# My Daughters Website Is Up. Let The Backlash Begin..



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Deleted


----------



## coopnwhitsmommy (Jan 13, 2005)

You have a beautiful dd and she has a great instrument


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Oh thank you so very much!!! I think she is extremely talented.
I appreciate you taking the time to look at her site and hear her vocals. I accidentally posted this message in the wrong forum!







:


----------



## mahdokht (Dec 2, 2002)

What made you decide to put her online? You mentioned that your family doesn't know anything about this. Were you referring to her father and siblings or some other family?


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

I will make an announcement to everyone then.


----------



## mahdokht (Dec 2, 2002)

...but if you don't want her to do this professionally for another 10 years, what will a site do for her? I guess I was just wondering what you hoped this would accomplish if it's not an advertisement.


----------



## mamamillie (Jul 22, 2003)

no one but her, right?
you did okay it w her before you put it up?

she is beautiful.


----------



## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

Never mind. Just not up for it.


----------



## FreeThinkinMama (Aug 3, 2004)

Why would there be a backlash over that? I have a babies online website for my daughter to show updated pictures to friends and family. She's beautiful and obviously talented







I'm glad you're having her wait until she's older to try to go after a career in it though


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Thanks for the replies, much appreciated.


----------



## wemoon (Aug 31, 2002)

I'd say as long as you have your daughters permission then you can do whatever the heck you want and everyone else can shove it.

But if your daughter doesn't even know, then that would be very, very wrong IMO.


----------



## Melda (Mar 27, 2003)

:

i could not have said it better ....


----------



## StephandOwen (Jun 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wemoon*
I'd say as long as you have your daughters permission then you can do whatever the heck you want and everyone else can shove it.

But if your daughter doesn't even know, then that would be very, very wrong IMO.

Ditto. She is a beautiful child.


----------



## kamilla626 (Mar 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *livinwithmcs*
I'm talking the WHOLE family. No one at all on either side. I didn't want anyone to tell me not to do it. I really think this is something she was meant to do.

When the site is completely finished within the next week or so I will make an announcement to everyone then.

If you were already anticipating that someone might tell you not to do it, don't you think that (if anyone does disapprove) the backlash might be 10x worse when you "announce" that you created it without _any_ input from the other people that care about her?

OTOH, you may also get also backlash from family member who think the website is a great idea, but feel insulted that you didn't even ask for their suggestions.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## Brisen (Apr 5, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *girlndocs*
Never mind. Just not up for it.









:


----------



## 2much2luv (Jan 12, 2003)

I think its a great site and she is lovely.


----------



## Ceinwen (Jul 1, 2004)

She's beautiful! And I love the site.


----------



## Harper (Jul 10, 2003)

I don't know what your situation is, but it seems to me that at least her dad should have some say about whether or not she is plastered on the internet???

She is a beautiful girl.


----------



## snoodess (Apr 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Harper*
I don't know what your situation is, but it seems to me that at least her dad should have some say about whether or not she is plastered on the internet???

She is a beautiful girl.









:


----------



## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

Buzz?

Fan base?

Professional?

Am I correct that this child is _6 years old?_


----------



## chersolly (Aug 29, 2004)

I just hope you and your child don't end up on Bravo's _Showbiz Moms and Dads 2_....


----------



## Still_Snarky (Dec 23, 2004)

She's beautiful and talented but I think I'd be uncomfortable keeping something like this from her father (if he's in the picture).


----------



## sohj (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *girlndocs*
Buzz?

Fan base?

Professional?

Am I correct that this child is _6 years old?_


----------



## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chersolly*
I just hope you and your child don't end up on Bravo's _Showbiz Moms and Dads 2_....

Having a website for a talented child is *NOT* the same as Showbiz moms and Dads...


----------



## cortsmommy (Jul 6, 2003)

Well I think that all of the girls who hit it big had a parent that pushed them forward (thinking Jessica and Ashlee Simpson). However I do want to share one story with you. I grew up with a girl named E. who was a beautiful girl that is extremely talented at playing the "fiddle" she loved to play. However her mom making her practice 3 hours a day and pulling her out of school so she could work on her "career" (in 7th grade) she ended up hating to play. She never became famous at all she just became a school drop out single mom. So yeah definitely SUPPORT your child and encourage her talent but do not DO NOT take away her childhood and her chances at a well rounded life.

Edit to add: I am a single mom too so I didn't mean that as a slam. I am extremely happy. However if I had been told all of my life that I was going to be a millionaire and a huge star then well I'd probably be depressed.


----------



## mermommy (Aug 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *girlndocs*
Buzz?

Fan base?

Professional?

Am I correct that this child is _6 years old?_


In all honestly this was my reaction too - especially when you want to not let her have a " career" until after age 16. She is beautiful and I'm sure she is talented - I did not watch the videos - but the site just made me feel weird.


----------



## Village Mama (Jul 22, 2004)

I don't know why... but this hits a strange spot with me.
Beautiful child though.
Hope she still enjoys it by the time she is 16. Is she aware about the site. I did't see a reply yet. Why not get her right into it if you are already taking the steps?


----------



## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

deleted


----------



## elyice (Apr 7, 2003)

I'm too terrified of pedophile predators to do anything like that.

she is adorable btw.


----------



## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

deleted


----------



## lula (Feb 26, 2003)

I have no opinion on the website just a comment...

