# Any other moms of Explosive/ Chronically inflexible Children?



## TreeLove (Nov 20, 2001)

just wondering...I've got 2....


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## CanOBeans (Apr 7, 2002)

:raises hand and waves wildly:

My DS is five and has tantrums like a two-year-old at the drop of a hat. God forbid I should say something that isn't exactly what he wants to hear or suggest doing something other than what he's doing at that exact moment. Sometimes I preface my suggestions with "please listen to everything I want to say, and then if you want to freak out about it you can" just to ward off the tantrum.







: He's improving little by little, but it's like moving a mountain some days -- I get so tired out just trying to keep my patience.

I can't imagine two of them. My DD is as easy going as my DS is uptight. Sigh. What do you do with your kids?


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## Missgrl (Nov 18, 2001)

My 2 year old is becoming that way!!!

I just want to say I'm so glad you are back Treelove!!!








I've missed your posts!


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## khrisday (Mar 18, 2002)

Treelove I have two as well- ds has Asperger's Syndrome (which means he thingks he is in charge of the worls and has preconceived notions about everything but doesn't think about telling you his ideas), and dd has post traumatic stress which means basicly that she is the freak out queen (she's actually a little more reasonable than ds). Have you read the book The Explosive Child- very helpful, also Raising Your Spirited Child. Do yours have sensory issues as well? Both of mine do.


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## TreeLove (Nov 20, 2001)

I read 1/2 of Raisng your Spirited Child-it kinda fit our situation, but not quite, then Emmet's teacher turned me on to The Explosive Child-it describes BOTH boys perfectly!I haven't finished the book yet, but just knowing baskets A,B &C has helped ALOT!

As to the question on how I do it...I take life a few minutes at a time, look out for potential pitfalls, and try to stick to a pretty rigid schedule, so there's no "surprises" for the boys.

I had then tested for special ed. Emmet qualifies due to learning delay, emotional/language delay, and some minor physical delays/problems. Gus was originally in the program as a role/model or peer for the children who needed special ed, but the teacher realized that she was spending MORE timewith Gus than any other child- helping him transition and navigate through the class due to his high anxiety. We then had him evaluated and although his intelligence is in the 95%tile for his age, his ability to cope with life is delayed.

Somedays are so hard. Days with only 1 or 2 meltdowns per son are the GOOD ones! LOL! The other day was a BAAAAAD one. Gus and Emmet were playing a game in their wading pool. I called gus in for something and that set Emmet off. I offered to take Gus's place in the game, but I just didn't understand the rules. This made Emmet livid! He kept screaming at me "YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THE RULES!!!! I'M SOOOOOO FRUSTRATED AT YOU!!!!" Finally, I gave up, told Emmet to come in the house and get ready for the fireworks, and I walked into the house thinking he would follow me. He came in about 5 minutes after me and got ready to go. The next day dh found 12 inch X's scratched into the driver side door of our van!

Sigh









But I STILL wouldn't trade this journey for anything. They have taught me SOOO much about what it means to be a good loving parent and for the most part I love this parenting trip, even the bad days.

One more thing, were your children preemie or did they have jaundice? DS's teacher has found that over the years about 90% of her "preemies" were/are Explosive and Chronically Inflexible. She feels it's related to prematurity/jaundice.

When we first met I told her that I didn't feel that Gus and Emmet were "bad" children, but were often percieved that way when we are out in public and they are pitchin' fits or fighting/attacking each other. She told me that:

"There are no bad children, just children who learn differently. It's our JOB to figure out how to help them." That really helped me put their behavior in perspective. They need my help in order to navigate in this world.

And yes they do Sensory Integration Disorder....


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## khrisday (Mar 18, 2002)

mine were both overdue and neither were jaundiced, but many preemies have developmental delay, learning disabilities, and other problems. My daughter was born with very severe meconium aspiration requiring heart/lung bypass surgery so she definately has some birth trauma.


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## lucina3 (Jun 25, 2002)

What a perfect description of my 4 year old! Sometimes I wonder how I'll survive!


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## MamaZuzi (Mar 31, 2007)

: Hi. I'm MamaZuzi and I'm hoping I found yet another place to get (and give) support. I have 2 young'ins who I love desperately but I struggle a lot. I believe they are both spirited (one inward and one outgoing) and I'm spirited as well. My firstborn has had developmental issues for a long time although he is mostly doing very well in 1st grade. He may well have a low level variety of Noonan's disease. My daughter is the more "normal" of the two but has been a real "bear" since turning 4 in Jan. She is HIGHLY INFLEXIBLE and that is what gets me lately. I try everything I cn think of and have read about and feel I'm doing pretty well but she can always outlast me and we end up in an ugly mess as we did today in the car (her getting out of her seat, throwing things, calling names, hitting her older brother etc.). Ugh.


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## Magella (Apr 5, 2004)

I have one, age 7, situation improving dramatically lately.

For those of you who are reading or have read The Explosive Child, here is a link to the Center for Collaborative Problem Solving (founded by Dr. Greene, author of The Explosive Child) web seminars-online seminars given by Dr. Greene and Dr. Ablon, accessible either live or anytime after the original broadcast (there is a fee). I've been to two workshops by Dr.s Greene and Ablon, and they are wonderful and explain very clearly the collaborative problem solving method. http://ccps.info/training/webinars.html


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## MamaZuzi (Mar 31, 2007)

Did you find the seminar or workshop you attended to be useful and easy to apply to your life? In other words, would you recommend it? I usually end up getting books because they are the most affordable but not sure they are always the easiest to absorb and put into practice. I saw those webinars and was thinking of viewing one once it has been done (less expensive).














