# Talk to me about things that are "Made in China"...



## Gemini (Apr 9, 2003)

Since coming to MDC last spring I have been enlightened to many things, and one of them being many of you ladies boycott purchasing items made in China. Please tell about why. I'm guessing it has to do with labor issues?

Now that I have become more aware of this, I'm seeing that just about EVERYTHING is made in China. Is it tough to avoid things made there completely? I would imagine it would be.

Fill me in ladies.

_OMG folks, she posted a thread in Activism!!_


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## emmaline (Dec 16, 2001)

Well speaking very personally, I live in an area where lots of manufacturing used to happen, mostly in textiles, clothing and footwear. Now all but a few workplaces have closed down, the manufacturing moved to locations throughout Asia, many in China. Though I'm happy for Chinese folks to have jobs, I know they are paid way less than my neighbours were and I know that mnay of my neighbours, especially the middle aged women, will never have paid jobs again. I would rather buy shoes that are keeping my neighbours in work, though this might be shortsighted of me. The ex-factories of course have been turned into "boutique apartment developments", reaping profits for the developers. For the wealthy men who own the businesses that have moved offshore - well, they say it's the only way to keep their businesses competitive, but most of them I think could cash up and live off their earnings tomorrow if they weren't obsessed with amassing even more wealth.

No doubt someone will post a cogent world-politics answer for you Gemini! mine is just personal.

(good heavens I just answered a post in activism







)


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## Hilary Briss (Nov 22, 2001)

Although I do have concerns about the way Chinese labor is treated, and I am not at all happy about what the Chinese have done in Tibet, my main reason for avoiding products that are made in the PRC is because most of their goods are shabby rubbish.


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## luckylady (Jul 9, 2003)

It seems just about everything is made in China. This irritates my DH to no end. We try to buy American or European, and it isn't easy! My DD loves "Little people" - they are made in China. She has them anyway.


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## somemama (Sep 25, 2002)

Oh, this has been a big issue for me lately. First of all, as has been mentioned, the USA loses jobs because those jobs have gone to Mexico and Asia (buying anything from any third world country makes me cringe.)

Secondly, the people in China are basically slaves--working long hours, in horrible conditions, with toxic chemicals, for very little money.

It is almost impossible to completely avoid buying Made in China products, but we have cut it down some, and that makes us feel better.

For example, we were looking for a piano recently, and more and more pianos are now being made in Korea and China. We ended up with a USA piano (made in our own state, in fact), and we are very happy with it. It is used, but it has gorgeous wood and sounds beautiful.

Also, I wanted to buy ds a "shape-sorter" for Christmas, but can only find ones made in China. So, dh is going to make one for ds himself, out of wood.

Also, on the rare occasions when we eat at McDonalds or such, we tell them "no toy" in the happy meal because all of those toys are made in China.

So, little things do make a difference, and it has also cut our consumption of things.


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## member234098 (Aug 3, 2002)

I remember knowing people in my parents' social circle who boycotted buying from department stores as Sears in the 1960's because the stores bought goods from foreign sources.

Economics and enviromental concerns have changed the landscape, and now it is hard to find anything made exclusively in this country (USA).

There are electronic parts researched here, manufactured in China, shipped to Mexico to be assembled and shipped back. How does this benefit anyone? Where is the pride in employment?


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## Super Pickle (Apr 29, 2002)

This has been on my mind a lot lately. I do really try to avoid things made in China but as others have said it is very hard. For example, I wanted some shoes for my baby for the winter. I deliberately went to Ecobaby for the express purpose of avoiding Made in China products. But when the Padders arrived, there it was--a tag saying "Made in China!"

Have you ever looked through the Oriental Trading Company catalogue? It used to come to our apartment addressed to the previous resident. I quickly stopped it. It made me sad that there are people whose lives basically come down to working in a factory making junk. Also, OTC has these "Inspirational" sections and whole "inspirational" catalogues which sell angels and stuff with Bible verses or slogans like "WWJD"...it doesn't sit well with me at all!

