# Blimey, Nov 05 Mamas - It's March!



## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Happy First Day of March, Mamas!!!

Or should I say, this year is really MARCHing onward!









I feel like we should do something fun to celebrate the new month, and the coming of Spring! A swap? A poetry slam? A Caribbean cruise??

Also I had a thought last night - how would everyone feel about creating an address database for our DDC? I'm not sure how it would work exactly, but I think it would be really helpful if we had each other's addresses so that we could send *surprises* to each other, rather than asking for someone's address when we want to send something.

(And, let's keep this on the DL, but I think I might be starting to get a twinge of babylust. I know: ME! It's crazy. See what a few days of good sleep will do to you?!







)


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

I love the idea of the address list. I'm game.
And yes, happy spring... Wow. March already.
I am SOOOO glad you have been getting better sleep, Amy. I got the worst sleep since the newborn days last night. But it wasn't entirely Isa's fault. We had a pretty rough storm last night (it even woke Joshua







) But Isa also woke up a lot. The longest stretch I got last night was an hour and a half







. But amazingly, I have a pretty decent attitude today. (Okay, the first 15 minutes that I realized I was awake for the day, I was _reeeeaaallly pissed_. But then I realized that I was up for the day and might as well make a good day of it. So I'm trying my best to smile







)
BTW, can I just mention again how much I love The Daily Groove? And how much it helps on days like this to be reading _The Big Rumpus_

Oh, I need a good laugh. I have cleaned up 4 pee puddles off the floor this morning and it's only 8:30!!! (But I'm still smiling, see? Still smiling....)


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Well, there's an address list on the yahoo group but I'd really appreciate adding the non-yahoo mamas in as well, so we can faery each other as and when we want. Personally I like the idea of a caribbean cruise or flying the whole lot of you over here (including Suriya) but I'd be up for a swap as well.
Shockingly, I'm not babylusting







I came to the conclusion that despite being a progesterone junkie, I actually WANT to wait 6 months or so before TTC again- unfortunately I did this whilst ovulating, having bd'ed a few (4) days before







I'm pretty sure I'm lucky though, this was during the Great Bout of Thrush which would have killed off anything.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

oh good. im starting in on this one early this time!










i woke up with a call from my sister and elwynn (he was sleeping over there) singing happy birthday. it was very sweet if not a a bit off key







isn't "happy birthday" like the all time hardest song to sing and have it sound nice?
i think i want to start a new traditional b-day song that isn't owned by disney.

anyways.. timothy took the day off work and is making me a special cup of organic yummy esspresso to start me off on this day of my birth.
ngaio is sitting at the table drinking water out of fine chine and singing to herself.
her favorite song to sing these days is "buNNY MONEY" which is what she calls bunny my hunny..she just says it over and over whilst swinging her arms..bending her knees and grabbing her crotch and i swaer..its the funniest thing ever.

i plan to knit and drink coffee while looking out over the sunshiney mountains.then we are going to go adventuring about town to try to find trouble, and to mail some packages.

hope you all have a beautiful first day of march. my favoritest ever month..
spring is in the air. maybe ill get a new baby for my birthday! *i wish*







:

oh yeah, speaking of babies..
we adpoted a second lop bunny becase one wasnt cute enuff. her name is floppsy mopsy. she is just the sweetest little thing and bunny is overjoyed to have a companion.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 

Oh, I need a good laugh. I have cleaned up 4 pee puddles off the floor this morning and it's only 8:30!!! (But I'm still smiling, see? Still smiling....)

speaking of pee.. the other night i had just changed the cotton tablecloth on our kitchen table when ngaio proceded to climb up onto it and pee.. i was so impressed with ther right then, i tell you.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

: MamaFern!!!!

That's so cute, Ngaio's song-and-dance routine. Rowan's just started being an airplane whenever she hears one (and we live near the harbour so there are always a LOT of floatplanes flying overhead). She put her arms out and back (DH says she's a delta-wing aircraft) and makes an airplane noise. The bonus is she can do this at the dinner table. And she does. A lot.

Spiritmomma, I am with you on the sleep deprivation last night! I think Rowan was overtired and she slept really poorly last night. Up about 7 times, I think. I was sleeping on the foamy beside the couch and eventually (after she fell off the couch a couple times - surprisingly, this DOESN'T wake her up!) I just snuggled her in next to me. And woke up a couple hours later with intense pains in my shoulder, ow. Overall, a crappy night. Early to bed for her tonight!

Yesterday I took the afternoon off (DH needed to work and my IL's needed to get their passports) and we stopped in at the mall and I got Rowan some new clothes. I bought her 18 mo clothes, expecting them to be big on her, but they're not really. Doh. Little bunny is growing like a weed!

Amy, I watched all the Brynn videos on your blog last night. Priceless! She is such a cutie. And I hear you on the baby lust - almost. Until last night I would have said, yeah, I could probably handle another baby in 9 months or so. But this morning - nope. Besides I STILL haven't got my period back so it's a moot point.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Happy Birthday, MamaFern!!!!!







:









I am glad you found your birthday money a few days back, too! That is sweet.









Spughy, mine just came back recently; I think I've had 3 cycles now. It's been making me all kinds of moody and tired, but at least I have a sex drive now, so I will take the bad with the good!







I'm not sure if I really have babylust or not...but I saw one of those mommy and baby shows on TV the other day, and the mama had two little girls, and I just thought...."ahhh, that would be so sweet!" Of course, they make it look fabulous on TV, but I know the reality of it still!!







Anyway, I'm not getting rid of Brynn's baby clothes anytime soon; that's all I'm sayin.









Helen, are you still active with the Yahoo group? I should pop over there and see if I would be able to keep up with them. I didn't realize they have an address list, but that is definitely a good idea for those of us over here!

Jaymi, I love the Scott Noelle emails too and I was actually going to thank you today for recommending them! I've really been getting a lot out of them.

Sorry about the restless babies, Spughy and Jaymi. Brynn had a weird night last night, but I think it was my fault, so I don't feel bad about it today. Otherwise though, thing are still going sooooo smoothly! I have to say, it is great.

Oh, and totally O/T: today we were in the shower, and she dropped her shampoo bottle on the floor and said, "Oh dammit!" and I have to admit, I totally had to stifle a laugh! I know it's wrong, but it was just the most adorable and hilarious thing to hear it coming out of her mouth. I did the right thing though and said, "We can say 'Oh shoot!'" and so that's what she said. But still:









And whoever said it a few posts ago: Yes, this is totally the cutest age ever. The. Cutest!!


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Amy, that's hilarious.

Nothing new to say here. Suriya has been having nighttime fussiness until 1 or 2am and the rest of the kids wake up early so I'm a little out of it.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

I love the little parrot babies reminding us of things that we say too often. Neela has mastered the perfect imitation of the "warning" gasp that I use (for hot or dangerous things). We've had a couple of swear words from her, but none that she "knows" yet









*Happy birthday Fern!!!* Wishing you a wonderful day and a terrific year!

I found a bag of kiddie clothes at the dumpster today- so I'm celebrating having a couple of new things for Neela, who is getting so big! She's too tall for some of her 18 month clothes already, and was 24 lb 6 oz last week when I weighed her!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I said it over in knitting, but

HAPPY BIRTHDAY FERN!!!!!!!!!!


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Happy March, mamas, and Happy Birthday Fern









Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
I feel like we should do something fun to celebrate the new month, and the coming of Spring! A swap? A poetry slam? A Caribbean cruise??

Also I had a thought last night - how would everyone feel about creating an address database for our DDC? I'm not sure how it would work exactly, but I think it would be really helpful if we had each other's addresses so that we could send *surprises* to each other, rather than asking for someone's address when we want to send something.

I'd be in for a swap! And how would this address database work (specifically where would it be located?)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Besides I STILL haven't got my period back so it's a moot point.

Me too. If we end up having more kiddos we want them close in age, but I am trying to enjoy this time without AF.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

happy birthday mama fern! have you ever heard the stevie wonder song that her wrote for mlk, jr? it's awesome and not owned by disney as far as i know. we play it on our birthdays.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Happy birthday MamaFern!!!!! Hope you have a great day!!

News on our end is that we should have a formal job offer for DH within two weeks. We didn't think it would be till early April that we could even get an unofficial offer letter, so mid-March is an improvement! At this point, being in limbo for 5 months about everything had just worn me down, and I was actually getting kind of a little depressed and lost a lot of energy for doing things to prepare for the move. I just want to know where I will be--this extended time period of limbo has sucked. But having an end to the waiting and the ability to make a decision in sight within the next two weeks has revitalized me somewhat and now we're getting stuff done around the house to prepare to put it on the market. We were distracted and eating out all the time for a while there, which we totally can't afford, but now I made a meal plan for two weeks and did a big grocery shopping and I've been cooking almost every day, so that's good. And now DH has finished the last of the evening classs he was teaching for the last several months, so he will be a lot more available and less preoccupied to do stuff at home, without constant teaching/preparing to teach/grading to do in the evenings. So that's life on our end!

I agree that this age is the cutest and funniest! Ella just does so many cute and funny things right now, that I laugh so much! Even when she is not right there--the other night after she'd gone to sleep, I opened up a kitchen cupboard where I keep pots and pans to put something away there, and found a banana sitting there that she'd obviously put in there earlier. It just cracked me up for some reason--it was just so random and funny!


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

For the love of GOD, I am so far behind!







:

I neeeeeeed to go to bed but before I do, two things:

1. I would love to swap addys...what if everyone PMs their address/info to one person (maybe you, Amy?







: ) and then that person could PM us all a list? Just a thought. I'm down for swaps, surprises and such.

2.







HAPPY BIRTHDAY FERN!!!!!









oh...and one more thing...where is this fun toddler you all speak about??? Mine has been a grumbling grump lately because of his molars!


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Amy, thanks for the book suggestion in the previous thread. A few other people have suggested it as well. Amazingly a couple branches of the county library just got copies. Although of course neither of the 2 with in 5 miles of me. I'll just be thankful for interlibrary loans. I had reading the spirited child book back when she was 2 or so and should really take a look at it again. Let me just say after one high needs, very sensitive or spirited child (however you want to call it or whatever she is) this little guy that some people think is so intense is just a breeze. Even when he does things like push his chair over to the stove and use it as a step stool to dig a mini handful of brownies smack out of the middle of the pan


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I know what you mean, Kristina. Skye may be clingy as all heck, but compared with the work that goes into parentin Isaac (now, not 5 years ago) she's a walk in the park.
The other possibility for a database would be to put it in a google spreadsheet, I guess- I'm still not very sure how those things work though.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

*trying to catch up while ezra sleeps in*

b/c she is soooo clingy, too that it's hard to fit in mdc time. she does grab a book and sit on the floor or in a chair sometimes though all by herself. i can so say in those times, "like mother, like daughter". she puts the book on her outstretched legs and just looks so serious sometimes. or, she will point and laugh at a page in the book. melts me.

i have some sort of allergy/sinus thing going on. ugh!

my mil may start watching her for an hour on mondays so i can take a much needed yoga class. i have not taken one since we were all preggo together.

we have some plans in the work to live abroad starting this summer. no firm details, yet but we are applying to a year long program that helps set up maternal health care clinics or work directly with existing ones (either through the WHO or through local orgs). We would hope to be in india, again but are open to pretty much anywhere in asia or africa...wow, can i be any more broad? the training starts in perth, australia so we would be true global citizens for a while. our biggest obstacle now seems to be just renting our house out to people we know/trust.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

A quick note from work to say,
HAPPY BIRTHDAY MAMA FERN!!!! (one day late).
It sounds like you had a glorious day.

I'm game for the address swap, just let me know what the ultimate plan is, and I'll send ours in.

Gunter, how exciting about the year ahead of you living abroad! Good luck as you figure everything out. Ezra sounds adorable. Gunter and flapjack, Finley is also super-clingy.

More soon, and Happy March to everyone!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Hi everyone!

Gunter - that sounds totally exciting.

And yes, I'm totally in for some sort of addressy-databasy thing. Amy already has my address, if you're doing the collecting, Amy!

Rowan had another terrible night but DH put himself on Rowan-duty so I could sleep and therefore function at work today. So I got to sleep from 8:30 til 5, which was nice. I think I know what's causing this though - my latest attempt to get cod liver oil into the girl. Going on advice I received here on MDC, I mixed it with lemon juice and honey. It does make it quite palatable - I have problems with the stuff too stemming from some childhood trauma - but I fear the honey gave her a sugar overdose (especially since she rarely, if ever gets sugar) and her little system couldn't deal with it. So, up every hour and a half, all night. I'll try a different CLO strategy tonight - maybe in mashed banana and yogurt? and we'll see how that goes.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

spughy, i'm curious...what's the CLO for? i'm glad that you at least got a good night's sleep last night.

finley had a MELTDOWN, his first, last night, before going to bed. it was pretty bad (and he didn't nap either!!!), but once he got to sleep at 9:00 (which is pretty late for him these days), he slept well through the night, waking only twice for milk with me.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barcelona* 
spughy, i'm curious...what's the CLO for? i'm glad that you at least got a good night's sleep last night.

I'm glad too! The CLO is for the vitamins and EPA. I use a high-vitamin, all-natural CLO from Dr. Ron's. And yes, I'm aware that most peds say not to give CLO to children, but I believe that there is a big difference between the CLO that is mostly available today that's been heat-processed and had vitamins stripped out and then synthetic forms added in, and the CLO that occurs naturally with the correct balance of naturally occurring vitamins A & D. Here's an article about that if you're interested.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Kavita~ I'm glad you guys will be out of limbo with a job offer soon!

Gunter~ What an exciting adventure! I hope you'll have some occasional internet access to update us on your work









I may have said this before, but Neela is confused about gender. I think it's my fault- she calls men "man" (usually) and women "people"- which I realise is the way that I point them out. So we're working on "woman". And then yesterday when my MIL asked her what she was, she said "boy". MIL said "no, you're a girl", and Neela shook her head and insisted "boy". They went back and forth a couple of times, until MIL gave up and said that it's futile to argue with a toddler.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Gender awareness is not really expected to be developed until 2-3 years old. Killy will be 3 in May and calls waitresses and cashiers "big guy" - which is a bit embarrassing and I have NO idea where he got that from! But, he and I have long discussions about who has a penis and who doesn't, so he does have a pretty good grasp on gender (or at least anatomy!).

Ellie's so precious lately! Except that she's developed the habit of shrieking when she wants something. She keeps adding new words, too, but is so much less talkative than Killy. Even when Killy was diagnosed with a speech delay at 20 months, he still babbled constantly! Ellie's just very quiet a lot of the time. And, since we're working with Killy so much on articulation (he has some articulation delays/issue and so is still in speech therapy), he's really bothered that she doesn't enunciate the end of her words. Today, she held up a toy duck and said, "DUH!!" and I said, "That's right! Its a duck! Duck!" and Killy said, "Ellie said 'duh,' not duck!"









Did I tell ya'll that I finally switched Ellie back to cloth diapers? I'm so glad, my inner environmentalist-voice has finally stopped yelling at me!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Well done







I felt so guilty the week that we did the kitchen, because Skye was in sposies the whole time. I forgot to mention that she shrieks too







Not so precious.
See, you just have this image of a wailing banshee on my shoulder now, don't you? Screaming when she's put down, shrieking when she's happy- it has to be said, it's a very noisy house.
EVERY single one of dad's carers has walked through the door, looked at the bedlam (3 kids, one dog, three adults, one wheelchair, a hoist, a commode and a couple of carers) and gone "blimey"







In an odd way, though, it's strangely peaceful. We know that the decision to help keep dad independent is the right one for our family, and that makes everything seem worth it.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Queen of Cups* 
Gender awareness is not really expected to be developed until 2-3 years old. Killy will be 3 in May and calls waitresses and cashiers "big guy" - which is a bit embarrassing and I have NO idea where he got that from! But, he and I have long discussions about who has a penis and who doesn't, so he does have a pretty good grasp on gender (or at least anatomy!).


We've already started with anatomy here. It's hysterical because Ella can't say nipples, but she can point to hers. And has taken to sometimes pointing to her nipples when she wants milk! (Partly because we sometimes call breasts milkies, as well as calling the milk that comes from them milkies. Now that we've added some goat-milkies to her diet, I'm sure she's totally confused! Yes, I swear that I do speak regular adult English to her most of the time. With a few exceptions!!)

And, midwife's daughter that she is, she knows where her "Nye-nah" is and will happily point it out and tell you what it is. DH was sort of traumatized by me teaching her this and her mastering it so quickly, so I tried to teach her to say penis just to totally freak him out, but it didn't take. Probably just as well!! As much as I am not into the vagina term, I just can't get into "yoni" either and then "vulva" just always sounds weird to me. So we'll stick with this until it's time to get more detailed and anatomically correct!

Oh, speaking of midwifery and my DH, I had to laugh at my husband the other day. I have definitely converted him to the dark side. He already had quite an education about normal birth while we were dating and married before I ever got pregnant. But I think the pregnancy and homebirth finished him off. If he ever leaves me for another woman it will have to be for some AP/NFL alterna-chick, he is ruined for any mainstream woman. Here is a snippet of the conversation that we had at dinner the other night about his colleague whose wife is pregnant:

DH: Remember I told you that Joe's wife is pregnant? Well, Joe and I were talking today, and she's due any time now.
Me: Oh. That's nice. He must be excited. Where are they having the baby?
DH: (humphing somewhat.) At the [local-huge-university-teaching hospital].
Me: Umm. (Takes bite of dinner.)
DH: Yeah, apparently her doctor is freaking her out, telling her it's a really big baby. They say the baby is about eight pounds.
Me: Oh, yeah?
DH: Yeah! I told him that they can't exactly accurately predict the weight of a baby before it's born, that ultrasounds are not entirely accurate at determining weight, and that anyway eight pounds is an average size baby. I mean, my mom had two ten-pound babies vaginally! (Pauses, continues gravely) I told Joe that it's a set-up for a c-section! I told him that they should get a doula, but he said that it's too expensive. And apparently she's totally scared about labor and wants to have pain meds as soon as she walks in the door. They took a Lamaze class but Lamaze doesn't work that well, does it? Isn't slow deep breathing better? (Shakes head.) So many women have already decided before they ever go into labor that it hurts too much and they are going to get an epidural. Between that and the doctors convincing people that they can't have an eight pound baby vaginally, no wonder the c-section rate is so high! I said, well, my wife must be some kind of superhero then! She had our baby at home! (Beaming at me.)
Me: Well, I'm not going to say that it doesn't hurt at all--it did! But it's not an unhealthy kind of pain.
DH: I told Joe that I caught the baby! He couldn't believe it!
Me: Well honey, keep in mind that these people have already made their choices and they are due any minute now, they are unlikely to change their minds or accept too much new information at this point, so try not to scare them about things they aren't going to change anyway, it's just disempowering. Why don't you just give him a little information that in the hospital they have choices, and can refuse or question things? Like if they want to give the baby its first bath themselves and not have the baby bathed in the nursery, they can request that. Also, if she is planning on breastfeeding they should keep the baby with them as much as possible and make sure to tell the nursing staff and also put a sign on the bassinette that says no bottles, no pacifiers, no supplements.
DH: Okay. That's a good idea.
(Pause for more eating.)
DH: I told Joe that they should try cloth diapers . . . .








How hilarious is that????


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
I may have said this before, but Neela is confused about gender. I think it's my fault- she calls men "man" (usually) and women "people"- which I realise is the way that I point them out. So we're working on "woman". And then yesterday when my MIL asked her what she was, she said "boy". MIL said "no, you're a girl", and Neela shook her head and insisted "boy". They went back and forth a couple of times, until MIL gave up and said that it's futile to argue with a toddler.









Before you argue, watch _Ma Vie En Rose_. You never know how she's feeling on the inside! Besides, I personally have gone through many phases in my life where I have identified with the males aspect, then felt very strongly feminine. Maybe she's feeling tomboy today









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
And, midwife's daughter that she is, she knows where her "Nye-nah" is and will happily point it out and tell you what it is. DH was sort of traumatized by me teaching her this and her mastering it so quickly, so I tried to teach her to say penis just to totally freak him out, but it didn't take. Probably just as well!! As much as I am not into the vagina term, I just can't get into "yoni" either and then "vulva" just always sounds weird to me. So we'll stick with this until it's time to get more detailed and anatomically correct!

We say yoni at our house. It's a sacred word and doesn't include any aspects of sexual oppression. She can point to her yoni (and mine







) and often points at papa's lingum. Since these words represent a worldview that sees masculine and feminine as holy and worthy of worship and honor, I figure why teach her a word that perpetuates the oppression I'm fighting against? She'll be receiving a copy of Inga Musico's CUNT as soon as she's able to read. Okay, maybe I'll wait until she starts her period...









HAPPY BELATED FERN!
I hope you had a wonderful birthday!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

One of my sons proudly told his teacher that the new baby (Skye) was going to come out of mummy's cunt. That was an interesting discussion to have at parents evening...
I've set up a google spreadsheet for contact details, btw. PM me your email addy for an invitation thingummy. Is it OK if I invite those people who defected to the yahoo group and don't post on MDC any more?


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Personally, I HATE HATE HATE the word cunt. It just sounds disgusting and no matter how it is said it almost always carries a sense of a degrading epithet. And yes, I am all aware about reclaiming the power of language, etc., but I'm just not into it.

I don't like the word vagina either, but it's also basically a standard medical term. And if we go poking around at etymologies, there are a lot of words that have origins/original meanings in latin that we would be suprised at/dismayed by, but I don't think that we necessarily connect to that origin every time we use a word. And women in India (home of the sanskrit term yoni) aren't necessarily respected and revered either based on the language. I agree that there is some benefit on having a term for the whole enchilada of the female genetalia, rather than dividing it linguistically into a number of separately named parts which makes calling it a vagina really inaccurate and glossing over the reality, but at 15 months I'll settle for that because to some extent, I am aiming also to teach my daughter language that will allow her to communicate with other people and understand/be understood, so that is what I will call it for now. Once she gets old enough to really be interested (which she isn't right now, she just wants to check out her poo) then we'll start getting more involved. For right now it's enough that she can point to her nose, her eyes, her ears, her tummy, her belly button, her feet, her toes, and her nye-nah!

I liked the movie "Ma vie en rose" but also generalization is a hallmark of this age/stage of development--Ella at this point calls anything with four legs and a tail a dog--so I wouldn't make any assumptions about Neela's gender identity just yet!!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Kavita: Sorry if my post offended. Sounds like I may have hit a sensitive issue for you. I agree that at this age, it's not as important to fill my child up with my politics as much as it is that she is understanding concepts and understood when communicating. In the same vein, yoni is easier to pronounce than vagina...







Not that Isa is really talking at all. She's still stuck in sign land!

So this weekend I had a breakdown/ breakthrough...
I haven't had the time to post about it until now. But the news is that Isa and I are working on a cooperative weaning process. It's not necessarily being left to her to decide whether or not we are weaning, but I am eliciting her voluntary cooperation, and in return, I am cooperating with her wishes to nurse when she asks. I had a great fear that I would be ostracized from all my "villages" and mama support groups for having this desire to wean. But so far, all the mamas I've shared with have been very supportive and understanding. I don't have any deadlines or feelings of urgency to wean by a certain age or date, etc... but I am actively working on nightweaning as a priority, and then as it seems right, weaning in general. Isa is doing pretty well with the adjustment. Though, she seems confused about the role of food vs. milk. Sometimes when she is hurt (having stumbled or whatever) she signs for food in the same way she used to sign for milk. I cuddle her and snuggle her and then finally, if she's still signing "food" I try to help her find a healthy snack. I figure she will grow out of this need for comfort eating, but since that is what she is asking for right now, I am cooperating with the request. She usually only takes a few bites anyway.

