# Introverted Children



## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Here is an interesting article about how introverted children can be overstimulated in an extroverted world. I believe it applies to GD in that our expectations for introverted children's behavior to conform in intense social environments may lead to increased 'tantrums', and overt distress that might be misunderstood as 'misbehavior'.

"Raising Your Introverted Child": http://www.child.com/child/story.jht...introverts.xml It is from the mainstream "Child" magazine. But had some well documented information. (There are 8 "pages" to the short article.)

Another description of children who are highly sensitive is explored by Elaine Aron at "The Highly Sensitive Child" web site: http://www.hsperson.com/pages/child.htm There is a "self test" to determine if your child is highly sensitive. There is a "Mothering the Highly Sensitive Child" tribe in the 'Finding Your Tribe' forum also.

Both dh and ds are introverted and highly sensitive. I am extroverted and tough to live with.









Pat


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## loon13 (Dec 2, 2002)

Pat,

Thanks for sharing those links.









My dd is introverted, too. Lately though, it seems to want to play with lots of children. But I still have to be careful not to overdo. She needs and is perfectly happy with her downtime at home.


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## nonconformnmom (May 24, 2005)

Maybe a bit off-topic, but how does a GD parent deal with feeling awkward and embarrassed if their introverted child does not greet others after being greeted? My 3 year old dd never returns greetings, to us even, but especially not to well-meaning strangers who say "hello" to her. I always feel a bit embarrassed and I sort of murmer to dd, "When someone says 'hi' to you, you should say 'hi' back." I say it with a smile, and then leave it at that, but I really feel like it's my fault, like people think I haven't taught her any manners. She also doesn't answer other typical questions like, "What's your name?" and "How old are you?" We've tried practicing with her, rehearsing and explaining to her what to say, all to no avail.

She doesn't hesitate, though, when we're ordering food at a restaurant to firmly and with authority say to the wait staff, "I want milk, please!"


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

I generally just say 'Jason likes to warm up to people at his own pace; but in 10 minutes, he might be talking your ear off (telling you all about his trains, dragging you up to his playroom, sitting on your lap and asking you to read him a book, etc. ~depending on the environment).' and I do a light little laugh to dismiss the expectation.

I don't correct ds and tell him he "should" anything though. I believe that is very shaming and humiliating to do in front of someone else. My above statement is a bit condescending, in my opinion, too; but I believe it provides a space for our son's introverted nature while he is learning the nuances of social mannerisms. The responses above do vary according to the child's age. At 4.5, our son isn't apt to climb into someone's lap; but he is likely to tell all about his trains (to exhaustion,







)

When a stranger is making idle conversation with ds, he won't tend to converse either. Especially, if the adult does that sing-song-y "And how are you!" in that loud, in your face voice that people reserve for children, as if they can not understand normal language cadence and volume and articulation. Our son is used to being spoken to one on one in a normal conversational tone. And people mean well, but often they do invade children's space with their inquisition and even by touching them without considering if it is desired by the child. These types of interactions just cause ds to clam up, literally pull away from the adult, stop eye contact and even try to pull me away from them at times.

But now, if people are civil and not overly dramatic, he will answer calmly and precisely. If I had expected him to perform, it would only have increased his discomfort; and my emotional angst at a "non conforming" response would put a lot of pressure on responding as 'rehearsed'. I don't believe that this would help the situation feel more natural to respond 'hi' and want to talk with the stranger. I just expect him to respond as he is comfortable. He has elected to utilize the manners that we have modelled too.

It took a couple of years for my mom to understand she couldn't just walk in our house and cuddle him up without sending him running to his room to hide. Finally, she just learned to come in and visit; and then 10 minutes later, ds was dragging her up to his playroom. Sometimes, the adult is the one who needs to learn.









Pat


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## onlyzombiecat (Aug 15, 2004)

In terms of discipline, I do think expecting an introvert to act like an extrovert is going to cause frustration.

Quote:

Dealing with Introverted Children

Explain introverted qualities to your child
Never correct your child in front of others
Let them watch before entering an activity
Encourage breaks to recharge
Realize they need time to think before responding to questions
from http://www.theintrovertadvantage.com/coping.asp

I'm an introvert, married to an introvert with an introvert dd (differing degrees).

I think roleplaying questions/situations in advance and then relaxing about it will probably be most helpful in the long run.

I'd say part of the not answering questions is age and part is needing time to warm up to a situation or person. I wouldn't get mad at at a 3 year old for not saying hi or something. I wouldn't think their parents don't teach them manners. What 3 year old has perfect manners? As the parent, I would probably just smile at the person and say "I guess she isn't feeling too chatty right now, maybe later".

My 5 year old dd got put on the spot and asked "What are you thankful for?" on Thanksgiving and she didn't really know what to say. We gave her a chance to answer but I wasn't going to hassle her until she did. She said something about her stuffed dog. It was sprung on us all by mil with no warning. I didn't know what to say either and came out with something dumb. I later heard someone ask dd how old she was and she started telling them all about her stuffed dog. She was talking to them but they didn't know what to make of her because she wasn't giving the expected response. Like asking "how are you today?" and getting an answer other than "fine". My dd was the only child who attempted to converse with adults other than one word answers to questions at the gathering. She is getting so much more confident. A couple of years ago she would've not said a word or hidden at that kind of event. I think in part it is because we haven't pushed her to talk to people. We don't act embarrased, apologetic or make a big deal about it.

I think many of us introverts just don't do small talk well so you may never get much response from those kind of questions. I can talk someone's ear off about a subject I am enthusiastic about just like scubamama's ds but I don't get small talk. And it takes me time to warm up to people too.


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## loon13 (Dec 2, 2002)

Dd likes to be the one to approach the other person. If you give her time to watch and wait, then she will jump in the conversation when she's ready. But she freezes and hides behind me when the adult too quickly approaches here and tries to make conversation. The more the she is pressured, the more upset she becomes.

I usually say to dd "Are you feeling shy?" She will nod and I say that is okay to feel shy, especially when we meet new people or people we don't know very well yet. All within hearing of the other adult, of course. Then I usually hug dd. Then I turn to the person and say "If you'll just give her a little time for her to get more comfortable, that'd be great."

