# They don't sleep (twins) and I am going insane...literally.



## nummies (Jun 9, 2007)

I have two babies that are two months old. They don't sleep. Ever. In order for them to be sleeping, they have to be lying on or next to me and it is impossible for me to be holding them both. They both want to nurse to sleep and sleep with the nipple in their mouth. But I can't lie down and nurse them at the same time (it is physically not possible). So therefore, when I take one of them off the nipple to feed the other one, the first one wakes up and starts screaming. My husband has been taking the screaming one away until I can finish nursing the other baby and then we start all over again. Last night, I got 20 minutes of sleep. No, that is not an exaggeration, 20 minutes of sleep from 6:30-6:50 this morning (and that was only because I fell asleep in the recliner while tandem nursing). I can't sleep in the recliner all night however, for one, tandem nursing is extremely painful and for another, they are too heavy for them both to sleep on me like that for extended periods of time.

They cry all the time. Seriously, 5 minutes of awake happy time is very rare. This is just getting ridiculous. My poor body is ready to give out and hubby is ready to put them both in the crib and leave them to cry. And frankly that is sounding pretty good right now.









Things that we are doing/ have tried: swaddling, swings, music, fans, white noise, bedtime routine, no dairy, pacifiers, etc.

I cannot pump for them because I don't get anything out so help in the feeding department is not an option.

But I am going insane. I am already on anti-depressants because I literally want to run away and never come back.


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## mumm (May 23, 2004)

Oh the days of wanting to run away! I don't miss those times. Honestly, the only reason I stuck around was because I knew it was better for my kids. But those days do pass. Starting an anti-depressant at 2 years was awesome for me! You are smart to not have waited so long.

It took a long time before I was able to nurse them both, but nightweaning was the best thing. Clearly you've got aways to go before that is an option though. The way things are now (or last night) are not how they will always be. Remember that when you want to run away.

I don't have any real advice, just empathy for how hard it is. Congratulations and hang in there!


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## verycozy (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm so sorry







I don't have any suggestions, since you've already tried everything that I would have suggested. If it makes you feel better (and I realize it probably won't) it's probably only another month or six weeks of this, and then it will improve.


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## 4Marmalade (May 4, 2004)

I know you said nursing both while lying down is impossible but figuring out how to do that is what saved me for a very long time. I would lie on my one side and side nurse one baby and I would use pillows alongside my back to keep the other baby level across the top of me. She was a better nurser and learned to nurse pretty much face down on my upper breast. She would then just turn to the side and I could continue holding her on top of me while we all slept. Swaddling them helped keep them in position. It wasn't the most comfortable but it got us through. As they got older I was able to nurse them simultaneously by lying on my back and holding them in the crooks of my arms with their heads resting on my upper arm. I still do this now at 20 months.

My only other advice would be to try to get some rest during the day. I took most of the nighttime parenting so dh could sleep and then he would try to take the babies and older dc's in the morning so I could "sleep in".

My two were very frequent night nursers. I know how hard it can be. It will change. The horrible time you are having will pass. I know it probably doesn't help much to hear that now but just know there are others who have BTDT and wish you sleep soon.


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## nola79 (Jun 21, 2009)

Oh, mama, I am so sorry you are going through that.


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## Baby_Cakes (Jan 14, 2008)

Couldn't read and not post. I do not have much advice other than just hang in there. I remember the days of wanting to just bail and say that this is NOT what I signed up for! You're not alone, not at all.

What about a paci for the other baby? Controversial, maybe, but when we gave Nora a paci just for those "moments" it was a lifesaver. Maybe those babies just need to suck.

You're right that that is just not enough sleep for you. Grab any few minutes that you can. Doze in that recliner all you need to. Whatever you can get, take!


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## Freeman (Sep 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nummies* 
I cannot pump for them because I don't get anything out so help in the feeding department is not an option.

But I am going insane. I am already on anti-depressants because I literally want to run away and never come back.

