# NMY Graduates Love Thread, Part 4



## snozzberry

*







to the NMY Graduates (+ babies) love thread!*










































































































































































































































*Previous Threads*
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3

Here's the latest Not Mamas...Yet tribe thread.

*Book Recommendations*
We decided to start a book recommendation list halfway thru this thread, so we're parking it here for now, but it will be one of the standard first posts in our subsequent threads. Names following book titles are the NMY grads who recommended the title.

Becoming the Parent You Want to Be
Sihaya

Bright from the Start
PiePie

The Continuum Concept
zoebird

Diaper-Free Baby
snozzberry, zoebird

Einstein Never Used Flashcards
PiePie

Ina May's Guide to Childbirth
Maela

Nursing Mother, Working Mother
PiePie, snozzberry

Odd Girl Out
PiePie

Our Babies, Ourselves
PiePie, snozzberry

Parenting from the Inside Out
zoebird

Playful Parenting
PiePie, snozzberry

The Second Shift
PiePie

Taking Back Childhood
Maela

Tender Hooks
PiePie

Toilet Learning (though won't be popular with ec'ers)
PiePie

Unconditional Parenting
PiePie, snozzberry


----------



## snozzberry

*Our Current Lovees*















: 7







: 11

Katt & Teotimo (Teo)







: (12/27/06)
Shanna & Fenton Edward







: (3/26/07)
Holiztic/Elizabeth & Quinn Herrick







: (4/13/07)
BeccaBear & Alexander Lewis







: (5/6/07)
Alice & Johannes Edward







: (5/20/07)
Sherrie (Turtle81) & Phillip Benjamin







: (6/2/07)
Farmama & Natalina







: (7/17/07)
Maela & Maev







: (7/17/07)
Jodi & Rosalie Jayne







: (7/23/07)
PiePie &







: (8/16/07)
Arelyn & Micaiah







: (8/16/07)
Sihaya & Calvin Elliot







: (12/22/07)
Kelly (snozzberry) & Abigail Ann







: (2/16/08)
Christina (cking) & Josephine Angela







: (4/1/08)
blizzard_babe & Isaac Vincent







: (5/6/08)
Heather (witchygrrl) & Rhea Ann







: (8/1/08)
zoebird & Hawk Octavian







: (8/30/08)
MujerMamaMismo & Sebastian Felix







: (12/21/08)


----------



## snozzberry

*Katt*

labor
birthstory
*Shanna*

first contractions
Roo's here!
birth story
*Elizabeth (Holiztic)*

Quinn has arrived! (by Daddymoe)
first post as a mama
Quinn's first pictures
*BeccaBear*

info post by Sihaya
first post-baby post in the Love Thread, and pics.
birth story!
*Alice*

labor!
Charlie's announcement
pictures
*Sherrie (Turtle81)*

Another little boy joins us! (post by Wateraddict)
Sherrie's update
*Farmama*

contractions!
Natalina arrived!
about the birth
first pics!
birth story part 1
*Maela*

BH contractions!, getting closer - real contractions
midwife on the way!
Maev arrived!
*Jodi*

Water broke!
Rosalie has arrived! (with pictures)
Birth story
*PiePie*

In Labor!
Baby girl is here!
*Arelyn*

In Labor! 1 2 3 4
Water Broke!
Micaiah has arrived!
Birth story
*Sihaya*

Calvin is here!
Birth story
*snozzberry*

Abby is here!
*cking*

The royal baby has arrived!
Josephine Angela
*blizzard_babe*

Isaac Vincent is here
*witchygrrl*

Rhea Ann is here
*zoebird*

Hawk Octavian is here
*MujerMamaMismo*

Sebastian Felix is here
If you have other important links to add, please PM me.


----------



## snozzberry

*Heather,* such good news about Rhea's weight!







: And sounds good about the job!







:

*zoebird,*
















*Shanna,* still just







from me. I wish I had more to offer.























*arelyn,* I'd love that GF carrot cake recipe if you don't mind sharing it!

*Me update:* Abby fell out of bed for the first time last night...onto our hardwood floors. She has a quarter-sized bruise on her forehead, a bigger bruise on her cheek, and a huge bruise on her side.





















We've been watching for fever, vomiting, and pupil issues ever since, and she seems fine. But just.





















I feel horrible. Been depressed all day, if that's the right word. If I get into work and forget for a few minutes, it will hit me like a mack truck and then I get this sick feeling in the deepest part of my stomach. Ugh.

It was a dumb mistake that shouldn't have happened. We _knew_ she was getting too mobile for our pillow-fortress nap solution. I even posted on this thread a couple weeks ago about how it wasn't going to last!!! So I feel guilty for not doing something sooner. And *then* I heard her tossing and turning while DH was brushing his teeth, but I was in the next room from her doing the bills, and I was trying to finish them up before I went to check on her. So double the guilt there.

So I think we're going to get a pack-n-play or something because I'm uncomfortable with the idea of bed rails (i.e. her getting caught in them), we can't put our bed on the floor (we've got a bedframe with drawers in as our dresser--small house), and we don't really have room for a full-on crib.

I know it happens to a lot of babies, but I'm still just unbearably


----------



## PiePie

kelly, hugs. babies are really resilient. i know you know that my dd has fallen more than once and is a







: child.

shanna, confess i haven't read those pieces myself, they are just the most recommended on mdc and hence on my to read list. wonder if you could apply gordon's method for nights to naps? anyway it sounds like he's a capital napper!! so you must be doing something right


----------



## TwilightJoy

I can't believe we have *16* babies now! That's just so many! Considering when I joined here we only had pregnant NMY.







:

Thanks for the new thread, Snozz.

Okay, back to my lurking.


----------



## Sihaya

My baby is the next to turn one. *faint*

In us news, we had our first overnight without DS last Friday. We went to a B&B for our 3rd anniversary fully expecting my mom to bring him to us around bedtime (10pm here), but he went down for her (despite not taking a bottle) and did fine overnight. I, on the other hand, nearly died of engorgement and pledged not to do another overnight without him until he's night-weaned









Moving is going very slowly. Things have been crazier than usual around here and now DH's work is demanding he work overtime for the next 1-2 months. I have no clue when/how we're going to clean/fix up the new place and pack up the old place when I have no car and no help.


----------



## witchygrrl

Thanks for the new thread, snozz! That reminds me...I should really write up my birth story. I guess I'm still processing it all.

a







to you also. I'm sure all will be well, but I totally understand the guilty feelings. I've already banged Rhea's head on a door while carrying her (I totally misjudged where it was), and I couldn't help but think I wrecked her head forever. But she's fine.

And for the big update....DH got the job!




























It means we'll be moving, but we wanted to do that anyway. It was just a matter of where! I am so relieved.


----------



## PiePie

heather so happy for you

back to my deposition







, gotta get of fthe pump







sometimes woh sucks


----------



## charliemae

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
I can't believe we have *16* babies now! That's just so many! Considering when I joined here we only had pregnant NMY.







:

Thanks for the new thread, Snozz.

Okay, back to my lurking.

















:








:


----------



## cking

subbing to the new thread - thanks snozz

and







to you. That's my new concern - Josephine will be rolling soon and I'm not sure what to do. But I understand how you feel.

I'm having trouble keeping up, or at least responding, so I just want to send out lots of







s to everyone.









In our news, _*we have a tooth*_! It is just barely cutting through the gums, but it's there. (and I'm _not_ crazy.







) But J is cranky and I'm tired. I can't wait to show the tooth to DH when he gets home.

And J took her first bottle yesterday. Nothing bad happened.







But I still feel a little









Kelly, good luck with the solids! I've been giving that a lot of thought too, since Josephine will be 6 months in only 6 weeks! I'm not in any rush to give her food, and I feel like whether or not she's ready for it, _I'm_ not ready. Did anyone else feel like this?


----------



## Maela

*Heather* yay for the job!!!









*Cking* yay for the tooth!!!









Dd and I took a bike ride to the store today and she fell alseep 5 minutes before we got home. She woke up when I took her out of the trailer and apparently that was her nap for the day.







: I really NEED her to take a nap today. I just don't know if it's going to happen.









Her new favorite past time is pulling the books down from the bookshelves.


----------



## Maela

steph, that's so great that you got a night alone. We have yet to try that. So did Calvin get a bottle when he woke up at night? Did he sleep with your mom? Dd would never take a bottle, but maybe she would take a sippy cup for night wakings? We're thinking about leaving her overnight for our 5 year anniversary. She would be almost 1 1/2. not sure if she'll be nightweaned by then or not.

Oh and Happy Anniversary!!


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
steph, that's so great that you got a night alone. We have yet to try that. So did Calvin get a bottle when he woke up at night? Did he sleep with your mom? Dd would never take a bottle, but maybe she would take a sippy cup for night wakings? We're thinking about leaving her overnight for our 5 year anniversary. She would be almost 1 1/2. not sure if she'll be nightweaned by then or not.

Oh and Happy Anniversary!!

Thanks! He took a sippy cup when he woke up at night. He did sleep with my mom and, despite teething, only woke up to eat three times through the night (for me it's every 45-60 min while he's teething). I was in total shock that we got a night alone - that was not the plan at all and the engorgement made it way too painful to do anything fun


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
_*we have a tooth*_!

WTH - the tooth disappeared. ???? Does that happen? DH thinks I'm









at least she's in a better mood now.


----------



## snozzberry

*Heather*, yay!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Kelly, good luck with the solids! I've been giving that a lot of thought too, since Josephine will be 6 months in only 6 weeks! I'm not in any rush to give her food, and I feel like whether or not she's ready for it, _I'm_ not ready. Did anyone else feel like this?

I totally felt like that! But I came around to the idea, and we went ahead and gave her avocado this morning. It was fun.









I bet that tooth will show up again soon! Maybe the gums are just swollen & covering up the bit you saw earlier?

*Maela*, I'm sorry about the lack of napping!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Her new favorite past time is pulling the books down from the bookshelves.

Hmm, I've wondered about that with Abby and whether we should get doors put on the bookshelves...

Now I'm off to search for not-so-plastic-y pack-n-plays...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
WTH - the tooth disappeared. ???? Does that happen? DH thinks I'm









at least she's in a better mood now.









I don't know if this is true, but my mom said that they can go up and down. But maybe the gums are swollen like Kelly said. Also, Dd had what I thought was a tooth (it was hard and white) early on and the dr said it was some type of cyst (harmless). It goes away. Could that be it?

*Kelly*, sorry about your baby falling off the bed. The first (out of two







) time Dd fell of the bed I felt horrible for days. The second time I felt worse, of course.














We do have carpet so that helped, but still it's so sad.









ETA: Dd finally went down for a nap. I was going to try to get her to stay up and just go down for the night early, but she was crying and obviously very tired, so I nursed her sleep. So now she's going to be up late late late tonight. Yay! *sarcasm*


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Maela:* I hope there's some good sleep for you coming soon!
*
Snozz:* Poor you. I'm sure Abby will be fine. Think of it as resilience training or something... I know I'll feel terrible for days when Squeak falls out of bed too!

I'm tired and achy and sick of reflux today. I'm also at work and haven't done a single work related task because my back is so sore that I can't sit still for more than 3 minutes. Methinks I need some acupuncture *and* an osteopath appointment. Gawd pregnancy is expensive!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
WTH - the tooth disappeared. ???? Does that happen? DH thinks I'm









at least she's in a better mood now.










well dh and my mom claimed they saw a tooth 2 mos ago that i still haven't seen. of course my mom is certifiable.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Gawd pregnancy is expensive!


oh yes. and at least you get a mw-assisted birth covered!


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM*, I hope you get some relief from your aches and pains. I can't remember if it's here that I heard this, but just remember that it's HARD work splitting cells all day, so your body deserves all the pampering and rest you can give it!

*Maela*, how did last night go?

*Thrush:* What do y'all know about it? I'm nervous I have it. My right nipple is sore to touch and hurts pretty bad during nursing/pumping, although it does start to feel a little better by the middle of the feeding/pumping. Abby bit me on that side a couple days ago, so I assumed it was just soreness from that.


----------



## accountclosed3

39 weeks today and feeling good. should get the computer back today or tomorrow.









everything in the house is ready. i just finished washing and organizing all of the baby clothing, my clothing, and my husband's clothing.

the bed was supposed to come yesterday, but the delivery guy had something come up, and so he'll come on friday. also, the cleaning service comes on friday. so, that will be interesting.

it always gets piled up like that.









also, the local obama campaign called to ask me to canvas again--which wuold be awesome except it's from 2-6 on sunday afternoon. that's 4 hours of waddling around. that might be too much.

but it might also make for great press: "







bama supporter gives birth while canvassing."

ah, 10 seconds of fame.







LOL


----------



## cking

The tooth is back! I'm not nuts after all. I guess the gums just cover it sometimes. I googled disappearing tooth and some MDC threads came up.









now I just have to decide whether to put yesterday as the date for her first tooth in the record books, or to wait until a tooth actually pops up.









Zoebird,














:to you.


----------



## farmama

Quote:

ETA: Dd finally went down for a nap. I was going to try to get her to stay up and just go down for the night early, but she was crying and obviously very tired, so I nursed her sleep. So now she's going to be up late late late tonight. Yay! *sarcasm*
funny, that happened with us yesterday too. how did you make out? natty didn't go to bed until 11:30, and she was WIRED. she played with her papa, and i fell asleep on the living room floor (waking every once in a while when she whacked me with her stuffed kitty). doh.


----------



## snozzberry

*zoebird,* it's great to hear everything's falling into place!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
now I just have to decide whether to put yesterday as the date for her first tooth in the record books, or to wait until a tooth actually pops up.

















I am so bad about writing in Abby's baby book. I did it once when she was a couple weeks old, but I haven't since. I also haven't been journaling as often as I was while on maternity leave...maybe once a month.







And I had such grand plans for documenting her babyhood so it was there for when she got older and would appreciate it...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
funny, that happened with us yesterday too. how did you make out? natty didn't go to bed until 11:30, and she was WIRED. she played with her papa, and i fell asleep on the living room floor (waking every once in a while when she whacked me with her stuffed kitty). doh.

It wasn't too bad. She went to bed at 9:30PM. I'm sorry your night was longer.







about the kitty though Sounds just like Dd.

Today made up for the last three days. She woke up at 6:45AM (not bad), took a nap from 11:15AM - 1:15PM without waking up (woo-hoo!), and went to sleep at 8:50PM (pretty good). I got so much done during her nap, and I had time to relax. We had Dh's parents over for dinner, and I was able to make a nice dinner while Dh watched Dd.

A question: The dropping things over and over and over. I know she's learning about gravity and how she can control how some things happen. I think that's great, and I usually try to humor her by picking the thing up over and over. However, there are times when this is kind of unreasonable. Like today we were in the grocery store. She likes to sit in the cart and I always bring toys for her to play with. She dropped a few out of the cart over and over. Finally I took them away because I wasn't able to go five feet without having to pick something up. She cried and screamed for about 10 seconds, but then she was fine. Was that mean of me? What do you all do?


----------



## snozzberry

: on answers to Maela's question...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Sorry this is going to be so short:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
A question: The dropping things over and over and over. I know she's learning about gravity and how she can control how some things happen. I think that's great, and I usually try to humor her by picking the thing up over and over. However, there are times when this is kind of unreasonable. Like today we were in the grocery store. She likes to sit in the cart and I always bring toys for her to play with. She dropped a few out of the cart over and over. Finally I took them away because I wasn't able to go five feet without having to pick something up. She cried and screamed for about 10 seconds, but then she was fine. Was that mean of me? What do you all do?

I usually say to Fenton "If you drop it again, I'm taking that as a sign that you're done with it". It gives him another chance, and takes in the possibility that he really is done with it (which he usually isn't. I get that it's a developmental stage, but, like you said, we can't just stand there and pick things up all day......

So much more to say and hear, but Fenton is trying to carry his popper up the stairs


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Sorry this is going to be so short:
I usually say to Fenton "If you drop it again, I'm taking that as a sign that you're done with it". It gives him another chance, and takes in the possibility that he really is done with it (which he usually isn't. I get that it's a developmental stage, but, like you said, we can't just stand there and pick things up all day......

So much more to say and hear, but Fenton is trying to carry his popper up the stairs









Oh good, so I'm not mean.







That's what I do too. I try to warn her before I do it, but I don't know how much she understands my warnings just yet.


----------



## snozzberry

Howdy mamas! I should sleep but I don't want to. Humph.

*PiePie,* how goes the world of working and pumping?

*zoebird,* how are you feeling?

How is everyone's sleep situation?

*Shanna,* what's a "popper" and why does Fenton have one?









*Christina,* how's that tooth looking?

*MMM,* did your appts help?


----------



## farmama

yep, i do the same thing.


----------



## ~Shanna~

nak

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Shanna,* what's a "popper" and why does Fenton have one?









It's one of these. Fenton loves it - he has one at home, and still runs towards them at church, friends' houses and any other place he runs into one.He especially loves carrying it up and then throwing it down the stairs









Can we talk frankly about television? And i mean _really_ frankly, not one of those discussions where everyone lies about what they wish they didn't do? Fenton has fallen in love with the muppets (or "mut!", as he calls them







). Thank you DH







:. Audio, visual, still, you name it. When he requests them, we're offering up the CD first, but we're still allowing him to watch it on dvd a couple of times a day when he requests it, despite my feeling that we should limit it to 1 episode a day. I don't feel comfortable not ever letting him watch tv when we have one in the house and dh and I have a healthy relationship with watching a movie once a week or so. But what concerns me is that the tv is on _more_ than it used to be, not less. So I'm redirecting to audio, and have plans to get some pictures of kermit and dogs (another favorite) to have on the fridge to also redirect to. I'm in that weird place where I don't think him looking at tv once in a while is going to turn his brain to mush, but I'm not comfortable with the slope we're on, and especially that he's watching it more than DH and I even watch ourselves. What are the trends at your place?


----------



## Maela

TV: Lately the tv has been on a lot in our house due to the fact that I love watching the olympics. Dd is also loving watching the olympics. So everyday between 10am-1pm (although 1-2 of those hours she's napping) and at night from 8-bedtime the tv has been on. But next week, we're going to be back to normal. Hopefully Dd doesn't mind. I do let her watch the occasional pbs kids show (like an episode a week) Sometimes she's really into tv and sometimes she watches for a minute or two and then is off to play. At the grandparents (especially my parents) the TV is always on. So she's exposed to it a lot there. I think that Dh and especially me have a pretty healthy relationship with the tv so i'm not freaking out about the amount Dd watches. I'm hoping that we set a good example for her.









Maev also has one of those poppers. She hasn't yet realized that she can walk with it even though she's walking well now.


----------



## PiePie

we got dd the popper for her first birthday.

we have been tv free since moving to the new house due to the cost of cable. however we are getting the big screeen today allegedly just for moving watching but well see... so dd hasn't seen tv since march or so. saw a bit on primary nights but that's it.


----------



## katt

Quick news here...
We spent the last week up at my parents and the farm only has dial-up, so I kept it short and didn't visit any boards.

TV: we watch a lot so, Teo is exposed to a lot. I do my best to keep cartoon exposure to a minimum, that entrances him the most. if he's going to watch tv, i'd rather the subject matter/concepts didn't change every 2 minutes. He watches sports with DH though, he'll kick back and snuggle.

okay, i got lots more to share, but i gotta get on w/ my day


----------



## Maela

We bought a digital antennae. I think it was about $40-50. Just a one time fee. It works pretty well and it's nice because we're not paying monthly. We get the basics.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm feeling good. gassy, mostly, but that can be controlled by eating good food.







and drinking my RRL tea and such.

the mattress still hasnt' come and i cant' get ahold of the delivery guy. that's blech. the baby's stuff is finished (cleaned, organized, etc), and there's a bit of debris around (old gift bags and what not) that are going to be recycled/trashed.

my parents come tomorrow to put upt hte towel rack.

they're desparate to buy a bassinette for me. like my ILs, they're *not listening*. i explained the continuum concept, which they think is realy crazy because "of course you'll want to put the baby down." which may or may not be true, btu that doesn't require a bassinette either.

they say that my sister can store it, which is fine, except when "in use" there's no real space. i think they're just freaked about co-sleeping, and dad asserts that no organization that is "real" or "withotu dubious or unknown backing" thinks that cosleeping is a good idea.

so, there you go. Mohtering and all-ya'll are "dubious with unknown backing."

well i already knew that, but cnosidering it's the way that people sleep all over the world and have for centuries, i figure that has a bit more longevit and clout than say, the APA or whatever. LOL

so, they're going to try and coerse me to take one; i m ight be able to distract them with something else, but what i haevn't figured out yet.

i figure if they read TCC, they might "get" it, but ryan wants to read it before handing it off to my parents.

and, i have to cleant he car. it needs to be vaccummed and also there is a weird spot in the back on the upholstry. should get that out before putting the car seat in.

that's all here. oh, and my computer is still at the shop and they won't return my calls, so i'm going by in a few.


----------



## witchygrrl

glad to know you're still feeling well, zoe.









re: cosleeping. We had gotten a cosleeper, but mostly Rhea sleeps with me anyway. I couldn't stand not being able to react immediately to her needs, even though she was about 9 inches away.

but we're headed to vt next weekend, and the beds aren't exactly what I would consider ideal for cosleeping, so we're bringing her moses basket. I hope the two of us can deal. plus the ILs will be there (seeing as it's a long weekend and their house), but it's not going to be restful. at all. Bf'ing will be an adventure also. I swear, no one ever bf'd in DH's family.

also, did your newborns have nightmares at all? she'll be sleeping peacefully, and then all of sudden cry out for a few seconds in her sleep. it's always heartbreaking when she does this, and we think it's because of nightmares.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 

also, did your newborns have nightmares at all? she'll be sleeping peacefully, and then all of sudden cry out for a few seconds in her sleep. it's always heartbreaking when she does this, and we think it's because of nightmares.

? the research indicates that they don't really dream until 4 mos.


----------



## PiePie

zoe, i still get ua violations from my parents (well, just my mom) for cosleeping.














when she was a newborn, i used the tiny love gymini http://www.amazon.com/Tiny-Love-Gymi.../dp/B00000J4SP when i wanted to put her down. i thought it was a good toy too.







i was having trouble getting a shower in so i also got a bouncy seat http://www.target.com/Fisher-Price-R.../dp/B000I2WB6G, about which i had mixed feelings... we have a crib now (acquired at 10 mos., assembled at least a mo. thereafter) that we rarely use.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
also, did your newborns have nightmares at all? she'll be sleeping peacefully, and then all of sudden cry out for a few seconds in her sleep. it's always heartbreaking when she does this, and we think it's because of nightmares.

Fenton did this too.

Will try to post more later, must get sleep. Now.


----------



## PiePie

stalking zoe.


----------



## witchygrrl

shanna, I'll be interested in what you have to say re:the baby nightmares. ven if research says they don't really dream, she falls into what looks like REM state really quickly. I always wonder what's going on in there.

I was also thinking about your tv post, shanna. we bought muppets stuff because we specifically loved the muppets from our childhood, and if Rhea should watch anything, she could watch that. But we also watch way too much tv ourselves, so honestly trying to have her not watch is going to be interesting.

so long as I don't stick her in a crib with some toys parked in front of the tv all day...oh wait, that was my babyhood







:


----------



## Maela

Heather, Dd would also do that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
they're desparate to buy a bassinette for me. like my ILs, they're *not listening*. i explained the continuum concept, which they think is realy crazy because "of course you'll want to put the baby down." which may or may not be true, btu that doesn't require a bassinette either.

they say that my sister can store it, which is fine, except when "in use" there's no real space. i think they're just freaked about co-sleeping, and dad asserts that no organization that is "real" or "withotu dubious or unknown backing" thinks that cosleeping is a good idea.

so, there you go. Mohtering and all-ya'll are "dubious with unknown backing."

well i already knew that, but cnosidering it's the way that people sleep all over the world and have for centuries, i figure that has a bit more longevit and clout than say, the APA or whatever. LOL

so, they're going to try and coerse me to take one; i m ight be able to distract them with something else, but what i haevn't figured out yet.

i figure if they read TCC, they might "get" it, but ryan wants to read it before handing it off to my parents.

and, i have to cleant he car. it needs to be vaccummed and also there is a weird spot in the back on the upholstry. should get that out before putting the car seat in.

that's all here. oh, and my computer is still at the shop and they won't return my calls, so i'm going by in a few.









ZB, there is a new book out that I saw at my LLL meeting. I can't remember what it was called. I'll try to figure it out. Here is a website that gives information on the safety of cosleeping.


----------



## Maela

_Sleeping With Your Baby: A Parent's Guide to Cosleeping_ by James J. McKenna

I thought he was an MD, but I guess not. I don't even know if the book is new or not; thought it was. But maybe this would help your parents with the bassinet issue?

We have a crib that's not set up anymore. Someone gave it to us for free before Dd was born. I don't know if I even want to set it up for the next baby.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Developing a sleep plan on Pantley's advice in NCSS for Toddlers. Will report back, it has been wonderfully helpful in clarifying what to work on.


----------



## snozzberry

*Shanna,* great to hear you're feeling hopeful about the advice you're getting on sleeping.

*zoebird,* maybe you can distract them with your beautiful new baby so they forget about the bassinet crap?









*TV:* It's so refreshing to hear such honest accounts of what everyone is trying to do with TV. I just love you ladies.







So for us: We are currently trying not to let Abby look at the TV while we're watching, so she just gets glimpses every once in a while. But it's hard, and we feel guilty for watching the TV and not paying attention to her, so we're trying to cut back. We were watching about 45 min-1 hr of TV every night while we ate dinner, and she would sit in a baby chair facing us. So now we're going to try eating dinner at the table w/no TV. It helps that she can sit in her high chair while we eat, now.

But I had planned on not letting her watch TV (in our house at least) before the age of 2, maybe longer. Maybe that's not reasonable--we'll see. I mean she's 6 months old now, and we're just now starting to adjust our TV watching habits to what we had planned to before she arrived.







We just really don't like the idea of her seeing ads before she can start to understand on some level that their purpose is to manipulate her. Also, I got that book Elizabeth recommended called _Endangered Minds_--it had some interesting things to say about TV, and even recommended delaying/decreasing TV until the child learns how to read, as TV watching can decrease comprehension skills. The book's point was that TV is a passive learning experience (if it's a learning experience at all), whereas reading requires active translation of words to concepts. So if a kid watches too much TV, they can develop passive learning habits and don't have great reading/learning skills in general.

*Napping changes:* Abby has always been a frequent napper and has always had decently long naps. She stays awake for 1-2 hours before being ready for a nap, then she sleeps 45 min-1.5 hrs. But in the last week, she's been pushing it to 2-3 hrs between naps and only sleeping for 30 min at a time!!! And getting her down for the nap has never been harder--we have to bounce her on the exercise ball for a looooong time. Sometimes it takes 2 or 3 times before we can put her down & she'll stay asleep. Also, she was never a "colicky" baby but in the last week, she's been fussy from early evening to 11 pm, and it's super hard to get her down to a nap during that time and also very hard to get her to go to sleep for the night.

*What could be causing this?!?* Possibilities I can think of:

Teeth? She has 2 bottom teeth already, so maybe more are on the way? I can't feel anything poking thru yet, and I don't see any bulges like I did with the 2 bottom.
Solid foods? We started giving her a little avocado every morning starting Tuesday, along with some water. The napping/fussiness issues started Tuesday night. (btw, we're not *boiling the water*...is that bad?)
Fighting illness? DH was sick with a bad cold on Wednesday and Thursday, then I've been sick Friday and today. She was a little snotty/sneezy last night and tossing/turning all night, but no more snotty/sneezy today. So maybe she's going to be in the clear?







:
She fell on her head Sunday night. I know it's unlikely to be related, but it's hard not to let my mind wander in that direction...
Do you guys have any other ideas on what could be causing a napping/fussiness change like this? I'm at a loss.









And I'm sure I don't have to tell you ladies this as a lot of us have been thru times like this, but I really feel like I'm about to reach a breaking point. I'll bounce her for 10-15 min (my back muscles are constantly sore as a result), lay her down, then her eyes will pop open and if I don't pick her up right away, she'll arch her back (new skill) and CRY CRY CRY hard.

Last night, when I was feeling achy and snotty and she was NOT sleeping, I was really not feeling very nice feelings towards her.







I know she's not doing anything on purpose, but it certainly starts to feel like that sometimes.

Okay, sorry for the novel...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
hear such honest accounts of what everyone is trying to do with TV. I just love you ladies.







So for us: We are currently trying not to let Abby look at the TV while we're watching, so she just gets glimpses every once in a while. But it's hard, and we feel guilty for watching the TV and not paying attention to her, so we're trying to cut back. We were watching about 45 min-1 hr of TV every night while we ate dinner, and she would sit in a baby chair facing us. So now we're going to try eating dinner at the table w/no TV. It helps that she can sit in her high chair while we eat, now.

But I had planned on not letting her watch TV (in our house at least) before the age of 2, maybe longer. Maybe that's not reasonable--we'll see. I mean she's 6 months old now, and we're just now starting to adjust our TV watching habits to what we had planned to before she arrived.







We just really don't like the idea of her seeing ads before she can start to understand on some level that their purpose is to manipulate her. Also, I got that book Elizabeth recommended called _Endangered Minds_--it had some interesting things to say about TV, and even recommended delaying/decreasing TV until the child learns how to read, as TV watching can decrease comprehension skills. The book's point was that TV is a passive learning experience (if it's a learning experience at all), whereas reading requires active translation of words to concepts. So if a kid watches too much TV, they can develop passive learning habits and don't have great reading/learning skills in general.

I find that it's so hard to have different expectations for baby than is the personality of our home. Brandon and I don't watch much tv, but we do some. And sometimes I look at my expectations for Fenton, and they're more in line as if we didn't have a tv at all. Same with food. We have a pretty good food repertoire here - my nephew recently told me that we have nothing "fun to eat"







. But we do have a bag of kettle chips always in the house, and I start getting stressed when Fenton requests them. But it seems wacky to not want him to eat something that I keep in the house. So I'm having to approach it backwards, of what is reasonable to have in our family life, and then go from there on helping Fenton to regulate. I guess that's a long way of saying: I dunno









Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Napping changes:* Abby has always been a frequent napper and has always had decently long naps. She stays awake for 1-2 hours before being ready for a nap, then she sleeps 45 min-1.5 hrs. But in the last week, she's been pushing it to 2-3 hrs between naps and only sleeping for 30 min at a time!!! And getting her down for the nap has never been harder--we have to bounce her on the exercise ball for a looooong time. Sometimes it takes 2 or 3 times before we can put her down & she'll stay asleep. Also, she was never a "colicky" baby but in the last week, she's been fussy from early evening to 11 pm, and it's super hard to get her down to a nap during that time and also very hard to get her to go to sleep for the night.

*What could be causing this?!?* Possibilities I can think of:

Teeth? She has 2 bottom teeth already, so maybe more are on the way? I can't feel anything poking thru yet, and I don't see any bulges like I did with the 2 bottom.
Solid foods? We started giving her a little avocado every morning starting Tuesday, along with some water. The napping/fussiness issues started Tuesday night. (btw, we're not *boiling the water*...is that bad?)
Fighting illness? DH was sick with a bad cold on Wednesday and Thursday, then I've been sick Friday and today. She was a little snotty/sneezy last night and tossing/turning all night, but no more snotty/sneezy today. So maybe she's going to be in the clear?







:
She fell on her head Sunday night. I know it's unlikely to be related, but it's hard not to let my mind wander in that direction...
Do you guys have any other ideas on what could be causing a napping/fussiness change like this? I'm at a loss.









And I'm sure I don't have to tell you ladies this as a lot of us have been thru times like this, but I really feel like I'm about to reach a breaking point. I'll bounce her for 10-15 min (my back muscles are constantly sore as a result), lay her down, then her eyes will pop open and if I don't pick her up right away, she'll arch her back (new skill) and CRY CRY CRY hard.

Last night, when I was feeling achy and snotty and she was NOT sleeping, I was really not feeling very nice feelings towards her.







I know she's not doing anything on purpose, but it certainly starts to feel like that sometimes.

Okay, sorry for the novel...

I'm thinking teeth, and that wild card of it just might hurt to grow that fast. I wish I didn't understand so incredibly thoroughly what you mean about the breaking point. This is a hard _hard_ job. I forget that a lot, because it seems like anything that so many people do can't be _that_ hard. I had a little connipiton fit last night because I was so sick of nursing Fenton to sleep for the umpteenth time. Brandon's trick is that he keeps near the changing table a picture of him holding Fenton when he was just 30 seconds old. He also says that when he's about to lose it, he stops and looks into Fenton's face. It helps to remind him that he's a person, worthy of empathy. I wish I had a trick. Usually I can empathize with what he's feeling, but often I can't get past my own selfishness, which is understandable. I haven't had a full nights sleep in 17 months. So all that to say...... Come sit in my treehouse







. But I really do believe that if you do the best you can (_really_ the best you can) in any moment, you can forgive yourself a lot because you feel confident that you have always done your absolute best. All of these rules we come up with for what is best for kids are pretty irrelevent when your child sees that you were a constantly-striving parent.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Developing a sleep plan on Pantley's advice in NCSS for Toddlers. Will report back, it has been wonderfully helpful in clarifying what to work on.

wow i am so glad! i had been feeling much guilt for recommending it without reading it first but i went out on a limb because my LC recommended it and I really like her, I know she coslept, etc.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
even recommended delaying/decreasing TV until the child learns how to read, as TV watching can decrease comprehension skills. The book's point was that TV is a passive learning experience (if it's a learning experience at all), whereas reading requires active translation of words to concepts. So if a kid watches too much TV, they can develop passive learning habits and don't have great reading/learning skills in general.

there is a middle ground here. when dd starts watching tv (age 3?) (more likely onlyl dvds) we intend to use closed captioning. finland has the best literacy rates in the world, and they don't start sch until age 7. but all their tv has cc. i think there might be a relationship. at any rate that's the plan.

also i really like common sense media's website re which specific tv programs, dvds, etc.


----------



## PiePie

kelly, from what i have read she may be having a developmental milestone and that can interfere with sleep. i can't say i noticed that much on this end. however, i have noticed that if something is bothering babe it is likely to bother them worst at night, if that makes sense. you are doing great, keep up the good work.


----------



## PiePie

I am a bit sad tonight. I went to a party held by an old friend of mine. we have been friends since age 5, although not v. good friends for quite a while. certainly not since i've known dh. but like many relationships it has ebbed and flowed. so i left feeling not only neglected and not understood but a huge gulf between me and her on parenting style. the worst was when dd pinched her dog she said to dd, you wouldn't want to be pinched and pinched dd! when dh said to me, "They are just vacuous people" I had to agree that we won't be schlepping out to the suburbs again to see them. i am feeling keenly my lack of girlfriends (esp mama friends) with whom I have contact IRL.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am a bit sad tonight. I went to a party held by an old friend of mine. we have been friends since age 5, although not v. good friends for quite a while. certainly not since i've known dh. but like many relationships it has ebbed and flowed. so i left feeling not only neglected and not understood but a huge gulf between me and her on parenting style. the worst was when dd pinched her dog she said to dd, you wouldn't want to be pinched and pinched dd! when dh said to me, "They are just vacuous people" I had to agree that we won't be schlepping out to the suburbs again to see them. i am feeling keenly my lack of girlfriends (esp mama friends) with whom I have contact IRL.

PiePie








I know that I'll be in the same boat as you. We are the first of our friends to have a baby. Some friends are trying or planning for later and others are vehemently (and sometimes offensively) childless by choice. Our best friends, who live one minute away, and we used to see multiple times per week, have completely disappeared on us since I've been pregnant and it makes me very sad. We have not changed, nor have we gone baby ga-ga. We still have adult conversations and do adult things but apparently all they see us as now are parents with screaming kids who impinge on their nice little middle class lifestyle. The sad thing is that we feared this would happen and approached them about it but they assured us that they'd be thrilled to be 'favourite aunts' and super involved. It makes me sad, but it also makes me really angry.
















I'm excited that we're going to see David Sedaris tonight...with our donor and his girlie. Now they are deeply loyal and committed friends who will never abandon us but with whom we have little in common...except for an eternal biological tie who is currently doing aerobics in my belly!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Shanna (or anyone else)- I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on Biden.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
Shanna (or anyone else)- I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on Biden.

Big disappointment for me. But Wellstone is dead, Kucinich is "unelectable" and my love for Edwards has been taken down a notch by, well, his penis. I'm thrilled it wasn't Hillary, but I never really thought that would happen.

I think my disappointment is pretty irrational - I didn't expect someone so "establishment", but I have to say that despite being a loose canon (and sometimes I heart that), he thinks fast on his feet and manages to make the moral dubiousness of opponent candidates look as ridiculous as it really is. So I'm fully prepared to eat my words.

Still stalking Zoe....


----------



## ~Shanna~

Anyone else feeling like they're suddenly featured in the media a lot as an idiot who doesn't vaccinate? They're sure a Johnny-come-lately on what an irresponsible moron I am.......

Pie Pie, I'm so sorry about the incident with your friend. To everything, a season..... How did you handle the pinching thing with your friend? That must have sent you into orbit.......


----------



## PiePie

pete seeger says dd has a good voice! i took her to hear him this morning at lincoln center -- she went crazy for "this land is your land" and "this little light of mine" (one of "my" songs with her). but she started screaming "gah," which i thought meant, "give me your coke can" (a frequent request) but no, it turned into "guantanamera!" everybody laughed -- she was really loud -- and pete seeger said, "good voice!"









on the pinching thing, i didn't say anything because dd wasn't bothered -- she is a really tough kid with a high pain threshold.


----------



## accountclosed2

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
there is a middle ground here. when dd starts watching tv (age 3?) (more likely onlyl dvds) we intend to use closed captioning. finland has the best literacy rates in the world, and they don't start sch until age 7. but all their tv has cc. i think there might be a relationship. at any rate that's the plan.

also i really like common sense media's website re which specific tv programs, dvds, etc.

I grew up in Sweden, where most of the TV programmes has cc (a lot of English/American TV, reruns, and for the hearing impaired), and also where children started school at 7 (now they either start at 6 or 7). Anyway, when I started school at 7, within a year all but 2 of the children in the class were reading fluently (and those 2 had learning difficulties). Why? Well, not because the teaching is great(it isn't), and I think we learned more English from TV than reading (although all text is good!). I think the main reason is that the majority of children are "ready" for reading by 7-8, brain research indicates that most girls are ready between ages of 5-7, most boys between 7-9. I've taught Y1 in Sweden and New Zealand (age 5 in Y1). Teachers and parents work really hard here in NZ to teach reading, and still a lot of the students struggle in Reading Recovery, an intervention programme and are considered to have reading problems by that young age.

DD slept really well at night already from the beginning (3-4 hour stretches), and a long stretch of 6-8 hours from 2-4 months. Then she started waking at least one more time most nights. By 5 months it was becoming twice more. In the last 10 nights we've had 2 good nights, luckily last night was one of them! The 2 before where terrible. First she won't go to sleep when I try to feed her to sleep (very tired, so it takes 1 1/2 hour. Then she wakes up about 2 hours later, has a feed, but won't go to sleep, and DH walks around with her crying for an hour, then I manage to feed her to sleep. Then she wakes up, early, those 2 nights at 4 or 5 , and will not go back to sleep (until 11.30am on Saturday!). Oh, and she usually only has one daytime sleep, up to 2 1/2 hour, although if she wakes up earlier she won't go back to sleep (sometimes only 1/2 h)

We have started giving her some solids (porridge with banana out of my breakfast bowl). She has no teeth. She is a very happy little girl, except when she gets tired.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Horrible night last night, one of the worst. Finally got to sleep between 5 and 6, after working out a mean plan to nightwean cold-turkey







Feeling more loving, with a plan to get a very dim nightlight so that I can see DSs face in the night if we're having trouble like this. I think it will help me. Went to church this morning and had 2 moms look at me in alarm when they heard about the night we had, saying "Well, my kids slept through the night at 3 months old!" Thanks, that's helpful. One of the moms laughed and said that I needed to "shut the baby monitor off, close the door, and have him sleep in the basement if needed"







: I'm trying to forget that her baby was diagnosed with failure to thrive, because I know that happens for all kinds of reasons. Then, a dearly-loved gentleman at my church was telling me all about his naive DIL who "didn't believe in spanking", and he kept telling her "just you wait". Well, apparently she eventually spanked out of anger and was so happy to see that "it worked!







:" WHAT??!!! YOu mean violence and coercion work?! Well, what the hell am I doing over _here_?????

Wishing I could drown my culture in a bathtub......


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
Shanna (or anyone else)- I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on Biden.

What Shanna said...DH and I also felt that Biden would have made a great Secretary of State rather than VP, but honestly...this isn't bad. Obama isn't my first choice (that would be Kucinich, but I know that the country won't go in that direction, sadly). But the ticket overall seems decent enough.


----------



## PiePie

shanna, interested to hear your new sleep plan.

BIDEN: not disappointed. not thrilled. would have preferred tim kaine but grateful it isn't evan bayh. like shanna, i really didn't expend a lot of energy on the possibility that it would be hillary. now once upon a time they would have been my dream ticket, in either order, but there is too much water under the bridge. i am mixed on biden. otoh, i am pissed that the didn't take anita hill seriously at first and then, once he realized clarence thomas wasn't going down on ideology, he blew off her confidentiality requests. otoh, he was a star (along with wellstone, but he's dead) shooting the violence against women act into being. i think for most people there is something to dislike about him along with something to like. a safe choice, i think.

having a freakin' panic attack about work.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
having a freakin' panic attack about work.

What's going on?


----------



## Maela

Kelly,







s. I definitely have days (or rather moments) where I am SO frustrated and near my breaking point and am not feeling nice. I think it's totally normal. But it does suck. I feel so mean sometimes. I think it does help to look at her face and think of something really cute/funny that she does.

Shanna, sorry about the rough night.







I have heard those comments from people too. So many people saying, "you'll change your mind about spanking once in a while." And TONS of the STTN at a young young age comments. I don't let myself complain about Dd's sleeping anymore to people who I know will say things like that or who just won't understand. GMIL is the worst, but we get a lot of comments from strangers/aquaintances too.

Dh and I have been having a rough time dealing with my mom lately. She is just always telling us what to do or what we're doing wrong with Dd. She doesn't even realize it. I know if I confronted her on it, she would be really hurt.














And I'm not good at confrontations. I'm just working on being very firm and short with my answers. "No, we've decided this." Dh and I decided we're going to work at letting her comments roll off our backs, and we'll have a laugh at the outrageousness of them later when we're alone. I think having a sense of humor about it might work.

I'm going to take a 5 day break from the internet and tv. I just feel like I need it. So I'll be gone for a few days, but thinking about you all. Have a great week everyone!


----------



## accountclosed3

still pregnant here and no problem. i am getting some heavy contractions now and again. by heavy, i mean that they're sustained. the belly gets hard and stays hard for quite a while. then, relaxes and the baby wiggles and wiggles. it all feels so wonderful. i'm really excited about what the birth will bring.

still using the library's computers. the computer fix-it group are a PITA. we took it to them last sunday, they said it wuold be done by thursday "at the latest." didn't hear a peep from them, even though i called on Wed for an update adn 2 times on Thurs. I tried to call again on fri, got nothing (no answer). So, i stop by.

i find out that they hadnt' even started working on it. they said it would be finished Sat afternoon/evening. I thought, great! said they'd call. they didn't.

Sunday, i call, and i find out that they've only started the project and that they can't finish it until "monday at the earliest" and that it should be done "monday night." called today to find out that it "might be done tomorrow."

but what realyl gets me is not the time it's taking, but the lack of customer service at two levels: 1. no communuication in general, and 2. when i call, they give me attitude about having to fix my computer. HELLO! it's your JOB and i PAID UP FRONT. duh.

so, i talked to the manager (again) about it, and while he apologized, i recommended that he actualyl train his people in some people/phone skills.

with any luck, we'll have it back tomorrow and ryan will be able to write again and i'll be able to be online.

also, still waiting on the mattress. was supposed to come last tuesday, right? yeah, it's coming tomorrow (supposedly). they called on tuesday tos ay that they had "more local deliveries" than expected, so i got bumped, but they didn't set a new appt because they'd left a message.

i called twice on wed, thurs, and fri. sat am while teaching yoga, i get a phone message (which i checked at 11) which came in around 9;30. it said "we'll deliver between 12 and 2 TODAY." are you kidding? that's the advance notice that i get?

so, then, they call at abuot 11:30 and apparently their driver was injuired during the morning and they couldnt' deliver. i ask the guy if they can bring it Sun, Mon, but he says he doesn't know what's ont he schedule.

did i mention that i also paid up front for delivery too? bah!

so, the guy says that he'll call back on sunday before "starting otu" and let me know when he can come on mon or tues. well, no call by 11 and so i call him. he says he can come on tuesday, but doesn't know when because he's already "out" and not looking at the schedule.

fine, but i better get my bed on tuesday! LOL

my parents did come for the day on saturday and it was a good time. we hung new curtains in the house and also took care of little fix-it projects that ryan and i couldn't do (no tools). that was helpful.

ryan asked his dad to come and help, but he refused because he was 'too busy' again, and ryan pointed out that this is another example of how they claim to want to help, but then never actuall do help when we need it, and then complain that we never allow or ask them forh elp, and then discove4r that my parents come toh elp. . .and well, the circle.

they said that we have to plan these things better. i figure that asking about a month in advance is enough, byut apparently not.

oh, and everyone is freaked about UCing now. well, not ryan and i. my mom/dad were under some illusion that i have a midwife. i told my mom that i know a midwife, and she's willing to come over if i want her and then charge later. i did NOT tell them that i was calling her, but that i could. mom took this to mean that iw as calling her, this made everyone feel better.

and i never corrected her of that notion, because i knew the illusion made her feelb etter and it didnt' hurt me either way anyway. then, ryan told my dad what ther eality was, and dad got very upset.

now, i told everyone about UC, but seriously. . ..

any other dramas? no, not really.

we have TV issues too--funny.

and i love Pete Seeger and we're looking to start a 'family singing gruop' based around his music and other folk music. it's jsut finding the folks for it.









oh, and finally, i decided that this would be my last week of work. if the baby doesn't come this week (i think it will be next week), then i'll work this week and start by taking next week off. makes sense to me anyway.









i thinkt hat i could use the rest, and my friend patti is going to help me laze arond and do some cooking and what not next week.

all in all, it's going well. but i do look forward to having my nternet at home, because at the library, you have tos tand. STAND.

i asked for a stool, and they said no. NO! can you believe it? it old them i was due any minute and it didnt' matter at all. LOL!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
still pregnant here and no problem. i am getting some heavy contractions now and again. by heavy, i mean that they're sustained. the belly gets hard and stays hard for quite a while. then, relaxes and the baby wiggles and wiggles. it all feels so wonderful. i'm really excited about what the birth will bring.


I was wondering about you







I remember those kind of contractions--they were definitely fascinating and exciting.

The first few hours of pre-labor (I'm not sure what to call it--we refer to that day as when Rhea basically said "fooled you!") were very regular, made me pay attention, and were vaguely sexual in sensation. But yeah, they were also sustained in a good way. I'm excited to see what your experience will bring!

And it seems some people need to be smacked...a 9 month pregnant lady standing at a computer...are they whacked?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
are they whacked?

yes. the whole world is.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Sleepless Moms:* I'm thinking of you. I'm feeling pretty sleep deprived myself and am really freaking out at the thought that this is nothing compared to what I'm about to embark upon...









*Zoebird:* Sounds like you're doing really well. And it's gonna be a Virgo baby for you!

*PiePie:* How's work? Just really busy or something else more sinister?

I know everyone does this to this group ... but now it's my turn ...
What great regime have you all come up with for nappies (diapers)? We're thinking prefolds with wool covers for newborn nights and just regular prefolds and PUL covers for days. And once Squeak is big enough we will probably switch to one-sized bamboo fitteds with wool covers for nights and continue with regular prefolds for days. I'd also like to have a few AIO's for going out but they're not in our current budget.

What do you all think? I think we're getting a 36 pack of prefolds. How many fitteds and wool covers do you think is a realistic minimum for what we want to do? Have I got the equation generally right? He's a summer babe.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I'm feeling pretty sleep deprived myself and am really freaking out at the thought that this is nothing compared to what I'm about to embark upon...








*PiePie:* How's work? Just really busy or something else more sinister?

on the cloth diapers, my view is that you can never have too many COVERS. the actual prefolds never/rarely ran out, but woe unto you if you don't have a clean cover on hand.

i honestly feel that pregnancy/birth/babyhood brings you what you can take. i had an abominable pregnancy, a challenging but ultimately empowering birth, and a blissful newborn period. so on my theory at least mujer you are working out all your kinks now and then everything will be easy peasy.

i have like the hugest trial of my life next week, i am woefully underprepared -- as in it is physically impossible for me to get prepared -- and in truth i am massively distracted by all the transitions in dd's life. the walking, first birthday, and impending transition to daycare (from nanny) all feel like huge milestones in MY life. this afternoon/tonight was sch orientation and she did grand -- shrieked in ecstasy whenever a new kid came in and toddled over ot hug (and in one case tackle) him, kissed tghe teachers goodbye, etc. they (the 3 teachers) were fighting over whose she was (hello, she's MINE







)-- she is clearly all 3 teachers' favorite. i am somewhat optimistic about finding mama friends through daycare. i have my eye on this lesbian couple who are still nursing their 15 mo ds, although i didn't like when she said dd's name was "screamer" in reference to her joyous squeals. there is another family i can't see clicking with -- their clothes are obscenely expensive (really, who wears a little black dress to a presch orientation? and ginormous diamonds?) and they have a full-time nanny for a sahm. dh thinks i am wrong ot make snap judgments and who knows maybe tghis kid will be dd's best friend. i am slightly disappointed that there are younger kids in the class -- it is obvious that she is drawn to older children. so basically it sucks that work and dd's transitions are colliding and i am sticking to my guns by prioritizing her in terms of time allocation but then i have guilt and anxiety over shortchanging work. in my heart of hearts, i think the judge is going to decide this based on whether he buys into stereotypes about poor people and no amount of lawyering labor is going to change his mind (whatever that is) but the do things by the book good girl in me thinks i should give this case my all. it could possibly be career making, yet here i am on mdc.







love you guys.


----------



## PiePie

oh, started out with 2 covers = disaster. can't remember if we upped it to 4 or 6.


----------



## katt

DOn't have a lot of time, but I wanted to share with you all that I finally started an ETSY account: http://www.photokatdotnet.etsy.com


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I know everyone does this to this group ... but now it's my turn ...
What great regime have you all come up with for nappies (diapers)? We're thinking prefolds with wool covers for newborn nights and just regular prefolds and PUL covers for days. And once Squeak is big enough we will probably switch to one-sized bamboo fitteds with wool covers for nights and continue with regular prefolds for days. I'd also like to have a few AIO's for going out but they're not in our current budget.

What do you all think? I think we're getting a 36 pack of prefolds. How many fitteds and wool covers do you think is a realistic minimum for what we want to do? Have I got the equation generally right? He's a summer babe.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
on the cloth diapers, my view is that you can never have too many COVERS. the actual prefolds never/rarely ran out, but woe unto you if you don't have a clean cover on hand.

I have to agree with Pie Pie, I needed so many more covers than I thought - Fenton pooped out of the dipe nearly every time, plus the woolies take a)initiative to get hand-washed and b)time to air-dry. We had 2 fleece and 1 wool cover for night, and usually this was enough, but I think there were a few times where I could have used a 4th night cover. I found we went through about 12 dipes a day when F was newborn, and that included doubling it up at night and not changing it for 8-12 hours when we slept. Back when we did that







. How often do you want to do laundry? Depending on squeek's wetness, you may find you can get away without changing a dipe at night. If he stays in one all night, I'd say just 1 fited per night, plus 2-3 extras per laundry run to smooth out lagging laundry. I don't think I know anyone who changed dipes in the night, unless of severe dipe rash. Most mamas I know just keep stuffing until they can get away without changing in the night.

Did that answer your question? I found dipe preparation to be maddening because it's so vast and complicated and even if it weren't, it's impossible to guess what kind of eliminator your LO will be. How many pul are you getting? I always seemed to be one short, no matter how many I had....

And while i hate to throw a new variable in your well-oiled machine, I simply must add that I LOVE bumgenius pockets, and wish I had known about this from the start. Same cost and benefit to AIO, but they dry faster and allow you to customize absorbancy. Only con is that you do have to stuff them, which probably takes less time than the extry drying time on the AIO.

And I have to echo Pie Pie on how you're probably getting your challenges out now. I had a blissful pregnancy and birth, hellish nursing, and sleep started out perfect and has declined since then (around the time nursing stopped it's blinding pain). It won't all get thrown at you at once







.

Katt, congrats on the Etsy account! That's such a great site.....

Awful night last night, we seem to be running one bad/one good. Napping like a dream. I should be sleeping.









Zoewatch.......


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Oh boy...we're on page 2! BUMP

Thanks *Shanna & PiePie* for the nappy recs. I'd really like to try a BumGenius but they're not avail in Australia. That is to say, lots of online business' claim to stock them but none of them ever have them in stock. Covers covers covers. I hear you. My mum has just bought a couple of metres of PUL and is going to try her hand at making them so hopefully we'll be all good.
This nappy thing is soooooo confusing. I've spent months trying to wrap my head around it. DP only really scratched the surface for the first time last night and she was sitting there saying 'oh boy, i get it now. this nappy business is serious stuff!'

Thanks also for the words about difficult pregnancy vs challenging babe. I hope you're right. I don't feel like my pregnancy has been terrible but it's WAY harder than I expected and I'm certainly looking forward to having this little wiggler earthside. I can't believe that I'm merely weeks from the 3rd trimester. How did that happen??

*Zoebird* - I think you're having a September babe too. Sending you love









*PiePie* - Sounds like you're being practical and realistic. You know in your heart that you're making the best choices for you and DD. Career opportunities are great and all, but at the end of the day it's just work. Of course, it's really important work but you're not a good worker when you're sacrificing yourself and your family. You have your priorities right. Keep believing that and look after yourself. I'll be thinking of you over the next week.









*Sleepless Mums:* sending you and your babes all the sleep vibes I can muster.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Better sleep last night. I bit the bullet and started writing down how often Fenton was waking, so I can see trends. He woke once around 2, and again around 6!







:

MMM, if you decide to go with BG, I would be happy to order and ship it to you.


----------



## accountclosed3

just finished my massage!

still standing at the library, but i do get to pick up the computer this afternoon. then, we have to get the internet hooked up again and what not, and then we'll be good to go.

got the mattress today too. it's nice. of course, they forgot to include the mattress protector (mattress pad), and so they said they'd ship it. i told them i wanted it on friday at the latest, and they are paying for shipping. their error, and i have already paid $258 for the thing AND waited over a week for it all.

otherwise, the house is finished. i do have an appointment to talk to another cleaning person on friday. i hope she'll be less expensive, but we'll see.

that's all around here. very few contrations really, but a lot of baby miovement.

oh, and we're having trouble figuring out how to put the car seat in. could they make the instructions more confusing?


----------



## TinyFrog

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
<snip> I can't believe that I'm merely weeks from the 3rd trimester. How did that happen?? <snip>

Oh my goodnes, that went FAST MMM!







:

Yeah for more sleep Shanna







:

ZB - glad to hear there will be no more standing for the computer. My goodness, that's just ridiculous!







: on having your mattress. I think you can take the car seat to the police station and they will help you install it.

Thank you everyone for sharing your lives and stories here.







I really appreciate all of your insight.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Then, a dearly-loved gentleman at my church was telling me all about his naive DIL who "didn't believe in spanking", and he kept telling her "just you wait". Well, apparently she eventually spanked out of anger and was so happy to see that "it worked!







:" WHAT??!!! YOu mean violence and coercion work?! Well, what the hell am I doing over _here_?????

Wishing I could drown my culture in a bathtub......









I'm there with you, Shanna. This weekend, BIL and his girlfriend were making snide comments about a friend who doesn't spank her dd and I'm at a loss of how I'll respond when those type of comments start to be directed at me/my child.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I'm going to take a 5 day break from the internet and tv. I just feel like I need it. So I'll be gone for a few days, but thinking about you all. Have a great week everyone!

Hope you have a peaceful break! I just finished a 4-day internet break of my own and catching up isn't as horrible as I imagine in the middle of day 2, but is still quite a task.

Things have been crazier than usual here. Spent Sat night and Sun morning at the hospital. My 17yo brother attempted suicide and was in the ped ICU. We are still in the thick of packing/moving and not feeling any closer to being ready to make the big move any time soon, though our lease is up in 2 weeks.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 







I'm there with you, Shanna. This weekend, BIL and his girlfriend were making snide comments about a friend who doesn't spank her dd and I'm at a loss of how I'll respond when those type of comments start to be directed at me/my child.

The happy thing is that they won't direct them at you or Calvin - they'll just talk about it behind your back. Which I actually think is better









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Things have been crazier than usual here. Spent Sat night and Sun morning at the hospital. My 17yo brother attempted suicide and was in the ped ICU..

Steph, I'm so sorry. I don't know what else to say.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I think my menstrual cycle might be coming back. I have to keep napkins in the car because of CM - sorry for TMI (really), but I wish someone had warned me about this, so I thought I'd warn someone else. It's just.....wow.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Steph:*







- so sorry to hear about your bro. I hope he's finding the care and help he needs.
Good luck with the packing and organising. Moving, they say, is one of the top stressors in life. Take care.
*
Shanna:* O/T but was excited to see you're a lover of Marilynne Robinson (via facebook). I couldn't really get into Gilead but Housekeeping is in my top 3 fave books ever!

Thanks too for the generous BG offer. I'll keep it in mind and see where the finances take us!


----------



## cking

I wrote a super long post last night and the computer ate it and then dd woke up! I promise to come back soon.

let's see if I can recap-

Josephine is getting two teeth! The second bottom tooth broke through the gums on Sunday. Dh finally realized there was a tooth last week and said "wow, it feels like there's a piece of glass in her gums."









in response to other's posts - she has also been crying out in her sleep - right now i think it's teething pain, but she's been doing it since she was very young. She also laughs in her sleep sometimes, so I do think it's dreaming.

be back


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Page 2 again!

A question for all you Mama's...Have you felt that your relationship with your DP has been jeopardised or negatively changed since the birth of your DC? I ask because it's probably the biggest worry I have about becoming a Mama. DP and I have had 7 very happy years together with never more than a minor tantrum/argument and only very rarely. I'd be so sad to cave under the pressure of new parenthood.


----------



## accountclosed3

i think that problems from before become pronounced after. so, i don't anticipate any real problems here.









our relationship has changed. ryan talked with me about how he feels very 'number 2' in my life, but also understands why. he used to be number 1, and of course when october j was dying, he was number 1, but that was temporary.

he just finished reading the continuum concept, and he totally gets how babies become number one, and also how our relationship has to adapt as well. he also read another article somewhere about when fathers really come to the fore in the child-parent relationships, which helped him a great deal.

he is involved, excited, etc--but he has to 'take care of' more things for himself than before. for example, i used to have way more patience for his whining, his piles of mess (clutter) and what not. he used to be able to really vent to me about anything ad infinitum until it was worked out.

not so anymore. i ahve other things on my mind/plate, and so he has to take care of a lot of that on his own. he's found this difficult, and he's found me "cold" because of it, but he's also understanding that my focus is on the baby and preparing for it, so i don't have a lot of physical or emotional energy to manage stuff that, technically, he should be ablet o manage on his own (and can and does, it's just that, before, he'd rely on me for "help").

so, we're finding balance. it's just new.

----

oh, and i'm on my friend's computer. guess what? my computer STILL isn't done and they didn't call me to let me know. i was completely ticked about it, and about their attitude. i've called to talk to corporate about it, as well as complained to the manager on site.

it's such a PITA.


----------



## witchygrrl

Our relationship has changed a bit too, but in an enriching way. DH holds DD and asks her all the time how we lived before she arrived. It's very sweet. It's just one more thing we have in common--that we have this beatiful child together.

Of course, it also helps that DH was able to find work. He says that I'm smiling again.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Zoe, I'd be raising holy hell! Don't mess with a ready to give birth mother!


----------



## PiePie

*steph*, that is so sad about your brother. your family must be under incredible stress right now. there are mh issues in my family too but that is more than i can imagine.

*mujerista*, yes things have changed, but almost 100% for the better. dh is a much more enamored dad than i would have thought possible. to be honest, i feel like i am #2 to dd to him (although he swears otherwise). the only "negative" -- or shall i say, things i want to work on -- changes have been that we don't have really any us time. our sex life is pretty inactive. part of that was my own fears/pain after the birth, part of it was the touched out feeling from nursing and babywearing and cosleeping (that was a relatively small factor, although i thought it would be bigger), a lot of it was that he was working way too hard for some period of time, and a lot of it was that we weren't laying the predicate romance because there was no alone time. so we went on a date on dd's first birthday. 1 date in 12 mos. that's it. my goal is to double that in the upcoming year. other impediments to sex: cosleeping, my falling asleep with dd sometimes when i nurse her down because the hormones are so strong, and of course the need for sleep. honestly i think if we unplugged from the net we might do better in the evenings after she is in bed. also getting the crib set up 10 mos. after the birth means that i can in theory put her down there for naps to give ourselves space.


----------



## PiePie

very rough day for me. left for work super early when dd was still asleep and when i came home somewhat late well before bedtime she was already down. and the judge told us that he wants us on trial till midnight next thursday. ua violation.


----------



## snozzberry

Baby who's still not napping well, so I didn't have time to read thru all the posts.







But I did see all the advice/support for me, and I truly appreciate that, mamas.

*Steph*, I saw your post about your brother.







I'm so sorry.

I really, really need to get some sleep, but just wanted to say one last thing...

*OBAMA ROCKS!!!*

Did anyone else watch the speech tonight?!?


----------



## PiePie

loved the speech.

does anyone know why "good" nights are sometimes followed by "bad" nights? the night before last, dd woke only once to nurse (i stuck my boob in her mouth for a second session...) then last night she was up for 2 hours squirming and more awake than usual for a nurse. it sucked. i think it's because she didn't see me at all during the day -- her nursing sessions were more than triple their usual length, too -- that she was using nighttime to reconnect.

of course now work is blowing up.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

We're back!

*zoebird*...can't wait to hear some news.

Had a hellish weekend - put my hip out and it got so bad I couldn't walk. Thanks to my osteopath, I'm mobile again but it's gonna take a while before I can walk properly. And, thanks to supple pregnancy joints and hormones, the midwife suspects it's going to keep happening. Oh the joy.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, glad you're on your feet again. pregnancy sucks but you get good and valuable rewards as soon as it's over!







guaranteed...


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
We're back!

*zoebird*...can't wait to hear some news.









:

Might want to head to Ryan's blog... http://holyembersofdreams.blogspot.com/








:


----------



## witchygrrl

I had a feeling Zoe's baby was here, but I couldn't place when...hooray!!! Happy birthday Hawk!!! And congrats to Jenifer and Ryan!







:







:







:


----------



## cking

Woohoo! Welcome baby Hawk!







:







:

Congratulations Jenifer and Ryan!

thanks for the update TJ.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Woohoo! Welcome baby Hawk!







:







:

Congratulations Jenifer and Ryan!

thanks for the update TJ.

Yay!

Welcome Hawk!!!! Congrats ZB & Ryan!!!!

What a cool name! I love it.


----------



## PiePie

wow! you did it! great photos with your ds. the pics of you at 36 vs. 38 weeks show a striking difference. can't wait to hear your story in your own words.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

:







Welcome Hawk














:
& congratulations Jenifer and Ryan.








I can't wait to hear all about the birth.


----------



## witchygrrl

DD is such a hungry girl. I feel like she is nursing ALL of the time...but it paid off. She weighed 8 lb 12 oz yesterday...a weight gain of 1 pb 10 oz in 2 weeks. Doc's not worried anymore







But man, would I like a rest!

Off to reserach delayed vaxes more..doc wants to start on her on them, and I'd rather wait on most, if not all of them until she's 2.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Welcome Baby Hawk!!!!!!!!!!







:







:







:







:







:







:







:







:







:







:


----------



## accountclosed3

thanks all!

we're napping in shifts, nursing is a bit of a struggle but we're getting there. hawk is eager, and when the "service" is slow, he is quick to lodge a complaint to management.

he was quite certain that this establishment catered to babies, but now he's not so sure!

right now, we try the breast, scream for 5 minutes, then i give him pumped milk with a dropper (about 3/4-1 oz), and then a bit of water (dr's orders on that one--when did i ever listen? anyway, it makes sense for the now), and then i try to pump and oz or more--whatever i can to create a reserve for the next feeding.

we have a small tube now, and surenge (sp?), to attach to the nipple and see if it will help him make the connection. we've only had one good nursing session--yesterday--but we have hope.

the LLL ladies are really greatl; the leader called today after we were at yesterday's meeting. that was really great.

night time isn't bad either. i'll need to learn some different ways of nrusing (not just sitting up), but we'll get there.

so that's us. not a lot of time here. having a snack before pumping, so i'll probably be reading and pumping while hawk and dad nap!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
thanks all!

we're napping in shifts, nursing is a bit of a struggle but we're getting there. hawk is eager, and when the "service" is slow, he is quick to lodge a complaint to management.

he was quite certain that this establishment catered to babies, but now he's not so sure!

right now, we try the breast, scream for 5 minutes, then i give him pumped milk with a dropper (about 3/4-1 oz), and then a bit of water (dr's orders on that one--when did i ever listen? anyway, it makes sense for the now), and then i try to pump and oz or more--whatever i can to create a reserve for the next feeding.

we have a small tube now, and surenge (sp?), to attach to the nipple and see if it will help him make the connection. we've only had one good nursing session--yesterday--but we have hope.

the LLL ladies are really greatl; the leader called today after we were at yesterday's meeting. that was really great.

night time isn't bad either. i'll need to learn some different ways of nrusing (not just sitting up), but we'll get there.

so that's us. not a lot of time here. having a snack before pumping, so i'll probably be reading and pumping while hawk and dad nap!

Hang in there Zoe







Nursing was so hard for us, but once we got it, I was so glad i hung in there. We did finger feeding too.

By the way: He's gorgeous


----------



## ~Shanna~

Dear God, I am in nesting mode for the next baby already.

It has something to do with:
-Planting season is over and I need to stockpile my seeds, and figure out what I need to order this winter. And that is a function of how much food I need 1 1/2 years from now
-Putting up food with this harvest, trying to figure out what to can, freeze, etc.
-Which leads me to fantasize constantly about how I'll stock my freezer for the next one, and plan to have a mothers helper for the next one
-Numerous newborns in my life (thanks Zoe














plus my sister is TTC
-We're getting a bigger bed this week, and I'm worried about having spent so much money and it still doesn't solve the issue of how to co-sleep with 2
-Feeling crampy and eggwhitey, with no af in sight...
-Change in academic plans for DH means the world won't end if we get pregnant before January
-I finally saw some action this weekend!









And I have a suspicion that there is an irrational thought process going on here, that if I have another one, DS can't still be so demanding. Which is ridiculous.......

Sooooo......anyone know of traditional food meals that freeze well???


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Sooooo......anyone know of traditional food meals that freeze well???










KerryAnn used to have a yahoo group on batch cooking (cooking a lot and freezing). She would be one to PM.

Also, I've made spaghetti, frozen pizzas, chicken and rice, taco pie, and a few other things for the boyfriend's freezer when he moved into a new apartment. I mostly TF'ed everything.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
thanks all!

we're napping in shifts, nursing is a bit of a struggle but we're getting there. hawk is eager, and when the "service" is slow, he is quick to lodge a complaint to management.

he was quite certain that this establishment catered to babies, but now he's not so sure!

right now, we try the breast, scream for 5 minutes, then i give him pumped milk with a dropper (about 3/4-1 oz), and then a bit of water (dr's orders on that one--when did i ever listen? anyway, it makes sense for the now), and then i try to pump and oz or more--whatever i can to create a reserve for the next feeding.

we have a small tube now, and surenge (sp?), to attach to the nipple and see if it will help him make the connection. we've only had one good nursing session--yesterday--but we have hope.

the LLL ladies are really greatl; the leader called today after we were at yesterday's meeting. that was really great.

night time isn't bad either. i'll need to learn some different ways of nrusing (not just sitting up), but we'll get there.

so that's us. not a lot of time here. having a snack before pumping, so i'll probably be reading and pumping while hawk and dad nap!


It'll happen, Zoe. Keep up the good work! It wasn't easy for us either, but we got the hang of it!

Can't wait to hear about you and Hawk.


----------



## Sihaya

Zoe, please let me know if you are in need of a Lact-aid system. I have four of them just lying around now that DS is back on the boob full time. I would be happy to sterilize one and mail it to you, overnight if necessary. Please let me know.


----------



## Maela

*ZB*, I'm so excited for you! Glad to hear the LLL ladies are giving you good support. I'm sure things will improve. Your baby is so beautiful.

I have been thinking a lot about the next pg too. We're still 10-11 months away from TTC, but it's been on my mind a lot lately. I find myself planning how I'm going to handle pg if I'm really nauseaus (sp?) again with a 2 yo. And how I'm going to eat better. And how I'm going to get in some exercise with a 2yo. And still cook homemade healthy dinners (like I've been doing for a month now!







to me!). And how we'll arrange Dd's room to accomodate new baby's stuff. And how if I want to find out gender. And if I want to announce the pg before i'm in the 2nd trimester. How we're going to save money for another homebirth. And on and on... I've always been a big planner, so this makes sense. I'm not really dreading it all, just anxious. I really want the next birth to go better than the last one did (although I must admit until the pushing it was a pretty good labor). And I really want to be calmer and more relaxed during this next pg and newborn period. So I've just really been working on preparing myself mentally. I've got a lot of physical and mental work to do in the next year and a half before the next baby comes.

