# When "shy" is just plain RUDE!



## MacKinnon (Jun 15, 2004)

My DD is just now 5, heading to Kindy in the fall. She has always been very willful and somewhat of a handful at home. At preschool she has been shy but extremely well behaved, she's never been in trouble in two years. The problem is mostly public situations with adults (friends or strangers), she is rude, just downright rude. I have felt that it is shyness, and we have talked alot about how to handle this best.

It started as a 2 year old growling at the cashier (which they often thought was funny, that didn't help!), she hides from her Grandparents (whom she sees weekly, they aren't strangers and aren't pushy with her at all), makes "Hmmph" noises and turns her head when adults try to speak to her, hides behind me if an adult bends down to her level, etc. We warn her when we are approaching a situation and try to prepare her as much as we can, "Auntie will be there, etc." We talk about appropriate behavior and her options "They will say hi, I can explain that you aren't ready to talk yet but growling at our family is not a choice." We talk about things that might happen "They will probably notice your new haircut. What do you want me to do or say to help make you more comfortable?" After she warms up, she's fine. She's fine, polite and funny. She ends up being a real ham in most cases. But in new or unexpected situations, she is awful. And sometimes just unexpectedly, like picking up DS from the sitters- some days she'll just refuse to speak, snarl at the other kids (her friends), etc. I ask every day if she wants to come in or wait in the car, and she'll choose to come in (despite my reminders) and then hmmph at the kids.

My tipping point was when I took her to DS's playgroup yesterday. Usually DS goes with the babysitter, DD is at preschool and I am at work. But, I was off yesterday, so we all went. DD was at her worst. She refused to speak to any of the adults, she snatched toys from the babies, only spoke with one or two words (example- red ball), stomped around glowering with her arms crossed, it was bad and if I hadn't had to drag her through 3 floors of the LIBRARY to leave, I would have.

At 5, I just feel like she is too old for this continued rudeness in all unfamiliar or new situations. I'm worried about what will happen at Kindergarten and how she will manage to handle her growing exposure to the world outside our home. I can't predict everything and would really like to have her at least not be rude when an old friend says hi at the grocery store unexpectedly. Has anyone dealt with this? How do I help her settle down? What is reasonable to expect from her in terms of interacting with adults at 5?


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I honestly don't know what advice to give you, but I think that focusing on her age is a mistake. DD is very similar in many ways (she'll be 6 in May). We continue to talk to her and encourage her to be more polite, etc. However, this isn't about age. It's about temperament and emotional maturity...and that really can't be forced.

I've been lucky in that we have the ability to homeschool. I'm doing that for at least a few years, so that her emotional maturity has a chance to catch up with societal expectations for her chronological age, which it hasn't done yet. However, I know that not everybody has that option....

Good luck. I do sympathise.


----------



## 3*is*magic (Sep 13, 2007)

A random question - does she only do it when you are around? Like, is it for YOUR benefit? I ask because my 6 year old DD (also the oldest) acts the exact same way, but NEVER when I am not there. It's as though the behavior is somehow just for me. It makes my *crazy* because I know she knows how to behave appropriately - she does so whenever so is without me. Her teachers, her friends' parents, even the school librarian have commented on how poised and polite and friendly she is (without me.) But even her kindergarten teacher has noticed (and commented) on how different she is when *I* am there.

We have an otherwise very good relationship, but I find this behavior tremendously frustrating.


----------



## The4OfUs (May 23, 2005)

I can't address it from a 5-yr old POV, but I can let you know what I do with my 2-1/2 yo who had starte growling at cashiers, and doing the back turned and "hmph!" thing. I've been working with her a LOT since she started this about 5 or 6 months ago. What I would do is tell her that what she was doing was rude, and give her an alternative that was less rude but still honored her feelings. She was a very intense baby and young toddler, and spent much of her time out in public being worn, and had severe separation anxiety until she was at least 2 years old...so I know that this is her personality, so I want to honor it, but still impress upon her that manners matter.

I tell her that while it's OK for her to feel whatever she feels inside, that I expect her to be polite on the outside. That she doesn't have to talk to or interact with people and be fake, but when she declines interacting with people, it needs to be done politely. Right now, if she doesn't want to interact with someone, I have her say, "no thank you", or "not now please".

Before we go into a store, or to a playdate, I run by the expectations with her, and what she CAN do if she's not ready to interact with people. I don't want to invalidate her feelings, I just want to teach her a polite way to handle them. If I see someone approaching her to talk while we're out, I'll whisper, "Remember, if you don't want to talk, just say no thank you, ok?".

It's taken a few months, but she's getting much better at just saying no thank you, and the rude stuff is decreasing, thank GOD. Courtesy is SO, SO important to me, so it was really, really bothering me.

I don't think it's ever too young to teach kids to be polite; you shouldn't expect them to be perfect right away ( or actually ever, obviously nobody is perfect), but certainly teaching them alternatives to express themselves politely is always age appropriate. I would expect that most 5 yos should be able to use an alternate phrase that has been supplied to them and reminded and practiced. With a 5 yo you could even roleplay with her to practice.

Good luck!


----------



## leighi123 (Nov 14, 2007)

I STILL act 'shy' to the point of it seeming rude. And its not that I dont try, I just CANT talk to people most of the time.

I was only recently diagnosed with aspergers, even though looking back, I've been 'that way' my entire life.

When my parents tried to 'make' me say 'hi' or talk to people etc, it just made things worse, because more focus was on me.


----------



## newbymom05 (Aug 13, 2005)

Wow, I don't know whether to be relieved that DS1 is not the only one w/ the "hmmpf" and arms crossed/head turned, or bummed that he may still be doing it at 6. I think he gets overwhelmed, but it's sooo frustrating for me. OK, faces at the strange lady who compliments him, I can understand, but faces at the same kids he sees every Monday for the past 2 years????


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *newbymom05* 
Wow, I don't know whether to be relieved that DS1 is not the only one w/ the "hmmpf" and arms crossed/head turned, or bummed that he may still be doing it at 6. I think he gets overwhelmed, but it's sooo frustrating for me. OK, faces at the strange lady who compliments him, I can understand, but faces at the same kids he sees every Monday for the past 2 years????

When I was in kindergarten, if I got to school late (I frequently did, no matter how early mom sent me off, because I got sidetracked by caterpillars and dew covered spiderwebs and flowers and...everything, really.), the classroom door would be closed. Even at the end of the year, I would _not_ go into the classroom if the door was closed, because I didn't want people looking at me. I knew all of them. More than once, I waited until "recess" (it was actually an early break, because kindergarten was only a half day), then slipped into class when everyone else went back in. My teacher eventually figured it out, and started checking at the door every day.

Even in my teens, I would cut a class rather than open a door and walk inside. I almost skipped a Cub Scout board meeting (I was the treasurer), because I was running late (dd was a baby, and life was a bit crazy) and the church door was closed when I got there.

I could easily see still having trouble with people I only saw once a week. What we call "shyness" in our society can be absolutely crippling. It still causes me tremendous anxiety and affects many parts of my life...and I'm 40. I've made progress because of the kids, but it's still hard.


----------



## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

Our ds was shy and froze in new situations. So he just wouldn't respond (which is probably a better response than "hmph").

I found that giving him a non-verbal option helped tremendously. So, waving or shaking his head worked, when talking simply wasn't going to do that.

We also talked A LOT about how other people might interpret his actions. "If you don't acknowledge it when your friends say "hi", then they will think you don't like them/don't want to play with them."

You might also consider play acting some of these things - use stuffed animals if she doesn't want to do it herself. Have her animal be the one who 'hmphs' and grumps at people and you be the other person and describe what the other person is feeling. Then reverse roles and model some other responses.

Finally, I do call my kids on rudeness. "That sounded rude. Please try again." is a common refrain around our house these days.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

you should read "how to talk so kids will listen..." especially their part on roles.

I wouldnt force my child to talk to anyone. I avoid labels like "shy". I would probably take the approach of

1) telling her why its good to talk to people (depending on the people of course)
2) tell her that its okay if she doesn't want to talk, and polite ways she can let the person know
3) and that she may not growl at others or show disinterest in interacting with people in an inconsiderate way (and come up with a plan for what to do when she does)

I have found my kids use manners more when they aren't forced. My DS has trouble with eye contact (SN) and my daughter pulls away from people she doesn't know and makes "scared" noises. but they both say thank you when someone does something nice for them. DS sometimes needs prompting to say bye.

Perfect example the last time we were at the grocery store an employee was helping us and said something to DD and she pulled away and looked away and tucked her head kind of. the guy called her "shy". I didnt say anything. when he was done helping us, she said "thank you!" with me even though I hadn't told her to. It's just been my experience that its good to teach a child how to use manners, when to use manners, and why to use manners, but not 'make' them.

My mom was always afraid of me seeming rude and talked to me a lot about not staring at people - which I don't think i ever did - but to this day I find it hard to make eye contact for any longer then it takes to make a short statement. I avoid eye contact when possible. I avoid talking to people when possible. I have to force myself to say hi, and I sometimes am socially inept, walking away during a conversation and afterward realizing I didn't really "close" the conversation properly. I sometimes wonder too if I have Aspergers, but never sought a formal diagnosis, though it would explain about myself as both a child and adult.


