# Cesarean Section Support Only Thread June 2005



## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

This thread is for support only and not to debate the necessity of cesarean birth. This is a place to moan, complain, bitch, mourn, share the joy, thoughtful decision, cesarean birthplans, etc and all are welcome!

The previous thread is very long but has some really good information in it. Here is the link: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=254694


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

My Cesarean Birth Plan

I am having a planned cesarean section the third week of June. My cesarean is being planned for mid-day. I chose to plan my cesareans because my first was a very bad emergency situation in which I felt the entire thing and felt out of control. When planning I arrange everything in advance, including who administer anestesia, my nursing care, and who assists my doctor in performing the surgery. I literally have my hand in every decision that is made, including the type of anestesia that is performed, what drugs are given to me during the actualy surgery, and what happens after the baby is born barring no complications.

Here it is:

As this is a planned Cesarean birth we are looking forward to a positive birth experience. We want to participate in this birth to the fullest. We have listed our preferences below; these decisions have been made after research, consultation, and thought. Therefore your help in attaining these goals is very much appreciated.

We would appreciate preoperative blood work and tests to be done on an out patient basis, and hospital admission on the day of the birth.

My sister, ****** , is to stay with me the entire time, even for procedures and administration of anesthesia. [note to readers, my sister is a former L&D nurse]

I would like an epidural for pain relief with continued pain relief with a PCAP. [note to readers, I had a failed spinal with my first csection. I had an epidural with my second with continued pain support for 17 hours after surgery through a PCAP that was hooked into my epidural cathetar. I was able to mover around, but did not have anything impairing my brain function.]

I would like the catheter put in after anesthesia is administered.

I do not wish to have medical students present during our cesarean.

My arms are not to be strapped down unless general anesthesia becomes necessary during an emergency. [ It is customary during surgical births in the USA to strap the arms down, like you are Jesus Christ, to the operating table. Not all doctors or hospitals do this, but it is the "norm".]

I would like the option of viewing the birth either by lowering the screen or positioning a mirror.

I welcome conversation during the delivery process. [ Some people request music, dim lights, and no talking at all. It's really up to you. ]

If my baby needs assistance during the delivery process, if possible please use a vacuum verses forceps. [ I've had one baby delivered with use of the vacuum with no visible problems or effects. I know too many babies harmed by forceps, in vaginal and surgical births, this is why I have made this request.]

We would like to take photos of the birth as it occurs. [ This will be up to your doctor or hospital, most doctors can have hospital policy waved. ]

I would like to see the baby immediately after birth if at all possible. I would also like to be given the baby or have it held near me in the OR. If at all possible, we would also like to be able to have a pillow up under Kim's head so that she can have a better view and be more comfortable during the surgery.[thank you Shannon for this tip!]

No mind-altering drugs are to be administered without Kim's expressed permission. I am aware that some hospitals routinely sedate the mom for the repair portion of the surgery. It is important to Kim not to feel drugged or be unable to remember the events of the birth. Kim would like to avoid having nausea medications administered unless absolutely necessary, Zofran is preferred if the need arises. [ Phenegran makes most people drowsy and can interfere with nursing after surgery. Also, sedative are often administered in the IV routinely before the surgery actually begins in the IV to "calm" the patient.]

If at all possible we would like that the baby's father, Jeff, be able to cut the cord. [ I am not asking that he trim it at the warming table for baby, but actually enter the sterile field to cut the cord. My OB is going to try and accomadate this request, with respect given to the sterile field.]

Kim prefers that the outside incision be sutured with stitches and not staples. [ There is a small risk of infection from sutures, however I think the benefits outweight the cons. I have had both, and the stitches left me with a nicer cleaner incision, and I felt as if I was held together better.]

Below is our birth plan geared towards the care of our baby. Some things are bolded for emphasis.

We want to participate in our baby's care to the fullest. We have listed our preferences below, these decisions have been made after research, consultation, and thought. Therefore your help in attaining these goals is very much appreciated. Our pediatrician is Dr. Dan ***** at Children's Medical Group.

The baby's father, Jeff ********, is to be with the baby at all times following the birth.

Kim wishes to have the baby with her in recovery so that she can breastfeed immediately. [ readers note that I request to recover in a Labor & Delivery Room so that I can have my baby immediately and have my husband and sister with me (or other guests) Find out your hospitals policies about recovery areas, some will not allow you to have your baby or your partner with you.]

NO EYE OINTMENT is to be administered to our baby at ANY TIME. Kim, the baby's mother has been tested for all STDs and was negative and since this is a cesarean birth our baby is at no risk of eye infection. This has been discussed prior to the birth with our baby's pediatrician.

We have refused the Hepatitis B vaccine at this time.

We do consent to having the Vitamin K shot administered to our baby.

All tests and procedures are to be done in the presence of one of the baby's parents, and with our expressed consent, barring no emergency situation.

Please do not bathe our baby. [note to readers, bathing a baby after delivery can often lower their temperature, resulting in having to go and stay in the nursery. Cesarean birthed babies already have a disadvantage to vaginal birthed babies because they tend to have a harder time maintaining their temperature, this is why we forgo the bath, and do one later that I can participate in seeing and/or being involved in it.]

If our baby is a boy, do not circumcise.
[ we are expecting a girl, but just in case!]

Our baby will be breastfed. Please do not give our baby pacifiers or bottles.

We would like our baby to room in with us. Kim will have someone with her at all times to assist her with the baby in anyway. [note to readers, most hospitals will not allow rooming in for cesarean birth mommas unless they have help, this is the hospitals policy I am going too]

Do not come and take our baby to the nursery unless we request it. Any procedures or pediatric checks can be done in our room. This includes ultraviolent light therapy for jaundice. [ note to readers, if they tell you they can't do the therapy in your room, they are bull sh*tt*ng you. I specifically note this because my babies often get jaundice do to ABO incompatibility.]


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## Kaitnbugsmom (Dec 4, 2003)

only about 8 & 1/2 weeks til my scheduled c. It's a repeat c, but the last one was in a super bad hospital that allowed me nothing.







This one will be in a brand-new family-oriented hospital. Their parent hospital even has a nursing supply store that sells handmade slings and commercial slings, and for cheap too







The nurses on the mommy floor have all had extensive training by certified LCs, and there's an LC three days a week, so since my doc requires two to three days past the date of surgery for a hospital stay, I'll get to see her at least once. I am bound and determined to do things right this time. The nurse that gave us our tour agreed with us on all of our points and addressed all of our concerns. She said we are the first couple to request delaying the eye gel and vit. K, but that it won't be a problem {I hope she didn't assume I would let it fly if she said otherwise} All in all things are looking good on that end. I am a bit worried about recovering with a six year old and four year old, both super active, to take care of at the same time. My closest friends all work and have kids of their own. Depending on if I get my C at thirty eight weeks or there is cause to wait, I will probably have T's sister with me for the first week or so. She's only seventeen, and her child rearing skills and ideas aren't the best in the world, but she's good with the older two and that's what I'll need more than anything. She's also pretty good at fetching things from the store, and reading stories to the short people, and throwing stuff in the microwave. So that will help alot. I plan to hole up in my bed with Em for the first week or so, as much as possible. Daily walks and gentle stretching of course, but other than that I want to just kind of be, y/k? I'm expecting this recovery to be alot rougher than the first, except that this time I pray there will be no NICU stay to complicate things for both Em and I, the way it did Jordan's first week home.

Kids fighting. More centered posting to come


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

I had a c-section with my first at 42 weeks and 3 days after a fever & failed induction. I won't go into all the details, but it was necessary, I don't feel that we were pushed into it, etc. I do of course wonder however what small things we could have decided differently that might have changed teh outcome, but I feel we made the best decisions based on the info available to us at that time. However, I didn't like having a cesarean, it wasn't the birth I wanted.

I am now 41 weeks and 1 day pregnant with my second. I have set up everything to do a VBAC, but like my daughter, my son does not seem want to be born. I am rapidly reaching the point where I have to decide when we call it quits and go for a repeat cesarean. I have pondered over and over whether I should consider a pitocin only induction, but pitocin caused hyperstimulation last time and I feel it would be too risky for me. I have a midwife appointment in a few hours and I know we will be discussing this. My current thinking is that we schedule a C/s for 42 weeks (6/7) and if I go into labor before then, then great. I know if everything continues to look okay with the baby my midwife would probably let me go longer, which in some ways makes this harder as its really soley my decision. I don't know how much longer I can wait emotionally, physically, etc. Also, If I wait longer I will no longer have my inlaws to take care of my DD (and we don't have much alternative).

What I am really mourning is the loss of a clear path I can say 'this is the right way to go'. I feel like if I choose to go with the cesarean I am giving up. I am scared that if I wait too much longer I'll be sacrificing my support and will just end up with the same outcome. I didn't want to post about this to VBAC or B&B because I know I would get a whole lot of 'trust your body', etc. I don't trust it, it didn't work (go into labor) last time and every day that passes I lose faith it will suddenly perform this time. My DD was 10lb 8oz and this little one looks to be just as big, so another doubt enters my mind. I am worried too that I'll rupture during labor. All of this is weighing on me greatly and of course that isn't going to help anything.









Anyway, thanks for listening.


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## alaska (Jun 12, 2004)

Hugs to you mightymoo - I sent you a pm.

kaitnbugsmom - you and I are in similar boats - I'm 6 weeks away. I'm hopeful that this will be a much different experience than the first.... and the feedback I'm getting from my Dr. re: my birth plan (which I basically plagarized from Kim - THANK YOU OTF







) is very positive. Why are you expecting a rougher recovery? I've read the opposite - that a repeat, non-emergency c/s results in much easier recoveries than emergency c/s.....
just curious.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Mightmoo - welcome! It seems like you are in a bit of a fix. My only words of encouragement or advice would be to follow your heart, your gut and to try not to care what other people think. Your baby, your body, your birth.

Stick around!

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Kaitnbugsmom - welcome! Stick around. Do you have a solid birthplan for your cesarean? Let us know whats up with you.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

mightymoo: For what's it worth, induction is one of the few things I am clear about at this point. I'm shooting for a VBA2C. If it gets to the point where induction is being discussed, be it for "post-date", rupture of membranes or whatever, I'm going to schedule a section. I don't want to do that, but I'd rather go straight to section (I think) than mess around with induction...especially since I think my odds of ending up with surgery would be high that way.


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## LizD (Feb 22, 2002)

Just want to chime in on sedatives during/after surgery- make sure you know what you want & ask for it, and ask to be kept informed every step of the way, I have a friend who was "dosed" with demerol w/o knowledge or consent. She'd never had it before, and between the stinging & loopiness thought she was dying and panicked. Obviously that's unusual, and anyone who wants sedatives should have them, but just be aware of maintaining your autonomy even in the OR, as the lively birth plan here provides for.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I don't have a birth plan for my VBA2C attempt, _or_ for my c-section, if it happens. But, I'll be seeing the OB tomorrow, so I guess I'll talk to him about some of these things then. And, hopefully, dh can help me keep my head straight about things like not wanting any morphine and all that.

Hey- does anybody know why they give you oxytocin for a schedule c-section? I had an IV, which I didn't even inquire about, because as far as I know they're standard for surgical procedures. The next day the nurse told me it was oxytocin. Why?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I don't have a birth plan for my VBA2C attempt, _or_ for my c-section, if it happens. But, I'll be seeing the OB tomorrow, so I guess I'll talk to him about some of these things then. And, hopefully, dh can help me keep my head straight about things like not wanting any morphine and all that.

Hey- does anybody know why they give you oxytocin for a schedule c-section? I had an IV, which I didn't even inquire about, because as far as I know they're standard for surgical procedures. The next day the nurse told me it was oxytocin. Why?

Its to help get the uterus down back to its normal shape and size. It is kind of hard to do "biscuits" on a belly that has been cut. After a vaginal delivery for the next few days you are supposed to massage the uterus to help it go down. Breastfeeding also helps with this.

I think you really need to get two birthplans going and discuss it all with your doctor. It's better to know ahead of times what they are willing to do and not do. You may also want to talk to him or her about anest. If you do VBAC do you want an epidural? etc. I have to say my aunt got more drugs after her vaginal delivery than I did before, during and after my csection. They gave her a sedative to help her sleep, phenegran for nausea, and morphine for pain. She was a total loon and out of her mind. She never asked for these drugs, they were just given to her because her doctor (not the one who delivered her baby mind you) ordered them. She is still angry about this happening to her, so be sure to say something now and not then.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Dd just wiped out my post...

I don't have a full birth plan written down, but I have taken some notes. I've been waiting for my OB appointment (today) because I don't really want to discuss these things with my regular doctor. My OB seems more supportive of the VBA2C attempt than she is.

I've already made up my mind that if my attempt to VBA2C goes through, I'm not accepting _any_ medications offered to me. If I want pain relief, I'll ask for it. The nurses on our L&D ward have a strong "we know what's best for you better than you do" attitude, and this time I'm ignoring them to the best of my ability. I'm definitely not accepting morphine. The only way that stuff is ever entering my body again is if I'm unconscious when it's administered - I'd rather be in ten times the pain than have to put up with the itching!! (I agreed to the morphine last time, because I was feeling too overwhelmed to even think about it.)

I was given a sedative after my first section, but not after my second one. I have no idea how much of my fogginess was from that, because the general anesthetic had already knocked me back pretty hard. I'm not finding these things a lot easier to think about ahead of time than I do in the OR, unfortunately.

Has anybody been able to keep their spouse with them while the stupid needle is administered? I find the epidural to be almost as terrifying as knowing that I'm being cut open, and for some stupid "hospital policy" reason, I have to face that with no support at all. I swear hospitals go out of their way to make the whole thing as grim as possible.

I definitely have to talk to my OB about keeping the baby with me after the surgery. I don't know if I'll get anywhere - I've known quite a few women (co-workers and such) who have had c-sections at this hospital and I've never heard of anyone not having the baby taken away while they "recover" in post-op.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

My DH was not present the first time, but was the second (as were students). I insisted that my sister stay with me -- I could care less about my husband being there. Luckily my sister is well known at the hospitals because of her work and she knows several of the anest. I have to say the IV was the worst thing I got last time, second the epidural but not the epidural itself, the shot that deadens your skin -- ugh.

I have an OB appointment today too! I hope yours goes well.


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## gethane (Dec 30, 2003)

Hi all, I've had a c-section, followed by 2 VBAC's and then another c-section. I am by no means trying to influence anyone's decision, but I would like to note that my 2 vbac's were pitocin induced and were successful. Induction does not always mean a failed vbac (though I know it does increase the risk







)

I would like to have another vbac, but I'm certain I won't find any ob any where within 60 miles to do one. I wish I could, I really really do. But driving 2 hours in labor is also not something I'm interested in doing, if I could even find someone within 120 miles to do a vbac here in nebraska.

My last child was going to be a planned section (against my wishes, the ob "fiddled" around for a few months whenever I asked if a vbac was possible, then announced mid pregnancy that his office no longer would do them for insurance reasons. And then told me no one in town will do them, and that the hospitals themselves were going to ban them). It turned out I needed an emergency c-section at 37 weeks anyway, for terribly high blood pressure.

I'm glad this thread is here. I sometimes feel like an anomaly because with all my previous problems, regardless of how much I want another vbac, a midwife or home birth is just not an option for me. Some people think its ALWAYS an option and its just not.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm pretty relaxed about students. I don't like having anybody there (eg. nurses, pediatrician, etc.) so the students don't particularly bother me. I figure they have to learn somewhere. Dh will be there for the surgery, of course...just hope he can be there for the needle.

The _last_ person I'd want there is my sister. She's the one who told me I'm pathetic because ds was born by section.

I hope your appointment goes well, too. I think my OB's going to schedule an ultrasound, and then I'll have one more appointment before the baby arrives...however/whenever that is.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

mightymoo-- hyperstimulation....my problem as well







It sucks doesn't it? I don't know if my c/b would have happened anyway or if the pit is the reason. I didn't go into labor with Bryce either and neither baby dropped or engaged (B did for about 2 weeks







but then went back to floating). I was VBAC until I hit 38 weeks I changed to a repeat then. I had Bryce the day before his due date. I didn't want to risk pit. NOt only because it is bad for VBAC but because I was super sensitive to it the first time. I didn't want to hurt myself or Bryce...that and my ob agreed it was best to leave it. If I had gone into labor we would have attempted VBAC but I was supposed to schedule at 42 weeks if I didn't go on my own.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

OB update.

My appointment today went pretty well. He wants me to schedule an ultrasound next week, to check the baby's position - he can't tell for sure where the head is, either. (This is strange - neither doctor can tell, and they're both good at this.)

If I go to section:
He's okay with waiting for labour, but has the usual concerns about "how do we handle it if you're late". *sigh* I'm still thinking on this, because if it's a section, I want him to do the surgery - not whatever doctor is on call. I just found out that my OB is away the last two weeks of June, which makes me _very_ nervous.

Having the baby with me while I recover is no problem. Apparently, policy has changed on this. DD would have been with me, except that the ward was too crowded - they couldn't keep me in the L&D room, or the OR, and had to send me to the general post-op ward. So...unless it's super-crowded again, the new baby can be with me right from the start.

That means my biggest concerns are mostly addressed, and the outcome looks good. I'll refuse morphine this time, so that's all the extraneous stuff taken care of.

If this goes to section, I still have a lot of "stuff" to deal with about having the surgery at all. But, at least all the "little" things are looking better.

DAMN! I just realized I completely forgot to ask about dh being with me while I'm anesthetized!!! Next appointment, I guess. (I wonder if I blocked that one out, because I'm the most pessimistic about it. What a coward.)


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Storm,

I am so glad that it looks like if you do have a repeat csection that you will have some of the things you want to make it a better experience.







I am glad policy has changed and that you can also keep your baby with you this time.

My OB is out of town all next week, making me a nervous wreck because I have so many contractions regularly but so far my cervix is closed. Its not as high as it was last time but its closed. I wish it would open just a bit since I am getting that IUD.

My csection could not be done on the 23rd at the time I wanted so it was moved to Friday the 24th at 12:30. I've already arranged child care and my sister has made arrangements to be with me that day for surgery. The anest. I wanted is also going to be there. I hear he is the best, so I guess I will find out in 22 days. My next and last OB appointment (I hope) is June 15th. My DH is going with me and we are going to go over the birthplan one more time. O, and the nurse called me the Queen of Csections today in the office. She said she had never seen a patient that knew more about csections and what they wanted from their surgical birth experience.







Hopefully this is a good thing for other patients who may not have a choice.

I also asked my OB about glueing the top incision. She said it would be a cold day in hell before she did that. She said that the underlying stitching has to be different than the regular stitching that they do and that infection risks are greater, not to mention the incision site opening back up. She said a lot of OBs will not do them on women who have had multiple csections or surgeries, nor on women who have gained a lot of weight or are over weight to start with. Some how this plays a part in the incision site opening back up. Yuck. Anyway she said a lot of surgeons/OBs are not going to take the time to stitch all the underlying layers correctly, and then when they use the glue you just have problems on your hand.

O, and I am getting double layered sutures this time just in case I change my mind and decide to have another baby. (yes I am crazy) :LOL


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Does anyone have a good resource on the drugs used during c-sections?

At the end of my labor last time, I had an epidural and felt fine (meaning "with it") - then they gave me whatever additional anethesia for the c-section and I remember feeling significantly out of it during the operation and for a while afterwards - it really wrecked the birth for me because I felt like I couldn't even see or concentrate on my newborn. I've had my midwife look at the postop report and she said there wasn't any narcotics on there, but I'm not sure I believe I wasn't given something! Anyway, I want to avoid feeling like that this time but I don't know anything about the various drugs used. Anyone have a link?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mightymoo*
Does anyone have a good resource on the drugs used during c-sections?

At the end of my labor last time, I had an epidural and felt fine (meaning "with it") - then they gave me whatever additional anethesia for the c-section and I remember feeling significantly out of it during the operation and for a while afterwards - it really wrecked the birth for me because I felt like I couldn't even see or concentrate on my newborn. I've had my midwife look at the postop report and she said there wasn't any narcotics on there, but I'm not sure I believe I wasn't given something! Anyway, I want to avoid feeling like that this time but I don't know anything about the various drugs used. Anyone have a link?

I found a good bit of my info on medscape/medline about the drugs they give during csections. Also I looked in some actual textbooks years ago. (tto long to remember... I live near a medical school)
This is what happens typically -- they give you a spinal or epidural, this causes your blood pressure to drop, the patient often will feel nauseated -- in come the anti-nausea drugs and ephedrine. The antihystamine(sp) phenegran often is uses for the nausea AND sedative. The thing is, the reason the patient gets nauseated is from the blood pressure drop, and often will subside after ephedrine is given. In my experience YOU have to request zofran for a csection, which does not give the sedative effect. Other drugs that may be used are sedatives/anti-anxiety medications during a csection. These are administered in your IV, often without your permission. This is standard surgical proceedure, especially during the suturing phase. This is to help relax you and make you "compliant". I specifically said "do not give me sedatives, valium, verset, etc. in my IV". Also, other things that are given to you are morphine and demerol during the suturing phase, especially if you have a spinal -- its up to you to say "don't give me that" or to request duramorph in your spinal.

I just wanted to say there was lots of stuff "left out" of my surgical report from my first csection. Somethings are just "understood" as well. Also some drugs, like phengran are not classified as narcotics yet cause the patient to have a hazy, dreamlike effect.

I will see if I can find a link for you, but its been awhile since I looked!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

http://www.ispub.com/ostia/index.php...ol4n2/nvpo.xml

this one above was interesting to read about spinals

http://www.humed.com/anesthesiology/obstetric.shtml

Above is just some general information

http://www.euroanesthesia.org/educat...enna/11rc3.HTM

another good link

I'm looking for some more stuff...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Storm,

I am so glad that it looks like if you do have a repeat csection that you will have some of the things you want to make it a better experience.







I am glad policy has changed and that you can also keep your baby with you this time.

My OB is out of town all next week, making me a nervous wreck because I have so many contractions regularly but so far my cervix is closed. Its not as high as it was last time but its closed. I wish it would open just a bit since I am getting that IUD.

The fact that he's away those two weeks is a little freaky. He's working with my original due date of July 14th, not the revised due date (per ultrasound) of the 9th. DD was deliver 5 days before my due date, with no visible signs of labour. But, ds was born 9 days early. So...my OB's first day back is July 4th (my next appointment with him) - that's not a lot of leeway if labour starts early. I really hope I don't end up with the on-call OB. That's the _only_ factor that's leading me in the direction of scheduling the surgery.

I never even discussed suturing - slipped my mind completely. I think I'll just go with whatever he's most comfortable with, as I want him to do his best job!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Ack.. the reason why it was so quiet.. was there was a new thread.. duhh..

I posted last on the last one.. here it is again in case it got lost..

thanks!

Chantal

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Re BIG babies..... I will ask my MW again.... I don't eat much dairy.. none at all when pregnant.. so that isn't it.. maybe sugar...?? tho I do not get GDBs.
When I asked after DD was born, the MW said I just have a great placenta...









Sometimes I think I make no evolutionary sense....














: I was born quite premature.. only 4 lbs 6 oz..and survived due to modern medicine.. which at the time was no where like it is now for premies.. I was a sickly child.. and survived due to the wonders of antibiotics.... and I can't push out my babies.. but survive because of the wonders of modern medicine... Is this trying to tell me something









Sometimes that is depressing..








although.. as of right now.. DD is the last child... hahah.. she isn't sleeping this week/month :yawning:















I tell DH.. nature's birth control in action









Chantal


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Sometimes I think I make no evolutionary sense....

I've been thinking on similar lines the past few days. I seem to have a propensity for building big babies, coupled with a propensity to carry them very long...I haven't had the opportunity to find out how far I would go if given the chance. (DD born via c/s at 42 week 3 days after induction - this one is 41w 3d so far) While I'm not a small person and I don't have anything like prematurity in my past, I still think that maybe I just ended up with a bad combination of genes so to speak. I wish I could know for sure, it would just make it so much easier to live with i the end I think.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

What size was your dh when he was born? DD was much bigger than ds - and they had different fathers. DD's father was much larger as a newborn than ds's father was. I think it might be a major factor.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
What size was your dh when he was born? DD was much bigger than ds - and they had different fathers. DD's father was much larger as a newborn than ds's father was. I think it might be a major factor.

Not sure if you were asking me or Chantal, but yeah, I could see that being a factor - DH was I think a bit over 9lbs, but not seriously overdue the way my babies are. If my babies were born at term they may have been similarly sized to DH.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I was actually asking both of you.









I know about the feeling like an evolutionary mistake - my brother, sister and I were all born by c-section, too. My brother was an emergency (a real one, for a change!), and in those days it was "once a c-section, always a c-section" - plus mom had the vertical cut. I've had well-meaning people tell me that without the surgery, mom wouldn't be here and neither would the rest of us (me, my siblings & my babies). The fact is, she probably would have lost my brother, but that doesn't mean she wouldn't have made it. So, there's no reason to assume that the rest of us wouldn't be. My sections have both been for breech, and I've talked to people here who have vaginally delivered breech babies...so it's not as though my son and I were destined to die. People like to second-guess.

I don't think it ever occurs to anybody to wonder how it feels to be told something like that. "You should be thankful to the doctors, because the women in your family are so defective that none of you would be here without them." Gee...thanks. I'm glad the surgery is available - as I said, I'm 99% sure it saved my brother's life. But, out culture is full of birth stories (a lot of them scary) and TV and movies full of "normal" births - although heavily medicated - and the whole c-section issues makes me (and I know I'm not alone) feel like I'm just cut off from a whole huge part of being a woman...and that there's something defective about me.

The big babies...some of them are just large. DD was 10lb., 2oz. - and she wasn't due for another five days when I had the section. This one I'm building right now seems to be shaping up to be another large one.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

My mom had me by c-section as well, though more for 'failure to progress' so whether it was really necessary is kinda lost to the ages now. Of course my younger brothers were both repeat c/s.

It's interesting that at the moment I'm rather lamenting the opposite of you - that I can't just put a 'defective' stamp on myself and stop wondering if it was my actions and choices that were responsible.. I felt like I tried so hard to do everything 'right' last time (choosing a midwife, birth center, waiting patiently to 42+ weeks, etc) and yet I got a c/s. What kills me is the 'what ifs' - I bet if I had just stuck my head in the sand and hired an sOB, I would have been induced at 40 weeks successfully and this would not be an issue. Not that I think its the better route, I just feel like that's just my luck. I've watched friends make 'bad' (read non-evidence based) choices and sail through without a hitch while I struggle and agonize over every decision and get screwed in the end, y'know?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Mightymoo,

I can relate to that. Doing everything right, but still ending up with an outcome outside what you anticipated or wanted. One of my neighbors has really large babies, went to 41 weeks with her first, all natural labor - 10.5lbs. She asked to be induced last time, said she wasn't doing it again. So they induced at 39 weeks without problem with cervidil and pitocin. She did get an epidural (walking) and was very happy with her birthing experience. Baby weighed nearly 9lbs.
I live among people who easily have babies vaginally and those of us who did have csections had them for pretty valid reasons, imo.
My MIL had 4 children between 9.5 and 11.5 lbs. All post dates. The biggest one died from birth complications (it was a natural birth) at 43 weeks. She has told me several times that in this day and age he would have made it. And she is probably right.
I am one to believe (and this is a spiritual belief) that its NOT "us" who ultimately make the choice. There is a divine reason for why our children are born the way they are. It's possible that your choices that led to your cesarean were in fact, meant to be that way.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
I am one to believe (and this is a spiritual belief) that its "us" who ultimately make the choice.

Oh - I find that so depressing. I had no "ideal birth" in mind at all with ds. I just knew that I didn't want any pain meds unless I was going completely insane, and that I absolutely didn't want a c-section.

My SIL was over yesterday. I was telling her how I was trying for a VBA2C. She had her daughter 6 months after ds was born, and had been terrified of labour. She was sooo relieved when induction didn't work and she had to have a section. She said to me "you're crazy. I can't understand why anybody would _want_ to go through excruciating pain." I see/hear comments like this so often that sometimes I feel as though I'm the only one who actually thinks a c-section hurts! I haven't pushed a baby out, but the labour I have experienced - to 10cm dilation (admittedly without complications...until the end) was a picnic compared to being post-op. Do other women really find c-section pain so easy to shrug off?


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mightymoo*
I've watched friends make 'bad' (read non-evidence based) choices and sail through without a hitch while I struggle and agonize over every decision and get screwed in the end, y'know?

