# Public role models, marijuana and our children



## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)

Michael Phelps was photographed smoking (is that the right verb?) a bong.

It seems that a big deal is being made of this, as if it's a shameful thing. This irritates me and I feel bad for Phelps. One, we wouldn't even know about this if no one bothered to run the photo. Two, it seems as though our minds have been made up for us by the headlines. The news editors have to get our attention somehow and so are spinning this as _Michael Phelps' Shame._ His career is supposedly on the line.

How?? What if I don't care that Michael Phelps smokes pot? What if a lot of people don't care? What if the majority of news reading people around the world wouldn't have cared, except that we're being told this is a disaster for his career?

The fear is that his sponsors, and he has a lot of big sponsors, will drop him because of this. So far, most have not dropped him. One, a watch maker in Europe, even said 'It's a non-issue.'

I would prefer that my kids not smoke marijuana until they're adults. I think if I'd been allowed to absorb this news tidbit all by myself, without any shameful spin on it, I'd have said, Huh, I didn't know he uses pot. But I don't really have a problem with Michael Phelps kicking back with some pot. And if my fourteen year old daughter mentions it I'll tell her straight up, I don't think this is a big deal at all. I hope my kids will continue to admire his fantastic talent and the hard work he's demonstrated.

I _am_ disappointed to learn that he was arrested for drunk driving four years ago. He should thank his lucky stars he didn't crash and hurt someone.

So, prior to this 'revelation' did you consider Michael Phelps a decent role model for children? Is he no longer a good role model for your kids?


----------



## talk de jour (Apr 21, 2005)

I haven't spoken to anyone thus far that gives a rat's behind about it.


----------



## Chamomile Girl (Nov 4, 2008)

I, like you, doubt most people care about it at all. But, see, we are supposed to care because pot is ILLEGAL! And gee golly that must mean that only criminals do it.

Can't we get these silly laws changed yet? California, for one, could really use the extra money for schools that would result of all the pot violators exiting the overcrowded prison system.

Most kids choose their role models based on skills, not lifestyle anyway. And of course anyone who listend to popular music knows that there is no limit to pot verbage.


----------



## choli (Jun 20, 2002)

He's an athletic role model. I don't generally expect athletes to be moral role models, just as I don't expect actresses or "celebrities" in general to be moral role models. They have a job and they do it, just as I have a job and do it and get paid.

As far as role models for morals and values, those are called parents.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

I don't care that he smoked, but I think it's a bunch of [email protected] that people follow famous people around hoping they'll do something they can embarrass them with.

I also think it's [email protected] that sports figures are considered to be role models. I'm sort of with Charles Barkley on that one. Enough with the sports worship already. Yeah, he accomplished something amazing. That doesn't mean he has to set a moral example for my kids. That's _my_ job.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'd actually completely forgotten who he was, and did a quick google when I saw this thread.

No - Olympic athletes aren't people I consider role models, actually. Too many of them abuse their bodies horribly in their pursuit of "excellence". Right now, we're seeing stories about Canada's ski jumpers being advised to eat 1000 calories a day (one of them in particular that I'm thinking of is 6' tall) and even take up smoking to get their weigh down, so they can jump farther. Abusing your body to win a medal isn't my idea of a role model.

Honestly...the coverage on Phelps made him seem more like a physical freak of nature than a man winning medals through hard work and dedication, anyway. Being blessed with a hugely unusual amount of physical talent doesn't make someone a role model, imo.

The pot? I don't care at all. It's just not relevant to me.


----------



## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

I'm trying to think of who he is, I get from the posts he's an athlete of some sort. Oh is he the swimmer?

Anyway, I don't give a flying fig if he smokes pot and how absurd that it could ruin his career.

I also don't think it discredits him as a role model anymore than someone who drinks responsibly. It is illegal but it shouldn't be and I'm open about that with my kids. Many decent productive people choose to smoke pot just like like many choose to drink alcohol (although pot is actually better in many ways).


----------



## AbbieB (Mar 21, 2006)

No, I don't care.

I actually like that more and more celebrities seem to be speaking out about their personal pot use and spreading the word that it's not addictive, it's not a gateway drug, and it's not the devil and it should be legal.

It seems to me that the media isn't going to make anyone that doesn't already think it's bad change their mind. It's one of those topics that people are pretty polarized on.

Most people that I know that think pot use is awful, shameful, terrible, choose your own word here, are the type to do what ever authority tells them too without questioning to deeply (I'm talking about people I know here, not making a broad generalization). The group I am thinking of equates the legal status of the plant with the danger of of it. They really do believe that the government made it illegal to protect us.

Then there is the group that doesn't care one way or another. I can not think of one of these people that has not at least tried it once so they know from experience that it's not a terrible drug.


----------



## LavenderMae (Sep 20, 2002)

The only people I know who are totally against pot are hardcore anti-drug (well only the illegal ones, prescription drugs of any kind seem to be A-OK) and to a fault imo.


----------



## Freefromitall (Sep 15, 2008)

I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.


----------



## pinksprklybarefoot (Jan 18, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.

My thoughts exactly.


----------



## New_Natural_Mom (Dec 21, 2007)

I don't consider drug users role models. Though in general, I feel there are few if any real public role models anymore (not that there ever really were). No one is perfect in public or private - but I'd rather my DS not look up to someone who is known to use drugs. I was disappointed to hear about Michael Phelps. I realize I am most likely in the minority about this on MDC







but there it is. I didn't rant about it, but my passing thought when seeing it on the news was, "him too? geez."


----------



## TiredX2 (Jan 7, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AbbieB* 
I actually like that more and more celebrities seem to be speaking out about their personal pot use and spreading the word that it's not addictive, it's not a gateway drug, and it's not the devil and it should be legal.

The *only* reason that it bothers me how many celebrities are "out" with their mj use is that it really highlights the social-economic (racist as well) war that the "war on drugs" is AND YET PEOPLE AREN'T UP IN ARMS ABOUT IT. Michael Phelps is photographed using illegal drugs and admits it in public, with no legal repurcussions. If he were of a poor colored man he would be locked up right now







:


----------



## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

I don't think we should teach our children that they should only do things to please other people; and that if they are not pleasing to others, then they should be ashamed.

People each have their own lights to let shine. For many different reasons.

eta: this is a good time to teach that we do not judge and gossip. We are not better or worse than other people. It is not our place.


----------



## Lemon Juice (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LavenderMae* 
Anyway, I don't give a flying fig if he smokes pot and how absurd that it could ruin his career.

I also don't think it discredits him as a role model anymore than someone who drinks responsibly. It is illegal but it shouldn't be and I'm open about that with my kids. Many decent productive people choose to smoke pot just like like many choose to drink alcohol (*although pot is actually better in many ways*).









:
Very well said! thank you!


----------



## Redifer (Nov 25, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.

LOL This.

I honestly don't care what he does in his free time, provided it isn't hurting anyone else. Michael Phelps is not my child or my responsibility. Jeez, he's 6 months older than me.

Likewise, I cannot see how smoking pot should effect his career at all. It's hardly a "performance enhancing drug", in this instance.

In the same breath, I'd like to mention that role models are not perfect, nor should we expect them to be. I'd rather my children choose role models that DO have flaws and make mistakes. Why? Because a strong person will handle those mistakes and flaws with dignity, grace and conviction.... which is the example I would love for my children to follow. Not "don't ever make a mistake", because that is highly unlikely.

Not saying that smoking pot is a flaw or mistake, since, to quote Kat Williams that adequately describes my opinion, "It's just a plant. It just grows like that. And if you just happen to set it on fire..."

Likewise, being famous for ANYTHING does not make you a role model. It makes you famous.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LavenderMae* 
The only people I know who are totally against pot are hardcore anti-drug (well only the illegal ones, prescription drugs of any kind seem to be A-OK) and to a fault imo.

I've known two people in my life who were totally anti-drug, because they were illegal - no other reason. Okay - I've known more than two, but the two I'm thinking of stuck in my head...because they both drove drunk, but didn't see drinking as a problem, because alcohol is legal, even though drunk driving isn't....and is far more harmful than smoking a joint.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Redifer* 
Likewise, being famous for ANYTHING does not make you a role model. It makes you famous.









:
I don't get why fame, in and of itself, is considered a virtue these days.


----------



## angelpie545 (Feb 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.

Yep. I am also scratching my head at the fact that we seem to elect people who actually believe it's a good idea to lock people up for years for smoking pot.







Don't get me wrong, I don't think that pot is a great idea, but it's not the worst thing ever. I'd rather someone smoke pot and stay home stoned than get drunk and drive. The fact that Michael Phelps took a bong hit isn't even a blip on my radar. He has no responsibility to anyone's children or to anyone to be a role model. He's just a regular guy who happens to be really good at swimming.


----------



## 2cutiekitties (Dec 3, 2006)

I personally don't care, even though I dont want my ds smoking doobies, but the reason it is new is because ... it isnt just a 23 yr old with a bong. IT IS MICHAEL PHELPS!!!!! OMG!! Bow down now, kidding. Another board I visit that consists of that age range worships him. The girls want to marry him (nail him) the guys want to be him. Hero worship. Whatever. I think he is unnattractive. Yes, they do care. Yes they do follow. I dont care, I am 36.

Also, those that really get into the sports always want to know how the megastars (Lance Armstrong & Phelps) do it. So is smoking pot the answer?Lets all get loaded and see how far we can ride a bike









Look how long Anna Nicole Smith was featured in the news! This country only goes for the tabloidy news anymore anyways. Jessica Simpson gaining 10lbs just knocked Obama off a cover.

sigh.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *2cutiekitties* 
I personally don't care, even though I dont want my ds smoking doobies, but the reason it is new is because ... it isnt just a 23 yr old with a bong. IT IS MICHAEL PHELPS!!!!! OMG!! Bow down now, kidding. Another board I visit that consists of that age range worships him. The girls want to marry him (nail him) the guys want to be him. Hero worship. Whatever. I think he is unnattractive. Yes, they do care. Yes they do follow.

You know...I "followed" a few heavy metal bands in a big way when I was younger. That doesn't mean that I would take up cocaine or trashing hotel rooms just because I heard they did that. I didn't quit smoking pot back then just because my "heroes" (Iron Maiden) weren't known as druggies, either.

Quote:

Also, those that really get into the sports always want to know how the megastars (Lance Armstrong & Phelps) do it. So is smoking pot the answer?Lets all get loaded and see how far we can ride a bike








Anybody who thinks that smoking pot is the secret to being a world-class athlete isn't paying _any_ attention. I loved pot when I was young, but a physical performance enhancer it wasn't!


----------



## LeoandLibra (Jan 13, 2009)

I am sick of the misinformation in this country regarding pot use. And yeah, I could care less who smokes pot, Michael Phelps included. It would be one thing if he were using a performance enhancing drug, but I think we all know that pot does not fall under that category. Celebrity worship in general is just so stupid to me, but that's a whole other thread.


----------



## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

I also generally don't consider athletes to be role models. The one thing about Phelps that I can see some people finding inspirational is that he used swimming in a positive way to deal with ADHD and overcoming some bullying he was experiencing.

I personally thing pot should be legal and don't care who smokes it. I think it's nuts that some over-zealous DA is looking into charging him with a crime.

However, for now, it's not legal. If my kids bring it up, I'll use it to discuss how sometimes our decisions have ramifications that we cannot anticipate. For example, if you have an arrest record, that arrest record can surface in the future in ways that might surprise you.


----------



## jenneology (Oct 22, 2007)

I believe that someone can be a role model even if not all of their behaviors are worthy of being modelled. I'll be teaching my kids that. Going by the Desiderata--although the quote is about comparing oneself to others--I believe that it can also be applied to learning something from everyone:
"If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain or bitter,
for always there will be
greater and lesser persons than yourself"
Each person is going to have some positive attributes that are worthy of emulation, but not all will be. I don't like in a world so black and white that I won't try to teach that to my kids. Barack Obama was a pot smoker and he still smokes cigarettes. I find many positive attributes about his character but I'm going to reject as a role model for me because I religiously and on principle decry smoking (of anything).


----------



## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)

_Barack Obama was a pot smoker and he still smokes cigarettes. I find many positive attributes about his character but I'm going to reject as a role model for me because I religiously and on principle decry smoking (of anything)._

That's a great point. I am disappointed that he still smokes cigarettes, but I lost my mom to lung cancer, too. Obama is most definitely a role model, IMO.


----------



## AbbieB (Mar 21, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TiredX2* 
The *only* reason that it bothers me how many celebrities are "out" with their mj use is that it really highlights the social-economic (racist as well) war that the "war on drugs" is AND YET PEOPLE AREN'T UP IN ARMS ABOUT IT. Michael Phelps is photographed using illegal drugs and admits it in public, with no legal repurcussions. If he were of a poor colored man he would be locked up right now







:

He would have been arrested (quite publicly too I'm sure) if he had been caught with that bong and a bowlful. But having a photo of you and a bong is not enough (thank goodness!) nor would be confessing to using.

Does anyone think it was stupid on his part to allow someone to photograph him smoking out?

Wow... page 2 and nobody has posted anything anti pot. I'm kind of surprised.


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

How did I miss that Obama used to smoke pot? For sure he's still a role model in my eyes, in fact I think I like him a bit more now







:


----------



## mamarootoo (Sep 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *angelpie545* 
I'd rather someone smoke pot and stay home stoned than get drunk and drive. The fact that Michael Phelps took a bong hit isn't even a blip on my radar. He has no responsibility to anyone's children or to anyone to be a role model. He's just a regular guy who happens to be really good at swimming.









:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EFmom* 
*I also generally don't consider athletes to be role models.* The one thing about Phelps that I can see some people finding inspirational is that he used swimming in a positive way to deal with ADHD and overcoming some bullying he was experiencing.

However, for now, it's not legal. If my kids bring it up, I'll use it to discuss how *sometimes our decisions have ramifications that we cannot anticipate.* For example, if you have an arrest record, that arrest record can surface in the future in ways that might surprise you.


yep









i'd also like to add that, even though i choose not to use pot when i'm pregnant, nursing or responsible for child care, this is the same attitude i have about alcohol.
i don't see anything wrong with having a few drinks when my husband and i are on a date-- granted i'm not pregnant, and wont be nursing before it's out of my system!
the fact that pot is illegal is my biggest reason for staying away from it, for the reasons i quoted from the PP. i would prefer it if my LOs waited until they are adults (it'll be a while-- one is still in fetus form







) to use it, but i would be MUCH MUCH more upset if i found out they were using alcohol before they were adults.


----------



## Jessy1019 (Aug 6, 2006)

I never really thought of him one way or another, but I don't have a problem with him smoking marijuana, and it wouldn't make me think less of him as a role model if he was someone my kids looked up to! We don't like or watch the Olympics, so I'm sure they don't even know who he is.


----------



## Amberoxy (Dec 20, 2007)

I didn't consider Michael to be a role model before and my feelings on that haven't changed. All I know about him is that he's an excellent swimmer due to hard work and winning the genetic lottery.

I would prefer my children to have local role models like our pastor or maybe a coach if they have a good one or a teacher if they have a good one - and of course I hope that my husband and I would be role models. I don't think celebreties make good role models because unless you really get to know them face to face, I don't think you can really know what makes them tick...kwim? To me, it isn't the actions but the motivations behind the actions. I am cynical and never really trust the motivations of celebreties when they do stuff.

I don't know enough about pot to really comment on that aspect of it...I myself enjoyed it when I was younger but am too afraid to smoke it now since most employers around here test for it.


----------



## kirstenb (Oct 4, 2007)

I also don't consider Michael Phelps a role model- I agree with the other posters that said being famous does not necessarily mean you are a role model. I feel that it is my responsibility to teach my children and set examples for them, not some random athlete. Even if it was someone my child looked up to, I think it would be a great teaching moment.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AbbieB* 
Does anyone think it was stupid on his part to allow someone to photograph him smoking out?

