# How to make others understand how we feel about superheros



## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

DH and I do not allow weapon play, no guns, swords etc. We also feel that superheros are not good for small kids. In the kids we are around introduction to superheros has resulted in LOTS of "fighting", hitting, kicking and other violent behavior. We also feel that modern superhero stories are not at ALL appropriate for small children.

People want to give DS batman and superman toys and we keep trying to explain our position but everyone keeps rolling their eyes and ignoring us.

In addition I am keeping a friends 4.5 year old who is totally obsessed with superheros and is CONSTANTLY trying to play fight with my 11 month and "shooting" at him. I have explained my position to the mother and asked her not to send super hero toys but she allows him to bring them anyway. I think I am going to have to stop keeping him since I do NOT want this around my child.

Am I REALLY the only person who thinks superheros/villains are NOT good for kids?


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## ctdoula (Dec 26, 2002)

No, you're not the only one who feels like this. But you're also a few years from finding out on your own it's almost a force that's beyond your control.

I felt in a similar way. Our son had no idea was anything was... until last year. He was four and a halloween costume catalog came in the mail. I was innocent enough to let him flip through it in the car.... and THAT.WAS.IT. He saw a photo of a Darth Vadar costume and I swear the male cells in his little body were all switched on. He took one look, said "I want to be this... who is this?" and BAM... he was 100% addicted/interested in ANYTHING star wars. He now knows more about Star Wars than my husband.

I swear... it's in the DNA. Shrug. I've done my best to channel the energy as best we can, but I'm beyond trying to prohibit it. He plays light saber. We try enforce no shooting, especially at people.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Your response made me laugh! DH would secretly be thrilled if DS loved Star Wars LOL

The little boy I keep was so SWEET until he started watching all these adult superhero movies and TV shows to advanced for him...now it's all fighting and "killing"

I hate hearing "I'm going to KILL that guy" from a preschooler.


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## grumpybear (Oct 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ctdoula* 
No, you're not the only one who feels like this. But you're also a few years from finding out on your own it's almost a force that's beyond your control.

I felt in a similar way. Our son had no idea was anything was... until last year. He was four and a halloween costume catalog came in the mail. I was innocent enough to let him flip through it in the car.... and THAT.WAS.IT. He saw a photo of a Darth Vadar costume and I swear the male cells in his little body were all switched on. He took one look, said "I want to be this... who is this?" and BAM... he was 100% addicted/interested in ANYTHING star wars. He now knows more about Star Wars than my husband.

I swear... it's in the DNA. Shrug. I've done my best to channel the energy as best we can, but I'm beyond trying to prohibit it. He plays light saber. We try enforce no shooting, especially at people.











My son was 3 when he decided to be Wolverine. He's never seen any X-Men movie. In fact, he's never seen any superhero movie at all. But he gravitates towards the Batmans and Spidermans in the toy section.
We've had to be creative on what to say about why Wolverine needs those claws.


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## Cascadian (Jan 28, 2009)

I dunno. I think it's a good, albeit blunt, way about teaching morality, strength, wanting good to triumph over evil. I think that wearing a mask and personifying a person with strength and goodness is a good thing, as is playing the shadow side (the villain) and *knowing* that it's wrong.

In the land of childhood make-believe, we can't always be the 'good guys' if there are no 'baddies', and darnit...sometimes it's just *fun*.

My kids love imaginary play. They play weddings, pirates, fairies, astronauts, scientists, etc. etc. They've also played funeral, cops 'n robbers and war. It's sure opened up some great conversations. I can't imagine being so hypervigilant to shield them or divert their games to my agenda.

Sorry...I guess I don't agree with censoring imaginative play.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cascadian* 
I dunno. I think it's a good, albeit blunt, way about teaching morality, strength, wanting good to triumph over evil. I think that wearing a mask and personifying a person with strength and goodness is a good thing, as is playing the shadow side (the villain) and *knowing* that it's wrong.

In the land of childhood make-believe, we can't always be the 'good guys' if there are no 'baddies', and darnit...sometimes it's just *fun*.

My kids love imaginary play. They play weddings, pirates, fairies, astronauts, scientists, etc. etc. They've also played funeral, cops 'n robbers and war. It's sure opened up some great conversations. I can't imagine being so hypervigilant to shield them or divert their games to my agenda.

Sorry...I guess I don't agree with censoring imaginative play.

I get what you are saying, I guess I just don't really feel like acting out fighting scene from movies over and over IS imaginative play. It sounds like your kids do engage in very imaginative play just like I did as a kid.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I agree that keeping superheroes and such away from your DS isn't really going to make a difference. Sorry, but little boys especially, love to play rough and will be action figure like characters while pretending whether or not they are exposed to them. They'll make guns out of anything - even their own hand will suffice - so while I get where you are coming from, it's likely that your extended family continues to try to give these gifts b/c they know little boys like them, and it's not going to be the one thing that makes your DS play a bit violently.


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## Cascadian (Jan 28, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
I get what you are saying, I guess I just don't really feel like acting out fighting scene from movies over and over IS imaginative play.

I know, I feel you, trust me. I don't like it either (the whole 'playing funeral' with someone playing the corpse really gave me the willies...







) BUT IME, they *will* play this stuff out. Kids process things through play or art, not just words or behaviours.

Better to start the conversation now as opposed to if/when he hits school. For example, my girls were really into playing and BEING princesses. We had a two year long conversation about what that meant, about being rich or poor, being beautiful on the outside and inside, and so on. They get it. I'm glad we were able to discuss it. Their way of playing princess has changed dramatically from before the convo. (They're now...a mix of princess/superheroes







)


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

LOL One of my neighbors little girls is always in boots, cape and tiara. She caller herself "Super Princess"


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## ASusan (Jun 6, 2006)

It's in the air they breath, as soon as they encounter other children, or, as pp pointed out, images (darth vadar) that we (as parents) don't necessarily create. AND, it's a basic part of their fantasy about being powerful, good v. evil, life & death, etc.

Less than one week in the preschool room at daycare (3yrs and up), my son was "shooting" us with his finger - "pkew pkew." Upon questioning, he had no idea what he was doing, or what his finger was, or what the play was about. It was just a sound and a motion he was doing. Later, I'm sure the concepts of kill, die, shoot...will enter his vocabulary and his awareness.

I highly recommend the first half of PBS' Raising Cain. It is chronological. Watch through the kindergarten vignette, at least.


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## beckington (Mar 1, 2004)

Wait, your son is 11 months old and people want to give him superhero toys? But, do they even make age-appropriate superhero toys for that age? I can't see what play value there is in that sort of stuff for kids that age. Personally I would take that approach - and point out the types of toys that a baby/toddler would enjoy more.

My son is 6.5 and we just bought him a toy lightsaber (well, he paid for part of it!). He's into Star Wars Lego now too. Last year he had a big thing for Spiderman and chose a Spiderman costume for Halloween. He's never seen a Star Wars or Spiderman movie, or any superhero type movie that I can think of. But he sees stuff his friends have and it comes from there. He loves it! He loves play fighting but he doesn't act out fighting bits from movies because he's never seen any. It all comes from his imagination and play with friends, but sure it made me feel icky when he started 'killing' etc. But he loves it and I see no reason to try and stop it. But 11 months?!

Personally I can't wait until we watch the Star Wars films together, but I'm hoping to hold him off another year at least. I think he's too young for them and wouldnt' understand a lot of it and that he'd find some of it scary. I LOVE Star Wars (the *real* movies!) and don't want to 'waste' it on him before he's ready to appreciate them fully, lol!


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## ChetMC (Aug 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cascadian* 
Sorry...I guess I don't agree with censoring imaginative play.

This is how I feel too.

Kids don't just imagine and pretend happy things. Kids use play to explore all sorts of concepts and feelings.

The only real rule we have is that when kids play together it has to be fun for everybody who is playing. It's fair to not buy the props, but I'm not comfortable telling kids what they can and cannot pretend.


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## Marsupialmom (Sep 28, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cascadian* 
I know, I feel you, trust me. I don't like it either (the whole 'playing funeral' with someone playing the corpse really gave me the willies...







) BUT IME, they *will* play this stuff out. Kids process things through play or art, not just words or behaviours.

Better to start the conversation now as opposed to if/when he hits school. For example, my girls were really into playing and BEING princesses. We had a two year long conversation about what that meant, about being rich or poor, being beautiful on the outside and inside, and so on. They get it. I'm glad we were able to discuss it. Their way of playing princess has changed dramatically from before the convo. (They're now...a mix of princess/superheroes







)

They do not need a movie to act out death or birth scenes......I have a few personal stories from my own childhood.

Many of these stories, ideas are not new. Look at folk tales, mythology.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

If you are watching the kid, you have the right to set the rules on what he brings to your home. Tell the mother that if she continues to send him with it, you will be confiscating those toys for the duration of the time he is in your house. That's your right.

However, I agree about boys and this kind of thing. My son had no exposure at all to superheroes until he went to preschool. Suddenly he was pretending to cobber people with his "lifesaver" (lightsaber). Although, to be honest, he was never very interested in pretending to actually be batman or superman.

I wouldn't have wanted any kid pretending to shoot my 11mo, however. That sounds like it's less about superheroes per se than about appropriate behavior.

As for people wanting to give you batman toys etc. after you've expressed a preference not to get them, there is no need to make a big deal. Simply take the toy and donate it to goodwill.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Yeah mine is still a baby superheros are meaningless to him, I just see no reason to introduce them so soon. I guess part of what bothers be about the child I keep (whom I adore) is that he's actually allowed to SEE all these movies but the BioDad and his parents (though the Mom asked them not to, she has given in to all the toys). I also know it's normal for kids to have an "obsession" about dinosaurs or cars or superheros. I guess it's mostly the violence of superheros that gets to me.

