# Anybody else uncomfortable with pre-birth sex determination?



## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

When I was pg with my first baby, all the layette depts of stores had newborn clothes in pink, blue, and yellow (sometimes green as well.) Some people were finding out the sex before birth, but not everybody. When I was pg with my 3rd,all I could find was pink and blue. I was going to buy both pink AND blue, and then return whichever ones I didn't need, but I ended up buying a ton of stuff at a garage sale and returning all of the "new in package" baby clothes I'd bought.

I felt like the only pregnant woman in the world who didn't find out the baby's sex ahead of time!

I just find it sad- it feels like some of the beauty of childbirth is lost because you don't find out the baby's sex at the time of birth. Now I'm hearing/reading all these "It's a girl!!' and "It's a boy!" announcements and the babies aren't even born yet. It just feels strange to me. Why celebrate that you had a medical procedure done?

With all the questions about ultrasound's safety, I'm surprised so many women are opting to get them done.


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## BeeandOwlsMum (Jul 11, 2002)

Well, I did fine out the sex of the baby.







I was going to have the 20 ultrasound anyway, for many an varied reasons. Given the fact that I might never get to be pregnant again (took IVF to get to this point), I decided that I wanted the reassurance of knowing evverything was okay and on track in there, and frankly, finding out the sex did not add time to the ultrasound.

I have no problem with people finding out in addition to a screening ultrasound. It does skeeve me out a little to have an ultrasound for no other reason than finding out the sex.

Now, the clothes thing....annoys the living crap out of me. EVERYTHING is pastelly pink or blue - you can find one dang primary color in the bunch. There are no gender neutral clothes that aren't green it seems.

So while ultrasound doesn't bother me in the way it bothers you, the need to makes babies look like easter eggs - gender assigned easter eggs - really does.


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## Evergreen (Nov 6, 2002)

I am so with Adina on this.

I am not planning on finding out this baby's gender, and clothes shopping sucks. I have no problem putting a girl in blue or a boy in pink, but I'd really like to find some nice aqua, green or even yellow outfits. They seem so few and far between. To make matters worse most of them actually say stuff on them like, "Daddy's Little Man" or "Princess Baby."


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## *guest (Oct 7, 2005)

You are right, ultrasound in itself is a can of worms. After a lot of thinking, we opted to have one screening to ensure that there were no major problems that would affect our planned homebirth. I clearly saw the between the legs shot and identified that it was a girl without the tech saying it, and that was a very special moment for us when I announced it. We got teary and felt like the whole world had just shifted. I don't think it will detract from the birth for us since I don't think anything can compare with seeing that face for the first time, but I also understand how people feel that there is something sacred in the mystery of waiting. I did get a feeling almost as if I wasn't supposed to be seeing her before she was done, but it doesn't keep me awake at night or anything.

I 100% agree on how irritating gendered clothing choices are. I'm sticking with neutrals like white and green and stripes, and you really have to search. We got completely disgusted that all the items for boys feature action, like sports and transportation equipment, and everything for girls is more passive and object-oriented - flowers, teddy bears. Bleah.


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## jayayenay (Sep 28, 2003)

We didn't find out the sex by ultrasound; we waited for birth. I thought maybe we'd find out for #2, but now having experienced the surprise in the moment, I will never do it any other way. One of my absolute favorite parts of my son's birth was calling out, "it's a boy!!" as soon as I saw his parts!









I agree on the clothes thing...not only are clothes pink, blue, yellow, or green, it's all pastel! Wtf is wrong with a nice red or royal purple? Or even dark green?







:


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## fallingstar (Jul 21, 2005)

We didn't learn our baby's gender until he was born, either, and I'm really glad! There's already enough pressure put on us all to conform to gender stereotypes without already forming those preconceptions before birth...

It was incredible to me how surprised everyone was that we didn't know yet, though. They acted like it was the most unusual thing, in an "oh how quaint; you're waiting to find out" sort of way. And we had a few relatives and friends annoyed with us for it, too. They wanted to know, and had an attitude of, "You ought to find out because we want to know," which is pretty ridiculous.

I wanted a surprise. I also think that it's part of what birth was/is to me, the mystery. Plus, I really believe that gender holds very little importance to what sort of person you will be, that many of those differences are socially enforced. So, obviously, what gender the baby was wasn't that important to me, and certainly not something that I'd need to find out ahead of time.

Right after he was born and I held him on my belly, I knew, for I'd hooked a hand under his rear and inadvertently felt the evidence. Heh. When they were asking my husband to look and say if it was a boy or a girl, I was whispering, "boy," with a little smile because I felt like for those first minutes it was my little secret. That's one of the memories of the birth that still makes me smile.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AdinaL*
So while ultrasound doesn't bother me in the way it bothers you, the need to makes babies look like easter eggs - gender assigned easter eggs - really does.

*laughing* Yes, that too!


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## edamommy (Apr 6, 2004)

:

I very much enjoyed knowing I was having a boy. I planned for a boy. bought for a boy. named the boy and talked to the actual boy... not just the "whatever" or the sexless "baby".

I celebrated SEEING him inside me. it was so real for my dh too. We didn't celebrate the medical intervention, but we sure appreciated it!

Actually, I'm annoyed by those who DON'T find out the sex!


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## Ruthla (Jun 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AdinaL*
Well, I did fine out the sex of the baby. I was going to have the 20 ultrasound anyway, for many an varied reasons. Given the fact that I might never get to be pregnant again (took IVF to get to this point), I decided that I wanted the reassurance of knowing evverything was okay and on track in there, and frankly, finding out the sex did not add time to the ultrasound.

I have no problem with people finding out in addition to a screening ultrasound. It does skeeve me out a little to have an ultrasound for no other reason than finding out the sex.

ITA!! I've also known couples who found out the baby's sex ahead of time but didn't share that info with anybody until after the baby was born.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *edamommy*







:

I very much enjoyed knowing I was having a boy. I planned for a boy. bought for a boy. named the boy and talked to the actual boy... not just the "whatever" or the sexless "baby".

I celebrated SEEING him inside me. it was so real for my dh too. We didn't celebrate the medical intervention, but we sure appreciated it!

Actually, I'm annoyed by those who DON'T find out the sex!









This is the kind of attitude I don't understand. My babies were always "my baby," not a "sexless whatever." Not knowing if the baby had a penis or a vulva didn't change that, or make the child any less "real."

I understand that you had a positive experience with knowing you were expecting a boy. Can you explain why you're annoyed by those who don't find out the sex?


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## dlm194 (Mar 23, 2005)

Quote:

Actually, I'm annoyed by those who DON'T find out the sex!
I found that people took this attitute with me since I didn't find out the sex. I don't get it!

I had no desire to find out the sex. I was so looking forward to the surprise of someone calling out "It's a boy" or "It's a girl!" I don't understand why people would act annoyed or whatever when I said that I didn't find out the sex. I don't care if people find out the sex but I find it almost unnatural to know the sex of your baby before birth!


