# Are there ANY kid clothes out there without gender messages???



## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

I am getting so frustrated trying to find clothes for my son and I wanted to see what you all do! He's 7 months, but he's big, and he's wearing 12 month clothes. I'm really trying to avoid strong gender messages all over his clothes. I mean, I don't mind some blue clothes or trucks or whatever, but I don't want ALL his clothes, ALL the time to scream "boy stuff!" I'd like some neutral stuff. It was easier at first - there are plenty of yellow, green and beige clothes for 0-9 months, with gender neutral themes like teddy bears or ducks. But now in the 12 month stuff it's harder to find anything neutral. I've looked at 18 month and toddler size stuff that he will probably need by spring, and it seems impossible to find anything gender neutral in those sizes!

I'm just really frustrated. Just because I have a boy does not mean he will automatically like sports, dinosaurs, and trucks - but I can't find any clothes that don't proclaim his love of those things. I was shopping in one store and EVERY single toddler boy outfit had a sports theme - they all said "All Star" or "Varsity Team" or something similar, with pictures of sports equipment. His grandmother got him an outfit that says "I like trucks and dirt!" on it... but he's not old enough to voice an opinion about whether he actually likes trucks. I did recently buy him some onesies with cars - like I said, I don't need EVERYTHING to be neutral. I just don't like that I feel like he's already being stuck in a box based on gender - what if he likes music or playing with cooking stuff, and doesn't like sports or playing with trucks? That would be fine with me! Heck, even animals are gendered - cats are for girls and dogs are for boys, at least in the world of baby clothes. Is anyone else out there so bothered by your child being told what they are "supposed" to like from such a young age? What do you do about clothes? What other gendered items (toys, etc) do you find problematic? I can't wait to read other mamas' experiences!


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## cschick (Aug 28, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *April Dawn* 
But now in the 12 month stuff it's harder to find anything neutral. I've looked at 18 month and toddler size stuff that he will probably need by spring, and it seems impossible to find anything gender neutral in those sizes!

When the spring clothing starts coming out at Walmart and Target (for example), you'll probably be able to find a lot of plain, solid-colored shirts and undecorated khakis and shorts. Old Navy generally has pretty unremarkable plain or striped shirts in the toddler boys section in those sizes as well (http://oldnavy.gap.com/browse/category.do?cid=36097), and plain "gym pants."


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## fairejour (Apr 15, 2004)

We put m daughter in whatever we liked. She wore a little outfit that was green and red plaid with a dino on the front, and she totally pulled it off! I'm sure it was for a boy, but, you know what, she loves dino's too!

I sure that doesn't work for a boy as well, but we know how you feel.


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

At that age, I had a hard time too. My kids are older, but I love the kid's line at American Eagle. They seem to be better quality than Old Navy, Target, etc. and they aren't limited to trucks and balls. The smallest sizes are 2T though.


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## flight (Feb 3, 2004)

It's tough to find gender-neutral clothes for children at ANY age. I buy plain (solid-colour_ T-shirts whenever I can find them. Here in Canada, the chain department stores carry them, and usually the selection is better at the beginning of the season.

Actually, when my son was a toddler, we used to have fun fabric-painting his shirts. (By "we," I guess I mean me.







He didn't try his hand at painting a shirt till he was closer to 3.5.)


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## daytripper75 (Jul 29, 2003)

I look for Levi's jeans for my children. Those are about the only jeans that I can pass down from dd to ds...


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## Anastasiya (Jun 13, 2006)

I hate baby outfits with stuff (esp writing) on them, and I never really have much of a problem finding things....

I found lots of stuff at Old Navy - I usually find most of my stuff there. Grey and blue striped one piece rompers with hoodies, beige and cream rompers with hoodies, a blue one piece with orange stripes on the sleeve and a kangaroo pocket, several rompers from Hanna Andersson that are either only stripes or solids, etc.

And sometimes just a plain or striped shirt with some denim or khaki overalls.

Can you tell I dress my babies in only one pieces?









Things like this:
http://www.hannaandersson.com/style....simg=35454_Z95
http://www.hannaandersson.com/style....%7C5%7C6%7C%7C

And at Old Navy - here's a boat load of stuff: http://oldnavy.gap.com/browse/category.do?cid=6177

BabyGap too:
http://www.gap.com/browse/category.do?cid=7142


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## eepster (Sep 20, 2006)

Gymboree has gender neutral themes going most of the time. A couple or years back the did a really cute hedgehog theme. DS had a few items from the boys side (overalls, a polo shirt, etc) plus the vibrating hedgehog toy, and one of the little girls in his Music Together class had a dress and cardigan from the girls side of the store. It was so cute the day they showed up in matching outfits just by chance.

Another place we get neutral t-shirts is Threadless. They sometimes have really good sales, so you can hold out for those. If you sign up, you can vote for new designs and you can keep stuff in your shopping cart for ages waiting for sales (they even email you if they only have 5 or so left in the size you want while you're waiting.)


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## Just Kate (Jul 30, 2009)

We've had good luck at Old Navy (lots of plain shirts in mustard, orange, brown and tons of striped shirts) as well as Target. Last year I got several one piece outfits from Target with stripes or sea animal motifs-- one had an octopus on it, for example.


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## shanniesue2 (Jul 4, 2007)

I like the Garanimals stuff from Wal Mart... basic stripes and solids with no pictures/writing on them in cotton shirts pants... and the best thing is that they are only $3 a piece. Granted the boys stuff is in "boy colors" (blues, greens, browns, reds, etc) but I guess I don't worry too much about that.


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## Friday13th (Jun 13, 2006)

I've been buying DS a lot of solid and striped thermals this winter from Old Navy and Target usually has some plain or striped tee shirts. Hanna has some nice stuff and for a wide variety solid colored basics you can try BasicBrilliance.com or American Apparel. (AA runs REALLY small but I love their hoodies and karate pants)


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## AnnieNimIty (Nov 14, 2009)

I guess I don't see what the big deal is about what is on his clothes unless he is very aware of it. My daughter is almost 2 and the only thing wardrobe-wise she cares about is having "pretties" in her hair because mommy does.
If he can't read yet what his shirt says only effects those around him not him or his perception of gender.

Then again, maybe I really don't understand the issue.


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## DaughterOfKali (Jul 15, 2007)

I love the baby clothes at Rugged Bear.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

I had great luck at consignment stores. My little boy wore pink, blue, green, brown - all colors, really. It wasn't hard to find. Lots of bugs, butterflies, fish, stars, firetrucks, etc.

You could also try Lands End.

Also, Grow is closing out their line of cotton clothing and everything is $10 or less. It's super cute and sturdy, and there's lots of plain/stripes/non-gendered pics. If I had a little one, I'd be stocking up.

https://www.growgrowgrow.com/index.asp


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## gbailey (Mar 10, 2009)

Try Target and believe it or not Macy's. There are a lot of brands of clothing there that are gender neutral and right now they have an amazing sale so the stuff is super, super inexpensive.


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## AndrewsMother (Jul 30, 2007)

Zutano makes gender neutral cothing.

Cheaper clothing and mass marketed (GAP, Gymboree, mall stores and the like) are generally gender specific. Urban baby boutiques and specialty stores are the best places to look.


