# Alternatives to D&C for missed miscarriage?



## sweetc (Aug 12, 2003)

Hi, I am hoping I can get some advice from you wise mommas.

I am still in shock from finding out yesterday that my baby's heart has stopped beating. I am almost 11 weeks along and the baby measures around 10 weeks. Such a sad thing to see a still baby with no heartbeat in my womb on the ultrasound.

I am trying to figure out what to do now, besides grieve. My OB is recommending a D&C due to the size of the baby. I am wondering what experiences any of you have had with that and also what experience you may have had with alternatives. I am not sure how long I can emotionally wait, but want to do the right thing for my body.

Christine


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## carolynb (Dec 13, 2003)

Hi! I don't know what you should do because everyone is different, but I'll tell you what I did. I have a miscarriage at 12 weeks and I decided to let it happen naturally. It took several weeks, and then I started to bleed. The pain was never that bad, but the bleeding wouldn't stop and went on and on. We realized in the middle of the night that I might bleed to death, and went to the hospital. It turns out that the placenta was not fully detached and was not going to stop bleeding, I had a D and C.
I then lost another baby at 16 weeks, and had a procedure immediately.
I will never again wait for nature to take its course because it is too stressful to wait the weeks, I want it over with to start again for a new baby. Only you know what feels best to you, though. I am so sorry that you lost your baby. If it makes you feel better, they can test the baby (only if they do a Dand C, not if it happens naturally) to see if it was genetically altered. Both of my losses, I discovered, were Trisomys. It helps to know why.


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## naturegirl (Apr 16, 2002)

If you decide to m/c naturally I believe there are some herbs that can assist. I was given Blue Cohosh with my miscarriage. You may want to ask a naturopath or your midwife about those options.

So sorry for you loss. Take care sweetc.









Cheryl


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## Ms. Mom (Nov 18, 2001)

Christine, I'm so sorry about your baby







It's never easy to lose a child.

Many women here have been able to miscarry naturally without medical intervention. Unfortunately, there is not timetable for miscarriage. In most cases it will start within two weeks, but every miscarriage is unique - just as every pregnancy.

Can you talk to your partner about your options? It may help to have his imput on this. Though the ultimate decision is going to have to come from you.

As naturegirl stated, Cohosh is an effective herb in helping miscarriage. However, it's a VERY POWERFUL herb. I would STRONGLY advise you to use it only under the direct care of a professional.

Please make sure you're taking good care of yourself as you move through this. Make sure you keep yourself hydrated and eat meals high in iron. There will be some blood loss no mater what rout you go.

Most women can miscarry at home without medical intervention. If you do decide to go this way, you'll want to stay in-tune with your body and look for any signs of infection, such as Heavy bleeding (more than a pad an hour), feaver, flu-like symptoms and severe abdominal pain (pain you cannot breath through).

I wish you peace as you travel this path.


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## JodynJupiter (Dec 14, 2003)

Hi Sweetc,
I am sorry for your loss. How difficult it must be to have seen the loss when you were expecting something so much more.
Sounds like your OB has a specific reason for DnC and that is certainly something to pay attention to. If you are wanting to avoid a surgery, maybe you can talk w/ him and let him know that it is important to you. Much as we sometimes need to express our desires regarding breastfeeding and birth, etc there are often solutions which can be provided once they know what is important to us.

Words like, "I am willing to have a DnC if it is medically necessary, but would prefer to avoid if possible. What complications could occur if I have it naturally? What tests would have to be performed if I do nothing?( they may feel like they need to moniter hcg levels, infection or clotting disorders, etc or nothing at all)
How long will it take? (monitering hcg levels may be helpful here)
What are the risks of a DnC?

I was pregnant for nearly 3 weeks beyond when I first became suspicious that all was not well. As it turned out, the pregnancy went 4 weeks beyond viability. I had a chance to mourn the loss while still pg which turned out to work _for me_ . You will have to think about what works for you and surely you don't have to do anything for a few days or so until you have had some time to consider your options. Again, I am very sorry for this.

I would like to share that my OB presented me w/ 3 options regarding the missed miscarriage (medical inducement, DnC and natural) and presented them as equal choices. I disagreed that they were truly equal choices in my situation ( the embryo is only 6 weeks along). I considered a DnC an unnecessary surgery and the medical inducement an unnecessary drug. But then again I am one who had unmedicated birth and refuses pitocin for my kids births etc. I mention this because it really gave me insight to this guy about how he might view a birth and how traditional OBs sometimes have a tendency toward controling things rather than letting them go, particularly if there is any chance it might lead to midnight calls or ER visits.

