# Toddler/Preschool parents: Do you think this is true?



## noralou (Jul 19, 2007)

My sister (who seems to have read ALL the sleep method books







), tells me that a common theme is that only when the baby/child is able to go to sleep on his/her own to _start_ the night, STTN can evolve naturally.
My 26m DS has always nursed to sleep, and wakes up many many many times in the night (especially lately, as he is getting his last molars). I've been avoiding all sleep training methods, even the gentlest. I believe that he'll get there when he gets there, and that his innately active temperament is closely related to his sleep pattern. I guess my resolve is a little shaky today because I'm so exhausted from a particularly tough night, and I'm questioning my (lack of) method. Though I might initiate weaning sometime soon, we are no where near getting DS to fall asleep without at least snuggling.
It would be nice to hear from someone who nurses or cuddles their toddler to sleep but still gets to STTN after that.


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## Roxswood (Jun 29, 2006)

Since dd turned 3 she sleeps through the night sporadically although we're always there when she falls asleep. I sometimes nurse to sleep but if not then she's always cuddled to sleep (but lying down in bed so I don't need to move her once she's asleep).

I think its more about maturity and sleep cycles because we don't do anything very differently from a year ago and yet her sleep is so different.


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## tonia_jo (Aug 7, 2005)

When our DD was a little over 2 and 1/2 years old, she self-weaned and started to sleep through the night all by herself! She is now 3 and 1/2 and she is always cuddled to sleep (she still sleeps with DH and I in our king size bed). But, when she stopped nursing, she also stopped waking up during the night - they fell hand in hand for us!


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## LolaK (Jan 8, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noralou* 
My sister (who seems to have read ALL the sleep method books







), tells me that a common theme is that only when the baby/child is able to go to sleep on his/her own to _start_ the night, STTN can evolve naturally.

Does she mean they have to fall asleep alone in their room? I mean does it count if a parent is cuddling them or sitting in a chair next to the bed?


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## Shelsi (Apr 4, 2005)

Ok we've never co-slept but never done any sleep training either. Ds STTN since he was 9 weeks old. I would swaddle him and nurse him to sleep and he would sleep about 10-12 hrs. He's 3.5 now and still sleeps great.

Dd is 5 mos old. She's got some food allergy issues we're working on but she will sleep about 5-7 hrs. At one point, when she was about 2 mos old she was sleeping 10 hrs straight. She's no where even close to being able to put herself to sleep...heck, half the time I can't even get her to sleep lol, but once she is asleep she can stay asleep for quite a while.


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## Astoria (May 27, 2004)

Um, no. My kids never nursed to sleep, odd I know, but they didn't. They went to bed in the same room with me checking on them periodically, but they fell asleep "on their own" even when pretty little. And they woke up at night all the time. And, honestly, they still do. They are pretty great now at 4 and 6 at going to sleep on their own. I kiss them good night and close the door and they go to sleep. But the little one wakes up at least once, usually twice a night needing water and reassurance and the older one likes help walking to the bathroom most nights. So we're totally still getting up with them.


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## noralou (Jul 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LolaK* 
Does she mean they have to fall asleep alone in their room? I mean does it count if a parent is cuddling them or sitting in a chair next to the bed?

No, I think she is referring to "sleep associations" meaning, if they fall asleep with a parent in the room, OR nursing, OR cuddling, the child will wake up upset if the scenario has changed (e.g., nurse to sleep, then mom unlatches, and rolls over). The theory is, if they go to sleep on their own, they won't rely on external cues (parent's help) to fall back asleep when they partially wake up during normal sleep cycles.

Thanks for your replies, mamas. It helps to know some kids do go to sleep on their own, but still don't STTN, while others nurse to sleep but STTN anyway.


