# Are boys routinely circ'd in the us???



## Gabe'sMummy (Dec 4, 2008)

Just a quick question out of curiosity really I guess. Do they circ all boys when born in the US regardless of religion? Is it something you have to specify that you DON'T want done??

I live in Britain and circumcision is never spoke about over here. It's just...well...not done unless for medical reason when the child is older. DS is 7.5 months and is intact, we never really even considered circ and I have never known a man who was!

Just weird how things are different in different countries/cultures.
Not sure what kind of replies I want, but any would be interesting.


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## Getz (May 22, 2005)

In my area, it is assumed your son will be circed at birth. I was asked to give consent at the hospital (it was in the long list of standard check-in questions) and I had to be very diligent that they did not do it. I also have to be super diligent that no medical professional foricibly retracts him. Many doctors still think this is the correct thing to do.









I have been lucky that no one gave me grief for leaving my son whole (except DH but that is another post) and my ped is foreskin knowledgable. The ped often has medical/nursing students shadowing her, so I get to talk to them about proper foreskin care (as in DO NOT TOUCH IT!).

I never even knew people did NOT circumcise until a few years ago. It was just normal around here.


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## lilabet (Aug 6, 2003)

Hi Gabe'sMum, this is almost exactly the same thing as I posted a few weeks ago! Ha, it is so wierd a concept to us Brits I guess. I just completely couldn't get my head around it. (Probably TMI but I was completely shocked the first time I came across a circ-ed penis in a sexual situation, and didn't really know what to do with it!)

Where do you live?


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## Gabe'sMummy (Dec 4, 2008)

I live in the west midlands.









Getz, I am really surprised. I think that's awful that people do not know any different...after all nature meant the foreskin to be left well alone!

It's funny how different our experiences are. Is there a reason why peds in the US routinely circ???


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## MommytoB (Jan 18, 2006)

Medical Myths Benefits they assume are full time benefits of preventing from Uti's, cancers, std's , hiv, etc .

I can't comphrend the logic from it either ! Here circ'ed males 75% suffer from meatal stenosis a complication from circumcision and they need a meatomy but they rather risk that complication in hopes they will prevent a UTI!

Boys have lost their glans and have even died from circumcision or the circumcision after effects but they rather risk those complications because they think they are gonna prevent dirty disease foreskin complications.

Then also, they do it for oh daddy has the penis it was done to him he's a-okay so if he's fine we will do it cuz daddy is fine , he's the one with the equipment . I don't want him different than daddy but hey what if a dad was white , the mom was black , you get a black biracial baby like obama ya know.

My brother looks like my mother more than he ever did our bio dad!

he has brown hair and so does mom. Dad and I have both light brown hair.

Then plus mom's raising kids as single mom's their parts are all different from a boy learning how to use the potty !

Also, america has foreskin prejudice just like they did in the past when segreation was occurring .

Sadly they have the belief that foreskin is so diseased, dirty, bad, full of infection and ugly they become to have illogical fear that making them think not with very logical.

If they would realize the overseas world but sadly there are some americans who live overseas and some docs do circ over there .

So the one's that don't realize the one's who overseas who don't circumcise don't realize that no one is having later circ's as much as medically flawed doctors are having america's intact boys being later circ'ed for just a normal foreskin function!

But I think the goverment realizes it because if they did the would do a study America VS Europe, Britian, Iceland, Australia, Finland study but they know how the study will come out so they rather do their studies compared with Africa .


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## mntnmom (Sep 21, 2006)

I grew up in the States. Heard of circ', but had no idea what is was, had never seen an intact guy, so I had no idea what a "foreskin" really was. When my DH explained what circ was I almost puked. NO WAY we're doing that to our son! Luckily,he agreed completely.

Yes, American doctors praticing at Army hospitals in germany perform Circ' all the time. But atleast they don't give you a hard time when you say "no".