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## mrsfrenchy (Apr 14, 2008)

Lands End actually has some really good shirts. My DD got several from relatives this year that could easily be worn by a boy. They are more expensive, but if you go to their website right now, they have a good sale on.


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## luv-my-boys (Dec 8, 2008)

it is hard to find "plain" clothes for kids of any age or sex. I hate having the boys plastered in cartoons or (IMO) worse advertisements. Some of the places I have been able to find plain stuff has been:

walmart: their garanimal lines have basic solid colored T's or Stipes. Minimally screenprinted pants and shirts as well. They tend to have a lot of plain basics

Target: Also have at teh start of each season some selection of plain t's or bottoms. The key is to shop EARLY in the season. Like target now has spring stuff out locally.

I like to shop at Gymboree or childrens place a lot as I hand down clothes from child to another and for us it seems to last and wear better. I only buy jeans from them (i have picky boys though) and they do carry a lot of solid colored t's (long andshort) and definately plain bottoms. I have rarely seen bottms with a print on them from them. Also they tend to do a lot stripes, some stuff is "sporty" to make them look like they are player #'s.


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## VisionaryMom (Feb 20, 2007)

We've tended to buy very basic clothes for both DS and DD. DS has mostly solid-colored or striped shirts and jeans and khakis. They're all easy mix-and-match. It's great!


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## MJB (Nov 28, 2009)

American Apparel's baby and kid clothes are almost all unisex. They run small though so order up a size (my 4yo wears a 6, my 6 yo wears an 8). Their t-shirts are very soft and are more fitted/flattering than most kids' t-shirts.
We also have lots of Old Navy and Gap. Gap usually has a boy, girl, and neutral option in their baby lines.


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## jess152 (Jan 20, 2008)

I'm with you 100%. I also hate how boys = puppies and girls = kittens. WTH!?

I've now got two boys and had a hard time the first time around with finding colourful things that weren't plastered with 'All Star' sport junk on them. I dressed DS1 in a cute little sleeper with flowers and someone asked me if I was 'trying to turn him gay' !! LOL! Unbelieveable!

I found some plain t-shirts with the plan to applique my choice of things on them. I like stripes, so will look for those. It's just so hard when stores separate into boy/girl sections. Why not a section with all kinds of colourful choices?


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## BetsyS (Nov 8, 2004)

THis is why I shop consignment. You get lots of brands/styles to choose from, without having to go to lots of stores. It works for us!

I prefer one piece outfits for babies, too (until they are 2 or 3), like a PP upthread. If you can sew, you can also easily make them. They take a yard of fabric and an afternoon.


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## 34me (Oct 2, 2006)

I love tie dye! If it doesn't move, I dye it...


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## 3*is*magic (Sep 13, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DaughterOfKali* 
I love the baby clothes at Rugged Bear.

Me too - especially the bargain basement


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## mamadelbosque (Feb 6, 2007)

Theres LOTS of stuff out there. I know this cause' I shop more-or-less exclusively at goodwill/salvation army/etc and I find lots of gender nuetral plain clothes - plaine green/blue/yellow/red/striped shirts


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## not_telling (Mar 31, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
Zutano makes gender neutral cothing.

Cheaper clothing and mass marketed (GAP, Gymboree, mall stores and the like) are generally gender specific. Urban baby boutiques and specialty stores are the best places to look.

Seconding Zutano for very cute clothing options (they tend to run small - fyi) and also basic Brilliance.


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## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

Thanks for all the great ideas! I see that several people suggested Old Navy - I haven't tried there and I will. I was surprised someone suggested Children's Place - that was actually the store I mentioned in my original post where EVERY ITEM for boys had a sports theme! I have been putting my son in a lot of Carter's things bought either consignment or at Kohl's on sale, but I will check out Old Navy, Target and Walmart based on this post. Also, I LOVE the idea of buying plain and tie dyeing it - what fun! Thanks everyone!


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## Melaniee (Apr 15, 2002)

I mostly get my son's clothing from Hanna Andersson. They have a lot of stripes or solids and sometimes, shockingly, even nice colors. LOL.

I also like Mini Boden but it depends on the items. They do have solids but also sometimes typical 'boy' emblazened clothing. Generally the only exceptions I make to the plan clothing are things with musical instruments on them, or in rarer cases a car. He mostly wears solids/stripes. I also got a super soft solid t-shirt from Gap Kids, too (ducking, I know, I know, it's Gap). I'm not happy with how the Children's Place holds up to washings but I have bought solids there in the past as well.

I loved Zutano when he was under 2!! I did used to get him things with prints back then, they just make cuter things for that age. He had a lot of animals or boats.


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## crl (May 9, 2004)

I've had lots of luck at LandsEnd. Be sure to check their overstocks page for sale prices. Hanna Andersson also has a fair bit of gender neutral stripes and solids, but tends to be quite pricey. And I agree with people who have suggested Target, I've found lots of very inexpensive solid t-shirts and sweats there.

Catherine


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Lots of really great options on this thread! I hear you: I HATE it! It's ridiculous. I feel like it's even worse for my daughter... finding a pair of girls pants that don't have a giant flower embroidered somewhere is ridiculously hard! Sometimes, I just want a pair of plain pants. Is that too much to ask?

I'll throw in Tea Collection. Really cute stuff.


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

THis is actually a huge pet peeve of mine too. Somehow we came through Christmas unburdened with clothes that I won't let him wear. I must *itch about gendering to my family enough!

My kid is about the same size/age as yours. I have had the best luck buying from:

*American Apparal* (baby sizes don't really run small IME, but the toddler sizes do)
*Zutano* (love, love, love...still gendered but in a less obnoxious way)
*Speesees* (My FAVORITE! Totally gender neutral and they are having a great sale right now. Speesees.com)
*Carters* for super basics like soft pants and one-color onesies. Some of their other stuff is ok too (but you knew that already).
*Lucky Kid* (Their girls clothes are pretty awesome; I bought a ton for my boy. But they seem to be downsizing as the store by me is no longer there. Sad, because next to speesees the pieces I got there have been my favorites).

What I do NOT like:

*Children's Place* (Uber-gendered! Plus their PJ's don't fit...too skinny).
*Gymboree* (boy's stuff all has firetrucks, dinos, pirates, what have you)
*Macy's* (I was there today and found nothing. Not even anything in Carter's (all too small) And the Macy's by me is HUGE).
*Hannah Andersson* (Their boys clothes are really boring compared to their super-cute girls stuff).

Neutral:
*The Gap and Old Navy* (They have lots of stuff without characters, but its still very gendered in terms of color combo. Plus all their boys stuff seems to have stripes. Stripes, stripes, stripes. I used to like stripes).
*Janie and Jack* Cute boy's clothes but the price tag is enough to stun.

Anyway that's my two cents. Much of it has already been posted by others. I just wanted you to know that I feel your pain. Its my personal quest to find clothes for my boy that are cute but that don't impart inappropriate messages.

Oh, and for the person who said that the kid is too young to notice...that may be true, but I am certainly old enough to notice. Most of the people who look at my kid are old enough to notice. Hopefully some of these clothing designers will wise up that MANY of us notice...and take our business elsewhere.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chamomile Girl* 
Oh, and for the person who said that the kid is too young to notice...that may be true, but I am certainly old enough to notice. Most of the people who look at my kid are old enough to notice. Hopefully some of these clothing designers will wise up that MANY of us notice...and take our business elsewhere.

