiful woman!


----------



## Jannah6

*Rootz* and *Futurmama*, you ladies made me LOL. I needed that







after having a heated debate on MDC. I am so not a confrontational person. I have been known to end friendships because I've been afraid to confront









*Bloomingstar*







:
*
Bajamergrrl* , Welcome and CONGRATULATIONS. I love coming to this thread







.

*Rootz* and *Shay* I hear you on the food issue.

My aunt(65) and uncle(69) are getting hit by this recession too. My uncle drives for a Black car service which lost a lot of clients in Manhattan. So business is not what it used to be. My aunt retired in 2006, but is now looking for something part-time.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 









He's off limits and spoken for. You didn't hear? He's waiting to become my second husband. I just have to convince the first.









Seriously, that man is just too luscious.














:

Well sorry to break it to you ladies but Dijmon has allegedly married Kimora Lee Simmons and she is pregnant with his child. He is a very attractive man.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Well sorry to break it to you ladies but Dijmon has allegedly married Kimora Lee Simmons and she is pregnant with his child. He is a very attractive man.









Say what????







: Kimora????? I'm just going to leave it at that.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Say what????







: Kimora????? I'm just going to leave it at that.










Yes indeedy. Kimora has that locked up!


----------



## eilonwy

Still... that's some gooooooood fantasy fodder. I don't need him...just a few pictures and a few hours of privacy.


----------



## Jannah6

There goes another Chocolate Brother wanting some exotic Chick. *JK JK JK*


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Still... that's some gooooooood fantasy fodder. I don't need him...just a few pictures and a few hours of privacy.
















OOOHHHH you are bad but I completely understand.

And I don't care who he is with, he will forever be mine (maybe only in my head but that's good enough).

Exactly Jannah LoL


----------



## Brown Lioness

@Bloomingstar, be encouraged, sis!

Soooo, ya'll can have Djimon, i'll go ahead and take Idris Elba, alright? cool? lol


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 







@Bloomingstar, be encouraged, sis!

Soooo, ya'll can have Djimon, i'll go ahead and take *Idris Elba*, alright? cool? lol

mmmm hmmmm


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
There goes another Chocolate Brother wanting some exotic Chick. *JK JK JK*


----------



## Jannah6

Can I get a







for Tyrese. When the kids go to sleep I think I'm gonna jam to some of Tyrese's oldies


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Can I get a







for Tyrese. When the kids go to sleep I think I'm gonna jam to some of Tyrese's oldies









ooohhh another chocolate one







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
ooohhh another chocolate one







:









Back up off him Sista. Oh I almost forgot to play his tunes. I better hurry before DH gets here. He hates on my relationship with Reesie,


----------



## Jannah6

Homeboy has a special place in my heart 




*ETA*, oh and I must not forget http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKO0K...eature=related


----------



## wiksty

Hello ladies!

I've been awfully busy as of late with my little Nesting Project, but alas, EVERY room in the house is clean and reorganized. All that there is left to do is pull out the baby clothes and wash/dry/sort them for use. I am...sooooooo excited!

36 weeks and counting down to an amazing homebirthing experience. Just found out a few hours ago that my mother isn't going to attend, but that's both good and bad news for me (long story) so I just hope hubby's mother and my trusted friends will still be available.

Oh...and hubby. We've been separated just shy of one month now...but we've been talking things through, and I've decided to let him come home. We're going to try again...I think that it may be worth this one last chance.

And OMG!!! I was accepted to Emerson College for graduate school! I'm so excited and really don't know what to think/do because it has been only one week and I'm still in shock, lol. But...It was my top choice school, and...school starts in Sept....and I'm due 3/31...so there's a lot to decide/plan/figure out before then, but...wish me luck!

Anywho, just wanted to drop by to say hey and catch up on everybody. Oh! I remember, the other thing I wanted to do was share the organic hair conditioner recipe I found/tweaked for my daughter's curls. It is AMAZING as far as the results, and really easy to make. It was supposed to be my quick fix in between purchasing something for her (i still need a daily moisturizer because jojoba oil and water works, but...I'm looking for more). But here it is:

I didn't wash her hair, just conditioned it...

1 large ripe organic avocado
1 can (400ml) organic coconut milk
2tsp organic virgin olive oil

mix together (I used my mixer) until smooth. Apply for 10-15 minutes, and rinse out. Her curls were just...perfect. Shiny but not oily, bouncy and full, soft and finger-comb-able. Lovely, and the results lasted like 4-5 days. I got the recipe from pioneerthinking.com and tweaked it a bit (what you see is what I actually used). Smells great too, but refrigerate the leftovers! The recipe I listed makes about one speghetti sauce jar sized portion. Enjoy!

Hope that all is well with everyone







I am well...and happy







:


----------



## Jannah6

*wiksty*







: on your reconciliation,HB, graduate choice, and hair conditioner find


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







s Cassie for all the suffering that your family has been going through. I was looking through your blog photos and my DS2 thought the pic of your DS holding your DD was of him holding my DD2(does that make sense







)
Here's a pic of DS2 holding DD2, he was 2 and she was a few weeks old.
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...5/88520022.jpg

Oh, and CONGRATULATIONS on your new home







:

*ETA*: What do you think about this statement? 'I think that some people have such a self hatred that they marry into another race so that their children will not look like them'. It's my response on another thread.

I get so sick and tired of peoples self hatred, especially Black people. If I have to hear another, "My Great-Great Grandfather on my half cousins mother side was Irish", I'm going to scream.
You know when I lived in NJ a lady contacted me(she got my # from my aunt) and wanted to hook up because we had something in common. We both had White DH







, WTH. At the time I was pregnant with number 5 and she had no DC. Yeah, I could really see us hooking up.
No lady, you and I are *NOT* in the same club, nor do I want to be!

Vent over









Your kids are so cute! And you made perfect sense. My DS thinks all kids with wild hair and fair skin are him. lol

As for the ETA, I've been accused of that. I have always been told I "act white" so it was no surprise that I married a white man, to most people. I once had blue contacts, not because I wanted to be white, but I wanted something different. It seems like everything I did or liked made me "white" and people assumed there's a self hatred. Honestly, I love myself. And while I'm not happy and proud of everything associated with AAs, I'm happy to be me. KWIM?

Anyway, then you have my sister who was sooo focused on her daughter not being too dark, having "good" hair, etc. I love my hair, her hair, the different light and dark skin tones, etc. But, because DH is white, I'm looked at as hating other AAs?

I know there are people that do hate themselves and want different for their kids, but I'm definitely not in that category.

*wiksty*~ awesome update! good luck on school, DH, & your 9th month!!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Your kids are so cute! And you made perfect sense. My DS thinks all kids with wild hair and fair skin are him. lol

As for the ETA, I've been accused of that. I have always been told I "act white" so it was no surprise that I married a white man, to most people. I once had blue contacts, not because I wanted to be white, but I wanted something different. It seems like everything I did or liked made me "white" and people assumed there's a self hatred. Honestly, I love myself. And while I'm not happy and proud of everything associated with AAs, I'm happy to be me. KWIM?

Anyway, then you have my sister who was sooo focused on her daughter not being too dark, having "good" hair, etc. I love my hair, her hair, the different light and dark skin tones, etc. But, because DH is white, I'm looked at as hating other AAs?

I know there are people that do hate themselves and want different for their kids, but I'm definitely not in that category.

*wiksty*~ awesome update! good luck on school, DH, & your 9th month!!


Thanks Cassie, your DC are too cute as well. I totally get where you are coming from. I've gotten the "You act White comment as well", though it was many moons ago. This came from my ghetto sister and ghetto people who really didn't know me. I was "acting White" because I spoke
proper English", didn't wear jeans and sneakers and liked to try different foods. My sister was fine if I drank a 40 and smoked some weed, but God forbid I should form a proper sentence








In my case no one "expected" me to marry a White guy. Although my friend did say, "You always did do weird things, so I'm not surprised". On her behalf, I should say that she meant that statement in the most loving way


----------



## jeca

Jumping in. I know someone who is going through this exact thing right now. She has flat out said she doesn't like black men. Then she'll turn around and say "you and such and such are alright but the rest I don't care for". Which makes me think she doesn't like black people in general since umm hello I'm not a man so why would you say that? She keeps asking for us to introduce her to a white captain or officer. So not only does she have race issues in my book but classism to boot. I feel bad for her though. Both her kids are by white men who have dogged her out yet she still continues to only seek out that race. I wish she would just seek out a nice guy in general and take the color blinders off. There is a black man she works with that she admits to being kind of attractive to but says that she can't see a future with him and has turned down every advance he's made towards her. Why? Because he's black her words not mine. That is self hate at it's worse form and honestly it makes me not want to deal with her. I get tired of hearing how black women don't like her etc.








Anyway I think when it comes to love we should be open minded and not limit ourselves because you could be missing out on something wonderful.

Now back to your regularly scheduled programming.
ETA: I think Kimora's new man is hot no doubt but he's a little too old for me. I was flat out heartbroken when ER killed off Mekhi Phifer. My husband hated for me to watch that how just because I would sit and drool at him. Mekhi Phifer mmmmmmmmmmmmm.


----------



## purplegirl

I used to get the 'you're going to marry a white man' spiel too. Is that the prize for being smart, poised and open minded? What I don't get is how folks don't realize what the underlying message is in statements like that. First of all, I'm the prize, not some man---black or white! Secondly, why are brothers considered 'settling'? That used to be my response to people who said such nonsense. I think about the messages we send little black boys about their self worth. In large part, it is a causative factor in some of the troubles we are seeing in the black communities. I am all about loving who you want to love. I have a major problem with placing value on the color of a person's skin.

*Jeca,* it's good to hear from you!

*Witsky,* best of luck to you with everything. I think it makes total sense to give your marriage your best shot. Congrats on your grad school acceptance and I know that things will work out as you transition to being a mom and student









*JeDeeLenae*, big hugs to you and I hope things continue to improve

*Bloomingstar*, I am sending you positive energy that things work out exactly the way you'd like!

and here's a big fat hug for everyone else


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I used to get the 'you're going to marry a white man' spiel too. Is that the prize for being smart, poised and open minded? What I don't get is how folks don't realize what the underlying message is in statements like that. First of all, I'm the prize, not some man---black or white! Secondly, why are brothers considered 'settling'? That used to be my response to people who said such nonsense. I think about the messages we send little black boys about their self worth. In large part, it is a causative factor in some of the troubles we are seeing in the black communities. I am all about loving who you want to love. I have a major problem with placing value on the color of a person's skin.

























I am all about loving who you want. My extended family thought that I would end up with a white husband I guess because of my "white" mannerisms, speech, etc... So imagine their shock when I brought a dark skinned black man with dreadlocks home to my granny's and introduced him as me husband this past December!







LOL! When my great aunt found out about the baby, she told my uncle, "Oh the baby must be white." Why would someone say that???







: When my granny told her that my son looks like a little chocolate doll, she was kinda like "huh?"







My family can be so strange!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 

Anywho, just wanted to drop by to say hey and catch up on everybody. Oh! I remember, the other thing I wanted to do was share the organic hair conditioner recipe I found/tweaked for my daughter's curls. It is AMAZING as far as the results, and really easy to make. It was supposed to be my quick fix in between purchasing something for her (i still need a daily moisturizer because jojoba oil and water works, but...I'm looking for more). But here it is:

I didn't wash her hair, just conditioned it...

1 large ripe organic avocado
1 can (400ml) organic coconut milk
2tsp organic virgin olive oil

mix together (I used my mixer) until smooth. Apply for 10-15 minutes, and rinse out. Her curls were just...perfect. Shiny but not oily, bouncy and full, soft and finger-comb-able. Lovely, and the results lasted like 4-5 days. I got the recipe from pioneerthinking.com and tweaked it a bit (what you see is what I actually used). Smells great too, but refrigerate the leftovers! The recipe I listed makes about one speghetti sauce jar sized portion. Enjoy!

Hope that all is well with everyone







I am well...and happy







:

That sounds so good. I want to eat it!


----------



## Jannah6

I got the Happy To Be Nappy DVD at the library and my children are watching it now







:


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I got the Happy To Be Nappy DVD at the library and my children are watching it now







:

What is that dvd? Is it like the book?


----------



## Brown Lioness

My family, being anti-marriage as they are, never speculated on who I would end up with, but they generally seem disappointed (one formerly favorite aunt had some hateful things to say about my then husband-to-be and i havent spoken to her since) that I ended up with a big dude. I guess they figured that since I was such the skinny minny,/track athlete, i'd end up with the same.







One of my uncles married a plus-sized sister (and had my lil cousin who also turned out to be plus-sized) and the degrading remarks about her size still hasnt stopped over 20 years later. So, suffice it to say, we dont really hang with my side of the family too much.

When I was single, i sometimes fancied myself marrying a latino or south pacific man myself (think the Rock).

But, i LUH my dreadlock wearing (tho he was shaved bald when I met him lol), milk chocolate, big daddy husband of mine.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I used to get the 'you're going to marry a white man' spiel too. Is that the prize for being smart, poised and open minded? What I don't get is how folks don't realize what the underlying message is in statements like that. First of all, I'm the prize, not some man---black or white! Secondly, why are brothers considered 'settling'? That used to be my response to people who said such nonsense. I think about the messages we send little black boys about their self worth. In large part, it is a causative factor in some of the troubles we are seeing in the black communities. I am all about loving who you want to love. I have a major problem with placing value on the color of a person's skin.

I've had that discussion many times about what we're saying when we say someone is "acting white." For instance, I was told I was "acting white" for breastfeeding and using cloth diapers, using proper english, the clothes I wear, etc. I was telling my sister how saying stuff like that implies a lot of negatives about people who are AA. Does this mean we can only use formula, disposable diapers, slang/ebonics, wear saggy clothes or stuff with rhinestone words across the tush?? Of course she says that's not what it means, but you can't help but infer that from what she says. Even doing good in school was considered acting white... so what does THAT say about AA?


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Oh, did I mention I finished my labor doula certification??? I got the certificate in the mail today!! I finally finished!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Oh, did I mention I finished my labor doula certification??? I got the certificate in the mail today!! I finally finished!


Congrats mama







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
What is that dvd? Is it like the book?

Yes, but sadly my DC were not interested.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Oh, did I mention I finished my labor doula certification??? I got the certificate in the mail today!! I finally finished!
















:







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I've had that discussion many times about what we're saying when we say someone is "acting white." For instance, I was told I was "acting white" for breastfeeding and using cloth diapers, using proper english, the clothes I wear, etc. *I was telling my sister how saying stuff like that implies a lot of negatives about people who are AA. Does this mean we can only use formula, disposable diapers, slang/ebonics, wear saggy clothes or stuff with rhinestone words across the tush??* Of course she says that's not what it means, but you can't help but infer that from what she says. *Even doing good in school was considered acting white*... so what does THAT say about AA?

:yes that totally is the implication.

My Freshman yr of HS was at a small predominately white school in Bklyn. Going in I totally thought that I would be up against some competition because the vast majority of students were White. It's funny, I didn't know that I had been brainwashed into thinking that Whites were smarter. Well I'll tell you, most of those students were probably rejects from other public/private schools. The language and behavior of some these students made my jaw drop. I think I spent about 2 weeks there before I told my aunt to get me out of there.

Oh, I remember a class discussion where one of the *WORST* students said, The sitcom Married With Children was more believable than The Cosby Show








That same student asked our Social Studies teacher if her husband held on to her hair while they had sex














she had waist length hair). His mother was the english teacher so


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Oh, did I mention I finished my labor doula certification??? I got the certificate in the mail today!! I finally finished!

Wow! Congratulations!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
:yes that totally is the implication.

My Freshman yr of HS was at a small predominately white school in Bklyn. Going in I totally thought that I would be up against some competition because the vast majority of students were White. It's funny, I didn't know that I had been brainwashed into thinking that Whites were smarter. Well I'll tell you, most of those students were probably rejects from other public/private schools. The language and behavior of some these students made my jaw drop. I think I spent about 2 weeks there before I told my aunt to get me out of there.

Oh, I remember a class discussion where one of the *WORST* students said, The sitcom Married With Children was more believable than The Cosby Show








That same student asked our Social Studies teacher if her husband held on to her hair while they had sex














she had waist length hair). His mother was the english teacher so









WOW! What school was that, I wonder?
That is nuts!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
WOW! What school was that, I wonder?
That is nuts!

It was called Brooklyn Prep







in Bensonhurst.


----------



## futurmama8

My twin brother (who is the complete opposite of me) tells me because I get good grades, don't hang out in the club, or because I get emotional that I act like a white girl? I can't stand that its like people are implying that black people are dumb ignorant fools or something and I just don't get it. What they consider white doesn't mean you have to the complete opposite in order to be black









I am sorry your kids didn't like the dvd Jannah I am going to look for it at our library for my godkids.

But I have applied with my nursing school to go to Tanzania this coming fall








: We will be going and helping out in rural regions. I hope I get accepted most people don't want to go because of the cost ($3500). what sucks is that they are just now telling us that the money needs to be in by MAY







I wish they would have told us this at the beginning of the school year







But at the end we get a two day safari and it covers everything. I am making flyers so I can get donations from any and everybody and I am also selling these older versions of rosetta stone for cheap as a way to fundraise. So wish me luck guys.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I am also selling these older versions of rosetta stone for cheap as a way to fundraise. So wish me luck guys.









: Eh? What languages, how much, details details....


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Congrats mama







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 














:







:


Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Wow! Congratulations!

Thank you!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
:yes that totally is the implication.

My Freshman yr of HS was at a small predominately white school in Bklyn. Going in I totally thought that I would be up against some competition because the vast majority of students were White. It's funny, I didn't know that I had been brainwashed into thinking that Whites were smarter. Well I'll tell you, most of those students were probably rejects from other public/private schools. The language and behavior of some these students made my jaw drop. I think I spent about 2 weeks there before I told my aunt to get me out of there.

Oh, I remember a class discussion where one of the *WORST* students said, The sitcom Married With Children was more believable than The Cosby Show








That same student asked our Social Studies teacher if her husband held on to her hair while they had sex














she had waist length hair). His mother was the english teacher so









Good luck raising the money! That sounds like a great opportunity!

I would have wanted out of that school too, but it doesn't surprise me. Quite a few of the private schools in my hometown had similar stories. I wonder how many young black kids assume they aren't as smart as white kids? It would be an interesting study. I wonder how that affects them.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
My twin brother (who is the complete opposite of me) tells me because I get good grades, don't hang out in the club, or because I get emotional that I act like a white girl? I can't stand that its like people are implying that black people are dumb ignorant fools or something and I just don't get it. What they consider white doesn't mean you have to the complete opposite in order to be black









I am sorry your kids didn't like the dvd Jannah I am going to look for it at our library for my godkids.

But I have applied with my nursing school to go to Tanzania this coming fall







: We will be going and helping out in rural regions. I hope I get accepted most people don't want to go because of the cost ($3500). what sucks is that they are just now telling us that the money needs to be in by MAY







I wish they would have told us this at the beginning of the school year







But at the end we get a two day safari and it covers everything. I am making flyers so I can get donations from any and everybody and I am also selling these older versions of rosetta stone for cheap as a way to fundraise. So wish me luck guys.

I'm sorry that my kids didn't like it. I actually let them watch it while I fed the baby in another room. I'm going to watch it with them and comment on the important parts.

That's great about the trip, not so great about the last notice.
Hope your selling goes well.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: Eh? What languages, how much, details details....

PM'ed you mama.

Thanks Jannah and Jedeelenae


----------



## jeca

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: Eh? What languages, how much, details details....

What she said!! I am looking for latin american spanish.
Congrats JeDeeLenae!!


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jeca* 
What she said!! I am looking for latin american spanish.
Congrats JeDeeLenae!!

I tried to pm you but your inbox is full. I will just tell you now.

I have latin america levels 1 and 2 and it comes with 26 other languages some have two levels some have just one. It is $50 dollars and I will pay for priority shipping to your address. Let me know and if you know anyone who is willing to buy one please recommend me







.

Oh and since everyone ask it is this cheap because this is version 2 of the program and they just put out version 3 which doesn't have the textbook. But this has the textbook and it comes up on adobe. Hope that wasn't confusing.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
That sounds so good. I want to eat it!

Funny that you mention it. Amara DID! Lol. She was going wild in the bathtub looking for more chunks of "ah-dah-dough," lol.


----------



## wiksty

oooh! Don't get me started on the whole "acting white" thing. I was called "whitegirl" all through junior high and high school because I got good grades, didn't like to party, spoke properly, etc. I frequently questioned my black peers on what they thought this meant of "acting black" but no one seemed to understand the perpetuation of negative stereotypes they were allowing to escape their own lips.

It's like the "N" bomb. I'm so sorry, but I do not think it's okay to refer to anyone using that term, no matter what color you are or race or whatnot. Sadly enough, blacks perpetuate the use of this derogatory term moreso than whites. But...I'm going to get heated in a second, and then I wont be able to sleep...so I'll just leave this be...for now.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 

It's like the "N" bomb. I'm so sorry, but I do not think it's okay to refer to anyone using that term, no matter what color you are or race or whatnot. Sadly enough, blacks perpetuate the use of this derogatory term moreso than whites. But...I'm going to get heated in a second, and then I wont be able to sleep...so I'll just leave this be...for now.

Today I was at my Whole Foods doing some shopping. Down in the frozen area, two guys were stocking up a section and having a conversation about COCK FIGHTING. I think I heard them say "n***a" about 10 times in the 2 or 3 minutes I stood there. I finished shopping and went right up to customer service to make a complaint. I HATE THAT WORD. HATE IT.
And you're right, black people do say it more. I don't make the distinction that some people make between "n***a" and "n***er". No matter how you slice it, it's still a word with an ugly history.
These two teachers in L.A. once did this after getting sick and tired of hearing their students use the "N" word:
They called an assembly and, as the kids entered the auditorium, they said, "Hey, n***as, come in! Hurry up, n***as!" When the kids got upset, they asked the kids what the difference was.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
oooh! Don't get me started on the whole "acting white" thing. I was called "whitegirl" all through junior high and high school because I got good grades, didn't like to party, spoke properly, etc. I frequently questioned my black peers on what they thought this meant of "acting black" but no one seemed to understand the perpetuation of negative stereotypes they were allowing to escape their own lips.
.

Try being the lone black goth in your high school. Oh yeah...








I went to a specialized HS so it wasn't a matter of grades, and our school was very mixed, but this was the heyday of Spike Lee's "School Daze" (incidentally, the video for EU's "Da Butt" was shot in my HS using our cheerleaders) and Public Enemy (who I loved, despite being a Goth queen). Everyone wore Africa medallions and high-top fades...except me. And I had a boyfriend with a 2 foot mohawk. LOL.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Try being the lone black goth in your high school. Oh yeah...








I went to a specialized HS so it wasn't a matter of grades, and our school was very mixed, but this was the heyday of Spike Lee's "School Daze" (incidentally, the video for EU's "Da Butt" was shot in my HS using our cheerleaders) and Public Enemy (who I loved, despite being a Goth queen). Everyone wore Africa medallions and high-top fades...except me. And I had a boyfriend with a 2 foot mohawk. LOL.

What school?


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Try being the lone black goth in your high school. Oh yeah...








I went to a specialized HS so it wasn't a matter of grades, and our school was very mixed, but this was the heyday of Spike Lee's "School Daze" (incidentally, the video for EU's "Da Butt" was shot in my HS using our cheerleaders) and Public Enemy (who I loved, despite being a Goth queen). Everyone wore Africa medallions and high-top fades...except me. And I had a boyfriend with a 2 foot mohawk. LOL.

I was the closest thing to a black goth I've ever met in high school, and I was neither black nor goth.







I've only met a few non-white gamers in my entire life, too. (Not that all gamers are goths or that all goths are gamers, but there's a fair bit of overlap.) I still remember being astonished when a black guy showed up to play AD&D with us one evening in college. It was hilarious, he was just as surprised to see me there.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
What school?

Brooklyn Tech.







Spike Lee's lived right up the block and his obnoxious sister, Joie, was so rude to us students. This was not too long after "She's Gotta Have It" and right around "School Daze".


----------



## Jannah6

Oh, I didn't know that it was filmed at Tech, but it make sense since that's Spikes stomping ground. BTW, what grade were you in when it was filmed


----------



## Whispers

Hello Ladies!









I've been reading this thread for a while and have decided to finally say hello!









I'm loving your conversations and looking forward to contributing.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Oh, I didn't know that it was filmed at Tech, but it make sense since that's Spikes stomping ground. BTW, what grade were you in when it was filmed









I was probably in the 11th or 12th grade. In 1988. Yes.. I'm that old...


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Whispers* 
Hello Ladies!









I've been reading this thread for a while and have decided to finally say hello!









I'm loving your conversations and looking forward to contributing.











Just jump on in!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Oh, I didn't know that it was filmed at Tech, but it make sense since that's Spikes stomping ground. BTW, what grade were you in when it was filmed









Spike is not a nice person with a really bad attitude. I love love love many of his films but he really is not nice. His sister was as well. She used to jump us on line at the local deli. I mean, she was JOIE LEE, for heaven's sake!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Spike is not a nice person with a really bad attitude. I love love love many of his films but he really is not nice. His sister was as well. She used to jump us on line at the local deli. I mean, she was JOIE LEE, for heaven's sake!
















I hate to hear that, I love his work and hate to hear he is not a pleasant cat.


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Try being the lone black goth in your high school. Oh yeah...








I went to a specialized HS so it wasn't a matter of grades, and our school was very mixed, but this was the heyday of Spike Lee's "School Daze" (incidentally, the video for EU's "Da Butt" was shot in my HS using our cheerleaders) and Public Enemy (who I loved, despite being a Goth queen). Everyone wore Africa medallions and high-top fades...except me. And I had a boyfriend with a 2 foot mohawk. LOL.

Your fellow classmates surely figured "this will show her how to act." Lol. Black goth queen must have been a hard role back in the day...it still is! But no one is really goth anymore (the younger generations at least) they're all EMO...*pukes*







That 2 foot mohawk must have been sexy!

That shopping experience today would've probably driven me up the wall. I cannot take it! If you weren't trying to listen in, but heard them clearly, and it made you upset, a woman of color, think of how uncomfortable it surely made the other customers, of any race! If those men could only realize the thoughts/contradictions that go with such language (not only of others that consider themselves worthy of perpetual degradation, but of all those lost on what is acceptable to call someone or reference and what is not) in addition to the context of the conversation---illegal animal abuse! Someone walked away from whole foods today thinking, "Those N***ers were planning a cock fight!" and I wont even go into all that I think could have come of that. Grrrrr. Why do people have to be so ignorant? So...pressured to feel like they have to say/do/be/wear/act these ways in order to be black?! Aaugh!

Not that I haven't gone through it myself, but I knew early on that it was more important for me to be 100% of myself, no matter what others thought of me or how "white" that made me. I wasn't going to hold back on being ME just because I wasn't the typical black girl. I suppose it's easy to get caught up in that world...my entire family still gives me the "you're not white" spiel every holiday because I'm not up to date on Beyonce's latest album or know who NeYo's history.

Well...sorry. There's more to being me than being up to date on hip hop and R&B, and there's more to being black than talking smack and acting ignant! If anything, there's more to being BLACK than any of that! Not that it's a competition, but I am probably much more knowledgeable of black history than any of my family members who would call me "white." Not just the stuff you read in biased text books either. And I live closer to nature than any of my relatives (which, of course, is because I'm acting "white" though Europeans adapted the lifestyle of living further from nature long before Africans). Sigh. I shouldn't get into it, because I get so upset...but it's just like...COME ON PEOPLE!!!

WAAAAAAKKKKKKE UUUUUUPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!! Lol


----------



## wiksty

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
(Not that all gamers are goths or that all goths are gamers, but there's a fair bit of overlap.)

My husband is still a gamer, but let go of the goth...mostly. Lol. He's white though, so...not seen as so much of an outcast.

@ *Whispers* WELCOME!!!


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I hate to hear that, I love his work and hate to hear he is not a pleasant cat.

If I can find it, he has some not so nice things to say about interracial couples. My DH wants to meet him REALLY badly.








As for my own personal experience with him when I went to school in the area, he was just downright rude.


----------



## rootzdawta

Hey Mamas . . . some good news.

My baby boy's recent blood test showed that his iron is way up and the lead levels are way down. He's in the clear! I did the iron supplement and kept him out of suspect rooms and voila!







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hey Mamas . . . some good news.

My baby boy's recent blood test showed that his iron is way up and the lead levels are way down. He's in the clear! I did the iron supplement and kept him out of suspect rooms and voila!







:

















: That is excellent news!!!! Yay for both of you.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Whispers* 
Hello Ladies!









I've been reading this thread for a while and have decided to finally say hello!









I'm loving your conversations and looking forward to contributing.

Welcome Whispers!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Spike is not a nice person with a really bad attitude. I love love love many of his films but he really is not nice. His sister was as well. She used to jump us on line at the local deli. I mean, she was JOIE LEE, for heaven's sake!
















I had a Spike encounter on the vineyard last summer. Let's just put it this way, the locals up there don't hold him in high regard because of his arrogance!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hey Mamas . . . some good news.

My baby boy's recent blood test showed that his iron is way up and the lead levels are way down. He's in the clear! I did the iron supplement and kept him out of suspect rooms and voila!







:

















that is awesome news mama!

I had my surgery and am home recovering. I'm in pain, but thrilled to say that experience is behind me







:


----------



## Draupadi

wiksty said:


> Quote:
> 
> Your fellow classmates surely figured "this will show her how to act." Lol. Black goth queen must have been a hard role back in the day...it still is! But no one is really goth anymore (the younger generations at least) they're all EMO...*pukes*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That 2 foot mohawk must have been sexy!
> LOL! My girlfriends were all the black girls who listened to New Wave anyway, so we clearly stood out. I was the only goth, though- IN MY WHOLE SCHOOL.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> That shopping experience today would've probably driven me up the wall. I cannot take it! If you weren't trying to listen in, but heard them clearly, and it made you upset, a woman of color, think of how uncomfortable it surely made the other customers, of any race! If those men could only realize the thoughts/contradictions that go with such language (not only of others that consider themselves worthy of perpetual degradation, but of all those lost on what is acceptable to call someone or reference and what is not) in addition to the context of the conversation---illegal animal abuse! *Someone walked away from whole foods today thinking, "Those N***ers were planning a cock fight!" and I wont even go into all that I think could have come of that.* Grrrrr. Why do people have to be so ignorant? So...pressured to feel like they have to say/do/be/wear/act these ways in order to be black?! Aaugh!
> The bolded part is exactly what I was thinking other people might be thinking.
> I thought of saying something myself, but thought better of it.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hey Mamas . . . some good news.

My baby boy's recent blood test showed that his iron is way up and the lead levels are way down. He's in the clear! I did the iron supplement and kept him out of suspect rooms and voila!







:









Wonderful, Mama!







:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

I had my surgery and am home recovering. I'm in pain, but thrilled to say that experience is behind me







:


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I had my surgery and am home recovering. I'm in pain, but thrilled to say that experience is behind me







:

Here's to speedy healing.







:


----------



## wiksty

*@purplegirl*

Happy healing


----------



## Arike

Hello everyone! I have been following the thread and lurking around a bit. Congratulations *rootzdawta* on your son's health!
@*purplegirl* wishing you a fast and speedy recovery!
@*JeDeeLenae* Belated congrats on getting your doula certification! Doulas rock!









Oh and in regards to highschool and standing out, I was like a pariah among the bussed in city black students and the white suburban kids didn't take too well to me either. I dressed pretty grunge, wore barrettes in my hair, wasn't girly at all, wore black and purple lipsticks and didn't follow trends. So yeah... Oh and I also listened to Nirvana and Soundgarden so I was known as the "whitest black girl" or an Oreo...







:

Oh and gross-out story of the day: Last week on my way to drop off my LO with the babysitter a random man on the street asked me to breastfeed him because he was thirsty.







:









Right now I am just trying to plan the next 6 months, I am still looking for a job and hoping everything will work out. I am also planning a trip for me and my LO to the Caribbean. I need a vacation so bad.









My LO is going to be 5 months in 9 days and I am finally ready to commit to an exercise regimen. I have been procrastinating because I just love spending every spare moment with DS.







And I have revisted a book called "Eat to Live" that I am hoping will help me lose the baby weight and then some.

Anyway I hope all of you ladies have a beautiful and blessed weekend!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Whispers* 
Hello Ladies!









I've been reading this thread for a while and have decided to finally say hello!









I'm loving your conversations and looking forward to contributing.









: *Welcome* Mama
*
Arike*, I'm sorry, but when I read what that man told you, I







Yeah, but that is NASTY. I remember reading something on craigslist a few yrs back. Some guy claimed to have some ailment which he wanted to be cured via someones expressed breastmilk.
I can't wait to see the results of your weight loss. Enjoy Ari, the time passes so quickly. One thing that I regret is not stopping to enjoy my DC more. You have a beautiful weekend too. In fact, I'm wishing all you Mamas a beautiful weekend







s


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
Spike is not a nice person with a really bad attitude. I love love love many of his films but he really is not nice. His sister was as well. She used to jump us on line at the local deli. I mean, she was JOIE LEE, for heaven's sake!
















Really. He makes good films, but he's "not a nice person"







:. That just sucks. Maybe he tries to compensate for his height challenge


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I hate to hear that, I love his work and hate to hear he is not a pleasant cat.
















I always laugh when people use the term Cat

*ETA:* Someone PLEASE tell me how to put multiple quotes in one posting.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Hey Mamas . . . some good news.

My baby boy's recent blood test showed that his iron is way up and the lead levels are way down. He's in the clear! I did the iron supplement and kept him out of suspect rooms and voila!







:

















:







:







: I am so happy for you and baby boy.
*
purplegirl*, I'm happy that your sugery went well







s and good healing. I'm hoping that you have less pain with each passing day.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
If I can find it, *he has some not so nice things to say about interracial couples*. My DH wants to meet him REALLY badly.








As for my own personal experience with him when I went to school in the area, he was just downright rude.

PLZ, I've seen pics of his wife







, but I guess he's safe because she IS Black.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Really. He makes good films, but he's "not a nice person"







:. That just sucks. Maybe he tries to compensate for his height challenge

























There may be a Napoleonic complex there somewhere...


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
PLZ, I've seen pics of his wife







, but I guess he's safe because she IS Black.

Ya think? http://www.tonyalewislee.com/tll_in_the_press.html.
He said something like, "When I see interracial couples, I glare at them really hard." Something like that.
As if people really care what he thinks!







:


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Really. He makes good films, but he's "not a nice person"







:. That just sucks. Maybe he tries to compensate for his height challenge

















Oh my, that made me giggle--hard







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 







:







:







: I am so happy for you and baby boy.
*
purplegirl*, I'm happy that your sugery went well







s and good healing. I'm hoping that you have less pain with each passing day.


I had a much better night and this morning, the pain isn't as intense








Thank you for the well wishes!


----------



## purplegirl

Jannah, you can multi quote by going to the bottom right of the post(s) you want to quote. You will see the option that has quotation marks and a small plus sign-i think it is the third option next to the 'quote' option.
Simply click that on that option for each post your want to multi quote. Then click on 'post reply' and when the new window opens, all of the posts you clicked on will be there. give it a whirl!


----------



## purplegirl

Has anyone heard India.Irie's new jam with Musiq, entitled "Chocolate High"? It's a sweet, catchy tune.


----------



## bajamergrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Has anyone heard India.Irie's new jam with Musiq, entitled "Chocolate High"? It's a sweet, catchy tune.






I like it!

Interesting that this post came up because I was just going to ask if anyone can think of any "neo-soulish" songs that would be great for a pregnancy/birth slideshow. I was listening to some music on YouTube this morning and got inspired.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Oh my, that made me giggle--hard







:

I had a much better night and this morning, the pain isn't as intense








Thank you for the well wishes!

Happy that I could help







Even happier that the pain is subsiding









Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Jannah, you can multi quote by going to the bottom right of the post(s) you want to quote. You will see the option that has quotation marks and a small plus sign-i think it is the third option next to the 'quote' option.
Simply click that on that option for each post your want to multi quote. Then click on 'post reply' and when the new window opens, all of the posts you clicked on will be there. give it a whirl!


Thanks


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Has anyone heard India.Irie's new jam with Musiq, entitled "Chocolate High"? It's a sweet, catchy tune.






they're a real couple right? very cute. nice to see a natural darkskinned sister getting her love on in the popular music circuit.

anyway, i like Spike Lee. he's been very helpful to couple filmmaker friends of mine. he's also attending the screening of a youth empowerment film program that my best friend works for as the discussant/judge--next week, i want to go so bad!! and his contribution to Black film ---well he has no equal in his peer group. i appreciate his opinions however controversial they may be seem to some. sometimes i think "being nice" is over rated in this culture.

okay enuf with Spike.







.

hope you are all doing good. purplegirl healing to you. rootz i'm glad your LO is doing better. Arike---gurl, i'd love to go to the islands with my baby and just chillllllll. and yes i feel you on the getting in shape post-baby but i haven't done so well in this regard.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
t*hey're a real couple right? very cute. nice to see a natural darkskinned sister getting her love on in the popular music circuit.*

anyway, i like Spike Lee. he's been very helpful to couple filmmaker friends of mine. he's also attending the screening of a youth empowerment film program that my best friend works for as the discussant/judge--next week, i want to go so bad!! and his contribution to Black film ---well he has no equal in his peer group. i appreciate his opinions however controversial they may be seem to some. sometimes i think "being nice" is over rated in this culture.

okay enuf with Spike.







.

hope you are all doing good. purplegirl healing to you. rootz i'm glad your LO is doing better. Arike---gurl, i'd love to go to the islands with my baby and just chillllllll. and yes i feel you on the getting in shape post-baby but i haven't done so well in this regard.

Adorable! India is so darling and I agree, so nice to see a dark skinned sister getting some serious play.
Thanks for the healing vibes. With each passing day, the pain is less intense and I am more able to walk upright. I was feeling a little cabin feverish yesterday but I got out for a few hours and man, did that feel great.
I hope yall are enjoying the bursts of Spring. I have tulips and crocuses popping up everywhere







:


----------



## Arike

Hey how are all of you ladies doing??? I see the thread slowed down a little so I thought I would pop in and say hi. I am so excited that spring is on it's way! I am not a cold weather person at all so I am relieved that it is warming up a bit. On another note, in a quest to be healthier and everything, I wanted to experiment with recipes since I love cooking. I tried out this black bean brownie recipe...







Everyone on the recipe blog I found it on was RAVING about how great they are. I am just mad I spent money on all the ingredients. Apparently I haven't learned my lesson because now I am going to try making a chickpea cake. I want to avoid wheat and focus on just legumes, veggies and fruit for awhile so I have been researching different wheat free/gluten free recipes and eating salad and greens daily. I am trying to approach eating healthy and getting back in shape in a positive way but I feel so crappy about my postpartum body. DS will be 5 months on sunday and I feel like I should have already lost all the pregnancy weight, yet I am holding onto 13 extra pounds. I was so healthy when I found out I was pregnant. During the pregnancy I picked up a few bad food habits that I have finally been able to undo but it's just hard looking at old pictures. I feel self-conscious.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Hey how are all of you ladies doing??? I see the thread slowed down a little so I thought I would pop in and say hi. I am so excited that spring is on it's way! I am not a cold weather person at all so I am relieved that it is warming up a bit. On another note, in a quest to be healthier and everything, I wanted to experiment with recipes since I love cooking. I tried out this black bean brownie recipe...







Everyone on the recipe blog I found it on was RAVING about how great they are. I am just mad I spent money on all the ingredients. Apparently I haven't learned my lesson because now I am going to try making a chickpea cake. I want to avoid wheat and focus on just legumes, veggies and fruit for awhile so I have been researching different wheat free/gluten free recipes and eating salad and greens daily. I am trying to approach eating healthy and getting back in shape in a positive way but I feel so crappy about my postpartum body. DS will be 5 months on sunday and I feel like I should have already lost all the pregnancy weight, yet I am holding onto 13 extra pounds. I was so healthy when I found out I was pregnant. During the pregnancy I picked up a few bad food habits that I have finally been able to undo but it's just hard looking at old pictures. I feel self-conscious.









Hey Arike. I am feeling you on the spring weather. It is so nice to see the sun!!! I'm still laid up but being able to look out the window is refreshing!

Good luck on changing your eating habits. I must say I've done very well over the past couple of week and managed to take off another five pounds







: I've done the EAT TO LIVE program in the past and think highly of it. Keep us posted.


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hey Arike. I am feeling you on the spring weather. It is so nice to see the sun!!! I'm still laid up but being able to look out the window is refreshing!

Good luck on changing your eating habits. I must say I've done very well over the past couple of week and managed to take off another five pounds







: I've done the EAT TO LIVE program in the past and think highly of it. Keep us posted.

Congrats on taking off the 5 pounds purplegirl! I desperately would like to take off 6 pounds by the end of april. I gotta get my butt back in the gym! I would like to be back to my pre-prego weight by my LO's first b-day.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
DS will be 5 months on sunday and I feel like I should have already lost all the pregnancy weight, yet I am holding onto 13 extra pounds. I was so healthy when I found out I was pregnant. During the pregnancy I picked up a few bad food habits that I have finally been able to undo but it's just hard looking at old pictures. I feel self-conscious.









I'm gonna try not to laugh or be snarky here, so bear with me. It took you nine months to gain that weight-- why do you feel like it should be gone in five? I'd call it a minimum, an absolute minimum, of 12 months (bearing in mind that the body is designed to gain weight, not to lose it). You should also be certain you're not confusing the words "healthy" and "slim." There are lots and lots of people walking around at "healthy weights" who are decidedly UNhealthy, and who have bad habits. I eat more veggies (even on Atkins) than most of the people I know at "healthy weights." I get more exercise, and I'm more conscious of what I eat. A lot of people have the mistaken impression that they can eat anything they want because health problems are associated with being fat. That's not true-- it's the crappy diet that does it to you, and being fat is only a side effect of that. There are plenty of healthy fat people and sick skinny people out there.

Thirteen pounds at five months post-partum? Three of that could be milk & boobs, easily, so we're looking at ten. I wouldn't call ten pounds an unreasonable price to pay for a healthy child, and if you manage to get some exercise and eat reasonably, I'd advise doing your best to move away from the numbers.

For the sake of full disclosure: I'm a fat person. I'm just shy of 5'1" and I'm a 14-16. I have gigantic bones and a very muscular build, so while the charts would have you believe that my 'ideal weight' is 125, in actuality I start to look ill around 135. Right now, my goal is to be a size 10 and that will probably put my weight around 170. I do not weigh myself because of a history of disordered eating & thought-- if I start weighing myself, I'll fixate on numbers and go crazy.







: I'm doing Atkins, and I began this diet shortly after my youngest (last!) baby's first birthday (so it's been almost two months). I waited this long because even I thought it best to give my body a full year to recover from pregnancy and breastfeeding (unfortunately my Bear is not nursing







) before I gave any thought to the matter. Truth be told, my primary motivation is probably saving what's left of my teeth by reducing sugar and killing yeast. Losing weight would come in third. As to hotness... I'm hot as hell right now, if I do say so myself.







I couldn't get hotter if I lit my behind on fire!







(Being a MILF RULES!







)


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I'm gonna try not to laugh or be snarky here, so bear with me. It took you nine months to gain that weight-- why do you feel like it should be gone in five? I'd call it a minimum, an absolute minimum, of 12 months (bearing in mind that the body is designed to gain weight, not to lose it). You should also be certain you're not confusing the words "healthy" and "slim." There are lots and lots of people walking around at "healthy weights" who are decidedly UNhealthy, and who have bad habits. I eat more veggies (even on Atkins) than most of the people I know at "healthy weights." I get more exercise, and I'm more conscious of what I eat. A lot of people have the mistaken impression that they can eat anything they want because health problems are associated with being fat. That's not true-- it's the crappy diet that does it to you, and being fat is only a side effect of that. There are plenty of healthy fat people and sick skinny people out there.

Thirteen pounds at five months post-partum? Three of that could be milk & boobs, easily, so we're looking at ten. I wouldn't call ten pounds an unreasonable price to pay for a healthy child, and if you manage to get some exercise and eat reasonably, I'd advise doing your best to move away from the numbers.

For the sake of full disclosure: I'm a fat person. I'm just shy of 5'1" and I'm a 14-16. I have gigantic bones and a very muscular build, so while the charts would have you believe that my 'ideal weight' is 125, in actuality I start to look ill around 135. Right now, my goal is to be a size 10 and that will probably put my weight around 170. I do not weigh myself because of a history of disordered eating & thought-- if I start weighing myself, I'll fixate on numbers and go crazy.







: I'm doing Atkins, and I began this diet shortly after my youngest (last!) baby's first birthday (so it's been almost two months). I waited this long because even I thought it best to give my body a full year to recover from pregnancy and breastfeeding (unfortunately my Bear is not nursing







) before I gave any thought to the matter. Truth be told, my primary motivation is probably saving what's left of my teeth by reducing sugar and killing yeast. Losing weight would come in third. As to hotness... I'm hot as hell right now, if I do say so myself.







I couldn't get hotter if I lit my behind on fire!







(Being a MILF RULES!







)

I hear everything you are saying. I think the reason I have put this pressure on myself is because I have a history of weight problems/bad body image. Before I became pregnant, I was finally in a good place with my weight and health. My weight was stable, I was a size 8 and I was in good shape without being obsessive. So now I just feel like in a rush to take all the weight off, but you are right. I should just focus on "health" as opposed to numbers on a scale. Thanks for your input. I am trying hard to feel hot and sexy again. Trying to fake it until I feel it.


