# Going Epi-Free?



## Sobranna (May 27, 2009)

I am 11 weeks and some change, and I've been seriously pondering the reasons for getting an epidural and researching the complications associated with that. I have two conflicting issues:

1. I am terrified of the epidural. My mom had some pretty bad experiences twenty years ago. She said after those experiences, she decided to go natural on the last one because, "it just couldn't be worse than the epidural." (Well, she proclaimed to me that it was, and if she had to do it again she would go ahead with the epi.)
2. I am a wimp. I'm not athletic, wouldn't really consider myself "in shape" (who really is after a month of m/s and fatigue??), and have never really accomplished anything physically hard (had to quit training for a half marathon because of shin splints, ugh!).

As I research I find my heart being pulled toward an intervention-free labor and birth. I am hoping you ladies can help me with your experiences and encouragement as well as any references and resources I can look up. I'm especially interested in reading about whether going without pain meds can shorten labor (or going with them lengthens it?) and prevent other medical interventions. Also, what things did you do in the months leading up to delivery that you felt made your natural birth more "successful"?


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## Pat899 (Nov 11, 2008)

That is a real problem with our culture. If you go without the epi you "must have a high pain tolerance" or "you must be really strong." These are all lies.

The truth is I am a wimp and I cry when I stub my toe just like most people. The truth is an epi free birth is better for my baby. So I do it med-free. Because I want the best start for MY baby. The truth is a med free birth happens whether you cry and scream through the contractions or whether you mediatate through them. The truth is I bonded to my babies better when I went epi free. The truth is birth is a lifechanging brush with the eternal. You create new life. And these reasons made my decision to never use drugs to numb my chance to touch the eternal again, easy. But the birth, that was still hard.


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## ~Charlie's~Angel~ (Mar 17, 2008)

Are you kidding? Am I in shape? NO. Do I have a high threshhold for pain? Eh, it depends. My husband makes fun of my sound effects all the time. I make noise when my kids pounce on my stomach or spray me with an ice cold garden hose.

Truth is, aside from knowing not getting an epi was better for my baby, I also didnt want to be robbed of the experience of giving birth to my children. I also watched my mother not be able to hold my sister for almost the first WEEK of her life due to complications from her epi. That was AWFUL!!!! I also am not a huge fan of needles in my ARM, let alone my spinal column.

Truth be told, i spent a total of 30 seconds begging for one with my second child, but all that meant was I was in transition, fully dialated, and ready to push. He was in my arms 10 minutes later. It was AMAZING to be able to feel every morsel of that, trust me!


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## Lit Chick (Aug 15, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pat899* 
That is a real problem with our culture. If you go without the epi you "must have a high pain tolerance" or "you must be really strong." These are all lies.

YES.

Let me tell you an embarrassing story. Years ago, I stepped on a piece of glass. A small one. But there was blood. My husband grabbed some tweezers and was going to pull it out, and I freaked out so much that I nearly threw up. I was shaking and crying, it was insane. He never even touched me. When I got enough courage to address the issue myself, the glass was about the size of a grain of kosher salt. And the bleeding had already stopped.
Lesson? FEAR is worse than pain. My foot never actually hurt, but I was afraid that there was a giant shard of glass in me that would be horrible to pull out. I worked myself up into a terror for no reason, and I anticipated and reacted to pain that was never really there.

Jump to me being pregnant. I also thought I was a "wimp" and that you had to be "strong" to go without meds. But my mother, my mother in law, and my best friend all had med-free births... and some were not that easy.... hmm. And I really did not like the idea of epis, especially after my aunt had one that went wonky...

So, I started to read. I ended up going with a home birth, and it was fantastic. The best book for me in the early stages was "Ina May's Guide to Childbirth". Even if you have a hospital birth, read it! It's excellent. "Birthing From Within" is another good one.

Also, I took a childbirth class that was Bradley-oriented, and it was fantastic as well. Helped us understand each intervention and the benefits and risks. There was also a pain management session where we all experimented with different techniques. We held onto an ice cube and did different things to find out what technique let us hold on the longest. I thought I'd be a "distract me with chit chat" type or person, but when I closed my eyes, and kind of chanted, I was not that uncomfortable.

By the time I had the baby, I was ready. I was prepared. I was NOT afraid of the pain.... and thus it did not really "hurt". It's not that there was no pain... but the sensations were never scary, never a "make it stop!" feeling.

And this is probably WAY too much TMI, but I thought of labor as a lot like an aggressive poop. I'm sure everyone at some point has one that comes on a little strong that is NOT comfortable. But do you freak out? No, it's only poop. You relax, and it happens. Early labor and transition was pretty much like that for me - I reminded myself not to fight the feeling, and it made the process smoother. Still not exactly comfortable, but nothing horrible.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

I had two babies at home. No meds of any sort. If I'd been in a hospital they both would have been sections. At least with labor the pain is OVER when the baby is out. Surgery pain lasts for weeks.

Epis hugely increase the chance of ending up with a section.

-Angela


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## limette (Feb 25, 2008)

I was given pitocin during my labor (without consent) and shortly after begged for the epidural.

The epi did not work and shortly after the baby went into fetal distress (from the pit and the epi?) and I had a c-section.

For my second, I labored the same way (back labor) except we didn't go to the hospital until 9cm. No drugs, vaginal birth.

Do I have a high pain tolerance? Hell no. Am I in shape? Absolutely not.

I'm not going to lie, my births (posterior babies) were painful. But by the time they got painful (transition) It was too late to do anything about it anyway and you are so caught up in the process that you just go with it.


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## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

I have never had an epidural ( I figured if other women had been able to do it without for thousands of years before the advent of the epi, I could too), but my best birth yet was with hypnobabies. I highly recommend it









ETA... I should say I was in the worst shape for my hypnobabies birth - hypnobabies kept me in control of the pain. It really was great - I'm still shocked at how well it went.


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## Asiago (Jul 1, 2009)

I had a drug free birth. Laboring at home helped a lot, not even being in the hospital setting was an asset for me while laboring. Also in my birth plan I asked not to be offered pain relief, and no one offered at the hospital once we arrived. They were very respectful of my wishes.

I felt great after the birth and was glad I did it that way.

Actually laboring was harder than the birth. At least being at home was a comfort, I would not have wanted to labor at the hospital.


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## ExuberantDaffodil (May 22, 2005)

it is so much easier to resist the temptation of an epidural if you know one isn't available.









I had a pitocin-induced hospital labor with my first, and 5 minutes before he was born, I was hollering for the epidural (didn't get one, not enough time).

For my second, I had an all natural (accidently unassisted) homebirth, and 5 minutes before she was born, I hollered (but not for an epidural







).

I am not athletic, in shape, or tolerant of pain.


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## mamabear0314 (May 13, 2008)

I had a 10.5 lb baby. No drugs. No tears. Short, intense labor. It was traumatic for me but...it was best for my baby.

My own comfort will NEVER come before my children. It started with the birth of my son and it will continue until the day I die.

ETA: That is a standard I hold to myself, not for anyone else FYI.


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## Pirogi (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ExuberantDaffodil* 
it is so much easier to resist the temptation of an epidural if you know one isn't available.










One of the things that I remember from my first labor (at home) was thinking, in early labor, "This isn't so bad. I wonder why people want epidurals?" Then later, once the contractions got stronger, I remember thinking, "Yeah, I can understand now."







Now I don't remember it being painful. Intense, yes, but not painful.

Laura Shanley often asks, what do you believe about labor and birth? Do you believe that it must be painful? Do you believe that a birth with little or no pain is possible? For you? The mind is an incredibly powerful force. If you believe that you can birth your baby without pain medication, you will.


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## CoBabyMaker (Nov 13, 2008)

I haven't had my med-free birth yet so take what you want from this.
I had a very long labor with DD and eventually decided to get an epi. I regret it so much! I know that everyone's experience will be different but for me it meant that my right leg went completely numb but even worse I couldn't feel to push and ended up with a c/s.
Looking back I know I could have avoided it if I had more support. To me, great labor support is the best pain management. Get a doula if you can! If you can't afford that try to find a well-educated (about natural birth) friend. I was pretty opposed to having a lot of people there but wish that I had just one more person. Even maybe just keeping that extra person "on-call" for if DH needs a break or you just need support from someone else.


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## gcgirl (Apr 3, 2007)

I don't actually buy the "epi-free is better for baby" argument, EXCEPT that I believe the mother being mobile and free to move during labor can help birth progress and lead to fewer complications. That's better for both mom and baby. There are also times when an epidural is helpful. I personally had no problem avoiding the epi with both hospital births, one with pit and one without, but I had short, uncomplicated labors.

The thing about the labor pain is it's different from injury pain. It feels productive (usually), and while it hurts, it's totally possible to work with your body in a way you really can't with other types of pain. I wouldn't worry about your ability to handle it because it's such a different thing.


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## luv-my-boys (Dec 8, 2008)

I wanted to add something in, pain relief in child birth isnt an all or nothing situation regarding the epidural. There are other forms of pain relief, everything from I.V meds to local anesthetics to things like hypnobirthing and bradley method.

Im not going to lie. Birthing my kids is the most painful thing I have ever done...over and over again







But for me and how I wanted to experience my births I just positively didnt want an epi. That isnt to say that all epidurals are horrible, I've seen otherwise. Epidurals are as good as the person doing them and every person reacts differently to meds. I've seen great epidurals where mothers have been all with it and it ended up being a wonderful experience to what a lot of MDC mamas would consider traumatic.

I do definately suggest that you ask your hcp about pain control options available to you *Prior* to your birth. Being educated about what is and what they do is a better option than not knowing at all. It also allows you the opportunity to ask questions and decide when your not in the heat of the moment.


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## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

More of the same here.

1) Do I have a high tolerance for pain? Well, not when I've stubbed my toe or gotten a papercut or bonked my head on the washing machine door when I'm switching the laundry and didn't see it start to swing shut. Also, you should hear me complain about the arthritis in my knees.

2) Am I athletic? Hon, you actually started training for a half marathon? I am excited when I run a HALF MILE, and I've only done that a handful of times in my life. If my husband grabbed my ankles I would give it my all to do 10 situps and then collapse in a wimpy heap.

That said, I also believe it's not just a case of avoiding the epidural. If I were strapped into a hospital bed with pitocin being dumped into my veins, I would have an epidural. Even though I would be terrified to. I think even the wimpiest of us could have a natural birth, but only if she is in control. When "hospital policy" is in control, that means you are prevented from coping with the pain. My midwife checked me a couple of times in labor, and laying on my back in bed so she could do it was the most excruciating part - I can't imagine having to deal with the whole birth that way. (For what it's worth, if I birthed again I'd decline the checks too).

I didn't have pitocin. It's excruciating.

I had a birthing tub, for me it was wonderful. For another mama, relief might be in a birth ball. Or in walking back and forth. Tying down an animal in labor is the worst thing you can do to her. No wonder women beg for epidural anesthesia. But it's better to make sure you're not tied up!

So, again, I think we can all get through birth - heck, women deal with back labor and so on, all natural, not that it doesn't hurt but you find ways of coping. But standard hospital management removes all your coping mechanisms and leaves you in panic. I think that the choice you are looking into making is about a lot more than the epidural but about your entire approach to your birth - and I think it's one of THE most worthwhile choices you can make in your LIFE.