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## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

I had never thought about it until I was pregnant with a boy. People assume boys are/will be circumcised, here, AFAIK. In fact, I had heard people making foreskin jokes ("wearing a turtleneck" or whatever) and just didn't get it. Circumcision, in my experience, was sort of explained like they cut off the little extra flap on the penis the same way they cut the umbilical cord - like it's routine, painless, and happens to everyone. In fact, the only reason I thought about it at all is because my mom told me she witnessed a circumcision and there was no way anyone could tell her that baby was not in pain. She said she fought my dad a lot about it, because she said there was no way in heck she was letting that happen to her kid and my dad was not agreeable. Luckily it wasn't an issue in the long term because they only had girl babies.

Now that I know more, I'm SHOCKED that this is happening and is considered barbaric to NOT do it. Thankfully I found out before my son was born, but even the homebirth midwife had asked us if we were planning to do it. It's definately the "default" here, but it's not because they automatically do it - you still have to sign something to have the "procedure" done, but most people don't think of it beyond just signing they same way they do when they sign into the hospital, if that makes sense? (ok, it doesn't make sense, but it's how it is...







: )


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

Yes it is still sadly routine for the most part rates are dropping slowly down to around 54-56% circed still depending on the studies you look at.

When a boy is born in the hospital one of the first things you will hear is "we will do the circ the morning before he goes home" even woman who have not consented to it still get told this because the nurse/dr dosnt see many who dont plan to circ


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## bluetoes (May 12, 2007)

It is such a horrible custom isn't it? Although I am American, my one American partner I kmew really well was intact (ironically it was only 15 years later I knew this when his wife and I discussed circ! All the others were European as is my husband. The funny thing is I had no idea really what circ. was or how awful it was since I didn't have much experience with a cut penis. So I knew early on it didn't need to be done nor should it be done. That makes the ignorant myths many Americans have even more frustrating to me since I know they're completely ridiculous and a symptom of an ignorant society.


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## 1littlebit (Jun 1, 2008)

whenever i hear people yap about the benefits of circ i point out that we are really the only country that circs like that other countries leave their boys intact... and then they say that the US is way ahead of other countries medically.. those countries will catch up eventually







sometimes i wonder about people.

severely deluded party of one?


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## layla983 (Oct 8, 2007)

It's so common here that you recieve a bill from the ultrasound tech if you find out you're expecting a boy to pre-pay for the circ. If you don't find out either way, you get the bill just in case & if your baby turns out to be a girl, you're refunded the amount you pre-paid.

I started getting actual bills in the mail around 28 weeks last time I was pregnant, I called & was told to nevermind them, but I kept getting them & even got a letter saying if I didn't pay my "past due" amount for the pre-payment of the circ, they'd deal with me on a cash only basis in the future. I had to jump through hoops to stop getting bills.

So locally, it's common & really expected.


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## pixiekisses (Oct 14, 2008)

I had to ask about that too when I was new here. I mean, for us in Scandinavia is just a "way out there" thought. It's never even concidered or talked about here, or done. If not for medical purposes when the kid is older. It's just not an issue.


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## ~savah~ (Aug 24, 2008)

It is so common here that I once had a guy tell me how anyone who didn't circ. their son was "a bad mother". Of course I let him know that I believed it to be the other way around and his sister (my friend) jumped in and saved him from my wrath. She of course ended up circumcising her son when she had him a few years later







.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Well hospitals can't circ a baby without parental consent. On the other hand in many many areas of the US circ is considered the default.


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## MCatLvrMom2A&X (Nov 18, 2004)

There have been mistakes made and a boy was circed who wasnt supposed to be it happened last year actually. On avg. it seems to happen once a year or so.