So, I guess I'm just saying, *Shanna,* that I think I know what you're going through.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
KerryAnn used to have a yahoo group on batch cooking (cooking a lot and freezing). She would be one to PM.

Oh, great idea! I have her site bookmarked around here somewhere.....

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I have been thinking a lot about the next pg too. We're still 10-11 months away from TTC, but it's been on my mind a lot lately. I find myself planning how I'm going to handle pg if I'm really nauseaus (sp?) again with a 2 yo. And how I'm going to eat better. And how I'm going to get in some exercise with a 2yo. And still cook homemade healthy dinners (like I've been doing for a month now!







to me!). And how we'll arrange Dd's room to accomodate new baby's stuff. And how if I want to find out gender. And if I want to announce the pg before i'm in the 2nd trimester. How we're going to save money for another homebirth. And on and on... I've always been a big planner, so this makes sense. I'm not really dreading it all, just anxious. I really want the next birth to go better than the last one did (although I must admit until the pushing it was a pretty good labor). And I really want to be calmer and more relaxed during this next pg and newborn period. So I've just really been working on preparing myself mentally. I've got a lot of physical and mental work to do in the next year and a half before the next baby comes.

So, I guess I'm just saying, *Shanna,* that I think I know what you're going through.









It feels a little insane, when on most days I don't feel like I can handle what I have. Partly, these types of planning dilemmas are just what I love to think about when I can't sleep. But it's becoming a little obsessive.


----------



## snozzberry

*zoebird*, congratulations!!!







:







:







:

Hang in there with the nursing. It sounds like you have some great support, though, which is great.

Hawk is beautiful! When do we get more pictures?























*Shanna & Maela,* you're making me start to sort of maybe think that one day I might could possibly entertain the idea of having another one. I LOVE planning and when I can't sleep, I lay in bed trying to think of something to plan for. It's calming for me.









But then again, the idea of taking care of a toddler while feeling nauseous...not so appealing.









So I will for now live vicariously thru your exciting planning and talking about planning.









Gotta run, need to get to bed before Abby wakes up to feed again...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Y'know *Shanna & Maela*,
The strangest thing has happened to us in the last 2 weeks. With 14 weeks (give or take) until the first is born, we're putting serious thought into our second. And we think we might do it sooner, rather than later. Might even start TTC when Squeak turns 1.

Of course, I'm still not 100% convinced that it's a smart idea to _ever_ have a 2nd child, but if we did it does make sense in terms of my career and further study aspirations to have them close together and study part time while they're young.

I can't wait for the second wave of grad babes to be conceived!







:

*zoebird* - I dreamt of Hawk last night. He was truly beautiful and it made me very excited about the impending arrival of my little boy. Can't wait to hear more about him and you. Good luck with the breastfeeding challenges


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* everything gets way easier once the breastauarant is fully stocked. trust me. we learned to nurse lying down at 6 w; my LC said not to expect it till 2 m. but then it gets way easier.


----------



## Sihaya

*Next baby* - I think I've shared this here more than I probably should, but I've been thinking about, dreaming of, and planning for our second since about a week before DS was born. The week after his birth, DH and I were considering and discussing whether we wanted to UC next time. I am really looking forward to being pregnant again. I loved it and miss it and want to do it as often as possible!

All that said, I know me and I don't think I could handle children closer together than ~3 years, so the countdown is t minus 20 months until we'll be TTC #2. Fortunately, it looks like I may be able to live vicariously through some of the other NMY Grads between now and then









*Side-lying nursing* - I agree with PiePie -this definitely made things so much better/easier. We were able to do it at ~3 weeks IIRC.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*z.b.,* everything gets way easier once the breastauarant is fully stocked. trust me. we learned to nurse lying down at 6 w; my LC said not to expect it till 2 m. but then it gets way easier.

i agree. we were able to do it early on (on the left side at least) but J didn't really seem to appreciate it until a little later. THen around 3 months, that's _all_ she wanted to do. Now she's finally 'requesting' to nurse in my lap occasionally.

hang in there ZB!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

So I will for now live vicariously thru your exciting planning and talking about planning.










me too. i have more to say about this, but for now that's all i can get out.


----------



## snozzberry

Abby actually slept thru the trash trucks coming down our street this morning, which is a first. Woot!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
But then again, the idea of taking care of a toddler while feeling nauseous...not so appealing.









So re-reading my post after a night's sleep makes me realize this may not seem like the most supportive statement for our mamas who are thinking about TTCing soon. I'm sorry if it came across that way--I was just trying to express where I am in my journey to another pregnancy.

*MMM,* you're getting so close!!!!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*Next baby* - I think I've shared this here more than I probably should, but I've been thinking about, dreaming of, and planning for our second since about a week before Calvin was born. The week after his birth, DH and I were considering and discussing whether we wanted to UC next time. I am really looking forward to being pregnant again. I loved it and miss it and want to do it as often as possible!

I totally get that. I had an easy pregnancy and loved the feeling of growing a HUMAN! Made me feel powerful.









Oh dang, Abby's up...


----------



## accountclosed3

thanks all. i know that it is coming together. things take time.

got good rest last night, too. sure, we were up every two hours no question, but slept well in between. so far, i feel that it is all going well.









and, i can hardley describe how much i love this guy!


----------



## witchygrrl

We can do side-lying, but not football. But I feel like side-lying works better for comfort than nutrition...my boob always feels so squished. But yeah, zoe, I agree with PiePie. Once fully stocked, it will get MUCH easier.

In other news, I think I had a real smile from Rhea this morning. I'll try to capture a pic of the next one.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
So re-reading my post after a night's sleep makes me realize this may not seem like the most supportive statement for our mamas who are thinking about TTCing soon. I'm sorry if it came across that way--I was just trying to express where I am in my journey to another pregnancy.

No, I agree with you; that's one of the things I've been worrying about. I remember saying during my first trimester, "How in the world do people do this with a toddler to take care of?!" I could barely take care of myself, and I couldn't take care of the house. But I'm sure we'll figure it out. We live closer to the gparents now and closer to Dh's work. My MIL is only working three days a week now, so I think I'm going to take advantage of her offer to come spend time with DD a couple of times a week when I'm really sick.








:







:







:







:







: <------ Maev loves this little guy. This is for her.


----------



## Maela

I would love to have our kids closer if it weren't for the fact that I didn't really enjoy pg all that much and, like Sihaya, can't really imagine myself being able to handle them being close. I get kind of stressed easily.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
We can do side-lying, but not football. But I feel like side-lying works better for comfort than nutrition...my boob always feels so squished. But yeah, zoe, I agree with PiePie. Once fully stocked, it will get MUCH easier.

In other news, I think I had a real smile from Rhea this morning. I'll try to capture a pic of the next one.

Posting on the run, but thought I'd share - I love side-lying while nursing, but only after I discovered this trick: Lie on my side, and then roll to a halfway-between-my-back-and-my side position. It's like you're lying more at a 45 degree angle. If you prop yourself up with pillows under your back and butt, you can get really comfy this way. They DC can nurse off bottom breast without it being squished. Does this make any sense?


----------



## witchygrrl

nak

Makes sense, Shanna...I'll give it a whirl!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm the last person to give Palin a thumbs-up, but.....

Have you seen this?

I would LOVE to see a politician campaign while babywearing. I would HATE for it to be someone I wouldn't vote for







!


----------



## witchygrrl

Ok, that's the first positive thing I've seen Palin do. Otherwise, she makes me want to uke

I'm insulted that the McCain campaign would hope I would vote for her because we're both genetically XX. Uh, no.


----------



## User101

Ladies, FYT is not the place for political commentary. We like to keep things civil here.







Thanks for understanding!


----------



## TinyFrog

Congratulations Zoe! He's beautiful!







:

I look forward to hearing (and seeing) more at a later time.

Happy baby mooning!







:







:







:







:


----------



## snozzberry

Maybe we can talk about Palin in our NMY Grads Facebook group instead?









*Cradle cap:* What can be done about it?

*Nap length:* Abby takes 30- to 45-minute naps, rarely longer. When did your babies transition to longer, less frequent naps?


----------



## Maela

*Cradle cap:* Dd had it and still does a little bit. My mom keeps telling me that if I would just scrub it every day, it would go away. But it's barely there anymore and I don't like shampooing her hair every day.







There's not enough there to look bad or cause any problems, so I'm just leaving it alone.
Anyway, when it would get really bad when she was little, I would put some olive oil on it and let it sit for a few minutes. Then I could _gently_ scratch it off with my finger nail because the oil softened it. Then I would shampoo it, and scrub it _lightly_ with a baby brush. Then her hair would always be so soft and shiny and smell good for a couple of days.







I did this once or twice a month until she was about 8 months.


----------



## PiePie

girlfriends, as soon as the trial is over i am going to join facebook...

the trial is going miserably. the judge is a huge sexist and my ego has been shredded so many times today. i have been really sad and missing dd so i bucked my boss and told her i am working from home tonight. 3rd all-nighter in a row. still not productive enough because dd needs to nurse long, to reconnect, i suspect, guiltily.

she loves sch. the teachers say they have never seen any child so well adjusted and that they can't believe she hasn't been in daycare before. she marched in on the first day and the teachers exclaimed, "she looks like she's going off to college!!" i got all teary. she lvoes the new toys and a little boy who is unfortunately named ferrell, pronounced like feral cats. the teachers tell us she is their favorite because she is so active, curious, inquisitive, etc.


----------



## Maela

*Nap length:* Gosh, I don't remember when she stopped. I think she started taking two 30min-2hr naps a day when she was around 6-9 months. Sorry I know that's pretty vague, I just don't remember. Then sometime around 10-11 months, she started taking only one 45min-2.5hr nap. This is still what she usually does.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
she loves sch. the teachers say they have never seen any child so well adjusted and that they can't believe she hasn't been in daycare before. she marched in on the first day and the teachers exclaimed, "she looks like she's going off to college!!" i got all teary. she lvoes the new toys and a little boy who is unfortunately named ferrell, pronounced like feral cats. the teachers tell us she is their favorite because she is so active, curious, inquisitive, etc.









So cute! I'm glad she's enjoying school so much. She sounds like such a cool little baby! I think my Dd and your dd would get along well. Maev's a little slower (not intelligence/academic-wise; she's very quick, just not developmentally as quick as Lorelei) and calmer probably, but they both sound like they have really strong, happy personalities.

I wish all the NMY Grad babies could get together and play.







Wouldn't that be so much fun?

Maev wants more of these.







:







:







:







:







:







:







:


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Anyway, when it would get really bad when she was little, I would put some olive oil on it and let it sit for a few minutes. Then I could _gently_ scratch it off with my finger nail because the oil softened it. Then I would shampoo it, and scrub it _lightly_ with a baby brush. Then her hair would always be so soft and shiny and smell good for a couple of days.







I did this once or twice a month until she was about 8 months.

Thanks for the tip! We put some olive oil on tonight for 15 min and then shampooed. But then we didn't have a baby brush (doh!) so we skipped that part. She went straight to bed after so I'm anxious to see what it looks like in the morning!







:

*PiePie,* hang in there! Do you know how much longer the trial will be, or does it depend? I'm sorry the judge is a sexist.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
she loves sch. the teachers say they have never seen any child so well adjusted and that they can't believe she hasn't been in daycare before. she marched in on the first day and the teachers exclaimed, "she looks like she's going off to college!!" i got all teary.

Oh, that is SO CUTE!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I wish all the NMY Grad babies could get together and play.







Wouldn't that be so much fun?

ME TOO!!! One of these days maybe we can plan a get-together in a central place.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev wants more of these.







:







:







:







:







:







:







:









Maev!!!


----------



## PiePie

when lorelei was 4.5 mos. i started instituting 2 regular nap times. i would lie down with her at 11 and at 2 and nurse. for the first week i napped with her all the time, my presence kept her asleep. after about a month of the same schedule, i stopped needing to be there, and she would conk out at exactly that time no matter where we were, waht the noise level was, etc. the first nap was 1 hour and the second nap was 2 hours, usually.

at about 9 mos. she started moving to 1 nap a day, which started out being at noon and is now moving to 1. that nap is ideally 2 hours long but often more like 1.75. the transition to a single nap has been very nonlinear.


----------



## accountclosed3

i think that non-linear is the truth of being with a little one.

we went to the LC and it was great. what we'd sort of figured out on our own (feeding him with a finger) is what needed to be done! so, we hand pump the breast and set him to, as long as he is happy there.

he likes something harder to suck on than a breast, and so we're doing some training of the tongue to get it to soften while still being able to suck.

once he begins to be frustrated with the breast, but before he starts screaming about it, we offer him the finger pad side up (his preference) for the first 1/3 of an oz or so. then, for the second 1/3, we give him pad side down, even though he doesn't like it (it's softer). if he starts to fuss a bit from this, we'll flip it, and hten try again on the next third and so on.

right now, he takes in about 1/2 to 1 oz each feeding, and this morning his 'split' a feeding taking in about 1/3 and then again another .57 oz, which took us close to 3/4 of an oz in this last "feeding."

after feeding him, i pump my breasts for the next feeding. i'm working my way up to getting hte full 2-4 oz out of me. it's not quite up there yet, but i do drip a lot and i get at least 1.5 oz per pumping (after hand pumping and just dripping away while i feed him, i might actually be above that 2 oz mark. but who knows?)

dr's appt today to follow up about weight, the time with the LC, etc.

oh, and the LC was in the maternity ward at the hospital. what a terrifying place. i am so glad that i didn't birth there. ryan said it was surreal--completely surreal.

i am glad that hospitals exist, but i'm also glad that i rarely need them.


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* far be it from me to interfere with advice from lc, but ime a hosp grade pump makes things easier at the beginning. we rented one for the first 2 weeks. so glad you saw an lc. best $210 i have spent. keep up the good work mama.


----------



## witchygrrl

mmm, yeah the hospital grade pump was great while I was staying in the hospital after the birth. But yeah, am I glad I never went into the real maternity ward. yikes! When I was hanging out at the birth center once Rhea was born, another mother was in labor next door, but things seemed calmed. She certainly wasn't 'sounding' the way I was.

I have so much to get done and no energy to do it. Rhea was nursing almost nonstop this morning. I had to laugh at the doctor last Tuesday asking if she was nursing every 3 hours...hah! More like every hour. She's napping now though. So cute.

ETA: nope, she's awake...and hungry again.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
when lorelei was 4.5 mos. i started instituting 2 regular nap times. i would lie down with her at 11 and at 2 and nurse. for the first week i napped with her all the time, my presence kept her asleep. after about a month of the same schedule, i stopped needing to be there, and she would conk out at exactly that time no matter where we were, waht the noise level was, etc. the first nap was 1 hour and the second nap was 2 hours, usually.

Wow that is really nice! I wish Dd was that consistent when she was little.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i think that non-linear is the truth of being with a little one.

Exactly.








I can't wait to hear your birth story. I'm glad youwere able to have him at home like you wanted to.

I should probably write out my own birth story someday.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl*
I had to laugh at the doctor last Tuesday asking if she was nursing every 3 hours...hah! More like every hour.

oh yeah, I never knew/know what to say when I get asked "how many times a day is she nursing?" I don't know... a hundred? now maybe 8? sometimes 20? Her nursing "sessions" are never consistent. And sometimes they last 2 minutes, and sometimes they last 15 minutes. She's never put herself on any type of feeding schedule. She only now, in the last couple of months, has started going 3-4 hours sometimes between nursings.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm really...comforted... to hear about the different 'nursing styles' around and what not.

i do have to admit, i'm psyched.

the LC said that i should work up to 2 oz. i'm still getting about 1.5 per pumping, though i did get two earlier in the day! so, that's good and i'm getting there! and that hospital grade pump is so nice and quiet!

beyond that, Hawk has also 'advanced' a bit in his progress. first, he will take the nipple and play with it a bit. i wouldn't call it anything like nrusing (no chomp or suction really), but he is staying on and tasting and trying.

with this, in the 'finger training' he has already moved from the pad up to the pad down position. this means that things are improving, that his tongue is softening to the idea here.

i talk to the LC again tomorrow, see where we go from there.

so, it's definitely progress. i think we'll get there no problem.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm really...comforted... to hear about the different 'nursing styles' around and what not.

i do have to admit, i'm psyched.

the LC said that i should work up to 2 oz. i'm still getting about 1.5 per pumping, though i did get two earlier in the day! so, that's good and i'm getting there! and that hospital grade pump is so nice and quiet!

beyond that, Hawk has also 'advanced' a bit in his progress. first, he will take the nipple and play with it a bit. i wouldn't call it anything like nrusing (no chomp or suction really), but he is staying on and tasting and trying.

with this, in the 'finger training' he has already moved from the pad up to the pad down position. this means that things are improving, that his tongue is softening to the idea here.

i talk to the LC again tomorrow, see where we go from there.

so, it's definitely progress. i think we'll get there no problem.









That's great *ZB*! I'm glad things are improving so quickly.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Maybe we can talk about Palin in our NMY Grads Facebook group instead?









*Cradle cap:* What can be done about it?

I put oatmeal in a sock with Fenton in his bath. Once it was wet, I used it to rub on his scalp. Don't know if it made it go away faster.

AF is back!!!!!







:


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
AF is back!!!!!







:

Wow! I wonder if your recent serious baby lust is at all related to hormones/ovulating? Our bodies are amazing things!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
AF is back!!!!!







:

Woo hoo! I'm actually kind of looking forward to it too. Just for the regularity of it, yk?


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm really...comforted... to hear about the different 'nursing styles' around and what not.

i do have to admit, i'm psyched.

the LC said that i should work up to 2 oz. i'm still getting about 1.5 per pumping, though i did get two earlier in the day! so, that's good and i'm getting there! and that hospital grade pump is so nice and quiet!

beyond that, Hawk has also 'advanced' a bit in his progress. first, he will take the nipple and play with it a bit. i wouldn't call it anything like nrusing (no chomp or suction really), but he is staying on and tasting and trying.

with this, in the 'finger training' he has already moved from the pad up to the pad down position. this means that things are improving, that his tongue is softening to the idea here.

i talk to the LC again tomorrow, see where we go from there.

so, it's definitely progress. i think we'll get there no problem.










You'll both get there, I have no doubt.


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm: ryan wants to hear about your dream. we are not surprised; we have a sense of his ability to travel already. yours isn't the first dream to come in, and yes, he appears to be quite the powerful little spirit!

nursing: still not up to "full production" and honestly, my breasts don't hurt. but, i have weird notions of discomfort, i guess.

still keeping on with the finger feeding, though we are offering breast frequently. he's doing great and does get a little bit of a suckle now and again.

sleeps like a champ, too. so we're actually pretty rested.

i'm so thankful my mom came yesterday to clean, but i'm not happy about my ILs coming tomorrow. BAH! bleh. i need to feelrelaxed/comfortable to pump and feed and allow him to go to nipple, and the whole process takes an hour. so, even while the ILs are here (they're coming after church, they may be here for one or two feedings), a large protion of their time will be without me, ryan, or the baby, because i'm not doing topless in front of them (like i did with my parents yesterday. my parents are, btw, incredibly cool--i guess i'd forgotten.







)

so, that's me. consternation about ILs. LOL


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
mmm: ryan wants to hear about your dream. we are not surprised; we have a sense of his ability to travel already. yours isn't the first dream to come in, and yes, he appears to be quite the powerful little spirit!

nursing: still not up to "full production" and honestly, my breasts don't hurt. but, i have weird notions of discomfort, i guess.

still keeping on with the finger feeding, though we are offering breast frequently. he's doing great and does get a little bit of a suckle now and again.

sleeps like a champ, too. so we're actually pretty rested.

i'm so thankful my mom came yesterday to clean, but i'm not happy about my ILs coming tomorrow. BAH! bleh. i need to feelrelaxed/comfortable to pump and feed and allow him to go to nipple, and the whole process takes an hour. so, even while the ILs are here (they're coming after church, they may be here for one or two feedings), a large protion of their time will be without me, ryan, or the baby, because i'm not doing topless in front of them (like i did with my parents yesterday. my parents are, btw, incredibly cool--i guess i'd forgotten.







)

so, that's me. consternation about ILs. LOL

I wondered how things were going with those characters







.

I'm thinking of you constantly with nursing, hoping the energy helps.

Have so much more I want to say, but I have 45 lbs of tomatoes to can......before naptime ends







:


----------



## witchygrrl

Zoe, I have no doubt he's an old, powerful soul..seeing the pics on ryan's blog just confirmed that. no dreams yet...i haven't slept enough to dream.

good luck with the ILs...I hated nursing in my ILs presence, and they're not nearly as 'special' as yours. The first time, I was still in the hospital, my mil was sitting in the chair nearish my bed, looking at a bf'ing maual. Rhea and I hadn't gotten the hang of things yet, and mil's asking me a million questions about what the LC had told me (who I had only talked to for about 5 minutes at that point) based on the manual (as my mil never breastfed and hasn't a clue). It was a VERY stressful experience, and the only reason why it happened was because DH had gone off with his dad to pick up lunch.
---------------------------------------------------------
Shanna, 45 lbs? Wow. And woot to AF's return!


----------



## snozzberry

Yay for Hawk's progress!

Yay for Shanna's AF!








:


----------



## accountclosed3

NAK!!!!!

so, we are on the breast! and he won't take anything else! we started with the nipple shield plus syringe and that ended quickly. he just hung out on the breast from 6 pm to 3 am, then we got 3 hrs of sleep, and we're back on again. awesome!

and we managed a side lying!

so that is great since i can just takr the baby up when i want to and ryan can hang with his parents.


----------



## cking

Yahoo! That's wondeful ZB!

Josephine is now sitting unassisted. I got a pretty good picture of it the other day.







Also, she rolls from her back to her belly all the time, but rarely from her belly to her back. In fact, she's done it exactly three times, but that was a month ago now. I know it's no big deal, but anyone know of anything I can do to encourage her? She seems to love being on her belly, so maybe there's no incentive...?

Piepie, thanks for the tip on napping. I think I will try that. So often I feel impatient and want to get up and do other things, but I know that's probably not best in the long run.

Kelly, we seem to be going through some similar changes with naps. She hasn't really been regular at all yet, so really it's constantly changing. But I think with teething and becoming more active, she's starting to want to stay awake longer and then take longer naps. There are times when she's too tired to play but not ready to nap/nurse, so I've found that to be the best time to wear her on my back. Then I can do something (like make lunch or take a walk) and she's content, and the change of scene seems to help both of us. Then after a while she'll be exhausted and even falls asleep in there sometimes.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Woo hoo! I'm actually kind of looking forward to it too. Just for the regularity of it, yk?









Me too, I can't wait!

Shanna--what do you think brought it back? Quinn is still nursing about 6-20 times a night, and I feel like its never going to come back!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 

Josephine is now sitting unassisted.

wow she is so advanced!!!!!


----------



## PiePie

cking, toy as incentive. mirror or portable mobile. gotta go.


----------



## snozzberry

Congrats, *zoebird*!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Josephine is now sitting unassisted.

Yay!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
There are times when she's too tired to play but not ready to nap/nurse, so I've found that to be the best time to wear her on my back. Then I can do something (like make lunch or take a walk) and she's content, and the change of scene seems to help both of us. Then after a while she'll be exhausted and even falls asleep in there sometimes.

What carrier do you use to put her on your back? Was it hard to learn how to put here there by yourself?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Quinn is still nursing about 6-20 times a night, and I feel like its never going to come back!

Dang, mama! You deserve a medal.







It's nice to see you on the thread more...I've missed you!









*Cradle cap:* We tried olive oil for 15 minutes, then a baby brush to lightly scrub, but it didn't come up. The olive oil makes it just about disappear, actually. It's easier to pick it off when it's dry. Maybe I should do that here and there, and follow up with olive oil to soothe the skin after?

Or maybe I should just wait for it to go away. It's just that it looks SO grody.







And she scratches at it sometimes, so I wonder if it makes her head itch.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*ZB:* Yay for Hawk on the boob! That's great news - I'm so happy it wasn't a long and drawn out process for you.

My dream was not that interesting - really it was just that I'd given birth to my boy who was very obviously Hawk. We were just in the early days and lots of people were visiting. And that's all I can remember. Sorry.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*PiePie* - Is the trial over? How did it finish up?


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

Yay!

What carrier do you use to put her on your back? Was it hard to learn how to put here there by yourself?


I've been using a Beco Butterfly. They are $$, but very easy to use. It has an internal panel, so I just put her in it lying down, and then put the whole thing on like a backpack. You are supposed to be able to do it while DC is very young, but I didn't get comfortable with it until recently. I even got her on my back for the grocery store last week! {funny, when she's on my front, I get lots of people stopping to admire her...but on my back I just got a few weird looks







)

I've also used a mei tai....a little more economical (i made mine) but a little more of a learning curve. I do the 'shoulder toss' which she actually really likes now, especially because she can pull on my ponytail.









Yeah, I think we're just sitting out the cradle cap. Our ped said it should go away in a few months. It seems to be going away as her hair thins out. The brush seems to flake it off, but it still sticks in her hair and I have to pick them out.


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm: nothing to apologize for. he probably brought reassurance, and sometimes, that's all you need.


----------



## witchygrrl

PiePie, how did you pick up on the reflux? I swear Rhea is spitting up too much...and now my cat is vomiting again also. Awesome.


----------



## PiePie

trial is going to go down as one of the lowest moments of my prof'l life. judge was a total ua violation and sexist pig who got off on humiliating me. it was miserable. don't know if we won or lost (but in my heart of hearts i know we lost) because it's not over yet -- he requires post-trial briefing on an expedited schedule. ua violation.

*witchy*, reflux starts at about 4 to 8 weeks. it can mean excessive spitting up but the only instances in which i consider it problematic (worth treating) are when it is causing pain and interfering with the bfing relationship. dd screamed immediately after eating and only then. eventually she started refusing the boob because she knew it would cause her pain.







only 10% can be addressed by your diet, and of that chunk 90% are dairy. when she went on meds it immediately cleared up and if it had been soemthing else the meds wouldn't have helped. btw, the meds are no longer needed. we want on holiday from them a few weeks ago and no symptoms!







: oh, the other telltale signs: arching back and standing -- like the whole body is stiff -- when screaming.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
NAK!!!!!

so, we are on the breast! and he won't take anything else! we started with the nipple shield plus syringe and that ended quickly. he just hung out on the breast from 6 pm to 3 am, then we got 3 hrs of sleep, and we're back on again. awesome!

and we managed a side lying!

so that is great since i can just takr the baby up when i want to and ryan can hang with his parents.

ZB, that is so awesome! Yay!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Me too, I can't wait!

Shanna--what do you think brought it back? Quinn is still nursing about 6-20 times a night, and I feel like its never going to come back!

Yes, Dd is still nursing 1-5 times at night. I have a feeling mine won't come back until she's done nightnursing or at least not more than once a night.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Cradle cap:* We tried olive oil for 15 minutes, then a baby brush to lightly scrub, but it didn't come up. The olive oil makes it just about disappear, actually. It's easier to pick it off when it's dry. Maybe I should do that here and there, and follow up with olive oil to soothe the skin after?

Or maybe I should just wait for it to go away. It's just that it looks SO grody.







And she scratches at it sometimes, so I wonder if it makes her head itch.

Sure, just do the olive oil. I just shampooed because her hair seemed too greasy, and the baby brush helped get rd of more of it for us. Or you could just leave it. But like you, I thought it looked gross.

I'm watching my friend's 8yo dsd this week. It's fun, and Dd's loving it.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
trial is going to go down as one of the lowest moments of my prof'l life. judge was a total ua violation and sexist pig who got off on humiliating me. it was miserable. don't know if we won or lost (but in my heart of hearts i know we lost) because it's not over yet -- he requires post-trial briefing on an expedited schedule. ua violation.

*witchy*, reflux starts at about 4 to 8 weeks. it can mean excessive spitting up but the only instances in which i consider it problematic (worth treating) are when it is causing pain and interfering with the bfing relationship. dd screamed immediately after eating and only then. eventually she started refusing the boob because she knew it would cause her pain.







only 10% can be addressed by your diet, and of that chunk 90% are dairy. when she went on meds it immediately cleared up and if it had been soemthing else the meds wouldn't have helped. btw, the meds are no longer needed. we want on holiday from them a few weeks ago and no symptoms!







: oh, the other telltale signs: arching back and standing -- like the whole body is stiff -- when screaming.

PiePie, I'm sorry the judge was such a ua violation toward you...I wish there were some way that the judge could be censored for bad behavior, but that might make it worse. Ugh.









and thanks for the advice on the reflux. it's not as bad as you describe--usually she wants more after she spits up, whether it's a small amount or looks like the entirety of what she just ate. she gets more upset if there is any left in her mouth--but I would be too. it was weird how we went from no spit up to spitting up extremely often, but I guess she's getting enough to eat based on how often we change diapers.

But hooray that Lorelei doesn't need meds anymore!


----------



## Maela

I don't know how much Rhea is spitting up, but I remember that Maev had an increase in the amount of spitting up at some point. I think it was around 4 months though, which is much older than your dd. I never found out why she increased the spitting up; I just guessed that maybe it was from being able to move around more, and maybe she was moving around too much right after she ate?
That doesn't really help I guess.









Hope things improve soon.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Me too, I can't wait!

Shanna--what do you think brought it back? Quinn is still nursing about 6-20 times a night, and I feel like its never going to come back!

When he's not in teething pain (not often, but we had a week or two consistently without it), he slept really well, only nursing 2X a night (2 am and 5-6 am, then going _right_ back to sleep). Seemed to coincide with that and when I started to suspect that Fenton was nursing often in the day because he was bored or wanted to try out his power. I started suggesting something else when i suspect this ("some bread?" "water?" "go outside?") so he wasn't nursing quite as often in the day.

Elizabeth, I've missed you







. Hard to keep up here with a Toddler running around, huh?









Have to run, but wanted to add: My sister (who is ttc) has asked me to be at the birth to video tape, but she has some insecurities about having me there when she's so vulnerable to feeling judged since I make such different choices from her. Had a frank discussion with her about it, but mostly acknowledged that yes, we do make different choices. Not sure how to proceed......


----------



## farmama

nak. gosh, i'm behind...

congratulations jenifer & ryan!

Welcome Hawk!


----------



## Sihaya

I know this question has been asked several times before but am hoping you'll all humor me. With Christmas/DS's b-day marching ever closer, I am starting a list of things we want/need for him for the next six months or so. I am starting to foray into the realm of toys and am wondering if there's anything you'd suggest getting (in the vein of natural, plastic- and battery-free, and with a low annoyance level) for a 12-18 month old?

So far, I plan to give four natural toy websites as suggestions, at three of which have mail order catalogs. I am also asking for books (we haven't received any since our baby showers), a drum/drums, a wooden popper/lawnmower, a sorter (to replace this), balls, and playsilks. I also want a play kitchen and play stands for him eventually but think he's a bit young just yet and they're a bit pricey to ask for - I'm afraid we'll get some cheap plastic substitute instead.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I know this question has been asked several times before but am hoping you'll all humor me. With Christmas/Calvin's b-day marching ever closer, I am starting a list of things we want/need for him for the next six months or so. I am starting to foray into the realm of toys and am wondering if there's anything you'd suggest getting (in the vein of natural, plastic- and battery-free, and with a low annoyance level) for a 12-18 month old?

So far, I plan to give four natural toy websites as suggestions, at least two of which have mail order catalogs. I am also asking for books (we haven't received any since our baby showers), a drum/drums, a wooden popper/lawnmower, a sorter (to replace this), balls, and playsilks. I also want a play kitchen and play stands for him eventually but think he's a bit young just yet and they're a bit pricey to ask for - I'm afraid we'll get some cheap plastic substitute instead.

nak
I dig this so much that i'm getting one for Fenton for christmas. And i got him one of thesethat is a great alt. to a sorter, got f's at keane's downtown









anyone seen "birth" yet? thinking of going......
'


----------



## accountclosed3

ack, christmas?! you mean, _christmas_?!

seriously, we're having an awesome day 10. things are hitting a nice, comfy rhythm.

and my butt hruts from sitting so much.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
nak
I dig this so much that i'm getting one for Fenton for christmas. And i got him one of thesethat is a great alt. to a sorter, got f's at keane's downtown









anyone seen "birth" yet? thinking of going......
'

The toy in that first link looks really cool! I forgot about Keane's but that would be a good place to suggest to my grandma who doesn't shop online. The jury's still out on Made in China toys here, not for lead issues, but others.

I'm undecided on seeing Birth still, the description makes me think it will make me more angry than anything, but I could be wrong.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I know this question has been asked several times before but am hoping you'll all humor me. With Christmas/Calvin's b-day marching ever closer, I am starting a list of things we want/need for him for the next six months or so. I am starting to foray into the realm of toys and am wondering if there's anything you'd suggest getting (in the vein of natural, plastic- and battery-free, and with a low annoyance level) for a 12-18 month old?

So far, I plan to give four natural toy websites as suggestions, at three of which have mail order catalogs. I am also asking for books (we haven't received any since our baby showers), a drum/drums, a wooden popper/lawnmower, a sorter (to replace this), balls, and playsilks. I also want a play kitchen and play stands for him eventually but think he's a bit young just yet and they're a bit pricey to ask for - I'm afraid we'll get some cheap plastic substitute instead.









:

Likewise, any suggestions for 6-12 months?









On the playsilks, I've been wanting some baby-sized, and I saw someone suggest getting silk blanks (on thaisilks dot com or the like) and dying them with koolaid. So I got some 11x11 and 22x22 (they have larger also) and they are sitting here waiting for me to dye. (i did dye some wool with koolaid last year and it was quite easy).


----------



## cking

While we're on the subject, I thought i'd mention that Cutie Patootie runs a yahoo group for coops on all kinds of stuff, including nice wooden toys. There is a link in her siggie. There's on going on Selecta toys right now. Now if I could just figure out a way to get the inlaws to use it.....


----------



## Sihaya

Christina, I was in a completely different thread and just happened to see that in her signature and was just about to come here and post about it!









ETA: Oops, it was actually lactivist's group I found. It looks like Cutie Patootie has a different one. Well, I joined both just to be safe!


----------



## snozzberry

Steph, thanks for starting the toy conversation! We got MIL to agree to NO store-bought gifts for Xmas--only gifts we make for each other--which I still am just







: excited about!

So that means I want to buy Abby some good toys ourselves. Although, just heard today Haba is recalling a bunch of their rattles/rings for choking hazard. Wasn't a surprise to me since Abby just about choked on the problem part on her Haba ring last week.







Luckily, she was able to swallow it--saw it come out the other end--but it was a SCARY minute where I picked her up, turned her upside down, and banged on her back, wishing I remembered the exact choking maneuver for babies. (I re-reviewed the manual right after we had both calmed down after that incident!)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
and my butt hruts from sitting so much.









I remember having that same problem in the early days!


----------



## snozzberry

Just saw that I was 1 away from post 1800, so had to do one more here because it's only right that it be with you all.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Just saw that I was 1 away from post 1800, so had to do one more here because it's only right that it be with you all.

















: Happy 1800!


----------



## PiePie

i know it has an older age range, but dd loved these http://www.amazon.com/Sylvia-Longs-M...1007937&sr=8-1 from as soon as she could sit up. i got them in the bargain section of borders for 4.99. i lust for this http://www.amazon.com/Haba-902-Disco...f=pd_sbs_ba_17 for dd for christmas this year but let's be real, the price is nutsy. my parents got dd this http://www.amazon.com/Parents-Busy-Z...1008152&sr=1-1 for her 1st bday, 2 mos. early, and she plays with it EVERY SINGLE DAY. it is available at target. and for the younger set, don't forget balls and puppets... i also lust for this shape sorter http://www.amazon.com/Plan-Toy-Shape...1008495&sr=1-1 and will probably get that.

eta: i have a melissa and doug puzzle but i am not in love with where the screws are. if i were doing it over i would get puzzibilities/small world toys/ryans room; it was just that m&d is more readily available.

eta: on musical instruments, i like those by remo aka lynn kleiner and woodstock percussion. but it is hard to find ones that are baby-safe. i ordered dd a set from a place called miscellaneous supplies. it contains plastic but the sound quality is high, better than some of the pure wood stuff. i've tested lots at various music classes. *cking*, some are available at kazams in princeton in palmer sq.


----------



## PiePie

thank you all for permitting me to engage in consumerist fantasies re toys. i am super down about the judge thing (i think he and i are in an abusive relationship, seriously) and boy is this the perfect distraction.

so in the if i had a million dollars vein, here are some more push toys: http://www.amazon.com/Haba-1623-Push...1011836&sr=8-1 andhttp://www.amazon.com/Haba-0949-HABA-Doll-Pram/dp/B000OMQCGA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=toys-and-games&qid=1221011964&sr=1-1 these haba prams are cheaper than the first i linked to but all are imo crazy pricey. but a girl can dream, right?









along the lines of one of *shanna's* links i like this http://www.amazon.com/Plan-Toys-0531...1012069&sr=1-1 hey maybe i'll get it. stop me now.









and *sihaya's* original inquiry included shape sorters, so here are some more http://www.amazon.com/Ryans-Room-552...1012262&sr=1-1 and this one, which i believe (correct me if you disagree??) is more appropriate for an older age range: http://www.amazon.com/Plan-Toys-3953...1012400&sr=1-9

btw, i totally agree that a toy kitchen is for an older age set. if a 12 mo can reach it, it won't work for a 3-4 yo. dd sees toy kitchens all the time at a park we go to containing outgrown toys (really nice ride-ons) but does not actually play kitchen with kitchen stuff. however, today she did use her toy phone as a phone and steal someone's ipod on the subway, put it to her cheek, and say, "hello!!"







:


----------



## PiePie

another push toy http://www.amazon.com/Radio-Flyer-Cl...1012783&sr=8-3 perhaps i should quit the law and become a personal shopper...


----------



## snozzberry

at PiePie's toy fun time!!!

Anyone read Confessions of a Naughty Mommy: How I Found My Lost Libido? I was skeptical, but I'm 40 pages in and LOVING it. The author's description of Sex Life After Baby is spot on, imho. At least so far...and it's funny as hell too!

And now to go spend too much time on Oompa Toys when I should be sleeping...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 







at PiePie's toy fun time!!!

Anyone read Confessions of a Naughty Mommy: How I Found My Lost Libido? I was skeptical, but I'm 40 pages in and LOVING it. The author's description of Sex Life After Baby is spot on, imho. At least so far...and it's funny as hell too!

And now to go spend too much time on Oompa Toys when I should be sleeping...

OMG, I need to read this. I _so_ need to find mine


----------



## Sihaya

Great links, PiePie! You've got me lusting after that Radio Flyer Walker Wagon. It's one of the more affordable wooden push toys I've seen.


----------



## PiePie

and anything under $70 is a great price for that wagon. check out your local craigslist first, though, as it is quite common and perhaps might be handed down (albeit commercially). what i like about it -- better than dd's push toy -- is that it is weighted and as such won't go fwd when an unstable baby pulls up on it.


----------



## PiePie

need to read that book too.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm finding myself feeling very amorous right now, but my body isn't ready at all. it's a tough spot! LOL

baby is doing well. we made our first trip out today that wasn't doctor/whatever related. we went to target to get another nipple shield and a box for them--even though he's now on the nipple itself about 1/3 of the time, so we are improving and i may not need the shield for long. we also went to the grocery store and a craft store to get some ink and paper to do hands/feet for everyone.

he has such long feet!


----------



## witchygrrl

Such cool toys to look forward to...









I'm still thinking DD has issues with spitting up--she's very gassy (honestly Dh and I are too these days), and I've noticed that sometimes she starts choking on my milk...I think my letdown might be too fast for her. So between the two, she spits up quite a bit, although it's much less at night, especially if we do side-lying. But of course, after I said she's not screaming at the boob, what does she do? Not consistently, but it was heartbreaking









So we need to examine diet. We do eat a lot of fiber and dairy. Perhaps it's time to cut down. And I need to look at how to deal with fast letdown. It was all seeming so easy a week or so ago. Silly me.

On a related topic, my great aunt, who usually seems so progressive and cool, asked if my doc had talked about solids for DD yet...um, she's not even 6 weeks old yet?!? Apparently even though she breastfed her 5 children, she gave them rice cereal at night so they'd sleep through starting when they were only a few weeks old. Yikes! 4 out of 5 have food sensitivity issues/allergies that I know about...I can only think this practice did NOT help in any way.


----------



## farmama

zoe, did you post your birth story? i have to get back through the pages i missed...

toys...i could buy so many, but i get so tired of picking them up!








plus, the ones i like best are not my girl's favorite (she's still packing around a bald little doll with a plastic homemade dress that my friend's 3 yo gave her for her b-day). so i'm doing my best to curtail the spending.

one of my friends is pg again, another is talking about #2, and it's getting me thinking.







we would have to dramatically restructure our business to make it work, though. i have NO time for anything in the summer.

thanks!


----------



## cking

Steph, that's so funny!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i know it has an older age range, but dd loved these http://www.amazon.com/Sylvia-Longs-M...1007937&sr=8-1 from as soon as she could sit up. i got them in the bargain section of borders for 4.99. i lust for this http://www.amazon.com/Haba-902-Disco...f=pd_sbs_ba_17 for dd for christmas this year but let's be real, the price is nutsy. my parents got dd this http://www.amazon.com/Parents-Busy-Z...1008152&sr=1-1 for her 1st bday, 2 mos. early, and she plays with it EVERY SINGLE DAY. it is available at target. and for the younger set, don't forget balls and puppets... i also lust for this shape sorter http://www.amazon.com/Plan-Toy-Shape...1008495&sr=1-1 and will probably get that.

eta: i have a melissa and doug puzzle but i am not in love with where the screws are. if i were doing it over i would get puzzibilities/small world toys/ryans room; it was just that m&d is more readily available.

eta: on musical instruments, i like those by remo aka lynn kleiner and woodstock percussion. but it is hard to find ones that are baby-safe. i ordered dd a set from a place called miscellaneous supplies. it contains plastic but the sound quality is high, better than some of the pure wood stuff. i've tested lots at various music classes. *cking*, some are available at kazams in princeton in palmer sq.

Piepie,
Yes, we got nesting blocks similar to that for our friend's 2yo's birthday, but I think J would like them too. She certainly would like to chew on them (can't keep her away from books, cardboard, wood, magazines, etc!)

I love that busy-box too. It seems like J might like that now too even though she's probably young for it. She'd love to spin the blocks. I really want more things that she can use while sitting. There was an inflatable globe (beach ball) at the LLL meeting last night and she loved it!

And I absolutely heart Jazams!

Ok, speaking of music&#8230;..J got to check out the piano at my sister's house and she was having a ball banging on the keys. Acutally, she sounded pretty good. Lol. So, I can't wait to get her a toy piano. She loved banging her hands on the table, so I got out a set of bongos that I never use, and she is having fun playing with those too. (but she does want to chew on the skins) We are going to take a music together class starting next week, so I'm psyched for that.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 







at PiePie's toy fun time!!!

Anyone read Confessions of a Naughty Mommy: How I Found My Lost Libido? I was skeptical, but I'm 40 pages in and LOVING it. The author's description of Sex Life After Baby is spot on, imho. At least so far...and it's funny as hell too!

And now to go spend too much time on Oompa Toys when I should be sleeping...


Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
OMG, I need to read this. I _so_ need to find mine

















I so need to read this too.














:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Such cool toys to look forward to...









I'm still thinking DD has issues with spitting up--she's very gassy (honestly Dh and I are too these days), and I've noticed that sometimes she starts choking on my milk...I think my letdown might be too fast for her. So between the two, she spits up quite a bit, although it's much less at night, especially if we do side-lying. But of course, after I said she's not screaming at the boob, what does she do? Not consistently, but it was heartbreaking









So we need to examine diet. We do eat a lot of fiber and dairy. Perhaps it's time to cut down. And I need to look at how to deal with fast letdown. It was all seeming so easy a week or so ago. Silly me.

On a related topic, my great aunt, who usually seems so progressive and cool, asked if my doc had talked about solids for DD yet...um, she's not even 6 weeks old yet?!? Apparently even though she breastfed her 5 children, she gave them rice cereal at night so they'd sleep through starting when they were only a few weeks old. Yikes! 4 out of 5 have food sensitivity issues/allergies that I know about...I can only think this practice did NOT help in any way.

That's so sad about the solid's. Our neighbor's first ped was suggesting they add rice cereal to her bottle of EBM at 2 weeks old. They dropped her quick, thank goodness. But that was supposed to help her gain weight quicker.







:

I had some problems with fast letdown too. Some suggestions were to try nursing 'down under' with you lying back, and the football hold with you lying back as well. And I think they also suggested coming off the breast when letdown happens and waiting until it slows down a bit to come back. DD still pulls off just before letdown occasionally, and of course milk goes flying everywhere. I now keep a diaper under us whenever we are side-lying.

and fwiw, we went through an extra-gassy phase around that age. I think she didn't really throw up until she was 5 weeks, and then it seemed to happen much more often after that. But it slowed down as she got a little bigger.


----------



## cking

Speaking of chewing on things, does anyone have ideas for teethers for a non-solids-eating/tooth-having baby? DD seems to really want to bite into stuff now. We have some wood teethers, but of course she prefers books and fingers. I give her a bm-icecube-in-a-sock every now and then, and I noticed she's starting to bite and pull on it with her new teeth.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

So that means I want to buy Abby some good toys ourselves. Although, just heard today Haba is recalling a bunch of their rattles/rings for choking hazard. Wasn't a surprise to me since Abby just about choked on the problem part on her Haba ring last week.







Luckily, she was able to swallow it--saw it come out the other end--but it was a SCARY minute where I picked her up, turned her upside down, and banged on her back, wishing I remembered the exact choking maneuver for babies. (I re-reviewed the manual right after we had both calmed down after that incident!)


Oh no! Glad she's ok. Which toy was this? I remember from your FB pictures that we have some of the same toys.

eta: nm, I found the post about it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Speaking of chewing on things, does anyone have ideas for teethers for a non-solids-eating/tooth-having baby? DD seems to really want to bite into stuff now. We have some wood teethers, but of course she prefers books and fingers. I give her a bm-icecube-in-a-sock every now and then, and I noticed she's starting to bite and pull on it with her new teeth.

Freeze a corn cob that has the corn bit off? Or even not frozen......Only good for a couple more weeks though......

Sleep is for wimps, and I _really_ hope to wimp out tonight


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm finding myself feeling very amorous right now, but my body isn't ready at all. it's a tough spot! LOL

baby is doing well. we made our first trip out today that wasn't doctor/whatever related. we went to target to get another nipple shield and a box for them--even though he's now on the nipple itself about 1/3 of the time, so we are improving and i may not need the shield for long. we also went to the grocery store and a craft store to get some ink and paper to do hands/feet for everyone.

he has such long feet!










how is your body feeling, zoe? at this point i pretty much feel like myself, though still a bit larger than i used to be. I checked out the postnatal yoga workout on the dvd I used throughout my pregnancy and wow, I'm in for it. definitely something to work up to. i plan on starting next week.

rhea did much better today...a couple doses of gripe water definitely helped the gas.


----------



## katt

i've missed SO much. I was out of the state and had some family things to do.

Congrats Zoe!!! SO Exciting.

Teething: no real help as DS didn't really indicate he needed anything. We did freeze those plastic water filled rings, but I didn't like to use them 'cause they smelled SO bad, even after I washed 'em and tried to let them air out.

Toys: right now Teo is all about balls, cars, motorcycles and train. Especially if he can attach them (magnents on the trains) It is SO cute, he'll lay down on his stomach on the floor to play with the cars and such. Gotta love it.
He also REALLY loves his Vacuum (he found it at Goodwill and wouldnt' let go), Tricycle, bead maze, and wooden pull-behind caterpiller.
I know he'd love something he can push/pull like a wagon or cart or something like that, but we don't have room. He'd also really LOVE a kitchen. I think he'd LOVE a balance bike. (he LOVES for me to push him around on the 'big' kids' bikes -yes, he has to wear his helmet, even on his low-rider trike-.

I do have an Amazon wish-list for him. I try to keep it updated for what he's up to at the moment, or something he'll be needing in the future. Teo's Wish List Keep in mind that I just go through and click... my retail therapy. I don't know if family/friends have even know about it, much less buy off it.







It might sometimes seem excessive concerning 1 kind of item, ie: lots of trains, I don't do a lot of editing, just wishing.


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Speaking of chewing on things, does anyone have ideas for teethers for a non-solids-eating/tooth-having baby? DD seems to really want to bite into stuff now. We have some wood teethers, but of course she prefers books and fingers. I give her a bm-icecube-in-a-sock every now and then, and I noticed she's starting to bite and pull on it with her new teeth.

Abby LOVES cloth teethers. Her two faves are the frog teether from Under the Nile and one of those ghost-looking things like this. She also loves the green beans and the carrot from the Under the Nile veggie crate.









eta: we'll also get the cloth teethers wet and put them in the freezer for a bit, and that helps a lot.


----------



## snozzberry

Oops, I forgot I had a question for y'all!

We're taking Abby to her first wedding in October, and I'd like to splurge on a super cute dress for her.







Preferably organic. Do you know of any good organic clothes retailers that have cute dresses?

Also, is there such thing as an organic Halloween costume?


----------



## accountclosed3

i did post the birth story in birth stories. it's not complete because there is so much i cannot describe--it was such a deeply spiritual experience and how do you describe that. i guess it was an ecstatic birth!

organic dresses...kate something. . .i'll look it up see if i find it. . .

body is actually feeling good. i feel larger than before, of course, but it's only 12 days out now. (oh, and hawk has regained ALL of his weight back, even though the doc didn't think it possible!)

anyway, i'm already doing most of the abdominal exercises that i normally do (and did during pregnancy), and i feel it coming together. the skin is still loose, but i'm in most of my old clothes (the 6s for certain, the 4s are a bit tight).

i hope to be back to size by hawk's blessing (oct 12), but it may be well before then anyway.

and my legs and arms are certainly leaner. but i feel good "down there" and bleeding stopped (turned yellow) on day 7, and is slowing too.

so, it's all good here. ice packs still feel nice though.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
I do have an Amazon wish-list for him. I try to keep it updated for what he's up to at the moment, or something he'll be needing in the future. Teo's Wish List Keep in mind that I just go through and click... my retail therapy. I don't know if family/friends have even know about it, much less buy off it.







It might sometimes seem excessive concerning 1 kind of item, ie: lots of trains, I don't do a lot of editing, just wishing.









same here


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
one of those ghost-looking things like this.

my mom got dd one similar to that and it didn't get much use as a teether. she preferred board books and cold washcloths and now sippy cups. what she really wants is to chew on frozen bags of milk but that is such a huge no. her top 2 teeth poked through on sunday.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
another push toy http://www.amazon.com/Radio-Flyer-Cl...1012783&sr=8-3 perhaps i should quit the law and become a personal shopper...









I love this one!

Teething: Maev loved chewing on wet baby washcloths.

Dd has been going to bed later and later. 8 o'clock is out of the question now. 9 o'clock, maybe, if we're lucky.







There goes the parents' alone time. I probably shouldn't be letting her sleep in right now, but I didn't get any time to myself last night. *whine*









Off to find ZB's birth story...

Then wake baby up.


----------



## TinyFrog

Kate Quinn Organics Dresses


----------



## TinyFrog

Farmama - How is the farm doing this year? It seems it was a rough year for most farmers due to the slower than normal warming of the weather. Is your farm back up and running as usual after the flood? Are you back in your house now? I stopped at the Olympia Farmers Market and picked up some of your wonderful chard and raspberries.







:


----------



## Sihaya

Not sure if it's fancy enough for a wedding, but Happy Green Bee also sells organic dresses.


----------



## PiePie

steph, just noticed your sr title. love it.


----------



## witchygrrl

Rhea will also be at a wedding this October...must peruse the dresses on these sites.


----------



## arelyn

We just got the internet...unfortunately we also got phone service and DS has discovered how to dial!! EEK!!!!!!!!! Sometime I'll find the time to get online nad post properly and read all I've missed (which is ridiculous amounts of material by now).


----------



## accountclosed3

you know, you might consider christening gowns as an option for the wedding dresses. you might consider asking the elders in your family for christening gowns.

my mother just brought the one that my sister and i wore, as well as her own (57 yr old christening gown). my mother's is beautiful, but so fragile. i'm having it box-framed, and hopefully my grandmother (with the help of my aunt) will be able to find a picture of my mother in the dress to be framed with it.

we're using the christening gown that i was in for hawk's blessing (including the bonnet, because i just think that's darn cute on boys--all those frills)--though ryan also wants to ask his mom to see what christening stuff might come up from their side of the family. who knows?

but, if i reject ryan's christening suit for my christening gown (because frills on boys is adorable!), she might get upset, just as how i had him in a little pink outfit in one of the pictures that we sent. it had a cat on it too, that pink outfit. it was so excessively girly--don't you know? LOL anyway, it totally wasn't. it was brown and pink with a cat on it for goodness sakes.

anyway, i ramble. i was thinking that you could probably find some really awesome old dresses in the family stashes somewhere--if you have contact with family. with mom's christening gowns, we also found a number of dresses that she saved that were mine and my sister's--adorable things.

anyway, an idea. perhaps not organic, but recycled.


----------



## Holiztic

Note on Kate Quinn: Everything we have bought of hers had holes or snaps falling off within a few wears. I refuse to buy another thing! Maybe just our experience, but buyer beware! We have ended up going all Hanna Andersson, much of what is not organic is Oko-Tex 100 certified (free of 100 harmful substances). For the under 2 crowd, you can find everything you need (except outerwear) in organic and/or oko-tex. Check, though, as not all is (some poly, acrylic, etc)

So we now have our third pair of shoes from Soft Star Shoes, and we LOVE them and wanted to share: http://www.softstarshoes.com

That's all I have time for!


----------



## witchygrrl

Makes me wish mine had been preserved...alas, it has not. As for DH, he had a bris, not a christening. Do they even have outfits for those? Maybe I'll ask my MIL about hers...

I think a brown and pink outfit with a cat on it sounds lovely--your ILs are special anyway, zoe. Of course, everyone asks if Rhea is a boy, even if she happens to be wearing pink. Whatever.

Love those shoes, Holitic! And too bad about Kate Quinn..I have one outfit by her--I'll see how it holds up.


----------



## snozzberry

Good suggestion on asking family for clothes, but neither side of our families has kept stuff like that unfortunately.







I might also check out some local consignment shops but as you'll see below I'm very tempted to buy something handmade...









*Elizabeth,* thanks for the heads up about Kate Quinn! I'm off to check out Hanna Andersson after this post...

*witchygrrl,* people mistake Abby for a boy sometimes too, when she's wearing pink AND her teething necklace.









*Vote on your favorite dress!*
I spent a lot of time on etsy.com yesterday







and found some ones I like. Which one is your favorite?

The wedding will be mid-October and the weather should still be fairly warm, but it's Texas so you never really know! For the short-sleeved ones we can just do a little sweater over them.
Option 1: Pink/white with brown sash
Option 2: Pink/white/brown flowers with pink/white sash
Option 3: Red/blue with peasant shirt


----------



## arelyn

:A Belated Welcome To Hawk







:

Congrats Zoe, I can't wait to read the birth story (unfortunately it'll have to wait until the little man is asleep)!

Maela: We're in the same boat. Kai has a late bedtime (11 yesterday) and most nights I fall asleep nursing him down and get no grown-up evening time. At least he sleeps in!









And the ILs are here...wish me luck!


----------



## Maela

Kelly, I like option 3 the best, although all of them are very cute!

Dd woke up at 6:45 yesterday! I didn't even have to wake her up. That's a good thing, because then she took her nap from 11:30 to 1:00 and went to bed at 8:30PM!! Yay!







: She woke up at 7:20AM today. And just went down for her nap at 11:30. Woo hoo! Hopefully this means we're getting back on track.


----------



## witchygrrl

Yeah, I like the 3rd option too. I'll have to go search on there since the wedding we're attending is a ren faire theme in NH.


----------



## Maela

I just realized that you changed the options kelly. Now I like option 2 the best.









Arelyn, sorry about your lack of adult alone time in the evening. It's really stressful for us when we don't get it for many nights in a row.







dh leaves early for work, so having alone time in the morning doesn't work well for us. I'll have to remember to try that on weekends though!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Good suggestion on asking family for clothes, but neither side of our families has kept stuff like that unfortunately.







I might also check out some local consignment shops but as you'll see below I'm very tempted to buy something handmade...









*Elizabeth,* thanks for the heads up about Kate Quinn! I'm off to check out Hanna Andersson after this post...

*witchygrrl,* people mistake Abby for a boy sometimes too, when she's wearing pink AND her teething necklace.









*Vote on your favorite dress!*
I spent a lot of time on etsy.com yesterday







and found some ones I like. Which one is your favorite?

The wedding will be mid-October and the weather should still be fairly warm, but it's Texas so you never really know! For the short-sleeved ones we can just do a little sweater over them.
Option 1: Pink/white with brown sash
Option 2: Pink/white/brown flowers with pink/white sash
Option 3: Red/blue with peasant shirt

those are so cute. I think I like #1 and #3 the best.


----------



## accountclosed3

good luck with ILs!

I really like the second and third dresses, and particularly the third dress. those are really lovely.

i'm having a friend make as suit for the baby for my sister's wedding in Feb. in the end, both ryan and i are in the wedding, and my sister picked a nice brown fabric and what not. quite nice really.

anyway, i figured i could just order extra fabric and then have my friend make an outfit for him that matches what ryan and i are wearing, since we're both in the wedding.

and, my dress has to be nursing friendly, too. and, my sister fore-warned the priest that i would, in fact, feed the baby in the church if needed. he seemed ok with that, she said.

so, that should be fun.

Cosleeping is the nicest thign ever, but i'm turning into a sandwich. that baby cuddles close, and then ryan cuddles close, and there i am in the middle trying not to be smooshed or smoosh anyone. LOL

so, i've moved over a bit to give ryan more space, which leads him to cuddling closer, and then the baby snuggles in really close. and sometimes, we just do "tummy-tummy" (skin to skin) with me on my back. it's nice, actually.

nursing right now is interesting. he nurses every 4th hr, for an hr or more. it kinda freaks me out, as he's supposed to go every 3rd hr, right?

so, anyway, we wake him every 3rd at night, and he'll feed for about 30-45 minutes, but then today, there was a 4 hr break between feedings (beginning to beginning) and the feeding lasted 2 hrs and 15 mintues (he did fall asleep occassionally and i had to wake him--but god forbid i take him from the breast.

in fact, now he's eaching every third--he's making hungry face again. he's so cute. so, i'll feed him again, and hopefully we'll get back on that 45 minute nursing every 3rd hr routine again!


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, there's no "supposed to" with breastfeeding, unless there's a medical (or similar) reason! Some babies have long feedings, but maybe not that often, some have tiny snacks once a hour or so. Some take a long time and just feed slowly, while others are guzzlers and finish quite quickly. And unless your baby is not gaining weight properly you don't need to wake them up to feed - they'll wake when they need to! With DD's weight issues I did end up feeding every three hours for about an hour - but I had low milk supply, and this worked best for us between 4 weeks and 4 months. We also did wake her up (every 4 or 5 hours) until she was about 10 weeks old, which I felt terrible about, but what with the LC, the nurses and the specialist paediatrician, oh well.

I realise you have had difficulties too, and I guess we just do what we need to do for our babies.

There will be days when Hawk will feed more often and seem more hungry (growth spurts). If you just let him, he'll soon settle into his "schedule" again.

Just try to relax about it. Not that I was very good about that. I found I worried a lot about everything in the first few months.

Oh, and in the first month DD was very reluctant to get of the breast at all!


----------



## witchygrrl

Oh yeah, I realized that my dress for the wedding I'm in is very much NOT nursing friendly. Awesome. Rhea does know how to drink from a bottle, a skill learned when we were having weight issues







Only my milk, though, thankfully. Never any nipple confusion, and she definitely prefers the breast. But the day of will be interesting...we plan on getting a brown New Native sling to match DH's outfit.

And I seriously want to know how/if you all keep house at all? Sharing chores? Waiting until you have bursts of energy? I had inspiration today, and Rhea napped quite a bit which helped, but yikes. Usually my apt is a sty.


----------



## TwilightJoy

I like the 2nd dress.


----------



## PiePie

*zoebird*, i LOVE that h. may wear your christening gown. consider a backup outfit -- i was at an mdc mama's ds's christening, and there was a diaper explosion between the church and the after party. dd wore my christening gown that had worn by everyone (one branch of) my family since at least 1848! handmade lace, brought over from ireland.







: note that the gown was originally made by a mama who had 5 boys and no girls. frills back then were very in for boys. and yes they are supposed to nurse every 3 hours, and here's the kicker -- you are supposed to count from beginning of feed to beginning!! we were religious about waking dd to offer the breast for the first month. at that point she had gained from 7 lbs. even at birth to a little over 8 lbs. and we were comfortable that she knew how to get what she needed. it sounds like your breastaurant is fully stocked now, but if you want to increase supply consider sleeping skin-to-skin.

*kelly*, i love the first dress. i tend to favor bright colors in general and especially on children.

*arelyn*, i totally feel you on falling asleep while nursing the baby down. for the first 7 mos. dd could stay up late but now she has a religious 9:30 bedtime which gives us a little couple time, when i am not working.


----------



## PiePie

*heather*, it is WAY too early for you to be worrying about housekeeping... at that point, the only housekeeping that got done in my house was by the post-partum doula. i am not one to talk on housekeeping because our apt. is a sty now too, but in general it happens in spurts during napping. it got WAY easier once she was interested in "helping" (totally counter-productive but whatever), which started at 7 mos. for dishes and 11 mos. for laundry.


----------



## Maela

ZB, I think it's cool that Hawk nurses for so long. Maev was (and still is) a short, but frequent nurser. Sometimes I wished that she was long, but less frequent. I always worried when she was very young if she was getting enough in five minutes.

Heather, our house is just now looking great again. After 9 months or so of pg and a year of having a baby. So, you have some time.







I would clean every now and then with bursts of energy during the naps that I put Maev down on our bed for. Sometimes when she was really little she would sleep for three hours and I would run around the house trying to make things look semi nice again. Usually though I would just try to keep up with laundry and dishes and not worry about much else. Dh helped when he could.


----------



## accountclosed3

we're doing well with housework...i am compelled to do it...it is tough with this nursing schedule. on for two hrs, off for one hr.

but it works!

sleep is tough though. and ryan complains even though i'm the one up doing the feeding and the night diaper now. i turn on a dim light...thats why he fusses about not enough sleep! silly man!


----------



## snozzberry

Thanks for taking a look at the dresses! It doesn't look like there's a clear winner so maybe I'll have to order more than one and see which one I like best.







Abby doesn't have any dresses at all right now and I feel this huge urge to dress her up lately, so two dresses wouldn't be bad.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
sleep is tough though. and ryan complains even though i'm the one up doing the feeding and the night diaper now. i turn on a dim light...thats why he fusses about not enough sleep! silly man!

Haha, you're letting him off easy! Lacking the proper equipment to participate in the night feeding, DH always did night diaper changes.









Seriously though, we bought a couple LED night lights to keep in the room so at least for pee diapers, we didn't have toe turn on the lamp on the dresser. Just thought I'd mention that in case it might help in your situation!


----------



## snozzberry

Oh yeah, *housekeeping*: For about the first 9-10 weeks, DH did pretty much everything house-related. So if he didn't do it, it didn't get done.







After that, I started participating more in housekeeping, but the house is pretty much cluttered always and more days than not has a nice layer of dog/cat fur on the hardwood floors. We need to get our Roomba battery replaced so we can start running it every day for when Abby starts crawling!

*witchygrrl*, that's so cool you're getting your DH a carrier like that! What did you think of the New Native? We tried it on once doing the hip carry, but it seemed like the fabric was cutting into Abby's legs.


----------



## accountclosed3

he was doing diaper changes before--and during the day he has diaper duty even though i'm trying to learn to EC.

next week, he starts working from home and gets back to his sort-of regular schedule. he is itching to get back to his writing schedule, and i'm learning to let him go a bit. i still expect him to help out on chores (dishes, laundry) and i'll take care of the rest of it. baby wearing while cleaning helps a lot!

also, i told him that i would take over this stuff. it doesn't mean he doesn't participate. he does hold the baby while i shower and when i need a bit of a break. it's not that frequent--hawk rarely cries (usually when he has gas or is having his diaper changed)--but sometimes i just need a bit of freedom to say, type with both hands? LOL!

otherwise, we're doing well with the continum concept (ok, he is in the car seat, but i sit next to him and touch him while he's there), and overall, it's not too bad to care for him.

what i do not care for, though, is ryan complaining about the difficulty when, in fact, he's not actually feeding, diapering, waking every 3rd hr, etc etc etc all day and night. he's mostly having to do more housework than he had to do i the past, and he also is the diaper washer. LOL

anyway, it's going very well. ILs are coming today. it's Opie's 92nd or 93rd birthday. she's officially diagnosed with dementia, now. i'm really upset.


----------



## katt

Option 2... my vote.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
sleep is tough though. and ryan complains even though i'm the one up doing the feeding and the night diaper now. i turn on a dim light...thats why he fusses about not enough sleep! silly man!

we stopped needing light at about 6 weeks. so perhaps he can be reassured that it won't be this way forever?


----------



## witchygrrl

lately, rhea has only one diaper change in the night, if that, even if she's eaten tons. first thing in the morning, that's when we go through a few. interesting. we want to look into starting EC, but we want to wait until she's holding her head on her own regularly.

thanks for the comments on housecleaning. i'm really not a neat freak--it was just getting to be really skanky and i couldn't deal. Dh is usually a zombie when he comes home, but at least he's not complaining that i can't get enough done duning the day as he sees how rhea and i operate on the weekends. but anyway, i feel better about things now.

Snozz, I like the New Native now that Rhea's big enough...before she'd lie deep in the pouch unless we folded up a blanket in there first. DH likes wearing her, though he prefers the Ergo. DH's outfit for the wedding is a Robin Hood getup, so we wanted one in brown to coordinate with his green and brown.


----------



## accountclosed3

for the most part, i don't need the light for nursing, but i do check the diaper. and it's strange, he didn't have a wet diaper last night, but this morning's was very wet, and he had two in succession.

also, feeding yesterday was wild, but last night had me a little excitable. LOL! he fed from 8:35 until 9;35 and then passed out until 1:45. UHM--that's 5 hrs between feedings folks! i was freaked! he slept for 4 of those hours, and then when he finished feeding around 2:45, he slept again until 6:45! That's 4 hrs!

and i was freaking out, because i'd wake at the 3rd hr, but he wouldn't budge from sleep to eat (he was breathing and doing "tai chi!"--that's what we call when he has those startle reflex thingies). but, i figured that if he was breathing and all of that, all was well.

but i'm calling the LC today just to check. chances are, he'll be completely different tonight, though his feedings do seem to be spreading out. which bodes well for yoga teaching. LOL

speaking of, i start back this sunday. woohoo! i need to figure out how to babywear AND breastfeed. right now, he's in the stork-wrap (german) which we love though it's warm, and i keep him in that cross carry. they recommend kangaroo, but i no likely. i tried the cradle, and he no likey.

could have been doing both wrong though.

anyway, i can't figure out how to adjust the cross to get him to a nursing position, which would be totally fab while working since that is the plan.

luckily, one of the local ECers is also an avid baby-wearing advocate who seems to know everything about everything, so hopefully we'll get together and she can help me out a bit!

also, EC is going funny. I'm learning the signals, finally, for poop--though he doesn't poop which is also the same for gas (farting). i'm still using diapes, but i'm holding him over the diape and doing a signal sound now.

nursing signal is "click click click" with the tongue (settles him down if he doesn't get nipple fast enough), and poop signal is ush ush ush. i don't know why. i guess you just do what comes to you!

it's pretty fun anyway. and ryan was surprised by foamy poop. what a riot that was.

oh, and another victory. today, we got ryan to work on time. it was a test run--technically he's working from home for the next two weeks, but he needed to go into the office. he got up and did his normal routine, hawk's feeding was perfect timing to get ryan to the office on time.

we simply changed and bathed him before he awoke, and i got ready before he woke, and then we fed him and were out the door.

because he was only working at the office for a couple of hours, i wrapped hawk up and we went grocery shopping, then walked to the coffee shop (where i had iced tea cuz i was hot), and then walked back to the car to change the diaper (no concept of pee signals until after he's done), drove to the quaker meeting, and then fed him for an hour while making phone calls for work and family.

then ryan came out, and here we are at home--hawk napping in dad's arms while he (dad) eats lunch. i get to be online until lunch is over, wherein i will wrap the baby and do the housework, though we're heading toward another feeding soon!

at least, i htink so. LOL


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
also, feeding yesterday was wild, but last night had me a little excitable. LOL! he fed from 8:35 until 9;35 and then passed out until 1:45. UHM--that's 5 hrs between feedings folks! i was freaked! he slept for 4 of those hours, and then when he finished feeding around 2:45, he slept again until 6:45! That's 4 hrs!

and i was freaking out, because i'd wake at the 3rd hr, but he wouldn't budge from sleep to eat (he was breathing and doing "tai chi!"--that's what we call when he has those startle reflex thingies). but, i figured that if he was breathing and all of that, all was well.

but i'm calling the LC today just to check. chances are, he'll be completely different tonight, though his feedings do seem to be spreading out. which bodes well for yoga teaching. LOL

Fenton slept like this (and longer - all night sometimes) when he was newborn. Oh, how it pains me to remember those times







. Anyway, I had similar concerns and had our MW come out and weigh him and it confirmed that he was gaining weight. That, with your intuition that he's lively and thrivey......it will become clear whether you need to encourage him more at night or not. If all is good though, I say "Enjoy the sleep mama!"









