# Mucho privato.. but need help.



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

What is the most used term for a vagina for a 3 yr old. Recently my daughter got potty-trained and I am struggling to use words to ask her to clean her 'Vagina'. I don't want to use the V word.. sounds too heavy. For her back I use 'tushie' and I am comfortable with it. I sometimes use 'buns' or even 'buttocks' and I am fine with all of those.

Just am stumped with the vag name 

Please help. Don't want to use the P-word!

ETA: Just to clarify. She knows it is her vagina. Not looking for something cute. I want to alternate that usage with another ..less heavy-handed is all. For some reason am feeling very school-marmish asking her to 'Please clean her vagina"....is all.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Ok a small observation:

I went and searched for some threads and something interesting caught my eye (almost like a common thread).

Some people have responded with - "We call them Vagina and Vulva. Don't want to use cutesy names. We call the backside 'Butt, bottom..tush' etc."

Well.. seemed a bit ..err..how do I put this.. let's go with odd.. odd to me 

I am not into confusing her or ashamed of the words. Just something softer for my wee girl is all.


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

I use the word vulva. When they are learning about wiping from the potty, I might just say "Wipe yourself." or "Time to wipe."

I am one of those people who don't use vagina when that's not what I mean.

I supposed I'd use "bottom" too for a very young child.


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## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

This topic is of interest to me. I have a son, and we just call his penis "wee wee"...without having made a decision to do so ~just happened. I know some people think this infers shame, but to me it is just age-appropriate. By the same token, we call his backside his "bum-bum", and one could just as well say that is shaming and we should call it by its proper name: anus. Uh, I don't think so. When he is older we will say penis, but for now it's his wee wee. IMO shame is inferred in so many other ways and a healthy sexuality is picked up from the parents' general attitude...not just through words.

Anyway the other day he asked about my wee wee and I told him that girls don't have wee wees...but then I was stumped what to say. I also felt like vagina or vulva was too serious (plus a two year old needs only one word ~differentiating would be too confusing...just as I don't at this point use the term scrotum or testicles). So we are also needing an age-appropriate word for girly bits....


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Vulva or labia is best. The vagina is the inside part that no one sees.

Always, always use the proper words with your kids. make sure they can name their parts with no shame!


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

I guess I don't see the word "vulva" as heavy.


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## hildare (Jul 6, 2009)

yeah- we say vulva with dd. she doesn't really understand what a vagina is. we do also say a baby is in a mommy's uterus.

she also will say rectum and anus, though only occasionally. she likes to say butt and butth*le.







she thinks those words are somehow inherently funny.

learning correct anatomical terms is important to me, though. fwiw, we found that vulva is pretty easy to learn to say, it was an early part of her vocab.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *P.J.*
> 
> This topic is of interest to me. I have a son, and we just call his penis "wee wee"...without having made a decision to do so ~just happened. I know some people think this infers shame, but to me it is just age-appropriate. By the same token, we call his backside his "bum-bum", and one could just as well say that is shaming and we should call it by its proper name: anus. Uh, I don't think so. When he is older we will say penis, but for now it's his wee wee. IMO shame is inferred in so many other ways and a healthy sexuality is picked up from the parents' general attitude...not just through words.
> 
> Anyway the other day he asked about my wee wee and I told him that girls don't have wee wees...but then I was stumped what to say. I also felt like vagina or vulva was too serious (plus a two year old needs only one word ~differentiating would be too confusing...just as I don't at this point use the term scrotum or testicles). So we are also needing an age-appropriate word for girly bits....


Thank you.

I am in the same boat. No shaming. She already knows it is a vagina. I find vulva even more 'heavy' on the ears. So no - no vulva yet... will do it when she is 4-5 yrs maybe.

But I cannot imagine saying "Have you cleaned your vulva well sweetie" when she is 4 years old.

Wish there were a cleaner healthier softer version that I could use.

Like bottom/buns/tush for anus.

Am also completely fine with penis and would have used that if she were a boy.

Sigh!


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hildare*
> 
> yeah- we say vulva with dd. she doesn't really understand what a vagina is. we do also say a baby is in a mommy's uterus.
> 
> ...


I say 'baby is in mommy's stomach' for now (I am pregnant).

She will learn uterus when she is 5-7 yrs old. I guess people may flame me..but she understands stomach. Even if I were to tell her uterus..she will currently have no idea what I mean..and she has time enough to learn that....

I guess I find myself being somewhere in the middle - I do NOT want cutesie names at all.... I just want something softer..until she grows older...

For me tush/buns/butt/bottom are perfect.... and seem soft when I say "Have you cleaned your tush well? Can we clean your buns now..." Instead of "Can you clean your anus"

:-(


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hildare*
> 
> *yeah- we say vulva with dd. she doesn't really understand what a vagina is. we do also say a baby is in a mommy's uterus. *
> 
> ...


See the bolded part. Don't you find it contradictory? She doesn't understand what a vagina is but she understands uterus? My DD just turned 3. If I cannot explain vagina to her how can I explain uterus?

ETA: Also did you notice... when people acknowledge that they use bottom/butt no one is batting an eyelid that it is not the technical term. But when I mention I don't want to use vagina/vulva people want me to use the correct technical term.

Promise.. not wanting to cause an argument.. just am trying to point out the anomalies.

I think there is a middle ground - like the bottom or the butt...but am unable to find it. Can someone help?


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## tropicana (Sep 11, 2011)

just to point out what is probably obvious once you think about it... the word *vagina* is just a word. YOU are making it "HEAVY".

say it lightly, say it in passing, say it with no shame on YOUR part and it is simply a word, no weird feelings, no nothing.

same goes for penis.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

We use vulva with our 2yo. We say bottom for the buttocks as that is the most common term used where we are. The anus is just the opening of the rectum, the hole if you like, so we don't use anus when we mean buttocks. I get what people are saying about a double standard but if we were being really correct we'd say gluteus Maximus which really is a bit of a mouthful for a toddler.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tropicana*
> 
> just to point out what is probably obvious once you think about it... the word *vagina* is just a word. YOU are making it "HEAVY".
> 
> ...


Disagree. And I feel you did not -either- read all my posts or did not understand what I was trying to convey.

She knows it is her vagina. She knows the word anus. She doesn't know rectum (it hasn't come up). I am completely open with her. I see NO SHAME in the word. No weird feelings. IF she were a boy I would have used the word penis!

I haven't told her there is a baby in my uterus. I see NO SHAME in the word uterus. I still prefer to say' baby in my stomach'.

So I am really talking about the 'sound' of it.. not any shame in the words.

At this time I have said all there is to say about it I guess... will not repeat things further.


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## newmamalizzy (Jul 23, 2010)

I somehow started using "crotch" with my daughter a long time ago, and that's as specific as we've gotten. She has a bum and a crotch. I think it's still an accurate term, just non-specific. Sometimes lately she will point and specifically ask about what's down there. Then I tell her. I think vagina IS a heavy word to use, and I don't think that it's you that makes it heavy - I think it's a heavy word in our culture. Vulva, to me, is too specific. If they're wiping their vulva, shouldn't they also wipe the labia? Too confusing. I'm stickin' with crotch.


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## podsnap (Mar 6, 2011)

I don't know anyone who doesn't call it a pee pee.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

I don't understand what you mean by "heavy."


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## freegirl23cat (Jan 25, 2004)

We use yoni....has beautiful goddess origin yet is kinda kidfriendly even for
pronunciation. My daughter also knows anatomical names


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> ...


What does this mean? Why is the word vagina not "clean" and "healthy?"


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## hildare (Jul 6, 2009)

BMama, dd doesn't know vagina b/c she can't see, feel, or otherwise know it's there  she is pre-he-tty sure she has a vulva.

she got to interact with the baby in the uterus b/c i was pregnant when she was learning vocab. and wanted birth stories, so i included uterus.

i try to use anatomical words with her, anus, etc. but like i said, she just likes to say (scream) butt!

of course you can call it whatever you want~ i just am inclined to believe that it's never too early to learn the proper names for body parts. dd likes to look at anatomy books, we have one by DK that she really likes to look at. she can also point to her clavicle and patella, but i have a pretty weird kid.


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## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> What does this mean? Why is the word vagina not "clean" and "healthy?"


Yeah, I'd like clarification on that, as well.

Perhaps you should consider "sacred well".


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> What does this mean? Why is the word vagina not "clean" and "healthy?"


Oh.. I meant as opposed to the P-word. One of my friends uses it and I don't like it (Pu$$y)

To summarize.. was looking for a clean, healthy but kid-friendly version that 'rolls of the tongue' easily (is what I mean by not heavy)


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PhoenixMommaToTwo*
> 
> Yeah, I'd like clarification on that, as well.
> 
> Perhaps you should consider "sacred well".


I was writing with many thoughts in my mind all at once.. the juxtaposition was unfortunate.

The second sentence was a summary of all my thoughts.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *freegirl23cat*
> 
> We use yoni....has beautiful goddess origin yet is kinda kidfriendly even for
> pronunciation. My daughter also knows anatomical names


I would have used this had I not thought that if she were in any kind of trouble and wanted to convey to someone else that she had trouble in her vagina/vulva - she wouldn't be understood 

All along I have been using vagina. But in the course of these replies.. I think labia sounds better. Maybe I will start using labia (silly isn't it.. I could have googled and got the answer..but I wondered what the common terms were and wanted the opinion of more moms)


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## crayfishgirl (May 26, 2009)

Our DD knows vagina, labia, and vulva, but for general discussion we use "girls parts" (as in "wipe your girl parts").


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## DaisyMae08 (Oct 27, 2008)

You can't just say, "make sure you wipe" or "don't forget to wipe yourself"? You don't necessarily need to name the parts.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *newmamalizzy*
> 
> . If they're wiping their vulva, shouldn't they also wipe the labia? Too confusing. I'm stickin' with crotch.


Vulva is a collective term for the female external genitalia. It includes the labia, minora and majora, and basically everything else you can see on the outside of the body between the pubic bone and the perineum.


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## graciegal (Jun 2, 2009)

I call it "girl parts" now to my 21 month old. It'll be years before I feel she needs to know she has a uterus, vagina, labia, etc.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

I still don't get what the OP means by "heavy." Are we talking about the sound of the word? Or what?


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## brambleberry (Oct 20, 2011)

I grew up being told to clean between my folds which I think is pretty descriptive and to the point about what you really need to do. The vulva needs extra cleaning attention because it is composed of folds that need to be cleaned between. We also have taught DD vagina and labia, but when she's being changed and there is poop that got worked up into the folds, that's what we talk about cleaning - the folds.


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## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

I think I know what you mean, My first child is a boy. I say penis no problem. Now I have a dd and I cringe (inwardly mind you) every time I use the word vulva. I don't know why. There is no shame involved I just hate the word vulva, and the word vagina for that matter. I just hate the way they sound. Now if I was to call it her "pee pee", well that's just fine, doesn't make my cringe, and it's what we called it when I was growing up. But I want to use the right word, so I just do it. Vulva it is.


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## Sharlla (Jul 14, 2005)

dh calls it a "giney" most people i know say vulva or vagina.


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

I think you just have too many factors going on - you want it to be cuter than "vulva," but not too cutesy or obtuse because you want it to also be clear to others...it's really complicated. I'm with others who say that the word isn't "heavy" - it's really not, it's what you are adding to the word. It's fairly easy to say. It just isn't as culturally common as "penis" (and while you may not personally be ashamed of anatomy, I do believe there are societal forces at work here leading to the discomfort...) - but it is a fair and proper equivalent.

The best alternatives I can think of are what some PPs mentioned - girl parts or private parts/privates (again, I don't think this is shaming - more like private like a diary - personal, not for general public viewing, haha).


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## Nicole730 (Feb 27, 2009)

I would also suggest crotch, but it is not a gentle sounding word. in my family, both males and females have crotches - the space between your legs. We use a wide variety of words, including vagina, penis, butt, butthole, anus, and I am trying to become comfortable saying vulva. My four year old know the baby is growing in my uterus, just like he knows his heart pumps blood and his food first lands in his stomach, the bladder stores urine or pee, etc...


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

You could call it a

Cookie

Feef

Hooha!

Pooter

Front bottom/ Front Butt

Whizer

Mooie

Fufu

Birdie

LouLou

Tutu and it's cousin TiTi

Pee Pee

Peach

Uh, so pretty much whatever you want to call it. However the Vulva and the Vagina are not dirty words. They are not disgusting and they are nothing to be ashamed about. Unless you feel shame?


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

I think I will use labia and folds for now. Vulva and Vagina when she grows older. Stomach for now .. uterus for later.

And the posters who are insisting that there may be a freudian shame involved in my not liking the sound of the word vagina- please take it at its face value when I say there isn't. Asking me in various ways and hints doesn't help - let's not play shrink with me please.

And please don't suggest all cutesie words and then try and ridicule me. I am NOT looking for a cutesie word.

And the posters who said they understood that it isn't a gentle or easy flowing word - thank you!! And the poster who writes that crotch doesn't 'sound' gentle either - I agree. Looks like some of us understand what 'gentle sounds' are ..and some of us don't see eye-to-eye with me on that.

No problem. Let's leave it at that.

I think I have found my answers... thank you all for your input.