At least one mama has posted here about them coming to get her ds to be circed after she had told them repeatedly that she didnt want him circed. They hadnt even looked at the paperwork they where just rounding up all the boys at the same time


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## tennisdude23 (Apr 2, 2008)

It depends where you live, what type of health services you use, and the insurance you have. It's not really routine anymore, with the current rates being half/half. Some hospitals don't even ask anymore and many insurance companies have dropped circumcision from coverage. If they do ask, you have to sign a consent form, but rarely does any one pressure you to do it from the medical staff. And the whole accidental circumcision thing is overblown. It can happen but its very rare because most hospitals have become very sensitive to lawsuits. So, rarely is the paperwork not checked. The problem is that because most hospitals bring up the subject merely through asking, many parents just say ok. without ever looking into it. It can bet you the rates would drop much quicker if hospitals would simply stop asking. But its easy money, so there is a little pressure for health institutions not to solicit the surgery.

When it comes to other people, well I am intact and I never heard a single comment about it, and I have seen intact guys. So, circumcision is not as default as you may think.


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## 1littlebit (Jun 1, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna* 
Well hospitals can't circ a baby without parental consent. On the other hand in many many areas of the US circ is considered the default.

i find this so odd. i see that it is the default.. and yet i don't get it yk? all baby boys are born with a foreskin... leaving it that way should be the default... not doing anything... and yet.. its not. it's odd not to do something.. like you are choosing something strange and extreme by not circing. i feel this way about vax too.. i mean obvious that is a more complicated issue.. but i do think it it is interesting that people who don't do it are asked if they have done their research.. not the other way around.


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## 1littlebit (Jun 1, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MCatLvrMom2A&X* 
There have been mistakes made and a boy was circed who wasnt supposed to be it happened last year actually. On avg. it seems to happen once a year or so.

At least one mama has posted here about them coming to get her ds to be circed after she had told them repeatedly that she didnt want him circed. They hadnt even looked at the paperwork they where just rounding up all the boys at the same time









wow. i would have flipping lost it. seriously... they would not have known what hit them. that is completely outrageous.


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## onelilguysmommy (May 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Arduinna* 
Well hospitals can't circ a baby without parental consent. On the other hand in many many areas of the US circ is considered the default.

and if you sign their general consent form...guess what you gave them. so you have to be for dang sure you make it known youre not having your baby have surgery. i just love how theres people, even doctors who will absolutely freak if you mention female circ even if its just inner labial removal and thats it and completely think male circ is great and theres something wrong with you and youre horrible if its not done.







:

anyway, yeah its considered normal and most places, sometimes strange or sick if you DONT. i thank god had my older in a hospital where they asked if i wanted it done, i said nope, they were cool with it, but then my mom told them i was paying for it cause she wasnt and asked when it was being done and i said it wasnt and she about had a fit..but whatever. now i have 2 (and am pregnant with most likely boy#3) and theyre all intact and staying that way! their dad thinks im strange too and most friends, but well, i saw the "informed consent" thing they gave my friend with her son and its a bunch of bs! her kids the one who ended up with weird scarring and his penis being shaped kinds oddly now and NO it wasnt like that when he was born, i was there and stuff..and yet she still has these comments about mine not being cut


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## Papai (Apr 9, 2007)

Yes, you really have to specify you DON'T want your child circ'd here in the States. Sad but true.


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## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *onelilguysmommy* 
and if you sign their general consent form...guess what you gave them. so you have to be for dang sure you make it known youre not having your baby have surgery.


Well I haven't given birth in 20 years but I have always lived in areas with a high latin american population where intact is the norm so it's not assumed at the hospitals where I've lived that people are circing.


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## Britishmum (Dec 25, 2001)

Yep. It's sad but true.

When I went to the birth center where I had my babies, I was shocked to the core when the nurse doing the talk to prospective parents talked about "the room where they take the baby boys to be circumcised." I almost puked, it was so horrible.