I would be very surprised if he knew the picture was even taken- it sounds like it was taken at a party. Everyone has a camera phone these days- it would be easy for someone to snap it without him knowing. I feel bad for him in that regard.


----------



## MG01 (Nov 17, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamarootoo* 

i'd also like to add that, even though i choose not to use pot when i'm pregnant, nursing or responsible for child care, this is the same attitude i have about alcohol.
i don't see anything wrong with having a few drinks when my husband and i are on a date-- granted i'm not pregnant, and wont be nursing before it's out of my system!
the fact that pot is illegal is my biggest reason for staying away from it, for the reasons i quoted from the PP. i would prefer it if my LOs waited until they are adults (it'll be a while-- one is still in fetus form







) to use it, but i would be MUCH MUCH more upset if i found out they were using alcohol before they were adults.

I agree with everything you said. I see pot and alcohol as similar in that responsible vs. irresponsible use makes all the difference, and do believe alcohol is inherently more harmful and worrisome. I think there are certainly reasons to teach our kids not to smoke, aside from morally condemning it which to me is irrelevant.

So to me, the fact that Phelps smokes pot, as an adult, is not all that surprising (many adults from all walks of life obviously choose to smoke) and nor should it interfere with the message I would hope to send to my children about marijuana or with the admiration that some may have for Phelps because of his athletic achievements. Of course I think there are reasons to avoid marijuana, especially as childhood/adolescence is not the time to make those decisions about any substance use, since a still developing child should not be introducing things to their system or making decisions with potential long term consequences. And I choose to avoid it because the potential risks are not worth it given its legal and social status and my personal and family responsibilities.

But I don't think that my encouraging my kids not to use marijuana while they are growing up has anything to do with the decision another adult (famous or not) makes to do so. And if I had older kids who brought up the situation, I think it would be a good teaching tool- to explain as a pp said that no one is perfect or makes decisions we would agree with all the time, but that whether or not we agree with someone's decision does not mean we should judge them. In addition, as a pp said, the situation would make for good conversation with older children about the stigma due to the legal status, and the possible harms- which realistically are associated more with the legal and social ramifications if discovered, rather than any inherent moral or physical risk. Because clearly in this case, the problem was not caused by his use of marijuana use but by the laws and stigmas surrounding it, resulting in negative attention and scrutiny. In fact, his superior athletic abilities and his pot use seem to further the point that it is not a killer drug that will ruin your health and stamina, no? The issue was not that he smoked pot and it harmed his swimming or health- the issue was that people got overly involved in his business and judged him.


----------



## 2xy (Nov 30, 2008)

I don't believe in public role models, really. Why would I want to try and emulate someone I don't even know? So....he's a talented swimmer. Big whoop. Celebrity worship has never appealed to me.

The only thing wrong with Phelps smoking pot is that it's illegal. And the fact that it's illegal is, IMO, stupid. If they showed a picture of him drinking beer, would it be big news? FWIW, I've never smoked pot. But I don't think it should be illegal. The only reason it's illegal is because it's so easy to grow that Big Brother can't regulate it and make a profit.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

My thought was, the guy just won gold medals and broke world records... at what point are you allowed to just relax and let go a little???? I don't smoke it, but my goodness - if he wants to let his hair down for a minute or two, who the heck begrudges him that? If he smoked up before teaching a preschool swim class, well, that would be a different story.

Any parent that is against marijuana use can just spin it to their advantage: "Son, when you win 8 gold medals, you can smoke some pot too. Better buckle down!"









I'm MUCH more against athletes taking performance-enhancing substances. Sportsmanship is really the only kind of modeling I expect to see from athletes. Of all the things you can say about marijuana, it does NOT give an athlete an unethical advantage.


----------



## jm+3 (Jan 26, 2009)

i feel strongly against drinking, cigarettes, and drug use. but there are people in our family that do those things, as well as people across the globe that do. some members of our family have conquered addiction and are proud to live a clean life. it's a tough subject to deal with, especially because my kids are too young to understand. my daughter is sad when she sees people smoking cigarettes, she doesn't want them to get sick. and i feel when it is age appropriate we will discuss the health risks involved with other substance abuse. my husband and i try to be our children's role models and leave the entertainers in the tabloids.


----------



## Belia (Dec 22, 2007)

I haven't read the responses, but I could care LESS if Michael Phelps smokes pot. It shouldn't affect his career or endorsements or public opinion one way or another.

As a matter of fact, I would be more surprised if a 23-year-old kid DIDN'T toke up occasionally.

OT, but I really feel for these kids these days with the prevalence of cell phones and cameras and the internet everywhere. They often simply don't have the maturity or discretion, yet their every mistake or questionable judgement is recorded forever and broadcast for all to see. I'm so glad there weren't cameras and blogs everywhere when I was in late HS/college. It's a different world.


----------



## chipper26 (Sep 4, 2008)

I don't see what the big deal is. I'd like to know what percentage of Americans truly have at least tried pot. Let those without sin cast the first stone. He apologized and I doubt we'll be seeing him do it again now that he is such a big star/influence.

I know kids look up to him, but they can look up to him for his talent and dedication to his sport and the commitment he has. Why does he have to be perfect?

Often the media dramatizes things to sell their story and I also think the lack of privacy these days due to technology can really suck.


----------



## *Erin* (Mar 18, 2002)

im embarrassed that my wonderful state is actually seriously thinking of filing criminal charges against him for it.

i think it's beyond minor. pot should be legal. it is in other countries, it likely will be here before too long (well, maybe not SC, oy...) i'd be more concerned (for him) if he had been filmed binge drinking. alcohol is a far worse thing for people than a little weed.

he is a SWIMMER not a ROLE MODEL. he swims well. that's it. him being in the public eye makes him a celebrity. celebrity is one thing, role model is quite another.

i get the vibe that the media wants this to be a huge deal, but most people don't care. including me.


----------



## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Collinsky* 
Any parent that is against marijuana use can just spin it to their advantage: *"Son, when you win 8 gold medals, you can smoke some pot too. Better buckle down!"*

















: LMFAO.

I am TOTALLY going to use this line sometime in my parenting career.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Yes, I think all famous people are role models whether they like it or not, and yes, I think it was poor judgement that he smoked pot, and I'm glad that it was published. Maybe he'll think twice about his decision making in public from now on, and maybe parents will use it as an opportunity to bring up smoking, pot smoking, drinking, etc. with their kids.

To be clear, I would be just as turned off by the guy were it cigarettes. I think its irresposible behavior for anyone, but particularly a young public sports figure, specifically an athlete who is supposed to be caring for his body. And drinking & driving...? That, over anything else, drops him REALLY low on my list. That's reprehensible.


----------



## mommy2naomi (Jun 4, 2007)

I personally don't consider anyone to be a role model and IMHO neither should other people. Putting anyone up on a pedestal and expecting perfection is exactly what is wrong with our society. We expect models to be skinny and beautiful but then we criticize them for teaching our children to be obsessed with weight. We expect sports people to win all the time under any circumstances but to be perfect angels in everything else too. I can go on but the point is, stop setting expectations that no one could possibly achieve.

We're human, we make mistakes, we learn as we go...


----------



## kewb (May 13, 2005)

I don't care that he smoked pot. I don't agree with his decision to do so but it was not my decision to make.

As for being a role model, yes, all famous people are role models even if they do not want that job. The fact that he did something human (made a poor decision, imo) is just another opportunity in parenting to talk to your kids about hero worship and the decisions we make. Role models are people. Riddled with humanity, history, relationship drama, all the stuff us none famous people have but society is not watching our every move.

This unrealstic expectation people have that our athletes, actors, teachers, religious leaders, etc must be perfect. Never make a mistake or a bad decision. It is not natural. No one is perfect and just because someone we admire made a bad decision is not a reason to toss them in the gutter and tar and feather them.

It makes me sad.


----------



## chirp (Feb 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.









:


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Belia* 
OT, but I really feel for these kids these days with the prevalence of cell phones and cameras and the internet everywhere. They often simply don't have the maturity or discretion, yet their every mistake or questionable judgement is recorded forever and broadcast for all to see. I'm so glad there weren't cameras and blogs everywhere when I was in late HS/college. It's a different world.

Likewise. DS1 has a pretty good head on his shoulders, but I'm going to talk to him about this a little. I don't think he and his friends go overboard on the cellphone camera thing, but the possibility exists. For one thing, I'm not sure most of them understand that there really is a difference between being an adult and saying to someone, "oh, yeah - I smoked pot when I was younger, and sometimes I got pretty goofy" and having photos/videos floating around _showing_ people how goofy you were, yk?

It's kind of scary. I don't think _anybody_ needs their adolescence or early adulthood captured on camera and broadcast to the world.


----------



## chirp (Feb 9, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
Likewise. DS1 has a pretty good head on his shoulders, but I'm going to talk to him about this a little. I don't think he and his friends go overboard on the cellphone camera thing, but the possibility exists. For one thing, I'm not sure most of them understand that there really is a difference between being an adult and saying to someone, "oh, yeah - I smoked pot when I was younger, and sometimes I got pretty goofy" and having photos/videos floating around _showing_ people how goofy you were, yk?

It's kind of scary. I don't think _anybody_ needs their adolescence or early adulthood captured on camera and broadcast to the world.


too true.

things like getting high and goofy always look worse out of context. even to people who share that, um...pasttime.


----------



## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

I don't know anyone who cares. Marijuana s just not a big deal among the people I know.


----------



## tallulahma (Jun 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.

right?

the only problem i have with pot- is that its illegal. it makes zero sense to me that marijuana is illegal & alcohol is legal or all the OTC meds that are down right poisonous....









i do not believe in celebrities/athletes, etc. as "role models".

my dh & i are excellent role models and we fill our lives with wonderful, inspiring people.

maybe people should quit looking to the new teen princesses and the athlete du jours and started BEING GOOD ROLE MODELS themselves.

in this house, we do not smoke pot because we do not break laws. we live within the boundaries of our government because we choose to live in this country....if we lived where it was legal, we probably would recreationally.

i do not believe anything is inherently evil or "bad".

so i cannot understand why his career would be in jeopardy.


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Yes, I think all famous people are role models whether they like it or not, and yes, I think it was poor judgement that he smoked pot, and I'm glad that it was published. Maybe he'll think twice about his decision making in public from now on, and maybe parents will use it as an opportunity to bring up smoking, pot smoking, drinking, etc. with their kids.

To be clear, I would be just as turned off by the guy were it cigarettes. I think its irresposible behavior for anyone, but particularly a young public sports figure, specifically an athlete who is supposed to be caring for his body. And drinking & driving...? That, over anything else, drops him REALLY low on my list. That's reprehensible.


I totally agree!!

I have a problem with it because it is ILLEGAL!







: Whether people like it or not, it is still illegal. So, if smoking pot is ok? What other illegal activities are "ok"? Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I totally agree!!

I have a problem with it because it is ILLEGAL!







: Whether people like it or not, it is still illegal. So, if smoking pot is ok? What other illegal activities are "ok"? Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?

I think it's a personal decision. If you're willing to pay the fine or do the time, it's your choice, right? At least for something _that_ minor. As far as I'm concerned smoking pot is about on the same level as a speeding ticket.

But then, I'm another one who thinks pot should be legal.


----------



## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I totally agree!!

I have a problem with it because it is ILLEGAL!







: Whether people like it or not, it is still illegal. So, if smoking pot is ok? What other illegal activities are "ok"? *Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?*

_We_ get to decide.

The individual does.

Right?

eta:
*
Legal vs. Illegal* and *Socially acceptable vs not socially acceptable* arent the same argument, are they?


----------



## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
I think it's a personal decision. If you're willing to pay the fine or do the time, it's your choice, right? At least for something _that_ minor. As far as I'm concerned smoking pot is about on the same level as a speeding ticket.

But then, I'm another one who thinks pot should be legal.









So true! I don't believe that everything that is illegal is bad ... it's illegal to speed, but I've sure done it.

Pot is illegal for many complicated reasons, and IMO it's a personal choice everyone needs to make for themselves. There are many decisions to weigh based on where you live and if it's deciminalized or not.

As far as role models go, as much as I hate it, sports figures ARE role models. What I still need to wrap my brain around is how to talk to ds about his role models and their behaviors ... say Phelps was a role model of his .. I don't disagree with him smoking pot, don't think it's "wrong". But then again, I don't want ds smoking pot, at least not until his body is mature and he is able to make an educated, healthy decision about it.

These things get tricky. I can see both sides. But I would feel very hypocritical looking down on Phelps for smoking pot. It's not a big deal to me or with most people I know, the only reason it's even an issue is because it's illegal and for all the wrong reasons, IMO.


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

I definitely don't think it's a big deal.

My first thought was: He can smoke pot and STILL be the fastest swimmer in the world??

WOW.

My second thought was: That's the FIRST picture of him hitting a bong to hit the media? I'm betting it wasn't his first time either lol

And my third thought was: aww dangit, now they (the media) are going to focus on this for a few days instead of real news. Happens every time.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
I think it's a personal decision. If you're willing to pay the fine or do the time, it's your choice, right? At least for something _that_ minor. As far as I'm concerned smoking pot is about on the same level as a speeding ticket.

I disagree, actually. I think speeding is worse.


----------



## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I disagree, actually. I think speeding is worse.









True


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I disagree, actually. I think speeding is worse.

Depends on the situation. In a school zone, I agree. On the stupid downhill rural road close to my house with a 25 MPH limit that _no vehicle will do in low while riding the brakes?_ Not so much_._









Some genius put in speed bumps and now all my neighbors veer around them while going downhill, and all the trucks detour instead of slowing down.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Here are my thoughts.

1. No big deal at all that he smoked pot.
2. The person (friend)? that took his picture is not very nice.
3. MP is pretty naive and should have smoked pot in a closed room with trusted buddies. He should know better than that!!
4. I don't think it's fair that he is a "role model." He just wants to compete.

And the biggest one...

What the HECK does the state think regarding pressing charges from a PHOTOGRAPH!!!!!!!!!!!! Ugh, that makes me sick sick sick. The War on Drugs is already a travesty, and now we can just take PHOTOS of people to try to bust them! GRRRRRR.

And I don't care much about what is illegal vs. not illegal. I care much more about WHY something is illegal than the fact that it *is* illegal. And the reason that pot is illegal is totally wrong. So yeah, breaking the law is not a big deal to me whatsoever.


----------



## AngelBee (Sep 8, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *choli* 
He's an athletic role model. I don't generally expect athletes to be moral role models, just as I don't expect actresses or "celebrities" in general to be moral role models. They have a job and they do it, just as I have a job and do it and get paid.

As far as role models for morals and values, those are called parents.











And even parents fall short sometimes.


----------



## OakBerry (May 24, 2005)

I don't care if he wants to let loose at a grown up party and take a few tokes.
The guy probably missed out on lots of social fun because of all his olympic training. Strict diet, sleep, and exercise routines.

It's not his fault some idiot with a cell phone camera or portable video player
wanted their 15 minutes of fame by "outing" him.

And the idea of prosecuting him from a photograph is absurd. How can they prove there wasn't tobacco in the bong?


----------



## salmontree (Mar 29, 2004)

As far as the prosecuting thing goes.. It sounds like some small town S.C. police chief trying to squeeze his 15 minutes of fame out of this whole thing.

Absurd.


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I totally agree!!

I have a problem with it because it is ILLEGAL!







: Whether people like it or not, it is still illegal. So, if smoking pot is ok? What other illegal activities are "ok"? Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?

The people who make the laws that we choose to follow, or not, are _just people_. They are no different, or better, than you or me. If you look into the reasons that marijuana is illegal, it becomes obvious that the laws were not made with the best interests of the public in mind.

If you are the kind of person who needs others to tell you what you can and cannot do, that's fine..but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong.


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
The people who make the laws that we choose to follow, or not, are _just people_. They are no different, or better, than you or me. If you look into the reasons that marijuana is illegal, it becomes obvious that the laws were not made with the best interests of the public in mind.

