# 15 and smoking



## AuntG (Apr 2, 2007)

...

Eh, nevermind.

I realize there are going to be some things I can't control and some things I can.

I think what's bothering me about my 15 year old smoking is that he is getting older and becoming his own person and that makes me feel old!


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## Cherie2 (Sep 27, 2006)

here with you


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## GenB (May 28, 2007)

I posted a thread about 2 years ago when I realized my then 18 year old was smoking. You're right. You can't control it but it made me absolutely nuts. She didn't smoke in front of me or at home but she smelled like an old ashtray full of cig butts. The nasty boy she dated at the time simply reeked. I got to a point where I didn't want them in the house because the odor wouldd linger. I also think it is one of the worst things a person can do to their body - i work for a hospice organization and see what happens to thse people who have smoked for years. She has no intention of quitting.

I've done everything I can think of to get her to quit. She basically ignores me or just says yeah mom, ok. I have to tell you it really makes me insane. There are so many things wrong with it. She smokes these Camel cigs that are flavored. it makes it harder to quit. She's 20 now and has 2 years under her belt. She's always had asthma and now has this rattly thing going when she laughs - its horrible.

Another thing that bothered me (and when I posted this I got some feedback chastising me for this but I'm sorry - its how I feel.) Alot of the nicer kids in town (kids I'd really want her to hang with because they are focused, they run or play tennis, are doing well in school. have plans for their lives, etc. etc. ) avoid her. Her friends all smoke and now they all drink alot, are addicted to tanning beds and generally like to run the bars. Its a rougher crowd. I just hate it. HATE IT!

I so so so feel your pain. Cigarettes should be outlawed (or taxed to the hilt!)


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GenB* 
I so so so feel your pain. Cigarettes should be outlawed (or taxed to the hilt!)

They are here, about $7-8 a pack.


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## GenB (May 28, 2007)

See -THATS what I'm talking about. I say knock'em out of the ball park with taxes and raise the age to purchase to 21. There is absolutely nothing good that comes from a cigarette. At all.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GenB* 
See -THATS what I'm talking about. I say knock'em out of the ball park with taxes and raise the age to purchase to 21. There is absolutely nothing good that comes from a cigarette. At all.

I can assure you that won't help any. Cigarettes are taxed horribly here, the age is 19 and I have never had any trouble getting cigarettes even when I was underage.

We also have a problem with under the table cigarettes that are even more unhealthy then the legal ones because they contain things not found in legal cigarettes, like rat droppings.


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AuntG* 
I think what's bothering me about my 15 year old smoking is that he is getting older and becoming his own person and that makes me feel old!

becoming his own person doesn't mean that smoking cigarettes has to be allowed by you as his parent.







I'm surprised that more people haven't posted. Perhaps I'm the only brave one.







But I disagree that a 15 yr old child should be able to choose to do whatever he wants while underage and still living in my home. If he were at least 18 then I'd say he has every right to choose to try something if he wants, but I'd still educate him on it and hope that he would make a healthier decision. I could care less how many $$ the habit costs, it's my child's long-term life span I'd be worried about.

And I'm not naive, I realize you can't control any child and that they can go behind your back and do whatever they want (usually due to peer pressure) but there's nothing wrong with letting our children know we disapprove of something and educating them against a potentially dangerous habit.

If I sound harsh I'm sorry but we are currently watching my FIL go through lung cancer. He smoked up until the day he was admitted in the hospital with pneumonia and they told him he had lung cancer 5 years ago. His quality of life has pretty much sucked. He regrets starting to smoke as a teenager. Perhaps if an adult talked to him when he first started and he had the right role models he may have made different choices, but who knows.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

:

It's my 20 year old so I really can't do anything except not let her smoke in the house and remember how hard it was for me to quit and everything my own mother did that didn't help.

She stinks. I'm sorry, but she stinks. She's a dancer. I can't believe she's doing this to herself. But she is.

Soooo.....the only thing that worked for me was cold turkey. I tried cutting back, I tried nicorette gum, i tried everything. It was miserable.i was unreasonably emotional. I got on http://www.quitnet.com at all hours of the night to whine and compare symptoms (did you know that detoxing from nicotine gives you the most horrendous case of the farts? I didn't.) and when I found cigarettes i forgot to throw away, i couldn't go near them and had to ask my then-thirteen-year-old son to tear them up, soak the debris, take it to the outdoor garbage can, and cover it with used kitty litter.

But i got through it. So will our kids. I wish they didn't have to, but we need to support them when they do and not alienate them so they won't be afraid to ask for our help when they need it.

I'm glad cigarettes aren't illegal because I don't want dd to go to jail. It doesn't matter what they cost because she's unemployed, doesn't have any money,and I don't have a clue where she's getting them. We have cancer in our family too and she's seen people she love get sick and die.

This sucks. It just plain sucks. It doesn't make me feel old,though,because i feel a good 20 years younger than i did when i was a smoker and my five year quittiversary is coming up in September.

Our kids will have quittiversaries to celebrate too someday. All i can do is keep on believing that.


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## MayBaby2007 (Feb 22, 2007)

Your kid is under age 18. I say, do everything in your power to keep those cigs away from him!

