# The Case for Teaching Kids 'Vagina,' 'Penis,' and 'Vulva'



## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

This article says that it is important that kids learn the real words for body parts, both so they are aware and can tell people about sexual abuse, and so they can tell parents and doctors specifically about health issues.

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/04/the-case-for-teaching-kids-vagina-penis-and-vulva/274969/

Quote:


> Yet while cases like these make headlines, educators increasingly believe--and parents seem increasingly to accept--that teaching and using plain and accurate language to describe the human body can help children live healthier lives. "We need all adults to be partners in teaching healthy childhood sexual development," says NSVRC's Palumbo, and "square one is body parts." Educators and parents should communicate accurately, without stigma or shame, she says. This helps children who "have important health questions or an experience they're concerned about talk with adults about their concerns," whether the child is seven or seventeen. Parents are children's most important teachers, it's true, but, as educators like Palumbo notes, not every one of the 55 million children who goes to school in America each day comes home to a CDC-ideal "safe, stable, and nurturing environment." One study indicates 34 percent of child sexual abuse offenders are family members. Meanwhile, one in ten students reports being sexually victimized by school employees, predominantly teachers and coaches.


Do you think it's important to teach kids the accurate words for body parts?


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## Lazurii (Apr 1, 2011)

I think it's vital. I would think that a child that knows the proper terms for their bodies would discourage a sexual predator. It's also important for children of all age to feel comfortable telling adults "no" when it comes to their bodies. That means don't force your kids to give unwanted hugs or kisses to family, stop tickling when they tell you to stop, and teach them to care for their own bodies at an early age.

My kids know the names of their "parts", even so far as "foreskin," "testes," "scrotum," "glans," "urethra," "clitoris," and "labia." This has been very helpful with medical issues as my kids can point out exactly what's bothering them, rather than saying, "My pee-pee hurts."


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Absolutely essential that your kid knows the names of his/her body parts.

And use them right, darn it!







Stop telling little girls the vagina is the outside part.... the outside part is the vulva or labia. No one sees your vagina except your midwife or lover.


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## purplerose (Dec 27, 2010)

Yes, very important. While we have nicknames for some parts(piggies for toes, for example), the kids all learned the correct names along with them.


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## anj_rn (Oct 1, 2009)

Absolutely essential that they learn the correct words. I was a pedi ER nurse for years, and in cases where medical staff is trying to find out the extent of sexual molestation, knowing accurate terms is key. You would be surprised how many school age girls do not know anything about their own genitalia.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

Of course. Whats wrong with knowing the truth?


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## walkinbluesmama (Mar 2, 2010)

Absolutely. Here's a horrible story for you that I heard from a sexual assault/abuse advocate....

A little girl went up to her headstart teacher and said "Johnny (not real name) keeps touching my cookie!"

Teacher says, "Sometimes we have to share our cookie, honey."

Cookie was the name her family had given her vulva. It took awhile for the teachers to discover what was going on (and yes, 'Johnny' was inappropriately touching her vulva).


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## tekcez (Jun 2, 2011)

Agree with philomom about not using "vagina" to refer to the vulva. My brother laughed at me for teaching ds that his sister has a vulva. Yes, she has a vagina, too, but that's not what he was pointing at when she was having her diaper changed. If you are going to use accurate terms...then use the correct ones.

Also I was so proud of him when he hurt himself and was able to tell me, "My testicles owie!" Not quite 2 years old, but can accurately express that he wracked himself.


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## sunshinelove (Jan 19, 2013)

I know that a lot of people are against only teaching the word vagina, but i feel like when girls are little it works just fine. I dont see the value in having her distinguish between vulva and vagina at a young age, it will probably confuse her and that doesnt help any. If she comes to me and tells me her vagina hurts i'm smart enough to figure out if its a UTI, infection, rash, etc. If she tells me that someone has been touching her vagina then it really doesnt matter if it was internal or external, both are just as bad. I think distinguishing the different parts like urethra, clitoris, labia, vulva, etc becomes relevant as preteens and teens, which the parents can teach and schools typically do as well. I also cant take the word "vulva" seriously, it sounds too much like volvo. Maybe thats childish of me, but it has never been a part of my normal vocabularly and thats never been an issue for me.

