# How common is spanking in the U.S.?



## rabbitmum (Jan 25, 2007)

Now I have got the impression from these forums that "mainstream parents" in the U.S. spank their children, but my husband, who has been in the U.S. a lot more than I have, says that they don't and that it's not so common.

So, educate me please, ladies:

- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?
- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?
- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

(This is the first topic in my new series "Help an ignorant European learn about American culture!" Thank you in advance!)


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## zech13_9_goforgold (Jun 24, 2008)

I think how a person spanks varies. Some people only slap the child's hand with their hand, but some use a "neutral object," like a stick, ruler, belt, or other object. Other parents believe it's best to spank on the bottom. A lot of states have a law that says "open hand, clothes bottom," but I don't know how many parents use that rule.

How common is it? It probably depends a lot on the region and religion of the people surveyed. I think many parents try it at some point in their parenting experience. Parents can also sign wavers at private schools to allow the school to spank their kids for them.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zech13_9_goforgold* 
I think how a person spanks varies. Some people only slap the child's hand with their hand, but some use a "neutral object," like a stick, ruler, belt, or other object. Other parents believe it's best to spank on the bottom.

That's interesting. I'm not American, but I've never heard the word "spank" applied to hitting a child anywhere but on the bottom. I've known people who slap their children's hands, but that's what they call it - slapping or smacking..."spanking" applies solely to the bum.


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
So, educate me please, ladies:

- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?
- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?
- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

(This is the first topic in my new series "Help an ignorant European learn about American culture!" Thank you in advance!)









Disclaimer- I'm in Texas









I would say that better than half the population spanks. Probably around 70% (off the top of my head...)
I do NOT know a lot of people that do, though my bil and sil do. I do my darnedest to avoid people who abuse their children.
YES, it varies greatly by location and culture.
They think- "you have to", "it's the only way they understand", "your kids will have bad manners, be monsters, etc etc if you don't"
As a rule- "spank" is hitting on the child's bottom with the parent's hand. Though it is rather common to use things like a spoon or ruler.










-Angela


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## vegemamato (Jul 4, 2007)

_- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?_

A study done in 2002 says that 65% of americans approve of spanking









_- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?_

Unfortunetely, a lot of the parents I've met (in my liberal, green city) seem to be ok with spanking. I hear a lot of threats and see a lot of hand-swatting in public too. I do not hang out with spankers, or let my children.

_- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?_

I'm sure it does..

_- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?_

To keep children compliant? Because their mom/dad did it and they turned out fine? (not making us Americans look good, am I?)

_- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?_

I've only heard of a spank on the butt- and swats everywhere else. I just call it abuse..


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## MusicianDad (Jun 24, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?

There is a lot of "if you don't spank you let your kids get away with anything" floating around. There is a huge misconception about what non-spanking and non-punitive parenting means. So people are afraid that if they _don't_ spank their kids will grow up to be selfish, uncontrollable, manipulative people who care only about themselves.

Also a lot of parents don't know any other ways and those closest to them aren't able or willing to offer suggestions that don't include spanking.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *vegemamato* 
_- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?_

A study done in 2002 says that 65% of americans approve of spanking









Yeah - but that's not an indicator of how many actually do it. I know people who approve of spanking, in principle, but don't spank their own kids...and people who don't approve of spanking, but do spank their own kids. (I've hit both dd and ds2 once, so I guess I'd technically fall into that category, although neither of them were actually spankings.)


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## ProtoLawyer (Apr 16, 2007)

I would say most people (or at least a large plurality) "don't spank," but the overwheming majority have spanked.


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## vegemamato (Jul 4, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
Yeah - but that's not an indicator of how many actually do it. I know people who approve of spanking, in principle, but don't spank their own kids...and people who don't approve of spanking, but do spank their own kids. (I've hit both dd and ds2 once, so I guess I'd technically fall into that category, although neither of them were actually spankings.)

yes- approving of something is very different than actually doing it.. I'm sure many responders didn't even have children, yk? I would guess that the number of parents who actually use spanking as a form of discipline -on a regular basis- is probably closer to 50%.. Just from my own experience, though..


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## MamaChicken (Aug 21, 2006)

ITA I know a lot of people who have spanked on the rare occasion but generally do not use it as a punishment everyday. Most people I know do not regularly spank their children. Many of them don't spank at all.

I am in the Pacific NorthWest (near Portland).


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaChicken* 
ITA I know a lot of people who have spanked on the rare occasion but generally do not use it as a punishment everyday. Most people I know do not regularly spank their children. Many of them don't spank at all.

I am in the Pacific NorthWest (near Portland).

I've honestly never known anybody who spanked every day or even close to it. Spanking was _very_ common when I was a kid - I don't think I knew anybody whose parents _never_ spanked - but it wasn't something that happened very much in any one family. (Obviously, it did in some families. That didn't come out right. I mean, the people I knew weren't spanked very often - it was rare.)

Anyway - this is getting really OT. I'm not in the US, anyway, and have no idea how common spanking is there. I've never actually seen it when I'm there, but I've only been there a few times...almost all in Knoxville, visiting my dh's family, although we do visit public tourist attractions, and I haven't ever witnessed a spanking, or even heard a threat of one.


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## NicaG (Jun 16, 2006)

I personally don't know anyone who spanks.

Anyone think there's a division by socioeconomic class? Or by region?


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## steelmagnolia9 (May 4, 2009)

I'm actually kind of surprised by the low numbers that have been estimated here. It must vary regionally because I am in the conservative South, and I feel like my husband and I are definitely the minority when it comes to this (we absolutely do not spank or swat or anything else that involves hurting a child) - especially within conservative Christian circles. I think some people really do believe they are doing their child a disservice by not spanking them.


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## onemoremom (Jun 8, 2007)

How many people do it varies HUGELY depending on region and social circle. Where I am now, people are generally surprised to see it or hear of it, it's just not quite 'done' much anymore. It would be absolutely shocking to see it in public. This is the same population that tend toward natural birthing, nursing their babies, putting tons of thought into when/how to educate, etc..

I've also lived in places where the idea of NOT spanking was so utterly foreign people would have laughed if you said you weren't planning to. If a child was acting up/behaving poorly in public, it would have been seen as poor parenting at best and maybe worse than neglectful to NOT hit the child right then and there.

Most of what I've seen is slapping of very young hands, and light taps on the bottom for older kids. It's more point of the thing I guess, I've never seen or heard from anyone who really wanted to physically HURT the kids.

From the few I know here that have done it, and use it as a discipline tool, it's usually explained that for very young toddlers, it's to help them stay safe until they can understand better. For example, a hot stove. Most of us will try to explain 'hot', find safer ways to show what 'hot' is, etc... and do what we can to keep littles away from a hot stove. The parents who spank, will also (in addition to the rest of all that) smack the childs hand if they reach for the stove. These parents see it as a safety measure-much prefer to smack, and the kid learns that stove=unpleasant, than have the child get a serious burn.

That's one example, but generally seems to illustrate the reasoning behind smacking/spanking for the very young. It's something they understand long before logic. Behavioral training I guess.

Those same parents seem to be the ones who will spank on the bottom as the kids get older. It's usually a last resort when a kid is totally bonkers and defiant and the parent is at wits end. It seems the threat of it is usually enough-once the kid is warned that if xyz then they get a spank, the behavior changes, they do as they're told. Otherwise, it's a light tap on the bum with an open hand. The children seem to protest more at the idea of the thing than actually fear it.

One thing I definitely notice is that among the people I know (including me) who DON'T spank, our parents were much more gentle. I don't know any of us who weren't spanked ourselves as kids, but what we got was similar to what I've described above.

The parents my age (or roundabout) who DO spank, had much more violent childhoods. Bruises, belts, much more aggressive, frequent and hurtful physical punishment than they are willing to use on their own children.

So I can really say that almost all the parents I know who currently have young children, are much more gentle than our own parents were. Which is good progress, I would say.