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## KKmama (Dec 6, 2001)

The thing that really bothers me is the clothing... I just don't like the pink and blue. I think gender identity is a big, big, BIG thing for adults, though, and that's why it's so important to so many people, it seems, to be able to tell the gender of babies (because honestly, without some visual cues like the insipid blue or pink clothes, you wouldn't be able to tell). I understand that people get excited, that knowing the gender and coming up with a name can help with bonding, but I think it can go too far.

Most of our newborn stuff is deliberately gender neutral (because we didn't tell people the gender with either of our boys). It's been fun unpacking it, knowing that #3 still gets to wear them, even though #3 is a girl.

I'm not sure how much of the less gender neutral stuff (mostly bigger sizes) we'll use on this 3rd baby... there's a very cute stretch suit with fire trucks on it which was given to us when #2 was a newborn, but he was so big that he only wore it once. She's definitely going to wear the hand-me-down winter coats (mostly navy blue or primary colors). I am *not* buying another set of winter coats just so she can look girly.


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## hannahmom (Mar 5, 2004)

We didn't find out either and I felt like it gave me some extra motivation through a loooong labor and nearly 4 hrs of pushing









I don't have a problem with people finding out. But I love the mystery. And it irks the heck out of my friends and family who are dying to buy pastel pink or blue *gag*


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## edamommy (Apr 6, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ruthla*
ITA!! I've also known couples who found out the baby's sex ahead of time but didn't share that info with anybody until after the baby was born.

This is the kind of attitude I don't understand. My babies were always "my baby," not a "sexless whatever." Not knowing if the baby had a penis or a vulva didn't change that, or make the child any less "real."

I understand that you had a positive experience with knowing you were expecting a boy. Can you explain why you're annoyed by those who don't find out the sex?

*It just bugs me. Especially those who DO GET THE ULTRA SOUND but just don't want to be told the sex?!?! It's a surprise enough to have a baby- no doubt ... don't you think? I LOVE shopping and not knowing exactly WHO I'm shopping for just bugs me! Of course, I revelled in the sea of baby blue that was my house during those months!







It's just my opinion. If I couldn't find out the sex I would surely go crazy!


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## Samjm (Mar 12, 2005)

We did not ind out the gender before birth despite having many many ultrasounds (I'm high risk). There were a couple of times when I almost caved and asked them to look.

We didn't want to know before birth for many reasons. We didn't want our baby to already be socialized before she / he was born. We didn't want all pink or all blue clothes, we wanted the surpise of it, we feel it is one of the great mysteries still left to us.

I'm very glad we didn't find out. We asked the delivery staff not to announce the gender. When DD was born, she lay on my chest for a few moments before DH and I looked together. We said "It's a girl" in unison. We were the first to know. It was very special.

We did get some grief from people during the pregnancy. People just didn't understand why we didn't want to know. I even had some people asking me for my Drs phone number so they could find out for themselves.

When we have #2, DH doesn't want to find out the gender again. I'm not sure, I think it might make it more real for DD if we can say the baby is her brother or her sister instead of "just" a baby.


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## Kewpie (Sep 21, 2004)

We didn't find out the gender of DD before she was born. I was planning on (and had) a natural childbirth, I wanted that anticpiation at the end to keep on pushing!









For awhile I assumed we'd find out the gender for our future babies, but then both of my SILs were PG at the same time. One found out the gender, the other didn't. I was WAY more excited about the birth of the SIL who opted not to find out the gender. I'm sure if it's your own child, it's different, but we won't find out the gender of any future babies.

There are so few true surprises in life, this is one of the best ones! Not to mention I know of at least a half dozen cases where the gender was wrong.


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## Blue Dragonfly (Jun 19, 2005)

I don't even get ultrasounds - there's really not a lot that can be done even if there is something wrong (I'm definetly operating on faith here), and I wouldn't abort even if there was something wrong (although I may have made a different choice earlier, or later for that matter, in my life.)

As for the sex, with my ds, both my dh and I were absolutely convinced we had a girl coming. Totally. It was soooo cool when I moved the cord and suddenly, our whole mindset had to switch - Hi Gabriel!! All our preconcieved notions of how our lives would be were changed. It was great. It really helped us to see our child as the induvidual he is rather than trying to fit who he is into an idea we had.

I like the excitement and possiblity that exists when you don't know. It makes the present of a child even more surprising and exciting for me.

To me, finding out the sex before the baby is born is like peeking under the wrapping paper of your big birthday present.


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## KittyKat (Nov 17, 2002)

I have done both, found out with my first 3, and did not with any since then.

The moment when I held my slippery newborn baby after #4 was born, and looked down into those dark bright eyes, so completely in love! Then I realized, hey I don't know if this person who just stole my heart is a boy or a girl... looked and, my dream had been right, ALL boy!

It was one of THE MOST amazing wonderful moments of my life ever.

So now I don't want to find out ahead of time.

I already had a dream this pregnancy that I gave birth to a baby with a head full of dark hair, lifted the sweet warm little bundle to my chest, and oh, yeah... looked to see the gender, GIRL parts!

I'm sorry, but as much as I enjoyed having the U/S with previous pregnancies, it doesn't even come CLOSE to how great it is to find out at birth, with all those lovely birth endorphins rushing through your system and making everything even more intense. Not to mention ultrasounds are not 100% accurate. My sister was told her third was a boy. Her in-laws went all out throwing her another baby shower, buying all this pastel blue stuff... my third NIECE has long dark hair and looks just like her mommy did as a baby.

And the concept that my precious "rainbow baby" who I treasure deeply is just some "nameless sexless" being that I am not "bonding" properly with because I haven't had an ultrasound, that's fairly insulting.
How did women manage to "bond" with their babies before we had all this technology to make sure it happened? Really!

Kathryn


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## Guest* (Aug 5, 2004)

I don't do ultrasounds and didn't find out the sex with my dd and we won't find out this time either. I like seeing my actual baby, and not a blurry image and discovering for myself it's sex.

I don't care if people find out either. If it's that important, go ahead, but like Adina, I don't understand having an ultrasound for the sole reason of determining the sex.

I just buy a few neutral items of newborn clothing to get use through a couple weeks, then go shopping later. That worked well for us last time and we'll do that again.


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## jayayenay (Sep 28, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rebeccamaryll*
I like the excitement and possiblity that exists when you don't know. It makes the present of a child even more surprising and exciting for me.

To me, finding out the sex before the baby is born is like peeking under the wrapping paper of your big birthday present.









:


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## riversong (Aug 11, 2005)

We didn't find out the sex of our baby until she was born and it was truly the best surprise of my life. Especially because everyone had told me they just knew it would be a boy. Finding out her sex was one of my favorite memories of her birth.

I loved being able to think about and talk to my little baby while it was inside of me without knowing the sex. I figured it was the only time in its life when it wasn't going to be defined by everyone's preconceived notions of what a girl or boy should be like.


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## TortelliniMama (Mar 11, 2004)

I don't see anything wrong with not finding out, but to us, it just would feel artificial to have the information available (our decision to have the u/s wasn't based on wanting to know the sex) and refuse to know. I agree with everyone who said that gender's not that important, and that's part of why I don't view it as a big surprise that should be saved until birth. I'm much more interested in the surprise of getting to know my kids as people, and that's not going to happen until I meet them anyway.