As for little boys, the same principle applies: when they're little its good for them to know penis and possibly testicles as well, but they dont need to know more than that until around the start of puberty.

For both sexes, i definitely feel its a disservice to give their parts dumb, cutesy names which has been the norm for many generations. Hoo-hoo, cookie, squishy, vajayjay, pee pee etc is not helpful and can be harmful, like that story a PP shared.


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## JelloPanda (Nov 26, 2010)

I agree - I've also read that it's "better" in court if a child can say "The person touched my vulva/penis" than "The person touched my flower/cookie!"

TOTALLY OT - Who seriously calls female genitalia a "cookie"? I would die. Every time someone asked me if I wanted a cookie, I would fall apart giggling. I mean, I'm an adult and I still can't handle the words "wiener" or "peep" in general conversation.


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## lanamommyphd07 (Feb 14, 2007)

Very different meanings when we look at a child's (often very natural) behavior, such as "I stuck the dinosaur in my butt", "I stuck the dinosaur in my anus" "I stuck the dinosaur in my vagina" or "I stuck the dinosaur in my vulva".

I can't get over the visual I get when someone (even grownups!) refer to a mysterious external vagina. I imagine this thing that resembles a waving tunnel, an unruly sort of thing always getting stuck in the panties. Wait....that's a penis.


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## sunshinelove (Jan 19, 2013)

I dont know, maybe i'm a dodo but i like the idea of using the word "vagina" as a reference to the entire female genitalia. The inner and outer are very much connected so why distinguish them (except for detailed circumstances like talking to your doctor)? Is it simply to sound proper? What i'm referring to is a lot like the term "yoni"--its referring to the entire female genitalia in a sacred way. My vagina includes all my female parts even if the dictionary says thats wrong.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sunshinelove*
> 
> I dont know, maybe i'm a dodo but i like the idea of using the word "vagina" as a reference to the entire female genitalia. The inner and outer are very much connected so why distinguish them (except for detailed circumstances like talking to your doctor)? Is it simply to sound proper? What i'm referring to is a lot like the term "yoni"--its referring to the entire female genitalia in a sacred way. My vagina includes all my female parts even if the dictionary says thats wrong.


I guess my viewpoint is that there is already a collective term for all the components of the female genitalia - vulva - so why use a different word? Especially one which has its own specific meaning. I appreciate that language is fluid and evolving, I just don't think that this is a particularly positive change.

And I feel quite strongly about teaching a child the name of something and then telling them 10-12 years later, actually that's not right. We wouldn't call the arm an elbow until puberty and then say actually, kids, your elbow is just the bendy, pointy bit, you also have fingers a hand, wrist, forearm, upper arm, shoulder and collectively it's your arm.

Sunshinelove, I don't mean to pick on you, I know lots of people share you point of view cthis is just something I happen to feel strongly about.


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## purplerose (Dec 27, 2010)

Some of these comments are cracking me up. Lanamommy-External vagina-wacky wavy inflatable arm man LOL

I do actually just call it a vagina when the kids are really little and in my care at all times. As they get older, they learn the real parts but it is no big deal. I totally agree with the pp talking about not just having the ONE talk...sex and the reproductive system is something that starts as toddlers. I have never had a one big talk. I mean...seeing cows mating in the field, there you go, don't tell them they are playing or wrestling, they are making baby cows. Totally not awkward, it's just what it is.

We ended up calling vagina "gina"(long vowel i) bc when we moved, my mom visited and I was showing her my box of China dishes, and my just-turned-5 year old thought I said "gina" as in "vagina" dishes LMAO. So now that's the nickname, but everyone but the 18 month old knows what is what.

Also, a speculum is called a "vagiculum".


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

I tend to agree with the 'not getting uptight' over vagina/vulva distinction. I grew up with 'vagina'. What about 'clitoris'? Its also visible...The fact is, female genitalia is more complicated that male, and therefore there are more parts to it. I dont need to go into every detail with my daughter (or son) Just a functioning word that is more or less accurate (as is vagina, even though it refers to the inside part rather than the outiside visible part) When you say 'penis' to a boy, he understands that thing he sees, that he pees with, that feels good when he touches, that must be kept private etc. But for a girl, you have to use so many different words, why not vagina? Vulva is also good and more accurate when describing the visible part, but not so much the part that she 'feels'.

