# who is a lawyer? Who can help? (not a joke, this is for real)



## 5796 (Oct 19, 2002)

quick...read this thread.....

this mommy needs a lawyer.

tell Len what she should do.

http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...0&pagenumber=1

thanks
tracy


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## Els' 3 Ones (Nov 19, 2001)

Surely someone at the shelter should have a minimal knowledge of law......................in my mind (extremely minimal) if she is in a shelter for abused women and families this would be considered greatly by any judge hearing custody. She needs to have everything documented and ready to go. All abuse incidences,etc.

C'mon this can't go down like this, can it?

El


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## Luma (Nov 21, 2001)

mamas, im so mad at this,
I have a question, do you think her being mexican could have anything to do with the direction things are turning for her and her baby??
I dont want to turn this in to a troublesome post, just thinking outloud that maybe she has legal grounds for something if that could be the case?


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## Kiyomi (Apr 11, 2003)

bumping up the new post list....


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## SpiralWoman (Jul 2, 2002)

how can a mother ever kidnap her own child unless custody had previously been revoked in a court? Am I correct in understanding she is in VA? Do husbands still own wives & children in VA? She has to have a lawyer. How do we set up a legal fund for her? Has anyone posted in the VA tribal area for someone local to help her seek aid?


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## Marlena (Jul 19, 2002)

Does she have any documentation of the abuse? Any hospital records? Any witnesses? Any records at the DV hotline and/or shelter? Photos of injuries/bruises? Counseling records that would provide support for her claims? Anything?? If so, she needs to marshall it NOW.

Why have her attys stepped down? Is it due to conflict of interest? Or is something else going on? This is NOT to imply anything negative about the woman (I don't know her from Eve, and know nothing about her or her situation), but merely because it could be relevant: did she lie to her attys? Did she say something on the stand that wasn't true? Did she try to get her attys to assist her in something that wasn't legal? (These are also reasons an atty might step down from a case). If any of the above happened (again, I'm NOT implying that it did, but it could be relevant), then she needs to stop; if anything of the sort has occurred, it's already hurt her case and could cause further serious, irreparable harm to her and her child.

If there's _good_ evidence of abuse, then I'm hard-pressed to understand how, even if her husband has lots of cash and excellent legal assistance, could've gotten custody. Did she have attorneys for the hearing? Did she marshall her evidence, including witnesses? If not, then she needs to file - if possible - an interlocutory appeal ASAP, and get an injunction against the order taking effect (I have no idea whether this is a possible step in her state - she'll have to check with an attorney).

If she's not gone through her local legal aid clinic yet (if one exists in her area), then she ought to do so NOW. Depending on her area, she may also be able to get an order directing her husband to pay for her atty, if she gets a private one. If that can't be done, then she should check with the local bar association to see if there are any private attys who might be able to take on her case at a cut rate or pro bono.

Good luck to her!


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## Dragonfly (Nov 27, 2001)

Quote:

_Originally posted by SpiralWoman_
*Has anyone posted in the VA tribal area for someone local to help her seek aid?*
I'm in VA (though a ways away from her) and today contacted a few agencies - one close to me that is very active and has had great success helping women in similar situations (though they are close to me, I'm hoping they might have some contacts in her area) and one domestic violence center in her area that is supposed to get back to me. Unfortunately, Friday is not the best time to get people enthused about helping out







. I'm going to keep looking through the weekend for other resources for this woman and keep in contact with Len about my findings.

I'm really surprised that the shelter may have failed her in this area. Hopefully we'll run across the certain someone who can get her on the fast track to legal aid soon....


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## Dragonfly (Nov 27, 2001)

*Quote:*

I have a question, do you think her being mexican could have anything to do with the direction things are turning for her and her baby??
You know, part of me would really be surprised and part of me would not. There is a huge Mexican immigrant (both legal and undocumented) population in both my area and hers. In theory, whether they are here legally or not, they are entitled to the same protections as anyone else. And I know the court system here must "deal" with immigrant men and women quite frequently so I doubt that she's receiving lesser consideration because of it. IMO, it's probably the money that's talking more than anything else. Of course, it's always possible that her case had the misfortune to land in front of some hick judge who has it out for illegals. But I really think it's probably the money - or, at least, the fact that the money is enabling the abuser to take the offensive (in more ways than one) position.