But like I said, if other people experience learning the sex differently, then I think it's great to wait until birth. Just because some people like to eat their frosting as they eat the cake doesn't mean that those who save all the frosting till the end are wrong!


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## TurboClaudia (Nov 18, 2003)

the pastel easter-egg, pink-or-blue clothing bothers me, too. hanna andersson all the way, baby! from the secondhand store, of course... unless the grandparents are buying it.









i think what bugs me most about the idea of finding out the sex of a baby in utero is the idea that somehow "seeing equals truth". i had this amazingly intellectually sexy, older, gay man college professor who actually did a research project about the development of the department store in paris in the 1800s and how that related to the cultural idea that all things that can be seen must be true. but just because it's a cultural idea doesn't mean that seeing is the only way of knowing, just that this "truth" has been the predominant way of thinking for a century-plus. seriously, this professor was fascinating.

and i can respect people making informed choices about having or not having ultrasounds for medical and health screening purposes, but i do have a harder time understanding those who would have an ultrasound exclusively for the purpose of finding out the sex of a baby.









~claudia


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## cuqui (Apr 14, 2004)

I did not find out with any of my 3 pregnancies. With #2 I was high risk and had a least 4 u/s (3 very short ones and the one long one at 21 wks that discovered my non-exsistant cervix and put me in the hospital for 10 wks. I had 2 girls and I still did not find out what #3 was until he was born. I would never trade that moment for anything in the world! All 3 times, when you look down and see you baby, just wonderful. With #2, it was probably 5 minutes before we even decided to look. With #3, my dds (7yrs & 5yrs) got to announce the gender of their sibling, they will never forget that experience. Do you think they would have remembered if I had told them upon coming home from a midwife visit (actually they attended most with me), besides they had so much fun with the anticipation.

About the clothes, I love to shop. I got organic cotton kimonos and sleepers in natural from Under the Nile, Ecobaby, and Gaiam. Within 2 days of his birth and a few clicks of the mouse viola! he had a few blue outfits, no biggy. How much clothing does a newborn need anyway?

I don't think anyone got annoyed with me for not finding out, or at least they didn't act annoyed.


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## ChattyCat (Sep 7, 2004)

It's a fantastic surprise no matter when you find out.









I don't really get having a non-medical u/s, but if you're having one (or tons of them) done anyway, why not? Granted, I totally respect people who choose not to find out, as many of my friends have done.

For me, knowing what the baby is allows dh and I to focus in on a name for our baby. Both of us seem to have trouble bonding until our kids have names. I know lots of people pick out two names, but for us it just doesn't seem to work.

As for baby clothes, I'm totally sick of the easter egg colors, too! Seriously, what is wrong with a little vibrancy to their clothes? Babies see bright colors better anyway. UGH!

And, people will probably tell you that you have a lovely girl anyway, when your child is dressed in all blue with trucks and puppies all over their clothes. And, vice versa.


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## celestialdreamer (Nov 18, 2004)

We chose to have a 20 week u/s with this baby, not specifically to find out the baby's sex, but to give us some reassurance that everything looked normal and it was ok to continue planning a HB. I know some people probably think thats weird, but I needed it for my own reasons. I figured while we were already looking, we might as well find out, since we had also known that our first baby was a girl. I do feel that when I found out the sex of each of my child it made them more 'real' to me...maybe I'm screwy or something then







If we have a third child, I don't plan on having an u/s and if for some reason I truly needed one, I don't think I'd want to find out the sex. Part of me wishes I still got to have that surprise this time, but part of me is glad to know that my instincts were right and to plan for our little boy.

I definitely hate that pretty much everything you can buy for NBs is all gender oriented. I really prefer to have some gender neutral stuff too. I really hate that SO many of the little baby clothes I've seen have sports stuff on them...we don't care for sports at all here really! And why do only girls get kitties and boys get doggies on their clothes? My dd likes both cats and dogs!


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## honeybee (Mar 12, 2004)

We decided not to find out the sex of ds, and we're doing the same this time around. Actually, when we tell most people that we're going to be surprised, they usually respond positively. However, nobody seems to understand NOT getting an u/s at all. Why do they bother having professional organizations like ACOG (which does not recommend routine u/s for low-risk women) if the docs don't listen to the recommendations? (Same goes for bf and peds).

Finding out ds's sex at his birth was such a great moment. Dh was sure we were having a girl. The doc said "it's a boy!" and dh laughed and said "I was wrong!" while he was laughing with a big grin on his face.

However, whether you know the sex or not, I do not understand this obsession with blue and pink. Ugggh! There are LOTS of other colors out there, so why don't they come on baby clothes?


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## hipem (Jul 13, 2005)

With dd we had a "just to be sure everything is ok" u/s but did not find out the gender. With ds, we had a "less to be sure and more to find out gender" u/s







: Of course, they said my placenta looked "low" (at 20 weeks) and my birth center (then homebirth midwife) had me get two more! And of course, in the end, everything was fine. When you know better, you do better...no u/s next time!

And as much as I loved calling him by name when he was in my belly, I truly adore the memory of lifting her leg and finding out for myself - SO worth the wait!

ITA about the whole newborn clothes thing...gack.


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## liseux (Jul 3, 2004)

"I have no problem with people finding out in addition to a screening ultrasound. It does skeeve me out a little to have an ultrasound for no other reason than finding out the sex." AdinaL








:

I have done both also, my first 2 I didn`t find out, I experienced the excitement of finding out at the birth. With my 3rd, I had become high risk so my dh and I thought it would be neat to know so we could picture a boy or girl baby, esp. since it was a subsequent pregnancy after a loss. That made sense to me then, but now I`m thinking about waiting again, all these posts about waiting are making me rethink finding out. Yet, its a surprise no matter when in a way.


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## BeeandOwlsMum (Jul 11, 2002)

I think that if I do manage to get pregnant again, I will put off finding out.

But yeah, it was a HUGE surprise at the u/s for me!







I was convinced that we were having a boy. I was wrong!! In some ways, I was oddly dissappointed, and kind of glad to have some time to adjust.







It didn't make any sense to me at all.







But, yeah, I was surprised, and giddy for the whole rest of the week!


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## MotheringHeart (Dec 18, 2005)

This is so funny because DH NEVER wanted to find out with any of ours, but I was always whiny about it. (We had standard 20 week ultrasounds because I believe they are a useful screening tool and I wanted it to be comfortable with a homebirth.) I would whine the whole time about not finding out, but the truth is, I LOVE that moment when the baby comes out and you are finding out the gender of the child. When DS was born, DH was standing right next to me and yelled in my ear "it's a boy!" It was hilarious. Then when DD#2 was born, I really wanted a girl and so I was shaking from just pushing her out and the midwife handed her to me and I looked between her legs. It was amazing. I wouldn't trade it for anything. And the next time we get pregnant, I'm not going to whine about not knowing at all. It is the BEST surprise.

