# Anyone else annoyed by children being required to sell stuff??



## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

I will probably raise a few hackles, even on this forum, as I am sure many of you have children in school activity programs and extracurricular clubs.

Our neighbors up the road stopped by on Sunday. Their 10 year old son is selling frozen cookie dough & cinnamon rolls to raise money for his public school's ASB program.

This child is special needs (though his parents never mention this, it is obvious) and was, quite frankly, scared of having to do his sales pitch. He knows us, quite well (he, his older brother and ds frequently play together), but could barely speak above a whisper and had no idea of what he was supposed to say.

His Dad kept saying, "You have to do this so that your class will win!" If their class sells enough, they get a pizza party (oh, THAT's a good use of funds raised







). (((Don't even get me started on the Dad's attitude!)))

I couldn't stand seeing the absolute fear in the little boys face and immediately said we'd buy something and let ds choose whatever he wanted (cinnamon rolls at $15 for a box







). The kid looked so relieved and just handed me the order form to complete.

I hate that the schools make the children sell stuff (and that the parents agree to this fundraising blackmail)! It isn't right to put your friends and relatives on the spot, basically forcing them to support their child and their child's school (or, club or whatever).

Especially when they know we homeschool and that ds does not benefit from these fundraisers. Plus, they are "safe" from any type of reciprocity as our son doesn't go looking for money to help with his "extra-curricular or educational" opportunities (though, wouldn't it be tempting to do so, just to see the looks on their faces!







).

I swore, after we were "hit" by his older brother last year (for the same frozen crap), that I wouldn't do it ever again. I don't like being forced into confrontations, especially with a child. Trying to tell children that you don't support their well-intention efforts is horrible. (((Thank goodness we live out in the country and don't have to deal with trick-or-treaters for UNICEF)))

But, the look on this munchkin's face provoked me into pulling out the cash. I was very kind and gentle with him, asking questions I thought he could probably answer from the order sheet in his hand but, alas, it wasn't to be. He could not tell me how much something cost, nor when the stuff would arrive, could not fill-out a receipt, could not tell me how much to pay him and could not make change for a $20.

And, all the while, his Dad is just standing there, telling him he has to do this, it isn't fair to the other children in his class if he doesn't. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr









I wanted to ask how, exactly, the funds raised would be used. But, the poor kid was already so stressed, I knew I wouldn't get any answers. And, Dad, well, Dad looked like he just wanted to get going. Sigh............

Over the years, dh has been "hit" at work by children's parents (his co-workers) selling mints, cookies, coupon books, doughnuts, candy bars, and other cheap stuff, all in the name of their kid's school activities (gymnastics, band, ASB, sports), scouting group or judo/karate clubs. He's always opened his wallet and given freely.

We don't fault the children, they really have no say in this. They are told that this is what they will do, fed a line about pizza party rewards and sent out to the trenches (with veiled threats about how not selling enough is letting everyone down).

My question is why do the parents allow their children to be party to this type of blackmail and, in so many cases, actively participate in the act???

Even worse are the kids being sent out to solicit for charities (UNICEF, Haiti relief, etc). We choose which charities we want to support, and give a lot of money to those. But, when a small child asks you to help the victims of the earthquake in Haiti, what are you supposed to say? Even though you may have already given to another charity that is doing something there (and you say this), it sounds like you are blowing them off and don't care for their cause.

Sigh, just wanted to rant a little. I guess that, sometime within the next month or so (since I never did find out when the frozen globs of commercial dough will arrive), we'll have the child and, probably (this time), Mom delivering the goods. Child will be in a better frame of mind as the pressure to sell will be off his little back and he might even smile.

I really hate this, especially knowing that it never ends.


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## heatherdeg (Dec 30, 2003)

On one hand, I TOTALLY, TOTALLY, TOTALLY agree with you for 99.9% of your post. And in the case you detailed, that's just absolutely disgusting.

The only point I mildly disagree on is when the child themself opts to collect for UNICEF or Haiti or whatever. I've seen this with one of my nephews and one of my cousin's kids. The nephew decided that for his sixth birthday, he wanted everyone to bring things that they could donate to the church's medical center instead of gifts. Granted, in this case, most people would've been spending money on a gift anyway so it's not exactly putting you on the spot to shell out money you weren't going to spend. He was in his ultimate glory when it transpired, when he delivered the items and promptly announced what charity he'd support with his 7th bday party.







My cousin's kid felt such empathy for the people struck by Haiti that he took on collecting on his own.

Of course, I also believe that kids who are driven and motivated that way on their own are also capable of understanding if I gently tell them that I only have enough money to donate to one thing or another and I had already donated to the other. They can also usually answer questions about why they're doing what they're doing because it's "their" cause--ya know?

Parents and schools who push kids into this kind of stuff make me really sick--especially with kids like the one you described. Why wasn't the father at least AT THE DOOR with his kid to help him learn the motions. I mean, heck--if you're going to push the kids into this anyway, at least soften the blow and nurture him through it a bit, huh??? Furthermore the whole "prize" thing is just more competition vs. the true point of the fundraising (whether it be a trip or supplies or whatever)... and only validates the point that the kids aren't really vested in the true goal. Add to it "letting everyone down" and wow... I mean, just, WOW.


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## Callimom (Sep 14, 2004)

I agree completely about the school stuff. When my son was in school we just didn't do these fundraisers. We don't get hit very often here but it rubs me the wrong way to pay for fundraisers for our very wealthy neighbourhood school.

But I disagree with you about supporting kids supporting charities. My hsed kids, on their own initiative, did a neighbourhood penny drive for the Red Cross. We we will support well known charities like the Terry Fox Run when kids come to our door looking for donations. I personally think it is important for kids - particularly in North America - to develop a sense of charity and altruism and I am willing to donate $5 or $10 to help that.

Karen


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## Vermillion (Mar 12, 2005)

Quote:

My question is why do the parents allow their children to be party to this type of blackmail and, in so many cases, actively participate in the act???
I swore I would never let my child participate in any door to door selling&#8230; Then, he decided he wanted to do Scouts, and his pack relies partly on fundraising to raise money. He didn't want to be left out (already an issue with homeschooling at times) so I let him sell the popcorn. Our pack keeps a percentage of the money raised for activities, and the boys get a percentage to go in an account for them to buy uniforms, pay for camp, etc. It helped my son learn a valuable lesson about working for what you want, setting goals, etc. I found that most of the people in our community were happy to help, and the ones who didn't want to, simply said no thank you. No biggie.

So that's why I let my son participate, and will continue to do so.

If I thought for a second that my son didn't want to or couldn't do it, or was stressed by it in any way, it wouldn't happen! I think it's awful when parents push their kids to do this kind of thing and make it stressful. Not cool.


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## dachshundqueen (Dec 17, 2004)

I think I'm just going to write a check for what my child needs. I don't feel comfortable having them sell either trashy goods or food. I also don't support those sales when I get harassed by small children peddling them.

If they expect that it will pay $x for my kid to go to camp, well, we'll just pay the full fee rather than the "cookie dough or popcorn" subsidized fee.

Liz


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## Vermillion (Mar 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dachshundqueen* 
If they expect that it will pay $x for my kid to go to camp, well, we'll just pay the full fee rather than the "cookie dough or popcorn" subsidized fee.

That's all fine and good if you can manage that, but in my son's CS Pack, there are kids who can barely even afford the basics, let alone camp and other activities. The fundraising gives their families another option.

We are fortunate enough to be able to pay cash for what we need, but we also do the fundraisers. My son has offered up the money in his account from fundraising to help if another kid needs it.

Sooo... I'm not judging the families who are against ALL fundraising, just the attitude that it's always bad. For some kids it allows them to be included in something they otherwise would be left out from.

That said&#8230; I am pretty much against school wrapping paper type deals. People pay enough in taxes that kids shouldn't be sent out to collect for them too.


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## zeldamomma (Jan 5, 2006)

I may be biased, but I think it can be good for kids to sell things, if they want to, of course. It gives them the experience of speaking with neighbors and other adults in the community with whom they might not otherwise communicate. It teaches them how conduct a transaction--explaining the product, asking someone for the right amount of money, counting back change, saying thank you and you hand them the product... These are useful skills, and it can be empowering for kids to know that they earned the money for whatever.