:


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## earthluvinmama (Jan 20, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sledg* 
For those of you who are reading or have read The Explosive Child, here is a link to the Center for Collaborative Problem Solving (founded by Dr. Greene, author of The Explosive Child) web seminars-online seminars given by Dr. Greene and Dr. Ablon, accessible either live or anytime after the original broadcast (there is a fee). I've been to two workshops by Dr.s Greene and Ablon, and they are wonderful and explain very clearly the collaborative problem solving method. http://ccps.info/training/webinars.html

I'm currently reading The Explosive Child...thanks so much for the link


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## veganf (Dec 12, 2005)

My 3yo. But it's improving S-L-O-W-L-Y.
Oh and he was 3.5 weeks overdue and no jaundice.


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## michelle1k (Jul 7, 2002)

Hi, I have an 8-year old (will be 9 in less than a month) who is (still) inflexible, explosive and highly emotional.







:

He has been like this from birth. The arrival of his sibling 4 years later made for really intense family living.

I am homeschooling him, but on the burn-out end of the scale pretty much constantly. Others are recommending school so I can get a break from him, but he is not a good fit for a traditional classroom. He is highly gifted, doing 6th grade math, 8th grade science and reads at young adult level. What we're planning on doing is to, over time, involve more and more outside tutors in his life.

Just yesterday, he was having breakdown upon breakdown because of a misunderstanding with the girl across the road who is 12. I was explaining and discussing the situation with him and as I was doing it (and he was melting down even while we were talking) I was thinking "man, this is like talking to a super-intelligent adult with the emotional skills of a 2-year old". Even though he "gets" something intellectually, does not mean he likes it or *wants* to get it.









Dh and I are immigrants to the US and so we don't have (much of) a support network. When we did get a large-ish break about a year ago now, we were amazed at how relaxed we became without him around and how our internal stress levels rose after being reunited with him after just 15 minutes. It's like he operates on another level of intensity altogether and needs everyone else up there with him. We're wiped most of the time.

Oh, he was almost 2 weeks overdue with no jaundice.


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## dara00 (Mar 30, 2007)

I feel like my daughter is heading in this direction, but I also don't know if it is just because she is 2. How do you tell?


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## Altair (May 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TreeLove* 
One more thing, were your children preemie or did they have jaundice? DS's teacher has found that over the years about 90% of her "preemies" were/are Explosive and Chronically Inflexible. She feels it's related to prematurity/jaundice.

When we first met I told her that I didn't feel that Gus and Emmet were "bad" children, but were often percieved that way when we are out in public and they are pitchin' fits or fighting/attacking each other. She told me that:

"There are no bad children, just children who learn differently. It's our JOB to figure out how to help them." That really helped me put their behavior in perspective. They need my help in order to navigate in this world.

And yes they do Sensory Integration Disorder....


I agree with the teacher on both points! I teach children with Asperger's and high(ish)-functioning autism in small inclusion classes... and I have also noticed that the majority of my kids were either preemies or had some kind of birth trauma/oxygen deprevation. Not all, but most.

As to the second point... that's what gets me through the day as well. I find there is NOTHING more helpful when dealing with explosive children than the ability remain clam and collected in the midst of their storm and the ability to TEACH them out of their problems rather than emotionally respond to the outburst.

Like a PP said (maybe it was you)... explosive kids try to get YOU up to their level of intensity. It takes a lot of work on the adult's part to avoid that. I repeat mantras in my head and relax my muscles and look at my breathing and slow down my blood pressure when a kid is melting down. There is no way I can help the child if I'm also agitated myself.

Depending on the kid, I either have to avoid the issue causing the meltdown and work on calming techniques first, or I need to help talk out the problem in a low voice. I don't like to *give* the child the solution to the problem causing the meltdown, b/c then I'm not giving him/her the tools to solve it alone next time. I also work on teaching them how to take a break and calm themselves down before we address the issue.... but for a lot of kids that takes a lot of time before they don't need me to physically be right there and help.

And then in general, I use a lot of Michelle Winner's Social Thinking ideas to help them see other perspectives in the world. The meltdowns won't stop until the root problem is addressed-- is the child mis-perceiving other's social cues? can the child not *think* socially when sensory issues become overwhelming? does the child not realize we can't read his/her thoughts? does the child not realize other people have thoughts and feeings? (and does s/he CARE???







)


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## michelle1k (Jul 7, 2002)

Oh, yes - sensory integration dysfunction / disorder... I should have mentioned that he has that. Both my kids have it actually, but life is pretty overwhelming on a lot of levels for ds (more so than for dd).


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## Magella (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaZuzi* 
Did you find the seminar or workshop you attended to be useful and easy to apply to your life? In other words, would you recommend it? I usually end up getting books because they are the most affordable but not sure they are always the easiest to absorb and put into practice. I saw those webinars and was thinking of viewing one once it has been done (less expensive).














:

I found the workshops I attended to be _extremely_ helpful, because they helped me understand better which made applying the concepts in daily life MUCH easier. The book is awesome, and I do refer back to it (and to my workshop notes) when I need reminders, but I cannot express to you how helpful it was for me to actually attend the workshops-to hear it explained by spoken word and anecdote, to hear the questions of other parents answered.

I haven't seen one of the webinars yet, but based on my experiences with their "in-person" seminars I would absolutely recommend giving it a try. Also, there's a new (less expensive) DVD coming out this spring/summer (that was taped at one of the workshops I attended, which again was extremely helpful and very much worth attending). I really can't speak highly enough about these people and their work. (I sound like a paid advertiser, but I'm not. It's just helped our family a lot.)