The women I've known who've had the "best" labours have all been smokers and couch potatoes (I mean *no* exercise - the type who whine about having to get themselves a snack from the fridge) who ate badly and never even read the free publication on prenatal care that BC moms get. The three of them were _all_ cases of "accidental" pregnancy with no partner in the picture, and one of them once told me she'd thought about an abortion, but it was "too much hassle" to make the appointment. They all sailed through the whole thing...easiest pregnancies and labours I think I've ever seen. The whole thing is very frustrating sometimes.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I feel as though I'm the only one who actually thinks a c-section hurts! I haven't pushed a baby out, but the labour I have experienced - to 10cm dilation (admittedly without complications...until the end) was a picnic compared to being post-op. Do other women really find c-section pain so easy to shrug off?


No, I would go through labor gladly. I didn't dilate to 10 but I was up to the maximum dosage of pitocin they could give (even with an internal fetal monitor) for hours with no pain meds. I agree that at the time I just wanted it over. The induction was hell. So was the recovery from my first section. It was 8 or more months before I felt even partly good.

It hurts. It hurts like hell. C-sections suck.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I had natural labour...actually, I was at home until about half an hour before the surgery, with no idea I was so far along. I'm sure from everything I've read that induced labour is worse.

I guess my thing is that I'd much rather have the excruciating pain _before_ I have newborn!!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
Oh - I find that so depressing. I had no "ideal birth" in mind at all with ds. I just knew that I didn't want any pain meds unless I was going completely insane, and that I absolutely didn't want a c-section.

My SIL was over yesterday. I was telling her how I was trying for a VBA2C. She had her daughter 6 months after ds was born, and had been terrified of labour. She was sooo relieved when induction didn't work and she had to have a section. She said to me "you're crazy. I can't understand why anybody would _want_ to go through excruciating pain." I see/hear comments like this so often that sometimes I feel as though I'm the only one who actually thinks a c-section hurts! I haven't pushed a baby out, but the labour I have experienced - to 10cm dilation (admittedly without complications...until the end) was a picnic compared to being post-op. Do other women really find c-section pain so easy to shrug off?

I meant to say NOT "us". LOL

Some do find it easier. Of course I will never know why!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Okay - I feel better now.









It's obviously - like everything about pregnancy/labour/birth (well, bodies in general, really) - very complicated. Not only do some women find the c-section easier than the labour, there's also the "emergency vs. scheduled" thing where I seem to be on the other end of scale from most. I really do think I had pain from my scheduled one for longer than my emergency one. It didn't affect me getting out and doing things any longer than the first one did, but the pain definitely lasted longer.

My OB asked me about a tubal ligation yesterday. Is 37 so old? Everyone, except dh, seems to think I'm insane or stupid for seriously considering another baby after this one.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
My OB asked me about a tubal ligation yesterday. Is 37 so old? Everyone, except dh, seems to think I'm insane or stupid for seriously considering another baby after this one.

My doctor was big on talking about tubal when I first went in. Then when I told her I had doubts about doing it she said not too. I then asked if she would be willing to do another csection on me if I decided I wanted another baby. She said yes, that she had done up to five on one patient. So I am getting an IUD. My husband is sure he wants no more children but he also isn't willing to commit to sterilization either (and I dont want him too)


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

My dh isn't sure about another one. He'd kind of like to stop at this one, but as he puts it "I'm not as hellbent on only having three as you are on having four". The thing is...I know I'm not rational about this. I've wanted four kids since I was 18. After all those years of problems conceiving and then losing my babies, the fact that I'm having these two as close together as they are almost feels as though my four were meant to be, after all. It's not something I can give up on easily...kind of my last chance for things to happen the way I want, you know?

Plus, both my SIL and my sister have four and didn't want that many. I know that shouldn't make a difference, but it does. They complain about having to deal with so many kids, and I just sit there thinking how badly I'd like to be in their shoes. And, I can't even say it because I just get "yeah - that's because you have no idea what it's like" - which is, unfortunately, true.

I was surprised my OB brought up a tubal, because we'd already discussed it at my last visit. He said he's quite willing to do up to four c-sections, if that's what's required and didn't seem to see any problem with me having another. Then, yesterday, he asked again? I wonder if he jotted something down incorrectly in his notes last time. I'd better make _sure_ this is cleared up before I go in to have this baby!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi
Lisa: My DH was less than 8lbs at birth. My sister was 6 lbs at birth and I was 4 1/2 lbs.. My grandmother says my mom was 8lbs something and my uncle was 9 lbs something....









Some days I think.. I want to try an hba2c.. My husband, doula and a MW are on board.. and some days I think that I want this too.. then other days I think that I don't.. that I am crazy to even consider it.. I couldnt' get these two out.. what makes me think I could do it again.

It is awful to have a c/s when all you want is a regular birth.. It is worse, imho, to have a c/s after laboring at home, getting to 10, pushing for 4 hours and then ending up with one..... And I don't think i could bare that again...









I think I am just feeling sensitive today...

My friend, who had a lovely homebirth, has found a local OB.. who is quite vocal in his support of home birth. She has an appointment with him next week. She is going with a HUGE list of questions on things ranging from shadow care to my situation. I think it is really nice of her to ask about me... If he says that he would be willing to do shadowcare and be an unofficial backup for an hba2c.. I might put more thought into trying..sigh.. I just don't know

Re Tubal: You had better make DARN sure they know your wishes BEFORE your c/s!!! I have heard of some Drs making the choice for the mother and then saying.. well.. I thought that is what you wanted..







:

Chantal


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## Henry's_Mamma (Jan 23, 2004)

Hi everyone ... just saying a quicky hello ... I haven't had a chance to catch up on everything, so if there's anything I have any comments on, I'll check back in later. Otherwise, I hope everyone is doing well! I'm almost 19 months post c/s (for FTP, basically) and only occasionally am aware of my scar. I get some soreness if I have ds in the backpack too much, but otherwise, it is no bother. I guess I'm lucky, although I have always healed/scarred rather well, so maybe that has something to do with it??? We're talking about thinking about (how's that for indecision??) ttc#2, and I'm planning a VBAC. I'd really like an HBAC but they're illegal here (NJ) and I can't find a lay midwife. So if I HBAC it'll be UC, and I'm not sure I'm comfortable with that (and I KNOW dh wouldn't be). We'll see what the future holds.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Hey Henry'sMama!

So thinking about thinking about #2 huh? Hell girl just jump right in!

I could have sworn I saw a NJ couple on a Baby Story having a homebirth. I could definitely be mistaken though. How close are you to the PA border and could you go to a birth center?

Keep us updated!

Kim


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Hi everyone









I have been meaning to join in this thread. I am a mama to three terriffic little boys...my first was a C-section for FTP, 2nd a medicated hospital VBAC, and 3rd an HBAC. I feel blessed to have my boys AND blessed to have had such a variety of birthing experiences







I wanted to offer my support to all of you...whether you have just had a c-birth, or are planning another, or are trying for a VBAC. I am glad there is a place for women at Mothering to discuss the different experience and emotions that go along with surgical birth









Kim--glad to see you are doing well







Just 3 more weeks and Miss Katie will be in your arms! yeah!


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## mcs (Apr 20, 2005)

hello- I am scheduled for a cection on monday at nine in the morning- it will be my first child and she is a footling breech. I had planned and read and planned till I felt this funny bump in my side (head) and then tried every every trick to coax her into turning, but alas this little lady has tied her self up in her cord. I am really thankful that I will be able to have her with the "safety" of a cection, but wonder too if I lived in another time/place if I could still have her vaginally. I was not afraid of vag. delivery, but I am afraid of sugery. I met with the anesth.. yesterday and told her that I tend to have a strong reaction to any meds. She blew that off, but said that I will only be given the spinal and past that, I will have a choice with all else. What would you think? True or not so true?

I wish that I would have found this thread earlier as I did not think to ask my dr. (the back-up for my mw who I had been seeing until the last few weeks) some questions that you have mentioned here. For example- the eye wash. Can I mention these types of things while laying on the table? Or could my dh mention it?

Also, I feel just terrible about it, but I am jealous and just plain sad that my dh will get to be with her first (they said that she can maybe come one hour after to the recovery, but probably three hours- hopefully, dh will work his charm.) I wonder how those of you have had previous c/s have delt with these feelings. Or, how you have delt with the hospital staff. My mw will also be there to advocate for us, but the nursing staff and she are not on the best terms- I don't want to set myself up for disaster. And lastly, what in the world do I DO in the recovery room? If I can't feed and fondle my baby or talk to my dh who is with her- what do I do? Just stare at the wall? Watch television? I don't know. Ok, I am sorry to bombard you all with so many questions, but the day after tomorrow will be too late to ask them. Thanks for starting this thread- I was wondering why no body had. mcs


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Ligmom - WELCOME!

Note to thread readers: Ligmom lives local and on my call list when Katie is born, so she will hopefully be able to let you know how things go for me.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

MCS: Many hugs for you!
With my first child, I was not able to see him, but for a moment, in the OR and then not again for 2 more hours. It made me feel really disconnected from him. With my second c/s things were different and I was so surprised at how much this helped me connect with my daughter.. luckily we were at a different hospital whose policies allowed all these things to happen. It won't hurt to ask if these things can happen.. they can only say No.. right..?

Double layer suturing for my incision closure. Here in my area, most OBs won't touch a VBAC with single layer sutures. This was non negotiable...

The OR staff at this hospital told DH to bring his camera.. it was one of the sad things about my first child's birth.. we had no photos.. We had not even thought to ask about this and were thrilled . Our OB had DH stand and take photos while she was being removed.

The warming table was near my head this time.. instead of across the room, and I was able to watch and be near my baby as they worked on her.

I was able to hold her on the table before she went to the nursury. This really helped me connect with her..

We had declined the eye drops and vit K when I went into labor, that is allowed here, but because of the labor I had and the injuries she sustained from it.. my MW and Doula felt that it would be prudent to get those. So they were administered in the nursery.. We also decline the Hep B vax and she did not get it at the hospital or later either..

My DH went with her to the nursery and I had a doula and she was able to be right outside the OR waiting..and she would go back and forth between, giving me the updates etc. If you don't have a doula, see if a family member can do this

I was able to recover in my own room, not a recovery room and my baby was brought to me as soon as I was in there. This was an hour later.. but more because of surgery complications than anything else.

I was able to breastfeed her as soon as I saw her, the nurses were good at this birth center and that helped.. If you are planning on nursing, have the phone #s of people who can help you on hand and call them right away.

They put morphine in my IV during the op and this makes me throw up.. so ask if they do things like that.

I had a spinal with my second and an epi with my first.. I liked the spinal better...

the ICAN website has a good white paper on planning a family centered c/s birth..

many hugs to you!

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

MCS,

When you arrive at the hospital, ASK to speak to someone in the nursery and the lactation consultant before your 9 o'clock surgery. Tell them you do not want the eye ointment because this is a csection and there is NO RISK of your baby getting an STD since you are not having a vaginal birth. Express to them that you plan on breastfeeding and would like to nurse in recovery, and if possible be able to recover in a L&D room. If they can't let you recover in a L&D room DEMAND that they bring your baby to your to nurse. Make it known that your DH is to be with your baby at any and all times for any proceedures.

Make it clear to your doctor BEFORE she cuts you, that you would like double layered sutures (in case you want to VBAC next time) and I would make it clear that you want NO sedatives during the suturing phase. Ask for Zofran for nausea. It's not too late to say something! Just don't let them bully you. Be more than willing to work within the confines of their rules but tell them you would like them to bend or break some of them to make this a good experience for you and your baby. Also try to talk to the LC, they often will go to bat for you to get your baby to you in recovery quicker.


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Kim, Thanks for the welcome









MCS--I second the excellent advise given to you by OTF and chantald. If you don't want your daughter to have the eye ointment you *can* decline it. They may try to tell you that it is a "must", but as her mother it is your right to refuse any medical procedures you aren't comfortable with. Definitely ask for the LC. She knows the importance of early breastfeeding, and will likely go to bat for you to bring your baby to you as soon as you are able to try to feed her. With that in mind, don't worry if you aren't able to feed her right away, but do stress to the staff that you don't want her to be given bottles or pacis(and let dh be with her to make sure)...I know many women who didn't get to nurse their babies until many hours after birth and baby was able to nurse quite well anyway









We will be thinking about you and looking forward to your update


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mcs*
And lastly, what in the world do I DO in the recovery room? If I can't feed and fondle my baby or talk to my dh who is with her- what do I do? Just stare at the wall? Watch television? I don't know. Ok, I am sorry to bombard you all with so many questions, but the day after tomorrow will be too late to ask them. Thanks for starting this thread- I was wondering why no body had. mcs

I would hope that you can have your baby with you. I only just found out that the policy at my hospital _is_ to allow the baby to be with the mom, but I missed out on that last time due to overcrowding in the OR section of the maternity ward. I had to go down to the main post-op (for the whole hospital). As to what I did...I spent an hour wondering how my baby and dh were doing, while I lay flat on my back, watching my bp/pulse monitor (nothing else to do), listening to the delirious woman next to me coming out of general anesthetic and being asked every five minutes if I could wiggle my toes yet. That hour was probably the worst part of my entire c-section experience...the worst part of both of them, actually. I hope you get to hold your baby - or at least have someone with you who can carry on a conversation!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ligmom*
I know many women who didn't get to nurse their babies until many hours after birth and baby was able to nurse quite well anyway









We will be thinking about you and looking forward to your update









Just to second this - with my first c-section, an emergency, I was separated from my son for over 12 hours. (I saw him long enough to fall in love and touch his cheek while they were transferring me from recovery to the maternity ward.) I was coming out of general anesthetic _and_ a sedative, given to me to help me sleep, when they brought him to me the next morning. I did have rough start to breastfeeding, but I nursed him exclusively for 4 months, and weaned him at 9 (*sigh* - in a misguided belief that I needed to if I wanted to ttc). It all went very well.

And, my mom was separated from all of us for extended periods (c-section rules in '63, '68 & '69 were a lot different) _and_ the nurses didn't support breastfeeding. She still breastfed all three of us.

So, while I hope you get your baby with you immediately after surgery, it's definitely not a death knell for the breastfeeding relationship if you don't.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

MCS - its worth noting that many many many hospitals now a days have no seperation at all for the mother and baby after a c-section, especially one in which you are not under general. My DD was cleaned up after the birth and handed to my DH, who held her right by my head through the rest of the surgery and then walked back with her while they wheeled me back to the L&D room for recovery (where we nursed immediately) and an hour later when we moved to our postpartum room, they had me carry her. I would make a big deal about that - there is no good reason to seperate mom and baby like that!


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## mcs (Apr 20, 2005)

Thanks so much for your kind (and swift) responses. I wish, I wish that while I waited for 4 freaking hours at the hospital yesterday for my bloodwork, that I had thought to ask to speak to the LC. I will though, certinly speak w/ her first thing on monday. Unfortunatly, the law in NY state requires that all babies (unless you take the hospital to court) recieve the eye ick, but I will ask again b/c of the c/s. And so forth...all great suggestions that I will try to follow.
I think because of the original disapointment on finding that I would have a c/s, that I have been a little too passive. You have all really bucked me back up- and just in time. Thanks again and again. I will let you know how it all goes when we return next week. mcs


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mcs*
Unfortunatly, the law in NY state requires that all babies (unless you take the hospital to court) recieve the eye ick,










I live in NY and could opt out of the eye ointment, we were not going to have it but in the end chose to do so because of birth trauma... I think it has more to do with "hospital policy" than anything else..I was offered to opt out prenatally.. at one of my MW visits...









Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Mandatory and the law are too different things. In the state of Alabama it is mandatory, but you can opt out of it. You can refuse any medical treatment for any reason, and that of your children. So if they tell you its the law, tell them to site it for you -- the law that is with a written documentation that it is illegal for you to refuse it. Hospital policy is just that policy and policies are meant to be broken.
At the hospital I am going to its policy not to allow cameras or video in the OR -- but my doctor said its here OR and *F* policy, she said we can take all the pictures and video we want. Guess who is going in there with a full roll to take?







And I plan to get DH to do some graphic ones -- I had some really good ones of them pulling my first child out of the incision, and I want them this time too.


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## mcs (Apr 20, 2005)

I guess that I am not so sure now- my mw told me at the very begining of the pregnancy that it was state (could it be city?) law- trusting her, thinking that I had read the same, and knowing that I don't have the money to sue a hospital, I did not question her further. I will, for curiostities sake, ask her about it today when I call with my list of other questions, but it is really not the very most important thing to me. I feel a little tricked though, and I don't like that. Thanks for the info. mcs


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Ugh, getting closer to D-day. I'm wondering if those of you who have had planned c-sections could share your experience with me.

What were you told in terms of eating before the surgery? When was the last time you were supposed to eat? Similarly when were you allowed to eat something (liquid, solid) afterwards? How long a hospital stay did you have?

Thx


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## SweetTeach (Oct 5, 2003)

MCS, I also live in NYC (Brooklyn) and from what I understand it is the LAW, not hospital policy to have all the newborn stuff administered to your child.
It is a no-consent law as well, so if you say you don't want it, and your child leaves your presence, these things will be administered.

Parents have refused, and from what I understand, they had difficulty leaving the hospital with their child and cases were opened up on them by CPS (I think citing neglect).

If you are birthing at home or in a birth center, I know that many midwives will "work with you" IYKWIM, but in a hospital in NYC, your hands are pretty much tied.

I am working with a hematologist to find out if a Vit K shot would be potentially dangerous to my child (s/he will have a 50% chance of having my blood clotting disorder which causes the blood to overclot...Vit K encourages more clotting).

Docs at the hospital I'm delivering at told me I need to get all of this in writing and in my files AND announced to all staff (signs up, etc) and I may even have to contact the Dept of Health pre-birth to make sure that they understand why my child shouldn't get this shot AND so I don't have to go through a CPS investigation for refusing it.

Bizarre.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mightymoo*
Ugh, getting closer to D-day. I'm wondering if those of you who have had planned c-sections could share your experience with me.

What were you told in terms of eating before the surgery? When was the last time you were supposed to eat? Similarly when were you allowed to eat something (liquid, solid) afterwards? How long a hospital stay did you have?

Thx

The guideline is nothing to eat or drink after midnight, however if I get thirsty before 6am I will have a little bit of water because my scheduled csections are not until 12:30 pm. Also the week of the surgery I eat lightly and normally take something like MOM two days before hand -- I eat a really good meal the night before, something I really enjoy, and then a snack right before midnight.

I had ice chips in recovery, and then once I got to my room I was allowed to have liquids, juice and water -- nothing heavy, by the evening meal I could have soft foods. The next morning I had a regular diet. I got a milk shake in the middle of the night with my last csection. My first csection I was starved for four days and I think that contributed to my poor recovery.

One of the things to get gas moving, because some doctors say you have to pass gas before eating or leaving is to chew gum and/or rocking, drinking something heavier than juice like a milk shake does the trick too. With my first csection I was kicked out of the hospital, literally - on the morning of day 5 (it was a Friday, and I had her on Monday at 1). When I got home I was in such horrible shape, I even passed out entering my house, and threw up all that evening. With my second csection I left in less than 48hrs. I felt great and was eager to get home to my other children. My plan this time is to leave Sunday afternoon (around the 48hr mark) if I am feeling up to it and there are no problems with the baby (we have ABO incompatibility and so its like a wait and see thing)

I had a really wonderful experience with my planned csection. The doctors and staff worked hard at giving me a great experience. I don't think I could have asked for a better birth experience. I feel confident that I will have that again. Everyone was made pretty aware that my first experience was traumatic and an emergency, so it seems they put that extra effort in to making sure things went smoothly. I also mentally prepared for it. Like one thing I kept in my mind was that I would feel pressure and pushing, that I would get nauseated, etc. That is why my sister was there, she talked me through all that. I did not want a quiet atmosphere in the OR because it was like that the first time and it scared me. So at my last csection they actually talked about funny commercials on TV and stupid songs on the radio. I told my current OB she could yap about anything, her new house, her ex husband, or sing but I definitely wanted a lively OR and I even told her if things start F-ing up to fake it until its all over with. I feel confident in her skills and I have built a great relationship with her over the past year so I'm of the belief I will have another great experience.

Just 19 more days,
Kim


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

My planned section was for 1:00 (actually happened at 2:24). I was told not to eat anything after midnight the night before, and no fluids after...I think it was 8:00 am. After surgery, I got nothing to eat or drink until I got up to the maternity ward (after my hour in post-op). Then, dh got me some much-needed water. I was on liquid diet until I passed gas - about two days. I talked to my OB about that this time, and he told me that studies indicate that the "no food until you've passed gas" thing doesn't really seem to hold up. And, he agreed with me that a person recovering from surgery needs to build up their strength. So, he basically told me that if I wasn't passing gas, I should just lie. :LOL

Once they switched me off the liquid diet, I was on the usual hospital diet until I was discharged...that was three days later.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Like one thing I kept in my mind was that I would feel pressure and pushing, that I would get nauseated, etc.

It's amazing how different it is for everyone. I don't recall any nausea with either section - and I'm prone to stomach upset when I'm nervous or, as was the case with section #2, flat-out terrified.

Kim...does the "pressure and pushing" bother you? My imagination goes into overtime, and I can't help thinking about what the scalpel is doing - that's the only thing that makes me feel ill!!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
Kim...does the "pressure and pushing" bother you? My imagination goes into overtime, and I can't help thinking about what the scalpel is doing - that's the only thing that makes me feel ill!!

Nope, because the first time I felt cutting and pain, so pressure and pushing was good to me. I didn't feel pain. I knew what was happening. My OB at the last section said "we are trying to push him out" -- he was stuck.

I had a baby shower today. Really cool, all girly stuff!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

MCS







ishing you the best tomorrow

I have always felt a lot of pressure with both sections.. The first it felt like I could not breathe and that was scary.. The second was better and I didn't feel too much until they had to really work to get DD out.. she was very very stuck...
They add morphine to the drip and that always makes me puke.. although this time I did not puke until I was back in my room.

Both my c/s were not scheduled.. the first, I had nothing to eat because of an induction.. the second. I had eaten regularly but threw up most of it during labor... I had been drinking lots of water and the MW had me sip some gingerale towards the end.. to boost my sugar...

My first c/s I was on a liquid diet for two days... bleah.. With my second c/s, I had it at 11 pm and by 8 am i was eating a HUGE and normal breakfast!! It tasted SO good too...They do not offer a liquid diet at the birthing center..









If I decide to have a third c/s.. I will be having it at the same birth center. I really like their policies.. well... most of them anyway... much more than the bigger hospital that is also near here..

Chantal


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## Henry's_Mamma (Jan 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
I could have sworn I saw a NJ couple on a Baby Story having a homebirth. I could definitely be mistaken though. How close are you to the PA border and could you go to a birth center?

Homebirth is perfectly legal in NJ. HBACs are not. It is illegal for a licensed midwife (CNM or DE) to attend an HBAC. I'm much closer to NY than to PA, unfortunately, and the same rules apply in NY, too. I'm very bummed. I've found a mw that I like for the local hospital, and if she doesn't pan out, there is a group of mws about 45 minutes away (5 minutes from where my mom lives) who attend VBACs. The hospital they use actually has about a 10% _lower_ c/s rate than the local hospital, so that might be a better move. I just worry about laboring at my mom's. She might make me a little







. :LOL


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Nope, because the first time I felt cutting and pain, so pressure and pushing was good to me. I didn't feel pain. I knew what was happening. My OB at the last section said "we are trying to push him out" -- he was stuck.

I had a baby shower today. Really cool, all girly stuff!









Ah - I can see your point. I think my imagination is actually worse than the reality. My OB didn't push dd out...but he did have to work her head loose. I'm not sure where it was stuck - under my ribs maybe? - but I could see her upside down in the mirror...just her legs and her bum and a bit of her back. It was kind of strange.

I don't think I'll be having one. I didn't get one with dd, either. I don't really have anybody to throw one for me. I don't really need anything, anyway...but after waiting so long for these two babies, I'd like to feel as though somebody understands how important they are to me. It doesn't feel that way at all.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Tomorrow is the big day. We have an appointment with the OB that is going to perform the cesarean in a few hours. I'm editing together a cesarean only birth plan (I had one that included c/section but I'm editing it now).

I definitely have fears about what happens if the spinal doesn't take or cover enough - normally they just give you basically a shot in your back and send you in, right? They don't keep the catheter in usually, do I need to request that? If it isn't enough what do they do? Last time I already had an epi and I remember they kept asking me if I felt anything, we went through a few rounds of that before I felt comfortable saying I couldn't feel it.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mightymoo*
Tomorrow is the big day. We have an appointment with the OB that is going to perform the cesarean in a few hours. I'm editing together a cesarean only birth plan (I had one that included c/section but I'm editing it now).

I definitely have fears about what happens if the spinal doesn't take or cover enough - normally they just give you basically a shot in your back and send you in, right? They don't keep the catheter in usually, do I need to request that? If it isn't enough what do they do? Last time I already had an epi and I remember they kept asking me if I felt anything, we went through a few rounds of that before I felt comfortable saying I couldn't feel it.

If you have fears about the spinal request an epidural and have the cath left in. Some doctors do not like doing this, but since you had an epidural before, yours may go for it.
Most spinals are done in the OR. You can walk to the OR if you like and get on the OR table yourself and then insert it then.
I got a PCAP with my epidural the last time and liked it, I am getting that again.
Let us know how your appointment goes and if you have any questoins, ask now!

Kim


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I hope everything goes well mightymoo. I know you were hoping for a VBAC, but hopefully being prepared for this will help.

I had a spinal (just checked that with my OB at my last appointment, because I wasn't sure), and they gave it to me on the table in OR, after I walked there. My spinal definitely took, and I could feel nothing but some pressure and tugging below my breasts...no pain at all until afterwards. Was it you that had a spinal that didn't take once before? I can understand being worried about that.

Just try to focus on the fact that soon you'll be holding your precious new baby...I find that helps a bit.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

After talking to the doc I'm less nervous about the spinal. He said they check very carefully that you have no feeling and will check again before beginning the procedure. I'm sure it will be fine. Ugh, its so much more nerve wracking than last time - last time it was at the end of a long induction and I was tired and didn't have a ton of time to reflect on what was about to happen. I am definitely ready to have this baby though!

One nice thing that I didn't realize is that my midwife will be scrubbing in and performing the surgery with the OB. I always figured in the case of a c/s she would be there, but I didn't realize she actually is involved (though I didn't exactly ask what her role was specifically, both her and the OB referred to it as 'we will perform the surgery', etc). I thought that was neat.


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## alaska (Jun 12, 2004)

GOOD LUCK mightymoo - Hoping things go really well for you tomorrow and that you have a very positive experience.

Lisa/Storm Bride - I know I don't know you at all and vice versa - but can I just tell you that I know how important your babies are and I wish that if there was such a thing as a cybershower, I'd throw one for you? Bringing a long-awaited new babe in the world - be it the first or the fifth - what could be better than that?

chantal - thanks for posting that little comparison between your first and your second c/s experience. I find it really comforting to read about how much better the second ones can be. I wouldn't say I'm "looking forward to it," but I'm kind of looking forward to it.

Speaking of "IT" - I have a question for those in the know -
I'm currently scheduled to have the section on July 14 - that'll be 39 wks, 1 day. But there are a few things that are concerning me about waiting until then:
1) my new ob - the one I really like who is doing the surgery - is leaving on vacation on the 15th - so she won't be around to attend me in the hosptial. I don't like that. Talking to other patients of hers, they got a lot out of her visits post-op. If she's not there, I'll be seeing someone else in her practice - one of which is my old ob (the one who was involved in my whole "hostage" issue, if anyone recalls that), which I think would be very weird for me... or I'd be see a doctor I've never seen before - none of whom were recommended to me when I started shopping for a new doc.

2) With my first - I went into labor naturally 10 days early. What if that happens again? If I have to have this repeat c/s, then I want all the "perks" of having a planned procedure - I've already gotten the thumbs up to my birth plan. I'm worried that if I go into labor early, and the c/section is done on a more "emergency" basis, that I'll be sacrificing some of the things that I feel are going to make this repeat c/s not such a bad experience.

So my question is - do I ask to move the section up to 38 weeks? Is that okay for the baby (whom I found out last week by virtue of an u/s we needed to make sure she still wasn't showing signs of downs - she's not - is still a girl







). I'm VERY sure of my due date - I was charting and know for certain when I ovulated and conceived.

amy


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

MightyMoo -- I will be thinking about you tomorrow and looking forward to hearing your birthstory. I will send all the positive vibes I can muster into you having a safe, wonderful cesarean birth.

Alaska -- I personally would move it up. I know how important it is to have your own supportive OB and I too would think it is weird dealing with the OB who held you "hostage". My OB is not on call the weekend I have my baby, but another OB I feel comfortable with is (they are also assisting with the csection) Also, I have a feeling my OB is probably going to stop by and see me anyway that weekend.
I've had all my csectoins at 38 weeks, this one is being done 16 days early, earlier than my previous ones -- however I am not concrete on my dates. Had my baby been a boy, I would have waited this time, but with a girl I feel much more secure in going in that early. I know I am in the minority about this, but I don't see a problem with this.