How is making marijuana legal in the best interest of the public?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
If you are the kind of person who needs others to tell you what you can and cannot do, that's fine..but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong.

I don't "need" others to tell me what to do. I am quite capable of making my own decisions. I just CHOOSE to obey the law. That is MY choice.









btw, even if it was legal, I wouldn't smoke it. I don't drink either, which also is MY choice.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
The people who make the laws that we choose to follow, or not, are _just people_. They are no different, or better, than you or me. If you look into the reasons that marijuana is illegal, it becomes obvious that the laws were not made with the best interests of the public in mind.

If you are the kind of person who needs others to tell you what you can and cannot do, that's fine..but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong.


I think MOST people need rules to keep MOST people safe, because most people don't use common sense, many people don't know right from wrong (think of the vast number of people who drive drunk, or who leave their babies to cry alone at night), and I believe most laws ARE made with the public's interest in mind (who elses interest do you think rules are made for).
That being said, I think many rules designed to keep people from doing unsafe things aren't up to par, and there are many which are missing.
For example... I believe alcohol is far more deserving of being illegal than marijuana is.
In fact, I think alcohol SHOULD be illegal... precisely because, back to your original point, "but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong", and thanks for making it, there are A LOT of people who drink, who ARE NOT fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right & wrong - and Michael Phelps is one of them - as he has driven drunk in the past (and as such, I don't think his decision making regarding mind/mood altering substances should be lauded).


----------



## gcgirl (Apr 3, 2007)

I haven't read all the repsonses, but I wanted to say that I don't really believe in role models, period. I think we should all strive to make our lives full and rich without trying to emulate someone else's.









And I really don't care who smokes pot. It's not my thing, but it's NOT MY LIFE.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

AKRotts, that's cool that you have no interest in smoking pot or drinking alcohol. That is your personal choice, obviously. 

But if you are genuinely interested in how making marijuana legal would be beneficial, there is quite a bit of information on this (it's one of my favorite topics actually). It's quite fascinating, really, and just as an FYI - there are a lot of people that are like you (don't smoke pot, will never smoke pot) who feel that it is wrong that pot is illegal.


----------



## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
How is making marijuana legal in the best interest of the public?

can of worms. opened.








:


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
How is making marijuana legal in the best interest of the public?

I don't "need" others to tell me what to do. I am quite capable of making my own decisions. I just CHOOSE to obey the law. That is MY choice.









btw, even if it was legal, I wouldn't smoke it. I don't drink either, which also is MY choice.









Darn right. I don't smoke or drink either. And it isn't because of the laws attached to either. It is because I choose not to poison my body. And like I said originally, those folks who ARE in the public eye - PARTICULARLY those lauded for their bodies & athleticism (michael phelps or football players or models), should be aware of their public profile, that many eyes are on them; children's included, and should understand that injesting or smoking poisons, legal or not, is AT the LEAST antipothic to their persona, and at worst, just plain stupid, poor decision making, particularly in light of their supposed understanding the body/health. Doesn't matter if you WANT someone to be a role model or not, or if THEY don't want to be a role model... if you CHOOSE to be a professional athelete, you ARE a role model to other young atheletes, and your decision making is under scrutiny. So they should be aware & make proper choices.


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
How is making marijuana legal in the best interest of the public?

This isn't what I said. I said that the reason it was made illegal was not for the best interests of the public. It was done for the interests of few.

But, I'll play anyway, here are a pair of reasons that making it legal would be good for society:
- Medical purposes. Google if you need to, there are too many medical uses to list.
- Legalization would stop the senseless prosecution of users who have harmed no one, and free up our judicial and penal systems for real offenders.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I don't "need" others to tell me what to do. I am quite capable of making my own decisions. I just CHOOSE to obey the law. That is MY choice.









btw, even if it was legal, I wouldn't smoke it. I don't drink either, which also is MY choice.









Good for you.









Again, though, I think you misunderstood me. I was responding to when you said:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?

So I said, in different words, "Those who are capable of deciding for themselves".


----------



## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I have a problem with it because it is ILLEGAL!







:

Oh, c'mon. This is not about it being illegal at all. Jay-walking is against the law (and in some places carries a heavier fine than possession of marijuana.) Would people be freaking out if Michael Phelps broke the law by jay-walking?

Quote:

What other illegal activities are "ok"? Who gets to decide what laws we can break and which ones we can't?
_I_ do. I decide for myself whether a law is just and moral and whether it is worth it to me to deal with the consequences of breaking it. And if I do decide so I will not feel guilty or sorry. If a situation arises where I have the chance to practice civil disobedience, I will do so proudly.

Past and current illegal activities that are not just ok-with-quotation-marks, but okay-without-quotation-marks: Homebirth midwifery. Homeschooling (or not schooling at all.) A woman showing her face in public. A woman doing the same work a man is allowed to do. A woman voting. A woman breastfeeding in public. Kissing in public. Doing whatever the @#$% one likes sexually with their partner in the privacy of their bedroom. A white woman marrying a black man. Working for barter and not reporting the income because one does not wish to support an immoral war. Using prescription drugs that have not been prescribed to the person using them because they need pain relief _now_. Using an illegal drug because it is the best one for the treatment. Practicing one's religion. Those are just some off the top of my head. I mean _really?_ You think the law is so sacrosanct that disobeying it can never be justified?

The criminalization of marijuana is stupid. It's wrong. It fuels a criminal culture in which people get hurt. It means my tax dollars are spent on keeping thousands upon thousand of people in jail when they could otherwise be contributing members of society. It keeps us from being able to grow a plant that is incredibly useful for all sorts of utilitarian purposes. It's hypocritical and corrupt. That's what I have a problem with.


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *fourlittlebirds* 
The criminalization of marijuana is stupid. It's wrong. It fuels a criminal culture in which people get hurt. It means my tax dollars are spent on keeping thousands upon thousand of people in jail when they could otherwise be contributing members of society. It keeps us from being able to grow a plant that is incredibly useful for all sorts of utilitarian purposes. It's hypocritical and corrupt. That's what I have a problem with.

yep. what she said. and everything else, i just didn't quote.

I can't imagine that some people actually believe that the law is always right. Just becuase something is illegal, doesn't make it "wrong".

Isn't it illegal to marry someone of the same sex in most states? Does that mean it's wrong to be gay and want to have the same benefits as heterosexual couples? sheesh.


----------



## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
understand that injesting or smoking poisons, legal or not, is AT the LEAST antipothic to their persona, and at worst, just plain stupid, poor decision making, particularly in light of their supposed understanding the body/health.

Then their persona is false. It's a good lesson, to my mind, of the foolishness of putting people up on pedestals to begin with. Making heroes out of people for being genetically gifted and winning. What nonsense. It's a great lesson for a kid to learn.

The rest of it is just bigotry. Many people find much value in using marijuana and do not suffer ill effects from it. If you have no idea why that is, you shouldn't assume you have any basis for comment on it. And if you know why it is, you would know that the notion that it is objectively bad and unhealthy is wrong.

So incredibly sure it's a poison and nothing but? Read this and this.

I wish I understood what spurs the irrational hatred and fear of pot.


----------



## Lemon Juice (Jun 6, 2005)

Ita w/ fourlittlebirds and Drummer's wife.

Quote:

*Why Condemn Phelps, When We Ought to Condemn the Laws That Brand Him A Criminal*

Sure, there will be some who will say that this latest chapter in Phelp's life is deserving of criticism because the 14-time gold medalist is sending a poor message to young children. And what message would that be? That you can occasionally smoke marijuana and still be successful in life. Well sorry if the truth hurts.
If you don't know about about Marijuana Reform drop by Norml and learn a little. Or if you have specific questions drop by my fav tribe, the MJ tribe. The first page alone is a great read....


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Why do people think that Phelps, as a competitive athlete, should be condemned for smoking pot on the grounds that he's not looking after his body? Many competitive athletes don't take care of their bodies. How many overtrain and injure themselves? How many take "performance enhancing drugs"? How many have hurt themselves with steroids. I believe I mentioned upthread that we have a man here _advising_ our ski jumpers to drop to a 1,000 calorie/day diet and _take up smoking_, so that they'll be skinny and light enough to jump to medal-winning lengths when the 2010 Olympics roll around. Looking to professional, or Olympic-class amateur, athletes as role models for all around wellness is illogical.\

ETA: I agree with fourlittlebirds and Drummer's Wife...and while I did smoke pot when I was younger, you couldn't pay me to smoke it now. My ex's dependency on pot caused massive havoc in my life, and contributed to my years of thinking my primary c-section had rendered me infertile for life. I hate pot and don't want it anywhere near me. That doesn't mean it should be illegal for people who aren't like my ex (who, in fairness, was addicted to _everything_).


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
This isn't what I said. I said that the reason it was made illegal was not for the best interests of the public. It was done for the interests of few.

But, I'll play anyway, here are a pair of reasons that making it legal would be good for society:
- Medical purposes. Google if you need to, there are too many medical uses to list.
- Legalization would stop the senseless prosecution of users who have harmed no one, and free up our judicial and penal systems for real offenders.

I understand the medicinal purposes, but isn't that allowed in most states already? I absolutely don't have a problem with that.

That wouldn't benefit the majority of those who smoke would it?

What are the other benefits?

fyi, I am NOT asking this to be a smart a$$, I really want to know.









Darn, I wanted to reply to a couple of other things but it is time to take the kiddos to gymnastics. I will have to come back to this


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I understand the medicinal purposes, but isn't that allowed in most states already? I absolutely don't have a problem with that.

No, it isn't allowed in any states, really. A federal law prohibits it, so even in states like CA the federal law can override the state's, and medical mj dispensaries can be raided and shut down. It's a pretty messed up situation.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
That wouldn't benefit the majority of those who smoke would it?

Besides the obvious medical uses, like pain, it's hard to say what the majority of smokers are getting out of their habit. It does different things for different people. For some, pot's for partying, for others, relaxing. For many, it helps with depression or anxiety, taking the place of pharmaceuticals. Self-prescribed, yes, but if it works it works.

Keep in mind that marijuana is an herb. If it weren't for decades of government propaganda you probably wouldn't think it different than any other herbal remedy.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
What are the other benefits?

The ability to produce and use hemp is one. This is really too broad of a subject, I wouldn't do it justice. Briefly, if marijuana were legalized, it could fuel our cars, provide extraordinarily healthy foods, revolutionize our paper and textile industries, and offer a safe and natural alternative to many medicines.


----------



## Irishmommy (Nov 19, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chipper26* 
I'd like to know what percentage of Americans truly have at least tried pot. Let those without sin cast the first stone.

Well I'm not American, but I have never tried it. But I don't need to cast stones, I don't see the problem with it.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
Besides the obvious medical uses, like pain, it's hard to say what the majority of smokers are getting out of their habit. It does different things for different people. For some, pot's for partying, for others, relaxing. *For many, it helps with depression* or anxiety, taking the place of pharmaceuticals. Self-prescribed, yes, but if it works it works.

I didn't make the connection until years later (I thought I just smoked pot because I was a hood







), but looking back, I think pot is the only thing that kept me alive long enough to graduate from high school. I've struggled with depression since puberty, but it was at its absolute worst in adolescence, and I didn't trust "the system" enough (still don't, but that's another issue entirely) to even consider admitting my mental state to anybody in authority. I just got stoned, and it all just went away...


----------



## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
I understand the medicinal purposes, but isn't that allowed in most states already? I absolutely don't have a problem with that.

What are the other benefits?

It is absolutely not legal for medical use in most states, both due to state law and the overriding federal law that a pp mentioned. As a former cancer patient, that infuriates me.

If mj were taxed and regulated the same way as tobacco, it would be a huge source of income for the government.


----------



## transformed (Jan 26, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
Why do people think that Phelps, as a competitive athlete, should be condemned for smoking pot on the grounds that he's not looking after his body?

Because, as an American, his body belongs to ME.







:


----------



## mamazee (Jan 5, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *karina5* 
AKRotts, that's cool that you have no interest in smoking pot or drinking alcohol. That is your personal choice, obviously. 

But if you are genuinely interested in how making marijuana legal would be beneficial, there is quite a bit of information on this (it's one of my favorite topics actually). It's quite fascinating, really, and just as an FYI - there are a lot of people that are like you (don't smoke pot, will never smoke pot) who feel that it is wrong that pot is illegal.

I've never smoked pot, and don't think I would because of the legality issue. But, if it were legal and if it helps with migraine headache pain, it would probably be preferable to the (legal) addictive and very strong narcotic medicines I've been given for my severe migraines. I'm afraid to try it since it's illegal. It frustrates me that there is something that might be safer than what I'm using, but that it is illegal.

Anyway, on topic, I don't care in the slightest that Michael Phelps smokes pot. Celebrities are, sadly, role models, although it's a weird phenomenon that they are. But they can't and shouldn't be expected to be perfect. They are human beings. I am confident I can teach my child to be healthy and responsible despite Mr. Phelps and his bong.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

And did anyone SEE his diet? It was phenomenally bad, by almost any standards. While it was mentioned here at MDC that he was eating crap, not one single person thought that he was failing as a "role model." Even though, technically speaking, a diet like that is probably way worse for the average person than getting stoned every weekend. Where's the outrage? Oh, eating really horribly isn't against the law. Should it be?

(I would hope the obvious answer is _of course not_, but with so many people sincerely believing that the illegality of marijuana makes this a safer, healthier country, I'm not so sure.)


----------



## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

When I first read about him smoking pot, my first thought was that explains his diet.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
In fact, I think alcohol SHOULD be illegal... precisely because, back to your original point, "but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong", and thanks for making it, there are A LOT of people who drink, who ARE NOT fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right & wrong - and Michael Phelps is one of them - as he has driven drunk in the past (and as such, I don't think his decision making regarding mind/mood altering substances should be lauded).

Please do some more research on what prohibition actually has accomplished when it's put into practice. In theory, idealistically, it's a beautiful, pristine, smiley utopia with less crime and more civic duty. In REALITY it does not play out that way. It has not, it is not, and it will not. History is a great teacher if people will just listen.


----------



## 1xmom (Dec 30, 2003)

I was more disappointed in how the whole thing got so blown up. So MP smokes a little pot, I don't care. He's not my child. And all those who expect him to be the perfect role model for their children, I would hate to see what they do in the dark or what skeletons are lurking in their closets. No one is perfect and we, as a society need to quit putting celebrities, sports figures, etc up on pedestals.
At dinner one night my dd and I were talking about role models and I asked her if she had any role models, her response was me and my niece







.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Collinsky* 
Please do some more research on what prohibition actually has accomplished when it's put into practice. In theory, idealistically, it's a beautiful, pristine, smiley utopia with less crime and more civic duty. In REALITY it does not play out that way. It has not, it is not, and it will not. History is a great teacher if people will just listen.


Well, I guess I've really fallen on the wrong side of the MDC line on this one somehow? This is natural family living, yet we have a slew of MDC moms talking about how great it is to smoke a drug (herbal, but a drug nonetheless), how its really helpful, wonderful, just an herb, etc. Bizzare assertions coming from otherwise educated & natural & grounded MOTHERS, whose parenting advice is often quite wise: "Yes, its illegal, but who cares". "It's perfectly fine to treat depression and other psychological troubles with drugs" (I read that its not okay to treat depression & other ailments with prescribed meds, but self-medicating with pot is fine, apaprently). "we should continue to allow free access to alcohol" (because as we see, people self medicating with alohol as they do, really helps society overall).

At the same time, my position that the choice to injest or smoke poisons in an effort to change your state of mind, "fix" problems, just get high/experiment, isn't the right path has been shot down.







This IS MDC right? I'm sorry, that is just NOT an okay way to live life, and I wouldn't want it for my children.