----------



## j924 (May 17, 2005)

One of my dds was extremely shy almost phobic of people. When she was rude to people it was less of a decision of manners but more of a fight or flight situation. If I am rude enough these people will leave me alone. It was very effective . We took a two pronged attack. Like you I would prime her for every situation we would walk into even her grandparents or especially her grandparents!!! Then if she was being shy/rude I would answer politely for her. I wouldn't expect it repeated but eventually I heard my words coming out of her mouth. She is now 9 and although much better there are times she gets taht deer in the headligths look and need some help. If it is any consolation kindy was her break out year.


----------



## pinksprklybarefoot (Jan 18, 2007)

DSD used to be a lot like this. Still is, sometimes. After a few embarrassing incidents at birthday parties where she refused to say "thank you" and "good-bye," we started really laying out the expectations before leaving the house. At six, we decided that if she is old enough to participate in the birthday party, then she is old enough to say these two little things to the host before leaving. Otherwise, she could stay home.

We had a similar problem when Grandma came to visit (which happens frequently), and after a few coaching sessions prior to Grandma coming, she has been much better about saying good-bye.

DSD can be a little shy, but in our case, she was mostly being rude because it had been tolerated by us for so long. Once we really made the expectations clear, she was able to use her manners with no problem. DS is almost 2, and we'll probably be a lot better about working on this sooner.


----------



## momma4fun (Jan 23, 2007)

i'll be following this thread

my 8 year old has always been the same way, obvious even before she turned 1

i've been painfully shy all my life yet was forced by my parents to be socially acceptable.

i've decided that my child's comfort and sense of "owning her own experience" as a child is more important than worrying about other people's feelings. i try not to worry about her rudeness making me look bad. as she gets older, we discuss her interactions with the outside world in more depth and i feel comfortable that the best way for her to grow into a confident adult is to have a safe feeling childhood. we talk a lot and i don't use the word shy with her anymore but we do use very specifc feeling words like anxious, discomfort, sensitive, scared etc so she can cleary communicate her feelings to me.

also, mine is the type that doesn't do this as often when i'm not there. and i THINK this is a sign that her greatest desire is to have my approval and unconditional love, so she actually gets MORE shy and self conscious in social situations around me because she's afraid of saying the wrong thing.....


----------



## Ks Mama (Aug 22, 2006)

My daughter expresses VERY similar tendencies, particularly in unfamiliar or group settings (like library story time); it was relieving in a way to read your post! My DD is just about 4.5. She doesn't growl (ha ha!), but she has occasionally reverted to 1 & 2 word speak, or will answer every question with nonsense answers, like, "what's your name?": "batman!" (she's NEVER seen batman, don't ask me where this came from, haha!), and "how old are you?": "beetle beetle BOP!", or will just stare at the person & not answer. Sure, I can think of it as embarrassing or irritating - but then I remember it's not ME that's behaving that way, and she IS only 4 yrs old; she's still learning how to navigate a HUGE new world. I try to model good interactions/conversations with people (I tend to be more of an introvert myself).

Her teacher & I have talked about it a bit; she's not worried, because she feels she's still quite young. She has noticed that she's a bit aloof, though she says its not shyness - and it really ISN'T - DD will talk to ANYONE, and she's incredibly smart & articulate - particularly adults, but she's very choosy as to when she lets herself get into her wonderfully bubbly articulate personality, and when she wants to be "rough" (as I call it). Her teacher is working with her to help her interact with her peers by pairing her up for each activity with a new person, and preparing her ahead of each activity/pairing by prepping DD with a few questions she can use to initiate conversation - like, "I'm DD, what's your name" "How old are you?", etc. I have found the technique to be helpful outside of school.

I also tend to ignore that behvior when it happens, and try to change the subject, or divert her attention, or I give her a chance to answer a question like, "what's your name" and if she chooses not to answer, I will say, Im sorry you don't feel like answering right now. (but I don't talk about it being rude, or her being shy). I have also diverted attention to myself... meaning, if the person is waiting for an answer, and I can tell DD is not being forthcoming, or is reacting loudly or rudely, I'll say something like, "I'm Mommy, and this is DS, or my, the store is busy today" or whatever. I don't call direct attention to being shy, and never call her shy, and I don't think its beneficial to talk at the time of being rude, or demanding to give an answer... I think these things just serve to make a child feel shamed, or forced, and will lead to further outbursts or clamming up altogether.

I really think its just a phase... but I think with all phases, the more attention & focus you put on the negative parts of the behavior, the more the behavior will persist. Preparation, reassurance, modelling, and positive reinforcement when she behaves in a less "rude" way is probably the best.


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
When I was in kindergarten, if I got to school late (I frequently did, no matter how early mom sent me off, because I got sidetracked by caterpillars and dew covered spiderwebs and flowers and...everything, really.), the classroom door would be closed. Even at the end of the year, I would _not_ go into the classroom if the door was closed, because I didn't want people looking at me. I knew all of them. More than once, I waited until "recess" (it was actually an early break, because kindergarten was only a half day), then slipped into class when everyone else went back in. My teacher eventually figured it out, and started checking at the door every day.

Even in my teens, I would cut a class rather than open a door and walk inside. I almost skipped a Cub Scout board meeting (I was the treasurer), because I was running late (dd was a baby, and life was a bit crazy) and the church door was closed when I got there.

I could easily see still having trouble with people I only saw once a week. What we call "shyness" in our society can be absolutely crippling. It still causes me tremendous anxiety and affects many parts of my life...and I'm 40. I've made progress because of the kids, but it's still hard.

OMG this is me too! Glad I'm not the only one







I *HATE* people looking at me. Hate it hate it hate it!

What is weird is everyone says there's no way I'm an introvert...because once I know people I'm really comfortable. It's the 'getting to know people' that freaks me the hell out! I still really battle w/the anxiety so badly. I won't answer my door during the day unless I know who it is, I rarely answer the phone (but I return calls to ppl I know), and I hate going places with tons of people.

Yet...ask anyone who knows me and they'd say I'm really social. They just don't realize the effort it took to get to that point. Go figure!

/hijack (sheepish)


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Shy is never plain rude IMO. I am the mother of an extremely shy 9 year old, and he certainly isn't being plain rude when he doesn't reply to someone, he is being forced out of his comfort zone and is doing the very best he can. I think it is especially hard for him because he is a charismatic child that excels in sports, so is extremely popular with other children and is very noticeable to adults because of his skills. He is recognized by many kids and they will want to say "hi" and interact with him, but many times, if the child isn't well known to him, he finds it very difficult and he comes off as aloof. I think we need to be very careful of our own agendas here. Is your DD's behavior causing you embarrassment? Do you think it reflects badly on you in the eyes of others? If so, let that go, and know your DD really is doing the best she can. I never force my son to respond to people and I will intervene if I see he is becoming very uncomfortable because some people can be very persistent. I strive to make sure he feels safe at all times and not pressured to speak when he clearly cannot. This gentle, non judgmental approach seems to be working because he is getting much better, he will now speak up for himself, he will say hello and answer questions, and he is even able to ride his bike alone to the local pizza restaurant and order himself a slice of pizza and eat it there. Give her time.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Theoretica* 
OMG this is me too! Glad I'm not the only one







I *HATE* people looking at me. Hate it hate it hate it!

*What is weird is everyone says there's no way I'm an introvert...because once I know people I'm really comfortable.* It's the 'getting to know people' that freaks me the hell out! I still really battle w/the anxiety so badly. I won't answer my door during the day unless I know who it is, I rarely answer the phone (but I return calls to ppl I know), and I hate going places with tons of people.

Yet...ask anyone who knows me and they'd say I'm really social. They just don't realize the effort it took to get to that point. Go figure!

/hijack (sheepish)

going to join this club with you and stormbride!!


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Theoretica* 
Yet...ask anyone who knows me and they'd say I'm really social. They just don't realize the effort it took to get to that point. Go figure!

I was talking to a mom I didn't know at a local homelearning meetup, and said something about being very socially awkward (that was in context, but I can't remember what we were discussing), and she just stared at me in shock. She told me I didn't seem that way at all. In my case, it's partly because, somewhere in my 20s, I started "coping" with social anxiety by talking...non-stop. I think people perceive it as a form of social confidence, but it's anything but.

I've come across different interpretations of "introvert" over the years. According to the ones in widespread use when I was younger, I'm slightly introverted. According to a definition I came across a few years ago, I'm a total introvert - that definition is all about where you find your energy. I find mine from being alone...even enjoyable social situations drain me.

