# Healing the Gut Tribe-October



## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Hey there mamas! Welcome to a brand new month.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

subbing...


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)




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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I need to have a cross contamination rant. My sweet little ds is so very allergic to dairy. I have thrown out everything in the house that either has dairy or has been processed in a facility that also processes dairy. I know he also has soy issues, but since ds1 does too we don't have any soy in the house anymore either. I thought we were safe.

Yesterday ds was so uncomfortable, crying, squirming, vomitting I had no idea what could have happened. I was frustrated because I thought everything here was safe...until I happened on anther thread completely by accident saying that Maranatha's nut butters are all soy contaminated. Sure enough I had eaten their macadamia nut butter that morning. I am so angry. I feel like nothing is safe! Lord knows how long before the poor little guy poops again. Over two weeks ago I accidentally got some dairy and it took him 8 days to have a bm. He's only 2 months old! He finally pooped on Saturday, and then I go and get soy contamination on Sunday.







Stupid gut. Stupid soy. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Okay, rant over.

Like I said in last months thread. I feel like we've done alot of healing. This little guy is just throwing me for a loop. Good thing he's the cutiest boy ever. I'd do anything for him.







:


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## Gale Force (Jun 15, 2003)

How terrible firefaery!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Like I said in last months thread. I feel like we've done alot of healing. This little guy is just throwing me for a loop. Good thing he's the cutiest boy ever. I'd do anything for him.







:

I think Jane has said that before "it's a good thing he's cute..." I agree. Things have gotten a lot better for us but the last time we were at the chiropractor he happened to see Frederick's bare feet and his toenails that curl under and said "hypothyroid." Well, of course he is.







My thyroid has improved a lot because I can actually lose weight now rather than gain uncontrollably, but I don't think it's as good as it will be. And my husband seems to be hyperthyroid, so we would make a good seesaw.

These things just take a lot of time. We like to think of healing in terms of months. Years or decades may be more like it.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Years is right.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gale Force* 
These things just take a lot of time. We like to think of healing in terms of months. Years or decades may be more like it.

How discouraging! Actually I wouldn't mind years if I could just eat a reasonably normal NT diet, maybe minus a few foods and with tons of lactoferments, water kefirs, liver, bone broths...that sort of thing.

ff--


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## mama-a-llama (Feb 8, 2006)

Ooh, I'll jump in here while the thread is short! Ds has eczema on his cheeks, and I have pompholyx on my hands (similar to eczema, but suppposed to be stress related, not allergic). We've both had lots of antibx so I assume our guts need help.

My major dilemma: I've been ep'ing, pumping 8x day until last month, when I went down to 7. If I go any lower, I won't have enough milk. But for my own health, I NEED more sleep. I was planning to start dropping pumps, and start supplementing with homemade formula. If I did SCD, not sure if I can make a legal formula. I was thinking about trying to elim dairy but it would mean I would have to keep my current pumping level for at least a month. Which is so overwhelming it makes me want to cry. This whole thing is stressing me out and making me want to cry.

My main question is: do you all use SCD? I see in the cheat sheet sticky that Jane also lists Rubin's stuff, and EFLF Health Recovery diet. I'm really afraid of SCD, b/c I'm prediabetic, and honey is a no go for me. All my usual alt. sweeteners are illegal. Also, I'm on inositol (illegal) for depression, and really feel it's helping. I'd hate to have to give it up--and nettles, which I also find helpful.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

For many reasons the SCD would be GOOD for you if you are prediabetic. Honey may be a no-go but for the rest of it the foods are low GI. You just won't eat a ton of fruit. I'll write later with more info.

Not everyone here does SCD. Some do it, some do a modified version, somedo the maker's diet. Some just eat well and use supplements. If you are trying to heal, you will fit right in.

I made my own formula with ds. There are dairy free options, but I didn't use them.

Sorry you are so stressed. It's no fun having supply issues. I pumped for a long time with ds (he never nursed), and for five months with dd(when she finally started to nurse!), which didn't seem that long to me, considering. Of course, there were always bad days. Are you doing any herbs (besides nettles) to help?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Geez, you mamas are quick. I just started a new thread. Going to delete it . . .

Just posted a pic on September's thread.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I need to have a cross contamination rant. My sweet little ds is so very allergic to dairy. I have thrown out everything in the house that either has dairy or has been processed in a facility that also processes dairy. I know he also has soy issues, but since ds1 does too we don't have any soy in the house anymore either. I thought we were safe.

Yesterday ds was so uncomfortable, crying, squirming, vomitting I had no idea what could have happened. I was frustrated because I thought everything here was safe...until I happened on anther thread completely by accident saying that Maranatha's nut butters are all soy contaminated. Sure enough I had eaten their macadamia nut butter that morning. I am so angry. I feel like nothing is safe! Lord knows how long before the poor little guy poops again. Over two weeks ago I accidentally got some dairy and it took him 8 days to have a bm. He's only 2 months old! He finally pooped on Saturday, and then I go and get soy contamination on Sunday.







Stupid gut. Stupid soy. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Okay, rant over.

Like I said in last months thread. I feel like we've done alot of healing. This little guy is just throwing me for a loop. Good thing he's the cutiest boy ever. I'd do anything for him.







:

I saw that thread ff. Sorry you're dealing with this. I swear, it would be easier living like a pioneer - at least you'd know where your food came from and what was in it.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I'm trying to psych (sp?) myself up to try water kefirs...but since I'm actually showing signs of improvement now I'm a little afraid of the sugar in them. I know I can culture them for a long time to reduce the sugar but I probably won't like them that way. Any thoughts on whether coconut milk kefir with its natural sugars would be any better?

Also, does anyone (GaleForce?) have any idea if I can make coconut milk kefir with water grains and no added sugar? I have a recipe for coconut milk kefir w/milk grains and no added sugar, but you have to make dairy kefir every few batches to keep the grains going. Maybe I could do the same thing with water kefir, or do those grains need more sugar than the milk ones?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

subbing


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I have been making coconut water kefir. I don't love the taste but I figure it is good for me... I mix it with other stuff (like kombucha) and it tastes pretty good. Actually the taste isn't too bad but it has a strange, strong smell I don't like.

I make it with milk grains. I am planning to recharge them periodically in milk, but I have milk arround to do that with and we aren't super sensitive to traces of milk like some are.

I think I'm going to try to make kombucha. Buying it is breaking the bank and DD loves it. My neighbor has a scoby. I had it in my fridge for like a month before and never got arround to making it...

There really does seem to be a shift in dd lately. Not sure if it is diet, healing from her birth trauma, growing up, whatever, I'll take it. Now if she would just start sleeping....


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## p1gg1e (Apr 3, 2004)

Subbing.

I've been feeling better almost 90% there. I'm a little lactose intolerent but over all no more indigestion , heartburn or nausea...No it was not MS I felt like this scince last Nov. DD's allergy to dairy is getting better and I've gained a little wieght this pregnancy but not much ( even though I didnt have MS this time







: ) I'm making pumpkin pie with cocanut milk to get my wieght up and I found that I can eat kasseri cheese









Thanks ladies and keep the good tips coming... Going back in to lerkdom


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I have been making coconut water kefir. I don't love the taste but I figure it is good for me... I mix it with other stuff (like kombucha) and it tastes pretty good. Actually the taste isn't too bad but it has a strange, strong smell I don't like.


Do you think the kefir is helping? Have you seen any negative effects from the sugar in the coconut water?


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

For the past 3-4 days I have had a, well, not a stomach ache, but my stomach (from bottom of ribs to belly button) feels tight and rounded, like a clenched muscle. I have also been burping a lot (not painful - no acid coming up, just little burps). I wonder if my digestion is slowing for some reason? Im actually less stressed this week than I have been - hmm.. Burping means acid, right? Which would mean? Ive been drinking some peppermint tea, but it doesnt help. Could it be the party Im hosting on Sunday for 40 people (15 kids under 5)?







Hmmmm.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

And the frustration continues...
So I've spent the better part of my day searching for a truly dairy free infant probiotic. Apparently they don't exist. Everything out there was at least started in dairy (yes, even the dairy free ones.) I called several companies and had to follow the trail on up to get real answers. One told me it was cultured from a human source (which means-well, you know







: ) and as I inquired further and was transferred several times they finally acknowledged it was in fact STARTED in dairy-but there's none left and it's just the starter and blah blah blah. How do you remove all traces of dairy, and even if you can how are you testing that you have?

Several at least were up front, but this one company (Sedona) didn't know it's arse from it's elbow-at least their staff doesn't.

I am not finding one that my guy can tolerate at all. I just don't feel safe using anything that has ever had contact with dairy.







:


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Subbing.

Dd's latest flare-up of eczema (from some dairy I consumed and didn't know it) is finally healing. I want to work really hard to keep the soy and dairy out of our diets. Dairy is pretty easy, but soy is tough. We love Chinese and Thai foods, which are now out. Darn that soy sauce!

Anyway, dd's bms are mostly normal now that she's getting l reuteri and culturelle everyday. We also added coconut oil. It's surprisingly tasty









I know that allergy testing has been discussed at length, but could someone give me the Cliffs Notes version as to why it is or isn't effective? I have been wondering if dd has any sensitivity to nuts. I thought I read somewhere that soy-allergic people are often allergic to other nuts (peanuts?). I'd love any info on those topics.

Thanks!


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It's the legume thing. Soy, peanuts, lentils etc. are all in the same family. It is very common for people to be allergic to related foods. Nightshades are another family that people are commonly reactive to.

I really prefer blood testing because it's very clear. I just posted this somewhere else. There's no confusion, you get a solid printout with your allergens on it. You have the possibility of false negatives, but as the person gets older it's less of an issue. Under two there may be many false negatives. I love Immunolabs for this and everyone I have referred there has been thrilled with them. People here have used them too, and I'm not aware of any bad experiences. Anyhow, that's my take!


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Does that include all beans? We eat a lot of them and haven't had any probs--even had lentil soup last week that didn't cause any neg reaction that I saw. I wonder about the potential of an allergy forming, though, since we know about soy. Is there an argument for avoiding other legumes at this point?


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## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

Just popping in to ask FF why she was shocked at my picture!?









Annikate,
I USED to be hot. Before motherhood.







:


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JaneS* 
Just popping in to ask FF why she was shocked at my picture!?









Annikate,
I USED to be hot. Before motherhood.







:









Me too. Hard to believe now.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

FF-so do you think that 10 months old is too young to get a good readout of allergies through a blood test?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Here's my advice-if at 10 months the babe is EBF then YOU get the testing done and see what you are leaking. Otherwise it depends on the severity of the reaction. *IF* insurance will pay-go for it. They actually recommend that you test again in a year or two to see of things stay stable. Then you'll get your readings now and again after the second b-day. If you are paying out of pocket and the reactions aren't too too bad, then I would wait.

The rule of thumb is if there are two know allergens in one family then you avoid everything in that family.

Jane-I never expected dark hair!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
FF-so do you think that 10 months old is too young to get a good readout of allergies through a blood test?

We had dd blood tested when she was almost a year old. She was eating *some* things but certainly not wheat which she tested highly allergic to. I don't regret having it done because it confirmed suspicions but I do wish that we had added more foods to the panel. (Her allergist only tested about 10 or 15.)


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Wow! I think we tested 115. The standard ped.panel is 88 (I think) but I opted to go with the adult panel because what mattered was what I was allergic to and therefore exposing her to. Again, it is worth it, but if you are not financially able to and really want it done, it may be worth waiting. That is if you can. I wouldn't have waited because dd was in bad shape.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Well, we go through the military for our health care, so everything through them is free. These blood tests are the kind you can get done at a regular lab? I suppose I could convince his ped to do the testing. His reactions are not horrible but he has not been exposed to wheat, corn or soy for a few months. DS is eating some things but he is getting to the age when other people might be tempted to give him food that is not approved by me







: . If I have proof I may be more successful in stopping that from happening.


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## mama-a-llama (Feb 8, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I made my own formula with ds. There are dairy free options, but I didn't use them.

I'd love to hear more about this. Could you PM me?

Quote:

Are you doing any herbs (besides nettles) to help?
Fenugreek tincture 3 ml/day, and oat tincture 3 ml/day. Maybe it's the stress, but the past few days have been really bad. I usually have a dip around AF, but this started after, which is unusual. I hate the idea of _choosing_ to supplement, but I just can't keep this up.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
And the frustration continues...
So I've spent the better part of my day searching for a truly dairy free infant probiotic. Apparently they don't exist. Everything out there was at least started in dairy (yes, even the dairy free ones.) I called several companies and had to follow the trail on up to get real answers. One told me it was cultured from a human source (which means-well, you know







: ) and as I inquired further and was transferred several times they finally acknowledged it was in fact STARTED in dairy-but there's none left and it's just the starter and blah blah blah. How do you remove all traces of dairy, and even if you can how are you testing that you have?

Several at least were up front, but this one company (Sedona) didn't know it's arse from it's elbow-at least their staff doesn't.

I am not finding one that my guy can tolerate at all. I just don't feel safe using anything that has ever had contact with dairy.







:

I'm sure you already researched this one, but just in case...Solaray BabyLife is supposed to be dairy free. But if dairy free probiotics aren't really dairy free...then that would probably explain DD's eczema flare-up, which started around the same time I started giving her the BabyLife...which would also mean she is way more sensitive to dairy than I thought, even though she doesn't generally show obvious signs. On the other hand, the BabyLife definitely helped her gut as she no longer has bloody poop, even when I ate a ton of dairy for about 10 days straight.

Do you know anything about herbal tinctures, firefaery? Like are there some herbs which don't do well as tinctures, or can you make pretty much anything into a tincture? I'm trying to do a bunch of herbal teas (milk thistle, liver support blend, digestive blend, anti-fungal blend, and mineral rich blend) but I can only drink so much tea.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Here we are http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/7947/dscf1856tt3.jpg


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Yeah, it's looking like nothing is really dairy free unless it's a human culture, and I haven't found one of those. Not sure if I'd use one if I did.

Caedmyn-tinctures are a great bet...they just tend to be much pricier. Easier to take, but pricier. I usually do a mix. Tea for around here, tintures if I'm out and about.

Mama-a-llama-let's talk. There are different things to look for to figure out which herbs you need to increase production. I will pm you in the am.

Nolan's mum-what a sweet little babe! How are things going over there? I used Immunolabs, as this is their specialty. You'd have to ask if they are equipped to do IgG testing. IF you have out of network benefits you could have it done through them.


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## mama-a-llama (Feb 8, 2006)

Maybe OT, but I was just reading last month's thread, about Alpha Lipoic Acid being a chelator. Eeep! I was taking 200mg/day during my pregnancies to help with blood sugar issues, on the advice of my former chiro/naturopath. I wonder if that has anything to do with ds's genetic disorder


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

on pics, dh governs our family photo website and makes it just plain HARD to share stuff (but if you're bored you can see what is available to the general public http://steinbachs.org/photos/) - so i jumped momentarily on the photobucket bandwagon http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n...1/HPIM0351.jpg

in past lives, i was an accounts receivable/inventory clerk (for my dad in high school), babysitter, musician (french horn, violin, classical voice but not opera, piano, some organ - until i got burned out performing in mid high school), science library technician, research lab technician (i hated the actual experiments- data was more fun), computer system administrator (until i got bored with that)... now i oversee the daily operations of a growing research center with a boss who is just now (5 years into my position here) learning how not to be a micromanager (he has a long way to go still).

firefaery - did you miss the posts JaneS made during the summer? something about an Amish child and poop and inoculation...

could you not use a dairy-free yogurt starter and then culture it on EBM over and over again? what about using milk kefir grains in EBM? it would taste NASTY, but eventually it might have high enough microbial count and low enough cow's milk protein that you could tolerate it. JaneS had been growing her grains in goat milk - maybe they'd be a good source.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

ff,







s to you. So sorry your ds is so sensitive. Thanks for the warning about Maranatha nut butters, I had no idea. Would that be the same with Trader Joe's versions?


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## motocita (Oct 31, 2004)

hey everyone,

i've talked to some of you before in other forums (thanks for all the great advice). i'm finally coming to join here officially, though i've read almost all the posts from every month.

my dd (2 years old) and i have yeast issues and need to heal our guts. when i read the description of leaky gut, it sounds like it fits her. we both had thrush when she was 2 weeks old and i tried to treat it every natural way i could find - finally swabbed her mouth with nystatin and i took diflucan and it went away. starting day 2, she had GERD/ reflux/ colic. it went away between 4-5 months. we used hyland's for keeping her comfortable. i eliminated dairy at some point but didn't see a difference. i thought you only needed to eliminate for 4 days so that's what i did and no difference.

at about 18 months, she developed eczema. we've done a real elimination diet, for about 5 weeks, and her OLD eczema spots almost cleared - they are no longer red except occasionally. their footprint is still there though. the newer spots behind her knees still look a mess and she has even developed some new ones since being on this crazy diet.

we eliminated dairy, gluten, eggs, soy, and nuts. about 3 weeks into the diet her eczema started getting much much worse and i realized she was sensitive to tons of things - it seems like salicylate sensitivity. i had been giving her lots of coconut oil to substitute for the fat we gave up with dairy, and lots more produce instead of the grains, and i think this pushed her over the edge. now her eczema is worse than when we started (overall) and she is reactive to everything!!! she has shiners every day instead of occasionally.

i cut back severely on the high salicylates and reintroduced dairy and eggs. i know it was not the smartest move but the elimination diet was tearing my household apart. it just was not good for our family. caused tensions, dd and i were constantly hungry and cranky.

jane, i loved the article you posted somewhere about moderation - the one where your friend took a moderate approach and still regained health. i feel drawn to this approach. i fear that our bodies will become even more sensitive to foods we can now enjoy, if we go on a super restrictive diet. this is why i am not doing SCD at this time. i'll try a moderate approach and see where that takes us.

i believe very strongly that probiotics will heal her gut. with this salicylate sensitivity we had to cut out coconut oil. i am also a strong believer of weston price/traditional foods so it seems nearly impossible to me to do without both dairy and coconut oil and still get a significant amount of probiotics into her.

we are 9 days into eating dairy and eggs. not much difference so far - she has good days and bad days. we've been eating 24 hour cow's milk yogurt (raw milk when i can find it) every day, with supplemental jarro probiotics cultured in there too. we've also been drinking kefir sodas daily. i'm soaking everything for 24 hours (brown rice, quinoa). we have bone broth in some form every day. continuing the CLO. yesterday i re-introduced x-factor butter oil and today our complexions looked rosy, plus dd was in a GREAT mood and full of energy today.

my plan, for today anyway







is to continue to eat in a traditional manner, preparing foods so as to be as digestible as possible, continue dairy unless i see a severe negative reaction, and keep a low level overall of the foods high in salicylates. i REALLY hope that dairy will work out, as i am totally counting on the probiotics to heal her gut. if we did have to cut out dairy i would continue with just kefir but i worry about our yeast issues and the sugar in those sodas.

i've also made an appointment to see dr. neustaedter (author of the vaccine guide, a frequent guest speaker here at mdc) on thursday. i sure hope the visit will be worth the $270 consultation that insurance does not cover. i had very good success with traditional chinese medicine myself so i am hopeful.

i guess that's about it. thanks for reading! i do feel somehow better after joining here officially, like i'm finally doing something concrete about our health.


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## gilamama (Aug 9, 2005)

wow i had looked on this thread a few months back for my dh, he had severe stomach problems that are to some degree healed b/c he has no more pain (havent asked about his bowels recently), but he cant resist junk food so i have feeling that his health is temporary. maybe you all have some advice for my baby. she is 8 months old, was sensitive to dairy but i have eaten it a few times lately and it doesnt seem to bother her. And is definitely sensitive to wheat - gives her green mucousy bowels and excema







- when *I* eat it. i have introduced food about a month ago, she had 2 teeth and is generally calmer and happier with food. but dont feel I am giving her the right things. wish i had one of those babys who wanted to EBF for a year, but that is not the case. dh also fed her food w/o my permission giving her diarea occasionally in that time. ugh... he has no self control for himself or my babies. (in terms of food) it is so usetting to me. ok... so i saw this "natural doctor" and she told me to give dd rice cereal with this herb "chinese date" in it. i was waiting till i had time to make my own b/c there is no brownrice ceral available where we live and she said dont drive myself crazy give her white rice cereal. this goes against what i know from NT and LLL reading. she didnt mention probiotics at all and i asked her another question b/c we are jewish and recently celebrated a holiday on which you fast all day 25 hrs asking her how to prepare for the fast she told me each day for a week cut down my food. THat seems like crazy advice for a tandem nursing mother. So I dont really trust this woman at all now, but payed her and we live in a small town and feel weird about stopping seeing her. Sorry to go off topic. Wanted to know what you all thought of her advice and what advice you have for my baby. SHe never had much of those flakes that belong in normal baby make. Oh and aside from inheritting my dh's stomach I took IV erythromycin in childbirth.





















i did everything natural to eliminate GBS and then at the last minute when I am almost at 10 cm the midwife pressures me and ya know i am about to have a baby so i cave. Just thinking about that choice makes me nauceous. i was thinking abt giving her egg yellow like it says in NT or oatmeal b/c of the omegas or coconut milk but I know coconut allergies are common so i wasnt sure. Iwelcome any advice you have, thanks for your help ladies.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Wow! I think we tested 115. The standard ped.panel is 88 (I think) but I opted to go with the adult panel because what mattered was what I was allergic to and therefore exposing her to. Again, it is worth it, but if you are not financially able to and really want it done, it may be worth waiting. That is if you can. I wouldn't have waited because dd was in bad shape.

Yeah, I wish I knew then what I know now. That allergist (while he believed in leaky gut, was an idiot. I actually had to threaten him w/a lawyer so he'd release dd's records to me.







: )

Wondering if our new DAN doc will order more allergy testing . . .


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Here we are http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/7947/dscf1856tt3.jpg

Awww, sweet!


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## JaneS (Jan 11, 2003)

FF,

Natren's Dairy Free Bifido Factor is grown on chickpeas.
http://www.natren.com/pages/natashart1.asp

Quote:

Dairy Free powder: Viable Bifidobacterium bifidum, Malyoth super strain on a culture base of organically grown garbanzo bean (chick-pea) extract and cellulose powder.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Jane-I'm calling them today. What it's grown on and what it's started on are two different things. I just can't take any more chances.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Pookietooth-I don't know. If you're concerned, call. What I do know is that we just set up an account with a nut butter company that is allergen-free. No soy and no peanuts, no gluten, no dairy. It's called Futter's Butters. www.futtersnutbutters.com I will be obtaining all my nut butters from them.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

mama-a-llama-there are plenty of things you can take for blood sugar support if you are still in need of it. Ask about chromium, vanadium, cinnamon...there are others too. Fenugreek is actually very good at regulating blood sugar. You just need to take it in a specific way.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Pookietooth-I don't know. If you're concerned, call. What I do know is that we just set up an account with a nut butter company that is allergen-free. No soy and no peanuts, no gluten, no dairy. It's called Futter's Butters. www.futtersnutbutters.com I will be obtaining all my nut butters from them.

I'm now drooling over the chocolate walnut....Thanks a lot.
















I just ordered some melatonin for dd. We haven't tried that yet. We'll see how it goes. I'm also working on getting more kombucha into her. We'll see. I'm just getting sick of experiementing.

Oh on another site I'm on there is a mom who is seeing a DAN Dr' for her ds. He sent him to a ped GI who scoped him and said that the yeast is becasue of inflamation and if you can get the inflamation undercontrol the yeast will go away too. This kid is on some anti-inflamatory drugs, not anti yeast drugs. Anyone know anything about this angle?


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Oh on another site I'm on there is a mom who is seeing a DAN Dr' for her ds. He sent him to a ped GI who scoped him and said that the yeast is becasue of inflamation and if you can get the inflamation undercontrol the yeast will go away too. This kid is on some anti-inflamatory drugs, not anti yeast drugs. Anyone know anything about this angle?

I'd love to know more about this, too.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I'm now drooling over the chocolate walnut....Thanks a lot.
















I just ordered some melatonin for dd. We haven't tried that yet. We'll see how it goes. I'm also working on getting more kombucha into her. We'll see. I'm just getting sick of experiementing.

Oh on another site I'm on there is a mom who is seeing a DAN Dr' for her ds. He sent him to a ped GI who scoped him and said that the yeast is becasue of inflamation and if you can get the inflamation undercontrol the yeast will go away too. This kid is on some anti-inflamatory drugs, not anti yeast drugs. Anyone know anything about this angle?

Darn! I have some melatonin I would've sent you. I tried it for for dd2
and while it did help her fall asleep initially, it did not keep her from waking (and waking, and waking...) DD never really had trouble falling asleep, she just can't *stay* asleep.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

How much melatonin do you give an infant? DD's been having a horrible time going to sleep at night lately (actually I think she's having a fine time, but I'm not!)--takes a couple of hours to get her to go to sleep (and stay asleep for a couple of hours).


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Darn! I have some melatonin I would've sent you. I tried it for for dd2
and while it did help her fall asleep initially, it did not keep her from waking (and waking, and waking...) DD never really had trouble falling asleep, she just can't *stay* asleep.

Well if it works you can send me your left overs.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Bluets-very cute, dinner looks yummy!

Annikate-Awww

Waiting to see some more!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

FF- those nut butters look good, esp the chocolate varieties. When I cheat I have been having a square of very dark chocolate







. Sorry your little one's are sensitive, it gets expensive trying all these different foods and suppliments only to find they don't work or make someone react. Not to mention that you have to do all your buying on line.

gilamama-sounds like you don't trust your natural doctor, don't go back it her advice makes you uncomfortable. Trust your instinct as to how much to eat during your fasting, nursing takes a lot of energy and calories. Also I read this article from the westin price foundation about grains for babies:

Quote:

Finally, respect the tiny, still-developing digestive system of your infant. Babies have limited enzyme production, which is necessary for the digestion of foods. In fact, it takes up to 28 months, just around the time when molar teeth are fully developed, for the big-gun carbohydrate enzymes (namely amylase) to fully kick into gear. Foods like cereals, grains and breads are very challenging for little ones to digest. Thus, these foods should be some of the last to be introduced. (One carbohydrate enzyme a baby's small intestine does produce is lactase, for the digestion of lactose in milk.1)
The whole article can be found at http://www.westonaprice.org/foodfeat...rish-baby.html


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Anyone have any suggestions for cold remedies? I'm already taking vitamin C to bowel tolerance and it doesn't appear to be doing a darn thing. I already take 5 cloves of raw garlic a day, too--maybe I need to increase that if I'm sick? The only remedy I know of for colds/sore throats is honey in tea (besides gargling with salt water) and of course no honey on this diet







I just hope DD doesn't catch it.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Sore throat...either throat coat tea (works SO well) or gargle with hypericum. I also employ colloidal silver for a really bad one. You shouldn't need to take any more garlic than you are.

If it is really bad the wet sock treatment is great, but not all that comfortable.

For future reference I love Yin Chiao for the beginning of colds/flu. If you catch it at the very beginning it never happens. IT's the one piece of "voodoo" my husband will regularly submit to as it always works for him.

Nolansmum-that is why I feel super lucky to be able to set up accounts, makes it hurt far less.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

DD got a cold today. I gave her a bath with some oils in it for colds. Can't remember all the stuff in it (got it in Germany) but eucalyptus and menthol, maybe plus some other stuff. Did some facial massage for her: warm the sides of your thumbs and then rub down either side of your nose, close to the front. You can also circle your eyes, and there is a acupuncture point just to the side of your nose -- in the depression -- that you can press on with your thumbs.

You could make a ginger/red pepper/lemon tea.

Do you have an acupuncturist? I have found them helpful for sinus/cold stuff.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

FF and Annikate - how did you gt rid of the pill-in-your-throat feeling (AK; if you do with that chelator, let me know!)?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Must be the first wave of colds, DS is getting over one and of couse he shared it with DH and me.

You ladies are so knowlegeable! FF- your family is so lucky to have you as a momma, who needs a doc(for the small stuff at least.)

Question about nut butters/nuts: When I soak nuts a al NT and then put them in the oven on a low temp are they still considered raw? When you buy nut butters from the store do you buy raw or roasted?


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Here is a pic of us from last year

Dried nuts have to stay under 120 I think? FF would know for sure.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

for really "raw", I thought the temp was 105F.


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## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

For colds I like to make a rosemary infusion, letting it steep for about 20 minutes. It's not bad at all to drink! Lately I have been using elderberry syrup and that works like a charm. I hope somebody can use this!

Here is a picture of DD and me from a wedding in May, and some of her from about two weeks ago.
http://s53.photobucket.com/albums/g5...ver/Elizabeth/


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
FF and Annikate - how did you gt rid of the pill-in-your-throat feeling (AK; if you do with that chelator, let me know!)?

I never had that feeling really, I was just *ahem-ing* a lot and feeling like I needed to keep swallowing yk? It wasn't really uncomfortable though.

I hate to admit it but while I was strict about the anti-candida thing (for a whole week and a half







) it did go away. Once I started fruit (and chocolate) again it came back a little.

That anti-candida diet messed me up so terribly that I started wondering why I was placing faith in a crazy homeopath to tell me what's right for me when clearly, the last 9 months or so on the SCD were working. I went back to *my way* with a few cheats here and there (like chocolate) and now I'm back to feeling normal again.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyofPunkiePie* 
Here is a picture of DD and me from a wedding in May, and some of her from about two weeks ago.
http://s53.photobucket.com/albums/g5...ver/Elizabeth/

Beautiful!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Here is a pic of us from last year

Dried nuts have to stay under 120 I think? FF would know for sure.

Link's not working for me.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Moonshine-me neither! I wanna see!

Nuts should stay beneath 118 to be considered raw. Fallon has different ideas on what constitutes raw for different foods based on fat content, but the raw world maintains under 118. I'm with them.

I buy raw when I buy them, but you're really talking about which is the lesser of two evils. Raw will still have phytates as they are generally NOT soaked, but roasted will have acrylamides. There are those that hypothesize that raw when bought conventionally aren't truly raw as the nuts heat up past 118 during the grinding. I prefer the taste of raw regardless.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

does this link work? yahoo changed their stuff around, and now I can't figure out how to link to a pic.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
I never had that feeling really, I was just *ahem-ing* a lot and feeling like I needed to keep swallowing yk? It wasn't really uncomfortable though.

I hate to admit it but while I was strict about the anti-candida thing (for a whole week and a half







) it did go away. Once I started fruit (and chocolate) again it came back a little.

That anti-candida diet messed me up so terribly that I started wondering why I was placing faith in a crazy homeopath to tell me what's right for me when clearly, the last 9 months or so on the SCD were working. I went back to *my way* with a few cheats here and there (like chocolate) and now I'm back to feeling normal again.

that a-hem feeling is the first symptom i get when i have anything with uncultured (pasteurized) dairy. then it cascades from there into really bad postnasal drip, sneezing, runny nose, watery eyes.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Yay! Now I can put a face to the voice! You look so much like my bf when I was little-very strange. Your girls are precious.

I gotta figure out how to post pics. I couldn't even post a belly pic in my ddc which is too bad as it is rather...adorned. Makes for a pretty pregnant belly!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyofPunkiePie* 
Here is a picture of DD and me from a wedding in May, and some of her from about two weeks ago.
http://s53.photobucket.com/albums/g5...ver/Elizabeth/

Georgeous! YOur DD already has a grace about her.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
does this link work? yahoo changed their stuff around, and now I can't figure out how to link to a pic.

Sweet girls!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Moonshine-me neither! I wanna see!

Nuts should stay beneath 118 to be considered raw. Fallon has different ideas on what constitutes raw for different foods based on fat content, but the raw world maintains under 118. I'm with them.

I buy raw when I buy them, but you're really talking about which is the lesser of two evils. Raw will still have phytates as they are generally NOT soaked, but roasted will have acrylamides. There are those that hypothesize that raw when bought conventionally aren't truly raw as the nuts heat up past 118 during the grinding. I prefer the taste of raw regardless.

Ok, so if I buy whole raw nuts from the store are they really raw? Or do I need to get them from a special place online for them to be truly raw? Then I can soak them and dry them in a dehydrator? How long on SCD before you were able to tolerate raw nut butters?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I was able to use them from the get go-thank god!

Nuts, if they are labelled raw are generally truly raw with the exception of cashews which are cooked out of their shells. You can get them truly raw, for a price. Peanuts are hard to find raw as well, but if you're interested I do have a source.

Once you have them just soak and dehydrate, then process. I often don't even dehydrate.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

FF- to post a pic: I'm assuming it is on your computer somewhere. Go to an image hosting site. You will see a button that says 'browse'. Click on it to find the photo in your computer. Then click on 'host it'. The next screen you come to will have a bunch of links you can copy and paste in a post.

Thanks for the info on the nuts, I am going to try grinding them right after I soak them next time around and see how my tummy does with that. I am not doing cashews or peanuts for now...


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## Gale Force (Jun 15, 2003)

Great pictures everyone! I'll get on the ball and post something, sometime.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I'm going to try to post a couple of pictures...
http://target.new.photos.yahoo.com/t...03057788392/34

This is me and DD at 4 months old (I couldn't find a good recent picture of both of us).

http://target.new.photos.yahoo.com/t...803057797442/4

And this is DD about a month ago.


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## nicholas_mom (Apr 23, 2004)

: I don't know why I am still coming here. Homeopathic doc put ds on gluten-free only since his excema took over his body in July and August. Of course, ds's excema is ALWAYS dormant in Sept. thru Dec. and starts up again in January only to be worse in Feb thru March and gets better in April - June and gets bad in July and August.

Doc think s the gluten-free is working but I told him that ds excema was 60% gone by the time we tried the gluten-free.

I want to do enzymes with ds for 2 more months while we do gluten-free. SCD is too restrictive for us here and mostly because we can't due nuts.

I do the 24-hour yoghurt and finally!!! am able to get ds to eat it. I put just a pinch of stevia in it and now he asks for mommy's raw yoghurt









I am STILL looking for hope and wisdom from you mammas!







:


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## crazycat (Oct 20, 2004)

New to this tribe ... nak

my ds1 has a very extensive medical history. due to being a 26-week preemie with severe chronic lung disease he spent the first three years or so of his life on steroids and antibiotics almost monthly. He also is G-tube fed and we have used primarily commercial formulas. I recently switched to a homemade formula posted by another MDC member that has no artificial sweeteners, uses whole organic yogurt, no preservatives, organic ingredients whenever possible, etc and he is doing VERY well so far on this, and I am so much more comfortable with this. I am hoping for suggestions on where to start with healing his gut. I have been giving him cod liver oil and probiotics as well as a multi and calcium/mag supplements but yesterday he had a very red, blistery rash in his diaper area, which I wondered if it could be a yeast die-off type of reaction from eliminating the corn syrup and having no more refined sugars in his diet?

I did read through some posts - I find this thread a little overwhelming in its size. Links to relevant discussions are welcome, too, I don't want anyone to feel they are repeating frequently asked questions over and over.

TIA!

ETA: DS is non-verbal, so has no way of telling me how he is feeling other than through his behavior, if that makes any difference in how you might choose any supplements or anything. Thanks!


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

crazycat- I have a fussy two month old on my lap. I'll be back, but just wanted to say welcome.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

I ought to know the answer to this question (and other rudimentary ?s I've been asking myself lately) but:
If one is allergic to wheat are they automatically and always allergic to gluten?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

No. There are different proteins that you could be having a problem with. Certainly a gluten sensitivity if far more common, but there are some who just have a wheat allergy.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Oh on another site I'm on there is a mom who is seeing a DAN Dr' for her ds. He sent him to a ped GI who scoped him and said that the yeast is becasue of inflamation and if you can get the inflamation undercontrol the yeast will go away too. This kid is on some anti-inflamatory drugs, not anti yeast drugs. Anyone know anything about this angle?

That makes sense, actually, because a lot of people with candida overgrowth have autoimmune diseases like fibro, chronic fatigue, etc. and also, diabetes is considered by some to be caused by chronic inflammation. And diabetes is associated with a higher risk of candida. My candida is caused by my PCOS (polycystic ovarian syndrome), which is thought by many to be also caused by chronic inflammation. I also have asthma, which is an inflammatory condition, too.

Chronic inflammation is very hot right now, by the way. There are many theories about what causes it, including high carb diets, food intolerances, stress and genetics. All I know is I don't want to be on anti-inflammatories, since they cause a lot of problems (like immune system shutdown, etc.). What I don't know is what the solution to it is. I do know many say to keep grains, carbs, and dairy to a minimum. But that's just one approach.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I think it's a chicken vs. the egg thing. A damaged gut has been shown time and again to predispose people to autoimmune diseases, PCOS, asthma, diabetes etc. Is it because of the inflammation? Partially, yes. The inflammation creates all kinds of problems, but why is there inflammation? Something happens to cause it.

I'm not saying anyone's doc is wrong-but here's my belief: It all starts with gut health. All of it. A damaged gut will interfere with hormones, disrupt pituitary and thyroid function, mess with your adrenals and so on and so forth. IT is at the beginning of pretty much all ailments. It controls the immune system, the nervous system, pretty much everything. A damaged gut can and will lead to all kinds of things (as we all know) and I firmly believe that all these conditions can be reversed and healed if we tackle the main underlying problem. Of course then you need to figure how to do that-which diet, which supplements and what (if any) energy work which I believe is really essential. It can be homeopathy, accupuncture, anything really that creates that necessary shift. We often forget that we need to be in a specific emotional space to start down the healing path-otherwise you may have all the pieces and the body isn't ready to receive them.

Inflammation is a very hot topic now, and it should be. Pretty much everybody nowadays has some degree of inflammation. I just think we need to look deeper. It isn't a state we are meant to be in. It is a defense against something. We need to examine what it is we are doing to cause it. Antiinflammatory drugs (IMO) are just suppressing the symptoms, not dealing with the cause.


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## crazycat (Oct 20, 2004)

Thanks for the welcome firefaery! I am looking forward to any responses. I also wanted to add, DS is autistic and the formula he had been on was gf/cf (Elecare - it is 55% corn syrup solids, 6% soy and is an amino-acid based formula for kids who have trouble tolerating other formulas.) I did not notice major behavioral changes in the year since he was started on Elecare. He has made tremendous progress with a new private therapy program and since we pulled him out of school and he has been able to stay away from the bulk of cold/flu viruses. This new formula does use whole grain breads and cow's milk organic whole yogurt, so obviously is not gf/cf. I have not seen any behavioral changes in the 4-5 days since we started this but I know it is still early. The diaper rash does seem to be a bit worse this afternoon, very red/raw with some small bleeding areas, perhaps a little bit bigger area than earlier today.

Just wanted to add this in case it helps at all ... I haven't seen this bad a rash on him before that I can recall. Would it likely be yeast? Or maybe due to adding back the gluten/casein products? I'm not even really sure what to use on it ... it isn't just the prickly type diaper rash that I've seen in the past, and my DS2 really has never had diaper rash to speak of so I haven't had a lot of need for that stuff.

I am really thankful to have found this site - I have learned so much in so many areas. Thanks in advance for any thoughts or suggestions!!!


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Have you read Enzymes for Autism and Other Neurological Conditions? That may really help you.

It's hard to say without seeing the rash. My dd gets a horrid rash on her bum if she gets exposed to gluten. The two things I use are colloidal silver (anti fungal anti bacterial and anti viral-so it stops anything without identifying it-also very soothing) and then rescue remedy cream. Works wonders. I've never had to use anything else and she gets NASTY rashes.

There are GFCF options for formula if you are interested. I didn't use them (I did make my own formula, but we used raw goat milk as the base) but I think others have.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

crazycat, welcome. My heart goes out to you in dealing with your struggles. No advice, but stick around -- you will learn a lot.

caedymn, clicked on your links and yahoo told me "Uh-oh, something bad happened."







And no pic.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

I'm going to try to post a photo link, too, also yahoo. It's from about a year ago, pre-scd. I have longer hair, and am a bit unhealthier looking now. http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/jredwi...cd.jpg&.src=ph


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## crazycat (Oct 20, 2004)

Thanks! I will check out that book for sure. Would those recipes be posted on this forum somewhere? I wonder if I just totally overwhelmed his system by switching so suddenly back to formula that was not gf/cf







He never used to have rashes like this when he was on different formulas, but I would have to check how long it's been since he was on a gluten containing formula ... I'd have to recheck ingredients. He was only just determined to be autistic last November so prior to that we didn't have any concern over the gluten/casein and weren't considering that at all. I would love to see the other recipes. Other than the rash he is tolerating this formula so much better and seems much more comfortable overall. Plus it goes easily through his tubing without clogging up, which is important. Also, he is actually starting to actually EAT baby foods (he's had an entire 4-ounce jar so far today) ... which is huge since he has never taken more than a tiny taste or two more than 2-3 times in the past 2-3 years, and never prior to that ... so his interest in food is definitely a new thing and the formula is the only thing that has changed ...

