# My midwife advised nightweaning my 1yr old



## MamaHippo (Dec 4, 2004)

I went in for my annual gyn appointment with my midwife today and had a long conversation about my depression and fatigue and low libido and such, and at the end of it all she said, "I know you don't want to hear this, but I think its time for you to consider nightweaning, for your sake." I dont know what to think. I guess I am afraid that if i nightwean, Noah will stop nursing totally, which I am not ready for (and neither is he, i think). Noah wakes 4-5 times a night to nurse and has his whole life. I am exhausted but I figured he'd grow out of it eventually. When he is in bed with us (from about 3 am on), he nurses nonstop. Diane (my midwife) says that he wants to nurse cus its right there and advises no more cosleeping too. I dont know what to think. I really like her and she's been very nice. I am exhausted and worn out. What should I do?
Lisa


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## aisraeltax (Jul 2, 2005)

i dont know but interested in what others sAY.


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

Why is your midwife giving out parenting advice?


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## the_queen (Nov 3, 2005)

You said that you're not ready to give it up.... in my experience, when I was suffering with depression, if I did something that I really really didn't want to do, my depression deepened. You might get more sleep, but you'll be mourning what you've lost. I didn't want to stop breastfeeding, but felt a lot of pressure to do so. The stress surrounding feeding/pumping/nipple shields/supply lines etc etc, yeah that all went away - but 4 years later I still grieve because I "gave up" on our breastfeeding relationship.

Maybe you should see a Lactation Consultant instead of a midwife, and get some really good advice on how you can continue night nursing in a less stressful way.








sending good thoughts your way


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## cuttiebearmom (Oct 22, 2004)

If it counts I know some mamas who have GRADUALLY nightweaned in the 2nd year, co-slept, and still had the kids nursing well into toddler years (just during the day







)


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

I would not nightwean a 1 yr old.

-Angela


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

I wouldn't nightwean either unless I were desperate. I dunno if you are there or not. And unless I was certain nightweaning would fix what is going on for me. It strikes me that he is really young, and that there may be other reasons you are feeling the way you are. And other fixes.

If it's a make or break for your sanity, however, I would do it.


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## earthmama369 (Jul 29, 2005)

We've been dancing around the same issue, as I'm pregnant, exhausted, and dd's had a couple nights of marathon nonstop nursing (2am-6:30am) that have left me in tears by dawn and too tired to be the mama I want to be during the day.

There are some approaches to try before nightweaning, if you're interested. I can't say if we've had any success in any of them because I just did a lot of my reading today and we've only just started to look at the situation and decide what's best for us, but The Baby Book by Dr. and Martha Sears has a good, comprehensive section on sleeping patterns at 12-18 months and various gentle approaches to finding a good balance between baby's needs (and at this age, habits and desires) and the parents' need for sleep. I really liked that they didn't push any one way as "the one and only way," and they mention frequently the need to be flexible and find what works for you as a family.

We're starting on the theory that she's teething and coming up on some major developmental milestones, both of which often manifest in such long night nursing sessions like you described. So I'm trying to increase my physical contact with Q during the day, really tank up on nursing before she goes to sleep and try to get her to nurse fully every 3 hours or so during the day, and give her some Boiron's homeopathic teething liquid before bedtime.

We're also thinking that there might be something to the idea that a baby will often associate how they go to sleep the first time for the night with what they need to go to sleep after that, so instead of me nursing her down to sleep every single night, I nursed her in the rocking chair instead of the bed and dh is taking a turn walking her down to sleep. We're going to give that a shot for a couple weeks, alternating nights, and see if that helps.

There were a whole bunch of other suggestions there. I can't remember them all right now (tired!!), but I'd really recommend checking it out and seeing if anything resonates with you. Good luck, mama!!!


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

I WOULD nightwean a 1 yr. old, but not because somebody else thought I should. You have to believe in your heart that it is a choice that will make you happier than you are now.

FWIW, we stopped cosleeping way before nightweaning, and just spacing out the feedings (which happened without any crying or anything, my son just slept more deeply and woke less often) and reclaiming our marital bed helped
with both exhaustion and sex. To be honest, my libido didn't bounce back until I weaned, but that is highly variable among mamas and my was weaned early so I could have breast surgery. I have a dd du in May, and I plan to nurse two years even if it makes for a depressing sex life. But two years of exhaustion is more than I can live with.