I read up on clinical shyness a long time ago. I don't remember much about it, but I do remember thinking that it applied to me in a big way. I think that lots of kids are labeled "shy" over behaviour that's not really rooted in clinical shyness, and that causes a lot of confusion over what "shy" really means. Mind you, I did that reading several years ago, and it's quite possible that "clinical shyness" isn't even a term that's used anymore. I'm far from up to date on psychological terminology.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Shy is never plain rude IMO. I am the mother of an extremely shy 9 year old, and he certainly isn't being plain rude when he doesn't reply to someone, he is being forced out of his comfort zone and is doing the very best he can. I think it is especially hard for him because he is a charismatic child that excels in sports, so is extremely popular with other children and is very noticeable to adults because of his skills. He is recognized by many kids and they will want to say "hi" and interact with him, but many times, if the child isn't well known to him, he finds it very difficult and he comes off as aloof. I think we need to be very careful of our own agendas here. Is your DD's behavior causing you embarrassment? Do you think it reflects badly on you in the eyes of others? If so, let that go, and know your DD really is doing the best she can. I never force my son to respond to people and I will intervene if I see he is becoming very uncomfortable because some people can be very persistent. I strive to make sure he feels safe at all times and not pressured to speak when he clearly cannot. This gentle, non judgmental approach seems to be working because he is getting much better, he will now speak up for himself, he will say hello and answer questions, and he is even able to ride his bike alone to the local pizza restaurant and order himself a slice of pizza and eat it there. Give her time.

Awesome approach! I totally agree with this. I am glad to hear you respecting your son's personality. I think my mom was an extrovert and I was an introvert and she didn't pick up on that growing up. made things worse for me. Instead of empowering me she tried to force me not to be shy or rude. IF you can respect your child's personality and accept how they differ from you, you can help them be the best version of _themselves_.







:


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Shy is never plain rude IMO. I am the mother of an extremely shy 9 year old, and he certainly isn't being plain rude when he doesn't reply to someone, he is being forced out of his comfort zone and is doing the very best he can.









:
That's what I was trying to say, and couldn't find quite the right words. Many, many socially acceptable behaviours are _very_ difficult for me - some of them are almost impossible, and can still cause me near-paralysis. (This was one of many factors that messed me up in high school.) I really tried as a child, but I'm sure I struck people as "rude" sometimes.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I was talking to a mom I didn't know at a local homelearning meetup, and said something about being very socially awkward (that was in context, but I can't remember what we were discussing), and she just stared at me in shock. She told me I didn't seem that way at all. In my case, it's partly because, somewhere in my 20s, *I started "coping" with social anxiety by talking...non-stop.* I think people perceive it as a form of social confidence, but it's anything but.

I've come across different interpretations of "introvert" over the years. According to the ones in widespread use when I was younger, I'm slightly introverted. According to a definition I came across a few years ago, I'm a total introvert - that definition is all about where you find your energy. *I find mine from being alone...even enjoyable social situations drain me.*

I read up on clinical shyness a long time ago. I don't remember much about it, but I do remember thinking that it applied to me in a big way. I think that lots of kids are labeled "shy" over behaviour that's not really rooted in clinical shyness, and that causes a lot of confusion over what "shy" really means. Mind you, I did that reading several years ago, and it's quite possible that "clinical shyness" isn't even a term that's used anymore. I'm far from up to date on psychological terminology.

It's so interesting to hear others say things that so much describe me! I have always been made to feel like I was "weird" but I'm not weird. It's usually extroverts who think that of me. I'm just different then they are, but obviously there are a lot of people who are introverted like me too.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
It's so interesting to hear others say things that so much describe me! I have always been made to feel like I was "weird" but I'm not weird. It's usually extroverts who think that of me. I'm just different then they are, but obviously there are a lot of people who are introverted like me too.

I seem to recall reading that extroverts outnumber introverts by quite a large margin. I think we (introverts) run into so many challenges, partly because our social norms are determined by the majority...who are _not_ introverts, and really don't understand how our brains work. As a result, we end up being put in emotionally tiring situations on a regular basis, _and_ many people think we're freaks for finding them draining!

The hardest part of being a homeschooling SAHM, for me, is giving my kids chances to get out and mingle, because it means I have to mingle, too.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I seem to recall reading that extroverts outnumber introverts by quite a large margin. I think we (introverts) run into so many challenges, partly because our social norms are determined by the majority...who are _not_ introverts, and really don't understand how our brains work. As a result, we end up being put in emotionally tiring situations on a regular basis, _and_ many people think we're freaks for finding them draining!

The hardest part of being a homeschooling SAHM, for me, is giving my kids chances to get out and mingle, because it means I have to mingle, too.

that is my concern as well with homeschooling. I know just taking my son to school in the morning gives me anxiety. Who to say hi to, when to end a conversation (I'm very bad at this - sometimes I talk to long, sometimes I walk away when without closing the conversation properly, sometimes I know I need to close the conversation but I don't know how) I try to be polite, but mostly avoid eye contact in hopes people won't walk to me. then I feel uncomfortable like its obvious I'm avoiding looking at people...


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
that is my concern as well with homeschooling. I know just taking my son to school in the morning gives me anxiety. Who to say hi to, when to end a conversation (I'm very bad at this - sometimes I talk to long, sometimes I walk away when without closing the conversation properly, sometimes I know I need to close the conversation but I don't know how) I try to be polite, but mostly avoid eye contact in hopes people won't walk to me. then I feel uncomfortable like its obvious I'm avoiding looking at people...

I've had a huge boost, because the local MDC Tribe is loaded with homelearning families. It makes a _big_ difference if I'm attending a homelearning meetup and I already know at least one or two moms, yk? I'll admit that making it to my first few meetups (the first one was a mom's night out) was _really_ hard, though.\\

ETA: My teenage son is in public school, and I always found that socially grueling, too. I remind myself of that when I'm finding the social side of homelearning really difficult. The part that makes it hardest is that the social "opportunities" at public school were built in. Now, I have to take the initiative...


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
Awesome approach! I totally agree with this. I am glad to hear you respecting your son's personality. I think my mom was an extrovert and I was an introvert and she didn't pick up on that growing up. made things worse for me. Instead of empowering me she tried to force me not to be shy or rude. IF you can respect your child's personality and accept how they differ from you, you can help them be the best version of _themselves_.







:

Thank you. I think it is easier to empathize with DS because I too, was a shy child and remember how hard it was at times. It never really goes away, we just get better at faking it.

ETA: Oh, SGM, he was my velcro baby, btw.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Thank you. I think it is easier to empathize with DS because I too, was a shy child and remember how hard it was at times. *It never really goes away, we just get better at faking it*.

so true!


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Thank you. I think it is easier to empathize with DS because I too, was a shy child and remember how hard it was at times. It never really goes away, we just get better at faking it.


THIS!!

I wonder which is more difficult, being an introverted parent of an extrovert, or the other way around?

I really like how so many mamas here are supportive of their kiddo's personalities. How refreshing!


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I wonder to Theoretica?

My 2 oldest seem pretty introverted but probably too soon to tell.

My husband is an extrovert and sometimes I think my being introverted is harder on him then vice versa... but in other introvert/extrovert relationships I have found its easier for my extroverted friends to be friends with me then vice versa. because they can drag me out with them, which takes me out of my comfort zone. My friend tells me im not shy, but thats because she knows me really well. i hate going out with her but I do because society makes you feel like that is the "normal" way to be and you try to fit the mold. So, I think it depends on the individual relationship, but in general I think its harder to be the introvert in the introvert/extrovert relationship - though I may just think that since im the introvert!


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Theoretica* 
THIS!!

I wonder which is more difficult, being an introverted parent of an extrovert, or the other way around?

I think both are difficult. My SIL (brother's ex) is an extrovert, and my niece is an introvert. I think it's been pretty tough on both of them. Actually...maybe it is harder. DS1 is a total extrovert, and it's really not that hard for me. He tends to make his own social arrangements, and I just play chauffeur/transportation device. The most wearing part is that in the evenings, he always wants to talk...and talk...and talk...about some videogame or something, and that's the time when I really want a bit of peace and quiet to unwind before bed. Finding the balance between getting that peace and keeping open the lines of communication is difficult.


----------



## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

Joining the group of "introvert but coping" mommies. Although I can seem very social in familiar situations, they always take a toll on me and I need major recovery time after even simple things like church on Sunday. Parent events at school are torture and would almost be enough to convince me to homeschool if my circumstances and children were different.

I have a "shy" DD too. And she is 6 today. I think it is OK to be shy and to refuse to engage with people. I am absolutely OK when DD hides behind me when approached by adults (even familiar ones), and I don't mind answering for her. In my mind, that is not rude. However, growling or acting badly out of shyness is not, IMHO, appropriate. I would definitely give child choices of acceptable behaviors, including not non-verbal cues or options.

However, acting badly at a playgroup would definitely have resulted in being removed from the situation, especially if she were bigger than the actual children participating. At that point, I think you had a responsibility to protect the smaller children from your child's actions, just as if you had a biting toddler. Despite the inconvenience of it, you probably should have left or gotten another mom to keep an eye on your other child and removed her from the room.

I'm not sure what to do in the long term beyond what you are already doing -- giving appropriate options, practicing, and keep trying. I wouldn't worry about school so much because lots of children are shy but OK in the classroom. And a good teacher should be able to coach appropriate reactions to new situations. Some very shy kids start coming out of their shells at that point as well. One of DDs friends is a child with selective mutism who is actually talking now that she has started K, even though she said not a word during her entire 2 years at preschool!