We talk or roleplay sometimes. When we pass a person on the street and we exchange "hello", dd will ask later why we did that. I say that it is polite or friendly to do so, (depending on if the person is a friend or acquaintance). So she does understand that we say hello when someone says it us, but I don't force her about it.

I don't like being put on the spot, and have enough trouble handling that on my own, so if anyone puts dd on the spot, I will jump in to help her. I will then talk to her about it afterward, letting her know what she can say, that she doesn't have to answer certain questions, etc.

Many times when she will ask me to say things for her such as "thank you" or "goodbye", because she wants to say it but is too shy. I happily do so for her. I figure in her own good time, she will do it on her own. But I never force her to say it.


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## sunnysideup (Jan 9, 2005)

I was shy as a child (actually, I still am in some instances), but I'm not an introverted person. My dh is introverted, but not shy. I think sometimes people confuse the two terms. An introverted person needs alone time to mentally re-charge thier battery (so to speak). An extrovert needs time with other people. My ds is an introvert. If we have busy days (during the holidays this is especially important to remember) with lots of people around all the time, he gets out of whack. I have to remember to give him some time to himself.

It's important to remember not to label your child as shy. It's pretty normal for a 1-3yo to need time to warm up to people before feeling comfortable with them. It's most likely something they will just grow out of.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

This is an interesting distinction between introverted and shy. Could you clarify how "shy" would be different from introverted? I was thinking that loon13's suggestion to speak directly to the child was more respectful than speaking for the child (as I suggested).







. And I liked "are you feeling shy?".

I am quite extroverted by personality trait. But sometimes, I feel reserved and more "shy" about striking up a conversation. Just a more fleeting feeling of lack of conversational initiative.

Thanks,

Pat


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## captain crunchy (Mar 29, 2005)

My husband has just been researching this topic, as he is introverted, and in his opinion his parents did him a great disservice by trying to always "draw him out" -- especially around other people. He thinks it really affected his self esteem and promoted him to withdraw even further. I think there is a difference between shy and introverted, though my hubby is in the shower or else I would have him explain what he was reading and how it is different (sorry lol)....

...but from what I recall, introverted people have more internally generated brain activity which makes them less likely and less in need of external stimulation (that isn't to suggest they don't need friends or anything, just that they seem to require less external stimulation because it overwhelms them) ... and extroverted people tend to have less internally generated stimuli, thus they naturally seek out more external stimuli so they don't get bored (not bored in the sense of *nothing to do*, but speaking rather to brain stimulation).

Now that doesn't mean extroverts are not as smart or vice versa, it has nothing to do with intelligence at all. It is more to do with activity in the frontal lobe where serious thinking takes place, and while the introvert has more activity in the sensory areas which require outside stimulation - they tend to not require so much external stimuli, extroverts have less activity in the frontal lobe (as it relates to this subject in particular), so they seek out external stimulation more.

(That was my very introverted, highly intelligent husband dictating from the shower LOL)

To my understanding, people who are *shy* may be actually extroverts, desiring to seek out external stimuli and needing it as much as an openly outgoing extrovert, but may lack the skills, confidence, whatever to actually seek it out (if that makes sense)...while introverted folks, though still benefiting and desiring close relationships, are just content to kind of *be* ....and have no problem being alone...

does that make sense, I know it is kind of jumbled! I am DEFINATELY an extrovert, always have been...


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Captain Crunchy, what book is dh reading? I would be interested (my need for external stimuli







) for my internal deep thinking.









I think I am confused by your explanation.









I have always considered myself an extrovert, I think out loud. But have never been needful of external stimuli to get me thinking. I think in my head to, unless people are around and then it all comes out my mouth. Dh is quite introverted (as best I am untangling), and thinks inside his head before anything comes out of his mouth. So, when people are intruding on his thoughts, he withdraws _in order to think_. But I am more "abled" to think by bouncing ideas back and forth *with* people. (Thus, I love the internet!!







).

But, dh is overstimulated by external variables. So, this is confusing to me. Put your introverted husband on the keyboard.







He has thought it all out already; and it sounds like we extroverts are still trying to do that.







Maybe that is why I love books, I can do my own collating of the author's ideas while reading. But, mostly, I love talking. Could ya guess?









Pat


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## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *scubamama*
I have always considered myself an extrovert, I think out loud. But have never been needful of external stimuli to get me thinking. I think in my head to, unless people are around and then it all comes out my mouth. Dh is quite introverted (as best I am untangling), and thinks inside his head before anything comes out of his mouth. So, when people are intruding on his thoughts, he withdraws _in order to think_. But I am more "abled" to think by bouncing ideas back and forth *with* people. (Thus, I love the internet!!







).

But, dh is overstimulated by external variables. So, this is confusing to me. Put your introverted husband on the keyboard.







He has thought it all out already; and it sounds like we extroverts are still trying to do that.







Maybe that is why I love books, I can do my own collating of the author's ideas while reading. But, mostly, I love talking. Could ya guess?









First, Pat, thanks for starting this thread! It's so pertinent to my relationship w/my dd right now! You must be psychic









Second, I, too, am an extrovert, but I'm also somewhat shy and was very shy as a child. I definitely was shy because I was self-conscious and very critical of myself, but still desired LOTS of human interaction. In fact, there have been few times in my life that I've wanted to be alone or quiet.

I have only been able to read about three pages of the Child article because it keeps crashing, but I've been thinking about this a lot lately. In fact, my sister was just recommending an article that was in the Atlantic awhile ago titled "Taking Care of Your Introvert". Has anyone read it?

My mom, a major introvert, and I have discussed this a lot, and I think the most important thing I've realized from our talks is that introverts don't necessarily feel uncomfortable or left out when they're not involved in the conversation. This is SO HARD for me to realize, because feeling left out was a major fear of mine as a young extrovert with low self-esteem/poor self-image. This actually makes me feel kind of relieved because my desire to feel belonging led me to do some pretty stupid things, especially in high school. So, if my dd does not feel this need I think she'll be better off.