I have a secret that I'm dying to share, but my sister swore me to secrecy...............







:







:


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I have a secret that I'm dying to share, but my sister swore me to secrecy...............







:







:

hmmmm...I have a couple of guesses







but I'll keep them to myself.

I saw my college roommate yesterday..she's due with her 1st on Thursday, but I do worry about her birth. Maybe I shouldn't because she doesn't dig the idea of natural childbirth (or bf'ing for that matter. sigh). She's scheduled for an induction next Friday if the baby doesn't come, and says she's signed up for the epidural as it was "good enough for her doctor when she had her baby." And formula was "good enough for us when we were babies," so it'll be okay, but she'll "try breastfeeding".

Oy vey. I think I could tell her otherwise until I was blue in the face, and it wouldn't matter. I've never thought of her as "mom" material. I hpe she proves me wrong.


----------



## PiePie

do you think my kid is sleep deprived? so i am reading _ncss for toddlers/preschoolers_. it says 12 mos should be getting 13.5 hours a day. she gets 10 at night and 2 for nap. btw we are i think consolidated into a snigle nap. so she shows no signs of overtiredness (the books lists) except for conking out on pub transit, but then it is only at her naptime. dh says no worries. still i feel guilty that i keep her up late so i can play with her despite woh and perhaps i am ruining her brain. by the way i had a huge anxiety reaction to reading about nightweaning. i guess i am nowhere near ready!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
do you think my kid is sleep deprived? so i am reading _ncss for toddlers/preschoolers_. it says 12 mos should be getting 13.5 hours a day. she gets 10 at night and 2 for nap. btw we are i think consolidated into a snigle nap. so she shows no signs of overtiredness (the books lists) except for conking out on pub transit, but then it is only at her naptime. dh says no worries. still i feel guilty that i keep her up late so i can play with her despite woh and perhaps i am ruining her brain. by the way i had a huge anxiety reaction to reading about nightweaning. i guess i am nowhere near ready!

I was surprised that Pantley gave such concrete numbers for sleep amount, given that there isn't anything else I've seen concreteness work for with kids. I think you'd know if she was sleep deprived. Pantley gave me second thoughts on whether I was keeping Fenton up too late because he has her signs of being "overtired" by bedtimes, but my xperiments have shown I was right, that he's not ready for bed earlier than 9. But I'm with ya, those charts of hers gave me fits for a spell


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Fenton slept like this (and longer - all night sometimes) when he was newborn. Oh, how it pains me to remember those times







. Anyway, I had similar concerns and had our MW come out and weigh him and it confirmed that he was gaining weight. That, with your intuition that he's lively and thrivey......it will become clear whether you need to encourage him more at night or not. If all is good though, I say "Enjoy the sleep mama!"










I have a secret that I'm dying to share, but my sister swore me to secrecy...............







:







:

This was us too. Josephine slept 6 hours at a stretch early on...then 8 hours starting at about two months. I was freaking out, but she was gaining and thriving _very_ well. (and plenty of wet/soiled diapers...) Now I'm not so sure how often she nurses. She did start night-nursing more often around 4 months, and I think she started to become more sensitive to noises around the same time - whenever DH and I came to bed, she'd wake for a nursing then.

So exciting about your sister Shanna!
















I still haven't been able to nurse in a carrier.







One of these days we'll find the position that's right for us. I hope you have an easier time of it, zoebird. Is the cross-carry that you are doing on the back?









RE: the sleep chart - I was surprised when I saw one (I think maybe in Sears?) that showed that sleep needs change very little from birth to age 5. (Just duration of waking times that change, i guess.) But no, don't think L is sleep deprived. You'd know.


----------



## cking

Oh and thanks everyone for sharing your experiences on nursing frequency/durations. Josephine has always been nursing every two hours and only stays latched on for 10 minutes, now 5 minutes at each breast (except of course during naps or nighttime - then she can stay on for an hour or two.) She is just now starting to increase it to about every 3 hours. It's good to know that it really is very individualized.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna!* You tricked me. I saw your facebook status last night and remembered that the last time you were 'dying to share the secret' it was great news about YOU!!! Still, lovely news!

Does anyone read the SimpleMom blog? DP (who is a disorganised, clutter-bug) has been reading for a while. Anyway, her latest post is about twaddle free books for pre-schoolers and I thought there might be a few interested women here. It's a pretty nice looking blog to play on too. But I can't believe that anyone could be that organised!!!!


----------



## Maela

MMM, thanks for the recommendation. I have been reading lots of "mom" blogs lately.

I think I might be crazy, but Dh and I are seriously considering "not preventing" for the next two months. There's a very good chance that nothing would happen since no AF yet. I have no idea why, but I just got the desire today to stop trying to not get pg. I don't know.... this could be a very bad idea.... Dh has always been fine with TTC again whenever I'm ready, so we're just waiting on me to be ready.
There's a specific time frame that I would like to have all our babies in if at all possible (Apr - Aug) so that's why it would only be for two months.


----------



## snozzberry

omg Maela!!!























MMM, thanks for that blog link!

Shanna, yay for your sis!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Horrible night last night







I was watching the muppets this mornin at 4 am. And was still watching at 5:30.














He's showing every sign of teething except swollen gums. Starting to feel gaslighted, I might eliminate dairy for a few days just to reassure myself.....

Hey, I'm getting rid of my Patapum because Fenton has outgrown it. Give me a holler if you might want it.


----------



## Maela

Okay, I think I've changed my mind.














I was nursing dd to sleep last night and thinking about how much she still nurses. I don't know if I can stand it if my nipples are so sore like they were last time.







If I wait another year before TTC, she'll be nursing a lot less, and if I just can't stand it, I won't feel so bad about slowly decreasing her nursing times. Right now though I feel like that would be devastating for her. One of the biggest reasons i wanted to wait for two years before TTCing, is because I'm not sure that I want to tandem nurse. And it wouldn't be fair to (IMO) force weaning before two.

I can dream...









Really though, how likely is it that I would get pg? We're getting kind of tired of the condoms.







I've had so much CM since Dd was about 3 mo. I've felt like AF could come any time now for the last year. I need to get a new battery for my thermometer...

Shanna, I'm sorry about your night. Dd is also having all the signs of teething, but no sign of it on the gums.







: I don't know what's going on.

Also, I have a question for you mamas of toddlers. Does your babe have a temper? Dd certainly does and she's gotten really aggressive lately. When she doesn't get what she wants or when I have to take something away, she will say "Ow!" and try to scratch or bite us over and over.







It's actually kind of cute; I have to keep myself from smiling/laughing, but I'm a little worried that she's already learned this. We have never hit/hurt her. And she's only with gparents; they don't hit. I don't think she's seeing it on TV.


----------



## witchygrrl

Sigh. A position in my field is opening up next fall at Wellesley College, but I'm not even close to finishing my degree so I don't qualify yet. And I'm on leave anyway. Why couldn't this be a few years from now?

New worry--Rhea smiles, but not very often...like she reserves them or something. how can I encourage her more than I do? I smile at her, I coo at her...


----------



## PiePie

*heather*, dd didn't smile till 6 weeks, way later that other babes in my ddc, now she is the picture of ecstacy, and, according to her dcp, the happiest baby they've ever seen. and they have 5, 5, and 40 yrs of experience to go by.







i didn't do anything to encourage it, i think it came about when she was able to sit/crawl and therefore feel more empowered.

i am in work hell.


----------



## PiePie

so i found _ncss_ to be pretty blah. not overwhelmingly offensive -- lots of great photos of cosleeping -- but not really where we're at.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
so i found _ncss_ to be pretty blah. not overwhelmingly offensive -- lots of great photos of cosleeping -- but not really where we're at.

Hmm...I wonder if I should even bother reading it? It was next on my list.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Hmm...I wonder if I should even bother reading it? It was next on my list.

I thought it had a lot of ideas, but somehow I haven't gotten around to trying many of them. They're pretty-labor intensive and decisive, so I think things have to be pretty bad.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I thought it had a lot of ideas, but somehow I haven't gotten around to trying many of them. They're pretty-labor intensive and decisive, so I think things have to be pretty bad.

Aaahh. Well, Dd keeps chaning her mind about whether or not she wants to stay up late at night or go to bed on time. Either way she usually wakes up at about the same time. If she stayed up late the night before, she's grumpy in the morning. If she didn't, she's a happy camper. So maybe I'll read the book anyway, just incase this gets worse.

Tonight was a good night. She went to sleep at 8:30PM.


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
New worry--Rhea smiles, but not very often...like she reserves them or something. how can I encourage her more than I do? I smile at her, I coo at her...

No worry! Abby was reserved at first too. It doesn't help when you have other mamas saying stuff like "oh, my baby smiles ALL the time!" Grr.

But now Abby is a happy little monkey all the time!

*PiePie,* I'm sorry about work.


----------



## witchygrrl

got 3 grins this morning! I guess the "normal" time for smiles is 6 weeks, and she's going on 7. she was just so ahead with her strong neck that I figured she'd be ahead on this too. I hear you, PiePie, on the idea of feeling empowered. Rhea seems so frustrated by not being able to move like Mommy and Daddy.


----------



## snozzberry

*Maela,* have you tried baby signs with Maev? In theory at least, it seems like that might help with her feeling frustrated enough to throw a tantrum, i.e. if she can use words to communicate her emotions.

Not even sure if that makes sense, but the thought popped into my head this morning so I wanted to share it!


----------



## PiePie

going to start a sing and sign class with dd per kelly's theory.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Maela,* have you tried baby signs with Maev? In theory at least, it seems like that might help with her feeling frustrated enough to throw a tantrum, i.e. if she can use words to communicate her emotions.

Not even sure if that makes sense, but the thought popped into my head this morning so I wanted to share it!

She uses signs for "more", "allgone/all done" and "nurse" and she says "ooooh" for open. I usually know what she wants, it's jsut that she can't have it at the moment because I need it or it's dangerous, etc. Like the other day we were getting into the car to go home and she had my keys. I needed them, so I was just going to take the car key off and give her the rest back. I was taking them gently and trying to tell her what I was going to do (not that she definitely would understand...) and she grabbed my hands and was scratching them saying "ow!"

Maybe teaching her the sign for "mad" so she can at least let me know in a positive way? I think I need to give her something constructive to do when she's mad.


----------



## accountclosed3

_carrying_: i'm using the front cross carry where hawk's on my chest. there is a way to shimmy the kid down to the breast, but it requires loosening the knot to do so. the concern i have with that is that he'll signal to nurse, and if i don't respond in about 20 seconds, he goes into full screaming mode. and, it takes more than 20 seconds to shimmy him around to the right position.

so, for the teacher training this weekend, we're going to be mellow about it all. i'll have the wrap, but unwrap him and have a seat--while continuing to teach--and nurse him. everyone at that class is pretty liberal.

but, i'm concerned about how to do things for the regular classes that i want to teach--and since he doesn't ahve a real nursing pattern yet or now or whatever. . .i'm a bit nervous about it. i want to start work in Oct--i do miss working.

_body stuff_: body is really starting to feel better. i think i pushed a bit much with my anus while giving birth--it hurts to go! silly me! i still have some loose skin and sub-cutaneous fat, but i'm back in pre-preggo clothing pretty nicely. and, i'm up to two miles of walking per day right now--the pace is slow, but it's good to be out and about. and of course, i'm baby wearing then. next week, i'm going to add in a bit more work to help remove the rest of the weight. though admittedly, every day i seem a bit thinner/leaner than before. breastfeeding works.

_breastfeeding_: hawk's been funny. ok, last night was nice. it was 4.5 hrs between feedings. we had a feeding at 9:30 and then again at 2, and then again at 6:30--which was perfect for our morning routine. but today, he's been on the breast more than he's been off. he took two "naps"--one while i was walking (that's about an hour) and one this afternoon (i napped also)--but otherwise he's either been on the breast or having his diaper changed. he hates having a wet/dirty diaper, but he also hates being changed. which brings us to. . .

_ECing_: so, he doesn't have clear signals. i'm considering just doing a nakie day to see if he does have signals that i'm missing, but normally he's either in his marathon nursing session and just goes whenever during said session, or he's asleep. he wakes up and goes "meep" when he has a wet diaper--so we change it then--and poop is obvious because he's noisy when he goes.

if i can't figure signals, then another suggestion from another ECer was to simply offer him the potty throughout the day when he usually goes. for example, he usually poos morning and evening (not day or night), and he pees pretty much about 30 minutes after each nursing--assuming he stops nursing. it seems strange to wake him to pee though. . .so who knows?

anyway, now that nursing is going well (i assume), we can move onto ECing.

Also, we weighed him today and he's just aroud 8 lbs. he was wiggling a lot, and it was at least 8 lbs, if not more. so, he's definitely getting enough milk between wet diapes and gaining weight.

i suppose he wants to nurse again now. ryan can't seem to settle him.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
_carrying_: i'm using the front cross carry where hawk's on my chest. there is a way to shimmy the kid down to the breast, but it requires loosening the knot to do so. the concern i have with that is that he'll signal to nurse, and if i don't respond in about 20 seconds, he goes into full screaming mode. and, it takes more than 20 seconds to shimmy him around to the right position.

so, for the teacher training this weekend, we're going to be mellow about it all. i'll have the wrap, but unwrap him and have a seat--while continuing to teach--and nurse him. everyone at that class is pretty liberal.

but, i'm concerned about how to do things for the regular classes that i want to teach--and since he doesn't ahve a real nursing pattern yet or now or whatever. . .i'm a bit nervous about it. i want to start work in Oct--i do miss working.

_body stuff_: body is really starting to feel better. i think i pushed a bit much with my anus while giving birth--it hurts to go! silly me! i still have some loose skin and sub-cutaneous fat, but i'm back in pre-preggo clothing pretty nicely. and, i'm up to two miles of walking per day right now--the pace is slow, but it's good to be out and about. and of course, i'm baby wearing then. next week, i'm going to add in a bit more work to help remove the rest of the weight. though admittedly, every day i seem a bit thinner/leaner than before. breastfeeding works.

_breastfeeding_: hawk's been funny. ok, last night was nice. it was 4.5 hrs between feedings. we had a feeding at 9:30 and then again at 2, and then again at 6:30--which was perfect for our morning routine. but today, he's been on the breast more than he's been off. he took two "naps"--one while i was walking (that's about an hour) and one this afternoon (i napped also)--but otherwise he's either been on the breast or having his diaper changed. he hates having a wet/dirty diaper, but he also hates being changed. which brings us to. . .

_ECing_: so, he doesn't have clear signals. i'm considering just doing a nakie day to see if he does have signals that i'm missing, but normally he's either in his marathon nursing session and just goes whenever during said session, or he's asleep. he wakes up and goes "meep" when he has a wet diaper--so we change it then--and poop is obvious because he's noisy when he goes.

if i can't figure signals, then another suggestion from another ECer was to simply offer him the potty throughout the day when he usually goes. for example, he usually poos morning and evening (not day or night), and he pees pretty much about 30 minutes after each nursing--assuming he stops nursing. it seems strange to wake him to pee though. . .so who knows?

anyway, now that nursing is going well (i assume), we can move onto ECing.

Also, we weighed him today and he's just aroud 8 lbs. he was wiggling a lot, and it was at least 8 lbs, if not more. so, he's definitely getting enough milk between wet diapes and gaining weight.

i suppose he wants to nurse again now. ryan can't seem to settle him.

Glad to hear things are going so well! I don't really have any advice for the bfing while babywearing; I couldn't really ever do it.







Maybe Hawk is going through a growth spurt, and that is why he's nursing so much?

I still haven't figured out Dd's signals for peeing. Poop, I can definitely tell, unless I'm not paying attention.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I got a good night's sleep last night! Hurray!







:

I'm trying to remember the name of a cookbook that we were talking bout here, something to do with moon and harvest? Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I ran into it at a Nourishing Traditions conference this weekend and vowed to see if my library has it....and now I can't remember what it's called. I just scored both Susun Weed books on paperbackswap. I heart that site







:

I miss you ladies, I've just been lurking away. Fenton is keeping me running, but he's such a joy. He's a little chatterbox these days - DH and I have counted that he's saying more than 70 words - he'll pretty much repeat anything you say, but it's amazing to me when I see him put a word into context that I didnt' know he knew. He's still almost exclusively breast fed though, despite my attempts to make solids more attractive. He's been "helping" me with gardening and preservation. And today he "helped" me by dropping Harry Potter audio disc 17 from the library.....down between the cracks in the patio. It will be a miracle if I get it out again. He's also interested in and asking to use the potty, though every time I set him on it, he gets scared and tries to climb back up me. He's pretty reliable when he tells me he needs a dipe change because he "pooped". It's so cool to see the ways he's excited about the world







:

MMM, how are you feeling? Is MMM our remaining pg mama? Am I forgetting anyone?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

MMM, how are you feeling? Is MMM our remaining pg mama? Am I forgetting anyone?

Still not loving every minute though this week has been better than last. I just want sleep and some reflux respite. I thought I had it nailed by upping my protein and cutting out most carbs and white everything but after 5 days of relative success, it's all back with a vengeance. I think it's got everything to do with Squeaks position and only a little to do with my diet.

My hip is better though so I can move and I'm happy to be swimming and walking and yoga-ing as much as possible.

I'm flying out this afternoon to visit my best friend. It's only an hours flight but summer has come early where she is (central coast, new south wales) and it's going to be a perfect weekend - 31 degrees celcius! (~87f.) I'm so excited - I'm going to swim in the ocean!

I think I am the last preggo though I suspect that there's a lurker or 2 here that may be getting close to TTC.


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, I hear you on the reflux. That was the worst part for me. I was getting ready to buy stock in Tums, the only thing that gave me relief, and even that got piddling toward the end. But you're just about in the 3rd trimester! Hooray!







:

The great-grandmas are getting antsy that they haven't met Rhea yet. But it's not exactly a short trip to NJ (4-5 hours without stops), and no one seems to realize that as a schoolteacher, especially one that early in his career, he can't just take days off to make long weekends whenever he wants. They're a bit too infirm to make the trip to us, and our only long weekend comig up is the weekend of the wedding we're in, so...guess they're going to have to wait.

*zoe*, I'm impressed about the nursing while wearing. My upstairs neighbor does that all the time, too.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm trying to remember the name of a cookbook that we were talking bout here, something to do with moon and harvest? Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I ran into it at a Nourishing Traditions conference this weekend and vowed to see if my library has it....and now I can't remember what it's called. I just scored both Susun Weed books on paperbackswap. I heart that site







:

Don't remember discussing it here, but I think you might be talking about Full Moon Feast.

http://www.wisefoodways.com/moons/

I have it and I love it.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
*MMM*, I hear you on the reflux. That was the worst part for me. I was getting ready to buy stock in Tums, the only thing that gave me relief, and even that got piddling toward the end.

If only I could, I would. Those things all make it worse for me. They tend just to redivert the indigestion to somewhere even more painful (like down my back).
But you're right. Yay







: third trimester. Only 12 weeks to go (i'm planning on a timely baby! no one burst my bubble!!!). 8 weeks left of work. Good things are coming!!!

Oh...and I forgot to mention before...we have FINALLY found the most wonderful doula. It's been no mean feat - NOBODY wants to work in December. But Ingrid is clearly meant to be because she's exactly what we were looking for and when we initially approached her, she wasn't available...then her December clients had their due date reviewed so we got the spot!!! And she does AMAZING pregnancy massage...none of this meek rubbing business - REAL massage. And she's cheaper than most of the other local doulas - which was not a consideration at all but is a very happy bonus.


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM*, 12 weeks yay!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maybe teaching her the sign for "mad" so she can at least let me know in a positive way? I think I need to give her something constructive to do when she's mad.

I could be talking out of my butt here







but I think that's the idea about signs helping prevent some tantrums. Because if they can use words to express their emotions, they don't always feel the need to act out in other physical ways. I would be curious to hear if you try it and it has any noticeable impact. I'm currently reading Baby Signs so I'll let you know if I come across any pertinent parts.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
going to start a sing and sign class with dd per kelly's theory.

Ooh, that sounds fun! I will definitely keep an eye out for something like that in my area.









*zoebird*, I am so happy everything's going so well for you! You have a great attitude about things, so I shouldn't have expected anything less.









I was with a group of moms this weekend--their kids were all around 2/3, and they were complaining about how the terrible 2s don't end at 3. And I thought about how I sometimes think "if she could just start taking longer naps, everything would be great" or "I can't wait til she's more mobile and I don't have to carry her every.dang.place." But that's not how it works. When you're constantly looking forward to the next thing to bring you happiness/contentedness, you'll never get there. So I'm trying to live more "in the moment" and find joy in what I have right now. Like I know I'm going to regret wishing for the crawling to come!!!









Anyway, seeing you navigate thru the early days of motherhood is a good reminder to myself to have a positive attitude.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
_ECing_: so, he doesn't have clear signals. i'm considering just doing a nakie day to see if he does have signals that i'm missing, but normally he's either in his marathon nursing session and just goes whenever during said session, or he's asleep. he wakes up and goes "meep" when he has a wet diaper--so we change it then--and poop is obvious because he's noisy when he goes.

if i can't figure signals, then another suggestion from another ECer was to simply offer him the potty throughout the day when he usually goes. for example, he usually poos morning and evening (not day or night), and he pees pretty much about 30 minutes after each nursing--assuming he stops nursing. it seems strange to wake him to pee though. . .so who knows?

The way we learned Abby's signals is to undo her diaper after a feeding and right after she woke up, then watch like a hawk (heh) until she went.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I got a good night's sleep last night! Hurray!







:

Congrats!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
He's a little chatterbox these days - DH and I have counted that he's saying more than 70 words - he'll pretty much repeat anything you say, but it's amazing to me when I see him put a word into context that I didnt' know he knew.

That's SO COOL!!!









*Crawling:* Abby's 7 months old today and not really showing any imminent signs of crawling. She gets up on all fours (torso up) for a few seconds but then plops back down. She's not doing the rocking thing people talk about, or if she is I'm misunderstanding what that looks like.

I'm worried we're not giving her enough opportunity to practice crawling though. We rarely put her on the floor because it's hardwood and invariably has oodles of pet fur on it. She spends a lot of time in the bed rolling and pushing herself up, etc.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista* my love, have you tried chewable papaya enzyme tablets for the reflux? my mw recommended. i bought but never used because my reflux wasn't that bad.


----------



## PiePie

my trial -- in the literal and existential sense -- is over so my workload has gone from extreme to luxurious. going to take some time off to bond with the babe.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
my trial -- in the literal and existential sense -- is over so my workload has gone from extreme to luxurious. going to take some time off to bond with the babe.









: Yay! Enjoy those precious snuggles.

Warning :: Spoiler Ahead! Highlight to read message!

How did the trial end up? Do I even want to ask?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
I could be talking out of my butt here







but I think that's the idea about signs helping prevent some tantrums. Because if they can use words to express their emotions, they don't always feel the need to act out in other physical ways. I would be curious to hear if you try it and it has any noticeable impact. I'm currently reading Baby Signs so I'll let you know if I come across any pertinent parts.

I thought about how I sometimes think "if she could just start taking longer naps, everything would be great" or "I can't wait til she's more mobile and I don't have to carry her every.dang.place." But that's not how it works. When you're constantly looking forward to the next thing to bring you happiness/contentedness, you'll never get there. So I'm trying to live more "in the moment" and find joy in what I have right now. Like I know I'm going to regret wishing for the crawling to come!!!









Thanks for the advice. my signing book doesn't include mad/angry oddly enough. I'll look it up online, I guess.

And I am guilty of not living in the moment too. I am always looking forward to the next thing - not just in parenting - in every aspect of my life.







I'm working on it. I just get so much happiness from planning and dreaming that I forget to enjoy the good times of the present.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*mujerista* my love, have you tried chewable papaya enzyme tablets for the reflux? my mw recommended. i bought but never used because my reflux wasn't that bad.

Oh...I'm in a country town now...but I am gonna search high and low! Surely there's a health food shop somewhere, right??!!
Thank you for the rec. I'll try anything!

Yay for time off with the babe. Hope the trauma of the last few weeks slips away quickly.


----------



## TinyFrog

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I think I am the last preggo though I suspect that there's a lurker or 2 here that may be getting close to TTC.










Ooo, really, who? Come out, come out wherever you are.







Not me, my time has not come yet.









Piepie - if you have time it would be neat if you could join Facebook and post a couple of pictures. I don't think I ever saw any pictures of Lorelie .







:


----------



## Holiztic

So I thought I'd pop in and give the updates on Quinn and I, as I've been pretty MIA the last, oh, 17 months. So...

Quinn is 17 months old, he's huge, about 30 pounds and 35 inches. He wears 2T clothes and size 7-8 shoes. He understands a ton of words and concepts and speaks a few dozen words (or attempts to). He gives hugs and kisses (real ones, finally!) and is just starting to run (well, walk fast and kinda trip along).

I am pretty good, just had a tooth pulled (my second, both in just over a year's time). I went most of my childhood and teen years borderline malnourished and and then went dentist-free from 22-28, so despite my VERY clean/healthy lifestyle the last few years, I had 2 teeth that were too far gone, and not believing in the safety of root canals, bye bye teeth







:

Quinn is still nursing about 5 times a day and a million times a night. I have yet to even come close to seeing AF. If that is still the case in April (Quinn's 2nd bday) there will have to be some weaning (at least night time). I hope to have another baby (as in born) around his 3rd birthday.

We are still in our little condo (well, it's 1000 sq feet, so not so little). Just had granite counters and new cabinets put in (DH did the cabinets). This place is looking so nice (and the economy the way it is) we are refinancing our ARM and think we'll stay a few more years. I really am feeling so strongly the whole "less is more" thing lately. I think it is good for the soul to not have too much, too big, etc. We have a higher household income than just about anyone we know (well) and yet we have the smallest house. I love it









I've been lurking at how all the little ones are doing, smiling, almost crawling, soon to be going to weddings, so exciting! I love thinking back to Quinn's early months when I read about Josephine, Hawk, Rhea, Abby...

uh oh, time for night nursing #2...

Elizabeth


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 
Piepie - if you have time it would be neat if you could join Facebook and post a couple of pictures. I don't think I ever saw any pictures of Lorelie .







:

I was thinking this too!


----------



## katt

I joined Facebook but never found you guys... help a gal out


----------



## PiePie

fb comin' up

dd got dx'd as anemic! dr alan greene's website indicates that false positive tests may come up if a kid is getting over a viral infection, and she did have a sniffly cold earlier in the week. our new (yes, 3rd!) ped is an extended bf'er herself but i did get the impression that she thought that bm is taking up tummy space for what she considers to be more nutrient rich foods? i am surprised by the test result because she is a total carnivore, could eat chicken 3 times a day if we served it. what would you add to her diet if you were me? anything is possible except for nuts -- no nut products till age 3 -- i have family history of allergies...


----------



## snozzberry

*Elizabeth*, it's so great to get an update on you and Quinn!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
We are still in our little condo (well, it's 1000 sq feet, so not so little). Just had granite counters and new cabinets put in (DH did the cabinets). This place is looking so nice (and the economy the way it is) we are refinancing our ARM and think we'll stay a few more years. I really am feeling so strongly the whole "less is more" thing lately. I think it is good for the soul to not have too much, too big, etc. We have a higher household income than just about anyone we know (well) and yet we have the smallest house. I love it









I'm totally on the same page on this front! We moved to a house that's half the size of our first house, and we love it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 
Ooo, really, who? Come out, come out wherever you are.







Not me, my time has not come yet.









Yeah, 'fess up!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
my trial -- in the literal and existential sense -- is over so my workload has gone from extreme to luxurious. going to take some time off to bond with the babe.

*PiePie*, whew. I'm glad you get to take some time off!

I'm sorry about L's anemia dx! Maybe it's a fluke?


----------



## arelyn

piepie: Try chickpeas! Kai simply adores them (of course he eats all sorts of weird things most American adults can't stomach but it's worth a shot).


----------



## cking

Oh, it's so hard to keep up with the posts I meant to write.







:

Holiztic, it's good to hear from you. Thanks for sharing your update.

Smiles - same here. It was hard to get a good picture of her smiling until about 2 months, and it wasn't really regular until about 3 months. Now it's nonstop.









we went to our first Music Together class today - what fun! Most of the babies are around the same age as Josephine, and she loved watching them and listening to the music.









Kelly, about crawling. I don't have experience yet, obviously, but I wouldn't worry about it. I was watching a bunch of the other babies today - the oldest was about a month older than J - and they are all in different places. One girl was already getting up on her knees (J doesn't do that) and another was standing pretty well - which J doesn't do either - but her mama said that she isn't sitting yet though. I really think there are so many changes and new skills in the 6-9 month time that every baby tackles them in a different order.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict*
Ooo, really, who? Come out, come out wherever you are. Not me, my time has not come yet.









I thought of you too!

Shanna, wow, 70 words! Amazing! I love reading updates on Fenton and Quinn and thinking about where we'll be in a year. (But still trying to live in the moment too!)

Piepie, FB FB FB! Already! Actually, I peeked at some of your DH's pics - and the spaghetti video! How cute!







She is getting so big!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Glad to hear things are going so well! I don't really have any advice for the bfing while babywearing; I couldn't really ever do it.







Maybe Hawk is going through a growth spurt, and that is why he's nursing so much?

I still haven't figured out Dd's signals for peeing. Poop, I can definitely tell, unless I'm not paying attention.

Same here though twice now Kai's gone "Uh-oh!" and ran toward the bathroom. He's actually quite happy to pee on the floor (puddles = fun) so I just take him whenever I think of it or DH thinks of it and we catch a lot of them that way. When Kai was Hawk's age we did a lot of nursing with his bum hanging over a BB little potty. He always went while nursing until he was...I don't remember...four or five months.

Today we got out to the Mennonite farm near us and picked raspberries and yellow cherry tomatoes.







I wish there was someway to preserve the taste of these little tomatoes. They're awsome!! With any luck we won't get the killing frost that should be coming though tonight (I doubt it though, I'm







: ). I'm not preserving nearly as much as I should. It's so hard to find time with a little guy trying so hard to help out. Any ideas?

Oh, I was going to sign off but Mike just got the coolest deal. He's now teaching trumpet lessons to the son of our organic dairy farmer! In return he get's a box of food. It's a sweet deal but I was shocked to see how much stuff they're putting in that box. We now get 2 gallons of milk, 2 dozen eggs and a hunk of beef for Mike. What are we going to do with all those eggs?


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
piepie: Try chickpeas! Kai simply adores them (of course he eats all sorts of weird things most American adults can't stomach but it's worth a shot).

Mmm, hummus....

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
we went to our first Music Together class today - what fun! Most of the babies are around the same age as Josephine, and she loved watching them and listening to the music.









Kelly, about crawling. I don't have experience yet, obviously, but I wouldn't worry about it. I was watching a bunch of the other babies today - the oldest was about a month older than J - and they are all in different places. One girl was already getting up on her knees (J doesn't do that) and another was standing pretty well - which J doesn't do either - but her mama said that she isn't sitting yet though. I really think there are so many changes and new skills in the 6-9 month time that every baby tackles them in a different order.

Those are good reminders, thank you!!!









I want to take Abby to something regular...I'll have to check out Music Together!


----------



## witchygrrl

PiePie, is Lorelei getting any foods with VitC? It makes iron more bioavailable, especially if eaten at the same time with iron rich foods...

I'm friends with PiePie's dh on FB, btw...I'll see if I can find more of ya...


----------



## snozzberry

I just requested Katt as a friend so watch for an update about me adding her so you can add her too!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
I joined Facebook but never found you guys... help a gal out

PMing you.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
fb comin' up

dd got dx'd as anemic! dr alan greene's website indicates that false positive tests may come up if a kid is getting over a viral infection, and she did have a sniffly cold earlier in the week. our new (yes, 3rd!) ped is an extended bf'er herself but i did get the impression that she thought that bm is taking up tummy space for what she considers to be more nutrient rich foods? i am surprised by the test result because she is a total carnivore, could eat chicken 3 times a day if we served it. what would you add to her diet if you were me? anything is possible except for nuts -- no nut products till age 3 -- i have family history of allergies...

I only have sec, so bug me if none of this makes sense, but:
Does she do any dairy? If so, I'd make sure it's raw. Pasteurized can rob body of iron. Also, i have a lot of (adult) friends who had great luck using cast iron to cook in to help with anemia.

Hope to be back soon, lots of interesting chatter


----------



## accountclosed3

so, we've started ECing. when we change his diaper, he gets fussy. now he's fussy when we EC.

it's tough, then, to want to EC. sometimes, he'll go while sleeping and keep on sleeping--i hate to wake him to change him. the signal, of course, while sleeping is waking a bit with some "meep" noises right before he goes. so, if i get him out of diaper and EC, it's a great catch (we're getting about 50% of everything right now), but it causes upset! he cries for quite a bit.

i'm not sure what this is about or how to settle him quickly, with the exception of putting him back on the breast--which is no problem really. i mean, he likes to be there and i do not mind so much.

ryan started singing songs to him today. it was so cute because he quieted down really quickly (hawk, that is), but it didn't work the second, third or forth time. LOL

today, though, was a big day out for us. so nice--we felt normal. First, we got up and had "big breakfast" while hawk actually slept so i got to eat without holding/nursing someone. nice.









then, we went to valley forge park and did about 2.5-3 mile hike. no clue how far it really was. we nursed and ECed him out there, half way through.

next, we went to lunch at our favorite mexican place--wherein Hawk slept.

we then went to our local farm to get produce, and Hawk needed another go and nurse. so we sat between the flowers and the pigs and enjoyed a nice shady nurse-in for about 1 hr and 15 minutes.

we came home then, ECed him again, nursed him again, watched The Waterhorse (which a friend of mine worked on as a set painter--but isn't in the credits sadly). it is a sweet little movie--well worth the net flix time.









then, another EC. woohoo! i've only changed the diaper twice today! it's working! it's working!

i suppose since Hawk is still crying after the stair climbing and the song, i should probably nurse him again to see if he settles.

i think he likes the comfort of it.

oh, and my MIL is really upset with me because the last two times they visited, she didn't get to hold the baby. the first time was because we were learning to nurse and he seemed to want to quite a bit and i went upstairs to do it because my FIL was ticking me off--making fun of the baby calling him a "silly bobble head." he thought it was funny, i didn't take kindly.

so, i just said--oh, heneeds to nruse--and we spent most of the time up here nursing.

the second time, he was just fussy and wouldn't be with anyone else. as soon as i would hand him off, he would start screaming. he wanted to nurse a lot, so i nursed him a lot and would hold him in between.

ryan held him that day for about 15 minutes while i ate, and even cried then.

so, they're very upset with me and tried to convince me that i should give him a pacifier, let them feed him from a bottle if he really needs to eat that much, or simply "let go" enough so that he can "cry it out" and learn to be with other people.

to which my response is. . .well you can guess and it ain't delicate.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
piepie: Try chickpeas! Kai simply adores them (of course he eats all sorts of weird things most American adults can't stomach but it's worth a shot).


she







them in indian food...


----------



## PiePie

snozzberry said:


> Mmm, hummus....
> QUOTE]
> she
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this too. the only problem is that she rubs her eyes with it all over her hands.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
PiePie, is Lorelei getting any foods with VitC? It makes iron more bioavailable, especially if eaten at the same time with iron rich foods...

yes i read this in sears. was thinking of doing apple sauce with that fortified rice cereal but she is not into the rice cereal. or yogurt and crunchier iron fortified cereal and berries?? tried blackstrap molasses with it and she really did not take to it. intend to bake gingerbread cookies with it. all of the products made for toddlers by earths best with decent amts of iron also have decent amts of sugar.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
PiePie, is Lorelei getting any foods with VitC? It makes iron more bioavailable, especially if eaten at the same time with iron rich foods...

yes i read this in sears. was thinking of doing apple sauce with that fortified rice cereal but she is not into the rice cereal. or yogurt and crunchier iron fortified cereal and berries?? tried blackstrap molasses with it and she really did not take to it. intend to bake gingerbread cookies with it. all of the products made for toddlers by earths best with decent amts of iron also have decent amts of sugar. any other ideas of good combinations? she loves, and gets a lot of, tomato sauce with turkey meatballs (less into beef).


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Does she do any dairy? If so, I'd make sure it's raw. Pasteurized can rob body of iron.

she eats lots of cheese and quite a bit of yogurt, both cows and goats. she just started on cows milk a month ago but gets no more than 3 oz. a day, so i seriously doubt the milk itself is the culprit. i have read that milk straight up can be a problem for iron but only in seriously large quantities.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Does she do any dairy? If so, I'd make sure it's raw. Pasteurized can rob body of iron.

she eats lots of cheese and quite a bit of yogurt, both cows and goats. she just started on cows milk a month ago but gets no more than 3 oz. a day, so i seriously doubt the milk itself is the culprit. i have read that milk straight up can be a problem for iron but only in seriously large quantities.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
yes i read this in sears. was thinking of doing apple sauce with that fortified rice cereal but she is not into the rice cereal. or yogurt and crunchier iron fortified cereal and berries?? tried blackstrap molasses with it and she really did not take to it. intend to bake gingerbread cookies with it. all of the products made for toddlers by earths best with decent amts of iron also have decent amts of sugar. any other ideas of good combinations? she loves, and gets a lot of, tomato sauce with turkey meatballs (less into beef).

maybe you could make the gingerbread cookies with the molasses and apple sauce? I like replacing oil or eggs with apple sauce in baking...makes them really moist, lower in fat, and you get vitC in there too.

Has she tried spinach yet? Not sure if that is age appropriate, but...


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
so, they're very upset with me and tried to convince me that i should give him a pacifier, let them feed him from a bottle if he really needs to eat that much, or simply "let go" enough so that he can "cry it out" and learn to be with other people.

to which my response is. . .well you can guess and it ain't delicate.









Ugh. What a pain. They're so....special.

My ILs don't get why Rhea nurses so much. She likes to snack as opposed to having marathons now, so she does get hungry all of the time, despite my efforts to keep her on longer each time. They also don't get why I don't like her in a stroller--it's so great! She falls asleep so quickly! Um, thanks, I'd rather wear her.

Ok, quick question. How do you get baby in the car in the cold weather? Do you wrap DC up in a Moby or something, and then strap baby into the carseat? DH thinks we should bring the carseat inside, get her hooked up first, then bring her out to the car, pre-bundled. We don't have a garage, btw.


----------



## Maela

Dd







yogurt and hummus. And yes she makes a huge mess too PiePie. She likes to rub things in her hair and eyes.







Isn't it so fun to clean up?

Dd went to bed at 7:55PM tonight!







: After two nights of staying up after 11pm, that's really good! She had a bit of cold the last couple of weeks and I think she's finally feeling better.

We never had to worry too much about the cold and walking to the garage because we live in CA. I used to wrap her up in a blanket before leaving the house, and that was good enough. If you have an infant carseat that just clicks into the base, I would put her into the carseat in the house like your dh said. I could see that being a pain though if it's a britax boulevard or something like that though.

ETA: Holiztic, it was nice to hear from you! We are also happy with our small house. It's 1275 sq ft, but that's still considered small by many people around here. We have lots of Mcmansions in the area.


----------



## katt

we never took the carseat out, mainly cause we have a 2 door and we just couldn't strap the baby in the seat and then put the seat in, just wouldn't work.

SO... for cold weather we'd heat up a heat pack (rice) stick it in the car seat to warm it up for a few minutes. Put baby in the moby to get him to the car and then strap him in.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
DH thinks we should bring the carseat inside, get her hooked up first, then bring her out to the car, pre-bundled. We don't have a garage, btw.

we are car-free so i have very limited experience with this but it sounds dead wrong from a safety perspective. the biggest danger is an improperly installed carseat.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 

Has she tried spinach yet? Not sure if that is age appropriate, but...

oh she loves her spinach. we don't have it much at home, bc dh hates it and he does almost all the cooking. but we eat out a lot (being ny'ers) and i developed a huge craving for spinach while pregnant and it lasted, so she gets it from me. will have to up that. it is age appropriate. she can do pretty much anything cooked. raw veggies are still out.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Dd







yogurt and hummus. And yes she makes a huge mess too PiePie. She likes to rub things in her hair and eyes.







Isn't it so fun to clean up?

it ENGRAGES me. we are struggling with where to put the high chair. in the kitchen which means that if we eat with her we eat stadning up or leaning on the counter, or in the dining room/playroom, which means we get to eat the dining room table and feel like a family, but means that her food on the floor spreads uncontrollably when she plays (it'[s the playroom). dh wants to feel like a family, i want to avoid feeling out of control angry at her. for perfectly age-appropriate behavior. she signals she is done by doing the baby signs sign for all done -- like a ref signalling safe -- and swishing her food on the floor. she does this at daycare too. and in restaurants. charming. i have started watcing her closely and sometimes i can cathc her just in th enick of time. but oy. wwyd?


----------



## PiePie

so sad over the melamine in formula in china. up to 13K kids.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
so sad over the melamine in formula in china. up to 13K kids.

me too. it's awful


----------



## snozzberry

*PiePie*, I just remembered that nitrates in veggies like carrots, spinach, root veggies, etc, can be linked to anemia. Might be something to look into? Are you cooking your own for any of those?

*Ears:* How do you clean them? I know I'm not supposed to stick anything in there, but gosh they're dirty! I used a wet wipe and tried to get the gunk off the parts closest to the outside, but then her ear got all red and she was grabbing/pulling it.


----------



## katt

*Eating Mess...* Can I just say that I LOVE having a dog? Whenever we eat over at someone else's house who is dog-free I hate having to clean up the mess. Whereas at home I just call the dog over to clean up for me. (except for grapes and raisins of course)
Is there anyway you can put a plastic sheet under her to help with the clean up? Not perfect, but it may help?

*Ears...* I don't know what you're supposed to do but, I use my nails and a wash cloth at bath-time. He doesn't much like it and squirms, but I get the worst parts. I only do it once in a while, not very often at all. Only when it looks like they need it.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

*Ears:* How do you clean them? I know I'm not supposed to stick anything in there, but gosh they're dirty! I used a wet wipe and tried to get the gunk off the parts closest to the outside, but then her ear got all red and she was grabbing/pulling it.









I've noticed that a lot of gunk will surface after a bath. I try to just get that out with a finger or a cotton ball wet with witch hazel.


----------



## cking

DD is going to be six months old next week. I'm having a lot of anxiety over this solid food thing. Silly, I know. I'm planning to just start slow, maybe only once or twice a day, and hopefully skip spoon-feeding and purees and do self-feeding. Would you mamas like to share your first-food experiences? When did you start? What did you start with? Did your dc continue right away or did it take a while to get steady with it?

I've been reading thru Super Baby Food. Wow, there is a lot of information in there but I think it may be overwhelming me. I like having the little chart suggesting which foods to introduce when, but for six-m.o.s she recommends mashing and thinning out food to spoon feed.


----------



## PiePie

EARS: she's got a ton of wax in there (takes after dh in that way) but i try to leave it alone. my grandmom used to say don't stick anything in there smaller than your elbow.

FOOD: cking, i used dr. sears's chart for what to introduce when and the superbaby foods book for recipes. i think the latter is a bit aggressive on solids. i also highly recommend _child of mine_. i was lovin' in but now my messy house seems to have eaten it.

ok she has now emptied my wallet of crucial cards.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
she signals she is done by doing the baby signs sign for all done -- like a ref signalling safe -- and swishing her food on the floor. she does this at daycare too. and in restaurants. charming. i have started watcing her closely and sometimes i can cathc her just in th enick of time. but oy. wwyd?

That is EXACTLY what Maev does.







We have hard floors, so it's not hard to clean up. My SIL has carpet and she lays down a big plastic sheet under the highchair. It's so easy to clean. Maybe that would help?

Solids: I used super baby food mostly for the recipes too. I also felt like she (the author) expected the baby to be eating so much at too early of an age. Dd's first food was an avocado the day she turned 6 mo. I gave her the whole half. She didn't do much with it. She did taste it with her tongue. We did about half puree/spoon feeding and half self-feeding.


----------



## Sihaya

*Ears:* Even though DH and I clean our own ears out with cotton swabs, we don't clean DS's unless there are big visible chunks of wax, in which case we use our fingers or a wash cloth.

*Solids:* We've done 100% self-feeding with DS. He started with pear and avocado at 6.5 months. It never occurred to me to look for recipes for him. We have just been feeding him whatever we have around the house that isn't allergenic (which isn't much). I want to make more of an effort to feed him 2-3 times/day, but we're still unpacking and I'm not even eating that often at this point, so he just gets fed whenever it's convenient.


----------



## PiePie

CKING, i think especially for exclusively bfing mamas the first solids is hugely emotional. i cried. we self-fed only bc dd took the spoon right out of dh's hand (you can see the video on his fb page) but after reading _child of mine_ i am a huge believer. we did solids only once a day and then only every other day from mos. 6-10. gotta go, trouble.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm going to stop lurking for a while. I can't even keep up with _that_ anymore...










MMM, I'll check in with you for Squeak's arrival!

Bye for now


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm going to stop lurking for a while. I can't even keep up with _that_ anymore...









MMM, I'll check in with you for Squeak's arrival!

Bye for now









Oh Shanna! You will be missed.


----------



## katt

*Solids:*
*First food:* Watermelon then Plum then cooked/canned carrots (from my dad's garden) then pretty much whatever we were eating but slightly softer or smaller to accomodate him. I try and keep dairy and other allergens to a minimum.

Now, he's a good eater. He doesn't shun much. He does get distracted, but if I hold food up to him he'll eat it. So, I do that if it doesn't seem like he's eaten a lot. (if he really isn't hungry he won't eat it and I don't push.)

He didn't start solids until 10 months. I figured that if he was happy playing with a bowl and spoon at the dinner table, then he didn't really need solids. After that got old then we started solids.

I'd usually offer him foods whenever we ate and let him eat however much he wanted. I LOVED the fact that he didn't care either way when we were out. That way I didn't have to worry about packing lots of solids to feed him.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm going to stop lurking for a while. I can't even keep up with _that_ anymore...









Bye for now































I'll miss you --- there were a few weeks there that I thought Ms Verbosity was back. I hope you secure the conditions that will enable her to return soon!







:


----------



## accountclosed3

it is exceedingly difficult to be verbose with only one hand!

nak, so lurking mostly and ryan is working from home so very little computer time for me!


----------



## Holiztic

just wait til your nursling (btw, nak) can kick the keyboard and smash his heel onto the mouse, and kicks your arms away from typing, etc.









SOLIDS: offered avocado and sweet potato at 6 months, no go. started again at 9 months with chicken broth (the real stuff), runny egg yolk, yogurt, applesauce, lacto-fermented veggies. Keep in mind that baby's don't really produce the enzymes for carbs (veggies included) until 1. That's why the veggies come out looking like they did going in


----------



## arelyn

Again I have to count my blessings with my parents and the in-laws. They're eccentric but they let me BF and co-sleep in peace. FIL's chiro even has no-vax info in his office so he doesn't even think that weird. Thank you all for reminding me how lucky I am.

Solids: Kai wasn't a solid fan. We tried bananas and rice pooridge purposly at 6mo but he doesn't like mashed banana and the rice made him throw up so we stopped for a bit. Then we'd just wait until he showed interest in our food and we'd mush a little with our fingers and he'd usually lose interest once he tasted 2 tiny bites of what we were eating (various legume and veg curries). He usually liked them but just wasn't interested in eating any large quantities. He's only started demanding regular meals this past month or so and you know what. He's just fine. Don't let solids stress you out. As long as you nurse a lot they don't really matter much.

Stuff in ears: Kai just has dirty ears. If there's something large I'll get it with my finger, otherwise it's no big deal.

Tossing food: When Kai tosses food I say "Oh, are you all done (and I do the sign)?" and I put him on the floor. Often he is. If he's not all done he get's a little upset and points at his chair so I say "Oh, you still want to eat (and I do the sign)." and put him back in his chair. I think he's starting to get it. He does the "all done" sign when he's all done trying the potty but has just started using it at the table.


----------



## cking

Thank you all for weighing in on the solids question.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
. Don't let solids stress you out. As long as you nurse a lot they don't really matter much.

Thank you for that, it makes me feel better.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
just wait til your nursling (btw, nak) can kick the keyboard and smash his heel onto the mouse, and kicks your arms away from typing, etc.









SOLIDS: offered avocado and sweet potato at 6 months, no go. started again at 9 months with chicken broth (the real stuff), runny egg yolk, yogurt, applesauce, lacto-fermented veggies. Keep in mind that baby's don't really produce the enzymes for carbs (veggies included) until 1. That's why the veggies come out looking like they did going in









So, did you hold off on grains and non-fermented veggies? I'm really wondering about the grains thing. It seems like most of the recipes in SBF and other books are for grains, but I'd like to wait a while on those. And what about meat? I'd rather wait a while on that, but I'm not sure how long.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
CKING, i think especially for exclusively bfing mamas the first solids is hugely emotional. i cried. we self-fed only bc dd took the spoon right out of dh's hand (you can see the video on his fb page) but after reading _child of mine_ i am a huge believer. we did solids only once a day and then only every other day from mos. 6-10. gotta go, trouble.

you're right, I'm already emotional over this and we haven't even started yet.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm going to stop lurking for a while. I can't even keep up with _that_ anymore...









MMM, I'll check in with you for Squeak's arrival!

Bye for now































We'll miss you!


----------



## Holiztic

Christina,

We planned to wait on grains to 1 year, and got pretty close, but around 10 months he got a little sourdough whole wheat bread (only way he'd take his egg yolk was spread on sd ww toast and cut into bite sized pieces). Even now he's pretty grain light. In a day he might have a small piece of soaked ww banana bread (homemeade, from nourishing traditions), a piece of sd ww bread (local bakery, soon to be homemade) and the occasional really bad think like some pizza crust (delivery crap) tonight. He's not into rice or qunioa or oatmeal or anything like it, just bread.

He got some butter drenched veggies early from 10 months, but he's not really into them (which I think is reasonable for a baby, they need ready-made nutrients--my theory--and yes I used to be vegan--is that cows eat the grass, turn it into nutrients for us which we get through dairy or meat. if we eat the grass (or lettuce) we have to do the work of the cow. Baby's need ready-made nutrients, like in breast milk. Not scientific, I know, but it's working. This kids is the strongest and healthiest toddler I've ever seen!

A typical day at 0-7 months: breast milk

7-9 months: 98% breast milk, 2% tiny tastes of applesauce, sweet potato, etc, very tiny!

9-10 months: 90% breast milk, 10% yogurt, applesauce, farm-made bone broth

10-12 months: 70% breast milk, 30% yogurt, egg yolk, butter, fermented veggies, raw cheese, little fruit and veggies--especially dried peas, and some sourdough ww bread/soaked ww banana bread

12-15 months: 50% breast milk, 50% everything above, plus whatever we eat at meals (he prefers meat, dairy, bread, eggs--and he loves a fermented blend we buy of cabbage, beets, carrots, and garlic)

16+ months: anything we eat, introduced nuts earlier than planned but in small amounts, probably about 20-50% breast milk depending on the day

Oh, and we started roasted chicken (dark meat, with fatty pan sauce!) as well as pot roast at 10 months. He LOVED it! Still prefers meat to just about anything, and as long as it is grass-fed and organic, its fine with me)

Hope this helps!

I have to say, not only is the kid so strong and healthy (and of course I think he's brilliant, too), we have NO struggles over food like some other toddlers. He eats some meals, others not so much. We don't play the "what do you want?" game here. I give a few options mostly from our meal, and if he doesn't eat it's no biggie (he doesn't fuss or demand something else either). We never had to do "choo choo" train or any other ploy to make him eat. I could go on, ask if you have any more questions!

no time to edit, forgive typos!


----------



## katt

Holiztic said:


> just wait til your nursling (btw, nak) can kick the keyboard and smash his heel onto the mouse, and kicks your arms away from typing, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you watching us? come on, you gotta have a camera in here someplace.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Christina,

We planned to wait on grains to 1 year, and got pretty close, but around 10 months he got a little sourdough whole wheat bread (only way he'd take his egg yolk was spread on sd ww toast and cut into bite sized pieces). Even now he's pretty grain light. In a day he might have a small piece of soaked ww banana bread (homemeade, from nourishing traditions), a piece of sd ww bread (local bakery, soon to be homemade) and the occasional really bad think like some pizza crust (delivery crap) tonight. He's not into rice or qunioa or oatmeal or anything like it, just bread.

He got some butter drenched veggies early from 10 months, but he's not really into them (which I think is reasonable for a baby, they need ready-made nutrients--my theory--and yes I used to be vegan--is that cows eat the grass, turn it into nutrients for us which we get through dairy or meat. if we eat the grass (or lettuce) we have to do the work of the cow. Baby's need ready-made nutrients, like in breast milk. Not scientific, I know, but it's working. This kids is the strongest and healthiest toddler I've ever seen!

A typical day at 0-7 months: breast milk

7-9 months: 98% breast milk, 2% tiny tastes of applesauce, sweet potato, etc, very tiny!

9-10 months: 90% breast milk, 10% yogurt, applesauce, farm-made bone broth

10-12 months: 70% breast milk, 30% yogurt, egg yolk, butter, fermented veggies, raw cheese, little fruit and veggies--especially dried peas, and some sourdough ww bread/soaked ww banana bread

12-15 months: 50% breast milk, 50% everything above, plus whatever we eat at meals (he prefers meat, dairy, bread, eggs--and he loves a fermented blend we buy of cabbage, beets, carrots, and garlic)

16+ months: anything we eat, introduced nuts earlier than planned but in small amounts, probably about 20-50% breast milk depending on the day

Oh, and we started roasted chicken (dark meat, with fatty pan sauce!) as well as pot roast at 10 months. He LOVED it! Still prefers meat to just about anything, and as long as it is grass-fed and organic, its fine with me)

Hope this helps!

I have to say, not only is the kid so strong and healthy (and of course I think he's brilliant, too), we have NO struggles over food like some other toddlers. He eats some meals, others not so much. We don't play the "what do you want?" game here. I give a few options mostly from our meal, and if he doesn't eat it's no biggie (he doesn't fuss or demand something else either). We never had to do "choo choo" train or any other ploy to make him eat. I could go on, ask if you have any more questions!

no time to edit, forgive typos!

VERY helpful, Thank you!


----------



## blizzard_babe

Hi... I'm back.









I missed you ladies. I'll try to read back over the last few pages and catch up on what's been going on, but here's a quick update.

Ike will be 5 months on the 6th of October. As some of you saw on facebook, he has two teeth. He cut them right around four months. It was kind of a rough transition... he was JUST getting past the newborn crankies when we moved and he started staying home with DH during the day. Then he cut teeth and was NOT happy about it. One thing then another then another. But since the teeth busted out, he's been a happy little monkey. He's enjoying playing on the floor and will roll and pivot and squirm and push his way around... he actually moves a considerable distance. A few times he's ended up under the couch







.

DH is doing well as a SAHD, but I think he'll come back to work at least part-time next semester. He needs the outside stimulation. Our top-of-the-list babysitter became available and is flexible when it comes to salary, so that's good. We'll do a trial run in December; DH is flying home for Christmas early so we can save some $$, so it'll be just me and the baby for a few weeks.

Work has been crazy busy... a bunch of the teachers here and in neighboring villages are going to be a pick-up site for a CSA out of Washington state (they deliver to member sites in rural AK), and I'm running it. I'm on our Site Improvement Committee, and am thinking of starting up a "Sunshine" committee that will do little things to brighten up our school community (staff, students, and parents/elders). After being pregnant and exhausted and "just surviving" my job last year, I had forgotten about how much I truly love teaching. My classroom is cluttered, not because I haven't been cleaning it (although my desk could use a once-over), but because I've found so many creative, messy learning activities to do with my students. I've already run out of glue sticks (although I hadn't bought new ones; just kept 'em from last year).

Anyway... it's good to be back! I might not be on much because my plate is pretty full, but we got internet at home (well, the kindergarten building next door got internet, and we get a signal at one end of our house; they still haven't brought private high-speed internet to this village







), so I actually have after-DS-goes-to-bed internet time at night now.


----------



## witchygrrl

Bye Shanna--hope you can come back soon!

Hi BB! Isaac is adorable! And I'm glad you are enjoying your job--that's wonderful!

I'm cutting out dairy for awhile. This child is GASSY! It gets really bad at night, though she will eventually go to sleep at 11:45ish. So we'll see what happens. She still spits up, though not nearly as bad as she used to.

I have a bachelorette party on SAturday, so Dh gets her for the night. I hope that works out okay.


----------



## arelyn

I was having a vegetarian crisis earlier today and then I read Liz's post with all the mentions of animal products and it made me nauseous. Thank you for inadvertantly helping me find clarity on the subject.







I think I need to up my protein or iron or some mineral intake. I've been getting these meat cravings since getting back to the US and they are only getting worse. Any ideas on stuff I should be eating?

BB: I'm so glad you're happily back at work. I kinda miss my job and keep toying with the idea of doing daycare out of the house but that would kill our flexibiity and we are loving it right now.


----------



## witchygrrl

Hmm, I'm an omni, not a vegetarian, but I always appreciate good veggie food. 3 bean chili? spanikopita?


----------



## arelyn

Actually I made Indian food tonight. I'm starting to miss the stuff.


----------



## PiePie

*cking* and i met up on friday.







:

*liz's* mention of pizza crust reminded me that it is great for teething!! i don't think dd downs much if any wheat from it but she found it quite soothing today. she was a wee bit meltdowny which we are attributing to the top 2 teeth busting through.

*z.b.,* naking gets easier as you get the hang of it and then harder as babe gets the hang of locomotion.


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, check out kellymom for alternate list of %ages of solids to bm. i would say that she was up to 25% solids by about 9 mos. but the really remarkable change is recently (12 mos.) when it rocketed up to about 50%. but then there are days like today where it is all about nursing (teething??). anyway it was pretty much all foods off our plates once she was about 10 mos. babyled weaning made it much easier, gotta say. we are still nuts free for her, but it is hard to remember that, e.g., pesto has pine nuts in it and masaman has peanuts. 2 oops and removal after she was all







:


----------



## accountclosed3

baby wearing saves the day! i was able to get a lot of chores done.

and, thankfully, ryan is stepping up to take care of H a bit more. the last two weeks, it was tough getting him to do anything with H so that i could take a few minutes to myself. In the morning, i do have 10 minutes to shower, dress, and make my bed while R changes/ECs and dresses the baby.

but, all during the last week when i wanted 10-30 minutes each day to myself for some yoga (particualrly because my back and butt hurt from so much sitting), and he simply would not do it.

first, he said that he didn't have the time between his work and writing schedule.

second, he said that he wanted to "look good for Austin" (film fest), and thus he had to work out and what not. he actually got in 4 workouts in the two weeks (being away from home from 4 until 6:30) and then also got in two runs and two bike rides (45 minutes each).

third, because H and I go to bed around 8:30-9:00, he stays up and gets to read, watch movies, whatever until he goes to bed at 10. I also do all of the night time parenting (EC, change, nurse).

i finally told him that i was burning out and he needed to hold the baby for at least 10-30 minutes each day. there must have been 3-4 days when he didn't hold the baby at all and it was all me.

i was so frustrated! so i finally told him that i also have physical goals that i wanted to meet that were just as important as his feeling good for the festival, and i pointed out that he's had a heck of a lot of time for his things when i have not.

thankfully, he shaped up shortly after. i've been able to get my 30 minutes a day, plus my shower time, to myself and he's doing what he can to settle H (and himself) when he fusses. i keep reminding him to EC the baby. that's usually why he fusses after eating!


----------



## witchygrrl

how frustrating, zoe. glad you two worked things out.

cking and piepie...how lucky that you got to meet!

I had my first night away from Rhea Saturday. It was a bachelorette party for my friend who is getting married in two weeks. We took her to a tapas bar and then to a drag queen cabaret. I only came for dinner--it was pouring rain, so not fun driving the 45 minutes to get there, and then trying to find a parking spot! On the way down I made the decision that after we ate, I was going back to my baby because it was so heartwrenching to leave her. DH did a good job, but she cried for about an hour even though DH was trying everything he could think of to soothe her. When she heard my voice on speakerphone, she was a little better. So anyway, I came back and she perked up and nursed for the rest of the night, pretty much.

I think the ILs were asking DH why she's not on a schedule yet--how she nurses on demand, and sleeps whenever she falls asleep. I mean, I would prefer it if she would fall asleep for the night before midnight. But she only wakes once, and that's when DH is in the shower (around 4:45-5am), and then back to sleep for a few more hours after we nurse. So for her age, I don't think that's bad at all.

Just as long as they don't suggest we do the whole CIO garbage.


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* oy. the "leisure gap" is an ongoing debate in our household. i suggest you read (while nursing) hochschild's feminist classic _the second shift_. i'm sure you will find it fascinating given your gender studies background. it paints a pretty nuanced picture of gender ideologies and how things go down and what strategies both sides use in this negotiation. but to be a bit more cheery on the subject, for us it got easier when 1. i went back to work (on some level my personal time "mattered" more to him then) and 2. she got bigger and more interactive, able to invent games herself, etc.


----------



## PiePie

in the early days it was him for 20 minutes in the a.m. and 10 minutes in the p.m. now it's him for 1.5 hours in the a.m. and at least 0.5 hours in the p.m. plus he will take her on a 4-5 hour bike ride on the weekend sometimes. a different world.


----------



## accountclosed3

i figure that ryan will spend more time in the coming months. particularly when we get to other foods! let me be honest, H spends a lot of time BFing! i mean, he goes every 3 to 5 hrs, and he goes for an hr most times.

at nite, R will complain about lack of sleep, evem though i'm now responding fast and H prefers EC so he doesn't really cry. and then i nurse for an hr while R snores! i nearly bit him when he said that i get more sleep because i nap in the afternoon! H eats at 1 am and 5 am! that's why i go to bed at 8:30! H nurses 8- 9 and sleeps until 1! then, nurses until 2 and sleeps until 5! then R gets up at 5:30 and complains!

i'm like, uh, who didn't snore from 1-2 and gets up at 5?

next feeding is then 8:00--right when i get ryan to work, so...i sit in the parking lot for an hr!

yeah, it was a bit much...lol


----------



## Maela

Witchy, I remember how hard it was the first time I left Dd. I was always excited to get a break for a couple of hours, but then a few minutes away and I'd be missing her already.

Yesterday I went to a bridal shower while Dh watched Dd and it was the first time that I didn't have that feeling. Maybe it was because she was with her Dada and I knew they were having fun. Also, she's getting older and doesn't nurse as often. Anyway, I had a great time relaxing and talking and eating with friends and my mom and sister.


----------



## Maela

I want to make roasted beets for dinner. What should I serve with it?

Any ideas?


----------



## Holiztic

I have a menu I make every 2 weeks (when I get my farm order)

Keilbasa and onions, quick marinated in a mix of beer, mustard, dried thyme
I spread on a cookie sheet and pop in toward the end of the beets (and carrots) roasting.

This is one of our favorite meals. Everything but the onion and marinade come from the farm.

This may not work for you, but I do recommend adding some UNPEELED carrots to you beets for roasting, they are sooo good together!

Enjoy!

Oh, and on leaving dc, at 17 months I still haven't passed the 3 hour mark away from him, and I don't wanna!!!!!







Truth is, I mentally added up the total hours I have been away from him since birth (roughly), and I didn't even hit 20.







There's just rarely anything I even think/want to do without him! At 2 this will gradually change. And when he weans even more so. But for now, he still feels like a part of me!


----------



## Maela

What is keilbasa?


----------



## witchygrrl

kielbasa is polish sausage. tasty stuff (though eat the turkey version, not pork).

mmm, roasted beets. I like them on anything, really.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who missed their babe terribly. I felt like a loser, but no one else had children at the party, so I shouldn't be so hard on myself.


----------



## accountclosed3

ok, seriously, i missed my baby when i walked less than 1/2 a block from him!

my friend was holding him in the yoga studio, i walked to the pizza place less than 1/2 a block away. i was freaking out and couldn't wait to get back to him!

i don't know if i could go to a party without him at this point! of course, with his ever-changing feeding schedule (obviously, on cue from him), i really don't like to go anywhere without him!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
kielbasa is polish sausage. tasty stuff (though eat the turkey version, not pork).

mmm, roasted beets. I like them on anything, really.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who missed their babe terribly. I felt like a loser, but no one else had children at the party, so I shouldn't be so hard on myself.

Thanks. I'm not a big fan of sausage, but Dh would love it.


----------



## katt

I've had to leave DS for large chunks of time, 10 hours or so for a wedding I was working. He did great and was with my mom, but I still missed him SO much.


----------



## accountclosed3

today is so much better than yesterday. i was trapped in the house all day and frustrated, which of course upset the baby (since they pick up on the emotions of others pretty quick), and so he wanted to nurse all day long. i nursed basically from 4 am until 5 pm when ryan *finally* got home from work. i was happier then, because we went out for dinner, and then came home and had our normal schedule.

today, i taught and it was perfect! pottied hawk before and after class, fed him after, went for a walk wearing him, and then came home. this day is so much nicer!

also, weird thing at dinner--competitive parents! LOL

we got to the thai restaurant rather early--before the usual dinner rush. i had hawk in his wrap and walked him around the restaurant when we got there after pottying him. he settled quickly and then other folks came in.

another young couple came with their baby--who looked to be just a few months older than hawk. that baby was in a bucket, but the parents ended up holding him during the meal anyway.

now, i'm so used to buckets that i don't think anything of them, and smiled at the family and cute baby.







but, it was really weird, because the *vibe* i got from them was definintely competitive.

how weird is that? i didn't even know what the competition was, except that hawk was in a wrap and their babe was in a bucket?

anyway, funny thing was, a lot of folks in the restaurant asked me about the wrap, but no one asked them about the bucket. but, they didn't ask about the wrap.

i love my wrap.


----------



## PiePie

huge harassment episode by multiple women (led by older women) for NIPing on the subway on tghe way home tonight.







: the theory was that i was not showing respect for others on the train. this tends to be the gist of anti-(visible/vocal)child-in-public sentiment. sigh.


----------



## witchygrrl

haven't tried the moby yet, but I do love my sling. I get more comments about how cool a way it is to carry my baby that way! A few people are like, will she fall out or suffocate? But I tell them no, smile warmly and carry on.

PiePie, what is their problem? Why can't they show some respect to you and yours? I haven't really NIPed yet, if only because I haven't been overly comfortable where I was, and we're not stealthy enough to do it without major boob overhang, but we're working on it. BUt even still--I don't think it should matter.

I had an interesting situation in Target yesterday. This poor new dad of twins was frantic, and he saw me with a baby and so figured I'd know something. Except he was asking me about how to mix formula, how to heat formula, etc. His wife was breastfeeding and supplementing, but wanted to wean them and go straight to formula. He was so wound up that I didn't want to scare him, so I did the best I could with the limited info I had. I did say that I exclusively give my baby bm, and so on, but had that been the mother, I think I would have done better. I just felt so bad about this clueless father, on a mission. But I feel worse about those poor newborn twins.









Tomorrow is Rhea's two month checkup and they want to give her the hib and prevnar at the very least (I talked them down to those two), but now that I've done further research, I don't even want those two. DH is not on board with skipping wellbaby checks in principle, but knows I'll probably have to fight every visit. I'd rather go for sick visits only. Any suggestions on how to approach the issue?


----------



## accountclosed3

i would just say no to the vaccines until you want them. our doc is only interested in giving two vaccines so far (his recommendation are these two)--whooping cough (not in a cocktail) at 4-6 mo and Hib at 1 yr. of course, he is very liberal and supports no vax, but if you want minimum vax, this is what he recommends.

also, could you find a different doc? we pay out of pocket for ours (he's out of network and we are high deductable); but we feel it's worth it to get the care that we want for Hawk. sucks though.

and, btw, i'm completely put out by McCain's tax plan in regards to health insurance. that's a total aside, but it's been gnawing on me because my 'rents, my sister, and one of our good friends are going on and on about how great mccain's plan is and that's why they're voting for him. when i ask about this, they say "oh, that's no true!" IT"S ON HIS WEB SITE! duh. i point htat out, and they say "you misunderstand what it means?"

OH, excuse me? i can't read?

anyway, there's an obama rally within 30 mintues of my house starting at 9. i desparately want to go, but my mother is coming down to spend the day with hawk and go shopping for my new clothes with me. she gets here at 10. no way she'll go to an Obama rally anyway, and i wouldn't want to leave her waiting.

it's SO upsetting. i want to go the rally! i will have a tantrum like a 3 yr old!


----------



## snozzberry

*PiePie,*







I'm sorry about the NIP harassment.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I had an interesting situation in Target yesterday. This poor new dad of twins was frantic, and he saw me with a baby and so figured I'd know something. Except he was asking me about how to mix formula, how to heat formula, etc. His wife was breastfeeding and supplementing, but wanted to wean them and go straight to formula. He was so wound up that I didn't want to scare him, so I did the best I could with the limited info I had. I did say that I exclusively give my baby bm, and so on, but had that been the mother, I think I would have done better. I just felt so bad about this clueless father, on a mission. But I feel worse about those poor newborn twins.









