# My Child Needs More Nutrition



## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

After speaking with an attachment therapist about the issues we were having with our recently-adopted child refusing to eat almost everything we served, we adopted a "here's the food, eat it or don't" approach. This worked very well. We didn't comment on what or how much she ate and the food battles almost completely disappeared.

Well, no good deed goes unpunished, right? When we were at the HIV doctor last week, he told us that, based on our daughter's most recent labs, she is deficient in several nutrients, two of them being calcium and iron. She refuses dairy products and green vegetables, in particular.

Now, I like to believe that children deserve freedom and autonomy in their eating, but I am not willing to let one of my children become malnourished for it. We spoke with the doc about giving her supplements and he said she needs the nutrition from FOOD, not supplements. He talked with her about this, we talked with her about this, but we are having huge food issues again. Her list of what she won't eat is a mile long, and she consistently refuses the vegetables that we serve her. Believe me, I have done everything I possibly can short of preparing traditional Ethiopian food every single night of the week (we usually eat it three times a week) to accomodate her likes and dislikes, but the simple fact is, she claims that she doesn't like so many foods that she is not getting enough variety to meet her nutritional needs.

We were driving today and I was trying to make a list of vegetables that she will eat. I came up with carrots (sometimes, other times she says she doesn't like them), cabbage, and eggplant, but only if it's fried. She won't eat broccoli, asparagus, artichokes, brussels sprouts, zucchini, squash, corn, peas, tomatoes (I know, they are a fruit), okra, spinach, collards (or any other type of greens), green beans, etc. The only veggies that I can remember her eating are carrots (sometimes), cabbage, and fried eggplant.

I am considering telling her that she can choose three or four foods that she absolutely will not eat and that, for the sake of her health, she has to eat whatever I serve if it's not one of those three or four foods.

Any suggestions?


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## captain optimism (Jan 2, 2003)

Why is the doctor opposed to supplementation? That seems really unfair! So much pressure on you and your children. Is it just because the supplements are poorly absorbed?

Okay, if I were in your shoes (which I am not, so this is just top of my head here) I would get a children's cookbook and do food purchasing and cooking together. I see that you homeschool, and it seems like a great opportunity to do some math and science. You can also do some nutrition curriculum with her. She might learn to like more things if she's involved in preparing them.

I am sorry you are coping with such a tough thing.


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

This site mentions other foods that are rich in calcium and iron.
http://www.vegsource.com/davis/nutritents.htm


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

I know you've worked so hard to get her healthy.

Here are some thoughts in no particular order:

will she eat salad? Spinach can be used for greens.
Will she eat sandwiches? Again- spinach instead of lettuce.
will she eat pizza? or other dishes with tomato sauce? A lot can be added to tomato sauce.

Muffins? zucchini muffins are yummy and sweet.
Ice cream? A good last resort for dairy.
Smoothies?
Yogurt?

For iron, I would increase her vitamin c- to increase absorbtion (actually you need c to absorb both iron and calcium, this could be part of the problem) I would use sodium ascorbate- it's easily disolved in water or juice and better absorbed than other types (like ascorbic acid or calcium ascorbate)

Also for iron, I'd use floradix- yeah it's a supplement, but more natural than most.

I would bet that once her body becomes more balanced, she will become less resistant to so many foods.

good luck!

-Angela


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:

Why is the doctor opposed to supplementation? That seems really unfair! So much pressure on you and your children. Is it just because the supplements are poorly absorbed?
Yes, it's that combined with the fact that HIV can cause malabsorption.

Quote:

will she eat salad?
No.

Quote:

Will she eat sandwiches?
Only PB&J. We went to a picnic and they served turkey sandwiches (we are veg but Desta is not) and she took everything off the sandwich and just ate the bread.

Quote:

will she eat pizza?
Yes, and that baffles me. She says her favorite food is pizza (plain cheese) but she won't eat cheese any other way.

Quote:

or other dishes with tomato sauce? A lot can be added to tomato sauce.
Yes, she will eat pasta with tomato sauce. We make our own, and it does have lots of other veggies in it. That's a good source.

Quote:

Muffins? zucchini muffins are yummy and sweet.
Yes, she does like those.

Quote:

Ice cream?
Nope.

Quote:

Smoothies?
Nope.

Quote:

Yogurt?
Nope.

The vit. C and Floradix suggestions are good ones. Thanks!

Namaste!


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Okay- the pizza and tomato sauce are a GREAT start. Do you have a food processor? I can hide ANYTHING in tomato sauce









zucchini, spinach, other greens, green peppers, carrots, you name it, it goes in tomato sauce.

Heck, serve pizza or pasta once a day, you can get several good servings in that way.

zucchini muffins can have other stuff added too.

I think the key here is going to be some GOOD quality supplements and being best friends with a food processor for a little while.









oooo, another thought- spinach dip - think it would have any chance of working? Will she eat raw veggies with a dip? Does she like dips? (dips are another good place to hide nutrition)

Go back and pretend she's a 4 yr old who won't eat anything. Try those tricks. (ants on a log? is she more likely to eat it if she made it?)

Ah- one more thought- homemade breads. I often substitute cottage cheese or yogurt for the liquid in bread recipies. you can't tell the difference.

good luck!

-Angela


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## Village Mama (Jul 22, 2004)

I think you may be reading too much into that... (I think you are great by the way!) and that it is unfair to go there... just my opinion though.

The suggestions here are great... as well as chips with blended bean dip and raw veggies thrown in. Blended soups can be a great way to get things in. Some kids prefer to eat everything raw. Does she like veggie juices?
I would definitely try to make some sort of fun homeschooling thing out of it... maybe explore sprouting things to eat herself, or look at trendy ways of eating like raw food, or vegan.Her helping and having power in making the choices might help. I hate making food an issue as well... but we slowly phased out anything that was not really good nutritionally, and the whole family eats really really well because of this.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Oh, no! I didn't read it that way at all!

I read that she went through a lot to bring her here, because she loves her and want the best for her--wants her to thrive and be healthy. So it doesn't make sense to let her become malnourished here where food is so readily available!

If she eats pizza, I would serve that *a lot*. Lots can be hidden in the sauce (pureed veggies, for instance).


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## Pandora114 (Apr 21, 2005)

I second the whizz everything up into a tomato sauce and let her eat whole grain pasta to her hearts content.

I would be leary of the spinach dip though. She'll see the green bits and go "OMG GROSS!!!!!!"

Will she eat seafood???

ETA: If she likes salty things, and seafood, how about trying to get her to eat some Dulse??

http://www.rolandsdulse.com/ He does mail order...If you tell him Ivy's daughter sent you you'll get the good dulse and possibly a discount.. ETA: AGAIN lol

Even if she wont eat it whole, you can wizz it up into the tomato sauce like you would any other veggie


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pandora114* 
Will she eat seafood???

Nope. She eats beef and chicken.

Namaste!


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## Pandora114 (Apr 21, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
Nope. She eats beef and chicken.

Namaste!