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## Fuamami (Mar 16, 2005)

Found it!

"Caring for Your Introvert" by Jonathan Rauch

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200303/rauch


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## onlyzombiecat (Aug 15, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *natensarah*
introverts don't necessarily feel uncomfortable or left out when they're not involved in the conversation. This is SO HARD for me to realize, because feeling left out was a major fear of mine as a young extrovert with low self-esteem/poor self-image. This actually makes me feel kind of relieved because my desire to feel belonging led me to do some pretty stupid things, especially in high school. So, if my dd does not feel this need I think she'll be better off.

I was a part of an introvert e-mail list for awhile and almost everyone felt they had less problems with peer pressure, drugs, or alcohol. I think that will be true for my dd. She is not a follower at all- very free thinker.
A lot of people on that list were pressured to act like extroverts growing up and it caused difficulties for them. When they embraced their introvert nature they really felt free and more confident.

I would define shy as something more to do with confidence, self-esteem, or anxiety. I think shyness has to do with caring about other's reactions or opinions. Shyness is often thought of with introvertedness but IMO it is more a condition that is seperate from a personality type. You might be a shy introvert or extrovert. You don't have to be shy to be an introvert. You might be shy sometimes. An introvert is an introvert all the time. Of course there are differing degrees of introversion and different types of introverts.
An introvert is a whole personality type. It is more about how you think and react to stimulus. It isn't something that is really changeable.

The brain activity of an introvert and an extrovert have been found to be different.

Quote:

The PET scans revealed that introverts have more activity in the frontal lobes of the brain and anterior, or front, thalamus. These areas are activated when a person's brain takes on internal processing such as remembering, problem solving, and planning. Extroverts exhibit more activity in the anterior cingulate gyrus, temporal lobes, and posterior thalamus. These areas are typically thought to be more involved in sensory processing such as listening, watching, or driving.

Differences in cognitive style and sensory-processing relate to characteristics associated with introversion and extroversion. True introverts are quiet, inwardly focused, and reclusive. Extroverts are gregarious, socially active, and sensation seeking. Introverts get more of their stimulation internally, whereas extroverts seek outside sources. These variations in brain activity suggest that a lot of our individual differences have an underlying biological cause.
from http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0779268.html

Quote:

Researchers in the Faculty of Science at the University of Technology Sydney have discovered why some of us are painfully withdrawn and others are the life and soul of the party.

According to the leader of the research team, Dr Yvonne Tran, it really hinges on electrical activity in the brain, or, to be more precise, the number of alpha waves generated from the frontal lobes of the brain.

The researchers have established a positive correlation between alpha waves generated in the frontal lobes of the human brain and personality traits that characterise introverts or extroverts.
from http://www.uts.edu.au/new/releases/2003/March/26.html


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## loon13 (Dec 2, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnysideup*
I was shy as a child (actually, I still am in some instances), but I'm not an introverted person. My dh is introverted, but not shy. I think sometimes people confuse the two terms. An introverted person needs alone time to mentally re-charge thier battery (so to speak). An extrovert needs time with other people. My ds is an introvert. If we have busy days (during the holidays this is especially important to remember) with lots of people around all the time, he gets out of whack. I have to remember to give him some time to himself.

It's important to remember not to label your child as shy. It's pretty normal for a 1-3yo to need time to warm up to people before feeling comfortable with them. It's most likely something they will just grow out of.











I agree that "shy" and "introverted" are often confused. I also agree not to label your child as "shy". That's a setup for a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Just to clarify, I ask dd if she "feels" shy. I'm trying to give her a short and sweet word to label the *feeling* she has when she backs away from other people. It also helps me limit the discussion in front of the other person.

We have talked about the feelings in further detail when we are alone, such as "Were you scared when you met Mr. Johnson today because he has a very loud voice?" or "You never met Jane before so you didn't know her. It's okay to take it slow to know her."

I believe my dd is introverted because while she does enjoy being around other kids from time to time, she NEEDS her time away from them. She needs her time to just be at home and do her own thing. Too much time with people, too many activities, etc, and she gets very frustrated and weepy and out of control.


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## loon13 (Dec 2, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *scubamama*
So, when people are intruding on his thoughts, he withdraws _in order to think_. But I am more "abled" to think by bouncing ideas back and forth *with* people. (Thus, I love the internet!!







).

Pat









:

Yeah, that's me, as an extrovert and my dh as an introvert. I need to talk my thoughts out loud. DH withdraws to think. There have been quite a few times when I ask him a question and because he didn't answer right away, I'll repeat the question. He'll usually remind me: "I heard you. I'm thinking."









As for dd, I think I can say she has extrovert tendencies (i.e. likes to look for friends to play with), but she seems to need to "recover" from too much of that kind of stimulation by withdrawing to herself for some alone play or quiet time with me reading, etc.


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## Embee (May 3, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnysideup*
I was shy as a child (actually, I still am in some instances), but I'm not an introverted person. My dh is introverted, but not shy. I think sometimes people confuse the two terms. An introverted person needs alone time to mentally re-charge thier battery (so to speak). An extrovert needs time with other people. My ds is an introvert. If we have busy days (during the holidays this is especially important to remember) with lots of people around all the time, he gets out of whack. I have to remember to give him some time to himself.

It's important to remember not to label your child as shy. It's pretty normal for a 1-3yo to need time to warm up to people before feeling comfortable with them. It's most likely something they will just grow out of.

YES! YES! YES! Thank you for articulating this! DH, DS and I are all introverted. DH is NOT shy, but I can be (mainly, I have trouble asking for help and information which drives DH mad!). DS doesn't appear to be terribly shy although he is somewhat uncomfortable around kids he doesn't know well at first. We all are very friendly in public situations where we may not know people well; with cashiers, tellers, towns people at large... smiling, hello and striking up conversations, etc when and where appropriate. DH and I are in a band and have played out more or less regularly for over 13 years and neither of us is shy about performing. DH likes to joke that we are the life of the party, if only we could talk ourselves into going!









