# Where can I raise my children????!!!!



## PreggieUBA2C (Mar 20, 2007)

I am so frustrated today. I live in Northern Ontario and have just learned that our region (which is enormous, btw) was chosen by our gov't for large deposits of uranium tailings that will be dug underground and left there. No long-term study has ever been done on the effects of the radiation that is emitted from such tailings, but a quick look at communities such as Elliot Lake will alert even the most casual observer that there is something quite amiss; they have the highest rate of colo-rectal cancer in the whole country and loads of other unusual cancers and immuno-diseases and a disproportionate (to the rest of Ontario) 'health-care' facilities to deal with this. We are considerably further north than Elliot Lake, and have some mines here too- but they are gold, nickel, platinum, palladium and copper (almost all are multi-deposit mines)- no uranium.

I have been researching places to live, in Canada, for our family and everywhere I look has some completely disgusting example of ongoing human destruction through mining, logging, petrochemicals, etc... I just can't find a single community that isn't dealing with some large-scale disastrous event tied to some big business cover-up scheme exposed or gov't allowed poisoning of the local population and environment. Is there really nowhere to go? I am not expecting the garden of eden, here- just a decent place where there isn't radioactive soil in my backyard or billowing smoke and heavy-metal contaminated ground and surface water.

Maybe I was born a thousand years too late? I'm so angry! And confused; what are we supposed to do? How do we determine the best place to live while people all over our country are suffering horrible lives and deaths from just living and trying to meet their basic needs? I live in CANADA! We're supposed to have CLEAN WATER at least!!! Btw, we have an oily film that quickly rises to the top of a glass of our tap water that the town water treatment officer says isn't there... but I'm looking _right at it_- right there!







:

Does anyone in Canada (or anywhere else- REALLY) live somewhere relatively clean? Anyone?

We moved up here to escape the pollution of the big cities...







Out of the frying pan as they say...


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## MilkTrance (Jul 21, 2007)

No advice here. We have pulp mills on the island, logging, farmed fish, etc.

However, we also have a lot of crunchy people, so at least you'd have someone to talk to.


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## Longhorn (Sep 21, 2007)

My cousin and his wife live in Toronto, not the best choice, but I remember reading a report that Vancouver and the surrounding area is great. Nice mountain air and gorgeous rivers, etc. I remember reading there were quaint little mountain towns around it and Banff.


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## CarrieMF (Mar 7, 2004)

Were have you been looking? I can name numerous towns in Saskatchewan that are not polluted, have no mines, no big disasters, etc. Even the bigger cities don't really & what they do is nothing compared to cities like Edmonton & the smog filled ones like Toronto. Plus Saskatchewan is currently cheaper than alot of other western provinces, but also in a booming phase.

Pretty much all of Alberta would be ruled out, this place stinks. Seriously stinks. There is no such thing as Fresh Air in Alberta, even in the mountains, the oil stinks so bad.


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## PreggieUBA2C (Mar 20, 2007)

This is a nuclear map of Canada: http://www.ccnr.org/nuclear_map/index.html By this, I cannot imagine there is anywhere in Saskatchewan not affected rather directly. We're in Ontario, and as you'll see, we're not better off- at all







. I have looked at various logging maps as well and other mining maps and the whole country is covered once they are layered. What I cannot wrap my naive little head around is how so many people have so little foresight that they don't realise and/or care that once we've poisoned all of our resources, we have nothing left to offer either in business or to our people. So infuriating.

Dh is looking into the surrounding areas of Vancouver because as we've learned through a rather drastic move up here, obtaining clean-ish water and access to real food is a big-city priviledge. Soooo, we are looking at finding a big city that we can live within driving distance from while still enjoying some of the outskirts-y quiet and solitude. We left southern Ontario because it was too loud, too dirty, too busy and waaaay too expensive for us having me at home and 3 (now 4) children.

It comes to this, I guess: if we want clean food and water and are willing to accept massive doses of multiple pollutants, in exchange, then we have to live in or near a city. It's hard to determine which is worse, perpetual, heavy mono-pollution (from the one mine or one mill) or multiple-source pollution so that it's a little-o-this and a little-o-that. It seems like a ridiculous compromise, especially in this enormous country. There should be somewhere that is not damaged, but it seems that big business has already littered the whole place without much or any notice/regulation and they did that long before we arrived.