See, I've always thought getting to the ROOT of a problem, instead of drugging it, is the best way of dealing with problems. I teach my children through example that if they have a problem, to talk about it, to work together to come to a solution. I teach them to treat their bodies well, not to injest harmful substances. Herbs are included with that (though posts have been made with the assumption that those against pot are against it simply because it's illegal - which is not a correct assumption. Personally, I do not think ingesting any chemicals with an effort to get high or mask problems, herbal or pharmaceutical or otherwise, is the right path). Masking the symptoms of ailments instead of confronting them, THAT is a bigger problem in this society than the illegality of pot. Frankly, if more people would learn how to use their bodies & minds to heal themselves, instead of using drugs to cover up their problems & ailments, the laws surrounding drugs wouldn't even be at issue.

But maybe I should just do some more reading up on it. Apparently I'm just really at a loss with my lack of research about the benefits of pot & alcohol, and really out of touch with the majority of MDC. Huh.


----------



## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

Wow. That was a tad holier than thou.

I don't smoke pot, nor do I drink alcohol. I've got a slew of alcoholic cousins and uncles, so I don't think I come from a good gene pool for drinking. I don't currently smoke pot because it is illegal.

I certainly wouldn't characterize pot as a poison. I suppose that if you smoke bales of it, it could have toxic effects, but ingesting huge quantities of many otherwise benign substances can have toxic effects.

The people I've seen who smoke a little pot aren't doing it to drug themselves into oblivion or run away from problems. It might be used for that by a minority of users, but I believe the majority use it because it's a pleasant, relaxing experience. That's the way I feel about chocolate or the way my husband feels about his occasional glass of merlot.

Perhaps doing a little research from unbiased sources isn't a bad idea.

Collinsky makes a very good point. Prohibition wasn't the answer for alcohol, and it's not the answer for pot, either.


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Ks Mama, I mean this is the nicest way: you are not very educated on the use of MJ or the benefits/risks. It's not a poison, I don't know where you got that idea. You really should do some research, from a variety of sources (you know, not anti-drug sites/books).

I didn't read people saying it's such a wonderful drug, everyone should be doing it and that who cares if it is illegal. I read that there are many who do not believe it should be illegal and that it's much safer than alcohol, crappy food, and the millions of pharmacutical drugs so many americans take daily.

And FWIW, I no longer partake, but I get frustrated when the people who get all up in arms about a little pot use are the ones who have usually never once tried it and put it in the same category as real drugs. They just come off sounding highly uneducated and close minded. (I am not referring to you, just anti-marijuana people in general).


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

I neither smoke nor drink, either recreationally, or socially, or medicinally. No desire to. If pot became as legal as licorice tomorrow, I wouldn't smoke it.

What I am saying is that making marijuana and/or alcohol illegal is NOT "getting to the root of the problem", and it has the opposite effect from what was intended by those who favor prohibition.

And I think what the others are saying is that everything we put in our bodies has to be weighed on an individual basis, based on _facts_ and not propaganda. You've indicated that you don't believe in taking any medication or herbs at all, so naturally marijuana would fall into that category and that's understandable. But to say that marijuana differs from other herbs is not quite true. Different plants, used different ways, have different properties and different effects.There are other _far_ more toxic (poisonous) herbs that have been used as medicinal cures for centuries. In almost all indigenous cultures, there is some usage of mind-altering plants - even if only by the shaman/healer/Wise Man.

Like I said, I don't want to smoke anything. I neither think more nor less of Phelps because of this. He's his own person, just as we are, just as our children are. If he chooses to smoke weed EVERY DAY OF HIS LIFE, what business is it of mine? It is not one of those things that has any effect on me, my family, or my life. Different people have different philosophies on what is healthy, what is acceptable, what is good, what is bad.

If Phelps moved next door and started a meth lab in his basement... that would be something I'd be up in arms about.

ETA: In principle, I agree with much of what you said, Ks Mama. I think an awful lot of things that are medicated for actually need to be met at a different level. I don't think that is something that can or should be mandated and regulated by the government. I think it's immoral to try to do so.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Bizzare assertions coming from otherwise educated & natural & grounded MOTHERS, whose parenting advice is often quite wise: "Yes, its illegal, but who cares".

I make my choices based on what I believe is _right_, not on what the law says. I always have. Laws put in place to protect me from myself make the assumption that a lawmaker who was trying to control the hemp industry many decades ago is better placed to make my life decisions than I am. I disagree. Laws put in place to protect people from _each other_ (speeding, assault, rape, etc.) are the ones I pay attention to.

Quote:

"It's perfectly fine to treat depression and other psychological troubles with drugs" (I read that its not okay to treat depression & other ailments with prescribed meds, but self-medicating with pot is fine, apaprently).
Pot worked better for me in my teens than prescribed meds did when I was 30 (the meds did work, but not as well as the pot). Again...I don't assume that a doctor is able to figure out what is working for me better than I am. _I_ know what's going on in my body. They don't.

Quote:

At the same time, my position that the choice to injest or smoke poisons in an effort to change your state of mind, "fix" problems, just get high/experiment, isn't the right path has been shot down.







This IS MDC right? I'm sorry, that is just NOT an okay way to live life, and I wouldn't want it for my children.

See, I've always thought getting to the ROOT of a problem, instead of drugging it, is the best way of dealing with problems. I teach my children through example that if they have a problem, to talk about it, to work together to come to a solution. I teach them to treat their bodies well, not to injest harmful substances.
Holier than thou much?
My mother taught me all those things, too. For example, we ate a healthier diet than anybody else I knew (virtually no processed food, homegrown veggies, fruit from our own trees, etc.). However, someone in the grip of a profound depression, including hourly thoughts of suicide, isn't able to rationally process those lessons. The "root" of my problem was that I didn't think like most other people, I was being bullied, and I had a "severe maladjustment to my peer group" (in the words of the one shrink my mom dragged me off to). I also had (have) profound trust issues with authority figures (not parents - institutional authority, such as doctors, teachers, social workers, police officers, etc.), based on my own experiences with people in those positions. Talking out my issues with those people was not going to happen. I was afraid if my mom knew just how bad it was, she'd require me to deal with such people, so I reluctantly avoided talking to her, too.

Quote:

Personally, I do not think ingesting any chemicals with an effort to get high or mask problems, herbal or pharmaceutical or otherwise, is the right path). Masking the symptoms of ailments instead of confronting them, THAT is a bigger problem in this society than the illegality of pot.
I agree completely. However, I also don't see any way to force other people to look after themselves properly. I'm not big on making laws prohibiting people from behaving in ways that I consider unhealthy - their bodies, their choice. "Confronting" mental illness is also far from a straightforward process.

I personally wouldn't ever touch pot again. I'm still glad it was there to keep me alive during my teens...even if my teachers and people like you would have rather watched me drop dead than do something they didn't approve of.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
...even if my teachers and people like you would have rather watched me drop dead than do something they didn't approve of.

Wow, people like me? Do you even know me? I would have rather seen someone die than do something I didn't approve of? That's HORRIBLE. Where did I ever say that?!? That assertion by you is WAY over the line. Poor form.


----------



## tayndrewsmama (May 25, 2004)

I think it's funny that there are people who have their undies all wedged up because of this. Seriously. They deserve to have them yanked up a little higher even. I have never understood why people put complete strangers up on a pedestal. He didn't ask to be put there. Too many people create images in their heads as to how certain people should behave and there's no good reason for it.

To Michael: Puff, puff, pass!


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tayndrewsmama* 

To Michael: Puff, puff, pass!

















:







:

you know, to anyone who thinks marijuana is dangerous: does it help put it into perspective to realize that no one, in the history of time, before or after prohibition has ever died from 'over-dosing' on pot. Yet, look at the number of deaths from medications such as Tylenol, which many parents feel no shame giving to their teething kid.

I agree with those who said we should be more upset with a possible "role model" eating a horrible diet, than hitting a bong. Regardless of what is legal/illegal, I don't want my kids to think it's okay to eat crap all thier lives.


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Bizzare assertions coming from otherwise educated & natural & grounded MOTHERS, whose parenting advice is often quite wise: "Yes, its illegal, but who cares". "It's perfectly fine to treat depression and other psychological troubles with drugs" (I read that its not okay to treat depression & other ailments with prescribed meds, but self-medicating with pot is fine, apaprently).

Lots of MOTHERS here use medication. It would be wonderful if our bodies and minds never needed any help, but for most that is not the case. All we can do (other than leaving real problems untreated) is try to choose the treatment option that is best for the body.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
"we should continue to allow free access to alcohol" (because as we see, people self medicating with alohol as they do, really helps society overall).

Who said this? I haven't seen anything remotely similar to this line of thought.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
At the same time, my position that the choice to injest or smoke poisons in an effort to change your state of mind, "fix" problems, just get high/experiment, isn't the right path has been shot down.

Poisons? Where did you come up with that?

It may not be the right path for you, but you don't get to choose everyone's path.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
This IS MDC right? I'm sorry, that is just NOT an okay way to live life, and I wouldn't want it for my children.

This IS MDC, yes. I take it you missed the MJ/Cannabis tribe? And the article on marijuana for morning sickness?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
I teach them to treat their bodies well, not to injest harmful substances. Herbs are included with that (though posts have been made with the assumption that those against pot are against it simply because it's illegal - which is not a correct assumption. Personally, I do not think ingesting any chemicals with an effort to get high or mask problems, herbal or pharmaceutical or otherwise, is the right path).

Marijuana isn't a chemical, and herbs aren't harmful substances. You don't let your kids have rosemary or basil?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Masking the symptoms of ailments instead of confronting them, THAT is a bigger problem in this society than the illegality of pot. Frankly, if more people would learn how to use their bodies & minds to heal themselves, instead of using drugs to cover up their problems & ailments, the laws surrounding drugs wouldn't even be at issue.

It is wonderful that you've never faced an ailment that your body couldn't heal on its own...but when you are sitting there making these judgments, try and think of a chemo patient who can't keep their food in, an asthmatic, or a new mama with PPD. Are they not trying hard enough? Should we refuse them treatment, or look down on them for not healing themselves without treatment?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
But maybe I should just do some more reading up on it. Apparently I'm just really at a loss with my lack of research about the benefits of pot & alcohol, and really out of touch with the majority of MDC. Huh.

How did "benefits of alcohol" come into the conversation? ...You should do some reading, agreed.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Wow, people like me? *Do you even know me?* I would have rather seen someone die than do something I didn't approve of? That's HORRIBLE. Where did I ever say that?!? That assertion by you is WAY over the line. Poor form.

You choose to support the criminalization of marijuana. You choose to judge what I should have done while in the throes of brutal and severe mental illness (with, I might add, a whopping 15 years of life experience to guide me through it). You choose to state that people like me should use our minds and bodies to heal ourselves. You choose to state that people such as I should not have used pot, because you disagree with it.

If I had paid attention to the laws about pot - if I had continued to try to get through on my own, through sheer will power - if the law (that you support) had been more effective in keeping pot away from me - I would, in all likelihood, be dead this past 20+ years.

As for the part I bolded...you don't know me, either - but you're more than happy to tell me how I should be allowed to live my life and/or manage my own problems.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Frankly, if more people would learn how to use their bodies & minds to heal themselves, instead of using drugs to cover up their problems & ailments, the laws surrounding drugs wouldn't even be at issue.

But maybe I should just do some more reading up on it. Apparently I'm just really at a loss with my lack of research about the benefits of pot & alcohol, and really out of touch with the majority of MDC. Huh.

First, do some research. Alcohol is legal and does far more damage than pot ever has. Pot has medicinal benefits, as several other PP have mentioned.

Second, if the FDA were not so corrupt and the government didn't make so much money prosecuting people for _the war on drugs_







people would be free to heal themselves without fear of arrest, wouldn't they?


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
You choose to support the criminalization of marijuana.

If I had paid attention to the laws about pot - if I had continued to try to get through on my own, through sheer will power - if the law (that you support) had been more effective in keeping pot away from me - I would, in all likelihood, be dead this past 20+ years.

As for the part I bolded...you don't know me, either - but you're more than happy to tell me how I should be allowed to live my life and/or manage my own problems.

Where did I say I support the criminalization of pot? I did suggest that alcohol should be illegal, being that I believe its a far more damaging substance than pot. Don't recall throwing my support behind criminalizing pot.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
You choose to judge what I should have done while in the throes of brutal and severe mental illness (with, I might add, a whopping 15 years of life experience to guide me through it). You choose to state that people like me should use our minds and bodies to heal ourselves. You choose to state that people such as I should not have used pot, because you disagree with it.

Actually, in my recollection, with the exception of the few statments I directed towards answering the OP's question of Michael Phelps, the rest of my statements were about my beliefs & choices about my life & my children. I don't see where I ever said what YOU should have done or should do.

I don't recall stating that YOU should not have used pot? You're taking this whole thread really personally & putting your anger on me without justification.

I'm sorry for your trials. I hope you can continue to heal.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
I did suggest that alcohol should be illegal, being that I believe its a far more damaging substance than pot.

I'm sorry, but your name is 'Ks Mama,' not 'KS Mama,' right?

I kept reading it as KS Mama and thinking of Carrie Nation.







:


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
I'm sorry, but your name is 'Ks Mama,' not 'KS Mama,' right?

I kept reading it as KS Mama and thinking of Carrie Nation.







:









I don't know who Carrie Nation is, and yeah, its K's Mama. Why?


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
I don't know who Carrie Nation is, and yeah, its K's Mama. Why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Nation

since you think alcohol should be illegal and I was mis-reading your name, it struck me funny.









Then I realized it was Ks not KS


----------



## Redifer (Nov 25, 2006)

Just wanted to chime in as another non-smoker who supports legalization of mj.

I have smoked pot. Back in high school, I smoked it daily. After high school, I gradually became less and less interested in it. By the time I was 19, I didn't smoke at all.

Now, at 24, I haven't smoked in 5 years. I have no plan to smoke again. At this point in my life, I don't like the way it makes me feel.

However, many people I know, including DH, smoke occasionally to regularly. They're all upstanding, law-abiding (for the most part) citizens. They all work, go to college... you know, normal adult behavior.

Like Storm Bride, we all consider ourselves adults capable of making our own informed decisions, including the decision to use (or not to use) mj. Providing we aren't hurting anyone, which we aren't, we believe we reserve the right to govern ourselves and our bodies as we see fit. I don't need a governmental parental unit trying to "protect me from myself".

There are many misconceptions about weed, and about the people who use it. I would like to take this time to mention that those misconceptions are there for a reason: they have been deliberately and shamlessly promoted by those "behind the curtain".

There are very few stereotypical, often propaganda-related, concepts that are tolerated on MDC. Racism and classism, just to name two, would never be tolerated here, because we know well the dangers of close-minded thinking. The same applies here. True, non-biased education is in order to fully understand the subject of mj use. To get that, one must first clear their mind of all other pre-formed notions of MJ use and users, which is a very difficult feat. But, once you commit to it, and open your mind to the idea that MJ is an herb, which can be used in many different ways, and the real reasons it was made illegal... well, it's enlightening, and scary when you consider the people who govern this country can (and have) do whatever suits THEIR best interest and not the people's.

Anyhow, sorry about that tangent. I do somewhat get worked up over this topic. I'm a strong believer in "What other people do in their free time, in the privacy of their own lives, provided it hurts no one, is none of my business". This sentiment includes use of MJ.


----------



## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

K's Mama, your post sounds like something straight out of the DARE program. It's obvious you are not very well versed in the benefits and effects of marijuana use. Fine, I don't expect everyone to be an expert.
 








But when you call it a poison and act holier than thou, it just comes off as ignorant. You yourself admit you are not well read on this subject, and obviously many of us here (that have researched it in depth) disagree with you.

Why not open your mind a bit? No one is saying you need to go puff on a joint tomorrow. We are just saying that if you were educated on the subject, you would probably not see it as a big deal AT ALL. Because it's NOT. Plain and simple.

