# Goth Diaper??? im i the only one...



## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

ok so i was this and i dont know i may be the only one but i think this is just wrong...









http://hyenacart.com/prod_details.php?id=35288&vid=124

it looks kind of prono or fetish to me... am i the only one..

i hope this is the right place to post this...i just seems like its not nice for a child that all..

oh and i love black dipes but Leather and metal rings is a bit much..


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## vkberes (Jun 26, 2004)

The leather straps may be a little constrictive on the butt. :LOL It is not my taste now but I was such a little goth in highschool that my shock meter for such things is worn down.


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## Joannect (Jan 19, 2004)

:LOL I saw it and thought it was a S&M'ish look.







: It made me chuckle but I have a weird sense of humor.


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## GeorgiaGalHeidi (Apr 16, 2004)

Well, not my style, but I would not go call CPS either, LOL! I would love to be a fly on the wall when the diaper mama shows it off to, say, those cloth diaper hating MIL's! HA! It'd be worth getting just for that shock value. LOL!


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## AinNJ (Aug 10, 2004)

yeah, i think i'm a little uncomfortable with that too.


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

I saw that and it just made me feel verrrrrry old. I don't think there's anything wrong with it, and it would be cute for Halloween, especially for the shock value!


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## punko5 (Feb 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AinNJ*
yeah, i think i'm a little uncomfortable with that too.


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## Leilalu (May 29, 2004)

I don't like it. I can see the goth appeal I guess, but I am always thinking in terms of safety.:LOL Dd could very easily try to use that ring to pick ds up .... lol At least, that's the first thing I thought. Or, he would get himself caught on something.lol No, my kids are waaaaay to curious for that kind of dipe


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## Spark (Nov 21, 2001)

When I think punk or goth I think of this...
http://www.crankypantshome.com/longies.html

But, not quite that dipe. It's interesting. REally creative, but it doesn't quite do it for me.


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## abbyskeeper (Mar 2, 2004)

This my first reaction. I was never goth, but that looks more S&M to me than goth. Maybe I'm too old to judge, though :LOL I like to think of myself as still fairly hip, but maybe I'm just fooling myself.....


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## mamadodson (Apr 6, 2004)

Not my taste at all, and how can that possibly be comfortable to have a piece of metal on your bum when the baby falls ..... ouch!!


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## WickidaWitch (Feb 16, 2002)

definitely different......


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## QueenSheba'sMom (Feb 4, 2003)

I thought it was s & m, too, so I was confused and surprised.

not my thing at all. I would even go as far as to say that it seems wrong to impose a diaper like that on a kid. But I'm very sensitive about that kinda thing. I want my kids to choose their own everything and even have issues with most advocacywear.

I wouldn't call cps about it, though. Just


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## Jane (May 15, 2002)

I think the skull longies are just the right amount of goth. That first one looks S&M - representing a sexuality, not a culture. But maybe if Mommy and Daddy are Harley enthusiasts?


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## vkberes (Jun 26, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Leilalu*
I don't like it. I can see the goth appeal I guess, but I am always thinking in terms of safety.:LOL Dd could very easily try to use that ring to pick ds up .... lol At least, that's the first thing I thought. Or, he would get himself caught on something.lol No, my kids are waaaaay to curious for that kind of dipe


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## 3JKids (Jan 6, 2005)

Hmmmmm...

See, I look at that, and I think B&D. That disturbs me, considering B&D is a specific fetish IMO...


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## katytheprincess2 (Jun 10, 2004)

I never got the whole goth thing







: I have to admit when I saw that diaper I was a bit disturbed. But that is just me. Very creative though and looks very well made.


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## AinNJ (Aug 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Spark*
When I think punk or goth I think of this...
http://www.crankypantshome.com/longies.html

But, not quite that dipe. It's interesting. REally creative, but it doesn't quite do it for me.

now i *love* the skull longies!!! they're adorable!!

Quote:

But maybe if Mommy and Daddy are Harley enthusiasts?
at one time dh and i both owned harleys and dh manages a motorcycle dealership. and i think it's inappropriate for a child.


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## Jane (May 15, 2002)

You're obviously not enthusiastic enough - you have maintained common sense!

I wasn't meaning to slag on harley owners at all. Just that I've seen some things remade in leather that shouldn't have been - dog jackets, furniture in harness leather, etc. It seems to be marketed to harley owners, although I don't know who actually buys it.

I didn't know until last week that my dh works with Mr. Leather "Our Town". He won the leather wearing body building contest.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

It makes me think of punk/goth. It doesn't make me think of porno/s&m.


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## Boobiemama (Oct 2, 2002)

It gave me a bad vibe, s&m'ish. And I am not shocked by most things, I am pretty open minded and not offeended easily, but icck.
I'm all for black diapers, but the leather straps are a bit much.


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## LoveBaby (Jul 22, 2004)

whoa...that totally gives me the creepys. Not goth, but definately S&M. Eeewww...just leaves a bad taste in my mouth especially as something for babies.


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Spark*
When I think punk or goth I think of this...
http://www.crankypantshome.com/longies.html

But, not quite that dipe. It's interesting. REally creative, but it doesn't quite do it for me.









:

this is punk or goth to me...and maybe a something with spikes on it is punk but i still wouldnt put it on a kid..KWIM?

i will say i really like the black one with ruffles on the butt...that is really cute and looks PAINLESS...unlike the leather strap one with a metal ring...

i dont know maybe im just always thinking of how it would feel to wear something like that KWIM? i dont think it would be so comfy..


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## ChichosMama (Aug 20, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Boobiemama*
It gave me a bad vibe, s&m'ish. And I am not shocked by most things, I am pretty open minded and not offeended easily, but icck.
I'm all for black diapers, but the leather straps are a bit much.


took the words out of my mouth.


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## jentilla (Nov 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *LoveBaby*
whoa...that totally gives me the creepys. Not goth, but definately S&M. Eeewww...just leaves a bad taste in my mouth especially as something for babies.









:

I know the WAHM was trying to appeal to certain moms, but...


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## MamaJennsMunkies (Oct 2, 2005)

YIKES!







thats sorta...well...soo NOT Gothic...more SnM'ish to me...in my opinion


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## mom2orionplus1 (Sep 17, 2004)

That looks more S&M to me too. Creepy.


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## Mamabug&co. (Mar 7, 2004)

Okay, back in the day, I used to dress in a mixture of grunge-punk-whatever I had that looked different, etc. I smile, whenever I see my younger family members doing the whole 'I'm a punk/goth/whatever' look, since for some kiddos, its just fashion and music history for the most part repeating itself







Kids are most definitely on a fashion rebellion, and are mixing preppy shirts with studded belts, etc. On the subject of the diaper...everyone is entitled to their opinion, and some obviously are not going to like the diaper shown. Some will love it, and may even purchase it. Personally, I don't like it. And, not because I think it stands for anything nasty, but because, I just don't get the leather look. Just like I dislike anything with skulls on it (they scare me-lol







). But, that's just me. Her diapers look very well made though, and the lace one is cute


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

Looks like something you would see in the S&M scene... on an adult lol


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

If a person capable of making their own decisions wants to wear leather straps and spikes or whatever, I could care less. But I think it's wrong to put it on a baby. That can not be comfortable to lay on. I would never put that on my baby.