It certainly gets over-done, and I'm tired of being hit up for things like sending a bunch of 14 year old strangers to China to play soccer (I'd like to go to China too, but I'm not going door-to-door asking other people to pay my way







). I won't buy "discount cards" or raffle tickets-- I'll only purchase actual products, and I get a lot less generous when the kid who's asking is old enough to have an actual job.


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## elizawill (Feb 11, 2007)

if we have extra cash, i don't mind helping kids out that we know. i've bought a bunch of girl scout cookies, candy bars, and lots of other junk. i would feel very sad if the child was forced to give me a sale's pitch that was obviously uncomfortbale for them... that would be awkward for sure. but most of the people that hit me up for my money are fairly outgoing kids and their excited to tell me all about the junk they have to sell, lol. having said that though, i am very glad my kids don't have to sell things. i am rather introverted and unfortunately i'm _waaaaay_ to concerned about making someone feel uncomfortable. when we sold girl scout cookies, it was very awkward for me to try and ask people to buy from my daughter. i ended up buying most of them and donated them to the troops.


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## One_Girl (Feb 8, 2008)

I really hate that schools require kids to sell things. We couldn't afford the things the school wants the kids to sell and we don't know people who can so my dd was excluded from the pizza party many of her friends went to because we are in a high class school district.


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## elizawill (Feb 11, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *One_Girl* 
...my dd was excluded from the pizza party many of her friends went to ...

oh my goodness!! i'm a fairly passive person, but that would make my mama bear rage like a machine. that's is SO rediculous! your poor daughter. i'm sorry that happened!!


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## MaterBum (Aug 11, 2005)

Here's what bothers me about those sale drives. I have to spend $3.75 for the troop to get $0.25. I'm making the company rich, not the troop! So when my nieces ask me to buy cookies for their troop, I make a straight $5.00 donation. I know that doesn't help them win some T-shirt or poster, but come on! Give that money for the prizes to the troop!

The same is true of those magazine drives for the schools. It seems so backwards to ask me to spend $20 so the school gets $1.00.







I really can't believe that more parents don't refuse to participate.

I agree that kids collecting for a non-profit organization that they are informed about and interested in is totally different.


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## sha_lyn (Jul 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Vermillion* 
That's all fine and good if you can manage that, but in my son's CS Pack, there are kids who can barely even afford the basics, let alone camp and other activities. The fundraising gives their families another option.

We are fortunate enough to be able to pay cash for what we need, but we also do the fundraisers. My son has offered up the money in his account from fundraising to help if another kid needs it.

Sooo... I'm not judging the families who are against ALL fundraising, just the attitude that it's always bad. For some kids it allows them to be included in something they otherwise would be left out from.

That said&#8230; I am pretty much against school wrapping paper type deals. People pay enough in taxes that kids shouldn't be sent out to collect for them too.









ITA...
Not to mention that the funds likely go to the local expenses. I know with girl scouts that the cookie sales are what keeps the organization running. Without profits going to our local service unit and council, Girl Scouts would have to charge much higher membership fees.

I do have a problem with for profit businesses (private schools, daycares etc) having fundraisers.

As for public schools, I'm on the fence. Having served on a PTA committee before, I see why PTAs have fundraisers. However I also saw a lot of waste of what was provided for by the district. If the district watched the spending it could finance many of the projects that the PTA raised funds for.


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## sha_lyn (Jul 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MaterBum* 
Here's what bothers me about those sale drives. I have to spend $3.75 for the troop to get $0.25. I'm making the company rich, not the troop! So when my nieces ask me to buy cookies for their troop, I make a straight $5.00 donation. I know that doesn't help them win some T-shirt or poster, but come on! Give that money for the prizes to the troop!

The same is true of those magazine drives for the schools. It seems so backwards to ask me to spend $20 so the school gets $1.00.







I really can't believe that more parents don't refuse to participate.

I agree that kids collecting for a non-profit organization that they are informed about and interested in is totally different.

The bakery only makes about $1 per box. Most of the proceeds go to supporting the local council and service unit. No money goes to the national organization. As for incentives: some councils have elected to do away with them to allow the troops to keep more money. Others let the troops decide. Most also allow the girls to earn camp scholarships or "cookie dough" that can be applied toward paying for any council or service unit sponsored event.


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## Marimami (May 5, 2005)

I was horrified when DD decided she wanted to sell cookies in GS. Now, she belongs to a wonderful troop...all homeschooled kids with AP, crunchy parents. I'm not sure any of us parents were that comfortable with it! But, the girls all get into it. We're completely down-playing the competitive aspects of it, emphasizing the charitable aspects of it, etc.

My normally socially introverted girl actually walked door-to-door with DH and spoke to every single one of our neighbors. She wanted to do this so badly, and it really did wonders for her social skills. So, I'm learning to loosen up.

I have a few acquaintances who only email me when they want to solicit donations for one of their causes. That frustrates me more than anything. Everyone has their causes that they support, and I think it's totally inappropriate to solicit your friends to get them to donate to a cause. I'd much prefer seeing the neighborhood kids!

Holli


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## sha_lyn (Jul 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zeldamomma* 
*I may be biased, but I think it can be good for kids to sell things, if they want to, of course. It gives them the experience of speaking with neighbors and other adults in the community with whom they might not otherwise communicate. It teaches them how conduct a transaction--explaining the product, asking someone for the right amount of money, counting back change, saying thank you and you hand them the product... These are useful skills, and it can be empowering for kids to know that they earned the money for whatever.*
It certainly gets over-done, and I'm tired of being hit up for things like sending a bunch of 14 year old strangers to China to play soccer (I'd like to go to China too, but I'm not going door-to-door asking other people to pay my way







). I won't buy "discount cards" or raffle tickets-- I'll only purchase actual products, and I get a lot less generous when the kid who's asking is old enough to have an actual job.

ITA... I know that girl scouts stress (and I assume boy scouts do too) that the money is earned by them for them as a group to decide how it should be spent. It has been a huge learning experience for the girls and very entertaining to watch the girls "get" that instead of just thinking "oh mom and dad are paying, lets go to disneyworld on a plane and stay for a month."

It can be a very valuable learning tool if used correctly.


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## luv-my-boys (Dec 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
My question is why do the parents allow their children to be party to this type of blackmail and, in so many cases, actively participate in the act???

.

I wanted to address this portion of your post. In some schools the "fundraising" is mandatory. Meaning if you dont sell x amt of $ your parents will get a bill for it. Now oh course that isnt the case for every school or organization but for some it is.

We are always "hit up" becasue everyone in our neighborhood has school age children (sports,scouts,teams) and I have learned to say "no thank you" and not give in to the "guilt" of it. However my DH proudly sponsered a girl scout for camp this yr with his cookie sale


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## oceanbaby (Nov 19, 2001)

In Little League, kids are asked to sell the frozen cookie dough crap, and we refuse to participate. Dh volunteers as a head coach every year, so we feel like we do our part. But more than that, I just can't abide by selling such gross crap. Ds doesn't even really know about it - the paperwork is just distributed to the parents, and dh doesn't say a word to the team about it.

4-H does a See's candy sale every year, and my mom buys some to give away as client gifts. But we've never had ds go door to door or anything.

We are constantly getting hit up from my SIL for her dd's private catholic school - book fairs, wrapping paper, etc. I feel bad not buying anything, but we don't need any of it, we don't have a lot of extra money, and I honestly have a hard time supporting a church funded catholic school instead of the many other very needy organizations.

Like the pp, I would prefer to just give money directly to the school. Whatever happened to spellathons, or walkathons? I remember going door to door soliciting donations for those when I was in school, but never selling anything.


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## zeldamomma (Jan 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oceanbaby* 
Like the pp, I would prefer to just give money directly to the school. Whatever happened to spellathons, or walkathons? I remember going door to door soliciting donations for those when I was in school, but never selling anything.

I actually prefer selling to the outright begging of a spellathon or walkathon. When I was a kid (and even now) the idea of getting people to "sponsor" me to do something useless like walk around the school gym made no sense. When I sold things, I wasn't asking for handouts, I was selling something, and if they wanted it, they'd buy, and if they didn't they wouldn't. And the only door-to-door fundraising my school did was for the 5th grade school trip, and they made fundraising available so that, hopefully, no kid would be left out for financial reasons. It totally confuses me that PTAs and teachers feel entitled to enlist children to fund their pet projects. Because I believe that selling is a valuable exercise for elementary kids, I buy the cookie dough and pizza kits, but I pay plenty of taxes to our local schools, and I just can't see why they need to fund raise in addition to that. I know some of the stuff they spend money on, and it's appalling.