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## captainkitty (Apr 19, 2007)

Once asleep, my 3 1/3 year old can STTN, but getting her to sleep is a funny nightmare of trying to nurse her down in my lap while reading (stays awake these days), trying to cuddle her down (stays awake, wants to talk), telling her a story (wants another story), leaving the room & listening to her get down, play, get back in bed loudly announcing she is getting back in, get down again, etc. (this is going on as I type).

I always nursed to sleep until she was just less than 3. The association of lying down in a dark room in bed & nursing to sleep is still incredibly compelling for her. I just can't do that any more -- she needs an early bed time & I inevitably fall asleep & it screws up my entire life to lose every evening of every day that way.

But this is a long way around to say -- she started really STTN about 9 months ago & it did not have to do with divesting her of strong associations with nursing or whatever to sleep.

I think they are just all different and it works itself out, and on its way there, it is hair pulling out time for most of us who did not CIO to start out the child's life.

Good luck!!


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## treemom2 (Oct 1, 2003)

My DD nursed to sleep until she was 18 months. She has pretty much always slept through the night, except when sick or teething. After she weaned when she would wake up she would just grab my hair, twist it between her fingers, and fall asleep. When she was 4 she moved down to a futon next to our mattress. I still lay with her every night as she falls asleep, she still twists my hair, and then she goes to sleep. She usually sleeps through the night and if she wakes to use the potty or for some other reason she usually falls back asleep on her own. DS is now three. He was still nursing about every 2 hours all night when he was 22 months and he quit nursing through the night when he was around 26 months. He now breaks off when he is done nursing, rolls over and falls asleep. During the night he doesn't nurse anymore even when he wakes up (which is pretty rare), he just sings or talks himself back to sleep. He is still co-sleeping in our same bed though.


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## dillonandmarasmom (May 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *treemom2* 
My DD nursed to sleep until she was 18 months. She has pretty much always slept through the night, except when sick or teething. *After she weaned when she would wake up she would just grab my hair, twist it between her fingers, and fall asleep*. When she was 4 she moved down to a futon next to our mattress. I still lay with her every night as she falls asleep, she still twists my hair, and then she goes to sleep. She usually sleeps through the night and if she wakes to use the potty or for some other reason she usually falls back asleep on her own. DS is now three. He was still nursing about every 2 hours all night when he was 22 months and he quit nursing through the night when he was around 26 months. *He now breaks off when he is done nursing, rolls over and falls asleep.* During the night he doesn't nurse anymore even when he wakes up (which is pretty rare), he just sings or talks himself back to sleep. He is still co-sleeping in our same bed though.

These are my kids to the tee...except my DS is the elder of the two...and DD still wakes to nurse at night (especially since her molars started to break through).


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## cutekid (Aug 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *captainkitty* 
Once asleep, my 3 1/3 year old can STTN, but getting her to sleep is a funny nightmare of trying to nurse her down in my lap while reading (stays awake these days), trying to cuddle her down (stays awake, wants to talk), telling her a story (wants another story), leaving the room & listening to her get down, play, get back in bed loudly announcing she is getting back in, get down again, etc. (this is going on as I type).

I always nursed to sleep until she was just less than 3. The association of lying down in a dark room in bed & nursing to sleep is still incredibly compelling for her. I just can't do that any more -- she needs an early bed time & I inevitably fall asleep & it screws up my entire life to lose every evening of every day that way.

But this is a long way around to say -- she started really STTN about 9 months ago & it did not have to do with divesting her of strong associations with nursing or whatever to sleep.

I think they are just all different and it works itself out, and on its way there, it is hair pulling out time for most of us who did not CIO to start out the child's life.

Good luck!!


My DS was like that. He always nursed to sleep and suddenly it didn't work as well any more. These days he nurses on my lap and then we read a book. If he hasn't settled down he's allowed to play on the bed. I go to do other stuff while he "settles himself". When he is ready to go to sleep I will rub his back while he falls asleep. There have been a few times where he has called me into the room and before I could get there he was asleep. Other nights he's wired so much that it takes over an hour for him to settle down but our night time routine NO LONGER includes me falling asleep too.