We came up here for less expense, more autonomy, less regulation... so did they, it seems







:.


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## dkapdblack (Apr 19, 2007)

Wow, thanks for posting that. DH and I found a company that sells Canadian land _cheap_, and we were looking to get land around Timmins (50-100 acres for $15-20,000!!). So you just really saved our behinds! Could you post links to the logging/mining maps?
Sorry I can't help any with your dilemma...


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## allgirls (Apr 16, 2004)

Try rural Newfoundland


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## Blu Razzberri (Sep 27, 2006)

Unless I'm reading the map wrong (it was a pain in the bum to figure out); it looks like BC is pretty much in the clear as a whole.

What is wrong with our government?? Canada is not as lovely as the world (or even as WE) perceive it to be - is it? But then again, I suppose the rest of the world is in the same boat.

*sigh*


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## CarrieMF (Mar 7, 2004)

Quote:

By this, I cannot imagine there is anywhere in Saskatchewan not affected rather directly.
look at the map again. Find Prince Albert, the majority of it is North of PA. Very few people live up there & those who do are flown in & working in any of the mining industries up there.

there are 4 symbols around Saskatoon. 2(Uranium Refinery, Heating Reactor) are prevented from being there. The other 2(Nuclear Research, Research Reactor) are there. The mining around Saskatoon is Potash, not Uranium & they are outside of the city.

Nuclear Research in Saskatoon

more Nuclear Research in Saskatoon

no matter where you live, you'd be surprised to find out what travels on our Train systems that is not related to uranium but equally or more dangerous.

Quote:

obtaining clean-ish water and access to real food is a big-city priviledge
I doubt you'll get cleanish water in a big city with all the polution & smog they have in them.

What do you mean by real food? How do you figure you'll get clean food living in a city?

What about fresh air?

Vancouver is NOT cheap to live in.


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## amydawnsmommy (Mar 13, 2005)

While I understand your concerns on radiation and its effects on your family in Northern Ontario I don't see how in this day and age you can really avoid radiation, chemicals and all the various pollutants that come with modern living.

The way I see it the best thing you can do is to protect yourself by making healthy choices (as healthy as you can), detoxifying your body and home, eating well, taking the appropriate vitamin & mineral supplements and leading a balanced lifestyle.

I live in Central Ontario. Yes I am frustrated that I don't have a lot of control over the chemicals/pollutants that effect myself and my family. But I am doing my best to keep my house as free of chemicals as possible, our food as healthy as possible, our vitamins & supplements taken daily and aim for a balanced life by incorporating exercise, chiropractic, massage therapy, Colour Energy, Reiki, BodyTalk and other modalities.


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## HerthElde (Sep 18, 2003)

Saskatchewan's not too bad. She hurts terribly with all the monocrops, but at least she's not as poisoned as most of the rest of the country. I'm in Regina - housing is at an alltime high, but still more affordable than many places in Canada. If you do decide to move here, shoot me a pm


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## HerthElde (Sep 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *amydawnsmommy* 
BodyTalk and other modalities.

Hey, I'm a recently certified BodyTalk practitioner







! I'm so excited to see it mentioned on the boards - you're the first I've ever seen!


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## HerthElde (Sep 18, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PreggieUBA2C* 
This is a nuclear map of Canada: http://www.ccnr.org/nuclear_map/index.html By this, I cannot imagine there is anywhere in Saskatchewan not affected rather directly. We're in Ontario, and as you'll see, we're not better off- at all







. I have looked at various logging maps as well and other mining maps and the whole country is covered once they are layered. What I cannot wrap my naive little head around is how so many people have so little foresight that they don't realise and/or care that once we've poisoned all of our resources, we have nothing left to offer either in business or to our people. So infuriating.