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## ananas (Jun 6, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Oh.. I meant as opposed to the P-word. One of my friends uses it and I don't like it (Pu$$y)
> 
> To summarize.. was looking for a clean, healthy but kid-friendly version that 'rolls of the tongue' easily (is what I mean by not heavy)


I can't imagine using that word with my child...just seems weird. I definitely think of it as slang, or as being sexual.

My baby girl isn't here yet, but I plan to use vulva. I know what you mean about vagina and vulva both being a little "heavy". For me partially, though, I think the reason is because my parents ONLY used the "cutesy" words...I literally did not know the word vagina and what it meant until I was 10-11. Even later for vulva. So I want my daughter to be very comfortable with the words from an early age, and then maybe also know some cutesy ones but not be misled at all about what the actual word is. I work at a grooming shop...when we're talking to each other, we'll use words like "hoo hoo" or "weiner", but when it's time to tell the owner about the "redness on her hoo hoo", we say vulva or vagina (penis for a boy, obviously)...so I think there's a time and a place for everything.


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## skycheattraffic (Apr 16, 2012)

So we call DD's backside her "bum" or "bum bum". I like the idea of using "crotch", just wish it sounded a bit more fun lol. While I agree that vulva is the anatomically correct term, I don't think she will be hurt by holding off on that for a while. We have been saying "girly bits" since birth (it just happened) and for me it's good enough for now: they are the bits only girls have. Fwiw my mom and I are not native English speakers so if she was watching DD and heard of an owie on the vulva, she'd be scratching her head or googling it lol. If/when I get pregnant the second time, I plan on saying that baby is in mommy's belly/tummy. Stomach to me is an organ of digestion while belly or tummy are the general abdominal area.
We don't bat an eye when a toddler calls her grandmother Nana or Grammie but somehow it's a problem for private parts. I plan on explaining the proper anatomical terms when she asks where babies come from. For the time being I can handle not having to hear "I fell and hurt my vulva" at the playground


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## Friday13th (Jun 13, 2006)

I'm a big believer in teaching correct anatomical terms (although I only have boys and somehow penis and testicles are easier for me) but for a situation like you're describing, i/e washing in the tub or wiping in the bathroom I usually say crotch. Because I do *actually* mean, wash the entire area. If they are asking questions or we're talking about something specific (if you're going to play with your penis, please go somewhere private or it is not okay to touch your brother's penis) we use the correct terms for the specific part we're discussing.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Are there other words you avoid teaching your child because you think they're too . . .heavy? This thread is confusing me.


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## Twinklefae (Dec 13, 2006)

We say vulva. It's important that children know the correct terminology. I also say 'bits' or 'parts' because they are asexual terms and I do home daycare so I use it with any child.

I'm really confused by what you mean by 'heavy'. If it isn't shame, do you somehow feel that your DD isn't able to understand it?

The same with uterus - there are age appropriate ways to understand. I told my DS that the baby was in a special balloon inside me called a uterus. It wasn't hard for him to understand.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Blessed_Mom, what you have to understand is that we have had this conversation before and I think it went well over 20 pages of what is and is not an appropriate term to use. I have no idea what you mean by saying a word is too heavy. You have yet to explain.


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## Snapdragon (Aug 30, 2007)

Blessed Mom I totally get what you mean about vagina being an awkward word. It is! We just have a son and I do use the word penis for him- which at his age snds a lot like pee and as the penis is where the pee comes out it makes sense to him.I think Penis is somehow less awkward of a word than vagina, for some reason.

I have mostly heard people use yoni with their little girls- it does sound softer and more sacred to me than vagina.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snapdragon*
> 
> Blessed Mom I totally get what you mean about vagina being an awkward word. It is! We just have a son and I do use the word penis for him- which at his age snds a lot like pee and as the penis is where the pee comes out it makes sense to him.I think Penis is somehow less awkward of a word than vagina, for some reason.
> 
> I have mostly heard people use yoni with their little girls- it does sound softer and more sacred to me than vagina.


You mean VULVA. Such a nasty word I agree!


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Imakcerka

You are making more of a deal about this than it deserves...I assure you. I think you should stop trying to arm-twist people's opinions especially when most of us do not see it as a form of sexual repression or regression.

And maybe walk away if it makes you want to bang your head against a wall. In the whole thread I have not read any poster use the word 'nasty' other than you. Nor insinuate shame as vehemently as you seem to want to do. It is almost like you wished somebody would say it so you can get on a high horse and start a soapbox tirade.

I assure you - this is not what the thread is about. You have your ammo ready I can see.. but this is not the battle ground you seek.


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## Snapdragon (Aug 30, 2007)

I don't think vagina is a nasty word (or vulva) and I certainly don't think a vagina is a nasty thing! I just agree with OP that the word is kind of awkward to say and I can see why she is looking for somehting different.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> Are there other words you avoid teaching your child because you think they're too . . .heavy? This thread is confusing me.


That question is uncalled for and has no bearing on this thread. I will gladly answer your question in another appropriate context.

(And the answer will please you and aligns right along side what you think others should be teaching or not teaching their kids at different ages.)


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Because I disagree? Because I questioned? Really?


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Because I disagree? Because I questioned? Really?


In the same way.. you had to bang your wall.. because someone said vagina was not soft on the ears? You had to infer that they automatically meant 'nasty'?

and you HAD to suggest cutesie words when I specifically said no cutesie words. AND again infer that I felt shame when I clearly stated that there was no shame....

...really?


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snapdragon*
> 
> Blessed Mom I totally get what you mean about vagina being an awkward word. It is! We just have a son and I do use the word penis for him- which at his age snds a lot like pee and as the penis is where the pee comes out it makes sense to him.I think Penis is somehow less awkward of a word than vagina, for some reason.
> I have mostly heard people use yoni with their little girls- it does sound softer and more sacred to me than vagina.


Vaginas are sacred?


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> That question is uncalled for and has no bearing on this thread. I will gladly answer your question in another appropriate context.
> 
> (And the answer will please you and aligns right along side what you think others should be teaching or not teaching their kids at different ages.)


I'm not sure why the question was uncalled for or why you think it would align with my beliefs. I really don't understand what's going on here.

I'm asking what about the words vulva and vagina and uterus are hard on your ears or your tounge. I'm wondering if there are other words you feel this way about and if they sound anything like those words, or if the akwardness is reserved for words that deal with female reproduction and sex. I think it's a reasonable question.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

There are clearly people on all sides of the spectrum on this thread. No one is posing questions in a belligerent manner. No one is 'putting words in another person's mouth'.

Yes I can see this subject and this issue rankles with you. You will be so surprised if you knew me personally about how much I am on the same side (against shaming of sex, against shaming of women and against subconscious subjugation and oppression). What you are CLEARLY not seeing is this is not the same thing.

If you wear the same colored glasses yes - you can see veiled oppression in nearly anything. It is easy..with a little twisting of people's words you can accuse anyone of taking back the cause of women centuries back.

But if you agree to disagree and if you admit that you cannot see what I and some posters meant by 'heavy' word but just MAYBE they don't mean nasty or dirty at ALL...then yes we can peacefully co-exist.

ETA: sorry this was directed towards Imakcerka.. you posted in between at the same time eclipse.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> I'm not sure why the question was uncalled for or why you think it would align with my beliefs. I really don't understand what's going on here.
> I'm asking what about the words vulva and vagina and uterus are hard on your ears or your tounge. I'm wondering if there are other words you feel this way about and if they sound anything like those words, or if the akwardness is reserved for words that deal with female reproduction and sex. I think it's a reasonable question.


If you had only asked about those 3 words the question would be appropriate... you almost made it sound like you think I am deliberately bringing up my daughter in a shielding manner by withholding words from her and thus sub-consciously gearing her up for a life of shame and inferiority.

*You failed to register that currently she knows it is her vagina.* She knows anus. She knows vulva. I just wished I could use another word for vagina when I keep asking her to clean it because as ridiculous as this may sound - this is God' truth - When I am in the restroom with her asking her to clean herself.. since she has been recently trained.. I get very affectionate with her and say things like "Ok.. now let's see if we can clean your..buns/butt/bottom".... instead of using anus..and I make a game and song about it. But all these weeks I was using Vagina and singing "let's clean your vagina..." was not coming out softly.

I didn't want to go the route of wee-wees or pee-pees.... since I WANT to use appropriate words... hence the dilemma.

NOW I have explained my position the umpteenth time. Please either try and understand OR understand why I wouldn't want to rehash the same questions.

AND what I meant by my answer would align with your beliefs is -- that I basically never withhold or hide anything from her.

I just haven't gotten to using uterus.. so far she hasn't shown great curiosity about the baby and I mostly say 'baby in my tummy' if she hugs me too tight or something.. is all.

Wasn't a deliberate with-holding,


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Did you grow up using those words in regular conversation? I didn't, although I knew what they were and there wasn't shaming surrounding them (either the words or the parts they describe). However, because I grew up not frequently using those words (and probably seeing other people's embarrassment and awkwardness when the words were used), they didn't flow off the tongue very well when I started using them with my kids. It felt awkward. Is that what you mean by heavy? Because my solution to that problem was to continue the using them anyway. Now they flow off my tongue. They're easy to say. All the Vs and Ls and soft Gs and As? Those are usually considered soft sounds in the English language. I think if you start teaching your daughter those words - and not just what they are, but to say them, they won't be awkward for her. They aren't to my kids. I'm not sure why you think they will be less "heavy" when she's older.


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

So, by "heavy" you're not referring to the actual meaning of the word but the sound of it? Do you mean that it sounds abrasive to you? Not soft and flowing? Sort of like "lalala" sounds melodious and "akakakak" has a harder sound? Is that what you mean?


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zinemama*
> 
> So, by "heavy" you're not referring to the actual meaning of the word but the sound of it? Do you mean that it sounds abrasive to you? Not soft and flowing? Sort of like "lalala" sounds melodious and "akakakak" has a harder sound? Is that what you mean?


Yes.. is what I mean.


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## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> Did you grow up using those words in regular conversation? I didn't, although I knew what they were and there wasn't shaming surrounding them (either the words or the parts they describe). H*owever, because I grew up not frequently using those words (and probably seeing other people's embarrassment and awkwardness when the words were used), they didn't flow off the tongue very well when I started using them with my kids. It felt awkward. Is that what you mean by heavy?* Because my solution to that problem was to continue the using them anyway. Now they flow off my tongue. They're easy to say. All the Vs and Ls and soft Gs and As? Those are usually considered soft sounds in the English language. I think if you start teaching your daughter those words - and not just what they are, but to say them, they won't be awkward for her. They aren't to my kids. I'm not sure why you think they will be less "heavy" when she's older.


They may not be less heavy when she is older.. but also I don't think I am going to continue singing those words to her for much longer...

...as a matter of fact.. I wish she will grow up to be as pedantic, verbose and a lover of long/heavy/difficult words as I am. All words...

Ans to bolded line: I grew up with those words. My parents are very progressive. There was never any shame. When I talking to her normally I don't find it awkward nor do I feel embarrassed.

If I am trying to be silly or funny to her to make her laugh I find it isn't flowing well off the tongue.

This is something you either get or don't get.

Replying thus again and again is putting me in a position of the lady 'who doth protested too much' - which is not a position I am enjoying being.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

That's not fair at all BM


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> That's not fair at all BM


You may be right Imakcerka.

But the sudden banging of the head on a wall with the .." Oh yeah 'cos vulva is nasty" - wasn't fair either.

Deliberately typing out all those cutesie words when my first post said - Please don't.. wasn't fair either.


----------



## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

OP, what you're failing to realize is that you are keeping the next generation as uncomfortable with the language as you are.

Frankly, it seemed like you wanted more from your question than what you asked. I'm sure you could have come up with any number of things to refer to your child's crotch. But it seemed like you were asking what others felt should be happening long-term.

I hate the use of the word vagina outside of referring to the actually vagina. When someone says "wipe your vagina" it sounds painful! There are so many ways to express oneself that I don't understand using the wrong terms.

Having said all of that, I understand having pet names for body parts. I just find it odd that you'd prefer a term other that vagina which isn't the proper term anyway.

I think "sacred well" is beautiful. It has a sound of awesomeness to it; don't you think?


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> You may be right Imakcerka.
> 
> ...


Oh that was based on the ridiculousness of the whole idea. And none of this makes sense. And yes I posted the cute names because they were softer. I don't know trying to be helpful I guess.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Disagree. And I feel you did not -either- read all my posts or did not understand what I was trying to convey.
> 
> ...


See one of my previous posts. I had already clarified that it was the way it 'sounded'....


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Well then what word is not too harsh?


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## dogretro (Jun 17, 2008)

This is why we use both cutesie words and technical words. In general, we call girl parts "peenie" (for a boy, it would be peener). Both of my girls (4 & 2) know that it is also called vulva. They will say either & the younger pronounces it "oval" which I think is hilarious. They can identify it, I prompt them to call it both, they don't have shame. I cannot think of anything else to call genitals that is not cutesie b/c anything else is a nickname. You could call it V. As others have suggested, say, "Make sure you wipe, front and back." That covers everything.

I don't see what the big deal about "proper terms" is, esp since most people mistakenly call the vulva "vagina". If a child can say, "He touched my pee-pee," and point to her crotch, it is a really dim adult who would not understand what that meant.