Tomorrow is Rhea's two month checkup and they want to give her the hib and prevnar at the very least (I talked them down to those two), but now that I've done further research, I don't even want those two. DH is not on board with skipping wellbaby checks in principle, but knows I'll probably have to fight every visit. I'd rather go for sick visits only. Any suggestions on how to approach the issue?

It sounds like you were very kind and helpful to that daddy!

fyi, we delayed all vax for Abby til 6 months, and our pedi was okay with it once we explained that she was EBF and *not* in any multiple-childcare situation. Forgive me, I forget whether you have Rhea in childcare? If not, that might be an approach to take. We also brought a copy of The Vaccine Book with us to pull out just in case, but we didn't need to reference it after all.

Good luck!


----------



## snozzberry

*zoebird,* I didn't know pertussis was available in a solo shot!!! Please give us more info!!! We got DTaP for Abby at 6 months, but I really just wanted pertussis...

*Missing babies:* I feel like a horrible mama for admitting this, but I don't miss Abby like you guys describe missing your babies.







I mean, I miss her of course, but it's not like I can't wait to get back to her. Is it possible I'm not letting myself "go" to truly connect with her on a deeper level?

I told DH about this a couple weeks ago because I was curious if I was the only one that felt this way. I'm only ever gone for 3-5 hours at a time for work, and he is sometimes gone 9-10 hours. He said he misses her most when he sees her picture on his computer, but it did kinda sound like I don't miss her as much/as often as he does.

Is it just that I feel completely comfortable leaving her with DH? She's as happy with him as she is with me.

Geez, what's wrong with me?


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 

also, weird thing at dinner--competitive parents! LOL

we got to the thai restaurant rather early--before the usual dinner rush. i had hawk in his wrap and walked him around the restaurant when we got there after pottying him. he settled quickly and then other folks came in.

another young couple came with their baby--who looked to be just a few months older than hawk. that baby was in a bucket, but the parents ended up holding him during the meal anyway.

now, i'm so used to buckets that i don't think anything of them, and smiled at the family and cute baby.







but, it was really weird, because the *vibe* i got from them was definintely competitive.

how weird is that? i didn't even know what the competition was, except that hawk was in a wrap and their babe was in a bucket?

anyway, funny thing was, a lot of folks in the restaurant asked me about the wrap, but no one asked them about the bucket. but, they didn't ask about the wrap.

i love my wrap.

I get that too. We always got lots of comments when carrying DD in a sling or wrap, and i noticed that people don't really 'notice' a baby as much in a bucket or stroller. But yeah, there is always this weird vibe from the other parents. Also, our neighbors have a daughter the same age as J, and they are big stroller/bucket users. We often go for walks together, and I usually have J in a sling or backpack. My neighbor hasn't ever really commented on the carriers. They have a Bjorn, of course, but they hardly ever use it 'anymore'.

Kelly, I think it's definitely different as babies get a little older. I see now how excited J is when DH comes home and she loves playing with him. I'm learning now to relax and let go a bit when she's with him. It sounds like
you're doing the same thing.


----------



## cking

Josephine turned six months old on Wednesday. I think she knows it too, because on Monday she really started to get her butt off the ground, and by Tuesday night she was doing a little backwards crawling. Yikes! It goes so fast.

So, we're going to start letting her taste some food this weekend. I'd rather do it during the day and while DH is here. But of course, on Wednesday night I get an email from MIL who is just dying to know what her first food was.







Sheeesh! And so it begins....


----------



## witchygrrl

Yeah, Rhea stays home with me, so definitely no multiple-child care involved. I see multiple fps in this office, and today is the one I wanted to see, as I've heard great things about him, except I've heard nothing on the vax issue. So he's an unknown. The other fp there that we've seen the most was able to negotiate me down to these two. The others, he felt, could wait (HepB, DTaP--but because I said DH and I were willing to vaccinate ourselves instead of her, rotavirus--which he won't give to his own children, and polio). They normally give all of those, plus the two that I'm talking about, at one visit at 2 months!!! No way would I ever allow that many at once, even if I did want to vax her. I honestly want to wait until she's 2 years old, then reassess.

I have a few facts and figures, though I only borrowed The Vaccine Book from my doula and had to give it back. I should really buy it for myself. Maybe I can find a cheap copy.

And yeah, Zoe, where is this single shot of pertussis? That would be fabulous! I would try to find another doc--in fact there is one in the same town, but he doesn't take any insurance, and we don't have the extra cash to see him. But he'll be at the local Holistic Moms meeting this month, so maybe I can talk to him about it.


----------



## witchygrrl

Ok, back from the doc's. I am making sure that we only see him, and no others, because he's fantastic! Totally cool with holding off on vax until she's 2 years old, like I want.







:

I worry too freaking much.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*, I'm sorry to hear that those women on the subway were so rude and thoughtless!!







I can imagine that would be so hard to deal with, especially with multiple people ganging up against you.









*Witchy*, glad to hear that your dr is okay with your decision. I wish my dr was a little more supportive of my vax decisions. I have not taken Dd in yet for her 1yo shots because I don't want her to have those until at least two, but probably later.


----------



## PiePie

we didn't have dd's 1 yr appt till she was 13 mos. nothing intentional, just scheduling.

so i've got a napper on my back again. i wish she were down in her crib or even our bed. but this seems to be the new normal?

dh was so rocking today. somebody yelled at him for letting dd "run around" in our historic house tour (she wasn't going to touch any artifacts -- all partitioned off -- but the stranger's thing was that she was going to hurt herself. dh was like, "oh, you think all kids need to live in a cage?" i







how similar we are in parenting philosophy and i







our free range toddler.


----------



## accountclosed3

i don't know about the vax per se. my doc is against cocktail vaxes, so gies individual unless the parent asks for something other! but, i'll ask at his next appt!


----------



## witchygrrl

Yeah, these cocktail vaxes bother the heck out of me. And how they tell you in the literature that having multiple vaxes at once is perfectly safe.







:


----------



## cking

We caught our first pee(s)!!!







:
Yesterday after J woke up from her nap I held her over the toilet and she pee'd!!! Of course it was just a trickle and ten minutes later she had a much larger one.







Then first thing this morning, she was dry, so I sat her on the little potty and she peed in it! woohoo! I had tried before, but maybe I wasn't timing it right or something. Anyway, yesterday I talked to a woman I know from LLL and she is trying it with her 3.5 mo dd, so I was inspired to try again.









we gave Josephine some avocado this weekend. She really didn't get a whole lot in her mouth, and what she did get she spit back out anyway. But she got a taste of it at least. And she loved smearing it all over the tray. ha! So, I actually feel better about this whole solids thing, knowing that she'll take it at her own pace. We'll keep offering....
She also was really more interested in chewing on the spoon, and the bowl. Which is funny since we've been letting her play with those for a while now. I think she's just in the midst of some hard teething, so the wooden spoon is more appealing.


----------



## arelyn

Congrats Christina! Isn't it great when ECing actually works?!

piepie: I can't believe the people on the subway!!!







I would have just died, or at least left sobbing.







s

Is anyone else starting to have trouble wearing your baby? It's easiest for me to wear Kai in a front wrap but I get such a backache! A back carry is more comfy but I can't figure how to get Mr Wiggly to hold still long enough to wrap him up unless I have DH around to help. Any ideas? What works for you?


----------



## PiePie

arelyn, front carry for short distances or when she needs to nurse; back carry otherwise. have been mounting her on back by myself since 6 mos. try with full length mirror. he will get the hang of it pretty quickly and help you out. unless he is like dd and wants to walk.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Congrats Christina! Isn't it great when ECing actually works?!

piepie: I can't believe the people on the subway!!!







I would have just died, or at least left sobbing.








s

Is anyone else starting to have trouble wearing your baby? It's easiest for me to wear Kai in a front wrap but I get such a backache! A back carry is more comfy but I can't figure how to get Mr Wiggly to hold still long enough to wrap him up unless I have DH around to help. Any ideas? What works for you?

Thanks!
Well, I'm a novice wrapper, but I also can't get J on my back with one yet. I actually got it tied once, but when I got up I realized it just wasn't going to work - not tied very well. Have you tried a mei tai? I have better luck with that. Somehow it's just easier to hold her steady with the MT, maybe it's the waist belt. I thought about converting my wrap to a MT - I saw someone on Etsy selling them like that - just gorgeous, but now I can't find the link. I also use a SSC which is incredibly easy to get on; but I do think the MT is comfier.


----------



## snozzberry

*Christina*, congrats on the EC success! J's experience with avocado sounds a lot like Abby's.







It was her first solid food too.

*Childcare advice:* Abby's naps are too short to get any real work done (for my job) from home during the day. So I've been staying up late at nights working while the fam sleeps.

I've come to the decision that it's not sustainable for me to be working late like that because I'm *always* ridiculously sleep deprived. So we're going to look into getting a nanny to come in a couple days a week so I can work from home, but I'll still be at home to feed Abby every 3 hrs or so.

*Any advice on what to ask in nanny interviews?*


----------



## PiePie

*kelly*, check out the sticky in the working mamas forum. think about what your litmus issues are. mine were feeding on demand and babywearing (up to 20 lbs.), and no tv or smoking. obviously no cio but that didn't really come up in a 1-on-1 setting. plus really dd is an alarm so nobody *could* cio her!


----------



## katt

cking - i could convert it for you, no problem, if you like.

We don't wrap much, wrapping on the back is pretty difficult for me so back carries are typically with the MT. I can front carry with sling, wrap, and MT. Teo's older so he knows what i'm trying to do and usually stays still for a while, giving me a decent window to strap him on. A mirror does help, cause then they can watch themselves and that does calm them down enough to give you a small window.


----------



## Verity

I keep seeing this thread and it's driving me crazy that I can't figure out what NMY means.

Would someone enlighten me?


----------



## Maela

*Cking*, congrats on the pee success!!

Dd won't let me wear her for more than 5 mintues now. She wants to walk.







She never was much of a sling baby, but now we hardly ever do it.

Still having a hard time with Maev's late bedtime. But we did find something that works _most_ of the time. I try to use only natural light for most of the day. Then in the early evening we put on only a couple of dim lights. At 8PM after her bath, I turn off all the lights in the house except for a nightlight in Dd's room. I sit in the rocker with my shirt up














, while Dd plays. After 5-30 minutes, she comes to me wanting to nurse to sleep (which can take up to an hour).







: Of course, there have been days where this did not work, but I'd say it's worked 80% of the time. We've been doing this for a couple of weeks now.

Beets are my new favorite food! I roasted some the other night and they were soooo good.














:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Verity* 
I keep seeing this thread and it's driving me crazy that I can't figure out what NMY means.

Would someone enlighten me?

















We were all at one time a part of the *N*ot *M*amas *Y*et thread, but now we are all mamas or pregnant. And we also have visits from some of the ladies from the NMY thread. I think there are some of us who still hang out there? Am I correct? Not sure.


----------



## Maela

Has anyone read _Taking Back Childhood: Helping Your Kids Thrive in a Fast-Paced, Media-Saturated, Violence-Filled World_ by Nancy Carlsson-Paige, Ed.D.? I am almost finished with it now, and I love it!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
cking - i could convert it for you, no problem, if you like.

Cool, thanks! Let me think about a little bit --I'm still trying to decide if I want to keep trying to wrap or not.









Maela, glad the new betime routine is working! I also just realized recently that turning the lights down really helps.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Beets are my new favorite food! I roasted some the other night and they were soooo good.














:

Yay! I know, I hated - _hated -_ beets before I tried them fresh and roasted. Now I really like them. They are also good grilled (boiled first) and with goat cheese, walnuts and arugula.









DD is now fascinated with watching me type. She also tries to use the trackpad on the laptop.









Verity, NMY is for Not Mamas Yet. That is a thread in FYT where we all met a while back. Several of us 'graduated' so we moved the chat over here.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Dd won't let me wear her for more than 5 mintues now. She wants to walk.









that's going around here too... it's just the age, i was telling dh tonight.


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*kelly*, check out the sticky in the working mamas forum. think about what your litmus issues are. mine were feeding on demand and babywearing (up to 20 lbs.), and no tv or smoking. obviously no cio but that didn't really come up in a 1-on-1 setting. plus really dd is an alarm so nobody *could* cio her!

Thanks, PiePie! I've gotten like 25 emails from nanny candidates so far. This is going to be like a 2nd job coordinating interviews & crap!

*Maela,* congrats on finding a bedtime routine that works better!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Has anyone read _Taking Back Childhood: Helping Your Kids Thrive in a Fast-Paced, Media-Saturated, Violence-Filled World_ by Nancy Carlsson-Paige, Ed.D.? I am almost finished with it now, and I love it!

Ooh, haven't heard of it, but it's now on my to-read list. Thanks for the tip!


----------



## PiePie

*kelly*, hell yeah it's a nightmare. it is totally a second job, and that is not counting the emotional energy of processing the magnitude of the decision. dh didn't get how huge it was; i only brought him in for final round. consider doing initial screenings by phone for your must have questions, whatever they may be. (like is the person willing/able to be paid on the books -- that knocked out a lot of folks here) having said all that, and having complained here re our former nanny arrangement, i ultimately believe that dd formed a good bond and got excellent, individualized, creative care. sending you best vibes for same.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Has anyone read _Taking Back Childhood: Helping Your Kids Thrive in a Fast-Paced, Media-Saturated, Violence-Filled World_ by Nancy Carlsson-Paige, Ed.D.? I am almost finished with it now, and I love it!

Sounds like a great read. Must check it out!

My friend's wedding is tomorrow...have to be in NH by 6:45 am to get my hair done. What was I thinking? I'm sure it'll be fine--she's a champ at adapting whereever we are.


----------



## Verity

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela;12344376We were all at one time a part of the [URL="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=929291"*
*N*ot *M*amas *Y*et thread[/URL]


Thank you for solving that mystery for me!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Verity* 
Thank you for solving that mystery for me!

Glad to help.
















: Three nights in a row of Dd going to bed by 9PM.







:


----------



## katt

we can't be on page 2!

anyway, teo had a dry diaper this AM and poo'd and pee'd in the potty!! about 5 min. later he tells me he poo'd again, but I wasn't paying attention.







I figured he had already poo'd so he was referring to that. I hate it when I don't pay attention to what he is saying. (not that I always understand cause some of his words sound so much like eachother) He actually did a bit, which I found out after I picked him up and smelled it.

Now I just gotta get some clothes on this kid.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Hi folks...just sticking my head in for a second. It's very quiet around these parts at the moment.

I've been quiet mostly 'cos I'm insanely busy at the moment. Work is kicking my butt...but only 4 more weeks after this one! Yay. I had my last big project finish up on the weekend which is great. Now I just have to coordinate a new website, finish up a [25 pages and counting] discussion paper and work on all my handover/induction manuals for my replacement. Totally doable, right!!??

Everything else is great. Squeak is perfect. The reflux is only bad some days and I'm even managing to sleep every few nights. Any spare time I've had lately seems to have been spent making mad dashes to ikea or target and putting together flat pack furniture! We've just finished the most awesome independent birth education classes too. I'm completely inspired and empowered and MUCH less naive than I was before we did the classes.

Hope everyone is doing well. And I hope our newest grad is thriving. (zoebird, how are you and hawk?)


----------



## snozzberry

baby in lap, but *mmm* good to hear from you! glad you're doing well & I'm so excited for you to meet Squeak!


----------



## PiePie

dying of curiosity over squeak's name, but totally understand if you are not ready to share the list.

just got back from whirlwind tour of washington dc. it was totally nuts, made us hate on lack of pub transit. also had rough time with friend with SN child with bad (potentially fatal) dx







who basically manipulated us into spending more time with her than planned and shortchanging other friends.







sigh. saw a lot of bad "discipline" in action and dh is more than ever into emotion coaching -- i.e., empowering kids to negotiate btwn themselves rather than having them tattle to you and then you imposing the law. he concluded the visit by saying he needs to read some of my parenting books.







i suspect all my friends think i am nuts to have such a "free range toddler." they were blown away by her antics like piling toy boxes to make ladder to climb onto dining room table (that i intervened in). but in general other kids seem so PASSIVE compared to dd, who seems like a different species. i felt a mix of pride (re dd) and sadness (re other kids) when a friend's oldest said re dd, "she is so much more fun than my brother and sister, and acts older." she actually has more words than my friend's 2 yo, the little sister in question, whose words are pretty much focused on dora, high heels, and disney princesses.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i suspect all my friends think i am nuts to have such a "free range toddler." they were blown away by her antics like piling toy boxes to make ladder to climb onto dining room table (that i intervened in). but in general other kids seem so PASSIVE compared to dd, who seems like a different species. i felt a mix of pride (re dd) and sadness (re other kids) when a friend's oldest said re dd, "she is so much more fun than my brother and sister, and acts older." she actually has more words than my friend's 2 yo, the little sister in question, whose words are pretty much focused on dora, high heels, and disney princesses.









I see this with Maev too a lot. Although, recently (last couple of weeks), she has become quieter and more shy in large group situations. I think she's just so interested in watching what the other kids are doing lately.


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, good to hear from you and that things are going well! I'm so excited about Squeak's impending arrival!

Rhea's doing well--she's so strong and strong-willed (not surprised with the huge Leo influence in her chart!). Last couple of nights she's been babbling away at bedtime--she babbles quite a bit, but this is much more concentrated. I had her loosely swaddled on my belly, and she looked like the Buddha giving pronouncements on us







So cute.

We had her at the wedding, and what a champ. When she wasn't sleeping, she was very social, and danced a bit to the music (she dances by pumping her legs, especially her right one). Everyone was impressed by how alert she was.

Yesterday the ILs were by for the day, along with a friend of the family--man, they're nuts. I was concerned how her bf'ing on demand was going to fly, not that I would change for their sakes, but I was hoping that maybe the friend would have more of a clue than the ILs. Hah! I was brushing my teeth when Rhea started making hungry signals to DH, and then the buzzer rang to let them in! So we get over there, made quick introduction to the baby and said that she was hungry and needed to eat! The friend says to her, "Hungry? Do you want a bottle?"" So I reply, "No, we eat from the booby!" in the same kind of babyvoice. Later the friend asked if I fed her on demand and if it was a pain in the neck!







: WTF kind of question is that? It was great later though when we walking in some public gardens later that day, and we managed to bf in the sling without having to sit down!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
It was great later though when we walking in some public gardens later that day, and we managed to bf in the sling without having to sit down!









Oooh Witchy, I'm impressed! You're already a pro!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oooh Witchy, I'm impressed! You're already a pro!









Yeah, it worked out pretty well. I had managed to do the same a few days before walking through Macy's, and I said to my MIL as such, who was pretty much speechless.







Thanksgiving is going to be sooooo special at their house. Oy.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dying of curiosity over squeak's name, but totally understand if you are not ready to share the list.

You're gonna have to hold on a bit longer sorry - we're not sharing. Nor do we actually have a name. But we have a shortlist. It seems we're going to have to meet this babe before he is named.

Our birth teacher had a 5 week old whose sisters had nicknamed 'baby rainbow' because she was still nameless. I fear the same fate for our boy.


----------



## PiePie

pak


----------



## farmama

first frost here on Saturday.







:

mmm glad to hear from you.







everyone!

my girl does this now, and it's adorable







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
You're gonna have to hold on a bit longer sorry - we're not sharing. Nor do we actually have a name. But we have a shortlist. It seems we're going to have to meet this babe before he is named.

Our birth teacher had a 5 week old whose sisters had nicknamed 'baby rainbow' because she was still nameless. I fear the same fate for our boy.

Popping in to say Hi. MMM, you were in my dream the other night! You and your partner were at the birth center where Fenton was born, I can't remember why. It was so nice to see your face, and I can't believe I recognized who you were







.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Maela, glad the new betime routine is working! I also just realized recently that turning the lights down really helps.

Yay! I know, I hated - _hated -_ beets before I tried them fresh and roasted. Now I really like them. They are also good grilled (boiled first) and with goat cheese, walnuts and arugula.









DD is now fascinated with watching me type. She also tries to use the trackpad on the laptop.










Ditto on all three accounts!!

Kai has been terrible about going to sleep lately. We've been having to drive
him around just about every other night. Turning the lights down does seem to be helping though (a few weeks ago driving was the only way to get him to sleep).

Still no luck wrapping Kai. He'd rather walk...unless Mike is there to wear him.

And a happy hello to MMM and Shanna!! You are missed but I understand about life being crazy and not getting to post much.


----------



## Maela

Nice to hear from you MMM, Shanna, and Arelyn!









I am _really_ in need of some like-minded mama friends IRL. I feel like there's no one that completely understands me (Dh comes very close, but he's not a woman







). I guess I can't expect anyone to _completely_ understand me, but it's just so lonely sometimes being "the weird one" but not "weird" enough to fit into most alternative groups. I seem to have a lot of contradicting qualities/ likes and dislikes that makes it really hard for me to fit into any one social "group." This probably doesn't even make sense.







Just wanted to vent.

LLL meeting tomorrow! Yay, some socialization! Need to try to make some friends....


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, i am right there with you on the irl mommy friends conundrum. i tried lll but i felt excluded because i don't ec and didn't hb. i am way too interactive with dd for most mamas the playgrounds, who sit on the sidelines and then swoop in with orders to share. another complicating factor is dd's maturity level and/or temperment -- means lots of mamas of similarly aged kids are competitive. i'll be your friend. our babes sound like twins so much of the time.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*maela*, i am right there with you on the irl mommy friends conundrum. i tried lll but i felt excluded because i don't ec and didn't hb. i am way too interactive with dd for most mamas the playgrounds, who sit on the sidelines and then swoop in with orders to share. another complicating factor is dd's maturity level and/or temperment -- means lots of mamas of similarly aged kids are competitive. i'll be your friend. our babes sound like twins so much of the time.

Great! You want to move on over here to the central valley in CA?








I enjoyed my LLL meeting today. BTW, I am the only one in my LLL meeting that ECs (well, I'm more of a part-time ECer) and one of only two or three that HBed, but everyone there is very accepting and even interested, so it doesn't bother me. I think that I will be the odd one out when I am the only one not CLWing. I plan on _slowly_ (like over the course of a year) encouraging weaning once Dd turns two. I have no problem with CLWing, but I sometimes get the feeling that it's not accepted to MLW in my LLL group, so I don't know if they'll be fine with me, yk? Time will tell....


----------



## Maela

Boy, did I kill the thread or what?







48 hours since the last post. Is that a record on this thread?

Has anyone here ever ordered toys from Magic Cabin? I just got their catalog in the mail today, and their stuff is so cool! And it doesn't seem to be overpriced.


----------



## PiePie

you didn't kill the thread. my fantasy would be if dd would magically stop nursing on her 2nd bday.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Boy, did I kill the thread or what?







48 hours since the last post. Is that a record on this thread?

Has anyone here ever ordered toys from Magic Cabin? I just got their catalog in the mail today, and their stuff is so cool! And it doesn't seem to be overpriced.

Has it been that long already? Time gets away from me. I've been meaning to reply to your post....

I haven't ordered from Magic Cabin, but I also have their catalog and really like it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Great! You want to move on over here to the central valley in CA?








I enjoyed my LLL meeting today. BTW, I am the only one in my LLL meeting that ECs (well, I'm more of a part-time ECer) and one of only two or three that HBed, but everyone there is very accepting and even interested, so it doesn't bother me. I think that I will be the odd one out when I am the only one not CLWing. I plan on _slowly_ (like over the course of a year) encouraging weaning once Dd turns two. I have no problem with CLWing, but I sometimes get the feeling that it's not accepted to MLW in my LLL group, so I don't know if they'll be fine with me, yk? Time will tell....

It's interesting, I guess it's kind of a benefit of living in such a mainstream area - it doesn't take much to qualify as crunchy. I've only met one woman so far who ECs, and she's just getting started with it part-time. I've also found a lot of like-minded moms in Holistic Moms Network. Everyone is basically at their own level of crunchiness.







There is actually a new member mama from CA who was concerned whether the moms were judgemental with regard to how holistic the member were. I guess someone had warned them that that might be the case, since holistic lifestyles are so much more rare here than CA.









Anyway, I always had trouble fitting into one group or another too.

Also, I never thought about the distinction between CLW and MLW that way. I mean, I guess I considered nursing until at least 2 to pretty much be the same as CLW. I know it's not, really, but I think there's a big difference between that and weaning at a much younger age. I guess my LLL meeting is very casual too - it's usually just the leaders and me and maybe one or two other mamas. I went to the daytime meeting in another neighborhood once, and it was mostly brand new mamas - with babes under six weeks. I guess a lot of people just go at the start and don't keep going. But I like having the support and conversation.








MMM! I was wondering how you were doing. It's good to hear from you.


----------



## Holiztic

We've gotten a few things from Magic Cabin, as Quinn gets older we'll surely get more. We have been very happy with them and their products (we've bought mostly HABA stuff).

I am aiming to be done weaning around his 2nd birthday. I always said I'd got to 3, but I am really feeling ready, and he's mostly nursing at night so night weaning would just about be weaning, which is my current plan. Not sure how I'll do it, though!

Right now I am offering raw milk during the day unless he is nursing down for his nap. Like I said, he mostly nurses at night, so I only have to do this once or twice, and he doesn't mind one bit. Its the night nursing that's going to be a tough break. I'll think about that after Christmas I guess.

My LLL is anything from hospital (with the whole list of interventions) birthers whose babies sleep in a nursery, wear pampers, and are fully weaned by 1, to homebirthing ec-ers that nurse to 5. We have a local natural parenting group that works for my exclusively crunchy AP fix.


----------



## accountclosed3

nak

ok, forgot to ask doc abt non-cocktail vax--sorry! but, h is 25 and some inches amd 9 lbs! very lanky, but healthy!

and no more nipple shields! he just did it last week when t he shield fell off as he was going for it. gaven't looked back!

baby blessing was good--more when not nak--but when is that these days!

hiked hawk mt with hawk---saw only one sharp shinned! but mt was busy and loud so no doubt hawks stayed away!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I am aiming to be done weaning around his 2nd birthday. I always said I'd got to 3, but I am really feeling ready, and he's mostly nursing at night so night weaning would just about be weaning, which is my current plan. Not sure how I'll do it, though!

consider huggins' _nursing mother's guide to weaning_.


----------



## accountclosed3

first, the baby blessing was--overall--really lovely. about 25 people and for the most part beautiful blessings. i was so glad to have the people there whom we did, and i'm sure ryan will write a blog about it soon and you can all see the pictures and what not. give him a week, as he's coming back from the film festival that was this weekend.









second, my ils spent most of the time shaming and freaking out. it was embarassing to have that in front of all of our friends on a day when we were offering blessings to that lovely baby. good lord, you'd think they could be kosher for 2 hrs, but apparently not.

ryan's dad did a blessing that was more about shaming ryan "remember that you wouldn't be where you are without your parents, always seek their council. . .blah blah blah" i tuned it out after that because that is NOT what i want for H and it was obvious that FIL wanted that from ryan and i.

and, others confirmed that such was the case. they're disasters. i look forward to moving far from them, but it would stink to move away form my parents who are cool.

except that my mother--currently overweight as is my sister--like to put it onto me as if i'm the cause of the weight gain and of course, i also "need to loose a lot of weight" and my "tummy is a real problem area." even though i'm just 10 lbs from my pre-preggo weight, and i think that's mostly boob at this point. LOL

no, seriously, 7 wks post partum and needing to loose so little is good. i feel like i can be bikini ready by christmas, even though i'm not gonig to the islands then. LOL!

anyway, my mom has body issues.


----------



## PiePie

*zoebird*, good for you for recognizing that they are her issues. my mom was not so blunt before dd's baptism (the first time she saw me post-partum) but when i asked which of 2 dresses looked better she justified her choice as "slenderizing." i was already very self-conscious about the belly bulge so it wasn't great.

speaking of the belly bulge, small and not so small children keep insisting i "must" be pregnant.







:







in one case, dh not so charitably noted (to me, not to the child) that i am way smaller than her mother. but in my case it is all in the waist/hips. i want to add exercise to my life but everything feels like it would be taking away from time with dd which i don't want to do because of the separation already in place for work.







if she were like 3 i could justify it as setting a good example for her but really at this point i think all she knows is i am with her or i'm not.


----------



## witchygrrl

*zoe*, ugh, i'm sorry about your ILs just wanting to shame you and act inappopriately. As for the weight issues thing, I am glad you recognize who it belongs to. Why do women have to criticize other women so soon after a baby anyway? I don't get it. I'm glad the baby blessing went well otherwise.

I'm right around my pre-preggo weight, though I'm not as strong as I usually am, so it's less muscle. None of my fav shirts fit right though as I have way more boob than I normally do. I've also found I need longer shirts in general, too. And DH and I have gotten a wicked sweet tooth lately, which has caused me to put on a few back that I had lost. Oh well.

Yesterday was the memorial service for my grandmother (finally after a whole fraking year!). The aunt I had really wanted to attend was sidelined because she had a stage 1 melanoma removed, and her doc told her not to fly. My other aunt who had largely planned it didn't drive me too crazy. Rhea was a champ, though she was totally overstimulated, so we had to retire upstairs where it could be quiet enough for her to eat.

holiztic, great to hear from you! It seems like I hear nightweaning is hardest anyway, but so far it sounds like things are going well-ish. good luck!


----------



## Maela

*Zoebird*, glad to hear that nursing is going so well! And that the blessing went well despite your ILs. My mom can also be very blunt/perfectionist when it comes to weight.


----------



## snozzberry

*PiePie,* I hear you on the exercise. Is there something you could do with dd? Like a fast walk every day? Or a mommy & me class or DVD? Or even just a DVD that you invite dd to join in on?

*zoebird,* glad to hear the blessing went well and *witchygrrl,* also glad to hear the memorial service went well and that you had a quiet place to take Rhea to. (I never understood the importance of that until the last few weeks: If I even *blow my nose* while Abby's nursing, she stops and stares at me, then refuses to eat again. I stare daggers at DH whenever he walks into the bedroom talking while Abby's nursing.)

*Pre-pg weight:* I'm within 3-4 pounds of it, which is nice but obviously I'd like to be back where I was before! Things are definitely bulging in different places now because even 3-4 lbs off, I still can't fit into the bulk of my pre-pg pants. So I am biting the bullet and buying new clothes for work because it's been 8 months and nothing's really changed that much in the last 2 months anyway.

*Nanny search:* We interviewed a GREAT nanny this weekend. She knew what the amber teething necklace was...first person IRL ever to know that!







She is very into natural stuff! Yay!

We have 2 more interviews scheduled with others on Mon & Tue, but I'm feeling pretty certain. DH wants to go ahead & interview them since we already set them up. So I guess my next step is to check refs...yay!!!!!!! I am *so* ready to get my work done during the day and not from 11 pm-2 am.

I have like 5 minutes til Abby wakes up from her am nap so gotta run & get some stuff done!


----------



## accountclosed3

can i do a plug for a good workout? i bought that "10-minute trainer" series from beachbody.com. seriously, it's a good series.

about a week after H was born, i started doing the 10 minutes. it's about all i could handle away from him, and he from me. i would ask ryan to hold him and so the 10 minutes or so, and if H was quiet and happy, i might have done 2 or 3 of the workouts.

it was really good, really convenient, and a good workout (and i like a good workout). and at just 10 minutes (14 total if you count the warm up and cool down), i really couldn't justify NOT doing it. and, often R would be there holding H while i did it anyway.

between that and walking, i felt like my pelvic floor was getting back in action. and, there's a yoga segment that's not bad. i didn't do that, though. i did about 10 minutes of yoga a day with H (mostly floor work to start), and now i do about 30 without him (ryan watching him) plus walking 4 miles a day.

i now feel strong enough to start my weight training--i'll do 30 minutes once a week while ryan holds H. don't want to do any day care stuff. and, i have a friend who is going to babysit H for me at the yoga studio while i take a class--which is sweet.

oh, and i have a massage this week--finally and thank goodness! i need it!

anyway, i feel really good overall, but i relaly felt that that 10 minute trainer was a good option for people who are super busy. at first i thought it might be a gimmick, but once i tried it, it ws really good.

so, an option.


----------



## PiePie

i have one of those 10 minute dvds. i intend to try it. TONIGHT!


----------



## Maela

Please feel free to tell me if I am being too stubborn/unreasonable:

My LLL leader brought over three bags of really cute clothes for Dd last month. There are 2 pretty Christmassy dresses that are in great condition. I really like them. And I love the fact that they were free and secondhand. The other day my mom told me about a dress that she saw at the store that she wants to buy Dd for Christmas (to wear on Christmas). I reminded her about the really cute dresses we already have. My mom said that she's the grandma and she should be able to buy Dd special things. I tried to get her to understand how we're trying to consume less and reuse things. My mom doesn't understand. She said that she's paying for it so why does it matter. I said because it's still being made by poorly-paid workers and bought for our daughter. we want to try to have a smaller "footprint". I know I hurt my moms feelings, but it bothers me to know that I have two perfectly good dresses right now. Why would we want to get a new one? Should I just let her buy the dress? Or should I tell her that next year if we don't have one already she can be incharge of getting one? Am I being too stubborn?
My mom thinks my "tree-hugger" ideas are silly.














:


----------



## witchygrrl

Why can't she buy her something else, if she really needs to BUY her things? I think you're handling it fine.


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, i try to redirect my mom toward stuff that i really do need for dd, like pretty darn soon a snowsuit. that is honoring her impulse to spend and provide for her granddaughter and be the one doing the choosing and yet also meeting my needs. but your question was is it worth the fight. for me it would depend how often she did it. once or twice a year, i would let it go. more than that, i would feel compelled to step up and try to put a stop to it. but at the end of the day we can control only ourselves.


----------



## arelyn

My mom doesn't ask. She just buys and will only produce a reciept if it doesn't fit. Buying new stuff is a big thing for my Mom (she was really poor growing up with two older sisters so she only got new clothes from the church Christmas party) so I don't make a big deal out of it. I don't want something relatively small to damage our already shaky relationship. Your situation might be radically different though. It's hard to tell without knowing your mom IRL. I'd try to be sensitive to her though. Obviously she views buying stuff as a grandmotherly duty and seems to be doing it to show love. She might take you rejecting her stuff the same way you might take someone rejecting a hug. Or if you made someone something nice from scratch and they replied with, "Why'd you waste so much time? You could have just bought me one at the store."

In future you might want to word your response to her talking about buying an unwanted item something like this, "Oh that sounds beautiful but one of my friends already gave her one and she took the tags off it so I can't return it!" (It's technically true!) I used this with some family member and it worked well (right now I can't think much less remember the exact item, I've had to retype this three times to make it make sense...I need to go to bed.)

Please in no way take this as me being snarky or whatever the word for it is. I'm just throwing ideas out there and trying to be helpful but I have the bad tendency to say stuff in an inappropiate manner and not notice until later when someone else calls me on it. No judgements at all are meant by any of this. And I'm really tired so this is an ideal time to put my foot in my mouth inadvertently.

On a cool note I just got a copy of "Country Wisdom and Know How" and it is awsome. It has so many good ideas (most complete with diagrams)!!


----------



## Maela

Thanks for the advice everyone. *Arelyn*, I'm not offended easily; you didn't offend me at all.







My mom grew up poor also, with two older sisters. She always wanted my sister and I to have new things and not to have to wear too many hand-me-downs; so I guess I understand where she's coming from. I, on the other hand, have always been thrilled to get things from people that were once theirs and now are being passed on to me. She can't understand that.
And our relationship has been somewhat shaky in the last few months. Dh and I have been having a really hard time with her always giving us advice on EVERYTHING in regards to Dd. I think it's the way she words it ("You should really do XYZ, if you don't ABC could happen." instead of "You know what worked for me? I did XYZ.") In her mind, she is always right. Dh hates being told how to do things. I'm tired of debating things with her (and my GMIL). I just want to find a few parenting books that I really like and pass them out as Christmas gifts. Then I can just tell them to refer to the book I gave them when they start lecturing me about something.







: I'm not going to do that, of course....but I'm tempted. I'm not good at debating, and the books could just do it for me.









Anyway, I think what I'll do is ask her to buy me some cute fancy shoes to match the dress. Also I need a pretty shirt to go underneath it.


----------



## PiePie

we've got the same deal with a grandmother (my mother) not loving hand-me-downs. fortunately she has reconciled herself to them (because she doesn't have the money to buy dd a new wardrobe every few months) with small exceptions, e.g., shoes. *maela*, perfect suggestion. *arelyn*, i still think we should set our moms up.


----------



## PiePie

thank you all fo rencouraging me to exercise. i did part of a mommy-baby yoga dvd with dd and i felt much better. still pretty high stress levels but my neck feels better.







:


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, another way to interpret your mom's comments -- instead as cutting you down as a parent -- is expressing her grandmotherly bond to dd, which you do want her to have, right? and then just praise the lord that you are the parent and get the final say.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*maela*, another way to interpret your mom's comments -- instead as cutting you down as a parent -- is expressing her grandmotherly bond to dd, which you do want her to have, right? and then just praise the lord that you are the parent and get the final say.

Yes, I do want her to have a bond with both of her grandmothers. She does, and it makes me so happy to see how happy Dd is when she sees her grandparents. It's just hard because my mom will keep bugging us about stuff, if we don't follow her advice. And she acts as if she feels bad for Dd because of some of the things we do differently from her. I guess I just need to keep saying, "This is what works for us mom. Dd's happy and Dh and I are happy with it."


----------



## witchygrrl

*maela*, I think her getting shoes and a shirt is just fine.

But I hear you on the comments getting to you. MIL thinks we co-sleep (as an example) simply because we don't have room for a crib (which we don't). So she was trying to give us suggestions as to where to move other furniture so we could potentially make room for a crib. Except that I want to co-sleep--we're happy this way. She doesn't ever get that we could be fine the way we are and always has to second-guess us (esp in terms of material things).

DH thinks I should just shut her down, but I have a hard time doing that because she's only got the best in mind for us, or at least, what she thinks is best for us. And maybe that's all it is with your mother. Maybe say something like, I know that you've only got the best of intentions with your advice. But what we do is what we feel is best for our family, and so far it has worked well. When there comes a time when we're stumped, believe me, we will come to you for advice!


----------



## PiePie

i am feeling more like a freak of a parent now that i've got a toddler. it seems that we are really rejecting a lot of social norms by not saying no just because. we are not so into manners for manners sake. so for example we let her climb on our coffee table with dh spotting her. i get a lot of flak for 1. being lax re safety (i do care about safety but i care about exploration and my view of what is truly dangerous seems to be narrower than most) 2. not teaching her what is "appropriate." i guess it is hitting us how our vision of appropriate is really different. also how our vision of appropriate is dependent on age in a way that others' isn't. thus for example it isn't okay for our 10 yo to stand on the coffee table but then again it wouldn;'t be so cool fo rour 10 yo to drool on us either! so glad dh and i are on the same page re this. i feel so alfie kohn.


----------



## TinyFrog

Another recommendation along with the shoes/shirt instead of yet another dress is BabyLegs/Huggalugs/etc or maybe some Hanna tights.


----------



## katt

buying granddaughters cute sweet special holiday dresses are almost a right of passage for grandmas. Or some other special holiday outfits, ya know?
We ask my MIL to buy DS shoes. Which is nice, cause the shoes we like are expensive and since he's her only grandchild.... we're all happy.

Maybe DD needs a nice winter coat? that way it is something she can wear all the time and your mom will get to buy her a super nice coat. who knows.

I agree that if she does it all the time it would be something to address, if not, then I'd let it slide 1 or 2x a year.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

*zoebird,* glad to hear the blessing went well and *witchygrrl,* also glad to hear the memorial service went well and that you had a quiet place to take Rhea to. (I never understood the importance of that until the last few weeks: If I even *blow my nose* while Abby's nursing, she stops and stares at me, then refuses to eat again. I stare daggers at DH whenever he walks into the bedroom talking while Abby's nursing.)

Yes! Same here. I often feel the need to explain this to other AP & nursing mamas. Pretty much the only place she'll nurse outside the house is in the car - and only if the radio is not on, because if the dj starts talking, it's all over.

Good luck with the nanny search Kelly!

Ok, since we're talking about weight - I'm now about 7 lbs under my prepreg weight. Which is great because I was struggling to lose weight (~15 lbs) for about 5 years before that. So now my prepreg jeans are fitting better than before, except&#8230;.I have no butt.







I'm having trouble keeping my pants up, especially with a back-carrier on. I guess sitting at a computer all day required some butt muscles? Haha, no I really guess it's because I did more fast walking before; trying to increase that now. Thanks for the dvd rec zoebird! And of course tops are a different story - with indcrease in boobs, ribs and a paunch. I'm quite topheavy these days.

Maela, funny, I was just doing some shopping on ebay for a Christmas-y dress. I don't think you're being unreasonable at all; and I can see the same situation coming up with my MIL in the future. I'm not really sure of the proper way to handle it, but it frustrates me - she keeps sending over more stuff that she bought; but it's always stuff that we absolutely don't need - instead of asking us what we do need.

I would love to ask MIL to buy shoes for J. Except, so far she hasn't given her 3 pairs of shoes, but none are what we're looking for. She gave us a little pair of tie-on boots last Christmas (before she was born!), and when the weather finally got cooler, I could barely get them on her feet let alone tie them over her chubby ankles.

Speaking of shoes - can anyone recommend something? I'm looking for something just to keep dd's feet warm for the winter. She'll be 8-11 MO, so something non-slip would be good too, since I'm sure she'll be pulling up soon.. I got a pair of fleece-line boots on ebay, but again, they don't really fit over her ankles. I am even having trouble getting Robeez on her feet.


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, i have now sampled 3 brands of soft-soled shoes, and i think that see kai run are the best made -- truly butter soft leather -- and the least slippery on the bottom -- little circles of treds in the midst of a soft sole overall. you want the see kai run "smaller" version (if you want soft sole). pedipeds are wider than robeez. robeez are the thinnest/softest sole, which is what i was looking for in a first shoe. i would estimate that pedipeds and see kai run are about the same thickness of sole; pedipeds is a little more fashionable and skr is better made. both have velcro over the ankle rather than the robeez elastic. i prefer the elastic because it makes them harder to get off. p.s. i didn't use shoes for her until she took off walking -- not convinced shoes are much warmer than socks -- and aren't those trumpettes too cute.

eta: out of the box, robeez are the least slippery on the bottom, but they soon get worn smooth.


----------



## accountclosed3

so, today was/is a strange day.

i had a lot of self doubt today. being that i'm a rather quiet and contemplative person (which you probably wouldn't know from my long posts), i tend to have long, quiet days. they are full, and always have been, but also very quiet.

so, my dad has been saying since H was born that i need to be sure that i'm "chatty" throughout the day with him, and then when i'm around my parents, they "show" me how to be chatty with him.

it seems strange to me, because i feel like i'm doing a good job overall. i'm attentive to his cries (used dunsten techique--not sure of the spelling, but she has those 5 sounds babies make and what they mean. "neh" means hungry, but with H, it also means "i'm about to go to the bathroom" particularly if followed by an "eeeAAAHHHhhheh" sound. which, btw, makes his mouth look super cute when he makes that shape!), i talk to him whenever he is awake or in that calm alert stage by telling him what i'm doing or what we're doing or what not--and of course, he's around and sometimes asleep or awake when i'm talking to someone else (like ryan or a friend or a yoga student--he's so cute in class: i was wearing him and usually he sleeps, but this day he was wide eyed and i did an adjustment on my client and she smiled and then he smiled at her and went "eee--ahh!" which just about made everyone melt!).

but, i think they fear that i'm not "doing enough" and beyond that, i went and read the Dr Sears book about developmental stages and they were talking about certain toys that they used. . .and i was like "i'm a slacker mom who doesn't appropriately stimulate her child!"

and add to that the fact that ECing is really rough right now (mostly because i'm busy and i catch the cue when driving or something and the time between cue and going is about 10 seconds, so no time to pull over, etc! so i'm not catching as much as i would like!) and i *really* feel like a slacker mom.

and then of course, my house is in disarray. before i left for my parents for the weekend, i managed to straighten up just a smidge before running off. then, coming back my mom didn't stick around enough for me to get everything put away before ryan came home, and so i have my suitcase and the laundry basket of clean laundry and the "diaper bag" which basically carries hawk's supplies of various sorts--the wrap, my "purse," and the "diaper bag" which is basically wipes and a few cloth spares and a dirty bag--all of which need to be unloaded, put away, etc.

the laundry piled up as i am out of detergent (going to get more tomorrow!); the dishes piled up because ryan got frustrated and i think H is in another growth change because he's a constant nurser right now and won't be in a sling while nursing no matter how hard i try, and of course, i just feel crazy.

so, again, just some slacker mom over here!

oh, and i'm supposed to be doing some work for the teacher training this weekend--another hand out--and i'm slacking on that. . .though ryan insists that i'll get some compy time early tomorrow night to do that work. . .and it's not much really. . .but i still feel like a slacker.

on the plus side, though, i got a yoga class in while the babe slept because my friend went for a nice walk while babywearing. then, in the afternoon, ryan and i walked in valley forge for a good couple of miles with him wearing the baby. and then tonight, the baby went to sleep and i could actually leave his side sweet thing!

and i was able to fold laundry and put it away, and put away some of the clean stuff i brought back from my parents.

so perhaps not so much of a slacker afterall!

someone kept telling me that i need to put him on a sleeping/feeding schedule. i don't know if that's possible with him yet. i figure by about 5-6 months he'll have one developed on his own. am i basically righta bout that? i dunno, i'm just going by feel.


----------



## witchygrrl

I don't think you're a slacker mom, not in any way more than I am. Also Rhea's only a month older than Hawk, and here I am, a trained theoretical and applied linguist, and I don't talk to my baby enough. So I get that.

Oh, I don't have a lot in the way of toys, either beyond a bunch of stuffed animals, a few cloth books, and a rattle or two (that she can't use on her own yet).

What we do is when she gets antsy is that we walk around the house and I point out the various knicknacks and pictures on the wall, and explain all of them to her. DH reads her stories (though I do too, sometimes, though I find I often get very tired reading aloud and yawn a lot). And now that she's very chatty herself, we have conversations. At night, she gives us her "pronouncements" where she goes on for about 10-15 minutes.

Developmentally, I'd say she's right on to a bit advanced in most things. She totally wishes she could get around on her own.

Don't worry about it Zoe, I'm sure Hawk's fine.

And PiePie--thanks for the tips on shoes. I'd love it if DH would just make her moccasins, but the kit we liked is not available for order ATM. We do have knit booties that look like Maryjanes--cute!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Maybe say something like, I know that you've only got the best of intentions with your advice. But what we do is what we feel is best for our family, and so far it has worked well. When there comes a time when we're stumped, believe me, we will come to you for advice!

Thanks, I like this! I'll have to try it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am feeling more like a freak of a parent now that i've got a toddler. it seems that we are really rejecting a lot of social norms by not saying no just because. we are not so into manners for manners sake. so for example we let her climb on our coffee table with dh spotting her. i get a lot of flak for 1. being lax re safety (i do care about safety but i care about exploration and my view of what is truly dangerous seems to be narrower than most) 2. not teaching her what is "appropriate." i guess it is hitting us how our vision of appropriate is really different. also how our vision of appropriate is dependent on age in a way that others' isn't. thus for example it isn't okay for our 10 yo to stand on the coffee table but then again it wouldn;'t be so cool fo rour 10 yo to drool on us either! so glad dh and i are on the same page re this. i feel so alfie kohn.

















: I understand!

*ZB*, I'm sure you're doing a great job. Our house was messy most of the first year, and it still gets messy for a couple of hours every day. But now I can usually clean up a bit while she's napping or when Dh gets home from work and it only takes about 30 min because it doesn't build up. Dd can play in her room by herself long enough for me to be able to do a quick cleaning in the bathroom.
And I had days where I just did not feel like talking much too. The other day at the park I was talking to a father as we were pushing our babies in the swings. He spoke broken english. He said that he's noticed how American parents talk so much to their babies. He said that in his culture (not sure where exactly he was from , but I'm assuming S. America) they don't talk so much to the babies. He didn't say it was a good or bad thing, just an observation. I think I also read something about that in CC? Not sure.
I remember that I used to carry Dd around to each room of our house and tell her about it (what it was called, what was in it, what we did there, etc.). She would always listen like she was actually interested.







So cute.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
someone kept telling me that i need to put him on a sleeping/feeding schedule. i don't know if that's possible with him yet. i figure by about 5-6 months he'll have one developed on his own. am i basically righta bout that? i dunno, i'm just going by feel.


i don't think anyone thinks that kids have a sleep sched at H.'s age; the general rule is 6 mos., and some extremists say as early as 4 mos. i imposed nap start times at 4-5 mos. for my own sanity (would lie down in bed with her and offer boob at 11 and 4 every day, and she would just conk out, and if she didn't that was okay too) and a bedtime at 7.75 mos., so i had a little personal time at home once i went back to work (i put her down at 9:30, which is usually before i go down myself). didn't develop an eating sched until 12 mos. and even then it's not much of a sched.; it applies only to when we offer solids, so boob is available whenever. and on the sleep schedule, she can wake up and partake whenever and i am not sure of the frequency but don't think there's a regular pattern to it.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 

Speaking of shoes - can anyone recommend something? I'm looking for something just to keep dd's feet warm for the winter. She'll be 8-11 MO, so something non-slip would be good too, since I'm sure she'll be pulling up soon.. I got a pair of fleece-line boots on ebay, but again, they don't really fit over her ankles. I am even having trouble getting Robeez on her feet.

We LOVE Hanna Andersson's swedish mocassins (no idea how to spell that!) Quinn wore them last winter (so same age as J) they stay on, can go over socks for extra warmth or alone (since they are already socks!). The bottom is non-slip suede, but not actually grippy, if that matters to you. He's actually wearing some now (we're on our third size, we have a total of 8 pairs of them in 3 sizes. They machine wash well and air dry in about a day.

Good luck!

OOPSS; didn't even think about outside! These are for inside only!!! Not sure which you meant!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i don't think anyone thinks that kids have a sleep sched at H.'s age; the general rule is 6 mos., and some extremists say as early as 4 mos. i imposed nap start times at 4-5 mos. for my own sanity (would lie down in bed with her and offer boob at 11 and 4 every day, and she would just conk out, and if she didn't that was okay too) and a bedtime at 7.75 mos., so i had a little personal time at home once i went back to work (i put her down at 9:30, which is usually before i go down myself). didn't develop an eating sched until 12 mos. and even then it's not much of a sched.; it applies only to when we offer solids, so boob is available whenever. and on the sleep schedule, she can wake up and partake whenever and i am not sure of the frequency but don't think there's a regular pattern to it.

This is helpful--the ILs keep asking if Rhea's on a schedule yet. I'll keep this in mind next time they say something about a schedule, and again when it's actually time.

Meant to add something about last night. DH likes to tell his mother whatever's happening with the baby, even if it's unnecessary, and then gets a dumb answer. Like last night she was fussing too much to eat even though she was really hungry. We finally quieted her down and she got on the boob and ate peacefully. THAT'S when DH decided to call MIL about the weekend, and I'm thinking oh ye gods help me.

His mother thought that he had said she had FORGOTTEN HOW TO EAT, and suggested giving her a bottle because it's easier. Even after correcting her 3 times that that was NOT what he said, that's all she had to offer.

I told him not to tell his mother things like that because 1. I want her to actually REALIZE what a good thing breastfeeding is, and not think of it as a chore, and 2. he's just going to get a stupid answer when it comes to bf'ing and any sort of AP/NFL parenting issues, and he knows it, so why bring things up that will get that result? No filter, that one.


----------



## farmama

cking,

Quote:

I really guess it's because I did more fast walking before; trying to increase that now.
don't worry. you'll get plenty of fast walking in when she starts walking. oh boy.

oh, and another vote for See Kai Run. the Robeez were too tight on dd's ankles, and although i liked the pedipeds, the leather soles are mostly good for inside, early walking. n wore through hers in NO time.

Speaking of NO TIME, lots more to say, but no time!


----------



## accountclosed3

thanks about the schedule things--that's what i figured anyway.

when people ask if he's on a schedule, i tell them the schedule that he has. this typically satisfies them. i say that he eats every 3 hrs or so during the day with a sleep time in the morning and afternoon, when we go for our walks, and how long he's awake and playing/talking, etc. then, i describe that he goes 4-5 hrs between feedings between 8:00 pm and 8:00 am on average (goes down at 8:30, wakes at 12:30 or 1, goes down again until 4 or so, and then up again at 7 though may hold off until 8. totally depends. and sometimes, he'll get up at 5 or so instead of four, etc, sometimes 3 instead of 4 and so on).

people seem satisfied to hear the general schedule, as if i've schedule him. i just do whatever he wants. LOL

on the IL front, we came up with yet another effort. LOL we'll see how this one goes. first, i've invited them to babysit while i teach at the studio on sat and thurs ams. this will be without us policing, which means i needed to come up with a plan for that. with this, htough, i dno't think they'll be too keen on driving 1.5 hrs to hang 1.25 hrs and then drive home again--as i asserted that i do have to 'get back to my business' aftr class and so does ryan (as sats are now a specialized writing time and i'm hanging with some friends each sat afternoon for the most part). so, i don't think they're going to do it often.

second, we want to get them into the picture, and came up with a plan with my parents. we have decided to buy and get all family members--including our sisters--copies of Alfie Kohn's Unconditional Parenting. We are going to tell them that we are really inspiried by this style of parenting and want it to be consistent throughout all of his caregivers.

with this, we're going to set a deadline because god knows that if i just gave them a book it would sit there. so, my parents have agreed that we'll "workshop" the questions in the back of the book at thanksgiving as a group--his parents, my parents, and us. Opie, too, of course, but we're not going to get her a copy of the book, but ask his parents to pass it along to her if they think it would be a good plan.

what i know about his parents is that they will force themselves to read something within a deadline particularly if they h ave to "preform" such as having answers to the questions in the book to workshop. and if they have to "preform" in front of my parents, they'll really be motivated to prepare.

the reason we're sending copies to the sister's is because when SIL gets her's, she'll tell her mom and they'll not feel "singled out" and realize that it's likely that my whole family got it too. and, we'll tell them this as well.

so, with luck, we'll be able to at least "force feed" them the information and plerhaps they're language will change a bit. it has every time ryan and i have "corrected" it by redirecting the language given to hawk.

such as "oh, you talk too much" when hawk was expressing that he had a dirty diaper and wanted to eat with "oh, we are so thankful that you communicate with us so well!" and so on.

she doesn't repeat the line agan, and usually makes it neutral after that--so MIL is learning quickly. FIL is a pain, but that's another story.

i have to take us to get our massages now!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
on the IL front, we came up with yet another effort. LOL we'll see how this one goes. first, i've invited them to babysit while i teach at the studio on sat and thurs ams. this will be without us policing, which means i needed to come up with a plan for that. with this, htough, i dno't think they'll be too keen on driving 1.5 hrs to hang 1.25 hrs and then drive home again--as i asserted that i do have to 'get back to my business' aftr class and so does ryan (as sats are now a specialized writing time and i'm hanging with some friends each sat afternoon for the most part). so, i don't think they're going to do it often.

second, we want to get them into the picture, and came up with a plan with my parents. we have decided to buy and get all family members--including our sisters--copies of Alfie Kohn's Unconditional Parenting. We are going to tell them that we are really inspiried by this style of parenting and want it to be consistent throughout all of his caregivers.

with this, we're going to set a deadline because god knows that if i just gave them a book it would sit there. so, my parents have agreed that we'll "workshop" the questions in the back of the book at thanksgiving as a group--his parents, my parents, and us. Opie, too, of course, but we're not going to get her a copy of the book, but ask his parents to pass it along to her if they think it would be a good plan.

what i know about his parents is that they will force themselves to read something within a deadline particularly if they h ave to "preform" such as having answers to the questions in the book to workshop. and if they have to "preform" in front of my parents, they'll really be motivated to prepare.

the reason we're sending copies to the sister's is because when SIL gets her's, she'll tell her mom and they'll not feel "singled out" and realize that it's likely that my whole family got it too. and, we'll tell them this as well.

so, with luck, we'll be able to at least "force feed" them the information and plerhaps they're language will change a bit. it has every time ryan and i have "corrected" it by redirecting the language given to hawk.

such as "oh, you talk too much" when hawk was expressing that he had a dirty diaper and wanted to eat with "oh, we are so thankful that you communicate with us so well!" and so on.

she doesn't repeat the line agan, and usually makes it neutral after that--so MIL is learning quickly. FIL is a pain, but that's another story.

i have to take us to get our massages now!

Oh man, I wish this would work with our families! They would think we were so weird and would probably also be offended (especially my mom). But this is what I was talking about being tempted to do. I still might give one of the books I liked - Taking Back Childhood - to my ILs because I think they could use it. They take care of my nephew quite often - he has an unstable home life (won't go into details, but it's a big mess







).


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

:
wow - i can't believe how quiet i have been. it's just not like me at all!

*ZB:* your IL's continue to make my jaw drop. Perhaps I should feel grateful that DP's father is yet to acknowledge our pregnancy. I like the idea of the Kohn workshop though - hope it works!
And you are NOT a slacker mum. Not one bit. It sounds to me though like you could probably use a bit more support.

*Maela:* You've no doubt made a decision about the xmas dress by now but I would think that if you can't redirect the money spending to something you need, then indulge your mum, let her buy the dress and perhaps donate one or two of the others - I have a one in, two out rule for DP who is a hoarder which isn't quite the same as your conundrum but sometimes you have to pick your battles and if you can make a little compromise with yourself in order to do so, it can help.
*
Shanna:* Funny dream! I'm really hoping that Squeak can enter the world in the bath at our birth centre...just like Fenton did. I hope there was some kind of significance in your dream!!
I find it so strange that we can dream about people we don't even know, let alone know what we look like. Way back, I had a dream about PiePie before I had even seen photos of her - it's really bizarro.

*Me update:* 33 weeks tomorrow. I'm really starting to feel every bit pregnant now. Some days are great, others I feel like I'm all squashed up with a very grumpy baby inside. I've also had a few bad episodes where my pelvis has felt like it's splitting in 2 but after a trip to the osteopath yesterday, I'm confident that that's fixed.

We did our birth plan with our doula on Monday night. She's so awesome - I can't imagine birthing without her. She and DP get along really well which is great and DP is thrilled that I pushed the doula thing. I'm really getting very excited about birth. I can't stop reading and soaking up every last bit of knowledge and am super keen to finish work so I can do more reading. 3 weeks left of work - and with a public holiday, my regular days off and my farewell do thrown in there, only 8 actual working days!

_Other random things..._
I'm finally reading Wolf's, _Misconceptions_. There are bits in there that really irk me and other bits that I could have written myself. I know most of you have read it and I think you felt the same, right? I do like that she really acknowledges the *work* of pregnancy. Not many books do that.

My sister is heading to the US for 3 months in November. She asked me before she booked the tickets if I would be ok with her being gone for Squeaks birth. I didn't feel entitled to say no but I'm really sad about it now. I know it's selfish but the Australian dollar has dropped to 60cents against the US (compared to 98cents when she booked the tickets) and I'm really hoping she at least cuts the trip short. (btw - the dollar thing is odd - our economy is really strong compared to the US, so why has our dollar lost value? makes no sense and now I can't afford to buy the wall decal I want from etsy!!!)

It's getting HOT here. October and already we're having 30degree (~90f) days. I'm so glad this boy is coming at the beginning of summer.

I think PiePie is in Mexico. Poor thing!









Thinking of you all and missing the eternal banter that seems to have stagnated here.







:


----------



## snozzberry

*Biting:* What do you do when your DC bites while nursing? I've tried pushing her into me, but then she just bites harder (tho that did work when she was younger). I've tried popping her off with my pinky finger. Tried both latching right back on *and* sitting her up and waiting a few minutes before trying again, but the biting continues. Ow.


----------



## blizzard_babe

Just dropping in to apologize for doing such an awful job at being "back." Life has been busy with baby and work and a new WAH venture we're putting together (DH being the SAHP, but both of us working on stuff)...

Off to clean the bathroom.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oh man, I wish this would work with our families! They would think we were so weird and would probably also be offended (especially my

ç

ditto. my mom would take it as a huge assault on how she raised us, which is to say, so not alfie kohn. i think becoming the parent you want to be might work better, accept it does not totally endorse cosleeping which is perhaps my mother´s biggest bugaboo with us. in my heart of hearts i believe that dd will understand that different people work different ways and, absent abuse, exposure to those differently styles will be part of her emotional education. at bottom i think what we as parents do with her is infinitely more important, and will make her resilient enough that other stuff will just roll right off. maela, i sort of think that your fam stuff is more your issue than dd´s, just a thought.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Biting:* What do you do when your DC bites while nursing? I've tried pushing her into me, but then she just bites harder (tho that did work when she was younger). I've tried popping her off with my pinky finger. Tried both latching right back on *and* sitting her up and waiting a few minutes before trying again, but the biting continues. Ow.


i end the nursing session and pass her off to dh who has a bottle of ebm. i am not okay with denying her food when hungry and i want to honor the impulse to bite (happens only when teething) so i am happy to redirect that toward an artificial nipple that she can bite. have had to do this like twice. it helps that she will take the bottle but prefers me.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 







:
I have a one in, two out rule for DP who is a hoarder

how the heck did you sell her on that


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 







:
Way back, I had a dream about PiePie before I had even seen photos of her - it's really bizarro.


makes total sense to me. i feel like this community is something so special.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I think PiePie is in Mexico. Poor thing!









Thinking of you all and missing the eternal banter that seems to have stagnated here.







:


i am indeed in mex. dd loves the sand but is scared of the ocean. which is sad for me because i have some spiritual connection with it, but i am hoping if we keep being non pressuring she will outgrow it. dh let her come toward me as far as she wanted today and she was so proud of herself for coming closer.







she is also making tons of little friends attended a bday party today and had a little boy (21 mos.) kiss her open mouthed for like hours. also tackled a nudist european boy (her hugs can turn into tackles) but his mom screamed at me that he is not ready for girls! lol.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Biting:* What do you do when your DC bites while nursing? I've tried pushing her into me, but then she just bites harder (tho that did work when she was younger). I've tried popping her off with my pinky finger. Tried both latching right back on *and* sitting her up and waiting a few minutes before trying again, but the biting continues. Ow.

I would unlatch her, say "no biting" and then put her down out of my arms. It was the only thing that worked. I felt bad putting her down, but it was only for a minute or two. Then I would pick her back up and offer to nurse. Usually that would stop it, at least for the time being. She has not bitten in a long time.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
ç

ditto. my mom would take it as a huge assault on how she raised us, which is to say, so not alfie kohn. i think becoming the parent you want to be might work better, accept it does not totally endorse cosleeping which is perhaps my mother´s biggest bugaboo with us. in my heart of hearts i believe that dd will understand that different people work different ways and, absent abuse, exposure to those differently styles will be part of her emotional education. *at bottom i think what we as parents do with her is infinitely more important, and will make her resilient enough that other stuff will just roll right off.* maela, i sort of think that your fam stuff is more your issue than dd´s, just a thought.

Bolding mine.
I sure hope so. And I know that the situation could be so much worse. Today I realized that there are a couple of things that my mom has not bugged me about more than once (and that was before the birth). They are: bfing past a year and cosleeping. I know she disagrees with both, especially the cosleeping. So I should remember to be grateful about that.









Glad you're having fun in Mexico!!

I am really really wanting another baby right now.







We dtd without protection this week for the first time since Dd was born. I don't think anything will come of it; it wasn't really to start TTC, just laziness, and not really worrying if it does happen. We're really set on only having babies between April and August though (for various reasons), so it's sad to know that soon we need to start being careful to use protection always for the next seven or so months. But I'm feeling very ready to TTC again. July seems so far away. I never thought i would be so ready to TTC again so soon. I did not love the first year. But now I'm really liking this age, and I want more of these cute little things!

Also, I finally bought a new battery for my thermometer, so I'm charting again! Yay! Nothing exciting yet though, still no AF. It's just fun to be charting again.







What a dork.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Just finished _Misconceptions_ and I'm feeling very negative about impending motherhood now. That book is a serious downer. I really hope I'm not aspirationally naive about birth and parenthood.

I think I'm just in a temporary bad place because my pelvis feels like it's breaking in two, and I haven't been able to get off the couch for 2 days.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
how the heck did you sell her on that

I didn't, exactly.







She knows I throw her stuff out, she just doesn't know what and when. It hasn't gotten me into too much trouble...YET!


----------



## accountclosed3

it is true; i could use more support. ryan is continuing to drive me nuts with complaints about his schedule and "needs." yesterday and last night were particularly nasty, and he became very angry with me when i finally left the situation. that is, while arguing (and it's the same argument from him every time for the last 3-4 weeks), i simply leave the house and go for a walk (with hawk). and while sleeping, i decided to just sleep in another room because i couldn't just be awake nursing for hours on end with ryan snoring away next to me.

for whatever reason, his sleeping doesn't bother me so much as the snoring does. it's like rubbing it in my face or something.

---

after talking to my ILs, they agreed to read the book and workshop it with us. we're also going to send copies to our sister's. we'll workshop those around christmas (i figure a reiteration would be good).

now, my parents basically did what alfie talks about, so they likely won't be offended (though i think my dad will be offended by some things). but, i am sure my ILs are going to be very upset by the first 7 or so chapters at least! but, they are at least willing to read the book and workshop it with us at thanksgiving.

i think that the approach is what made it possible. we worked to develop how to approach his parents about it and came up with a method by which it was as if we're all learning about this together so that there is consistency in how hawk is treated with everyone.

this way, they see it as we're learning, my parents are learning, and so are they. not as in "you are freaks and need to learn or i'm out of here." which is totally how i feel.

i could use more sleep. and more help. but, i'm getting by.


----------



## accountclosed3

oh, and i don't think that you are naive about parenthood or birth. i don't think that anyone who hangs around here and works hard at this stuff really can be.

it's true that you don't know what it's going to be for you--that there are great unknowns--but most of us are ready to take on whatever comes. that to me is as prepared as one can be, and it sets you up to be a very successful and happy parent.

there are things in my parenting life that i could not have foreseen--such as ryan's continually negative behavior right now. i expected more support from him, and i haven't gotten what i expected or even what i basically need. bringing it up, we usually end up in a fight where he complains about his needs not being met, etc, and completely disregards how our lives have changed (for the better!) because of hawk.

and, that's hard on me.

but i don't think that i was somehow naive, and i really hated the insinuations from parents before hawk was born that i was naive or that i simply "had no idea." the truth is that i did have an idea--but there were a lot of unknowns.

and it's ok for there to be unknowns. it doesn't make one naive. you already know that birth and parenting are going to change everything, and you know that you can handle it!


----------



## accountclosed3

and, i agree that what we do is far more important than what anyone else would do, but i personally want to bear-attack people who are as ILs are around the baby. if i can find some way to help their behavior change without having to bear-attack them, then all the better.

seriously, it is about me feeling better, not necessarily about making them better--though i hope it helps.


----------



## Maela

MMM -









*ZB*, I hope you find a way to get some more support soon. Things will get better. I also sometime find myself feeling resentful that I'm the one that has to nurse Dd throughout the night (and always







). It can be frustrating and very tiring sometimes. Then I try to remember how on the other hand, I'm so lucky to be the only one to nurse her. It's a special bond.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i end the nursing session and pass her off to dh who has a bottle of ebm. i am not okay with denying her food when hungry and i want to honor the impulse to bite (happens only when teething) so i am happy to redirect that toward an artificial nipple that she can bite. have had to do this like twice. it helps that she will take the bottle but prefers me.

I like that idea. DD is becoming so drooly--we're wondering if she'll teeth early.

and i hear ya'll on the support issue. because rhea is having a growth spurt, she was a lot more wakeful for booby last night than usual. So I didn't sleep as much as I usually do. I asked DH if he could take Rhea for the morning and let me sleep. She had a bottle of ebm available if hungry. And I feel so much more rested now. It's a rare treat, but I'll take it.

And I'm finally starting a freezer stash. DH is so worried that if I can't be home to feed her for some reason, he keeps the free formula in the house. But I want it out (except for the organic similac--I'm amused by the idea of making milkshakes with it for me to pass along the vitamins to DD).


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I would unlatch her, say "no biting" and then put her down out of my arms. It was the only thing that worked. I felt bad putting her down, but it was only for a minute or two. Then I would pick her back up and offer to nurse. Usually that would stop it, at least for the time being. She has not bitten in a long time.

Okay, I will try that. I have enough trouble pumping right now (just can't get my milk to let down) that the EBM/nipple technique isn't a good option.







Nips hurt hurt hurt now.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I am really really wanting another baby right now.







We dtd without protection this week for the first time since Dd was born. I don't think anything will come of it; it wasn't really to start TTC, just laziness, and not really worrying if it does happen. We're really set on only having babies between April and August though (for various reasons), so it's sad to know that soon we need to start being careful to use protection always for the next seven or so months. But I'm feeling very ready to TTC again. July seems so far away. I never thought i would be so ready to TTC again so soon. I did not love the first year. But now I'm really liking this age, and I want more of these cute little things!

How exciting!







: It's nice to see you come around to it again because I am also not loving the first year. There are things I love about it, but on the whole, not so much.







:

*MMM*, I'm sorry you're hurting!







Your body is working hard right now putting the finishing touches on that little babe, but that doesn't make the pain any less.









*PiePie*, I'm sorry you're not getting more support right now.







I remember we fought more in those first few weeks. It will get better as everyone settles into a new life together.

*witchygrrl*, love the idea to make a formula smoothie! haha!

*Me update:* Abby's on only her SECOND nap of the day, when she's usually had FOUR naps by now. Argh.

