# He's 9 years old, is 54" tall and weighs 54 lbs. Which carseat??



## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Our 9 year old pretzel stick boy needs a new carseat (I think). He's 54" tall and weighs 54 lbs.

The tops of his ears are above the back of his current carseat (an older Graco), which I think indicates the need for a change, am I correct?

We were looking at carseats today, and all of them state they are for a child with a maximum height of 52" (which is 3" shorter than he is now).

He can sit comfortably in the regular back seat of our Expedition with the seat belt at a proper fit, but I know he is too light for the law to allow this.

He likes his carseat and we've never had any issues with him regarding the use of them. He's a safety nut!

The boosters (the ones that are just the seat part with arm rests) look so, I don't know, flimsy. Not the word I'm looking for, but after his lifetime in the seats with sides and headrests, those booster seats just look unsafe! Are there any carseats that can hold a child over 52"???? Price is not a issue.

Okay, I just saw the Graco "Nautilus" at the staore. It says it is good for children up to 57". Is this a good carseat?

We are preparing to go on a long road trip for our vacation and we want him to be as safe as possible and comfortable, as well. He rides in the center seat position in our car (and will continue to do so until he is 27!).

Recommendations?? Help!


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Yes, he needs out of that seat ASAP. It's important to note, as well, that the seat is outgrown if the top harness slots are below his shoulders, even a little bit. And I'd bet if his head is that far above that he's outgrown the harness height as well.

The seats with the highest harness heights on the market would be the Nautilus or the Britax Regent. But you'd have to sit him in one to see if his fits. The height guides on seats are guides, it really depends on how long your child's torso is. If he's too tall for the harness on the regent, there is no harnessed seat he will fit in, and getting a good high back booster is your best bet. The Nautilus converts from a harnessed seat to a high back and low back booster, so I don't know if their height guide is for it in harnessed mode or booster mode.


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

He doesn't use the harness anymore (hasn't for quite awhile).

The shoulder and lap belts work perfectly for him. We wouldn't be using the harness if we get the Nautilus (he wouldn't find it comfortable).

I think we'll go ahead and buy it tomorrow, see how it fits ds and the car and go from there.

I do wish it had a tether attachment, however. I don't like that the seat belt is the only thing keeping it in place.







:

Thanks!


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## treqi (Dec 31, 2006)

I know you need a new seat now but the new Britax Frontier will be a forward facing harness/booster that can use LATCH when in booster mode(and it has a 60" height limit) if the $280 price tag isn't an issue or if you have other kids you could pass it down to it would be a great option for you..... and the Graco Turbo Booster is a high back booster that has a height limit of 57" which is what I would recommend for the mean while if you were to wait for the Frontiers release....


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

If you aren't planning to use the harness, really there is no reason to spend money on the Nautilus or the Britax Frontier. They're so expensive because it's a harnessing seat.

Dedicated boosters go above 52". Were you only looking at combination seats? Those often have a lower height limit (and often make pretty poor boosters)

Take him to the store and let him try out boosters till he finds one that's comfortable, then buy it


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## thepeach80 (Mar 16, 2004)

I haven't gotten to see it IRL, but I really like the look of the Britax Monarch.


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## Astoria (May 27, 2004)

I had read that if you are using a seat as a booster only, it is best to have a lightweight seat, because it actually is the seatbelt holding the child in and the only point of the booster is to make sure the seatbelt is positioned across the body properly. The heavier the seat, the less safe if case of an accident if it is only the seatbelt holding and not a harness system.

So having the high back is there for positioning the seatbelt across the chest better. If the child is tall enough that the seatbelt positions well on just a booster seat (meant to lift the child to make him taller for better positioning), wouldn't it be safer to not have the back? I'm really not sure what the answer is. It seems like the OP is hoping the back of the booster will provide some extra safety in a crash by providing head/neck protection. I'm not sure if this is true with a booster. (I know its important with a harness carseat.)


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## thepeach80 (Mar 16, 2004)

A highbacked booster is absolutely safer than a no back booster! Not only goes it offer side impact protection (especially in seats w/ special side impact protection like the Britax Monarch), it offers the head/neck support needed in vehicles w/ no headrests. There are guidelines that say a booster shouldn't weigh more than 9#, but it's not enforced and so far there's been no real life evidence that the weight of the booster is more dangerous than the benefits of having the back. If you're concerned, there are some boosters that are very lightweight, like the Recaro Vivo Lite.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

What thepeach said


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

The height of the Nautilus' headrest is just too high. We've decided to return it tomorrow and try the TurboBooster.