I was so shocked that my voice went all trembling (and I hated myself afterwards for being so incoherent) but I guess at least I was the lone voice who spoke out. Of course, she shot me down in flames. I said something about how it was not necessary and that there was plenty of info on the web about why. She retorted with a totally patronising laugh that there is plenty of info on the internet, but that people shouldn't believe it. Most of the poeple in the room laughed along with her.

It was totally horrible, and I still regret to this day that I was not coherent enough to lay into her on the subject. It's so frustrating to know your facts, but be so upset that you can't express them with clarity.

I also regret to this day that I did not lodge a formal complaint with the hospital. Dh was so embarrassed by the debacle (I threw the whole room into disarray) that I just shut up. Knowing what I know now about routine circumcision in this country, I'd never have shut up. I'd have taken my complaint to the highest level. This nurse was telling parents that it was essential to circ a baby if dad was circ'd, that there was evidence that to do otherwise was damaging to the child, that it was just a little snip, and all sorts of other crap.

Ack. I still want to cry thinking of it. It was so shocking to me, and I was so ineffective in my argument against her. But it just took me totally unawares - I had absolutely no idea how deep this tradition runs with people, and how resistant they are to the truth.









I just hope that maybe, just maybe, one parent there out of the hundred or so, went home and did some research before agreeing with this nurse that it is essential to do this 'minor' procedure.


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## odenata (Feb 1, 2005)

I was happy to find out that in my neck of the woods (Pacific NW) circ rates are much lower than the U.S. average - less than 35%. It's almost never done at the hospital I'm going to give birth at soon.


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## robertandenith (Apr 1, 2008)

unfortunately yes but we are going to end this!!!! if it means 10 or 20 years, we will end this, I can't believe UNITED STATES is allowing this to happen to baby boys!!!







:







:


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## njeb (Sep 10, 2002)

It all depends on which area of the U.S. you live in. The circ. rate is much lower on the west coast, with "only" 30% of the newborns being cut. Here in the Midwest, where I live, which is what the northern middle of the country is called, over 85% of all newborn boys are cut.














It makes me want to puke.


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## tennisdude23 (Apr 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *njeb* 
It all depends on which area of the U.S. you live in. The circ. rate is much lower on the west coast, with "only" 30% of the newborns being cut. Here in the Midwest, where I live, which is what the northern middle of the country is called, over 85% of all newborn boys are cut.














It makes me want to puke.









I think that number is lower these days, more like 70%.


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## njeb (Sep 10, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tennisdude23* 
I think that number is lower these days, more like 70%.

Well, the circ. rate is still way too high, but it's good to know it's going in the right direction. I just hope that some day, the rate is 0%.


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## 1stBabyAt39 (Dec 23, 2008)

Wow, I had no idea that so many are uncircumcised. Circumcision must be pretty common where I live, because I've honestly never seen one intact in all my life.

In regards to "retraction"...I always thought that men have to pull the foreskin back to put on a condom.







: Again, having never actually seen one, this is just something I've heard. Do they??


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## mimim (Nov 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1stBabyAt39* 
In regards to "retraction"...I always thought that men have to pull the foreskin back to put on a condom.







: Again, having never actually seen one, this is just something I've heard. Do they??

Eventually it retracts on it's own. Sometimes as a preschooler, but often not until puberty. When people talk about retracting on this board, usually they mean forcibly retracting it before it does so naturally.


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## Galatea (Jun 28, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1stBabyAt39* 
Wow, I had no idea that so many are uncircumcised. Circumcision must be pretty common where I live, because I've honestly never seen one intact in all my life.

Nor I, but I am 30 years old, and you 39. For the babies that are born now, only half of them in the US are circumcised. No baby born now will ever be having sex with a member of our generation!

I followed both my sons to the nursery to make sure they weren't circumcised. And wrote all over their diapers and onesies.


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## Juvysen (Apr 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Galatea* 
Nor I, but I am 30 years old, and you 39. For the babies that are born now, only half of them in the US are circumcised. No baby born now will ever be having sex with a member of our generation!