I wish. This seems to be what most consumers want. I can't tell you how many comments I get when my daughter wears her red corduroy overalls (with a black and white striped girl's shirt underneath). Everything from "I guess DH dressed her this morning" with a wink to outright questions about why I dress her like a boy. Um, hello, I have photographs of _me_ in red corduroy overalls! Last I checked, nothing about red, corduroy, or overalls is gender specific. I, however, seem to be the only person on the planet that thinks that, however.

I'm reading Pink Brain, Blue Brain about this topic and it's really interesting.


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## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I'm reading Pink Brain, Blue Brain about this topic and it's really interesting.

Oooh! I read that book. I thought her theory about prenatal testosterone was intriguing.


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## snuggly (Feb 9, 2009)

I love love LOVE dreamsacks stuff for baby (and me!): http://www.dreamsack.com/store/baby/
It is bamboo: sooo soft, sustainable, and comfy... Just solid colors too.
Their duds are pricey but basic white baby clothes are on sale on sierra trading post right now: http://www.sierratradingpost.com/Dreamsacks.html
I just stocked up!


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## ~adorkable~ (Nov 7, 2007)

i wanted to add that i am a girl that loves trucks and dirt! so maybe you are assigning more gender attachment to the images than there needs to be?

i get your frustration on feeling cornered into anything for sure


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## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *•Adorkable•* 
i wanted to add that i am a girl that loves trucks and dirt! so maybe you are assigning more gender attachment to the images than there needs to be?

i get your frustration on feeling cornered into anything for sure

Oh, I'm not saying that girls can't love trucks and dirt. What I'm saying is that an outfit like that is clearly marketed to my son, and his g-ma bought it because he's a boy, and everyone oohs and aahs at how cute it is when my boy is in that outfit. But if I were to put a girl in an outfit that says "I love trucks and dirt," I would get comments like the previous poster who said that people ask why she dresses her daughter like a boy. It's assumed that my son likes trucks and girls his age don't. And with an outfit like that, you can either put that outfit on a boy and confirm gender stereotypes, or you can put it on a girl and people will act like you're a total weirdo. I'd rather just buy stuff that is not clearly aimed at one gender and sidestep the whole issue!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
I'm reading Pink Brain, Blue Brain about this topic and it's really interesting.

I'm going to have to check that book out!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chamomile Girl* 
Anyway that's my two cents. Much of it has already been posted by others. I just wanted you to know that I feel your pain. Its my personal quest to find clothes for my boy that are cute but that don't impart inappropriate messages.

Oh, and for the person who said that the kid is too young to notice...that may be true, but I am certainly old enough to notice. Most of the people who look at my kid are old enough to notice. Hopefully some of these clothing designers will wise up that MANY of us notice...and take our business elsewhere.

Thanks for all of your suggestions, you had some great ones! Also, I agree with you about the kids noticing. It's not necessarily just about whether my son will notice his stereotyped clothes. It's that everyone around him notices, and many people treat boys and girls differently from the start, and I want to challenge that. As he grows older, I don't want him to start realizing that he is expected to like certain things and not others because of his gender. I don't want to restrict him like that!


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## Addy's Mom (Nov 20, 2009)

Could someone explain the problems with gender-specific clothes to me a bit more? Does that mean no dresses for girls, etc.?


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Addy's Mom* 
Could someone explain the problems with gender-specific clothes to me a bit more? Does that mean no dresses for girls, etc.?

On a most basic level, I think it's about nature versus nurture. How to not "pre-determine" your child's nature with how you nurture and what you expose them to... i.e. dinosaurs, trucks, sports for boys and fairies, princesses, dolls for girls.

It's about trying to give your kids the room and freedom to be themselves rather than molding or stuffing them into a predetermined role.

There is the whole other component to this and this is robbing children of their childhood innocence with clothing and toys that are themed beyond their maturity level. I'm thinking of the t-shirt slogans that are sometimes way beyond the age they are marketed to (IMO).

I personally think that toys matter more than clothes, but each has impact, I think in giving kids ideas and clues about perceived social mores.

I don't so much go for gender neutral but I avoid the gender specific, stereotyped things.


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *April Dawn* 
Oh, I'm not saying that girls can't love trucks and dirt. What I'm saying is that an outfit like that is clearly marketed to my son, and his g-ma bought it because he's a boy, and everyone oohs and aahs at how cute it is when my boy is in that outfit. But if I were to put a girl in an outfit that says "I love trucks and dirt," I would get comments like the previous poster who said that people ask why she dresses her daughter like a boy. It's assumed that my son likes trucks and girls his age don't. And with an outfit like that, you can either put that outfit on a boy and confirm gender stereotypes, or you can put it on a girl and people will act like you're a total weirdo. I'd rather just buy stuff that is not clearly aimed at one gender and sidestep the whole issue!

Exactly.

I am like this with toys. My inlaws buy very stereotypical "boy" themed toys. Trucks, trucks, trucks, trucks, and more trucks. We have so many trucks. Too many trucks. I posted earlier in a different post about how they buy riding toy truck after riding toy truck, or large truck after large truck. We are overrun!

If I had a daughter would they still buy the trucks? Don't some girls want to play with trucks? And wouldn't some boys prefer something other than trucks?

Yes, my son likes trucks but he also really likes dolls. My inlaws have never bought a doll. The closest they've come to that is a stuffed animal.


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## leila1213 (Sep 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zinemama* 
Also, Grow is closing out their line of cotton clothing and everything is $10 or less. It's super cute and sturdy, and there's lots of plain/stripes/non-gendered pics. If I had a little one, I'd be stocking up.

https://www.growgrowgrow.com/index.asp

So cute! I like that stuff.

Also, kids will see their baby photos (as well as their siblings and other children) when they ARE old enough to 'understand' ... ie, they may not be able to read, but they can clearly absorb the trends in boys and girls wearing certain colors or images to the exclusion of others, and draw many (sometimes unwanted or harmful) conclusions as to what that means to their own or others' identities.


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## RoadBuddy (May 19, 2005)

We have some gendered clothes for DS. I happen to like dinosaurs, so there's some of those around, for example. What I hate is the ones with messages about what your kid will become. Things that say "future all-star" or "mommy's hero" with a firetruck. My son may not be a sports star or a fireman - if he wants to be those things, great, but I'm not into labeling his future as a tiny baby! If I had a girl, I'm sure I'd feel the same way about the equivalent things for girls.

If you're looking to avoid things like trucks, dinosaurs, sports, etc but are OK with plain/stripes in blues, reds, greens, greys, browns, it's not hard to find in my experience. But those things still seem "boyish" in color combo and look. Totally gender neutral may be harder.

I love Zutano. I've never ordered from these guys, but I like the solid colors . http://www.cottonseedclothing.com/ But I think it only goes to 2/3T. Baby Gap has the baby basics line for babies and playtime favorites for toddlers and preschoolers which has some gendered colors and messages, but also lots of plain, solid colors and stripes. Old Navy is decent for plain and striped things. Target sometimes has solids and stripes.


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## NicaG (Jun 16, 2006)

H&M also has a lot of cute unisex clothes--I've been able to hand down all of ds's H&M baby clothes to dd. And the items that are more boyish or girlish are still really cute, not obnoxious, no weird themes.