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## Len (Nov 19, 2001)

Trabot, thanks for starting this thread.
Marlena, probably I made a wrong statement, about her lawyers stepping out.... what really happened is, the shelter had offered to get her a lawyer, but, because she is mexican, she was also in contact with the consulate (in Washington) and they also offered to assist with a lawyer, but afterwards, the shelter assumed that the consulate was taking care of the legal and they didn't do anything, while the consulate didn't have anyone either. So as of this afternoon she didn't have a lawyer, but was speaking with the consulate, which is hard for her because it being long distance.
I asked her and there is no evidence/witnesses/documentation/reports of any incidents before. The only thing she may have in favour is that he has a record of conviction for assault (that he lied to her about).
He has spoken with the H and he tried to lure her back to the house, if she does that, her grounds for an abuse complain do not stand ground. But so far it may be the only way she gets to stay with her daughter.
Dragonfly, I'll call her tomorrow first thing, I'll give her the information you gave me and I'll try to send her all the other posts here, in case something may help.
She is just too devastated, and I'm worried for her health/wellbeing.
Thanks everyone, and I'll keep you posted.


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## Len (Nov 19, 2001)

I forgot, I also wanted to ask a lawyer or someone who may know, there's a posibility that the H has searched this boards, and may even be reading what I am posting about her....
are we safe? should I be less specific? Can he use this information against her somehow? Maybe is too late anyway, but this has turned so ugly that I don't know what to think....


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## Marlena (Jul 19, 2002)

H may have no idea that these boards exist, let alone that his wife uses them. Nevertheless, I would not suggest posting further information publicly, if you're concerned it could be detrimental to her if H found out about it.

If you're worried about info that's already been posted, then you might consider editing it out of your posts.

Feel free to PM me (note, though, that I am NOT a VA lawyer, and can't give any specific information, as such). Also, there are a number of other attys on the board, one or more of whom may also be willing to help (I don't know).


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## Eggie (Aug 7, 2003)