Well your best bet is to get some Dulse and wizz it up into the tomato sauce...if you browse the page I posted it'll show the nutritional content of the plant and you'll be amazed









http://www.rolandsdulse.com/chart.html


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## Nora'sMama (Apr 8, 2005)

Will she eat a smoothie? Put enough fruit/other sweeteners in a smoothie and you can add just about anything else without affecting the taste.

yogurt, fruit and frozen spinach (due to the concerns with fresh spinach but also because it helps the smoothie stay cold!) is a good one, and you could add nutritional yeast for B vitamins, protein powder, maybe Floradix (don't know if it would completely hide the taste though) or crush a flavored children's vite w/ calcium and dump it in there too.

make it w/ whatever fruits she likes. heck whatever foods, period, she likes. the blender is magic for making food attractive.

(there is also the old standby of throwing an egg in, too, for added iron and protein, but raw eggs...salmonella...your comfort level may not be high w/ that depending on the source of the eggs.)


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## mata (Apr 20, 2006)

lots of great suggestions here-I really hope things improve for you all very soon-that must be so hard on you.







I have one more tiny contribution. I put a lot of nutrient-dense things in pancakes (silver dollar size go over best here)-flax seed oil, yogurt, pumpkin, spinach, etc. You mentioned you're seeing an attachment therapist, and I'm sure you've explored all possibilities to help her-do you feel there's possibly an emotional component behind her refusing these foods? I hope I don't offend and it's not my intention to pretend to be an expert, but it sounds like she's trying to control her environment. I can't help but wonder if these issues will improve as she feels safer in her new home. I hope she's soon accepting more foods that give her the nutrients she needs, and you're able to put this stress behind you.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 

Honestly, I am a bit offended that you would even think I think my daughter is a product I bought. You clearly know nothing about me. Perhaps I worded things poorly but really ... give me the benefit of the doubt here. I'm frustrated and worried about my daughter.

I'm sorry your feelings are hurt. I know you are worried about your daughter. I just was really shocked at the phrasing... that after all you went thru, the money you spent, she didn't have the right to malnourish herself. I thought it was important to point it out.

Good luck finding ways to nourish your daughter. I think there have been some helpful suggestions on this thread. I might also prepare more of the foods she is used to, ask her what she would like to eat, that she is familiar with, and prepare that.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mata* 
I hope I don't offend and it's not my intention to pretend to be an expert, but it sounds like she's trying to control her environment.

Yes, I think you're exactly right. That's why the attachment therapist's advice worked so well. We completely removed the power struggle by saying nothing about what and how much she ate. She was completely in control. It worked well. (Previous to that, she would do things like request something specific for dinner and then, when I served it, tell me she didn't like that food [before even tasting it].) The problem we run into now is that the AT's and the doctor's advice seem to conflict (the doctor was pretty clear that we need to *make* her eat what she needs), and I feel like I'm stuck either way: Make her eat things she says she doesn't want to eat and screw up our attachment but have a healthy kid or let her eat whatever she wants and have a malnourished kid. I'm looking for ways to integrate the two so they aren't opposing ideas. I really appreciate the advice and suggestions I'm getting.

I guess part of it too is that, as a vegetarian, I am constantly inundated with the "eat a variety to get your nutrients" idea, so the idea of serving spaghetti (for example) every day makes me uncomfortable. But it's true that, if I can get a variety of NUTRIENTS into the meal, it doesn't really matter if the MEAL is repetitious.

Thanks again everyone!

Namaste!


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

Back again, post nap.

Peanut butter is a great source of iron. Almonds have both iron and calcium. I grind them in my coffee grinder and put them in baked goods. How about raisins and figs?

Dairy is not an easily absorbed source of calcium, so I wouldn't even look there. The ratio of calcium and phosphorus should be one to one for human absorption, like breastmilk. Cows milk has a one to two ratio. That extra phosphorus REALLY wants to bond with some calcium so it will do so with what is already in your body and cause you to excrete the calcium you had.


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## Pandora114 (Apr 21, 2005)

oooh I know! Does she like...

COOKIES???

Come on, hehehe Cookies.

You can make, Gingerbread cookies, and subsitute the regular molasses for Blackstrap..voila! IRON SUPPLIMENT!


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
. But it's true that, if I can get a variety of NUTRIENTS into the meal, it doesn't really matter if the MEAL is repetitious.


I think this is probably key at this point. If she wants pizza every day- give her pizza every day. Every week make new sauce and add different goodies







She could have muffins every morning- make a bunch of different kinds, pop them in the freezer, defrost a different one every day.

So if you can get two - know she'll eat them and know they're nutritious- meals in her every day, that gives you lattitude to have a family dinner that's different every night that she can eat or not.

Something else to think on- what she's doing is developmentally appropriate. MANY kids go through a finicky stage. Her's is just more dangerous because of her medical issues.

let us know how it goes! I think of your family often









-Angela


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## mata (Apr 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
Yes, I think you're exactly right. That's why the attachment therapist's advice worked so well. We completely removed the power struggle by saying nothing about what and how much she ate. She was completely in control. It worked well. (Previous to that, she would do things like request something specific for dinner and then, when I served it, tell me she didn't like that food [before even tasting it].) The problem we run into now is that the AT's and the doctor's advice seem to conflict (the doctor was pretty clear that we need to *make* her eat what she needs), and I feel like I'm stuck either way: Make her eat things she says she doesn't want to eat and screw up our attachment but have a healthy kid or let her eat whatever she wants and have a malnourished kid. I'm looking for ways to integrate the two so they aren't opposing ideas. I really appreciate the advice and suggestions I'm getting.

I guess part of it too is that, as a vegetarian, I am constantly inundated with the "eat a variety to get your nutrients" idea, so the idea of serving spaghetti (for example) every day makes me uncomfortable. But it's true that, if I can get a variety of NUTRIENTS into the meal, it doesn't really matter if the MEAL is repetitious.

Thanks again everyone!

Namaste!


yes, that's definitely a difficult balancing act. just trying to think of ways for her to feel empowered and in control here-do you involve her in her meal preparation? I know my daughters are more willing to eat things if they're involved in the preparation, and if the preparation is fun. Using fun shaped cookie cutters (letting them pick out the ones they want to use, etc. etc.) on sandwiches and cheeses, making dips for carrots, having their own little pans for making muffins, breads, mini lentil or meatloafs, etc.


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## embers (Mar 24, 2006)

Avacado, spinich, collards, broccli, carrot, etc.... these things can get blended/processed and added into so many other things - the pizza sause, sause for noodles, in the dough or noodles if you make them from scratch, in baking (muffins, bread, etc)... Avacado is so easy to hide that you can mash it into pudding cups or blend it into ketsup!

I would also go for suppliments, too. Why not?

Flax oil in cold food...

Strawberries and bananas (kiwi, pear, etc) mashed together into a gram cracker crumb crust - and go ahead an hide avacado mashed up, tofu, and some spinich cut TINY. you can stir in a touch of the flax oil... and even a spoon full of yogurt if you blend it well and add enough banana so she does not know the difference!