My mom smoked. I stole hers and started smoking when I was 11 yrs old (5th grade, whatever age that was). She didn't find out for a couple of years. She used to beat my a$$ when she caught me. Over and over again. But as long as I could get them (from her, not hard!), I smoked. 7th grade, mom gave up and started buying cigs for me so I wouldn't steal hers.

I'm almost 27 and I've been smoking 1+ packs/day for all these years. I have chest pain, shortness of breath and heart palpatations. I've seriously tried quitting more times than I can count....but it's soooooo hard after so many years. Looking back, I really wish my mom would have stood strong and not allowed a child to smoke (or kept cigs w/in my reach to steal). It's not her fault that I smoke....but she enabled the habit.

I want to quit soon. Very soon (may check out that site someone posted!). I want to quit before it has an influence on my dd. I will lock her in our cellar before I allow her to pick up this horrible horrible habit. I'd do anything possibe to keep her off of these things....including quitting to set a good example.

Find your son's source for getting cigs and cut him off--do anything you can to help him. He will thank you some day.

GL mama


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MayBaby2007* 
Your kid is under age 18. I say, do everything in your power to keep those cigs away from him!

My mom smoked. I stole hers and started smoking when I was 11 yrs old (5th grade, whatever age that was). She didn't find out for a couple of years. She used to beat my a$$ when she caught me. Over and over again. But as long as I could get them (from her, not hard!), I smoked. 7th grade, mom gave up and started buying cigs for me so I wouldn't steal hers.

I'm almost 27 and I've been smoking 1+ packs/day for all these years. I have chest pain, shortness of breath and heart palpatations. I've seriously tried quitting more times than I can count....but it's soooooo hard after so many years. Looking back, I really wish my mom would have stood strong and not allowed a child to smoke (or kept cigs w/in my reach to steal). It's not her fault that I smoke....but she enabled the habit.

I want to quit soon. Very soon (may check out that site someone posted!). I want to quit before it has an influence on my dd. I will lock her in our cellar before I allow her to pick up this horrible horrible habit. I'd do anything possibe to keep her off of these things....including quitting to set a good example.

Find your son's source for getting cigs and cut him off--do anything you can to help him. He will thank you some day.

GL mama









Uh yeah, I can attest to the fact that trying to keep ones teen away from cigarettes won't stop them from smoking...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
I can assure you that won't help any. Cigarettes are taxed horribly here, the age is 19 and I have never had any trouble getting cigarettes even when I was underage.

I never did, either. Admittedly, they were much cheaper back then (I quit permanently when I was...21?...so about '87), but I had no source of income. I still found ways to buy them.

My sister has been smoking for about 30 years. She can't/won't quit, and she spend a huge amount of her family's money on cigarettes. All the taxes aren't doing anything to cut back her smoking at all.

I wish I knew the answers, but I don't.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Do "never mind" threads usually get so many responces... Just curious.


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## nolonger (Jan 18, 2006)

Nah, just an emotionally charged issue and the OP probably had the courage to post something the rest of us were afraid of being flamed for.

fwiw, I started at 13 and quit at 40. I got mine from vending machines as a young teen even though it cost seventy five cents a pack and I could have gotten them from the store for sixty cents.

Apologies for freaking out so much about an adult child but I'm sure the OP felt all that and worse about her fifteen year old.


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## Shann (Dec 19, 2003)

My two boys are 13 and 14 and they both smoke. I learned early on that all attempts to stop them were failing. Some things you just have to let go on. This is what I did. So, yes, they smoke, and I gave up the constant battle. They won, I lost.


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## Thisbirdwillfly (May 10, 2009)

Shann, How do a 13 & 14 year old afford cigs?

More generally, raising prices does lead to lower rates of both continued and starting smoking in the general population. That it has not worked on an individual does not negate that.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

13 and 14 years olds have a vast number of ways of getting money from allowances, to doing odd jobs for neighbours, to getting a paper route, to getting a part time job, I've known a few to even dress in rags and beg on the street when they weren't allowed to do any of the above.


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## aterita (Jun 1, 2009)

Are you concerned about his smoking or whether "his smoking feels you old". Every one in this world have some things in control and some out of control. But yet as a parent, you need to intervene into the smoking problem of your son. He is young, and also you don't want him to be addicted to smoking or other similar bad habits. You as a parent have much control over this problem and you can set limits and rules. Home based intervention will help a lot in changing behaviors of struggling youth. Such programs like The Home Intervention System will help you deal with a wide range of problems that children often encounter including; anger, substance abuse, school issues, self-esteem, arguing, motivation, interacting with family, and more. So as a parent you have to act & be strong.
Best Wishes...


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## candiecotton (Jun 6, 2009)

ok heres what you do get 2 plastic milk jugs that you can see through & fill them 1/2 full with water . then have him place all his butts in one of them & after about a week or 2 when its full . ask him to sit down with you & have an adult conversation.
then haul out both jugs & tell him they are a representation of his lungs.
show him the nice clean one filled with nothing but water & tell him thats how his lungs are . then give him the one filled with butts & open it too so he gets a smell of it. & tell him thats what his lungs are like .

& if the gross factor doesnt work cust off the allowance & tell him if he wants to smoke he will work to earn the money


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## mommy68 (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *noordinaryspider* 
Our kids will have quittiversaries to celebrate too someday. All i can do is keep on believing that.