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## *MamaJen* (Apr 24, 2007)

For me, the big issue was avoiding the snowball of interventions. If you get the epidural, you're tethered to the bed, you're more likely to get pitocin, which can cause fetal distress and lead to a C-section, you're more likely to tear or get an epesiotemy because you can't feel your body's own urge to push or control your pushing, and so on.
If you are at all interested in a natural birth, I think the best thing to do is research and learn everything you can about birth. The Business of Being Born is a good place to start. Also, Your Best Birth is a pretty decent introduction. Gentle Birth Choices or Ina May's books are also good.
I just think there is such a crazy huge difference in the way OB-attended hospital births and midwife-attended homebirths are handled. For example, most midwives encourage you to use a birth tub (think a portable hot tub set up in your living room or in the birthing center). Birth tubs are really effective at relieving pain and relaxing you.
I think it is possible to have a natural birth in a hospital, but in many ways you are set up to fail, unless you get super educated and go in with good birth support, like a doula. When women go in with just a vague idea of not wanting drugs, they are not well-equipped to resist the onslaught of interventions. If you truly want a natural birth, your best bet is a midwife.
As far as the pain of a natural birth goes, I found it really manageable. For one thing, it's not like stubbing your toe or breaking your arm, where it's a sudden intense pain. The contractions start out mild and slowly build in intensity, plus you have a long break in between each one. As they get more intense, your body's natural endorphins start to kick in. In an undisturbed natural birth, it's seriously like being on drugs. I've heard it described as "laborland" or "going to Mars." For me, it was this warm, fuzzy, pain free place, and I totally forgot I was having a baby. I was actually surprised when he started crowning, because I was so in the moment. Labor was never what I would call painful. There was discomfort, but it was never unmanageable or overwhelming, and once I started pushing it honestly felt kind of good.
The other thing is, labor is a physical, physiological experience, but it's also an emotional and mental experience. If you are scared, if you feel vulnerable, if you feel unsupported, it will hurt. If you feel calm, if you feel like you're in a safe space, if you feel supported, it will hurt a lot less.
Anyway, it's a big learning curve, but there's a ton of great information out there.
This is also an interesting perspective: http://www.childbirthconnection.org/...ing_vision.pdf


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## cappuccinosmom (Dec 28, 2003)

I've had three hospital births and no epidural.







I don't love pain. Don't tolerate it well. But for me birth was very different than other types of pain. It was productive. I knew that I was going *through* it to get to a really great "prize" at the end--my baby.







I had one labor that hurt like heck but I was able to tolerate it. Now, the only way I could tolerate it was to be bent over at a 90 degree angle.







If I'd been required to stay in bed, on my back, I'd have been begging for the epidural. That's why watching those baby shows on TV make me cringe. I want to reach out and help those women get up and into a position that will allow them to tolerate the contractions.









Probably not good to start a massive exercise regimen now, but start walking every day, and doing recommended pregnancy exercises, especially squatting. Even moderate exercise like walking will make a big difference in your overall stamina and health. For many years, walking is pretty much the only form of exercise that's been available to me. I'm fat and definitely not in shape, but my births have all been short, even wit hthe larger babies.


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## Toolip (Mar 7, 2008)

I think that there was an article in Mothering (I don't remember the title, something about a tiger... or something like that, it was sometime in the last year I think, anyone remember?). It addressed all of the issues that you brought up, it was a great article, I think you would find it very encouraging.


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## MegBoz (Jul 8, 2008)

Girl, I think you're really selling yourself short! The fact that you even STARTED training for a half marathon tells me you're a lot more athletic & motivated to attack physical pursuits than the average American (bear in mind that the average American doesn't exercise _at all_.) Based on your sig, you're either an accountant or engineer & most people in those professions have a Bachelor's Degree - obviously _that_ took a lot of hard work, persistence, & perseverance to achieve! I don't think you should view yourself as a wimp. Seriously.

My advice is to read "The Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth" by Henci Goer. THAT will show you, without a doubt, that an epidural _has_ risks & complications (chiefly that it slows labor, leading to a need for pitocin to speed it up, which can lead to fetal distress, etc.) The 2 things that concerned me most were that it doubled your risk of CS (which I really wanted to avoid) & quadrupled your risk of insturmental delivery (forceps or vacuum) - the latter increases your risk of bad perineal tears (although the epidural itself ALSO increases your risk of bad perineal tears.)

Personally, I read "Thinking Woman's Guide" and decided that a medicalized birth is not for me! "I'll suck it up & deal with the pain." is what I thought.

I was also emotionally freaked out at the idea of all those tubes in me (not just the epidural catheter in my spine, but the resulting necessary blood pressure cuff around my arm, fetal monitor continuously around my belly, IV in my hand, and potential need for catheter in my urethrea to empty my bladder. EWWWWW! Reminded me of the movie "The Matrix" with people plugged up. That struck me as way less appealing than learning to cope with the normal, natural process of labor.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lit Chick* 
FEAR is worse than pain.










& I was personally way more scared of being out of control of my own body, controlled by doctors & machines, & the whole medicalized experience, than I was of the natural pain of birth.

Then I started Bradley Training & read "Ina Mays Guide to Childbirth" by the famous midwife Ina May Gaskin. (My library had it!) Then I started thinking, "Ya know, it's probably going to hurt, but I bet it will be manageable, at least 95% of the time, and it's probably going to be an awesome experience." *I started looking forward to giving birth and no longer viewing it as something I'd have to grit my teeth & suffer through* until it was over.

& ya know what, that's EXACTLY what it was like. Totally manageable, AWESOME experience!









Being a very logical, rational person, this processed worked for me. Based on your career, I'm guessing you're the same way!







So I recommend keeping your mind open & just getting educated. I also recommend trying to get some exercise - walking, & some upper body resistance training can be helpful - carrying a baby around gets tiring on the arms! Good luck!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *laohaire* 
I think that the choice you are looking into making is about a lot more than the epidural but about your entire approach to your birth - and I think it's one of THE most worthwhile choices you can make in your LIFE.









:


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## listipton (Jun 26, 2008)

Lots of the same as already posted. Here are my birth experiences, FWIW.

I have done childbirth with both the epi and natural. With dd, I read one book about the 'evils of epidurals' and it was so slanted that I thought there was no way it could be that bad. Everyone around me told me not to be a hero, it hurts so just don't feel it, and that I couldn't do it without drugs anyway because I am the 'girly' one in the family. In my experience (and this is just my experience talking), I was not let in on the 'secret' about the epi.....If it's done 'right' you still 'feel' the end, just not the contractions. Instead of being able to work with your body, you're stuck in bed with your legs being pulled up, directed pushing and nurses and docs yelling at you because while you can feel the end result (and yes, it hurts), you can't feel WHEN to do the things they're telling you to do. And I had an 'easy' first birth (fast and no pit. The nurses kept telling me they were so surprised that I didn't need it.) And I personally didn't tolerate the epi well (fever, shakes, backache).

With ds, I went to a different practice and worked with a group of midwives. I read Ina May's Guide to Childbirth and then everything I could get my hands on regarding what my body would most likely be doing during normal birth. The end result was that while childbirth does hurt, I was able to do it. It didn't hurt nearly as bad as my epi birth. I do vaguely remember a part in transition where I said 'this was a bad idea', but within 10 minutes, I was holding baby boy. Go for the natural mama, you CAN do it







.


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## Xavismom (Dec 22, 2009)

I am a HUGE wimp with pain. HUGE. And I have never been athletic, and I was admitedly not in good shape while I was preg. I did try to walk a lot ,but thats about it.

But I did have a 31 hr posterior labor, with no drugs. I'm not gonna lie, it hurt. But its a different kind of pain. I spent most of my labor in a tub, water helped a lot. We did Bradley.

Honestly, the worst part of my labor, was about 30 min of me having one of those straps around my belly listening to DSs heart. The rest of the labor, I was not hooked up to ANYthing, but at one point MW tried listening to DSs heart with the handheld thing, and said it sounded off, so she wanted to check it continually for a while. He was fine, so we took it off after a while. But it was AWFULL having to be in the bed with wires and things strapped on. I dont know how anyone makes it through an entire labor like that, UGH!!! It was so much better to be able to move, walk, squat, rock, sit in the tub, etc. The thought of being strapped into a bed the whole time with an epi would freak me out.

My birth was awesome. I loved it in the moment, and I still cherish the memory of every second. My two main reasons for going drug free, were so that I could fully be IN the moment for everything, and for DS's benifit/safety/health.


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## cristeen (Jan 20, 2007)

I haven't read all the responses, but I just wanted to share this...

I am not in shape, no way shape or form. I'm about 150 lbs overweight. If I had been in the hospital, I would have had a c-section, no question. I'm not big on pain, and the physical pain of labor was compounded by the fear associated with my previous loss.

All that being said, I was in labor for 5 days. I finally pushed him out the afternoon of the 5th day, in my bedroom, with no drugs whatsoever. It was the most intense exhausting painful experience ever. And knowing that I did that was the most exhilarating, freeing, empowering experience ever. Sure, I wish it hadn't taken 5 days, but looking at this little guy smiling at me, it was worth it to me to feel that I took control and did it. Both for him and for me.

Not sure if that's terribly coherent, but... I've been told my entire life that I can't do this or can't do that. Always can't. And I proved with this one act that I'm good enough and I can do anything.

But, if I had been in a hospital, I never would have been allowed to go 5 days (3 days with broken membranes). So for me, staying home was key.


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## Mandala126 (Aug 28, 2007)

One more out of shape mama here.








I have absolutely no pain tolerance. I pass out everytime I get blood work done.
I pass out watching movies involving needles and blood.
To be honest epi was never an option for me for one simple reason: I always thought it would lead to more and more interventions and eventually a c/s. (and of course I'd be scared of the needle going into my spine







).
Long story short, two babes, in the hospital - midwife attended, drug free both times.
You can totally do it!!


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## Right of Passage (Jul 25, 2007)

I can link you to my birth pictures. I am not in shape, well round is a shape, but I'm fluffy!

I have had one intervention filled birth, and 2 intervention free births. I would go no-epi in a heart beat, happily.

If I were in a situation where it was an epi or a cesarean, I would get the epi without guilt or shame.

You can do it, and better yet you can enjoy labor, you can enjoy birth.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gcgirl* 
I don't actually buy the "epi-free is better for baby" argument, EXCEPT that I believe the mother being mobile and free to move during labor can help birth progress and lead to fewer complications. That's better for both mom and baby. There are also times when an epidural is helpful...

The thing about the labor pain is it's different from injury pain. It feels productive (usually), and while it hurts, it's totally possible to work with your body in a way you really can't with other types of pain. I wouldn't worry about your ability to handle it because it's such a different thing.











I want to say one other thing, which is that if you put yourself in a situation where pharmaceutical pain relief is not available, then you won't get it. That's all.

I had a hospital birth but labored at home into the pushing phase. It was hands down the most painful experience of my life but the thought of an epidural (again, not that I'm strongly opposed to them personally) didn't cross my mind bc it just wasn't there, not on the radar screen. It wasn't about 'I can do it' or 'I can't do it,' it was just about getting through that next contraction.