And FYI merryone, I don't think anyone has a problem with "kinky people", it's seeing that kind of thing on a baby that feels wrong. Your use of the word kinky implies that you think it's sexual looking, and IMO, it's wrong to put anything sexual on a baby. You can express your kinky sexual preferences without involving a child.


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## scatterbrainedmom (May 31, 2005)

it is a little disturbing to me also, but so are a lot of halloween costumes. but it is just that to me, a halloween costume.


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## jacquel13 (Sep 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bunnyhatanpaa*
ok so i was this and i dont know i may be the only one but i think this is just wrong...









http://hyenacart.com/prod_details.php?id=35288&vid=124

it looks kind of prono or fetish to me... am i the only one..

i hope this is the right place to post this...i just seems like its not nice for a child that all..

oh and i love black dipes but Leather and metal rings is a bit much..









uhhh...you're not the only one. . I agree it looks a little too "sexual fetish" for a kid.


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

Gotta chime in here.. Coming from a Goth in the old days ( and still when I can get out without the kiddos!) that dipe is ALL Goth! The straps and ring are detachable, so I don't really see them as being a hazard if they are used just for looks out and about.
DH ADORED IT! Of course... I also own diapers that say "Punk Rock Girl" and "NIN ~ uh huh", and those are his fav!
Honestly, its labled Goth, it looks Goth, its presented as a Halloween dipe, where is the S&M and B&D vibe coming from?? Its a dipe, ya'll! I think she did a great job coming up with something TOTALLY original in design and appropriate for the holiday.

Oh.. and the skull thing.. so not Goth. Billy & Mandy... oh so Goth .. yah yah yah!

Just MHO, of course









ETA: Had to amend my statement on the skulls not being GOTH.. THESE ~ http://www.universalmama.com/product...w_Product=2463 ARE Goth and oh do I wish I had the $$ for em!!!!


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sdurdin*
it is a little disturbing to me also, but so are a lot of halloween costumes. but it is just that to me, a halloween costume.









I can totally see this at a costume party where they have the toddler dressed up in a goth outfit with black makeup on (although I don't know if a toddler would tolerate black makeup, but you know what I mean).


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## Red Fern (May 2, 2005)

I dont see anything wrong with it.
And I doubt that goth folks are thinking about S&M when the dipe their kiddos in that.
To each is own man...


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MerryOne*
And the replies were along the lines of you'd have no common sense to like this type,







way to go on not judging.

You said the above, and then you said this:

Quote:

I don't see it as sexual and please DON'T put words in my mouth!

I didn't see any replies that stated "You have no common sense if you like this diaper". People were just stating their opinions, like you are. Some did not like it, just as you do like it. Other's liked it along with you. So if anyone is putting words in people's mouths... I definitely didn't put any words in your's, I even quoted you saying something about feeling judged as a kinky person. Those were your words, not mine. I didn't say it was kinky.

Much of what you are saying are non sequiturs to me, as in does not follow. So I cna't really respond. Like this:
"I am alternative, I think it's sick that most ppl in here think that it's something that someone who use to show off their sexulity with their child "

So why don't we just agree to disagree? All this thread is, is opinion. You don't have to like mine and I don't have to like yours. And as far as judgments, yeah I make judgments every day. Like about what is better to feed my kids, what is the best use of my money, what I want to expose them to, what I want to do with my life, etc. I just don't view judgment as a bad thing. I see that term used so often as a (negative) sweeping reference to anyone who has an opinion someone else doesn't like, then you're "judgmental" and that is a very bad thing. No one in this thread said anything personal to you, you turned it into something personal yourself.

The last thing I will say on this thread (I promise, because you get your hand slapped around here if you say too much and I don't want to get the thread deleted), is just that you are a much better judge of what is Gothic than I am. I'm sure you have gathered, that I was never Goth. So I will concede that you know much more than me on that particular topic. I'm positive that's how the maker of the diaper intended it and that's cool for all of you who like it. I just personally don't and wouldn't put it on my babe. That's all.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

I have to agree with the last 4 posts. I don't see it as sexual.

Just because some people dress up in leather straps and metal rings when they want to look sexy doesn't mean that leather straps and metal rings are ALWAYS sexual.

Other people dress up in pink lace when they want to look sexy. Does that mean that diapers with pink lace are sexual?

There are lots of people who incorporate black leather and metal into their clothing style all the time: punks, goths, bikers...


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Cross posted with you, nicandboys. I can see why someone who likes the diaper would be offended by this thread. People haven't simply been saying that they don't care for it personally. If that were all there was to this thread, I wouldn't have a problem with it and probably no one else would either. But it seems like some people have actually been implying that it would be *wrong* for anyone to put this diaper on a child. And I think someone did say something along the lines of someone having sense for not liking the diaper.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

I also see MerryOne's point about some people being quick to put their minds in the gutter.

I have an aunt who has a black leather whip. She took it to work one day so she could repair it on her lunch hour. Everyone was shocked by it. Not because they thought of it as a weapon, but because they thought of it as a sex toy. They were all making comments about how she must do something sexual with it. It is not her sex toy. It is just her whip.

The USA is such a sexually-oriented culture that sometimes it seems like you can hardly say or do anything without people thinking it's sexual.


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
Cross posted with you, nicandboys. I can see why someone who likes the diaper would be offended by this thread. People haven't simply been saying that they don't care for it personally. If that were all there was to this thread, I wouldn't have a problem with it and probably no one else would either. But it seems like some people have actually been implying that it would be *wrong* for anyone to put this diaper on a child. And I think someone did say something along the lines of someone having sense for not liking the diaper.

You're correct Sustainer, I said I think it's wrong to put it on a baby. But mostly because it looked so uncomfortable. I, however, have a huge hang up about putting comfortable things on my baby. I have always been hung up on having hidden snaps, let alone a big buckle on my babe's butt. If it were a babe that wasn't mobile, they would lie on it. But, I stand corrected, because I did see someone say earlier that it's removable. So my fault for not reading the whole description. I didn't see the comment about having sense, I'll have to go back and look for it and see how I interpret it myself. I still dont like it and think leather and metal look better on a teen or adult than on a baby, but again, that's only my opinion. But I want my kids to be dressed innocently and remain innocent for as long as possible- we're kids for such a short period of time. And I tend to agree with someone earlier, who commented that she doesn't like to express her views through her children, or something along those lines. I don't put controversial things on my baby, but you are right that if someone else wants to do that, it's their business. I still think even if someone says it is *wrong* to do it, than that is still just their opinion. If you feel firmly that it's not wrong than why worry about someone else's opinion? I hear all the time that it's wrong to still let my toddler nurse all night, but I'm not worried about what they think.


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## madtan (Sep 24, 2005)

My first reaction







: I wouldnt let my







: wear that....if I had one. I feel... uke


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
The USA is such a sexually-oriented culture that sometimes it seems like you can hardly say or do anything without people thinking it's sexual.

I always hear the opposite- that the US is so into violence while being such prudes about sex at the same time. I see what you are saying, but I also think that it's part of what you have to take into account. If it bothers you that people might take it that way, then why wear it/put it on your child. If you don't see anything wrong with it, then just wear it proudly and know some people are going to have a different opinion and it won't matter to you. When I look at it, it looks so very adult to me and inappopriate for a baby. Again, that's just _my_ opinion.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Sorry, I didn't mean the people who objected to it for other reasons, like comfort. I meant the people who claimed it was sexual.