Thanks again!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crazycat* 
Thanks! I will check out that book for sure. Would those recipes be posted on this forum somewhere? I wonder if I just totally overwhelmed his system by switching so suddenly back to formula that was not gf/cf







He never used to have rashes like this when he was on different formulas, but I would have to check how long it's been since he was on a gluten containing formula ... I'd have to recheck ingredients. He was only just determined to be autistic last November so prior to that we didn't have any concern over the gluten/casein and weren't considering that at all. I would love to see the other recipes. Other than the rash he is tolerating this formula so much better and seems much more comfortable overall. Plus it goes easily through his tubing without clogging up, which is important. Also, he is actually starting to actually EAT baby foods (he's had an entire 4-ounce jar so far today) ... which is huge since he has never taken more than a tiny taste or two more than 2-3 times in the past 2-3 years, and never prior to that ... so his interest in food is definitely a new thing and the formula is the only thing that has changed ...

Thanks again!

Have you read Children With Starving Brains by McCandless? If not it's a must read for anyone dealing with kids w/ASD or gut problems. She lays out *exactly* what you can do righy NOW to help. If there were only one book ever written on this topic that I could recommend, that'd be it.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Annikate-just curious, have you read Karen DeFelice's book? I much preferred it, but I'm a whacko anyway!







: I just wasn't thrilled with McCandless. Perhaps I should read it again.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

YK, I ordered it early on in this healing process and never really read the whole thing. I read McCandless a couple of months ago after I had learned a lot so maybe that's why hers resonated w/me more than Karen's. I should re-read it. (Or read it through that is!)

I'm not ADHD but I tend to read several books at once and if one stops being interesting to me, I rarely pick it back up.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I think we are getting die off in dd!!!







: I haven't ever thought this before with her.

Of course this means she is nuts







: but that is good, right????

We are just hitting her hard with probiotics right now w/o adding anything back to her diet. I'm giving her reuteri 2x a day and lots of kombucha. (not really sure how much). Her reaction is the "I got something I shouldn't" reaction but since I know she isn't getting anything new but those probiotics and they aren't new, just in greater ammounts, I think it is die off.

In general she is in good spirits, just tough at nap time/bedtime. Thankfully dh does bedtime.







:


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

I ate some bulghar wheat today without looking at the ingredients list.







Only a bite but I know it'll affect dd's sleep (as if getting 2 molars at once isn't enough.)

I bought some falafels at WF and didn't look at the list 'cause the girls were fussing and *gulp* swallowed it before I could spit it out.

QUESTION:
Theoretically, when I am healed completely, will I be able to ingest wheat and it NOT pass through b'milk to dd? Not that I would, but does gut healing prevent it passing through b'milk? It doesn't does it?


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I think we are getting die off in dd!!!







: I haven't ever thought this before with her.

Of course this means she is nuts







: but that is good, right????

We are just hitting her hard with probiotics right now w/o adding anything back to her diet. I'm giving her reuteri 2x a day and lots of kombucha. (not really sure how much). Her reaction is the "I got something I shouldn't" reaction but since I know she isn't getting anything new but those probiotics and they aren't new, just in greater ammounts, I think it is die off.

In general she is in good spirits, just tough at nap time/bedtime. Thankfully dh does bedtime.







:

Do you think it's the kombucha killing the yeast? Or do you think it's the retueri? I haven't tried kombucha at all yet for any of us.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
QUESTION:
Theoretically, when I am healed completely, will I be able to ingest wheat and it NOT pass through b'milk to dd? Not that I would, but does gut healing prevent it passing through b'milk? It doesn't does it?

You would think so...

I have noticed that even though I feel leaps and bounds better, if I slip in some uncultured dairy (or the weakly cultured kind), ds gets a snotty nose too. So in my case, I'm gonna say that something is still getting through to him. However, he isn't getting the red rashy cheeks that he had before and the snotty nose clears up much faster now than it did before. I would guess that he's getting a pile of my histamines...


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Do you think it's the kombucha killing the yeast? Or do you think it's the retueri? I haven't tried kombucha at all yet for any of us.

I bought kombucha and tried it - thinking that I would add it to my repertoire (dh loves tea, so kombucha seemed like the next step). I couldn't even finish drinking the bottle. It's still in my fridge and I keep thinking "oh, I should finish that"... It tasted very similar to apple cider vinegar. Is that what it should taste like? Vile, was the adjective that came to mind first.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Acid/Alkaline - Which one does yeast like? I am soo frustrated at reading the opposite. I just now read that it does not like acid (good bugs produce lactic acid that keeps yeast down), but havent we all discussed taking chlorophyll to alkalinize?







:

Also, to piggy-back on a comment FF made about motional readiness, it sounds like what MT said in the 101 thread (also on the subject of acid/alkaline); that your emotions can be acid, or your family, or work, or attitude, and these need to be worked out too for healing to happen. Makes sense to me.


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Acid/Alkaline - Which one does yeast like? I am soo frustrated at reading the opposite. I just now read that it does not like acid (good bugs produce lactic acid that keeps yeast down), but havent we all discussed taking chlorophyll to alkalinize?







:

Also, to piggy-back on a comment FF made about motional readiness, it sounds like what MT said in the 101 thread (also on the subject of acid/alkaline); that your emotions can be acid, or your family, or work, or attitude, and these need to be worked out too for healing to happen. Makes sense to me.

Alkaline is always better.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
You would think so...

I have noticed that even though I feel leaps and bounds better, if I slip in some uncultured dairy (or the weakly cultured kind), ds gets a snotty nose too. So in my case, I'm gonna say that something is still getting through to him. However, he isn't getting the red rashy cheeks that he had before and the snotty nose clears up much faster now than it did before. I would guess that he's getting a pile of my histamines...

So . . . does this mean (in theory) that if one's gut was not damaged at all and in perfect working order, then one could consume just about anything and not worry about it getting into b'milk?

This doesn't really make sense to me. Just *how* do things get into b'milk besides leaky gut?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Do you think it's the kombucha killing the yeast? Or do you think it's the retueri? I haven't tried kombucha at all yet for any of us.

I think it is the kombucha but it could be the reuteri. Not really sure but I increased the kombucha first.


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
I bought kombucha and tried it - thinking that I would add it to my repertoire (dh loves tea, so kombucha seemed like the next step). I couldn't even finish drinking the bottle. It's still in my fridge and I keep thinking "oh, I should finish that"... It tasted very similar to apple cider vinegar. Is that what it should taste like? Vile, was the adjective that came to mind first.









I saw a bunch of different *flavors* today at WF but didn't even look at them. I'm sure they're full of sugars.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
I bought kombucha and tried it - thinking that I would add it to my repertoire (dh loves tea, so kombucha seemed like the next step). I couldn't even finish drinking the bottle. It's still in my fridge and I keep thinking "oh, I should finish that"... It tasted very similar to apple cider vinegar. Is that what it should taste like? Vile, was the adjective that came to mind first.

It does have a bit of that taste but lighter and with fizz. The berry flavored ones are better. I don't mind vinegar though so perhaps I'm not the person to ask. We like it and more importantly DD loves it!

I'm getting a scoby from my neighbor as soon as I can get myself over to her house to get it so I can make my own.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 







I saw a bunch of different *flavors* today at WF but didn't even look at them. I'm sure they're full of sugars.

We get the citrus one and the one with green stuff in it (chlorophyl???) I'm gonna start making it myself though soon.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I occassionally get this kombucha and do quite like the taste. I started with original, then tried guava and grape. All very yummy. I got an extra original last time to try and start my own, but I ended up drinking it instead.







Maybe it is an acquired taste? My kids like it too. In fact, we often argue about who gets to drink it. If only they would dig the water kefir that I am making as much. My grains are just exploding.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I occassionally get this kombucha and do quite like the taste. I started with original, then tried guava and grape. All very yummy. I got an extra original last time to try and start my own, but I ended up drinking it instead.







Maybe it is an acquired taste? My kids like it too. In fact, we often argue about who gets to drink it. If only they would dig the water kefir that I am making as much. My grains are just exploding.

Thats the one we drink too


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## gilamama (Aug 9, 2005)

just wanted to thankyou for the link nolansmom and the response. it was such a relaif to have it all spelled out for me (what baby foods to feed when etc..) happy healing everyone.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

firefaery, I just got some cacao nibs and goji berries (which dd loves.) Will you post a yummy smoothie recipe for me so I can use my cacao?







:


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

We have two that we love:

"Selkie's Milkshake"
coconut milk, frozen strawberries, raw almond butter, honey and cacao

"Quillian's Smoothie"
strawberries, banana, cherries, blueberries, acai, peaches, greens powder, cacao, raw almond butter, coconut oil and sometimes goji juice.

Aren't the berries wonderful? They are so good for you, so tastey and really nutrient dense. My kids prefer them to raisins.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Kombucha







!

Sounds easy to make after making yogurt! Boy is it pricey at WF. I guess I want to drink it awhile before buying a 'culture' to make sure it agrees with us.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

My dd has athletes foot! Is this probably candida or is that another fungal thing? could it be a sign of die off?

She was a real mess today at the chiro's. I'm hoping that was die off. The chiro thinks that is certainly possible. Also I have gotten her swallowing the formula sf-722.









Man I hope that this really is die off and that we get through it to a calmer place soon.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

So, about enzymes. . . I've been back reading at enzymestuff.com because I'd forgotten the things I learned there (I feel like there is so much info to absorb with this leaky gut/allergy stuff!), and I had a couple of questions for your gurus. Currently, dd is taking all the right probiotics and we're doing elimination (dairy, soy and wheat), but other than some Candidase I bought early on, I haven't addressed the enzyme issue as seriously as I should have.

First, the Candidase was so bitter, I've had trouble getting dd (1) to ingest it. What can I do?

Also, it seems that the protease enzyme is the best for leaky gut to clear out the "junk" (as she says) and let things heal. What brand should I be looking for and how do I get my baby to take it?

Do the chewable papaya enzymes do any good? I just bought some today out of desperation. They contain sugar, so I don't know if the good effects will outweigh the bad.

Thank you, ladies! If it wasn't for you and everyone on these boards, I would be literally pulling my hair out. It's the *hardest* thing to do, knowing that your child is sick, for lack of a better word. I'm so glad there is something I can actually be doing about it.

ETA: I just checked my bottles and I have Digest Gold by Enzymedica. I'm assuming that will work for proteases.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

crazycat, if the formula has whole grain breads in it, the rash could be yeast from the grains. Have you already tried the formula in Nourishing traditions? I think Mercola has a slightly different recipe, too. Breaking the Vicious cycle has a formula, too, but it's not for long-term use. It's deficient in calcium, among other things. It uses pasteurized honey and dry curd cottage cheese. Is the milk you're using for the yogurt in the formula goat's milk? If so, you need to supplement the B12 and Folic Acid (if you aren't already).

Chinese Pistache, I don't know about the papaya enzyme tablets -- you could just try using raw papaya if available instead. The taste of most enzymes can be covered up, but only if you mix it with something like peanut butter or honey. See http://www.enzymestuff.com/discussionmixing.htm


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

You ladies are all so gorgeous. And your dc's are too!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
We have two that we love:

"Selkie's Milkshake"
coconut milk, frozen strawberries, raw almond butter, honey and cacao

"Quillian's Smoothie"
strawberries, banana, cherries, blueberries, acai, peaches, greens powder, cacao, raw almond butter, coconut oil and sometimes goji juice.

Aren't the berries wonderful? They are so good for you, so tastey and really nutrient dense. My kids prefer them to raisins.

Mmmm, sounds good.

What was the story with the coconut milk a few months back? One kind had lots of crap in it and another kind was okay. I've only tried c.milk *once* when I tried to make yogurt which didn't work. Can I get some at a regular grocery store?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Oh yeah, the goji berries are great! DD prefers these to raisins too (which I'm thrilled about since I don't really like her eating raisins) - - waaay too much sugar for her.


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## nicholas_mom (Apr 23, 2004)

Since doing gluten-free with ds, I noticed ds' bm are yellow and very mushy and he has 3 BMs a day. Is this his body detoxing? It has gone for 3 weeks now and wondered how long does detoxing take?

We saw his homeopathic doc the other day and he stopped this with a homeopathic remedy. But the doc doesn't do enzymes and I think I stoppped his healing because the dead stuff isn't coming out fast enough.

I am planning to do enzymes with ds.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
Chinese Pistache, I don't know about the papaya enzyme tablets -- you could just try using raw papaya if available instead. The taste of most enzymes can be covered up, but only if you mix it with something like peanut butter or honey. See http://www.enzymestuff.com/discussionmixing.htm


Thank you! I didn't see that link on her site. That's just the kind of info I needed. Thanks again!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

DH has a friend who is a medical researcher. After hearing our story he did some reserach and is quite sceptical that dd has candia since the only references he can find to it talk about severe life threatening conditions in nicu babies and the like.







: This is why I don't talk about this much. DH did his best to explain it (sent me an e-mail with a trail of comments in it) but got a bunch of it wrong as well. I'm not sure if I should be trying to clear things up with this guy or just drop it.


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## sphinxie (Feb 28, 2006)

Can anyone tell me about sources for well-priced, good quality COL and enzymes--for someone in Canada, specifically Vancouver? I've been buying them from my naturopathic clinic, but if I want to do this long term (especially the COL) I need to do a little comparison shopping. But a lot of the info is for the US, which comes with lots of shipping & sometimes customs costs for here.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Anyone wanna comment?







:


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Patty, the mainstream medical community and many related scientists are very sceptical of candida in someone other than someone who has HIV, because they only recognize it once it's terminal. It's a totally different paradigm. They don't believe in leaky gut, either. Ask them to explain how cow's milk protein gets into breastmilk.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
DH has a friend who is a medical researcher. After hearing our story he did some reserach and is quite sceptical that dd has candia since the only references he can find to it talk about severe life threatening conditions in nicu babies and the like.







: This is why I don't talk about this much. DH did his best to explain it (sent me an e-mail with a trail of comments in it) but got a bunch of it wrong as well. I'm not sure if I should be trying to clear things up with this guy or just drop it.

Yeah, I agree w/Pookietooth. I'd not waste any time or energy on it. We all know we're more informed than most - - even those who are scientists or medical professionals.


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## p1gg1e (Apr 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I occassionally get this kombucha and do quite like the taste. I started with original, then tried guava and grape. All very yummy.


Mmm I like that kombucha in mango







I'm so confused really about it though its fermented and its contains yeast but the probiotics are amazing in it... like eating raw sauerkraut... everything I read says those are a no - no but Sigh its killing my yeast and I feel better







:


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Thai Kitchen's coconut milk was reformulated and now contains soy. the new cans have gold lids, but if you can find them with the black lids you are good. There are several other brands that are fine...it's just about the label reading. I believe I am now using New Native-I just got a couple of cases from the co-op. I'll verify.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

This is OT, but so cool I have to share...

I performed tonight for all of the Supreme Court Justices! It is intimidating being around such intellectual and powerful people! They all look so much smaller than I imagined







. We got to walk through the actual courtroom too. I was speechless, all I could say is 'Wow!.'


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## flowmom (Feb 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sphinxie* 
Can anyone tell me about sources for well-priced, good quality COL and enzymes--for someone in Canada, specifically Vancouver?

Spectrum Supplements in Montreal ships free in Canada if your order is over $100. They carry Houston Neutraceuticals enzymes (the chewables are great for kids). They also carry CLO.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *p1gg1e* 
Mmm I like that kombucha in mango







I'm so confused really about it though its fermented and its contains yeast but the probiotics are amazing in it... like eating raw sauerkraut... everything I read says those are a no - no but Sigh its killing my yeast and I feel better







:

As far as I can tell, the anti-candida diets are usually referring to regular pasturized sauerkraut, which is made with vinegar, as a no-no.


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## flowmom (Feb 3, 2004)

I could really use some advice for a local AP mama who is shell-shocked because her husband had a sudden onset of Crohn's Disease a couple of months ago and is now disabled by severe joint pain (so bad he has to crawl to the bathroom).

Any good links on Crohn's & gut healing?
She wants to try SCD (friends got her the book) but she is a vegetarian so she is really struggling with how to plan meals and cook for her dh - any good sites with support or strategies for transitioning onto the diet?


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## Nosy (Feb 23, 2004)

Hi, I'm new here and trying to jump in on this thread while I can still keep up with it. I've read the healing the gut sticky, but I'm wondering what you all think might be appropriate for healing the gut of a 9 mo old. My 9 mo old DS has allergies to soy, nuts, & chocolate (react by spitting up after nursing). He is having trouble gaining weight. I have terrible breastmilk supply problems, else I would try to continue exclusively breastfeeding him (with no introduction of solids). He currently nurses mostly, but I have given him yogurt (would like to make my own raw milk yogurt, but haven't figure it out yet) & a few low on the allergy scale fruits & vegetables (pears, squash). He had antibiotics through me at birth and has had yeast problems since birth.

So is everything appropriate for a baby so young? Is it better just to do the healing the gut protocol for me and assume things will trickle down? I'd really like to get him feeling better. As an aside my 2.5 year old has asthma and some allergies, so he could probably benefit, too. Thanks for all I've learned so far from these informative monthly threads.


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## mamajaillet (Jul 24, 2006)

Hello everyone, I have posted a few time in the alleries forum, and tried to get through last month's thread here, but started too late, and just couldnt' get to the end to post and into.

I am still learning a lot about all of this, and know that we have some gut issues. My dd who is 5 mo is sensitive to dairy, and we are doing an elimination diet to see if we can find any other triggers, her skin is a little dry in patches, and her bum is so red (although it is clearing up, been on TED for almost 2 weeks). I am also realizing that my first probably has some triggers too, and I just didn't know enough before to recognize the signs.

So...I hate to ask questions that you have probably answered for so many finding there way here, but I am still trying to sort through some info in my head. If my dd is reacting to things through bm, does that mean I have a leaky gut? Is that the only way these proteins get through? Does it mean that I have the same sensitivities?

And if our guts are all messed up, do we have yeast problems too? We have never had thrush (in 5 years of nursing), I've never had a vaginal yeast infection either. However, my ds craves sweets (don't most kids?), but we haven't ever had sugar in our home--just b-day parties and such, and not until he was two. He craves fruit and jelly and cereal, and he is crazy when he has these, even fruit. Likewise, I have sweet cravings too. I can't imagine giving up grains, I tried to really limit them the first week of our elim diet, and I just can not digest meat like I can grains. Without the grains, I can't go to the bathroom.

I feel so overwhelmed at this point, but committed to healing us, and learning all that I can. I just thought we were so healthy, and I suppose on one level we were, we didn't eat junk. But I suppose none of that matters if our guts are wacky.

Anyways, I have realized that some of you mamas know more about all of this than my ND, so I am here to learn!!

Blessings.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
This is OT, but so cool I have to share...

I performed tonight for all of the Supreme Court Justices! It is intimidating being around such intellectual and powerful people! They all look so much smaller than I imagined







. We got to walk through the actual courtroom too. I was speechless, all I could say is 'Wow!.'

Very cool!


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nosy* 
Hi, I'm new here and trying to jump in on this thread while I can still keep up with it. I've read the healing the gut sticky, but I'm wondering what you all think might be appropriate for healing the gut of a 9 mo old. My 9 mo old DS has allergies to soy, nuts, & chocolate (react by spitting up after nursing). He is having trouble gaining weight. I have terrible breastmilk supply problems, else I would try to continue exclusively breastfeeding him (with no introduction of solids). He currently nurses mostly, but I have given him yogurt (would like to make my own raw milk yogurt, but haven't figure it out yet) & a few low on the allergy scale fruits & vegetables (pears, squash). He had antibiotics through me at birth and has had yeast problems since birth.

So is everything appropriate for a baby so young? Is it better just to do the healing the gut protocol for me and assume things will trickle down? I'd really like to get him feeling better. As an aside my 2.5 year old has asthma and some allergies, so he could probably benefit, too. Thanks for all I've learned so far from these informative monthly threads.

Right now you should be focusing on healing yourself. Anything you take (supplements, enymes, probiotics, etc.) will transfer through your bm to your babe. Have you looked into anything to increase your supply?

Have you looked at the sticky at the top of the forum? There's tons of good info there.

Helping my dd is what brought me here. DD was about 9 months at the time too. Little by little she's healing as am I. I actually healed much faster than she did and I know that without b'milk she would've been far worse than she was/is.

Hang around a while, the mamas here are extremely knowledgeable.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It is always best to start with yourself...as you heal things will get better. There are plenty of things that are appropriate for your babe, but before you jump in whole hog you may want to do some reading here first.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I am really frustrated! I have been so good about not cheating and I am so bloated. Bloated all day, all night, even in the morning when I wake up. My uterus area is protruding and it is firm. Actually my belly bloat starts from the bottom of my rib cage and goes all the way down to my pubic area. I don't have any stomach upset or bowel symptoms. Usually if I eat something that doesn't agree I feel it right away as a stomach ache and then the bloat comes. What gives??? I have also gained 5 lbs and have not changed the amount that I eat.

I remember a couple of others talking about this too. Anyone else going through this? Any ideas why this is happening?


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

i started here for my ds when he was 13 months old or so. i got it in my head that we should test him for leaky gut (before i knew how the test was performed). then i broke out in hives (a first!) and i found out that the leaky gut test involved collecting urine over a 6 hour period - haha. it turned out that *I** was the one with the leaky gut. he might have also had a leaky gut - but if he did, i think he is in the healing process now.

i agree with annikate and firefaery - focus on yourself and your babe will heal along with you (though at a slower pace because dc is healing AND growing, learning, etc).


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

nolansmum, i got that feeling once when i tried eating tempeh. the next time i tried tempeh, i used beano and didn't have the problem. i can't remember - are you using enzymes? if not, perhaps you should try some.

ETA - i stay far away from tempeh now!


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## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

Your post sounds a lot like the one I posted here a few months ago! It is quite a journey, and I am still very new to this myself (maybe I'm like apprentice to all the pros that hang out here!), but here are some pointers I'd give you from what I've learned after 3 months on this journey.

Yes, if things are getting through to your dd, you have gut issues. It took me a long time to believe this about myself because I never had any of the things I was reading about. however, after being on the SCD (check out www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info if you haven't been there yet) for 3 months, I realize that I did have some of the symptoms, I'd just come to think they were normal. Now my skin looks great and I feel so much healthier. I've had some emotional ups and downs with die-off and the stress of learning all this and trying to heal a little one, but when those aren't affecting me, I feel great.

Just because you have leaky gut does not mean you have yeast issues, although plenty of folks here have both. Luckily so far we don't, so we''re only having to battle one demon.

I, too, really couldn't imagine giving up grains and was overwhelmed about the introduction diet on SCD because of all the dairy (which I knew I couldn't do with my dd). However, once I bit the bullet and did it, it wasn't nearly as bad as I had feared. I have had to emotionally disconnect myself from food (I'm from the South and a family where EVERYthing centers around food). It's probably emotionally way healthier than how I was before, but has been really hard. I would suggest you check out www.pecanbread.com and their introduction diet if you decide to go the SCD route because it is dairy free.

I agree with ff - take some time to read around. It took me about 3 agonizing weeks to read up and decide I had to do this. For me, it really boiled down to the fact that I was already avoiding so many things, and I decided that if there were a chance to fix this, I should do it. Granted, I knew she may outgrow the issues on her own or that I may do all this and it not help, but I didn't want to take the chance that she wouldn't outgrow it and I would forever be wondering if I could have made it all better in the beginning by doing the diet. Plus, I figured it was easier to fix her though me than try to deal with following the diet for a toddler.

Good luck!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamajaillet* 
Hello everyone, I have posted a few time in the alleries forum, and tried to get through last month's thread here, but started too late, and just couldnt' get to the end to post and into.

I am still learning a lot about all of this, and know that we have some gut issues. My dd who is 5 mo is sensitive to dairy, and we are doing an elimination diet to see if we can find any other triggers, her skin is a little dry in patches, and her bum is so red (although it is clearing up, been on TED for almost 2 weeks). I am also realizing that my first probably has some triggers too, and I just didn't know enough before to recognize the signs.

So...I hate to ask questions that you have probably answered for so many finding there way here, but I am still trying to sort through some info in my head. If my dd is reacting to things through bm, does that mean I have a leaky gut? Is that the only way these proteins get through? Does it mean that I have the same sensitivities?

And if our guts are all messed up, do we have yeast problems too? We have never had thrush (in 5 years of nursing), I've never had a vaginal yeast infection either. However, my ds craves sweets (don't most kids?), but we haven't ever had sugar in our home--just b-day parties and such, and not until he was two. He craves fruit and jelly and cereal, and he is crazy when he has these, even fruit. Likewise, I have sweet cravings too. I can't imagine giving up grains, I tried to really limit them the first week of our elim diet, and I just can not digest meat like I can grains. Without the grains, I can't go to the bathroom.

I feel so overwhelmed at this point, but committed to healing us, and learning all that I can. I just thought we were so healthy, and I suppose on one level we were, we didn't eat junk. But I suppose none of that matters if our guts are wacky.

Anyways, I have realized that some of you mamas know more about all of this than my ND, so I am here to learn!!

Blessings.


----------



## motocita (Oct 31, 2004)

i took dd to see a traditional chinese medicine doctor and he explained to us that he likes to strengthen the patient's energy first, because sometimes homeopathic remedies don't work if your body doesn't have enough energy to mount a sufficient response to the remedy. he gave us two herb formulas - one to help her body release excessive heat and the other for frailty and weak digestion.

but, the really awesome part of the exam was the accupucture. he did it with a laser since dd is only 2 years old. he also used a scratching type tool to stimulate the energy channels in her legs and arms, right near where the worse eczema is. dd loved it, she got totally quiet and let him do it without any objection. this is very startling because she is usually super phobic of strangers and especially men. afterward on the car ride home she told me she wanted to see that doctor again, so he could do the scratching thing. she really enjoyed it!

it's been 2 days since the visit and her eczema is very noticeably reduced, plus i haven't seen those shiners that i used to see with almost every meal! we've been eating everything again with no reactions. this doctor believes we should strengthen her gut and just eat healthy. he does NT himself so that was great to hear. he did say to avoid wheat (but not gluten) because it's not healthy in general. he says that eczema is very easy to treat.

it really has been like a miracle for my family and i highly recommend anyone here who has access to see an accupuncturist. maybe you can avoid the frustration and trial that we went through with our elimination diet. i wish i had known sooner that this would have worked for us so quickly.


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## chasmyn (Feb 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *motocita* 
i took dd to see a traditional chinese medicine doctor and he explained to us that he likes to strengthen the patient's energy first, because sometimes homeopathic remedies don't work if your body doesn't have enough energy to mount a sufficient response to the remedy. he gave us two herb formulas - one to help her body release excessive heat and the other for frailty and weak digestion.

but, the really awesome part of the exam was the accupucture. he did it with a laser since dd is only 2 years old. he also used a scratching type tool to stimulate the energy channels in her legs and arms, right near where the worse eczema is. dd loved it, she got totally quiet and let him do it without any objection. this is very startling because she is usually super phobic of strangers and especially men. afterward on the car ride home she told me she wanted to see that doctor again, so he could do the scratching thing. she really enjoyed it!

it's been 2 days since the visit and her eczema is very noticeably reduced, plus i haven't seen those shiners that i used to see with almost every meal! we've been eating everything again with no reactions. this doctor believes we should strengthen her gut and just eat healthy. he does NT himself so that was great to hear. he did say to avoid wheat (but not gluten) because it's not healthy in general. he says that eczema is very easy to treat.

it really has been like a miracle for my family and i highly recommend anyone here who has access to see an accupuncturist. maybe you can avoid the frustration and trial that we went through with our elimination diet. i wish i had known sooner that this would have worked for us so quickly.

That is wonderful news! Thank you so much for sharing that!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *chasmyn* 
That is wonderful news! Thank you so much for sharing that!









That is great news motocita and something I will definitely keep in mind!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I think we are finally really getting somewhere with dd.

The die off crazy behavior has abated. And she just seems more centered and settled than ever before. She has also gained 4 lbs since early July! She has always been very thin and she is very thin no longer. She is pretty proportional now (actually a higher percentage for weight than height for the first time ever.) Her belly is begining to stick out some which has me a bit concerned. It isn't really fat, just round. I'm not sure if this is normal or not since her belly has always been really flat. She is getting to be quite solid. No real rolls of fat but then at her age there shouldn't be, but just solid body mass. I can tell she is so much healthier than she ever was before.

Me, I'm in die off I think. I feel vaguely like I have the flu (body aches). I'm trying some liver support to help me with this and plenty of epsom salts baths.

The big changes for me and dd is that we started kombucha and lots of it (4-6 oz a day for her) and more probiotics in general. Reuteri 2x a day. Colostrum for both of us but I think that one is helping her more than me.

I've got my first batch of homemade kombucha going now. Hopefully it will work and I'll have some in another week or so.

The bad news for me is I tried taking a probiotic with rice starch in it and it gave me a stomach ache.







I was really hoping to be able to try rice soon. I miss getting to take comunion and if I could do rice I was going to put rice crackers into the comunion plates so that I could eat those. Plus it would be nice for our budget to be able to eat some cheap filler foods.

The other big news in my life is that I have set up a child care exchange with a neighbor that gives me one morning a week off and probably hired a college student for another morning. (Still need to have her and dd meet). Just knowing that I'll be getting some help takes such a load off my shoulders.

Oh and I have been getting acupuncture. Well my acupuncturist is pg and due soon and had the guy who will be replacing her while she is on materinity leave in meeting her patients the other day. He apparently knows quite a bit about candida (my acupuncturist specalizes in fertility) and did a special needling to address that. I feel noticably different ever since. My digestion is better, I have more energy. I noticed a lot of positive changes in my cycle from the work that she has been doing on me but never an immediate change like I felt this time. I'm excited to see how he can help me.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *motocita* 
i took dd to see a traditional chinese medicine doctor and he explained to us that he likes to strengthen the patient's energy first, because sometimes homeopathic remedies don't work if your body doesn't have enough energy to mount a sufficient response to the remedy. he gave us two herb formulas - one to help her body release excessive heat and the other for frailty and weak digestion.

but, the really awesome part of the exam was the accupucture. he did it with a laser since dd is only 2 years old. he also used a scratching type tool to stimulate the energy channels in her legs and arms, right near where the worse eczema is. dd loved it, she got totally quiet and let him do it without any objection. this is very startling because she is usually super phobic of strangers and especially men. afterward on the car ride home she told me she wanted to see that doctor again, so he could do the scratching thing. she really enjoyed it!

it's been 2 days since the visit and her eczema is very noticeably reduced, plus i haven't seen those shiners that i used to see with almost every meal! we've been eating everything again with no reactions. this doctor believes we should strengthen her gut and just eat healthy. he does NT himself so that was great to hear. he did say to avoid wheat (but not gluten) because it's not healthy in general. he says that eczema is very easy to treat.

it really has been like a miracle for my family and i highly recommend anyone here who has access to see an accupuncturist. maybe you can avoid the frustration and trial that we went through with our elimination diet. i wish i had known sooner that this would have worked for us so quickly.

How did you find an acupuncturist to treat your dd? Mine just treats adults. Hmmm... Actually after my experience last week dh was wondering when we could take dd in. I pointed out that she wouldn't put up with the needles. I do know of another tcm acupuncturist. I'll have to look into that.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

motocita-glad to hear you are having success with the accupuncture!!

Pattyla- happy to hear success for you and dd too! I can't remember how long you have been doing this diet...I'm envious that you are making your own kombucha! After only a few bottles I am hooked. Keep up the good work!

bluets-You are right, I ate something I wasn't ready for and I am paying the price. I think it was the nuts.

I was reading on pecanbread that it is common to have a flair up in symptoms again after 3-4 months on the diet. (I have been on SCD for almost 4 months) The weeker pathogens die first and the hardier ones are left to cause troubles that surface arounde this point. I am going to do the intro diet again for a few days, basically restarting the diet. Pecanbread suggests juicing 2 carrots + 1 clove garlic and taking with food 1-2X per day to help kill off the yeast and bacteria. Is there any way to juice a carrot without a juicer?


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## motocita (Oct 31, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
How did you find an acupuncturist to treat your dd? Mine just treats adults. Hmmm... Actually after my experience last week dh was wondering when we could take dd in. I pointed out that she wouldn't put up with the needles. I do know of another tcm acupuncturist. I'll have to look into that.

this acupuncturist is actually a pediatrician. he told me that about 50% of the kids are OK with needles and the rest aren't. we're going to try a needle or two next week. i've had acupuncture myself - about 5 years ago when i had terrible stomach cramps with almost every meal. i seriously thought i was going to die a couple of times. my mom had a lump in her breast that was malignant and a different acupuncturist had gotten rid of it for her and it was such an unbelievable thing that i took a chance and went in for my stomach thing. it took about 4 months of acupuncture (about once every 4-6 weeks) and totally disgusting herbs everyday, but i came out of it with the strongest stomach i've ever had! plus a bunch of other benefits. i thought acupuncture was only for adults too.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

I've been getting more heat from DH to let ds stop SCD. He lets ds have non-scd stuff when they go out together, it turns out, so now ds only wants dh along. DH says that ds hates me for the diet, and that he and ds are sneaking around me because of it. And that my fighting with ds about the diet isn't healthy, after all he could be hit by bus tomorrow. Sigh. Patty, how do you get your dh to support you?

Nolansmom, what type of performance did you do? So cool, congrats!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
I've been getting more heat from DH to let ds stop SCD. He lets ds have non-scd stuff when they go out together, it turns out, so now ds only wants dh along. DH says that ds hates me for the diet, and that he and ds are sneaking around me because of it. And that my fighting with ds about the diet isn't healthy, after all he could be hit by bus tomorrow. Sigh. Patty, how do you get your dh to support you?

Nolansmom, what type of performance did you do? So cool, congrats!

Dh knows that dd needs help. He doesn't have the time and energy to figure out how to help her so he goes along with what I have figured out.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 

Pattyla- happy to hear success for you and dd too! I can't remember how long you have been doing this diet...I'm envious that you are making your own kombucha! After only a few bottles I am hooked. Keep up the good work!


We've been doing scd for 7.5 months. We have been fruit and honey free for over 2.5 months and dairy free for just about 7 weeks (except that we just cut out butter today to see if that makes a difference).


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## flowmom (Feb 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ksenia* 
I could really use some advice for a local AP mama who is shell-shocked because her husband had a sudden onset of Crohn's Disease a couple of months ago and is now disabled by severe joint pain (so bad he has to crawl to the bathroom).

Any good links on Crohn's & gut healing?
She wants to try SCD (friends got her the book) but she is a vegetarian so she is really struggling with how to plan meals and cook for her dh - any good sites with support or strategies for transitioning onto the diet?

Anyone??


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

HI everyone, I hope you don't mind if I jump in and ask a question.







I am making my first yogurt (finally! it's about time) and I was just talking to my mom about it and we were talking about intestinal health and stuff and I said that the homemade yogurt is the best probiotics you can get. Forget about spending money for store bought probiotics - right? I hope I am right. And she asked me this: "And how about the stomach acids? Are the bacteria going to survive it and go past the stomach into intestines?" and I did not know the answer. All I could say was that it has worked for many people and IS working so obviously it does survive.

Can someone enlighten me on this one please? THANK YOU!









Also, how about SCD for people allergic to nuts? What options are there for them? My mom has very very bad gut, sometimes she gets BM only once a week. She has very extreme ecsema spreading EVERYWHERE, and I am just so worried about her. She is in very poor health. She has way too many issues. She is coming to visit in 10 days from Europe and I'd like to know as much as I can about SCD so I can talk to her in details about it. She does not wanna give up grains, she loves them and eats them all the time. At least she used to....now she is at the poin where almost anything she eats gives her allergic reaction.


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## chasmyn (Feb 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ksenia* 
Anyone??









I didn't want you to think you're being ignored. I personally have no advice, as I eat meat. I know that www.pecanbread.com has a lot of recipes and links. Maybe it would be a start?

I Googled 'vegetarian SCD' and found this:

http://www.scdrecipe.com/j_vegetarian.html

and this:

http://www.healthfullivingsf.com/recipes/recipes/

HTH


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ksenia* 
Anyone??









I think that www.healingcrow.com has a lot of info about various approaches to gut healing.

There is lots of good info mixed up in here but I"m not sure how to pick it out for you. Most of us have read a range of books and take some info and leave other info. There are Jordan Rubin's books. I think they have a lot of good info, they just read like an infomercial for his products.

I would start with the healing crow page I think.

Also www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

Good luck!


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Pavlina,







to your mom. SCD can be done without nuts, although it's kind of boring -- basically meats, veggies, eggs, fruit and dairy. You just have to get really creative with the stir frys, and other combos. You can make crackers out of cheese by baking or frying slices of it. Slices of butternut squash can also be baked at a low temp to make cracker-like things.

Ksenia, SCD is supposed to help Crohns's disease, although I'm not sure of the specifics with joint pain. See: http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.i...ns_disease.htm
http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.i...estimonies.htm
http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.i...elebration.htm


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## flowmom (Feb 3, 2004)

Thanks chasmyn, pattyla, and Pookietooth!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
I've been getting more heat from DH to let ds stop SCD. He lets ds have non-scd stuff when they go out together, it turns out, so now ds only wants dh along. DH says that ds hates me for the diet, and that he and ds are sneaking around me because of it. And that my fighting with ds about the diet isn't healthy, after all he could be hit by bus tomorrow. Sigh. Patty, how do you get your dh to support you?

Nolansmom, what type of performance did you do? So cool, congrats!

Tough situation







Has your DH read any literature on the subject? He is not playing fair with food issue. Is there any way he would agree to it for a certain time period 100% to see if it helps and then make a decision from there?

I played string quartet music for cocktail hour before a dinner party.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yin Yang* 
HI everyone, I hope you don't mind if I jump in and ask a question.







I am making my first yogurt (finally! it's about time) and I was just talking to my mom about it and we were talking about intestinal health and stuff and I said that the homemade yogurt is the best probiotics you can get. Forget about spending money for store bought probiotics - right? I hope I am right. And she asked me this: "And how about the stomach acids? Are the bacteria going to survive it and go past the stomach into intestines?" and I did not know the answer. All I could say was that it has worked for many people and IS working so obviously it does survive.

Can someone enlighten me on this one please? THANK YOU!









Also, how about SCD for people allergic to nuts? What options are there for them? My mom has very very bad gut, sometimes she gets BM only once a week. She has very extreme ecsema spreading EVERYWHERE, and I am just so worried about her. She is in very poor health. She has way too many issues. She is coming to visit in 10 days from Europe and I'd like to know as much as I can about SCD so I can talk to her in details about it. She does not wanna give up grains, she loves them and eats them all the time. At least she used to....now she is at the poin where almost anything she eats gives her allergic reaction.










You can read up on probiotics and yogurt at the power of probiotics thread:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...ad.php?t=96009

Sorry that your Mom is feeling so crummy. I don't think that SCD would be that bad with out nuts. Many of us here have to cut out food groups in the diet be it fruit, dairy, or eggs and in the end I think it is worth it to heal. Hopefully you can convince her that the diet will help her.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
I've been getting more heat from DH to let ds stop SCD. He lets ds have non-scd stuff when they go out together, it turns out, so now ds only wants dh along. DH says that ds hates me for the diet, and that he and ds are sneaking around me because of it. And that my fighting with ds about the diet isn't healthy, after all he could be hit by bus tomorrow. Sigh. Patty, how do you get your dh to support you?