My mother did not allow "weapons" play nor any toys or games where killing living things is a main theme. Did we all play that way with friends? Oh yeah we did but it was never a big thing for us. It was an occasional thing now an all day every day thing.

LOL I was totally unprepared to be the mother of a boy even though I am a total tomboy! The other day he managed to EAT half a beetle! EWWWWWWW I was so grossed out







My MIL (with 3 boys) just laughed at that!

I am really enjoying all of your advice and stories! Thanks!


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## MisaGoat (Jul 10, 2006)

I think that you will find, as your son gets older, that the force of superheros is too great to resist. He will hear about them from other children even if you do not allow the characters in your home or him to watch the movies/shows. My son is running around now shooting out spiderwebs like Spiderman. Has he seen the movie or read any comics? No, he did see a preview and like 10 minutes of it but he started acting out Spiderman before that.

The superheros/princess concept, I think appeals to children especially 4-5 year olds as they try to process the world into good and bad. In the superhero/princess stories there are villains and the hero so it is very clear what/who is good/bad.

It also goes along with the gun/sword/lightsaber dillemma, we don't allow any toys like that but they are made out of legos, sticks, etc. I think the most important thing is to discuss what these things mean to our children.


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## Bluegoat (Nov 30, 2008)

My girls are obsessed with princesses, and fairies. I get to be the Evil Queen. Though it's not all bad - yesterday my two year old told me "I love you, Evil Queen!"


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## mamadelbosque (Feb 6, 2007)

Yeah, just another vote for good luck limiting it. Its not gonna happen. I suppose you can be super restrictive and simply not "let" them play weapons/fighting/etc in your house... but then your stifilign their imagination. Do you really want to do that? No? Then don't.


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

You have every right to not have gun play directed toward your babe in your home. You could just tell him those are the house rules or get playful with it and say I'm shooting kisses, can you think of something nice to shoot at me?

My son was talking about Spiderman and Ironman long before he actually SAW them in front of him. I swear it's osmosis.
ETA: Oh, and by day 3 of preschool, he was shooting at me with his tinker toy. We went from "no gun play" to "no pretending to shoot me in the face". Sigh.


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## elmh23 (Jul 1, 2004)

When people want to give him things with a superhero on them, just say no thanks.

But, my son was play fighting and shooting LONG before he discovered superheros. Superheros have actually been really good for his play since before he would take stuff (essentially be a "bad guy" but didn't know what that was.) Now he is a good guy, rescuing stuff (teddy bears, etc.) which makes me feel better at least.

Some kids play fight, some do not. IME, introduction to superheros doesn't cause every child to start fighting. Some kids are just more physical.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Maybe you could create some opportunities for appropriate super hero play. If your family wants to get him super hero toys have them get him a cape and a mask. Play with the boys to create an imaginary super hero that is gentle and kind and helps people and animals. It won't last for ever. Regardless of if my kids are playing super hero, house, school, princesses there always seems to emerge a good guy and bad guy. it seems like something kids just to need to embrace. to work it out. Perhaps instead of banning super hero stuff (these are his comfort objects and entertainment) just worry about his behavior (no play fighting with the baby. we play gently). There is no reason super heros have to be violent or incite a riot.


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## thehighernest (Aug 11, 2009)

I'm completely not prepared to raise a boy either, but I'm trying to soak up as much info. as I can on the art of raising boys. FWIW, I enjoyed reading Killing Monsters: Why Children Need Fantasy, Super Heroes, and Make-Believe Violence.

Having said that, yeah, why is anyone giving a 1 year old superhero figures???


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## mum4vr (Jan 31, 2007)

btdt-- all over the map on this one. DS1 never had nor wanted weapons/ superheroes (didn't even see Toy Story 'til he was like 7! bc I thought it was pretty competitive for a young child) Anyway, his first exposure to weapons was a disturbed child at pre school shouting KILL! KILL! KILL! and chopping the head off a stuffed animal with a plastic butter knife. Yeah, good times.

We still did no kill, no weapons play until the force could not be reckoned with, then we went to no shooting at living things, and finally no shooting at people. I still say this to children at church or the park-- "we don't kill PEOPLE!"

Anyway-- they're boys! Excess testosterone from before birth! My boys do now fish and hunt (like, for food, not sport; not that they've ever been uh, successful hunters, yet, LOL) DS1 now makes pocket money butchering smallish livestock for friends and tanning hides. (See, it could be worse, you could have 8 coyote hides drying in your carport, like I do right now







)

They totally ream anyone among their friends who is careless w a weapon, even a bb gun or airsoft, even if the muzzle accidently points toward a person in an unloaded, half-disassembled weapon, so they get it. They value life and personal safety.

What bothers me the most is the slow shift in values on my part. Still not sure whether I changed my own values or caved, and THAT is where it's at for my peace of mind.

You are right, tho to insist on no weapons/ violent toys at your house, and never let the child pretend to kill people-- it's just not something young children should emulate or practice, IMO. You may be the only one in that child's life teaching him life is too sacred for that to be ok, even as a joke, even in play.

blessings









boys are a whole new kind of fun, eh?


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## savithny (Oct 23, 2005)

I don't know any kids who play "named" superheroes who just reenact the movies over and over again. I know as a kid, when the neighborhood gang all started playing "Star Wars" all over the block, we weren't slavishly following the movie like a script at all -- in fact, in general we weren't reenacting the movie becuase, y'know, that had been done already.

Have you ever really watched a group of kids playing superhero play? They come up with their own scenarios and act them out. Generally, the characters shape the roles each participant is taking (bad guy, good guy, etc), but that's just the launching point.


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## cileag (Aug 16, 2008)

http://www.askmoxie.org/2010/08/disc...th-others.html

This chapter in this book really surprised me--maybe it'll help you be ok with the exposure you can't control?


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

I just wanted to say I don't find superheroes at odds with my values much.

I mean yes, sure, the shows have violence and I'm not about to screen _Dark Knight_. I'm not rushing out to increase our plastic merch (although we have some) and if we do screen something it tends to be vintage stuff back when they didn't do much that was gory.

But standing up for what is right and even intervening with force if necessary to protect innocent people isn't something that bothers me. It's an archetypal story. I kind of prefer that to some of the kids stuff on the market that is sort of - chaotic and disorganized. I really prefer Mr. Rogers but even he has that witch puppet hanging out with him in the world of make believe.









That said our rule is all the play has to be consensual. 11 month olds can't consent so that would be a no go.


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## Lisa1970 (Jan 18, 2009)

The "super heros" are worships for some sort of super power that allows them to save people or something. I don't think they are harmful. But all the super hero movies like Batman and Spiderman are disgusting and over the top for kids. I could not believe it when my son was the only child in kindergarten to not see Indiana Jones. That movie was completely inappropriate for children. I don't know why these adults movies are being advertised targeted at children. I don't allow my children to see those movies, or any movie that I feel is inappropriate. I don't think just the general idea of super heros will hurt your children, but I think there are issues with not wanting your children to see the movies. I think that there is a lot of out of date advice out there regarding to how harmful these things can be to kids. The movies are so intense and gross and ...ok.....I have to go, sorry, wish I could add more. Children calling.


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## dawncayden (Jan 24, 2006)

My 4.5 year old LOVES superheroes








It all started when he was 3 years old at a thrift store when he found a Superman stuffie with cape and HAD TO HAVE IT! He didn't know who it was and as far as I knew had never seen anything like it. But it all began that day.
From then on, I was on the lookout for 'appropriate' hero play, as in, Early Reader comics that were more appropriate for a younger child, or just some hero toys, or costumes. I actually found that his imaginative play has flourished since loving heroes. He makes up his own stories surrounding his hero toys and his dress-ups, as well as he incorporates the stories from the Early Reader comics.
We allow weapon play and rough play in our house but we also have strict rules about it too. Everyone involved has to be having fun during the play. We have to be respectful of boundaries, and when someone says 'no or stop', then we have to listen to them.
We don't involve babies in the play usually since 'they don't understand what the game is' yet.
If someone shots at me and I don't want to play then I just tell them, no thank you I don't want to play, and they listen to that.

In your situation though, you son is so young. It is strange that people are giving you toys for him concerning superheroes already. I'd probably just put them away for when he is older. Don't most of them have a 3+ on them anyway.

I would be setting some rules about when and how the older boy can be playing at your house. I would have a 'no involving the baby' rule for sure. Maybe tell him he needs to protect the baby...that sometimes helps


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Thanks all! I am checking all the links out and have put _Raising Cain_ in my Netflix Queue.

I will surely try to steer him towards more "rescue" type play rather than killing play. Perhaps he would enjoy "rescuing" the baby instead of ambushing the baby.

In my Mother's house weapons were a big NO but my grandfather hunted and taught all of us about guns. I am pretty proficient in handling weapons though it has been quite a while since I handled more than a bb gun LOL. I am just against play killing and DH is with me on this one. It's not so much that I expect my son to never engage in this type of play, I just want to control the exposure more. Sooner or later he'll want to know what that blue light saber hanging above his door is for LOL!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lisa1970* 
The "super heros" are worships for some sort of super power that allows them to save people or something. I don't think they are harmful. But all the super hero movies like Batman and Spiderman are disgusting and over the top for kids.

I didn't know they were aimed at kids. I never saw much of the advertising for those movies, except for trailers once or twice, but they didn't seem particularly kid focused to me.

Part of the problem with the movies is that they're drawn from the current renditions of the superheroes. Comics like Batman and Spider-Man have changed a _lot_ over the last 20-25 years, and they've become much, much darker than they used to be (although the original Batman, of the 30s, was _hardcore_). So, those heroes are straddling two very different kinds of worlds...the modern, dark universe which is definitely not meant for kids, and the older one, which was much more kid friendly.

My kids have seen the Spider-Man movies. They haven't seen Dark Knight. _I_ couldn't even stomach Dark Knight, and I'm a Batman fan from waaaayyyy back.