And how on earth you came to the assumption that we think alcohol is beneficial is beyond me, I must have missed that post. Alcohol IS a poision, and while I'm not giving up my occasional glass of red wine, I'm also one of the first to say it is very harmful to your body in excess.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Nation

since you think alcohol should be illegal and I was mis-reading your name, it struck me funny.









Then I realized it was Ks not KS
















lol!


----------



## tallulahma (Jun 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 







:







:

you know, to anyone who thinks marijuana is dangerous: does it help put it into perspective to realize that *no one, in the history of time, before or after prohibition has ever died from 'over-dosing' on pot.* Yet, look at the number of deaths from medications such as Tylenol, which many parents feel no shame giving to their teething kid.

.

bolding mine.

or how many times you hear of alcohol poisoning, otc drug overdose, prescription drug overdose.

people give their kids oragel, benadryl, motrin, tylenol.

benadryl can cause apnea- oragel can cause heart problems, motrin- stomach ulcers, tylenol- complete liver failure.

people give these things every 4-6 hours around the clocks for days!

i can. not. understand the rage at smoking pot.

not for this country of "you got a pill for this ailment?"


----------



## AndVeeGeeMakes3 (Mar 16, 2007)

I do consider Phelps a _*role*_ model. In the _role of a swimmer_, he is certainly a model, yes?

As far as other types of models, I'd like to think that my daughter will look closer to home.

I am very much in favor of the legalization of pot. I'd much rather take that than naproxen or aspirin when my arthritis is killing me and much rather take it than phenergan when nausea strikes. That said, I would like for my daughter to wait until she is an adult, with, hopefully, a good head on her shoulders, to avail herself, should she want to.

And, nope, it's definitely not a "performance enhancing drug."


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tallulahma* 
i can. not. understand the rage at smoking pot.

not for this country of "you got a pill for this ailment?"

and that's just it! Because their is a pill for everything, we've been brainwashed to thinking marijuana is evil and dangerous. Think of the money big pharma would lose if we could just grow some herb and use it to help with anxiety, depression, pain, migraines, etc.,


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Redifer* 

There are many misconceptions about weed, and about the people who use it. I would like to take this time to mention that those misconceptions are there for a reason: they have been deliberately and shamlessly promoted by those "behind the curtain".

There are very few stereotypical, often propaganda-related, concepts that are tolerated on MDC. Racism and classism, just to name two, would never be tolerated here, because we know well the dangers of close-minded thinking. The same applies here. True, non-biased education is in order to fully understand the subject of mj use. To get that, one must first clear their mind of all other pre-formed notions of MJ use and users, which is a very difficult feat. But, once you commit to it, and open your mind to the idea that MJ is an herb, which can be used in many different ways, and the real reasons it was made illegal... well, it's enlightening, and scary when you consider the people who govern this country can (and have) do whatever suits THEIR best interest and not the people's.



Quote:


Originally Posted by *mistymama* 
K's Mama, your post sounds like something straight out of the DARE program. It's obvious you are not very well versed in the benefits and effects of marijuana use. Fine, I don't expect everyone to be an expert.









But when you call it a poison and act holier than thou, it just comes off as ignorant. You yourself admit you are not well read on this subject, and obviously many of us here (that have researched it in depth) disagree with you.

Why not open your mind a bit? No one is saying you need to go puff on a joint tomorrow. We are just saying that if you were educated on the subject, you would probably not see it as a big deal AT ALL. Because it's NOT. Plain and simple.

And how on earth you came to the assumption that we think alcohol is beneficial is beyond me, I must have missed that post. Alcohol IS a poision, and while I'm not giving up my occasional glass of red wine, I'm also one of the first to say it is very harmful to your body in excess.

and I just wanted to quote the above, because they are worth repeating


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 
and that's just it! Because their is a pill for everything, we've been brainwashed to thinking marijuana is evil and dangerous. Think of the money big pharma would lose if we could just grow some herb and use it to help with anxiety, depression, pain, migraines, etc.,


And I guess that's where I'm being misunderstood on this thread, or maybe I'm not good at communicating my point. Because really, what you say here I agree with ... the mindset of this country (and probably most Westernized countries) is that there IS a pill for everying. Or a drug, of some kind. And I don't believe that's a good frame of mind to have becuase it is very limiting to my natural ability to heal. But its not because I'm an enemy of pot or an enemy of "big pharma".

I don't think marijuana is evil; and I never stated that in this thread. I just don't see a reason for myself to research the benefits (as many have said I *need* to do before having an opinion), because its not something I'd take/use (I have never said I've never tried pot, although, its also been assumed on this thread that I'm some kind of across the board abolishionist who's never known the virtues of pot so can't possibly have an opinion, which is ridiculous. I don't think you have to have personal experience either way in order to formulate an opinion about something). Like I wouldn't have a drink to relax. I don't need drugs of any kind, herbal or otherwise, to relax. I'm not a fan of drugs to fix problems either. Not that I don't understand the NEED for them sometimes (again, my point was taken out of context in this thread, that I was somehow saying drugs, marijuana included, should NEVER be used and that people should die instead of get better with drugs), of course there is need, in some cases, for some kind of drug use.

Personally, I do not use drugs, I don't like the way drugs or other chemicals feel in my body, I don't like what they do to my body, I wouldn't want my kids to use them, I do consider drugs poisons of a sort (okay folks, thanks for capitalizing on semantics, y'all might as well have said I was equating marijuana with arsenic for the amount of times you picked the word poison out of my post - frankly, I was talking more about the fact that I wouldn't inhale smoke, period, because of the damage it does to your body - and YES I understand there are other ways to injest pot, for those of you who feel I'm completely unversed in MJ, we don't need an entire other post about how you don't need to smoke it to use it), because they alter your state of mind & the ability of your body & brain to act in harmony with each other & with the earth, and I prefer to live as naturally as I can (and of course, I have used herbs & other drugs in medicinal ways, as most all people have, because like I said, sometimes there is need for medicine, but I choose to limit my exposure to things which effect me in negative ways - like this thread, haha). And to the natural part... yes, I understand MJ is a plant, (like rosemary as someone suggested I was being hyppocritical if I gave my children rosemary, but would eschew pot), the difference is that when I flavor a meal with rosemary, the amt. of the herb used isn't enough to have an effect on anyone's state of mind or abilities. It's a flavoring. It's not a mind or mood altering substance. And because *I* (can everyone see I'm talking about ME) would not choose to alter my state of mind with a drug, that certainly does color my opinion about drugs in general.

I apologize if I offended anyone with *MY* feelings on drugs, and what I do with my life & how I influence my family in natural ways. I do feel a bit ganged up on in this thread, and one poster went way over the line of appropriateness. My intention as always was to give my opinion, as it is with everyone on these sites... we just give our opinions within the context of our own experience. Sometimes that experience doesn't jive with everyone elses. And sometimes the way things come out on paper isn't the way they were intended. Again, I'm sorry for any offense, it wasn't intentional.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
First, do some research. Alcohol is legal and does far more damage than pot ever has. Pot has medicinal benefits, as several other PP have mentioned.

Which is precisely why I said, in a previous post on this thread, "I believe alcohol is far more deserving of being illegal than marijuana is."

But everyone seems to be ignoring that post & jumping to the conclusion that because I don't think drug use should be lauded, that I am in favor of criminalizing marijuana.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
Which is precisely why I said, in a previous post on this thread, "I believe alcohol is far more deserving of being illegal than marijuana is."

But everyone seems to be ignoring that post & jumping to the conclusion that because I don't think drug use should be lauded, that I am in favor of criminalizing marijuana.










Gotcha.







Your last post makes that a lot more clear.

And I agree it would make more sense to change the laws.

Can you imagine if there were pot bars? You'd never get people out of those bar stools and it would be impossible to turn tables so you could make a few bucks. Tabs would be small because people would order one round and then sit _forever._

Of course, there would be hardly any fights.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

Ks Mom, I think I'm understanding you a bit more - I had read your earlier posts one way but it seems I wasn't getting you.


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Ks Mama, sorry if you felt ganged up on. I think you should be able to express your opinion, definitely, just know there are a lot of people who take things personally, on either side.

and, yes, thanks for clarifying your stance. I also do not feel like we should be medicating every symptom, but rather finding out the root cause of the pain/condition. I don't give my kids tylenol or what have you for fevers and my family does not ever take prescription drugs (short of abx when I had sepsis, and pain meds after my c-sections). Anyway, the thing is that some people *do* need to treat their health issues and it just really isn't fair that they are forced to take potentially dangerous medications when something as harmless as marijuana may be an alternative option. That's where the legality issue frustrates many; as long as you aren't voting no when it's up for legislation (and it can't be for just medicinal purposes, because we see the federal gov. stance on that overrides the law in states where it is legal) then you aren't for criminalization of marijuana.







That's when I do think everyone should have educate themselves by doing some research. Whether or not they intend to ever use it or not, if they are going to show up and vote on the issue, they need to be informed.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
That being said, I think many rules designed to keep people from doing unsafe things aren't up to par, and there are many which are missing.
For example... I believe alcohol is far more deserving of being illegal than marijuana is.
In fact, I think alcohol SHOULD be illegal... precisely because, back to your original point, "but you should really think before judging others who are fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right and wrong", and thanks for making it, there are A LOT of people who drink, who ARE NOT fully capable of making their own decisions regarding right & wrong - and Michael Phelps is one of them - as he has driven drunk in the past (and as such, I don't think his decision making regarding mind/mood altering substances should be lauded).

I apologize for misunderstanding your stance on marijuana being illegal. I took this quote to mean that you didn't think the law went far enough, and that alcohol should be illegal _in addition to_ marijuana.

There are also a lot of people who drink who _are_ capable of making their own decisions about right and wrong...and I see no reason why they should have those decisions made for them, simply because there are other people who can't make those decisions. I see no reason why I shouldn't be allowed to have a drink in the evening, just because my dad's a drunk. You can also be quite sure that if alcohol were illegal, I'd be annoyed, but it wouldn't be a big enough deal to me to make me break that law. My dad? My ex's best buddy? They wouldn't care at all if it were illegal - if they could find a way to get it, they would.

I think Michael Phelps's decision to drive drunk was totally unacceptable, and I'm not "lauding" his decision to use pot. I really couldn't care any less than I do if he - or anybody else - chooses to use pot. However, driving drunk and using pot are in no way the same thing. He endangered others by driving drunk. The same doesn't apply to the bong hit.

You and I have a philosophical disagreement here. You want to protect people from themselves, and I don't.

I do apologize for saying "people like you". I mistakenly thought you felt your beliefs about drugs should be legislated to apply to everyone, as that was what your post sounded like. I mistook you for one of the anti-drug zealots who'd rather watch people suffer than behave in a way they don't approve of. I'm sorry.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I think Michael Phelps's decision to drive drunk was totally unacceptable, and I'm not "lauding" his decision to use pot. I really couldn't care any less than I do if he - or anybody else - chooses to use pot. However, driving drunk and using pot are in no way the same thing. He endangered others by driving drunk. The same doesn't apply to the bong hit.









: I didn't know he drove drunk. That does bother me.


----------



## Lisa1970 (Jan 18, 2009)

I have never ever held out famous people as role models to my children. I hope to be my childrens best role model. When someone says because someone plays football well, they should be seen as a role model, well, it just irritates me. All they did was get good at football, that is nothing great or amazing. Famous people are just people who media made famous. We don't know them. Everyday people are the good role models. Famous people did not ask to be the role models to our children and I think we would be wrong to expect them to be, or to even want our children to hold them out as ones.


----------



## SleepyMamaBear (Jun 5, 2005)

honestly, him tokin on a bong doesnt bother be one bit.
i think what he does on his own time is his business so long as he isnt hurting anyone or putting anyone in danger (the DUI really really does bother me)
i think he is an AMAZING athlete, and if he makes the choice to smoke cannabis who am i to judge him???
as for role models... i would rather my children look up to people who try to better the world instead of athletes, but thats just me


----------



## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 
Can you imagine if there were pot bars? You'd never get people out of those bar stools and it would be impossible to turn tables so you could make a few bucks. Tabs would be small because people would order one round and then sit _forever._

Of course, there would be hardly any fights.









Naaah, the bill for nachos alone would be astronomical.


----------



## tayndrewsmama (May 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EFmom* 
Naaah, the bill for nachos alone would be astronomical.









The grill would busy, busy!


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ks Mama* 
I do feel a bit ganged up on in this thread, and one poster went way over the line of appropriateness. My intention as always was to give my opinion, as it is with everyone on these sites... we just give our opinions within the context of our own experience. Sometimes that experience doesn't jive with everyone elses. And sometimes the way things come out on paper isn't the way they were intended. Again, I'm sorry for any offense, it wasn't intentional.

Aww, now I have to wonder if I'm the inappropriate poster.

If my posts come off as harsh, it may help to know that I'm typing one handed. I'm trying to get my points out quickly. Like you said, intention is hard to gauge on the net, but I thought we were having a friendly discussion. I saw it as a chance to try and help you move past a few misconceptions. Sorry if you saw it differently.

If I'm not that poster, uhh, nevermind.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EFmom* 
Naaah, the bill for nachos alone would be astronomical.









: ooh, yeah. And then they'd forget and pay several times.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
Aww, now I have to wonder if I'm the inappropriate poster.

No - it was me.


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bigeyes* 







: ooh, yeah. And then they'd forget and pay several times.

















:


----------



## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EFmom* 
It is absolutely not legal for medical use in most states, both due to state law and the overriding federal law that a pp mentioned. As a former cancer patient, that infuriates me.

A good friend of mine has chronic pain from back injuries and surgeries. His choices (in terms of what worked) were narcotics or marijuana. Guess which was easy to get from his doctor? Guess which he wouldn't go to jail or lose his job for? Guess which he developed a devastating addiction to that wrecked his marriage?

He went through an extremely painful withdrawal and got his life back on track, including getting his master's degree and working professionally, overseeing a program benefiting a disenfranchised population and preserving their culture. He uses marijuana now to deal with his pain, through the medical marijuana program. But of course the federal government could come in at any time and shut down his supplier. That is _wrong._ It's disgusting.


----------



## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:

And I don't believe that's a good frame of mind to have becuase it is very limiting to my natural ability to heal. But its not because I'm an enemy of pot or an enemy of "big pharma". I don't think marijuana is evil; and I never stated that in this thread. [...] And because _I_ (can everyone see I'm talking about ME) would not choose to alter my state of mind with a drug, that certainly does color my opinion about drugs in general. I apologize if I offended anyone with *MY* feelings on drugs, and what I do with my life & how I influence my family in natural ways.
This seems a little disingenuous to me. You very clearly weren't speaking just about your feelings about the drug for _yourself_, you were making judgments about others, e.g. that for _them_ it's stupid and bad (i.e. "evil") for their health, that's it's "just NOT an okay way to live life." Those are generalized statements, not "it's not right for me," but "it's not right for anyone." And now it seems you're back-tracking. So, really, which is it?

Quote:

I don't think you have to have personal experience either way in order to formulate an opinion about something).
No, but if you haven't had the experience that someone else has had you should probably at least consider that your view possibly isn't objectively the only true one and that there may be something you don't know, instead of making absolute pronouncements about The Way Things Are.

Quote:

Bizzare assertions coming from otherwise educated & natural & grounded MOTHERS, whose parenting advice is often quite wise: "Yes, its illegal, but who cares". "It's perfectly fine to treat depression and other psychological troubles with drugs" (I read that its not okay to treat depression & other ailments with prescribed meds, but self-medicating with pot is fine, apaprently). "we should continue to allow free access to alcohol" (because as we see, people self medicating with alohol as they do, really helps society overall).
Straw men. 1."It's illegal but who cares" is a lot different from saying, "If a law is unjust, to disregard it is ethical." 2. Who has said or even implied that self-medicating is always fine but prescription drugs never are? 3."Self-medicating with alcohol is good" (which has not been said here) is very different from saying, "prohibition does not solve the problems it claims to, and introduces new ones" (which has been said.)