Nolansmom, what type of performance did you do? So cool, congrats!

pookietooth - who does the cooking in your house? and do you have family meals? if so, that would be one argument for the whole family to go SCD. if i had to do SCD, we all would be eating that way because i don't have time to cook 2 meals. when ds and i went dairy-free, i made dh go dairy-free too - it isn't fair to ds for dh to be eating cheese in front of him. dh can eat all the cheese he wants on his own, but he better not eat it in front of ds and i.

my dh supports me in our food decisions because (a) i've been reading more about this than he has; (b) i can cook way better than he can; (c) i convinced him that it is good for him; (d) he knows that this is the right way to go.

dh isn't too much into Christianity these days but our marriage verse was Ephesians 5, with the interesting interpretation that the husband would make appropriate decisions to make the wife happy.

one could say that i wear the pants in this household. however, i firmly believe that if an issue is very important to you, you've got to stand your ground and define the boundaries.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

FF-did you determine if the yogurt starter grom GI pro health is truly dairy free? I should have done this earlier







but I am now cutting out the trace amounts of dairy in our diets.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Boy this thread is quiet lately!

ff--do you think it is possible to use too many different types of herbs (teas, infusions, tinctures, etc) at once? I keep finding all these different herbs that are supposed to do different things and I want to use them all!...but I'm wondering if maybe it would best just to do a few at a time.

Any more suggestions for a dry cough? My stupid cold still won't go away and I have been coughing all night, in spite of trying absolutely everything I can think of, including vitamin C, various teas, homeopathic cough syrup, OTC cough suppressant...tonight I'm trying cough drops, maybe those will actually help.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

caedmyn, what helps me when I have a cough is drinking lots of water, ginger tea (made by simmering slices of ginger in water for about 20 minutes), garlic, breathing steam, and time. There is a homeopathic single remedy for a constant dry cough, but I can't recall which one. You can go to www.abchomeopathy.com and enter your symptoms, and it will help you find a good one. Single remedies work better than combination, because they are targeted at your specific issue. You just have to find the right one, which can be tough.

My DH won't read on the subject, and is very sceptical in general. He says that any diet that requires 100% compliance is doomed to fail. Well, it was fine until he started letting ds have stuff. We have been on it for a year now, by the way. I actually think part of the problem is that I have lost confidence myself in the diet, and it's showing. I actually have bought and prepared grains a few times in the past couple of months, although ds has mostly stayed away. It's the sugar he can't resist.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

DD's yeast rash on her butt has come back







Could there be enough sugar in the butternut squash I've been eating almost every day for the last week? I've fed it to her several times, too, although she doesn't eat much of it. Or could wheat or soy cause the rash? I had almost a whole package of crackers a few nights ago when I was trying to stop coughing. Although she's never reacted to wheat or soy before as far as I could tell.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

caedmyn, I don't know what could've caused the rash but I DO know that wheat is the devil in disguise to my dd. It causes all kinds of problems.

I thought the tiny bit I consumed a few weeks back didn't affect her (and it probably wouldn't have if I didn't continue to eat canned nuts.) Now I'm convinced that she can't even handle trace amounts through my b'milk.









DD1 has issues w/soy - - come to think of it, I think it caused her yeast to flare.

Interestingly, dd1's yeast issues came around the time she was taking swimming lessons. Then I figured out that the chlorine was not helping her at all and actually pulled dd2 from lessons when I learned that was setting her back.

Anyway, dd1 is now doing some *refresher* lessons this week and while I'm pumping the probiotics into her I did notice that her little vulva is slightly red (just where the yeast rash used to flare before.)

I know that didn't answer your question and I went off on a tangent there .. .


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
caedmyn, what helps me when I have a cough is drinking lots of water, ginger tea (made by simmering slices of ginger in water for about 20 minutes), garlic, breathing steam, and time. There is a homeopathic single remedy for a constant dry cough, but I can't recall which one. You can go to www.abchomeopathy.com and enter your symptoms, and it will help you find a good one. Single remedies work better than combination, because they are targeted at your specific issue. You just have to find the right one, which can be tough.

My DH won't read on the subject, and is very sceptical in general. He says that any diet that requires 100% compliance is doomed to fail. Well, it was fine until he started letting ds have stuff. We have been on it for a year now, by the way. I actually think part of the problem is that I have lost confidence myself in the diet, and it's showing. I actually have bought and prepared grains a few times in the past couple of months, although ds has mostly stayed away. It's the sugar he can't resist.


Sounds like you are ready to transition into some more foods off the diet? Maybe if you could prepare treats that have honey and nut flours it would give your DS something to look foreward to? Does he tolerate honey?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Well I'm off to try to get a script for diflucan. I'm at my wits end here and I figure most Dan Dr's will want to start with that anyhow so why not do it with someone cheaper.

Wish me luck.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Good luck, Pattyla! Are you still seeing results from the kombucha?

Pookietooth--can you convince your DH to at least give your DS healthy foods, maybe advanced SCD food, when he "cheats"?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I got it!

I'm to wait and make sure I'm not pg before starting it. Probably I'm not but better safe than sorry. I hope insurance kicks in and covers some of it.

She did a pap and checked it out under the microscope. She said it had lots of yeast in it. I don't even feel particularly yeasty right now.

We are still doing the kombucha. DD is doing better, well she was untill two days ago. Not sure if this is more die off after a short break or something else.







:

We're off to my IL"s for the weekend. I hate taking the "show on the road" but we havn't visited in nearly a year and we won't be going back for the holidays so this is it. I've got meals planned for the whole time we are there, just a few more things to bake and we are set.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Patty-good luck at the IL's. Will be interested in how you do with the diflucan.


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## Gale Force (Jun 15, 2003)




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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I need opinions!

I found an alternative doctor in my town. I emailed him with information about our problems with dairy/soy sensitivity, eczema and yeast overgrowth. His response was that homeopathy has an 80% chance of clearing up the eczema "whether or not it is yeast or allergy induced." He also said, "Our goal in treating is to cure the problem," and noted that the elimination diet eliminates symptoms, but does not cure.

Sooooo, I'm not sure how I feel about this. I have misgivings about homeopahty in general (did you see my thread about alternative medicine? lol), because it seems like allopathy in some ways--cure symptoms, but not necessarily get to the root of the problem. SCD says the gut CAN be cured, and then, when it is, symptoms resolve. I don't know, his response and perhaps approach (at least from his brief email) don't seem to address the gut's importance.

What would you all do? I have a VERY small pool of alternative doctors from which to choose. I really wanted someone who would be willing to do an allergy blood test, but I have a feeling this doctor wouldn't think that was useful.

AHHHH!

What would you all do? Should I make the appt anyway?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I need opinions!

I found an alternative doctor in my town. I emailed him with information about our problems with dairy/soy sensitivity, eczema and yeast overgrowth. His response was that homeopathy has an 80% chance of clearing up the eczema "whether or not it is yeast or allergy induced." He also said, "Our goal in treating is to cure the problem," and noted that the elimination diet eliminates symptoms, but does not cure.

Sooooo, I'm not sure how I feel about this. I have misgivings about homeopahty in general (did you see my thread about alternative medicine? lol), because it seems like allopathy in some ways--cure symptoms, but not necessarily get to the root of the problem. SCD says the gut CAN be cured, and then, when it is, symptoms resolve. I don't know, his response and perhaps approach (at least from his brief email) don't seem to address the gut's importance.

What would you all do? I have a VERY small pool of alternative doctors from which to choose. I really wanted someone who would be willing to do an allergy blood test, but I have a feeling this doctor wouldn't think that was useful.

AHHHH!

What would you all do? Should I make the appt anyway?

I'd go ahead and make it anyway. I've come to find that I use lots of different resources and take from them what I can use and leave the rest yk? For instance, I used a mainstream allergist to RAST test dd. Never went back and probably won't. I used a chiro who did muscle testing and won't go that route again either. I'm currently using a homeopath and a craniosacral therapist for dd. I'd love to find another homeopathic doctor b/c this one does not know anything about chelation but she HAS helped dd in many other ways. IMO, homeopathic medicine is the way to go.







I will also continue our craniosacral therapy.

Go and see what you think. You'll find other resources as you go along. I wouldn't care one way or another whether they understand gut healing or not. Most don't but they can still be useful to you.


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## sphinxie (Feb 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I need opinions!

I found an alternative doctor in my town. I emailed him with information about our problems with dairy/soy sensitivity, eczema and yeast overgrowth. His response was that homeopathy has an 80% chance of clearing up the eczema "whether or not it is yeast or allergy induced." He also said, "Our goal in treating is to cure the problem," and noted that the elimination diet eliminates symptoms, but does not cure.

Sooooo, I'm not sure how I feel about this. I have misgivings about homeopahty in general (did you see my thread about alternative medicine? lol), because it seems like allopathy in some ways--cure symptoms, but not necessarily get to the root of the problem. SCD says the gut CAN be cured, and then, when it is, symptoms resolve. I don't know, his response and perhaps approach (at least from his brief email) don't seem to address the gut's importance.

What would you all do? I have a VERY small pool of alternative doctors from which to choose. I really wanted someone who would be willing to do an allergy blood test, but I have a feeling this doctor wouldn't think that was useful.

AHHHH!

What would you all do? Should I make the appt anyway?

My understanding is that SCD doesn't cure the gut, it creates a situation in which the gut can heal and cure itself.

My very vague understanding--and I'm _sure_ there are lots of people on mdc who know lots about Chinese medicine so you could post a thread just about that--is that he will mainly balance your humors. He will also give you perscriptions that will help your gut to heal more effectively. So that's speaking through my hat a little, but nonetheless I think that SCD and Chinese medicine could be very complimentary. The only thing is that he may prescribe some illegals but could probably change the prescription if you mention that.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I'm a little blown away. I have never heard anyone call homeopathy close to allopathic medicine. Maybe you're understanding of it isn't quite clear?


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I'm a little blown away. I have never heard anyone call homeopathy close to allopathic medicine. Maybe you're understanding of it isn't quite clear?

That's quite possible. But in all I've read about it, I've seen a strong focus on curing symptoms (despite the talk of treating the "whole person"). And then, when this doctor said that he "cures" eczema (80% of the time), regardless of whether or not allergies or yeast are the culprit, it added to my concern.

I do think I'll visit him, because it can't hurt. And maybe I'll be surprised at the visit, especially if he addresses the root causes of her yeast and eczema. I just wish I could find a doctor (any doctor) who would recognize the reality of a damaged gut


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
That's quite possible. But in all I've read about it, I've seen a strong focus on curing symptoms (despite the talk of treating the "whole person"). And then, when this doctor said that he "cures" eczema (80% of the time), regardless of whether or not allergies or yeast are the culprit, it added to my concern.

I do think I'll visit him, because it can't hurt. And maybe I'll be surprised at the visit, especially if he addresses the root causes of her yeast and eczema. I just wish I could find a doctor (any doctor) who would recognize the reality of a damaged gut









The choice of remedy is based on the symptom yes, and it's very detailed, but it's not directly curing the symptom. It's an aid to help choos the correct remedy. That's probably what you are talking about. Homeopathy is as far is it could possible go from allopathic medicine. I can tell you've never been to a homeopath because if you were you would never said it's not treating the whole person.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yin Yang* 
The choice of remedy is based on the symptom yes, and it's very detailed, but it's not directly curing the symptom. It's an aid to help choos the correct remedy. That's probably what you are talking about. Homeopathy is as far is it could possible go from allopathic medicine. I can tell you've never been to a homeopath because if you were you would never said it's not treating the whole person.









No, you're right, I've never been. But what you said about the remedy and symptoms *has* been my impression of homeopathy. Anyway, I'm not trying to criticize the practice. I promise! I know that many people have had success with it, and I'm definitely willing to try it. I'm crossing my fingers that it will be useful for us


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
No, you're right, I've never been. But what you said about the remedy and symptoms *has* been my impression of homeopathy. Anyway, I'm not trying to criticize the practice. I promise! I know that many people have had success with it, and I'm definitely willing to try it. I'm crossing my fingers that it will be useful for us









I know you are not criticizing it, that's why I am just trying to explain it a little. When you think about it - you really need something to hold on to when trying to figure out the person you are going to treat - and that something is symptoms. You can't just look at person and tell them what remedy they need. KWIM? It's based on symptoms. But that does not mean you don't treat the whole person. Alopathic medicine supresses the symptoms - it targets the symptoms alone, not the person as a whole. Homeopathy only uses the symptoms to "get to know" the person. Then once you take the remedy, it "teaches" your body how to heal itself.
To find out more about it read this wonderful thread: homeopathy thread


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Wanted to add that with classical homeopathy, the goal is to figure out a person's constitution, and strengthen it. There are several approaches with homeopathy, including one that involves using several remedies one after the other. Classical homeopathy is using a person's behavior, appearance, and physical complaints to figure out what remedy matches their constitution. Yeast and gut damage are symptoms of something as well, depending on who you talk to -- mercury poisoning, parasites, malnutrition, etc. However, I have to admit that for us, homeopathy has been pretty hit or miss, with more misses than hits. It takes a real expert and they really need to do an intensive interview with you to figure out what your constitution is, otherwise, the remedy will do nothing.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

ITA, I'm very blessed to have a fabulous homeopath. We have had just about NO misses with him. Once we had to try two remedies because he was on the fence about which was the right one. The second one was the one.

As Pookietooth said, it's about identifying the person's constitution. It also isn't as much about the symptoms as it is about how you REACT to the symptoms. Seven people could have a cold and all experience it differently. Those seven people will likely have seven different remedies. Once you get your body into balance, it heals itself. It doesn't matter what the cause of the damage is, what matters is the body's ability to shift energetically and eliminate or heal the damage. I hope you have a good experience! My friend always says the way to convert anyone into a true believer is arnica-a remedy that is most often used acutely. It works so fast for everyone that it's hard to deny the efficacy of homeopathy!

I have to say that your homeopath explained it very well, so hopefully we have been able to shed some light on his explanation for you.


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## mamajaillet (Jul 24, 2006)

Chinese Pistache, I think we talked a little through pms, and I mentioned that we were using homeopathic rememdies, but never elaborated about our experience. I guess I can't say whether it is working or not yet, since we are doing unda numbers which are used similarly to antibiotics, in a series for three weeks straight. By themselves, they are remedies for things such as overindulgence in foods, colic, stomach discomfort, being high strung...in effect my dd's symptoms from the allergires. Yet, her "diagnosis" was a bad gut, and so we are doing probiotics and anti-inflammatory diet, plus not eating offending foods (aahh, which we are still trying to figure out). Anyways, I think the homeopathic part of the treatment is to try to stimulate her healing response, as others have mentioned, not to get rid of the symptoms.

As someone esle mentioned to, this guy can be a part of your healing puzzle. He doesn't have to get it all about your babe to offer something that will help. Ours gave us a probiotic with lactose, and said that she didn't worry about that...but I just feel like we need to use a completely dairy free one so we do. I ultimately learn from all the sources I can, and then follow my mama instinct about what to apply to heal us...I hope that it works!!


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## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Any more suggestions for a dry cough? My stupid cold still won't go away and I have been coughing all night, in spite of trying absolutely everything I can think of, including vitamin C, various teas, homeopathic cough syrup, OTC cough suppressant...tonight I'm trying cough drops, maybe those will actually help.

Do you have your tonsils and adenoids? When I was a wee lass (about 4 or so), I had a persistant cough that would not go away. All the other cold symptoms went away except the cough. I went through all the allergy testing popular in the late '70's: back scratching and 14 shots in each arm with common allergens. Nothing but a slight, slight reaction to ragweed (must be why I don't like chamomile tea







).

It ended up being my adenoids. They were bigger than my tonsils, so I had surgery to remove them both. I had such a traumatic experience with trusting ANY of the medical staff after the allergy tests! I remember crying and not allowing them to examine me, I also remember being told I could not leave the hospital unless I had a milkshake or ice chips. I wouldn't take anything from them initially because I thought they were trying to poison me! I settled for ice chips.

Anyway, I digress, but having those pesky adenoids removed got rid of the cough and the recurrent ear infections. Not that I am an advocate for surgery, I am not, but if you've got the *parts*, maybe it's a direction to look into.


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## nicholas_mom (Apr 23, 2004)

Since doing gluten-free with my DS with excema (5 weeks) and some homeopathic remedies, his excema really looks good. I recently got my free Houston enzymes in the mail and I am excited about using it. I have been giving it to him for 2 days, but so far no problems.

I hope we are on the right track.









I highly recommend homeopathy, too. I have been using it for over 10 years for different things and see more benefits than any allopathic doctor I've seen.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

I have some old yogurt in my refrigerator (3+ weeks old). Can I still use the whey from it or will that be rotten too?

Anybody know?


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicholas_mom* 
I recently got my free Houston enzymes in the mail and I am excited about using it.

What's the trick to getting free Houston's enzymes in the mail?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

If my DD has mucous in her poop after eating something, what does that mean? She's only getting avocado, squash, CLO, and CO right now. She did eat quite a bit of avocado yesterday, though, maybe twice as much as she usually eats (she was visiting grandma).


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It means that her body is having an inflammatory response to something. It *could* also be that she has a cold and is swallowing mucus.


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## mama-a-llama (Feb 8, 2006)

Would I be better off doing some kind of elim diet first, before starting SCD? I mean, it seems like it would be dumb to start eating lots of nuts and eggs if those happen to be what ds is reacting to. But I have to admit, even THINKING about that makes me feel like I'm gonna die. I already have food restrictions (can only eat fairly minimal carbs) so the idea of giving up dairy and eggs and nuts all at once is pretty awful. Meat and veggies, that would be about it. And doing this on top of pumping and low supply, ugh. I guess I have to get a script so I can supplement with Neocate?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Argh! So what the heck am I supposed to feed her if she's reacting to avocado or CO?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Argh! So what the heck am I supposed to feed her if she's reacting to avocado or CO?

We are dealing with multiple food intolerances too. Maybe it was just too much avocado at once? Maybe some pureed lamb or turkey?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I am readin g 'Enzymes for Autism' right now and I wish I would have read this book earlier! So much of the information is hitting home.

I have a couple of questions...

I re started SCD from the beginning and I have upped my enzyme intake, I do with all meals and Candex inbetween meals. I have also been taking a lot of raw garlic. But I want to add an anti fungal when I take the Candex. Can I use Olive Leaf Extract while breastfeeding? All the labels say check with your practitioner. Also, what do I look for in a good brand of OLE? I found this on ethat seems good to me (has the least amount of other active ingredients)
http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/e...jsp?id=CF-1684

How much would I take?

I have gotten my ADD DH to take enzymes now! He will never agree to a strict diet. I can feed him well while he is at home but there is only so much I can do. Hoping to see changes...


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Nolansmom, the only antifungal that I know of that's safe while bfing is garlic, but that doesn't mean it's the only one.

Carly, if your ds is 11 months, isn't he eating enough solids that you don't need to supplement with formula? I see in your sig he's not nursing -- does he drink from a cup? If so, could he drink a homemade breastmilk substitute? Neocate has corn syrup in it doesnt it? An elimination diet can be helpful for some allergic reactions. As far as low carb SCD, here is what the official site says: http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.i...ydrate_scd.htm

Annikate, I think you could use the whey, but the probiotics are probably pretty depleted. If the yogurt smells OK, you could use the yogurt in baking, since the probiotics are mostly gone.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mama-a-llama* 
Would I be better off doing some kind of elim diet first, before starting SCD? I mean, it seems like it would be dumb to start eating lots of nuts and eggs if those happen to be what ds is reacting to. But I have to admit, even THINKING about that makes me feel like I'm gonna die. I already have food restrictions (can only eat fairly minimal carbs) so the idea of giving up dairy and eggs and nuts all at once is pretty awful. Meat and veggies, that would be about it. And doing this on top of pumping and low supply, ugh. I guess I have to get a script so I can supplement with Neocate?

IMO & experience, elimination diets just don't work. I wouldn't recommend it.

I don't remember your story (there are so many mamas here!) Why can't you do eggs or nuts or dairy?

There are other mamas here who can talk about doing SCD dairy and egg free and even mamas who do it w/out nuts too.

The beginning of this diet is difficult, but is worth it. It has helped my b'feeding dd immensely.


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## mama-a-llama (Feb 8, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
Carly, if your ds is 11 months, isn't he eating enough solids that you don't need to supplement with formula? I see in your sig he's not nursing -- does he drink from a cup? If so, could he drink a homemade breastmilk substitute? Neocate has corn syrup in it doesnt it? An elimination diet can be helpful for some allergic reactions.

He unfortunately is currently 100% tube fed (and 100% breastmilk fed, supplementing with donor milk). I haven't yet introduced solids, although I was considering starting to puree them in with the milk. I want to do a homemade formula, but didn't want to start him on a dairy based one if he were allergic to it. And I wasn't sure how complete a bm substitute I could make if I were trying to elim dairy.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
IMO & experience, elimination diets just don't work. I wouldn't recommend it.

I don't remember your story (there are so many mamas here!) Why can't you do eggs or nuts or dairy?

Ds has eczema and a nasty red ring on his bottom. I didn't want to start SCD and be eating more nuts and eggs if that was what he was allergic to. I was thinking about eliminating the big 8. My sister was allergic to eggs as a kid, I was allergic to dairy (and wheat). There may be allergy testing in our future. The feeding clinic drs want his ped to order a CBC with differential IgE, apparently to see if he might be having food allergies that contribute to his total lack of eating by mouth.

Quote:

The beginning of this diet is difficult, but is worth it. It has helped my b'feeding dd immensely.
Does BTVC talk anywhere about how to add foods back after the intro diet? Maybe I'm just missing it. I know Pecanbread has stages, but didn't see it in the book.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

No-Elaine just sort of leaves it up to you! IT's been a frustration for many a mama.

Isn't Enzymes for Autism WONDERFUL? I can't recommend it enough. It's my favorite book to refer people to for gut stuff. The title can throw people off, but it's just so clear.

We found the SCD to be immensely helpful. We did it egg and dairy free, then put eggs back after a period of time. IT was definitely do-able.

Elimination diets are really not that beneficial. IF you take out the foods that you (or your dc) are reacting to and replace them with something else you will ultimately end up with a new allergy. It is very important to heal your gut. You can take out those foods if you choose, just don't do it without taking large steps to close up those leaks.

So I'm working on a new therapy. I will keep you all posted. I'm making my own homeopathic remedy for the allergies. I will consider it a success if we can reintroduce the big foods with no reaction. If that happens I will post the results and maybe we will have a new tool in the arsenal!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
So I'm working on a new therapy. I will keep you all posted. I'm making my own homeopathic remedy for the allergies. I will consider it a success if we can reintroduce the big foods with no reaction. If that happens I will post the results and maybe we will have a new tool in the arsenal!

Awesome! I wanna learn how to do that! Please post your progress - I'm very interested. Good luck!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
So I'm working on a new therapy. I will keep you all posted. I'm making my own homeopathic remedy for the allergies. I will consider it a success if we can reintroduce the big foods with no reaction. If that happens I will post the results and maybe we will have a new tool in the arsenal!

sounds interesting, hope it works! Are you talking about the dairy allergy, soy or all of them?

Do you know about Olive Leaf Extract, if it is saf ewhile BF?


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## mamajaillet (Jul 24, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 

Elimination diets are really not that beneficial. IF you take out the foods that you (or your dc) are reacting to and replace them with something else you will ultimately end up with a new allergy. It is very important to heal your gut. You can take out those foods if you choose, just don't do it without taking large steps to close up those leaks.!

I have been worried about this, especially after I realized that we could handle rye but not spelt on this elim diet. I just started buying this sourdough rye that is made where we live during this diet, but used spelt as my main baking grain all through this pregnancy. I am so afraid to go ahead and think rye is ok, and eat it regularly, because won't we just end up reacting to that. And rice so often...seems like that could lead to a reaction.

On the other hand, it did seem like we needed to find our triggers before we start SCD, and we are doing enzymes, reuteri, kefir, and I need to find a another baby dairy free probiotic for dd, and one with other buggies for me. I hope this starts the healing so that we don't start reacting to the things we are eating now.

Speaking of the reuteri, from the limited time I have to get on and do my research, I understand that we get this strain from breastfeeding. So...I am wondering if I was never breastfed, does that mean I don't have it in my gut, and therefore my kiddos don't either?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Sorry-no it's not safe for breastfeeding.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I am getting some major die off







now that I am using the enzymes in a better way. I have a rash on my face so now I can share in DS's discomfort. Never thought i'd be happy about a rash, esp a yeast rash! I hope that we can beat it this go around. I am taking Candex in between meals with a clove of garlic and before bed and when I wake. I am breaking open all my capsules, I think my bloat a few weeks back was do to the veggie capsules not disintegrating and therfore the enzymes were really not helping me digest food at all. Wish I would have known this months ago...

mama-a-lama-If you are having a yeast problem SCD will help heal, plus enzymes and garlic. I am not doing eggs, dairy and very few nuts (for now). You need to make sure you eat tons of fats: CO, olive oil, walnut oil. It is well worth it to nip the problem in the bud and do everything that you can all at once. It is really not that bad, a little boring, but do-able. I look foreward to a future when DS has fewer food sensitivities because of my sacrifices now.

Thanks FF, I hope the garlic + Candex does the trick for us







:


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Awesome! I wanna learn how to do that! Please post your progress - I'm very interested. Good luck!









:

are you making thrm from the allergens themselves? like wheat and dairy?
i hope it works for you well!

there's a company that make homeopathic remedies for allergies and the remedies are made from the allergens themselves. http://bioallers.com/
I bought recently the wheat & grain allergy and it helped.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

No, not from the foods. I'll share more if I get close to healing! I have lots of links that I will post.

I have however, just made some from breastmilk. I figure that if I use my milk homeopathically it will create a shift for me and anyone in my house that's nursing.







It contains all the antigens and antibodies, so in theory their (and my) body should recongnize them as they are introduced homeopathically. We'll see. Im more hopeful about other remedies I'm using, but I don't wnat to get hopes up until there's progress.


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## nicholas_mom (Apr 23, 2004)

Quote:

What's the trick to getting free Houston's enzymes in the mail?
A mamma on another list said she got free enzymes by calling them up. I wrote an e-mail to Mr. Houston and told him that a mamma said that Houston does a free trial sample. I told him what our Doc was doing with my ds' diet and if he recommended any enzymes. Something to that effect. He sent them to us.

Another question......So, now that I upped the dose of enzymes, ds's excema popped up in a different area. Is this die-off because of the enzyme or should I stop the enzymes?


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

I wanted to ask you mamas about enzymes. I was gonna buy the Candex and then I found this product, which almost identical in the enzyme composition as the mentioned Candex but it's different brand. Can you tell me what you think about it? It's a great price! http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Candida-...nagement/cas-1

and this is Candex: http://www.vitacost.com/PureEssenceL...nagementSystem

there are really almost identical except the first one has 240 capsules.


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
No, not from the foods. I'll share more if I get close to healing! I have lots of links that I will post.

I have however, just made some from breastmilk. I figure that if I use my milk homeopathically it will create a shift for me and anyone in my house that's nursing.







It contains all the antigens and antibodies, so in theory their (and my) body should recongnize them as they are introduced homeopathically. We'll see. Im more hopeful about other remedies I'm using, but I don't wnat to get hopes up until there's progress.

That is an interesting idea!! Good luck! I was giving LAc Maternum (which is made from breast milk) to DS1 when I was trying to wean him, it really helped.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

question about pH testing...I got some pH strips and tested both saliva and urine today. The strips say optimal range is 7.0-7.5 My salivia test was 7.25. The urine test, however, was 6.0. What does that mean, and why would they be so different?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

They will almost always be different. What you want to pay attention to (for internal body chemistry) is the number on the urine strip. You mouth's pH level will change constantly based on what you have *just* eaten, it will more reflect the acid/alkaline ash that a food produces. The urine will show how your body is reacting to the food.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
They will almost always be different. What you want to pay attention to (for internal body chemistry) is the number on the urine strip. You mouth's pH level will change constantly based on what you have *just* eaten, it will more reflect the acid/alkaline ash that a food produces. The urine will show how your body is reacting to the food.

Hmmm...the acid/alkaline food theory doesn't seem to hold very true for me, then, considering I eat mostly "acid-forming" foods (lots of meat!).


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

This was my whole point. The way your body responds to the food is a product of your metabolic type. SO if I'm a carb type and you're a protein type and we both eat a bunch of meat it will acidify my system and neutralize or even alkalinize yours. It's very cool. Do you know what your metabolic type is? Once you do the testing becomes a very useful tool for figuring out macronutrient ratios. I am a protein type-when I eat a vegan diet that is completely plant based I actually get really acidic. In theory (superficially) that should alkalinize me, but it doesn't even come close. That's why I think the SCD worked so well for me. All the meat, eggs, and nuts actually alkalinized my system.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Sorry-so my point is that it doesn't acutally matter what the ash residue is, what matters is how *you* metabolize the food. The urine will be a better indicator.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I'm ordering DeFelice's book, "Enzyme for Autism." Would it be worthwhile or redundant to buy her "Enzymes for Digestive Health and Nutritional Well-being?"

Also, I've been contemplating taking dd to an allergist to get a blood test (not RAST) to determine what things she's reacting to. I wonder though if I'm wasting my time and money since *knowing* what we're allergic to won't really change the work we have to do to heal our guts. Any thoughts from anyone who's been there? Part of me wants to be able to monitor the lessening of her allergy/food sensitivity. The other part of me just doesn't want to deal with a mainstream doctor's approach to allergies.

Also, can someone explain to me about how milk (or whatever allergen) proteins pass through breastmilk. I've read that a mother who is digesting properly won't pass these proteins to her infant. Is that right? If so, there are A LOT of mothers out there with unwell guts. . .

How are you all taking garlic? Do you just swallow a chopped clove? And what time of day is best?

And I know this is technically an allergy question, but from a "healing the gut" pov, at what point does anaphylaxis become a possibility? Is it when a person has not been tolerating/digesting a particular food (say, peanuts) and their gut is a mess, and they *continue* to consume them? I ask because I'm trying to get my dd (14 mths) to take her enzymes, and I'm worried about putting it in peanut butter.

Finally, I ordered some chewable enzymes. Has anyone heard of them? I hope they aren't a waste of money. http://www.buyenzymes.com/t-nedigestchewables.aspx


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

FF, do you have a book recommendation or link that explains the alkaline/acidity idea? Thx


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Not really-this is just me taking snippets from various places, applying them and testing for results. It's not all that formal, but I am trying to figure it out. I think alot of what is out there doesn't account for different body chemistry.


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## gilamama (Aug 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Argh! So what the heck am I supposed to feed her if she's reacting to avocado or CO?


havent scrolled to read the rest of the responses, but my dd(almost 9 months) would have mucous in her make EBF when i would eat certain things and then when i started feeding her ricealos would have it and now, she is eating egg yoke (soft boiled) and banana and has had no mucous in her make, and her excema is clearing up and her skin is not all dry but rather soooooooooo soft like a babys should be. I highly recoment egg yoke and maybe some cods liver oil or fish oil supplement for your dd. it will help build up tissues, cellwalls etc.. my dd also eats veggies cooked in chicken soup (potato and sweet potato) and soes well with them.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Sorry-so my point is that it doesn't acutally matter what the ash residue is, what matters is how *you* metabolize the food. The urine will be a better indicator.

I understood what you were saying...just to be a wise guy (not to you personally, just in general) I had to point out that if the saliva pH supposedly reflects the acid/alkaline ash, it doesn't seem very accurate to me since I had eggs & meat for breakfast and tested in the alkaline range for saliva anyway. Does that make sense? Sorry, I just needed to get some sarcasm out there!


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
How are you all taking garlic? Do you just swallow a chopped clove? And what time of day is best?

And I know this is technically an allergy question, but from a "healing the gut" pov, at what point does anaphylaxis become a possibility? Is it when a person has not been tolerating/digesting a particular food (say, peanuts) and their gut is a mess, and they *continue* to consume them? I ask because I'm trying to get my dd (14 mths) to take her enzymes, and I'm worried about putting it in peanut butter.

I crush garlic because the chopped garlic showed up in my stool...so I figured I wasn't getting the full benefit of it







I take it with breakfast and lunch to try to give it a little bit of a chance to wear off before bedtime (poor DH!). Take it with meals, though (in the middle of a meal works best for me)--otherwise it will give you an upset stomach. I take a sip of warm tea and then pop some crushed garlic in and swallow it all.

I'm not sure anybody knows the answer to your anaphlaxis question...although I wish I knew, too. Have you tried giving your DD enzymes mixed with applesauce? I used to take them that way before I eliminated fruit from my diet.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I'm ordering DeFelice's book, "Enzyme for Autism." Would it be worthwhile or redundant to buy her "Enzymes for Digestive Health and Nutritional Well-being?"

Also, I've been contemplating taking dd to an allergist to get a blood test (not RAST) to determine what things she's reacting to. I wonder though if I'm wasting my time and money since *knowing* what we're allergic to won't really change the work we have to do to heal our guts. Any thoughts from anyone who's been there? Part of me wants to be able to monitor the lessening of her allergy/food sensitivity. The other part of me just doesn't want to deal with a mainstream doctor's approach to allergies.

Also, can someone explain to me about how milk (or whatever allergen) proteins pass through breastmilk. I've read that a mother who is digesting properly won't pass these proteins to her infant. Is that right? If so, there are A LOT of mothers out there with unwell guts. . .

How are you all taking garlic? Do you just swallow a chopped clove? And what time of day is best?

And I know this is technically an allergy question, but from a "healing the gut" pov, at what point does anaphylaxis become a possibility? Is it when a person has not been tolerating/digesting a particular food (say, peanuts) and their gut is a mess, and they *continue* to consume them? I ask because I'm trying to get my dd (14 mths) to take her enzymes, and I'm worried about putting it in peanut butter.

Finally, I ordered some chewable enzymes. Has anyone heard of them? I hope they aren't a waste of money. http://www.buyenzymes.com/t-nedigestchewables.aspx


It seems like we are at similar stages in our healing process. I *think* both of Defelices books have similar info. About the peanuts, I personally would not not give them a lot if your DD is allergic to other foods or is sensitive in general. DeFelice has a whole chapter on how to mix enzymes with food to get kids to take them easily. I have swallowed garlic whole but I find it is more effective crushed. Sometimes I add it to my food (soup is not so bad with tons of garlic.) I am experimenting with taking it between meals, it got us some wicked die off-I now have a yeast rash on my face.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

So many questions...

Any reason I should not start giving enzymes to DS who is 10 months old and eating 3 good size solid meals a day?

Die-off-we are getting some wicked yeast rashes here, does that mean I am going at it too strong? How long can I expect the yeast flair up to last?

The one good thing about me getting the rash on my face is that now I test out creams and can tell which one works to alleviate the itch.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Ier allergen) proteins pass through breastmilk. I've read that a mother who is digesting properly won't pass these proteins to her infant. Is that right? If so, there are A LOT of mothers out there with unwell guts. . .

my guess (nobody has studied this, so it is purely a hypothesis based on some reading i've done)...

if mama has leaky gut... large proteins from food she eats escape into the gut lumen (they haven't been broken down by the cells in the intestinal lining)... from there they slip into the bloodstream and into the lymph system and then into breastmilk.

i think that there are a lot more mamas with unwell guts than one thinks. pregnancy and labor can be hard on a body, and if one is not in good health to begin with, they probably wipe out the gut - more so labor because of the various interventions that have become commonplace (e.g., antibiotics for GBS).


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

caedmyn, apples and pears are supposed to be filled with pectin - supposed to be helpful for building up the gut lining. if i recall, turkey is chock full of glutamine, also helpful for the gut. what about trying some pureed ground turkey? eggs also have sulfur, no? organic sulfur (MSM) is needed to build up tissue between cells.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yin Yang* 
I wanted to ask you mamas about enzymes. I was gonna buy the Candex and then I found this product, which almost identical in the enzyme composition as the mentioned Candex but it's different brand. Can you tell me what you think about it? It's a great price! http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Candida-...nagement/cas-1

and this is Candex: http://www.vitacost.com/PureEssenceL...nagementSystem

there are really almost identical except the first one has 240 capsules.

I compared the ingredients to these products and the only difference is that there is 100 AG of glucoamylase in the NSI brand and 200 AG of glucoamylase in Candex. Glucoamylase breaks down starch to glucose. This is a small difference and the most important imgredient is the cellulase anyway.

Thanks for finding these, they are half as expensive as Candex


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

I have to be quick, but will tell more later if you're interested.

Had a DAN doc appt. yesterday.







We waited over 3 months to *see* him (it was a phone consult) and was sooo worth it.

We're working on dd's gut.

Anyway, while talking about NCD/zeolite, this guy said most recent studies are showing that it doesn't seem to chelate like it claims to. BUT . . . he is seeing results from it and his theory is is that it alkanalizes the gut.

Interesting, because it has helped dd soooo much.

So, even if it doesn't pull metals like it says it does, it's still helping her in significant ways.

Just thought I'd throw that out there.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
caedmyn, apples and pears are supposed to be filled with pectin - supposed to be helpful for building up the gut lining. if i recall, turkey is chock full of glutamine, also helpful for the gut. what about trying some pureed ground turkey? eggs also have sulfur, no? organic sulfur (MSM) is needed to build up tissue between cells.

Wouldn't the pectin be in the peel, though? DD's not going to be able to digest fruit peel. I've just started giving her bone broth, which is supposed to contain glutamine. I've thought about eggs, too, I'm just a little reluctant to start them because they're such a common allergen. I'm making coconut milk kefir right now and I'm going to start giving her that--I hope it helps!


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
I have to be quick, but will tell more later if you're interested.

Had a DAN doc appt. yesterday.







We waited over 3 months to *see* him (it was a phone consult) and was sooo worth it.

We're working on dd's gut.

Anyway, while talking about NCD/zeolite, this guy said most recent studies are showing that it doesn't seem to chelate like it claims to. BUT . . . he is seeing results from it and his theory is is that it alkanalizes the gut.

Interesting, because it has helped dd soooo much.

So, even if it doesn't pull metals like it says it does, it's still helping her in significant ways.

Just thought I'd throw that out there.









I'd like to hear more when you get a chance...did you ever get your DD tested for mercury toxicity?

Also, if you have time can you post what all you've tried for your younger DD and what has/hasn't helped? I'm trying to work on my DD directly now instead of doing everything through me/breastmilk but I am kind of at a loss as to what to do.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Pectin is found in the fruit.


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

I'm just ducking in here to sub and I have vent and a ramble of questions, if you don't mind. We are going through quite an dietary examination here with our six year old dd just diagnosed with juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. I have been considering stopping SCD, or at least having to add more foods if we eliminate nuts because they are high in oxalates. I am worried that two of my children were too thin on SCD. You can see their ribs and their bones stick out.

Then two other children aren't thin on it, but the one is moody (preteen), and the other is the dd with arthritis. Just now three out of four of them needed to get eyeglasses. The only one who didn't need glasses has uveitis. For the youngest to get uveitis and have an arthritis flare just when we were three months or so into eating a healthy diet is frustrating. Our daughter has had this pain which we now know to be undiagnosed arthritis for fourteen months, primarily foot pain, way back when we were eating gluten and casein free. We can't just say the SCD diet caused the foot pain, because it has been there for a full year previous. I do wonder though, why we would get uveitis while on the SCD? Right now the arthritis is really bad, but that could be because its the time of year when it gets cold and arthritis gets worse. It was really bad this time last year, we just didn't know what it was.

I went about reading about the whole eastern way of getting rid inflammation by eliminating all sat fats and red meats, and I just don't know what to do at this point. Our two thin children...well, I can't imagine that taking the sat fats out of their diet could be a wise idea. We would all like a traditional diet better than the eastern one, and cooking without any oils or very little sounds so un attractive, but we are willing to do what it takes for her to get better.

So, I'm taking a new look at traditional diets, looking at, maybe we were doing the SCD wrong, yk? We were transitioning into it...maybe we didn't eat enough veggies or we were neglecting some vital nutrients because we weren't making bone broths yet...and we really haven't done the yogurt that much. We have majored on fruit, meat, & nuts. Lots of peanut butter. Maybe we aren't taking into consideration allergies.

Maybe we aren't using the right kind of oils, we'd been using coconut oil. But also refined olive oil just the regular kind from the store, maybe that is the problem? Is just regular butter from the store we were using the problem? Were we eating too much fruit and not enough veggies. Well, maybe you can eat too much meat. Could we have been eating too much bacon and eggs? We would eat bacon 3 or 4 times a week.

Is there anyone who is using SCD or NT for rheumatoid arthritis? If so, what modifications do you make? Do you combine the SCD and avoiding high oxalate foods? Do you use SCD and avoid nightshades? Could it be the nuts and orange juice being high in oxalates causing pain?

The dc with arthritis has constipation, then sometimes unloads a large amount of loose stool all at once. I read the arthritis could be leaky gut, yeast, bacteria, or viral. On her hair test, it showed Aluminum, antimony, bismuth, tin, and titanium all in the yellow. Aluminum and bismuth were mid yellow.
She showed high calcium and mag on her hair test, does that mean she's dumping those nutrients? Selineum and Germanium were low. This was last february's hair test.