I also like Old Navy a lot.

Children's Place seems to have changed--they used to be reliable, but now their clothes are just yucky.


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## atlantafemme (Aug 4, 2007)

Oooh, I'm so happy to see this thread!









My partner is a gender sociologist so we gave our DS a gender-neutral name and have been trying to put him in gender-neutral clothing as much as possible. It does seem to be getting harder as he gets older. Plus DS is big so everyone keeps telling me he's going to be a linebacker. OVER MY DEAD BODY I reply (not b/c of my resistance to the gender stereotyping--girls can be linebackers too in my community--so much as I'd prefer him to remain concussion-free...)

My partner and I are both female and couldn't be more opposite in our gender expressions, plus we have a lot of different male friends and family members with a spectrum of gender identities/expressions. While I still think it's important to be intentional about how we model gender to and for him, I think he'll learn the most about it from the people who surround him. So we educate those people (when we can) if they don't get it.


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *RoadBuddy* 
I hate is the ones with messages about what your kid will become. Things that say "future all-star" or "mommy's hero" with a firetruck. My son may not be a sports star or a fireman - if he wants to be those things, great, but I'm not into labeling his future as a tiny baby! If I had a girl, I'm sure I'd feel the same way about the equivalent things for girls.

Yes! I agree.

Some of the slogan tees for kids go too far (IMO): i.e. "chick magnet" and worse.

On children's clothing?


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## NYCVeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Addy's Mom* 
Could someone explain the problems with gender-specific clothes to me a bit more? Does that mean no dresses for girls, etc.?

The problem with rigidly gendered clothing, IMO, is that it enforces norms about who or what a child can be/like based on their gender. There are many girls who like butterflies and ballet, of course, but the way the clothing is marketed and designed makes it seem as though 1) girls are supposed to like those things, 2) boys are not and 3) any child who doesn't conform to those expectations is somehow "wrong." So I would say the problem isn't that clothing with trucks on it is marketed to boys but that the same clothing is NOT marketed, EVER, to girls. The worst to me is the clothing that is plastered with stereotype-enforcing slogans: pink toddler shirts that say things like "Diva" or "Future Shopper" and so on.

It's the same with toys: I don't know a toddler boy out there who doesn't like to push around a doll or stuffed animal in a toy baby stroller, but most of the strollers are pink (designating that they're for "girls") and located in the "girls'" section of the toy store.

My dd wears dresses, but she also wears dinosaur pajamas. She wears pink and purple, but also red and navy blue and green (which I often have to buy in the boys' department...sigh). If she decides that pink is her favorite color and the only thing she wants to wear, that's fine with me. But I don't want her ever to feel that pink is a color she HAS to like and wear simply because she's a girl, or that there are certain colors/styles/toys/hobbies that are off-limits to her because she's a girl.


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## April Dawn (Oct 31, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NYCVeg* 
The problem with rigidly gendered clothing, IMO, is that it enforces norms about who or what a child can be/like based on their gender. There are many girls who like butterflies and ballet, of course, but the way the clothing is marketed and designed makes it seem as though 1) girls are supposed to like those things, 2) boys are not and 3) any child who doesn't conform to those expectations is somehow "wrong." So I would say the problem isn't that clothing with trucks on it is marketed to boys but that the same clothing is NOT marketed, EVER, to girls. The worst to me is the clothing that is plastered with stereotype-enforcing slogans: pink toddler shirts that say things like "Diva" or "Future Shopper" and so on.

It's the same with toys: I don't know a toddler boy out there who doesn't like to push around a doll or stuffed animal in a toy baby stroller, but most of the strollers are pink (designating that they're for "girls") and located in the "girls'" section of the toy store.

My dd wears dresses, but she also wears dinosaur pajamas. She wears pink and purple, but also red and navy blue and green (which I often have to buy in the boys' department...sigh). If she decides that pink is her favorite color and the only thing she wants to wear, that's fine with me. But I don't want her ever to feel that pink is a color she HAS to like and wear simply because she's a girl, or that there are certain colors/styles/toys/hobbies that are off-limits to her because she's a girl.











You explained it better than I could, thanks!


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## Melaniee (Apr 15, 2002)

Add to the list all the 'princess' crap. Or my favorite, the ones with 'princess' written across the butt of your toddler's sweatpants.

So, since we're talking about gender-stereotyping, I can add my family story. Ds is our eldest. I think my Ds was at least 6 if not 7 before he heard or 'learned' certain colors pertained to girls or boys. After age 7 he really started focusing on typically "boy" activities and interests, though still retains enjoyment of playing dolls with his little sister and of course loves to cook like his father. Prior to that age his interests were quite androgynous. He never asked for dresses, etc. and I never went so far as to buy them, but he liked pretty much any activities any child would like, regardless of gender. I think he still does, but he pretty much intitiates play that would be stereotypically considered 'boy,' at this point.

My Dd started telling us at age 2 1/2 that she liked pink (OMG, I detested pink and have now had to learn to...ahem...somewhat embrace it) and at age 3 started saying blue was a 'boy color' (of course we gently explained anyone can like blue and in fact it's mommy's favorite color).

So, I guess my point, and learning experience is that sometimes they're just born that way.


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NYCVeg* 
The problem with rigidly gendered clothing, IMO, is that it enforces norms about who or what a child can be/like based on their gender. There are many girls who like butterflies and ballet, of course, but the way the clothing is marketed and designed makes it seem as though 1) girls are supposed to like those things, 2) boys are not and 3) any child who doesn't conform to those expectations is somehow "wrong." So I would say the problem isn't that clothing with trucks on it is marketed to boys but that the same clothing is NOT marketed, EVER, to girls. The worst to me is the clothing that is plastered with stereotype-enforcing slogans: pink toddler shirts that say things like "Diva" or "Future Shopper" and so on.

It's the same with toys: I don't know a toddler boy out there who doesn't like to push around a doll or stuffed animal in a toy baby stroller, but most of the strollers are pink (designating that they're for "girls") and located in the "girls'" section of the toy store.

My dd wears dresses, but she also wears dinosaur pajamas. She wears pink and purple, but also red and navy blue and green (which I often have to buy in the boys' department...sigh). If she decides that pink is her favorite color and the only thing she wants to wear, that's fine with me. But I don't want her ever to feel that pink is a color she HAS to like and wear simply because she's a girl, or that there are certain colors/styles/toys/hobbies that are off-limits to her because she's a girl.

Really great post! I totally agree.


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## Smalls181 (May 12, 2006)

I always found that thrift stores were the best places to find a wide variety of neutral clothes. I could find plenty of solid colored shirts without all of the themes and designs.

OT, we did a wide variety of "boy' and "girl' clothes for DD when she was a baby and toddler. For her 2nd birthday, she picked out a one piece, grey romper with a Panda bear on it for her party. For her 3rd birthday, she picked out the most elaborate, silky, blue, fancy, girly dress that Ive ever seen. Somewhere between and 2 and 3 she became very girly and it has only gotten more intense. She hasnt worn pants in 2 months... only skirts and dresses.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smalls181* 
I always found that thrift stores were the best places to find a wide variety of neutral clothes. I could find plenty of solid colored shirts without all of the themes and designs.