IF you do go into labor, I think its very possible you can still have a good experience. Unless labor presents some problem, they can still arrange things for you like it was planned. Just be calm and collected about the whole thing. Talk to your doctor about this before hand. I talked to my OB about this and she assured me that even if I went into labor, that she would do everything possible to ensure I got the same treatment and my birthplan was followed.

Time seems to be flying by for several of us!

Kim


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## alaska (Jun 12, 2004)

Kim, it makes a difference if it's a girl?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alaska*
Kim, it makes a difference if it's a girl?

Yes, girls mature faster than boys. Their lungs mature faster, and even though they may weigh less than there male counterparts, they fair better during emergency situations, premature birth, and birthing complications.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

alaska: Thanks. I appreciate that. I don't really need anything, anyway...just would have liked a shower for Emma, as I'd been trying to have a baby for almost 10 years!

As for your question...I'm currently trying to decide whether I want to go into labour before a section (if I can't VBA2C). I want to, because I prefer to have my body ready for the baby's arrival...but I'm also stuck on the dilemma of possibly not having my OB for the surgery. I don't want someone I don't know doing it...

I don't really have any answers for you, but I think in your situation, I'd be inclined to move the date up. (My situation's the opposite...my OB gets back from vacation 5-10 days before my due date, depending if you use my dates, or the ultrasound. I'm really hoping not to go into labour early.)


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## alaska (Jun 12, 2004)

The doc agreed to move it up to one day before the beginning of the 39th week - not a big improvement but I'll take it. July 12.
thanks for the comments


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I saw my family doctor today - discussed some of what I'm discussing with my OB...eg. VBAC vs. scheduled section vs. going into labour, then having the section. She's really pushing a scheduled section. "We don't want to risk this baby, or this mommy". *sigh*


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Lisa,
I am sorry you are having such a hard time with your birthing decisions. Of course your dr. is right--we *don't*want to risk this baby or this mama--but there are risks to both sides of this situation. I don't know all of your situation, since I am pretty new to this thread, and I don't want to influence your choice toward VBAC or C-Section. I just wanted to say that YOU are the person best qualified to decide which set of risks are the right one for you and your baby. I have confidence that whatever you decide will be the correct choice for you







to you, mama. I will be thinking of you


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Thanks, muchly.

I've basically decided to try VBA2C, if this baby isn't breech (both my others were). If the baby is breech, I'll agree to a c-section...I'm not completely convinced it's necessary, but I haven't found a caregiver around here who's experienced at catching breech babies, so I'm more-or-less okay with that.

The dilemma I'm now having is scheduled c-section vs. waiting for labour, if I go ahead with the surgery. I've had one of each, and I found a lot more problems with my milk when my section was scheduled. I'd really prefer to wait for my body to decide it's time for the baby to arrive. _But,_ I also don't want someone other than my OB doing the surgery...I like him, and he's considered the best around here. I already know he does a very good, tidy job. And, if I wait for labour, I may not get my family physician, either. If I have to have a section, I'd really rather have the two of them present than not...

Well...still time to make up my mind. And, we'll see which way this baby is tipped on Friday. _Nobody_ can tell where the head is - not me, not my OB and not my doctor. It's weird.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I saw my family doctor today - discussed some of what I'm discussing with my OB...eg. VBAC vs. scheduled section vs. going into labour, then having the section. She's really pushing a scheduled section. "We don't want to risk this baby, or this mommy". *sigh*

Lisa I am sorry about the kind of feedback you are getting on this. I am not sure what kind of advice to give you on this. If your OB is comfortable giving you a TOL, then I suggest going with it.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Hi all,

I hope some lurkers will come out for some advice.









My csection is scheduled for Friday, June 24th and I was thinking that coming home on Sunday afternoon would be ideal, June 26th. Now I am not so sure. Last time I came home in under 48hrs without problem. I felt great and was eager to leave. The only problem with waiting until Monday is that I would only have my husband there to help me leave the hospital, instead of him and my sister. My sister has to go to work on Monday and my husband is not the greatest "care giver" in the world. I'm just wondering how much peace and rest I will get once I get home with the other three kids!

Kim


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Lisa I am sorry about the kind of feedback you are getting on this. I am not sure what kind of advice to give you on this. If your OB is comfortable giving you a TOL, then I suggest going with it.

Kim

I'll be doing a TOL if the baby isn't breech. I'm finding that out tomorrow.

The decision that's giving me so much trouble is what to do if my baby _is_ breech. I really can't choose between scheduling and going into labour.


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## leahdbc (Jan 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Hi all,

I hope some lurkers will come out for some advice.









I will.







Actually I looked everywhere the other day for a C-section folder and couldnt' find you guys. So glad I stumbled onto you this morning. I will be back soon with questions. My first was born via emergency c-section due to breech position after hours of unmedicated pushing.

We are struggling right now between VBAC or repeat section. But leaning heavily toward a C-section - mostly due to my husband's terminal health condition which renders him unable to help or even be present for a long or difficult labor. Opting for a section lets us take part in the birth together and will be much much easier on him. (especially given that my hospital's VBAC success rate is rather dismal) And for what its worth, I recovered very nicely and quickly from my first surgery - no pain meds at all after the actual procedure. (do you think I will be so lucky again?!)

More soon - just wanted to pop in and say hello and so glad to have found you ladies. I am excited about the possibility of making a C-section birth be a bueatiful one!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I'll be doing a TOL if the baby isn't breech. I'm finding that out tomorrow.

The decision that's giving me so much trouble is what to do if my baby _is_ breech. I really can't choose between scheduling and going into labour.

Well you know what I would do.









I think its going to really weigh on you about who you want to deliver your baby, how important that is to you.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Leah, Welcome!

I can definitely see your reasons for having a repeat cesarean. I know how important it is to have your spouse be able to participate, and you seem to have even more pressing reasons. Could you elaborate on your husbands condition?

Also, I think you can be so lucky again. I had a great csection last time and great recovery, so I know it can happen!

Take care,
Kim


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## mamameg (Feb 10, 2004)

I have not had a chance to read through the entire thread, but I wanted to quickly thank OnTheFence for posting your thoughts on your birth plan (page one of this thread). I am not pg again yet, but TTC and debating VBAC. I am suffering quite a bit of anxiety over the decision to VBAC or repeat c/s and reading your post made me feel more calm than I have ever felt around the issue. You made me see that a repeat c/s might very well be the way I can control the situation and that might be what I need. Thank you. It's refreshing to finally see that it is possible to be somewhat powerful in all of this.









Best wishes to everyone preparring for birth!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hello
Kim: Could you schedule the section for a day earlier and come home on a Saturday and then have help for 2 days?

Leah: so sorry about your DH's condition. I hope that you can find a birth solution that works for you both.









I am not pregnant yet.. not even thinking of TTCing.. but I have been thinking about the birth of this future child.. and have made some decisions.. I met with a lay MW the other day and had a very good conversation with her. She had some interesting things to say about the two births.. and then about DD's birth in general.. that her presentation was a nearly impossible one for anyone to get out and that there was nothing wrong with me.. it was just rotten luck. That alone.. made the meeting worth while. I felt like a huge dark cloud was lifted from me.. and I am feeling much more at peace..

I have decided that, barring something medical that would indicate otherwise, this next baby will be an hba2c.







. This decision has also brought me a lot of peace too..It just feels right for our family.

Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Well you know what I would do.









I think its going to really weigh on you about who you want to deliver your baby, how important that is to you.

Kim

That's where I'm going back & forth, back & forth...I really strongly want to go into labour first, but I also really strongly want a good OB to do the surgery. If I'm going to be cut open, I want it to be by someone I _know_ is good with a scalpel.

I wonder if I can request no nurses in the OR...I guess not...


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## leahdbc (Jan 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Leah, Welcome!

I can definitely see your reasons for having a repeat cesarean. I know how important it is to have your spouse be able to participate, and you seem to have even more pressing reasons. Could you elaborate on your husbands condition?

Sure Kim. He has a degenerative neurological condition which affects multiple areas of his brain and nervous system (the disease is called Multiple System Atrophy or MSA). He is confined to a wheelchair much of the time and stress, exhaustion and too much stimuli makes him much more prone to seizure like episodes leaving him unable to move or speak. Fortunately, I am able to work from home so that I can see to his care and be with him each day. One of the medications he takes sedates him at night in an attempt to calm the seizures - awaking at any point to drive and/or join me at the hospital is simply not possible. And he is very sensitive to who gives him care. We do have family nearby to help but he does much better when with me.

He wants very much to play an active role in our little girl's birth and I would love to do whatever I can to make it easier on him. We both worked so hard to have a natural birth with our son (Zac's illness had only just begun at that point and while he was in a wheelchair, he was able to be present and active) but it took its toll such that his health suffered for quite some time afterward. I don't know if I want to put him through that again.

He is utterly supportive of any choice I make but we are making this one together and I think it will turn out well.

Oh and thank you for the great ideas on the birth plan. I did not realize that I would still be allowed to ask for so many things. I can't wait to sit down and sort through all the great info I have gathered from this thread. Thanks ladies!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamameg*
I have not had a chance to read through the entire thread, but I wanted to quickly thank OnTheFence for posting your thoughts on your birth plan (page one of this thread). I am not pg again yet, but TTC and debating VBAC. I am suffering quite a bit of anxiety over the decision to VBAC or repeat c/s and reading your post made me feel more calm than I have ever felt around the issue. You made me see that a repeat c/s might very well be the way I can control the situation and that might be what I need. Thank you. It's refreshing to finally see that it is possible to be somewhat powerful in all of this.









Best wishes to everyone preparring for birth!

Thank you so much for your kind words, I really appreciate them!

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Chantal,

I had wanted to schedule my c-section for Wed or Thurs but she was booked with other surgeries.







She said she could fit me in, but thats not exactly what I wanted, I wanted my own surgery time.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Leah,

Thanks for sharing about your DH with all of us. I think its good for other people who lurk here to know that there are so many parts of our lives that play into our birthing decisions.

I think if you choose the route of planning a cesarean section, that you could find a very compassionate doctor to accomodate any if not most of your requests to make the experience wonderful for you and your husband. I would think though that it would need to be a planned event for those things to take place but well worth it. There are certain things absent from my birthplan that others here have done, like have a mirror or lowered drapes so the birth can be viewed -- this is something that could be requested and set up for the two of you. I would highly recommend having an additional support person in the OR for you and to assist in recovery for you and your husband plus baby so that all of you could have optimal time together but everyones needs get met. You might could even find a doula to do this for little or nothing considering your husband situation. I know some doulas who strictly volunteer for families with a need.

Kim


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## leahdbc (Jan 4, 2004)

Thanks Kim. If we go this route, we will schedule with the same doctor who delivered our son. She knows us both quite well and is more than compasionate in terms of our wishes and Zac's limitations. She also let me go home very early last time (I was begging! I wanted our family to be together and Zac couldn't stay at the hospital) and she has assured me I will have the same liberties again.

We are speaking with our old Bradley instructor about being a doula for us but I believe my hospital isn't very lenient with the number of people allowed in the OR with me. Last time I wanted my mom in too so when Zac left with the baby I would have someone nearby and they wouldn't let her in. I was too drugged and distraught to protest. But I will ask again and the mirror is a wonderful idea!

Fortunately we have ample time to plan and I am truly excited about the possibilities.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Jackson is here!







Born on Tuesday - 11 pounds, 22 inches and a 14.5 inch diameter head.

Thought I'd just post an update. We had our repeat c-section on Tuesday. Overall I was very happy with the birth experience. Obviously it wasn't what I wanted originally but I think we had a great team who made it a nice birth.

I did not have the problems I had last time with feeling out of it. I still don't know what they did last time, but I wasn't given anything other than the spinal and some oral stuff to remove the acidity of my stomach. So I really felt I was aware of what was going on. My midwife assisted in the birth, which was fabulous and they were all really great about describing everything to me (I didn't really want to look) while my doula took tons of pictures. Apparently I have a very 'interesting' uterus. I didn't realize it but I have a big walnut or so sized fibroid as well as some other small ones - but I know I thought the big one was a foot or something! I also have an unusual number of large veins or something, which makes me wonder if that isn't the reason I grow such big babies.

My midwife even showed me the placenta (pretty usual for a c-section!) which did have a fair bit of calcification she pointed out starting in, so between that and the size of him, I'm glad we didn't wait any longer to try for a VBAC, I think we made the right choice.

Unfortunately despite the fact that I didn't hemorrage or lose an usual amount of blood, my red blood cell count was extremely low after surgery and I passed out for a few minutes. I ended up getting a couple of units of blood before coming home yesterday. So I'm still recovering, but overall, it seems to be going well.

Thanks everyone for your help and advice!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Welcome, Jackson!! And, thanks very much for the update, mightymoo! Congratulations!!! Enjoy your new little boy...11 pounds - wow!!!
Another week and he'd have shared my birthday - but he'd probably have been 12 pounds!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Welcome Welcome Jackson! What a healthy size boy!! I am glad you are feeling better and hope you enjoy your babymoon!!







s

Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well...I'm off to my son's talent show at school, then I'm going for the ultrasound. I get to find out which way this baby is turned. Let's hope it's standing on its head!!


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

Hello everyone!

I posted this in the old thread but I guess I should have posted it here (been sorta busy lately ...):

Hi everyone,

I just had my second my second baby via c-birth last Saturday. We're doing well, and I don't regret opting for a c-birth at the hospital over an HBAC here in the mountains. I guess I'll write my birth story up later ....

After leaving the hospital after only two days, I do have some new advice for those planning a c-biorth, though. DON'T do it! Especially if you have another small one at home.

Go here to see a picture of our new family member (!!): http://tealeaf5.diaryland.com/beyondreaso.html


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Welcome New Babies!







Looks like the next month will be busy for some of us.

Lets read those birthstories and get some sage wisdon from you gals!

Kim


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well...just had the ultrasound.

Baby is head down, but facing my left side, not my back. The technician figures that both his/her weight and head circumference are in the 90% percentile. Now...I know a lot of people have had the u/s techs be way off on this kind of thing, but they weren't _that_ far off on my last baby, and they underestimated, not over.

I'm still thinking TOL, but I'm definitely going to think it through a _lot_ more before I talk to the OB on Monday.

There's _nothing_ about a planned, schedule c-section that suits my preferences....nothing at all.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Lisa,

Are you thinking a VBAC is not possible now? You could do some of the spinning baby exercises, possibly have Websters technique done to better position baby for labor.

As a side note: my doctor was fairly accurate last time, as was my first OB on the size of my babies.

Kim


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Lisa








Head down is good







Sorry the baby seems to be transverse. My first was like that.
My first OB with baby 1 was 2 lbs off with weight.. he said the baby would be 7lbs tops.. He was 9
My second OB said that the baby would be around 8.. she was 9lb 2 oz

I just make em big I guess...







:

This is such a hard decision to make... I hope you can find the one that gives you peace.

I don't know if this will help or not.. but it was an interesting link

ERCs and Neonate Outcomes
Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Lisa,

Are you thinking a VBAC is not possible now? You could do some of the spinning baby exercises, possibly have Websters technique done to better position baby for labor.

As a side note: my doctor was fairly accurate last time, as was my first OB on the size of my babies.

Kim

It may end up not being possible, but I'm going to try. I do have to talk to my OB _and_ family physician about their schedules. But, I'm far more willing to chance their absence for a TOL than I am just to labour before a section.

I'm still hoping for one more baby after this, and I know my chances of getting a caregiver to cooperate with a VBA3C attempt are pitiful. So, this is the one I'm going to try for. I definitely feel more involved in this decision than in either of my previous births, which helps. (The first was a panic situation, and the second one left me feeling railroaded.)

I'm going back to spinningbabies.com. I had looked up some breech exercises (eg. breech tilt), but had quit doing them because I didn't know which way baby was turned, and couldn't figure it out. As always, it seems totally obvious now...what we thought _might_ be baby's head was his/her bum and spine. I just need to find the exercises to urge this baby to turn around a little bit.

I may yet have a few crises, but I think I'm now at a point where I can cope with whatever outcome I get. I'll try to avoid another section (especially if my toddler continues the way she's been the last few days!!), but I'm not in the "end of the world" mindset about it anymore. You ladies have been terrific!

I am glad this week is over...I failed a road test yesterday, which didn't exactly make my week.


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

I am wondering if it's a trend for hospitals to be less blase about how many people come into the OR. There was some back and forth between my OB and the anesthesiologist about it last week. The doctor said it was up to the anesthesiologist, who said that that's simply not true: Now "the hospital" has instituted a "blanket policy" of only one person, he said. Later, my OB and my midwife and a nurse were saying along the lines of 'well, they all just want one support person there but none of them want to be the bad guy.' It all seemed a great way for them (all the medical staff) to keep me from having two support people with me while not taking responsibility for the decision (because no one would admit that it was a decision). In my case, I wanted my partner and my midwife. While he stayed with me up near my head and later stood with our baby and held him after brith, I thought she could be narrating the surgery and taking pictures. They wouldn't let her in, though. So we have a lot fewer pictures of this baby than we got of our first baby (born at a different hospital) two years ago.

My MW was allowed to come in to the OR after my partner left with our baby to go to the nursery. So I did have someone with me while they stitched me up. I didn't really want to be alone for that. It was a good thing, too, as my spinal went "too high" and for a time during the procedure I felt like I didn't have the strength to lift my lungs. The anesthesiologist came close to putting me under GA. Thank god it finally got better.

What's interesting to me now, after one "crash" c-section and one repeat , elective c-birth is that, even when you plan, there is so much you can't plan in. It all worked out well for us last week. But there were moments - like the above near-GA experience - that showed me how out of our hands it all is. For instance, I thought and considered long and hard what medications I would be given so as to be completely alert when I met my baby (as opposed to the first time, when I was totally woozy and out of it and did not remembe the first six hours - of course, this was also after two days of labor and about 2 1/2 days of no food). I told the anes. and my doctor: Please no mood alterers, etc. But then, after the surgery, my blood pressure crashed for no apparent reason and I had several periods of throwing up, etc. They even called my OB back to the hospital. So I was pretty out of it for several hours afterwards. It wasn't exactly quality time with my new baby.

But it was all OK in the end.

Sorry I'm so wordy today. I actually came back into this thread to say that I checked out of the hospital just two days after my baby was born. I think this was too soon. If I could do it over, I would have stayed at least one more night. After I got home - in itself VERY tiring, the whole checkout procedures, gathering our stuff, the drive, etc. - I was exhausted. And though we had a lot of help lined up here, there was my excitable toddler to deal with. He was thrilled with the new baby but I felt too tired and sore and emotionally worn out to really spend time with him. And when it came time to sleep, I realized with a sinking heart, there was no way in hell of approximating the comfort of my hospital bed. I couldn't sleep lying down, I couldn't sleep on my side (too much pressure on my incision) - finally we managed to juryriig a propped-up bed with a million pillows from all over the house. It wasn't the same, though. And because my partner was helping take care of our 2-year-old, I had no one at hand to help me in and out of the bed. Suddenly I was in charge of all diaper changes and other care of our new baby, too (which the nurses and my DP had done in the hospital).

Everything is fantastic now (it's been one week already! and my new boy's cord stump has already fallen off! it's going too fast!), but I just wanted to sound a word of caution because the first two days home from the hospital were harder than I though they had to be.


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## mcs (Apr 20, 2005)

I have been a little "lost" since the birth, but just now, my dh has left to pick up my mom from the airport and I feel ready- I think- to tell at least, the short of the story.

Because of her position (kind-a transverse/footling with the cord wrapped two- in the end, three times around,) we decided to have a cesarian. It was not an easy choice and at the same time, it was no choice at all- she could not, otherwise, have been born. I was lucky to at least have time to prepare myself for a birth that was not my original ideal.

The birth was scheduled for nine am on monday, june 6 and it started well- even like magic. I was at the hospital by seven for the sugery to start at nine. I did not sleep at all the night before and was very uncomfortable on the ride to the hospital. I was having a lot of what turned out to be---real contractions! I even lost my mucus plug on the table of the waiting room. I had been so focused on preparing for the sugery and baby, that I had not even noticed that what I thought had been bx contractions b/c of nervousnes and not drinking from the night before had grown so strong and close together. This still makes me really happy- to know that she was born on her birthday.

So, from seven until one in in the afternoon, I sat with my contractions growing in discomfort and getting closer together while one emergency c-cection after another went into the operating room ahead of me.
At one o'clock, I was taken to the recovery/prep room with still no real clue for a start time till suddenly, my doctor popped in and said that he was assembling the crew- that we would start in just a few min. The doctor and the rest in the room were all really great- they took a lot of time to assure my comfort and to talk in nice tones. It was a strange sensation to have no sensation- like nothing to compare. I could feel some pulling in my abdomen, and hear the tools and beeps all around, but I was totally disconnected. Hilger and I talked about chicken soup and other funny things just to keep the mood light and in between, my midwife would tell me what was happening. They did not lower the screen for the birth like I had asked them to do, but I could hear her cry and almost immediatly bagan a shake all over my body and tears that were a million miles from the chicken soup and medical smell. She was born at 2-12 and weighed 6lbs 6oz- 19 inches long. Soon, Hilger was able to hold her and then to bring her to my face where I could, for a few min., akwardly touch her. It was a thrill and then it was gone as Hilger went with her to the nusery.

I have never been so alone in my life. Nearly two hours later, Hilger was finally able to bring her to me and she nursed like a natural. The staff was cruel beyon belief and would not let me keep her with me for long- it was another five hours before I was taken to a room and could see her again. And that--begins a whole other story of complaints. The nursing care at this hospital was a nightmare- the extent of which I am still realizing. Like I said though- that is for another two pages.

Home-home-home is wonderful. I am lost between disbelief and a comfort that I have never experienced before. Both are bliss. Let me go back to them now. mcs


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

MCS I am so sorry you were treated so poorly by the staff and that they held your baby hostage and you were not allowed to visit with you. You should definitely write a letter about this.
More and more hospitals are working with cesarean section moms, and allowing them to have their babies with them immediately after birth and for rooming in.

I am glad you are home! Hoping you have a speedy recovery.

Kim


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

MCS














I am so sorry you had such a poor experience with your post op care!! We are here for you when you are ready to vent. Rest, heal and ejoy your baby










Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mcs*
I have never been so alone in my life. Nearly two hours later, Hilger was finally able to bring her to me and she nursed like a natural. The staff was cruel beyon belief and would not let me keep her with me for long- it was another five hours before I was taken to a room and could see her again. And that--begins a whole other story of complaints. The nursing care at this hospital was a nightmare- the extent of which I am still realizing.

I'm so sorry you had such a bad experience at the hospital. I haven't been very happy with the post-op care I've received in the past, either.

But, I'm so glad you're home and happy with your beautiful new baby girl!! This is really such an incredible time.


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

MCS, I'm so sorry your experience was bad with pp staff. I can't understand why anyone would ever think it a good idea to keep mom and baby separated ... in the absence of dire medical need, of course.

We had a little run-in with a nurse who took advantage of a low period for me (I had just told her I was feeling bad and a bit ill) to bully us about our decision to wait till day 7 for the entire PKU. We had told her we'd waive it in the hospital because it was all set up with both my HB midwife and our pediatrician to wait till our boy had some breastmilk in his system. This was what we did with our first baby. Our ped was also totally behind this decision. There was some unpleasantness and afterwards it seemed (amazingly) pretty clear that she was witholding my pain meds a little later each time. (She knew how sore I was feeling, especially since I was up and trying to walk around as much as possible.) I'm pretty certain her intentions were good (and like to think the witholding of medication was unconscious), though. I can't imagine what those of the staff treating you were.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

One thing I don't like about having a cesarean is the crapshoot in the aftercare you may get. My first one I had a really shitty experience, bad nurses, and one was so mean to me and she screwed my meds up. With my second baby, I was very lucky that the first night my sister was with me and I had the epidural with the PCAP. The nurses rarely came in because heck, I had my own private nurse. I had not expected my sister to do this again, but she has offered to stay with my again the first night and first morning after my csection when they pull everything out. I was lucky last time in that my daytime nurse and the nursing assistant were on the ball. They brought me my meds on time, and were constantly checking on me. However the last night I had a nurse who I think was overworked -- she seemed aggravated when I buzzed her several times for my pain meds. Then she brought me the wrong thing, and then had to take it back. I did sleep some that night and had them take my baby to the nursery for a few hours (I loved the baby nurse we had both nights) I had the same nurses during the day that I had previously the last morning I was there.

For those who are planning or may anticipate another csection I am going to suggest talking to your doctor about your aftercare and ask that if they are not on call, to discuss it with the doctor that is. My last appointment is Wednessday and I plan to discuss the food and pain medication with my OB. If I want too, I would like to be able to eat that night regular food, and while I am in the hospital, I don't want to be prescribed Tylenol 3. I think its pretty useless and I prefer demerol orally, however I would like the option of taking Extra Strength Tylenol if I want too. The last time they had to call my doctor to see if I could take it because they were ordered to give me T3. I actually told the nuse "I have some in my bag, either I just take it or you can give it too me."

Also, if you don't like a nurse or aide, you can ask to speak to the nursing manager on duty and have them changed. Should it be a personality conflict or a problem with care, say so. We did this for my Grandfather when he was in the hospital -- sometimes to save the nurses from his prejudices and foul mouth. Another thing, request a nursing student -- they often will cater to you and they are only assigned one patient. A nursing student was my saving grace with my first csection and she advocated for me several times.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

hmmm..I wonder if it's a difference between the US and Canada. I don't think talking to my doctor about the nursing care, food, etc. would do any good at all. I talked to him about the liquid diet, and he told me that recent studies suggest that the whole "wait until the patient is passing gas" thing has been found to be pretty much irrelevant. I told him I really disliked trying to bounce back from surgery on a diet of milk, jello, and thin porridge...so he told me to lie. :LOL

This doesn't sound like he really has a whole lot to say about the diet provided to me in the hospital. And, I don't think he has any involvement with who the nursing staff are or how they behave.

If it weren't that I simply can't cope at home that quickly (especially this time with a toddler), I'd walk out the day after surgery. The care I've had after surgery has been awful. The nursing staff mostly treat me like I'm a lazy layabout, and that doesn't make things any easier to cope with. DH was with me all night every night last time, but he can't do that this time, because he has to stay with dd. Besides, he's just started a new job, and can't reasonably take a whole bunch of time off. I may just completely ignore my nurses and not even talk to them...maybe they'll go away...


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

: It really is a shame.. that one's care after a c/s can so impact how you feel about the whole situation and how little control you can exert over it..

With my first, I had adequate care afterwards... It was a large hospital.. one of the "best" in our area.. and they are always busy.. we call it the baby factory now. The nurses were very overworked and we got no support during labor.. we should have hired a doula... and afterwards it was the same.. They would come in when they could, but that was it. I had to recover in triage.. couldn't see my baby for hours and then getting nursing going was horrible.. My baby ended up becoming dehydrated, developing a fever (likely due to the 3 doses of epidural I had received during labor) and ended up in the NICU.. Begin a whole host of problems from that.. some of which we are still dealing with today







:

With my second section, I switched practices to deliver at a small birthing center.. while not freestanding.. it was more birth center like than the hospital.. and we got much better pre and post care there. I don't know if it was because of the hospital.. or I just go lucky.. I have heard of some nurses who are not nice, but most people who go there really speak well of their experience. My post care was much different.. and that really impacted my feelings about my section.. which was not planned.

It really is such a shame that you can plan for your section and think that things will go as you wish.. and have some nurses or "policy" take advantage of you when you cannot advocate for yourself...










Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
It really is such a shame that you can plan for your section and think that things will go as you wish.. and have some nurses or "policy" take advantage of you when you cannot advocate for yourself...

Yeah - I'm definitely worried about the post-surgery care aspect of things. I'm not so worried about pressure during the VBA2C attempt, though. DH will be there, and I don't think he's going to let anybody push me into anything I don't want...no matter how fogged from labour I am.


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

mcs--Congrats on the birth of your baby





















: I am sure she is all that you dreamed she would be







And I am glad that nursing is going well for you.

Sorry to hear about the way you were treated after her birth








We are hear to listen when you feel ready to talk about it


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## Henry's_Mamma (Jan 23, 2004)

mcs & Mightymoo ... Congrats on the birth of your babies!

For whomever had the awful nurses experience ... I am so sorry. I faced similar issues with my c/s. I never held ds on his birthday. I got a brief glimpse in the OR, and then I didn't see him again for 4+ hours. And that was only after dh marched to the nursery and brought him to me. I was begging for my baby and no one would listen.