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## phathui5 (Jan 8, 2002)

I'm curious as to your midwife's own parenting style and how that might be affecting the advice she's giving out. Now, if you were the one who felt that you needed to nightwean for your own health and it could be done in a loving way, I would totally support you, but not if it's not even something you want to do.


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## stephsmom (Jul 8, 2005)

I can't speak to the main issue but you should have your thyroid checked. Low thyroid can cause exhaustion and depression. People expect mothers of young children to be exhausted so sometimes things like thyroid aren't checked.

My baby broke my heart by weaning herself altogether before she was 9 months old. She preferred goat milk to me! I thought it was because I was working but my mom told me I did the same thing. My baby, now 13 1/2, was just an independent little bugger who didn't want to eat if she had to turn her back on the room. Still bugs me that I didn't get my planned nursing time in. However, she's allergy-free, and has never missed school due to illness.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Just had to pop in to say that babies don't wean themselves at 9 months.










sorry for your experience.

-Angela


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## Jenlaana (Oct 28, 2005)

Everyone's experience is different. Judging isn't going to help matters. What do YOU think you should do?

IF you don't feel in your heart that its what you need to do, then it shouldn't matter if its your midwife or anyone else that reccomends it. (even pediatricians and LC's are wrong sometimes...) If you do think that maybe it would help things, any possibility of putting a place for your babe to sleep in your room (like a crib or pack and play etc), but not in your bed and trying that? I'm having a really hard time with sexual intimacy with my husband because our baby is in the bed with us, but she's still young enough that I am working around it. (we have a cradle in our bedroom that she doesn't sleep in often, but she naps there when we want a little more privacy...if she's out of the room I'm too preoccupied with listening to her to relax)


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## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

first of all, i think your midwife was trying to help based on how you are doing. there is nothing wrong with this. it's up to you if you want to take her suggestion or not.

i have a friend who's wonderful and lovely DD was up 5-8 times per night to nurse. after a long time (i don't remember how long) she finally had to night wean her for her sanity and physical health. b. continued to nurse during the day until just recently.

she is a great mom and frankly i give her credit for being up as many times per night as she was for as long as she was.

AP does not mean children get what they need to the exclusion of the mother's needs. if the mother is drained and exhausted everyday, waht does she have to give her child? AP is about balancing the needs of children and parents and knowing what your limits as a parent are. and if that means night weaning at 1.5 years, then there is nothing wrong with that and i would support you in doing that. if you choose to not wean your son i would strongly suggest you get someone to watch him 2 hours during the day so you can nap and heal. or finding some other way of meeting your needs, so you can take better care of yourself.

being an AP mom does not equal being a martyr.







and i'm glad you have a midwife who cares enough about you to be honest with you, even if it's not a popular suggestion.


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## IncaMama (Jun 23, 2004)

follow your heart, mama. it also doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing. DS nightweaned when i lost my milk due to this pg...but he still nurses all the time during the day. do you think that your ds's night nursing is contributing to a lack of sleep and thus to depression? if so, maybe you could take a few nights to sleep somewhere else and let your DC cuddle with your DH...you could get a few more hours of sleep and maybe feel better? like i said, it doesn't have to be all or nothing. you don't have to make a big decision like this all in one big leap.

as with any other parenting choice, follow YOUR heart...nobody else's.


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## JamesMama (Jun 1, 2005)

((hugs)) mama, I'm just going to repeat what these wise mama's have said. If you don't want to nightwean your 1 y/o, don't do it. I can't imagine trying to night wean my DS (he's 10 months old, but even at 1 I don't think I could do it)








follow your heart.