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## Ambystoma (Mar 26, 2009)

*- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?* Hopefully less than half-as a usual form of discipline (meaning not just once or twice ever)
*- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?* I do-but that is because it is the common form of discipline in my family, and therefore the people I grew up with.
*- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?* I would think it's more common in the south, around the Bible Belt (NC, SC, Georgia) and from my experience, the norm in Appalachia
*- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?* IME, because the Bible says to, because they don't know of other options, because it's easier, because people encourage them to saying their kids will be "spoiled brats" etc, because fear is easier to acquire than respect
*- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?* Most people I know say they don't want their kids to associate their hand with pain







Most of the time on the butt (belt, wooden spoon, hand) or the leg when I was a kid







with a switch (green stick pulled from a bush/tree that is springy)

I think it is more common than people want to admit. Most people will publicly say they don't approve of spanking/beating because it is not "PC" anymore. For instance, my mom used to be friends with a couple who had kids later in life that called spanking their kids a "time out" so they could threaten their 2 and 3 year olds with a spanking in public without dealing with an angry observer. (HINT: if you're trying to hide it, it's probably because it's wrong!)


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## Sk8ermaiden (Feb 13, 2008)

I think everyone is right and it varies so much. I'd say here probably at least 60% and probably 70% of parents of young children spank.

The definition of "spank" definitely varies. My DH was raised with the traditional "good way" of spanking. Sent to the room - all parties cool down - offense is explained and a few openhanded spanks are given.

My mother used to chase me around the house with a wooden spoon, smacking wildly. It sounds terrible, but as a kid I thought it was HI-larious, and even as an adult I still laugh about it. It never actually hurt, nor do I think she intended it to - she was just letting out frustration. She was NOT a consistent or fair disciplinarian, and that's a mistake I will not repeat.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ambystoma* 
(HINT: if you're trying to hide it, it's probably because it's wrong!)

I get what you're saying, but that's not really true. There are lots of situations in which people hide things that aren't wrong, in any way.


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## Ambystoma (Mar 26, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I get what you're saying, but that's not really true. There are lots of situations in which people hide things that aren't wrong, in any way.

True. Perhaps I should have said, If you're hiding something, perhaps you should re-evaluate to see if you're doing it for the right reasons?


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## Huckablogger (Aug 20, 2008)

I would say 90% spank in my area. (the south) the only parents I know in this area who DON'T spank are fellow LLLers. Churches, mine included, have even done parenting classes that TEACH you how to spank.







I seriously got up and left Sunday School one day. My in laws spanked DH with a wood paddle with holes drilled in it so it would hit harder and not have air resistance.







and they are not bad people, just did not know there was another way. they thought they were being more gentle because they got whipped with belts and branches.

Also, the common response by parents to biting here is to bite the child back.


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## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Huckablogger* 
Also, the common response by parents to biting here is to bite the child back.

I've heard that advice many times, as well.


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## Mama Mko (Jul 26, 2007)

I know a lot of people who spank. All of my siblings who have children spank their children.

I'm the nut in the family.


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## vegasgrl (Mar 19, 2009)

Huckablogger said:


> My in laws spanked DH with a wood paddle with holes drilled in it so it would hit harder and not have air resistance.
> 
> 
> > My dad has been a public school middle school (10-14 year olds) teacher for 35 years. He used to mount his paddle, the one with the holes, on the wall at home every year after the school year was over - all his kids that year would sign it. It was just a generally accepted part of public school education that spanking was a punishment if you broke specific rules. This was the late 70's and early 80's though; spanking was outlawed in the schools a long time ago. My dad is the most gentle, kindest soul you'll ever meet; all his students loved him - thus the signing. But that's just how acceptable spanking was 30 years ago.


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

Quote:

Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
Every parent I know "in real life" spanks.


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

vegasgrl said:


> Huckablogger said:
> 
> 
> > My in laws spanked DH with a wood paddle with holes drilled in it so it would hit harder and not have air resistance.
> ...


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## Amylcd (Jun 16, 2005)

The girl in this story (Bria Rose) attended the highschool my children will end up going to. Because of this incident, they now send home forms for the parents to sign if they want to decline the paddlings. Unfortunately, most parents are fine with it.

http://www.nospank.net/n-g84.htm


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## Whistler (Jan 30, 2009)

I think it makes a huge difference which part of the country you live in. Here in the Northwest you NEVER see spanking or swatting in public and rarely do you see scolding. At the park or playgound, I almost never see even a time-out. I do see a LOT of children throw fits and scream and kick and parents vary from holding them to taking them home to doing nothing to redirection or distraction but I never see swats or spanks.

I hear that in the South it's much more common and accepted to swat or spank, especially in public. So as a country-wide phenomenon I have no idea what the actual stats are and I have even less of an idea how many parents here do it.

ETA: I don't think any of the schools around here use paddling any more either, with the possible exception of a VERY conservative private school. I have a feeling that they don't even have teachers spank but call the parents to discipline a child if it gets to the point where such action is needed. Then the parents can choose what method of discipline to use. It is just not a very accepted practice here.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
Now I have got the impression from these forums that "mainstream parents" in the U.S. spank their children, but my husband, who has been in the U.S. a lot more than I have, says that they don't and that it's not so common.

So, educate me please, ladies:

1 How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?
2 Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
3 Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?
4 Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?
5 And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

(This is the first topic in my new series "Help an ignorant European learn about American culture!" Thank you in advance!)









1) growing up almost everyone I knew was spanked (venture to guess 95% at LEAST), except for a small handful of people, who all turned out MUCH better then the rest of us, thus validating my feeling it was wrong and helping me feel confident in my choice not to use this inhumane act towards my own children. I think its less common now a days, though I'm yet to meet a person in real life where I live aside from my son's school teacher who doesn't believe in spanking.
2) yes, but I choose not to become friends with those people. I rather be lonely then be friends with a monster.
3) I think so. at least openly. It was more "hidden" (admitted but not performed in public) where I grew up (north and central jersey) but where I live now I feel like I can't leave the house without seeing a child be hit or hearing about a child who has been hit or is going to get hit.
4) I can't answer that, but I can only guess that someone educated on the manner would not choose to inflict this potential damage on their children. It is a compliment for me to say these people are uneducated in this area, for me to assume that no one who understood the damages would willingly choose to be a monster.
5) I've heard (and seen) it all "smack, slap, swat, tap, flick, spank, hit, etc - on the hand, leg, butt, only in "dangerous situations", only for open "defiance', only as a "last resort", only for a certain age group, as long as they live under my roof, etc.

My best advice, don't learn about American culture. It's completely revolting what is allowed and acceptable about the way children are treated here. And the "it's the parents right" thing makes me sick. I am all for rights as a parent - but before that I am for the rights of HUMANS and children are humans too - though I guess I'm in the minority in thinking so.

It makes me sick anyone could think anything good about spanking. People who hit others are NOT kind or gentle. They may do kind or gentle things, but kind an gentle people do not hurt others. It's till legal in some states for schools to do it as well, and this is WAY over my head, I cannot grasp how it has remained legal to do this?!?!?! Sick sick sick.

And for the person whose dad had the student sign - what would happen if they refused? I would fear being hit if I didn't sign... SICK - I mean REALLY who would have them SIGN it?! Sounds sadistic to me!

This reminds me of that show dexter - seemingly nice wonderful guy to everyone around him, but really a serial killer. Some of these teachers and principals get a sexual pleasure out of disciplining the students. Not saying thats the case with the above mentioned teacher, but I would consider it due to the desire of the students autograph... why would he want to remember what he had done... what enjoyment was there? Sadistic for sure. I don't care WHAT year it was!

and nothing to do with spanking but we all thought my grandfather was one of the kindest, gentlest, most awesome people ever (he was my best friend when I was young)... turned out, he was molesting my sister when he lived with us. Seems you cant ever really know anyone, but someone who saves autographed paddles from spanking children would be a red flag for me.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

also the following are more likely to spank (according to statistics)

lower income class
those with less education
those with lower IQs
depressed mothers
those who were spanked or abused growing up

(where I live this seems to hold true - also certain cultural backgrounds seem to do it more then others as well)

and the following are morelikely to get spanked, or spanked more
boys
chlildren with special needs


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## Equuskia (Dec 16, 2006)

Considering 21 states still allowing paddling in school, well, physical punishment isn't exactly uncommon in the US, of course, depending on the region.

More than 200,000 kids spanked at school


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## onlyzombiecat (Aug 15, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?
- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?
- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

I'd say it varies from family to family.
I think spank usually means hitting the child's buttocks with a hand or object. I don't think a hand slap is a spanking.