----------



## Sharlla (Jul 14, 2005)

when i was little it was called "privates"


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

In my house, we use vulva, but we also use "boobah," because that's the closest dd could get when she was a toddler. She's almost 9 now and only uses that when she's joking around. My youngest ds is coming up on 7 and has a major speech delay. On the occasions he's used the word (not often, because he doesn't have one), it sounds sort of like a cross between vulva and boobah.


----------



## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Originally Posted by zinemama
Quote:


> So, by "heavy" you're not referring to the actual meaning of the word but the sound of it? Do you mean that it sounds abrasive to you? Not soft and flowing? Sort of like "lalala" sounds melodious and "akakakak" has a harder sound? Is that what you mean?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Yes.. is what I mean.


Ok, I finally get what you mean by heavy (I think a lot of confusion could have been avoided if you'd clarified that this was what you meant from the get-go. You probably thought you did, but clearly people did not understand what you meant. I certainly didn't.

So, this is a fascinating approach to parenting that I have never encountered. You're actively choosing not to use certain words because they are not melodious. I'm really curious what other words you don't use with your dd. I can think of several right off the bat that contain "harsh" sounds (or sounds contained in vagina and vulva):

unicorn
cracker
cookie
compost
vegan
volvo
garden
jelly
vacuum
tickle
tomato
and so many more!

Is it difficult to come up with alternatives for words that contain harsh sounds? And more importantly, how do you think your dd will be affected by hearing those sounds? How do you keep her away from them in day-to-day life?


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## rtjunker (May 11, 2011)

I care for a 92 year old woman. I have to help her use the restroom, and wash up. In that situation Vagina doesn't feel like the right word to use either. I typically hand her a wet washcloth and tell her to wipe her crotch, then I tell her to make sure she's steady so that I can wipe her butt for her. I've used Vagina before, but she is more comfortable with crotch. Her and her family use Yoni to refer to the vagina when talking about it with the children in the family. Honestly, I don't think using a word other than Vulva or Vagina infers shame, it's tone of voice, body language and other things that children do pick up on that can infer shame. There's no right way or right word that works for everybody, so we all have to do things in a way that we are comfortable with.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zinemama*
> 
> Originally Posted by zinemama
> Quote:
> ...


I specifically quoted one of my earliest posts that mentioned the 'sound' of the word. If you didn't understand when I essentially said the same thing - then you obviously did not read all my posts.

So I am very interested about your deductive logic.

You got that this was 1) My approach to parenting in general 2) That I am actively choosing NOT to use non-melodious words with my DD and am shielding them from her 3) Have come up with a whole slew of words that you think may be similar to words I have been hiding from my child 4) Wonder if I am actively trying to come up with alternate words for every 'harsh sounding' word out there in the world 5) Wonder how my DD is being affected by hearing these harsh words or how I perceive her as being affected by harsh sounding words 6) and Ask how I keep her away from such words.. How do I shield her? Do I close her ears when she hears them? Do I put a special word-selector over her ears?

Your logical reasoning fascinates me! Care to explain how your mind works? Am really very curious.

Also explain how you chose to completely ignore that I have been using vulva and vagina all her life so far and will continue to use it but was wanting to know if there were a reasonable substitute when I was making a song about it and wanting to make her laugh?

That would be truly helpful too.


----------



## Diyan (Apr 14, 2009)

I have two boys so this is all theoretical for me, but when I hear of people using 'vagina' with young girls, it seems odd. Mostly because, while I learned early on that I had a vagina and what it was for, I had no personal experience with it until I was menstruating and trying to learn to use a tampon. I assure you, my 3- and 1-year-old boys have personal, daily experience with their penises, so it would be just as odd not to use that word.

I sort of like the word vulva because is is a general term for all the external female parts, but it's not commonly part of most people's vocabulary, which is what makes it 'heavy.' It's like saying scapula when you mean shoulder blade - they're both accurate and precise, but one is normal and the other is technical. And talking about wiping the vagina after going potty is like saying clavicle when you mean shoulder blade, since the vagina is interior and not part you wipe.

I don't talk about wiping a bottom, butt, tush, or anus. I just say "wipe." I imagine for a girl, when I need to specify, I would say "in the front" and "in the back."

Regarding pregnancy, I usually talk about the baby being 'in my belly.' Stomach (tummy) is a specific organ, up high right under the rib cage, where my food goes when I swallow. Kids come up with the oddest ideas anyway about - I don't want to tell him that baby is in the same place as the food I swallow. Belly is a nice general term for the middle part of my body where my uterus, bladder, intestines, stomach, etc are. Belly sounds normal to me. Womb sounds old-fashioned. Uterus sounds technical, so I use it when talking to my 3-year-old, but only when I want to be more precise than 'belly.'


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> I specifically quoted one of my earliest posts that mentioned the 'sound' of the word. If you didn't understand when I essentially said the same thing - then you obviously did not read all my posts.
> 
> ...


Well since you pointed out you read a thread here on MOTHERING where we all talked about the proper terms to be used and what we thought should be used, I'm surprised you're even the tiniest bit upset how other members of MOTHERING have interpreted your original post.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Diyan*
> 
> I have two boys so this is all theoretical for me, but when I hear of people using 'vagina' with young girls, it seems odd. Mostly because, while I learned early on that I had a vagina and what it was for, I had no personal experience with it until I was menstruating and trying to learn to use a tampon. I assure you, my 3- and 1-year-old boys have personal, daily experience with their penises, so it would be just as odd not to use that word.
> 
> ...


This is exactly me. Except now you want to split hairs and state your way is right because MY tummy = stomach - but YOUR belly = nice general term for all the middle parts of your body.

Here http://thesaurus.com/browse/tummy belly and tummy are synonyms!

And did you just write belly 'sounds normal' to you? Have you not been reading up on how some people are trying to have a duel with me just because I said something 'sounds harsh'.

So belly sounds normal eh? Tummy sounds nasty? Belly is sacred? Do you think there may be some inherent shame you feel in using 'tummy'? Maybe a repressed childhood incident or upbringing you want to tell us about so we can brainwash you? Maybe you want to subconsciously change the way the whole world talks because it suits your agenda?

Roll it off your tongue enough times and see- it does flow normally after all...

..and you don't use uterus but use belly? My- that is a fascinating approach to parenting. Care to tell us what other words are you shielding from your kids?

P.S. I hope Diyan .. you will not misunderstand me and think that all this is directed at you!


----------



## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rtjunker*
> 
> . Honestly, I don't think using a word other than Vulva or Vagina infers shame, it's tone of voice, body language and other things that children do pick up on that can infer shame. There's no right way or right word that works for everybody, so we all have to do things in a way that we are comfortable with.


This is the wisest thing said yet in this discussion.








This is always an entertaining thread, every year or so when it gets brought up....

And for my personal view: I can't even remember what we called our genitals when I was a child. I can, however, name about 241 other ways in which I took on the cultural shame around sexuality.

I also tend to think this is one thing that at the end of the day when our children are all grown up, we aren't going to look back and think mattered *at all*.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

You know what's really ridiculous?? A bunch of grown women who are "uncomfortable" using the word VAGINA or VULVA. And the even more ridiculous part of that? Passing off your discomfort by saying the word is too "harsh". And, dude, my vagina is not sacred. That is just asinine. It's an organ. With many purposes, but it is not "sacred".


----------



## Lauren31 (Feb 25, 2008)

I use vagina or tell her to wipe front to back. I also say uterus, penis, vulva, breasts, nipples, etc.... whatever is being discussed. Why would that be awkward?


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Well since you pointed out you read a thread here on MOTHERING where we all talked about the proper terms to be used and what we thought should be used, I'm surprised you're even the tiniest bit upset how other members of MOTHERING have interpreted your original post.


I read parts of some threads. Again .. you have not read my posts properly. You keep talking about some thread that spanned 20 pages long. I have not come across that. If you see the time difference between my first post and the second post where i mentioned I just browsed some threads you will know it was a cursory glance.

I am NOT surprised about my original post being misunderstood.

I am surprised that the questions which were answered in post 15 are being ignored and the same answers are being acknowledged in post #30 (arbitrary numbers). I am surprised that posters are suggesting cutesie names when *requested not to*.. and then claim they were trying to be helpful. I am surprised that they think they are being cute by writing this...

I am surprised that attacks by this same members are supposed to be considered fair and when I call them out on it - they scream 'unfair'.

I am surprised that ridiculous assumptions are being made about my parenting in general and no too respectfully either.

I am surprised that each of you is looking at one part of the elephant and accusing me of calling the elephant - a fan, a snake, a pillar.. and are oblivious to the fact that they are reading half-baked parts of my post and deliberately ignoring some facts.

I am also surprised at how blood-thirsty some of you are acting and are trying to arm-twist here.


----------



## Katielady (Nov 3, 2006)

FWIW, my daughter started asking at a very young age (18 months-ish?) what to call her girl parts (she'd grab it during diaper change and say, "Tummy?" or something like that.) I wasn't sure what to say and went with vulva, even though I felt weird saying it every time. For a while after that she would walk around and grab her crotch and go "FOOFA! FOOFA!", sounding so pleased with herself and happy with her body. It tickled me, and I feel a lot more comfy with the word vulva now.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PhoenixMommaToTwo*
> 
> You know what's really ridiculous?? A bunch of grown women who are "uncomfortable" using the word VAGINA or VULVA. And the even more ridiculous part of that? Passing off your discomfort by saying the word is too "harsh". And, dude, my vagina is not sacred. That is just asinine. It's an organ. With many purposes, but it is not "sacred".


Oh then you should really fight with the posters who are suggesting using yoni or sacred well !


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

BM, slow it down. Slow it down. It's gonna be okay. You can look all over MDC and this topic gets brought up yearly. And everyone is still surprised by those who seem to have some issues with the way VULVA and VAGINA roll of the tongue. It's not new. Besides I think we're due for another one of these threads. Sorry you didn't like people disagreeing with your original sentiment. Can't always have it your way.

PS

It's a forum, there are lots of people here. LOTS! We're not all going to agree with you.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lauren31*
> 
> I use vagina or tell her to wipe front to back. I also say uterus, penis, vulva, breasts, nipples, etc.... whatever is being discussed. Why would that be awkward?


You use vagina when you want her to wipe her vulva? My.. that is a serious technical indiscretion ..haven't you been reading the responses to my posts from previous posters?

How could you do that to a young impressionable mind. She is going to grow up and be scarred for life now!


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

You sound angry, BM. There's no judgement attached to that statement. Just an observation.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> BM, slow it down. Slow it down. It's gonna be okay. You can look all over MDC and this topic gets brought up yearly. And everyone is still surprised by those who seem to have some issues with the way VULVA and VAGINA roll of the tongue. It's not new. Besides I think we're due for another one of these threads. Sorry you didn't like people disagreeing with your original sentiment. Can't always have it your way.
> 
> ...


Please disagree with me all you want. Do it respectfully is all I ask. Don't make assumptions and don't try and ridicule. Don't try and put words in my mouth. Read my complete posts. Don't make this your personal soapbox.

Just because it looks a bit like all those other threads.. it is not one of 'those' threads.

May be it has been an year and you were hungrily waiting for one such thread. Sure you can use it as a platform to rehash all that you ALL had collectively decided was the 'most correct and best' way to do things and maybe you ALL had reached a consensus on what the world should/should not be doing.... No problems.

Do not make me the scapegoat of all that you perceive as evil and try to fit my square statements into a round hole so you can get things off your chest. And do not try and shame me.

No one likes to take it lying down.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Oh then you should really fight with the posters who are suggesting using yoni or sacred well !


I suggested sacred well, it was tongue in cheek, yo. Because it's ridiculous. Like this argument. Really, how is labia any different than vagina or vulva? It seems like you kinda tossed that out there as a way to get people off of your back.

And yeah, to the poster who said it, sure, if a kid is being abused they can say "pee-pee" or crotch or whatever word you use for it, but that's not the point, is it? It's about the negative connotation that the words vagina, vulva, etc have acquired over history. It's about the idea that sexual organs are dirty or are shameful and so they must not be referred to ever, except with cutesy names or in hushed tones. Seriously, people, come on.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> You sound angry, BM. There's no judgement attached to that statement. Just an observation.


Eclipse if you are observant enough to see 'inherent shame and years of oppression' in my slightest protest about how I could not make a song about vagina... surely you are observant enough to see the judgement!

Let's not kid ourselves here. Let's call a spade a spade.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Eclipse if you are observant enough to see 'inherent shame and years of oppression' in my slightest protest about how I could not make a song about vagina... surely you are observant enough to see the judgement!
> 
> Let's not kid ourselves here. Let's call a spade a spade.


Or a vagina a vagina.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PhoenixMommaToTwo*
> 
> I suggested sacred well, it was tongue in cheek, yo. Because it's ridiculous. Like this argument. Really, how is labia any different than vagina or vulva? *It seems like you kinda tossed that out there as a way to get people off of your back. *
> 
> And yeah, to the poster who said it, sure, if a kid is being abused they can say "pee-pee" or crotch or whatever word you use for it, but that's not the point, is it? It's about the negative connotation that the words vagina, vulva, etc have acquired over history. It's about the idea that sexual organs are dirty or are shameful and so they must not be referred to ever, except with cutesy names or in hushed tones. Seriously, people, come on.


Oh did it? All this provoking people and responding back sounds like I am trying to get people off my back? It doesn't seem like I am standing my ground to you?

Well.. then we have a winner for what else is ridiculous - people!


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Or a vulva a vulva.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Or a vulva a vulva.