----------



## The4OfUs (May 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
Awesome approach! I totally agree with this. I am glad to hear you respecting your son's personality. I think my mom was an extrovert and I was an introvert and she didn't pick up on that growing up. made things worse for me. Instead of empowering me she tried to force me not to be shy or rude. IF you can respect your child's personality and accept how they differ from you, you can help them be the best version of _themselves_.







:

I have to ask an earnest question to you ladies who have had the experience in childhood of being forced to talk to people. I had posted above that while I don't expect my daughter to interact with people as far as having a conversation with them if she doesn't want to, I *am* expecting her to briefly decline conversation politely. Just in the past few weeks it has started to click for her, and today she did it on her own without me reminding her...we were at DS's gymnastics class, and she was playing in their lobby play area, and one of the other moms tried to engage her in conversation....and DD started to turn and cross her arms, but then turned back and faced her, stuck her little hand out in a wave, and said, "No thank you." Then a couple minutes later DD came over on her own and interacted with the group of us.

Sooo, my question to you is what do you think about me expecting and guiding her towards politely declining conversation with people? DO you think it's harming her, or the same as you being forced to talk to people as a child? To me (and I could be wrong, because I am an extrovert) it feels like I'm honoring her personality in that I'm not requiring her to make small talk or actually answer the question or greeting the person is giving her, but at the same time teaching her that courtesy is possible in most benign social situations. It seems to be working without causing her anxiety or to become more upset around people...in fact, it would seem to be making her feel better about herself being able to say something to them that they understand...she is lately being more outgoing on her own without me saying anything to her in stores, actually saying hi back to some people when they say hi to her.

Just wondered your thoughts. It seems, at least to me, to be a compromise between
a) forcing her to continue a conversation with someone that she doesn't want to, and
b) not addressing her if she turns her back or shouts at someone (which even if she is anxious or shy is rude). I want her to be able to assert herself with someone, but politely, not have me speak for her in situations, KWIM?

I am a very outgoing and social person, and social courtesy is really important to me, so this has been a really tough one for me trying to honor her very different personality while still passing on my values and teaching her how to interact with the world.


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Do more role-playing and role modeling.

Remind her when she forgets and have her do-over pretty quick.

There's no excuse for treating other people badly, introvert or no.


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *The4OfUs* 
I am a very outgoing and social person, and *social courtesy is really important to me*, so this has been a really tough one for me trying to honor her very different personality while still passing on my values and teaching her how to interact with the world.

This is the point, this is *your* agenda, not your dd's she doesn't have any need to be socially outgoing, courteous etc. Don't think she doesn't know what being courteous is, because she does. Model your values, she sees them and takes them in. Don't push her, let her feel safe first and foremost. As a shy introvert, I promise you, I have learned to interact with the world and am frankly quite good at it.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *The4OfUs* 
I have to ask an earnest question to you ladies who have had the experience in childhood of being forced to talk to people. I had posted above that while *I don't expect my daughter to interact with people as far as having a conversation with them if she doesn't want to, I *am* expecting her to briefly decline conversation politely.* Just in the past few weeks it has started to click for her, and today she did it on her own without me reminding her...we were at DS's gymnastics class, and she was playing in their lobby play area, and one of the other moms tried to engage her in conversation....and DD started to turn and cross her arms, but then turned back and faced her, stuck her little hand out in a wave, and said, "No thank you." Then a couple minutes later DD came over on her own and interacted with the group of us.

*Sooo, my question to you is what do you think about me expecting and guiding her towards politely declining conversation with people?* *DO you think it's harming her, or the same as you being forced to talk to people as a child?* To me (and I could be wrong, because I am an extrovert) *it feels like I'm honoring her personality in that I'm not requiring her to make small talk or actually answer the question or greeting the person is giving her, but at the same time teaching her that courtesy is possible in most benign social situations. It seems to be working without causing her anxiety or to become more upset around people...in fact, it would seem to be making her feel better about herself being able to say something to them that they understand...*she is lately being more outgoing on her own without me saying anything to her in stores, actually saying hi back to some people when they say hi to her.

Just wondered your thoughts. It seems, at least to me, to be a compromise between
a) forcing her to continue a conversation with someone that she doesn't want to, and
b) not addressing her if she turns her back or shouts at someone (which even if she is anxious or shy is rude). I want her to be able to assert herself with someone, but politely, not have me speak for her in situations, KWIM?

^NO THOSE ARE NOT THE CHOICES! WHAT YOU ARE DOING IS GREAT!^

I am a very outgoing and social person, and social courtesy is really important to me, so this has been a really tough one for me trying to honor her very different personality while still passing on my values and teaching her how to interact with the world.

i think you are handling it right. you definitely SHOULD be teaching her how to politely remove herself from conversation. I dont know how to because I was always forced to interact. it would have been more beneficial if i was taught how to politely not interact.


----------



## Theoretica (Feb 2, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I seem to recall reading that extroverts outnumber introverts by quite a large margin.

Well yeah...we don't LIKE answering questions!!!

I mean really now...









Great thread BTW!


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
This is the point, this is *your* agenda, not your dd's she doesn't have any need to be socially outgoing, courteous etc. Don't think she doesn't know what being courteous is, because she does. Model your values, she sees them and takes them in. Don't push her, let her feel safe first and foremost. As a shy introvert, I promise you, I have learned to interact with the world and am frankly quite good at it.

DITTO, depending on what you mean by social courtesy - of course no matter what your personality you shouldn't be growling at people, but you shouldn't have to talk either. whether you hand it with non verbal cues or verbal cues is fine.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *philomom* 
Do more role-playing and role modeling.

Remind her when she forgets and have her do-over pretty quick.

*There's no excuse for treating other people badly, introvert or no.*

same can be said for extroverts. i think introverts shouldnt treat people badly by means of finding a way (verbal or not) to politely move away from interaction they dont want to be a part of. at the same time, extroverts can not treat others badly by respecting an introverts personality and not forcing them to interact if they don't want to.


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *philomom* 
Do more role-playing and role modeling.

Remind her when she forgets and have her do-over pretty quick.

There's no excuse for treating other people badly, introvert or no.

I would recommend only role-playing when the child is a regulated state, don't push it, or make it tedious. Do-overs in front of others is very hard for a shy child, it makes it worse because you are drawing even more attention to them than they comfortably handle.

Children behave badly when they are not regulated, ie stressed or in fear. A shy kid put in a situation where they have to talk to someone is in stressful/fearful situation, they will no longer be regulated, and many will "act out" or be perceived as being rude. They are not behaving badly. again, that is the parents agenda. They are doing the best they can.


----------



## Evan&Anna's_Mom (Jun 12, 2003)

I too try to honor my DDs needs/personality but also teach social courtesy. And it may be "my" agenda, but I completely believe that all people should be polite (in an age appropriate way) and that being polite is not mutually exclusive with being shy. Just like not saying please/thank you is not acceptable to me, something like growling or glaring wouldn't be acceptable either.

So, I won't force my DD to speak if that is beyond her. I will allow her to hide her face, which is a pretty clear message to adults that she is shy, without being rude or mean, I think. I will intercept a particularly "aggressive" adult who seems determined to ignore her cues. "Please don't persist, DD is uncomfortable around strangers", that sort of thing. And if she does manage "Hello" or to answer a question, I will always compliment her afterwards. If she were unacceptable, I would speak to her afterwards as well, pointing out that there were polite options but her option was unacceptable. Just like I would handle an impolite response from my older, less shy DS.

I will sometimes encourage her a little if the adult is one that she knows and its a "safe" situation. For example, adult friend of ours at our home for dinner I will sometimes say "Please say hello to Ms. X", but I won't force her.

I don't know if this is the perfect answer, but it has worked well so far. I think that being polite serves children, and adults well, and makes the world a better place. Its my job as a parent to teach my children to be polite. But its also my job to protect them. Its a balancing act to be sure.


----------



## philomom (Sep 12, 2004)

Hmm, I'm particularly upset by the use of "parent's agenda". Isn't a lot of childhood based on what a parent finds acceptable in their children's life?

Would my kids brush their teeth and eat healthy meals if it wasn't on my agenda? Likewise the OP said that interacting nicely with the outside world was very important to her as parent.... and it is to me as well. Sure kids forget sometimes, but generally, my kids kids treat random folks in our lives with politeness and respect. I don't think that anyone should be down on the Op for wanting that. She can gently re-shape her child's behavior without excessive trauma to her daughter or herself. There's lots of books for kids out there that can be read to her child... probably some videos, too. But, I would be firm on the rudeness factor.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

I agree with reshaping the behavior of the growling or being mean to teach them to be polite, but I don't agree with reshaping behavior to make them go against their personality (ie - extrovert or introvert) I am an introvert that doesnt mean I don't allow my children to have friends. so why should an introvert be forced to talk when they dont want to? I haven't seen anyone down on the OP - a lot of us have shared our experiences as introverts though, which I think provides good insight for the OP to consider in what her approach will be and what her goal will be. (like does she want to teach her child to be a social butterfly and be polite, or does she just want to teach her child to be polite.) An introvert might resort to being "rude" because they don't know how to respond comfortably. If they are only taught how to be polite when being social, how can they learn how to be polite when they don't want to be social? it needs to be taught. many children are not taught this, but instead forced to be social as a part of being polite, whereas you can very well be an introvert and be polite.