Also, 'vulva' is an ugly word, 'vagina' sounds so much nicer.

However, having been alerted myself to the strict scientific differences between vag and vulv, i teach my kids the strictly correct words.(still dont like the word 'vulva')

My sister, 40yrs old, pregnant with her first child, and doing lots of research on childbirth, surprised me by her ignorance of the word 'perinium'. Do you tech your kids the word 'perinium'? I bet those who get uptight about the vulv/vag issue dont ....

(Shocking the story about the cookie)


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## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

I taught both the words "vulva" and "vagina." When my older one got a UTI at 4, and told me her vulva hurt, I had a better idea of what was going on. If she'd told me her vagina hurt, I would have had other questions. It felt helpful for me that she knew both words. Her doctor was actually surprised she knew the word "vulva." She thought it was great she knew how to accurately talk about what was happening, but she said it isn't common for kids to know that word.

I don't teach "perinium" and I'm not sure how likely my girls are going to need that word anytime soon. I guess I don't think because teaching every possible word seems overly complicated, that teaching those two is complicated.


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## JessicaStrubhar (Nov 2, 2012)

Definitely. We just called it our privates growing up (both boys and girls) and my husbands family had similar names, and I think it creates a "dirty" connotation. I think children feel like if we can't say the name of our body parts something must be wrong with it, or it isn't good. However, I haven't ever thought about getting so technical. I will definitely consider that.


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

Absolutely! Crucial - for self-esteem, health, protection, normalization of sex, so many things. It's a no-brainer to me (of course, I've never been one for any kind of cutesy baby talk with my kid







curious about the world? cool - a spade is a spade - that's what's up!).

I don't think that teaching girls the difference between "vulva" and "vagina" is any more complicated than telling a boy he has a "penis" AND "testicles."







Lord knows nobody combines the frank and beans!


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

My boys dont know the word 'testicles' yet, i mean, they never really asked...in any case, it is not the anatomical equivalent...


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## sunshinelove (Jan 19, 2013)

Katelove--But vulva isnt a collective word for all the parts of the female genitalia--thats just the part you can SEE. Thats actually a small percentage of the total parts.

I grew up using the word vagina as a collective term and i see nothing wrong with that. If people want to make that distinction they can but honestly i dont think it really matters other than for technical purposes. I thought more about this and i realized that a lot of little girls arent even aware of an inner vs an outer female gentalia, just the outer so giving it one name makes it less confusing. Once they are exploring themselves more and have more questions then it is more appropriate to give them the different terms.


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sunshinelove*
> 
> thought more about this and i realized that a lot of little girls arent even aware of an inner vs an outer female gentalia, just the outer so giving it one name makes it less confusing. Once they are exploring themselves more and have more questions then it is more appropriate to give them the different terms.


It's interesting how people can have such different experiences - one of my childhood friends had to be taken to the doctor for putting marbles up there! And my mother made sure to always tell us (proactively) not to put things in there, just like no crayons up the nose, no paper clips in the ears or what have you.


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## purplerose (Dec 27, 2010)

Oh my gosh...marbles!!


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## erigeron (Oct 29, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *contactmaya*
> 
> Also, 'vulva' is an ugly word, 'vagina' sounds so much nicer.


What a way to decide what word to use!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mamazee*
> 
> I don't teach "perinium" and I'm not sure how likely my girls are going to need that word anytime soon. I guess I don't think because teaching every possible word seems overly complicated, that teaching those two is complicated.


Totally seconded. I don't get why teaching two words, "vulva" and "vagina", is so complicated. If I had to use just one word I'd go with vulva. That's the external part that she is most likely to see and interact with, anyway. Girls aren't too likely to have much to do with their vaginas until puberty. Unless they are molested, in which case, like someone noted upthread, knowing one accurate word for the area is sufficient because nobody should be touching them on any part of the area anyway.