The hardest part is the emotional loss I feel coupled with the new sense of creativity and adventure that this new kind of parenting forces me into. I have felt ready for this for a while and only now am giving myself permission to try it. The truth is that nursing had turned into a chore that I didn't feel good about most of the time. I felt ready to Love Isa in a new way. I HATE that so many metaphors I come up with for nursing relate to sexual relationships, but the fact is, our culture's ideas of Love often fall into a sexual category. But the metaphor that best describes why weaning feels like the right thing to do is this: When one first falls in love, it involves a lot of making out and physical affection. One is sleeping less, but elated. One willingly enters into physical expressions of Love frequently and enjoys it. But at a certain point in the relationship, it becomes apparent that in order to stay together, there needs to be more to the relationship than the physical. The two need to Love each other in a way that invokes their spiritual, emotional, and intellectual connections.
The good news is, Isa and I will not be "breaking up"!







But I do feel a strong desire to replace some (not all) of the physical affections of nursing with other expressions of Love. Sometimes I just want to snuggle and cuddle or even play wrestle (which involves her climbing all over me and me sometimes tickling or otherwise playing back) but not nurse. I am no longer game for an hour of non-stop nursing. It just doesn't feel right anymore. I feel like I have SO much Love to give her and so many new ways to show her my Love. Now, though, there is an adjustment for her to pick up on the game. When she first asks to nurse, I offer to hold her, to get her a snack or drink, or to play. This depends on whether I think she's aksing to nurse because a) she wants my physical affection, b) she is hungry or thirsty, c) she is bored. If none of these satisfies her and she still wants to nurse, we nurse. That's option d) Hey, mama, I just want to nurse.








Part of our nightweaning has involved my saint of a husband







beginning to cosleep with Isa while I sleep alone. This has helped trememdously. He and I had a long discussion on how to help me stop being a total







all the time. He asked what did I need to stop being so angry and so tired all the time. I answered unflinchingly in one word: sleep. So then we talked for hours (while Isa ran around the house naked and hyper and playing and singing and checking in with us, then running around some more) about how to make that happen. We voiced the unspeakable options ("Let's tranquilize her!







) and then tried to find options that didn't smack of child abuse.







We came up with nightweaning and Joshua cosleeping with her. She sleeps longer when someone is sleeping near her, but she keeps me awake. Joshua was always willing to get up with her, but didn't wake up unless I woke him. But for three nights now he's been sleeping in her room and getting up with her when she wakes. She is already waking less often and getting to sleep more easily when she does wake. I have only needed to nurse her _once a night_ (!!!) and am feeling like a million bucks when I wake up in the morning after having had at least one 4 hour stretch every night. Ahhh.... I feel so much better. Isa is getting better sleep too.








I feel like I know all of you so well. And I absolutely depend on the support of this group when I make decisions. I felt it necessary to tell my story in case anyone else is feeling the horrible guilt I was feeling about it. Or just so you'll know what may be coming for you when you do feel ready to begin weaning. In any case, I would appreciate any feedback you may have. I just felt like I needed to be honest with all of you on what Isa and I are going through right now. Thanks! And Lots of Love to those of you who made it through this long-winded post!







:


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

You know that both my boys weaned/ were weaned by 18 months, right? Alex self-weaned at 17 months after many, many nursing strikes starting from 8 months onwards, and it was a battle to keep him on the boob. OTOH, Isaac would happily have continued nursing a while longer, but I wanted my boobs back, my body back, my bed back- this happened at the same time as his dad and I split up as well, and after over two years of celibacy I gave myself permission to feel sexual again, which was part of it.
With Isaac, we went with "don't offer, don't refuse." His verbal skills, even at 17/ 18 months, weren't good enough for me to feel able to reason with him. He went from nursing 5-6 times a day, to 1-2 a day (middle of the night, mainly) to not waking at night. You may not want to hear this, but for both boys the midnight feed was the last one to go.
With Skye, we're DODRing now, and she's cut the amount of times she's nursing per day to 5-6, which is a level I'm happy with, including 1-2 night feeds. I'm not intending to wean her any time soon (particularly since I suddenly seem to be back to a "normal" menstrual cycle, so TTC, when we do, won't be an issue) but CLW isn't a goal of mine either. I figure there will be a time that seems right for us, but now isn't it.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

I think every mother has to do what she had to do in order to be the best mom possible. If that includes gently weaning... then that's what you do. Do you go to LLL? One of the four series (one series is done each month) is on nutrition and weaning, and a LLL Leader can be a great help in finding weaning techniques that are gentle and non-traumatic.

Having said that, I really can't relate to the desire to wean... (and I'm not saying that at all judgmentally, just honestly) I've been tandem nursing for 15 months now, and while there are moments I'd like to get down to JUST ONE nursling, I don't feel comfortable weaning Killy. I love the closeness that come with breastfeeding (and I still get to cuddle and wrestle and all that stuff, nursing doesn't replace that for us), and most of the time I even like tandeming. When I have both children curled up nursing, it can be pure bliss. Ellie still seems like such a baby to me that it never even crossed my mind that she's a nursing toddler until I was telling a friend about how I saw a couple at church pointing when I was nursing Ellie. My friend said they were probably just surprised to see such a big girl nursing, and it blew my mind - I had never thought of Ellie as anything but a nursing baby!














Oh, and I stopped offering mommy-milk to Killy after his second birthday (my goal is to nurse each of my kids to the 2-year mark recommended as a minimum by the WHO), but he still asked a ton of times every day. I will distract him sometimes, though, since he has a very "chompy" nurse that is uncomfortable if my breasts aren't really full. Luckily, I have over-supply issues, so I'm often plenty full! I'd say he nurses 2-3 times a day, and Ellie nurses at least 6-8 times a day and once during the night. I'm working toward gently night-weaning her, as everyone I've ever known who still nurses their 2+ year old at night deeply resents it. I don't want to end up there!

So, I looked at the pictures of Isa and I think she looks a lot like Ellie! I don't think I'd looked at her pics in a few months - her hair is really similar to Ellie's, and her face shape, too. Wild! She's very cute, of course! (and not just because she reminds me of Ellie!)

Ellie's saying more and more words! New words every couple of days! Yay! I can't wait till she can tell me exactly what she wants, and what she's thinking...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 
Before you argue, watch _Ma Vie En Rose_. You never know how she's feeling on the inside! Besides, I personally have gone through many phases in my life where I have identified with the males aspect, then felt very strongly feminine. Maybe she's feeling tomboy today









Yeah, I have no problems with whatever she wants to be. But also certainly not making assumptions about gender identity- in either direction. And her godfather (or faery godfather as he likes to be known) is a sometime drag queen, so she has people around that can offer a lot of insight into the many facets of gender identity. One day.

Jaymi~ I'm glad that you and Isa are working things out (and not breaking up







) Thanks for sharing your story with us, which I know can be risky in some places on MDC









I never had a "goal" for how long I would breastfeed, other than promising one more day at a time in the early agonizing days. I still don't; I sit on the fence about nightweaning, DODR, etc. I refuse sometimes on days when she asks every 15 minutes, I offer on days when she gets really distracted. We don't do cows milk, and only a little soymilk when my pumped stash is low. I'm kind of surprised that I don't care more about it, though I do have nights where I fantasize about night weaning at three am!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

P.S.- QofC~ congrats on switching back to cloth!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Okay..i seriously have less than a minute...

I'm in for an address swap...I think it would be great! I also think we should do a birthday database too









okay i have to run again...I'll try to catch up soon...

But the wedding is ONE MONTH away...and Friday is the end of the 2nd trimester at school so grades are due once again...

*hugs* mamas~


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

kaspirant, I put a section in the google spreadsheet for mamas to stick their DOB's. I had a fiddle, and I can't get into the spreadsheet when I'm not logged into google as me (if you see what I mean?) but the chances are that someone with talents that way could.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

i met up with sarah and rowan today!! rowan is the sweetest little munchkin. the kids didnt really play together but they did kiss a few times







. it was ever cute. sarah took some pictures, so she will probaly share them when she gets home.









ill write more later


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Hi Mamas! We had an awesome time in Vancouver on the weekend. We met Fern and Ngaio and Elwynn (yay!) at Science World and the kiddies had a good time playing although Rowan was zonked out asleep when we got there. She woke up in time to play with the balls though - her favourite thing ever - and to be kissed by Ngaio. I got a picture of that - DH will post it sometime today. I wish I'd left more time to play at Science World - we missed a whole bunch of cool stuff and I'd really have liked to spend more time with Fern & co, but oh well - next time!

We also had fun at the aquarium on Saturday. Rowan was a little startled by dolphins leaping WAY over her but she really liked the big fish in the tanks - the sharks and the huge amazonian crazy-fish (ok, mama just forgot what they're called, but they're cool!) and the BEST part of the weekend, for her, was that the friends we were staying with had not one but TWO kitties who decided that being pawed by a toddler was preferable to hiding away from all the humans so Rowan got a whole lot of kitty love all weekend. And my friends got first-hand experience with toddler determination. (They're expecting a baby. It's good for them.)

Rowan also really loved the kiddie slide on the ferry. She spent the whole trip, both ways (when we weren't lining up for food) just climbing up the stairs and then sliding down. Totally ignored the other kids on the slide, to the point of crashing into them as she slid down, but they didn't seem to mind and nobody got hurt so that was all ok.

Oh and Amy - you'll appreciate this - Rowan slept the ENTIRE night through on the little trundle bed in my friend's guest room (I slept on the twin bed above it). Not one wakeup from 9 pm to 6:30 am. It's the SBS (strange bed syndrome). Weird huh?


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Fern and Spughy - how wonderful that you got to spend time together! I am jealous! And Spughy, it figures, doesn't it??!







I'm starting to think that it's just all of the new sights and sounds that wears her out when we travel - so much stimulation!! That's wonderful though; you must have felt like a new woman!!

Speaking of sleep, I am glad you shared your feelings about your situation, Jaymi, and I don't think it's anything you should feel bad about! After everything we've been through, I can 100% relate to your need for better sleep and for some transitions. We are still doing so much better with Brynn sleeping in her own space, and even though she still wakes ~3 times per night (and yes, I'm still getting up and nursing her in her room), everything is just so much more peaceful and we are all sleeping much better. But I can totally relate to the feelings of wanting to wean; before we reached this point a few weeks ago, I was having *serious* feelings of wanting to wean. Since things have settled down though, all of those feelings dissipated on their own, and I now really enjoy and get a lot of pleasure from our breastfeeding relationship. So however you all work it out, I hope you find peace and happiness! As we've all said a zillion times, you can be a much better mama and partner if some of *your* needs are being met too!







(And PS: Yay to Joshua for being such a great partner to you right now!)

I'll jump in on the whole anatomy discussion here. We just call it her vagina, and I've tried to also show her where her labia are. She calls it her dye-nah.







I am with you, Kavita: I just can't go there with cunt, mainly because that's what my alcoholic abusive step-father called me when I was a teenager. So, yeah, probably not going to get over that anytime soon! Also, I just think it's good for her to know the standard medical terminology for all of her parts, and hopefully that will keep her from feeling embarrassed or ashamed about it when she's at an age where she has to talk about those parts!

Oh, and Kavita, that conversation you and your DH had was *hilarious*. That has happened to me, too, where I have heard my own words coming out of DH's mouth as he has a conversation with someone else. It's so awesome.

So our news is that DH still doesn't have a job offer yet. The job in Nebraska seems to still be a possibility, Detroit is out (YAY!!!), and looks like he's also being considered for a job that may take us to either Oregon (where I grew up, and where my family still lives) or Atlanta (where my BFF lives!). Which, can I just say: HOORAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm keeping my fingers, toes, and eyes crossed!

Oh, and my MIL is coming up this weekend.







: So not looking forward to that. Whatchya gonna do though? Sigh.

Well that's it for me. Brynn's been keeping herself entertained here in the office while I caught up. She's now flicking a rubber band off her teeth, so I guess we've entered the "negligent parent" mode.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Lovely pictures of Fern & her little mini-me, Ngaio, and my little solemn girl are up here: http://gallery.fishbc.com/gallery/vi...684&id=pic_017 Just click the arrow at the top right to see more!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
I'll jump in on the whole anatomy discussion here. We just call it her vagina, and I've tried to also show her where her labia are. She calls it her dye-nah.







I am with you, Kavita: I just can't go there with cunt, mainly because that's what my alcoholic abusive step-father called me when I was a teenager. So, yeah, probably not going to get over that anytime soon! Also, I just think it's good for her to know the standard medical terminology for all of her parts, and hopefully that will keep her from feeling embarrassed or ashamed about it when she's at an age where she has to talk about those parts!

So our news is that DH still doesn't have a job offer yet. The job in Nebraska seems to still be a possibility, Detroit is out (YAY!!!), and looks like he's also being considered for a job that may take us to either Oregon (where I grew up, and where my family still lives) or Atlanta (where my BFF lives!). Which, can I just say: HOORAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm keeping my fingers, toes, and eyes crossed!

Hey--don't knock Detroit!!! (My hometown!)







Of course I don't actually live there now, but there are some hip areas of metro Detroit that you actually would probably like living in, so if you did end up there it would be okay. And they have an awesome symphony orchestra that does concerts for tots (I took my nephew when he was about 2 and he loved it) and the Detroit Institute of Arts is great--it is the fifth or sixth largest (depending on who you ask) fine art museum in the U.S., and has quite a few original works by the who's who in art history--including a huge area which has original murals painted by Diego Rivera. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Institute_of_Arts
And you could hang out with my sister and her kids too!









I like "dye-nah"! This probably dates me as the fossilized old lady of the group that I am, but it reminds me of J.J. in the show "Good Times" and his trademark tag line--so I think I am now going to rename my anatomy, my "Vagin-O-MITE!!!"









Spiritmomma, sorry if I was sort of a crankypants in my previous post! (Can I blame it on PMS?







: ) This whole discussion definitely made me think about some things a little more deeply, so I appreciate that.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Amy I'm secretly hoping you move to Oregon just so we can hang out constantly.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
I think I am now going to rename my anatomy, my "Vagin-O-MITE!!!"









Holy Sh**, Kavita, that might be the funniest thing I have ever heard!!!
Oh, and now you sell me on Detroit, *after* we find out we're not moving there!









DiD, me too Sister! Vibes, vibes, vibes!

Spughy & Fern, those pictures were wonderful! I love the one of Ngaio kissing Rowan! Oh and I was going to tell you Spughy, Brynn recognizes Rowan's photos now and when she sees her, she will say, "Baby Woh-when!" So. Cute.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Spughy and Fern, how lucky are you guys! What adorable pictures! What beautiful little girls. Ah, if only we could all meet up IRL. And spughy, how nice that you got that uninterrupted sleep!

Amy, so glad that the sleep thing is going better with Brynn in her own space. I'm impressed that you can get up like that to nurse her in the chair. And I'm sending good vibes your way as you await the news of where you'll all be moving!!! How exciting and mysterious. Do keep us posted.

Kavita, Love that conversation with you and DH!







I've definitely been experiencing that with my DH. It's so funny...and also, on a serious note, so great to have such supportive and enthusiastic partners in parenting.

Spiritmomma, sending peaceful vibes your way as you start this process of weaning. I think it is SO important for you to feel good in order to be a good mama, and if there's any resentment, then it's a sign that it's time for change...and how great that you are able to listen to that and know that and act on it. I hope it's a smooth happy journey; it sounds like it's already begun and already is so.

I'm definitely not there with the weaning thoughts, though like MelW, I have no plan. I have no timetable, nor am I committed to CLW (though it could happen). At the moment, Finley and I are both happy with our nursing relationship. And every day is pretty different. Sometimes, he wants it all the time (and I will sometimes distract him), and sometimes it's just a handful of times in the day and twice at night. (He is pretty consistently down to twice at night these days). I think the hardest thing for me is starting to face the looks, b/c most of the people that I see IRL often, are not AP . I see them because they're nice, and they're easy to see, and it's cold and hard to travel across this big city to meet with the AP moms. But sometimes I do manage to do so, and it is wonderful. A group of us have recently organized a weekly playgroup, and that is GREAT. To not feel so alone. As the weather warms up, I'll hopefully be able to manage getting out to see these cool AP moms out and about more often.

I have good news, which is that my hepatitis bloodwork came back, and I am Clear as can be, and it is dormant as ever! So yay for that!!!! I have also not been sick for two weeks. I am still going to find a way to balance my body though, and perhaps meet with someone in homeopathy or naturopathy.

more soon...nak!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Barcelona, I'm so glad you are feeling better. That must be a huge relief for you.

Spiritmomma and anyone else who is on the weaning path... I totally understand. I don't want to wean Rowan, but I am soooo sick and tired of taking pills to be able to nurse her. So I'm cutting way back on the blessed thistle and the fenugreek and I'm not buying any more after my current stash is gone. Next month, I'm going to start weaning off domperidone. If my supply tanks completely, so be it. I'm hoping that Rowan will just go down to nursing once or twice a day and not stop completely, but I'm mentally prepared for it if she does. I think. I do still love nursing her so much, but I really want to get really healthy again too and I can't do that if I'm worrying about my milk supply, because exercise DOES make a huge difference in how much milk I make. If it takes me a month to wean off domperidone, she'll be nearly 18 months by then and, while I won't have made it to those magical 2 years, I think all things considered what with the supply problems and the mastitis and going back to work and all, we'll have done pretty well.

Actually, I'd really like it if she just kept the after-work nursing session. She's so cute with that - as soon as she sees me she comes running up to me and grabs my boobies saying "Bah! Bah!" and then I say, "ok, we'll go have boobies" and she runs as fast as she can to the couch and grabs our nursing pillow (just a couch pillow really) and brings it back to me with a big smile on her face and then jumps up and down. It's too cute for words.

Everything is too cute for words these days, isn't it? Amy that's so cool that Brynn can recognize Rowan! BTW the sling(S!) arrived - they're fabulous, thank you so much! (Everybody else, Amy made Rowan a sling for her dolls!!! It's adorable!)


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

On a breast-related but not breastfeeding-related note, I bought my first bra since Neela was a few weeks old today. I put on a sexy shirt a few weeks ago and was totally unimpressed with how my bra fit and breasts looked, so I just bought a totally impractical but very sexy bra. And it makes my breasts look hot







:


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

That's awesome Mel! It'll be at least a year before I can have a sexy bra. I have such huge boobs right now from tandem nursing it scares me a little


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

I just wrote this long reply and then somehow lost it while Brynn was on my lap banging on the keyboard. Arg!!

Anyway:

Spughy - Yay!! I hope Rowan likes her sling, and I hope the new one fits your DH this time!

Mel - I am soooo with you on the bra thing! This past weekend we were at the mall and I told DH that when Brynn weans, I am totally getting a new bra and underwear wardrobe! I am so sick of my plain-jane bras and want something FUN! It's just so impossible to find bras in my size though, so I have to settle for what I can find.







: I can't wait to go back down to a 34C, or even a 34B would be wonderful!

Barcelona - that's wonderful that you are hep-free and feeling better!! I hope that with the cold weather soon behind us, you will kick all of these yucky bugs!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Mel, I'm totally with you. I'm wearing the bra that I got married in today (wires, impracticality and all) and every time Steve sees me, he gets that slightly glazed look in his eyes that he got when we were first together







: In case anyone was wondering, I just kind of hoick it down in front, and my boobs are so squishy that I don't think mastitis is even an option.
I'm so jealous of Fern and Spughy, I think I'm considering moving to Vancouver. I want to meet other MDC-ers! Those pictures are just too cute for words.
Gotta go, someone has found the controls to grandad's adjustable bed and is bouncing his head off the ceiling. This age is NOT CUTE.


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

I hate bras and rarely wear them at home. It's too difficult to find decent bras in a 38 I although I might be down to an H now which would be nice. At the moment when I do wear a bra its a nursing bra I bought a year ago that is too big now, but I haven't got $50 to buy a new one. My dd CLW at 4.5 after Joseph was born and I don't see him weaning any sooner so I will probably be wearing nursing bras for years yet. Attempting to push soft bras up or down doesn't work for me with so much to move around there is always some part getting pinched. After bouts with mastitis while pg and up until about 6 months pp I don't want to tempt that again. I very distinctly remember buying that first non nursing bra when Annette was around 2-2.5 years old. It felt really nice to have a "pretty" bra on again even though it was still just a white bra. Why is it so difficult to find colored bras in large sizes?


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I'm totally with you on that one, Kristina. I'm "only" a FF, and that's a battle sometimes.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Sarah: super cute pics with Fern and Ngaio.







And know that whatever happens is the best thing as far as weaning. I am realizing my biggest mistake in mothering so far is to have had expectations. (Like how long I would co-sleep or how long I would nurse...etc.) If I were to look at my parenting choices based on what is happening and how she and I were feeling instead of based on what I thought or wanted to happen, I'd probably stop being neurotic and start being happy.







It seems like you are very open to whatever needs to take place going forward. And it also seems like you are ready to put your own health needs first. Which, _trust me_ will improve your relationship with Rowan with or without weaning.

Fern: I can't believe how much Ngaio has grown! She looks so much like you and more like a little girl instead of a baby. You guys are adorable!







:

Kavita: I LOVE vagin-o-mite! That's my very favorite of all!









As far as bras are concerned, I never wore one until I was voluptuously pregnant. I wore one for a few months after Isa was born (for the sole purpose of holding my nursing pads in place). After I discovered Lily Padz and shelf-bra tanks, I haven't touched a bra since. And I ain't lookin' back...


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

I just posted some new videos of Isa on my MySpace page.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Isa is so cute! Thanks for sharing


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Yay Isa! That is so fun! By the way, Jaymi, you have such a pretty singing (and speaking) voice!!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Thanks, ladies!









I have been trying to capture more of her signing, but she stops as soon as the camera's on, ykwim? She's like that frog from Loony Toons that sings opera, but when someone looks he's a dead frog in a box.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 
Thanks, ladies!









I have been trying to capture more of her signing, but she stops as soon as the camera's on, ykwim? She's like that frog from Loony Toons that sings opera, but when someone looks he's a dead frog in a box.










I have made that *exact* comparison.









"Hello my baby, hello my darlin, hello my ragtime gal!"


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Google have finally got the ads right, I see.
Suddenly, Skye seems to be having another growth spurt. She's in a mega clingy spell (so what else is new?) but threw a proper, grown up tantrum at the farm this morning (because I took her away from the sheep







) and again this afternoon. She's waving bye-bye, and clapping, and doing- you know. Stuff.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

It's funny because I'm in the exact opposite position with bras--I have always had probably a cup size difference between sides, so it's always been hard if not impossible to find a bra that fits and is comfortable. I'm about a 38 D these days, although I think I was more like a C before getting pregnant, but really that's just an average between two totally different breasts. A bra either fits on the right (larger) side and is poofing out/crumpling on the left side because there is too much fabric without enough breast to fill it out, OR it fits on the left side, but my breast is squishing out of it on the top of the cup on the right side. The breast-muffin-top look--not a nice one under clothes. So when Ella was 6 months old I decided to try a Bravado nursing bra--I LOVE IT!!!! I now have three and I am going to wear them forever. Because of the design of the cups, it is supportive of both sides without too much or too little fabric, and looks good under clothes, and isn't scratchy. I got a leopard print one, so it's a little more exciting than the average nursing bra too!