How do you think your milk supply is? I am wondering if it's possible that they are not getting enough at a feeding to latch off and be content for a while? Since you can't pump to allow dh to give a bottle, are you opposed to giving them a bottle of formula as a test to see if they would be more content if they took a lot in at one feeding? I hope that makes sense (I'm sleep-deprived, too!) Not suggesting that you give formula consistently and compromise your milk supply, but that you try it to see if it's a matter of them getting more at one sitting and then being content for a bit. You mentioned that you tried pacifiers without success-- have you tried different kinds? My twins liked the Soothies (the green ones that the hospital gives -- if you've had a hospital birth--they are available at places like Target too, though) at first but now have taken a liking to the MAMs (which my older 2 liked as well). IME, none of my kids have ever had nipple confusion from a bottle or a pacifier, but I guess some do. When I found out I was having _twins_, any notion of delaying a pacifier or delaying a bottle fed by someone else beyond a week after they were born went out the window....

Big hugs!! Things have to get better, right? As another poster said, it's great that you got help for depression now; is the medication helping at all yet, or is it too early to tell?


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## Nanasi (Sep 11, 2009)

Mandie, it sounds like you're in the thick of colic. We went through that, too. And there were times when I definitely wanted to run away. Our twins are 3 months old now, but I remember thinking just a few weeks ago that six weeks was supposed to be the peak of the fussiness. For us, the peak came at about 11 weeks. The fussiness has been improving ever since.

One thing I realized was that I'd been misreading their cues. They'd start turning their heads from side to side and smacking their lips, so I'd try to nurse them. They'd pop on and off for 20 minutes (hurting me every time), before I'd cut them off. The thing is, they weren't hungry. They were tired. Where as they'd just fall asleep on their own for the first month, they now needed our help relaxing enough to go to sleep. Sometimes that meant they had to squirm and cry a bit in our arms to let off steam.

I still misread their cues sometimes, but things have gotten a lot better. If they start getting fussy within 2 hours of eating, I change diapers and try to get them to sleep. Sometimes that doesn't work, so I end up nursing them. Often they just need enough of a suck to relax before they drop off to sleep. Then I won't move them until they stop smiling and jerking in their sleep (20-30 minutes). Usually we can move them to their crib then.

It's hard, I know, but it does end. In the meantime, try to get them to sleep at the same time so you can get some sleep, too. Unless your babies are still really small, they should be able to go 2-3 hours without eating. It gets better. It really does!


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## nummies (Jun 9, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *4Marmalade* 







I know you said nursing both while lying down is impossible but figuring out how to do that is what saved me for a very long time. I would lie on my one side and side nurse one baby and I would use pillows alongside my back to keep the other baby level across the top of me. She was a better nurser and learned to nurse pretty much face down on my upper breast. She would then just turn to the side and I could continue holding her on top of me while we all slept. Swaddling them helped keep them in position. It wasn't the most comfortable but it got us through. As they got older I was able to nurse them simultaneously by lying on my back and holding them in the crooks of my arms with their heads resting on my upper arm. I still do this now at 20 months.

My only other advice would be to try to get some rest during the day. I took most of the nighttime parenting so dh could sleep and then he would try to take the babies and older dc's in the morning so I could "sleep in".

My two were very frequent night nursers. I know how hard it can be. It will change. The horrible time you are having will pass. I know it probably doesn't help much to hear that now but just know there are others who have BTDT and wish you sleep soon.

Thank you. Sadly my DH leaves for work at 5 so we are all up for the day at that point because I can't hold them both in bed.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Baby_Cakes* 
Couldn't read and not post. I do not have much advice other than just hang in there. I remember the days of wanting to just bail and say that this is NOT what I signed up for! You're not alone, not at all.

What about a paci for the other baby? Controversial, maybe, but when we gave Nora a paci just for those "moments" it was a lifesaver. Maybe those babies just need to suck.

You're right that that is just not enough sleep for you. Grab any few minutes that you can. Doze in that recliner all you need to. Whatever you can get, take!

They won't take pacifiers. I have tried 6-7 different brands and they act like they are choking to death.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freeman* 
How do you think your milk supply is? I am wondering if it's possible that they are not getting enough at a feeding to latch off and be content for a while? Since you can't pump to allow dh to give a bottle, are you opposed to giving them a bottle of formula as a test to see if they would be more content if they took a lot in at one feeding? I hope that makes sense (I'm sleep-deprived, too!) Not suggesting that you give formula consistently and compromise your milk supply, but that you try it to see if it's a matter of them getting more at one sitting and then being content for a bit. You mentioned that you tried pacifiers without success-- have you tried different kinds? My twins liked the Soothies (the green ones that the hospital gives -- if you've had a hospital birth--they are available at places like Target too, though) at first but now have taken a liking to the MAMs (which my older 2 liked as well). IME, none of my kids have ever had nipple confusion from a bottle or a pacifier, but I guess some do. When I found out I was having _twins_, any notion of delaying a pacifier or delaying a bottle fed by someone else beyond a week after they were born went out the window....