A friend of mine blogged about teaching her kids euphemisms for genitals. I asked her about it and she said that she has difficulty bringing herself to use the words herself, and she'd rather have a euphemism that she can say in a matter-of-fact way than use the real word and cringe and thereby convey to her kids that it's a cringe-worthy thing. I can sort of see an argument there, though I am assuming also that they taught the kids both the real names and the euphemisms.

I've heard the "Uncle Max touched my cookie" kind of story before (on the Internet, not anywhere in real life). The really horrid version was where the girl was telling her mom, who was presumably the one who taught her to call it a cookie in the first place!


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## mamazakka (Jun 10, 2008)

Hmm. My parents tell a story about friends of theirs who (in the mid-1960's) had taught their little girl to call her genitals her "box"...she was about 3 yrs old and the little girl's parents thought it was just hiLARious and kept finding ways to ask their daughter about her 'box' throughout the dinner party and then laughing uproariously at her befuddlement...

As a result my parents never socialized with those people again, and were thusly inspired to teach their daughters the correct terminology, yay.

Another story I have filed away is when I learned my college boyfriend's parents taught their daughter to call her genitals her "goodgirl". They also didn't explain menstruation when it was imminent and she was pretty sure she was dying, bleeding to death...

Yikes. Very glad I didn't end up married into that mess.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sunshinelove*
> 
> Katelove--But vulva isnt a collective word for all the parts of the female genitalia--thats just the part you can SEE. Thats actually a small percentage of the total parts.
> 
> ms.


Vulva is a collective term for the labia majora, labia minora, clitoris and vestibule. That covers pretty much everything. Yes there is more clitoris on the inside than the outside and the vagina isn't included but what else is missing?


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## sunshinelove (Jan 19, 2013)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katelove*
> 
> Vulva is a collective term for the labia majora, labia minora, clitoris and vestibule. That covers pretty much everything. Yes there is more clitoris on the inside than the outside and the vagina isn't included but what else is missing?


What about the uterus, cervix, fallopian tubes, and ovaries?


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## erigeron (Oct 29, 2010)

We're talking about parts that the kid can recognize and touch/point to. I mean, we don't typically teach them about the anatomical location of their pancreas, kidneys, gallbladder, spleen, etc. either at the same time we are teaching them hand, arm, chest, ear, eye, etc.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *contactmaya*
> 
> Also, 'vulva' is an ugly word, 'vagina' sounds so much nicer.
> 
> Enigeron- "What a way to decide what word to use


I think i said at least a couple of times that the correct terminology is desirable. therefore i use the correct terminology. Nonetheless, i dont get as uptight as others about the vulvl/vagina distinction because i grew up with 'vagina'. Also, vulva isnt a nice word, but who cares? Its the accuracy i aim for...anybody here say that they choose words to use based on what they sound like?

Having said that, personally, i feel my vagina more than my vulva, although i see my vulva. A boy feels his penis like a girl feels her vagina ( i guess) So what the girl feels is just as important as what she sees . Thats why the word 'vagina' is important, and maybe how it came to be used in the first place.



> Originally Posted by *katelove*
> 
> Vulva is a collective term for the labia majora, labia minora, clitoris and vestibule. That covers pretty much everything. Yes there is more clitoris on the inside than the outside and the vagina isn't included but what else is missing?
> 
> Thanks for clarifying.


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## Sara Galvan (Jan 25, 2013)

As a mother who has practiced accurate body part naming my children's entire life I can see the emotional benefits in my children vs their peers. My children are much more secure and mature with their bodies then their same age group friends. My MIL was horrified that I asked her to use the word penis rather than the slang "birdie". She even went as far as to ask me NOT to teach her 4 yr old THAT word. I asked her why? We call his nose a nose and his elbow an elbow? She only had an emotional response. After all theses years she has accepted that terms like penis and vulva and yes even breast and vagina are used in our house when needed.

Sara CD and CBE

Labor Affirmation:

My cervix opens outward and allows my baby to ease down.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sunshinelove*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


Those are the internal reproductive organs not genitalia.