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Mismatches boobs are another fun problem. In the past a minimizer helped to even things out and helped with the shirt gap issue. How do the Bravados fit? I hate the uniboob look so I've been very leery of trying them out, but if they even out the difference that could be good too. I've also seen mention of a bra that is supposed to be similar that is sold on ebay. The brand is Yes! and in this store http://stores.ebay.com/breastfeedingisbestforall they are selling for $13.99 much cheaper then most other bras, but it makes me worry about the quality. Ideally for me I'm hoping that some stuff sells and dh gets back to work soon from this not so fun time off with nothing to do. That way I can get another goddess bra which I love. Or I can just keep doing what I do at home and maybe someone from National Geographic will stop by for pictures


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

For me, bravado are a uniboob







(I love that expression.) I wear the ++ ones though, so that might be why.
On fashion, what's the "in" look for 1yo girls in swimsuits? Last year she wore just a swim nappy and nobody batted an eyelid. This year, I trust her not to poop all over the pool and I keep looking at all these gorgeous girlie costumes-but then I imagine the battles getting it on and off. It's harder trying to find cute bikini bottoms for a 1yo as well. She was so funny at the pool today, we haven't been in months and she's grown up so much. So she was taking these giant, giant steps waist-deep in the water, and splashing, and kept deliberately dunking herself under the water and kicking back up to me







So adorable.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

I bought Rowan a cute 1-pc swimsuit last year that was way too big on her so I figure I'm good on the swimming attire until she's at least 2. I hope. It's blue with a frilly thing on the bottom and strawberries, if that helps









I got 4 new books in the mail yesterday from Amazon. I'm all excited about them but I never get time to read... argh! I got Unconditional Parenting, Wild Fermentation, and Plant Foods of Coastal First Nations (which I am going to use to figure out what plants around here we can safely forage and eat.) I also got a crappy fantasy novel (latest Robert Jordan) but I figure I might get to it by next winter IF I'm lucky







.

The first recipe in Wild Fermentation is for mead. I think I could certainly do with some of that right now.

And re: the bra thing - I have mondo boobs on a small frame - most "big" bras don't fit me because the straps can't go short enough or the bottom band is too wide. I found some Bravado "Supreme" - I think that's what they're called (these ones) and they work ok, although they don't exactly give me a wonderful sillhouette, they're pretty much saying "yeah, these boobs are kinda droopy, but look I can make them stick out a bit more!". I did put on one of my old underwires when I went out with people from work a few weeks ago and I felt FABULOUS but I'm scared to wear underwires all day because of the mastitis thing. I'm definitely looking forward to wearing decent bras again.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Hi everybody!!! Wedding is in less than 4 weeks and life is hectic!

I noticed a swimsuit question...we got ours from coolibar.com

Love it!!

hope all is well...

What about the address database...did i miss something?!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Oh yeah, what do we do for the address thing again, Helen? Log into a google account?

Spughy, that is hilarious about the bra thing. I've been wearing underwires since Brynn was about 6 months old, I think, and I've never had mastitis. I still have some crappy nursing bras and some sports bras that I wear, but for the most part I wear the full-structure mondo bras, which do help keep things under control and don't give me uniboob!

So this is interesting. Twice in the past 3 nights, Brynn has gone to bed before 9:00pm, and both of those nights she's slept the longest ever; when she went to bed at around 8:30, she slept till about 11:45, and then when she went to bed at 8:15 last night, she slept til 12:15. FOUR HOURS!! So I was telling a friend of mine about it today, and she said she's reading this book about baby sleep and it said that this mom in the book had a 19-month old who slept like Brynn (waking every hour to two hours) and his usual bedtime was like 9:00 or something (same as Brynn) and that she heard that an earlier bedtime could help, but she didn't believe it. So one night she put him to bed really early, like 6:30 or 7:00, and he slept ALL NIGHT, til like 8:00am, without waking. Totally crazy. Anyway, I don't have those kinds of high hopes, but I do think it's interesting that without even really trying, Brynn has shown a pattern of sleeping longer when she goes to bed early. Aaaaaaanyway, so we decided to try to put her down around 7:00 tonight, which is the time that she always wants to go up and put her jammies on, but tonight we didn't do bedtime stories or running around naked or anything. She just got her jammies on, nursed for a while, and then I put her into bed while she was still awake. It took about 10 minutes, but she didn't cry, and she passed out around 7:30. So we'll see what happens. Even if she doesn't sleep all night, it sure is nice to have the extra time in the evening with DH, or to watch America's Next Top Model on Tivo.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

I have nothing to say on infant/toddler sleep. We have broken all the rules of both sleep experts and good common sense. Ella goes to bed/sleep at the earliest around ten, the latest around midnight. She will wake up at about 2 or so sometimes and cry if I'm not there, but seems to otherwise usually sleep through. She wakes up at about 5 am to nurse, then rolls back over and goes to sleep. The last hour or two are back to back nursing and switching and sleeping and nursing some more. Then we wake up for real, usually around 10-12 hours after her initially falling asleep, get up and move into breakfast time. It's a little silly, but it works okay for us for the most part. If I put her to sleep earlier (like between 6 and 9) that ends up constituting a nap, and then she's up bouncing around for hours and hours.

Oh, as far as the bras, they're just the regular bravado ones, not the plus or supreme or anything else. Just the standard one.


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

Wow, this is the most behind I've ever been on our thread! Just subbing now. I usually keep up on the reading, but lately have just been unable to do it all! I started work one day a week last month, so that's taking up more of my time. Also trying to be more organized around the house- decluttering.

Best wishes to all! I've missed you! I am right now coming down with a cold, now that both boys are finally well after weeks of being sick!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

kaspirant, I'm so sorry I haven't emailed you yet. You haven't missed anything, I've just been a bit crap.
Amy, pm me your proper email address and I'll send you an invitation to log into the spreadsheet.
Spughy, mead is always good








So is honeybeer...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

nak...which i haven't done for a while. there should be a smilie for nak wsith toddler trying to type with her toes.

swimsuits- we have a girlie frilly bum one-piece, plus a two piece uv suit thingie from baby banz. i need a new swim diaper, though...

we have an early bedtime and still not great sleep







but neela wakes up at around six or six-thirty no matter when she goes to bed, so we try to keep bedtime around seven just to get enough hours of sleep

i hope the wedding prep goes well, kaspirant


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
I have nothing to say on infant/toddler sleep. We have broken all the rules of both sleep experts and good common sense. Ella goes to bed/sleep at the earliest around ten, the latest around midnight. She will wake up at about 2 or so sometimes and cry if I'm not there, but seems to otherwise usually sleep through. She wakes up at about 5 am to nurse, then rolls back over and goes to sleep. The last hour or two are back to back nursing and switching and sleeping and nursing some more. Then we wake up for real, usually around 10-12 hours after her initially falling asleep, get up and move into breakfast time. It's a little silly, but it works okay for us for the most part. If I put her to sleep earlier (like between 6 and 9) that ends up constituting a nap, and then she's up bouncing around for hours and hours.

Hey, this is pretty much us, too! Ez usually falls asleep a little earlier though, sometime between 9pm-10:30pm. I used to worry about her not having a bed time and or going to bed so late. I am okay with it now though. Plus, i like to sleep in so it's awesome that she doesn't fully wake up until 8-9:30am.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Baby Suriya is a month old today.
Yesterday Winter said book.
I am SO tired. That's all.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
Baby Suriya is a month old today.
Yesterday Winter said book.
I am SO tired. That's all.


That is an amazing summary...made me smile.

I hope you have a good day!!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Rowan typically goes to bed around 8 or 8:30 (earlier if possible, but it's generally US who can't get our act together for that) and sleeps until just before 7 am. She's been pushing that earlier at times, which is OK by me because it means I can get into work earlier which means I can leave earlier!

The time change is this weekend though - which I am sort of dreading... I don't remember how she reacted to the last one...

DiD - sorry you are pooped, mama







.

Kaspirant - wedding stuff!







: And a toddler! yikes! Good luck.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Yeah, she fell asleep at 7:30, but slept the usual 2.5 hours for the rest of the night, and even woke up thinking it was morning around 3:30! So I'm definitely not going to push it to be that early again!







I do think I will try to keep around 8:00 if possible, just because *I* am so exhausted by then myself!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

I hear you guys on the sleep woes...
After several fantastic sleep nights (the best of which was her sleeping from 9:30 pm to 4:00am!!!!!) she woke every 2 hours last night.
And today has been crazy busy with us running all around the world.
And this weekend Joshua is in massage school all weekend again....








:

I'm tired just thinking about it.

But he did bring me flowers today.







That made me cry.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 

But he did bring me flowers today.







That made me cry.


AWWWWW!!! Sniff.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Yes, it was especially sweet, because he and I missed each other. I didn't get home until after he had left for school. And Isa was asleep, so I basically had the moment "to myself" and read the card and got all misty.







: I needed that...


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Hey mamas! Whew...I am SO behind. I have been struggling with a VERY sick little guy this week. Noah spent 12 hours throwing up on Tuesday...all day pretty much every 30-45 minutes.







Then Wednesday and Thursday he had diarrhea. He puked once last night and once this morning. Then he's had hellacious diarrhea all day today. I'm struggling SO hard to keep fluids in him. He won't eat, won't take a lot of water, won't take Pedialyte...he has been nursing a lot, though. He's acting mostly fine but you can tell he doesn't feel 100%. Much better than Tuesday when he was just lying in my arms all day sleeping and puking. Any time he tries to have anything solid it just comes right back out. He did try to eat a teeny bit of pizza crust earlier with NOTHING on it...thirty minutes later he filled three diapers back to back. I feel so bad for him...the minute he does it he comes whining to me signing potty. Then he cries because he doesn't want his bum wiped for the hundredth time in an hour. ARRRRRRRGH. I hate this. I could seriously go the rest of my life without seeing him this miserable again. I know, I know...it's just the beginning, eh?

**BARCELONA*...I _JUST_ remembered I haven't e-mailed you back yet!







: I'm so sorry, mama, I will catch up with you very soon!!!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

SoulJourney - is it really gross yellowish runny poop with a very sour rank smell? Because it sure sounds like rotovirus. That is pure hell to live through.

My parents are visiting, so I don't have much time. Its nice to have them with us for the weekend! The kids are LOVING grandma and grandpa!


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

QoC: YES! It is THE most HORRIBLE smelling, yellow, runny poop ever. It makes me want to vomit every time I change his diaper and I have a really strong stomach. Makes total sense as to why he's hanging on to this for so long b/c doesn't rotavirus last up to like 9 days??? Ugh. Yesterday was day four.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

It generally lasts 3-8 days. However, it is contagious for 10 days from the onset of symptoms and members of a family can re-infect each other. Wash the sheets, spray lysol everywhere, scrub the tubs and toilets, try to wash hands as much as possible. Disinfect anywhere that he's pooped, especially. Its transmitted by fecal-oral contamination, which happens easily since there's poop all over the freaking place for a week when a kid has rotovirus. Killy had it when Ellie was about 2.5 months old and she didn't get it at all (usually exclusively breastfed babies don't get it) but Killy had it for about 5-6 days. He had diarrhea every hour or two all day every days. It was horrific. We were going through literally 15 diapers a day. The first time a child has it is the worst, then its generally not as bad subsequent times, but a full immunity is never really reached. I've had some adult friends who caught it from their toddlers and were violently ill, but I guess DH and I must have had it a few times as kids because we both had very mild cases when Killy had it.


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Yeah, my DAD actually got it from Noah!







So far, so good for me. I have actually been using sposies this week because I just couldn't keep up on diapers nor did I have the slightest desire to. It's really funny because even though Noah has a pretty healthy sized backside







it looks pretty tiny in sposies!

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we are at the end of our road with this. He hasn't had any poopy diapers yet today. Of course it's only 10:30am, but that's a start.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

michelle

have you tried homeopathics for noah?
it really helps my kids when they have sicknesses like that..

ngaio had a stomach flu or something where she puked everything up for days and i finally sent someone to get some homeopathic ipicac and as soon as she had a dose the throwing up stopped...she did again about 6 hours later, another dose and she was fine.

there is good ones for diarrhea..i cant think of the name though.








:

its scary when they are so sick... i hate the feeling of being so unable to help them..and that they cant really understand yet why they feel so horrble.

ngaio cried most of last night.. she was restless and she kept saying "body.owwsh" over and over. she is teething but she also has had like 4 falls in the last 3 days.
she climbs on everything and i just cant stop her. she fell on her head off the kids table (she was standing on it trying to get something ff the shelf..)and though she was running around after a quick nurse i cant help feel like this totally horrible mother who lets her baby get head injuries all the time..

*sigh*

i need a padded house.. for mysake and my kids.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

its got the first rough draft of my [email protected]!

the leaves are all going to look more like the left hand one, but other than that its pretty similar to what it will look like...

im getting it tomorow!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

qof c, I remember when Killy had rotovirus- it was the first time I'd heard of it (we either don't have it over here or call it something different.) It sounds horrible- I hope Noah gets better soon, Michelle, and that you don't get it.
Fern, how excited???? Have fun...
Our weekend is being spent decluttering Skye's room. It looks really cool, and absolutely huge- pictures on Monday.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
On a breast-related but not breastfeeding-related note, I bought my first bra since Neela was a few weeks old today. I put on a sexy shirt a few weeks ago and was totally unimpressed with how my bra fit and breasts looked, so I just bought a totally impractical but very sexy bra. And it makes my breasts look hot







:

i just bought my first pretty nursing bra. it's a pink bravado one i got from an mdc mama - i love it









Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
kaspirant, I'm so sorry I haven't emailed you yet. You haven't missed anything, I've just been a bit crap.
Amy, pm me your proper email address and I'll send you an invitation to log into the spreadsheet.


hmmm. is this what we were supposed to do? somehow i missed it! off to send you a pm.


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

:







:







:







:

neither my mom nor my dad is coming to my wedding...

My mom responded "well none of you girls were at my wedding" She's referring to an october wedding to my stepdad that took place while I was in college...and broke. We even offered to pay for her plane ticket and her hotel...more f*cked up excuses...

but that's not the worst of it.

my dad is super conservative and while I love and respect him...this just takes the cake.

His reply "Coming out to CA to see you two get married would be the same as taking a trip to watch someone murder someone else" He wasn't joking...he is convinced that since I am re-marrying I may as well be committing murder...

My sisters are broke...neither of them can afford to come...








: just doesn't cut it... I need a :heartwrechingsob: smilie right now.


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Awww, Kaspirant...







mama! I'm so sorry!














and more


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

kaspirant, want me to go and see your dad? I have a few super-conservative ways of putting things.... fwiw, my uncle and aunt disagreed with my divorce, my decision to live with Steve (and my first husband) outside of marriage, and the whole convulated mess that is my family. They're still incredibly proud of me, because they see that I'm happy, and they know how rare true happiness is nowadays. I can kind of see your mum's pov, though I think she's being a bit petty. I really hope she changes her mind.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

Kaspirant:

im so sorry..








why are people so uncaring? it makes me so sad. but i think that in the bigger picture, had they decided to come with all of their negative thoughts and energy, maybe it would have been sad anyways..you deserve only the most wonderful day and greatest celebration..dont let anyone ruin it for you.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

lots of hugs to you, kaspirant. family can be so hard sometimes...

and lots of hugs to you, SoulJourney and to Noah too! I hope he's feeling better.

i am so tired, i'm about to collapse. And then there's a whole new week a comin'! must...sleep...must...rest....ugh....zzzzzzzzzz... .


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Oh, kaspirant - I"m sorry







. That's not very nice of your family at all. I hope your DH-to-be's family is a little more welcoming of you.

I'm with you, spiritmomma - soooo tired! Rowan is getting a canine tooth in now and it's making her a real cranky-pants today. Last night she was up a LOT - and she was doing so well before too! She wouldn't even go back to sleep for DH like she normally does. Tonight we're going to be firm about it - no boobies until after 2 am, because mummy reeeeallly needs to sleep. And mummy will be going to be shortly.









If I were genetically engineering babies I'd make one that didn't get teeth. Or had them all at birth. Or something. Teething sucks.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Got flu. Want to sleep. Can't. Car broke. Isaac in hospital yesterday. Gah


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kaspirant* 







:







:







:







:

neither my mom nor my dad is coming to my wedding...


kaspirant - hugs to you. i know this is difficult. when DW and i had our commitment ceremony both of my parents told me they were not going to come - issues with the fact that i was in a committed relationship with another woman. at any rate they both came at the last minute and were in horrid moods the whole day - long story short i ended up wishing they hadn't come. all of this to say i know it hurts and hugs to you - just have fun and screw 'em if they won't have fun with you









Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Got flu. Want to sleep. Can't. Car broke. Isaac in hospital yesterday. Gah









i hope isaac is okay???


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Got flu. Want to sleep. Can't. Car broke. Isaac in hospital yesterday. Gah

















May you, your car and your son spontaneously heal.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Kaspirant. I hope you have a terrific and beautiful wedding without them.

Helen, take care. Lots of healing vibes for you, Issac and your car.

SoulJourney~ Healing vibes to Noah, too.

The fan in our living room heater broke and overheated and set off the smoke alarm. Broken from being jammed with an elastic and a dime (or "elaskick" and "money"). When I tried to explain to Neela that she shouldn't put things in the very tempting slots because it gets broken, she told me to "fix it"







She's really verbal, but still has very toddler logic. And I'm supermama who can fix pretty much anything, I guess.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

kaspirant- neither my mom nor my dad were planning to come to my wedding, either...so i stopped planning for them and we started planning for ourselves...and we pretty much eloped to a cruise in the bahamas. we had a big party the weekend that we got back and my mom was invited and did come to that. people can be such jerks. re:the conservative bit...I am so sorry to hear what he said. it's completely unfounded and ridiculous. when did loving someone become "wrong" and comparable to killing? ARGH.

helen- hope things turn around for you this week and isaac gets better asap. is he out of the hospital now?

we are trying to declutter our house so we can travel starting in june. we are getting rid of a bunch of stuff, loaning some things out to a friend (glider and diaper changing station) and trying to sell our VW Jetta. If you know anyone who wants one around NC, please let me know! We are flying through Seattle and staying there for about a week before continuing on to Australia. Woooo hooooo! Maybe we can meet some of you NW mamas?


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Ooo! Gunter, do a day trip to Victoria and come visit us!!!! http://www.clippervacations.com/vict..._ferry_service


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

hellen... that sounds like a rough day indeed.. i hope things are better today.

so.. i'm tattooed!!







:check out my blog.
not great pictures, but it gives an idea.. and its not done yet!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Flu still bad. Isaac hyperactive on blue inhalers and nebulisers, but at home, alive, and breathing. Maybe if I take his blue inhalers, I'll feel hyperactive and so be able to function normally.
Car was NOT broken, the heat blocking plate (or whatever it was called) from the original exhaust was still in place but had come loose. The garage took it off and now the car is fine. Thank goodness. All in all, the day has been less bad than it could have been.

Fern, I love the ink







Very, very you.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Oh my god. I am so so glad to be back to MDC and our DDC! I have been away at my parents' for the past five days and haven't been able to get online...I haven't had a chance to catch up and read, but I have missed the conversation, and the support! I am trying to de-stress from my trip...it was pretty stressful (as it usually is with them)...will probably/most certainly have some questions for you wise ladies soon.

Anyway, just had to pop on and say hi and missed you and can't wait to catch up!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Just popping in to say hi. No real news here. Things have been a little crazy! There has been a lot going on, quite fast, in terms of dealing with stuff with the house. We had a meeting last Monday at our house with about 15 people plus one of them had a toddler Ella's age, and then a last minute houseguest last Thursday. (Our friend's waterbed sprung a leak, and he kept trying to fix it, then progressed to the couch, and then finally he was getting totally sleep deprived and called to ask if he could come sleep in our guest bedroom for a night so he didn't lose his mind!) And we are selling our old car that doesn't work, and has basically been an extra closet on wheels, so all the clothes for Ella for the next three years that my sister saved from my niece, all were taken out and have been in the house. But I'm slowly getting things decluttered and organized again.

Ella has also progressed to an incredible pace of home reorganization these days. We don't want to put locks on everything (especially b/c we're moving in a couple of months) but some days it is tempting. Also, our laundry room is off/attached to the kitchen, and we keep our kitchen trash in there. DH made the horrible mistake of throwing out a torn pair of underwear and letting her see him do this! She promptly started taking all the underwear out of the laundry hamper and throwing it into the trash! So now I have to really check the trash before taking it out! She also loves throwing things in the bathtub. So while I try to pee, she is usually taking everything out of the cabinet and drawers and throwing them into the tub. Her favorite is a few packages of travel-sized Kleenex.







: Also, another funny was that I was going to put her into the shower with me (in the other bathroom, which has a stall shower) and I got her naked and jumped into the shower myself first, then popped out to get her. In the time it had taken me to do that, she had discovered the toilet brush (I have one of the Lysol squirty ones) and was running out of the bedroom, emitting a war cry and brandishing it like a samurai sword! It was so cute!!

I had a non-Mommy related self-development activity today. I have a friend whose husband is a professional chef, and he has Mondays off. So I had recruited him to give me some lessons on knife skills and chopping food. I mean, I can cut things okay and I'm actually a pretty good cook and baker, but when you watch a professional cooking, the way they can handle a knife and cut vegetables is just amazing. So he came over and we did some chopping, julienneing, dicing, and a few other more advance techniques with french names that I don't remember! It was good--I learned a few new techniques and a few different terms and methods of cutting various things. And most of all, I learned that in culinary school you spend six hours a day for six whole months learning this! So I don't feel so bad now for my amateur ways!!!!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Welcome back Barcelona! Sorry to hear that things were stressful at your parents.









Kavita, sounds like things are moving right along with the big relocation! I am sure it's going to be hectic and stressful, so I'm sending happy vibes your way!

Helen, oh my gosh! How scary for you! A friend of mine had to take her 2 1/2 year-old daughter to the hospital this week for a 106 fever (106!!!!!) and when she was telling me how many times they had to poke and prod her, I started crying. As a Mama, I'm sure it is just incredibly hard to go through something like that. I hope Isaac is feeing better today!!!

Fern - WOW!!! Totally awesome, Mama. And five hours under the needle? GYAH! Well you did have two natural homebirths, so you can do anything!!

Oh speaking of "doing anything," this is so cute. The other night, DH was telling me what an amazing Mama I am, and he said, "You are Super Mom!" Brynn heard him and tried to repeat what he said, but it came out "Soup Mom!" So she was running around the kitchen for about 5 minutes proclaiming, "Soup Mom! Soup Mom!"







So funny. She articulates most of her words really clearly now, but has a few that are so hilariously wrong. Teapot for example, is "Pooh-pot" for some reason.

Oh, she's awake. More later.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Amy - "Soup Mom" would make an awesome senior title. Just sayin'.

Kavita - too fun with the knife skills! I worked as a prep cook for a year and there's nothing like cooking under pressure to get the knife skills good. I don't have any formal training but I made an effort to teach myself how to do things properly. It's fun, isn't it? You feel like one of those chefs on tv.

Barcelona - welcome back! Feel free to vent to us about your parents - we understand









Fern - AWESOME tattoos!!!!