OT, we did a wide variety of "boy' and "girl' clothes for DD when she was a baby and toddler. For her 2nd birthday, she picked out a one piece, grey romper with a Panda bear on it for her party. For her 3rd birthday, she picked out the most elaborate, silky, blue, fancy, girly dress that Ive ever seen. Somewhere between and 2 and 3 she became very girly and it has only gotten more intense. She hasnt worn pants in 2 months... only skirts and dresses.

Recently my daughter is the same way! She's suddenly turned into little miss Girly girl priss. I really don't know where she gets it from: she doesn't watch TV, she goes to a really crunchy Montessori preschool, I buy her a real range of clothing. But now she'll pretty much only wear something if it's satiny or glittery.


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## thehighernest (Aug 11, 2009)

I'd third Basic Brilliance. I also really really love Kate Quinn Organics (but they can be expensive unless a good sale is going on).

Oh, and also Baby Soy! And Under the Nile.

I actually buy a lot of stuff at Carters - mostly short and long sleeve plain white Onesies and cotton pants in all colors.

My thing is also that I want my 9 month old in _comfortable_ clothing. I hate all that dressy stuff often found at places like Gymboree, etc. i.e. shirts with collars or rough pants.


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## Alathia (Nov 18, 2005)

The problem I see with rigidly gendered clothing is that girls can get away with wearing "boy" things and just be called tom boyish. But trying to find some nice purple or pink boy things is awfully, awfully hard. DS1 loves pink - loves, loves, LOVES it but we can only find pink boy shirts in the dress department, and not in just plain t shirts. I end up thrifting to find pink shirts and then doing some crafting on them to make them more "him" than just a boy wearing a girl shirt.

we do a lot of basic t shirts (solids and stripes) and comfy pants from Old Navy (like this)

For little boys, we love Zutano. I love their prints and stripes and the fact that they are rarely emblazoned with trucks/sports/etc.. Here's my youngest wearing a great orange/green combination.

we also like Conceptual Tea, like this outfit

Not sure what your weather is like, but I adore little sweaters on baby boys as well. This one is from my baby sister, so it's over 20 years old (my mom saved it for me).


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## DaughterOfKali (Jul 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thehighernest* 
I also really really love Kate Quinn Organics (but they can be expensive unless a good sale is going on).

When she does have a sale, it's great. I bought a shirt and a velvet corduroy jacket from there on clearance a couple of years ago. The jacket was too big so ds should be able to wear it soon. The shirt is dressy and he adores it.


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## AndrewsMother (Jul 30, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Alathia* 
The problem I see with rigidly gendered clothing is that girls can get away with wearing "boy" things and just be called tom boyish. But trying to find some nice purple or pink boy things is awfully, awfully hard. DS1 loves pink - loves, loves, LOVES it but we can only find pink boy shirts in the dress department, and not in just plain t shirts. I end up thrifting to find pink shirts and then doing some crafting on them to make them more "him" than just a boy wearing a girl shirt.


We love DS in his pink and purple Ralph Lauren Polos. To add additional colors we layer them with long sleeve t-shirts in contrasting colors.

If you don't want to pay full price, Marshall's and Steinmart carry them for about $11.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thehighernest* 
I'd third Basic Brilliance. I also really really love Kate Quinn Organics (but they can be expensive unless a good sale is going on).

Oh, and also Baby Soy! And Under the Nile.

I actually buy a lot of stuff at Carters - mostly short and long sleeve plain white Onesies and cotton pants in all colors.

My thing is also that I want my 9 month old in _comfortable_ clothing. I hate all that dressy stuff often found at places like Gymboree, etc. i.e. shirts with collars or rough pants.

I don't know if you're familiar, but there's a discount website called The Mini Social and I've seen all three brands on sale there. You can get really good deals (I get a lot of cool toys on there too). The only downside to the site is that it takes forever to ship: most things I order from other websites come within a week, but it usually takes about a month before they even ship.

/Not affiliated with them in any way


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## Addy's Mom (Nov 20, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NYCVeg* 
The problem with rigidly gendered clothing, IMO, is that it enforces norms about who or what a child can be/like based on their gender. There are many girls who like butterflies and ballet, of course, but the way the clothing is marketed and designed makes it seem as though 1) girls are supposed to like those things, 2) boys are not and 3) any child who doesn't conform to those expectations is somehow "wrong." So I would say the problem isn't that clothing with trucks on it is marketed to boys but that the same clothing is NOT marketed, EVER, to girls. The worst to me is the clothing that is plastered with stereotype-enforcing slogans: pink toddler shirts that say things like "Diva" or "Future Shopper" and so on.

It's the same with toys: I don't know a toddler boy out there who doesn't like to push around a doll or stuffed animal in a toy baby stroller, but most of the strollers are pink (designating that they're for "girls") and located in the "girls'" section of the toy store.

My dd wears dresses, but she also wears dinosaur pajamas. She wears pink and purple, but also red and navy blue and green (which I often have to buy in the boys' department...sigh). If she decides that pink is her favorite color and the only thing she wants to wear, that's fine with me. But I don't want her ever to feel that pink is a color she HAS to like and wear simply because she's a girl, or that there are certain colors/styles/toys/hobbies that are off-limits to her because she's a girl.

I do appreciate yours and others' explanations. I was raised in the early 70s with parents who were brutally rigid about gender roles, down to toy, clothing, and chore assignment, as well as preaching that education for girls is pointless and a waste of money. Kids today have so many more choices in life, I just never thought their clothing or even toys were really an issue. Or maybe it's just my personality. If I wanted to play basketball, I did, parents be damned. I was fighting with teachers in first grade who told me I could only be a stewardess (which is what they were called back then) not a pilot. If my son wants a play kitchen, I get it for him. No biggie. It never crossed my mind there was any controversy with that today.


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## atlantafemme (Aug 4, 2007)

http://www.alternativeapparel.com/Collections/Babies/

A friend of ours works for Alternative Apparel and gave us a bunch of onesies, including a pink one







, when DS was born. They are super soft and comfy!


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## NYCVeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Addy's Mom* 
I do appreciate yours and others' explanations. I was raised in the early 70s with parents who were brutally rigid about gender roles, down to toy, clothing, and chore assignment, as well as preaching that education for girls is pointless and a waste of money. Kids today have so many more choices in life, I just never thought their clothing or even toys were really an issue. Or maybe it's just my personality. If I wanted to play basketball, I did, parents be damned. I was fighting with teachers in first grade who told me I could only be a stewardess (which is what they were called back then) not a pilot. If my son wants a play kitchen, I get it for him. No biggie. It never crossed my mind there was any controversy with that today.

Oh, I assure you that these issues are very much still around. In talking to friends and lots of random strangers at the park and at dd's school I've heard amazing stories: a dad who actively tried to sabotage his son's love of a toy kitchen because they thought it was effeminate; a mom of two boys lamenting that she would never get to buy a toy kitchen because she had boys; a dad who allowed his son to have a doll, but took away the pink clothes the doll came with, threw them out, and replaced them blue overalls; a dad who would only let his son--grudgingly--have a toy stroller if it was blue and not pink (despite the fact that the boy wanted a pink one); and countless parents who didn't get their child the toy/shirt/whatever they wanted because "that's for boys/girls" and the child was the other sex. And I've lived only in very liberal, urban places.