I do concern myself with comments that indicate criticism of others. Especially when I believe those comments are based on ignorance.

We *are* prudes. That's why we're so obsessed with sex. Because we repress it.

Just for the record, I personally wouldn't buy this diaper or put it on my baby.


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

I think the main problem is that, rather than everyone who doesn't like the diaper saying "Hey, that just isn't for me..." or "I personally wouldn't like to see my child in that diaper".. some posters basically came out with "WHOA! Who on earth would put their child in a diaper that looks like it was made for some deviant sexual activity??"

I think that those of us who think it is cool are being made to feel like we are some wierd sexual freaks for even considering it as something we would let our children wear!

Noone is saying that you cannot have an opinion.. all I am asking is that everyone remember that they are JUST opinions, and we really should all be a little more careful about our wording of them in a place where there are bound to be differing ones.

Love it, Hate it.. it really DOESN'T matter.. what DOES matter is how we treat each other, yah?


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*

We *are* prudes. That's why we're so obsessed with sex. Because we repress it.

Speak for yourself!














:

hehehehehehehe!


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Actually I was referring to most of the people in this country and *excluding* myself :LOL


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## Just*Lindsay (May 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
I also see MerryOne's point about some people being quick to put their minds in the gutter.

I have an aunt who has a black leather whip. She took it to work one day so she could repair it on her lunch hour. Everyone was shocked by it. Not because they thought of it as a weapon, but because they thought of it as a sex toy. They were all making comments about how she must do something sexual with it. It is not her sex toy. It is just her whip.

The USA is such a sexually-oriented culture that sometimes it seems like you can hardly say or do anything without people thinking it's sexual.


Hmm...I guess I dont get the whip thing. I see a whip as being violent, I mean why else would you have a whip? Just for decoration? So...while your aunt is allowed to have a whip for hitting a rock in anger, sex, whatever, I have to say I CAN understand why people were talking...

Anyways, that was WAY o/t, lmao. I also see this as S&M-ish and if goth, very adult-like, so therefore _I personally_ feel it is inappropiate for a child. I guess its b/c I dont like adult-like costumes or clothing on a child period. Children are so naive and innocent, why put anything on them that suggests otherwise, such as devil costumes, etc (btw Im not christian and dont even believe in the devil so its NOT a religios thing). Anyways, who cares what I think, if you like it, buy it, I personally, again, do not and would not buy that for my child EVER!

Also, Im not bashing the wahm, I think she did this innocentely thinking it would appeal to someone "goth" or for halloween.


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## bleurae (Feb 25, 2005)

I think it is funny as can be and adorable. Maybe too hot for summer, but cute nonetheless. Placing sexual inuendo onto it is on those who do it and imo pretty sad. I think placing army camo on a childs bum is much much more offensive.


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## Boobiemama (Oct 2, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*

I have an aunt who has a black leather whip. She took it to work one day so she could repair it on her lunch hour. Everyone was shocked by it. Not because they thought of it as a weapon, but because they thought of it as a sex toy. They were all making comments about how she must do something sexual with it. It is not her sex toy. It is just her whip.


So WHAT did she do with her whip?? :LOL I had one (although it was called a crop) when I raised pigs and showed them at the fair. But cant imagine any other reason I'd need a whip, unless its for animals.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Just*Lindsay*
Hmm...I guess I dont get the whip thing. I see a whip as being violent, I mean why else would you have a whip? Just for decoration? So...while your aunt is allowed to have a whip for hitting a rock in anger, sex, whatever, I have to say I CAN understand why people were talking...

She doesn't use it in anger or in sex. But people weren't talking about it being violent. They were convinced that she must use it for sexual purposes.

She likes whips. She considers it a collector's item. She practices whipping it. She goes in the back yard and whips the air, the ground, whatever. It takes skill. It's a hobby.


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## Just*Lindsay (May 19, 2004)

Aha, thanks...I have to say I would have wondered as well, b/c I would have never known it was a hobby, almost a sport, yk? Im not saying I would have judged her but I would have been on of those ones who wondered!


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## Simplicity (Mar 24, 2004)

It makes me think of Punk/Goth. Nothing S&M at all.


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## bleurae (Feb 25, 2005)

I have a friend who owns whips as a hobby as well. I also have friends who own em for s&m but that's another story.


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

I go yearly to "leatherfest" (a bdsm gathering lol) and honestly, I have seen very similar shorts/pants on many adults. - that's why the first thing that came to my mind is s&m. I'm sure if i had never actually seen anything like that before I would find it completely innocent.


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## shishkeberry (Sep 24, 2004)

I didn't think of the diaper as sexual at all when I saw it. I like it







There aren't enough goth clothes for kids out there, IMO.


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
She doesn't use it in anger or in sex. But people weren't talking about it being violent. They were convinced that she must use it for sexual purposes.

She likes whips. She considers it a collector's item. She practices whipping it. She goes in the back yard and whips the air, the ground, whatever. It takes skill. It's a hobby.


i have been laughing all day at the thought of your aunt in the Backyard with her whip!!! :LOL Whip a way women!!!


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## 15yrsbetweenboys (Aug 11, 2003)

I have been trying to write a brief reply to this thread since I first saw it-and I haven't yet been able to write anything that I feel accurately represents my feelings about this topic. I try very hard to consider peoples feelings prior to posting or running my mouth-let's just say that I go out of my way to NOT hurt peoples feelings if at all possible.

Honestly, my first reaction to this post is empathy for the wahm who made this-it is a very creative and "out of the box" idea IMO, and it has been TOTALLY taken out of context and had an entirely different and unintended shadow cast on it. I realize that posters are sharing their own opinions on the subject-but, isn't there a point at which individual opinion (or, sharing said opinion in a public forum) becomes inappropriate? (say, when voicing your opinion is hurtful or detrimental to others? Or, perhaps when there is absolutely no benefit to anyone in sharing said opinion?)

My father always had this to say about opinions (and it is my opinion that he is right LOL)
"yes, we all have opinions-but, we all have a-holes too and we don't feel obligated to share those-why then should we feel obligated to share our opinions??"

Whether or not a particular item is appropriate for our children is up to each of us as individuals to decide-and I for one would rather make those choices on my own-without public input or approval. Honestly, this thread (like many before) makes me want to cry because of the lack of consideration shown to the wahm involved..

But, again this is my opinion and I realize nobody asked for it (see above on opinions), but I felt like I would be wrong to NOT point out how this COULD be (and most certainly IS) hurtful to her.........

Shan


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## nitareality (Oct 23, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *15yrsbetweenboys*
Whether or not a particular item is appropriate for our children is up to each of us as individuals to decide-and I for one would rather make those choices on my own-without public input or approval. Honestly, this thread (like many before) makes me want to cry because of the lack of consideration shown to the wahm involved..
Shan

























When I saw it I thought "harley baby".


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## mamatojack (Apr 12, 2005)

Love it!! So original and great for Halloween which it's marketed for.







Hats off to the WAHM for such a unique idea.


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

i wanted to say sorry if i hurt the WAHMs feelings by posting this topic at all... im sure she wasnt thinking S&M when she made this...it was just the feeling i got....i do really like the other black one with the ruffles it think its super rad...

it just seems that on this type of forum we shold be able to say the things we like about a dipe and the things we dont....without hurting the Whams feelings...just because this dipe is a little much for me doesnt mean i wouldnt buy the other black ruffle one if i had a girl or that i think she is a bad Wham.. or that i think someone is crazy for buying it... KWIM. It would just me crazy for me to think of buying it because the feeling i got.

i know its hard to say things like dislikes without the Wham getting hurt because they are members here too as well..

so i just wanted to say to to maker im sorry if me posting this has hurt your feeling in any way....