None of us are great seekers of social time. In fact, are incredibly drained by it, even small doses. Our sincere wish is to kick back at home as much as possible. I have my once a month girlie gathering, and an occasional community project. DH has his running buddies whom he sees once or twice a week. We are forever seeking more alone time, or 'alone together' time and it's then that we can truly recharge, relax and enjoy life.

I saw this tendency in DS early on, and somehow DS himself started using the word "shy" when faced with social situations with other kids say. In fact, for him "shy" was was one of those universal words that young toddlers often use and he used it also for feeling scared, upset, among other things. I actually regret that I used the question, "are you feeling shy?" because for us, it simply was not an acurate term for what he was feeling. I think it put a label on DS and made him even more uncomfortable when in reality, he just isn't a terribly social guy, much prefers ours or his own company and the freedom to play creatively here at home where it's easiest and most comfortable to do so. Of course, he does like new experiences and we do get out and about regularly. For this, we use a lot of "orienting" before we enter a new situation; talk about when, where, who and what will happen as best as I can predict. We've also used play and role-play beforehand to help DS feel more empowered. Once DS feels he can visualize 'the scene' he is much more comfortable, really looking forward to things. Of course, this doesn't mean that when given an option for home or the park that he doesn't pick home 80% of the time. But at least now I feel confident and even relish that its because he loves home and wants to be there. He's not pining away for something he's afraid of, he just has a (very healthy) preference to be home.

I recently read "Hold On To Your Kids" and Neufeld gives some pretty great perspective on "shyness" and what it really means in terms of the psychological "blue print" so to speak... worth a look imo.









The best,
Em


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## Notshy (Jan 1, 2006)

People often mistake introverts as being "shy." It's just as spoken above. "well put" AND -From the shower. Fantastic....


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## aira (Jun 16, 2004)

I generally don't make any mention of the concept of "shyness" with DS. In a social situation, if he is putting his face in my chest to avoid a new person, I say something like, "Do you feel like hiding? I'll help you if you need." And I offer his ever-present blanket to hide under. And then I mention that if / whenever he wants to come out and see what we're doing, he's welcome to join in.

I was just asking DH what we should say to other people (for DS's benefit) when they call him "shy". That happens all the time lately. I like the idea to say that he'll warm up when he's ready...


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## writermommy (Jan 29, 2005)

My oldest dd was both shy and introverted. She is outgrowing the shyness, but is still an introvert. I definitely agree that there is a difference. I am introverted and was shy as a child. Not really shy anymore, unless I am in a very uncomfortable situation.

I never tried to draw her out or get her to answer people, especially not strangers. This makes no sense to me at all. We spend all this time teaching our kids not to talk to strangers, etc. But, then people expect them to say hi to every stranger that speaks to them. Totally mixed messages. To me, a relative or family friend that my dds don't know or only have met once or twice are strangers to them, even if not in the traditional sense.

Bottom line, if they want to talk, they talk and if they don't, I wouldn't make them or put pressure there. I also avoid the "shy" label. If someone else referred to my dd as shy, I would say that she's not shy, she just likes to get to know people slowly. I hate the way some people who don't know a child love to stick a label on them.


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## Quinn'sMommy (Jan 2, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *captain crunchy*
My husband has just been researching this topic, as he is introverted, and in his opinion his parents did him a great disservice by trying to always "draw him out"

I can relate to that. As someone that is shy and introverted I hated nothing more as a child then someone trying to "draw me out of my shell."


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## Proudly AP (Jul 12, 2003)

i **really** dislike it when an adult who wants to interact with my dd before she's 'ready' calls her 'shy' or tells her she's 'shy'. she has said this about herself after several such exposures.

i usually state, 'she needs time to get used to people.' (i was using the expression 'needs time to warm up' but silly me forgot about the literal interpretations of a preschooler. when i heard her saying that her doll was cold and needed to 'warm up' before she would talk to the other doll, i a) laughed and b) clarified the meaning of the figurative phrase.

when dd has said, 'i was shy with so-and-so' i usually say, 'you needed time to feel comfortable and that's okay. just because someone calls you shy or tells you that you are shy does not mean that you are or have to be'. she is nearly 4 and understands this well, i think.

i agree, too, that the distinction between shy and introverted is very important.


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## mamarhu (Sep 12, 2004)

I am really enjoying thinking about all this talk of introvert versus shy. Quite timely aroung here. I am strongly introverted, but not at all shy. I am perfectly comfortable talking with strangers, addressing a large audience in a public speaking situation, chatting with my clients or coworkers. I am not even nervous about job interviews! But I don't seek out friendships. This discussion has been enlightening for me, as I have always sort of thought I "should" want friends. I have wanted to join a synagogue, but held back because although I want to attend services or classes, I have never wanted to "join" in the more personal sense. Now, at nearly 50, I am finally giving myself permission to remain on the periphery. That is really where I have always been comfortable.

Both my Dumplings are extremely introverted as well. So was their father, if there is any genetic componant to all this. I have been feeling some pressure (thanks, Mom!







) to encourage them to participate in some sort of group activities. They are homeschooled and thriving, except that they do not want to do much in the form of classes or group activities. My mom is a pure extrovert, if you hadn't guessed. Neither of them want to, and I fully understand this. But I question if I am allowing them to limit themselves too much. I guess I am trying to tell how much is introverted peronality, and how much is shyness - in the sense of anxiety caused by lack of social skills, and how much is innate. YoungSon's (10 years) ASD dx explains some of his retiscense, but DD (11) is quite the same in this regard, with no diagnotic reason.

And that is the question: how much should I push them beyond their comfort zones? If at all. Or is it unreasonable to ask of them what I do not ask of myself?


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## LynnS6 (Mar 30, 2005)

I'm an introverted, not shy, parent of an introverted (just growing out of shyness) child. My introvert is also highly sensitive (to the point of having Sensory Processing Disorder). I also have an extrovert who is highly sensitive (she's not on the far end of the extrovert continuum, but she's definitely more outgoing than ds.) So, being sensitive is separate from being an introvert is separate from being shy.

I've done a TON of reading on this (both books that Pat mentioned) and some others - a lot related to SPD. Here's what I understand (parallels what some other people have written).

