# I'm reaching my limit with co-sleeping and night-nursing



## junipermuse (Nov 1, 2006)

I'm feeling so frustrated and really disappointed in myself right now. I have an almost 20 month old dd and it is increasingly difficult to sleep with her in our bed. First of all it is starting to feel too crowded with both her and dh in our queen size bed. We just moved to a tiny apartment though and we can't fit a king in the room so getting a bigger bed isn't an option. My dh complains every morning about how uncomfortable he slept and i feel i'm constantly fighting her and him for some space. Also even though dd falls asleep in her crib she usually comes in to bed with us around 12:30 to 2:30 and then wants to nurse the rest of the night. This is actually painful for me. I know nursing shouldn't be painful and it's obvious that something is wrong with her latch at night, but if I stay awake all night to make sure her latch is perfect then I won't get any sleep. She's a twiddler too and i have to fight her to keep her hand off my other breast even when its covered with a shirt and a blanket. Sometimes this wakes her all the way up and then it's hard to get her back to sleep. Also as it gets closer to early morning she starts becoming very restless (even though she is still technically sleeping and definitely still tired) she starts kicking me and dh, pulling away with my boob still in her mouth, switching boobs constantly (I can not sleep through this at all) I am tired and grouchy and my breasts are in constant pain. Last night I tried to tell her the boobs were sleeping because I was in so much pain. She cried and cried for half an hour, and then my husband asked if she wanted to go for a drive. Of course then she said yes and he wouldn't take her so I had to get up out of bed and spent an hour driving her back to sleep. I was so tired. Dh went back downstairs to get her out of the car and as soon she was laid down she woke up and cried to nurse. So dh got up with her to watch some tv (it was probably 4:30 am) but she kept coming back in to the bedroom asking to nurse so finally I broke down and nursed her so we could get some sleep. Dh slept on the couch which actually helped a bit because at least I could stretch out and my back didn't hurt so much, but I think I was just so exhausted at that point that it was worth sleeping through the pain. The thing is I always wanted to co-sleep and even now there are times I really enjoy having her in bed with me. I just can't deal anymore with the all-night-nurse-athons. I don't even mind nursing her a bit if I could unlatch her when she seemed done. But she gets so upset when I unlatch her. I feel like such a failure as a mother and as a wife, because it's my fault that no one is getting any sleep. I aso feel like i'm not really being supported by my husband either. To make matters worse I've really been wanting to start trying for another baby, but this makes feel like there is no way we'd survive the pregnancy (if we don't fit in bed now can you imagine what it would be like if I gained 40lbs) let alone having a newborn and a toddler who doesn't sleep. And what if the baby is as bad a sleeper as dd or even worse. I'm really feeling so depressed. Seriously I would have no trouble co-sleeping and night-nursing indefinitely if it weren't so painful and if everyone was getting a good night sleep. Does anyone have any ideas or just words of encouragement?


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## jennifer_lc1 (Sep 8, 2007)

i feel ya on the lack of space. we also have a queen. my bb is only 2 mths though. he does lopve his nurseathons and i swear at times when he just won't let me sleep and is just twiddling and fussy to keep himself awake when he is obviously so tired, i feel like sobbing. i understand your pain.

ideas? i don't have much, mine is just a babe still so this is really to be expected. have you tried changing up your whole bedtime routine? i heard this works with fussy sleepers/constant nursing.

if you bathe her a few hours before bed change it to right before bed, if shes on any solids at all, give her a little bit of a snack to get her belly fuller, and instead of nursing her back to sleep,. break the habbit for a few nights, see if she actually is hungry *let her eat til she seems full to you* then just lay the law down, tell her she has to go to bed, i don't mean to sound like a mean mama, i am totally not!, i just mean let her know its ok to go to bed, she isn't missing out on anything by sleeping, that its good for her.. talk her through it instead of nursing her through it.

good luck!


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## D_McG (Jun 12, 2006)

I don't think I could cosleep with DS in a queen (well, DS and DH).

If you want to continue cosleeping then can you put your mattress on the floor and put her crib mattress next to it?

If you are thinking it's time for separate sleeping then I'd just persist with putting her back in her crib.

For the constant night nursing you might nightwean. That assumes this is not new. If it's new since your move then it'll probably resolve itself.