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Just*Lindsay*
Aha, thanks...I have to say I would have wondered as well, b/c I would have never known it was a hobby, almost a sport, yk? Im not saying I would have judged her but I would have been on of those ones who wondered!









I would expect people to *wonder* about why someone has a whip, but there's a great deal of difference between wondering and actually making comments about what someone thinks someone else does in their bedroom. They were seriously shocked too, they weren't kidding.

As for the diaper I'd just like to say again that I agree with those who have been saying that's it's one thing to say that a diaper's style just isn't one's cup of tea and it's another thing to say that a diaper is actually wrong. This is a sensitive topic so I think people should be careful what they say.


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
As for the diaper I'd just like to say again that I agree with those who have been saying that's it's one thing to say that a diaper's style just isn't one's cup of tea and it's another thing to say that a diaper is actually wrong. This is a sensitive topic so I think people should be careful what they say.









:

I feel bad for the WAHM who made the diaper. She did something totally original and hip, IMO. I don't think there's anything wrong at all with saying that you don't like it, or it's not for you, but it's another thing entirely to say that it's wrong for someone else to buy it or you think it's wrong in general.

Incidentally, I think there's a bit of an untapped market for goth or punk type baby stuff, judging by how well some of it (like the Minor Threat cover) sells. I don't know anythinga bout Minor Threat the band, but I assume they're either goth, punk, or grunge, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## Yarnia (Aug 29, 2003)

My first thought was "cool, a diaper with a handle! That could be useful for roaming toddlers" lol Snap a leash on that baby. KIDDING

You guys have almost totally squashed my goth theme soaker plans! scary scary!
Elizabeth


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## binxsmom (Jun 14, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KristiMetz*







:

Incidentally, I think there's a bit of an untapped market for goth or punk type baby stuff, judging by how well some of it (like the Minor Threat cover) sells. I don't know anythinga bout Minor Threat the band, but I assume they're either goth, punk, or grunge, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.










i totally agree with this!! i would love to find some little plaid punk bondage pants for both dd and ds. it would make tieing them up sooooo much easier. :nana:


----------



## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*
i totally agree with this!! i would love to find some little plaid punk bondage pants for both dd and ds. it would make tieing them up sooooo much easier. :nana:









:


----------



## Sabin (Aug 30, 2004)

I just want to say that I have thoroughly enjoyed this thread and not once have my feelings been hurt. Rest assured. I am so pleased that not once was I personally trashed for creating it.

For those of you that know me I am as straight laced as they come and in case you are wondering - no, I would not put this on my baby. HOWEVER, I think it is a totally cool diaper and have gotten lots of positive feedback about it. This diaper was created with the help of my friend's 17 year old son who was wearing pant exactly like the post about the hot topics store. He is totally excited about this diaper and thinks it is the coolest thing he has ever seen. THIS coming from a 17 year old boy - getting excited about a cloth diaper.

I do not know anything about S&M, and if I did I might see some of the connections that some of you are talking about, but really don't have a desire to read up on the topic LOL.

SO, I really do appreciate the "press" this diaper has gotten and thank you! I have a very thick skin - so thank you mama's for worrying about me - but no need! :







::

Feel free to keep discussing - I am having a good time.

Lisa
AKA - MDC goth diaper ruckus maker LOL


----------



## WickidaWitch (Feb 16, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sabin*
AKA - MDC goth diaper ruckus maker LOL


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

I'm so relieved that you haven't let this thread bother you! I was really worried about the effect that some of the comments might have.

I still think people should watch what they say more closely in the future, because I'm sure there are WAHMs who would be really hurt if they had been the one who had made such an item.


----------



## Sabin (Aug 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
I'm so relieved that you haven't let this thread bother you! I was really worried about the effect that some of the comments might have.

I still think people should watch what they say more closely in the future, because I'm sure there are WAHMs who would be really hurt if they had been the one who had made such an item.

If the comments would have been made about ME personally then yes, but about a diaper - no way. There are plenty of diapers out there that I REALLY dont' like either.

Lisa


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

Good for you, Lisa!!! ( Altho.. I like it, and probably would let the girls wear it out to MILs just so it could make my year :LOL)


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## Altair (May 1, 2005)

I love it.









Leather/rings are MUCH more commonly used as fashion accessories than as sexual markers. Every 15 year old walking around with leather/rings on is not practicing S/M. There is a distinct difference between GOTH (a cultural and fashion idea) and BDSM (sexuality). A big difference.

As we all know, some people think *all* cloth diapers are sexual. Just because there is a subset of people that think cloth diapers are sexual does not mean that people who use them on their children use them for that purpose. Similarly, just because *someone* might see it as sexual, does not mean a mom who buys the diaper thinks of it that way. Just b/c someone gets off seeing a mom NIP doesn't mean she's doing it for sexual kicks, etc.


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## Spark (Nov 21, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sabin*
This diaper was created with the help of my friend's 17 year old son who was wearing pant exactly like the post about the hot topics store. He is totally excited about this diaper and thinks it is the coolest thing he has ever seen. THIS coming from a 17 year old boy - getting excited about a cloth diaper.

Well, heck, that's reason enough to make a stash full of these diapers!!! :LOL

Looks like a quality well crafted diaper!


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## GoodWillHunter (Mar 14, 2003)

Not my thing.


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
Sorry, I didn't mean the people who objected to it for other reasons, like comfort. I meant the people who claimed it was sexual.

I do concern myself with comments that indicate criticism of others. Especially when I believe those comments are based on ignorance.

We *are* prudes. That's why we're so obsessed with sex. Because we repress it.

Just for the record, I personally wouldn't buy this diaper or put it on my baby.

So we repress our sexual urges and then due to that, we talk about it every chance we can get and turn everything itno something sexual? That's really interesting. Are you a trained psychologist? I'm honestly not being sarcastic, I'm curious if you have had some kind of training that qualifies you to make such a statement. And how many Americans do you estimate have hang ups about sex, and how many are like you enlightened ones who are sexually open? And what defines someone who is a "prude" and someone who is sexually enlightened? How do you know? I guess you make some kind of "judgment" huh? This whole thread has really gotten off topic. As far as the whip, I don't know where your aunt works, but if my husband took a whip to his work, a professional office setting, than how could he not expect talk and questions? It doesn't matter if it's a horse whip or what. Unless you work in a whip factory or somehting, I don't see how it wouldn't get noticed. There was no other time during her day your aunt could find to repair her whip? It seems like a way of calling attention to yourself. Just like I noticed people saying they would buy that diaper for shock value, in other words, for the attention it would bring.

As far as WAHMs, I would never post something about a WAHM's character, or anything about her personal life. But I don't see a problem with having personal preferences and expressing them. I think Lisa has an awesome attitude.


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## anhaga (May 26, 2005)

Not my cup of tea for my daughter. But I have learned from the discussion. Otoh, I bet my other children would like to see this on dd and they would probably think it was Lord of the Rings-ware. :LOL


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## mom to 3 boys (Feb 7, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
It makes me think of punk/goth. It doesn't make me think of porno/s&m.


ditto!