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## Tofu the Geek (Dec 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oceanbaby* 
Whatever happened to spellathons, or walkathons? I remember going door to door soliciting donations for those when I was in school, but never selling anything.

DD's school has a yearly Spell-a-thon for the younger grades and a Read-a-thon for the older grades. The Spell-a-thon is held during school hours but for the Read-a-thon they go to school on a Friday evening at 5pm, pizza is served to all the kids that show up for the Read-a-thon and they read from 5-9pm and for the big reward at the end they get a dance from 9-10pm. The funds raised go to school trips, camp for the grade 7/8's and other student activities. DD doesn't go door to door, she calls grandmas/grandpas and aunts/uncles and has raised the most money in her class for the last couple of years.


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## limette (Feb 25, 2008)

I don't like it either. DD1 brought home a brochure for pizza kits from and not only are they low quality and super expensive (and the group only gets a small commission) but it has instructions for effective sales which rival what my dh got when he did furniture sales.

IMO there is just something incredibly tacky about having kids sell in that manner.

Why can't donations be just for donations sake, why attach a crappy product to it. If you must actually sell something I'd be much more willing to attend an old fashioned bake sale.


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## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

When our school sends fundraising stuff home, it specifically says NOT to go door to door. It does suggest asking grandparents/aunts/uncles, but not neighbours. And as we have no relatives here, anything bought is bought by us.

But our school also has no issue with kids not participating. If one class gets a pizza party, the whole class gets it, including my dd who they have to order a GF pizza for, at more cost.


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## ZanZansMommy (Nov 8, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MaterBum* 
Here's what bothers me about those sale drives. I have to spend $3.75 for the troop to get $0.25. I'm making the company rich, not the troop! So when my nieces ask me to buy cookies for their troop, I make a straight $5.00 donation. I know that doesn't help them win some T-shirt or poster, but come on! Give that money for the prizes to the troop!

Ditto! When my troop sold cookies last year & I saw the measley amount we made after A LOT of work, I said forget it! SO not worth my time. And my girls really didn't care this year that we didn't sell cookies.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
The bakery only makes about $1 per box. Most of the proceeds go to supporting the local council and service unit. No money goes to the national organization. As for incentives: some councils have elected to do away with them to allow the troops to keep more money. Others let the troops decide. Most also allow the girls to earn camp scholarships or "cookie dough" that can be applied toward paying for any council or service unit sponsored event.

Shouldn't this be for GS nationwide? In our area this is not the case, and if it is, they've done a crappy job of letting us know. They say the procedes go to lowering costs for programs, but many of the ones offered are the same or higher than what we pay as homeschoolers. So, really I don't know what all this money goes towards. Luckily, all my parents decided to pay for the fieldtrips & other things for GS. I do realize that not everyone can do this.

I will give a cash donation to scouts, but I already support our local school district with my tax money. They're not getting any more thru crapping fundraising.


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## ollyoxenfree (Jun 11, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limette* 

Why can't donations be just for donations sake, why attach a crappy product to it. If you must actually sell something I'd be much more willing to attend an old fashioned bake sale.

I know a few people who respond to fundraising sales pitches with a straight donation and a brief note stating that they don't want/need the product, but they are happy to support the student/school/group.

It's always a good option for people who don't want the crappy product.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *oceanbaby* 
In Little League, kids are asked to sell the frozen cookie dough crap, and we refuse to participate. Dh volunteers as a head coach every year, so we feel like we do our part.

And why do they even need to do that? Our kids play soccer. We pay a registration fee, which includes their uniform. We pay for a soccer ball and cleats beyond the registration fee. There's no need for additional fundraising. I imagine if parents agreed to stop doing this, the organizations would find a way to exist within their means.

The only thing completely sales-related here that we get asked to do is Girl Scout cookies. We buy 4 boxes every year, and that's it. We have a small school at the Seventh Day Adventist church down the street. The kids from there come door-to-door, but it's usually direct charity, such as collecting food for the food pantry, never money or buying stuff.


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## sha_lyn (Jul 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ZanZansMommy* 

Shouldn't this be for GS nationwide? In our area this is not the case, and if it is, they've done a crappy job of letting us know. They say the procedes go to lowering costs for programs, but many of the ones offered are the same or higher than what we pay as homeschoolers. So, really I don't know what all this money goes towards. Luckily, all my parents decided to pay for the fieldtrips & other things for GS. I do realize that not everyone can do this.

I will give a cash donation to scouts, but I already support our local school district with my tax money. They're not getting any more thru crapping fundraising.

Yes that is the case nation wide. The money goe toward the cost of running the camps and offices such as paying the mortage/lease/rent, utilities, employee salary etc. If anything is left then it probably goes to programs/fieldtrips, but really the cookie money pays all the over head expenses that the council has. Any money that goes to GSUSA is paid directly by the 2 bakeries (Little Brownie and ABC).


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## zeldamomma (Jan 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MaterBum* 
Here's what bothers me about those sale drives. I have to spend $3.75 for the troop to get $0.25. I'm making the company rich, not the troop! So when my nieces ask me to buy cookies for their troop, I make a straight $5.00 donation. I know that doesn't help them win some T-shirt or poster, but come on! Give that money for the prizes to the troop!

Huh. Our troop gets either $0.55 or $0.65 per box, and the boxes are $3.50. The remainder goes to support, among other things, the many nice, large camps our council owns.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

I wouldnt like it at all if it where required. Thankfully it is optional here or I dont know what I would do. I refuse to allow my kids to sale stuff because the people I know to ask cant afford to buy stuff like that and I know for a fact they would use their last dollar to pay for it. I am not doing to that my extended family. The other people around have kids in school so they dont need mine asking for more of their hard earned money.


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## velveeta (May 30, 2002)

I think it is wrong to put children is a position of having to sell any kid of item. I can't say no to children at my door, so I always write a donation check. The stuff they sell is always super-yucky stuff that I don't want or need.

Having said that, I LOVE GS cookies (my whole family does), so we buy lots every year from our friends.

I think I still might be a little traumatized from having to sell JUNK as a child. (campfire girls and school things).


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## phoebemommy (Mar 30, 2006)

I think kids selling to support their project or a cause can be a very good thing. But I more and more have a problem with all this prepackaged, overpriced stuff I'm expected to buy, much of which isn't a quality I'd ever buy otherwise. I paid ten bucks this year for boy scout popcorn, which was half the size as last year and came in a plastic container, rather than the metal tin from last year. It was probably $1 worth of product. I understand, the money goes to the troop and all that, and that I can just give a donation, but selling overpriced crap from a top-down source doesn't seem like the best lesson to teach kids. Frankly, I'd much rather see kids making things to sell, or mowing lawns or shoveling driveways, or some other useful or personal product or service. But I guess that's pretty idealistic of me.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limette* 
Why can't donations be just for donations sake, why attach a crappy product to it. If you must actually sell something I'd be much more willing to attend an old fashioned bake sale.

Around here, at least at elementary schools, bake sales are a thing of the past. They did them when ds1 was in school, but the new healthy eating guidelines killed them off.

The groups sell crap, because crap sells. We (ds1's old Cub Scout group) tried selling flower bulbs - pretty nice ones - for two years, because one of the group committee didn't want to see food, or "garbage", as she put it. The amount of effort put in was astonishing, and the return wasn't very good, despite the reasonable payout by the bulb company. The next year, they switched to Scout popcorn - and it went over well, and sold itself. It wasn't quite as sure a hit as Girl Guide cookies, but pretty close. We also received notification from Scouts Canada that if we wanted to sell anything else, it had to be an approved fundraiser. We could wash cars, chip Christmas trees, or whatever - but not sell any product other than Scout popcorn.

I don't mind fundraisers, and dh and I took the viewpoint that ds1 was learning that sometimes you have to work to be able to play.


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## Marsupialmom (Sep 28, 2003)

At that age, the kids have no clue. When my son did K the PTO had no clue.

My son's in school this year and fund raised for swimming. He knew exactly were the money was going.