There are many people like you, for whom this stuff is not an issue. But I don't buy the idea that children aren't affected--subtly or more overtly--by the cultural messages with which they're bombarded every day. This stuff pervades not just clothes and toys but television, movies, advertisements, books, you name it.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Addy's Mom* 
I do appreciate yours and others' explanations. I was raised in the early 70s with parents who were brutally rigid about gender roles, down to toy, clothing, and chore assignment, as well as preaching that education for girls is pointless and a waste of money. Kids today have so many more choices in life, I just never thought their clothing or even toys were really an issue. Or maybe it's just my personality. If I wanted to play basketball, I did, parents be damned. I was fighting with teachers in first grade who told me I could only be a stewardess (which is what they were called back then) not a pilot. If my son wants a play kitchen, I get it for him. No biggie. It never crossed my mind there was any controversy with that today.

I don't think these issues have gone away at all. I think in some ways they've gotten worse. Surveys have shown that over the past 30 years, popular views about the differences between women and men have actually gotten more pronounced over the past few decades, not less. And I definitely think that the difference between boy and girl toys and clothes have gotten more pronounced since I was a kid. Sure there have always been boy toys and girl toys, but there's also always been a whole range of gender-neutral toys too. The difference is that nowadays you can only buy them either with pink butterflies or blue dinosaurs on them.


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## Alathia (Nov 18, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AndrewsMother* 
We love DS in his pink and purple Ralph Lauren Polos. To add additional colors we layer them with long sleeve t-shirts in contrasting colors.

If you don't want to pay full price, Marshall's and Steinmart carry them for about $11.

unfortunately my kids have really big heads. like, off the charts big. it's either stretchy necks (like basic ts), or total button downs. Polos or rugby shirts get caught on their heads and everyone is sweating and unhappy. I love the look of little polo shirts, but alas, not for my guys!


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

i really don't care that much about gender stareotyping. i have three really girly girls and liked dressing them up all girly but for reals, must everything have a flower or lady bug or kitten on it!!!! I mean I don't mind haveing a floral outfit, a shirt with kittens, and a ladybug dress but for crying out loud, does it need to fill her whole closet? must everything have pink in the mix?

I can imagine that same frustration arises with boys. when I worked in a childrens clothing store everything, on either side of the isle, was exactly the same and the same as everything else every where else and you get to the 12 month size and hit a wall of footballs and dinosaurs. (which by the way ios perfectly average for a baby your sons age. when people asked about sizes we recommended they buy something in twice their age. so the average six month old wears a 12 month size) Come to think of it I worked in that clothing store 11 years ago and it was the same dang themes!!

So my recomendations are gap (they have layette for bigger babies!! Thier sizes run much bigger than say, gerber or carters). and old navy. patagonia has some cute stuff up into bigger sizes. Target often has some basics. walmart and kmart both have a line of inexpensive basics. but you are still looking at pants and shirts. I guess my kids pretty much lived in gap overalls until they potty trained. Those things lasted forever and fit through like three sizes. and fit over cloth diapers. I could girly them up with cute shoes and tops. we could go completely gender neutral if we wanted to. (I was much more gender neutral with my first than I was my last. After Ava I gave up on ever needing to pass down to a son....) . Carters often has some basics too and they sometimes have fun with colors. for jeans I like levis because they were pretty gender neutral. Places like Kohls and mervyns are hit and miss. but their one peice infant stuff is going to be the same old motifs you have seen already and have seen for years. i had luck finding stuff at pennys and sears but it was still hit or miss. www.miniboden.com sometimes has some great stuff. They look pretty picked clean right now....it doesn't look like they have released their spring line yet though.


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## leila1213 (Sep 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Alathia* 
For little boys, we love Zutano. I love their prints and stripes and the fact that they are rarely emblazoned with trucks/sports/etc.. Here's my youngest wearing a great orange/green combination.


Gorgeous!--the child, the outfit, the photo--all of it!


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## meco (Mar 1, 2004)

Another great place for non-traditional stereotypes is H&M. I love their clothes because you can always find something there.

I also find checking out discount stores like TJ Maxx, Ross, Marshall's, Loehmann's, Filene's, Century 21, etc are always great place to find clothes for both boys and girls that meets these criteria. You can find more random and less mainstream children's clothing brands.


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## Alathia (Nov 18, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leila1213* 
Gorgeous!--the child, the outfit, the photo--all of it!

aww thanks!


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## AndrewsMother (Jul 30, 2007)

So, I was in Wal-Mart tonight, and and I stumbled across this. There are other outfits in the collection that are equally cute, but I was too lazy to take pictures. My favorite outfit is navy blue and white striped with a frog and a fly, which I would put on either a girl or a boy.

The yellow dresses that are partially visible in the picture are great for a girl without the use of the color pink.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...x/IMG00548.jpg


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## wildmonkeys (Oct 4, 2004)

I have three boys and I do understand (as I am sure I would with three girls!) My 2 year old wears plenty of hand me downs from my friends dds (turtle necks and whatnot) but as my boys have gotten older, I have found it even tougher. My oldest plays the trumpet and fences - why is it almost impossible to find a shirt without a guitar or a sport with a ball???

Anyway, I really like Crazy Eight and Pumpkin Patch. The clothes are still essentially divided by gender but the colors and themes seem less rigid.


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## rubidoux (Aug 22, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ObliviousAnnette* 
I guess I don't see what the big deal is about what is on his clothes unless he is very aware of it. My daughter is almost 2 and the only thing wardrobe-wise she cares about is having "pretties" in her hair because mommy does.
If he can't read yet what his shirt says only effects those around him not him or his perception of gender.

I think it's a very big deal, actually. And I've always felt the same as the OP. And my older son, who's now six never wore tractors, trucks, sports, etc until he was old enough to tell me what he liked. It turns out he does like most of that stuff, but I was not going to push him into it just because he was a boy. And I am completely astounded by the fact that so many women (and let's face it, it is the moms 99% of the time, and you can see the way these little boys are dressed that they aren't going to be dressing their babies either) dress their little boys in such a gendered fashion.

Just tonight I was reading on another forum that a woman made a sleep sack for her NEWBORN son and she was stressing that it wasn't at all girly. What could the freaking harm have been if it had been girly????? Omg, drives me crazy.

Ok, so I guess I'm saying I completely get you, OP. I made all of my first ds's clothes from about 1 yr until he was five when I got pregnant and had no energy. Now I'm struggling to keep my new little one in mostly solids. I compromise with themes that I've deemed gender neutral -- ie, space, animals. It bothers me that the rest of the world sees those as "boy" things, but sometimes I've just gotta ignore the rest of the world. He's got a ton of pink and flower dipes that make me smile.


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## lach (Apr 17, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ObliviousAnnette* 
I guess I don't see what the big deal is about what is on his clothes unless he is very aware of it. My daughter is almost 2 and the only thing wardrobe-wise she cares about is having "pretties" in her hair because mommy does.
If he can't read yet what his shirt says only effects those around him not him or his perception of gender.

Then again, maybe I really don't understand the issue.

