# Intact ds, circed cousins....how have you dealt?



## Quirky (Jun 18, 2002)

I am pessimistically thinking ds and any other sons I have will be the only intact boys on my dh's side of the family (2 circed boys, 1 boy on the way for whom I've advocated strongly but I'm not optimistic.







)

DS is only 2, too young to recognize a difference....but what happens when he gets older and is around his cousins at the beach or whatnot? Or if his cousins notice the difference? What do I say to them, or to him?

I really don't want to have to lie for the sake of family peace and say something along the lines of "cousin's parents made a choice and that's OK." It's not OK, and that just perpetuates the cycle of violence. OTOH, obviously my poor nephews had no choice in the matter because of their parents' ignorance,







and I don't want to make them feel bad (their parents, on the other hand, I don't mind so much because they were WILFULLY IGNORANT.







)

I guess the same question comes up with respect to friends as well as family....

Any suggestions on how to walk this line between intactivism and tact?


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## AllyRae (Dec 10, 2003)

Hmmm...I've never seen my siblings, cousins, or parents naked (at least since I became old enough to remember such things). I don't think about it because honestly, I don't forsee my son and his cousin being naked together as older kids... That and they live 5 hours a way. Besides, your son will meet other circ'ed boys as well...I guess just explain what it is any why you chose not to do it.


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## TiredX2 (Jan 7, 2002)

I'm not forseeing much of a problem, either.

In our family, there are circd: 11, 11, 8 and intact 8 & 2 and I haven't seen it come up. I heard about 8 year old being circd and was SHOCKED because 11 year old big brother had a botched circ. Couldn't believe they would do it again (and their mom is a nurse!).

We think it is wrong, though, and would present it as such. The same way we present any of my sibs spanking or how my brother smokes. IMO, there are some things that transcend personal opinion.


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## Tinijocaro (Jan 4, 2003)

My circx'd nephew (then 5) saw my intact son (then 4) and asked why my son's penis was so big. that was the only comment and they haven't been together naked since then. They are now 10 and 9. I responded that everyone is different.


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## ared1 (Dec 13, 2003)

Well, my DS is intact but his cousin is not. I gave her the Fleiss article and she had contact with my son before hers was born but they still did it. My DD has started asking qeustions about it and I present it to her the same way I present it to anyone else. I gave her the reasons why (minus the sex talk) and told her that alot of people did it because they didn't know better. That I felt it was wrong and I will tell my son and his cousins the same thing if it ever comes up. Let their parents explain to them why they cut a part of his body off. They made the decision to do it and they must deal with the reprecussions.


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## TiredX2 (Jan 7, 2002)

Quote:

Let their parents explain to them why they cut a part of his body off. They made the decision to do it and they must deal with the reprecussions.








I won't lie to my kids to make someone else feel better about their poor choices. Harsh but true.


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## calngavinsmom (Feb 19, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TiredX2*







I won't lie to my kids to make someone else feel better about their poor choices. Harsh but true.


Damn straight people!!!!


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## Stevie (Jun 20, 2004)

ITA and to take it further, I do change my son's diaper in front of older children. When we were camping a few weeks ago there were a 9 yo boy and his 11 yo sister with us and while both were there, one of them asked why DS's penis looked different. (I think the words were, "what's wrong with Mandela's penis?") I told them that this is what a penis looks like before they cut the end of it off, went on to explain that a lot of people just don't know any better and doctors are really bad about not telling them any better. We had a good little discussion. Their mother was there and just said she was glad I was around so they got the chance to learn. (her son was adopted at the age of 2, already circ'd)

Intactivists in the making


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## Ilaria (Jan 14, 2002)

If Owen ever asked me why his penis is like that I would simply say ALL boys are born like that, but some parents have part of their boys' penises cut off.

All of his close friends are cut and since we all have pools, they see each other naked all the time...one time Owen pointed at a friend's penis and said "what's that on top!?" (you know, the glans sticking out) I wanted to scream: You mean, "What is he missing!??!!!"