Big hugs!! Things have to get better, right? As another poster said, it's great that you got help for depression now; is the medication helping at all yet, or is it too early to tell?

Thanks. I have tried 6-7 different brands, including the ones you mentioned. I am *this close* to giving formula, but am really trying not to. I don't think I have an issue with supply. They are both over 12lbs, have plenty of diapers, etc.


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## lovermont (Dec 20, 2006)

I am so very sorry that things are the way they are now.
My knee jerk reaction when someone suggests formula, as a pp did, is to say: "no way!" But I have a friend who anticipating supply issues (due to her past medical history) was not surprised to find she had supply issues. I started pumping for her and nursed her once when she was less than a couple months old. I didn't notice any weird latch and she nursed for an hour and a half. Her mom said she then cried from the time they put her in the car (soon after de-latching from me) until she was given a bottle at home that she sucked down. That started the mom thinking that maybe it wasn't a supply issue but a latch issue. I'm wondering if your babes are struggling with latch because you said tandem nursing is painful? Just a thought.
Also, when the non-nursing baby is carried away by your husband does that baby continue to scream until re-latched? I wonder if he tried wearing the baby if that would help? I don't know if that would give additional comfort because it is similar, I'm thinking, to swaddling and being held by a parent.
I would definitely say that YOUR sleep is priority. I think it took me a long time to realize that if I wasn't doing at least okay then the kids would not be doing okay. Is there anyone you would feel comfortable coming over to rock, sway, sing, talk on a walk, etc the babies while you (and dh?) took a much needed nap?


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## AmyKT (Aug 20, 2009)

I'm so sorry! I wanted to run away from my ONE colicky newborn. I can only imagine what it's like with two.

This is controversial, as well, but you mentioned that they like to sleep on you, so have you let them sleep on their tummies? That really helped DD.


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## Freeman (Sep 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nanasi* 
One thing I realized was that I'd been misreading their cues. They'd start turning their heads from side to side and smacking their lips, so I'd try to nurse them. They'd pop on and off for 20 minutes (hurting me every time), before I'd cut them off. The thing is, they weren't hungry. They were tired. Where as they'd just fall asleep on their own for the first month, they now needed our help relaxing enough to go to sleep. Sometimes that meant they had to squirm and cry a bit in our arms to let off steam.

I still misread their cues sometimes, but things have gotten a lot better. If they start getting fussy within 2 hours of eating, I change diapers and try to get them to sleep. Sometimes that doesn't work, so I end up nursing them. Often they just need enough of a suck to relax before they drop off to sleep. Then I won't move them until they stop smiling and jerking in their sleep (20-30 minutes). Usually we can move them to their crib then.

I've noticed this, too. At this age, I think they're typically only awake and content for no more than 1-2 hours. After that, overexcitability and irritability ensues! Have you ever been able to soothe them to sleep and put them down anywhere (besides on your body) w/out them waking up? Have you tried them on a slight incline? Do they fall asleep in their car seats in a moving car? If so, I suggest a relaxing drive (if safe in your sleep-deprived state!) and a drive-through coffee (or ice cream, if you're trying to avoid all caffeine). This shall pass! I know it's really hard.


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## hergrace (Oct 9, 2003)

What a rough place to be. I hope you find something soon. That level of sleep deprivation is killer. DS1 was a non-sleeping baby and that was terrible for me. I can only imagine the reality with two like that at a time.

Have you tried fenugreek in case it is a supply issue?
Might it be reflux? The triplets had issues with both. We had to go no dairy and no soy to soothe their reflux .

I know that you said you had tried no dairy, so I don't want to push this. But, I had very similar behaviour with DS1 who had such a severe dairy issue that the first time I thought I had tried no dairy, I hadn't tried it enough. The first time I tried it, I avoided everything I could identify as having dairy for two weeks and noticed no change at all.