Vullllllvvvvvaaaa.......... it kinda rolls of the tongue, eh? Vagina, vagina, vagina. See? Not that hard to say, or type, in this case.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Maybe a vulvita? Or Vulvinator?


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> Oh did it? All this provoking people and responding back sounds like I am trying to get people off my back? *It doesn't seem like I am standing my ground to you? *
> 
> Well.. then we have a winner for what else is ridiculous - people!


Nope, sounds like you're throwing around a bunch of meanie accusations more than you're standing your ground. And I mean that respectfully, of course.


----------



## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Maybe a vulvita? Or Vulvinator?


Vulvita sounds like vaginal (or, uh, vulvular) cheese. Like a really bad yeast infection.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Maybe a vulvita? Or Vulvinator?


Vulvita reminds me of cheese. Not sure I want to associate cheese with vulva.


----------



## PhoenixMommaToTwo (Feb 22, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> Vulvita sounds like vaginal (or, uh, vulvular) cheese. Like a really bad yeast infection.


Cross post! And jinx, you owe me a coke!


----------



## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> I specifically quoted one of my earliest posts that mentioned the 'sound' of the word. If you didn't understand when I essentially said the same thing - then you obviously did not read all my posts.
> 
> ...


I'll be happy to explain how my mind works! You specifically said - and repeated - that it wasn't the content of the word that bothered you. You have no problem with the body parts in question, no history of thinking about them as shameful and that certainly wasn't something you were passing on to your daughter.

The problem as you stated it was with the sound of the word itself. It's harshness or "heaviness." And since you were so adamant that it was the sounds itself, not the meaning, not the associations - that this had _nothing to do with what the word actually meant_ - it wasn't a terribly great leap of logic to assume that you were similarly concerned with the sounds of other words. After all, why single this one out if your concerns about it's sound had nothing to do with its meaning?


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Good talk ladies.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

BM, I don't think anyone is ignoring what you have said or twisting it. I think we either have different opinions of this than you do, or we still don't understand exactly what this thread is about and what it was intended to accomplish. I'm not sure at what point I made you mad by asking questions to try to understand what you were talking about.


----------



## Blessed_Mom (Aug 15, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PhoenixMommaToTwo*
> 
> Nope, sounds like you're throwing around a bunch of meanie accusations more than you're standing your ground. And I mean that respectfully, of course.


Seriously? You just see my posts as being mean or accusatory? Then you have bad blinders on PMTT. Hope it can go without saying that I mean that respectfully too..

On the other hand...

OK ladies.. this has gone on long enough. What say? *I am closing shop*. Please feel free to use this thread as a battleground or your soapbox all you want. Just be careful about not misquoting me. Feel free to lament on the world in general and the atrocities committed to women in particular and how men and society have used secret weapons to subjugate women through the ages (only being partly cheeky).

Try and not be disrespectful to me. Try as much as you can also to not try to drag me in. Again - can I remind you that I am done? Read my bolded line above.


----------



## artekah (Apr 26, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> Or a vulva a vulva.


But it's common and accepted to call a vulva a vagina? ROFL!


----------



## artekah (Apr 26, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zinemama*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


I follow you zinemama and was thinking the same thing.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

BM Just flushed the thread. But I still think this is worth talking about. If we can talk about it.


----------



## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

Do you work so hard to avoid other "heavy-sounding" words?

I don't know how a "heavy" word is constructed, but by golly, if Vulva is one, then Volvo must be too! "Mommy, what kind of car is that?" "Well, honey, it's a, uh, it's a Swedish car, honey."

Face it, the argument that the pronunciation is difficult or unpleasant is just ... let's say misleading.

The word is heavy because society imbues it with shame. It's not your fault. It's not your fault at all.

However, you have an opportunity to help this generation of women (we're right along side you) to empower our children.

Your daughter is going to grow up thinking "vulva" is weird if you can't bring yourself to say it. Is that what you want? Why not take the bull by the horns and reclaim the word?

VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA VULVA - YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *laohaire*
> 
> Do you work so hard to avoid other "heavy-sounding" words?
> 
> ...


My son used to tell everyone his mommy had a volvo. I did not drive a volvo.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *laohaire*
> 
> Do you work so hard to avoid other "heavy-sounding" words?
> 
> ...










Who let you out of the MDC closet? It's Vulvita!


----------



## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

Oops, my bad.

Yet.... "Mommy has a Volvo" works for the grocery store line.

"Mommy has a vulvita" - you're gonna get looks, man.


----------



## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

I guess than answer is to call it a Volvo, then. Mystery Solved.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *laohaire*
> 
> I guess than answer is to call it a Volvo, then. Mystery Solved.


Hmmm, I like your style.


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> My son used to tell everyone his mommy had a volvo. I did not drive a volvo.










My kids did the same thing!

Really, use the right words... everyone! You do not wipe your vagina when you pee! You wipe your vulva or labia.


----------



## Angelorum (Aug 5, 2006)

LOL at volvo! My son couldn't quite remember the word vulva when I told him what my parts were called, so he started calling it my Zelda. Much less embarrassing in public, but still something I'm going to have to correct him on. Maybe I'll wait until we are home though!


----------



## podsnap (Mar 6, 2011)

My mom was the kind of mom who openly discussed her vaginal odors and her irregular menstrual cycles with me and even she called it a tinkler.


----------



## artekah (Apr 26, 2009)

I thought I would share this fascinating linguistics article for anyone who's interested. It discusses exactly which elements make an English word beautiful or ugly sounding. (Most beautiful-sounding word: tremulous, which I agree is beautiful.)

http://www.davidcrystal.com/DC_articles/English51.pdf

By these standards, which make a lot of sense, the word vagina is indeed on the ugly/harsh-sounding side, (which I think is what OP meant by "heavy?") but it's certainly not the worst. Vulva is much better-sounding (the word velvet sounds similar and is actually on a list of beautiful words). You could just decide to call it your velvet.









But I think of all the available words, yoni is the prettiest-sounding, and also has the nicest meaning/etymology. It is not cutesy at all, and would be very nice to sing to a little one. Labia is also very pretty-sounding.

I do think that the sound of the word alone is probably not the thing that turns OP off. You can't really detach words from their meanings completely, or it's very hard to anyway.


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## Nicole730 (Feb 27, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philomom*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't know, I am two weeks from my due date and it sure feels like I have been wiping vagina the last few days.

I am trying to use the word vulva, but I was taught vagina and didn't even realize how it was incorrect until recently. I am immature and vulva makes me giggle, it does sound supercute when the kids say bulba though.


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## akcowgirl (Sep 9, 2006)

We use girl parts. As in " clean your girl parts well"


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## newmamalizzy (Jul 23, 2010)

Hmm.. I was thinking about this more, and I think I tend to associate the word vulva, in particular, with only the sexual functions of the girl parts. Not so much the "wipe yourself after you pee" function. Probably because I learned the word vulva in the context of sex ed. Also, as for the "fight the shame" perspective...I feel like I don't want my 2 year old fighting the shame without knowing she's saying something controversial. She's sensitive, and I'm pretty sure she would feel bad about herself if she uses the word vulva in public and gets a bad reaction from the unenlightened folk at the grocery store. I think is often imparted before kids are old enough to understand things like that, and there's a lot of different ways that shame can be caused, and a lot of other people who can cause it. I'll tell her the word "vulva" when she's old enough to understand that she shouldn't talk about her private parts in public.


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## Diyan (Apr 14, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blessed_Mom*
> 
> This is exactly me. Except now you want to split hairs and state your way is right because MY tummy = stomach - but YOUR belly = nice general term for all the middle parts of your body....


Didn't mean to criticize your word - just explaining why I use the word I do.


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## Dia (Nov 23, 2006)

I saw this thread a while ago and enjoyed reading all of your comments.

I get that the OP is done with conversation now.

So, I have to say, I mean this without criticism, it's pretty disturbing to me that the term vagina is such a bad thing to say to young girl. I can't understand it. This implies shame. Should I feel ashamed for having a vagina, should I be careful not to say the word? Should I be careful not to let my daughter know she has a vagina? Because she is young? Can't handle the word vagina or concept of having a vagina? Have I said the word vagina enough times?

This is disturbing to me. There is already so much misogyny in the world. Your daughter will pick up on your hesitation, embarrassment, shame, even if you are not fully cognizant of it.

Children are more tuned than we often give them credit for.


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## k x s (May 16, 2012)

I don't like the words penis, vulva or vagina. I know its a cultural thing. I don't mind using them for adults but for children they just seem to have some sort of sexual connotation that I'm not comfortable with. I feel at that age pee-pee and bottom is more appropriate and easily interchangeable between genders and describes what they are doing most accurately anyway. You don't wipe your vagina you are wiping the opening you just peed out of. Otherwise I will generally refer to their gentalia as their private parts.


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## IsaFrench (Mar 22, 2008)

that

I'll tell her the word "vulva" when she's old enough to understand that she shouldn't talk about her private parts in public.

and that

I'm pretty sure she would feel bad about herself if she uses the word vulva in public and gets a bad reaction from the *unenlightened folk* at the grocery store.

i think 7 or 8 is a good age for learning the exact terms for body parts

regarding school, you don't want them too precocious (and sharing recently acquired knowledge with half of the class, when some parents might come after you for indecency or something ....) but you don't want them too backwards and learn first from schoolmates (some of whom might have had access to porn films on the computer from a VERY early age, not always intentionnaly from the parents ...)

and this

you are wiping the opening you just peed out of.

the same for bath time in our family .... cannot remember when I started (2 or 3 years of age ? by 4 definitely) but our kids are instructed to stand up in the bath, get soap on both hands& one hand is for "le trou du pipi" and the other hand is for "le trou du caca"

DH is British so apprently in his family " we don't talk about these things" => i don't know how to translate from french to english

hence why i'm lurking on this thread ...

still haven't found the words in english that will suit me and my family best .... (and it's definitely NOT what is taught at school when learning a foreign language nor in the usual language courses.....LOL)


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## IsaFrench (Mar 22, 2008)

yeah, just past the 1000 posts mark ... very fitting since it's the same type of thread that grabbed my attention and made me notice that thre was a mothering forum on the web (after reading the magazine for a while WITHOUT noticing ... for about 5 years, on and off ....)


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## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *newmamalizzy* .I feel like I don't want my 2 year old fighting the shame without knowing she's saying something controversial. She's sensitive, and I'm pretty sure she would feel bad about herself if she uses the word vulva in public and gets a bad reaction from the unenlightened folk at the grocery store. I think is often imparted before kids are old enough to understand things like that, and there's a lot of different ways that shame can be caused, and a lot of other people who can cause it. I'll tell her the word "vulva" when she's old enough to understand that she shouldn't talk about her private parts in public.


Excellent point!

What kinda bothers me is the way some of the ladies here have been acting all surprised and baffled by the fact that some people are uncomfortable using the words vagina and vulva. C'mon folks, get real! We live in a very sex-shamed and shaming culture ~obviously~ and you all know darn-tootin' well that is why many people feel uncomfortable using the proper words. Unless you meant to be ironic, and even if you did, it is condescending to assume this "Whaaaaaat?! People are ashamed of their sexuality? You're kidding!" stance. We all know why people don't want to use these words. We all know we live in a sex-negative culture. Please don't pretend this is news to you.

FWIW I am very on-the-fence about this issue. I don't judge people on which words they use or don't use to describe their genitals. As a PP said, sexual shame is picked up by our children from our general tone and attitude as well as our own relationship to sexuality and how openly we approach the topic...without even saying anything directly. If you ask me, if all of those channels are open and clear, the terminology is not as important. You can be calling it yoni or vulva and yet be living in fear of your own sexuality and clam up every time your older child asks you about it, and THAT will infer shame, not the words you are using. Likewise, if you are always open to explain things and convey a relaxed attitude as well as living your own sexuality fully, then your child will pick that up and not feel shame....even if you say "willy" and "geeny" instead of the proper terms.


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## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

I would also like to remind us all that the great Ina May Gaskin in her classic book Spiritual Midwifery unapologetically uses the word pussy and gives an explanation of this: she claims that words are just words and if you are so upset by a word then you need to look at that. I think it applies both ways: to those afraid to say vulva and to those who turn their nose up at a nickname. At the end of the day they are just words and there are so so many more complex factors at work in conveying shame or not.


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *P.J.*
> 
> What kinda bothers me is the way some of the ladies here have been acting all surprised and baffled by the fact that some people are uncomfortable using the words vagina and vulva. C'mon folks, get real! We live in a very sex-shamed and shaming culture ~obviously~ and you all know darn-tootin' well that is why many people feel uncomfortable using the proper words. Unless you meant to be ironic, and even if you did, it is condescending to assume this "Whaaaaaat?! People are ashamed of their sexuality? You're kidding!" stance. We all know why people don't want to use these words. We all know we live in a sex-negative culture. Please don't pretend this is news to you


But the point of the OP was to use a nickname, which many, many of us said we were fine with. I do use nicknames and interchange them with the real terms. But vagina doesn't really come up at all except when I was telling DD1 about how the baby would mostly likely be born and if she asks what that opening is called. The point is that it has very little place in a bathroom discussion.

And when it's brought up over and over that vulva is a perfectly GREAT word to describe what she is trying to describe, everyone is getting all: Anything but THAT WORD!!!"