Dh is looking into the surrounding areas of Vancouver because as we've learned through a rather drastic move up here, obtaining clean-ish water and access to real food is a big-city priviledge. Soooo, we are looking at finding a big city that we can live within driving distance from while still enjoying some of the outskirts-y quiet and solitude. We left southern Ontario because it was too loud, too dirty, too busy and waaaay too expensive for us having me at home and 3 (now 4) children.

It comes to this, I guess: if we want clean food and water and are willing to accept massive doses of multiple pollutants, in exchange, then we have to live in or near a city. It's hard to determine which is worse, perpetual, heavy mono-pollution (from the one mine or one mill) or multiple-source pollution so that it's a little-o-this and a little-o-that. It seems like a ridiculous compromise, especially in this enormous country. There should be somewhere that is not damaged, but it seems that big business has already littered the whole place without much or any notice/regulation and they did that long before we arrived.

We came up here for less expense, more autonomy, less regulation... so did they, it seems







:.

I can't get the map to work. Regina's pretty far south - Uranium mines are north.
ETA: Okay, I got it. Regina is as "in-the-clear" as anywhere else in the country.

I don't get the real food thing? Most of our food comes from local farms, organic and in season. We also have 3 excellent organic grocery stores


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## sea_joy (Aug 5, 2006)

I live on a small Island in a group of islands surrounding the tip of Vancouver Island. We are actually part of America, but the environment is the same.

BC is expensive, and it certainly has problems, but as far as nature and healthful environment go, it's hard to beat. Clean air (super clean air on the Island) lots of wildlife, etc.

By the way, I've seen pictures of what happened to Afgani children after the US buried depleted Uranuim in the ground. It seeped into their water systems and they have massive birth defects.infant death problems in these areas. I would bever live in a place that had bad water and where you could not grow healthful food (ie, safe soil).

Good luck in your search.

Crystal

P.s don't drink the oily tapwater!


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## amydawnsmommy (Mar 13, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *HerthElde* 
Hey, I'm a recently certified BodyTalk practitioner







! I'm so excited to see it mentioned on the boards - you're the first I've ever seen!

Hey cool!!!!

Where are you located?

I am in Central Ontario.

My first ever BodyTalk session was on Thursday and while driving home I had this really cool vision of this horrible black sticky gross stuff flying out of my body. At one point I noticed something small and red until all the black goo which was coming out of my chest. I figured it wasn't important. Then later I wondered what it was came back to it and it was my heart! Once I uncovered it and rubbed it clean it grew and grew and grew.









Everything that came up in the session as a priority made perfect sense. I love it!


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## Rhiannon Feimorgan (Aug 26, 2005)

Well we are far away form any of the hot spots on that map. There is talk right now of a gold mine going in north of here but it will be quite a way north like about 100km or so. The water is hard and has a stron miniral taste but it is clean with no contamination from industry or agriculture. We are about 2 hrs drive from Prince George which although not a huge city is still big enough to have access to all the amenities. There are a few nice organic food stores and many local ranchers who sell pastured beef and milk ect.

And the cost of housing is so much lower than areas farthur south. Our very nice 4 bed 3 bath house on a large lot cost $130 000.

There is even a nice little natural family living comunity.

Oh and did I mention the lake is beautiful.


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## PreggieUBA2C (Mar 20, 2007)

Hey everybody!

Sorry I've been absent...

We've made a decision to move to central Ontario this coming March. It's not perfect, but we have to access to non-oily water and food, and we'd also like to be able to access some more resources for our family since we have none to little support and raising 4 littles alone is tough sometimes.

To answer some questions, we live in the far north, so when I said that we don't have access to real food, I wasn't exaggerating. We have one grocery store and the whole produce section would easily fit into my small kitchen. Other foods are highly processed and come in 3 or more packages in packages. We can't even buy what appears as plain, skinless chicken breasts without there being a long list of ingredients on the package.