For me to notice any difference at all with DS1, I had to avoid anything that had ever been near a dairy protein (including all the ingredients that *might* have dairy in them) and keep it up for three weeks, at which point I noticed an incredible difference.

I used the hidden dairy cheat sheet at www.kellymom.com and the information there was very helpful. She also discusses other foods that could be issues.

Hope you find something that helps soon.


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## Intertwined (Jun 29, 2005)

Ouch. Been there. I think I literally did not sleep from the time the twins were born until they were about 6 weeks old. I did have some help that first couple of weeks but after that I was on my own with a husband like yours who was gone for most of the day. At night, I let him sleep because he worked such long hours on his feet and needed to be mentally sharp to do his job. I suffered badly.
















What about donor milk? Do you have a milkie Mama who could pump for you? 2-3 nights of sleep would do you a WORLD of good and then you're not giving formula. If it comes down to it though, you've GOT to sleep. It's downright dangerous to not get enough sleep for that long (and believe me, I learned that the hard way). It doesn't have to be forever and it doesn't have to be full time but maybe even once a week to get a full night of rest?

Some things you've probably covered but just in case:

Happiest Baby on the Block
Tongue Tie
Let them suck on your finger instead of a boob/paci
Prop yourself up in bed with a mountain of pillows. Swaddle both babies in sposies that will hold a flood and set them up to your breasts and GO TO SLEEP while they nurse. This works wonders for me when I was dying with no sleep. I did it on the couch, but the bed would probably work, too. I used my EZ2Nurse as my "base" and then used pillows behind my back, my neck, and my arms. Propped my feet up and I could at least doze while they nursed. I was mostly trapped though, hence the diapers that will hold a flood.








Tandeming shouldn't hurt, even if it's overwhelming and not-so-much-fun. Get their latch checked. I agree with a PP that they might not be expressing well so are nursing all day long rather than getting a good feed at once.

Hang in there. Really. It DID get way easier at the 6 week mark and then again at the 12. They didn't night wean, I forced them to do it at about 11 months because I. Was. Done. but they are still nursing at almost 2 and I rarely feel like I did those first weeks. I promise it will get easier. Much love Mama.


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## Meems (Jan 8, 2007)

OMG. I am feeling so bad for you right now!

Here's my .02--- Find someone to come over and take both babies (after they've been fed) and you go to bed and get some rest. It may take 2 people to watch them, but seriously, your supply is going to suffer, as is your mental health, physical health, etc etc if you do not eat and get some rest!!!!

Repeat. As often as you can.

I think if I were in your shoes, I'd call a lactation consultant and see if that is any help.

Please hang in there!


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## kjoy2 (Sep 21, 2007)

Everyone has offered amazing advice. I would try *everything* previously mentioned. I know many a mom/twin mom who has used formula beautifully in conjunction with BM, though I understand how it isn't your ideal. Also, they might get into pacifiers as they get older.
Other ideas:
-Baby swings for sleeping (but who am I kidding?!)
-Putting something with a bit of weight on the baby's back or abdomen as he is sleeping (I've heard this works wonders for kids who have sensory integration difficulties), such as one of those little rice or seed-filled fabric pillows.
-I've said this before: belly sleeping = sleeping 2 hour stretches for my kids at night after the initial hell of getting to sleep for the night.
- Looking back, here's what I would have done, so here's what I'm emphasizing: GET HELP to come during the day, take the babies (and your older son?) for a walk or anywhere out of the house for a couple of hours so that you can sleep. If you can't pump, then provide formula in bottles to go. The babies will be FINE without you. YOU need rest more than anything right now.
- My babies never fell asleep on their own, either. They were babies who truly could NOT turn off. They would scream in the car. They would scream in the stroller. I would try my darndest to ensure that they were not becoming overtired and try to quiet them & place them down to sleep, but they would not fall asleep nursing (aside from a handful of times in early infancy) and it would take 1-3 hours walking, bouncing, etc., only to have them wake up screaming the minute I set them down. Sooooo, that obviously was not going to work. I couldn't spend my entire day trying to get a baby to sleep (while another baby screamed, while I didn't get any rest, while we all became more and more overtired). At about 3 months of age I started following the No Cry Sleep Solution to get the girls to fall asleep on their own. I started with the first morning nap. I'd walk one baby until almost asleep, place in co-sleeper. If baby cried, pick up & comfort until quiet, then immediately back down. Over and over and over and over and over. And you know what? It started to work in very little time, and they have continued to be able to fall asleep on their own unless they are sick or teething.

