# 9 yr old soiling pants...NOT CONSTIPATED!



## stuckinthemiddle (Oct 2, 2009)

My boyfriends 9 yr old son soils his pants almost daily. He can go a month without doing it...if there is a reward at the end of the month. But once he gets the reward...he goes back to soiling.

He is NOT constipated. We've tried the miralax, rewards, making him clean up his mess, taken away all "fun" stuff and just allow him to read or sit quietly.
NOTHING works.

He can tell you exactly when he did it and what he was doing at the time. He'll sit in it until someone tells him he smells and to go clean up.

He'll do it at school, during soccer, watching tv, playing...or just riding in the truck to the store.

He has no history of any kind of abuse (he's spoiled rotten). He has an older sister that is now 18 and she's been doing the same thing since she was about 5.

We've taken him to the doctor, there is nothing physically wrong with him. He is well loved and gets plenty of attention. He's very bright, excels in school, except for when he's too busy playing to care.

We've ruled out everything and come to the conclusion that he's just either to lazy to go or thinks he's gonna miss out on something if he takes 5 min. to go 10 feet to the bathroom.

We firmly believe that it is NOT Encopresis. Not when he can tell you exactly what he was doing at the time.

When we ask him why he does it, he says "I don't know". Ask him when he's going to make an effort to stop, he always says " right now".

He freaks out when we bring up people finding out about it. But then acts like it's no big deal that he's done it again.

I'm just the girlfriend of the father, I have no real say but his dad is trying to be a good father and trying to do what the doctor said, not punish, small reward, make him clean up, etc...

His mother...well...she just ignores it and acts like it will go away. Which is hasn't with her daughter.

Any thoughts, ideas, recommendations????


----------



## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

He's been to the doctor, but has he been to a pediatric gastroenterologist? GI problems can be extremely difficult to diagnose in children and teenagers. That would be my very next step if this were my child.


----------



## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

Are you saying that the 18-year-old sister poops her pants even now? Is she as nonchalant about it as her brother? What do her parents think about the fact that she never grew out of it? And why do they think that the son will grow out of it using these tactics if the daughter never did?

I guess try the pediatric GI doc, but after that I'd probably have him in therapy. Unless both kids have some sort of genetic GI disorder, I'd be worried that there's something going on that you are unaware of.


----------



## Thisbirdwillfly (May 10, 2009)

Wait, the 18 year old does it as well? Are you saying she attended high school and now is working/going to college and soils herself from time to time? Infront of other people?

For the nine years old, Pediatric Gastroenterologist. If that's not it, intensive therapy.

Something is going on here and it is not laziness.


----------



## stuckinthemiddle (Oct 2, 2009)

the 18 yr old still does it, is about to be married and have a child of her own.

she and the 9 yr old have the same mother, different fathers. her step father, my now boyfriend was never allowed to say or do anything to help her. her mother never took her to the doctor.

the 9 yr old has been to the pediatrician, he suggested miralax...said it'd be over in a month. that just made the mess worse.

while I was typing my earlier post he was on the phone with his dad (he's at work), his dad asked him if he was still clean, he was. he went to the bathroom before we left for soccer practice and in the last hour and a half he has soiled his pants.

He thinks nothing of it, his dad talks to him about it every day. He ignores his dad while he's talking.

I'm at my wits end. He can control it when there is a reward being dangled in front of him. So what happens when he's in the real world and there is no reward for doing what you should be doing anyway?

I just don't get it.


----------



## ~PurityLake~ (Jul 31, 2005)

That is so weird. The fact that the boy can control it if he wants to tells me there is no health problem going on here. But I can't imagine what the 18 year old is doing it for still....what is her reward?


----------



## baltic_ballet (May 17, 2007)

If you have conclusively ruled out that it's not physical could be physiological? have you thought of taking him to a child psychologist?


----------



## possum (Nov 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *stuckinthemiddle* 
He has no history of any kind of abuse (he's spoiled rotten). He has an older sister that is now 18 and she's been doing the same thing since she was about 5.

. . .

Any thoughts, ideas, recommendations????

There is a lot of abuse that is just not in the open. Other posters have suggested looking into physical, GI issues, but I would personally consider counseling with a concern that there might have been abuse that the children never told anyone about. In my experience, even parents who think they know don't always know. Unless a parent has been with a child 24/7 from the day he was born, s/he can't be sure.
Whatever the root issue(s), I think a counselor might be able to help.
I hope you can help resolve this difficult issue.
Melinda


----------



## stuckinthemiddle (Oct 2, 2009)

I've suggested the psych. consult idea....so far that's a no go. Mainly because we can't afford it. But I also know that his father feels like he is failing in some way and he also is afraid of his son being labeled or put on meds...thus making him feel more like a failure.
He's been a single dad, and had to fight to keep custody of his son. He's scared to death of losing him....or failing him.

In a way I understand that...but I'm so frustrated that I don't care about any of that...I just want to be able to have fun with both of them and do things as a family without having to worry about cutting the day short because the 9 yr old needs a shower. We can't go anywhere. And not to sound selfish, but I feel like I'm being punished and confined to the house.