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## Princessenoire (Jul 26, 2006)

Wow. I'm so excited to see this group. We have a six year old who...man, explosive describes him perfectly! He does NOT deal with change well at all, and has very specific ideas of how things should be. He was not jaundiced at all, but was induced at 37 weeks







: and had lung issues until the age of 5 due to it. I think I run longer gestationally, as his sister was born this past Oct (ch-ch-ch-changes!) at a few days "over dates" but covered in vernix. I am definitely going to check out The Explosive Child. Thanks!


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## Tuesday (Mar 3, 2003)

I'm bumping this thread even thought it is a bit old. My older son turns 5 next week and he is still every bit as explosive as he was 5 years ago!

I feel so discouraged. We've had him see peds, developmental peds, child psychiatrists, social workers. The opinion is he is too young to diagnose and he doesn't have autism but is "intense" and may develop mood disorder later in life (which sounds like a lot of people, actually).

I have read and re-read Explosive Child, Spirited Child, and everything else I can find and I just can't seem to maintain a calm consisten manner with my son. He absolutely drives my DH and I bonkers some days with his miserable, high strung moods and angry demands and tantrums. The more frustrated we become and at a loss to hold it together, of course, the worse he gets.

My other son is very different. He's almost 2 and he's grumpy sometimes and stubborn but within a more normal moderate range. He's 2, after all. Mostly he's just a pleasant guy to be around.

But my older son - I have such a hard time with him. And yet everyone that knows him can't handle him and his moods escalate more with them than with me. My close friends say they could "not" handle his moods and anxieties. I'm not sure if that is good or bad.

Anyway, I'm really at a loss where to turn - the mental health services in my city have seen him and they've kind of turned their back on us now. I feel the stress from dealing with him had contributed to my chronic pain disorders I've developed.

I'm just wondering if other parents out there have similar kids and have found some solutions beyond Ross Greene's book!

Thanks so much.


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## raisinghumans (Sep 2, 2006)

Funny how things happen. I haven't visited mothering for a couple of months and came on tonight specifically to post this very thread...

Anyone else out there with chronically inflexible children?

Hmmm, so there are.

My dd is 8 years old. She is Explosive and Chronically Inflexible.

I have read the book. It describes her so well, you know the whole waffle dilemna in the beginning.

My dd doesn't exhibit some of the other disorders mentioned in the book like Aspergers or ADHD or Sensory Issues. She is however completely inflexible, mostly grouchy/unhappy.

I worry about her so much because once she heads down the freak out road she says such terrible things, not about anyone in the house but about herself. And that is what makes it really difficult for me to stay calm through.

She says (when melting down) things like:

I want to kill myself.
I don't care if I hurt myself.
I am stupid.
I never should have been born.
I hate myself.
and on it goes.

It breaks my heart. I have done everything to help my dd's grow with a sense of self worth and to hear her talk that way is so painful.

I did seek help from some family services in my town. The woman didn't have much to offer except that my dd is a really neat kid, she doesn't see any need to worry about her self esteem, and to try and accept that she is chronically inflexible.

Unfortunately it is not so easy. I wish I could film one of my dd's meltdowns for her to see.

And now, my 6y/o dd has started to say things like "I am so bad" when I have to ask her to stop doing something and I know that she is totally learning that from her sister.

And another thing, my inflexible dd is really really tough on her sister. She yells at her, tries to punch her etc. I hate that my younger dd has to put up with so much. I do what I can to explain to her what is going on and keep her out of harms way but it is still hard on her too.

Ugghhh. I really wish I had shiny happy kids sometimes. The constant negativity really gets me down.

Thanks for listening!


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## straighthaircurly (Dec 17, 2005)

We go through really bad phases of what my husband calls emotional firestorms where my 4.5yo son cries, bites, hits, and carries on over something as simple as the wrong milk glass. I am exhausted emotionally by 9:30am. Fortunately the last few days have been wonderful after 2 weeks of horror. I don't know if getting him back on regular doses of omega 3/6s is what is turning it around or if it is just luck.


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## Tuesday (Mar 3, 2003)

straighthaircurly - what is the source of the omega 3s you're giving your DD - what brand and type of supplement, I mean? I have a bottle of Carlsson's fish oil but I keep forgetting to give it to my DS. Will do so right now!

raisinghumans - the comments from Family Services in your town - that sounds like the sort of replies I get. The psychiatrist (we have, apparently, one of the worst shortages of child psychiatrists in the country in my city) after 5 months of assessment basically said the same thing. He's intense, you're intense, deal with it. And not much help. (She determined I was intense after one of her psychiatric medical students called my house and was so rude, I thought it was a prank phone call. This student (an MD studying to be CHild Psych) was literally the rudest person I've ever spoken to on phone. I lost my patience and yelled at the person and complained to the office.)

It's frustrating when people act like you're imagining your child's issues or people with "shiny" kids as you say really don't "get" what one goes through.

Agreed. There are days too when I am mentally exhausted by 9:30 a.m.

The really crazy thing is I am a SAHM and we need money and I really want to be home with my second son and want to start a before/after child care program. I'm worried about how my explosive DS will fare and will he scare away potential clients and their families. Meanwhile, 18 years ago, I worked with "young offenders" in group home and foster parenting settings and had less trouble than I have with my 5 year old!

Hugs Moms


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

My dd, 5, is pretty chronically inflexible and explosive. She does have sensory issues and may be on the autism spectrum (a developmental ped says she's probably not, but I often think she is), and I think the way she perceives the world can be overwhelming for her and she is still figuring out how to handle it in calmer, more socially acceptable ways.

We are going to start her in OT for her sensory issues this summer and see if that helps at all.