I haven't witnessed anyone spank their child in a long time thankfully.

I'm on a mainstream forum and several parents there would spank their children and several would not. I would say they have similar education levels, money and religion- as much as you can tell online.


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## phathui5 (Jan 8, 2002)

Quote:

also certain cultural backgrounds seem to do it more then others as well
All of the African American parents I know (minus the few in the AP group) spank, swat, etc. I know a few white parents who spank, but it's a much lower percentage.


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## frontierpsych (Jun 11, 2006)

It seems about half and half here, maybe a little more spankers than non-spankers. Positive discipline seems to be catching on, in general, especially among more educated mothers.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Whistler* 
I hear that in the South it's much more common and accepted to swat or spank, especially in public.

Not everywhere. I live in the South and have for most of my life, and I have never seen a child spanked in public. I don't recall even seeing a swat although I suppose something like that may have gone unnoticed by me before I had kids. Also, none of the parents I am close enough with to talk about discipline spank. I was shocked the other day when I heard a mother in Target threaten to hit her child. That's just not something I am used to hearing.


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## SunshineJ (Mar 26, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *onemoremom* 
Most of what I've seen is slapping of very young hands, and light taps on the bottom for older kids. It's more point of the thing I guess, I've never seen or heard from anyone who really wanted to physically HURT the kids.

From the few I know here that have done it, and use it as a discipline tool, it's usually explained that for very young toddlers, it's to help them stay safe until they can understand better. For example, a hot stove. Most of us will try to explain 'hot', find safer ways to show what 'hot' is, etc... and do what we can to keep littles away from a hot stove. The parents who spank, will also (in addition to the rest of all that) smack the childs hand if they reach for the stove. These parents see it as a safety measure-much prefer to smack, and the kid learns that stove=unpleasant, than have the child get a serious burn.

That's one example, but generally seems to illustrate the reasoning behind smacking/spanking for the very young. It's something they understand long before logic. Behavioral training I guess.

Those same parents seem to be the ones who will spank on the bottom as the kids get older. It's usually a last resort when a kid is totally bonkers and defiant and the parent is at wits end. It seems the threat of it is usually enough-once the kid is warned that if xyz then they get a spank, the behavior changes, they do as they're told. Otherwise, it's a light tap on the bum with an open hand. The children seem to protest more at the idea of the thing than actually fear it.


This is a lot of the reasoning I have seen. For many it's along the same lines as if you see your toddler about to dart into the middle of traffic, it's far quicker to grab their arm and forcibly jerk them back to the sidewalk than to try another method that may not be as effective, and often with toddlers it's the thought of better a little sting now than a lot of pain later, at least with the dangerous situations. Also at that age a LOT of it is for the attention factor. Many parents I know have given their child a single swat on the seat to get their attention. If the child is wearing a disposable diaper under their clothes it can make a loud enough "pop" sound that it makes the kids pause (I've yet to see anyone do this hard enough for the child to react as if they are in any kind of actual pain, and while I'm sure it would be possible, the people around here usually just don't hit that hard and wouldn't want to).

I'd say a pretty large percentage of parents in the US (_and grandparents_) spank their children. Mind you for most that would probably mean a few times a year, not a daily, weekly, or monthly occurance. I live in the midwest and the motto has generally been one of "spare the rod, spoil the child". Unfortunately, those who disagree with this have traditionally been those who went to the other extreme of employing NO discipline, so their children were the example kids. You know, if you don't spank your kids they'll turn out like those little heathens type thing. (The ap/gd movement is very new, at least in this area, which is why I say traditionally.)The ideas of spanking in this region completely span all racial, education and socio-economic status.

I've noticed from the people I'm aquainted with that while generally accepted, the definition of "spanking" does vary. For most people it tends to be 1-2 open handed swats on a clothed behind. However, for those in the military or who are more strict in religion, it tends to be more expected that children will listen and do as they're told and not talk back, and their version of spanking is more dramatic.

The one big change I've seen since I was a kid is that it's now fairly uncommon for a parent to use any kind of prop when spanking around here. It's basically hand only. The regional definitions in this area are spank= 1 or more open handed hits on the bottom, smack= a single open handed hit that is a bit lighter, either on the hand or the bottom, swat= same definition as smack, generally less than an actual "spank", as in you'd swat at a fly.

ETA: This always seems to be a point of contention in these discussions, but very few people I know that choose to spank have ever done so in anger. The general attitude is that if they are angry with the child they walk away so as not to actually harm the child by accident.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

there are varying degrees of abuse, just as there are varying degrees of other things. By most people's standards, including those on MDC, what my mother did to me was not abuse. What was done to my husband would be considered abuse. That being said, it had an abusive effect on me, and therefor, I dont care what anyone says, it was abuse. Not the same level of abuse as what legally constitutes or what was done to my husband, but abuse just the same. Strangely, my husband doesn't feel he was abused.

I use the term monster. I am not saying for every parents who has hit their child, but for every parent who CHOOSES to hit their child. To me, that is a monster. TO ME. No one has to agree with me. I do see some one who makes a mistake, realizes thats what it is, apologizes to the child, and sets forth to change as completely different from someone who says "I hit my kid because I think purposefully inflicting pain on them to get them to do what I want them to do is right/healthy/acceptable/okay/etc"

If a spouse were to hit his wife against her will it wold be abuse reguardless the amount of force used. I am only holding the same standards for the smaller, defenseless members of our society. I am not making an exception "its abuse when an adult his another ADULT against their will, but its only bad parenting if they hit a child" Legally, I am aware it is not abuse. I don't think all people who spank are monsters - but those who know there are other options and CHOOSE to purposeflly hurt their children in my eyes are monsters. So are the men who do so to their wives.

It's also dangerously hard, even when calm, to determine the amount of force and how it will effect ANOTHER person. What is a mild spanking to one child may be traumatic to another. One child may be like my sister, pretending to cry for my parents benefit but not feeling any pain at all only anger. A child of the same size and build receiving a spanking of equal force may end up with bruises, nerve damage, or worse - and it wouldn't necessarily be because the parent use too much force and the former child could "take it"... it could be they aren't using much force, but the latter child has a more fragile body. Of course, mentality has to be taken into consideration as well. My sister thinks spanking is wrong, same as me. We had the same mother, if anything she's gotten my mother's "worse years" - and yet *I* was more emotionally damaged by my mothers actions. I was abused emotionally by my mothers physical discipline techniques. Even in places where torture is used it is intended to go beyond the physical. it is intended to effect the person mentally - and so are spankings. So, the same spanking may or may not be physically abusive. It may or may not be mentally abusive. Truly, you cannot know the effect it will have on SOMEONE ELSE. You are not them. And I don't think most spanking parents are willing to ask "is this effecting you in a negative way? because if it is we will stop and try something else." Nor do they seem to put two and two together to realize simply by observing their child that their child is suffering mentally (and sometimes physically) BECAUSE of the spankings.

I respect some people think there is some kind of fine line, or even thick line, on the subject. This is one I see very simply: spanking, no matter the intent or force used, EASILY has the potential to affect the other person in an abusive way, and would be considered abuse if done to another ADULT against their will, and therefor, in my eyes, is abusive.

Other things are abusive as well, such as yelling, and *I* myself am guilty of that. I can accept that my yelling has an abusive effect on my children, is therefor abusive, and was something I *had* to stop. I apologize, I change. An abusive act is not what makes an abusive person in my eyes. The monster is the heartless person who sees no wrong in hurting others - the humane person is the one avoids these things, acknowledges when they have done wrong, make restitution, change. That is not what I'm talking about here. I am talking about people who do things that have abusive effects on others - things that would be considered abusive if done one adult to another instead of one or more adults to a child - and done with intention, and with the idea that it s their right to treat another smaller human this way, that what they are doing - purposefully inflicting pain on a child - is in fact RIGHT. Right to do, and their right to do so, well when I hear that I see a monster. I see either a person overcome by rage who does not care, or a person who can only find serenity in hurting others which is a sickness in itself. Not to mention the people who use their right to spank as a way to indulge in sexual pleasure. It may never amount to what a judge would call sexual abuse, but they get sexual gratification out of the simple act of spanking the child. This is sexual abuse in my eyes too, even if some people don't consider it simply because the person is smacking instead of fondling. It's the Intent. and the Effect.