I'm wondering if the arthritis would get better if she chelated. I was thinking we could get more into the SCD or NT but add in soaked grains and beans and more veggies and maybe less meat?

Since eastern medicine calls arthritis a calcic disorder should we supplement more calcium and magnesium? The weston price website even said for some conditions a vegetarian diet is better. Which conditions does weston price think does better as vegetarian? It didn't say, but it made me wonder if arthritis was one of them.

sorry for the ramble....







: I would like to know your take on it....


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Pardon this vent:

I hate feeling like my dd is a fragile, breakable piece of fine china. I hate being paranoid that her grandparents are going to give her something she's allergic to (just a "little lick of whipped cream"







: ). I'm stressed about what to feed her, wondering whether or not she'll take the supplements, trying to decide if she's too small, and whether or not I should take her to a doctor. Wondering if dh and I will ever have a night out alone again because I can't trust another person to watch her, not even family which sucks.

Ahhh! The mental pressure I feel about her and her health sure saps the joy I want to be feeling.







: I've got to figure out some way to deal with these conflicting emotions because we'll be here for a while







I feel like such a bad mother.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Chinese pistache,

You're not a bad mama -- else you wouldn't be here.

Would it be helpful to tell your family that these are food allergies... exaggerate. Mention death, perhaps.

We're facing a dilemma when we visit my inlaws (well, dh's grandparents) over Thanksgiving. They eat a very SAD diet. So dh will let me bring our own food (haha! he used to give me grief when I did this in the past). He's going to be explaining to the grandparents that this is a doctor prescribed diet and that we're dealing with food allergies (only some of this statement is false, so it isn't a complete lie).

Our favorite sitter is a college student from our daycare. Perhaps there's a local daycare where you can get a referral for a babysitter? If it is a state licensed facility, most states require daycare workers to be screened - criminal history, first aid training, etc. - so you'd be likely getting someone who is reliable and can follow instructions and doesn't have family baggage







Then leave instructions about food with some mention of doctor's orders. Why people believe things when you include the phrase "doctor's orders", I have no idea -- but it works!


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

bestbirths - have you tried kefir? i'm a bit fuzzy on the matter of RA, but i may have read something (on dom's awesome kefir website) that it may ameliorate RA symptoms. kefir with a shot of honey is quite palatable. if you want to give it a try, i've got a TON of grains. also, kefir slows down digestion and, in so doing, it improves absorption and nutrient uptake.

our ND prescribed brown rice to help with absorption, chorella for a time (for dh) to help pull out toxins and such, alpha lipoic acid for whatever reason...

have you tried epsom salt baths? they're calming, magnesium boosting, and they also pull out toxins.

did anybody here try those foot pads to pull down toxins? do they work? http://gaiam.com is selling them now (i saw it in the mail order catalog so i don't have a link to the product).


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
bestbirths - have you tried kefir? i'm a bit fuzzy on the matter of RA, but i may have read something (on dom's awesome kefir website) that it may ameliorate RA symptoms. kefir with a shot of honey is quite palatable. if you want to give it a try, i've got a TON of grains. also, kefir slows down digestion and, in so doing, it improves absorption and nutrient uptake.

our ND prescribed brown rice to help with absorption, chorella for a time (for dh) to help pull out toxins and such, alpha lipoic acid for whatever reason...

have you tried epsom salt baths? they're calming, magnesium boosting, and they also pull out toxins.

did anybody here try those foot pads to pull down toxins? do they work? http://gaiam.com is selling them now (i saw it in the mail order catalog so i don't have a link to the product).

Yes, I've tried the foot pads and they DO work, but don't use them if you have amalgams in your mouth! The night I used one all I tasted was metal and I had the most bizarre dreams too.







: VERY dangerous for b'feeding dcs to do if you have metal in your mouth.









ETA: I'll sell you mine if you want 'em.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bestbirths* 
I'm just ducking in here to sub and I have vent and a ramble of questions, if you don't mind. We are going through quite an dietary examination here with our six year old dd just diagnosed with juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. I have been considering stopping SCD, or at least having to add more foods if we eliminate nuts because they are high in oxalates. I am worried that two of my children were too thin on SCD. You can see their ribs and their bones stick out.

Then two other children aren't thin on it, but the one is moody (preteen), and the other is the dd with arthritis. Just now three out of four of them needed to get eyeglasses. The only one who didn't need glasses has uveitis. For the youngest to get uveitis and have an arthritis flare just when we were three months or so into eating a healthy diet is frustrating. Our daughter has had this pain which we now know to be undiagnosed arthritis for fourteen months, primarily foot pain, way back when we were eating gluten and casein free. We can't just say the SCD diet caused the foot pain, because it has been there for a full year previous. I do wonder though, why we would get uveitis while on the SCD? Right now the arthritis is really bad, but that could be because its the time of year when it gets cold and arthritis gets worse. It was really bad this time last year, we just didn't know what it was.

I went about reading about the whole eastern way of getting rid inflammation by eliminating all sat fats and red meats, and I just don't know what to do at this point. Our two thin children...well, I can't imagine that taking the sat fats out of their diet could be a wise idea. We would all like a traditional diet better than the eastern one, and cooking without any oils or very little sounds so un attractive, but we are willing to do what it takes for her to get better.

So, I'm taking a new look at traditional diets, looking at, maybe we were doing the SCD wrong, yk? We were transitioning into it...maybe we didn't eat enough veggies or we were neglecting some vital nutrients because we weren't making bone broths yet...and we really haven't done the yogurt that much. We have majored on fruit, meat, & nuts. Lots of peanut butter. Maybe we aren't taking into consideration allergies.

Maybe we aren't using the right kind of oils, we'd been using coconut oil. But also refined olive oil just the regular kind from the store, maybe that is the problem? Is just regular butter from the store we were using the problem? Were we eating too much fruit and not enough veggies. Well, maybe you can eat too much meat. Could we have been eating too much bacon and eggs? We would eat bacon 3 or 4 times a week.

Is there anyone who is using SCD or NT for rheumatoid arthritis? If so, what modifications do you make? Do you combine the SCD and avoiding high oxalate foods? Do you use SCD and avoid nightshades? Could it be the nuts and orange juice being high in oxalates causing pain?

The dc with arthritis has constipation, then sometimes unloads a large amount of loose stool all at once. I read the arthritis could be leaky gut, yeast, bacteria, or viral. On her hair test, it showed Aluminum, antimony, bismuth, tin, and titanium all in the yellow. Aluminum and bismuth were mid yellow.
She showed high calcium and mag on her hair test, does that mean she's dumping those nutrients? Selineum and Germanium were low. This was last february's hair test.

I'm wondering if the arthritis would get better if she chelated. I was thinking we could get more into the SCD or NT but add in soaked grains and beans and more veggies and maybe less meat?

Since eastern medicine calls arthritis a calcic disorder should we supplement more calcium and magnesium? The weston price website even said for some conditions a vegetarian diet is better. Which conditions does weston price think does better as vegetarian? It didn't say, but it made me wonder if arthritis was one of them.

sorry for the ramble....







: I would like to know your take on it....

I wouldn't take out the S fats either. How about olive oil? Did you use a lot of that?

SCD has helped me maintain weight for the first time - ever so I'm confused as to why it's not working for your dcs.







We eat a lot of olive oil, (co too, but mostly olive oil), butter - tons of it, and avocados. Will your dcs eat avocados?

I know literally nothing about arthritis. I wish I could help.









Your dc w/arthritis sounds like he also has IBS. The SCD should help that. It's VERY important to do the yogurt (or other probiotic) EVERY day. That has helped my dd1 the most. (She had constipation issues - severe ones- until the yogurt.)

Sounds like you have a lot going on w/metals etc..(dd2 does as well







) so I understand your frustration. Getting the gut in shape is top priority for these kids.

Can you afford a DAN doctor? I finally decided I couldn't do this on my own and had my very first DAN appointment yesterday.







It was awesome. So great that whenever I think about it I want to cry.

I finally feel some relief.

Have you posted on the enzyme-autism yahoo group? Those mamas are very knowledgeable about some of the questions you're asking. (DId I violate a rule here by mentioning them?







)


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Pardon this vent:

I hate feeling like my dd is a fragile, breakable piece of fine china. I hate being paranoid that her grandparents are going to give her something she's allergic to (just a "little lick of whipped cream"







: ). I'm stressed about what to feed her, wondering whether or not she'll take the supplements, trying to decide if she's too small, and whether or not I should take her to a doctor. Wondering if dh and I will ever have a night out alone again because I can't trust another person to watch her, not even family which sucks.

Ahhh! The mental pressure I feel about her and her health sure saps the joy I want to be feeling.







: I've got to figure out some way to deal with these conflicting emotions because we'll be here for a while







I feel like such a bad mother.









It IS extremely stressful taking on all this responsiblility to heal our dcs. It is very very difficult both mentally and emotionally. You surely are not a bad mama. Think of all the mamas out there who don't have a clue about how nutrition relates to health and emotions and all the rest that we know about our kids.

You'd be a bad mama, knowing what you know now and driving through McDonald's for dinner every night yk?

We are all trying the best we can.

My ILs are super sugar freaks and refined foods, all that. Well, they come from the South so whaddaya expect? I catch them all the time (at family gatherings) trying to sneak a little *sweet tea* or cake or cookies or whatever to dd. I love them but they equate *goodies* with love.









Try not to worry about the supplements until the time comes - there are ways of disguising them and getting them into kids. What supps are you talking about?

If she's otherwise healthy, (I don't remember her issues), don't worry about her size.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Bestbirths--







I'm sorry you're having so many issues with your kids. Have you seen any improvements in any of them while on the SCD? It doesn't work for everyone, so if it's not helping you I definitely would switch to something else.

What are you referring to as an Eastern diet? A macrobiotic diet?

Regardless of what diet you're following, can you get more fatty foods into your skinny kids? Coconut oil in everything, full fat dairy if they can tolerate it, butter, cream, etc. And can you put your DD with rheumatoid arthritis on a different diet so you can monitor what causes her to react more easily?

The book "Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases, and Toxins" mentions successfully treating rheumatoid arthritis with large doses of vitamin C.

The book "Root Canal Cover-Up" which is based on Dr. Price's research says that people with rheumatoid arthritis tend to show bone loss, which means their blood level of ionic calcium is too high. He found that arthritis could be reversed if the blood ratio of calcium to phosphorus was corrected (should be 2.5:1 calcium to phosphorus). The book doesn't mention magnesium but her calcium:magnesium balance could be off, also. Can you get a blood test for mineral levels?

I seem to remember reading a post in the Nutrition forum about someone whose arthritis greatly improved while drinking kombucha (I don't remember what type of arthritis, though). I think kefir would also be really good because of the bacteria and yeasts in it. If she can't do dairy you can do water kefirs or coconut milk kefir.

The book "Traditional Foods are Your Best Medicine" says that rheumatoid arthritis patients do best when they eliminate dairy, fruit & fruit juice, and all sweeteners. You might avoid nightshades, too, or at least eliminate them for a while to see if you see any difference when they are added back in. I know I have read several places that many people with rheumatoid arthritis have trouble with the nightshades.

Okay, that is all I can think of right at the moment. Hopefully this will give you some ideas on where to begin trying to heal your DD.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Annikate, thanks for the hug







Dd is taking probiotics (culturelle and reuteri). She's very hit and miss about what she'll eat. One day, she loves eggs, the next day no. Same with oatmeal, applesauce, etc. The enzymes have been difficult. I haven't been able to disguise them yet. I just ordered some flavored ones (not the very basic papaya ones, either), so we'll see how it goes.

Bluets, that's a very good idea about finding a sitter. I'm going to call around. We just moved here, but in our old town, we had a college student who watched our kids. She was wonderful. Thank you.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I'd like to hear more when you get a chance...did you ever get your DD tested for mercury toxicity?

Also, if you have time can you post what all you've tried for your younger DD and what has/hasn't helped? I'm trying to work on my DD directly now instead of doing everything through me/breastmilk but I am kind of at a loss as to what to do.

Yes, we had dd2 tested twice: Once when she was about 8 mos. old and once about 9 months later. Both times she met Andy Cutler's counting rules for being mercury toxic. see this site.

We tried everything to help her. And I mean everything. It started w/reflux. This is what led us here - to this tribe and SCD. Thank you JaneS! If it weren't for one of her posts to my questions about food allergies/intolerances I wouldn't know any of this. She's all







about it when I tell her but I mean it. I don't doubt that dd would be an ASD kid if it weren't for Jane. Well, or if I had kept vaxing her too.







:

But. . . I digress.

DD doesn't have reflux anymore but she is still slightly constipated. Her stimmy behaviors have disappeared. Her dark circles and red bumps under her eyes have disappeared.

Her CDSA shows tons of bad bacteria and yeast too. Too much bifido and lacto (yes, too much can also be a bad thing.)







So her gut needs some serious help.

Her major issue still is that she doesn't sleep. She wakes, and wakes, and wakes. Which is typical of these kids. Her cradle cap has still not gone away either which I just learned can be indicative of metal toxicity.

So . . . what seems to be helping the most:?
magnesium sulfate cream after bath at night
craniosacral therapy (helps her body eliminate toxins)
high doses of vitamin c
clo

I had my first DAN visit yesterday and we will be adding some other stuff







:
B12
Omega 6s and 9s
caprylic acid
milk thistle

The doc did not think it necessary to put her on an anti-candida diet (or myself for that matter.)







(I'm selfishly happy about that.)









So, I will post our progress as we go along. We're going to be doing some regular testing too like a fecal metals, thyroid test, check her liver counts and amino acids, etc.

I know we've taken some positive steps so far, but finally, I feel like we're heading in the right direction toward some *serious* healing for her.


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## Yin Yang (Jul 9, 2003)

What is DAN doctor?









I was wondering something. How would you know that your child might have all these problems mentioned above, or some of them, if they seem to be perfectly healthy? I am not sure how to explain it.....I mean I'd never think my 3 months old for example would have too much mercury in him unless there was something "wrong" with him. It's pretty scary reading about all these very young children who are so full of heavy metals and have leaky guts.....how does 9 months old get leaky gut? It's an very genuin question, how does exlusively breasfed baby get to have such problems? I understand there is way too much crap and polution everywhere around us, but why does it cause so many problems to some people?
Like bestbirth's children - oh my god, reading your post just makes my heart ache for you all!







Really - it seems like all of your children have so many serious problems!!
I have been reading this thread with lots of interest and learnign and making notes and trying to follow everything here....just wanted to express my thoughts on the whole thing.


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
bestbirths - have you tried kefir?

Yes, we tried kefir. I couldn't get the children to eat it. It was too sour. How much honey are you adding to 1 T of kefir to make it palatable? Then, I killed the kefir we had. I have a couple rennet tablets someone gave me and said I could make my own kefir again from that. I don't know how to do that. Now that we know she is sick though, we will try harder to make the kefir taste better.

We do epsom salt baths and epsom salt creme often. I am checking into getting dd some of those detox footpads, and also we have started to use our sauna everyday.

We tried soaked quinoa, and some oatmeal, but I don't know if we are brave enough to try rice, it has been an allergy problem in the past.


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## Gale Force (Jun 15, 2003)

Bestbirths,

You were stewing your kefir for too long. When you get more grains, try letting it sit for about half the time. You still may need to dress it up with something. As she gets used to it, you might be able to get away with brewing it longer.

Amanda


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## Gale Force (Jun 15, 2003)

Best Births,

I saw your post in the traditional foods forum too and haven't had a chance to read it closely but you've obviously made a lot of good changes and have worked hard at it. These health crises always make us stop and ponder what else we need to do. There are definitely diet tweaks you can make (for instance peanuts are high in phytates and can cause thyroid problems i don't think it's good for any of us though I ate some yesterday







: ) The broths I would start ASAP. I would strongly suggest taking up fermenting vegetables and fruit. With all of the children and likely an assortment of problems, the broth will add more minerals and the fermentation more vitamins and bacteria. Those are all good things regardless.

The child with RA, perhaps a red blood cell mineral/metal panel at Metametrix or Doctor's Data. It's much better than a hair analysis and it will give you a sense of whether chelation is really necessary. She may need certain nutrients more. In terms of cures for RA, the only "cure" I've seen lately is the milk diet that we were talking about in the traditional foods forum. My mom had arthritis (though I don't think RA) in her 20s and got it under control with a diet high in meats and vegetables and some supplements. I just asked her about the supplements but she doesn't remember.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I have only a minute, but I wanted to respond to Bestbirths-







. You have so much on your plate! You really need to read one of Karen DeFelice's books 'Enzymes for Autism' is the one I read. I think enzymes could be beneficial for RA and inflammation, esp bromelain. She also says in this book that enzymes can help underweight children too, helps their bodies process nutrients and if they have any gut issues it can help to heal them so they have a bigger appetite.

Chinese pistache, you are a very loving mama! You are doing an amazing thing by taking control of your baby's health. In the enzyme book there is a whole chapter on how to disguise enzymes. The yummiest solution was to melt chocolate, add the enzymes and freeze.

Gotta go, DS just woke from a nap!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I've been away. I'll go back and read in a minute if I can.

A couple of weeks ago I wrote to the guy at www.thaumaturge.net He belongs to the same Christian Denomination as I do, went to the same college as my DH and several people from our church have used him to solve some puzzling (and major) health issues. I figured it couldn't hurt anything and he is way cheaper than the DAN! Dr we are considering.

His responce to me/us blew me away! I was quite shocked and yet it totally makes sense with all that I have learned. Frankly 3 months ago I might not have beleived what he had to say but I have read a lot since then. Try to bear with me while I explain all of this.

Ultimately, I beleive that this gut issue, for me, goes back to bad nutrition. (Read the Untold Story Of Milk to understand this further). This plus abx and exhaustion in college or perhaps even earlier (I'm not sure how far back this yeast issue really goes) set me/my gut up to harbor various pathogenic microbes. I suspect that they may have changed somewhat over the year but that in general I haven't ever had a good balance of gut flora. This is why my immune system has never been good at fighting things off. My white flour vegitarianism in college and beyond probably tipped me even father in the wrong direction. I am currently reaping the results of many, many years of abuse that my body had undergone. My dd had the misfortune of inheriting my poor gut flora and being put on IV abx at birth and spending the first 4 days of her life in a NICU far from me.

So that said here is what he said is wrong with me.

Parasite that I picked up at some point in my 20's. I have become increasingly convinced (through my reading) that this very thing might be my problem but couldn't figure out how to determine that for sure. I mentioned nothing about this in my letter to him.

And DD

Staf infection that she picked up shortly after birth. The NICU where she was has persistant Staf that they can't get rid of. My great fear having her in there was that she would get a staf (or other) infection. He had no idea that she had been hospitalized at all.

And he mentioned that my dh has a problem with keeping his blood sugar stable and recomended a suppliment for that as well as recomending that he take cranberry to keep him from passing yeast back to me. He also recomended that I take cranberry when I get pg to keep my blood sugar stable.

I have ordered the various suppliments he recomended and plan to follow the protocol he recomends for us. I started dd on it today. Her protocol will take a total of 3 months. Mine will take 4 months.

He might be wrong but right now I don't think so.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bestbirths* 
I'm just ducking in here to sub and I have vent and a ramble of questions, if you don't mind. We are going through quite an dietary examination here with our six year old dd just diagnosed with juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. I have been considering stopping SCD, or at least having to add more foods if we eliminate nuts because they are high in oxalates. I am worried that two of my children were too thin on SCD. You can see their ribs and their bones stick out.

Then two other children aren't thin on it, but the one is moody (preteen), and the other is the dd with arthritis. Just now three out of four of them needed to get eyeglasses. The only one who didn't need glasses has uveitis. For the youngest to get uveitis and have an arthritis flare just when we were three months or so into eating a healthy diet is frustrating. Our daughter has had this pain which we now know to be undiagnosed arthritis for fourteen months, primarily foot pain, way back when we were eating gluten and casein free. We can't just say the SCD diet caused the foot pain, because it has been there for a full year previous. I do wonder though, why we would get uveitis while on the SCD? Right now the arthritis is really bad, but that could be because its the time of year when it gets cold and arthritis gets worse. It was really bad this time last year, we just didn't know what it was.

I went about reading about the whole eastern way of getting rid inflammation by eliminating all sat fats and red meats, and I just don't know what to do at this point. Our two thin children...well, I can't imagine that taking the sat fats out of their diet could be a wise idea. We would all like a traditional diet better than the eastern one, and cooking without any oils or very little sounds so un attractive, but we are willing to do what it takes for her to get better.

So, I'm taking a new look at traditional diets, looking at, maybe we were doing the SCD wrong, yk? We were transitioning into it...maybe we didn't eat enough veggies or we were neglecting some vital nutrients because we weren't making bone broths yet...and we really haven't done the yogurt that much. We have majored on fruit, meat, & nuts. Lots of peanut butter. Maybe we aren't taking into consideration allergies.

Maybe we aren't using the right kind of oils, we'd been using coconut oil. But also refined olive oil just the regular kind from the store, maybe that is the problem? Is just regular butter from the store we were using the problem? Were we eating too much fruit and not enough veggies. Well, maybe you can eat too much meat. Could we have been eating too much bacon and eggs? We would eat bacon 3 or 4 times a week.

Is there anyone who is using SCD or NT for rheumatoid arthritis? If so, what modifications do you make? Do you combine the SCD and avoiding high oxalate foods? Do you use SCD and avoid nightshades? Could it be the nuts and orange juice being high in oxalates causing pain?

The dc with arthritis has constipation, then sometimes unloads a large amount of loose stool all at once. I read the arthritis could be leaky gut, yeast, bacteria, or viral. On her hair test, it showed Aluminum, antimony, bismuth, tin, and titanium all in the yellow. Aluminum and bismuth were mid yellow.
She showed high calcium and mag on her hair test, does that mean she's dumping those nutrients? Selineum and Germanium were low. This was last february's hair test.

I'm wondering if the arthritis would get better if she chelated. I was thinking we could get more into the SCD or NT but add in soaked grains and beans and more veggies and maybe less meat?

Since eastern medicine calls arthritis a calcic disorder should we supplement more calcium and magnesium? The weston price website even said for some conditions a vegetarian diet is better. Which conditions does weston price think does better as vegetarian? It didn't say, but it made me wonder if arthritis was one of them.

sorry for the ramble....







: I would like to know your take on it....

Really quick short responce but I am most of the way through the Untold Story of Milk and there was quite a bit about the benefits of raw milk (can't remember if it was cultured too) for RA. Not necessarily a buy the whole book ammount of info but certainly a borrow it ammount of info.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I have been away from this thread, although reading along, because I thought my issues were resolving. And my digestion is generally better. But I have a raging rash on my face that I have now been told by a couple people that it looks like ezema. Which as far as I know, I have never had before.

I am wondering a few things. I ran out of enzymes and haven't ordered any more. I went off any sort of diet and was eating a lot of bread.







: I guess these things could have contributed. Also, wondering if it is moving if that is actually a good thing?

So am going to order more enzymes, stop the bread, and...? Can any of you who have/had suffered from ezema give me some tips, thoughts?


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Yin Yang* 
What is DAN doctor?









I was wondering something. How would you know that your child might have all these problems mentioned above, or some of them, if they seem to be perfectly healthy? I am not sure how to explain it.....I mean I'd never think my 3 months old for example would have too much mercury in him unless there was something "wrong" with him. It's pretty scary reading about all these very young children who are so full of heavy metals and have leaky guts.....how does 9 months old get leaky gut? It's an very genuin question, how does exlusively breasfed baby get to have such problems? I understand there is way too much crap and polution everywhere around us, but why does it cause so many problems to some people?
Like bestbirth's children - oh my god, reading your post just makes my heart ache for you all!







Really - it seems like all of your children have so many serious problems!!
I have been reading this thread with lots of interest and learnign and making notes and trying to follow everything here....just wanted to express my thoughts on the whole thing.

DAN! stands for Defeat Autism Now. The doctors who are trained in the DAN protocol use chelation, enzymes, special diet, etc. to treat Autistic Spectrum Disorders.

I'm curious to know how Annikate got to see one of them since her dd is not ASD. Tell us, Annikate!

Yin Yang, our gut problems are a result of antibiotics I received in labor. I won't go into the whole back story of how we ended up with them (GRRR!), but as a result of them, dd has a yeast overgrowth (presented in rashes), and dairy and soy sensitivity (as an infant, she vomited and has mucousy poop; as an older baby, she developed eczema). Also, there was a period of time in between her dairy sensitivity (I did an elimination diet when she was ebf), and the presentation of her yeast and eczema. When we started her on grains (not rice cereal, but crackers and such), the eczema and yeast really flared up. I think her gut was messed up from the antbx, but the grains (which candida thrive on) sent her over the edge. aNYWAY, THAT'S OUR SITUATION. oOPS--NAK.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I have been away from this thread, although reading along, because I thought my issues were resolving. And my digestion is generally better. But I have a raging rash on my face that I have now been told by a couple people that it looks like ezema. Which as far as I know, I have never had before.

I am wondering a few things. I ran out of enzymes and haven't ordered any more. I went off any sort of diet and was eating a lot of bread.







: I guess these things could have contributed. Also, wondering if it is moving if that is actually a good thing?

So am going to order more enzymes, stop the bread, and...? Can any of you who have/had suffered from ezema give me some tips, thoughts?

It will probably go away when you start the enzymes and cut out the bread. If it is itchy I use diaper creme, I know there is a ton of info on the eczema tribe but it takes a long time to read.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Patty, am I remembering correctly that you make your own kombucha? Where did you get your directions from and what kind of containers did you find it helpful to have around for brewing and storage. Actually any tips you have would be welcome







: . I found someone near me that has the starter.
Thanks!


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I've been away. I'll go back and read in a minute if I can.

A couple of weeks ago I wrote to the guy at www.thaumaturge.net He belongs to the same Christian Denomination as I do, went to the same college as my DH and several people from our church have used him to solve some puzzling (and major) health issues. I figured it couldn't hurt anything and he is way cheaper than the DAN! Dr we are considering.

His responce to me/us blew me away! I was quite shocked and yet it totally makes sense with all that I have learned. Frankly 3 months ago I might not have beleived what he had to say but I have read a lot since then. Try to bear with me while I explain all of this.

Ultimately, I beleive that this gut issue, for me, goes back to bad nutrition. (Read the Untold Story Of Milk to understand this further). This plus abx and exhaustion in college or perhaps even earlier (I'm not sure how far back this yeast issue really goes) set me/my gut up to harbor various pathogenic microbes. I suspect that they may have changed somewhat over the year but that in general I haven't ever had a good balance of gut flora. This is why my immune system has never been good at fighting things off. My white flour vegitarianism in college and beyond probably tipped me even father in the wrong direction. I am currently reaping the results of many, many years of abuse that my body had undergone. My dd had the misfortune of inheriting my poor gut flora and being put on IV abx at birth and spending the first 4 days of her life in a NICU far from me.

So that said here is what he said is wrong with me.

Parasite that I picked up at some point in my 20's. I have become increasingly convinced (through my reading) that this very thing might be my problem but couldn't figure out how to determine that for sure. I mentioned nothing about this in my letter to him.

And DD

Staf infection that she picked up shortly after birth. The NICU where she was has persistant Staf that they can't get rid of. My great fear having her in there was that she would get a staf (or other) infection. He had no idea that she had been hospitalized at all.

And he mentioned that my dh has a problem with keeping his blood sugar stable and recomended a suppliment for that as well as recomending that he take cranberry to keep him from passing yeast back to me. He also recomended that I take cranberry when I get pg to keep my blood sugar stable.

I have ordered the various suppliments he recomended and plan to follow the protocol he recomends for us. I started dd on it today. Her protocol will take a total of 3 months. Mine will take 4 months.

He might be wrong but right now I don't think so.

Would you mind telling what he recommended for you and what the cost is? I've only glanced at the website but it looks interesting...especially if it works for you!


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
I wouldn't take out the S fats either. How about olive oil? Did you use a lot of that?

We use a lot of olive oil, and cook with it sometimes. My mom is afraid of the coconut oil because she has high bp and is afraid of the sat. fat I guess. I was wondering if our olive oil is turning into something bad when we cook with it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Will your dcs eat avocados?

Yep, we just had them in a salad for tonights dinner.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Can you afford a DAN doctor?

We can't afford one at this time, and we'd have to travel far to get to one


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Pardon this vent:

I hate feeling like my dd is a fragile, breakable piece of fine china. I hate being paranoid that her grandparents are going to give her something she's allergic to (just a "little lick of whipped cream"







: ). I'm stressed about what to feed her, wondering whether or not she'll take the supplements, trying to decide if she's too small, and whether or not I should take her to a doctor. Wondering if dh and I will ever have a night out alone again because I can't trust another person to watch her, not even family which sucks.









to you mama. I often have the same feelings. Lately I've been reading "Excuse me Your Life is Waiting," by Lynn Grabhorn, and she basically says that by focusing on what you don't want (illness, poverty, sadness), you get more of the same, and that if you focus on what you do want (joy, love, laughter, abundance) you will get more of that, if you truly feel the experience of joy and happiness and feel yourself getting the things you want. Easier said than done for me, I am not a good positive thinker (although she would say you don't think it, you feel it). Bleh.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bestbirths* 
Yes, we tried kefir. I couldn't get the children to eat it. It was too sour. How much honey are you adding to 1 T of kefir to make it palatable? Then, I killed the kefir we had. I have a couple rennet tablets someone gave me and said I could make my own kefir again from that. I don't know how to do that. Now that we know she is sick though, we will try harder to make the kefir taste better.

I agree with GaleForce - don't let it ferment for so long. I change mine every 24 hours, but that gives quite a sour kefir (good pucker power!). I have to let it ferment a long time because casein and I don't get along.

I like a tbsp or 2 of maple syrup in an 8 oz glass. My dh has a really sweet tooth (all that sweet southern tea he grew up on) - he puts in about 1/4 c of honey in our 10 (or 12) oz glasses. haha - he doesn't waste his time drinking from the small glasses!

xenabyte posted a LOT of kefir drink recipes - check out http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=203282 for some ideas.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Patty, what kinds of supplements did he order for the parasite? Or did he not think you needed to treat it? I have heard there aren't really any safe supplements for parasites while BFing. Is that not true?

I would love some kefir grains, if someone has some to offer. I have been considering kefir for quite a while, and feel ready to try it now.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Would you mind telling what he recommended for you and what the cost is? I've only glanced at the website but it looks interesting...especially if it works for you!

For dd he recomended goldenseal and pao d'arco. I didn't get those from his website. Also pleursy root. I don't have that yet.

For me he recomended Nu Zareba, Nu Ease, Nu Toward and Nu Radix. Those plus Dh's chromium and cranberry (2 months worth of everything) came to about $130. (I don't remember exactly.) You have to phone the company who makes them to order.

It would really depend on what is wrong with you what he would recomend though. I was blown away that he said that dd has staf. I never would have guessed that one and haven't really been doing anything to address bacterial infection, just candida.

I do still need to check on the safety for bfing on all of these. (I did tell him I was bfing but I always check on safety and just haven't yet).


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bestbirths* 
We use a lot of olive oil, and cook with it sometimes. My mom is afraid of the coconut oil because she has high bp and is afraid of the sat. fat I guess. I was wondering if our olive oil is turning into something bad when we cook with it.

i doubt that... olive oil has a pretty high smoke point. check out http://www.oliveoilsource.com/olive_oil_smoke_point.htm for more info.

your mom shouldn't be afraid of the saturated fat - get Bruce Fife's book on coconut oil (the title escapes me right now) to convince her otherwise. Or have her read "Eat Fat Lose Fat" by Fallon and Enig.

i just read something disturbing about how, on average, our intake of omega-6 fatty acids are almost 2 orders of magnitude higher than they ought to be - requiring us to take in 3500 mg or so per day of omega-3 fatty acids to offset that intake. yikes. http://newsletter.vitalchoice.com/index000146521.cfm for more details.


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Bestbirths--







I'm sorry you're having so many issues with your kids. Have you seen any improvements in any of them while on the SCD? It doesn't work for everyone, so if it's not helping you I definitely would switch to something else.

Yk, I have noticed an improvement for me. My stamina has increased, I am no longer heat intolerant and can use the sauna. The children complain complain complain. The oldest craves bread, and wakes up every morning saying there is nothing to eat, and woe is her, she wants a donut and if she can't get one, she's pissing and moaning about it, saying how much she hates the diet. The other kids wish we could go back to gluten and casein free because at least then, they could have cakes. They complain about missing pizza and ice cream and say they hate the diet. They won't tell me if they are having health improvements. I would say though. They look less healthy. Maybe we haven't been doing the diet the right way though. I can listen to them, but not the negativity...kwim? My one thin son craves meat, like asks for beef jerky. I used to give him bacon 3 or 4 times a week. One thing I did notice is after 3 months on SCD, when we introduced sweet potatoe it was like christmas. We introduced quinoa and they ate it. We introduced oatmeal this morning and the oldest who is always complaining about being hungry was the only one who ate it. The others picked at it and didn't finish. I could mix some enzymes in their food more.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
What are you referring to as an Eastern diet? A macrobiotic diet?

Well, kind of. We'd tried macro before and dh had horrible headache dieoffs and had to stop about a month into it. The book I've been reading "Healing with whole foods", as well as our accupunturist is very much the low oil, no red meat kind of mindset. I understand now that it is two different schools of thought. I know I want to believe that the traditional diets are the best ones, because that is what we like.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Regardless of what diet you're following, can you get more fatty foods into your skinny kids? Coconut oil in everything, full fat dairy if they can tolerate it, butter, cream, etc. And can you put your DD with rheumatoid arthritis on a different diet so you can monitor what causes her to react more easily?

I was going to try lard...thinking yk...lard would fatten them up. I just read that store bought lard is rendered with hydrogonated oils. I hope to find some fat that I could render myself. I had bought the lard from the store before reading this and added it to some oatmeal for them this morning. One child tried a little and said she didn't like it. She said, "I'm never eating oatmeal again because I don't like how it makes me feel too full"...um ok. I realized we didn't get the whole oats and soak them. So maybe that's the problem. It was McCanns oats though, and they are supposed to be the best. I will try adding coconut oil to their foods and full fat dairy. I have some half and half, it's not raw but regular. Maybe I could mix it with carob and honey for the thin ones. Or raw goat milk. The funny thing is carob is like heaven to them now...

Yes...for example I could give real bacon to the thin ones and turkey bacon to the one with RA...unless traditional diets still believe that full on red meat is the best for RA... The whole red meat thing is confusing to me. Is the avoiding red meat for RA incorrect like the sat. fat info. is incorrect? Just to eat white meat, or to go ahead and eat red meat when they say no red meat or dairy for arthritis. I have taken out the cheese out of the diet and nuts almost completely out of the diet for the child with RA. But we cheat away from her with this, so I could go back to giving the thin ones cheese, but only if the JA child doesn't find out. She will cry if someone eats good stuff she can't have in front of her.

JA child gets 1000 to 2000 mg of C a day.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
The book "Root Canal Cover-Up" which is based on Dr. Price's research says that people with rheumatoid arthritis tend to show bone loss, which means their blood level of ionic calcium is too high. He found that arthritis could be reversed if the blood ratio of calcium to phosphorus was corrected (should be 2.5:1 calcium to phosphorus). The book doesn't mention magnesium but her calcium:magnesium balance could be off, also. Can you get a blood test for mineral levels?

Hmm. I will have to wait a long while to afford it. I'm tapped from chelating our oldest child and remodeling...still paying on dh's surgery from last year. Worst possible time for a health crisis...as usual...







Her hair test shows ca/p 3.56 on a range of 1-12. She has aluminum in her hair test and I read that aluminum inhibits calcium absorption. Possible trigger for sarcoidosis, which I think is related to RA. So, lets just say for the sake of saving a couple hundred bucks that she does have a calcium absorption problem...or something is blocking calcium absorption...what would the treatments be?

My gut says definately...It is a problem with calcium. Plus maybe viral and food allergy related.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I seem to remember reading a post in the Nutrition forum about someone whose arthritis greatly improved while drinking kombucha (I don't remember what type of arthritis, though). I think kefir would also be really good because of the bacteria and yeasts in it. If she can't do dairy you can do water kefirs or coconut milk kefir.

I'm going to try again with kefir...and kombucha is new to me. Where do you buy it?

Thank you for all of this valuable information.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I'm curious to know how Annikate got to see one of them since her dd is not ASD. Tell us, Annikate!

While my dd does not have an ASD diagnosis, she is metal toxic and DAN docs specialize in gut healing and chelation.

They are expensive and not all take insurance etc. (Ours does, but we have to submit it ourselves and they will only pay a portion.) To us, we'll beg, borrow and steal if it means dd will heal completely and *not* get an ASD diagnosis yk? I just feel we're racing against the clock to get her healed.

Many mamas do this themselves with great success. I am not mentally or emotionally strong enough I guess. After all we've been through in the last year and a half it's a wonder I'm still standing.







:


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
i doubt that... olive oil has a pretty high smoke point. check out http://www.oliveoilsource.com/olive_oil_smoke_point.htm for more info.

your mom shouldn't be afraid of the saturated fat - get Bruce Fife's book on coconut oil (the title escapes me right now) to convince her otherwise. Or have her read "Eat Fat Lose Fat" by Fallon and Enig.

i just read something disturbing about how, on average, our intake of omega-6 fatty acids are almost 2 orders of magnitude higher than they ought to be - requiring us to take in 3500 mg or so per day of omega-3 fatty acids to offset that intake. yikes. http://newsletter.vitalchoice.com/index000146521.cfm for more details.

Bluets-that's the big arguement against coconut oil...too much omega 6. I have to say I tend to agree...I jsut do my very best to get alot of 3's as I use a bunch of CO.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Annikate, I haven't talked to anyone that has done this without some kind of help! That would be an enormous undertaking. You're doing so well, mama. Your little one is so lucky to have you.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Bluets-that's the big arguement against coconut oil...too much omega 6. I have to say I tend to agree...I jsut do my very best to get alot of 3's as I use a bunch of CO.

I never thought about the omega 6's in CO...I wonder if eating a ton of grass-finished meat & high omega 3 eggs is enough to balance it out. I eat roughly 3/4 lb of meat and 3 eggs a day.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Bestbirths--I know I've read about some things that affect calcium metabolism but I can't remember what right at the moment. If I think of them I'll post them. The stuff I read suggested that RA is due to an excess of calcium, though, not a deficiency









From what I've read you will need to give your DD vitamin C to bowel tolerance in order for it to help her--my 9 month old can take 1000 mg a day without reaching bowel tolerance.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

RA does tend to be a problem wth calcium, as in excessive calcium in the blood. This can be measured quite easily with a blood draw. Have you done that? Dr. Joel Fuhrman talks alot about this, and he's right on for alot of it-it's just that pesky pH part that's missing. If your body is too acidic it will pull calcium out of the bones and into the blood to buffer it. That is true. Many things can cause this acidic state and the idea is to correct it so the body isn't depleting it's stores constantly. The problem is that everyone in the world (it seems) things that certain foods are the way to do this. I think it is a nutritional problem (as RA is an autoimmune disease) but that different people need different foods to fix it. (anyone tired of hearing about pH levels already?







)

A traditional diet is the best course of action regardless for anything...it jsut needs to be tinkered with to suit the needs of the individual. A traditional diet can mean rice, veggies and fish. It can mean red meat, bone broths and sourdough, it can mean beans, chicken and veggies-you get the idea. You need whole foods that are properly prepared. What foods they are (*I *believe) depends on how the kiddo metabolizes them.

For instance, it is my understanding that red meat will ONLY be inflammatory if it is wrong for your body. If it's what your body needs it will actually put you into balance. Does that make sense?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

How do I figure out my metabolic type? What about dd?


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
While my dd does not have an ASD diagnosis, she is metal toxic and DAN docs specialize in gut healing and chelation.

They are expensive and not all take insurance etc. (Ours does, but we have to submit it ourselves and they will only pay a portion.) To us, we'll beg, borrow and steal if it means dd will heal completely and *not* get an ASD diagnosis yk? I just feel we're racing against the clock to get her healed.

Many mamas do this themselves with great success. I am not mentally or emotionally strong enough I guess. After all we've been through in the last year and a half it's a wonder I'm still standing.







:









I think we all need help. That's why I'm on this thread!

Annikate, forgive me if you've already shared this, but do you have any idea how your dd became metal toxic?