Not much new here. Rowan had the crappiest night EVER last night and DH took it all on his shoulders







Apparently she was up every 20 minutes until well after 1 and then I don't know what happened. But it was bad. Poor DH. Tonight I will spend the whole night with the bug, which is bad because I have to give a presentation at work tomorrow, but probably what I will do is have everything prepped for that today, then call in sick tomorrow morning and sleep in while DH deals with Rowan. My presentation isn't til the afternoon so I should be ok with that. I don't have a whole lot of sick days left to play with but I'd rather sacrifice half of one than look like an idiot in front of a bunch of developers.

And last night I forgot to take my pumped milk out of my pump bag and put it in the fridge, so it went down the drain







and DH was all pissed at me (for good reason) and Rowan will get just cow milk in her bottle today, which she probably won't even drink. So it wasn't happy times at our house this morning.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

So the baby's new fussy time is from 10pm to about 3:30-4am. Everyone else gets up at 7am. So guess how much sleep I'm getting.
I'm a freakin zombie.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Oh, DiD, I'm so sorry







I hope she learns to sleep soon- does your dp have any food allergies, by any chance? Is it worth trying an elimination diet?
Amy, Isaac's doing good. This attack was milder than the one before, which was milder than the one before. It's now 17 months since the last time he was admitted (at least, when I took him in) and the chances are he's outgrowing it. He is, however, completely hyperactive because too much salbutamol gets him like that. To be honest, I just count my blessings every time it happens because we're so lucky to have him, even if he is driving me crazy- I know people who've lost their children to asthma and that could be us.
Hmm. Maybe I should post a couple of blue inhalers to DiD?
Hee-hee. Soup mom! And knife skills. That's what I get for proposing a month of recipe swaps and not much else.
Spughy, here's hoping "the bug" sleeps tonight. Have you tried drugging her with warm cows milk before bed? That worked for Skye when my milk supply was down when I was pregnant...


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Spughy, here's hoping "the bug" sleeps tonight. Have you tried drugging her with warm cows milk before bed? That worked for Skye when my milk supply was down when I was pregnant...

I actually started giving Ella a bottle with about 4 ounces of warm goat milk or cows milk sometimes at night. I used to nurse and nurse and nurse and then she would still not go to sleep, and after about 45 minutes of going from side to side to side she would pop off and say "boof!" which is her word for food, and start signing food, and water. Then I'd end up getting up and she'd eat a huge bowl of oatmeal or some other meal, and suck down a bunch of water, and then we'd go back to bed and nurse some more. I feel kind of bad, not supplementing her or giving her bottles for over a year and then starting at 14 months! But I figure that otherwise, I am supplementing nursing with foods anyway, and if I was giving her milk in a cup with meals or something, I wouldn't think anything of it. I guess it's more that it looks like bottle feeding as a substitute of addition to breastfeeding to me that it bugs me! I started with the bottle because I started giving her kefir, and it was too thick for a sippy cup, too thin for a bowl, and in a regular cup it ended up dumped all over. So I cut a large hole in one of the bottles that was sitting around from her early infancy (that only got used maybe 5 times until then!) and used it to give her kefir once in a while. So that was sort of the slippery slope. She still nurses a lot, and often I will nurse her, give her some goat milk, and then nurse her some more to sleep. It was kind of funny thought the other night, I was lying down in bed with her and she was sort of in her typical nursing position in the crook of my arm, but she was drinking from the bottle. Then she shoved the bottle over on top of my other breast, and moved over to that side, just like she does when she switches sides nursing!!







I started pumping actually once or twice a day, and it did seem like it was improving my supply a bit, but then it was hurting my nipples. So I don't know what I'm going to do about the whole situation in the future. I definitely don't want to wean her at least before 2 (and especially I really want her to still be nursing when we go to India to visit the IL's, which should be either in October or December) and I worry that I'm cruising for trouble. And I also don't want her to have a big memory of being bottle fed, after I suffered and struggled for so long to nurse her exclusively!!!! I guess I have to get a new cup for her for milk, if I'm going to give it to her!!!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

The whole conversation about milk bottles before bed is similar to our situation right now- Neela is starving in the early morning. I think she's having a growth spurt right now, and she power nurses (NOT comfort nursing, but hard sucking draining nursing) side to side in the early morning. Usually until I'm totally fed up and get up with her- and she tells me she's hungry and devours a huge breakfast. I'm tempted to set out a little early morning snack to get longer in bed in the mornings, but I don't really want crumbs in our family bed!

This morning she found my water bottle, so I was awakened (well, already awake, but finally opened my eyes) when she poured the rest of the water on the sheets and said "wet! mess!"


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Spughy, here's hoping "the bug" sleeps tonight. Have you tried drugging her with warm cows milk before bed? That worked for Skye when my milk supply was down when I was pregnant...

I don't think she'd drink it, to be honest. She's only ever taken a bottle from my MIL and that's usually during a diaper change, and if she gets distracted from it, that's it, bottle done. And getting her to take ANY cow milk in it was a challenge but now she'll drink half mum juice/half cow juice. Sometimes.

I would worry about her getting enough calcium, except that she goes through those fresh mozzarella pearls (we get unsalted ones and she looooves them) like there's no tomorrow.

But Kavita - I think I will try your trick with the bottle and the kefir. She seems to like kefir but she's only had it from a shot glass and that usually ends up messy.

ETA: hunger is not often a problem at night. Most often when she nurses it's just a little bit, unless she's had a crappy dinner. Last night she ate most of an egg and some frozen berries before bed (she had refused to eat dinner) and when DH brought her in for a nurse she didn't eat much, just hung out on the boob til she fell back asleep. I found out later that she'd been up and *running around* and face-planted, which is why he brought her in. At 1 am.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Ooo! Gunter, do a day trip to Victoria and come visit us!!!! http://www.clippervacations.com/vict..._ferry_service

i am planning a trip up to vancouver, for sure! i will check out all the details about victoria. i would LOVE to meet you all face to face!!!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, I cheat and put a tiny spoonful of honey in it







The boys have hot milk and honey before bed in winter, so, you know. It was there. And easy. And I'm lazy. I haven't got her hooked on hot chocolate yet though







Nor am I going to.
I can't believe I'm resorting to "hidden vegetables", btw- did I mention that Skye is becoming an incredibly picky eater? Won't touch cheese, carrots, broccoli, apple, pear, green beans, cucumber....there's a substantial list. She will, however, eat almost any fruit if it's pureed and frozen as an ice lolly, so that's what I'm doing


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

The google ads crack me up- right now mine are all for living wills and financial advice









Helen, do I hear an avocado smoothie ice lolly coming up?

Neela is still sensitive to cow's milk (even if I eat more than a tiny bit she reacts), but sometimes drinks a couple of ounces of soy milk if my pumped milk stash is running low. She likes it warmed up and in a "straw cup". I'm starting to hate the straw cups, since they're such a pain to clean. She's finally okay with tipping her head back to drink, so we're transitioning to either sippy cups or regular cups that don't grow mildew in little corners


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Helen, I hear you on the picky eater thing. Rowan is now refusing mushrooms, which she formerly loved and were a good way of getting calories into her (fried in butter), she doesn't like pasta much, she won't eat ground beef... but she IS now eating eggs, which she didn't like before, and carrots and asparagus. It's just so frickin' RANDOM what she will and won't eat. Very frustrating.

And Mel - I hate the straw cups too. But if you only ever put water in them, they're fine.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
So the baby's new fussy time is from 10pm to about 3:30-4am. Everyone else gets up at 7am. So guess how much sleep I'm getting.
I'm a freakin zombie.

ouch! i remember those nights of NO sleep with keagan. lately i am running on about 5 hours of sleep over the night - not all in one stretch - and most of the time i am okay with that









helen - i'm glad that isaac is home.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

So odd to hear about all these picky eaters. Winter eats more than both of his older brothers. I started feeding him solids out of necessity during my pregnancy so I think maybe he got a message of urgency from me. He'll eat almost anything and lots of it. He's getting lots of mama milk now and I nurse him before bed but he gets snuggled into bed awake instead of me nursing him to sleep and he sleeps through the night beautifully. Winter's my easy kid.
I just got Suriya to sleep so I think I'm going to go try to get in bed and see if we can skip fussy time tonight.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Oh, we eat avocado. My favourite high-nutrient sandwich when I was nursing isaac and couldn't eat- you know, anything- was a wrap with avocado, salad, bean sprouts, vegan mayonnaise and barbeque sauce. Sounds disgusting, but tastes amazing. Skye will quite happily eat guacamole, as long as she can use a spoon and not those icky vegetables.
Which raises another question: can anyone else's child "dip" their food? Skye throws it in and then screams








DiD, I hope she sleeps tonight


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Well, Rowan LOVED the arctic char we had for dinner last night (even liked the wasabi cream with it!!!) and ate a pile of the soba noodles too. Followed by dessert of frozen berries and whipped cream. Basically she was a little piggy. But, DH says she didn't eat a huge amount for lunch, which she normally does (apparently - I don't usually see this!) so maybe she's just good for one big meal a day and the rest is nibblies.

She slept better last night until she woke up at 3, then she was awake for almost an hour after that for DH but the stupid twit didn't bring her into me because I "needed my sleep". DUDE you are trying to finish your damn THESIS which is more important than some piddly presentation I have to give - GRRRRRR!!!! He makes me so MAD when he goes into martyr-mode. I HATE it. I got plenty of sleep last night before 3 - I could easily have done broken sleep for the rest of the night with Rowan in bed with me and been perfectly functional this morning.

Argh. So I'm grouchy. Also, DH broke my immersion blender which is essential for my morning kefir smoothies since Rowan broke my regular blender







and he fixed it, but it took a long time and he kept saying "2 more minutes" so I waited until he fixed it, made my smoothie and ended up at work half an hour later than I wanted to be.

But - on the up side of things - Rowan actually drank LOTS of cow milk, straight, from her juice box even! yesterday. So starting next week I am going to stop pumping at lunch and start working out. Woohoo!

ETA: Helen, Rowan can sort of dip her food. But mostly she likes it handed to her, pre-dipped, and will frequently lick off the dip and hand it back, to get more dip.







Dips usually end up distributed across her face and hands (and shirt). DH is always appalled when I let her self-feed with yogurt.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Hahaha about skipping fussy time. Fat chance of that. I went to go lay down and she woke up so I got up and tried again.
She cried until 4:30am and then the boys got up at 7.
Shoot me.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

DiD.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Ellie LOVES to dip food. Killy discovered dipping about this age, too... Today at lunch she got upset, though, because she kept eating chips and salsa and finally the spices got to her. My kids usually really like spicy food, but something about this salsa was too hot for her (maybe a different kind of pepper than the salsa we normally eat?).

Killy had a little fever and runny nose for about 36 hours earlier this week and now Ellie has it. Poor little thing. She's sweaty and sleepy and clingy.

Ellie keeps adding new words, yesterday her new word was "brother." Killy was excited, he said, "Thank you, Ellie!" and kissed her when she called him brother... it was sooooo sweet, I nearly melted.

Check out my blog for more cuteness: http://www.photogrove.com/journal/2007/03/13/683/


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

there is so much to catch up on!...i did finally read and catch up...

kaspirant, i'm so sorry you're going through that with your parents. family stuff can be SO hard (i know well). hopefully, like the others said, the overall energy of your day will be better and brighter without them there, if they have such negative attitudes. sending warm loving vibes your way!

fern, what a beautiful tatoo! wow! i'm not so brave.

spiritmomma, isa is adorable! i loved seeing her in action. i know just what you mean about them not doing what they normally do when you turn the camera on, though. finley is just the same. how is the weaning going?

helen, how very scary about isaac! is he feeling better and calmer now? oh, i can't even imagine.

souljourney, how AWFUL! i hope noah is feeling better now?? i hope?! do not worry about writing back.. take your time and write when you feel inspired and have the time.

and hugs to everyone! i love hearing how you and the babies are doing. though they're really not babies anymore, are they? it's wild...they really are turning into little boys and girls.

so, where to begin? i'm overwhelmed, and luckily, DH is home today and is out at the moment with finley so i'm able to collect my thoughts a bit and take a few deep breaths.

finley and i went to florida to see my parents for five days, which has become my limit for seeing them. on day four, like clockwork, they started making a few too many comments and making a few too many faces. up til then, i was doing great at remaining calm and meditating to myself to not accept the "garbage" and negative energy they try to pour onto and into me. after finley had been fussing in the car, mini-tantruming really, i caught my mom say to my dad, with a really awful look on her face, "i don't ever remember OUR kids acting like that, do you?" the nice feelings surrounding finley were quickly changing into their typical constant criticisms, focused at me, for letting him be that way.

on the day i was leaving, day five, my mom (oh, it's hard to even explain, b/c our relationship is so f*cked up and she is so hard to explain and is so deeply damaged), she was crying with this pissed off and wounded look on her face telling me that nana (my grandmother) had her feelings hurt b/c finley wouldn't let her (or anyone) hold him and that next time i came, could i make sure we really spent time with nana. i had emailed nana trying to set up time with her and she didnt write me back. once i was home, my mom said they were coming over on sunday and i said oh great! we can spend time with her then...thinking they'd hang out most of the day and that would be our nice chunk of quality time. they came over, ate lunch (ignoring finley throughout lunch), and then left, maybe after one hour. i said, well, i didn't want them to leave, they just left! next time, i can make sure we spend the whole day, but i don't know what else you want me to do to make sure we spend time with them. then she went on and on with all these false statements, and i kept correcting them. and oh my god. it's too hard to even explain the whole thing, but it was just so frustrating and upsetting, because it seems like EVERY time i go down there, no matter what is going on, they find something to be really upset with me about, i'm always this awful/bad daughter. this time it's b/c my son isn't good about other people holding him.

they were relentless with comments about him needing to be more independent.

after that explosion, i said, mom, i am sorry i hurt nana's feelings. i never meant to do that. i'm not exactly sure how i did...
my mom said, well, i'm sorry you got so ANGRY. i was just telling you that her feelings her hurt (with this real martyr look on her face).

i just feel so trapped and not myself when i'm there and it's so stressful. i thought i was doing great, but after that last day, i just felt like exploding, and felt so angry. i want to be able to come to peace with the situation. it is so hard.

thanks for listening.

some of you might be aware that my dad wanted to be called "big dad" myDH was not okay with that, so i finally asked my dad if he would consider being called something else, and that was, as i expected, a hard conversation, and my dad put up quite a fight, but i was able to stay strong and hold my ground and support my DH, as i know he would do for me, if the tables were turned.

they are going to be in town this weekend and we will see them on saturday. hopefully it will be a positive day together.

on top of that, my DH is going through a hard time, b/c things in his career are just really slow and frustrating, and we are still more seriously thinking about that huge move to LA...

AND...i just got a role in a play, which is nice and exciting, and i am going to do it. the only thing that isn't great is that i will have rehearsals two nights per week for five weeks. they said they will try to let me go home early and do my scenes in the first part of the night, but some nights i might not be home til 10:30. i'm a wreck knowing how this will affect finley, but i also feel like it is something i really want and need to do...
i know he will be with DH and he is great with him, but it's not the same as me. we are thinking about trying to scoot his bedtime later to it won't be as traumatic. another idea is that maybe he could come to the rehearsal and nurse with me and then get in the sling with DH afterwards. a final (and not great) resort is that we could let him watch a movie til i get home...
any other suggestions, or has anyone else been in a similar situation?

SIGH.

sorry to be unloading so much negative stuff.

it feels good to get it off my chest, and i do feel hopeful that i will find a way to coexist with my family peacefully, and that our little family will find our way, too.

more fun baby stuff soon







'

..on a random baby note, finley slept amazingly in florida--woke only once/night!!!! since we've been home, it's been disastrous. maybe the time change?


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barcelona* 
AND...i just got a role in a play, which is nice and exciting, and i am going to do it. the only thing that isn't great is that i will have rehearsals two nights per week for five weeks. they said they will try to let me go home early and do my scenes in the first part of the night, but some nights i might not be home til 10:30. i'm a wreck knowing how this will affect finley, but i also feel like it is something i really want and need to do...
i know he will be with DH and he is great with him, but it's not the same as me. we are thinking about trying to scoot his bedtime later to it won't be as traumatic. another idea is that maybe he could come to the rehearsal and nurse with me and then get in the sling with DH afterwards. a final (and not great) resort is that we could let him watch a movie til i get home...
any other suggestions, or has anyone else been in a similar situation?

I want to reply to your whole post with a great big







We DO have experience with a really similar situation- I work evenings four nights a week and don't finish until 11:30. Before going back to work when Neela was 12 1/2 months old I had put her down for 99% of naps and bedtimes with nursing. And I was a wreck- how would she ever fall asleep without nursing??? The first little while was tough- she would scream and cry when I left for work and was extra clingy during our time together. BUT her relationship with her dad got a lot closer and he manages to put her to bed really well in his own way (sings a song, rocks her and lies down with her and pats her). She drinks breastmilk in a cup (yes- the stupid straw cup!) before bed. The terrific thing is that she actually sleeps much better on the nights that he puts her to sleep than when I do. If I'm in the house she will only nurse to sleep, otherwise I'd have him do bedtime every night









I think the best advice that I was given and will give is that babies are resilient and will respond well to loving caregivers. Even though Finley is very attached to you, he knows his dad and will probably settle in a different way for him. And if he doesn't, he and your DH can stay up and play until you get home! HTH!

QofC~ The photos of your kids are beautiful, as usual!

DiD~







This too shall pass









Neela dips, but for the sake of the dip, not the veggie/cracker/whatever dipper. Her favourite is hummous, which she will eat by the bowlful. She also eat soup as a dip with crackers or toast (dips them in to suck of the soup, then re-dips).


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Thank you so much for your reply, Mel. It helps a lot to hear of another attached mama who's been through something similar. I just hope those first few times aren't traumatic with the crying, and that he is okay. He LOVES his daddy, so I know he will ultimately be okay...I just know that he needs me a lot at night, too. Like you said, though, they can just stay up til I get home if all else fails. Thanks again!









And DiD, I also meant to say, hang in there, mama. That is So hard, that sleep deprivation. If I really concentrate and take myself back, I can get a glimpse of remembering it, and Ouch. As Mel said, this too will pass...hang in there!!!!

Finley doesn't really do dips...he sounds similar to Rowan, though, spughy, where he'll eat it if we feed it/present it to him that way and he licks the dip off and wants more.









And Q of C, what adorable pictures, and how SWEET that Ellie said Brother and Killie said Thank you. Wow...makes me look forward to the day when we do give Finley a little brother or sister (though we are planning to wait a while).

Hope you all have restful nights!!!


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Yeeeeehaw! Mr. Noah is FINALLY well again! A week straight of vomiting and diarrhea is noooooo fun. I hope that we never have to go through that again. Wishful thinking on my part, I'm sure. He has pretty much exclusively breastfed again for the past week, with today being the first day that he's touched food. As a matter of fact, yesterday and today he has had that seedy/yellow mustard newborn breastmilk poop again! I forgot how smooshy that stuff is. At least it had some consistency as opposed to what we've dealt with in the past week. It was just so sad and miserable all week. He would bring his pathetic little self over to me and sign potty, indicating that he had, once again, shat himself. I really think he lost a good deal of weight this week. He's no longer my chunky monkey!







But, it's over now, thankfully! Thanks everyone for thinking of us!









Fern: OMG...AMAZING ink! Love, love, love it girl! And yes, it does suit you well!

Helen: I am glad to hear your bunch is doing better! You made me laugh out loud as I visualized Skye dipping! Noah is definitely a dipper. And like most of our kiddos, he sucks the dip off and redips. Silly boy.

DiD:







mama...hopefully you get a good night of sleep tonight.

For those of you with picky eaters and whomever is "sneaking" veggies...I am joining you! Noah pretty much refuses most veggies these days. I, too, have resorted to smoothies. It's actually pretty nice because I don't eat nearly the amount of veggies that I should. We toss it all in the blender...broccoli, spinach, carrots, yogurt, avacado, flax meal, berries, banana, you name it, it goes in!







Blueberries are GREAT at disguising so many things!

MelW: Noah is also sensitive to pretty much any dairy except yogurt. How on earth do you get Neela to drink soy milk? Noah will barely even drink water...he's strictly a mama's milk boy. And he will NOT take any way other than straight from the tap.

Barcelona:







mama! It's so hard to have such different parenting styles than that of our parents and then listen to them openly judge us. Anytime the issue of parenting comes up between my mother and myself, anytime I make the slightest suggestion that I'm having a hard day, hard week, or I'm just plain tired, she goes into some tirade about how she did it and she had FOUR kids and I don't know hard and blah-di-blah blah blah. I often think "geez...would it be TOO hard to let me borrow your shoulder for once? Does it always have to be about YOU? I'm really not trying to one up you, I promise!" She acts as if I'm always trying to minimize the works she did as a mother and that is just not the case at all! Sorry...off my soapbox now! I just wanted to commiserate for a moment!

Spughy: Noah is officially a fan of wasabi, too! He kept taking my sushi rolls from me today, dipping them in the wasabi & soy sauce and sucking the rice off.









Ok...babe is back in my arms after, oh, 45 minutes sleeping solo. For some reason he would much rather be sleeping uncomfortably in my lap at the computer than have an entire bed to himself for a couple of hours.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SoulJourney* 
MelW: Noah is also sensitive to pretty much any dairy except yogurt. How on earth do you get Neela to drink soy milk? Noah will barely even drink water...he's strictly a mama's milk boy. And he will NOT take any way other than straight from the tap.

I can rarely get her to drink soymilk- but DH can







She'll drink other things when the "tap" is at work, I guess. The only time I've had luck was getting a steamed soymilk at the cafe so that she could have her own "latte".

And I'm so glad that Noah is well again!

And wasabi may be the official favourite food of the November 05 babies! Neela adores sushi. We have a friend that makes and brings over nori rolls just for the delight of watching her messily devour them


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

ooooohhh...never thought of getting him his own "latte!" That would end the war of him forever wanting my REAL latte for sure!


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
I just got Suriya to sleep so I think I'm going to go try to get in bed and see if we can skip fussy time tonight.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *DreamsInDigital* 
Hahaha about skipping fussy time. Fat chance of that. I went to go lay down and she woke up so I got up and tried again.
She cried until 4:30am and then the boys got up at 7.
Shoot me.

I'd much rather send a







your way.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Which raises another question: can anyone else's child "dip" their food?











Quote:


Originally Posted by *barcelona* 
so, where to begin? i'm overwhelmed, and luckily, DH is home today and is out at the moment with finley so i'm able to collect my thoughts a bit and take a few deep breaths.

family stuff is HARD!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
And wasabi may be the official favourite food of the November 05 babies! Neela adores sushi. We have a friend that makes and brings over nori rolls just for the delight of watching her messily devour them









Ellie adores sushi! When we go out for it, she tears the rolls up to get to the fish and eats that first, then the veggies, then the rice, and finally the nori. The Japanese ladies at the restaurant we usually go to can hardly believe it! Killy is so enthralled with the sushi train circling the bar, though, that he's always too excited to eat anything.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Does anyone else find that the hardest/most annoying thing about parenting (at least at this stage) is the inability to even think even one single thought without interruption? I am having a really hard time with this. I have so much to do and think about and work through right now, and I have so little time to do it, Ella is so demanding of my time and attention, and when she isn't it seems like DH is there being demanding (or I feel like he is, really we are just not having time to communicate well either.) It is a constant battle to keep the house from being a total pigsty between Ella and the dogs messing everything up, and by the time I have her in bed and everything taken care of and done in the house, I am just too tired to really think clearly. There are some things troubling me or on my mind a lot--some serious yet undiagnosed physical health problems and depression that my sister is having, issues about our upcoming move and decisions that need to be made (like about housing) that are pragmatic, but also related to our values and priorities and future goals. Some marital issues that I am trying to figure out how to deal with, body image stuff, and also a million mundane decisions to make about our house to do stuff to fix it up for a hopefully quick and profitable sale. I just feel like I need more uninterrupted time to think, and I am getting a little nutty without it!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
Does anyone else find that the hardest/most annoying thing about parenting (at least at this stage) is the inability to even think even one single thought without interruption?
I just feel like I need more uninterrupted time to think, and I am getting a little nutty without it!