And WHY I am so pissed at "We all know why people don't want to use these words."

....Ugh! No....I'm not sure why people continue to let it be this way. We're not talking about controversial word reclamation. We're talking about words that are looked down on due to our culture.

I can't understand why anyone would want to keep that going for this next generation.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Maybe some people don't want to rock the boat. You know like armchair activists. Or whatever they call them.


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## JavaJunkie (Jan 16, 2009)

I don't think it's surprise and bafflement that there is shame and stigma so much as it is incredulity that grown women who KNOW that the words penis, vulva, and vagina are simply anatomical terms, choose to perpetuate the shame and stigma.


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

I am glad this thread took a turn toward the hilarious because frankly, the anger and vitriol coming from the OP was getting a lil..."heavy" for me.









The OP spent for...ev...er claiming it was just the actual "sound" of the word - only to totally freak out that others thought this might LOGICALLY extend to other words, if so. And then questioned their logic.









I don't get this wanting a middle ground between cutesy and correct thing - it's like, "I want to be sort of enlightened about this, but only half way, cuz those words are still kinda icky..."

Or perhaps "vulva" simply didn't rhyme in her bathroom song?


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

I mean "volvo"


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

You mean Vulvita?


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

Precisely!


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Nobody here is feigning innocence about why some people are uncomfortable with the words, except for possibly the OP. It's frustrating as hell to watch grown women perpetuate it, though. I mean, state representatives are getting banned from speaking because they have the tenacity to use the word vagina when talking about bills that affect women's health. There's something wrong in this world.

As for, "what if your child tells some other kids that OMG a vuvla is called a vulva? And their parents get mad?" . . . I don't even know where to start. I guess those parents can just get mad or get over themselves.


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## tinyblackdot (Aug 31, 2007)

we call it her tee tee, she knows the technical terms for it, she knows that her vagina is her vagina and that a penis is a penis, but until she has reached puberty i consider them tee tees, and pee pees. Just like we don't call her bottom by technical terms as in anus or buttock, its a bottom.

And why in gods name would anyone have their child refer to it as the P-word? Isnt that reserved for a purley sexual way to view the vagina? Sorry, that would be like my daughter using the F-word to refer to sex or making a baby. WAY too much!


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## Nicole730 (Feb 27, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> Nobody here is feigning innocence about why some people are uncomfortable with the words, except for possibly the OP. It's frustrating as hell to watch grown women perpetuate it, though. I mean, state representatives are getting banned from speaking because they have the tenacity to use the word vagina when talking about bills that affect women's health. There's something wrong in this world.
> As for, "what if your child tells some other kids that OMG a vuvla is called a vulva? And their parents get mad?" . . . I don't even know where to start. I guess those parents can just get mad or get over themselves.


I agree about the parent getting over it. There is no way a two or three year old can sexualize the words vulva, vagina, or penis. it is the adult that is doing so. This just makes me think of the whole breastfeeding thing, it is the adults that sexualize,shame, or otherwise perpetuate misconceptions about what breasts are first and foremost intended for. If your kid sees me nursing in public and you don't know how to explain it, oh well. Same as hearing proper anatomy. And with both, the more people are exoposed, the less of a big deal it will become.


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## IsaFrench (Mar 22, 2008)

i don't quite agree with the "parents need to get over it" , every parent is entitled to their own views on age appropriate-ness

and also what belongs to public talk and private//family time talk ....

this disctinction hasn't been addressed much in this thread i think = do you really use the same terms when you are alone in a bathroom with your child and when you are out in public ? i would be surprised if this was the case ....

i suppose it also all depends at what age your children start getting to school ? where i am it's 3 years old, 4 years old and 5 years old.

bathrooms for that age is in one single big room with boys one side, girls one side (opposite, with washbassins in the middle), no doors and very low separators between each lavatory so that the staff can have an overview of things =>so all the kids pee in front of each other (am not sure, i think that they take all girls first and then all boys, for each class at set times of the day . but during recess it's whoever needs to go and pee go by themselves ...)

very much the case of "kids are expected to do what they have to do .... but not quite talk at lenght and in details about it !"

there's quite a fair amount of muslim families in that school, quite a few mums with head cover .... but only a single one at the beginning of the year objected to the set up ....

i need to leave the computer now ...


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

No they need to find a way to get passed it then because it's ridiculous.


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## Lauren31 (Feb 25, 2008)

Thanks to this thread I have learned the difference between vagina and vulva. I always used them interchangebly. hmmm.... the more you know? Right? That said, I still think it's right to say both and my daughter will grow up knowing the difference.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IsaFrench*
> 
> i don't quite agree with the "parents need to get over it" , every parent is entitled to their own views on age appropriate-ness
> and also what belongs to public talk and private//family time talk ....
> ...


In answer to the bolded question. . .yes? I mean, what else would I use? And why?

And the other parents need to get over it because I'm not going to teach my kids based on other people's values. I mean, sure, I have talks with my kids about whn certain topics are appropriate and when they're not - but if a kid says, my peepee hurts and my kid says, "That's called a penis" and some other parents is mad? Oh well.


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## hillary77 (Nov 17, 2010)

I agree with this post totally. It's also important to remember we here at MDC come from very different backgrounds and are living in different "contexts". And as for feminism, some people object to the word vagina because the latin origin means "sheath" or "sword scabbard", and some people object to a part of their anatomy being defined solely by what you put in it. For this reason, I taught my daughter "yoni" and "vulva" but made sure she knew what vagina is because that is still most commonly used in my neck-of-the-woods by the school nurse and other adults whose care she may be in (grandma, etc.). language is always evolving, and there are plenty of reasons to rethink words we use and how we use them always. I think shaming OP for having questions and asking for feedback is not constructive at all.

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *P.J.*
> 
> Excellent point!
> 
> ...


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## MichelleZB (Nov 1, 2011)

I've read all the posts here and have a few short comments:

1) I honestly don't know if our original poster BM knows the difference between vagina and vulva? I hope she is still reading this thread. In case we're not being clear, BM, VAGINA is the *inside part*. You would never, ever, ask your daughter to clean her vagina because douching is no longer recommended. If you are douching your daughter's vagina, please consult your doctor because this can lead to infection!

2) What's the big deal? If saying vulva makes you squeamish, there's no end of euphemisms to use, even non-cute ones. For instance, I might even say:

--let's wipe your private parts

--let's wipe your female bits

--let's wipe the lippy part

--let's wipe your folds

--let's wipe the peeing place

You swear you're not uncomfortable talking about genitals, BM, but if you were totally comfortable I think you would have come up with some of these on your own. It's okay to feel embarrassed about genitals, but you should know that you are so that you don't pass that onto your kids accidentally.


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## MichelleZB (Nov 1, 2011)

Also, consider cunt. I think we should bring that word back. It's old and functional.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MichelleZB*
> 
> Also, consider cunt. I think we should bring that word back. It's old and functional.


Uh, no. I think that's used entirely in sexual connotations these days. Not appropriate.


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## Viola (Feb 1, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> Vaginas are sacred?


Every sperm is sacred, every sperm is good.

I think it's funny because we all have different reactions to words for various reasons. In some ways, vagina, anus, labia, penis sound too clinical to me, although I guess I've heard enough penis jokes now that it doesn't sound as clinical anymore.

I hate hate hate the word cunt. But I hate twat more. Ick.

I really didn't like yoni for a long time, it sounded too cutesy, but now it's kind of grown on me.

We use the term vulva, which while not a pretty word, has something cute about it and doesn't sound as clinical to me.

Body parts aren't the only words that we have problems with, I know. Some people hate the word moist or other kinds of words. I hate the word puke. And then, as body positive as I would like to be, my first response to telling someone to wipe their folds is, "Ewwww!" Folds...I just have all these mental pictures. I have a mental picture of vagina too, so I generally don't use it unless I mean vagina. Nothing against you, Blessed Mom, I just realized when you said it, that I had my own negative connotation with the term, so clearly it makes sense you can have your own sense of vulva or whatever. It took me awhile to get used to vulva. Vagina seems like it could be a person's name.









With us it really depends on what kind of mood we are in. Sometimes when I'm feeling really goofy, I'll deliberately say hoo haw, and use a strong country accent. Doan fergit ta' ream out yer hoo haw. Except I really don't tell my girls to do that.


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## IsaFrench (Mar 22, 2008)

i like "wipe your peeing place" i think it sounds really neutral and appropriate in most circumstances

as a non native speaker, i wouldn't have thought it could be idiomatic to use the words "peeing place" ...

i would totally use the worde "vulva" in the context of going to a pediatrician if there was anything the matter with that body part

but it seems "too medical" to me to use in every day life


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MichelleZB*
> 
> Also, consider cunt. I think we should bring that word back. It's old and functional.










I'm fond of the word cunt myself, but I wouldn't teach it to a kid. I don't like pussy at all. It makes me think of pus. I don't want to think of my vagina and pus at the same time. I'm also not fond of the cat metaphor going on there or that ti's used as a euphemism for weakness.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

I hate the word MOIST!!! HATE IT! Just wanted to share.


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## Angelorum (Aug 5, 2006)

Moist bothers me a bit. The word "fondle" just totally skeeves me out though! Probably because the only context I ever heard it in when I was a kid was in reference to child abusers. I do have trouble saying vulva, but I'm trying to get over it, because I don't think it's healthy.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IsaFrench*
> 
> this disctinction hasn't been addressed much in this thread i think = do you really use the same terms when you are alone in a bathroom with your child and when you are out in public ? i would be surprised if this was the case ....


I do. My 2yo doesn't know any other words for vulva or penis.

I can't stand "panties". Ugh, makes my skin crawl.


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## Buzzer Beater (Mar 5, 2009)

I taught both my girls the word vulva.

Dd2 loves it, and says it to everyone. She pats it and smiles. She's 2.

Dd1 hates the word, refuses to use it ever, and was shocked that her little sister uses it. She refers to her parts as her vajayjay (which I hate with a passion) even though she knows it's incorrect. She's 21.

Chock one up for the world and a dose of shame.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buzzer Beater*
> 
> I taught both my girls the word vulva.
> 
> Dd2 loves it, and says it to everyone. She pats it and smiles. She's 2.


Ha! That's great. My 2yo will go round the group assigning each person to a category "penis, vulva, vulva, penis" etc. Fortunately she's only done it with the family so far.


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## TracyGladRags (Feb 16, 2011)

I worked in a daycare for a few years, and was the head teacher for the potty-training age group (kiddos who could walk, but were not yet toilet-trained, were in my class -- generally about 1.5 - 2.5 years old). It varied WILDLY what kids called their parts, and I usually just made sure to listen for them to say whatever word they wanted to use and agree with them.

I remember a kid sitting on the toilet and pointing to his (uncircumsised) penis, then saying, "what's that?" This is a weird situation to be put in as a daycare provider -- personally, I'd just want to say penis, because that's what it is, but you don't want the kid to go home and tell his mom the new word he learned. It seems sketchy, you know? Anyway, I just said, "what do you think it's called?" The answer? "My elephant!"









I also remember a girl who was taught that the word for all of her parts "down there" was "booty." This got confusing when she had a yeast infection and kept saying that her "booty" hurt.

My personal thought is that you should teach the correct words whenever possible, unless you're personally very uncomfortable saying them, because that discomfort will show and your child will absorb it. I think "vulva" is a pretty kid-friendly word, personally. Good luck to you!


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## tropicana (Sep 11, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MichelleZB*
> 
> Also, consider cunt. I think we should bring that word back. It's old and functional.


can you imagine, presenting that word to little kids who will repeat it, LOL, innocently and all... "the mom is changing the baby's diaper, and wiping her cunt."

THAT would catch everybody's attention in a crowd...


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## Ashley1987 (Jun 19, 2012)

When my two were younger I used vulva and penis too though my mother kept insisting I have my girl call the vag tutu! My daughter would always come back from grandma's house using that word because my mother (for some odd reason) was uncomfortable with using vulva??!! If you let anyone watch your kids then make sure they use the proper words because it can become confusing for your little ones


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## nearlyelated (Mar 30, 2011)

M 2 year old son is started making assumptions about my private parts. Before I could label it for him he would look at me and ask, "it just comes out your bum, right?". So I've used the work vulva with him a couple of times, but I think he's still a little confused about my obvious lack of penis.


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## JollyGG (Oct 1, 2008)

To start out I used pee pee to name the part that pee (urine) comes out of. on both my kids. I really don't consider the term a cutesy term for penis, but more a name based on it's function. My son knew that his pee pee was also his penis. My daughter got upset that the babysitter would insist she didn't have a pee pee and instead she has a nu nu. I then told her that we'd just use the correct term and call it Vulva is she'd like. She told me she'd rather stick with pee pee, but now she does know the correct term. Now that she's past potty training age we don't need any name for that part at the sitters, but she was relived to hear that the babysitters word wasn't any more correct than the word she knew. She's gotten more comfortable with the term vulva as she's gotten a little bit older.


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## Katielady (Nov 3, 2006)

A friend of mine told me a great story on this subject. She was peeing, and her four-year-old son was in the room. (Aren't they always?) And he asked, "Mom, are you peeing from your penis?" and she said no, from my vulva. And he said, "Oh, that's what kind of penis you have?" She sighed and said yes, thinking to herself, "Because it's ALL about the penis!"