And as for not *knowing* the baby just because you don't know the gender, that is malarky. I dreamed all my children and saw them, as they are now, in my dreams. And I know that my dreams were true because I didn't know beforehand. I was connected to my babies from the moment they were concieved and I knew them before they ever took their first breath.


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## crunchy_mama (Oct 11, 2004)

We found out with our first (and only so far) I really don't think that helped bonding in anyway though. Next time I would prefer to wait, but don't know if I can convince dh.


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## FitMama (Jul 20, 2003)

I choose *not* to find out the gender in advance. Everyone around me (including DH) dislikes it. They say thing like "It makes planning so much easier!" My infants do all the same things, no matter what their gender: nurse, sleep, pee, poo. Why do I need to know if it is a boy or girl?

Plus, it's my way of sticking it to everyone around me. I love getting my way heh heh heh.


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## MidwifeErika (Jun 30, 2005)

With my first child I did believe that finding out the gender would help me bond with her better. I found out and it was just kind of like "oh, that is nice" on our end. Even though we wanted a girl! It really took the wind out of our sails without us realizing it. I can't explain it really. Once we knew and told people, then everyone started assigning her a name and personality, which really drove me nuts! There was so much more pressure on us to have a name picked and for us to have typical "girl" stuff all over the place. yuck.

With our second child, we didn't find out because we didn't do any ultrasounds and it seemed silly to submit to a test just to find out something that we would find out in just a few months time. I bonded just fine with that baby. I was pretty sure it was a little boy who had been trying to come to me for months (I had a m/c 6 months before becoming pg again and I really felt it was still him). I was completely in love with this child and could care less if a girl or boy because it was MY child. And then Owen was born. There could never be a moment as great as when my husband looked between our child's legs, and shrieked "it's a boy!" in the most giddy voice I have EVER heard out of this man. I know it would have been the same giddiness if it had been a girl too. It was just the build up was so great and the fact that in this homebirth, he was the very first to know and no one else told him about his own child. My husband doesn't get giddy or emotional (we joke that he is "dead inside" like Chandler on Friends), so to hear him so excited like a kid at Christmas... well worth the wait.

I am not finding out this time either. We have fun joking about what gender the baby is and talking about different names without any comitment and dreaming about this child who is going to be absolutely amazing no matter if a boy or a girl. We have fun explaining to our daughter that it might be a boy or a girl and it is just a surprise that we will see this summer. She changes her mind every week on what gender the babe is and what we should name him/her. I am enjoying floating through without pressure from people about naming too. We don't believe in naming our kids before they are born (we have lists of favorites, but I just can't name someone who I have never looked at face-to-face) and without knowing, it gives us a great excuse to not even discuss names with people. Last pregnancy we got more pressure from people to find out the gender, but not anymore.... I think they found out how much fun it was getting a phonecall saying "baby is born and healthy and a ....., and the name is...." More exciting than "baby John is here now" IMO.


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## 2Sweeties1Angel (Jan 30, 2006)

I'm really anal about some things and finding out my baby's gender is one of them. I don't know why because it shouldn't really matter, but it does to me. I like to plan and shop, and I hate most of the gender neutral clothes. I'll admit that I loved shopping for pretty little pink things for DD







: I found out that the twins were boys a little before 20 weeks, but I didn't find out DD's gender until about a month before I had her because she wouldn't open her legs. I didn't have any U/S just to determine gender, but I was tempted--didn't do it because of potential risks and because I hate holding my bladder for that long while somebody pushes on my stomach.


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## chumani (Apr 12, 2002)

With my first four we didn't have any u/s. We got a lot of "how do you prepare?'" questions. With #5 I ended up with an u/s as I had an accident at 20weeks that caused part of the placenta to abrupt. The tech was checking blood flow in the placenta and then w/out asking he checked gender and said "you have a girl" I was very upset as with all our other babies I was the first to announce the gender. It changed how I viewed my pregnancy, not in a bad way just different. We will definitely not be finding out with this baby. I really missed the moment when I should have been able to tell everyone. Her birth was amazing though and the look in her eyes after she was born was so beautiful it didn't matter when I knew she was a girl just that she was born safely in the best way for us.

As far as baby clothes, I make 90% of my childrens clothing so we have a lot of funky clothes in our house as they pick the fabric themselves. I have had a ton of people ask where I get my babies/childrens clothes and have even started making custom clothing for others. I enjoy seeing my babies in the little kimonos and gowns I make.

I understand some have a "need to know" I am just not one of them.

Best wishes!
Sarah


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## ABand3 (May 21, 2005)

I'm in the 'no peeking' camp - didn't want to know ahead of time, and during the one ultrasound I had I told the tech over and over NOT to tell me or let me see.

Discovering and announcing the sex of the baby myself at birth was to me one of the most memorable and spiritual moments; it was one of the few things I put in my birth plans for my 2nd and 3rd.

I got a lot a grief from friends and family, especially during pg #3, becuase the first two were boys and some people were hoping for a girl. I'm not big into shopping, and wasn't about to find out the sex just to fuel some peoples' need to shop







:


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## Undercover Hippie (Sep 7, 2004)

I guess I am a little different than some of the PPs. I did not find out the gender of baby #1 but did find out with baby #2. I loved knowing. I don't know why, but I did and it's just the way I am. The pregnancies and births were just as magical whether I knew or didn't. The moment of learning their genders and realizing that I had a son/daughter was just as amazing and just as emotional whether it happened at 42 weeks or 20 weeks. (Actually, it was almost more amazing when I found out earlier because there was the emotional moment of the u/s, and then another emotional moment at the birth when I saw that she really was a girl.) And the precious first moments when I met my babe were awe-inspiring and holy each time.

For me, since it did not detract from the experience and in some ways made it richer, than I'd choose to know again. But we are all different. No reason to judge.


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## mamaverdi (Apr 5, 2005)

Next time, I will probably find out the gender since ds2's issues run in boys only. I actually feel sad about finding out the gender ahead of time. What irks me way more than clothes is people calling their belly babies by the chosen name. It makes me feel ill.

mv


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## 2Sweeties1Angel (Jan 30, 2006)

*What irks me way more than clothes is people calling their belly babies by the chosen name. It makes me feel ill.*

Why? I think it's better to call the baby by it's name if you have one picked out. That way you're not referring to it as "it" or "the baby". It seems more personal. Then again, names are another thing I'm anal about. I already have all of my future children named and I'm not even pregnant again yet.


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## mamaverdi (Apr 5, 2005)

Well, several reasons really. Mostly, superstition.


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## turtlemama77 (Jul 29, 2005)

We didn't find out ahead of time for dd#1, and won't be finding out this time either. I have to say though, for some reason, I have more of an urge to find out this time than I did last time. The biggest thing holding me back is that it drives people crazy that we won't find out.









Seriously though, the surprise at the end of a hard labor last time was amazing. I'd had a feeling for about the last two weeks of my pregnancy that I was having a girl, so it was pretty cool when she turned out to be a she! Plus, the majority of the clothing we'd been given was neutral colors, so we have a nice stock of 0-6 month clothes for new little baby come July.