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## laohaire (Nov 2, 2005)

Yeah, that is true. During my home birth - and it was painful, yeah - I wasn't thinking about an epidural at all. I wasn't thinking about anything except just making it through the contraction.

I will say, though, that the feeling of euphoria after the birth was just incomparable, totally worth it.


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## Lit Chick (Aug 15, 2007)

Oh yeah, the buzz! I almost forgot about that.
After all that work, all the pain and discomfort is gone. For a little bit, there's this great rush - I felt alert, and relaxed, but still a little out-of-it in a good way. And then that wears off, and there was this utterly relaxed bliss, like post awesome massage or orgasm - full body contentment. What a feeling!


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gcgirl* 
I don't actually buy the "epi-free is better for baby" argument, EXCEPT that I believe the mother being mobile and free to move during labor can help birth progress and lead to fewer complications.

All the research I've seen is pretty clear on this matter. Epidural does bring risks for the baby that they wouldn't have otherwise.

-Angela


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## dogretro (Jun 17, 2008)

Between pushes I was literally crying and begging my baby to please just come out already. But I did it w/ no drugs or interventions! And I am so proud of myself, which is totally worth all of the pain










A few things that helped: DH and I both read the book _The Birth Partner_. It is a great book that is written for dads & doulas. One v important tool we got from the book was using a code word. This was an unusual word that I picked that, if I said it, it meant, FOR REAL, that I wanted an epidural. This freed me up to be able to say what I felt, such as saying that I didn't think I could do this anymore. When dh heard that, instead of saying, "Do you think you want drugs?" he knew it was a cry for help & he spoke words of encouragement. It made my mental environment more relaxed.

I, too, stayed home for most of my labor (hospital midwife birth, awesome). It was painful, but obviously survivable. I *wanted* to experience it, so most of it did not bother me. I went thru transition at the hospital & I knew, rationally, that getting drugs was not a realistic option b/c I was so close to the pushing phase. That helped, too.

You are not going to go from 0 to 10 all at once, so pain med options should not be viewed in that manner, either. Can you get thru one more contraction? How about one more? How about 15 more minutes? I wanted to be fully present in each moment, even though I could have done w/ less pain, haha! I am v glad I did not use drugs, but after that experience, I reserve NO judgement for any woman who chooses drugs. There is no failure in birth, just different experiences.


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## treeoflife3 (Nov 14, 2008)

I'm a fat lazy wimp with absolutely no pain tolorance (AND I bruise when you LOOK at me) and I gave birth epi free.

I firmly believe that our ability to get through birth naturally has everything to do with our state of mind and not our bodies. Our bodies already know what to do and tell us what they are doing... it is our job to learn how to listen and follow accordingly.

If you go in thinking everything is going to be painful and you need to AVOID feeling the pain or you'll not make it through, chances are you'll want an epi... but if you go in with the mindframe that every contraction is really just your body trying to tell you how to move (or not move) and what position to be in (or not be in) and that you just need to focus exactly on what your feeling until you have a breather between contractions, I think most women can make it through.

As someoen said, labor pain isn't like the pain that comes with a broken arm. Labor pains come in waves and have a real purpose... it is quite literally your body doing something to get the baby out, rather than your body screaming 'something isn't right here!' ride the wave and enjoy the breaks between. Staying relaxed, keeping your humor, following the sphincter rule, being in a comfortable place where you can really just relax and do whatever feels right... all of those can make for an awesome birthing experience. Yes, it might hurt a LOT but some people never feel pain... its all about how you manage it... the pain doesn't have to be something you need to get away from.

Reading Ina May's guide to childbirth helped me a lot. It gave me the confidence that I CAN do this and it gave me lots of ideas on HOW to do it.

In my own birthing experience, I barely even noticed when I was in transition, which was definitely the hardest part (other than the charlie horse I got towards the end while pushing haha but I don't think that happens to everyone.. ) and I had ONE brief thought about epi's... but then I was moving on to another position and figuring out how to follow my body and I forgot all about it. I had more important things to focus on going on in my body than to focus on how an epi might make me numb.

epidurals scare the crap out of me anyway.... I really don't want a needle in my spine.


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## Anna's Lovey (Dec 24, 2008)

Watched "The Business of Being Born" about two weeks before my due date. Decided I didn't want the Epi. Did NOTHING to prepare. Had a hospital birth with pit. but no epi. I'm a wimp when it comes to pain, but it was all very bearable, and I felt really exhilarated afterwards knowing that I did it without the epidural.
Good luck to you whatever you decide.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
All the research I've seen is pretty clear on this matter. Epidural does bring risks for the baby that they wouldn't have otherwise.

I'm not sure what risks you're referring to specifically but I agree there have been findings of prolonged second stage and somewhat higher risk of instrumental delivery (which may or may not be improved by the common practice of turning down the epidural for the delivery).

As gcgirl said, these are probably related to mom's reduced ability to move and feel what is happening.

However, a common fallacy I see on MDC is that epidurals raise Caesarean rates. The studies I have seen pretty consistently find that caesarean rates do not appear to be elevated by the use of epidural analgesia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16235275
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18044297
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14695735
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12005470

Another one I see circulating around here is that epidurals adversely affect neonatal alertness. This is also not supported by the available literature (actually one small study found better alertness in the epidural babies):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2718709

On balance I agree that the less intervention you have the easier the labor, delivery, and recovery are likely to be. But I don't agree that there is good evidence for adverse outcomes *for the baby* from an epidural. I think the benefits of skipping the epi mostly accrue to the mom so it really is a personal decision and one that should be made without mama-guilt.


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## Pat899 (Nov 11, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *gcgirl* 
*I don't actually buy the "epi-free is better for baby" argument, EXCEPT that I believe the mother being mobile and free to move during labor can help birth progress and lead to fewer complications.* That's better for both mom and baby. There are also times when an epidural is helpful. I personally had no problem avoiding the epi with both hospital births, one with pit and one without, but I had short, uncomplicated labors.

The thing about the labor pain is it's different from injury pain. It feels productive (usually), and while it hurts, it's totally possible to work with your body in a way you really can't with other types of pain. I wouldn't worry about your ability to handle it because it's such a different thing.

The FACT is that an epidural does add risks to the baby. It is not just about mom being mobile. You are introducing a powerful narcotic to a baby via the mom during a stressful time for the baby. Common sense says its dangerous. But more importantly, there are real documented risks.


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## AmyKT (Aug 20, 2009)

I have a fairly decent tolerance for pain, but I'm no superwoman. When I cramp at AF time, I always load up on Aleve. Why suffer if you don't have to? Still, I wasn't willing to deal with the risks of an epidural -- not to myself or to my baby. I took a hypnobirthing class and found the meditations to be very helpful. I listened to one track for an hour and dilated 4 cm while not feeling much pain at all. Don't get me wrong -- most of it hurt like crazy, but once it was over, it was over. And eating a meal after having a drug-free birth? It's the best thing ever.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pat899* 
The FACT is that an epidural does add risks to the baby. It is not just about mom being mobile. You are introducing a powerful narcotic to a baby via the mom during a stressful time for the baby.

No, you are not. The epidural remains in the mother's epidural space. It does not enter her bloodstream and hence cannot be transmitted to the baby.


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## MyFullHouse (Apr 23, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *treeoflife3* 
I'm a fat lazy wimp with absolutely no pain tolorance (AND I bruise when you LOOK at me) and I gave birth epi free.


Me, too!

But I had an epidural with my first, and Stadol with my second. I went on to have a 100% natural labor with my third, and an augmented (but no pain drugs) labor with my fourth.

My drug-free births were BY FAR the better experiences for me, maybe because I'm a control freak. With the epi, I lost control of my body. With the Stadol, I lost control of my mind. With both, all I kept wishing was for everything to be over.

With the last two births, yeah, I still wanted it to be over, but I was able to focus on being PRODUCTIVE and ACTIVE in my labor. It gave me control, and something to do with my time.









Also, with the pain meds, I was constantly thinking about their wearing off. It kept me nervous and distracted (in a bad way.) With the natural labors, I was.... *with* my pain, for lack of better words. I was able to *use* it, and look at it as positive progress and a guide to the end of the road.

Also, I was able to walk to and from the bathroom unassisted, right after delivery. A nice added bonus!

While I've never taken a natural child birth class, the Bradley books helped me A LOT! I can't wait to start flipping though them again!


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## beckyand3littlemonsters (Sep 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pat899* 
That is a real problem with our culture. If you go without the epi you "must have a high pain tolerance" or "you must be really strong." These are all lies.

The truth is I am a wimp and I cry when I stub my toe just like most people. The truth is an epi free birth is better for my baby. So I do it med-free. Because I want the best start for MY baby. The truth is a med free birth happens whether you cry and scream through the contractions or whether you mediatate through them. The truth is I bonded to my babies better when I went epi free. The truth is birth is a lifechanging brush with the eternal. You create new life. And these reasons made my decision to never use drugs to numb my chance to touch the eternal again, easy. But the birth, that was still hard.









i am the biggest whimp i know lol i've been almost in tears just brushing my hair, however all my lo's have been born at home without pain relief, actually tell a lie i had 1 puff of gas and air with my 1st and it was awful.
am in shape? yes, round is a shape


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## St. Margaret (May 19, 2006)

I worried, too, about not being in shape or strong enough for natural birth. SO not an issue. The trick is PREPARING. And I don't mean working out, although walks and swims and yoga were all good. I did hypnobabies and I was pretty good about doing the CDs for a long time, every day, and practicing during the day when I could, at the end. birth was challenging, it was intense, and it was WONDERFUL. I am way more scared of an epidural than natural childbirth, and let me tell you-- I am LOOKING FORWARD to birth this time around. I read all the good books, Thinking Woman's Guide, LLL's book, Sears, some others Kitzinger I think, Birthing from Within, some Ima May but by then I had it down, it was the same stuff... and I got a supportive team all around me, a supportive place to birth (this time a homebirth unless Dr. Wonderful gets reinstated safely, hopefully somewhere else!), and did some nice birth prep in a class (with our doula) with my hubby, where we could talk and share... and it just carried me right through to a successful birth. I know there can be things like bad positions, but that's why you get a good birth attendant... otherwise natural birth is SO do-able. I could look at the strong feelings of birth as something *I* was doing, my body was doing, and feel very comfortable. I was glad when it was done at the time, but said right away I wanted to have like 5 more kids, so it wasn't THAT bad







.

Getting to a place where you really believe birth is normal and no one is going to spring fear upon you is key. That's what slows down labor, and makes it hurt, when you fear and tense up. Epis slow down labor. Then they give you pit and baby goes into distress and you end up with a section. Pretty common pattern these days, sadly. But it doesn't have to be that way and if you want it, you can have a better birth.

You can do it!


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## milosmomma (May 9, 2007)

I'm going to echo what everyone has already said, but...

I had an epi with my first labor (which led to a CS) and a med-free birth with my second. Without the epi I felt SO much more involved in the labor, pushing, etc. Like others have mentioned, I just went into my "zone" and did my thing. By that time, I was so prepared that I just sort of let my body do what it was supposed to do.

I cannot stress enough how helpful "Ina May's Guide to Childbirth" was for me. The first half of the book is birth stories and I remember reading it during pregnancy #2 and wishing that I'd had it during pregnancy #1. Not only did it "normalize" natural birth in my mind (by reading successful birth story after successful birth story over and over), but it altered the way I thought about labor (using the word "rush" instead of the word "contraction").