Bad AP mama confession coming up...
I was off sick from work this week and sent Neela to daycare for a couple of hours in the afternoon anyways. And sat on the couch and stared in to space thinking. And reminiscing about how I used to have enough free time to space out on a more regular basis. For a really, really long time.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Fern: LOVE the ink! It's gorgeous!

Kavita: I would love to take some "chopping" lessons. I have a really nice JA Henckels Knife, but I'm still pretty slow. I respect the blade and am afraid I might get my finger tip along with whatever veggie I'm working on!
Sounds cool!.... And yes, I think the constant interruption is difficult to deal with. Usually I deal with it by not doing whatever I was trying to do and focus all my attention on Isa. When she's had her fill of me and wants to be left to play freely, I go back to whatever I was doing. And I also do a lot of forgiving myself for not getting stuff done!

Well, Sorry I've been MIA, but things have been quite busy around here. I've had very little computer time lately due to being outside, at the park, at the Children's Museum, Art Museum or someone's house. Whew! I've barely done a load of laundry or cleaned my house lately! But Isa and I are having a ball. She has been sleeping for much longer in the afternoon since I stopped putting her down for a nap in the morning and instead taken her somewhere that she can play. And play HARD. Then around 2pm, I take her back home...she's usually asleep in her car seat/ stroller/ Ergo before we even leave the parking lot.







It's awesome. She sleeps for about 2 hours everytime, give or take a half hour. Aahhhh.... sweet alone time for me. Although I usually am still in the car with her, she let me move her to the house after she fell asleep today. So I'm finally checking in here!
Weaning is going pretty well. Most days we only nurse 2-3 times. Once in the morning, sometimes once in the afternoon, and then about an hour before bed. I'm not nursing between 10pm and 6am. She usually only wakes up once at night during those hours and Joshua rocks her back to sleep. I feel like a million bucks most of the time now. I'm happier and definitely healthier. (Thanks for asking barcleona!)

Hope everyone is doing well. And that spring is tangible for all of you this weekend. It's been gorgeous here. Sunny, in the 70's, beautiful storms at night... I love spring!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Worst. Night. Ever.

I am starting to suspect that either Rowan is so sensitive to sugar that the Motrin we give her for her teeth makes the problem worse, not better, or she is sensitive to dairy and the milk she's been getting is causing the problem. But she's eaten cheese and yogurt since she started solids with no problem at all.

She slept with me last night. Tossed and turned all night. Woke up frequently. Didn't need nursing, just cuddled back to sleep within a minute or two. But woke up at least every 1/2 hour. I didn't sleep. I took the morning off work and grabbed a couple extra hours. I tried to put her in her crib - she slept just a little over an hour in there and I heard her whimper in her sleep a bunch of times.









What is wrong with my baby?!?!?!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Sarah - do you get the dye-free Motrin? When I gave Killy tylenol that was pink when he was 4 months old, he stayed awake for 18 hours straight - I kid you not. A lot of kids are super-sensitive to red dye.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Yeah, it's dye-free.







But it's loaded with sugar. It tastes disgusting.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Hey, that shows how healthy you are now and how re-defined your taste buds are. A few years ago, you might not have thought that








Kavita, one of the things that my ex and I have talked about recently is that maybe, just maybe, we could have survived the combination of my PND and his bipolar and nervous breakdown if only we hadn't had an incredibly demanding toddler with serious health issues sapping the emotional and physical life blood out of us. Seriously. (and given that you know how I feel about my ex, this says a lot.) This age is a lovely age, but it's very very very hard work. The one piece of advice I'd give, though I know you can't take it, is to not make any big changes at all this year and just let the dust settle.
You know what? My gorgeous, adorable son aforementioned now has less control over the English language than his 1yo sister. It's official. The reason I know this is because he was babytalking today and she laughed and said "baba"







. Which made him all the worse


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

trying...to...catch....up...


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
This age is a lovely age, but it's very very very hard work. The one piece of advice I'd give, though I know you can't take it, is to not make any big changes at all this year and just let the dust settle.
(

BWAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA!!!














:

Okay, now that I am finished with that--how I wish I could take that advice!
I felt really bad today b/c at story hour at the library, my mommy friends were planning activities for the coming months and the summer, and I'm not going to be there.







Things are not going well the last couple of days--I had a huge fight with DH last night, and then today on the phone I unleashed on my mother in a huge way. My mom is really snappy and hostile with the family, but doesn't even realize it because she is just used to talking to everyone in the family like crap and they (my dad + my sister and her family) are just used to it and put up with it, and further take on responsibility for not making her angry. Oh, and then try to get everyone else to toe the line and not make her angry or upset. I live far away and I don't play like that, but I also know that it's mostly pointless to try to improve anything with her because you end up the bad guy. So I've mostly distanced myself from her a lot. But in talking to her tonight about what is going on with my sister, she started up with me and I WENT OFF. I am both horrified that I was totally verbally abusive and horrible to her, and just also sort of feel relieved to just express the anger I'm feeling toward her for once.

Sigh. I need to take some B vitamins and Omega fatty acids and just lock my a** in a closet until this passes.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I know. I'm so sorry- but seriously, try not to file for divorce until Ella's two, huh? Moving cross-country is scary but for us, it's been the best thing we've ever done (even if our living room does look like a nursing home.) We have friends, we have a social life, etc, etc.
Whilst totally unrelated to my Nov babe, I shocked myself today. I booked an appointment with the boys headteacher for next week. I'm asking for help in finding parenting classes (so that I can rule out the possibility that it is "just bad parenting") and a professional opinion on his behaviour and tantrums. I just can't deal with him any more - I don't WANT to deal with this any more. We had a long chat yesterday, and he acted like he's never heard the word "wrong" before. The forgetfulness, the rudeness, the complete inability to have things any other way than his is driving me crazy. It's now at the point where either we get outside help, or I have to ask his dad to offer him a home for a while and I don't want that.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Helen. Is it Isaac who's causing you grief? Could it be related to his hospital visit(s)? Is it possible he's worried that one day he'll go into the hospital and you won't come to get him out again - he's trying to push you to see if there's a breaking point? I know it sounds wacky but I've been reading Alfie Kohn and he touches on some stuff like this. And even if that's the case it wouldn't really make things any easier for you would it?








for you too Kavita - sounds like you're going through a very stressful time. I hope this passes quickly for you.

Rowan SLEPT last night - from 2:30 til 6:30 in her crib. But before that she was up for DH and wouldn't settle - he gave her a snack then brought her to me after an hour of her being awake. But she slept well after a good long nurse, very quietly, no moaning and tossing.

The difference? No motrin last night. We gave her some Hyland's teething gel instead. Hmmmm..... Also, I found her last molar had popped out yesterday - that combined with the two canines has gotta cause some discomfort. So I'm less concerned that it's the milk now.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Yeah, it's Isaac who's causing grief. Some of this could be him pushing because he's insecure, but some of this is him just being him. He wasn't left on his own in hospital, btw, and never has been: but he has a strong sense of his own mortality. I'll try Alfie Kohn though, I've never read any of his stuff.
One thing we realised today. Isaac, for all he drives me absolutely, completely totally and utterly insane is totally true to himself and his moral values. I've never caught him lying, doing anything deceitful or- you know. Any of the nasty tricks that small children do sometimes. Alex's integrity (and the grownups) tend to work much more on scales of grey, so I'm glad for that. We'll come through this. Somehow.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Geez...
Hugs to you Kavita and Helen... and you too, Sarah for Rowan's unhappy sleep nights...
Things seem pretty good here. We went to the Children's Museum again today. The scheme of letting her run herself ragged and then sleep for a few hours in the afternoon seems to be helping both her mood and her nighttime sleep. She slept from 9:30pm to 7:15am only waking once around 1:30. Papa helped her back to sleep and I woke up feeling fabulous.
I am taking a break from prepping some of tonights dinner. My best friend from California has moved to Indy and is coming for dinner tonight with her daughter whom I've never met and she's almost 2!!! Our girls are almost exactly 6 months apart. This should be really fun.
Well, I better get back to grating carrots and chopping cilantro...

Peace be with all of you!


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Dairy protein allergies are something I know too much about. Annette was around 10-11 months and starting to eat cheese and yogurt before I figured out her fussiness and eczema was due to dairy. At 5 years old she can handle some amounts of cheese, yogurt and ice cream, but if she has too much she will still get an upset stomach and break out in patches of eczema. We have never tried giving her straight milk as the proteins are changed some in the processes of making other things with them. There are many people that can handle cheese and yogurt, but can't handle straight dairy. There are also lots like my dd that can handle small amounts of diary, but too much will cause a reaction when they hit the threshold for their body. I'm still 100% dairy free not even hidden diary or Joseph reacts badly. We are OK if either of us has small amounts of hidden soy, but if I pig out on soy ice cream we are in trouble. I don't plan on introducing soy milk to him until he is at least 18 months, but at this point 2 years is looking far more likely. We are also holding off on eggs and a number of other foods that have a high potential to cause problems.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Kristina. I think I'm planning on taking Isaac dairy free (well, prolly Feingold, actually) because in addition to the behaviour and asthma attack, his eczema has flared as well. I put it down to a change in washing powder, but maybe not?


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Helen it sounds like you are far more in need of







after this long of being at least mostly diary free it's just life as usual. When I got pg with Joseph I was still bfing Annette. At that point she was fine if I had hidden dairy and small amounts of things like a slice of pizza. I haven't had a glass of cow's milk in about 5 years now and at this point I honestly don't miss it at all. I have to admit I was never a big dairy person. What killed me early on with Joseph was his horrid spit up when I had caffeine. I couldn't have my dark chocolate







Thankfully he can handle it when I have small bits now. I also encourage my kids to bf until at least 2 years for that optimal brain growth so keeping up the times in a day isn't a big deal for us. So far Joseph has only had a very few skin problems probably because I caught the dairy issue early on with him. Annette ended up on Zyrtec for at least a year just to get her skin under control because the ped had no clue my diet could cause her skin problems. She does also react bad to changes in laundry liquid though. We pretty much only use All Free and Clear. There is one other brand we use at times, but even with the natural stuff we can have problems. So really it sounds like either could be an issue. I've seen very little about the Feingold, but what I have is good and it intrigues me. I should probably read more about it if I ever get free time to read.


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

S Kristina: I'm right there with you on the dairy issues. I actually am really good about not consuming much of any dairy myself other than yogurt and some hard cheeses. I *duh* forgot the other day, though, and had alfredo sauce *and* ice cream in one evening. I NEVER eat either one of those foods, so for me to have both in one evening is insane. At any rate, the next morning poor Noah had an INSANE belly ache. Of course this is right after coming off a week of belly problems. Bad, bad, bad mama.







Eggs are BAD for him, too.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Oh Michelle







I remember those days (and when I accidentally poisoned Skye by eating half a tub of ben and jerry's...)
Kristina, we're going to come through this. I don't know how, and I think I need some external help because some of Isaac's behaviour is so extreme, but at least I've found something that I really like and admire about him, which I've been flailing for. He still drives me nutty, but you know- my bad day had a bright spot in it.


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## kandkrose (Jan 2, 2006)

hi ladies - i'm a nov. 2005 mama.... any chance i can jump in?


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Well, yeah, but you need to tell us a bit more about yourself?


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Helen:







back at ya, mama. Yeah, I don't think Noah would do so hot if I'd ate a half tub of B & J!!! I'm glad that you have found a light with Isaac. I think you should definitely read Alfie Kohn and have you also read Raising Your Spirited Child? It, for me, is a good reference point and has become somewhat of a "bible" for me to refer back to on those days that I feel as if I'm losing hope.









KandKRose: Welcome! What's your scoop, mama? Tell us about you and your family!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Helen: I second the Alfie Kohn and Raising your Spirited Child. Also, if you haven't already, sign up for this daily email: The Daily Groove

kandkrose: welcome! please join us, but be forewarned, we are a chatty bunch!









Dinner with my best friend and her family last night went swimmingly. Her daughter Athena and Isa got along great. I think we will all be spending a lot of time together here. Hopefully after she gets in sync with her job and the flow of life here in Indy, she'll be taking Wednesdays off from work so she can come to the playgroup I host with SoulJourney! Yay!
Weaning is at a point where I'm comfortable staying where we are for a while. We are down to three times in 24 hours. Once at 6am (my snooze button!) once in the afternoon after her nap, and once about an hour before bed. She's eating food and drinking water pretty constantly and she's peeing alot. So I think she's staying hydrated and satisfied even with less mama milk. I think it's going well. She doesn't even fuss when she signs for milk and I say "not right now." She seems to understand that I'll be happy to get her whatever she wants to eat whenever she wants it. She trusts me to keep her belly full. I'm not really ready to give up any more nursing sessions right now, but when it does feel right, the afternoon nursing will probably be the next to go. I enjoy our nightly wind down and I LOVE our early morning snuggles.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

hmm, I'll check that site out. Thanks!
Does anyone else think that we're less chatty than usual this month? It seems to have been really quiet round here- and I notice zjande's mia (again.) Sniff. I miss being a newly wed.
DH declared that I wasn't getting a present for mothers day, because he was investing heavily in my birthday next month, what with me turning 30 and all. Way to make a girl feel old







That's 36 days time, in case anyone else is counting, until I'm no longer in my twenties, no longer a "young mum," just- mum.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

im on a knitting binge, sorry im mia..









we are leaving for a week tomorow and im trying to get my sh!t together, so im not much fun.. im going in to get my new glasses today so i can get learning to drive (yuk) so i wont be stranded in the middle of nowhere when we move in june..did i mention that we are moving? ngaio is being a psycho clingmonster and its wearing me thin.. (i wish literally) and im doing a one day fast to try to clear me head or whatever because im so jumbled up about everything.
i still have major babylust and im so pissed off that this month we dtd quite a few times without any for of BC and he didnt withdraw and im frigging bleeding a week or more earlier than usual. i always thought i culd get pregnant if he even touched me and now ims ad because i want another baby but now the universe is against me. the house is a mess and i dontwnat to cleanup. my clothes are all fallingapart and i keep getting medical bills in the mail even though they know im a poor single mother (at leats as far as taxes go..) im So glad itsspring break because i swear i feel like i could lock all of my chldren and daycare kids in a cage and leave them there if i have to se them anymore.
i need a day off. but yes, i want another one















:

ok. rant complete.

sorry to not respond to anyone else. im no good.







:


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Fern







I did see that you were stalking Dec DDC too







You're sure it's not just an implantation bleed, right? You didn't mention the move, or the driving lessons, or any of the rest of it, but I hope it all goes well.
Did I mention I finished Ambrose's scarf? 29, 312 stitches of stockingette....







: I'm so there with you on the knitting binges.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 
Hopefully after she gets in sync with her job and the flow of life here in Indy, she'll be taking Wednesdays off from work so she can come to the playgroup I host with SoulJourney! Yay!

Hey, you two are in Indianapolis right? I am not going to be that far from you when we move! (Louisville is about an hour and change, from what I hear.) We also have some good friends there, so we will be coming to visit them sometimes once we move, so maybe we can meet up! Can we come play too?







: One benefit to moving, I will finally be SOMEWHERE where there is at least a vague possibility of ever meeting any of our Nov DDC IRL!!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaFern* 
im on a knitting binge, sorry im mia..









we are leaving for a week tomorow and im trying to get my sh!t together, so im not much fun.. im going in to get my new glasses today so i can get learning to drive (yuk) so i wont be stranded in the middle of nowhere when we move in june..did i mention that we are moving? ngaio is being a psycho clingmonster and its wearing me thin.. (i wish literally) and im doing a one day fast to try to clear me head or whatever because im so jumbled up about everything.
i still have major babylust and im so pissed off that this month we dtd quite a few times without any for of BC and he didnt withdraw and im frigging bleeding a week or more earlier than usual. i always thought i culd get pregnant if he even touched me and now ims ad because i want another baby but now the universe is against me. the house is a mess and i dontwnat to cleanup. my clothes are all fallingapart and i keep getting medical bills in the mail even though they know im a poor single mother (at leats as far as taxes go..) im So glad itsspring break because i swear i feel like i could lock all of my chldren and daycare kids in a cage and leave them there if i have to se them anymore.
i need a day off. but yes, i want another one














:

ok. rant complete.

sorry to not respond to anyone else. im no good.







:


Hugs MamaFern!! Sounds like you need a break and some time to go off by yourself for a few hours! Any chance of getting someone to take the kiddos for a while you you can rejuvenate?

And where are you moving to?


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

ez has a rash around her knees, inner elbows, and ankles. anyone else seen this? it looks like a bunch of little mosquito bites. i am trying not to worry. i called my friend of 4 kids who is also a nurse and she thinks it may just be heat rash.

fern- i bought something for you at the bead shop last week. it reminded me of you. if you send me your addy via e-mail, i will mail it on up to you.

we went to a children's museum in mil's town. i actually saw this sign







for the first time IRL (only seen it online or in mothering mag)! they had a large lending library that included the WAB, Dr Sears books, garcia's sign language book, "the birth partner" and a few other titles that i really appreciated. dh and i were so excited! along with this sign







, there were the words something like "while breastfeeding moms are welcome everywhere in the museum, here is a private, quiet space if you would prefer that". there were big overstuffed chairs and books everywhere. the sign and words were posted above the changing tables, too! i was so stoked and so proud of them! my single guy friend used to work there and he does support BF, mainly b/c he spends a lot of time with his BF sis and with me and my fam. i wrote a note showing appreciation for the signs.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

I feel like I've been a little less chatty this month. I feel busy and like I've not checked in as much as I'd like. But I'm keeping up, so maybe it's not just me!
Fern: Hugs, mama. I'm right there with you. I've had some seriously weird CM patterns... and last night after making love, I had some bleeding. But my cycle isn't due for a LONG time.... WTF? I'm confused. I feel like I should take a test, but I'm scared!







I was just starting to feel like I was getting my life back...maybe that means its the perfect time...Ugh. I'm still on the fence about having more kiddos. I REALLY want to, and I'm REALLY scared that I'll break down.







:
Kavita: Ooooh.... yes of course you can come and play! Let me know when you'll be in town and we'll set up a meet up!
Hope everyone is doing well! Lots of Love to all!


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Helen...yeah, I know I've definitely been alot less chatty this month, for sure. I have just had SO. MUCH. GOING. ON. that it's been impossible for me to try to connect with anyone lately. We'll come back around full swing, though, I'm sure! I do miss Zjande, though, and I was missing Fern until she popped that cute little head of hers in!

Fern...tell us more about your move!!! You seem to have soooo many new things going on in your life lately, I'm sure that when the time is right you'll have another little bun in the oven!

Kavita...Please, please, please play with us! You know, I was also thinking, if you are in Louisville, how cool would it be if we could all do a camping trip somewhere in southern Indiana sometime? Sooooooo fun! Let's keep it in mind!

Noah's dad is going to be in town tomorrow, Monday and Tuesday. He gets him for ten hours a day each day...







As much as I always hate sending Noah off with him (not because he treats him badly, btw, just to clarify!) I am actually looking forward to having ten straight hours to do as I please tomorrow. First thing I'm doing at 8:45am is hitting the gym and staying until I can no longer stand!







Then I'm going to get my hair cut and do all the things that are way too difficult to do with a toddler in tow. My sis is hanging out with me the entire day, I'm so excited! Monday and Tuesday I still have the little man that I normally watch. I wish that I could afford to take at least one of those days off but I can't. Oh well, I at least have ten hours tomorrow! Keep your fingers crossed for me that Noah has a good day tomorrow!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SoulJourney* 
Kavita...Please, please, please play with us! You know, I was also thinking, if you are in Louisville, how cool would it be if we could all do a camping trip somewhere in southern Indiana sometime? Sooooooo fun! Let's keep it in mind!

Noah's dad is going to be in town tomorrow, Monday and Tuesday. He gets him for ten hours a day each day...







As much as I always hate sending Noah off with him (not because he treats him badly, btw, just to clarify!) I am actually looking forward to having ten straight hours to do as I please tomorrow. First thing I'm doing at 8:45am is hitting the gym and staying until I can no longer stand!







Then I'm going to get my hair cut and do all the things that are way too difficult to do with a toddler in tow. My sis is hanging out with me the entire day, I'm so excited! Monday and Tuesday I still have the little man that I normally watch. I wish that I could afford to take at least one of those days off but I can't. Oh well, I at least have ten hours tomorrow! Keep your fingers crossed for me that Noah has a good day tomorrow!










Camping sounds fun!!! I happen to have a few insanely nice pieces of camping gear too, which I bought right after I broke up with my last boyfriend before DH! That boyfriend had some pretty nice gear--so a part of recovering from that breakup was to buy gear that was similar, but a notch better!!







So I'll bring the multifuel stove and the nifty pots!







Right before buying my house and meeting DH I went on a really awesome solo backpacking trip with my dogs in Arizona's white mountains. It was scary, though, because it was bear country and I swear that I heard a bear growl off in the distance--I was in this alpine valley, with forest on either side, and it really echoed. It totally made the hair on the back of my neck stand up and I spent a long time sitting up by my little fire thinking about bears!!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

What is this, the 11/05 DDC moves en masse to 12/07?







That would be so cool... I'm still sitting firmly on the fence about this maybe-baby. I'm really excited, but part of me just wonders why I don't just slice open my body, remove my still-beating heart and shove pins in it now so I save myself the hassle later on, you know? I'm down half a stone and my diet is way better than it was a couple of months ago, but there's still every chance of things going wrong again. Drat Lemsip and it's mucus-drying abilities







:
It's Mothers Day here, so far I've had a conversation about inappropriate touching of willies, a discussion of rape and Rowan's birth, fifteen minutes of someone using my head as a trampoline, a gift-wrapped dummy (wrapped in lots of snot and put into my mouth. Gah), someone complaining about one of my branch officers (I will be going round there with a big stick to sort them out later) and a can of diet coke and a bar of chocolate as breakfast in bed







It's 8am! I can't wait to see what the rest of the day brings- peace and quiet, hopefully.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

That would be fun and super crazy for all of us to move on masse to 12/07 DDC! I've had some crazy feelings in my abdomen lately. Is it gas? Implantation? Menstrual Cramps? My sense of bodily timing is SO off right now that I have no idea what's happening in my body right now. It's the most alienating feeling. I feel a distance between my conscious mind and my body right now... eery.
BTW, camping sounds like fun!