I also think sometimes people confuse outgoing with confident. You can be an introvert and still have self confidence and feel good about yourself. but I think a huge part of making that happen for a child is for the child to know thats its okay to be introverted and to understand their comfort level in a social setting. To learn ways to avoid undesirable situations without using a method that might make them uncomfortable.
If my children are introverts and I try to force them to be talkative, then in a social setting where there is peer pressure they may not feel comfortable speaking up. If I teach them well though, I can teach my introverted child a way to get out of those types of situations without having to confront it in a way they are not comfortable with.

Many times things have happened in my life (not good) that could have been prevented if I had the tools to get out of social situations without saying anything or worrying about seeming rude. Since I felt not talking would be rude, and I didn't feel comfortable talking, I found myself stuck many times. You may be able to teach your child to be verbal but you can't force them to be comfortable with it.

Evan and Anna's mom I agree with a lot of what you said. I would probably use different wording, but for some, that is just semantics









ETA: I don't really think "social" was the right word here, but I hope it's understood what I mean. Introverts aren't anti social. We just socialize in a different way.


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Philomom, the point is, we all have agendas and needs, but when we are interacting with our children we need to be upfront and honest about this. What is more important at any one time, your need/agenda or their's? Sometimes its yours, other times you can let have their's, ie a few minutes to play before you have to rush out of the house. We must be mindful that our agendas don't get in the way of relationship with our children. After-all parenting is all about relationship. If brushing teeth is causing a child stress and causing them to refuse to do it, act out, lie etc, then this needs to be examined. Same with food, this is personally one of my big ones, as my shy kid is also a picky eater, so I deal with this constantly. We need to get to the core of the behavior, what is causing them to become dis-regulated and address that. It is like health, you can go for treating the symptoms or you can treat the cause.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Philomom, the point is, we all have agendas and needs, but when we are interacting with our children we need to be upfront and honest about this. What is more important at any one time, your need/agenda or their's? Sometimes its yours, other times you can let have their's, ie a few minutes to play before you have to rush out of the house. We must be mindful that our agendas don't get in the way of relationship with our children. After-all parenting is all about relationship. If brushing teeth is causing a child stress and causing them to refuse to do it, act out, lie etc, then this needs to be examined. Same with food, this is personally one of my big ones, as my shy kid is also a picky eater, so I deal with this constantly. We need to get to the core of the behavior, what is causing them to become dis-regulated and address that. It is like health, you can go for treating the symptoms or you can treat the cause.


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

I also want to clarify that, of course you should teach your child they should be polite. But most kids know that by the time they are 3 or 4, even if they aren't always demonstrating it. But you don't try and teach a child this when they aren't in a regulated state because they are not going to hear you.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

OP: I think that gently encouraging your dd to politely refuse conversation is fine. Making a big deal out of it in front of other people would be a big mistake, but it doesn't sound like that's what you're doing.

I will say that, as an introverted child, even one with a mom who did her best to honour my personality, I often felt that I was expected to behave according to other people's social needs, and my own needs were unimportant. What many other people considered basic courtesy (something as simple as "no, thank you") was often very, very difficult for me. It didn't help that other people obviously didn't care if it was difficult - they only cared if I performed adequately. I didn't feel that way about my mom or dad or a couple of their friends...but that was my opinion of the outside world. When other people made social courtesies "a priority" in my interactions with them, they were telling me that my emotional needs were umimportant.

It can be a very difficult line to walk. I have to say that just the title of this thread made me _very_ uncomfortable. When a 5 year old is growling, instead of politely interacting, it's not helpful to dismiss it as "just plain rude" or to decide that she's now old enough to behave appropriately, yk? All we can do, as parents, is continue to gently guide our children. Getting on my dd's case about how she's "old enough" to be polite to people doesn't help her or me. It just adds to my frustration, and makes her feel even more _different_ (ie. "other kids don't feel this way, so why do I?"). She feels tremendous stress from interacting with people, and putting on more stress doesn't help either of us.

Good luck, OP. I can understand that this must be hard to deal with when it's alien to your own personality.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
...at the same time, extroverts can not treat others badly by respecting an introverts personality and not forcing them to interact if they don't want to.









:
I've found that extroverts, by and large (there are always exceptions), seem to feel that they're doing introverts a favour by getting us "out of our shells" or whatever. It's _so_ hard to deal with.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 







:
I've found that extroverts, by and large (there are always exceptions), seem to feel that they're doing introverts a favour by getting us "out of our shells" or whatever. It's _so_ hard to deal with.

YES. yes yes yes. 24 years later, in their minds, I am still in a "shell" but the reality is the only time I feel "trapped" is when in the company of someone who is trying to get me out of my shell. I am happy as an introvert. The only time being an introvert bothers me is when someone is trying to turn me into an extrovert - which in my problem can't be done. you can teach us to fake it, but you can't change who we are. I don't think an extrovert would enjoy being forced to act like an introvert either.


----------



## Chinese Pistache (May 29, 2006)

My dd behaved this way a lot. We did a couple of things. In the moment, we'd usually just say to the person that dd "takes a little while to warm up" and then, we 'd ignore her. Because insisting and reasoning and cajoling her just made her more stubborn about talking. Obviously, we saw that she felt more self-conscious and more singled-out when we did that (live and learn!). The other thing we did is try to help her understand how others might be interpreting her aloofness. They might think she doesn't like them, doesn't want to play with them, etc. We had some success with talking about situations in advance and what she might expect, but sometimes I think that produced more anxiety.

Eventually she outgrew this behavior. She's not an extrovert, she's still very observant and sometimes reserved, but she's very friendly and she doesn't freeze in new situations (though she does like the comfort of family close by, which we always provide). She definitely is more comfortable and happy now. I don't know that any of our actions had any influence or if she grew up a bit and gained more confidence, but there you have it.


----------



## Dabble (Jun 14, 2007)

This has been such a fascinating thread!

OP: Do you feel like you are an extrovert raising an introvert? Is it hard to understand her perspective of not wanting to speak with people?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I've come across different interpretations of "introvert" over the years. According to the ones in widespread use when I was younger, I'm slightly introverted. According to a definition I came across a few years ago, I'm a total introvert - that definition is all about where you find your energy. I find mine from being alone...even enjoyable social situations drain me.

Yes, yes, yes! I think we might be seeing more introverts coming out of the woodwork on this board because it requires no face-to-face interaction and is therefore attractive to us. I can easily meet my social needs by chatting online to people I've never met.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
Thank you. I think it is easier to empathize with DS because I too, was a shy child and remember how hard it was at times. It never really goes away, we just get better at faking it.

This is very true, and I've also had people express astonishment when I mention that I'm introverted. I'm very very good at faking it, but I still don't like it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 







:
I've found that extroverts, by and large (there are always exceptions), seem to feel that they're doing introverts a favour by getting us "out of our shells" or whatever. It's _so_ hard to deal with.

Isn't that the truth!?! I've had people accuse me of "not living" because I would prefer to curl up with a book on a Friday night instead of going out for a night of bright lights, loud talking, and strange social situations. No thanks.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I don't think an extrovert would enjoy being forced to act like an introvert either.

Really! I totally think true extroverts get their energy from being out and about, and they would feel drained and depressed by being forced to stay in when they are desperate for social contact. I can understand that about them, and wouldn't expect them to bend to my will, but it doesn't seem to work the other way around.

I am the mother of a three year old boy who is almost absolutely on the path to being a serious extrovert. Always eager to jump in to any situation, talks to anyone, hams it up and loves it, takes NO time to warm up to people and never has....what am I going to do with this child!?! I know we will have a had time understanding each other as his social circle increases with age.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Chimpmandee* 
Yes, yes, yes! I think we might be seeing more introverts coming out of the woodwork on this board because it requires no face-to-face interaction and is therefore attractive to us. I can easily meet my social needs by chatting online to people I've never met.

The net has been a _huge_ blessing to me. I found the support I needed to realize how bad my first marriage really was (had toyed with a real-life support group, but there's _so_ much difficulty attached to that for me). I also met my dh online. Online friends from MDC have eased me into the homelearning community in a way that's been hard, but not even remotely the same kind of hard as it would have been to just drop in cold.

Quote:

Isn't that the truth!?! I've had people accuse me of "not living" because I would prefer to curl up with a book on a Friday night instead of going out for a night of bright lights, loud talking, and strange social situations. No thanks.
Oh - sooooo true. I've had the "you really need to get a life" comments a few times, and had several people accuse me of letting myself get old at too early an age. Yet...the only time being home with a book felt like "not living" was when I let other people's ideas about what I should be doing mess me up.

It's kind of frustrating that I'm willing to believe people when they say they'd rather be at a club than home with a book or going for a walk alone...but they never seem to believe me about the opposite!