Genitalia = external reproductive organs


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## sunshinelove (Jan 19, 2013)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katelove*
> 
> Those are the internal reproductive organs not genitalia.
> 
> Genitalia = external reproductive organs


I learned it as "internal genitalia" vs "external gentalia" (look in any medical or anatomy textbook). If we're going to be so particular about teaching kids body parts then its important not to dismiss the internal genitalia. What if your daughter has pain her ovaries? If you only teach her about the vulva then she wont have any clue whats going on. Also, its important to explain the internal genitalia before she starts menstruating so she doesnt become traumatized.

Anyway, i still think using "vagina" as a collective word is good enough when they're really little since there is a lot to learn when it comes to both internal and external genitalia. I learned "vagina" as a collective term and its used as such in general language so there is nothing harmful about it, imo. If you're going to be exact then dont leave anything out.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sunshinelove*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


Maybe this is a regional thing? I have looked in many anatomy etc textbooks, being a midwife and an emergency nurse








and I've never seen the term internal genitalia used.

And I totally agree with you that we shouldn't ignore the internal reproductive organs. Im sorry if i gave that impression. My oldest daughter is not quite three so we haven't done a lot of internal anatomy yet but I taught her that her baby sister grew in my uterus. As she gets older and asks more questions then I will teach her the other organs. And not just reproductive either.


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

I feel like euphemism have the additional downside of giving your kids the impression of "this is not a topic we can discuss frankly; do not talk about it." When I was abused as a kid, I knew I should tell my mom... but I just couldn't. I'd mentally freeze up. She didn't find out until thirteen years later, when she straight up asked me about it because the man had been accused by others.


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## erigeron (Oct 29, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *contactmaya*
> 
> Having said that, personally, i feel my vagina more than my vulva, although i see my vulva. A boy feels his penis like a girl feels her vagina ( i guess) So what the girl feels is just as important as what she sees . Thats why the word 'vagina' is important, and maybe how it came to be used in the first place.


Interesting. As an adult I'd say I feel both, but I think it was different when I was a little girl. I'm not sure if you mean "feel" in the sense of "touch" or in the sense of "be internally aware of", but I'd still say the same for either usage. I wasn't really conscious or connected to my vagina until puberty and beyond. I knew it was there but more in the way that I know my pancreas is there.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

I mean 'internally aware of'. You raise a good point, i cant really remember what i felt as a child. Possibly, when naked, i would 'feel' as in 'be aware of with an internal feeling', both the vagina and vulva, but not feel the vulva so much if dressed, which i am most of the time....

actually, i would have to say that even then , most likely i had more awareness of 'vagina'....

I wonder if knowing the words gives us the more of a physical awareness?


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## mamazakka (Jun 10, 2008)

'Birdie'?! Really? Wow. Never heard that one before.


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## tittipeitto (Jan 23, 2011)

So I see that so far everyone agrees, use the right words, not words that make it feel like vagina/vulva or penis are something to be embarrassed about.

Can this discussion now evolve to, WHAT we teach about them. If we say vagina must be kept private, and don't let our kids see us naked, aren't we still sending the same message?

I come from Europe, and there my kids run around naked all the time, here I hear people talk how their 3 year old is STILL not aware of what is appropriate, and opens the door to guests in his underware. ...!!! I mean, aren't you sending the same damn message, that your private parts are bad even at age 3 and even if they are covered, just not covered in enough layers.

I live in the states, so I have to balance this, and keep my kids clothed at the beach and when guests arrive, but I try to make it about "do you want to wear something cute when guests arrive" instead of "go cover yourself up, we have guests coming!" I'm practically paranoid about making my kids feel in any way that there's something inherently bad about little penises. And still they have learned how it is here, and they will cover their underwear-covered penises around their friends the same summer they just spent naked in europe.

We have a common nick name in my country for vulva, that is cute and normal, and everyone knows it, and while we learn vagina or vulva in a natural way along the years, we continue to use them as medical words only, not in normal conversation. So I think that a little deviation from vagina is ok, as long as it's commonly used, not a word like cookie!