I went in knowing that I didn't want meds, but telling myself that I'd "play it by ear". When the nurse asked whether I'd want meds, I told her that I was going to see how it went and I'd let her know. Then I went through my entire labor looking a few minutes ahead. "I'm not going to ask until at least the top of the hour. I can make it through one more contraction. etc". I think a lot of people say the same thing about dieting.. "I'll allow myself a cupcake...tomorrow."

In the end, everybody acts/labors/births differently and many women won't know how they'll react until it's happening. But if you're prepared and you trust yourself (even if you're scared), you'll be fine.


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## mamabear0314 (May 13, 2008)

Epidural risks to baby:

* Fetal distress; abnormal fetal heart rate
* Drowsiness at birth; poor sucking reflex
* Poor muscle strength and tone in the first hours.

While in-utero, they may become lethargic and have trouble getting into position for delivery. These medications have been known to cause respiratory depression, and decreased fetal heart rate in newborns.

ETA: These are the reasons I wouldn't get one. But as long as it's an educated choice that's what matters. I don't think it benefits anyone to pretend there are no risks to baby though.


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## Smithie (Dec 4, 2003)

"My mom had some pretty bad experiences twenty years ago. She said after those experiences, she decided to go natural on the last one because, "it just couldn't be worse than the epidural." (Well, she proclaimed to me that it was, and if she had to do it again she would go ahead with the epi.)"

Yeah, purely in terms of the amount of physical distress one must endure in the momnent, an epidural is less distressing than an unmedicated birth.

I have had three births - one at a birth center, one at home, one in a hospital with pitocin and an epi. None of my births were "bad." All three of my babies were healthy and pink and nursed right away.

Each birth was what I had decided I wanted, based on what I knew about my body and what was going on with my family at each point in time. That last birth, with the Pit and the epi, was a birth where I just had no interest in pain. I didn't have the time or emotional energy to put into getting over all that pain, and I had confidence that my uterus would do its job even with the drugs (I have 5-hour unmedicated labors).

BUT, this is your first birth, and if you decide that unmedicated/natural is what you want, then I think you'll be really happy with the experience. (Whereas, if you do it to please or impress your spouse or mother or whoever else, it's not so likely to turn out well). If you end up deciding to birth without meds, I urge you to do so out of a hospital. Hospitals are just not the ideal location to be private, get naked, work with the pain, and have an unimpeded natural birth. Even though I gave birth twice with very minimal interventions of any kind, I don't think that I could have pulled it off in the hospital environment.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *micah_mae_* 
Epidural risks to baby:

* Fetal distress; abnormal fetal heart rate

True but temporary (it's a response to lowered blood pressure in the mom and evens out after half an hour or so AFAIK)

Quote:

* Drowsiness at birth; poor sucking reflex
* Poor muscle strength and tone in the first hours.
These are not supported by the literature as far as I know. Could you link some studies to back this up? I'd be curious to see.

Quote:

ETA: These are the reasons I wouldn't get one. But as long as it's an educated choice that's what matters. I don't think it benefits anyone to pretend there are no risks to baby though.
I think it's of benefit to have as close to a true picture of the situation as possible. Obviously you wouldn't want to paper over real risks but I also see a lot of non-fact-based scaremongering about epidurals and I don't think that's beneficial either.


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## mamabear0314 (May 13, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 
True but temporary (it's a response to lowered blood pressure in the mom and evens out after half an hour or so AFAIK)

These are not supported by the literature as far as I know. Could you link some studies to back this up? I'd be curious to see.

I think it's of benefit to have as close to a true picture of the situation as possible. Obviously you wouldn't want to paper over real risks but I also see a lot of non-fact-based scaremongering about epidurals and I don't think that's beneficial either.

Looks like it's mostly cited from websites like aafp.org and childbirth books..

Compiled using information from the following sources:

American Academy of Family Physicians, http://www.aafp.org

William's Obstetrics Twenty-Second Ed. Cunningham, F. Gary, et al, Ch. 19.

Mayo Clinic Guide To A Healthy Pregnancy Harms, Roger W., M.D., et al, Part 2.

39 Goer, Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth, p. 133

40 Goer, Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth, p. 270

41 Goer, Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth, p. 270-271

42 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-po...=6&db=m&Dopt=b

43 Goer, Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth, p. 270-271

44 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-po...=6&db=m&Dopt=b

I don't think it's scaremongering..if there's even a chance of a risk it's too much for some people. I'm extremely paranoid about my kids, especially while pregnant and it's just too much for me (and I'm sure I'm not alone).


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## laughingfox (Dec 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 
I'm not sure what risks you're referring to specifically but I agree there have been findings of prolonged second stage and somewhat higher risk of instrumental delivery (which may or may not be improved by the common practice of turning down the epidural for the delivery).

As gcgirl said, these are probably related to mom's reduced ability to move and feel what is happening.

However, a common fallacy I see on MDC is that epidurals raise Caesarean rates. The studies I have seen pretty consistently find that caesarean rates do not appear to be elevated by the use of epidural analgesia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16235275
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18044297
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14695735
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12005470

Another one I see circulating around here is that epidurals adversely affect neonatal alertness. This is also not supported by the available literature (actually one small study found better alertness in the epidural babies):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2718709

On balance I agree that the less intervention you have the easier the labor, delivery, and recovery are likely to be. But I don't agree that there is good evidence for adverse outcomes *for the baby* from an epidural. I think the benefits of skipping the epi mostly accrue to the mom so it really is a personal decision and one that should be made without mama-guilt.

Unless I am mistaken, those linked studies all seem to have been conducted by hospitals and by anesthesiology departments at medical schools- people who stand to financially benefit from continued and/or increased epi usage- certainly not an unbiased source.


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## JennTheMomma (Jun 19, 2008)

I had my first son in the hospital with an epidural. I hated the epi. It worked for 45 minutes to allow me to sleep for a bit, but once it wore off it made me feel sick and I had back pain for almost a year, and then sporadic pain for months after that.

My second son was born a month ago, at home with no medications. It was painful and intense, but it didn't get painful or intense until I was in transition, and in the hospitals around here that is the cutoff point for medications. During the time of transition it felt like forever, but in retrospect, it only lasted about 2 hours. My recovery has been night and day from the first. First I couldn't walk or sit for 2 weeks. My second I was sitting and walking just a few hours later. I could also pee without any discomfort the day of birth. My first son was extremely sleepy after birth, I didn't see him awake until 2 days later. I couldnt' BF him, he wouldnt' wake up for it. DS2 was alert at birth and stayed alert for 5 hours, latch was great and BFing took place about 30 minutes afterwords.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *micah_mae_* 
Looks like it's mostly cited from websites like aafp.org and childbirth books..

Those have to be getting the info from somewhere though?

Quote:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-po...=6&db=m&Dopt=b

44 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-po...=6&db=m&Dopt=b
Those links don't work.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughingfox*
Unless I am mistaken, those linked studies all seem to have been conducted by hospitals and by anesthesiology departments at medical schools- people who stand to financially benefit from continued and/or increased epi usage - certainly not an unbiased source.

Sure, since those are the people with the interest, resources, and expertise necessary to conduct such studies.

If you have other data to offer I'd love more information. However I don't think it's legitimate to dismiss all the available studies in favor of unsupported claims, just because you don't trust doctors. You can examine a study and assess its importance/relevance given whatever design flaws it has, but blanket rejection of all systematically gathered data is logical fallacy.


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## Veritaserum (Apr 24, 2004)

You may want to look into Hypnobabies. I had an epidural with my first baby and used hypnosis with my last four. I'm a pain WIMP and I _hate_ pain, but I was able to give birth without pain meds thanks to the hypno-anesthesia skills I learned from Hypnobabies. With hypnosis I've been able to give birth comfortably (only pressure/tightening), which I liked better than an epidural (which was only painless after I got it and had other side effects that I didn't like). I loved my hypnosis births and would never choose to give birth without it in the future.


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## SublimeBirthGirl (Sep 9, 2005)

Take a good childbirth class. There are many to choose from and you can find the one that fits you best. Get your partner on board. If you're giving birth in a hospital, hire a doula. Seriously consider looking into homebirth, at least talking to some midwives. Giving birth without drugs in the hospital can be a huge challenge, because they simply aren't set up to support it. Giving birth without drugs at home is much easier and just as safe (I've had 2 babies, one hospital and one home, both in the water, no epidural either time).

I really recommend getting over your fears of the epidural. Fear of an epidural will not carry you through transition. You won't care anymore. I know from my first. I was giving birth without an epidural purely for reasons based on fear. I didn't want drugs in my baby. I didn't want a needle in my spine. When I hit transition not a one of those things mattered to me. All I wanted was to make it go away. I had a good midwife and a supportive husband and they got me through without it, but it was a close call. IMO decisions should not be based on fear.

With my 2nd, I had a much easier time. Being at home was part of it, but so was embracing the idea of natural birth for its own sake. There was no fear anymore, just knowing that natural birth had its own rewards. Fear only holds us back; we should try to be empowered instead.

Check out The Business of Being Born. There's a great segment in there that talks about natural birth having benefits beyond the mere avoidance of drugs. It's My Body, My Baby, My Birth is great too. You'll probably have to buy that one but it's only $12 or so.


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## SublimeBirthGirl (Sep 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 
No, you are not. The epidural remains in the mother's epidural space. It does not enter her bloodstream and hence cannot be transmitted to the baby.

I've seen at least one to the contrary, that the drugs do enter the mother's blood stream just in smaller quantities than if they were put directly into it the way IV narcotics are. I'll have to see if I can find it.


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## laughingfox (Dec 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 
If you have other data to offer I'd love more information. However I don't think it's legitimate to dismiss all the available studies in favor of unsupported claims, just because you don't trust doctors. You can examine a study and assess its importance/relevance given whatever design flaws it has, but blanket rejection of all systematically gathered data is logical fallacy.

I'm skeptical of _any_ study from anyone with a vested interest, doctor or not. That stance seems pretty logical to me.

I did examine the abstracts of those studies a little bit.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16235275
This one shows an increase in instrumental delivery, which is not without its own problems. I know you were just talking about c-sec rates, but the OP







did want to know about other interventions, and there you have them.
Also, it's largely comparing epi vs. opioid.
I found it interesting that this study stated that it's purpose was to look for adverse effects, but they specifically did not look for severe or long-term adverse effects.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18044297
I don't know enough about Saudi birth practices to say how relevant that study is to me.
You can tell there's a difference in the way birth is handled in the society in which I live vs. the society in which the study was done in just by looking at the numbers: 106 people in the study got epidurals, 755 did not. Those are certainly not the numbers you'll find in a US hospital.
It also shows increase in instrumental delivery.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14695735
This study does show an increase in labor duration (which the OP wanted to know about) , and again an increase in instrumental deliveries. However, it's another one comparing epi vs. opioid, so it's not entirely relevant when one wants to compare c-section rates in epi births vs. drug-free births (which is what I assume the OP meant by "natural").