Quote:

I could not believe it when my son was the only child in kindergarten to not see Indiana Jones. That movie was completely inappropriate for children.
Different people draw the lines in different places, and for different reasons. My kids have all seen the Star Wars trilogy (the original one - the prequels suck, and I have no interest in renting them to see again), all four Indiana Jones movies, and the Lord of the Rings trilogy. Lots of people wouldn't be okay with that for their children, and that's fine. I don't have a problem with it.

OP: I can't help you with the superhero issue, as I have no problem with superheroes. But, as far as toys coming to your house, you definitely have the right to just say "no", and not allow it. If the mom sends it, anyway, put it up and don't let the boy play with it until he leaves. The mom will get the message. If you really don't like the way he plays with your son, then it's probably best to stop watching him.

And, I have to agree with those who wonder why your _baby_ is getting superhero toys. That seems odd.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lisa1970* 
The "super heros" are worships for some sort of super power that allows them to save people or something. I don't think they are harmful. But all the super hero movies like Batman and Spiderman are disgusting and over the top for kids. I could not believe it when my son was the only child in kindergarten to not see Indiana Jones. That movie was completely inappropriate for children. I don't know why these adults movies are being advertised targeted at children. I don't allow my children to see those movies, or any movie that I feel is inappropriate. I don't think just the general idea of super heros will hurt your children, but I think there are issues with not wanting your children to see the movies. I think that there is a lot of out of date advice out there regarding to how harmful these things can be to kids. The movies are so intense and gross and ...ok.....I have to go, sorry, wish I could add more. Children calling.

I totally agree that if parents aren't okay with movies, then don't show them to your kids. I'd kind of disagree though that all/many/most superhero movies (the recent reboots anyway) are geared solely or even really geared at all to kids.

Just like there is the kid's versions of King Arthur and the gallant knights vs. the adult infidelity versions (and the Christian versions, and the pagan versions, and the feminist versions and...) there are loads of versions of superheroes. Obviously as parents we have a few years anyway where we can decide which versions are okay or not okay.

And part of the pleasure of maturing, I think, is to revisit stories with new understanding. I'm re-reading Swiss Family Robinson for the first time since I was a kid and where before it was just all so much fun now I'm like "now I totally get why the mother didn't want the husband going back out to the shipwreck!" and "seriously, is there any way one family can get so much DONE in a day on a desert island?"

Anyway, just saying that for me superheroes (and heros in general) are a lot broader than a particular movie.

OP I actually came back to mention that in the range of horrible plastic toys there is a series called Rescue Heroes - firemen, etc. - that are pretty playable. 11 months is still way _way_ too young but if you were looking for a compromise with your family that might be one way to go in the future.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
I hate hearing "I'm going to KILL that guy" from a preschooler.

I think it's perfectly fine for you to have some house rules about language and violent play. If one of DS's friends talked about killing someone in my house I'd tell him to stop, and if he refused he'd be sent home -- that's not how we talk in this house. So, views about superheroes aside, it's perfectly within your rights to have rules about behavior for this boy while you're watching him.


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## ssh (Aug 12, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cascadian* 
I dunno. I think it's a good, albeit blunt, way about teaching morality, strength, wanting good to triumph over evil. I think that wearing a mask and personifying a person with strength and goodness is a good thing, as is playing the shadow side (the villain) and *knowing* that it's wrong.

In the land of childhood make-believe, we can't always be the 'good guys' if there are no 'baddies', and darnit...sometimes it's just *fun*.

My kids love imaginary play. They play weddings, pirates, fairies, astronauts, scientists, etc. etc. They've also played funeral, cops 'n robbers and war. It's sure opened up some great conversations. I can't imagine being so hypervigilant to shield them or divert their games to my agenda.

Sorry...I guess I don't agree with censoring imaginative play.

I agree with this.

But I also don't let almost 5 year old DD watch movies that have alot of violence so she's only seen a couple of spiderman, one star wars, and one teenage mutant ninja turtle movie. She did inherit some jurastic park toys, star trek action figures, a batman and a teenage mutant ninja turtle from my DH and an old friend of his. She thinks superheros save people from all sorts of things including falling from great heights or getting 'trapped' in a box. Lately her princess dolls have been transforming into superheros and saving each other. One of her dolls transforms into a giraffe (shleich model) that can fly and then saves the other princess dolls. I'm not disturbed by the flying giraffe kicking the T-Rex in the head and grabbing a princess from it's jaws. We haven't had a problem with play fighting and we've always had sword rules (like only hit other swords with your sword or pretend the tree is a dragon). We don't allow talk about killing real people, but the T-Rex can talk about killing one of the dragons or even 'eat' the model animals.


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## Alyantavid (Sep 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ChetMC* 
This is how I feel too.

Kids don't just imagine and pretend happy things. Kids use play to explore all sorts of concepts and feelings.

The only real rule we have is that when kids play together it has to be fun for everybody who is playing. It's fair to not buy the props, but I'm not comfortable telling kids what they can and cannot pretend.

That. You can control what he's exposed to now, but at some point, he'll play with another child and figure it out. In my experience, boys especially, go through a stage where they're obsessed with this kind of stuff. With my kids, I've found that talking to them about the good that superheroes do is much more effective than just not allowing it.

Good luck. Raising Cain is a great resource for moms of boys. I don't get why mine do most of what they do but that book has helped a ton.


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## karne (Jul 6, 2005)

The images of good and evil are very, very powerful for children. You can look to classic fairytales and see this.

We have a rule that inside the home is a "safe spot"-no pretend shooting, light sabers, etc. It's too intense inside. DS is heavily into Star Wars (the real version), and super heros here. I have to say, I don't find that it's the characters, per se, that draw my son, as much as it is the idea of being a good guy, and feeling strong, and being rightous against "bad guys". When I watch this sort of imaginative play going on it's clear that it's feeding something very important.

FWIW, I actually think Star Wars is pretty cool, and I totally love that my little boy loves comics-we do the Marvel and DC comics that are geared for younger kids. He collects them and reads them over and over again. And, never in a million years were these things on my radar before I became the mom of a little boy!


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## jessemoon (May 31, 2004)

I keep recommending this book (about every few months it comes up). It is written for preschool teachers, but I found it very helpful as a parent. It talks about why kids gravitate to superhero/villain play, why they need parts of it and what adults can do to help channel it positively. It also talks about the difference between adult discomfort and damaging aggression.

" Heroes, villains and saving the day! Magic Capes, Amazing Powers explores why children are so strongly attracted to superhero and weapons play, and addresses the resulting concerns of parents and teachers. Unique in its approach to this wildly popular type of play, Magic Capes describes how teachers can use redirection, story-telling, dramatic play materials, anti-bias curriculum and clear limit-setting to guide superhero play in a positive direction that allows children to play and satisfies the concerns of adults."

Very helpful and reassuring.
Magic Capes, Amazing Powers: Transforming Superhero Play in the Classroom

http://www.amazon.com/Magic-Capes-Am...6547296&sr=1-1


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## CatsCradle (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

I totally agree that if parents aren't okay with movies, then don't show them to your kids. I'd kind of disagree though that all/many/most superhero movies (the recent reboots anyway) are geared solely or even really geared at all to kids.
I agree with this. I think it is the job of the parents to educate themselves on what is or is not appropriate for their children. This is why the film industry publishes parental guidelines. Take for instance "Where the Wild Things Are": the film got a lot of criticism because many people thought it was not appropriate for children. The film, however, was marketed to an adult audience. In fact, the film's director, Spike Jonzes (one of my favorites!) said that his goal wasn't to make a movie for children, but rather a film about childhood. I enjoyed "Wild Things" immensely but the dialogue was definitely geared towards adults (nothing obsene, just adults talking to each other and a kid in a complex adult way). That being said, we can complain about marketing all we want, but as the parent we have the last word.


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## ChetMC (Aug 27, 2005)

I just wanted to point out the Raising Cain is also a book.

I'm actually a big fan of all of the Micheal Thompson books that I've read so far. He has several pertaining specifically to boys, and a couple of others that address issues pertaining to both genders, education, etc.


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## Twinklefae (Dec 13, 2006)

I think that there are a lot of ways to work around these issues in an age appropriate way. My DH is a huge comic fan. There was no way my child was not going to be exposed to superheros.

However, these days, while the ADULT movies are out there (and he's never seen them) there are also comics like Tiny Titans and shows like SuperHero Squad which are aimed at children and have little violence and a lot of problem solving.

Along the same idea is the PBS show "Super Why" where fairy tale characters use reading as their super powers.

I've learned over the past few months as DS got really into this, that mostly he wants to wear a cape (We use playsilks right now, I think Santa is bringing a 'real' cape this year) and run around.

He makes the 'shooting' noise, but doesn't connect it anything, so I haven't said much. I have found in my experiences working with children that outlawing a thing usually just makes it more exciting. It's never easy though.


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## junipermuse (Nov 1, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jessemoon* 
I keep recommending this book (about every few months it comes up). It is written for preschool teachers, but I found it very helpful as a parent. It talks about why kids gravitate to superhero/villain play, why they need parts of it and what adults can do to help channel it positively. It also talks about the difference between adult discomfort and damaging aggression.

" Heroes, villains and saving the day! Magic Capes, Amazing Powers explores why children are so strongly attracted to superhero and weapons play, and addresses the resulting concerns of parents and teachers. Unique in its approach to this wildly popular type of play, Magic Capes describes how teachers can use redirection, story-telling, dramatic play materials, anti-bias curriculum and clear limit-setting to guide superhero play in a positive direction that allows children to play and satisfies the concerns of adults."

Very helpful and reassuring.
Magic Capes, Amazing Powers: Transforming Superhero Play in the Classroom

http://www.amazon.com/Magic-Capes-Am...6547296&sr=1-1


I was just coming here to post a recommendation for this book as well.