I hope you find a path which brings you the most comfort in this tragic time, _whatever_ that path may be. I don't think you would be wrong for choosing a DnC if that is what is indicated and right for YOU.

I also would use caution regarding herbs other than raspberry leaf tea w/o supervision from midwife or knowledgable care giver. I did a quick search on this myself and it sounded pretty hairy.

Jody (formerly from the Aug moms group)


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## sweetc (Aug 12, 2003)

Thank you all for your helpful and kind replies. I am still figuring it all out and it helps to be able to talk about it.

This morning I am going to go see my NP and see what she has to say and what her experience has been. I would like to avoid a D&C. (I gave birth to my son without any medication or intervention in the hospital and that was a wonderful experience for me.) The thing that keeps hanging me up is my OB is concerned about how far along I am and how much bleeding there would be, and I guess that makes it somehow scarier for me. Although I am not sure it makes it scarier than a surgery...

Is it bad for me to wish this had happened earlier in the pregnancy? I bled some at 7+ weeks and was mentally prepared to loose the baby then, if you ever are truly prepared.

Also, I was considering a homebirth this time around and am trying to view a miscarriage at home a trial run for that, but with a live birth there is a lot more support. I guess I feel alone in this, even though my DH is being very supportive.

Thanks for listening and being a resource for me. It is nice that there is a group of women with experience with this, but so sad at the same time.

Peace,
Christine


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## SamuraiEarthMama (Dec 3, 2002)

dear sweetc! of course you're not "bad" to have wanted this further in your past, earlier before you had built up dreams and hopes for this baby.

sometimes i hear stories of women who have suffered stillbirths and i wonder if i could have survived something like that... i was so wiped with my relatively early (10 week) losses, i can't imagine trying to recover from a pregnancy loss further along. sometimes i think i'm "lucky," finding out and miscarrying early, instead of after feeling the baby move, thinking of names, buying things for it...

i guess it's a matter of perspective. it's never a GOOD time for a loss!

i did both of my miscarriages naturally. one caught me by surprise (oddly enough, in a hospital while doing support for a friend who was in preterm labor), the other was intentionally at home. the second was definitely like a homebirth, as far as creating a safe and comfortable place to labor, cutting down all outside interventions, and having the people and things around me that i wanted. my midwives came by and helped with herbs, tea, and a shoulder to cry on.

i was bleeding quite a bit until i passed everything... i think subconsciously, i was really trying to hold onto this baby! but they did a bp check and made sure i was OK, and i didn't have to go in a see a doctor.

i have to wonder... you always hear caregivers say, call if you bleed too much. but has anyone ever heard of a natural miscarriage proceeding to hemmorhage? (sp?) i haven't, and i've known a LOT of women who have miscarried. i can't find any statistics on it... i really don't think it's a very common situation. so unless you've had iron problems in the past or are already sick from something else, i wouldn't worry too much about that aspect of being at home.

have you already made contact with the local midwives? they might be willing to come check you out, and support you through this. my midwives didn't charge me a penny for my aftercare for either miscarriage (though i don't know if all midwives follow this policy), and they made a huge difference in my confidence level. even a doula friend might be of comfort, if that's all you have.

good luck to you. i'll be thinking of you, and again i'm so sorry this is happening!

hugs, katje


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## traci5489 (Oct 27, 2002)

Christine:
I am so sorry for you loss. I have had a natural mc with both of mine. The first was at 10 wks and the second at 7 wks (still going through this one).

My mc at 10 wks and took me 13 days to complete and then I was checked by u/s and by my ob to be sure it was complete. I bled fairly heavily and I was in a fair amount of pain, mostly at night when I would relax and try to sleep. This mc has been much easier physically on me, and I just saw my ob yesterday to be sure all is well and to check with u/s and was told that the process is almost complete. I really wanted to avoid a D&C if possible and am glad I could, but for some it is medically needed or the wait is just too much for them to bear.

I will keep you in my thoughts and just remember that "we" are here for support if you need us.