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## earthmama369 (Jul 29, 2005)

Everyone's experience is different, but I thought I'd share our first night in case it helps. DH walked Q down to sleep, and it actually seemed to make a difference. She woke up to nurse for the first time an hour earlier than usual, but out of the six times total that she woke up and fussed for nursing, DH was able to get her back to sleep twice within a couple minutes, and once she only nursed for 30 seconds (just checking to make sure it was still there?). So our end pattern went from:

bed around 9:30-10pm with 20-45 min. nursing
nurse 2am, 20 min.
nurse 4am, 20 min.
nurse on and off, 5:30am-7:30am
up at 8am
(with a night of nonstop 2am-6:30am nursing every 2-3 night)

to:
nurse 15 min.
bed with DH, 10:30pm
nurse 1am, 15 min.
nurse 3:30am, 10 min.
nurse 6:30, 20 min.
up at 8am

We let her fuss a little more than usual when she woke to see if she'd go to sleep for DH (so, maybe a couple minutes instead of "instant b00b"), but she woke up her normal, happy, no-grudge-bearing self and I woke up feeling more rested than usual. I'm sure we'll have our ups and downs, but it seems like an encouraging start.

I hope some of the ideas in this thread help you and Noah find a good balance for yourselves!


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## NataliaMama (Dec 1, 2005)

Lisa,
My advice would be to try and slowly work down on the number of feedings per night. Sometimes babies get into the habit of waking up, and then continue to wake even if they are not hungry. I would try to start teaching him to fall asleep next to you without nursing. Show him that you are there and close and that he can just drift back to sleep without the help of the breast. Maybe make yourself take a nap during the day to help with your fatigue.

But most of all, do what feels right for you and him!


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## midwestmeg (Jul 10, 2005)

You are getting great replies!









You don't need to nightwean if you don't want to- but I do believe around one or so babies can just be nursing to get back to sleep (that's their sleep trigger) and can learn to relax and go back to sleep without the boob. That's just IMHO; every baby is different.

I got pretty worn out by a year or so, and my baby was waking more and more, not less, so we did something similar to earthmama, and it made all the difference. I spent half the night away from our bed, got my sanity back, dh learned that he could solve night problems (shhh, pat, pat, pat) and dd stretched out her sleep right away. Now, after about a week I felt a little lonely and came back, and since then dd has been sick, gotten molars, etc, so she did go through a nightwaking phase again BUT the key difference is that I was rested enough to handle it and I now know in the back of my brain that if I needed to rest somewhere else I could.

Reducing night nursings/nightweaning didn't cause early weaning for me! I worried about that, and during the day I make myself available and we still nurse a lot. Dd has just started really eating food, but still uses breastmilk as a bit part of her nutrition.

HTH..... Meg


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## tinuviel_k (Apr 29, 2004)

Everyone is different with how they react to little sleep. Here is my story:
We nightweaned at 15 months. I was desperate. Denali was waking every hour or 1 1/2 hours to nurse, and she would only sleep from 11pm to 7am. I was getting less than five hours of sleep a night, and she would also wake up mid-nap for nursing, so I couldn't catch up on sleep then, either. SOmehow I never mastered the trick of nursing while asleep, or being able to go right back to sleep after she was done. I loved co-sleeping and breastfeeding but I felt so horrible all day long.

I was so very tired. I cried every morning for almost an hour for ten months. I caught a cold nearly every month because my immune system was shot. I started getting grey hair all of a sudden. I was NOT in a good space with my health, all due to sleep deprivation. But I was scared to night wean, and I didn't want Denali to go hungry at night.

What finally convinced me was that Denali started get some serious tooth staining from night time feeding marathons, (Weak teeth run in the family") I decided it was either nightwean or deal with extensive dentistry and tooth decay later.

We took it nice and easy. I cut back on night time nursings gradually and worked on building alternative comfort techniques, like singing, rubbing, and telling stories. I did these things while nusing, and then gradually cut out the nursing. Within three weeks she was not nursing at night at all. She began immeadiatly to sleep through the night.

I felt 100% better. Within a wekk I had my energy back, and I'd stopped crying. I didn't get sick for about 8 months. And my head stopped producing new grey hairs.








Our breastfeeding relationship did not suffer in the least! We still co-sleep, and it is wonderful.
So here we are, 13 months later, and Denali still nurses as often as she can. She is 2 1/2, happy as a clam, sleeps through the night (8 hours),and I am SO GLAD I nightweaned when I did. I am glad I waited till she was 15 months: she ate solids very late, and I wanted to give her a good, solid food foundation before stopping the night nursing.