And I totally know what you mean about racing against an ASD diagnosis. I researched vaccines years ago with my first child. I became interested in ASD and the relation to vaxes, environmental toxins, etc. We ultimately decided to delay and selective vax, not starting until our kids were over 3 years old. Anyway, I thank God everyday that I had the inclination to research all of that because if my baby who has these gut problems had been routinely vaxed, I believe she could definitely have ended up on the spectrum somewhere.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

THere are metabolic typing test you can take. I think it's very helpful for adults, and the lower end cut off is (I think) 3 years. You can also try to measure her pH and adjust her diet to get it where it needs to be. IF your dd eats a ton os meat, eggs and dairy and is neutral, she's a protein type. If she lives off of fruits and veggies and is pH neutral she's more likely to be a carb type...and of course there are many variations in between. It also about being neutral (for health) and alkaline for the killing of things like yeast.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Annikate, I haven't talked to anyone that has done this without some kind of help! That would be an enormous undertaking. You're doing so well, mama. Your little one is so lucky to have you.










Thanks ff.


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## luchita (Jun 13, 2006)

Hi, we are learning about enzyme therapy...dd is 3 years old and we are currently doing a gf diet. It's exhausting and now we're finding other culprits too. Elimination of the offending foods only seems to improve the situation but not entirely. She has symptoms of leaky gut and I'm starting to believe that is the cause of her food intolerances, instead of the other way around. She's had very frequent and very loose stools for as long as I can remember, but now she also suffers mood swings, hyperactivity, dark circles around her eyes, restlessness, rashes/eczema, gas pain, etc...
While reading all the threads, I didn't see very many references to enzyme therapy so I'm curious to get some feedback. I'd love to hear your stories if you've tried enzymes, even if they didn't work for your situation.
I'm reading Enzymes for Autism and feeling pretty optimistic about it. I just ordered some from Houston Nat. Inc. and I'm pretty anxious to get dd started on them.

Thanks!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I just took two metabolic typing tests. Both came out clearly protein type for me. DD has always craved meat, fats and the like. She eats her veggies well but not like meat (most of the time). I think she is probably a protein type as well. She also is very similar to me emotionally and that seems to be part of it as well.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Wolcott and Kelly have both written that most kiddos are protein types.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Im looking for recommendations. Dont I want to take around 20,000 mg of vit A, but not more than 1000mg vit D? So if I got a CLO brand with 5000mg A/200mg D per 1/2 tsp and took 1 tsp, Id only be getting 10,000 vit A. How much is *optimal*? How much do you take? Thanks!


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
RA does tend to be a problem wth calcium, as in excessive calcium in the blood. This can be measured quite easily with a blood draw. Have you done that? Dr. Joel Fuhrman talks alot about this, and he's right on for alot of it-it's just that pesky pH part that's missing. If your body is too acidic it will pull calcium out of the bones and into the blood to buffer it. That is true. Many things can cause this acidic state and the idea is to correct it so the body isn't depleting it's stores constantly. The problem is that everyone in the world (it seems) things that certain foods are the way to do this. I think it is a nutritional problem (as RA is an autoimmune disease) but that different people need different foods to fix it. (anyone tired of hearing about pH levels already?







)

A traditional diet is the best course of action regardless for anything...it jsut needs to be tinkered with to suit the needs of the individual. A traditional diet can mean rice, veggies and fish. It can mean red meat, bone broths and sourdough, it can mean beans, chicken and veggies-you get the idea. You need whole foods that are properly prepared. What foods they are (*I *believe) depends on how the kiddo metabolizes them.

For instance, it is my understanding that red meat will ONLY be inflammatory if it is wrong for your body. If it's what your body needs it will actually put you into balance. Does that make sense?


Yes, this makes sense. Maybe if she is to acidic her body is pulling calcium from her bones...I haven't done the above test but I do have ph urine test strips and asked dd to lmk when she has to pee next. Wouldn't the milk diet make sense then? Or just provide her with as many sips of RGM as she would like during the day?

So, generally what would be the ways to alkalize a body with traditional foods, depending upon the person?? Without a test is there a way to figure this out?...dd likes fruit, juice and cheese, and chicken, but she likes red meat too, she loves nuts. We had taken the nuts, nightshades, cheese and red meat out of her diet. I read some weston price and decided to give some raw goat milk a go. She loved the glass of raw goat milk I made her with 1 T carob and 1 T raw honey in it this am. This am we had a bone broth soup with a spoonful of CO added to make them fatter.

Found my kefir...in a glob in a glass jar in the fridge...ok...what is the deglobbing method for the kefir...rinse?....add milk reuse?...or can I make water kefir out of it by adding water? I know maybe I'll read that got kefir thread too.

btw...goat yogurt is in the oven...so is it true that instead of 24 hours, if I just leave it in for 8 or 10 it won't be as sour?

I read that goat milk might help RA...the milk diet....hey isn't THAT 160 degree's from what other's say about avoiding dairy for RA?...Goats are not producing much in our area, so if we attempted a raw milk diet, it would have to be with supplementing with some raw cow milk. I don't see why she couldn't have dairy though, she's completely neurotypical as far as that, no learning disabilities or adhd, or asperger's.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

annikate - you mentioned that cradle cap is a sign of metal toxicity. got a reference? i recall that firefaery said it was a sign of food allergy/intolerance. i'm confused.

ds has cradle cap that is clearing up. if it is food allergy, then i understand where it came from and why it is clearing up. if it is metal toxicity, then i'm at a loss as to why he got it in the first place - i don't have a mouthful of metals, just one little itty bitty composite (tooth-colored) filling. my mercury levels (according to hair analysis) are just fine and his lead levels are well below danger level.

he does occasionally have dark circles. they are much better of late since i reduced our wheat (and often gluten) intake at home but i can't easily reduce it further at daycare or he'll starve (it's a vegetarian daycare with a no-nut policy). and he already knows that he doesn't eat like the other kids







they made pumpkin pudding yesterday with whipping cream and he didn't get the whipping cream. of course, it would be too much for them to just consider restrictions when planning their fun food activities







:

for me, it is curious (or maybe not!) that i can maintain a nice weight when i have a low grain intake. the free mercola metabolic typing said that i'm mixed type, but then i usually just eat whatever i'm craving at the time. funny how i usually have seasonal cravings too. right now it's the homemade sauerkraut my mom left with us (which ds loves but dh abhors).


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I have always heard (from various docs and nutritionists I work with) that it is a food allergy. I would buy that it's just a sign of imbalance that *can* have multiple causes. I haven't ever heard the metal toxicity before though.

bluets-the free test isn't nearly as extensive as the one you pay for







: However Mercola said at the last lecture that a great many people come up as mixed on that one. You'd get a better idea if you took the one you pay for (shocking, isn't it?) I use the one in Wolcott's book-The Metabolic Typing Diet. That way I can retake it whenever (as bodies often can change) IT's a good test, if you are interested.

It is true though that in a healthy state you will crave only what you need. I'm jealous!


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## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

Hi. I'm lurking and subbing. We just found out about a bunch of food sensitivities my son has and looking into healing his little gut.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - you mentioned that cradle cap is a sign of metal toxicity. got a reference? i recall that firefaery said it was a sign of food allergy/intolerance. i'm confused.

This is what my new DAN doc said the other day when I asked if this was indicitive of yet another food allergy. He said it could be that, could be metals and could be (something else that I don't remember.)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
ds has cradle cap that is clearing up. if it is food allergy, then i understand where it came from and why it is clearing up. if it is metal toxicity, then i'm at a loss as to why he got it in the first place - i don't have a mouthful of metals, just one little itty bitty composite (tooth-colored) filling. my mercury levels (according to hair analysis) are just fine and his lead levels are well below danger level.

Has he been vaxed at all or had any flu shots? Have you had flu shots while pg. or b'feeding?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
he does occasionally have dark circles. they are much better of late since i reduced our wheat (and often gluten) intake at home but i can't easily reduce it further at daycare or he'll starve (it's a vegetarian daycare with a no-nut policy). and he already knows that he doesn't eat like the other kids







they made pumpkin pudding yesterday with whipping cream and he didn't get the whipping cream. of course, it would be too much for them to just consider restrictions when planning their fun food activities







:

Dd's circles will come back immediately with the slightest amount of wheat or gluten.









Interestingly, dd1 gets red under her eyes (like blood vessels) and I *think* that's her way of showing die off but I haven't looked much into this yet.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Has he been vaxed at all or had any flu shots? Have you had flu shots while pg. or b'feeding?

duh. yeah. vaxed to 6 months. cradle cap was manageable and going away at 5 months but then came back with a vengeance around 9 months - right when he got his eczema. eczema cleared up when we quit uncultured dairy (like- cleared up within days)... cradle cap has been slower to go away but we're finally making progress. so perhaps we're finally clearing out the crap from the vaxes and the remaining allergenic proteins.


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
It is true though that in a healthy state you will crave only what you need. I'm jealous!









well, when i don't have cravings, trying to make a decision about what to eat is next to impossible!


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

dh and i've been struggling with this one for a bit...

"they" say that stinky armpits are indicative of a zinc deficiency. i'm pretty certain that we don't have a problem with zinc, yet i frequently have stinky 'pits and lately dh's smell like a dead skunk (even after he's put on deodorant - more like the Monsters Inc "odorant").

got any ideas?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I suspect it has more to do with detoxing. When I was about three months into raw even dh commented that I had no odor even if I missed a shower or two. Of course there are more scientific ways to test!









Anyway, many people report having this happen when they do cleanses and detoxes, so it has to be somewhat connected...


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Giving my son chlorophyll helps with the stench.


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## mamajaillet (Jul 24, 2006)

Man..why isn't any of this information mainstream.







: All of my babies had/have cradle cap, and everyone acts like it is normal, and gives you advice on what oil worked best for them. Kind of like my dd's major symptom was colic, which "doesn't" have a cause.

Anyways, I wanted to ask you all a question. Is there anyway that one can drink too much kefir, or take too many probiotics, or that enzymes could cause digestive problems. I posted a question about this in allergies, kind of, because since I started all of these things about a month ago, my digestion is way worse. I am barely going to the bathroom anymore, where once I was pretty regular, unless I ate a bunch of cheese. Meat does seem to slow things down for me too, and I am eating way more meat now. But I feel so tired since I started this, sleeping in, taking naps, and also snappy with dh, for no reason. Is this all a good sign, like die off or detox. Feeling so crappy makes me want to stop, I didn't feel this bad before I started trying to heal my gut.







:


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I suspect it has more to do with detoxing. When I was about three months into raw even dh commented that I had no odor even if I missed a shower or two. Of course there are more scientific ways to test!









Anyway, many people report having this happen when they do cleanses and detoxes, so it has to be somewhat connected...

THis is making me jealous of all you stinky mamas!


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamajaillet* 
Man..why isn't any of this information mainstream.







: All of my babies had/have cradle cap, and everyone acts like it is normal, and gives you advice on what oil worked best for them. Kind of like my dd's major symptom was colic, which "doesn't" have a cause.

I know.







: Dh and I were just last night talking about writing a book about all this. Very, very beginner-basics of course (I'm not qualified for anything more!







) but still . . . don't you think other mamas would like to know that this information is at least OUT THERE?

I had no idea until coming to MDC. It makes me sad for all the mamas who have no idea and all the little ones who potentially *could* be helped yk?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I realized today my DD isn't even digesting avocado that she self-feeds. I shouldn't give her anything she can't digest, right? Should I only feed her pureed stuff? I mostly feed her, anyway, because she can't self-feed the stuff I really want her to have (like CLO, CO, kefir, probiotics, and bone broth).

firefaery--if my urine is too acid, does that mean I am eating the wrong things or can it be a sign of overall health (ie the candida overgrowth)?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Im looking for recommendations. Dont I want to take around 20,000 mg of vit A, but not more than 1000mg vit D? So if I got a CLO brand with 5000mg A/200mg D per 1/2 tsp and took 1 tsp, Id only be getting 10,000 vit A. How much is *optimal*? How much do you take? Thanks!

No you want 20000 IU (IU is the measuring until for fat soluble vitamins) of vitamin A and 2000 IU of vitamin D...that's if you're pregnant or nursing, otherwise it's 10000 A & 1000 D. It's best to get a high vitamin CLO which has roughly 5000 IU vitamin A & 500 IU vitamin D per 1/2 tsp. Here's a link to the best price I've found for that (there's only 2 high vitamin CLO's out there that I know of). http://www.building-health.com/foodstore.html#CLO


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

That's how I feel about CST. I have many great practitioners that I work with and get to be around their genius all the time. One benefit is that I get the behind the scenes stuff...getting to hear about different cases (nameless of course, unless I am somehow involved) I get to see what happens when things aren't caught and know to catch them myself.

One of the more amazing things is CST. In fact, my latest little imp was having a period of fussiness (which for him means vaguely whining for about ten minutes







) so I took him for CST two days before he was scheduled. The frontal bone had slipped down and was compressing his little brain. It took less than a day for it to migrate back. We were talking and I asked the CST what happens to kids who don't come regularly in the beginning when such minor movements care so major. We talked for awhile and I got a much better picture. It's really sad. I literally watched over the course of a day while that bone moved upwards-and it's not like he hadn't had any work...we have gone twice a week since the day he was born. Little things make ALL the difference, I think it's tragic that all kids aren't required to go for CST. It's even more tragic that they are so adamant about doing harmful things (vaccines) without supporting the babies inherent strengths.

Maybe we should start a campaign and bring awareness to the masses. I mean we all have tons of free time, right?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
THis is making me jealous of all you stinky mamas!










If it's any consolation I'm not stinky, either







Actually I don't even sweat much since I started a whole foods diet before getting pregnant with DD. I don't know if that's a good sign overall, or if it just means I'm not detoxing much at all.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamajaillet* 
Man..why isn't any of this information mainstream.







: All of my babies had/have cradle cap, and everyone acts like it is normal, and gives you advice on what oil worked best for them. Kind of like my dd's major symptom was colic, which "doesn't" have a cause.

Anyways, I wanted to ask you all a question. Is there anyway that one can drink too much kefir, or take too many probiotics, or that enzymes could cause digestive problems. I posted a question about this in allergies, kind of, because since I started all of these things about a month ago, my digestion is way worse. I am barely going to the bathroom anymore, where once I was pretty regular, unless I ate a bunch of cheese. Meat does seem to slow things down for me too, and I am eating way more meat now. But I feel so tired since I started this, sleeping in, taking naps, and also snappy with dh, for no reason. Is this all a good sign, like die off or detox. Feeling so crappy makes me want to stop, I didn't feel this bad before I started trying to heal my gut.







:

I'm guessing you're going through die-off. You may want to back off on the kefir and probiotics and see if that helps. You can make yourself feel really lousy if you introduce too much too fast and overwhelm your system. Also, do you normally have problems with dairy? It's possible the kefir could be causing problems for you if you do. Increasing your intake of coconut oil should help you have more energy.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Caedmyn-ultimately it's the wrong foods. The acidity allows the yeast to thrive.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Hey, I don't sweat much either. I never have.







It's probably not the best thing. Whenever dh isn't feeling good (like a cold or something), he goes and has a good sweaty workout and always feels better.

About the time thing: Yeah, I know. But seriously, don't you just feel sooooo fortunate to know this stuff and sooooo sad for those who don't? I mean really, it could make me cry.

Of course, those I do know IRL think I'm a nut job so go figure.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Hey, I don't sweat much either. I never have.







It's probably not the best thing. Whenever dh isn't feeling good (like a cold or something), he goes and has a good sweaty workout and always feels better.

About the time thing: Yeah, I know. But seriously, don't you just feel sooooo fortunate to know this stuff and sooooo sad for those who don't? I mean really, it could make me cry.

Of course, those I do know IRL think I'm a nut job so go figure.

Yeah...if we published a book or something it would help some people but the majority wouldn't act on it even if they knew. "Too much work" or "too weird" or whatever...


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

*Cademyn* - thanks for the reply (I meant IU's







). BTW, what are you doing for CO now that the $28 one is out? Im thinking of ordering some from wilderness family naturals.....

*Cleansing* - anyone done it? I have read some info lately about drinking psyllium and bentonite to rub some of the goo off the intestines so that treatments (antifungals, pro-b's, etc) can access the yeast which are burrowed in the goop? But then I also read that psyllium (leo galland says....) is bad for LGS. My digestion seems to have slowed the past two weeks, and Im wanting to try cleaning of some kind, although I dont want to fast necessarily. A colonic perhaps?

Im also thinking of starting *enzymes* to reduce the load on my intestines, but need to read more about them. Do enzymes have any effect on bm's?

If any of you write a book Ill buy it







This whole mercury angle is scaring the crap out of me (oh, if only that were literally true







)

One more, *testing*. For those of you who have had a CDSA (and now Im thinking of hair analysis too), how did it help your treatment plan? What info does a CDSA give? And then its up to you to figure out treatments for the results of the CDSA?

Lots of questions - THANKS for any info!

jess


----------



## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Yeah...if we published a book or something it would help some people but the majority wouldn't act on it even if they knew. "Too much work" or "too weird" or whatever...

i'm convinced my nephew has issues and i'm shocked at my sis, who used to be quite a lot crunchier than me. i directed her to the HTG cheat sheet and she claims "it's too much work". i blame her overbearing perfectionist inlaws for the change. in a way it's too bad she's on the west coast - no family support; in a way it's a good thing she's on the west coast - no familial interference. i had my mom take some kefir grains back to Canada and instructed her to send some to my sis.

i thought about forming a holistic mom's chapter here locally. a book would be fun to write but a lot of work (right GaleForce?).

which reminds me - i found an article the other day that says plain ol' acidophilus can knock down E coli O157:H7 (the pathogenic strain).


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Bluets-that's the big arguement against coconut oil...too much omega 6. I have to say I tend to agree...I jsut do my very best to get alot of 3's as I use a bunch of CO.

Hmmm...I was just researching omega 6s in CO and found a website saying it has only 1% omega 6's. I can't find anything else that lists the level of omega 6's in CO. Do you know of any sites, or how much do you think it has?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

A cleanse ( or hydrotherapy-colonic irrigation) shouldn't really be done until the gut is healed significantly. The abrasion can be too much for an already damaged gut.

I don't know. IF the info was more mainstream it wouldn't be as "weird." It is getting to a tipping point, I think. Too many kids are walking around damaged. There may be the "pioneers" in terms of being proactive about it, but it will get to a point where the lack of info in conventional circles is blatently irresponsible (even though most of US think that now.) I think people are poised to start asking more questions and demanding results. THere will come a point where parents will become interested in getting real answers. I mean-alternative medicine is becoming more mainstream. I think it's just a matter of time. We just need a shift in consciousness.

The great part is that we are all out there doing this. Already people are hearing through the grapevine..."So and so has a child who had AWFUL eczema and she cleared it through diet-she never needed meds! Maybe you should talk to her..." and you get referrals. The friend gets results and goes on to tell other people including her doc who is skeptical but can't deny results. Eventually it leaks out, and maybe the doc decides to learn more to better serve his/her patients, or at least learns to refer to a specialist for dietary modification. The specialist, seeing all the autoimmune stuff makes the gut connection and goes deeper. They may start questioning other things that don't seem diet related, but recognize quickly that there are common threads...and so on and so forth. I see it happening alot already. It's really cool.

I guess it's just our job to be vocal. Like here on this board. How many people (by the show of virtual hands) were referred here having no idea that what you were seeing was ultimately about gut health? I know several off hte top of my head. Ans as you learn, how many others have you helped? It's kind of like going back to our roots and being a community. It's amazing that this kind of information isn't more reasily available, but at the same time, it is!


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
*Cademyn* - thanks for the reply (I meant IU's







). BTW, what are you doing for CO now that the $28 one is out? Im thinking of ordering some from wilderness family naturals.....

Hmmm...I just looked at the link and it doesn't appear to be out. It's actually $15.90/bottle--it's the Blue Ice CLO.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

No, the *CO* is out at mountain ...?...herbs









The wilderness family naturals is $$$$ Oy. Ive been getting 29oz of nutiva for $18 a pop and plowing through it. Anyone have a good, economical source for CO?


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
*Cademyn* - thanks for the reply (I meant IU's







). BTW, what are you doing for CO now that the $28 one is out? Im thinking of ordering some from wilderness family naturals.....

*Cleansing* - anyone done it? I have read some info lately about drinking psyllium and bentonite to rub some of the goo off the intestines so that treatments (antifungals, pro-b's, etc) can access the yeast which are burrowed in the goop? But then I also read that psyllium (leo galland says....) is bad for LGS. My digestion seems to have slowed the past two weeks, and Im wanting to try cleaning of some kind, although I dont want to fast necessarily. A colonic perhaps?

Im also thinking of starting *enzymes* to reduce the load on my intestines, but need to read more about them. Do enzymes have any effect on bm's?

If any of you write a book Ill buy it







This whole mercury angle is scaring the crap out of me (oh, if only that were literally true







)

One more, *testing*. For those of you who have had a CDSA (and now Im thinking of hair analysis too), how did it help your treatment plan? What info does a CDSA give? And then its up to you to figure out treatments for the results of the CDSA?

Lots of questions - THANKS for any info!

jess

Whats wrong with the $28 co?


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Whats wrong with the $28 co?

Nothing but they're out of stock. My mom tried to order some and they told her they had to find a new supplier...so I'm guessing it will be a while before they get more and even then it will be more expensive.

I ordered my last batch from www.jigsawhealth.com. I got a gallon of the centrifuged CO (and ordered some pH strips too so I could get the free shipping). I'll either keep ordering from them or I'll order the 54 oz Nutiva from www.vitacost.com. It's $20.99 plus a flat rate of $4.99 for shipping--I'd probably order 5 containers at a time which works out to $52.50 per gallon including shipping. It's quite a bit more than the mountainroseherbs price but those are the cheapest prices I've been able to find on the internet.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

http://www.curezone.com/foods/fatspercent.asp

Cordain also talks about it in the paleo literature. Coconut oil isn't an allowed oil on the paleo diet because we are already out of whack on our 3:6 ratios.

Erasmus is one of the more informed people regarding oils IMO, anyone read his stuff?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

11. What is the amount of Omega 3 fatty acids in VCNO?

None. VCNO is not a source of Omega 3 fatty acids. These need to be supplemented in diet from elsewhere (such as our Cod Liver Oil). The primary benefits of coconut oil are the nutritive value of medium chain fatty acids.

(from the TT site)


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
http://www.curezone.com/foods/fatspercent.asp

Cordain also talks about it in the paleo literature. Coconut oil isn't an allowed oil on the paleo diet because we are already out of whack on our 3:6 ratios.

Erasmus is one of the more informed people regarding oils IMO, anyone read his stuff?

If I'm reading the chart right, CO has one of the lowest amounts of omega 6's listed. It seems to me that if we're eating grass-fed meat, eggs, & dairy (and not grain fed/finished), the ratios will balance out okay with CO. I suppose if you're eating mostly grain-fed animal products you might need to try to balance the ratio with flaxseed oil or whatnot.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Right. *IF* you are doing only grass fed meat and CLO it should balance out. The rec's are more for the people eating grain fed meats and eggs that aren't pastured. However, fats are stored so I think the point of Cordain is that it will take a LONG time to balance out, therefore eliminate sources of omega 6's until you are in better health. At least that is my understanding of it.

Since not many people do ONLY grass fed, pastured and wild caught it is worth thinking about though. I don't do much meat at all and I grew up SAD so I try to be very conscious of it. I do alot of CLO to help balance it out!

I highly recommend CO, I don't necessarily agree with the warnings (else I wouldn't go through an 8 pound tub every month!) I was just mentioning it in response to bluets post. Always good to gather info!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Just thought I would update again on the suppliments I will be taking. I have researched them and it seems like everything is either safe for bfing or largely unknown (therefore contradicted.







) I just called the guy who runs the site and he assured me that these are completely safe as well.

I might be more nervous if my dd wasn't nearly 3 but since she is I'm going to go ahead and just keep a close eye on her.

As far as she goes she got a wicked rash on her bottom last night







(day 2 of her herbs) I'm assuming die off. She is taking the herbs in quite a bit of apple sauce with some maple syrup as well because they are so extremely bitter but has had no behavioral issues from it. That is a miracle in itself.

I personally am finally hopeful! It is so nice to have someone else make the decisions about what to do next! Last night on my "night off" I went to the bookstore (as usual) but instead of reseraching sleep or health I reserached homeschooling. It was so nice to look forward to the future instead of being mired in the issues of the present.

Just a month ago I was so depressed about all of this I was nervous about my health (both mental and physical) from the stress of dealing with it. Now I'm hopeful and excited about the future.

We have put ttc on hold for the next 4 months while I do this protocol. At least one of the herbs is not safe while pg (used traditionally for contraception) so I don't want to mess with that. I do think I'll continue my Acupuncture though. It really is making a huge difference in my cycles. I ovulated a few days ago and no nipple soreness!!! That is huge! This way I'll be all ready to ttc once we are through this.


----------



## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I highly recommend CO, I don't necessarily agree with the warnings (else I wouldn't go through an 8 pound tub every month!) I was just mentioning it in response to bluets post. Always good to gather info!









Of course! I was mostly thinking out loud and soliciting new thoughs









What do you do as far as maintaining a good ratio of calcium to magnesium? I've been drinking 2 cups a day of nettle infusion which is supposed to have
about 600 mg/calcium per cup, but now I'm worried about my magnesium levels, especially since I've read that most Americans are actually magnesium deficient.

Also, I was just looking at a chart Dr. Price did of the amounts of various minerals in traditional diets vs. the SAD of that time. The amount of minerals consumed by these groups varied widely as far as the levels of calcium, magnesium, and phosphorus, yet they were all very healthy. Do you have any thoughts on how this relates to the current recommendations of say, calcium to magnesium at a 2:1 ratio (I think that's correct), or calcium to phosphorus at a 2.5:1 ratio?

And last but not least, do you know of any sources for lists of vitamin/mineral content in various herbs? "Herbal Healing Wise" lists the contents for the few in the book but I would like something that lists a bunch more herbs.


----------



## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Of course! I was mostly thinking out loud and soliciting new thoughs









What do you do as far as maintaining a good ratio of calcium to magnesium? I've been drinking 2 cups a day of nettle infusion which is supposed to have
about 600 mg/calcium per cup, but now I'm worried about my magnesium levels, especially since I've read that most Americans are actually magnesium deficient.

Also, I was just looking at a chart Dr. Price did of the amounts of various minerals in traditional diets vs. the SAD of that time. The amount of minerals consumed by these groups varied widely as far as the levels of calcium, magnesium, and phosphorus, yet they were all very healthy. Do you have any thoughts on how this relates to the current recommendations of say, calcium to magnesium at a 2:1 ratio (I think that's correct), or calcium to phosphorus at a 2.5:1 ratio?

And last but not least, do you know of any sources for lists of vitamin/mineral content in various herbs? "Herbal Healing Wise" lists the contents for the few in the book but I would like something that lists a bunch more herbs.

I think you are thining about it too scientifically. It is best to get minerals in their natural state. I think ideally we ammericans need more of most every mineral, assuming we are getting it from mineral rich foods. If you are choosing to suppliment then it makes more sense to pay attention to how much of what. This is just my gut on this though. I really don't think you need to work so hard "balancing" the minerals from the herbs. Perhaps getting more of a herb that contains something you need is a better approach. I'm currently taking nettle because I am anemic (per my naturopaths recomendation).


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
I think you are thining about it too scientifically. It is best to get minerals in their natural state. I think ideally we ammericans need more of most every mineral, assuming we are getting it from mineral rich foods. If you are choosing to suppliment then it makes more sense to pay attention to how much of what. This is just my gut on this though. I really don't think you need to work so hard "balancing" the minerals from the herbs. Perhaps getting more of a herb that contains something you need is a better approach. I'm currently taking nettle because I am anemic (per my naturopaths recomendation).

Oh I'm a great one for overanalyzing things...ITA that it is best to get vitamins & minerals from foods or herbs. I am concerned about magnesium, though, because I've been reading a lot lately about how much magnesium deficiencies contribute to various diseases, and also because I already have symptoms of magnesium deficiency (leg cramps occasionally). Now that I've seriously upped my calcium intake without doing anything to balance the magnesium intake, I don't want to create/exerbate problems. I would actually like to find a herb that high in magnesium to increase my intake, but everything I've found so far that's high in magnesium is even higher in calcium, so I'm not sure if that will help much.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

*Book* I would love one, maybe a composite of the info in the HTG and the nutrition, plus some homeopathic...gosh it would be huge! I think people absorb what they are ready to hear. Through this healing process I feel like I am learning in 'layers'. Started with the diet and as we keep discussing I get new ideas and research those and add them, or not. I remember Jane telling us about enzymes way back, but I have really just gotten to that 'layer' recently.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

FF- does the Boernicke & Tafel brand of homeopathic remedies have any lactose? I need Arnica and the ingredients listed on the many websites says only *arnica montana*. Doesn't it need another ingredient to hold it together?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It needs a carrier which will either be lactose pellets or alcohol. There is a rumor that you can buy them in water, but I haven't found anything to back that up.

Boiron makes both tissue salts and homeopathics in alcohol, and that's what we're using now.


----------



## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom;6314068One more, [B*
testing[/B]. For those of you who have had a CDSA (and now Im thinking of hair analysis too), how did it help your treatment plan? What info does a CDSA give? And then its up to you to figure out treatments for the results of the CDSA?

Lots of questions - THANKS for any info!

jess

CDSAs are expensive & difficult for the average joe to interpret. I wouldn't recommend doing it on your own (though I did both dds myself.) To be honest, the interpretation of dd2's was so time consuming, I never got around to reviewing the whole thing myself. Luckily my DAN doc went over dd2's point by point w/ me just this week.

The hair analysis is beneficial to do on your own imho.


----------



## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Through this healing process I feel like I am learning in 'layers'. Started with the diet and as we keep discussing I get new ideas and research those and add them, or not. I remember Jane telling us about enzymes way back, but I have really just gotten to that 'layer' recently.

ITA. There is sooo much to know that I think one cant take it all in at once. Now that we have the diet pretty well understood, its on to supplements/enzymes, maybe cleansing, etc. When IM not morbily depressed, it can be fun

Thanks for your help cademyn.

Patti - Im sooooo glad you are getting a load off of your shoulders! You deserve it (we all do, but you have been feeling the burden for awhile. Its soo good you're having a break!)


----------



## chasmyn (Feb 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Oh I'm a great one for overanalyzing things...ITA that it is best to get vitamins & minerals from foods or herbs. I am concerned about magnesium, though, because I've been reading a lot lately about how much magnesium deficiencies contribute to various diseases, and also because I already have symptoms of magnesium deficiency (leg cramps occasionally). Now that I've seriously upped my calcium intake without doing anything to balance the magnesium intake, I don't want to create/exerbate problems. I would actually like to find a herb that high in magnesium to increase my intake, but everything I've found so far that's high in magnesium is even higher in calcium, so I'm not sure if that will help much.

What about dolomite? KAL makes a good brand.


----------



## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

I've actually kept up with everyone's posts today and have been reading the cheat sheet. I can't follow everything, but I'll be able to soon! My 4yo with multiple food intolerances is now on probiotics. He's taking Rhino FOS with acidophilus which we started on the rec of a dr. I'm guessing there's higher quality stuff out there. Does anyone have a rec? Also, should I do something for my 8mo who has a couple of intolerances?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

This is very interesting...I think either the nettle infusions or the coconut milk kefir I've been drinking is alkalinizing my body. I've only been testing my urine pH for a few days but before I started those two it was usually in the 6.0 range. Since the third day after I started those, it's been in the slightly alkaline/optimal range. It could just be a coincidence, and if not I don't know which of the two is doing it, but anyhow, I'm happy









On the negative side, I've been giving DD the coconut milk kefir and yesterday she got a bit of eczema on her chin, which she's never had before, only on her cheeks. I don't know if it's a reaction to the coconut milk, or the kefirizing, or maybe the two grains or so of brown rice she ate a few days ago (we went out for Chinese and DD managed to snag a bit of brown rice in spite of our best efforts to keep her away from the plates). Plus today I tried to feed her some very keferized coconut milk (it just about exploded out of my jar after I left it on the counter for 1/2 an hour!) and now she doesn't want to eat any of it. I'm making a new, milder batch and I'm going to make sure it's fairly sweet with vanilla and stevia before attempting to feed her any--I sure hope she'll still take it.

Oh, and can someone tell me how to make coconut milk yogurt? If I can't get DD to take the kefir I'm going to try making yogurt instead.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Oh, and can someone tell me how to make coconut milk yogurt? If I can't get DD to take the kefir I'm going to try making yogurt instead.

i had some success with the powdered coconut milk from wilderness naturals - just don't let it set for 24 hours. with the powder, you can really control thickness and gelling - i was able to get quite a "normal" (storebought) consistency. i just let it sit too long and i contaminated it by peeking.


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## p1gg1e (Apr 3, 2004)

My MW says I'm to alkiline..I need to make my self more acidic...

I've been Dairy free scince Ive been a bit lactose intolerent, should I try adding it back in with kefier and suck it up? BTW this is to kill a yeast infection in my gut. Please can you tell me what would help the most. Ive been drinking cranberry juice, would lemon juice work also? I take the 50 billion hope probiotica and they work pretty well, I just need more. ALso I'm 6 months pregnant. I dont have a BAD infection but I have a bit of a yeasty feeling in the colon...

I'm not interested in doing the SC diet at this time.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *p1gg1e* 
My MW says I'm to alkiline..I need to make my self more acidic...

I've been Dairy free scince Ive been a bit lactose intolerent, should I try adding it back in with kefier and suck it up? BTW this is to kill a yeast infection in my gut. Please can you tell me what would help the most. Ive been drinking cranberry juice, would lemon juice work also? I take the 50 billion hope probiotica and they work pretty well, I just need more. ALso I'm 6 months pregnant. I dont have a BAD infection but I have a bit of a yeasty feeling in the colon...

I'm not interested in doing the SC diet at this time.

If you culture kefir for 48 hours it is supposed to remove all the lactose (24 hrs with grains, strain out the grains and then culture for 24 hours more before refrigerating). Otherwise you could try making kefirs with water kefir grains using juice, coconut milk, or sugar water flavored with fruit or ginger (if you let them culture long enough most of the sugar will be eaten up by the grains).

Are you doing any fermented foods?

I think it is usually necessary to make some dietary changes to kill off yeast...at a minimum eliminating all sugars, fruits, & fruit juices. Usually anti-fungals are recommended also. You should ask your midwife to be sure, but coconut oil and raw garlic are good anti-fungals and safe for pregnancy--just start with very low doses and work your way up gradually.


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## p1gg1e (Apr 3, 2004)

Ive eliminated almost all sugar ( I have a treat here and there on the low end) ,and I'm eating fermented foods ( stor bought, not in the mood to make them myself







: )

I tried making Kefir and I liked the taste of the store bought better. Could I add lactase drops to the kefir?

I'm taking garlic (capsules) everyday. Anyway I can get coconut oil to not be so icky?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *p1gg1e* 
Ive eliminated almost all sugar ( I have a treat here and there on the low end) ,and I'm eating fermented foods ( stor bought, not in the mood to make them myself







: )

I tried making Kefir and I liked the taste of the store bought better. Could I add lactase drops to the kefir?

I'm taking garlic (capsules) everyday. Anyway I can get coconut oil to not be so icky?

Are the fermented foods you buy unpasturized and traditionally fermented (without vinegar)? If they are not they aren't doing you any good.

I would think store-bought kefir would be okay as long as it is plain/with no added sugars. You could try lactase drops and see what happens.

I've read that garlic capsules don't do much against candida. You can make your own capsules with empty capsules and raw crushed garlic, though. I substitute CO for any other oil or butter. I add it to casseroles or stir-frys, warm herbal teas, make homemade mayo & salad dressing with it, cook eggs or hamburger in it...you get the idea, I use it in everything. You could also try coconut milk (regular, not lite), which has a fair amount of coconut oil in it (2-4 Tbsp per can, depending on who you ask).


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Are the fermented foods you buy unpasturized and traditionally fermented (without vinegar)? If they are not they aren't doing you any good.

generally, the ones that you want will be in the refrigerated section, not on the regular canned/jarred good shelves.

Quote:

I would think store-bought kefir would be okay as long as it is plain/with no added sugars. You could try lactase drops and see what happens.
or you can leave the kefir out on the counter for a day to let the lactose (and other proteins) breakdown naturally.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I don't know what's going on with my dd! I've been completely strict about avoiding dairy and soy for the past three weeks. She had a bit of eczema behind the one knee and it seemed to be clearing up. Then, this week, we started her on some enzymes that she would actually eat, and now her eczema is really bad (like, I'm afraid it's going to become infected bad), and she has yeast rash bumps down her arms, on her belly and on her rear end. Could this be die-off? Could she be reacting to the new enzymes (and not in a good way)? I'm not sure what to think. Any ideas?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
I don't know what's going on with my dd! I've been completely strict about avoiding dairy and soy for the past three weeks. She had a bit of eczema behind the one knee and it seemed to be clearing up. Then, this week, we started her on some enzymes that she would actually eat, and now her eczema is really bad (like, I'm afraid it's going to become infected bad), and she has yeast rash bumps down her arms, on her belly and on her rear end. Could this be die-off? Could she be reacting to the new enzymes (and not in a good way)? I'm not sure what to think. Any ideas?

I would back off on the enzymes at this point. That dairy is still barely out of her system (remember it takes 2-6 weeks to fully eliminate it) Give her system a break and try again in a couple of weeks. It could be die off but it sounds like she isn't copeing well with it. If die off makes you miserable it may be too much for your body. The goal is a happy functioning immune system that kicks these things out on it's own.


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## p1gg1e (Apr 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Are the fermented foods you buy unpasturized and traditionally fermented (without vinegar)? If they are not they aren't doing you any good.

I would think store-bought kefir would be okay as long as it is plain/with no added sugars. You could try lactase drops and see what happens.

I've read that garlic capsules don't do much against candida. You can make your own capsules with empty capsules and raw crushed garlic, though. I substitute CO for any other oil or butter. I add it to casseroles or stir-frys, warm herbal teas, make homemade mayo & salad dressing with it, cook eggs or hamburger in it...you get the idea, I use it in everything. You could also try coconut milk (regular, not lite), which has a fair amount of coconut oil in it (2-4 Tbsp per can, depending on who you ask).


Yep they are raw







I do as much as a can with what I can $$ wise at this point. I will try the crushed garlic insted... Its hard to eat









Ive been making pumpkin pie ( low sugar) with coconut milk (whole) and its yummy









I'll try the lactase emzymes in the kefir... I do miss it so







:

Thanks! After the baby is born I will step up more herbs and such and then later in 3+ years when we have weaned







even more herbs. Its so hard right now but really I feel ALot better than I did 6 months ago I just have hit a wall







:


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Another question on pH. Is my goal to be neutral or alkaline? I just tested and got a alkaline result. Like 8.0.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Depends, in life you want to be neutral-maybe *slightly* towards alkaline. If you are trying to kill off pathogens you want to be alkaline.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Depends, in life you want to be neutral-maybe *slightly* towards alkaline. If you are trying to kill off pathogens you want to be alkaline.

I'm confused on this--some things I've read say urine should be slightly acidic, and some say neutral or slightly alkaline.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I know. IT's very annoying-much in the same way that there is all kinds of conflicting info out there on anti-candida diets. I have just read and researched and talked to professionals and found that everything I put credence in said the same thing. Since it's worked for me and others I have faith in it. There are so many things we don't understand. The best you can do is read everything yourself and see what makes sense and why and follow that. I know I have dealt with chronic yeast and bacterial stuff (had many tests including live blood cell testing) and the only thing that works for me is alkalinizing-of course I didn't know until recently that that's what I've been doing. I just knew certain diets brought health for me. I'm now working to interpret why that was, and why others do better on other diets. I really think it's comes down to the pH.

THat probably doesn't help much. There are no hard and fast answers. But most everything I have come across that is reputable has said that you want to be more towards alkaline and definitely alkaline if you have undesirable bugs.


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

Thank You!!! I followed your advise on brewing the kefir less time and now we are on a roll. I've made maple kefir, carob kefir, kefir nog, and kefir muffins in the past three days. One of my very thin children loves kefir....and kale...he said could you feed me much more of this green stuff...i thought that was funny because mostly I choke kale down.

Also by brewing the yogurt less time (12 hours) it is turned out way less sour. What is the least amount of time we could brew the yogurt? I'd like it to be even less tart if possible.