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## SunshineJ (Mar 26, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
I agree that keeping superheroes and such away from your DS isn't really going to make a difference. Sorry, but little boys especially, love to play rough and will be action figure like characters while pretending whether or not they are exposed to them. They'll make guns out of anything - even their own hand will suffice - so while I get where you are coming from, it's likely that your extended family continues to try to give these gifts b/c they know little boys like them, and it's not going to be the one thing that makes your DS play a bit violently.

Hate to say this, but it's really not limited to little boys! My sweet little 6 year od DD with her long blonde curls routinely gets out in the thick of things with the neighborhood boys and tends to lead the superhero play. Today I saw her with a 6" curved piece of cardboard using it as a "laser shooter"...

I understand your concerns, I really do. DS was always prone to nightmares, and we had to be especially careful with what he watched on tv. When he was 4 and getting ready to go into preschool I didn't want him to be the odd kid out and the only one not knowing about superheros, so we did a gradual exposure. Yeah, totally addicted, with little sis close behind. One thing to look into, either for the child you watch or yours when he's older are the "Classic" superhero videos. These are the OLD Superman and Justice League cartoons that are extremely mild in violence levels. As for the superhero movies with actual people in them, I can't really think of any we've ok'd for DS to watch yet (he's 8) simply because of the violence and language. He has seen the first couple of Star Wars that were released, the 3 Muskateers (LOVED it!) and the first and third Indiana Jones, but that's only been within the past year. If it weren't for the whole masterbation discussion and the fact I'm really not ready to answer questions on that just yet if I don't have to, I'd consider letting him watch Transformers.


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## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

I'm a fan of superheroes.







Growing up, Mum disapproved of them - not because of the violence specifically, more because she had the impression they were "low" entertainment, anti-intellectual, black-and-white, and vaguely associated with nasty, snotty little boys.









Then I grew up a bit and became a geek, and actually learned about superheroes (which Mum never had). And you know what? They're pretty darn cool. Some of the books have fantastic artwork, and really clever writing (Joss Whedon penned a few X-Men comics!). The characters aren't just good-hunky-heroes vs evil-ugly-villains. Iron Man wrestles with alcoholism (OK, not suitable for kids, but y'know, real world issues!): most superheroes agonise about issues of vigilante-ism, abuse of power, the loneliness that comes from being different, etc. Batman doesn't have superpowers, but relies on his talents, inventions and... well, money, but it's still pretty cool that he's up in the big leagues with the guy who's faster than a speeding bullet. Superpowers can be used as obvious or subtle allegories for racism, homophobia, even neurodiversity. A lot of comics reference all sorts of arcane ancient literature, gods, mythology and so on - not always with strict adherence to historical fact, mind you, but it's a good way to obliquely learn a lot about other cultures. You can also get erudite villains who quote Shakespeare and Dante, which is educational.







Comic books can be a good way to learn how to storyboard films - the way the artists tell the stories through framing is pretty sophisticated. And most of the "major" superheroes, at least, have stories which resonate because they're classics. Peter Parker pining after the popular MJ, Clark's love triangle with Lois and his own superhero persona; Bruce Wayne's trauma over his parents' death... it's dramatically good stuff. Impossible situations, tortured love, motives of justice and revenge... you can see why people love it.

Now, that said I haven't gone out of my way to educate 2.5 year old DD about superheroes (yet!). But she's caught on to Superman and Batman by reading her father's comics - in fact, when we watched Sleeping Beauty the other day she looked at Maleficent and said "Batman!"







We won't be showing her The Dark Knight for a long time (I didn't like it much anyway - Heath Ledger was great, but the plot was way too convoluted and political), but I don't think her current level of awareness is doing her any harm. I think she mostly likes the cloaks, actually.







But when she's bigger, I might just work a superhero study unit into our homeschool curriculum. They're worthwhile.


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## Wild Lupine (Jul 22, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lilyka* 
Maybe you could create some opportunities for appropriate super hero play. If your family wants to get him super hero toys have them get him a cape and a mask. Play with the boys to create an imaginary super hero that is gentle and kind and helps people and animals. It won't last for ever. Regardless of if my kids are playing super hero, house, school, princesses there always seems to emerge a good guy and bad guy. it seems like something kids just to need to embrace. to work it out. Perhaps instead of banning super hero stuff (these are his comfort objects and entertainment) just worry about his behavior (no play fighting with the baby. we play gently). There is no reason super heros have to be violent or incite a riot.









for when your son is older. My daughter loves to dress up as Spiderman and runs around helping people.

But 11 months is very young for these kinds of toys. It sounds more like gender stereotyping that being pro-superhero. Along with being totally unaware of what a baby might like to play with.

You could quietly put them away, and if they ask say he's too young to enjoy them now. Then when he's older you can sort through what you think is OK and what isn't.


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## JamieCatheryn (Dec 31, 2005)

I'm really happy with the superhero play DS, who's 4, does right now. He wears his cape, gets a phone call that somebody needs help, flies to the rescue and saves the person/animal that's stuck, injured, or threatened by a dragon or tiger or a pirate, sometimes killing the offender with a sword, sometimes convincing it to be friendly.

Dark superhero stuff comics and movies like batman, ironman, the watchman, are in no way for kids IMO. Playing superhero and telling some stories, though, seems pretty alright. Oh and I'm not a fan of letting kids obsess over licensed characters and products, so yeah I'd decline the action figures if possible, or let him play with it a couple days then donate it.


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## nixnc (Aug 6, 2010)

i was a single parent with my oldest son for the first 6 years of his life. at first, i was adamant about no guns, shooting, fighting, etc. then he went to preschool. this is no lie--the first evening after coming home from preschool, i fixed him a pb&j, cut in half. he ate it into the shape of a gun and proceeded to shoot at the cat. this made me realize i was not going to be able to control every single aspect of his life and i lightened up a bit. we discussed appropriate play, etc. since then, i adopted the theory that as long as you have an open dialogue with your children and be honest with them about things, toys are toys. we discuss gun safety, and my now husband has even taken him to shooting ranges with gun lessons where gun safety is a must. (he's 14 now and the gun craze subsided a few years ago).

my best friend has 4 children that are heavily sensored in everything from tv to toys to music and movies. you name it, she regulates it. which is fine by me, this is her style of parenting. that being said, she does keep my youngest son (5) and will watch the new baby when i go back to work after the birth.

we are pretty liberal with what our children watch/hear/play because i know for a fact i cannot regulate what they see at other people's houses. if i tell my child "you can't watch this" there is some other child that is allowed to watch it and he's going to go over there to do so. to eliminate untruthfulness and confusion, our children are allowed to watch a lot of stuff other kids aren't WITH US so we can explain it and discuss things like: this isn't real life, movies are fantasy, etc. we also discuss appropriate times they can discuss these movies, etc: not at school, not at aunt kelli's (the above mentioned friend), not at the dinner table, etc.

i do NOT allow nathan to take any toys/movies/etc over to aunt kelli's that she doesn't approve of because that is her request and i would never want to offend her. she knows how i feel and she respects it, but it is her house and i would never disrespect her.

i have also discussed this issue with nathan's preschool teacher when we had him at the Y the last 2 years (he's in kindergarten now). i was concerned he was talking about/playing inappropriately during school time. the teacher assured me that when you get boys together, whether they are exposed to it at home or not, they will be exposed to it at school or the park etc.

also, the more you prohibit something, the more it makes them want it. case in point: when aunt kelli's oldest son comes to visit, he BEGS to play video games that contain guns and out of respect for her i don't allow him to do so. however, if she allowed him to explore the option of gun fantasy, i don't think he would be craving it soo much.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smokering* 
I'm a fan of superheroes.







Growing up, Mum disapproved of them - not because of the violence specifically, more because she had the impression they were "low" entertainment, anti-intellectual, black-and-white, and vaguely associated with nasty, snotty little boys.









Then I grew up a bit and became a geek, and actually learned about superheroes (which Mum never had). And you know what? They're pretty darn cool. Some of the books have fantastic artwork, and really clever writing (Joss Whedon penned a few X-Men comics!). The characters aren't just good-hunky-heroes vs evil-ugly-villains. Iron Man wrestles with alcoholism (OK, not suitable for kids, but y'know, real world issues!): most superheroes agonise about issues of vigilante-ism, abuse of power, the loneliness that comes from being different, etc. Batman doesn't have superpowers, but relies on his talents, inventions and... well, money, but it's still pretty cool that he's up in the big leagues with the guy who's faster than a speeding bullet. Superpowers can be used as obvious or subtle allegories for racism, homophobia, even neurodiversity. A lot of comics reference all sorts of arcane ancient literature, gods, mythology and so on - not always with strict adherence to historical fact, mind you, but it's a good way to obliquely learn a lot about other cultures. You can also get erudite villains who quote Shakespeare and Dante, which is educational.







Comic books can be a good way to learn how to storyboard films - the way the artists tell the stories through framing is pretty sophisticated. And most of the "major" superheroes, at least, have stories which resonate because they're classics. Peter Parker pining after the popular MJ, Clark's love triangle with Lois and his own superhero persona; Bruce Wayne's trauma over his parents' death... it's dramatically good stuff. Impossible situations, tortured love, motives of justice and revenge... you can see why people love it.










I was a major comic fan from about age 7 or 8 until my early 20s. I had to drop them all, because I just couldn't afford to lay out that much money for something that gave me such a short amount of reading time. And, I'm not really into the current ones much. (I think Spider-Man's character has been pretty much destroyed in the last few years.) But, they're a _lot_ more layered than many people realize.