I would love to find some little baby clothes that are NOT pastel.


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## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

I don't care either way. Both times, I have had an immense feeling, and I trust my judgment more than anything. I found out last time just to see if I was right or not, but really there was no doubt for me. If I have an ultrasound, I will find out again, but I wouldn't have an ultrasound for that reason. It really bothers me when people act as if the u/s is foolproof. I know people that go out, paint their nurseries pink or blue, buy all one gender clothes, etc, etc, when the ultrasound can be wrong, and it has happened to several people I know.


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## mahogny (Oct 16, 2003)

I found out with my first, a boy, but was unable to find out with my second, a girl. We tried to with her, but she didn't cooperate.

I LOVED LOVED LOVED knowing the gender beforehand. That's why I attempted to do it again! I loved calling my baby by his name, I loved using the correct pronoun, I just loved looking at little boy stuff. I loved planning for a boy.

When I couldn't find out with my second, I really felt something lacking. I didn't enjoy gender-neutral. I didn't enjoy picking out two names. I didn't enjoy not knowing. I didn't enjoy the ambiguity I felt. I know some people love the moment of birth gender announcement, but that wasn't for me.

To each her own.


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## Past_VNE (Dec 13, 2003)

The ultrasound was wrong for my neighbors. The boy that I worried so much would be circumcised was "It's a Girl!!" a few weeks ago, the sign perched across their door.

------

We didn't find out about Jett until we peeked down, him laying on my chest, all warm and wet in the blow-up kiddie pool in our dining room. It was a delightful moment. Despite learning later that he had craniosynostosis, a possibly genetic (98% are flukes, 2% are genetic) and primarily male congenital disorder, we will not have an ultrasound for the next child, either. Cranio, in the medical world, is a forced Cesarean because the child has one or more fused joints in the skull and the skull cannot overlap to ease birth. Conventional "wisdom" says that cranio babies must not go through labor. Well, he was my first baby and we had a 12 hour labor, mostly quite pleasant, though I did push for almost four hours.

*Oh, and as a side note, despite the potential for another problem, we feel that it is okay to try for another baby since Jett's surgery was so quick (57 min.) and relatively easy (out of the hospital 18 hours later with no apparent pain by two days later.) Post surgery and helmet therapy (one year) it won't affect him in any way. <---Just in case you wondered.


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## Earth Angel (Dec 13, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamaverdi*
Well, several reasons really. Mostly, superstition.

I'm with you , but I wouldn't describe it as superstition. Many cultures feel that the baby is not here until it is HERE KWIM? Yes, the spirit may be with the mamma, but the baby's physical body isn't here until it is HERE. I don't think this takes away from bonding, but helps to honor the ture miracle that birthing a baby is. All of these cosmic things must come together to get the baby here safely and for mamma to birth him or her safely. I think some honor is taken away from that when we go in for a medcial procedure to see who is in there.

I do understand ultrasound as the tool it is, but for "seeing who is in there", that isn't OK in my mind....but everyone must make the choice for themselves, and I want to make sure I say, that whoever makes whatever choice for themselves its A OK with me







The above has just been MY philosophy for my 2 pregnancies.


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## loudmama (Mar 12, 2005)

For DD, we didn't even have an ultrasound. When 20 weeks came, we asked if we needed it. The MW said "no." So we didn't do it. Didn't want to find out the sex anyway. It was REALLY special when DD was born via c-section for DH to announce we had a -----, by her name. It was one of the few things saved from our birth plan.

For this pregnancy, I only wanted an ultrasound to find out where the placenta was. I just wanted to make sure it was in the right place, because if there were signs of previa, I needed to mentally prepare myself for another surgical birth. We made it very clear to the tech that we didn't want to know what we were having.

L


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## MamaDance (Oct 31, 2005)

I had alot of U/S's and managed not to know the gender, we didnt want to find out! You would be surprised how many techs are like "you dont want to know?"
It was amazing finding out that my DD was exactly like she was in my dreams, just amazing!

My family and friends did not even know I went into labor, so to call them and say "Hey Aunt, you have a new neice" and hear them scream and laugh was an awesome experience!!

Worth every second of not knowing the sex. I have alway known my baby, I dont need to know the gender to make me know them any better.

But I am glad it is there, i think it helps alot of people really get to know their baby. Some people are more visual than others, they need visual proof to make it more "real" and that is ok. Plus I think it helps DPs get in on the action lol


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

I found out gender, because I would have been disappointed if I was having a boy, and I needed time to adjust.

I would find out the gender again. I don't do pink or blue clothing, or any of that traditional gender crap, but knowing the baby's gender made her more real for me. I would want to know if I was having a son or daughter. Those nine plus months of waiting were hard. It's nice to get some information.


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## hubris (Mar 8, 2003)

As much as I hate it when people wave the "personal preferences" flag for many parenting decisions, I'm gonna have to say that this is one area that I truly do think is all about personal preference.

I've done it both ways. With Griff, we didn't find out until he was born. With Reese, we found out during a routine ultrasound. Both ways were amazing in their own way. Both ways were perfect for us in that time and place. I honestly can't say that one was better or worse than the other. Neither boy was a "sexless whatever," both were little people that I was eager to meet.

Now, the clothes - THAT does annoy the dickens out of me. So much blue and pink, and very few other choices. Even if you know that your baby is a boy or a girl, maybe you don't want just pink or blue. Maybe you'd like some lime green, or a nice eggplant. Or just something without ducks on it.


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## Past_VNE (Dec 13, 2003)

It's not even just the clothes. The daggone strollers and car seats and sunshades and and and and do they still sell girl/boy sposies?

I am female. I don't drive a pink car. I drive a blue car and a green truck, both have grey interiors. If I had a daughter, why the f*(^ would I get a pink car seat? I don't even like pink. I have a son. I didn't get a race car carseat, or one with some other, you name it, sex-based pattern. I got black, because it matches both cars' interiors and hides any and all stains well.

There are, certainly, lots of gender-free carseats. But, I saw one a few days ago in that "We Don't Know the Sex of our Baby" green. I would guess that was DEFINITELY the target group, not just folks who happen to like that shade of green. Ick.


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## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

Really?

It must vary by where you live because I have only ever seen strollers in browns, blues, greens, etc. I've never seen gendered car seats or strollers. That is bizarre. What about if you want to reuse for the next kid or give to a friend or something?


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## Past_VNE (Dec 13, 2003)

Really!

Boyish Stuff:
Britax Raceway Print

Girly Stuff:
Britax Ashley Print
Britax Olivia Print
Britax Aloha Print
Britax Tiffany Print
Graco MetroLite LX Lindsey Stroller

The Stereotypical Gender Neutral Green:
Graco Sunny Safari
Graco Clover System
I can't find a link, but I also saw a seat in that GenNeut green, a toile pattern.

I don't mean to pick on Britax excessively. They just have the widest selection of patterns, girl/boy/neither. And, they're the ones I'm most familiar with, since we have a Marathon and are ordering another, a Boulevard.

There are nothing wrong with these patterns, colors, per se. It's the way they're targeted and the intentions that bother me. But, it's not like I'm running around critiquing people. It's just my opinion.