Shy people are worried about what other people think about them, and are thus reluctant to interact because they are anxious about the interaction.

Introverts need to be alone to recharge. They get energy from their thoughts and ideas and need time and space to explore those (oh so true for me - I NEED to be able to let go in my mind.)

Extroverts need other people to recharge. They get energy from interaction.

Highly sensitive people are just more sensitive to stimuli - external or internal. We just got back from a trip to Disneyland (a highly sensitive introvert's hell!) and Legoland (ahhhhh how calm in comparison!). Things that other people didn't notice, I (and my children) found too loud, too scary, too intrusive. (The Winnie the Pooh ride made my kids shrink in terror!)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nonconformnmom* 
Maybe a bit off-topic, but how does a GD parent deal with feeling awkward and embarrassed if their introverted child does not greet others after being greeted?

I turn to my child and ask "Do you want to say hello or wave?" Giving my introvert an NON-verbal response option helps. (One of the things about introverts is that they don't do well verbally under pressure a lot. It takes more to get the words out.) If ds (he's 5 1/2 now) doesn't want to, he doesn't have to. And I couldn't make him anyway! And if he doesn't, I look at the person and say "well, not today." When he was younger, I also would use phrases like "He needs to watch for awhile before he feels comfortable joining." or "Do you need a few minutes to warm up?"

As he gets older, he's getting better at the social nicities. No way would he respond (wave, verbally, eye contact) when he was 3. Last week we were at the dentist's and he answered the hygienist's questions, told her how old he was, told her what he wanted for Christmas, etc. I am starting to tell him that when he doesn't respond when people talk to him, they might think he's rude or that he doesn't like them. At 5, I think he's old enough for that info now. He needs to know how not responding is interpreted and is old enough to learn to take someone's persepctive -- at least in baby steps.

More to say, but ds wants to play Tonka Firefighter,and who am I to stand in the way of a boy and his emergency vehicles, since he's been so patient during this novel of mine!


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

mamarhu, my introverted friend warned me when ds was quite young that she perceived our son to be an introvert. My extroverted self didn't much heed the delta until I learned to watch for ds's cues and reactions to being such a happier person when in small groups of familiar people. And,







I FINALLY realized why dh didn't ever like all my 'let's invite a dozen or twenty people over for the evening' ideas.







:

So, following my happily successful, introverted friend's admonishments, we have never pushed ds to "socialize". He is quite social with his little friends who he adores and loves to engage with them. It just takes months of short, neutral visits with new friends to engender comfort, for either dh or ds. Of course, dh is a manager of many people and is loved for his engaged and responsive attention to other's on a meaningful level. But, in private, he doesn't much want to socialize with crowds. Neither does ds. So, we respect that in our family.

I don't believe that a parent needs permission to follow their child's lead about personal preferences related to his own personal life and associations. I am an advocate of doing that regardless of what other's believe.









Pat


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## aira (Jun 16, 2004)

I didn't read all replies.









But I wanted the throw in there that our family is a seriously mixed bag. I have been talking to my close friend about this - she used to see-saw between thinking I was an introvert and extrovert, and we came to the conclusion that I'm likely a natural extrovert, who was "unnatually" forced into introversion by abusive parenting... I am, however, very highly sensitive. So that may figure into the scenario. Point is I have opposing forces acting on me in many situations.

DH is... very very very type A - even when he's withdrawing into his cave he's type A.









DS is all introverted and sensitive. He actually came up with "I'm feeling shy right now," about a year ago or so. It works well for us, and I can ask him that if I notice he's getting buggy about something. It usually gives him a "place" to retreat.

I also tell people that he like to warm up, or that he needs time.

He calls... gotta go.


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## *LoveBugMama* (Aug 2, 2003)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnysideup* 
I was shy as a child (actually, I still am in some instances), but I'm not an introverted person. My dh is introverted, but not shy. I think sometimes people confuse the two terms. An introverted person needs alone time to mentally re-charge thier battery (so to speak). An extrovert needs time with other people. My ds is an introvert. If we have busy days (during the holidays this is especially important to remember) with lots of people around all the time, he gets out of whack. I have to remember to give him some time to himself.


My son fits the description of an introvert in many ways. He is also a very, very sensitive child, with sensory issues. So sometimes it`s difficult for me to see what is part of his sensitivity, what is sensory and what is him just being introverted.

He HATES being alone. It scares the living daylights out of him. So that part seems to be very much NOT introverted, right? But he needs alonetime alot! It`s just that he needs his alonetime together with me and/or his dad. Just us. At home.

And according to several articles and/or books I have read about this subject, being introverted doesn`t always mean that you need to be completely alone to recharge. Just that you need quiet times alone or with your selected few trusted one(s).

Just thought that could be interesting to someone.


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## zeldamomma (Jan 5, 2006)

This is an interesting thread. Dh and I are introverts, and my oldest is sensitive, but an extrovert. I have such a hard time dealing with her need to be with me when she's upset-- going off to be alone, then coming back when you feel better just seems so natural to me.

One of my BIG pet peeves is when people treat being quiet as a personality flaw that needs to be fixed. These same people tend to be OH SO LOUD (dh and I are sensitive people too-- I love quiet), and are completely oblivious of the way their behavior impacts the rest of us. Though I assume they think there's only one way to be happy, and it involves talkingtalkingtalkingtalking
talkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalking. ..

Learning about extroversion has been a real eye-opener for me.









ZM


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## crb (Aug 22, 2005)

Interesting discussion- I never thought about shy extroverts, but that makes perfect sense. They are looking to others for interaction, but are having trouble getting into the conversation or whatever and feel uncomfortable and shy. DD seems very comfortable w/others, but is also very focused inside herself and sometimes needs to step away from a group to be alone. And she definitely wants me and dh in w/her at this point!
I am curious what is wrong w/discussing w/a child that they might be "feeling shy" in a given situation (like feeling angry or sad) - not as a personality label, but just as a description of the situation? Is it a very negative word - more so than angry or afraid or anxious? Or is it just that it is a less clear description? From the discussion it sounds like people really want to avoid the term.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Bumping.