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12005470
This study also shows a longer second stage for the epi moms, as well as more augmentation, increased likelihood of fever, and increased chances of urinary incontinence. However, again, it's comparing epis and opiods, not epis and drug-free.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2718709
This study is so statistically insignificant it hurts.
It compares a group of 15 babies with a group of 19.
I can conduct a larger "study" than that just by talking to a small group of friends.

Also of interest- the Cochrane study mentioned in the study in your first link was done at a hospital with a 12% c-section rate. That's far lower than national average, and it hurts the relevance of the study to have it done at a hospital where c-sections are already avoided more than is "normal".
That info comes from the text of this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1481670/, which showed that epidurals increased c-section rates more than any other factor.

You can find studies that say _anything_. That's the beauty of the internet, and of malleable statistics. It's also why I always consider the source.


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## beep (Aug 18, 2009)

When I gave birth to my son, I had to have an epidural for medical reasons. I knew this would be the case beforehand, and really grieved that I couldn't have an unmedicated birth and worried that my son would be affected and that we both would get caught up in a cascade of interventions. As it turned out, I was able to have a safe, peaceful, vaginal hospital birth and did feel labor & my son coming out, but with greatly decreased risk to myself and no pain. The recovery was also straightforward. I put in a lot of time up front with the HCPs (OB, anesthesiologist, midwife) and worked on being very clear about my wishes & needs and communicating well, and this made all the difference for me.

I tell my story not to argue for an epidural, but to say two things. First, just to say that if for whatever reason an epidural is needed or desirable, it is still possible that things will go well. Second, that getting whatever support you need to have whatever birth you need/want is super important. I was happy to read that you know in your heart what you want... best of luck in going for it!


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## Comtessa (Sep 16, 2008)

While I was pregnant, I announced to any and everyone who would listen that I would not _for any reason_ consider having an epidural in labor. I was convinced that I would never get an epidural, I was horrified at the idea of people actually _electing_ for them. I was so upset by women in my (hospital-based) childbirth class who were making plans to bring video games to the hospital with them so they could play away the hours of (presumably drugged) labor. I was like, "you are going through one of the most intense and sacred transitions of your life, and you're going to play video games through it?" For me, the epidural represented all of our culture's most appalling techniques for avoiding encounter with the transcendent, the liminal and the transformative.

I had an epidural in labor.

Birth (and parenting too!) serves up a hefty slice of humble pie to us all.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *dogretro* 
Between pushes I was literally crying and begging my baby to please just come out already.

Me too! I kept saying, "let go, let go, let go," and the MW started getting concerned and asking all sorts of questions about my emotional state and was there something I needed to talk about. I just looked at her blankly for a minute until I realized why she was asking, and then I laughed out loud and said, "oh, I wasn't telling _myself_ to let go, I was telling the _baby_ to let go and come out already!"

Really, though, the pain of labor was never so bad that I felt I really couldn't handle it. It was the intense _work_ of labor that finally overwhelmed me -- my body couldn't sustain it. I was in transition for a LONG time (about 10 hours), and I was vomiting a LOT, so I started to get dehydrated, which started to affect my energy levels too.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cristeen* 
I was in labor for 5 days. I finally pushed him out the afternoon of the 5th day, in my bedroom, with no drugs whatsoever. ...if I had been in a hospital, I never would have been allowed to go 5 days (3 days with broken membranes). So for me, staying home was key.

5 days! You're the first person I've "met" who had a longer labor than me!!!







I was in labor for three days, and ended up transferring for exhaustion. I'm sure that if I had planned a hospital birth, they would have interfered to 'hurry things up' long before I decided I needed intervention. When I got there, I told the doctor, "I just need an epidural and some rest." He said, "you're dilated too far for an epidural," and I said, "trust me, this is still going to take many more hours." Thank heaven he trusted my judgment on that! (It took 5 more hours before I was ready to push, and 4 more hours of pushing.) I am convinced that the epidural is what made it possible for me to rest, let my body relax and finish dilation, let the baby slowly move into the position she needed in order to be born. It slowed the whole process down, which is what I needed in order to have the strength to push her out.

All of that is to say -- in my case, I truly believe that the epidural was a reasonable intervention that made it possible for me to have a vaginal birth. If I had gone on with my endless transition without IV fluids or sleep for another 5 hours, I (or the baby) very likely would have crashed from exhaustion and dehydration and ended up with an emergency C-section.

However, everything that MegBoz says about epidurals is true:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MegBoz* 
...not just the epidural catheter in my spine, but the resulting necessary blood pressure cuff around my arm, fetal monitor continuously around my belly, IV in my hand, and potential need for catheter in my urethrea to empty my bladder. EWWWWW! ... I was personally way more scared of being out of control of my own body, controlled by doctors & machines, & the whole medicalized experience, than I was of the natural pain of birth.

Me too!!! But in the end, because I was so aware of all of these "extra" things that came with the epi, none of them were actually too bad. Well, the catheter was gross. But besides some lingering back pain at the catheter site for several months, I had no other ill effects from any of these things. Thank heaven. Because I was prepared for it when I requested the epi, I didn't feel at all disempowered by all the medical stuff. (I did have some very sharp words with the resident who tried to put an internal fetal monitor into my baby's scalp _without even asking me_... and after that, they were careful not to do anything without getting my consent.) And since I was already so exhausted when I got to the hospital, I didn't even mind that I couldn't get up and walk around after the epi -- because I was too tired to feel that I _could_.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *listipton* 
I was not let in on the 'secret' about the epi.....If it's done 'right' you still 'feel' the end, just not the contractions. Instead of being able to work with your body, you're stuck in bed with your legs being pulled up, directed pushing and nurses and docs yelling at you because while you can feel the end result (and yes, it hurts), you can't feel WHEN to do the things they're telling you to do.

Yup. All of this is true. I hated it all. And the epi certainly slowed down my pushing stage because it interfered with effective pushing. But I don't think I could have done anything differently; even my HB MW thought the only way I was going to get baby under the pelvic bone was by pushing flat on my back. I tried some other pushing positions after they dialed down the epi, and none of them felt right to me -- the one that worked best with my body and my baby actually seems to have been this one. Of course, if I'd been at home and undeterred by cords and lines and tubes everywhere, I might have tried some other positions and found one that worked better, but as it was, this did _eventually_ work. Thank heaven for my supportive, hands-off OB, who waited quietly through 4 hours of pushing while I worked to get the baby out. And, he never once gave me a hard time about "giving in" to the epidural -- he and I both knew that I wouldn't have asked for it if it weren't really necessary for me.

So my advice is this: plan _not_ to get an epi, because you absolutely _can_ do it -- labor pain is absolutely manageable without it. But don't make grand pronouncements about how you'd never get one, either, because you might just end up eating some good healthy servings of crow later.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughingfox* 
I'm skeptical of _any_ study from anyone with a vested interest, doctor or not. That stance seems pretty logical to me.

Right, so it should apply equally to the more NCB-friendly providers. I'd say Goer and Gaskin have a 'vested interest' in promoting NCB, wouldn't you?

The fact is that everyone has a viewpoint, and there is no such thing as a study done by someone without one. If you reject all studies done by people with 'interests' you reject all the available data. (It's certainly appropriate to examine study particulars with a critical eye, but that's different from rejecting them out of hand because you think the authors are personally suspect.)

[start peripheral discussion of study particulars]
_http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16235275
This one shows an increase in instrumental delivery,_
Yup, as I noted in my post #32. The prolonged second stage and increased rate of instrumentation (something like a 1/3 increased risk) are relatively consistent findings.

_I know you were just talking about c-sec rates_
Indeed, because it's one I see talked about a lot on MDC and many posters seem to assume that it's true that epidurals raise section rates.

_I found it interesting that this study stated that it's purpose was to look for adverse effects, but they specifically did not look for severe or long-term adverse effects._
OK, well if you have data to cite about those effects, again, I'd be interested. This study looks at short-term effects. The Cochrane review, for example, looked at long-term risk of backache. (They didn't find a difference.) What effects were you thinking of?

_Also of interest- the Cochrane study mentioned in the study in your first link was done at a hospital with a 12% c-section rate._

Huh? Cochrane is an independent group that does systematic reviews of the literature. That review covered twenty-one studies involving 6664 women.
[/end peripheral discussion of study particulars]

Quote:

You can find studies that say _anything_. That's the beauty of the internet, and of malleable statistics. It's also why I always consider the source.
OK then, so when people are saying that epidurals raise section rates and cause drowsy babies they should easily be able to find citations to back up those claims, right? But I never see that done here.

By the way, from some of the things in your post it sounds like you think I'm saying an epidural birth is entirely equivalent to an unmedicated birth. Obviously that is not true. What I did say is that a large part of the difference arises from the mom's immobilization, and that overall the risk *to the baby* is rather small. (Yes there is an increase in instrumental delivery, rates of instrumental delivery range from 5-20% so a 1/3 increase takes you from, eg, a 10% chance to a 13% chance; you can make your own value judgement about the importance of that effect.)

I think there are good reasons to avoid epidurals (as I did in my birth) when possible, but I think most of the benefits of avoiding the epidural accrue to the mom (no need for directed pushing, easier recovery, etc.).

Overall I would say the 'guilt value' of epidurals among NCB advocates *hugely* outweighs their actual risks to the neonate.


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## expat-mama (May 28, 2008)

I just want to say that this is a really GREAT thread for me to be reading as I am getting close to my baby's birth and preparing everyday for it. Thanks!
It's really nice and helpful to hear positive stories of women who were perhaps not so confident in their strength or pain-tolerance going through epi-free labour and birth and being so happy about it after all!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MegBoz* 
My advice is to read "The Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth" by Henci Goer.

Personally, I read "Thinking Woman's Guide" and decided that a medicalized birth is not for me! "I'll suck it up & deal with the pain." is what I thought.

& I was personally way more scared of being out of control of my own body, controlled by doctors & machines, & the whole medicalized experience, than I was of the natural pain of birth.

Yep, the "Thinking Woman's Guide" certainly hardened my resolve and gave me the facts to back up what I felt in my heart was right for me and my baby.
And I totally agree with some PPs who have said that an epidural is a lot scarier than the prospect of a natural birth! A needle...in my SPINE?!? Eek. Just the fact that the thought of that makes me shudder and my stomach turn, whereas the thought of a natural birth doesn't is a sign that I'm making the right choice for me.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Comtessa* 

So my advice is this: plan _not_ to get an epi, because you absolutely _can_ do it -- labor pain is absolutely manageable without it. But don't make grand pronouncements about how you'd never get one, either, because you might just end up eating some good healthy servings of crow later.

Thanks for this reminder! I'm usually a really adamant person and I usually like to express my beliefs loud and clear (when the topics come up) to anyone who will listen. But I've been trying to be careful about this (having eaten humble pie more than enough times because of my loud-mouth disposition







)- birth is a private thing and in our culture and society it seems complicated by so many factors. I do have strong beliefs about it, but unless someone asks me why I think my choice is right for ME, I'll keep 'em to myself. It's hard though when you mention your choices and it seems like there are so many people ready to tell you can't do it and why you'll fail.







I wish THEY would keep their ideas about birth to themselves too.


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## teenyxdoodlez (Apr 2, 2010)

*I'm only posting to encourage Original poster to go epi free-NOT to debate!!