I really hope you guys turn a corner soon.


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## DeerMother (Apr 22, 2008)

I know you said you've tried white noise, have you tried really loud white noise? Mine would respond to the clothes dryer or a hair dryer. There were several nights at that age that ds slept in a swing near the dryer and I slept in a chair w/ dd. I know it is hard to see when you are this tired, but my dc responded to different things. You may consider focusing on getting one to sleep more and not both right now.

THIS WILL PASS! I know it seems like an eternity right now, hang in there.


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## Llyra (Jan 16, 2005)

My younger two are twins, and only one of them was fussy and colicky and miserable. I can only just barely imagine having both of them be like that. I feel for you so much.

Having twin newborns is literally the most challenging experience I've ever been through in my life. It was hard. Really really hard. I was mind-numbingly exhausted, and struggling with constant feelings of inadequacy. I remember horrible days where I was so exhausted that all I could do was cry and cry, so there we'd sit, all three kids and me, on my bed and we'd all just cry together. I remember at one point telling DH that I thought maybe I had to give one of them up for adoption, because I didn't feel like I could do it.

It's really really hard.

First of all: you have to sleep. There's no way around that. A way has to be found, even if it means making some very hard decisions. Nobody's going to benefit if you go completely over the edge. And one good night of sleep will do miracles for your ability to think clearly and make decisions.

So I'd start by calling in any help you have, declaring that you're going crazy, and putting your foot down to your partner and saying you MUST have one good night of sleep. Choose a six hour slot during which you WILL NOT be disturbed, just for that one night. Leave your partner and whoever else you can get in to help with some bottles, and go to bed. Six hours is enough to clear your head, but not enough that you're going to get clogged ducts or seriously and permanently undermine your milk supply.

If you can't sleep with the babies in the house crying, can you check into a cheap motel for the night? I remember how hard it was to sleep, even when I was totally wasted, knowing my babies were needing me. But you have to be healthy to care for them, and you can't be healthy subsisting on a half hour's sleep a night or less.

Then after that, you may find that the twins and your DH had a horrible night, but I would guess that you will be feeling a lot more clear-headed and able to think about how to make changes that will make this easier.

And remember-- it's going to get much easier, and probably soon. For most babies, the colicky fussiness starts to dramatically subside as they get past three months and closer to four months.

Once you're able to think clearly, I'd start looking into a few things. The first would be milk supply-- have the babies' weight gain checked. Maybe rent a baby scale and weigh them before and after a feed, to see how much they're getting. Make sure that it's not hunger that's making them so miserable. I'd also talk to a good pediatrician about reflux.

Secondly, I'd start taking a good look at their daytime sleep. When babies aren't sleeping at night, and are miserable wrecks all the time, often the culprit is overtiredness and overstimulation. If they're awake for long stretches during the day, that might be the problem. A good rule of thumb is that if they're awake more than 90 minutes at any time, it's time for a nap again. Getting good daytime sleep will lead to less miserable evenings and sounder sleep at night.

Another thing to do is to start working with them on an alternate way to fall asleep besides nursing. Nursing to sleep is of course the most natural way for a mom and baby to sleep, but with multiples things get sticky. It really helped us to have the babies know another way to fall asleep. For DS, it was being put in the sling with DH and walked from the front door to the back while DH patted his bum and sang. (You should see a grown man try it!) For DD2, it was putting her in the carseat that fit into the stroller and pushing her back and forth on the front sidewalk, and then bringing the carseat inside.