Also, my son as a toddler once said his knee hurt, but was pointing to his crotch so I was really confused. We finally figured out he meant his scrotum. I guess because it's red and wrinkly like a knee? Hee hee hee.


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## Snapdragon (Aug 30, 2007)

I never in my life referred to my vagina as my vulva. I guess technically I was mis speaking but noone I knew ever called it a vulva! We called it a vagina and I still do. After thinking about this thread I realized that if I had or have a daughter I think I would use the word vagina. Actually this week my 2 yr old asked me (in the midst of me encouraging him to pee in his potty) generally about what mom and dad pee with and I did say dad has a penis and mom has a vagina. So I agree with people on that level of using the "correct " terms- but then I guess it isn't correct anyway if vulva is? vulva sounds odd to me and is not a word I ever used.

However, I still stand by supporting the original poster in her honest question and think that the snark and meanness given to her in response was just totally uncalled for! She wasn't saying anything about teaching her child to be ashamed of her body parts- she was just trying to find a word she felt more comfortable using and was asking this online community for opinions. I was really surprised at the turn this thread took in peoples' responses.


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ashley1987*
> 
> When my two were younger I used vulva and penis too though my mother kept insisting I have my girl call the vag tutu! My daughter would always come back from grandma's house using that word because my mother (for some odd reason) was uncomfortable with using vulva??!! If you let anyone watch your kids then make sure they use the proper words because it can become confusing for your little ones


I grew up in the deep South... try hearing "sugar pot" as a euphemism.







What a way to confuse a kid, eh?


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## MichelleZB (Nov 1, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snapdragon*
> 
> I never in my life referred to my vagina as my vulva.


Because it isn't! A vagina is the inside part, the part penises or tampons or stuff goes in. You wouldn't ever "wipe" your vagina unless you cram toilet paper up your vagina and, I don't know, swirl it around, then pull it out?

Vulva is the external genital organs. Vulvas are what you wipe.

And I wasn't serious about using cunt. Though I do think that is a cool word.


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## Snapdragon (Aug 30, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MichelleZB*
> 
> Because it isn't! A vagina is the inside part, the part penises or tampons or stuff goes in. You wouldn't ever "wipe" your vagina unless you cram toilet paper up your vagina and, I don't know, swirl it around, then pull it out?
> 
> ...


I mean I know the vagina isn't the vulva- I didn't state that clearly- I just meant I and every woman I ever discussed it with referred to the whole thing- in and out- generally as the vagina. I guess we were wrong but that is what we were taught.


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## riversmommy (Mar 21, 2007)

This has been a great read, though I too am surprised at the meanness and snark offered up here on what is usually a more accepting, respectful place for genuine questions. My sympathies are with the OP who was repeatedly harassed.

That said-- I like yoni. I dislike cunt (Kerouac at ten years old might've scarred me a bit). I HATE the word vulva! It is ugly to me and reminds me of sterile hallways and labcoats discussing anatomy in impersonal terms. I like the word vagina, have never shied away from using it.

We all have connections with words and that is was makes them powerful. If you need to empower yourself with the use of vulva, I think you should go for it. But, as some PP have alluded, the word might not matter as much as how you say it and (a point our snarky mamas might ignore), how others react when you say it. I am not saying we should never use vulva or penis, but it's unfair to assume the general public's reaction will be comfortable for a young child. I was very sensitive about words as a kid and I think my free use of certain words (like vagina) in less than respectful company did more to inflict shame than my parents frankness and nonchalant approach ever did.


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## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

I read the whole thread, and I have to say, I really didn't feel like the OP was being attacked unfairly. I felt that her sniping and vicious reactions were much more negative than suggestions that the OP might want to examine where this discomfort with proper terminology comes from and whether she wants to pass that along.

The OP posted saying that she didn't want cutesy names but wasn't comfortable with proper names either. But she wanted something that was anatomically obvious to a stranger? This is just a weird, complicated position she's put herself in. She asked what others used, and many said they were fine with the proper names and wondered why she wasn't. I don't think that's crazy mean.









Frankly, given her list of qualifications for a euphemism, it was fair to ask why on earth she was going to all the trouble. To which she replied it was ONLY about the "sound" of the word - and went on to clarify, this only referred to the actual sound of the letters. I'm sorry, but the fact that she reacted so horribly when others wondered (quite rightly) if this applied to other "heavy" sounding words, tells me this is a bluff. Plain and simple.

All I gathered was that the OP obviously knows she is uncomfortable with these words but doesn't want to examine why or what effect that discomfort might have on her daughter. She made that pretty clear by lashing out at others who urged her to. All she wants is a not too cutesy euphemism (which, I might add, many - including myself - provided her with, and she didn't even acknowledge the vast majority of those suggestions - she just railed against anyone who challenged her dislike of proper terminology).


----------



## nstewart (Nov 6, 2010)

I'm with the people who used to refer to the whole she-bang as "Vagina" just beacause that is what I grew up hearing (well, actually when I was little it was a "birdie" or "bird". Talk about words I hate...) but am teaching DS that mommy has a Yoni. I like the fact that it is all encompasing, and I also dislike the word "vulva". It remindes me of some kind of a car, like a Volvo, I think?? Anyway, it doesn't conjure anything nice for me and this has nothing to do with same, but just with disliking the word. I also dislike "ginch" and "shlong".

DS calls his penis his "pee pee" half the time and "penis" the other half of the time.

Teaching kids proper terminology is important, but being too serious about body parts can create discomfort too. Like PP who makes the joke about a whoo-ha. Why not have fun with anatomy if it lightens the subject? My head is my "noggin" sometimes, my hands are my "paws", my face is my "mug", my fingers are "digets", and my breasts are more often referred to as "mamma moots" than anything else these days, what is wrong with "whoo-ha" from time to time?


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## IsaFrench (Mar 22, 2008)

as a non native speaker, at this stage, i think i could do with a nice table with columns headed

- anatomical words

- cutesy words commonly used

- cutesy words not so widespreadly used

- words most used by older generation

- fashionable words that younger generation things it's cool to use

- etc ....


----------



## hildare (Jul 6, 2009)

this thread is interesting, for sure.

i have to say it: i think that people who refer to genitalia as "pee-pees" are really doing their children a disservice. pee pee is, to the child, obviously a waste product. much is made of where a kid can and cannot urinate, and children are bound to eventually internalize the message that their bodies are dirty. not cool.

it makes me a little crazy when people do not call body parts by the correct name. but, you know, keep on doing that. it'll just help my kid by reducing the number of competitors for her med school application.


----------



## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hildare*
> 
> this thread is interesting, for sure.
> 
> ...


I grew up calling my vulva, my "pee-pee". I never got it confused with a waste product, nor did I internalize the message that my body was unclean. I think it is important that kids know the correct words, and we use them. But, all you guys who jumped on the OP (and yeah, you did), are making way too big a deal about it. And the med school thing..lol...cute A sarcastic little smiley would help at the end of that, so people know you are saying it tongue in cheek...you are right?

Edited to add : The (and yeah, you did) wasn't directed to you personally hildare.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

I really don't see any way in which the OP was "jumped." I saw a lot of people trying to answer her question and figure out exactly what she was talking about and having a discussion about the words we use to name genitals and I saw her fly off the handle about people disagreeing with her or not reading her mind or. . .something.


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

She did get upset because we didn't understand what she was talking about and she couldn't coherently explain herself without throwing out insults. But whatever. We all have a new list of great words for the lady corner!


----------



## cat13 (Dec 8, 2010)

Lady corner? Is that like the lady garden?


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Pretty close!

I love her! Dh showed me her blog years ago when she had just started and he had just started blogging and there was a blogging network of SA bloggers. I remember laughing my butt off thinking I hope this thing takes off. Then I went about my life and sure enough DH sends me a link at work with a HOLY AWESOME! She's a doll. I hope I run into her someday.


----------



## SunRise (Apr 18, 2005)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cat13*
> 
> Lady corner? Is that like the lady garden?


Well, that was worth it, to see the news anchor stifle her smile after the bloggess uses the phrase lady garden. I may just use this reference for my daughter.


----------



## MichelleZB (Nov 1, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hildare*
> 
> it makes me a little crazy when people do not call body parts by the correct name. but, you know, keep on doing that. it'll just help my kid by reducing the number of competitors for her med school application.


LOL! This totally reminds me of the character Elliot Reid on Scrubs, who's a doctor but can't say "vagina". She says "bajingo" instead, even in medical exams. (Her parents are from Connecticut.)


----------



## pickle18 (Jan 27, 2012)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MichelleZB*
> 
> LOL! This totally reminds me of the character Elliot Reid on Scrubs, who's a doctor but can't say "vagina". She says "bajingo" instead, even in medical exams. (Her parents are from Connecticut.)










I forgot about that!!! That episode was hilarious.


----------



## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> I hate the word MOIST!!! HATE IT! Just wanted to share.


Thank you!

I'm coming late to this thread. It is a great morning read, and I skipped to the end (can't wait for the middle!) but this jumped out at me.

Thank you. Thank you. I have privately hated that word for years. Privately because it just seemed such a silly thing. Now I know I am not alone. Or crazy! OK, it doesn't disprove that, but it means that I am not alone and crazy.

This is completely off the side, but as an afficionada of English language history, I wonder, why is the "proper" word always Latin? Don't other languages also have proper words? Ever since those Norman farts* took over the British Isles and made proper terms, like sh** and f*** into crass unmentionables, (something those filthy Saxons* did down in the fields herding "swine" to send "pork" to upper class tables) the upper classes have continually made what was once perfectly proper English into something only the lower classes spoke (for example: the double negative, perfectly proper, standard and acceptable once upon a time.) Of course, perhaps the Anglo-Saxons had it coming to them after their near-obliteration of the Celtic tribes who have only something like 14 words as a contribution the English language wheras the Saxons have the entire structure of the language as their legacy.....

Alright, I don't really need to know all that. Latin does a good job of giving a right and proper name to every little bit and bob on our bodies. I just wish there were more options for the "proper" name. I mean, I think as an English speaker, uvula is far less illuminating than "that hangy-downy-thing-in-the- back-of-your-throat". Come to think of it, maybe "uvula" does literally mean "hangy-downy-thing". And has anyone done a search on what "vulva" translates to? Maybe it means "girl parts".







Latin seems to be a lot like French. You could probably say "elephant poo" in either and have it sound intellectual, or like something you'd want to see served at a fancy restaurant.

So, I say "vulva", would like to say "cunt" and wish that word were taken back from the gutter like all good old words, and I think "yoni" is very pretty.

Back to reading the rest of the thread. Thank you for wandering off track with me.

*I'm related to those Norman farts. Also related to the filthy Saxons. And the Celtic tribes.


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## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

BTW, I even though my girls are passed that age where we might do this, I like the idea of a wiping song.

Here's a start, to the tune of "I'm a Little Teapot":

Wipe your little vulva front to back

Urethra, labia, perineum, um..... crack?

I'm being silly, but I like the idea. Back to the starting block.

And I'm getting over being embarrassed about shouts of "TESTICLES" in the store. But when the girls point out all the parts of their animals to their grandma, or tell her that their animals are mating, well, that's a bit..... uncomfortable.


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## hibiscus mum (Apr 6, 2009)

Well, in this house we say "sinhole" for DD. Mine is "gaping sinhole" since, ya know, I've had two kids.









All kidding aside, I sort of get how vulva seems odd when everyone growing up just called it a vagina. But we all say vulva in this house and it's just another word now, nothing ugly or harsh about it. I think those that are bothered with the word will get used to it if they give it a try. Sort of like when your SIL names her baby something stupid that doesn't roll off the tongue nicely. Eventually you're accustomed to saying it and it suits your niece or nephew.


----------



## hibiscus mum (Apr 6, 2009)

Phew! My iPad auto-corrected sinhole to sinkhole. Glad I caught that one.

And SweetSilver - your song is awesome. I'd buy it off iTunes if you record it.







. Can you write another one about pooping in the toilet/potty. My son's got peeing down but I'm tired of cleaning poopy underwear. Perhaps I'll just pick out a tune to go along with the book Everyone Poops.


----------



## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Oh, but "gaping sinhole" made me laugh!


----------



## MrsMike (Aug 4, 2006)

We use plain old anatomical terms here. A penis is called a penis. A vulva is a vulva. I don't consider the words to be unclean and unhealthy.


----------



## hildare (Jul 6, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SweetSilver*
> 
> I like the idea of a wiping song.
> 
> ...


----------



## lbkw (Apr 15, 2008)

I read this thread yesterday before my OB appointment. While in the room with the detailed anatomical chart, I scanned it for labels. It seems like the part that gets wiped and cleaned is referred to as the "Vestibule". I've never heard that term before but it seems completely benign for anyone who is looking for something of the sort. I guess you would have to explain that there are many different kinds of vestibules, but that would come in time.


The urethra, vagina, and *ducts of the* greater vestibular glands open into the vestibule.


----------



## JudiAU (Jun 29, 2008)

She is cleaning her vulva which is the term we teach our kids. We also use the generic "pee pee" for both kids but they know the real word too. Using the wrong v word drives me crazy.


----------



## Katielady (Nov 3, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lbkw*
> 
> I read this thread yesterday before my OB appointment. While in the room with the detailed anatomical chart, I scanned it for labels. It seems like the part that gets wiped and cleaned is referred to as the "Vestibule". I've never heard that term before but it seems completely benign for anyone who is looking for something of the sort. I guess you would have to explain that there are many different kinds of vestibules, but that would come in time.
> 
> ...