Hi all,

I was the mother in trouble and now I feel safe to post because of the last things that happened. I was living in a very hard situation of emotional abuse with my husband, no hittings but I think that you don't need to be hited to hurt that much. It was just unbearable plus he threaten me to call immigration and tell them he wont sponsor me anymore and send me back to my country and will make arrangements so I wont see my daughter never again. My Visa stills as a tourist with a pending extension. Most of all our problems were because of all the big lies he told me before we got married, also some big family secrets and issues, his lack of anger management and because of the sick control of his parents in his and our lifes (they do control everything in his life, and makes him feel guilty if he doesn't follows them, plus I just discovered that their ego is so enourmous), plus he has some mental dissorders and refused to take medication, and the insults and mind games were terrible. So finally one day, and God helped me so much, I decided to leave to a Domestic Abuse and Violence Shelter with my baby. When I got there I found out that my case was really much risky than I thought, the abuse was really hard. Mostly I was so afraid of loosing her, as I was loosing my self in this relationship with out being able to fix it or end it because he refused it always. It was the best desition I could made, I felt really free and safe for a couple of days but I didn't want to go to the police because I was afraid of him having so many troubles as he has a record and also lied in his job about it, I didn't want to hurt anyone, and he will be forever my daughter's dad so I just waited for days and days until the Shelter or the Consulate would provide me with a lawyer, I wasn't even sure of what to do, just wanted to do it the less painful for all of us. I wanted so much to rest.
Well, meanwhile my husband acted so quickly, and this mostly because of his parents who took all control of the situation. They hired a private investigador, one of the bests in US (she was charging $500 usd an hour) and a really expensive lawyer, and he obtained an ex parte emergency custody with so many lies that made me sick.Then they "kidnapped" my e-mail account so they found out where I was and of course they know now about any place in which I post, but it's ok now, I wont hide anything and if they are reading this I hope God will help you because I consider you very, very bad and mean persons and I sincerely hope you can have peaceful dreams when you go to sleep with such a bad conscience (sp?).
So after the custody thing, which I went to ask by myself about it at the Court and signed it (I thought I wasn't served though) I was now commiting an abduction and I was commiting a crime! God, it was really a nightmare. After I found this I called him and we agreed on doing the things the right way, he was going to drop off that totally unfair custody, was going to look for medical help for him and even was going to issue passports and authorization letters for my daughter to fly to Spain with me, and yes, with out abuse and control, we were going to try to fix our relationship in the future, after he would really start helping himself, that was last Thursday's night and the next morning the police called the Shelter sayingthat the father , my husband, just called to urge them to recover his child (he later told me that his father made the phone call with out telling him about it), and I was "about to spend many years on jail if I didn't deliver my daughter at 2:30 at the Sheriff's office". His mother and his exgirlfriend were the ones who were going to pick her up (can you imagine that???) but he "changed" his mind and decided to pick her up by himself at 5:00 letting me the possibility to go back to him and not been separated from my daughter... just the thought of spending one night with out her was so hard for me then. So yes, I went there, he lied on his knees and asked me to come back to him and sadly I didn't have any option. I am back to my husband, and I found out that his parents were the perpretators of all of this (and yes, also him because he signed all the documents), that they always wanted us to get a divorce and obtain the custody of my baby so they could have her and my husband would married his exgirlfriend.
Everybody knows that I am an excellent mother (sorry for the lack of humble but I need to say it for the next statement), even his parents, just to see my baby, who is always extremely happy, with a smile that enlightens any room and any heart and so healthy growing up like a weed and ... and For God sake: I was about to be in jail!... by the hands of my inlaws... Ok, so my husband knows that I am not here by my own will, and I do still love him, I think I will always will so we will try to fix this, he is working in drop off that custody thing, he will go to several therapies, including one designed for abusive husbands, also we will go to marriage counseling and he accepted that he is an abuser, he will stop contact with his parents, at least me andmy daughter wont see them never again, and he also knows that I wont tolerate any more abuse and I will leave again if this happens, but now with papers on my hand (which we are working on), plus my staying on the Shelter plus some more things count as a proof of abuse if anything else happens. The most important part of this is that I will never hide it again, now everyone knows it and also everyone follows up. It was so hard for me to feel absolutely alone with such a carry on my shoulders, and now, thanks to you wonderful ladies, and many, many other people I know I'm not







.
My pets remain in the Shelter, soon they will come back to us, my daughter loves them so much







but I would appreciate to know any data of possible foster homes in VA for them just to keep them on hand.
I really hope that we can make it thorough this, so many emotional scars but just his real willing to do it, even if I was cohersed (sp?) to come back, could be the difference.
Also after reading this, any legal advice will be appreciated. My husband knows that in order to really have a wonderful relationship I must feel safe after such a horrible trauma. He also knows that if I stay with him after this, it's because I really will want it, with out control, with freedom... that is what we are looking for







.
Please keep us in your prayers and THANK YOU very much for all your help, specially to my dear Len


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## 13moons (Aug 9, 2002)

Oh Eggie! What an awful experience! I truly hope that everything works out for you and your daughter. We all need to feel safe and loved.
You sound like a very brave woman and a good mom.
Just know that we are on your side and that there is a community here that you can come talk to and find support and advice and help from when you need it. Good luck to you and your family. Take care of yourself!


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## simonee (Nov 21, 2001)

{{{{{{Eggie}}}}}}










That's just awful! I hope you can find the strength to do what's best for you and your daughter, I hope your h can find the courage to choose for you and not his parents.

wishing you the best and thinking of you


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## SoHappy (Nov 19, 2001)

I'm keeping good thoughts in my heart for you.


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## lotusdebi (Aug 29, 2002)




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## cinnamonamon (May 2, 2003)

s to you!! We're here if you need anything!