----------



## rootzdawta

Arike, before I had children, I had a figure that was the bomb. Almost any outfit would compliment one of my many assets: legs, hips, stomach, behind, breasts, arms . . . Having children really, really changed my body and the way I felt took a serious hit. Sometimes I would think why did I have kids so young? If I knew how much havoc it would wreak, I would have waited and enjoyed my sexy body longer. When I say I have had to do a lot of spiritual work just to be able to look at my post-partum belly in the mirror, I am not kidding. I do an affirmation called mirror talk. Totally naked in front of the mirror telling myself over and over that I love my body just the way it is, I'm content with my body. Content doesn't mean I don't want it to change or I'm happy with. Just that this is where I am right now. I exercise faithfully, eat well and enjoyably and I know eventually, I'll look up and really, really like what I see.







It's not easy. It sucks at times. Yeah, girl, I believed in faking it till you make it. That's how I got through a lot of things in my life. These days though, I'm all about making my own reality by changing the lens through which I'm looking through.


----------



## Bloomingstar

I hear you Arike and I appreciate Rynna's words too. Lamine is only 2 months (and 5 days hehe) old. I've lost 40 of the 50lbs I gained. I'm doing a pretty god job of not freaking out about my belly and I hope it holds out. Especially since I gt pregnant pretty soon after Carnival last year and I was in ridiculously good shape--I had to be tight to go wining down the road in basically a bikini and glitter







I missed Carnival this year but I intend to be back next year, so I give myself a year. I've looked at some of my pictures from then and peeked at my belly now and have tried to see the bright side. I'm more concerned about my stomach muscles coming back together. Everyone needs their core to be strong but I'm a dancer--I REALLY need them! I have a concert coming up in June so I have lots of work to learn when I go back to rehearsals and I dont want to be weak and lumpy, but I know it took 9--well, 10--months to get here and who loses 40lbs without even trying? I've got little to nothing to complain about. One of my friends saw my belly and said I now just look like most people







I'm just focusing on eating well so this big boy--he's 14lbs already!--gets enough of the right stuff and trying to figure out how to help my muscles reconnect.

I also recommend theshapeofamother dot com as a nice reminder that most people go through this and time is the great changemaker for a lot of things.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
I hear everything you are saying. I think the reason I have put this pressure on myself is because I have a history of weight problems/bad body image. Before I became pregnant, I was finally in a good place with my weight and health. My weight was stable, I was a size 8 and I was in good shape without being obsessive. So now I just feel like in a rush to take all the weight off, but you are right. I should just focus on "health" as opposed to numbers on a scale. Thanks for your input. I am trying hard to feel hot and sexy again. Trying to fake it until I feel it.









JUst wanted to add- I've seen Arike. She's gorgeous!


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
Everyone needs their core to be strong but I'm a dancer--I REALLY need them! I have a concert coming up in June so I have lots of work to learn when I go back to rehearsals and I dont want to be weak and lumpy,

Yeah I am sort of freaking out about going back to the dance company. My director said once they begin a new repertoire I can come back to rehearsal. I am secretly hoping that won't be until the fall! I really want to work on my body and get healthy and fit so I can come back strong.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
JUst wanted to add- I've seen Arike. She's gorgeous!

Aww shucks...







Thanks WilliamsMama!


----------



## oyinmama

i miss youse guys.







:

@ purplegirl, thanks for stopping by my FB page to say hi!









i come by now and then to browse and try and catch up, but don't generally reply b/c it's been soooo long i don't know where to begin!

well, tonight i'll begin with happy bday to all the aquarian mamas i missed. (big ups!







) and BIG WARM KISSY WELCOMES to the new babies!!

to jump into the body image discussion a bit, you mamas are hot. i am in agreement w/eilonwy that we should definitely allow at least as much time to take off as it took to put on. i also understand that in our own heads, that's sometimes easier said than done. we want our bodies back now now NOW!! i too love the shapeofamother website - it's inspiring to see such a range of real women's real bodies and to know that our strength and health comes in so many different shapes and sizes.

in my news it's generally the same, workworkwork, with differences in the specifics: we opened up a little storefront last month, and are moving our biz from its big and drafty warehouse facility to a smaller/more efficient production kitchen in a former balloon factory across the street from the storefront. we are excited!! and exhausted.

baby boy is about to be one!! middle of next month. i cannot. believe. it. he's got eight teeth, and has started to stand and clap, stand and bounce, stand and reach. we are counting down the precious days before he takes those first steps and then we have to rearrange everything in our lives again for his safety. LOL!

too too excited about springtime. i was not built for the cold.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
JUst wanted to add- I've seen Arike. She's gorgeous!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oyinmama* 
i miss youse guys.







:

@ purplegirl, thanks for stopping by my FB page to say hi!









i come by now and then to browse and try and catch up, but don't generally reply b/c it's been soooo long i don't know where to begin!

well, tonight i'll begin with happy bday to all the aquarian mamas i missed. (big ups!







) and BIG WARM KISSY WELCOMES to the new babies!!

to jump into the body image discussion a bit, you mamas are hot. i am in agreement w/eilonwy that we should definitely allow at least as much time to take off as it took to put on. i also understand that in our own heads, that's sometimes easier said than done. we want our bodies back now now NOW!! i too love the shapeofamother website - it's inspiring to see such a range of real women's real bodies and to know that our strength and health comes in so many different shapes and sizes.

in my news it's generally the same, workworkwork, with differences in the specifics: we opened up a little storefront last month, and are moving our biz from its big and drafty warehouse facility to a smaller/more efficient production kitchen in a former balloon factory across the street from the storefront. we are excited!! and exhausted.

baby boy is about to be one!! middle of next month. i cannot. believe. it. he's got eight teeth, and has started to stand and clap, stand and bounce, stand and reach. we are counting down the precious days before he takes those first steps and then we have to rearrange everything in our lives again for his safety. LOL!

too too excited about springtime. i was not built for the cold.









: I saw the picture of baby boy's teeth







. Can you say cute


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 







: I saw the picture of baby boy's teeth







. Can you say cute









Now I'm going to stalk purplegirls FB page









I replied to the body image/weight loss issue, but it's not here







: Oh well, I'll be back to respond. I'm off to pogo.com to play some scrabble.

*ETA* CONGRATULATIONS *Oyin*, on all fronts







: and a Happy Belated BDay to you too.


----------



## Arike

Nice to see you back *oyinmama*!

Today we went to apply for our little guy's passport! I am so excited. This little guy is going to have lots of miles on his butt!







I hope all you ladies have a great weekend!


----------



## shayinme

Hey all! I have been mad busy but finally have a chance to catch my breath. I would say to all the newer Mamas who are anxious about weight, just relax. I can relate to how you feel, I ended gaining more weight in the first few months after dd was born then I had during the pregnancy. I looked in the mirror when dd was 8 mos and was like whose the beast in the mirror, seriously I had balloned up.

Anyway I did eventually take off the weight, almost 50 lbs over 2 years on WW. I went from a 14/16 to a 6 sometimes a 4, next month will make a year that I have kept the weight off. I will be honest early on I just wanted the weight gone but realized what I wanted was to be healthy and that involved shifting my mindset.

It was hard because when I had my son may years ago I was 19 and with him when I left the hospital I was back in my regular clothes but for me having a baby in my 30's was a totally different ballpark. I will be honest my body isn't quite what it used to be but the reality is I am almost 40 so I accept it.

Oyinmama, congrats on the business plans







Hope everyone is doing well.

Shay


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 
Nice to see you back *oyinmama*!

Today we went to apply for our little guy's passport! I am so excited. This little guy is going to have lots of miles on his butt!







I hope all you ladies have a great weekend!

That's great







. One of the things that I wish that I had done was traveled more.

Oh, For you Brooklyn Mamas who might be interested there is going to be a multi stoop sale. DH has given me Sundays off







so I want to go to this:

*Selling a wide selection of gently worn kids clothes in a variety of sizes at a Multi-Family Stoop Sale on Sunday.

Multi-family stoop sale
Wyckoff Street between Smith & Hoyt.
STOOP SALE
Sunday, March 22, 2009
10 - 3

TOYS
Thomas the Tank Engines
Hess trucks
Large-scale battery operated train & track
Melissa & Doug Tabletop Folding Kitchen
Berchet Play Kitchen
Play food + plates, cups, bowls, utensils
Polly Pocket
Art supplies
Game Boy
Little Tikes Shopping Cart

Books, games, toys, puzzles and MORE MORE MORE

CLOTHING
Girls clothing (sizes 3-4T) all seasons
Boys clothing (sizes 2T-boys 7/8) all seasons,

HOUSEHOLD + OTHER
Golf clubs
P-touch

Plus
BROWNIES & LEMONADE
And
FREE STUFF*

ETA*:*I stopped stressing about my weight 3 babies ago







Although I did go on a diet in 2006 and lost a lot of weight, then I got pregnant









When I married my DH in June of 2000 I was 119 lbs, my oldest DS was 2 1/2 yrs old. It had taken me 9 months to take off the pregnancy weight(I gained 53 lbs). Actually my prepregnancy weight was about 125.
When I got pregnant with my DD a month after my marriage







I gained a ton, 77 lbs







Unfortunately I've never gained less than 45 lbs during my pregnancies. My mother told me that she gained 70 lbs during her pregnancy with me.

The smallest that I've been since my second pregnancy is 150 lbs, that was after the diet. I'm almost 5' 2" so even 150 is big for me. Right now I'm 165(ALL stomach). I've actually gained a few lbs post partum. Food is one of the few things that I can enjoy, *so I eat*, but I'm not a dancer, not even a private dancer







. So I don't have the worries that some of you mamas have. My main concern is that my DH does *NOT* see or touch my stomach. The only thing that will get my stomach down is surgery. Can anyone spare $10,000???

My plan is to start to walk off the weight when the weather starts to get warmer. At least i can be toned, and I like walking.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arike* 

Today we went to apply for our little guy's passport! I am so excited. This little guy is going to have lots of miles on his butt!







I hope all you ladies have a great weekend!

I don't particularly like traveling but indeed, getting DS2's passport was very exciting. I think because it represents freedom to me. I can't wait to hear of all the fab places you travel!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Hello Ladies, just saying hello before Spring Break ends and I return to my studies. This is the first semester that I have had to study and the experience is interesting to say the least. I am failing my first class ever, but I will drop it tomorrow and take it during the 8 week mini-mester online. I realize my errors so now I will right them.

I don't know if anyone remembers, but DS was accepted to at least one of the schools to which I applied







:. However it is one without Financial Aid for the first two year







. I will have to make a few sacrifices, but I believe that they are worth it. If you have a chance read my post in Finance & Frugality and tell me what you think. I would like the perspective from you wise WOC.

Other than school, DH and DS nothing new is going on in my life. Well I am working part time as a mentor to high school students. My job is to mentor them to attend college or assist with process. So far so good.

I have read briefly the post of the past few days and there is too much to comment on. However the weight issue commanded my attention even though postpartum weight was not my problem, BUT I have gained so much weight since losing all of my baby weight. All that I wear are jeans and lose shirts because IMO I am too big to look cute. I finally said that enough is enough so I am trying the Eating for your Blood type. It makes sense. When I followed a similar self created diet I was healthy, energized and most importantly trim. Some people look okay with extra meat, but I am not one of them. I really would like to wear a two piece and not scare the fish, or wear shorts.

So good luck to all of you mama's working to lose weight. We can do it!!!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I don't know if anyone remembers, but DS was accepted to at least one of the schools to which I applied







:. However it is one without Financial Aid for the first two year







. I will have to make a few sacrifices, but I believe that they are worth it. If you have a chance read my post in Finance & Frugality and tell me what you think. I would like the perspective from you wise WOC.


I have been reading your thread in F & F. Honestly, I don't know that I would make that choice just because with the economy and things so volatile its hard to know where one is going to be in a few short years. At this point my feelings are based more on the fact that in recent years I made choices banking on making a higher salary (went to grad school, got my masters but things have not turned out the way I planned financially).

However when my son was starting school, I did send him to private school and that was because even though we lived in a good area in Chicago at the time, the local public school was only ho-hum. Combined with the fact that I had to work, a private school that offered an after-school program made more sense.

I suppose had we stayed in Chicago he would have stayed in private schools though even that is hard to say because at 6 he went to live with Dad in Maine where the schools were far better than the public ones in Chicago.

I understand the desire to give our kids the best but for me I have 2 kids and with 1 who is a year away from college I look at the whole picture. Honestly $14,000 is a lot for preschool in fact several months ago we had briefly thought about moving back to Chicago and some of the preschools and pre-K programs were in that price range. Well as a non-profit administrator and a journalist there is no way we could afford that. It would be more than just giving up shoes or pants, which truthfully we already are Goodwill shoppers these days. But at 36 and 41 we have to plan for our own retirement one day and considering that I have over 100K in student loans (silly private schools for me) paying that kind of cash for preschool is just not feasible.

Right now my son who is a junior and looking at colleges while he is not considering Ivy League schools much to his Dad (my ex) irritation is looking at some good solid schools. Right now its a mix of private and public schools.

Growing up biracial in New England though he has had wide exposure to many areas, he is interested in poli-sci and involved in drama. I think having parents who are active in their kids education is a key to success, I have been talking to my son about college and his future since he was 11. He used to laugh at me but recently he told me he was glad I was bugging him early on.

I have a 3 yo and while I worry about her future too, living in Maine she attends a multi-cultural preschool/daycare, we are active in the community and books are God in this house. LOL

However you have to make the choices that are comfortable for you, I know at one point I was ready to go into debt to send the little one to a Montessori program where they would have had french and all sorts of great programming.

Well a couple months ago they sent me a newsletter and it was clear that there was only lipservice being paid to the cultural sensitivity piece and considering dd would have been the only kid of color, I ruled the place out at that point. It would have given her a fabulous foundation but having spent most of my own childhood as the only fly in the buttermilk I think it did more damage than good. I thrived educationally but stumbled socially.

All that to say, if you feel this is where your son should be and he will thrive and it won't hurt you too much financially, then go for it.









Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I have been talking to my son about college and his future since he was 11. He used to laugh at me but recently he told me he was glad I was bugging him early on.

This has me entirely nervous now... I've never talked about college with my kids, I don't think, except perhaps to mention that it's where I or Mike was when we were younger. I know, it seems silly to be worrying about it when my kids are so young, but not to put too fine a point on it Bean is, presently, three years ahead of his age-grade in terms of academic work. By the time he's eleven, it's likely we'll be looking at some kind of college coursework.







: What did you have to say to your son, all those years ago?

Quote:

having spent most of my own childhood as the only fly in the buttermilk I think it did more damage than good. I thrived educationally but stumbled socially.
I can certainly relate to some of this. My kids look "white" for the most part (except BooBah, she looks like she's been bleached and had her hair straightened







genes are so strange) but it's very important to me that they understand that they're mixed and that they spend time with diverse groups of children. I wish we had a local group of AA homeschoolers around here.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
This has me entirely nervous now... I've never talked about college with my kids, I don't think, except perhaps to mention that it's where I or Mike was when we were younger. I know, it seems silly to be worrying about it when my kids are so young, but not to put too fine a point on it Bean is, presently, three years ahead of his age-grade in terms of academic work. By the time he's eleven, it's likely we'll be looking at some kind of college coursework.







: What did you have to say to your son, all those years ago?

I can certainly relate to some of this. My kids look "white" for the most part (except BooBah, she looks like she's been bleached and had her hair straightened







genes are so strange) but it's very important to me that they understand that they're mixed and that they spend time with diverse groups of children. I wish we had a local group of AA homeschoolers around here.









When he hit 10-11 he went through the sullen phase and I stayed on him that the choices he makes now can impact his future. There was one incident when he was hanging out with his now step siblings at 12, they snuck out the house and vandalized a building.







:







Pretty much my tone was that of you get branded a trouble maker that label will last a while.

I also encouraged him to think about what he wanted to do when he grew up, for years he wanted to be a chef, he liked cooking but a few years ago realized it was not his passion.

I know many folks feel 11-12 is too young to think about the future but considering that I was 14 when I started to rebel against being what I was perceived as (goody two-shoes) I really felt he needed me to be persistent at that preteen stage.

In some ways I feel it paid off, he never got in trouble again after the vandalism situation of course he is only 17 and can still change his course. However he is far more thoughtful and advanced than I was at 17.


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I understand the desire to give our kids the best but for me I have 2 kids and with 1 who is a year away from college I look at the whole picture. Honestly *$14,000 is a lot for preschool* in fact several months ago we had briefly thought about moving back to Chicago and some of the preschools and pre-K programs were in that price range. Well as a non-profit administrator and a journalist there is no way we could afford that. *It would be more than just giving up shoes or pants, which truthfully we already are Goodwill shoppers these days.* But at 36 and 41 we have to plan for our own retirement one day and considering that I have over 100K in student loans (silly private schools for me) paying that kind of cash for preschool is just not feasible.

Shay









I totally agree.

Ugh . . . school. I'm annoyed that it's so complex! I'm annoyed that it seems that really stellar educations are out of reach for middle to lower income families! I'm annoyed that you have to bend over backwards it seems to give your children "the edge".

In fact, sometimes I think it will be a good thing for life to get simpler. Right back to basics. Even the playing field out a bit. Every child deserves a stellar education and every parent deserves not to have to sell body parts to give it.

Anyway, I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do when it's time for my sons to attend school. I'm going to check out a public preschool on Wednesday. In my gut, though, I think homeschooling it will be. And I'm hoping by putting the energy out there I'll attract other homeschooling friends. Because what I'm most worried about with homeschooling is isolation.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I have been reading your thread in F & F. Honestly, I don't know that I would make that choice just because with the economy and things so volatile its hard to know where one is going to be in a few short years. At this point my feelings are based more on the fact that in recent years I made choices banking on making a higher salary (went to grad school, got my masters but things have not turned out the way I planned financially).
Sometimes I wonder what will happen if I am not accepted to medical school, even though I KNOW that I will. So I unbderstand the worries of banking on an education. Perhaps I am wearing blinders or I am insulated by the relatively stable economy in our area that I have honestly not given the situation much thought.

However when my son was starting school, I did send him to private school and that was because even though we lived in a good area in Chicago at the time, the local public school was only ho-hum. Combined with the fact that I had to work, a private school that offered an after-school program made more sense.

I suppose had we stayed in Chicago he would have stayed in private schools though even that is hard to say because at 6 he went to live with Dad in Maine where the schools were far better than the public ones in Chicago.

The schools here in my opinion are not even ho-hum. Maybe I could move, but that is where the *conflict* comes in. Why pay more to live in a nicer area to attend a better school when I can just pay tuition? I really don't want to live in the suburbs, and that is where the better schools are found.

I understand the desire to give our kids the best but for me I have 2 kids and with 1 who is a year away from college I look at the whole picture. Honestly $14,000 is a lot for preschool in fact several months ago we had briefly thought about moving back to Chicago and some of the preschools and pre-K programs were in that price range. Well as a non-profit administrator and a journalist there is no way we could afford that. It would be more than just giving up shoes or pants, which truthfully we already are Goodwill shoppers these days. But at 36 and 41 we have to plan for our own retirement one day and considering that I have over 100K in student loans (silly private schools for me) paying that kind of cash for preschool is just not feasible.

Right now my son who is a junior and looking at colleges while he is not considering Ivy League schools much to his Dad (my ex) irritation is looking at some good solid schools. Right now its a mix of private and public schools.

Growing up biracial in New England though he has had wide exposure to many areas, he is interested in poli-sci and involved in drama. I think having parents who are active in their kids education is a key to success, I have been talking to my son about college and his future since he was 11. He used to laugh at me but recently he told me he was glad I was bugging him early on.

I have a 3 yo and while I worry about her future too, living in Maine she attends a multi-cultural preschool/daycare, we are active in the community and books are God in this house. LOL

However you have to make the choices that are comfortable for you, I know at one point I was ready to go into debt to send the little one to a Montessori program where they would have had french and all sorts of great programming.

Well a couple months ago they sent me a newsletter and it was clear that there was only lipservice being paid to the cultural sensitivity piece and considering dd would have been the only kid of color, I ruled the place out at that point. It would have given her a fabulous foundation but having spent most of my own childhood as the only fly in the buttermilk I think it did more damage than good. I thrived educationally but stumbled socially.

All that to say, if you feel this is where your son should be and he will thrive and it won't hurt you too much financially, then go for it.









Shay

We just received acceptance #2 to the oldest AMI Montessori program in the SW. (i am so proud of my angel at the moment) A lot of Montessori schools, especially the better programs are generally lacking in color. I was thrilles to actually tour Two schools that were able to prove that they were open and welcoming of minorites. Not just the students, but the staff. We LOVED watching non white(black too) staff receive respect and genuine interactin from white co-workers. Based on my interactions with non people of color in this city, I am leary of the public & private schools in the better neighborhoods of my city.

I was always the fly in my classroom, and I spent my childhood in this city, and I must say that I don't have warm fuzzy memories. It took me awhile to get over those less than stellar years and don't want to subject DS to the same experiences.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 

Ugh . . . school. I'm annoyed that it's so complex! I'm annoyed that it seems that really stellar educations are out of reach for middle to lower income families! I'm annoyed that you have to bend over backwards it seems to give your children "the edge".

In fact, sometimes I think it will be a good thing for life to get simpler. Right back to basics. Even the playing field out a bit. Every child deserves a stellar education and every parent deserves not to have to sell body parts to give it.

.

Considering that elder boy goes to college next fall, I am so feeling you. His first choice is now a state school but its still going to be a lot of money and that's with at least a 2 way split maybe 3 between me, his dad and his grandma. I keep joking that I need to get liposuction and a tummy tuck so I can get a night job at the strip club to pay his tuition. Sad thing is I am only 35% joking.

That M.Ed don't pay as much as I need it to. LOL

Shay


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
This has me entirely nervous now... *I've never talked about college with my kids, I don't think, except perhaps to mention that it's where I or Mike was when we were younger. I know, it seems silly to be worrying about it when my kids are so young?
*
*
*
*

Too young, really, you think? I rememeber telling anyone that would listen from a very young age that I was going to Harvard and I was going to be a doctor. (I do have my eye on their post Bacc program) DS might not ever attend college, but he needs to have a high mark for which to aim. From day one I have whispered in DS's ear that he comes from greatness and will accomplish great things. Perhaps great things might = welding metal, but I have to plant the seed. I tell him from time to time that his great, great, great grandfather, and each following generation has attended University and one day he will too.*


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 







I totally agree.

Ugh . . . school. I'm annoyed that it's so complex! I'm annoyed that it seems that really stellar educations are out of reach for middle to lower income families! I'm annoyed that you have to bend over backwards it seems to give your children "the edge".

I am going to play devils advocate, so don't hate me. I always vex my mother for days on end by doing so. Why should education be an easy reach? I listen to friends and family who work in middle and lower income schools and they feel as if they jobs are in vain. The students don't want to learn, the parents uphold their children when they are wrong and don't appear to support the childs education. Is it then a waste of money to continuously pump money and energy into schools that consistenly receive less than stellar marks. NCLB is not to blame, because I have heard the same arguments from my mother's teacher cohorts all of my life. The only time that they did not complain is when they taught in upper middle class and wealthier areas where the students came ready to learn and the parents had a vested interest in their child's education.

But of course all middle and lower middle class families are not the same and many do value education, but on the outside looking in that does not seem to be the case.

In fact, sometimes I think it will be a good thing for life to get simpler. Right back to basics. Even the playing field out a bit. Every child deserves a stellar education and every parent deserves not to have to sell body parts to give it.

Anyway, I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do when it's time for my sons to attend school. I'm going to check out a public preschool on Wednesday. In my gut, though, I think homeschooling it will be. And I'm hoping by putting the energy out there I'll attract other homeschooling friends. Because what I'm most worried about with homeschooling is isolation.

How do you feel about homeschooling. My child will not listen to me. I tell him that an A is an A, and he says no it is not, that is a 10. Silly boy. But he will listen to his teacher. What is that all about.


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## rootzdawta

Well, AM, I don't think it should be an easy reach by any means. I think that the reason why the public school system is so dismal is that it is easy and folks don't appreciate "free". But those who do appreciate it and sincerely desire better just have to do too much to get it. Sacrifice too much. Whether it's money wise or culture wise. There's no middle ground . . . like maybe schools partially state funded and the other part parent funded . . . or maybe a discount in your school taxes if your child is not in the system. In the town I live in, we pay serious property tax and the schools are sub-par. It is primarily because the parents don't care. The handful that do just deal fighting for the 2 or 3 better schools in town (which are overcrowded) and then trying to figure out what to do after fifth grade because middle school and high school is out of the question. LoL . . . Shay, yup liposuction starts to sound like a good idea in hopes of becoming a successful stripper.

As for homeschooling, ds is 3 and he will argue with me about things from time to time. I really don't stress it if he won't agree that what comes after 14 is 15 because if I do, he figures that it pushes my buttons and insists on it more. If I behave nonchalantly, withall the books and resources that are around him, he realizes 15 comes after 14 eventually and that's that. I *really* would love to homeschool--the only thing stopping me is my difficulty in finding a good, consistent homeschooling community.


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## AndrewsMother

Rootz, what is the reception to HSing in NYC?

I thought of homeschooling briefly, but I know that I am not equipped to teach DS. I am awful at fractions and not that good at balancing equations. I think that it is great that some parents can give their child an education, but I am sure to inflict more harm than good.


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## futurmama8

Hello everyone, checking in to see how ya'll are doing. I was finally able to pull myself away from the MC forum









I finally learned how to post links with one word







so now I finally have pics in my siggy.

Andrewsmothers goodluck figuring out the schooling thing. I read your post and I am very intrigued by that school for your son. Those are some great oppurtunities. I really want to homeschool but man if I could do that school financially I would. Best of luck.

Hope everybodies doing ok!!


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Rootz, what is the reception to HSing in NYC?

I thought of homeschooling briefly, but I know that I am not equipped to teach DS. I am awful at fractions and not that good at balancing equations. I think that it is great that some parents can give their child an education, but I am sure to inflict more harm than good.

NYS as a whole is a very conservative state in every sense so homeschooling is regulated and you have to check in, do assessments, etc . . . however, I've heard that in NYC, there's a homeschooling group for people of color (or at least a few black homeschoolers) although I can't seem to find them. The great thing about NYC is that there are so many resources--museums, free to low cost programs, etc.

It's good to be honest with yourself about what you're capable of. I was actually pretty good at school and surprise myself with how much I've retained. That along with my degree and a willingness to read, read, read, I think makes me very qualified to teach my children. Patience to do it, though, is another story. Not to mention . . . me? Will I be able to focus on me? My writing? My career?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
NYS as a whole is a very conservative state in every sense so homeschooling is regulated and you have to check in, do assessments, etc . . . however, I've heard that in NYC, there's a homeschooling group for people of color (or at least a few black homeschoolers) although I can't seem to find them. The great thing about NYC is that there are so many resources--museums, free to low cost programs, etc.

It's good to be honest with yourself about what you're capable of. I was actually pretty good at school and surprise myself with how much I've retained. That along with my degree and a willingness to read, read, read, I think makes me very qualified to teach my children. Patience to do it, though, is another story. Not to mention . . . me? Will I be able to focus on me? My writing? My career?

Oh, and I forgot to mention the patience.

I read alot, but not to the extent that I could teach him a foreign language from a native perspective or any other language. I love my Chemistry class, but I don't have a passion for it like so many Chemistry instructors.

I know that my expectations are high and I don't want to spoil my childs love of learning. I could read at his age and I have to stop myself from becoming annoyed because he only recognizes two letters. Not really annoyed but I have to tell myself that he is not me.

I drool over the private schools, museums and other opportunites that are available in NYC. When people tell me that they moved form New York to the south I just look at them and wonder, WHY? Yes I am sure that they city has it issues, but the adavantages seen to be outweigh the negatives.

But what do I know, I have only visited.

Can you imagine homeschooling for the full 12 years or only elementary?


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Oh, and I forgot to mention the patience.

I read alot, but not to the extent that I could teach him a foreign language from a native perspective or any other language. I love my Chemistry class, but I don't have a passion for it like so many Chemistry instructors.

I know that my expectations are high and I don't want to spoil my childs love of learning. I could read at his age and I have to stop myself from becoming annoyed because he only recognizes two letters. Not really annoyed but I have to tell myself that he is not me.

I drool over the private schools, museums and other opportunites that are available in NYC. When people tell me that they moved form New York to the south I just look at them and wonder, WHY? Yes I am sure that they city has it issues, but the adavantages seen to be outweigh the negatives.

But what do I know, I have only visited.

Can you imagine homeschooling for the full 12 years or only elementary?

You know, I think this is where a good homeschooling collective comes in. I'm really clueless when it comes to chemistry and I struggled with physics.In a strong network of homeschoolers, these two things are bound to be someone's strength or else we can pool our resources to provide the best education in these subjects (tutors, etc). But because I haven't found that network (or haven't created it, as it were), I don't know that I could continue up until 12th grade. However, in NY there are programs like Prep 9 that we could find where they would get full scholarships to private day or boarding schools (my sister did the program and many other people I know).

I have high expectations too and in school, I had really high expectations of myself. That actually took the joy out of learning because I was always in competition with myself. My hope with homeschooling is to take the pressure of grades and rank off my children so they can enjoy the learning process. I want their education to be more substantive than how well they can regurgitate information and how high their GPA can be (although knowledge and good grades are still important to me).


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## eilonwy

Yes... at six, I think my oldest is too young to be thinking about college. Should he be getting the message that he will be something great? Absolutely... but college involves making decisions with a much longer outlook, and quite frankly many 18 year olds aren't ready to make those decisions.

The way I see it, it's my job to see to his education. I'm the grownup, the parent. At sixteen things are different, but at six it's mostly my decision. The trouble is, with a kid like mine taking care of his basic educational needs will probably involve college coursework long before he's old enough to look after himself. It will still be my responsibility to see that he gets what he needs when he's ready to begin college-level work at this point. It makes me dizzy to think about it.







:

As to public education... well, my son is getting an excellent 'free and appropriate public education.' I am of the opinion that it should be an easy reach, and I think that the factors which go into making a school a poor learning environment are numerous, and often overly simplified with platitudes and statements like, "The parents just don't care." It's all much more complicated than that, and I think it does a disservice to parents and kids when you try to simplify things so much. No Child Left Behind may not be responsible for all of it, but it certainly hasn't helped; That's a law that needed to be repealed before it was ever passed.

Homeschooling: Easier than most people think-- yes, to do well. While the educational level of the parents is the primary predictor in how well a public school student will do in school, the same is not true of homeschooling. Parents with eighth grade educations have successfully educated their children from home to college. Single, working parents have successfully home educated their children. It's all a matter of priorities and resourcefulness. Right now, I've got it "easy" but at the end of next school year I may well pull Bean from the cyberschool he's currently attending in order to homeschool him independantly (long story). I'm not remotely afraid that I'm incapable, nor that he will "get behind." Resources are extremely scarce around here, but I'm bound and determined to make it work. Our local public school is entirely unwilling to accomodate even moderately gifted students, and in my opinion and experience private schools foster an unhealthy sense of elitism and entitlement that does not serve children well later in life. While it's not my personal favorite (for me or for BeanBean) I'd sooner unschool Bean than send him to any of the private schools in the area (which include a Waldorf, at least two Montessoris, a Democratic, and several other schools).

Speaking of all this... Erika? Where are you?


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## rootzdawta

Rynna, I hear what you're saying and a lot of it resonates with me. But having taught in the inner city and talked to parents in this town (including the PTA president), I really do believe wholeheartedly that while it is complex and politics do play a part, the single most important indicator as to whether a school will be worthwhile is parental involvement. And, due to a host of reasons that, you're right, are not simple, where I am, parents are not the most involved, i.e. school is not or it can't be their priority.

I also agree that homeschooling is not as difficult as it sounds. But a parent *has to* believe within themselves that they can do it or else they'll easily be overwhelmed or frustrated.


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## Arike

I would love to homeschool my DS but I have to work. Unless me and DH's situation changes overnight, DS will be attending a public/charter/private school. DS is only 5 months old and I am already worried about where he is going to attend pre-k and beyond. I love NYC but the public school system has MAJOR issues. And private schools...like $30,000 a year, no joke. I mean that's how much my college tuition was with room and board! And I really don't want to start taking out loans now for kindergarden. I think that's ridiculous. Sometimes I feel like private schools here are like first class airplane tickets, i.e. so expensive that it becomes an elite priviledge. Part of me wants to move to an affluent suburb BUT the other part of me is excited that my DS lives in an international crossroads where he can see, meet and be friends with people of many different backgrounds. Just the other day I was indirectly asking my mother to help DH and I with a down payment on a house in Westchester County.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Hello everyone, checking in to see how ya'll are doing. I was finally able to pull myself away from the MC forum









I finally learned how to post links with one word







so now I finally have pics in my siggy.

*Andrewsmothers goodluck figuring out the schooling thing.* I read your post and I am very intrigued by that school for your son. Those are some great oppurtunities. I really want to homeschool but man if I could do that school financially I would. Best of luck.

Hope everybodies doing ok!!

Thank you. If I could just get DH to assist with the decision making process I would be content.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I have high expectations too and in school, I had really high expectations of myself. That actually took the joy out of learning because I was always in competition with myself. My hope with homeschooling is to take the pressure of grades and rank off my children so they can enjoy the learning process. I want their education to be more substantive than how well they can regurgitate information and how high their GPA can be (although knowledge and good grades are still important to me).


I know that it sounds like you are set on homeschooling and that is good. Though if you decide to look at schools Montessori might be a good fit for your family. I love Montessori for the younger year, but I am unsure for the older years.

I understand why many are against the grade system, but I did not like attending a school that did not grade assignments. I am competitive by nature and just the idea of learning is not enough. I want to know just where I stand in relation to the rest of the class school.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I know that it sounds like you are set on homeschooling and that is good. Though if you decide to look at schools Montessori might be a good fit for your family. I love Montessori for the younger year, but I am unsure for the older years.

I understand why many are against the grade system, but I did not like attending a school that did not grade assignments. I am competitive by nature and just the idea of learning is not enough. I want to know just where I stand in relation to the rest of the class school.

LoL . . . AM, I go back and forth like a volleyball. This week I'm homeschooling. Next week, I'm not. In fact, tomorrow I'm going to go check out a public preschool. There are some decent public schools in town (though not the ones I'm zoned to) and I'm tossing around the idea of just putting my foot down to get my kids into one of those. Especially since I know the kind of mama I am . . .I'd do a lot of reinforcing work at home. Public school, even if not stellar, I think I could make work. Which would give me time to write. Figure out my career . . . go back to school.

I'm not against a grade system per se. I'm quite competitive too. But at some point in school, the whole point of everything was to be the best. To be first. Not to learn. I'd like a set up for my kids where there is balance between competitiveness and knowing that no two people can really be compared. Does that make sense? For me the competitiveness took the joy out of learning . . . it was all about "winning". I didn't go to my senior prom studying for AP Biology. I just had to get a 5. I did. And now ten years later, I wish I had gone to my prom and I would have been okay with a 4. I want my children to enjoy it . . . do things they like even if they're not #1 at it or if it means they won't be #1.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I'm not against a grade system per se. I'm quite competitive too. But at some point in school, the whole point of everything was to be the best. To be first. Not to learn. I'd like a set up for my kids where there is balance between competitiveness and knowing that no two people can really be compared. Does that make sense? For me the competitiveness took the joy out of learning . . . it was all about "winning". I didn't go to my senior prom studying for AP Biology. I just had to get a 5. I did. And now ten years later, I wish I had gone to my prom and I would have been okay with a 4. I want my children to enjoy it . . . do things they like even if they're not #1 at it or if it means they won't be #1.

This is how I feel about grades and this is coming from someone who aside from my intentional f'up years in HS always got excellent grades. In college, I actually was bummed because I graduated with a 3.87 GPA, got one B in a music class of all things. Even in grad school I feel like the desire to get the best grades took away from learning. (added with being the only Black person in the dept so I HAD to bring my A game)

The thing is looking back, I think its too easy to get hooked on straight A's for the sake of having them and lose sight of the joy of learning. I am all about no pressure learning.

Shay


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Speaking of all this... Erika? Where are you?

Hello Sisterfriends!

I am here but I have been so busy lately that all I can do is read here at MDC.
Hopefully I can come back here and comment on the many topics that have been discussed lately.
Oh, before I forget:
This is to All of the New Members here:







*!WELCOME TO THE TRIBE!*








I hope to see many more posts from all of you!









**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## olliepop

A few months ago, I posted a thread about going natural on the Multicultural forum and Purplegirl told me that I should make sure my esteem is intact before taking the plunge. At the time, I didn't know exactly what she meant, but now that I have gone natural, it was like







:.

When my mother saw my new hair-do (or hair-don't from her perspective) she told me that she didn't like it, it was too "ethnic" for her. It could have been a blow to my esteem, but it wasn't. I had to remember all the times she dragged me to the salon as a little girl, how I cried when the relaxer burned my scalp, only to have her and the woman doing my hair repeat, "Beauty feels no pain."

THAT was where she was coming from and I just took it with a grain of salt, told her that I was really happy with it and that she was entitled to her opinion.

Anyway, I love it and just wanted to thank Purplegirl for the heads up!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
A few months ago, I posted a thread about going natural on the Multicultural forum and Purplegirl told me that I should make sure my esteem is intact before taking the plunge. At the time, I didn't know exactly what she meant, but now that I have gone natural, it was like







:.

When my mother saw my new hair-do (or hair-don't from her perspective) she told me that she didn't like it, it was too "ethnic" for her. It could have been a blow to my esteem, but it wasn't. I had to remember all the times she dragged me to the salon as a little girl, how I cried when the relaxer burned my scalp, only to have her and the woman doing my hair repeat, "Beauty feels no pain."

THAT was where she was coming from and I just took it with a grain of salt, told her that I was really happy with it and that she was entitled to her opinion.

Anyway, I love it and just wanted to thank Purplegirl for the heads up!

Hi there. You are most welcome







I know what I went through when I decided to go natural. The unsolicited comments were more than I could endure. I am still natural though at this time, I am wearing a 'protective' style because my hair fell out due to health issues. This summer I plan to rock my fro again and feel better armed to deal with the ill-informed comments.







It's a process though and I don't expect people to 'get it' right away. The very good news is that more and more women are deciding to go natural and I think that's fantastic.
Thanks for coming back and sharing your process


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
A few months ago, I posted a thread about going natural on the Multicultural forum and Purplegirl told me that I should make sure my esteem is intact before taking the plunge. At the time, I didn't know exactly what she meant, but now that I have gone natural, it was like







:.

When my mother saw my new hair-do (or hair-don't from her perspective) she told me that she didn't like it, it was too "ethnic" for her. It could have been a blow to my esteem, but it wasn't. I had to remember all the times she dragged me to the salon as a little girl, how I cried when the relaxer burned my scalp, only to have her and the woman doing my hair repeat, "Beauty feels no pain."

THAT was where she was coming from and I just took it with a grain of salt, told her that I was really happy with it and that she was entitled to her opinion.

Anyway, I love it and just wanted to thank Purplegirl for the heads up!

So glad that your Mom's comments did not sting too bad, I went through a similiat deal almost 10 years ago when I went natural. I will admit it was dramatic (one day bob length hair and then an inch of hair on my head), my husband was stunned but he got over it. It was my Dad though who starterd acting a fool, man stopped talking to me because he couldn't get what was wrong with me.









Anyway yeah, going and staying natural requires some self esteem. I will be honest even at almost 10 years natural, I still have my moments.

Shay


----------



## eilonwy

My mom and sister both still freak out at the notion of my now eleven-year-old niece growing dreadlocks. In my opinion, they can't possibly be worse than the mess that's on her head right now. She's got about an inch and a half (much longer, if you pulled it out straight-ish) of natural hair and then six or seven inches of fried, relaxed mess. It gets worse: In many places, the relaxed hair has broken off so she's got this completely freaky, whacked out thing going on where there are these big patches of soft, nappy hair just there and then others with the fried mess hanging off. I mean it's downright surreal. It would look SO much nicer if they just cut all the mess off, but even though my sister wears her hair VERY short she won't cut the fried mess off of Chibi's head. It's awful, I know I'm not describing it well but I also know that you ladies probably have some idea of what I'm talking about.

Of course the kid can't begin to take care of her hair on her own in this state; Most adults would probably be at a loss, too. It irritates me SO MUCH-- not because I'm one of those self-righteous people who thinks that everyone should wear their hair natural, but because I think that kids should be able to learn to take care of their own hair or at least have some say in the care of it, and Chibi never got to make an informed decision. Now they give her trouble for never combing her hair or wanting to deal with it, but honestly... my sister doesn't know what to do with it, how the hell should the kid?!









I've got to go... BeanBean made pasta...







: The perils of having a child who can read and follow instructions...


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
A few months ago, I posted a thread about going natural on the Multicultural forum and Purplegirl told me that I should make sure my esteem is intact before taking the plunge. At the time, I didn't know exactly what she meant, but now that I have gone natural, it was like







:.

When my mother saw my new hair-do (or hair-don't from her perspective) she told me that she didn't like it, it was too "ethnic" for her. It could have been a blow to my esteem, but it wasn't. I had to remember all the times she dragged me to the salon as a little girl, how I cried when the relaxer burned my scalp, only to have her and the woman doing my hair repeat, "Beauty feels no pain."

THAT was where she was coming from and I just took it with a grain of salt, told her that I was really happy with it and that she was entitled to her opinion.

Anyway, I love it and just wanted to thank Purplegirl for the heads up!

I'm so happy for you! It IS tough going the natural route. I walked around with 2" hair for months and could feel the eyes. Definitely need that self assurance!

Rynna, I know what you mean about the hair. That's how my MIL "liked" my hair. I thought it looked horrid, which was why I did the big chop then. I couldn't wait!


----------



## olliepop

Thanks! I really like it. I do a "straw set" with tiny curling rods and so I have tiny tight curls that loosen a little as the days go by. My dh LOVES it. My daughter is happy that we both have "curly" hair and my little guy (2 years old) says, "I like your little hair, Mommy." That's all the reassurance I need.

Also, all my white friends love it and my MIL says it's the best hairstyle I've ever had. The only resistance I get is from my own family.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:

The only resistance I get is from my own family.
Olliepop, you look gorgeous.
I can't imagine why anyone would not like how you look!
I've always wished I could go short myself but I have a big forehead and short hair just makes it look massive.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
my little guy (2 years old) says, "I like your little hair, Mommy." That's all the reassurance I need.

Awww! What a sweetie!


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
Thanks! I really like it. I do a "straw set" with tiny curling rods and so I have tiny tight curls that loosen a little as the days go by. My dh LOVES it. My daughter is happy that we both have "curly" hair and my little guy (2 years old) says, "I like your little hair, Mommy." That's all the reassurance I need.

Also, all my white friends love it and my MIL says it's the best hairstyle I've ever had. The only resistance I get is from my own family.









It's strange. So many AA people feel that we should get as far away from nappy as possible. It's crazy what some people do to their hair to keep it straight, silky, etc. And when people in your family are trying so hard to do that, they may feel it almost insulting that you would prefer what they try so hard to avoid.


----------



## Jannah6

I was thinking since Spring is here that many people are doing Spring cleaning. So, do any of you NYC mamas want to do a Spring cleaning trade/swap/give away?