I have a dear friend who sings opera and has had many problems with voice coaches etc pushing her in the wrong direction and ending up with damage. Before pursuing the website I would look into making sure that the voice training she is getting is going to help her be able to sing in 10 years.
I know you are probably already being very cautious but IMO this training is WAY more important to her future career than any website. (also it may allow her to continue having fun...as opposed to getting irritable with the whole thing!







)

just my opinion, best wishes, lula


----------



## Jen123 (Mar 16, 2004)

Who was coaching her singing "Tomorrow" in the video ? There is an adult singing in the background.

I fear you want this more than she does...hence all the sneaking around.

I seriously hope this doesn't damage your relationship with your husband.


----------



## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

Okay I deleted my previous two posts so I could sum up my thoughts in one.

My mothering comfort meter is extended. I'd personally make the website private and secured for family only and I'd change your location here at MDC. SOmeone could look you or family members up in a heartbeat unless you wisely changed her name and are using a stage name.

I think your mama's instincts are going off. Your daughter is talented and will probably be a big success. I can hear what you are talking about esp. in one video in particular.

Mama's know their children's gifts and I LOVE that you are honoring her gift but well, the internet is not a trustworthy place. Please understand that I am not trying to alarm you but be realistic about the world we live in. I am not implying that you are not by any means and you have to trust your gut but this is my response to your OP. FWIW.

Peace,


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Ok, wow lots of questions.


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Deleted


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

I'm not comfortable with this.

My own children and their names and photos are not to be found on the internet. I can't give you a good reason, it just doesn't seem like something a cautious parent would do.

Good luck to you and your family.


----------



## Changed (Mar 14, 2004)

I think your site is beautiful, as is your child but quite a few years early.
That other kids website is well, trashy and silly. It's a mockery of her fine voice.


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Philomom thank you as well for your comments. I honestly understand your viewpoint as well. I sincerely appreciated your closing line


----------



## sapphire_chan (May 2, 2005)

Is this what she wants? I'll assume yes, and say go for it.

Don't ever push it so far she or you are afraid to quit. (that doesn't make sense)

I mean, it should always be what she's trying to do, not what you're trying to do for her. Encouraging past rough spots is fine, pushing too hard isn't. What the borderline is, I couldn't say, that's what your mama instincts are for.


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Thanks Sapphire.


----------



## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

The whole thing makes me deeply uncomfortable. I understand she loves to sing -- I love to sing too, although I don't think I ever was a prodigy. But what's so lacking in a little girl singing around the house and in children's theater productions? Why must it be about "the industry"?


----------



## cortsmommy (Jul 6, 2003)

Well after reading your replies I'm convinced! You sound like you have a great head on your shoulders. I wish your darling daughter and you much happiness. Good luck and have fun!


----------



## Dar (Apr 12, 2002)

I showed my daughter your site, because she's been active in theatre and musical theatre since she was 8, and has done some theatrical work for pay, as well as lots of stuff for fun. She's known many professional and semi-professional actors and singers, as well as some really, really talented people who haven't made it big (yet?). Here's what she wrote:

*
I'm not pretending to be a world class singer but I've known other 6 year old singers/actresses and I think she might need some more serious voice lessons before getting "the buzz" out there.
I think if people in the industry see an 8 or 9 year old who has a vibratto and is a soprano without having to squeak, that will still get her really far.
There is so much rejection in show business. I would hate to see someone with such potential give up because she's not ready yet.
I don't think she would get a professional audition from those sound clips. Maybe she would like to do some comunity theater first? It really gets your name "out there" more then a web site.*

Dar, and Rain


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Thank you Cortsmommy I appreciate that.


----------



## De-lovely (Jan 8, 2005)

I think you need to reconsider posting photos etc....calendar dates of performances and such. Internet weirdos are sooooo common....not the greatest of judgements in my opinion.Just because she wants to sing professionally doesnt mean she needs a website at SIX years old! I also think that it is just plain unsettling....she is SIX.If you arent planning to let her do anything professionally now, why now? When I was six I wanted to be an ambulance driver then at like 8 I wanted to be a teacher then a marine biologist then a journalist then a teacher again.....she is beautiful but SHE IS SIX. Is this something you get a kick out of more than her? I have a hard time thinking that one day she walked up and said, "Mom,I need a website to create 'buzz' for my career."


----------



## griffin2004 (Sep 25, 2003)

Your daughter is lovely and obviously talented. It's great that you're nurturing that for her at a reasonable pace.

That being said, I would not have a site like this for my child due to fear of internet and IRL perverts, weirdos, and stalkers. Imagine her lovely little face being Photoshopped into some hideous picture and then circulated. I don't mean to be a fearmonger, but the comments of other posters about the inherent dangers are worth paying attention to, imho.


----------



## FreeThinkinMama (Aug 3, 2004)

Uh, my dh doesn't really know about the website I have for our 2 yr old dd. Like I said, it's just pictures and updates for family & friends but what's the big deal? He's completely computer illiterate, he has no interest whatsoever. I see no difference between someone posting their kids picture on a message board like this or babiesonline.com (where my dd has a site) and a private website. It's on the internet, it's a public forum, potentially some weirdo could come across it but so what? Some weirdo looking at my dd's picture does not hurt her. She's fully clothed, there is no way for them to find out where she lives etc.