He was going to wrestle but between the trash talk and their type of fund raising he quit







I don't mind fundraising when they know the reason and it is fund raising with ethics. They wanted us to give out addresses to family, friends, businesses we use so they could market to them.

My girls do scouts and they have goals. They do get a small portion, but the biggest chunk of that money goes to Girl Scout regional offices to run and run camps. Considering camp prices hasn't changes in 5 years that isn't bad.

I know you don't like what or how the dad was encouraging his son to speak but I can sympathize. If he is a shy person he might need encouragement (incentive) to get up the nerves. You are not helping the child by not giving him the ability to ask.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zeldamomma* 
I may be biased, but I think it can be good for kids to sell things, if they want to, of course. It gives them the experience of speaking with neighbors and other adults in the community with whom they might not otherwise communicate. It teaches them how conduct a transaction--explaining the product, asking someone for the right amount of money, counting back change, saying thank you and you hand them the product... These are useful skills, and it can be empowering for kids to know that they earned the money for whatever.

Yep, learning to talk to all kinds of folks is a great skill. I always play the fund raising by ear. If its a product I don't care for.. I don't have the kids sell it. If its a good product, I send my kids out by buddy system and cell phones to the neighbors. I never explain or apologize either way. Kids are older teens now and they have never had any trouble selling OR not selling.


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## Dar (Apr 12, 2002)

Moved from Learning at Home and Beyond to Parenting...


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## AliciaP8 (Dec 15, 2005)

I completely agree with the original poster. Our son is in public school. We pay our taxes and contribute to whatever school activities he attends. We've never done the fundrasier selling stuff because it makes me uncomfortable to ask neighbors to support my kid's activities, it makes my son uncomfortable approaching people for this reason and mostly the stuff they are selling is crap.

I do make sure his teacher knows at the beginning of the year that we don't participate in door to door stuff and if there is a need for money to let us know so we can decide if he should attend and how much it will cost. Money is not super tight for us and so I've also paid extra at times when I thought the event was especially valuable and I know some kids don't have the funds to participate.


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## Geist (Jan 27, 2010)

Only when they have to do it for public school, mainly because it's not voluntary and remember the amount of pressure put on us when I was in school to get out there and SELL STUFF! I hated it. If they started their own business and were selling stuff they made themselves, I would find it awesome and a great show of initiative.


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## betsyj (Jan 8, 2009)

Right there with you OP!! I refuse to buy anything from kids selling door to door. I find it inappropriate at best, manipulative and exploitative at worst.

While I am hardly a subscriber to a sex offender in every home scenario, I do get nervous seeing these little girls showing up on my doorstep selling stuff and there is no parent in sight. It drives me bonkers and I just wonder what they are thinking.

My son does not need to learn how to sell cheap crap made in China, or cookies or pizza dough loaded with artificial products that I don't serve at home. And he can learn to talk to different kinds of people without being forced into selling stuff so a company I don't care for can make a big profit.

Those skills can be developed in many other ways-volunteering or an after school part time job. NOT by hawking junk to neighbors and strangers.


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## cedoreilly (May 21, 2005)

The problem is people want something for their money (out PTO has run into this issue). When kids come around selling stuff, I just give them money and tell them I don't need whatever they are selling but want to support them. I wish sometimes with school fundraisers that they just leave a blank or make a comment on the forms that if you wish to make a donation instead, it is fine (and the fundraiser is not required). As far as the pizza party thing... That always bothers me when I hear schools so that.


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## Ceinwen (Jul 1, 2004)

We refuse to participate both ways - buying or selling. I find it ridiculous at best.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

I don't have a problem saying no to kids who sell stuff door to door -- just a simple "Not today, thanks. Good luck!" and a smile doesn't seem particularly ruthless to me.









We choose our donations carefully throughout the year, and we have a family policy about never handing money out the door or over the phone.

As for my DS participating, we don't solicit our friends and family when his school sends home the See's candy/wrapping paper/etc. forms. And actually with that stuff, we don't buy anything ourselves either. We do give a small donation for stuff like walkathons, but again, we don't solicit friends and family, and we only give the amount we're comfortable giving (usually $25) rather than the amount the school says their hoping to raise per child (usually $125).

I must be immune to peer pressure or something, because stuff like this just doesn't make me feel the least bit bad. I also don't feel pressure to have big blow-out birthday parties just because someone else does, or to dress my kids in designer clothing just because someone else does, etc. -- I'm happy doing it my way, they're happy doing it their way, and so far no one has expressed any judgment either way, so it's all good.


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## claras_mom (Apr 25, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
My question is why do the parents allow their children to be party to this type of blackmail and, in so many cases, actively participate in the act???

My main issue is when the kids in question - oh, like the 2-1/2 to 5-1/2 year olds at dd's Preschool - are no way going to actively participate in the act of selling.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dachshundqueen* 
I think I'm just going to write a check for what my child needs. I don't feel comfortable having them sell either trashy goods or food. I also don't support those sales when I get harassed by small children peddling them.

If they expect that it will pay $x for my kid to go to camp, well, we'll just pay the full fee rather than the "cookie dough or popcorn" subsidized fee.

Liz

According to my sister, you can sometimes catch a little grief from other parents or from the teachers for "not being a team player." I'm not kidding, but I haven't experienced it directly....yet.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *velveeta* 
I think it is wrong to put children is a position of having to sell any kid of item. I can't say no to children at my door, so I always write a donation check. The stuff they sell is always super-yucky stuff that I don't want or need.

Having said that, I LOVE GS cookies (my whole family does), so we buy lots every year from our friends.

I think I still might be a little traumatized from having to sell JUNK as a child. (campfire girls and school things).

Back in the day--more than 35 years ago







--Campfire Girl candy was pretty darned yummy. I did sell a lot of it door to door. I was old enough to choose to do so. And later, I did sell the Girl Scout cookies (no campfire girl troop when we moved). What I always liked about the candy was that we weren't taking orders--I've realized since that someone, the troop or the parents, was probably having to pay upfront for the cases.

Always hated magazine sales, so I never did much with that (passive resistance). There was a brief period in high school when the band director organized sales of citrus--fantastic oranges and grapefruit. I always felt pretty good about that, because it was such a wonderful product.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *claras_mom* 
According to my sister, you can sometimes catch a little grief from other parents or from the teachers for "not being a team player." I'm not kidding, but I haven't experienced it directly....yet.

Yeah, that's the kind of crap I'm talking about. I just don't participate in those kind of playground politics. If other parents want to think I suck for not going along with the herd on stuff like this, it just doesn't bother me. But so far, like you, I haven't noticed anyone having any sort of judgment about it, so maybe that type of stuff is less common than we think.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I get annoyed with the frequent fundraisers. I understand the schools need money, but I'd rather they ask for a donation of X amount, and call it good. Maybe it's because we don't know a lot of people out here, or have family nearby to bug to buy wrapping paper and crap, but it usually ends up being DH and I that feel obligated to purchase a few things just so my kid can win the cheesy prize. My DD did actually do well selling frozen baked good recently, due to some generous neighbors/parents of friends... but then of course when one of the little girls came by selling crap for her school, I felt like I had to reciprocate even though nothing in her catalogue was remotely appealing.

The most recent selling fundraiser sent home by my pre-k kid? Sheets! $20 or $40, depending on thread count. No way to spend less. I considering ordering a set for us, but DH was irritated by it (since I had just last week wrote a check for jump rope for heart, and another for reach for the stars reading to pay for books b/c I wouldn't let DD beg anyone else for 'pledges'). I am honestly going to have to send back the Sheets for Sale packet empty. I've just spent too much money, and the year is only half way over (and this doesn't count yearbooks, pictures, etc.).


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## sha_lyn (Jul 27, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *claras_mom* 
.....................................

According to my sister, you can sometimes catch a little grief from other parents or from the teachers for "not being a team player." I'm not kidding, but I haven't experienced it directly....yet.

..........................................

For a classroom I don't agree with such policies/attitudes but I have to say I do for things like Gril Scouts. As I said before we did have to start insisting that girls that don't participate should pay their own way to events that the troop has rasied money through sales to attend.

We really didn't think it was fair to all the other girls who show up for most meetings, participate in both sales (fall product and cookies) and plan events/activitie etc to foot the bill for girls that only show up for the fun stuff and never participate in the planning or fundraising. Like I said before, even if they showed up for one booth sale that was a complete bust, at least there in an effort there.