----------



## Draupadi

Sure, Jannah!
Let's talk about it.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
It's strange. So many AA people feel that we should get as far away from nappy as possible. It's crazy what some people do to their hair to keep it straight, silky, etc. And when people in your family are trying so hard to do that, they may feel it almost insulting that you would prefer what they try so hard to avoid.

frustrating? yes. crazy? strange? i think not. symptomatic of a larger painful history of oppression? yes.

i mean take a look a any TV show or music video or mainstream film and do you see any natural hair on Black women? those more recent icons w/ natural hair have cut it off! look back to 1920, find any yet? besides Mammy, is Lena Horne rocking it? Dorothy Dandrige? were we not told that our hair in its natural state is ugly and unkempt for centuries? thus, why would be strange that our Elders, and often our peers, in wanting what is best for us--expect and demand that our hair be tamed and made appropriate for the mainstream--so we can be seen as respectable and normative. this is to be expected. sad but true.

i've got to get this off my chest: sometimes i feel like some of the expressions on this thread hint at Black people-bashing or at least a kind of POC cluelessness. i know many of us are the unique and alternative living, ap parenting, bohemian-minded folks in our community and many of us were/are the odd-one-out- fly in da buttermilk--only black girl in AP class/ at the Red Hot Chili Peppers show, only one making the cloth diapers in tha hood, afro punk before there was afro punk, i get it, whatever. but alot of what is hip, organic and crunchy now was simply our way back in the day. so what happened?? well, the excellent film on black midwives---Bringin in Da Spirit--speaks to this.

despite the conditioning, racism and exploitation, we've rocked it and loved each other thru the fires. despite our triumphs, however, we have a lot of healing to do as a community, as a people. going natural can be a healing rite for us. when i was the first to dread in my family ten years ago, my Mama asked "who would marry me with hair like that?" hurtful, yes. was i po'd? yes. but i knew she was honestly afraid i would be rejected and unloved. i told her not to worry cause i'd marry a brother with dreads too. ten years later indeed i did. ten years later my sister, who used to perm my hair, is now a renowned loctician. and my mom wears an afro and wants my sister to start her some sister locs. my determination to go natural inspired the women in my family, slowly but surely.

so ollipop perhaps your family will be inspired by your healing journey. (and i'm NOT saying you shouldn't vent but being the renegade ain't easy).

nonetheless----if you've read this far---you all may be asking why the heck is this woman so riled up???

because i'm sooo sick of hearing on MDC and mothering mag how AA women don't breastfeed. and how the Black folks just don't get "attachment parenting." and how AA babies are simply due to their racial category at risk for SIDS. i want to call these discourses into question. if these stats are "true" we must demand WHY! ( i just finally subscribed to mothering today, the digital version and was all excited to read it and in the first couple of pages AA women are bashed as the quintessential anti-ap-ers. but no one is grappling with the big stinky "WHY?" as they might find they are complicit in constructing the reasons ---this is some typical white privilege bs.)

and because i come to this thread with the occasional hope of shielding myself from some of these assumptions but sometimes i feel like there is a consistent chorus of "aren't we soooo diff't from all those ignorant, spanking their kids, daycare lovin, junk food in the morning, vaccinating, passive public schooling, creamy crack addicted, color conscious, anti-breastfeeding black folks." (lol! i'm laughing at this list!) and yes i make some difft choices from those folks, but i'm clear--those folks are _*my folks*_. so i try view them and approach them with compassion and patience, cause i know the systems they/we are up against.
it is those systems that have worked tirelessly to construct that ignorant self hating passive POC. those of us who manage to subvert that conditioning and get better info and make healthier choices should get off the high horses/the island of one-isms and get with some Harriet Tubman type of maneuvers and spread the love! (and i know some of you are IRL and virtually---i just feel maladjusted to the thread's politics or something or over MDC in general right now, sigh).

okay, i've got to stop







!!! before you







:!
p.s. ollipop you look absolutely gorgeous with the natural and JeDeeLAnae this is not directed at you specifically







.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
frustrating? yes. crazy? strange? i think not. symptomatic of a larger painful history of oppression? yes.

i mean take a look a any TV show or music video or mainstream film and do you see any natural hair on Black women? those more recent icons w/ natural hair have cut it off! look back to 1920, find any yet? besides Mammy, is Lena Horne rocking it? Dorothy Dandrige? were we not told that our hair in its natural state is ugly and unkempt for centuries? thus, why would be strange that our Elders, and often our peers, in wanting what is best for us--expect and demand that our hair be tamed and made appropriate for the mainstream--so we can be seen as respectable and normative. this is to be expected. sad but true.

i've got to get this off my chest: sometimes i feel like some of the expressions on this thread hint at Black people-bashing or at least a kind of POC cluelessness. i know many of us are the unique and alternative living, ap parenting, bohemian-minded folks in our community and many of us were/are the odd-one-out- fly in da buttermilk--only black girl in AP class/ at the Red Hot Chili Peppers show, only one making the cloth diapers in tha hood, afro punk before there was afro punk, i get it, whatever. but alot of what is hip, organic and crunchy now was simply our way back in the day. so what happened?? well, the excellent film on black midwives---Bringin in Da Spirit--speaks to this.

despite the conditioning, racism and exploitation, we've rocked it and loved each other thru the fires. despite our triumphs, however, we have a lot of healing to do as a community, as a people. going natural can be a healing rite for us. when i was the first to dread in my family ten years ago, my Mama asked "who would marry me with hair like that?" hurtful, yes. was i po'd? yes. but i knew she was honestly afraid i would be rejected and unloved. i told her not to worry cause i'd marry a brother with dreads too. ten years later indeed i did. ten years later my sister, who used to perm my hair, is now a renowned loctician. and my mom wears an afro and wants my sister to start her some sister locs. my determination to go natural inspired the women in my family, slowly but surely.

so ollipop perhaps your family will be inspired by your healing journey. (and i'm NOT saying you shouldn't vent but being the renegade ain't easy).

nonetheless----if you've read this far---you all may be asking why the heck is this woman so riled up???

because i'm sooo sick of hearing on MDC and mothering mag how AA women don't breastfeed. and how the Black folks just don't get "attachment parenting." and how AA babies are simply due to their racial category at risk for SIDS. i want to call these discourses into question. if these stats are "true" we must demand WHY! ( i just finally subscribed to mothering today, the digital version and was all excited to read it and in the first couple of pages AA women are bashed as the quintessential anti-ap-ers. but no one is grappling with the big stinky "WHY?" as they might find they are complicit in constructing the reasons ---this is some typical white privilege bs.)

and because i come to this thread with the occasional hope of shielding myself from some of these assumptions but sometimes i feel like there is a consistent chorus of "aren't we soooo diff't from all those ignorant, spanking their kids, daycare lovin, junk food in the morning, vaccinating, passive public schooling, creamy crack addicted, color conscious, anti-breastfeeding black folks." (lol! i'm laughing at this list!) and yes i make some difft choices from those folks, but i'm clear--those folks are _*my folks*_. so i try view them and approach them with compassion and patience, cause i know the systems they/we are up against.
it is those systems that have worked tirelessly to construct that ignorant self hating passive POC. those of us who manage to subvert that conditioning and get better info and make healthier choices should get off the high horses/the island of one-isms and get with some Harriet Tubman type of maneuvers and spread the love! (and i know some of you are IRL and virtually---i just feel maladjusted to the thread's politics or something or over MDC in general right now, sigh).

okay, i've got to stop







!!! before you








:!
p.s. ollipop you look absolutely gorgeous with the natural and JeDeeLAnae this is not directed at you specifically







.

No I love everything you said, everything.







Much of what you said is definitely things I have thought at one time or another. I do sometimes feel that and not necessarily here on this tribe but with more crunchy/AP leaning Black women, there is this tendency to diss our sistern who may not be where we are on the journey and it drives me mad. Once upon a time I was one of those women, with my 17 yo, I was permed, ate and fed my kid crap, spanked, etc.

It was only because I started reading various materials that opened my mind and met some folks who introduced me to different ways that I was able to expand and grow. Looking back, I never knew anyone who nursed their kid, yet the first woman I ever saw nursing (I was 22 or so at the time) was a Black woman nursing a toddler. I remember looking that this chick like WTF??? Yet she did not flinch, was not ashamed and just gently told me her child needed comfort. I always held that image in my mind, always said if I had another baby I would try that breastfeeding thing and I will be darned of I didn't. My girl just weaned a month ago at 3 years 7 mos...we never know the seeds we are planting with family and friends, that sista I spoke of maybe thought I was the fool for looking at her in judgement but she planted a deep seed that carried over a decade later.

Yeah, I may be a dreadlock having, mostly natural eating sista who likes alternative (well mostly jazz these days music) but I still have fellowship and bonds with all my sisters of the diaspora.

I agree there is a whole historical piece we have to look at when we look to thinge like natural hair, midwifery. Fascinating piece, my Dad whose folks were sharecroppers in Arkansas was concerned about me using a midwife with dd. It turned out he had been delivered by a midfwife, he only discovered that recently when he got a copy of his birth certificate. This stuff is in our blood, we just lost our way...we will get it back.

Shay


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
No I love everything you said, everything.









This stuff is in our blood, we just lost our way...we will get it back.

Shay

Ashe!


----------



## rootzdawta

Nnaemeka, you know why I have a picture of a woman carrying a baby with a wrapper as my avatar? Because much of what you just said is how I feel . . . You come on here to MDC sometimes and read some post about some horrible mother had their baby in *gasp* a stroller. And the underlying sentiment is "Why don't _those_people carry their babies?" as if babywearing is a brand new, AP discovery.







No, like Shay said, we have been doing this _forever_. I make it a *point* to wear my son on my back traditional style--no Ergo, no super designer sling . . . just the skirt part of an old dress I had back in the day. I love when folks in my predominantly Black neighborhood take an interest and want me to show them how to do it. I'm not knocking Ergos and slings . . . but please, don't try to act like you are introducing me to something new and "in tune" and AP. We just have to get back. And we are.


----------



## Bloomingstar

yes! ashe! word.

And that film is great! my midwife an a few other women organized a screening of it a few weeks ago in BK and I saw it (were you there?)

I'm over it with th "black people don't do..." stuff also. And I think it plays into the way black folks in America--and I guess African-Americans specifically--are so routinely isolated from black folks in other parts of the world. more to say on that but baby calls!


----------



## Brown Lioness

I also think that a lot of black folk DO parent AP in some ways, but because it doesnt have that LABEL of being AP, then its not seen as different from the norm.

I remember seeing an episode of Bringing Home Baby (you know, the show that MDC hates to love lol) that featured a young sista that just had a baby and was getting help from her HUGE family. During the episode, her mother showed her how to keep the baby's skin moisturized after giving him a "bath" (she didnt believe in REALLY bathing the baby, just wiping her down with washclothes, which makes sense, the baby was all of 3 days old at the time). The mother showed her how to "oil her down" with olive oil. Im sure all the advertisers for that show just cringed and winced at that, because she was using olive oil instead of the latest Johnson and Johnson baby wash, lol. It just made me so proud and confirmed that if us younger sisters would just look back a generation or two, we STILL have that innate knowledge that the baby industry and all these baby and parenting gurus are just now "discovering".

This goes the same for granny midwives, baby care, etc. It does no good to try and look down on each other for knowing or not knowing that knowledge. I admit that i also get irritated when black women are accused of everything short of being the worst mothers on the planet. Especially when when its forgotten WE were EVERYONE's ELSE's mother at one point (we were the wet nurses, the nanny, the mama, the midwives, etc BEFORE we were able to go home and be mothers to our own children, if even then).

Even with other aspects of "hippy" or "boho" or "crunchy" living, those are things we already knew as well. Growing our own food and avoiding processed foods (my granddaddy as well as other elders in my family, refuses to eat at restraurants), reusing things, using natural/herbal remedies, natural bath and body products, etc.

It seems to be that all these new "natural living" prospects have been taken right from the lives of indigenous peoples.

I agree that we are getting back. Maybe all of these new-fangled labels will help us realize what we already knew, lol.


----------



## Draupadi

Yes to all.
A lot of folks tend to forget that AP is just what's normal in LOTS of non-western cultures.
Things like babywearing and co-sleeping don't raise an eyebrow in many places in the world. Hell, my mother used to "wear" her siblings when they were babies (she comes from a family of 11), and co-sleeping is just what everyone does where she's from. When DH and I decided that we were going to co-sleep, Mom just said to me, "Well, it's natural to want to be close to your baby."
I also don't like when people act like they invented it and are showing you something new.








Anyway...


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
I also think that a lot of black folk DO parent AP in some ways, but because it doesnt have that LABEL of being AP, then its not seen as different from the norm.

I remember seeing an episode of Bringing Home Baby (you know, the show that MDC hates to love lol) that featured a young sista that just had a baby and was getting help from her HUGE family. During the episode, her mother showed her how to keep the baby's skin moisturized after giving him a "bath" (she didnt believe in REALLY bathing the baby, just wiping her down with washclothes, which makes sense, the baby was all of 3 days old at the time). The mother showed her how to "oil her down" with olive oil. Im sure all the advertisers for that show just cringed and winced at that, because she was using olive oil instead of the latest Johnson and Johnson baby wash, lol. It just made me so proud and confirmed that if us younger sisters would just look back a generation or two, we STILL have that innate knowledge that the baby industry and all these baby and parenting gurus are just now "discovering".

This goes the same for granny midwives, baby care, etc. It does no good to try and look down on each other for knowing or not knowing that knowledge. I admit that i also get irritated when black women are accused of everything short of being the worst mothers on the planet. Especially when when its forgotten WE were EVERYONE's ELSE's mother at one point (we were the wet nurses, the nanny, the mama, the midwives, etc BEFORE we were able to go home and be mothers to our own children, if even then).

Even with other aspects of "hippy" or "boho" or "crunchy" living, those are things we already knew as well. Growing our own food and avoiding processed foods (my granddaddy as well as other elders in my family, refuses to eat at restraurants), reusing things, using natural/herbal remedies, natural bath and body products, etc.

It seems to be that all these new "natural living" prospects have been taken right from the lives of indigenous peoples.

I agree that we are getting back. Maybe all of these new-fangled labels will help us realize what we already knew, lol.

You took me back with this post. I remember when I was a kid, I thought my Pops was odd as heck for oiling his skin with olive oil. Yet he swore by it and now you see folks talking about using oils like olive oil as if its some new concept.

I was thinking of this post when I was washing my hair today and remembering how my Granny who wore a low natural for years used to swear by using Kurt's Castile Soap to wash her hair with...I remember it had this strange odor but she loved this stuff. Now we have folks talking about Dr. Bronners which is a castile soap but its almost trendy, last I checked a simple bar of castile was way cheaper.

In some ways I think Black folks were some early frugal folks, yeah many of us don't eat pork now. But think about how may of us may have had families especially if they were from the south that ate things like pig ears, pig feet and things of that ilk. Look, while we don't need to eat that now and really shouldn't, the fact is those were the scraps given to slaves yet the ancestors turned those things into life sustaining foods. Even greens, almost every week we had greens (mustard, turnip, collards, kale) when I was a kid I only thought Black folks ate em or southern whites. Now look everyone is eating them and in some cases like up here in Maine, I have to $3 a pound even in the summer which is crazy. I remember even at the hood store in Chicago they were like .49 a pound.

Another thing and I swear I will shut up







is omega 3 oils (cod liver oil) now we can buy a $20 bottle but when I was kid my folks swore by that and yeah the cheaper stuff didn't taste as good as say Nordic Naturals (which I use







) but fact is we were getting our Omega 3's before folks said we had to.

In my early 20's when I was a single Mama, most of my cooking was based off the southern style cooking I grew up with yet I never had a weight problem. In part I was active but fact is that food was rich and you didn't need to eat a lot. Funny thing is when I went veg the first time (cultural shift is my diet) is when I started having weight issues.

I am actually glad we are having this discussion, its good.

Shay


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
frustrating? yes. crazy? strange? i think not. symptomatic of a larger painful history of oppression? yes.

i mean take a look a any TV show or music video or mainstream film and do you see any natural hair on Black women? those more recent icons w/ natural hair have cut it off! look back to 1920, find any yet? besides Mammy, is Lena Horne rocking it? Dorothy Dandrige? were we not told that our hair in its natural state is ugly and unkempt for centuries? thus, why would be strange that our Elders, and often our peers, in wanting what is best for us--expect and demand that our hair be tamed and made appropriate for the mainstream--so we can be seen as respectable and normative. this is to be expected. sad but true.

i've got to get this off my chest: sometimes i feel like some of the expressions on this thread hint at Black people-bashing or at least a kind of POC cluelessness. i know many of us are the unique and alternative living, ap parenting, bohemian-minded folks in our community and many of us were/are the odd-one-out- fly in da buttermilk--only black girl in AP class/ at the Red Hot Chili Peppers show, only one making the cloth diapers in tha hood, afro punk before there was afro punk, i get it, whatever. but alot of what is hip, organic and crunchy now was simply our way back in the day. so what happened?? well, the excellent film on black midwives---Bringin in Da Spirit--speaks to this.

despite the conditioning, racism and exploitation, we've rocked it and loved each other thru the fires. despite our triumphs, however, we have a lot of healing to do as a community, as a people. going natural can be a healing rite for us. when i was the first to dread in my family ten years ago, my Mama asked "who would marry me with hair like that?" hurtful, yes. was i po'd? yes. but i knew she was honestly afraid i would be rejected and unloved. i told her not to worry cause i'd marry a brother with dreads too. ten years later indeed i did. ten years later my sister, who used to perm my hair, is now a renowned loctician. and my mom wears an afro and wants my sister to start her some sister locs. my determination to go natural inspired the women in my family, slowly but surely.

so ollipop perhaps your family will be inspired by your healing journey. (and i'm NOT saying you shouldn't vent but being the renegade ain't easy).

nonetheless----if you've read this far---you all may be asking why the heck is this woman so riled up???

because i'm sooo sick of hearing on MDC and mothering mag how AA women don't breastfeed. and how the Black folks just don't get "attachment parenting." and how AA babies are simply due to their racial category at risk for SIDS. i want to call these discourses into question. if these stats are "true" we must demand WHY! ( i just finally subscribed to mothering today, the digital version and was all excited to read it and in the first couple of pages AA women are bashed as the quintessential anti-ap-ers. but no one is grappling with the big stinky "WHY?" as they might find they are complicit in constructing the reasons ---this is some typical white privilege bs.)

and because i come to this thread with the occasional hope of shielding myself from some of these assumptions but sometimes i feel like there is a consistent chorus of "aren't we soooo diff't from all those ignorant, spanking their kids, daycare lovin, junk food in the morning, vaccinating, passive public schooling, creamy crack addicted, color conscious, anti-breastfeeding black folks." (lol! i'm laughing at this list!) and yes i make some difft choices from those folks, but i'm clear--those folks are _*my folks*_. so i try view them and approach them with compassion and patience, cause i know the systems they/we are up against.
it is those systems that have worked tirelessly to construct that ignorant self hating passive POC. those of us who manage to subvert that conditioning and get better info and make healthier choices should get off the high horses/the island of one-isms and get with some Harriet Tubman type of maneuvers and spread the love! (and i know some of you are IRL and virtually---i just feel maladjusted to the thread's politics or something or over MDC in general right now, sigh).

okay, i've got to stop







!!! before you







:!
p.s. ollipop you look absolutely gorgeous with the natural and JeDeeLAnae this is not directed at you specifically







.

Oh, I totally understand and agree with all you've said. I want to clarify that I don't think people are crazy for straightening their hair, just the actual process of it. I remember the big huge scabs I had on my scalp, and crying, etc. when I got perms. To me, that burning chemical cream we use is crazy. (and scary, and restimulative, as my scalp starts to twinge.)

What's funny is that just this past week, I talked to about 5 of my relatives who are mothers about different ways of mothering. None of which mother just like me, but that is to be expected since I'm just me. It was nice to hear different parenting philosophies even if some made me cringe. I've had this talk with my sister who is about my total opposite, on a few occasions. I've bought her slings, cloth diapers, I've encouraged her to follow her head and heart and not societal norms. I find that to be a very important part of being in my family is spreading new ideas.

And I DO listen to others. One cousin who limits TV to 1 hour a day and has a very smart LO gave me more ideas on what I can do at home with my kids to keep them entertained other than Word World. And I love doing that.

And I know that wasn't directed AT me, but just wanted to talk about it too.


----------



## nnaemeka

Brown Lioness said:


> I also think that a lot of black folk DO parent AP in some ways, but because it doesnt have that LABEL of being AP, then its not seen as different from the norm.
> 
> I remember seeing an episode of Bringing Home Baby (you know, the show that MDC hates to love lol) that featured a young sista that just had a baby and was getting help from her HUGE family. During the episode, her mother showed her how to keep the baby's skin moisturized after giving him a "bath" (she didnt believe in REALLY bathing the baby, just wiping her down with washclothes, which makes sense, the baby was all of 3 days old at the time). The mother showed her how to "oil her down" with olive oil. Im sure all the advertisers for that show just cringed and winced at that, because she was using olive oil instead of the latest Johnson and Johnson baby wash, lol. It just made me so proud and confirmed that if us younger sisters would just look back a generation or two, we STILL have that innate knowledge that the baby industry and all these baby and parenting gurus are just now "discovering".
> 
> This goes the same for granny midwives, baby care, etc. It does no good to try and look down on each other for knowing or not knowing that knowledge. *I admit that i also get irritated when black women are accused of everything short of being the worst mothers on the planet. Especially when when its forgotten WE were EVERYONE's ELSE's mother at one point (we were the wet nurses, the nanny, the mama, the midwives, etc BEFORE we were able to go home and be mothers to our own children, if even then).*
> 
> Even with other aspects of "hippy" or "boho" or "crunchy" living, those are things we already knew as well. Growing our own food and avoiding processed foods (my granddaddy as well as other elders in my family, refuses to eat at restraurants), reusing things, using natural/herbal remedies, natural bath and body products, etc.
> 
> It seems to be that all these new "natural living" prospects have been taken right from the lives of indigenous peoples.
> 
> I agree that we are getting back. Maybe all of these new-fangled labels will help us realize what we already knew, lol.[/QUOTE
> 
> SOOO TRUE!!! (oops caps lock but yeah!)
> 
> i'm so thrilled and relieved you sistas are feeling me on this! and here i was having all sorts of nervous energy about my post
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> i had never heard of "AP" until my friend directed to this forum when i was pregnant and so i had to google it! but most of Dr Sears and the AP articulators describe is just the what i was planning to do with my youth regardless.
> 
> @ RootzDawta: yeah, i find interesting too how many discussions around "those people" with the strollers or the loud, mean mamas on the bus are highly racialized---but no one ever says directly "those horrible Black mothers" but its all there, between the lines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> @ Bloomingstar: no, i wasn't there. but i did see that film in BK years ago at the Reel Sistahs Film Fest, just by accident really, and i was so moved and amazed by the herstory of Black midwives, and the years of love and struggle it took the sister-director to produce the flick. i'm glad to know the film is still in rotation.
> 
> @Williamsmama: yes, i agree that most of what is crunchy and organic is the way of life most indigenous cultures. however due to the popularity of things like yoga and acupuncture and such, some peoples are getting their props (well, sort of i had a long discussion with an Indian friend who is outraged and hurt by the white appropriation of yoga but that's another matter). i do think there is a greater reluctance to recognize of African/Diasporic ways as living traditions which are healing, natural, ideal etc. (besides our music that this!) particularly in regards to parenting, there seems to be this idea that we need to be saved from our selves.
> 
> @ JeDeeLenae: yeah, i feel you too! i mean to some degree i do think perming/frying/ chemically burning one's hair to flatness is crazy. but Franz Fanon discusses how madness is a logical response to colonialism and i think its the same in this case, post-enslavement. self hatred is psychosis but i think completely understandable given we were never meant to survive as Audre Lorde said! so the fact that even some of us have retained the best of our culture and manifested new healthy cultural tropes is just a testament to our greatness.
> 
> i truly appreciate all your comments! i thank you for hearing me cause i really considered that it might be safer and more comfy not to share my feelings. thanks for proving me wrong--i'm so glad we have this tribe!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


----------



## eilonwy

Nnaemeka;

That was a beautiful post... and now I have questions.

I get a bit of the "Those people don't know how to take care of their babies," but from a slightly different side. I'm light-skinned enough that white people who aren't paying attention (and let's face it-- most aren't) will often take me for one of them. (I make a concerted effort not to look white these days, but it's a heck of a lot easier to put my hair up than it is to leave it loose and curly.) The response, when I point out that I'm not white, basically implies that I know better because I'm not black, either.... like somehow, having lighter skin and finer hair makes me more enlightened than the average black woman. The really sad part is that I get this from black people as well-- that I'm not "really black," so I don't really understand. I can't encourage black women to wear their hair naturally because I don't understand; I can't encourage black women to breastfeed because I just don't know what it's like to experience life as someone who's obviously black.

And I get that. I really do. I will be the first to tell you that being mixed isn't always the easiest thing in the world, but it's true that I don't share the same depth of experience as someone with darker skin, with thicker hair, etc. So: What can I say or do that would be "supportive" without coming off as condescending? Is it even possible, or am I once again relegated to the ranks of "outsider?" I do like point out the historical significance of it all, but for the most part I'm dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it. Any thoughts?


----------



## Draupadi

For a little levity...
Why did I get choked up the first time I saw this?


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WilliamsMama* 
For a little levity...
Why did I get choked up the first time I saw this?

I was just listening to India. This was too cute. Her voice is so nice.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Draupadi* 
For a little levity...
Why did I get choked up the first time I saw this?

New username? Cool... what's it mean?







My kids love that ABC.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
New username? Cool... what's it mean?







My kids love that ABC.









It's cute, isn't it? She makes it sound so...enlightening!









As for my new handle,thanks!
It's from the Mahabharata. I've used it for years on some political/race relations forums I used to frequent.

I decided to change my name because I saw a poster with the the username "William'sMom". WAAAAY too close to mine.

They just changed it about 10 minutes ago!
Thank you, mods!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Draupadi* 
For a little levity...
Why did I get choked up the first time I saw this?

My DS is totally addicted to this.
1. He loves Black women(namely his mama)








2.He loves Elmo
3.He loves his ABC's
What more could he ask for???


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## Jannah6

*nnaemeka*









I totally know where you are coming from. When I first read your post I thought, 'Is she talking to me?' "What is it that I may have said'. I realize that while I have a strong desire to help the women/children in my community sometimes I do have this them Vs me attitude. Thank you for your posting, it's made me more conscious of my attitude.

mama's I can't say to much yet, but there is something in the workings for a food co-op in Bed-Stuy.

*ETA:* Check out this site. Volunteers are needed
http://www.eastnewyorkfarms.org/whoweare.html


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## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
...i truly appreciate all your comments! i thank you for hearing me cause *i really considered that it might be safer and more comfy not to share my feelings.* thanks for proving me wrong--i'm so glad we have this tribe!







.

Nnaemeka,

Thank you for the courage of your posts!
I have felt the same here at MDC many, many times, and when it gets to me, I tend to just withdraw from the conversation for a few weeks/months until I feel the need to re-connect with my sisterfriends here again(and for me, the pull of this tribe is strong!).
But because of your posts, the next time I read posts here that make me feel like retreating, I too will have the courage to speak my truth to them!
So thanks again for your powerfully inspiring posts.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
So: What can I say or do that would be "supportive" without coming off as condescending? Is it even possible, or am I once again relegated to the ranks of "outsider?" I do like point out the historical significance of it all, but for the most part I'm dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it. Any thoughts?

Hi Rynna,

If I were you, I would share my truth with a "sister" in the same way as I would share it with anyone. Because if someone is not open to hearing you because of skin color, age(this personally was my hardest hurdle)and/or some other difference, the thing that they might take away from meeting you is your clarity and honesty.
And your shared truth, even if seemingly unheard at the time, might plant a seed that is felt and acted upon much later. I know that it happen that way with me(both as the receiver and the giver of the wisdom).

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 

And I get that. I really do. I will be the first to tell you that being mixed isn't always the easiest thing in the world, but it's true that I don't share the same depth of experience as someone with darker skin, with thicker hair, etc. So: What can I say or do that would be "supportive" without coming off as condescending? Is it even possible, or am I once again relegated to the ranks of "outsider?" I do like point out the historical significance of it all, but for the most part I'm dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it. Any thoughts?

I've been trying to come up with something to say in regards to this. It kind of hits home since these very well could be the words of my own daughter when she's older. Maybe your experience isn't the same, but the journey you live being of a mix of races, definitely includes similar struggles. You do have to learn to accept the differences you have. Accept your hair type. Accept your not quite white skin, which isn't quite brown either.

My cousin had hair similar to a mixed person before she got a perm, and her beautiful hair never quite returned to what it was before.







Anyway, I think people will always consider that you ARE part of the AA community, even if you have a different struggle/journey.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
Anyway, I think people will always consider that you ARE part of the AA community, even if you have a different struggle/journey.

But that's just the trouble-- *white* people consider me part of the AA community on occasion. Black people rarely do so unless I'm pushing my way in and making a case for myself. Even then, I occasionally get the "Why would you want to be black when you could pass so easily?" sorts of comments.







: If I don't make a concerted effort to look mixed, most people assume that I'm white or Latina (there's a HUGE hispanic population in Lancaster).

I don't know. I get the feeling people think I'm being "greedy" by laying claim to many different heritages... but I *am* all of these things, and I don't think it's reasonable to deny any part of myself, or to say that I'm "more" of one thing than another simply because of the way that I look... especially when that look is decidedly mixed. I spent most of my life being confused by it all, but the decision to consciously, actively accept that I am *mixed*, that I am no more one race than another, was a huge, life-altering thing... in a good way. Getting other people to accept that, and the idea that I do have just as much right to claim "blackness" as anyone else is more difficult. Of course that's compounded by the fact that my experience as a light-skinned, fine-haired person of color is very different from that of a dark-skinned, coarse-haired person of color. I feel like I can claim blackness as my own, but I may not have the right to encourage black women to breastfeed their babies or wear their hair naturally because I might be overstepping my bounds in light of differring experience.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
frustrating? yes. crazy? strange? i think not. symptomatic of a larger painful history of oppression? yes.

i mean take a look a any TV show or music video or mainstream film and do you see any natural hair on Black women? those more recent icons w/ natural hair have cut it off! look back to 1920, find any yet? besides Mammy, is Lena Horne rocking it? Dorothy Dandrige? were we not told that our hair in its natural state is ugly and unkempt for centuries? thus, why would be strange that our Elders, and often our peers, in wanting what is best for us--expect and demand that our hair be tamed and made appropriate for the mainstream--so we can be seen as respectable and normative. this is to be expected. sad but true.

i've got to get this off my chest: sometimes i feel like some of the expressions on this thread hint at Black people-bashing or at least a kind of POC cluelessness. i know many of us are the unique and alternative living, ap parenting, bohemian-minded folks in our community and many of us were/are the odd-one-out- fly in da buttermilk--only black girl in AP class/ at the Red Hot Chili Peppers show, only one making the cloth diapers in tha hood, afro punk before there was afro punk, i get it, whatever. but alot of what is hip, organic and crunchy now was simply our way back in the day. so what happened?? well, the excellent film on black midwives---Bringin in Da Spirit--speaks to this.

despite the conditioning, racism and exploitation, we've rocked it and loved each other thru the fires. despite our triumphs, however, we have a lot of healing to do as a community, as a people. going natural can be a healing rite for us. when i was the first to dread in my family ten years ago, my Mama asked "who would marry me with hair like that?" hurtful, yes. was i po'd? yes. but i knew she was honestly afraid i would be rejected and unloved. i told her not to worry cause i'd marry a brother with dreads too. ten years later indeed i did. ten years later my sister, who used to perm my hair, is now a renowned loctician. and my mom wears an afro and wants my sister to start her some sister locs. my determination to go natural inspired the women in my family, slowly but surely.

so ollipop perhaps your family will be inspired by your healing journey. (and i'm NOT saying you shouldn't vent but being the renegade ain't easy).

nonetheless----if you've read this far---you all may be asking why the heck is this woman so riled up???

because i'm sooo sick of hearing on MDC and mothering mag how AA women don't breastfeed. and how the Black folks just don't get "attachment parenting." and how AA babies are simply due to their racial category at risk for SIDS. i want to call these discourses into question. if these stats are "true" we must demand WHY! ( i just finally subscribed to mothering today, the digital version and was all excited to read it and in the first couple of pages AA women are bashed as the quintessential anti-ap-ers. but no one is grappling with the big stinky "WHY?" as they might find they are complicit in constructing the reasons ---this is some typical white privilege bs.)

and because i come to this thread with the occasional hope of shielding myself from some of these assumptions but sometimes i feel like there is a consistent chorus of "aren't we soooo diff't from all those ignorant, spanking their kids, daycare lovin, junk food in the morning, vaccinating, passive public schooling, creamy crack addicted, color conscious, anti-breastfeeding black folks." (lol! i'm laughing at this list!) and yes i make some difft choices from those folks, but i'm clear--those folks are _*my folks*_. so i try view them and approach them with compassion and patience, *cause i know the systems they/we are up against.* it is those systems that have worked tirelessly to construct that ignorant self hating passive POC. those of us who manage to subvert that conditioning and get better info and make healthier choices should get off the high horses/the island of one-isms and get with some Harriet Tubman type of maneuvers and spread the love! (and i know some of you are IRL and virtually---i just feel maladjusted to the thread's politics or something or over MDC in general right now, sigh).

okay, i've got to stop







!!! before you







:!
p.s. ollipop you look absolutely gorgeous with the natural and JeDeeLAnae this is not directed at you specifically







.









Wonderful written post







However I cringed when I red what I bolded in red, because I often feel as if POC who don't make good decisions use that as an excuse as to why they can't or won't better themselves.

Maybe I am wrong, but I believe that they only system that we are up against is ourselves.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
But that's just the trouble-- *white* people consider me part of the AA community on occasion. Black people rarely do so unless I'm pushing my way in and making a case for myself. Even then, I occasionally get the "Why would you want to be black when you could pass so easily?" sorts of comments.







: If I don't make a concerted effort to look mixed, most people assume that I'm white or Latina (there's a HUGE hispanic population in Lancaster).

I don't know. I get the feeling people think I'm being "greedy" by laying claim to many different heritages... but I *am* all of these things, and I don't think it's reasonable to deny any part of myself, or to say that I'm "more" of one thing than another simply because of the way that I look... especially when that look is decidedly mixed. I spent most of my life being confused by it all, but the decision to consciously, actively accept that I am *mixed*, that I am no more one race than another, was a huge, life-altering thing... in a good way. Getting other people to accept that, and the idea that I do have just as much right to claim "blackness" as anyone else is more difficult. Of course that's compounded by the fact that my experience as a light-skinned, fine-haired person of color is very different from that of a dark-skinned, coarse-haired person of color. I feel like I can claim blackness as my own, but I may not have the right to encourage black women to breastfeed their babies or wear their hair naturally because I might be overstepping my bounds in light of differring experience.

Why do you care how black other people think that you are? Why do you have to let people know your race or attempt to look like something other than who you are? Why can't the experiences that you have as a women be your black experience? Perhaps your lack of a black experience has less to do with your skin and hair than your perception, choices and position in life. Some of the "realest", "blackest" women I know look/looked more caucasian than you, and one of them happens to be my grandmother. She spent her early life fighting civil injustice and encouraging other blacks to vote.

My closest friend in middle school has the crunchiest mother that one will ever met and she was crunchy before it was cool. She spent her lifeliving and working in an old historic black neighborhood. I don't rememeber anyone questioning her waist length straight hair or pale skin as lack of evidence to prove that she belonged in the "hood".

Being black is not a look or a hairstyle, but a way of life, and slang, rap, ebonics and coarse tresses have nothing to do with it.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Why do you care how black other people think that you are? Why do you have to let people know your race or attempt to look like something other than who you are? Why can't the experiences that you have as a women be your black experience? Perhaps your lack of a black experience has less to do with your skin and hair than your perception, choices and position in life.

Well, because I can understand how a black woman might not take me seriously as a black woman due ot my differing experience-- and make no mistake, my experience *is* different. My perception, choices, and position in life are really irrelevant to this aspect of how I'm perceived by others. It might feel, to them, like a man talking about how childbirth feels. How the hell could he know, and where does he get off telling me, when he's never had the necessary parts to experience it and couldn't possibly understand? It's not about looks or perception, it's about the reality that life experiences will necessarily vary-- in this case, yes, based on looks.

Quote:

Some of the "realest", "blackest" women I know look/looked more caucasian than you, and one of them happens to be my grandmother. She spent her early life fighting civil injustice and encouraging other blacks to vote. My closest friend in middle school has the crunchiest mother that one will ever met and she was crunchy before it was cool. She spent her lifeliving and working in an old historic black neighborhood. I don't rememeber anyone questioning her waist length straight hair or pale skin as lack of evidence to prove that she belonged in the "hood".
You don't, but she might. It's not even about belonging "in the hood," it's about maintaining a degree of authenticity based on shared experience. I *don't* share the full experience, and it would be disingenuous to imply that I do. How far do I have the right to assert that I understand, that I do share that experience, when I don't? Before you assume that this is one more experience having to do with my position in life and my choices, you should recall that my upbringing was far from "elite." Street cred I can manage, but not as a black woman.

For the record, I *don't* pretend to be anything other than I am. But again, it raises the question: Can I really say, "Black women do this, look at me, I do it" without getting rolled eyes? In my experience, the answer is no.







I can act, but I cannot assert anything based on shared experience, because I don't share the full experience and we all know that.

Quote:

Being black is not a look or a hairstyle, but a way of life, and slang, rap, ebonics and coarse tresses have nothing to do with it.
Again, I've never said anything about slang, rap, or ebonics. They'd be entirely irrelevent; For all you know, I listen to nothing BUT rap and the mess that pours out of my mouth when I speak is entirely incomprehensible to most native speakers of English most of the time. You've made a series of assumptions there that no doubt go further, and which I personally think you should evaluate for a host of reasons, but I'm going to leave it at that.

A black "way of life?" What is it, then? Can you quantify what blackness "is," and can you be so certain that I have it? I have to tell you that even if such a thing is possible, the fact of the matter is that we live in a world where people are seen as being different from one another based, exclusively, on things like skin color and hair texture. Those differences will be reflected in our differing experiences. Just like a man can't possibly understand what it feels like to give birth, and shouldn't begin to assert any kind of understanding because he's got some sense of "femininity," I don't think that white people have any right or reason to assert an understanding of the black experience. That said, I'm not white-- I'm somewhere in between. My experience differs from that of black women and it differs from that of white women as well.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Well, because I can understand how a black woman might not take me seriously as a black woman due ot my differing experience-- and make no mistake, my experience *is* different. My perception, choices, and position in life are really irrelevant to this aspect of how I'm perceived by others. It might feel, to them, like a man talking about how childbirth feels. How the hell could he know, and where does he get off telling me, when he's never had the necessary parts to experience it and couldn't possibly understand? It's not about looks or perception, it's about the reality that life experiences will necessarily vary-- in this case, yes, based on looks.

How you are perceived by others is part of the experience of being black. Your fair skin is no different than my never living or attending school with people who look lik me. I am accused daily of not having experienced a typical black childhood, but I don't care. There is not a typical black experience based on skin color, education, economic status, or class. I will never know what it is like to live as another black woman, but I can still offer insight into my life that others might might some similarity, but more often than not no common bond.

You don't, but she might. It's not even about belonging "in the hood," it's about maintaining a degree of authenticity based on shared experience. I *don't* share the full experience, and it would be disingenuous to imply that I do. How far do I have the right to assert that I understand, that I do share that experience, when I don't? Before you assume that this is one more experience having to do with my position in life and my choices, you should recall that my upbringing was far from "elite." Street cred I can manage, but not as a black woman.

For the record, I *don't* pretend to be anything other than I am. But again, it raises the question: Can I really say, "Black women do this, look at me, I do it" without getting rolled eyes? In my experience, the answer is no.







I can act, but I cannot assert anything based on shared experience, because I don't share the full experience and we all know that.

So are you implying that color is the only way to maintain a degree of authenticity. Once again I don't get it, and I am the darkest person in my family so I am baffled. Perhaps people are rolling their eyes at something other than your blackness, or perhaps you spend your time with the wrong women period. Regardless of race.

If you consider yourself of black origin then you have an experience to share. Why would you not? What does elite have to do with anything. One can be ELITE and BLACK, POOR and BLACK, EDUCATED and BLACK, UNEDUCATED and BLACK, or FAIR SKIN I LOOK WHITE and still be BLACK and have an opntion on their experience that is valid and of importance.

Again, I've never said anything about slang, rap, or ebonics. They'd be entirely irrelevent; For all you know, I listen to nothing BUT rap and the mess that pours out of my mouth when I speak is entirely incomprehensible to most native speakers of English most of the time. You've made a series of assumptions there that no doubt go further, and which I personally think you should evaluate for a host of reasons, but I'm going to leave it at that.

A black "way of life?" What is it, then? Can you quantify what blackness "is," and can you be so certain that I have it? I have to tell you that even if such a thing is possible, the fact of the matter is that we live in a world where people are seen as being different from one another based, exclusively, on things like skin color and hair texture. Those differences will be reflected in our differing experiences. Just like a man can't possibly understand what it feels like to give birth, and shouldn't begin to assert any kind of understanding because he's got some sense of "femininity," I don't think that white people have any right or reason to assert an understanding of the black experience. That said, I'm not white-- I'm somewhere in between. My experience differs from that of black women and it differs from that of white women as well.


I haven't made any assumptions. You have, as to the depth of experience that one could possibly only have as a person with skin of a darker shade.

I would think that it would be so much easier to just be me as a collective whole than worry about who thinks what about the parts that create me. In fact I can make that statement, because I am not 100% african american. But who is? I am me 100%.

Why can't a white person understand the black experience to some degree? I will never have a white experince but I am able to understand their culture and their lives from study, conversation and close friendships. I might not be white, but I can easily tell that even they don't just roll out of bed and land at the top of the ladder.

If skin and hair are the sole indicators I know quite a few white people with dark skin and tightly curled hair who are non black. Does that mean that they have had a "black experience" similar to my own?


----------



## shayinme

Rynna, you should check out a book called The Black Notebooks by Toi Derricote. Its her memoir of being a whte looking Black women, she does not attempt to pass though society tries to make her pass. However the book talks deeply about her struggles finding her place, if I recall she was married to a Black man. Its a good book, I read it years ago and I beleive she used to teach at the University of Pittsburgh. I am not sure if she is still there.

AndrewsMother, I will admit that sometimes we create barriers when there are none, yet 36 years of living and I beleive there are some real barriers. Those of us with a stromg support systen can and do rise against the barriers that society throws against us and let me say as the Mama of a young Black man, I feel like I am getting a special seat into how society tries to detour us.

This is a real example. My son is a HS junior, he is a B+ student, he didn't apply himself as strong as he could freshman yeat and it did pull his GPA down. That said a B+ average is nothing to sneeze at, he is super involved in theatre, already been approached by a state university for a drama scholarship. He is now running to be the senior class president in the fall, all around good kid and even if he were not my kid I would think he was cool.

Anyway he recently met with his guidance counselor, why did this man suggest that my son apply to trade school so he could become a mechanic?







:







: Um....there is nothing about my son that says trade school material...for goodness sake he is taking AP classes this year.

My point is that sort of stuff happens all the time to Black boys, its routine. It happened to my own brother in the 90's, he expressed an interest in being an architect and was told that was not realistic for him. My Dad went up to the school and reamed the counselors behind out. My brother is an apprentice architect and just got his Masters in December.

All this to say that for those with parents who are not involved or they have no support system, there are obstables. Thankfully my brother had my parents and my son has me, his dad and a family that supports him, so he got mad at the counselor but brushed it off. Some kids would not do that.

Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Rynna, you should check out a book called The Black Notebooks by Toi Derricote. Its her memoir of being a whte looking Black women, she does not attempt to pass though society tries to make her pass. However the book talks deeply about her struggles finding her place, if I recall she was married to a Black man. Its a good book, I read it years ago and I beleive she used to teach at the University of Pittsburgh. I am not sure if she is still there.

AndrewsMother, I will admit that sometimes we create barriers when there are none, yet 36 years of living and I beleive there are some real barriers. Those of us with a stromg support systen can and do rise against the barriers that society throws against us and let me say as the Mama of a young Black man, I feel like I am getting a special seat into how society tries to detour us.

This is a real example. My son is a HS junior, he is a B+ student, he didn't apply himself as strong as he could freshman yeat and it did pull his GPA down. That said a B+ average is nothing to sneeze at, he is super involved in theatre, already been approached by a state university for a drama scholarship. He is now running to be the senior class president in the fall, all around good kid and even if he were not my kid I would think he was cool.

Anyway he recently met with his guidance counselor, why did this man suggest that my son apply to trade school so he could become a mechanic?







:







: Um....there is nothing about my son that says trade school material...for goodness sake he is taking AP classes this year.

My point is that sort of stuff happens all the time to Black boys, its routine. It happened to my own brother in the 90's, he expressed an interest in being an architect and was told that was not realistic for him. My Dad went up to the school and reamed the counselors behind out. My brother is an apprentice architect and just got his Masters in December.

All this to say that for those with parents who are not involved or they have no support system, there are obstables. Thankfully my brother had my parents and my son has me, his dad and a family that supports him, so he got mad at the counselor but brushed it off. Some kids would not do that.

Shay

Shay, I understand that things such as what happened to your brother and son happen all the time. What I don't understand is how anyone can accept the menial lives that others might try to place upon us because we are black. What is so hard about saying, that is not acceptable, my child will not fit into your preconceived mold?

Where is the fight and the determination to be more than what others create for you. I know how society works, what I don't understand and refuse to accept is that someone else other than God has a hand in my destiny.

I have a problem with people accepting whatever. The same tactics were used when my parents were in school, so why are we as black people still accpeting the lower role in scoiety. Have we not learned from the past. Who is the high school counselor that she can tell a child with a B average that he should attend a trade school, and who are the parents that don't realize the lack of depth in the suggestion.

That makes me LIVID, not that the counselor suggets it, but that POC accept it.


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Why do you care how black other people think that you are? Why do you have to let people know your race or attempt to look like something other than who you are? Why can't the experiences that you have as a women be your black experience? Perhaps your lack of a black experience has less to do with your skin and hair than your perception, choices and position in life. Some of the "realest", "blackest" women I know look/looked more caucasian than you, and one of them happens to be my grandmother. She spent her early life fighting civil injustice and encouraging other blacks to vote.

My closest friend in middle school has the crunchiest mother that one will ever met and she was crunchy before it was cool. She spent her lifeliving and working in an old historic black neighborhood. I don't rememeber anyone questioning her waist length straight hair or pale skin as lack of evidence to prove that she belonged in the "hood".

Being black is not a look or a hairstyle, but a way of life, and slang, rap, ebonics and coarse tresses have nothing to do with it.

While I agree with you, in general, I know there's a difference between the Black Experience now and the Black Experience back in the day. I have loads of older "mixed" family members (they consider themselves black, of course) and the social parameters of blackness back in the day were much more inclusive and "us vs. them". Even today, some are appalled that we, of the younger generations, would EVER date/marry someone non-black. And, some of these older ppl could have passed if they'd wanted to. There was a different level of inclusion back then, I think, b/c they were united against an oppressor.

Nowadays, everyone wants to claim mixed and stuff (I mean, I'm technically mixed, but for me, race is about politics, so I will always claim black), which dilutes the sense of unity, I think.

Race is a social construct. It's not real, so when I talk about race, I'm talking politics. And, politically, I'm black all the way. And, I actively encourage everyone else (whites, included) to claim black as their race. I think that until all people are willing to take on the plight of the oppressed, oppression will continue to go unchecked for the most part.

Okay...I was on the phone while typing this, so I hope I was more coherent than I feel I was.