This is just my story. We are all different, and our babies are different. Do what you think is right for you and your baby. Whatever you decide, I hope you get more sleep soon!


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## MamaHippo (Dec 4, 2004)

Yes, I am getting some great advice. I am so glad I have this resource.

I am just totally worn out. I am grinding my teeth and losing my hair. I havent had a full 8, even 6, hours sleep since my second trimester. Its affecting my ability to cope.
Noah has never been a long-stretch sleeper. He goes to bed at 7:30, wakes at 10 to nurse, wakes at 1 to nurse, wakes at 3ish to nurse, and then around 4 comes back into our bed and nurses nonstop until we get up for the day around 7 am. He only naps once a day and doesn't nap without waking after about 40 minutes to nurse. I get between 3 and 5 hours of sleep a night, which isn't nearly enough. When he's in our bed all night he nurses all night and screams when i try to unlatch him and roll over. Dh has tried going in to comfort him at night, but that just makes DS scream even louder, because he knows daddy doesnt give milk. I don't think i can do the cold-turkey nightweaning, its not not going to work. I got through last night with nursing him down to sleep, then just rocking him when he woke, then nursing him when he woke at 6 am. Noah cried but he cried in-arms, not alone. it seemed to go okay.
We will see how tonight goes.
Thanks for the advice, ladies.

Lisa


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## jplain (Aug 17, 2003)

I agree with a lot of previous posters. I especially resonate with what NataliaMama has posted, especially about trying to teach a baby how to get back to sleep without sucking.

I tried nightweaning at a year, and it was very difficult. And it didn't stick. We continued to nurse at night for several more months. We eventually nightweaned around 18 months, and it was much easier then. DD was verbal enough to understand what was going on, and she was obviously more ready.

In no way has nightweaning impacted her daytime nursing. At 26 months she still nurses at least 4-5 times a day, and a lot more than that most days, despite the fact that my supply is down to almost nothing b/c I'm pregnant.

Hang in there!


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

"AP does not mean children get what they need to the exclusion of the mother's needs."








:

Nobody likes to be sleep-deprived. But I think it's hard for people who can abide with it to understand what it's like for those of us who can't, because we are getting sicker and sicker in body and spirit. My son was always a great sleeper for his age, and meeting his infant needs at night still drove me into a massive depression and temporarily destroyed my body's ability to heal. Breastmilk was best, and I sacrificed my own health to nurse him at night when he needed to take in calories 24/7. It was VERY clear when that changed (dramatic alteration in nursing pattern), and since he was already supplemented (breast surgery, supply issues, weight loss, long sad story but we're fine), I began to offer a bottle instead of the breast when he woke at night. That was a burden my husband could share, and it was a phase that didn't last long, since ds truly didn't need calories 24/7. I think he was a little over 12 months when he stopped waking at night.

If you are sick, you need to make a change. Maybe dh could offer ebm or any other fluid your ds is drinking a couple nights in a row? At the very least, ds' reaction to not seeing you at night and not getting the boob would give you more information about what he's seeking when he wakes at night.

Hugs to you, mama. Take care of the WHOLE family, eh?


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## Datura (Mar 18, 2005)

We didn't night wean, but we did night reduce. Basically, I offer other forms of comfort *first*, try my darnedest to get him down, then offer the breast if that's what he really wants. If I can hear his tummy growling, he gets boobie right off the bat. Otherwise, I cuddle him, rub his back or rock his body gently back and forth. He's down from a minimum of 4 wakeups a night to 1 or 2. I'm moderately sane again, too, yay!


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## MAMom (Mar 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cuttiebearmom*
If it counts I know some mamas who have GRADUALLY nightweaned in the 2nd year, co-slept, and still had the kids nursing well into toddler years (just during the day







)

This is us. DS is 2.5 and we began nightweaning at around 18 months. It was really hard at first, but I too was totally exhausted & needed more sleep at night.

As this poster mentioned, we did it very gradually. Talked a lot with DS about how nummies needed to sleep at night. DH helped a lot. We used the Dr. Jay Gordon night weaning "plan", but that info no longer seems to be on his site.