What pump are you using? If you aren't using a double-electric with brand-new soft parts, then I would look into getting hold of a better pump. A pump with older soft parts may not be functioning optimally, and a single pump doesn't provide the stimulation that you may need to letdown for the pump. You can rent pumps from hospitals; just call the maternity floor and ask. Have you tried putting one baby on one breast, and the pump on the other, so that baby can stimulate the letdown reflex for the pump? Because my next suggestion is going to be a daily bottle of pumped milk. Believe me, I'm the biggest advocate for exclusive breastfeeding you'll meet. But when mama is going crazy, something has to change, and pumping a bottle is not going to be as undermining to your supply as formula, and is a lot better for the babies. If you designate a period of time during which you HAVE to sleep, and leave DH in charge during that time, at least you can guarantee a small part of the night where you know you will be able to get some rest. For us, we made it early-- I went to bed at 7:30, and DH stayed with the babies until around 10 or 10:30, when he brought them to bed and I nursed them. I chose earlier in the evening because nursing during the late-night hours is good for keeping up your supply. 2 1/2 to 3 hours isn't very long, the babies will be okay, and it's better than sleeping only like 20 minutes.

I found tandem nursing very difficult until the twins could sit alone. I just couldn't support their weight for very long, and nursing them both while lying down was impossible for me. I think breast size and shape have a lot to do with this. So another thing to do is to start teaching them to stay asleep when you unlatch. This is a tricky business, and it starts with learning to stay latched while side-lying. Work on that during the day when you're feeling more alert, because it can take practice. What finally worked for us-- I'd swaddle one twin tightly, and prop him on his side with two rolled-up blankets. (Tape them so they don't come unrolled.) Then I'd lie down on my side and nurse him to sleep. But I wouldn't get into full-body contact-- I'd have the rolled blanket between us. That way he wouldn't notice so much when I started to slip away. Once he was asleep I'd wait a long time, until he was barely suckling at all, and then I'd very very slowly move my body away from him, while staying latched. Then I'd unlatch really slowly by pulling away without using my hand. If he woke again, we'd go back to the beginning. Eventually if I was slow and subtle enough, he'd let go, then I'd slip away from him, going to elaborate lengths not to make a single sound, and I'd go out of the room and get the second twin and nurse her to sleep the same way. Of course if she cried, the whole deal was off, but with patience and persistence they did eventually learn the new way, and what that did for me was let me nurse them down one at a time. Then I'd sleep between them, so that I could pop the nipple in the mouth of anybody who stirred, before there was any crying that could potentially disturb the other.

It takes time and patience and there will be some days when it feels like it's all going horribly wrong, but it can be done and you will do it. Mamas of multiples are superheroes. After having done all that, I feel like I could easily do just about anything at all, because nothing else could be harder.

I can't write more now. It's 3 and I have to go to work. But hang in there, and if you want to talk, PM me.


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## KimPM (Nov 18, 2005)

I don't know what kind of pump you have (and this isn't the pumping forum), but ... you could try renting a hospital grade pump for a short while to see if that allows you to get the flow going. I rented a Medela hospital pump for a short while and it was great. Then when I tried buying a different brand pump, I couldn't get any out. So I bought a Medela Pump in Style and it worked just fine, too. Like the hospital-grade Medela pump, it had a special start-up cycle that got the flow going, then it switched to a regular pump-it-out mode. The difference in the way each pump works is important.

It could also be that due to extreme exhaustion, your body isn't producing as much as it should right now.


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## Meems (Jan 8, 2007)

Please give us an update mama, worried about you


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## Leersia (Oct 27, 2005)

Oh, my dear woman, I saw your post heading when I was scrolling down through the forums, and couldn't not post to you. My twins are now almost 8, but I swear that even now, when a newborn starts crying, I have a stress response that suggests I have PTSD from parenting newborn twins. I know that it doesn't really help, when you feel that you are literally about to drop said and starting to hallucinate from stress and lack of sleep, for people to tell you that this phase will be behind you soon enough, but it will. I also found nursing very painful for about the first 8 weeks (too painful to tandem), and then after that you could have hit my nipples with a baseball bat and I wouldn't have felt it. I tandem nursed them with a double football hold on a large nursing pillow starting at about 8 weeks, and it made such an enormous difference because I comfort them both at the same time.

I was really paranoid about using formula due to supply issues, and in retrospect, I think some judicious use of it would have really helped my sanity a lot. I agree with the PPs that you need to find some way to get a block of sleep for your health and sanity. Hugs to you!


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## geo_girl (Apr 18, 2007)

hi there nummies,

I hope that this finds you in a little better mental space today.

Please do not feel bad about supplementing with a bit of formula. You have to take care of yourself so that you can take care of them. PLUS you can get someone ELSE to do the feeding while you have a rest or hang out with your toddler.