*
I'll keep my response short and simple and based on personal experience only. MY reasoning and feeling towards having an epi: I'm a super tiny girl, not athletic or "in shape" what-so-ever. The most exercise I get is walking..that's it..lol! Pain tolerance is eh..I can deal with it if I HAVE to. The thought of giving birth is, of course, scary to anyone, especially for a first time mother like I (at the time) was. The thought of shoving a needle in my spine was even scarier to me. Not to mention the thought of my baby being medicated as well. Going through my whole entire pregnancy eating healthy, getting "exercise"..lol..and doing the right things only to, at the very last minute, shoot my child up with drugs, BECAUSE THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT YOUR DOING, to avoid going through pain just seemed a little selfish to me. So I decided, after much research and encouragement from ALL the women in my family who have all had med free births, to steer clear of ANY pain meds at all costs. My husband knew too that at my weakest point in labor to not let me cave in and get them.
Well, the time came to have our first born. I was in so much pain I thought it would never end. I asked the nurse to have something put in my i.v to take the edge off. She told me no..lol as did my husband. I pleaded, I cried, and the answer was still no (luckily I was dialating too quickly so either way it was a big fat NO!). I had to get through it without drugs..so that's EXACTLY what I did. Let me tell you it was the best experience of my life!! In the end my baby was born healthy and *lively*! I had the biggest rush of energy afterwards and felt amazing. Knowing that I just gave birth to an 8pd baby with no drugs was the best feeling i've ever had in my entire life. I felt like I was the strongest woman alive. When it came time to have my second, Same feeling, AMAZING!!!
The pain only lasts for so long and will eventually pass. The thought of knowing that I was strong enough to bring my children into this world on my own and drug-free, Is an indescribable feeling of pride and strength that will NEVER leave me! Not to mention the bragging rights I now have







. In the hospital I was known as the "tiny patient who had a drug-free birth in 4 hrs (1 1/1hrs with my second). Even all the Dr.s and nurses were in awe







! Made me feel amazing and even prouder of the choice I made.
It will only be a matter of days (Hopefully!!) before I do it all over again. I actually look forward to this amazing experience that we call natural med-free childbirth! I can't wait 'till the day comes when I can say "Yep, these are my 3 babies and I brought them into the world without doping them up and as naturally as could possibly be!"
Whatever choice you decide on, I wish you a happy and healthy birth experience that you too will be proud of







. We all know sometimes things can take a turn and birth plans don't always go the way we want or imagine them to be. In your case, I hope you get whatever type of birth it is you want for you and your LO!!


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## Youngfrankenstein (Jun 3, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 

I think there are good reasons to avoid epidurals (as I did in my birth) when possible, but I think most of the benefits of avoiding the epidural accrue to the mom (no need for directed pushing, easier recovery, etc.).

Overall I would say the 'guilt value' of epidurals among NCB advocates *hugely* outweighs their actual risks to the neonate.

I agree with you. Deciding based on fear, guilt, or "the ewww factor" aren't scientific. I believe an epidural has risks. I don't think that means they are the wrong choice.

I've had 4 births. Two with epis and 2 without. My last baby was a homebirth and I am almost 99% sure I would have had an epidural had I been at the hospital. Even though I knew what I was getting into, I really though the pain would be less due to the great circumstances. I was seriously thinking about how to go to the hospital during the end of my labor. Pushing was no picnic, and while I only pushed for about 12 minutes, mw had to reach up in there and dislodge baby's shoulder. Not so pleasant.

I would not do things differently next time. Every other part of the birth was optimal: recovery, pp pain, etc.

I just think it's so hard to gauge another person's experience and make a decision for them based on one's own experience.

In a sense, I was waiting for those endorphins, the "buzz" or something, that never happened. I thought I'd be up and out of bed right away and back to normal in no time. I did okay, but I was wiped out and tired.

Like I said, things went great, but I believe this stuff is so individual. I get a bit annoyed when I hear the quotes of "It doesn't have to be painful" and "Just practice this technique and you won't feel a thing". I'm not saying it wasn't that way for those people, but they shouldn't assume it's the same for everyone and that others weren't prepared and therefore had pain.


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## laughingfox (Dec 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mambera* 
Right, so it should apply equally to the more NCB-friendly providers.

I never said they didn't. I said that I _always_ consider the source. Always.
I never said that studies should be rejected based on the viewpoint of those conducting them, either, just that it should be taken into consideration.

[start peripheral discussion of study particulars]
_OK, well if you have data to cite about those effects, again, I'd be interested. This study looks at short-term effects. The Cochrane review, for example, looked at long-term risk of backache. (They didn't find a difference.) What effects were you thinking of?_
I wasn't commenting on existence or non-existence of any specific risks, just that they set out to look for problems, but then didn't bother looking for anything serious. It struck me as ironic, that's all.









_Huh? Cochrane is an independent group that does systematic reviews of the literature. That review covered twenty-one studies involving 6664 women._
That was bad wording on my part.
The majority of the Cochrane study's info on those 6664 women came from a hospital with a 12% c-section rate. Another doctor looked at all the same studies involved, and came out with a drastically different conclusion. Did you follow the link?
I could be wrong, but this is probably the article people quote when they say epidural doubles the likelihood of c-section.
[/end peripheral discussion of study particulars]

Quote:

OK then, so when people are saying that epidurals raise section rates and cause drowsy babies they should easily be able to find citations to back up those claims, right? But I never see that done here.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I did already link to a citation on c-section rates.

Asking a couple dozen moms what their experiences are, or witnessing the birth of a couple dozen babies of friends and relatives will give you as large a population sample as the Finland study previously linked, even if it doesn't give you a source to cite. They may just be speaking from personal experience?
(Really, in making hospital-related birth decisions, I feel that asking around about your local hospitals is a much better way to go, especially if you know anyone who works/worked in L+D. It might not be quite as scientific, but taking the local hospital procedures, policies, staff, attitudes, etc. into account will give you a much better idea of what to expect than any national or international studies.)

Quote:

By the way, from some of the things in your post it sounds like you think I'm saying an epidural birth is entirely equivalent to an unmedicated birth. Obviously that is not true. What I did say is that a large part of the difference arises from the mom's immobilization, and that overall the risk *to the baby* is rather small. (Yes there is an increase in instrumental delivery, rates of instrumental delivery range from 5-20% so a 1/3 increase takes you from, eg, a 10% chance to a 13% chance; you can make your own value judgement about the importance of that effect.)

I think there are good reasons to avoid epidurals (as I did in my birth) when possible, but I think most of the benefits of avoiding the epidural accrue to the mom (no need for directed pushing, easier recovery, etc.).

Overall I would say the 'guilt value' of epidurals among NCB advocates *hugely* outweighs their actual risks to the neonate.
I wasn't assuming you were saying that there was no difference at all, or really arguing any specific point myself, just picking apart studies.
I agree with you (taking into account, of course, that "small" is relative), and I wholeheartedly agree that there's no need for guilting any mother for her birth choices, whether you have sources to cite or not. All that any mother can do is decide what's right for herself and her family, and making those decisions is hard enough without random strangers expecting you to justify yourself.

Besides, studies have shown that 94% of statistics are just made up anyway.


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## rparker (Jul 15, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sobranna* 

1. I am terrified of the epidural.

I was/am too.

Quote:

2. I am a wimp. I'm not athletic, wouldn't really consider myself "in shape" (who really is after a month of m/s and fatigue??), and have never really accomplished anything physically hard (had to quit training for a half marathon because of shin splints, ugh!).
Same here.

Quote:

As I research I find my heart being pulled toward an intervention-free labor and birth. I am hoping you ladies can help me with your experiences and encouragement as well as any references and resources I can look up.
I had a pretty much pain free, medication free, intervention free vaginal birth in a hospital with my first child. My total labor was 6 hours long and parts of it were intense, and some parts were gross and/or uncomfortable, but the only times it really hurt were when I sat still for electronic fetal monitoring and listened to the nurses rather than my own body.

I had read the side-effects of epidurals beforehand. I had also read a lot of stories about women having medication free births. The potential complications (for ME) from an epidural scared me way, way more than the idea of painful contractions. I also read several books that talked about how contractions did not have to be inherently painful and the relationship between fear and tension and pain. So I went into birth with an understanding of the physiologic process behind contractions and the expectation that birth wouldn't hurt *and* a total fear of spinal headaches, plummeting blood pressure, and complications leading to c-section.

The books I read while pregnant that I found helpful were _Ina May's Guide to Childbirth_ and _Hypnobirthing_.

Quote:

Also, what things did you do in the months leading up to delivery that you felt made your natural birth more "successful"?
I don't know that any of these things had a huge role in making my birth "successful," but they are all things that most women delivering in US hospitals don't do so maybe there's something to them:

-I didn't gain a huge amount of weight. 20-35 pounds depending on whether or not you count the weight I lost in the first trimester due to morning sickness. I also didn't begin pregnancy significantly overweight (150 lb. 5'5"). I think this might have made the later months of pregnancy physically easier.

-I walked a lot, partially because I wasn't driving the first part of my pregnancy. I didn't walk fast or competitively or anything... just a few miles a day most days. This is really the only regular "exercise" that I got btw.

-I drank a lot of water. Maybe 2-3 liters a day? I was already in the habit of drinking water before becoming pregnant.

-I ate a generally healthy, almost exclusively vegetarian diet fairly low in processed foods and virtually no "fast" or "junk" food. I did, however, frequently enjoy "unhealthy" things like cheese cake









-I only ate one dessert per day.

-I didn't eat for 2. I ate the equivalent of one extra snack per day about the same number of calories as a plain bagel.

-I got enough sleep.

-I drank a pregnancy tea containing red raspberry leaf in the third trimester.

-I was adjusted by a chiropractor once during the third trimester.

-I had a well informed, _calm_, and supportive birth partner... I think that this made the biggest difference overall.

-I discussed my preferences and expectations with my OB prior to labor and he was willing to support and advocate for them, despite not being terribly "crunchy" himself.

-I didn't go to the hospital until my contractions were 4-5 minutes apart and pretty regular/long... i.e. I wasn't very interested in talking during them. In my case this was after only 3 hours of contractions.

I don't think that any one of the above things really "made" my pregnancy/birth experience successful, but they all probably made it slightly more enjoyable in their own small way. This time I plan to: drink more raspberry leaf tea and I started earlier (because I like it and it makes me feel better NOW) and increase my flexibility and strength... I don't think the latter is necessary for an easy vaginal birth, but I think that it will help in the postpartum period.

I'm sorry if this is repetitive/irrelevant. I don't have time right now to read all of the replies or follow this thread. I did want to let you know though that an epidural free birth does not have to be painful and that you don't have to be a superwoman to accomplish this









Oh, and the biggest benefit to not having an epidural (all of my slightly obsessive fears about epis aside) is being able to move around during labor. If a contraction began to be at all painful I was able to pretty quickly switch to a different position so that by the end of the contraction I was not experiencing pain. I remember reading that this is the body's way of giving feedback to ensure that the baby is optimally positioned and able to descend.

ETA: I just had time to read some of the previous posts on this thread and I want to clarify that I'm not claiming "you must do these things to have a natural childbirth" or that "if you do these things your birth will not be painful." I was just trying to answer the OP's questions about what things I thought made _my_ birth experience positive... not invalidate/contradict anyone else's experiences.