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## Jannah6

I shall return to discuss, off to the library.

Now here is a person who could really have "passed"

http://aalbc.com/authors/toi.htm


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Shay, I understand that things such as what happened to your brother and son happen all the time. What I don't understand is how anyone can accept the menial lives that others might try to place upon us because we are black. What is so hard about saying, that is not acceptable, my child will not fit into your preconceived mold?

Where is the fight and the determination to be more than what others create for you. I know how society works, what I don't understand and refuse to accept is that someone else other than God has a hand in my destiny.

I have a problem with people accepting whatever. The same tactics were used when my parents were in school, so why are we as black people still accpeting the lower role in scoiety. Have we not learned from the past. Who is the high school counselor that she can tell a child with a B average that he should attend a trade school, and who are the parents that don't realize the lack of depth in the suggestion.

That makes me LIVID, not that the counselor suggets it, but that POC accept it.

If you have no one to tell you, you don't know that you don't have to accept it..how do you know better? Again, in my family there was never an abundance of money but support and dreams were always in abundance. I think that has made the difference between me and peers who have stumbled along the way.

I won't lie at times I have just wanted to give up but between my internal drive and support system, it didn't happen.

I have worked with the poor and undeserved for years, most of that time in Chicago (large Black population) and there are lots of folks who for whatever reasons (Mama gotta work 2-3 jobs just to keep food on the table) don't get the support they need.

In a larger context the greater Black community that existed in the 50's, 60's and part of the 70's does not exist. It used to be if your parents weren't on the job, we lived in communities where we looked out for each other. I know that was the case in my Granny's old hood. I gotta run, but these are just some of the things that IMO cam be barriers.

Shay


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## futurmama8

Wow, interesting discussions. This thread moves very fast.

I felt just like Jannah.. Is it something I have said? I probably did. I sometimes get caught up in thinking that the way I live is so much better and everyone should live this way. OTOH I feel very very protective when someone may say negative things about the black community that may not be true. This causes me to reflect on myself and realize I need to accept everyone for who they are and realize people are doing the best they can. I have noticed that something within the black community are AP without a label and we were doing this before this stuff was it. My question is, how did we get away from being this way??? What happened between the older generations who did AP or NFL to now???

AndrewsMother you wrote,

Quote:

Being black is not a look or a hairstyle, but a way of life, and slang, rap, ebonics and coarse tresses have nothing to do with it.
Don't you think that there is a black culture?? I think rap, ebonics, different and varying hairstyles is apart of the black culture. BUT doing these things are not a guage for being black and I is what I got from your post. There are things that are black people do BUT not all black people do these things. I think to some people that being apart of the things you mentioned above is a way for them to be black and take part in that culture.

Does that mean if a white person listened to rap, spoke slang, had different hairstyles is black?? No I don't think so, I just think that they are attracted to black culture. I think all over the world now, the race construct is prevalent so people have to be put in categories whether a person likes it or not. Race is very real, differences are very real and I think we should just accept them and move on.

Eilonwy as a person who is considered "high yellow" and "red bone"







by friends and family, I am confident to know some of my experiences are the same as someone who is very dark skinned. I can not share the same experience as a dark skinned person who is made fun of as ugly or "too dark" because I am not dark.. BUT I can be empathetic and show them that I think that they are beautiful and some people are stupid. I just think that if you can show that you understand their experience and support whatever it is that they do then it should be ok. I have found that people won't take getting told they should be natural very well and some may use your color or hair as a deflection from themselves. Some people are still colorstruck also, and all the light is better and "good hair" stuff is still alive and well. I think all people who realize that they could have done the better thing (breastfeeding for example if they didn't have any medical or psychological issues) but didn't may feel bad and instead they attack you for not understanding. I would be empathetic and tell them you will be there to support them and leave it alone.


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## wiksty

It's a girl!!!!

Our homebirth was successful









8lbs 2ounces (and we've yet to measure her, lol).

Born at 12:52pm on March 30th 2009

Two pushes, no tear...I will post my birth story soon!!!

~B


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## futurmama8

Terra Elizabeth








:







:







:







: Congrats wilksty!! Enjoy your baby girl!!


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## AndrewsMother

Congratulations and welcome Terra Elizabeth!


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## bajamergrrl

Congratulations! I look forward to reading your birth story.


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## Arike

Congratulations on the new baby wiksty! And congrats on a wonderful homebirth!


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## shayinme

:







: Congratulations Wiksty!


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## eilonwy

Welcome, Terra!







: (Beautiful name!)


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
It's a girl!!!!

Our homebirth was successful









8lbs 2ounces (and we've yet to measure her, lol).

Born at 12:52pm on March 30th 2009

Two pushes, no tear...I will post my birth story soon!!!

~B

SWEET SWEET SWEET. LOVE THE NAME


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## JeDeeLenae

congrats wiksty!!!


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## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
It's a girl!!!!

Our homebirth was successful









8lbs 2ounces (and we've yet to measure her, lol).

Born at 12:52pm on March 30th 2009

Two pushes, no tear...I will post my birth story soon!!!

~B









:







:







:








:







:

that's awesome! congratulations and welcome to your little one!


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## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wiksty* 
It's a girl!!!!

Our homebirth was successful









8lbs 2ounces (and we've yet to measure her, lol).

Born at 12:52pm on March 30th 2009

Two pushes, no tear...I will post my birth story soon!!!

~B

Congratulations!

Welcome Earth-side, little Terra!


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## Brown Lioness

Awww, Congrats wiksty!!!!







:


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## olliepop

Quote:

so ollipop perhaps your family will be inspired by your healing journey. (and i'm NOT saying you shouldn't vent but being the renegade ain't easy).

It is tough to have views that differ from your family's view. I'm sure that my mother is taking my choice to wear my hair in its natural state as a slap in the face and somehow saying that her choices are wrong.

Quote:

we never know the seeds we are planting with family and friends, that sista I spoke of maybe thought I was the fool for looking at her in judgement but she planted a deep seed that carried over a decade later.
This is so true. When my dd was 7 months old and nursing, some family members were up in arms saying that she was too old to "still be doing that." I went on to nurse her until she was 18 months despite the very loud, very strong opinions from the peanut gallery.

Flash forward to this past Christmas when my younger cousin was nursing her ten month old. Everyone jumped on her about it and when I came to her defense, and shared that I was "still" nursing my 23 month old, we were both dismissed for having "newfangled ideas."

The only one who was open to what we were saying was our even younger cousin, only 9. I hope what we said would stick with her and later down the line, MUCH LATER, she'll remember what we said about nursing and extended nursing.

Quote:

p.s. ollipop you look absolutely gorgeous with the natural
And thank you!


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## Jannah6

Congratulaions *Wiksty*







:


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## Jannah6

It was nice meetig you yesterday *Bloomingstar* . Sorry for talking your ear off and making you walk slow









Olliepop, that's great that your 9 yr old cousin is thinking this way







. Maybe the younger generation will follow suit.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
It is tough to have views that differ from your family's view. I'm sure that my mother is taking my choice to wear my hair in its natural state as a slap in the face and somehow saying that her choices are wrong.


I know its hard (((hug))). I was so hurt when my dad actually stopped talking to me because I went natural. I did do it in a rather dramatic fashion but he was acting like I had killed someone. Its been almost 10 years now and even though I doubt he approves of my locks (







still grumbles about my pretty hair) at least he is mostly over it.

For me going natural was the beginning of an amazing and transformative experience that went far beyond just my hair. Just hold your head high, by the way I peeped your photo in your sig and you are gorgerous. You remind me of a old friend from HS who was a model and dancer.

Shay


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## JustKiya

Congrats Wiksty!!! Welcome Earthside, Terra!!!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
It is tough to have views that differ from your family's view. I'm sure that my mother is taking my choice to wear my hair in its natural state as a slap in the face and somehow saying that her choices are wrong.

My mom told me that I looked like a lesbian. Can you tell that she was not thrilled?


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## Draupadi

Congratulations Mama!
Good work!


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## futurmama8

It's my birthday Ya'll!!!







:







:

I am finally 21























this weekend my mom is throwing me a fun party + a nice stripper with all my friends and family +







=














:






























If you guys can come down to the nati, you're invited


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## nnaemeka

welcome Terra Elizabeth!!!







: Wiksty enjoy your babymoon.

happy b-day Futurmama8!!! have a blast!







.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
It's my birthday Ya'll!!!







:







:

I am finally 21























this weekend my mom is throwing me a fun party + a nice stripper with all my friends and family +







=














:






























If you guys can come down to the nati, you're invited









Happy Birthday!
Have a wonderful birthday!
Wow. 21?
I can't even remember being 21!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
It's my birthday Ya'll!!!







:







:

I am finally 21























this weekend my mom is throwing me a fun party + a nice stripper with all my friends and family +







=














:






























If you guys can come down to the nati, you're invited









Happy Birthday to you!







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
It's my birthday Ya'll!!!







:







:

I am finally 21























this weekend my mom is throwing me a fun party + a nice stripper with all my friends and family +







=














:






























If you guys can come down to the nati, you're invited









Happy Birthday. I was like you, a Mama before I turned 21 and it so strange when I turned 21. It was like look, I have been an adult now for a while.

Anyway have an amazing day!

Shay


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## eilonwy

Oddly, I feel as though I was 21 just last week. It takes my breath away to realize that it's been ten years...


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
It was nice meetig you yesterday *Bloomingstar* . Sorry for talking your ear off and making you walk slow









Olliepop, that's great that your 9 yr old cousin is thinking this way







. Maybe the younger generation will follow suit.

It was great meeting you too! And I should slow down. I developed that habit in high school and then again when I moved to Brooklyn to get past and away from men on the street talking to me. I generally get past so quickly it doesn't matter wat they're saying. The flip side is that I sometimes end up ignoring or rushing ast people I actually know or would want to speak to haha. It was a big adjustment to walk slower when I was pregnant, though I was still sometimes pretty swift. And now no one is really saying anything--the baby is some kind of man repellent







: except for the ones that yell "god bless you and the baby" (is that just a NY thing? men "blessing" ou on the street? heh).

HAPPY BIRTHDAY futuremama8














:







:


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## futurmama8

Thanks everyone!! You all are so sweet









I had a question, are there any MOC on MDC? I haven't been hear that long so just wanted to know


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## princesstutu

Happy B-day, futuremama! (What's a MOC? Man of color? If so, not that I'm aware of.)


----------



## futurmama8

Yes Man of Color, sorry I wasn't clear enough.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Yes Man of Color, sorry I wasn't clear enough.


I've encountered one MOC a few years ago. If there are others, they haven't identified as being such.


----------



## futurmama8

Hmmm that is very interesting. I bring this up because my boyfriend was joking about joining because I am always on here







: and that it must be something good going on. I told him he should since there many black men on here if any. So it got me thinking so I thought I should ask


----------



## eilonwy

Rianne, you should absolutely encourage him to join. I'd love to see more men of color posting in the Dads forum in particular.







For the record, "MOC" usually stands for "moms of color" around here.







That's why I was confused... my thought was, "Um, this entire thread?"


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
For the record, "MOC" usually stands for "moms of color" around here.







That's why I was confused... my thought was, "Um, this entire thread?"









Took me a minute for the same reason.









Guess I'll re-intro myself here, now, since it seems I'm back on MDC.

I'm a single (maybe that'll change soon) mother to four of the greatest kids I know. Last kid by UP/UC almost 5 years ago (gasp! where does the time go?). Looking forward to the next (and probably last) one.







Still a huge proponent of co-sleeping, extended nursing, babywearing and all that jazz. Ethnic background: Native (Cherokee and Comanche), African, German. Politically ID as black, but am prone to checking the "other" box.

I've had a bit of a time transitioning into post-baby phase. It's almost like I don't know what to do with myself now that I can do _anything_ with my time. Life sometimes feels overwhelming in the face of so many options. Esp. since I really like simply having babies and stuff.

I went back to school after my divorce, but it's not satisfying me, so I'm job-hunting. Writing resumes is for the birds. I'm trying to finally get paid to write...also for the birds.







I really am enjoying the newfound freedom, tho.

I have sensory issues and kids with sensory issues. We've dealt with food allergies and at least two of my kids are Aspies. (I probably am, too.) I try to offer support where I can and I'm still learning, of course. Motherhood is a lifelong institution of higher learning and I'm so grateful for it.

paz


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
Rianne, you should absolutely encourage him to join. I'd love to see more men of color posting in the Dads forum in particular.







For the record, "MOC" usually stands for "moms of color" around here.







That's why I was confused... my thought was, "Um, this entire thread?"
























Girl I am still a little wet behind the ears when it comes to MDC









Maybe I should have said DOC (dudes of color







)

We don't have babies yet so I don't know if he really join yet. Maybe I will incourage him to lurk for a while like I did.


----------



## JeDeeLenae

I could really use some advice.

Last year, I started hanging out with a mom that I met from diaperswappers. She was on bedrest and I started going to her house almost daily for a few weeks. I helped her out, her daughter, etc. Her daughter stayed at my house for a bit when she was in the hospital. We continued to hang out (I was still pregnant at this time) for a while. So, then I had my baby. She had mentioned wanting to come to the birth, but I wasn't so sure. She had made comments before that didn't seem to compatible with birth support at a homebirth, and she had a 4 mo old baby. I just didn't want to have to worry about anyone other than myself and my baby while in labor.

Anyway, the day I went into labor, it started pretty quick. I started noticing the uncontrollable contractions about 1pm and she was born at 5pm. I didn't call her to the birth. I was on IM with her when I couldn't type anymore, though. Anyway, she came over after the baby was born. Loaned me some money to get stitches that next day (we were flat broke until payday) and all was good. A couple days later, she asked for the money, which was fine. I went over there with the boys and the baby. We talked, etc. and all was good.

Then, we stopped talking. I chalked it up to hectic holiday time and just being busy, and her grandma was sick. So, we just didn't talk much at all, occasionally there would be an IM, but that was it. Fast forward to Feb and she makes a comment on the local mom's board that I never call or get on yahoo anymore. I log on and we start to talk. She then says she pulled away because she was mad at me for not calling her so she could be at the birth. That this was possibly her only chance to be at a homebirth. So, she was hurt. I acknowledged her feelings, talked a bit more, and not since then.

I was a little upset that she pretty much stopped talking to me for 3 months, when I needed support the most, because I didn't call her when I was in labor. The same person who I hung out with more than anyone, and even considered to be one of my best friends, just kinda dumped me.. over that. And never said anything until 3 months later.

Well, now she's emailed me again saying she wants to talk and chat again. That she's going through a lot and could really use a friend. Part of me says, just ignore it. But another part of me kinda misses having a friend so close. But, I don't think the relationship would be the same. I still harbor resentment for when she flat out said my boys weren't cute, how she negatively commented on Kellianne's name, even after we were sure that was her name. I just don't know if I should respond to her... or how to respond. Other than having mixed race children, breastfeeding and cding, we don't really have many similar interests... I don't think.

Thanks for reading my long drawn out story.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JeDeeLenae* 
I could really use some advice.

Last year, I started hanging out with a mom that I met from diaperswappers. She was on bedrest and I started going to her house almost daily for a few weeks. I helped her out, her daughter, etc. Her daughter stayed at my house for a bit when she was in the hospital. We continued to hang out (I was still pregnant at this time) for a while. So, then I had my baby. She had mentioned wanting to come to the birth, but I wasn't so sure. She had made comments before that didn't seem to compatible with birth support at a homebirth, and she had a 4 mo old baby. I just didn't want to have to worry about anyone other than myself and my baby while in labor.

Anyway, the day I went into labor, it started pretty quick. I started noticing the uncontrollable contractions about 1pm and she was born at 5pm. I didn't call her to the birth. I was on IM with her when I couldn't type anymore, though. Anyway, she came over after the baby was born. Loaned me some money to get stitches that next day (we were flat broke until payday) and all was good. A couple days later, she asked for the money, which was fine. I went over there with the boys and the baby. We talked, etc. and all was good.

Then, we stopped talking. I chalked it up to hectic holiday time and just being busy, and her grandma was sick. So, we just didn't talk much at all, occasionally there would be an IM, but that was it. Fast forward to Feb and she makes a comment on the local mom's board that I never call or get on yahoo anymore. I log on and we start to talk. She then says she pulled away because she was mad at me for not calling her so she could be at the birth. That this was possibly her only chance to be at a homebirth. So, she was hurt. I acknowledged her feelings, talked a bit more, and not since then.

I was a little upset that she pretty much stopped talking to me for 3 months, when I needed support the most, because I didn't call her when I was in labor. The same person who I hung out with more than anyone, and even considered to be one of my best friends, just kinda dumped me.. over that. And never said anything until 3 months later.

Well, now she's emailed me again saying she wants to talk and chat again. That she's going through a lot and could really use a friend. Part of me says, just ignore it. But another part of me kinda misses having a friend so close. But, I don't think the relationship would be the same. I still harbor resentment for when she flat out said my boys weren't cute, how she negatively commented on Kellianne's name, even after we were sure that was her name. I just don't know if I should respond to her... or how to respond. Other than having mixed race children, breastfeeding and cding, we don't really have many similar interests... I don't think.

Thanks for reading my long drawn out story.

Hard to answer, at first I was going to say just leave her alone. However one of my dearest sista-friends here in Maine is someone who initially I didn't quite click with. For the first 3 years we knew each other, it was more like we were just associates but now we are tight despite our differences.

That said, we never had a situation like you have, I'm sorry but talking greasy in anyway about my kids is call to not speak again. Plus and I am sorry but unless you told her she could definitely come to the birth it was rather presumptious for her to assume that would happen. Considering she was a new friend, that is a rather bold expectation.

I know what its like to not have many like minded folks near you (I am a Black woman in Maine...beleive me I know) but why welcome drama in your life? This woman sounds like drama, so I would probably just keep some distance for a while.

Shay


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## bajamergrrl

*JeDeeLenae*, I agree with Shay that you should probably keep some distance from this person. from what you've said it sounds to me like she's more concerned with her feelings than yours. She wanted to be at _your_ birth to meet _her_ needs. She wants to get back into contact with you in order to meet _her_ needs. Maybe stay civil and friendly if you're comfortable, but don't get pulled into her drama. Unfortunately friendships have a lifespan and this one might have reached its end.


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## princesstutu

I agree. She sounds too selfish and inconsiderate for me to continue to deal with. However, I understand feeling like you've lost a friend.

I think, if you still harbor anger from when she insulted your kids, you might not want to deal with her, anymore. Sometimes, we tolerate things we wouldn't normally b/c we're lonely or want to give something new a chance.

Basically, this is about you. Maybe sit quietly with yourself and ask yourself, "Do I really want to continue a friendship with this woman?" See what answer comes.

Good luck!


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bajamergrrl* 
*JeDeeLenae*, I agree with Shay that you should probably keep some distance from this person. from what you've said it sounds to me like she's more concerned with her feelings than yours. She wanted to be at _your_ birth to meet _her_ needs. She wants to get back into contact with you in order to meet _her_ needs. Maybe stay civil and friendly if you're comfortable, but don't get pulled into her drama. Unfortunately friendships have a lifespan and this one might have reached its end.










Yeah that to all of that!


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## Jannah6

s *JeDeeLenae*, I agree with the advice the other mamas have given you. It seems like she's not worth the drama, especially when it comes to talking about your DC.
Perhaps you can establish a relationship with another mama in your area.


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## JeDeeLenae

Thanks for the advice. You guys have pretty much echoed my thoughts on it, I just needed outside perspective. I do think it had a lot to do with being lonely and desperately wanting a friend. Thanks again ladies. I'm going to think on it a bit more, but I think I'm going to just leave it alone.


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## Bloomingstar

quick question--have any of you ladies had either or both? I think I am in early stages of mastitis--have what I think is a duct that's BEEN plugged, feeling a bit weak/tired, got chills, haven't eaten the best the past couple days, probably not getting enough fluids..anyway, all the stuff I see talks about there being redness. Whenever I see this redness business I get aggravated because not everyone will be able to see redness through or on their skin. Sometimes can, sometimes I can't, depends on where on my body it is. So I guess I want to know how else it may have shown up for you. thanks!


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## princesstutu

The one time I got mastitis, I had what looked like a raised vein going across my boob. Of course, it was a swollen milk duct. In my case, it was obviously red. If you're feeling weak and getting chills, along with breast tenderness in a certain area and plugged ducts, then I'd bet you've got mastitis.

I'm trying to remember what I did to get rid of it. I think I just stayed in bed with the baby, nursing incessantly. I'm not big on medicine.

Hope it clears up soon!


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## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
quick question--have any of you ladies had either or both? I think I am in early stages of mastitis--have what I think is a duct that's BEEN plugged, feeling a bit weak/tired, got chills, haven't eaten the best the past couple days, probably not getting enough fluids..anyway, all the stuff I see talks about there being redness. Whenever I see this redness business I get aggravated because not everyone will be able to see redness through or on their skin. Sometimes can, sometimes I can't, depends on where on my body it is. So I guess I want to know how else it may have shown up for you. thanks!

I've never had either. I hope it clears up for you.


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## Jannah6

s *Bloomingstar* . I've never had mastitis, but my SIL did. My advise to you is to find out ASAP before it gets worse. I hope you get well soon.

Safi and I are dealing with thrush and my nipples are torn. Oh the pain and agony that I'm going through


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
quick question--have any of you ladies had either or both? I think I am in early stages of mastitis--have what I think is a duct that's BEEN plugged, feeling a bit weak/tired, got chills, haven't eaten the best the past couple days, probably not getting enough fluids..anyway, all the stuff I see talks about there being redness. Whenever I see this redness business I get aggravated because not everyone will be able to see redness through or on their skin. Sometimes can, sometimes I can't, depends on where on my body it is. So I guess I want to know how else it may have shown up for you. thanks!


How are you doing?


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
quick question--have any of you ladies had either or both? I think I am in early stages of mastitis--have what I think is a duct that's BEEN plugged, feeling a bit weak/tired, got chills, haven't eaten the best the past couple days, probably not getting enough fluids..anyway, all the stuff I see talks about there being redness. Whenever I see this redness business I get aggravated because not everyone will be able to see redness through or on their skin. Sometimes can, sometimes I can't, depends on where on my body it is. So I guess I want to know how else it may have shown up for you. thanks!


I had masitits when I first tried weaning my girl last fall, I went about 20 hours without nursing. Next thing I know my breasts were hot to touch, red and it was painful, I felt like crap. I called my HCP and when I told her I was weaning she immediately prescribed a antibiotic since she couldn't see me for a few days. After a couple days on the abx I felt normal so while she did not see me, I am pretty certain it was mastitis.

What bugged me though was that any online searches don't give visible examples that are good for WOC of mastitis or plugged ducts that are applicable to WOC...if ya know what I mean.









Shay


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
quick question--have any of you ladies had either or both? I think I am in early stages of mastitis--have what I think is a duct that's BEEN plugged, feeling a bit weak/tired, got chills, haven't eaten the best the past couple days, probably not getting enough fluids..anyway, all the stuff I see talks about there being redness. Whenever I see this redness business I get aggravated because not everyone will be able to see redness through or on their skin. Sometimes can, sometimes I can't, depends on where on my body it is. So I guess I want to know how else it may have shown up for you. thanks!

I did notice redness, but it wasn't until the mastitis had gotten pretty severe. I had also developed a *rash at the location of the lump* so that really was a big clue. I would go ahead and go to the doctor...they probably will be pretty reluctant to diagnose as mastitis because they won't notice the redness (when I went to the ER the NP who saw me was hesitant to diagnose it as such because she didn't notice the redness). But I was adamant about getting antibiotics because I was in so much pain.

I hope you feel better!! It's not fun.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Next thing I know my breasts were *hot to touch*, red and it was painful, I felt like crap. Shay

Me too!


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## Bloomingstar

thanks ya'll! I am feeling better--mostly. The aches, chills, weakness and utter exhaustion are gone. I could barely pick up the baby Saturday, I felt so wretched. Now I am just trying (still!) to unplug this duct. grrrrr. My midwife told me some things to do and take so I'm doing that. And if all else fails, I have an appointment next week to get a small lump under my arm checked out--I'm not worried, I don't think it's cancer, there's no history in my family, it's not growing or changing but it should be looked at just the same--and maybe they'll be able to help somehow.


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## Jannah6

*Bloomingstar*, I'm hoping for continued recovery and that everything turns out alright for you.


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## Anne512

I have a quick question and figure you guys would be the best ones to answer it. I'm 10 weeks pregnant and my midwife wants me to test for sickle cell. It's my 4th pregnancy and I told her that if I didn't have it for past pregnancies, why would I have it now? But she insisted that since I'm Black, I might have be a carrier. It shouldn't be a big deal, but it bugs me. Did anyone here get tested for sickle cell?


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## Jannah6

*Anne512* , I was never tested for it in my previous pregnancies, but when I tried out a new practice for a couple of months they did offer genetic testing on me. I did accept, all testing came back negative.

*BTW*, love your 6 yr old DD name









Some of my FB mama friends noticed my status, thanks for the well wishes. I'm so angry at my husband right now. He bought a motorcycle







. I don't understand how he could make such a decision when he has small children at home. I am so angry right now, I can't even speak to him. I sent him a text message telling him how I felt, but he hasn't responded yet, which is surprising because he usually does.


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## bajamergrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Anne512* 
I have a quick question and figure you guys would be the best ones to answer it. I'm 10 weeks pregnant and my midwife wants me to test for sickle cell. It's my 4th pregnancy and I told her that if I didn't have it for past pregnancies, why would I have it now? But she insisted that since I'm Black, I might have be a carrier. It shouldn't be a big deal, but it bugs me. Did anyone here get tested for sickle cell?

This is my first pregnancy and I was tested for it - I'm negative. It is possible for a mother and father to both carry genes for sickle cell anemia but not pass them on to their offspring. This means that even though your previous pregnancies did not result in children with sickle cell anemia it doesn't mean that a future pregnancy won't if both you and and the father carry sickle cell genes. Weigh the risks and benefits to you and your family. For me, I didn't think there was a big risk in my child having sickle cell since there isn't a history of it in my family nor my DH's family. However, if I tested positive for the trait, I would see about getting my DH tested as well. If he was positive too then I would at least know to prepare for the possibility of my child having the disease. On the other hand, I can see how that news can cause anxiety during the pregnancy especially if there isn't much that can be done about it until after the baby is born.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Anne512* ,

Some of my FB mama friends noticed my status, thanks for the well wishes. I'm so angry at my husband right now. He bought a motorcysle







. I don't understand how he could make such a decision when he has small children at home. I am so angry right now, I can't even speak to him. I sent him a text message telling him how I felt, but he hasn't responded yet, which is surprising because he usually does.

My DH also has a motorcycle, but he's owned one since before we met so I'm used to it. However, I would be upset if he went and bought one for the first time at this stage in our life together. If your DH ends up keeping the motorcycle, please insist that he take a motorcycle safety course and wear appropriate safety gear. Also he should ride with experienced but safe riders.


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## Jannah6

Thanks for the advice *bajamergrrl* . I am so angry I wrote motorcysle


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Anne512* 
I have a quick question and figure you guys would be the best ones to answer it. I'm 10 weeks pregnant and my midwife wants me to test for sickle cell. It's my 4th pregnancy and I told her that if I didn't have it for past pregnancies, why would I have it now? But she insisted that since I'm Black, I might have be a carrier. It shouldn't be a big deal, but it bugs me. Did anyone here get tested for sickle cell?

I was actually tested for the sickle cell trait as a very small child; In the late '70's, there was a huge push to test EVERYONE who might remotely be black. I'm not a carrier. Some have raised ethical concerns regarding the testing (i.e. can people be denied insurance coverage for a "preexisting condition" if they carry the sickle cell trait?); I'm not sure whether or not those concerns have been addressed (legally).

Here's the thing. You know that you don't have sickle cell anemia, because you'd have endured crises long since-- you'd be well aware of it. Your midwife is talking about testing for sickle cell *trait*, which many AA carry, because you can pass it along to your children. If you AND your husband are BOTH carriers of sickle cell trait, you have a one in four chance of giving birth to a child with sickle cell anemia. As I'm sure you know, that's a scary deal and it is something you might want to be prepared for before birth.

Circumstances under which you should ABSOLUTELY be tested for sickle cell trait:
1. You have a first- or second-degree relative with sickle cell anemia (i.e. a sibling, parent, first cousin, aunt/uncle). In any of those cases, your chance of being a carrier is significantly higher than that of the general AA population.

2. Your partner is a known carrier of sickle cell trait or has sickle cell anemia himself. In the event that he is a carrier, he has a 50% chance of transmitting that gene to his children. In the event that he has sickle cell anemia, he has a 100% chance of transmitting that gene to his children. Thus, if you are a carrier and your husband is a carrier, you have a 25% chance of having a child with sickle cell anemia. If you are a carrier and your husband is symptomatic, you have a 50% chance of having a child with sickle cell anemia.

It's good to know, in my opinion, but it's not strictly necessary except in the above two cases.

Jannah, sorry to hear about the motorcycle. Some men never grow up...


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## princesstutu

*Anne*, it sounds to me like your midwife just wants to test you b/c you're black. I'd get a new midwife if I were you. She sounds ignorant.

Then, again, I'm highly intolerant of things like that and a UCer.









I love motorcycles. My dad had one when I was young and I loved riding on it with him.


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Anne512* 
I have a quick question and figure you guys would be the best ones to answer it. I'm 10 weeks pregnant and my midwife wants me to test for sickle cell. It's my 4th pregnancy and I told her that if I didn't have it for past pregnancies, why would I have it now? But she insisted that since I'm Black, I might have be a carrier. It shouldn't be a big deal, but it bugs me. Did anyone here get tested for sickle cell?

I'm Nigerian and many Nigerians (Africans in general) carry the trait. I've known that I have the trait for as long as I can remember. My mom used to warn me about marrying someone who also had the trait. She didn't have to do much warning, though, as I saw many examples of relatives and friends who had sickle cell anemia (my best friend included who was frequently in the hospital and frequently getting blood transfusions). So awful and terrifying. Anyway, I think my midwives would have tested if I didn't already know. It's not something that develops though . . . you either have it or you don't. And if you had sickle cell anemia, you would absolutely know. Having the trait doesn't affect you in any way. The chances of having a child with sickle cell anemia if both parents carry the trait is one in four. My uncle and his wife both had the trait, had four children, and no sicklers. So no harm in knowing.


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## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
*Anne*, it sounds to me like your midwife just wants to test you b/c you're black. I'd get a new midwife if I were you. She sounds ignorant.

Then, again, I'm highly intolerant of things like that and a UCer.









I love motorcycles. My dad had one when I was young and I loved riding on it with him.

How did your mom feel about that? My husband better not dare try putting any of my DC on that bike. It's not only the motorcycle,I don't trust that he'll be very careful.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
*Anne*, it sounds to me like your midwife just wants to test you b/c you're black. I'd get a new midwife if I were you. She sounds ignorant.









:

Neither the OB I had with the first pregnancy, nor the MW I have with this pregnancy has asked me about the sickle cell testing specifically. They gave me literature on all the testing, asked me what I wanted to do and then let it go.

Ooops...then again, maybe it's because my DH is white so it wouldn't make a difference







Sorry. Maybe I'm not the best person to offer advice lol.

But seriously though, I always question those who want to force any kind of medicine or testing on their patient. I think it's insensitive.


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## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
How did your mom feel about that? My husband better not dare try putting any of my DC on that bike. It's not only the motorcycle,I don't trust that he'll be very careful.

She was fine with it. She liked riding on it, too. She had her own helmet. I remember my baby brother would go on rides, too.

I was really sad when he sold the bike. I plan on buying one for myself one day. I think the experience is one kids should have, if they can. We always wore helmets, altho I understand why ppl who don't wear them don't wear them. I wouldn't mind feeling that wind all around me, but I think safety is more important in that situation.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Anne512* , I was never tested for it in my previous pregnancies, but when I tried out a new practice for a couple of months they did offer genetic testing on me. I did accept, all testing came back negative.

*BTW*, love your 6 yr old DD name









Some of my FB mama friends noticed my status, thanks for the well wishes. I'm so angry at my husband right now. He bought a motorcycle







. I don't understand how he could make such a decision when he has small children at home. I am so angry right now, I can't even speak to him. I sent him a text message telling him how I felt, but he hasn't responded yet, which is surprising because he usually does.


Jannah, I understand you anger. If my DH were to purchase a motorcycle, he would probably have to leave me, because I am adamant about him not owning or riding one. Sure bikes are cool and fun to ride, but they are non0negotiables in our home.

1) I think that there is more risk involved than I am comfortable.
and
2) We do not carry enough life insurance.

At our stage in life fun is practical and safe.


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## AndrewsMother

I have not posted much in the past few weeks.

I took a hiatus to focus on my grades, but I am not sure if it helped. This is the first time in my life that I have had to study. I have never stressed over lack of knowledge or not gotten an assignment. I am befuddled to say the least. I am questioning my career path, but I can't think of anything else that I want to do in life. I keep reading career manuals and poruing over the schools major section, but nothing interests me like medicine. And the idea of anything else in the health care industry does not interest me either. I would rather not have a career if I had to work as a nurse or a P.A.

Instead of dropping my difficult class, I chose to continue until the end of the smester. If I earn anything less than an A I will take the class again, but at least when I take the class for a 2nd time I will have some knowledge of the material.

Sometimes I wish that I could settle for less or be satisfied with less, because it seems as if life would be so much easier. But I doubt that I would have happiness. Being a mom, a student, a wife and a part time employee requires to much effort that at times I want to say walk away from some of my responsibilities. DS sounds so pathetic when he asks me to stay at home from class or work that my heart aches. Yes I know that he is fine at home with his father, but......

I am working as a mentor in the local school system at a middle school and high school to assist students with college preparation. I like the job, but I should work in a lab or as a cashier because I have an emotional investment in my work. The schools are so depressing that I don't want to go there to earn a $1, so why would students want to go for an education. Some of the teachers and administrators seem to care, but so many are just there for the paycheck and summer vacation. If minority teachers don't care about minority students who will?

This school has a 25% admissions rate to college and that is considered high. There is 30 minutes a day set into the schedule for Advocacy (like homeroom, but for college preparation) instead of teachers using the time to talk about college or assist with application or FAFSA they read newspapers, chat with other coworkers or apply makeup.

PSATs scores were returned to students last week. A high score fell somewhere in the 40th percentile, average was about 20-30%. I am flabbergasted because this is the school zoned to my home.

Of course when this school was 95% non minority the scores were much higher.









I feel so badly for parents who have no choice but to send their children to failing schools. Even if they are high achievers, a 4.0 at this school is not the same as a 4.0 in a school with rigourous academics. This is evident in the amount of students required to take remedial classes upon entrance to college or universities.

I am so annoyed with poorly performing minority schools. Why can't blacks and hispanics as a whole perform well in an academic setting?







: I don't get it.

I guess that I needed to vent.


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## madsommer

*Andrew'smother*- I totally understand what you're saying. I think a large part of the problem starts at home. If they don't have parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts, family friends telling them that they can be anything they want to be...that they WILL be a doctor or that they WILL be a lawyer or that they WILL be a teacher, then no one is providing a good example for them.

My parents always stretched themselves financially to put my brother and I in good public schools. But aside from that, my father didn't allow TV Mon-Thur; we had to read for an hour every night; we played instruments and sports; my grandma used to always tell me that I was smart and I was going to be a doctor or a lawyer.

And honestly, by highschool, if no one has given them that glimmer of hope or that discipline, will, or desire to be something more, then they're gonna be pretty lost. It's sad, but it's the truth. The real key is early intervention and placing more responsibility on the parents instead of the teachers (though there are lots of bad teachers too).


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
*Andrew'smother*- I totally understand what you're saying. I think a large part of the problem starts at home. If they don't have parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts, family friends telling them that they can be anything they want to be...that they WILL be a doctor or that they WILL be a lawyer or that they WILL be a teacher, then no one is providing a good example for them.

My parents always stretched themselves financially to put my brother and I in good public schools. But aside from that, my father didn't allow TV Mon-Thur; we had to read for an hour every night; we played instruments and sports; my grandma used to always tell me that I was smart and I was going to be a doctor or a lawyer.

And honestly, by highschool, if no one has given them that glimmer of hope or that discipline, will, or desire to be something more, then they're gonna be pretty lost. It's sad, but it's the truth. The real key is early intervention and placing more responsibility on the parents instead of the teachers (though there are lots of bad teachers too).


Totally agree with this and will add that after 7 years in Maine and working with low income whites, the traits that we sometimes ascribe to low income folks of color are also there with low income whites. Kids in my after-school program get mediocre grades and the parents don't care or too tired working a dead-end job to get involved.









Shay


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## futurmama8

AndrewsMother said:


> Quote:
> 
> I have not posted much in the past few weeks.
> 
> I took a hiatus to focus on my grades, but I am not sure if it helped. This is the first time in my life that I have had to study. I have never stressed over lack of knowledge or not gotten an assignment. I am befuddled to say the least. I am questioning my career path, but I can't think of anything else that I want to do in life. I keep reading career manuals and poruing over the schools major section, but nothing interests me like medicine. And the idea of anything else in the health care industry does not interest me either. I would rather not have a career if I had to work as a nurse or a P.A.
> As a young woman in a nursing program I think it has many paths that you can follow. Working your butt off on a medical/surgical floor with 6 or 7 patients isn't what all nurses have to do. I wanted to go to medical school but I NEVER wanted to waste all that time in school. So I am going to graduate school to become a Certified Nurse Midwife and Nurse Practitioner since they are just like doctors just with less schooling. But i can totally understand not knowing what to do because I thought being in nursing school I would slave the rest of my life, now I see that I don't have to. I wish you much luck though.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> I am working as a mentor in the local school system at a middle school and high school to assist students with college preparation. I like the job, but I should work in a lab or as a cashier because I have an emotional investment in my work. The schools are so depressing that I don't want to go there to earn a $1, so why would students want to go for an education. Some of the teachers and administrators seem to care, but so many are just there for the paycheck and summer vacation. If minority teachers don't care about minority students who will?
> Wow! That is so very true. I bet most went in wanting to make a difference but the struggles can wear you down. This makes me so sad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am glad you are doing your part though, that is great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> This school has a 25% admissions rate to college and that is considered high. There is 30 minutes a day set into the schedule for Advocacy (like homeroom, but for college preparation) instead of teachers using the time to talk about college or assist with application or FAFSA they read newspapers, chat with other coworkers or apply makeup.
> 
> PSATs scores were returned to students last week. A high score fell somewhere in the 40th percentile, average was about 20-30%. I am flabbergasted because this is the school zoned to my home.
> 
> Of course when this school was 95% non minority the scores were much higher.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel so badly for parents who have no choice but to send their children to failing schools. Even if they are high achievers, a 4.0 at this school is not the same as a 4.0 in a school with rigourous academics. This is evident in the amount of students required to take remedial classes upon entrance to college or universities.
> 
> I am so annoyed with poorly performing minority schools. Why can't blacks and hispanics as a whole perform well in an academic setting?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : I don't get it.
> 
> I guess that I needed to vent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really have many things that I want to venture out on. I would LOVE to open African centered schools like *this one* but I would need to connect with a lot of people all over the country. Me and my boyfriend also want to open up community centers and community gardens in the low income areas. I don't know how realistic that is but those are things I want to do for all people but especially POC.


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## madsommer

Anyone happen to read the thread in "parenting" titled "anyone live in a 'rough' neighborhood?" I'm glad that most of the people who responded were offended by her subtle, or perhaps not so subtle, racist comments...however I'm sure the thread will be removed soon.

I just wanted to ask you ladies how you deal with the racism that you encounter? I am 23 and have always lived in predominantly white neighborhoods and didn't really grow up near my extended family so needless to say I had some identity issues that popped up around my senior year of high school. I read a book and then all of a sudden became enlightened, angry, and unsure.

I try not to think about how it affects me, but every once in a while I just get so saddened and angry when I realize how ignorant people can be. I'm especially trying to prepare myself for when DS gets older. Being bi-racial...sure, now he gets lots of compliments on his hair and his eyes...but what will happen when he gets to school and gets made fun of?

I already have a hard time as it is trying to fit into play groups in my area and in my neighborhood.

Sorry, I feel like this is jumbled but I just had to get some thoughts out. I just hate when I feel like I've found a place where i'm comfortable and then someone says or does something that makes me angry.

Like how do I tell my white in-laws that calling my son a monkey is offensive to me? I know they don't mean it like that, but I still cringe.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
*Anyone happen to read the thread in "parenting" titled "anyone live in a 'rough' neighborhood?" I'm glad that most of the people who responded were offended by her subtle, or perhaps not so subtle, racist comments...however I'm sure the thread will be removed soon.*

I just wanted to ask you ladies how you deal with the racism that you encounter? I am 23 and have always lived in predominantly white neighborhoods and didn't really grow up near my extended family so needless to say I had some identity issues that popped up around my senior year of high school. I read a book and then all of a sudden became enlightened, angry, and unsure.

I try not to think about how it affects me, but every once in a while I just get so saddened and angry when I realize how ignorant people can be. I'm especially trying to prepare myself for when DS gets older. Being bi-racial...sure, now he gets lots of compliments on his hair and his eyes...but what will happen when he gets to school and gets made fun of?

I already have a hard time as it is trying to fit into play groups in my area and in my neighborhood.

Sorry, I feel like this is jumbled but I just had to get some thoughts out. I just hate when I feel like I've found a place where i'm comfortable and then someone says or does something that makes me angry.

Like how do I tell my white in-laws that calling my son a monkey is offensive to me? I know they don't mean it like that, but I still cringe.


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
Like how do I tell my white in-laws that calling my son a monkey is offensive to me? I know they don't mean it like that, but I still cringe.

Tell them just like that. Say, "I would appreciate it if you didn't refer to my child as a monkey. I don't like it. It feels offensive and I know you don't mean to be offensive, but that's the way I react to it."

That way they know where you stand and why. And, it gives them an opportunity to explain to you where they're coming from, if they choose to take it. If they insist on doing it (barring an accidental slip where they apologize immediately or you remind them and they apologize), I would take my child to another room, outside, or home. You don't have to tolerate anything that makes you feel uncomfortable and as family, I wouldn't think they'd want to contribute to any negative feelings among you all.

As far as dealing with racism, I don't take it personal. If I feel like calling ppl on their stuff, I do. If I don't, I don't. The same is true for anything I have a problem with.


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
Tell them just like that. Say, "I would appreciate it if you didn't refer to my child as a monkey. I don't like it. It feels offensive and I know you don't mean to be offensive, but that's the way I react to it."

Yeah. I'll have to do that. I just feel like race is such a sensitive topic...plus they're pushing 70 so they grew up in a completely different time. So I don't really get angry with them, it just makes me kind of sad. However, the husband of my sister-in-law is also black so I wonder if he's ever heard them say something that he found offensive...I'll have to ask him about that...


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
*Andrew'smother*- I totally understand what you're saying. I think a large part of the problem starts at home. If they don't have parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts, family friends telling them that they can be anything they want to be...that they WILL be a doctor or that they WILL be a lawyer or that they WILL be a teacher, then no one is providing a good example for them.

My parents always stretched themselves financially to put my brother and I in good public schools. But aside from that, my father didn't allow TV Mon-Thur; we had to read for an hour every night; we played instruments and sports; my grandma used to always tell me that I was smart and I was going to be a doctor or a lawyer.

And honestly, by highschool, if no one has given them that glimmer of hope or that discipline, will, or desire to be something more, then they're gonna be pretty lost. It's sad, but it's the truth. *The real key is early intervention and placing more responsibility on the parents instead of the teachers (though there are lots of bad teachers too*).

I grew up hearing the bolded line, and quite frankly I am tired of listening. I I am not a cynic, but I do not think that some parents or some types of parents will ever care. It is the schools system and the teachers responsibility to ensure that students with parents who don't care or are too tired to care will have a chance. The blame keeps being placed, but no side is accepting responsibility. Will schools systems across the nation have to implement more schools like the Seed Foundation to ensure that all children receive the support and sturcture that is needed to advance in our society.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Totally agree with this and will add that after 7 years in Maine and working with low income whites, the traits that we sometimes ascribe to low income folks of color are also there with low income whites. Kids in my after-school program get mediocre grades and the parents don't care or too tired working a dead-end job to get involved.