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## Past_VNE (Dec 13, 2003)

Oh, and since the boy is sleeping on my lap and I can't budge....

More pink strollers

In my eyes, the blue stuff is totally boy/girl, but I think it is targeted to moms of boys, just the impression I get.

Blue strollers


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## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

Oh man those are awful! I have honestly never seena pink car seat or stroller before. It is so bizarre. All the ones I've seen are pretty inconspicuous to go with all different car interiors, etc.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

I live near Lissa, and same here! I've never seen a pink or blue car seat or stroller either. Bizarre.


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## Lousli (Nov 4, 2003)

Interesting thread. I was dying to know, both times, as early as possible. With my first, we found out at the 20 week u/s. With dd#2, we had an amnio and found out then at 15 weeks. My older daughter was excited to find out that she would be having a little sister, and she even helped name her. It was really cute to hear her talking about her baby Hazel. I don't understand the superstition of not naming the baby or calling the belly by name. To me, as soon as we found out her gender, she was Hazel, and even if something had happened and we had lost her, she still would have been Hazel. I wouldn't have changed her name if she had been born still.


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## jennlindsey (Nov 5, 2005)

We aren't finding out, and it's been interesting! I'm amazed at how automatically people ask, "So what are you having?" (Umm ... a baby?) We are definitely in the minority, it seems.

We actually did have an ultrasound, for medical reasons, and had a funny moment where, when I told the tech that I "couldn't see" (I'm nearsighted and had trouble viewing the monitor), she automatically assumed that I couldn't tell the sex and wanted to, so started fishin' around -- thankfully DP was quick enough to say, "No, don't go there, we don't want to know!"

Interestingly, we also have a medical reason for potentially wanting to know the sex (I'm a hemophilia carrier), and we still decided not to find out. If I found out the baby were a boy, I think I would automatically shift into needless "high risk" anxiety mode, and I don't think that's helpful (we *are* meeting with a hematologist to discuss the issues that might come up if we have a son and he has the disorder, so we aren't in denial either).

Every once in a while I wish I had found out, just out of curiosity, but I'm looking forward to the surprise. The clothing/stroller/everything gender-assigned thing, however, drives me NUTS. It seems like only the spendier retailers offer gender-neutral, too.


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## Doodlebugsmom (Aug 1, 2002)

I'm just having trouble understanding why anyone would care if people do/do not find out the sex of their babies!







As long as they aren't getting risky tests just for that purpose, I really don't see why it matters. Whatever happened to "To each their own"?


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## wannabe (Jul 4, 2005)

It seems to be very cultural.

In Australia it's not uncommon to not find out what the baby will be - and it's more accepted than in America.

I found out, and loved knowing, but a friend of mine who hasn't found out (baby not born yet) and another who kept it a secret didn't cop any grief for their choice.

The no gender neutral stuff - or even anything that's not pink or blue drives me insane, too. what if you don't LIKE pink or blue? What about yellow or green or purple or orange?


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## dlm194 (Mar 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wannabe*
It seems to be very cultural.

In Australia it's not uncommon to not find out what the baby will be - and it's more accepted than in America.

In my experience, it's pretty common to find out the baby's sex ahead of time herein the US. Maybe it's regional in the US? None of my friends from childhood and no one in my family seems to find out ahead of time. But I live in a different state now and EVERYONE that I have met here finds out.

Going back to a point made on page 1.... I had a u/s at 20 weeks for the sole purpose of checking on the baby and ensuring everything was okay (or, heaven forbid, preparing ourselves for the worst). I didn't view that u/s as the "sex-finding" u/s. I didn't want to know but the fact was that I had a shy baby who didn't reveal the goods (or so the technician said but maybe she was just saying that!). I could not, in a million years, imagine asking for another u/s just to find out the sex! I wouldn't expose my child to any more u/s waves than I felt necessary!


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## eleven (Aug 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *momma2emerson*
It's a fantastic surprise no matter when you find out.









Exactly! It was huge surprise and I remember bursting into tears at dd's 20 week ultrasound. (I was convinced it was a boy - great maternal intuition there!







)

I'm really glad that we found out beforehand and I was able to truly enjoy the moment. I was delirious and in and out of consciousness during and after my cesarean following 2 days of labor. I barely cared that I had had a baby at that point - the gender would have been completely meaningless to me.

(Am I the only one who prefers pastels to primary colors?







: H&M has great beiges and browns and wonderful gender neutral earthy tones. Yum!)


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## bratmobile (Jun 30, 2004)

For me pregnancy is a sacred time since it is the ONLY time in my child's life that they live without the burdens and assumptions that surround sex and gender. The english language is kind of weird in that we have to say, "they" or "it" and that you can't even talk about a person without using a gendered pronoun. That part is a bit akward I suppose for people. I really just enjoy that my baby is just a person now and not a boy or girl. They will not ever have that again.

Its just annoying that even newborns get spoken to and talked about differently based on their sex, like "oh what a pretty girl" and "oh what a strong little guy." Last time I had a boy and it didn't take long before people started talking about how big or strong he was, (he was pretty dang chunky







) and how he was a "little linebacker" etc. Maybe he'll be a ballerina for crying out loud! I want him to decide what colors he likes and what sports/activities he likes and who he wants to love! I see so many heavy implications that go along with sex/gender I am just delighted to put it off for as long as I can and let my baby be free of it all.


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## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

I didn't find out with dd and it was the best surprise of my life, I don't ever want to know with any of my dc. My original reason was because of the risk of being told one sex when it was really another. My first birth I ever watched in nursing school, was a young mama who had many U/S that told her she was having a girl, well out came a beautiful baby boy. This poor mom was completely overwhelmed, she just sat there and cried about her baby girl, I swore right then that I'd never find out the sex. And I wouldn't have it any other way, but whatever floats your boat.


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## miranda (Mar 8, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Evergreen*
To make matters worse most of them actually say stuff on them like, "Daddy's Little Man" or "Princess Baby."

Isn't that ridiculous? I can't stand those things.

We didn't find out the sex until birth with either of our dds. I had an sonogram at 41 1/2 weeks with dd #2 to check the AFI. Should I be so lucky as to be pregnant again, we wont find out the sex until birth. It's such a cool moment. I wouldn't want to give it up.


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## Guest* (Aug 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bratmobile*
For me pregnancy is a sacred time since it is the ONLY time in my child's life that they live without the burdens and assumptions that surround sex and gender. The english language is kind of weird in that we have to say, "they" or "it" and that you can't even talk about a person without using a gendered pronoun. That part is a bit akward I suppose for people. I really just enjoy that my baby is just a person now and not a boy or girl. They will not ever have that again.

Its just annoying that even newborns get spoken to and talked about differently based on their sex, like "oh what a pretty girl" and "oh what a strong little guy." Last time I had a boy and it didn't take long before people started talking about how big or strong he was, (he was pretty dang chunky







) and how he was a "little linebacker" etc. Maybe he'll be a ballerina for crying out loud! I want him to decide what colors he likes and what sports/activities he likes and who he wants to love! I see so many heavy implications that go along with sex/gender I am just delighted to put it off for as long as I can and let my baby be free of it all.