As to what kids feel, their vulva or vagina, I have lots of memories running around naked, and how you want to put on underwear when things are poking you in your vulva, or the visual memories are of vulva. I had no idea about vagina until later, but I do remember, how swinging in the swing we would scream, "I feel it in my vulva" but only as an adult I know it was not in vulva, it was the inside, vagina. but did that really matter to me as a child, that I didn't know I was talking about the outside even though I felt it in the inside. No. What mattered that we were free to scream out loud I feel it in my vulva, and not have to pretend I felt it in my belly, which is not correct!

Someone touched the subject of also talking about sex to your kids as a continual learning curve, not having "the one talk". And I so agree! I think this is guidline from my country, maybe even here, to tell your kids the absolute truth about how babies are made, but ONLY answer their question, no need to go further. So in my world this has meant that babies grow in mommy's belly, until the 3 year old asks "does it pop out of your belly button" then they need to learn it comes out of vagina. When my kids asked how does it get there, I say that you need daddys sperm and mommy's eggs to make a baby. and my then 6 year old didn't ask how daddy's sperm got there, and according to this rule you shouldn't tell more than they want to know. So that's where our conversation ended, and he will probably ask more soon, or eventually. At that point I don't know what I'll say, if it's soon, something vague like we make love, love is great  or if his older, get him a illustrated book... My kids also know about periods, because we are weird and we dont close the door when we go to the bathroom. I had to tell my potty training two year old: "no, mommy doesn't have a diaper because she pees on herself, she gets blood once a moth, not all the time just somethimes." then seven year old wants to know why i bleed, and I'm not going to leave him wondering about mommy's scary condition, so I tell him that womens bodies are pretty much ready to make babies every month, and if you don't get pregnant, you bleed for a few days and then the body gets ready for a new one. And his reply was: "Yeah, don't make a new baby, we already know how THAT is, then you don't have time to play any games"

A good base for one day understanding that if you don't prevent it somehow, she will get pregnant 

I also struggle telling kids things like, no-one should touch you around your swimwear line... then a slap in the booty from a friend is sexual abuse that they should feel bad about? I so wish I didn't have to, but I have said that no adult is allowed to touch your penis, and you have to tell mom about it, even if they would say don't tell. But more important is probably to be open about these things and remember to keep their trust, so when they come with any other bad secrets, you shouldn't freak out so bad that they never tell you another secret...


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## purplerose (Dec 27, 2010)

tittipeitto-I am in total agreement with all you have said here! I have also struggled with the culture of covering ourselves without feeling like their body is bad. My 10 year old will change clothes right in the living room in front of the huge window for all the neighbors to see and I have to stop it.

I remember once my little kids playing in the sprinklers at my inlaw's, and I had no changes of clothes(it was a last-minute idea) so I just let my 18 month old play nude...everyone acted like it was very weird!


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## SheSpeeds (Dec 7, 2006)

I am all for my children knowing their anatomical parts and names for areas less spoken in our culture. However! Dirty connotations comes from the tone and intent of the person using them more so than word choice. Language, both for private and non-private subjects, needs to take into account maturity of the child. "Did you know there are many names and nicknames for your body parts!" is a great segue to learning additional names when the child is interested. What if giving your young child the anatomical names for their body parts and requiring them to use the names appropriately lead them to believe that their anatomy is complex, boring, and a bit scary.

Think of other examples where we use nicknames to simplify language for the early years. ..."Boo boos" are more specifically lacerations, x degree burns, abrasions. And calling it "green lollipop soup" makes split pea way more tasty!


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

> Originally Posted by *tittipeitto*
> 
> Can this discussion now evolve to, WHAT we teach about them. If we say vagina must be kept private, and don't let our kids see us naked, aren't we still sending the same message?
> 
> I come from Europe, and there my kids run around naked all the time, here I hear people talk how their 3 year old is STILL not aware of what is appropriate, and opens the door to guests in his underware. ...!!! I mean, aren't you sending the same damn message, that your private parts are bad even at age 3 and even if they are covered, just not covered in enough layers.


I see the answering the door as a matter of drawing boundaries between public and private. That can be taught without making a child shameful. My 3yo used to answer the door naked...i didnt think it was a big deal.

as for letting the children see us naked, that depends on the family, In our family we are naked or scantily dressed, and that is what my children are used to. I cant imagine having to worry about my own child seeing me naked when i step out of the shower, not to mention, there goes the possibility of having showers together...