Quote:

Personally, I do not use drugs, I don't like the way drugs or other chemicals feel in my body, I don't like what they do to my body, I wouldn't want my kids to use them, I do consider drugs poisons of a sort [...] because they alter your state of mind & the ability of your body & brain to act in harmony with each other & with the earth,
I assume you mean, "I do not use drugs because it negatively affects your state of mind and inhibits your ability to act in harmony with each other and the earth." Again, you're making an observation not just about you, but projecting your experience onto everyone. Not everyone has that experience. Many people feel that it alters their consciousness in positive ways. Do you really think you know better than they how it affects them in their life?

Quote:

I do feel a bit ganged up on in this thread,
You're saying that something people here have found to be beneficial to them is stupid and bad. Of course they're going to react strongly to that.


----------



## KittyDanger (Jan 27, 2009)

I may be the only person who thought of it this way, and excuse me if someone has already mentioned this bc I only skimmed all of the replies...but instead of the picture negating his success, I thought, why don't people now see that people who occassionally use MJ can lead normal, productive, and greatly successful lives...?

I would be way more concerned about alcohol abuse than this.

God knows what people would think of me if I was being hounded by cameras.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KittyDanger* 
I may be the only person who thought of it this way, and excuse me if someone has already mentioned this bc I only skimmed all of the replies...but instead of the picture negating his success, I thought, why don't people now see that people who occassionally use MJ can lead normal, productive, and greatly successful lives...?

.









: It would be incredibly refreshing if he had the reaction of, "Yeah, I smoke pot now and then. It's a travesty that it's illegal, and I live a productive life like the majority of pot smokers."

Aaah, but that's wishful thinking.

I really wish that all the doctors, educators, nurses, police, business owners, and other professionals I know would come forward and be honest about their pot use, but I do understand that people are scared b/c of the stigma.

It's a darn shame though.


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
Marijuana isn't a chemical, and herbs aren't harmful substances. You don't let your kids have rosemary or basil?


How can you even compare marijuana to rosemary or basil? It isn't even close to being the same. Marijuana is a mood altering substance, the other two are not.

I come from a family of alcoholics and drug addicts, which is probably why I feel as strongly as I do about alcohol and drugs (including prescription drugs).


----------



## beka1977 (Aug 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *New_Natural_Mom* 
I don't consider drug users role models. Though in general, I feel there are few if any real public role models anymore (not that there ever really were). No one is perfect in public or private - but I'd rather my DS not look up to someone who is known to use drugs. I was disappointed to hear about Michael Phelps. I realize I am most likely in the minority about this on MDC







but there it is. I didn't rant about it, but my passing thought when seeing it on the news was, "him too? geez."









:

Plus - the sheer stupidity of him doing this in a way that he could be photographed. Why risk your career?


----------



## Lexy (Feb 2, 2009)

If I had to pick one drug that any of my child would be addicted to, it would be pot. Why? No long term side effects and there's no actual addictive properties that make you want to smoke it aside from the high itself. I'm not a smoker myself, but I know a lot of people who are. They are competent, respectable, educated adults that have wonderful lives. Hard to say the same about a drunk... or cocaine addict.
I think marijuana is made out to be a billion times worse than it is. it's surely less harmful than a bottle of t3's, that I'm sure every single person has been perscribed atleast once. Pot only has memory effects... and temporary at that. Pain killers can rot the lining of your stomach.
Don't get my wrong. I don't like drugs. But personally, I think the drugs they should be going after and trying to bust are the ones that kill people and destroy lives. Alcohol is a prime example. If you drink too much, you WILL die. If you smoke too much, you really need to sleep.
I just think the war against drugs is lopsided.


----------



## mammastar2 (Dec 17, 2004)

Haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to point out that there's a great article on Salon today (http://www.salon.com) about this.

It's called "Michael Phelps, Puppy Torturer!" and points out that the coverage and disapproval the poor guy is receiving is all out of proportion. It also points out that other admitted pot-smokers include Al Gore (Nobel Prize winner) and Barak Obama.


----------



## kriket (Nov 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KittyDanger* 
why don't people now see that people who occassionally use MJ can lead normal, productive, and greatly successful lives...?

Because they can't have you never seen reefer maddness?! They all go crazy and jump out windows and kill people and play jazz piano really really fast!

/scarcasm

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lexy* 
If I had to pick one drug that any of my child would be *addicted* to, it would be pot. Why? No long term side effects and there's no actual addictive properties that make you want to smoke it aside from the high itself. I'm not a smoker myself, but I know a lot of people who are. They are competent, respectable, educated adults that have wonderful lives. Hard to say the same about a drunk... or cocaine addict.
I think marijuana is made out to be a billion times worse than it is. it's surely less harmful than a bottle of t3's, that I'm sure every single person has been perscribed atleast once. Pot only has memory effects... and temporary at that. Pain killers can rot the lining of your stomach.









: well said mama. People find out I smoke pot, on a regular basis and you can see, litterally see, the suprise in their eyes! Well, not as much anymore, the dreadlocks 'give me away'

and on that note, you will be amazed how many people think that dreads are representative of dry buds. What the heck. A way of wearing your hair, dedicated to pot.







: Someone actually said they wanted to smoke one of my dreads, I almost let them just to watch them smoke burning hair.

How ignorant can people get?

Pot isn't going to wreck anyones life. Unless they let it, and then it was just a matter of time before they found _something_ to wreck their life with.

The "its not legal" argument doesn't hold water with me. Its also not legal to have sex any other way then missionary, or walk your fish on sunday. I believe sodamy is still illegal in most states too.


----------



## PushPineapple (Aug 4, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
How can you even compare marijuana to rosemary or basil? It isn't even close to being the same. Marijuana is a mood altering substance, the other two are not.

I come from a family of alcoholics and drug addicts, which is probably why I feel as strongly as I do about alcohol and drugs (including prescription drugs).

K's Mama said "I teach them to treat their bodies well, not to injest harmful substances. Herbs are included with that"

I thought that was an odd thing to say, calling herbs harmful substances, so I pointed out some other herbs. I never said marijuana = rosemary.


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PushPineapple* 
K's Mama said "I teach them to treat their bodies well, not to injest harmful substances. Herbs are included with that"

I thought that was an odd thing to say, calling herbs harmful substances, so I pointed out some other herbs. I never said marijuana = rosemary.

Ahhhh gotcha, I misunderstood


----------



## KittyDanger (Jan 27, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kriket* 
Because they can't have you never seen reefer maddness?! They all go crazy and jump out windows and kill people and play jazz piano really really fast!

Bahhaha. I'd also like to emphasize my use of the word occassionally. IMO anything used habitiually is likely a problem.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *beka1977* 







:

Plus - the sheer stupidity of him doing this in a way that he could be photographed. Why risk your career?

There is virtually no way in which he could do it in which he'd be safe from being photographed. As someone mentioned upthread, young people today live in a world of camera cellphones. They basically have _no_ safety from photography unless they're completely alone...and have their blinds/curtains drawn. It's a little like their entire generation are paparazzi.


----------



## runnerbrit (May 24, 2006)

I think that Michael Phelps is an amazing swimmer and his drive and determination to achieve his goals are worth looking up to. He is 23 and did spend the last 4 years swimming *every single day. In many ways he is still a kid! I watched an interview with him and his favorite thing to do in his off time was play video games and hang out with his friends and dog.

The punishment that has been placed on him for this do not fit the crime. Not to mention the huge waste of taxpayer dollars to "look into" the photo. Don't they have bigger crimes and bigger issues to worry about. He has lost millions of dollars in endorsment money when Kellog pulled out and has been suspended for 3 months from competing.

Not to mention he owned up to it! He did not lie, he did not make excuses, he did not hurt anyone. He apologized.*


----------



## kriket (Nov 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *runnerbrit* 
Not to mention he owned up to it! He did not lie, he did not make excuses, he did not hurt anyone. He apologized.

good for him! I think if more people didn't deny and flip the coin to "oh thats bad I would never do it" when they are 'caught' things wouldn't get so crazy.


----------



## choli (Jun 20, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AkRotts* 
How can you even compare marijuana to rosemary or basil? It isn't even close to being the same. Marijuana is a mood altering substance, the other two are not.

I come from a family of alcoholics and drug addicts, which is probably why I feel as strongly as I do about alcohol and drugs (including prescription drugs).

What's wrong with mood altering? Do you have a problem with aromatherapy as well?


----------



## lorelei (Dec 31, 2004)

I personally think it's silly to make such a big deal out of smoking pot. I'd be much more upset over the drunk driving incident. People could have actually gotten hurt or killed as a result of that decision, as opposed to smoking some weed.

It's my personal belief that FAR more harm has come from the use (and abuse!) of alcohol than marijuana use. I think one of the main reasons pot is illegal in our country is because if legal, it would be really hard for the government to make money off of it. It's something you can easily grow yourself with little to no special equipment or knowledge. Brewing your own booze is a lot harder.


----------



## AkRotts (Sep 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *choli* 
What's wrong with mood altering? Do you have a problem with aromatherapy as well?

You are comparing marijuana with aromatherapy? Really????


----------



## SleepyMamaBear (Jun 5, 2005)

what IS wrong with mood altering?!
really, if i am feeling depressed and need a pick me up, i'd way rather have some herbal medication that makes me feel much better, and also alleviates my chronic pain from fibromyalgia, it doesnt harm my body at all, its not risky to use, unlike big pharma anti-depressants that have a mile long list of potential side effects, its natural and its beneficial...
so, why are so many people upset about mood altering? alcohol is mood altering, aromatherapy is mood altering, chiropractor care is mood altering, acupuncture is mood altering, so WHY is it seen as a negative thing when it comes to cannabis, a natural plant that has many incredible uses?


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Well I will tell you who is absolutely NOT a role model to any kid of mine, and that is the law enforcement officers who are involved in this INSANE WITCHHUNT. I mean, really, THIS is how tax dollars are spent? BARF.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/29125081/

Quote:

COLUMBIA, S.C. - Authorities in the South Carolina county where Michael Phelps was photographed smoking from a marijuana pipe have been arresting people as they seek to make a case against the superstar swimmer, lawyers for two arrested people said Thursday.

Attorneys Joseph McCulloch and Dick Harpootlian told The Associated Press they each represent a client charged with possession of marijuana who were questioned about the party Phelps attended near the University of South Carolina campus in November.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

The lengths to which this government will go to enforce and promote a policy that was not put into place for the good of "the people" in the first place and not based in fact/reasearch/science* is absolutely amazing.







: If they prosecute Phelps for this I will lose my mind. That is ridiculous, how could that even make it to court? Any judge with any sense would toss it immediately.

Except the "war on drugs" might need someone to take a fall, lest people find out the truth.

History, people. It tells you everything you need to know.

*in fact, the first real study done was basically CHUCKED because it didn't support the existing anti-marijuana laws


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SleepyMamaBear* 
what IS wrong with mood altering?!

Well when it comes to mj, the pharma companies don't get their cut! THAT is what's wrong with THAT mood altering!

Now, mood altering from a shiny orange PILL...THAT is acceptable.

Doesn't that make sense???


----------



## Minky (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm anti-drug because my DH's marijuana addiction nearly ruined our lives.

I'm glad marijuana is illegal after what I've seen, and it distresses me when people say it's "just pot." My husband wasn't himself when he was on it, thought of nothing but getting his next fix, and didn't give a care about our family.

The ONLY thing that stopped him completely ruining our lives was one day, after he'd bought his latest fix, a cop pulled our car over. He didn't arrest or search us, but he "warned" my husband that the police were watching.

It was a long, hard road, but he flushed the pot when he got home, and he hasn't touched it since then. Quitting was a hard road, a very hard road, but once he realised that he could be in jail away from his family, quitting was worth it. It was only after he'd quit that he realised what hell he had made our lives up until he quit. I wish I could talk to that officer now and thank him. He saved all of our lives.

I think the sheriff who is prosecuting this case is very brave and very fair. I'd like to write him a letter thanking him for what he's doing. I think so many lives are hurt or destroyed by marijuana but we never hear about it because people dismiss it as "just pot." And often law enforcement is the only way to stop things.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I'm anti-drug because my DH's marijuana addiction nearly ruined our lives.

I'm glad marijuana is illegal after what I've seen, and it distresses me when people say it's "just pot." My husband wasn't himself when he was on it, thought of nothing but getting his next fix, and didn't give a care about our family.

The ONLY thing that stopped him completely ruining our lives was one day, after he'd bought his latest fix, a cop pulled our car over. He didn't arrest or search us, but he "warned" my husband that the police were watching.

It was a long, hard road, but he flushed the pot when he got home, and he hasn't touched it since then. Quitting was a hard road, a very hard road, but once he realised that he could be in jail away from his family, quitting was worth it. It was only after he'd quit that he realised what hell he had made our lives up until he quit. I wish I could talk to that officer now and thank him. He saved all of our lives.

I think the sheriff who is prosecuting this case is very brave and very fair. I'd like to write him a letter thanking him for what he's doing. I think so many lives are hurt or destroyed by marijuana but we never hear about it because people dismiss it as "just pot." And often law enforcement is the only way to stop things.


Of course there are people that abuse pot, and I'm sorry to hear your DH was one of them, and it's good to hear he isn't doing that anymore.

The problem with your story is that it's just that...one story. It's similar to alcohol. There are people that use it - even daily - (one glass of wine with dinner for example) and it is not a problem in their lives. And then, of course, there are people that let the drug (alcohol) ruin their lives and the lives of their family.

Your DH is the exception and not the norm when it comes to pot, as the majority of pot users lead productive lives and don't let their use harm their families and loved ones.


----------



## joensally (Jun 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Lexy* 
If I had to pick one drug that any of my child would be addicted to, it would be pot. Why? No long term side effects and there's no actual addictive properties that make you want to smoke it aside from the high itself. I'm not a smoker myself, but I know a lot of people who are. They are competent, respectable, educated adults that have wonderful lives. Hard to say the same about a drunk... or cocaine addict.
I think marijuana is made out to be a billion times worse than it is. it's surely less harmful than a bottle of t3's, that I'm sure every single person has been perscribed atleast once. Pot only has memory effects... and temporary at that. Pain killers can rot the lining of your stomach.
Don't get my wrong. I don't like drugs. But personally, I think the drugs they should be going after and trying to bust are the ones that kill people and destroy lives. Alcohol is a prime example. If you drink too much, you WILL die. If you smoke too much, you really need to sleep.
I just think the war against drugs is lopsided.


I attended a session on early psychosis a while back, and the nurse educator presenting mentioned that the kids they're seeing are smoking way more pot than they used to and this is physically changing their brains. Doesn't sound so benign to me.


----------



## joensally (Jun 19, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KittyDanger* 
I may be the only person who thought of it this way, and excuse me if someone has already mentioned this bc I only skimmed all of the replies...but instead of the picture negating his success, I thought, why don't people now see that people who occassionally use MJ can lead normal, productive, and greatly successful lives...?

I would be way more concerned about alcohol abuse than this.


You're comparing occasional use to abuse, which doesn't compute for me. Of course abuse of a substance is more concerning.


----------



## the_lissa (Oct 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *karina5* 
Of course there are people that abuse pot, and I'm sorry to hear your DH was one of them, and it's good to hear he isn't doing that anymore.

The problem with your story is that it's just that...one story. It's similar to alcohol. There are people that use it - even daily - (one glass of wine with dinner for example) and it is not a problem in their lives. And then, of course, there are people that let the drug (alcohol) ruin their lives and the lives of their family.

Your DH is the exception and not the norm when it comes to pot, as the majority of pot users lead productive lives and don't let their use harm their families and loved ones.

Exactly. Abuse of any substance is not good, but that isn't cuase to make it illegal imo.


----------



## kalimay (May 25, 2005)

to lighten the mood a funny SNL clip about this

http://www.hulu.com/watch/56636/satu...michael-phelps


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I'm anti-drug because my DH's marijuana addiction nearly ruined our lives.