Quote:

I am the mother of a three year old boy who is almost absolutely on the path to being a serious extrovert. Always eager to jump in to any situation, talks to anyone, hams it up and loves it, takes NO time to warm up to people and never has....what am I going to do with this child!?! I know we will have a had time understanding each other as his social circle increases with age.
If it helps any, ds1 is a total extrovert, and we still do okay. He doesn't really get my need to be alone, and I don't get his need to spend _so_ much time with his friends...but we work with it okay. And...when I went way out on a limb and joined a choir a few years ago, he was one of my biggest supporters. He thinks it's awesome that I'm doing something like that, and doesn't think it's weird that it's hard for me (even though he joined a choir and doesn't even blink at it). Living with extroverts can be strange, but it's not as hard to understand each other as I thought it would be.


----------



## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Sorry I have not read all the responses - There is nothing you can really do about the shy. but her behavior is something you can work on. Shy or not things like growling and bullying are never acceptable. If it were my kid I would deal with just like any other inappropriate behavior. I would tell her "you do not have to talk if you don't want to but you absolutely may not growl" (for example) and then deal with it the way we deal with any other type of misbehavior if it were to continue (do whatever works in your family).


----------



## Peony (Nov 27, 2003)

I've enjoyed reading this thread as well, I am an introvert, DD1 is very much one, DD2 not so much. DD1 is 6 as well, and while she doesn't growl at people she spends most of time hiding under chairs or behind me refusing to speak. Which is fine by me, I remember it being very painful to have someone speak to me and then knowing that I'd have to talk to them.

I try to empower her by finding places where she is ok with speaking. For example, once in a while she gets to pick a fast food restaurant to eat at. She loves to pick Wendy's because our local one puts a ticket in the child's meal for a free Frosty. She now will go up and wait in line and speak to the cashier to get her own treat. I never said she had to, but asked if she would like to do so, and supported her until she felt comfortable doing it herself. Considering that it took her 2 years to speak to the woman who does the great storytime at our library that we go to weekly, this is huge for us.

Things like regular swim classes are difficult for her so we do private ones. She loves gymnastics but it takes time to ease her into a different class or when they change instructors. She won't speak to the other children or a new coach so I make sure that I'm nearby so I can speak for her if need be. The coaches she has had for years, know her well and can read her by now so she often gets asked to do special duties which does wonders for her self esteem. She also suffers from anxiety which didn't appear suddenly until she was 5.5 so I'm always careful not to push because it backfires in different areas. It can be frustrating when she wants to do something but then when we get there, she is unable to. And that's what I keep in my mind, it's not for a lack of her wanting to, she desperately wants to, but she truly can't, this isn't something she can control.


----------



## The4OfUs (May 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *uccomama* 
This is the point, this is *your* agenda, not your dd's she doesn't have any need to be socially outgoing, courteous etc. Don't think she doesn't know what being courteous is, because she does. Model your values, she sees them and takes them in. Don't push her, let her feel safe first and foremost. As a shy introvert, I promise you, I have learned to interact with the world and am frankly quite good at it.

While I understand your point about me putting my values onto her (but don't we all as a part of parenting, impart our values?), I would counter that being minimally courteous (or at least not outwardly rude/hostile) is a pretty universal agenda/expectation of human beings....in other words, I can't think of any culture where being ignored or shouted at are considered the norm, acceptable, or desireable. So I don't think it's really just *my* agenda....though it is my agenda that she start learning it and practicing it now as opposed to later...but I get your point that it's at least in part about me and my feelings about politeness even for toddlers. I'm also not expecting or desiring her to be a social butterfly like me, she can be herself...I just want her to be polite *while* she is being herself (which I don't think is just my agenda), and it felt like when I wasn't addressing the rude behaviors, they were getting worse and more pronounced, which I was not OK with.

I'm just going to keep doing what I'm doing because its seems to be working for us, and it does not seem to be causing her any distress. I thank you ladies for your input and thoughts!

And with that, I will stop hijacking the OPs thread (SORRY OP!!)


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *The4OfUs* 
While I understand your point about me putting my values onto her (but don't we all as a part of parenting, impart our values?), I would counter that being minimally courteous (or at least not outwardly rude/hostile) is a pretty universal agenda/expectation of human beings....in other words, I can't think of any culture where being ignored or shouted at are considered the norm, acceptable, or desireable. So I don't think it's really just *my* agenda....though it is my agenda that she start learning it and practicing it now as opposed to later...but I get your point that it's at least in part about me and my feelings about politeness even for toddlers. I'm also not expecting or desiring her to be a social butterfly like me, she can be herself...*I just want her to be polite *while* she is being herself* (which I don't think is just my agenda), and it felt like when I wasn't addressing the rude behaviors, they were getting worse and more pronounced, which I was not OK with.

I'm just going to keep doing what I'm doing because its seems to be working for us, and it does not seem to be causing her any distress. I thank you ladies for your input and thoughts!

And with that, I will stop hijacking the OPs thread (SORRY OP!!)

This was already addressed, but in short - no one is saying to allow her to be mean. just that it would help more to empower her in a way that she can be polite but quiet if she wants, instead of the ultimate goal being for her to be polite and verbal. Teaching manners = good. expecting a child to act in way that goes against the core of who they are = not so good. to the bolded I think no one disputes that approach, and that is what everyone is saying _should_ be done.

the agenda comment I think was geared towards trying to turn an introvert into an extrovert - not towards wanting your child to be polite regardless.


----------



## The4OfUs (May 23, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
empower her in a way that she can be polite but quiet if she wants, instead of the ultimate goal being for her to be polite and verbal.

This is good stuff, really making me think. I would love some suggestions for this, being quiet but polite....cause all I can think of is a smile, right? A nod? A thumbs up?

I'm not trying to be snarky, I genuinely want to help give her different options for different situations.....

So I guess I'm not done hijacking







...but I think the OP will probably welcome more ideas, too, so I'm trying ot not feel too guilty







.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

If I were the OP I would be thrilled that my post inspired such a lovely discussion







I suppose we could use a thread on introverts and extroverts though!

as for being polite but quite, I dont think a child really needs to do anything IMO. perhaps there is something they can signal to you that they aren't ready yet. If anyone comments or if you like, you can say "DD takes her time to warm up to people" I tend not to say anything at all. My DD is still polite even though she tucks her head into my arm, like I said at the store the other day she said thank you as the person was walking away. It's just her comfort zone and I respect that. I wouldn't ignore my child giving dirty looks or growling, but I would tell her its okay if she doesn't want to talk. she can either say "excuse me" and occupy herself with something while I talk to the person (like a book or something) or she can smile if she wants or she can just stay quiet but that its not polite to make others feel uncomfortable by growling at them. I would probably talk to her (outside of the situation) and say "you felt uncomfortable being approached when you weren't in the mood to talk. Those feelings are okay, but we need to be considerate of others. Growling makes others feel uncomfortable, and you know how that feels. Not good right? So what can we do so that we can respect how you feel, and respect the people around us too?" Let her come up with some ideas and come up with some ideas too. After brainstorming, go through your list and decide which things just aren't an option for you. Decide on the remaining options which would be best (maybe she would be comfortable just giving a smile or a thumbs up. Maybe she would feel comfortable if you could, as much as possible, see the situation before it occurs and give her something to be "busy" with when the person approaches. Perhaps, in family situations, you can let relatives know that she likes to observe before joining in conversation, that she isn't being rude, but she may wait a while to come up and say hi. Make a plan with DD, like she can go color in her room when company arrives, but you want her to come down and say hi to everyone within a certain time frame. Come up to her at some point and invite her down. Ask if being by your side while she says hi would make her more comfortable. Or see if she wants to make little "cards" to hand out to the relatives so she doesn't have to say hi in person. Or she can set the table for dinner parties and leave little notes that say "Hi Grandma! glad you could make it!" and put stickers on it and color it. so she may not be being 'social' at the gathering, but I'm sure all the relatives would be bragging about how sweet and thoughtful she is. These are just some ideas I dont have time to type any more right now, but I have a ton more ideas where this came from









in the end do what you think is best for your DD I'm just saying that as an introvert myself, these are the things that would have given me the skills I need to thrive in this world. Pretending to be someone I am not does not help me. And I don't think I should risk my own comfort to appease others. Should I be polite? of course! but I shouldn't be made to be a social butterfly when I'm happier at home with a book.

Also ,if she feels more comfortable on the phone she can call relatives once a week "just to say hi". okay im done for now


----------



## The4OfUs (May 23, 2005)

Wow, LOTS of great ideas there, thanks. My DD is only 2-1/2, so asking her to brainstorm is fruitless at the moment...but I am going to copy this thread into a document so I can have it for future reference...

In our case she has no problem with family social gatherings at all these days....it seems to be more of a mood thing right now...if she's in a good mood, she's all smiles and coy...if she's in a bad mood, LOOK OUT...snarls, growls, hmphs, and don't look at me!s abound.









Thanks again!!