Shay

I am sure that the root of the problem is more class than income, but either way there is a problem.



futurmama8 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother*
> As a young woman in a nursing program I think it has many paths that you can follow. Working your butt off on a medical/surgical floor with 6 or 7 patients isn't what all nurses have to do. I wanted to go to medical school but I NEVER wanted to waste all that time in school. So I am going to graduate school to become a Certified Nurse Midwife and Nurse Practitioner since they are just like doctors just with less schooling. But i can totally understand not knowing what to do because I thought being in nursing school I would slave the rest of my life, now I see that I don't have to. I wish you much luck though.
> 
> Wow! That is so very true. I bet most went in wanting to make a difference but the struggles can wear you down. This makes me so sad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am glad you are doing your part though, that is great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really have many things that I want to venture out on. I would LOVE to open African centered schools like *this one* but I would need to connect with a lot of people all over the country. Me and my boyfriend also want to open up community centers and community gardens in the low income areas. I don't know how realistic that is but those are things I want to do for all people but especially POC.
> 
> I just have no desire to be a nurse, and it is not because of the idea that I might overextend myself on the med/surg floor. There is a definite difference in the training that nurses receive and their abilty to treat patients. I want the freedom to question the treatment, to try a different course of medication and perhaps research a better cure. Nurses do not have that flexibilty. I know many nurses who work in many different areas and have talked to them extensively, but what they do does not have any interest to me.
> 
> I don't that I will change my goal, but rather the way that I achieve it. Instead of completeing the prerequisites in my home state I am researching premed post bacclaureate programs in other parts of the country. Spending a year or two focusing on my science classes without the worrying of l cooking dinner, doing laundry, working and doing whatever else I have to do would benefit me greatly.
> 
> The Lotus Academy looks great. There is a school here with a similar concept that I considered for my son, but I was detered by the fact that three year olds have nightly homework, P.E. is held outdoors (it is very hot and humid here 8 months out of the year) and the location of the school. Low income areas do not frighten me, but I am skeptical of any school, not matter it's reputation if it is housed in a commerical area, or commercial building.
> 
> Futuremama, do you live in Philadelphia?
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *madsommer*
> Anyone happen to read the thread in "parenting" titled "anyone live in a 'rough' neighborhood?" I'm glad that most of the people who responded were offended by her subtle, or perhaps not so subtle, racist comments...however I'm sure the thread will be removed soon.
> 
> I just wanted to ask you ladies how you deal with the racism that you encounter? I am 23 and have always lived in predominantly white neighborhoods and didn't really grow up near my extended family so needless to say I had some identity issues that popped up around my senior year of high school. I read a book and then all of a sudden became enlightened, angry, and unsure.
> 
> I try not to think about how it affects me, but every once in a while I just get so saddened and angry when I realize how ignorant people can be. I'm especially trying to prepare myself for when DS gets older. Being bi-racial...sure, now he gets lots of compliments on his hair and his eyes...but what will happen when he gets to school and gets made fun of?
> 
> I already have a hard time as it is trying to fit into play groups in my area and in my neighborhood.
> 
> Sorry, I feel like this is jumbled but I just had to get some thoughts out. I just hate when I feel like I've found a place where i'm comfortable and then someone says or does something that makes me angry.
> 
> Like how do I tell my white in-laws that calling my son a monkey is offensive to me? I know they don't mean it like that, but I still cringe.
> 
> I call my son Monkey all of the time, and it bothers my husband so I don't do it as often. He climbs, jumps and swings from any and everything so in my mind he is my little monkey. I don't know how I would feel about my white in-laws using the term. Is your child the only one called monkey, or do they use the term for all of their grandchildren? Either was if you are uncomfortable with the term then you should let them know how it make you feel when they call your son a monkey. Don't tell them to stop, but tell them how you feel first then ask if they could use another term of enderament.
> 
> The threatd about housing did not bother me for one reason, I have been there and done that. I lived in a low income area of Atlanta for a couple of years and I loved the location, but was not soo keen on my neighbors. My family complained of the location and was all too happy when I moved. My family is black, I am black and I shared the sentiments of the person who wrote the post so I can't find fault with her words simply because she is not black.
> 
> Even now I want to live near the downtown area, but the neighbohoods and the people are questionable. The location would be perfect, but when I visit my friends homes I wonder if we should move to the lush suburbs.
> 
> I lament to my husband about the fact that low income people don't often value their neighborhoods. We are not rich, and I would rather live in afforable housing, but now that I have a child I don't want for him to think that this is how black people or people with limited incomes have to live.
> 
> I can understand not having money to paint or make repairs, but being clean and neat is free.


----------



## futurmama8

AndrewsMother said:


> Quote:
> 
> I just have no desire to be a nurse, and it is not because of the idea that I might overextend myself on the med/surg floor. There is a definite difference in the training that nurses receive and their abilty to treat patients. I want the freedom to question the treatment, to try a different course of medication and perhaps research a better cure. Nurses do not have that flexibilty. I know many nurses who work in many different areas and have talked to them extensively, but what they do does not have any interest to me.
> Just so you know that I wasn't implying you should be a nurse because it is NOT for everybody and I times I thought it wasn't for me, actually being a floor nurse isn't. I was saying that being a Nurse Practitioner is close to being a doctor but with not as much demands. Sorry if I was confusing, I tend to do that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> I don't that I will change my goal, but rather the way that I achieve it. Instead of completeing the prerequisites in my home state I am researching premed post bacclaureate programs in other parts of the country. Spending a year or two focusing on my science classes without the worrying of l cooking dinner, doing laundry, working and doing whatever else I have to do would benefit me greatly.
> That is a great goal, what area do you want to work in?
> 
> Quote:
> 
> The Lotus Academy looks great. There is a school here with a similar concept that I considered for my son, but I was detered by the fact that three year olds have nightly homework, P.E. is held outdoors (it is very hot and humid here 8 months out of the year) and the location of the school. Low income areas do not frighten me, but I am skeptical of any school, not matter it's reputation if it is housed in a commerical area, or commercial building.
> 
> Futuremama, do you live in Philadelphia?
> No I live in Cincinnati but I heard of the school on this movie *500 years later*, they said that it was a very good school. If you watch it come over to books and media as I am trying to start a conversation about it


----------



## futurmama8

Man I missed the thread you were talking about. O well.


----------



## kimiij

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
So I am going to graduate school to become a Certified Nurse Midwife and Nurse Practitioner since they are just like doctors just with less schooling.

Me too! I start school this Fall. I am doing a 3-yr combined BA to RN to CNM program. Are you in a combined program or will you apply to a CNM/NP program when you graduate from nursing school? Great to see another woman of color becoming a CNM. We are few and far between.

I went the CNM route (as opposed to MD) b/c I wanted to provide a different more compassionate kind of care. Midwifery called to me and I couldn't ignore it (and believe me, I tried hard to ignore it..I even completed a whole pre-med post-bac!)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I just have no desire to be a nurse, and it is not because of the idea that I might overextend myself on the med/surg floor. There is a definite difference in the training that nurses receive and their abilty to treat patients. I want the freedom to question the treatment, to try a different course of medication and perhaps research a better cure. Nurses do not have that flexibilty. I know many nurses who work in many different areas and have talked to them extensively, but what they do does not have any interest to me.

I don't that I will change my goal, but rather the way that I achieve it. Instead of completeing the prerequisites in my home state I am researching premed post bacclaureate programs in other parts of the country. Spending a year or two focusing on my science classes without the worrying of l cooking dinner, doing laundry, working and doing whatever else I have to do would benefit me greatly.

I completed a post-bac about a year ago when I thought I wanted to go the OB/GYN route. Obviously, I ended up deciding against it. But, let me know if you want any advice b/c I went through what you're going through (researching post-bacs, etc.) almost two years ago. Good luck!


----------



## AndrewsMother

futurmama8 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother*
> 
> Just so you know that I wasn't implying you should be a nurse because it is NOT for everybody and I times I thought it wasn't for me, actually being a floor nurse isn't. I was saying that being a Nurse Practitioner is close to being a doctor but with not as much demands. Sorry if I was confusing, I tend to do that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is a great goal, what area do you want to work in?
> 
> No I live in Cincinnati but I heard of the school on this movie *500 years later*, they said that it was a very good school. If you watch it come over to books and media as I am trying to start a conversation about it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh no, you were not confusing!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I contemplated the Nurse Practitioner and Physician Assistant route and weighed the pros and cons month ago.
> 
> At first I just knew that I wanted to work as a Perinatologist, but I feel as if I am drawn towards Epidemiology or MD Public Health.
> 
> I will look at the video and reply


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
Me too! I start school this Fall. I am doing a 3-yr combined BA to RN to CNM program. Are you in a combined program or will you apply to a CNM/NP program when you graduate from nursing school? Great to see another woman of color becoming a CNM. We are few and far between.

I went the CNM route (as opposed to MD) b/c I wanted to provide a different more compassionate kind of care. Midwifery called to me and I couldn't ignore it (and believe me, I tried hard to ignore it..I even completed a whole pre-med post-bac!)

I completed a post-bac about a year ago when I thought I wanted to go the OB/GYN route. Obviously, I ended up deciding against it. But, let me know if you want any advice b/c I went through what you're going through (researching post-bacs, etc.) almost two years ago. Good luck!

Sure, I welcome your advice!


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Man I missed the thread you were talking about. O well.

'Twas interesting


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
*I am sure that the root of the problem is more class than income, but either way there is a problem.* I agree.

Is your child the only one called monkey, *or do they use the term for all of their grandchildren?* Either was if you are uncomfortable with the term then you should let them know how it make you feel when they call your son a monkey. Don't tell them to stop, but tell them how you feel first then ask if they could use another term of enderament.

This is the first grandchild so it's uncharted territory for everyone. I just don't think of my child as an animal...and it's not like he's a climber or anything so I just find it a weird choice.

*The threatd about housing did not bother me for one reason, I have been there and done that. I lived in a low income area of Atlanta for a couple of years and I loved the location, but was not soo keen on my neighbors. My family complained of the location and was all too happy when I moved. My family is black, I am black and I shared the sentiments of the person who wrote the post so I can't find fault with her words simply because she is not black.*

My issues was that it really wasn't an issue of race, it was an issue of class. The problem would have read the same if she left out race - if indeed her problem was really just that she lived near other poor people. But later in the thread she even admitted that she came from a racist family. So even though she didn't realize it, she was echoing the same sentiments. It wasn't just that they were poor - but that they were poor _and_ of color.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
My issues was that it really wasn't an issue of race, it was an issue of class. The problem would have read the same if she left out race - if indeed her problem was really just that she lived near other poor people. But later in the thread she even admitted that she came from a racist family. So even though she didn't realize it, she was echoing the same sentiments. It wasn't just that they were poor - but that they were poor _and_ of color.


I agree with you completely. I am intentionally withholding my thoughts on that thread but I couldn't help but respond here.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
Me too! I start school this Fall. I am doing a 3-yr combined BA to RN to CNM program. Are you in a combined program or will you apply to a CNM/NP program when you graduate from nursing school? Great to see another woman of color becoming a CNM. We are few and far between.

I am a junior in the BSN program now, only 1 more year!! Then I am going to fufill my contract with a hospital the paid for my schooling for 2 years in L&D then go back to do the masters thing. I am looking at frontier nursing school or University of Cincinnati but I don't know yet. I agree there needs to be more CNM's of color. I would like to do homebirths and hospital births but cincinnati is not very progressive as a whole. I actually want to work more in the low income area hospitals so I can allow women who normally would have intervention filled births a more holistic and natural approach. Even though I don't have children I have seen a few born and I don't think many don't realize how....powerful they were and can be. It's like a chore instead of gift and I want to people to actually experience that gift.

Sorry I rambled on







, I am just very passionate about a lot of things.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
I agree with you completely. I am intentionally withholding my thoughts on that thread but I couldn't help but respond here.

Me, three.
That thread had me







:.


----------



## Draupadi

*Jannah,* sorry I didn't catch that you were upset. Did everything work out better?


----------



## chanibell

Andrewsmother, I can totally emphasize. There was jubilation here ( in Seattle) when the African American Academy opened in the Beacon Hill neighborhood. From the outside it is a beautiful school. Last yr it was on the list of a failing school that will be closed down.







I'm so upset I'm not sure what to say. I don't know anyone who has their kids in that school. I live in another part of Seattle. I don't have all the details of why it was a failing school,but it simply didn't make the grade. I think a jr high will be relocated into the building,but I agree with some OP's. It starts at home. When was it acceptable to let our kids fail? Why don't more parents get involved? I don't have all the answers.

I have a friend who grew up in Poland and when she came to the US she was "technically" in 9th grade,but was doing 12th grade work. She said she got straight A's even in English when she barely spoke the language!

I was adopted as a toddler and raised in a household that didn't accept poor grades at all no way! I even won the science fair in the 6th grade!









When I was about 25, I met my birth family. Let me just say that I think if I had grown up in their environment,I just don't think that I would have gone on to get my science degree in HIA.

My birth brother didn't graduate from hs. When I asked my birth mom why,her response was," well I asked him to go,but he didn't want to".

Apparently there were just no expectations there.

I make it a point though to be in my nieces lives though. I wish they didn't live all the way across town b/c I see that one of them isn't where she should be in math and needs extra help. She says that she gets it,but I don't know. My brother is now incarcerated and their mother works odd hrs. I'm trying to do as much as I can and be a role model.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Andrewsmother, I can totally emphasize. There was jubilation here ( in Seattle) when the African American Academy opened in the Beacon Hill neighborhood. From the outside it is a beautiful school. Last yr it was on the list of a failing school that will be closed down.







I'm so upset I'm not sure what to say. I don't know anyone who has their kids in that school. I live in another part of Seattle. I don't have all the details of why it was a failing school,but it simply didn't make the grade. I think a jr high will be relocated into the building,but I agree with some OP's. It starts at home. When was it acceptable to let our kids fail? Why don't more parents get involved? I don't have all the answers.

I have a friend who grew up in Poland and when she came to the US she was "technically" in 9th grade,but was doing 12th grade work. She said she got straight A's even in English when she barely spoke the language!

I was adopted as a toddler and raised in a household that didn't accept poor grades at all no way! I even won the science fair in the 6th grade!









When I was about 25, I met my birth family. Let me just say that I think if I had grown up in their environment,I just don't think that I would have gone on to get my science degree in HIA.

My birth brother didn't graduate from hs. When I asked my birth mom why,her response was," well I asked him to go,but he didn't want to".

Apparently there were just no expectations there.

I make it a point though to be in my nieces lives though. I wish they didn't live all the way across town b/c I see that one of them isn't where she should be in math and needs extra help. She says that she gets it,but I don't know. My brother is now incarcerated and their mother works odd hrs. I'm trying to do as much as I can and be a role model.


I found a few articles about the African American Academy on google. The school opened with a great vision, but somewhere early in it's inception someone or something floundered.

I will reply more later, I am procrastinating about writing a paper and perparing for work.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Andrewsmother, I can totally emphasize. There was jubilation here ( in Seattle) when the African American Academy opened in the Beacon Hill neighborhood. From the outside it is a beautiful school. Last yr it was on the list of a failing school that will be closed down.







I'm so upset I'm not sure what to say. I don't know anyone who has their kids in that school. I live in another part of Seattle. I don't have all the details of why it was a failing school,but it simply didn't make the grade. I think a jr high will be relocated into the building,but I agree with some OP's. It starts at home. When was it acceptable to let our kids fail? Why don't more parents get involved? I don't have all the answers.

I have a friend who grew up in Poland and when she came to the US she was "technically" in 9th grade,but was doing 12th grade work. She said she got straight A's even in English when she barely spoke the language!

I was adopted as a toddler and raised in a household that didn't accept poor grades at all no way! I even won the science fair in the 6th grade!









When I was about 25, I met my birth family. Let me just say that I think if I had grown up in their environment,I just don't think that I would have gone on to get my science degree in HIA.

My birth brother didn't graduate from hs. When I asked my birth mom why,her response was," well I asked him to go,but he didn't want to".

Apparently there were just no expectations there.

I make it a point though to be in my nieces lives though. I wish they didn't live all the way across town b/c I see that one of them isn't where she should be in math and needs extra help. She says that she gets it,but I don't know. My brother is now incarcerated and their mother works odd hrs. I'm trying to do as much as I can and be a role model.


Hey sweetie. Long time no talk to. It's good to see you around


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Draupadi* 
*Jannah,* sorry I didn't catch that you were upset. Did everything work out better?


No, my husband will be riding that darn bike







He said that he didn't know that it angered me so much until I sent him the text message


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Draupadi* 
Me, three.
That thread had me







:.

I read some of that thread and I was







:







.


----------



## futurmama8

Wow I didn't know all you guys were peeved by that thread. Was the lady blatently racist or was it subtle? I wanna know more about what happened LOl I am VERY nosy.

I have something that is bothering me. I was talking to a friend from school and she breastfed her babe for 5 months, cool most babies don't even get that especially children of color. So I am thinking she is pro breastfeeding you know so I tell her my cousin just told me her last son just weaned and he is 2.5. I told her all 4 of her kids breastfed to at least that age I was really proud of them because they are great, well grounded kids. Well I spoke too much







:, she then goes and says, "that is disgusting why would anybody want a 2 year old hanging off their t*tty", then she tells the only other black girl in the class and they both keep talking about how disgusting it is and it's not right and they would never have a a baby over 6 months hanging off their t*tty. Then she says "you are only supposed to breastfeed for 6 months", I told "her no you are supposed to exclusively breastfeed for 6 months but the AAP recommends AT LEAST a year and the WHO AT LEAST 2 years". Then she says "I never heard that my doctor said 6 months", I told her "your doctor was dead wrong and giving the wrong info". I told them proudly I am going to breastfeed as long as I can because it's best, then she shot me down and said "you don't have kids yet so you can't even say that"







I feel I can never tell facts since I have no children, I mean I know I can't tell people how to raise their kids I wouldn't do that but I can give facts can't I?







I was kind of peeved the rest of day because I felt it was a happy moment but they turned into something so negative???

Do you guys think I should send her this *article* that was in mothering? I don't want to be seen as beating a dead horse but these people want to be nurse practitioners and I one wants to even work in the NICU!! I am just really sad right now. Should I not tell people with children about recommendations since I have don't have kids myself??


----------



## chanibell

Oh hey Purplegirl! I miss you too!







:


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Wow I didn't know all you guys were peeved by that thread. Was the lady blatently racist or was it subtle? I wanna know more about what happened LOl I am VERY nosy.

I have something that is bothering me. I was talking to a friend from school and she breastfed her babe for 5 months, cool most babies don't even get that especially children of color. So I am thinking she is pro breastfeeding you know so I tell her my cousin just told me her last son just weaned and he is 2.5. I told her all 4 of her kids breastfed to at least that age I was really proud of them because they are great, well grounded kids. Well I spoke too much







:, she then goes and says, "that is disgusting why would anybody want a 2 year old hanging off their t*tty", then she tells the only other black girl in the class and they both keep talking about how disgusting it is and it's not right and they would never have a a baby over 6 months hanging off their t*tty. Then she says "you are only supposed to breastfeed for 6 months", I told "her no you are supposed to exclusively breastfeed for 6 months but the AAP recommends AT LEAST a year and the WHO AT LEAST 2 years". Then she says "I never heard that my doctor said 6 months", I told her "your doctor was dead wrong and giving the wrong info". I told them proudly I am going to breastfeed as long as I can because it's best, then she shot me down and said "you don't have kids yet so you can't even say that"







I feel I can never tell facts since I have no children, I mean I know I can't tell people how to raise their kids I wouldn't do that but I can give facts can't I?







I was kind of peeved the rest of day because I felt it was a happy moment but they turned into something so negative???

Do you guys think I should send her this *article* that was in mothering? I don't want to be seen as beating a dead horse but these people want to be nurse practitioners and I one wants to even work in the NICU!! I am just really sad right now. Should I not tell people with children about recommendations since I have don't have kids myself??









s *futurmama8*. I'm so sorry that this happened to you. Some people can be so negative. IMO you should totally provide her with the info, the rest is up to her. As for giving people with children recommendations, go for it







. I used to do it with my older sister all the time, not that she listened, but at least I tried.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Wow I didn't know all you guys were peeved by that thread. Was the lady blatently racist or was it subtle? I wanna know more about what happened LOl I am VERY nosy.

I have something that is bothering me. I was talking to a friend from school and she breastfed her babe for 5 months, cool most babies don't even get that especially children of color. So I am thinking she is pro breastfeeding you know so I tell her my cousin just told me her last son just weaned and he is 2.5. I told her all 4 of her kids breastfed to at least that age I was really proud of them because they are great, well grounded kids. Well I spoke too much







:, she then goes and says, "that is disgusting why would anybody want a 2 year old hanging off their t*tty", then she tells the only other black girl in the class and they both keep talking about how disgusting it is and it's not right and they would never have a a baby over 6 months hanging off their t*tty. Then she says "you are only supposed to breastfeed for 6 months", I told "her no you are supposed to exclusively breastfeed for 6 months but the AAP recommends AT LEAST a year and the WHO AT LEAST 2 years". Then she says "I never heard that my doctor said 6 months", I told her "your doctor was dead wrong and giving the wrong info". I told them proudly I am going to breastfeed as long as I can because it's best, then she shot me down and said "you don't have kids yet so you can't even say that"







I feel I can never tell facts since I have no children, I mean I know I can't tell people how to raise their kids I wouldn't do that but I can give facts can't I?







I was kind of peeved the rest of day because I felt it was a happy moment but they turned into something so negative???

Do you guys think I should send her this *article* that was in mothering? I don't want to be seen as beating a dead horse but these people want to be nurse practitioners and I one wants to even work in the NICU!! I am just really sad right now. Should I not tell people with children about recommendations since I have don't have kids myself??

Look at it from a medical standpoint. You are training to be CNM and will work as a L& D nurse for two years to pay back your student loans. It is your job to be as knowledgeable as you can about breastfeeding and anything else that a new mom might need to know. SO even though you don not have children you are able to know what will be of the most benefit not to just your child but to any child.

My male OB/gyn never gave birth, but I valued his education, training and second hand experience.

I hope that your friend is not going into L&D or CNM because I would hate for anyone to ask breastfeeding advice.


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## Yinsum

Never realized this was here. So coming to it a tad late.
Hey everyone


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yinsum* 
Never realized this was here. So coming to it a tad late.
Hey everyone

Hey lady







:, come back and join the party.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yinsum* 
Never realized this was here. So coming to it a tad late.
Hey everyone


Hey woman. I'm personally thrilled that you have found us


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## Yinsum

Thanks Shay and Purplegirl, I will be sure to stick around.


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## futurmama8

Thanks Jannah and Andrewsmother







I will send it to her tomorrow. Unfortunately one of them wants to work in L&D or the NICU but she doesn't realize how good breastmilk is for preemies and babies in general







I need to start educating some more LOL! It doesn't help that our nursing teachers don't even tell us how important breastfeeding is. Medical and nursing schools really need to work on their curriculum. Maybe I will become a professor or something too.








Hey Yinsum


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## Arike

Is anyone celebrating Mother's Day this year? I was thinking to myself "What am I going to get mom this year for Mother's Day?" And then I thought "Wow this is my first Mother's Day as a mom!"







:Technically I was pregnant last Mother's Day but I didn't know it so I wasn't celebrating anything.







I don't know what to do this year... I feel like going out to eat is so played out; we do that like every year, except one year we went to "The Bodies" exhibition. I am trying to think of something fun to do for mother's day with my parents, DH, DB and DS. Or maybe just with DH and DS.

BTW, my little boo will be 6 months a week from today!







We are starting him on solids this weekend. I am going to attempt the whole "baby led weaning" thing. Has anyone else tried this?


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## eilonwy

My older three all self-weaned (Bear is on creepy, entirely artificial formula... long story, but in this case even calling it "artificial breastmilk" is a misnomer). Bean and BooBah started solids at 6 months. Bella was closer to ten because she was a month early and clearly not ready. In fact, if I'd known then what I know now, Bean wouldn't have started so early either... but he was DESPERATE to eat and very interested (unlike Bella, who really couldn't have cared less one way or the other). BooBah was perfect, took the spoon from her grandmother's hand and proceeded to feed herself.









In any case, while BooBah and BeanBean were the same ages when they started solids, BooBah self-weaned at 15 months (yes, she really did) and Bean didn't wean until a month before he started kindergarten (4.5). He might have nursed right up to his fifth birthday if I hadn't been pregnant, but no longer-- he felt like being a real kindergartener meant that he was old enough not to nurse.









I'd have to consider CLW as one of my great parenting successes thus far. It's a good deal.


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## JeDeeLenae

welcome Yinsum!

futurmama8~ like the other ladies said, your knowledge of recommendations is just as important for these other ladies to know regardless of your parenting status. I hope they think about it and realize that they need to be more knowledgeable about bfing.


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## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yinsum* 
Never realized this was here. So coming to it a tad late.
Hey everyone

Woohoo!
Welcome, Yinsum!


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## Draupadi

*Futurmama*, giving out info is not bad. You can only pass it along and hope that she takes something from it.

My aunt visited the other day and asked me sort of passive-aggressively, "Aren't you doing it (breastfeeding) too long?" DS is almost 2 so you know the pressure is on.







Even my mom is starting in. When DS comes to me and asks for it, she'll chime in, "No, no William. No nee-nee!" and I have to correct her. I think she's starting to get embarrassed by my EBF.


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## JeDeeLenae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Draupadi* 
*Futurmama*, giving out info is not bad. You can only pass it along and hope that she takes something from it.

My aunt visited the other day and asked me sort of passive-aggressively, "Aren't you doing it (breastfeeding) too long?" DS is almost 2 so you know the pressure is on.







Even my mom is starting in. When DS comes to me and asks for it, she'll chime in, "No, no William. No nee-nee!" and I have to correct her. I think she's starting to get embarrassed by my EBF.

Eventually, they'll get over it. I'm one of the few breastfeeders in my family and when I had to nurse my then 2 yr old at my aunt's bday party in a pottery store, most said nothing or "you do what you have to do." It was surprising.


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## futurmama8

Thanks everyone for the advice. I just don't like when people always say you don't have kids...







. I sometimes feel like I shouldn't say anything at all but some people use that as an excuse too. I am going to send her the article tomorrow, hope she doesn't get mad.

I wonder how my family and my bf's will react when we have kids because we are already way from the norm. On easter his mother kept saying stuff about this bottle my barley 2yo goddaughter had







I told her it comforts her when she needs it and that is all that matters. I can only imagine when its my breast







I will not hear the end of it.

Thanks for all the support again ladies


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## Whispers

Hello Everyone!

I introduced myself a month aog but then we moved and we haven't had internet for a while And it has been a bit hectic trying to unpack and organize the house with my 2 constantly needing attention! But we are finally moved in now and it is all good.

A bit of background. I am a mixed race South African now living in Wales with my white Zimbabwean dh. It's been very interesting reading about race from an AA perspective. Some of which I get some of which I don't.

I've just read the last 12 odd pages in one go to try and get up to date! Man, it was quite a read!







So some of my answers may be a bit old.

As for the monkey thing, that's what I call my dd. That's what my mom called me, she still does sometimes.







I guess growing up we where called so many awful things that where I came from if someone called me monkey, in a racist way it would have been increadably tame compared to what we usually had hurled at us. I've never known monkey to be used in a racist way so I guess that's why I don't *get* it. Now I'm getting all paranoid?!! Should I change my siggy?

I haven't had my hair relaxed or blow dried since 2001 odd. I just decided it was too painful and I hated the smell. It's taken me a long time to come to terms with my hair. That is is ok to just let it be what it is a great big giant 'fro and love it. My mom did try a few times to persuade me to straighten it but she's gotten over it now. She actually likes it now.

Quote:

Futurmama, giving out info is not bad. You can only pass it along and hope that she takes something from it.

My aunt visited the other day and asked me sort of passive-aggressively, "Aren't you doing it (breastfeeding) too long?" DS is almost 2 so you know the pressure is on. Even my mom is starting in. When DS comes to me and asks for it, she'll chime in, "No, no William. No nee-nee!" and I have to correct her. I think she's starting to get embarrassed by my EBF.
ITA!!

I started getting pressure to stop BF when ds was 2 months old.







In my dh's family they only bf for 2 months so they where very shocked when I didn't. And they still ask dh pretty much on a weekly basis if ds "still drinking from me" I just laugh! The problem isn't mine it's their's. That is how I always look at it.

Anyway that's enough waffling for today. We are off to do some weeding!









Take Care


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## madsommer

*Futuremama* - ditto everyone else. I'm a pretty non-confontational person, but I think sending an email with a link is just fine and not over-stepping any boundaries. But I will say, that at least she's breastfeeding! It took a while for my parents and my ILs to get used to the fact that I was bf'ing, but after a while (well, with the exception of my MIL) they stopped asking when I was going to stop.

*Whispers* - you don't have to change your siggy







. It's just something that I am uncomfortable with. It's just that historically, monkeys/gorrillas/apes have been used to represent blacks in a disparaging manner. And plus, I just don't call other humans animals. I know animal names are popular as terms of endearment, but that one particularly rubs me the wrong way. But, to each his own!


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## futurmama8

I was lurking in the CAC forum and found a article that blows my mind. It is about *circumcision in Africa*.

Why is that this advertisement of genital mutilation is only happening in Africa? I understand their rates of HIV are high but come on... I am really angry about this because I know MY people are being taken advantage of and used as lab rats (like the Tuskegee experiment).

I am going to get kind of deep here...is this modern day castration of the black male??? I know white people had this view as the black man as "oversexualized" and "animalistic" hence the overprotection of white women from the black male. What do you think? Am I way off base?

I really don't like this and I don't see why these people can call for mass circumcison of the people on this continent. I know some of the people in Africa will see this "evidence" between decreased HIV and increased circ as a medical miracle but is it really? Or is it taking advantage of people who have to deal with poverty and racism on a whole other level?

I am not a conspiracy theorist (ok maybe a little







) but this is just taking it to a whole new level. Wouldn't it be cheaper and easier to teach people how to be sexually responsible, decrease sexual partners and hand out condoms? I am just very sad, angry and feel violated (even though it isn't me, its my people you know?).

I would post this in CAC but I wanted to see what POC had to say about it?

Rianne


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## madsommer

*Futuremama* - it makes me sad more than anything else. I can't possibly see how performing all of these operations would be any cheaper than condoms. IMO, the root of the problem is misinformation/miseducation/ignorance about safe sex. They can circumsize all they want, but if no one is spreading the message of safe sex, then it still won't help.

It's so sad to see people taken advantage of because of their poverty and ignorance. Looks to me like someone is just trying to make a lot of money. I'd like to see exactly how they tracked the sexual encounters of the people they studied and how accurate their conclusions really are.

Lots of other thoughts, but baby in lap. Time for bath


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## eilonwy

Madsomer, I have a BeanBean too.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







Madsomer, I have a BeanBean too.

















Even my mother has started calling him that now. May I ask what his given name is? My son's name is Dean, but Bean comes out much softer so I tend to call him that a lot (plus it was his nick-name in the womb so it's just kind of stuck).


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 







Even my mother has started calling him that now. May I ask what his given name is? My son's name is Dean, but Bean comes out much softer so I tend to call him that a lot (plus it was his nick-name in the womb so it's just kind of stuck).

His given name is entirely unrelated to "BeanBean" (I use pseudonyms for all my kids on the internet). I call him Bean because I desperately wanted to name him Ender Akiva, but Mike had a canary.







Bean as a nickname, he couldn't argue with.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
*Futuremama* - it makes me sad more than anything else. I can't possibly see how performing all of these operations would be any cheaper than condoms. IMO, the root of the problem is misinformation/miseducation/ignorance about safe sex. They can circumsize all they want, but if no one is spreading the message of safe sex, then it still won't help.

It's so sad to see people taken advantage of because of their poverty and ignorance. Looks to me like someone is just trying to make a lot of money. I'd like to see exactly how they tracked the sexual encounters of the people they studied and how accurate their conclusions really are.

Lots of other thoughts, but baby in lap. Time for bath









Thanks for the response. I was just don't get it and I agree it may be about money. Why Africa is my question? Why not India or China, is there something special about Africa.

Hope I didn't ruin the thread with my crazy questions


----------



## bajamergrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Thanks for the response. I was just don't get it and I agree it may be about money. Why Africa is my question? Why not India or China, is there something special about Africa.

Hope I didn't ruin the thread with my crazy questions

I think you're asking very good questions. I always have ethical concerns whenever vulnerable populations are involved in research. I also have concerns about male circumcision being touted as the "great savior," particularly since I do not see a similar emphasis on women being protected. Personally, I'm not a proponent of cutting off healthy tissue as prevention when there are alternatives. However, as a health educator who has done HIV prevention work, I can see why it isn't simply a matter of safer sex messages and handing out condoms. Lack of knowledge is only one part of the puzzle. Socioeconomics, culture, environmental barriers, and gender all contribute to sexual health issues.

I don't have a definite answer for "Why Africa?" Statistically speaking the prevalence of HIV is a lot higher on the continent than for India or China. Other than that, I can only speculate. I do know that the circumcision as "vaccine" is spreading beyond Africa. I read not too long ago that Suriname was implementing a free male circumcision program to reduce HIV risk.

My hope is that in the fight against HIV/AIDS we do not forget that it is still an issue in the US, particularly for POC.


----------



## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Or is it taking advantage of people who have to deal with poverty and racism on a whole other level?

Yes, it is.

Circumcision is not new to the continent of Africa, however, there is no solid research guaranteeing that lack of foreskin = less risk of HIV transfer. I remember a few years back when this pseudo-knowledge first came out and whites/scientists from all over the western world said it was a false and misleading piece of info. Why is it getting touted by governments? Well, let's see...what are foreskins used for? http://thetyee.ca/Views/2007/01/30/Foreskin/ http://www.norm-uk.org/where_do_foreskins_go.html

If cloning were all the rage, you'd want some foreskin. Esp. from the folks who supposedly originated human life as we know it.

I am a die-hard "conspiracy theorist". I believe the people of Africa have been given AIDS/HIV in those vaccines for many, many years, now. Not accidentally. And, I believe there are high numbers of false-positives for the tests.

This subject pisses me off so much, I'm going to shut up now. The sitch in Africa isn't about conspiracies. It's about seeing what's right in front of your eyes. It's so much easier to take land if the ppl on it are dead, isn't it? And, yes, this is ALL about land. Africa is one of the greatest resources on the planet, if not THE greatest resource.


----------



## futurmama8

NO DON'T SHUT UP!! Keep going girl

Bajamergrrl
Thanks that makes since and I know it shouldn't be that simple. What do you think can be done to reduce transmission?

Quote:

I do know that the circumcision as "vaccine" is spreading beyond Africa. I read not too long ago that Suriname was implementing a free male circumcision program to reduce HIV risk.








uke WTH!

I know circumcision was practiced within cultural aspects but what is with this global campaign for circ in Africa as if only they are biggest problem with AIDS. Why don't we have that here? Why aren't we freaking testing people here? I am not saying we should be circing or whatever but why Africa. I get so mad at this because I know white scientist are convincing these people without evidence. It's like they get informed consent from the people but the no one is even informed of this topic







. It is like these people are saying, "we are going to take a risk and our subjects are the African people".

Princesstutu

Quote:

I am a die-hard "conspiracy theorist". I believe the people of Africa have been given AIDS/HIV in those vaccines for many, many years, now. Not accidentally. And, I believe there are high numbers of false-positives for the tests.
I have heard that theory about HIV in Africa. I don't know who was saying this but they said that HIV was a white gay disease and almost overnight it became a African disease. I don't know how true that is but it doesn't sound farfetched, I mean look at the Tuskegee experiment.

Quote:

This subject pisses me off so much, I'm going to shut up now. The sitch in Africa isn't about conspiracies. It's about seeing what's right in front of your eyes. It's so much easier to take land if the ppl on it are dead, isn't it? And, yes, this is ALL about land. Africa is one of the greatest resources on the planet, if not THE greatest resource.
If the people are dead then their land is fair game. I don't even think they have to be dead just tired enough to give up. They are a strong people and I doubt that will happen. This continent has supported life since who knows when..It is the greatest resource, only now are we ruining this beautiful place.

Thanks again princesstutu I really appreciate your perspective.


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## futurmama8

I wanted to post some thinks since bajamergrrl mentioned circ here among POC.

This shows the circ rate for all races from the *CDC*.

Quote:

For most of the past 20 years, proportionately more white newborns received circumcisions than did black infants. Between 1980 and 1990, white infants, on average, were 13 percent more likely than black infants to be circumcised. By 1995, this percentage difference declined to about 7 percent- 68.6 percent of white infants compared to 63.9 percent of black infants. Now, circumcision rates for black and white infants are about the same. In 1999, the latest year these data are available, 65.5 percent of white newborns and 64.4 percent of black newborns were circumcised.
Blacks have had the lowest circ rate until recently. It supposedly was low in reaction to the castration explained below.

I also looked for a history about circ among blacks and was surprised at the results. It seems they did this to slaves to prevent the raping of white women and *control black promiscuity*Some of the language from this website is disturbing.

Quote:

Racist stereotyping lives on

The same racist assumptions about ***** promiscuity, licentiousness and ignorance were apparent in Eugene Hand's promotion of circumcision as a preventive of venereal disease in 1949. It is easy to see the same white fear and jealousy of Black sexuality, and the same determination to limit and suppress it, in *contemporary suggestions that African blacks should be circumcised to "protect them" from HIV-AIDS*.
It looks like these views are just being passed down and masked as "help"







.

Quote:

2. Compulsory circumcision to solve "the ***** rape problem"

In the 1880s, compulsory circumcision was urged as means of helping the "coloured race" overcome its infantile ignorance of the laws of hygiene and protect it from syphilis and many other diseases. In the 1890s, however, the emphasis shifted: circumcision was now to be enforced as a means of curtailing and *controlling Black sexuality and protecting white women from assault by sex-crazed ******s.* The charge was led by long-time circumcision crusader, Dr Peter Charles Remondino.
I could quote the whole thing but I won't







I honestly never heard of any of this before tonight.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I wanted to post some thinks since bajamergrrl mentioned circ here among POC.

This shows the circ rate for all races from the *CDC*.

Blacks have had the lowest circ rate until recently. It supposedly was low in reaction to the castration explained below.

I also looked for a history about circ among blacks and was surprised at the results. It seems they did this to slaves to prevent the raping of white women and *control black promiscuity*Some of the language from this website is disturbing.

It looks like these views are just being passed down and masked as "help"







.

I could quote the whole thing but I won't







I honestly never heard of any of this before tonight.









wow, that takes it to a whole other level


----------



## bajamergrrl

I just wanted to point out that when I said we should not forget that HIV is still an issue here in the states for POC I wasn't saying that circ was the answer. FWIW I'm against RIC for human rights reasons, but not entirely opposed to an adult making those decisions for themselves even though I think a lot of reasons for circ are bs.

As far as what can be done to reduce transmission in Africa, I hesitate to answer that question because my HIV prevention experiences are limited to the States. However, I think a mistake would be to lump all Africans into a monolith. Different countries/groups will have differences related to their HIV risk and will need tailored interventions.

I think a variety of interventions are always a good idea and that they go beyond spreading basic information (which is still necessary). I know one of the types of interventions that has been attempted has to do with women's economic empowerment/independence, e.g. encouraging women to start their own businesses with microloans in an attempt to help them build some power and control in their lives. Other interventions involve encouraging the use of female condoms.

Overall, I don't think there are any simple answers. I look at HIV as our generation's TB or leprosy. There's always going to be a disease popping up that is scary because we don't know a lot about it but over time we learn, adapt and try to get it under control.

What bothers me about the circ program in Africa is that it feels condescending in a way. It can come across as "these people are too stupid/poor/primitive" to get this under control so we "smarter people" need to do it for them.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist so I can't get behind certain theories. However I do wonder how it is that this virus has gotten so out of control on the continent. I do suspect that a legacy of colonialism, corruption/negligence on the part of former colonizing nations, corruption on the part of some African leaders and various "isms" all play a part in how this came to be.

Ok, now I have to add to my reading list for before my baby arrives.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bajamergrrl* 
Overall, I don't think there are any simple answers. I look at HIV as our generation's TB or leprosy.

For the record, both TB and leprosy have made HUGE resurgences in the past two decades. While leprosy is uncommon in the developed world, it's a very big problem in some developing countries. Tuberculosis has become much, much more common in the US due to increasing prison populations (it spreads like wildfire) and the difficulty involved in controlling it (very similar to leprosy in that it requires long-term, consistant antibiotic use).

Quote:

What bothers me about the circ program in Africa is that it feels condescending in a way. It can come across as "these people are too stupid/poor/primitive" to get this under control so we "smarter people" need to do it for them.








: That's what I was thinking. I'm not a conspiracy theorist either, but the condescension bothers me, too.


----------



## bajamergrrl

eilonwy said:


> For the record, both TB and leprosy have made HUGE resurgences in the past two decades. While leprosy is uncommon in the developed world, it's a very big problem in some developing countries. Tuberculosis has become much, much more common in the US due to increasing prison populations (it spreads like wildfire) and the difficulty involved in controlling it (very similar to leprosy in that it requires long-term, consistant antibiotic use).
> 
> I know that TB has made a resurgence (and is an issue for HIV+ individuals)...didn't know about the leprosy. I didn't mean that they aren't diseases to be concerned about nor that they had been eradicated. What I meant to express was that sometimes when a disease is new to us there is a sort of panic and stigmatization that accompanies it until time passes and we start figuring it out. Sorry I didn't express that thought properly.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
wow, that takes it to a whole other level

I know...

Bajamergrrl I understood what you meant in your previous posts. You never came off as pro circ or anything









Thanks for your opinion on what we could do. I like hearing solutions to problems we have. I would really like to have different workshops for inner city, low income people to teach them different parenting issues. I think that could help with adding more awareness and knowledge of certain things.

I do think that if women had more control of their lives and their economic status it would make them a little bit more in control of their sex lives. I think that is a great point.


----------



## 1hautemama

Hello, mamas, I've never posted here but have been chewing on a dilemma DD1 is dealing with at school and at times within the family...I am not of African descent, but I hope I am welcome. I am half Korean half caucasion. I have never related totally to either side. The Koreans in my community were/are very ethnocentric. I was often teased for being so "American", talking/acting like a white girl, but they also said how lucky I am for not having eyes that were so slanted, I was a banana, yellow on the outside white inside







. Hmm. On the other hand at school some of the meaner kids taunted me for being a "****", *****, often asked me to say something in Korean and Im ashamed to say I obliged just to make nice. The prizewinner, a boy once told me his uncle claimed to know first hand that "Oriental" women have slanted vaginas...It didn't matter that I'm half caucasion, it wann't good enough for them. Aside from dealing with this sort of stuff, my traumas were not that bad. I never thought I held onto this stuff till DD1 starting talking about the kids teasing her in kindergarten. I foolishly thought it's not a big deal. Tried to brush it aside. Then DD1 tells me one day (a few years ago) she didn't want her face anymore, she wanted a different face. Her classmates make fun of her eyes, ask her if she's Chinese. I tell her to let them know she is an American, and if they continue to be mean to not acknowledge them, at all, ever. I am confounded by this, first, because she attends a school that is mostly Hispanic and AA. She does not look "white". Like me, she has dark hair, dark eyes, olive skin and after a little sun DH calls us brown berries. I don't feel like I am in a good place to advise her since she has come into contact with more of the trouble makers lately. I feel the anger eating at me, and I realize the way I dealt with the teasers and taunts was by lashing out. I realize now that as much as I have tried to teach my girls love and respect for all races, I harbor a deep seated hatred and anger. My DH, when we were discussing w/ DD's teacher last week, remarked that it was not all that different from the way kids taunted him for being red headed and covered in freckles. Come again? I can't even begin to fathom an argument w/DH right now. I dunno, maybe it WAS painfull as child being amongst his white peers w/ all that red hair and freckles. I can't relate to that. And he can't relate/appreciate what I and DD1 put up with. I remember now trying to prove my "white cred" to my caucasion peers, then going to church the very next Sunday trying to prove my "Koreaness" to please the elders.
Now I've spent years running the other way, away from being Korean or white or whatever that those things are in the past and my children's lives are going to be different. We have a new president, despite all the rabid haters, all those fear mongers on FOX, we have moved forward. Haven't we?BUt none of that matters to my daughter right this second. Right now more than anything in this world she wants to look like Hannah Montana. Then all those kids would like her at school. It's no longer enough for her to respond "im a little bit of this a little bit of that". Right now Im a walking ball of anger and resentment. Where did I go wrong? Sorry for the book.


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1hautemama* 
Hello, mamas, I've never posted here but have been chewing on a dilemma DD1 is dealing with at school and at times within the family...I am not of African descent, but I hope I am welcome. I am half Korean half caucasion. I have never related totally to either side. The Koreans in my community were/are very ethnocentric. I was often teased for being so "American", talking/acting like a white girl, but they also said how lucky I am for not having eyes that were so slanted, I was a banana, yellow on the outside white inside







. Hmm. On the other hand at school some of the meaner kids taunted me for being a "****", *****, often asked me to say something in Korean and Im ashamed to say I obliged just to make nice. The prizewinner, a boy once told me his uncle claimed to know first hand that "Oriental" women have slanted vaginas...It didn't matter that I'm half caucasion, it wann't good enough for them. Aside from dealing with this sort of stuff, my traumas were not that bad. I never thought I held onto this stuff till DD1 starting talking about the kids teasing her in kindergarten. I foolishly thought it's not a big deal. Tried to brush it aside. Then DD1 tells me one day (a few years ago) she didn't want her face anymore, she wanted a different face. Her classmates make fun of her eyes, ask her if she's Chinese. I tell her to let them know she is an American, and if they continue to be mean to not acknowledge them, at all, ever. I am confounded by this, first, because she attends a school that is mostly Hispanic and AA. She does not look "white". Like me, she has dark hair, dark eyes, olive skin and after a little sun DH calls us brown berries. I don't feel like I am in a good place to advise her since she has come into contact with more of the trouble makers lately. I feel the anger eating at me, and I realize the way I dealt with the teasers and taunts was by lashing out. I realize now that as much as I have tried to teach my girls love and respect for all races, I harbor a deep seated hatred and anger. My DH, when we were discussing w/ DD's teacher last week, remarked that it was not all that different from the way kids taunted him for being red headed and covered in freckles. Come again? I can't even begin to fathom an argument w/DH right now. I dunno, maybe it WAS painfull as child being amongst his white peers w/ all that red hair and freckles. I can't relate to that. And he can't relate/appreciate what I and DD1 put up with. I remember now trying to prove my "white cred" to my caucasion peers, then going to church the very next Sunday trying to prove my "Koreaness" to please the elders.
Now I've spent years running the other way, away from being Korean or white or whatever that those things are in the past and my children's lives are going to be different. We have a new president, despite all the rabid haters, all those fear mongers on FOX, we have moved forward. Haven't we?BUt none of that matters to my daughter right this second. Right now more than anything in this world she wants to look like Hannah Montana. Then all those kids would like her at school. It's no longer enough for her to respond "im a little bit of this a little bit of that". Right now Im a walking ball of anger and resentment. Where did I go wrong? Sorry for the book.