Some don't though.







Some get cancer, emphysema (sp?) and other breathing problems when they get older and still smoke. It's sad to see but I see it all the time, people dragging oxygen tanks around with them and smoking at the same time. And even though two people in my DH's family have battled lung cancer, every single one of his nieces/nephews smoke.

I think education would help if they would do it more in the schools. They have no problem worrying about sex ed, but should really focus a lot on not only drug abuse but tobacco use as well. And they may have classes on tobacco use but I don't know what goes on in the schools these days. I do know that kids usually don't want to listen to their parents because that's the last person in the world they want to believe is trying to get them to do something for their own best interest.


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## churndash (Mar 25, 2009)

I have a 15 year old and there is just no way I would throw up my hands and say "oh well" if she decided to take up smoking.

First and foremost, she'd never be allowed to smoke in my home - if she really, truly wants to kill herself with cigarettes I can't stop her but she's for damn sure not going to kill me and her brother and sister too.

Fortunately - for my kids at least - they have watched my mother and her horrible struggle with emphysema, her strokes, her heart attacks, and they agree that smoking is a disgusting, filthy, hideous habit that they do not want to come anywhere near.

Smoking is not just "bad" - it's DEADLY!

I did not spend all those years nursing her, choosing the healthiest foods, keeping her safe in a carseat, nurturing her mind and body...only to stand by while she kills herself with cigarettes.

Nope, no way. If I had to lock her in her room for a month before I talked sense into her I'd do it.

I am watching my mother DIE from smoking. There is no way on earth I would let a child of mine get on that road. And 15 is still plenty child enough where I have some control.

Sorry, I'm just really passionate about this. I hate,hate, hate cigarettes. I hate watching my mom die because of her smoking.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

One of my concerns with smoking is that it could turn into smoking pot, which could turn into harder drugs, which could actually end up with meth destroying your life (read the book Beautiful Boy)

I don't think any addict out there didn't start with cigarettes.


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## 95191 (Nov 8, 2007)

Quote:

I don't think any addict out there didn't start with cigarettes.
ahhhhhhh-NO, so utterly untrue

there are MANY out there that *never* smoked anything and are totally addicted to legal drugs (prescription and others) of all types

regarding how the 15 year old- some start and never stop, others it's just a phase


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
One of my concerns with smoking is that it could turn into smoking pot, which could turn into harder drugs, which could actually end up with meth destroying your life (read the book Beautiful Boy)

I don't think any addict out there didn't start with cigarettes.

Uh huh...

Lets see, cigarettes are _not_ a gateway to pot and pot is _not_ a gateway to harder drugs.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

I am going to be totally honest here. If I found out either of mine where smoking they would go NO WHERE without me except school and the school would be informed that they where to be watched at all times. Yes at the school here that is possible. Some bigger schools it might not be but thankfully that wont be a problem here. Shoot I would even drive to school during their lunch break to watch them myself.

I can hear the eyes rolling out there but I am serious. Until they turn 18 or show me they can be trusted not to smoke they go no where that they cant be watched. This is their very life we are talking about here not just something to let go.

I did try smoking when I was a teen but back then there was a place to smoke on the high school campus just for us kids.







: Thank the good Lord I came to my senses and it was just an experiment but for many of my friends it wasnt









I have been teaching both my kids about smoking and how horrible it is. I will continue to do so and hope it sticks and I wont have to deal with it later.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
Uh huh...

Lets see, cigarettes are _not_ a gateway to pot and pot is _not_ a gateway to harder drugs.

I respectfully disagree.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *serenbat* 

there are MANY out there that *never* smoked anything and are totally addicted to legal drugs (prescription and others) of all types


I was talking about addictions to illegal drugs. I don't know of any addicts of illegal drugs who didn't start with cigarettes and pot.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
I was talking about addictions to illegal drugs. I don't know of any addicts of illegal drugs who didn't start with cigarettes and pot.

Addiction is addiction no matter what.

The "pot as a gateway drug" theory has been disproven.

Millions of people smoke cigarettes and have never touched pot or anyother drug.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
I was talking about addictions to illegal drugs. I don't know of any addicts of illegal drugs who didn't start with cigarettes and pot.

There is a pot thread in parenting that has outlined the logical fallacy of that statement in relation to pot being a gateway drug.


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## LVale (May 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
I am going to be totally honest here. If I found out either of mine where smoking they would go NO WHERE without me except school and the school would be informed that they where to be watched at all times. Yes at the school here that is possible. Some bigger schools it might not be but thankfully that wont be a problem here. Shoot I would even drive to school during their lunch break to watch them myself.

I can hear the eyes rolling out there but I am serious. Until they turn 18 or show me they can be trusted not to smoke they go no where that they cant be watched. This is their very life we are talking about here not just something to let go.

I did try smoking when I was a teen but back then there was a place to smoke on the high school campus just for us kids.







: Thank the good Lord I came to my senses and it was just an experiment but for many of my friends it wasnt









I have been teaching both my kids about smoking and how horrible it is. I will continue to do so and hope it sticks and I wont have to deal with it later.