If that one is too high, as well, I'm not sure what we'll do. I guess we would need to use a backless booster, which doesn't sit well with any of us.









As I said, the Nautilus completely blocks the central view of the rear window in our Expedition, making it a hazard as far as driving safety. Unfortunately, we have to weigh the two safety issues and go with clear visibility as being more important. We refuse to move ds into one of the outboard positions, knowing the center back is safest. And, as he is an only child, that is where he will stay!

Dh is 6'5" and can see fairly well through the back window with the Nautilus in place. But, as the Expedition is my vehicle and I am just 5'2", what I can or cannot see takes precedence. With the Nautilus, I can't see safely. I refuse to rely only on my side mirrors for viewing behind me (which is what I'd need to do if we kept the Nautilus).

Ds would not be using the harness in any case, he's too tall as far as the openings for the shoulder straps, even in their highest position!

Thanks for answering my question about the anchoring. I still don't quite understand why boosters cannot be anchored and tethered, harnessed or not.

I mean, the regular seats in cars are fastened down tight. Adding a booster seat (of any style) adds something movable under a passenger. I see that as something that affects the safety of the passenger! Seems like the engineers need to work on that.... Just my opinion.

Thanks for your responses. I'll post again after we try the TurboBooster. Keep your fingers crossed!


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Wow, thanks to everyone responding!!

We all like the feeling of a highbacked booster for ds. We regularly drive on a stretch of a road notorious for its bad accidents (remember the accident that took the lives of those 5 children two years ago? We drove by after it happened). Any additional measures towards safety are biggies for us (though nothing could have saved those children, so bad was the damage).

The back seat of our Expedition does have headrests. So, though we could use a backless booster, the other style is more to our liking.

We have the LATCH system in our car with the additional seatbelt+clips to use (which has been great with his current Graco). His current carseat is attached to the backseat, both where the Expedition seatback joins the Expedition bottom seat and a rear tether over-&-behind the Expeditio back seat. His carseat doesn't move. At all. That sucker is solid. Can we use this same system with the Nautilus? Could it be installed under the seat pad (but, over the seat framing), thus holding the Nautilus firmly, in addition to using the regular seatbelt to hold ds firmly (as with his surrent Graco)? ((Does that question even make sense??!!))

Quote:

Take him to the store and let him try out boosters till he finds one that's comfortable, then buy it
We're off to the store to buy the Nautilus and see if it will work in our car. It is ds's overwhelming desire to have the highbacked booster.

The nearest place we could buy a Graco Turbo Booster or the Britax is 90 miles away. But, if the Nautilus doesn't "fit" our needs, we'll return it and go take a look at the others.

I'll report how things work when we get back.

Again, thank you so much. Keep the comments coming!!


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## Eris (Sep 11, 2002)

There are vanishingly few seats which you can use as booster while it is attached to the car with LATCH. I don't believe your Graco is one of those, and I know that the Nautilus is not.

I have been told that the Graco Airbooster is among the tallest high back boosters available; I believe it is taller than the Nautilus.


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

While you can top tether the CarGo (the seat you currently have) in booster mode, you cannot use the lower anchors, so you'll want to discontinue that if you continue to use it as a booster.


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Okay, we bought the Nautilus.

Ds likes how it feels.

BUT, we have a problem!! With the headrest in the highest position (which is where it fits ds best), the driver has ZERO central visibility through the rear window because it blocks the view!!

I'd not thought of this (as it hasn't been a problem before).

Oh, dear, now what?!

Hmmm, back to the drawing board...............

On another related subject: *why* can't the bottom anchors and rear tether be used with a booster seat??? We've been doing this with his other booster. The seat holds firm with no movement with the use of the bottom and rear attachments. Why is this not okay??? I always thought that there should be no movement in a carseat.

What is the logic of having a booster only held in place by the regular seatbelt?? What is the unsafe reasoning behind not using the anchors?

The Nautilus has the anchoring equipment (bottom and rear clips & belts).


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
On another related subject: *why* can't the bottom anchors and rear tether be used with a booster seat??? We've been doing this with his other booster. The seat holds firm with no movement with the use of the bottom and rear attachments. Why is this not okay??? I always thought that there should be no movement in a carseat.

What is the logic of having a booster only held in place by the regular seatbelt?? What is the unsafe reasoning behind not using the anchors?

The Nautilus has the anchoring equipment (bottom and rear clips & belts).

The Nautilus is a harnessed seat. It has those anchors set ups for when the seat is used with the harness. Do you have your son harnessed in it?