First, welcome. I too used to lurk...intimated by the size of the thread and then I just posted one day. I think everyone seems to be pretty nice









I can understand why you are feeling frustrated. But maybe now is a good time for both you and your daughter to reconnect with your heritage. Maybe start introducing some books, tv shows, games, food, etc. that are representative of your culture. Do you live near any family? Perhaps they could be a good resource as well...it would be helpful for her to be around some other people who look like her. Try not to be too angry with your DH...it's hard for people to empathize sometimes when it comes to race-based discrimination. Sorry, I'm not much help, but those were the first things that came to mind. Hang in there!


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## madsommer

I want to make another attempt at going natural. I tried once last year, but after about 4 months gave in and got a relaxer again. I need more resources and information about how to transition. Before I was just curling my hair every night in order to hide the new growth....but then something happened and my hair stopped curling?! It was weird. That was when I went and got a relaxer.

I will admit that I am not the best when it comes to hair care. I have never been one of the girls that cares a ton about her hair (unless I have it cut into a really short style and then I have to work with it so I don't look too bad lol). Anywho, anyone have any website recommendations or personal experience?


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## princesstutu

First of all, *1hautemama*,









Second,

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1hautemama* 
Then DD1 tells me one day (a few years ago) she didn't want her face anymore, she wanted a different face.

I dealt with something similar with my now 9yo dd a few years ago. It was about her hair. She wanted hair like the white and Asian girls. And, the black girls whose mamas straighten their hair.

We had a long, long chat about how beautiful she is just the way she is, why I will never straighten her hair (but that she's free to do it herself when she's grown), and why variety is a good thing. This is something I put forth a conscious effort to reinforce with her on a regular basis. She is beautiful, sweet, honest, intelligent, etc. I tell her these things regularly.

I'm not the superficial type, for the most part. Concentrating on looks is something I have to put effort toward when it comes to my dd, b/c it's a stupid focal point, IMO. BUT, she lives in a very superficial world. It's easier for me to block those things out, but as a child, she is taking in her world on a different scale than I am and these things get to her. I work on building her up to counter the knocking-down the rest of the world might do. I have found that as she's gotten older and more comfy with how she presents her looks to the world, the world has offered her many opportunities for random compliments.

I'm sorry your dd is going thru this. It is so typical, tho. The best we can do is build our dd's up, I think, and help them be as confident as possible. (Not only children of color go thru this, but it can definitely take on a whole other connotation for us, can't it?)

I don't know that you "went wrong". This certainly is NOT an indicator that you went wrong. It's you vs. society. That's a big battle. And, as long as you help your dd, you're doing well. Good luck.


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## princesstutu

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
Before I was just curling my hair every night in order to hide the new growth....but then something happened and my hair stopped curling?!

I call that type of thing "The Universe is Talking to You".









I've "gone natural" so many times, now, I don't bother remembering. I have a thing for variety. Anyhoo, I think the most important thing to work on is your mindset. You're not "transitioning". This is your hair. This is what it is. Until it's something different. And, the point is to love it _right now_, not wait until it looks a specific way to love it then.

The point of going natural, IMO, is self-acceptance. If you're trying to hide the natural, what's really going on?

I shaved my head practically bald in January. My hair is short and I'm going to loc it up this time (and keep them), but I'm not in transition. I have short hair. And, it's beautiful, just the way it is. I love it. (Except when I don't.







)

I don't know what you're trying to do with your hair besides love it, but I really got a lot out of reading how Rastas view hair and why they do what they do with the locs.


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
I call that type of thing "The Universe is Talking to You".









The point of going natural, IMO, is self-acceptance. If you're trying to hide the natural, what's really going on?

Touche! I had just read on some other womens' webpages that they found a straw set or roller set and easier way to deal with styling issues until they were comfortable with the length of their new growth to make the big chop. I just have no idea how I would wear my hair as it started to grow out....and I'm really nervous about the idea of just cutting it all off...


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## 1hautemama

Madsommer, ITA w/ Princesstutu. Go au naturel! Of course, I can't give you any personal experience -my hair has been stick straight all my life, but DD's kindergarten teacher is Afican Puerto Rican, her hair is cropped super short. I wouldn't say she's "pretty". Her look is stunning and regal.
Thanks so much, Princesstutu for your response. Wouldn't it be transformative for our society to trade bodies/likenesses for a few days? Teaching DD to be appreciative of her own unique beauty and qualities will be a task for sure. I try my best to be project a healthy self image, and reject society's idea of beauty/feminism. Is it too early to have that talk, that what the mainstream media sells as "beautifull" is rooted in sexism, racism, and classism? All those "isms" ...Don't get me started on Disney







. Recently DD1 wanted a Hannah Montana t-shirt w/ HM's likeness holding her fingers in the peace sign (which is actually the sign for victory), so I looked at the shirt, saw it was made in China, and told DD sorry, but I just won't get it for her. MIL was there and she rolled her eyes and bought it. When DD asked me why I didn't want her to have it, I asked her how much peace did that peice buy? It went over DD's head and I just let it go, but MIL was still there, and she was up for an argument. Why am I so hell bent on pushing my ideals on a child, she asks. Well, my conscience tells me I can't live otherwise, because then everything I teach my child is a lie, a hypocrasy. It's like the person we've all heard start off a sentence "Im not racist but..." People say they want peace, and they wear that necklace, that shirt, made in a sweat shop. Made in China. The Chinese, who oppress Tibet, who support Sudan who in turn support the Janjaweed. So, I asked MIL, how much peace did that peice buy?


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## princesstutu

*1hautemama*, it is NEVER too early to teach our children the truth and how to act compassionately toward our planet and fellow earthlings. If I were you, I'd sit with my daughter, comfort her with massage/playing with her hair/whatever she likes, and talk about these things. Your dd is 8yo, right? She's old enough to understand if you talk in the way she can grasp. Use easier to understand language. Like what you wrote above.









You don't have to label the "isms" to discuss them. I've been talking to my kids about these things since they were born, probably, b/c I tend to talk whether or not I have an audience. My 5yo likes Hannah Montana. I won't let her watch the show or wear it. She knows why, too. That's why she asks her dad.







Her dad is lazy, altho he supposedly agrees with me on this type of mental colonializing.

*madsommer*, I guess I'd have to know more about your hair. Can you do braids while it grows out? That's what a friend of mine did. I don't do braids b/c I can't stand tightness on my head and I don't trust ppl with my hair. Otherwise, I'd use them to grow my hair out, too. You can do twists, bantu knots.

As my hair grows out, I tend to prefer the wild look. Wild, wavy hair really does it for me. I just tie a bandana or scarf around my head and go about my bizness.


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## 1hautemama

LOL I talk/rant to the plants too







. DD asked me once -momma, are you talking to yourself or am I supposed to answer? I like your expression "mental colonializing". I also call it the Disney Lobotomy... DH is pretty supportive of my anti Hannah Montana/Disney stance. But she's moved on to another obsession, something about a hot vampire...twilight? Anyone know what that is?
BTW, I didn't know the creator of Oyin Handmade is an MDC momma till today browsing through past posts. Funk Butter ROCKS!!!


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
I want to make another attempt at going natural. I tried once last year, but after about 4 months gave in and got a relaxer again. I need more resources and information about how to transition. Before I was just curling my hair every night in order to hide the new growth....but then something happened and my hair stopped curling?! It was weird. That was when I went and got a relaxer.

I will admit that I am not the best when it comes to hair care. I have never been one of the girls that cares a ton about her hair (unless I have it cut into a really short style and then I have to work with it so I don't look too bad lol). Anywho, anyone have any website recommendations or personal experience?

I have been natural almost 10 years locked for 5. I transitioned by using braids and extensions until I just got tired and did the big chop. It seems you are in the Chicagoland area? I am from Chicago and I know there are a lot of braid shops where you can get some braids that will last a while, that is the simplest way to start out.

It will take some time to get used to your natural texture, believe me I know...I was the sista at the shop getting my hair washed every Friday and touched up every 6 weeks. My hair was in the budget like a light bill so I know how hard it is.

I will also say that nappturality.com is a great resource for natural hair, best online site IMO for Black hair. I remember when Dee started that sight, we had been on a few earlier sites. I also know in Chicago there are some nice natural salons. I went to Amazon right before I started my locks 5.5 years ago, they are on the southside and they do amazing work wth natural hair, pricey but worth it.

Shay


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
you can get some braids that will last a while, that is the simplest way to start out.

I will also say that nappturality.com is a great resource for natural hair, best online site IMO for Black hair.

Shay


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## AndrewsMother

I have never attempted to grow a relaxer out of my hair. I have done the big chop three times. Twice to rid myself of the relaxer and most recently to rid my hair of dry damaged ends. Each time being almost bald is a shock, but my hair grows somewhat quickly so the agony is short lived.

I have worn braids (micros) three times in 8 years, and I am contemplating a fourth, but I just don't like braids. They are easy to maintain and easy to style, but when I want to dress up I just don't feel dressy with braids.

I enjoy having natural hair, because it is versatile. I can wear my hair, straight, curly, wavy or fluffy in the same week, but I prefer to wear it parted down the middle in two plaits that are pinned up on either side of my head.

I guess that I really don't have any transitioning advice other than keep your hair moisturized and oiled. I wash my hair daily or atleast every other day and apply lots of coconut oil mixed with other random oils. Every time that I try something new or different I experience catastrophic results.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *princesstutu* 
*madsommer*, I guess I'd have to know more about your hair. Can you do braids while it grows out? That's what a friend of mine did. I don't do braids b/c I can't stand tightness on my head and I don't trust ppl with my hair. Otherwise, I'd use them to grow my hair out, too. You can do twists, bantu knots.

As my hair grows out, I tend to prefer the wild look. Wild, wavy hair really does it for me. I just tie a bandana or scarf around my head and go about my bizness.

My hair has always been rather thick. I too hate the tightness of braids - my scalp is really tender. I need to look at some pictures of twists...this is what my mom said she plans to do. I want the natural look. I don't really care what my hair looks like...and I have no expectations for it. I just want to get rid of the relaxed hair and get to a natural state.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
It seems you are in the Chicagoland area? I am from Chicago and I know there are a lot of braid shops where you can get some braids that will last a while, that is the simplest way to start out.

I will also say that nappturality.com is a great resource for natural hair, best online site IMO for Black hair. I remember when Dee started that sight, we had been on a few earlier sites. I also know in Chicago there are some nice natural salons. I went to Amazon right before I started my locks 5.5 years ago, they are on the southside and they do amazing work wth natural hair, pricey but worth it.

Shay

Thanks for the link! I will check it out. I currently live in the West Suburbs, so I'm not too inclined to travel very far with a young toddler. We are hoping to move to the city's northside pretty soon, so hopefully I can find some places in the city that will be helpful.

*rootzdawta* Just wanted to say that my son was born on 12.29.07 too









Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I have never attempted to grow a relaxer out of my hair. I have done the big chop three times. Twice to rid myself of the relaxer and most recently to rid my hair of dry damaged ends. Each time being almost bald is a shock, but my hair grows somewhat quickly so the agony is short lived.

I guess that I really don't have any transitioning advice other than keep your hair moisturized and oiled. I wash my hair daily or atleast every other day and apply lots of coconut oil mixed with other random oils. Every time that I try something new or different I experience catastrophic results.

How long was your hair when you made the big chop? I'll need to see if I can find some of those oils. My hair is quite thick and dry, so it needs all the moisture it can possibly get (I think this may have been my downfall in the earlier attempt). Right now, due to pregnancy hormones, my hair is growing really well so I'm pretty motivate to make the change now while my hair is a little healthier.

Thanks for the tips so far ladies!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 

How long was your hair when you made the big chop? I'll need to see if I can find some of those oils. My hair is quite thick and dry, so it needs all the moisture it can possibly get (I think this may have been my downfall in the earlier attempt). Right now, due to pregnancy hormones, my hair is growing really well so I'm pretty motivate to make the change now while my hair is a little healthier.

Thanks for the tips so far ladies!

The first time(2002) my hair was shoulder length, the 2ndtime(2005) maybe two inches or so longer and the third time (2008) it was almost bra strap length. These lenghth were with my hair straighted. When in it's natural state my hair was almost sholder length.

2006, one year and two months later.

2006, one year and three months later with a ponytail pulled back without coming out my hair. I love the length versatility of natural hair!

I will post a picture of my hair length in 2004 about 2 years after the first big chop after DH wakes up. I don't know how to access those pictures.

My scalp is pretty oily, but my hair is dry. I think that attmepting to become a prodcut junkie is what dried out my hair and damaged my ends. Since 2002 I had used nothing but coconut oil on my hair when it was natural. Trying out recommendations from friends about great products was not a good idea. I should have known this, because my hair care routine is so different from theirs. My hair thrives when washed daily and most others complain that washing their hair often dries it out. In the past I just cheap coconut hair grease from Sally's or Target. Now I use real coconut oil mixed with 7 other ingrdients. So far so good. If I notice any dryness I will not hesitate to go back to the cheap stuff no matter how much petrolatum it contains.

I also use black gel to keep my hair from frizzing. I don't care for the wild look on my head. It looks okay on others, but not for me!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 

Thanks for the link! I will check it out. I currently live in the West Suburbs, so I'm not too inclined to travel very far with a young toddler. We are hoping to move to the city's northside pretty soon, so hopefully I can find some places in the city that will be helpful.

How long was your hair when you made the big chop? I'll need to see if I can find some of those oils. My hair is quite thick and dry, so it needs all the moisture it can possibly get (I think this may have been my downfall in the earlier attempt). Right now, due to pregnancy hormones, my hair is growing really well so I'm pretty motivate to make the change now while my hair is a little healthier.

Thanks for the tips so far ladies!

Let me know when you move to the northside and I can give you some names of places. Its been 7 years since I lived in Chicago but I still have family and friends there. I am almost certain there are probably a ton of african braiding shops still down on Broadway, some are good, some are bad.

If you were interested in twists, then Amazon would be the place to go. I had 2 strand twists done there and and used them later as the base to start my locks. Its an amazing salon.

When I first when natural, I had almost shoulder length hair but ended up after several months using braids and extensions going for the big chop. I cut it down to 2 inches and wore that for almost a year, I loved having my hair that short though dh did not like it so much. It was also a good place to start as far as getting to know my hair, I found transitioning hard and eventually just wanted to do it.

A lot of oils you need can probably be found at a HFS. Good luck!


----------



## kimiij

When I first went natural, I wore braids for 2 months and then I did the Big Chop. I did not have the patience to wait for my hair to be 6 inches long to cut off the relaxed part. When I did the Big Chop, they took most of my growth away anyway and my hair was very very short. I loved it though! It was during the summer and I walked to work, so I would wash my hair each day and it would be dry by the time I arrived at work.

I also liked that I was able to learn about my hair as it grew out. I didn't suddenly have 6 inches of hair that I had to figure out how to comb.

I recommend nappturality.com also- it's a great resource for new and transitioning naturals. I don't go there much anymore but I loved it when I was first figuring things out.

If you do transition, I recommend staying away from heat. You don't want to damage that new growth! Straw sets are a great idea. Good luck!


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
2006, one year and two months later.





[URL=http://http//www.facebook.com/...ew=global&sub[/URL] j=594221775&id=1149286716
For some reason the links did not work...would you mind reposting? Thanks!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* [URL=https://www.mothering.com/community/forum/post/13652670]


I did not have the patience to wait for my hair to be 6 inches long to cut off the relaxed part.

I don't have the patience for it either! I'm going to keep researching and see what I think will work best for me.


----------



## Yinsum

It's been almost 15 years since I have been natural. When I decided to go I did not want to lose the length so I did an extreme move. I washed my hair with apple cider vinegar; it strips the relaxer from the hair shaft. I don't recommend this unless you follow with lots of moisturizing. I mean lots of moisturizing. I was still working in the corporate world at the time, so I found an old school beautician who would hard press my hair. I know not good, but it was the beginning of a transition and learning to love the beauty of my hair. From that stage I started doing bantu knots over the weekend and pulling them out for the work week.
My next transition was 2 strand twist. And occasionally I would take them out and just wear the frizzy look from that process. Now I have been with my locs for 8 years


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yinsum* 
I washed my hair with apple cider vinegar; it strips the relaxer from the hair shaft.

I had not heard of this before...I may have to try that out. I'm in desperate need of a wash but trying to wait until I figure out what my plan of action is


----------



## Yinsum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
I had not heard of this before...I may have to try that out. I'm in desperate need of a wash but trying to wait until I figure out what my plan of action is









It works, but the major downside is that it STRIPS your hair. So be prepared to do some major moisture infusion afterward. I don't regret doing it. I was ready to shake loose the relaxer.


----------



## AndrewsMother

It is impossible to actually remove a relaxer/permanment/or any chemical from the hair, because it pentrates the cortex and changes the structure of the hair shaft. Using vinegar is actually further breaking down the hair causing it to dry out even more and it appears to be of a texture similar to relaxed hair.

Yinsum is correct in saying that you will need a lot of moisture on your hair, otherwise it will break off unevenely and force you to do the bigh chop that you are dreading.


----------



## shayinme

Speaking of hair, do any of you live in New England? I am up in Maine but need to get some TLC for my locks, as you can imagine there isn't much for Black salons in Maine. Technically we have 2 but one is horrible, she had no idea how to manage natural hair and this was before I locked my hair. I'm not holding out much luck for the other place.

I had my locks started as a place in Boston, I wasn't in love with the place and was hoping to see of anyone was in New England and had any natural hair salon recommendations.

I have posted on nappturality before and didn't have much luck.


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## ~gilli~

Good Morning Ladies!

I too, have been wearing my hair in locs for about nine years now and love it. I really did not mind the short stage because I was rocking the hats and scarves. My locs are down my back now and I was thinking of trimming them, because I really, really hate spit-up in my hair, lol!


----------



## chanibell

Hey ya'll,

Now I know this group isn't still taking about hair







LOL

I'm reading this great book called Paris Noir and its a very interesting book about AA moving to Paris after the war. Has anyone read it? Has anyone been to Paris and what was your experience as an AA woman?

blessings
Chani


----------



## Arike

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Hey ya'll,

Now I know this group isn't still taking about hair







LOL

I'm reading this great book called Paris Noir and its a very interesting book about AA moving to Paris after the war. Has anyone read it? Has anyone been to Paris and what was your experience as an AA woman?

blessings
Chani

I lived in Paris and it was definitely an interesting experience! As an AA woman, no one thought I was AA. They assumed I was French West Indian and when I spoke french and they heard my anglophone accent, they thought I was british, trinidadian or jamaican. I also had people who thought I was african(from french speaking countries) There is definitely an exotic factor to being black in france, men of all races were very interested.







Boy do I have some stories...LOL







In france, I feel like having a black woman on your arm is like having a trophy wife.







Overall it was a good experience. I would love to live in Paris again but france's economy sucks and it's really hard to get a job there without an EU passport. Their unemployment rate is pretty high too. I have a friend who is a lawyer who works in Paris but with an american company. Oh Paris...


----------



## kimiij

Arike - you're making me want to move to Paris
















:







:


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1hautemama* 
Hello, mamas, I've never posted here but have been chewing on a dilemma DD1 is dealing with at school and at times within the family...I am not of African descent, but I hope I am welcome. I am half Korean half caucasion. I have never related totally to either side. The Koreans in my community were/are very ethnocentric. I was often teased for being so "American", talking/acting like a white girl, but they also said how lucky I am for not having eyes that were so slanted, I was a banana, yellow on the outside white inside







. Hmm. On the other hand at school some of the meaner kids taunted me for being a "****", *****, often asked me to say something in Korean and Im ashamed to say I obliged just to make nice. The prizewinner, a boy once told me his uncle claimed to know first hand that "Oriental" women have slanted vaginas...It didn't matter that I'm half caucasion, it wann't good enough for them. Aside from dealing with this sort of stuff, my traumas were not that bad. I never thought I held onto this stuff till DD1 starting talking about the kids teasing her in kindergarten. I foolishly thought it's not a big deal. Tried to brush it aside. Then DD1 tells me one day (a few years ago) she didn't want her face anymore, she wanted a different face. Her classmates make fun of her eyes, ask her if she's Chinese. I tell her to let them know she is an American, and if they continue to be mean to not acknowledge them, at all, ever. I am confounded by this, first, because she attends a school that is mostly Hispanic and AA. She does not look "white". Like me, she has dark hair, dark eyes, olive skin and after a little sun DH calls us brown berries. I don't feel like I am in a good place to advise her since she has come into contact with more of the trouble makers lately. I feel the anger eating at me, and I realize the way I dealt with the teasers and taunts was by lashing out. I realize now that as much as I have tried to teach my girls love and respect for all races, I harbor a deep seated hatred and anger. My DH, when we were discussing w/ DD's teacher last week, remarked that it was not all that different from the way kids taunted him for being red headed and covered in freckles. Come again? I can't even begin to fathom an argument w/DH right now. I dunno, maybe it WAS painfull as child being amongst his white peers w/ all that red hair and freckles. I can't relate to that. And he can't relate/appreciate what I and DD1 put up with. I remember now trying to prove my "white cred" to my caucasion peers, then going to church the very next Sunday trying to prove my "Koreaness" to please the elders.
Now I've spent years running the other way, away from being Korean or white or whatever that those things are in the past and my children's lives are going to be different. We have a new president, despite all the rabid haters, all those fear mongers on FOX, we have moved forward. Haven't we?BUt none of that matters to my daughter right this second. Right now more than anything in this world she wants to look like Hannah Montana. Then all those kids would like her at school. It's no longer enough for her to respond "im a little bit of this a little bit of that". Right now Im a walking ball of anger and resentment. Where did I go wrong? Sorry for the book.

1Hautemama, welcome. I'm 1/2 Korean (but half Black, too). I know how you feel. I know what you mean about having to prove "(insert color here) cred" and also proving Koreanness to elders. On one hand, I'm supposed to be very Korean in my manners when around my Korean relatives, but then when I was in HS, I was never black enough. Things are better now that I'm an adult and don't care, but I don't know how things are going to be for my son.
As for your DH, I agree with you- it's NOT the same as being teased for being a redhead. There's obviously a racial element to being teased for having olive skin, almond eyes, etc...
Anyway, hugs.


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## Jannah6

*1hautemama* many many







s, I know what you are going through. My DD's attend a predominately Arab school and have faced issues with their braided hair because they are different. I guess one or two braids is acceptable, but a whole head







My DH and I have just tried to point out that everyone is created differently. It didn't help though. When the teasing happened to DD1 her teacher spoke to the class, but I don't know if it sunk in. So when it happened to DD2 we didn't bother mentioning it to her teacher until the parent teachers night. She told us that we should have said something earlier. I didn't brother telling her that we had BTDT.
When DH and I discussed the issue among ourselves, he likened it to his being teased for having big ears. I had to tell him that it was absolutely not the same thing, but he wasn't convinced.
For a while neither of my DD's wanted braids, but they are o.k with them now. The teasing has stopped and their classmates just accept that this is the way their hair is.
Writing and thinking about it now, I probably could have done more. Maybe I should have asked to speak to my childrens class and written a note to the parents? I think both times I was a little shell shocked and angry that my DD's were going through this.
I am soooo sorry that your DD is going through this. I hope that you guys find peace soon.


----------



## nnaemeka

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Speaking of hair, do any of you live in New England? I am up in Maine but need to get some TLC for my locks, as you can imagine there isn't much for Black salons in Maine. Technically we have 2 but one is horrible, she had no idea how to manage natural hair and this was before I locked my hair. I'm not holding out much luck for the other place.

I had my locks started as a place in Boston, I wasn't in love with the place and was hoping to see of anyone was in New England and had any natural hair salon recommendations.

I have posted on nappturality before and didn't have much luck.

peace Shayinme,

my sister is in Boston and she is a natural hair care professional. her info is here: http://www.sisterlocks.com/WebPages/Martine.html and here's an article about her work: http://www.boston.com/news/local/art...m_with_new_do/
she has clients from all over---i'm not the only one who thinks she's fabulous!
she does sisterlocs as well as grooms traditional dreads/locks.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nnaemeka* 
peace Shayinme,

my sister is in Boston and she is a natural hair care professional. her info is here: http://www.sisterlocks.com/WebPages/Martine.html and here's an article about her work: http://www.boston.com/news/local/art...m_with_new_do/
she has clients from all over---i'm not the only one who thinks she's fabulous!
she does sisterlocs as well as grooms traditional dreads/locks.









Thank-you, I will contact her. I actually had run across her when doing a google search but figured she only did sisterlocks. Sadly Boston has very little in the way of natural shops, I had my locks started at a shop there but was never really happy which is why I started freeforming. Its just that now I have a serious dread-fro and I don't care for it so much. So I need the new growth to be married into my existing locks.


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## eilonwy

Those Sisterlocks look fantastic! I never thought I'd see a locking style that might actually work on my hair! *sigh* If only there was someone in Lancaster, so I could send my sister to talk with her. One of my nieces has been asking for locs for years (my sister just permed her hair again














and they could probably agree on those.


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## Draupadi

I've thought about loc-ing my hair for almost a decade now. My own brother has locs past his butt!








DH doesn't think I'd look good with locs (he likes my curly hair) and I'm not sure how they'd take to my hair either. My hair is curly and thick but really very fine. I don't know.
It's such a commitment, isn't it?


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
Arike - you're making me want to move to Paris
















:







:

Ditto! My husband and I decided that if we win the mega millions we'll move abroad. France is on the top of our list.

My mom wanted to get sister-locks too, but my father didn't like the look. I've decided to just go ahead and let my hair do it's thing. I'll justkeep washing and moisturizing until I can get enough new growth to do the big chop. It's growing pretty quickly right now with the pre-natals I'm taking so I think right after the baby is born would be a perfect time (when the PP hair-loss starts anyway). I'm actually kind of excited about being free from the hair (I always liked wearing my hair short).


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## Jannah6

I've been on the fence about locs. I have really thick hair and would probably need locs to be done on a weekly basis. I know that I'm not committed to do that and can't see going to a salon on a weekly basis. I'm really feeling those sisterlocks though







. A few years back I actually saw a woman with sisterlocks, but didn't know they were called that. Her hair looked beautiful.

A couple of people mentioned hair texture. My aunt has fine hair and the first time she tried to loc her hair it didn't work. The second time it took, she had her locs for ten years before she cut them off. There is also a German woman that attends the toddler storytime at the local library and her hair is locked, so it can be done. *Draupadi*, my cousin has hair like yours and she sported locs for a few years, but I didn't really like it . It was like her hair didn't know if it wanted to be locked,curly, or straight. She probably should have gone to someone who really specialized in locs. I guess it's not really an issue though, cuz if your DH likes your hair the way it is then that's the look for you


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## bajamergrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
I've been on the fence about locs. I have really thick hair and would probably need locs to be done on a weekly basis. I know that I'm not committed to do that and can't see going to a salon on a weekly basis.

I was on the fence for years but last fall I decided to take the plunge and I haven't regretted it. My Dh and I are both growing out our locks at the same time and we do maintenance on each other's head. I've always taken care of my own hair so I never went to salons very much. If you decide to take the plunge maybe you can learn about how to self-manage or start off going to a salon and then learn how to do it yourself.


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## ~gilli~

Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!


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## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!

heeheehee!! oh boy. congrats on returning to playing! Oh gosh, I have a dance performance in June and I'm terrified I'll leak! I'll have to get some real pads, not those annoying plastic backed things that dont even stay in place. I'd rather leak than wear those things







:


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## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!

That's hilarious!


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## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!









: I think that most breastfeeding women have a story like that... or three.


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## futurmama8

Bloomingstar can I just say you are freaking beautiful!! You have a cute little family.

Back on topic:

My mother started her own locks about 9 years ago. They aren't organic locs but they are kind of small and they are down to her butt. Half of my family is Rastafarian and they have organic locs that are just beautiful. I think I will lock at some point then cut it off and start all over again with the fro.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!

That is too funny!








Congrats on gigging again. That is wonderful









I, too have thought about locs. My hair is growing back in after my health issues. My plan is to sport an afro this summer and then transition to locs after months of conditioning. I'm fortunate in that I live close to philly where there are plenty of natural stylists and loctians.


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## Jannah6

There will be a breastfeeding awareness brunch at Restoration Plaza tomorrow(Fri) from 11am-1:30p.m.

1368 Fulton St
Brooklyn, NY 11216


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## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 









Bloomingstar can I just say you are freaking beautiful!! You have a cute little family.

Back on topic:

My mother started her own locks about 9 years ago. They aren't organic locs but they are kind of small and they are down to her butt. Half of my family is Rastafarian and they have organic locs that are just beautiful. I think I will lock at some point then cut it off and start all over again with the fro.

awww thank you so much!









So do any of you cloth diaper your LOs? I decided to just do it! I'd gotten some before the baby was born but I was sooo wiped out after the birth and it was still freezing and we have to use a laundromat so...disposables it was. Then he outgrew everything! I sold the stuff I had online and got ones he'll fit. I just got back from the laundromat--been there all day prepping the prefolds--and there were two older ladies there who figured out that the things I had were diapers and the were reminiscing about cloth diapering with the gerber flat ones. Part of me was terrified someone would sound an alarm about me washing diapers







but they were nice. I have a sprayer and a contraption called a wonder washer to use before taking things to the laundromat anyway.

All that to say: do you all cloth diaper and does everyone think you're a nut or say "good luck" with lots of snark? Older women--my stepmother, the laundromat ladies--are nice but anyone under 40, forget it!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
There will be a breastfeeding awareness brunch at Restoration Plaza tomorrow(Fri) from 11am-1:30p.m.

1368 Fulton St
Brooklyn, NY 11216

where in there is it? I think I will try to make it!


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## Sorin

Hello, Ladies. Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm still not quite sure if MDC is the place for me, but for an intro post, the "Women of Color" thread is a no-brainer.

I'm from and currently live in Chicago and have been married to DH for 5 years. Currently, we have no children, but if the plumbing works, we plan on making the steps to change that by the end of this year. We will both be "older" first-time parents--I'll be 36 this year and DH will be 40--but that is not at all unusual for the line of work I am in (I'm in academia). I hate labels, and eschew subscribing to any "philosophies," so I do not anticipate becoming an "AP" parent or a "mainstream" parent. I definitely plan on trying to breastfeed (and I have a lot of family support since both my mother and my MIL breastfed their babies), I might try cloth diapers (my mother used them on me), and I will definitely be a WOH momma. However, that's about all I can say at this point. I'll just tackle the other stuff when it gets here.

I stopped taking the pill a few weeks ago and am learning how to track my fertility, so I'm really quite excited! I never desired kids until now, but for job-related reasons we still have to delay until the fall/winter to begin to TTC. I can't wait!

Anyway, I just wanted to pop in and introduce myself. Sorry I can't contribute to the current hair conversation because I have a relaxer and love it! (Can I say that here?







) My hair is shoulder-length and in fantastic shape, so if any sisters out there want tips on how to keep relaxed hair healthy, I can help!

Oh, and DH and I are both Af-Am---did I say that?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sorin* 
Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm still not quite sure if MDC is the place for me,


Welcome Sorin. There are many times when I am not sure if MDC is the place for me, but I learn so much by lurking.

I always begin to respond to posts, but I don't have the time or inclination to write a thesis to a question about a two year old, so I cancel my reply and continue with my lurking.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sorin* 
Hello, Ladies. Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm still not quite sure if MDC is the place for me, but for an intro post, the "Women of Color" thread is a no-brainer.

I'm from and currently live in Chicago and have been married to DH for 5 years. Currently, we have no children, but if the plumbing works, we plan on making the steps to change that by the end of this year. We will both be "older" first-time parents--I'll be 36 this year and DH will be 40--but that is not at all unusual for the line of work I am in (I'm in academia). I hate labels, and eschew subscribing to any "philosophies," so I do not anticipate becoming an "AP" parent or a "mainstream" parent. I definitely plan on trying to breastfeed (and I have a lot of family support since both my mother and my MIL breastfed their babies), I might try cloth diapers (my mother used them on me), and I will definitely be a WOH momma. However, that's about all I can say at this point. I'll just tackle the other stuff when it gets here.

I stopped taking the pill a few weeks ago and am learning how to track my fertility, so I'm really quite excited! I never desired kids until now, but for job-related reasons we still have to delay until the fall/winter to begin to TTC. I can't wait!

Anyway, I just wanted to pop in and introduce myself. Sorry I can't contribute to the current hair conversation because I have a relaxer and love it! (Can I say that here?







) My hair is shoulder-length and in fantastic shape, so if any sisters out there want tips on how to keep relaxed hair healthy, I can help!

Oh, and DH and I are both Af-Am---did I say that?









Welcome







:


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## ishereal

Hello mommas! I haven't been here much but I am stopping by to say hi and check in. I am moving to Dallas, TX from St. Louis, MO next week and it's so chaotic right now!!!!


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hello mommas! I haven't been here much but I am stopping by to say hi and check in. I am moving to Dallas, TX from St. Louis, MO next week and it's so chaotic right now!!!!


Wow! good luck mama. Check in when you are able.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
awww thank you so much!









So do any of you cloth diaper your LOs? I decided to just do it! I'd gotten some before the baby was born but I was sooo wiped out after the birth and it was still freezing and we have to use a laundromat so...disposables it was. Then he outgrew everything! I sold the stuff I had online and got ones he'll fit. I just got back from the laundromat--been there all day prepping the prefolds--and there were two older ladies there who figured out that the things I had were diapers and the were reminiscing about cloth diapering with the gerber flat ones. Part of me was terrified someone would sound an alarm about me washing diapers







but they were nice. I have a sprayer and a contraption called a wonder washer to use before taking things to the laundromat anyway.

All that to say: do you all cloth diaper and does everyone think you're a nut or say "good luck" with lots of snark? Older women--my stepmother, the laundromat ladies--are nice but anyone under 40, forget it!

where in there is it? I think I will try to make it!









Bloominstar the breastfeeding awareness event is at Restoration Plaza www.restorationplaza.org 1368 Fulton St Brooklyn, NY 11216.

I do cloth diaper and I haven't gotten any ill responses. Some people that I know think that I'm "weird" anyway, so. Once while at the park a 20 something yr old lady figured out that I was CD DS and asked me about it. She was quite interested. Me, I pretty much have a don't care attitude. People are going to say what they say, but they don't live my life KWIM? I'm not CD DS anymore because I don't have the funds for a stash right now. I CD Safiyyah, but sometimes I do put sposies on her if I'm feeling really tired/lazy.


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Welcome Sorin.

I always begin to respond to posts, but I don't have the time or inclination to write a thesis to a question about a two year old, so I cancel my reply and continue with my lurking.

You sound like me









*WELCOME* *Sorin*
I hope the move goes well *Ishereal*


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
So do any of you cloth diaper your LOs? I decided to just do it! I'd gotten some before the baby was born but I was sooo wiped out after the birth and it was still freezing and we have to use a laundromat so...disposables it was. Then he outgrew everything! I sold the stuff I had online and got ones he'll fit. I just got back from the laundromat--been there all day prepping the prefolds--and there were two older ladies there who figured out that the things I had were diapers and the were reminiscing about cloth diapering with the gerber flat ones. Part of me was terrified someone would sound an alarm about me washing diapers







but they were nice. I have a sprayer and a contraption called a wonder washer to use before taking things to the laundromat anyway.

All that to say: do you all cloth diaper and does everyone think you're a nut or say "good luck" with lots of snark? Older women--my stepmother, the laundromat ladies--are nice but anyone under 40, forget it!


Well my babies are out of diapers but I did use cloth, never got any flack from anyone. I don't really have any family aside from my Dad and brother and neither ever said much one way or the other. As far as others, most of the parents I know are into cloth so it wasn't a biggie. I suppose if my Mama were alive she probably would have thought it curious.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sorin* 
Hello, Ladies. Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm still not quite sure if MDC is the place for me, but for an intro post, the "Women of Color" thread is a no-brainer.

I'm from and currently live in Chicago and have been married to DH for 5 years. Currently, we have no children, but if the plumbing works, we plan on making the steps to change that by the end of this year. We will both be "older" first-time parents--I'll be 36 this year and DH will be 40--but that is not at all unusual for the line of work I am in (I'm in academia). I hate labels, and eschew subscribing to any "philosophies," so I do not anticipate becoming an "AP" parent or a "mainstream" parent. I definitely plan on trying to breastfeed (and I have a lot of family support since both my mother and my MIL breastfed their babies), I might try cloth diapers (my mother used them on me), and I will definitely be a WOH momma. However, that's about all I can say at this point. I'll just tackle the other stuff when it gets here.

I stopped taking the pill a few weeks ago and am learning how to track my fertility, so I'm really quite excited! I never desired kids until now, but for job-related reasons we still have to delay until the fall/winter to begin to TTC. I can't wait!

Anyway, I just wanted to pop in and introduce myself. Sorry I can't contribute to the current hair conversation because I have a relaxer and love it! (Can I say that here?







) My hair is shoulder-length and in fantastic shape, so if any sisters out there want tips on how to keep relaxed hair healthy, I can help!

Oh, and DH and I are both Af-Am---did I say that?









Welcome!







: Chicago is my hometown, I left 7 years ago, still miss it. Nothing wrong with a relaxer, I had one for years and my hair was actually in great shape when relaxed, I stopped relaxing partially because I was planning to move to Maine which meant no shop to go to, also was tired of spending a ton of cash on my hair. However as I like to say when I was relaxed, my hair stayed straight and I mean that in both ways. Overall I like my locks but sometimes miss the bob I used to rock.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hello mommas! I haven't been here much but I am stopping by to say hi and check in. I am moving to Dallas, TX from St. Louis, MO next week and it's so chaotic right now!!!!

Happy moving! May it go safe and not be too stressful.

I'm doing well, just a minor bout of depression but have started taking yoga which is nice. Its mostly financial woes that have me down but it will pass. The farmers market opens this weekend so I am getting excited, otherwise I am hanging in there.

Shay


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## ishereal

It's good to hear all of you are doing well, I am nervous about the move. I have to find like minded mothers that I can link up with and I think I have given up on trying to find like minded w.o.c (sad but true) .......


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## DanaDane

hi ladies--

Just wanted to introduce myself--new member (joined in March but only just got around to posting today). I'm not even a mom yet---but we're planning on adding to our family in the next couple of years. I am currently a full-time student--I worked for several years in the DC area.

What else . .. oh yes--I am a woman of color--born and raised in LA, but have lived a lot of different places--and my dh and I are currently living in NC.

Happy to see this section of the board---now I need to go and read to catch up!


----------



## DanaDane

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
It is impossible to actually remove a relaxer/permanment/or any chemical from the hair, because it pentrates the cortex and changes the structure of the hair shaft. Using vinegar is actually further breaking down the hair causing it to dry out even more and it appears to be of a texture similar to relaxed hair.

Yinsum is correct in saying that you will need a lot of moisture on your hair, otherwise it will break off unevenely and force you to do the bigh chop that you are dreading.

Yes--the only thing I use vinegar for (specifically very diluted apple cider vinegar) is to either further neutralize my hair after relaxer application and---every once in a while to clarify--but yeah, the moisture/protein balance is definitely the key. Many have too little or too much of one or the other causing breakage.

I am sort of into hair---here is my hair album: http://members.fotki.com/DanaBash/about/

I am relaxed---mild only---but I have wrestled with whether or not to go natural. There are some great hair albums out there with ladies who are natural that talk a lot about what products/techniques to use to help the transition.


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DanaDane* 
hi ladies--

Just wanted to introduce myself--new member (joined in March but only just got around to posting today). I'm not even a mom yet---but we're planning on adding to our family in the next couple of years. I am currently a full-time student--I worked for several years in the DC area.

What else . .. oh yes--I am a woman of color--born and raised in LA, but have lived a lot of different places--and my dh and I are currently living in NC.

Happy to see this section of the board---now I need to go and read to catch up!









welcome.


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## oyinmama

happy mother's day to all! it's been fun catching up - welcome to the new mamas, and those new to this thread. hope everyone's day is full of laughs and love!

http://web3.twitpic.com/img/8267226-...6f4be-full.jpg


----------



## Yinsum

Happy Mother's Day!


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~gilli~* 
Good morning everyone!

So, I started playing music again! I had a gig with my band for Cinco de Mayo, and I'm standing at the bar with the drummer. After the gig, I noticed people looking my way because I was all that...nope! Just staring at the HUGE milk stain on my red shirt!







: So much for thinking I was cute,lol!

LOL. Too funny! I've had a couple incidents like that myself.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Welcome Sorin. There are many times when I am not sure if MDC is the place for me, but I learn so much by lurking.

I feel the same way sometimes. I was just thinking today about taking a break - at least from posting. But I do learn a lot from reading many of the posts.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sorin* 
Hello, Ladies. Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm still not quite sure if MDC is the place for me, but for an intro post, the "Women of Color" thread is a no-brainer.

I'm from and currently live in Chicago and have been married to DH for 5 years. Currently, we have no children, but if the plumbing works, we plan on making the steps to change that by the end of this year. We will both be "older" first-time parents--I'll be 36 this year and DH will be 40--but that is not at all unusual for the line of work I am in (I'm in academia). I hate labels, and eschew subscribing to any "philosophies," so I do not anticipate becoming an "AP" parent or a "mainstream" parent. I definitely plan on trying to breastfeed (and I have a lot of family support since both my mother and my MIL breastfed their babies), I might try cloth diapers (my mother used them on me), and I will definitely be a WOH momma. However, that's about all I can say at this point. I'll just tackle the other stuff when it gets here.

Welcome! What part of the chicago area are you in? DH and I currently are in the west suburbs...I'm always looking for some new friends







Heck - just ONE friend really...we just moved here about 10 months ago.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ishereal* 
Hello mommas! I haven't been here much but I am stopping by to say hi and check in. I am moving to Dallas, TX from St. Louis, MO next week and it's so chaotic right now!!!!

Good luck on your move! I used to live in the STL area and really miss it. The city has a lot of good things to offer.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I'm doing well, just a minor bout of depression but have started taking yoga which is nice. Its mostly financial woes that have me down but it will pass. The farmers market opens this weekend so I am getting excited, otherwise I am hanging in there. Shay

I'm glad you're feeling better. I've been in the same boat...had finally found a therapist that I liked, but now I can't afford her







But getting outside with the baby has really helped. I hope things get better for you soon!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DanaDane* 
hi ladies--

Just wanted to introduce myself--new member (joined in March but only just got around to posting today). I'm not even a mom yet---but we're planning on adding to our family in the next couple of years. I am currently a full-time student--I worked for several years in the DC area.

What else . .. oh yes--I am a woman of color--born and raised in LA, but have lived a lot of different places--and my dh and I are currently living in NC.

Happy to see this section of the board---now I need to go and read to catch up!









Welcome!!

*AFM* - These two months are super busy for me...just got back from Iowa for my brother's college graduation (














and now only 3 weeks or so until TX for my BF's wedding, then my bro's wedding in MN the following week. I'm starting to get that uncomforable pregnant feeling...not even in teh 3rd tri yet...will be 22 weeks on Wednesday. Anywho, I hope everyone had a wonderful Mother's Day!


----------



## Jannah6

*Welcome Dana*
*
Madsommer*,







s. I totally know how you feel about the uncomfortable pregnancy feeling. I'm totally with you on "I will go back to school some day". I graduated HS in 1993, they actually had my HS reunion this weekend, but I didn't attend. I have 113 college credits, but right now I'm just raising my children. So, like you 'I will go back to school some day'


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
*Madsommer*,







s. I totally know how you feel about the uncomfortable pregnancy feeling. I'm totally with you on "I will go back to school some day". I graduated HS in 1993, they actually had my HS reunion this weekend, but I didn't attend. I have 113 college credits, but right now I'm just raising my children. So, like you 'I will go back to school some day'

Yeah...most days I don't think about it because I enjoy being home with my son soooo much and I'm so thankful that I get the opportunity to do so. It's just every once in a while when I feel like I'm being marginalized because I don't have a degree, or when my *younger* brother finishes before me


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
Yeah...most days I don't think about it because I enjoy being home with my son soooo much and I'm so thankful that I get the opportunity to do so. It's just every once in a while when I feel like I'm being marginalized because I don't have a degree, or when my *younger* brother finishes before me









I'm soo with you. My 17 yr old niece is graduating in June and will be starting college in the fall, so I'm like







, especially since I help raise her.


----------



## rootzdawta

Movie Trailer

What do you all think?

I'm a little annoyed that she turns into a frog. But it's cutesy, I guess.


----------



## Yinsum

I see they have worked on some of the kinks from their *original idea*
I still hesitantly await what comes of this.


----------



## bajamergrrl

I would say the new movie seems to be a giant step up from their original idea.


----------



## AndrewsMother

1) Why must she have the typical black girl attitude?

2) "this gon be good" I despise slang, especially when it falls from the lips of blacks on the silver screen, even those that are animated.

3) Why New Orleans? Hurricaine Katrina has given the city an ugly reputation, and I dubt that this movie will help.

4) Why New Orleans? Why not South Carolina?

Why can't they portray black as beautiful?


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
1) Why must she have the typical black girl attitude?

2) "this gon be good" I despise slang, especially when it falls from the lips of blacks on the silver screen, even those that are animated.

3) Why New Orleans? Hurricaine Katrina has given the city an ugly reputation, and I dubt that this movie will help.

4) Why New Orleans? Why not South Carolina?