There's nothing wrong with realizing you can't nurse all night and cosleep in a queen. I think you have a number of options. I'd just pick on and go for it for a week and if it doesn't work then go to plan b. That's usually how we do things here and mostly the original plan works fine.

I don't think there is a right or wrong here. Just lead the way for your little girl and I'm sure you'll find a way to maximize everyone sleep. (For us now that's cosleeping but not nursing. For months it meant abandoning the crib, sleeping topless and letting him nurse as much as he wanted. These things evolve with time).


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## bl987ue (Mar 14, 2006)

For starters, if you do not want to nightwean, you need to teach your wee one nursing manners. You are well within your rights not to have your nipples twiddled. Yikes! If you do want to nightwean, Dr. Jay Gordon's website has some good advice on doing so.


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## D_McG (Jun 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bl987ue* 
You are well within your rights not to have your nipples twiddled. Yikes!

Absolutely. My toes curl at the thought of that. I simply couldn't bear it.


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## kiwiva (Apr 17, 2006)

It is so frustrating. We have the acrobatic sleeper between us in a queen bed. Perpendicular sleeping is also a favorite of hers.

I absolutely do not allow twiddling. Drives me positively insane. DD is 2 weeks from 2 now and at some point in the last couple months went through a period of all-night nursefests. I really thought I had a newborn. Could that be a phase with yours, especially if you just moved? We also have had periodic probs with the early morning constant nursing to get back to sleep. I resolved one of those phases with room darkening shades, but they come and go from time to time.

There have been times for my sanity that I rolled over said "No more" at the constant need to latch and she cried and finally DH woke and tried to comfort her. Inevitably I would then need to nurse again, but at that point she'd be ready to nurse to sleep and unlatch.

Now I am seeing a light at the end of the tunnel that wouldn't have been there a couple months ago. DD is sometimes trying to nurse when asleep (we were in a hotel last week and she rolled over and tried to nurse the towel I had rolled up next to her, it was too funny, since there was no milk there she gave up and went back to sleep so I know it is possible).

So now I roll over or squish a blanket between us to stop her pulling off my shirt, tell her it's sleep time and she moves on back to sleep. She has started crying and saying "milk time" several times, but a min or 2 later she is back to sleep. So this tactic is working for us now (not every time). If she is really insistent I do nurse her back, but I figure the more times I am successful at getting her back without nursing the better.

Good luck, I know it can be sooooo frustrating.


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## abitofcrunchmama (Jan 21, 2008)

Oh, I can certainly relate. DS is 18.5 mo and I am thisclose to night weaning, because I can't take the nurseathons.

You shouldn't feel like you failed. We have a king size bed and there is bearly enough room for all of us...no way we could cosleep in a queen.

I don't have any advise, but I def can relate and pass on a hug.


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## chocolatefish (Sep 21, 2008)

Have you had a look at the No Cry Sleep Solution book? Lots of ideas to try and reduce the all night nurseathons and moving baby to her own bed. But i hear your pain - co-sleeping is great when it works and a flippin nightmare when it isn't. I would second the suggestion to address the bed size by going on the floor and giving your daughter a matress of her own alongside, from memory that's one of the NCSS suggestions for getting her to her own bed. I used to get bad back pain, but find that a good pillow under my shoulder / back / bum helps with that. Qlso would agree that the all night nurseathons tend to come as phases - DS is teething big time at the mo so he is up and nursing through the night many times.

Good luck, you will find something that works for you. Well done mama!


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## junipermuse (Nov 1, 2006)

Thanks for the support everyone. The last two nights dh has moved to the couch when dd comes to our bed and I have slept much better. In our old house we had the bed up against the wall and I actually felt that gave us more room because I wasn't trying to stop myself from falling off the bed so I could move way over. I wish there was a way to put the mattress on the floor with a baby mattress next to it, but really the room is so small it wouldn't fit. When we moved we chose a place with a large living space and a killer kitchen, but in exchange to bedrooms are pretty small. I do have ncss both the original and the toddler one. I should definitely read the toddler one again now that she's bigger maybe more of those ideas would work. Frankly I didn't find the first one all that helpful, but I really liked the author's opinion that meeting your baby's needs is important but also meeting your own. So different than most sleep books.