Another book that has some good tips is The Difficult Child by Turecki. I read it a long time ago so don't remember it that well, but I do recall that it had some interesting stuff about temperament vs. misbehavior - in other words, as parents we need to figure out what our kids are doing as part of their nature/temperament (things they can't help) vs. what they are choosing to do (can help and change). It's also anti-spanking, which is always good.

I think I should reread that, as well as The Explosive Child.


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## Magella (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tuesday* 
I'm bumping this thread even thought it is a bit old. My older son turns 5 next week and he is still every bit as explosive as he was 5 years ago!

I feel so discouraged. We've had him see peds, developmental peds, child psychiatrists, social workers. The opinion is he is too young to diagnose and he doesn't have autism but is "intense" and may develop mood disorder later in life (which sounds like a lot of people, actually).

I have read and re-read Explosive Child, Spirited Child, and everything else I can find and I just can't seem to maintain a calm consisten manner with my son. He absolutely drives my DH and I bonkers some days with his miserable, high strung moods and angry demands and tantrums. The more frustrated we become and at a loss to hold it together, of course, the worse he gets.

My other son is very different. He's almost 2 and he's grumpy sometimes and stubborn but within a more normal moderate range. He's 2, after all. Mostly he's just a pleasant guy to be around.

But my older son - I have such a hard time with him. And yet everyone that knows him can't handle him and his moods escalate more with them than with me. My close friends say they could "not" handle his moods and anxieties. I'm not sure if that is good or bad.

Anyway, I'm really at a loss where to turn - the mental health services in my city have seen him and they've kind of turned their back on us now. I feel the stress from dealing with him had contributed to my chronic pain disorders I've developed.

I'm just wondering if other parents out there have similar kids and have found some solutions beyond Ross Greene's book!

Thanks so much.











I'm sorry you haven't found the help you need. Our experience was our explosive child did have an underlying anxiety disorder that needed treatment-the whole explosive child approach is wonderful, but sometimes there is an underlying "something else" that needs treatment in order for that approach to be effective. We hadn't really guessed that anxiety was behind a lot of our dd's explosiveness and inflexibility-it just sometimes looks different in kids than we tend to think anxiety looks. Our dd also has sensory issues that are "sub-clinical" which contribute to her explosiveness (I think if we'd had her evaluated at a younger age, before we learned to cope as much as we did, and before she started to outgrow some sensitivities, she would have qualified for some treatment for her sensory issues). Also, if a child lacks the skills (or the level of skill) required to engage in the collaborative problem solving approach, then we're going to feel stuck in the approach and it isn't going to be effective. We found that this was another big thing for us, our dd really had to learn some emotional regulation before this approach could really take off and work for us. She also had to learn some flexibility in thinking, which we could address both with the collaborative problem solving approach and outside of that-through games that encouraged flexibility, through talking about flexibility and demonstrating flexibility ourselves. _Raising A Thinking Child_ is a book that focuses on ways of helping kids learn skills that allow them to participate in problem-solving together with others-mainly through games and role-play.

Check out this site if you haven't already, http://www.explosivekids.org/index.html, because there's a message board there (though it can be kind of slow) with some people who have a lot of experience and advice to offer.


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## Tuesday (Mar 3, 2003)

sledg - thanks for the advice and links.

I'm curious - if you don't mind me asking - what sort of treatment has worked for your daughter? I mean outside of cognitive retraining as you describe? I'm curious in particular because my own DS - I am pretty certain too that he has anxieties which lead to his irritability, mood swings, inflexibility. It's not surprising since I have anxiety issues myself. I feel for my DS b/c I see how anxious he gets about a particular situation - he is so anxious, he projects into the future about what may or may not occur and it is so hard for him to just enjoy "now". A lot of adults struggle with anxieties and worries but I think it truly sucks for a young boy to already be neurotic and anxious. Or maybe the idyllic childhood is just a myth.

Anyway, I"m looking into that text you recommended! THANKS!


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

Sledg - I'm also curious about worked for the anxiety in your dc. My dd also has anxiety, and I suspect it and the sensory issues are at the heart of dd's "difficult" nature.


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## Magella (Apr 5, 2004)

Well, first we saw a psychologist who only worked with dd. She did a lot of cognitive-behavioral stuff, which really is a very good approach for dealing with anxiety. The problem with the psychologist's only working with dd was that my dh and I felt like we still had no clue what to do a lot of the time-and that was a problem since dd spends the majority of her time with dh and I, not in a psychologist's office.

The second psychologist worked primarily with dh and I, and was also a cognitive-behavioral therapist. She helped us learn how to best respond to dd's anxiety, so that we could help her learn to cope. She also worked with us to help us figure out how to best proactively work on the behavioral issues-the aggression, the meltdowns-which included a lot of work on helping dd learn to better identify, communicate, and manage her emotions.

In between the first and second psychologists, I found that we could learn a lot at home about dealing with the anxiety. Two books were extremely helpful, and again are cognitive-behavioral approaches to anxiety. _Freeing Your Child From Anxiety_ helped us better understand anxiety, and gave us some tools for helping our dd. _What To Do When You Worry Too Much_ is geared toward kids, for use with adult help and also gave us very helpful tools. Both helped us help dd understand anxiety better, which is enormously important for learning to cope with it.