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## NatureMama3 (Feb 25, 2004)

It's never been an issue for us (and sadly, they ARE the only uncut ones), but if it were to become one we'd deal with it like any of our other choices. Say it's simply a different choice they made, that not everyone has the information we had and that while we would NOT choose that, we still love them.


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## BrettsMama (Oct 17, 2003)

To your child I would just explain that cousin's parents chose to have part of the penis cut off when he was a baby. You chose not to do that because you think that is wrong to do to a baby. If they don't like it, too dang bad. It's the truth.

Now if the cousins were questioning you, I'd probably tread carefully. I mean, they are just kiddos.


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## Mommiska (Jan 3, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BrettsMama*
To your child I would just explain that cousin's parents chose to have part of the penis cut off when he was a baby. You chose not to do that because you think that is wrong to do to a baby. If they don't like it, too dang bad. It's the truth.

Now if the cousins were questioning you, I'd probably tread carefully. I mean, they are just kiddos.

ITA. I will tell my children what circ is and why it is a bad thing to do to a baby.

I will be honest if they ask why other parents have done it to their babies - that it is done in America for social reasons - because 'everyone else' is doing it.

And I'll use that to discuss why it is not a good idea to do things just because everyone else is doing things.

I'll also talk with my children about the importance of compassion towards those who are circed (and the fact that, in America, many children don't realise they are circed/don't know it is a bad thing).

As for other children - I think, if this is ever an issue, I will refer them to their parents. As someone else posted here - it is not our responsibility to explain to a child that his parents chose to have part of his penis cut off.







Additionally, I'm really not sure what I could say that the parents would find acceptable, you know?


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## 2tadpoles (Aug 8, 2004)

My boys have never seen their cousins naked, nor vice versa. But my oldest saw his best friend naked when they were about seven. They were changing after swimming.

He later asked me how come his friend's penis looked different (my son is intact). I told him, very matter-of-factly, that some people choose to have the skin surgically removed when the baby is born. His eyes got wide and he grimaced, and he said, "Too bad the baby doesn't get to say anything about it!"

I don't think my younger boy has ever seen another boy's penis, aside from his brother's.


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## kathy1_10 (Jul 18, 2004)

I was giving my ds and two of his friends a bath and a couple days ago my ds ask what was on top one of his friends penis, so I explained circumcison to him. I was suprise how small his friends circumcised penis looked compared to my ds penis. I felt so bad for ds's friend it looked so unnatural, his penis stood straight out where my ds hangs down even his other intact friend looked smaller, but I think its because my ds has a long foreskin.


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## MyCalling (Sep 1, 2004)

I would probably choose to explain things at least a little to a child that comes up and makes a comment in front of my sons. I would hate to say "go ask your parents" and have him come back later telling my sons they are messed up or ugly because that's the bull their parents fed them.

My sons have seen two little circ'ed boys both of whom were messed up in some way from it. One was red and lopsided and the other had a huge scar bulge on the top like a growth. My oldest gave a funny look and walked away. He was too young to comment but the look was priceless! Thankfully we have mainly very anti-circ. friends and all other boys are intact they might see later.

Jessi


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## juliemaye (Oct 26, 2003)

I haven't really thought about it. My DH is circ but my son and future sons won't be. So they will probably learn about the difference in our home first. I really don't see it as a big deal. If th question comes up...I will just explain it the best way I can for how old he is.


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## BoobyJuice (Jun 25, 2003)

My husband has a big family (there are 15 grandchildren with 2 more on the way) and everyone swims and has had bath together. Our 2 sons are the only ones intact. My oldest is only 3 but has already noticed. We explained that their parents has part of their penises cut off and that we didn't do that to him. We tried to emphasize that he was normal but not make it sound too horrible - he's in the very honest age and we didn't want him saying something outrageous to his cousins. The funny thing is there is such an argument about "looking like daddy". Guess what? He's never noticed that daddy is circ'ed. I think it's the size, the hair, whatever - they don't think to compare themselves to daddy.