Pat


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## 4tsomething (Jan 2, 2007)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *crb* 
I am curious what is wrong w/discussing w/a child that they might be "feeling shy" in a given situation (like feeling angry or sad) - not as a personality label, but just as a description of the situation? Is it a very negative word - more so than angry or afraid or anxious? Or is it just that it is a less clear description? From the discussion it sounds like people really want to avoid the term.

Well from my experience of having been an introverted, anxious child/adolescent, I always hated being labeled shy. Having people say that about me seemed to make me even more self-conscious and hesitant in social situations, as if being viewed as "shy" would somehow draw more attention to me when/if I did speak up - don't know if that makes sense.

And the context of HOW it is said can make a difference as well. DD is rather introverted. We had a recent family gathering during which my SIL's grandmother obsessed about how "shy" DD was. Her first comment upon meeting DD (who had just woken up from a nap, BTW) was, "what's the matter with her, is she shy?"







: I responded as calmly as I could, "she's just waking up and takes awhile to warm up to new people" . She made several more comments throughout the afternoon, "look how shy she is," "oh my she's really shy"...ad nauseum. DD appeared unphased by it (mama's issue, I guess) but never did "warm up" to her either - she's got pretty good radar about who she wants to hang out with!!


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## trinaker (Dec 19, 2005)

I've found this topic interesting because I have an introverted 2-year-old. He'll spend lots of time on his own in his room reading through books and generally plays on his own very quietly.

My husband and I are also both introverted. I would think this would be an advantage since we understand, but in some ways I find it makes me project my experiences onto my son. I agree that in American society, introvertedness is not valued and I find myself always trying to make him more comfortable around groups.

One issue I am struggling with is whether to force him to go out when he wants to stay him. If I want to take him to a singalong or something, he'll almost always say he'd rather stay home. If I force him to go, he usually has a good time once he's there, but sometimes he's unhappy and then I feel guilty for dragging him out. Any suggestions on how to deal with this?


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *trinaker* 

One issue I am struggling with is whether to force him to go out *when he wants to stay him*.

I found your typo to be thought-provoking.

Pat


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## trinaker (Dec 19, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WuWei* 
I found your typo to be thought-provoking.

Pat

Ha! Good point. Maybe I meant what I typed. I have been letting him stay home when he wants to more often, but then I worry he's not learning coping skills to deal with large groups. He'll probably be going to preschool in the fall, but the one I'm hoping he goes to is very free-flowing so he'll be able to set his own agenda. He seems to do best in settings like that, so hopefully that will give him the group experience without forcing anything.


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## 5in9years (Nov 18, 2005)

Why does shy have to have a negative connotation? I have a social introvert and a shy one. I also have at least 2 extraverts-not sure about one of the kids. I've always believed that both shyness AND introversion should be respected.
My introverted but social 11yo was slow to warm up as a toddler. She wasn't shy around new people, just preferred not to interact with them until she knew them. (I'm not sure how to describe the difference, but having a shy child as well, there is a difference). She is comfortable in almost any situation and can now enter a group quickly and easily. BUT she needs some time every day just to be left alone. It's difficult in our crowded home, but we try to make her bed (top bunk) her space. She will retreat there and spend an hour reading or thinking, and then be ready to rejoin the family. Unfortunately, she has to share a room with her extraverted 8yo sister, and we really have to be aware of helping her maintain her space. The 8yo doesn't get when her older sister is feeling invaded.

We were criticized for allowing her to be "rude" as a toddler and not speak to people she didn't know, but I ignored the criticism and made sure adults weren't crossing her boundaries-she hated being kissed and hugged by relative strangers.

My 6yo is a shy introvert. We have to "protect" him from people who want to draw him out or make him participate in things before he's ready. If left alone in a new situation, he will get comfortable and get involved. Pushing only makes him feel more out there, and he goes farther into himself to escape. I talked to his K teacher at the beginning of the year and she's been great about letting him take his time. He didn't talk to her for 3 days-just ducked his head and grinned when she asked him a question. She was patient and backed off, and he's very comfortable with her now. He's had to get comfortable with a sub this month b/c his teacher just had a baby. The sub is a quiet person herself, so she's also been good to give him time. He thinks of himself as shy, but doesn't think of that as a trait that will keep him from doing what he wants. Rather, he knows that if he feels uncomfortable at first in a new situation, it's b/c he's shy and he needs a little time to settle in. As long as everyone else leaves him alone, he will stick with it until that happens. That's why I question "shyness" as a negative trait. IMO it is a neutral one and shy kids need to be respected and given the space and the tools to participate in life. That starts with understanding that it's okay to BE shy.


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## sunnysideup (Jan 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *trinaker* 
One issue I am struggling with is whether to force him to go out when he wants to stay him. If I want to take him to a singalong or something, he'll almost always say he'd rather stay home. If I force him to go, he usually has a good time once he's there, but sometimes he's unhappy and then I feel guilty for dragging him out. Any suggestions on how to deal with this?

There were a couple of things that helped my son feel more comfortable doing group activities. He liked to know he had a way out, in case he decided he wanted to leave. And, he liked to arrive a little early, so that we didn't have to enter the group when everyone else was already there.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *5in9years*
That's why I question "shyness" as a negative trait. IMO it is a neutral one and shy kids need to be respected and given the space and the tools to participate in life. That starts with understanding that it's okay to BE shy.

I agree.
I'm just not a fan a labeling kids in general.

It's not unusual for children under 5 to be overwhelmed by large groups, or slow to warm up to new people--but if they hear mom say "he's shy" everytime they feel apprehensive it becomes part of their identity.


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## 5in9years (Nov 18, 2005)

I agree.
I'm just not a fan a labeling kids in general.
It's not unusual for children under 5 to be overwhelmed by large groups said:


> There's a big difference between typical slow to warm up toddler and preschooler behavior, and a child who is by nature uncomfortable interacting with new people or being the focus of attention. I guess I don't really have a huge issue with labels, as long as the connotations are neutral. For my 6yo, it seems to be helpful to have a name for those feelings, and a reason for them. It also helps him to put his discomfort in perspective-"I always feel this way at first, but I'll be comfortable enough to talk in a while."
> 
> I don't understand why it's so bad to have that as part of one's identity. It's no different IMV from a child being creative or physical or any other trait. Shyness is a part of what makes my son who he is at this point in time. Just like being social is part of what makes my oldest dd who she is.