I had one night nursery nurse (no rooming in) who I adored. She was wonderful to me and to my ds. The nurses who took care of me were ok, except for this one nurse who was pure evil. And of course, she was the one to wake me at 4am, 30 hours after ds's birth, to tell me they put him under the bili lights for his jaundice. This is after she scolded me for cuddling him in my arms and sleeping together a few hours prior.







She was mean mean mean. If she could see us now.


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *leahdbc*
I would highly recommend having an additional support person in the OR for you and to assist in recovery for you and your husband plus baby so that all of you could have optimal time together but everyones needs get met.

If you can swing it with your hospital, this is a great idea. I originally had my doula booked because we were attempting a hospital VBAC, but in the end had a planned c/s (as I've mentioned before), but my doula came and was my second support person in the OR besides my husband. She was great about helping keeps us calm and relaxed beforehand, during the surgery she took tons of pictures, kept me informed of what was going on and company when DH was over keeping the baby company at the warmer. It was really really great and I am thinking that if I have another c/s I will hire a doula to be there, something I never would have considered before.

Additionally, when we got back to our room, she was there to help us get started breastfeeding - since we had our own support we didn't need to worry about whether the nurses were busy or supportive. About an hour after the surgery I had an episode where I passed out for about 2 minutes - My husband was holding the baby afterwards since I needed to lay down, it was nice to have my doula there to keep me company and hold my hand, etc. So I was really glad we had additional support even though traditionally you might not think it useful or necessary for a c/s.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *storm_bride*
I'm still thinking TOL, but I'm definitely going to think it through a lot more before I talk to the OB on Monday.

Just thought I'd mention that I thought TOL is supposed to have a lot of benefits preparing baby to be born even if the end result is still a c/s.

Quote:

For whomever had the awful nurses experience ...
After reading these experiences, I'm really glad we had such great care. Some were better than others, but I never had a nurse that was bad. The last nurse before we checked out did try to bully me a bit on the PKU, but I just told her frankly the test given in the hospital is inaccurate because they don't have enough food in their systems and she's trying to tell me that the later its caught the more brain damage will be done - oh really? So then why aren't they running the test in the hospital lab for immediate results? Can't be so urgent if its smeared on a card and sent into the state for processing... Too bad I didn't think about that until after we left! And there was the fact that she didn't have anyone walk us out to the car, so my DH had to carry the baby and I had to push the car with my stuff - 48 hours after having surgery!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mightymoo*
Just thought I'd mention that I thought TOL is supposed to have a lot of benefits preparing baby to be born even if the end result is still a c/s.that

I'm tentatively planning to go into labour even if I already _know_ I'm going to have a c-section. My hesitation about this has to do with my caregiver's schedules. I'm due July 9th (or 14th, depending which measure is used). My OB is away from the 20th of June until July 4th, and then my family physician is away from the July 3rd. If I don't go into labour before the 4th, my OB and I can schedule a section and my family doctor will attend. If I go into labour spontaneously after that, my OB _might_ be there, and my family doctor almost certainly won't be. If I have to have a section, I _really_ want my OB to do it...I actually trust him near me with a scalpel...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I have an odd question for you ladies:

I can't physically cry after a c-section, because it causes so much abdominal pain. Do the rest of you find that, and do you think it might have been easier to cope with the emotional aftermath if you could have cried some of it out right away?

I was just reflecting on my two previous surgeries, and it somehow seemed like the most unfair thing about it was that I wanted so badly to cry and I couldn't let myself, because if I started I couldn't stop and it hurt so much.


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## daekini (Jun 17, 2004)

Thank you everyone for sharing your stories... I've tried to read through the thread (i just found it) but I may have missed some things...

I've been getting some support on the VBAC area of this site but I'm desperate for some kind words about the possibility of a repeat C... So reading your posts has really helped.

briefly: I had a wonderful C-section w/my DD... yes you heard me right. My doc let me try and nurse on the table while she was sewing me up (I got too nauseated though) and she wrapped things up quickly so that I could finally nurse successfully at 30mins after delivery. It was scheduled due to breech and a noncancerous lymphatic tumor that might have burst during pushing.

Unfortunately that wonderful OB has moved away.
Her replacement is very controlling and I'm having trouble planning a VBAC. But I have what I'm calling my "39 week hump" ~ I'd like to try a VBAC prior to that time. I'm having so much trouble making my dh and doula and friends understand my thinking. Maybe you can help. Or at least understand.

The doc will schedule a C-Section for me at 39 weeks. The date or gestational time is not the issue for me - I know that many people VBAC beyond that time. The deal is this: if anything were to happen to the baby during a VBAC, and I had chosen to wait even past that date that the doc would do a C-section, I would not be able to live with myself. I'd always be saying "I could have had a c-section and a potentially healthy baby at 39 weeks and I decided to wait!"

Does that make sense? I don't think I could live with that decision. Anything up to 39 weeks, if I go into labor spontaneously, is okay with me. But I just can't get over this "39-week hump". If my doc had said she'd schedule for 40 weeks, it would be a "40-week hump" - I guess this is why people don't understand my fears.

Anyway, dh and doula and everyone are almost too supportive of VBAC. I love their support, but I'm feeling so much pressure to choose to wait. I realized today that I really don't want to do that. I'm so afraid to tell them. I don't want to disappoint them, but I realized today that I would be doing it only for them, and if anything happened I would be blaming my dh for pushing me into that decision. We have a wonderful relationship so I don't want to risk doing that. How do I tell these people that I need their support with both of my decisions? How can I even say that - it sounds so weird! I want a VBAC up to the date that my OB sets for C-section.

I guess it's harder for me because I did have the good fortune of having a wonderful C-section. I'm sitting on this fence, and I'm pretty comfortable with it except for the people pushing me (some almost militantly) in one direction. I know the risks of each... am I missing something? Should I be going for one or the other, period??? It's just not my style.

I'm so sorry to butt in for the first time with all this rambling. I hope to get to know you all better.

love,
alison


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *daekini*
Does that make sense? I don't think I could live with that decision. Anything up to 39 weeks, if I go into labor spontaneously, is okay with me. But I just can't get over this "39-week hump". If my doc had said she'd schedule for 40 weeks, it would be a "40-week hump" - I guess this is why people don't understand my fears.

I understand completely. For me that date was 42 weeks. But I knew those last 3 weeks I could have a c/s at any time and it was very hard to get through. What did help was that while I kept thinking I couldn't wait any longer, the idea of scheduling something for TOMORROW always seemed much too soon. At 41 weeks we scheduled for 42 weeks and since I didn't go into labor before then, we had a repeat c/s at 42 weeks. I felt like knowing what I know about the dangers of c/s vs VBAC, I knew intellectually VBAC was safer and better for my future childbirth potential, I had to give it a good try. (BTW, since I went to 42.5 weeks with DD, I knew scheduling any sooner was not giving a VBAC a chance, for others, sooner might be more reasonable since they don't have a history of long gestation).

But I had a very hard time with that decision and I had chosen very very VBAC supportive providers (CNM and doula) and I knew that it was *my* decision, and no one elses - when we scheduled my midwife basically said 'we'll do what you want' in terms of waiting or doing it, etc. A few days before the c/s I had my husband (I was far too upset) call my midwife and basically ask her point blank if she thought it was a good idea. Knowing she was so supportive of VBACs and doesn't give in to 'big baby fears' it made all the difference in the world to have her tell us that at that point knowing we had a BIG baby (DS turned out to be 11lbs) our chances of a VBAC at this point were really slim and she thought the c/s was probably the best choice. It took a great weight off my shoulders and allowed me to start preparing mentally for the birth we were going to have.

I can totally be on board with the feeling that I would never forgive myself if something went wrong. But I know things can go wrong with a c/s too. It's very hard to realize that you can't know which direction will come out okay and which might potentially have a problem, but no matter what you do that other choice will always be there with a big 'what if' in your mind. The best you can do is weigh the choices available, taking into account how YOU feel and what you want (not anyone else) and go with what you feel is the best choice. For all this talk, I know that no matter what if the outcome had been bad I never would be able to get over having made the wrong decision. No one can know all ends much to my chagrin.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi Allison
Welcome to the group









Everyone has to make a decision about what to do that makes sense to them and feels right to them. The decision that you make might be very different from the one I would make.. we are two different people.. with different thoughts, goals, fears and concerns. I hope that you are able to make a decision that you feel comfortable with









I dont' go into labor at 39 weeks.. I always go post dates.. 40 1/2 weeks.. almost 41. I was never concerned about the baby. I made sure I kept my appoinments, did my kick counts, paid attention to the baby's movement and how I felt.. I was "tuned in" and I knew that all was well. For me, and this is just what was right for me, I knew that a trial of labor was important.. needed..Studies support that labor improves outcomes, even when a c section is the result. Even if I were to schedule a c section for the next baby.. I would want labor to begin on its own. That is what I feel is right for me and my baby...

But studies aside, you need to make a choice that is right for you...You are right.. bad things happen.. they happen more than we would like to admit... mothers and babies don't make it sometimes.. I think that this is a hard thing to accept.. with all our medical knowledge.. that everyone can't be saved...

Many hugs as you make this decision..

Chantal


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## mandalamama (Sep 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*







: It really is a shame.. that one's care after a c/s can so impact how you feel about the whole situation and how little control you can exert over it.

absolutely! it's like when they say that a labor nurse can make or break a labor ... the recovery care has SO much impact on the whole birth experience.

i think i might have something like PTSD, i'm realizing now at 8 months PP. i'm having recurring nightmares about some things, i'm having a lot of adhesion pain and i find myself getting angry very quickly when that pain occurs, and i keep trying to make normal medical appointments for myself and i just can't do it! i'm terrified of ever seeing a doctor







i've been calling around to find a therapist who is taking new patients *and* takes Medicare, those are hard to find!

it's odd how the feelings about my birth keep changing with time. after 30 hours of labor, where i was so blissed out and happy in Laborland, the transition to "omg now this is serious" seems scarier to me as time passes ... the whole labor, we had the room dark except for one small light, and it was so warm and peaceful and quiet, then suddenly everybody was rushing away from me and into scrubs, suddenly i was rolled into bright lights, cold air and loud metallic and electronic sounds *shudder* i had to have a spinal rather than an epidural because i have a problem with injected anesthetics - they spread out like a "donut" and don't take where they're supposed to. we just couldn't risk that with a cesarean! i don't know if the anesthesiologist made a mistake, or if i was just too sensitive to the drugs used, but i went numb all the way up to my neck, only my left shoulder had feeling.

i feel so upset when i read about other c-births, or see them on tv ... the mamas are able to be coherent and even touch their babies. the spinal made me feel really fuzzy-headed, and the total numbness made me feel like i wasn't breathing, so i was a mess. i couldn't touch Willow because the spinal also paralyzed me (it took 6 hours to wear off!). i do remember her looking at me with wide open eyes, and me saying "hi baby!" and kissing her head. i remember how good she smelled, all salty and warm and earthy







then the shakes started and also i started throwing up, all they could do was keep suctioning my mouth and throat. i was either passing out a lot, or my memory is blocking it out, because i don't remember much except my doula rubbing my shoulder and telling me to breathe "in ... out" over and over. when i hear about women being able to chat with the nurses and stuff like that, i realize how "not normal" my cesarean was! ugh.









my husband had been awake and in action for about 48 hours, so he passed out in our room. i couldn't move for 5 more hours, so my doula stayed and kept latching Willow on for me. it's all a blur, i think the pain meds they put in the IV messed with my head. then i was alone, the room was dark, Willow was in the nursery with my permission, i told them to bring her back when she woke up. so i had 2 hours of trying to move and slowly gaining feeling and movement. except for my legs, i wasn't able to move them for about 7 hours total. i didn't know this wasn't normal!! the nurses acted like it was normal.

i felt like i needed to pee and it felt wrong, i tried to wake my husband but he was totally passed out. finally someone answered the call bell, and they said the line was kinked and that they'd fixed it. i felt the same way an hour later, the nurses had changed shifts by then, the new nurse was horrified ... the line was totally backed up and my bladder was distended, the other nurse had laid the line beneath my leg instead of over it. i am still having problems with needing to pee too much, and painful bladder. i take cranberry tablets every day still.

after i got feeling back, we roomed in and it was great







my main problem was getting my meds on time ... they'd bring them 2, sometimes 3 hours late. i was on percocet for pain ... not the surgery, but the arthritis and fibromyalgia! 30 hours on my feet labor-dancing, OUCH!







i was also on a med for sleep, that was safe to nurse with, they'd bring it around 1 am but it didn't work for some reason. i'd feel a little sleepy and start to drift off around 6am but then the "parade of random medical people" would start. BLEAH! the second night, my husband made a big "DO NOT DISTURB BEFORE 8 A.M." sign for my door, which everybody ignored.

the food was great. when i left early (a little less than 3 days) i regretted leaving the food! :LOL i didn't eat anything but a little fruit juice or some pudding at home for 4 weeks after, i didn't have any help to make food for myself. i was whacked out without my regular meds for 3 weeks, but that's another story. i know that if i had been able to function without the meds and continue breastfeeding, i wouldn't be so depressed or anxious right now. i keep going off the meds and re-lactating once a month, it doesn't work but it feels good to try.

whew, too long of a post! i'm sorry. i just feel weirded out about my post-op experience. it's been 8 months and only know am i realizing the enormity of some of the things that went wrong. and feeling the long-term effects! especially the adhesion pain.


----------



## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I have an odd question for you ladies:

I can't physically cry after a c-section, because it causes so much abdominal pain. Do the rest of you find that, and do you think it might have been easier to cope with the emotional aftermath if you could have cried some of it out right away?

I was just reflecting on my two previous surgeries, and it somehow seemed like the most unfair thing about it was that I wanted so badly to cry and I couldn't let myself, because if I started I couldn't stop and it hurt so much.

I cried during my last csection when they pulled Jack out. Remember though I had the epidural and didn't have any pain.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Alison,

I do understand what you are saying. I would have enourmous guilt and felt like I had made the wrong decision if something happened to an already healthy baby. This is ME though. I am not one that believes the notion "well the baby may have died anyway during the csection". The thing is while a vaginal delivery is safer, when things go wrong with them, they often go really wrong. (say rupture for instance) I have a uterine anomaly, and for the first time I have a vertex baby. Technically I could labor or have a VBAC in that sense (vertex baby, even facing the right way) However my rupture rate ranges from 3% to 20% depending on what you read about uterine anomalies with an already cut uterus. My OB doesn't know what the risks are *for me*, and at this point we aren't sure what my uterus may do next. At least with a csection *I* know my risks, and while something can go wrong things are less likely to be catastrophic. Of course this is my personal view, but I thought I would share it since you brought this up.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Well I thought this was going to be my last OB appointment but she wants to see me one more time before my scheduled csection on the 24th. I am going on the afternoon 23rd.

She was really booked this time, and Jeff and I had to wait nearly an hour to see her. I gained half a pound. So my total so far is 8.5lbs, my BP was great, urine great too. I am retaining some fluid. However it was 100 degrees yesterday, I think some of it has to do with the heat. Staying hydrated right now is my biggest problem, because I get parched so quickly if I go out anywhere.

We discussed the planned csection. I just really wanted to touch up on things I had talked about with her before. She said that someone needs to remind her to use stitches instead of staples because she will forget. I told her not to worry, my sister would! She says that she really thinks it will be possible for Jeff to cut the cord too. I am very excited about that!

Next week I am going to get checked to see if I have dilated any. I have serious doubts I have, but since I am still planning to get the IUD I am hoping for just a little bit of dilation.

I have 8 days to go.


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## daekini (Jun 17, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Alison,

At least with a csection *I* know my risks, and while something can go wrong things are less likely to be catastrophic. Of course this is my personal view, but I thought I would share it since you brought this up.

Kim


Hi Kim, and everyone... thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I feel very much like you do about this. And I have been through a C-section and had a great recovery, so I naturally have less fear of the C-section.

I've often felt that having a VBAC vs. Cesarean can be compared to travelling by Car vs. Airplane.

The risks of having an accident are greater if you are travelling by car... but if you happen to be the 1% that gets into a plane wreck, your results are much more likely to be catastrophic.

I think one thing that really scares me about VBAC is that they often don't even know that you've ruptured (or dehisced) until it's too late.

I talked about my feelings w/dh last night and he didn't even realize that he'd been putting this pressure on me. Turns out, he's totally supportive of whatever decision I make.









I was up at 3 a.m. looking up articles on PubMed and it still didn't really help me much... and now I'm soooo sleeepy!

thanks again,
ali


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
I cried during my last csection when they pulled Jack out. Remember though I had the epidural and didn't have any pain.

Kim

I probably could have cried in OR, but there actually were a few minutes afterwards when I was too blissed at finally having my baby - 10 years is a _long_ time to wait. I mean more in the several days post-op. I can't cry out the emotions I'm feeling, and I think it makes it worse because I effectively end up "stuffing" the disappointment and depression.

Well...maybe I'll see if I can bawl my eyes out while the anesthetic is still working. The release might help.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well...had an appointment with my doctor (not the OB) yesterday. She asked again if I wanted to schedule a section, and I said no. She's been putting on the pressure (gently, and I do believe out of genuine concern) for the last several appointments, so I finally told her how I felt about it. As far as I can recall, my words were "from my standpoint as the patient, not as a medical professional, you want to give me a 100% chance of physical and emotional trauma in order to avoid the slight chance that I may experience something worse. That's not acceptable to me.". She stood there looking sad, but said "okay". I think she gets where I'm coming from, but is still really worried.

DH is having a bit of trouble. He asked me last night if me or the baby is going to die...don't think he really believes it will happen, but the whole thing is freaking him out a bit. DH has never been around pregnant women until we got together - I think the whole "good pregnancy, ending in c-section" thing with dd really rattled him. I re-assured him that the odds are good, but that I obviously can't make any guarantees. He's definitely behind me on this, but he's scared. I think he always thought of birth as something that always went okay until he hooked up with me and my "VBAC vs. ERCS" issues.

So...my doctor is using the u/s due date - July 7th (got it wrong in my sig...thought they said the 9th), and my OB is using my original due date - July 14th. My OB is away for two weeks right now, and I went into labour with ds at 38.5 weeks - of course, dd was born 5 days before due date, with no labour at all. I'm getting a little freaked about this, as I could very well go into labour while my OB is still away. A scheduled section wouldn't have changed that, though - it wouldn't have been set up until around the 8th. My OB says that when u/s is so close to the original due date, he stays with the original date, because women know their cycles, and he'd rather rely on that than on the u/s.

I'm rambling. Anyway - I'm seeing my doctor weekly, and see my OB again on July 4th (if I haven't already gone into labour). At that time, we'll once again discuss my options. I just hope my OB doesn't bring up a tubal again. He seems to forget that he's already asked me and I said no. :LOL


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
However my rupture rate ranges from 3% to 20% depending on what you read about uterine anomalies with an already cut uterus. My OB doesn't know what the risks are *for me*, and at this point we aren't sure what my uterus may do next. At least with a csection *I* know my risks, and while something can go wrong things are less likely to be catastrophic.

You do have a point, Kim. This one has been eating at me a lot. If something goes wrong with my VBA2C attempt, I know I'll be kicking myself for the rest of my life. And, I really can't find good stats on my risks, anyway. My first section was 12 years ago. There seems to be no consensus on whether such a long time makes a difference in the risk of rupture. I know that dd being fully 2-years-old is a plus, but how much of one?

And, I've had a really hard time finding anything that separates the risk factor for 2 previous c-sections...the studies all seem to break into "one previous incision" and "two _or more_ previous incisions". If two increases the risk, then it's a safe bet that three increases the risk even more - but by how much? Maternal age...size of baby...how much difference do they make?

I wish I had more answers...


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

A study just came out examining the vba2c rupture rates. It was a good study. I am going from memory here.. but the rate was less than 2%..

I will go find the study..

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
You do have a point, Kim. This one has been eating at me a lot. If something goes wrong with my VBA2C attempt, I know I'll be kicking myself for the rest of my life. And, I really can't find good stats on my risks, anyway. My first section was 12 years ago. There seems to be no consensus on whether such a long time makes a difference in the risk of rupture. I know that dd being fully 2-years-old is a plus, but how much of one?

And, I've had a really hard time finding anything that separates the risk factor for 2 previous c-sections...the studies all seem to break into "one previous incision" and "two _or more_ previous incisions". If two increases the risk, then it's a safe bet that three increases the risk even more - but by how much? Maternal age...size of baby...how much difference do they make?

I wish I had more answers...

I am not sure how you were sutured before. Some studies suggest double layer sutures help prevent against rupture, while others do not. Some say a VBAC after a csection for malposition is more likely than if your csection was for some other reasons. Everything contradicts everything else. I personally think its hard to say *all* VBAC attempts have a less than 1% rupture rate without induction methods, etc. In the last three months I have read about four different mothers who have had ruptures, only one had pitocin given AFTER an already spontaneous labor and they believe that the problem did not happen because of the pit. If it's so rare then why do we read about it so often -- is it because we are looking for it?

When I discovered that Katie had turned vertex I started to research VBAC once again, and like you having had 2 previous csections was looking for something that gave more numbers or at least some evidence based advice on rupture rate and rate of success. It really was hard looking for that, because there really isn't much to go on.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
A study just came out examining the vba2c rupture rates. It was a good study. I am going from memory here.. but the rate was less than 2%..

I will go find the study..

Chantal

I would love to read it! Please post it if you can locate it again.


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## caramia (Jun 16, 2005)

I feel the exact same way as you..
I have 12 weeks to go but have been given the choice of a repeat cesarean or attempting Vbac, I am so nervous.. as this baby is due only 17 months after my last cesarean.. I am scared to VBAC because of rupture, is 17 months too early to even attempt a vaginal birth, but scared of the recovery after a cesarean, especially with a little one at home.. I have been doing research like crazy.. and don't have a clue what to do.
I feel for you.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
When I discovered that Katie had turned vertex I started to research VBAC once again, and like you having had 2 previous csections was looking for something that gave more numbers or at least some evidence based advice on rupture rate and rate of success. It really was hard looking for that, because there really isn't much to go on.

Kim

Of course, your research is even more complicated because of your uterine anomaly. If this baby turns again, I may ask my OB to look into that - find out if I also have one. Mind you - if this one goes to c-section, I'm not that interested in pursuing a VBA3C with the next one. Do you know if uterine anomalies have any repercussions outside of childbearing?

It is frustrating. Despite the fact that I'm fighting another c-section, I am putting a lot of trust in my doctors to handle an emergency. The whole thing is difficult, as I'm not sure I trust doctors at all at this point. But, we'll see how it goes. Baby-under-construction is thriving and active...and still head down...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
A study just came out examining the vba2c rupture rates. It was a good study. I am going from memory here.. but the rate was less than 2%..

I will go find the study..

Chantal

That sounds pretty good. My OB uses 3% as his working estimate. Of course....I really wish I knew if the length of time between sections makes any difference. I found numbers that suggested anything over 2 years is good. But, I can't tell if the odds improve with even more time. Emotionally, I tend to wonder how relevant my first c-section even is...it was over 12 years ago!

Kim: I have no idea about the sutures, either. I think I'm just going to leave things where they are. The fact is at this point, there's a pretty good chance I'll go into labour before they would have scheduled my surgery, anyway!


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## gethane (Dec 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caramia*







I feel the exact same way as you..
I have 12 weeks to go but have been given the choice of a repeat cesarean or attempting Vbac, I am so nervous.. as this baby is due only 17 months after my last cesarean.. I am scared to VBAC because of rupture, is 17 months too early to even attempt a vaginal birth, but scared of the recovery after a cesarean, especially with a little one at home.. I have been doing research like crazy.. and don't have a clue what to do.
I feel for you.

I think they prefer 18 months, but I don't think 17 months is crazy. My first vbac was 18 months after my c-section. My second vbac was 18 months after my first vbac.

It's sad they make it sound so scary. I'm all for people being informed, but I wasn't even scared when I had my 2 vbac's, back in the 90's, and they went totally fine.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
Of course, your research is even more complicated because of your uterine anomaly. If this baby turns again, I may ask my OB to look into that - find out if I also have one. Mind you - if this one goes to c-section, I'm not that interested in pursuing a VBA3C with the next one. Do you know if uterine anomalies have any repercussions outside of childbearing?


Not really. Some women have problems with their kidneys and are more prone to infection. That is all I can find. Mostly its with reproduction, higher incidence of miscarriage, implantation problems, ovulation problems and of course, birth problems.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm almost done having children - well, maybe I am done...dh & I are still negotiating number 4.









I may not bother getting this checked out. If I'm finished having children, it doesn't seem likely that I can do anything about kidney difficulties or infections. From what you've posted, I don't _think_ an anomaly is what's been going on with me, anyway - although it's certainly possible. The human body is too complicated...


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi
The study is in Am J Obstet Gynecol. 2005 Apr;192(4):1223-8; discussion 1228-9.
PMID: 15846208 Macones GA, et al. Obstetric outcomes in women with two
prior cesarean deliveries: is vaginal birth after cesarean delivery a viable option?

I cannot quote it directly or post the summary because I dont' have permission. But it did find that the rupture rate for a VBA2C was in the 1-2% range, with an N of 1082 subjects and a vbac success rate of about 75%
20% of the ruptures were linked to prostiglanden use..

On the whole the study says that, while there are more complications in the vba2c group but states that on a whole, the risks are low.

Chantal

If you go to the medical library of your local hospital and give them the pubmed ID you can request a copy.. which takes a while...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I think I'll probably have the baby before I could get the report - don't know if it works the same way in Canada or not. I might need a different ID??

Thanks, chantal. Every little bit helps, and 1-2% is within my risk tolerance. Besides, 75% success rate is not shabby! I'll cross my fingers and try to stay calm.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I have an odd question for those of you with more than one caesarean, particularly if the first was emergency, and the secon planned ahead. I'm wondering how you knew (if you did) that you'd be okay with the second or subsequent surgeries?

When I got pregnant with baby-under-construction, I'd already been told that it would have to be a c-section, and I'd have to accept it. I didn't like it, but I wanted another baby, and I thought I'd be okay with it. Once I found out I was pregnant, I just lost it - nightmares, insomnia - you name it. So...this one may be a VBA2C, but I know it may be a section. I _think_ that I'd be okay with my next baby (if there is one) being another section if that happened...but how do you know for sure? I thought I'd be okay with this one, and when it came down to it, I'm not okay with it at all....


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
I have an odd question for those of you with more than one caesarean, particularly if the first was emergency, and the secon planned ahead. I'm wondering how you knew (if you did) that you'd be okay with the second or subsequent surgeries?

When I got pregnant with baby-under-construction, I'd already been told that it would have to be a c-section, and I'd have to accept it. I didn't like it, but I wanted another baby, and I thought I'd be okay with it. Once I found out I was pregnant, I just lost it - nightmares, insomnia - you name it. So...this one may be a VBA2C, but I know it may be a section. I _think_ that I'd be okay with my next baby (if there is one) being another section if that happened...but how do you know for sure? I thought I'd be okay with this one, and when it came down to it, I'm not okay with it at all....

I was told that I would never carry another pregnancy to term, that I would not have any biological children, so when it looked like my pregnancy was going to make it, I decided that I would make the best of the situation. I knew that I was given this chance by the gods and that I had confidence that in the end I would have a baby. I felt confident in my doctors skills, and the fact that she worked with me every step of the way in making sure I had a good experience in that OR. When they pulled Jack out, I cried and was saying "I can't believe my body did this again."

I am not going to lie, I've had a pretty uneventful pregnancy compared to my last one and I hope that I have that same kind of cesarean -- uneventful, as I planned, but I do have anxiety about it. Last time was a healing experience for me and again, I have a great doctor who is working to give me the best overall experience and at this point in my life a vaginal birth is the last of my wants or concerns -- I want happy healthy babies with no catastrophic events taking place.


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## Stayinhom (Dec 29, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caramia*







I feel the exact same way as you..
I have 12 weeks to go but have been given the choice of a repeat cesarean or attempting Vbac, I am so nervous.. as this baby is due only 17 months after my last cesarean.. I am scared to VBAC because of rupture, is 17 months too early to even attempt a vaginal birth, but scared of the recovery after a cesarean, especially with a little one at home.. I have been doing research like crazy.. and don't have a clue what to do.
I feel for you.

I feel the same way. I am scheduled for a repeat c/s in 5 days. And I still am questioning myself. I hope I made the right decision. I still might change my mind and opt for a VBAC. I don't know. It is scary either way. I too have researched and researched and researched and am clueless and majorly anxious. If something goes wrong I know I will never forgive myself. I wish I had a magic ball and could look into the future and see which path is best for us. I'll let you know how it goes.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

for all of you struggling with your decisions..

No one has a magic ball that they can tell what will happen by looking in it. Life would be so much easier if we did.

No matter what choices you make or will make.. try to find peace with them.
It can be easy to look back and say "I should have" or "If only" or to feel guilty about a choice made or not made. Be easy on yourselves.


