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## Shahbazin (Aug 3, 2006)

I do agree that the "superhero" thing is both pervasive, & has roots in the earliest human myth. FWIW, my girls are allowed to watch PBS, & some DVDs (not "whatever is on") & their imaginative play usually involves Schleich animals & people, & stuffed animals playing out scenarios very loosely based on Super Why, Narnia, the Lion King, the Last Unicorn, & the dinosaur scene from Fantasia. See Mufasa, Simba, Scar & Aslan (a purple stuffed lion) save the 'spikysauraus' or the prince or whatever, from TRex, the Red Bull, & the White Witch, assisted by various princes, princesses, unicorns, flying pigs & assorted other characters - some with little capes tied on them - or maybe the lions just eat all the dinosaurs & horses "because they're hungry, & lions eat a lot!"


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## hollytheteacher (Mar 10, 2007)

My son is only allowed to watch PBS shows and he is in LOVE with Iron Man. He knows nothing of the story, Nothing about the comic books or anything, but he still is in love with Iron man, likes to pretend to be Iron man and can identify Iron man cardboard cut outs at the mall/movie posters/etc.

It's probably because he loves the song "I am Iron Man...do dee do dee do dee do do do do" or at least that's how he sings it.

I would never allow him to watch the movie or even hear the stories or whatever, but it does not bother me that he "plays" Iron man...in fact someone at DH's work got a little Iron Man happy meal toy and gave it to DS and he likes to rock it to sleep and carry it in a homemade baby wrap


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## ChristyMarie (May 31, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ctdoula* 
No, you're not the only one who feels like this. But you're also a few years from finding out on your own it's almost a force that's beyond your control.

I felt in a similar way. Our son had no idea was anything was... until last year. He was four and a halloween costume catalog came in the mail. I was innocent enough to let him flip through it in the car.... and THAT.WAS.IT. He saw a photo of a Darth Vadar costume and I swear the male cells in his little body were all switched on. He took one look, said "I want to be this... who is this?" and BAM... he was 100% addicted/interested in ANYTHING star wars. He now knows more about Star Wars than my husband.

I swear... it's in the DNA. Shrug. I've done my best to channel the energy as best we can, but I'm beyond trying to prohibit it. He plays light saber. We try enforce no shooting, especially at people.











This is why my son has a light saber. He has no idea who it is but he HAD TO HAVE IT.

Spider man undies are his favorite. He has no clue who spider man is beyond the fact that he's red and looks really cool. *shrug*


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## EdnaMarie (Sep 9, 2006)

I felt that way too.

About princesses, too.

But I agree with ctdoula. It's just... I mean, if you have a very quiet child that doesn't much care for playing with other children, who is very bookish and only likes an empty park, and who has few cousins or lives in I don't know, some commune in Vermont, I'd say you're good to go.

If your child is anything like mine-- She's a girl for God's sake! And she still makes guns! We don't have guns, we don't buy guns, other kids her age at the park don't have guns, she saw boys at pre-school playing with Lego guns I guess and... the long and the short of it is, she loves other kids and it just takes one kid to introduce The Drama of the Superhero or The Magic of Royalty and we're all exposed for life.

Yeah. Anyway. You just don't have that much control over it. And I don't live in the US. I live in Germany and my child attends a German pre-school. True, there are a lot of Russians there, but I mean...

We don't watch TV more than 30 min. a week. She gets to play PBS kids.org when she fills up her star book for the day (another thing I thought I'd never, ever, ever, ever, EVER do, not the videos, or the star book :sigh ). But it's everywhere.

Everywhere. Even Dora. And you know what kind of bike my daughter wants?

"I want a Batman bike."

Ask me how she knows about Batman. ASK.


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## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

Quote:

I was a major comic fan from about age 7 or 8 until my early 20s. I had to drop them all, because I just couldn't afford to lay out that much money for something that gave me such a short amount of reading time.
I know, right! I don't buy them - well, I never even buy "real" books except for twice a year at the Red Cross sale, 'cause I'm cheap - but we have a flatmate who moved in with a whole bookshelf of them. He's a single guy without many living expenses, but boy, does he shell out for those things. It's pretty handy, really.







So I'm working my way slowly through his collection - I've read Fray and some of the Buffy comics, a few Iron Mans, a few Batmans and Justice Leagues, the first Marvel Zombies (which is awesome!), V for Vendetta, which is really a graphic novel, but hey: just bits and pieces. It took me a while to get into the format of comic books - I VASTLY prefer it when they come with the whole arc in one volume, not all these tiny piecey cheap-looking magazines with no conclusions - but I'm starting to get a better grip on which artwork's good, which villains bore me and so on. I'm a sucker for superhero movies, too - Green Lantern's coming out next year on my birthday, but I'll (hopefully) have just had a baby, so - dilemma!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Smokering* 
I know, right! I don't buy them - well, I never even buy "real" books except for twice a year at the Red Cross sale, 'cause I'm cheap - but we have a flatmate who moved in with a whole bookshelf of them. He's a single guy without many living expenses, but boy, does he shell out for those things. It's pretty handy, really.







So I'm working my way slowly through his collection - I've read Fray and some of the Buffy comics, a few Iron Mans, a few Batmans and Justice Leagues, the first Marvel Zombies (which is awesome!), V for Vendetta, which is really a graphic novel, but hey: just bits and pieces. It took me a while to get into the format of comic books - I VASTLY prefer it when they come with the whole arc in one volume, not all these tiny piecey cheap-looking magazines with no conclusions - but I'm starting to get a better grip on which artwork's good, which villains bore me and so on. I'm a sucker for superhero movies, too - Green Lantern's coming out next year on my birthday, but I'll (hopefully) have just had a baby, so - dilemma!









Green Lantern was one of my favourites for a very, very long time. I also found our recently that one of my favourite SF authors was heavily involved in setting up back story about the Guardians, the Corps, Malthus, etc. I usually wait for superhero movies to come out on DVD, but I think I may go see this one in the theater. DH won't be interested, so maybe I can get ds1 to go with me. (I don't mind seeing movies alone, but I like to talk to someone about them afterwards.)


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## gcgirl (Apr 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *grumpybear* 
We've had to be creative on what to say about why Wolverine needs those claws.

He's a chef!


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## Lula's Mom (Oct 29, 2003)

I try very hard to stay away from the branded superhero stuff- I have just gently discouraged family from buying stuff like that. But as far as "fighting" and acting out violent play, I have gotten used to it as my son gets older.

My son's *favorite* thing in the world is to playfight with his dad. It's very physical, with ds jumping on DH, and DH throwing him in the air and down onto the couch. It's not something I get involved in- it's clear to me that this is the way ds wants to bond with his dad. He feels loved when they act out these aggressive fantasies together.

I wasn't always comfortable with it, but reading things like this recent article helped me understand ds better. Bring it: Boys may benefit from aggressive play


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## ASusan (Jun 6, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EdnaMarie* 
And you know what kind of bike my daughter wants?

"I want a Batman bike."

Ask me how she knows about Batman. ASK.

How does she know about batman?


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## berry987 (Apr 23, 2008)

I haven't read all the responses, so I hope I'm not too repetitive. I have three sons and had plans to be weapon and sword and pretend-violence-free. Ha. Ha. And Ha. I grew up with 3 sisters and a much older brother so I had no idea that many, many boys are born with a desire to play like they are fighting and conquering. As much as my feminist and pacifist brain might argue with these values, I see my sons and how those story lines inspire and ignite their imaginations and I've come to realize that they are free to play how they want. They have swords and lightsabers and Star Wars blasters now and run around like little heroes, but they are sweet, kind, wonderful little boys and I have no doubt their imaginative play is NOT making them violent. They save bugs on the sidewalk, protect their younger neighbors, and are just generally soft, sweet little guys.


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## EdnaMarie (Sep 9, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ASusan* 
How does she know about batman?

Hah! Well. You see. One day we went to an all-wood park surrounded by trees. It was so pretty. Sun shining, children in all cotton and Keens, whole-grain homemade snack packed. One of those times you think, "Yes. I am a good mom and we are outdoors, we planned ahead, and this day is going great."

So up come two older boys, around seven. Good boys. They listen to me when I tell them not to run too fast near the baby, not to raise their swords above their waists unless they are out of the baby airspace.

"Really? You've never seen Batman?" Incredulous look.
"He's SO COOL!"
"He has a cape!"

Pan out to watch two wonderful little boys teach my daughter all the rules of Superheros.

On the walk home: "Superheros aren't scary, mom! They're good! They fight bad guys! I wanna be a superhero!"

Now, she was already aware of Star Wars thanks to an overzealous dad (not hers, her cousin's). But she was afraid. This was just the icing on the cake.

I give up!


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

OP your son is 11 months old. Dont think of a blanket statement as no superheroes. think in terms of as you see your child grow and flourish what attracts him.

my dd was a fan of superheroes from the age of 1. esp. spiderman. and of course bob the builder.

HOW?

from beach towels at Target. she ignored hte princess stuff till she was 5, she ignored stuffed toys till seh was 3. still isnt quite into them. but she loves super heroes.

she is a precocious child and a thinker. and a great surprise to me. when she first saw tom and jerry (which to me is worse than super heroes) around 3 at a friends house she fell in love with that show. she loved all the voices and the art. that there was violence she totally 'didnt see'.

you would be surprised without any exposure what kind of imagination our chilidren have. at early 3 our cat miscarried. dd was really looking forward to the birth and had really gotten into all about kittens. then all we saw were drops of blood. so she made up scary horrific bloody violent stories to figure out what happened to those kittens. her stories not only shocked me but my friends too.

i think you have an opportunity to working with that little boy who comes to play. let him bring his superheroes (if you take them away its like taking food away from a little boy) and you sit and play with him and see if you steer his play towards non killing games. in other words maybe teach him to be a little more nurturing.

dd first saw spiderman when she was 3 1/2. by the time she was 4 she was watching ninja turtles. all her friends were boys. and it was amazing to me what she 'saw' there versus what anyone would 'see'. while she followed the story line she asked some deep deep question. and she thought about things a lot more. we actually got into a conversation about capital punishment (i have no idea at 4 how she learnt about the death penalty). to date she is absolutely against that. it was at 4 she brought up if hte bad guys is bad because he kills then why arent we the bad guys too?

at 3 because of her home made by gma princess cape dd because super princess spider girl.

i think what you can do is instead of removing the 'picture' of superheroes you can change the role they play.