I'm also encouraging my boyfriend to take him back to the pediatrician and to be more agressive and not just accept what the doc says.


----------



## Latte Mama (Aug 25, 2009)

Wow, something major going on here. What does the 18 year old say is her issue? Does she make excuses for it? Did either child do it in school and how did the school handle it? Did they get teased?

I would just think that societal pressure would have been enough to have stopped this by now so obviously, something is way off. You want to think it could possible be a medical problem BUT, if even the 18 year old is not pursuing this avenue, well I would tend to think psychological. How sad.


----------



## Latte Mama (Aug 25, 2009)

I just realized you said the 18 year old has been doing it since she was 5, BIG red flag here. How old was the 9 year old when he started? Or was never having bowel movements on the toilet?


----------



## groovynaturemama (Mar 8, 2007)

if this is true, then i would suspect abuse of some type...


----------



## BellinghamCrunchie (Sep 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *stuckinthemiddle* 
We firmly believe that it is NOT Encopresis. Not when he can tell you exactly what he was doing at the time.


Yes, it is encopresis. Its functional, or voluntary, encopresis, and its a psychological condition, and its not all that uncommon.

No he's not doing it because he's lazy or doesn't want to walk ten feet.

Here's some links:
http://www.fpnotebook.com/Peds/GI/FnctnlEncprs.htm
http://www.psychnet-uk.com/clinical_..._disorders.htm
http://adoptionworld.org/awi/corp/sn/snpage14.htm

Professional intervention is warranted, and the development of a behavior plan with professional input is needed.

Don't blame either of these children for their condition. Its a mental health issue.


----------



## stuckinthemiddle (Oct 2, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BellinghamCrunchie* 
Yes, it is encopresis. Its functional, or voluntary, encopresis, and its a psychological condition, and its not all that uncommon.

No he's not doing it because he's lazy or doesn't want to walk ten feet.

Here's some links:
http://www.fpnotebook.com/Peds/GI/FnctnlEncprs.htm
http://www.psychnet-uk.com/clinical_..._disorders.htm
http://adoptionworld.org/awi/corp/sn/snpage14.htm

Professional intervention is warranted, and the development of a behavior plan with professional input is needed.

Don't blame either of these children for their condition. Its a mental health issue.

the links are very helpful.....thank you. non-retentive encopresis makes more sense than them saying he's constipated...when he's not.


----------



## QueenOfTheMeadow (Mar 25, 2005)

I have removed numerous posts from this thread:

Do not post or start a thread to discuss member behavior or statements of members made in other threads or to criticize another discussion on the boards. Do not post to a thread to take direct issue with a member. If you feel a member has posted or behaved inappropriately in a discussion, communicate directly with the member, moderator or administrator privately and refrain from potentially defaming discussion in a thread.


----------



## goodygumdrops (Jan 25, 2007)

Ooops. Sorry about the post. I must have misunderstood. I'm sorry your family is going through this and I hope you come up with a solution. Seems like other members know what their talking about.

GL


----------



## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Total anecdata, but there seems to be a family history to toilet-training difficulties with poo. Both DH and I were difficult to get clean, and it's been a nightmare helping our oldest kid together PL- and if you talk to other families having a hard time, often their parents were difficult too. Weird,huh? I think the pediatric gastroenterologist is a good idea.


----------



## StoriesInTheSoil (May 8, 2008)

First of all, the fact that the 18 year old regressed at age 5 to soiling herself is a BIG BIG red flag of serious trauma. Why did her mother divorce her bio-dad and did it happen around that time?

What does the 18yo say about the issue?

I would suggest intensive therapy right now. The boy CAN control it and doesn't. This is as serious but treatable mental health issue if it is encopresis.


----------



## stuckinthemiddle (Oct 2, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tinyactsofcharity* 
First of all, the fact that the 18 year old regressed at age 5 to soiling herself is a BIG BIG red flag of serious trauma. Why did her mother divorce her bio-dad and did it happen around that time?

What does the 18yo say about the issue?

I would suggest intensive therapy right now. The boy CAN control it and doesn't. This is as serious but treatable mental health issue if it is encopresis.

I'm not sure when the 18yr old started. But the 9 yr old was fully potty trained and he started doing it at age 5. Which is when his half sister moved back in the house...she was already doing it before he was born.

I've checked a few links that I was given and it could be the NON-Retentiv Encopresis. I just learned that when the boy was younger and started doing this, he was taken to the doctor and they said he possibly had Oppositional Defiant Disorder.

He will also pee his pants. But again...only when he's doing something fun. Playing a video game, on the playground, watching cartoons.
Whenever it's reading time, he's in the bathroom every 5 min. so he doesn't soil his pants.

He just WONT stop to go to the bathroom. He'll be sitting there watching TV and start doing the the potty wiggle....but instead of getting up and going...he'll go in his pants and then just sit in it until someone smells him and tells him to go clean up.

Everyone seems to think the reward system is the only way to handle this, but I'm not convinced. Because he'll control it and not soil until he gets his reward and then go right back to it.

Anyway he's going back to the DR. tomorrow....I've suggested therapy so I guess this is the first step towards that. We'll see.


----------