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## ameliabedelia (Sep 24, 2002)

I think the hiding foods in other foods is a good idea to a point, but you really need to work on helping her eat a variety of foods. I wouldn't count on the "hiding foods" method to be enought to get her enough nutrition. I mean, how many vegetables is she really going to get in the oh, 2-3 tablespoons of tomato sauce she eats on pizzas or pasta. Not much, and not anywhere near even ONE serving of zuccini or spinach or whatever. And, there IS a limit to how much spinach or zuccini or whatever you can hide. I mean, no way are you going to hide even 1 whole zucchini in a cup of tomato sauce (trust me, I've tried LOL) and really to get a serving of veggies, it needs to be AT LEAST 1/2 cup of something thing like cooked spinach or zucchini. When it comes to eating veggies and getting proper nutrition...VOLUMNE is key. Since she is so mal-nourished, you can't really count her getting those nutrients from veggies unless she eats large quanities of the veggies. There's not enough zucchini in zucchini muffins, not going to be enough blackstrap molasses in gingerbread cookies, etc., etc. . Obviously, every little bit helps..but it sounds as though she just really needs to be getting QUANITIES of nutrient dense foods, not just little bits hidden here and there.

I definitely suggest getting her involved in cooking, finding recipies, shopping, preparing foods, etc. Really, though..she is 11 right. That is old enough to learn that sometimes we eat things don't really like because they are good for us. I cook and eat different veggies almost every night..and trust me I don't LOVE vegeatables. Some I like more than others..but generally I am not eating them because I really like them..I am eating them because I KNOW they are good for me and an imporant part of my diet and I find them tolerable. I think you need to really talk to her about this, and WORK with her on finding ways to make the foods tolerable and yummy. Help her look for recipies. Maybe plant a garden together (late for this year, but maybe next spring). What she grows, she is likely to eat. Go to a farmer's market together, etc. Just really involve her the process and also let her know that sometimes we do eat foods, that may not be super, yumny declicious because our body needs the fuel we provide. I am not saying your should force her or anyting, or start punishing or rewarding when it comes to food, obviously gentle discipline is NEEDED here...but 11 isn't too young to learn that sometimes we eat things we may not LOVE because they are good for us.

The other thing, is does she like nuts. Nuts are really yummy, especially things like cashews and brazil nuts..,most people do like them..and they are really nutrient dense. Dried fruits are good too..and a great way to get the nutrients in a denser form, without having to eat the same quanity as you would of the fresh fruit.


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## kama'aina mama (Nov 19, 2001)

Your doctor is an idiot. Anyone who thinks you can force another person to eat something they don't want to is an idiot. It's just really not possible.

How hard is it to just make her what she likes? Why not make Ethiopian food that is familiar to her and healthy available all the time? Make large batches and freeze if it makes it simpler. I can't imagine trying to force a child with health issues to eat food she doesn't like when there is a perfectly reasonable option.

Oh... don't microwave her food either... but you probably knew that.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kama'aina mama* 
Your doctor is an idiot.

Actually he's not an idiot. He knows she needs more nutrition.

Quote:

How hard is it to just make her what she likes?
Well, as I mentioned in this thread, the foods that she will eat don't provide her with enough variety to get all the nutrition that she needs. That's why I posted this thread asking for suggestions.

I'm much more along the lines of ameliabedelia in that she needs to learn more about proper nutrition and expand her palate a bit. Another problem is that, when she lived in the orphanage, she had no choice in what was perpared or served. If she was hungry, she had to eat what she was given or go hungry. So things that she would eat in Ethiopia because she had to are things that she won't eat here because she sees that we have lots of other options. Which is fine, I want her to have choices, but it ends up with her eating peanut butter, spaghetti, and carrots almost to the exclusion of other foods. It's not a matter of me making food that she likes. I do that a lot. It's a matter of her not getting a balanced diet because she refuses so many foods that have nutrients she needs.

Namaste!


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## PoppyMama (Jul 1, 2004)

If he's not an idiot then he's an unsympathetic and unrealistic @$$. I also don't find it at all surprising that your dd has food issues. What else has she been able to control in this life. Even if absorbtion is an issue wouldn't a high quality suppliment that absorbs better than other vitamins be better than the other options.


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## kama'aina mama (Nov 19, 2001)

I'm sorry, maybe I misunderstood, but when you said

Quote:

Believe me, I have done everything I possibly can short of preparing traditional Ethiopian food every single night of the week (we usually eat it three times a week) to accomodate her likes and dislikes, but the simple fact is, she claims that she doesn't like so many foods that she is not getting enough variety to meet her nutritional needs.
I took that to mean that you believe that if you cooked her the food she is accustomed to and she ate it she would be fine.

Black strap molasses is a great suggestion. Do you have a cast iron pan? Cooking anything in cast iron dramatically increases iron intake. Where is the calcium on a traditional Ethiopian diet? I assume leafy greens... does she eat them when prepared how she grew up with them? Calcium is trickier than iron.

And... okay... explain to me how to force a person to eat.


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## milk_maker (Jun 24, 2004)

I have no advice to give being the mom of a super picky eater myself, but just wanted to chime in with kudos to you. I've off and on e-stalked you and your path to adopting your daughter and just think you and your family is awesome!









Oh and I'm taking notes because there are some great suggestions in here...maybe I can get Mr. Picky Pants to eat using some of these ideas.


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## mammastar2 (Dec 17, 2004)

It sounds like the doctor and the attachment therapist both have important things to say, but different concerns. The problem is that you share both their (valid) concerns, and you're faced with trying to follow two conflicting pieces of advice!

Perhaps in the short-term you can focus on 'hiding' high-density nutritional foods in the things that she will eat, and using good quality supplements. Long term, if you continue to avoid food battles as per the attachment therapist's recommendation, you may well have more success getting her to branch out and try a variety of foods than if food again becomes a source of conflict and control.

While no doubt the HIV doctor is correct that it is important for her to eat better, he is not a parenting expert, and may not have thought through the fact that trying to 'make' her eat the recommended diet could lead her to stubbornly restrict her diet more. Conversely, hiding the good stuff in things she likes and giving her supplements could take the pressure off and allow an easier path to better eating as you spend more time together, garden, cook, relax, shop for stuff, etc.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Sorry, I was editing for clarification and we cross-posted.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *kama'aina mama* 
I'm sorry, maybe I misunderstood, but when you said I took that to mean that you believe that if you cooked her the food she is accustomed to and she ate it she would be fine.

No, I meant that, I do what I can to make sure that she has the opportunity to eat meals that she likes, but she needs a wider variety than that.

Quote:

Do you have a cast iron pan? Cooking anything in cast iron dramatically increases iron intake.
Yes, I do almost all my cooking in cast-iron.

Quote:

Where is the calcium on a traditional Ethiopian diet? I assume leafy greens... does she eat them when prepared how she grew up with them? Calcium is trickier than iron.
Mostly it is in milk (which she won't eat) and injera made with teff. Teff has a lot of calcium in it. We are working on making injera (Ethiopian flatbread) with teff, but so far every recipe we have tried has failed. We continue to work on it. They also eat a lot of collards, but she won't eat them here.

Quote:

And... okay... explain to me how to force a person to eat.
Well, you're right, you can't force a person to eat. But telling us that our daughter needs to eat the things that give her the nutrition she needs does not make him an idiot.









Namaste!


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## colobus237 (Feb 2, 2004)

Making big batches of the foods she prefers and freezing/refrigerating them in meal-size portions sounds great. I often freeze things in sandwich-bag size freezer bags, thaw and serve.
What about meats and eggs for iron? Red meats served with tomatoes?
Almond butter and jelly sandwiches? On fortified bread? Orange juice with calcium? Ice cream, or frozen yogurt, or pudding?
What foods is the doctor recommending?