Also, she's getting 2 top teeth in and is using the bottom teeth to cut into her top gums, and so she's bleeding a lot from her top gums.





















Now there's a scab on top but I don't think it will last long. Poor baby.


----------



## Maela

Poor Abby!

We only had *1* wet diaper today! Everything else was in the toilet!


----------



## snozzberry

Did you guys do any pain meds for teething? We are very anti-meds here but it seems inhumane to make her suffer this much pain.























She has a teething necklace, but still just in a lot of pain.


----------



## witchygrrl

*Snozz*, how about ice in a washcloth, with a rubber band to hold the ice in? she can suck on that, which should help bring some swelling down, I would think.

Also, I have Little Teethers by Little Remedies--the drug is benzocaine, but it doesn't have any weird ingredients like saccharine, which is why I'm keeping it in the house. Haven't had to use it yet, though...


----------



## witchygrrl

Oh, and I met my college roommate's baby for the first time--she's 6 weeks old! Her birth sounded like my nightmare though--her mother just went into the hospital after her water broke but didn't have any contrax, so she was put on pitocin within two hours. The pit did almost nothing for hours until WHAM! Then she went for the epidural, which hurt to get, and caused her blood pressure to drop very low. The only good thing of this was that it allowed her to sleep some before pushing, and then they let it wear off, so she could tell what she was doing during pushing. Then after two hours of pushing, baby was vaccuum extracted! Then mom got a dose of pit after! Yikes!

My friend was saying that she wished someone would have told her these side effects before she went in there, but she did no research on her own, didn't take classes, and so kept getting surprised by things. This from a woman with a BIO degree! I mean, if I had needed interventions, I knew what they were, what the potential side effects would have been, and I had a doula with me to help clear my mind and think about these things, if necessary. I'm not saying I didn't get surprised by what happened along the way, but that's more how my individual body works more than anything.

So I asked her if she had another baby, would she birth again this way? She said yeah, probably.









*MMM*, you're doing fine, honey. You're much better prepared, believe me. I just hope that you'll feel better soon.

And woot! *Maela*, that's great!!


----------



## Maela

No meds for the teething pain. I don't think it was ever that bad for Dd. I did give her wet washclothes to chew on, and she liked that.

*Witchy*, that's sad about your friend. It's sad that we can't trust OBs to inform us. Even if i hadn't done any research, i know I would have learned a lot from my mw. The prenatal appointments were an hour or two long. But with OBs it's in and out, and no info until they want to intervene and by then it's "too late."


----------



## witchygrrl

Yeah, I think her paramedic husband told her more than her OB. And oh yeah, I forgot about the episiotomy that they didn't tell her they gave her!







: I'm sorry, if someone's going to cut my vagina and perineum, you had better ASK ME first!

Of course, if my DH was a paramedic, I would have been more inclined to just UC









Oh, pics are now in my siggy!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am indeed in mex.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
ç


Aha! So that's how you accidentally typed that character.









ok, back to reading and mentally replying to posts....


----------



## cking

Kelly, we use Hylands teething tablets (homeopathic) occasionally. I also took a free sample of infants Tylenol the last time we were at our ped's. Haven't used it yet, but decided I wouldn't be against it if it got bad enough. The thing that seems to work best, similar to what witchy mentioned - is an ice cube in a sock. She can hold it and suck on it, usually devours it - at least when it's frozen EBM. She likes it better than any food so far.









have much more to say - be back later!


----------



## snozzberry

We will have to try the sock trick! Brilliant. I thought I heard something bad about Hyland's...was that just a rumor maybe? Never can trust mainstream "facts" about that stuff...

*Nanny update:* We found one! She came over for a couple hours to play with Abby today, and it went well. She worked up to holding Abby, and she was okay for a few seconds--at least as long as she'll let our friends hold her.


----------



## Maela

Witchy I can't see your pictures. Is anyone else having this problem?


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Witchy I can't see your pictures. Is anyone else having this problem?

The link just posted funny.

Delete the first http and you should be fine.


----------



## witchygrrl

whoops, all fixed. funny, it worked the first time I tried it.


----------



## Maela

She's so cute! Already looking so much older than her newborn photos. She looks very wise IMO.


----------



## snozzberry

Aw, what a little cutie pie! And so much hair! I'm jealous.


----------



## witchygrrl

thanks







she is a total cutie pie.

her hair, it seems, is exactly like mine. A ton of it, but very fine anf flyaway. same color, too. any idea when the transition from her baby hair might begin?


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Did you guys do any pain meds for teething? We are very anti-meds here but it seems inhumane to make her suffer this much pain.























She has a teething necklace, but still just in a lot of pain.

We used Humphry's teething pellets and they work well for Kai. Poor Abby sounds like she's having some extreme teething though. Kai only had two days that the pellets didn't help the pain and he had a fever too so we gave him baby Tylenol but there's a new study now that having Tylenol just once or twice before 1yr really increases the chance of babies developing asthma. I guess I'm not much help. Sorry about that. I hope the little lady feels better soon!

And I didn't really like the first year much either. Well, it was fun once Kai hit 8 months or so but before that it was really trying.


----------



## Maela

A Halloween picture

Maev was a butterfly.


----------



## witchygrrl

Oh my goodness, adorableness abounds! Love the costumes, all of you!


----------



## Holiztic

Cute!!!!

Here's Quinn the turtle


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Oh my goodness, adorableness abounds! Love the costumes, all of you!

Thank you! Dh did both his and my make up. He won best teacher costume at his school!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Cute!!!!

Here's Quinn the turtle

So cute! I love his hair! It's beautiful!


----------



## arelyn

I love the pictures! Quinn looks like such a big kid. I haven't seen a picture of him in a while and it was just shocking!

Kai actually fit into the duckie outfit he wore at his first Halloween but we didn't charge the camera. He "helped" me pass out cider and cookies at our Co-Op during our town's "Fright Night" so I know a lot of people snapped his picture. I'll have to hunt them down.


----------



## Maela

Okay, here it is. 15 months later.







Sorry it's so long.

On Monday, July 16, 2007, at 11:00AM I had my first real contraction. For some reason, I just knew that this was labor starting. It wasn't painful, just different from the BH contractions that I'd had before. 11:00AM happened to be the exact time that J was leaving for very minor surgery to have a small sebaceous cyst removed from beneath his scalp. I remember putting J's hand on my belly, and saying, "I think that's a contraction." Then we kissed goodbye because he had to go.
While he was gone, I cleaned the house, did laundry, and took care of all those little last minute things that I wanted to do before the baby arrived. I'm glad that I was home and that I was pretty sure this was it, as it gave me some time to prepare myself and our home.
The contractions were still coming, but irregularly, about every 15-30 minutes. They still were not painful; just a tightening. I wanted to time them to see how long they lasted, but it was difficult to tell exactly when they began and ended. A couple of hours later while in the bathroom I noticed some pink-tinged mucous. This made me really excited! Every time I went to the bathroom after that, I had more and darker mucous.
I don't remember exactly when J came home - I think maybe around 4PM. He was not feeling well. He had a headache, and he got queasy every time he saw blood trickling from the stitches on his scalp. So I called my sister to ask her to come over after work to be with me. I was feeling fine, but wanted someone there to chat with and help just in case I needed it while J rested.
At 7:30PM I called my midwife, L, to let her know that I was in labor. She advised me to take a nap since I had not taken one yet that day. So I tried to lie down for a while, but I was too excited to sleep.
My sister came over around this time, so I got up. She had brought a salad, and she cut up some fruit for me. We sat around and talked. I found a thing online that timed contractions. It was fun trying to figure out how close they were. They were starting to hurt a little by now, but I had had worse period cramps, so they were not bothering me.
J got up for a little while, but he still wasn't feeling well. He was so disappointed that he wasn't able to enjoy things and help out more.
My sister and I took a walk around our condominium complex. I was feeling really good at this point. We walked for almost an hour. It was dark outside and the temperature was perfect. I enjoyed the exercise. Every few minutes, I would stop talking while a contraction came, but I was still able to walk easily during them.
After the walk I decided to take a shower and get all cleaned up and pretty. I spent a long time in the shower washing my hair, shaving and just enjoying the warm water. Then I got out and blow-dried my hair straight and even put on some make up. I wanted to look nice. I put on the nightgown that I had bought especially for the birth. My sister took the last belly pictures.
I decided to sit on the birth ball for a while, knowing that the bouncing would probably help move things along. And boy did it! I got my first intense contractions soon after getting off of the ball. This was at about 1AM. The contractions were about 2-4 minutes apart now, and they lasted anywhere from 30-90 seconds each. The longer ones were usually less painful than the shorter ones. We decided to call our midwife to ask her to come.
L came at 1:30AM. She set up her equipment, and then used the Doppler to check the baby. The baby was doing great with a heart rate in the 130s. My sister left at about this time. I tried to get some sleep.
The next time I went to the bathroom, I lost the rest of the mucous plug and there was more blood. The contractions were getting stronger, but I was still handling them well. At 3AM, L decided to go home to rest some more, as I seemed to be doing well. She told us to call her back over whenever we wanted.
This is where things start to get a little fuzzy in my memory. I am using my midwife's notes from the birth to get accurate times. I know I spent most of my time in bed trying to rest for about an hour or two. At 4:50AM, J called L to have her come back, as my contractions were getting very intense. She arrived a half an hour later. She checked the baby's heart rate again and it was still in the 130s. My contractions were 2-3 minutes apart and lasting about 60 seconds.
At 5:30AM, L called another midwife, A, who was going to assist at the birth. She lives over an hour away, so she started making her way over to our house.
It was about this time that L suggested a change in position like sitting on the toilet. I was scared to move, but I did it because I knew that some women really liked laboring on the toilet and being in an upright position would help bring the baby down. Also, I had to pee. The contractions on the toilet were scary. I don't know if they were necessarily more painful or not. They were just so strong that I felt like I was going to fall off the toilet. I had to lean on J, who was sitting on a stool in front of me. I had lots of bloody show at this time. I am assuming I was in transition.
L asked me if I wanted to her check my dilation, but I refused. I was too afraid. I started to feel my breath catch during the peak of the contractions. I had read somewhere that this could mean I was ready to push. I told L how I felt, but I also remember saying that I really didn't want to push if I wasn't dilated all the way. She offered again to check me, and I refused.
L told me that if I felt like doing some gentle pushing I could. That was at 6:00AM. I tried some gentle pushing on the toilet for a couple of contractions and then decided to move back to the bed. L started checking the heart rate with the Doppler more often - it was always around 130.
I didn't feel like I was making any progress. L suggested that I breathe through a few contractions before trying some more pushing. At 6:50AM, A arrived. I tried some visualization through the next few contractions. I tried to relax my body as best I could, while moaning, "She's moving down, down, down&#8230;" and picturing the baby moving down the birth canal. I feel like that helped me feel more in control and calmer.
At 7:30AM I moved to the toilet again, and stayed there for almost an hour. I don't remember much of it. I do remember L suggesting that I feel myself to see if I could feel the baby's head or the bag of waters. I checked and I could feel something - I'm assuming the bulging bag of water. That was pretty cool.
By 8:30AM I was back on the bed. My midwife's notes say that I was definitely complete with a bulging bag of waters. I tried a few different positions - squatting, hands and knees, and semi-sitting - for pushing over the next hour and a half. None of them seemed to get me anywhere. I did not feel that huge, overwhelming urge to push that everyone talks about. I hardly felt an urge to push at all. I was tired and feeling helpless. I just wanted the baby out.
At 9:35AM, A suggested lying flat on my back with my legs up. I hesitated because I knew that this was usually the least desirable position for a woman to give birth in. It was one of the reasons I wanted to give birth at home - to avoid being forced into this position. L said that sometimes it's just what is needed to get the baby past that bone (don't know which one) and out. So I agreed to try it. I had to push really hard - harder than what I thought one had to push (from all of the stories and information that I had read) - but I was finally making some progress. After an hour of really intense pushing in this position, Maev Lin was born at 10:30AM, Tuesday, July 17, 2007. She was born 'in caul' or in the sac of water. My midwife told us that some people consider that very special. After tearing the sac away from the baby, she laid her on my belly. The first thing I noticed was that she looked all purplish, but she was quickly turning a normal color. Then I noticed her big hands and stubby fingers and said, "Oh man, she has my hands."
I started hemorrhaging right after the baby came out. The midwives were able to stop it with pressure. After the placenta came out, I started bleeding again. Apparently there was a huge clot behind the placenta. I was given some Pitocin and one dropperful of Shepherd's Purse. I lost about 4 cups of blood in all. I immediately started feeling spacey and tired. I felt sad that I wasn't that interested in being with the baby - I just wanted to sleep. I'm sure this was all due to the blood loss. A fed me some fruit and yogurt, and I felt a little better. L said that I could sleep as soon as I peed. I was able to make it over to the toilet, but I couldn't pee, and sitting up was making me feel faint. So I lied down on the bathroom floor. I was feeling so weird. I told everyone that I wanted to hear some music, and that I wanted to talk to my parents. So someone put on some music and gave me the phone and I talked to my parents while lying on the bathroom floor. J was holding Maev and sitting on the floor near me. He looked exhausted and traumatized, but happy. Poor Maev was crying, but I just didn't have the energy to do anything about it. I really did feel better after talking to my parents. I was finally able to pee!
I got back into bed and we tried nursing. Then the midwives did the formal newborn exam. They left at 2PM, and J, Maev and I took a long nap in our bed. Finally some rest! I felt much better when we woke up. I couldn't believe I had such a beautiful baby. J and I just sat there in bed staring at her until our parents arrived for their first visit.


----------



## accountclosed3

i only have time for pictures, not the birth story, but i will be back! everyone looks so cute!

had a nice vacation weekend in pittsburgh. walked around ryan's fav neighborhoods, caught a museum, hung out with friends and my sister a bit. went to two parties--one without the baby while my sister watched him. it was freaky--we were apart for 45 minutes.

i do feel a bit crazy though. my sister has two large dogs and two cats. and, her house is covered in fur, dander--and both dogs and both cats have potty problems (don't always go where they're supposed to. i'd told my mom that i was planning on staying in a hotel the whole weekend, but she insisted that it would hrut my sister's feelings and that she was keeping the place very clean and it wouldn't be a problem. i talked to me sister and she agreed, even though i brought up to both of them my concerns about the animals.

well, wouldn't you know that we get there and the place stinks like nothing, there is fur everywhere, and it's *cold* in the house (it is an old house and kinda drafty anyway). and who doesn't get congested in about 15 minutes but poor hawk? i was up all night with him because he could hardly breathe and i couldnt' find a bulb asperator/syringe to help him out.

poor fellow! i did keep him hydrated by practically non-stop nursing overnight.

so then, after it all, i tell my mom that at christmas (which will be in january at my sister's house) we'll be staying in a hotel (the hotel was so much easier, nicer, relaxing, clean, whatever), she said "oh, i thought those animals would be a problem. i told you to consider that."

uhm, what? crazy pills!

anyway, i'm off to find a travel humidifier.

and here's a question--how do you handle wires? ok, i know that sounds nuts. let me restate it.

in the winter, i use a lamp, a humidifier, and a fan. of course, they're all on the floor and while i tie up the cords as much as i can, there is still a bit spare hanging out.

i'm concerned about hawk getting mobile and getting into the cords. what do you do about cords?









yeah, we're starting to baby proof. lol


----------



## accountclosed3

great birth story!


----------



## accountclosed3

pics in the sig. these pics are about 3-4 weeks old. one has my FIL in it, the other my aunt edna. i think that the one with m FIL is 4 weeks old at least.

i suppose we're not so great at taking pictures. he's a cute baby. i suppose we're also not great at loading pictures that we take anway. LOL


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm concerned about hawk getting mobile and getting into the cords. what do you do about cords?










we watch her. that said, she did pull the cord for the external hard drive and smash it to the floor. sigh. i would love a totally wireless home.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
sigh. i would love a totally wireless home.

Aaahhh, you must mean Heaven. Sounds nice.









We let Dd play with them if theyweren't plugged in. She still loves to play with the cell phone chargers. Otherwise, we also just try to watch her and keep most of them tucked away behind something. That's not always possible though.


----------



## Maela

: Dd is taking a long and early nap today!







:

My mw is offering well-woman care now. Dd and I went to see her yesterday. The other mw who was at Dd's birth was also there. Afterwards, we went out to lunch with them. It was so cool to be able to hang out with my mws! I'm never going to an OB/GYN again, if I can help it. What a relief!
I told one of the mws about my fear of having a horrible time pushing again with the next baby. She said, "You will not have to do that ever again. You'll have to push, but not like that." She said it so assuredly. I felt a huge weight lift off my shoulders when I heard her say that. Just knowing that she really believes that gives me confidence.
I guess that's why I finally wrote my birth story last night.


----------



## cking

I love the pics! So cute. Maela, you and DH both really look old...







I had to do a double take, I wasn't sure if that was you. I love Maev's costume. And Quinn looks so cute. Great costume too!. J was a bee.

Maela, I'm so glad you posted your birth story. I thought I was too far behind with typing up mine, but now I feel like it's not too late.







I haven't finished reading it yet, but I'll be back. So cool that you got to go to lunch with your Mws. Mine said something similar, that it will be totally different next time.

We have been totally lax on babyproofing, and now we need to catch up quick. J isn't officially crawling yet, but she can move backwards and in circles, so she gets around. And she's getting to the stage where she gets very upset if we take something away from her. She grabbed the power cord for the laptop yesterday,,,luckily macs are well designed to break away, but it was still plugged in. So I guess we'll have to store it in another room or something. DH and I have argued about this - he thinks it's ridiculous to change anything; i want to move things that are enticing and obvious hazards.

She seems to be starting to take interest in some foods. The main obstacle now is slipperiness.







Pear was a hit, and just now she really wanted to munch on the green part of a leek. Until she bit off a piece of it and got upset when we took it away......

was there an age at which your dc stopped trying to destroy books?


----------



## accountclosed3

my main concern with cords is at night. a friend mentioned that once her cosleeping kiddo got mobile, he'd sometimes wake at night and she'd sleep while he wandered around the room--cords and all. so i was concerned about that.

another concern is this: herbal supplements and stuff. i have about one cup of lactation tea per day (or so), but now that we have the winter months coming on, i usually start to take things like "airborne" supplements to boost my immune system. a lot of it i do with good foods, of course, but i also do take some teas and such that are immune boosters.

now, every tea says that it's not appropriate for pregnant or lactating women--i think they're required to say that. but do you guys look into interactions with other teas and/or the situation with lactation and the baby with these immune sytem boosters?

also, when/if you are sick yourself--and you don't take traditional medicine like me unless absolutely necessary--what do you take to feel better or help the healing process, and do you still breastfeed and all of that?

i should probably just email the LLL gal, but it's a surprising moment wherein the baby is happy chewing ryan's finger off rather than mine.

he's been rather sharky today. LOL drool, chewing on his own fist or my finger. it's hilarious. he leans back, gets a good look at my finger, grabs it with his fist and then leans in with a big CHOMP! and chews away agressively. LOL


----------



## cking

:


----------



## witchygrrl

*zoe*, love the pics and *maela*, the birth story. someday I'll get mine up

Re: the supplements. I guess it depends on what you take. I've added extra vitC and an echinacea on days after we've been in crowds to give all of us a boost, and that's been fine. beyond that, I'm not sure. I think as long as they don't also work to dry you up, you're okay.

And this is how I feel this morning:




























:


----------



## Maela

I luckily haven't been really sick more than once since Dd was born - and that only lasted 24 hours. I was sick to my stomach and felt achy all over. Continued to bf, just stayed on the couch. My sister came over to help, as Dh was sick too. I've taken Tylenol while bfing, but that's it. I'm sure I've probably had some tea that says "not for pg, or bfing" but I try to look at the labels because I get nervous. Although, I'm sure, likeyou said ZB that it's just for their protection. So, sorry no advice.
Oh, but I did work for Airborne a few years ago as a customer service rep and we were told to tell customers whent hey asked that the owner/creator of Airborne took it while bfing (she extended bfed - her son was turning three when I worked there), but to ask your dr.









*Cking* Josephine looked so cute in her bee costume! I can't believe how old she is already!

I went to bed very happy







: (Yay Obama!), and woke up very sad







. Ca voted to pass prop 8.


----------



## witchygrrl

I thought Prop 8 was still too close to call. That's unfortunate


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I thought Prop 8 was still too close to call. That's unfortunate









Is it?! I'll have to go check...


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
DH and I have argued about this - he thinks it's ridiculous to change anything; i want to move things that are enticing and obvious hazards.

i'm with you on this. dh's way, you'll be saying no all the time and she will understand the no but won't be able to resist the discovery impulse and you will then have to intervene physically. it gets old, trust me.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 

also, when/if you are sick yourself--and you don't take traditional medicine like me unless absolutely necessary--what do you take to feel better or help the healing process, and do you still breastfeed and all of that?


i rely on hale's _medication and mother's milk._ there is a decent if not totally up to date list in _the nursing mother's companion_ by huggins. the short version is that tylenol has no negative effects and psuedophendrine cold meds are to be avoided in that they dry up milk supply temporarily. if you have a q about a particular drug, you can always post in bfing and someone will actually own the hale's tome.


----------



## Maela

95.4% of the precincts have reported in. You're right it's still not decided. But it's 52%yes to 48%no. I don't know...

I would be so happy though!


----------



## witchygrrl

I'll keep hoping, and if it ends up passing, I hope the SC will take it up and make it unconstitutional to have such an amendment.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:

was there an age at which your dc stopped trying to destroy books?
Kai became very good with books just a month ago (so 13 mo) but he still can do a lot of damage to paper when he get's excited or tries to carry the book to me by a page. The Very Hungry Caterpillar isn't looking so good these days.







On a good note though I got it used from the library so it's a good first real book...it's sturdier than most and if he completely destroys it I'm only down a buck so no big deal.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I'll keep hoping, and if it ends up passing, I hope the SC will take it up and make it unconstitutional to have such an amendment.

Looks like they're not wasting any time. As someone who doesn't care one way or the other about marriage per se, I am so devastated by this because of the homophobia and ignorance it represents. If California can't move toward equality, the rest of the world is in big trouble.


----------



## witchygrrl

nak

At least here in MA we have marriage equality. CT now does too, so New England will have to continue to lead the way.

MMM, how are you doing these days?

I'm fired up beyond belief--the birth center where I gave birth is in danger of being closed to laboring and birthing women, so prenatal care only. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I'll keep hoping, and if it ends up passing, I hope the SC will take it up and make it unconstitutional to have such an amendment.

no you most definitely do not want this court touching it. it can only be bad.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
no you most definitely do not want this court touching it. it can only be bad.

True--I forgot how awful it had become for a minute there. Silly me and my idealism.


----------



## PiePie

dh just said we don't need another baby carrier














:


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
nak
MMM, how are you doing these days?

Squashed up and sore and almost over it. Had a great midwife appt this morning though. He's nicely head down which surprised me because I thought he was lying horizontally across! It's just that he's big and taking up lots of space. Anyway midwife encouraged me to hold on for 2 more weeks which, in my head space, made me think that it's actually possible that he'll be early! I know I could still be in it for the long haul but this morning, that was exactly what I needed to hear.

What did you folks do to lower the chances of testing GBS positive? I'm taking pro-biotics and plan on a few apple cider vinegar baths between now and the test in 2 weeks time. Any other recs?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dh just said we don't need another baby carrier














:
















Really? Thankfully, DP is the carrier pusher in our house. She wants one of everything!
I don't think you can have enough carriers. I say you veto his opinion in this case!


----------



## TinyFrog

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Anyway midwife encouraged me to hold on for 2 more weeks









Sqeeeeee! Oh my gosh, I didn't realize you were so close.







:


----------



## witchygrrl

I know--I'm so excited. Stalking MMM...







:


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 







Sqeeeeee! Oh my gosh, I didn't realize you were so close.







:

Wow, neither did I.







: Sending you lots of







: MMM.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dh just said we don't need another baby carrier














:
















My DH says this too.







Then he says silly things like "what's the difference between wearing her and carrying her?" when we are going into a very busy store. gah.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Kai became very good with books just a month ago (so 13 mo) but he still can do a lot of damage to paper when he get's excited or tries to carry the book to me by a page. The Very Hungry Caterpillar isn't looking so good these days.







On a good note though I got it used from the library so it's a good first real book...it's sturdier than most and if he completely destroys it I'm only down a buck so no big deal.

She _is_ starting to get really into board books. She likes holding them, turning the pages and looking at the pictures. So that's really cool....I was started to get discouraged reading to her since she was always trying to chew on them (board) or rip the pages in paper books. So I guess we'll stick with the board books for a while, and we'll just have to find some more interesting ones.









I just had a very







conversation with my mom, who is, let's just say, a one-issue voter. I know not to talk politics with my family, and I usually avoid it altogether, but she just said something completely out of nowhere that got me all riled up. Man. It was almost enough to ruin my happy week.







:


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, i tested gbs positive even though i was taking the probiotics. i was very







: but to be honest it didn't really inhibit my laboring. it was only 20 minutes every 4 hours, and i could walk or be in the tub while it was going on.

*cking*, don't let the turkeys get ya down.

so it looks like a close friend of dh's, and either the 3rd or the 4th person to meet dd (memories diverge), has been elected to congress!! it is considered "the" upset. it is sufficiently close that there will be a recount, and his opponent has bush's lawyers from fl 2000, but we are still fantasizing about attending the inauguration. he is a bigwig in the "religious left," and won in a mostly bible belt district.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 







Sqeeeeee! Oh my gosh, I didn't realize you were so close.







:

I know, it's shocking isn't it? People weren't lying when they told me that once I got to 30 weeks, it'd fly!

Thanks PiePie for the reassuring thoughts re the antibiotics for GBS. I'm leaning toward declining if it turns out I'm positive though I've promised DP that I won't think/talk about it until it's actually an issue! I'm very good at worrying about the 'what ifs?'

Christina - sorry to hear about your frustrating mother. My mum is generally progressive but has NO understanding of how politics works so can be hellishly frustrating. She'll vote conservative just because 'he seems like a really nice person.' And next election she'll vote for the Greens because 'we need balance' (our political system is not quite so 2 party dominant - minor parties can make a difference in the senate) Anyway - point is, I understand.


----------



## Maela

There was a sad two? months that I couldn't read to Dd. She just wanted to grab the books and gnaw on them or rip them apart. So I would let her play with her board books, but no reading.








Then she loved being read to (over and over and over...), but was still very hard on the books. So I just kept the special books up. That phase lasted until just a month or two ago. Now she is actually very careful (for a 1yo) with her books.

Okay, so I'm pretty sure I ovulated sometime near the 3rd of this month. I guess I'll know if I'm right or not if AF comes in about a week. It's hard to tell because some of my temps are weird - I think from so much night waking. We did DTD right near then, but I read that it's rare that a woman gets pg w/first pp ovulation. I haven't been using FF to chart, just pencil/paper.
I have been going back and forth on whether or not to start TTCing now, in July as planned, or sometime in between. As of yesterday, I decided that I would be okay with getting pg anytime. But we do want to avoid having a baby in August (beginning of the teaching year for Dh) and December (just too hectic for us with the holidays). So starting in December, we're going to be officially TTCing - if I ovulate. But I reserve the right to change my mind - again.


----------



## Maela

MMM - I am also so excited for you!!









_No nap_ yesterday. At all. The good thing is that she went to bed right at 8 o'clock. That was nice. But this had better not be a habit.







: She may think she doesn't need naps anymore, but I do need them.


----------



## snozzberry

*Maela,* Yikes, no nap?! I'm sorry.









But congrats on your current position on TTC! That's so exciting!

*MMM,* I'm







: for you and Squeak to have a beautiful birth!


----------



## accountclosed3

do we have a book list? i think we should start a book list sticky.

Ryan and I are going to buy a book. what book should we buy? tell us within the hour! tell us now!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
do we have a book list? i think we should start a book list sticky.

Ryan and I are going to buy a book. what book should we buy? tell us within the hour! tell us now!









I think that's a great idea! Is this just for parenting books or anything?

I really liked _Taking Back Childhood_. And _Ina May's Guide to Childbirth_.

Maybe we could put a list on the first page of our thread?


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, i i think it should be at the "head" of our threads like our birthstories and stuff.


----------



## Maela

I'm using FF again now. The link in my sig to my chart should be working. See how my temps are allwacky? But FF thinks I o'ed so that's good.


----------



## PiePie

parenting-related books i would nominate:
tender hooks
bright from the start
nursing mother, working mother
toilet learning (though won't be popular with ec'ers)
out babies, ourselves
playful parenting
einstein never used flashcards
unconditional parenting
the second shift
odd girl out


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, !!!!!!!!! re your ttc


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

5 years since Ani D last toured Australia and she announces an adults only show for 6 weeks after Squeaks due date. We're gonna buy tickets with the intention of leaving Squeak with my sis who lives only 5 mins from the venue but with the expectation that we may not make it. Potentially, we could be away from him for less than 2 hours.

This is our first test! Can we maintain our lives and our love and still be awesome parents??


----------



## accountclosed3

MMM:

yes, you can. but, i would wait and see how nursing goes--how his timing is between feeds and whether or not you (or he or both) are ready to take bottles of EBM. also, whether you can handle leaving him for that long.

seriously, at an hour--i have to back with hawk. and that's usually when he's just in the other room (say, upstairs while i'm teaching yoga or something). of coruse, he's ready for me at an hour too, usually. sometimes, i get 1.5 hrs, but usually just an hour apart is about as far as we go.

it's surprising how those hormones work.









and why wouldn't toilet learning be popular with ECers? does it not like us or something?







i'm just curious. i mean, that could be simply because it doesn't apply to an ECer i guess.









here are a few that i've read: The Continuum Concept, Diaperfree Baby, and Parenting from the Inside Out.


----------



## snozzberry

Okay, I am starting a book list. For each title, I'll add the names of who's recommended it.









I've got everything since zb suggested the idea, so post your other recs and I'll add them!


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM*, I think it might work out, as long as you're flexible. Around 6 wks pp I went to an all-day conference away from Abby. That was too long, but 2 hours (including travel time) would have totally been doable.

But if you're open to leaving early if necessary, I don't think you'll have a problem at all.


----------



## Sihaya

I have a ton of book suggestions, but will just drop by the one I'm reading right now: Becoming the Parent You Want to Be


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 

and why wouldn't toilet learning be popular with ECers? does it not like us or something?







i'm just curious. i mean, that could be simply because it doesn't apply to an ECer i guess.









her criticism of ec is that it interposes the parent into the child's processes in a way that messes with the parent (really maternal)-child bond. her approach to toileting is very non-judgmental/non-pressuring -- fits very well with alfie kohn. her take is that by trying to catch a pee or a poop parents are prone to sliding into injecting language/feelings of their own failure/success vis-a-vis the child's elimination proceses, and that kids pick up on those emotions and associate it with their bodily functions in an unhelpful way. (she also has a feminist critique, which arguably could be/has been extended to ap generally, re how it chains the mama down. that was not the persuasive part to me.) also that it can lead to scheduling, which she thinks is not about developing the child's own awareness of physiological sensations. she is all about taking the child's cues but also about not imposing the parent into what should be matters of the child's bodily autonomy. i do not mean this as an attack on ec, i am just summarizing her argument, which is a small part of the book. and i want to emphasize that the book is very much about taking kids' cues and there is some stuff i found relevant for this age, like being really careful to use non-judgy language for elimination, and (this part i wasn't doing) always using the same terms, but since her big contribution to the field was how to use picture books to assess children's readiness and allow for it to be their idea, the bulk of the book presupposes a verbal child.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I have a ton of book suggestions, but will just drop by the one I'm reading right now: Becoming the Parent You Want to Be

love it


----------



## Holiztic

I only have a minute, but just wanted to announce that Quinn is using the toilet (not right now, I mean in general!). He's been in big boy underwear for a week and has only had a couple "accidents". Wow, this is so much better than diapers, and he just has this whole proud air about him since we started.

Also, I think he's sleeping better now that he isn't peeing all night (he still wears a diaper at night, but it has only 1-2 pees in it after 10+ hours). I say "I think" because we all have colds and that is messing with our sleeping, so it's hard to tell, but we'll know soon!

Gotta make some breakfast!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I only have a minute, but just wanted to announce that Quinn is using the toilet (not right now, I mean in general!). He's been in big boy underwear for a week and has only had a couple "accidents". Wow, this is so much better than diapers, and he just has this whole proud air about him since we started.

Also, I think he's sleeping better now that he isn't peeing all night (he still wears a diaper at night, but it has only 1-2 pees in it after 10+ hours). I say "I think" because we all have colds and that is messing with our sleeping, so it's hard to tell, but we'll know soon!

Gotta make some breakfast!

Wow!







Yay Quinn!!


----------



## witchygrrl

Woot for Quinn! That's awesome!

And yay Maela--how exciting that you might be the first to go for 2!









Hmmm, I really haven't read any parenting books, other than ones on breastfeeding or skimming through The Baby Book. I have What to Expect the First Year, but yeah, that's not something I read for advice. I'll definitely have to take a look at the ones you've all named.


----------



## accountclosed3

piepie:

i can definitely see that criticism of ECing. i know a lot of people who feel that way when trying it, and it's obviously not for them if that is the case.

the truth of it for us (in response to the critique, not you!) is that it is really fun. we probably only "catch" about 80% right now and we really love it. there isn't any negative language arond eliminating at all, and we do change our language a lot.

but, we do notice that diaperers also tend to have negative language toward changing diapers which babies could superimpose onto themselves.

we're very conscious of the language that we use such as when we do catch, i always say "we did it!" and "i really enjoy taking care of you in this way!" and i do the same with diapers when i "miss" and i laugh when i miss because it's funny to me. i always say "oh, silly mama, wasn't paying attention!" and then i offer the potty and clean up.

i wouldn't say that it 'chains' me to anything any more than any other aspect of AP though. i would say if anything feels confining it's breastfeeding! i have to do it frequently, i have to do it for a long time, and so far, i've found no carry that functions and so i have to sit and do it.

and during that 30 minutes to 1.5 hr time span, i basically sit in one spot, talking to him until he settles in, and then reading a book (outloud usually, we're reading a buddhist book right now by pema chodron). and that's that.

i mean, if anything, i am chained by the feeding, whereas the pottying is really just this fun thing that we do. . .i guess like a game to us. . .and i do notice certain biological aspects and also cues. he doesn't always cue, but when he does, it is obvious.









but, i can take a criticism and still disagree with it.


----------



## accountclosed2

I agree, Zoebird, regarding EC. It is the one thing that I've loved most about being a mother, about our relationship and I really think it has strengthened our bond no end!!! We've had a bit of a rough run, with breastfeeding issues (off the donor milk 2 months now!!!!) and DD being, well, definitely High Need. EC is a positive bond, which makes me focus on DD in a happy way so many times every day! We read books, sing songs and make silly faces on the potty. I have to say, that for me breastfeeding has never been such a positive bond, it is often frustrating, a bit of a "must" (although I'd never give it up, we've worked so hard for it, and I really want to make sure DD gets the benefits of BF for as long as possible!!). Babywearing hasn't been the easiest either (DD dislikes most slings and carriers), although DD wants to be held constantly. I don't mind most of the time, but it certainly isn't an elective.

I love this little girl so much, and there's nothing I'd rather do than stay home with her. She is funny and stubborn and strong and happy! By now she cruises on furniture, climbs on everything and demands "mamamamama!". She jumps, rocks to music and "reads" her favourite books, turning the pages in order, stopping at her fav pages!

Anyway, EC makes our day together easier, and our bond stronger!!!!








:







:







:


----------



## witchygrrl

I think co-sleeping has made our bond very strong, stronger than breastfeeding. While I love being able to nourish our daughter, she is a Snacker, which makes things frustrating for me, so perhaps I don't enjoy it as much as I should.

But breastfeeding at night and being able to sleep with my baby beside me (whether between DH and me or just next to me) is simply wonderful. Mornings are wonderful. Yesterday, DH had the day off for Veteran's Day, so we all had a lazy morning. I had left to go to the bathroom and found DH snuggling with Rhea. I said something to the effect of how moments like these wouldn't be possible if we just put Rhea in a crib. And DH said, "Thank you for being smarter than me," which made me go "hunh? why?" And it was because I had pushed him to really think about the benefits of co-sleeping, and away from getting that crib. He feels it has really helped the two of them bond as father and daughter!







:

And thank you ladies, for keeping me thinking about it during my pre-pregnancy and pregnancy. It just feels so right!


----------



## Maela

My dh loves cosleeping too. The other day, I was telling MIL about how I was hoping to have Dd in her own bed full time by 2yo. Dh had heard and said, "By the time she's two? So soon?" So cute! Made me second guess my own feelings. I would love to have her in bed with us, but I'm worried about having her there with a newborn. Our bed is queen-sized on a tall bedframe. We'll see what happens...


----------



## accountclosed3

i have a love-hate relationship with cosleeping. i love it because it is so healthy, convenient, and really wonderful. i hate it because i'm still nervous/afraid of harming the little guy. it is such a funny thing!

but, as he gets older, i'm getting used to it and starting to relax more. but i still feel this sense of panic when i wake from a deep sleep.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
but i still feel this sense of panic when i wake from a deep sleep.

I got that for a while in the beginning too. Not fun.


----------



## witchygrrl

I think Rhea's teething already. Abrupt change in fussy behavior, which seems to be helped when her gums are massaged. She's been drooly for a few weeks now, but I figured that was average. Maybe I'm wrong, but yikes, the crying is piercing.

She's only 3 and a half months. Sigh. I feel so bad for her, whatever it is.


----------



## snozzberry

Oh, poor Rhea!







Abby started teething around then too, so I feel your pain.

I







cosleeping too! I wouldn't want it any other way. We had originally talked about getting her in her own bed by 1, but I think we're both on the same page that we really don't mind it at all...in fact, we both love snuggling with her.









Anyone else here doing nanowrimo? (national novel writing month)

It's kicking my butt!


----------



## arelyn

I LOVE cosleeping!







: It is the best!! I can't imagine how people can sleep without their baby next to them. I don't know how I'll sleep once Kai is ready for his own bed.

DH usually likes cosleeping but he LOVES babywearing. Kai doesn't really like to be worn by me unless we're going somewhere really interesting and I don't like wearing him too much as it's hard on my back. Riding in the sling has become a special papa-baby thing and they love it and I'm happy seeing them so happy.

ECing, however, is not on top of my favourite list. Kai hates using diapers (though he likes wearing them







) and it is very cool when you get a catch but I do feel chained by it. And I'm sure I've said some things to Kai when we've missed that are far from positive (I don't yell at him but it's no secret that Mama is not pleased to find poop on the floor two minutes after he says he's all done trying the potty







). I wouldn't stop though. Kai really seems to like it so much better than diapers (this is the baby that actually waited for me to take the diaper off him before he would let out his merconium) and poop on the floor is usually easier to clean than poop mushed into a diaper. And one diaper all days are so fulfilling.

And I'm falling asleep at the computer. Good night everybody!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
And DH said, "Thank you for being smarter than me," which made me go "hunh? why?" And it was because I had pushed him to really think about the benefits of co-sleeping, and away from getting that crib. He feels it has really helped the two of them bond as father and daughter!







:

And thank you ladies, for keeping me thinking about it during my pre-pregnancy and pregnancy. It just feels so right!

That sounds like something my DH would say.







I love cosleeping too. I just don't understand how people do it any other way. It would take so much time for her to fully wake up and cry enough to wake us up if we were in another room. One thing that still bugs me, though, is that I still don't know what to do with my lower arm.







I used to sleep with my arms right out in front of my face, but that is where DD is now, so my elbow would be at her head. So now I keep the lower arm tucked under my pillow, but I often wake up sore that way. <?>

Also, dd has become very clingy while sleeping lately....seems she has to be nursing or at least snuggled up next to me to stay asleep. I guess maybe it's the teething.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I think Rhea's teething already. Abrupt change in fussy behavior, which seems to be helped when her gums are massaged. She's been drooly for a few weeks now, but I figured that was average. Maybe I'm wrong, but yikes, the crying is piercing.

She's only 3 and a half months. Sigh. I feel so bad for her, whatever it is.

J started teething around then too.







it's tough, I know.

J's top tooth (teeth?) started cutting through her gums this week. It's been a very rough two weeks so far. I hope there is some relief soon! She has been grinding her bottom teeth on the top, and it makes this awful sound that sends chills down my spine. But, that's also how I know the tooth is definitely there.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AislynCarys*
I love this little girl so much, and there's nothing I'd rather do than stay home with her. She is funny and stubborn and strong and happy! By now she cruises on furniture, climbs on everything and demands "mamamamama!". She jumps, rocks to music and "reads" her favourite books, turning the pages in order, stopping at her fav pages!

I loved reading this - it made me







My dd is only a little bit younger than yours, and it's so neat to read about the similar things they are doing.


----------



## PiePie

*witchy*, for us this early teething (descending into gums from bone?) was the worst. of course she has only 4 teeth so who knows what's to come.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
One thing that still bugs me, though, is that I still don't know what to do with my lower arm.







I used to sleep with my arms right out in front of my face, but that is where DD is now, so my elbow would be at her head. So now I keep the lower arm tucked under my pillow, but I often wake up sore that way. <?>

I had this problem too. I sleep with my arm up under the pillow and my head. And I think this caused my backaches that I had every morning for probably the first 10! months. I would wake up so sore!! Now my back has gotten used to it finally, I guess. Also, if she's not teething or sick she'll let me move away and roll over onto my stomach (how I've slept my whole life, except in pg) after she's nursed back to sleep. Aahhh! I sleep so much better that way. But there are some nights where she'll wake up right away if I try to move. Then it's harder for me to go back to sleep.







:

The thing Dh and I like most about cosleeping is waking up next to her in the morning.







I love it! Especially on the weekends if we sleep in a bit. She'll wake dh and I up by patting our heads and saying, "Hi, hi!" I'm going to miss that so much. Right now we put her in her bedroom for the beginning of the night until she wakes the first time. Some day she's going to sleep right through the whole night in her bedroom. I'll be happy for the sleep, but so sad that I didn't get to wake up next to her like we've done every day since her birth.


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
J's top tooth (teeth?) started cutting through her gums this week. It's been a very rough two weeks so far. I hope there is some relief soon! She has been grinding her bottom teeth on the top, and it makes this awful sound that sends chills down my spine. But, that's also how I know the tooth is definitely there.

Abby does this too. *shiver*

DH said it sounds like she's eating potato chips, so I try to imagine that's what the sound is, and it makes it a *little* less annoying...


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Right now we put her in her bedroom for the beginning of the night until she wakes the first time. Some day she's going to sleep right through the whole night in her bedroom. I'll be happy for the sleep, but so sad that I didn't get to wake up next to her like we've done every day since her birth.

this interests me. would like bed back for dtd. but don't want to give up cosleeping, and honestly don't think she is ready for nightweaning.


----------



## Maela

I just took some pictures of our (clean!) house a couple of weeks ago. I put her down on a mattress on the floor in her room. I have to rock/nurse her to sleep first of course. Then after we'vg e gone to sleep, when she wakes up, we bring her back to our bed.

I know - the pictures weren't necessary, but it was fun.


----------



## Holiztic

We've been talking about getting Q a toddler bed to put in our room (like 2 feet from our bed) but I just don't feel like it is time yet. I keep thinking how most adults I know don't like to sleep alone, why would a baby/toddler. No judgment here, just my own little feeling. Of course, we wouldn't be considering it if we didn't have _some interest in doing it. We'll see.

Now I am thinking we'll do the true family bed until the second child (no, no news) is around 2, then put Q (at 5) and the second kid together in a double for a little while, then when the 3rd kid is 2 (Q will likely be 8), move Q into his own bed and the 3rd kid in with the 2nd. Guess the last little one gets their own bed at 5 this way.

Any ideas? Might have to ask some experienced mamas (not that you all aren't, but you know what I mean!) if this is feasible._


----------



## PiePie

mattress on floor would work better than crib for nursing down. hm.


----------



## snozzberry

*Maela*, cool wall color in your bedroom...so fresh! Did you have to do much painting before y'all moved in?

*Holiztic*, I totally understand where you're coming from. I have a feeling we might end up bed-sharing longer than we originally thought...

I don't have any advice on your plan, but it sounds doable to me (as long as you have a plan for DTD







)!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Now I am thinking we'll do the true family bed until the second child (no, no news) is around 2, then put Q (at 5) and the second kid together in a double for a little while, then when the 3rd kid is 2 (Q will likely be 8), move Q into his own bed and the 3rd kid in with the 2nd. Guess the last little one gets their own bed at 5 this way.

Any ideas? Might have to ask some experienced mamas (not that you all aren't, but you know what I mean!) if this is feasible.

I have thought about this too. Will Dd feel left out when Dh and I are sleeping with the new baby and she's all alone in her room? If Dh and I would be willing to give up our bedframe for a few years and put the mattress on the floor with the twin mattress alongside it, we would be able to cosleep with both kids until they could share a bed (or just a room) - like you said when the younger is about two. That way no one would feel left out. I think that I would be willing to do that, but I don't know if Dh would. I don't want him to resent cosleeping; he enjoys it so much now. I think I will wait to see when we actually end up having the baby and how Dd copes with it before I ask Dh what he thinks.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
mattress on floor would work better than crib for nursing down. hm.

Yes. That is why we got the mattress. Soooo much easier.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Maela*, cool wall color in your bedroom...so fresh! Did you have to do much painting before y'all moved in?

Yeah we had to paint the whole house. We need to paint the outside too. I really want to do Dd's room soon, but we're trying to spend as little money right now as possible.


----------



## Maela

Maybe I didn't ovulate.







FF took away the coverline. But then how can I get accurate temperatures when Dd is sleeping so poorly?! I think she's getting more teeth soon. I've been noticing her gnawing on her fingers and drooling lately. She woke up _every_ hour last night. I woke up with a sore back again.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: I'm done with work! It's a relief but also a challenge, I have to admit. Though I genuinely don't subscribe to thinking that being 'just a mum' is not valuable, I've realised that a lot of my identity is definitely bound up in my career. {honestly, i believe it's the most valuable job in the world - no flames please!!!} It's interesting though that even with my world view and ideologies, that I'm carrying so much of that societal, lack of valuing motherhood crap. I'm nervous about being judged. Silly, huh?

I suspect that once Squeak is earthside that I'll be way too busy to navel gaze like this - I'm just being a brat I think.

I can't wait to meet this little creature and I'm looking forward being able to better contribute to parenting conversations with y'all when I actually have some kind of point of reference too.

Meanwhile, I sit here - pondering the need to nest and its incompatibility with my complete inability to move - partially due to exhaustion and partly 'cos my pelvis is pretty much shot at this point. 1 more week and I can birth in the birth centre, 2 more weeks will give me half a chance of getting done, what I need to get done. 3 more weeks and I don't think I'll cope any longer!! Please please let the midwives be right about the early arrival of my boy!


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, congratulations on being done with work (well, monetarily paid work







)!! That's so exciting. It is a big change. I can't say I missed my job, but I did really miss the kids that I worked with.


----------



## snozzberry

*Maela,*







for the rough night of sleep (or lack of it).

*MMM,* congrats on starting the next phase of your life! You will be a great mom--or mum, as the case may be.


----------



## Holiztic

MMM,

just peaked at your blog for a minute and had to share that shortly after Quinn was born (maybe 2 or 3 months) the indigo girls were here, my all time favorite live show ever. I have seen them 6 times and NEVER miss them when they are within 25 or so miles.

Well, we missed it, I didn't even consider going (still deep in my PP stress/anxiety attacks was just 1 reason, DS nursing every 30 minutes was the other), but the night of the concert I put on some of their CDs and felt like I was really missing something. Perhaps if we'd had somewhere to leave him 5 minutes from the show... okay, yeah right, it could have been in our living room and I'd have told them to be quiet, they were bothering the baby. You'll see!


----------



## PiePie

we had baby's first haircut today, they cut off way too much, i am super traumatized and sobbing over it. lots of finger pointing between nathan and me over it.


----------



## TwilightJoy

I got engaged last night so I thought I'd pop in and tell you ladies about it.









We went on a memory walk where as we walked around campus, he told me different memories he had of me. We walked past the different places we've lived, worked, studied, etc. He brought up memories of past walks we'd gone on and different things we've done. Then we walked up to our school's campanile and he had a dozen roses waiting for me. He told me it had been a great three years together and that he loved me and wanted to spend the rest of his life with me. Then he got down on one knee and asked me to marry him.
This is a picture of our hands together this morning.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/g...24600_4800.jpg
And a close up of the ring. It has 11 diamonds on it. It's white gold. The middle one is .52 karats and it's round cut- though the prongs make it look slightly square. On each side of the middle ring is a small baguette diamond. Then in the band on each side are 4 small square diamonds. It's SO sparkly!
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/g...24598_2991.jpg

More pictures are on facebook if you're friends with me.

No idea when the wedding will be, probably in the next year or so- really no idea.

I'm so happy I just can't stop smiling.







:


----------



## Maela

Congratulations *TJ*!!







: That's so exciting! And your ring is beautiful.

I remember when I got engaged and I couldn't stop looking at how shiny it was. I'm usually not that into jewelry, but it was because it _meant_ something so important, yk? Anyway, have fun planning!!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
we had baby's first haircut today, they cut off way too much, i am super traumatized and sobbing over it. lots of finger pointing between nathan and me over it.









I'm sorry about the haircut. Everyone keeps asking me when dd will get one, but I'm not ready.







Maybe when she's two.


----------



## PiePie

*TJ,* mazal tov! i remember my engagement very fondly. we had known each other for 3 mos, 10 days, and he cooked me dinner and presented the ring. which, like maela, i







even though i had a feminist opposition to engagement rings. which reminds me, dh's wedding ring is at the bottom of the gulf of mexico, lost while snorkeling.








apparently the price of gold has really shot up, which apparently happens when the rest of the economy is in the tank.


----------



## Holiztic

Congrats TJ!!! Nice ring, but seriously, your hands are gorgeous!


----------



## snozzberry

*TwilightJoy*!!!! Congratulations!!! Beautiful, beautiful ring.

I felt a lot like PiePie and didn't think I wanted a diamond engagement ring at all until I saw the sparkly diamond on my hand.









*PiePie,* I'm sorry about the haircut.


----------



## katt

PiePie - that's what I'm afraid of so, DS has long hair. which, facebook members can see.









TJ: Congrats!!!! If you need a wedding photog.







what a sweet proposal.


----------



## accountclosed3

congrats tj! we got engaged because it occured to us at the same moment that we should probably be married. but we didnt' get married for 5 more years or something. lol then, 5 more years before baby.

mmm: work! i love my work. but, being a mom, i've never worked harder and i feel like i get nothing/hardly anything done. i love caring for this little one though! he's so awesome.

piepie: my hindu friend said that i should never cut hawk's hair, unless he gets his head shaved at a temple (in india) first. likewise, i should never cut my hair again. so, i figure i'll just listen to him. he did say that small trims (to get rid of dead ends) are fine. so, i get a cut this week. but the baby, no cuts until we go to india. i look forward to braiding his hair like a norseman!









i think ryan put up new pictures which should be linked under hawk's name, and also, hawk has learned to roll over from back to front, and he's working on getting from front to back now.

he's a cutey.

any i know that this is totally stupid, but i'm psyched. i really wanted to see the animated film Bolt when it came out, but of course i can't take hawk tot he movies yet (too loud for him). but, when he's being carriedin his wrap, ,he'll sleep for a good 3 hrs.

so, my dad and i are giong to see the movie on friday while my mom walks hawk in the mall. i'll keep my phone on vibrate just in case, but we should be able to see the whole film, no problem. i'm so psyched. i love goign to movies with my dad!

oh, and having ILs babysit hawk wasn't terrible. i was still freaked out, but i wrapped him onto FIL and told them to walk until the end of class. they actually ECed him twice, too. so, they did ok, and he was asleep through most of their visit--which was all day, but he got his am and pm walks in--which were two wrapped naps!


----------



## PiePie

*zoe*, fyi, many chain theaters offer baby matinees that have the sound turned down and the lights dimmed but not off, if you are craving a movie. i tried it once with dd and i have to say it wasn't right for us, because i spent the whole time chasing her crawling up and down the lighted steps. but this is a kid who was crawling at 5 mos. i should have tried it when she was younger.


----------



## PiePie

i'm pretty bent out of shape over 2 BFing incidents on Friday. See Working Mamas forum. Only the daycare one is still hurting.


----------



## witchygrrl

*TJ*, my belated congrats! What a beautiful ring, too.

DH is sick. He's had a rough cold all weekend that we've been bombarding with all sorts of vitamin C, echinacea, chicken soup, onions, garlic, you name it! Then he passed out this morning in the bathroom, scaring the $*[email protected] outta me. Turns out, he had been sweating all night, and was dehydrated and needed food also.

Somehow Rhea and I have managed to escape it thus far.

*zoe*, back to front already!? Rhea makes it to her side, but her shoulder gets in the way. She'd rather be standing, it seems.








*PiePie*


----------



## cking

Congrats TJ! Beautiful ring







:







:

PiePie, sorry about the haircut.









MMM, congrats on finishing up work. I understand how you feel. I didn't really love my job, but it still just felt weird (to oversimplify it) to be leaving it after all those years. But what lies ahead for you is going to be so amazing, challenging, and awesome. I am so excited to meet your little boy.









witchy, sorry DH is sick. I hope you and Rhea avoid it. J and I had our first since she was born cold a few weeks ago - very mild, but still no fun caring for a child while sick.


----------



## arelyn

NAK for the first time in ages!

TJ: Congrats!! Best of luck planning the wedding. I hope it doesn't involve family drama like my bet friemd's did (not to scare you). Try to have fun with it!! I love'd planning ours once my mom gave up trying to plan for me.

PP:Gosh it sounds like you've been having a rough time!







s


----------



## Maela

*PiePie* it's so unfair that you're getting all this crap about bfing!








I still haven't gotten a really negative comment yet about NIPing.







:

*For the mamas of toddlers, I have a question*: Does your baby have little 'routines' that they do? Like Dd will have a pile of blocks and then she'll move them over to another area in her room (sometimes stacking them, sometimes not) and then move them all back again doing this several times. Talking to herself the whole time. She doesn't move them in the exact same order or put them down in the exact same positions - just moves them all, then back again. Or she'll give me a couple of items, then take them back to put them on the floor and then give them back and then take them back to the same spot on the floor again...
I've been around more children with autism of this age than I have 'neuro-typical' children of this age, so obviously this behavior makes me just the teeniest bit nervous. But I don't know if this is just totally 'normal' behavior for a toddler... Also I saw her walking on her tiptoes the other day for about a half hour, but that could just be something fun she discovered... And at story/song time she doesn't dance around like most of the other kids (and how she did at the baby story time). She just sits in my lap and watches, but that could just be some stranger anxiety because she's totally silly around our family and friends.
I made the mistake of mentioning this to Dh and now he's more worried than I am and he wants me to ask you guys if your toddlers do anything like this. I'm 90% sure everything is fine and it's just my background (working with kids with autism) and my worrisome nature.


----------



## snozzberry

*Maela*







I'm _sure_ everything is fine! Sure, sure, sure. But when we get a little worm like that in our head, it's hard to ignore it, I know.

Abby's just now getting into her own in independent play, so I don't have any experiential advice for you.

But I know how those little ideas can take root and scare you, so







from me.


----------



## katt

Maela-
Teo takes a while to warm up to a room full of kids. He likes to sit back and take things in for a while and he's always a bit hesitant regarding lots of crazy kids. he's pretty little and not usually very 'aggressive'.
Tip-toe walking, which I'm SURE you know, can be a stage kids go through.
She seems like she has an activity she enjoys doing. Maybe she is cleaning like mom, or shopping or something like that. Sounds cute to me.


----------



## Holiztic

I don't see any problem at all Maela. It sounds to me like she is playing in a normal toddler way. Quinn has his little play routines like that and he is not the least bit ASD. He just discovered tiptoes and cracks up when he does it (but he only does it for a minute or so a day). My nephew ONLY walked on tiptoes for the first year of walking (and I suspect mild ASD with him) but he showed WAY more signs of it than just tiptoes, and like I said, I suspect very mild (if at all). Can't comment on the shyness or not dancing, this kid is super social and unfortunately IS big AND aggressive. He'd be the kid yanking your kids out to dance and crying if she/he refused!

So Q has his 4th cold in 2 months. He handles them really well, but gets every one! Ugh! We're staying home the rest of winter, kids with runny noses/coughs are everywhere--and Quinn being so social, of course, he touches everyone!


----------



## Maela

Thanks everyone! I am pretty sure she's fine. I guess I was worried because she used to be soooo social. A few months ago she would have been one of those kids out in the front dancing, but again I know that the stranger anxiety at this age can be strong, so... And I'm glad to hear that you think the play 'routine' is typical of a toddler. I just wasn't sure about that having not been around many 'non-ASD' toddlers. I was 12 when my brother was born, so I remember him, but it turns out that he's been having some problems lately with OCD and anxiety, and now that I look back he did have some ASD-type symptoms as a child, so that's part of it all too.

Anyway, thanks!


----------



## Maela

Poor Quinn! Hope he feels better soon.

*Witchy*, how is your dh? How are you and Rhea?


----------



## witchygrrl

DH is better, but I've now come down with his cold, as has Rhea. She doesn't seem too bad, though--she coughs more at night and when first waking up, and except for a teeny bit of congestion, it's hard to pick up on. So hopefully, it'll go away soon.

No teeth have shown up yet, but the really acute behaviors have gone away. Maybe things were just shifting in there. She has such a little mouth--I just hope she didn't inherit DH's big teeth!

And Maela, I echo the thoughts of others--most likely, it's a stage of self-exploration more than anything.









My birth center is safe...for now:
http://www.boston.com/news/local/art...nites_protest/

I just don't get why malpractice insurance has to be so high when the clientele of birth centers is by definition LOW-risk. Argh.

And a







for Quinn--I hope he recovers soon. Poor little guy.


----------



## snozzberry

Abby pulls at her ears when she's tired. Could it be an ear infection? Or is that just a nice tell-tale sleepy sign?


----------



## PiePie

*kelly*, very unlikely ear infection (although if your gut says it is and you see fever and fussiness definitely get it checked). my mother and otehrse swear it's a sleepy sign but i swear dd did it just because from about 3 mos. till about 9 mos. (that's an overstatement -- maybe 7?) just because. no longer.

i am so tired.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

I think I'm on the road to the cascade of interventions and I'm mad at myself for letting it happen. Spent all day yesterday in the hospital having every conceivable screening and test for pre-eclampsia just because of some very sketchy/borderline urine protein and marginally elevated blood pressure (elevated for me, but by no means high - 120/80). All was clear but I've got to go back and do it all again on Monday, if I don't, they'll risk me out of the birth centre.







:
















I think there's some politics at play too which frustrates me even more. See my post in 'birth professionals' for the long version of the story.


----------



## witchygrrl

Ugh, MMM, I'm sorry that happened! I would say keep really well hydrated and eat bananas daily 'just in case'. I watch my BP like a hawk because of family history so when I saw my own BP go higher than I liked closer to the end, I started eating bananas to keep it down. Not sure if that was what really did the trick, but my BP went back to normal.

But ITA that it was overkill, big time. 6 hours of tests seems rather extreme. If you have to do it Monday, else risk out of the birth center, I suppose you need to, but I would definitely BRING IT UP at your next regular appt.








You're so close!


----------



## Holiztic

MMM,

My BP started to go up at 37 weeks, just a tad at first. Not to scare you, but it went up and up and up. I tried EVERYTHING including a cupboard full of herbs, to no avail. The only thing that kept it low enough to still have a homebirth was drinking epsom salts (in warm water) and chasing it with a milk/egg yolk drink (for the protein hit). This lowered it for a couple hours at a time. I only did this during labor and in the day after--not a long term solution! I don't recommend this unless you really believe you don't have pre-e. I had no protein and late-onset moderate swelling. My MW didn't even send me for tests when I was hitting 150/110 (but again, no protein in urine).

Good luck, you and baby will be fine! My worries over my BP (and the thought of being risked out to the hospital) is what brought on my PP stress/anxiety disorder (which I can't emphasize enough how bad it was). So whatever you do, don't get too worried about this, you and baby will be just fine (I promise!!!!)


----------



## cking

MMM,







and







:

Kelly, I think it's probably just a sleepy sign.


----------



## Maela

MMM, sorry you had/have to go through that.







Hopefully, things go well Monday. Try not to get too stressed.

No nap again today. Second time this month, I believe. This is crazy. Nice bedtime though - 7:15PM


----------



## Maela

Dd is having a language explosion! It's so cool. She's saying new words every week. She finally uses "mama" consistently - I







it! She also consistently uses Dada, Nana (grandma), papa, and Gigi (grandma). Tonight during her bath, she pointed to her towel and said, "Towel." No joke. She also pointed to the moon in _Goodnight Moon_ and said, "moon."

Oh and she's getting into playing with her baby doll and her other stuffed animals. She puts them on her bed and says "night" for good night/night night. and she picks it up and says, "baby" and gives it a hug and kiss.


----------



## katt

maela-
that is SO sweet.


----------



## Holiztic

so after 2 weeks of Quinn being almost completely toilet trained (after only 2 days of learning!) He has now almost totally regressed! He had a yeasty-type infection under his foreskin last weekend that really hurt him for about 24 hours. When he peed, he screamed! I think he started associating the pain with using the toilet. The first few days this week he was inconsistent about avoiding the toilet, about 50/50. So far today, he is totally refusing. We have been through 3 pairs of undies/pants. So frustrating after having this almost perfectly toilet-trained kid for 2 weeks. Any thoughts?


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, god. totallly scary.

maela, i want you to know that i wrote a super long post re your autism fears and then it didn't show up. the short version is that 1. i have read about such rituals kicking in at 18 mos. in neurotypical children and 2. a 2 yo in dd's sch does this.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*mujerista*, god. totallly scary.

maela, i want you to know that i wrote a super long post re your autism fears and then it didn't show up. the short version is that 1. i have read about such rituals kicking in at 18 mos. in neurotypical children and 2. a 2 yo in dd's sch does this.

Really? Yay! I'm glad she's not the only one!

We went to a wedding tonight and had so much fun! Dd was dancing so much; she was the life of the party! She also ran around with some other little ones on the dance floor. So cute. No fear of strangers tonight. I'm beginning to think that there's something about that room in our library where they do story/song time that she doesn't like because it's the only place where she stays glued to my lap like that. I don't know what it is though. It is a big room, but...









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
so after 2 weeks of Quinn being almost completely toilet trained (after only 2 days of learning!) He has now almost totally regressed! He had a yeasty-type infection under his foreskin last weekend that really hurt him for about 24 hours. When he peed, he screamed! I think he started associating the pain with using the toilet. The first few days this week he was inconsistent about avoiding the toilet, about 50/50. So far today, he is totally refusing. We have been through 3 pairs of undies/pants. So frustrating after having this almost perfectly toilet-trained kid for 2 weeks. Any thoughts?

That's too bad! Poor Quinn! Is it all cleared up? No advice, sorry. Maybe if you be really careful not to push it, he'll want to try again in a couple of weeks. It can't last long; but it is inconvenient.









Dd seems totally ready to get serious about this potty thing. We've been half-heartedly ECing her since 3mo, but lately she's been having lots of dry diapers. Also she'll often let me know when she's wet or going. And she says good bye to her pee/poop when the toilet is flushing. She's just so aware of her elimination and that we try to get it into the potty, that I think she could be "potty trained" fairly easily with a little more effort on my part. So either after Thanksgiving (did I say we're going to Disneyland?!







) or maybe I'll wait until after Christmas, I'd like to give it a try.


----------



## Maela

I was so sure I was ovulating a few weeks ago. Turns out I hadn't, even though I had all the signs. I'm so ready to get my normal cycles back. Lots of (okay 3







) people I know are pg, and I would desperately like to join them - or at least to have the ability to get pg again.

Oh and MIL keeps dropping hints that she's hoping to hear news soon of a pg from one of us (me or my SIL). This is because my SIL and I both announced our pg at Disneyland two years ago on Thanksgiving. So now I think she's expecting to hear that again this time.







: Kind of annoying. I'm tempted to tell her that she should be careful when she's saying stuff like that to people because she never knows if that person is TTC and having a hard time or not. But then she would know that I actually would like to be pg again, and then I would never hear the end of it.







Are you pg? Are you pg yet? You're not pg are you?

Just a little (undeserved, really) rant. I'm just in a bad mood.


----------



## PiePie

I also am home sick. dd started puking on Friday night and did through Saturday night, between between pukings she was really happy. I OTOH came down sick on Sunday -- really really sick. Haven't kept anything down in 36 hours. So also feel really really weak. dd's teacher had warned me it was going around. Per the class email list-serv, 5 out of 7 kids have had it -- one for 6 days and counting! Please God I am not up for that. On the bright side, dh totally redeemed himself from his ua violation behavior as soon as dd started puking and was incredibly sweet with her all day yesterday. I am a little hurt over her severe separation anxiety from dh (screams bloody murder if left with me). So a question about morning sickness and other pukiness: do you try not to puke? Instinctively, I lie still and try not to puke. Yesterday I was even spitting out my spit, on instinct -- I guess I knew it would make me puke. But once I did puke I felt so much better. dh thinks I should actively try to make myself puke and perhaps then I wouldn't have been so laid low by the m/s. Anyway, I cannot believe we are hosting Thanksgiving. The house is a disaster and I can't imagine cooking anything.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I also am home sick. dd started puking on Friday night and did through Saturday night, between between pukings she was really happy. I OTOH came down sick on Sunday -- really really sick. Haven't kept anything down in 36 hours. So also feel really really weak. dd's teacher had warned me it was going around. Per the class email list-serv, 5 out of 7 kids have had it -- one for 6 days and counting! Please God I am not up for that. On the bright side, dh totally redeemed himself from his ua violation behavior as soon as dd started puking and was incredibly sweet with her all day yesterday. I am a little hurt over her severe separation anxiety from dh (screams bloody murder if left with me). So a question about morning sickness and other pukiness: do you try not to puke? Instinctively, I lie still and try not to puke. Yesterday I was even spitting out my spit, on instinct -- I guess I knew it would make me puke. But once I did puke I felt so much better. dh thinks I should actively try to make myself puke and perhaps then I wouldn't have been so laid low by the m/s. Anyway, I cannot believe we are hosting Thanksgiving. The house is a disaster and I can't imagine cooking anything.

That sounds awful - healing, healthy vibes for you and L.
As far as m/s - making myself vomit would offer me about 3 minutes of relief but nothing significant.
Take care


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 







I was so sure I was ovulating a few weeks ago. Turns out I hadn't, even though I had all the signs. I'm so ready to get my normal cycles back. Lots of (okay 3







) people I know are pg, and I would desperately like to join them - or at least to have the ability to get pg again.

Oh and MIL keeps dropping hints that she's hoping to hear news soon of a pg from one of us (me or my SIL). This is because my SIL and I both announced our pg at Disneyland two years ago on Thanksgiving. So now I think she's expecting to hear that again this time.







: Kind of annoying. I'm tempted to tell her that she should be careful when she's saying stuff like that to people because she never knows if that person is TTC and having a hard time or not. But then she would know that I actually would like to be pg again, and then I would never hear the end of it.







Are you pg? Are you pg yet? You're not pg are you?

Just a little (undeserved, really) rant. I'm just in a bad mood.

Bad mood totally warranted. So sorry that you're not quite on the track you want to be on. It'll come, I promise.

As for your MIL - it's incredible isn't it? I think the pressure to have a second may be greater than the pressure for a 1st. I haven't even popped this one out yet and people are already asking me what my plans are for subsequent kidlets.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thanks folks for your support and suggestions re the preeclampsia scare. I drank epsom salts, ate bananas, sipped on gallons and gallons of water and went through with round 2 of testing and fetal monitoring yesterday. Just as suspected, I am ALL CLEAR!







:My blood pressure went back down to 110/70 and the protein in my urine was minimal. Intuitively, I knew I was fine but with a whole weekend to dwell on it, I did let myself get a little stressed (ok, a LOT stressed).

Interestingly, I had been eating at least one, usually two bananas a day until about 10 days ago when I got all banana'ed out. I do wonder if they've been keeping my blood pressure good? I won't be skipping them anymore, that's for sure.

So now, at 37 weeks, I am finally clear for my birth centre birth!







: I cannot wait to meet this little critter but despite the super crampiness, I suspect it'll be a little while longer yet....the desire to nest has NOT set in at all.









Oh, and I tested negative for GBS.







AND my thyroid seems to have totally healed itself. Against all advice from the midwives, GP and naturopath, I took myself off my meds midway through this pregnancy and my most recent test results are the best they've ever been! Uncanny, seeing as pregnancy is supposed to make thyroids go crazy.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*, hoping for a quick recovery for you and your dd.







:
Oh, and i can never make myself vomit. I do EVERYTHING I possibly can to not vomit because I hate it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Bad mood totally warranted. So sorry that you're not quite on the track you want to be on. It'll come, I promise.

As for your MIL - it's incredible isn't it? I think the pressure to have a second may be greater than the pressure for a 1st. I haven't even popped this one out yet and people are already asking me what my plans are for subsequent kidlets.

Thanks. I just had a baby it seems like. I feel like it's really soon, so why would she be expecting another already? It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't actually want another one already.









Yay MMM!!







: I'm happy things went so well today, and I'm very excited for you.