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## claras_mom (Apr 25, 2006)

I tend to separate out the Girl Scout sales from school sponsored sales. Because I was a scout for many years and was involved as a teenager at the council level, I knew very clearly the impact of cookie sales not just on the local troop and the individuals but on the council. I can see your point about participation, but don't know exactly what I think about it. The non-participation is outside my experience. Of course...I hit scouts around about Cadette level, with a very small troop in a small town. We all pitched in. By the time I was a senior scout, it was just me. I was the troop.

I'll buy 2 boxes of cookies from any kid who comes to my door (with a sigh for the ever shrinking numbers and ever increasing price







); but I'm not so jazzed by the tables set up on campus or in front of supermarkets. Changing times - I know that there are a lot of concerns these days about kids going door to door.

But I think my sis was talking about school stuff, not about scouts (she's done both). For dd's (expensive, private) preschool fundraiser, I figured out what I might have spent and took the percentage of that that went to the school. Then I wrote a check. The director never said one word about it; I'd be very surprised if I was the only one going that route.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sha_lyn* 
We really didn't think it was fair to all the other girls who show up for most meetings, participate in both sales (fall product and cookies) and plan events/activitie etc to foot the bill for girls that only show up for the fun stuff and never participate in the planning or fundraising. Like I said before, even if they showed up for one booth sale that was a complete bust, at least there in an effort there.

I guess my question there would be if you require a certain level of sales. DH and I lived in a lower income neighbourhood, and I made a fairly low salary, when ds1 was in Cubs. When they did sales, we couldn't afford to buy very much, and people in our neighbourhood (and friends and family) were in the same boat. I can remember ds1 pounding pavement and knocking on doors for a total of about 15-16 hours to sell a bare minimum amount of product. A couple boys in his troop sold at least double what he did, and none of them ever knocked on a door - they just got their parents to hand the form around. It doesn't bother me that they did that...but it does bother me that my son could have ended up being penalized by the troop, because his family, friends and neighbours didn't have much money. (To be honest, the troop would have probably decided to subsidize him, in any case, as I think they'd have felt they were slapping us in the face, otherwise. DH was a leader, and I was both the Treasurer and Registrar. Telling us our son couldn't come to camp because he didn't do enough and we were broke would have felt...icky, to everybody.)

ETA: Ooops - just noticed you said even showing up for one booth sale would be okay, so I guess my concern is null and void.


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## dachshundqueen (Dec 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *claras_mom* 
According to my sister, you can sometimes catch a little grief from other parents or from the teachers for "not being a team player." I'm not kidding, but I haven't experienced it directly....yet.

I'm sorry. I pay my taxes, and pay extras for additional activities that I have my child engaged in otherwise. It is not my fault that school districts cannot budget properly nor choose to reduce the size of their administrations. Their failure to do so does not preempt my parental right to not engage in sales, and any parents who should choose to be so bold as to attempt to bully me into said foolishness have an exciting 5 minutes coming to them.

To be clear, DH and I run an international business, so I do have a clue about running a far reaching organization.

Liz


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## Rosebud1 (Sep 8, 2007)

I just had a rather pleasant fundraising experience. The small local elementary school makes homemade chocolate candies (super gourmet, delicious) and Moms sell them at a table on the main drag during Valentine's Day week. Apparently the children made them themselves at school, and again the results were pretty impressive. I am not sure how much money they generated, but I think it was a positive experience for the children to learn how to bake and make such a creative delectable product! Now I am not sure how 'legal' this is, but here in northern Cali we are a little casual with things! In this circumstance I was happy to buy them.


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## mamatoablessing (Oct 17, 2005)

DD's dance school does a fundraiser every year for their costumes. For every 5 boxes of cookies you sell, you get $10 to put towards your costume (which runs around $60). I toss the fundraiser stuff right in the recycle bin. Bascially, we'd be asking our friends/neighbors/family to donate money towards a costume which we are perfectly capable of affording. That makes me feel weird.

Both girls also attend a private school and they do some crappy fundraiser every year but we don't participate. I pay my tuition. That's enough.

As for GS, I totally support cookie sales.


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## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

I go back and forth. I totally support Girl Scouts and other non-profits doing sales. I run a local non-profit group, the only money we have to spend is from fundraisers. The local public schools and the wrapping paper, cookie dough, etc... annoy the heck out of me but then DD1's small private school does 3 big fundraisers a year. I do pay our tuition but the fundraiser money goes to scholarships for students who otherwise would not be there, so where do I draw the line? Honestly I would rather just write a check and be done with it, but I am not writing one 3 times a year in addition to paying what I already do pay monthly.


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## MCR (Nov 20, 2001)

I hate the fundraisers and refuse to send my kids around the neighbors to sell.
They sometimes say not to knock on doors, that leaves just me, (no relatives in miles) to buy, friends have kids doing the same sales. So I gave up, I write a $10 check to the PTA in lieu of the fundraiser, they can't complain they get more than if I had ordered one crappy item i didn't want or need. My kid should still participate in the pizza party if there is one, he raised $10 for the school without giving the cookie company anything, so what.
For science camp I just paid the full amount needed for Ds to go.
For little league here they give an opt out, you pay them $20 per kid extra at sign up and no need to sell cookie dough.
The only fund raiser I've ever liked was the local discount card one. $20 card you get a free small pizza with an xtra large at the local pizza place, and 10% off at the health food store each time you shop and there was loads more on it.
I dread Dd starting school, it will start all over again, book sales, cookie sales, science camp fundraisers, on and on and on.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCR* 
I write a $10 check to the PTA in lieu of the fundraiser, they can't complain they get more than if I had ordered one crappy item i didn't want or need. My kid should still participate in the pizza party if there is one, he raised $10 for the school without giving the cookie company anything, so what.

I agree.

In my DS's preschool, they had a Trike-a-thon and the class that raised the most money got a pizza party (or something, I can't remember the specific reward). But DS's class at the time had 4 students in it, and other classes had 10 or 12. Such bad planning. I would rather have my DS invite some friends over for a pizza party at our house than have him feel bad because his class that's 1/3 the size of other classes was (obviously) unable to raise the most money.









That experience kind of soured me on the whole competitive nature of fundraising in general, and now I'm inclined to do stuff like the poster I quoted -- give a check directly to the school and bypass the whole ridiculous thing.


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## BMG580 (Jun 19, 2007)

Well, I just paid $8 for a dozen glazed donuts b/c a kid who lives down the street was selling for some team he is on. The kids always look so nervous and desperately hopeful when they show up at my door with their order sheets that I can never say no. I always end up with junk food or expensive wrapping paper that we don't need, too bad no one is out selling fruit!


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## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *limabean* 
In my DS's preschool, they had a Trike-a-thon and the class that raised the most money got a pizza party (or something, I can't remember the specific reward). But DS's class at the time had 4 students in it, and other classes had 10 or 12. Such bad planning.

Those in charge should be doing it per capita, and averaging each class's donations by the number of kids. That's how our school does it (k classes seem to be around 17, the grade 8s are close to 30).


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## Dandelionkid (Mar 6, 2007)

We used to sell chocolate bars as kids. One elderly man and his wife would always buy the bars, then give them to us to eat. we loved his house. An alternative to keeping the junk is to give it back to the kids


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## DariusMom (May 29, 2005)

I'm American but now live in Europe. I'm *so so* glad that, where I live, kids don't have to sell all this crap. We pay a small fee (about the equivalent of $50) at the start of each school year to cover expenses and an extra fee for the class trip (usually around $40). If parents can't pay, there is an extra fund to help low-income families.

There are fees to join sports clubs for kids (sports generally aren't done through the school). The city gov't has a special fund to help pay the registration fees for low-income kids (and I don't mind my tax euros going to that at all!). Some very low-income clubs (usually soccer or swimming clubs serving predominately low-income areas) sell lottery tickets at the equivalent of about $3 a piece to help fund their activities. We always buy a few. And that's it . .. .

I would much rather just make a flat donation than be hit up to buy tons of over-priced crap I don't want or need. I also don't like that so much of the profit goes to the companies and not to the organization.

I agree that it can be positive if kids learn to not just ask for money. So have a bake sale, car wash, etc., etc. In most cases, I feel like kids aren't even learning to sell. Their parents are learning quid pro quo with their co-workers and neighbors!