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## Awaken (Oct 10, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
ez has a rash around her knees, inner elbows, and ankles. anyone else seen this? it looks like a bunch of little mosquito bites. i am trying not to worry. i called my friend of 4 kids who is also a nurse and she thinks it may just be heat rash.

fern- i bought something for you at the bead shop last week. it reminded me of you. if you send me your addy via e-mail, i will mail it on up to you.

we went to a children's museum in mil's town. i actually saw this sign







for the first time IRL (only seen it online or in mothering mag)! they had a large lending library that included the WAB, Dr Sears books, garcia's sign language book, "the birth partner" and a few other titles that i really appreciated. dh and i were so excited! along with this sign







, there were the words something like "while breastfeeding moms are welcome everywhere in the museum, here is a private, quiet space if you would prefer that". there were big overstuffed chairs and books everywhere. the sign and words were posted above the changing tables, too! i was so stoked and so proud of them! my single guy friend used to work there and he does support BF, mainly b/c he spends a lot of time with his BF sis and with me and my fam. i wrote a note showing appreciation for the signs.

Gunter, that is so cool! How encouraging! I would be thrilled to see something like that! Hope Ez's rash goes away, or you figure out what it is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 
That would be fun and super crazy for all of us to move on masse to 12/07 DDC!

Uh, no, no it wouldn't be fun, not at all! Speak for yourself sister! I am firmly planted here in the Nov 05 DDC!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Gunter, I'm so sorry that I completely didn't see your post. On a similar note to the museum, the Surestart centre where I run one of the breastmates groups (our local community project where lots and lots of money gets thrown at poor families so their toddlers don't firebomb cars like what their teenagers do) got the Unicef Baby-friendly community award this week







I am SO proud of Tiina, our lovely midwife, and the rest of the team for wanting this so badly.
Mothers Day was lovely. We went to the outlet village, decided we didn't want to do shopping, didn't want to wait in a long queue to eat, didn't want to do anything much. So we had Burger King for lunch, went to the park and then took our muddy boots to Borders and spent much time and money frolicking. Great fun







No (or very little) shouting either, though Skye was not happy being told that she couldn't go to Starbucks this morning


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Helen, it sounds like you had a nice day, albeit with an interesting start!









And yeah, count me out for the Dec 07 DDC. I'm aiming for the Nov 08 DDC, I think. No TTC til Christmas!

Rowan's still in teething hell. It's not as bad as it was, since we cut out the motrin, but she's been needing to sleep with mummy the past few nights and I'm exhausted. She usually has 3-4 hours GOOD sleep a night and the rest is quite restless. I have a hard time with cosleeping anyway and it's worse when she's wriggling around because I wake up every time she moves. Tonight DH is going to have to deal with her for a good portion because I need some sleep - and I have to work tomorrow of course.

But the upshot of this is that once this last canine is through we only have the two upper ones (which aren't looking imminent) and the two-year old molars and then we're done with teeth for a good long time. I am going to go get NCSS for Toddlers today I think, too.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Today I went to a NINO meeting and then came home and worked in the garden with all three boys. hey! I'm starting to feel like my life can be normal again. A friend let me borrow her Kozy and I wore Winter on my back for the first time while I did some housework. It was awesome. Beautiful spring weather here today and I'm feeling so optomistic.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

ezra's rash kinda went away after the bath but it flared up a little bit, again today at her knee and under her neck/chin. it wasn't right after she ate anything though. one idea that we have is that she may be allergic to something at my mil's house. we were there all weekend and my mil held her a bunch. not to bash her b/c she is great but she uses a lot of toxic items like toothpaste AND clothes detergent that is BLUE! so, maybe the clothes detergent dyes bothered baby ez? certainly, i didn't let her anywhere near that toothpaste; we actually left ours there for mil to try. or the carpet may have bothered her? we are keeping our eyes on it. at least she hasn't been itching.

she kissed a boy tonight. her boyfriend. they were hugging and kissing and we tried to take pics of them. pathetic parents taking pics of smooching babes. we went to hear a kid's band play but got there super late. we did have a yummy dinner and my mama friend split a pomegranate martini or two with me. woo hoo.

there is absolutely no way that i am in any DDC that even exists on MDC, at this point.







not b/c i don't want another babe (i do)...not b/c i don't have babylust (it comes and goes)...not b/c i am scared of labor (so looking forward to that, again, believe it or not!) but just not any time soon. we'll be traveling for a year come june so i want to wait until that is nearly over before we even start to talk about ttc. plus, adopting a child is on our radar for ezra's sibling. but, i will certainly cheer on you mamas ttc!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Well, I hate to brag... but I have the hands-down cutest picture of babies kissing ever... Brace yourself: Ellie and her little boyfriend. My friend took the picture and we're both crazy over it.

Ellie has been super-fussy all day... I think its because she's teething, she has all her top and bottom front teeth, all her one year molars, and none of her canines. They were the last to come in for Killy, too, and I remember them taking the longest and seeming to cause the most pain. GREAT.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Wow! How much hair has Ellie got? (and how jealous am I?








)


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Awww, kissing babies!!!! That is so cute. QofC, Rowan's canines have been the worst so far for the teeth. I think that's normal.

Gunter, has Ezra been eating lots of citrus? My sister always got a rash like that after eating too many oranges. Tomatoes could do it too, I think.

Well, we MIGHT have figured out how to get Rowan to sleep better. Yesterday she was outside, running around, almost all day (to the point where she was cranky before dinner because she was exhausted) and then she ate a huge dinner (of takeout chinese







: ) and slept like a log from 8:30 to 5:30 am. So maybe she just needs more exercise??? It was a beautiful day yesterday though - today, not so much. But MIL will have orders from DH today to march the child around the block for at least an hour this afternoon, rain or shine, I'm sure


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Queen of Cups said:


> Well, I hate to brag... but I have the hands-down cutest picture of babies kissing ever... Brace yourself: Ellie and her little boyfriend. My friend took the picture and we're both crazy over it.QUOTE]
> 
> Your family is beautiful! I have thought so since we were preggo together! i will have to post that pic of ez and her boyfriend. he is a little cutie.
> 
> ...


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

We are all sick- reading but not getting a free hand to post! It's been over a week and I'm totally beat. Between it being DH's exam week (with final papers and a ton of marking to do), Neela being sick and nursing non-stop and not sleeping and me working because I've now used up all of my sick time for work- I am sooo exhausted. I'm having a hard time sustaining myself, let alone a huge toddler who is mostly NOT eating solids right now (except, mysteriously, hummous)







:

Kissing babies are sooo cute


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Gunter* 
Your family is beautiful! I have thought so since we were preggo together

Thank you! I think my kids are pretty darn gorgeous, but I realize I might be a bit biased...


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

I just wanted to say HI, and thinking of you mamas having a hard time...Fern and Kavita (with your mom)...and MelW being so tired...Fern, where are you moving?

I'm usually not the best at keeping up with the board, but have been worse than usual this month, Helen. Again, so much going on here, mixed with the stresses that you all know about.

A mini update from here is that I have my first night rehearsal on Thursday, so am a nervous wreck about Finley being without me at bedtime, but am also balanced with a bit of calm knowing that he WILL be with DH in his home, so I think he will be okay...And the latest I'll be is 10:15, which is late, but not too too bad.

My mom apologized to me for her behavior at the end of our stay there, and I think it is the first time she has ever apologized to me. So that was both shocking and nice. I think it might be because I stood up for myself more than usual, and am getting stronger. They were in town this weekend for business and we saw them Saturday afternoon, and they were on their best behavior and quite nice with only a couple of comments about why we don't have batteries in our toys and stuff and why we don't let him watch Sesame Street (the TV thing is a battle...we never do TV, but occassionally do bits of movies in "emergency" situations, though I'm sure you movie and tv-free moms balk at that...but anyway, it's one of those issues I'm still trying to sort out myself. Finley hasn't watched anything in almost three weeks, so that's pretty good. That may change on Thursday night).

I'm jealous of you mamas living close to each other!

As for the babylust, I understand it...it comes and goes for me, and lately is pretty strong, though it makes no sense for us right now. Our plan is to wait til Finley is 3 or 4 to TTC.

Helen, sounds like you had a lovely Mother's Day!

Spughy, isn't it marvelous when they sleep in those long chunks? Finley has been back and forth...one night is amazing, the next night pretty restless. I definitely think it helps when he has run around a lot, but it's been freezing and snowing here, so that's been difficult to achieve.

DiD, so glad you feel like you're getting your life back!

Spiritmomma, you too, on the getting your life back









Gunter, I hope you can figure out the rash thing. That would definitely be troubling. I wish I had ideas, but am not great in that department.

As for the teeth, it seems like Finley has been working on his molars forever, literally for months, but they have yet to come through. His gums are really swollen, though. He has his front eight teeth, 4 on top and 4 on bottom, and has since he was 10 months, and nothing since then! He has been wanting to nurse a LOT lately, more than usual, so maybe something is actually coming through...Let's hope!

Sorry this is so very scattered. It's kind of how I feel at the moment, all over the place. This is such a transitional and strange time for us, what with our careers so up in the air, and trying to balance the financial and the creative in our lives. And my eyes are reacting STRONGLY to being on the computer lately...really feeling fuzzy and bad. So I'm going to try to really limit my screen time. I'm on it a lot fixing pictures and reading MDC (when Finley sleeps, but can't type), and trying to keep up with friends via email...I just have to tone it down.

So that's me for now!

Love to all of you!


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Oh, and Q of C, what beautiful kids you have...and what an Adorable picture! Nothing like kissing babies


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

barcelona~ how amazing that your mom apologized! I hope that this marks a change in your relationship with her









I'm feeling mildly better. Neela is eating again. My DH cheered me up this morning by teaching Neela to say "super hot". Who is super hot? "Mama". Our friend and neighbour taught her to say "multisyllabic" yesterday while I was at work. My kid is a parrot


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
I'm feeling mildly better. Neela is eating again. My DH cheered me up this morning by teaching Neela to say "super hot". Who is super hot? "Mama". Our friend and neighbour taught her to say "multisyllabic" yesterday while I was at work. My kid is a parrot









I can't even get my kid to say MAMA reliably! Your kid is a frikkin' genius!!!!

But mine is still awfully cute. This morning we were playing kissy-face with the french doors in our living room - she walks up to them, smooshes her face against the glass and I go on the other side and smoosh MY face against the glass so we're "kissing". Then she pops her head around the door to get a real kiss.









My REAL news today is that DH finished his thesis!!!! YAAAAAYYYYYY!!!!







YAAAAAAYYYYYY







YAAAAAAYYYYY

I can't begin to explain how good this is. Yes, there's some "defense" thing he has to do but from now on we can start to make some sort of plans about the rest of our life. The end of limbo is nigh!!!!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy, I'm so happy for you







Mine is currently superglued to his maths textbook with sheets of graph paper strewn all over the living room floor, so I can understand a little of what you've gone through...
Mel, I'm glad she can say multisyllalllallabullic (heck, even I can't and I'm 29) but thinking that her mommy is super-hot is way, way cooler


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

We should totally have a partners of students support thread! My DH handed in the last of his papers and assignments for the term yesterday, but is on campus today to pick up all of the papers and portfolios that he has to mark for his students. The amount of work he is doing amazes me, since I was the perfectionist workaholic and he was a total slacker as an undergrad.

And my confession: I've been browsing grad schools for me on the internet. I think I want to go back to school- I also think I don't know what I might be getting myself into







:


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
And my confession: I've been browsing grad schools for me on the internet. I think I want to go back to school- I also think I don't know what I might be getting myself into







:

uhm, i do this all the time! just to see what is out there and i make mental notes to myself about their requirements to get in, do i need to take the GRE, do they have a dual degree program, etc? i will probably get my Master's in Social Work one day. One day....


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
My REAL news today is that DH finished his thesis!!!! YAAAAAYYYYYY!!!!







YAAAAAAYYYYYY







YAAAAAAYYYYY

yay!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Love love love the kissing babies! I wanna see yours, Gunter!

Spughy: Yay for DH's thesis being done! YAY!
















As for me and mine, I got some kind of disgusting sickness on Monday that involved a lot of uke and (imagine diarhea smilie here). Yeah. Eww.
I think it was something I ate, though, because besides being a bit weak and tired, I feel a LOT better today. I am hoping that by tomorrow it will be as if it never happened. Poor Isa is getting a tooth on the bottom and really wanted to nurse, but I was so dehydrated and has such a sour stomach, I couldn't really nurse her very well. I tried, but my attempts disappointed her, so Joshua was in her room all night trying to explain that Mama is sick, etc...





















I felt so bad for both of them...
But, like I said, feeling much better today and hoping for "all better" tomorrow.

Hope everyone has got out to enjoy the lovely spring weather!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Yay! Happy Eostre! Equinox! Whatever you want to call it, it's the first day of spring. We have snow coming through the apple blossom, it's blowing a gale and I had to take my nose stud out on the way to school because I was so uncomfortable.
spiritmomma, I'm sending you many hugs and virtual lemon barley water. I hope you feel better soon.
I went diaper shopping







First time in over a year, but the elastic has gone in a couple of her tots and another one is threadbare. A huggle, a swaddlebee and I'm coveting puddlepants, just can't decide which one.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MelW* 
We should totally have a partners of students support thread! My DH handed in the last of his papers and assignments for the term yesterday, but is on campus today to pick up all of the papers and portfolios that he has to mark for his students. The amount of work he is doing amazes me, since I was the perfectionist workaholic and he was a total slacker as an undergrad.

And my confession: I've been browsing grad schools for me on the internet. I think I want to go back to school- I also think I don't know what I might be getting myself into







:


Can you expand it to partners of teachers also? My DH teaches some evenings at a university, and OMG it is a TON of work. If he's not teaching, he's preparing for a class or grading. And math is the most fun because the students freak out on a regular basis and call him at weird hours!!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 

As for me and mine, I got some kind of disgusting sickness on Monday that involved a lot of uke and (imagine diarhea smilie here). Yeah. Eww.

Hmm, I'm not so sure that I want to even imagine what a diarrhea smilie looks like!









glad you are feeling better!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Right now at my house I am in solidarity with all of our teething babies. I just got impressions done for two crowns yesterday, and my gums feel like raw hamburger.







: The dental assistant was a new one, and was not very good at getting the retraction bands on. I am hoping all the pounding on it hasn't killed my one tooth entirely, one of them feels okay but the other one is throbbing intermittently. And they had to do it THREE TIMES to get a decent impression. Grrrrrrrr.

Meanwhile, I got some sad news today too--my dear old next door neighbor, who is 89, just found out that she has several abdominal tumors, and they are admitting her to the hospital in the morning to observe her to make sure that she is not developing an intestinal blockage from the one there. She also has one on her liver.







Her son was over at her place and I was outside and he came over and told me. It doesn't look so good.







They are not going to do surgery or chemo, they are only going to do what is necessary to keep her comfortable and control her pain, and they may have to do surgery just to relieve the blockage if that's necessary for comfort. She may have to go from the hospital into a nursing home or hospice too. I feel so bad. I love her, she's such a wonderful person, and we are good friends. I hope that I'll get to see her in the morning before she goes to the hospital, I know she'll want to see Ella and I don't think they will allow Ella in the hospital to visit. When I was pregnant, she was avidly watching my place to see what was going on and when I would have the baby. She noticed a couple of extra cars in the driveway and surmised that it was the midwives, and so the morning after Ella was born she came by and asked my DH if I'd had the baby. He invited her in and she was so excited to see Ella, who was maybe about 10-12 hours old at that point! I let her hold her, and she was so awed--she'd had a hysterectomy at a young age and both her children were adopted from the state hospital when they were at least several months old--and she said that she'd never ever held a baby that young before!!! She is very enamored with Ella, and Ella loves her too. I hope that she is okay, and that whatever happens she is comfortable and well cared for.

Sorry to be a big downer.







That's what is going on in my world. That and trying to get our house ready to put on the market. I think I'd better go to bed now, it's going to be a long day tomorrow.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Laura. We had one of those days recently- sometimes on the way to school I've noticed a lady watching out of her living room window as we get off the bus, and tbh I've always been rather awed and scared- you know, just HOW bad a parent does she think I am? That kind of thing. Anyhow, she came out when Isaac was off last week, called Alex over and gave him two lollies- one for his brother- and explained to me that the kids who walk up and down so regularly bring her so much happiness. She's only got a few months left, and seeing them brightens her day- it wasn't just my boys either, but the kids who go to the childminder up the road, and a few other families. So bittersweet.
I hope that this lady has a gentle, sweet and peaceful few months, and that Ella can keep bringing her the happiness she already does


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Kavita. That's such a sad situation. Death comes to everyone but it doesn't make it any less sad or poignant.

Anybody know where Amy is???? She hasn't been on here for a long time, it seems.


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## zjande (Nov 4, 2002)

Hi everyone! I apologize for not partaking in our fabulous March thread but then barging in here now with questions!

But if you wouldn't mind, will you tell me what your babies' teeth look like? Are they all pearly white? Or is there some discoloration or some downright brown spots? And how often do you brush them?

I'm anxious to find out. I'm confused about Xeowyn's teeth, they are so discolored! His top front teeth especially. But I'm fearful of going to the dentist because I worry they would tell me to night wean or stop breastfeeding or something.

My dd (who is 15 now) suffered from bottle mouth syndrome & had a lot of very traumatic early dental work. However, I both breast AND bottle fed & so tend to blame the decay on the bottle.

And my 2nd child, well I just can't remember his teeth or whether I brushed them when he was a toddler or anything!!







(I was soo busy in school at the time).

Anyway, how are your munchkin's teeth doing??


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

My munchkin's teeth are shiny shiny white. And yes, we brush them - religiously - twice a day, with flouride toothpaste. Flame me if you like. I have done all my reading and I think the benefits of using flouride *topically* while teeth are erupting outweigh the risks. When her baby teeth are all in we will switch to a xylitol-based toothpaste and use it more frequently, probably after every meal and snack if we can.

My dad was a dentist, my mom a dental nurse. FEAR OF DEATH if my child gets a cavity, I tell you.







. FWIW, I still have no cavities and no tooth discolourations and I'm (gulp) 34.

ETA: I don't believe that night-nursing causes cavities per se. I DO FIRMLY believe that ANY sugar in a baby's diet can contribute to cavities. Sugar (even natural sugars like from fruit) before bed, followed by night nursing will be worst of all.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
FWIW, I still have no cavities and no tooth discolourations and I'm (gulp) 34.


Oooooh. I hate you!







I think I have about eight teeth that *don't* have any dental work done! Of course, I grew up on a diet of Coke and . . . well, Coke!







I am still addicted to the crap, it is probably my greatest downfall. And in my defense, we had a childhood dentist who was pretty awful in some ways, he insisted on drilling and filling places that were slight flaws in the enamel. so we had more fillings than cavities, even. Of course, today my mouth is so raw and hurt and awful feeling that I took ibuprofen right away when I got up, so I'm not feeling so charitable and loving toward my current dentist, either!

Oh, and I ran over right away this morning to my neighbors--the hospital doesn't have a bed for her yet, and so she is still home. We hung out for a while and had a nice chat. (Well, as nice a chat as you can have when you have run to someone's house still in your pajamas and with your child still in her night diaper and unfed and then runs around madly on a search and destroy mission in an unchildproofed house!) So I felt better when I saw her--she is taking things in stride and doesn't seem unduly distressed about the situation, and seems to have the practical elements well in hand. Bad thing was that Ella tried to pet her dog and she snapped at/bit her.







She didn't bite hard and didn't break the skin, but it scared Ella and me too! I should not have let her be petting her, I feel like it was kind of my fault--as I was going to take her away from the dog is when it happenned. I felt bad though because when we came home later Ella expressed some new fear of our dog when she bounded up to greet us, so I hope she doesn't end up being afraid of doggies. OTOH, a little bit of respect for dogs wouldn't be a bad thing!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

No time to catch up









I have horrid teeth. My parents weren't very helpful for me.

We brush DS's as much as we can...as often as we can. He currently LOVES his toothbrush.

I have to get better at all of our dental care...

and my wedding is in 2 weeks....







:







:







:







:







:


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Kavita~ Have you tried some teething tabs for yourself? I did for a toothache once and it helped a bit.







for you and your neighbour. I'm glad you had a visit and I hope that Ella gets a healthy *respect* for dogs. We're working on that- Neela thinks it's okay to kiss random dogs on the street right now







:

Neela's teeth are pretty white. She's also in love with her toothbrush (and mine, and DH's...) but I still have to negotiate letting mama "finish" the brushing.








Aubrey & kaspirant. Check in when you can


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Killy and Ellie both have teeth that are shiny, pearly white. We religiously brush before bed and usually at least another time or two during the day. We use a non-fluoride toothpaste. spughy - I agree that topical fluoride is important, too, but what about the concern about kids swallowing it? They already get so much from the city-water that they certainly don't need to be swallowing extra wads of it every day. Or are you on well-water?

You don't necessarily have to night wean, but be sure that there are NO food particles on their teeth when you take them to bed because the milk-sugar will have something to stick to in the mouth then, and make a perfect spot for bacteria to grow then. Also, if you can give a sippy cup of water after nursing at night, that will help avoid the milk-sugar hanging out in their mouths. These bits of advice came from my dentist last year. She also told me it would help immensely to floss between anywhere that my kids had teeth that touched. I thought the idea of flossing a toddler's teeth was absolute insanity, BUT she suggested just flossing in front of Killy every day and seeing if he got interested. He did! He loves for me to floss his teeth now!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

My teeth are nearly perfect.







I had a diet of LOTS of sugar when I was a kid, drank soda and ate candy for lunch as a teen... BUT when I was a child, my elementary school did monthly flouride treatments (the kind you "swish" like mouthwash) and my molars were "sealed" when I was in middle school to prevent food from getting trapped in the deep socket parts on top. In dental terms, I had "deep pits and fissures" in my molars. Um... could I use any more quotation marks in this paragraph?









Isa's teeth are pearly white and show no spots or otherwise. We are still using the flouride-free toothpaste because she sucks the toothpaste off the brush before I can do any useful brushing. And I don't think she can spit yet. As soon as she can, I'm switching to flouride paste. (*Spughy*: I'd be interested in your research or a good site to look at on flouride for little kids...) The girl does LOVE her toothbrush though









Kavita: Wow. What a deep situation with your neighbor. I'm glad she has you and little Ella to brighten her day. Hope the dog thing pans out okay.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

QofC - our city water isn't flouridated. Rowan does swallow when I brush her teeth, but I only use the smallest smidgin of toothpaste - like 1/10th the "pea size" they recommend - so I'm not worried about toxicity.

Spiritmomma - I will try to dig up the resources I found for you. I don't have the links any more but I will retrace my steps and post something for you as soon as I can.


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## zjande (Nov 4, 2002)

I'm researching breastfed babies & tooth decay online right now & I came across this article that begins with this line: "There are so many things to be concerned about when you axe a parent of a baby, and this is one of those things..." OMG, haha, that is some interesting misspelling.







I too have a lot of worries when I *axe* a parent.









ETA: Well, according to Kellymom, breastfeeding is very unlikely in causing his tooth discoloration/cavities.























Sigh. I think I'm going to have to battle with him to let me brush his teeth more often & for longer periods of time. I'm stressin' about this. My dd (& her dad & I) were soooo traumatized by all the dental treatment she had to get for her bottle mouth syndrome. I can't go through that again with another baby.









His dad has *perfect* teeth. Like, perfect perfect. I have the very opposite of perfect. Mine were rotting out of my head by the time I was 7. Maybe Xeowyn inherited my teeth.