Chantal


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
So...this one may be a VBA2C, but I know it may be a section. I _think_ that I'd be okay with my next baby (if there is one) being another section if that happened...but how do you know for sure? I thought I'd be okay with this one, and when it came down to it, I'm not okay with it at all....


My first was a totally unexpected c/s and I was devasteted by it. It sent me into a terrible downward spiral of PPD that took nearly a year to fight my way out of...on my own.. suffereing in silence because I didn't say anything.. and I looked "fine" on the outside...

When I got pregnant with my second child, I was terrified that I would have another c/s. I was not really scared of the surgery or recovery, I had had a good experience with both with the first one.. but I was so scared I would spiral down into deep PPD again and I knew I could not survive it. So I shared my feelings with my DH and my MW and my family.. so they all knew.. if I should not get the birth I wanted.. that I would need help...

And I didn't get the birth I wanted.. and I was sure I would be just devastated again.. But I wasn't.. I was sad.. dissapointed.. but not overwhelmed by it.. and that surprised me. I think it had a lot to do with how I prepared everyone to help me cope.. and that helped me. I also think that it helped that I had labored long and hard, my body worked.. but it was just rotten luck that I ended up with a secon c/s.. nothing I did or could have done would have really changed that.. and I believe that firmly.. and that has helped me feel a little less sad about my second c/s. I still grieve it.. but not like the first...
I also think it helped that I was able to see and hold my baby minutes after she was born.. that my DH has photos of her being born.. that I was able to nurse her as soon as I returned to my room.. and that she was not in the NICU.. I think all those things helped me feel more "in control" than the first time..

We are starting to think about #3.. and I am considering a vba2c.. even if I have to do it at home.. But I am keeping my options open.. We are not planning on getting pregnant for at least a year yet.. and things may change.. I do know.. that if I have a third c/s.. this will probably be the last baby.. The risks of repeated c/s make me uncomfortable and I am not willing to risk my babies growing up without a mother...

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

I am starting to get anxious. Four days from now I should have a baby in my arms. Its hard for me to imagine I am going to have four children. I just switched meds for PPD. I am now on Effexor XR and I like it much better.

Everything is set, almost too perfect.

I talked to my neighbor who is going to assist the anest. on Friday for my cesarean. He said he did a csection with my doctor on Friday and it took her 16minutes from cut to close. I was shocked and in awe at the same time.

Just thought I would check in!

Kim


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## Henry's_Mamma (Jan 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
I am starting to get anxious. Four days from now I should have a baby in my arms.

It's that time already??? Wow time flies! Good luck ... we'll be thinking about you ...


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Kim
The very very best to you. Wishing you a wonderful birth!









Chantal


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Kim,
I am so excited for you







LMK, if you need anything. Can't wait to meet your baby girl









OT: If you get time, call me...I want to pick your brain about something. :LOL


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

OTF-- I haven't posted here in a bit but I just remember the date...you are so close!!

How exciting!! I pray that sll goes well and that you and your babe have a wonderufl birthing experience


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ligmom*
Kim,
I am so excited for you







LMK, if you need anything. Can't wait to meet your baby girl









OT: If you get time, call me...I want to pick your brain about something. :LOL









I was actually going to call you today!









Not so sure if you want to pick my brain these days tho!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Hey, Kim - looking forward to reading all about the arrival of Katie. I hope everything goes perfectly!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Tomorrow is the big day. I'm nervous.









Four kids. FOUR. I can't imagine.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Tomorrow is the big day. I'm nervous.









Four kids. FOUR. I can't imagine.









You're going to have your hands full - that's for sure. I hope you have a chance to pop in and let us know how it went. Good luck - I'm sure everything will go well...and you'll be holding Katie Rose soon.


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

NAK. I was very nervous the day before, two and a half weeks ago. In fact, I started to freak out a little and talk about not showing up at the hosp. DP gave me a glass of wine to calm my nerves, and his sister and her family (4 YO + 2 YO) came over with dinner. which was a nice distraction. I got it out of my system and was fine the next morning.

I hope all goes smoothly for you. I am sure you've thought of everything. You'll have a new baby in your arms before you know it (the best part!).


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

I was nervous too, but I was so uncomfortable I couldn't sleep the night before, so I was glad I didn't have to be pregnant anymore!

The day of the c/s we went into the L&D ward where we were told to show up and I walked up and joked 'Hey, is this the place to have a baby?' and all the nurses looked at me like I had three heads - then I said we had a scheduled c/s for 2pm and they said 'Ugh we don't have one scheduled'! I NEARLY DIED! Luckily they straightened it all out and we had the operation at the time we had planned.

So when you are all nervous beforehand, finding out that the place that is supposed to do the operation doesn't even know who you are is not fun!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Well, I had my last OB appointment today. Baby is super active. I had to wait over an hour to see the doctor because she was delivering a baby. I was calm and relaxed, chatting with another girl who is due in a few weeks but being induced next week due to some health complications.

Anyway, my blood pressure was 20pts higher on the bottom, and 20pts higher on the top. I laid down for awhile on my left side, and it was even higher. My OB said she wasn't going to tell me what my protein was in my urine because she didn't want me to be paranoid all night long and we were having the baby tomorrow so it really wasn't all that important. I did have pre-e in my last pregnancy starting around 33 weeks, and so it looks like I did pretty good making it this far without any problems in that area. I also lost 2lbs.

I will post more later. I need to go eat!


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## Stayinhom (Dec 29, 2004)

I'm scheduled for my c/sec for tomorrow (the 24th) too. I am nervous/excited/scared/anxious/happy/relieved...you name it, I'm feeling it! This will be our second daughter.








Onthefence...let me know how yours goes. I am scheduled for 10 am. Isn't it just surreal?
Best wishes


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

I am scheduled for 12:30.

My legs and ankles are badly swollen and I've been seeing floaters. I can't sleep either.

I only have an hour and a half left to eat. LOL


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

OTF!! Congrats! Today is the big day! Happy birthing to you!!

Stayinhom-- We have never met but congrats and good luck to you too! Happy birthing!

2 new babies meet their mommies tomorrow!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

to you both!!

Chantal


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Just wanted to update y'all









Finally managed to talk to Kim (she's been calling since Fri., but I had a family crisis)...She and Katie Rose are doing fine







I'll let her share the details with y'all, but I didn't want to leave you hangin' any longer.

Congrats, OTF!!!! Hurray for your beautiful baby girl!!!!





















t














t


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Thanks for letting us know!! YAY KIM!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

YAY!!! Congratulations KIM!!!!! Welcome Katie Rose!!

Stayinhom: Hope all went well!!

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

I'm hoping I will not be interrupted.








I have lots to share with all of you.

*The Birth*

On Friday the 24th I arrived at the hospital around 10am, and might I add that I had my hair fixed and full makeup on. I was a little nervous but was set at ease with Katie's constant movements. She was very active and my husband kept telling her she was about to be evicted. I walked to Labor & Delivery and they told my husband they would come and get him shortly and asked him to go to the waiting room. This is now a hospital policy so that they can ask patients questions without family or husbands present. At first I was a little aggravated but after I was in there I was glad he wasn't there.

I had a wonderful L&D nurse named Heather. She was really sweet and funny but was a little taken a back by some of my requests, even mentioning that some of them could not be done. I told her that I had already discussed them with my OB and the Anest. Dept and that they would be honored. She was surprised that they all were.







Anyway the most difficult part of my whole cesarean birth was the placement of the IV. I have really small veins, and it took three people over thirty minutes to finally get one in with a pediatric needle. It was in a really painful spot in my wrist along the bone. Katie was really active, her heart rate sometimes going as high as 174, I was having some contractions, and my blood pressure was doing very well. Shortly after the IV was in, my husband came back to the L&D room. Now we just waited.

A little after 12pm my sister and Steve, the anest. assist. came in. Steve is actually my neighbor, and he was able to get the anest. from his group that I wanted. I was THRILLED about that. A little before 12:30 I got the epidural. It was a breeze, I felt only pressure and it only took a few minutes. Everyone was really surprised how relax and easy going I was. All i could think about was how in just a few minutes I was going to meet my daughter. The epidural block took more on my right side, so I was redosed before going to the OR to get it more even. I was still able to move my body and feet with concentration but had a very good block by the time I went to the OR. Everyone in the OR was really jovial and funny, setting me at ease. They kept asking me how I felt, and I told them fine.

Once I was on the operating table, I almost felt relief. I could still feel Katie moving. My sister and my husband were there talking to me. I went in to the OR at 12:40, at 12:46 Katie Rose was born. While they were getting her out I had no pain at all, I could feel them pushing her out and as soon as they pulled her head out I felt relief. They held her up over the sterile field and showed her to me. She was covered with vernix and very little blood and she was crying. The first thing everyone in the room said was how much smaller she was than we thought she was going to be. My husband did not get to cut the cord like we had wanted him too, but that seemed to be the last of our concerns. Our pediatrician checked out the baby and declared her perfect. Her apgars were 9 and 9. My husband announce from across the room that she was very little and had lots of brownish black hair. He brought her to me and I looked at how small she was. She had lots of hair and had very small features. Her skin was a very rosey pink and she had lots of vernix all over her body and it was really thick in the creases of her skin. After a few minutes my husband walked her to the nursery to get weighed and measured and to get a diaper for her.

After Katie was taken to the nursery, Steve kept asking me if I was feeling okay. They were asking me all kinds of questions, and must have asked me half a dozen times if I had any pain. My pain was a Zero. None at all. In fact I had no oxygen, surprising since my blood pressure was running very low during the entire surgery. My Ob told me that I had very little adhesions and that my uterus and ovaries looked remarkably well for having had now three csections. My septum was still intact but flattened, and my placenta was very healthy looking. At 1:05 they were wheeling me out of the OR to my L&D room to recover. Twenty minutes from start to finish! I was pleasantly surprised.

As soon as I was in recovery I began asking for ice chips. I had really bad dry mouth and I also wanted to sit up in the bed. Steve came to monitor me and to redose my epidural and set up the PCAP. While he was in there, my blood pressure dropped to 88/33. They kept asking me how I felt, and if I was light headed. At this point I was feeling fine and did not know my blood pressure was so low. They brought the baby to me and told me that she weighed 6lbs 12oz and was 20 inches long. (she isn't 20 inches long tho) I unwrapped her from her blankets and took a look at all her little features. She was really small, and about that time my OB stepped in to check on me. She commented that she was small and maybe a little earlier than we thought but that everything looked great and I was doing well. I started to feel a little light headed and I was given ephedrine. My blood pressure was not recovering, and didn't for several hours. Instead of staying for 1.5hrs in recovery, I stayed four hours, though I don't think I minded because I didn't complain. I did have bouts of sleepiness, and disoriented for a good bit of my recovery from the low BP, however I was allowed to keep the baby with me the entire time. The only time my BP recovered to anything normal was when my dad and MIL visisted me in recovery, which my L&D nurse commented on jokingly.

Overall I would rate my birth experience as absolutely wonderful. This cesarean was easier than the last, and I had no pain during or in recovery. Baby wasn't really interested in nursing right away but did nurse three hours after birth for nearly an hour on both breasts. We did have some trouble nursing, but not for her lack of trying or interest. Her mouth is very small and my nipples are really large, so it took her awhile to get it into her small little mouth. The staff was absolutely wonderful and the baby nurse we had was very respectful of all our wishes. I absolutely got the best experience someone could dream of and everyone worked really hard to make it special.

I will post more about my actual recovery since it has been very different than my last planned cesarean. I am doing well and have been home since Sunday. I have so much to tell all of you and to talk about!

Kim


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

OTF-- SOunds perfect







I'm so glad everything went well.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Congratulations, Kim! It sounds as though all your planning really paid off. Best wishes for the next few weeks of getting to know Katie.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Oh Kim
Many many







for you! It sounds like it was a great experience overall. I am so happy for you!

Chantal


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## LisaG (Feb 23, 2003)

Yay Kim








I'm so, so glad to hear things went so well. I just stopped in to ask if anyone had heard how you were and was so happy to see your post. Enjoy your babymoon!!!

Lisa


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Thank you all so much for the congrats!

Things are going really well. I am so glad to be home from the hospital. I left Sunday around noon time. My recovery this time was different than my last one. While I had excellend day time nursing care, at night it was horrible. I actually had nurses forget about me, and I was not given my medication on time. Whenever I did need something from them I had to pester or walk to the nurses station. It was quite aggravating. My pain level was very low, and mostly had very little to do with my cesarean. Afterbirth pains are terrible this time and continue to be. I am told this gets worse with each child. One side of my incision has a burning sensation, this same sensation I felt for the majority of my pregnancy, so I believe it has something to do with the nerve endings in that area. I also was a lot more stiff and had more muscle problems after having my epidural removed.

I did have some side effects from the epidural that I did not have from my previous one. I have a numb spot on my back where it was inserted. I also have muscle cramps and numbness in my left leg that I am still having. They say this should go away within the week.

Overall I feel a lot better than I did at the end of my pregnancy. I can easily move around and do not have the pain that I had due to her being head down. No more running to the bathroom every 30 minutes either. I am hardly bleeding. I am down to using pantyliners 5 days out.

I will tell more about our adventure later. I think I hear Katie stirring.

Kim


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
. I am hardly bleeding. I am down to using pantyliners 5 days out.

I will tell more about our adventure later. I think I hear Katie stirring.

Kim

I am sorry that your night nurses were not good









You are lucky that your bleeding is light..I was told that it can get worse with each child.. and it was true for me..









Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

During this past hospital stay I spent a good bit of time in the nursery just talking with the nursery workers. I have to say, that while the nursery nurses were wonderful, I was very depressed and upset by new policies that have been adopted since having Jack.

One is one I wanted to share with all of you because this seems to be a policy that is being adopted at other hospitals all over. If your baby is bathed after a cesarean birth they must put the baby under the warmer for at least one hour, preventing mom from having baby in recovery. I chose not to have our baby bathed before even knowing this new policy, but while visiting the nursery, I heard them telling the student nurses that all csection babies that had baths had to be put under warmers because they tend to have more problems maintaining their temperature than vaginal birthed babies. So if you want your baby in recovery, you may want to think of at least delaying any bath until later and nursing is established.

Another thing, about dropping temps in newborns born by cesarean. Katie did have trouble keeping her temp above 97 in recovery. I luckily had a great nurse who knew me, and helped me keep her in recovery. We placed Katie on my chest skin to skin and then wrapped her with warming blankets from the nursery. She then got a warm blanket from a warmer from L&D and laid it on top of both of us, within ten minutes Katie's temp was high enough to stay with me for the duration. If they say your baby is having trouble maintaining their temps try those things to bring it back up and have them check it again.

One thing I found disturbing about the nursery setting now is the lack of skin to skin contact. The nurses have to wear gloves whenever they touch a baby now. This is a fairly new rule I was told. They are also not allowed to hold babies anymore, unless to feed them or bathe them. While I was in the nursery watching Katie on her bililight (she is Coombs Positive) on Sunday morning, there was a baby in the far part of the nursery crying. It was totally depressing to me! Anyway, Katie's nurse told me the baby had been crying on and off for nearly two hours and they had called the mother several times to take the baby to her but the mother said she didn't want her and wanted her left in the nursery. Because of the new policy, they can't just sit and hold the babies while they work. It was so sad!!! I wanted to go and pick that baby up. This is one of the few hospitals that encourages rooming in, but it was sad that so many parents didn't do this. I was thinking that if more parents knew that the nursery workers cant hold the babies and have to wear gloves just to put a pacifier in their mouths, they might would rething rooming in. We were so glad to have rooming in and be able to have the bililights in the room with us so we could continue to room in. Our baby was the only baby of 20 who did total rooming in while we were there.









Kim


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I tried rooming in with ds, and I simply couldn't manage it by myself. With dh there, I was able to have dd in the room the entire hospital visit.

What on earth has caused this change in policy???? This was the sort of thing that went on when my dad was a baby (he was in an orphanage, and never ever picked up except to feed, change and bathe him), and I believe it did a lot of psychological damage to babies. I can't believe this has been reversed! I'll have to find out if that's the policy at our hospital...

Poor babies.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

When I had Tracy the policy was liekt his. Where I had Bryce the policy was different. When you walked on the floor the nurses were all holding babies. Bryce was in NICU for 30 hours and then he was with me. But he did so well sleeping and the nurses were great he went to the nursery the last night. The nurses held him as he slept.

Concerning bathing, Bryce wasn't bathed till he got out of NICU, my request since he didn't go to NICU till he was several hours old. Until he had a bath anyone handling him had to wear gloves. If he had been bathed they could have skin to skin contact.


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Ok, so I lost the thread this month!! Kim, big congrats on Katie, I'm so happy to hear she's here, happy and healthy!
That's terrible the nurses aren't allowed to hold babies, my hospital has no nursery so rooming is mandatory but if you need a break--the nurses just take baby to the desk with them--one downfall--if they are all busy, they can't take the baby. The only time we left Molly was when we went to get a coffee.
I gotta tell you all, reading these stories of new babies is getting me to wanting one again! I had a bit of a pregnancy "scare" (read-not the right time,but so sorry to see AF) and now I'm thinking of trying next month--I'm probably nuts with a 5 mos old :LOL


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## SKK (Apr 9, 2005)

CONGRATS KIM!!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

That is terrible.. The nurses at our birth center hold the babies and rock them all the time....

What is Coombs Positive?

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Coombs Positive is when there are blood incompatibility issues between you and your partner and the baby you carry has your partners blood type. This has happened with two of our three biological children. Our oldest and youngest. What happens is that it can cause severe jaundice and even require a blood transfussion. I am O+ and my husband is A+, and Katie is A+.

If there is a problem, one way to help is to cut the umbilical cord immediately after birth. The thing is you don't know until after baby is born unless there was an amnio before hand. Our daughter was put on a bilibed when she was six hours old, which I think has helped tremendously not to mention my milk came in very quickly. We have home health care right now. She gets her blood drawn two days, then they skip a day, and then do it again.







When her bilirueben level drops below 10 we can take her off the lights. Her level is dropping but still at a 14. While not a problem for other infants, we have to continue to watch hers to make sure it doesnt rise.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Hi Shannon!

Wow, already thinking of another one. What does your OB think? Or have you even discussed it with her yet. The reason I ask is that my OB likes to see at least 18 months to two years between csections. Not sure if you would do a repeat of not.

Kim


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Nah, I haven't talked to her about it--actually, I'm still attempting to get to the bottom of the pain I've been having since 3 weeks PP. I had a colonoscopy last week and apparently I have a lovely colon, so that's not it (but funny thing--the doc who did it came back after talking to dh to let me know that his wife's name was Shannon and his daughter's name was Molly!)
Anyway, ideally he wants to repeat the cat scan, but without the dye it's not much good and since I was covered in hives just from drinking the initial dye before even getting the injectable one--he says he'd rather open me up and take a quick look than risk my dying in the scanner (which almost happened once when I had the dye for a renal study) I really need to get all this taken care of first--but yeah, I have some pretty major baby fever going on


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## aisraeltax (Jul 2, 2005)

we are having a planned csection in december with my 3d child. both of my sons were born via csection, although with both of them i attempted natural childbirth. i was in labor with the first child for over 36 hours before he went into distress and they had to perform an emergency csection. almost the same situation with my second son, although they performed an emergency csection after about 20 hours. both kids were almost 9 lbs. i dont understand why i wasn't able to deliver them naturally though. i am 5'9 and not petite at all. for whatever reason, though, we will be having a planned csection and i am a little worried about it. its not like i haven't been through the procedure before, but its never been the case that i have planned it. its just happened. this one i am getting nervous about though.
anyone in the same situation?
can you share your experiences with me about what to expect when a csection is planned?
thanks
Rach


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Rach,

At the beginning of this thread there is a birthing plan for a planned elective csection. Above is my birth story of that csection. I am sure some other moms can give you some advice too!

I've had two really good experiences with planned cesareans.







So you can have a good and wonderful birth.

Welcome to our little thread on MDC!

Kim


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## scoobers (Jun 24, 2005)

Hello everybody,
I'm new here but am very happy to have found this thread. I just want to say that I really appreciate everyone's sharing their experiences.

I'm still struggling with my own birth experience but for a different reason than others on this thread. I had a very difficult vaginal birth which ended up in an emergency forceps delivery. My son still has scars on his head albeit small ones, and I will be dealing with the effects of my 4th degree laceration (no episiotomy) from the forceps for the rest of my life. (Sex problems, incontinence, etc.) I had to have reconstructive surgery because of the laceration and it's helped but I'm just accepting that I'll never be the same down there, that's been very hard.
I'm actually bitter that I WASN'T given a C-section. I was 10cm and pushing for 4 hours, totally exhausted before my son got into trouble and my doctor just yanked him out with the forceps. Words can't possibly describe the pain and the terror. Thank god my son was alright except for a couple of scars on his head from the forceps. My husband was totally traumatized. I believe the entire floor of the hospital heard my screams when she pulled him out. My husband was unable to speak for an entire day afterwards. We didn't even call his parents to tell them until the next day. I was too weak, in shock and terrible pain to hold my son for a couple hours. I think I must have lost a lot of blood because I was also unable to stand or walk on my own for 2 or 3 days afterwards.
I really don't understand how it could have happened. A forceps delivery was my biggest fear. I had a long conversation with my doctor about it after seeing them in the childbirth class. She assured me that she very rarely used forceps...only in an absolute emergency to save the life of the child. So, you can imagine how I felt when things went really south. It got really chaotic and everyone started screaming at me to push (hello, what had I been doing for 4 hours) and she yelled for the forceps. I vaguely remember my husband screaming at her as well (only time I've EVER heard him yell). We had asked for a C-section after I became exhausted after pushing for 2+ hours but they just ignored us. I believe that was because there was no doctor around. My doctor had come in after I'd been pushing for an hour and announced she was off to do a twin delivery so I'd have to use the MW on call, someone I'd never met, knew nothing about. The MW came in, introduced herself and left. That was the last we saw of her. After 3+ hours of pushing, after repeated requests for a c-section, my doctor came back from her twin delivery and I was STILL pushing. She tried to get him out with the vacuum extractor and that's when things got really bad.
I felt like such a failure afterwards. Why hadn't I been able to push him out? I'm very fit. I had just ran a marathon the year before getting pregnant. He was a fairly big baby but not giant (8lbs, 6 oz). I later went to a different OB/GYN who measured my hips(the bottom section) and told me they are unusually narrow. Now, why didn't my birth OB do that? My new OB/GYN seemed surprised she hadn't. I think my son's head just got stuck and couldn't get past. I really makes me VERY angry when I hear people criticizing women/doctors about C-sections and/or pain relief. In my case there would very likely have been a better outcome for all. I don't understand why people are so judgemental about the experiences and choices of others.
I also believe that the forceps delivery was at least a partial cause of the BF problems we had. He was unable to latch because he couldn't open his mouth very wide. I was told that the forceps can cause the plates in the head to misalign and that can cause problems in the beginning. We didn't get very good support from the lactation person in the hospital before going home and we had an awful few days at home where we thought he was getting milk but he wasn't. That turned into an emergency and it was only through the intervention of a wonderful lactation person at a different hospital that we were able to get things turned around. It took 2 months of pumping and persisting with trying to get him (and me) to learn to latch before it finally worked out. He nursed for 14 months before weaning himself and in the end I was happy we had stuck with it but it sure was hard in the beginning.

After that experience my husband and I were pretty sure we weren't going to have any more kids. My son is now 2 yrs and 3 months and we've moved from pretty certain we're done to considering the possibility but still leaning to no. The ONLY way I would do it is if I could have a planned C-section. I've talked to my NEW OB/GYN about it and he said after what I've been through he doesn't know of a doctor who would advise a Vbirth so that's not an issue. I've talked to him about the surgical risks and feel ok about that but I have some questions I'm hoping some of you who've been through it could help me with.

From what I understand, there are two types of pain medications. One is a spinal and the other an epidural. Is that correct? What are the pros and cons of each? (I had an epidural with my vaginal birth but it didn't work and I know a woman who had an emergency c-section with one that didn't work so I'm a little worried about those.)

What impact does it have on your stomach muscles and/or shape? After they heal are they different?

How bad does the scar look? Does it depend on your skin type/healing ability? How they sew you up? I seem to have been blessed with the kind of skin which is resistant to strech marks. Does that mean the scar would be less? What are the pros and cons of sutures vs. staples vs. glue?

I know a lot of you were not happy to have a c-section and didn't have good experiences, but is there anything that would have made it go better for you? (Other than having a V-birth.)

I would want to have my baby with me immediately. How common is that? I read OTF's post about the bath and that's great info, thanks.

What could I do prior to the c-section to prepare?

Thanks for reading and for sharing your experience.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I can't say much about the anesthetics. I've had a general and an epidural - they both worked, and I hated them both. However, my mom had a true spinal when she had me...and developed what's called a spinal headache. She says it was the worst headache she's ever had, and this is from a woman who used to have to crawl to the bathroom at least one day a month from the severity of her migraines. I'd be inclined to try to the epidural - if it's a planned section, not an emergency, they'll know it's not working before they try the surgery.

I _hated_ everything about both of my c-sections, but I can certainly understand your point of view. I will mention that, in my case at least, some of the judgmental attitude stems from the feeling that women who treat c-sections as the "easy" option make it that much harder for women like me to get medical professionals to treat our emotional reactions seriously.

As for the scar...if I'm at all typical, it's not really anything to worry about. After two sections, I have a very thin white scar at the bikini line. It's almost invisible. It occasionally itches a little, and there's a very narrow area that's never quite regained full feeling. (After each section, especially my first, there was a numb area...if I ran my fingers down my stomach, they'd hit a part that felt like it had been frozen at the dentist. Over time, that faded.)

I was overweight even when I had my first baby, so I can't really see my abs. But, as far as strength, function, etc. - everything's normal now (well, except that I'm 39+ weeks pregnant :LOL ). Since my sections, I've done months and months - even years - of crunches, leg lifts, various yoga positions, etc. Once I got past the recuperative period (about 6-8 weeks with my emergency section - 6 months or so with my planned one), everything's been normal in that regard.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I just noticed a couple of other questions in your post.

I don't know what you can do to prepare, other than general prenatal fitness. Make sure you get your exercise so that you're as fit as possible before the surgery - I think recovery tends to be quicker that way. You're emotionally okay with the idea, so I can't really think of anything else, except to research the procedures (as you're doing right now).

My babies weren't with me afterwards for either surgery. Apparently, dd would have been, except that there was no room for me on the L&D ward, so I had to go to the general post-op recovery...no babies allowed there. IF I have to have another section, that probably (hopefully) won't happen again. Check with your hospital, because it really depends on them.

I can't think of anything that would make a c-section better for me, except for lots of mental/emotional preparation. I'll never be happy about having a section, but that's me - you sound like you're in a psychologically much better place for one.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hello All

Scoobers: I am so very very sorry that you had such a traumatic delivery.







for you. Have you been able to talk to someone about your experiences? Healing emotionally from a traumatic delivery can be a long process. I hope you are able to find the support you need.
I am also sorry that your Dr did not act in a respectful way of you, your body and your wishes.. Are you still seeing her? It makes me so mad to hear of Drs who do things like this.. Some of them have this godlike complex that is sickening...

I don't hate my c sections.. they make me feel sad and sometimes less of a woman..But my second section was a much better experience than the first. I am waffling between how I would like our next child to be born...

Many







s for you and I hope that you can start on the road to healing.

Here is a White Paper that might help.. It is a little long so, PM me if you want it. I have permission from the author to pass it along. It is called

Plannning a Family-Centered Cesarean by Michelle Smilowitz,

Chantal


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## aisraeltax (Jul 2, 2005)

on the fence,
thanks for much for pointing that out to me. there is so much to read here, you cant possibly read it all. i have a birthing plan that contains alot of what you have listed, but yours is much more comprehensive and i hope you dont mind if i copyright infringe upon you.
As for talk about scars earlier, i have had 2 csections and an ectopic pregnancy, and they have used the same scar each time. although i guess it gets a little wider each time, the scar is below my bikini line and cant be seen unless im wearing a very skimpy bikini (which i dont really do).
it has gotten much more sensitive with time (no pain, but i dont like it to be touched) and my internal scar tissue has given me a lot of problems.
when i had my first son, i was in college and had no medical insurance (i was an idiot and took the money my parents gave me and spent it). we made a deal with the drs. and paid upfront for a "normal" birth. i sold my car in order to pay for it. the dr. and the hospital signed an agreement that the payment was in full. as you all know, i didnt have a "normal" pregnancy and ended up in the hospital for over 3 weeks...totaling in excess of 15,000 (remember, this nearly 15 years ago). I was 22, in good health, etc. so the dr. and hospital didnt think it would really be a risk. they were wrong and i paid $1,500 for that birth. i know if the dr. and hospital could have prevented the csection then, they would have b/c it was in my situation in their economic interest. as for the 2nd one, i think i just had the same problem (whatever it is).

can you guys tell me what the difference/cos/prons of staples and sutures are. ive always had staples and never had problems. i have very slight hole scars above and below the scar, but its almost invisible. i never had a problem with them but dont know anything and the differences.

glad i found you guys!
Rach


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi Rach
I had staples the first time and sutures the second.. Neither gave me any issues..so I can't say which is better.

Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *scoobers*
From what I understand, there are two types of pain medications. One is a spinal and the other an epidural. Is that correct? What are the pros and cons of each? (I had an epidural with my vaginal birth but it didn't work and I know a woman who had an emergency c-section with one that didn't work so I'm a little worried about those.)

What impact does it have on your stomach muscles and/or shape? After they heal are they different?

How bad does the scar look? Does it depend on your skin type/healing ability? How they sew you up? I seem to have been blessed with the kind of skin which is resistant to strech marks. Does that mean the scar would be less? What are the pros and cons of sutures vs. staples vs. glue?

I know a lot of you were not happy to have a c-section and didn't have good experiences, but is there anything that would have made it go better for you? (Other than having a V-birth.)

I would want to have my baby with me immediately. How common is that? I read OTF's post about the bath and that's great info, thanks.

What could I do prior to the c-section to prepare?

Thanks for reading and for sharing your experience.

Welcome! First let me say how sorry I am that you had such a traumatic delivery. I think some people don't believe that a vaginal birth can turn so sour and leave a woman just as traumatized as an unplanned or an unnecessary cesarean. My SIL had a similar experience to yours and elected to have a csection with her second child -- she had no problem getting an OB to do this. Forcep delivery is very scary, I know my OB told us she rarely does them anymore for the very reasons you listed. I know two children who have long term damage due to forceps -- sad indeed.

As for your questions, I will try to answer a few of them.

1) The two most common anest. methods used for cesarean births are spinals and epidurals. Both have various risks, its a matter of choosing what you are most comfortable with. Spinals are preferred by most OBs because they are quick acting and wear off in about 45-60 minutes from onset -- they also provide a denser block. However, once you have a spinal it cannot be redoses, meaning that if the block does not go well, they cannot redo it and put more anest. in. This is what happened to me in 1997. I had a spinal that did not do right, instead of going down into my pelvis and legs, it went in my chest, shoulders and neck. I felt an entire csection that lasted nearly 75 minutes. They were unable to knock me out due to how the block took. With a spinal you can have a long acting anest put in called duramorph this helps with pain after the csection.
An epidural is done just like one for a L&D patient seeking a vaginal birth. A cath is left in your back so that you can be redosed should your block not work or only effect one side. The block is not as dense as a spinal, you can often still move your legs and can feel pushing and pulling, but you should not feel pain. Also with an epidural you can leave the cath in after the csection and have a continuous dose of medication administered into your spinal column for continous relief after your csection, this can also be hooked to a PCAP for you to administer pain medication should you need this.
Both carry risks, like BP problems, continued numbness, back pain, paralysis, and the list goes on and on -- however the risks are fairly small and much less than have GA.

2) Your stomach muscles and shape will be effected. However if you are fit, like say Madonna, you are more likely to be able to tone your body and get your shape back more quickly. You may have some shelf there, of stretching that may not go back. I am a fat chick, and my body is all out of whack as it is, so I probably am never going to get my girlish figure back unless I have plastic surgery.

3) Scars vary person to person. I've seen some people who barely have a visible scar. I think this has to do with skin type and the surgeon doing it. There is arguement to what is best, staples or sutures for the outside closure. I can tell you that I've had both, and both times that I've gotten sutures the scar/incision site looks 100% better than the staples. Most Drs when given the choice for themselves will choose sutures, for one it is less likely to open and it does close the flesh better. Many surgeons do not like to do them though because it takes longer to do them. I am not an advocate of glue after doing more research into how the glue is used. What I have been reading on OB-GYN forums and heard from three OBs, including my own, is that the glue does not give a substantial closure and that it is superficial. That underneath the glue the layers have to be sewn just right up and under the skin -- unfortunately most surgeons do not take the time to perform this type of closure (the closure is like lacing from what I understand). With glue you are more likely to get infection, a bigger increase than sutures, and the glue less likely to hold than staples. Also some patients are finding it to be an irritant, more so than the adhesive from the steri strips.

4) I have had one bad experience and two planned wonderful cesarean births. I would not hesitate to have another planned cesarean. However at this time, I believe this is my last babe.









5) It is becoming more and more common for cesarean birth mothers to have their babies in recovery. I think the key is to ask about it and plan before hand, and go to a family friendly hospital. I had all my babies with me in recovery, and the last two I had with me immediately after entering recovery. My daughter was born at 12:46, my csection ended at 1:05 and by 1:15 she wsa in my arms. I also had her held up to me on the OR table and was able to touch and look at her, and look at her brown hair.









6) What I have done to prepare is to surround myself with supportive medical professionals that are willing to work with me, be my partner not a dictator. I also have an advocate for myself for the surgery and discuss things with them before I have a cesarean. (this is my sister) Mentally I prepare by meditating and thinking through the different scenarios in my head. I also talk to myself about the feelings and sensations I will have in the OR, so not to freak out before hand. I talk about things openly too with my husband, friends, support person and doctor -- whether it be something good or anxiety.

Hope this helps!
Kim


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Our baby was the only baby of 20 who did total rooming in while we were there.









Kim

This is sooooo sad - I can barely stand to think about it!

Here's hoping your recovery goes well. I have now reached the 4th-week mark and counting.


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## solson (Mar 2, 2003)

Can I join in? Our little one is scheduled to arrive in 5 weeks, 8/8 at 1pm.

We had a shoulder dystocia birth with our DD which resulted in her having a brachial plexus injury to her arm. While I had the option, it was STRONGLY recommended to me that we do the c/s as its the only way to assure a safe outcome for this little one.

I'm having a hard time dealing with it all. Im sad about not getting to birth vag again. Sad about recovering from surgery when I should just be enjoying my babe. Terrified about the surgery.

I'm glad I found you all.


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## Henry's_Mamma (Jan 23, 2004)

Kim ... I've been MIA so congrats on the birth of Katie Rose!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Solson: Welcome.. I am sorry your DD was injured... You have to make the choices for yourself and your baby that you feel are best.









Recovering from a c/s with an older child was a challenge for me Here is one suggestion .. line up help now.. and try to take it easy!

Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well....getting closer to an attempted VBA2C. I'm not in labour yet, but hoping it will start soon, as I don't need to deal with stressed out care providers over me being "overdue".

I'm finding the more I talk to the doctors about my VBA2C, the more I find that I have a lot of anger over my primary section that's never been resolved. The staff wheeled me into OR over my protests, cut my son from me, kept him in the nursery for five nights (I couldn't care for him anyway), loaded me with sleeping pills and painkillers when I was in no state to protest (ie. still woozy from anesthetic...didn't even know I'd had a baby!!). The nursing staff treated me like a lazy cow because I couldn't even roll myself onto my side. And, I'd never consented to the surgery in the first place!!

Now, I have to fight over every little thing and turn trying to have a vaginal birth into a warzone. Their determination to have a "happy healthy" mom and baby has left me feeling like a defective machine - I'm "healthy" except that God forbid I try to have a vaginal birth....they obviously don't think I'm so healthy, but they just keep spinning the same old tired story. I'm almost ready to scream....

As you can probably tell, I had an appointment with my doctor today, and it was all about her philosophy on managing my labour with this baby. My family physician is on holiday, so it's her relief who'll be attending, and...well, let's just say that after she talked to me today, my blood pressure was actually high for the first time ever in any of my pregnancies....


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## scoobers (Jun 24, 2005)

Hello again everybody,
Thanks so much for everyone's replies and for your kind words and concern.

Chantal,
While I still have feelings of anger and bitterness about how things went at the birth I've finally come to a place where I'm feeling more at peace about it. My husband really wanted to sue our doctor but I didn't feel that would be something that would help me emotionally. A couple months after the birth I tried to talk to my old OB GYN about it but found that I was just too fragile at the time to confront her. I'm still considering writing her a letter to let her know what a bad experience I had and possibly get some questions answered. I struggled w/PPD for about the first 6 months but I'm feeling much better.

I would love a copy of that white paper but I'm not sure how to PM (is that Private Message?)

On the Fence,
Thanks so much for your very helpful info. I have a couple of follow up questions if you don't mind. Was the bad spinal experience due to the fact that it was an emergency c-section? I.E.if it had been a non-emergency situation would they have been able to redose? It sounds like you had epidurals with the other two?

I also read a bit of your blog, congratulations on the birth of your daughter! Hope your recovery continues as well as it seems to be going now.

Storm Bride,
I'm really sorry you had such a bad c-section experience. Thanks for all your helpful replies. I'm pulling for you to be able to get the V-birth you want.

Thanks again to all!


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

I also had a spinal that didn't take and it was a planned c-section. If I do this again I will get an epidural for sure.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Today's my due date per ultrasound...another week based on LMP (my family doctor is using one, and my OB the other one). I don't care about post-dates, but I'm hoping this baby comes soon, so my doctors will chill out.

Sometimes I feel like fighting the anesthetic...they can't pretend the whole experience is benign if I'm screaming and thrashing like a crazy woman... (Obviously I'm not serious, but I do feel that way sometimes. I hate anesthetic in the first place, and surgeons can pretend they're not injuring you, because you can't feel it.)


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

If you have a spinal with a planned csection or non emergency it CANNOT be redosed. You can either suffer through it drugged out of your mind or they can knock you out. I did not have the latter option because it went to high into my chest.
The main reason I chose an epidural was the sense of control I would have and the fact that it could be redosed. I could still move my legs, etc with the epidural and could feel pressure. Some people do not want to feel pushing or pressure, but I did.

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Wanted to give all of you a brief update on me and Katie since I have been MIA.

Things are going well as far as recovery from the cesarean. I have my follow up OB appointment this afternoon. I am however sick as a dog. This is my fourth day of really suffering through it. I have a terrible ear ache and throat ache. I cough like I am about to puke up a lung.

I havent had any post partum bleeding since Saturday. My incision looks good too. I do have some burning sensation on one end of it, but this is normal for me. I've lost a considerable amount of weight. I can't wait to find out how much today. My appetite varies from hungry to not wanting to eat at all and I am drinking lots of water and the occassional juice.

My two main questions for my appt today are:
When can I have sex? (yes my drive is already back)
&
When can I take a bath? (I hate showers)

Hopefully she will give me meds for my throat and ear!


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## Heavenly (Nov 21, 2001)

Hi sorry to jump in. Here's my post from the VBAC board. Opinions?

I am 8 weeks pregnant and I cannot find a caregiver. I have had two c-sections. The first was without any labour for severe pre-eclampsia and breech and the second was after an attempted home VBAC, baby went into distress. The midwives that are 3.5 hours from me are not going to work out. The Ottawa midwives have still not contacted me. If I have to go with an OB I almost feel like I should just schedule a c-section because there is such a high chance I would end up with one anyways. That's if I can even find an OB who will take me. My chances of success are what - 60-70%? So I have a 30-40% of needing a c-section anyways. I would rather have a scheduled one than one after labour because I have done both ways and even with the pre-e the one without labour was a much easier recovery. I was so wiped after 25 hours of labour with my daughter and I had set myself up to believe I was going to VBAC and the devastation caused by failing sent me into PPD that last until she was over a year old. At least if I planned a c-section I would know in advance instead of focusing on a vaginal birth and then having the devastating failure again. And no, I can't change my mindset to not think of it as a failure - it is a failed vaginal birth and the expectations and then the letdown was just horrible. I just don't know anymore. I am not a healthy person at all. I have many medical conditions, one of which is chronic fatigue syndrome and I am very weak. I don't mean mentally, I mean that my physical body is very weak. I cannot stand or walk for too long even when not pregnant as I get tired very easily. I have many digestive problems and also a congenital bladder defect. What are my chances at a successful VBAC really? At least with a planned c-section my inlaws could arrange to be here to watch the kids (they are the only people I really trust my kids with - they live 5 hours away) and I could take a sleeping pill and get a good nights sleep beforehand. My husband will be taking 2 weeks off and by the end of that I would probably be pretty good in the recovery process. I am lucky in one things which is that I seem to recover from c-sections easily. I mean, yeah it hurts, but by 1 week I was shopping, by 2 weeks I was going out with the kids and by 4 weeks I felt pretty much back to normal. This is my last bio child so the idea of never having a vaginal birth is sad to me. Its almost like a rite of passage that I will never get to experience. But then again maybe it is an empowered birth experience I am seeking not just the vaginal aspect. In that respect a planned, controlled c-section IMO could be pretty empowering. I would be able to know how things were going to go and make my wishes known. I want my placenta so hopefully they wouldn't have a problem with that. I don't see why they would. I just don't know what to do.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi Ladies
Kim: how is it going?

Lisa: Any baby yet?







Be strong and trust yourself!!!
















Hi Heavenly!








I have had two c/s.. both were unplanned.. the first was not an emergency.. the second was nearly an emergency.. I went into my second pregnancy and labor convinced that a c/s would devastate me. I would not allow myself to "fail" yet again (yes.. I think of them as failures too) and it happened... But I have found some peace with my second c/s.. it was a beautiful labor and everyone respected the natural process.. appropriate medical intervention was used when needed.. and I do believe, deep in my heart, that it saved both my daughter's life and mine..

I have the same mixed feelings about baby #3.. when we are ready to have it.. OBs who support VBACS here are hard to come by and those who support VBA2C are nearly impossible to find.. If I wanted a VBA2c, I would need to have the baby at home.. Part of me wants to so badly.. and part of me cannot bare the thought of failure again... So..I have no answers for you.. but wanted to offer my support and understanding..









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

No baby yet - no sign of labour. My ultrasound due date was yesterday...my due date by LMP is next Thursday...

This baby is feeling really big - but it's head is down where it's supposed to be (for once!) and I'm hoping things will go well. I'm reaching the point where every little twinge of pelvic pain (like a full bladder) or small bout of the runs is being received with "maybe it's starting!" in my head. But, I really don't think anything's happening yet. I kept getting this weird feeling it would be either Wednesday (the 6th) or tomorrow...but I don't know why.

I think dd is keeping me too busy and too stressed to go into labour! She's been NUTSO the last little while...too many changes, I think. But...she kissed my belly at bedtime last night, and said "night, night, baby".


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Storm Bride-- Good luck! Youa re at the en and sound so patient. I don't know if you feel that way though









Happy birthing! I hope all goes well!


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Lisa, trust your dd she probably knows exactly what is happening and that's probably why she's acting up--I know on my due date board, there were tons of mamas with toddlers who's toddlers started acting up and mom went into labor shortly after.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

its our family: It took me years of ttc and three miscarriages to get to my second baby (my kids are just over 10 years apart). So, I guess I've been taught some degree of patience by going through all that.

I'm not antsy in the classic "I want this baby out now" way. I am hoping it comes soon, as I know my caregivers are going to start pushing to schedule a section if I'm "overdue". But, so far, I'm still healthy and feeling well, although tired. So, I try to go for at least one walk every day and find a few times where I can take 5 or 10 to relax, do some gentle stretching and meditate a little. It's keeping me from dwelling on things too much. If baby doesn't arrive today, I kind of hope it will wait until next week. My OB's much more likely to miss if it's a weekend, and I'd rather have him than the OB on call.

shannon: I'll keep that in mind. Sometimes she has me spinning in circles so badly that I could probably go into labour without noticing it!


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
its our family: It took me years of ttc and three miscarriages to get to my second baby (my kids are just over 10 years apart). So, I guess I've been taught some degree of patience by going through all that.

saw your sig. Very exciting!!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Hi All,

Checking in.

My recovery is going well. Had doctors appt yesterday and she was very pleased with how everything is healing and how remarkable I looked.








I go back Aug 5th for my six week check up and at that time will have my IUD inserted. My insurance is going to pay 100% of it too!







She said that I could not have a bath, and next week I can start having sex and driving again. Woo Hoooo!!! So I ordered a sampler pack of condoms from Condom Country until my IUD is put in.
The bad thing is, is right now I have a horrible ear infection so I am on mega amounts of medication, especially for pain. My ear has hurt me far worse than any pain associated with my last two cesarean.
In other news, I am preparing for another major Hurricane. I am really miffed at mother nature right now, I just had my house finished from Hurricane Ivan damage.

Heavenly -- I would probably go that planned csection route as you probably already knew.









Storm -- I am waiting on you to have that baby!!!


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Kim, that sucks to have an ear infection with a brand new baby. Oh and I just noticed, your Katie was born June 24, Molly was born Jan 24--must be a good date for those planned sections









I have some good news (well I think it's good news) We have finally diagnosed my pain issues that I've been having since 3 weeks after my section. It turns out I have an ovary (my left one-where the pain is) that is twisting and then untwisting repeatedly-this explains why I'm fine one minute and then almost passing out the next and then suddenly fine again a couple hours later. Anyway, it was diagnosed during a 2 hour U/S on a very high tech machine-they didn't see a twist, but they did see a spot on the fallopian tube that looked thinner and weaker--he compared it to when a garden hose kinks--if it always gets kinked at that same spot, eventually that spot on the hose will get weak. So it went undiagnosed originally because all the tests were done when the ovary wasn't twisted and it hadn't been happening long enough to damage the tube. Now, heres the kicker, we found out when I was treated at the fertility clinic for the miscarriages that I only seem to ovulate from that left ovary. He said if we knew for sure that my right ovary was functioning, he would just remove the left, but he's concerned about 2 things 1) I may not be able to have another baby if he removes and 2) If that right ovary isn't producing much in the way of hormones, he's concerned that removing the left will throw me into instant menopause which is hell.
Right now the plan is to wait and see, he said it takes a minimum of 6 mos and more often a year (especially in someone who's soft and fluffy like me) for all the internal organs to settle back in the right place and tighten up in there, he's hoping since the pain is not coming anywhere near as regularily now that eventually it will "cure" itself. So I left with instructions that if severe pain lasts longer than 4-5 hours, it's an emergency and I need to get to the hospital (and my regular OB has already agreed she'd do the operation if it becomes an emergency and we are to call her on her cell, she'll do it wether she's on call or not) and that if I do become pregnant, I will need U/S's early to ensure the implantation happened in the uterus and it didn't get stuck in that kink. Just before we try again, I'm going to have HSG done to ensure the fallopian tube still has good flow and also if it is narrower there, he's hoping that will open it up and increase our chances of a good outcome.
Really, it just feels so much better _knowing_ what's wrong and being validated that this pain is real and nasty--even if nobody could figure it out!


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## Lisa Lubner (Feb 27, 2004)

hi everyone... sorry to jump in like this, but this seemed like the place to put this. this is the story about my second birth, and i just wrote it today, 3 years after the fact.









Quote:

she was three weeks early, there was a bright bloody show instead of the normal snotty looking stuff, and the labor pains were fierce... not like the intense-but-managable contractions during adam's birth. when we broke my water at 9 cms, the first words out of my midwife's mouth were "someone call 911". i was bleeding. a lot. having been trained as a doula, and having read emergency childbirth by gregory white, i knew that meant that i either had placenta previa or a placental abruption, and that helped me to stay calm. i remember thinking "at least i don't have a cord prolapse". my midwife gave me oxygen, and when the ambulance arrived, they used the sheet i was on to carry me out of my apartment. i remember my contractions slowed down, that the bumps in the road hurt, and i remember looking at the trees out the window. all things considered, i was calm and i was doing alright.

once we made it to the hospital though, things got upsetting for me. there i was, a shy and modest muslimah, half naked and bleeding to death in front of a bunch of twenty something med students. i remember one dude was standing at the foot of my stretcher with his arms crossed and he was chewing gum. he served no purpose, he was just watching the whole ordeal. i was sure i would need a c-birth, and i was tired from such a long hard labor, and so i was asking for an epidural. they told me that they had to wait until they knew what was going on. i remember thinking "well if you would just listen to me... the baby's heartbeat is fine... i have O+ blood... just give me the damn epidural!" they wanted to put one of those stretchy elastic bands over my belly that hold the monitor in place, i said no. i asked that they not touch me during my contractions, and during the very next one the nurse i said that to started petting my arm and telling me to breathe. "WOULD YOU PLEASE STOP TOUCHING ME!" at this point, my husband asked that all non-essential men leave, and the gum guy left.

my backup doctor wasn't there, so i was attended to by dr. breast. (no, i'm not kidding) the man was huge, greasy looking, and he smelled bad. he came in and told the nurses that he wanted to do an internal EFM, and i refused. he then said something like "let me ask you this. if you don't want my help, why did you bother coming here?" my husband stuck up for me, saying something about not wanting to cause trouble, we just didn't want to screw anything into the baby's head. thankfully, the backup of our backup doctor walked in at that moment. his name was dr. borrow, and he was kind and relaxed, and he was a customer of my paper-hanging husband. he was about to have me moved to a delivery room so i could finish my labor and push the baby out, but right after he said so i started bleeding a lot... so off we went to the emergency room.

suddenly, i was surrounded by a ton of strangers. i was cold, and when i said the electric razor they were using was hurting me, i got laughed at by the nurses. a few different student nurses tried getting an IV in my arm, but they all failed miserably and i was getting really upset about being repeatedly stabbed in the arm. finally this wonderful woman with a beautiful jamaican accent came over, turned the overhead light on, and got it right on her first try. i was genuinely thankful. my husband had to leave the room, and i was about to be knocked out, since they never got around to the epidural i had been asking for. i was really scared, but through the sea of faces my midwife appeared at my side and held my hand. they put a mask over my face, and then there was darkness.

regaining conciousness was very gradual. i couldn't see anything, but i remember hearing my husband saying "it's a girl (oh good, i thought), and she's beautiful like you." then i remember pain on my hip, where the catheter tube was wedged between my hip and the bed i was on. i couldn't focus my eyes, and the only words i managed to get out were "help" and "pain". my parents were at my side, trying to get the nurses to hurry up about my pain meds. i remember being thirsty, and my dad hand-feeding me ice chips. i was really touched by that.

i don't remember the first time i laid eyes on zahra. i later learned that she had apgars of 9 and 9, that through the ordeal, she was completely fine. however, the placenta was 50% abrupted by the time they did the surgery. my iron level was SIX, and i was seriously close to needing a blood transfusion. my poor mother did an amazing job of concealing her worry when she saw how pale i was. i found out that the hospital staff had referred to my husband as "the boyfriend", and that my dad had to use his "large angry man" threat to get my pain meds for me. at one point i had to get up and walk my tired body to the nursery to get my baby because they didn't return her in fifteen minutes like they promised. when i got there, she was screaming in her bassinet while two nurses were sitting there with their feet up. there are more little things that happened to make my stay at the hospital traumatic, but i think you get the idea.

it took a few years and a successful VBAC to cure me of my post-traumatic stress disorder, and of the deep depression that it caused. during the whole ordeal, i wasn't once afraid for my baby. she had a strong heartbeat through the whole thing, and the only thing that really upset me was the treatment i received at the hospital...
thanks for reading. love and support to all the c-birth mamas.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Hi All,
I am on mega amounts of medication, especially for pain.

Kim
You taking good probiotics to prevent thrush in you and (if you are nursing)the baby? The last thing you need is a thrush infection.. Take it from someone who got milk ductal thrush.. It is no fun

Hope the hurricane misses you!

Shannon: Sorry you are in such pain!

LoveMyLittles: thanks for sharing your birth story

bbl

Chantal


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi All
Just checking in.. wondering if Lisa had her baby... and wondering how Kim fared with the hurricane

Hope you are all well!!










Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

No baby yet - my in-laws almost got caught in the hurricane on their way home to Knoxville (they were visiting his mom in Mobile). Scary stuff! I hope Kim didn't have any problems.

I think I _may_ have lost my mucous plug this morning, but I haven't anything to go by as to whether or not that's what it was (with ds, I laboured at home in the dark for the first several hours and lost the plug then...never lost it with dd). I've also been getting very mild pains that _might_ be contractions.

So...either things are starting to happen, or I'm suffering from wishful thinking. :LOL


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

SB- I hope this is it







Happy possibly birthing today


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Oh Lisa, I so hope this is it and you get the birth you want so badly-whether it's a perfect vbac or a perfect c-section.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well..nothing yet, but I'm really getting the feeling it will be soon. Before my futile attempt to conceive and my miscarriages, I trusted my judgment about these things. But, I'm afraid I've let wishful thinking lead me astray too many times. Now, I'm just _hoping_ I'm right.

I still hope to avoid a section, but I'm getting more and more to the point where I just really want to meet this little one! (And, I always wanted boys, but now I'm sort of hoping for another girl...dh and I can't pick a boy's name. :LOL )


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Hi all,

I've survived another brush with a Hurricane! Eeek! Luckily no damage. The storms tho seem to be just hurling this way lately.

Lisa, I hope this is it!!! I've been wondering the last few days if you had that baby yet!

Kim


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi All
Kim, glad you are ok!

Lisa.. hoping you are doing well!!!









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm doing well - no real labour yet, but I'm pretty sure I'm experiencing pre-labour...very mild, though. Hopefully, I'll wake up at 3am having contractions...

Due date is two days from now...and if I don't go into labour until the weekend, I won't complain. My OB is the OB on call at the hospital this weekend...


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## auntieM (Apr 14, 2004)

Sorry to worm my way in here... DD was born via c-section 01/04. She was breech & we decided that a planned c birth was the way to go. I remember there being a list posted of things that were helpful to do both before & after that were very helpful to me. I have a friend who is in the same situation I was & was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. I'd like to help ease her mind & give her information that will help her have the best possible birth & recovery. BTW, this thread was very helpful to me then.









Thanks!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi auntieM! Welcome!
If you pm me your email, I can email you a white paper written by a lady at ICAN about planning a family centered c/s. It has many helpful suggestions. I know Kim's birth plan is also great.

Lisa! Hang in there! The more early labor you have the less work later! I remember with DD I headed to the BC because of "false labor" and was sent home.. and all that week I was so miffed.. so when labor really started I was in denial until I was intransition that I was actually in labor!!!









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Lisa! Hang in there! The more early labor you have the less work later! I remember with DD I headed to the BC because of "false labor" and was sent home.. and all that week I was so miffed.. so when labor really started I was in denial until I was intransition that I was actually in labor!!!









I'm hanging in okay - just hope I'm not imagining all this. It's been about a week now that things just feel...off (my stomach's been upset, _mild_ cramps, etc.).

When I had ds, the admissions nurse wanted to send me home, because I "obviously" wasn't very far along yet. But, she went ahead and sent me to L&D for observation...I was 8cm - 10cm during contractions. You know...tv and movies always make labour look like this absolutely unmistakable thing that every woman will identify in the first 30 seconds, and it's so not like that!


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

Hi. I would also love a copy of the family centered c section, if you don't mind. Mine is planned for Sept 6th. You may have read some of my posts.


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Hanging in still Lisa??


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Hi. I would also love a copy of the family centered c section, if you don't mind. Mine is planned for Sept 6th. You may have read some of my posts.


Happy to send it.. just need your email

Lisa: How are you doing?









Chantal


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

Hi! It's mommamiagal. Maybe you have read some of my posts. I am agonizing over having a c section, and I wonder if you can somehow help me through this. How do I get over my fear? Can you tell me step by step what happens. How long are you hooked up to all of the IV's and catheter after the birth? Isn't it hard to breastfeed like that? Also, I am so sad about leaving my 2 year old for 3 days.How can I bring back some joy to this birth, I went on a hospital tour tonight and it really depressed me..now I know why I had my last two at home. Thank you. I will really appreciate it! Maria


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm still here...nothing's really changed. The doctor said yesterday that it looks as though baby's head is "beginning to engage" - I guess that means it's dropped a little bit.

I still haven't had any definite labour pains, but the mild cramps haven't gone away, so I'm optimistic...somewhat. :LOL Other than that, my only good signs are that baby and I aren't growing much now, and I've started producing a lot of mucus-y discharge (sorry if that's TMI). Fingers are crossed!

Today is my actual due date (I screwed up in my signature), and it feels weird to be at that point. I think I'm the first woman in my family to ever actually carry 40 weeks! Emma is driving me mad...can't keep up with her and she keeps tearing her diaper off, and I have to get it back on, which is hard when getting up and down has become so difficult. I'm terribly tired, and don't seem to be experiencing any of those famous "bursts of energy" (nesting) - I wonder if that's a good sign, a bad sign or totally meaningless...