In addition to what other people have said, a big issue for me is the external reinforcement of strict gender roles based on children's clothes. I see it all the time: when my daughter wears a dress, she gets compliments on how pretty she looks. The "girl"ier the dress, the more effusive the compliments. Kids are savvy: they pick up on social cues like no one's business. That's how they learn to navigate the world. When the fifth stranger says "Oh, who's the little _princess_!? Don't you look _pretty_! I just _love_ your dress!", it becomes pretty obvious to her "okay when I wear my red overalls no one pays attention to me. When I wear my pink dress, people praise me." And so the lesson she takes from this is that the pink dress is the right choice. And boys get similar treatment when they wear very boy-specific clothes.

And of course the adults don't think anything of it, so it's not like I'm accusing well-meaning adults of turning my daughter into a delicate female buttercup. Really they just do it to make conversation: lots of adults like cute kids, and like complimenting cute kids, and an outfit is an easy thing to compliment, and a culturally gender-appropriate outfit is a safe thing for them to compliment. (Or so they think, because they haven't read the same books I have!) But the fact is that this sort of thing does reinforce very strict gender definitions at a time when children are looking to define their place in the world.

Now, my problem is that I _like_ pretty dresses. I derive great joy in sewing them, and in buying them. I've always been very girly in how I dress: I was a teenager in the mid-90's, and as all my friends wore flannel, I was probably the only customer under the age of 20 that Laura Ashley had had in a decade. So I have to say that I'm guilty when it comes to dressing my daughter, at least, in traditionally very feminine clothing. (I do draw the line at anything that reeks of entitlement, superiority, or attitude). I am, however, cognizant of the message this sends her and I try to mitigate it in other ways (and it's not like she dresses like that every day. I love her red overalls!). I also try to compliment little kids on their clothes if they're not wearing something super gender-specific.


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
. The "girl"ier the dress, the more effusive the compliments.

But, sometimes it really IS the dress. I love those dresses. I would say something to a woman who was wearing a pretty dress too. Maybe not "And, who's a pretty princess todaaaay???" But, I'd say "I love that dress".

I told a man who was wearing an orange plaid shirt the other day that I loved that shirt. His wife hit him in the shoulder and said "SEE?!?!" (apparently, he doesn't like it LOL)


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## akat (Jun 30, 2009)

I never had much trouble finding tons of cute stuff for my son - Gymboree [I have a ton of that hedgehog stuff and am just washing it for the new baby due in a couple of weeks so excited to get to have another baby wear it soooooo cute], Target, Old Navy, Baby Gap, the used baby shops.

But now my son's a very tall 5 yo moving into the Boys section - oh my lord. There's absolutely nothing in the Target Boys section that doesn't have a spider or a skull on it. Blech. I mean, one cute skater shirt with a skull is fine, but every day? And what is up with the only kind of socks you can buy for a boy are white footies? Seriously, every boy in America wears nothing but white footies every single day? [I did finally figure out there are still colored ankle length ones at Children's Place, but still!]

In terms of gender stereotyping, my son was born with tons of hair, and we kept it long, and put him in relatively gender-neutral clothes. When people called him a girl [often] they would apologize profusely and be totally embarrassed if corrected - everyone was like that! It was shocking. I never was the slightest bit phased by the initial assumption - who can really tell a baby's gender without the genitals, and what's the big deal? A lot of people are very very rigid about gender.


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## InMediasRes (May 18, 2009)

I love Old Navy as well. Lots of solids and stripes. I also find great stuff for DD there in her very best color - navy blue. Everyone tells me what a cute little boy I have, especially when she's wearing navy top, navy pants, and her brother's grey half zip sweater. It's my favorite outfit of hers. I would put my son in purple if I could find it. He loves it, and I think it would look great on him.

There was a study I read once about compliments from strangers about young children's clothing. They found that boys were more often complimented on character when dressed to the nines in "boy"ish clothes, ie. "Don't you look like a little man!", "You look so grown up!", "Look how handsome you are!", and girls were more often complimented on their clothing, ie. "What a pretty dress!". I found that interesting.

I also don't like that girl's clothes are unnecessarily restrictive. For an active young girl, tight pants, short skirts, tights, and uncomfortable shoes might discourage them from active play, which I find unfortunate.


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## JollyGG (Oct 1, 2008)

I really noticed in when I went through hand me downs. My oldest is a boy and my second is a girl. Early on I had tons of his clothes that worked just fine for her as well. The older they both get the fewer hand-me-downs my daughter gets from my son. Now she does occasionally wear something that used to be his, but not that often.


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## lightforest (Nov 11, 2005)

I'm also pretty shocked by how gender-specific children's clothing seems to be.

I thought that I'd share one more clothing company for folks to check out - they're called hessnatur. Most of their items are neutral. Their kids' section isn't even divided into boys and girls! They are spendy, but I noticed a lot of cute stuff for kids in the sale section of the site. They also sometimes have storewide 25% off sales.

I'd be really interested in knowing whether anyone has ordered from them before. I never have myself, but am considering getting a few things for my own babe-on-the-way.


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## not now (Mar 12, 2007)

I'm going to second (third?) Wal Mart and their Geranimals line. Tons of basics for no more than $3.50.


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## Polliwog (Oct 29, 2006)

My 5 1/2-year-old son doesn't own a pair of white socks. We've gotten colored socks at TCP, Gymboree, Gap, and Old Navy.


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## Logan (May 17, 2009)

Organic cotton brands always seem to be gender neutral. They usually have all the same fabrics/colours in the same style. So the only ones which wouldnt suit would be a dress- unless you're cool with those too







Im in Australia so I cant recommend the US brands, but my favorite here for gender neutral would probably Nature Baby: www.naturebaby.co.nz They ship internationally (free I think for over $500) and their prices are less the NZ tax for international customers.

But yeah good luck with Target and such. Everything has to be either flowers and butterflies and always pink, or macho male themes. I havent found anything from those shops that doesnt have a teddy bear or some 'cutesie' image plastered on it. But all the organic companies Ive seen seem to have very interchangeable pieces. Plus they are better for your babies skin too so that's an added bonus


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## ollyoxenfree (Jun 11, 2009)

I agree with looking at the organic, eco stuff as a good place to find gender neutral clothes.

Just thought I'd add that it's Spring Craft Show season. I always found lots of great kids clothes made by really talented artisans at craft shows. They tended to be less gender specific or at least offered quite a few gender neutral pieces, because with small, time-limited shows the artists want few limitations on what they sell.


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## *bejeweled* (Jul 16, 2003)

We







Hanna Anderson.


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## honeyhaze (Oct 31, 2008)

I recommend finding your local consignment sales and shopping in both sections. I've been able to find lots of excellent gender neutral clothing for my son using that method, plus it's waaaay less expensive.

H&M also has decent gender-neutral clothing for kids.


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## honeyhaze (Oct 31, 2008)

You know what kills me with girls clothing these days is all the garish "rose pink." Pale pink I can deal with, but these medium-pink shades usually strike me as cheap and 80's looking. Every children's clothing sale I go to is an endless wash of pink pink pink pink. I can still find the green and purple and orange and yellow gems amidst all that pink, but at first glance it seems impossible. And don't even get me started on jersey knit.

Zutano makes cool, fun clothes that either boys or girls can wear. Lots of colors other than pink or blue, lots of patterns other than trucks or flowers.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

I saw an ad on craigslist - someone NEEDED to trade their blue bumbo for a pink one because they were having a girl this time around.