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *purplerose*
> 
> I remember once my little kids playing in the sprinklers at my inlaw's, and I had no changes of clothes(it was a last-minute idea) so I just let my 18 month old play nude...everyone acted like it was very weird!


They are weird if you ask me. I have done the same.


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## Escaping (Nov 13, 2012)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *contactmaya*
> 
> I tend to agree with the 'not getting uptight' over vagina/vulva distinction. I grew up with 'vagina'. What about 'clitoris'? Its also visible...The fact is, female genitalia is more complicated that male, and therefore there are more parts to it. I dont need to go into every detail with my daughter (or son) Just a functioning word that is more or less accurate (as is vagina, even though it refers to the inside part rather than the outiside visible part) When you say 'penis' to a boy, he understands that thing he sees, that he pees with, that feels good when he touches, that must be kept private etc. But for a girl, you have to use so many different words, why not vagina? Vulva is also good and more accurate when describing the visible part, but not so much the part that she 'feels'.
> 
> ...


I agree! 'vulva', 'vagina', 'scrotum' just sound ugly to me... I don't even like to use them in a sentence, not because of what they're describing, just because of the sound that they make... I also think the words 'pregnant', 'placenta', 'uvula', etc just sound gross... I can still remember in grade school, kids freaking eachother out saying "your uvula is showing!" so it can't just be me...

I think it's important for kids to know proper words for things, but outside of that conversation, you can't make me use them!


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Escaping*
> 
> I agree! 'vulva', 'vagina', 'scrotum' just sound ugly to me... I don't even like to use them in a sentence, not because of what they're describing, just because of the sound that they make... I also think the words 'pregnant', 'placenta', 'uvula', etc just sound gross... I can still remember in grade school, kids freaking eachother out saying "your uvula is showing!" so it can't just be me...
> 
> I think it's important for kids to know proper words for things, but outside of that conversation, you can't make me use them!


See, I'm in the minority here. I think vulva and labia sound fine and used them with my children of both genders. Vagina as an all encompassing word is so WRONG. It's like saying you are wearing your innards on the outside. It gives me squicky vibes when I hear folks using the wrong language for private parts.


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## erigeron (Oct 29, 2010)

I think "scrotum" is a hilarious word, personally.


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## Escaping (Nov 13, 2012)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *erigeron*
> 
> I think "scrotum" is a hilarious word, personally.


When I was a kid, our neighbours had a very hard to pronounce name similar to "scrotum". We just called them "the Scrotums" lol (not to their face of course).
I think 'testicles' sound kinda funny and 'ovaries' sound cute... lovely actually. They should switch 'ovary' with 'vagina' then I would have no problem referring to my vajayjay by its proper name.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

Agreed. I think the word 'ovary' is lovely. 'Scrotum', quite ugly. Vagina...well, i like Opera's suggestion 'VJJ'.


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

Interesting post (I would have never suspected semantics would be of interest on a "mommy" site)...but a couple of points...

Most of the folks have the correct spelling for the anatomical parts and most have them generally in the correct physical location, but to be factually correct, a vagina is not visible to the casual observer nor can it be viewed by its owner unless squatting over a mirror.

"Vulva" is the more inclusive, but still doesn't cover all her external parts, for example her mons veneris. Try the word "pudendum" (singular) or "pudenda" (plural, and more commonly used)...but be forewarned, many in the medical community wouldn't know, or even use, the word, finding it too imprecise.

But I like it..it covers everything, just as "cookie" does for the little girl in an earlier post.

"Pudenda"...say the word out loud a few times. ---and many of you found "scrotum" a screamer.


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## Lazurii (Apr 1, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gordius*
> 
> "Vulva" is the more inclusive, but still doesn't cover all her external parts, for example her mons veneris. Try the word *"pudendum"* (singular) or "pudenda" (plural, and more commonly used)...but be forewarned, many in the medical community wouldn't know, or even use, the word, finding it too imprecise.


After researching "pudendum" I would never use it. Here it is from Wikipedia:

Quote:


> For example, the term _pudendum_, which denotes the external genitalia, literally means "*shameful thing*".