KellyMom also has some good night weaning info.

We offered DS a snack before bed (banana, oatmeal, etc.) and he still often eats right before bed (and occasionally in the middle of the night - DH has a high metabolism & DS does too!) He will often take a bottle of rice milk before bed and occasionally in the middle of the night (though less often now).

I am 7 months pregnant now, and DS is still nursing about 3 times per day (he would prefer more, but my body is screaming no...it is very painful for me). He still nurses a lot more, including at night, if he is not feeling well or having a rough day.

And I am a better and more sane mom during waking hours b/c I am getting enough sleep.


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## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

at 17 months, my partner started offering our son a sippy cup of goat milk at night when he woke up.

he still wanted to nurse, but this prevented the frequently waking to nurse for 90 seconds and falling back to sleep. his tummy was full and he started sleeping until 6 or 7 AM before wanting to nurse and at that point i had a full breast to offer my vacuum cleaner baby and we were all happy. maybe it wasn't the best solution, but it worked for us. (and yeah a snack before bed is good too)

he will still sometimes wake up and ask for milk. (at 40 months)


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## reillys_mom (Mar 5, 2005)

Thank you for all of the replies. I really needed them after last night I was in tears from another night of constant nursing. I know I am worn out since I've been sick (including mastitis), but I couldn't do it any more. DH took DS to try to put him back to sleep but eventually went back to nursing DS. All night he only "slept" while nursing. So, my question is how do you "reduce" night feedings? I read earthmama's suggestions. what are other things that can work?


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## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *reillys_mom*
All night he only "slept" while nursing. So, my question is how do you "reduce" night feedings? I read earthmama's suggestions. what are other things that can work?

is he teething? starting to walk? using words? all these things can make kids more clinggy at night. if he is teething hylands teething tablets before bed help or other homeopathic remedies.

here's what worked for us:

snack before bed
encourage lots of nursing during the day (kids at this age are really busy during the day and forget to nurse, then they feel the boob by them at night and CHOMP!)
sippy cup of milk at night (we weaned to goat milk)
mama sleeps elsewhere (this worked really well for me and ds and lp where happy with it)
all else fails; chamomile drops before bed or mama takes catnip an hour before nursing to promote baby sleeping.

GL!


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## spirit4ever (Nov 4, 2004)

Quote:

all else fails; chamomile drops before bed or mama takes catnip an hour before nursing to promote baby sleeping.
Ummmmmm....catnip?????????????? Could you elaborate on that please









I sometimes have a hard time putting myself in someone elses shoes, often b/c my son wakes 12-15 x's per night and have absolutely no advice to give. So I really had to go back and remember what it was like not to be able to sleep through the nursings, which was when I was pregnant and it was just too painfull. I then nightweaned, but my ds was 2, my baby is now almost 11 months and I cannot imagine how I would even go about nightweaning him (also cause he wakes up way to much!!!). You have to do what is best for you're health, and sanity. Maybe not totally nightwean but go down to one night nursing session in case he is really hungry, then try to let dh help.

From my own personal experience though nightweaning was much easier for my ds when he was closer to 2, which was when he was able to understand much better, before that every time I tried it was a lost cause. Oh and he nursed often during the day once he was nightweaned!!!


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## johub (Feb 19, 2005)

When my ds was 14 months old he was till nursign all night long. This was very hard on me because I was 8 months pregnant with twins.
Anyway, in preparation for the twins birth we moved him to a mattress on the floor next to my bed. I lay down next to him for him to go to sleep and I was always within arms reach. If he needed to nurse I planned on getting down on his bed. Within a few nights he was sleeping all night. He was still cosleeping in the sense that he was no further than an arms reach away and still in our room. But the smell of my milk was a little further from his face and he just stopped waking to nurse.
Not only did he not wean, he continued to nurse for another 16 months. And at 3 1/2 he still cosleeps.
It does not have to be an all or nothing thing.
It could be that the constant nighttime nursing is affecting your sleep, energy level and libido. Those are reasonable things for your midwife to advise you on, so I dont think this is a case of her advising you on your parenting but on your health, which is affected by the things you do with your body.
If you do suffer from the things you mentioned this could be worth trying. That doesnt mean committing to it. It just means you could try it and see how it works. And if it doesnt help or your ds has a problem with it, back off.
There is nothing overstepping for a midwife to advise a mom to take a little better care of herself.