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## mbm (Jun 14, 2006)

That is funny. I'm sure I screwed up my daughter's psyche by making her sit in a green Bumbo.

Pink clothes I can deal with. DD looks nice in pink. Pink TOYS, on the other hand, drive me batty.


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## NYCVeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hoopin' Mama* 
I saw an ad on craigslist - someone NEEDED to trade their blue bumbo for a pink one because they were having a girl this time around.

That's one of the most depressing things I've ever heard.


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## gabeycakesmama (Dec 5, 2008)

Oh, I hate hate how hard it is to find tasteful, plain clothing for kids that's made in the USA. We do a LOT of American Apparel T's and I make the majority of his bottoms myself out of wool yarn or purchase them from US WAHMs.


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hoopin' Mama* 
I saw an ad on craigslist - someone NEEDED to trade their blue bumbo for a pink one because they were having a girl this time around.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *mbm* 
That is funny. I'm sure I screwed up my daughter's psyche by making her sit in a green Bumbo.

Pink clothes I can deal with. DD looks nice in pink. Pink TOYS, on the other hand, drive me batty.











OMG. That Craig's List ad makes me roll my eyes. Seriously? I can't stand the pink and blue allegiances when having a girl or a boy. I love the color blue, but I purposely did not buy anything that was blue or pink. I went neutral all the way.

I also don't buy anything sports related, too girly girl, adult slogans, attitude slogans, nothing commercial, and if it's something overtly genderized that we get as a gift, I donate it.

I'm also not subjecting my child to characters on clothing, but now that my child is growing older and requests things, I do buy character clothing and toys my child specifically asks for. I think that is OK. I would prefer not to but I want my child to have fun during childhood, too, and if it's something directly asked for, I think it's important to honor choice, as long as it's something safe and not-offensive.

(I'm also a no violent toys/toy gun person, and those just get thrown away and not donated because I just don't think a kid ever needs a toy gun).


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## That Is Nice (Jul 27, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *honeyhaze* 
You know what kills me with girls clothing these days is all the garish "rose pink." Pale pink I can deal with, but these medium-pink shades usually strike me as cheap and 80's looking. Every children's clothing sale I go to is an endless wash of pink pink pink pink. I can still find the green and purple and orange and yellow gems amidst all that pink, but at first glance it seems impossible. And don't even get me started on jersey knit.

Zutano makes cool, fun clothes that either boys or girls can wear. Lots of colors other than pink or blue, lots of patterns other than trucks or flowers.

I know what you mean. The hot pinks are everywhere now. They sort of give me a headache. I was just looking at clothes yesterday and the colors are just too bold and too overstated in the girls' section. Maybe it's the spring season colors. I don't notice it as much during fall/winter.

My child is really getting into things like Barbie, and My Little Pony, and we went to look for some things and it was all this over the top loud, bright hot pink and sparkles, sequins, and applied scents...on the toys! Crazy.


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## RoundAbout (Aug 3, 2006)

I haven't read all of the responses, but I have to say that I put my 3 yo DS in Hawaiian shirts a lot (and have since he was a baby) and he gets a ton of compliments. I love the fact that I can put him in something colorful and flowery and fun and still be masculine.


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## MacKinnon (Jun 15, 2004)

We've bought alot of our clothes from the "cheap" shelves at Target/Kohl's, they usually have like 4 or 5 pairs of shorts/pants/leggings and then 4 or 5 shirts that all coordinate in their store brands, folded on shelves. I've found a fair amount of that stuff to be more likely to just be solid colored, patterned, etc. They are blue/green/red for boys, pink/purple/light blue for girls, but I don't mind that, it's the "Cutie" written across the butt, and the "All Stars" on the front that I try to avoid. I like too that they all coordinate, so I'll get three tops and three bottoms that all go together (bigger problem with girls stuff). Now that my DC are older, my DS really does LOVE trucks, so we get those things too. But yeah, it can be hard and gets worse as they get bigger!!


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## minkleaf (Nov 7, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lach* 
The difference is that nowadays you can only buy them either with pink butterflies or blue dinosaurs on them.

Just tonight my 3 year old DD was wearing her favorite pajamas with the dinosaurs on them and commented on how the pteranodons were all green and she wanted pink ones. Her favorite dinosaurs are scary t-rexes. but I never see them in pink. Only on the boy aisle in green and blue. She's noticed that too. The only girl clothes dinos seem to be cutesy, not scary, if one can even find them.


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## noobmom (Jan 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rubidoux* 
And I am completely astounded by the fact that so many women (and let's face it, it is the moms 99% of the time, and you can see the way these little boys are dressed that they aren't going to be dressing their babies either) dress their little boys in such a gendered fashion.

I personally would prefer to put my kids in gender neutral clothing as much as possible. But, I got a lot of hand-me-downs. Most of the clothes weren't things I would have picked out myself, but guess what? I used them anyway because they were free and in good condition. So, not every mom is trying to dress their boys or girls in "such a gendered fashion". A lot of the nicer clothes are expensive (i.e. Hanna, Zutano, etc.). Sorry, this post just rubbed me the wrong way.


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## mommy amber (Mar 29, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MJB* 
American Apparel's baby and kid clothes are almost all unisex. They run small though so order up a size (my 4yo wears a 6, my 6 yo wears an 8). Their t-shirts are very soft and are more fitted/flattering than most kids' t-shirts.

we love american apparel too...precisely b/c I can get plain colored clothing for my girl and boy...


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## dogretro (Jun 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Hoopin' Mama* 
I saw an ad on craigslist - someone NEEDED to trade their blue bumbo for a pink one because they were having a girl this time around.

Maybe they were just tired of all the blue. I know when I went to get dd's new car seat a couple of months ago, I bought the pink & brown one b/c she is a girl & we are having another girl. When it comes to baby equipment such as bouncy chairs & toys, sometimes I get tired of always "having" to buy the neutral/boy item. I purposely bought dfd2 pink toys b/c I bought dd a bunch of gender-neutral colored ones b/c we didn't know her sex & I also wanted them to share w/ our other kids. I see having a second girl this time as a perfect excuse to explode w/ pink & frills & sparkles if I want to.

DD's clothes are mostly pretty girlie &, nope, I don't mind. I shouldn't, I picked them out. She has plenty of things that are not pink or have pictures on them, but every piece says "girl" either b/c of ruffles or the cut. I am always able to find v feminine outfits that are not always "girl" colors from the regular outlet stores like Old Navy, Carter's, Children's Place, and Osh Kosh. DD has an outfit in her closet right now that is from Carter's that is a thin, puffy tank top that is white background w/ large orange & brown dots on it that goes w/ brown shorts. The CUT is girlie, but not the colors (traditionally). She does not have many shirts that are covered in flowers & ponies & things. Not hard to find at all. I do get her lots of girl clothes that are not pink b/c I don't want to look at it all the time, but her clothes are still from the girl's section & look like girl clothes. My mother generously pays for all of dd's clothes & there is no way that I am interested in asking her to buy expensive organic clothing for my kid(s). I'm not paying twice the price just to avoid a dang flower. DH and I also both hate pastel clothing for baby boys w/ a passion. We just cannot stand it & won't put it on future sons. GN soft greens & yellows are okay, but that's it.


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