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## oatmeal (Nov 15, 2002)

Hey Len

I have posted this is a couple of other places but I think people just ignore my posts these days.

I know a great lawyer in legal aid here in Los Angeles your friend can 1. talk to and 2. can get concrete way to secure a lawyer in VA.

this lawyer deals with Mexican mamas a lot too, and Mexican mamas married to Americans.

That's my last try! thanks.


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## Meiri (Aug 31, 2002)

I'm not a lawyer, but from your post Eggie it looks to me like a restraining order against his parents is in order!

If counselling and working on the marriage is what you both want, then I wish you well and all success.

But if the grandparents of your child continue with that kind of interference and abuse (yes it is abuse IMO to interfere with your son's marriage) then I'd not hold out much hope.


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## magnoliablue (Dec 29, 2002)

Eggie, I have been following your story, and want you to know, if you ever need to talk, or need advice.. I am a victim of abuse..verbal and physical..and actually the emotional and verbal abuse is far worse than physical.. physical wounds may heal, but the emotional scars they, and the emotional abuse leaves, take a long time to heal. I wish you the best in working out your marriage difficulties, and I agree that this will be difficult with the interference of other people such as his family. Please know that there are many here to help you, and whenever you need, I am here for you. Karen..magnoliablue


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## Luma (Nov 21, 2001)

Dear Eggie, Im so proud of you, what you said about the abuse that now is known, and is not silent anymore, and that you know youre not alone, is an empowering feeling and reality! Im very glad to read that dd and you are together. You went through so much in these days and you have to hold on to all that you learned, to your truth, and be strong.
You both have been in my heart all these days and in the hearts of the mammas here, and you know you are supported by all of us women here, and from the MDC dads too, and if theres anything you can think of that we can do as a community, please let us know and we will do it.
Its very good to hear from you.
love
Lupita


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## Eggie (Aug 7, 2003)

Thank you everyone!!!, we are hanging in here








Can anyone, specially lawyers, share more on this?:



> _Originally posted by Meiri_
> *I'm not a lawyer, but from your post Eggie it looks to me like a restraining order against his parents is in order!
> 
> If you like to PM about it I will be so happy.
> Thank you again!!!!!!*


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## Gemini (Apr 9, 2003)

to you Eggie.

I was so sickened when I heard last week he was takingyour dd and I'm so relieved to know it's turning out differently.

I think you should give Oatmeal a private message to talk to her about the lawyer she knows.


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## Dragonfly (Nov 27, 2001)

Eggie









Here's the website for the Rappahannock Council on Domestic Violence. They have a shelter and their headquarters in Fredericksburg:

RCDV

Definitely check out their website and give them a call. I spoke with them the other day and it seems like they might be in a position to assist you with finding legal help. Also, try calling Legal Aid in your area. You'll have to go through an intake process. You'll want to be as detailed as possible so they know they are dealing with an abuse case - thus, maybe less likely to count your husband's income in the qualification process? Not sure how that works, but hopefully it will be the case.

Finally, as soon as ds' father gets back with the car, I'm going to PM you the name and number for a woman who does dog rescue in Fredericksburg (with Central Virginia Animal Rescue, I believe).

Stay strong!


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## dancingmama (Dec 18, 2001)

Eggie, I tried to pm you but your mailbox is full.

My heart goes out to you, and I hope you are feeling safe! I wanted to make sure you received the gift certificate I sent -- it went to your PO Box (Len gave me the address) and now that you are back home, I hope that it was the correct place to send it....