Edited AGAIN to add: My dh will talk your ear off about how fluoride is a poisonous by-product of the fertilizer industry that is so toxic they didn't know how to get rid of it so they started putting it in our drinking water & making up studies about it being good for us just so our bodies would "filter" the substance for the industry. If you would like to research it at all, Google "fluoride is toxic". You will find PLENTY of reading.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Yeah, I have worries about fluoride too. I have crap teeth, Alex and Skye have good teeth, Isaac has crap teeth







So yeah, I reckon it's hereditary. You'll laugh to know that my ovulation spike is actually an abscessing root canal, so I guess I'm not pregnant now (thank god.)
Kavita, I have 30 days left to declare myself finally free of the junk- I swore I'd have beaten the coke addiction by the time I hit 30. I think I may, just, be able to do it.


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## s_kristina (Aug 9, 2004)

Here is a link I just got about fluoride http://www.ada.org/prof/resources/po...de_infants.asp I haven't read all of it yet, but thought some of you might be interested in it.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

s_kristina, thanks for that link. I read it and it directly contradicts other research I've done, of course.







:. It says not to give flouride toothpaste to children under 2, but the research I've done says that topical flouride application is MOST effective during tooth eruption. That research cited actual studies, whereas I couldn't find a citation for anything on the ADA page. It also RECOMMENDS flouridated water when there are loads of studies that show that systemic flouride (ie, ingested) is dubiously effective at reducing cavities. (http://fluoridealert.org/health/teet...-systemic.html, http://www.slweb.org/leverett-1991.html, http://content.karger.com/ProdukteDB...name=77764.pdf)

Zjande, flouride IS a toxin. It has also unequivocally proven useful in strengthening dental enamel (and thus reducing cavities) when topically applied. Just because something is a toxin doesn't mean it doesn't have a place in maintaining or restoring health. Warfarin is also a toxin and is useful in helping people with certain types of heart disease. Neither would be necessary under the optimal conditions for which we are evolved. However, unless you and your children follow a completely paleo diet with few carbohydrates and no sugar at all, your teeth are being swamped with stuff they weren't designed for and you have to compensate somehow or pay the price. Good genes will help and bad genes will hinder, for sure - but having bad genes is MORE reason to use flouride, IMHO. But ONLY topically.

If you're really anti-flouride, you can use xylitol. It's less toxic, but also less studied. It works completely differently, by altering the pH of the saliva and making the mouth a less hospitable place for the strep mutans bacteria that cause cavities. It does nothing to help strengthen tooth enamel, AFAIK. You can compensate for that with diet, but you have to REALLY educate yourself about what nutrients you need and what you need to avoid to do that. FWIW, that's the route I plan to go once Rowan's teeth are fully in - but I think it's going to take a lot of work, planning, and attention to diet even beyond what I currently do, which is not insignificant.

Also, FWIW - my dental health is NOT due to genetics. My dad had about 4 of his original teeth left when he died, I think, and my mom is constantly having dental work done. My dental health is due to the excellent diet I had as a child and topical flouride (just toothpaste, once or twice a day). The city water where I grew up was also flouridated, but I think that had less to do with it than my parents' dedication to my sisters and my oral health. (Neither of them has any cavities either.)


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Hey Mamas. I've been out of the loop for a couple of weeks now. Our house is getting ready to go on the market, and we've been scrambling to get everything ready (by we, I mean ME). Also DH is still running all around the country trying to get a job, and we drove to Atlanta last weekend (yes, drove a total of *13 hours in one day* with a 15-month old!). It was great though, and I have to say that Brynn is a traveler extraordinnaire!!!!!!!! And I got to see my BFF and her 15-month old, too. It was awesome. I have some, but not all, of the pics up on shutterfly.

Hey Kavita, guess where DH's hot #1 job prospect is?


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Awwww, did y'all DDDDC me? I feel so special!!!!


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Heh, I saw that go up a few days ago and wondered when you'd notice







I still owe Willemsmama a good one when she gets back online properly, I just can't beat Mary's.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

I haven't been online in about a week, but I noticed it right away!!! I







you Helen! By the way, I was thinking about you on our journey; while we were driving through southern Tennessee, we kept passing "Flapjacks Pancake House" - I wanted to stop and take a picture to send to you, but I never did.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

So far, knock wood, all of my kids have beautiful straight healthy wonderful teeth. Winter has a bit of a gap between his top front teeth but it adds character and it's not enough to be a problem. I had one cavity my entire life, so hopefully that's something I've passed on to my little ones.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Okay, so I feel like we know each other pretty well... but I stumbled across this thread and thought it looked like fun... Anybody else interested in being put in the spotlight? Maybe a new mama each week or month?


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Thanks for the fluoride links, Kristina & Sarah. I grew up on well water and with fluoride drops. My knowledge of fluoride is limited to my conversations with my old dentist who like to talk about nerdy things that we were both interested in- long conversations about the social determinants of health







Ingested fluoride has a small margin of "safe" use- too little doesn't help in preventing decay, too much causes fluorosis. I think that's why some "authorities" don't recomment fluoridated toothpaste for kiddos- since it's hard to know how much they might be ingesting. And to complicate things: some water has naturally occuring fluoride, and some water supply has added fluoride. It's worth calling your local water folks to ask about your supply if you drink tap water.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

Welcome back Amy!!!

We brush Finley's teeth almost every night with this baby toothpaste that doesn't have fluoride in it. It's good to talk about and think about. I've been worried that our teeth brushing isn't doing that much...I can't get him to really open his lips and really really get to the front of his top teeth, but hopefully I'm doing enough ? I might try the floss thing, soon, too. Q of C, do you just use regular floss with Killy? And so far, Finley's teeth are white and healthy.

I am so happy and so relieved, because tonight was my big late night out for rehearsal, the second night in Finley's life that I was away during his bedtime (the first one being a nightmare/disaster when he was 9 months old), and he did great!! He went to sleep with Alex...he took him out for a walk in his stroller, which is something they do, and he often naps with him during the day that way, and it worked tonight! I came home to him sleeping in the stroller, and he woke up a few minutes ago, and I was here, able to nurse him back to sleep in bed. I'm so happy and relieved to be home and by his side, and to know that it was fine. So I can do this play and not stress! I think it's gonna be fun and really good for me, too.

So much more to say, not nearly enough energy, so I'm gonna sign off for now and collapse...


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *s_kristina* 
Here is a link I just got about fluoride http://www.ada.org/prof/resources/po...de_infants.asp I haven't read all of it yet, but thought some of you might be interested in it.

thanks, yet another thing to read!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *spiritmomma* 
Okay, so I feel like we know each other pretty well... but I stumbled across this thread and thought it looked like fun... Anybody else interested in being put in the spotlight? Maybe a new mama each week or month?

i've seen it before and been intrigued. . .

Quote:


Originally Posted by *barcelona* 
We brush Finley's teeth almost every night with this baby toothpaste that doesn't have fluoride in it. It's good to talk about and think about. I've been worried that our teeth brushing isn't doing that much...I can't get him to really open his lips and really really get to the front of his top teeth, but hopefully I'm doing enough ?

we were in the same boat until about a month ago when keagan REFUSED to let us brush his teeth. it started when my DW began putting him to bed each night and "didn't know" we had a toothbrush for him. huh?! ah, well, that's my life.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Susannah M* 
it started when my DW began putting him to bed each night and "didn't know" we had a toothbrush for him. huh?! ah, well, that's my life.

My DH knew we had a toothbrush for her, but didn't know that we used it for anything but a teething toy! I mentioned about a friend's baby's dental problems, and he said "I guess we should start brushing her teeth soon."







: Luckily she likes it, and she's getting them brushed every night, even when mama is at work!

Neela had a night terror last night, I think. At the time I was worried that it was a strange seizure or something. It was horrible- like a crazed flailing tantrum with psycho baby eyes. After she finally calmed down, I called my MIL in the middle of the night to help calm DH and I down. Poor girl!

Then today she threw up all over in the middle of her nap. I left her lying in it, because I thought she needed the sleep more than the cleanliness. But when she woke up and I tried to bathe her, she had another major freak out. Screamed for milk, but pushed away when I tried to nurse her. She just sobbed and flailed for a few minutes.

My DH is sick. I'm still sick. I'm freaking exhausted. Sigh.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
Hey Mamas. I've been out of the loop for a couple of weeks now. Our house is getting ready to go on the market, and we've been scrambling to get everything ready (by we, I mean ME). Also DH is still running all around the country trying to get a job, and we drove to Atlanta last weekend (yes, drove a total of *13 hours in one day* with a 15-month old!). It was great though, and I have to say that Brynn is a traveler extraordinnaire!!!!!!!! And I got to see my BFF and her 15-month old, too. It was awesome. I have some, but not all, of the pics up on shutterfly.

Hey Kavita, guess where DH's hot #1 job prospect is?









Well, if it's in Tucson, I know of a great house for sale!









We're in the same boat, getting ready to list our house this coming week. Of course Ella has to be super clingy alternating with super wild now, so it's making it difficult for me to do anything much. And I'm also not feeling very well right now, so all in all it's a little bit of a bummer. DH was home from work Thursday and today to work on stuff, and I thought that he would be able to work out in the yard with Ella on his back for some of the time so that I could get stuff done in the house, but instead it turned out to be one of those things where he was running to the hardware store or the irrigation store or the nursery every ten minutes to get some part/plant/whatever that was needed. I had a cleaning lady come in yesterday, and that was okay, but it didn't work out to be as helpful as I'd hoped. I'd had her come before once when Ella was about 10 months or so and a lot had gotten done then, but I realized this time that it hadn't been the cleaning lady who'd done all that, but me! I'd been working alongside her the whole time and Ella was non-mobile and was fascinated with just sitting in her high chair and watching her clean or being on my back in the Kozy. This time I was really disappointed, because Ella was shrieky and impossible and I couldn't really do much at all, and it turns out the the cleaning lady was pretty slow and inefficient!! So the floor is clean and the microwave got wiped out and the stove got clean, but I'd wanted to do some more deep cleaning and it just didn't happen. I guess DH and I are going to have to just do it ourselves when Ella's asleep or something. I was really happy though because my friend took my baby alongside hers, and drove them around so that they could both nap and then took them to the mall and wheeled/carried them around and fed them and amused them for several hours so we could get some things done. So I did accomplish a little. Just not enough.

Do we have an "overwhelmed" smiley?


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
Well, if it's in Tucson, I know of a great house for sale!










No - Louisville!! He's going on the 3rd for his 3rd interview. Yay!


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Our house is going on the market hopefully the week after next (first full week of April). We had gotten it almost ready, ran into a hold-up, and now I feel like I'm starting from scratch. I'm completely overwhelmed!


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## SoulJourney (Sep 26, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
No - Louisville!! He's going on the 3rd for his 3rd interview. Yay!

Yay! You'll have to join us for camping, too!


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

*Barcelona* Yay for Finley and his papa! I love it when I am nervous about Joshua doing something with Isa that I normally do with her and it turns out better than I could have imagined. That's awesome that you won't be worrying about it anymore.
**Amy** I hope you come to Louisville so we can go camping! Keep us posted!
*MelW* Ugh... I hope _everyone_ is feeling better soon. Last week when I was sick, Joshua got a touch and so did Isa who was also teething... I feel your pain. I just hope it passes quickly!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Barcelona~ Congrats on the good time at bedtime. I was too self-absorbed yesterday to notice and post congrats. What a relief! Good luck with the play (or break a leg?)!

Amy~ I'm still rooting for Oregon, but I hope your DH's interview goes well


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

amy- why don't you put nc on your list of places to interview? please?

just reading along but i should be going to bed now.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Neela peed in the potty twice yesterday and twice again today. We're not ECing or even really potty learning, but I did tell her to let me know if she wanted to pee or poop in the potty. Two mornings in a row she's asked when we wake up, and then actually peed when I took her! Until now she's been asking a lot, but just sitting on it. Or peeing on the carpet when I let her have naked time. And this is a girl who loooves to be naked, so she may have rescued naked time for herself, since I was getting really fed up of pee all over the place


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Mel - that's awesome with the potty! Rowan likes to sit on her potty but only with her pants on - she doesn't like the feel of it on her bare bottom. She likes to run around naked too but we learned that if her bare feet touch a cold floor she'll pee whether she really needs to or not. So her naked time is kind of restricted to the living room where there's carpet. And yeah, we tried to take advantage of the floor thing to "catch" her pee but it just made her upset







So we stopped - we'll potty learn when she's ready.

Barcelona - I'm so glad Finley was fine with your absence for an evening! That takes a load off your mind, doesn't it?

Good luck everyone with the house selling/buying/moving.









I bought a copy of NCSS for toddlers today. So far I've learned that my current practise of letting Rowan sleep til she wakes up in the morning is probably not helping her sleep well at night, and she's going to bed too late (which I kind of knew). The problem is she goes to bed right after dinner - we are going to have to get our act together to get dinner on the table earlier. Which would be easier if I could get home from work earlier, which I could do if I could get into work earlier in the morning, which I could do if Rowan woke up earlier... we'll see how this goes. I hate to wake my sleeping baby but if it helps nighttime go easier, I'm all for it. So tomorrow morning she'll be up at 7:30, even though she didn't go to sleep until 9 this evening. Of course that means I have to get up at 7:30 too and I don't even have to go to work tomorrow - my sister is visiting and I took a vacation day. Oh well, it just means I get to be conscious for more of my vacation day, right???


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Gunter, I would if I had any choice in the matter!! I love it out there!

Spughy, all I can say is UGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. We are of course not really doing any better in the sleep department. We're still using the PnP most of the time, but her average sleep stretch, despite *everything* we've done, is still around 2 hours. Last night was a "good" night in that she slept for 3.5 hours the first time, then around 2-3 for the rest of the night. But she did chow down right before bed time last night, and ate *a lot*, so that probably helped. But she's still working on 2 molars and one incisor, so I just don't have much hope for anything else. I've kind of given up on trying for much more, to be honest. We've done everything short of literally letting her cry it out, and I've just really started to think this is who she is right now, no matter what we do. (Oh, and she didn't sleep any better while we were traveling this time.)

That's interesting that it says that letting her sleep in later in the morning may be detrimental -- only because Brynn usually wakes up on her own around 7:30am (with a 9:00 bedtime) and it doesn't seem to make any difference with her. Naps don't matter either; she can sleep for 45 minutes during the day up to 3+ hours, and it never influences how she sleeps at night.

I'm not trying to be negative though!! I am excited to hear how it goes for you and keeping my fingers crossed that you will see *some* improvement!!! Keep us updated.


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## barcelona (May 1, 2006)

thanks, everyone, for sharing the relief and joy that finley can survive evenings with papa...now i can rehearse in peace (though of course i'll still worry a bit). so far, the play is going well and i'm really glad i'm doing it. it feels great to be creative again, and to do a comedy is a great outlet. and the cast is fantastic, and it's good to be in touch with my deaf friends and community again.

we still have a lot to figure out, in terms of our life and career, etc., but it is coming together, slowly but surely. i don't think we'll be moving to LA this year (yay!). we can't sublet our apartment, and i don't think we're that desperate yet to move again (just moved last year), and go through all that mess.

anyway.

melW, i really hope you're all healthy and well now. that sounds exhausting and awful. that is exciting about the potty progress, though! we haven't even started that at all...and keep meaning to get something.

speaking of, do any of you use the seats on the grown up potty instead of getting a separate little one? does it work? we were thinking of doing this with a step stool.

spughy, i'm sorry you're still having sleep issues! and amy, i'm sorry you guys are too, though hopefully there is some peace in just accepting it for now . it does seem like there are still so many developmental things happening, and teeth coming in, etc, until they are 2, that it seems really difficult to instill anything that regular in terms of sleep. finley really goes back and forth, still, as he has for many months now: some nights are amazing, and others, he's up quite a bit. last night was a good night--slept from 9 to 2 am, and then woke twice, i think, til the morning. it was really interesting, though, cause we fell asleep last night when he did and he didn't wake up at all...normally, i go out and we have grown up time, and he wakes up once or twice til i come to bed. interesting that he didn't budge when we were with him. i think he was also very tired, cause we had a big day.

we went to the central park zoo yesterday, which was so fun! we hadn't been since he was about ten months old. he loved the monkeys, and then really loved the "children's zoo" where they had farm animals. that was right up his alley. i think his favorite was the cow. the sea lions were overwhelming, and he said "bye bye" when they came out of the water, which means he's a bit scared and wants to go. we stood further back, and he was able to enjoy them, though.

i also had a photoshoot, which i did for a friend, and am barely charging them, so that was both fun and challenging. it was my first time working with older kids (6 and 8) that i didn't really know. so it was a lot more challenging to get them to open up and really show themselves to me for me to capture. but i think i got some good ones, so hopefully i won't disappoint.

i'm at a delightful place called the tea lounge while alex (dh) plays with finley at the playground. it's a wonderful break, and i am feeling my mind clear up. and it's making me be quite chatty on here today









amy, can't wait to hear where you guys move...what a big mystery just around the corner. i hope it all works out beautifully. i can't imagine packing up the house with a toddler.

and i'm jealous of all you mamas going camping together! if only we weren't so far away...

spiritmomma, i'm all for the "spotlight" thing. how do we do it? let's start! do we do a november DDC spotlight thread, separate of this one?

thanks for listening to my ramblings...
hope everyone is having a peaceful or at least joyful start to the week!


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Mel - that's awesome with the potty! Rowan likes to sit on her potty but only with her pants on - she doesn't like the feel of it on her bare bottom.

Ha ha, potty stuff is fun, isn't it? Ella was doing okay with a little relaxed late EC/early potty accustomization, but now she is too busy to be bothered with it. The bathroom is the Promised Land for her--coveted and forbidden!







She loves pulling everything from the vanity drawers and throwing it all into the tub, and pulling the toilet paper all off the roll, and bonding with the toilet. And she figured out that it is fun to sit on the baby bjorn little potty, and scoot herself around on it with her feet. So she doesn't sit still long enough to actually go potty on it anymore! And there is very little funnier than seeing her "driving" her potty out of the bathroom and around the house!









I just found out today that the movers DH's job will be using will pack up our house for us and do all that work. Woo hoo! I was stressing about that. I'll probably pack some of the things myself anyway, but a lot of crap I'll be more than happy to leave for someone else to do. We are soooo busy with this whole house situation. DH took a couple of sick days from work Thu-Fri (with the blessing of his boss) to work on the house and supervise the general melee. We're having pictures and a virtual tour taken this week for the MLS listing, so we've been working like crazy to get everything in order. It's coming together, though, and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. Once we get everything established, we'll just have to worry about maintenance and showing and then going to Louisville and finding a place to live . . . . Oh, the kicker of course is that DH, although he knows that he is going to be employed there and has a general idea of what his salary and job title will be, STILL does not have a formal offer letter yet! At this point, Amy's husband will probably have a job offer before DH does and get moved to Louisville before we do. Which is good, because we can't get a mortgage and buy a house or sign a rental agreement without that offer letter, and so we will probably be trying to set up camp in her basement after they move!!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

All hopes of catching up are blasted away by the 11+ pages. I guess it's a good that it's nearly April, but starting out April with a wedding and a vacation is gonna start me off behind again.

The wedding is next week. YAY!! We tried Jacob's suit on last night. Be still my beating heart...my baby looks all grown up









We haven't started with the potty yet, but Jacob is showing signs of being ready to try...I need to give him the opportunity more. He has a couple of times while his diaper is off gone up and peed on the toilet standing next to it. I guess that's as close as he can get right now.

I'm so ready for the wedding to be over and for us to just be married. it is cool that everything is coming together and it is going to fly by. I hope I remember some of it. We have an awesome photographer so that will be great.

okay i gotta get back to work...ttyl all!!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Kaspirant - good luck with all the wedding prep! You WILL post pics here afterwards, right???

I got Rowan to sleep early-ish last night - started bedtime around 7:15 and she actually fell asleep at about 8. She slept not too badly - didn't wake up til 10, then again at 11, then one good 4-hour stretch between 11 and 3. She was up at 7 which was good. Hopefully we can keep this sort of routine up (although maybe with some faster falling-asleep action).

I feel like I'm coming down with another cold, thanks to my sister who brought one with her to visit


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Kaspirant - good luck with all the wedding prep! You WILL post pics here afterwards, right???


YES!!! OMG i can't believe it's _next week!!!_

I feel bad coming here and drive by sharing wedding excitement without knowing what's going on with our kiddos.

I feel self centered and it sucks. I promise to be back...with out all the *me* posts soon!!!

and I'm taking friday OFF work. I need a break and Adam's family is flying in Monday so I want a day to get myself internally ready for the hectic that is going to be next week....AND....DF booked us a spa day for the day before the wedding. Look at what an AWESOME DF I have....this is what I'm doing the day before the [email protected]@@

Quote:

FOR THE BRIDE 160 minutes
aroma steam shower • 60 minute massage • Caribbean spa manicure • Caribbean spa pedicure • AVEDA deep conditioning treatment • shampoo • style

FOR THE GROOM 160 minutes
aroma steam shower • 60 minute massage • executive manicure • executive pedicure • hot aroma towel shave • men's cut • style

Okay so I promise to update and be much less scatter brained and much more involved once this is all done!!!

ttyl ladies!! miss you all and reading about all our little "big" kids.


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
I got Rowan to sleep early-ish last night - started bedtime around 7:15 and she actually fell asleep at about 8. She slept not too badly - didn't wake up til 10, then again at 11, then one good 4-hour stretch between 11 and 3. She was up at 7 which was good. Hopefully we can keep this sort of routine up (although maybe with some faster falling-asleep action).

Have you read "Sleepless in America"? She's a huge advocate of early to bed and early to rise. And consistency with naptimes, etc. I think the book is a bit more suited to older kids, but it's an interesting read anyways. The take home messages for us were: changes in "schedules" take a long time for kids to adjust their clocks, and re-inforcing the importance of exercise and exposure to natural light, especially in the mornings.

kaspirant~ Have a terrific spa day. I am officially jealous!

We're feeling much better here, finally. We've also started exercising as a family again, with some short runs in the morning. Neela loves her bike trailer/jogging stroller, and yells out "run...fast" as we start


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

We had a really rough night tonight. It is so hard when DH is gone; I never get a break. I think Brynn is officially entering the Trying Tumultuous Twos.















:


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

just reading along.

ez peed and pooped on the pot today. she also peed on the deck and pooped on the deck. can we say "poop deck"?







i am still doing double-takes when she actually can sit herself down on it without a lot of prompting from me. most times, she starts to pee somewhere and i pick her up or throw the potty up under her. we spend a lot of time outside and she doesn't wear bottoms. we have brick floors inside so it makes clean up so much easier!

i am working on my doula certification still. i just found out that one friend who i will doula for is switching from a birth center to a homebirth!!! i am so stoked. she was going back and forth about it, mainly b/c medicaid pays for the birth center but not homebirth. now, it's totally a homebirth plan!

in the next month, i hope to be a more official part of that breastfeeding organization, the one i can't really talk about, you know.









i feel like i have been reading my eyes out for those two things recently. i only have the VBAC Companion left on my doula list but i have to order it first. Off to do that now.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Huh? Is there a reason we can't really talk about LLL on here?
Good luck with the doula certification. I keep thinking about training, but I don't think this is the right time in my life right now. I'm supporting an antenatal class next month so I'll see how that goes.
Amy, two is much easier than one. Two year olds can TALK. One year olds have to assume that we're intelligent enough to figure out what they mean. Skye bit me during a tantrum last night when I didn't respond fast enough







Poor sod (well, sods really. Her teeth are really sharp.)
My chat with the school nurse yesterday went - well. Apparently I should give him a piece of pasta in a pot when he gets home from school if he didn't have a tantrum on the way into school. I kid you not, this is what she said.
God bless the NHS.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

LLL Leaders are NOT supposed to identify themselves online in communities where they might be in a position where they would ever ask for advice regarding breastfeeding. Also, some groups are REALLY uptight about Leader Applicants revealing that they're in the application process, its supposed to be hush-hush until you're accredited.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
We had a really rough night tonight. It is so hard when DH is gone; I never get a break. I think Brynn is officially entering the Trying Tumultuous Twos.