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## jaye_p (Mar 12, 2005)

OK, I know I'm in the minority here, but I think it's cool. That said, there's no way I'd put it on my ds - but for practical, not aesthetic reasons. He'd definitely get himself caught on something.

See, to me it doesn't scream "s&m" b/c a lot of contemporary goth clothing (vs. the goth styles of the late 80s when I was a teenager) has leather straps, metal chains, clips, etc. Criss-crossed straps have become mainstream (at least in the goth world), so IMHO they've lost a lot of their subversive s&m punch, KWIM?

But those jolly roger crankypants truly rock!


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## jaye_p (Mar 12, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *shishkeberry*
There aren't enough goth clothes for kids out there, IMO.









:

A challenge to all WAHMs reading this thread: More goth clothing! More goth clothing! More goth clothing! (Seriously.)


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## Jane (May 15, 2002)

How many hits did she get from this? Any ink is good ink, no?

But yes! More unusual clothing!!


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jaye_p*







:

A challenge to all WAHMs reading this thread: More goth clothing! More goth clothing! More goth clothing! (Seriously.)

























I'd buy!


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## chickadee79 (Jan 5, 2005)

I like it. I definitely want more goth diaper WAHMs.


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## Yarnia (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *jaye_p*







:

A challenge to all WAHMs reading this thread: More goth clothing! More goth clothing! More goth clothing! (Seriously.)

I'm on it









off to wind the black yarn.....


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## JohnnysGirl (Dec 22, 2003)

I agree with the OP, I agree with Nic (and isn't it terribly hard to have an online discussion with someone typing so stream of consciousness without using any grammar/punctuation/editing?), and I also think Lisa has an awesome attitude!








But Off Topic:.... um, I'm definatly not going to be getting excited about lots of goth offerings over at hyenacart, sorry....







: To each his own, but shining smiling beautiful babies look like angels to me, bright & pure & innocent..... nothing about the goth subculture is about celebrating purity and sweet innocence.







: So WAHMs, _some_ of us want way more geckos & tree frogs, celestial images, and ....giraffes!








Could say more about whether or not I feel that crossed leather straps & metal rings implies anything about sexual bondage, but will simply stop here.


----------



## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
So we repress our sexual urges and then due to that, we talk about it every chance we can get and turn everything itno something sexual? That's really interesting. Are you a trained psychologist? I'm honestly not being sarcastic, I'm curious if you have had some kind of training that qualifies you to make such a statement.

I'm not a psychologist. I don't think it requires professional training to make such an observation about one's culture.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
And how many Americans do you estimate have hang ups about sex

I couldn't say for sure, but definitely the majority.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
how many are like you enlightened ones who are sexually open?

I would say that people who have healthy attitudes about sex are in the minority in this country.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
As far as the whip, I don't know where your aunt works, but if my husband took a whip to his work, a professional office setting, than how could he not expect talk and questions? It doesn't matter if it's a horse whip or what. Unless you work in a whip factory or somehting, I don't see how it wouldn't get noticed.

She works in a hardware store. She had it in the break room. I would expect it to get noticed and talked about and questioned, and I'm sure she expected that too. But there's a difference between that and everyone expressing their conclusions about her private life.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
There was no other time during her day your aunt could find to repair her whip? It seems like a way of calling attention to yourself.

She likes having something to do on her lunch breaks. On other days, she brings other handicrafts to work on. She expected people to be interested, in the way they might be interested in anything they don't see everyday. She didn't expect everyone to decide that it had a sexual purpose.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
But I don't see a problem with having personal preferences and expressing them.

As I've said, I don't have a problem with people expressing personal preferences either. It's comments about a product being wrong that I take issue with. Comments that seem to call into question the ethics of anyone who would make such a thing, or consider making such a thing, or buy such a thing, or consider buying it, or even like it.


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

As I've said, I don't have a problem with people expressing personal preferences either. It's comments about a product being wrong that I take issue with. Comments that seem to call into question the ethics of anyone who would make such a thing, or consider making such a thing, or buy such a thing, or consider buying it, or even like it.[/QUOTE]

i dont think anyone has really called into the question the ethics of anyone who would make the diaper, or consider making the diaper, or buy the diaper or consider buying the diaper, or even liking the diaper!! dont know where you got that but whatever... For me i was saying that the diaper whould be wrong for me and i never once was thinking that someone who thought otherwise had bad ethics









and Lisa im so glad you have such a great attitude about this...and im glad you understand unlike others that just because some of us think this may be a little to much for our childern that you dont feel we think you are a weirdo or something!!!









oh and i would love some Black longies to you knitting Wahms but not with metal or leather or spikes :LOL


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## QueenSheba'sMom (Feb 4, 2003)

Ok, I need a briefing here, because it appears that I'm old and totally out of date and out of touch (& I'm not even thirty yet!)

Back in my day, there was a difference between goth (siouxsie & the banshees, black lace, victorian stylings, the cure) & punk (piercings, spikes, leather, sex pistols, sid & nancy, fishnet). I always thought goth was morose and punk was hyperactive.

Coud someone plese redefine these a little for me?


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## amysuen (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MerryOne*
if we just write off any change in offerings we effectively drive off many of these younger edgier mamas, because we cutey moms will drown out the edgier ones request, just my thoughts.

Good point! It doesn't do the CDing community as a whole any good if new CDing mamas feel rejected. I try to keep an open mind and be accepting and repectful of other people's choices, even if they're not what I could choose. But your post pointed out that I'm not doing that as well as I could. Thanks!









ETA- *.me.* we must be from the same generation


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## LoveBaby (Jul 22, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *.me.*
Ok, I need a briefing here, because it appears that I'm old and totally out of date and out of touch (& I'm not even thirty yet!)

Back in my day, there was a difference between goth (siouxsie & the banshees, black lace, victorian stylings, the cure) & punk (piercings, spikes, leather, sex pistols, sid & nancy, fishnet). I always thought goth was morose and punk was hyperactive.

Coud someone plese redefine these a little for me?

dude, same generation here, too! :LOL

of course, I might definately be the most boring person on the planet and wasn't in the goth/punk/grunge scene at any point in my life, so I wouldn't be good for any sort of culrural comparisons! :LOL


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## michray (Aug 11, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *.me.*
Ok, I need a briefing here, because it appears that I'm old and totally out of date and out of touch (& I'm not even thirty yet!)

Back in my day, there was a difference between goth (siouxsie & the banshees, black lace, victorian stylings, the cure) & punk (piercings, spikes, leather, sex pistols, sid & nancy, fishnet). I always thought goth was morose and punk was hyperactive.

Coud someone plese redefine these a little for me?


You are correct in your understanding of the characteristics of Goth versus Punk ... but I think fishnet falls under both









aaaahhh The Cure, baby! Where have all the Goth bands gone??


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## TRIBE (Apr 10, 2004)

so what IS considered Goth these days? I look at the Hot Topic stuff and think Punk, not Goth.

I see Corpse Bride & think Goth :LOL


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Jenniebug*
so what IS considered Goth these days? I look at the Hot Topic stuff and think Punk, not Goth.

I see Corpse Bride & think Goth :LOL


:LOL :LOL


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## jentilla (Nov 18, 2004)

I'm all about cool, edgey styles, all the ducks and bunnies turn me off, but I don't like to see babies in black, it's just too grown up. Now that my dd is two I would put her in a bit more black. I'm also really turned off by leather. I would love to see more funky fabrics and less pastels









We keep mentioning all the teens we see in leather straps, etc. which is interesteing b/c they are TEENS not BABIES.