I have to disagree with you, respectfully. I would not ever follow my teen around, because he or she was smoking. You can give them all the info you want, then it is up to them to make the choice. May I ask you a question, did your parents follow you at every venue in your teen years? Oh by the way, I am not a newbie, our sons are 28 and 31, and are non smokers. But guess what I am. I told my sons point blank about smoking, all the horror stories, etc. You need to get a grip. If you micromanage every thing in your teens life, that is not cool. They will resent you for it.


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## LVale (May 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
Addiction is addiction no matter what.

The "pot as a gateway drug" theory has been disproven.

Millions of people smoke cigarettes and have never touched pot or anyother drug.

Thank you for pointing that out, Yes I smoke those so nasty cigs. But gee I don't do drugs and I am 48 years old. And I know numerous pot smokers who have never done hard drugs. And these pot smokers are in their 50's and 60's, oh the horror! LOL!


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## Mama2Jesse (Jan 5, 2009)

I watched my Papa die because he smoked. I was four years old. Woke up to the EMT's pounding through the house, got out of bed went into his room. And I have to stop because I don't like to think about it.

If that wasn't enough, I helped my father recover from a bypass at 37. Heavy smoker. Bypasses, um, HURT. For a long time. Not something I would want someone I love to go through.

DH picked up the habit at fourteen. His mom caught him, so decided to make him smoke a carton. Well, DH hadn't been inhaling the smoke, she made him inhale it. He smoked for ten years. Quit as my nineteenth birthday present.














:

I seriously would do anything in my power to keep a young person away from the cancer sticks. That, to me, is as dangerous as if they were going out drinking and driving home. Only more drawn out and painful.

My heart goes out to you, mama... but fight for your kid, even when they're too young and dumb to appreciate it. No, ESPECIALLY when they're young and dumb.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LVale* 
I have to disagree with you, respectfully. I would not ever follow my teen around, because he or she was smoking. You can give them all the info you want, then it is up to them to make the choice. May I ask you a question, did your parents follow you at every venue in your teen years? Oh by the way, I am not a newbie, our sons are 28 and 31, and are non smokers. But guess what I am. I told my sons point blank about smoking, all the horror stories, etc. You need to get a grip. If you micromanage every thing in your teens life, that is not cool. They will resent you for it.

No they didnt but they didnt need to when they found out about the smoking I had already tried it and stopped and told them so. Had I still been smoking they would have been well within their rights to follow me to make sure I ddnt do it any more.

The only two issue I would do what I said on is smoking and drugs. Other than that I would think of micromanaging like that. But to me this issue is one that I have no give at all on. They can resent me all they want for it but at least I would be doing my job and keeping them safe until they are no longer in my care.

Yes kids need to make their own choices as long as those choices do not threaten their lives. If they cant make the right ones then it is my job as a parent to make the decisions for them until they are capable of doing it themselves. Some teenagers are capable of making the right choices and are very mature while others are still very much children.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
No they didnt but they didnt need to when they found out about the smoking I had already tried it and stopped and told them so. Had I still been smoking they would have been well within their rights to follow me to make sure I ddnt do it any more.

The only two issue I would do what I said on is smoking and drugs. Other than that I would think of micromanaging like that. But to me this issue is one that I have no give at all on. They can resent me all they want for it but at least I would be doing my job and keeping them safe until they are no longer in my care.

Yes kids need to make their own choices as long as those choices do not threaten their lives. If they cant make the right ones then it is my job as a parent to make the decisions for them until they are capable of doing it themselves. Some teenagers are capable of making the right choices and are very mature while others are still very much children.

If you make descisions for them when they can't make the "right" ones, how are they ever going to learn to make the right ones?

People make mistakes and learn from their mistakes.

Plus maturity does equal not making mistakes. Everyone makes mistakes. It's an inevitable part of living life.


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## churndash (Mar 25, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
If you make descisions for them when they can't make the "right" ones, how are they ever going to learn to make the right ones?

People make mistakes and learn from their mistakes.

Plus maturity does equal not making mistakes. Everyone makes mistakes. It's an inevitable part of living life.

I wouldn't give my kid a loaded gun and let her "learn from her mistake".

All there is to learn from smoking is how to become addicted to nicotine and destroy your body. This is not a learning experience, this is life and death.

Smoking = death as far as I'm concerned. I would no more sit back and do nothing while she smoked than I would sit back and watch her slit her wrists.

You can disagree all you want, it is my kid and my choice. I would do ANYTHING humanly possibly to make my child stop smoking.

Really there is nothing anyone could ever possibly say to change my mind on this topic, so we'll have to agree to disagree.


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## SandraS (Jan 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
One of my concerns with smoking is that it could turn into smoking pot, which could turn into harder drugs, which could actually end up with meth destroying your life (read the book Beautiful Boy)

I don't think any addict out there didn't start with cigarettes.

And my baby will NEVER leave my family bed.

Your statement can't be more wrong.


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## gini1313 (Jul 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *churndash* 
I wouldn't give my kid a loaded gun and let her "learn from her mistake".

All there is to learn from smoking is how to become addicted to nicotine and destroy your body. This is not a learning experience, this is life and death.

Smoking = death as far as I'm concerned. I would no more sit back and do nothing while she smoked than I would sit back and watch her slit her wrists.

You can disagree all you want, it is my kid and my choice. I would do ANYTHING humanly possibly to make my child stop smoking.