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## RufusBeans (Mar 1, 2004)

Here where we live now, in Northwestern PA, it is very common. I know maybe one other person here that does not, and I met her on MDC.

People openly talk about it, mostly in the context of "I don't spank her very often, but yesterday she just went over the line..." Parents at activities will joke to their kids -who are dawdling or singing instead of putting shoes or coat on- " want papa to spank you when you get home?" DD's ballet teacher even told her once that I was going to spank her after class for not listening.

Where we used to live in Western US, most people minded their own business and I am not sure if most people did or not. They just didn't talk about it, I tend to think that it was not as common.

To me spank means hand on butt, and what I've been unfortunate enough to observe, that's what it is here.

Although once when we first moved here, a friend DH had just met was over and dd was whining to me about something, and the friend turned to dd and said "hey RufusBean's dd:" and he grabbed his belt buckle and kinda shook it with meaning, but with the same jokingness that the mothers at the activities use. This was lost on dd and dh, but I saw it and knew what he meant. Like I said people don't mind their own business here, and they just assume everyone uses physical punishment.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

slight OT: but one of my pet peeves is when people talk about spanking their kids to others out of the blue IN FRONT OF THE CHILD. I think that is terrible too. Or the threatening to spank them in front of everyone. I feel bad for anyone who ever tries something like that in front of me. and at this point in my life, I'm not really so sure what I wold do if someone even threatened that in front of me.


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## vtgirl (Mar 20, 2002)

:
















we don't hit. we don't know anyone who does. we were certainly *spanked* as kids but have figured out the flaw in the rationale and decided to take our chances with gentleness. so far it has worked out GREAT!


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## kcstar (Mar 20, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SunshineJ* 
ETA: This always seems to be a point of contention in these discussions, but very few people I know that choose to spank have ever done so in anger. The general attitude is that if they are angry with the child they walk away so as not to actually harm the child by accident.

This was not the case in my family of origin. Spanking was readily performed in the heat of the moment. Whining was often countered by a raised hand, ready to slap the face.

We slapped DS's hand exactly once, because we had not brought electrical outlet covers to the room we were meeting in, and in the hours we were there we ran through all of our distraction techniques until he wouldn't be distracted anymore. A small bag of outlet covers were added to the diaper bag within the week, I'd like to say that very evening. As a rule, distraction and attention to needs have worked so much better for us.


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## angelamariebee (Jun 20, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?
- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?
- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?
- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

I know less than a handful of people in real life (not counting internet friends here) that are opposed to spanking. The vast majority of parents I know spank their kids. To them spanking means all sorts of different things- some just hit their kids wherever, some only spank on the butt, some only slap hands, etc. Some are more mild spankers and some are borderline abusive (although I'm of the opinion that hitting is hitting, and it's all abuse). I don't think I know anyone that uses belts or spoons, etc, to spank their kids.

Most of them have made comments to me about how I NEED to spank DD, so I imagine they all think it's the only appropriate way to discipline a child.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *angelamariebee* 

Most of them have made comments to me about how I NEED to spank DD, so I imagine they all think it's the only appropriate way to discipline a child.

that bothers me too - especially when what you are doing is working... my mom was from that "you need to spank" camp. She didnt care that with my personality it wasn't necessary. That when I was a young child we were decently connected and she didn't have to do that. I was also a pretty good kid - not because I was spanked or afraid of being spanked - the spanking only hurt our relationship and my behavior got worse over the years - but if she had just kept our connection in place and went another route with discipline it would have worked really well for me. She spanked for the sake of spanking "because the bible says so" which to this day she still doesnt understand the bible DOESNT say so







but yeah, she also thinks I "need" to spank my children - even though at their age that are millions of times better "behaved" then my younger brother was at those ages (IDK about me or my sister). I just don't understand the "*have* to spank" mentality. That some people would do it even if there is a better, healthier, safer, more effective way.


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## allgirls (Apr 16, 2004)

I am returning this thread.

Several posts have been removed. Please take note of and adhere to this section of our User Agreement, particulary the bolded sentence as it pertains directly to this thread.

Mothering.com is the website of natural family living and advocates natural solutions to parenting challenges. We host discussion of nighttime parenting, loving discipline, gentle weaning, natural birth, homebirth, successful breastfeeding, alternative and complementary home remedies, informed consent and many other topics from a natural point of view. We are not interested, however, in hosting discussions on the *merits of crying it out, harsh sleep training, physical punishment,* formula feeding, elective cesarean section, routine infant medical circumcision, or mandatory vaccinations.

Allgirls


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## theretohere (Nov 4, 2005)

Spanking is very common here. I know teenagers who are still being spanked. Whipping with belts and thin tree branches is also very common.


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## Channelle (May 14, 2008)

I actually don't know anyone in real life that doesn't spank.









Everyone looks at me like I have two heads when I say I won't, even my dh sometimes! (But he has promised to be very openminded to not doing it first and trying other gentle methods, and also promised to try to learn to be gentle. He was just raised in a very "spank-filled" house.)

My parents spanked, but never me. I was just a really good child. I think I was in time out once my entire life, and never even grounded. My brothers were spanked, especially my older, more angry brother. If it means anything, I turned out extremely normal and stable, and my brothers are the opposite.

Everyone I know though spanks differently. Some only save if for extreme cases, some after they've let their anger cool down, some every time they get angry in a burst of anger, some smack hands, some smack faces, some spank butts with their hands, and some spank butts with objects. Most spank because that is what they think is the right and normal and what everyone does. And because it's the only way to discipline a child, and if you don't the child will be defiant and disobedient and a "hellion". A lot do it because the Bible tells them too.


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## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)

I live in California. I was spanked occasionally. When my kids were little I spanked them a few times (hand on bottom), but it wasn't part of any well thought out discipline theory. It was just because I was really angry and frustrated. It's been a long time since I spanked them. It never worked.


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## mermaidmama (Sep 17, 2008)

- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?

I'm not sure.

- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?

I have witnessed it with strangers. I also know people whove done it.

- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?

I imagine it does. I think it also varies depending on class and how the parents were raised.

- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?

I don't know of all the reasoning behind it. But.....some do it and feel bad but continue to do it, some think they are teaching a lesson, some its religious, some think if it "worked" on them then it's good for their kids, some people dont know what else to do.

- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?
Hit them on the bottom or hand. Some use objects like...my husbands mom would spank his bottom with wood spoons.


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## waiflywaif (Oct 17, 2005)

Wow, I don't know anyone in real life who DOES spank. I've heard of it, and even seen kids get smacked out in public, but I don't know a single person who personally does, and I have a very diverse circle of friends.


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## Raene (Jul 24, 2008)

I'm from Texas, lived there until 3 years ago, and honestly, aside from those in my AP group, NEVER had I met anyone who didn't spank until moving north. It's just that everyone does it. All my friends were spanked, I was spanked, and my neices/nephews are all spanked. People in the grocery store spank. Every kid I babysat was spanked.

Yeah...the AP group was an eye-opener for me and a life-saver for my DC.


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## beanma (Jan 6, 2002)

OP, just stay away from Wal-Mart if you don't want to witness a public spanking.


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## mouthcave (Oct 9, 2008)

I live in Georgia and I don't know anyone else that doesn't/didn't spank. I see people hit their children in public on a pretty regular basis. I know that some public and private schools in the state still use spanking as a punishment as well. It is very common as far as I can tell. Most, if not all, people I know consider spanking to be hitting the child on the bottom. I know of people that just use hands, some that just use belts or other objects, and some that usually use hands and save belts for when they feel the child is really misbehaving. I'm not really sure if the child's bottom is clothed or what. They still hit the child's hand as well, but they don't call it spanking.
I've mostly just heard that spanking is the only way to get the child to listen and behave. I am usually told that my son is just naturally "good" so I don't "need" to spank him.
I'm not sure of actual percentages at all and like others have said, I'm sure it varies pretty greatly depending on where you live in the US.


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## Mama.Pajama (Jul 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?

65% of Americans approve of spanking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?

Every mother I know spanks their children, except for one cousin of mine. I guess I would seem like a radical in this area to not spank my toddler (or be goofy in public and interact with him, or breastfeed, co-sleep, etc.).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?