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## captain optimism (Jan 2, 2003)

Wow, I was all ready to complain about censoring creative play until I understood that your child was 11 months old! My policy on any commercial stuff (Disney, etc.) was to tell anyone who was receptive that I thought those companies should pay ME to advertise their shoddy creative product on my perfect, beautiful child. I completely understand you feeling the same.

But the issue of playing with violence in creative play is broader than Superman pajamas on a toddler. I think kids want to work out the stuff in the world around them in their play.

I never censored violent play, but my child hasn't been interested in play fighting. I think this year, when he's 7, is the first one where he's played bad guys/good guys games with play weapons and fake violence. In kindergarten, he sometimes hung on the edges of the boys' Star Wars games, but mainly involved a few friends in playing a game of his own devising about prairie dogs avoiding creatures made of hot lava.

Even now, when he plays weapons games, he will tell me, "We're playing weapons--they are pretend and we aren't using them close to each other's bodies." (There's a little girl who sometimes seems confused about this, so my ds has a little spiel.)

I hear other moms trying to get their younger children to pretend they are tranquilizing a scary wolf instead of killing it, or wishing their child wasn't playing guns. I guess that's a way of communicating your values to your child. I prefer to emphasize the difference between real and pretend. I mean, we're vegetarians and we talk a lot about why that is, and special effects in movies and how the people who pretend to fight in them are usually friends, that sort of thing.


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## operamommy (Nov 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
I agree that keeping superheroes and such away from your DS isn't really going to make a difference. Sorry, but little boys especially, love to play rough and will be action figure like characters while pretending whether or not they are exposed to them. They'll make guns out of anything - even their own hand will suffice - so while I get where you are coming from, it's likely that your extended family continues to try to give these gifts b/c they know little boys like them, and it's not going to be the one thing that makes your DS play a bit violently.

Definately! I have 3 boys, and like a pp said, it's like it's in their DNA! What we have tried to do is provide superheroes that we feel are acceptable - because I strongly feel that little boys need *something* to fill that role. If you don't provide it, then of course they will go with Batman, Wolverine, etc. We focus on knights a lot - stories of King Arthur and also Robin Hood.

I have to add that I don't feel all modern superheroes are bad - not at all. My ds1 LOVED Star Wars as a young boy. I can't wait for my two younger sons (10 and 12 years younger than ds1) to be old enough for The Force!


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## Smokering (Sep 5, 2007)

Isn't Robin Hood at least as amoral as Batman? One's a vigilante in a city where every level of justice is corrupt to the core; the other steals from the rich to give to the poor, making him also kind of a vigilante in a corrupt world, only attacking rather more nebulous villains (random rich barons, not mob bosses). Don't get me wrong, I like 'em both, but I'm not sure I'd say Robin Hood is _more_ appropriate/black and white/virtuous than Batman.


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## grumpybear (Oct 5, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gcgirl* 
He's a chef!

LOL. That's a good one!
For now, Wolverine just uses his claws to chop firewood (DS sees his dad do that).
But I could totally see him being a chef!


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## Megan73 (May 16, 2007)

My two-year-old just told me Dr. Doom (DH leaves his comics around) was going to come and eat him. But then again, he'd said earlier Frere Jacques was going to eat him so I guess French folk songs are out, too.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Thanks for all the replies. I admit to being confused by the "there is no way to avoid it" my mother raised us (including boys) without violent, aggressive play or weapons play. She simply did not allow it. All of us were (and still are) VERY imaginative and never felt stifled by the rules. "No toy weapons" to us was just like "no blue hair" LOL.

It makes me a little sad to hear from so many Moms (especially at MDC) that there is nothing I can do to prevent my little boy from violent weapons play and "killing".

I also admit that I don't understand why limiting this type of play is stifling creativity. The child I keep will ONLY play with action figures and weapons, he will ONLY reenact movie scenes, rarely making up his own scenarios. He does not color, play with blocks etc. How is this creative?

I am still reading the links provided here. Thanks SO much for all your input!


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## meemee (Mar 30, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
I also admit that I don't understand why limiting this type of play is stifling creativity. The child I keep will ONLY play with action figures and weapons, he will ONLY reenact movie scenes, rarely making up his own scenarios. He does not color, play with blocks etc. How is this creative?

i dont get how that is NOT creativity. his interest is action figures and weapons. if he wasnt given weapons he would create it out of sticks and legos. and he reenacts movie scenes. how is that different from a little girl who copies play from mommy. we call that imaginative pretend play. if i remember correctly he is about 4 or 5. that is a ripe age for pretend and imaginary.

the thing is it is ALSO the age of one mindedness, of obsession. he will have to colour pretty soon enough.

and on top of that there are many kids who DONT like pretend or imaginary play. they just DONT. does that mean if they dont play with blocks its not creative play.

of course i abhor how much violent play there is.

but neither am i against it. i mean if your kid was born in a small tribe his creative play WOULD include violent play expressing the 'killing' he sees around him - like hunting or the killing of their domestic animal.

and another thing, just coz it worked with you guys and your mom doesnt mean it would for your son. i have seeen plenty of 2 year olds - boys and girls - who have not seen anything violent - nothing and they do it on their own.

sometimes at least that's how i feel. we try to 'clean up too much'. not saying that's what you are doing. we get so caught up in the philosophy that we dont look at the reality of life. of what our children want. and that's all i want you to be aware of.


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## GuildJenn (Jan 10, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
Thanks for all the replies. I admit to being confused by the "there is no way to avoid it" my mother raised us (including boys) without violent, aggressive play or weapons play. She simply did not allow it. All of us were (and still are) VERY imaginative and never felt stifled by the rules. "No toy weapons" to us was just like "no blue hair" LOL.

It makes me a little sad to hear from so many Moms (especially at MDC) that there is nothing I can do to prevent my little boy from violent weapons play and "killing".

I also admit that I don't understand why limiting this type of play is stifling creativity. The child I keep will ONLY play with action figures and weapons, he will ONLY reenact movie scenes, rarely making up his own scenarios. He does not color, play with blocks etc. How is this creative?

I am still reading the links provided here. Thanks SO much for all your input!

We were raised in a similar way about certain types of play. Anything violent, noisy, or 'weird' was not okay.

The reason it worked with my sister and I was we did not have room at home to express what really interested us or mattered to us. Losing our parents' approval was really a big deal. Are you sure that none of you ever felt stifled by the rules? And do you know what your brothers were playing at other people's houses, on the schoolyard, etc.?

It's had a lifelong impact on me that as a writer and artist, I struggle with a lot - that what REALLY interests me is not acceptable. Now it's true - not every person or child will react that way. But I know I did.

That said I don't think you have to allow the kid you mind to engage with your son with language you don't allow. But if you were my caregiver, I would wish that you would stop judging my child as "not creative" and my parenting as poor just because he's in a superhero phase. (Which is kind of what it sounds like in this post.)

I find that a little disrespectful.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

No one is saying you have to run out and buy your baby toy guns and action figures (even when he gets older). I have never, and will never, buy toy guns. But, I'm not going to stop the kids from playing cops and robbers, or Spiderman, as they run around the house. I have 3 boys (and 1 girl who sometimes likes this kind of play, too). The only thing you'll do when forbidding creative, "superhero" play, is suppressing that inside them. Why not let it get it out when they are 3 and 5 years old, instead of leaving it so they are intrigued by their friend's shoot'em up video games when they are 11? Not saying those things are exclusive of one another, it's just that letting kids act out what they are imagining can be a good thing - even when it's saving the world or being the one destroying the world. They're just kids. It's all fun and games.


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## Owen'nZoe (Sep 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
Thanks for all the replies. I admit to being confused by the "there is no way to avoid it" my mother raised us (including boys) without violent, aggressive play or weapons play. She simply did not allow it. All of us were (and still are) VERY imaginative and never felt stifled by the rules. "No toy weapons" to us was just like "no blue hair" LOL.


I suppose it depends on the child and the child's interests. My son was 2 when he learned about Star Wars from the other kids at daycare. He came home obsessively talking about "Ha Soda and Dark Feeder". Everything became a lightsaber or a blaster. He stopped wanting to play anything else for well over a year. For awhile when he was 3, I tried preventing him from playing the violent stuff, and he just completely stopped playing. He would literally sit and stare at the wall. I *think* he was still playing Star Warsin his head. I lifted the ban, and he started playing again.

BTW - in real life, my son is about as non-violent as they come. He likes sticking up for other kids, but he never gets physical in real life. He's dealt with a bully so mean that I found myself kind of wishing he'd just deck the kid (*blush*), but my son never did. What the kids play really doesn't determine what they're like outside of play.


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## Doodlebugsmom (Aug 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 

It makes me a little sad to hear from so many Moms (especially at MDC) that there is nothing I can do to prevent my little boy from violent weapons play and "killing".

Well then this article, from a 2006 issue of Mothering Magazine, is sure to surprise you!


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## EdnaMarie (Sep 9, 2006)

Wow, we were allowed toy weapons (no killing in front of mom... we just waited until she left) AND blue hair. Not on her dime, though.