The short answer to your question is, one of two options. Either it was never tested that way, or it was tested that way, and failed the testing.

Traditionally boosters work differently than harnessed seats. Harnessed seats shouldn't move because the harness itself, which is secured to the seat, is what is retaining the child. In a booster, the SEAT BELT, which is attached to the vehicle, retains the child, and the booster moves with the child in ride down time in an impact.


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

_Okay, weird things going on at MDC!! So, I am re-posting my last message. Hopefully, it will not get lost amongst the other messages already posted on this thread! When I posted it yesterday, it appeared (on my computer, anyway) up in the middle. Weird, weird, weird.......... (On another MDC forum, a thread I started yesterday has not even appeared, though their was one reply!) Weird.............._

The height of the Nautilus' headrest is just too high. We've decided to return it tomorrow and try the TurboBooster.

If that one is too high, as well, I'm not sure what we'll do. I guess we would need to use a backless booster, which doesn't sit well with any of us.

As I said, the Nautilus completely blocks the central view of the rear window in our Expedition, making it a hazard as far as driving safety. Unfortunately, we have to weigh the two safety issues and go with clear visibility as being more important. We refuse to move ds into one of the outboard positions, knowing the center back is safest. And, as he is an only child, that is where he will stay!

Dh is 6'5" and can see fairly well through the back window with the Nautilus in place. But, as the Expedition is my vehicle and I am just 5'2", what I can or cannot see takes precedence. With the Nautilus I can't see safely (without the carseat, I can see just fine!). I refuse to rely only on my side mirrors for viewing behind me (which is what I'd need to do if we kept the Nautilus).

Ds would not be using the harness in any case, he's too tall as far as the openings for the shoulder straps, even in their highest position!

Thanks for answering my question about the anchoring. I still don't quite understand why boosters cannot be anchored and tethered, harnessed or not.

I mean, the regular seats in cars are fastened down tight. Adding a booster seat (of any style) adds something movable under a passenger. I see that as something that affects the safety of the passenger! Seems like the engineers need to work on that.... Just my opinion.

Thanks for your responses. I'll post again after we try the TurboBooster. Keep your fingers crossed!


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

There are a lot more options than the Turbobooster. Where are you shopping?


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

So techs, weigh in. Safer outboard with a hbb or in the middle with a lbb?


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Quote:

ThreeBeans There are a lot more options than the Turbobooster. Where are you shopping?
Well, right now, at Wal-Mart, as it is the closest store for us. The next closest is 90 miles away, in the city. The usual, popular stores are there and I am fine with searching there if folks have other carseat suggestions. We can drive down to the city next week to shop. However, I won't buy anything from Burlington Coat Factory (so keep that in mind







).

We used to have a Britax, which was wonderful. I had to order it on-line, at that time, as there were no Britax distributors within 200 miles of us. But, it was for ds when he was a mini-munchkin, and didn't have much to say about carseats!

I don't want to order a carseat via internet or catalogue. Ds needs to sit in it and we need to know it will work in our car.

Quote:

DahliaRW So techs, weigh in. Safer outboard with a hbb or in the middle with a lbb?
We will only go with a carseat in the middle. Outboard is not an option, as far as we are concerned.

Sigh...................

Again, thank you, so very much, for your suggestions, info and advice!


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

I think if you are loathe to put the seat to the side, you are not going to find a booster sized appropriately for your child that is NOT going to some degree obscure your vision.

In your shoes, I would put the booster on an outboard seat









Some boosters that I might consider for sheer comfort factor are the Graco Air Booster, as well as the Compass B510 (not the 505 or the 530)


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Quote:

Some boosters that I might consider for sheer comfort factor are the Graco Air Booster, as well as the Compass B510 (not the 505 or the 530)
Thanks, we'll look at those!!


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## wonderwahine (Apr 21, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ThreeBeans* 
I think if you are loathe to put the seat to the side, you are not going to find a booster sized appropriately for your child that is NOT going to some degree obscure your vision.

In your shoes, I would put the booster on an outboard seat









Some boosters that I might consider for sheer comfort factor are the Graco Air Booster, as well as the Compass B510 (not the 505 or the 530)

i agree, your child is 9, not 2, youare going to have to use the side seats eventually, and boosters will fit best in the side seats.


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## sainteanne1 (Apr 10, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ThreeBeans* 
Traditionally boosters work differently than harnessed seats. Harnessed seats shouldn't move because the harness itself, which is secured to the seat, is what is retaining the child. In a booster, the SEAT BELT, which is attached to the vehicle, retains the child, and the booster moves with the child in ride down time in an impact.


good explanation!

grahamsmom98

I would recommend you find a car seat inspection service near you and have them help you. A certified inspector will help you determine the best place for the seat and help you understand why a booster on the side is a safe and secure place for your 9 year old. www.car-seat.org will have answers.