If there are calender dates or contact info(other then a non traceable email) on the website, I disagree with that. But I didn't look around enough to find out. Aside from that, I see nothing wrong with putting her picture and voice clips on there.


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

No performance dates will be posted, only the resulting performances. I know this thread has become long but people seem to be not reading my comments throughout before posting. The only thing I am putting up there are performances. But thank you for replying anyway, much appreciated.


----------



## merpk (Dec 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *eemamahob*
I think you need to reconsider posting photos etc....calendar dates of performances and such. Internet weirdos are sooooo common....not the greatest of judgements in my opinion.Just because she wants to sing professionally doesnt mean she needs a website at SIX years old! I also think that it is just plain unsettling....she is SIX.If you arent planning to let her do anything professionally now, why now? When I was six I wanted to be an ambulance driver then at like 8 I wanted to be a teacher then a marine biologist then a journalist then a teacher again.....she is beautiful but SHE IS SIX. Is this something you get a kick out of more than her? I have a hard time thinking that one day she walked up and said, "Mom,I need a website to create 'buzz' for my career."









:


----------



## hotmamacita (Sep 25, 2002)

Just a moment to brag about myself....I have a four octave range and my mother knew it but never encouraged me to take lessons or anything. My friend, a professional jazz singer, has encouraged me greatly to sing and write and I have. I write tons of songs for my kids and sing to them all the time. I love my four octave range.









My 6 yo sings beautifully and she has learned from my example and makes her own songs up which really endears me. But this little one just wants to dance and she dances beautifully. She just choreographed her first ballet a few weeks ago and we are holding a private performance at home which even includes her set design (that she told her papa to make). I love this age. Creativity is amazing to me.


----------



## Ilaria (Jan 14, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cortsmommy*







Well after reading your replies I'm convinced! You sound like you have a great head on your shoulders. I wish your darling daughter and you much happiness. Good luck and have fun!

I agree with that!!


----------



## trinity6232000 (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *livinwithmcs*
No performance dates will be posted, only the resulting performances. I know this thread has become long but people seem to be not reading my comments throughout before posting. The only thing I am putting up there are performances. But thank you for replying anyway, much appreciated.

I have been reading this thread for the last couple days. I wasn't going
to post, but last night I had a problem sleeping thinking too much about
this. So here I am.
I have read all your responses and you do sound like a loving, caring,
parent. I don't think you are trying to harm your child, I believe you are
intelligent. I just don't know if a web-site at age six is the best way to
promote your child, and that is what it is, your promoting her. Which just
a tad leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
I worked in the music industry until my daughter was born. My Brother
is a professional full time musician, has been for the past 20+ years. We
have actually had LONG conversations about my dd and her love of music,
and how I plan to hold her from taking it to any professional level as long
as I can. She also loves to sing. plays piano. Any object in our home
becomes a microphone. She performs at school, and that will be all
until she leaves for college, or moves out of my house.
I don't want to sound all high and mighty but those who are serious in
the music business look down on the web-sites and those trying to create
a "buzz" for their children. They are laughed at. Any "buzz" you will make
will only be appreciated by those who want to make money off your child.
I am sorry but it's the truth. I have watched it, and as much as I hate to
admit, I have laughed myself. I laughed, while hurting for the child. I would
hate for you or your daughter to go threw this in anyway.
Most can tell who has been singing, training as a child. They lay it on too
thick when they sing. They use too much vibrato for drama. They weren't
allowed as children, to develop their natural voice. That's what people
want to hear. Not another manufactured voice. Those are a dime a
dozen.
The way to go for your daughter if she enjoys music and singing is to
keep singing at home, like any other child would. Maybe trying theater
for fun. Learning to play an instrument, so that learning music theory
in the future would be easier for her. Singing in the choir (which I read
she already does). Keeping it all in FUN. No talk of the future, no buzz,
no contests, no talk of Fan base.

DO you wish for your daughter to be a musician/vocalist? Or a performer?
In my opinion there is no room for talk of the future at such a young age
no matter what kind of talent that child has. This is coming from the
person who started piano lessons at 3, cello at 7, guitar at 15, and went
professional at 19. Until I was old enough to drive myself to my gigs, it
was a hobby and treated that way by both of my parents.

One more thought. The reason I am hoping and praying my daughter
does not follow my footsteps is that this industry LOVES to chew you
up and spit you out. No matter the talent, no matter how hard you work.
It's luck, and a numbers game. For every person who makes it, there
are a million still trying. Why would anybody want to promote this as a
future for their child? It's almost a set up for failure. Why can't it be a hobby,
she's six. She has the rest of her life to promote, herself.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## sohj (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *trinity6232000*
...I don't want to sound all high and mighty but those who are serious in the music business look down on the web-sites and those trying to create a "buzz" for their children. *They are laughed at.* Any "buzz" you will make will only be appreciated by those who want to make money off your child. I am sorry but it's the truth. I have watched it, and as much as I hate to admit, I have laughed myself. I laughed, while hurting for the child. ... Just my 2 cents.

I've seen this, too. I have friends in the entertainment industry and have seen this A LOT.


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

Thank you both for your insights, I really do appreciate it. I am sorry you had trouble sleeping last night, didn't mean to upset you.