As far as what specifically worked for dd: learning to be more aware of her feelings, to check in from time to time with her emotions and physical state; learning relaxation techniques (like progressive muscle relaxation, belly-breathing) and learning what else helps her feel good/relaxed when she's feeling tense/etc. (for her this might be physical activity, reading, alone time, a walk outside...); learning reality-testing (is what I'm worrying about really likely to happen?, for example-learning to recognize when something is actually dangerous vs. when the "worry brain" is in control and overreacting); learning to distract oneself/shift gears by focusing on a pleasant thought or do something that requires concentration (and is completely different from what one is worrying about). At one point, she had some anxiety about using the bathroom that really had an obsessive-compulsive quality to it. To deal with this particular issue, dd and the therapist came up with a rewards chart together: every time dd _tried_ a particular coping skill after using the bathroom she got a sticker, and at the end of the day if she got 3 stickers she got to choose a treat. This worked very well, and really helped dd get "unstuck" and resolve the anxiety around using the bathroom. We learned to reassure her less (because reassuring her reinforces the anxiety), and instead to let her know when something is "for mom and dad to worry about, it's not [her] job", or to just listen once and encourage her to solve the problem herself ("oh, you got cut. I see. Well, you know where the band-aids are if you need one."), or encourage her to write it down in her journal. We learned to stop trying to fix things, stop trying to make dd less anxious, and to be more calm ourselves. We found it helped to do whatever we could to keep her overall stress level down-modify our activities schedule, monitor our own mood/tone of voice/body language/stress level, provide predictable routine. Our therapist also had us incorporate child-led one-on-one time as many times a week as we could fit in, for 15-20 minutes a day. This totally positive interaction did wonders for both her and us.

For the sensory issues, which do give rise to some of her anxiety, we've just worked on coping. For loud noises she uses headphones, we've worked on helping her learn to ask for space (and on teaching siblings to respect that request), we buy clothes that work for her, we do some brushing/deep pressure/heavy blanket/other sensory activities that seem to help soothe her.

There has been so much involved in helping dd with her anxiety that I can't really capture it all here. Again, those books are good places to start and I highly recommend them. And I really think it would've been much harder to help dd learn to cope with anxiety without the help of our psychologists. We really benefitted from both the expertise in understanding and dealing with anxiety, and the support. Anxiety is such a tough, draining thing both for our child and for us.

eta: http://www.worrywisekids.org/index.html has some good information about kids and anxiety. Here's a description of cognitive behavioral therapy from that site, and sums up (very generally) what has helped dd:

Quote:

Cognitive Behavior Therapy:
Teaching kids to challenge their anxious thoughts and understanding of situations, rather than accepting anxious thoughts as the truth, CBT encourages kids to generate more realistic versions of situations and their ability to cope with them. Ready with a new mindset, children then gradually face their fearful situations breaking the challenges down into small, manageable steps. Overtime, children are able to more quickly tap into non-anxious interpretations of situations, and understand that avoidance of feared situations, only makes matters worst, instead the only way to get past anxiety is to face it head on and approach situations until they become used to them.

_First is Psychoeducation_. Children need an explanation for how anxiety is triggered and maintained, and importantly how feeling anxious is not a reflection of the actual degree of danger or likelihood of risk in a situation. .._Second is Cognitive Restructuring_. Children will be guided to generating and evaluating the accuracy of self-talk-their internal dialogue or appraisal of a situation..._Third_, because anxious thinking riles up the body, children are taught _breathing and relaxation techniques_. _Fourth, children are coached to re-approach_ their feared situations now prepared with their new skills of smart, worry-wise thinking and calm breathing. Challenges or exposures are taken starting with the easiest (using the child's assessment, or fear temperature as a guide) and working step by step till they reach their goal.


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## TiredX2 (Jan 7, 2002)

OMG. What a find!

We are currently seeing a psychologist (for DD, but DP & I go too) for so many of these issues. They have been batting around diagnoses--- anxiety disorder, depression, biopolar--- for a couple years now.

We have been doing deep breathing excercises w/DD since she was young. The psychologist is helping her do more visualization as well.

Can't wait to read the book! We have been encouraged to read several books on bipolar, but this just seems like such a better fit.


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## Justmee (Jun 6, 2005)

I am actually re-reading The Explosive Child. I got a free copy when it first came out because I was working at a radio station, the publisher sent it, and no one wanted it. I was teaching children with behavior disorders at the time so I grabbed it, read it, and then shared it with everyone else at work







.

One of my twins tends to be explosive. I think she also has sensory issues (starting OT this week). She's not a majorly severe case by any means, but she definatly has "issues" (for lack of a better work). When she loses it she's just not rational, and it can be over anything, including something that never bothered her before. Most of the time she is a wonderful, loving child, very happy and smiley, but if she goes "off" watch out...


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## greeny (Apr 27, 2007)

Sledg, thanks so much for all the info. I know that "treatment" (that's not the right word, but I can't think of the right word) for different kids will be different, but you've given me a lot of great ideas and things to think about and read. Thanks so much.


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## LauraLoo (Oct 9, 2006)

Giving this thread a little









I've had the "Explosive Child" book for about 6 months, and just opened it up yesterday. DS used to just cry or passively resist when he was frustrated, but within the last couple of months it's escalated to more. He's also an anxious kid, was speech delayed, highly sensitive, and some SPD's. We taken him to a neuropsych and a ped. neurologist that haven't seen anything dx'able.

Funny because he has great problem solving and flexibility of thinking if the situation doesn't involve him. Once his emotions get involved he loses all perspective - he just can't seem to get past his own feelings and has made some poor choices in how he is handling things at school and at home. It's like watching a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde!

Will be going back through this thread to re-read all the suggestions.....
OP - thank you for posting this!