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## Ahappymel (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cuttiebearmom*
If it counts I know some mamas who have GRADUALLY nightweaned in the 2nd year, co-slept, and still had the kids nursing well into toddler years (just during the day







)

Yup, this was me : )
I nightweaned my little boy in his 2nd year. It was pretty gradual. Now he is 4 yrs old. Nurses about 2 times a week and recently announced that he is a big boy and nursing is for babies : ) So I don't know how much longer this will last...I'm treating every nursing like it's the last


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## MamaHippo (Dec 4, 2004)

We had had some ok luck with only nursing DS once between 10 pm and 5 am the last couple nights, but last night he woke at 11, at 1 and at 3. I was able to rock him to sleep at 11, but the other times it was all milk or nothing. DH got angry at 3 and basically told me to keep my butt parked and not go in to him, cus all he wanted was milk. DH went in but DS refused to even let Dh hold him. He cried for 2 hours for milk, until i finally 'overrode' DH and went in, picked him out of DH's arms, and took him into our bed and nursed him. It took him an hour to calm down. Dh really thinks it needs to be a 'cold turkey' thing, but I dont think it will work. We are moving soon, too, so DS will be in a strange place. I think its pointless and futile to nightwean before a major life change, but DH doesnt agree. We are arguing incessantly about this.
I am exhausted and my health is suffering, but it was far more stressful and painful to have to lay there and listen to my son cry "Numms mama, Numms mama" for 2 hours.
Is it possible that he just isnt ready?
How much crying was involved in your (successful) nightweaning?

Lisa


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

Hmmmm. 2 hours seems like a lot. Maybe time for a night bottle of goats milk?

I tend to agree with your dh that you and the nummies need to be "asleep" in the middle of the night. Eventually, you really will be asleep.

I feel like you would not be doing this if you were not at the end of your rope. I'll bet your dh agrees. My dh said it was very scary to watch me get sicker and sicker from fractured sleep. I think the most important thing is for your dh to keep comforting, keep explaining, and not leave ds alone to cry. I am totally cribbing from Dr. Sears here.


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## Marsupialmom (Sep 28, 2003)

You do what you think is right.

Also it doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing. Can you cut back on how often he is nursing vs quit all together. Not being perminantly attached from 3 on could do you wonders or it could make you misserable









With my child that nursed until she was a little over 4 I did tell her my na-na's needed sleep. So she had to wait until morning but she was older than one.

I found when I needed to cut back on night nursing for what ever reason offering a little water helped. So can a humidifier, if your house has dry winter air.


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## crunchyconmomma (Feb 6, 2003)

i bet someone already posted this, but i was suffering from to little sleep and LOTS of nigtweaning and cried on my beloved, trusted, lactation consultants soulder and she reminded me that busy babies (what a 1 year old is, especially if you mention thinking he would wean altogther i think it's b/c he isn't taking the time to nurse in the day) come to "check in" at night. he loves sleeping next to the breast and yes, he is doing it because it's right there, so good for you for being there for him. pat yourself on the back and find ways (that, again, i am sure other mamas suggested) to take care of your issues. weaning and cribbing are lame ideas. shame on the MW for not at least trying to help you find other ideas first.


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## MamaHippo (Dec 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smithie*
Hmmmm. 2 hours seems like a lot. Maybe time for a night bottle of goats milk?


I tried the goats milk last night. I made him a bottle of it and gave it to him to try. He took 2 sips, made a terrible face and then refused to touch it again. guess he doesn't like goats milk.
Any more ideas? Rice milk maybe?


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## Kathryn (Oct 19, 2004)

I just can't see a baby my daughters age (6/18/04) being able to even understand what you're doing to them. If you're able to get him to sleep without nursing for the first two wakings, why not just nurse the third one? Eventually he won't need that one either.


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

Hmmm. My ds was actually HUNGRY when I finally introduced goat milk, due to all the one-boob-nursing after my surgery, so maybe he was not feeling picky. Did you warm the milk? I had to do that for about six months.