I'm glad marijuana is illegal after what I've seen, and it distresses me when people say it's "just pot." My husband wasn't himself when he was on it, thought of nothing but getting his next fix, and didn't give a care about our family.

My ex's marijuana habit did end our marriage (okay - not _only_ that, but it was probably the biggest nail in the coffin). I'm still not anti-pot.

My dad is an alcoholic, but I don't think alcohol should be illegal, just because _he_ isn't capable of drinking in a responsible manner. I am. My mom is. My dh is. My bff is. I know many alcoholics, and many addicts, _and_ I know many people who drink responsibly and/or use pot on an occasional basis, in which the _only_ potential problem comes from the fact that it's illegal.

I would never presume to tell other people that they can't smoke pot, just because my ex was incapable of using it responsibly. I'll also point out that the illegality of pot didn't prevent my ex or your dh from becoming addicted/dependent and messing up their lives.


----------



## Lemon Juice (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I'm anti-drug because my DH's marijuana addiction nearly ruined our lives.

I'm glad marijuana is illegal after what I've seen, and it distresses me when people say it's "just pot." My husband wasn't himself when he was on it, thought of nothing but getting his next fix, and didn't give a care about our family.

The ONLY thing that stopped him completely ruining our lives was one day, after he'd bought his latest fix, a cop pulled our car over. He didn't arrest or search us, but he "warned" my husband that the police were watching.

It was a long, hard road, but he flushed the pot when he got home, and he hasn't touched it since then. Quitting was a hard road, a very hard road, but once he realised that he could be in jail away from his family, quitting was worth it. It was only after he'd quit that he realised what hell he had made our lives up until he quit. I wish I could talk to that officer now and thank him. He saved all of our lives.

I think the sheriff who is prosecuting this case is very brave and very fair. I'd like to write him a letter thanking him for what he's doing. I think so many lives are hurt or destroyed by marijuana but we never hear about it because people dismiss it as "just pot." And often law enforcement is the only way to stop things.

I am sorry your dh abused a substance.







I'm sure the entire ordeal was awful for you. But MJ is NOT addictive...people have addictive personalities and your dh is one of them. He could have abused anything but chose MJ. That doesn't make MJ bad b/c for many that is not the case. And we don't hear about it b/c there are so few cases of this compared to other drugs and alcohol and cigarettes. And imo you would be writing a letter and thanking him for wasting thousands of tax payers dollars.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *karina5* 
Of course there are people that abuse pot, and I'm sorry to hear your DH was one of them, and it's good to hear he isn't doing that anymore.

The problem with your story is that it's just that...one story. It's similar to alcohol. There are people that use it - even daily - (one glass of wine with dinner for example) and it is not a problem in their lives. And then, of course, there are people that let the drug (alcohol) ruin their lives and the lives of their family.

Your DH is the exception and not the norm when it comes to pot, as the majority of pot users lead productive lives and don't let their use harm their families and loved ones.

ITA w/ All of this. And his story is very similar to alcohol which is legal and destroys MANY more lives than that of MJ. Those lives that mj destroys is b/c of the law makers and not the mj in most cases. Your dh is a small exception and while it's sad it is not the norm when it comes to mj. Stats prove that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the_lissa* 
Exactly. Abuse of any substance is not good, but that isn't cuase to make it illegal imo.

Right on! Especially when that substance benefits many people. For example...Just b/c your dh abused it doesn't mean that a person experiencing severe nausea should feel like a criminal to use it to keep down food and eat to live.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

The sheriff isn't going to get anywhere with his case, he isn't brave, he is trying to get his name in the paper and maybe his city on the map. That is self interest, not bravery. SC has no law against toking a bong that is handed to you, which by all accounts is what happened.

They have laws against possesion, which he did not do. Also, he never admitted that MJ was what was in the bong. By his statement could have been tobacco. I'm sure he didn't check.







Anyone who thinks this case will get any real traction has no real idea about how the criminal justice system works in this country. Umm, the entire area that this happened in works on the Good Old Boy Justice System, and Micheal Phelps has mad layers. They are just trying to make a little $$$ and they will fail.

Also, the idea that MJ is super illegal in this country is a false one. In at least 10 states it is legal, in a few more it is decriminalized and there is a HUGE cultivation industry that the government totally knows about and tolerates. Guess what? You can even toke in JAIL! That's right, I just talked to someone who did a 7 year bid and he told me: not only can you smoke every day in prison if you can afford to (it is more expensive there) but the gaurds overlook it AND sometimes are your connection to the outside. They appreciate happy mellow prisoners. Crazy right?

Also, if you will read any accounts of that night, it was clear that he was ABUSING ALCOHOL which no one finds very scandalous somehow? It is almost 'expected' at his age. :eyeroll: Most secular socialization takes place in bars or drinking parties.

Anyway, drinking IMO is what compromised his judgement enough to toke a bong on camera. It is the LEGAL substance that our dear MPhelps seems to struggle with.


----------



## Collinsky (Jul 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I'm anti-drug because my DH's marijuana addiction nearly ruined our lives.









I feel the same way about porn







:... so I do get where you are coming from. The difference is that I don't think porn should be made illegal or something that can be prosecuted, because I don't think that's the answer. Just because I've been hurt by someone's addiction to it, doesn't mean that I have the right to say that even though most families aren't adversely affected by it, they aren't allowed to indulge in it in any form, because of my situation. To say that a committed loving couple wanting to rent an explicit movie to enjoy together should be illegal because some men have a porn addiction that is affecting their marriages adversely (some even lose their jobs because of the obsession and compulsiveness) is simply not fair. Marijuana has medicinal uses, as well as often being a harmless social drug like alcohol. There is actually less chance of dependency and overuse with weed than there is with beer and wine, but making those illegal made things worse for everyone, alcohol consumption increased, and it created a level of organized crime in this country that had never been seen before that.

I personally know people with marijuana problems - where the usage has interfered in their lives, where it is the most important thing for them. And that sucks, just like any addiction does. And it hurts people around them. And it hurts them! But the issue is that people who abuse marijuana to the point that it is ruining their lives (just like people who abuse alcohol or gambling or sex or food or whatever) have _something more going on_. And without marijuana, it will be something else that is used to numb their pain. Untreated addiction doesn't go away, IMO, no legislation can change that.

I know it's so hard, when an issue touches you so hard, so close. In your situation, it seems that the laws helped your husband and your marriage... but the laws aren't beneficial for most families.


----------



## HisBeautifulWife (Jun 18, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *journeymom* 
So, prior to this 'revelation' did you consider Michael Phelps a decent role model for children? Is he no longer a good role model for your kids?

I do not think that children should look to celebrities as role models. You don't know them, you don't know their character. Being rich doesn't make someone a good role model. Being famous doesn't make someone a good role model. You don't know what or who they did to get there.

I prefer children look to people in their own lives for inspiration. If that's not possible, that's fine. Everyone doesn't grow up having a role model. Some people look inside themselves, or look to God.


----------



## Minky (Jun 28, 2005)

I can't believe that there are people here who would blame the user, not the drug and the dealers who got him hooked on it. And people who say it's not addictive are liars. It is addictive and has withdrawal symptoms. My family has the scars to prove it.

The difference between alcohol and marijuana is that marijuana affects the motivational center of the brain. The alcoholics I have known in my life were motivated to get another job even if alcohol eventually caused them to lose it. The marijuana users are too unmotivated to even go look for a job.

The sheriff is brave and will be able to test that bong, which has been confiscated, for marijuana residue. And hopefully those college kids and Phelps can get some help before it's too late.


----------



## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I can't believe that there are people here who would blame the user, not the drug and the dealers who got him hooked on it. And people who say it's not addictive are liars. It is addictive and has withdrawal symptoms. My family has the scars to prove it.

The difference between alcohol and marijuana is that marijuana affects the motivational center of the brain. The alcoholics I have known in my life were motivated to get another job even if alcohol eventually caused them to lose it. The marijuana users are too unmotivated to even go look for a job.

The sheriff is brave and will be able to test that bong, which has been confiscated, for marijuana residue. And hopefully those college kids and Phelps can get some help before it's too late.

Minky, I'm sorry for what your family went through, that must have been awful.

But you are just plain wrong. MJ is not PHYSICALLY adictive and in no way, shape or form causes withdrawl symptoms. That's a fact.

Your experience is clouding your judgement, but it's just insane to say that because of the rare situation you experienced that MJ is addictive, etc etc. It's just not in ANY way true.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Minky, nobody on here called you a liar for what you're family went through but you are essentially calling people liars for saying that pot has not messed up their lives or the lives of their families. Why are you calling people liars when nobody did that to you?

And it is true that pot is not physically addictive the way nicotine or heroin is, where the body has withdrawals. That is not to say a person can't get " addicted" to having pot the way your DH did, but it is just not true that pot is physically addictive (part of the reason there have been no deaths from pot).

As far as motivation goes....you apparently have no idea how many productive, job-holding, responsible members of society use marijuana. That's too bad that you only have the stereotype of the cheeto-eating couch-lazing slacker but not all pot smokers are that way (most are not, in fact).

The sherriff is not "brave" to be testing that bong. That takes no bravery.







I suggest you educate yourself on the War on Drugs and maybe you will learn a thing or two about the motivations to keep pot illegal. I guarantee you that "bravery" has nothing to do with it.

People have been very kind to you about your particular situation, but the lack of information and knowledge you have about both pot and the War on Drugs is truly astounding, as well as insulting on your part.


----------



## stacyann21 (Oct 21, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Freefromitall* 
I had to scratch my head at the idea that a 23yr old with a bong was considered national news.









:

Michael Phelps is not my son's role model and I don't have an issue with adults using mj responsibly anyhow.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I can't believe that there are people here who would blame the user, not the drug and the dealers who got him hooked on it. And people who say it's not addictive are liars. It is addictive and has withdrawal symptoms. My family has the scars to prove it.

The difference between alcohol and marijuana is that marijuana affects the motivational center of the brain. The alcoholics I have known in my life were motivated to get another job even if alcohol eventually caused them to lose it. The marijuana users are too unmotivated to even go look for a job.

The sheriff is brave and will be able to test that bong, which has been confiscated, for marijuana residue. And hopefully those college kids and Phelps can get some help before it's too late.


If this case gets any traction, I'll eat my shirt. The sheriff won't be able to prove that the marijuana residue on that bong was not there BEFORE Phelps got it handed to him, or that it was truly ever in Phelp's possesion, by ALL ACCOUNTS it was handed to him. Some have theorized that he 'knew what to do with it' but that is pure speculation. Maybe he had seen a movie, like 'Next Friday'.

Also, what will the Sheriff do? Extradite him?







That is truly laughable! I've seen them be unable to extradite people for attempted murder, nevermind taking a toke of someone else's bong which is NOT ILLEGAL! Plus, I sincerely wish those who believe the case will get any traction always retain that simplistic & beautiful faith in the American Legal system, but the facts are, even a semi-competent lawyer could make this disappear before 10 a.m. and a fancy high priced celebrity lawyer wouldn't even have to get out of bed to demolish it with his Blackberry!









*My old boyfriend was crazy addictied to TV.* (As are many many americans) I mean he would watch all day and it totally affected his motivational center or his ability to do anything but watch TV. I tried to get rid of it but he had to have his 'fix' every dang day. Should TV be outlawed because it depletes the motivation of 20 something young men?

My mom is addicted to perscription pain meds and drives all over town while hopped up on them, endangering others. No one can do anything about it, because she has some real pain issues as well. Should those be illegal? She is also addicted to Diet Pepsi at the rate of 3+ cans per day and it has demolished her health and wreaked havoc with her bones. Should we outlaw DP?


----------



## Aubergine68 (Jan 25, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dinahx* 
*My old boyfriend was crazy addictied to TV.* (As are many many americans) I mean he would watch all day and it totally affected his motivational center or his ability to do anything but watch TV. I tried to get rid of it but he had to have his 'fix' every dang day. Should TV be outlawed because it depletes the motivation of 20 something young men?

My mom is addicted to perscription pain meds and drives all over town while hopped up on them, endangering others. No one can do anything about it, because she has some real pain issues as well. Should those be illegal? She is also addicted to Diet Pepsi at the rate of 3+ cans per day and it has demolished her health and wreaked havoc with her bones. Should we outlaw DP?


I haven't read the whole thread, don't know who this guy is and certainly don't personally care what he does.

But, honestly, I think I could personally get behind the criminalization of network TV, driving while impaired by prescription pain meds, and the sale of aspartame in food products. I tend to think society would be much improved by this.

ETA, yeah, I'm kidding, sort of. But I'd seriously like to live in a world like that.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

Me too.







But I think until we criminalize these things, and alcohol and tobacco too, we best leave Cannabis sativa alone.









Minky, it is also worth noting that in your DH's case the ACTUAL penalties for small possesion were 'a warning'.

They had no idea he would decide to turn over a new leaf, he could have easily not have. And the penalties even if they had decided to throw the book at him, would not have meant years in jail or a misdemeanor. Even in the dirty south (where stricter MJ laws IMO indicate a lower tolerance for hippies and minorities, not a lower tolerance for the herb itself), it wouldn't have been more than a misdemeanor, and misdemeanor first offenses are typically pled down to violations at worst and nothing at all at best.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

ETA: Just pulled this off the Washington Post's comments:
Leon Lott has a much higher arrest record for marijuana busts than cocaine or crack, hmmm...priorities. He denied there was a gang problem until he was forced to bust up a gang meeting following several crime watch calls to his department. He had no participation in the largest cocaine bust in his county.

I don't know about you, but I'd like to see some of that bravery directed toward cocaine. There definitely is some in SC. Also a growing Meth problem.


----------



## primjillie (May 4, 2004)

Minky, I agree with you. I don't know anyone in real life who smokes pot on a regular basis that can keep a job and a relationship. They just seem to lose thier initiative and motivation to do something productive with their lives. I have heard many, many stories on MDC about people who smoke daily and still lead productive lives. I'm surprised at this, based on the people I know, but I guess anything is possible. I can't compare pot to alcohol, because alcohol is legal and pot isn't, whether we like it or not. Almost everyone in my life, drinks socially and sometimes every nite, but they are employed and don't seem to let the alcohol affect their lives, as pot can do. I wouldn't risk pot, just because it is illegal (where I live, at least). My family and my job are worth risking. I think it is irresponsible if you have a family, but that is just my opinion. I am disappointed in Michael Phelps, but it doesn't change my view of him. I'm not into hero worship anyway......


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *primjillie* 
I have heard many, many stories on MDC about people who smoke daily and still lead productive lives. I'm surprised at this, based on the people I know, but I guess anything is possible.

It's entirely possible that you also know people who do this. You can't tell by looking at them that they smoke pot, and most of them don't advertise it to people they don't know well. I can think of at least one teacher (at the time - she's since left teaching for something else) who smoked years ago. She didn't let her students know and kept it pretty close to her chest, as it could have cost her her job. I knew another woman - a successful stock broker - for about 5-6 years before I found out that she and her husband smoked pot...and she only told me because she was letting me and my ex use her apartment until we got a place, and thought we might come across their stash and/or paraphernalia. The people smoking pot and leading productive lives aren't the ones that you can look at and say, "he/she smokes pot". It doesn't _show_.

Quote:

Almost everyone in my life, drinks socially and sometimes every nite, but they are employed and don't seem to let the alcohol affect their lives, as pot can do.
Yes - pot can affect one's life...but so can alcohol. I've known many, many people who drink, and who smoke pot. Overall, I've known more people whose lives have been negatively affected by the abuse of alcohol than by the abuse of pot. Admittedly, I also know more people who drink than smoke (because pot is illegal, and that's the only reason in several cases), but even when I look at it as a proportion of people I know who do one or the other, the alcohol is more destructive. Of the people I know who do both, more of them have lives that have been adversely affected by their alcohol consumption than by pot.

I will personally never smoke pot again, and I do still drink occasionally. I still believe pot to be considerably less dangerous than alcohol.