Yeah.... no thanks.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

I actually read the pudenda word for the first time in Wild, a book by Cheryl Strayed. I was shocked that first, she used a word I didn't know... I'm a huge word nerd.. and then upset that she choose such a word over vulva or labia or the general term "mound".


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## Escaping (Nov 13, 2012)

Blech.... "mound" and "pedendum" (even before I knew the definition) sound icky too... This is why I could never read those romantic "ladies" novels... every time I'd get to one of these words I'd get itchy.


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## contactmaya (Feb 21, 2006)

You would be amazed at how the intellect continues to function, even after pushing a baby through the vagina.... ( i believe i got that right )

Someone once said they preferred to use the term 'birth canal'. Not sure why.

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Gordius*
> 
> Interesting post *(I would have never suspected semantics would be of interest on a "mommy" site).*..but a couple of points...


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## ISISandOSIRIS (Jun 20, 2011)

This thread makes me think of "frank and beans" from _There's Something About Mary_.

A pp said that kids aren't taught inaccurate terms for other body parts, but that's not really true. Many kids are taught "tummy" to refer to the entire abdominal area. "My tummy (or even stomach) hurts" is often vague and could refer to stomach, intestines, or even appendix. We use other vague terms. "Mouth" may refer to lips, tongue, gums, etc. There's nothing wrong with not being super exact terminology sticklers all the time, but an educated child would be able to narrow it down when specifically asked.

I plan to teach my son the terms "testicles" and "penis" and will certainly make sure he knows their meanings, but realistically, I'm sure I'll also say peener, balls, etc. because, well, I just like the word peener . No different than saying noggin, piggies, kisser, paws, or any other pet name we have for our bodies. As long as he knows the real terms, I don't find anything wrong with it.

Besides "sex talks" that do use the correct terms, I also plan to explicitly teach my son about right and wrong touch from a very early age and onward. Regular talks about sex organs in a developmentally appropriate manner is a priority for me. First step is identification of our body parts and knowing exactly what they're called - whether it's penis or lower intestine. Casually though, nicknames are okay.

I also don't believe that cookie story. That has urban legend written all over it. The point though, is that kids should learn when it's necessary to use proper terms, like around doctors and teachers. Totally get that.


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

My sister, who died at three...called it her "pocketbook"..."Cookie" doesn't seem that far fetched to me and being a daddy/grand-daddy (so you aren't confused as to where I am coming from), I sort of like it. "Out of the mouth of babes..." gk


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

I am not even going close to your word "itchy"...and I don't read "those romantic ladies novels" either. Thanks for the input. gk


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

Sorry, I didn't catch that "new mama" addendum at the bottom of your post...So what was it? An occasion for cigars or for donuts? gk


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

Hi word-nerd...never heard that assonant before. Thanks...I can use it. One of the courses I had in Pre-Med was "Greek and Latin Medical Derivations...Proud to say I aced it. I've got Strayed's "Wild'" in my corner heap of books, I going to...want to...read but tell me, did you enjoy It and, my goodness, where and how did she use "pudenda"? gk


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## Gordius (Sep 23, 2011)

OK, fair enough...but should you be interested, the word "pudendum" derives from the Latin gerund, pudere, to be ashamed. It is word from the very prudish Victorians. One would never use the word even obliquely in polite conversation. It would be too shameful to admit that such an area even existed on the female body. I didn't realize such squeamishness would still be extant in these Internet Times. gk


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## Cyllya (Jun 10, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ISISandOSIRIS*
> A pp said that kids aren't taught inaccurate terms for other body parts, but that's not really true. Many kids are taught "tummy" to refer to the entire abdominal area. "My tummy (or even stomach) hurts" is often vague and could refer to stomach, intestines, or even appendix.


Ugh, I'm definitely avoiding this with my kid. When I was a teenager, I had a conflict with a school nurse who didn't understand kid-speak medical terminology and refused to provide me medicine for my terrible "stomach" pain. (Although if you have abdominal pain, I don't know how you're supposed to pinpoint exactly which organ it is, so why the heck would a medical professional just assume that it was definitely whichever organ you guessed? This wasn't the only time this nurse was obnoxious, but....)


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