Really there is nothing anyone could ever possibly say to change my mind on this topic, so we'll have to agree to disagree.

Until people see cigarettes in this way, there will always be this disagreement. I honestly see people smoking and am shocked that people stills smoke, after all we know about how bad it is for you.

I work in critical care and smoking kills. A slow and painful death of suffocation. It hurts and people can't breathe. It is horrible. They are in and out of ccu for years, over and over and over, because they can't breathe. They are on bipap and intubated over and over. I would also do anything to keep my kids from smoking. I am an ex smoker. Quitting sucks. But not as much as dying from COPD or lung cancer.

Don't just sit back and let your kids smoke. Sometimes you are right, you can't stop them, but fight and do everything in your power to get them to stop. It WILL hurt and it WILL kill them. A loaded gun would be less painful.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
Millions of people smoke cigarettes and have never touched pot or anyother drug.

You're arguing it backwards. I *certainly* didn't say that every smoker will advance to any other drug.

However, every meth addict started with cigarettes. There isn't a meth addict out there who never touched a cigarette.

Beyond that, I wanted to say this to the OP:

My MIL didn't really take it seriously when my dh started smoking at 14. She came up with lots of excuses........it's just a phase, it's just being a teenager, it's normal rebellion, it's due to the stress of the divorce of his parents the year prior, etc.

Three decades later, he's still fighting his addiction to cigarettes (even now, with a serious lung problem, he can't quite kick smoking). Maybe, just maybe, if she had gotten him help at that point in time and had taken his smoking seriously, he would have been able to quit then. Just something to think about.

(And, for the record, just in case anyone is wondering, he doesn't smoke in the house or the car.)


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SandraS* 
And my baby will NEVER leave my family bed.

Your statement can't be more wrong.


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## enkmom (Aug 30, 2004)

Watching my two sisters smoke, and having interactions with the friends of my older children, I can say with certainty that kids who want to smoke are going to smoke. As parents we can TRY to stop them, but they won't stop unless they want to.

My sisters started smoking at 14 and 16. They started by sneaking cigarettes out of Dad's packs, and then started swiping entire packs. There were always so many cartons around that my parents didn't catch on for a long time. At the time, there were cigarette vending machines around, so they bought them there on the (rare) occasions that a clerk wouldn't sell them to them. When they were desperate, they shoplifted them (they weren't under lock and key like they are now). When they were TRULY desperate, they picked butts out of dad's ashtray and then broke them up and rolled the loose tobacco up in notebook paper. They had friends give them to them at school or on the bus. And scariest of all, they dated older men (the kind you don't bring home to mother) who gladly gave them cigarettes. One of my sisters has since died (not from smoking) and the other has absolutely no desire to quit. She grumbles about the cost, but she enjoys smoking.

I think I just got lucky with my kids. Growing up in a house that my Dad smoked in heavily, I had chronic sore throats and post-nasal drip, and after a one-week "coolness" trial when I was 17 I have never wanted to smoke. I certainly let them know the dangers and begged them to never smoke, but it was clearly their decision - most of my daughters friends smoke, and several of my sons friends do to. If they had wanted to smoke, they would have. I would certainly have tried everything in my power to get them to quit, but I am realistic enough to know that I would have been fighting an uphill battle that I may well have lost.


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## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
I don't know of any addicts of illegal drugs who didn't start with cigarettes and pot.

How many addicts do you know?

I know two. A former friend of my mother, and an aunt of mine. One is a meth addict, and the other is a cokehead and alcoholic. The meth addict did smoke when he was younger, but doesn't anymore. My aunt has never smoked. She's an asthmatic. She started with booze.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
You're arguing it backwards. I *certainly* didn't say that every smoker will advance to any other drug.

However, every meth addict started with cigarettes. There isn't a meth addict out there who never touched a cigarette.

Then there really is not a point to even mentioning it. Correlation does not equal causation.


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## Louise 1959 (Jun 24, 2009)

I think most heroin users also drink coffee...think we better keep our kids away from Folgers!


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## SandraS (Jan 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Louise 1959* 
I think most heroin users also drink coffee...think we better keep our kids away from Folgers!

that made me giggle...


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benj* 
Then there really is not a point to even mentioning it. Correlation does not equal causation.

And generalizations are always wrong.









I highly doubt that every single meth addict started with cigarettes.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *churndash* 
I wouldn't give my kid a loaded gun and let her "learn from her mistake".

All there is to learn from smoking is how to become addicted to nicotine and destroy your body. This is not a learning experience, this is life and death.

Smoking = death as far as I'm concerned. I would no more sit back and do nothing while she smoked than I would sit back and watch her slit her wrists.

You can disagree all you want, it is my kid and my choice. I would do ANYTHING humanly possibly to make my child stop smoking.

Really there is nothing anyone could ever possibly say to change my mind on this topic, so we'll have to agree to disagree.

If smoking = death then how come there are many, _many_ smokes who live to a ripe old age and die of natural causes?

smoking increases the chance of early death.

Either way, you can follow your kid around all you want, that doesn't mean they will stop doing things you don't like. Teenagers are seperate people from their parents and will make different choices whether you approve of them or not.


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## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

Just for the record, I'm not nor have I ever been a smoker. I just think this is funny....