This goes to show, there is something for everyone and that's what WAHMS are creating for, everyone.


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## Raynbow (Aug 2, 2004)

I don't know... when I was making nursing necklaces, I made a Goth Nursing necklace, complete with black teddy bears and all...









Too bad there isn't much call for NNs... especially odd ones. I made a pagan-styled one that was really neat, too...


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *binxsmom*
i totally agree with this!! i would love to find some little plaid punk bondage pants for both dd and ds. it would make tieing them up sooooo much easier. :nana:


:LOL :LOL







:LOL


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## Ok (Feb 6, 2004)

Me, I'm just an old hippie.







I love tiedyes. I never have understood the fruit-on-bum themes (except for fruit of the loom whities







)

Now, before you dismiss me entirely, I'm old enough that I had an original sex pistols "god save the queen" ep w/ the (quickly) banned picture cover. I did punk for about 2 weeks and quickly retreated back to hippies and blues. :LOL

If theres a market, someone can fill the void. Its not a style for me.

As a side note: maybe we should do one of those "favorite themes" threads.

As another side note: does anyone imagine talking to your current babes in about 15 yrs, sharing all the cute fluffy pictures you took of them... wondering how they might react?


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## QueenSheba'sMom (Feb 4, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ZenSizzled*
As another side note: does anyone imagine talking to your current babes in about 15 yrs, sharing all the cute fluffy pictures you took of them... wondering how they might react?


You mean like when my little financial analyst says "mo-om, you diapered me in leather?!"

speaking of 'back in the day'- I was a stinkin hippie myself, grateful dead & everything. but when I got to college I discovered that hippies were long- dead on the east coast







:

so I learned all about different kinds of scenes










like today I'm a hippie among punks. yesterday I was a hippie among ravers. tomorrow I'll be a hippie among goths.

etc.


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## Ok (Feb 6, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *.me.*
You mean like when my little financial analyst says "mo-om, you diapered me in leather?!"

speaking of 'back in the day'- I was a stinkin hippie myself, grateful dead & everything. but when I got to college I discovered that hippies were long- dead on the east coast







:

so I learned all about different kinds of scenes










like today I'm a hippie among punks. yesterday I was a hippie among ravers. tomorrow I'll be a hippie among goths.

etc.

Yeah, hippie was outcast when I was in college (early 80s). Wearing the colors was a literal and proverbial flag of dissent. (if the shoe fits







) But I just couldn't do the pink/green/cowl-neck preps-doing-coke scene. Blech. As a side note to this (yowsa I'm into "side notes today, even if they are in the text and not on the side







): in the early 80s, punk and hippies hung out together. We sort of had to to bolster our mutual ranks against the overlords of evil: capitalists. Yep, if the smoke is right, we party (um, I mean Bandy) together quite naturally.









The Dead... ahhhh. Good times.









But yes, I totally wonder about what C might say to me in 15 yrs: So, Mama... you showed off pictures of me in ~that~??? Yes dear, and you were so adorable


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bunnyhatanpaa*
i dont think anyone has really called into the question the ethics of anyone who would make the diaper, or consider making the diaper, or buy the diaper or consider buying the diaper, or even liking the diaper!! dont know where you got that

I didn't say that anyone has said, in so many words, "I question the ethics of anyone who would..." However, some people have used words like wrong, porno, fetish, s&m, etc. Such comments could make anyone who feels that the diaper is appropriate for a child feel attacked.


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## TRIBE (Apr 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Raynbow*
Too bad there isn't much call for NNs... especially odd ones. I made a pagan-styled one that was really neat, too...

I would LOVE a pagan-styled nn!


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## QueenSheba'sMom (Feb 4, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ZenSizzled*
Yeah, hippie was outcast when I was in college (early 80s). Wearing the colors was a literal and proverbial flag of dissent. (if the shoe fits







) But I just couldn't do the pink/green/cowl-neck preps-doing-coke scene. Blech. As a side note to this (yowsa I'm into "side notes today, even if they are in the text and not on the side







): in the early 80s, punk and hippies hung out together. We sort of had to to bolster our mutual ranks against the overlords of evil: capitalists. Yep, if the smoke is right, we party (um, I mean Bandy) together quite naturally.









The Dead... ahhhh. Good times.









I mean, we're all pierced alike & tattooed alike & have similar values, and so, well, heck- can't we all just get along? whether it's to NIN, the cure, a maxell tape from a jerry garcia band show, some kickass jungle music, parliament funkadelic, or whatever have you....(of course, in the end, it may have been more about the ...err...brandy...)- can't we all just get along?!








:

ok, I'll end my side tyrade now.

that was BEFORE I became all grown up, started dressing professionally, and discovered that the tie dye and patchy wonderfulness could live on with my kids! :LOL

come to think of it (hey I'm coming back ON TOPIC again!!), I think these leather diapers would make an excellent baby shower gift for the offspring of my goth ex boyfriend, if he ever decides to procreate with his goth wife!

that and a cd of the cure doing lullabies.


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## spatulagirl (Feb 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *.me.*
You mean like when my little financial analyst says "mo-om, you diapered me in leather?!"

speaking of 'back in the day'- I was a stinkin hippie myself, grateful dead & everything. but when I got to college I discovered that hippies were long- dead on the east coast







:

so I learned all about different kinds of scenes










like today I'm a hippie among punks. yesterday I was a hippie among ravers. tomorrow I'll be a hippie among goths.

etc.

I am a hippie-raver if that makes any sense :LOL I hear ya on the different styles from east to west coast. My style got WAY more techno when I moved east to go to school.


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## Fluffhead (Oct 30, 2004)

*cheers to the deadheads* :LOL ...well *cheers to heads of all cultures*...

if you have embraced a culture and its a part of why you are whom you are today than that in some way will get passed down, even indirectly, to your youngins.


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## ShabbyChic (Feb 24, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Butterflymom*
I'm definatly not going to be getting excited about lots of goth offerings over at hyenacart, sorry....







: To each his own, but shining smiling beautiful babies look like angels to me, bright & pure & innocent..... nothing about the goth subculture is about celebrating purity and sweet innocence.







: So WAHMs, _some_ of us want way more geckos & tree frogs, celestial images, and ....giraffes!








Could say more about whether or not I feel that crossed leather straps & metal rings implies anything about sexual bondage, but will simply stop here.

Easier to quote than type. I agree 100%.


----------



## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sustainer*
I'm not a psychologist. I don't think it requires professional training to make such an observation about one's culture.

I couldn't say for sure, but definitely the majority.

I would say that people who have healthy attitudes about sex are in the minority in this country.

She works in a hardware store. She had it in the break room. I would expect it to get noticed and talked about and questioned, and I'm sure she expected that too. But there's a difference between that and everyone expressing their conclusions about her private life.

She likes having something to do on her lunch breaks. On other days, she brings other handicrafts to work on. She expected people to be interested, in the way they might be interested in anything they don't see everyday. She didn't expect everyone to decide that it had a sexual purpose.

As I've said, I don't have a problem with people expressing personal preferences either. It's comments about a product being wrong that I take issue with. Comments that seem to call into question the ethics of anyone who would make such a thing, or consider making such a thing, or buy such a thing, or consider buying it, or even like it.