----------



## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Nice website. Just FYI though, I couldn't get the clips to work in netscape. They worked in Firefox though.

I'm not a paranoid one about the web- I wouldn't worry about the info being up on the web. I have tons of stuff on me on the web and on my dd. Anyone who wanted to could figure out exactly who I am and where I live.









Doesn't bother me.

-Angela


----------



## boomingranny (Dec 11, 2003)

Sorry to say, this is not cool. I also think that your justifications border on sounding obsessive and over the edge.

just my cyber-opinion.

cheers and good luck for your daughter, may all HER dreams come true...


----------



## Shonahsmom (Mar 23, 2004)

I think I might get so flamed for writing this.... but... your daughter is beautiful and I'm sure she's an amazing kid, but, and I don't mean this in an insulting Simon Cowell kind of way because I'm really a very nice person.. but, she sounds to me just like any other six year old kid singing. Maybe I'm missing something... that "whistle register".. my dd does that all the time and so do most of the five and six year old girls she hangs out with and its mostly really annoying. The clips are short, so maybe its just not enough to showcase this huge talent you say she has, but I so don't see it. I don't know, I went to the site after reading all of your posts and I expected to be blown away. She's absolutley adorable. I'm just not getting it. I've seen clips of C. Aguillera at 5 and 6 years old and while I'm not a fan of hers music she has an amazing voice. And its very, very apparent in those clips of her even at that age. Just my .02







:


----------



## girlndocs (Mar 12, 2004)

I finally put my finger on what's bothering me, here. I completely believe you when you say your daughter loves to sing and wants to be a singer when she grows up.

But unless *she* came to *you* with the ideas of "buzz" and "fan base" and "the industry" -- unless she somehow discovered those things on her own -- then no, this isn't something child-led because those are things _you_ have brought into it and expectations you have created.

They're adult concepts and expectations, and adult concepts and expectations weigh kids down and create pressure.


----------



## LoveBeads (Jul 8, 2002)

Am I the only one who doesn't understand the purpose of this thread?









I'm not understanding the title "let the backlash begin". Why are you inviting hostility? Are we supposed to be critical and angry or are you looking for support and advice?


----------



## ms. pacman (May 4, 2004)

I don't think it's a big deal having a website for your daughter. However, as a pp said, it's the fact that she's only a little girl and the idea that you're "promoting" her that rubs some people the wrong way.

BTW, I am so awestruck by that Mariah Stanley girl, and I'm not even kidding! She has an amazingly beautiful voice, I was seriously blown away. The content of the songs seemed weird coming from a 12 year old, but her voice, wow!

And to pp, I think the "backlash" was expected from the family members when they discover the website.


----------



## LoveBeads (Jul 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ms. pacman*
And to pp, I think the "backlash" was expected from the family members when they discover the website.

OH!! Now I get it. Oops!


----------



## LisainCalifornia (May 29, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ms. pacman*
BTW, I am so awestruck by that Mariah Stanley girl, and I'm not even kidding! She has an amazingly beautiful voice, I was seriously blown away. The content of the songs seemed weird coming from a 12 year old, but her voice, wow! .

Really? I actually had the opposite reaction. She looks like a very nice little girl, but her voice sounded very fake to me--too stylized. I have never seen her on TV, though.

My eight year old loves to sing too--and actually has one movie that she watched over and over and would sing the songs to it (rewinding and practicing it until she had it perfect). Then she performed it for us, had me video tape her, etc...all in fun. She has been doing this since she was 4. I don't think this is a sign to me that she needs to become famous or I need to do anything about it--it is just her fun thing she likes to do. I think this kind of behavior is more common than you think. My daughter even tells me she wants to be "famous" like Hilary Duff--but that does not mean it is the right thing to encourage her to do that...just the opposite is true, actually. I think it might be a good idea for you to step back and just let her be.


----------



## Soundhunter (Dec 13, 2003)

I think you worrying about her "career' this young is yucky.

Who knows, if left to do things in a "child led" way, which direction she would go in with her talents. I wouldn't want my daughter to go the way of Christina or Britney, trashey sluts with nice voices but little original talent. If my daughter was musically inclined I could only hope that she'd go more in the direction of a Norah Jones or Alicia Keys or Sarah Mahglauclin (i know, bad spelling), women who developed their talents as WOMEN, who write their own songs & play their own instruments and have a unique and original style, who have more to sell than renditions of other people's songs while wearing slutty clothes. We're a pretty musical family and Emma, our toddler, will be encouraged to play with the dozens of musical instruments in our house, encouraged to make music, most of our friends are musical, we often take her to musical performances where children are welcome. I don't think children should be thinking about careers, and I don't think their parents should be getting all hyped about their careers either, ESPECIALLY at 6 yrs old. When you look at those rich famous female singers who started out as children, do they really have a quality of life that you dream of for your little songbird? They have a lot of money and fame, but they don't live a life that I'd dream of for my daughter, that's for sure. As you can probably tell, I'm not too fond of the site at all, especially since it's focus is on this "career" stuff. Yuck! I'm sure your intentions are good, but I think you yourself are too hyped about this stuff.