Quote:

I love these little facts. "Well you know. Smoking takes ten years off your life." Well it's the ten *worst* years, isn't it folks? It's the ones at the *end*! It's the wheelchair, adult diaper, kidney dialysis f*&%ing years. You can have those years! We don't want 'em, alright!? - Denis Leary


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
And generalizations are always wrong.









I highly doubt that every single meth addict started with cigarettes.

Yes, definitely, you present an excellent point. Mine was only assuming her premise was true.

I've done both, but I definitely don't believe cigarettes to be a "gateway" to harder drugs.

And to another post...following children around? That's a sure-fire way to lose any trust.


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## fruitfulmomma (Jun 8, 2002)

I'll steer clear from the parenting advice, since my are not that old yet, but personally I started when I was 12 or 13 and quit once when I was 16 and then hit a rough patch and started again and quit cold turkey when I was 17. I haven't touched one for almost 12 years, though some days I'd really like to. But I quit for my husband because he hated it and he meant more to me than they did.

I did see my grandfather die from lung-cancer and honestly it just didn't have an effect on me. My mother hated it and was very hurt by my actions but at the time our relationship was really rocky and I didn't really care.

And FTR, I have smoked both nicotine and pot and have NEVER touched any other drugs, illegal or otherwise.


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## churndash (Mar 25, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
If smoking = death then how come there are many, _many_ smokes who live to a ripe old age and die of natural causes?

smoking increases the chance of early death.

Either way, you can follow your kid around all you want, that doesn't mean they will stop doing things you don't like. Teenagers are seperate people from their parents and will make different choices whether you approve of them or not.

Like I said, we'll have to agree to disagree. I don't know why you want to persist in arguing about this when I've already said that there is nothing you or anyone else could ever say that would change my feelings on this matter one iota.

My 15 year old does not smoke, thank God. Or maybe it's watching both of her grandmothers dying from emphysema and cancer of the larynx that I should thank.

I really don't care whether "some" smokers managed not to kill themselves with their stupid, filthy, disgusting habit.

Every day I watch my mother struggle to breathe and cling to life, although many times she has talked about killing herself, just to end her daily pain.

I would never sit idly by and watch my child killing herself. I would do everything in my power to stop her from doing it.

Please do not reply to me, as there is nothing else for us to discuss. I do not wish to argue any further. I will not change my mind and neither will you so let's just drop it.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *churndash* 
I wouldn't give my kid a loaded gun and let her "learn from her mistake".

All there is to learn from smoking is how to become addicted to nicotine and destroy your body. This is not a learning experience, this is life and death.

Smoking = death as far as I'm concerned. I would no more sit back and do nothing while she smoked than I would sit back and watch her slit her wrists.

You can disagree all you want, it is my kid and my choice. I would do ANYTHING humanly possibly to make my child stop smoking.

Really there is nothing anyone could ever possibly say to change my mind on this topic, so we'll have to agree to disagree.

A great big







: to everything you just said. Whatever it takes I will do.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Trust is earned not given. If my child is smoking how can I trust them? I am sure that one day when they are grown they would thank me for stopping them from becoming addicted to a life threatening thing. If that means a few years of tension then so be it.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
Trust is earned not given. If my child is smoking how can I trust them? I am sure that one day when they are grown they would thank me for stopping them from becoming addicted to a life threatening thing. If that means a few years of tension then so be it.

What does smoking have to do with trust? Smoking and lying about it, I can see. But just smoking?

If my parent was following me around to see if I smoked, I would definitely be able to find a way to still smoke. Untrustworthy, maybe. Stupid, no. Seems that it would worsen the situation. My parents were ridiculously strict, yet I still managed to get into trouble a lot.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

You are the one mentioned them never trusting me if I followed them around that is what I was referring to.
Because the very act of smoking in the first place would be betraying my trust knowing how I feel about it.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
You are the one mentioned them never trusting me if I followed them around that is what I was refering to.

If you were referring to them trusting you then why would you say, "*If my child is smoking how can I trust them?*"

I was asking how just smoking makes you not trust them.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
Because the very act of smoking in the first place would be betraying my trust knowing how I feel about it.

So if you don't approve and support every single thing they do, it's automatically betrayal?

I mean, I wouldn't want my kids smoking either---don't get me wrong. But if it gets to that point, I guess you haven't reared your adamant position too well, right?

How exactly do you think following them around would solve the problem, logically? You don't think they would be able to figure something out?


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *churndash* 
Like I said, we'll have to agree to disagree. I don't know why you want to persist in arguing about this when I've already said that there is nothing you or anyone else could ever say that would change my feelings on this matter one iota.

My 15 year old does not smoke, thank God. Or maybe it's watching both of her grandmothers dying from emphysema and cancer of the larynx that I should thank.

I really don't care whether "some" smokers managed not to kill themselves with their stupid, filthy, disgusting habit.

Every day I watch my mother struggle to breathe and cling to life, although many times she has talked about killing herself, just to end her daily pain.

I would never sit idly by and watch my child killing herself. I would do everything in my power to stop her from doing it.

Please do not reply to me, as there is nothing else for us to discuss. I do not wish to argue any further. I will not change my mind and neither will you so let's just drop it.