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## captain optimism (Jan 2, 2003)

I had another idea, spinning off of both all of the people who thought involving her in food prep might help, and her tolerance for food prepared in a traditional Ethiopian way.

It would be sooo cool for you to write a kids' Ethiopian cookbook with her. It could have information in it about what nutrients people get from traditional Ethiopian foods, how to buy ingredients in a US supermarket for the dishes, and then recipes. it would be a great homeschooling project for your family, it could help her understand how eating more foods is good for her, it would make her proud of a big accomplishment--

and I would totally buy the book when it's done! so would a lot of us! We would love to learn from your family about Ethiopian culture. Plus a lot of us would be happy to get a kid-friendly explanation of nutrition written by another kid.

(Of course she might also want to include recipes for pizza or peanut-butter sandwiches, with nutrition information for those--and that's fine, too.)


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## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

Quote:

I'm much more along the lines of ameliabedelia in that she needs to learn more about proper nutrition and expand her palate a bit.
She does, I agree, but maybe she doesn't need to do this so much short term as long term. She's had a huge, huge change in her life. Her whole world has been turned upside down. For the better, to be sure, but for a child it's a lot to deal with.

Personally, I'd go along with the hiding whatever good stuff you can in the foods she will eat for now. Pasta 5 times a week with different stuff in the sauce won't hurt her.

You say she eats chicken and beef but you are veggie. Are you willing to cook those things for her? I know it's a pain to have to cook two different meals and in normal circumstances I'm not in favor of it. But I think that right now Desta has enough going on emotionally and developmentally that it might be worth doing.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Here is an example of how things are going right now:

For lunch today I asked the kids what they wanted. Efram suggested eggs, and Ramona and Desta said that was fine. Efram and Desta chose hardboiled eggs and Ramona chose scrambled. When we sat down to eat, Desta peeled the whites off the eggs and left the yolks (with all the calcium and iron) sitting on the plate.









Another example:

I served burritos for dinner last night. I had rice, corn, beans, lettuce, tomatoes, avocados, spinach, and cheese available as fillings. Desta got a jar of peanut butter and ate a pb burrito.

I don't mean to sound like I am griping. I really don't. I just feel so completely responsible for this kid, ESPECIALLY because her life has changed so dramatically, and trying to balance everything I am trying to deal with in parenting her well and meeting her medical needs sometimes feels like a Sisyphean task.

Namaste!


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

I would just go with it. She ate egg whites and a peanut butter burrito. What's wrong with that? I think if you try to turn it into a control issue, by making her serve what you prepare with a few exceptions, things will get worse.

Can you make more Ethiopian foods? What Ethiopian dishes does she like? Are you making them properly? Is her eating picky there too, or is she more willing to eat those things because they are more familiar?


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## kama'aina mama (Nov 19, 2001)

How much of this have you discussed with her?


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EFmom* 
You say she eats chicken and beef but you are veggie. Are you willing to cook those things for her?

At the risk of being crucified for not being flexible enough, the honest answer is that no, I have not cooked these things for her. Vegetarianism is (among other things) a religious value for us, so we have not as yet prepared and served meat for her in our home.

HOWEVER! Between regular visits to other people's houses, food that Ethiopian friends bring for her, visits to restaurants, and relatives visiting our house and bringing food for her, Desta has the oppurtunity to eat meat 3-5 times any given week, which is about as often as she ate it in Ethiopia.

We have spoken with both the nutritionist and the HIV doc about this (as well as our pediatrician) and all three have mentioned that we don't want to overload on animal fats anyway because HIV meds can raise blood lipid levels. We checked with the HIV doc before we ever adopted her about whether an veg diet would be nutritionally adequate for her and we were told that many HIV docs actually recommend a veg diet. We chose not to "make" Desta be a vegetarian.

We are exploring the idea of buying deli meats for her (not the nitrate-laden packaged kind) that she could put on sandwiches and that we would not have to prepare, but she has told us that she really only wants meat wat (wat is stew in Ethiopia) for meat. She's not even a fan of hamburgers.

Namaste!


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
What's wrong with that?

Well, I meant is as an example of how she tends to avoid the foods that have the nutrients she is deficient in, even down to avoiding the specific parts of those foods that are highest in the nutrients she needs.

Quote:

Can you make more Ethiopian foods? What Ethiopian dishes does she like? Are you making them properly? Is her eating picky there too, or is she more willing to eat those things because they are more familiar?
She claims that I make the Ethio food well, and she eats it with gusto, as long as it's not collards. I have tried that three times and she has eaten very, very small portions of it and then gotten peanut butter to put on the rest fo her injera. I think part of it is that she's just not familiar with a lot of what we eat, so we need to help her expand her familiarity with American food.

Namaste!


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

You know what, I would make the meat wat. You have a child who is HIV+ and probably has low appetite related to her health condition, who came only a few months ago from Ethiopia to America, your family, and all the huge shock and change with that. Can you even imagine? I can't.

And then to have so much of the food be different too. I know it probably seems like a lot to cook Ethiopian food 3x/week, but that means 18 of the meals you are serving her every week are unfamiliar. And how authentically are you able to cook Ethiopian dishes?

Your religious objection to meat, a food she likes, must be hard. Eating it seperates her from your family, at a time when she is new to your family and must feel seperate still already. I think it would be really helpful to show your support and acceptance of her by cooking meat in the manner she enjoys it, or by asking someone else to cook substantial quantities regularly, and have them available in your fridge for her.

ETA - I was veg for 15 years so I can really relate to how odd it feels to cook meat. I think it's worth it, tho.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama*

She claims that I make the Ethio food well, and she eats it with gusto, as long as it's not collards.

Well, I think that is great. I would cook it every day. I don't think she needs to eat collards, there are lots of other Ethiopian sources of the nutrients she needs, I'm sure.


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## Starr (Mar 16, 2005)

Hugs. Food issues with any child adopted can be a struggle. Having her be older only means she gets tovoice her displeasure instead of crying. BTDT.

For now I think it wouldn't hurt to grate veggies and sneak it into other foods. Baby steps. Maybe over time you could grate them less finely as she gets comfortable and use to eating it.

Cheese pizza. Can you hide other food under the cheese layer?

What about trying to eat at friends houses more often. Maybe if she is a guest and thinks she has less say or options over eating something else she will eat whats in front of her not to be rude. May not work but could be worth a try.

A goal system. Teach her about food choices and have a reward system if she eats so much dairy or veggies that day she can get a treat or reward. May seem a little childish but if she is working towards something she may eat it.

Other than that good luck. I hope over time it becomes less of a struggle. Others had some great ideas but only you know what will work and what wont. Keep us posted, I so miss the updates in your blog about how she is doing.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

If it were my child I would give them supplements while working on food issues. I totally agree whole heartedly that nutrition should come from food but you can't let a child, especaily one with health issues, suffer malnutrition until she decides to eat better. I would supplement while working to getting more nutrients into her. You have already gotten some good ideas of how to do that.