The legality does vary from state to state.
The practice itself varies culturally- by religion, by ethnicity, by gender, but interestingly enough, not by economical status.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?

It's an archaic practice that does not work. People spank their kids because that is how were disciplined and learned how to discipline from their own parents. They are satisfied (sometimes) by immediate compliance and control- they don't believe all that psychological mumbo-jumbo concerning the long-term effects on their children. They may have their own references, perhaps a book by James Dobson







, but these are _not_, by any _stretch_ of the imagination, accepted in the mainstream scientific community, which as a rule of thumb, probably means it's BS.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

I think this question will remain more of a mystery than the others, since spanking is something often done in the heat of the moment. I can tell you that my own parents used their hands more than anything, but when they wanted it to hurt worse, they used the belt, a rubber hose named "Mister Misery", a wooden spoon (with a smiley face on the concave side and a frowny face of the convex side), etc. My dad was more contemplative about what weapon he would wield, but my mom would grab whatever happened to be laying around. In my siblings' and my own case, blows were directed at the backside, from the lower back to the back of the knee.
I certainly know that not every parent does it like mine did, but nevertheless, I strongly disapprove of all forms of physical punishment just the same, based on science _and_ personal experience.


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

the economics of spanking:
http://www.slate.com/?id=2075217


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama.Pajama* 
I can tell you that my own parents used their hands more than anything, but when they wanted it to hurt worse, they used the belt, a rubber hose named "Mister Misery", a wooden spoon (with a smiley face on the concave side and a frowny face of the convex side), etc. My dad was more contemplative about what weapon he would wield, but my mom would grab whatever happened to be laying around. In my siblings' and my own case, blows were directed at the backside, from the lower back to the back of the knee.
I certainly know that not every parent does it like mine did, but nevertheless, I strongly disapprove of all forms of physical punishment just the same, based on science _and_ personal experience.

In the places I've lived, if anything other than a hand or spoon on the bottom would be called "beating" or "smacking" or "hitting"; the word "spanking" would refer specifically to a hand or spoon to the butt. Some types of "hitting" might be considered acceptable in some regions, but they still wouldn't be called "spanking."


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## Mama.Pajama (Jul 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lolar2* 
In the places I've lived, if anything other than a hand or spoon on the bottom would be called "beating" or "smacking" or "hitting"; the word "spanking" would refer specifically to a hand or spoon to the butt. Some types of "hitting" might be considered acceptable in some regions, but they still wouldn't be called "spanking."

Agreed. As I said, I don't think what my siblings and I experienced was commonplace "spanking": I think people put it into practice from one extreme (explaining what's happening and why beforehand and hugging the child afterward) to the other (beating them unconscious). I just don't agree with physical punishment one way or the other, know what I mean?


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## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I think I understand Katie. A tap on the hand is not compareable to beating a child into a hospital stay. However, one being horrible does not make the other acceptable either. there are varying degrees of unacceptable, unhealthy treatment towards children.


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## sunny*pa*mom (Mar 28, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *waiflywaif* 
Wow, I don't know anyone in real life who DOES spank. I've heard of it, and even seen kids get smacked out in public, but I don't know a single person who personally does, and I have a very diverse circle of friends.

Me too!! And most of my friends are pretty mainstream. Time outs are common but I don't know anyone who spanks.


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## Mama.Pajama (Jul 16, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I think I understand Katie. A tap on the hand is not compareable to beating a child into a hospital stay. However, one being horrible does not make the other acceptable either. there are varying degrees of unacceptable, unhealthy treatment towards children.

Exactly.


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## Ceinwen (Jul 1, 2004)

I'm in northern Ontario, and I think more people here spank than they admit to. The culture seems to be much less accepting...

In my personal circle, no one spanks as a form of punishment persay, but I know all my friends (including myself, G!d help me) have spanked out of pure frustration - then usually cry and apologize to our child and call each other for help and advice.


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## limabean (Aug 31, 2005)

I think it varies tremendously by region.

I was never spanked, and none of my friends or family (most of whom are fairly mainstream) spank their kids, that I know about. I've also never seen anyone spank their child while out in public.


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## dulce de leche (Mar 13, 2005)

Where I live, I've only met one family that doesn't spank. It is so expected that our former pediatrician gave me copy of TTUAC at dd1's 6 month old WBV because he "could tell she was strong-willed." It is done both publicly and privately. Generally, it means hitting a child on the bottom or legs with a belt, paddle, switch, wooden spoon or hand. It is so ingrained that I think few people question it. It is also accepted for any caregiver (babysitter, teacher, etc) to do it, with the expecttion that the parent will repeat it as a way of backing them up. It is horribly sad.


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## amberskyfire (Sep 15, 2007)

Personally, I have never known anyone who was not spanked. I always thought it was something EVERYONE in the world did until I learned about natural parenting about eight years ago. I'm from the south where it was pretty common to hear of people making their kids "go cut a switch" to whip them with. I've also seen plenty of people smack their kids in public.

I think maybe your husband thinks that because most parents don't spank their kids in public where other people can see. That's probably just the worst of the bunch that do that.

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that probably 90-95% of US parents or more use spanking or some other form of hitting for punishment. I really have no idea, though.


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## Mal85 (Sep 3, 2008)

nak...

almost everyone i know has spanked and/or been spanked. although i really think there are different ways spanking is used. most parents i know don't use it as a form of punishment, more like a heat of the moment 'you're not listening, you're out of control i don't know what to do if i hit you, you'll know i mean business' kind of thing. it gains compliance. i was spanked. all my siblings (i'm one of 6) spank, some to lesser degrees than others.

my mom will see a child acting unruly and say "he/she needs a good spanking". it makes me cringe. i think most parents just don't know better forms of discipline. they need more tools in their toolbox, so to speak.


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## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)




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## journeymom (Apr 2, 2002)

I'm still thinking about this thread.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mal85* 
most parents i know don't use it as a form of punishment, more like a heat of the moment 'you're not listening, you're out of control, i don't know what to do, if i hit you you'll know i mean business' kind of thing. it gains compliance.

Agreed. I think this is why my parents spanked, and it's exactly why I spanked my kids.

There is one other couple in our circle of friends who actually had a parenting philosophy that included spanking, complete with big wooden spoon prominently displayed as a warning.

Otherwise, we don't know ANYONE who spanks their kids, at least purposefully.

And frankly, I suspect our spanking friends probably quit that when they figured out that their son was a little more 'spirited' than average, bordering on adhd. They started him on herbal remedies and got him involved in gymnastics and soccer where he can constructively get his ya yas out.

My husband jokes that he believes in spanking, "That kid needs a good spanking!" and I don't think he's entirely joking. _But I notice he's never spanked our kids._


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## nextcommercial (Nov 8, 2005)

I'm very mainstream, and I don't spank.

All my friends are very mainstream, and I only know one who spanks. (My sister in law)

I go to a church that doesn't believe in spanking.

I have a daycare in my home. None of them are spanked.


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## rainyday (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Whistler* 
I think it makes a huge difference which part of the country you live in. Here in the Northwest you NEVER see spanking or swatting in public and rarely do you see scolding. At the park or playgound, I almost never see even a time-out. I do see a LOT of children throw fits and scream and kick and parents vary from holding them to taking them home to doing nothing to redirection or distraction but I never see swats or spanks.









:

I also live in the Northwest, and I have NEVER seen someone spanking or hitting their child in public or in their home, and I too have only rarely seen someone scolding their child loudly. None of the parents that I know use spanking.

I've visited other parts of the country (like Texas and Louisiana) on family trips, and I've been absolutely shocked by how differently (for the worse) parents treat their kids there. No car seats, no booster seats, public spankings, threatening a "whipping", smoking in front of the kids, screaming at them in public...It was really horrifying and made me very, very glad I live some place where we do not have to see that or be around people who treat their children like that. Around here people would stare at you (and not in a nice way) if you did that to your kids in public.

So, I'd say, yes, in my experience it varies a huge amount according to region.


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## NYCVeg (Jan 31, 2005)

I've never personally known anyone who spanks their kids. Maybe some do, and just don't talk about it--but there is definitely not a culture here that condones corporal punishment. I've never seen anyone spank in public.