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## mean_jeannie (Mar 3, 2007)

My ds is 20 mos and STTN. He only recently - like within the past week - started going to sleep on his own. I always rocked him to sleep, since he was an infant, and he would STTN after being rocked. He never nursed to sleep and he stopped waking for night feedings when he was 7 mos.

Otherwise, nightwaking for him occurred only if he was sick, or going through something developmentally.

So, I think your sister is reading a little too deeply into that "common theme." Or it just wasn't the case for us, I guess.


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## verde (Feb 11, 2007)

My 27 mos old DD doesn't nurse to sleep but she does want a binky. We cosleep and I or DH will lay down with her until she falls asleep and then we get up and go do stuff. Usually she STTN. Recently, when it has taken her a long time to fall asleep, I have tried something different and it's worked. I tell I need to go downstairs and ask her if she can fall asleep on her own. She says "OK." I give her a kiss and a hug and tuck her in and leave. She has then fallen asleep on her own. I feel lucky to have this option.


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## Momma Aimee (Jul 8, 2003)

so the ? is does a child HAVE to go to sleep ALONE to sttn ....

no

does not yet sttn, at least not every bight ... but all three DN are parented to sleep -- not nursed any more -- and then sttn .....

and my ds1 stopped nurseing TO sleep before he stopped night nurseing ....

rember -- be it sleep, size, eating, walking, talking.....all kids are difernt and short of a real prob WILL do whatever it is in their own time


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## kalisis (Jan 10, 2005)

If you don't count nursing, both my kids sleep through the night. I sit with DS while nursing DD and put both of them to sleep at the same time. Once asleep, DS will stay asleep all night, except if he needs a drink or to use the bathroom. That has been the scenario for more than a year now and he's nearly 3.5. DD will also stay asleep once asleep, but she does wake to nurse. I have never done any sleep training, I totally don't believe in it, so I think maybe you just have a rough kid in this dept, kwim?

Hang in there mama, you're doing the right thing and you know yourself and your kid best of all. Trust your instincts - they'll steer you right.


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## kalisis (Jan 10, 2005)

ugh...the internet just ate my post!

Oooh, no it didn't. How weird. Anyway, sorry, double post.


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## donutmolly (Jun 9, 2005)

My DD (31 mo) started STTN at about 24mo. She still nurses to sleep most nights -- the first night I was able to say "good night" and leave her in her bed (w/out any crying) to fall asleep on her own was after she had already been STTN for several months.

I agree that most sleep books have this philosophy, and urge parents to remove all sleep "props" at going to sleep time to ensure going back to sleep during the rest of the night without any help from mom or dad. Honestly, for my DD this would never have worked without tons and tons of crying... and although it was a rough road for us -- I am glad we waited for her to STTn at her own pace.


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## chrissy (Jun 5, 2002)

/


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## chrissy (Jun 5, 2002)

we (well dh) still cuddle to sleep even our oldest, who is 6. he sleeps through the night just fine. he just likes to fall asleep with his dad. it's our routine, though he is (finally) starting to grow out of it, i think. he gets in his pjs, brushes his teeth and goes to the bathroom. then dh reads to him for a while. then they cuddle and listen to norah jones for a little while. i think sometimes dh comes down before noah falls asleep, but not usually. it doesn't take him too long to fall asleep though.

i do the same routine with our 3yo (and usually the baby joins us). she falls asleep in a flash, as long as she hasn't had a nap. she doesn't exactly sleep though the night though. she goes to sleep in her bed, then wakes up at some point and comes into my bed then goes back to sleep.

i fall asleep with my dh and my baby every night and i would sleep through the night if it weren't for the aforementioned 3yo and baby.


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## SublimeBirthGirl (Sep 9, 2005)

I definitely think that babies who fall asleep on their own the first time during the night are less likely to need help going back to sleep when they wake up during the night. It's been true of both of mine at least.