All kids are different. Rice milk is not harmful, as long as you remember that it's basically fortified water and make sure ds nurses enough during the day. Some kids like soy milk or almond milk. Heck, the world is full of kids who like formula. Pediasure is also appropriate for a child over one.

Or dh could handle the first two wakings, and you could nurse at the third. Sleeping through those first wakings would be important, though.


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## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaHippo*
I tried the goats milk last night. I made him a bottle of it and gave it to him to try. He took 2 sips, made a terrible face and then refused to touch it again. guess he doesn't like goats milk.
Any more ideas? Rice milk maybe?

you'll have to try it a few times. my son wouldn't drink it right away either. i actually mixed it with EBM a bunch of times, increasing the amount of milk until he drank it. if you are suddenly gonna give a sippy cup (or bottle, whihc i don't suggest becuse of the ear infection thing) i would start with EBM or a mixture of it and whatever milk you are gonna use.)

also, i think commmerical goat milk is kinda yucky. it's a bit sour for me. even though my son will drink it. we prefer the fresh stuff around here. (hurry up march come on!)

HTH!


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## midwestmeg (Jul 10, 2005)

Hmmmm... I agree with one of the previous posts that if you're getting ds to go back to sleep without nursing at least once or twice at night, then you're doing well. The only folks I know who get their kids to 'magically' sleep through the night all in one go are the ones who do CIO. Otherwise, it's a compromise. And if ds is learning how to go back to sleep sometimes without nursing, it's possibly fair to say that when he just can't you might as well nurse. You are making progress!

My dd had good nights, then not so good. It's the ole one step forward, two back thing. Try to look at the whole picture. My dd used to wake every two hours or so, or just when I'd finally gotten back to sleep. We nightweaned and for awhile she was doing the whole night. Now she nurses when I go to bed around 11 pm (sometimes I wake her, even) and then at 6 am. She was fully night weaned, but teeth, colds, life, you know. So this is our pattern now and I've realized through this process that being flexible is important.... but I couldn't be that optimistic now if I hadn't done something 'drastic' then. I was loosing it!

I only ever had, maybe, 5 minutes of fussing with my dh. I have had some fussing when I was back in bed w/dd... but not for very long. I learned that if she really winds up, then she's not going to back down and we just nurse. However, I try not to respond too quickly to give dd a chance to rearrange herself and fall back to sleep. Sometimes she will try forever to get herself back to sleep and can't, by then I'm awake so I figure 'just nurse and go back to sleep, darn it!'.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I skimmed everyone's posts, so hopefully this isn't too much of a repeat.

I used Dr Jay Gordon's nightweaning method while still cosleeping (google his name and get his websigte -- there are very explicit instructions there) with my DD1 at 17 months. I think that it is about as gentle as nightweaning can be if it is not DC's idea. I haven't read up on it in a long time, but as I recall, there was nothing about crying for 2 hours. If my babe was crying that long, I don't think that I would go through with withholding a feeding, at that time. Doesn't mean that I would give up completely.

I personally wouldn't try to introduce any bottle of anything (except maybe EBM, if I truly thought DC was hungry). Not trying to criticize anyone doing this. If your DS is really so hungry, than maybe work on just reducing feedings. Oh, and by the way, you get to decide what "nightweaning" means. It doesn't mean necessarily the whole time HE is sleeping, maybe only when you are sleeping, or something like that.

My acupuncturist advised me to wean completely for my health's sake. Needless to say, I did not take his advice (DD2 was 15 months old), but I do get the hormones, health, state of mind connection and the possible effects that bfing in general can have on the mother's health.

Nightweaning DD1 didn't seem to make any difference in her nightwaking, as in, she still did it. She did take a pacifier, so I don't know how that affected the nightweaning. She still at almost 4 wakes more than her 2 yr old sister. And DD2 pretty much nightweaned herself.







You just never do know.

Hopefully you can find a solution that helps you get back your health and that works for your family. It can be so tough when you feel like you have to chose one or the other, but hopefully you can find another angle.


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## Cutie Patootie (Feb 29, 2004)

Hugs to you mama.