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## Hiker Mama (May 12, 2008)

My ds (6) is spirited and intense, though not to the extent that some of you are describing. It was so interesting for me to read this thread. I want to send you all hugs and make you some tea or something; I really feel for you. SInce i'm not in quite the situation that many of you are, I don't have too much to offer, except for one thing: I have been seeing an art therapist for a little over a year now, and have used some of the techniques I have learned from her to help my son with his intense emotions. In particular, when he is really upset about something (sad and/or angry) I encourage him to paint or draw his emotions. He is already artistic and can communicate with words about what he feels, he just has a difficult time moving through difficult emotions to get to the other side. Many times he will follow my advice to do some art around his emotions, then he will share with me the art work and what the piece means. He is then usually able to move on; it calms him down, helps him externalize his feelings, and resolve them in some way. Now he will even think to do that on his own sometimes. It is really cool how profound his thoughts are at such a young age, and how he can express them in art.

We also try to use other anger management techniques, such as yelling into or hitting his pillow, jumping up and down, going outside and running around the yard as fast as he can... I can't think of what else. All of these things work best when we are showing to him that we understand his emotions and hear what he is telling us. Also, sometimes it just helps to have something positive to look forward to in the future ("I know you're upset that we have to leave the playground now, but we need to go home and get lunch so that you can go to school and do [whatever special thing is planned for the day]").

Hope this helps a tiny bit. Hugs to you all.


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## Sunflowermommie (Jul 22, 2003)

I am so glad I found this thread! I will be purchasing the Explosive Child ASAP.


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## 5in9years (Nov 18, 2005)

My 7yo is one of these kids. He was FT (about 38 weeks) with no birth trauma and minimal normal jaundice. He is a worrier, and has sensory and OCD stuff going on, though neither is beyond managing with some understanding. We've been able to reduce meltdowns to almost never by asking him to go to his room to calm down. At first, I had to carry him to his room, and he would always run out, so at first i would have to hold him there. I would whisper in his ear that I would let go as soon as he calmed down. Eventually he would stay in his room without help, and then eventually he would walk to his room without help. Now, he will growl or argue, which is so much easier to deal with than a full scale meltdown. I ask if he needs a few minutes alone to calm down, and he either decides he does and goes, or decides he doesn't and gets it under control.

His meltdowns are almost always about things not being "the way they're supposed to be". Sometimes, we can adjust things to make him more comfortable, but I also want him to learn resilience so we balance that with helping him cope with change. I doubt he'll ever embrace change but now I have hope that he will be able to tolerate it and live a normal life-something I doubted when he was 5.

Mild OCD and sensory stuff runs in our family. No one has ever TTBOMK sought (or needed) treatment, but many of us have quirks. I was the kid who hated certain fabrics, had to have the tags cut out of my clothes and gagged on mushy foods. I also compulsively find patterns and count things (they need to come out even in some way) everywhere I go as a method of self calming. Neither of those oddities prevent me from living my life, so i work around them. They helped me to understand my son (I have other kids with sensory issues as well, but none as inflexible as this one). He only wears one brand of socks b/c he doesn't like fuzz on the inside. Neither do I, so I buy him the socks he likes. I found out in adulthood that my brother also counts things and finds patterns. My grandfather wouldn't allow his food to touch on his plate. Another relative only put one food on the plate at a time. None of those things were important in the big picture. We focus instead on his being able to tolerate a change in the afternoon routine or a cancelled doctor's appointment.

I do choose his teachers with this in mind. While we are working on dealing with change at home, I think at school things need to be easier for him. I chose a 2nd grade teacher for next year who is fairly structured. There is another equally qualified, indeed gifted, teacher, but her classroom is much more free flowing. If a lesson isn't going well, she'll rearrange the schedule to cover it later in the week and go look for butterflies in the bushes. My 9yo loved her. My 7yo would flip out.


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## claras_mom (Apr 25, 2006)

Quote:

Mild OCD and sensory stuff runs in our family. No one has ever TTBOMK sought (or needed) treatment, but many of us have quirks. I was the kid who hated certain fabrics, had to have the tags cut out of my clothes and gagged on mushy foods. I also compulsively find patterns and count things (they need to come out even in some way) everywhere I go as a method of self calming. Neither of those oddities prevent me from living my life, so i work around them.
I had to smile as I read this....I do the same kinds of things--look for patterns, count things. I have an order that things need to go in--whether it's shampooing before soaping in the shower or deciding on an order for eating the food on my plate. It's only since I got married that I realized these quirks may be a little left of center. I don't know if dd will develop her own quirks; she definitely likes control, so we'll see how that plays out. I've started to suspect mild sensory issues, but as you say, if a kid only likes a particular kind of socks and they're easy to get, then why make an issue of it?


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## suzyn (Feb 9, 2006)

I was just about to ask about anger and 5 y/os and what was appropriate, but haven't been here very much and so typed it in to the search and look what I found!!!

I have been struggling with my son since he was born. He was a planned home birth but we did a hospital transfer because of mecomium and ended with a c-section because of rapid decelerating heart rates.

Since his birth, he has been a challenge. In fact, since he was my first, I thought that was how babies were--they didn't sit peacefully in their carseats, sleep, etc.

Anyway, to make huge post, just long, last Christmas I convinced dh that there was something "not right" with ds and we needed to address it and so in the process, looked at his diet and started by taking him completely off artificial colors and flavors.(completely. not even one little pink tootsie roll from the bank). After that, we have seen marked improvement. For the most part, he is a different kid. He can concentrate, has impulse control, and generally doesn't vibrate.

Just recently, he has been having difficulty handling frustration. He shrieks and has a huge tantrum because he can't get the pillows just so for his blanket tent. He stomps off and slams the door if I don't say yes to any request (can I have a cookie; can we go to the park; i wanted THAT purple leaf)

so i read the excerpt from the Explosive Child, and to tell you the truth, it scared the crap out of me. Now I can't sleep. I'm scared I'm headed down that road and I am not in any shape to handle that waffle incident as described.

So is there any advice you can give? I have two other little girls and I spend so much energy trying to figure out ds that its a wonder dds get fed.

thanks, though, for all of this. I am still blaming myself for all of this--but not as much.