----------



## Maela

I'm thinking of getting my hair cut - today or tomorrow. It would be an inch or two shorter than my picture in my sig. Is that too short for my face shape? I've never had it that short (since I was 3yo anyway) If someone could reply in the next hour that would be great because I might go tonight.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I'm thinking of getting my hair cut - today or tomorrow. It would be an inch or two shorter than my picture in my sig. Is that too short for my face shape? I've never had it that short (since I was 3yo anyway) If someone could reply in the next hour that would be great because I might go tonight.









I think you could pull it off if you made it a little choppier with a bit more layering. Do you know what I mean? Maybe I'll look for a pic...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Maela*... perhaps something like this:
http://www.hairstylestalk.com/images...airstyles1.jpg

BTW - totally jealous! I'm desperate for a haircut but we are stone broke this week because the accountant at work messed up my maternity leave payments so it's out of the question.







I fear I'm going to birth with BAD hair


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Maela*... perhaps something like this:
http://www.hairstylestalk.com/images...airstyles1.jpg

BTW - totally jealous! I'm desperate for a haircut but we are stone broke this week because the accountant at work messed up my maternity leave payments so it's out of the question.







I fear I'm going to birth with BAD hair









That's cute, but I think maybe a little too stylish/fasionable/brave for me.







I prefer plainer styles for myself. Hmm...I have a picture of what I want, but no way to show you.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
That's cute, but I think maybe a little too stylish/fasionable/brave for me.







I prefer plainer styles for myself. Hmm...I have a picture of what I want, but no way to show you.









Well I think you'd be super cute but you've gotta be comfortable too. I say cut it how you want it...if you hate it, it'll grow out. It's only hair. Go for it!


----------



## PiePie

*MUJERISTA*, you crack me up! birth with bad hair -- honestly, that should be your biggest challenge!! my girlfriend was all hot to trot to get her teeth whitened before she birthed so that she would look just so in those post-birth photos -- well she only used pics of baby's face, so it was irrelevant... i found that the urge to be done already correlated more strongly with the onset of labor than the urge to nest.

but then again you are hearing this from a woman with a filthy apt. who is hosting thanksgiving (gulp). we need a better balance here at home: either hire more domestic help on stuff i don't care to do ourselves (cleaning, babyproofing) or care less or at least communicate/negotiate mutual expectations better. i swear dh is grieving his dead mother through expectations that i replicate her thanksgiving -- can we say set-up for failure? i feel dread at the thought.

dd seems better, i am rallying but not sure if it will last.

dd is also having a language explosion, and more saliently a reading obsession. she demands to be read to every minute of every day, demanding books by name. now yall know i love kiddie lit and have been longing to do this (read to my child) since i was, say, 5 (my favorite game with my little brother used to be playing librarian and reading him books out of a little red wagon) but it is absolutely constant -- she won't let me do anything else. she recites portions of books too -- of course it's our version, so she says democrats for donkey and gay whenever she sees a rainbow flag (side note: is todd parr gay?)

we got her sch pics back and she has the most uncharacteristic impression -- sober -- fwiw all of the kiddos (except the oldest) look notably unsmiling in the group photo. dh says someday she will post it on facebook.


----------



## Maela

I did it. It looks...not bad. I'm sure there'll be some pictures taken this weekend, and I'll post a few on Monday. Thanks for the help, *MMM*. I understand the wanting to look good for the birth. I felt that way too. I didn't care about the pictures. I just wanted to feel like I at least _started_ labor looking my best. It helped me feel a little less self-conscious, knowing that my hair and make up were done, later on when I was on all fours with everyone staring at my butt.









*PiePie*, Maev definitely has been like that - wanting me to read to her _constantly_. She's gotten a little better about "reading" to herself sometimes in the last few weeks. I also love reading children's books, but when that's all you do and it's the tenth time for that particular book....







She would point to things in the book wanting me to name them saying, "That!" And if I was busy or just didn't answer her right away, "THAT!, THAT!!!" Now that I look back on it, it was cute, but at the time, it was very frustrating.


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm: i'm so glad that your birth is good to go. and, i can understand wanting to look right/good for birth.









as for my hair, i'm going to break down and dye it. i have an appt with the aveda salon, as they have the second best dyes (closest to the earth that still function nicely). so, a small trim to shape things up, and then get it back to the normal shade of blonde. the pregnancy muddied it, so that the hair near my head is darker than the ends. so, i want it all to match. the hair dresser wants to go with a nicole kidman color. that might be a bit much, but ok.

so, i'm scared about that even though i understand that it won't affect the breast milk and stuff.

the house, currently, is a mess and it makes me nuts. i am keeping the bathrooms clean and ryan's doing a decent job of the kitchen, but there's a smidge of clutter downstairs and in our room, and the laundry isn't folded. that's my big thing--i gotta fold laundry!

but, the baby only wants to be held when napping, etc. so, holding is what we do.







lots and lots of it and my arms are tired. so, the laundry isn't folded.

and, i'm getting more sleep. i finally just "broke down" and decided to sleep on my back with the baby draped over my breasts. he's the happiest of campers because he can snack all night long and snuggle too. my back hurts when i sleep like that, but, it works out because i get more sleep. also, ryan's been doing the night time pottying, so i dont' have to get up to do it.









as for thanksgiving, we usually have it here, but my mom recommended that they go ahead and host it. then, i would cook it. fab--because i love to do that. but then mom stepped in and wanted to make "everything easier" and so we're having boxed soup and whatever boring not hand made stuff which makes me crazy.

bah! oh well, she already bought the "ingredients!" so, no scratch soup, veggies, etc this year. just the turkey. bah bah bah! i was looking forward to cooking.


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, too funny! I went to my hairdresser a few days before my due date to get my hair done. I figured it would be the last time for awhile (meaning, I haven't had it done since and it looks AWFUL). Anyway, she said to me that she hoped I wouldn't go into labor and have the baby there, but she seemed comforted by me wearing jeans







But congrats on having everything all clear, including your thyroid! That alone caused you soo much stress. Hooray!

*Maela*, I'd love to see what you had done. Your hair was cute before, but I understand not undertaking something major.

I need my hair done, though. Rhea's over 16 weeks old, and I usually have my hair cut every 3 months (my hairdresser is a little pricey, but she does a good job). But I'm partially stuck because I want something different, and not a style I have to "do" all the time. Yet I don't want to look like a stereotypical, minivan driving mommy--because I'm not. Sigh.

*Zoe*, good luck with the coloring. I like Aveda, but DH doesn't...he hates the smell of the local Aveda salon I went to before I switched to my current person.

Oh, and DH's grandmother is already asking about great-grandchild #2...um, there won't be #2 from us, and wouldn't it be nice to wait until she met the first one first before asking for more??? Oy.


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* please come here and cook and fold for us! jk. seriously, i;d rather hold a kiddo any day.


----------



## katt

I got my hair cut about 4 months ago. It went from waist length to above my shoulders. I wanted something I could easily wear the boy with. It is a pain to tie on a MT or Wrap and get your hair stuck in it.

on a side note: I finally got some Livie and Luca shoes for the boy. I'm SO excited. They are having a clearance sale on the Futbol style. So, instead of 40$, they are 20$. AND they had his size. I'm THRILLED!

I hope they get here soon.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*PiePie* - you think the haircut thing is funny...wait 'til you hear about the freakout I had on Friday when I realised my toenails were covered in ugly, chipped red nail polish! What if they'd rushed me into surgery for a c-section with toenails like that!??! Oh Boy! Fortunately my Mum is coming tomorrow and she's treating us both to pedicures!

I have never been a girlie girl. This pregnancy has turned me into such a princess. DP has even started calling me Princess (affectionately) and where once I would have decked her, I quite like it now. Now, if I start wearing make-up, then you all should be very very worried about me!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

My dad has just offered to pay for 3 months of nappy (diaper) service!







so happy - we only have half our nappy stash bought and it's been stressing me out!

Talk to me about toys? I don't need to be worried that Squeak doesn't have any yet do I? People will give them to us, right?


----------



## accountclosed3

no worries abt toys. hawk totally doesn't care! he wants people!

nak


----------



## ~Shanna~

:
I needed to come back and see you all. I'm in such a dark place. Fenton is working on his molars ( i can see 2 coming through, and pray to God that the other two come today), and for the last week I haven't been to sleep before 4 am. Between bedtime and 4 am (5 am las night), he crawls over us in bed, shrieks, asks to watch the Muppets, asks for a snack, asks for the potty, says he has to poop....any time we get him what he says he wants, he still wanders around the house crying. He always wants whatever is on the opposite floor of the house that he is on. I fwe try to hold him to comfort him, he shrieks, thrashes and tries to hurt both of us. He wants to nurse constantly, but my milk supply is going down so he thrashes and I eventually climb the walls with the feeling of toddler teeth on dry breasts. I have been sobbing for the past week, on occasion punching my pillow....I'm angry, exhausted and seriously questioning whether I can ever go through this again with another child. I'm turning into a monster. I'm patting his back too hard, wanting to let him wander around a dark house alone at night while I put in earplugs...
I'm seriously considering putting the crib together and dividing the night with DH - one of us sleeps in the spare room with ear plugs while the other sits next to Fenton in the crib so he doesn't cry alone. I don't know what this will help - I just know that what is happening right now is that I follow him around the house for 6-7 hours in the middle of the night while he sobs, with me sobbing and feeling violent towards him. I can't help but want to at least see if these hours could be more productive towards him learning to sleep in a place where he can't just get up and terrorize us.
Every night I think that this is the night we'll actually get sleep because he can't go for a week without sleep, right? We're going on Day 7 and I'm afraid that I'm going to do something violent. I don't know what I need from anyone...I just needed to come here and be with friends.


----------



## PiePie

mmm: i am a toy whore, and i believe that until babe is sitting, babe needs only 3 toys: a baby safe mirror, a mobile, and a gym. oh, and a musical pull-down toy. the mirror we had for dd is by earlyears and unfortunately is not made any more, but sassy and lamaze make nice ones. tiny love makes the best mobiles, but they are pricey ($40?) and we didn't have a crib to mount it on, so we just used portable ones. one (by infantino, not made any more, hand me down) was hand held and one we could velcro to the wrist. the latter is still made and is by tiny love and is like $12 and has non-tinny, non-electronic music. sounds like an old-fashioned music box. for gyms, i am a huge proponent of the gymini by tiny love. pre-baby i would have told you they are a waste of money at $40 plus. however, we got one as a hand-me-down, and it was the only way i could put her down (for 10, sometimes even 15, minutes for the first 3 mos). they are soft fabric, no plastic, and ours was an original version, no lights or music (but i have heard the music and it is quite nice, not extreme or electronic sounding). she loved it so much we cried when she outgrew it. i would check out craigs list for one if you don't luck into a hand-me-down.

sick to my tummy.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, i think it is very much time to divide the nights with dh, if not turn every other night over to him entirely, till you get your groove back. would it be doable to try over the holiday weekend when he can nap during the day?

that is what we are toying with for nightweaning -- christmas week with dh on duty. it is either xmas or may, given his work schedule. i don't think it is good for our marriage to wait for may, although honestly i don't want to transition her to her own bed.

last night she woke only once but i had horrific insomnia, i am like dying here of exhaustion.

*shanna*, for today, try getting a sitter to take him out somewhere, just for a hour and a half, so you can NAP. he will be so excited with his adventure out in the big world that by the time he misses you you will be reunited and you will be refreshed.


----------



## katt

Shanna - HUGS! You can do this, you will get through it, This too shall pass.
but, in the mean time you are very much entitled to your feelings.

I think spliting the night with DH is a great idea. You need to take care of yourself as well.

Pie Pie's sitter idea is fabulous. You get some sleep, he gets to get out w/ a change of scenery.

HUGS!

MMM: Toys? we don't have a lot, even when he was an infant. He wasn't interested in them at all. It was all Mom and Dad. We read a lot of books, a lot of talking, and hands on. I did have a gym thing that didn't get pulled out until he was almost too big for it. he still kinda liked it.







He LOVES shoes, anyones shoes, as soon as he could get to them he'd go wear them. Very funny! Balls, he's always loved to throw balls, for us for the dog into a basket... Last night he went to sleep w/ the lilttle cheapy basketball DH got for him.

I say you are fine w/ no toys. Just wait until you see where his interests lie and then go with that.


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*














I'm sorry things are so tough right now. At times like this I like to remember what Katt said _This too shall pass._ Although I guess that's really hard to believe when you're in the middle of it.
Could you let him roam around your bedroom (with the door closed) at night? Maybe leave some toys out for him while you guys try to sleep? Or is he just so unhappy that you couldn't even do that? Poor little guy.
I agree with the babysitter idea or even if dad could take him for a few hours this evening out somewhere?

MMM: we had lots of toys







, but the things dd liked best were: the gym thingy, soft rattles, and mirrors of any kind.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, i came back to say 3 things, offered in a spirit of pure support. the first, and i say this without judgment, simply as a factual matter, is that television right before bedtime can cause sleep disruption and sometimes delay the onset of sleep. so maybe have the muppets go nigh-nigh 30-90 minutes before you need fenton to? does he have a regular bedtime? having dd on a schedule is helpful. she conks out at exactly the same time every night and most days for nap. from what i have read here molars are a big issue, but if the sleep issues continue past that, in light of his history, it might be worth having f. checked for allergies, which sometimes manifest exclusively as sleep issues... we love you and you will pull through this.


----------



## Holiztic

Shanna, are these the 2 year molars or his first molars? Doesn't matter much, I was just curious as we still have the 2 year molars to go! Quinn's sleeping is going downhill with his canines coming through. For him, though (not trying to be glib here, I promise) it just means he has a 2 hour stretch where he sleep-nurses non-stop. I am so frustrated by it, but you make me realize I should be thankful that at least we are in bed, laying down. I don't want to make you worry, but have you talked to his ped? It sounds like you are saying he isn't sleeping more than a couple hours in a 24 hour period. Is that right? This sounds a bit extreme to me and might be worth a visit to the doc?

Okay, so after saying all that (which probably didn't sound helpful at all, feel free to glare at me) I absolutely agree that you need to do WHATEVER gets you through, mama! An insane (literally and hyberbolically) mama is no good to anyone, least of all a child in turmoil.

Wish I could come over and give you a break! See if someone can, NOW!


----------



## TinyFrog

Shanna I hope you and Fenton find some relief soon.


----------



## snozzberry

*Shanna,*












































You are having normal feelings for what you're going through.

I agree with everyone else: Get a sitter now--pay someone or get a family member/friend.

After you get some sleep, then you can think about next steps, like calling the ped. My personal take on next steps is that I wonder if there are herbal remedies to help with the teething pain. So if it were me, I would probably look into a naturopath and/or acupuncturist.


----------



## farmama

Shanna,








s. i know how hard it is to maintain patience and a loving attitude toward someone who is screaming and running around the house. what helps me is to remember that your lo is in pain, and not only can't rest, but most likely doesn't understand WHY ON EARTH his poor mouth hurts him so. That doesn't get you any further in the sleep department, though.

are you completely opposed to tylenol or some sort of less nasty teething aid/pain reducer? it sounds like y'all could really use the rest.








s


----------



## ~Shanna~

Thanks you guys - I really miss you all.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Could you let him roam around your bedroom (with the door closed) at night? Maybe leave some toys out for him while you guys try to sleep? Or is he just so unhappy that you couldn't even do that? Poor little guy.

I'd be willing to do this, except he's so upset that he doesn't really want to play or do anything - he's just crying. Screaming, really. Nursing will often be what he wants and I do it when I can, but increasingly I don't have any more milk, or I'm climbing the walls from toddler teeth on spent breasts. It doesn't help that emotionally I'm really wanting to nightwean and intend to start helping him to do so as soon as the teeth are through.

Last night was a little better - he slept fitfully, but it seemed more due to an on-coming cold that we're all getting (big surprise there). He never fully woke up last night though, so its a major victory. He only slept soundly in 10 minute increments, so that combined with my exhaustion-induced insomnia means I still didn't sleep well. But at least it was peaceful. It helped galvanize our decision that putting him in the crib isn't going to help unless you can sleep through your child screaming. Which, thank god, we can't.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
television right before bedtime can cause sleep disruption and sometimes delay the onset of sleep. so maybe have the muppets go nigh-nigh 30-90 minutes before you need fenton to? does he have a regular bedtime? ... from what i have read here molars are a big issue, but if the sleep issues continue past that, in light of his history, it might be worth having f. checked for allergies, which sometimes manifest exclusively as sleep issues... we love you and you will pull through this.

There's a lot of wisdom in that, but I feel stuck because watching the "muts" is the only thing that seems to get him to relax enough before bed. Although, he's done watching them about 60 minutes before bed. Still, I'm not crazy about it being part of the getting ready for bed routine, period. But otherwise, he's a perpetual motion machine, wanting to tackle Daddy, chase Mama with the popper...all things that are so much fun, but make for very difficult settling down for bed. He's not even particularly interested in TV in general, just the songs and dancing of this particular show. I know all parents say this, and I think Steph can corroborate: Fenton is a particularly spirited child, so I'm often at a loss for how to help him relax. It's not hyperactive really, it's just that he seems to have a lot of things that he wants to do, and most involve running or bouncing







We have a routine and he goes down quite easily. The biggest culprit here is that nursing helps him feel better when he's teething, and this time around there isn't as much supply as there used to be. So when he wakes up in the night in discomfort, what used to be a constant nursing session is now a full-blown wake up and crying because the milk is all gone. As for allergies, I wondered the same thing. He tested negative for all common allergies, though I know he's sensitive to dairy and eggs because he gets a diaper rash about 5 hours after consuming. We've eliminated, but could be he's sensitive to other foods. But does it seem likely that he'd have the rash symptom for some and only sleep issues for others? To be honest, I've only seen these sleep symptoms in the weeks before a tooth pops through so I have a strong gut feeling that it is the teeth. I've just never seen it so aggressive. The past week he's also sleep deprived, as Elizabeth pointed out: ~2 hours of sleep early in the night, 4-5 hours of sleep later in the night, then a 2-3 hour nap during the day. But I don't see what our ped can do before we rule out that it's teeth. So I think I'll wait it out because I'm so sure it is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Shanna, are these the 2 year molars or his first molars?

It is the 2 year molars - he has only 2 more to go and we're. done.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
Shanna,








s. i know how hard it is to maintain patience and a loving attitude toward someone who is screaming and running around the house. what helps me is to remember that your lo is in pain, and not only can't rest, but most likely doesn't understand WHY ON EARTH his poor mouth hurts him so. That doesn't get you any further in the sleep department, though.

are you completely opposed to tylenol or some sort of less nasty teething aid/pain reducer? it sounds like y'all could really use the rest.

Thanks so much







Most of the time I can keep my patience and empathy. I hurt seeing him hurt so much. My magic hours where I totally lose it are between midnight and 2, or if I haven't been to sleep at all by 4 or 5. Which, well, makes sense. We aren't at all opposed to pharmaceuticals - The only thing that has ever helped his suffering at night is Motrin, and I have nightmares about how much we've given him. We never exceed the the rule of 4 doses in a day for 10 days in a row - in fact, we only ever give him 1 dose at night for maybe a 3 or 4 night stretch. But he's been teething for 17 months, so we've gone through what looks like a total of a lot.

But for how challenging night parenting has been this week, he's an absolute joy during the day. He's talking so much and so clearly, and has finally started to remember number 7 when he counts, so he's getting all the way to 14 (the number of steps at Grandma and Papa's house







)

I really appreciate all of you. Sorry to come and navel gaze for so much space. It helps me to delineate what is going on, and to get your advice. I hope this also helps someone if they go through it. But I have to concur with Pie Pie, my sense is that the molars, for some kids, are an absolute nightmare.

MMM, I just caught the end of your eclampsia scare - I'm so sorry you had to go through that







I'm trying to pop in here at least once a week to check for Squeak







: And I'm so sorry to vent on these things right before your little one comes - I really think our issues have been highly unusual.

Elizabeth, on the potty regressing, I don't think I've ever seen a kid _not_ regress. I think most parents are either forgetting or simplifying if they talk about potty learning like it's an event. Especially if he's doing a lot of new things right now, I can see how he'd want to go back to what is familiar every so often. But it looms bigger to you because it's a big difference in what it means for your life, huh?

Have to go to T-day dinner. Thanks again you guys. I hope to report back soon that, whatever challenges we face, we can now be sure that it not teething.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, why the supply drop? fenugreek??


----------



## katt

Happy Thanksgiving!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna* - please don't apologise - you're going through some stuff. I can take it, I swear! In fact, I try often to think about how I'll cope if my boy is a spirited munchkin.
Anyway, I sure hope you're all sleeping soundly as I type this. I have no advice but I think you've received some really sound counsel from these other awesome mamas.

Thanks all for the toy input. I need to stress less. It's not like we live in the middle of nowhere with no opportunity to shop! Squeak will be appropriately toyed, I'm sure


----------



## witchygrrl

*Shanna*, not much advice here either, other than I hope you can get someone help you get some well-deserved rest. I didn't have internet at the in-laws, otherwise I would have said so sooner.








sounds like you're doing the best you can under the circumstances.

*MMM*, I'm stalking you! You're soooo close now!

Thanksgiving was both better and worsethan I thought. The loveliest comment coming from GGrandma (Rhea was in a sling on me at the time) was that if I carry her around like this now, I'll be going with her on her honeymoon, too. Thankfully, her aunt, uncle, and cousin ALL BACKED ME UP ON THIS, even though they weren't AP at all. They seemed to think the philosophy made a lot of sense


----------



## accountclosed3

whoosh! shanna--that's a lot to go through. i hope that everyone gets more sleep and that the teeth are d-o-n-e soon!

so, thanksgiving was great. mom finally realized that i wanted to cook, and so she went back and got all the ingredients for me to do so. hawk had an am feeding and just completely mellowed with my mom for a good 3 hours before he needed to feed again. this gave me enough time to get everything chopped and prepped to cook, and then while he fed, i just directed as such: boil that, sautee those, roast that after the turkey, put the turkey in now. . .and so on. it was perfect and the food was fabulous.

unfortunately, i didn't get to cook for m friends as much as i wanted. their baby is due any day now, and i was able to make a freeze about 10 servings of soup for them, which would be enough for dinners for 5 nights. i was hoping to get three more soups up and freeze for us and them (ok, so there are 20 servings total, but i figured that people wouldn't necessarily want doubles of cream of broccoli and corn chowdah and potato-leek). i wanted to also make a minestrone, a split pea, and turkey-noodle with left overs but my dad and ryan ate the left overs before i got to use them to make soop.

and of course, hawk got overstimulated throughout t he rest of t-day, and so he was a little koala on friday. . .which meant no extra cooking anyway. LOL

ok, so, the ILs were actually ok. they were modestly rude to opie, my mother was nervous and did her nervous laugh think that my sister also does. she doesn't like to entertain my ILs at all, and knew that i would be watching the baby like crazy and that my FIL has been on my case about my weight.

also, the book thing turned out ok. my ILs completely deny chapters 1-7 of alfie's unconditional parenting. . .that is, they don't think that they did any of those things, but since their entire self esteem is wrapped up in being "good parents" and what not, they certianly couldn't admit that they did any of those things (punished by rewards and what not). but, they did like the ideas that he gave in chapters 7-10, and were willing to talk about those techniques in specific. so, that was helpful--and we were able to describe how we were already implementing it in certain ways (such as, when pottying, we talk about how we enjoy the ECing process, and we ask him if he feels good/better after going potty, etc).

overall, it was pretty decent and we had a good time. but today, thankfully, was a PJ day. we just hung out all day long in our PJs and watched movies while hawk was a koala (a nursing koala this time) intersperced with reading and internet time. ryan's reading some icelandic saga to the baby now. i don't remember which one.









also, while switching between movies (we watched Amelie and Kung Fu Panda), i saw an informercial for Your Baby Can Read. looked interesting, and at least like a game i could play with hawk. i'm also considering using some hooked on phonics materials.

now, not so that he can be some uber achiever, but just to give me idaes of what to do. i read these books and they give examples, but then they say 'Oh, make your own cards and do X!" and i'm like "freakin'-a, i can't even get my laundry folded let alone take the time to make cards for him." so, i'm looking for different word/picture games that we can play as he gets older and more interested.

so, i know some of you are educators and speech-path folks and other smarties, so if you'd look into it for me, that would be awesome.









because then i can put it on the christmas list for him.


----------



## PiePie

*witchy*, we had some of that here too.







dh's bff was in town visiting, and he came to visit with his wie's bff. they carried their baby in a baby carrier and went on about 1. how their bjorn was superior to our ergo (of course they didn't say it right, they kept saying ergobaby, and correcting us) whereas they actually drug their lo in an infant carrier and how there was, check this out, "no data" to support exclusive or extended BFing, invoking his expertise as a doctor (internist, so knows like next to nothing about peds). i felt obliged to be polite which was the worst because i really could have told him of up down and sideways. dh was not pleased that i was "judgy" of them, whereas i felt they were rude as hell for sitting my living room and whispering about me nursing on my own darn floor. i also felt like dh's friend didn't coo enough over my lo, who i of course think is the best thing ever. he said she was "human," which dh felt like for him was a really high compliment. (?) okay, i hear something on the monitor that sounds ominous.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
now, not so that he can be some uber achiever, but just to give me idaes of what to do. i read these books and they give examples, but then they say 'Oh, make your own cards and do X!" and i'm like "freakin'-a, i can't even get my laundry folded let alone take the time to make cards for him." so, i'm looking for different word/picture games that we can play as he gets older and more interested.

so, i know some of you are educators and speech-path folks and other smarties, so if you'd look into it for me, that would be awesome.









because then i can put it on the christmas list for him.

My favorite authors. who I've mentioned before, Hirsh Pasek and Golinkoff, are all about play and learning, and not about flash cards, but it's good to read a variety of viewpoints. Anyway, they wrote a book called Einstein Never Used Flashcards.
http://books.google.com/books?id=pr8...ummary_s&cad=0

I haven't read it yet, but intend to. But I am somewhat familiar with their work, and their main thing is that kids need to play in order to foster creativity, which in turn fosters problem solving in all sorts of ways. This book has some suggestions about how to go about doing this sort of thing.


----------



## PiePie

5 stars for _einstein never used flashcards_, although i think the age group of that book cannot reasonably be considered below 18 mos., and arguably has a lower limit of 3 yrs. the principles still apply to our babes, but most of the research is with older children, because they are comparing diferent presch settings.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Another thumbs up for einstein never used flashcards! Actually DP picked it up and loved it. I've only heard the general overview but it sounds awesome.

Cooked a huge pot of bolognese to freeze and spent almost 3 hours cleaning my fridge today. Mum and her cleaner are coming over to scrub stuff tomorrow too. Maybe, just maybe, I'll get the hang of this nesting thing.

I wish I could say that I thought Squeaks arrival was imminent but I think we're here for a while longer yet. This Aries sure gets a lot of tests of her patience....so much learning for me to do!!!


----------



## Maela

*ZB*, glad to hear you got to cook a little for Thanksgiving! And that the book thing went fairly well.
I don't know if this is what you are talking about re: cards, but Dd has a book that's kind of like a very short picture dictionary that she's always loved (like since she was just a couple of months old). It has pictures with the words beneath of several objects in categories like bedtime, eating, wild animals, farm animals/pets, bathtime, toys, etc.... She loves to look at it and can label or point out most of the things in it by now.

It's so crazy how fast she is learning new words now. I really can't believe it. I think this is pretty normal, but I'm just not used to it having worked with children with autism and my little brother didn't talk much until he was three. She's like a little parrot (good thing Dh and I started watching our language as soon as she was born







).

We had a great time at Disneyland! The drive there wasn't so fun (7 hours with traffic), but she really did well for a 1yo. We stopped often. I forgot our camera, so I have to get ahold of my dad's and FIL's pictures, so I can show you all. Dd got so excited on some of the rides. Even when she was scared, it never lasted the whole ride. She would be alternately scared and and then super excited. On one ride she was scared when we first got on and then she was mad when it was time to get off.







And the gparents watched the little ones for a couple of hours both nights, so that we could go on the big rides. Dd had a lot of fun being with her cousins.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Another thumbs up for einstein never used flashcards! Actually DP picked it up and loved it. I've only heard the general overview but it sounds awesome.

I'll have to read that one; it sounds like something I would like.

Dd has a molar coming in! But she doesn't have all the teeth in front of it yet (sorry don't know their names







). Anyway, I just noticed it today. She has been sleeping so poorly in the last couple of months, and I had noticed that her gum was swollen there, but nothing was happening. Then on Wednesday, all of a sudden she was sleeping well again (waking 1-3 times a night instead of 5-7 and taking better naps) and she's been sleeping well since! Yesterday when we were driving home she fell asleep at 5PM. I thought it was a late nap. We stopped to eat dinner and woke her up. She was so upset the whole time we were eating, and we couldn't figure out why. Then as soon as she got back in her carseat she fell right back to sleep and slept for the rest of the night (waking for nursing of course). So she basically had a bedtime of 5PM last night! And she didn't wake up early either. Maybe she was making up for the last month or two of poor sleeping.







_This too shall pass._ I have to remind myself - during the bad times _and_ the good times.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

:
DP's family have just told us that they are having Christmas breakfast at her sisters house - a plan they made in full knowledge that we can't be there because we're having a low key gathering for xmas lunch at our house (Mum is bringing the food and we've promised that the house WON'T be clean). Originally, none of DP's family other than her parents could make Christmas (because they're working or with their partners family) so we thus invited her parents to spend the day with us at our place with my Mum and her partner. We actually thought this was the best case scenario because it would allow both sets of grandparents to spend the day with their first grandchild. Now we've not only been ditched but they've knowingly excluded us.

I can't help but feel this is going to be a pattern. DP's father has not spoken to me since we announced my pregnancy. He has only acknowledged the pregnancy to DP twice. He has said to DP's mum _'it won't really be our grandchild'_ which still hurts me. DP's sister has serious middle child syndrome and is jealous that we're pregnant first - she has done everything she can to belittle and undermine the excitement that their mum has for her first grandchild. She even convinced DP's mum that it was rude of DP to provide a couple of suggestions for things we still need for the baby so we're likely going to receive a whole stack plastic crap now. (We don't do registries here but I really thought it was ok to ask our parents for things we need - my folks ask at every given opportunity if there's anything else they can help us with.)

arghhh - I could go on and on. I'll shut up now. Suffice to say, I'm hurt and offended and most of all, feeling really sad for DP.


----------



## witchygrrl

*maela*, sounds like you had a really fun trip! DH can't wait to take Rhea to theme parks!

*MMM*, that's very upsetting. what small people they are.







to you and your DP


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm: sorry about your DP's parents. that's just nuts!

thanks for the book recommendation, so long as i don't have to create the various play activities. see, that's the issue. i have read a number of books about play-as-learning and every one includes things that you can make!

because i just don't want to make anything.

as it is, we do play with him and read to him and talk to him. and, i have a few small books that have things like "Bee" and then B and also a bee drawing. right? this your-baby-can-read stuff is not for academics to me--i could care less--but they have these cards that are words with pictures and are a bit more diverse than some books i've seen.

maela, i'd definitely be interested in the book that you recommend.









also, i do plan on finding the Einstein book, i just hope that the play activities aren't craft-based for mom because i just don't have the skills (or time or desire!).

and, seeing as he's only 3 months, he's very happy just playing with people. moving his body, being talked to, read to, and he's into looking at our bodies move and mimicking (particularly hands--he's trying to snap as ryan snaps at him as part of his hand/finger games).

i'm not worried about it at all. i just thought it would be fun to have word-and-picture to play with.

oh, and hawk loves mirrors and photographs of people. he was looking at his newborn photos and loves to do that. he can look at pictures of people forever!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
maela, i'd definitely be interested in the book that you recommend.









Here it is. It's really not anything special, but Maev loves it.

*MMM*







I'm sorry your DP's parents are being so rude. So it's rude of you and your DP to make gift suggestions, but not rude for them to say yes to coming to your house for a holiday and then say they're going somewhere else?


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM*,























*Maela*, so glad you guys had fun! And enjoy that sleeping heaven.









*Signing*: Abby's doing "more" at mealtimes, which is great, but she's also doing it all throughout the day. Hmm. I can't figure out what she wants more of. Maybe she thinks it means "want" in general?

Just saw on local mom's list that baby born same day as Abby is saying "kee" for kitty and waving hello/bye and pointing at things when asked where they are. Abby's not doing any of that, except sometimes waving. Dang. I hate feeling like she's behind, even though I know know know every baby is different.


----------



## PiePie

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...6#post12712106


----------



## witchygrrl

so despite Rhea being sick all through Thanksgiving weekend, she had a cluster of surprises for us. first, I noticed her passing her chew bracelet back and forth from one hand to the other several times in succession. Then 2 days later she rolled over twice! then today I had a boppy pillow on the couch with the opening toward the back, and I had her inside the space so I could eat some lunch without dropping it all over her. She first did a kind of back bend, then I saw her wriggle up to a cockeyed sitting position! I moved her back because I barely believed what I was seeing, and she did it again! good thing we ordered her high chair last week.

*snozz*, she's fine, promise. She is signing, and probably attaching different meanings to it. The other baby might not be signing. But in essence, comprehension always comes before production, so she's gearing up on that first. She'll be producing more in no time, promise.

*maela*, I keep meaning to comment on how much fun it must be to see maev's language explode like that!

*zoe*, I hear ya on the no crafts thing...I married an artisan, so I figure HE can make the crafts, but even if I didn't, I'd not have any idea what to do in that dept.


----------



## Maela

I think I have to take another break from the computer. I don't watch more than one tv show a week, but i'm online sooo much. I feel like it's almost just asbad, yk? i'n not getting anything accomplished and december is going to be a crazy/busy month for us. So, yeah i'm ging tobe gone for at least a few days. I'll miss you all though!









might check in once in a while to stalk MMM!









oh and yay Rhea! I can't believe how old all our lo's are getting!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Please tell me this extreme crying and anxiety is a sign of imminent labour. I cannot possibly be THIS upset just about xmas.
Thanks all for the hugs.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, i had a sobbing meltdown the day before i went into labor when my mw told me i was not dilated at all.


----------



## witchygrrl

I had a meltdown a few days prior when I was at the birth center for 12 hours, only to be told I hadn't progressed at all, and should just go home and be patient.


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, my water works picked up too! haven't stopped; i cry at everything.


----------



## PiePie

i am so angry at dd right now and am coming here because i need to express it to someone who is not her. she broke my glasses. yes i know i should not have let her access the glasses. but that just makes me angry at myself. having a rough time with this unfamiliar emotion.


----------



## PiePie

also having a lot of tiny but frequent concerns re her development -- 1. is she "behind" and 2. is she not being given optimal attention in her daycare setting. the second is definitely partly working mamas guilt and is not at all tiny. dh is so sick of hearing about the first -- he thinks dd is perfect and is hence offended when i query whether her speech is too indistinct, etc. mostly i am worried that she "lost" a ton of words between 9 and 11 months, when she was working on walking. has tons of new ones every day now (picked up again in october), but not very well articulated -- too many things sound like "gah." also has stopped maintaining eye contact for long periods -- dh thinks she is just too busy to have a staring contest. the pretend play however is through the roof cute, and making up tons of interactive games. he also really doesn't get the second, in part because he does not get the professionalization of early childhood education -- she is happy and that makes him happy -- he is a simple man. he is completely smitten that she identifies her body parts. i am less surprised because i have a much higher estimation of her receptive vocabulary, and her verbalizing it is just an extra.


----------



## arelyn

Just popping in on baby watch.

MMM: I'm sorry the ILs are being so insensitive! (can I call them ILs, they're acting like ILs...I call my parents the ILs when they insist on acting stupid). I hope they'll fall in love with the litle guy when he comes and this doesn't become a pattern. You don't need this, especially now. Don't worry, I was a wreck too.







s

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Signing*: Abby's doing "more" at mealtimes, which is great, but she's also doing it all throughout the day. Hmm. I can't figure out what she wants more of. Maybe she thinks it means "want" in general?

.

Kai uses the sign "more" to designate want. When he does it I say "More what? Show me." and he'll point to the desired object. Usually. He's doing it more and more.

piepie: our LOs are on par. Kai is far to busy to be his usual social self...unless it means chasing other children.

meala: My dentist FIL says it's normal to get molars before the canines (the third ones out). Kai has 11 teeth (the front 8 and three molars)...I am simply blown away by that number...it's crazy! When did he get so big!


----------



## PiePie

DD has only 4 teeth!! That is one area of "behind" as to which I have no worries....


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 

Kai uses the sign "more" to designate want. When he does it I say "More what? Show me." and he'll point to the desired object. Usually. He's doing it more and more.


ditto. today she did it in the swing to indicate no more swinging, want another part of the playground.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Just popping in on baby watch.

Me too


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

No baby...and no more meltdowns either. DP has been saying Dec 4th for weeks now. I'm positive she's wrong! I've always said Dec 13th which is a full moon and the day before his due date. He was conceived on a full moon and since being pregnant, I've felt a real affinity for the moon so it seems like a lovely full circle to come.

My house is clean, I've had a pedicure and a haircut, I just finalised my will and I've paid all my bills. I'd love for him to arrive soon but I have no sense that he will!

Thanks for all the love and support everyone







:


----------



## cking

MMM, so excited for you! Very good idea paying your bills. I missed a cc payment after J was born.









We've been very busy over here lately this month. J's two top teeth started coming in, she started crawling and pulling herself up, and now taking steps while holding our hands (!). I'm pretty sure she made the sign for milk a few times, she initiated peek-a-boo for the first time and is adding a whole bunch of new consonant sounds. Wow, things are moving fast. We really have to make the house baby-friendly fast, and figure out how to put up a Christmas tree at the same time.









Sorry I have been absent. I'm reading along and checking in, just haven't had a chance to post. The teething has been pretty rough - please someone tell me that the top front teeth are worse than at least some of the others?


----------



## farmama

MMM,

it's so frustrating when parents don't act like grown ups. i say ignore them as best you can, and focus your energy where it should be: your soon-to-be-born new bean!







:

it may seem a little woo-woo, but i started talking to the lo about getting ready to be born. i asked her to get ready, and encouraged her to help mama to help her be born. i talked to her a lot during labor, and maybe it just helped me to be more focused, but my labor was awesome. just a thought, and feel free to ignore me.









Christina,

the top front teeth are worse than at least some of the others. really. after to the 1 yr molars, they were the hardest.

Shanna,

how are you holding up?


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
No baby...and no more meltdowns either. DP has been saying Dec 4th for weeks now. I'm positive she's wrong! I've always said Dec 13th which is a full moon and the day before his due date. He was conceived on a full moon and since being pregnant, I've felt a real affinity for the moon so it seems like a lovely full circle to come.

My house is clean, I've had a pedicure and a haircut, I just finalised my will and I've paid all my bills. I'd love for him to arrive soon but I have no sense that he will!

Thanks for all the love and support everyone







:

Ah, a friend of mine is due on the 13th...how cool would it be if your sons arrived on the same day? She had her meltdown the day after you, by the way.


----------



## Sihaya

Too overwhelmed by life to post, but wanted you all to know that I'm still reading along!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
The teething has been pretty rough - please someone tell me that the top front teeth are worse than at least some of the others?









I consider myself an expert







The top two were the worst until we got to the molars. I have it from other parents that the top two were the absolute worst for them









Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
Shanna,

how are you holding up?

It's still rough going, and I can't see into his mouth to see how we're doing on the last 2. But, he's at least spacing out sleepless nights, so we're getting _some_ rest. Thanks for thinking of me







I can't wait to come here and report that they're all in!!! Gotta go. Be back soon for baby watch!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
MMM,
Christina,

the top front teeth are worse than at least some of the others. really. after to the 1 yr molars, they were the hardest.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I consider myself an expert







The top two were the worst until we got to the molars. I have it from other parents that the top two were the absolute worst for them









It's still rough going, and I can't see into his mouth to see how we're doing on the last 2. But, he's at least spacing out sleepless nights, so we're getting _some_ rest. Thanks for thinking of me







I can't wait to come here and report that they're all in!!! Gotta go. Be back soon for baby watch!

THANK YOU!







: That is a huge relief. At this point I don't know how we'll see/feel in her mouth so maybe we just won't know she's working on teeth. teehee don't I wish. She just won't let us stick our fingers in her mouth anymore. Especially if she has a chunk of paper in there that she tore off a magazine.









Shanna, I didn't get to post while you were having the crisis but I hope you are done very soon.







I can totally understand the way you were feeling, if this bout of teething we've had is any preview.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Checking in! DP was clearly wrong on Dec 4th but I may also be wrong on Dec 13th. Midwife thinks Squeak will be born within the week - based mostly on his position which is perfect and very secure (ie. deeply engaged, can't even feel his head, just shoulders). I sure hope she's right because I've been put on bedrest for my stupid blood pressure which again isn't high, just a bit higher than usual for me and seems to be strangely fluctuating!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
she is happy and that makes him happy -- he is a simple man. he is completely smitten that she identifies her body parts. .


HA!!! I totaly missed this!! Not only should we get our silly moms together, and our ridiclously strong children together, now we need to get our simple, body part identifying hubies together.

Oh, and Kai just realized he can use his ability to climb on things other than playground/church nursury equipment. I found him in the middle of the kitchen table eating a cookie yesterday and he keeps getting up on the computer desk to play with the laptop and my geraniums!! ACK!!!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Checking in! DP was clearly wrong on Dec 4th but I may also be wrong on Dec 13th. Midwife thinks Squeak will be born within the week - based mostly on his position which is perfect and very secure (ie. deeply engaged, can't even feel his head, just shoulders). I sure hope she's right because I've been put on bedrest for my stupid blood pressure which again isn't high, just a bit higher than usual for me and seems to be strangely fluctuating!


Woot!! Very exciting (not the BP part)! EBVs!







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'll try to post more later, but:
Fenton has slept through the night the last 2 nights. I can't see yet if his teeth popped through, but it could be related to the fact that we have eliminiated wheat. I'm still waiting to see how this shakes out, but so far I feel like I have an entirely different child in the night. I'll try to elaborate more later.

MMM, I'm _really_ here on babywatch!


----------



## accountclosed3

i have a question about mother's helpers.

i have decided to give myself a nice retreat for the holiday season--30 days of yoga classes, but i can only do this if i have a mother's helper. a friend's daughter is going to be home for the holidays, and i'll only need her for mornings for this retreat.

so, what would be a good payment per hr (i'll need her about 2 hrs total)? i'll only need her for 25 days or so, of course, maybe 24...on account of christmas. . .anyway. advice would be nice.


----------



## PiePie

let's deal with definitions to make sure we are on the same page. here, mother's helper means someone who is in the home at the same time as you are. they tend to be young -- as young as 9, but usually more like 13. they go for 10-13 an hour, often commensurate with age. older people (out of high sch) and/or people who are home with babe without you are called babysitters and go for 20 an hour. which is related to why we have had a grand total of 2 dates since dd was born. the other huge drawback about babysitters is that they charge for a 4 hour minimum, even if you use them for less. take this tempered with the knowledge that ny is ny, but i have heard the same rates for wdc.


----------



## accountclosed3

to define it, it's sort of in-between. the person will be with me at the studio where i'm practicing--either in the next room or if she would like, wrapping and walking with him. so it's sort of a combination of both.

i talked with my friend a bit, though, and she said that the average price here for this kind of caregiving would be $7/hr. so, for the class, that would be about $11, but i figured because her round trip would be 2 hrs total, just pay her $15. i would not need her for 5 of the 30 days, which puts the price at $375 plus the cost of the yoga (i would have 4 classes/wk free, 3 would be at another studio due to scheduling needs but would require a 10 class card for $130). so, the whole of my cost would be about $500--which isn't too bad for a whole month.

but, woof! what a lot of money! but, i have some saved up and it's all tax deductable anyway. well, the yoga part is.


----------



## katt

I'm watching and waiting too!!

I've got a 2 year b-day party to plan over here! ACK!


----------



## witchygrrl

My gosh...is Teo going to be 2? For real? Where did the time go?


----------



## TinyFrog

Our first grad has a nearly two year old.









And $20/hr for a babysitter?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Wow - Teo is almost 2! Unbelievable!!!

Still here, no sign of anything. We wait.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Still here, no sign of anything. We wait.

I am just so excited for you!!!









You'll come and post when labor starts- right?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 

And $20/hr for a babysitter?
















yeah no kiddin


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 

Still here, no sign of anything. We wait.

thinking of you


----------



## farmama

MMM,








: Thinking of you...

We just got through the first year molars, and i was thinking, what a relief! Finally we'll get a good night's sleep. Yeah, and then the lower canines (are they still canines on the bottom??) started coming in.

ugh.

For $20 an hour, i couldn't afford to have someone to watch my lo. it'd be way cheaper for me to stay home. although i'm certain that cost of living around here is easily half what PiePie is paying...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Blood pressure is through the roof







On my way to the birth centre now where I'm sure I'm gonna get risked out. I'm so sad.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Blood pressure is through the roof







On my way to the birth centre now where I'm sure I'm gonna get risked out. I'm so sad.

Oh sweetie







I'm going to keep checking back, hoping you're wrong.


----------



## Maela

*MMM* Hope things have improved.














:







:


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM,*







I'm thinking of you and hoping for the best. Just remember that soon, you will hold your sweet baby in your arms!

*Babysitters/nannies:* Might depend on where you live. Going rate for nannies in my area is $12-18/hr based on experience. We pay $15.


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, thinking of you and hoping all is well...


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 

For $20 an hour, i couldn't afford to have someone to watch my lo. it'd be way cheaper for me to stay home. although i'm certain that cost of living around here is easily half what PiePie is paying...

dd is in daycare, since sept. when we had the nanny, $ was very tight.


----------



## Sihaya

When I was nannying, I made ~$7/hour before taxes. This was after I turned down a job offering $5/hour. Cost of living here is very low, but high unemployment also drives down wages in the more unregulated fields. There was very much a "you should just be happy you _have_ a job" mentality, even when my wages barely covered gas and wear & tear on my car.

MMM - Thinking of you and sending all the positive vibes I can muster.







:

In us news, I was _that mom_ this weekend when we went to a party thinking we were all getting over food poisoning, but it was actually a virus







Ended up making at least 7 other people sick


----------



## Holiztic

Oh MMM, I hate to hear that, as I know exactly what you are going through. Please take care of yourself.

Please PM me anytime if you need support or want to know what I experienced or how it went for me.

Tons of positive vibes being sent your way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thank you, thank you, thank you all. It's looking alright for now. I managed to get my BP back down while I was at the BC which was quite a feat! For now, the midwife has recommended all the induction acupuncture in the world plus whatever else we want to try. I happened to have an acupuncture appointment _and_ a massage appt (with my doula) for today anyway so I think it's meant to be. I did a little bit of acupressure on myself late last night and it gave me really intense cramps...so I stopped because I realised that I'd like to sleep for the night. But it bodes well for some success today!

If my BP peaks again like it did yesterday, then I prob won't get a second chance with the BC but I'm working on being ok with inducing in the hospital and I certainly more ok about it today than I did yesterday. I think I'll have a session of hypnotherapy or kineseology to help me get used to the idea...if I have to.

*Holiztic*, thank you for your kind offer and concern. I take very seriously what happened to you and I'm determined to learn from it. I'm sorry that your horrible experience had to happen but I am grateful for the cautionary tale.


----------



## snozzberry

*MMM*







: !!!

*Solid foods:* Abby turns 10 months old next week, and we're still just giving her one solid food a day, if that. Is that bad?


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*MMM*







: !!!

*Solid foods:* Abby turns 10 months old next week, and we're still just giving her one solid food a day, if that. Is that bad?

Not bad at all. Quinn was there at about 9 months. By 10 he was eating more often, but very little volume. At 10 months he might have been eating a tablespoon a day.

I have also found that at that age they do better with liquids anyway. I really liked the idea of Quinn holding and chowing down on a pear or steamed carrot (self-feeding), but I really think they don't digest it at that age. They can't do much chewing, and then the food comes out the way it went in. So we ended up favoring good quality (homemade or farm-made) yogurt, bone broths, and really finely minced fermented veggies (Rejuvantive Foods Vegi-Delite Zing Salad). This is just our experience/opinion and might not reflect Abby or others' babes.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*MMM*







: !!!

*Solid foods:* Abby turns 10 months old next week, and we're still just giving her one solid food a day, if that. Is that bad?

not at all. we did every other day from 6-9 mos., once a day from 9-12 mos., and then a huge jump to 4 times a day at 12 mos. still not up to the recommended 5 times a day because she nurses all night long and thus is not interested in (other) breakfast.

she's got walking pneumonia, i have a cold (perhaps something worse), and dh is oot.


----------



## witchygrrl

*PiePie*, sounds absolutely miserable









So one baby I've been waiting for, besides MMM's, has been born. She was scheduled to be born on Monday (via planned c-sec--mom has massive fibro and other issues), but mom went into labor on Saturday. I can't wait to meet her--she's basically my niece









Now I'm waiting for the other, the one due the same day as MMM...so far, all has been quiet.








:







:


----------



## cking

MMM, I'm relieved for you that things are better. I hope they stay better.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*MMM*







: !!!

*Solid foods:* Abby turns 10 months old next week, and we're still just giving her one solid food a day, if that. Is that bad?

I don't think so. Breastmilk is still her primary food up to a year and a lot of people don't even introduce solids until 12 months.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Not bad at all. Quinn was there at about 9 months. By 10 he was eating more often, but very little volume. At 10 months he might have been eating a tablespoon a day.

I have also found that at that age they do better with liquids anyway. I really liked the idea of Quinn holding and chowing down on a pear or steamed carrot (self-feeding), but I really think they don't digest it at that age. They can't do much chewing, and then the food comes out the way it went in. So we ended up favoring good quality (homemade or farm-made) yogurt, bone broths, and really finely minced fermented veggies (Rejuvantive Foods Vegi-Delite Zing Salad). This is just our experience/opinion and might not reflect Abby or others' babes.

On a related note, even though J is only eating a tiny bit of food, her poops are changing. And even though, like you said, they come out whole, it's still changed the rest of it. yuck.

Anyway, I will have to look for some fermented veggies - I like that idea. And I don't really have time to make my own right now.







Holiztic, how to you serve liquids? I've given J some yogurt, and I just hand her the spoon and she goes to town. But for broths - do you give them in a cup? J seems more interested in food, but has an easier time if it's the right texture or shape.

I had a weird couple of days. I need to vent about them to you lovely ladies, who I know will understand.

On Friday Josephine fell off the bed. Crawled right off. I knew it was coming I felt awful, but mostly really stupid. She cried for 5 minutes, then was fine. I was more upset. But of course that meant that something needed to change for naptime. DH was stubborn about changing our bed/crib situation, I was really pissed and for a few days I tried to put her in the packnplay for naps, but she kept waking up, and I was totally fried. Last night we finally talked about it and took our futon apart and put the mattress on the floor. So far it's working well. But I really was freaking out for a few days - it was making me doubt all of my mothering principles. She still nurses to sleep every time, and I really don't want to change that right now.

That's all I have time to type right now- be back later.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: Still here. Still pregnant. I'm not holding my breath about the natural induction attempts working. In fact, I wish I hadn't listened to everyone, including the midwives, who said he'll be early. Fingers crossed I can keep my blood pressure down. I have a sense that if I can manage that, then we're gonna be here for a good while longer.

My mum is here at the moment. She's really very helpful and tries so hard not to interfere (and mostly succeeds) but I'm just not really up for having people around. I'm not sure it's worth the cleanest oven you've ever seen!

Poor Mummy Christina - glad Josephine is ok. These things are always so traumatic for the parent, rarely for the bub!


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, you should send your cleaner, i mean mother, this way!

*christina*, these things happen. most cosleeping mamas in this tribe have had it happen. dd rolled off the bed at 10 days old! the middle of the king-sized bed! you shoulda heard that head clunk. i thought i was gonna kill dh. then it happened to me. now she gets her hands down in time, so she falls on all 4s. we have a mattress on the floor surrounded by pillows. lots of pillows....


----------



## snozzberry

*PiePie,* that sounds so horrible! I hope you all recover fast and/or your DH comes back soon.

*MMM,*







Just remember you will have your whole mothering life ahead of you before you know it.









*Christina,*







I'm so glad J is okay.

Maybe you remember this, but Abby fell off the bed around that age too. So I know _exactly_ how you feel. Even after it happened, it took us *too* long to actually make changes to her naptime routine because we couldn't decide what to do.







At least she didn't fall off again before we moved her to the floor for her naps...









Thanks for the *solids* advice, everyone! I feel so much better now. Whew!


----------



## witchygrrl

I'm glad J is okay, too, Christina







. Now that Rhea is really starting to roll around more, I've been worrying about this myself.

She's been making friends with our kitty. Serena, who has been a real trooper as Rhea learns how to "pet" her, which currently involves her grabbing fistfuls of fur. No threats of scratches or bites yet...for Serena, this is huge.


----------



## arelyn

MMM: Babywatching and praying things will go well for you!!

The Bed: Kai has fallen off the bed a few of times. As soon as he became mobile we started playing on teh ed. When he would go for the edge I'd turn him aorund and help him slide off the bed and tell him "Go feet first!" After a while I'd just have to say "Go feet first!" and he'd turn himself. Now he's a pro at safely dismounting the bed.

Solids: You know, I think breastmilk is still Kai's main food. He eats 2-4 solid meals a day but not very much in quantity. Not like the kids at daycare did but he's growing fine. Short and skinny but so are we and he's hitting all the milestones ahead of schedule so I'm not worried. Now if I served pancakes, raisins, and milk tea for every meal he'd proably eat more solids but no, I'm a mean Mommy who serves him the same food we're eating.


----------



## PiePie

baby is getting better but i feel worse


----------



## snozzberry

Oh, poor PiePie!

What do y'all do about vitamin D? Thinking about getting some drops for Abby after reading that the AAP is recommending 800 a day.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

What do y'all do about vitamin D? Thinking about getting some drops for Abby after reading that the AAP is recommending 800 a day.

We did plenty of time outside in warm weather, and I did (and do) high vitamin cod liver oil/butter oil capsules that Quinn got via nursing. Keep in mind *I* was only getting 500 IU from that last winter when Q was almost exclusively nursing, so he must have been getting much less. I was eating a good bit of raw dairy, but not tons. I doubt he was getting 800 IU last winter! Looking back I should have been taking more than 1 capsule a day. I am now.

We started him on the CLO/BO (squeezed out of the capsule, of course) around 15 months. If it had been winter, we'd have started him at 12 months.

I just looked at the symptoms of rickets in babies/children just out of curiosity and Quinn could quite literally be the poster child for NOT rickets (if that made any sense). I credit a nourishing traditional diet.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Oh, poor PiePie!

What do y'all do about vitamin D? Thinking about getting some drops for Abby after reading that the AAP is recommending 800 a day.

We do Cod liver oil as well, per Weston A Price recommendations. We're going to witch to the fermented CLO when my current stash runs out.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Oh, poor PiePie!

What do y'all do about vitamin D? Thinking about getting some drops for Abby after reading that the AAP is recommending 800 a day.


we did drops from 5-6 mos. meant to start in at 4 mos. but went out of town for christmas, etc. ped said not necessary after 6 mos. i also did some hat off time outside, but not daily, and not long enough. i think the rec is an hour a day without hat or 10 minutes a day in the buff.


----------



## Holiztic

So we're about to leave Quinn for the first time at night (not all night, just until around 10-10:30). He has never ever gone to sleep without me, or been without me after dark. I have no idea how he'll handle it. He'll be at our house with his favorite Grandma, so it should be okay. I think he might just stay up (he rarely is up past 9). Wish us luck!


----------



## cking

THanks for all the support mamas. It's nice to be able to turn to you all since I know family and mainstream friends would probably tsk tsk if we told them.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
The Bed: Kai has fallen off the bed a few of times. As soon as he became mobile we started playing on teh ed. When he would go for the edge I'd turn him aorund and help him slide off the bed and tell him "Go feet first!" After a while I'd just have to say "Go feet first!" and he'd turn himself. Now he's a pro at safely dismounting the bed.


I want to do this. I have started doing it for the futon mattress and I think she's catching on - even though it can't be 6" high - but this is one of the things DH and I argue about. Our bed frame is high and we only got it 1.5 years ago, so DH doesn't want to take it down. But it has side rails, so it wouldn't work for her climbing down.







So we'll do all our playing on the futon for now.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
So we're about to leave Quinn for the first time at night (not all night, just until around 10-10:30). He has never ever gone to sleep without me, or been without me after dark. I have no idea how he'll handle it. He'll be at our house with his favorite Grandma, so it should be okay. I think he might just stay up (he rarely is up past 9). Wish us luck!

This just happened to us last week. Friends (who have kids!) where having an adults-only party, so we left her with MIL. We only stayed at the party two hours, but she was asleep when we got back! We could have stayed another hour or two. I was nervous because she never goes to sleep without me (except in the car) - not even for DH. Go figure. Good luck!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: It's my due date and I've found some zen...at least for the moment. No more listening to the predictions, dreams and premonitions from people who think they know. No more believing midwives who say 'within the week.'

My BP is fine and there's no immediate threat of hospital transfer or induction so I'm really focusing on giving Squeak the time he needs to join us.

If only the phone calls would stop. Honestly, do you think I wouldn't tell my own mother/father/close friend that the babe had been born?


----------



## PiePie

*liz*, did you enjoy yourself? and how was q?


----------



## witchygrrl

What a weekend--we were included in the 1.25 million that lost power from a major ice storm. Seems we were some of the first to get power back. Thankfully we had friends with room to spare, even for the cat!

Now we get to face the fridge and freezer


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*liz*, did you enjoy yourself? and how was q?

He was really confused when we got our coats on and started saying goodbye. He started to cry but stopped as soon as MIL engaged him in an activity. They were totally fine playing and reading from 6:15-9:15. At 9:15 he started crying "boobie", so she called us and we left (made it through cocktail hour, and all of dinner, even grabbed a bite or two of dessert!). Turns out he only cried for a couple minutes and then went back to playing. He was still wide awake when we got home at 10 and after excitedly yelling "Mommy, Daddy" he pretty much ignored us and kept on playing with MIL for 10 minutes until I mentioned the B word, then he nursed to sleep at 10:30. That's the latest he's been awake in months.

Then today we took him (sans nap) into DC (45 minutes away) for a holiday show (singing/dancing/pageantry) and he actually sat in my lap quietly watching for over an hour!!!

He fell asleep in the car (5 pm) and that was bedtime, as he is still asleep now (in bed). Going to have to change his diaper at some point!

MMM--what a great mindset to enter labor, if I'd been able to do that I might have avoided the PP Stress/Anxiety. You're doing great and Squeak is lucky to have you!!!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
MMM--what a great mindset to enter labor, if I'd been able to do that I might have avoided the PP Stress/Anxiety. You're doing great and Squeak is lucky to have you!!!

MMM: I was thinking something along those lines but Liz said it so much better! Maybe you should put DP on phone duty when she's home. Phone calls really stressed me out too (and Kai came early so I can't even imgine how annoyed you are by now).

And Liz, I'm glad Quinn did so well!


----------



## Maela

I am SO tired of not knowing when or if Dd is going to take a nap each day. She will start her nap any time between 11-4PM or not even take a nap at all. It wouldn't be so bad if I knew at the beginning of the day what was going to happen. It doesn't matter what time she wakes up. It doesn't matter what time she went to sleep the night before. Today there has been no nap. But just because there is no nap, doesn't mean that she's going to bed early. She likes to make it a surprise every day. She never goes to bed/takes a nap at the same time more than two days in a row.







: It's REALLY frustrating. I just need some kind of sleep routine, or I'm going to go crazy!
I know this is a normal part of parenting (when you don't sleep train), but I'm really having a hard time with it today.







I could have worse problems, I know. But I NEED that break in the middle of the day, and it really helps when I can expect it to be at a certain time. Dh's birthday is on Wed and I was going to wrap his gifts and write him a nice letter today during her nap. Hopefully, I can find time to do this tomorrow.

Usually on a day like this I would give Dd to Dh when he got home from work and take an hour out for myself at the book store or something, but Dh is sick.

Sorry, just needed to vent.







:
_This too shall pass._


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, as usual our LOs are in a similar phase. DD delayed her nap yesterday by 2 hours! and then made it an extra long (3 hour) nap, followed by an hour late to bed. i can roll with the naps but was beside myself over the bedtime. today she was down only 10 minutes late at sch. of course, imo, she routinely gets deprived of 30 minutes of sleep at sch







: but such is group care. i am







: that they didn't take the kids outside today. tomorrow is going to suck so hard: dh is leaving very early, i have to do a super early daycare dropoff and get to a clinic way in the middle of nowhere as the trade for getting someone to cover my clinic when i had parent-teacher conference. i hate mornings.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I know this is a normal part of parenting (when you don't sleep train), but I'm really having a hard time with it today.










Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
but was beside myself over the bedtime.

Sending my utmost sympathy and hugs. We're not having this particular problem, but others (the screaching....Oh, the screaching!) that are making me nuts.

I'm here on baby watch! Oh, and to say: I made budget this month!!!!!







:


----------



## Maela

Thanks for the sympathy. It's 8:30PM here and she's still awake!







So she has been awake since 7:00AM! 13.5 hours with no nap. I think she would be asleep by now if she wasn't sick. Her nose is stuffed (no matter how much I try to suction the stuff out) and she can't nurse for long. Don't know how she's going to fall asleep w/out nursing. Usually when she's stuffed a good suctioning works just fine, but not this time.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Back on the BP/induction train. I can totally see how women are pressured into making choices that aren't right for them or their baby despite their best intentions. I'm really feeling it but until I can see evidence that my stubbornness is hurting me or Squeak, I will not be bullied. Even if the birth centre risks me out, it's going to take a lot for me to let them induce me. Thank the stars for my awesome partner and my amazing doula who are holding me together right now.


----------



## Maela

Good for you MMM!







I'm sorry you're having to go through this though.

So Dd ended up going to bed at 9:20PM last night. She was up for 14 hours! Crazy. I was rocking her in the glider like usual, but she was having a hard time nursing because of her nose. Then she just stopped trying and laid her head on my breast and fell asleep. It was really sweet. She must have been so exhausted.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, stay strong mama(2b)

*maela*, dd can blow her nose, works much better than suctioning


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, my good friend is feeling the pressure a bit too...she was due the same day as you, but no baby yet! Stay strong!!

Rhea's hard gums make my nipples hurt again! Ugh


----------



## farmama

mmm,

blessings!







:

maela,

same boat here. dd just doesn't work with a schedule, even if i try to quiet her down to get her to sleep earlier. only when she's worn herself out thoroughly will she give in...and who knows when that will be


----------



## Maela

I'll have to try teaching her how to blow her nose. That seems like it would be much less traumatic.










So today was totally the opposite.







She slept in until 8PM, took a nap from 12:45-2:30, and then went to bed at 8:45PM. I don't understand it; I'll just be happy.


----------



## farmama

i need to x-post, but any thoughts on discouraging the top-of-the-lungs piercing screaming that my lo has taken to lately?

i've tried ignoring, offering a "safe" place that she can do all her screaming, calmly explaining that it really upsets me, and sternly telling her that she needs to stop it. anyone?? Bueller?


----------



## Maela

Farmama, sorry no advice. Dd doesn't scream much, unless she's really excited and then it doesn't last long.
Hopefully, someone else has some ideas.

This is a cute thread...


----------



## AsYouWish

:

















:








:


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
i need to x-post, but any thoughts on discouraging the top-of-the-lungs piercing screaming that my lo has taken to lately?

i've tried ignoring, offering a "safe" place that she can do all her screaming, calmly explaining that it really upsets me, and sternly telling her that she needs to stop it. anyone?? Bueller?

dd's teachers say "no screaming" and she screams louder!

dh says hoo hoo hoo in a very low but loud voice, hoping she will copy. it has worked once.

i try to figure out what she wants and either give it to her or explain why she can't have it now (usually the thing is that she has to wait, something she is not at all good at).


----------



## snozzberry

We fly out tomorrow at 7:30 am to go to MIL for xmas. Eek! Never taken Abby on a plane before. Also never BF in public before, so plane will be a 1st.

Still not packed so gotta run but had to say...

*MMM,* I'm thinking of you!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
We fly out tomorrow at 7:30 am to go to MIL for xmas. Eek! Never taken Abby on a plane before. Also never BF in public before, so plane will be a 1st.

Still not packed so gotta run but had to say...

*MMM,* I'm thinking of you!











you've never NIP?!?!?! Wow! How have you managed that? I think our first was when Quinn was a week old, and by 10 months we'd done it hundreds of times. This is not any form of judgment in the least, just amazement!!

Flight will be fine! Quinn's first was at 13 months, he nursed on the way up and slept most of the way, then nursed on the way down. If she's doing any finger foods at all, have those. Raisins helped on the way home when he was awake. We also brought a few "toys" (not official toys per se, just fun things) for him to hold/look at. You'll be fine!


----------



## PiePie

*kelly*, flying with a baby is easy. all you need is the sling and your boobs.














after they start walking it pretty much sucks.







on our latest flight, the bigggest help was lift-the-flap books, e..g, where's spot? or where's maisy?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Still here though with much more patience than previously. I've had a hell of a 24hours -

I was risked out of the birth centre by the consulting obstetrician yesterday morning. Just before I left she decided to do an internal where she discovered I was 6cm dilated and 100% effaced. Her conclusion was that I was in labour. She decided that I could go back to the birth centre straight away and they could break my water. Of course, it's against bc policy to intervene in any way, including breaking water. They, however, were happy to let me labour naturally there..YAY! I was back in.

I still wasn't convinced I was actually in labour but foetal monitoring showed that i was having contractions 2 mins apart, I just wasn't feeling them! Everyone was in awe. I was feeling very fortunate.

I called my doula and explained the situation and she came up to the BC for a few hours. Nothing was happening and I was bouncing around happily, still with minimal pain so we decided it would be fine to let her go off to her daughters Christmas concert. By 9.30 last night, still nothing was happening so we asked to come home. The consulting obstetrician said no - that if we left now, there was no coming back to the BC. So, against better judgement, we stayed the night and had a fairly peaceful nights sleep.

When we woke up this morning, I had still not really progressed so it made sense to come home and wait for my water to break. It all seemed very uncontroversial and one ob agreed to let us home. The most superior ob however, not only said I couldn't come home but that I had to be admitted immediately to the HOSPITAL for induction. This despite perfect blood pressure and endless perfect results from monitoring. I got very scared and very shaky. I felt bruised and blackmailed and bullied.

Anyway, after lots of tears and long conversations with our doula and the BC midwives, we made the decision to 'act against medical advice' and come home. The BC midwives were wonderful and have committed to do all they can to keep me with them when I do go into natural labour. They'll prob have to lie to keep me in there which makes me feel pretty lucky.

I feel completely traumatised but I'm also thrilled to be home and thrilled to have yet another opportunity to birth naturally. Even if I do end up getting thrown out of the BC, I will have more chance to birth naturally in hospital than I was being given today! I cannot believe that despite all my knowledge and preparation, I have been trapped in the web of intervention. Sure, thus far I've avoided it but I had to fight every.step.of.the.way. I can't imagine how it is for women who haven't had the opportunity to learn as much as me.

So, I'm actually hoping this boy stays in for a day or 2 longer because I need the time to recover and find some strength. And next time, I am having a homebirth, NO QUESTION!!!

Must go and have a nap. I'm completely drained and it'd be awful to actually go into real labour feeling like this.


----------



## Maela

MMM,





















And WOW 6cm 100% effaced?! Did I read that correctly?? I'm glad everything is going well for you, but I'm sorry you had to fight so much. I'll be thinking about you!!!


----------



## Maela

Oh, and another NO NAP day here. I was in a great, patient mood today though (I think it was the LLL meeting that helped), so it was fine. She conked out at 8PM exactly.









ETA: I'm very afraid that I am going to be pregnant with a 2yo that does not nap at all.


----------



## arelyn

MMM: I have to say, your BC midwives sound awsome!! And I really admire how well you seem to have handled all that. I would be in too much of a state to type about it! You are going to do wonderfully!!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
i need to x-post, but any thoughts on discouraging the top-of-the-lungs piercing screaming that my lo has taken to lately?

i've tried ignoring, offering a "safe" place that she can do all her screaming, calmly explaining that it really upsets me, and sternly telling her that she needs to stop it. anyone?? Bueller?

Kai only did that scream when he needed help with something. Even something ridiculously silly, like I threw the ball and want you to throw it back, or the pages in this book are sticking together. I taught him the "help" sign, not really expecting much (it seems like such an abstract concept for a littel guy) and was shocked when he picked it up super fast and now only screams if I'm not looking at him and don't see his frantic signing. But screaming because she likes the sound. That's a whole different kettle of fish! I remember kids at daycare that did that but I don't remember how I dealt with it.


----------



## cking

MMM -







Stay Strong!







:

Kelly, I think you'll do fine. J usually refuses to NIP, but she did alright on the plane. I think she was a little startled by the engine noise during takeoff, so she didn't really hesitate to nurse. Have a good trip!


----------



## ~Shanna~

MMM, you are one. tough. lady. I'm thinking of you constantly, wondering how things are going. Your BC sounds amazing, I have images of your MW chaining themselves to the door of the BC









Your faith in humanity will be in my prayers. The doctors don't know better, so they can't do better. I'm inspired by your strength, and exuberant over all you've managed so far







:.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
We fly out tomorrow at 7:30 am to go to MIL for xmas. Eek! Never taken Abby on a plane before. Also never BF in public before, so plane will be a 1st.

Good luck Kelly! It should be no problem - you probably don't have to see what you're doing as much as you did in the early days. And you'll be surprised how much privacy you have, if you want it, especially if you don't take an aisle seat. Have a wonderful trip - Fenton did great on a plane a year ago. As Pie Pie said, you couldn't pay me to try it with him now!