Um, you wanna get technical... You were the only that disagreed with me when I disagreed with someone else. So I am not the one "continuing to disagree".

In fact I think I may have actually addressed one of your posts only once. Twice if you count this time.

You want to stop your kid from smoking then go ahead, I have nothing against that. What I do have a problem with is parents who think they can realistically follow their child around 24/7 and prevent them from doing something that way. Teenagers are not that compliant. The only way to keep them with you 24/7 without them being able to slip off is to handcuff yourself to them. At which point I believe you run the risk of getting into legal trouble yourself because the law doesn't look to kindly on such things.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
Trust is earned not given. If my child is smoking how can I trust them? I am sure that one day when they are grown they would thank me for stopping them from becoming addicted to a life threatening thing. If that means a few years of tension then so be it.

I doubt I would ever forgive one of my parents for such a gross invasion of privacy.

Nor would I likely have a healthy sense of my own bourdaries as an adult.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

They would know I was there. I wouldnt sneak and watch them. The following I mentioned was at school since that is the only place they would be allowed to go.

Quote:

So if you don't approve and support every single thing they do, it's automatically betrayal?
No I didnt say that at all what I said is that the only 2 things I felt this strongly on was smoking and drugs.

Yes there are other things I dont approve of but I would live with it if it happened but not this.

I stand by my OP on the steps I would take should I find out that either of my kids where smoking.


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

You don't have to be sneaky about it to perminently ruin their trust and respect for you or cause psycological damage.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
They would know I was there. I wouldnt sneak and watch them. The following I mentioned was at school since that is the only place they would be allowed to go.

You don't think your children could figure out a way to do it behind your back? I just don't think this would work logically. It seems like a false sense of control on your part, but does NOTHING to solve the problem.

Quote:

No I didnt say that at all what I said is that the only 2 things I felt this strongly on was smoking and drugs.
Well, I don't think there are parents out there that encourage smoking and drugs.


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## SandraS (Jan 18, 2007)

I certainly hope all of your dreams for your teenagers come true - that they'll never lie, they'll never betray you, they won't ever sneak behind your back to do anything, that they'll always be open and honest and discuss everything up front; they'll be aware of your wishes and follow them to a "t". You've raised them to be thoughtful honest human beings and they would never dare do something you wouldn't agree with. They're smart. They won't succomb to peer pressure. They won't ever do something dear ol' mama would be unhappy with.

No offense, but everyone needs to click their heels together. Teenagers can be wonderful people. I have a great relationship with mine. But I'm not naive. I am certain there are things he does that I would not approve of. But I will not lock him in the house or hover over him to be sure.

If my mother followed me everywhere, I would've not only started smoking, I probably would've rebeled ten times worse just because she was there to "ensure I didn't".

You can only raise them to the best of your ability and hope they make the right decisions. Beyond that, they are their own people and will do what they want. You can tell them not to smoke in the house, or not to bring it there, or whatever - but you cannot be everywhere.

Smoking isn't the end of the world. Millions try it and stop. Millions don't. It is what it is. But it's certainly not a gateway, it's certainly not a snub to the parent that asks their child not to. I don't smoke, I hope my kids don't, but if they do, it wasn't because of my teachings or my parenting. I can just hope they stop.

Good luck.


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## Cherie2 (Sep 27, 2006)

I understand not wanting your child to smoke .. We are after all their protectors... we as parents want to do everything to keep them healthy and alive. The difference with me is that I feel I can better protect my children if they are honest with me. And I feel they are more apt to be honest with me if I do not judge their actions. They both know how I feel about it and they both have to make choices about their own lives

I seriously do appreciate the passion that those of you have shared about doing anything possible to keep your child from smoking. My view is that if I behaved that way with my child it would only serve to distance them from me and create deception and alienation. How can I protect them if they are hiding their actions from me?


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benj* 
You don't think your children could figure out a way to do it behind your back? I just don't think this would work logically. It seems like a false sense of control on your part, but does NOTHING to solve the problem.

Well, I don't think there are parents out there that encourage smoking and drugs.

I understand everyone has different ways of dealing with things and I am OK with that.

If they are never away from me then it would be extremely difficult to find a way I would think though of course not impossible since nothing is impossible.

It would not have damaged my trust in my parents had they did that to me. I guess I was not your avg teen though. My friends where so different from me. Yes I would have been a bit angry but not trust them, no way.

I am confused as I dont see how I implied that there where parents out there that would encourage smoking or drugs







: what I said was I felt strongly enough about it to go above and beyond to prevent it.

I am in no way naive enough to think I can control every thing they do that would be really odd thinking but there are some things I can and will control.


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benj* 
Then there really is not a point to even mentioning it. Correlation does not equal causation.

And yet it's worth investigating the correlation.

If I can keep my child away from cigarettes, then I can also keep my child away from harder drugs.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *A&A* 
And yet it's worth investigating the correlation.

If I can keep my child away from cigarettes, then I can also keep my child away from harder drugs.

Well, why don't you research reasons why people turn to harder drugs instead of making baseless assumptions? This is where people make mistakes when they jump to their own conclusions. And I highly doubt every meth user ever has smoked cigarettes.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
I understand everyone has different ways of dealing with things and I am OK with that.

If they are never away from me then it would be extremely difficult to find a way I would think though of course not impossible since nothing is impossible.