Why can't they portray black as beautiful?

I have to say that from that brief clip I did not see her as having a
typical black girl attitude. Honestly New Orleans has a rich history, that may be one of the reasons they chose it as the setting.

Based off that clip, I would be interested in seeing it. Like Rootzdawta, it seems like a cutesy flick. My undergrad degree is is African-American studies so I am always aware of how we are presented and at least with that clip there was nothing that made me cringe or get mad.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I have to say that from that brief clip I did not see her as having a
typical black girl attitude. Honestly New Orleans has a rich history, that may be one of the reasons they chose it as the setting.

Based off that clip, I would be interested in seeing it. Like Rootzdawta, it seems like a cutesy flick. My undergrad degree is is African-American studies so I am always aware of how we are presented and at least with that clip there was nothing that made me cringe or get mad.

Yes New Orleans has a rich history, but I don't consider it to be authentically African American. Creoles are known to have a very mixed lineage. There is nothing wrong with a mixed lineage, but why can't she be more african, than African, Spanish & French, two European cultures.

You must have missed the neck roll and the hand on the hip at 1:10. I also don't understand why her prince can't be a black male. I have no problem with interracial marriages, but why can't one disney princess have a black prince?


----------



## kimiij

Nothing made me cringe but I did "notice a few things":

- Her prince is not black. I do and I don't understand why at the same time.

- She turns into a frog. Why does the black girl have to turn into a frog? lol. Although, the princess in Shrek was an ogre so maybe it really isn't a big deal.

I think it looks like it will be a really fun movie though. I don't have any problems with it being in New Orleans. New Orleans has a great history and it shouldn't be reduced to just Hurricane Katrina.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
1) Why must she have the typical black girl attitude?

2) "this gon be good" I despise slang, especially when it falls from the lips of blacks on the silver screen, even those that are animated.

3) Why New Orleans? Hurricaine Katrina has given the city an ugly reputation, and I dubt that this movie will help.

4) Why New Orleans? Why not South Carolina?

Why can't they portray black as beautiful?

That whole attitude I noticed right away...









Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Yes New Orleans has a rich history, but I don't consider it to be authentically African American. Creoles are known to have a very mixed lineage. There is nothing wrong with a mixed lineage, but why can't she be more african, than African, Spanish & French, two European cultures.

You must have missed the neck roll and the hand on the hip at 1:10. I also don't understand why her prince can't be a black male. I have no problem with interracial marriages, but why can't one disney princess have a black prince?









I still believe there are some underlying predjudices that people have since black isn't the norm...


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
Nothing made me cringe but I did "notice a few things":

- Her prince is not black. I do and I don't understand why at the same time.

- She turns into a frog. Why does the black girl have to turn into a frog? lol. Although, the princess in Shrek was an ogre so maybe it really isn't a big deal.

I think it looks like it will be a really fun movie though. I don't have any problems with it being in New Orleans. New Orleans has a great history and it shouldn't be reduced to just Hurricane Katrina.

I think that you missed my point. I think that this movie will not help the stereotype that the city gained after the hurricane. The city definitely has a pre and post hurricane perception.

My problem with New Orleans is that in literature, movies and history New Orleans is the place to go for exotic fun, something different, and this extends to women. Women who are viewed as Cyprians and mistresses to white male customers and benefactors.
And surprisingly her prince is of European descent.

So, I guess that even in animation the black man is not capable of ardor, romance, love and passion, but he can do a jive time dance.


----------



## kimiij

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I think that you missed my point. I think that this movie will not help the stereotype that the city gained after the hurricane. The city definitely has a pre and post hurricane perception.

My problem with New Orleans is that in literature, movies and history New Orleans is the place to go for exotic fun, something different, and this extends to women. Women who are viewed as Cyprians and mistresses to white male customers and benefactors.
And surprisingly her prince is of European descent.

So, I guess that even in animation the black man is not capable of ardor, romance, love and passion, but he can do a jive time dance.

I see what you're saying but I don't think that it is going to significantly alter any perceptions of New Orleans.


----------



## rootzdawta

Well, for the most part, I think Black men are still regarded with fear (well Black people in general but Black men more so). Disney has had lots of issues concerning discrimination/racism so maybe this is their first tiny baby step in the right direction? Also, had the princess been basically Snow White but Black, many would have been saying she's not real, she's not authentic, she's got no flavor. If she was an African princess, I honestly don't think it would sell and AAs would be asking why she couldn't be AA and Africans would be pissed because Africa isn't a country and the accent would suck.

I wish Black people were in more control of the images presented. But at the same time, we can't even agree on what the right image should be. All we can do is react (disjointedly) to whatever images are presented to us.


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I think that you missed my point. I think that this movie will not help the stereotype that the city gained after the hurricane. The city definitely has a pre and post hurricane perception.

*My problem with New Orleans is that in literature, movies and history New Orleans is the place to go for exotic fun, something different, and this extends to women. Women who are viewed as Cyprians and mistresses to white male customers and benefactors.*
*And surprisingly her prince is of European descent.

So, I guess that even in animation the black man is not capable of ardor, romance, love and passion, but he can do a jive time dance*.

I don't like this either. And I have a feeling that if you see the movie in its entirety, there may be more offensive imagery. However, the target age demo is not going to understand all of the things we are pointing out...but I probably still wouldn't watch it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
Well, for the most part, I think Black men are still regarded with fear (well Black people in general but Black men more so). Disney has had lots of issues concerning discrimination/racism so maybe this is their first tiny baby step in the right direction? Also, had the princess been basically Snow White but Black, many would have been saying she's not real, she's not authentic, she's got no flavor. If she was an African princess, I honestly don't think it would sell and AAs would be asking why she couldn't be AA and Africans would be pissed because Africa isn't a country and the accent would suck.

I wish Black people were in more control of the images presented. *But at the same time, we can't even agree on what the right image should be.* All we can do is react (disjointedly) to whatever images are presented to us.

ITA. It's sad.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Yes New Orleans has a rich history, but I don't consider it to be authentically African American. Creoles are known to have a very mixed lineage. There is nothing wrong with a mixed lineage, but why can't she be more african, than African, Spanish & French, two European cultures.

You must have missed the neck roll and the hand on the hip at 1:10. I also don't understand why her prince can't be a black male. I have no problem with interracial marriages, but why can't one disney princess have a black prince?

ahem ahem...

to go a little off of the frog bit, I'd have t say that I TOTALLY disagree with New Orelans creoles not being "authentically" African American, and it's not only because I am creole and from new Orleans







New Orleans may not have what is now seen as a "typical" African-American spin to its culture but I'd argue that New Orleans and its creoles have the OLDEST history and most remaining vestiges of what can be linked to the continent in the U.S.

The issue is in how the history is hidden and the mixed-ness and "exotic" tuff are all played out (which is why Disney set it there--do we REALLY expect Disney to try to have what most people would consider a "typical" African-American?). For example, people loooove to play up how the wrought iron in the architecture of the French Quarter is so European, but it's only there because the Africans who made it were iron workers, and some of the stuff--if you look at the tops of churches all throughout Louisiana, for another example--are actually Adinkra symbols. But that doesn't bring tourists. Louisiana laws are the reason that the one-drop rule still exists in peoples minds.

Okay I could go on and on but I think the point I'd really like to make is that New Orleans certainly DOES have an AUTHENTIC African-American culture, but it may not be what is TYPICALLY represented (although I'd STILL argue that many of the things people associate with black people in this country began there--music being a big factor). I do agree that black culture in New Orleans can be a lot different from the rest of the country--I learned that real quick when I left home and went to college, which is probably why I am now living in a Caribbean stronghold in Brooklyn because that feels closest to "home."

All that said, it is annoying to me that once again, a woman from New Orleans are being trotted out as this "exotic" thing. I think we've been given the VERY short end of the stick in terms of historical representations that don't highlight creole women (and let's face it, we can't even get out of the colonial period half the time) who were as African as they were anything else and furthermore worked to uplift African people in New Orleans, those who were free people of color and those who were enslaved (see someone like Henriette Delille, though you still may not actually find good info--i did a research fellowship about her in college). I think we have to also be clear that the original meaning of creole was one who was born in the colonies of parents who were African OR European (not AND). Eventually it came to mean the mixed up business, and that happened mostly when the Americans bought Louisiana territory and began imposing laws (and language and so forth) that were repressive to the culture, so the culture became more insular and people got more specific about who was who and what. "Americanness" is MORE of the historical question mark over folks from New Orleans, I'd argue, rather that "Africanness."
And of course that still traps us in oh, the early 1900s at the latest. Unless it is about music, it's like people don't even really SEE that anything even happened in New Orleans between slavery and Katrina, which is miserablly sad and given us very short shrift, but which is also a part of how the city sold itself as a tourist destination until a catastrophe happened that couldn't be spun.

Okay now I'll really stop. heh. got a little riled up


----------



## olliepop

There are dolls in the works, but it will be interesting to see if the marketing will be as pervasive as it is for the other Disney princesses. A great deal could happen between now and Summer 2010.

*"Princess Tiana dolls will be introduced in several sizes and at several price points, which will be determined by the retailers. The dolls will include a standard collector fashion doll equivalent in scale to a Barbie doll, a Tiana toddler doll, a doll that holds a talking frog, and a doll set with Tiana and Prince Naveen, her tadpole-hopping love interest post-transformation."*

*"Princess Tiana will initially stand alone and not be included with Disney products that group the princesses together until the summer of 2010 and after audiences have been fully introduced to her and her story, Franklin says."*


----------



## madsommer

*Bloomingstar* - Great post! My parents just moved to NO last year and I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE going there! But I'm also big into history and it's so rich and vibrant. My father went to LSU and he has a lot of friends and frat brothers still down there so I have had the pleasure of learning about NO and Louisiana through native eyes and it's so enlightening. A beautiful place! I would move there if it weren't for that humidity


----------



## Brown Lioness

Hi ladies! Here's a Friday feel good video, not sure if you all have seen this yet. Its VERY cute!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uMh5...layer_embedded

I had a wild pregnancy dream last night after watching this video, lol.


----------



## futurmama8

Bloomingstar you wrote:

Quote:

I'd argue that New Orleans and its creoles have the OLDEST history and most *remaining vestiges of what can be linked to the continent* in the U.S.
I don't see a *big* difference between what you and andrewsmother said. I think the culture and practices in NO are inherently African traditions brought over from the continent. I don't think it was specifically started by AA people even though it the both are connected. I hope that makes sense, for example rap is something started by AA's but it came from African traditions of storytelling.
I actually don't think people know that most of the culture within NO comes from West African culture. I think it's kind of sad though.

I can remember my mother having this tape of black fairy tales and it had snow white, rapunzel, cinderella and a lot more. I am going to ask her what it is called becaue I loved watching them and still do.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Hi ladies! Here's a Friday feel good video, not sure if you all have seen this yet. Its VERY cute!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uMh5...layer_embedded

I had a wild pregnancy dream last night after watching this video, lol.

That video made me smile really big














thank you!!


----------



## bajamergrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Hi ladies! Here's a Friday feel good video, not sure if you all have seen this yet. Its VERY cute!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uMh5...layer_embedded

I had a wild pregnancy dream last night after watching this video, lol.

VERY cute! Brought a pregnancy-induced tear to my eye.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
ahem ahem...

to go a little off of the frog bit, I'd have t say that I TOTALLY disagree with New Orelans creoles not being "authentically" African American, and it's not only because I am creole and from new Orleans







New Orleans may not have what is now seen as a "typical" African-American spin to its culture but I'd argue that New Orleans and its creoles have the OLDEST history and most remaining vestiges of what can be linked to the continent in the U.S.

The issue is in how the history is hidden and the mixed-ness and "exotic" tuff are all played out (which is why Disney set it there--do we REALLY expect Disney to try to have what most people would consider a "typical" African-American?). For example, people loooove to play up how the wrought iron in the architecture of the French Quarter is so European, but it's only there because the Africans who made it were iron workers, and some of the stuff--if you look at the tops of churches all throughout Louisiana, for another example--are actually Adinkra symbols. But that doesn't bring tourists. Louisiana laws are the reason that the one-drop rule still exists in peoples minds.

Okay I could go on and on but I think the point I'd really like to make is that New Orleans certainly DOES have an AUTHENTIC African-American culture, but it may not be what is TYPICALLY represented (although I'd STILL argue that many of the things people associate with black people in this country began there--music being a big factor). I do agree that black culture in New Orleans can be a lot different from the rest of the country--I learned that real quick when I left home and went to college, which is probably why I am now living in a Caribbean stronghold in Brooklyn because that feels closest to "home."

All that said, it is annoying to me that once again, a woman from New Orleans are being trotted out as this "exotic" thing. I think we've been given the VERY short end of the stick in terms of historical representations that don't highlight creole women (and let's face it, we can't even get out of the colonial period half the time) who were as African as they were anything else and furthermore worked to uplift African people in New Orleans, those who were free people of color and those who were enslaved (see someone like Henriette Delille, though you still may not actually find good info--i did a research fellowship about her in college). I think we have to also be clear that the original meaning of creole was one who was born in the colonies of parents who were African OR European (not AND). Eventually it came to mean the mixed up business, and that happened mostly when the Americans bought Louisiana territory and began imposing laws (and language and so forth) that were repressive to the culture, so the culture became more insular and people got more specific about who was who and what. "Americanness" is MORE of the historical question mark over folks from New Orleans, I'd argue, rather that "Africanness."
And of course that still traps us in oh, the early 1900s at the latest. Unless it is about music, it's like people don't even really SEE that anything even happened in New Orleans between slavery and Katrina, which is miserablly sad and given us very short shrift, but which is also a part of how the city sold itself as a tourist destination until a catastrophe happened that couldn't be spun.

Okay now I'll really stop. heh. got a little riled up









I really like what you said







. I recently just read Bliss Broyard's book about her father Anatole Broyard who was a Creole who chose to pass and it was really a good starting point as far as recognizing at least for me that Creoles are very much a part of the African-American experience.

Growing up I had a girlfriend who was Creole and she most certainly would consider herself Black. While historically there were Creoles who did not want to be considered Black, there were many who were okay with it.

Discussions like this remind me that there is no one singular Black experience. Even so called stereotypical behavior has a basis in truth, while I may not walk around doing the eye and head roll, I most certainly have enough kin that do.

Sorta off-topic but like Madsommer I would love to live in NO but that humdity would kill me.


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Sorta off-topic but like Madsommer I would love to live in NO but that humdity would kill me.

Yeah. I don't think I could handle the summers, but I do plan on escaping many a Chicago winter to stay with my parents!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bloomingstar* 
ahem ahem...

to go a little off of the frog bit, I'd have t say that I TOTALLY disagree with New Orelans creoles not being "authentically" African American, and it's not only because I am creole and from new Orleans







New Orleans may not have what is now seen as a "typical" African-American spin to its culture but I'd argue that New Orleans and its creoles have the OLDEST history and most remaining vestiges of what can be linked to the continent in the U.S.

The issue is in how the history is hidden and the mixed-ness and "exotic" tuff are all played out (which is why Disney set it there--do we REALLY expect Disney to try to have what most people would consider a "typical" African-American?). For example, people loooove to play up how the wrought iron in the architecture of the French Quarter is so European, but it's only there because the Africans who made it were iron workers, and some of the stuff--if you look at the tops of churches all throughout Louisiana, for another example--are actually Adinkra symbols. But that doesn't bring tourists. Louisiana laws are the reason that the one-drop rule still exists in peoples minds.

Okay I could go on and on but I think the point I'd really like to make is that New Orleans certainly DOES have an AUTHENTIC African-American culture, but it may not be what is TYPICALLY represented (although I'd STILL argue that many of the things people associate with black people in this country began there--music being a big factor). I do agree that black culture in New Orleans can be a lot different from the rest of the country--I learned that real quick when I left home and went to college, which is probably why I am now living in a Caribbean stronghold in Brooklyn because that feels closest to "home."

All that said, it is annoying to me that once again, a woman from New Orleans are being trotted out as this "exotic" thing. I think we've been given the VERY short end of the stick in terms of historical representations that don't highlight creole women (and let's face it, we can't even get out of the colonial period half the time) who were as African as they were anything else and furthermore worked to uplift African people in New Orleans, those who were free people of color and those who were enslaved (see someone like Henriette Delille, though you still may not actually find good info--i did a research fellowship about her in college). I think we have to also be clear that the original meaning of creole was one who was born in the colonies of parents who were African OR European (not AND). Eventually it came to mean the mixed up business, and that happened mostly when the Americans bought Louisiana territory and began imposing laws (and language and so forth) that were repressive to the culture, so the culture became more insular and people got more specific about who was who and what. "Americanness" is MORE of the historical question mark over folks from New Orleans, I'd argue, rather that "Africanness."
And of course that still traps us in oh, the early 1900s at the latest. Unless it is about music, it's like people don't even really SEE that anything even happened in New Orleans between slavery and Katrina, which is miserablly sad and given us very short shrift, but which is also a part of how the city sold itself as a tourist destination until a catastrophe happened that couldn't be spun.

Okay now I'll really stop. heh. got a little riled up










Sorry to rile you up!

You did not mention anything about NO or Louisiana that I do not already know, except that I disagree about Creoles having the oldest black culture in America, but that gives me something to read over the summer.

I can't argue with you about the historical significance of the state, but it is never accurately portrayed. You are correct, music is one of the only positive attributes that the area can claim and that is tragic, but who can be blamed but the residents of the state? How can outsiders see something that is hidden beneath years of oppression, exploitation and ignorance if the people who call New Orleans, or Louisiana home don't take the time to make it evident?

New Orleans is a nice place, and I have traveled there many, many times, but it is not a favored destination.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Hi ladies! Here's a Friday feel good video, not sure if you all have seen this yet. Its VERY cute!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uMh5...layer_embedded

I had a wild pregnancy dream last night after watching this video, lol.

I love it!


----------



## AndrewsMother

Did any of you attend Howard?

or

Is anyone from the Washington, D.C. area?


----------



## Yinsum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Did any of you attend Howard?

or

Is anyone from the Washington, D.C. area?


I grew up in DC. Much of my family is still there, but I no longer live there


----------



## kimiij

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Did any of you attend Howard?

or

Is anyone from the Washington, D.C. area?

I went to college in DC but not at Howard. Love DC and I missed it very much when I first moved to NJ.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Hi ladies! Here's a Friday feel good video, not sure if you all have seen this yet. Its VERY cute!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uMh5...layer_embedded

I had a wild pregnancy dream last night after watching this video, lol.

I posted that to my Facebook page. It's so sweet!







Such cute little fellows!

The Disney Princess discussion, I figured I should avoid but I should say this: I've often considered that if I'd grown up in another part of the country, I'd likely feel stronger about a black identity. It's one of those things you can't know without having done it, but I do think of it often. Instead of being "black" or "white" or "whatever," I've spent a lot of time forging a mixed identity and I think that's fairly healthy of me, but sometimes I think that it would have been nice to grow up with an identity already in place for me.

Not sure if that makes sense.... I probably need to eat.


----------



## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Did any of you attend Howard?

or

Is anyone from the Washington, D.C. area?

I went to Howard, but Im not from DC, tho I now live in the DC area.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
I went to Howard, but Im not from DC, tho I now live in the DC area.

Thank you for the responses. Howard has a BSRS in Radiation Therapy and I have considered applying. Only a few schools in the US offer the program, so I can't be too picky as to where I apply.

I have contacted Howard and two other HBCUs and have not had anyone answer the phone or return telephone calls after 3 or 4 days. Is this normal?

I briefly attended Clark Atlanta and my experience with the Administration and the stories of others at various HBCUs left me hesitant about applying to another.

What was your experience like? Would you do it all over again?


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yinsum* 
I grew up in DC. Much of my family is still there, but I no longer live there


Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
I went to college in DC but not at Howard. Love DC and I missed it very much when I first moved to NJ.


Do you all know anything about the Washington International School?


----------



## Barbamama

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
I have contacted Howard and two other HBCUs and have not had anyone answer the phone or return telephone calls after 3 or 4 days. Is this normal?

I briefly attended Clark Atlanta and my experience with the Administration and the stories of others at various HBCUs left me hesitant about applying to another.

What was your experience like? Would you do it all over again?

I grew up in the Maryland suburbs, live in DC now. I didn't attend Howard, but of none of my friends and colleagues who did regretted it; all are rabidly pro-Howard. It's graduation time, maybe the delays/unattended phones have something to do with that?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Do you all know anything about the Washington International School?

I've looked into WIS and likely will apply for DD either next year for pre-K or down the road at grade 3. I'd be very happy if she's admitted and I'm able to afford the tuition. . . . . It's a well-regarded school, though not at the absolute pinnacle of the DC private school pecking order (which, to me, isn't necessarily a bad thing). One of DD's friends has a parent who teaches there, if you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to try to get answers for you.


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## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
I went to college in DC but not at Howard. Love DC and I missed it very much when I first moved to NJ.

Where in NJ are you? I lived in Edison for 4 years.


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## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Thank you for the responses. Howard has a BSRS in Radiation Therapy and I have considered applying. Only a few schools in the US offer the program, so I can't be too picky as to where I apply.

I have contacted Howard and two other HBCUs and have not had anyone answer the phone or return telephone calls after 3 or 4 days. Is this normal?

I briefly attended Clark Atlanta and my experience with the Administration and the stories of others at various HBCUs left me hesitant about applying to another.

What was your experience like? Would you do it all over again?

Well, the A (administration) building which is who handles all the enrollment applications has shorter summer hours (anytime after commencement is summer for them lol) and they are also tryna handle everybody for the first summer session.

You HAVE to stay on them. If you sit back and wait for their call, it most likely won't come. I say call them as much as you're able to keep checking status. One thing that Howard teaches all its students is that if you dont do something yourself, it will never get done....in other words...you betta hustle! lol

My experience was pretty good per the circumstances (i was pretty lost on why i went to college, very little direction, majored in something i wasnt very interested in, etc). I am very glad that I went and I would like my future children to follow in those footsteps (only i want them to have a more defined purpose on why they want to go).

If I had to do it all over again, I most definitely would but I wish I would have known what I know now. I would have majored in something totally different, kept my behind in campus housing and participated in more organizations that interested me.

Howard is as good as what you put into her. So when you get in (you most likely will, you just have to stay on them), make the very most of it and enjoy it.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
I grew up in the Maryland suburbs, live in DC now. I didn't attend Howard, but of none of my friends and colleagues who did regretted it; all are rabidly pro-Howard. It's graduation time, maybe the delays/unattended phones have something to do with that?[/

I am going to hope that the end of the year has something to, their inability to answer the phone, but for some reason I don't think that that is the reason. I am in the process of lookin at applying to 6 to 8 different schools, and only the HBCU's fail to answer the phone or return phone calls.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Barbamama* 
I've looked into WIS and likely will apply for DD either next year for pre-K or down the road at grade 3. I'd be very happy if she's admitted and I'm able to afford the tuition. . . . . It's a well-regarded school, though not at the absolute pinnacle of the DC private school pecking order (which, to me, isn't necessarily a bad thing). One of DD's friends has a parent who teaches there, if you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to try to get answers for you

DS will attend the international school next year in our home city for PK3, of course we would like for him to continue his education at WIS. If I apply to Howard I will apply to WIS, but our moving to the city is contingent upon both of us being accepted. If I have any questions, I will contact you. Thanks.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
Well, the A (administration) building which is who handles all the enrollment applications has shorter summer hours (anytime after commencement is summer for them lol) and they are also tryna handle everybody for the first summer session.

You HAVE to stay on them. If you sit back and wait for their call, it most likely won't come. I say call them as much as you're able to keep checking status. *One thing that Howard teaches all its students is that if you dont do something yourself, it will never get done....in other words*...you betta hustle! lol

At this point staying on them would require me to fly to washington to ask the exact same questions that I have answered via phone and email at the other schools. I have not applied to any of the other schools, but have only had an initial transcript evaluation. I have not even contacted the main administration department, just the department for my major. I will not apply to Howard until after my transcripts are evaluated because their prerequisites are different, nothing at all like the other schools. Perhaps their classes just have different names, but I need to know what classes I must take in the fall in order to gain acceptance for next year.

And as for the part that I bolded, I learned that at a very young age. It sounds to me as if that is an excuse for poor administrative practices. Maybe Howard is not for me, why should I jump though hoops when I am paying THEM money.

I just don't understand why it is so hard to answer the phone.

My experience was pretty good per the circumstances (i was pretty lost on why i went to college, very little direction, majored in something i wasnt very interested in, etc). I am very glad that I went and I would like my future children to follow in those footsteps (only i want them to have a more defined purpose on why they want to go).

If I had to do it all over again, I most definitely would but I wish I would have known what I know now. I would have majored in something totally different, kept my behind in campus housing and participated in more organizations that interested me.

Howard is as good as what you put into her. So when you get in (you most likely will, you just have to stay on them), make the very most of it and enjoy it.

Everyone keeps insisting that I stay on top of HBCUs and I find this frustrating and ridiculous. I left one HBCU for that reason, but I hoped that the experience would not be the same at others.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Everyone keeps insisting that I stay on top of HBCUs and I find this frustrating and ridiculous. I left one HBCU for that reason, but I hoped that the experience would not be the same at others.

I've applied to more than 30 schools in my short lifetime, none of them HBCUs, and have run across this problem in about 50% of them. Just throwing that out there. If it's the HBCU experience that you want, then you keep trying. But if it's not that important to you, then keep moving on. I passed on many expensive private liberal arts schools because of this issue. After a few unreturned phone calls, I just moved on. I will also say that if you're unhappy about your process now, then you probably won't be happy if you ultimately decide to attend anyway.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *madsommer* 
I've applied to more than 30 schools in my short lifetime, none of them HBCUs, and have run across this problem in about 50% of them. Just throwing that out there. If it's the HBCU experience that you want, then you keep trying. But if it's not that important to you, then keep moving on. I passed on many expensive private liberal arts schools because of this issue. After a few unreturned phone calls, I just moved on. I will also say that if you're unhappy about your process now, then you probably won't be happy if you ultimately decide to attend anyway.

I am sure that the problem is not exclusive to HBCUs, but from my experience it is only the HBCUs that have communication issues. Part of me wants the HBCU experience, but the other part of me wants no administrative or financial aid drama. I just want to expand my mind, graduate and move on to the next phase in my life.

There are so few schools to which I can apply, only 28 offer the major, and Howard is one of them. Actually Howard is my # 3 choice, but only because of the proximity to where we would live. My #1 choice is here in my home town. #2 is a 2 hour drive away from our current home. #4 & #5 would require a move to Atlanta, but I would have to stay on campus in either Savannah or Augusta and only see DS and DH on the weekend.

Washington, and Atlanta, also have International Schools to which we could apply for DS. We will only move if we are both accepted to schools in the same city.

If I had an option in Washington D.C. other than Howard I would definetly pursue it.


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## Brown Lioness

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Everyone keeps insisting that I stay on top of HBCUs and I find this frustrating and ridiculous. I left one HBCU for that reason, but I hoped that the experience would not be the same at others.

I agree with you on that and there really should be no excuse for poor communication but thas just how it is sometimes. There are people who have gotten quick communication but i think it really depends on who you're contacting.

Again, if you are contacting a specific dept, take in mind that this is the summer and the depts are WAY pared down as far as staff is concerned. Sounds dumb but thas how they roll to keep cost down. Just keep contacting them and ask for alternative people you can contact, ask them when the best time to call is, if maybe people will respond quicker through a different phone number or through email, let people know what you're question is so they may be able to direct you to the person who can answer your question the fastest.

I agree tho, that if you are unhappy with your experience with Howard (or any school giving you the run around really) thus far, it may not be the school for you.


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Brown Lioness* 
I agree with you on that and there really should be no excuse for poor communication but thas just how it is sometimes. There are people who have gotten quick communication but i think it really depends on who you're contacting.

*Again, if you are contacting a specific dept, take in mind that this is the summer and the depts are WAY pared down as far as staff is concerned. Sounds dumb but thas how they roll to keep cost down. Just keep contacting them and ask for alternative people you can contact, ask them when the best time to call is, if maybe people will respond quicker through a different phone number or through email, let people know what you're question is so they may be able to direct you to the person who can answer your question the fastest.*
I agree tho, that if you are unhappy with your experience with Howard (or any school giving you the run around really) thus far, it may not be the school for you.

I did all of that! I will probably attempt to call a few more times, just to see how long it takes to receive a response.


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## purplegirl

AM, I can imagine your frustration. I attempted to go matriculate at an HBCU when applying to undergrad and had a similar experience. I did not attend because of that reason. That said, I have had many family members and friends who attended Howard and other HBCU's. They have fond memories and experiences that I longed for. I would encourage you to keep pushing. Howard is an excellent school and I love Wash, D.C.


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## ~gilli~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Did any of you attend Howard?

or

Is anyone from the Washington, D.C. area?

I am. I didn't go to Howard, But my mother did and all our family still lives in D.C.but I live in Baltimore now.


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## SamI'mNot

Hey y'all! I've been lurking around here on and off for a while and I thought it was finally time I made my appearance.









I'm not from D.C., and I didn't go to Howard, but I am a student. I've gone to several different schools, and I've gained admittance to and then declined several more. I've discovered that if they give you the run-around when you're not even a student, it usually doesn't improve much once you get admitted.

I agree with Brown Lioness. It just may not be the school for you. And believe me, that's a fantastic thing to realize early on. The sooner the better!


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SamI'mNot* 
Hey y'all! I've been lurking around here on and off for a while and I thought it was finally time I made my appearance.









I'm not from D.C., and I didn't go to Howard, but I am a student. I've gone to several different schools, and I've gained admittance to and then declined several more. I've discovered that if they give you the run-around when you're not even a student, it usually doesn't improve much once you get admitted.

I agree with Brown Lioness. It just may not be the school for you. And believe me, that's a fantastic thing to realize early on. The sooner the better!


Even though I would love to attend Howard University, I will wait until I have completed my undergraduate degree. Everyone that I have spoken with who attended as an undergraduate and then as a student in a professional program remarked upon the differences in administration. The run around factor was either substantially reduced or eliminated all together.


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SamI'mNot* 
Hey y'all! I've been lurking around here on and off for a while and I thought it was finally time I made my appearance.









I'm not from D.C., and I didn't go to Howard, but I am a student. I've gone to several different schools, and I've gained admittance to and then declined several more. I've discovered that if they give you the run-around when you're not even a student, it usually doesn't improve much once you get admitted.

I agree with Brown Lioness. It just may not be the school for you. And believe me, that's a fantastic thing to realize early on. The sooner the better!

Hi. Welcome back. I remember you from way back--good to see you posting again.







:

How is everyone? Did you all have an enjoyable holiday weekend? Mine was pretty nice. I went to my home town of Philly on Saturday. I did all of the touristy things and had a blast. Sunday, I went to a cook-out with family and friends. It was nice as well.
I'm dealing with some personal struggles. I've decided that I will not be ttc'ing at all. It is an extremely painful decision, but most realistic at this time in my life. The pain is more intense than ever and particularly when I see women my age with children. However, it's just not going to happen for me. I am way past the age that I feel comfortable even attempting and any other means are out of reach (donor egg, ivf). Adoption is still on the table but I have to get past my pain, anger and disappointment of not being able to do conceive--the mourning process. It's a lonely process and one that is challenging my spirituality. It just doesn't make sense and I wished it would. Maybe some day it will.


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## Jannah6

*Purplegirl*, I'm sending you many many many HUGS. I don't know your pain,but I can only imagine what you are going through. God tests us all in different ways.
From what I know of you, if you decide to adopt, you'll make some child/children very happy. My aunt who raised me never had any children. If she had children maybe my life would have been different. She never officially adopted me, but she has been a mom to me. I'm sorry that this is all jumbled up. I just finished a 6 hour trip.







s


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## Yinsum

(((((PURPLEGIRL))))) sending you lots of love


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## kimiij

Purplegirl - I don't know all of the circumstances and history behind your decision but I just want to send you so many







. I don't know your exact pain as I have my own struggles but I do know what it's like to want and wait for something that doesn't seem to be appearing. And I also know that facing the possible reality of it never happening can be emotionally crippling. I don't know what religion you are but during the times when I'm not asking/yelling "WHY NOT ME?," it helps me to remind myself that God's plan for me is infinitely better than anything I could plan for myself. And that it is good.


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## madsommer

purplegirl


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## oyinmama

(((purplegirl))) i'm sending you love and light! like many of the previous posters i don't know the details of your personal struggle but have nothing but admiration for your loving and nurturing spirit. may you reach a place of beautiful peace. xoxo!


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## SamI'mNot

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Hi. Welcome back. I remember you from way back--good to see you posting again.







:

Thanks so much for the welcome! Prayers and support from my heart for you.


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## AndrewsMother

Purplegirl, once you move past your pain you will become a great mom to someone.


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## Barbamama

Purplegirl,





























times 1000 to the 10th power. You'll be in my prayers.

MH


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## Brown Lioness

Im so sorry, Purplegirl...


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## futurmama8

I hope you can heal purplegirl many







to you


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## purplegirl

Oh wow, the love and supportive words mean more than you can ever know. This journey has been so unpredictable and at times deeply painful. Ioften feels so isolated because I don't have many folks IRL who really understand. For example, my aunt said to me that she knew why I didn't have children and that was because I was so loving and good to others. Huh?

I never thought I'd live my life without children. It doesn't make sense that a person who has such a fondness of kids, who works with them and whom children tend to gravitate toward, is without her own. That is my frequent conversation with God. I am not a quitter, but I am realizing that my age is the biggest factor. I could take extraordinary measures to make this happen, but I cannot be selfish. I think my best course of action is adopting a child who a a toddler or older. I am giving myself some time to mourn and hopefully by the end of summer, the adoption process will begin.
Again, the love and support is appreciated and warms my heart. A lot of yall have been through this with me. You have supported me through the surgeries and healing. Seriously, it's what has gotten me through.


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## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 

I never thought I'd live my life without children. It doesn't make sense that a person who has such a fondness of kids, who works with them and whom children tend to gravitate toward, is without her own.

You are describing my aunt to a T. She raised me since I was 2, without her I don't know where I'd be today. She's 65 and children still gravitate towards her. I echo what AndrewsMother said, YOU WILL BECOME A GREAT MOM TO SOMEONE







s


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## eilonwy

Purplegirl... You've had quite a journey in this, haven't you? I hope peace finds you quickly.







:

Samantha: Where the heck have you been, woman?!







You've missed hearing all about my redhead (a.k.a. Captain Carrot, a.k.a. tHRH). How's my niece? How are you?


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## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
For example, my aunt said to me that she knew why I didn't have children and that was because I was so loving and good to others. Huh?


I understand exactly what your Aunt means. Like Jannah I have a awesome Aunt, while she is not my mother figure, I can depend on her more than I can my real mother.

She is such a giving person, and I think that she can be this way because after she is assured that she is prepated for retirement, everything else that she has is used as a blessing for others. She gives freely to those that are in need. If she had a child I am sure that her money would have been set aside for the needs of her immediate family.

Maybe your inability to have a child frees you to love and care for a child(ren) that otherwise might not have someone to love them.

I can't imagine not giving birth to my own child, so while I don't know your painI understand it.


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## nnaemeka

purplegirl---your lovely spirit shines thru even in cyber space. may the Mother of all guide and protect you. one love.


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## Draupadi

*Purplegirl*, big hugs, Honey. You and I were on our path together, weren't we?
Big hugs.


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## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
You are describing my aunt to a T. She raised me since I was 2, without her I don't know where I'd be today. She's 65 and children still gravitate towards her. I echo what AndrewsMother said, YOU WILL BECOME A GREAT MOM TO SOMEONE







s

I third that!


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## purplegirl




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## chanibell

Any one catch this show? I usually don't watch Tyra,but I was flipping around and saw she had a show dedicated to AA woman and dependence on weaves,wigs,etc. It also had people who sported natural looks. It had a mother who was embarrassed to introduce her own daughter b/c her daughter didn't have her hair permed! Then they asked these cute little AA girls about hair and they all wanted " good hair" one girl said she only felt beautiful wearing her Hannah Montana wig ( which was blond)

It was sad. Plus I can count on 1 hand the number of AA women I see in the pools around here. It isn't done. My aunt who is 42 can't swim.









Tyra also had two authors on the show who wrote a book called: Hair Story: Untangling the roots of black hair in America by Ayana Byrd and Lori Tharps.

Has anyone read this? Any thoughts? Saw the show?

blessings~


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## AndrewsMother

I have never viewed the Tyra Show, but I would have enjoyed watching that episode.

I am natural, but I am seriously contemplating sewing in tracks tonight or going to the salon next week for braids because I KNOW that I do not look as good as I can with short hair. I am not a beauty with longer hair, but I look BAD with short hair. While I enjoy and love the texture of my natural hair, I am not happy with my appearance and will do anything to enhance my appearnce until my hair returns to an acceptable length.

Some women look great with short hair, and others like me know that a little coverage on the forehead makes a difference.

What I don't understand is why women who wear weaves constantly relax their natural hair. I just don't get it. I wore sewn in weaves from 1996 to 2002 with out any damage to my hair or scalp, but I only relaxed my exposed hair IF maybe twice during that six year period. When I decided to go natural I manually straighted my exposed hair.

As I type I remeber that I had more than enough hair of my own, but weave is so much easier to deal with on a daily basis, especially the kind that I could wet while showering in the morning. A little shine gel and a cute hair clip and I was good for the day. My own fuzzy, curly, wavy hair can take 45 minutes to an hour to wash, comb out and place in either a bun or two pinned down braids.









As for the simming issue most blacks that I know who can't swim never learned, not because they were afraid to get their hair wet(thought that is what they told/tell people) but because they were too poor to afford swimming lessons or because they grew up in parts of the south that did not have public swimming facilities for blacks until the early 1980's. So I do know 46 + year old people in my mothers hometown who never learned to swim because of segregation. The only swimming pool in town was turned into a flag base rather than allow blacks to utilize the facility.

I am sure that there are many who can't swim because of their hair, but perhaps there is more to their story. I grew up swimming with my friends, both black and white.

ok i will cease my rambling


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## Jannah6

*AM*, who said you don't look good with short hair??? I disagree with your opinion. Me thinks you look very cute, *HTH* LOL

*ETA:* I could write a book on good hair/bad hair. Especially now that I am a mom of biracial children. I'm so sick of those terms


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Any one catch this show? I usually don't watch Tyra,but I was flipping around and saw she had a show dedicated to AA woman and dependence on weaves,wigs,etc. It also had people who sported natural looks. It had a mother who was embarrassed to introduce her own daughter b/c her daughter didn't have her hair permed! Then they asked these cute little AA girls about hair and they all wanted " good hair" one girl said she only felt beautiful wearing her Hannah Montana wig ( which was blond)

It was sad. Plus I can count on 1 hand the number of AA women I see in the pools around here. It isn't done. My aunt who is 42 can't swim.









Tyra also had two authors on the show who wrote a book called: Hair Story: Untangling the roots of black hair in America by Ayana Byrd and Lori Tharps.

Has anyone read this? Any thoughts? Saw the show?

blessings~

I caught the piece when the little girls were talking about their hair and wanted to seriously talk to their mamas. There was the biracial girl whose Mama had her with weave in her head and she was under 10. There was also the Mama relaxing her 3 yo







:







:.

Maybe its because my own girl is 3 but I cannot wrap my brain around the idea of anyone relaxing a young child....I am not prone to getting dramatic but when they showed that Mama relaxing that child's head, I did have tears in my eyes. That's just wrong on so many levels.

I will admit I may have a bias, for the most part I think everyone looks well with natural hair, its what grows out of our heads. I hate to see a new generation of black girls being indoctrinated into good hair/bad hair and the girl with the Hannah Montana blond wig? Words fail me.

@ AndrewsMother, I like Jannah, I think you look adorable with short hair but I do understand if its not your comfort level.

Speaking of hair, I have decided to cut my locks off. Its been a hard decision but I have reached a place spiritually and emotionally where its just time to let them go. I admit its a little daunting to go from hair that right now is to the middle of my back to 4-5 inches but I am looking forward to being able to wash and go again.

As women so many of us look for that long hair but the past year the longer my hair has gotten, the more headaches its caused literally and figuratively. So in the next few weeks I am planning a cutting celebration/party and then I am going to have my hair colored.

Shay


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## futurmama8

Thanks for the add on facebook Andrewsmother!!! you have a beautiful family and I think you look hot with short hair







but do what makes you feel good.

Are there any other mama's on facebook?? I would love to have some MDC mama's as friends. My name is Rianne so add me girls.

I wasn't able to see the Tyra show even though I am trying my hardest to find it somewhere. I heard all about it on nappturality and it sounded kind of sad. I saw the commercial about the girl saying she wanted "that white girl flow" and I was left







. Off to try to find it again.


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chanibell* 
Then they asked these cute little AA girls about hair and they all wanted " good hair" one girl said she only felt beautiful wearing her Hannah Montana wig ( which was blond)

It was sad. Plus I can count on 1 hand the number of AA women I see in the pools around here. It isn't done. My aunt who is 42 can't swim.










That is sooooo sad. But I've been there done that, especially being raised in predominantly white neighborhoods my whole life. I never had any other examples...and my mother was perming her hair too so she wasn't exactly helping me out in that area either.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Some women look great with short hair, and others like me know that a little coverage on the forehead makes a difference.

As for the simming issue most blacks that I know who can't swim never learned, not because they were afraid to get their hair wet(thought that is what they told/tell people) but because they were too poor to afford swimming lessons or because they grew up in parts of the south that did not have public swimming facilities for blacks until the early 1980's. So I do know 46 + year old people in my mothers hometown who never learned to swim because of segregation. The only swimming pool in town was turned into a flag base rather than allow blacks to utilize the facility.

Girl, I gotta have a bang too! At least a little something to cover my forehead...or maybe I need to get over that too









And ITA about swimming. My parents simply didn't have access to a pool growing up. My dad taught himself in high school or college, but that's because he went to a private high school and play sports on scholarship in college so he was privy to a pool almost 24/7 at those times. My mom didn't take swimming lessons until she was 40. I can stay above water and not drown myself, but I dare not go deeper than 5 feet







And not because of my hair. I just am scared.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
I caught the piece when the little girls were talking about their hair and wanted to seriously talk to their mamas. There was the biracial girl whose Mama had her with weave in her head and she was under 10. There was also the Mama relaxing her 3 yo







:







:.

So in the next few weeks I am planning a cutting celebration/party and then I am going to have my hair colored.

Shay

Was the mother who put in the weave white? I can't understand why white mothers of biracial children won't just ask their MIL or even their husbands or some other AA person about hair care for the children! It just doesn't make any sense!

I can't believe someone would put a relaxer on a 3yo. That makes me cry too.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Are there any other mama's on facebook?? I would love to have some MDC mama's as friends. My name is Rianne so add me girls.

I'm on facebook!!! Search Alisha Ann Marie (chicago) and you'll see a cute little boy for a picture...that's me


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## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Thanks for the add on facebook Andrewsmother!!! you have a beautiful family and I think you look hot with short hair








but do what makes you feel good.

Are there any other mama's on facebook?? I would love to have some MDC mama's as friends. My name is Rianne so add me girls.

I wasn't able to see the Tyra show even though I am trying my hardest to find it somewhere. I heard all about it on nappturality and it sounded kind of sad. I saw the commercial about the girl saying she wanted "that white girl flow" and I was left







. Off to try to find it again.

I am such a face book dork--love it! Pm me so we can exchange info. Any other mamas, feel free to do the same!


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## chanibell

Yep,

I forgot the 3 year old who was getting her hair permed. I know its all about personal experience and how you feel about yourself whether natural,weave or whatever. My issue with the show was mostly the kids on there and them not being happy with their hair/themselves.

I didn't even think about the pool thing. Of course pools are pretty expensive to keep up. The hair thing is what I get when I ask people why they don't swim. Just my own experience. I want to read that book to see the history and also why the authors wrote a book. Gonna put it on the library list.....


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
While I enjoy and love the texture of my natural hair, I am not happy with my appearance and will do anything to enhance my appearnce until my hair returns to an acceptable length.

AM, I so feel you. My hair is short now not by choice but simply because it stops growing and/or breaks easily. I'm wearing a lowboy now. Everyone insists I look cute and I've been trying so hard to convince myself it's true. But I can't stand having such short hair. I'd even be willing to deal with a small afro. Just something. I think I look too much like my baby brother and I just don't feel like I look my best with short/close cut hair. The past few weeks I've just been wrapping it . . . I feel a lot more confident that way. And the biggest lesson in this whole thing is that confidence absolutely makes or breaks a style. No matter how many folks say you look cute with short hair, it simply doesn't matter until you look cute to yourself.

And while I love my own natural texture and I love to see what grows out of Black people's heads in it's own state, I will say that except for locks and low cuts, most natural styles require a lot of time and commitment. Just youtube some natural hair care videos. I don't have an hour every night to deal with my hair to make it look good. I don't have the money to try out 80 thousand different products to find the *right one*. And I don't want unhealthy, dull, lackluster hair. Not willing to rock that even if it is natural. So braids and weaves seem like a good compromise. Like you, I don't get why folks relax their own natural hair under the braids and weaves! My sister's natural under her weave and it's unbelievable how long it's getting and how healthy and full it looks. For me, it's always about the motivation for wearing a wig/braids/weaves . . . I love to hear when it's worn for convenience and not because the wearer just despises what's growing out of their own head. Wearing weaves/braids/wigs doesn't automatically mean that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
Speaking of hair, I have decided to cut my locks off. Its been a hard decision but I have reached a place spiritually and emotionally where its just time to let them go. I admit its a little daunting to go from hair that right now is to the middle of my back to 4-5 inches but I am looking forward to being able to wash and go again.