Not true... my BIL is dating a woman who is 30-some years older than he is... They've been together since he was 23-ish? He's 33-ish now...

There's all sorts of relationships out there


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## Fyrestorm (Feb 14, 2006)

I know I've mentioned this here before...

MGM is so common in the US that during autopsy, if a man in intact the report of autopsy states "uncircumcised" If the deceased is mutilated it either has no notation or says "normal genitals"

How freaking sick is that?


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## Galatea (Jun 28, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Juvysen* 
Not true... my BIL is dating a woman who is 30-some years older than he is... They've been together since he was 23-ish? He's 33-ish now...

There's all sorts of relationships out there









Okay, fine, unusual but possible, but my point is that the aesthetic tastes of a generation that will be considered old should not be taken into account. Just as our kids will not wear the same clothes, or hairstyles, or listen to the same music as us, they will not likely think the same way about circumcision as we do. And in a generation where half of the men are intact, and anti-circumcision info is everywhere, these kids will DEFINITELY know the difference.


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## Microsoap (Dec 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Fyrestorm* 
I know I've mentioned this here before...

MGM is so common in the US that during autopsy, if a man in intact the report of autopsy states "uncircumcised" If the deceased is mutilated it either has no notation or says "normal genitals"

How freaking sick is that?

The Columbine autopsy reports indicated that Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were circumcised and their male victims indicate that they were circumcsied (the victims were). It states on Elvis Pressley's, that he's intact. But on Bruce Springsteen's _birth_ certificate, it indicates that he's circ'd.


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## tennisdude23 (Apr 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Microsoap* 
The Columbine autopsy reports indicated that Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were circumcised and their male victims indicate that they were circumcsied (the victims were). It states on Elvis Pressley's, that he's intact. But on Bruce Springsteen's _birth_ certificate, it indicates that he's circ'd.

Lol, how do you know the autopsy reports of the Columbine accident? Given that these involved minors, I would not think they would be public knowledge.


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## odenata (Feb 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tennisdude23* 
Lol, how do you know the autopsy reports of the Columbine accident? Given that these involved minors, I would not think they would be public knowledge.

They're online.


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## tennisdude23 (Apr 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *odenata* 
They're online.

Oh, ok. But the info. here is limited with no mention of circ. status of many of the victims, at least according to what you showed me. I am actually surprised that a lot of this is public record, given that many of the victims were underage. Not that this is of any importance.


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## AstridS (Mar 9, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *1stBabyAt39* 
In regards to "retraction"...I always thought that men have to pull the foreskin back to put on a condom.








: Again, having never actually seen one, this is just something I've heard. Do they??

No, they don't. The foreskin retracts on its own when a man is having sex. So assuming that the condom is only put on when a man is aroused, the foreskin has already retracted.


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## calpurnia (Sep 26, 2004)

it was from mdc that i found this out too - so surprising! my dad was circed (it was common in his country at that time) & my brothers weren't, so i always learnt that it was a useless procedure that used to be fashionable... so surprised to find out it was so current in the states.

off-topic - *lilabet*, you're due on my duedate of a year ago! see sig for when she did come though







i am also in london...


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## hakunangovi (Feb 15, 2002)

Gabe's Mummy, Don't forget that circumcision became popular in the U.K. during the Victorian era and reached a peak of about 50% by the late '40s, especialy among the "upper classes". In 1949 Dr Douglas Gairdner's paper "The fate of the foreskin" was published. Shortly after that the NHS stopped paying for the circumcision of newborn boys and the custom rapidly declined. My guess is that you would find a fairly high proportion of the older generation males in the U.K. have been circumcised.

From reading some of the papers that have been published (available at www.cirp.org) it would seem that, like the Drs in the U.S. British Drs also employed circumcision as a "cure" for any and all foreskin problems. At least until fairly recently, as there is evidence that they are now encouraged to utilise less invasive procedures.


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