We take a day-long trip one/month 5 hours south to a town with a grocery store more like a Zehrs that stocks organic food, so we stock up there, but it is a struggle because our produce always runs out within the first two weeks with a lot of careful arranging and planning. We tried to order in organics through the grocer, but they are so disorganised that the case of rice milk we ordered 3 months ago hasn't yet arrived and everytime we ask about it, the manager says he's forgotten to check on it but will call us right away- which he has never done. There is literally a _wall_ of white bread and it took two months for us to finally have whole grain breads brought in, but then the manager left and bread disappeared for a while until the next one brought it in finally and now we're on the third manager, and we're not buying (or asking for) our bread there anymore- it's on our out-of-town list. I'd make our bread, but honestly, with being so pg and having very weak and loose wrist joints, it isn't going to happen anytime soon. Having cases shipped is very cost prhibitive since we still have to factor in the expense of travelling for the rest of our food.

I know that city water isn't 'clean,' but for the most part, it's not going to poison us like the arsenic tailings and mystery oil here are. We've just learned of yet another person in just the last few months diagnosed with non-hodgkins lymphoma... That's three people in a few months. We cannot use the soil, obviously, because it's been covered with arsenic tailings so that the township can use up the grants they received for employing northern workers, and if they don't use the grants up, they won't receive them next year, so for some reason, spreading tailings all over town is the choice (and cheapest, I'm sure) endeavour.

I will miss the air up here for sure, but that may be on the outs too with the new mines underway.

In central Ontario, we'll have access to organic food and while I'll still have to tell our children not to pick things up off the road, at least for the most part, we can safely walk on the road and not cart in a load of arsenic on each shoe- we'll cart something in, but it won't be a an overdose of a specific toxin, yk.

We really strive to live healthfully; my dh is in the midst of an amazing body cleanse right now, and we eat as well as possible (pales in comparison to former diet), and otherwise live as natuarlly as possible. We just didn't know we could be so limited.

FTR, 50% of deaths that occur in the far north of ONtario are the result of heart failure. I called the medical facility that sent this info pkg to us (requesting donations for the new fancy diagnostic machinery to deal with this) because I found it soooo hard to believe. It was confirmed to me and when I asked what the major contributing factors were (since I wanted to make sure it wasn't environmental) I was told that diet is the number one factor. I then asked why they weren't interested in spending the several hundred thousands of dollars they were asking us for to educate and improve the quality of food available up here instead of trying to diagnose the symptoms of what they know could be a preventable condition. No answer. Surprise, right?







:

Bluerazzberri, BC is logging central. A dear friend of mine lives in the far north there and during this last year, she watched as whole masses of land were clear-cut because of beetle infestation and then had massive amounts of poison (ie: pesticide) dropped from water-bombers over the forests. She said that somedays she cannot go outside because the smell from the mills is so terrible. She also said it's pretty impossible to avoid the mills up there. She's a locum dr, and has travelled extensively thoughout the province. She loves it there, so she compromises on the stinky air and pesticide thing.

I was talking to a friend in the south and he expressed what I know to be true since I lived there all my life except this past year- a lot of this stuff simply wouldn't happen down there because too many people would notice. He has worked on water mains and said that if they were so careless as to allow more than a few granules of debris into the lines while they work, they'd receive a thousand calls and be dealing with it for weeks; up here, a few people might call, and that's about it- not much incentive for people with no intrinsic motivation toward excellence (that may be harsh, but we've seen a lot of stuff and I actually think it fairly accurately reflects the general mentality up here).

Anyway, I'm ranting... not so good. The good-ish news is that while we cannot have the ideal, we are making a positive change that with all it's faults will better meet our needs. I also think that it is more likley to find other like-minded conscientious people in larger centres than up here. It might even be possible to make a change where one is needed elsewhere; here, it seems that the people have resigned to ignorance and they don't want to be informed (ie: our elected mayor quit because the town treasurer refused to show him the accounting so that he couldn't make the budget changes he promised the electors, then the council _appointed_ another mayor during a closed meeting- appointed, didn't call another election, and they chose a person who clearly doesn't understand the big picture, but just agrees to whatever the council- 8 people- wants. This actually happened here! WTH?! We have a non-elected mayor for four years!). And everyone is fine with it. They just shrug their shoulders. With 200 people, every decision made by council affects everyone directly, so it's not like they'll just be able to ignore this, they just don't care to _do_ anything about it!

Okay, I'm done, now, I think.