Can you expain more about this alkaline stuff? How do I find out dd's type to know which foods will alkalize my daughter? I'm not clear on that. I know I read on WAP that they don't agree with eating for your blood type ideas so this whole thing is confusing.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

It isn't about your blood type-I don't agree with that either...although Dadamo has a new book that is focused on genomes and it's much more interesting than the blood type deal. I think he's on to something.

For pH you can just do trial and error. You can buy testing strips very inexpensively. Just monitor what she's eating. If she does alot of grains and stays alkaline then she's likely a carb type. If meats alkalinize her, a protein type.

THe longer you incubate the yogurt and the tarter it is the more jam packed it becomes with the bugs. If it's a dairy based yogurt and you aren't doing the SCD, I'd think you could go as little as 8 hours or so. But I don't do dairy so I'm not an expert


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## MommyofPunkiePie (Mar 24, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *luchita* 
Hi, we are learning about enzyme therapy...dd is 3 years old and we are currently doing a gf diet. It's exhausting and now we're finding other culprits too. Elimination of the offending foods only seems to improve the situation but not entirely. She has symptoms of leaky gut and I'm starting to believe that is the cause of her food intolerances, instead of the other way around. She's had very frequent and very loose stools for as long as I can remember, but now she also suffers mood swings, hyperactivity, dark circles around her eyes, restlessness, rashes/eczema, gas pain, etc...
While reading all the threads, I didn't see very many references to enzyme therapy so I'm curious to get some feedback. I'd love to hear your stories if you've tried enzymes, even if they didn't work for your situation.
I'm reading Enzymes for Autism and feeling pretty optimistic about it. I just ordered some from Houston Nat. Inc. and I'm pretty anxious to get dd started on them.

Thanks!


Did the other symptoms start after the gf diet was started? If so, what did you replace the gluten with? I'd start there as a possible allergen to look into.


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## kimya (Apr 3, 2006)

I am not sure if this is the right place for this, but I need to ask a question. DD has had green, very mucousy stools for almost a month. She is 12 weeks old and exclusively breastfed. I have been taking all-flora probiotics myself and for about a week i gave her a 1/4 capsule twice a day (recommended by her naturopath). It wasn't helping so i got Jarro-dophilus for babies. I had trouble mixing it with BM, it became hard and pasty, so i mixed it with a little water and gave it to her with a spoon. After two days she had a very smelly poop the color and consistency of wet cement. So I stopped giving it to her and the green slimy stools are back. She is asleep right now but about 20 minutes ago she was crying and straining in her sleep. She passed some gas and I thought there would be a bowel movement but there was nothing in her diaper. It was a really sad cry. I can't remember the last time she cried in the night. She seems healthy except for stools and having really dry skin. Any ideas here? It has just been dragging on a long time and I can't call the naturopath until tomorrow.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kimya* 
I am not sure if this is the right place for this, but I need to ask a question. DD has had green, very mucousy stools for almost a month. She is 12 weeks old and exclusively breastfed. I have been taking all-flora probiotics myself and for about a week i gave her a 1/4 capsule twice a day (recommended by her naturopath). It wasn't helping so i got Jarro-dophilus for babies. I had trouble mixing it with BM, it became hard and pasty, so i mixed it with a little water and gave it to her with a spoon. After two days she had a very smelly poop the color and consistency of wet cement. So I stopped giving it to her and the green slimy stools are back. She is asleep right now but about 20 minutes ago she was crying and straining in her sleep. She passed some gas and I thought there would be a bowel movement but there was nothing in her diaper. It was a really sad cry. I can't remember the last time she cried in the night. She seems healthy except for stools and having really dry skin. Any ideas here? It has just been dragging on a long time and I can't call the naturopath until tomorrow.









An exclusively breast-fed baby should only receive bifidus as a probiotic, as that is the dominant strain in their gut. Natren Life Start & Solaray BabyLife are two good baby probiotic powders. When my DD was little it worked best for me to get my finger wet and dip it into the powder and she would suck it off my finger. IMO probiotics can sometimes cause a bit of stomach upset at first. You may want to start with a low dose and increase the amount and frequency gradually. Are you doing anything else to address the problem, such as trying to figure out foods that cause problems? Dairy is a common problem.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I don't think the kefir sodas/coconut milk kefir is working for me--I am definitely "itchier" than I was before I started them, and I'm also have way more gas and some bloating. I'm really hoping it is a healing reaction, but it's probably just the yeast growing some more. I was really hoping they would work...they're so good, too!







I've got some kombucha brewing, though, so maybe that will work out better.

But...I think the coconut milk kefir is helping DD. I have been giving her as much as I can get into her, which isn't a whole lot, maybe 1-2 Tbsp/day. I started Tuesday or Wednesday and she has slept better the last three nights than she has in the past 5 months. She only woke twice two of those nights and slept 8 1/2 hours straight one night!


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## krissi (Sep 24, 2004)

Hi,

I've not read the whole thread for this month but would love any ideas. I have my DD on SCD; she's been on it since about March when we found out she had leaky gut syndrome. 52 food sensitivities and she had high eosinophil protein x on her first CDSA. She's made developmental leaps and bounds on SCD but continued to have diarrhea.

We just repeated the CDSA and it seems things have gotten worse for her. She had very highly elevated lysozyme, which I understand is an inflammation marker, occult blood in the stool, elevated secretory IgA and still has nasty bacteria in there (3+ staphylococcus aureus...penicillin resistant no less). No lactobacillus showed up at all despite that I've been giving her daily probiotics for months...although she did have good levels of bifidobacterium.

I got the results from her DAN ped who didn't seem too alarmed but mentioned we might need to switch her to a different stronger brand of probiotics. We're supposed to have a phone consult about it in a week or two, hopefully I can collect for an OAT so we can see those results too. But I just wondered in the meantime if anyone here has experience with this. I'm feeling kind of disheartened that the results were still so bad after months of SCD. I did just get her started on the homemade goat yogurt. Maybe that'll help some...


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

krissi - if sauerkraut is allowed on SCD, you might try that. http://www.cas.muohio.edu/~mbi-ws/foodmicro/kraut.htm - it has lots of lactobacillus. my ds eats my mom's sauerkraut by the fistful.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
krissi - if sauerkraut is allowed on SCD, you might try that. http://www.cas.muohio.edu/~mbi-ws/foodmicro/kraut.htm - it has lots of lactobacillus. my ds eats my mom's sauerkraut by the fistful.

Thanks for posting this, I have been making fermented red cabbage ( I only ferment it for a week or so) but I love german kraut!







Do you have a stone crock that you make large batches in? I remember my Mom used to have a 5 gallon crock, wonder what she did with it...


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## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
An exclusively breast-fed baby should only receive bifidus as a probiotic, as that is the dominant strain in their gut. Natren Life Start & Solaray BabyLife are two good baby probiotic powders. When my DD was little it worked best for me to get my finger wet and dip it into the powder and she would suck it off my finger. IMO probiotics can sometimes cause a bit of stomach upset at first. You may want to start with a low dose and increase the amount and frequency gradually. Are you doing anything else to address the problem, such as trying to figure out foods that cause problems? Dairy is a common problem.

Are those good probiotics for babies who are just starting to eat, as well?


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Thanks for posting this, I have been making fermented red cabbage ( I only ferment it for a week or so) but I love german kraut!







Do you have a stone crock that you make large batches in? I remember my Mom used to have a 5 gallon crock, wonder what she did with it...

i humbly confess that i am not a fermenting genius. my mom, on the other hand, is... her pickles are out of this world (there's a thread in Traditional Foods that Annikate started asking about pickles and i posted my mom's "recipe"). her sauerkraut isn't really hers -- it's my grandmother's on my dad's side. both my parents were born in Europe and raised on farm-based traditional diets, so that's a lot of how we were raised.

back to the act of fermenting... mom does ALL of her fermenting in large plastic wastebaskets, though she found a plastic rubbermaid bucket with a lid and a handle for the last batch because she was smuggling it from Canada and needed it to be somewhat portable (just to get it from the house to the car then into my kitchen).

teehee ... i'm still wondering what customs would have said if mom and dad had said "no, we don't have anything to declare" and then the officer were to go poking around through the trunk, discovering the big plastic bucket of rotting cabbage and the small bucket of rotting cucumbers and the 3 or 4 loaves of sourdough.







probably a better explanation than if they happened upon the kefir grains i sent home with her.

oh, and the trick to sauerkraut is (a) lots of cabbage; (b) hot brine; (c) no whey; (d) an inch or so of horseradish root (toss it into your compost heap when you package up the finished kraut). garlic is optional. family friends add various seed spices for both fermenting and for eating (they eat it heated). ds and i like it plain and cold. in fact, mom's pickles and sauerkraut are the easiest ways for me to get probiotics into ds.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Im venturing into enzymes. Im starting with a "broad" one. What brands have you all used and what did you notice? Thropps sure is cheaper, but does it *work* as well as Enzymedica, for example? What physical/emotional effects should I be watchful for? I recall JaneS mentioning getting hyper? Does it do anything to bm's? Thanks


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I don't think the kefir sodas/coconut milk kefir is working for me--I am definitely "itchier" than I was before I started them, and I'm also have way more gas and some bloating. I'm really hoping it is a healing reaction, but it's probably just the yeast growing some more. I was really hoping they would work...they're so good, too!







I've got some kombucha brewing, though, so maybe that will work out better.

But...I think the coconut milk kefir is helping DD. I have been giving her as much as I can get into her, which isn't a whole lot, maybe 1-2 Tbsp/day. I started Tuesday or Wednesday and she has slept better the last three nights than she has in the past 5 months. She only woke twice two of those nights and slept 8 1/2 hours straight one night!

Caedmyn, for some reason I am not able to pm you. I have no words of wisdom. In a situation like this i would likely give it another week or so and see if there are any changes. It could be exacerbating symptoms, or it could be die off. They can look so darn similar. Let us know what you decide to do. Oh-and feel better.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Im venturing into enzymes. Im starting with a "broad" one. What brands have you all used and what did you notice? Thropps sure is cheaper, but does it *work* as well as Enzymedica, for example? What physical/emotional effects should I be watchful for? I recall JaneS mentioning getting hyper? Does it do anything to bm's? Thanks

I've used Thropps & Enzymedica...I didn't notice any difference between them. They didn't seem to affect me at all but I had to work up the dosage gradually because they intially made DD very very cranky.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *krissi* 
Hi,

I've not read the whole thread for this month but would love any ideas. I have my DD on SCD; she's been on it since about March when we found out she had leaky gut syndrome. 52 food sensitivities and she had high eosinophil protein x on her first CDSA. She's made developmental leaps and bounds on SCD but continued to have diarrhea.

We just repeated the CDSA and it seems things have gotten worse for her. She had very highly elevated lysozyme, which I understand is an inflammation marker, occult blood in the stool, elevated secretory IgA and still has nasty bacteria in there (3+ staphylococcus aureus...penicillin resistant no less). No lactobacillus showed up at all despite that I've been giving her daily probiotics for months...although she did have good levels of bifidobacterium.

I got the results from her DAN ped who didn't seem too alarmed but mentioned we might need to switch her to a different stronger brand of probiotics. We're supposed to have a phone consult about it in a week or two, hopefully I can collect for an OAT so we can see those results too. But I just wondered in the meantime if anyone here has experience with this. I'm feeling kind of disheartened that the results were still so bad after months of SCD. I did just get her started on the homemade goat yogurt. Maybe that'll help some...

DD1 also has no lactobacillus, which stumps me because she eats the SCD yogurt too.
Ironically, dd2 (if I'm remembering correctly) has an overabundance of lacto which her DAN says is not so good. (Too much or too little of a thing can cause problems.)

These kids sure are tough to figure out.

I started dd2 on this from Custom Probiotics. This is what they recommended and they seem to know a lot about kids, asd, b'feeding and such.

She's on the constipated side and these have helped her bms somewhat. I've started culturing my yogurt with it too.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Im venturing into enzymes. Im starting with a "broad" one. What brands have you all used and what did you notice? Thropps sure is cheaper, but does it *work* as well as Enzymedica, for example? What physical/emotional effects should I be watchful for? I recall JaneS mentioning getting hyper? Does it do anything to bm's? Thanks

I started with V gest by Enzymedica, .5 capsule, worked my way up to a whole capsule and then added a protease, virastop .5 cap at a time. Basically following the 'low and slow' method on the enzymestuff website. I have some thropps, which DH is now taking, but I am hesitant to use it because there is bromelain in it and DS seems to be so sensitive so I am sticking with the enzymedica. I currently take digest gold. And I always open up the capsule when I take it, the veggie gelatine takes a long time to dissolve. It made my poop stinky when I restarted the diet and upped my amount. It is also making DS's poo stinky. I also take candex in between meals.


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## lilsishomemade (Feb 12, 2005)

I am wondering how those who drink kombucha do it? I was at the store buying some probiotics, and saw a bottle there, so bought it. I took a sip, but that's all I could do...do you just drink a glass a day? Sorry, but this is all still so new to me, any advice is helpful.


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## Bestbirths (Jan 18, 2003)

I don't know on the kombuchu, ours is being sent to us. Maybe the homemade tastes better. I know kefir tastes better with a shorter brew time, so maybe its the same with kombuchu.

I xposted this situation in traditional foods under an arthritis thread, because dd, age 6, has just been diagnosed with juvenille rheumatoid arthritis.
My dd is having problems with constipation. And she occasionally has really weird poops where she gets backed up then sends a mound of bulky looking poo the size of horse's poo into the toilet. It's dark and loose too, not formed, but not really loose diarrea...ok tmi. I noticed this especially following soy products, so we eliminated that.

Currently the issue is constipation. She went to the er in terrible pain and not able to breathe, only to find that she was very constipated they said was the issue. The Xray showed (I know-I allowed it because I was worried there was a serious problem) her constipated and bowel completely filling the colon and backed up into her ribcage...it was awful looking. We have used virastop, but ran out...so I wonder if that is why the problem is back? Also in the past few days since we ran out of virastop the arthritis is worse, but it also got colder, so it's hard to say if that is why she's worse. It does seem like the constipation gets worse when the arthritis is worse, so maybe it is from being tense.
We have used 1/2 tsp of CLO & flaxseed oil a day. We've done castor oil packs. She is sipping on raw goat milk, and having raw goat yogurt and kefir drinks. I think I'm going to do another three days of castor oil packs over her liver, because that worked getting the bowels moving last week. We do epsom salt baths. I was giving her psyllium husk. It's like we did all this for three or four days, the bowels got moving, then we didn't do psyllium, epsom salt baths, or the castor oil packs and four days later now she's constipated again. We keep pushing water, but she doesn't like drinking water...I know that could be the whole problem. We have been making soups and broths too.

She's also taking bromelian, querceitin, & curcumin and a vitamin shake once or twice a day.

I do have candex and custom probiotics, should I be adding those? If they were added in apple sauce, would it still work since they are not supposed to be given with food.


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## krissi (Sep 24, 2004)

Thanks for the suggestion of sauerkraut. DD loves sauerkraut and I didn't think of that. Do you have to make it yourself for it to contain the lactobacillus or would any kind of organic kind of sauerkraut work? I bought some at Whole Foods over the weekend just as a kind of way to reintroduce it to her diet but can start making it if need be. And if you make it, do you need some kind of starter?

Have also been in touch with the ped again...looks like we're switching to a Custom Probiotics product with six strains of Lactobacillus in it and 260 billion per serving. Our old probiotic from Kirkman had only 20 billion. I hoep this will help!

Quote:

Im venturing into enzymes. Im starting with a "broad" one. What brands have you all used and what did you notice? Thropps sure is cheaper, but does it *work* as well as Enzymedica, for example? What physical/emotional effects should I be watchful for? I recall JaneS mentioning getting hyper? Does it do anything to bm's? Thanks
We use lots of enzymes since we had seen undigested food in the stools. DD gets all three of Houston's three times a day, a split capsule of Candex per day, and she's on a new product called "GastroCalm" that is a mixture of enzymes and anti-inflammatory herbs. I never saw any emotional effects of any of them but they do reduce her abdominal cramping. We actually saw firm stools for about a week when we added in No Fenol but the effect was short lived and then returned to normal. I think Candex has been helpful in finally getting yeast under control, esp. in combo with No Fenol.


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## luchita (Jun 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MommyofPunkiePie* 
Did the other symptoms start after the gf diet was started? If so, what did you replace the gluten with? I'd start there as a possible allergen to look into.

No, I started the diet after the other symptoms came up...the eczema and rash went away immediately. The hyperactivity and moodiness/bad temperment seems to happen most whenever she has *any* type of artificial color, flavor or additive. And high-fructose corn syrup.
The pooping up to 8 times a day, 3-4 days a week had already been going for quite some time.

We got our enzymes on Friday...she is taking Peptizide and ZynePrime with breakfast and dinner and No Fenol with phenolic foods. She also takes probiotics.
We've managed to keep her away from artificial stuff since starting the enzymes. No easy feat since her birthday was Saturday!
Her disposition seems better lately, but the pooping remains the same. She had no b/m's on Friday or Saturday, but yesterday she had 6 b/m's just from 2 pm to 9 pm. Nearly one every hour.
I'm at the end of my rope trying to figure out what is causing this. We are going to stick with the enzymes for at least a couple of months and keep a food/temperment/bowel journal...

Any advice would be much appreciated!
Thanks


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Bestbirths* 
Currently the issue is constipation.

(lots snipped)

can she handle oatmeal? i find that if i don't have oatmeal (like when i visit my ILs), i get totally plugged up... there's a link to study (on enzymestuff.com) about how oats can help repair a damaged gut, so they can't be all bad.

what about adding a shot of prune juice to her smoothie, every other day or so?


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

yeast and acid/alkaline:

http://www.drlwilson.com/Articles/candida.htm

What do you all think?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Just browsed it quickly but it makes sense. Most metal toxic kids have yeast problems and a copper imbalance.

I agree with the fermented foods thing but it's jmo. Fermented foods are supposed to help alkalanize so I never quite understood why they were on the *avoid* list of some anti-candida diets.

The cellulose thing makes sense to me too.

Thanks for posting that.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

How much detox or whatever do you think that I can expect in DD1 (4.75)? We are on day 1.5 of no grains (well, last night we had brown rice pasta) and today she didn't eat much and also seemed a bit under something. Not sick, exactly. Of course, it could just be that she stayed up too late last night and had a long day at school. I am attempting the no grains things with her, or at the very least, wheat because of circles under her eyes that she has had for years. Despite trying different things, they are still there and I just don't think that grainy carbs are the best for her. Strangely enough, I thin, my DH will be the hardest battle on that one.







:


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
How much detox or whatever do you think that I can expect in DD1 (4.75)? We are on day 1.5 of no grains (well, last night we had brown rice pasta) and today she didn't eat much and also seemed a bit under something. Not sick, exactly. Of course, it could just be that she stayed up too late last night and had a long day at school. I am attempting the no grains things with her, or at the very least, wheat because of circles under her eyes that she has had for years. Despite trying different things, they are still there and I just don't think that grainy carbs are the best for her. Strangely enough, I thin, my DH will be the hardest battle on that one.







:

Hi! Where ya been?









I doubt this is any kind of die off yet but I've been known to be very wrong about such things.









I'd highly recommend getting her off of wheat AND gluten for at least 4 weeks and see if you notice an improvement in her undereye circles.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
I'd highly recommend getting her off of wheat AND gluten for at least 4 weeks and see if you notice an improvement in her undereye circles.

I am going to try my darnest. Actually, that is what I suggested to DH. He is on board, but whenever he is in charge of food it is 99.9% of the time rice or pasta for dinner and sandwiches for lunch.







I was up until 12:30 last night making and preparing stuff, just to make sure that she had enough to eat today. Not that she is that dependent on grains, but I was due to go shopping and a bit low on our staples.

I have been so-so. I had the face rash from he!! last week, which is largely gone, except that my lips are soooooooooooooo sore that I feel that I need to put vit E oil on them every 10 min. My stomach stuff was ok while my face was exploding, but now it is not good and also upset.







I have been getting in more fermented stuff -- sauerkraut and water kefir, which may or may not have anything to do with it. And at the risk of TMI, after a spell of perfect poop







, I am back to floaters. Which for me also corresponds to an ennormously distended stomach. Enough that DD is asking me why my stomach is so big.







This is a long road to recovery, isn't it??







:


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

DD's DAN doc recommended this for her.

My homeopath recommended it for me.

It's supposed to be an anti-fungal. That's 2 recommendations in only a few weeks. I haven't taken mine because I burp it up







and it's nasty tasting but I'm giving it to dd. I'm considering taking it again though . . .


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 







This is a long road to recovery, isn't it??







:

Yes, and it's sooooo hard at times.

I'm still feeling







: about dd's DAN doc pointing out that I still have leaky gut (after hmmmm. . . almost 9 months on this diet!) Now I'm back to worrying about every little thing I ingest again.









We're starting dd on a whole new protocol and I surely don't want to do anything to interfere w/that. I'm considering weaning her. Only _considering_ it (or at least night weaning) but need to think long and hard about it first.

Her DAN thinks that the metal in my mouth may be affecting her more than b'milk is beneficial. KWIM?









I'll probably post an OT post about this too all you HTG mamas later on.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Yes, and it's sooooo hard at times.

I'm still feeling







: about dd's DAN doc pointing out that I still have leaky gut (after hmmmm. . . almost 9 months on this diet!) Now I'm back to worrying about every little thing I ingest again.









We're starting dd on a whole new protocol and I surely don't want to do anything to interfere w/that. I'm considering weaning her. Only _considering_ it (or at least night weaning) but need to think long and hard about it first.

Her DAN thinks that the metal in my mouth may be affecting her more than b'milk is beneficial. KWIM?









I'll probably post an OT post about this too all you HTG mamas later on.

Poopy!







What about having your fillings taken out and pumping to keep up suplly? Would that work? What a hard decision to make.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

How much zinc do you all suppliment yourselves with? I am guessing I am deficient and have started taking 900mg a day. Is that a good amount?
What about magnesium? I take 900-1200mg a day, you guys were talking about this a while back...

I had the phone interview with the CST today and I am looking foreward to meeting the woman, she seems like a good match for me at least. Our appt is on Wed. Then we have the regular ped check up on Thursday. I was thinking about asking for a blood test to check food allergies. I hate to make him go through the blood test but it seems better than suffering through rash after rash if he has actual allergies to foods that I can avoid.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Poopy!







What about having your fillings taken out and pumping to keep up suplly? Would that work? What a hard decision to make.









Yeah, it sucks. DD's DAN didn't actually suggest this (we didn't talk about it for long) but he did tell me that I might want to think about weaning her for say 10 days and pumping during those 10 days to keep up supply just to kind of do a test. If she does better w/out my milk (







) then she'd be weaned. If not, then she could go back to nursing.







:

DD1 pretty much night weaned herself during my pregnancy. Then I completely weaned her at 27 months because I just *couldn't* do the tandem nursing thing anymore. It wasn't that difficult w/her. I can't imagine actually having to go through the weaning process so suddenly w/dd2.

Maybe I'll try the night weaning thing first. Problem is, she's awake ALL NIGHT LONG. Nursing is her comfort yk? With this child, it might make more sense to *day* wean her. Ever heard of such a thing?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
How much zinc do you all suppliment yourselves with? I am guessing I am deficient and have started taking 900mg a day. Is that a good amount?
What about magnesium? I take 900-1200mg a day, you guys were talking about this a while back...

I had the phone interview with the CST today and I am looking foreward to meeting the woman, she seems like a good match for me at least. Our appt is on Wed. Then we have the regular ped check up on Thursday. I was thinking about asking for a blood test to check food allergies. I hate to make him go through the blood test but it seems better than suffering through rash after rash if he has actual allergies to foods that I can avoid.

Good luck!
I don't know, after Jane found out so much about her ds by doing the skin pricks, I almost think if I had to, I'd go for that. I dunno though . . .

We did a blood draw for dd and I'm not completely convinced it was entirely accurate (although it did confirm the wheat thing.)


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Just browsed it quickly but it makes sense. Most metal toxic kids have yeast problems and a copper imbalance.

I agree with the fermented foods thing but it's jmo. Fermented foods are supposed to help alkalanize so I never quite understood why they were on the *avoid* list of some anti-candida diets.

The thing that struck me is that he says yeast _likes_ an _alkaline_ body, so you want to be more acidic! havent we been talking about alkaline being good. And I know Ive come across this idea in other reading - that acid is better to fight yeast.... I think I asked about it here for that reason. It makes a lot of sense to me (dont good bugs make acid in the gut?).

Nolansmum - that seems like waaayyyy too much zinc. I take 50mg/day and have read that the upper limit is 80? Are you sire you're taking 900? Mag. I take 700, but havent tinkered with it.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
The thing that struck me is that he says yeast _likes_ an _alkaline_ body, so you want to be more acidic! havent we been talking about alkaline being good. And I know Ive come across this idea in other reading - that acid is better to fight yeast.... I think I asked about it here for that reason. It makes a lot of sense to me (dont good bugs make acid in the gut?).

Now I always thought (and I'm NO yeast expert by any means!) that one needed to alkanalize in order to rid the body of yeast.







:

I have to admit though, the the subject of yeast bores me and I only 1/2 pay attention to what people post about it.









I'd much rather talk about bacteria, parasites and other nasties.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lilsishomemade* 
I am wondering how those who drink kombucha do it? I was at the store buying some probiotics, and saw a bottle there, so bought it. I took a sip, but that's all I could do...do you just drink a glass a day? Sorry, but this is all still so new to me, any advice is helpful.

I really like the taste of kombucha. So does dd. It is certainly individual though.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I have only ever read alkalinize for yeast-and not just on the internet...in classes and things too. I know there's contradictory info everywhere, but I'm not sure what to make of this. Very odd. Maybe it's another piece of the misunderstanding regarding what foods do what in which bodies. Interesting.

That is WAY too much zinc. For maintenance I do 25-30 mg a day. If I'm acutely ill maybe 60. Maybe. Zinc is one of those pesky things that you could OD on, so I'm pretty darn careful with it.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
The thing that struck me is that he says yeast _likes_ an _alkaline_ body, so you want to be more acidic! havent we been talking about alkaline being good. And I know Ive come across this idea in other reading - that acid is better to fight yeast.... I think I asked about it here for that reason. It makes a lot of sense to me (dont good bugs make acid in the gut?).

Nolansmum - that seems like waaayyyy too much zinc. I take 50mg/day and have read that the upper limit is 80? Are you sire you're taking 900? Mag. I take 700, but havent tinkered with it.

oops!







yah, I am taking 90mg of zinc


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I take 30 mg, along with copper. Got my info from MT on the Nutrition thread.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I was reading through some part of the enzymestuff website and found this:

Quote:

Another reason may have something to do with yeast. Dr. Semon (the author of 'Feast without Yeast' and autism doctor) said that if you have yeast you should NOT take B vitamins as these feed yeast...or the yeast intercept it so you don't benefit, etc. Something else to look into exactly if you have yeast and are considering B vitamins above the RDA level.








Never heard of this, anyone else? I know there are yeast -free b vitamins.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

What about oatmeal to help heal the gut? Those of tyou that have tried it, how have your bodies reacted to oatmeal after being on SCD? Is it something to try once I am well on my way to being healed? (When will that be???







)


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
I'm still feeling







: about dd's DAN doc pointing out that I still have leaky gut (after hmmmm. . . almost 9 months on this diet!) Now I'm back to worrying about every little thing I ingest again.









You know, sometimes I wonder if anybody ever truly heals...gets better, even symptom-free, yes, but really 100% healed? I don't know...


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I got investigating tonight and had a lightbulb moment that possibly my problems, at least of late, might be from being too alkaline.







: Must investigate further, but of course it is confusing in that where I was reading (here) listed what foods to eat and stay away from, depending on what you are trying to correct. Isn't this exactly what we _weren't_ talking about?? How everyone reacts to foods differently??







:


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I am going to try my darnest. Actually, that is what I suggested to DH. He is on board, but whenever he is in charge of food it is 99.9% of the time rice or pasta for dinner and sandwiches for lunch.









DHs are often just terrible about food. Mine thinks I'm nutzo, and is bad about letting ds eat some of his non-SCD food. He asked me to write down the diet -- even though he's already been over it with me several times. It just doesn't sink in!







:


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
With this child, it might make more sense to *day* wean her. Ever heard of such a thing?









Yes, all the time. My ds is pretty much day weaned now, in part because I was thinking I'd be going back on Prozac and didn't want to have to wean him suddenly for that, and partially because I was thinking my mercury fillings being mostly removed might be causing me to detox mercury, even though I still have one definite one, and two possible ones under crowns.


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
yeast and acid/alkaline:

http://www.drlwilson.com/Articles/candida.htm

What do you all think?

It's interesting, although I think some of it is wrong -- candida is in everyone, it's when it overgrows that it's dangerous. I didn't know that stevia had lead in it -- yikes, and I just went and bought some. Scary!


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## PrairieBohemian (Aug 31, 2004)

I was looking for an SCD tribe to support dh (about to begin SCD). I guess this is it?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
You know, sometimes I wonder if anybody ever truly heals...gets better, even symptom-free, yes, but really 100% healed? I don't know...

The sucky part is that *I* feel "healed". MY symptoms are - - dare I say? - - 100% better. (Unless I eat crap and then I'll have some minor annoyances like bloating or gas.)

BUT . . . I still have leaky gut and so I'm doing more harm than good to dd right now.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *animus_silvae* 
I was looking for an SCD tribe to support dh (about to begin SCD). I guess this is it?

This is it although not everyone here is doing SCD. Some of us are though.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
The sucky part is that *I* feel "healed". MY symptoms are - - dare I say? - - 100% better. (Unless I eat crap and then I'll have some minor annoyances like bloating or gas.)

BUT . . . I still have leaky gut and so I'm doing more harm than good to dd right now.









How do you know you still have leaky gut?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I got investigating tonight and had a lightbulb moment that possibly my problems, at least of late, might be from being too alkaline.







: Must investigate further, but of course it is confusing in that where I was reading (here) listed what foods to eat and stay away from, depending on what you are trying to correct. Isn't this exactly what we _weren't_ talking about?? How everyone reacts to foods differently??







:

I think the problem with the acid/alkaline balance theory is that almost everyone thinks you have to eat "alkalinizing" foods, when really (as we've been discussing) if you're eating the proper foods for your body it will normalize. "The Metabolic Type Diet" has a good explanation of this. I haven't finished reading it yet but it is really interesting and what I've read so far definitely holds true for me (I'm a protein type which is probably why I've done well and felt really well on this high protein low carb candida diet).


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
How do you know you still have leaky gut?

Because I ate some wheat w/out thinking and dd's symptoms came back w/a vengeance.

I also had 2 peices of dd1's wheat free birthday cake on Sat. (still, sugar in it) and dd2 was UP ALL NIGHT. I'm quite sure it was from the sugar.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Nolansmom--you asked earlier if the EBF baby probiotics were good for a baby just starting solids. From what I've read, as a baby eats more and more solids their gut flora gradually changes over to resemble that of an adult, and the transition is complete somewhere around 5 years of age. IMO at this age they should still be getting mostly bifidus but it won't hurt to add in another probiotic, also. I give my DD the BabyLife 3x/day and acidophilus/bifidus mixture 1x/day.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

This is a funny question, but what is your tongue supposed to look like? I've had a white coating on my tongue for a long time that I'm sure is related to the candida, but now that is going away. But the top of my tongue isn't the same color as the bottom of my tongue. It's a lighter color...it still kind of looks like it has a layer of white lightening the pink, but almost as if it's the natural color instead of a coating, if that makes sense. Does that sound normal?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

How can I tell if my coconut milk yogurt turned out? It doesn't smell anything like yogurt.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
This is a funny question, but what is your tongue supposed to look like? I've had a white coating on my tongue for a long time that I'm sure is related to the candida, but now that is going away. But the top of my tongue isn't the same color as the bottom of my tongue. It's a lighter color...it still kind of looks like it has a layer of white lightening the pink, but almost as if it's the natural color instead of a coating, if that makes sense. Does that sound normal?









We do tend to overthink things don't we?

FWIW, the top of my tongue is lighter than the bottom. I think everyone's is.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 







We do tend to overthink things don't we?

FWIW, the top of my tongue is lighter than the bottom. I think everyone's is.

I guess I'm approaching normal then







I just wanted to make sure the white coating was actually disappearing and not morphing into something else!


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
This is a funny question, but what is your tongue supposed to look like? I've had a white coating on my tongue for a long time that I'm sure is related to the candida, but now that is going away. But the top of my tongue isn't the same color as the bottom of my tongue. It's a lighter color...it still kind of looks like it has a layer of white lightening the pink, but almost as if it's the natural color instead of a coating, if that makes sense. Does that sound normal?










"Tongue Diagnosis - a simple way to evaluate digestive health"

In chinese medicine the tingue is the window to the digestive system...by carefully noting the color, texture, shape, and moisture ....

A healthy tongue is ruddy pink, lays comfortably in the mouth (not fat or thin), has an even shape, smooth texture, and thin moist light white fur that covers the surface evenly from back to front. The appearance of coarse, thickened, wet, dry, absent, or dislcolored fur (translucent whoite changing to opaque white, gray, yallow or brown) is an early sign of congestion of the stomach and poor digestion..."


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?

I belong to the school of thought that once you wean, you don't need to "replace" it with anything, as in other milk. Course, if you are "prematurely" weaning, maybe that is different. But when that is obviously is different depending on who you talk to.







Does she eat enough solid food that you feel she has enough nourishment from it? If I were in your position and not worried about getting in more calories, I would probably do tea.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
How can I tell if my coconut milk yogurt turned out? It doesn't smell anything like yogurt.


If it worked it will be very tart. I know mine doesn't seem fully "developed" until after it has chilled. At that point it its virtually indistinguishable from regular old yogurt.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?


I personally wouldn't substitute with anything. It isn't necessary at this point. Goat's milk is not legal, though hard goat cheese is. IT does have casein in it as well as lactose (which is what makes it illegal.) I personally wouldn't do it, but that's just me.

And FWIW I wouldn't wean either. You may want to get a second opinion from someone who understands more about bf, toxicity and body ecology. I am not able to give great advice on this, though I know someone who can. If you are having any ambivalence here I'd pursue it further to make sure you are doing what you know is best. I hate to see people quit bfing and regret it later. I hope I'm not speaking out of turn, you just sound really sad about it. Of course if you are comfortable in this decision and it makes sense to you-ignore me!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?

No fluid (animal) milk is legal on SCD. You could try something like almond milk or another nut milk.

40% of people with a problem with cows mill will also have one with goat milk. They are similar and share some proteins but not all.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
DD's DAN doc recommended this for her.

My homeopath recommended it for me.

It's supposed to be an anti-fungal. That's 2 recommendations in only a few weeks. I haven't taken mine because I burp it up







and it's nasty tasting but I'm giving it to dd. I'm considering taking it again though . . .

Given what you've been through a concentrated foem isn't a bad idea. It's naturally found in CO which is why it's a useful tool in gut healing (that and the lauric acid) Good luck! It is pretty nasty though. What is your source derived from?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Because I ate some wheat w/out thinking and dd's symptoms came back w/a vengeance.

I also had 2 peices of dd1's wheat free birthday cake on Sat. (still, sugar in it) and dd2 was UP ALL NIGHT. I'm quite sure it was from the sugar.

I think that you really aren't healed untill you can eat all foods (at least in small ammounts) w/o a reaction. Just being able to eat scd food w/o reaction can put you still a year away from healed (according to Elaine)


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?

I agree with everybody else--I don't really get the point of substituting, unless it's a nutrition thing. If so I'd either go with raw goat's milk yogurt if you can get it, or else try to get bone broths & maybe herbal teas/infusions into her for the vitamins and minerals in them. Or I suppose any liquid would work if she just needs to suck. If it's a comfort thing, I don't know what you can do besides lots of cuddling. Does she have a lovey? When my DD is hurt/upset she prefers to snuggle with her big stuffed pig (that thing is half as big as she is!) and suck her thumb instead of nursing (I hold her while she does it, of course).


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
If it worked it will be very tart. I know mine doesn't seem fully "developed" until after it has chilled. At that point it its virtually indistinguishable from regular old yogurt.

I don't think it worked then. Can you tell me how you make yours? Have you ever used probiotic powder as a starter, or what do you use?


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## chasmyn (Feb 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
What about oatmeal to help heal the gut? Those of tyou that have tried it, how have your bodies reacted to oatmeal after being on SCD? Is it something to try once I am well on my way to being healed? (When will that be???







)

I triedd oatmeal once and it trned me into a raging maniac. Seriously, I was fuming and highly irritable and just in this rage. No more for me!!! However, I can eat a slice of buttered dark sourdough rye without incident.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Because I ate some wheat w/out thinking and dd's symptoms came back w/a vengeance.

I also had 2 peices of dd1's wheat free birthday cake on Sat. (still, sugar in it) and dd2 was UP ALL NIGHT. I'm quite sure it was from the sugar.

Could there be gluten in it? Sometimes it can be a gluten reaction, and there is gluten in so many things.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I don't think it worked then. Can you tell me how you make yours? Have you ever used probiotic powder as a starter, or what do you use?

I use progurt starter.
Mine is:
2 cans coconut milk, 2 tablespoons sweetener (agave, maple, honey etc) 2 tablespoons thickener (gelatin, agar agar etc.) 2 teaspoons vanilla extract or 1 bean. I use 1/4 tsp of starter (which is twice the rec. for this volume.) I put in starter at 105 and incubate at 110 for 10 hours.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Okay mamas I need your advice.

IF I try to partially wean dd, what do I substitute with? I gave dd1 cow's milk. (Don't know that I'd do that again, but it comforted her at the time.)

I have not been following any info. about goat's milk. Is this illegal on SCD? Is there caesin in it? Should I try raw cow's milk or store-bought goat's milk (I don't know of a source here) or neither?

i was concerned about this when i found out i had leaky gut. my ND was of the opinion that BM was much better than any other alternative, in spite of my leaky gut. he encouraged me to keep nursing. he reminds me still that breastmilk is perfect food in the sense that it has already been secreted, making it easier on the digestive system.

look at it this way... if you keep nursing, you will be less likely to get complacent about what you're eating. in getting complacent, you might think you're healed when you really aren't - and then you'd eat illegals and undo all the healing you've done. am i making any sense?


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

firefaery made a comment some while back about d'adamo's new direction with the genome and such.

the newest thing is "nutrigenomics" where one considers the impact of the genome on nutritional status and effect of nutriceuticals (supplements). the nutriceutical industry finally "gets" it. we are each the product of our genes. and though we are 99% identical, that 1% difference is vast. that's why not every diet will work the same in each one of us. if you can get it (or if you want it, PM/email me), a good article on this topic is:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...526993b62cc70b
Lydia Afman PhD and Michael Müller PhD
Nutrigenomics: From Molecular Nutrition to Prevention of Disease
Journal of the American Dietetic Association
Volume 106, Issue 4 , April 2006, Pages 569-576

Abstract

Until recently, nutrition research concentrated on nutrient deficiencies and impairment of health. The advent of genomics-interpreted broadly as a suite of high throughput technologies for the generation, processing, and application of scientific information about the composition and functions of genomes-has created unprecedented opportunities for increasing our understanding of how nutrients modulate gene and protein expression and ultimately influence cellular and organismal metabolism. Nutritional genomics (nutrigenomics), the junction between health, diet, and genomics, can be seen as the combination of molecular nutrition and genomics. The diverse tissue and organ-specific effects of bioactive dietary components include gene-expression patterns (transcriptome); organization of the chromatin (epigenome); protein-expression patterns, including posttranslational modifications (proteome); as well as metabolite profiles (metabolome). Nutrigenomics will promote an increased understanding of how nutrition influences metabolic pathways and homeostatic control, how this regulation is disturbed in the early phases of diet-related disease, and the extent to which individual sensitizing genotypes contribute to such diseases. Eventually, nutrigenomics will lead to evidence-based dietary intervention strategies for restoring health and fitness and for preventing diet-related disease. In this review, we provide a brief overview of nutrigenomics from our point of view by describing current strategies, future opportunities, and challenges.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Also, Annikate, didn't JaneS constantly rue her choice to wean her DS, thinking it would make him better, but only made him that much worse? Not trying to guilt you into anything, but I am with FF in this.


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## artisticat (Jul 28, 2004)

Question for all you wise ones.