I wish I could figure out how to break her of the twiddling habit. She is just so persistant. We've been working on it for a year. And I consistently stop her everytime (unless I'm asleep and don't notice) and it is still a constant battle. Maybe i could try getting a nursing necklace again. She wasn't interested before, but it might be worth another try. Really though the kicking and wiggling issue is mostly at night she really (aside from the twiddling) is a pretty well mannered nurser during the day. It's as if staying asleep is really a struggle for her.


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## D_McG (Jun 12, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *junipermuse* 

I wish I could figure out how to break her of the twiddling habit. She is just so persistant. We've been working on it for a year. And I consistently stop her everytime (unless I'm asleep and don't notice) and it is still a constant battle.

Do you stop nursing her for a set period of time when she does it? With DS I put him down and didn't nurse him for a while. Every.single.time day or night.

I'm glad you're getting sleep!


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## bdoody11 (Aug 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *junipermuse* 
In our old house we had the bed up against the wall and I actually felt that gave us more room because I wasn't trying to stop myself from falling off the bed so I could move way over.

I co-sleep with my DH and 19 month DD in a queen. I feel your pain!

I just wanted to add that you could get a bed rail and it would effectively act like the wall in your old house. We finally got one because DD kept falling off the bed.







However, one the surprising additional benefits is that either I or her can get right to edge of the bed, giving the others more room.

We have this bed rail. It was a snap to install and I love that I can slide it under the bed when not in use.


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## MyZoeJane (Aug 13, 2004)

I remember the frutration with night nursing like it was yesterday. I feel your pain, sweetie! DD was also a "diddler" and as a previous poster suggested, what worked for me was to completely unlatch her from nuirsing when she did it and make her wait a bit to make sure she understood the connection between the diddling and the not being able to nurse. We kicked it in a week or two this way.

Is there ANY way you could squeeze a crib (converted into a toddler bed, not all do this) between your bed and the wall? I did this to shove DD off into it when I need to strecth out. Invitably, she'd climb back in, but I'd get a couple of hours of good sleep this way!


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## Pumpkin_Pie (Oct 10, 2006)

I am right there with you mama. My son is turning 18 months on Sunday and we have going through the worst week of sleeping that he has had since he was born. I am so tired, exhausted actually by the all night nurse fests and the kicking, punching, crawling, worrying that he is going to fall out of bed, etc, etc, etc.

About a week ago, I decided I was going to attempt to night wean. When he woke up to nurse, I would say, "Nay Nays are sleeping, we will have more Nay Nay in the morning". He would cry and claw at my shirt and say "No! Mama! No Mama!!!" and just wail. It was heart breaking, but I stuck to my guns and would nurse him at the first hint of light in the sky (which is around 4:30 come to find out...







)

Fast forward nearly a week, and he is still waking up at least once, if not twice a night screaming to nurse, me feeling like the crappiest mama ever for denying him what he obviously needs and still sticking it out and letting him cry to sleep in my arms while I say to him, "It's ok, we will have Nay Nay in the morning, Mama's here, you are ok, etc, etc, etc". Nothing was getting better.

Last night I decided, maybe he needed to be in his own bed. I don't own a crib, but I do have a pack and play in our room, so I put him to bed in there after nursing him down. Pretty much the instant his body touched the sheepskin I had laid down in there, he woke up crying and clinging to me. I had to nurse him to sleep 4 times and try to lay him down 4 times before he actually slept in there. He didn't get to sleep until 9:30, and then woke up at 2:30. When he woke up, he was frantic, and even though I went to him before he was really even awake, he was terrified.

It was a complete disaster. I have decided that maybe he isn't ready to night wean, and we are not ready to not co-sleep, so tonight, he is going to have free access to my breasts all night and I am not going to attempt to put him in his own bed again any time soon. I have no idea what is going to happen, but I so need to sleep.

I just wanted to give you some support and say that I am so there. It is so freaking hard. You want to give your LO the nurturing they need, but it is impossible if you are falling apart in the process. I wish I had the magic answer, and hope that we all get sleep soon.


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## treehuggermama (Jan 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *abitofcrunchmama* 
You shouldn't feel like you failed. We have a king size bed and there is bearly enough room for all of us...no way we could cosleep in a queen.