FWIW, I've lived exclusively in big cities in the Northeast, and my circle of friends and acquaintances tends to be middle or upper middle class with extended formal education (virtually everyone I know has a graduate degree of some type). YMMV.


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## RoadBuddy (May 19, 2005)

I think it varies regionally. Here, I know one person who does, no one else. She's German and just moved to the US (so not indicitive of the local area here). I'm in a city in the midwest among people with college or graduate degrees and middle or higher incomes, which I think statistically correlates. That is, people with more education and such tend to spank less, although I'm sure many of these people still do spank.

I think it was more common 20-30 years ago, and it is still somewhat common (maybe 50%?) in the small town in the midwest where the ILs live.


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## mamadebug (Dec 28, 2006)

I think it varies by region. I live in the SF Bay Area, and have never seen a child spanked in public, threatened with a spanking or know anyone who lives around here that spanks.

When we visit my husband's family in southern CA, I feel like I often hear kids threatened with spanking or see them actually get spanked when we are out in public. My husband's cousin and his wife spank their child, and no one else in the family gives it a second thought.


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

That reminds me, when I lived in a rural area of the midwest, spanking was accepted from parents but frowned upon from other caregivers.


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## Poogles0213 (May 18, 2008)

I would guess the majority (or, at least, more than half) of people in my area spank. The mindset seems to be that children *need* to be spanked otherwise "they'll never learn!" and not spanking is assumed to mean permissive parenting or neglect.









I totally agree, though, that it varies greatly from region to region and even community to community.

Growing up, I never knew there was any other type of discipline. I think the first time I had a time-out was when I was around 9 at an aunt's house (they also spanked, it just wasn't the first-and-only line of discipline














. And "spanking" within most of my family covered a wide range of violence, from a "swat" on the behind with clothes on, to being stripped from the waist down and hit repeatedly with an object (spoon (wooden, metal, plastic), hanger, switch, belt, extension cord etc) anywhere between the lower back and the knees. I can still see and hear my younger brothers screaming bloody murder while my dad hit them wherever he could because they were frantically trying to get away from him.uke

Of course, I realize that MOST people who do spank aren't out-and-out abusive like my family. But where I spent my young childhood, it wasn't really that much worse than what most of the kids I knew went through









This has, no surprise, partially been the reason behind me deciding to never hit my kids, once I have them...


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## Mal85 (Sep 3, 2008)

I should add, I live in a small rural community in the midwest. No one bats an eye at parents spanking their kids, but it's not cool for other caregivers to spank someone else's child.


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## texmati (Oct 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
Disclaimer- I'm in Texas









I would say that better than half the population spanks. Probably around 70% (off the top of my head...)
I do NOT know a lot of people that do, though my bil and sil do. I do my darnedest to avoid people who abuse their children.
YES, it varies greatly by location and culture.
They think- "you have to", "it's the only way they understand", "your kids will have bad manners, be monsters, etc etc if you don't"
As a rule- "spank" is hitting on the child's bottom with the parent's hand. Though it is rather common to use things like a spoon or ruler.










-Angela


I live in texas as well... and as much as I love this great state I am *afraid* to say that we won't spank here at work. I know I'd be laughed at.

I don't doubt that there are non spankers here, but spanking is very much accepted. People don't seem to be ashamed of it at all. I'm shocked at how many people implement planned spanking as a form of discipline.

As in, behave or you will get 4 spanks when we get to the car. I'm sure i got smacked as a kid when my mom lost her cool, but it was never so ritualized, and it was always considedred a kind of failure, yk?


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## Daphneduck (Jan 22, 2009)

...


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## Breeder (May 28, 2006)

I was spanked and "switched" (that would be hit on the legs with a green tree branch) when I was young.

My kids have never been spanked (let alone switched) I smacked DS1 on the hand once and I burst into tears. He was unfazed (thankfully). I have never repeated that action.

*"I live in texas as well... and as much as I love this great state I am *afraid* to say that we won't spank here at work. I know I'd be laughed at." -Texmati*

I will tell anyone who talks about punishment that I do not spank, my older son is such a well behaved young man it has caused many a co-worker to reconsider and two even changed their methods of discipline to non-violent ones!

Never be afraid to speak up, even if everyone else laughs there might be one person who is inspired by you.


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## rabbitmum (Jan 25, 2007)

Thank you all for taking the time to write all those interesting replies! It has been quite educational for me!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *vegemamato* 
I've only heard of a spank on the butt- and swats everywhere else. I just call it abuse..

So, does this mean that in addition to the 50 - 70 % who are spanking, there is a bigger group that approve of "swats", "slaps" or whatever else they call their particular form of hitting children?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
...and people who don't approve of spanking, but do spank their own kids. (I've hit both dd and ds2 once, so I guess I'd technically fall into that category, although neither of them were actually spankings.)

I don't really think you can count parents (like you and me







) who "have lost it" on occasion, only people who *plan* to hit their children because they think it's the right thing to do?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *onemoremom* 
So I can really say that almost all the parents I know who currently have young children, are much more gentle than our own parents were. Which is good progress, I would say.

Yeah, that's wonderful!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sk8ermaiden* 
My DH was raised with the traditional "good way" of spanking. Sent to the room - all parties cool down - offense is explained and a few openhanded spanks are given.

That just sounds absolutely perverse to me.







What was the point of that? Everybody calm down, and *after* they have talked about what happened, they go through some kind of ritual of humiliation, to remind everybody that the bigger person has the power and the smaller person has to submit? Completely weird.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Huckablogger* 
Churches, mine included, have even done parenting classes that TEACH you how to spank.









That's about the craziest thing I have ever heard!







Although I do remember a case when my daughter was little, where some extreme Christian church or other had published a magazine (translated from English I must assume) that contained instructions on how to spank. It was taken to court and stopped since it was instigating a crime.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Amylcd* 
The girl in this story (Bria Rose) attended the highschool my children will end up going to. Because of this incident, they now send home forms for the parents to sign if they want to decline the paddlings. Unfortunately, most parents are fine with it.

This almost made me cry. And somehow it seems really absurd that they even hit teenagers.







:

Have to go!


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## Astrogirl (Oct 23, 2007)

I'm Canadian, and the only people I know IN canada and the U.S. that spank are of Mediterranean original (Portuguese, Tunisian & Italian). Not sure if that counts for much.

Most Americans or Canadians i know that have spanked have done so once, out of a moment of weakness or desperation, like they have run out of tools or options, rather than as a rule for parenting. They don't like to do it, or want to do it, and know its ineffective, but just reached a bad point.

(btw - to journeymom: I've also said "that kid needs a spanking". I think its a bad habit from our culture, I sometimes feel that way, but I would never do it - I couldn't bring myself to raise a hand to a child)


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## SquishyKitty (Jun 10, 2005)

I dont' think spanking is all that common anymore. I have lived in Germany for 10 years, and I think american kids get the occasional smack to the back of the head just like european kids do.

Spanking is only done when hitting on the bottom. Everything else is smacking/slapping.


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## rabbitmum (Jan 25, 2007)

Again, thanks for all the great replies!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
My best advice, don't learn about American culture. It's completely revolting what is allowed and acceptable about the way children are treated here. And the "it's the parents right" thing makes me sick. I am all for rights as a parent - but before that I am for the rights of HUMANS and children are humans too - though I guess I'm in the minority in thinking so.

Yeah, I find the "parents' rights" part of this phenomenon intriguing. I find that we often assume that American culture is very similar to ours, the US is to a great extent populated by our great-grandfathers' sisters' and brothers' great-grandchildren, after all! Which makes it really stand out when there's ways of thinking that are so different. There seem to be some "absolute ideas" in American culture, and in US laws, that seem irrational to us (me), or have some irrational consequences, like when ideals of personal freedom actually diminishes people's freedom.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
and the following are morelikely to get spanked, or spanked more
boys
chlildren with special needs









I'm sure that's true! Really sad!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Equuskia* 
Considering 21 states still allowing paddling in school, well, physical punishment isn't exactly uncommon in the US, of course, depending on the region.

I wasn't even thinking of schools! That seems really old-fashioned and weird (and awful).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SunshineJ* 
For many it's along the same lines as if you see your toddler about to dart into the middle of traffic, it's far quicker to grab their arm and forcibly jerk them back to the sidewalk than to try another method that may not be as effective

(Except it's really easy to pull a toddler's arm out of joint!