----------



## talk de jour (Apr 21, 2005)

I sing seriously. Currently, I sing in a general high school choir [which received a I, superior, rating at a state music festival this year] and have been accepted into a twenty-voice select choir for next year which consistently receives superior ratings at state festival, received a gold rating at last year's private Heritage Festival in Chicago, and has been recognized by the Missouri legislature for outstanding performance. I also received a II, excellent, rating at this year's Greater St. Louis Solo and Ensemble Festival. Therefore, I think I know what I'm talking about.








I'm a soprano, as you can probably tell from my username. I do a lot of study of the female voice, especially the highest range, and there are a few realities you're going to have to come to terms with.
First, almost every little girl has access to this 'whistle range'. It's due to the fact that their vocal cords have not matured and, thus, are incredibly tiny. The highest of soprano voices tend to retain this size after puberty.
However, most girls [probably about ninety percent] lose it. Most females -- sixty to seventy percent, when all's said and done -- sing in the alto range, which is most comfortable for most adult vocal cords. It comprises, in general, the F below middle C to the G above. It's pretty small, yes. This range can perhaps be increased to a fifth [seven half-steps -- half-steps are equal to one piano key's interval to the one immediately next to it, for the uninformed] above or below, but that's a hopeful number. It's unlikely, even with the most expensive training.
Even though your daughter has this great high range at six years old -- six years old, mind you -- she will most likely not retain it. Those are the cold, hard, unchangeable facts.
You cannot even prepare for a career until your daughter has completed puberty. Voice training needs to be catered to the mature voice. The technique that is taught to young singers is designed for the immature voice. Most of their technique will need to be changed, if they are taught this way, when they reach puberty. Every singer I know who has gone through pre- and post-pubescent voice lessons will attest to this change. The vast majority have said that they wish this technique training had been held off until their voices matured; they would not have had to put time, money, and effort into developing useless vocal technique.
An unfortunate consequence of incompetent voice teachers molding the prepubescent voice is the development of vibrato.
Vibrato is a beautiful, natural thing.
Many people ask, natural? I thought one had to learn vibrato.
No. Real vibrato is a natural consequence of reaching vocal maturity, proper singing technique and breath support, and the total control thereof. A six-year-old, nine-year-old, twelve-year-old -- most seventeen-year-olds, in fact -- should not have vibrato. If a prepubescent child has vibrato, it is artificial and a disgusting bastardization of technique. It is NOT a desirable trait and will eventually lead to degradation of the natural singing voice. It's very unfortunate what pushy teachers and parents will lead to in the world of child vocals.
Have you ever listened to the Vienna Choir Boys? They are all beautiful, classically-knowledgeable, prepubescent singers. Their most well-known trait is their crystal-clear vibratoless tone. They sing as children should strive to. If a child aspires to sing like Sarah Brightman or Charlotte Church [I really don't like to use pop stars as examples because I know the sorts of technique that goes into the creation of those voices] then they should first sing properly for their age and body and should understand that those voices can only be developed with time and effort and vocal cord maturity.
If you want your child to sing, as it sounds like she greatly enjoys it, then by all means let her sing. Let her join a regional children's choir or children's church choir. I recommend the former; most larger cities have one. I have a friend who is a beautiful soprano with a big, wonderful voice with just the right amount of vibrato. She is seventeen years old, and she sang with the St. Louis Children's Choirs [a wonderful institution] until last year. She let her voice develop naturally, and quite the amazing natural instrument it is.
To help her in her future musical endeavors, your child should also learn an instrument -- probably piano, which is extremely helpful to singers. I wish I knew it better, because I'm going to have to learn it in college anyway. It will help her develop an ear for pitch, sight-reading ability, and provide a greater understanding of music theory.
By no means am I trying to dissuade your child from singing. You just need to remember that a career should be out of the question at the moment if you want her to have a healthy childhood and a healthy voice as an adult. Don't get her hopes up about her range, please -- I know far too many ex-elementary and middle school sopranos who can't come to terms with the fact that they're altos now. Instead, let your daughter know that she can have a wonderful voice no matter what notes she can sing, and hold off on the serious voice lessons and performances -- and for Pete's sake, a 'fan base' until later. There's plenty of time for that later -- let her enjoy childhood now.

::steps off soapbox::


----------



## trinity6232000 (Dec 2, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sly Soprano*
-Even though your daughter has this great high range at six years old -- six years old, mind you -- she will most likely not retain it. Those are the cold, hard, unchangeable facts.
-You cannot even prepare for a career until your daughter has completed puberty.
-An unfortunate consequence of incompetent voice teachers molding the prepubescent voice is the development of vibrato.<snip> It is NOT a desirable trait and will eventually lead to degradation of the natural singing voice. It's very unfortunate what pushy teachers and parents will lead to in the world of child vocals.
-To help her in her future musical endeavors, your child should also learn an instrument -- probably piano, which is extremely helpful to singers. I wish I knew it better, because I'm going to have to learn it in college anyway. It will help her develop an ear for pitch, sight-reading ability, and provide a greater understanding of music theory.
-Instead, let your daughter know that she can have a wonderful voice no matter what notes she can sing, and hold off on the serious voice lessons and performances -- and for Pete's sake, a 'fan base' until later. There's plenty of time for that later -- let her enjoy childhood now.









:














:














:














:














:














:














:














:














:














:














:


----------



## KermitMissesJim (Feb 12, 2004)

My first thought was any voice teacher who agrees to train a six-year-old in the manner you describe is taking advantage of you, stealing your money and hoping for a piece of famewhore pie later.