Dd has a horrible rash on her vaginal area. There are huge bumps in and around everywhere down there. Sometimes just the bumps are red and sometimes the whole area looks enflamed. She spent all day Saturday playing outside at my mom's ranch and getting dirty and wet and had a lot of miini accidents and peed her pants that night. So sat around in wet clothes a lot throughout the day.

She is pottytrained, but has small uh-oh gotta go accidents.
She has been peeing a lot lately (but she also drinks a lot of water).
Our diet is horrible right now.
I just weaned her last month.

Is this just a yeast rash? This is probably her second bottom rash in her life. The bumps just sorta freak me out thinking it isn't yeast. These are huge like mosquito bites or something.

She is itching like crazy and in such discomfort. Mostly in the middle of the night. What can stop the itchies? I know how horrible rashes can be down there as I had some mysterious rash when pregnant for her and couldn't find anything to get rid of the intense itching.

Can Chicken Pox start in the vaginal area? I did notice two spots (red raised bug bite looking spots) on her arm today and don't know if they are new or not.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Annikate--you add reuteri to your yogurt when you make it, right? Do you/have you ever added any other strains of probiotics at the same time (besides the regular yogurt starter)? I'm trying to figure out if I can mix two different probiotic powders as starters for my coconut milk yogurt.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

My dd gets that rash with gluten exposure. It's awful/ It gets all red with a couple of huge red bumps that eventually look pussy (can take up to a week, but it always happens.) Colloidal silver always works, as does rescue remedy cream. HTH.

It could also be yeast, but that is why I use colloidal silver. IT deals with fungal, bacterial or viral causes. You don't need to know exactly what it is, and it will keep it from getting further infected.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
Also, Annikate, didn't JaneS constantly rue her choice to wean her DS, thinking it would make him better, but only made him that much worse? Not trying to guilt you into anything, but I am with FF in this.

Yes, and I keep thinking of this.

DD doesn't have a problem w/the 24 hr. yogurt. Maybe I'll give her that.









I'm only in the very beginning stages of this anyway . . . just kinda thinking out loud here.

Thanks everybody.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Annikate--you add reuteri to your yogurt when you make it, right? Do you/have you ever added any other strains of probiotics at the same time (besides the regular yogurt starter)? I'm trying to figure out if I can mix two different probiotic powders as starters for my coconut milk yogurt.

Yes, I'm now adding the stuff I got from Custom Probiotics and the reuteri. The CS stuff made it THICK THICK. It's good.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

What can I do/take to minimize die-off? DD has been sleeping horribly the past few nights and I think it is because of die-off (at least I hope it's die-off) from the kefir sodas I've been drinking. With the amount of stomach rumbling and gas I'm having, she's probably getting quite a bit of toxins. Vitamin C and pascalite clay are good for mopping up toxins, right?

This is more or less what my tongue looks like now...does that look normal?
http://images.ask.com/fr?q=White+Ton...age%253D2&qt=0

(The first picture at the top of the page.)


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Which one







What a wierd site, and Im someone who's been studying my tongue for 3 mos







I think the one that says "healthy tongue" looks healthy







I think the chinese medicine interpretation is pretty accurate; that tongue condition mimics digestion, but I dont really know. Im glad Im not the only one though


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## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

So, what does really stinky pee in my almonst 5 mo old mean? It comes and goes, so I don't think it's the diapers. My mom commented the other day (without prompting) that it smelled alkaline, but I have no idea what she was basing that on (and I got distracted and forgot to follow up with her). It does seem to be linked to a generally not-so-happy mood in her and a hard time sleeping. Could this be die-off? Is it related to acid/akaline stuff I might be eating? Oh, just when I feel like I'm getting a handle on scratching the surface of understanding all the gut healing stuff another thing comes along . . .

Can I whine for just a minute? This is so hard.







: I am SCD, but with no dairy or eggs. I was at a conference last week for work that was out of town, and I had to eat there most of the time (no time or place to cook even if I had brought my own stuff). I got to take the baby along (or I wouldn't have gone), but I know I got some dairy through butter. I questioned everything, but one bite into a piece of chicken one night and I could tell it had butter on it. Well, of course the little one reacted and, alas, I guess no healing yet (yeah, I know its early, but I really need to see progress to stay motivated!).

How do you mommas do this that have been at it for years? I feel like I am falling apart trying to find time to work (I woh 50+ hours a week), meal plan, grocery shop, cook, research all this stuff, and oh - yeah, see my dh and kiddos. DH does what I ask him to, but I have to do all the meal planning and research and make very detailed lists if he is going to shop or cook. Agggggghhhh. On the upside, I can tell this diet is making me feel better because despite getting very little sleep, I still have realitively more energy than I've ever had before. The most frustrating thing is that its all so trial and error, and I haven't found anyone (chrio, naturopath, etc) around here that I feel like I can trust to help me. If anyone knows of anyone in Atlanta, let me know . . .


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LovinLiviLou* 
On the upside, I can tell this diet is making me feel better because despite getting very little sleep, I still have realitively more energy than I've ever had before. The most frustrating thing is that its all so trial and error, and I haven't found anyone (chrio, naturopath, etc) around here that I feel like I can trust to help me. If anyone knows of anyone in Atlanta, let me know . . .

Me too - - that's how I can tell this diet is good for me too. I get entirely too little sleep yet I am functioning (sort of







) and I've not been sick w/ even a sniffle since starting SCD.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Does kombucha give anyone else a wicked headache?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

This candida diet is messing up my immune system. I've only had one bout of stomach flu and one of regular flu in the last ten years, and I hadn't had a cold since I was a couple of months pregnant with DD. But in the last four months I've had the stomach flu, a bad cold, and now I have the flu







:


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

That may mean it's working quite well. If your immune system has been on overdrive fighting the yeast, it would have prevented illness, but at a cost. IT *could* be that your body is sort of resetting itself and therefore you are rebuilding the immune system by catching all this stuff. Like people who have autoimmune issues often don't get sick. The body is so very busy attacking everything it can find it easily fends off viruses and things. That doesn't mean the person is healthy.

I'm a glass is half full kinda gal


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Haven't read the replies, but that sounds like a yeast rash to me. I would get some otc anti-fungal creme (clotramizole is best, the others can be too harsh on the skin). There are natural remedies, but with such a big inflammation and probably a lot of pain, I'd be inclined to get rid of it as quickly as possible.

Off to read more. . .

Quote:


Originally Posted by *artisticat* 
Question for all you wise ones.

Dd has a horrible rash on her vaginal area. There are huge bumps in and around everywhere down there. Sometimes just the bumps are red and sometimes the whole area looks enflamed. She spent all day Saturday playing outside at my mom's ranch and getting dirty and wet and had a lot of miini accidents and peed her pants that night. So sat around in wet clothes a lot throughout the day.

She is pottytrained, but has small uh-oh gotta go accidents.
She has been peeing a lot lately (but she also drinks a lot of water).
Our diet is horrible right now.
I just weaned her last month.

Is this just a yeast rash? This is probably her second bottom rash in her life. The bumps just sorta freak me out thinking it isn't yeast. These are huge like mosquito bites or something.

She is itching like crazy and in such discomfort. Mostly in the middle of the night. What can stop the itchies? I know how horrible rashes can be down there as I had some mysterious rash when pregnant for her and couldn't find anything to get rid of the intense itching.

Can Chicken Pox start in the vaginal area? I did notice two spots (red raised bug bite looking spots) on her arm today and don't know if they are new or not.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I wrote before about how my dd started to react with a bigger flare up of eczema, even when I was strictly soy and dairy free. Well, I thought it was eczema, but it really was an awful yeast rash that had taken over the site on the back of her leg. It was awful and raw and starting to get infected. So, I bit the bullet and put clotramizole on it (I'd been trying to avoid pharmaceuticals, but it was getting out of control). The rash went away. I figured out that the new probiotics and enzymes I'd gotten had sugar in them (I didn't even think of it since they're an SCD legal brand, though a new product). So, now that the yeast is mostly wiped out the eczema that remains is VERY mild. I'm so relieved.

So, we're still working on healing the gut, but i'm not so obsessed by her skin and worried about infections any more.

I bought the yeast product from www.candidasupport.org Anyone here heard ot it? I'm hopeful that with something to work on the yeast and doing SCD to heal our yeast damaged guts, we'll overcome this.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
That may mean it's working quite well. If your immune system has been on overdrive fighting the yeast, it would have prevented illness, but at a cost. IT *could* be that your body is sort of resetting itself and therefore you are rebuilding the immune system by catching all this stuff. Like people who have autoimmune issues often don't get sick. The body is so very busy attacking everything it can find it easily fends off viruses and things. That doesn't mean the person is healthy.

I'm a glass is half full kinda gal









You're probably right...sure sucks though!

I wonder if that means DD's immune system is working really well or really poorly--she hasn't gotten sick at all. This diet is helping me, but it hasn't done squat for DD. I wish I could figure out what I need to do to heal her. Maybe the coconut milk yogurt will help--the batch I made yesterday is definitely yogurt, although it's not super tart.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Anyone want to give me their opinion on this:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...46#post6366046


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Anyone want to give me their opinion on this:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...46#post6366046


when my ds started eating solids, lots of what he ate came out looking much the way it went in. over time, he became more efficient at digesting stuff and as he got more teeth, he could actually chew it. now there are a significantly smaller number of foods that look the same going in as coming out (corn is a biggie - i always know when they have corn at daycare) - still a few foods though, most notably the ones he has trouble chewing. i don't view it as a problem with his gut as much as it is a part of growing up. then again, i could be wrong.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
when my ds started eating solids, lots of what he ate came out looking much the way it went in. over time, he became more efficient at digesting stuff and as he got more teeth, he could actually chew it. now there are a significantly smaller number of foods that look the same going in as coming out (corn is a biggie - i always know when they have corn at daycare) - still a few foods though, most notably the ones he has trouble chewing. i don't view it as a problem with his gut as much as it is a part of growing up. then again, i could be wrong.









If she wasn't already having gut problems I probably wouldn't worry about it, but since she is, and since she acts slightly constipated and has multi-colored (mucus-y?) stools, I don't want to do anything that could make her worse. There are foods (like corn or raw carrots) that I wouldn't expect her to digest, of course, but I don't give her those.

Thanks for your opinions Annikate and Pookietooth--I think I'll cut out the self-feeding for the time being and see if her constipation and poops improve. Besides, I'm sure coconut milk yogurt and coconut oil are much more healing foods than avocado!


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

caedmyn - your plan sounds good. in truth, i also avoid giving my ds stuff (like corn!) that i know he doesn't digest well. what's the point of stuffing food into him that will only occupy space and not give any nutrients. what he eats at lunch at daycare is another story and not something i can easily control (dairy-free is hard enough in this setting).

have you tried giving your dd any type of meat? of everything ds eats, meat is the most easily digested. you could do ground turkey - then you'd have the option of feeding her or letting her self feed.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

caedmyn- Are you sure you are sick and not going through die-off? had the 'flu' when I first went on SCD. Sorry your DD isn't sleeping well, Nolan had a tough couple of weeks when I restarted the diet, waking several times a night.

How do you make kefir soda? I am going to get some water kefir grains and a kombucha scoby soon.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Its about time for an uplifting success story. Or at least progress?

Anyone?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Well, I don't know if this counts...but I was reaaly starting to lose it due to the fact that my ds2 only has bm's every eight to ten days. And then, when he does it's just one. It's not like he goes all day long-it's just once and thaen we wait eight to ten more days.

I knew he was significantly dairy and soy allergic and we suspect eggs as well. I was upset because I had done so MUCH healing over the last year and a half. I kept chasing potential allergens and with no success. I finally went to see a PT who does CST. He is phenomenal (he was the guy that literally fixed my dd-my mom is convinced she wouldn't have made it without him.)

He did the assessment and asked if he had ever had a choking episode-in fact he had. After an accidental dairy exposure he had so much mucus he choked and couldn't remove it himself, I had to pull it out of his throat. He said that the lack of pooping was a result of him holding and guarding his esophogus-consistent with the aftermath of choking. Because of this happening so early the nerves weren't exactly wired correctly. The who digestive system was basically "on hold." So now we are working on that.

It's success in that I feel like we have answers and can move forward. It also isn't that big of a deal (I mean it is to him-but in the grand scheme of things nothing's WRONG.)

As far as dietary stuff, we're plugging along. I feel alot better than I have in awhile now that grains are gone. Anybody else?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Why does it seem that the longer I'm doing this, the more questions I have about it? Want to indulge me in a possibly silly question. As I lie awake last night again, I was pondering this:

If our guts are supposed to be 100% in a perfect world (yk, no proteins getting through, no leaky gut, no problems w/digestion, no gas, perfect bms etc.) then what about all the recommendations that people give to nursing moms about supps to take to help their babes.

For instance: MT recommended magnesium for mamas to take in the afternoon to help their babes sleep at night. Lots of people tout CLO for mamas to make their b'milk excellent for nursing babes, I could go on with more examples but you get the point.

So. . . IF we had perfect guts, then all of this would be a moot point. Our babes wouldn't benefit anyway.

Right?

HAve any of you ever wondered if there is anyone out there on this planet that has a perfect *healed* gut? I mean, really, is there ANYone out there that can eat ANYTHING at ANY TIME without even a teeensy weeensy reaction of some sort?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
caedmyn - your plan sounds good. in truth, i also avoid giving my ds stuff (like corn!) that i know he doesn't digest well. what's the point of stuffing food into him that will only occupy space and not give any nutrients. what he eats at lunch at daycare is another story and not something i can easily control (dairy-free is hard enough in this setting).

have you tried giving your dd any type of meat? of everything ds eats, meat is the most easily digested. you could do ground turkey - then you'd have the option of feeding her or letting her self feed.

I don't know Jennifer, I'd advise against meat (except maybe lamb.) Meat proteins are usually tough for little tummies to digest. I made the mistake of trying to give dd meat too soon. I wish I had waited.

Lamb is supposed to be the most easily digested meat. My dd LOVES it too.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Why does it seem that the longer I'm doing this, the more questions I have about it? Want to indulge me in a possibly silly question. As I lie awake last night again, I was pondering this:

If our guts are supposed to be 100% in a perfect world (yk, no proteins getting through, no leaky gut, no problems w/digestion, no gas, perfect bms etc.) then what about all the recommendations that people give to nursing moms about supps to take to help their babes.

For instance: MT recommended magnesium for mamas to take in the afternoon to help their babes sleep at night. Lots of people tout CLO for mamas to make their b'milk excellent for nursing babes, I could go on with more examples but you get the point.

So. . . IF we had perfect guts, then all of this would be a moot point. Our babes wouldn't benefit anyway.

Right?

HAve any of you ever wondered if there is anyone out there on this planet that has a perfect *healed* gut? I mean, really, is there ANYone out there that can eat ANYTHING at ANY TIME without even a teeensy weeensy reaction of some sort?










I have wondered this myself. I will say that I know TWO people who did the immunolab blood test just because (we have a practitioner here who is immunolab crazy) and had no allergens whatsoever. I had always maintained that everyone must have some reactions in this modern world. Apparently that isn't the case. It is a really wonderful test and I trust it. It's just weird.

The magnesium isn't meant to leak through the gut, a mamma with magnesium in her diet will have magnesium in the milk. Same with omega 3's and DHA. IF you have it in your nutritional stores, you wlll have it in your milk. It's a separate issue from the proteins leaking into the blood stream


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
I have wondered this myself. I will say that I know TWO people who did the immunolab blood test just because (we have a practitioner here who is immunolab crazy) and had no allergens whatsoever. I had always maintained that everyone must have some reactions in this modern world. Apparently that isn't the case. It is a really wonderful test and I trust it. It's just weird.

The magnesium isn't meant to leak through the gut, a mamma with magnesium in her diet will have magnesium in the milk. Same with omega 3's and DHA. IF you have it in your nutritional stores, you wlll have it in your milk. It's a separate issue from the proteins leaking into the blood stream

So how does the good stuff get through then? Through the bloodstream?

I am no scientist - can you tell?









Jennifer, where are you?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Nutrients are absorbed in the intestines through the villi and microvilli (that is why it's such bad news when they are damaged.) There is a big difference between things leaking into the bloodstream (which are generally proteins) and the uptake of nutrients into the bloodstream through the proper channels.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
caedmyn- Are you sure you are sick and not going through die-off? had the 'flu' when I first went on SCD. Sorry your DD isn't sleeping well, Nolan had a tough couple of weeks when I restarted the diet, waking several times a night.

How do you make kefir soda? I am going to get some water kefir grains and a kombucha scoby soon.

It could be die-off I suppose--I do have a very upset stomach. It seems like being freezing cold all day would be the flu and not die-off, though









DD actually went to be at a normal time last night--I don't know if the vitamin C/pascalite clay helped her sleep, or if she was just tired from not getting much sleep the previous 24 hours.

There's a thread on water kefirs in the Traditional Foods forum...basically you use 4 Tbsp. sweetner (anything but honey) to 1 qt. of non-chlorinated water, and add 2-4 Tbsp. grains to that. Then you can either add dried fruit, fruit juice, or slices of citrus fruit (with the rind removed) for flavoring. I like to add 1/2 a cup of lemon juice, although I've had good results with adding slices of 1/2 a lemon, too. You can also keferize straight juice, or coconut milk. The coconut milk kefir is really good with a little vanilla and stevia added--I stuck it in the freezer for a while and it was like a tangy vanilla milkshake.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Re: bf'ing and "leaky gut"--this is what I wonder: if flavors from foods we eat get into the breastmilk, how do they do that? Are they "leaking" somehow? And if flavors get through, wouldn't it be possible for other parts of food to get through, too, even if your gut is okay?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I have given DD meat and she doesn't digest that, either. I didn't try ground meat, though. I've thought about egg yolks but since eggs are a common allergen I'm a little reluctant to give her any.

Success story: the anti-candida diet has actually helped me quite a bit. I generally don't have problems with low blood sugar any more, my acne is almost completely clear, and I can go for hours without eating instead of needing to eat every couple of hours. I had a fungal infection on the bottom of my foot that's gone away, too. Plus my moods are more stable now and I feel better in general. I still have a ways to go, though--my digestion still isn't all that great I don't think and I still have gas. And the diet hasn't helped DD.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Here's my update, not so good.

So Ive had this feeling of something stuck in my throat for two months, along ith a burning throat. I figured it was yeast related, and was feeling like Im getting worse as time goes on. 3 wks ago I developed heartburn, extreme pressure and pain in my chest with burping all day. Then I got my period (a whole other story) and the symptoms improved but are very much there. I finally went to see an ENT yesterday to rule out anything serious, and as I suspected, I have gerd







: Now, the *treatment* for gerd is acid reducers! Guess what yeast love, no acid. One of the side effects of acid meds is yeast infections. There are several foods I should not eat with gerd; fat!!!!!!, onions, garlic. Gues what my diet has huge ammounts of? Right.

So on one hand this could all be a conseuence of the anti-candida diet (I have never eaten so much meat, fat, onions and garlic) and the gerd will reslove when I adjust my diet - someday. But until then I dont want to take acid reducers, and the pain is no small thing.

That means that my yeast symptoms have improved. My tongue, ears, and eyelid rash are slightly better this month. *Just* treating the yeast now seems so straightforward, and I wish that's all I had to do. There's slim relationship, that I can find, btwn yeast and gerd (although there is actually a whole book I found on amazon about GI troubles all being caused by candida). But if thats true, then why would I develop GI troubles after starting to treat candida! Im numb. What can I eat?

Does nyone know what foods trigger a greater release of acid in the stomach? I think its meat and fat, which would account for this. I wonder if I could start eating more soaked nuts? I know they're supposed to be hard to digest - why again?

I read yet another source yesterday about yeast liking alkalinity in the intestines (good bugs produce lactic acid, which keep yeast under control). So I dont know if its possible to alkalize ones body except for the gi tract? Just thought Id throw that out there.

So my current project is how to manage the gerd for a year or two until the yeast is better (that doesnt make sense ... forevere I guess)







:







:







:

fwiw, Ive never had any of these symptoms before, so I (that is to say Dh) is hopeful that its all diet related.

Not really progress, exactly, although maybe a little with the yeast (knock wood)


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

saskiamom--







I'm sorry you're having a rough time right now. I did a quick search for natural remedies for GERD, and one that seems to be popular is apple cider vinegar--2Tbsp of apple cider vinegar in a little bit of water before or after meals. It couldn't hurt to try it. I also saw some recommendations for taking pancreatic enzymes or papain or bromelain, or also Betaine HCL (which may be a pancreatic enzymes, I'm not sure).

This is totally my opinion (and completely contrary to Bee's of course) but if you've been doing the candida diet for a few months and aren't really seeing any results, maybe you need to make some changes to it. Have you thought about doing some other things to increase the good bacteria in your body, like maybe coconut milk yogurt, or even (homemade) dairy yogurt if you have access to raw milk and do well with dairy products? Or you could try water kefirs. I'm still not 100% sure if they are helping me as opposed to feeding the yeast, but assuming they are helping, they must be pretty effective because they are kicking my butt with the die-off (far more than anything else I've done).


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
So how does the good stuff get through then? Through the bloodstream?

I am no scientist - can you tell?









Jennifer, where are you?









what firefaery said.

for the record, my training is in theoretical plant population genetics ("in my computer, there are plants that have genes... ") so even though I can read the science literature, doesn't mean it is necessarily any easier!

so in addition to nutrients being secreted (remember - breastmilk is secreted!) into breastmilk, i'm guessing that trace (or maybe not-so-trace?) amounts of mama hormones get in there as well. my cycles have started coming back (though still really irregular - kinda wonky actually) - when AF drops in, i get horrendous gas regardless of the food i put in my mouth. ds gets the same issues at the same time. we're a stinky pair









then i noticed this thing the other day. ds has a little spot of eczema just below the corner of his mouth (in the drool path). it is popping up exactly 1 yr since his first round of eczema. but then i just recently shifted my oils a bit (i decreased EPO dramatically, but i don't like the result, so i'm going to go back to a higher level) - so maybe that's it? but then it is also in a place where it could be just irritation from zipper on the new winter jacket. this morning dh noticed that a tiny patch (on his own arm) near his elbow was itchy again - also 1 yr since it popped up last winter (same spot pops up this time every year).

good news, since someone asked - ds digests mostly everything that goes in (in spite of the questionable stuff they feed at daycare). he has much much less gas (except when AF visits me!) AND - the best part - he sleeps on his own mattress beside me (instead of between dh and i) for most of the night and seems to need fewer night nursings (well, again, except when AF visits me - then he needs to latch-on to get through gas pains). i think i had 5 solid hours of sleep last night even though ds decided not to eat any solids at dinner and just wanted to nurse all evening instead (which also shows that solids don't necessarily help with sleep). he even went to bed 45 minutes early. he's now regularly eating kefir with a splash of granola and a drizzle of honey. we went for a month where he refused breakfast entirely, so this is a major deal for us. he's also talking - a few (or more) new words every day. one of his younger classmates was faster to pick up on this whole talking thing but he hadn't been battling with head congestion (his parents went the ear intubation route instead of diet) - so i'm delighted ds was able to catch up.

i did do a really really dumb thing 2 nights ago. i thought it would be a good idea to give ds a little bit of bone broth as a bedtime mineral snack. ugh - between the broth and the almost constant nursing, by 2am he was drenched, the top sheet on the mattress was drenched, i was getting drenched.... no more bone broths right before bed.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Re: bf'ing and "leaky gut"--this is what I wonder: if flavors from foods we eat get into the breastmilk, how do they do that? Are they "leaking" somehow? And if flavors get through, wouldn't it be possible for other parts of food to get through, too, even if your gut is okay?


Well if you eat a lot of garlic you will smell like garlic. I don't think that is leaky gut.

Also a study found that babies are more receptive to foods mom ate while pg than the ones she ate while bfing. (sorry no clue about a link on that one. I think it was carrot juice that was tested)


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Just wanted to share a quick update on us. DD is taking her first nap of the week so I don't have long to be on here.

DD is on week two of the herbs to get rid of her staf. I'm still not seeing any improvement in her except that she can now eat some applesauce (to take them in). We did a therapeutic bath for her sleep last friday. She stopped napping and started waking up at 4 am every day. Yesterday I finally got her in to her chiro and her neck was really messed up (first time ever) and her Dr gave a homeopathic remedy that was supposed to reverse the bath. Last night no waking and today she is napping so one of those worked but we are back to square one with the sleep issues.

I'm waiting for the full moon to start taking my remedy for my parasite (actually 5 days before it is when I'm to start that is the begining of next week.) I'm feeling like I am in limbo right now, hopeful that this will finally be the answer and also fearful that I have put off healing even longer if this doesn't work (plus I'm cheating badly w/chocolate since I got these results.







)

Dh has begun cheating on the diet fairly regularly although his meals are still usually legal. This means that we get to put up with his super stinky farting all evening every day he cheats.







: But he has no digestion issues.







: Anyone got anything that can prove to him that stinky farts aren't normal???? (besides the fact that they disappeared while he was eating strict SCD for months?)


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## LovinLiviLou (Aug 8, 2004)

I found this on another website - Anybody ever try making cocunut yogurt this way?

_Blend 1 cup of coconut meat (from a young coconut, found in Asian Markets) with one cup of the young coconut water. Add 1/2 teaspoon of probiotic powder. Blend the mixture until smooth. Pour into a sealable container and allow mixture to stand covered with a paper towel for three hours. This process allows the mixture to culture._

It only says to culture for 3 hours, but since coconut meat is SCD legal, I'm thinking it would be SCD compliant. Is my logic faulty here?


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Dh has begun cheating on the diet fairly regularly although his meals are still usually legal. This means that we get to put up with his super stinky farting all evening every day he cheats.







: But he has no digestion issues.







: Anyone got anything that can prove to him that stinky farts aren't normal???? (besides the fact that they disappeared while he was eating strict SCD for months?)


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Well if you eat a lot of garlic you will smell like garlic. I don't think that is leaky gut.

Also a study found that babies are more receptive to foods mom ate while pg than the ones she ate while bfing. (sorry no clue about a link on that one. I think it was carrot juice that was tested)

I've read that before too. And I also wonder about this. I don't think caedmyn means *smelling* of garlic though. DD1 LOVED b'milk (more than usual) whenever I ate garlic.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Well guess what?

Maybe I didn't *leak* the wheat into dd after all. . . .

Today I came home to find dd sucking on a dog biscuit. She LOVES our 91 pound mutt and carries those bones around in her little fists every day.








They are made mostly of WHEAT FLOUR.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

annikate - at least your dog is normal. my male cat is allergic to fish, seafood, beef, pork, and all the usual fillers (wheat, corn, maybe rice). so the cats eat duck and green pea cat food because the male kitty probably has a leaky gut that i just don't have the energy, time or finances to figure out.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Well guess what?

Maybe I didn't *leak* the wheat into dd after all. . . .

Today I came home to find dd sucking on a dog biscuit. She LOVES our 91 pound mutt and carries those bones around in her little fists every day.








They are made mostly of WHEAT FLOUR.

They will find their carbs any way they can get them!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - at least your dog is normal. my male cat is allergic to fish, seafood, beef, pork, and all the usual fillers (wheat, corn, maybe rice). so the cats eat duck and green pea cat food because the male kitty probably has a leaky gut that i just don't have the energy, time or finances to figure out.

We figured out years ago that one of our cats is 'allergic' to the nutritional yeast they add to most cat foods. Now I believe he has a yeast infection and leaky gut. And like you I do not have the energy to heal the cat right now too.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Thanks for posting your progress 'reports'.I am so up and down emotionally dealing with this diet and healing. Sometimes I feel like I have come a long way and then I regress, or have 'die-off', or make a mistake that I feel utterly guilty for.

DS went to the CST yesterday. He let her work on him for 45 min! She really clicked with both of us, it was nice to have her acknowledge my hard work with the diet. SHe worked on releasing the bones in his skull that were jammed tightly together (you could feel the heat radiating from his head.) She also worked to help his slight bowleggedness. She said he would keep having 'releases' in the next 4 or so days and he has had some major ones. We didn't hear a peep out of him last night but he had been coughing/choking up phlem all night, his crib was covered in it. He did it a few times this morning and it scared the &*^# out of me. He took a 3.5 hr nap this afternoon







, DH and I were scared he stopped breathing so we went in and the door opening woke him. He has also been sighing a lot and getting the hiccups. He also had no appatite today for BM or solids. His body was concentrating on healing, I hope.

I need to vent about our horrible check-up with the regular ped. today. She was horrified with his rashy face and perscribed Bactroban, kenalog, and milder cortisone cream. She tried to scare me saying the rash would scar his face if I didn't use these creams immediately







: . Scare tactics don't work on me. Then she went on to the vaccine subject (ds is not getting them, ever) saying 'your daycare provider is ok with that? And the other parents are too? Then she went on to the flu shot, telling me that if I don't get it I will surely bring home the flu to DS. At least she gave us a referral to the allergy clinic, which is the primary reason I went to her. I cant' believe that a doctor feels like she has the right to treat me like that. I think it is time to try a new ped, although they are all probably the same at a military health facility.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

saskiasmom-I am sorry to hear about your GURD. Do you currently take any digestive enzymes? How long have you been strictly doing Bea's diet?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - at least your dog is normal. my male cat is allergic to fish, seafood, beef, pork, and all the usual fillers (wheat, corn, maybe rice). so the cats eat duck and green pea cat food because the male kitty probably has a leaky gut that i just don't have the energy, time or finances to figure out.

I had a kitty that I believe had leaky gut, probably caused by vaxes







She had a gum disease and needed cortisone shots every month or her mouth hurt so much she would yowl and hardly eat. I tried putting her on a whole foods diet but she wouldn't eat the food (and she was living at my parents' house in a different state at that point cuz DH hated her so I couldn't monitor her as I would have liked to). I finally had my mom take her to a naturopathic vet who did acupuncture on her and prescribed some homeopathic and herbal meds...we ended up taking the meds back though because they were too expensive. My poor kitty died a couple of weeks later







I don't know if the acupuncture was just too much for her system or if she was already headed that way but it was probably for the best as I know she was suffering. She was only four years old.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Thanks for posting your progress 'reports'.I am so up and down emotionally dealing with this diet and healing. Sometimes I feel like I have come a long way and then I regress, or have 'die-off', or make a mistake that I feel utterly guilty for.

DS went to the CST yesterday. He let her work on him for 45 min! She really clicked with both of us, it was nice to have her acknowledge my hard work with the diet. SHe worked on releasing the bones in his skull that were jammed tightly together (you could feel the heat radiating from his head.) She also worked to help his slight bowleggedness. She said he would keep having 'releases' in the next 4 or so days and he has had some major ones. We didn't hear a peep out of him last night but he had been coughing/choking up phlem all night, his crib was covered in it. He did it a few times this morning and it scared the &*^# out of me. He took a 3.5 hr nap this afternoon







, DH and I were scared he stopped breathing so we went in and the door opening woke him. He has also been sighing a lot and getting the hiccups. He also had no appatite today for BM or solids. His body was concentrating on healing, I hope.

I need to vent about our horrible check-up with the regular ped. today. She was horrified with his rashy face and perscribed Bactroban, kenalog, and milder cortisone cream. She tried to scare me saying the rash would scar his face if I didn't use these creams immediately







: . Scare tactics don't work on me. Then she went on to the vaccine subject (ds is not getting them, ever) saying 'your daycare provider is ok with that? And the other parents are too? Then she went on to the flu shot, telling me that if I don't get it I will surely bring home the flu to DS. At least she gave us a referral to the allergy clinic, which is the primary reason I went to her. I cant' believe that a doctor feels like she has the right to treat me like that. I think it is time to try a new ped, although they are all probably the same at a military health facility.

I am really up and down on this healing business, too--especially when I stop and think about how little DD has really healed.

Your CST story scares me--I had a CST session done last Saturday (nothing major going on with me) and am planning on getting one done on DD in two weeks. She is two weeks younger than your DS...I hope she doesn't have major head issues! But on the other hand, if she does, CST will probably help her heal. Just out of curiousity, was your DS a hospital birth and did he have a hard birth or forceps or anything like that?

My DH is military (USAF) and he says that if any of the base doctors or nurses ever give me a hard time about not vaxing DD I should tell them to stop harassing me or I (or he) will contact their supervisor. That might be something you could do if you feel comfortable doing it. Oh, and you could have mentioned to her that you know someone (me!) whose DH got the flu shot (Flu Mist) and gave the flu to them







:


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
He has also been sighing a lot and getting the hiccups. He also had no appatite today for BM or solids. His body was concentrating on healing, I hope.

every time my ds gets hiccups - that is, hiccups every so often during a period of days, nothing before and nothing after - he usually has a growth spurt. on the other hand, my grandmother told my mom that a baby who hiccuped was cold.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I am really up and down on this healing business, too--especially when I stop and think about how little DD has really healed.

Your CST story scares me--I had a CST session done last Saturday (nothing major going on with me) and am planning on getting one done on DD in two weeks. She is two weeks younger than your DS...I hope she doesn't have major head issues! But on the other hand, if she does, CST will probably help her heal. Just out of curiousity, was your DS a hospital birth and did he have a hard birth or forceps or anything like that?

My DH is military (USAF) and he says that if any of the base doctors or nurses ever give me a hard time about not vaxing DD I should tell them to stop harassing me or I (or he) will contact their supervisor. That might be something you could do if you feel comfortable doing it. Oh, and you could have mentioned to her that you know someone (me!) whose DH got the flu shot (Flu Mist) and gave the flu to them







:

DS was a hospital birth, no forceps or anything. BUT, he was 9lbs 12 oz and has a BIG head. It took me 3 hrs of pushing to get him out. It really is no wonder his head got so squeezed. The CST session didn't scare me, or the realeases, I am just amazed at how much he has reacted. We are keeping a close eye on him. I forgot to add that he had mucous in his poop, it looked like thick spider webs, very strange.

I get flustered around regular DRs and have a hard time asserting myself. I need to get over this because I have strong convictions and am confident I am doing the right thing. Ahh, the military system is so ackward, I am enlisted and all the DRs are officers. So, yes ma'am, I will not be getting those shots...


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Wow Nolansmum, That's quite a CST story.

DD reacts by not sleeping for about 2 weeks and then she settles in. (somewhat.) I do know it helps her though. I'm going to try it myself soon!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - at least your dog is normal. my male cat is allergic to fish, seafood, beef, pork, and all the usual fillers (wheat, corn, maybe rice). so the cats eat duck and green pea cat food because the male kitty probably has a leaky gut that i just don't have the energy, time or finances to figure out.

Ummm yea all our pets are on grain free diets too.







:


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
DS was a hospital birth, no forceps or anything. BUT, he was 9lbs 12 oz and has a BIG head. It took me 3 hrs of pushing to get him out. It really is no wonder his head got so squeezed. The CST session didn't scare me, or the realeases, I am just amazed at how much he has reacted. We are keeping a close eye on him. I forgot to add that he had mucous in his poop, it looked like thick spider webs, very strange.

I get flustered around regular DRs and have a hard time asserting myself. I need to get over this because I have strong convictions and am confident I am doing the right thing. Ahh, the military system is so ackward, I am enlisted and all the DRs are officers. So, yes ma'am, I will not be getting those shots...

DD had an easier birth (7 lbs 3 oz, 20 minutes of pushing) so hopefully her head won't be in too bad of shape. I just meant your DS' reaction to the session scared me!

Yeah I don't know how it would work when you go to the doctor if you're enlisted...it's not fair that they can try to intimidate you just because they outrank you. Maybe you can just do what they recommend in the vax forum--repeat that you've made your decision and it's not open for discussion over and over until they get tired and give up. Is your DH enlisted, too?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I have had stomach cramps and diarrhea for three days now and it is getting worse. I thought it was just die-off but now I think something's wrong. I don't know if I should go to the doctor or just try to wait it out. DH is out of town until tomorrow afternoon, too, so if I do go I have no one to watch DD.

Also, DD's poop must be pure acid or something. She commonly poops first thing in the morning and I didn't put her on the potty this morning when she woke up because I had to use the toilet. I could hear her poop in her diaper and it could not have been more than 5 minutes at the absolute most before I changed her diaper, and her butt had BLISTERS on it from the poop! I do not know what to do with her anymore.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I have had stomach cramps and diarrhea for three days now and it is getting worse.

I have had this too. The pain feels like stomach bug, but it is the slowest moving one that I have ever had. Started last weekend with just feeling quite nauseous. Then moved to feeling stomach pain (like I was going to have diarrhea) mainly in the evenings. Then yesterday it started in the morning. After getting the kids to school over an hour late (we have never been that late before, but I woke up 15 min before their school started







), I came home and spent the rest of the day, until I had to get them again, in bed.







: Today looks like the same, but now since last night, I actually do have diarrhea. Up until then, it just felt like I should have it, or throw up. It is really weird. My experience with stomach things like this is that they come on fast and vicous, but then leave rather quickly too. This sucks! But part of me likes an excuse to just lie in bed for hours.







:

As far as a doctor for this, I am not going. There is nothing _my_ doc would be able to do for me. Maybe you have a better one.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Also, DD's poop must be pure acid or something. She commonly poops first thing in the morning and I didn't put her on the potty this morning when she woke up because I had to use the toilet. I could hear her poop in her diaper and it could not have been more than 5 minutes at the absolute most before I changed her diaper, and her butt had BLISTERS on it from the poop! I do not know what to do with her anymore.

My DD2 would get this sometimes too. It would also happen from a pee-soaked diaper. I never really did resolve it. She is just now not in diapers. It is actually how I got her to give up her nighttime diapers. I knew that she could physically go all night w/o a diaper, but was just resistent to the idea. One morning, relatively recently, she woke up with a completely red butt -- looked burned -- all from pee. I explained to her that she wouldn't have that problem if she didn't wear diapers. It convinced her. I guess that won't so much work for you, and of course it doesn't take care of the underlying problem. I have been meaning to test her urine pH, but haven't done it yet. Not sure what I would do with that knowledge right now anyway.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I think dd might be losing weight again. I'm not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing.

When we cut out all fruit she gained 1 lb in 3 weeks. She has always been thin so I thought that this was a good thing. But she gained it mostly in her belly. She got that round toddler belly for the first time in her life. Well we started giving her apple sauce 2.5 weeks ago to get these herbs into her. Her round belly is gone and she is lighter on the scale. She seems fine and healthy, I'm just not sure if the round belly was a bad thing that needed to go or a good thing that I should be trying to get back. I was considering making sauce out of some other fruits becasue she is getting sick of the apple sauce (3x a day for the first week and 2x a day for the past 10 days and that will continue for 10 more days and then down to 1x a day for another month, I would get sick of it too.)

I'm giving her nofenol before these bowls of applesauce. I've never really know if phenols were an issue for her or not but figured better safe than sorry. Well berries have a lot more phenols than apples. I'm just not sure if this is yet another thing I should be worried about.... I need to get these herbs into her and I don't think she is up to swallowing the capsuls they come in (she can swallow some pills but smaller ones).

Thoughts????

I'm just worried that 1.5 more months of this could be bad for her if it is indeed making her lose weight she really doesn't need to lose (although she had finally gotten up above 50% for her weight, her height is arround 75%)


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

annikate - you mentioned that meat is hard to digest for (some?) little tummies... that was a new one - an acquaintance here with a 1 yr old has spent a lot of time reading (the German) websites for solid introductions with extreme care - the mama in this case is ultrasensitive to mold and other environmental stuff that she assumed her ds would be allergic to the world, including food. she used ground turkey, mashed carrots and mashed potatoes as some of the first foods she introduced to her ds.

why is it that WAPF recommends liver and yolks as first foods (without specifying age of those first foods) ? wouldn't liver be even harder on those little tummies?

and then at what age should one be giving CLO to b'fed kids? my ND thinks that b'fed kids don't need anything except maybe probiotics - that mama should be taking any and all supplements... thoughts anyone?

(just sitting here reading the latest issue of Wise Traditions)


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Pattyla-I have been making myself a 'pumkin' smoothie and I stick lots of vitamins and oils in there. It tastes decadent, like pumkin bread batter. puree in blender:
1 cup baked squash or pumkin that has been chilled in fridge
1 tbsp honey or to taste
cinnamon to taste
vanilla
2 tbsp almond or other nut butter
tbsp oil of choice


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - you mentioned that meat is hard to digest for (some?) little tummies... that was a new one - an acquaintance here with a 1 yr old has spent a lot of time reading (the German) websites for solid introductions with extreme care - the mama in this case is ultrasensitive to mold and other environmental stuff that she assumed her ds would be allergic to the world, including food. she used ground turkey, mashed carrots and mashed potatoes as some of the first foods she introduced to her ds.

why is it that WAPF recommends liver and yolks as first foods (without specifying age of those first foods) ? wouldn't liver be even harder on those little tummies?

and then at what age should one be giving CLO to b'fed kids? my ND thinks that b'fed kids don't need anything except maybe probiotics - that mama should be taking any and all supplements... thoughts anyone?