You're right, it's just your "observation" and not necessarily the facts. I think you feel comfortable saying that because it's downright _trendy_ and _hip_ to bash Americans and America. (Especially if you're American yourself, than it makes you look ever so high-minded and too enlightened and intelligent to be brainwashed by the government like the rest of us repressed, uptight, mindless Americans).

If I said "All Asians are good at math", or "Most French people smell", you would take exception to that, and most likelly call me a racist and narrow minded, and tell me how harmful it is to make such blanket statements and perpetuate stereotypes about groups of people, when there is no fact behind my "observations".

It's a gigantic leap to decide that if anyone looking at that diaper, of leather and metal, decides it looks at all s&m, then it's indicative of an overall American problem of sexual repression and prudery. I think it's ironic how you think it's wrong to make any judgments about anyone liking that diaper because it might hurt someone's feelings or make them feel like an outcast, but it's okay by you to make sweeping judgments and blanket statements about anyone who thinks it looks s&m.

Can I just say that I think it's great that we've been able to debate all the aspects of this and so many people have brought up interesting points. I've really enjoyed this discussion and am grateful it hasn't been pulled!


----------



## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
You're right, it's just your "observation" and not necessarily the facts. I think you feel comfortable saying that because it's downright _trendy_ and _hip_ to bash Americans and America. (Especially if you're American yourself, than it makes you look ever so high-minded and too enlightened and intelligent to be brainwashed by the government like the rest of us repressed, uptight, mindless Americans).

If I said "All Asians are good at math", or "Most French people smell", you would take exception to that, and most likelly call me a racist and narrow minded, and tell me how harmful it is to make such blanket statements and perpetuate stereotypes about groups of people, when there is no fact behind my "observations".

It's a gigantic leap to decide that if anyone looking at that diaper, of leather and metal, decides it looks at all s&m, then it's indicative of an overall American problem of sexual repression and prudery. I think it's ironic how you think it's wrong to make any judgments about anyone liking that diaper because it might hurt someone's feelings or make them feel like an outcast, but it's okay by you to make sweeping judgments and blanket statements about anyone who thinks it looks s&m.

Can I just say that I think it's great that we've been able to debate all the aspects of this and so many people have brought up interesting points. I've really enjoyed this discussion and am grateful it hasn't been pulled!









I was thinking just the very same thing...about the judgments and such..


----------



## Sabin (Aug 30, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
that diaper, of leather and metal,


Not that it really matters, since both the diapers have already sold, but the diapers are made out of black PUL and once you take the decoration off it is just a plain black diaper suitable for every day use with snaps where the decoration can attach to. You aren't the only one to assume the entire diaper is made out of leather BTW - jsut thought I would clarify.

Lisa


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## bunnyhatanpaa (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sabin*
Not that it really matters, since both the diapers have already sold, but the diapers are made out of black PUL and once you take the decoration off it is just a plain black diaper suitable for every day use with snaps where the decoration can attach to. You aren't the only one to assume the entire diaper is made out of leather BTW - jsut thought I would clarify.

Lisa


great they sold!! i wonder if we will get a posted picture in the show and tell.







:


----------



## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sabin*
Not that it really matters, since both the diapers have already sold, but the diapers are made out of black PUL and once you take the decoration off it is just a plain black diaper suitable for every day use with snaps where the decoration can attach to. You aren't the only one to assume the entire diaper is made out of leather BTW - jsut thought I would clarify.

Lisa

Thanks Lisa, for clarifying! I will change my wording then, to "appears to be leather", or has an impression of leather.


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## Sabin (Aug 30, 2004)

WOW! Someone subtitled me!







:

Thanks Mama!

Lisa


----------



## TRIBE (Apr 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bunnyhatanpaa*
great they sold!! i wonder if we will get a posted picture in the show and tell.







:


There will be


----------



## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
You're right, it's just your "observation" and not necessarily the facts. I think you feel comfortable saying that because it's downright _trendy_ and _hip_ to bash Americans and America. (Especially if you're American yourself, than it makes you look ever so high-minded and too enlightened and intelligent to be brainwashed by the government like the rest of us repressed, uptight, mindless Americans).

I'm sorry but









You do realize that this is the country where the Attorney General put a DRESS on the Lady Justice statue, right?

I don't think America being sexually repressed is in anyone's imagination...

I'm sure you are not personally repressed... but as a culture, gosh! Surely no one would argue with that.


----------



## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
I think you feel comfortable saying that because it's downright _trendy_ and _hip_ to bash Americans and America.

I always say what I believe is the truth, without regard for whether or not it is trendy or hip. I express unpopular opinions all the time. You really don't think that confusion about what things are sexual is a widespread problem in this culture? Why do you think that nursing in public is such an issue?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
If I said "All Asians are good at math", or "Most French people smell", you would take exception to that, and most likelly call me a racist and narrow minded, and tell me how harmful it is to make such blanket statements and perpetuate stereotypes about groups of people, when there is no fact behind my "observations".

Such statements containing the word "all" are generally incorrect. There are very few things you could say about a culture that would be true of ALL the members of that culture. If you were French and had lived in France all your life and you told me that most French people smell, I would not think you were a racist. However, I doubt that if you were in a position to know, you would think that. You really think it's harmful for me to say that there are widespread unhealthy attitudes about sex in our culture, if that's what I really think? You really think that my statement is analogous to your examples? Of course I think that my observations are factual. Otherwise I would not make them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
It's a gigantic leap to decide that if anyone looking at that diaper, of leather and metal, decides it looks at all s&m, then it's indicative of an overall American problem of sexual repression and prudery.

That isn't quite what I said. My belief that it's common in this country to have psychological issues related to sex and my beliefs about the confusion regarding the nature of the diaper are not dependent on each other, although one can have influence on the other.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
I think it's ironic how you think it's wrong to make any judgments about anyone liking that diaper because it might hurt someone's feelings or make them feel like an outcast, but it's okay by you to make sweeping judgments and blanket statements about anyone who thinks it looks s&m.

I just think that, since it's such an inflammatory issue, people should be careful about claiming that children's apparel is sexual in nature, without sufficient evidence. I don't believe that the mere fact of something being made with leather and metal is sufficient evidence. As far as what is causing people to think the things they are thinking about the diaper's design, I disagree with your interpretation of my remarks.


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## anhaga (May 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
You're right, it's just your "observation" and not necessarily the facts. I think you feel comfortable saying that because it's downright _trendy_ and _hip_ to bash Americans and America. (Especially if you're American yourself, than it makes you look ever so high-minded and too enlightened and intelligent to be brainwashed by the government like the rest of us repressed, uptight, mindless Americans).

Can I just say that I think it's great that we've been able to debate all the aspects of this and so many people have brought up interesting points. I've really enjoyed this discussion and am grateful it hasn't been pulled!









You and I must live in very different zip codes (and we do







). Trust me, please, that America-bashing is (1) not happening in my zip code and (2) making comments and judgments about illogical policies at local, state and federal levels should hardly be referred to as "bashing."

So, no trend here regarding America-bashing and I think the fact that Bush is president for a 2nd term indicates that those of us anywhere left of the way-right are still in the minority. Except at MDC









And as for the diaper, the maker says: "the diapers are made out of black PUL and once you take the decoration off it is just a plain black diaper suitable for every day use with snaps where the decoration can attach to. "

Black is the color of sophistication and high culture. This diaper is suitable for all the best country club affairs. Black is beautiful.