----------



## grisandole (Jan 11, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *trinity6232000*
I don't want to sound all high and mighty but those who are serious in
the music business look down on the web-sites and those trying to create
a "buzz" for their children. They are laughed at. Any "buzz" you will make
will only be appreciated by those who want to make money off your child.
I am sorry but it's the truth. I have watched it, and as much as I hate to
admit, I have laughed myself. I laughed, while hurting for the child.


Ditto this. I have friends and family in "the industry", and I was very briefly in it until I decided it wasn't for me. If you are serious about having your daughter perform, having a website isn't the way to go. I don't know who you think you are "promoting" her to, and who you are creating a "buzz" for......some internet weirdos? Do you really think that agents/managers/producers surf the net looking for talent? Sorry to be harsh, but if you are going to do this, at least do the research and find out the legitimate, intelligent way to get into the business. Seriously, you are setting yourself and your daughter up for scam artists and sickos.

Kristi


----------



## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

I don't really understand what everyone is getting so upset about. All I see is a mom trying to support what her child wants to do.

Some people are born into their vocations - they've known what they want to do for as far back as they can remember. They simply have a huge passion for a particular thing. If her daughter wants to pursue that, I can't think of any reason her mom shouldn't support it.

I'm a little surprised that on a board where a lot of people feel that the desires and rights of children are trambled on, there aren't more people who feel she should be able to support what her daughter wants to do, and help her.

With me, I wanted ballet lessons - I plagued my parents about it. So at 2.5 years old, I started taking ballet. I no longer take it, but I'm really glad that they supported it, because I really loved doing it.


----------



## grisandole (Jan 11, 2002)

Well, I personally wouldn't care if the OP put her daughter in performing arts classes, or was looking for an agent or something. That isn't what she is doing, though. She's putting her daughter all over the internet in hopes of creating a "buzz" about her. That isn't nurturing a talent or desire.


----------



## HelloKitty (Apr 1, 2004)

Growing up I always wanted to be a famous singer or actress, my parents however did not support me. They wanted me to instead become a painter (I had a talent for drawing and pastels). They would push me for art lessons and wanted me to accept a scholorship to an art high school for drawing that I got offered. Instead I quit drawing altogether.and I still harbor some resentment over them not supporting me in what I wanted to do. So I applaud you supporting your daughter but...

The website rubs me the wrong way. Not just the privacy aspect but the whole "creating a buzz" talk and all that. I mean, she is only 6 - IF she still wants to sing years from now, she has plenty of time to make it happen. Get her voice lessons if you want, put her in a little kid chorus but I wish you would forget about creating a buzz right now and just let her be a kid. Just seems like too much pressure to me.


----------



## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *hotmamacita*
My 6 yo sings beautifully and she has learned from my example and makes her own songs up which really endears me. But this little one just wants to dance and she dances beautifully. She just choreographed her first ballet a few weeks ago and we are holding a private performance at home which even includes her set design (that she told her papa to make). I love this age. Creativity is amazing to me.










Too cute!


----------



## snuggly mama (Mar 29, 2004)

Ok, so first my disclaimer: I know nothing at all about the music industry. I don't know how it works, what talent scouts do, or what it takes to make a career out of singing.

But I am a mom, one with children who display many levels of talent. I love that my dd can write fabulously inventive stories, and I love that my ds can run rings around his friends on the soccer field. But I love more that they are children with huge potential to do so many things and with lots of time to make those decisions. Your daughter is beautiful and her voice is lovely -- but she's six years old!!! It makes me sad that her direction in life is being charted before she's had a chance to make the discoveries of her other interests. Wouldn't it be ok if she always had a true passion for singing but pursued another, less famous, line of work? Wouldn't it be ok if she loved music so much that she became a music teacher? Wouldn't it be ok, too, if she loved singing so much that she sang beautiful, tender lullabies to her own babies someday? The child who is in love with music may well be an adult in love with music -- but not necessarily one who wants to perform for a living. Perhaps as she grows she'll find other passions in her life. Enjoy her beautiful voice, encourage her to sing for you, for friends and family, even in choir or small performances as she wishes. But why not just videotape them as treasured memories, not as highlights of a blossoming career?

It's obvious to me that you love your daughter and are so proud of her abilities. I think your willingness to support her interests is wonderful, but I also think that you can be equally as protective of her childhood. I wish you both all the best.


----------



## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shonahsmom*
I think I might get so flamed for writing this.... but... your daughter is beautiful and I'm sure she's an amazing kid, but, and I don't mean this in an insulting Simon Cowell kind of way because I'm really a very nice person.. but, she sounds to me just like any other six year old kid singing. Maybe I'm missing something... that "whistle register".. my dd does that all the time and so do most of the five and six year old girls she hangs out with and its mostly really annoying. The clips are short, so maybe its just not enough to showcase this huge talent you say she has, but I so don't see it. I don't know, I went to the site after reading all of your posts and I expected to be blown away. She's absolutley adorable. I'm just not getting it. I've seen clips of C. Aguillera at 5 and 6 years old and while I'm not a fan of hers music she has an amazing voice. And its very, very apparent in those clips of her even at that age. Just my .02







:


Ok, I"m NOT going to flame you at all









I'm expressing my concern...not for your child's safety, but for her voice.