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## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

I was just thinking about this more. My kids have light sabers, and toy swords (ala the foam ones made by lego). But they just don't happen to have toy guns, as I guess I draw the line there - maybe b/c I'm anti-real gun, too. I dunno. But, they certainly make guns out of other objects at times, including with their own hands - so I can't all-out ban 'gun play' even if I wanted to. I guess I can't imagine being that strict and being able to actually enforce it (especially with multiple kids). Though, I am sure when I had one who was only a baby, I would have assumed that might be ideal and quite possible. It really doesn't matter how sheltered they are, and how limited their actual toys are - kids, mainly little boys, will act out superhero and even shooting, at times. They will also pretend to be daddies and carry around dolls - and play happily with Barbie dolls if given a chance... so, it's not like they are only interested in possible violent imagination play. Not at all, IME.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Owen'nZoe* 
What the kids play really doesn't determine what they're like outside of play.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GuildJenn* 
We were raised in a similar way about certain types of play. Anything violent, noisy, or 'weird' was not okay.

The reason it worked with my sister and I was we did not have room at home to express what really interested us or mattered to us. Losing our parents' approval was really a big deal. Are you sure that none of you ever felt stifled by the rules? And do you know what your brothers were playing at other people's houses, on the schoolyard, etc.?

It's had a lifelong impact on me that as a writer and artist, I struggle with a lot - that what REALLY interests me is not acceptable. Now it's true - not every person or child will react that way. But I know I did.

That said I don't think you have to allow the kid you mind to engage with your son with language you don't allow. But if you were my caregiver, I would wish that you would stop judging my child as "not creative" and my parenting as poor just because he's in a superhero phase. (Which is kind of what it sounds like in this post.)

I find that a little disrespectful.

For us it was just toy weapons and blue hair. I was in high school in the 80's weird was ok LOL. We never did feel stifled. I was always active in art and music and writing (still am), my siblings were very active in creative areas. Noisy was never an issue. We are all happy, peaceful, loving, successful adults. None of us feel deprived at not being allowed super violent weapons play.

And sure we played some of those things away from home but since we knew it was not allowed at home it was no big deal. It was a fun game nothing more.

I am not trying to insult the child or his parents (although his mother DID NOT want him exposed to such violent programming so young but the Dad's parents undermine her at every turn). I adore the child, but I don't adore the violent play. The mother is also looking for answers as to how to curb this type of play but even after asking he be given NO more super hero stuff for a while just this weekend the Gparants bought him TWELVE new action figures from Ben 10 (which I have not seen). I do wish the child would play ANYTHING else for five minutes I admit.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
No one is saying you have to run out and buy your baby toy guns and action figures (even when he gets older). I have never, and will never, buy toy guns. But, I'm not going to stop the kids from playing cops and robbers, or Spiderman, as they run around the house. I have 3 boys (and 1 girl who sometimes likes this kind of play, too). The only thing you'll do when forbidding creative, "superhero" play, is suppressing that inside them. Why not let it get it out when they are 3 and 5 years old, instead of leaving it so they are intrigued by their friend's shoot'em up video games when they are 11? Not saying those things are exclusive of one another, it's just that letting kids act out what they are imagining can be a good thing - even when it's saving the world or being the one destroying the world. They're just kids. It's all fun and games.

I guess part of it is that I feel like if I give in to violent play at 2 then why not violent video games and movies at 5. I know people whose preschoolers play games like Grand Theft Auto and other uber violent games. One of my dearest friends 6 year old has seen all the Halloween and Friday 13th movies. They say the same thing "Oh it does not faze him" I guess I WANT extreme violence to faze my child. I don't want that to all seem normal to him. IMO "killing" is not play and not normal. But...I never claimed not to be different LOL I will be happy to teach him how to use a gun or to fence when he is old enough but I don't believe guns and swords (or grenades for that matter) are toys.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Doodlebugsmom* 
Well then this article, from a 2006 issue of Mothering Magazine, is sure to surprise you!

Reading now.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Still reading the article but this stuck out to me:

*Encourage Imaginative Weapons Play*
Carlsson-Paige and Levin discuss a continuum of play, from the imaginative to the imitative. In imaginative play, children's needs are being met: the play is initiated from within, they are in control, and they bring to their play the issues they need to work on. Imaginative play is essential to a child's healthy growth and development.7
The problem is that media influence can undermine healthy, imaginative war play and move a child's play toward the imitative end of the spectrum. Children are bombarded with brand-name characters with built-in personalities, plots, and product lines.8 As Garbarino points out, "GI Joe does not do gentle."9 This scripted, "captured," imitative play is like junk food: appealing, prepackaged, and heavily marketed. In imitative play, children are not in control and are not being nourished. While a few empty calories won't hurt, children need to spend the bulk of their time engaged in healthy, imaginative play.

THIS is what I meant when I saw his play is not creative.


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## Doodlebugsmom (Aug 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
The child I keep will ONLY play with action figures and weapons, he will ONLY reenact movie scenes, rarely making up his own scenarios. He does not color, play with blocks etc. How is this creative?

I would chalk this up to being a phase. Both of my kids (now almost 9 years old and 6.5) went through phases like this. Well, not exactly like this, but my dd would NOT play anything other than princesses and my ds wouldn't play anything besides superheros. I must admit that they didn't really enact scenes because at that age they weren't really watching anything like that. But, they literally would NOT play anything else. So, I'm guessing that this child's obsession (and really, that's kind of what it is) will pass as well.

For the record, we allowed ds to watch the Spider-man movie series at age 5. I think there is one gun in the entire series. We have not let him watch the new Iron Man or Hulk movies, as they do have a lot of guns and such. He watched Star Wars in the last year, and has also been building guns with his Legos. He is a super-sweet, sensitive little boy. He's also been into the Ben 10 and Superhero Squad cartoons for a while now. Instead of banning gun/weapon play, we talk about how real guns and weapons can be dangerous.


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## Doodlebugsmom (Aug 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
Still reading the article but this stuck out to me:

*Encourage Imaginative Weapons Play*
Carlsson-Paige and Levin discuss a continuum of play, from the imaginative to the imitative. In imaginative play, children's needs are being met: the play is initiated from within, they are in control, and they bring to their play the issues they need to work on. Imaginative play is essential to a child's healthy growth and development.7
The problem is that media influence can undermine healthy, imaginative war play and move a child's play toward the imitative end of the spectrum. Children are bombarded with brand-name characters with built-in personalities, plots, and product lines.8 As Garbarino points out, "GI Joe does not do gentle."9 This scripted, "captured," imitative play is like junk food: appealing, prepackaged, and heavily marketed. In imitative play, children are not in control and are not being nourished. While a few empty calories won't hurt, children need to spend the bulk of their time engaged in healthy, imaginative play.

THIS is what I meant when I saw his play is not creative.

Maybe you could get involved with the play, as suggested in the article. You can then guide him to use his imagination to come up with new, original scenarios.


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Doodlebugsmom* 
*I would chalk this up to being a phase.* Both of my kids (now almost 9 years old and 6.5) went through phases like this. Well, not exactly like this, but my dd would NOT play anything other than princesses and my ds wouldn't play anything besides superheros. I must admit that they didn't really enact scenes because at that age they weren't really watching anything like that. But, they literally would NOT play anything else. So, I'm guessing that this child's obsession (and really, that's kind of what it is) will pass as well.

For the record, we allowed ds to watch the Spider-man movie series at age 5. I think there is one gun in the entire series. We have not let him watch the new Iron Man or Hulk movies, as they do have a lot of guns and such. He watched Star Wars in the last year, and has also been building guns with his Legos. He is a super-sweet, sensitive little boy. He's also been into the Ben 10 and Superhero Squad cartoons for a while now. Instead of banning gun/weapon play, we talk about how real guns and weapons can be dangerous.

It has been this way since he was 3...

I have been trying to gently guide his play to more rescue than kill type of games. SO far he shows no inclination towards less violent roles but I am working on it!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
For us it was just toy weapons and blue hair. I was in high school in the 80's weird was ok LOL. We never did feel stifled. I was always active in art and music and writing (still am), my siblings were very active in creative areas. Noisy was never an issue. We are all happy, peaceful, loving, successful adults. None of us feel deprived at not being allowed super violent weapons play.

And sure we played some of those things away from home but since we knew it was not allowed at home it was no big deal. It was a fun game nothing more.

But, it's not just a fun game to all kids. Imaginative play is a way of processing things, and one child being okay with being told "you can't process life in this fashion" doesn't mean that all children will be okay with it. This is a crucial way of processing things for some children.

Quote:

I do wish the child would play ANYTHING else for five minutes I admit.
I tend to feel that way when children get on a kick of playing the same way all the time, no matter _what_ they're playing.

Quote:

They say the same thing "Oh it does not faze him" I guess I WANT extreme violence to faze my child. I don't want that to all seem normal to him.
DS1 watched movies that I'm pretty sure everybody on MDC would feel were completely inappropriate for his age when he was little. He didn't watch slasher horror films, because _I_ never watched them, and couldn't even stand to have them on. But, he watched some pretty violent, dark, disturbing stuff. It didn't faze him. Extreme violence - _any_ violence - fazed and upset him. But, he understood very well, very early, that what was on tv wasn't real. I'm not going to say that all children are like that, because I know they're not (I'm 42, and ds1 had better ability to emotionally separate fact and fiction at 4 or 5 than I have now). But, a child being unfazed by something on tv does _not_ mean they're going to be unfazed by such things in real life. DS1 is now 17. He's not violent. He's very caring and gentle towards younger kids (sometimes a little impatient when his little brother climbs on his nuts or his baby sister claws his face - but not violent). The very first thing any of his teacher ever said to me was that he was very kind. Violence - real violence, where people get hurt - upsets him a lot.

Quote:

IMO "killing" is not play and not normal.
If it's not normal, there are a _lot_ of really freaky kids out there...mostly boys, but a lot of girls, too. Play is a way of processing life. Death is part of life, so death gets processed, too. That can happen in many, many ways, including by pretending to kill people, "monsters", etc. I've known many kids who will happily "kill" 100 "enemies" in 10 minutes of play...but who would go out of their way to avoid stepping on an ant, and are inconsolable when they _hear about a small animal being hurt. Play isn't real._


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## [email protected] (Sep 7, 2010)

To OP...