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## mrspineau (Jan 15, 2008)

I think they have some pros to them... that child who was terrified to do his pitch may learn to overcome that fear through doing activities like that. It can be a good way for children to learn to speak to people, and a good way to show support for a team, or class, or whatever.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

this used to really bother me but not any more. My children may sell if they want to but it is all them. they have to go out and take orders and deliver. our neighborhood is saturated with kids so most kids don't sell anything except to family in other parts of town. There is no penelty for not participating. honestly I would rather send a $10 check than buy a $10 loaf of bread. but I do not even do that much.

I do not mind when other children knock on our door. good for them taking the inititive and working hard. However I also have no problem saying no to over priced junk food and wrapping paper. chocolate bars on the other hand........









I think it is great when kids decide to raise funds though!! for whatever charity strikes them. if you do not want to give don't. honestly my kids do not remember who said no and yes. all they know is they made some money to help someone.







trick or treating for unicef - my kids love this and I love it when kids come trick or treating. its a quarter! no big deal. and it helps them be a part of something so much bigger.

I also wanted to add, any prizes for sales fundraisers are individual, not class parties. My dd is on student council and to raise money for the supplies (they are making care packs for haiti) four difffernt teachers and the principal are just putting collection jars outside their doors (penny war, every penny add 1 point... nickles, dimes and quarters in the jar subtract points, so much more fun than selling wrapping paper and candles). the whole school will participate in the party after ward. the winning teacher gets to ductape the loosing one to the gym wall


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

i also wanted to add that I am so thankful our band did fundraisers. I had a real job but it went to pay for everything else in my life (clothes, Dr. appointments, school supplies) and I would not have been able to go to the band trips had I not raised enough extra by selling stuff. My friend and I busted our butts! it sucked but had it not been for the $300 we earned selling frozen pizza and cookie dough to our neighbors we woud not have been able to go. Scholarships were available but only if you had done some fundraising. Tax dollars did not cover band trips and the competition was good for us. and the trip was fun. and educational. Our band director was brilliant with money and managed to make the fundraising sucessful and the trip inexpensive. but still.

I don't neccesarily always have money or want what they are selling (part of a good fudraiser is selling something people want at a price point they can afford) and when I do not want it or do not think it is a good value I feel no guilt saying no. if it is a cause I really support I will just give a donation to the organization or to that child.


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## octobermom (Aug 31, 2005)

My 7 year old comes home with some dumb fundraiser everyother day it drives me batty because she coems home on how shes must sell so they can get so and so prize ect.. I will NOT allow my 7 year old to go door to door selling so we jsut don't if I think its a worth while cause we will donate a bit to the pot and once in a blue moon I might ask a few friends I know if they might be intrested but that is it. When she is older shes can choose to try or not but not at this age.

Deanna


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## Wild Lupine (Jul 22, 2009)

I haven't read all the replies so maybe someone has mentioned this already. But the real problem is how schools are funded. When I was teaching I hated, hated, hated the fundraisers, but they funded very important programs for the children, such as afterschool/extracurricular activities that required purchasing anything, including all sports, the garden club, the sewing club, etc... For many kids, being at these after school activities was their only option besides being home alone. Those funds also paid for scholarships for field trips for kids whose parents couldn't afford it. Once my department used money obtained in this way to pay for science equipment that was outside our allotted budget. I wouldn't be surprised if some schools fundraised for text books.

I came to the conclusion that until schools are better funded, fundraisers are a necessary evil. If you really don't want to buy anything, say no. Or lobby for better school funding or another way to pay for the above.


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## Phoenix~Mama (Dec 24, 2007)

I HATE fundraisers and especially required fundraising.

My DSD goes to a private school and they have a mandatory fundraising obligation of $400/per kid.

The kicker is they get such a small percentage of whatever crap they are selling towards their $400, they would literally have to be out everyday selling.

DH and I are going to end up just donating money directly to her fund... well we are hoping we are allowed to do that because most of the fundraisers she has had so far are absolute crap that we do not eat or would not use.

We did fall for the entertainment book with coupons... though every coupon we have tried to use so far the establishent has decided to no longer honor them. Terrific... what a waste of $20 that DSD only received a $1 towards her $400 fund anyway.









Ugh... yeah... don't get me started on this. lol


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## lonegirl (Oct 31, 2008)

I am sort of mixed. In grade 8 we sold quite a few things (Christmas ornaments-which I still have, figurines, Salt and Pepper shakers etc) these were sold to raise money for our Grade 8 trip. I had a lot of fun doing it because I was earning money to do our big trip (one week trip by bus to Toronto -9h bus ride). I also did Jump-Rope for Heart and did fund raising for that. UNICEF-we were given them at school but I didn't have to take mine out.


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## mommy2maya (Jun 7, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JSMa* 
I HATE fundraisers and especially required fundraising.

My DSD goes to a private school and they have a mandatory fundraising obligation of $400/per kid.

The kicker is they get such a small percentage of whatever crap they are selling towards their $400, they would literally have to be out everyday selling.

DH and I are going to end up just donating money directly to her fund... well we are hoping we are allowed to do that because most of the fundraisers she has had so far are absolute crap that we do not eat or would not use.

We did fall for the entertainment book with coupons... though every coupon we have tried to use so far the establishent has decided to no longer honor them. Terrific... what a waste of $20 that DSD only received a $1 towards her $400 fund anyway.









Ugh... yeah... don't get me started on this. lol

REally? $1? Cause our Home and School just did this one, and the books sold for $20, and we got $12.50 for each book sold.


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

"My DSD goes to a private school and they have a mandatory fundraising obligation of $400/per kid."

Aaaaaugh. I am on the board of my daughter's preschool, which is attached to our house of worship, and they have an annual fundraising goal of $3,000 that goes right to the general fund. Profits from tuition don't count towards it. This is separate money that we parents are supposed to raise, that benefits the temple in general rather than the preschool - and half of our families aren't even Jewish!

So, I've spent a lot of time this year saying "no, the parents aren't interested in forming a PTO to organize fundraisers. The preschool is already a profit center for the temple. No, I am not going to ask parents to give more time and money so the preschool can be MORE of a profit center. No. NO. *NO.*"

As a parent, I want to send my child to a school that has a sound a sustainable and non-exploitative business model - i.e., they charge in tuition what it costs to run the place, and don't try to suck more money out of the families in myriad pain-in-the-butt ways throughout the year.

Geez, I guess I also have strong feelings on this issue.


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## MomOf3boyz (Oct 21, 2008)

While fund raising is a pain, it's unfortunately a necessity in our area.

Our school is seen as a wealthy neighborhood school. We have some very nice houses in our area, and this makes us seen as 'rich' on the whole.

The truth of the matter is that our school has a 40% poverty rate, and that our wealthy parents are being hit by the economy and just don't have the funds to donate anymore.

Our PTO at school supports the library, field trips, a school age jump roping club, gives money to the teachers for their classrooms, helps pay for upgrades to make playground equipment safe, and the list goes on and on. 100% of the money earned goes back to the school.

We used to run a "No Fundraiser Fundraiser" which asked for donations from parents so we didn't need to do fundraisers. The first year was awesome, and the second year was abysmal. We fell short of our budget by over $5,000!

If our parents can't give outright to the school, we need to find alternate ways to make the money for the school. Especially since our schools budget will be cut over 25% in the next three years. I am sure that the parents in our school complaining about fund raising will complain even louder if we cut their kids extra curriculars, libraries and classroom supplies.

If I have to put some effort into making sure that my sons get the education that they deserve, I am totally willing to do it.


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## Caneel (Jun 13, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zeldamomma* 
It certainly gets over-done, and I'm tired of being hit up for things like sending a bunch of 14 year old strangers to China to play soccer (I'd like to go to China too, but I'm not going door-to-door asking other people to pay my way







).

Honestly! This type of thing is out of control where I live. The "fundraising" by the selective, travelling sports teams is awful, the parent's should be ashamed of themselves for allowing it to go on.

In my area, travelling soccer and softball teams are big. Participation is invitation only. The team, coaches, and parents travel up and down the East Coast to play in tournaments. This is not AYSO or little league type of teams. The clubs are private, elitist (not all but the majority) selective and most definately not open to all kids.