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

Hi Christine, I am so sorry for your loss. I'm usually a lurker (by the way, thank you wonderful ladies for all the support you've been providing me without knowing it!) but I can relate so much with what you're going through. I found out at a 12 week ultrasound that my baby had stopped growing 4 weeks earlier. It was unbearable. I (like many other women here) was against a D & C and decided to wait things out naturally. Like you, I wanted natural childbirth at home and reasoned, "If I can't handle a natural miscarriage, how I can handle natural childbirth?" My midwife had told me that my body had started to absorb the pregnancy and that there was a small possibility that I may not even have a m/c at all but that my body may just absorb the whole thing. I'd never heard of this before and didn't know if I'd be able to handle it -- the waiting, the not-knowing. But I decided to wait it out. My midwife gave me a weekly blood test to make sure I wasn't getting infected and to measure my HCG levels. I never did have an actual miscarriage. It took five weeks, but my body ended up absorbing the entire pregnancy and ended with a very light (brownish) period. It may sound unbearable to some women (even me) waiting for your body to absorb your baby, but for me it was an important, even beautiful, time in my life. I grieved for my baby but was still able to find beauty and comfort in each day. I learned so much about myself in that five weeks and even developed a new respect for my body. It was probably the most important 5 weeks of my life. That was back in October. Now my dh and I are ttc again and are very hopeful. I feel healed from my first pregnancy and quite sure that my next pregnancy will be different. I agree with the other womens responses that this is a very personal decision. What worked for me, may not work for others. But I wanted to share my experience with you. I hope it helps.
I'll be thinking of you,
Kate


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## sweetc (Aug 12, 2003)

Thank you all for your kindness. I am blessed by your willingness to share your stories and comfort me through this.

I saw my NP, who is also a midwife, yesterday. We had a wonderful talk and I was again reminded that I am a strong women with a strong body. I am going to wait and respect the process that my body needs to go through. She gave me some herbs to help and offered to be with me if I needed. So, while it is hard not knowing how long this will take, I am more at peace with waiting and taking the extra time to say goodbye to my baby. It feels right for now.

I will probably have more questions and doubts as I move through this, and it is nice knowing that all of you are here for me.

love,
Christine


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## taradt (Jun 10, 2003)

((hugs)) to you

it is a very hard decission to make and every one is different but i will tell you what worked for us...

my baby died sometime between 13 - 16 weeks, we found out forsure right before christmas and were presented with 2 choices from the dr (d&c or induction) we spoke with our midwife about natural miscarriage. we were told the risks (excessive bleeding if tissue or placenta stays attatched, infection, ect..) we decided we liked those risks better then having the d&c so we waited another week and a half, by then the dr and midwife were getting a bit concerned about not knowing how long the baby had been in there and i was starting to have a really hard time with reality, i kept thinking i was still pregnant (which i was in a way) and i had already made peace with the fact that the baby had died but couldn't get any closure. we finally decided to induce labor so that i could stay at home and be able to bury my baby withoug going through the processes of the hospital. after more then 10 hours of hard labor Keena was born in the bathtub Dec. 31st what would have been 18 weeks for me. her birth was really beautiful and the most peaceful thing i had ever been a part of, it was really healing for me (i had a c section with my first) and i felt that i gave her a final gift. my midwife was great and actually came over for part of the labor and was there when we birthed Keena.
anyways that is our story, good luck in what you choose ((hugs))


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## sweetc (Aug 12, 2003)

Hi Mommas,

A quick update. I had the miscarriage naturally at home last night. It went well and I am feeling sad but very strong.

Thank you all for your support, caring, and comfort. I don't really know how to tell you just how much it meant to me that a bunch of women I don't know would share their beautiful personal stories with me. It helped me get through this. I cried for each one of you and your losses.

What strong and wonderful women you are. I feel honored to be a part of this forum with you.

Peace,
Christine


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## SamuraiEarthMama (Dec 3, 2002)

thanks for letting us know how you're doing.

what a beautiful name for your precious baby!

i wish you a gentle and peaceful healing,

katje


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

Christine,
Just wanted you to know that I'm thinking about you. I'm sure you'll be feeling a lot of mixed emotions. Be kind and patient with yourself.
I found that writing and talking about it helped me so much.
I also came across an excerpt called "Spirit Baby" in a book called Babycatcher. To sum up, it lets us know that the soul of the baby we lost in m/c will be the same soul of the next baby we have. I believed this before I found the book and it was wonderful to feel validated by this excerpt.
I'm sure you will see your Ocean baby again, Christine.
Wishing you peace,
Kate


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## SamuraiEarthMama (Dec 3, 2002)

is this the excerpt you're talking about? because it's the same thing my midwife sent to me after my first miscarriage! and it did bring me great comfort. found it on the web so i don't think it's a problem excerpting it here:

Excerpt from BabyCatcher: Chronicles of a Modern Midwife

Spirit Baby

Colin, my twelve-year-old son, discovered me late one rainy afternoon sitting at the kitchen table, a damp Kleenex crumpled in my left hand, wiping my eyes as I tried to compose myself for his sake. It was the third week of January, two months after I'd miscarried a pregnancy, but I still found it impossible to get through a day without at least one meltdown into misery.