Shay

Shay







. . . I know what a hard decision it was. I really do. You have my support and encouragement. It will be a big transition and I know you'll miss them but yes, girl, the absolute best thing about short hair is wash and go . . . especially during the summer!


----------



## eilonwy

I love having super short and even a bald head... but I do feel confident that I'm cute and my hair grows relatively quickly, so it's not a big deal either way. In my personal opinion, you have to be somewhat babyfaced to look cute bald (because babies are often bald and very often cute) and I'm very babyfaced.







: Hm. I wonder what tHRH would think about me shaving my head... he'd probably say, "Right on," and move on to a different subject.


----------



## kimiij

I did watch part of the Tyra Show but I couldn't watch all of it because I was annoyed at Tyra. First, because she was wearing cornrows. Maybe it's just me but I found that to be a "strategic" move on her part and also fake because she is always wearing a blond weave down to her waist. Second, because I just didn't want to see her say "You perm your 3-year old's hair" in that judging/accusatory/fake shock tone.


----------



## Sorin

I'm amazed that "good hair/bad hair" is still "news." (Then again, this is Tyra we are talking about, so perhaps it is not quite "news."







) It seems so very last generation to me, but perhaps that is just because hair was never an issue in my family. My grandmother's got stick straight hair, my mother's got a slight curl to her hair (which she can easily blow dry straight), my dad has "typical" course hair, and I've got some weird schizo combo so I relax it to make it more managable. No one in my DH's family talks about good hair/bad hair, nor do any of my girlfriends. Maybe I just live in some "hey, anything goes when it comes to your hair" utopia!

There is so much more going on today with the black experience--social, political, economical concerns--that to obsess over whether a child has good or bad hair seems . . . so trivial. To relax a 3 year old's head? Crazy!

Now I do understand the obsession over hairstyles, however.







I've toyed with a couple of different haircuts myself. I haven't gone super short yet, but I keep threatening my DH that I will one day (perhaps when I turn 50!) And if we have a little girl (which we think we might since DH and I both dreamed about her) I'll just work with whatever hair she has and try to make it look cute! She can decide if she wants to relax it or not when she gets older (like a teenager--which is when I first did it).

Anyway, sorry for the rambling hair musings. I just think that as black people we need to move beyond the whole good hair/bad hair vocabulary. Hair is just hair. What you do with it is just what you decide to do with it. Whatever makes you feel like the queen you are, then wear it with pride!


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
*most natural styles require a lot of time and commitment.* Just youtube some natural hair care videos. I don't have an hour every night to deal with my hair to make it look good. I don't have the money to try out 80 thousand different products to find the *right one*. And I don't want unhealthy, dull, lackluster hair. Not willing to rock that even if it is natural. .

Shay







. . . I know what a hard decision it was. I really do. You have my support and encouragement. It will be a big transition and I know you'll miss them but yes, girl, the absolute best thing about short hair is wash and go . . . especially during the summer!

Thanks. I have to say I really wish more folks talked about the fact that being natural unless you have locks (even they take work or you end up with what I have a free-form mess) or a simple TWA being natural can take a lot of time and or resources. I have seen to many people get caught up in the product habit, instead of paying $50 or whatever a week to get your hair done, you end up buying a bajillion products for the elusive curl definition.

Despite the fact that I have been natural almost 10 years, I was a lazy natural







. Now I am paying for that but I will say 10 years ago we didn't have any youtube with DIY videos. So I am actually looking forward to starting over where maybe now I can learn how to do some good twists, etc every now and then.


----------



## Yinsum

I didn't see the show.
But I will say that I had to reverse the brain washing I had from my family and society about my bad hair. It was a process that took many years. Happy to say that I am lovin every bit of my natural hair.


----------



## kimiij

In my experience, my natural hair does not require an hour each night in order for it to look good. I think it's an unfortunate myth that most natural styles requiire a lot of time and commitment.

I currently wear my hair in two-strand twists. I twist my hair once a week or once every two weeks. My daily upkeep is minimal. Sometimes I don't do anything to my twists at all and on other days I spray Greg Juice or a water spritz on it to keep it moisturized. That's it.

I had a TWA for several months when I first did the big chop. The upkeep for that is minimal also. That summer I would rinse my hair with water and conditioner each morning, run some oil through it, pat it down, and then let it dry as I walked to work. If you are spending $$$$ on a TWA, then something is wrong!







I mean, with a TWA, your hair is so short, you aren't even going to be using that many products. And there's no need to become a product junkie. I mean, you can if you want but it's not a pre-requisite for rockin' a cute TWA or any other hairstyle.


----------



## Draupadi

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 

*Some women look great with short hair, and others like me know that a little coverage on the forehead makes a difference.*


This is me. If I had short natural, I'd look like a Klingon.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
In my experience, my natural hair does not require an hour each night in order for it to look good. I think it's an unfortunate myth that most natural styles requiire a lot of time and commitment.

I currently wear my hair in two-strand twists. I twist my hair once a week or once every two weeks. My daily upkeep is minimal. Sometimes I don't do anything to my twists at all and on other days I spray Greg Juice or a water spritz on it to keep it moisturized. That's it.

I had a TWA for several months when I first did the big chop. The upkeep for that is minimal also. That summer I would rinse my hair with water and conditioner each morning, run some oil through it, pat it down, and then let it dry as I walked to work. If you are spending $$$$ on a TWA, then something is wrong!







I mean, with a TWA, your hair is so short, you aren't even going to be using that many products. And there's no need to become a product junkie. I mean, you can if you want but it's not a pre-requisite for rockin' a cute TWA or any other hairstyle.

A TWA (like a lowboy or baldie) is a natural style that is low maintenance, agreed. But as AM has said, and me too, some folks don't feel that look flatters them. As for two-strand twists, that still takes time (especially if your hair is short and needs to be twisted very small to look full and not scalpy) or if it is long and for me at least, after about 2 days, they need to be taken down and done again. In any case, I think most natural styles require time and commitment, at the very least, in comparison to rocking a weave, braids or a wig. Not all. And everyone's situation is different. Just because Greg's Juice works in your hair doesn't mean it works in her hair. Many sisters do have to go through a whole list of products to find the one that works for them (not necessarily that they are using a whole bunch of products at one time).

I think when it comes to our hair, we need to give each other space to just be and not make sweeping generalizations one way or the other based on our own personal preference/experience. And I agree . . . the good hair/bad hair and natural v. straight discussions are getting to be tiresome,


----------



## kimiij

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
A TWA (as is a lowboy or baldie) is a natural style that is low maintenance, agreed. But as AM has said, and me too, some folks don't feel that look flatters them.









I was not pushing the TWA on anyone and I did not say anything like that in my post. I was giving my experience with wearing/caring for a TWA for three months while my hair grew out. I agree that some folks don't think the look flatters them and I'm one of them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
In any case, I said _most_ natural styles require time and commitment. Not all. And everyone's situation is different. Just because Greg's Juice works in your hair doesn't mean it works in her hair. Many sisters do have to go through a whole list of products to find the one that works for them (not necessarily that they are using a whole bunch of products at one time).

Yes, I've also gone through several products in the attempt to find the right ones (I actually only started using Greg juice recently). My point was that MY routine is simple, not heavily involved, and the daily maintenance is minimal.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I think when it comes to our hair, we need to give each other space to just be and not make sweeping generalizations one way or the other based on our own personal preference/experience.

I wasn't making any sweeping generalizations. In fact, I was responding to the sweeping generalization of "most natural hairstyles take a lot of time and commitment." Not using the word "all" doesn't mean that it's not a sweeping generalization.

You shared your experience and I shared mine. My entire post was me giving my personal experience with my natural hair. Hearing both sides I think benefits everyone, even if it means I disagree or had a different experience than yours.

Ultimately, I was trying to share with shayinme/others my experience that natural loose hair does not have to be made into this thing that has to involve more time and commitment than you want it to. I wish her luck in whatever style she chooses to rock









I really feel like this is touching on other issues as well. In the same way that some of us have lost the opportunity to learn traditional homemaking/baby caring skills from our mothers, we've lost the opportunity to learn how to care for our natural hair as well.


----------



## Yinsum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
And I agree . . . the good hair/bad hair and natural v. straight discussions are getting to be tiresome,


They are tiresome, but real. My dd is 6 and wants smooth hair like most of her classmates that have hair flowing down their back. At that level, her peers have messages like ask your mom to do this to your hair. I think as you said we all have a right to wear what suits us individually.
I understood Kimiij post more about her experience not a blank statement. I too have had a change in how I approach my hair. Instead of thinking I have a mess of bad hair to deal with, I have grown to view it as a time to nurture my hair. And I am waaayyy low maintenance and scarce on product.
Back to where I started, this conversation continues in my home. I want my daughter to love her hair in it's natural state. When she is older, if she chooses to do other alterations to her hair I hope she makes those decisions out free choice not self hate. I am not implying that's why women do it. However when I was younger that's why I did it. I hated my bad hair that wasn't as straight as my mother's, my aunt's or my grandmother's.

My hair natural is very liberating for me. I honestly have a love affair with my hair. I have been with dh for 21 years. He said to me a few years ago that he noticed how much I really love my hair and he had watch me struggle and fuss with my hair over the years.


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
In my experience, my natural hair does not require an hour each night in order for it to look good. I think it's an unfortunate myth that most natural styles requiire a lot of time and commitment.

I agree my experience is just like yours. I have been natural for only 10 months but I can't get with doing a bunch of stuff to my hair. I honestly just put my satin bonnet on at night, wake up and spray some water in it rub a little and get on the bus.

I think 1 hour out of the week to do some twists isn't that much maintenance imho.







and this is a really big misconception and one that I think keeps people from seeing the beauty that our hair has.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I think when it comes to our hair, we need to give each other space to just be and not make sweeping generalizations one way or the other based on our own personal preference/experience. And I agree . . . the good hair/bad hair and natural v. straight discussions are getting to be tiresome,

I understand your side too and some people just don't have the time but I don't think it is much different then any other style someone could have. I don't think we should be militant about it but this is something that affects POC and I it should be talked about.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 
I really feel like this is touching on other issues as well. In the same way that some of us have lost the opportunity to learn traditional homemaking/baby caring skills from our mothers, we've lost the opportunity to learn how to care for our natural hair as well.

It really is and I wish this wasn't such a hard topic to talk about







I wish we didn't take everything so personal.


Yinsum said:


> Quote:
> 
> They are tiresome, but real. My dd is 6 and wants smooth hair like most of her classmates that have hair flowing down their back. At that level, her peers have messages like ask your mom to do this to your hair. I think as you said we all have a right to wear what suits us individually.
> I was the same way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted good soft hair like my mixed cousins. I wanted the nice baby hair. Man I was really messed up and my mother was a very natural dread and I now find it amazing how she didn't talk to me more loving my hair. She said I would come home, cry and beg her to make my hair like the white girls. I can't believe the mentality I had then and how much it has changed now.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> I understood Kimiij post more about her experience not a blank statement. I too have had a change in how I approach my hair. Instead of thinking I have a mess of bad hair to deal with, I have grown to view it as a time to nurture my hair. And I am waaayyy low maintenance and scarce on product.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope this conversation can continue with some more good things said.


----------



## rootzdawta

When I say it's tiresome, I mean it goes in circles, emotions get all riled up and at the end there's never a resolution. It seems pointless.

And if one person says, Yeah, it takes me a lot of time and effort to deal with my natural hair and then another says, Oh that's a misconception as if she is just not doing it right, to me that's problematic. That's all I'm saying. If it doesn't take that much to keep up with your natural hair, great. But it would help to acknowledge that this is not everyone's story. And allow that space.

And that's my final word on it because I don't think these conversations get anywhere. If you're happy with whatever it is you've got going on, I'm happy for you.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimiij* 







I was not pushing the TWA on anyone and I did not say anything like that in my post. I was giving my experience with wearing/caring for a TWA for three months while my hair grew out. I agree that some folks don't think the look flatters them and I'm one of them.

Yes, I've also gone through several products in the attempt to find the right ones (I actually only started using Greg juice recently). My point was that MY routine is simple, not heavily involved, and the daily maintenance is minimal.

I wasn't making any sweeping generalizations. In fact, I was responding to the sweeping generalization of "most natural hairstyles take a lot of time and commitment." Not using the word "all" doesn't mean that it's not a sweeping generalization.

You shared your experience and I shared mine. My entire post was me giving my personal experience with my natural hair. Hearing both sides I think benefits everyone, even if it means I disagree or had a different experience than yours.

Ultimately, I was trying to share with shayinme/others my experience that natural loose hair does not have to be made into this thing that has to involve more time and commitment than you want it to. I wish her luck in whatever style she chooses to rock









I really feel like this is touching on other issues as well. In the same way that some of us have lost the opportunity to learn traditional homemaking/baby caring skills from our mothers, we've lost the opportunity to learn how to care for our natural hair as well.

I appreciate you sharing your experience, even though I have been natural almost a decade now I never quite tire of talking about hair. We Black woman have a complicated relationship with our hair.









I will say I agree that natural hair does not have to be a huge time suck, that said unless someone has (gosh I hate to sat it cuz it sounds bad) a looser curl pattern, its been my experience that women I see with the flyest natural do's (2 strand twists, etc) are generally the ones who put a tad bit more time into their hair. That said, I spent 4.5 years with a TWA and a low fro and I was a total ash and go girl, no patience for twisting and all that.



futurmama8 said:


> I agree my experience is just like yours. I have been natural for only 10 months but I can't get with doing a bunch of stuff to my hair. I honestly just put my satin bonnet on at night, wake up and spray some water in it rub a little and get on the bus.
> 
> I think 1 hour out of the week to do some twists isn't that much maintenance imho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and this is a really big misconception and one that I think keeps people from seeing the beauty that our hair has.
> 
> I understand your side too and some people just don't have the time but I don't think it is much different then any other style someone could have. I don't think we should be militant about it but this is something that affects POC and I it should be talked about.
> 
> It really is and I wish this wasn't such a hard topic to talk about
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish we didn't take everything so personal.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Yinsum*
> I was the same way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted good soft hair like my mixed cousins. I wanted the nice baby hair. Man I was really messed up and my mother was a very natural dread and I now find it amazing how she didn't talk to me more loving my hair. She said I would come home, cry and beg her to make my hair like the white girls. I can't believe the mentality I had then and how much it has changed now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope this conversation can continue with some more good things said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it will continue. Speaking of, I cut my hair off last night. I know a few of ya'll here saw it on my FB page. I clearly need to see a barber or someone just to clean me up since I am no barber but I really did have a lot of hair under those locks. Lets just say I am not at the TWA stage yet, I need to cut more off but the locks are all gone.
> 
> So how do I feel? Amazingly lighter, thus far no tears have been shed, I suspect it was just time. Right now I admit my hair looks a tad crazy and I haven't gotten paid yet so it will be a few days before I can get to a shop but it still feels better than the locks had been feeling.
> 
> My locks were started after my mom's death 5 years ago and I think there was just too much of that energy from her passing starting to weigh me down at a time I had made peace with her passing.
> 
> Anyway I think today I may try my hand at a twist out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I will let ya'll know how it goes.
> 
> Shay


----------



## AndrewsMother

Great conversation, I will have a few replies tonight.

RootzD, I agree, just because I am natural does not mean that I can just accept any look. If my curls in my TWA are not glossy or lying in the wrong direction I have to wet my head and start over. I can spend 20 minutes on a TWA, so imagine how long it takes me to do twist. I will admit that I have very thick hair and it takes two stylist over an hour to two strand twist my hair without extensions.

I am natural, but conservative so I will only wear two strand twists at certain times, and never when looking for a job, taking family portraits or wearing a suit. Not all natural styles are acceptable to me(and for me) in all situations.

I see women with twists or afros in evening wear or work suits and they look nice, but I feel frumpy and not presentable.

I think that the amount of time required to maintain a natural depends on many factors, and the look that a person is willing to accept. I see people who can wear the same twists for a week, but after 3 days I take mine out because they don't look fresh.......i need to get dressed for church....talk to you all later


----------



## Yinsum

I remember a very long time ago (like 20 years back) I was working in corporate America in NYC. I was still having my own hair struggles and I saw this woman that made me stop in my tracks. She was drop dead gorgeous wearing a well tailored business suit and she had locs. Beautiful locs that went down to her hips. I dare say that sighting planted the seed in my thoughts. I thought this woman was so well put together: how could corporate America say her look is not in line with business etiquette?

I like that we are having these conversations. I wish we could have them at corporate levels. I don't think corporate America respects us in that natural capacity which is a shame IMO.

It seems that we all agree is that we go with our flow what works for the individual works for the individual. That we aren't taking it to a debate that one style trumps the other. I do know from my own experience is that not much info is shared about natural haircare. sort of like what kimiij said about losing that knowledge.


----------



## purplegirl

I have no issue with how Black women wear their hair. I appreciate and admire natural styles. Currently I am wearing a straight weave because my hair fell out--meds/stress related. I have a huge mound of hair on top of my head, but on the sides and the back, my hair isn't even grasp-able. I love my current style, but plan to go back to wearing my own natural hair when it grows back. I had twists for a very long time and not only did my hair grow,it was the healthiest ever. That said, I got lots of negative comments from other Black women. I chalked it up to living in a state that is conservative. I completely understand the need to 'feel pretty'. If you're not feeling it, then it's not working for you.

What really tweaks my nerves is when men offer unsolicited opinions about my hair. I know so many men who don't like it when women cut their hair, wear natural styles, get weaves, etc. For example, a good friend's dad went ballistic when she went natural. He told her she'd never find a husband looking like an 'African'. My dh rolls with me and my hair woes. If I like it, he loves it.


----------



## Jannah6

Dag, this thread is so hard to follow sometimes because I don't get the updates via email







:

I have extremely thick hair, but surprisingly I've never wanted bone straight hair. I've never used the terms good/bad hair. I guess it's mostly because of my aunt. She raised me to love my Black self and my hair. She always told me that women would kill for such strong hair. No matter what I do to my hair it always bounces back. I've had an S-curl, gherri curl, very short cuts,perm, extensions. Right now my hair is permed, not because O like the perm best, but because it allows me to do different styles and my hijab rest better on my head with a perm. My DH could care less how I wear my hair, which is one reason I love him. He's not "into" hair. In fact he's suggested and complimented me when I've cut my hair short. Sorry, I'm rambling, 2 of my DC are in my face and messing with my hair as I speak, LOL. I'll write more later cuz they are driving me nuts.


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
What really tweaks my nerves is when men offer unsolicited opinions about my hair.

LoL . . . Word.

Btw, I did read _Hair Story_ and I really enjoyed it. It gave me a lot of insight and actually just a lot of information. In my opinion, it is a well researched, well written and well put together book that should be standard reading for everyone. I think the biggest point that made an impression on me is that African people/Black people have *always* been really into their hair. Way before the arrival of the Europeans and the slave trade. In many African cultures, everyone had their own comb that was specially crafted for them. The comb maker had a place of esteem in the society. Hours were devoted out of every week to the care and grooming of hair. In fact, hair was one way a person could be identified. From a person's hair you could tell if they were married or not, what their societal rank was, etc . . . One of the first things slave catchers did to dehumanize and demoralize enslaved Africans was to shave their heads.

Another interesting point was just the real business savvy/acumen of Madame C.J. Walker. I mean, she was good at what she did. She wasn't actually the creator of the straightening comb but she patented a method of using it that kept one's hair from breaking off and marketed it in a creative way. I am actually more in awe of her business sense than her product. I was so glad to have a more well-rounded view of Walker.

I really enjoyed the book. It mainly focused on Black hair in America (that is, the African American experience). I'd love to see something similar that talks about the experiences of Black folks other places too.


----------



## jeca

:


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
LoL . . . Word.

Btw, I did read _Hair Story_ and I really enjoyed it. It gave me a lot of insight and actually just a lot of information. In my opinion, it is a well researched, well written and well put together book that should be standard reading for everyone. I think the biggest point that made an impression on me is that African people/Black people have *always* been really into their hair. Way before the arrival of the Europeans and the slave trade. In many African cultures, everyone had their own comb that was specially crafted for them. The comb maker had a place of esteem in the society. Hours were devoted out of every week to the care and grooming of hair. In fact, hair was one way a person could be identified. From a person's hair you could tell if they were married or not, what their societal rank was, etc . . . One of the first things slave catchers did to dehumanize and demoralize enslaved Africans was to shave their heads.

Another interesting point was just the real business savvy/acumen of Madame C.J. Walker. I mean, she was good at what she did. She wasn't actually the creator of the straightening comb but she patented a method of using it that kept one's hair from breaking off and marketed it in a creative way. I am actually more in awe of her business sense than her product. I was so glad to have a more well-rounded view of Walker.

I really enjoyed the book. It mainly focused on Black hair in America (that is, the African American experience). I'd love to see something similar that talks about the experiences of Black folks other places too.

I would really like to read that, it sounds interesting.

I remember on nappturality they had an article discussing hair in the Dominican Republic and it is really sad. They talked about how some of the people there look down on people for having natural/nappy hair, the dislike for Haitians for having dark skin and very kinky hair. I was very surprised and pissed at the same time because the mentality of blacks all over the world has been just...messed up







I am going to try to find the article and post it.


----------



## Draupadi

Just felt like giving this thread a bump.
Good morning! How is everyone?


----------



## bajamergrrl

Good morning! I am well. I got out of bed with a little bounce of energy which I was amazed at since I'm 32 weeks pregnant.


----------



## Arike

Good morning! Or should I say afternoon! I am doing well, trying to figure out what to do with the little guy today. The weather seems nice, 80 degrees and sunny. But DH is visiting a friend so it's just me and DS today. He is quite the handful these days. He gets stronger and stronger by the day and requires constant attention! He wears me out! Maybe we will go to the park...


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## purplegirl

Hey lovelies! I am trying to find things to do today. We were promised sun and heat, but it is overcast and not very warm. I will probably end up running errands then putzing around the house...how exciting!!


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## Jannah6

I'm late responding, had a busy day yesterday. Sheila, you know that because you are my facebook buddy


----------



## ErikaDP

Hello Sisterfriends!

I has been so long since I have posted here! I have been so busy that I have had just enough time to read here but not enough time to post.
I am happy to see so many new members here-Welcome!
And I am very happy to see posts from long time members who I haven't seen posting here in a long while!
As for me, my life has been very full these past few months and I am finally able to see the conclusion of a lot of projects that have kept me very occupied since the first of the year.
So with a little more free time, I hope to post more here in the coming weeks.

Now for some questions!
Does anyone here have any summer trips planned? We are keeping it pretty low key-a couple of group camping trips are planned and we hope to travel to the west coast at least once this summer. But we most likely won't take a big weeks-long trip somewhere far away where we have to stay in a hotel.
So if you are planning a trip some where exciting, please post about it here so that I can live vicariously through your posts!
I also hope to have an all moms weekend trip with some of my girlfriends in the coming months and I will keep you all posted about the trip if I am able to arrange it.

Speaking of mamas, I would really like to get together with some of you MDC mamas in person. Are there any northeastern US mamas who would like to gather somewhere for a picnic? If given enough notice, I will travel pretty far for a gathering. Just let me know if you are interested..

And finally, I am on facebook(still trying to get the hang of it) and I would love to connect with my fellow MDC facebookers so please look me up!
Enjoy the rest of your Sunday!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


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## Jannah6

*ErikaDP*, just PM'D you my facebook name.

I would really LOVE to go to Disney World, but sadly it is not in the cards for us. I'd like to rent an RV and drive to Niagara Falls, but we'll see. We've been a little busy around here. My sons school annual picnic is on Tuesday. We always have so much fun, so I'm looking forward to it. On Sunday my husbands family is having a picnic, which should be chaotic, but fun.

*OT[/B:Yesterday someone told my aunt that Safi needed some sun







:. She won't tell me who told her. WTH, I would never say that about someones DC.*


----------



## shayinme

We are trying to plan a camping trip in the White Mountains, little place in Bartlett NH with cabins. ( not ready to brave a tent just yet) However money is really tight this year, dh's client load has dropped as has mine so we are not sure.

Erica, my best Maine sista-friend just moved back home to CT, she is from the Danbury area. So I know at some point this summer I will be in CT since I promised her I would come see her new place. Are you near Danbury at all?

I would love to get together with some of ya'll









Shay


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Now for some questions!
Does anyone here have any summer trips planned? We are keeping it pretty low key-a couple of group camping trips are planned and we hope to travel to the west coast at least once this summer. But we most likely won't take a big weeks-long trip somewhere far away where we have to stay in a hotel.
So if you are planning a trip some where exciting, please post about it here so that I can live vicariously through your posts!
I also hope to have an all moms weekend trip with some of my girlfriends in the coming months and I will keep you all posted about the trip if I am able to arrange it.

Speaking of mamas, I would really like to get together with some of you MDC mamas in person. Are there any northeastern US mamas who would like to gather somewhere for a picnic? If given enough notice, I will travel pretty far for a gathering. Just let me know if you are interested..

I plan to spend a fair amount of time at Four Quarters this summer, and a fair amount of time relaxing with my Redhead. Have I mentioned that I'm in love? I'm in love!







:







I'd love to meet up sometime, with or without small people.

Quote:

And finally, I am on facebook(still trying to get the hang of it) and I would love to connect with my fellow MDC facebookers so please look me up!
Enjoy the rest of your Sunday!
I'm on Facebook.







I'll PM you in a bit.


----------



## ErikaDP

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
We are trying to plan a camping trip in the White Mountains, little place in Bartlett NH with cabins. ( not ready to brave a tent just yet) However money is really tight this year, dh's client load has dropped as has mine so we are not sure.

Erica, my best Maine sista-friend just moved back home to CT, she is from the Danbury area. So I know at some point this summer I will be in CT since I promised her I would come see her new place. Are you near Danbury at all?

I would love to get together with some of ya'll









Shay

Hi Shay,

I live in the center of the state, so I am about an hour from Danbury. Let me know when you plan to visit your SF and we can meet up for lunch and/or dinner. And I am always up for meeting at bookstores, libraries and museums.
You know, Danbury is only about an hour or so from New York City, so maybe we can plan an MDC mamas gathering somewhere close by(there are a lot of really quaint little towns near by)while you are in the area. Just something to think about.

Where do you live in Maine? Are you in Portland?
The reason that I ask is because I plan to go up to Maine sometime this summer and I wouldn't mind being shown around by a "local". Let me know if you are up for a day trip visitor.
Thanks for your reply.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ErikaDP* 
Hi Shay,

I live in the center of the state, so I am about an hour from Danbury. Let me know when you plan to visit your SF and we can meet up for lunch and/or dinner. And I am always up for meeting at bookstores, libraries and museums.
You know, Danbury is only about an hour or so from New York City, so maybe we can plan an MDC mamas gathering somewhere close by(there are a lot of really quaint little towns near by)while you are in the area. Just something to think about.

Where do you live in Maine? Are you in Portland?
The reason that I ask is because I plan to go up to Maine sometime this summer and I wouldn't mind being shown around by a "local". Let me know if you are up for a day trip visitor.
Thanks for your reply.

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:

I am only 20 mins south of Portland. I basically live in one of those towns you always pass on the coast. Yes, I would love to show you around, Portland is a fabulous town. Let me know when you want to come and we can make some plans. I will let you know when I am heading to Danbury.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
I plan to spend a fair amount of time at Four Quarters this summer, and a fair amount of time relaxing with my Redhead. Have I mentioned that I'm in love? I'm in love!







:







I'd love to meet up sometime, with or without small people.

I'm on Facebook.







I'll PM you in a bit.









You sound happy! Details if you feel like sharing.


----------



## eilonwy

: I thought I'd already bragged on him on all of my regular threads.







He's a redhead, so he's tHRH (the Hot Red Head). I'm absolutely smitten with him, he's fantastic. Everything about him thrills me endlessly, and he feels the same way about me (which rawks! Rawr!














. He's met the kids, who adore him and he loves them, too. Bean's actually called him Dad twice.







It's hilarious. Bella says his hair is "owange," or that he has a "fi-uh head."







: She likes him a lot, but Bean and BooBah are insane about him-- so much so that yesterday when I got back from the farm BooBah said, "Oh, hi mom. Where's tHRH?" "Well I didn't bring him." "Why not? You should go pick him up!" "He has to work tomorrow." "So when does he finish work?!" and so on.







It's adorable.

He's fantastic. I really can't say enough wonderful things about his hotness, which has featured prominantly in my Facebook statuses for about two months now. At least.







I'm so deliriously happy.














:


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## rootzdawta

Ladies . . . I went hiking today for the first time in my life. And it was great.







: I took both the boys (sDS2 was in the mei tai). Bugs and all, it was really a beautiful experience. Two main reasons I have avoided the great outdoors: 1. I'm phobic of snakes and 2. I have severe allergies. But there were no snakes today and my allergy medicine (kinda sorta) worked like it was supposed to. Plus, we did the whole trail and I was not winded which means that I am in good shape now physically and stronger.







: On top of all that, the hike was with some really good folks who are also homeschoolers and I just can't believe how unbelievably blessed I am that these folks came into my life. I'm moving out of my comfort zones and liking it while making good friends for myself and my kids along the way!







:


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## purplegirl

Hey sista friends. Congrats Rynna. I've seen your face book status msgs but didn't catch the clues! Good luck with the red headed one!

Rootz, your hiking expedition sounds like fun. I haven't been hiking since I was a kid, much for the same reasons you avoided it. You would have freaked had you been to my home on Saturday. I went out back to check on my garden only to find a snake coiled up in front of it. I know there are lots of them in my yard but this is the first time I've seen one that close. I was surprisingly calm but you can best believe, I am forever paranoid. I had my lawn guy put down snake away and clear away a lot of the english ivy; another sista informed me that mint helps to keep them at bay.

I am making my annual trek to the vineyard. This year a very dear friend will be joining us. Other than that, we will probably make quick weekend trips to close cities.

I'd love to meet you lovelies in person. I am open to traveling anywhere to make it happen.


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## futurmama8

Hi Erika I will PM you my name on facebook. I live in Cincinnati and we are going to North Carolina for our family reunion in a couple weeks, maybe chicago later in the summer because I







: loved it. I really am trying to play it low key since I have to save for Tanzania this fall. I don't have any babies though







.

Rootzdawta I would love to go hiking. What kind of shoes did you wear? I am thinking of getting some Vibram five fingers and they are supposed to be good for hiking and running. I have a feeling that I would be wore out though.


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *purplegirl* 
Rootz, your hiking expedition sounds like fun. I haven't been hiking since I was a kid, much for the same reasons you avoided it. You would have freaked had you been to my home on Saturday. I went out back to check on my garden only to find a snake coiled up in front of it. I know there are lots of them in my yard but this is the first time I've seen one that close. I was surprisingly calm but you can best believe, I am forever paranoid. I had my lawn guy put down snake away and clear away a lot of the english ivy; another sista informed me that mint helps to keep them at bay.









: I would have been running for dear life. My sister is also deathly afraid of snakes. We read a story once where a guy in some tropical place fought a huge massive python. The python was in a tree and fell down on the guy and started to squeeze him. The guy just kept stabbing him for hours and hours and hours until he won. We joked that it would have been so easy for the snake as we would have passed out right upon seeing it LoL.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 

Rootzdawta I would love to go hiking. What kind of shoes did you wear? I am thinking of getting some Vibram five fingers and they are supposed to be good for hiking and running. I have a feeling that I would be wore out though.

I wore my Pumas. LoL. Regular old sneakers. They were kind of jacked up to begin with from getting caught in the rain but they held up pretty well for the hike. If I had to do it again, or if it's going to be a regular thing, I would invest in some Timberland chukkas or something like that. My ankles could have used a bit more support.


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## rootzdawta

For Rynna: I'm in Love

Enjoy this time girl!! Being freshly in love is dreamy.







(So is being not-so-freshly in love but that takes more work! LoL.)


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## futurmama8

Hey ladies I need some information. My unemployed, 11th grade drop out twin brother just got someone pregnant...







It isn't a bad thing that the baby is coming but he isn't prepared AT ALL. Anyway, I wanted to know if you guys knew of some good baby books? I think ones that maybe push a little on the AP side but not too hard but educate about breastfeeding, co-sleeping and circ or something would be nice. Do you guys know of anything?


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## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Hey ladies I need some information. My unemployed, 11th grade drop out twin brother just got someone pregnant...







It isn't a bad thing that the baby is coming but he isn't prepared AT ALL. Anyway, I wanted to know if you guys knew of some good baby books? I think ones that maybe push a little on the AP side but not too hard but educate about breastfeeding, co-sleeping and circ or something would be nice. Do you guys know of anything?

Hmmmm...I don't have any suggestions as DH read all the same books that i did. But maybe it will also be good to find something that incorporates a little humor as well. If I think of something, I'll le tyou know. I wish I had done that for my brother. I really really really don't like how he and his fiance parent...but I'm the







: of the family lol.


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## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 
I wore my Pumas. LoL. Regular old sneakers. They were kind of jacked up to begin with from getting caught in the rain but they held up pretty well for the hike. If I had to do it again, or if it's going to be a regular thing, I would invest in some Timberland chukkas or something like that. My ankles could have used a bit more support.

Thanks I love pumas they are really comfortable. Can I just say I LOOOVVEE your blog. I love to read and I discovered your library and there are so many books I am going to read now that I am out of school. We read Things Fall Apart in high school and I was captivated by it, I've read about four times since then and it never gets old. Thanks for that Rootzdawta, your post about yoga has inspired me as well.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Hey ladies I need some information. My unemployed, 11th grade drop out twin brother just got someone pregnant...







It isn't a bad thing that the baby is coming but he isn't prepared AT ALL. Anyway, I wanted to know if you guys knew of some good baby books? I think ones that maybe push a little on the AP side but not too hard but educate about breastfeeding, co-sleeping and circ or something would be nice. Do you guys know of anything?

What about Dr. Sears baby book? Its pretty basic as far as hardcore AP stuff but its a good entry into things without scaring him and his lady off.


----------



## eilonwy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Hey ladies I need some information. My unemployed, 11th grade drop out twin brother just got someone pregnant...







It isn't a bad thing that the baby is coming but he isn't prepared AT ALL. Anyway, I wanted to know if you guys knew of some good baby books? I think ones that maybe push a little on the AP side but not too hard but educate about breastfeeding, co-sleeping and circ or something would be nice. Do you guys know of anything?

You might try talking to the girl; I mean, you already have a good idea about how your brother's going to react (or not), but you could forge a new relationship with your niece's mother and perhaps end up with a sling-wearing, cloth-using, extended-nursing new friend.







Ask Sam I'm Not how she found MDC.


----------



## Draupadi

I wish we had some plans to speak of for the summer, but we may plan a trip to Cali for the fall/winter. My cousin lives there and another cousin is in college out in LA.

And btb, I'm on Facebook too if anyone wants to add me as a friend.









Hope everyone's well!


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shayinme* 
What about Dr. Sears baby book? Its pretty basic as far as hardcore AP stuff but its a good entry into things without scaring him and his lady off.

I was thinking that and some of the reviews on Amazon were bad. Is it unrealistic for a black woman who is low income, will need to work and go to school? I just wanted something pretty balanced but I think I will buy that. I am definitely going to recommend cloth diapers and I would be willing to buy them for her.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 
You might try talking to the girl; I mean, you already have a good idea about how your brother's going to react (or not), but you could forge a new relationship with your niece's mother and perhaps end up with a sling-wearing, cloth-using, extended-nursing new friend.







Ask Sam I'm Not how she found MDC.









I definitely will talk to her I just don't know her and I really don't want to be preachy especially since I have no babies myself. I guess I want her to learn on her own and if she has questions I can recommend her here and answer anything she needs to know. That would be AWESOME if she ended being like that but I know this lifestyle isn't for everyone so I won't be betting on it LOL.


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## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
Thanks I love pumas they are really comfortable. Can I just say I LOOOVVEE your blog. I love to read and I discovered your library and there are so many books I am going to read now that I am out of school. We read Things Fall Apart in high school and I was captivated by it, I've read about four times since then and it never gets old. Thanks for that Rootzdawta, your post about yoga has inspired me as well.

















Thank you so much!!

I love to read too . . . so much in fact that I think I really do want to go back to school to get a doctorate in literature no matter how long it takes me to actually start. I really love literature so much.







And yoga too! Glad I inspired you!!


----------



## futurmama8

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rootzdawta* 







Thank you so much!!

I love to read too . . . so much in fact that I think I really do want to go back to school to get a doctorate in literature no matter how long it takes me to actually start. I really love literature so much.







And yoga too! Glad I inspired you!!









I sometimes battle with the program I am in now and a literature degree but I just take a bunch of lit classes and read by







off.

O and congrats on becoming a mod







hope I am not too late.


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## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I was thinking that and some of the reviews on Amazon were bad. Is it unrealistic for a black woman who is low income, will need to work and go to school? I just wanted something pretty balanced but I think I will buy that. I am definitely going to recommend cloth diapers and I would be willing to buy them for her.

.

IMO sadly most of what is out there as far as having a AP slant frankly does not probably sit well for most working mamas especially WOC. That said there is a Afro-centric parenting website and book by a sista I have known online for a number of years. (she isn't really at MDC anymore). She is a single mama, who did the cloth dipes, co-slept, slings, etc...

I will get a link to her website and you can see if you can get a copy of her book, I think they were almost out of print.

I thought the baby book was okay but it was clearly written with the assumption Mama was home







:. Granted I stayed home the first 13 months and have not worked ft since my dd was born but I hate those assumptions because families come in all shapes.


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## futurmama8

Thanks Shay for the help. I am thinking of getting her the holistic parenting book because it seems pretty good and maybe get her the baby book too as a reference.

I just bout the Holistic parenting book it doesn't look very long either.


----------



## AndrewsMother

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eilonwy* 







: I thought I'd already bragged on him on all of my regular threads.







He's a redhead, so he's tHRH (the Hot Red Head). I'm absolutely smitten with him, he's fantastic. Everything about him thrills me endlessly, and he feels the same way about me (which rawks! Rawr!














. He's met the kids, who adore him and he loves them, too. Bean's actually called him Dad twice.







It's hilarious. Bella says his hair is "owange," or that he has a "fi-uh head."







: She likes him a lot, but Bean and BooBah are insane about him-- so much so that yesterday when I got back from the farm BooBah said, "Oh, hi mom. Where's tHRH?" "Well I didn't bring him." "Why not? You should go pick him up!" "He has to work tomorrow." "So when does he finish work?!" and so on.







It's adorable.

He's fantastic. I really can't say enough wonderful things about his hotness, which has featured prominantly in my Facebook statuses for about two months now. At least.







I'm so deliriously happy.














:


Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, a new love. Those are awesome! I love, love, love being married, but I often miss that warm feeling that comes along with a new crush!!!!


----------



## Jannah6

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 

O and congrats on becoming a mod







hope I am not too late.

Oh, I didn't even notice until Rianne mentioned it. CONGRATS, don't ban me! LOL


----------



## rootzdawta

Quote:


Originally Posted by *futurmama8* 
I sometimes battle with the program I am in now and a literature degree but I just take a bunch of lit classes and read by







off.

O and congrats on becoming a mod







hope I am not too late.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jannah6* 
Oh, I didn't even notice until Rianne mentioned it. CONGRATS, don't ban me! LOL









Thanks!!! Very interesting being on the other side.


----------



## madsommer

Hey ladies,

I am just so sick over my brother's impending wedding at the end of the month. I am so vehemently against it after some things that transpired this past week, but told him that if he really wanted me to, I would still be a member of the bridal party. Well, he still wants me to be a part of it, so I will have to put on a happy face. I wish I was happy for him.

Part of me feels guilty for telling him that I didn't he should get married and that I don't support the union, but the better part of me knows that it was important to tell him that I don't think this "woman" is worthy of him. It's too long to get into, but basically she's verbally abusive and disrespectful toward him. This is all just so hard to watch.

I know no one expected my husband and I to really last. But despite how hastily things occured for us and how much we struggle financially, our home is filled with love honor and respect.

Why would you tell your future spouse, even in anger, that you weren't too worried about the marriage anyway because it was just a civil ceremony so you didn't care if you had to get it annulled? I am just flabbergasted at her (and his) behavior. They are a volatile mix and I just feel so badly for the both of them and the child involved. Sigh. Just needed to vent. Thanks.


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## AndrewsMother

That is sad madsommer. I know a couple who have a marriage like the one that your brother is about to enter. They have been married for 15 years, and at best the whole household is dysfunctional.

Has your brother sought out any type of relationship counseling?


----------



## madsommer

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
That is sad madsommer. I know a couple who have a marriage like the one that your brother is about to enter. They have been married for 15 years, and at best the whole household is dysfunctional.

Has your brother sought out any type of relationship counseling?

When I had talked to my brother a few days ago, the day of the fight, he said that he suggested it to her and she refused. Maybe she changed her mind. I hope that they do follow through and get some counseling, as it's paramount to them creating any sort of functional relationship - though I don't think it ever will be.


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## splendid

Friends, how are you all doing? I'm so happy to see new faces and old friends.

It has been sometime. We are all here. It has been a very interesting couple of months. We are wrapping up our formal school year at home and are ready to start our summer adventures. This year we are hoping to camp in northern Virginia, NY, and in Maine. My dh is happy we are getting back outdoors.

Both of my boys are good, I realized last week my 2 year old is going to be 3 in a few weeks and that my 8 year old has become very wise. In sad news, my sister left her newborn baby with me. And we have been taking care of her since then. My husband had his doubts (as did everyone else) that she was going to come back for her, and asked me to find away to tell her to comeback for her daughter.







I see his rationale, he didn't want to become attached to this baby and then have my sister come and take her back in x months are x years. Unfortunately, my sister does have a history of doing these things (leaving her children with others instead of raising them herself). It makes me sad knowing we are giving the baby back to such uncertainty. This baby has been long enough to have thought we are her parents and my kids are her brothers.









I'm still around on Facebook so throw me a PM and we can catch up and keep in contact there.


----------



## shayinme

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
It has been sometime. We are all here. It has been a very interesting couple of months. We are wrapping up our formal school year at home and are ready to start our summer adventures. This year we are hoping to camp in northern Virginia, NY, and in Maine. My dh is happy we are getting back outdoors.



Where in Maine? I live up here (Southern Maine) so I'd love to hear your camping plans. We are hoping to go camping as well but was thinking a little place in New Hampshire.

Shay


----------



## purplegirl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *splendid* 
Friends, how are you all doing? I'm so happy to see new faces and old friends.

It has been sometime. We are all here. It has been a very interesting couple of months. We are wrapping up our formal school year at home and are ready to start our summer adventures. This year we are hoping to camp in northern Virginia, NY, and in Maine. My dh is happy we are getting back outdoors.

Both of my boys are good, I realized last week my 2 year old is going to be 3 in a few weeks and that my 8 year old has become very wise. In sad news, my sister left her newborn baby with me. And we have been taking care of her since then. My husband had his doubts (as did everyone else) that she was going to come back for her, and asked me to find away to tell her to comeback for her daughter.







I see his rationale, he didn't want to become attached to this baby and then have my sister come and take her back in x months are x years. Unfortunately, my sister does have a history of doing these things (leaving her children with others instead of raising them herself). It makes me sad knowing we are giving the baby back to such uncertainty. This baby has been long enough to have thought we are her parents and my kids are her brothers.









I'm still around on Facebook so throw me a PM and we can catch up and keep in contact there.

Hey there. It has been a long time. I am so sorry to hear about your niece. Can you all get custody or guardianship since your sister has essentially abandoned her? It is very nice to 'see' you.


----------



## Bloomingstar

Hi all! I've been lurking. all is well over here. Baby will be 6 months in a couple weeks and I can't wrap my mind around that quite yet. My MIL came to visit for about 3 weeks and it was wonderful--I ate well







: No one told me breastfeeding would make me hungrier than pregnancy! DS is in the 90th percentile for weight and height, so my body is working hard. I'm still figuring out how to manage things, I guess--cooking, cleaning up, keeping baby happy, not going nuts in here--but everyday I feel like I have a better handle on it all. We're going to Houston this summer, in August, to see my father and stepmother and my sister, her husband, and their 3 little ones will be there at the same time so I am super excited. And I'm cloth diapering the baby, which I am happy about, and my sister has ended up switching to cloth because my niece had a rash that wouldn't quit. too bad about the rash but pretty cool that now things are sorted out with the cloth. I think I'm going to finally break down and get a stroller. It's going to be a bit hot for the Moby, I think, and this boy is almost 20lbs as it is.


----------



## eilonwy

I don't blame anyone for wanting a stroller with a 20 pound baby. Then again, my kids don't generally get to 20 pounds before 18 months; In fact, of the four only Bear has managed to hit 20 before a year.







Bella actually managed to triple her birth weight by 15 months, but she was still only 18 pounds.







Do what you've got to do, and save the sling for shorter trips & around the house.







Oh, and back carries are, in my experience, much easier with heavier babies. (I have no idea how you carry your little dude, but I'm assuming it's round front because that's what most of us do.)


----------



## georgia

Hi, everyone









I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it's time to start a new thread so we can keep our server happy. If someone can please start the next thread, that would be great. Thanks so much and sorry for the inconvenience!


----------



## rootzdawta

Here's the link.


----------



## georgia

Thank you!!!


----------



## ErikaDP

Wow! What a long thread!
And I hate to admit it, but I am really sorry to see this thread go!








Onward to the new thread!

**..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ Peace, Love & Light!-:¦:-
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´**

Take Care,
Erika







(I don't wear a fro, I'm just a sister who likes this smilie!)







:


----------