I know exactly what you are going through. I never technically nightweaned my first, but I did start putting some limitations on nursing at night when he was around 12 months. I never denied him nursing when he woke, but I started mentally keeping a time limit. I would let him nurse for about 10 or 15 minutes, then I would unlatch him and say "all done"...hold him and rock him and do whatever it took to get him back to sleep. Gradually I cut it down to 5 minutes of nursing per wake up. So, I knew he never went hungry and he could still snuggle with me. He was very angry at first, but after about 3 or 4 days he caught on. It isn't that I didn't want to nurse him at night as often as he would wake up, it was that I couldn't keep him latched on for hours at a time and keep my sanity and health. Once he understood that he could nurse at night for food and not for comfort (we could snuggle and get comfort that way instead and still be with mama without nursing) he cut down on nursing at night on his own. After a couple of months...he nightweaned himself. Even now at 28.5 months I will nurse him if he wakes up and asks but only for about 5 minutes and then I say, "all done baby" and he unlatches and goes right to sleep. I never really did the "daddy take the baby thing" because I knew he didn't understand why I wasn't coming to him or why he couldn't have milk and...I would just lay there awake and listen to him cry with daddy. I also wanted him to be able to sleep with me and not want to nurse all night long, so I knew it had to be me who comforted him back to sleep. HTH


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## umami_mommy (May 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spirit4ever*
Ummmmmm....catnip?????????????? Could you elaborate on that please










did i forget to reply to this?

if mama takes a few capsules of catnip (any herb company sells it or you can dry it yourself) it's a nice calmative that shouldn't make mom too sleepy. but it comes through the breastmilk well and helps a fussy baby to sleep. it's an old folk remedy, not one you are likely at see at a LLL meeting. worked for us, but sometimes actually amde me a bit sleepy too, which was the last thing i needed. but lots of BF herbal mamas i knwo have used it.


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## Ahappymel (Nov 20, 2001)

I think that the night-nursing involves intimacy and comfort just as much as the actual nourishment of mother's milk.
Since it is an emotional need, that is why I tended toward gradual weaning.
Your little one definitely knows the difference between mom's warm nummies and a plastic bottle of goat's milk


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *honeybeedreams*
first of all, i think your midwife was trying to help based on how you are doing. there is nothing wrong with this. it's up to you if you want to take her suggestion or not.

AP does not mean children get what they need to the exclusion of the mother's needs. if the mother is drained and exhausted everyday, waht does she have to give her child? AP is about balancing the needs of children and parents and knowing what your limits as a parent are. and if that means night weaning at 1.5 years, then there is nothing wrong with that and i would support you in doing that. if you choose to not wean your son i would strongly suggest you get someone to watch him 2 hours during the day so you can nap and heal. or finding some other way of meeting your needs, so you can take better care of yourself.

being an AP mom does not equal being a martyr.







and i'm glad you have a midwife who cares enough about you to be honest with you, even if it's not a popular suggestion.









What she said.

Seriously, if you are losing your mind with the sleep deprivation (and I recognize that there are mamas out there who ARE able to function with it - and who therefore are perhaps not so qualified to comment on your situation), then you need to make a change.

Trust me, nightweaning your 1yo will not make him stop nursing. The 3yo I'm still nursing in the daytime certainly didn't get that message! I would give it a go. Have dh sleep with him for a week and see what happens. It may not work. We tried at about 14 months, and gave up, and then again at 16 months and it worked.

Getting a good night's sleep made a profound difference in my ability to parent during the daytime and in the quality of my interactions with my older child, who was also suffering due to my sleep-deprivation.


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## BrittanyD (Sep 23, 2005)

Looks like you've gotten tons of advice, but I just wanted to add that I'm working and co-sleeping and night nursing and I've found that I HAVE to go to bed really early in order to get enough sleep. Most nights, I fall asleep with my daughter, while she nurses at 7 or 8:00. This way, I'm in bed 10-12 hours and don't get exhausted from getting woken up for night nursing all night long. The nights that I nurse my daughter to sleep and then get up to do things and hang out with my hubby, I can definately feel it the next day!

Babies grow up really fast and these years of co-sleeping and night nursing will be over before you know it, so if you enjoy it, then enjoy it while you can!


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