Let us know how you are doing, and great big HUGS to you!

dancingmama


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## Eggie (Aug 7, 2003)

Hello ladies









Again thank you all for your support. I have a sad update, this time the abuser wasn't my husband but his mother. Last Saturday, while my husband wasn't here, my inlaws came to deliver somethings for him. When they rang the bell I answered from the second floor window and ask them to leave it in front of the door, but the mother said that they were carrying a cellphone for him so then I asked them to come back when my husband were here but they insist in giving me those things, so I came down, opened slightly the door to take the things and the mother said: "I came to see the baby", so I asked her to talk to my husband first and she said "No, I will see her now", so she pushed me really hard and got in to the house with her husband behind, and I ran upstairs and she went behind me... I made it to my baby's room and locked the door, so she started kicking and punching the door like crazy and saying the worst insults in the wolrd: Fu...ng bi*c, Wh**e..., I'm going to declare you insane, that baby is mine, you are going to loose her, I'm going to take that baby from you", shouting so hard and vicious and my poor baby and me we where so scared inside the room... I asked her to leave or I would have to call 911 but she said this was her son's house and she would come when ever she wants, and kept insulting, and then the father started shouting that I was mentally insane and well... I was absolutely scared. After 10 minutes of insults, and when they notice that I wasn't going to participate in the fight, they left and they slammed the door so hard that things fell from the shelves downstairs... I called 911 and filed a report and then called my husband and he came immediately to take me to the Magister. My husband told me that things could got so much worse if I didn't lock my self in the room... he knows his mother... Gosh, they are absolutely crazy, this is so scary. I was amazed to notice how similar my husband and his mother act... but his mother is more, more vicious and extremelly cruel.
Sadly my husband, who at first was very supportive, after talking to his parents that night, is already making excuses for them, whom said I was very dramatic and nothing really happened (of course...), and he is already promising them that they will see our daughter really soon. And what about the terror in my daughter's eyes while this woman was hitting the door of the room and shouting all kinds of insults???
This is sooo sad







.
They told him that as soon as they get from their vacation, they will come back next January, they will do some research about grandparental rights in Virginia...
Will see what can we solve in our next marriage counseling session. Probably not much, plus again I live in fear about this sick people trying new things to separate me from my daughter. I will all let you know what happens in the future, but please keep praying for us. Thank you.
Wishing you a beautiful Christmas, God bless you all.


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## 5796 (Oct 19, 2002)

eggie,

it is time to get a lawyer.

It is my opinion that you need to start getting some long vision. if you know what I mean...you need a lawyer to guide you as to what they can and can't do and you need to be discussing, "what if" it does not work out with your husband and he turns on you again....

hugs

tracy


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## shelbean91 (May 11, 2002)

I agree- you need to talk to a lawyer. You should have an order of protection to keep his mother away from you if that is the way she is. Did you file a police report? You need to do that right away- even if it is days later. Keep a journal of dates and times that things happen. Get a video or tape recorder so if something like this happens again, you have proof of what she said and did.

I understand she wants to see her granddaughter, but needs to go about it appropriately. There is no reason she can't only come by when your dh is home, if at all.

I don't think there is anything she can do about grandparents rights at this point, but maybe someone else has info about that.


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## Moon (Nov 25, 2001)

Lawyer up, Eggie. No matter what your husband promises you, no matter where you go from here, you need to know YOUR rights when you are dealing with these people. Someone is going to get hurt and you can't be sure it isn't going to be you or the baby. DO IT.

According to my Warrenton-based attorney, there are no grandparents rights in Virginia, but they CAN make your life miserable using props like Children's Services, and it sounds like they have an unhealthy hold on their son, who DOEs have rights.

Get help, get it now, or get used to the idea you aren't going to keep your baby.


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## 5796 (Oct 19, 2002)

here's what it can look like without a lawyer:

http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...hreadid=106116


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## Marlena (Jul 19, 2002)

Also consider the fact that you may very well be able to get a restraining order against the grandparents...and it may be worth doing. You'll have to weigh carefully its likely impact not only on the situation with the grandparents, of course, but also with your husband. Perhaps it would be a wake-up call for everyone, and put a brake on things. Or perhaps it would just exacerbate things and put you and your daughter in greater danger. You have to consider carefully what it would likely do.

In any event, though, I'd suggest not letting them in your house again, under any circumstances...even with your husband in attendance (perhaps especially so).

Do line up a good attorney who specializes in family law and is well-experienced in issues involving domestic abuse. Even if you don't ever go forward with him/her, you should have him/her ready to go if it becomes necessary. Legal aid clinics, as well, are usually experienced in such matters (it often constitutes the bulk of their work).