Have at it, sports can be great for kids but it absolutely baffles me that they (adults involved whether they are coaches or parents) think it is ok to ask other people to subsidized a child's (and parent's) hobby.

These "teams" stand outside of Wal-Mart or at the gas stations with cans, panhandling for cash so they can go to a tournament in Virginia Beach. No thank you!

I ruffled many feathers when I worked in banking. Between my fellow employees and the customers, I was getting hit up all the time. While I made a point to be polite, I had no problem saying no and if they pressed me, I told them my opinion on the subject.

As far as school fundraisers - The cookie dough makes me want to scream! My DH is such a sucker for that type of stuff. He has learned by now that he better think twice about ordering mass quanities. I remember once he bought one of each type and 2 or more of his favorites from the daughter of a friend. It was over a $100. I had a fit.


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## mommy2maya (Jun 7, 2003)

Oh and when I went to catholic school, which yes, is private school, but not for profit schools, which IIRC, is the type of school JSMa dsd goes to. Anyway, there was even less money for extra curriculars than at public school. When I was there, for our activities fee it was either $200 or sell raffle tickets. The raffle tickets sold pretty well. Anyway, if you didn't sell, you couldn't attend dances or do activities. This didn't include sports- for sports there were additional fees and fundraisers.


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## mommy2maya (Jun 7, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smithie* 
"My DSD goes to a private school and they have a mandatory fundraising obligation of $400/per kid."

Aaaaaugh. I am on the board of my daughter's preschool, which is attached to our house of worship, and they have an annual fundraising goal of $3,000 that goes right to the general fund. Profits from tuition don't count towards it. This is separate money that we parents are supposed to raise, that benefits the temple in general rather than the preschool - and half of our families aren't even Jewish!

So, I've spent a lot of time this year saying "no, the parents aren't interested in forming a PTO to organize fundraisers. The preschool is already a profit center for the temple. No, I am not going to ask parents to give more time and money so the preschool can be MORE of a profit center. No. NO. *NO.*"

As a parent, I want to send my child to a school that has a sound a sustainable and non-exploitative business model - i.e., they charge in tuition what it costs to run the place, and don't try to suck more money out of the families in myriad pain-in-the-butt ways throughout the year.

Geez, I guess I also have strong feelings on this issue.









her dsd goes to catholic school. catholic schools are non profit and barely get enough money to operate.


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## mommy2maya (Jun 7, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MomOf3boyz* 
While fund raising is a pain, it's unfortunately a necessity in our area.

Our school is seen as a wealthy neighborhood school. We have some very nice houses in our area, and this makes us seen as 'rich' on the whole.

The truth of the matter is that our school has a 40% poverty rate, and that our wealthy parents are being hit by the economy and just don't have the funds to donate anymore.

Our PTO at school supports the library, field trips, a school age jump roping club, gives money to the teachers for their classrooms, helps pay for upgrades to make playground equipment safe, and the list goes on and on. 100% of the money earned goes back to the school.

We used to run a "No Fundraiser Fundraiser" which asked for donations from parents so we didn't need to do fundraisers. The first year was awesome, and the second year was abysmal. We fell short of our budget by over $5,000!

If our parents can't give outright to the school, we need to find alternate ways to make the money for the school. Especially since our schools budget will be cut over 25% in the next three years. I am sure that the parents in our school complaining about fund raising will complain even louder if we cut their kids extra curriculars, libraries and classroom supplies.

If I have to put some effort into making sure that my sons get the education that they deserve, I am totally willing to do it.

This exactly.


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## muldey (May 8, 2002)

I just don't do the fundraisers.I don't have the money,and neither do my family and friends.Ds just came home with the frozen cookie dough and cake sale.It went right in the recycle bin.I would rather give a small donation directly to the school.I do the book sales though.My kids get books at a good price,and the classroom gets books for free.Once a year they have a buy one get one free bookfair and we love that.


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## AmyKT (Aug 20, 2009)

Ok, I haven't read through all the posts, so I may be repeating or stepping into a hornets nest, but the thing that really really bugs the holy crap out of me is when daycares -- private businesses! -- do fundraisers. My goodness, the exorbitant tuition isn't enough?

But yes, in general, all school fund raisers annoy me. In many cases, I'd rather give a kid $5 for his club or school than to spend $15 on some junk that I don't need and that his school is only going to get a cut of a few dollars for.

I do love that frozen cookie dough, though









ETA: And I'll always buy GS cookies. yum.


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## MomOnDaEdge (Nov 10, 2007)

ETA: And I'll always buy GS cookies. yum.

THAT.









Having skipped all 70+ replies, I LOATH school fundraisers.

My kids get to pick one, and only one, for the entire year. DH and I take them to work, exchange with the other parents, and that's that.

GS Cookies are the one off.







Samoas have a siren call


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## lula (Feb 26, 2003)

In general I am fine with kids selling for various reasons. If they are fundraising for a "fun" activity or sports team etc. I like that they have the experience of selling and that they don't expect donations for whatever activity etc they have planned. I like that they aren't relying on donations. (even if the stuff they are selling isn't my first choice in product)

In my area kids seem to sell useful things, salt (they even deliver it and cart it into my house) wreaths/christmas trees/garland (also delivered) etc.

The scenerio described however seems excessive.


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## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MomOnDaEdge* 
ETA: And I'll always buy GS cookies. yum.

THAT.









Having skipped all 70+ replies, I LOATH school fundraisers.


GS cookies do seem to be a league all their own. My DD is a GS, and when we sold in our neighborhood this year, all but one house that had people at home bought cookies. The girls did their tunk sell at a gas station and sold cases and cases. It's really nice because our troop is economically diverse and this way all the girls can decide on activities together and they all made the money together. It really is better than the parents with money just writing checks for what their kids want to do. And it is good for the kids to handle the money, talk to people, etc.

A lot of fundraisers,though, I just don't get. The frozen cookie dough at the school, for example. The kids aren't supposed to go door to door. We don't have extended family, and DH can't take things like that to work. So I let each of my kids pick out one thing of dough and that's that.

And I kinda hate it when kids come to my door selling something that I don't want. I'd really like to always be able to say *yes.*


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## Jeannettea (Apr 2, 2006)

A couple of years ago, I went to the PTA meeting and made the suggestion that an option be added for all the parents instead of doing the fundraising.

First, let me explain that often the fundraiser had a prize at the end (for example, that year it had been a party with a bunch of inflatables in the gymnasium for all kids who sold a certain amount of money (which meant the school's portion was $30).

I suggested the PTA make it an option from then on that any parent who wished to opt out of the fundraiser but wanted to give money to the PTA could give the $ amount needed for their kid(s) to get to go to the party/get the award, and they agreed!

I didn't see how it worked out the next year b/c my dd wanted to be homeschooled so we did, but I heard from friends that they were very grateful to be able to just write a little check and be done with it - especially for those fundraisers that took place @ the holidays (you know, the ones where you have to deliver all that giftwrap, boxes of candy, sausage/cheese, etc.)!

Also, my standard response (b/c I work at one of the schools part-time and get hit up by @ 100 students every time there's a new fundraiser) is to just say, "Thank you but I've already ordered."


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## Phoenix~Mama (Dec 24, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommy2maya* 
her dsd goes to catholic school. catholic schools are non profit and barely get enough money to operate.

Yes... she goes to a Catholic school... and yes they do not have enough money to operate, hence them not having a music or art teacher....









But then they should raise their tuition, not have some unattainable fundraising goal to meet that the parents end up writing a check out for anyway.

Seriously, DSD would have to sell thousands of dollars of crap to meet her goal... and let's be realistic... she is 5, so she isn't selling anything... her parents are.


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## InMediasRes (May 18, 2009)

I have a personal beef with fundraising because I had similar experience to the kid you describe when I was a kid.

Cookie season was torture for me. I have an emotionally abusive mother who I was always trying to please. She sat back and watched me struggle as an introverted kid trying to talk to strangers, horrible at math trying to make change, getting lectured by old me about how I should know how to do figures in my head. Besides what she bought, I usually didn't do very well with cookies sales, and there was always the implied "letting the troop down" thing, plus listening to the parents brag about "MY daughter sold X number of boxes this year!" just made me sick.

I loved scouting and the activities that went with it, but if I was a parent of a kid like me, I would never require my kid to do the selling.