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## trinaker (Dec 19, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *sunnysideup* 
There were a couple of things that helped my son feel more comfortable doing group activities. He liked to know he had a way out, in case he decided he wanted to leave. And, he liked to arrive a little early, so that we didn't have to enter the group when everyone else was already there.

I've also found that arriving early tends to make a huge difference. Since he's usually stalling before we leave, it's hard to get there early enough for him to settle, but I guess we need to start leaving even earlier. Giving him an out doesn't seem to help. Once we're at our destination, he doesn't mind staying -- he just wants "all those other kids" to leave!


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## sunnysideup (Jan 9, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *5in9years* 
I don't understand why it's so bad to have that as part of one's identity. It's no different IMV from a child being creative or physical or any other trait. Shyness is a part of what makes my son who he is at this point in time. Just like being social is part of what makes my oldest dd who she is.

I think it's imporatant to allow your children to be who they are without attaching labels. No matter how positively you view the label, it can still feel like a boundary to a child. One might not even bother trying art, because they've been labled "good at math" and sister is the artistic one--KWIM?

I don't think there's anything wrong with talking about "feeling shy" I just don't think it is necessary to label a child as "shy" as if it were a perminant condition.

My first child was extreemly outgoing and social as a preschooler, and up until age 7-8. Now at 14, she has a small group of a few close friends, but she's not any more social than average. My ds was unusually socially reserved up through age 6-7. Now at age 12 he's not shy at all. He is very popular and at ease socially.

Maybe part of it is a personal bias. As a child, I was always introduced as "this is Samantha, she's shy."







It wasn't until age 25 or so that I realized I didn't _have_ to be shy.


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## 5in9years (Nov 18, 2005)

I can see that. I was always pushed to do things before I was ready. I felt like people were ignoring my need to get comfortable and not to be the center of attention. Being accepted as "shy" would have been much easier in comparison. My mother is extraverted and social, and pretty fearless. She didn't always know how to deal with my fears and sensitivity. She worried that acknowledging fears would make me more fearful.


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## eli janine (Jun 29, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *4tsomething* 
Well from my experience of having been an introverted, anxious child/adolescent, I always hated being labeled shy. Having people say that about me seemed to make me even more self-conscious and hesitant in social situations, as if being viewed as "shy" would somehow draw more attention to me when/if I did speak up - don't know if that makes sense.

And the context of HOW it is said can make a difference as well. DD is rather introverted. We had a recent family gathering during which my SIL's grandmother obsessed about how "shy" DD was. Her first comment upon meeting DD (who had just woken up from a nap, BTW) was, "what's the matter with her, is she shy?"







: I responded as calmly as I could, "she's just waking up and takes awhile to warm up to new people" . She made several more comments throughout the afternoon, "look how shy she is," "oh my she's really shy"...ad nauseum. DD appeared unphased by it (mama's issue, I guess) but never did "warm up" to her either - she's got pretty good radar about who she wants to hang out with!!









This is exactly me!!! (And my DS1 as well!) I am an introvert who was labeled shy by everyone. I never have been any good at small talk, and I have preferred to express myself in writing or artwork. I love my few close friends, but in truth they sometimes have to hunt me down to get me to do something, because I'm just perfectly content alone, or with my DH and kids. I, too, felt sort of "outed" by the shy label, as though giving the world's extroverts a reason to try and fix me.

Now I wouldn't call myself shy--I love talking with people once I'm comfortable with them, and I'm not afraid of public speaking one bit. My jobs as a teacher and a wedding photographer both require me to use a lot of social skills, but some inside part of me acknowledges that it's a little like playing a role, like acting, and I think the recharging time is to refamiliarize myself with ME.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Bumping.

Pat


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## Ilovelife (Jun 6, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *nonconformnmom* 
I always feel a bit embarrassed and I sort of murmer to dd, "When someone says 'hi' to you, you should say 'hi' back." I say it with a smile, and then leave it at that, but I really feel like it's my fault, like people think I haven't taught her any manners.

In the past, I've felt the same way, but I've come to realize that although I am my dd's parent, she is her own person. SHE chooses when to speak and to whom. It's not my fault. If I am teaching her and modelling appropriate behavior, I am doing my job, so there's no need to feel guilty. What other people may think about me or her is also out of my control, so I try not to spend time worrying about that.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Bumping.

Pat


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## olliepop (Jun 26, 2007)

My 4 year old dd is an introvert and has been all her life. At 7 months, she stopped letting people besides my husband and me hold her. (I chalked it up to Stranger Anxiety then, but now I think it's just her personality.)

It was around that time we went to an annual family reunion and almost all our relatives said she was spoiled. At the next reunion, she was labeled shy (and rude) for not answering the adults when they bombarded her with questions. It's like they ignore me when I say she needs time to warm up and to basically leave her alone until she does.

At the reunion when she was 3, they all started with the questions as soon as we got there, "Do you like school? Do you like your teachers? Are you excited about becoming a big sister? She was overwhelmed and just played with her dad in the corner. She didn't "come out of her shell" until it was sprinkler time, but by the end of the day, she was singing solos in the middle of the party. What?







:

It's about that time again - the reunion is in 2 weeks and I'm dreading the first couple of hours b/c I know that no one's going to respect her boundaries and they are all going to say, "Are you shy? You're too old to still be shy." I hear those things from my mother on a weekly basis.







:

Is there anything else I can say besides the warm up line? What can I say to my dd to make her feel comfortable during the barrage of questions? How do I explain to people that she's not being rude?


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## maya44 (Aug 3, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *WuWei* 
I am more "abled" to think by bouncing ideas back and forth *with* people. (Thus, I love the internet!!







).
But, mostly, I love talking. Could ya guess?