Juicing and smooties are both excellent options. you can slip all kinds of stuff into smooties on the sly. freezing them as popcicles are also a good way to add soem more. Calcium fortified orange juice if she will drink it is a good option too (nothing from concentrate tastes good. i would go with the minute maid in the carton . . . ) but litle more than a glorified suppliment. however I am guessing you may have trouble getting suppliments into her . . . . Pudding. lots of milk in pudding. yes lots of crap in the instant pudding but I will risk it for chocolate. . . I mean calcium . . .

good luck. Youhave so many issues working against you. it must be so frustrating. one guy saying youahve to do this because this is best and another saying the oposite is best and both of them being right to an extent.


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

I think her acceptance of American foods will come naturally, in time. Maybe as she makes more and more American friends, and sees the foods that her peers enjoy. Surely as she is exposed to foods over and over that she sees the rest of the family enjoy.

I would definitely educate her about nutrition, as I would any child. But I don't think I'd choose this battle right now--battling her to eat more foreign foods. I would work with her preferences--wat, pizza, pasta, etc. Have portions in the freezer, and serve it right along with your regular meal. And then go back to not commenting at all on what she chooses to eat.


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## ~member~ (May 23, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
Believe me, I have done everything I possibly can short of preparing traditional Ethiopian food every single night of the week (we usually eat it three times a week) to accomodate her likes and dislikes, but the simple fact is, she claims that she doesn't like so many foods that she is not getting enough variety to meet her nutritional needs.

You are expecting a child who has grown up with awesome food to switch to this society's foods? As an adult, I have gone back to eating the food I knew and loved as a child.

I would find a way to prepare her tradional foods and learn to like them , too. They are a lot healthier than typical American meals, iykwim.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

Would it help for her Dr. and her therapist to get together with you and discuss it all together? there really are two seperate issues at work here that need to be brought together.

another thought was do you have an ethiopian resteraunt near you? I know the one here serves huge portions for a reasonable price and you could easily split them up and keep them on hand to make as a part of your regular meal or as a lunch option. I know the flat bread they serve is insanely nutritious, so even if you could pop some of that on the table at every meal. mesh ethiopian foods into every meal kinda? rather than making a whole meal every now and then.


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## ~member~ (May 23, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 
I think her acceptance of American foods will come naturally, in time.

But why should she?


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## sunnmama (Jul 3, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaInTheBoonies* 
But why should she?

The dr said it would be healthier for her to have less animal fats, considering her HIV meds. So I can understand why the OP would prefer her to broaden her palate beyond Ethiopian food, if it is largely meat based.


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## ShadowMom (Jun 25, 2004)

Have you considered a supplemental drink... one of the nutrition ones? There is everything from Slimfast that is fortified, to protein drinks, and then I think there are quite a few at the health food store, depending on what sort you're looking for. That might help with calcium intake.

As far as iron - isn't there quite a bit of iron in red meat? You said she likes red meat. Maybe more meals with that?

Also, how about stuff with good 'ol flour? Wheat flour has a reasonable amount of iron in it, and I believe even white flour is fortified. There are lots of bread like things you can make, maybe she would eat one of those? How about pancakes with a flavoring she would like? Maybe rolls or biscuits? Ooooh... I bet you could sneak some things into a muffin.

Dunno if this helps at all, but that's all I can think of mama. Good luck.


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## colobus237 (Feb 2, 2004)

There are very lean meats available that would probably work great in a stew (trimmed chicken breasts, lean cheap cuts of beef or lamb or goat). US pork is so lean that it has to be injected with liquids to make it edible. I agree with thismama's suggestions.
I don't think that Ethiopian food is necessarily heavily meat-based...I can't imagine that would be economical. But it is a concentrated source of some important nutrients, and for an ill child who is having trouble getting enough nutrition, that would overcome other considerations for me. I think broadening the palate or eating what the family eats are secondary (or less) considerations when dealing with a kid who has a life-threatening illness and who does not need power struggles in life right now...yk?


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## EFmom (Mar 16, 2002)

Quote:

another thought was do you have an ethiopian resteraunt near you? I know the one here serves huge portions for a reasonable price and you could easily split them up and keep them on hand to make as a part of your regular meal or as a lunch option.
If you've got one near you, I think this is a fabulous idea. Buy a couple of orders of wat, and divvy it up into meal sized portions and pop them in the freezer for Desta.

I can understand how it would be tough to have to add cooking Ethiopian food every single meal as an additional task right now. I'll bet your plate is more than full, bad pun intended!


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## ~member~ (May 23, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnmama* 
The dr said it would be healthier for her to have less animal fats, considering her HIV meds. So I can understand why the OP would prefer her to broaden her palate beyond Ethiopian food, if it is largely meat based.

FWIW- everytime I have eaten with my friends, there is only one meat dish among several vegetarian/bean dishes.


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## momto l&a (Jul 31, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
Here is an example of how things are going right now:

For lunch today I asked the kids what they wanted. Efram suggested eggs, and Ramona and Desta said that was fine. Efram and Desta chose hardboiled eggs and Ramona chose scrambled. When we sat down to eat, Desta peeled the whites off the eggs and left the yolks (with all the calcium and iron) sitting on the plate.









Snip


My girls suggest hardboiled eggs but the yoke is so dry they end not eating them.

So I discovered that deviling the eggs they gobbled them right up.


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## gaialice (Jan 4, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
After speaking with an attachment therapist about the issues we were having with our recently-adopted child refusing to eat almost everything we served, we adopted a "here's the food, eat it or don't" approach. This worked very well. We didn't comment on what or how much she ate and the food battles almost completely disappeared.

I did not have time to read all the responses, so bear with me if someone has already said this. I personally think I would keep the approach to food you agreed with the therapist (maybe adding to her plate a food you're sure she will eat like for instance iron-rich whole wheat pasta), while at the same time completing her plate with the great recipes that pps have put forward. Food battles stink. She will grow up to like more foods as she grows older. I was worried last year my eldest ate very few foods, now the list of dislikes is getting shorter and shorter and it is the little one who is starting the "I do not like it" phase. I think the more of an issue this becomes the longer the phase will last. Does she like sardines dissolved in hot olive oil and served as a dip for toasts? That's the most calcium-rich thing in the world. I used to eat that during pregnancy and while nursing... Good luck...Your children are beautiful... and Desta looks so well adjusted from your blog and your pics... I thought the idea of building a "little house" was just great! I am sure this will solve itself out..


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MamaInTheBoonies* 
I would find a way to prepare her tradional foods and learn to like them , too. They are a lot healthier than typical American meals, iykwim.

Okie dokie, one more time for those of us who may have missed it: I cook Ethiopian food. Frequently. I plan Ethiopian at least 3 times a week for dinner. She eats an Ethiopian breakfast every morning. She eats leftover Ethiopian dinners for lunch. We eat Ethiopian at friends' houses several times a month. Ethiopian friends bring us Ethiopian food several times a month. We visit Ethiopian restaurants several times a month. Our entire family loves Ethiopian food. I do not serve the SAD in our home. We eat a healthy, whole-foods, multi-ethnic vegetarian diet.

Eating, serving and liking Ethiopian food is not the problem.

The problem is that she is not getting the nutrients she needs from the foods she eats. I honestly do not think that this is a problem of my lack of providing her with foods she likes. I buy foods she likes. I prepare foods she likes. She has access to fodds she likes as snacks. The list of things that she likes is *microscopic[/i] and does not encompass enough variety to give her all the nutrition she needs.