:

sometimes i feel that way, too. ez will scream "NOOOO" and it doesn't make sense to me why she is doing that in the particular situation. ugh.


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## MamaFern (Dec 13, 2003)

in my more than 5 years of knowing and going to the LLL i never ever knew that..weird.

ngaio is doing really well. she actually slept most of the night on elwynns old bed. she fell asleep in my arms so i put her on there, with no diaper, because she was bare bum and i didnt want to wake her.. she slept a long time, till like 4am and woke up dry! when she woke up i put a diaper on her (she still wont pee in the night..she just yells at me) and when i was done she said "all done. milkies?" then i nursed her for about 5 minutes then she rolled over and went back to sleep till 6:15. its actually sort of a miracle for us. usually she nurses all night.
she is getting 4 new teeth.. those pointy fangy ones







that seem to be really painful. i remember elwynn teething his canines and it was hellish.. its the only teething that i remember. even his molars popped in without me even knowing.

ngaio is talking so much! she repeats almost every word and a lot of phrases. she has some favorite words like No way! and why?







and started saying elwnn which just melts my heart.. she says it like elweeeen. its tvery cute.

her new favorite thing is the "bum bum" or better known as the trampoline. she runs outside any chance she gets and climbs up (its got netting all around so its pretty safe) and is getting good at walking around on it and jumping too!

we were away for a week, checking out our new house and visiting with the inlaws, or as i like to call them, my outlaws







no offense meant. they all all very nice.....

its a daycare day. blah. im looking forward to friday saturday and sunday







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Queen of Cups* 
LLL Leaders are NOT supposed to identify themselves online in communities where they might be in a position where they would ever ask for advice regarding breastfeeding. Also, some groups are REALLY uptight about Leader Applicants revealing that they're in the application process, its supposed to be hush-hush until you're accredited.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaFern* 
in my more than 5 years of knowing and going to the LLL i never ever knew that..weird.

Its in the Leader Handbook.


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## DreamsInDigital (Sep 18, 2003)

Winter is *still* teething his bottom first molars and top cuspids. He's sleeping fine at night but during the day his mood is just up and down all day. One minute he's fine, playing and happy and then his fingers go in his mouth and he starts just wailing his poor little head off. I feel so bad for him and I want those darn teeth to come in and let my poor baby feel better already.
I got my Babyhawk Mei Tai yesterday and as soon as I put Winter in it, we both fell in love with it. He LOVES being carried on my back.
I had to pick up my 3 1/2 year old the other day and then immediately afterwards I picked up Winter and realized that Winter weighs more than his bigger brother.







I don't weigh my kids very often so I don't know how much they weigh but man, Winter is a big sturdy kid.


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Fern, Rowan is getting more of her "fangs" too. One is fully in but now the other 3 - all of them - are showing little white points in her gums. Last night was horrible - she wouldn't settle in her crib and had to snuggle all night, although oddly she didn't need to nurse. At one point she was snuggled up to me and patted my boobs and said "boo? boo?" a bunch of times but her eyes were closed and I just ignored her and lay really still and she went to sleep. Then she woke up fully at 3, I nursed her and took her out to DH so I could get some good sleep. He brought her back at 6:30 - she'd been up since 5:30. She just will NOT go back to sleep for DH anymore.







: But I'm borderline today for being able to be functional at work - I just don't know what to do. If I get LESS productive at work my boss will start to notice and I'll get a talking-to. He's very sympathetic about stuff like this - he's up most nights with his 3-year old - but there's a limit. But I don't feel right about giving her to DH at night if she's not going to sleep, because that's depriving her of sleep.

Gunter - "poop deck"







snort


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

OK, that does it. I am definitely, definitely EC-ing the next baby, whenever it may come along (15dpo and still not late, for those following the saga.) I can't even put my 6yo in bed for a few hours without lots of changing of sheets








According to the school nurse, all I have to do is put a piece of pasta in a jar and Isaac will magically behave for me. I think that's funny, myself, but I couldn't find the words to describe non-coercive parenting without hitting her over the head with a dangerous toy snake and calling her a simplistic idiot.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Pasta? What the hell?


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Um... huh? I'm totally lost! Pasta in a jar?


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Will pasta make Rowan sleep? I'm pretty anti-pasta for nutritional reasons but I have only minor aesthetic objections to pasta in a jar.


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

pasta? I don't get it either... where's my wikipedia link?


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## flyingspaghettimama (Dec 18, 2001)

flapjack, you were just lucky enough to have your NHS nurse be a certified pastafarian.

Next time you see her, just say RA-men.

We are having so very many no sleeping nights here. No sleeping! Ever! No naps all day! So much fun to talk talk talk talk talk about and never sleep!

I can't wait to nightwean. I count down the months, mentally. Well, and all those fangs have to pop out.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

so, i nurse ez to sleep in the car and then bring her into our house. i put her gently into our family bed. she sleeps for hours. we entertain our friend and drink beers.

she wakes up crying and i nurse her back to sleep. i am careful not to move an inch although my body is twisted and tangled up like a pretzel gone crazy. she wakes up crying and i, again nurse her back to sleep being very careful to not rouse her or move or think about my very full bladder which i desperately need to empty and she is kicking. i nurse, nurse, nurse. she is falling asleep ever so slowly. i am mentally begging her to fall asleep so i can pee. i have to pee so bad now.

dh come to bed and lies down on the other side of us. he asks me a question and i put my one finger to his mouth to give him the, "shush, baby is *almost* asleep. don't say anything to wreck this up." he gets the cue and is quiet. she is asleep with her head at our tummies on top of the comforter. i am so thankful that in about 5 seconds, i will muster all of my stealth mom skills and quietly roll out of bed one body limb at a time to avoid waking her at any cost. i have worked so hard for so long to get her to sleep and my bladder is about to burst.

BUT THEN, dh lifts the comforter to pull it up over his shoulder, thus rousing the baby and waking her into a full screaming cry. ARGHHHHHH!!!

sound familiar? do they have any idea how hard we work to get the babes to sleep and how easily it can all be shot?







: back to nursing her to sleep, again for the third separate time in twenty minutes. each time, i thought she was out and was ready to head out myself. i love him for so many reasons, really i do.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Have you tried telling him that one of the babies in your DDC sleeps with her hands wrapped around daddy's bicep and instead of nursing to sleep gets cuddled to sleep by daddy every night, taking up some 3 hours of his useable day? That might do it... (it's not true any more, but it was for a long time.)
The pasta is apparently a reward chart type thing, and three or four or ten pieces of pasta qualify Isaac for a treat (apparently, pasta is not a treat). She's completely overlooking the fact that
a) Every single piece of literature on reward charts says that if you give the reward 6 hours later, it's absolutely worthless
b) We aim for non-coercive parenting.
c) The reason Isaac chooses to refuse to go to school in the morning is because he's fed up with people chasing him round the playground like a rabbit on a whippet track. If he could just be given the skills to say "no, I don't want to play any more" then the issue would go away. Pasta versus a strapping lug of a 7yo who's nearly a foot taller than him? Not EVER going to happen...
d) He'd probably eat raw pasta


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Thanks for the explanation, Helen. It's still wacky, but less surrealistically so now. Pastafarian indeed. People are so strange.

Gunter - I SO know the pain of the full bladder and the almost-asleep child. And the husband who mostly gets it but just not quite. In our house it's the bringing a load of wood in and dropping it in front of the fireplace so it makes a big noise and wakes the baby up. Or letting the dog come in wearing her collar and having her shake right next to the baby's head.

Last night Rowan slept pretty well. But, in the bed with me. I could not get her to settle in her crib. So I am a zombie today. Also I was on my computer last night helping someone with their major-important-project-that-must-be-done-tomorrow so I figure I can justify taking the afternoon off 'sick'. The functioning part of my brain has already checked out for the day and is in a bar somewhere, sleeping in a puddle of beer. The remaining part is sufficient for getting coffee and logging on to MDC but I think that's as far as it's going to go.

Oh yeah and my mom is visiting so DH is all cranky and sullen so home life is SOOOO much fun right now. I wish he wouldn't do that, but objectively I do have to admit that she can be a little annoying. However, she doesn't live here, I only get to see her a couple times a year, and I have to interact with HIS mother who also has her moments ALL THE TIME so he can damn well suck it up.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Spughy.
Just a thought- when we visit my mum, she tends to end up with one (or more) small people tucked up in bed with her. You could maybe kill two birds with one stone?


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

It's a good thought, Helen, but Rowan isn't too comfortable around my mom just yet because she sees her so rarely. If she won't sleep for DH, she DEFINITELY won't sleep for my mom.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *spughy* 
Or letting the dog come in wearing her collar and having her shake right next to the baby's head.

yep, that happens at our house, too! arghhh! our dog doens't even wear a collar on a regular basis anymore but when he does and shakes near the sleeping babe, i have to remind myself out loud that i am both a pacifist and a vegetarian. otherwise, we could be having dog for dinner.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
We had a really rough night tonight. It is so hard when DH is gone; I never get a break. I think Brynn is officially entering the Trying Tumultuous Twos.















:










keagan definately has days like this too. it is hard.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Queen of Cups* 
LLL Leaders are NOT supposed to identify themselves online in communities where they might be in a position where they would ever ask for advice regarding breastfeeding. Also, some groups are REALLY uptight about Leader Applicants revealing that they're in the application process, its supposed to be hush-hush until you're accredited.









doesn't make sense to me. of course i have never been to a meeting or anything but isn't the purpose of LLL somewhere along the lines of helping women learn what they need to know to feed their babes as nature intended? if this is the case how could giving info be a bad thing?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
According to the school nurse, all I have to do is put a piece of pasta in a jar and Isaac will magically behave for me. I think that's funny, myself, but I couldn't find the words to describe non-coercive parenting without hitting her over the head with a dangerous toy snake and calling her a simplistic idiot.

i read the update and still don't get it. apparently i would not make a good pastafarian


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

Susanna - I PMed you to explain more in depth.

UGH! We just had a horrible trip to the grocery store. And, I'm a dirty coercive parent because I did not buy Killy a toy after he scratched the hell out of Ellie's face while we shopped. So, there was a 30 minute tantrum. But, I'm surely not rewarding nasty behavior by buying toys 5 minutes after it happens.

Off to go play in the yard with the kids so we can all cool off.


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## Kavita (Dec 7, 2004)

Q of C, sounds tough! Hope that the playing in the yard was fun anyway!

Spughy, I hope that your DD starts sleeping better and that you can get some rest! It's so embarassing when you fall asleep at work and start drooling on your desk!









Things here are crazy. The highlight--we had a plumber here to fix something that was leaking to outside the house and he had to go up into the attic. This is not the type of attic that you store stuff, etc., just where the electrical and plumbing stuff is. I am standing there in my house and I hear this "AAAAAAUGH!" and a cracking noise and I turn around in time to see my plumber's foot and leg coming through the ceiling of our family room accompanied by ton of breaking sheetrock and a huge mushroom cloud of insulation being dumped on the ground. The plumber was okay, he caught himself on a beam and did not actually fall onto my floor. So then tomorrow we're having someone come to finish the painting the kitchen and laundry room and putting them back together and then painting the hallway, the same plumbing company coming to put in a new water heater, and a sheet rock guy from a construction company coming to repair the ceiling.







: We're going to L'ville to look for a house on the 17th of April. Hope that we get a quick and good offer before then on this house!


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## MelW (Jan 13, 2005)

: following along with the pasta saga....

Kavita! I hope your house repairs go more smoothly from here on.

We drove to the coast today and Neela played naked in tidal pools. And dipped her feet in the ocean. It was terrific, but we're totally entrenched in the napping at home routine. So despite my amazing timing for napping in the car on the way there, she stayed awake all day until the ride home, and is now awake and not even close to sleepy. I love day trips, but they totally mess up any routine we have.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

OMG, Kavita - I would just die! Our house is (hopefully!) going on the market next week, but our real estate agent was adamant that we were not to spend any money fixing the house up, as the market is slow (at least in this area) and we're not likely to re-coup expenses. I was thrilled to hear that actually - it saved a lot of stress from situations like you're describing! And, its probably saved me from killing DH who would LOVE an excuse to spend several thousand dollars doing home improvement projects on a house we're only going to live in for a couple more months.







:

Well, the evening got better, mostly because I had a meeting to go to without the kiddos. We played in the yard, had a nice dinner, and then I went to my meeting, and got home just in time to nurse Ellie down. Ahhhhh... I'm feeling much better now.


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Things are still really hard here. DH and I are at the point where we need to have a serious parenting strategy session but he's been so busy with working on getting a job, not to mention all the damn traveling, that I feel we haven't had a moment in the past week to really talk. Last night was AWFUL though.









Kavita, that's crazy about your house!!! How stressful (although comedic in the retelling).









Anyway, here is the short list of places where DH is having 2nd and 3rd interviews:

St. Louis this past Tuesday (Kaspirant!!)
San Jose this coming Monday
Louisville next Thursday (Kavita!)
Atlanta next Friday or the following Monday

And if none of those work out, we are just going to go with Plan B and move in with my parents in Oregon until further notice! So I feel good. At least I have a general sense that we're not moving somewhere crazy; I feel good about all of our options for varied reasons.







Possibly by the end of next week, by definitely by two weeks from now, we will know where we're moving!!! SO EXCITING!


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Q of C - you're not a dirty coercive parent







. I'm all over unconditional parenting but buying a kid a toy after he did something like that doesn't seem right to me. Alfie Kohn would have a hard time justifying that one, I think!

Amy -







. I share your nighttime misery. And we are a month or two behind you on the moving uncertainty, I think. You're lucky the uncertainty will be ending soon. Ours is just beginning - DH's thesis will be "officially" submitted in the next few days I think and then his job hunt begins. That's not likely to be stressful, not at all.














:

Kavita - OMG on the plumbers falling through your roof!!!! DH did that to our downstairs neighbour when he was working on the deck a couple years ago. Scared the poop out of her. (well not literally.)

Last night was no better. Hylands teething tablets either don't work for us or it's not actually teething that's causing her restless sleep. I did switch places with DH at about 4 last night and slept on the couch and Rowan did sleep ok with him in the bed so I think I'll do that earlier on tonight.


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## nov05mama (Mar 29, 2007)

I am new to this site...
I have a November '05 babe! I was wondering if I could join in?
My name is Gabriele and my DH is Joe. We have been married for almost 6 yrs. We have been TTC since 2002. We conceived our first after 13 months TTC, but I m/c at 12 wks. Then it took us another 15 months to conceive my Nov baby. We have been TTC again for over 10 months and are HOPEFULLY pregnant. I got a FAINT positive the other day, and I haven't tested again yet since its still so early...I am keeping my fingers crossed...
I have been a SAHM since just before my son was born (I left work about 2 wks pre delivery), but I have a personal business website for making invitations and announcments (and more)...The link is in my sig!
Before that I was an Assistant Manager at Michaels Art & Crafts for 5 yrs. And before that I was a Pre-School teacher.
So, that is me in a nutshell...


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Welcome, Gabriele! Come, join our teething/moving/not-sleeping hell!









Hope your







pans out for you. We've had one new arrival in this group (DreamsInDigital) since we had our Nov babes and there are a couple more trying, I think. I am NOT one of them


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Welcome Gabriele! I saw you post in Dec...I'm currently on planet "too scared to test." I'm now 18dpo and STILL not late, which according to TCOYF makes me either pregnant or a freak, but I'm trying to hang on in there until CD30. (I've had two miscarriages recently, both on the full moon, and I ovulated very early this month- CD9 instead of 19.)
Trmptplaya's next, isn't she? Then sprgrl...is it tragic that I check zjande's chart with as much attention as I do my own?
Amy, I like plan C, which is the one where you move to England and hang out with us lots







Just saying...
Kavita, good luck with the move


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Queen of Cups* 
Susanna - I PMed you to explain more in depth.

got, it. thanks!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Kavita* 
Things here are crazy. The highlight--we had a plumber here

this totally sounds like something that would happen in my house








it was built in 1910 and let's just say some things are still original









Quote:


Originally Posted by *nov05mama* 







I am new to this site...

welcome, gabriele


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

*HERE COMES THE BRIDE!!























Happy wedding day, Alicia!!! I am thinking of you today!*

So I started my period sometime in the middle of the night. This explains so much about my feelings this past week. I'm really kind of irritated with how irregular my period still is (18 days last month, 30 this month!







: ) because it's so unpredictable. But at least I know I'm not losing my mind.

Flapjack, I'll float that idea to DH and see what he says.









Mel, sounds like you had a lovely day!

Welcome Gabriele! Good luck on your BFP!


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 

*HERE COMES THE BRIDE!!























Happy wedding day, Alicia!!! I am thinking of you today!*


I feel so special.

The wedding is actually on Wednesday. But we can celebrate now!!


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Oh, duh!! I was actually going to check your signature (didn't you used to have the date?) but it didn't say, so I thought it was today since it's Saturday and all.









I'll just repost that on Wednesday then.







But, happy 3 days til your wedding!!!!!!!!

I'm such a dork.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Hey, it's Alicia's virtual hen night








And I'm on the virtual orange juice














:







:







:














:


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## kaspirant (Apr 28, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
Oh, duh!! I was actually going to check your signature (didn't you used to have the date?) but it didn't say, so I thought it was today since it's Saturday and all.










I'll just repost that on Wednesday then.







But, happy 3 days til your wedding!!!!!!!!

I'm such a dork.

Nope no dork feeling allowed. You thought of me...I feel so special!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
Hey, it's Alicia's virtual hen night








And I'm on the virtual orange juice














:







:







:














:


Oooh now this sounds like fun ladies


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## spiritmomma (Aug 29, 2005)

Hey everybody!
Sounds like lots of families are in transition this week...
Amy: Hope you guys get some concrete news soon... Good luck to your DH as he interviews these next few times. Sorry about the parenting woes, hope you guys get a chance to check in with each other soon. That's hard. It will work out, though, and you WILL find some peace and time to talk.

Alicia: It's AAAAAALLLLMOST Wednesday! How exciting! Are you sleeping, or are you way too excited. I can hardly wait to see the pictures!








Gabriele! Glad to have you!~

Isa is doing some new things, so I thought I'd share. She is using _actual words!_ She has begun saying _down_ and pointing to the ground when she wants to run free but is being held. She also says "sssss" while she signs juice. It's a start







Other than that, it's been run run run all day either at the Children's Museum or the Park. We've been having some really fun days.


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## Phoenix_Rising (Jun 27, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by **Amy** 
So I started my period sometime in the middle of the night. This explains so much about my feelings this past week. I'm really kind of irritated with how irregular my period still is (18 days last month, 30 this month!







: ) because it's so unpredictable. But at least I know I'm not losing my mind.

um, yeah. i just got my period for the first time postpartum. and boy, have my moods been showing it! i hate that part.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *flapjack* 
And I'm on the virtual orange juice














:







:







:














:

???? did i miss something important ????


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

Hello mamas! Kaspirant, I'm so excited for you!!! I hope your wedding is beautiful and blissful and wonderful.

Spiritmomma - yay real words!! Rowan's been saying a lot more identifiable things lately too. Bus, duck, Mog (her new favourite book), Daisy, Dada, up, hop on pop (it really does sound like that - it's her other new favourite book), apple, date, etc. This morning she even said "Ma!" and pointed at me









My mom is visiting and it's going so-so. She let Rowan scream at the top of the stairs for me when I took laundry downstairs - I thought she was going to get her and Rowan was just resisting Granny's attempts at pacification, but NO, when I got back upstairs (albeit less than a minute later) Rowan was still screaming for me at the baby gate and my mom was sitting on the couch knitting. Then she had the gall to say something to the effect of "you're going to have to let her do a whole lot more of THAT" and I just yelled "What the hell are you TALKING ABOUT??" at her then realized that was just upsetting Rowan more so I took her into the bedroom and cuddled and nursed her. Whereupon she fell asleep, 3 hours before she was due for a nap. I considered having the "our parenting style is not yours and you'd damn well better respect ours if you ever want to look after Rowan" talk with my dear ma but I was all calmed down and mellow after our cuddles and I decided not to pick a fight right then, because we'd probably wake Rowan up. So I will bait her later this evening when DH comes home and describe what happened from Rowan's point of view, which will probably get my mom to say something rude and inappropriate at which point I will tell her off. Is that wrong???









Rowan's sleeping again - it's a two-nap day. Oh, but I almost forgot the really good thing that happened - yesterday we took the little bug for a looooong walk in the morning then her daddy took her for another loooong walk in the afternoon and she slept all night last night in her crib -woke up at 12:30 and 5:30 and not a peep out of her the rest of the night! Woohoo! So today - more running around for our girl. I was suspecting she wasn't getting enough exercise and it looks like I was right. Amy - it's worth a try for you guys too - get Brynn outside and make her run around for at least 2 hour and a half stretches, and see if that doesn't make her sleep better! And never mind the weird looks from people with strollers.


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## Gunter (May 5, 2005)

kavita- that is complete craziness about your house! i would freak out.

gabrielle- i live near you; we are in the triangle area.

gotta take the babe to bed with me...hope to catch up later.


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## Queen of Cups (Aug 29, 2003)

I agree about exercise being necessary. We go out almost every morning and every afternoon to wear Killy out. The park, the children's farmstead, the children's musuem, the zoo, the pool (during the summer), the library, the science museum... We visit them all, almost all on a weekly basis! There are three parks within a mile of our house and we visit one almost every day! As long as its over 40 degrees, we go outside! If its under 40 or its raining, we go play at the mall (I walk for exercise with the kids in the stroller, then they play in the play area). Oh, and we usually spend a couple hours outside every day playing in the yard. But Killy still doesn't sleep through the night and he's almost three!







:


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Susannah- yep, you're right, that was the announcement. And everyone else missed it







But I started bleeding right when I should have anyhow, so things obviously weren't meant to be







:


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## *Amy* (Jun 16, 2004)

Awww Helen.














The emotional roller coaster of TTC is *so* hard.

QoC & Spughy - I've had the same thoughts about exercise, but it seems like even when I know she's totally worn out, she still sleeps as poorly as ever. It does make a difference with naps, though, but not night-time sleep.







: That being said, exercise is important enough in its own right, so I try to get her out as much as possible now that the weather is warm enough!

Oh, and Spughy, that is hard about your mom. I don't think it's wrong to wait and pick a fight though.









Susannah, isn't it the worst!?? I was telling DH, I never had PMS this bad before I had Brynn! And then I was like, well, yeah; I wasn't sleep deprived then, either, and I could also get away and be by myself when I needed to, or just zone out and watch TV, read, etc. I told DH we need to have a strategy for next month so that I get some relief *before* things get so bad!!

Has anyone started an April thread yet?


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

Nope. Bad things happen when I start threads







Besides, the longer I can pretend it's March, the further away my birthday seems







:
Amy, thanks for the hugs. I just find it so overwhelming that in my early twenties my life was a complete mess and if my then husband so much as sneezed, I'd be pregnant, contraception or no. Now at close-on-30 and with a lot of friends struggling with the peri-menopause, I really want another one and it doesn't seem to be happening


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## spughy (Jun 28, 2005)

New thread here...


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