----------



## witchygrrl

MMM, what a long strange trip you are having. Kudos for sticking to your proverbial guns, and thank goddess for the BC and midwives you have.

I'm keeping my







: for you.


----------



## PiePie

*Mujerista*, Yes it is a fight, but you have proven that you are a fighter!


----------



## Maela

Oh, re: screaming, I think *Arelyn* is right on with teaching the sign for "help." That may be why Dd doesn't scream much. She signs help and uses it a lot.


----------



## AsYouWish

Hello Mamas!

I want you all to know that I have lurked this thread from the beginning. You all moved on from the NMY thread, and I ended up mostly lurking that one too while DP and I put TTC out of our heads pretty much, to be reevaluated in January 2011. I never even bothered to update my info in the NMY threads to reflect this. For various financial and professional reasons, I was resigned to not starting a family for a few more years. It is because I have lurked so much that I feel like I "know" you all so well, although I'm sure you don't feel the same. But I hope you don't mind that I share with you a little about my life lately. I need the support of mama-friends now more than ever.

On December 1st, my mom died.







: Her long journey with early stage Alzheimer's Disease was finally at an end. Even though my mother had been sick for so long, her death still came as a shock. None of my family was expecting it; we all honestly thought -- based on what we knew of the typical progression of Alzheimer's -- that we would have her for at least another couple of years. I can't detail right now about the last months, and how things ended, because it is just too horrific. I am glad she is no longer suffering, but I am left without my mother.







Needless to say, I still feel as though I will never stop crying.









Yesterday, December 19th, I got a BFP.














This, from a single, sleepless, uncharted, unplanned, low-odds, grief-stricken, emotion-led, reason-absent night during the time of the wake and funeral. Needless to say, I still feel as though I will never stop crying.







:

I hope you don't mind if I join you.







: Like I said, I need the support of mama-friends now more than ever.


----------



## Maela

*AsYouWish*, Yes I remember you!









Wow, what a rollercoaster you've been on this month.







I'm so sorry to hear about your mom. We are going through something similar with Dh's grandfather (Alzheimers - it's getting really bad and now his health is deteriorating too). It's really sad, but I can't imagine how much harder it would be if it was my mother.















Congratulations on your BFP!














: I don't know your exact situation, but I bet you can make this work in your life. I'm so excited for you!








, Congratulations! and We're here for you!!


----------



## Sihaya

*AsYouWish* -







and Congratulations! I was wondering who would show up pg next. We can't very well not have any pg NMYs!







Now I'm just wondering who will get pg in March to give us our _fourth_ December baby - it's a tradition, after all









*MMM* - Thinking of you







:


----------



## witchygrrl

*AsYouWish*, I remember you too. Losing a mom is a tough thing, no matter when and how it happens. I know that pain very well, so a big







from me. But as my ILs say (and I'm inclined to agree) that no matter how ill-timed they may seem, babies ARE a blessing. Congratulations!


----------



## arelyn

AsYouWish: I was trying to think of something so say but I'm at a total loss for words. Just know that were here for you!!


----------



## cking

AsYouWish -







Ditto to what others have said. Please do join us - this is a great group of ladies who are very supportive.


----------



## katt

AsYouWish - It is very good to see you back. I mostly lurk, but rest assured you are in my thoughts.


----------



## accountclosed3

lurking and on babywatch.

my friends had their baby girl a week ago. . .a week late and with an induction, back labor, but vaginal and they're happy with the birth. the little girl is adorable. they had some trouble with nursing (similar to us), and so iw as hanging out and encouraging, gave them our whole milk bank (because they were going to sup with formula and were too afraid to ask for milk) but now she's pumping and feeding and when her nipples feel better, wants to try bfing again. she's also supplementing with formula because hawk will not allow me to pump. he feraks! and freaked a bit when he saw the milk go from my breast to bottle to jamie's mouth while i was hanging out there! he was like "what? that's mine! where are you taking that?" so now, when i try to pump while he eats, he wiggles so much i can't hold him and pump. so, the milk bank will have to wait, i guess.

and, thank goodness, both my mohter and mil have figured out to ask about christmas stuff. my MIL wants to get him things that her friends are getting their grandchildren, but it's not stuff that we want or would use. she's disappointed, but she asked first, thank goodness.


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* i had great difficulty buidling up my stash when dd was h's age because of what you are describing. the only time that worked was when she napped. of course half the time i would get all hooked up and she would wake.


----------



## PiePie

what's up with me is that i am going to try to make tomorrow my last day of pumping at work. very sad about it. love devoting time in my work day to her. not sure if i should replace that with family organizing time (needs to happen more than it has been) or getting work done so i don't stress at home time. maybe half an hour of family organizing time each day would be good. ah, exercise, there's a possibility. i am such a stress cadet these days it would be good to exercise.

also, not going to try nightweaning. i had always expected to move baby from the family bed when baby became a toddler but the truth is i love her there. know that my supply can't take the hit of quitting pumping and night-nursing.


----------



## Maela

PiePie we are not nightweaning either right now. My plan was to do it in the summer after she turned one. Then my plan was to do it over Christmas break (when dh doesn't need sleep for teaching), and now I still feel like it's not the right time. I hope I don't regret this decision in the next couple of months. Especially if I get pg soon. But I have a feeling that it's going to be at least April before I am pg again. Actually April would be perfect.









Maybe we'll nightwean over spring break... or this coming summer...


----------



## PiePie

because of dh's work schedule, it was either now or may. guess it will be may. i don't have af yet so pregnancy is not a real possibility at the moment.


----------



## PiePie

which was actually a motivation in dh's mind for nightweaning. still, i think if we nightwean in may then i just be back by july, right? who knows, really, i just like to obsess about that unknowable future


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: Sebastian Felix was welcomed into the world, _*without intervention*_, at 12.05am on Sunday 21st December.







:

Just under 8 hours of labour with 3 and a bit hours of pushing. My contractions started at 2mins apart, 1minute long so it was a pretty huge shock but with the amazing support of DP and our doula, I did it.

He's huge. 4.3kg (about 9pounds 5ounces) and 56cm long (22inches). He doesn't even fit his newborn clothes or nappies.

We stayed at the BC until this morning and are now just settling in at home.

More later. Must sleep while babe sleeps!


----------



## ~Shanna~

WELCOME SEBASTIAN FELIX!!!!!!!!!!







:







:







:







:

Fenton and DH throwing up, so I can't stay and bask. But: MMM CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Maela

:














:








CONGRATULATIONS MMM!!!!
WELCOME TO THE WORLD SEBASTIAN FELIX!!!!














:














:


----------



## witchygrrl

:*Congratulations to MMM and her DP!
Welcome Sebastian Felix!!!!!!!!!!!*







:

A solstice baby, too--very cool























:







:


----------



## PiePie

*







:







:








:







:







:







: HIP HIP HOORAY!!







:








:







:







:







:







:






















SEBASTIAN FELIX





















*


----------



## PiePie

DH has been super sick for 6 days now.


----------



## PiePie

*Mujerista*, You and I have the same taste in names. Love Sebastianm, the name and the little person! He's got a place to visit in Manhattan as soon as he's ready for the Big Apple!!


----------



## PiePie

although DD has only 4 teeth fully in, and a 5th cut, we seem to be having some molar action -- it's swollen, she's rubbing it, and actually cried last night quite a bit. can folks talk to me about the order in which their kids teethed??


----------



## arelyn

:







:Welcome Sebastian!!!







:







:








Congratulations on getting the birth you worked so hard for!!!


----------



## Sihaya

*







:Congrats MMM & DP!!!







:








:Welcome Sebastian Felix!







:*

Both of those names were on our boy's name list.







Sounds like a fantastic birth - I'm so glad it turned out well.









*PiePie*, re:teething order - Calvin got bottom middle two, top middle two, next two on bottom, next two on top, and has recently seemed to be working on bottom molars _and_ bottom eye teeth, but nothing's broken through yet AFAIK.

ETA: Calvin's first birthday is today. We aren't doing much for it, besides two things I stole from Shanna - blowing up the birth pool to take a family picture in it and having a candlelit solstice. We do a party on his half-birthday and we don't really do gifts, which we'll reevaluate as he gets older.


----------



## cking

elcome Sebastian Felix!!!!







:







: Congratulations MMM & DP!







:

Oh, I'm so excited for you. So glad you got to birth without intervention.


----------



## cking

: Calvin!







:

It sounds like you have a nice, quiet celebration planned.


----------



## farmama

Congratulations MMM & DP!!!








: Welcome Sebastian!!!







:

i've been checking in frequently and am soooo happy that you got your BC wishes!

Rest well.


----------



## farmama

As You Wish,

what a ride you are on. My condolences and congratulations. How overwhelming it must be--both at the end and beginning of the circle of life. Remember to give yourself the space you need to deal with all your emotions, and know that it's okay to be happy and sad at the same time.

blessings.


----------



## TinyFrog

CONGRATULATIONS MMM!!

WELCOME SEBASTIAN!!!








:







:







:







:







:


----------



## TinyFrog

HAPPY BIRTHDAY CALVIN!!!








:














:


----------



## TinyFrog

I am sorry to hear about the loss of your mother AsYouWish.









Congrats on the BFP.







:


----------



## accountclosed2

Congratulations MMM!

I've been lurking lately, but I have been checking here for any news. So glad you got the birth you wanted. So exciting!


----------



## AsYouWish

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*AsYouWish*, Yes I remember you!









Wow, what a rollercoaster you've been on this month.







I'm so sorry to hear about your mom. We are going through something similar with Dh's grandfather (Alzheimers - it's getting really bad and now his health is deteriorating too). It's really sad, but I can't imagine how much harder it would be if it was my mother.















Congratulations on your BFP!














: I don't know your exact situation, but I bet you can make this work in your life. I'm so excited for you!








, Congratulations! and We're here for you!!

Thank you so much! We are excited too. And a little scared, but fairly confident (well, most of the time) we can work things out.







: Thank you for the welcome!







:

I'm so sorry to hear about your DH's grandfather.







It's hard.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*AsYouWish* -







and Congratulations! I was wondering who would show up pg next. We can't very well not have any pg NMYs!







Now I'm just wondering who will get pg in March to give us our _fourth_ December baby - it's a tradition, after all









Thank you very much! I am happy to be here.







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
*AsYouWish*, I remember you too. Losing a mom is a tough thing, no matter when and how it happens. I know that pain very well, so a big







from me. But as my ILs say (and I'm inclined to agree) that no matter how ill-timed they may seem, babies ARE a blessing. Congratulations!

Thank you!! I feel more than blessed right now. I already know I wouldn't change a thing, despite the fact that it didn't go according to The Plan and I'm an emotional wreck right now.







In a woo-new age-spiritual way (that is very foreign to me because I'm an atheist!), I feel with this pregnancy and the person that will be born that I still have a little bit of my mom with me.







:

I'm so sorry that you know what it feels like to lose your mom, too.







:







I hope your little one makes you feel more connected to her.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
AsYouWish: I was trying to think of something so say but I'm at a total loss for words. Just know that were here for you!!









Thank you. Thank you so much!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
AsYouWish -







Ditto to what others have said. Please do join us - this is a great group of ladies who are very supportive.









Thanks so much! I really appreciate it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
AsYouWish - It is very good to see you back. I mostly lurk, but rest assured you are in my thoughts.

Thank you so much, katt!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
As You Wish,

what a ride you are on. My condolences and congratulations. How overwhelming it must be--both at the end and beginning of the circle of life. Remember to give yourself the space you need to deal with all your emotions, and know that it's okay to be happy and sad at the same time.

blessings.

Thank you so very much! Yeah, happy and sad in the same moment, that is where I am.







/







I'm going to be making an appointment with my counselor after the new year. I need a little guidance through both of these processes. *sigh* In the meantime, the warm welcome here really helps!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 
I am sorry to hear about the loss of your mother AsYouWish.









Congrats on the BFP.







:

Thank you for the sympathies and the well wishes. I appreciate it!


----------



## AsYouWish

HAPPY BIRTHDAY
CALVIN!!!








:







:







:







:


----------



## AsYouWish

: Welcome to the world, Sebastian!!!!







:









Congratulations MMM & DP!!!!







:







:







:


----------



## witchygrrl

Happy Birthday Calvin!

My friend had her baby yesterday, too! Babies all around!


----------



## Maela

HAPPY BIRTHDAY CALVIN!!!!


----------



## katt

All these birthdays!!

Welcome Sebastian, great name!
Happy 1st Calvin.

my friend had her baby last week too!


----------



## PiePie

merry christmas to one and all!!








: i am staring at dd's first tree (last year we were away) and feeling all mushy.

saw billy elliot last night and bawled throughout -- i am a big mush -- was pre-baby but now anything to do with children and parents







hope i can give dd unconditional love. i love her so much and i hope she always knows that.

her big present (a slide) is arriving late -- never order from big toy express!! -- but i think it will be good to have new toys introduced slowly.


----------



## PiePie

p.s. i too had another friend give birth last weekend!! what was it with the solstice? she went early.


----------



## katt

Merry Christmas All!

we spent x-mas eve with the ils. Teo got to open a few gifts. He stopped after 3 and was done opening, even though he had more. Not to seem ungrateful, and I did LOTS of smiling 'cause well, Teo was having a good time, but the gifts he's gotten from is grandparents so far are a bit too young for him. I'm sure I'll be back to post more later, but so far he's having fun.


----------



## Maela

Merry Christmas!

Dd is having so much fun playing with all of her cousins (most of them are Dh's cousins' kids - does that make them second cousins?







)! Dh's family are mostly teachers and so do not have to work for a week before x-mas and therefore they all come up early and we have dinner with them almost every night for like 5 days before x-mas. It's fun and dd's loving it!

This sounds so materialistic of me, but I'm really excited about the new clothes that Dd is going to get from the relatives today. She doesn't have a lot right now in her current size. She could use more than the three pairs of pants she has now.

hope everyone's holidays are going well!!


----------



## Holiztic

Merry Christmas!!!

We were at MIL's house until after 9:30 last night. Q skipped his nap and was happy and very well-mannered (with lots of people and noise!) until 9 when he just asked for boobie and went right to sleep in MIL's bedroom. We left at 10 when he woke up, he slept in the car and went right back to sleep (nursing) when we got home.

We were up until 1 putting together his play kitchen, wrapping, listening to music, etc.

At 7:30 Quinn woke up and had Daddy carry him out to the living room (usual weekend routine) and he didn't notice the kitchen at first. When he did he went to it, touched it, then walked away







But 2 minutes later he was cooking and having a blast.

We totally succeeded so far in keeping things low-key in terms of gift receiving/opening. Over an hour, he saw/played with his kitchen (with existing toys, nothing new yet), pulled out the (unwrapped) food items and 1 board book in his stocking, then at the end of the hour (after much eating of dried cranberries and bananas!) he opened his little sigg water bottle.

Super low key, but lots of fun and smiles!

Grandma comes around 11, low-key will be blown out of the water (but at least super natural/waldorf stuff, just way too much!)

Enjoy everyone!!!!!!


----------



## PiePie

we had an awesome christmas. like you, liz, dh and i were up late decorating the tree. the tree was a hit but the real star of the day was http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0014I90UI/...l_159jfu2fvt_b.







: there is a an optional key to the ball runs and dd actually can do it! she was so excited yesterday she was up past midnight. today we went to a dan zanes concert.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

HI folks. Thanks for all the love and congrats. This parenting thing is a trip. I cannot believe that we've been entrusted with the life of this amazing little creature. I feel so privileged.

It's going really well so far. The fog has started to lift and I'm finally able to leave the couch for small periods of time. Those first few days, you do well to just tread water, don't you? I can't believe that some of you were able to be giving updates online.

So far, Sebastian is a very chilled baby. He rarely cries and is really happy to be loved and cuddled by rooms full of strangers. Unless he's hungry, DP is just as able to comfort him as I and he hasn't thrown any serious challenges at us yet. Last night I even managed 8 hours sleep (plus 2 hours awake time to feed, of course). I feel like a new person today - I was even contemplating going to the post xmas sales to pick up some baby stuff that I thought we'd be given but weren't. Seb however, had other ideas!!

How cool is breastfeeding??!!! I'm really lucky, I know - Seb is an awesome feeder and so far, all is good. I've got a great supply and I'm starting to work out his patterns and cues...although today, he's trying to prove me wrong of course! Why though, did no-one tell me how horrible your boobs get the day your milk comes in? I thought I wouldn't make it through that 24hrs.

Xmas was pretty cool. It was just supposed to be my Mum and her partner coming here for really low-key xmas (remember the drama about DP's sister stealing xmas?) but in the end DP's whole family arrived here with an entire xmas spread. At first I was overwhelmed and hormonal and really annoyed but it turned out beautifully and everyone was sooooooooo happy to be spending the day with Sebastian that both families got on famously. I don't think I truly realised the significance of the first grandchild thing until then. It's extra special that he's the first on both sides.

Better go - he wants boobs and DP wants her neck back (he sucks it when he's hungry and she's holding him.)

There's a few pics up on my blog for anyone interested. Link in sig.


----------



## farmama

mmm,

he's gorgeous! thank you so much for sharing!







:


----------



## snozzberry

Man, I leave for a few days and look what happens!!!

*MMM*, congratu-frickin-lations!!!!! Sebastian is awfully, awfully cute!







:







:







:

Seriously, so dang cute!

I am so happy that breastfeeding is going well for you and that you got great sleep so soon!

I'm just so happy for you and I wish I were there in person to give you a
















Quote:


Originally Posted by *AsYouWish* 
I feel more than blessed right now. I already know I wouldn't change a thing, despite the fact that it didn't go according to The Plan and I'm an emotional wreck right now.







In a woo-new age-spiritual way (that is very foreign to me because I'm an atheist!), I feel with this pregnancy and the person that will be born that I still have a little bit of my mom with me.







:

I'm so sorry to hear about your mother.









But what an exciting time in your life with the BFP! I know exactly what you mean about this feeling. I lost my sister in February almost 2 years ago, then ended up with our BFP in June that year. Not even sure if I believe in God, but wow...I totally felt that my sister's spirit was part of that BFP and now my first daughter.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 









you've never NIP?!?!?! Wow! How have you managed that? I think our first was when Quinn was a week old, and by 10 months we'd done it hundreds of times. This is not any form of judgment in the least, just amazement!!

Haha, it helps that I'm a homebody and don't really go out much.









The *flight* was AWESOME, like you all said it would be.







Abby did great and didn't even need to nurse during takeoff/landing every time. Didn't seem to be bothered by her ears--maybe that comes later?

Used *gdiapers* for the trip and worked fine except for poop, which they did NOT contain. Luckily Abby had some vacation-induced constipation and only pooped 3 times in 10 days.









And happy bday, *Calvin*!


----------



## snozzberry

Oh yeah, *PiePie* are you the one who got the Yookidoo Discovery Dome? If so, how is DD liking it? Or if it wasn't you, who was it?


----------



## snozzberry

I need to go back and search the NMY Grad archives but...

What's your *favorite toy* for encouraging/helping/supporting walking?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
Oh yeah, *PiePie* are you the one who got the Yookidoo Discovery Dome? If so, how is DD liking it? Or if it wasn't you, who was it?









it was me and she totally loves it. as does dh. gotta say, i like it too.


----------



## PiePie

dd used the mega bloks wagon (25) for walking. i liked that it had two uses -- wagon and construction. imho, the best walking toys are those haba wagons, but they are crazy expensive (200-300), and the next best are the radio flyer first walker wagons (100). both of them are weighted so if the kid has no balance and leans into them they don't go flying. prices in parentheses explain our choice, plus she was pretty steady -- the wagon was more for her emotional security. the mega bloks are also good for building. first there was lots of pulling apart, and that is still dominant -- we build, she destructs.







:

i really should go to bed.

mujerista, so glad BFing is going well. i have observed that bigger babies generally nurse better. is it that their mouths are bigger?? anyway, you


----------



## Maela

I wish we could have afforded the radio flyer walker wagon. We didn't really have anything.

*MMM*, I'm so glad to hear that bfing is going well for you! I hated that first day of my milk coming in too. It was not fun. Dh looked at my hard swollen breasts and said, "This isn't sexy at all. It just looks painful!"







Once my mw told me to pump in the hot shower, I felt much better.
And boy is he handsome! I love that bottom picture!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
I need to go back and search the NMY Grad archives but...

What's your *favorite toy* for encouraging/helping/supporting walking?

None! We really believe they should do it in their own time and when their muscles/coordination are totally ready. So we just let him do it. He did start holding by holding one of our hands, and of course we let that happen, but nothing for him to lean on or push or what not.

Just our opinion, of course!!! I'm sure you'll get some good recommendations for things should you really want to have something!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
HI folks. Thanks for all the love and congrats. This parenting thing is a trip. I cannot believe that we've been entrusted with the life of this amazing little creature. I feel so privileged.

It's going really well so far. The fog has started to lift and I'm finally able to leave the couch for small periods of time. Those first few days, you do well to just tread water, don't you? I can't believe that some of you were able to be giving updates online.

So far, Sebastian is a very chilled baby. He rarely cries and is really happy to be loved and cuddled by rooms full of strangers. Unless he's hungry, DP is just as able to comfort him as I and he hasn't thrown any serious challenges at us yet. Last night I even managed 8 hours sleep (plus 2 hours awake time to feed, of course). I feel like a new person today - I was even contemplating going to the post xmas sales to pick up some baby stuff that I thought we'd be given but weren't. Seb however, had other ideas!!

How cool is breastfeeding??!!! I'm really lucky, I know - Seb is an awesome feeder and so far, all is good. I've got a great supply and I'm starting to work out his patterns and cues...although today, he's trying to prove me wrong of course! Why though, did no-one tell me how horrible your boobs get the day your milk comes in? I thought I wouldn't make it through that 24hrs.

Xmas was pretty cool. It was just supposed to be my Mum and her partner coming here for really low-key xmas (remember the drama about DP's sister stealing xmas?) but in the end DP's whole family arrived here with an entire xmas spread. At first I was overwhelmed and hormonal and really annoyed but it turned out beautifully and everyone was sooooooooo happy to be spending the day with Sebastian that both families got on famously. I don't think I truly realised the significance of the first grandchild thing until then. It's extra special that he's the first on both sides.

Better go - he wants boobs and DP wants her neck back (he sucks it when he's hungry and she's holding him.)

There's a few pics up on my blog for anyone interested. Link in sig.

He's just gorgeous!







: Congratulations. I'm so glad bfing is going well. I'm still pretty amazed by it myself - and now I have a LO who likes to nurse while on hands and knees.







The first day was pretty rough here too, emotionally and physically. I still notice that whenever I'm engorged I'm usually upset.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
I need to go back and search the NMY Grad archives but...

What's your *favorite toy* for encouraging/helping/supporting walking?

J got the Radio Flyer wagon for Christmas. So far she loves it. She was starting to push up on everything, especially the nursing stool, so we figured it would be good for her to have something that is the right height for her. We still follow along with her, of course. But it's a pretty well made wagon that doesn't tip and has resistance pegs on the wheels. I think the baby center store had one of the Haba wagons on sale now.








On a completely unrelated note, yesterday J slipped on the coffee table (on a booklet that I was about to move) and chipped her front teeth. She's only had them a month, and they are already chipped.







I'm pretty upset about the whole thing. Her teeth are really sharp now, and I can feel it while nursing.


----------



## witchygrrl

*MMM*, your son is very handsome! After having such a rough trip getting him here, I'm glad things are now going smoothly!!! Congrats again









The 3 of us drove to FL for a little vacation, and to meet Rhea's Great-Grandpa. Even though he can no longer talk or move well, she is obviously the apple of his eye. He was SO happy to meet her yesterday, and we'll be going back to see him today.







: All the staff at the nursing home was thrilled to see her too (there's quite the wall of her pics on my grandpa's wall, thanks to my aunt).

Rhea did get way too much for Xmas, and we'll probably take some of it back, but I do love these:
http://www.constplay.com/cgi-bin/con...n=WEB+20081204


----------



## Maela

*Witchy*, those blocks are so cool! Perfect for a baby!

Dd didn't get much from us (a bracelet, an old-fasioned stuffed Piglet, Tinkerbell pillow and Mr. Potatohead - which she loves







) because we knew that she would get so much from the grandparents. And she did - most of which we probably could have done without. But we are thankful that she has people in her life who love her so much. And she got lots of cute clothes.







:


----------



## snozzberry

*Christina,* I'm sorry to hear about J's tooth.







That's so frustrating when something like that happens when you were *just* about to remove the obstacle/danger/etc!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Theres been so much going on here that I'd like to respond to, but much of it was so heavy that I don't think I can do it justice in the seconds I manage to snatch here online. I've been sharing your sorrows and joys here, I'm sorry I'm so silent.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
What's your *favorite toy* for encouraging/helping/supporting walking?

We didn't use anything either.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 







On a completely unrelated note, yesterday J slipped on the coffee table (on a booklet that I was about to move) and chipped her front teeth. She's only had them a month, and they are already chipped.







I'm pretty upset about the whole thing. Her teeth are really sharp now, and I can feel it while nursing.

















Fenton chipped his front tooth on our djeme drum about a year ago, maybe you remember. We had the same problem with how sharp his tooth was then, so we visited a ped dentist and he was able to smooth it down with a drill/file. It was an awful experience, I had to hold Fenton down while he did it. But the alternative was that nursing was becoming impossible because the tooth was so sharp, and I thought 30 seconds of terror was worth preserving the nursing relationship - he was less than a year when it happened.. In case that helps







. Like you, I felt like I had broken this perfect, brand new body that I was supposed to take care of.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
I need to go back and search the NMY Grad archives but...

What's your *favorite toy* for encouraging/helping/supporting walking?

An upside-down laundry basket also works well. For us, this is a plastic basket on carpet. Not sure about wicker/hard wood.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
*Christina,* I'm sorry to hear about J's tooth.







That's so frustrating when something like that happens when you were *just* about to remove the obstacle/danger/etc!

Thank you.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 








Fenton chipped his front tooth on our djeme drum about a year ago, maybe you remember. We had the same problem with how sharp his tooth was then, so we visited a ped dentist and he was able to smooth it down with a drill/file. It was an awful experience, I had to hold Fenton down while he did it. But the alternative was that nursing was becoming impossible because the tooth was so sharp, and I thought 30 seconds of terror was worth preserving the nursing relationship - he was less than a year when it happened.. In case that helps







. Like you, *I felt like I had broken this perfect, brand new body that I was supposed to take care of.*

Thank you. That is exactly how I feel. As silly as it sounds, it really helps to know that the same thing happens to others. I was thinking about taking her to a dentist --and that is the same vision I had.







That must have been hard. I think it's the combination of the sharp tooth and the odd positions she chooses to nurse in lately







, but I think we might have to do the same thing.

Happy New Year everyone!


----------



## snozzberry

Happy New Year!!!







:


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, chipped baby teeth must be common. an mdc friend i know here whose ds is a little older than my babe also has a chipped tooth. at least it's not a permanent one!


----------



## witchygrrl

I totally get the meltdown over a chipped tooth, though Rhea has yet to get any! (She's a big fooler, it seems!) Anyway, I was trimming her nails and she wriggled so much I cut her (even with a "baby" nail trimmer). I was in utter despair! Now it's fine...of course.

cking,







!

and Happy 2009!!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm getting a cold sore. If you can't remember what that means for me, I'll know more in a couple of weeks.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm getting a cold sore. If you can't remember what that means for me, I'll know more in a couple of weeks.

Is that what I think you mean?!! That would be so awesome.







:

If I'm wrong, sorry.


----------



## TinyFrog

I had to snoop back into what seems like a past life to verify what you were referring to Shanna.









While reliving the past I came across my own introductory post. I'll share, in case anyone needs a good laugh.









Quote:

Anyway, I hope to be happily TTC in 2007. Possibly in May?
So much for that.







*sigh* Some day.


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna - Wow!








: for you

Andrea -


----------



## Holiztic

Shanna, how (possibly, maybe) exciting! If not, no hurry--I still don't have a period!!

BTW: Anyone heard of not having a period yet at 21 months? Longest I have heard of so far, feeling like I'm menopausal, well, except for the whole menopause thing









Q still rarely goes past 3 hours without nursing. Weaning in 4 months is going to be traumatic for all!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Shanna-
My mind went to a leaky gut thing... but the other ladies are thinking pregnancy. I guess you were pregnant when I joined NMY so I don't remember your first pregnancy, I do remember your SCD struggles though. So... which is it? Please let us know!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: really Shanna? how very exciting!!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Shanna, how (possibly, maybe) exciting! If not, no hurry--I still don't have a period!!

BTW: Anyone heard of not having a period yet at 21 months? Longest I have heard of so far, feeling like I'm menopausal, well, except for the whole menopause thing









Q still rarely goes past 3 hours without nursing. Weaning in 4 months is going to be traumatic for all!

Not IRL, but I have read in books that some women can not have a period until like 36 months pp. I hope that's not me! I still haven't gotten mine either after almost 18 months. Dd is definitely nursing less often lately. Sometimes she'll go maybe 6 hours w/o nursing. It all depends on what we're doing that day. If there are a lot of people around, she's too busy to nurse. But if we're home all day and it's just she and I, she'll nurse every couple of hours. And she still nurses at least a couple of times at night. I don't want her to wean yet, so I'm not encouraging anything, but it would be nice for her to stop nursing at night so that maybe i'll start ovulating again. I don't know if I can nightwean her







; I'd rather her just do it herself. We'll see...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
Shanna-
My mind went to a leaky gut thing... but the other ladies are thinking pregnancy. I guess you were pregnant when I joined NMY so I don't remember your first pregnancy, I do remember your SCD struggles though. So... which is it? Please let us know!

That's what I thought at first too, but then I noticed she said that she would know in a couple of weeks, so I the 2ww came to mind. Hopefully, I'm right.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm getting a cold sore. If you can't remember what that means for me, I'll know more in a couple of weeks.

Oh my! So exciting!!!







:







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *watteraddict*
While reliving the past I came across my own introductory post. I'll share, in case anyone needs a good laugh.

Quote:
Anyway, I hope to be happily TTC in 2007. Possibly in May?
So much for that. *sigh* Some day.









Soon, I hope.
















Well, AF came back here last month. 9 whole months.







And dd is still nursing every 3 hours or less. She might go 5 or 6 hours at night, so maybe that's why. The funny thing is, it came back exactly 18 months after my LMP....summer solstice '07 to winter solstice '08. ah well, I better get a new battery for my thermometer.









I think DH wants to ttc again soon, but I think he really is just excited that i might get a sex drive back.









Did anyone else find themselves totally burnt out when your LO started crawling/cruising? I'm not sure how I could ever handle two LOs.

I got a copy of the new book Baby-Led Weaning. I know most of you are well past this phase, but I recommend it. It's mostly common sense stuff, but it's nice to have a book about solids that I totally agree with. All of the other books seem to have stuff about starting purees at 4 months, no mention of breastfeeding beyond 12 months, etc.









On that note, J is really into food now. It's pretty cool.


----------



## snozzberry

*Shanna*!!!!







:

Very useful to hear how often some of the older kids are nursing. I was wondering if Abby's nursing would slow down or stay the same. So far, she's still at every 3 hours, even at night.

So in 41 days, my child is going to be *ONE YEAR OLD*. Holy crap. I see what everyone means about it flying by. Can't say the first few months flew by, but now it is!


----------



## snozzberry

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Well, AF came back here last month. 9 whole months.









Dang!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Did anyone else find themselves totally burnt out when your LO started crawling/cruising? I'm not sure how I could ever handle two LOs.

I totally know what you mean. Having 2 makes me think I will have even *less* personal time because that would be 1 kid for each parent to watch, and when I would be alone how in the world would their naps and such ever line up for me to get free time?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I got a copy of the new book Baby-Led Weaning. I know most of you are well past this phase, but I recommend it. It's mostly common sense stuff, but it's nice to have a book about solids that I totally agree with. All of the other books seem to have stuff about starting purees at 4 months, no mention of breastfeeding beyond 12 months, etc.









On that note, J is really into food now. It's pretty cool.

Cool! What foods does she like most?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 

BTW: Anyone heard of not having a period yet at 21 months? Longest I have heard of so far, feeling like I'm menopausal, well, except for the whole menopause thing









Q still rarely goes past 3 hours without nursing. Weaning in 4 months is going to be traumatic for all!

Yes. Not even on the edges of the bell curve yet. I have researched this a lot, because I have friends who claimed they had to wean to get pregnant. Statistically more than 90% of nursing moms get the periods back by 24 mos. Now mind you if you search the BFing Beyond Infancy forum you will find women in that 10 percent tail, with some late dates I found scary, as I would like to TTC #2 at some point (not ready now) and I don't have mine yet and we are at 16.5 mos. FWIW, DH made some noises about not TTCing #2 late last month and I hit the roof. I think what he was saying was that things need to change, and I guess I will work on helping make those changes, because I really do want another. Just not yet. If you are still interested in reading up on this, I found the most quantitative information on kellymom and in Mothering Your Nursing Toddler. In the latter I found that even in that 10% tail most women can still conceive if they limit nursings to twice a day, which sounded reasonable to me (after age 2). Kellymom made me think that the whole must wean to conceive thing is based on women wanted to conceive again before the nursling turns 2; it is especially likely to be necessary before turns 1. basically there are a chunk of women who get AF while nursing when nursling is very small -- under 6 mos -- and then a lot who get it between 12 and 24 mos. It tends to skew more toward 24 mos. for those of us who are closer to 40, according to my LC. How old are you?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Did anyone else find themselves totally burnt out when your LO started crawling/cruising?

TOTALLY!! then i adjusted to the new normal.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
That's what I thought at first too, but then I noticed she said that she would know in a couple of weeks, so I the 2ww came to mind. Hopefully, I'm right.









Sorry to be so cryptic and then leave







. I think I could be pregnant, but I don't feel any different (other than the cold sore, which is maybe a 50% sign). I can't remember if I felt any different this early last time....

My period came back when Fenton started sleeping and not nursing for about 6 hours stretches or so. I only got mine back 2 or 3 months ago I think.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
It tends to skew more toward 24 mos. for those of us who are closer to 40, according to my LC. How old are you?

I am 29 (for 6 more weeks!) so I don't think I qualify as near 40 (though it is all relative).

He nurses about 10-15 times a day (when we are home that is, only about 4x if out and busy) and 6 times a night. Seriously! This kid loves boobies. I offer snacks, cow milk, water, etc. Sometimes he takes it then asks for boobie right after, sometimes he refuses and wants nothing but boobie.

I want to wean him at 2 whether I have AF or not, I need a break before getting pregnant! Plus, this kid is huge (over 30 pounds) and nursing a 30+ pounder as much as 20 times in 24 hours is draining, I am losing weight and getting sick like crazy! I think he's sucking the life out of me (mostly joking here).

Thanks for all the info.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
He nurses about 10-15 times a day (when we are home that is, only about 4x if out and busy) and 6 times a night. Seriously! This kid loves boobies. I offer snacks, cow milk, water, etc. Sometimes he takes it then asks for boobie right after, sometimes he refuses and wants nothing but boobie.

I want to wean him at 2 whether I have AF or not, I need a break before getting pregnant! Plus, this kid is huge (over 30 pounds) and nursing a 30+ pounder as much as 20 times in 24 hours is draining, I am losing weight and getting sick like crazy! I think he's sucking the life out of me (mostly joking here).

Thanks for all the info.









That's Dd. _Way_ less nursing when out and about. I'm sorry you're feeling so drained!









*MMM*, I've been peeking at your blog and you've definitely got one cute baby boy! And I'm quite jealous about his sleeping habits. Come on, sleeping during a bath?! How nice would that have been? Dd hated baths until she was a few months old. I'm glad things are going so well for you! Keep the pics coming!









I think Dd is just about through with naps. Isn't this happening way too early? She is sleeping in more and going to bed earlier though, so I guess that's cool. I just wonder if it isn't healthy for her not to nap at this age? I could wake her up a little earlier (like at 7AM), but that doesn't always mean that she'll nap at a good time. Then she might nap at 5PM and then have a late late bedtime (like 10 or 11PM) which is not okay.


----------



## PiePie

yes you can look in weissbluth for typical age range but i am retty sure this is WAY TOO YOUNG to give up naps altogether. dd has a day or 2 without naps but still needs her 1 in the afternoon, more or less from 1:30 to 3.


----------



## Maela

Today she decided to prove me wrong. She woke up at 6:45AM (pretty early for her lately) and then took a nap from 10:30 to 11:30AM.







I give up on trying to figure her out.


----------



## snozzberry

Count me in the giving-up-on-figuring-out-nap-habits camp!

*Shanna,* I'm







: for you!

So I took Abby to her first playdate today!







:

The boy was her age (3 days older), the other girl was 2 mos younger.

So, um, is it normal for a child Abby's age (10.5 mos) to take toys away from other babies? I thought that "mine" stuff didn't happen til later, like 1.5 yrs?

She would grab a toy from the other kid, then not give it back when they wanted it back.

And as the mom, what do I do in that situation? She doesn't understand the logic of sharing I'm sure, so do I take it away from her & give it back to the other kid?

And like, seriously--they let anyone have one of these things? You don't have to take a class or get a permit or _anything_? I don't know what the heck I'm doing!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
So, um, is it normal for a child Abby's age (10.5 mos) to take toys away from other babies? I thought that "mine" stuff didn't happen til later, like 1.5 yrs?

She would grab a toy from the other kid, then not give it back when they wanted it back.

And as the mom, what do I do in that situation? She doesn't understand the logic of sharing I'm sure, so do I take it away from her & give it back to the other kid?

I think it's totally normal! Dd is just about 1.5 and has _just_ started getting what "sharing" is. But I still don't make her share, because she's obviously too young to understand _why_ it's nice to share. If she takes a toy away from another baby (which happens a lot), I usually grab another toy to either distract her so I can give the toy back or distract the other baby. I think most parents understand that babies this age don't understand. Toys get taken from Dd too, and I usually just try to get her another one quick.
It was so funny watching dd play with her cousin (12 days older) during the holidays. They're just constantly grabbing things from each other.


----------



## PiePie

*Kelly*, not a lot of time to post but the short version is I agree with *Maela* and don't require sharing. I believe that at this age the understand giving but not sharing. I recommend the socialization chapter (and onlh that chapter) in _Parenting our Toddler_ b the Barnard folks. The troick is to find other parents who are also on board with not forcing sharing. I tr to be non-interventionist because when we intervene kids come to expect that and don't get the emotional intelligence skills from working it out on their own. when i do intervene, i tell the kid with objec 2 give 2 child when done, so kid can have power 2 decide when (power is goal) and when kid is grabee "hold on nex ime).

keboard falling apar because dd hrew shoe frusraed from high heels


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
keboard falling apar because dd hrew shoe frusraed from high heels

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I wasn't going to say anything but, guess what Shanna...me too!! We had a dumb condom user error and then I ovulated later that day (assumig that familiar twinge still means what it used to mean). I thought nothing of it but then the day before yesterday I was drinking apple juice and threw up and was nauseous most of the day and then today I was browning groundbeef to make chili for DH and DS and almost got sick again. It's way early for MS so maybe it's just a coincidence. My cycles are kinda sporadic and long though so I won't know if I'm late until the 15th for sure (AF is due sometime between 11-14). I feel emotionally ok with a pregnancy but it would be such bad timing.

"sharing": While it is too early for sharing I don't let DS take toys out of other children's hands. I just say, "No, she's still using that. Here let's play with this."and try to draw his attention to another object. Sometimes it works, sometimes he throws homself on the floor screaming. I acknowlege that he's frustrated. Then I sit next to him until he calms down and I tell the other parent about how South Asians train very young babies to throw tantrums.







:


----------



## PiePie

*arelyn*, why bad timing?


----------



## ~Shanna~

nak

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
I wasn't going to say anything but, guess what Shanna...me too!!









I'm less sure for myself - I don't have any other symptoms, and I had another round of fertile cm later than I expected. It reminded me how I've been seeing cm much later in my cycle than 14 days before af..... I can't believe we're on another round of 2ww here!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
"sharing": While it is too early for sharing I don't let DS take toys out of other children's hands. I just say, "No, she's still using that. Here let's play with this."and try to draw his attention to another object. Sometimes it works, sometimes he throws homself on the floor screaming. I acknowlege that he's frustrated.

This is pretty much what we do unless the other baby doesn't care or loses interest. I'd like to let them work it out for themselves, but that would mean my chlld running roughshod over every kid every time because he's always the more persistent one. I advocate for the other child if they want it, leave it alone if they don't, and try really hard to not be influenced by what I am afraid the other parent is thinking of me if I don't intervene.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I don't have any other symptoms,

Well, unless you count the fact that I could _not_ leave the library yesterday without checking out a book that had a knitting pattern for newborn hat and gloves







.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Well, unless you count the fact that I could _not_ leave the library yesterday without checking out a book that had a knitting pattern for newborn hat and gloves







.

Aaaahhh!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

Cool! What foods does she like most?

She likes apples & pears (to nibble on whole), Oatios, bread, avocado&#8230;..and basically she's willing to explore anything we put in front of her. I hope she keeps that up (I know, unlikely&#8230

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

So I took Abby to her first playdate today!







:

The boy was her age (3 days older), the other girl was 2 mos younger.

So, um, is it normal for a child Abby's age (10.5 mos) to take toys away from other babies? I thought that "mine" stuff didn't happen til later, like 1.5 yrs?

She would grab a toy from the other kid, then not give it back when they wanted it back.

And as the mom, what do I do in that situation? She doesn't understand the logic of sharing I'm sure, so do I take it away from her & give it back to the other kid?


Oh fun! Josephine does this already. She gets upset whenever we take something from her, especially if she's tired. And she'll grab toys from other babies and gets upset if they grab something from her. I agree with what others said about not understanding sharing - especially at this young age. I'll sometimes try to distract her with another toy if I need to take something from her.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry*
And like, seriously--they let anyone have one of these things? You don't have to take a class or get a permit or _anything_? I don't know what the heck I'm doing!









you mean a kid? I know, right?


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*arelyn*, why bad timing?

We were just planning our next excursion overseas and the timing will put all our plans out of whack and make traveling on an airplane more complicated (two lap travelers to juggle or three tickets to pay for).

It's no huge deal though.


----------



## PiePie

*arelyn*, I do not understand. Is there any airline that does not require you to buy a seat for a child 2+? Because Kai will be 2 by the time any bean appears...


----------



## Maela

: I think I may have ovulated. But I'm not going to get too excited because this has happened before. My nipples have been really sore the last couple of days, but I think that may be due to Dd's teething/poor latch. She's always had a not-so-good latch, but after the first six weeks of bfing it hasn't hurt me until this weekend. When I got pg last time, my nipples became very tender from the day I conceived, but I don't know... I don't know if I even want to be pg the first time I actually ovulate (how likely is that anyway?), but if I were I would be happy. Really I just want my cycles to return; getting pg in April would be perfect.


----------



## witchygrrl

Seems like there's quite a few potential 2nd babies....how exciting!!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*arelyn*, I do not understand. Is there any airline that does not require you to buy a seat for a child 2+? Because Kai will be 2 by the time any bean appears...

On international flights under threes are lap "babies". Maybe all their parents are fibbing about their ages. IDK I just know...oh nevermind...Kai's freaking out from comptuer jealousy.


----------



## PiePie

so i posted a q about it in frugality.


----------



## PiePie

so the answer from frugality is no, and even some 1 yos have to pay for a seat, depending on weight and airline.

2 media pieces i wanted to share:
http://www.facebook.com/ext/share.ph...=ZJn6N&u=ixJYt (best most of you have already seen this)
http://www.arts.gov/research/ReadingonRise.pdf


----------



## witchygrrl

Yeah, I didn't feel entirely comfortable flying wth DD in arms, so we drove to FL. That wouldn't work wih going overseas, though.

I am slowly realizing that Rhea will be 6 months old soon. How did that happen? I feel so unprepared re: solids.


----------



## Maela

OMG Witchy she's going to be 6 months!? Wow.

Where is *ZB*?


----------



## Holiztic

On sharing:

I have noticed a lot of moms actually stop their child from playing with other children completely in order to avoid this issue. It drives me nuts! Sometimes we are at a public play space and a child comes up to Quinn (not taking anything or causing any problems) and the mom runs over (doesn't even acknowledge us) and scoops up her toddler, saying "oh no, he's playing with that" and they disappear.

I'd rather grabbing toys away and tantrums than children never learning how to interact!! It sounds like you all are on the same page.

I let Quinn take the toy if it isn't aggressive grabbing AND if the other child doesn't mind, but I say "Quinn, that was nice, ______ (that boy/girl if I don't know name) let you play with the ________, let's say thank you". If it is aggressive or the child is at all upset, I return the item to the child and explain "___ was playing with that, let's find another toy", but I try to let them play together instead of whisking him away. It works 90% of the time, except when he is tired, then he hits me (we're working on this!) It's more like he's hitting the air and sometimes I happen to be in the path, but still a problem, of course.


----------



## witchygrrl

I know, Maela...it's just so surreal to me. And I was wondering where ZB was too...

Holiztic, that seems sensible. I'm terrible with conflict in general, but avoiding any potential sharing/not sharing issues doesn't promote learning in any way. And isn't development all about learning?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
2 media pieces i wanted to share:
http://www.facebook.com/ext/share.ph...=ZJn6N&u=ixJYt (best most of you have already seen this)

Thanks for posting this, I hadn't seen. We should be so lucky that breast pumps become as "ubiquitous as cell phones".


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
On international flights under threes are lap "babies". Maybe all their parents are fibbing about their ages. IDK I just know...oh nevermind...Kai's freaking out from comptuer jealousy.









I was going to say "I just know there are a lot of very big, very verbal kids riding on laps on Etihad, Jordanian and Indian airlines. Though Indian and Jordanian were miserable so I hope we don't have to use them again. Also, a friend we met in India had to really twist the arm of their travel agent to get a seat for his 35lb two and a half year old. He kept being told it was impossible until he explained he would pay the normal fee and the travel agent was just shocked..."But he is 2...you don't have to pay for another seat." :doh

At anyrate, it's a moot point. AF showed up on time and I'm ok with that. My travel bug is biting more than my baby bug!

Would watch the videos bu Kai just got bored with the pots and wants a story. I'll anwer hsi call now while he's acting nice...before the green eyed monster attacks!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
I'll anwer hsi call now while he's acting nice...before the green eyed monster attacks!

Fenton gets this whenever I get on the phone. It's funny to watch him race through a list of his "needs" as soon as I pick up the phone: "Potty! Milk! Hurt! Up! Read! Hummus!" He doesn't even wait for a response to each


----------



## Maela

Maev just wants to talk to whoever I'm talking to on the phone. Usually it's a family member that she knows, so I'll let her. Then she just says, "Hi!, Hi!" And tries to show whoever it is what toy she's playing with.







When ever the phone ring she says, "dada?" She always thinks it's Dh or my sister.
Sometimes she brings me the phone and names who she wants to call. I usually make the call for her and whoever it is (usually Papa or my sister) is very happy to talk to her.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev just wants to talk to whoever I'm talking to on the phone. Usually it's a family member that she knows, so I'll let her. Then she just says, "Hi!, Hi!" And tries to show whoever it is what toy she's playing with.







When ever the phone ring she says, "dada?" She always thinks it's Dh or my sister.
Sometimes she brings me the phone and names who she wants to call. I usually make the call for her and whoever it is (usually Papa or my sister) is very happy to talk to her.

That's so cute. J 'called' my mom the other day. I gave her the phone to play with (














while I put dishes away, and she managed to scroll through the caller id list and hit send. she even left a message. I didn't find out until my mom called back later in the day.

DH went on a business trip last week, and since he got back J wants nothing to do with me. It's.all.about.Daddy.

She discovered stairs the other day - and she climbed an entire flight - 13 steps - on her first try.









I'm wayyyy behind on baby-proofing......


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hey does anyone have any film recommendations? New release or otherwise? This weather has me under the weather and bored just reading during Fenton's naps. Although I have some _fabulous_ titles on anarchy coming from the library....

Also wondering too how our newest mamas are doing? ZB, MMM?

I have time to be on here today, but I'm so lost in the conversation that...


----------



## Maela

Woo hoo!







: Dd's actually taking a nap! And it's not at 5PM!! It's only noon!

Third day of high temp! Please keep your fingers crossed for me that I ovulated. Nipples are not very sore anymore; I don't think I'm pg.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hey does anyone have any film recommendations? New release or otherwise? This weather has me under the weather and bored just reading during Fenton's naps. Although I have some _fabulous_ titles on anarchy coming from the library....(

Have you seen Little Miss Sunshine? I love that movie. Also really liked Amelie. Can't think of anything else at the moment.

What books are you getting?


----------



## Holiztic

Keeping Mum is the only thing that comes to mind, hilarious!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

nak

still here, still doing great though battling with an oversupply and fast let-down which is giving the boy some yucky reflux. Will see an LC next week if i can't get it under control myself.

damn...he's stroppy. more later.


----------



## Holiztic

just had to google "stroppy" !

yeah, quinn was/is stroppy also! but he's also way more social and affectionate than the less stroppy babies/toddlers I know. I think its a trade-off!


----------



## Maela

also had to google "stroppy"









Looking at my chart...if that's not ovulation, I'm going to be very upset. It's so clear! FF hasn't said anything yet though, so we'll see...


----------



## Sihaya

*Maela* - I don't think FF will give you a CL unless it can pinpoint the O date, and with those two missing temps, that's impossible to do accurately. I definitely agree that you O'd, though. Either on CD 85, 86, or 87.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*Maela* - I don't think FF will give you a CL unless it can pinpoint the O date, and with those two missing temps, that's impossible to do accurately. I definitely agree that you O'd, though. Either on CD 85, 86, or 87.

Oh, that makes sense. I wish I hadn't forgotten to take my temp this weekend
I'm glad you agree!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
nak

still here, still doing great though battling with an oversupply and fast let-down which is giving the boy some yucky reflux. Will see an LC next week if i can't get it under control myself.

Yeah, I have really fast letdown too...Rhea would usually pull off, and then I'd put her back on when it quieted down a bit. She would get squirted a lot this way, though


----------



## ~Shanna~

Af showed up today. I had felt almost indifferent up through Sunday. By Monday though, I was so sure I was pregnant that I didn't even think I would ever test. Yesterday I was so positive that I told DH that I was almost positive that I was. Cold sore 2 days after O, tender breasts, heightened sense of smell...The biggest sign was that I was feeling energy in my uterus, especially when F was nursing. So I'm definately shocked. I'm really disappointed that I'm not, which is an enormous turn around from a week ago.

One thing that strikes me is that my cycle is running about 24 days, and I feel like I am not getting 14 days between O and AF. It's been so long, is that the luteal phase? If so, I thought I remembered ways to lengthen it? Chasteberry/vitex maybe?

Anyway, life goes on and I can hardly carry on when this would have been a surprise. Funny how it works that way though.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hey does anyone have any film recommendations? New release or otherwise? This weather has me under the weather and bored just reading during Fenton's naps. Although I have some _fabulous_ titles on anarchy coming from the library....


I have seen only 2 in 2008: _Wall-E_, which was good but I didn't see what all the hype was about, and _Frozen River_, which was amazing -- I think you would like its politics. But I warn you it is very emotional from a new mama's POV.

XOXOX to all...


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
One thing that strikes me is that my cycle is running about 24 days, and I feel like I am not getting 14 days between O and AF. It's been so long, is that the luteal phase? If so, I thought I remembered ways to lengthen it? Chasteberry/vitex maybe?


You need a luteal phase of at least 10 days for implantation to occur. Vitex supposedly lengthens it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
You need a luteal phase of at least 10 days for implantation to occur. Vitex supposedly lengthens it.

Thanks, I was thinking it had to be 14, but now that you mention it 10 sounds familiar....


----------



## witchygrrl

vitex worked well for me in lengthening my lp, but yeah, 10 days is the minimum, I think.








Shanna


----------



## Sihaya

*Shanna*, I don't know much about Vitex other than the LP lengthening part, but Shatavari is supposed to both lengthen your LP and increase your milk supply (not sure if you need/want that right now). It did help my LP, but I didn't notice any increase in supply. I think I have some leftover from my low supply days if you want to try it. If you want to buy new, FFL carries it in tincture form.


----------



## ~Shanna~

nak
Thanks for all the help. I think my lp is okay, i was just was thinking 14 instead of 10. Feeling a little blue today







.


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*







It would be disappointing to be so sure about it and then be wrong.









So are you officially TTC#2 now?


----------



## AsYouWish

Shanna
















: for ovulating Maela


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
nak
Thanks for all the help. I think my lp is okay, i was just was thinking 14 instead of 10. Feeling a little blue today







.

You know, I understand your disappointment and it _is_ sad that you're not knocked up just yet but it seems to me that this was a great practice run and now you've made room in your universe and consciousness for your next precious LO. It's exciting!

Vitex is what I credit for getting me preggo. I'd throw it into the TTC mix for anyone who is taking a while to conceive or who has wacky cycles...unless you have an FSH issue. Then I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.

Have I mentioned that my ambivalence over more than one child is over? I'm ready to TTC again now! I'm shocked beyond belief. Lucky it's not possible for DP and I to conceive an oops baby. We might have Irish twins if that were the case.

Re: stroppy. I wondered whether it was a bit of an Australian colloquialism. Comes from the word obstreperous I think and I use it interchangeably with cranky, irritable, impatient, fussy...It's a good word methinks.


----------



## cking

I'm sorry Shanna









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 

Have I mentioned that my ambivalence over more than one child is over? I'm ready to TTC again now! I'm shocked beyond belief. Lucky it's not possible for DP and I to conceive an oops baby. We might have Irish twins if that were the case.


Really? WOW. That's amazing. It's funny, having af back has me kind of thinking about it. Then there's that voice in my head saying 'Nooo! 18 months is too close.' eh, we'll see.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I'm sorry Shanna









Really? WOW. That's amazing. It's funny, having af back has me kind of thinking about it. Then there's that voice in my head saying 'Nooo! 18 months is too close.' eh, we'll see.

I did not get this feeling until Dd was almost 15 months old. The transition to motherhood was very hard for me. I really don't do well without time to myself, but I'm finally coming to terms with not having much "me time" for the next decade(?) or so. I was afraid that I wouldn't want to TTC again when we had planned (at 2 years). But then when she hit 15 months, it just hit me all of a sudden and I desperately wanted to get pg again. I'm jealous of all of you who want to TTC so soon after your babies are born!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
So are you officially TTC#2 now?

Definately. And perhaps more aggressively than I thought we would - DH is really disappointed too.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
You know, I understand your disappointment and it _is_ sad that you're not knocked up just yet but it seems to me that this was a great practice run and now you've made room in your universe and consciousness for your next precious LO. It's exciting!

You couldn't be more right about this. I've felt ambivalent for the past couple of months, right up until last sunday. Once I was so sure that I was, I was really really excited. And _remarkably calm_. It can't hurt that Fenton's last tooth is just about through and he's sleeping so much better. I have 2 goals before #2 arrives: 1)Help Fenton to nightwean (which looks like might happen on its own once that tooth is through) and 2) learn how to do a back carry with a newborn. After that, I'm as prepared as anyone can be.

MMM, I'm so glad that you're feeling the way you do because it sounds like you're having such a lovely transition to motherhood. Like Maela, I found the transition to be incredibly difficult and its only in the last month or two that I've definitely decided I can handle another one and thus want another one. It was really confusing to what i thought I knew about myself to be so constantly wondering if I should stop at 1. I'm so glad it's going so well!







:

Unrelated: Fenton just started saying "Yup".As in "Fenton, did you poop?" "Yup!"


----------



## snozzberry

*Shanna*









*MMM,* that is so cool that you feel so ready for another already! Have I mentioned that I am so, so happy for you guys?







:

Like *Shanna* and *Maela*, I also had a rough transition to motherhood. I neeeeeeeed "me" time. While I still don't see myself getting pg again anytime soon, now I can finally begin to see that I *might* want that in the next couple years.

Abby's 11 months today, and I *just* started seeing this as a possibility in the last month or so. Don't get me wrong though--I can still swing wildly back to "no way, no how" in 0.001 second!

2 women at work are pg, and I'm jealous of them. Not because they're going to get a baby in the end







but I really enjoyed being pg. The energy, the power, the attention.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
DH went on a business trip last week, and since he got back J wants nothing to do with me. It's.all.about.Daddy.

Ugh, that sucks!!! Abby wants DH *always* and me *only* when she's hungry.







I try to tell myself that I should be glad she has such a great relationship with her daddy, but I wanna be the favorite for once, dammit!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hey does anyone have any film recommendations?

I really enjoyed _Waitress_, not a new release though. We also got the _Unconditional Parenting_ DVD, but haven't watched it yet.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I have 2 goals before #2 arrives:


I'm sure I've mentioned this here before, but I have 4 goals before our #2 gets here: 1) DS is verbal so I can more or less understand him the majority of the time, 2) His teeth are all in, 3) He is weaned, and 4) He is pottytrained/diaper-free. I think I may be a bit ambitious









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
2) learn how to do a back carry with a newborn.


I may be able to help you with that one. This video helped me immensely: Do you have a non-stretchy wrap? If not, I have two and could probably lend you one of them.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
2 women at work are pg, and I'm jealous of them. Not because they're going to get a baby in the end







but I really enjoyed being pg. The energy, the power, the attention.










Don't forget the belly







This is exactly how I've been feeling for about a year, now. I DO NOT want another baby yet, the timing wouldn't work for us, but I would love to be pg, pretty much non-stop for the next 10-15 years







It doesn't help that it feels like everyone around me is either pg, just had a baby in the last year (or both







), or is TTC. The waiting is really starting to get to me, even though I know it's what's best for us.


----------



## witchygrrl

I'm excited for all those who want to TTC again, whether right after or way after. But while I did love being pregnant and while the birthing process was so wonderful (and fascinating, I have to admit), I only want the one. The only thing I think I'll miss is just being pregnant again--that was (mostly) fun.

I'll live vicariously through y'all, me thinks. DH is going to have a physical later this month and will be asking about the big V.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 
2 women at work are pg, and I'm jealous of them. Not because they're going to get a baby in the end







but I really enjoyed being pg. The energy, the power, the attention.









I loved being pregnant too, it's part of what I'm so excited to do again -I'm curious if I'll feel that way with all of my pregnancies. But I'm also jealous of 1st-time pg mamas because I'll never experience that unique blend of the experience: being able to pamper myself because I have no other responsibilities; being so excited without the knowledge of the hardships to temper it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I may be able to help you with that one. This video helped me immensely: Do you have a non-stretchy wrap? If not, I have two and could probably lend you one of them.

I've officially "learned" the theory, asked for a wrap for my bday... now I'm just waiting for niece/nephew #3 to show up in may so I can practice. When I was so sure i was pg, i think part of my serenity is that both goals are half done. Which is why they made the cut to being goals for #2.


----------



## PiePie

i have always known i wanted a second child, but I *dread* the pregnancy. dh has expressed recent opposition to a second -- he requires more date time, i think.







:














i am confident he will come around though. i am not saying he regrets dd -- he doesn't -- but he is increasingly blindsided and disappointed that things he loved to do, and could do when she was a lovable lump in a sling, are no longer viable for long periods of time. i was fully expecting this and know that she won't be a toddler forever -- not sure what his problem with deferred gratification is. anyway, we have time to work this throughg as i feel the need to devote myself fully to dd right now, plus i don't have af yet anyway.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry*
Ugh, that sucks!!! Abby wants DH *always* and me *only* when she's hungry.







I try to tell myself that I should be glad she has such a great relationship with her daddy, but I wanna be the favorite for once, dammit!

Oh







This just started with J, but she's been doing the same thing. I think it's cute sometimes, but yeah, she only wants me for my boobs.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *snozzberry* 

2 women at work are pg, and I'm jealous of them. Not because they're going to get a baby in the end







but I really enjoyed being pg. The energy, the power, the attention.










I really enjoyed being pregnant also. Although, like Shanna said, it might be different the second time around.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I have 2 goals before #2 arrives: .... and 2) learn how to do a back carry with a newborn. After that, I'm as prepared as anyone can be.


I really like that video that Steph posted. But I haven't had much luck with back carries in a wrap. [I had help with one at a BW meeting, and it was very comfy...but I haven't been able to do it on my own.] Do you have a mei tai? I have been using that for back carries, and I love it. I use the Ergo too, but it's actually easier to get her on my back in the MT. I think that'll be what I use mostly with our second child, especially as a newborn.


----------



## cking

Oh, and I have to clarify that I am in no way ready to TTC again, but it's been on my mind a bit since having AF back means it _might_ be possible. But Josephine has become incredibly active lately, and dare I say spirited, and it really has me in doubt as to whether I could actually handle life with more than one child. Every diaper change becomes a wrestling match, many days she hardly naps and is always getting into 'trouble'.







But often, just when I can't take it anymore, she falls asleep and she has that same little angel face she had as a newborn.....


----------



## Maela

*Witchy*, I think it's great that you know how many you want. I wish I knew (for me it's deciding between 2,3 or 4); I'm such a big planner that it's really hard for me not to be sure about it RIGHT NOW.














I'm thinking maybe one doesn't really know until they've had their last baby. So that explains why you know.








And then of course, I could plan all I want, and still things don't usually go as planned for me.
















*Cking* oh man those diaper changes with a wiggly baby really tested my patience. She's still wiggly sometimes, but not as bad as she was from 9-15 months.

My baby girl is 1 1/2 year old today. Wow. Tomorrow she'll be closer to 2yo than 1yo. That just blows my mind.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Every diaper change becomes a wrestling match, many days she hardly naps and is always getting into 'trouble'.









Oh, these were some of my darkest daytime moments as a parent, where I wanted to literally yell at him. Especially if the wrestling managed to get poop all over the place. We ended up switching to BumGenius because of this, and it helped a lot to only have 1 layer to get on him.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Cking* oh man those diaper changes with a wiggly baby really tested my patience. She's still wiggly sometimes, but not as bad as she was from 9-15 months.

My baby girl is 1 1/2 year old today. Wow. Tomorrow she'll be closer to 2yo than 1yo. That just blows my mind.









Thanks. It's good to know she might calm down a bit in the future.









Happy Half birthday to your DD! Wow, time goes so fast.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Oh, these were some of my darkest daytime moments as a parent, where I wanted to literally yell at him. Especially if the wrestling managed to get poop all over the place. We ended up switching to BumGenius because of this, and it helped a lot to only have 1 layer to get on him.

Yep, we're using mainly bum genius now, and it helps (even pocket dipes with snaps are too hard.) But many times I put them on her while she's standing, which leads to leaks.







We've had a few very messy changes already too. I end up trying to distract her with some object to keep her interest - usually something she's not 'supposed' to play with - like the phone. But it has to be something new every time. This morning the dragonfly from her mobile worked well, until she decided to 'dip' it. Yuck!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
But many times I put them on her while she's standing, which leads to leaks.









Exact same experience here. That should be my goal #3 before the next baby: perfect the standing up dipe change.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
We've had a few very messy changes already too. I end up trying to distract her with some object to keep her interest - usually something she's not 'supposed' to play with - like the phone.

And this too







. Speaking of this though: Fenton and I had an adventure to the Urgent Care this morning. First thing this morning he swallows a penny. My default is to wait those things out before I panic and go to the doctor, but I had the sense to get some advice about what to watch for in terms of obstructions, etc. and basically all advice said "don't wait it out, get to a doctor". So we did. Fenton _hates_ the doctor and has so little experience going to one - he pretty much panics if they even touch him to take his pulse







. He did great though, and has been repeating my words to everyone that he was "so brave"







. They took an xray to make sure it wasn't stuck somewhere, and now I'm thinking it was unnecessary. In case this ever helps anyone, my pastors wife (GI nurse) advised that if its stuck in their esophogus, it will be obvious they they are in discomfort. She then gave me a cheap stethoscope and told me to divide his torso into quadrants around his belly button. Listen in all quadrants and if in any section you hear nothing or a hissing noise, then get to the doctor because it indicates an obstruction further down. Wish I had known that, but didn't think that would be on the test







. We did great and I didn't even panic, I just didn't have a clue what the common sense thing to do was. And we have one wicked xray picture for his baby book.







I'm threatening DH that I'm going to include the penny once it passes. Which it hasn't, and I'm trying not to panic. We're only about 12 hours out, but I'm really worried about all that copper, zinc, etc in his system. Might do a light Kombucha cleanse (or similar) after this passes, but I need to think this through better....


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*, sorry about the penny. Good for you for staying calm!

I swallowed a penny when i was ~10mo. My mom didn't see it happen, so she didn't know what was wrong, just that I wasn't acting normal and that I wasn't eating hardly anything. She took me to the doctor and they all insisted that I was fine. She took me back a couple of days later cause I still wasn't eating, and they finally did an x-ray to find out that I had swallowed a penny. They had to put me out to get it out from deep in my throat/esophagus (not sure where exactly it was).
My sister swallowed an earring, but my mom found it the next day in her diaper.









I'm sure you'll see the penny soon, *Shanna*!


----------



## cking

Wow, Shanna, what a frightening experience.







Glad you were able to stay calm. I hope it all comes out smoothly. And thanks for the advice on how to handle it if it happens to us.


----------



## katt

I'm still here, i've missed you guys though.
Shanna-I hope the penny has passed through by now!
I'm SO ready to be pregnant again. AF JUST returned a month ago. Although I feel I was fertile w/o it and I wish it was still gone. oh well, it was bound to happen at some point. Hopefully w/in the next year we'll get PG again. We'll see. We are not TTC or anything, i just think that Teo needs a sibling.

Let's see...
We've moved into our own apartment. it has a yard and a view, i'm pretty excited. I've got permission to plant a garden. Wish me luck, our yard gets pretty wet and i'm not sure about sun exposure and i've never planted a garden on my own, it's always been at the direction of my dad.









Teo is 2 now, can you believe it? He LOVES anything having to do with balls. Volleyball and Tennis are two of his favorites, he has his own Rah-Ree (racquet)sp? and DH has taught him how to properly Bump and Set (w/ his fingertips no less) and they are working on Spike. Gotta love 'em. He got a Yellow Strider Bike for his birthday from Mom and Dad. Which he loves and knows to put his helmet one (when he does it himself he usually puts it on backwards, but hey, he does it voluntarily. It is his ZLallow Dide (yellow bike).
He's a great eater and loves fruit, isn't very picky, but doesn't always eat a lot, which is okay with me as he'll eat when he's hungry (sometimes he packs it away, other times he doesn't)
His vocabulary is expanding and a few of his old words are starting to get more recognizable: durduh is sounding more and more like Turtle. He doesn't really string words into sentences much, but i'm not worried about that as he makes his point very well. I do have to interpret for him occassionally, but it all works out.








He usues his 'polite' words pretty regularly, which I'm pretty pleased with: Pees, Dain Dou, and Useme (please, thank you, and excuse me)

He's addicted to Thzords and dohduh (swords and yoda) and his favorite movie is, can you guess? yup, Starwars. Fav. scene: chapter 46 Yoda and Count Dooku's light saber fight. I'm SO sick and tired of that movie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! EVERY day: Thzord? Mo-ee? (sword, movie?) I make him wait until Daddy gets home from work. ha ha ha haa

What else??? Potty Learning. He does great, when he's got a naked butt. He tells me / signs pee (i'll stand him on the rim of the big potty to pee in there) sometimes he doesn't tell me and just goes in and pees in the little potty on his own. Poop he's getting pretty good at too, yet again, he'll stand or squat on the big toilet rim. We get all excited for him. We're pretty pleased, mainly cause he's doing it himself and we're not pushing any of our time frame on him, so it is less stress for us.









We are having bed time issues. He goes to sleep super late (or early, depending on your pov) and sleeps until 12-2pm! He's a good sleeper and once alseep for the night will typically sleep for 12+ hours, it is getting him to sleep at a reasonable hour that is difficult.
Normal day: wake up 12:30, no nap, asleep at 8:30/9, wake up at 12, asleep around 3am
or
wake at : 1:30, nap around 5, wake at 7 (when he naps he naps well) asleep at 2am

I just gotta shift his hours... wake at 10, nap at 3 wake at 5 alseep at 10
would be great! Even wake at 9!

Dh keeps saying he shouldn't get a nap, then he'll go to sleep earlier, but that isn't making any difference!!!!!!!!!!!! ARGH!
I don't mind his wonky hours, but it does kinda put a damper on the day when I don't get out and about until 1 or 2pm.

Okay, that's about what's going on up here.


----------



## Maela

*Katt*, Yay for having your own place! With a yard! Good luck on the garden. I can't believe Teo is already 2!! Sorry to hear about the bedtime issues - I would have a really hard time with that. I hope things get better soon. I think it's so cool that Teo is learning some tennis already; I love tennis; it's such a fun sport.

I know I've said this like a million times already, but I am just so excited that I ovulated!







: Now I'm just waiting for AF, which I'm pretty sure is coming as I've been sooo irritable the last couple of days! If it hasn't come by the 29th I'll assume I'm pg, but I'm almost positive that I'm not. My nipples aren't sore at all and that was my biggest pg sign from the day of conception with DD. Okay, I'm going to stop talking about my cycles for awhile now...







I promise.


----------



## witchygrrl

I can't believe Teo is 2 either...that's crazy stuff!

Poor Rhea has a cold again...she seems pretty happy, considering. She's getting close to crawling though...she can turn around nicely, and she can back up a bit


----------



## arelyn

Happy birthday day Theo and happy half birthday Maev!