I'm getting the feeling that people think I am being inflexible. I honestly do not think this is the case. I am not plunking down plates of stuff she hates and saying "







Eat it or go hungry!" What I am trying to do is find ways to incorporate the foods that provide the nutrients her bloodwork results show she is deficient in.

Namaste!*


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## alegna (Jan 14, 2003)

I had another thought- is there any possibility that any of her meds are making food not taste good or impacting her appetite in any way?

Just a thought that crossed my mind....

-Angela


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Btw, I am sure that it is hard for people not living this drama to understand the full scope of it. If it were as simple as every single meal being an Ethiopian one, I would do it. If it were as simple as red meat making a daily appearance on the menu, I would grit my teeth and do it. If it were as simple as letting her choose what she wanted from a variety of healthy options, I would do it. If it were as simple as giving her some supplements, I would do it. However, none of those things alone does it. We are trying to blend food preferences and dislikes with working on attachment and bonding with meeting unique medical needs with working around unique medical predicaments with learning about nutrition with confronting a radically different style of cuisine with helping her learn decision-making skills with being responsible parents ...

Namaste!


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *alegna* 
I had another thought- is there any possibility that any of her meds are making food not taste good or impacting her appetite in any way?

I know that some of the meds can cause decreased appetite, but this does not seem to be the case with Desta. She has what I consider to be a good appetite and does not pick at her food. She has gained 11 pounds and grown 2 inches in the 4 months she has been with us.

Off to make a traditional Ethiopian meal for dinner!

Namaste!


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## nicole lisa (Oct 27, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
She has gained 11 pounds and grown 2 inches in the 4 months she has been with us.


That right there is huge. You're doing awesome, mama!

I can't imagine how hard it is to know just how sick your DD could become and trying to balance that with honouring her right to self determination. I know I would have a hard time keeping fear away.









It sounds like you're trying everything and there I have no advice. It just felt important to let you know you're being heard and that none of us can know just how hard it all is (an older child adoption can be TOUGH without adding in a potentially devastating disease) without being you.

Keep on keeping on, mama. You'll find a way to make it work.


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## mata (Apr 20, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
I'm getting the feeling that people think I am being inflexible. I honestly do not think this is the case. I am not plunking down plates of stuff she hates and saying "







Eat it or go hungry!" What I am trying to do is find ways to incorporate the foods that provide the nutrients her bloodwork results show she is deficient in.

Namaste!


no, I'm on your wavelength.
















11 lbs in 4 months-that's great!!! I looked at your photos-your whole family is adorable, and Desta is such a beautiful young lady.


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## megincl (Sep 10, 2002)

Dharmamama,

You are an amazing woman who I can tell is working on doing what is absolutely best for her daughter, family, self, etc. So, just wanted to say that up front.

I have a child who is very very very hard to feed. Especially with any kind of balance in his diet. Were he not still breastfeeding, I'd be very concerned about his intake in certain areas. He does, however, have sensory issues that should really be addressed through OT/feeding therapies. He had some, insurance ran out, long story. But, I was wondering if there might be another kind of access to supporting Desta with eating and whether some sort of eating therapy, protocols that OTs use, etc might help her. I'm not at all certain, from what you've described, whether anything sensory might be at play, but from what I know of Ethiopian food (a bit), there are definitely a good deal of unfamiliar textures and sensations in "American" food, which might come into play here.

Just wanted to suggest another possible avenue for exploration.....And even if it's not sensory, there are step-by-step processes that OTs use to help kids with food aversions/sensory issues around food to try them. Very gently, very slowly. So, it could be something to look into.

Best of luck continuing to nourish your daughter.

megin


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## Rivka5 (Jul 13, 2005)

I'm baffled at the hostile tone some of the responses have taken. Speaking for myself, I'm in awe at what dharmamama and her family have undertaken. I'm not sure that I'd have it in me.

Dharmamama, does Desta's HIV clinic have a pediatric nutritionist on staff? If so, that person might be able to help you balance the nutritional needs and the emotional/behavioral needs.

Also, here is advice about slipping vegetables into fruit smoothies:
http://moxie.blogs.com/askmoxie/2006...smoothies.html


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rivka5* 
Dharmamama, does Desta's HIV clinic have a pediatric nutritionist on staff? If so, that person might be able to help you balance the nutritional needs and the emotional/behavioral needs.

Yes, and we have seen her. I felt it was very helpful. We actually had an Amharic interpreter go with us. I found out about the Ethiopian breakfast that Desta likes to eat and about where I could buy some of the spices that she likes as well as got information about the nutritional content of the foods that Desta likes so we could see where we needed to go to get the nutrients she is missing. I think that it helped Desta to see that we are trying to work with her, not against her.

Namaste!


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *megincl* 
sensory issues

Our other daughter has sensory issues and we are working loosely with an OT. I could ask her what her thoughts are about Desta. She has met her and is somewhat familiar with our journey thus far. This is a good idea. Thanks!

Namaste!


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## twin1coby (Jun 6, 2005)

HOLY SUPERMAMA of the 1st DEGREE!!! I just want to concur w pp that you are doing some serious hard work (which you know already) and that all of the thinking and preparing of special (wonderfully thoughtful and nourishing) meals takes sooo much energy and time and WOW you have two other kiddos and are homeschooling. Anyway, sometimes when I feel overwhelmed and am trying to access that just out of reach reserve of patience (because I have been tending with love my children who are simultaneously driving me batty) I feel like another understanding mama hug would be so therapuetic...that was a serious runon just to say: here's a big electronic hug to someone who's doing some pretty awesome lovin work.

Ok, love, respect, and heartfelt encouragement, Teresa

ps: our iron smoothie recipe:
--frozen berries (we use any combination of raspberries/strawberries/blackberries)
--frozen banana
--2 TBLSN Frozen OJ (w/o calcium supplement)
--1 cup or so of water
--2 tsp of Floradix
--->My 4yo sucks this down, and has not complained about the floradix taste yet...it doesn't have yogurt in it, so maybe it would pass as something a little dif. than a smoothie? Hugs again, tw


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## Blu Razzberri (Sep 27, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thismama* 
...I just was really shocked at the phrasing... that after all you went thru, the money you spent, she didn't have the right to malnourish herself. I thought it was important to point it out.

Look, I hate to stir the pot here; but for someone who's signature puts religion under fire; you sure are focused on other peoples wording! You concentrate too hard on the words, and not enough on the POINT. The child isn't eating, and the mother is trying to find solutions...no need to put her under attack! - Respectfully.

I don't know alot about nutrition, to be honest, I just try to avoid sugars and try not to impose my dislikes onto my son (which I'm doing successfully...he likes shrimp *barf*). But something I did learn from my mother (who catered to me, her picky child); was how to hide things. As said before, spaghetti is the easiest to hide things in, and what I do, is make large amounts of pasta sauce, then noodles, and mix the two, then freezer bag child-sized servings for those nights when I don't feel like cooking or he won't eat what we're having. Couple of things to consider...

- select your pasta carefully. You can buy cool tri-colored pasta that are made with spinach and tomato. Or, consider buying a pasta maker, and make your own.