I heard a broadcast on the radio the other day. It was an interview with a man from an organization which serves the persecuted church. He had just returned from China and Vietnam. He had many shocking stories, but one I couldn't forget was about pastors of house churches that are in prison in China. They are forced to work 16 hours a day (for no pay of course, as they're prisoners) making the Christmas tree lights that we buy in Wal-Mart or Target or Ace Hardware or wherever. And they are given no tools, so they have to use their teeth to clamp things. Their fingers become bloody until they form adequate callouses. I'm sure other types of political prisoners are treated similarly.

Anyway, buying "Made in China" is one more thing that I can no longer do with a clear conscience. If it happens accidentally, like in the Ecobaby occasion, I get over it, but I always check now.


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## AmyB (Nov 21, 2001)

I am another one who is trying hard to avoid "made in China" . I'm a fanatic label reader and I definitely chose what to buy depending on where it is made.

My objections are the Chinese occupation of Tibet, abusive labor practices, environmental concerns (such as the Three Gorges dam on the Yangtze River), and concerns that we are shipping our own economic security overseas along with manufacturing jobs.

One way to avoid Chinese stuff is to avoid Wal-Mart and other big box type stores that have cheap prices mainly because they sell cheap out-sourced goods.

In order to avoid "made in china" baby shoes I bought Mexican made baby shoes at a store in the hispanic neighborhood (I had to take dh along because he can speak Spanish and I can't). The shoes are extremely nicely made compared to cheap Chinese shoes, but they cost about $10 more. If I buy one nice pair of shoes instead of two cheap ones it's still a savings, though.

--AmyB


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## Britishmum (Dec 25, 2001)

My reason for avoiding goods made in China is the slave labour. Although it is fairly impossible to avoid it. However, we do wherever possible.

On thing that drives dh mad in particular, are people who moan and moan on about the state of the economy, and the job losses, then go out and buy major items, like cars, that are made abroad. In particular, his company has been laying people off left right and centre. Everyone at work is really depressed about it. Then two of them decided recently to upgrade their cars, and bought Toyotas. Everyone apparently stood around looking at brochures etc about these cars, and not one person except dh made a comment about maybe buying one made in the USA. To moan about cuts in your own industry, then go out and give thousands of $$$s abroad, just makes no sense to me. But then, not much makes any sense to me these days.







:


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## Els' 3 Ones (Nov 19, 2001)

China is a communist country................which means simply that every dollar we spend with them sends money to the gov't - ie - red army.............somewhere in the future the US will be at war with China and we will have funded it!! Oh, the irony!!!

Amnesty Int'l has lots to say abt China:

CHINA

I've have saved thousands of dollars over the last 20 or so years trying to buy NOT made in China. But, it is so pervasive (Chinese imports) that you would still find much in my home that is from there...........................







But I still try.

El


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## velryba (Jan 16, 2003)

If opposition against China's internal/external policies should be a justification against buying stuffs made in China, then we ought to examine our country's foriegn policies. That could lead, at least on occasions, to a conclusion that we also ought to not buy anything made in the United States.


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## Hilary Briss (Nov 22, 2001)

Quote:

we also ought to not buy anything made in the United States.
I tried to implement a boycott of U.S. goods here last year, but without much success.


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## RidentMama (Aug 18, 2003)

Okay, my DH and I are big into avoiding products made in China. His hometown has lost all but one major industry, because the plants moved their production facilities to China. Now there are no jobs, very little money, and numerous people hunting for work to keep food on the table. Avoiding products made in China, then, is something we do to support keeping jobs in the United States, thereby keeping money within the United States. Also, the thought of supporting a system where so many people are enslaved is just appalling.
But boycotting US Goods? Why don't you just tell your employer: "Heck no, I don't need the $$, just send my job overseas!" 'cause even though you don't completely agree with the way the government is run, you're not hurting it as much as you're hurting the factory worker, the construction crews, your neighbors, friends and family. The more jobs are shipped overseas, the less jobs there are here, and the harder it becomes for everyone to make ends meet.


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## velryba (Jan 16, 2003)

I am not advocating the boycotting of anybody in particular. What I am pointing out is the fallacy in the logic of using the argument that we ought to boycott Chinese products because we disagree with their oppressive policies, yet not apply the same reasoning to when our country act in oppressive manners.

However, the arguement that "we ought to buy locally to support local economy" is a sound argument. (call this reason 2)

We just need to pay attention to the fact that while reason 2 may be correct, it does not make reason 1 an acceptable reason.