You articulated this so well. What a refreshing take on this debate (although, I can't believe it's actually a debate!







)


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## myhoneyswife (Apr 30, 2005)

We're not finding out, though I'd love to! We're not doing an ultrasound. I always say that we're not doing an ultrasound unless it becomes medically necessary, but I am having a hard time thinking of a reason that it would be medically necessary... Bummer, cuz I'd like to know







Maybe an accident and placental abruption, but I don't want to know that bad...









I personally really like yellow and there are tons of cute newborn yellow or crème things. I like that







I got 2 sleep sacks in yellow and white with duckies on them that I can't wait to dress 'the grape' in. The grape is our nick name for the baby, and I think it's cool that the baby can already have a nick name. But it was kinda neat for my sister-in-law to be able to call her baby by her name while in utero.

Car


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## Peppamint (Oct 19, 2002)

I understand what you mean (the op). We found out the first two times, dh really wanted to so I just went along. We were very surprised to find out dd was a girl but I *knew* ds was a boy.

This time, I just don't know and we didn't have an u/s... I'm not convinced of the benefits of u/s for diagnostic use (except for a few things, but even then sometimes it's falsely positive or falsely negative KWIM?) and I wasn't going to go to the trouble of seeing an OB to get an u/s, especially when I didn't even want to know the gender.

I'm anxious to meet "thumper"... he or she will be his or her little person and I'm very excited to get to know him/her.









I've been knitting a lot of greens/yellows/etc. I've always preferred the non-pastel clothes for the most part. We've had good luck with BabyGap and Zutano has a lot of cute stuff too that is bold and bright colors.


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## Seie (Jun 9, 2005)

For my first birth I was romantic about it and wanted to wait and not know till I had my baby. I was really looking forward to the moment when I would find out. But turned out I had a 50 hour labor and when I finally had my baby on my chest I was so happy and relieved that I completely forgot about looking to see what gender it was. My DP accidentally caught a glimpse of boys parts and asked me if I even knew what gender it was - and I didnt..
So the second time around I wasnt so romantic about it. I wanted to know in advance because I was kinda hoping to get a girl so I would have one of each. I didnt want to spend my entire pregnancy hoping for a girl. That would be unfair to the baby if it should turn out not to be a girl. If it was a boy then I wanted to know ahead of time so I could look forward to having another son rather than hope for a daughter and then get a son. Do I make sence?
Anyway we opted to find out and I was happy to be told that it was a little girl. But that wasn't the important part of it. The important part was that at that very moment my baby truely came to life to me. I had some sort of sudden realisation that a baby was actually gonna come from this and that was worth everything.. nomatter that it was a girl.

I am still undecided for next time cause now I really dont care if it is a boy or girl. I just want another baby..


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## fallingstar (Jul 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bratmobile*
For me pregnancy is a sacred time since it is the ONLY time in my child's life that they live without the burdens and assumptions that surround sex and gender. The english language is kind of weird in that we have to say, "they" or "it" and that you can't even talk about a person without using a gendered pronoun. That part is a bit akward I suppose for people. I really just enjoy that my baby is just a person now and not a boy or girl. They will not ever have that again.

Its just annoying that even newborns get spoken to and talked about differently based on their sex, like "oh what a pretty girl" and "oh what a strong little guy." Last time I had a boy and it didn't take long before people started talking about how big or strong he was, (he was pretty dang chunky







) and how he was a "little linebacker" etc. Maybe he'll be a ballerina for crying out loud! I want him to decide what colors he likes and what sports/activities he likes and who he wants to love! I see so many heavy implications that go along with sex/gender I am just delighted to put it off for as long as I can and let my baby be free of it all.

Absolutely. You described it so eloquently. That is a huge part of it for me. I don't care what other people do, but for me it was important to let that little baby just be a person for as long as possible.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

I am not on the fence on this. I am so glad I found out the sex of my children before birth. I found it to be fun, planning for them, naming them, creating their space in our home, and shopping. It was a very sacred and fun time for my husband and I and I am so glad we had those months of knowing before the actual event.

I'm not on the fence about the gender thing either. I am all for dressing your babies like boys and dressing girls like dolls. I once had all these "ideas" about gender expressed here and I dressed my oldest in very neutral clothing, not allowing people to say things that were not gender neutral around her, had a very gender neutral nursery, etc. That is for the birds! Give me my pink and blue and pastel colors! I have really enjoyed dressing my little boys up, buying them ball caps, and tennis shoes with dinos and sports logos on them that light up. And right now I am having a good time doing the girly thing. Lace, bows, smocking, jewelry, pink, pink, and more pink. My little girl is 8 m old and she just loves getting dressed up -- she will not pull her bows off and she loves to have her bling on. She will even wear :::gasp::: those giant bow bands! (lets not forget the monogrammed diaper covers and diaper bags) I'm so glad I did the girly thing, and I don't believe its going to be detrimental to who she is. My one regret is that I didn't do this with my oldest daughter. And you know what, all that gender neutral stuff didn't keep her from wanting dolls and preferring girly stuff, and doing the boy thing, didn't prevent one of my sons from wanting barbies, dressing up in girl clothes, and wanting girly stuff and the other from being all boyish. I personally think the whole gender neutral thing is baloney and detrimental to children in the long run socially, cognitively, and culturally. (and no fun for moms or dads!)

I have to go breastfeed my little princess now


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## BeeandOwlsMum (Jul 11, 2002)

How is allowing a child to express their own gender identity detrimental to them or society?

I dont' think a kid is going to be scarred for life if I dress them in gender typed clothing when little, nor do I think that a girl is going to have a massive proble if I put her in something blue, or my son in something hot pink. I don't wear pink and frilly stufff every day, and my husband doesn't wear strictly blue every day either.

The clothing thing is purely for the convenience and enjoyment of the parents. To keep them from having to correct people about what sex the baby is, and to entertain them in dressing their child. The baby is too young to give a rat's butt what they are wearing as long as they are comfortable.

Older kids will express preferences on what they wear regardless of what you put them in when they are babies. My mother got put in pink all the time - she hates pink, hates the way it looks on her, and owns not one pink thing. I got put in very little pink, and mostly pretty gender neutral stuff...and I own all colors (though most of the pink has come from maternity clothing- what is up with that????!!!), and wear all colors, except green - which I think makes me look sick.

Personally, my favorite baby clothing right now is the long sleeved, royal purple tie-dyed onesie that _I_ dyed.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Well Adina, but ppl respond to babies/children differently depending on what type of clothing they are wearing. And infants are WIDE OPEN, perceiving the world around them, and themselves.

I didn't want to put my daughter in pink. She was already told she was "dainty," "pretty girl," and "princess" enough.

You have to actively counteract that stuff IMO.


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## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

ICAM Thismama.


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## BeeandOwlsMum (Jul 11, 2002)

I guess I am lucky...in the group of people I hang out with - kids are kids. And no one really cares what they wear. One of my best friend's sons loves all things sparkly. Another one is a total boy (plaid and corduroy). No one treats the kids differently at all based on what they are wearing.