You may be reticent to line up an attorney because it may seem as if it tilts the balance towards the failure, rather than success, of your marriage. However, given the violence involved and the very real possibility (given past events) that your daughter could be taken away from you, however temporarily, you'd probably be well-advised to act to protect both you and your daughter *now*


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## Dragonfly (Nov 27, 2001)

Eggie,

You should also know that while grandparents' rights are not expressly written into Virginia law, the statute does allow for visitation and even custody by a third party if it is deemed in the child's best interests. Courts have said that one situation where visitation and/or custody for grandparents might be in a child's best interest is where a mother is considered unfit.

My concern here is that these people might have it in the works to have you declared unfit. They sound crazed about getting their claws on your child.

PLEASE find a lawyer.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Ifg you can get a phone in many rooms or a cordless phone that you can keep on you at all times and don't hesitate to call the police next t ime this happens. Scary stuff and you need documentation. She had no right to be in your home or to be harrasing you. Unfortunately in some states grandparents have won visitation in court







Also during your couseling w/ dh you need to address his mothers behavior and his toleration of it. this is definitely a stumbling block in your marraige and the source of his abusivness.


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## 5796 (Oct 19, 2002)

Is there any update?


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## Eggie (Aug 7, 2003)

yes... some things had happened. My mother in law sued us for visitation, the first hearing is next March 26th. Thankfully I haven't seen his parents since the mother broke into my house and they say they also don't want to see my husband any more, just want my daughter to be dropped off at their house for visitation







... like a potatoe's sac. My husband promised me so many things but he never went to the Fresh start group (the one for men who abuse women) and he did go to see a psychiatrist but he refuses to take the medication. He is so upset because he just wants his parents back and everything back to normal







. Also in our last marriage counseling session this Monday he informed me that last Friday he received a call from the mediation center, asking us to mediate instead of proceeding with the hearing; today he told me that he already made an appointment with them, and I was very clear that I wanted to talk to my lawyer first.
Tomorrow I will talk to my lawyer, I did find one thorough Legal Aid, and will see what happens. Meanwhile my husband is so angry with me because I cannot just forgive everything and get over it, he says I'm blind because I cannot see how much he had changed... and 2 weeks ago I found that he contacted his ex-girlfriend again; he openend a new email account and wrote her and his father that in case they need to contact them they shall write him there, as I could see his other e-mail accounts. He told me he did that because his father is sending him daily e-mails telling him how coward he is and how a lousy mother I am, and that he shall stand up against me. So he said he is tired about this emails and had to tell them that I was "checking" his other emails so they shouldn't write there and he planned to never check the new account. He just had lied so much that it's imposible to believe anything anymore...
This is how everything started in the past... and now my husband said that he wont go to the marriage counseling again. I do not know what will happen. I'm just praying for the courts to really protect my child against her violent grandparents and... I am so tired







Thanks God my baby is doing wonderful, she's about to walk, and getting cutter everyday... I want my daughter to grow up with out violence, I want her to feel secure and in a safe environment... I'm praying so much.


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## Eggie (Aug 7, 2003)

Oh, I forgot to mention, I'm still going to the RCDV (Rappahanock Council of Domestic Violence) support groups and one of the volunteers will go with me to the hearing, just for support, of course in case my lawyer tells me that the mediation is not a suitable option tomorrow.
Thanks mamas


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## Els' 3 Ones (Nov 19, 2001)

I so happy you have a lawyer.

El


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Man, that sucks. i will be praying for you and your dd and for a miricle in your marraige.


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## 5796 (Oct 19, 2002)

Eggie,

Hugs. I'm glad you have your own lawyer.
I don't think your daughter should ever see those awful people.

I can't imagine why your husband does not want to get help. He needs help in so many areas you would think he would want some guidance.

Your daughter sounds like she is thriving which of course is the one brilliant light in this mess. Stand by that knowledge and I'm praying that spirit send some more light your way.

hugs.
tracy


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