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## detergentdiva (Oct 16, 2002)

I have always believed in supporting local business. Too often we see US businesses going overseas to cut costs or slapping the "made in the US" label on an item you make out of goods made in China yet assembled in the US.
It is tough but I try to keep a bit of an awareness on what I buy and where it comes from. I do look at labels and try to support local mom and pop type stores. I figure it's the lest I can do.


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## oncewerewise (Feb 14, 2003)

I believe in supporting local companies, when possible. (Sometimes my budget doesn't allow it, sometimes what I'm looking for isn't available locally.)

The problem with boycotting is that it usually hurts the people you might be trying to protect. The better solution is to keep those 'slave labourers' alive and try to fix the situation from another angle.

My two cents.


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## Gemini (Apr 9, 2003)

HB







:









Thank you for all your responses. It's been neat reading abut this.


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## Hilary Briss (Nov 22, 2001)

Yeah, sure, laugh at my effort to boycott American goods. My heart was in the right place. I can't help it if I'm addicted to Vanilla Coke... I tried to be a good role model.

My boycott went over about as well as my thread on flagburning as your patriotic duty. It's hard to believe that was over a year ago.







:


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## Els' 3 Ones (Nov 19, 2001)

But, see, if you boycott China you _*are*_ boycotting Amerika!!!! Think Disney, Nike, Walmart, etc.................

El


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## athena_dreaming (Oct 15, 2003)

I recommend "No Logo" by Naomi Klein to anyone who is interested in learning more about third-world working conditions and what you can do about it. She's not particularly supportive of the boycotts, mostly because, after talking to those workers, she learned that they don't mind the jobs or hte work, they just want better working conditions. And boycotting--especially if you don't tell the company why you're boycotting or that you're boycotting--won't do that.

I mean, picture it: Board meeting of Big Company that Makes Crap in China:

CEO: Why aren't people buying our stuff?
Exec 1: We just finished running that really expensive ad campaign with all the little girls sitting around drinking their pretend tea that they just made with their pretend kitchens ....
Exec 2: It's even purple and glittery! What more could they want?
Exec 1: Maybe our ad campaigns need to be more traditional.
Exec 2: It's worth a shot, I guess.
CEO: So we're settled, the ads aren't working?

My point being that boycotting can really backfire if the company doesn't know about it and doesn't know why. They could conclude that declines in sales are part of hte normal economic cycle, or that the ads aren't working, or that their product needs to be cheaper and they should cut wages more, or lots of other things that would make the situation worse instead of better. If they see their sales declining and want to make their product cheaper, for instance, it's entirely possible they will move *more* factories overseas

Just a few things to keep in mind...


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## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

I team teach a university course on contemporary China, and although I've researched this issue considerably, I'm still not sure on where I am with it.

Joint venture and foreign invested firms (mostly US and Japan) tend to be the most exploitative, especially of women. They tend to hire only very young migrant women (rural women temporarily living in urban areas), and make them work long hours with total control over their lives. The workers must sign contracts which forbid them from seeking higher pay elsewhere, or they lose all the pay for the contract period. The pay is horrible by our standards. But, as athena says, these women want these jobs and relative to what they can make farming or in rural enterprises, the pay isn't bad. In their own villages, the women are seen as highly successful.

The women in these factories are not being oppressed at the hands of the Chinese government. They are being exploited by US and Japanese business interests. In terms of working conditions and equal wages for equal pay, women make out much better working in State owned enterprises.


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## magnoliablue (Dec 29, 2002)

Have to share this..shopping the other day at TJMaxx....looking for toys for my extremely crunchy friend who will avoid most everything made in China, as I also try to do.. I LOVE the Melissa and Doug wood toys, or at least I USED to...turned them over.. Made in China,plain as day.. I stood there..said outloud.."ok, where the #@!$ two weeks before Christmas can I find toys made in the US or somewhere other than China??"...lady in aisle with me said.. 'Probably China":LOL sad to say, that's probably true


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## Gemini (Apr 9, 2003)

Thanks for the info!

Now I'm an ignoramous when it comes to many things. Please tell me more about the issues in Tibet some of you mentioned. I also would like to know how you all feel about the Three Gorges Dam too. I think I better go start new threads.


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