That sounds so architechtural! If we're going with building terms, I think veranda has more of a romantic appeal.


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## Renaissance31 (Jun 19, 2012)

For our children we call them "bottom," "man parts," and "lady parts."

We plan on sticking with these terms until we need to differentiate the finer details.


----------



## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hibiscus mum*
> 
> Well, in this house we say "sinhole" for DD. Mine is "gaping sinhole" since, ya know, I've had two kids.
> 
> ...


Dying laughing over here...sinhole..oh my good heavens...hahahhaa. YES.

Also...if ONLY we could take back the word "cunt". That is such a good word...too bad it's been turned so dirty. What is the origin of that word?? I'll have to google that.

I think of my vulva/vagina/uterus/etc much the same way I think of a favorite dog, as far as what I call it is concerned. I have four dogs and they each have a name...it is their name, it's what the vet knows them by and when it is important that they come right away, that is the name I holler.

But between the four crazy mutts I've got...there are about 16-20 "pet names" floating around. Each dog will come to his/her name, but will also come to his/her little pet names, born completely out of affection over the years and very sweet and dear to us. Molly will come to Molly...but also Moolah, Moose or Damn Dog (she's a trash eater and a poop-roller-inner, she can't help it, she loves the smell of poop). All my dogs have at least three pet names.

My "lady parts" are much the same. In the doctors office it's "vulva". If my daughter is itching herself, it's "is your vulva itchy?" - so, like, you know...when it's important that we're clear about things, we call it what it is - but when I'm talking about my glorious birthing experiences...it may be something more in line with "gates of life" or something. When I'm describing my preferred grooming habits...she may be called something more along the lines of "shaggy mistress". When I'm in bed with my husband, in the throes of passion...well, she may go by something that TOTALLY fits in that moment, which would probably sound downright ungodly in the checkout line at the grocery! She's a mysterious lady and wears many hats!! Pee maker, baby birther, pleasure house...there is kind of a lot going on down there, far too much to have only one name for her!

Like my favorite dogs, I've grown attached to my sex organ over the years, she's been marvelous to me! Every phase of life has brought on a deeper level of affection and even more reasons to love that misty underworld...it is a realm that goes by many names! There is nothing "cutesy" about her...but some of my names for her may sound that way to others! Oh well!

Oh, PS, "sugar pot" = STEALING IT! HAhahah (not so "haha" if you actually grew up with adults using this around you seriously...gross!)


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

You all are so wrong and so hilarious!!!!


----------



## nstewart (Nov 6, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BroodyWoodsgal*
> 
> Dying laughing over here...sinhole..oh my good heavens...hahahhaa. YES.
> 
> ...


Love the pet name anaology and agree completely!


----------



## Angelorum (Aug 5, 2006)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lbkw*
> 
> I read this thread yesterday before my OB appointment. While in the room with the detailed anatomical chart, I scanned it for labels. It seems like the part that gets wiped and cleaned is referred to as the "Vestibule". I've never heard that term before but it seems completely benign for anyone who is looking for something of the sort. I guess you would have to explain that there are many different kinds of vestibules, but that would come in time.
> 
> ...


Interesting, I've never heard it referred to that way before. I think some of my uncomfortableness with the word vulva is that I've never even heard a med-pro say it. My midwife was usually talking about more specific parts (using their proper names) rather than the whole thing, the nurses at my friend's hospital birth I attended kept referring to it as her "bottom". When I was trying to tell my mom that my vulva (didn't say vulva, can't remember what exactly I said) ached really badly a few days after DS was born, she was trying to clarify where I meant and said, "you mean your, uh, child-birth area?" Seriously, I don't know that I've ever heard anyone say vulva in real life. Kind of sad.


----------



## Nicole730 (Feb 27, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SweetSilver*
> 
> BTW, I even though my girls are passed that age where we might do this, I like the idea of a wiping song.
> 
> ...


I love your song. I am going to have a hard time not singing it to my potty training little girl.


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## crystal_buffaloe (Apr 30, 2010)

I just read this entire damn thread. Thank you all.

Also, I grew up in the south ... and I know LOTS of names skirting around the lady-parts.

And also, I kind of wish I were back in undergrad (my concentration was linguistics) just so I could use this thread as a data set. "It has nothing to do with shame! I just don't like the V-word! Penis is okay, though!" I did get to use "cumdumpster" in a sociolinguistics class, once though.

And finally, at our house (and, in fact, in public) we say "vulva" when we need to. It's correct AND cute


----------



## tropicana (Sep 11, 2011)

this thread reminds me of the good old days on MDC...


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## cat13 (Dec 8, 2010)

I saw this comic today and thought about this thread.

FWIW, I don't think I even had a name for "it" growing up. Maybe "my thing" but mostly it was left un-talked about. When I got older I used the word vagina to mean all the parts.


----------



## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

best comic ever!

nak


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## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Katielady*
> 
> That sounds so architechtural! If we're going with building terms, I think veranda has more of a romantic appeal.


Yeah, I thought "vestibule" was a bit weird. What? It's the room that the penis stops to kick off it's shoes before walking into the rest of the house? "Veranda" is where we woo it with some sweet tea before we invite it inside......

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BroodyWoodsgal*
> 
> Also...if ONLY we could take back the word "cunt". That is such a good word...too bad it's been turned so dirty. What is the origin of that word?? *I'll have to google that.*


I thought about that and decided not to. I dare not imagine what kinds of links might be suggested with that search word.....


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## artekah (Apr 26, 2009)

Cunt: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cunt#section_1


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## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SweetSilver*
> 
> Yeah, I thought "vestibule" was a bit weird. What? It's the room that the penis stops to kick off it's shoes before walking into the rest of the house? "Veranda" is where we woo it with some sweet tea before we invite it inside......
> 
> I thought about that and decided not to. I dare not imagine what kinds of links might be suggested with that search word.....


Yeah vestibule is frakkin' gross!! A vestibule is a small room I go into to pull cash out of an ATM...it has terrible carpeting and smells slightly of urine. No no, we shall not be calling our lady cats "vestibules" around here!

Oh and I, too, decided against a google search of the word "cunt"...what with the risk of pulling up viruses...but couldn't help myself and settled on throwing in "etymology" in hopes that I would bring up a "cleaner" search! Well it worked...and I'm even more fascinated by this word now! What a long history!

Here is the wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cunt

Apparently there are others out there who believe this word should be "reclaimed"...though it doesnt appear that the word has been used openly as a non-offensive, factual term for the vulva/vagina region since before the renaissance period! After that it's allll vulgar! Hahaha. So we'd be reclaiming it from, basically, "Norsemen of Olde" times. Very interesting stuff.


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## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kedrosami*
> 
> Cunt: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cunt#section_1


Hahahah look at us, cross posting!


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## hildare (Jul 6, 2009)

how about cunnikin and quim?


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

I prefer queynte.


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## Viola (Feb 1, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SweetSilver*
> 
> And I'm getting over being embarrassed about shouts of "TESTICLES" in the store. But when the girls point out all the parts of their animals to their grandma, or tell her that their animals are mating, well, that's a bit..... uncomfortable.


Teach them to say it like the Greek God of Balls--testiCLEES


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kedrosami*
> 
> Cunt: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cunt#section_1


Robin Williams has a great skit about how using that word gets him thrown out of the house.


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## MPsSweetie (Jan 29, 2006)

I know what you mean. My daughter, 10, and I call it the nethers. As in nether regions. It's funny, light, clean, silly. Takes the embarrassment out of talking about it. Which is good, considering she's getting older.
We call the backside bum, buns, booty. Again, keeping it light, but not dirty sounding.


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## MPsSweetie (Jan 29, 2006)

BUT she knows the real names also.


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## crystal_buffaloe (Apr 30, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viola*
> 
> Teach them to say it like the Greek God of Balls--testiCLEES


I LOVE THIS


----------



## kayabrink (Apr 19, 2005)

I was going to suggest a word that we use in french, that (once again, in french) is not a loaded term at all but rather delicate. But I did not know how to say this word in english. In french it is "entrejambe" which means, the space between your legs. I googled it. Turns out in english the word is crotch. Not so delicate.









I realise this is not what you want to hear, but our kids know and use the terms vulva, vagina, and clitoris. Not that you want or need to use them all the time. My daughter once asked, rather loudly, if I had wiped my vulva when we were in a public restroom.







Could you not just say, did you wipe well?

In other languages they also refer to what you are wiping off, as opposed to the surface being wipe, i.e. did you wipe the last drop? I don't know that the word you are looking for exists.

What does yoni come from? Is it an adult word or a child word like wee-wee? Just out of curiosity as I haven't heard this term before.


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## hillary77 (Nov 17, 2010)

http://jezebel.com/5921451/i-dont-care-about-your-stupid-vulva-its-all-vagina-to-me

Hee hee!! A popular discussion I guess.


----------



## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hillary77*
> 
> http://jezebel.com/5921451/i-dont-care-about-your-stupid-vulva-its-all-vagina-to-me
> 
> Hee hee!! A popular discussion I guess.


Dying of happiness....what a freaking hilarious blog post. Hahahha.


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hillary77*
> 
> http://jezebel.com/5921451/i-dont-care-about-your-stupid-vulva-its-all-vagina-to-me
> 
> Hee hee!! A popular discussion I guess.


Too bad its closed to comments. I would have had a few choices things to say to her about continuing the mis-naming of female genitalia. She really isn't doing anyone any favors.


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## Adaline'sMama (Apr 16, 2010)

My 2 year old says vulva. I think its easy to say, correct, and not abrasive at all.


----------



## Katie8681 (Dec 29, 2010)

Mulva?


----------



## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Katie8681*
> 
> Mulva?


That was a really funny Seinfeld episode!


----------



## CherryBombMama (Jan 25, 2010)

I just read this whole thing! This was a great read 

(We say vulva with the kids.)


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## 1stTimeMama4-4-10 (Feb 4, 2010)

Wow, didn't know this was going to be so controversial! Only read the first page. DD, who is 26 months, says girl parts and butt. I see no need to introduce the words vagina, rectum, anus, vulva, penis, scrotum, or uterus. She's still mostly baby, and so I am sticking with simple concepts. She will know the anatomically correct names as she gets older but for now, I don't really see the need. I guess I am in the minority!


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1stTimeMama4-4-10*
> 
> Wow, didn't know this was going to be so controversial! Only read the first page. DD, who is 26 months, says girl parts and butt. I see no need to introduce the words vagina, rectum, anus, vulva, penis, scrotum, or uterus. She's still mostly baby, and so I am sticking with simple concepts. She will know the anatomically correct names as she gets older but for now, I don't really see the need. I guess I am in the minority!


The standard thinking now is to teach kids all the right names. If the unthinkable were to happen... your children, both girls and boys would have the language to tell a trusted adult what was touched. ..... not just say... "so and so touched my bottom" .


----------



## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philomom*
> 
> The standard thinking now is to teach kids all the right names. If the unthinkable were to happen... your children, both girls and boys would have the language to tell a trusted adult what was touched. ..... not just say... "so and so touched my bottom" .


Stop trying to make sense!


----------



## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philomom*
> 
> The standard thinking now is to teach kids all the right names. If the unthinkable were to happen... your children, both girls and boys would have the language to tell a trusted adult what was touched. ..... not just say... "so and so touched my bottom" .


Yeah I kind of see this concept as being somewhat relevant...but I think a kid who says "soandso touched my bottom" and a kid who says "so and so touched my vulva" have about the same chances of getting the help they need...because it all comes down to the parents.

My kid tells me "soandso touched my bottom" I'm not going to be like "Oh, okay...well, if you'd said vulva I would be alarmed...but your bottom, eh, no biggie" - especially not if I know my kid says "bottom" for "vulva". You know?

Actually, now that I really think of it...I cannot imagine that it would make any difference at all what the kid calls it. In this day and age, if a kid says "soandso touched my _________" most adults ears are paying close attention by the time the kid gets to the word "my"...you know? If the word following "my" is in any way a private region or sounds like it could be a euphemism for "vulva"/"vagina" it's not going to be ignored by any sane mandated reporter or parent. If a kid seems uncomfortable and is telling you that someone touched them...you're going to ask follow up questions, you know? It's not going to be like "Oh, he touched your muff-muff? Well I don't know what that is, but is sounds fairly ridiculous and nonsensical! Go play, little girl!" You know?


----------



## tillymonster (May 12, 2011)

We call it hooha. Yoni is one I've used as well. Not too cutsie and really is obvious what we are talking about.


----------



## tropicana (Sep 11, 2011)

i think the terms are important for when they talk to a police officer or child protective services or whomever would interview them in the event that they were molested.

we all "touch their bottoms" all the time when we pick them up to boost them up to the top of a slide or whatever innocent touching goes on. WITH CLOTHES ON, of course.

very very few people should ever touch their unclothed vulva per se or their vagina or their penis per se. that should only be mom or dad or whomever trusted caregiver guardian, AND only in select circumstances such as putting ointment on a rash, especially as the child gets to preschool age.

that is the difference...


----------



## gemasita (Jul 1, 2005)

Wow, this is *some* thread! It has me laughing out loud!