It would not have damaged my trust in my parents had they did that to me. I guess I was not your avg teen though. My friends where so different from me. Yes I would have been a bit angry but not trust them, no way.

Well, I strongly disliked my parents. I started smoking when I was 11, and it made it all the more sweeter knowing my father hated it.

However, it does sound like you have a good relationship with your children. Your flawed solution to the smoking problem would probably never come into effect.

Quote:

I am confused as I dont see how I implied that there where parents out there that would incourage smoking or drugs







: what I said was I felt strongly enough about it to go above and beyond to prevent it.
No, but the way you put it was just funny to me. I think most parents would take drug use seriously.


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## purslaine (Feb 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MusicianDad* 
I doubt I would ever forgive one of my parents for such a gross invasion of privacy.


I do not think this holds true for everyone - at all. Knowing what I know now, I would be thanking my parents for doing their best to help me not start smoking.

For a child 15 and under I would do my best to get them to break the habit. That would include being grounded for about a month and I would curb any sources of income they had. Hopefully that would rid their system of nicotine and it would end there. If I tried numerous ways to get them to quit and none worked, I would eventually let it go. I will at least have done my part and sent the strong message that smoking is not OK, and I will have probably reduced the amount they actually smoked if only by making it inconvenient. Grounding a kid for a month or two while they sort thing out? Fine. Grounding a kid for 2 or 3 years until they reach the age of majority would probably do more harm than good.

I would not ever allow smoking in the house and I would not pay for or shop with their money for cigarettes.

None of this is a secret to my kids. They know if they start smoking, I will do what I can to stop them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benj* 
My parents were ridiculously strict, yet I still managed to get into trouble a lot.

I wonder if this is where some of the laissez faire attitude to smoking is coming in? Your parents were strict and you rebelled?

The truth is, I am not strict. I am quite laissez-faire in most regards. I think there is a real difference in being strict across the board and being strict on a few, important issues. I think kids know that - I doubt being strict on a few non-negotiables is going to push someone into trouble who wasn't headed there anyways.

Here is my take. As kids age we slowly let them make their own decisions. Things that concern safety are the last we let go of. These include things like drinking, driving and smoking.


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## benj (Jun 4, 2009)

Erm, no. I think you have misunderstood me. Of course I would take drug use seriously. But following my kids around all day would make the problem worse. There has to be a better solution. And I am not hands off--- I don't know where you got that idea.


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## purslaine (Feb 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *benj* 
Erm, no. I think you have misunderstood me. Of course I would take drug use seriously. But following my kids around all day would make the problem worse. There has to be a better solution. And I am not hands off--- I don't know where you got that idea.

May I ask, in all seriousness, what you would do then?
-------------

This thread has become quite polarised - or that is how I am reading it. On one side we have those who would pull out all the stops to prevent smoking -and on the other we have those who will talk about smoking and support quitting, but that is about it. There must be some middle ground and I am curious as to what the research says.


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## AuntG (Apr 2, 2007)

Wow! I was really surprised to find this had generated so many replies. I had totally forgotten about it!!

I can't recall what I wrote at first, but it was a description of how I figured it out in the first place and it was long and tedious and not really all that important. So that's why I came back later and just kinda said, "Eh, nevermind... my kids smokes, that's it. "

So, first of all, HE doesn't buy them, he gets them off his friends that smoke. And if you think there is only one or two kids out there in your community that smoke and if you have any illusions of keeping your kid away from them then good luck with that. You'd be surprised!! Very surprised to know what these kids are up to. If smoking is the worse thing my kids does (and I'm sure it isn't) then I count myself lucky!!

Secondly, he knows I know, he knows I hate it, and I do not allow him to do it at the house. When he smells of it, I make him get out of my presence and go take a shower and I make a BIG dramatic wailing fuss about it. He isn't allowed to come around his younger siblings when he smells that nasty either until he cleans up.

Thirdly... I regret to inform some of you that age 15 is not anything like age 5 or even 10. Being a "good parent" means different things at different ages. At age 2, it is appropriate to follow your child around every where. At age 15, it is not. And trust me, you are not going to WANT to be around your 15 year old that much!!!! But I can't even begin to imagine all the developmental damage that would done to a 15 year that was never out from under parental observation.

Anyway, simply put, there are far worse things to worry about right now. I still don't like the smoking, but I also know how to pick my battles and not alienate my child, and still manage to go to school full time and take care of a family of four as a single mom, and I think I'm doing a wonderful job!


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## A&A (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AuntG* 
I still don't like the smoking, but I also know how to pick my battles and not alienate my child, and still manage to go to school full time and take care of a family of four as a single mom, and I think I'm doing a wonderful job!









I'm sure you are a wonderful mom. But please keep in mind that the neuro-pathways will get more entrenched with each passing year of his smoking, and he might end up like my dh, simply unable to quit at age 43.

So, if I were you, I'd ask him if he'd like your help in quitting. If yes, then help him.


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## Cherie2 (Sep 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AuntG* 
Anyway, simply put, there are far worse things to worry about right now. I still don't like the smoking, but I also know how to pick my battles and not alienate my child, and still manage to go to school full time and take care of a family of four as a single mom, and I think I'm doing a wonderful job!


























I bet you are!


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