I don't have any advise, but I def can relate and pass on a hug.









: we have 4 in our king and I have about an inch of room for me!


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## mexicali mami (Mar 24, 2007)

I just wanted to add that we are in the same spot. After a week of hardcore nightweaning (absolutely none until 5am) we are back to nightnursing. It was awful, even less sleep than before. Lots of crying and fits. Awake from 12pm till 5am at times. So, I guess my 22 month old still "really needs" his chi chi and we are going to try again in a month or two. We cosleep in a full size bed against the wall but moved DP to his own bed so at least one of us can sleep. Lucky guy









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pumpkin_Pie* 
I am right there with you mama. My son is turning 18 months on Sunday and we have going through the worst week of sleeping that he has had since he was born. I am so tired, exhausted actually by the all night nurse fests and the kicking, punching, crawling, worrying that he is going to fall out of bed, etc, etc, etc.

About a week ago, I decided I was going to attempt to night wean. When he woke up to nurse, I would say, "Nay Nays are sleeping, we will have more Nay Nay in the morning". He would cry and claw at my shirt and say "No! Mama! No Mama!!!" and just wail. It was heart breaking, but I stuck to my guns and would nurse him at the first hint of light in the sky (which is around 4:30 come to find out...







)

Fast forward nearly a week, and he is still waking up at least once, if not twice a night screaming to nurse, me feeling like the crappiest mama ever for denying him what he obviously needs and still sticking it out and letting him cry to sleep in my arms while I say to him, "It's ok, we will have Nay Nay in the morning, Mama's here, you are ok, etc, etc, etc". Nothing was getting better.

Last night I decided, maybe he needed to be in his own bed. I don't own a crib, but I do have a pack and play in our room, so I put him to bed in there after nursing him down. Pretty much the instant his body touched the sheepskin I had laid down in there, he woke up crying and clinging to me. I had to nurse him to sleep 4 times and try to lay him down 4 times before he actually slept in there. He didn't get to sleep until 9:30, and then woke up at 2:30. When he woke up, he was frantic, and even though I went to him before he was really even awake, he was terrified.

It was a complete disaster. I have decided that maybe he isn't ready to night wean, and we are not ready to not co-sleep, so tonight, he is going to have free access to my breasts all night and I am not going to attempt to put him in his own bed again any time soon. I have no idea what is going to happen, but I so need to sleep.

I just wanted to give you some support and say that I am so there. It is so freaking hard. You want to give your LO the nurturing they need, but it is impossible if you are falling apart in the process. I wish I had the magic answer, and hope that we all get sleep soon.


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## greenemami (Nov 1, 2007)

we have nearly the same problems as the OP. My dp complains all the time about not having enough room, dd is a MAJOR twiddler, and she literally nurses all.night.long! (dd is nearly 18 months)I would love any suggestions-I am considering night weaning as well, but I know it will not be pretty and I don't think I can stand to see her that upset. Plus the lack of sleep. We are also hoping to try for another soon, but have the same fears. Let me know if you find anything that works!


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## jadzia's_mommy (Jun 9, 2005)

We were able to nightwean only by me spending a couple nights in another room. It seemed to help to have me and my breasts totally out of the picture.


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## babymaggie (Nov 11, 2007)

This thread is making me cry mamas. Hugs to all and I hope everyone's sleep problems end soon.


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## jadzia's_mommy (Jun 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jadzia's_mommy* 
We were able to nightwean only by me spending a couple nights in another room. It seemed to help to have me and my breasts totally out of the picture.

Just to clarify my pp--they slept in the bed with DH, I slept in the other room for 2 nights. So he was there to comfort them when they woke up. HTH!


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## CrysKeys (Sep 26, 2008)

Hey, I'm a newbie here but i just wanted to put in a few words.

DD will be 2 in a few days and for 2 weeks she was doing nursethon most of the day and night even with her regular solids.

She started eating more and is more independant in the day just a couple of days ago and stopped the constant nursing. Thank goodness.

Sometimes i notice it's what she or i eat that keeps her waking up at night. Caffine or perhaps discomfort from difficult to digest foods in her tummy.

I'm so glad i found this site. It seems all the other parents around me simply did not share my convictions!


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## Surfacing (Jul 19, 2005)

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