Stunned when the test came back positive, Rog and I had stared at each other with doubt and ambivalence. At forty-one, my professional life consumed me. I'd just achieved what some had predicted was an impossibility: I'd been granted delivery privileges at Alta Bates, and as a consequence, my midwifery practice burgeoned. Some months I delivered twelve babies, and no one ever knew if or when I'd be home. Rog, too, felt stretched to his limits, keeping his business afloat while picking up the slack for my frequent unscheduled absences. Colin and Jill approached their challenging adolescent years. How could we fit an infant into our lives? But when I lost the pregnancy and all hope for resolution dissolved with my tears, I fell in love with the baby that was not to be.

Colin asked, "Are you crying about the baby?" and when I nodded tearfully, he said, "Well, you just have to have another one, Mom, because it's a Spirit Baby, and you should be its mother."

I must have looked puzzled because he said, "Don't you know about Spirit Babies? How could I know about them if you don't? I mean, you're my mom!" But he could see my perplexity.

So my first child, this not-yet-teenaged boy, pulled a wooden chair to my side and draped his thin arm across my shoulders, saying, "Well, Mom, here's how it is. See, I was one myself, so that must be how I know. Anyway, every woman has a circle of babies that goes around and around above her head, and those are all the possible babies she could have in her whole life. Every month, one of those babies is first in line. If she gets pregnant, then that's the baby that's born. If she doesn't get pregnant, the baby goes back into the circle and keeps going around with all the others. If she gets pregnant but something bad happens before the baby's born&#8230;now listen, Mom, because here's the really cool part. It goes back into the circle, but it becomes a Spirit Baby, and all the other babies give it cuts. Each month, it's always first in line. Isn't that great?

"So you just have to get pregnant again, and you'll have the same Spirit Baby. If you don't, though, then the baby circle will just beam that little Spirit Baby over to some other woman's circle, and it'll be first in line for her. It keeps being first in line somewhere until it finally gets born.

"But it'd be a shame for you not to have it yourself, because I know how much you want it. So you just have to try again. Mom, remember that baby you lost before I was born?" I nodded wordlessly. "Well, that was me. Really. I've always known I was a Spirit Baby. I mean, I know what I'm talking about here, Mom."

In spite of Colin's certainty that our household, so often bordering on chaos, lacked only an infant to make things perfect, Rog and I demurred. But Colin didn't give up and even enlisted his sister's support. Driving with them in the car one evening, I looked at my son in the passenger seat beside me. He stared out the side window and tried to hide his tears, but I saw the flush on his face, the shaking of his shoulders, and the surreptitious swipe of hand across cheek.

Six months had passed since my miscarriage, and I had just finished yet another discussion in which I'd told my pleading son that having a third baby at my age was out of the question. I reached over the space between us and squeezed his fingers. "Colin, I don't understand this passion you have for a baby. Why do you want one so much?"

He tore his gaze from the distant hills and looked at me with swimming eyes and trembling lips. In a choking voice, he put all of his twelve-year-old passion into his reply.

"Oh, Mom! Oh. Just for the joy of it!"

Jill stretched forward from the back seat and placed a hand on each of our shoulders. "Yeah, Mom, just for the joy of it."

It was my turn to look out the side window and struggle with misty vision.
So, at a time when most women eye the empty nest at the end of their branch on the family tree with something approaching relief, I gave consideration to laying just one more egg. Several months of discussions peppered with doubt and disbelief followed. Although Rog and I made the final decision, there's no denying that a big part of our decision to have a third child began with the insistence of our adolescent children that we "needed a baby in the house." Rog and I took a deep breath, looked at each other across the blond heads of those two wishful children, swallowed - and made a giant leap of faith.

I conceived my Spirit Baby a week later. Just for the joy of it.

(more at http://www.babycatcher.net/)

oh, my, i'm crying again just reading this. i had two miscarriages in a row, and the thought of the same spirit trying again... and again... to join my family, just makes me so happy and excited. it really feels like it's not just me making the decision... there's another soul involved, and somehow, it's got a choice in the matter too.

and oddly enough, "Joy" is a name we've considered since the first pregnancy...

katje


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

Katje,
That's it! I must have read it a million times. I read it to anyone who would listen and I cried every time.
Thanks for posting it here. I think every women who's experienced a m/c should read this...
Kate


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

And I love the name "joy."