I refuse to buy anything for my soon to be baby that has words on it...they are all either princess, sweet or hero, strong stuff...that annoys me.

I guess my way of actively countering stuff is to ignore what people seem to think I or anyone else should be wearing.







And i have been known to wear some weird stuff that is very, very comfy.









I think the clothing thinghas gotten much much worse since I was a baby though. Maybe due to the advent of ultrasound? I mean I look at baby pictures of me and my younger sister - and we were in bright colors, and mostly gender neutral type stuff.









I dunno -


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## bratmobile (Jun 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AdinaL*
How is allowing a child to express their own gender identity detrimental to them or society?

I dont' think a kid is going to be scarred for life if I dress them in gender typed clothing when little, nor do I think that a girl is going to have a massive proble if I put her in something blue, or my son in something hot pink.

Is this a response to what I posted? Or something else? I hope I didn't come off the wrong way because I don't think there's anything _wrong_ with gender coded clothing. I don't think there is anything wrong with girls who like pretty pretty princesses and boys who like monster trucks and trains (like my DS!) I also don't think there is anything wrong with people and young children that want to step out of their "traditional" gender roles. Oh, and back to the OP, I don't think there is anything wrong with finding out the sex of your baby







but for me-I feel a special joy in the unknown!

I live in Berkeley and most people here are "cool" about gender things too but even here and even in my own house I have to watch myself to make sure that I am not the one who is making choices for my DS. I don't want to unconsciously give him a vibe that he should like certain activities or clothing or colors and not others. I dress him in more "boy" clothes than "girl" clothes but he has access to both should he show any interest. So far, clothes are just clothes and that's great. I don't think babies will be scarred for life because they wore pink or blue. I do think people are scarred by experiences that block off their options to expressing themselves, like implying that certain clothes or colors are appropriate for them based on their genitals. Some kids know early on that they want to be identified as a gender that is not the same as their sex. Some kids like to go back and forth and some might just like a particular color. I just think that kids should decide these things and we should be aware of the part we play in influencing and _framing_ their choices.

If we only offer one set of choices, like "do you want to wear lavendar or pink?" That is setting up framework for them and excluding other options. I do think its fine to dress your child how you want and if you have a baby girl that you want to dress in pink all the time I think that's fine. If that girl grows up and expresses a desire to dress in a more masculine way and she is told no or laughed at or put off, I actually don't think that's ok.







I think its sad and I know a LOT of people will disagree with me there. Likely, people's reactions will be stronger in the case of a boy crossing gender lines than a girl though.

And FWIW, my point was exactly that it is NOT detrimental to children (or society) to express their gender identity. Of course children should feel free to express how they want to be perceived by others, as girly girls or masculine boys or gender benders! I just think that it is remarkable how _early_ the construction of gender begins and how invisible and weighty it is-and as a fetus or even newborn _they_ are not the ones who are constructing their own genders, we are.


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## Kathryn (Oct 19, 2004)

I'm having a hard time deciding what to do with this pregnancy. I'm very obessive about things and it will eat at me if I decide not to find out. What I think we are going to do is find out, but keep it a secret to everyone else. My husband does not want to not find out. I would rather find out. I have a very hard time with the fact that I can't control every aspect of my pregnancy and birth anyway.


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## USAmma (Nov 29, 2001)

I actually enjoyed finding out. I would not have had an u/s for the purpose of finding out. I had u/s to check for potential problems with my babies. My family has a history of neural tube defects and my brother had a rare but severe genetic condition. So it was important for me to be prepared for whatever my babies might be facing, if anything.

Finding out that I was having daughters was not an issue of what color clothes to buy. (I bought mostly gender neutral clothes for the first 3 mos anyway). It was a matter of bonding with them a little bit better. I can't explain why. It was just nice knowing what I was having. OTOH I can understand the excitement that there is by not knowing until the birth.

My SIL lives in India and they have a problem with abortion of female babies. It's technically against the law to find out the sex of the baby by u/s. She had to sign a waiver that she wouldn't even ask. So for her it's going to be a true surprise.


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## 2Sweeties1Angel (Jan 30, 2006)

*I refuse to buy anything for my soon to be baby that has words on it...they are all either princess, sweet or hero, strong stuff...that annoys me.*

Same here, except that I will buy it if it's cheap enough. DD has this stupid pink jacket that says Princess on it, but it was only a dollar brand new on clearance. She needed a jacket and there was no way I was paying $10 for one when I could get one for $1. She's only a year old so it's not like she'll be wearing it for very long anyway.


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## katerkat (Aug 13, 2005)

Honestly, I don't see the issue. I have no problem with those who choose to wait. Me, it didn't feel real until I knew it was HIM, my Russ, coming. I had some mental problems with the whole pregnancy thing, and it was easier when I knew WHO I was waiting for, not just the baby. If you fine with waiting, go ahead and wait. I don't think my birth was any less special - I was still pushing just as hard because I wanted to meet HIM, rather than find out what IT was.


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## minkajane (Jun 5, 2005)

We didn't find out DS's gender ahead of time (I actually thought he was a girl). We asked when the doc talked me into an US to check if he was still breech (why couldn't he tell from palpating?) but DS's butt was too far down and my pelvis hid his genitals. I think it's nice to leave it a surprise. We got a lot of yellow and blue clothes. I guess blue is more gender-neutral than pink. We wouldn't have minded putting him in pink, though I draw the line at frills and skirts.


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## Patchfire (Dec 11, 2001)

I've done it both ways. We found out with dd and did not with ds.

I won't find out when/if we have another. We had specific reasoning for finding out with dd, though. Dh and I were absolutely deadlocked on the issue of a boys' name until sometime in mid-2003. Yes, we carried on the argument even when we weren't pregnant or ttc. It was that big of a roadblock. (Dh is a IV, he wanted a V, I said over my dead body - literally.) So we found out, because we wanted to know if we had twenty weeks or a few years to resolve it. I don't regret it, per se, but that may be because it only confirmed what I already knew.

There were still... familial issues surrounding having a boy. I mostly pushed them aside while I was pregnant with ds, but it took two days of intense journaling and emotional work for my mind to allow my body to progress and go into labor. I think that if I had found out the sex beforehand, it would have been harder for me to do that emotional work, because I most likely would have hidden the issues even more deeply.

We try not to be overly gender-ized. My dd has had pajamas with a crown on them (she picked them out) and pajamas with soccer balls on them (again, she picked them out). My real challenge is going to be with ds. I am afraid that if he picks out something stereotypically boy, I will not be as open to it as I would be dd picking something stereotypically girl (within reason on both - the bizarre writing on clothes and other attitudes will NOT be encouraged). Too, it seems 'harder' to have a boy in 'girly' clothes than a girl in 'boyish' clothes. I want both of them to find their own way in the labryinth without too much pressure from the outside world. I don't know yet how well that will work. I do like to think I'm doing something right when dd picks out pink, ruffly things for ds as often as she does blue puppy-dog things.


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