Pat

Can I ask you a question Pat? Please understand that I mean nothing snarky or rude by it. I think this is fascinating.

Do you think that your feeling the way you explain is the post is the reason that the idea of "time outs" bother you so much?

When the idea of a "time-in" is described on this board it makes my skin crawl when I think of it from my own point of view (that is to say if I put myself in the place of the child who was experiencing a "time in")

I never minded doing time-ins FOR my own kids (I didn't call them that back then but that's what they were) but one of my three dd's really didn't respond well to them at all. (The other two did, beutifully).

My third one though, while on some level not wanting to go away from me, seemed to need to do so in order to get herself together. If she didn't the thing that had made her unhappy seemed to drag with her for a looooong time.

But when we put her in a time out (if this was done it was often doen in order to meet the needs of the other children) she seemed to calm down immediately and come back (she was allowed back whenever she wanted so long as she did not contiune to do things that interfered with the needs of her siblings) fairly quickly. When she did she seemed usually happy, but more importantly, at peace.

Anyway, this just occurred to me as to different people needing different things.

I too consider myself an introvert (but NOT shy!). And you know how people sometimes say here that a time out is wrong because "hey if you were crying and upset would you want your dh to say "I am going to leave you until you calm down" and MY answer is actually "well I don't think I could articulate to him that that is what I want, but truthfully it is best."


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## CowsRock (Aug 1, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Embee* 
DH likes to joke that we are the life of the party, if only we could talk ourselves into going!









None of us are great seekers of social time. In fact, are incredibly drained by it, even small doses. Our sincere wish is to kick back at home as much as possible.

This describes me and my hubby perfectly...well I wouldn't say we are the "life" of the party, but we hold our own, the times we manage to not talk ourselves out of going. We almost always drag our feet about going some place and we'll even admit in the moment we'll be happy if we go, but we still would prefer to just hang out at home.


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## hipumpkins (Jul 25, 2003)

: Subbing b/c I want to read the whole thing and I have to go play beanie babies right now.


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## WuWei (Oct 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *maya44* 

Do you think that your feeling the way you explain in the post is the reason that the idea of "time outs" bothers you so much?

My concern with "time in" or "time out" is whether the child finds it beneficial from their own pov. I can certainly understand that dh prefers "time away" to recenter, when I might feel "cast away" if it were imposed upon me. But, the desire to have "space" can certainly be encouraged, facilitated or offered in ways which are agreeable to the child, either with or without company, imo. Or the need for one's own space could be met by facilitating the child to become engaged with some other activity, which isn't impacting others.

Pat


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## katiecat (May 4, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *olliepop* 
It's about that time again - the reunion is in 2 weeks and I'm dreading the first couple of hours b/c I know that no one's going to respect her boundaries and they are all going to say, "Are you shy? You're too old to still be shy." I hear those things from my mother on a weekly basis.







:

Is there anything else I can say besides the warm up line? What can I say to my dd to make her feel comfortable during the barrage of questions? How do I explain to people that she's not being rude?

Olliepop, we have the same situation coming up (without the previous reunions like you've had) and I am wondering the same things. I am hoping people will back off ds if I just tell them he needs time but...I have my doubts about some of them!

We had a bad situation at Christmas with dh's family and I'm really hoping it won't be similar at this family reunion (which is my family) in 2 weeks.

I'm sure I read this thread when it was first started and I really appreciate it again now. DS and I are introverts, dh is extrovert. With ds, currently the hardest thing for him is large groups (hence my apprehension about this reunion coming up). I think he just gets completely overwhelmed in a big group, whether people even try to talk to him or not but it's much worse when people are "bugging" (what I consider bugging) him. With us, as well, his anxiety causes him to get very demanding and sometimes he doesn't even want _me_ talking to anyone. This I find hard to handle. I know it's not "bad behaviour" on his part, it's his anxiety and I do talk to him about other ways to handle it but for now, that's the phase he's in. And then he's labelled as rude and a brat and all that... Sigh...

Another part of it for me is handling how _I_ feel. I don't mind so much ds's behaviour and we will be able to escape when we need to. But I find I just get feeling very bad and I feel all closed off and then I basically ruin it for myself. Yuck. I'm trying to figure out exactly what bothers me. I guess it has to do with me feelign like people are judging me/ds/my family without even knowing anything about us.


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## Realrellim (Feb 1, 2006)

Having just spotted this thread, I was going to post a family-related question too.

DH, DD and myself are all introverts. I think all three of us are also highly-sensitive, though I think DH is highly-sensitive in different ways than DD or myself.

So last week we were visiting my in-laws, who I think are mainly extroverts. They are amongst themselves at least. DH feels comfortable because this is his (large, extended) family, but even after having met these people 11 years ago, I still hesitate before walking into a room filled with his large family during a get-together. DD, who is 2-1/2 does too.

Even when it's just his parents and his brother, wife and child, it's loud. MIL is a preschool teacher-turned-administrator who apparently has forgotten that kids sometimes need time to answer questions. I have to remind her repeatedly to give DD a chance to answer the question before she asks it again. My SIL is very directive, so when she is around she directs much of my nephew's play (he just turned 3, and I has autistic tendencies [has not been tested] which might explain some of SIL's behavior). The end result is that it's LOUD and someone is always talking. Often it's endless questions: "What color is this? What animal is this? Do you know what this shape is?"

DD knows her colors, knows most animals, and has a good grasp of basic shapes. While she was there, her most frequent response to such questions was to ignore them completely or to say "I don't know" even though she did. I don't care that she didn't answer the questions (she's visiting, not taking an IQ test), but I'm looking for a way to get SIL and MIL to give DD more space at Christmas when we visit again.

I'm most concerned about my MIL. Last Thanksgiving we had a moment where it got really noisy (TV and people talking) and DD was uncomfortable. I explained nicely that DD doesn't so well with a lot of noise, and MIL's response was "well, she'll have to learn to deal with it."







: I hadn't asked anyone to be quiet or turn the TV off--I was just explaining DD's reaction, which was to essentially shut down and sit in my lap and nurse in a quiet(er) corner.


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