- you can also buy tortilla's that are made with spinach (and one's made with tomato) but you don't have to tell her what's in them. (a good idea for that, esp. if she won't eat wraps - sandwiches - is to brush them with butter; cut them up, and bake them in the oven for a few minutes until they're crispy. Then serve them as chips; maybe even with dip (like, Philidelphia chipdips - cheeze product!! - they come in various flavors, let her pick)

- tofu. I'm not a vegetarian, nor did I grow up eating tofu. I came across it under unfortunate circumstances. I was pretty broke, and I found out that tofu is a good source of alot of vitamines and proteins; so I started mashing it with a fork into little bits, and making pasta sauce from half ground beef and half tofu. You couldn't even tell it was there. Look up tofu recipes too (though, you're a vegetarian, so you probably already know)

- iced cream...I know Breyers makes natural iced cream, so maybe it's worth checking the label for the nutritional content...? There could be calcium.

I found this site that has a list of iron rich foods: http://www.bloodbook.com/iron-foods.html so that might help.

Also, ALMONDS (dry roasted, 240ml/1 c. = 389.2mg Calcium; 5.2mg Iron)....you can buy them slivered (great for chicken flavored rice; or in salad); you can buy them whole for eating by the handful, or for baking; sliced (GREAT for cake decor and so on); and ground ...which is my favorite...I always throw a couple spoonfuls into sauces ...maybe she'd even like it by the spoon/handfull?

If you can manage to get in just three leaves of spinach some way some how, that's 25mg's of calcium. (yes, I just read that off a pamphlet I happened to get at the grocery store today









I guess you'd have to look at it like this: being a vegetarian, you don't eat meat; but what if you were suddenly in a place where you were faced with having to every day? Perhaps, infiltrate your kind of food into her diet slowly (like, start with once a week, or wherever you're at, then slowly go up to something small everyday on the side of what she's used to, until you up the portion and downsize what she's familliar with to the special meal). I know you have your own tastes and other kids; so maybe the freezer and the microwave will be your best friend for awhile. And just keep trying new foods and just ask her to try it and that's all; and when she dislikes it; ask questions like "what is it that you don't like? Is it the taste...? How it feels in your mouth? Is it because there are too many foods put together? Is it because it's one food by itself? Is it because it looks strage?"...asking specific questions might help you better determine what specifically it is she dislikes about the food and you can work around it better.

I'm sorry for my long rant, I hope I helped even a little bit!


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## Blu Razzberri (Sep 27, 2006)

Oh; one more thing: try making the food "fun"....get her to help cut sandwiches into silly shapes with cookie cutters, or create a face out of the foods or something like that.


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## thismama (Mar 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Blu Razzberri*
for someone who's signature puts religion under fire

Just doing my job.


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## Celery (Jun 28, 2006)

You don't need to make just injera with teff!

I substitute about the quarter of the flour in any recipe with teff, and it tastes wonderful! Really nutty and yummy. Maybe teff zucchini muffins would be a hit?

You could also make your own spinach pasta - kids love to help wind the handle on the machine.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

holy cow. you have covered just about every base. All i can say is just keep trying. and in the mean time sneak in as much nutrition as possible.

good luck mama.


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## captain optimism (Jan 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
I know that some of the meds can cause decreased appetite, but this does not seem to be the case with Desta. She has what I consider to be a good appetite and does not pick at her food. She has gained 11 pounds and grown 2 inches in the 4 months she has been with us.

Okay, I didn't know that.

Now I'm back to thinking that your doctor is not a very nice person. Maybe your child needs to eat more food and get more nutrients from food. But can I just point out that eleven pounds and two inches must have required that you fed her a diet that was rich in nutrients? Especially calcium? Pressuring you around this just feels really unfair. it is just incredible, wonderful, that she's grown so much in such a short time! Yes, I understand that she really needs more nutrients, still. But can the doc give you some credit for what Desta, and you, have already achieved?

I went and read your homeschooling blog. I feel like my responses in this thread were really inadequate. If she's still learning English and struggling with (though enthralled by! Excellent







) basic math, probably pulling nutrition into her homeschooling curriculum is a little much. I'm always thinking about how to integrate lots of learning into one package. Maybe it's enough that you had an Amharic interpreter with you when you saw the nutritionist.

I did have another thought along the same lines though. I've been thinking about your situation all day and wondering what might be helpful! Maybe you could institute a New Food of The Week program at your house. Everytime you go to the grocery store, you and the kids pick out a new food, learn about it, and try it. Then everyone in your family will be in the same position. You could make a chart with everybody's ratings.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *captain optimism* 
Now I'm back to thinking that your doctor is not a very nice person.

No, that's really not the case. He's very kind, has a great sense of humor, has been very nice to Desta, and has gone out of his way on several occasions to help us out and make things convenient for us.

He's been working with us on the eating thing since Desta joined us. He has made some helpful suggestions and has been very supportive of me through my frustration. He has spoken with Desta several times about nutrition and has always been careful to acknowledge the newness of American food and congratulate her when she tries new things. He asks her for recommendations of Ethiopian food.

It's not like he was standing in front of us shaking his finger in our faces saying, "You need to feed this girl better!" He just told us, very plainly, the she's going to need to eat more variety and she's going to have to take some (not all) of the responsibility for eating nutritiously.

The "Food of the week" idea is a good one. Thank you.

Namaste!


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## 4evermom (Feb 3, 2005)

I had a thought about why the dr might be opposed to supplements. Calcium and iron inhibit each other's absorbtion. So if one was relying on a multivitamin, dd wouldn't be getting the vitamins in an absorbable form. Keeping this in mind, you might want to focus individual meals on being either high iron or high calcium.
Smilies from ds







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## *Erin* (Mar 18, 2002)

gosh, mama, what a lot to tackle. big love to you.
i wanted to mention kefir-it's got lots of calcium, and tastes delicious. lots of good probiotics too. you can find it at kroger grocery stores and in health food stores. also fortified cereal, my dd, a very picky 4-yr-old raw-foodie vegetarian (by her choice, my dh and i eat some meats)also really loves barbera's wild puffs-they're like a coco-puff but tastier and healthier, and chock full of iron. i second the mentions of floradix, too, despite the dr's wanting you to get the iron and things thru food.
good luck to you and your girl.


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## sagewinna (Nov 19, 2001)

Almond butter (alone or blended with peanut butter so it's more familiar) might help, almonds are great... Good luck to you and your family.


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## eclipse (Mar 13, 2003)

I just want to say that, dealing with an extremely picky eater myself, I have loads of sympathy for you. My son doesn't have the health issues that your daughter does, and it's still frustrating and frightening to me to think of the nutrients ds isn't getting.


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## flapjack (Mar 15, 2005)

I don't know if you've already tried this, but at times we've resorted to a peanut butter smoothie- glass of milk, spoonful of skimmed milk powder, spoonful of peanut butter, half a banana (more to taste) and a handful of frozen spinach cubes. Add honey or sugar if you need to- and on occasions, I've been known to dye it green and call it Kryptonite.
Also, if she'll eat pizza then that gives you
a) a layer of tomato sauce to hide vegetables in
b) the potential for her to pick out her own toppings.
It's also possible for you to really bulk up the nutrient value of bread if you make your own, by using vegetable water or even a vegetable juice, skimmed milk powder, molasses and nuts, fruits, seeds and vegetables. Pumpkin bread is one that springs to mind.
And, obviously, don't forget the value of letting her get involved in the kitchen.