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## mambera (Sep 29, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *laughingfox* 
I never said they didn't. I said that I _always_ consider the source. Always.
I never said that studies should be rejected based on the viewpoint of those conducting them, either, just that it should be taken into consideration.

OK, agreed.







And maybe I am a bit oversensitive about this because I really do feel like a lot of MDC posters will dismiss studies they don't agree with "because they were done by _doctors_" while applauding studies (no matter the source) that reach conclusions they like.

_The majority of the Cochrane study's info on those 6664 women came from a hospital with a 12% c-section rate. Another doctor looked at all the same studies involved, and came out with a drastically different conclusion. Did you follow the link?
I could be wrong, but this is probably the article people quote when they say epidural doubles the likelihood of c-section._

Sorry, you're right - I didn't read the link the first time. Now that I have read it, I see that it says the reason the biggest Cochrane study didn't find a difference was because they never gave epis before 4 cm, and that when epis are given before 4 cm they really do increase the rate of c/s.

That's certainly a legitimate and important point. As far as I know (and my direct experience is limited to two hospitals), it's pretty standard practice to wait for 4 cm before giving the epi in order not to stall labor.

So while it certainly seems true that _early_ epidurals can stall labor and result in increased rates of c/s, early epidurals are not AFAIK standard practice so it isn't really accurate to make blanket statements about increases in c/s rate based on what happens when you inappropriately give the epi too early.

Quote:

Really, in making hospital-related birth decisions, I feel that asking around about your local hospitals is a much better way to go, especially if you know anyone who works/worked in L+D. It might not be quite as scientific, but taking the local hospital procedures, policies, staff, attitudes, etc. into account will give you a much better idea of what to expect than any national or international studies.
ITA with this. I think a wise choice of HC provider is actually far more important for a good birth than anything else (like Bradley classes or whatever).


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## scottishmommy (Nov 30, 2009)

I haven't read all the replies. I had an unmedicated birth for very practical reasons. I believe that medication should be used when needed, so if I had really wanted an epidural I would have had one. But my labor was precipitous so they didn't offer me one. I have to say (at risk of getting flamed) I was kind of traumatized by the pain. My first thought was that I should have had pain relief. Now I am so glad that I had an unmedicated birth. I'm glad because there can be lasting side effects from epidurals. I know people who have dizzy spells, headaches and back pain from epidurals. These are people who've had epis for other surgeries, not just for labor. Of course a lot of people don't have any lasting side effects, but still I'm glad I don't have to deal with any of that.
That being said, I believe that epidurals can be very helpful for an exhausted mother. I know many women who weren't dilating through hours of excruciating labor and the minute they got the epidural they relaxed and dilated. What I object to is women being pressured into getting an epi, because it would be more convenient for the hospital staff.


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## lunarlady (Jan 4, 2010)

I had an epidural free birth because I had a homebirth, but I had a homebirth because I decided I wanted a natural labor and delivery, and wasn't sure I would get one in a hospital setting.

I do feel you can have an epidural and have a fine, healthy baby. So for the record, I think the choice to have or not have an epidural should be totally up to the mom. And I konw several friends that have had totally natural, drug free hospital births, so I also beleive that is a possiblity.

Here are the reasons I choose to avoid drugs during my labor:
-- I sometimes have weird reactions to drugs. I'm like the poster child for strange side effects. Some medications for pain don't work for me at all, others make help with pain, but also make me sick, dizzy, or give me rebound pain (headaches or other pain that occurs when the drug wears off). I didn't think labor was a good time to be experimenting with pain management techniques I have never tried before.
-- I hate pain. I don't want to feel it, experience it, or embrace it. I would prefer to avoid it entirely. However, I also am very aware of my body and know that it sends pain as a message. Some pain during childbirth is a signal. I worried that by damping out the signals, I could injure myself during childbirth. In particular, I worried about tearing during the pushing stage. I wanted to know how hard to push to streach and not tear, and I worried an epi would prevent my body from giving me that feedback.
-- When in pain, I don't sit still. I rock, roll around, moan, and pace. The idea of holding very still while somebody stuck a needle in my spine because I was in pain...just didn't compute well. If I was going to get an epi, I'd need it put in before the pain got bad. And if I did that, how would I ever know if the pain of labor was unbearable? If I never experienced it, how would I know I couldn't handle it?

As I said, I had an unmedicated birth. And here's what I say to those considering it.
-- The pain is not unbearable. The pain is bad, yes. There were about 20 minutes when I was very, very unhappy. (transition) I was like a movie...screaming, crying, moaning and miserable. But it is like very bad menstrual cramps combined with severe constipation. It is not like dislocating your shoulder or breaking a bone. The pain is managable, purposeful, and transient. For everything but that 20 minutes, the pain was no worse than other pain I've experienced at other times in my life. Very similar to the strong menstrual cramps I take medicine for, or painful gas cramps that I've had from time to time.
-- I was very happy to have 100% of my feeling during the pushing stage. It is one of the most amazing experiences of my life feeling DD moving down the birth canal, and being able to judge how much to push based on how much streach I was feeling. Pushing was NOT painful, although I did have one small tear right when her head came out and that is the only time during the entire labor I said "OW!"
-- Afterward, I was whipped, but also had a slight natural high like you get when you run that extra 5 mintues when you think you can't, or when you summit a mountian, or when you finally complete a job that you've been putting off for a long time. I was proud of myself (and still am).

Overall, I'm very pleased with my natural birth. I took a Bradley class and strongly reccomend it. It is very nice to be in a community of people who are all planning a natural birth, and supported by people who think like you do.

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## Beltane (Jul 20, 2006)

I am planning a homebirth and I have found this thread to be very enlighting and inspiring! Thank you for everyone posting their personal stories.


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## Sobranna (May 27, 2009)

I had no idea what kind of response I would get when I posted the original question, and I've been overwhelmed by the insightful, inspiring stories everyone has shared. I've appreciated the arguments from both sides, and definitely got a lot of information (which I'm still poring over). It didn't take long before I was convinced that a natural birth was the right choice for me. I feel so encouraged! I told DH, and now it will take some convincing so that _he_ feels like he can do it!









Thank you all who have already posted and who have yet to post! This is really good, encouraging information!


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## lunarlady (Jan 4, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sobranna* 
. It didn't take long before I was convinced that a natural birth was the right choice for me. I feel so encouraged! I told DH, and now it will take some convincing so that _he_ feels like he can do it!









I know what you mean! For me, I was all in the moment, but my poor DH. There was a few minutes during labor when I was in quite a state. DH wanted to go downstairs and unlock the door so the MW could get in. I kept screaming at him "Don't you dare leave me! Don't leave me!" He kept saying "Honey, the MW has to get in the door. It will only take a sec. I'll be right back, promise. I'll run!" And I, in my totally irrational state, was like "Heck no, she can break in a window. If you leave, I'll kill you!" He did, of course, go open the door. When he got back I think I yelled at him "You left! Why aren't you helping me! Help me!" Transition is rough on those poor partners.









Funny in retrospect. Good thing I have a calm and collected DH.







I think the Bradley classes really helped prepare him for the reality of birth. If you don't do a class, maybe just the book would help. My DH really appreciated have the job of "coach" for my labor, as it gave him a clear job to do and made him feel like he was helping with the birth.


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## Quinalla (May 23, 2005)

Here is what sealed it for me, even if you get an epidural, they do not always work effectively (not at all, numbing only one side, partial pain relief, etc.). Further more, sometimes there is not enough time to get one with a fast labor (like mine) and you can't always get one as soon as you might want with a longer labor. So either way, you definitely want to prepare yourself with techniques to deal with the pain/intensity and not rely on just being able to have the epidural. And if you are preparing to deal with birth without pain meds anyway, why not go for it? You will have a faster recovery as will your baby. I personally am one who is ok with pain meds during birth, but with my preparation I didn't need/want them and there wasn't time for me anyway









ETA: With regards to your DH, everyone has a different experience and DH dutifully went to the birthing class with me to learn different ways to help me, but when I was in labor I didn't want to be touched AT ALL during contractions. Anything that distracted me (talking, blanket on me, etc.) was extremely annoying, so my DH wasn't able to do much for me except be there in the room which was comforting to me and he helped answer their long list of questions in the hospital since I was answering them in transition with my fast labor!


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## Sudonk (Nov 29, 2005)

I was totally terrified of childbirth and planned to get as strong an epidural as I could, as soon as I could possibly get it. Then I did some research into epidurals and found out about many of the potential down-sides mentioned here. I decided to use an epidural only if absolutely necessary, instead of considering it to be my one-and-only tool for a more comfortable birth. Seemed reasonable to me!

It turned out that my first birth involved 16 hours of intense back-labor before I reached the point when my hospital would have allowed me to request an epidural. I have no idea how I could have gotten through that without preparation and natural childbirth skills! Luckily, I had discovered the use of hypnosis for birth and learned skills to remain calm and comfortable, despite the back labor and longish labor. I highly recommend learning Hypnobabies, since it made the pregnancy easier and more comfortable (lots of luscious sleep the whole way through is a beautiful thing) and led to very comfortable births. So comfortable, in fact, that I never even considered pain meds except to think, "Wow, that is powerful! I can completely understand how an unprepared person would panic and think she needed help getting through it." I've now had 3 unmedicated births, and really found that I enjoyed them. They weren't something to get through, or withstand, they were challenging and fun and amazing and showed me just how strong and powerful my mind and body and relationships were. I'm so glad that fear prompted me to look into all my options instead of just assuming that getting an epidural was the only viable option for birth!


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## teenyxdoodlez (Apr 2, 2010)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sudonk* 
I was totally terrified of childbirth and planned to get as strong an epidural as I could, as soon as I could possibly get it. Then I did some research into epidurals and found out about many of the potential down-sides mentioned here. I decided to use an epidural only if absolutely necessary, instead of considering it to be my one-and-only tool for a more comfortable birth. Seemed reasonable to me!

It turned out that my first birth involved 16 hours of intense back-labor before I reached the point when my hospital would have allowed me to request an epidural. I have no idea how I could have gotten through that without preparation and natural childbirth skills! Luckily, I had discovered the use of hypnosis for birth and learned skills to remain calm and comfortable, despite the back labor and longish labor. I highly recommend learning Hypnobabies, since it made the pregnancy easier and more comfortable (lots of luscious sleep the whole way through is a beautiful thing) and led to very comfortable births. So comfortable, in fact, that I never even considered pain meds except to think, "Wow, that is powerful! I can completely understand how an unprepared person would panic and think she needed help getting through it." I've now had 3 unmedicated births, and really found that I enjoyed them. They weren't something to get through, or withstand, they were challenging and fun and amazing and showed me just how strong and powerful my mind and body and relationships were. I'm so glad that fear prompted me to look into all my options instead of just assuming that getting an epidural was the only viable option for birth!









That is so awesome! I was thinking your story was gonna end in you getting an epi..Wow! 16hrs of labor AND in a hospital?! Good for you!!


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## Sudonk (Nov 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *teenyxdoodlez* 







That is so awesome! I was thinking your story was gonna end in you getting an epi..Wow! 16hrs of labor AND in a hospital?! Good for you!!