Yes, she has a nice voice at 6. I'm not sure that "whistle tone" can be determined at this young of an age though. My biggest concern is her lessons. A 6 year old is physically too young to have true vibrato. There are changes thar happen as a body grows that allow certain thngs to happen. Afemale voice isn't even fully mature until the mid 20s!

Here is an example. A child's voice is to sound airy. YOu will probably even hear air in the tone. Why? BEcause there are muscles tht cause the vocal folds to move. The muscle that causes the folds to close completey aren't formed/mature enough to do the job till the late teens. Forcing the folds closed is that fastese way to hurt yourself. Kinda like people who sing with a lot of glotteral attacks end up with nodes and "Tired" voices. Have you heard Mariah Carey lately?

THis is just one example, there are a few more as well. Of course this is only 4 years of formal training and a degree in music speaking....maybe after I get my Master's I'll know better :LOL Vocal pedagogy...I knew I loed that class!

The other thing, I'm not sure if she does this but, mimmicking the product of someone elses voice is dangerous! The product without the technique is a bad combination.

Please, please, please make sure that the instructor you are using is trained and is knowledgable with young voices because not all of them are. I had some bad ones gorwing up.

A little girl's voice should sound ike a little girl's voice. Typically a little girl who sounds like a woman is putting her vocal health in jeopardy.

I wanted to add that as a child I had a 6 octave range. Now as an adult I only a 4.5 octave range. Not because I'm a bad singer or I've lost ability but as a child grows so does their voice...and octaves don't really matter all that much in the "Real" world...maybe to Mariah Carey it does though :LOL It matters what you do with the range you have.


----------



## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sly Soprano*
If a prepubescent child has vibrato, it is artificial and a disgusting bastardization of technique.


This sentence right here made my day :LOL


----------



## USAmma (Nov 29, 2001)

This thread has been edited, posts removed, and moderator alerts issued because they broke the following rules:

Quote:

Posting in a disrespectful, defamatory, adversarial, baiting, harassing, offensive, insultingly sarcastic or otherwise improper manner, toward a member or other individual, including casting of suspicion upon a person, invasion of privacy, humiliation, demeaning criticism, namecalling, personal attack, or in any way which violates the law.
and for those who responded to the person who was namecalling, etc . . .

Quote:

*Posting to discuss the statements or behavior of a member or members on the board,* or to criticize another discussion on the boards. *Such issues should be directed to the moderator or administrator privately and not made a subject of discussion in a thread.*
Please try to keep your posts within the User Agreement. Thanks.


----------



## Moss's Mommy (Mar 28, 2002)

I have to say... it creeps me out too. What is that industry quotes part of the website? Is it where magazines and stuff will have their quotes? What if that never gets a quote? Wouldn't that be horrible for you and your daughter? Most children have beautiful voices, all of us think our children do. And she is beautiful, but all children are with the right clothes and hair (and even with the wrong clothes and hair.) She's just 6, I know you are soooo proud of her and you have good talent at making a website (if you made it yourself, and please don't tell me you paid someone else to make it.) BUT.. but but but. I just feel sort of sad for you both. Sad for her when she doesn't live up to your expectations and sad for you when she doesn't live up to your expectations. She'll find her own way... you shouldn't try doing it for her. Good Luck, anyhow, in finding happiness.


----------



## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

I really don't see the point of trying to create a "buzz" and a "fanbase" for a child who won't be available to the "industry" for at least 10 years anyway.

Personally, I wouldn't want my very young child to have a fanbase. I would never want to be part of a young child's fanbase. It seems very creepy to me. I don't want strangers encouraged to be interested in my daughter.

I can't help the feeling that by creating this website, you are turning your daughter into a product.

Namaste!


----------



## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

One more thought: if your website is successful in creating a "buzz" about your daughter, there's going to come pressure to have her out there doing something. If you're trying to market her, no one is going to want to wait 10 years to see what happens. How will you explain to your daughter that you've done this marketing and she's now in demand, but you're not going to let anything happen for her because you want her to have a childhood until she's 16? Nobody in the "industry" is going to care that you are trying to protect your daughter's childhood. They just want a money-making product. (Witness Mary Kate and Ashley.) If you don't want her "out there" now, don't put her out there now.

Namaste!


----------



## magnoliablue (Dec 29, 2002)

I am curious as to when she started vocal training, and what kind of education and experience her coach has, as most coaches I know will not permit a child to begin lessons until 10, because the voice is more mature at that point, as well as the child.
My dd is a competitive dancer, she started dance at 4, but not competitively until 6 years after that, and she had to fully understand everything being involved at this level takes. Not to mention, SHE had to want to do this, it did not come from me or her instructors. SHE made the choice to commit herself to this level, and she gives up a LOT of her down time to dance, often missing out on things, but she wants to do this. The day she decides she does not want it anymore, no matter how great a dancer she is? She's done, no question about it. Likewise, if her grades slip, same deal goes.
While I admire you for supporting your dd's obvious talent, I hope you understand the pressure she could be under, and more importantly, I hope it has been adequately explained to her, in a way she understands.
Good luck, she is beautiful.