)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I do see some one who makes a mistake, realizes thats what it is, apologizes to the child, and sets forth to change as completely different from someone who says "I hit my kid because I think purposefully inflicting pain on them to get them to do what I want them to do is right/healthy/acceptable/okay/etc"

I agree, that's two completely different things!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I was abused emotionally by my mothers physical discipline techniques. Even in places where torture is used it is intended to go beyond the physical. it is intended to effect the person mentally - and so are spankings.

I think you're right, it seems like the humiliation and disrespect is just as important as the pain, as several in this thread have pointed out that many spank very "symbolically" to get "attention".

Quote:


Originally Posted by *vtgirl* 







:
















we don't hit. we don't know anyone who does. we were certainly *spanked* as kids but have figured out the flaw in the rationale and decided to take our chances with gentleness. so far it has worked out GREAT!

Good for you!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *kcstar* 
This was not the case in my family of origin. Spanking was readily performed in the heat of the moment. Whining was often countered by a raised hand, ready to slap the face.

That's just awful! I never understood why so many parents see "whining" as a crime.







You talked in an unhappy sounding voice and were met not with understanding, but with a raised hand. That's just so sad.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *theretohere* 
Spanking is very common here. I know teenagers who are still being spanked. Whipping with belts and thin tree branches is also very common.



















Quote:


Originally Posted by *Channelle* 
I actually don't know anyone in real life that doesn't spank.









Everyone looks at me like I have two heads when I say I won't, even my dh sometimes! (But he has promised to be very openminded to not doing it first and trying other gentle methods, and also promised to try to learn to be gentle. He was just raised in a very "spank-filled" house.)

Good for you for being the two-headed weirdo!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *waiflywaif* 
Wow, I don't know anyone in real life who DOES spank. I've heard of it, and even seen kids get smacked out in public, but I don't know a single person who personally does, and I have a very diverse circle of friends.

It does seem like there's a lot of different experiences among you US moms! I'm glad to hear that there are quite a few of you that don't see spanking or threats as very common.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *beanma* 
OP, just stay away from Wal-Mart if you don't want to witness a public spanking.

He he, I'll remember that if I ever go to the US again! Which will be after and if I get over my fear of flying. Wal-Mart is one of those extra huge supermarkets that you have over there, isn't it? Supermarkets are apparently a bit of a conflict generating environment, it seems to me, from reading here on MDC!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Mama.Pajama* 
my own parents used their hands more than anything, but when they wanted it to hurt worse, they used the belt, a rubber hose named "Mister Misery", a wooden spoon (with a smiley face on the concave side and a frowny face of the convex side), etc.

Again, that's just completely sick!







I'm so glad to see that many like you turn around and refuse to continue this tradition of child abuse.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dulce de leche* 
It is so expected that our former pediatrician gave me copy of TTUAC at dd1's 6 month old WBV because he "could tell she was strong-willed."

A "strong-willed" baby of six months?







I'm glad to see that this was your *former* pediatrician.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Breeder* 
I will tell anyone who talks about punishment that I do not spank, my older son is such a well behaved young man it has caused many a co-worker to reconsider and two even changed their methods of discipline to non-violent ones!

Hurrah!







:


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## rabbitmum (Jan 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SquishyKitty* 
I dont' think spanking is all that common anymore. I have lived in Germany for 10 years, and I think american kids get the occasional smack to the back of the head just like european kids do.

Spanking is only done when hitting on the bottom. Everything else is smacking/slapping.

I didn't know that it was so common to hit kids in Germany? But that's a whole nother thread. Europe isn't one country and there are many different cultures (as it seems there are even within the US). I have never seen kids getting smacked on the back of the head here or anywhere else in Europe.


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## Caneel (Jun 13, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
Now I have got the impression from these forums that "mainstream parents" in the U.S. spank their children, but my husband, who has been in the U.S. a lot more than I have, says that they don't and that it's not so common.

So, educate me please, ladies:

- How big a percentage of the population in the U.S. would you estimate spanks?

*Don't know about current times but when I was a kid, I suspect at least 50% of parents hit their children as a form of punishment.*

- Do you personally know a lot of prople that do?

*No I don't.

The only mother who I ever heard openly admit to hitting her child was a co-worker.

No one else in my family hit their children to the best of my knowledge. My aunt (and mentor) was very GD.*

- Does it vary from state to state, or from different cultures within the American culture?

*In my opinion, it has more to do with educational levels. I am sure culture plays into it but I don't intimately know anyone from a different culture aside from my relatives.

My German father never hit me or even threatened physical punishment in any way. (emotional punishment was his thing) Further, I never saw any of my German relatives use physical punishment on their children.

My mom, on the other hand, often hit me on the face (hard) and voliently pulled my hair. This continued until I was in high school when my dad put a stop to it. I do remember being spanked, bent over the knee and hit on the buttocks with an open hand, as a small child*

- Why do they think it's a good idea to spank?

*My guess is because they don't know any better way or that their own feelings are out of control and they take it out on their children. This describes my mother.*

- And what do they do when they "spank", really? Do they hit the child with their hand on the child's hand, or what?

*Spanking as I know it involves hitting on the buttocks.*

(This is the first topic in my new series "Help an ignorant European learn about American culture!" Thank you in advance!)










*I wish there wasn't anything to learn about this part of American culture









I must say that my mother totally and completely regrets hitting me. She has apologized countless times and assured me she would never hit DS. I believe her and have no concerns.*


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## Kappa (Oct 15, 2007)

It's pretty common. I don't know people who spank a lot at all, but there may have been a few incidents where there were spankings, and the threat of spanking is used to keep kids on their best behavior. Like PPs, I live in Texas, and I would say upwards of 75% have spanked, and believe in spanking. Many believe in beatings a/k/a whuppins. I remember when I was young my friends would go on and on and on talking about beatings they got. There was a one-ups-manship going on a lot of the time, but they were beaten. I was the "freak" that never needed a beating. Well, I did a lot of weird stuff that would have warranted a beating in another household, but my Mom wasn't going to fly off the handle just because I ate all of the oatmeal creme pies in one day or decided I needed to know what would happen if I put bleach on my jeans. My punishment was that I didn't have any more pies, and my favorite jeans were ruined. Now when something was really off, my Dad's anger/yelling was more than enough to get me back in line.


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## JollyGG (Oct 1, 2008)

Never mind


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## Astrogirl (Oct 23, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
I didn't know that it was so common to hit kids in Germany? But that's a whole nother thread. Europe isn't one country and there are many different cultures (as it seems there are even within the US). I have never seen kids getting smacked on the back of the head here or anywhere else in Europe.


Its not. I live in Germany - Its illegal here and I have NEVER seen it done - even though I've seen kids behave really badly that would get them spanked in Canada (where i come from).


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## Britishmum (Dec 25, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SquishyKitty* 
I dont' think spanking is all that common anymore. I have lived in Germany for 10 years, and I think american kids get the occasional smack to the back of the head just like european kids do.

Spanking is only done when hitting on the bottom. Everything else is smacking/slapping.

I'm really surprised by this.

Until I came to the US, I had never met anyone who hit their kids with implements. Well, actually, in the context of work in the UK I knew one or two families that I worked with, and they were immediately investigated and stopped by child protective services. It was absolutely not seen as acceptable or legal to hit your child with a wooden spoon, belt or stick, and it was always a reportable crime. And corporal punishment has been outlawed in the UK for years, unlike the USA.

By contrast, when I came to the USA, I discovered that hitting is not only legal, but in some circles considered your duty as a parent. Discussion can even be 'amusing' amongst adults as they chat about the spankings their kids receive. And I know a family who keep a 'magic stick' in the car, just in case their kids need a little abuse when out on the road.









Fortunately, where I live and in my circle of friends any form of physical punishment is frowned upon. But that is most certainly not the case in many other areas.


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## Britishmum (Dec 25, 2001)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
I didn't know that it was so common to hit kids in Germany? But that's a whole nother thread. Europe isn't one country and there are many different cultures (as it seems there are even within the US). I have never seen kids getting smacked on the back of the head here or anywhere else in Europe.

ITA. I never see kids being hit on the head in the UK either, nor have I in other European countries. I guess it just depends upon where you are?