When I was in marching band and we did fundraiser after fundraiser for stupid crap that no one wanted so that everyone could pay for tour or uniforms or whatever (every kid had to raise a certain amount or pay out of pocket), I got a job instead. I couldn't stand the idea of having to call up my family members and pitch to them.

This really all goes back to the "give something to get something" model. The adults will only pay out if they're getting some food or cheap product in return (and let's face it, GS cookies are nothing like they used to be), and kids have to be bribed into selling by promises of pizza etc. I realize that not all fundraisers are like this, but I despise the ones that are.


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## MacKinnon (Jun 15, 2004)

I'm never thrilled about fundraisers, and we do participate loosely, my kids will never be the top sellers though! I have seen how the money is used, seen the impact it can have on an organization that is tight for funds. I do give to some kids that come door to door, and not others. Mostly based on who we know, but other things like Girl Scouts, we choose to support (and this year I had my own cookie-selling Daisy Scout).

My DD's school just does a fun-run, it's their only fund-raiser and it's direct-donation. I was glad to see that! However, what upset me is when everyone who raised over X for the fun-run at school, got a pizza party. I was upset for two reasons, first of all that the healthy aspect they focused on with the run was squashed by the reward of pizza, and mostly, because although *WE* had family and friends who could afford to donate enough for DD to make that mark, I'm sure there were others that couldn't. The idea of this sort of reward, in this economy, seemed very, well, hurtful to those who weren't able to participate due to finances. Next year I am planning on sitting on the committee so I can be more involved with this and hopefully make an impact on what happens.


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## JessicaS (Nov 18, 2001)

The fundraisers drive me insane. I like the trashbags and GS cookies but I don't like useless junk. They never have magazines I would be interested in.

I'll donate to organizations like jumprope for heart, march of dimes reading drive, breastcancer marches, and other things where people do things to raise funds but I DO NOT WANT little figurines or expensive wrapping paper.

We will go to fundraising meal things like pancake breakfasts, taco dinners, spaghetti dinners and I am a sucker for a church bake sale.







I will go to fundraising car washes.

I just mostly do not want stuff that sits around collecting dust and I don't want to pay $15 for cookies (which dd's karate is doing atm)

I would rather pay to have people take my stuff than sell it to me

I will give you twenty dollars to get this couch out of my house while my husband isn't here!







I wish someone would call me about stuff for a rummage sale


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MomOnDaEdge* 
Samoas have a siren call









Don't you mean thin mints? As far as I'm concerned they come in a box that's just two servings.


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## elus0814 (Sep 21, 2009)

My DD sells girl scout cookies and she's 5. She goes up to the door with me standing behind her and she makes her pitch. She sold hundreds of boxes like that this year and raised a ton of money that her troop really needed since some of the kids can't afford to do some of the things the other girls are doing and need the troop to sponsor them in order to go. If they had been selling frozen cookie dough or plastic junk I wouldn't have let her participate but for girl scout cookies I'm ok with it. While walking around the neighborhood we had people pulling over in their cars to ask to order since they had been tipped off that there was a girl scout walking around.

If DD didn't want to sell the cookies she wouldn't have to. I don't think any school or organization should force kids to sell. If they want to sell to help other kids then that's great but it should never be required.

When I was a kid my Catholic school had one fundraiser every year and it was candy bars. The school bought them for 50¢ each and we sold them for $1 per bar. There was no requirement to sell any but it did get very competative (sp?) between the kids and the class that sold the most got to wear regular clothes one day instead of their uniform.

I take issue with school fundraisers partly because we homeschool. We already pay taxes to fund the schools, we shouldn't have to buy wrapping paper to subsidize them too. It makes me want to start going door to door selling trinkets at a 500% markup to buy my kids books or trips to the zoo but we don't because we pay for what our kids need and don't ask others to foot the bill. I have never felt guilty for saying no to a kid selling stuff.

I guess I don't understand why activities can't be pay your own way. When I was in high school everything had a fee. If you wanted to be on the baseball team you had to pay a certain amount plus rent your uniform from the school and buy your own t-shirt. You also had to own your own glove and bat since the school didn't supply them. I'm sure there were kids who couldn't afford it, one year I couldn't be on the swim team because we didn't have the money but that's the way the world works. Why has this changed? Why are kids now expecting others to give them money to do these things? Inexpensive things should be paid for by the school, they get an average of $8000 per student. I have about $2000 to homeschool two kids and we are able to do most everything we want plus we use up to date textbooks and consumable workbooks. That amount includes extracurriculars and lessons. Why can't schools make this happen with 8x that amount in tax money to play with? Maybe schools taking the time to eliminate wasteful spending would allow them to fund projects without fundraising.

I really don't like kids raising money for fun extras or trips, like school ski clubs raising money to buy lift tickets - I'd like to go skiing too but it's expensive, if these kids want to go they need to earn the money themselves since they are usually teenagers anyway and could at least babysit or mow lawns for the money. Panhandling is the other annoying thing, no matter how many times you shake that coffee can in my face in front of the grocery store to raise money to buy you and your swim team new jackets I am not going to put my change in it, what's wrong with the jacket you're already wearing?


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## a-sorta-fairytale (Mar 29, 2005)

I am glad that while dd's charter school is POOR and has to fund raise at least the core values of the school are reflected in the fund raising choices.
We had:
*usborn book fair
*koru catalog http://korufundraising.com/
with organic spices, organic body products, reuseable bags etc
*and a WAHM who did the school pictures (which turned out so beautiful and not cruddy like normal big name school pics)

I also did a fund raiser for the school where i bought 400 hand made fair trade finger puppets @ a little under $1 each and sold them for $2 each. I made the school over $300 and the items were something the kids liked, were used for gifts, and were aligned with the school values. I donated the unsold puppets to a local shelter a few days before xmas so all the kids in the shelter had one gift to open.

We have talked about charging a school fee each year for the students so that there doesnt have to be as much fund raising. The school uses a lot of really nice materials (beeswax crayons, water colors, wool yarns etc) so the parents hardly have any supplies to buy. I think i spent under $10 on school supplies this year - had to get a box of bandaids, a pack of printing paper and a box of ziplock bags. At the local public school i would have to buy between 50-100 worth of supplies. So, i wouldnt mind spending the $50-100 supply fee instead of as many fund raisers.


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

"Yes... she goes to a Catholic school... and yes they do not have enough money to operate, hence them not having a music or art teacher....

*But then they should raise their tuition, not have some unattainable fundraising goal to meet that the parents end up writing a check out for anyway.*

Seriously, DSD would have to sell thousands of dollars of crap to meet her goal... and let's be realistic... she is 5, so she isn't selling anything... her parents are."










My dd also goes to a religious nonprofit school. And I would like them to _charge what it costs_ upfront. If they were to have a scholarship fund for students who couldn't afford the standard rate, I'd be happy as heck to fundraise for THAT.


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## rachel1496 (Oct 15, 2009)

My niece's public school was really heavy on the fundraisers in the beginning of the year but they've slowed right down since before Halloween. For the most part I don't mind it but I HATE HATE HATE those "prize" sheets they send home with the kids. Try explaining to a 4 year old that the remote control car she wants to win requires over $1000 in sales and we don't know nearly enough people to make that even a remote possibility.


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## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

Our neighborhood doesnt allow people to go door-to-door selling stuff (anything at all).

I do buy girl scout cookies (like 1 box a year), because they taste good.

I'd rather do something like volunteer at the school vs. buy random junk. In my first 2 years of college I spent 450 hours tutoring in elementary schools in southern california, great experence for me (Im working on a teaching degree), great for the kids, and great for the teachers.


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## Cascadian (Jan 28, 2009)

Fundraising doesn't bother me.

Private schools, IMO, are businesses. If they build it into the financial model for the kids, so be it. You have a choice to send your kids or not. What's the difference between adding a couple of hundred to the tuition vs fundraising a couple of hundred? Half dozen of one, six of the other.

My DD sells cookies for Guides and loves it. Life skills, counting money, learning a sales pitch, pride in selling, learning how to be heard. I don't see anything wrong. And people around here love to buy the cookies - never seen a grumpy person once.

Public schools - obviously underfunded, and typically fundraising benefits the school as a whole, which benefits my kids. Can't really see anything wrong with this.


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