I still think/hope this baby will come soon, and I kind of hope it's tomorrow, as both my doctors will be available for the hospital tomorrow. Anytime this weekend, I'll get my OB, which means if it went to section, it would be the surgeon I want - best of both worlds.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Hi! It's mommamiagal. Maybe you have read some of my posts. I am agonizing over having a c section, and I wonder if you can somehow help me through this. How do I get over my fear? Can you tell me step by step what happens. How long are you hooked up to all of the IV's and catheter after the birth? Isn't it hard to breastfeed like that? Also, I am so sad about leaving my 2 year old for 3 days.How can I bring back some joy to this birth, I went on a hospital tour tonight and it really depressed me..now I know why I had my last two at home. Thank you. I will really appreciate it! Maria


Hi Maria
There is a good white paper on the ICAN site that details a c/s step by step.. I could look it up for you if you would like..

I think the length of time you are on IVs etc really depends on the hospital and your Dr, have you discussed any of this with your OB?

I have had 2 c/s.. neither were planned... but with my second c/s, I prepared myself that it might happen and I had a list of requests ready to go.. in case.. It really helped me feel more in control of the situation and also allowed me to feel more like I was a participant rather than just a body on a table..

We requested to bring a camera into the OR and that the OB tell us when they were ready to remove my DD so my DH could take photos. I really cherish those pictures of my daughter being born.

We had asked if DH could cut the cord, however due to the situation, he was unable to do so.

My baby was worked on near my head so I could see and hear what was going on as they revived her.

My doula was able to be at the door of the OR while we were there and when DH went with DD, she was able to be a relay between him and I

I was able to hold and touch my daughter on the operating table.

These things really made a big difference to me. It also helped we had a very good birth center who was willing to grant our requests.

I had my IV from about 11pm until 8 am.. but I had my catheter for 4 days.. due to a cut bladder during surgery..That was no fun..

A recent article in the Lancet speaks of 2 ladies who had a c/s. One was planned one was not. In both cases the babies were kept with the mother and both recovered in their own rooms instead of recovery right after surgery. They were able to bond with the baby for that hour after birth in much the same way a vaginal birth mom can. They delayed the bath, ointment etc, until after this time and also the baby was then bathed etc in the room. Perhaps this is a request you can talk about with your Dr...

LMK if you want that link to the white paper on what a c/s entails..

Lisa








Have you tried any natural methods to move things along?

Chantal


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

My planned c/s was a lot like chantald described. I had the catheter in from the surgery (2pm) until the next morning around 8am. They kept my IV (and later a heplock) in a lot longer because I passed out an hour after the surgery and they wanted it there in case they needed it.

My doula was able to be my second person and take pictures during the surgery - she took pictures of everything and it was great having someone take pictures so we didn't have to worry about it.


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

Hi. Great advice everyone. Thank you everyone.
Chantal..how did they manage to cut your bladder? Was your section an emergency?Yes, send me the lonk. I would love it!
Mightymoo..Why did you happen to pass out, was everything OK , were you just exhausted or did you lose blood?
Maria


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Mightymoo..Why did you happen to pass out, was everything OK , were you just exhausted or did you lose blood?
Maria

Sorry, I should have posted an explaination! So I felt fine right after the surgery, then after an hour or so I just felt really dizzy and passed out they say for like 1-2 minutes. Apparently my heartrate was really high (like 150) and my blood pressure was low and then my heartrate dropped, causing me to pass out. I didn't lose a lot of blood during the surgery, though. (I even have a picture of the blood container - my doula was very thorough!) Obviously they were concerned about hemorrage, but I didn't show any of the signs of that. They took some blood and did a CBC (complete blood count) and found that my hematocrit (red blood cell level) was very low - 20% (normal is more like 40) - so that explained why my heartrate was so high, I had half as many blood cells so I had to pump them through faster.

The last time we did my blood count while I was pregnant, I was also very low, so I think that although I didn't lose a ton of blood, since I was low to begin with the normal amount of blood loss between birth and surgery was enough to drop me too low. Before I left the hospital, the second day after the surgery we chose to have me get two pints of blood in order to boost my levels since although I wasn't dizzy or lightheaded, I was extremely tired and it would take many weeks for my body to recover on its own (and with a baby that just seemed hard to manage). At my one month checkup we checked my blood and I was back up to 31, so I seem to be doing just fine now.


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Hi! It's mommamiagal. Maybe you have read some of my posts. I am agonizing over having a c section, and I wonder if you can somehow help me through this. How do I get over my fear? Can you tell me step by step what happens. How long are you hooked up to all of the IV's and catheter after the birth? Isn't it hard to breastfeed like that? Also, I am so sad about leaving my 2 year old for 3 days.How can I bring back some joy to this birth, I went on a hospital tour tonight and it really depressed me..now I know why I had my last two at home. Thank you. I will really appreciate it! Maria

Hi, mommamialgal. I had some of the same fears you did. I have one emergency c-section and then chose to c-birth this year rather than be at home (very far out in the mountains) or v-bac at my rather uptight hospital (I hated it so much I felt that vbac'ing there was doomed from the outset). Anyway, I was also very, very worried and sad about having to leave my 2-year-old. The day of the surgery, though, that was not on my mind - I was totally focused on the new baby coming. He did not come to the hospital the day of the birth, and I worried about that too before the fact. But the truth is, that whole afternoon was so full and action packed ... it was OK that he didn't come. He was being taken care of by his cousin (his nanny) and his grandmother at home, and by all reports he didn't even notice we (his dad and I) were gone.

They came to the hospital the next day and he was thrilled to be there, to make a completely unexpected, exciting excursion and to meet his new brother. He seemed a litle confused by the environment but not upset. Then the next day (only 2 nights in the hospital) we came home!

As to your worries about the catheter and IV: I had my catheter taken out the afternoon after the surgery. It was actually easier with it in because 1) you don't feel it at all and it doesn't get in the way of breastfeeding, and 2) once it was out, that meant I had to get up out of bed and try to use the bathroom. That was the most painful thing - getting in and out of bed the first few days.

The IV came out pretty soon too, but they did leave the hep lock in until the next afternoon for some reason. It was a little bruised and annoying, but it didn't really get in the way of anything.

The pp nurses are usually very kind. I had a GREAT experience after my 1st hospital birth. I was a little less thrilled this time, but if I had to do it over, I would definitely "fire" any nurses I didn't feel I was getting optimal care from.

Maybe you can also check out after just 2 nights, to minimize the time spent away from your 2-year-old and get back on home turf faster?


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## mightymoo (Dec 6, 2003)

I thought I would also mention that despite my passing out and blood count problems, I still checked out after only 2 days (about 48 hours). I could have stayed another day if I wanted to, but I didn't want to.

And my daughter, who was just barely 2 at the time, did just fine without me. I think having the c-section planned did really help with that - before I left for the hospital I was able to talk to her and say goodbye and prep her for our being gone for days. I think this was much easier than if I had managed to go into labor and had disappeared sometime in the night.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Lisa








Have you tried any natural methods to move things along?

Chantal

Not really...some walking and a bit of dancing/yoga (eg. hip rotation and things). I keep thinking I should try EPO, but I don't even know where to get it, and I seem to be in a coma, so it keeps slipping my mind. I may try sex again...it's a bit uncomfortable, but not really painful, and not unpleasant.

Any other suggestions?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Hi! It's mommamiagal. Maybe you have read some of my posts. I am agonizing over having a c section, and I wonder if you can somehow help me through this. How do I get over my fear? Can you tell me step by step what happens. How long are you hooked up to all of the IV's and catheter after the birth? Isn't it hard to breastfeed like that? Also, I am so sad about leaving my 2 year old for 3 days.How can I bring back some joy to this birth, I went on a hospital tour tonight and it really depressed me..now I know why I had my last two at home. Thank you. I will really appreciate it! Maria

I'm online for a short time before going out in public for the first time in 3 weeks









To help with fear I would meditate on the positive, have a plan, discuss everything with your doctor, and don't read all the bad and negative stuff out there about csections.

I had all of my csections at lunch time and had my IV and Cath removed the following morning for the past two, the first time I was hooked to all of it nearly 3 days due to complications (the csection was an emergency).

Most hospitals have family centered rooms for mothers to room in in. I think you will have mixed feelings about leaving your older child once you have your new baby. Relish in that alone time with the baby, and have your older child visit but have plenty of things to occupy them with. Also keep in mind, depending on how well you are recovering, you may not want the child there or crawling all over you. I was happy to have my children visit, but when they were gone and it was just me and the new baby I was very happy!

Most csections these days only last 15-30 minutes from incision to closure. Get good anest. and you will most likely have no to little pain. Remember though with a spinal or epidural you will feel pressure and pulling while they try to pull the baby out and when they are putting your goods back in the abdominal cavity.


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

Hello everyone,
I'll be 6 weeks pp tomorrow and have been doing fine up to now, but I've just had some strange symptoms I'd like to run by you. I was already seen by an OBGYN but (surprise, surprise) didn't learn anything from my visit.

I woke up in the night between Wednesday and Thursday with terrible pains in what felt like my uterus. It felt so tender and was so painful, it was as if I was transported back to 1 week pp and had been punched in the stomach to boot. I was feverish and was moaning and was having trouble even walking. I wasn't certain it was my uterus, though - the only other thing that hurt this bad besides labor was the impacted stool and intendant gas pains I had after ds1 was born. But this pain was a little different: longer lasting, not so much like tiny knives being inserted into my belly. It went on for about two hours without decreasing. It really did feel like my uterus.

I *have* been lifting a lot of stuff, unavoidable with a very active, 33-lb. toddler and a 13-pounder in a bucket car seat. But I've also been feeling so great these past two weeks that I thought nothing of it. I felt nearly completely healed from my surgery. I did also have some bright red discharge earlier in the evening, after about 3-4 weeks of practically no more lochia.

I felt feverish, at times like vomiting or like I might faint. DP and I simply could not decide whether we should go to the hospital or call 911 or what. I really didn't want to go because we'd had no sleep, it was 3:00AM, it would take at least 30 minutes to get there and I had two small children to worry about. Finally, I got in the bathtub, and the hot water on my abdomen seemed to make it better and also to relax me. So far, so good. But after I got out, I no longer felt hot and clammy and feverish but rather had violent chills and shivering for about another hour and a half. In bed, DP covered me with every blanket in the house and still I felt like I was freezing to death. Finally, I fell asleep.

The next day: My uterus felt very tender and sore, again like 1 week pp. No more bleeding, fever had passed. I was walking very slowly again, and it sort of hurt when I first straightened up. Today: I feel almost normal, had a little bit more bright red blood, uterus is still very slightly tender but seems to be getting better.

WHAT could this be? The OB's exam was painful because my uterus was so tender. He couldn't see or feel anything unusual in his exam. I have pretty much ruled out gas pains myself because of the lingering soreness in my uterus. If it's gone, that's great - I just don't understand what could possibly have caused such a level of pain (enough to wake me up!) out of the blue. Any ideas?


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Mellixa, I would be seriously concerned about uterine infection right now. I've had 2, one after my d&c and another after my c-section (I have rheumatoid arthritis and am on immunosuppresive drugs) Both times I was in agony--like IV demerol agony and weak and shakey. The chills and feeling feverish along with pain in that area would be my primary concerns. Keep a close eye on it as it can wreak some major havoc if it's not treated. Hopefully your body managed to get rid of everything with the discharge you had and your body is fighting it off without help.


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## gethane (Dec 30, 2003)

Shannon, that's exactly what I was going to say. I had one uterine infection after my 2nd vbac (dumb doc insisted on sticking his hand up there to check for tears) and it was the worst thing I've ever felt.

I'd say if you feel feverish again you really need to go seek medical attention.

Good luck!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Did your Dr order a blood test to check your antibody levels to rule out an infection? Can you go see him/her again or another dr in the practice and see if they can help you. I don't think those symptoms are normal at all and agree that you should keep a close eye on it...









Chantal


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
Not really...some walking and a bit of dancing/yoga (eg. hip rotation and things). I keep thinking I should try EPO, but I don't even know where to get it, and I seem to be in a coma, so it keeps slipping my mind. I may try sex again...it's a bit uncomfortable, but not really painful, and not unpleasant.

Any other suggestions?

Hey Lisa
How are you feeling today? EPO needs to be started at around 37 weeks to really be effective.. so I'd not worry about starting it now. I'd keep doing what you are doing.. and keep enlisting your DH..
















Chantal


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Hi. Great advice everyone. Thank you everyone.
Chantal..how did they manage to cut your bladder? Was your section an emergency?Yes, send me the lonk. I would love it!
Mightymoo..Why did you happen to pass out, was everything OK , were you just exhausted or did you lose blood?
Maria


Hi Maria
Yes.. my c/s was more of an emergency than I would have liked... my birth story is here
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=238119

A nicked or cut bladder is a common complication to a c/s.. or so I am told








I'll look for that link for you..

Chantal


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Yes, send me the lonk. I would love it!

Maria


Here is the URL to their white paper section. It is the 4th topic down.. it is in PDF format..

http://www.ican-online.org/resources...pers/index.php


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

Ladies, thanks for your replies. I certainly hope what I have (had??) is not a uterine infection. Sounds very nasty and painful.

The OB who saw me did have blood and urine run. No problem there. I have had no more truly worrisome symptoms. My uterus feels much better, I am moving normally, etc. The only thing is that there is still some red flow - is it possible I have my period back already?!? At six weeks? (The first time around, it was 8 months.) No cramping, not even mild. I am a bit perplexed. Or could this be my body working out the infection on its own? My only other symptom is a slight stomach ache I've had off and on for several days. But maybe I've just not been drinking enough water?

The doc also set me up to get a vaginal ultrasound. He'd hoped it would be done that afternoon or at the latest on Friday, but they couldn't fit me in until next Wednesday. If I feel completely well by then, I'm not going (the very idea has me feeling worse, especially since I don't know quite what it entails, how big the u/s wand is, if the tech is male or female and have so long to mull over it ... so imagining the unknown has me almost more worried than my symtoms).

Lisa, good luck to you ... I hope that baby decides to make a show of it soon.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

I had pp discharge for 8 weeks.. it went away for a week around 6 weeks and then returned... I then got my period at 9 weeks... So, perhaps yuo did too much.. I have heard that red flow indicates you need to slow down









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Hey Lisa
How are you feeling today? EPO needs to be started at around 37 weeks to really be effective.. so I'd not worry about starting it now. I'd keep doing what you are doing.. and keep enlisting your DH..
















Chantal

I'm doing okay, but had a bad night last night. Going past due date is _extremely_ rare in my family, and because of the u/s date being a week earlier, the feeling that I'm really late is persisting, even though I know it's not true. It feels as though everyone in my family is asking me every ten minutes if the baby's here yet (and I feel like saying "oh, yeah - I just hadn't got around to telling anyone yet"), and that's making me feel even more pressured...

So, last night, I didn't sleep much...just kept getting this feeling that this baby isn't going to come out on its own, and I'm destined to have all my babies by c-section. DH and I are moving in the first week of August, and I just kept having thoughts about trying to deal with both little ones and a move while recuperating....made me wonder if I should just give up and schedule right now, so I have more time to recover. This is soooo not like me to just want to give up. Anyway, since 2:30 this morning, I've had four crying jags for no apparent reason. I'm hoping the weepiness is a sign that my hormone levels are changing in preparation for labour...does that sound far fetched?

Aside from my emotional state, everything's about the same...occasional mild cramps, mostly in the evening - and everything else is staying the same...

melixxa: I hope this all clears up for you. If it makes you feel any better, I've had vaginal ultrasounds a couple times (post-miscarriage) and they're not that bad. My tech both times was female, but she basically gave me the wand (she said it was like a big tampon, but honestly looked to me like a dildo) and asked me to insert it myself. Then, she just held the end of it while I was still covered with the sheet. It's kind of weird, but certainly nothing compared to a standard vaginal exam or pap smear.


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## auntieM (Apr 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *melixxa*
The only thing is that there is still some red flow - is it possible I have my period back already?!? At six weeks? (The first time around, it was 8 months.)

I had a 6 week pp period & didn't have another while I was nursing dd. I understand it's fairly normal to have af at 6 wks pp. HTH!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Lisa many







for you!!! It can be so hard to deal with the pressure from others about "is the baby here yet" and also the worry about your body "working" I know all those pressures so well! There are a lot of stresses for you right now.. try to relax, do some yoga and trust yourself









Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Hi Maria
Yes.. my c/s was more of an emergency than I would have liked... my birth story is here
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=238119

A nicked or cut bladder is a common complication to a c/s.. or so I am told








I'll look for that link for you..

Chantal

Having a nicked blader is not common, its a risk with any abodminal surgery from what I have read (csection, hysterectomy, bowels), especially in an emergency. The reason it is likely to happen in emergent situations, rather than planned csections is that the bladder has not been fully drained. and the patient has not refrained from fluids prior to surgery. Also, one of the problems can be if the uterus is tilted.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Having a nicked blader is not common, its a risk with any abodminal surgery from what I have read (csection, hysterectomy, bowels), especially in an emergency. The reason it is likely to happen in emergent situations, rather than planned csections is that the bladder has not been fully drained.

How long does it take a catheter to drain the bladder? They had the catheter in me as quickly (or more quickly) than they had my IV in when I had ds. No nicks, fortunately.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Thanks, chantal. I haven't spent the last four months convincing all the doctors that I'm crazy just to give up now. But, sometimes I'm tempted...

No more weepiness at least. I hope I sleep tonight - and that I'm up for at least 15 minutes tomorrow before anybody asks me if I've had the baby yet!!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

tilted uterus.. yup.. that is me... It was fun... not....

Lisa.. can you screen you calls and put a message on the machine that says something like "Hi.. no still pregnant.. leave a message" and then just dont' answer the phone!

Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Nope - I'm living at my mom's right now, and we have two different numbers on the same phone. So, calls to _her_ number go to the same answering machine.

Besides, two of these people live here...my mom and a woman who lives upstairs. They just can't seem to come into the same room as me without making some comment. And, my sister's having trouble with her husband, and I think she calls to ask about the baby as an excuse to rant about him...


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## Heavenly (Nov 21, 2001)

Hi all. Well I'm here for the long haul. I've decided to go with a repeat c-section and I feel so relieved now that the decision has been made. I have to go to bed now but just wanted to pop in. I am due February 17 but hope to schedule for February 10 (a friday) if thats possible.

BTW is there any way we could start a July thread? This is the June one and its getting really long.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

I'm going to start a new thread for August since we are mid month already! But congrats on your decision and we are here to support you for the long haul!


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Shawna, you should have seen the last one!!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hi All
Popping in to say HI! and check on Lisa..







for you! How are you hanging in there?

Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Hi Chantal.

I guess I'm hanging in more or less...still no sign that this baby is going to come out. My OB is scheduling me for a section on the 26th, if baby isn't here yet...I'll be 12 days post-date. I agreed while at his office, but I think I may call back and cancel it, as I'm not coping well. I spent about an hour in the middle of the night crying downstairs (so I wouldn't wake up dh and dd)...and never did get back to sleep. DD has only been up for 15 minutes, and I'm already too exhausted to deal with her. I don't see how I can keep this up for another week knowing I have a section hanging over my head.

If I end up sectioned that late, I know I'm going to be in bad shape. I'll have cost ds most of his summer vacation beause of needing his help with dd. And, I'll be moving only two weeks after my surgery. I'm starting to think I should have just gone along with the stupid surgery two weeks ago - except that baby's still not here, so I just don't buy that he/she was ready to arrive then.

I'm a mess today.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Oh Lisa! Many many hugs for you!!!!! I wish I was thre to give you a hug in real life! I wish there was something that I could say that would make you feel better... but I know that there isn't.. Please don't be hard on yourself.. The last few weeks are so stressful when you are waiting for baby anyway... pile on top of that the pressures you are feeling and the upcoming move.. no wonder you are stressed out and teary. Please try to focus on the wonderful joy that will happen soon.. the meeting of your dear baby to be.








Chantal


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

SB-- I'm sorry you are having such a bad time of this. I can understand the looming c/b feeling. I can understand the fear of moving 2 weeks post c/b. I'm not sure what to say except I've been thinking of you and praying/hoping the next time I see a post is a birth announcement.

Please try and relax at least a little.


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

Well, I've done it...I told my husband I am having another c/s. When I told him I felt it was what I needed to do for the saftey of baby and me, he was so supportive. He made me feel very comfortable in my decision. And I feel so good having made the decision, I'm about 35 weeks, so I certainly took my time. There was alot to think about...and I'm very happy to be able to just concentrate on making it a beautifull and comfortable experiance.
When I told my husband that something was telling me not to VBAC, he then confesd he to has had a very bad feeling about it. anyways...I'm having my baby on Aug 23...hurray!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

chantal & megan: Thanks muchly. This has definitely been a tough couple of days. I'm soooo looking forward to getting into our own place (we've been living with my parents for a couple years - first we were helping them out, then they were helping us out). One of the stressful things about this pregnancy has been that I'm not in my own space. So, I'm not upset that I'm moving so soon after the baby comes - but I'm definitely freaked about doing it so soon after a c-section! DH has only had his job for a little under two months, so he really can't take much time off over all of this...I'm afraid the load tends to fall on my 12-year-old and somewhat on my mom (who just cracked her rib).

The last few days have also been hot, which I'm sure you both know is no fun when you're pregnant! But, today is cooler, and I'm trying to get myself settled a bit again. I definitely need to get more sleep than I have been the last few nights. And, I'm trying to come to terms with a c-section, while still hoping, hoping, hoping for my VBA2C...it's kind of hard to juggle the two emotions. :LOL

Iriemama: I'm glad you've reached a decision you're okay with. I think it's important to trust your gut.


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

You know...it was easy to make the decision when I stoped rationalizing everything and just did what I felt was right. I would love a VBAC, but I just know that it's not the right decision in my situation.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Iriemama96*
Well, I've done it...I told my husband I am having another c/s. When I told him I felt it was what I needed to do for the saftey of baby and me, he was so supportive. He made me feel very comfortable in my decision. And I feel so good having made the decision, I'm about 35 weeks, so I certainly took my time. There was alot to think about...and I'm very happy to be able to just concentrate on making it a beautifull and comfortable experiance.
When I told my husband that something was telling me not to VBAC, he then confesd he to has had a very bad feeling about it. anyways...I'm having my baby on Aug 23...hurray!









I am so glad you told your DH and that both of you are now planning on a wonderful experience!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Lisa,
I am sorry you are at such a difficult moment right now. Hoping and praying that everything works out the way it is supposed too.

Kim


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## melixxa (May 20, 2003)

nak

lisa, thinking of you and hoping your wait is soon over! i am a bit miserable sometimes bf'ing in the heat and caring for a newborn + active toddler - i feel for you still being pregnant!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm better today. I only had one pair of shorts I could wear pregnant, and they tore. Then, I couldnt' find my lightweight sweatpants and spent two days in pants that were WAY too heavy for the heat. But, I found the light ones this morning, so I'm not quite as overheated.

Now, I just need to walk and relax...not at the same time. :LOL


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Is it really weird that I found my scheduled section (without labour) to far more traumatic and harder to recover from than my emergency section (after 20 hours labour)? I seem to be a minority of one in this...other accounts all seem to find the planned sections to be a better experience, and I just found it hellish and weird and...freaky. Everything in me just screamed "this is not how to have a baby".


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## matts_mamamama (Mar 19, 2004)

I don't think it's weird - I think that you weren't at peace with the decision and that you didn't feel it was the best way for you to have a baby; when you labored you went through it as much as you could and having a section had to happen. Either way is not wrong, it's just how YOU FEEL about it, ya know? I think you could have 50 babies via c-section and every one of them could be traumatic to you if that's not how you feel it's how to have a baby.

Hope that made sense, I'm working on 3 hours of sleep and a toddler with an ear infection...


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

That made perfect sense to me. I just don't feel right about c-sections...and I think the whole planned thing upset me more than I'd realized, as well. I've always felt that a baby coming _should_ be an unpredictable, "it happens when it happens" kind of thing. Setting the date ahead of time (and not ever labouring at all) just felt all wrong...not "the way it's supposed to be". And, honestly - my recovery was longer and worse, which seems a bit unusual based on other accounts I've read.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Anyone heard from Storm Bride?? I haven't noticed any posting from her so I'm starting to get excited for her....


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm still here...been doing a lot of housework today...maybe it's "nesting". My stomasch's a mess todasy, and I'm actually glad of it - hoping it's an early labour thing.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

oooo... I hope so!


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

Hooray for babies! No matter how they get here! I am personally feeling very excited about my CS. It is a little weird knowing when baby is coming...I'm not telling anyone though! Haven't even told my hubby yet. I know he wishes it could be a suprise.
The closer I get though, the more freaked out about the surgery and recovery I become. Last time it was an emergency, so I did what I had to do. I didn't have a chance to be freaked out about it. Now the "what if's" are setting in.
Very excited though, just four short weeks untill baby!!! So much to do!!







:



































ahhhh!


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## mariag (Feb 21, 2004)

HI...hope you all don't mind me jumping in. My sister in law had an emergency c-section a couple days ago and I would like to send her something (she is in another state) as I know it is a hard process and recovery as well...I was hoping you all might have some suggestions for me....

Thanks so much,
Maria


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Honestly, it might sound weird...but I'd send a fruit basket or something. I found it really hard finding the time and energy to eat. I know that's true with a newborn under any conditions, but not being able to stand at the stove or counter for any length of time definitely doesn't help...

If I think of anything else, I'll post again, but that was the first thought that popped into my head.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Yes.. some type of meals.. or even go in with others and hire help... like a post partum doula.. I know that I would have loved those things..
I wish your sister fast healing, both physically and emotionally..

Lisa... hang in there!!









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Doing okay, chantal. I had a non-stress test today, and it seemed to go okay, although I think baby was asleep - I was almost asleep.

I was awake for several hours last night, and thought it was anxiety, but I'm thinking it _might_ have been hormonal. I had blood-tinged discharge this morning, and I'm kind of queasy, and I feel generally crampy, _and_ I have a backache. So many false alarms that I'm afraid to believe it, but it seems as though labour might actually be getting started.

Both my others came on Fridays - think that means anything?


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

When My friend had her baby, we all got together and signed up for a night of bringing them dinner. And it was wonderfull! For a week and a half someone would bring them there dinnner so they did not have to spend the time cooking, and could just enjoy there baby.


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## mariag (Feb 21, 2004)

Thanks for the ideas...I'll start checking online to see if there is a local place I can have make a basket of some sort, or maybe even deliver dinner a couple times...

Good luck to you all

Maria


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hope so Lisa!!!









Chantal


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

SB-- I hope you are laboring!!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Well...even more blood-tinged stuff last night. I am having contractions, but I haven't been able to pin down how far apart they are, and they're _really_ mild. This baby and I are taking our time in getting things happening. Maybe this means that this baby will be a little more calm than my other two. :LOL


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

A calm babe would be good


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm not sure if it's calm, or just comfortable. But, it doesn't seem to want to leave its current residence. I cannot believe how big I've become...


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

:LOL I can imagine!!

So, is your huby as patient as you or has he noticed? My hubby would be like....what, you are due when??


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

My hubby was a 42.5 week baby himself. So, he's actually been the one helping me keep cool and not get freaked out. I never ever thought I'd go past my due date, and the paranoia about post-dates in the obstetrical community has added stress. James just keeps reminding me that there's no reason I should have expected to be early and that he was late and a very healthy baby. He's been a rock...except much cuddlier.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Wow! What a hubby! He sounds completly sweet! I'm glad you have such a support system through him.


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

This may seem like an incredibly vain question but, when anyone went in for their c section did you get ready like you were going out for the day, regarding hair and makeup? This will be my first one, and with my natural births I never bothered with hair and makeup because of all the sweating and showering and everything involved with the labor part. Plus I was always able to do the shower and hair thing right afterwards for visitors.

How soon are you able to get up and shower and use the bath room, maybe check the mirror before visitors start coming in. Is standing really that hard after the c section?
Any other hospital advice or suggestions would be great!


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## aisraeltax (Jul 2, 2005)

why would you NOT try to look your best? i mean, if you don't care (which i don't know if i will or not but i think i probably will), then dont worry about it. I have pix of both my sons and look like crap! if i could at least look good for this one that will be at least one good advantage to having to go through this csection (# 3).
do whatever you want and don't feel vain!


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

With my planned c/b I just got ready like I did any other morning. I don't look bad in the photos either.

Standing after a c/b...standing isn't the problem. it is standing straight. All of those muscles have been cut and stitched back together. You have to stretch those muscles out to be able to stand straight. Best advice..... never stand bent. Force yourself straight. It is easier for the long run.

As for checking a mirror you should be able to as soon as you want....with a hand held.

Shower is normally 24 hours. It depends on how long you leave in the epi or if you have a spinal. Our hospital had a requirement of 8 hours with epidural. As soon as I could feel my legs I was up and about. I may have showered that first day but I doubt it.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I actually poured sweat after my planned section...not sure if it was from the anesthetic or what, but it was worse than after my emergency one (with 20 hours of labour). I felt absolutely gross.