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

my daughter is 2. I can come up with some ideas for 2 year old when I have more time (later) if you want. but mostly I just focus giving her words for how she feels and making suggestions (ie - I do the brainstorming)


----------



## MacKinnon (Jun 15, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
If I were the OP I would be thrilled that my post inspired such a lovely discussion







I suppose we could use a thread on introverts and extroverts though!

I'm the OP and I am thrilled







This has been an interesting thread to read, although it's not entirely our situation. I'm sorry I abandoned it! My DD and I are very much alike, I don't think she is an introvert and I am an extrovert. I'm not sure how I would label either of us. We both tend toward a social anxiety type reaction toward unfamiliar situations but then tend to be extroverted with people we know and are familiar with. I have never labeled my DD "shy" in her hearing, or really in general. She isn't really shy, she just tends to act inappropriately in unfamiliar situations. I'm just struggling to handle this behavior. To be honest, I have always tended toward inappropriate outbursts when I am emotionally overwhelmed. I would really like to help and support my DD, to give her the skills to overcome her emotional turmoil in those situations. I feel that part of success in our society is appropriate social responses. I have never forced her to speak and have supported her when she wasn't able to respond. But I do feel that she is old enough to not growl, hmmph, etc. to strangers.

Anyway, I've got more to say, but I read through the whole thread and now don't have time for a detailed reply! But I'm home tomorrow and we will be back on to post more. It's great to read everyone's thoughts, reflections and ideas


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ilovemyavery* 
I'm the OP and I am thrilled







This has been an interesting thread to read, although it's not entirely our situation. I'm sorry I abandoned it! My DD and I are very much alike, I don't think she is an introvert and I am an extrovert. I'm not sure how I would label either of us. We both tend toward a social anxiety type reaction toward unfamiliar situations but then tend to be extroverted with people we know and are familiar with. I have never labeled my DD "shy" in her hearing, or really in general. She isn't really shy, she just tends to act inappropriately in unfamiliar situations. I'm just struggling to handle this behavior. To be honest, I have always tended toward inappropriate outbursts when I am emotionally overwhelmed. I would really like to help and support my DD, to give her the skills to overcome her emotional turmoil in those situations. I feel that part of success in our society is appropriate social responses. I have never forced her to speak and have supported her when she wasn't able to respond. But I do feel that she is old enough to not growl, hmmph, etc. to strangers.

Anyway, I've got more to say, but I read through the whole thread and now don't have time for a detailed reply! But I'm home tomorrow and we will be back on to post more. It's great to read everyone's thoughts, reflections and ideas









to me it sounds like you are both introverts - but she hasn't learned appropriate ways to handle her discomfort, and you already have


----------



## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

I am exactly halfway between extravert and introvert when I take one of those tests. I'd say the thing to do is, as some people have said, practice very rote responses at a calm time at home. If they have practiced saying "no thank you" (or equivalent) rather than shouting during repeated role-playing sessions, it is a lot more likely to come out automatically at the right time. One reason it's easier for adults to deal with this, is that we have years of practice and we don't have to make up "no thank you" from scratch when under pressure.

ETA I used to volunteer as a mentor for a 6-year-old girl who happened to be having trouble with appropriate responses in public, and that's what we did, the practice role-playing sessions.


----------



## One_Girl (Feb 8, 2008)

I think that there is nothing wrong with letting a child be shy and wait until warming up to say hi. If it is a child saying hi maybe you could say hi to them instead and ask them how they are and model how to be polite in a situation like that. The grabbing toys from kids and glaring and stomping around is not part of shyness though. That is rude and inappropriate behavior and even if you have to drag her through three floors to leave, you should. Perhaps she knows that you will not do that in certain settings and feels free to be as grabby and rude as she wants to be because she knows that you will only talk to her and not do anything to make the playgroup pleasant for the other people attending by taking her home.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *One_Girl* 
The grabbing toys from kids and glaring and stomping around is not part of shyness though.

Actually, it's quite likely that it _is_ part of shyness. People react differently to stress, and having to interact with people, on any level, can be _very_ stressful for some people. I've watched dd (not quite 6) over the years, and the glaring and stomping and grumping is always when she just can't cope with people.


----------



## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

In that case (brainstorming here, this isn't something I've dealt with) the role-playing would be about teaching the child to recognize her own emotional signals and learn to tell the parent "I'm nervous and need to leave soon," before it gets to the point where she starts to bully the other children.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lolar2* 
In that case (brainstorming here, this isn't something I've dealt with) the role-playing would be about teaching the child to recognize her own emotional signals and learn to tell the parent "I'm nervous and need to leave soon," before it gets to the point where she starts to bully the other children.

Definitely. We've done a _lot_ of work with dd on removing herself from situations that she can't handle...and she's made a lot of progress. Learning her own signals for when she's starting to overload has been very helpful to her.


----------



## NikonMama (Jan 8, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
Even in my teens, I would cut a class rather than open a door and walk inside. I almost skipped a Cub Scout board meeting (I was the treasurer), because I was running late (dd was a baby, and life was a bit crazy) and the church door was closed when I got there.

I could easily see still having trouble with people I only saw once a week. What we call "shyness" in our society can be absolutely crippling. It still causes me tremendous anxiety and affects many parts of my life...and I'm 40. I've made progress because of the kids, but it's still hard.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
My mom was always afraid of me seeming rude and talked to me a lot about not staring at people - which I don't think i ever did - but to this day I find it hard to make eye contact for any longer then it takes to make a short statement. I avoid eye contact when possible. I avoid talking to people when possible. I have to force myself to say hi, and I sometimes am socially inept, walking away during a conversation and afterward realizing I didn't really "close" the conversation properly. I sometimes wonder too if I have Aspergers, but never sought a formal diagnosis, though it would explain about myself as both a child and adult.

These sound like me. I hate social situations, and get extremely anxious about it. I completely avoid going out or being around more than just a couple good friends. The moms in my son's class (he's in 4th grade) have a "mom's night out" every month or so, and I have yet to get myself to go. I always say I'm going to, and then chicken out at the last minute. The same goes for job interviews. I panic the day or two before, and more than once I have canceled or told them I'm sick and then rescheduled.







My son is a huge extrovert, gets along with everyone, makes friends immediately, and can walk into any situation and feel completely at ease. He loves social anything, and it is so hard for me to understand him. I can't volunteer in his class or help with the class parties. They have a school dance for Valentine's day every year...and every year I assume my position in the hallway, don't move, and never talk to anyone unless they talk to me first. I have been told many times at job interviews that I'm "too shy" and have actually been told by people that I need to "work on that" or "be less shy". HUH?? The few times I have actually been in large groups, especially people I don't know, I almost have panic attacks and I don't stay very long. My husband is a HUGE extrovert, so it is hard being married to someone that loves being around people. I often come off at rude of "b*tchy". I don't know why, though, b/c I'm always extremely polite and nice to people and do my best to carry on a conversation, but I guess extroverted people (mainly women) see introverted people (again mainly women) as b*tchy. I just don't start conversations unless I know the person well.

When I was in 2nd grade I went to Parochial school, and they made me sit in the back of the class and never called on me and pretty much just ignored me. Since I never EVER talked, they labeled me as "retarded". When I was in 3rd grade my parents switched me to public school, and guess what? I was put in the "Excellence In Youth" program, which is for extremely smart children.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Theoretica* 
OMG this is me too! Glad I'm not the only one







I *HATE* people looking at me. Hate it hate it hate it!

What is weird is everyone says there's no way I'm an introvert...because once I know people I'm really comfortable. It's the 'getting to know people' that freaks me the hell out! I still really battle w/the anxiety so badly. I won't answer my door during the day unless I know who it is, I rarely answer the phone (but I return calls to ppl I know), and I hate going places with tons of people.

Yet...ask anyone who knows me and they'd say I'm really social. They just don't realize the effort it took to get to that point. Go figure!

/hijack (sheepish)

That sounds exactly like me. I am extremely shy, and come off at b*tchy to people that don't know me. I don't like talking to people I don't have a lot of contact with. Even my family (my mother, father, sister, grandmother, etc), I don't see or talk to them very often, so I feel awkward around them and rarely talk. Once I get to know someone really well and become comfortable, though, I come out of my shell and I'm a blabber mouth. I turn into a huge goof, and am really social around them.


----------



## lolar2 (Nov 8, 2005)

Just FTR, although I'm sure most of you are aware of this, it is possible to be an introvert without having social anxiety. Likewise it is possible to be an extravert and have social anxiety. They often are not correlated.


----------



## beanma (Jan 6, 2002)

Just wanted to pop in and mention that you can "feel shy" w/o being shy. I wouldn't label my kids as "shy" anymore than I would label them as always being "mad". Shyness is a feeling that comes and goes just like anger or silliness. When they don't want to speak up in public situations (rare now, but still happens sometimes) I sometimes ask them if they're _feeling_ shy.