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## TigerTail (Dec 22, 2002)

I wish you all well.

I am not feeling the 'sneak the veggies in' thing some people are suggesting; I am of the thought that food sensitivities and allergies in children are often manifested as 'don't like it'.

My mom forced me to eat all kinds of crap that you'd suppose are traditionally 'good' for you (orange juice, strawberries, walnuts, avocados, eggplant) that I later was able to articulate, "Hey. I don't want to eat this, it makes my mouth hurt & my stomach ache."

It must be frustrating to be worried about her health & limited eating, & I'm glad you are being so patient. But honestly, I hope you can figure out the injera; it's farking good, I could live on that & some doro wat.







I am sympathetic!

(I wonder if it's the culturing you are having trouble with? Some of the NT mamas may be able to help you out with getting it started; maybe even find a way to have an Ethipian friend get you some raw dough to use as a starter? Apologies if you've tried that!)

Just one last thing- I get what Thismama was saying; if you aren't adopted you cannot imagine how shocking that sounded. I know you didn't mean it that way, Dharma; just saying Thismama was not the only one who found the phrasing... awkward.

Anyway, namaste back atcha, & try to relax & let her figure this stuff out herself a bit. People bugging me about food gave me a lot of issues that (thankfully) in adulthood I managed to overcome. I know how important excellent nutrition is to her health status (& everyone's!); I just don't think pressing the issue will be a help. Especially not sneaking food into her she does not wish to eat. I would _hate_ having to explain my every food preference.

You're doing great with the 11 pounds, Desta! (More wat!)


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TigerTail* 
Just one last thing- I get what Thismama was saying; if you aren't adopted you cannot imagine how shocking that sounded.

Well, I am truly sorry if I said something that hurt or offended. I didn't mean to at all. I guess in my mind it's no different than saying of Ramona, "I didn't spend nine months stuffing my face with 100 grams of protein a day and go through 11 hours of natural childbirth so that she can become malnourished by her own choosing." It's my job as Mom to make sure my kids are healthy. But I'm sorry if it came across wrong.

Namaste!


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## Blu Razzberri (Sep 27, 2006)

How 'bout banana bread (you can find a recipe that uses yogourt to make it with) and instead of walnuts, use almonds. That's a good recipe choc-full of vitamines that you could (dare I say it?) serve for lunch (*GASP*).


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## TortelliniMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Has anyone mentioned the Little House Cookbook? It's partway down this page:

http://www.fun-books.com/liwgen.htm

I've never seen it, but even if it isn't exactly full of the kind of foods Desta needs to eat, at least it might inspire her to branch out a little, assuming that Little House is still of interest to her.


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

Thanks again for everyone's good ideas and support. I went back and talked to the HIV doctor yesterday. I explained to him how I felt that his advice and the attachment therapist's advice were conflicting and that I felt stuck in the middle and unsure of what to do. The doctor apologized and said he had not meant to put me in the middle. He said that he has been pleased with Desta's progress since she got here, that he feels that her health is improving and that she must be getting a decent amount of nutrution as evidenced by her growth and weight gain. He said (and I know this is true) that many kids adopted from other countries have a great spurt of "catch-up" growth when they first arrive due to the better nutrition, health care, and emotional situation they are in. His concerns are not so much immediate as they are long-term. He said she not in immediate danger of becoming malnourished, but that chronic deficiencies in calcium and iron will cause long-term problems. He said that if we are having a lot of heartache and headache over the eating issue that he would be happy to recommend some good supplements, but that in the long run we are going to have to figure out a diet for Desta that does meet all her nutritional needs without the use of supplements. He said he does have some patients who are very ill and very malnourished and that supplements are helpful to them but that the best course of action is to have excellent nutrition to begin with as excellent nutrition will not only prevent problems but also help her HIV meds be more effective. He said that he would be happy to discuss these things with Desta again if I wanted him to, but I told him that I thought she might feel uncomfortable with that, and he said that was fine. I told him about my plans to "sneak" more nutrition into Desta and he said that would be a good starting point and that, hopefully, with time, she would broaden her list of acceptable foods. I asked him whether there was any way we could determine whether Desta has sensitivities to any of the foods she refuses and he said that we could by all means do that if I wanted to. We plan to talk more about that at our next appointment.

I feel better about things and dh and I plan to begin following the attachment therapist's advice of "here's the food, eat what you like," which worked very well for us when we first started it.

Namaste!


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## captain optimism (Jan 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *dharmamama* 
Thanks again for everyone's good ideas and support. I went back and talked to the HIV doctor yesterday. I explained to him how I felt that his advice and the attachment therapist's advice were conflicting and that I felt stuck in the middle and unsure of what to do. The doctor apologized and said he had not meant to put me in the middle. He said that he has been pleased with Desta's progress since she got here, that he feels that her health is improving and that she must be getting a decent amount of nutrution as evidenced by her growth and weight gain.

Wow. I am so relieved by this and it's not even my daughter. Or my respected doctor. Great! Good!

I am rooting for everything to keep working out for your family as well as it has been.


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## lilyka (Nov 20, 2001)

wow! what an awesome Dr. !!!

thats good to klnow that she is not in any immediant danger. That should give you some time to just work things out with her adjusting and making the general cultural transition. hopefully with time this will work itself out to some extent.


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## Rivka5 (Jul 13, 2005)

What a great example of patient-doctor communication. I'm so glad you talked to him about it, and so glad about his response.


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## GiggleBirds (Oct 24, 2006)

I didn't read the whole thread, but I noticed she is Ethiopian and your family is vegetarian. There are lots of ethiopian veggie recipes at this site:

http://www.ivu.org/recipes/


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## dharmamama (Sep 19, 2004)

I just wanted to update people on this situation because so many people took an interest in it when I initially posted this thread.

After Desta's January visit to the HIV doctor (at which time her bloodwork again indicated nutritional deficiencies), we implemented a "vegetables first" rule at the dinner table. Desta has to eat a serving of vegetables before she gets anything else for dinner, and if she wants seconds of anything (usually she wants seconds of the high-carb portion of the meal) she has to eat everything else on her plate first.

I know that this is not in keeping with the MDC way, but Desta visited the HIV doctor again two weeks ago and we just got the results of her blood tests on Thursday. Her T-cells, which had been dropping, have climbed 300 points and all her other bloodwork, including that which had previously indicated nutritional deficiencies, was fine.

I talked to Desta about this and about the fact that the HIV doctor said that the high-carb, no veggies diet she prefers could be contributing to her fatigue, and I hoped that she would understand the connection between her eating habits and her health, but she didn't seem to. I think that the connection is too vague for her. Since she was still _feeling_ ok, in her mind everything was fine.

I don't like forcing her to eat, but she has gotten used to it and it's not really an issue anymore. We just told her that we are her parents and we are responsible for making sure she stays healthy and that's the way it is. We initially had an argument about it, but when she saw that dh and I were united and that we were not backing down, she accepted it.

dm


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## jayayenay (Sep 28, 2003)

Glad to hear she's doing well!


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