I was trying to think of a word to use for my 17-month-old son when he sees me use the bathroom and points between my legs. I don't like vagina because that is the internal part, not what he is pointing at. FWIW, I like the term the poster on the first page suggested: crotch. It's pretty general until he gets older and needs to know more specific parts. Glad I read this thread because I couldn't think of a word on my own.


----------



## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gemasita*
> 
> FWIW, I like the term the poster on the first page suggested: crotch. It's pretty general until he gets older and needs to know more specific parts. Glad I read this thread because I couldn't think of a word on my own.


Yeah, we grew up with "crotch" and my mother still spoke it like the word was being choked out of her.


----------



## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tillymonster*
> 
> We call it hooha. Yoni is one I've used as well. Not too cutsie and really is obvious what we are talking about.


I've only heard grown women joking around with friends call it a hooha, which I've always considered kind of vulgar. I had no idea parents seriously taught their kids this term.


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zinemama*
> 
> I've only heard grown women joking around with friends call it a hooha, which I've always considered kind of vulgar. I had no idea parents seriously taught their kids this term.


You can find wipes called Hooah's. But you'd find them on base/post/port. You take em with you when you're out in the field to wipe your parts. I always thought they were hilarious!


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## zinemama (Feb 2, 2002)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imakcerka*
> 
> You can find wipes called Hooah's. But you'd find them on base/post/port. You take em with you when you're out in the field to wipe your parts. I always thought they were hilarious!


Isn't 'hooah" some military manly-man thing that they say?


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## Imakcerka (Jul 26, 2011)

I was in the military... I don't think it's all manly. But whatevs


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## crystal_buffaloe (Apr 30, 2010)

We were already saying vulva/vagina with my 25 month old, but then I read this today:
Quote:


> And, here's another good reason to add to the PANTHEON of reasons to teach your children the anatomically correct names for their genitalia:
> 
> There isn't a child molester on earth who's going to talk to your daughter about her vagina. Really. But if she suddenly starts calling it a cupcake, you can ask her who taught her that.


So I'm going to step it up and tell the grandparents they need to be saying vulva/vagina, too.

Link to the full article: http://www.checklistmommy.com/2012/02/09/tricky-people-are-the-new-strangers/


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## 1stTimeMama4-4-10 (Feb 4, 2010)

I hope that since people are so concerned about the potential of child sexual abuse that you are all aware that the VAST majority of sex offenders victimize children who they have intimate access to. These are trusted friends and relatives, not the wired who lives down the street. I am much more concerned about preventing access to, well, pretty much everyone - and I do mean everyone - while my child is unable to communication with complete clarity. So for me, that's not really a factor in the decision of what to call genitals. By the time more people have access to my child, she will have a better handle on the specific anatomically correct language. And this thread was so fun before!


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## crystal_buffaloe (Apr 30, 2010)

I think that most people are aware that children (and adult women) are most likely to be sexually abused by someone they know. Believe me, you're not teaching me anything new here. My grandmother was abused by her uncle and I was assaulted in junior high (by a family friend, at our house).

If DD all of a sudden bursts out with something about her "private parts" when we've been using anatomically correct terms and I ask her who said that, I seriously doubt she's going to say "oh, the creepy man behind a tree at the park," but she might say "Uncle Joe" or "Father Mike" or even "Cousin Sally" and then I would very much want to know why that person had any business discussing anything about "private parts" with her, since DH, MIL, my mom, my sister, Miss L (our former DCP) and I are the only people who have ever taken her to the bathroom ever. A lot of molesters groom children by laying a lot of groundwork before moving in -- and that might well include "playful" talk about genitals.

In any case, we made the decision to use correct terms long before I read that article yesterday. I think it's a compelling argument not to use a variety of euphemisms, or to feel comfortable talking about it around everyone because you are using a euphemism, or to seek out the most common cutesy euphemism in your area/at your daycare/whatever, and it's something I had not thought of before.

Clearly, you can make whatever choice you feel is appropriate for yourself and your family. This is just part of my experience/reasoning for what we are doing.


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## BroodyWoodsgal (Jan 30, 2008)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1stTimeMama4-4-10*
> 
> I hope that since people are so concerned about the potential of child sexual abuse that you are all aware that the VAST majority of sex offenders victimize children who they have intimate access to. These are trusted friends and relatives, not the wired who lives down the street. I am much more concerned about preventing access to, well, pretty much everyone - and I do mean everyone - while my child is unable to communication with complete clarity. So for me, that's not really a factor in the decision of what to call genitals. By the time more people have access to my child, she will have a better handle on the specific anatomically correct language. And this thread was so fun before!


Thank you, I was feeling this exact same thing...but didn't know how to say it.

As an adult survivor of childhood SA, I am extremely firm in my "policy" about who is allowed unsupervised time with my LOs. Everyone in the family(both sides) understands that my kids are not allowed unsupervised time with anyone except the one person I trust completely with my kids: my MIL. Everyone is cool with this....and that's a good thing, because I don't tolerate haters when it comes to this kind of thing.

My experience and background being what they are, this policy allows me to kick back, worry free. My mother was a SA survivor...she worried constantly about us being victimized. Ha. My abuser was my stepfather and everyone's "favorite guy". He was the "nice guy"...the handsome, well educated, super helpful neighbor everyone loved.

The person who molests your kid is, statistically speaking, not going to be some hairy dude in an alley or a menacing pervert who breaks in through the basement. It's going to be your husbands brother. The extremely well-liked karate instructor...the teenaged babysitter you've known since he was two, etc. So, in order to prevent my mind from burning itself out with worry, my kids are never, have never, been in the care of anyone but me and DH...except for the rare occasion that my MIL watches them while I hit the store or take a nap. Until such time that I think they are "old enough"...this will remain the policy. In any case, by the time I think they are old enough to be in situations where the unthinkable COULD happen...they will be way beyond the point of

So yeah. My kids know the correct terms for their anatomy...but they can call them whatever they want. I'm not really worried about it. My son has been referring to his penis as "the big hose" (hahaha, it is ADORABLE) and my DD calls her lady parts ma'gina...as in "my vagina" smashed together. Whatever. When she has an itch she knows to say "vulva". My "caring" about what she calls it ends there.


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## jewel1288 (May 6, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philomom*
> 
> Vulva or labia is best. The vagina is the inside part that no one sees.
> Always, always use the proper words with your kids. make sure they can name their parts with no shame!


I couldn't agree more. Even if you, momma, don't see shame in the word penis or vulva, your child may interpret your choice not to use it as shame. If you call it what it is, I think it will be normal for them to talk about things frankly, just as they are about other topics that might other wise be touch-y subject, like sex. Maybe that seems like a big jump, but it really isn't. If vulva, penis, vagina, and breast are normal words for them, then talking about sex should be much less uncomfortable for everyone.


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## P.J. (May 18, 2010)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crystal_buffaloe*
> 
> We were already saying vulva/vagina with my 25 month old, but then I read this today:
> Quote:
> ...


I just read the article. Good tips. But this part makes NO sense! If my son calls his penis "wee wee", and all of a sudden has a new word, say his "light saber"....well that is a new word no matter what he's been calling it; penis, wee wee, whatever. There is reason to dig deeper regardless, and having used anatomically correct terms until that point will have had no influence.

Same thing for those of you who are saying the kids need to be able to accurately describe anything that has been done to them: as long as you know what they mean does it matter if they are saying wee wee or penis?


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *P.J.*
> 
> I just read the article. Good tips. But this part makes NO sense! If my son calls his penis "wee wee", and all of a sudden has a new word, say his "light saber"....well that is a new word _no matter what he's been calling it_; penis, wee wee, whatever. There is reason to dig deeper regardless, and having used anatomically correct terms until that point will have had no influence.
> 
> Same thing for those of you who are saying the kids need to be able to accurately describe anything that has been done to them: as long as you know what they mean does it matter if they are saying wee wee or penis?


I have read studies that suggest that pedophiles are more likely to choose victims who don't use anatomically correct words for their sex organs, because using anatomically correct terms suggest to the pedophile that they have open communications about sex with their parents. Predators capitalize on the taboo nature of so many things surrounding sex. If your child is able to indicate that it isn't a taboo in their family, the predator is more likely to worry about the child disclosing what happened.


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## katelove (Apr 28, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *P.J.*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


I don't think it's so much a matter of the parents understanding what the child means but more a matter of being able to present an unambiguous case for prosecution. If the defense can argue that someone, somewhere uses "wee wee" or whatever to describe something other than their genitals then it can cast reasonable doubt on what happened.


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## thursday2 (Jun 20, 2009)

This is unrelated to the original topic, but seemed pertinent to the discussion at hand:

http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/article/2012/06/22/talking-with-your-kids-about-sexual-abuse

I myself am not comfortable with referring to female genitalia as vulva, etc. - it has nothing to do with shame, I just think it sounds harsh and clinical, and I do think that the looks and comments my DD would get in the store, etc. if she yelled out "My vulva itches!" would do more to harm/confuse her than calling it something else. We call it penis for DS, and he has shouted about it in public, but people find it funny...that's societal, I'm sure, and probably where this whole debate stems from... Anyway, DH and I talked a lot about it after reading this thread, and whoever suggested "nethers," thanks! We often call DS's stuff 'junk' as well, as in, "Hey, kid, get your hands off your junk!" if he's playing with the whole area because I think it keeps it lighthearted, which is what we'd like. I feel like nethers is a good female equivalent that doesn't sound so doctor's office...

But that musing aside, the above article makes some really interesting points about why it's a good idea to use the proper terminology from the beginning - as groundwork for later discussions about the bad side of sex. If the first time they learn about sex and sex parts is in the context of "here's bad stuff people might do," it's going to start them with a culture of fear - this is how I was raised, and why I never told anyone about the SA I went through, and why I had/still have a lot of issues. If they know about the neutral/good stuff already, telling them to watch out for the bad stuff is just the other side of it, like strangers or hot stoves or anything else that they have positive or neutral associations with initially that you add nuance to as they mature. I hadn't thought of it like that before, and it's definitely going to influence how we talk about things with both our kids. I thought I'd share for anyone else that found herself eye-rolling through some of the posts -


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## SweetSilver (Apr 12, 2011)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thursday2*
> 
> This is unrelated to the original topic


Everything just about is unrelated to the original topic on this thread, so why not?









I don't find "vulva" too clinical. "Vaginal vestibule"..... now that's too clinical!


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## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eclipse*
> 
> I have read studies that suggest that pedophiles are more likely to choose victims who don't use anatomically correct words for their sex organs, because using anatomically correct terms suggest to the pedophile that they have open communications about sex with their parents. Predators capitalize on the taboo nature of so many things surrounding sex. If your child is able to indicate that it isn't a taboo in their family, the predator is more likely to worry about the child disclosing what happened.


Yep, I've read those studies, too. It's so important to be able to call a spade a spade and have the power of language behind your kids.


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thursday2*
> 
> I myself am not comfortable with referring to female genitalia as vulva, etc. - it has nothing to do with shame, I just think it sounds harsh and clinical, and I do think that the looks and comments my DD would get in the store, etc. if she yelled out "My vulva itches!" would do more to harm/confuse her than calling it something else. We call it penis for DS, and he has shouted about it in public, but people find it funny...that's societal, I'm sure, and probably where this whole debate stems from...


But a lot of us here are asking you to examine whether you should hang on to this discomfort and unpack your feelings towards using the correct terms for the female anatomy. Why is it easier to say "penis"?


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## themothership (Mar 2, 2009)

We use anatomical terms (penis/vulva). It may make others uncomfortable, but it is what works for our family. Are there embarrassing moments in public? Of course, like the time my daughter said "Momma has her period, blood on her vulva" (she was 24 months), but I'd rather my daughter know what body parts she carries around instead of having it called a bug, or teedle (both family terms for the vulva).


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## thursday2 (Jun 20, 2009)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youngfrankenstein*
> 
> But a lot of us here are asking you to examine whether you should hang on to this discomfort and unpack your feelings towards using the correct terms for the female anatomy. Why is it easier to say "penis"?


I don't like cutesy terms either, btw, but I don't think it's necessary for me to work out my issues via my daughter. *shrugs* Not accusing anyone else of that, it's just how I feel about it. Some of my issues I know (SA survivor, religious upbringing, mom still won't even say "private parts" despite being married to a doctor - she just gestures and makes horrible faces), some are societal influences having to do with feminism, etc....and the rest I don't really care. There are lots of things I would like to change about society and it's view/subjugation of women, etc. etc. and a lot of things I think I overblown. She'll know what it's called, much like my son knows both knee and patella, and she can choose what to call it, I suppose, but if I'm doing a disservice to feminism or my own growth by being uncomfortable referring to it as a vulva on a daily basis, that doesn't bother me in the least. Better that than her sensing my discomfort and my having to get into a discussion with a 4 year old about issues I hope she never has to face.


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## thursday2 (Jun 20, 2009)

Oh, meant to add: I think it's easier to say penis because it's not as harsh. I feel about the word "dick" the same as I do about "vulva." It's a harsh word; I don't like it. The OP was mocked for her not liking the sounds, but I agree. I'm big on words and sounds, and I don't like V words for the most part - when looking at baby names, we skipped the V chapters entirely because I know how much I don't like them, so it's not do completely with anatomy, or gender roles. I think cunt's a better word than vulva, but has connotations I don't like for a child using it... For women, there's not a particularly neutral/attractive word out there like penis - and yes, that's to do with society, but it is what it is.


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