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## hipumpkins (Jul 25, 2003)

NJ checking in:
Twice in my life I've seen a child hit and it made gasp. both those times I was on vacation in Disney world so those people could have been from anywhere.
I have never seen a child here hit at the park or Y or anywhere else we hang out but I have heard threats and seen some forcefulness.


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## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
Yeah, I find the "parents' rights" part of this phenomenon intriguing. I find that we often assume that American culture is very similar to ours, the US is to a great extent populated by our great-grandfathers' sisters' and brothers' great-grandchildren, after all! Which makes it really stand out when there's ways of thinking that are so different. There seem to be some "absolute ideas" in American culture, and in US laws, that seem irrational to us (me), or have some irrational consequences, like when ideals of personal freedom actually diminishes people's freedom.

In the 19th century, spanking was pretty common in Europe too-- so it isn't too, too surprising that some aspects of European culture have survived among Americans of European descent, which have not survived in Europe. Unfortunately one of those aspects is spanking.


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## Plummeting (Dec 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zech13_9_goforgold* 
Parents can also sign wavers at private schools to allow the school to spank their kids for them.

LOL! Clearly you either don't live in the South or Midwest or you aren't aware of what the laws are in your state. In _many_ Southern and some Midwestern _public_ school districts, you have to sign a form if you _don't_ want them to spank your kid. Spanking in public schools is still a big problem in _several_ states.

I'd say that in the Midwest probably 60 to 70% of parents spank, but you can break that down further based on exactly where you're talking about. I think in the rural areas the numbers are on the high end and in the larger metropolitan areas the numbers are on the low end. In the South I'd say that about 90% of parents spank, again depending on whether you're in a rural or urban area. I've lived in different states in both regions for extended periods. In the South you're considered unusual if you _don't_ spank.


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## Plummeting (Dec 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NicaG* 
I personally don't know anyone who spanks.

Anyone think there's a division by socioeconomic class? Or by region?

*Absolutely*. I live near Memphis and just witnessed three spankings while spending one afternoon (less than 4 hours) at the zoo. Well, technically two spankings and one case of a woman hitting her small child on the head (HARD) with a full water bottle because he wouldn't get down off of a step when she was ready to move on. Most people in the South spank. LOTS of people in the South spank a LOT. I wouldn't say lots of people do it daily, but that doesn't mean they don't do it regularly, so I'm really confused about people thinking that it's not "regular" if they don't do it every day. That's silly.


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Plummeting* 
In the South you're considered unusual if you _don't_ spank.

I don't spank. I live in the South. I am not unusual in my area.


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## Plummeting (Dec 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *riverscout* 
I don't spank. I live in the South. I am not unusual in my area.

And that's why I said, about the South, "...again depending on whether you're in a rural or urban area." So perhaps I should've said, "In _most_ areas of the South you're considered unusual if you don't spank," and that would be absolutely accurate.

I highly doubt that if you drive an hour or two from wherever it is that you live, you're going to be considered "normal" by the locals if they find out you don't spank. I've lived in Asheville, NC, where I'd say it was very normal _not_ to spank kids, but Asheville is like some weird anomaly in a southern state, as is Austin, TX, IMO. I don't know where you are, but I'd bet my bottom dollar you're in a larger city. As far as the South is concerned, I've lived in NC, TN and TX and I have family in MS, AL and two different cities in TX. I currently live near Memphis and also have family in Knoxville. I worked in SC for over a year. I can assure you that in all of the places in those states that I've spent much time, aside from Austin and Asheville, spanking is absolutely the norm and I've seen it done in public in every single one of them but the DFW area, where lots of people spank, just not in public.

My husband has lived in MS, TN, AL, AR, TX, NC and LA. He actually _didn't believe me_ when I told him the other day that it's unusual to see people hit their kids where I'm from. I've never seen a kid hit in public where I'm from. I've never even seen my siblings or cousins spanked, even though we all were. That's something reserved for in private where I'm from. In _almost_ every place DH has ever lived, spanking is absolutely the norm and people who don't spank are considered odd. Actually, spanking was the norm in every single one. The only difference was in how people reacted to those who didn't - whether they considered them odd or not. They generally do.


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## rabbitmum (Jan 25, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lolar2* 
In the 19th century, spanking was pretty common in Europe too-- so it isn't too, too surprising that some aspects of European culture have survived among Americans of European descent, which have not survived in Europe. Unfortunately one of those aspects is spanking.

I still think it's strange! And surprising. Why hasn't it stopped?

The Danish law for Public Schools from 1814 says: "He [i.e. the teacher] must never allow himself to give the children slaps, punches or strikes with his hand, to pinch them, or use demeaning words against them. Just as little as he may arrange any "shame bench" or "shame corner" [= timeout]; and generally in no way use humiliating punishments, that may stifle the [child's] feeling of pride [actually "honour"], and serve to harden rather than improve the child."

I'm sure this didn't mean that spanking stopped in all schools and homes, but still it says something about the attitude in society.

And it was written almost two centuries ago. Didn't most of the European emigration to America happen later than that?


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## riverscout (Dec 22, 2006)

***


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## darcytrue (Jan 23, 2009)

I don't spank my children and I won't go in to the type of discipline I do use because I thought it was not allowed on MDC.







I do know that my older sisters both spanked (and yelled) at their kids when they were younger.







My brother doesn't spank his 5 yr old DD but his wife does. In fact, his wife will get on to her for the smallest things, when she isn't even doing anything wrong. She will pop her or yell at her or tell her to stop acting stupid, etc. It bothers me a lot but I can't do anything about it because I am close to my brother and don't want to cause any problems. I do try to model good parenting behavior in front of people like my SIL and others that are harsh in their discipline - hoping it will maybe rub off on them.









I also witness mothers jerking their kids around, talking nasty to them and popping them in stores and at parks so it's common. I do see it happening.


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## jnet24 (Sep 4, 2006)

I live in a smallish town outside Toledo Ohio and *everyone* I know spanks their children, except the parents I have met at our Natural Family Living group. It is not unusual to cuss at your children either. I have heard this from family members to numerous people in the grocery store. I am not advocating that I am just mentioning that I see it all the time.

When I explained to my mom the reason I do not spank my children her response was we'll see how long that lasts.


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## SquishyKitty (Jun 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *rabbitmum* 
I didn't know that it was so common to hit kids in Germany? But that's a whole nother thread. Europe isn't one country and there are many different cultures (as it seems there are even within the US). I have never seen kids getting smacked on the back of the head here or anywhere else in Europe.


I'm fully aware that Europe isn't one country. I have lived in Germany for 10 years and I'm just talking about what I've seen personally. We've made a point to do a lot of traveling, so this isn't just from my tiny view here in my village.


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## Cinder (Feb 4, 2003)

DH and I graduated from bible college, I'd estimate 90% of our friends from college spank... also most use babywise/the pearls. We talk to them still on face book and such, and ignore the parenting aspect, but we do not actually get together in person.

Other than that, dh's brother, who has no children, thinks we should spank, and dh's other brother/his wife probably do spank, but we disagree with enough other stuff that they do that I refuse to every see them/talk to them, so I have no clue... And that's it, I don't know anyone else who spanks, my mom didn't, and neither did dh's parents.


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## Cinder (Feb 4, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 

and the following are morelikely to get spanked, or spanked more
boys
chlildren with special needs

What?!? Seriously, kids with special needs get spanked MORE?!? I would of just assumed less!


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## Equuskia (Dec 16, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cinder* 
What?!? Seriously, kids with special needs get spanked MORE?!? I would of just assumed less!

Unfortunately, there are people that believe that "special needs" don't exist, that children with autism and such are just badly behaved children that need more "discipline", in other words, that just need to be spanked more.


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## ginadc (Jun 13, 2006)

Like hipumpkins, I live in New Jersey--a very liberal town in the northeast part of the state, a few miles west of NYC. Spanking just isn't done here, and there's no way it would be permitted in the schools. I have never seen or heard of anyone here using spanking or any other kind of physical punishment with their kids.

That's not to say there are no parents here who ever spank, but I'd say it's vanishingly rare in my area. If someone in the circle of parent-friends from my kids' day care ever said something about spanking their child, they'd get looked at like they had six heads.


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