I don't think I'm supposed to wear makeup if I go for the surgery, but I'd have to check the sheet again. I don't do anything with my hair except brush it and I haven't worn makeup more than once or twice in the last couple of years, so that stuff doesn't really apply to me.

Standing up straight is very hard at first. I couldn't do it for more than a few seconds for the first few days after each section. I can't even begin to imagine standing up long enough to check my hair or makeup in a mirror. But, other women here have managed better - I think it really depends on the individual. I took my first shower the day after surgery, because that's when they took out my catheter and IV. (With my emergency section, it was about four days before I was able to shower.)

If you don't break out in the sweats like I did, there's no reason at all that you couldn't check on your hair and makeup in a hand mirror as soon as you want to. I'd guess you wouldn't want to bother with it until the anesthetic wears off, but that might just be me.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
This may seem like an incredibly vain question but, when anyone went in for their c section did you get ready like you were going out for the day, regarding hair and makeup? This will be my first one, and with my natural births I never bothered with hair and makeup because of all the sweating and showering and everything involved with the labor part. Plus I was always able to do the shower and hair thing right afterwards for visitors.

How soon are you able to get up and shower and use the bath room, maybe check the mirror before visitors start coming in. Is standing really that hard after the c section?
Any other hospital advice or suggestions would be great!

The csection I had a month ago, well the day before I had a spa day and had my hair colored.







That night I did a nice mineral bath with eye pads and body scrub, shaved my legs, etc. The next morning, I fixed my hair and put on makeup. I had a spritz that you can spray on to freshen your makeup up and I used it once I got to my room. All my friends remarked how good I looked!









I had my epidural removed the next morning and was up in an hour using the bathroom and showering. I was stiff but not in pain. However this was my third csection and I knew what to expect. I think that is key, knowing what to expect.


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

Cesarean Goddess......You make it sound so easy. How long did you take the meds? Motrin or Tylenol? How long did you stay in the hospital, if I remember correctly you said 48 hours.
Did you have any problems leaving your littliest one home?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Cesarean Goddess......You make it sound so easy. How long did you take the meds? Motrin or Tylenol? How long did you stay in the hospital, if I remember correctly you said 48 hours.
Did you have any problems leaving your littliest one home?

First, I don't want it to sound too easy. My first csection was hell to recover from, in fact death would have been good relief. But it was an emergency, and I had fully planned a natural birth. I also had a version --which I would never recommend ever.

As for the last two csections, I think they were fairly easy. A good part of preparing was mentally. I wanted a good outcome, I meditated and prayed for those outcomes, plus had good care providers working to create a wonderful birth for me. I truly believe that mind over matter is in my favor and can be for others. If you believe you can have a postive, wonderful cesarean birth -- you will. If you focus your energy towards the goal of a healthy baby and healthy birth, then you can make decisions and overcome hurdles easier than when things are just thrown at you and you have that idea that its going to be awful.
I took PLAIN demerol for the first three days after my epidural was removed. I took this ever 4 hours to start along with taking 800mg of Motrin every 6-8 hours. I took the Motrin longer and had it refilled. I have half a bottle left, as I have used it as needed and before outings for just in case. Sometimes I go days without taking a Motrin, but if I do too much, I may have discomfort so I take one. I am not going to "tough it out" when I have safe available meds.
For my last two csections I was out of the hospital at 48hours (or less). I obeyed the rules and met my doctors requirement for leaving the hospital. I also was eating and drinking and walking to build strength. I asked for help when I needed it, and sometimes when I didn't. I made it clear to my daytime nurses that I really wanted to leave in 48hrs. I also had stitches for my outside incision, which I think helped me immensely. (I felt better held together in my incision area)
As for my youngest child. I did hate leaving him, but at the same time I wanted to spend some alone time with this new baby. The kids, all of them, came to the hospital to visit after Katie was born. I loved seeing all of them, especially the youngest one. I had trusted childcare, which I think was important and Jack had two other siblings to entertain him. I was happy to be at home when I got there, but I did love the time we had alone with the new baby, even though it wasnt a lot of time. It was nice just to focus on her.


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

Cesarean Goddess..What is a version?


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
Cesarean Goddess..What is a version?

It is when a doctor or midwife try to manually turn a breech baby to the vertex position. I never recommend them. Ever. I believe they are dangerous, and had I known what I know now I would have just opted for a csection, but I was greedy and selfish and wanted a vaginal birth (pretty much at any cost). The version not only failed, it crapped me and my baby out. She was also bruised and pooped meconium and I had a nightmare surgery where my spinal didnt work. I was in the OR nearly 75min. (notice my last csection was 20 minutes from cut to close) I have no choice but to have csections due to a mullerian anomaly, that is why I have read so much about csections and talked to so many people about them.


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## mommamiagal (Jan 6, 2003)

MY Ob uses spinal -duramorph for her c sections. Why wouldn't a spinal take? I know they can'tr be redosed. Does the epidural stay in your back the whole time with an iv in your hand or back?

You are a cesarean goddess, Thanks for all your advice.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

No VBA2C for me.
My OB told me that he'll withdraw from my case if I try to push this any further. He's already gone over the post-date guidelines being used around here, and can't in good conscience continue any further.

So, I'm going in for section number 3 at 9:00 tomorrow morning. I don't know if I'll post before I leave, because I have to be there at 8:00, and that doesn't leave me a lot of time for getting going...

I really can't believe it...labour's been hovering for days, but it just won't get going...


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

Goodness SB







for you! That is unfortunate that you cannot have your VBAC2, but, on the brite side, you get to meet your baby tomorrow morning! How exciting! I am getting very impatient myself








Well much love to ya momma, and I'm sendin' you some good vibes for a beautifull birth and speedy recovery


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

SB-- I am so sorry. You have been so strong through this and I know you are saddened by this. I pray that all goes well tomorrow!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm trying to look on the bright side...my stubborness did pay off in two ways. First, I have had signs of early labour, so hopefully I won't have the delay with my milk that I had with dd. And, second - they wanted to do this section on July 4th - three weeks ago. Since baby still isn't quite ready to arrive, three weeks ago was too early, so I bought him/her a bit of time.

And, I am looking forward to meeting my peanut...he/she has taken a lot longer to get here than we were expecting!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Lisa
Many many







for you!! You are SO STRONG! You did what you thought was best and bought time for this baby to grow and get ready to be born! You should feel really proud of yourself!!!! Have a lovely birthing day and check in when you can. We all cannot wait to meet your new little one!!









Chantal


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Life is getting interesting. I've had three strong contractions in the last 45 minutes or so, and I'm starting to get "bloody show". This is starting to look like a race... :LOL


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## gethane (Dec 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
Life is getting interesting. I've had three strong contractions in the last 45 minutes or so, and I'm starting to get "bloody show". This is starting to look like a race... :LOL

Well hoping you get whichever result you want







. Don't suppose you could oversleep tomorrow if it looks like you need just a few more hours.


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Go Storm Baby!!!!! Do you think if you go in in labor he'll give you some time to see how you progress????

Lisa, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this is a happy and healing birth for you--no matter how that baby comes out. I'll also second what everyone else has been saying, you've been so strong and far more patient than I could have ever been. I so hope you have a good day tomorrow--and remember, we're all going to be here rooting for you--you have the power of all of us!!


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shannon0218*
Go Storm Baby!!!!! Do you think if you go in in labor he'll give you some time to see how you progress????

If labour's well established when I go in tomorrow (eg. regular contractions, etc.), I'm prepared to be moderately belligerent. I know my OB is genuinely concerned, and my family physician even more so. But, if I'm actually _in labour_, I'm not going to be easily swayed by arguments about how many weeks along I am!!

I think this is going to be at least somewhat healing, no matter what. Although today has left me feeling powerless, I've felt far less like I'm being pushed around than I have in the past. And, a nice snuggle with dd this morning reminded me that I do have two really wonderful children.

Plus, my mom's cousin called tonight to update the family...her daughter (my second cousin, I guess) was expecting twins in June. She had them in April...and only one of them came home. The surviving twin didn't get home until June...two months in hospital...birth weight was 2lb., 11oz. This tells me that I complain too much...


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride*
This tells me that I complain too much...


No you don't. At least no more than any other pregnant woman...actually maybe less.


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## Ligmom (Nov 24, 2001)

Lisa,
Sending you peaceful birthing vibes









Hope your birth (no matter which kind







) is a beautiful event for you. Can't wait to hear your update


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

SB-- I've been thinking about you all morning. I hope all is well!


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Lisa, I am sending all the postive vibes I can for you!

Kim


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mommamiagal*
MY Ob uses spinal -duramorph for her c sections. Why wouldn't a spinal take? I know they can'tr be redosed. Does the epidural stay in your back the whole time with an iv in your hand or back?

You are a cesarean goddess, Thanks for all your advice.

Mine didnt take properly, varying things can happen, like just insertion on whether or not they work properly. I am not the only one here who has had a spinal fail. The epidural cath stays in your back and can be redosed, you can also keep it in up to 24hrs for pain management -- this is what I do so I do not have to take meds that affect my mind or make me sleepy.

Kim


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

Can you VBAC with a posterior baby??


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Iriemama96*
Can you VBAC with a posterior baby??

I wouldn't if I had never labored before or in a hospital. I would be more likely to try with a midwife who could help with optimal positioning to spin the baby. From what I have read posterior babies can often slow labor and cause pretty bad back labor, also long pushing stages.


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

I labored for about 24hrs with #1. But, I may have polyhydraminos as well, so it's not really an option. Just curious.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
I wouldn't if I had never labored before or in a hospital. I would be more likely to try with a midwife who could help with optimal positioning to spin the baby. From what I have read posterior babies can often slow labor and cause pretty bad back labor, also long pushing stages.


BTDT both times.. and ended with a c/s both times.. I'd make sure my MW knew how to handle posterior babies and focus on turning them WELL before labor.. I did that the second time.. but I seem to make posterior babies.. and she was malpresenting in other ways that it was impossible for her to get out.. oh well..

The book, Optimal Feotal positioning would be a good resource, perhaps hiring a knowledgeable doula and also taking a Spinning Babies course? If I were to do it again.. I'd make sure I did all 3 of those..

Lisa: hope that all went well.. no matter what..









Chantal


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## rachelr2 (Jul 18, 2005)

Hi all,

I am looking for data, advice and reassurance from anyone on having a cesarean requiring a vertical incision. Becasue of a fetal abnormality requiring a larger incision, we have no choice and I am really scared of the whole thing. Can anyone help me?

Our baby boy has a very strange abnormality not see before by the fetal-maternal community in Boston. He has what is called a lymphangeoma - a fluid-filled distension under his right arm. It is not a separate growth, but is under his skin. He is 27 weeks at this point and already the width of the distension is 4.75cm. It is between 2/3 and 3/4 the size of this entire abdominal cavity! Like you or I holding a basketball under our arm. He is doing great otherwise (strong heart and system, no concerns about a chromosomal problem) but will require surgery at some point. What the "team" says is that they will have to drain as much fluid as possible by needle before prepping me for the csection. They hope to drain enough to help make the delivery easier on him and me. They have already said they expect this to be difficult. I asked about the repairs and they said they will sew it up in 3 layers. They plan to give a spinal for this (I asked about epidural and they said they prefer the spinal in this case???). I just need reassurance that I am going to be okay at this point. They keep saying how HE will be okay, but what about me? Won't we BOTH be okay? Scary. Any other suggestions or questions we should be asking?


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

What a very scary thing to have to go through. I'm sure you will be fine though, I mean the only thing different than a normal C/S is the incision. And they used to use that incision primarily, so it can't be all that bad.
And thats wonderfull that they are so sure about your babys health. I hope you have alot of support from family/friends. A coplicated pregnancy/birth can be so very stressfull.


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## Khadijah (Jul 19, 2005)

I just wanted to tell you mother to mother. That if you have to have a c-section you will be fine. I had two one in 97 and one in05.Altho with this last one i had a slight infection because when the took the staples out it one did not heal good. It was caught and by the grace of god I got meds and the infection cleared up and my incision healed great. It will be ok.
I will keep you in my prayers.


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## rachelr2 (Jul 18, 2005)

Thank you both. We haven't told many people yet so we don't have a great support network in place. I just need to keep hearing from people who have had tough cesareans and have been okay and their babies have been okay. I just found this out yesterday so emotionally I am still freaked out, I'm sure with time I will feel better. Thanks for your responses and prayers!

rachel


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## egoldber (Nov 18, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rachelr2*
I am looking for data, advice and reassurance from anyone on having a cesarean requiring a vertical incision. Becasue of a fetal abnormality requiring a larger incision, we have no choice and I am really scared of the whole thing. Can anyone help me?

I had an emergency C section in April due to a UR with what was essentially a vertical incision. My previous C section scar ruptured and I also ruptured vertically. Honestly, I noticed no difference in my healing between this surgery and my previous C section. I was up and out of bed and walking (slowly) the next day. I had general anesthesia this time and the epidural I had the first time was much, much preferable. But I had no catheter, no IV, had eaten real food and showered within 24 hours of the surgery. Part of this was because my baby was in the NICU, so if I wanted to see her, I had to get out of bed, so the staff was extemely accommodating to me. But I would insist on being up and about as soon as you can.

Also, be sure to take your pain meds as needed. You don't want to get behind on the pain and be chasing it. I spent a miserable second night because I slept through my 2 am pain med dose. I told the nurse the next day to please come and wake me up for the middle of the night dose and she did and that helped tremendously. I did notice that I needed pain meds after I went home longer this time than I did the first time. With my previous CS, I did not need a refill of the Percocet I was discharged with. This time I needed 1 refill, but was off them by about 10 days post surgery. But I was also MUCH more active this time post surgery, again because my little girl was in the NICU and I had to be up and about and walking in order to see her. I think I over did things a bit, but I really didn't have any choice. Definitely take things easy. Be active, but don't overdo it.

If your little one spends time in the NICU (and it sounds like perhaps he might), you may want to consider a plan for how to manage that. Our hospital's NICU is HUGE (largest in the Washington DC metro area) and DH had to run around and make sure I had a wheelchair available for me to use when we were with her (which was about 20 hours a day out of 24). This was more difficult after I had been discharged, but my baby was still in the hospital. Definitely stay as long as possible in the hospital to make it easier to visit your baby in the NICU. The OB offered to discharge me at day 3, but I declined and stayed the full 96 hours because it made it much easier for me to visit her when I was in the same place. The NICU she was in also had fold out beds so that you could sleep in the NICU with your baby if you wanted.

One thing to think about is that if you want to VBAC in the future, a vertical scar is more likely to rupture than the more typical low transverse incision. So it may be almost impossible to find an OB who would take you on as a VBAC candidate, if that is something that might interest you. The rupture stats I have seen for classical C section scars tend to be around 4%. I know that my OB (who is extremely VBAC friendly) wants to do a planned C section prior to labor when and if we are lucky enough to be pregnant again.

Good luck.


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Great info Beth, thanks for joining us.

Rachel, about the anest situation. I would ask questions about how long your doctors typical csections last and how long they expect yours to last. A spinal is a deeper block, but wears off much faster than an epidural. While your doctor may prefer to operate with a spinal, there is no reason they can't do an epidural on you if you are concerned about the length of surgery or would like continunous pain relief after surgery that you can get with an epidural. Duramorph in the spinal though is a good way to go if you do get the spinal. Some of us here have had both and there are varying opinions on which is best.

Also, know that your baby and you can have a good experience even with a csection. I've done it twice after a horrific experience. I personally believe planning is key.

When are you due? Will they want to take the baby at a certain gestational age?

Kim


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## greenmansions (Feb 16, 2005)

Hi mamas,
I recently went for my first OB visit for my second baby. I had DS via c/s on the 4th day of labor, nonprogressing for 3 days in spite of frequent (5-15 min apart) contractions the whole time, then they gave me pitocin. During 2 hours of pushing they determined I had developed preeclampsia, so they "shut me down" and did a c-section about 1-2 hours later.

DS was malpositioned, head tipped back instead of tucked. But while on the operating table waiting for some blood test to come back I really felt the urge to poop/push so I think he might have been ready at that point. When he was delivered, he had a huge red ring on his forehead from being lodged in the pelvis and they actually had a little difficulty getting him out.

My epidural did not take well during the section and so they put me under. I had the shakes badly for about 4 days, including days 3 and 4 of labor and then the first 2 days after.

My OB is recommending a scheduled c/s at 39 weeks for several reasons, and would like to hear opinions about this from you all. I am older, will be 42 when baby #2 arrives. She says that my labor will likely be as long and hard the second time around. I also have about 70% risk of getting pre-e again. We also have had numerous miscarriages, so she prefers to be more cautious than she would be with a younger mom who had had no problems.

She would allow me to try a VBAC if labor started on its own, but is concerned that I would just end up with a c/s again. They won't use pitocin this time.

It took me 2 months to feel normal again after DS c/s due to the preeclampsia swelling, and I had some kind of weird gallbladder thing happen where I had lovely bright yellow diarrhea (sorry tmi) for about 5 weeks too. I also had a lot of trouble w/ bf in part due to the pre-e meds, and ended up pumping.

I guess I'm wondering about likelihood of ending up with general anesthesia again, getting such bad shakes again, about ability to bf (nurse, not pump) successfully, thoughts about scheduling early vs. attempting VBAC first.

This will be our last child, if that matters.

Sorry for such a long post - I am only recently beginning to process all that happened now that we're pg again. Thanks for any thoughts on all this.


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## LaughingHyena (May 4, 2004)

I had my c/s nearly a year ago now. I had placenta previa and fibroids and had been in and out of hospital with heavy bleeding four the previous 6 weeks

The recovery wasn't as bad as I though it might be, I was able to walk short distances on the second day although I found it difficult to lay down until about day 4. Mostly I was worried that I would't be able to get up again. Ferinatly keep up woth the pain meds, there were a few times that I didn't and I regretted it.I came home after 4 days although DD was in NICU for another couple of weeks. For me it was better to come home, we live quite close to the hospital so were able to visit several easily and I found it upsetting to be around the other mums with babys and to be woken by them in the night. It was a difficult descision though and very strange to come home without her.

If you think there is a good chance of your baby needing to go to NICU I would highly recomend going to see it if you can. I found it really hard waiting in recervery for the anasthetic to wear off not "knowing" where DD was. I think I would have found seeing the place before helpful.

Like greenmansions I'm only really beginging to process this as we start thinging about having another baby. At the time it was just something we had to do and there was no time really to think about it.


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

I had pre-e with my first as well and ended in a section. My son and I also had a severe infection so he was in a "plastic bubble" for three days and could not nurse. It was EXTEMELY difficult to establish nursing. But not impossible, it took us three months to really get it down. I also developed severe gall stones as a result of the pregnancy and my gall bladder had to be removed. Although I waited untill DS could stay with dad for a few hours (about 7 months).
Point being, BF is not impossible, difficult maybe but not impossible. I am pregnant with DS#2 right now and I am strongly recomended to have another C/S due to some extremly high fluid levels. But otherwise, I would try for VBAC.
But, before I ever found out about the complication, I really just felt that I was supposed to have a section. Something about a VBAC just didn't sit easily, my body told me that it was not a safe thing to do. So really, all in all, do what feels right to you.
and age had nothing to do with my problems, I was pregnant at 21 and delivered at 22. This time around I will deliver at 24.
Good luck with this very difficult decision, it took me seven months to make it!


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

I had PIH with my first (150/100) and a c/s because of failure to progress and transerse attest.. I was determined to have a VBAC with baby #2 and was concerned about PIH again.. I found a great OB/MW practice that was very proactive about PIH etc with suppliments and diet.. and was great. I didn't get my VBAC (you can read why in Sophia's birth story.. link posted earlier..a page back or so).
Greenmansions.. if you want a VBAC.. (my opinion here) maternal age, risk for PE or PIH, past labor experiences and MC risk really would not sway ME from trying for a VBAC but you have to do what you feel is best for you and your baby..

Chantal


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## Heavenly (Nov 21, 2001)

Iriemama96 - actually your age probably DID have something to do with it. Women in their very early 20s or younger with their first child are at higher risk for pre-eclampsia. I had my son at 21 and also had pre-eclampsia. We both almost died and he was born my emerg c-section at 34 weeks. I didn't have it with my second child and hope I won't have it this time. Oh I was 23 when I had my second child and I'll be 26 when I deliver this one.


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## egoldber (Nov 18, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *OnTheFence*
Great info Beth, thanks for joining us. ...Kim

Kim, thanks for the welcome. We are not TTC yet, but will be in a few months. We were told to wait 6 months minimum to allow time for my UR to fully heal. But next time (knock on wood, since I am 37 and also have a history of early MC) we will be having a planned CS, probably at 36 or 37 weeks. I have already found this thread (and the previous ones) to be super helpful.


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## Iriemama96 (Jun 24, 2005)

I thought pre-e was an undescriminate disorder. Atleast that is what i have read, where did you read about it being related to your age??


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## greenmansions (Feb 16, 2005)

Regarding pre-e, my OB told me that "women at the extremes of age" (as she put it) are more likely to get it - ie younger mamas and older mamas.

Thanks all for input on my earlier post.

I will have to talk to my doctor - I still have so many questions especially re anesthesia and timing a c/s right, as well as things related to trying VBAC.

DH thinks I should have the c/s - he thinks it will be easier on me, and that way we can arrange for a family member to fly in and be here to help since we'd know the date - with a VBAC that part would be a lot harder to plan.


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

Any word from Storm???


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## wenat (Apr 17, 2004)

I just got a tip that I hadn't yet heard in this forum, for post c/s healing.

One of my colleagues, who had two c/s babies in the late 70s, said that her best tip from one of the nurses was to get a light girdle (like a control top pantyhose, that light) to keep everything tucked in after the c/s.

I hadn't heard that one before, and thought I'd check in with all of you experienced folks to see if you had, and if you think it would help. (I remember it really hurt to laugh after my c/s, so having some extra support might not be a bad thing.)


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## matts_mamamama (Mar 19, 2004)

I held a pillow up to myself for the first few days, not only when I laughed or coughed, but pretty much ALL the time I moved!! I liked the support and pressure on my incision.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Hello, all!

Evan Walker made his entrance on Tuesday morning (the 26th) at 10:05, via c-section. He weighed in at 10lb, 8oz. He's healthy as can be and hasn't lost much weight, because he eats constantly. And, so far he seems to be the most sedate of my kids.

My section didn't go very well, but I seem to be recovering faster than I did from the last two. At the very least, I'm more mobile. I had a bad time with nurses and haven't slept much since Monday night. I'm feeling really ambivalent about this one - not kicking myself quite as much as in the past, but still not sure why I stopped fighting when I did, and wishing I'd held out for my VBA2C. My daughter is hell on wheels right now and I can't do _anything_ with her...she tries to climb on my lap, and plants her hand in my stomach, pushes on my legs (straining the incision), etc...this is one of the things I was most afraid of, and it's even worse than I expected.

Anyway - I'm going to try to get some sleep, without worrying about nurses busting in my door to check my blood pressure just as I doze off. I'll post a few more details tomorrow.


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## shannon0218 (Oct 10, 2003)

Glad to see Evan is here Lisa and Congratulations! Sorry it wasn't the healing birth you wanted though








Can't wait to hear more about that big strapping boy


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## its_our_family (Sep 8, 2002)

I'm so glad you and Evan are home! He is a big boy! Glad to hear he is a good nurser...and calm









I'm sorry your experience was far from what you had hoped for and I hope your recovery continues to go quickly.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'm actually not quite as badly off as I sounded last night. I just got more sleep than I've had in the last four days combined, so my morale has definitely improved. I still wish I'd held out for the VBA2C, except if a real emergency had arisen. However...I still see three victories in standing my ground as long as I did.

1) Evan didn't have the breathing problems in his first few days that Emma had. I don't know if that's because I had labour, but I'm inclined to think that it was. So...holding out for labour seems to have helped him there.

2) My milk came in as quickly as it did with Kelly. Emma lost over a pound in hospital, but Evan only lost 7oz, even though he started out slightly heavier in the first place. He was definitely getting more milk more quickly, and I attribute _that_ to the fact that I went into labour first, as well.

3) Because I did hold out that long, and it seems to have helped my little guy, I'm not feeling _quite_ as bulldozed as last time. I wish I hadn't given in at the last minute as the contractions were really happening at that point (about 5 minutes apart, couldn't talk throught them, etc.). But, I didn't, so I'm trying to focus on the positives.

And, for whatever reason, I've definitely bounced back much more quickly than with either of my others. I still feel like death warmed over, but I was walking the ward on the first day - at a point where I could barely make it to the bathroom with Emma. So, something's better.

My incision was oozing and gaping slightly yesterday. I was afraid they were going to keep me another day and I'd already called my mom to pick me up, and my daughter knew I was coming home. That would have broken my heart. But, my OB just told me I can page him if there's an increase in bleeding or if I experience any unusual pain. He'll call me back and meet me at the hospital, if necessary. He may have made me a bit mad at the end, but I definitely appreciated that...another day in that room would have broken me, I think.


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Congratulations Lisa! Welcome Evan!!! Enjoy your baby and be easy on yourself!!









Chantal


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## OnTheFence (Feb 15, 2003)

Lisa congratulations on the birth of your son!

Enjoy your baby moon!


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## mandalamama (Sep 1, 2004)

duhhh, i didn't even see this thread as i was going through pages, i started an August one here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=322266 but the mods can delete that one i guess.

congrats, Lisa! it sounds like you've got a really positive mindset. keep it going! and take good and gentle care of yourself









i'm still having adhesion problems. my OB said my only option is a laparoscopy, and she can't guarantee i wouldn't get more scarring/adhesions, in fact it'd be likely. surely that can't be the only option! is there any natural supplement that helps with the reduction or softening of injury scars, like keloiding on the outside? a tablet or capsule, i mean. maybe it'd do the same on the inside? no way i'd get another surgery, this was my first and hopefully my last. every time i bend to pick up something from the floor, no matter how carefully i position myself, i get a tearing pain just below and to one side of my bellybutton. it reminds me of the tearing pains during pregnancy, when the uterus was growing upwards, except its WAY worse. i'm worried about internal bleeding in small amounts, and more scarring if i keep tearing the adhesions. it just freaks me out. and it hurts worse during menstrual cramps.


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## LisaG (Feb 23, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mellybean*
i'm still having adhesion problems. my OB said my only option is a laparoscopy, and she can't guarantee i wouldn't get more scarring/adhesions, in fact it'd be likely. surely that can't be the only option! is there any natural supplement that helps with the reduction or softening of injury scars, like keloiding on the outside? a tablet or capsule, i mean. maybe it'd do the same on the inside? no way i'd get another surgery, this was my first and hopefully my last. every time i bend to pick up something from the floor, no matter how carefully i position myself, i get a tearing pain just below and to one side of my bellybutton. it reminds me of the tearing pains during pregnancy, when the uterus was growing upwards, except its WAY worse. i'm worried about internal bleeding in small amounts, and more scarring if i keep tearing the adhesions. it just freaks me out. and it hurts worse during menstrual cramps.

Just poking my head in here







, you might want to consider lymphatic drainage. It's a type of bodywork that's really helpful at improving the mobility of tissue, including scar tissue and adhesions. Anytime an incision has been made the flow of lymph gets disrupted and has to reroute itself. After I had my surgery for fibroid removal and uterine repair (incision similar to c/s) I found it invaluable for my recovery. Pulling into my scar when standing was gone after 1 session, my scar changed texture and color (for the better), and my abdominal shape changed. You can search for a practitioner at Upledger Institute by typing in your city/state or zip and then specifying the modality as lymph drainage. I'd look for someone who's had at least 2 levels and preferably is certified. Good luck









Lisa


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Hey.. did we ever get an August thread going.... kim??

How is everyone doing?

Chantal


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## mandalamama (Sep 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chantald*
Hey.. did we ever get an August thread going.... kim??

How is everyone doing?

Chantal

i started an August thread, it's prolly lost in the forum though, http://www.mothering.com/discussion...ad.php?t=322266 b


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## chantald (Oct 26, 2004)

Meli
The link didn't work....?


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## fawny (Jul 25, 2007)

I just wanted to put my story out there: I had an emergency c-section after 26 hours of labor and 2 hours of pushing. I was planning for a home birth in water... well that didn't work out. I was extremely traumatized that I had a c-section and feel that my entire birth experience was chaotic and terrible. I suffered from ppd as well, I think a major part of that was due to how my labor turned out. When I look back at it now however I am SO greatful for modern medicine because without it my dd and I would not be alive today. She was posterior and was NEVER going to come out on her own, and boy did I try!!! I think there are waaaay too many c-sections performed these days but I am also very greatful for the fact that they can be done relatively safely when they are neccesary! I am planning for a VBAC the next time, and I am going to try my hardest to make it happen


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