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## Tuesday (Mar 3, 2003)

I have posted on this thread and am mom of an explosive 5 year old. We have had my son visit with peds, psychiatrists, counsellors. No diagnosis except speech delay and auditory processing delays but he starts, next week, an "Intensive Child Treatment Program" at a local hospital. If I receive any helpful tips, I'll pass them on.

In the meantime, I wanted to share this book.

http://www.amazon.com/Spirit-Games-A.../dp/0471406783

The book is written by Barbara Sher. The book has absolutely nothing to do with parenting explosive kids. But I have found her activities very helpful with my son. Instead of power struggles and explosions, using ideas from this book, we've been able to avoid quite a few meltdowns.

You might want to check it out.

(If only my DH would try these ideas!







)


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## LeftField (Aug 2, 2002)

I have one. He's 4 1/2 now and it's starting to get better. Before anyone writes it off as typical toddler tantrums, my baby started tantruming at 10 months and at 3 yrs old, he's picked up a chair and thrown it. He would get so into a tantrum to the point where I used to wet his face to shock him out of it. It was like he couldn't stop himself and wanted to stop and the water on his face sort of shocked him out so he could stop. My oldest is the world's easiest going child so this was a big parenting surprise.

But he seriously is getting easier. In the past, if I touched his arm, he would throw himself down on the floor and say, "You knocked me down". He said people threw him across the room (!!!) when a light touch would cause him to hurl himself across the room. He was soooo hard. It's getting easier although I know that he is still very sensitive, he dislikes transitions, he is very self-deprecating and he is shy. He is extremely intelligent, which can be a good and a bad thing, in terms of his explosive nature. He has a really overactive imagination that can work against him sometimes (at age 2, he was afraid of imaginary cows that kept trying to eat him).

He is not on the autism spectrum.

He was not a preemie but he did have jaundice. He wasn't treated for the jaundice (homebirth) but we just gave him a lot of sunlight and breastfed frequently. It cleared up.

Sometimes, I get a little freaked out between the similarities between my little guy and my sister as a child, because my sister is bi-polar and she's had a very hard time of it.

ETA: I have seen my family doctor about this issue. My doctor is a father of 6 and has seen it all. He said that what I was describing was within the range of normal but the very far end in terms of intensity. I've also read part of the Spirited Child and the Explosive Child. I think I had to return them to the library or something before I could finish them. I didn't like the Spirited Child very much because it seemed SO broad as to encompass at least half of all children. Heck, even my oldest and I tested as "spirited" according to her broad checklist and we are the easiest-going people. We are sensitive and introverted but I don't see how one can group that together with explosive behavior like my youngest displays. I felt like the author was way too inclusive to the point where "spirited" was just a watered down term that could describe a ton of traits. The Explosive Child book was much better but I need to check it back out of the library so I can finish it.

I also bought "The Optimistic Child" which *I think* mostly deals with self-esteem but it's related to our explosive issue. I've noticed that my explosive child is very hard on himself and negative. He compares himself to much older children and that is often related to his freak-outs. He gets upset if he can't do things like much older children. I haven't started reading the book yet but it's highly rated.

Oh, and this is just random, but I've found that my explosive child is much easier to deal with if I give him chunks of responsibility. Of course, sometimes, asking him to do things causes a freak-out. But a lot of times, if I tell him that I really need help and give him an opportunity to help, he's much happier. He feels better about himself and he feels like he's in control of something.


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## IfMamaAintHappy (Apr 15, 2002)

I just read this book after a recommendation in the Raising Your Sensory Smart Child toward this book... My 8 yr old is very much inflexible, and I am so glad to have a thread with you wonderful moms on it!


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## CalaRei (Mar 10, 2008)

Wow. This is an incredibly fascinating thread. I had no idea there was a pattern like this, but it now explains some things my niece does.

We put a movie in the vcr one day at pap-pap's, and three seconds later, she was in an absolute melt down because it hadn't been rewound completely and started in the middle. I chalked it up to being coddled, but... I'll remind myself to have more sympathy in the future.

Thank you.


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## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)

This thread has a wealth of intriguing information. This all describes my son and myself pretty well. I was also diagnosed with bipolar II. I've been contemplating cognitive behavioral therapy for me to learn how to retrain my thought patterns. If I learn how to cope better perhaps I can help my son.

- Totally down on one's self
- Expecting people to read minds
- Misunderstanding people's intentions
- High anxiety, not realizing that the anxiety isn't linked to reality (I'm finally learning to question my anxiety when I'm in the midst of it)

All me.


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## mama_ani (Aug 2, 2007)

I haven't read the whole thread yet but I'm checking in here... I have one! It's my 10 yo dd.

Off to read...


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## chrissy (Jun 5, 2002)

i have one too. he's 6.5 and has also been this way from birth. more later.


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## Mihelinka (Nov 2, 2004)

I've got one too. My 4yo, a challenge to love when
he hasnt' eaten enough & he starts hitting his brother or me
He expects us to know his thoughts & gets vvery upset when we can't read his mind
Always wants to win
Everything is a competition, i can go down the slide more times than him, I"m taller, faster, etc.....
I get very tired & cranky after dealling with him


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## mauimama5 (Apr 12, 2005)

Me. 15 and 4. Near identical personalities and they look exactly alike. Although my 4 year old doesn't RAGE to the level as big brother has/does. Big brother has recently been diaognosed as Bipolar 2, and ADHD, ODD SID years back. They both suffer from really high anxiety and panic attacks.