----------



## magnoliablue (Dec 29, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sly Soprano*
I sing seriously. Currently, I sing in a general high school choir [which received a I, superior, rating at a state music festival this year] and have been accepted into a twenty-voice select choir for next year which consistently receives superior ratings at state festival, received a gold rating at last year's private Heritage Festival in Chicago, and has been recognized by the Missouri legislature for outstanding performance. I also received a II, excellent, rating at this year's Greater St. Louis Solo and Ensemble Festival. Therefore, I think I know what I'm talking about.








I'm a soprano, as you can probably tell from my username. I do a lot of study of the female voice, especially the highest range, and there are a few realities you're going to have to come to terms with.
First, almost every little girl has access to this 'whistle range'. It's due to the fact that their vocal cords have not matured and, thus, are incredibly tiny. The highest of soprano voices tend to retain this size after puberty.
However, most girls [probably about ninety percent] lose it. Most females -- sixty to seventy percent, when all's said and done -- sing in the alto range, which is most comfortable for most adult vocal cords. It comprises, in general, the F below middle C to the G above. It's pretty small, yes. This range can perhaps be increased to a fifth [seven half-steps -- half-steps are equal to one piano key's interval to the one immediately next to it, for the uninformed] above or below, but that's a hopeful number. It's unlikely, even with the most expensive training.
Even though your daughter has this great high range at six years old -- six years old, mind you -- she will most likely not retain it. Those are the cold, hard, unchangeable facts.
You cannot even prepare for a career until your daughter has completed puberty. Voice training needs to be catered to the mature voice. The technique that is taught to young singers is designed for the immature voice. Most of their technique will need to be changed, if they are taught this way, when they reach puberty. Every singer I know who has gone through pre- and post-pubescent voice lessons will attest to this change. The vast majority have said that they wish this technique training had been held off until their voices matured; they would not have had to put time, money, and effort into developing useless vocal technique.
An unfortunate consequence of incompetent voice teachers molding the prepubescent voice is the development of vibrato.
Vibrato is a beautiful, natural thing.
Many people ask, natural? I thought one had to learn vibrato.
No. Real vibrato is a natural consequence of reaching vocal maturity, proper singing technique and breath support, and the total control thereof. A six-year-old, nine-year-old, twelve-year-old -- most seventeen-year-olds, in fact -- should not have vibrato. If a prepubescent child has vibrato, it is artificial and a disgusting bastardization of technique. It is NOT a desirable trait and will eventually lead to degradation of the natural singing voice. It's very unfortunate what pushy teachers and parents will lead to in the world of child vocals.
Have you ever listened to the Vienna Choir Boys? They are all beautiful, classically-knowledgeable, prepubescent singers. Their most well-known trait is their crystal-clear vibratoless tone. They sing as children should strive to. If a child aspires to sing like Sarah Brightman or Charlotte Church [I really don't like to use pop stars as examples because I know the sorts of technique that goes into the creation of those voices] then they should first sing properly for their age and body and should understand that those voices can only be developed with time and effort and vocal cord maturity.
If you want your child to sing, as it sounds like she greatly enjoys it, then by all means let her sing. Let her join a regional children's choir or children's church choir. I recommend the former; most larger cities have one. I have a friend who is a beautiful soprano with a big, wonderful voice with just the right amount of vibrato. She is seventeen years old, and she sang with the St. Louis Children's Choirs [a wonderful institution] until last year. She let her voice develop naturally, and quite the amazing natural instrument it is.
To help her in her future musical endeavors, your child should also learn an instrument -- probably piano, which is extremely helpful to singers. I wish I knew it better, because I'm going to have to learn it in college anyway. It will help her develop an ear for pitch, sight-reading ability, and provide a greater understanding of music theory.
By no means am I trying to dissuade your child from singing. You just need to remember that a career should be out of the question at the moment if you want her to have a healthy childhood and a healthy voice as an adult. Don't get her hopes up about her range, please -- I know far too many ex-elementary and middle school sopranos who can't come to terms with the fact that they're altos now. Instead, let your daughter know that she can have a wonderful voice no matter what notes she can sing, and hold off on the serious voice lessons and performances -- and for Pete's sake, a 'fan base' until later. There's plenty of time for that later -- let her enjoy childhood now.

::steps off soapbox::

I wish I had read this post before I spouted off.







Very well said, and absolutely what I would have liked to explain.


----------



## Charles Baudelaire (Apr 14, 2003)

She is LOVELY!!!


----------



## livinwithmcs (Nov 26, 2003)

It's Our Family, thank you so much for your post. I know there has been some concern about the vibrato in my daughter's voice, so I contacted an expert in voice, David Jones.

Mr. Jones teaches Master's Vocal Training at Julliard and the Manhattan School of Music. He has helped to train the world's best opera singers and will be a guest speaker at the upcoming Classical Singer Convention in New York. You can read what they (opera stars) have said about him and his training here http://voiceteacher.com/quotes.html . He has a Master's degree in voice and has had extensive training in vocal science, working with the world's top laryngologist.

I asked him if vibrato in a child is damaging and told him of the concerns that have been posted to this thread, although I really have not been concerned about it.

His answer is this: "They are incorrect."

But once again I do appreciate you taking the time to post your thoughtful message.


----------



## hippiemomma (Mar 13, 2005)

http://www.amydiamond.se/?sid=archive&folder=videos

Check this site out. this girl has some real talent. she is amazing.









check out if I ain't got you alica keys cover, simply amazing.


----------