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## Ellie'sMom (Aug 10, 2002)

Katje and Kate: Thank you so much for sharing that. It is _exactly_ what I needed to read this morning.

Crying, cutting and pasting,

Jenny


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## BBMom (Mar 9, 2002)

Christine...I also just lost my baby at 11wks (we had an vaginal US about two weeks prior and the heartbeat was excellent - I am still not comprehending what happened, why, etc). We decided on a D&C because I just could not deal with a natural MC - I am just not that strong...a personal thing I believe. It was hard enough to know I was pg but "not" for two days. It was horrible for me. It has been a week now and I go for my post-D&C checkup tomorrow. Last Tuesday when I found out I decided I would never try getting PG again...today I have changed my mind. I want to try. I have never had a MC before...I felt very alone and lost this entire week. I was not sure how to feel...to just get over it or what I should do (kinda what I was getting from my MIL - more like I need to move on already).

It's been a difficult week...I hope it gets easier.


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

I can't say how much I needed to read just that at this moment!
On wednesday I had a d&c, this was a loss at 9 1/2 weeks. All had been going well, we had seen a heartbeat at 6 1/2 weeks, blood levels had been great etc. I have to say we have found with this pregnancy the most wonderful OB ever. After the u/s on tuesday afternoon I got home that evening to a message from her asking me to call her at her home #. She told me there was no heartbeat, she offered me to allow it happen natually, induce it or have a d &c. I had my first m/c naturally and ended up in hospital with a very low blood pressure and in horrible pain, after that we had a chemical preg, then this one. For me I just couldn't bear to sit and wait again, also the aspect that she could have the tissues tested with the d&c. She suggested I have another u/s the next morning for my piece of mind and we did, she did the d&c that afternoon. All went well, bleeding and cramping was minimal--especially from some stories I've read.
Tonight however, the crying started again. I just am not sure my baby will come to me. We did everything right and we've lost 3. Meanwhile this afternoon while out, I saw a teenager, pregnant and chainsmoking. I'm guessing she didn't want to be pregnant and was certainly not "taking care of her unborn child" I was so angry, that she would abuse this privledge of being pregnant and I simply can't seem to stay pregnant despite taking every precaution and wanting this baby SO badly.
After reading that excerpt, I can visualize my little spirit baby, perhaps just waiting for things to be perfect. I wasn't convinced we'd try again, in spite of my wonderful OB assuring me it would happen for us. Now I know we have to and our baby will wait for us to be ready again.


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

Hi Shannon, I'm so glad you found comfort in this article -- I think it's an amazing and beautiful story. I hope you're doing better. I've been following in the Feb ottrta thread, but wanted to post here so you would know I was thinking about you. I hope your cycles become regular again right away.









Kate


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Thanks Kate, I don't think I'd be able to get by without these boards! At least not without strangling the next person who tells me it's "God's will" I just heard that one from my mother in law to which I replied "so is it also God's will that the 17 yr old crack head can get pregnant stay pregnant and carry on to abuse or endager her baby?" (not that this happens all the time--no flames please)
Anyway, I plan to have my dh read that story, but I don't think he's ready yet--he's still in a panic, last m/c we lost our young pup only a few days after and I reasoned she had to go to look after our baby--well wouldn't you know we just got another pup, also 11 mos old--he won't let her outside! She's going to be the most sheltered German Shepherd in history!


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## KateSt. (Nov 25, 2003)

Oh, I KNOW exactly what you mean about those "well-intentioned" comments from people you'd like to strangle. My favorite was "well, at least you know you CAN get pregnant," (which I heard more than once). I couldn't BELIEVE it!
All I know is my m/c has made me more empathetic to other peoples grief and I absolutely refuse to offer them platitudes.
All I say now is "I know there's nothing I can say to ease your pain." Someone said that to me and I found it poignant.

I can also relate to your bitterness towards others who take pregnancy for granted -- I still struggle with this from time to time. I know people who've abused their bodies and gotten pregnant without even trying and it makes me crazy! I just try to comfort myself by saying they have different lessons to learn in this life than I do and different difficulties...sometimes it helps.







:

Uggghhh.. I can't imagine a m/c AND losing your dog...








I'm glad you got another pup. I'm sure she's wonderful albeit overprotected.









I'd love to hear what your dh thinks of the article. I couldn't read it to anyone without crying...

Kate


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