My 4 year old is very inflexable. Funny story though...I recently bought each child thier own color matching bowls and plates. To eliminate the confusion at meal time, to make things more consistent. I thought my 4 year old specifaclly would love it. He would rather eat off a tupperware lid as long as it's familiar. My inflexable, smart, tempermetal 4 yr old HATES it. Refuses to eat out of the blue dishes b/c we gave him that color. All the other kids love it.

he baffles me....

edited to add: while I was typing this up my older son was making them cereal for a snack and gave 4 yr old the BLUE bowl. Older ds refused to give him a different bowl.....the bowl went flying.....sigh....


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## Surfacing (Jul 19, 2005)

: subbing to come back later and read


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## forrestguy (Mar 6, 2008)

This is not meant in a disrespectful or judgmental way AT ALL, but I'm wondering if these kinds of kids existed 100 years ago. I wonder how much of this is societal and due to the way that we raise kids now. And don't get me wrong, my kids have meltdowns all the time, I just can't really picture one of those pioneer kids having a meltdown. Are we giving them too much? Are we not giving them enough chores and responsibilities? I know I get depressed when I don't have enough to do, I start feeling useless.


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## Lizseas (Nov 7, 2005)

I came on the site specifically searching on this topic as well!

My 9 year old son is explosive and says the same things as you daughter... Add a whole bunch of I-hate-YOU's directed at me, and the occasional grabbing a knife from the knife block (SCARY), and that's him in a nutshell.

I also have an almost 4 year old daughter who gets really afraid when her brother is going off, and actually tries to calm him down. Then he starts spitting his rage at her!

When he is not exploding, he is a delightful child! Highly intelligent and gifted as well. He was SUCH a mellow baby too!

By the way, I am the lucky recipient of all of this. Almost NO ONE has seen his rages, except for an occasional head-butting with a good friend. Actually, he has had 2 HORRIFIC years in school with his rigidity and control-freak type teachers.

I am a single parent who works full time, so I get absolutely NO breaks from this. His father implies that I am simply being ineffective as a parent.

SIGH.

I try to plan fun things to do when I am off of work, but inevitably, I hear how awful, stupid, boring, dumb the things are.

SOOOOOO hard on me--the eternal optimist--to hear such negativity all the time!

Off to work I go! I hope more people weigh in here... It is at least nice to know I am not alone!


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## zeldah (Mar 29, 2003)

I have 2 very intense boys, but only the pumpkin gets the "explosive" label. And boy does he ever explode! Unfortunately he takes his anger out in violent ways, mostly pounding his older brother, occasionally friends, and scratching dh's car with rocks.

We've been working with Kirk Martin and CelebrateCalm.com, but it takes a long time, and lots of pro-active parenting (I call it hands on managing his behavior). I also manage their diets pretty closely, avoiding artificial colors and flavors. I have a friend who recommends the Feingold diet, which I find very difficult to follow because of my family's ULTRA pickiness when it comes to food.

Ultimately, I just try to take it one day at a time, and stay calm ... and sometimes a glass of wine at the end of a rough day.


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## mags (May 4, 2004)

I am so glad that someone started this thread. Both of my kids are explosive to some extent, but my 4.5 yr old is one of those kids that totally fits the description of the kids from, "the explosive child" book. I am almost finished reading that book and plan to use the tactics. I do not think my son's birth was particularly traumatic, BUT he did have some jaundice and was never a good nurser, even after his frenulum was clipped (tongue tied). My son's tantrums can ruin the day for the entire family. We will have something nice planned, he blows up over something seemingly insignificant and then the entire family has to accommodate him and change our plans, b/c he is throw into a funk and won't snap out of it. I know it sounds horrible to say this, but it's like he is the family party pooper, due to his freak outs. However, when he is in a good mood he can be the sweetest kid and he is also a very friendly and outgoing child.

The thing is, I have always had this weird feeling since he was a baby that he was different. It was verified after I had my second son and I felt that things with my second son seemed more, "normal" than my oldest son. I suspect my oldest does have some SPD issues and ADHD type of behavior. I was going to homeschool him, but have been so frustrated with him during this past yr that he is going to go to preschool in the autumn. He is very excited about it, but I am nervous, since I am afraid he will have one of his blow ups at school and be labeled a problem child. At the same time though I am curious to see how he will fare at school behaviorally. I know that I myself as a child was the perfect student behaviorally and academically at school, BUT had a lot of blow ups at home due to the way I was parented (overly strict, domineering parents who did not care to find out what was going on). Academically, he is very bright for his age, but I feel that emotionally and socially he is very immature due to how inflexible he can be and I worry a lot that he will end up being an outcast among peers b/c of his outbursts.


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## Danielle283 (Jun 7, 2005)

My daughter is. Just tonight she had a total meltdown when I tried to brush her teeth before her bath instead of after like normal. If I do anything out of order or different she freaks out. I feel so bad when she's trying to explain just exactly the way she wants something and we arent getting it. Oh and she wasnt a preemie or Jaundiced, but had a traumatic birth (Group b strep, breathing problems) that kept her in the NICU till she was 4 weeks old.

Something I struggle with though, is wondering if she's just spoiled as a few people have "suggested" when they see me trying to calm her down. She's not a bratty kid though in general, just knows what she wants and watch out if she doesnt get it!


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## lah7 (Dec 31, 2006)

Well, I'm definitely subbing. DS has some sensory issues (I call it 'issues' rather than disorder because I did get him evaluated, he does indeed have it, but not badly enough that we needed OT, we just try to make it through on our own). And his biggest issue is transitions and, yes, he does indeed get explosive. I think I need to go take a trip to the library.

But yes, DS has explosive tantrums at 4, and will have tantrums for an hour or longer on average, most days.


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## Surfacing (Jul 19, 2005)




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