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## Sustainer (Sep 26, 2002)

By the way, my only point with the whip story is that people are always thinking that something is sexual when it's not. Just because it involves leather or whatever.

I think I've said everything I want to say on this thread. I'm unsubscribing now and I won't be coming back to this thread, so I won't see any future posts. My partner just lost his job, so I've got too much to think about now without concerning myself with a diaper that I don't even care for (sorry Sabin, just isn't my thing).


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KristiMetz*
I'm sorry but









You do realize that this is the country where the Attorney General put a DRESS on the Lady Justice statue, right?

I don't think America being sexually repressed is in anyone's imagination...

I'm sure you are not personally repressed... but as a culture, gosh! Surely no one would argue with that.

I'm not arguing that things like that are ridiculous, and too many people have issues with nudity and Sustainer's example of breastfeeding in public, is a good one. I have actually dealt with someone before who had a problem with me breastfeeding at the park. I think there needs to be a lot more breastfeeding education in general, but that's another topic. What I have a problem with are the blanket statements and conclusions- that if you don't like the diaper you're sexually repressed. And that all Americans are prudes, blah, blah. Or at least all Americans who are not completely left of center.


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *anhaga*
You and I must live in very different zip codes (and we do







). Trust me, please, that America-bashing is (1) not happening in my zip code and (2) making comments and judgments about illogical policies at local, state and federal levels should hardly be referred to as "bashing."

So, no trend here regarding America-bashing and I think the fact that Bush is president for a 2nd term indicates that those of us anywhere left of the way-right are still in the minority. Except at MDC









And as for the diaper, the maker says: "the diapers are made out of black PUL and once you take the decoration off it is just a plain black diaper suitable for every day use with snaps where the decoration can attach to. "

Black is the color of sophistication and high culture. This diaper is suitable for all the best country club affairs. Black is beautiful.









Regarding this comment: making comments and judgments about illogical policies at local, state and federal levels should hardly be referred to as "bashing."

I agree with you. This discussion wasn't about government policy though. And what is considered illogical is in the eye of the beholder.

For the record, I'm not in the "way-right", or even the right. I actually have a hard time "fitting in" anywhere politically, because I have so many different, some would say contradictory beliefs. I believe in gay marriage for one, because I think it's a civil rights issue. I also don't think capitalism is evil. I consider myself someone who is always willing to learn more- I come to MDC for one, despite the fact that I disagree with some of the political beliefs here. That doesn't mean I can't tolerate hearing a different viewpoint, and sometimes I learn something too. And it doesn't mean I don't have anything in common with the people here, I think when it comes to parenting, I do. That is mostly what I come here for.

I don't belong to a country club, but I don't have a problem with black. I own quite a lot of black myself.


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nicandboys*
I'm not arguing that things like that are ridiculous, and too many people have issues with nudity and Sustainer's example of breastfeeding in public, is a good one. I have actually dealt with someone before who had a problem with me breastfeeding at the park. I think there needs to be a lot more breastfeeding education in general, but that's another topic. What I have a problem with are the blanket statements and conclusions- that if you don't like the diaper you're sexually repressed. And that all Americans are prudes, blah, blah. Or at least all Americans who are not completely left of center.

Just for clarity - Sustainer didn't say that "if you don't like the diaper you're sexually repressed". What she said, I believe, was that she felt it was misguided, and representative of some issues with sexuality in our culture, to attach a sexual or fetish nature to something fairly innocuous like a diaper.

Here's another comparison (although comparisons never work on Internet boards, I don't know why I try... LOL). Let's say someone embroidered a detailed and beautiful flower on a diaper. It's an embroidery of a beautiful flower unfolding its petals. Then let's say someone posted and said that they felt the flower was very Georgia O'Keefe looking and they felt it was totally inappropriate for a child to wear.

I think what Sustainer, and I, and others are feeling, is that something similar is happening here... a sexual significance is being attached to something that doesn't necessarily have it... and while that's definitely in the eye of the beholder, that doesn't mean that all beholders are going to view it that way since it (the diaper) can have many interpretations, and the intended one is most certainly not sexual.


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## nicandboys (Mar 21, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KristiMetz*
Just for clarity - Sustainer didn't say that "if you don't like the diaper you're sexually repressed". What she said, I believe, was that she felt it was misguided, and representative of some issues with sexuality in our culture, to attach a sexual or fetish nature to something fairly innocuous like a diaper.

Here's another comparison (although comparisons never work on Internet boards, I don't know why I try... LOL). Let's say someone embroidered a detailed and beautiful flower on a diaper. It's an embroidery of a beautiful flower unfolding its petals. Then let's say someone posted and said that they felt the flower was very Georgia O'Keefe looking and they felt it was totally inappropriate for a child to wear.

I think what Sustainer, and I, and others are feeling, is that something similar is happening here... a sexual significance is being attached to something that doesn't necessarily have it... and while that's definitely in the eye of the beholder, that doesn't mean that all beholders are going to view it that way since it (the diaper) can have many interpretations, and the intended one is most certainly not sexual.

Thanks for clarifying, but I understand what she was saying. And as far as your flower comparison, that would be fine with me if that was someone else's opinion. I might not agree, or find it ridiculous even, but I don't have a problem with someone having an opposing opinion. I recall a specific incidence where someone commented on the diapering board, that when she saw diapers with cherries on them for little girls she thought it seemed sexual and so she didn't buy those type of diapers. I thought it was really strange, I always thought cherry prints were cute and had never thought of it that way. But I didn't take it personally. I didn't post about how unwelcome or judged I felt because my dd did own a cherry print diaper.


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## TzippityDoulah (Jun 29, 2005)

I dont see a thing wrong with it morally or ethically speaking... but functionally -- well babies dont usually where metal for a reason you know?

I do agree it could be percieved as S&M kinda thing, but I seriously doubt that was the intention... I think it was cool. but nothing i would ever use b/c I'm all about simple and easy. and that just doesnt seem to fit my standerd of living.


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## Ms.Doula (Apr 3, 2003)

porno/s&m. not goth. For an adult... ummmm whatever








But for a baby..... ICK!!







NOT apropriate.


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## Persephone (Apr 8, 2004)

Well, I can certainly see the S&M POV. However, before I clicked the link, I was thinking a black diaper with zippers or spikes or something. The leather just isn't that funky to me. *shrug* Whatever.


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## Raynbow (Aug 2, 2004)

I can go through my beads and see if I have ones for it. It was wooden beads (natural colors) with a crow center piece (black stone style). It was really neat... I wonder if Istill have the picture... hmm...
I kind of gave up since selling them is hit or miss - and with a FT job and two boys on my own... T has since taken over my bead stash (read: scattered them all over the spare room!), but I will look, okay?


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## Ms.Doula (Apr 3, 2003)




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## TRIBE (Apr 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Raynbow*
I can go through my beads and see if I have ones for it. It was wooden beads (natural colors) with a crow center piece (black stone style). It was really neat... I wonder if Istill have the picture... hmm...
I kind of gave up since selling them is hit or miss - and with a FT job and two boys on my own... T has since taken over my bead stash (read: scattered them all over the spare room!), but I will look, okay?


Cool thanks and no rush









Ms. Doula she was replying to my post about Pagan nursing necklaces earlier in this thread


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## Ms.Doula (Apr 3, 2003)

I C


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