A lot of us start out with the same good intentions, but it becomes a losing battle around age 4. If some of your acquaintances roll their eyes, honestly it could be b/c you only have an 11 mo old right now. You're likely to one day see "superhero" tendencies in your son, too. Don't be surprised if you have a sword wielding superhero in a cape one day!

If you don't believe this, do an experiment & take all the cultural influences out of your child's life right now (including no longer babysitting the older boy). Stick him in Waldorf (if you start school early) and have him play with wooden blocks & learn faerie stories. It's my bet that his genetic programing will take over, just as it did w/ my neighbor's Waldorf child (and several other kids I've watched grow up over the years, including mine)! Boys turn sticks into guns, no matter how many nurturing toys you give them. And you would rather he have superhero fantasies than idolize the bad guy...

Never say never w/ parenthood...

I've read positive things about this "play" in boys, and have learned that they are working out real world issues this way. After banning guns and weapons for the first 5 years, I finally decided to give in and buy him a nerf dart gun recently (he's almost 6). We've had great conversations about weapons, true bad guys, wars, how horrible killing is, etc... It has been an entry way into a learning experience, in other words (at his 5yo level, of course). It's my strong belief that by banning anything, no matter what it is, the allure of something banned makes something more attractive than that thing would have been originally. I don't want toys to have that power over him, and in fact, he's still a well-adjusted kid now w/ a toy gun. He still plays a vast variety of other games, is creative, kind, thoughtful, etc... Part of this is that boys are most deeply into the superhero stage from ages 4-5, but they do evolve out of it and expand their interests.


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## WifeMomChiro (Jul 28, 2010)

FWIW- My dd's school does not allow pretend weapons of any kind and the boys (yes, mostly boys) still make things into weapons. Lincoln logs are apparently great swords and daggers. My dd is pretty gentle in general, but she and her daddy bond over super hero squad comic books, so super heroes and common at our house. DD is actually going to be Wonder Woman (again) for Halloween.


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## Owen'nZoe (Sep 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
It has been this way since he was 3...

I have been trying to gently guide his play to more rescue than kill type of games. SO far he shows no inclination towards less violent roles but I am working on it!

Our Star Wars obsession lasted at least a year and a half...but it did eventually get replaced with other interests. Those phases can last a long time when you're a parent bored to death by the subject.









If he doesn't want to be the rescuer, would there be any violent play you'd find less offensive? In our house, the boys love playing 'Going on a zombie hunt'. It's like going on a bear hunt, only you're out searching for zombies and when you find them, they come after you, and you have to shoot them before they eat your brains. Violent? Yes. But, wow, are they proud when they save themselves! And I can't get too offended by the desire to kill a zombie.


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## Thalia the Muse (Jun 22, 2006)

OK, how wrong is it that I want to play Zombie Hunt now?


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## DariusMom (May 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *[email protected]* 
To OP...

A lot of us start out with the same good intentions, but it becomes a losing battle around age 4. If some of your acquaintances roll their eyes, honestly it could be b/c you only have an 11 mo old right now. You're likely to one day see "superhero" tendencies in your son, too. Don't be surprised if you have a sword wielding superhero in a cape one day!

If you don't believe this, do an experiment & take all the cultural influences out of your child's life right now (including no longer babysitting the older boy). Stick him in Waldorf (if you start school early) and have him play with wooden blocks & learn faerie stories. It's my bet that his genetic programing will take over, just as it did w/ my neighbor's Waldorf child (and several other kids I've watched grow up over the years, including mine)! Boys turn sticks into guns, no matter how many nurturing toys you give them. And you would rather he have superhero fantasies than idolize the bad guy...

Never say never w/ parenthood...

I've read positive things about this "play" in boys, and have learned that they are working out real world issues this way. After banning guns and weapons for the first 5 years, I finally decided to give in and buy him a nerf dart gun recently (he's almost 6). We've had great conversations about weapons, true bad guys, wars, how horrible killing is, etc... It has been an entry way into a learning experience, in other words (at his 5yo level, of course). It's my strong belief that by banning anything, no matter what it is, the allure of something banned makes something more attractive than that thing would have been originally. I don't want toys to have that power over him, and in fact, he's still a well-adjusted kid now w/ a toy gun. He still plays a vast variety of other games, is creative, kind, thoughtful, etc... Part of this is that boys are most deeply into the superhero stage from ages 4-5, but they do evolve out of it and expand their interests.









:

Couldn't say it better myself. We had a very similar experience and my super-creative, artsy, utterly non-violent, completely non-sporty, very gentle and sweet seven year old DS who is going to go try out the local Waldorf school tomorrow has a hideous plastic M-16 he won at the local carnival floating around. He also loves to build battleships and fortifications out of Kapla!


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## EdnaMarie (Sep 9, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
It has been this way since he was 3...

I have been trying to gently guide his play to more rescue than kill type of games. SO far he shows no inclination towards less violent roles but I am working on it!

I would chalk it up to being a personality.

I don't believe that all children engage in the same kind of imaginary play. Some kids only do re-enactments, but are very creative in other ways. It's so hard to know.

Quote:

I guess part of it is that I feel like if I give in to violent play at 2 then why not violent video games and movies at 5. I know people whose preschoolers play games like Grand Theft Auto and other uber violent games. One of my dearest friends 6 year old has seen all the Halloween and Friday 13th movies. They say the same thing "Oh it does not faze him" I guess I WANT extreme violence to faze my child. I don't want that to all seem normal to him. IMO "killing" is not play and not normal. But...I never claimed not to be different LOL I will be happy to teach him how to use a gun or to fence when he is old enough but I don't believe guns and swords (or grenades for that matter) are toys.
Death is normal, though. It happens to everyone. And experimenting with that does happen. I am sorry to say war is a part of human culture and it pervades nearly every society. There are few war/conflict free societies. Murder has been known since before we became **** sapiens.

Now, is it morally okay?

No. But playing without death and without conflict is just to pretend it's not there.


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## StephandOwen (Jun 22, 2004)

We feel this way too. However..... I do want to point out that just having a "superhero" toy does not make a boy violent









DS's birthday was about a week ago. He got a spiderman action figure from a friend. He also got fairies from another friend. He has never had any superhero action figures before, but this spiderman plays wonderfully with the fairies







DP and I are considering getting him a couple more since he likes this spiderman so much. Nothing that ds has done with the spiderman has been anything even close to violent


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## EarthMamaToBe (Feb 19, 2008)

Steph the fairies playing nice with spiderman made me laugh!

I do find it amazing that he (the child I keep) can tell you everything there is to know about approx. 100 super heros/villians.


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## nolansmummy (Apr 19, 2005)

I have to agree with most posters and say its in the genes and highly influenced by the world around him. My son wasn't /isn't allowed to watch the superhero movies but has seen star wars. He is now 6 and believe me, anything can be turned into a weapon of some sort.
We realized around 3 that we couldn't fully limit his play, but we did make two rules:
1. No "real" looking guns.
2. No "pewing" real people, (Pewing is shooting) Only toys or objects.


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## gcgirl (Apr 3, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Megan73* 
My two-year-old just told me Dr. Doom (DH leaves his comics around) was going to come and eat him. But then again, he'd said earlier Frere Jacques was going to eat him so I guess French folk songs are out, too.


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## Polliwog (Oct 29, 2006)

I'm a big fan of Diane Levin (and her colleagues) work. There are lots of great resources in this list from NAEYC. http://www.naeyc.org/files/tyc/file/...0Resources.pdf


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## Hoopin' Mama (Sep 9, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 

It makes me a little sad to hear from so many Moms (especially at MDC) that there is nothing I can do to prevent my little boy from violent weapons play and "killing".


I think that once the initial shock is over that the child learned this behavior against efforts to keep it at bay, a person starts to look at it from a different perspective. Do I really want to micromanage a 5yo's play to that extent? Nope. But there are rules, and they will be enforced. Pretending to shoot people in the face is off limits. And there is no way in heck I'd let ds pretend shoot at a baby. But if he is playing with another 5yo, I will not intervene.

I just don't know that there is a way to completely avoid it. Maybe if you homeschool. Or maybe your child will just not be interested in that kind of play.


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## berry987 (Apr 23, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EarthMamaToBe* 
Still reading the article but this stuck out to me:

*Encourage Imaginative Weapons Play*
Carlsson-Paige and Levin discuss a continuum of play, from the imaginative to the imitative. In imaginative play, children's needs are being met: the play is initiated from within, they are in control, and they bring to their play the issues they need to work on. Imaginative play is essential to a child's healthy growth and development.7
The problem is that media influence can undermine healthy, imaginative war play and move a child's play toward the imitative end of the spectrum. Children are bombarded with brand-name characters with built-in personalities, plots, and product lines.8 As Garbarino points out, "GI Joe does not do gentle."9 This scripted, "captured," imitative play is like junk food: appealing, prepackaged, and heavily marketed. In imitative play, children are not in control and are not being nourished. While a few empty calories won't hurt, children need to spend the bulk of their time engaged in healthy, imaginative play.

THIS is what I meant when I saw his play is not creative.

Hmm....I have an issue with this. My sons love Star Wars and superheroes and are often out playing with these themes in mind. But if you ever watch a 4 or 5 year old playing "Star Wars" they are adapting and changing it to fit their imagination. I don't see scripted games like "now we are battling like Darth Vader and Luke Skywalker" but "I'm Luke Skywalker (with a knights helmet, rain boots and a cape on for a costume) and we're going to beat the monsters!!!" Still very imaginative.

It's the same with themed legos. My kids love Star Wars legos...but they are almost never in their actual intended shape. They make new ships and fortresses with their imaginations while still saying they are playing Star Wars.

I think the article above doesn't give kids enough credit for their huge, wild imaginations and the fact that they are very hard to box in with themes.


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