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## noralou (Jul 19, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SublimeBirthGirl* 
I definitely think that babies who fall asleep on their own the first time during the night are less likely to need help going back to sleep when they wake up during the night. It's been true of both of mine at least.

Do you mean that you are able to leave DC in bed awake, and s/he'll fall asleep alone?
Boy, I just can't picture my kid doing that at all. If he didn't cry, I'm sure he'd get out of bed and bounce off the walls







. I remember reading early on (I think it was in Penelope Leach's baby book) that it was a good idea to put baby down when he was drowsy, but not yet sleeping, so he could drift off on his own. I tried it for a few days when he was maybe 5 months old. Even then, if he didn't cry (in which case I scooped him up), he'd kick his feet and wake himself up. I pretty quickly dropped that goal, and have been nursing him down ever since.


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## BeanyMama (Jul 25, 2006)

we tuck in dss and sing to them and then leave while they're awake but sleepy. they sleep 11-12 hours strait since around 18 months, in our bed. they'd probably wake up in the night if they were alone. i know i would


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## MamaOutThere (Apr 6, 2007)

I stay with dd2 (26 mos), not nursing, until she falls asleep. She's usually on my chest. And then she sleeps through the night (90% of the time).

Now, that I've read through a bit, I guess I should add that from birth until the age of 14 mos, she woke 10+ times a night. Then, progressively, she woke less and less. She started to consistently sleep through the night in October.


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## cheenya (Dec 17, 2001)

Just another "every child is different" reminder.
Both my DC still nurse to sleep.
DS, who is almost 2 sleeps through the night unless he is sick.
DD who will be 5 very soon is still waking 4 to 5 times a night. She will sometimes fall back to sleep on her own, but usually needs help in the form of back rubs, cuddling, or nursing.
They are very different children, DD in general is much more highly sensitive and I need to put more energy into parenting her day or night.

Good luck finding the path that works best for you and your DS.


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## kris1225 (Feb 22, 2002)

both of my kids 6 and 3 are weaned. they both fall asleep on their own and neither sleep through the night. i've tried everything BUT CIO. they just hate sleeping.


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## D_McG (Jun 12, 2006)

I fell for this and worked with DS so he could put himself to sleep. It made absolutely no difference. It might have made things worse.

I honestly think for a lot of babies this only works in the context of CIO. If they 'put themselves to sleep' by crying without a response, then chances are when they wake up they won't bother looking for help.


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## savithny (Oct 23, 2005)

Hm. - true in some ways, for us?

Both mine started just not falling asleep at the breast around 12 mos. They'd pop off and be looking around sleepily. So, after a few nights of "what now," I just popped #1 into his bed. He looked around a bit more, closed his eyes, and fell asleep.

He was already nursing down and sleeping through the night most nights at that point. But then, he came home from the hospital doing a 4-hour stretch at night, and other than a few growth spurts, always did at least that, and was doing 6 hours (midnight-6) by 4 months. But the point at which he started dropping off the breast before he was asleep marked the point at which he mostly dropped the midnight waking to nurse, and was sleeping through from 8pm - 7am.

DD did the same, but at a later age by several months, and it wasn't a sign she was ready to do 11 hours, but it signalled a drastic reduction in the number of nightwakings.

Both of them started the night in their own cot or crib from small babyhood on, and I brought them into the big bed in the early morning (4-5am, when they woke).


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## Twwly (Jan 30, 2007)

Not true for us.

DS will fall asleep easily to a song or two, but does not get through the night without nursing or potty. (15 mos)


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## kailotus (Nov 15, 2007)

i cuddle my 2 and a half year old son to sleep every night and he sleeps a solid 12 hours without waking up (he refuses to nap though). he is still co-sleeping with us, and i am fairly sure he would not sleep 12 hours if he didn't have us next to him. i feel very lucky to have the chance to sleep so well every night...but, our next baby is due in about two weeks and i am not so sure our great nights of sleep will last much longer!!!!


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