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dinahx* 
Should TV be outlawed because it depletes the motivation of 20 something young men?
Should we outlaw DP?

Am I allowed to say yes to these?


----------



## SleepyMamaBear (Jun 5, 2005)

i will chime in here and put myself out on a ledge, knowing that at any time i can come back and delete what i have posted...
i use MJ as a medicine. Daily. i have fibromyalgia, chronic migraines, ibs, and am bipolar. in combination with my prescription medicine, the MJ helps me be a functioning memeber of society. i am the opposite of unmotivated when i medicate. it helps me function, it helps me with my range of motion, it helps my migraine pain, and keeps me from puking. i couldnt live a productive life without it.
yes, it IS federally illegal. in the state that i live in it is decriminalized, and even legal with an OMMP card to grow and partake.
every single friend i have that also partakes in the blessed herb finds releif and motivation in it. i havent known any lazy stoners since i was in high school and everyone was just sitting around smoking pot to get stoned off their arses and eat doritos.
as an adult, i dont know anyone who could be labeled as a lazy stoner, or a pot head. just functioning motivated members of society that are wonderful human beings, not the terrible unmotivated lazy stoners that are being portrayed on this thread.

i have to say that i do take offence to being labeled along with the other stereotypes that people have of others who partake in Cannabis.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

That's a good point that people don't necessarily *know* who uses pot and who doesn't. It's not like there are labels to wear









The pot smokers that I know that are productive members of society do keep it under their hat. They have a variety of jobs - teachers, social workers, clergy, business owners, administrative assistants, Director of agency that helps battered women, health practioners (both traditional and alternative medicine), and even law enforcement!

They go to work, cook meals, go to church, go to family get togethers, do things outdoors, have hobbies, and volunteer in their communities, just to name a few things.

I really think this can't be emphasized enough, and it's a shame that people just think of the Jeff Spicoli stereotype when it comes to pot smokers.

It reminds me of my mom, who is quite sheltered and I must say, judgemental. One day she said, "Well I don't know any gay people!" and I said to her, "Well you do, but you just don't know it."


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *primjillie* 
Minky, I agree with you. I don't know anyone in real life who smokes pot on a regular basis that can keep a job and a relationship. They just seem to lose thier initiative and motivation to do something productive with their lives. I have heard many, many stories on MDC about people who smoke daily and still lead productive lives. I'm surprised at this, based on the people I know, but I guess anything is possible. I can't compare pot to alcohol, because alcohol is legal and pot isn't, whether we like it or not. Almost everyone in my life, drinks socially and sometimes every nite, but they are employed and don't seem to let the alcohol affect their lives, as pot can do. I wouldn't risk pot, just because it is illegal (where I live, at least). My family and my job are worth risking. I think it is irresponsible if you have a family, but that is just my opinion. I am disappointed in Michael Phelps, but it doesn't change my view of him. I'm not into hero worship anyway......


IMHO, someone who drinks every nite is unquestionably an alcoholic. I would say that is affecting their lives, it is certainly affecting their liver and possibly their driving ability, since alcohol can stay in your system for longer than is commonly thought.

Please, if one more person posts on here that you can lose your children from cannabis use. You CAN'T. CPS will not take children away for mere marijuana use, it would have to be combined with other clear cut destructive behaviors. The worst that can happen for simple cannabis use is that you will have to take a class and possibly lose 1200. You would have to be making 'cannabis sales' your bonafide career to face any type of serious or even non-serious jail time. There is no state in which you will see jail time for simple possession of cannabis alone unless you like to buy in such crazy large amounts that no one would believe they were for personal use.

Plus let us please also differentiate from misdemeanor/violation illegal and felony illegal. There is a clear difference.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SleepyMamaBear* 
i havent known any lazy stoners since i was in high school and everyone was just sitting around smoking pot to get stoned off their arses and eat doritos.

I have - but not many. And, you know...ds1 doesn't smoke pot, and is very motivated in some ways (not-quite-honour roll, and well over 90% in several classes, plus volunteering at the boys and girls club, choir, gymnastics, camp counsellor a couple weeks a year...and would like to do more, playing guitar, drawing, etc.). Nonetheless, he's quite capable of sitting around on the couch playing videogames for several hours at a time, if he's allowed to do so.

And...I'm not a super-motivated person. I become overwhelmed very easily (eg. we have _massive_ cleaning/decluttering/organizing to do around here, and I'm totally avoiding dealing with any of it), and then I go hide. People could have (and did!) looked at my crappy high school grades and assumed it was because of my pot use. It wasn't. My grades started to slip long before I got into pot, and my motivational issues were, at worst, somewhat aggravated by being high. My ex, who was absolutely dependent on pot, is a highly unmotivated person, whether he's smoking pot or not.


----------



## Minky (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *primjillie* 
Minky, I agree with you. I don't know anyone in real life who smokes pot on a regular basis that can keep a job and a relationship. They just seem to lose thier initiative and motivation to do something productive with their lives. I have heard many, many stories on MDC about people who smoke daily and still lead productive lives. I'm surprised at this, based on the people I know, but I guess anything is possible. I can't compare pot to alcohol, because alcohol is legal and pot isn't, whether we like it or not. Almost everyone in my life, drinks socially and sometimes every nite, but they are employed and don't seem to let the alcohol affect their lives, as pot can do. I wouldn't risk pot, just because it is illegal (where I live, at least). My family and my job are worth risking. I think it is irresponsible if you have a family, but that is just my opinion. I am disappointed in Michael Phelps, but it doesn't change my view of him. I'm not into hero worship anyway......

Yeah, I agree on the hero worship, too. My kids probably don't remember what he is.

I'm also always surprised when I read stories (always online) about marijuana users with happy, productive lives, because the exact opposite has been true with the many friends and family members I know who have had problems with the drugs. And I know I'm n ot a doctor, but there is definitely something to the studies that say it effects motivation.

There's also another factor, which is, unlike booze, if you're in a room with someone smoking MJ, you get the effects as well, which is really undesirable if you don't want them, and you have to worry about your kids as well. DH never smoked around DD and quit before DS was born, but it was always a worry.


----------



## mistymama (Oct 12, 2004)

"Minky, I agree with you. I don't know anyone in real life who smokes pot on a regular basis that can keep a job and a relationship."

Oh trust me, you know them. You just don't KNOW that you know them.
















The theory that someone can't smoke pot, keep a job & relationship is seriously laughable and so, so naieve. Belongs in Reefer Madness right along with the guy who takes a toke and goes insane.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

You know I thought that, about booze not affecting you if you are nearby (and also not being a temptation of mine, just not a drinker) until I moved into the 'drinking dorms' (to avoid the 'toking dorms') at college. BIG MISTAKE! Drinking does affect the people nearby. Drinkers become incredibly LOUD and IDK, you just can't study with them near by. So I would just argue that drinking DOES affect the people around.


----------



## bigeyes (Apr 5, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mistymama* 

The theory that someone can't smoke pot, keep a job & relationship is seriously laughable and so, so naieve. Belongs in Reefer Madness right along with the guy who takes a toke and goes insane.

Exactly. To me, a 'stoner' is like an alcoholic. People who can use MJ responsibly are just like people who can drink responsibly.









One of the most driven people I ever knew was a person who smoked a joint every evening at home. She worked full time and went to school part time on her way to a degree. An ex-bf, otoh, was what I would consider a 'stoner.' Smoked all the time and had zero ambition.

I have other friends who are accomplished and successful, and they smoke regularly.

Pot and alcohol aren't the problem, whatever it is that goes wrong with the person who becomes an addict is the problem. I mean, some people even become addicted to food, but we can't outlaw food, can we?

Wouldn't it make more sense to find out what makes some people become addicted?


----------



## Drummer's Wife (Jun 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mistymama* 

Oh trust me, you know them. You just don't KNOW that you know them.

























yup. I can think of 2 RN's, 1 PA and a teacher that I know personally who partake on a very regular basis. Oh, and an awesome chiropractor! Then of course, I know a ton of other functioning members of society, these are just the ones on a more professional level that you would probably assume didn't smoke.

Now, I do know some lazy, unmotivated, 'stoner' types but it's more of a personality/mental health thing and they also use other substances, including alcohol.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

Exactly: what I find really dangerous about PHYSICALLY addictive drugs like nicotine and heroin/opium/opiates are that they are addictive INDEPENDANT of the propensity of the user to become addicted. They can addict anyone who uses them. The same can be said to some extent for cocaine and meth, because they create such a disincentive to 'come down' because you will be faced with such incredible depression when you do.

So to me that is the difference between pyschologically addictive drugs and actual PHYSICALLY addictive drugs. Pyschologically addictive drugs are just like TV or Food or the Computer. People looking for an escape may turn to them, but they don't exert a PHYSICAL hold on the user.


----------



## Lemon Juice (Jun 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I'm also always surprised when I read stories (always online) about marijuana users with happy, productive lives, because the exact opposite has been true with the many friends and family members I know who have had problems with the drugs. And I know I'm n ot a doctor, but there is definitely something to the studies that say it effects motivation.


I would LOVE to see these "studies" you refer to. I really would.
You are in need of a good read. I posted this back on page 4 but you obviously didn't read all the posts. You need to educate yourself on the other side to be making the judgements that you make. Beacause right now you sounds so uninformed and downright uneducated on the subject.

Quote:

Contrary to the messages promoted by the federal government, marijuana consumers include people from all walks of life, ethnic classes, and socio-economic backgrounds. America's current President said that he smoked marijuana regularly as a young man. Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, former Vice President Al Gore, former Republican House Speaker Newt Gingrich, California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, and legendary astronomer Carl Sagan all have admitted using marijuana at different times during their lives.

Quote:

According to the U.S. government, some 70 percent of current marijuana users are gainfully employed. Statistically, most marijuana users are successful academically and financially. A National Bureau of Economic Research study even reported that marijuana use is associated with earning higher wages. Some former and current users, like Virgin tycoon Sir Richard Branson, Progressive Auto Insurance founder Peter Lewis, and New York State Mayor Michael Bloomberg are even multi-millionaires.
I'll also add to one of your online "stories". My dp partakes EVERY SINGLE DAY and makes near 100 grand a year. Self taught at what he does and his company wants to make him a VICE PRESIDENT of the corporation and he hasn't even worked there a year (actually...8 months in he was offered this...) So put us on your list, mama!







:


----------



## cottonwood (Nov 20, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *primjillie* 
I don't know anyone in real life who smokes pot on a regular basis that can keep a job and a relationship. They just seem to lose thier initiative and motivation to do something productive with their lives. I have heard many, many stories on MDC about people who smoke daily and still lead productive lives. I'm surprised at this, based on the people I know, but I guess anything is possible. I can't compare pot to alcohol, because alcohol is legal and pot isn't, whether we like it or not. Almost everyone in my life, drinks socially and sometimes every nite, but they are employed and don't seem to let the alcohol affect their lives, as pot can do.

There was a time in my life that I could have said that about alcohol-drinkers -- the only people I knew who drank were my two grandfathers, who were both raging alcoholics, and the "bad" kids at school. All my friends and their parents and my parents' friends were teetotallers. From that I guess I could have surmised that the universal effect of alcohol is that it ruins people' lives.

In my experience, I've known only *one* person personally who uses marijuana who is what most people would regard as "a loser", but he has always had mental issues and difficulty fitting into society (as seen from the outside, he doesn't see it that way, he thinks he's just fine.) Everyone else I know who uses marijuana works a steady job, and most are professionals and well-regarded in the community. Should I conclude from that that pot "makes" people successful and improves their lives?

There's a difference between correlation and causation.


----------



## Minky (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:

*Please, if one more person posts on here that you can lose your children from cannabis use. You CAN'T.*
If my DH has to do jail time because of drug use, he loses his kids while he's in jail. I didn't mean someone would actually take our kids away, though if kids are being exposed to marijuana smoke secondhand on a regular basis, it might be a good idea.


----------



## sharon.gmc (Nov 17, 2008)

Michael Phelps has attracted a lot of young fans already. It's just irresponsible to do that.


----------



## dinahx (Sep 17, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
If my DH has to do jail time because of drug use, he loses his kids while he's in jail. I didn't mean someone would actually take our kids away, though if kids are being exposed to marijuana smoke secondhand on a regular basis, it might be a good idea.

Well since he got off with a warning for simple possesion even though apparently the cops knew all about what he was up to, how strictly do you think MJ laws are enforced? I know someone who's DH was caught with 3 OUNCES and a scale and baggies in the last year. A lot more than simple possesion. Jail time, you think? Nope! Not a single day. And IMO the legal case was handled badly. As in the outcome could have been even better!

And I really feel that secondhand TOBACCO smoke is the real problem in our nation. Some doctors estimate that a FULL THIRD of children who grace their hospital beds are sick ONLY from Tobacco smoke. So those children should also be removed, and actually be removed first, because Tobacco secondhand smoke has a lot of other carciongenic compounds that are not found in cannabis smoke (including radioactivity and the undisclosed tobacco company additives). But then we would have one overburdened foster care system right?


----------



## Redifer (Nov 25, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Drummer's Wife* 







yup. I can think of 2 RN's, 1 PA and a teacher that I know personally who partake on a very regular basis. Oh, and an awesome chiropractor! Then of course, I know a ton of other functioning members of society, these are just the ones on a more professional level that you would probably assume didn't smoke.

Now, I do know some lazy, unmotivated, 'stoner' types but it's more of a personality/mental health thing and they also use other substances, including alcohol.


Have to agree with this. And, for comparison, allow me to throw out two seperate industries I've worked in:

Strip club - I've worked in 3. Hardly anyone at all smoked mj (or drank, or did drugs, contrary to popular belief and what the media would imply). In each club, out of 25-40 employees, I can count on one hand (or less) the employees that smoked on an occasional basis. This was in a semi-large city with fairly progressive opinions on mj.

National Cable Company - Literally, every second person smoked mj on an occasional to regular basis. These were clean-cut, college educated professionals, that lived in nice victorian houses, went to work every day, paid their bills, etc. And this was in a small town where the use of pot was highly frowned upon. Only reason I knew half the building was partaking is because my best friend was the supplier. Otherwise, I never would have known (or guessed).

Simply because someone doesn't wear a huge 420 t-shirt or a button that says "Ask me about my bong!" doesn't mean they don't smoke/don't support mj.


----------



## aniT (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Minky* 
I can't believe that there are people here who would blame the user, not the drug and the dealers who got him hooked on it. And people who say it's not addictive are liars. It is addictive and has withdrawal symptoms. My family has the scars to prove it.

The difference between alcohol and marijuana is that marijuana affects the motivational center of the brain. The alcoholics I have known in my life were motivated to get another job even if alcohol eventually caused them to lose it. The marijuana users are too unmotivated to even go look for a job.

The sheriff is brave and will be able to test that bong, which has been confiscated, for marijuana residue. And hopefully those college kids and Phelps can get some help before it's too late.


Dude seriously? Thats about all I can think to say to this post.









As someone who used to smoke pot several times a day I find this post so completely off base it is not even funny. Pot is not addictive. I was able to stop the second I wanted to stop smoking it. There were no withdrawal systems at all. As for people not being motivated enough to go out and look for a job, well from my vast experience with dating losers I have to say, that has nothing to do with pot and everything to do with their own personality.

I also don't believe they can arrest you unless they catch you with it IN YOUR POSSESSION. So getting a lil DNA and pot residue off a bong is not going to get anyone arrested. Nor should it force them into a program to get help for something they don't need help with. Seriously, the priorities in this country are messed up.


----------



## karina5 (Apr 15, 2006)

Update on Michael Phelps:

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/29224926/

Yay!!!







: They won't do anything about someone holding a bong in a PHOTO







. Thank goodness common sense rules (here at least).

This sherriff Lott guy sounds more than a little power-trippy to me, and I do NOT say that about most law enforcement. Anyway...I'm glad to hear this.


----------