But I do feel it's a fine line to walk. Instilling pride in being intact in your sons so they don't feel different in a bad way while not saying anything that would make other children feel bad. It isn't their fault their parents did such a horrible thing to them.

I'm personally batting 0% - I find it so depressing. Every person I have ever talked to about it has done it anyway. The worse part is now a few of them think it's wrong, now after they've already done it.


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## alissakae (Jun 14, 2002)

Our extended family is heavy on girls, so my kids just have one male cousin on each side of the family. My sister's ds is intact (we're the NON-circumcising family) but my dh's brother had his son cut







. The circ'd cousin is only one month younger than my third son, and I'm not even sure if they've ever seen each other naked (they are 14 now). It doesn't matter, my boys know what circumcision is and know that if questioned the best response is to tell the other person that they haven't had any of their penis removed. If a child were to ask me, I'd also tell them that some parents ask doctors to cut off part of their baby boy's penises but we kept our babies whole. Then it's up to the parents to explain their reasoning to their son.


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## ABC's&123's (Jul 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BoobyJuice*
The worse part is now a few of them think it's wrong, now after they've already done it.









*Hmmm... interesting that you think that is 'worse'. Mightn't they have more sons in the future and keep them intact? Look at the bright side!







You weren't able to prevent the circumcisions they've already done, but additional sons, friends, grandchildren, relatives- might well be intact at least partially because of you.

Just a thought... (my 3 y/o is circumcised)
















Ang.*


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## BoobyJuice (Jun 25, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ABC's&123's*
*Hmmm... interesting that you think that is 'worse'. Mightn't they have more sons in the future and keep them intact? Look at the bright side!







You weren't able to prevent the circumcisions they've already done, but additional sons, friends, grandchildren, relatives- might well be intact at least partially because of you.

Just a thought... (my 3 y/o is circumcised)
















Ang.*

I see where you are coming from. Just find it really depressing that they decided after it was to late that it wasn't good. And I don't know a single person IRL who circ'ed their first but not additional boys - even the ones who said they'd decided it was wrong. They've all said it just seemed too wierd to have done it to one and not the rest. Guess I'm just not feeling all that positive about my ability to make a difference. Everyone seems to do it anyone - and then regret it.









But thank you for the reminder. Maybe they'll go forward and spread the word. I can always hope. (Of course I have in-laws still telling us that our almost 4 yo and almost 2yo are going to have to be circ'ed sometime after they get some horrible infection







she's due with a boy in 2 weeks. )


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## MyCalling (Sep 1, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BoobyJuice*
(Of course I have in-laws still telling us that our almost 4 yo and almost 2yo are going to have to be circ'ed sometime after they get some horrible infection







she's due with a boy in 2 weeks. )

I'm very rude to rude people so I would have said, "Millions of men in Europe would be laughing at your stupidity." You know how they all get cut later in life from horrible infection, right?







:


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## BoobyJuice (Jun 25, 2003)

The irony is that my husband's parents are both from Europe. His own father isn't circ'ed. Yet somehow all of his (dh's) brothers are sure something horrible is going to happen and have circ'ed their own sons.

We're surrounded by mainstream folk on all sides (we're the freaks







). My step-brother's son is also circ'ed. When he and my oldest were just 3 they were bathing together and noticed the difference. I explained that his father had had the end of his penis removed. I then told them both they'd have to ask him why. His answer? It's like a haircut. What !?!?!?!


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## ABC's&123's (Jul 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *BoobyJuice*
His answer? It's like a haircut. What !?!?!?!

*Wow- need to get the name of that barber, as I'd sure hate to come back missing HEALTHY BODY PARTS!







:








Ang.*


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