Thank you! Actually, the birth was around 24+ hours long. The 16 hours refers to how long I was dealing with intense back labor before I even reached 4 cm! That is when I would have been permitted to request an epidural, if I wanted (or needed) one. I always mention that to women who are planning to get an epidural and not developing any additional skills. Most of them think they can walk in and say, "I had a contraction, bring on the epidural!", but that isn't always true. I have no doubt that if I hadn't used hypnosis to prepare for my birth I would have wound up with a "mercy c-section" just for being stalled for so long while having such an intense labor without the option of an epidural. Having an amazing OB who was willing and able to sit on her hands and do nothing as long as baby and I were fine was the other piece of the puzzle that kept me from having surgery that day! I still consider her a friend to this day, and wish we could clone her and send her out to every L&D!


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## Oztok5 (Mar 25, 2008)

You absolutely can do it! My little guy was born a month ago yesterday, so the whole labor process is still pretty fresh in my mind, and I promise that if you have the right preparation and support, you can labor without pain meds.

As many people have said, a lot of it is how you mentally approach birth. I did the hypnobabies home study course which really pushes the fact that birth can be comfortable. My baby was poorly positioned (fully posterior and we believe slightly acynclitic) so I had pretty intense back labor for much of the time. I'm not going to say that my labor was an ideal, painless, hypnobirth because it wasn't, and after experiencing the back labor, I'm not sure that it's possible for that type of labor to be painless, but after he moved down past the most painful part in my back, the labor was really fairly comfortable if I allowed myself to listen to my body. I made it though my intense back labor by using the relaxation techniques I learned, having wonderful birth support to give me counter pressure, and by moving around to different positions as my body told me to.

The affirmations I repeated to myself were: "It can't be stronger than me because it is me" (which I read somewhere here, and it really helped me during the hard ones) and "I can do anything for a minute."

I ended up transferring to the hospital after about 35 hours of labor and 5ish hours of pushing. He just wasn't moving down, and after two more hours of pushing at the hospital, I consented to a c-section. The point of me telling you this last part is that, once the c section was planned, I obviously got an epidural. After about 15 minutes, I felt absolutely nothing. I'm sure they gave me a pretty strong one since I was already going for the section, but after experiencing labor and pushing without the epidural, I just can't imagine trying to push a baby out without being able to feel the contractions and urge to push. It was very surreal to be laying there and having someone tell you you're having a contraction and not be able to feel it. Even though I was exhausted from 37 hours of labor, I honestly didn't like it at all! It felt like I didn't know my body anymore.

The moral of the story is that, even if I knew I would end up with crazy long back labor again, I would still pick it over the epidural. I like to feel in tune with my body. The second moral is to do everything you can to have a well positioned baby.


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## butterflies (Sep 28, 2008)

You've already gotten so much great information here. I just thought I'd chime in as another mom whose had 2 unmedicated hospital births. The first was fairly long (20 hrs total... we were at the hospital about 15 hrs) and the second was only 3 hrs. These were in very different parts of the country- one was a large city teaching hospital and the other was a tiny local rural hospital. In both cases, I found that the staff was quite wiling to listen and respect my choices once they realized we were really well-educated about our decisions. Dh was nervous the first time but he trusted my research completely. He brought a little notebook with his notes and had made a kind of flow-chart for different possible scenarios to help him advocate for me with the staff. We didn't need most of it but it made him feel better! And I was more confident knowing that he could help me verbalize my thoughts and questions.


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## AstridS (Mar 9, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lit Chick* 

By the time I had the baby, I was ready. I was prepared. I was NOT afraid of the pain.... and thus it did not really "hurt". It's not that there was no pain... but the sensations were never scary, never a "make it stop!" feeling.

This is SO true!
I read an article a few days ago, about the difference between feeling pain and suffering.
And while there was plenty of pain at my homebirth, I never really suffered. I never really had that "I can't handle this, some one should make it stop" feeling. I knew that the pain was there for a reason and I knew that it would stop eventually. So.. it hurt. It _really_ hurt. But I wasn't suffering, because while I didn't exactly _like_ the pain I knew why it hurt and on some level I _wanted_ the pain to be strong, because that meant that things were moving along and I would be a mamma in just a few, short hours


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## zjande (Nov 4, 2002)

I've birthed 5 babies without an epidural. Besides a dose of Staidol with #1, they've been drug free births.

I would never in a zillion years consider getting one because the thought of someone coming towards my spinal column with a big scary needle is straight out of my worst nightmares! eek!









I think labor hurts like getting run over by a train, but geez! I think women that go for big ol' needles in their spines are freakishly brave!!









The only person I know personally who has had an epidural, got an intense headache from it that lasted 2 weeks. She said she couldn't even bend her head during those 1st wonderful weeks of bonding, to see her baby nursing.


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## bluebirdiemama (May 2, 2008)

I had two epedural free births








In fact, no drugs. One at a birthing center and one at home.

My preparations for my first birth wer minimal, just a class about what happens to the body, and metods for coping. I got through it just find, although it would have gone much better if I had done more reading.

My preps for my second birth include watching Orgasmic Birth --- GREAT video, and reading Ina May's Guide to Natural Childbirth --- I didn't feel ready to give birth until I read this book. It is amazing.

I also set up my favorite music to play, had birthing ball to use, and set up a hanging rope that I could pull on it I needed help pushing (I didn't).

Next time I really want to have a birthing pool. I used a huge tub at the birthing center for my first birth and it was great.


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## Harmony08 (Feb 4, 2009)

Hi,

I had an epidural after 30 hours of unproductive but incredibly painful labor. I did HypnoBabies, had a wonderful Doula and a very supportive husband and I was totally commited to no epi. After I got the epi I rested and dilated completely in 5 hours. I was able to push in different positions. I had an explosion of love and well being when I birthed my son and he was placed on my chest. We bonded instantly and breastfed right away. I had no complications at all from the epi. My son is perfectly healthy and happy. There is another side. It is possible to have a beautiful birth and an epi.


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## Fruitful4Him (Jun 22, 2002)

I have given birth 5 times. The first 4 times were all natural...3 in the hospital and 1 at home, UC. The 5th I had an epi ... I felt like I needed it and I am glad I did, ...it all worked out for the best. I am hoping for an epi free homebirth this time but I am open to how the birth unfolds. I have really enjoyed this thread.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

I have heard to many stories of woman getting an epi then the baby going into distress requiring emergency section for me to even consider doing an epi.


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## Lilygoose (Oct 27, 2009)

I had a med-free vaginal birth. I have a decent pain tolerance, but was not in shape (gained 85 pounds with my pregnancy!!) My DD was 10 lbs 11 oz and I had back labor, and although it was painful, it was the most alive moment of my life. I highly recommend it to any one who will listen for more than 5 minutes







Originally I chose this for my baby. In the end, it was wonderful for me! My DH and I went through 12 weeks of Bradley method classes, and although I did not use a lot of their "calming" techniques or practice the exercises, it was really helpful for knowledge and a feeling of confidence, especially for the confidence. I understood ALOT about what was going on with my labor, was able to make informed decisions and believed that I was strong enough to do it. I also recommend using a tub if one is available. This helped alot and I spent most of my labor in it off and on. For me it isn't a question of being able to "cope" with the pain, because you can-people can endure alot-its a question of being wholly present and accepting of the experience. If you focus on the pain that is the entirety of your experience, if you focus on the intensity and awesomeness of it that will be your experience.


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## phathui5 (Jan 8, 2002)

Quote:

And I totally agree with some PPs who have said that an epidural is a lot scarier than the prospect of a natural birth! A needle...in my SPINE?!? Eek
That is precisely why my first birth was unmedicated. I was 16, had only taken the hospital childbirth classes, but I knew I didn't want anyone putting any needles anywhere when I was in labor.


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## elanorh (Feb 1, 2006)

There's been a lot of good advice here! I agree with the books recommended!







Goer's book is great for this (and something to read snippets of to your dh).

I've had two natural, med-free births. Dh was hesitant and worried with #1 - let's face it, *I* was a little worried too, that my family/friends who'd had NCBs were minimizing what it was like so as not to scare me.









I think it's really important to help your dh break through the stereotypes about what labor is supposed to be like, and help him understand why you don't want an epidural. A spouse who is scared and/or unsupportive, is going to make your job more difficult. _Business of Being Born_ would be *great* to watch together! Share articles, etc. that you're reading, too. My dh was nervous and little uncomfortable with his role (and it's hard to know what that role will BE 'til you're in labor anyway). I told him that even if I asked for pain meds, he was to tell me, "No!" I think we set up a code word in case I was really serious? I don't recall now.









Having a supportive HCP is also important. Not an HCP who supports natural birth [but only for mothers who are laboring faster than expected, several days ahead of their due dates]. Someone who understands that birth will be a different process with each mother. Goer's book would give you good ideas of questions to ask your current OB/MW to help you recognize whether you're with someone you can work with; and if you decide to look for a new HCP, Goer's book should give you good questions to ask them, too. It's important to ask open-ended questions, not "yes/no" questions. The way they answer the question tells you a lot!

Look at the side effects of epidurals. They're so common that people don't think about them (epidurals) - but I know several women who've had 'bad' epidurals, or long-term side effects. One friend got an epidural, but at transition, it wore off (but only on ONE SIDE). This has convinced her that natural child birth is horrendous - but imagine feeling no pain, and then suddenly it crashes in on you all at once rather than gradually working into it?! I've another friend whose dh was so worried about her being in pain, that even though she'd had a previous NCB, she gave in and got an epidural -- she ended up with migraines and trouble walking (scared to hold her baby for the first two weeks after birth). Lots of stories about women with chronic back pain after their epidurals ....









It's worth avoiding them. If you have relatives who've labored naturally, ask how long their labors were -- it doesn't work for all families, but in my family at least we all labor FAST (all have natural births) - my mom, aunt, cousin, and all my sisters have had fast labors. I hit a point in both my labors (transition) where I found myself thinking, "Wow, I can see why some women want pain meds." That was exactly when it was time to push.

Expect it to be intense, but manageable. When you start feeling more pain, then consciously relax your body. I think that society makes birth look so scary, that many women scare themselves into tenseness and a more painful birth.







You can do this! And the rush afterwards, is amazing.

One last thought - a few years ago I was sick with the stomach flu - I was sitting there feeling miserable, and had an epiphany about how to describe labor - it was pretty much like I was feeling right then (contractions were) BUT you know roughly when it's going to end - it progresses, it's manageable - whereas stomach flu can last for DAYS and you get nothing out of it; labor is usually much shorter, and you have a BABY when you're done.














*note- not nausea, just the cramping feeling

If you're worried about being fit, walk more. I walked to and from work while pregnant with #1. You don't need to be a marathon runner to give birth!


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## Mountaingirl79 (Jul 12, 2008)

I havent read all the other replies yet, and I will, but I have my own experiences to throw in too.  I was scared of natural labor with my first because I didnt really feel like I knew my body well enough to take the pain. AKA I thought I couldnt handle it. So I had an eipdural and a 22 hour labor.
Preg #2, I had read and read and thought and thought about how I could overcome my fear, but you know what, mother nature blessed me that time with a labor that started in the middle of the night, and then by the time the contractions got serious, and we loaded up to go the the hospital, I was in transition and we made it to the hospital with only 30 mins until he was born. It was great. I had a four hour labor and was up immediately afterwards.








You CAN do it.


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