I agree with the previous posters that correcting or offering alternatives to behaviors like growling and scowling is appropriate, but as I have learned you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. You can make it buck and kick, etc, by trying to make it drink, though. I can't *make* my kid say "Thank you" as much as I encourage it and demand it. I cannot make her lips and tongue form the words. If she decides she's not going to do it there's absolutely nothing I can do to make her and the best I can hope for if I keep prodding her about it is a big old meltdown. I can model saying "thanks", though, and I can explain that "she's feeling a little shy right now" and offer my gratitude and we can talk about it at home or in the car, but I can't make it happen. And goodness knows there are plenty of times I wish I could make it happen!

So, I try to defuse the situation if I can and ease my kid's anxieties and remind her of some things she could say or do-say thank you, smile (hard if you're feeling anxious) wave, etc, and then I let it go 'cause hangin' on will only make it worse.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lolar2* 
Just FTR, although I'm sure most of you are aware of this, it is possible to be an introvert without having social anxiety. Likewise it is possible to be an extravert and have social anxiety. They often are not correlated.

Yes. I've been talking about introversion, but also about shyness. IMO, _real_ shyness is much more closely related to social anxiety than to introversion. Mind you, the definitions of introversion that I used to see were more about shyness or social anxiety than the "energy source" definitions I see being used today.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *beanma* 
Just wanted to pop in and mention that you can "feel shy" w/o being shy. I wouldn't label my kids as "shy" anymore than I would label them as always being "mad". Shyness is a feeling that comes and goes just like anger or silliness. When they don't want to speak up in public situations (rare now, but still happens sometimes) I sometimes ask them if they're _feeling_ shy.

I guess there are different perceptions of what shyness is. When I'm talking about shyness, I'm not talking about a feeling that comes and goes. I'm talking about an integral part of my personality. If someone asked me if I were "feeling shy", I'd kind of wonder what they were talking about. I don't "feel" shy - I _am_ shy.


----------



## QueenOfThePride (May 26, 2005)

I think some of you introverts/shy people ought to go read up on Asperger's....

The diagnosis wasn't available when we were children, so no one knew about it or how to identify possible Asperger's children. I always thought I had too much shyness or social anxiety, but I've realized that I have social anxiety, *because* I don't know what to say to people, or carry on a conversation. The way I see it, introversion is a spectrum, and Asperger's typically applies to people at the more extreme end.


----------



## beanma (Jan 6, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Storm Bride* 
I guess there are different perceptions of what shyness is. When I'm talking about shyness, I'm not talking about a feeling that comes and goes. I'm talking about an integral part of my personality. If someone asked me if I were "feeling shy", I'd kind of wonder what they were talking about. I don't "feel" shy - I _am_ shy.

Well, YMMV, my kids "feel shy". They don't feel shy in every situation. Dd1 is perfectly glad to be the star of the show, in fact, and totally in the spotlight on her terms. Sometimes, though, she's a complete puddle of goo in a different situation. It is completely dependent on the situation and her feelings. It's well within the clinical definition for the feeling to come and go. I would hesitate to label a child as shy unless I knew for sure that the child always felt shy in social situations because then you're just asking the child to live up to the label - a self fulfilling prophecy. I prefer "feeling shy" as that gives some wiggle room for one day maybe feeling a different way.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

Call me an introvert/shy/aspergers/social anxiety or whatever you want to lable it, doesn't really matter I am me and I dont like social situations, but I had NO problem with stage fright. I did a lot of stage acting. I felt comfortable with a small cast of people, though not *completely*... when it comes to "being the star of the show/totally in the spotlight" for some if may be a matter of feelings shy/vs being shy. It may also be a matter of feeling comfortable ACTING _for_ others, but not INTERACTING _with_ others. I agree though, some people "feel shy" at certain times or in certain situations, some people may *be* shy by nature. Some people may *be* shy but have times where they *feel* outgoing. Being a shy person doesnt mean you dont have wiggle room to feel another way.

Also for some introverts, if their energy is in place from having enough time with their introverted needs being respected, they may have the energy to be a part of more social or interactive situations.

For me, I cannot go out with my friend at the last moment. But if she lets me know a few days in advance then I can go, and I have fun, though usually afterward I feel mentally drained. She doesn't get this and doesn't understand why I don't say yes everytime she calls and asks if I want to go to lunch with her in an hour.

I do agree though, that i prefer not to label someone as "shy". but sometimes it can be a part of who someone is, part of their personality. Like a softspoken person may be loud sometimes. It can be in your nature to be one way most of the time. If you define "shy" as "who you are" then yes, that might not leave room for wiggle room for some. However, if you acknowledge shy as part of your personality, that leaves plenty of wiggle room, but at the same time helps you to respect your limits - which is important because sometimes when others ARENT respecting your limits its good to know its "part of who you are" and that its "okay". So many people talk about shyness like its a bad thing...

also I think perhaps part of me is extroverted. if I go out with an extrovert I can find energy from interacting with THEM. Or maybe I just find interacting with them a distraction from everything else going on around me... I tend to be more "one on one" even when in a group. If I can't find that one on one within the group, I tend to just stay quiet and to myself, wishing I were home.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *beanma* 
Well, YMMV, my kids "feel shy". They don't feel shy in every situation. Dd1 is perfectly glad to be the star of the show, in fact, and totally in the spotlight on her terms. Sometimes, though, she's a complete puddle of goo in a different situation. It is completely dependent on the situation and her feelings. It's well within the clinical definition for the feeling to come and go. I would hesitate to label a child as shy unless I knew for sure that the child always felt shy in social situations because then you're just asking the child to live up to the label - a self fulfilling prophecy. I prefer "feeling shy" as that gives some wiggle room for one day maybe feeling a different way.

I wonder a lot about that sentiment about labelling people. I see it here quite a lot. I never gave a crap what label people gave my feelings, to be honest...except that the labels sometimes made me angry. I don't recall anybody _calling_ me shy as a child. I do remember hearing the "she's feeling shy" thing, and I hated it. It felt really, really dismissive.

I don't "feel shy" in every situation, either. If I walk into a party where I know everybody, and there's nothing calling major attention to me (eg. walking into a sit-down supper when everybody is already eating), I'm fine. That doesn't change that I _am_ shy - there are simply a very small, limited number of situations in which I've become at least somewhat comfortable. I have lots of "wiggle room" to feel a different way on a different day, so this line of thinking has always perplexed me a little bit. (I'm also "gifted" - doesn't mean I don't make stupid mistakes and/or act like a dope a lot.)

Anyway - that was just random babble, and I realize it may come off as if I'm criticizing your interaction with your dd. Obviously, you know her, and I don't, so you have a far better idea of how the strategy of avoiding labels is working for her.


----------



## Mirzam (Sep 9, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
Call me an introvert/shy/aspergers/social anxiety or whatever you want to lable it, doesn't really matter I am me and I dont like social situations, but I had NO problem with stage fright. I did a lot of stage acting. I felt comfortable with a small cast of people, though not *completely*... when it comes to "being the star of the show/totally in the spotlight" for some if may be a matter of feelings shy/vs being shy. It may also be a matter of feeling comfortable ACTING _for_ others, but not INTERACTING _with_ others. I agree though, some people "feel shy" at certain times or in certain situations, some people may *be* shy by nature. Some people may *be* shy but have times where they *feel* outgoing. Being a shy person doesnt mean you dont have wiggle room to feel another way.


I agree, my "shy" son certainly isn't shy on the soccer pitch. One of his coaches has even made that very comment. The kid can barely say "hi" to the man, but on the field he really "performs", he gives it his all.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I agree that shyness and self-consciousness are two different things. I happen to suffer from both, to a significant degree, but I know many people who only suffer from one or the other.


----------



## Super Glue Mommy (Jan 4, 2009)

i think it really just comes down to figuring out the personalities of those you live and interact with, and finding a way to respect that (and in cases of children finding a way to respect that but teaching them how they can respect that in themselves without being hurtful towards others - though some people may see things as rude even when it's not...), and allowing them to grow their way, not trying to force them to fit into a mold. And also seperating feelings from personality. I think there are a lot of times people think i am *feeling* shy but it's just *who I am* and I want to be accepted for that, not made to feel I need to change, or like being shy is a *bad label*. being shy isn't what hurts, its not having the skills to cope with shyness and not having people who know you support you without trying to change you that hurts.


----------



## jeteaa (Jan 23, 2007)

my 4.5 yr old dd1 could often be considered "shy". We were in the store the other day, and as usual, the cashier tried to intereact with her and dd1 turns away and hides her face. The cashier says "oh, she must be shy". And I say "No, she just must not be interested in talking with you". Yes, maybe a bit rude on my part, but it was true. A few minutes later we run into a mom friend and dd1 lights up and talks just fine with her.
The best thing I read about "introvertness", is that it may not be introvertness, just the lack of social skills. So I feel my job in this situation is to teach my dc social skills and support THEM 100% in any social situation. If a child was RUDE to others in order to HURT them, then thats not ok. But, I have yet to meet a child who is that deep down rotten to act out in that way. So I assume the rudeness has some other roots.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Super Glue Mommy* 
I think there are a lot of times people think i am *feeling* shy but it's just *who I am* and I want to be accepted for that, not made to feel I need to change, or like being shy is a *bad label*.









:


----------