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## thepeach80 (Mar 16, 2004)

I have to agree w/ ThreeBeans. I would rather see a child in a hbb on the side than a lbb in the middle. There was a study? recently showing in side impact crashes, the child on the side struck and in the middle received the most injuries and there was no difference in safety between the middle and being on the side that was struck. Plus a good hbb will offer GREAT side impact protection, a lbb will offere no protection at all.


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Thanks, everyone. The TurboBooster we just purchased fits fairly well (I can even see beyond it!). The seat belt connection is a bit tight (the rear part of the booster is wider than his previous carseat, but we can live with it.

Quote:

i agree, your child is 9, not 2, youare going to have to use the side seats eventually, and boosters will fit best in the side seats.
Actually, he will stay in that center position as long as is possible, with a carseat or without. There is no reason he needs to be in the outboard seats (unless, of course, he is driving







). He has a better view (no front seat obscuring his vision) and it is a safer position. This is both his choice and ours.

Interestingly, as we were moving these things around (my nails looked nice before we started messing with all this!), he sat in the middle seat (without a carseat), straight-up, butt against where the seat meets the back, and his feet are flat on the floor, knees comfortably bent. The shoulder & seat belt fits across his hips and across his chest, and the rear headrest is above his ears by a good 4".

According to Washington state law (one of the toughest in the nation), he doesn't even need to be in a booster! The law states a child can use the regular seat belts if they are at least 8 years old *OR* 4'9" tall. Ds is 9 1/2 years old and 4'6". Technically and legally, he can do without the booster.

However, we still think using the booster is the safest plan.

Again, THANK YOU everyone for all your help and answers! Your knowledge is greatly appreciate it!


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

By the way, Graco says that the Nautilus can use the LATCH system when using it as a booster with the lap/shoulder belt, in additon to using the harness.

Just an FYI, even though I didn't need to do this!


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## treqi (Dec 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
By the way, Graco says that the Nautilus can use the LATCH system when using it as a booster with the lap/shoulder belt, in additon to using the harness.

Just an FYI, even though I didn't need to do this!

I just read the manual and couldn't find that... where did you read that?


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## grahamsmom98 (May 15, 2002)

Quote:

treqi: I just read the manual and couldn't find that... where did you read that?

http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?p=408637


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
I still don't quite understand why boosters cannot be anchored and tethered, harnessed or not.

I mean, the regular seats in cars are fastened down tight. Adding a booster seat (of any style) adds something movable under a passenger. I see that as something that affects the safety of the passenger!

Well, yes, it is something that affects the safety of the passenger. But, what effect does it have? That's the question.

If the booster is tethered to the car, and your son is using the seatbelt, in an accident, he loses contact with the (tethered) booster, hits the seat belt, and lands back in the booster.

If the booster is untethered, in an accident, both your son *and* the booster respond to the crash forces together, are restrained by the seat belt, and land back in the car seat.

I can totally see how, depending on the seat construction, the second scenario could be substantially safer. The booster is a smaller target than the entire seat of the car... perhaps kids are more likely to land "wrong" on the seat if it's tethered. I'm not a transportation safety engineer, and can't tell you for usre about THAT seat and the tests that were run on it... but I'd be inclined to believe that either way might be safer, depending on how the seat is constructed, and the best way to determine that is to look at results of crash tests... so I'd accept the recommendation of people who have done just that.


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## Lisa85 (May 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 

We will only go with a carseat in the middle. Outboard is not an option, as far as we are concerned.

Sigh...................

Again, thank you, so very much, for your suggestions, info and advice!

Why is outboard not an option? I don't think you're going to find a hbb that doesn't obscure the view in the center position and that will accommodate your ds's height. If a hbb that fits your ds doesn't work in the center, and is safer on an outboard seat than a lbb in the center position, then why wouldn't you do it that way?


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## ThreeBeans (Dec 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grahamsmom98* 
By the way, Graco says that the Nautilus can use the LATCH system when using it as a booster with the lap/shoulder belt, in additon to using the harness.

Just an FYI, even though I didn't need to do this!

You might want to read again; perhaps you misread? But it definitely does not say that. I own one









ETA: Ah, I see Graco has updated their stance on that? Well, until the manual is reissued it still technically cannot be used like that







I'm glad to hear it though.


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