Anyway, central Ontario. I'm looking forward to it. I am forced to recognise that the whole country is filthy, but I don't like it one bit. And I don't accept that it is an proper way to treat the earth either. I'll do my part in my own backyard I suppose and just deal with the showering acid on my organic soil and vegetables...


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## PreggieUBA2C (Mar 20, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rhiannon Feimorgan* 
Well we are far away form any of the hot spots on that map. There is talk right now of a gold mine going in north of here but it will be quite a way north like about 100km or so. The water is hard and has a stron miniral taste but it is clean with no contamination from industry or agriculture. We are about 2 hrs drive from Prince George which although not a huge city is still big enough to have access to all the amenities. There are a few nice organic food stores and many local ranchers who sell pastured beef and milk ect.

And the cost of housing is so much lower than areas farthur south. Our very nice 4 bed 3 bath house on a large lot cost $130 000.

There is even a nice little natural family living comunity.

Oh and did I mention the lake is beautiful.

That does sound lovely.

Our gold mines are 100km north too, but they dumped the sludge in the town. I don't get it... I guess if they can transport mining tailings and sludge out-of-province or 2000+km away from the site, 100km isn't really all that far away.

We have thousands of lakes up here, and we brought dc to a popular one where many people have built cabins for vacationing, and found that the whole shoreline is now covered in tailings. I can only imagine how much of that stuff ended up in the lake before they spread it out on the shore. Please do what you can to protect your home from mining contamination; the gov't simply doesn't have the bodies to deal with how much of it is happening even if they did care to regulate more strictly.

I hope you continue to enjoy your home; I'm now realising what a huge thing it is to have a place where you love being- a peaceful sanctuary to raise your family. I hope we have that someday too.


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## Starflower (Sep 25, 2004)

Wow. I guess I can stop fantasizing about moving to Canada to escape the nasty stuff here in the US.









Glad to hear your family will be making a positive move though. The stuff about the arsenic is just sick. I'm so glad you'll be away from that when you move.


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## wagamama (Jul 3, 2006)

I stumbled onto this thread and found it fascinating. I grew up in "lower Northern Ontario" (SSM), but now go back and forth between Japan and Nigeria. I too am incredibly saddened and frustrated with the pollution of our entire planet.







: Japan is a fascinating and fun country, but an environmental disaster. One example: Japanese women have the highest levels of dioxin in their breastmilk in the world. Nigeria has been polluted by mining, the oil industry, pesticides and insectides, to name a few problems. And people burn garbage, with tons of plastic, out in the open, lead-based gas and paint is still used ... the list is endless. It is sooo depressing.







:


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## Sandrine (Apr 14, 2004)

Interesting read. Now i wonder if my city is bad for raising children.


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## jakesask (Jul 31, 2007)

I too would petition for Sask as a pretty good place to live. The biggest contamination problem would surely be herbicides and pesticides (and I'm not trying to brush that off; the high rate of prostate cancer in farmers is not just coincidence). But I've lived in Saskatoon for 6 years and I've never encountered air pollution, and certainly nuclear mining/waste is not an issue for 99.9% of the population.

I've lived in rural Sask, urban Sask, and urban Iowa. I've seen a number of different American cities, from San Francisco to Chicago, and a number of places -- both urban and rural -- in Canada too. I definitely think Sask is the "purest" place I've been.


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## kmeyrick (Aug 30, 2006)

I believe Scandinavian countries are ahead of the curve when it comes to taking care of the environment....of course, a few of them have ignored whaling laws, but look into it. Lots of people are interested in Iceland, Norway, and Sweden.


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## sara_m (Jul 12, 2004)

We live in Santa Fe, New Mexico, and have very little industrial pollution. I believe Los Alamos County (about 40 minutes from Santa Fe) was recently voted the cleanest county in the States. Anyway, our air in lovely and clean, and the high desert landscape allows you to see miles in any direction.


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## Magali (Jun 8, 2007)

Jasper National Park. But we will be moving soon. I understand where you are coming from. I feel spoiled to live here, actually born and raised. It is beautiful and clean. i always say if i must live in Canada this is the place i would most rather be.


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