Thinking of you,
charlene


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## Freeman (Sep 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Leersia* 
I was really paranoid about using formula due to supply issues, and in retrospect, I think some judicious use of it would have really helped my sanity a lot. I agree with the PPs that you need to find some way to get a block of sleep for your health and sanity. Hugs to you!

Nummies, how are you? I know we are all thinking of you! I know you said that you are leery about giving formula but don't pump out any milk b/c the twins are always eating. It might only take giving 1 bottle of formula. If they take the bottle and are content for a while, you could hopefully let your supply build for a couple of hours and then pump (in between you getting some REST). I think you would prob. feel so much better with several hours sleep!


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## jeliphish (Jul 18, 2007)

I concur with the previous posts.... a bottle of formula or donated milk may be a life saver. Seriously. One bottle right before bed for both of them. You HAVE to take care of yourself first and this is so difficult to learn with the first baby(s). I learned quickly with my second that I could not do what I did with DD1 or I would seriously have a nervous break down. Sleep deprivation will make you go insane...and I am completely and utterly serious. It makes you delusional, depressed, feel pain everywhere, like throwing up.... it's dangerous. Even if you are not having supply issues, a bottle at night when they are supposed to be cluster feeding is going to help them store fat and stay asleep longer. I would suggest a). trying a hospital grade pump b). borrowing milk from a nursing friend or c). formula. A 3 or 4 oz bottle at night may make all the difference in the world. Can you sidecar their crib next to the bed? Maybe if they sleep on their tummy they will sleep longer, and if you are concerned about their safety- you could get a angel care monitor. Try sleeping them snuggled together and apart. Try the swing... Anything. It is survival mode right now and you are not going to form any bad habits if it takes a swing or sleeping in their crib beside you. You need rest







Hang in there


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## twinmama2010 (Jan 1, 2010)

I'm so sorry to hear you are going through so much pain and exhaustion. I have to ask though- have you worked with a lactation consultant and evaluated your supply? Our first few weeks were exactly like this with screaming non stop- so we brought in a lactation consultant and went through 7-10 days of pumping and working with her and we determined that I was just not making enough milk for both babies. I had difficulty getting pregnant due to PCOS, and I hadn't known that PCOS can also mean low- supply, but I don't know your specific circumstances. I think it would be worth looking into- because if your babies aren't sleeping and screaming non-stop it seems to me that they aren't ever satiated. We are now using an organic formula and also nursing/pumping and the schedule is much easier. The girls sleep longer and my hubby can help out with feedings. If your sanity is suffering, please take this in to consideration. I felt desperate too- but I can enjoy my days with my babies now because I am well rested. I hope you can find a solution that works for you.


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## pualum (Mar 17, 2010)

I'm sorry, honey. I think about you often when I'm feeding at night. I know it doesn't solve your problem, but I want you to know I think about you. I don't think I can manage 3 babes at the same time, but if another momma from our group wants to come with I wouldn't mind letting you get some sleep. Maybe, with the nice weather we could take them for a walk while you sleep.

If it's colic like a pp said you could try an amber anklet. I just got my little guy's today. I can FB you the info or give it to you when I see you again.


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## snadaska (Aug 12, 2009)

I don't have any advice just wanted to say that I'm so sorry that you are having such a rough time. I hope things get better soon. It sounds like others on this board have some experience with a situation like yours. I really hope you get some sleep soon and that things improve. Good luck and let us know how you are.


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## JudiAU (Jun 29, 2008)

Hugs. Sounds very, very hard. =(

Some thoughts:

don't give up on the pacifiers - sometimes it takes many tries before a baby will accept. I always wanted my babes to take them because I had to go back to work and so I tried really hard - totally lifesaver

If you can't pump and want to avoid formula, what about some donor milk? You might find someone locally...

One bf'ing mom I know said her sanity was saved by sleeping with one baby while hubby had the other

You might consider an elimination diet or is reflux possible? Those sounds like really insane demands on you.

Finally, I PROMISE it will get better. I SWEAR.

HUGS.


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## marinak1977 (Feb 24, 2009)

Oh Mandie... that sounds so so tough. No advice, but positive vibes and sleepy thoughts sent your way.


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