(just sitting here reading the latest issue of Wise Traditions)

I don't have links now (had a near computer crash about a month ago and cleaned the HD b/c I thought I would have to reinstall the op system). I got some good links from some of the mamas on either the enzyme-autism group or the mercury-autism group. Can't remember which one. This is also where I got the tip about lamb.

ETA: I remember something about it taking several days for babes to digest meat.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Pattyla-I have been making myself a 'pumkin' smoothie and I stick lots of vitamins and oils in there. It tastes decadent, like pumkin bread batter. puree in blender:
1 cup baked squash or pumkin that has been chilled in fridge
1 tbsp honey or to taste
cinnamon to taste
vanilla
2 tbsp almond or other nut butter
tbsp oil of choice

that sounds yummy







i've been starting to get my annual squash/pumpkin craving and was wondering how to satisfy it!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Pattyla-I have been making myself a 'pumkin' smoothie and I stick lots of vitamins and oils in there. It tastes decadent, like pumkin bread batter. puree in blender:
1 cup baked squash or pumkin that has been chilled in fridge
1 tbsp honey or to taste
cinnamon to taste
vanilla
2 tbsp almond or other nut butter
tbsp oil of choice

That sounds good! I got some local pumpkins that I need to cook up soon (trying to wait till after halloween cause dd decorated them with markers). I may have to sacrifice one. Although I just remembered, she doesn't like squash.







Bummer, I love squash.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
annikate - you mentioned that meat is hard to digest for (some?) little tummies... that was a new one - an acquaintance here with a 1 yr old has spent a lot of time reading (the German) websites for solid introductions with extreme care - the mama in this case is ultrasensitive to mold and other environmental stuff that she assumed her ds would be allergic to the world, including food. she used ground turkey, mashed carrots and mashed potatoes as some of the first foods she introduced to her ds.

why is it that WAPF recommends liver and yolks as first foods (without specifying age of those first foods) ? wouldn't liver be even harder on those little tummies?

and then at what age should one be giving CLO to b'fed kids? my ND thinks that b'fed kids don't need anything except maybe probiotics - that mama should be taking any and all supplements... thoughts anyone?

(just sitting here reading the latest issue of Wise Traditions)

I used to agree with your ND, but after it became clear to me that although the candida diet was helping me, it was not helping DD at all, I decided I had better start giving her things directly if I wanted to heal her. Both CLO and CO made a difference in the frequency of her poops, so that she now poops almost every day instead of frequently going 2-3 days between poops. (I know CO is technically a food but I give it to her for its medicinal/healing value.) She still clearly has digestive issues, though, based on the look of her poops. I'm also giving her herbal infusions and trying to get coconut milk yogurt and kefir into her (although technically I suppose those are probiotics). I gave her vitamin C for a bit, too, after she was super constipated but it made her gassy so I stopped it.

Anyhow, I guess in theory I still agree that it is best for the mama to take supplements, but in practice, it hasn't worked for us. I would have started giving DD CLO at about a year if I hadn't been trying to heal her. But anyway, once you start feeding them solids, I don't see that giving them supplements directly is really any different (I'd still be pretty cautious about giving individual vitamin or mineral supplements other than vitamin C, but CLO or herbal infusions are different IMO).

I've heard that meats are supposed to be the easiest foods to digest (besides maybe CO and good fats) but the meat I've given DD thus far she hasn't digested. Maybe if I'd given her ground meat, instead of chicken or stir-fried elk steak, she would have digested it better. I don't see why liver would be any easier to digest than those two. Sometimes you have to take the advice of the WAPF with a grain of salt--they recommend feeding babies egg yolks at 4 months and I think that is way too early to be starting babies on solids.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Pattyla--can you get any more fat into your DD to help her gain weight? She might like that pumpkin shake recipe even if she doesn't like squash--I've made the pumpkin pie filling from pecanbread with squash and it tastes nothing like squash.

Can you make peachsauce or pearsauce? I don't know if those are high in phenols or not. I made yummy peachsauce from frozen peaches when I was doing the SCD.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

I have also heard that meat is the hardest to digest. Course, I was reading veggie sites when I came across that, but I am still inclined to agree with it.

Nolansmom, that pumpkin smoothie sounds great. How did you cook your pumpkin? Just halve it and stick in the oven?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
I have also heard that meat is the hardest to digest. Course, I was reading veggie sites when I came across that, but I am still inclined to agree with it.

Nolansmom, that pumpkin smoothie sounds great. How did you cook your pumpkin? Just halve it and stick in the oven?

I thought that meat was the easiest to digest, I read it of WAPF. Hmm.

I halve the squash/pumpkin and stick it in the oven. Acorn squash is a bit watery, but butternuts work well. I look foreward to my shake all day!


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

DS had a horrible day today. He must have gotten a stomach bug. He had a HUGE loose stool this am, then 5 minutes after he BF he projectile vomited all of the milk. He was ok most of the day, nursing in small amounts, eating a bite here and there. He had D all day too. Then tonight after he BF, again he projectile vomited it all out. No fever.









ugh and his cheeks are terrible. I have put putting eucerin and weleda calendula cream on all day long and I swear it makes no difference. In fact, he has red bumps on his legs where yesterday for the first time I put eucerin.







:


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

So frustrating that there's so much contradictory info. I have read both an equal amount of time. Meat is difficult to digest, and meat is the easiest. I am inclined to believe it is the former. When little ones were given meat back in the day it was usually prechewed by the mama which is far different from simply grinding it. It was in effect predigested which means that those mamas had the wisdom to understand the babe wasn't ready for it on it's own.

Of course that's just MHO. There's definitely info out there saying the opposite. In terms of composition of macronutrients, fruit is the closest to bm which makes me very comfortable starting with that.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Could Ds's stomach flu be a healing reaction to the CST? Ds and I are not sick at all.


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## bluets (Mar 15, 2005)

still searching for articles that support either "early meat" or "late meat", but i thought i'd share this... uh... interesting... article: http://www.goarticles.com/cgi-bin/showa.cgi?C=298595

kind of a funny tone/style of writing - quite like a British manual or something. but i do like the following paragraph:

"When one or two of the large grinding teeth have appeared, the same food may be continued, but need not be passed through a sieve. Beef tea and chicken broth may occasionally be added; and, as an introduction to the use of a more completely animal diet, a portion, now and then, of a soft boiled egg; by and by a small bread pudding, made with one egg in it, may be taken as the dinner meal."


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Could Ds's stomach flu be a healing reaction to the CST? Ds and I are not sick at all.

All righty then, now I am sure it is the stomach flu because I have it







:


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
So frustrating that there's so much contradictory info. I have read both an equal amount of time. Meat is difficult to digest, and meat is the easiest. I am inclined to believe it is the former. When little ones were given meat back in the day it was usually prechewed by the mama which is far different from simply grinding it. It was in effect predigested which means that those mamas had the wisdom to understand the babe wasn't ready for it on it's own.

Of course that's just MHO. There's definitely info out there saying the opposite. In terms of composition of macronutrients, fruit is the closest to bm which makes me very comfortable starting with that.

I think I agree with you, firefaery. I have also heard that getting the eyeteeth is a sign that baby is ready for meat, just like getting molars is supposed to be a sign of readiness for grains.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I am about to send DH to the store for some Immodium which is supposed to be safe for BF'ing. I am getting desperate. Even after not eating for 36 hours I still have horrible stomach cramps and diarrhea, plus my lower stomach near my pubic bone is quite sensitive and sore to the touch. I tried a bunch of herbal teas that were supposed to be good for diarrhea yesterday and they didn't do anything. I am really afraid something is seriously wrong--I keep thinking of Jordan Rubin's story. If anyone has any suggestions to help please let me know.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Valerie - Im so sorry. That sounds miserable, and scary. I dont have any ideas.

Lately Ive been wondering about the rejuvelac. When we ferment saurkraut, the salt inhibits the bad bugs from growing until the good ones take the lead, so what is stopping the bad bugs from growing in the rejuvelac? Particularly as my last 2 batches did not taste fermented *enough* (I think my house is geting too cold) - what's in there after sitting for 24 hrs? Would nothing grow, or equal good and bad? I hope this isnt a naive question. I tossed it, as I wonder what exactly IM drinking in there, and my kids like to drink it too.

The other thing Ive been wondering about (which someone posted about today on bee's), is the effect of *natural* antifungals on the balance of flora. I was just reading a book last night, and have come across it before, that oergano oil and garlic are potent antibiotics that, over time, can affect the good bugs too, so one must make sure to repopulate. Bee used nystatin, which is not an antibiotic. And she didnt use rejuvelac. Im starting to wonder how much of the treatment could be changing more than I want in there. This *could* be related to you - obviously diet, antifungals, and probotics are changing things in your gut, which could just make this a different/worse experience of stomach flu?

I just had my first period in awhile and I have never in my life had such awful, scary PMS. If we're healing, and taking good care of our bodies, why are they not having a better time with all this instead of worse?

And then theres my reflux, which started 2 wks into the diet. Could it be that eating so much more meat and fat is messing with my digestion? (which bee would dismiss). I am a mixed type (metabolic typing ... though as FF said, the test from the book may not be good enough), which is how I ate before now. Dh made a riser for the head of the bed so now it is slanted wayyyy up - it looks ridiculous, and is a danger to the kids (as they love jumping on our bed)







, but I slept well last night









Sorry for the bla bla bla...


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bluets* 
still searching for articles that support either "early meat" or "late meat", but i thought i'd share this... uh... interesting... article: http://www.goarticles.com/cgi-bin/showa.cgi?C=298595

kind of a funny tone/style of writing - quite like a British manual or something. but i do like the following paragraph:

"When one or two of the large grinding teeth have appeared, the same food may be continued, but need not be passed through a sieve. Beef tea and chicken broth may occasionally be added; and, as an introduction to the use of a more completely animal diet, a portion, now and then, of a soft boiled egg; by and by a small bread pudding, made with one egg in it, may be taken as the dinner meal."

I was looking for the links I used to have and could only come up w/contradictory information (like everything else!)







:

I guess I'm just weird about it because, in trying to follow NT, I gave dd2 some broth w/pureed chicken in it when she was about 10 mos. old and she threw her guts up for 7 hours straight.









She doesn't have any problem w/chicken now though.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Caedmyn, have you tried taking pascalite? I'm so sorry you are feeling so badly!


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Valerie - Im so sorry. That sounds miserable, and scary. I dont have any ideas.

Lately Ive been wondering about the rejuvelac. When we ferment saurkraut, the salt inhibits the bad bugs from growing until the good ones take the lead, so what is stopping the bad bugs from growing in the rejuvelac? Particularly as my last 2 batches did not taste fermented *enough* (I think my house is geting too cold) - what's in there after sitting for 24 hrs? Would nothing grow, or equal good and bad? I hope this isnt a naive question. I tossed it, as I wonder what exactly IM drinking in there, and my kids like to drink it too.

The other thing Ive been wondering about (which someone posted about today on bee's), is the effect of *natural* antifungals on the balance of flora. I was just reading a book last night, and have come across it before, that oergano oil and garlic are potent antibiotics that, over time, can affect the good bugs too, so one must make sure to repopulate. Bee used nystatin, which is not an antibiotic. And she didnt use rejuvelac. Im starting to wonder how much of the treatment could be changing more than I want in there. This *could* be related to you - obviously diet, antifungals, and probotics are changing things in your gut, which could just make this a different/worse experience of stomach flu?

I just had my first period in awhile and I have never in my life had such awful, scary PMS. If we're healing, and taking good care of our bodies, why are they not having a better time with all this instead of worse?

And then theres my reflux, which started 2 wks into the diet. Could it be that eating so much more meat and fat is messing with my digestion? (which bee would dismiss). I am a mixed type (metabolic typing ... though as FF said, the test from the book may not be good enough), which is how I ate before now. Dh made a riser for the head of the bed so now it is slanted wayyyy up - it looks ridiculous, and is a danger to the kids (as they love jumping on our bed)







, but I slept well last night









Sorry for the bla bla bla...

Are you taking HCL with meals? That has made a huge difference for me. I'll tell you how to do it if you aren't familiar. I have almost weaned off of it by now so I can tell that my digestion is improving.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
I am about to send DH to the store for some Immodium which is supposed to be safe for BF'ing. I am getting desperate. Even after not eating for 36 hours I still have horrible stomach cramps and diarrhea, plus my lower stomach near my pubic bone is quite sensitive and sore to the touch. I tried a bunch of herbal teas that were supposed to be good for diarrhea yesterday and they didn't do anything. I am really afraid something is seriously wrong--I keep thinking of Jordan Rubin's story. If anyone has any suggestions to help please let me know.

Have you tried activated charcoal? It is a good way to soak up the bad guys in your gut and get them out.

Also any antibacterial herbs would be good since you are obviously fighting something off.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I tried pascalite and vitamin C and neither seemed to help. Haven't tried activated charcoal although I have some.

I posted on the vax board looking for any remedies anyone had, and someone posted that diarrhea can be caused by the body dumping toxins...which I already knew but when I read that I started thinking about all the water kefirs I was drinking when this started. They were causing tons of die-off symptoms (gas, bloating, rumbly stomach) that went away when this started. Just a theory, but if this was caused by my body dumping toxins, then maybe eating something that feeds the yeast (honey, applesauce) will stop the dumping and make the yeast happy again. I ate a tablespoon of honey a little while ago so we'll see...

Please be happy again little yeasties...I'll try to kill you off slowly later!


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

The bugs are so diabolical! When I hit bad die off I always felt like some villain from a cartoon. Drat! Foiled again! I'll get you next time, and when I do...(brandishing fist.) Clearly I though about it to much


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Valerie - Im so sorry. That sounds miserable, and scary. I dont have any ideas.

Lately Ive been wondering about the rejuvelac. When we ferment saurkraut, the salt inhibits the bad bugs from growing until the good ones take the lead, so what is stopping the bad bugs from growing in the rejuvelac? Particularly as my last 2 batches did not taste fermented *enough* (I think my house is geting too cold) - what's in there after sitting for 24 hrs? Would nothing grow, or equal good and bad? I hope this isnt a naive question. I tossed it, as I wonder what exactly IM drinking in there, and my kids like to drink it too.

The other thing Ive been wondering about (which someone posted about today on bee's), is the effect of *natural* antifungals on the balance of flora. I was just reading a book last night, and have come across it before, that oergano oil and garlic are potent antibiotics that, over time, can affect the good bugs too, so one must make sure to repopulate. Bee used nystatin, which is not an antibiotic. And she didnt use rejuvelac. Im starting to wonder how much of the treatment could be changing more than I want in there. This *could* be related to you - obviously diet, antifungals, and probotics are changing things in your gut, which could just make this a different/worse experience of stomach flu?

I just had my first period in awhile and I have never in my life had such awful, scary PMS. If we're healing, and taking good care of our bodies, why are they not having a better time with all this instead of worse?

And then theres my reflux, which started 2 wks into the diet. Could it be that eating so much more meat and fat is messing with my digestion? (which bee would dismiss). I am a mixed type (metabolic typing ... though as FF said, the test from the book may not be good enough), which is how I ate before now. Dh made a riser for the head of the bed so now it is slanted wayyyy up - it looks ridiculous, and is a danger to the kids (as they love jumping on our bed)







, but I slept well last night









Sorry for the bla bla bla...

I've been considering adding a bit of salt to my rejuvelac lately, too. I don't think it's bad if it doesn't taste as fermented--with my rejuvelac, anyway, I just figure the amount of cabbage I used varied (I'm a dumper, not an exact measurer) or that the house got a little cool, or I didn't let it sit as long as usual (I don't always go quite 24 hours). I figure the less fermented it tastes the better as I still think that stuff is nasty.

Funny how Bee didn't follow her program in healing but pushes it so hard on everyone else! I posted on the other candida yahoo group on the "anti-Bee" thread but it didn't show up









Have you considered subbing "safe" carbs like brown rice, buckwheat, aramanth, or quinoa (or more veggies) for some of the meat & fat, just to see how you feel? How closely were you following the "ideal ratios" for protein, fat, and carbs?


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

Oh, caedymn, I feel your pain. I was finally feeling a bit better last night, _almost_ normal. Felt pretty good this moring, ate breakfast and now am back in bed with terrible stomach pains. I would like to think that I am getting rid of stuff I need to get rid of, but man, this sucks. I don't recall ever being sidelined this long over a stomach thing. In fact, the last time I was really bedridden was one day when I was pregnant with DD1, throwing up. And that was over 5 years ago.

And I can't decide what tools I have for healing on hand would be useful right now. I don't have any pascalite, I am out of charcoal, I am scared to do vit C, and am unsure about my yogurt or water kefir or kombucha.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Where is everybody today?

I'm finally feeling a bit better this afternoon, although yesterday evening, last night, and first thing this morning were bad. I made the mistake of eating grains yesterday (I was starving and they sounded good) which really really upset my stomach, although it had been a bit better up to that point. What has helped is a remedy someone on the vax board posted: combine 1 tsp. cinnamon with 1 Tbsp. slippery elm powder in 1/2 c. of water. It forms a thick goopy substance--I ate it with a spoon and chased it with water. That stuff definitely helps--at the very least it's made the stomach cramps go away for a few hours after I take it, and sometimes it makes the diarrhea go away, too (seems to work best on an empty stomach).

moonshine--are you feeling any better? If not, definitely try the remedy I posted. It's weird but not bad--I can only taste the cinnamon. I don't know how I would have survived the last 24 or so hours with it.


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## Richie'sMama (Dec 4, 2001)

Hi all.

I think my son has leaky gut syndrome. He has all sorts of (mild) sensory issues and has been doing MUCH better since we went Gluten/Casein Free, but now I want to help him HEAL and don't know where to start.

Where would you start?
Digestive Enzymes?
How do you determine which digestive enzymes someone needs?
Can a six year old take enzymes?
Which brands?
Is there a practioner I can contact -- or a book or web site to explain this all?

or-- should I be looking elsewhere?

Thanks for setting me on the right path.

- paula


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
Where is everybody today?

I'm finally feeling a bit better this afternoon, although yesterday evening, last night, and first thing this morning were bad. I made the mistake of eating grains yesterday (I was starving and they sounded good) which really really upset my stomach, although it had been a bit better up to that point. What has helped is a remedy someone on the vax board posted: combine 1 tsp. cinnamon with 1 Tbsp. slippery elm powder in 1/2 c. of water. It forms a thick goopy substance--I ate it with a spoon and chased it with water. That stuff definitely helps--at the very least it's made the stomach cramps go away for a few hours after I take it, and sometimes it makes the diarrhea go away, too (seems to work best on an empty stomach).

moonshine--are you feeling any better? If not, definitely try the remedy I posted. It's weird but not bad--I can only taste the cinnamon. I don't know how I would have survived the last 24 or so hours with it.


I am glad you are feeling better. I am going to get some slippery elm. This stomach 'bug' knocked me out completely, I can hardly think about eating even though I am starving. I do not know if this is some healing reaction or a flu, no one else has gotten it except for me and the DS even though he has his hands in peoples mouths.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Richie'sMama* 
Hi all.

I think my son has leaky gut syndrome. He has all sorts of (mild) sensory issues and has been doing MUCH better since we went Gluten/Casein Free, but now I want to help him HEAL and don't know where to start.

Where would you start?
Digestive Enzymes?
How do you determine which digestive enzymes someone needs?
Can a six year old take enzymes?
Which brands?
Is there a practioner I can contact -- or a book or web site to explain this all?

or-- should I be looking elsewhere?

Thanks for setting me on the right path.

- paula

Welcome!
nak
Look at the Healing the Gut sticky at the top of the Health & Healing page. All kinds of info. there to get you started.


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## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

I've been reading the sticky, but still have a question...

I'm getting solaray babylife for my 8mo. Should I take him off solids for a while when we begin it?


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

I start my parasite cleanse on tuedsay. (seems fitting that I start it on Halloween







) I did some reading about it finally last night. It seems that the parasites hatch out of their eggs arround the time of the full moon. That is why it is recomended that you time a parasite cleanse to start shortly before the full moon.

Well DH and I both got diahrea yesterday. I figured it was becasue AF is starting (for me), but that doesn't explain DH. I often get diahrea just as af is starting but I'm also pretty regular with my cycles so perhaps I'm just getting AF right before the full moon each month and those buggers are hatching and messing up my gut!

I'm trying to convince him to take the antiparasite suppliment too. I read in more than one place that it is best to treat the whole family for parasites at once or you run the risk of just passing them arround and reinfecting each other. It is supposed to attack fungi and bacteria too so that should cover whatever is going on in his GI tract as well. We'll see if he does it.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sarasprings* 
I've been reading the sticky, but still have a question...

I'm getting solaray babylife for my 8mo. Should I take him off solids for a while when we begin it?

Don't see a reason to stop solids IF he is fine with everything you have been giving him. Just don't add anything new besides the probiotic and start with a small amount.


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## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
Don't see a reason to stop solids IF he is fine with everything you have been giving him. Just don't add anything new besides the probiotic and start with a small amount.

Thanks. He's only eating a few foods (rice pudding, carrots, spinach, and chewing on papaya) and really only once a day. There is something that is bothering him (he has a bum ring), but I'm not sure if it's something he's eating or me. I started keeping a food log for me and I'll add him in.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sarasprings* 
Thanks. He's only eating a few foods (rice pudding, carrots, spinach, and chewing on papaya) and really only once a day. There is something that is bothering him (he has a bum ring), but I'm not sure if it's something he's eating or me. I started keeping a food log for me and I'll add him in.

I wouldn't give any grains yet as they are harder to digest, and spinach can be hard to digest
read this:
http://www.deliciousorganics.com/Pre...ddlers%20avoid


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## sarasprings (Mar 30, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I wouldn't give any grains yet as they are harder to digest, and spinach can be hard to digest
read this:
http://www.deliciousorganics.com/Pre...ddlers%20avoid

Ugh. I know. I'll stop the rice pudding. I put it off until he was 8 months. I should know better.







I didn't realize that about the spinach, though. I was giving him spinach/carrot to help him with colds. Thank you!


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

I'm calling an allergist tomorrow to see if they will do the ELISA test (blood test for IgG and IgE). If not, we'll go through directlabs.com or something like that to have it done ourselves. Dh would prefer if we went through a doctor because then our insurance will likely cover it. These tests can get expensive. I just don't know if a mainstream allergist will even be open to it. The ELISA test was on quackwatch.com as a "dubious" test







: Sometimes I sooo hate western conventional medicine.

Anyway, I just got Threelac from candidasupport.com and I'm happy to report that dd is willing to take it! Yay! Hopefully, we'll see an improvement in her yeast symptoms.

We're finally home after being gone for the weekend. I'm so happy to be preparing and eating our own food again. I think my dh's family thinks I'm full of it when it comes to dd's food sensitivities. That's one more reason the blood test would be useful, lol.


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## Richie'sMama (Dec 4, 2001)

You can order the Elisa kit from the lab (they offer a bunch of 'dubuious' tests) but need a script from a dr. to get the blood draw. The test is like $99 and they try to get your ins. to cover it. I have the phone # downstairs. Email back if you want it.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Cool. I had great luck with threelac during pregnancy. IT doens't taste bad at all....kinda lemony.


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chinese Pistache* 
Anyway, I just got Threelac from candidasupport.com and I'm happy to report that dd is willing to take it! Yay! Hopefully, we'll see an improvement in her yeast symptoms.

Let us know how the threelac works, any reactions and so on.

FF-if you took threelac during pregnancy I assume it is ok during breastfeeding? If this is a good product why is this the first time it has been mentioned here?


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

I have been thinking (it is a miracle sometimes







) don't good yeast and bacteria need to feed on something? Wouldn't they 'eat' the same things as bad yeast and bacteria?


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Nolansmum* 
I have been thinking (it is a miracle sometimes








) don't good yeast and bacteria need to feed on something? Wouldn't they 'eat' the same things as bad yeast and bacteria?

Thats a big can of worms, I think. You've heard of FOS. Some argue that its a bad additive b/c *bad* bugs feed on it as well as good. Others say it is not fed on by bad bugs (although I htink this has been pretty soundly debunked). Now, there is a chain length involved (as in how many chains are in the carb). FOS is short, while something called inulin is longer, and therefore supposedly feeds good bugs better (I cant remember exactly why, maybe Cademyn can chime in). This goes back to something JaneS posted about a friend who overcame yeast with a more balanced diet. Im starting to wonder how well anything done too much helps. Again, it seems to be a matter of finding what works for your body. One good thing about kefir is that it provides good bugs, and the little sugar in there feed them (and those already present) but likely also feeds bad bugs, but its a trade off. Hopefully the benefits outweigh the detriment? Ive also heard that its a good idea to eat something (a sprouted tortilla) every couple days to feed the good bugs. Ive also been wondering about herbs aimed at yeast - dont they also affect good bugs? Like garlic. Its anti-bacterial isnt it? Some brands of pro-b's instruct to take them 2 hrs away from herbal anti-fungals. I dont really know about any of this, and would like to hear others ideas...

...although, I am sooo discouraged lately that Im guessing the answer is "its different for everybody" or "try it and see how it works for you". Sorry. Now that I have gerd, Im having a hard time carrying all this. Both seem interminable, and the diet needed for both, and the physical discomfort of the gerd, is making me miserable. Again, sorry.

On threelac, Ive heard good and bad (shocker). The good is that it works (with the diet, etc. despite their claim that you dont need to adjust diet). The bad is that some people become very sick using it.

Have any of you looked at Walt Stolls site much? What do you think?


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Thats a big can of worms, I think. You've heard of FOS. Some argue that its a bad additive b/c *bad* bugs feed on it as well as good. Others say it is not fed on by bad bugs (although I htink this has been pretty soundly debunked). Now, there is a chain length involved (as in how many chains are in the carb). FOS is short, while something called inulin is longer, and therefore supposedly feeds good bugs better (I cant remember exactly why, maybe Cademyn can chime in). This goes back to something JaneS posted about a friend who overcame yeast with a more balanced diet. Im starting to wonder how well anything done too much helps. Again, it seems to be a matter of finding what works for your body. One good thing about kefir is that it provides good bugs, and the little sugar in there feed them (and those already present) but likely also feeds bad bugs, but its a trade off. Hopefully the benefits outweigh the detriment? Ive also heard that its a good idea to eat something (a sprouted tortilla) every couple days to feed the good bugs. Ive also been wondering about herbs aimed at yeast - dont they also affect good bugs? Like garlic. Its anti-bacterial isnt it? Some brands of pro-b's instruct to take them 2 hrs away from herbal anti-fungals. I dont really know about any of this, and would like to hear others ideas...

...although, I am sooo discouraged lately that Im guessing the answer is "its different for everybody" or "try it and see how it works for you". Sorry. Now that I have gerd, Im having a hard time carrying all this. Both seem interminable, and the diet needed for both, and the physical discomfort of the gerd, is making me miserable. Again, sorry.

On threelac, Ive heard good and bad (shocker). The good is that it works (with the diet, etc. despite their claim that you dont need to adjust diet). The bad is that some people become very sick using it.

Have any of you looked at Walt Stolls site much? What do you think?

I try to stay away from both FOS and inulin. They're both controversial, and I think if someone wants the "benefits" of them, it's best to get them from the foods that naturally contain them, like onions for FOS. JMHO

It seems logical to me that anti-fungals like garlic and coconut oil must primarily damage the bad bugs. I say this because people have been eating them as part of their regular diets for thousands of years, and if they killed off all the good bacteria, etc, those people would have had a lot of health problems, and that isn't the case. I don't know how that applies to more medicinal-type things like oil of oregano or grapefruit seed extract. I don't know if anybody really knows. Also, garlic and coconut oil both support/enhance your immune system and I don't think they could do that if they were killing off all the good bacteria in your gut. Same thing with vitamin C--it supports your immune system but is anti-fungal in large doses.

I think Threelac actually has been mentioned before, but it's just like all the other "miracle cures"...it works for some, doesn't work for a good percentage of people, and makes some people worse. From reading different candida boards, the overall impression I've gotton of Threelac is that it doesn't do much for most people, although some people do say it's helped them a lot.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

You mean on Mothering or in this group? I have seen many discussions on Mothering (and participated in some as well.) I had good luck with it when nothing else worked in pg. I am very good at getting control over yeast, but even doing everything I had done with success before I was getting no relief. I decided to try threelac because it has different strains and I thought maybe that was my issue-needing more variety in the strains. It did work, I saw a difference in about a week (I had visible physical symptoms.) I didn't adjust my diet, as I was eating a very good diet (in theory) But hte point is, the diet and probiotics weren't working until I introduced the threelac.

Worked for me, but not in a way that I was so confident about it that I'd be recommending it to people all over the place. I guess it's worth a try if you don't happen to be getting results no matter what and it's clearly yeast that's the issue.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

firefaery--did you have yeast issues again in your last pregnancy?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

I did at the end. My constitutional didn't hep and neither did anything else. IT was weird, everything had been under control for so long. Looking back I have a great idea about what was wrong, but in the moment I had no idea. I was doing everything right.







Since there isn't a TON of things you can do in pregnancy and I wanted to avoid thrush I tried the threelac. It worked in my situation.


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

What's FOS?

I'll keep you all posted on Threelac.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

FOS (fruct0-oligo-sacharide) is a kind of sugar that is said to only feed good bugs, but I think now many people are starting to doubt that. Many probiotics include it, but not all, and the two sides make claims about it, pro and con.

I didnt mean to say I endorse using any of those things, I definitely believe in getting what you need from whole foods, but I do wonder/worry about overcompensating and causing as many problems, but just different, by treating the yeast.

Im confused about it. It seems like I know as many people who have treated themselves for yeast successfully and gone on with their lives as I do people who seem never to get rid of it. I understand that finding individual balance is key, but why do we have to work so hard when so many others (the majority) go about normal eating/drinking and dont get into trouble? For example, it sounds like most of us were going blythely about our lives before either having kid with issues or suddenly having issues ourselves. Im NOT advocating SAD, I just really dont get it. Ive talked a lot about dis-ease with Dh and he underscores that people just get sick, no one expects it. I guess that's just the way it is. Sorry if Im a downer - I guess Im working on the acceptance part of this *journey* as much or more than the symptoms and diet/treatment. ...or acceptance is part of my journey.... bla bla bla


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
I understand that finding individual balance is key, but why do we have to work so hard when so many others (the majority) go about normal eating/drinking and dont get into trouble? For example, it sounds like most of us were going blythely about our lives before either having kid with issues or suddenly having issues ourselves.




The thing is, the majority of people ARE sick, they just don't know and/or don't know how to or don't want to bother fixing it. My family was generally pretty "healthy"...I had multiple ear infections as a baby, hypoglycemia starting at about 14, acne, and issues with gas and yeast-infection-type itching from a young age. My sister had multiple ear infections and strep throat, mono, pleurisy, severe acne, lots of cavities, and seems to catch anything that's going around. My brother had a lot of eye infections and has severe acne. My dad has chronic constipation and fungal toe infections along with diverticulosis/-litis (can't ever remember which is which). My mom has hypothroidism and gastoenteritis and acne. But none of us has allergies/eczema/asthma, and we'd probably all consider ourselves pretty healthy.

People consider chronic constipation, allergies, eczema, asthma, gas, bloating, stomach rumbling, cavities, etc etc "normal", and it's not 'til you have some sort of more drastic wake-up call that you realize that they're NOT normal or healthy and begin to look for solutions...and the majority of people never come to that realization, or if they do, they look only to allopathic medicine for a "solution".


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## Pookietooth (Jul 1, 2002)

ITA with caedmyn, I think most of us have just learned to live at a lower standard of health because western medicine doesn't deal with chronic problems very well and views most as symptoms to be managed with drugs. I had PCOS, depression, and chronic migraines, but nobody said anything to me about diet -- well, some suggested low carbing for the PCOS, and one doctor suggested I cut out nuts, cheese, chocolate for the migraines, but they never talked about my chronic yeast infections or looked at my hair loss or any of that.

I am so tired of fighthing these yeasties, but I am sure that I can get over them eventually.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

I am pretty convinced my diarrhea was caused by the water kefir grains. It was starting to go away yesterday and I have been gradually adding adding fermented foods back to my diet. Well at lunch I forgot about "gradually" and had a little bit of water kefir, and some fermented ketchup, cabbage relish, and pickles. Within 1/2 an hour my diarrhea totally came back







It finally seems to be going away again, but it seems pretty clear that the fermented foods/water kefirs caused it. I would have thought after all this time on the candida diet/anti-fungals/probiotic foods with little die-off I wouldn't have had a huge reaction to them, but apparently there was more yeast in there than I thought. There must be an all-out war between the good and bad bugs going on in my gut--I think the good ones are winning, but the bad ones sure are kicking my butt on the way out









Any suggestions on how to help DD's eczema? It isn't bad but it's spreading--in the last few days it's popped up in little patches on the backs of her arms and her upper legs







I just don't know what else to do to help her. I take CLO and so does she, and I take 3000 mg of EPO a day. She gets probiotics a couple of times a day, along with maybe 1 Tbsp/day of CO and an ounce or two of coconut milk yogurt, and no other solids right now. I'd feed her more yogurt if I could but it's really a struggle just to get that much of it into her. Oh, and I have been giving her a little bit of nettle infusion and I started giving her a few sips of my dandelion root/burdock root decoction today. I've put CO and sweet almond oil on her eczema but they don't seem to help.


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Is there someone here who sees a good classical homeopath in (or near) CT? I'll be in CT at the end of this month and I was considering seeing if I could get an appointment. I'm dying to know what dd's constitutional remedy is.


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## sparkletruck (Dec 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pookietooth* 
I am so tired of fighthing these yeasties, but I am sure that I can get over them eventually.

That's good to hear once in awhile - I feel that way deep down.

The thing is, I really didnt have anything going on. I have had depression, but I also come from a disfunctional family and can trace the depression to when that all started. I have been an athlete most of my life, I never got sick, all my grandparents lived to their late 90's at home, etc. No one in my family has any chronic stuff, so Ive had this idea that we are hearty stock. I do now see that MANY people have health issues, especially after talking to some friends about what Im doing (they come forward with all these yeast issues.... so crazy), and that my diet has been carb heavy, albeit healthy in the way I knew healthy before now (no white, sprouted, etc). Anyway, I find this so interesting b/c again I was at a potluck last night with all my robust friends and they were eating whatever they want (pumpkin soup w/ ham, hummus - nothing SAD







). Gotta go, but I like this conversation. Thanks for responding!


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

firefaery--do you know anything about making herbal ointments/salves? I'm thinking about trying to make a couple of herbal ointments for DD's skin, one with calendula and the other with sarsaparilla. The other ingredients are shea butter and beeswax.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Another ? for ff: (and anyone else)

Gonna post in h&h later too - nak

DD1 has the terrible habit of sucking on & biting her bottom lip. It is red & raw. While she's getting somewhat better abouut biting it, now she's picking off the dry healing peices of skin.

Sometimes it looks red, *wet* and (yeast-y?) Other times just orange-ish and crusty.

I've tried coconut cream (from Tropical Traditions) which does help some, I've tried Emu cream and abtibiotic cream.

I realize that it won't completely heal until she leaves it alone, but what do you think would work best? Do you think this is yeast?


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## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

Annikate, that sounds yeast-y to me. I don't know how old your dd is, but you could use gentian violet since it's safe if she ingests it.

? about FOS--are we talking about fructose (sugar from fruit)? That's supposed to be "safe" on SCD, right? But not necessarily good for the yeast. . . Sorry if these are dumb questions. I got my books Breaking the Vicious Cycle and Enzymes for Autism, but I haven't started them yet.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pattyla* 
Is there someone here who sees a good classical homeopath in (or near) CT? I'll be in CT at the end of this month and I was considering seeing if I could get an appointment. I'm dying to know what dd's constitutional remedy is.

Yup. And if you're in Tolland you'll be close.
http://www.drshevin.com/
http://www.minimum.com/p7/engine/auth.asp?n=1039


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *caedmyn* 
firefaery--do you know anything about making herbal ointments/salves? I'm thinking about trying to make a couple of herbal ointments for DD's skin, one with calendula and the other with sarsaparilla. The other ingredients are shea butter and beeswax.

What would you like to know?


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Annikate* 
Another ? for ff: (and anyone else)

Gonna post in h&h later too - nak

DD1 has the terrible habit of sucking on & biting her bottom lip. It is red & raw. While she's getting somewhat better abouut biting it, now she's picking off the dry healing peices of skin.

Sometimes it looks red, *wet* and (yeast-y?) Other times just orange-ish and crusty.

I've tried coconut cream (from Tropical Traditions) which does help some, I've tried Emu cream and abtibiotic cream.

I realize that it won't completely heal until she leaves it alone, but what do you think would work best? Do you think this is yeast?

My dd does this and I have great success with colloidal silver. I don't have her drink it, I just spray it on her mouth. It will manage fungal or bacterial infections-I really like it.


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## moonshine (Dec 5, 2002)

saskiasmom, depression is yet another symtom of a problem of the gut. PM Gale Force for a pdf of her book she is working on -- precisely on this topic (well, postpartum).


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## Pattyla (Apr 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
Yup. And if you're in Tolland you'll be close.
http://www.drshevin.com/
http://www.minimum.com/p7/engine/auth.asp?n=1039

Do you see him? I'm trying to decide between taking dd to him and going through with my appointment on sat for dd to be seen by an acupuncturist who sees children. I don't think dh will agree to both. (frankly the way we have been hemoraging money lately I don't feel good about both either). I'm just not sure... It would be good to know her constitutional remedy though... I have heard such miracle cures from kids given their right remedy... I would really like a miracle cure here.


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
My dd does this and I have great success with colloidal silver. I don't have her drink it, I just spray it on her mouth. It will manage fungal or bacterial infections-I really like it.

Good 'cause I just put some on her. I have a dropper and just put some on my finger and rubbed it in. Hope it works!


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## Annikate (Aug 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *moonshine* 
saskiasmom, depression is yet another symtom of a problem of the gut. PM Gale Force for a pdf of her book she is working on -- precisely on this topic (well, postpartum).

*saskiasmom,*
Yes, and here's a thread about it. I've learned TONS here and used some suggestions too.


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## caedmyn (Jan 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *firefaery* 
What would you like to know?

I don't know...how to make them, if those herbs would do well as ointments/salves, that sort of thing. I'd like something I can make in a day, not something that has to sit for several weeks before it's ready.


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## Panserbjorne (Sep 17, 2003)

Pattyla-he is my homeopath. I love him.

Caedmyn, I'll pm you when I have two free hands...


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## Punchy Kaby (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *saskiasmom* 
Im confused about it. It seems like I know as many people who have treated themselves for yeast successfully and gone on with their lives as I do people who seem never to get rid of it. I understand that finding individual balance is key, but why do we have to work so hard when so many others (the majority) go about normal eating/drinking and dont get into trouble? For example, it sounds like most of us were going blythely about our lives before either having kid with issues or suddenly having issues ourselves. Im NOT advocating SAD, I just really dont get it. Ive talked a lot about dis-ease with Dh and he underscores that people just get sick, no one expects it. I guess that's just the way it is. Sorry if Im a downer - I guess Im working on the acceptance part of this *journey* as much or more than the symptoms and diet/treatment. ...or acceptance is part of my journey.... bla bla bla




I struggle with these issues daily, esp when the results are so slow in coming.
I think that we are striving for a level of health that most people never consider is possible. And by not possible I mean they are unwilling to change their lives because they are so addicted to SAD. Many people talk to me about my diet because they have problems (yeast, IBS) and a couple of them have attempted some form of SCD or NT.. In Enzymes for Autism, she mentioned a timeline for gut healing and said with the enzymes and no or very little diet changes you should be well on the way to healing in 2-3 months. I wish! Right now I am stuck in the begining stages of SCD, eating about 15 foods, afraid to try anything for fear that DS's cheeks will rage out of control. They are on the verge of being out of control now and I have no idea what it is from, I feel ready to give up. His cheeks are far worse then they ever were when I was eating SAD and I don't think that it is from 'healing reactions.'


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## chasmyn (Feb 23, 2004)

It's November!!! New Thread: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...60#post6431960


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