Is anyone struggling with a low supply? My milk seems to be drying up and , as he's teething, Kai is very displeased. It's a little better now that AF is done but Kai's still doing a lot of fussing at the breast; pinching, hitting, wiggling, requesting to switch sides (he's says "shwish") over and over and over. He just blew me away one day after repeted switching he stopped nursing and signed "more", then he pointed at the breast he had been nursing and signed "all done".









SO, here's what I've tried so far:
-taking a multi-vitamin
-drinking mama milk tea
-eating meat (pot roast, with leftovers spaced out over a week)
-drinking more water
-cutting caffiene
-deworming (needed to be done anyway and now I'm not starving all the time)

Is there anything else I can try or is this just my body's way of weaning Kai even though he's not ready?


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Is there anything else I can try or is this just my body's way of weaning Kai even though he's not ready?

Oatmeal is an easy thing to add if you don't already eat it regularly. If it were me, I would try to increase my supply in your case unless he was 2 or older (at which time I'd start being fine with C weaning because we want to TTC soon after). If you're interested in trying herbs or other supplements, I'd be happy to tell you what did and didn't work for us, just let me know.


----------



## PiePie

*arelyn*, we have been having lots of side switching, but i didn't take that as a sign of low supply. it is bleeping annoying though. i am confident in my supply -- i stopped pumping but did sneak in a session on inauguration day as nobody was doing any real work anyway -- i got 8 oz., which is huge. when i went back to work i started taking fenugreek because i was nervous i wouldn't produce enough for the pump. it help somewhat. i went off it when i got mastitis -- i guessed her nursing was slowing down but the fenugreek wasn't letting my milk supply adjust accordingly.


----------



## Maela

We also have lots of side switching! Dd says, "side!" I don't think I have supply issues; although the supply has decreased somewhat.

I have heard that supply can change and taste can change during AF.


----------



## Maela

Has the penny showed up yet, *Shanna*?


----------



## witchygrrl

I thought my supply was decreasing too, so I stepped up on the mother's milk tea. fenugreek and oatmeal also worked well for us. last night I was thankful for the supply increase as Rhea had her first fever...not fun







but she's herself again today.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Penny made an appearance after 60 hours. Everyone else in Fenton's world is relieved and thinks the story is over, but I'm really concerned about all of that copper and zinc in his system and what it does to the GI. The penny looks much duller than when it went in







Anyway, I can't find information on detoxing so I think I may start very dilute kombucha.

Fenton has also fallen in love with the power it gives him to request the other side when nursing. Except when he says it, it comes out "Oven side!" He's also just started getting attached to toys and wants to take them with him to bed, in the car, everywhere...He's attached to three (!) toys: a stuffed monkey, a small stuffed Elmo and a giant stuffed Elmo. All. In. Bed. With. Us.







He's also starting to say "cuddle Daddy" in the middle of the night when I tell him that I can't nurse him anymore because I'm tired or sore. And then he rolls over and cuddles Daddy.







He's just about sleeping through the night since we eliminated gluten. He's such a chatterbox, I love hearing what's been on his mind for 22 months.

A friend is miscarrying today







I feel so inadequate...


----------



## Maela

I haven't felt pg at all since my nipples stopped hurting a few days ago. Then today I got a serious feeling that I might be pg. I was almost positive. I jokingly asked Dh to pick up a HPT on his way home from a church meeting tonight. He did, but by the time he got home I didn't think I was pg anymore. I thought it was all in my head. But he made me take the test anyway because he had gone to all the trouble. And it was...










I still can't believe it. I'm excited, but I just can't believe it.
















Praying for a







!


----------



## katt

Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## AsYouWish

WOW!!!







: What wonderful news!! Congratulations!!!






























:


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Amazing maela! Congratulations! How does your dh feel? I am totally jealous.


----------



## Maela

Thanks for the congratulations! Dh is very happy and nervous. Someone told him not too long ago that the hardest years of parenting were from the moment your #2 was born until when your youngest turns 2yo. That makes sense to us (although I'm sure it's not that way for everyone). So we're both a little scared about what we've gotten ourselves into.







But we wanted a second at some point so we might as well do it now.


----------



## PiePie

OMG! Wow! I have felt so parallel with you for so long -- our DDs have been on the same track, more or less, it seems. Now you are embarking on a whole new path. Trailblazing for the rest of us! This means you got the first egg, right? (no AF) That would make you the second mama I know to have done so. Gulp.


----------



## PiePie

:







:







:


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, that's fantastic! Congrats!







:









AsYouWish, how are you doing/feeling??


----------



## arelyn

:CONGRATS!!!!!!!!







:

I'm so looking forward to having people to pregnancy stalk again. It was so much fun!

Oatmeal, I forgot about that one. DH got a bag of GF oatmeal so we'll give that a try


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela, that's wonderful!!!!! Congratulations!!!!!







:







:







:







:


----------



## Sihaya

Congratulation Maela! I had a feeling...









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Someone told him not too long ago that the hardest years of parenting were from the moment your #2 was born until when your youngest turns 2yo.

I sure hope not! That will be about 14 years for us!









Not doing very well here. Still haven't gotten a new car yet, DH's work is taking advantage of him in the worst way, and I am feeling isolated and alone and like everything is falling apart. It is sinking in that despite going to a lot of playgroups and having a lot of mama acquaintances, all of my community-building has been surface-level and I _still_ don't have anyone I can really lean on when things are rough


----------



## AsYouWish

Hey, witchygrrl, I'm doing okay. Thanks for asking!

Alright, that isn't the whole truth. Physically, I'm okay. I have low-level nausea throughout the day, and have thrown up a couple of times. And this week, severe headaches have been added to the mix, which I'm not so thrilled about, but it is manageable. I'm often really tired, but since I'm still unemployed I get to sleep a lot. I feel very, very fortunate in that regard!

Emotionally, I'm a wreck. I still cry every day about my mom. I miss her so much!! I feel like the rest of my family is coping and all, "She's at peace, so I'm at peace," and I'm still so angry that any of us ever had to go through that at all. My mother's life was stolen from her by the disease, and she was stolen from us, moment by creeping moment. I'm devastated that my child will never know her and vice-versa. I'm just not dealing well with any of it.

And I cry because I don't know what to do about my non-work situation, and if I should bother trying to find a job in this economy. I don't know if I'll make enough money to cover child care and still add something to our family income, and I'm sure I won't get much of a maternity leave. And I don't want to commit to a position/employer only to skip out on them when the baby comes. DP makes enough that we will be able to pay all of our bills every month and maybe even save a tiny bit, but there won't be much paying down of our debts or accumulating a down payment for a place of our own. Before I got pregnant, the plan was I would find a new job and, by dedicating all of my income to the debt and downpayment, we would meet our goals of being debt free and putting an offer on a condo/townhouse in two years. And now?? Not so sure how things are going to play out.

And now I cry because I have family drama subsequent to my pregnancy announcement. All of my family (dad, sisters, brothers-in-law, and other life partners, nieces & nephews & their spouses/partners if applicable, aunts and uncles, and cousins) were informed in mass by our email pregnancy announcement. The announcement itself was a children's book that I explained reminded me of mom and her relationship with her children and grandchildren. We made a few modifications to it by the old-fashioned cut and paste method and wrote in the names of each family member as characters in the book and included their birth month & year, and there was a last little label with a ? for the name and Aug. '09. We scanned all the pages and included a link where family could download the story as either a pdf or powerpoint slideshow. Everyone who I heard from personally, either by phone or email or in person, "got it" right away and loved it! Then my nephew's wife posted on my facebook wall, "are you pregnant?" and I freaked because a lot of our friends don't know yet, and DP and I have specific plans for how we are going to tell them. I don't want them finding out by reading someone else's message on my wall! So I deleted her post from my wall and sent her an email calling her on her mistake. I wasn't nasty about it, but I made it clear that this was a huge error and put our further announcement plans at risk. Then she never apologized or acknowledged her error or my hurt feelings, and then I received an email from my nephew, her husband, about how overboard I went and my attitude to her was uncalled for. Then I emailed back about how hurt I was, and tried to explain that outing someone's pregnancy or other personal news for them in public is a really big faux pas and I was so hurt that they didn't seem to care that niece-in-law possibly compromised our plans for surprising our friends with our news. And then last night my nephew/niece-in-law wrote back this horrible email. I mean, it was awful!! To the point where they are just being intentionally cruel!







: I don't know how to handle this at all, and I am just so devastated.

So that about sums it up. Right now, things feel more bad than good.







If you read all of that,







to you. Bet you are sorry you asked though, huh?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 







Congratulation Maela! I had a feeling...









I sure hope not! That will be about 14 years for us!









Not doing very well here. Still haven't gotten a new car yet, DH's work is taking advantage of him in the worst way, and I am feeling isolated and alone and like everything is falling apart. It is sinking in that despite going to a lot of playgroups and having a lot of mama acquaintances, all of my community-building has been surface-level and I _still_ don't have anyone I can really lean on when things are rough









I'm sorry you're feeling so lonely!







I hope things improve for you soon. I also have no one to lean on when things get rough. Everyone is either *a.)* someone who I love who I know loves me, BUT they don't parent the same way/have similar beliefs as I do; so I feel like I can't complain/get advice from them because they will tell me that I'm doing things wrong and this is what I need to do instead *OR b.)* someone who parents/has similar beliefs as I do, BUT we are not really true friends (yet?).
Often Dh is the only one I can really talk to about things; most of the time he will understand me or at least empathize with me without telling me what I should be doing, yk? That's all I want - a mother friend to talk to who understands me.
Sorry, I kind of turned that into a me thing....







I'm just saying I think I understand what you're going through.

*AsYouWish*, I'm so sorry you're having a rough time right now!














And that your nephew and his wife are being so insensitive. It must be really hard dealing with all of that right now.
And I don't think anyone is sorry that they asked, just sorry we didn't ask sooner! Feel free to come here and complain to us anytime!

Dh and I have not told anyone yet. We are going to wait another two weeks to tell his sister (who was pg with us last time, remember?) and then another two weeks after that to tell our parents, other siblings and friends. I want to get Dd a t-shirt that says "big sister" on it. That is how we're going to tell everyone who we see on a regular basis.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
OMG! Wow! I have felt so parallel with you for so long -- our DDs have been on the same track, more or less, it seems. Now you are embarking on a whole new path. Trailblazing for the rest of us! This means you got the first egg, right? (no AF) That would make you the second mama I know to have done so. Gulp.

Yes, you're right; no AF - first egg. Crazy, huh? It kind of scares me though; it just doesn't seem like it shloud be that easy, yk? Oh well, I'm calmer than I was last time. I don't want to worry unless I have reason to.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Congrats, Maela! So happy for you!!!


----------



## PiePie

*AsYouWish,* PMing you.


----------



## cking

Maela, that is wonderful!







:









I just peeked at your blog....I have to say, I am quite envious right now of both your choice of in-season produce and the ability to go to the park.







Ah, soon enough it'll be spring and DD will most likely be walking and more than ready for parks and playgrounds.....









Steph, I'm sorry you are feeling so isolated.







Hope it gets better for you soon!

AsYouWish, I'm sorry you are having a hard time.







It sounds like your nephew and his wife are quite childish. It stinks that you had to go through that at a time like this.







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Zoe, if you're lurking:
I seem to remember you mentioning going gluten-free for your pregnancy as a way to limit pain during childbirth. Can you send some info on this idea? I'm googling and can't find anything beyond pain associated with Celiac...


----------



## accountclosed3

The information about gluten free comes out of ayurveda--check out the Gentle Birth Method.

congrats to those heading into their second baby. whoosh! that's something! already?









had a funny experience with MIL that i had to share. recently, they've been upset with me because i am 'getting smart' with them. aside from my own assertion that the idea of 'getting smart' refers to a heirarchy which doesn't exist between us (ie, they are not an "authority" figure in my life), i was really frustrated when they asserted this because they don't listen. they disagreed.

but here is the hilarious story that lead to this assertion on their part. my MIL was carrying haw after yoga to the restaurant near-by where we would have lunch for my FIL's birthday. it was less than 1 block away. Hawk was awake from his nap and, as usual at this time, hungry. he'd been pottied and wanted his mother--if you recall, that's me! LOL

anyway, my MIL is carrying him and he's fussing a bit and i'm ok with that because i knew he'd get food soon enough. i tell her to start walking toward the restaurant while i locked the door of the yoga studio. my FIL and ryan were getting things into and out of the car (yoga gear in, gifts and cake--oh, and there was another cake drama wouldn't you know? LOL). my MIL stops on the side walk to ask me something and hawk sees me and starts SCREECHING and reaching for me. so, i walk over to them and put my arms out and say "i'll take him." i say it very calmly.

my MIL turns in a quarter circle away from me and says 'it's ok for him to cry!" and so i take a quarter-circle step and say "it's ok, but i'll take him now" again, kindly. and she does another quarter turn and says "it's ok for him to cry! he needs to love his grandma!" after three revolutions of this and him SCREECHING and leaning towards me each turn, i finally scream at her "LET HIM GO! GIVE HIM TO ME NOW!" and i grab him and pull him out of her arms and he immediately stops screaming and puts his head down on my shoulder with a big sigh.

ryan watched the end of this and was like "what the heck was that?" and then my FIL said that we have to be willing to let hawk learn to love them by letting him CIO in their arms so that he learns that they're safe.

look, i seriously don't know if it's the water that they drink, something that they smoke, or the fact that they don't eat after 8 pm, but honestly, they're completely bizarre.

so, i take him into the restaurant and feed him, to which my MIL reiterates that if i'd just give them a bottle of breast milk, they would be able to give him what he wants. ryan then asserts that what he wants is to be with his mother and that the breast is not just about food, but also about comfort, connection, and his right sense of place.

they decide that this is garbage and that we should basically respect them. then FIL tried to lecture me about "getting smart" which lead to my digression into how that phrase is inappropriately utilized on so many levels between us beginning with the fact that the terminology is typically used in heirarchical structures to denote a cheekiness or lack of respect for the 'authority'--which they are not--and then from there, how their apparent lack of listening skills and the overt assertion of their psychological desires and "neediness" is superceding their intellegence as well as hawk's and our own relationship and realities leads to my loss of patience such that i end up screaming at them in the street on more than one occasion.

i did admit to a short fuse, though, which i believe comes from the fact that my instinct to protect hawk from having to resort to deafening screeching in the hands of a pair of out-of-touch loonies outweighs any patience, rationality, or whatever other spiritual prowess or other emotional commodity i may have had in the past with them.

Essentially, i just want to bite their heads off whenever i see them because they're so f'ing greedy.

i swear, she STILL stares at me so intently when he eats. now he's doign this adorable thing where he touches my face when he eats.

ryan reminede me that his mother said on a number of occasions "i just want him to love me." she is so desparate for love. it's sad really.

i finally told her "it's not his job to love you, or to love me, or to love anyone. his only work is to grow, to be himself, and to live that authentically. an aspect of this is a great capacity for love, of course, but ultimately, it is our job to love him so that he can love himself, not so that he will love us."

yeah, she didn't get that and said that she simply wants him to love her. so i told her--then treat him well.

we've decided to discontinue visits from both sets of grandparents for a while.

my mother keeps saying how much hawk is like my sister and continually commenting about my weight (which, btw, is less than before i was pregnant, though my body composition is quite strange. i'll be interested to see what it's like post-lactation or when AF arrives...what those hormonal changes may do.). she either wants to maniacly clean my house or shop--both of which provide ample opportunity for her to complain about my lack (how filthy i live and how 'fat' i am--her two self-obcessions, btw, and therefore projections), and my father to bring up uber conservative politics while overstimulating hawk at every opportunity such that i end up with very fussy baby come evening-time.

yeah, it's time for the grandparents to give us some space, i think. poor ryan's having panic attacks before his parents come because of how they treat him before and after walking hawk for his nap, as well as how they handle hawk and speak to me (such that i then snap at them and then he has to defend that--he hates conflict!), and i have to emotionally gear up for the out-and-out projective shame-fest form my parents.

seriously, sun-thurs are quite nice. so, we're going to extend that into sat and sun. whew.

wrote a lot more than i thought. oh, and my parents also suggested that after my sister's wedding, i should surrogate for her because, you know, my body is proven and my sister has these health problems and "they want to start right away.'

so, not only is my son like my sister, i should also have my sister's babies for her so that she can be sure to have a healthy baby and be able to get into shape (she's currently 220 lbs, whereas when she is healthy she is about 145--this is emotional eating, btw, and not a health problem, though it has created health problems including fertility issues).

it's nuts over here.







so, we need a break from all grandparents.


----------



## katt

Zoe-
HUGS! I'm so Sorry you and Ryan have to deal with that. Don't you wish the ILs would realize that if they want him to love him they should respect and offer love to him and wait until he's old enough that his 'world' is wider then mom, then mom and dad etc... Just like a normal person.

AsYouWish- HUGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Maela

OMG zb that's is so crazy!! I would be so pissed! I've had my mom and MIL both say, "oh she's fine!" and turn away from me when dd was younger and crying and obviously wanted me, and I was fuming. I just calmly and firmly said "No she needs me". Luckily they then would turn back and give her to me. But if they had kept on turning I would have yelled too.







What is it with some people?! They had their chance to be parents!







It's YOUR turn to be the most important person in a child's life. As Hawk, gets older he'll want to be with his gparents more (at least that's how it was with Maev), but right now he's so young. Gparents seem to have such a hard time with that. My MIL would say so often when M was really young, "I just want her to know us." She will! Give her a chance; she's only a couple of months old! I hope I remember that when my kids have babies.

Sorry that made me so mad just reading it...


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah! that's totally the OTHER thing that they say. they say that they want him to know them. he definitely recognizes my parents, though he does spend more tiem with them and they are more respectful of us. . .but my ILs are here less frequently and are not very respectful of him.

and i agree, give him a chance, he's only 5 months old for goodness sakes!

but i did think the turning in circles thing was hilarious. how crazy must we have looked to anyone who might have seen? here's a woman holding a baby turning in circles away form the mother while both mother and baby are reaching for each other and the baby is screaming is poor little head off?

now, i chuckle. at the time, it was very frustrating.

and seriously, if you just take good care of him, he will love you. he's a very lovely fellow. LOL


----------



## witchygrrl

*AsYouWish*, I'm not sorry to have asked. I would have responded sooner, but Rhea continues to have a wicked cold, and has given it to me now too. Poor thing. Anyway, I'm sorry that things are going the way they are for you, but please feel free to vent here whenever you need. Many







from me.

*Zoe*, good lord! Yeah, I'd say you definitely need a break from the grandparents, especially the ILs. How the heck is screaming in her arms going to "teach" Hawk to love your MIL? That makes absiloutely no sense. I do kinda want to know about this latest cake drama, though.

My MIL has struck again, though she pales in comparison. We hadn't heard from them in days (which was kinda nice, actually--oops, did I say that?







), when we finally get a phone call last night. Apparently MIL's mother, who is 91, has been in the hospital with pneumonia since *Thursday*. Her reason--that we couldn't do anything about it, so therefore we didn't need to know. I shouldn't be surprised---gods forbid anyone say anything of actual importance to each other EVER. She asked me before we went to FL if my grandfather knew we were coming because we might not to have wanted to tell him because it would be too exciting for him. I said, no, we actually TELL him things. What a concept.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Thanks for the info, ZB. I'm curious about Fentons sensitivity to gluten, wondering how it might be affecting his teething pain. And HOLY COW, what a comeback post! I'm so sorry that your family is truly...wow.

It's funny, while I was reading your post and Maelas, I both thought the situations were insane, but also reflected some of what I see in even the most normal families (especially the "overstimulating" thing - why does everyone think that the way to get a kid to like them is to get in their face and shout at them to perform?) it also reminded me of my relationship with my Goddaughter before I had Fenton. She was mostly AP-ed, and I remember how frustrating it was for me to not get to have any relationship with her that wasn't mediated through her parents - they would never let me comfort her, didn't ever let me be alone in a room with her. At the time it felt like they didn't trust me and that they were helicopter parents. Now, as a parent that still values people having that with my own son, I see that I wanted that before it was developmentally appropriate. So, while I still think your family is insane







, I think there is a kernal there that can be in the most best-intentioned people.
I had the best NIP experience yesterday at church. I was working in the "little people" room, and we had a couple of girls that were newly attending, agest 5 1/2 and 8. Absolutely captivating kids. The younger one saw me nursing Fenton and came over to watch, getting really close to watch him. I've had a lot of kids do this before, and it's usually because they haven't seen a baby nurse before and they ask questions to that fact. I assumed that's what was going on until she told me that she used to have Nummies with her Mommy too. I was delighted that she knew this and asked her questions. Turned out that she weaned about 6 months ago, Mother-led, when her Mama told her that now that she was 5 she was a big girl and it was time for them to move forward in their relationship together. She talked about it with such fondness, telling me how big she was now, and how much she loved Nummies when she had them, that she loved being close to her mom and that they tasted so good, "like orange juice". It was really, really cool. And then she told Fenton how lucky he was to be having nummies, and that someday he'd be a big boy and would want something different.







Really, really cool.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I had the best NIP experience yesterday at church. I was working in the "little people" room, and we had a couple of girls that were newly attending, agest 5 1/2 and 8. Absolutely captivating kids. The younger one saw me nursing Fenton and came over to watch, getting really close to watch him. I've had a lot of kids do this before, and it's usually because they haven't seen a baby nurse before and they ask questions to that fact. I assumed that's what was going on until she told me that she used to have Nummies with her Mommy too. I was delighted that she knew this and asked her questions. Turned out that she weaned about 6 months ago, Mother-led, when her Mama told her that now that she was 5 she was a big girl and it was time for them to move forward in their relationship together. She talked about it with such fondness, telling me how big she was now, and how much she loved Nummies when she had them, that she loved being close to her mom and that they tasted so good, "like orange juice". It was really, really cool. And then she told Fenton how lucky he was to be having nummies, and that someday he'd be a big boy and would want something different.







Really, really cool.


awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I had the best NIP experience yesterday at church. I was working in the "little people" room, and we had a couple of girls that were newly attending, agest 5 1/2 and 8. Absolutely captivating kids. The younger one saw me nursing Fenton and came over to watch, getting really close to watch him. I've had a lot of kids do this before, and it's usually because they haven't seen a baby nurse before and they ask questions to that fact. I assumed that's what was going on until she told me that she used to have Nummies with her Mommy too. I was delighted that she knew this and asked her questions. Turned out that she weaned about 6 months ago, Mother-led, when her Mama told her that now that she was 5 she was a big girl and it was time for them to move forward in their relationship together. She talked about it with such fondness, telling me how big she was now, and how much she loved Nummies when she had them, that she loved being close to her mom and that they tasted so good, "like orange juice". It was really, really cool. And then she told Fenton how lucky he was to be having nummies, and that someday he'd be a big boy and would want something different.







Really, really cool.

That is so cool! And cute!

The worrying has begun. I had a temp dip this morning, and it scared me a little. Not a huge one, but not a small one. I was doing a good job of being calm and relaxed until today.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
The worrying has begun. I had a temp dip this morning, and it scared me a little. Not a huge one, but not a small one. I was doing a good job of being calm and relaxed until today.

I had a temp dip with Fenton - I can't remember how big, but enough that I worried.







. Today that "worry" wanted my help putting a diaper on his Kermit doll


----------



## cking

Wow, ZB, your ILs are wacky. I think a break is just what you need.

Shanna, that is such a cute story. Thanks for sharing it.









Maela,







I can understand your worry. But I think your temp was still pretty high - still well over your cover line.


----------



## Sihaya

*Shanna* -







: at your story.

*Maela* - I agree with Christina, I wouldn't worry until your temp dips below 98. Personally, I had to stop temping once I knew I was pg so I didn't drive myself crazy!

After reading about all the crazy in-laws some of you ladies are dealing with, I am so grateful for DH's family. There's still drama, but at least they are supportive and respectful.


----------



## Maela

Thanks for the encouragement about my temp today. I should probably stop taking it soon, so I don't think about it. Maybe in a few days







. Last time I stopped after 21dpo; I'll make myself stop then.

I just took a nice nap with Dd. Aaahh! Ever since I found out I was pg, I've been having official nap times with her. Sometime around noon, we go in her bedroom and I shut the door. I lie on her bed and doze, and she has the option of nursing/lying down with me, playing with her puzzles or reading her books. It's worked pretty well. Half the time she doesn't sleep, but at least I get mine!







I figure if I can create that good habit now, it'll be much easier when I'm further along in the pg.

She's still sleeping, so I'm going to go get some housework done finally...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

My 5 week old babe is living through some tough times. We're onto the second week of a shocking heatwave here (this week is all upwards of 40 celcius or 104 f) and now it looks as though he's TEETHING! His bottom 2 front teeth are breaking through. He's dribbling like a rabid dog and chewing on my boob and his hands chronically.

Poor boy. And poor mummies too.

I dream of air con. I think we'll take him to a shopping centre for a while when he wakes up!


----------



## PiePie

*Maela*, do you plan to nurse through pregnancy? not that you should have a plan about it at all...

having some pretty bad work anxiety on this end.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
My 5 week old babe is living through some tough times. We're onto the second week of a shocking heatwave here (this week is all upwards of 40 celcius or 104 f) and now it looks as though he's TEETHING! His bottom 2 front teeth are breaking through. He's dribbling like a rabid dog and chewing on my boob and his hands chronically.

Poor boy. And poor mummies too.

I dream of air con. I think we'll take him to a shopping centre for a while when he wakes up!

OMG he's teething?! Wow, poor baby! That is just crazy.
And, OMG no AC?! Our summers here are that hot and I can't imagine doing it without AC.







Most people have AC here. We're just wimps.








You're going to have a tough little guy there! I hope things cool down soon.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*Maela*, do you plan to nurse through pregnancy? not that you should have a plan about it at all...

having some pretty bad work anxiety on this end.

I don't know.







Right now my nipples are barely sore. Not like last pg. I plan on waiting until she's 2yo to decide whether I want to tandem nurse or not. I want to read _Adventures in Tandem Nursing_ and I want to see how attached she is to the boob at that age, and then I'll make a decision. I've never really thought that I could handle tandem nursing, but she's only going to be 26.5 months on my due date. I feel like that might be too young to expect her to be completely weaned by then.

I'm sorry you're having anxiety about work. What's going on?


----------



## Maela

My temp went back up. I'm going to quit charting today.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Holy crap - I have a child and suddenly I live under a rock - Iceland is _bankrupt_????

Maybe it's the fact that I've just read Ishmael, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration and The Dystopians article in the New Yorker this week....is anyone else finding that these events and voices are affecting them more than just in the theoretical? I'm getting the sense that worrying about whether our house will sell below what we paid for it is just polishing brass on the Titanic...

I have so much more to say and ask (and I'd love to talk about this more elegantly than the above), but I'm afraid duty calls in the form of "Kermit go potty".


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Zoe, if you're lurking:
I seem to remember you mentioning going gluten-free for your pregnancy as a way to limit pain during childbirth. Can you send some info on this idea? I'm googling and can't find anything beyond pain associated with Celiac...

I was GF and labor was miserable and long...though I don't have anything to compare it to. Maybe I'll do gluten with the next pregnancy and go GF when the LO is born.

Oh, it's official. DS had his first real gluten (he shared a pancake with my mom) and had the classic celiac reaction including radical behavoiral changes (if he were eating gluten all the time he'd totally be diagnosed ADHD). Maybe now my parents will finally believe me.


----------



## Holiztic

Yeah, Ishmael really got me, made me think of only having 2 kids, then listening to Sally Fallon talk about how we're all going to be infertile within a generation made me decide on 10 kids. Then I just stopped reading/listening and now I want 3 kids.

Re: Iceland: DH mentioned we should take a vacation there because it would be dirt cheap, and I asked "why?", and he told me the news. I live under a very big rock since having a kid. I got my news from chatting at work and from the news clips on commercial breaks. Now I don't work (out of the home, I mean) and watch 1 show (Top Chef) on DVR.

DH says I should check the news when I am online, but this is precious time that I would rather use on MDC, checking email, and looking for houses (we're about to buy one!!)

On that note, we are putting our condo on the market soon and will likely get a smidgeon more than we paid 4.5 years ago, even though we have thoroughly (I mean top to bottom) renovated it. Oh well, we should just barely break even after paying realtors, I guess it could be worse.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
DH says I should check the news when I am online, but this is precious time that I would rather use on MDC, checking email,

This is my problem exactly! I also didn't know about Iceland.









Reading _Ishmael_ in college changed my life. I'm not being dramatic here. Daniel Quinn's other books are really good too.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Oh, it's official. DS had his first real gluten (he shared a pancake with my mom) and had the classic celiac reaction including radical behavoiral changes (if he were eating gluten all the time he'd totally be diagnosed ADHD). Maybe now my parents will finally believe me.

Fenton is sensitive to gluten (sleeps horribly, gets a burning dipe rash and says his "tummy hurts"), but th allergy tests say negative so everyone treats us like lunatics for eliminating. So no. they won't finally believe you.







I'm sorry your fears on gluten were realized though







. I'm having great luck with this cookbook. And I'm even coming to think that maybe gluten isn't good for most people, and we're lucky to have such a decisive reason to limit it. The grapes really are sour







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Yeah, Ishmael really got me, made me think of only having 2 kids, then listening to Sally Fallon talk about how we're all going to be infertile within a generation made me decide on 10 kids. Then I just stopped reading/listening and now I want 3 kids.









Yeah, me too. And "Children of Men" didn't help either...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I guess it could be worse.

It's likely to be a lot worse for us. I haven't been able to post about all the tumult in our life lately, but basically DH has decided he wants to go on for a PhD after he finishes his MDiv in 2 years. And he wants us to use the "equity" in our house to supplement what will probably be an inadequate stipend. In a marketr where nothing is selling, let alone below market. Oh, and there's not a program in this state, so we'll have to move.







...








Anyway, I wonder if the whole civilization is going to collapse...puts a lot of my current concerns into prospective: Like affording our next BC birth, maybe I'll be squatting in a field while our chickens get looted. Seriously though, I am starting to feel some of that Y2K pull.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
This is my problem exactly! I also didn't know about Iceland.









Thanks, I feel a lot better. As Elizabeth said, I often don't even get to poop in privacy, so keeping up on the news....I wrote a long journal entry a few months ago about the stereotypes about mothers becoming distant from society while raising kids (oh, and stupid), and how I had just had to put aside The Brothers Karamazov because it was too heavy to hold one-handed while nursing.


----------



## PiePie

so effing pissed: red crayon all over pale yellow wall. i think the reason i'm pissed is that i know it's my fault.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i think the reason i'm pissed is that i know it's my fault.









That's when I get the maddest too.


----------



## ~Shanna~

2ww begins tomorrow







Which begs the question: What am I doing _here_????


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna,







:


----------



## Maela

Lots of














for Shanna!


----------



## witchygrrl

Rhea actually gave me a 6 hour stretch last night without waking me up to eat. Amazing!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Rhea actually gave me a 6 hour stretch last night without waking me up to eat. Amazing!

Oh I am so jealous!!

Dd is getting 3 molars _and_ her top two canines right now. So she's asking to nurse very often during the day and waking a lot at night. For some reason they seem to bother her the most between 2-4AM - she nurses almost constantly that whole time. So I'm a little tired. But we have been taking great naps together!


----------



## witchygrrl

That's a lot of teeth to come in at once. Yikes! I'm glad that you're getting those naps in with her though.

MMM, how's teething on your end?

Rhea STILL has no teeth. She's really into foolin', I think









Meanwhile, I have 3 cavities, and I really need to get those taken care of. Ugh.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Rhea actually gave me a 6 hour stretch last night without waking me up to eat. Amazing!









:

Fenton only _just_ started doing this consistently.







: for me!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Went to buy a small backpack for Fenton today - he wants to take 5 things with him everywhere he goes, so I had the brainstorm to get him a backpack as a natural limitor of how many things we can take....
Anyway, i could NOT afford the $30 + SH bags online that come sans characters, so we go to Target, hoping to find a cheap plain bag...and he falls in love with this.









You want to know the crazy thing? I have no idea where he even heard of Elmo. Not that none of his friends like it, and some of them watch network TV, but just: How does that get communicated between kids?There was nothing in our home or discussion that touched on Elmo, and suddenly he can spot him at 50 yards. Of course, he also thinks _anything_ red is Elmo: the red ladybug shaped colander at Target. The Santa pinata at the produce market...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Went to buy a small backpack for Fenton today - he wants to take 5 things with him everywhere he goes, so I had the brainstorm to get him a backpack as a natural limitor of how many things we can take....
Anyway, i could NOT afford the $30 + SH bags online that come sans characters, so we go to Target, hoping to find a cheap plain bag...and he falls in love with this.









You want to know the crazy thing? I have no idea where he even heard of Elmo. Not that none of his friends like it, and some of them watch network TV, but just: How does that get communicated between kids?There was nothing in our home or discussion that touched on Elmo, and suddenly he can spot him at 50 yards. Of course, he also thinks _anything_ red is Elmo: the red ladybug shaped colander at Target. The Santa pinata at the produce market...









So did you buy it? It is kind of cute.









Dd never knew who Elmo was either until recently when she got a shirt with him on it from my parents.


----------



## Holiztic

nak

q doesn't know any licensed characters--- we've been taking him to the kid section at barnes & noble to play with the train table. we call it train table (which q has been saying for a couple months) and he calls the pieces trains. even with EVERY other toddler saying "thomas" over and over, i was so happy he just kept saying train. last week a 2 year old just kept saying "thomas" over and over. you guessed it, for a week he called every train (including his plain ikea ones) thomas







: thank goodness he is now back to "train"


----------



## PiePie

i think the only licensed character dd would recognize is pooh. because we received a pooh puppet that she has loved since she was very young. no lovey yet though. curious about that the lovey will be. *liz*, i am finally reading that endangered minds book you recommended ages ago.


----------



## cking

:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Holy crap - I have a child and suddenly I live under a rock - Iceland is _bankrupt_????

Maybe it's the fact that I've just read Ishmael, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration and The Dystopians article in the New Yorker this week....is anyone else finding that these events and voices are affecting them more than just in the theoretical? I'm getting the sense that worrying about whether our house will sell below what we paid for it is just polishing brass on the Titanic...

I have so much more to say and ask (and I'd love to talk about this more elegantly than the above), but I'm afraid duty calls in the form of "Kermit go potty".


Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
It's likely to be a lot worse for us. I haven't been able to post about all the tumult in our life lately, but basically DH has decided he wants to go on for a PhD after he finishes his MDiv in 2 years. And he wants us to use the "equity" in our house to supplement what will probably be an inadequate stipend. In a marketr where nothing is selling, let alone below market. Oh, and there's not a program in this state, so we'll have to move.







...








Anyway, I wonder if the whole civilization is going to collapse...puts a lot of my current concerns into prospective: Like affording our next BC birth, maybe I'll be squatting in a field while our chickens get looted. Seriously though, I am starting to feel some of that Y2K pull.

Thanks, I feel a lot better. As Elizabeth said, I often don't even get to poop in privacy, so keeping up on the news....I wrote a long journal entry a few months ago about the stereotypes about mothers becoming distant from society while raising kids (oh, and stupid), and how I had just had to put aside The Brothers Karamazov because it was too heavy to hold one-handed while nursing.

I'd love to talk more about this....but for some reason I haven't been able to put together an intelligible post in recent months....I wonder why.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Went to buy a small backpack for Fenton today - he wants to take 5 things with him everywhere he goes, so I had the brainstorm to get him a backpack as a natural limitor of how many things we can take....
Anyway, i could NOT afford the $30 + SH bags online that come sans characters, so we go to Target, hoping to find a cheap plain bag...and he falls in love with this.









You want to know the crazy thing? I have no idea where he even heard of Elmo. Not that none of his friends like it, and some of them watch network TV, but just: How does that get communicated between kids?There was nothing in our home or discussion that touched on Elmo, and suddenly he can spot him at 50 yards. Of course, he also thinks _anything_ red is Elmo: the red ladybug shaped colander at Target. The Santa pinata at the produce market...









Yeah, I've heard that could happen.









I'm still hoping to at least make it to J's first birthday without licensed characters. There are a few here, but she hasn't really caught on. But of course, the one day that DH stayed home sick from work, he turned on Sesame Street. And she loved it....
















MMM and Maela, so sorry about your teething issues! That is so hard.









J is working on some teeth now...I'm pretty sure it's her lateral incisors, but her pain and fussiness seem to be disproportional for those teeth. Did anyone's LO get other teeth at the same time? She has the front 4 so far.


----------



## ~Shanna~

We had a horrible evening last night. My sister's church youth group was doing a fundraiser where they offered babysitting at their church for $7 per kid. Since Fenton often stays with my sister and his cousins, and they were going to be there, we thought it would be a great chance to get out. I felt a little uneasy as we were leaving him because it was a different environment. I told my sister where we were going for dinner and just as we were finishing up dinner and getting dessert to go, we hear our names being paged. I literally thought I was going to throw up, imagining Fenton having felt upset and abandoned in this new place. We raced back, 30 minutes across town, and found him crying that cry that comes after one has been crying for a long, long time. She said he was mostly "fussy intermittently", but had been "really upset" for the past 45 minutes, since just before she called us. I felt awful - we've never left him where we didn't return to find him happily engaged, he's never cried when we left him... Now I don't know whether my gut was telling me not to leave him, or if it was more the factors aligning perfectly. I still feel sick imagining him feeling abandoned.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 







So did you buy it?

We did. After determining that we were in more a Target price range rather than an LL Bean one, I couldn't not let him choose what he wanted. Especially when the plain ones at Target were impossible for him to open himself. A struggle waged in my mind of AP purity versus letting him have a choice when he clearly had one, and we went with encouraging his choice. It was much easier once I realized how much my pride is often wound up in these things. Still, I felt sadness, seeing in concrete terms my son being appropriated. I don't know how to walk that line and still preserve how important community and free-will is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
J is working on some teeth now...I'm pretty sure it's her lateral incisors, but her pain and fussiness seem to be disproportional for those teeth. Did anyone's LO get other teeth at the same time? She has the front 4 so far.

The incisors were really rough dfor us, and many other parents I know. Any chance it's food sensitivity? _So_ hard to sort that out when they're teething







. If you give meds, does it seem to help her? That can be a clue - we started to suspect something else was up when Motrin didn't help Fenton's pain. I'm embarrassed to say, however, how much we tried Motrin before nailing that down though. So if it can help you...

So I have two recommendations I have to share. Fenton got this for Christmas and it is the most loved toy I have ever seen, bar none. Fenton seems to have a particular love of music, but it's been _really_ popular with every child that has come over. And we got him this book for Christmas - I thought it was going to be one of those things we got him because _we_ liked its "values" so much, but it turns out he loves it. She does an awesome job of showing what diverse environments babies can be loved in, and she doesn't make a big deal out of the diversity.

Gotta go, I'm making Coney sauce tonight for our indoor roasting of hotdogs over a fire







I'll let you know how that goes with a Toddler








. Thanks for listening about my night last night. No one else besides DH seems to see what I was so upset about.


----------



## katt

hi all!!

Shanna-I wouldn't worry too much about Elmo. I try and avoid characters as well, but Teo knows Mo-mo cause our friends have a few stuffed/talking elmos. But, it was an AP choice on your part cause you allowed him to have a say and make the decision, you listened to what he wanted and didn't force your own values on him.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna*...so sorry to hear your distress. I completely understand where you're coming from here. It surprises me that others in your life don't.

We had our first very successful night out without Squeak on Friday and it went way better than I anticipated. My sis babysat at her place and they had a ball. Apparently they danced and sang and bounced in the bouncy seat. She assures me that there was no screaming and only a few grizzles.

I did really well too with much less anxiety than I anticipated and no tears either. And Ani was awesome (PiePie - you asked on facebook...). The minute she came on stage I was thrilled and knew I'd made the right decision. It felt very poignant that she spoke lots about motherhood and sang those couple of songs about her daughter.

re: teething. I feel a bit silly about that - apparently he's not teething, it's just his teeth have started moving up and down. All normal and only slightly early. It could still be months before any teeth actually break through though which is a great relief.

I'm sick with an achy body, exhaustian and a sore gut. It's hot and Squeak is off colour too and has been nursing almost constantly all afternoon and night. It's been such hard work but now that he's finally down for the night I feel more positive. I was really getting myself in a stir and questioning my ability to parent in all conditions. This mothering gig really is relentless and tough.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
hi all!!

Shanna-I wouldn't worry too much about Elmo. I try and avoid characters as well, but Teo knows Mo-mo cause our friends have a few stuffed/talking elmos. But, it was an AP choice on your part cause you allowed him to have a say and make the decision, you listened to what he wanted and didn't force your own values on him.

She's right. Allowing him free choice is a very AP thing to do. I'm pretty sure I'd have a hard time doing it though - especially if Barbie was part of the picture!


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*, I'm so sorry to hear about Fenton's rough time with the babysitter! I don't think what you were feeling was unreasonable at all. I would have been upset too.

I hate the thought of Dd crying like that. We have tried a couple of times to leave her in the church nursery, and I told them to bring her to me as soon as she starts crying. Both times they waited until she was crying really hard - like sobbing with that hiccup







- to bring her to me.







: They are really nice people just trying to help, but







:. So now Dh and I take turns staying with Dd in the nursery and we will continue to do so until she's comfortable there. Luckily, she loves being with both of our parents...

*Shanna*, I also think you made the right decision about the backpack.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Shanna*, I'm so sorry to hear about Fenton's rough time with the babysitter! I don't think what you were feeling was unreasonable at all. I would have been upset too.

I hate the thought of Dd crying like that. We have tried a couple of times to leave her in the church nursery, and I told them to bring her to me as soon as she starts crying. Both times they waited until she was crying really hard - like sobbing with that hiccup







- to bring her to me.







: They are really nice people just trying to help, but







:. So now Dh and I take turns staying with Dd in the nursery and we will continue to do so until she's comfortable there. Luckily, she loves being with both of our parents...

We are hoping to try Q in the church nursery soon. DH keeps putting it off, but I am insisting soon! I finally quit the gym after a year of paying without going (one and only reason:not leaving Q in the nursery! I LOVE working out, so I am bummed! Planning on building a home gym when we get a house, though)


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 

I did really well too with much less anxiety than I anticipated and no tears either. And Ani was awesome (PiePie - you asked on facebook...). The minute she came on stage I was thrilled and knew I'd made the right decision. It felt very poignant that she spoke lots about motherhood and sang those couple of songs about her daughter.

re: teething. I feel a bit silly about that - apparently he's not teething, it's just his teeth have started moving up and down. All normal and only slightly early. It could still be months before any teeth actually break through though which is a great relief.


my first night out without dd was to see an ani concert, remember? dh watched her so it wasn't quite the same as your sitch.

dd started that (i call it teething) at 3 mos. and didn't get teeth till 9 mos. that was by far the worst of it. knock wood.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, i would have made the same choice re elmo -- i think it is the ap thing to do but not the nfl thing to do, and when they conflict i tend to go with ap. i confess i would not have been ap had barbie or bratz been in the mix!


----------



## accountclosed3

we still haven't had a night out without hawk. i think i just can't stand it. that, and the boy likes to nurse and i don't want him using a bottle . is that wrong of me? everyone keeps saying "oh, just drop him off here for a few hours." and i'm like, he's only a baby once and why can't i enjoy it?

well, this has been our first weekend sans grandparents and it's been nice save for the fact that my mom is completely ticked off and called every day wednesday through today. my mil was only upset that ryan didn't tell her until friday (even though i told him every day last week to call her and tell her early), and she was upset about that because fil always has the opportunity to work on saturdays.

but, on the plus side, ryan's secondary symptoms related to anxiety are way down, and so he's feeling better overall. we've decided to go ahead and go grandparent-less until my sister's wedding, and then see from there what we want to do.

my mom and i have started planning the garden for our little condo. there's not a lot of space--i would say about 4 x 10 ft in front of the sliding door, and then we're jsut going to "steal" a little bit of space from the condo association. i called them to ask to have a few plants removed. right in front of our front window, to the left of the door (if you're facing the door) is this horrid, low-lying, prickley juniper bush. it's blech. and, they're tough to remove. so the association is going to remove it for us, as well as three other bushes which they say would be easier to kill than to give away. sad really, i hate killing healthy plants. oh, and a bit to turf to dig up too.

so, i have three main areas. the one where the juniper is, that's probably 10 x 10 square, all southern facing and LOTS of sun. i'm thinking raised beds with nice river-rock sized gravel around them. plantings of herbs and veggies. four squares with their own water catch/slow-release pots, and perhaps a large herb pot in the center. in front of the house, by the porch, i thought i'd make that his little play area--i hvaen't figured that out yet... and then the side-yard...i'm thinking a little curving path and an overall bird friendly garden...a little cottage garden perhaps with a small "banging wall" or at least my wind-chime turned xylophone in that part.

whew! so, my mom is helping me with the design and while i mentioned it to my mil (who loves to garden, but hates to garden. she does all things because she should), i really don't want their help because their timeline and my timeline are different. whereas, my mother will come each friday and do crazy things like pull up sod and condition soil and get things organized as well as help with planting. my dad would help also, and hold the baby while mom and i worked. my MIL would mostly make my crazy while my FIL would criticize how i did things (according to him, i never "do things right" i just "don't put the effort in." but he's a perfectionist and i don't care for his style. i like things a bit haphazard, messy, and what have you--particularly in garden spaces. where i don't, i hire a pro. you know, like if i redid my kitchen. and besides, if he made the sand box, it wouldn't be ready until sometime in 2011 or something).

sounds like things are going along nicely with most of ya'll. that's exciting!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
we still haven't had a night out without hawk. i think i just can't stand it. that, and the boy likes to nurse and i don't want him using a bottle . is that wrong of me? everyone keeps saying "oh, just drop him off here for a few hours." and i'm like, he's only a baby once and why can't i enjoy it?

Well, Quinn is almost 22 month and he has never had a bottle. The first time he was away from me for longer than 2 hours was well after starting solids (so after 1) and even still he has only been away from me for 2+ hours a handful of times. This is as much about my wants as his, for those that want to go out and give baby some time with the grandparents/aunt/etc I think babe will be just fine, but I simply never wanted to!

Now that Q is getting older and getting so attached to the grandparents, we are playing more with leaving him for a few hours at a time (mostly daytime, working around naps). We have still not gone out at night since the company christmas party, but want to try again soon. I don't expect he'll go to bed with me gone until he weans at the earliest.


----------



## PiePie

http://niemann.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/02/i-lego-ny/


----------



## ~Shanna~

Many, I just blew up my 3rd crock pot in as many months. I apparently use them more than they're designed for. I'm disappointed because I really had streamlined what I do in the kitchen with as few gadgets as possible, and now I need to figure out what other crap I'll need to get done what I need to get done. Bummer.

Hey Maela, I haven't heard you mention where things are at with becoming a LLL leader - is this on hold due to the baby, or are you still hoping to do this soon?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*shanna*, i would have made the same choice re elmo -- i think it is the ap thing to do but not the nfl thing to do, and when they conflict i tend to go with ap. i confess i would not have been ap had barbie or bratz been in the mix!

That's a really interesting point, I hadn't thought about the difference between AP and NFL. It reminds me of all the discussions DH and I have been having about cosleeping since we've both come to believe that it's actually safer for the baby to cosleep (if you remember, this is a 180 degree turn around for us). Anyway, our discussion was about how we would handle it if a LO slept better on their own - before Fenton, that was my ideal and now I'm finding that I'd have a tough time letting them do that even if I saw that they slept "better". Anyway, thanks for giving that a name for me.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
we still haven't had a night out without hawk. i think i just can't stand it. that, and the boy likes to nurse and i don't want him using a bottle . is that wrong of me? everyone keeps saying "oh, just drop him off here for a few hours." and i'm like, he's only a baby once and why can't i enjoy it?

I _sooo_ felt this way too. When we were having nursing issues, I couldn't even stand to watch DH finger-feed Fenton. Still chokes me up to this day.







But yeah, I remember being at a LLL meeting meeting, back before we were even TTC, and hearing the rather militant AP leader (in her 50s, by the way) try to convince all the new mamas that they didn't need time away from their LO. Even then I thought that if a Mama thinks she does, then she does. If she thinks she doesn't, then she doesn't. Interesting how we get it on both sides trying to make us feel guilty for our choices.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Well, Quinn is almost 22 month and he has never had a bottle. The first time he was away from me for longer than 2 hours was well after starting solids (so after 1) and even still he has only been away from me for 2+ hours a handful of times. This is as much about my wants as his, for those that want to go out and give baby some time with the grandparents/aunt/etc I think babe will be just fine, but I simply never wanted to!

Now that Q is getting older and getting so attached to the grandparents, we are playing more with leaving him for a few hours at a time (mostly daytime, working around naps). We have still not gone out at night since the company christmas party, but want to try again soon. I don't expect he'll go to bed with me gone until he weans at the earliest.

We just had another tough time leaving Fenton last night. My mom and I went to go see Revolutionary Road ( I love me some Kate Winslet). I didn't worry at all, even after Friday's debacle, because he's done so well with his cousins and Aunt at their house. But he had a tough time. I don't know if he's remembering how he felt on Friday, or if he's really starting to feel differently about being without us. We're pulling back from a few plans we had to leave him over the next month - I'll be curious to see how it goes when he's with his Grand parents next Wednesday - if that doesn't go well, we may pull back entirely for a while. Just when I think I have this game figured out....


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Really interesting discussion on when and if we leave our kids. Those of you who waited - I think you must be blessed with some kind of saintly gene. Despite feeling like 6 weeks was a bit early, I realise now how ready I was and now that I've had some time out, I want more! In fact, Sebby just thwarted my plans to have an hour out while my sister wore him while she did her grocery shopping...the boy sure knows how to pick his moments to lose the plot!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
hi all!!

Shanna-I wouldn't worry too much about Elmo. I try and avoid characters as well, but Teo knows Mo-mo cause our friends have a few stuffed/talking elmos. But, it was an AP choice on your part cause you allowed him to have a say and make the decision, you listened to what he wanted and didn't force your own values on him.

ITA.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 

re: teething. I feel a bit silly about that - apparently he's not teething, it's just his teeth have started moving up and down. All normal and only slightly early. It could still be months before any teeth actually break through though which is a great relief.


DD started drooling right at six weeks, and I consider that when she started teething. It was 3 months later before her first teeth came in...but it seems to be an avg of 3 months for each set of teeth so far.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

The incisors were really rough dfor us, and many other parents I know. Any chance it's food sensitivity? _So_ hard to sort that out when they're teething







. If you give meds, does it seem to help her? That can be a clue - we started to suspect something else was up when Motrin didn't help Fenton's pain. I'm embarrassed to say, however, how much we tried Motrin before nailing that down though. So if it can help you...


She does respond well to the homeopathics (chamomilla) that we give her. At least, she likes taking them.







I'm thinking maybe the new tooth is pushing on her front tooth a bit, and causing some extra pain. Not sure. But she has been getting very restless at night.

That drum looks like so much fun!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shanna*
I sooo felt this way too. When we were having nursing issues, I couldn't even stand to watch DH finger-feed Fenton. Still chokes me up to this day. But yeah, I remember being at a LLL meeting meeting, back before we were even TTC, and hearing the rather militant AP leader (in her 50s, by the way) try to convince all the new mamas that they didn't need time away from their LO. Even then I thought that if a Mama thinks she does, then she does. If she thinks she doesn't, then she doesn't. Interesting how we get it on both sides trying to make us feel guilty for our choices.

Good point. I think I took it at my own pace. I felt a lot easier about it once she was a bit older and I saw that she was ok waiting a little while to nurse. But it wouldn't have been relaxing for me to go out without her any earlier than that.


----------



## Holiztic

So much for the whole "Daddy's little tax deduction" thing.

Our kid is not even 2 and we have already lost our child tax credit and actually OWE taxes for the first time ever! I am certainly not going to complain about making "too much" money nor am I going to suddenly become a Republican to try to lower our tax burden, but I sure am bummed!

So in many parts of the country, $110k a year for a married couple--which is where the deduction cuts off--isn't all that much, why the heck can't we deduct for our kids??

Thank you for listening to my rant.


----------



## Maela

Wow, the cut off is 110k? We won't pass that for a VERY long time - probably never.









I'm sorry you're having to pay though, that stinks! I had to pay once too. It's not fun; especially if you're counting on getting some money during tax season.

Shanna, I'm working on becoming an LLL leader right now. I was planning on it taking me about six months (there's a lot of writing and reading involved) which would mean I'd be done by June, but now that I'm pg I'm not sure. Especially if I get morning sickness like last time. I think my new goal is going to be to have it done by the birth, cause I don't think there's any way I'm going to get anything accomplished that first year.







Luckily, I'm going to be a co-leader with three other women (at least for a while), so I won't have to do everything myself.


----------



## Maela

Ugh, I spent 2 hours making a really yummy onion soup, and in the end I burned it.














Our oven and stove cook everything too fast too much. So I have to learn that I can't rely on what the recipes say. I really need to start tasting my food and checking it more often.







Yes, I am just now in the past year learning how to cook...

So we ended up getting Taco Bell...







: I know, I know...


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
http://niemann.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/02/i-lego-ny/

this was awesome. thanks.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I think my new goal is going to be to have it done by the birth, cause I don't think there's any way I'm going to get anything accomplished that first year.









That reminds me....does it seem to any one else that a year as a mother goes by much faster than it ever did before?









speaking of a year - Snozz, are you out there? Any plans for Abby's birthday?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
That reminds me....does it seem to any one else that a year as a mother goes by much faster than it ever did before?









It didn't go by fast for me at the time.







But now that I'm six months past it, it seems like it went by fast.









I think I'm feeling my first little bit of morning sickness this morning.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I think I'm feeling my first little bit of morning sickness this morning.


























Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
So much for the whole "Daddy's little tax deduction" thing.

Our kid is not even 2 and we have already lost our child tax credit and actually OWE taxes for the first time ever!

I have my knickers in a twist again over the whole "you have to spend 7.5% of your income on medical expenses before you can deduct any". I look at all the debate going on in this country about universal health care, and then I'm confronted with this law that seems they went way out of their way to be unreasonable and inconsistent.

I remember the first time we had to pay in for taxes







. What an end to an era - I used to finance my Spring Break plans with tax money. That was when I started waiting to send my return in on April 15th rather than sending it in on February 1st


----------



## Holiztic

Yeah, when we thought we would get a refund we were chomping at the bit to get all our 1098s and file ASAP. Then last night, as turbo tax still had us in the red with only a few charitable contributions to go (and it was obvious we were going to owe) I said "maybe you should just save this and we'll get back to it in a couple of months."

So if getting a refund is like lending the gvt money tax free, then is owing like getting a free loan? I guess we pulled one over on Uncle Sam, huh? (Okay, gotta look at it with some kind of silver lining!)

I told DH this was an odd year for us, big pay increase from last year but while still in a "small" mortgage. Now that we are buying a single family house and our mortgage interest will double, I guess we might go back to getting a refund (if we don't change our elections).


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Ugh, I spent 2 hours making a really yummy onion soup, and in the end I burned it.














Our oven and stove cook everything too fast too much. So I have to learn that I can't rely on what the recipes say. I really need to start tasting my food and checking it more often.







Yes, I am just now in the past year learning how to cook...

I just started learning to cook this fall, Maela, so you aren't alone. So far I've burnt a chicken carcass into ash trying to make stock, ruined Roasted Chickpeas twice, put a meal in the crock-pot but never turned it on, and put a meal in the oven but forgot to turn it on. I get so angry when I do something like that and I just want to say forget it and let DH cook or do Dream Dinners for the rest of my life. But, slowly, I'm getting better and not making as many silly mistakes. I'm sure you are, too!


----------



## arelyn

The scariest thing happened yesterday. Kai was helping me scrub the toilet (he loves the toilet brush so I let him help) and when he was done I thought he walked into the kitchen. Instead he walked behind me, opened the cabinet (since I took off the baby lock), and took out the bottle of Kaboom cleaner that came with the house. I turned around just in time to see him spray it in his mouth and it wasn't the first squirt as he already had bubbles on his lip and cheek. I was mortified!!! I still feel sick when I think about it. I flushed out his mouth and face and had him drink water and went down the street to the medical clinic (the bottle said give water and seek medical help). They soon discovered that the poison control phone number wasn't where they or I thought it would be in the phone book so they sent us to the nearest hospital two towns over. We were almost there when we realized that Kai was fine. He was happy as a lark pretending to drive. We decided to stop by the library, a couple blocks from the hospital, to see if they had the number for poison control. They did and it turns out it's really acidic but otherwise "harmless" so long as it's not aspirated so no need to go to the emergency room. Just keep drinking plenty of water and avoid acidic foods.

Kai is pretty ok today. He had a little cold the past few days and it's out of control today (I couldn't give him his Vit C yesterday or today). The poor guy is drowning in phlem, has some scary diarrhea (so glad we EC), and is super sensitive. Any ideas on how to help Kai's poor tummy get back to normal?


----------



## Maela

Arelyn, no advice here, but that is scary. I'm glad to hear he's okay though.







s to you and Kai.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Scary scary Arelyn. Glad Kai is just fine!

Sebby is throwing a few challenges at us at the moment. Yesterday he was really hard work and didn't sleep for more than a 15minute stretch all day. He was in a foul mood by the end of the day. Consequently, he was out for the night by 7pm which I was nervous about, and rightly so. He slept soundly until 11 and then was awake every hour until I finally gave in and got up with him at 5.30. It's 8.15am now and he's fast asleep in the wrap and I'm daring not move for fear of waking him. Meanwhile, I'm exhausted. Seems like he's going through something developmental...do you think?

My little tax deduction is earning us $950 as part of our 2nd economic stimulus package (we didn't get anything in the first pkg) and I'm also getting another $950 based on my low income. DP gets $950 too! THat's almost 3 grand for us...which is lucky...

because WE HAVE TO MOVE!!! grrrr.

The owner has decided to sell our house afterall. Apparently he owns a stack of properties but has chosen ours to cull in order to safely ride out the economic downturn. The house is being auctioned in March but fortunately the new owners can't kick us out until our lease expires in June. There's a small possibility that the new owners will buy the house as an investment and we can stay but there's not much investment going on in this economy so I'm not holding my breath.

Where's my rich benefactor? All we need is about $80,000 for a deposit. The rent we pay is about the same as mortgage repayments so we'd be covered from that angle...

I'm tired.


----------



## PiePie

shanna: movie rec: across the universe


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I just started learning to cook this fall, Maela, so you aren't alone. So far I've burnt a chicken carcass into ash trying to make stock, ruined Roasted Chickpeas twice, put a meal in the crock-pot but never turned it on, and put a meal in the oven but forgot to turn it on. I get so angry when I do something like that and I just want to say forget it and let DH cook or do Dream Dinners for the rest of my life. But, slowly, I'm getting better and not making as many silly mistakes. I'm sure you are, too!









I have gotten a lot better already.







What are Dream Dinners?

*MMM*, I'm sorry you didn't get much sleep. I hope tonight is much better for you two.









I'm going to go ahead and say it out loud to make it official, even though it may jinx me: Dd has been taking regular ~2hr naps every day at around noon for 9 days in a row now!!







: And it's taking me <45min to put her to sleep at night now.







:
I really hope I didn't mess this up by saying it out loud.







: This is perfect timing considering I am pg now. I think I would have gone crazy if she had continued her no nap/late nap and bedtime thing.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I have gotten a lot better already.







What are Dream Dinners?

You go there and assemble frozen meals. They have all the ingredients cut up and ready and you just put the meals together. We did it first for freezer meals for the first couple of months postpartum and we just went back last week and made a few just in case. There are several other similar businesses if there aren't any Dream Dinners around you - Super Suppers, Dinner's Ready, etc.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
You go there and assemble frozen meals. They have all the ingredients cut up and ready and you just put the meals together. We did it first for freezer meals for the first couple of months postpartum and we just went back last week and made a few just in case. There are several other similar businesses if there aren't any Dream Dinners around you - Super Suppers, Dinner's Ready, etc.

Oh yeah we have something like that here. my MIL gave me a gift certificate for it before dd was born. It was really helpful! But expensive.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
You go there and assemble frozen meals. They have all the ingredients cut up and ready and you just put the meals together. We did it first for freezer meals for the first couple of months postpartum and we just went back last week and made a few just in case. There are several other similar businesses if there aren't any Dream Dinners around you - Super Suppers, Dinner's Ready, etc.


we have a DreamDinners down the road from us--haven't tried, but they usually send coupons for specials...i.e. so many meals for $50.

the ILs are coming this weekend. Give me strength.


----------



## accountclosed3

it's so great reading about everyone's successes!









around here, we are happy campers. ryan and i had such great talks this week while he was on vacation. he's getting rest, meditating more, and spending a lot of time with hawk such that, at one point, he snapped at me "i know how to parent my child!" we have come over the mountain, ladies! before, it was always "what do i do?" and "will you take him, he's fussy!" and now it's like "back off, i'll parent him!" so cool!

work is also going SO well. i started a $5 class and i already have 15 regulars in 5 weeks. LOL it's awesome and growing! my other classes are also growing, i average $90 per class now. teacher training shrank down to the essential 5 that started (it had ballooned up to 10 at one point), and now i'm adding the 3 hr class once per month into the schedule. i'm probably going to switch out the thursday morning for the once-per-month 3-hr class!

the reason for switching out the thursday am (which has grown to 10 regulars though we still may be on new years resolutions, though typically by now, those folks are long gone unless they really like it!) is because i might be caring for jamie bella in a month or so. we're going to do some dry-runs in the next two weeks. my friend might be starting her job at the beginning or middle of march--we're not sure. Jamie will be 3 months, hawk about 6.

so, i'd be at home with two little ones all day. can i handle it? i don't know--but my friend said "you're very creative. if you want it to work, you'll find a way!" that was sweet of her.







everyone else (my mother mostly) is saying that i shouldn't and can't do it anyway. but, she doesn't like groups of children. LOL

anyway, because i like to get out of the house, not only will i walk with them (likely a twin wrap carry), but i'm thinking of offering a by-donation family yoga class in my neighborhood club house. i know that there are other mamas in the neighborhood (some went to my yoga classes at the Y), and i can take both jamie and hawk to this and teach with them there. it has to be by donation because the club house can't be used for profit, and i thought i'd give the donations to the local food pantry because it's hard hit right now and that goes directly to local families! when i called the association, they seemed thrilled at this idea.

so, it also looks like i'll finally have a garden come spring! my parents, ILs, jamie's parents, and my friend patty and her son zack will come over and we're going to pull out some nasty plants, and then get everything together such as conditioning the soil and what not. looks like it might be two saturday afternoons of work with all of us. the guys will tackle getting the nasty juniper out and drawing out three other bushes; while the ladies are going to pass around babies while getting the beds ready and the gravel laid out. then, the next saturday we'll put in the fixtures (sand box, fountain, bird feeders/houses, etc) and possibly the plants if we're past the frost!

i am so psyched about both 1. having a garden and 2. having friends and family help to build it!









and then--and this is really cool--it looks like some investments that ryan's parents made when he was 2 or something are going to have nice dividends this year. on the advice of our financial dude, we are putting 1/3 of it into CDs for 9 months. it's set aside to pay taxes, but we'll also get a high dividend on it too to roll over into mutual funds or whatever. then, he recommends that we take 1/3 of it and pay off as much school debt as we can. that 1/3 of that income will cover about 1/3 of (my) school debt and all the rest of ryan's (which is about $1k), and then take the final 1/3 to redo the stuff in our house that needs re-doing (eg, our house is 10 yrs old and needs a new water heater; also, we want a new stove/oven as ours is currently unpredictable so far as temps go). and then invest whatever is left in mutual funds.

i feel SO blessed that in an economy that is tough, we are doing so well financially that we can do these amazing things (and build the economy through it). we are really, really blessed!









ok, the baby is upset because ryan let him suck on the apple and then took it from him. LOL


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

It's kind of like hell here at the moment. Saturday was our hottest day on record (46.4c) and with it brought horrific bushfires that have burned half the state, killed over 100ppl and destroyed hundreds, maybe thousands of homes. We've lost one of our sources of income but that's incidental compared to the real tragedy.

DP's parents are currently trapped on their property with fire on all sides and all roads closed. They have no electricity, no phone reception and very little water left. They tried to leave on Saturday but the roads were already closed. We're very scared. Poor DS has had to deal with such intensity in heat and in emotion and is pretty highly strung right now. Our content little soul is not so content right now. I'm trying hard to put all my energy into calm for him.


----------



## PiePie

*Mujerista*, oh no! I was going to ask you how you were with the heat (heard about the fires on the radio) but didn't imagine it would be that bad.

very upsetting convo with my parents. will write about it later. but







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*Mujerista*, oh no! I was going to ask you how you were with the heat (heard about the fires on the radio) but didn't imagine it would be that bad.

very upsetting convo with my parents. will write about it later. but







:









MMM, I wondered if this was affecting you







. I can't imagine the fear and anxiety you're feeling.

Pie Pie, let fly when you're ready.


----------



## cking

MMM this is awful.







I'm so sorry you all are going through this. Sending prayers.


----------



## accountclosed3

my thoughts and prayers are with you and yours MMM! and i'm interested to hear, piepie.

we seriously can't be around the grandparents right now. ryan's dad came to visit and while he had a "great time" with him, it all turned out to be a mess because he was worse then ever (all lsymptoms back, etc) after his dad left.


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, I'll be thinking about you, your dp and your babe. I hope things improve soon and everyone in your family is safe.

*ZB*, glad to hear things are going so well for you guys (except gparents I guess







), especially with all your outside projects!

I had the _tiniest_ bit of a brownish tint to some of my CF today. I was really worried this morning (that's when it first happened), but now I'm feeling pretty calm. I'm pretty sure everything's okay, but I don't think I'll really stop worrying until a few days from now if nothing more happens. It happened twice in the morning and once in the early afternoon; everything has been normal since. And it (the brown color) really was just _barely_ noticeable. No cramping. This would have freaked me out last pg, but for some reason I am just feeling really calm about things this time around. It probably helps that the only people that know that I'm pg are Dh, you all, and my midwife (I just told her last night). I think we're going to wait as long as we can before we tell anyone else. I really like it this way. Anyway, please send me some positive vibes that this is nothing...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thanks for your thoughts everyone. The fire is going through the town as I type. We've lost contact but last we heard they were fighting embers from getting to the shed they're hiding in but were safe. So scary.

Also just heard about one family we know who didn't make it. We fully expect to hear of more. So sad.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Oh my goodness, MMM, that's just so... horrifying! I'm keeping you guys in my thoughts and sending rain and cool breezes your way.

Please keep us posted.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I had the _tiniest_ bit of a brownish tint to some of my CF today.

It sounds like old implantation blood - brown is good!

MMM, I'm just speechless...







:


----------



## witchygrrl

MMM, I was hoping that the wildfires were nowhere near you. I hope and pray that your DP's family are safe, and that things settle down soon. What a truly frightening and sad situation.

Zoe, I'm sorry the grandparent situation isn't getting better. My ILs were here and weren't tooo bad, even if they were a bit obsessed with Rhea eating solids (she isn't yet, FTR). I think I handled that pretty well.

PiePie,


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
It sounds like old implantation blood - brown is good!

MMM, I'm just speechless...







:

Oh good! Nothing more since yesterday afternoon.









MMM how are things today? Or tonight, what's the time there?


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, i'm not sure what the deal is. i think that they are unknowningly negative and ryan is just 'used to it' and so he doesn't hear what they are saying. and it still ultimately impacts him deeply.

for example, there were some lay offs at his work. in true LOA fashion, we worked our gratitude for the job that ryan has. we're very thankful for his job. his parents, while sharing the sentiment said "We are, of course, hoping that you keep your job!" well, it SOUNDS nice, but the underlying assuming is that one *won't* keep the job! so, it's sort of back-handed.

i am SO sensitive to language because i really do a lot with LOA. my business has tripled in the last six weeks and continues to grow. i've also gotten nearly to my pre-pregnancy shape (weight was already at the right number, but body comp was different), without making any radical changes.

so, he spent about 1.5 hrs with his dad one-on-one talking about these various things, and then ended up in a total funk over it and all of his other stress. and yet, he fails to see the connection.

next weekend, it's my parents; then the wedding. bah!


----------



## PiePie

Our grandparents problem is the opposite: they are totally blowing us off!! my parents had scheduled to visit (for a weekend) and now they are cancelling. For a completely lame reason. What kind of grandparent does not want to rearrange their life to see their grandchild? They are completely selfish and self-absorbed. Of course I am completely absorbed in DD, so I guess we are mirror images of each other.

I guess it's like with my single, childless friends -- they feel like everyone is having babies and mutating into someone unrecognizable, whereas I feel all alone in motherhood (vis-a-vis old friends, trying to make mama friends in real life which is steady but slow, and of course I lurve my virtual mama friends







) and like they are huge losers for not wanting to babysit, etc. Some of my childless friends are very into DD, and those are the only ones who appeal to me right now. I do have IRL mama friends too, but the only pre-DD friends who are mamas live far away.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Oops...Happy belated birthday Snozz. Hope it was all sunshine and lollipops!







:

Good news and bad from here...DP's parents were eventually evacuated last night so they are safe. It doesn't look good for their house though - the fire is still out of control so they won't know for certain until it's all over. We're all just very glad they're safe.

The town where we run a weekly market stall (selling coffee) has been burnt to the ground. We're very sad and incredibly worried because a lot of ppl died in the area...

It really is like a war zone here. DP has been lobbying to move out of the city but after this, I don't think I'll ever agree!

Thanks for all your thoughts and concern.


----------



## PiePie

*mujer*, glad they got out. gheesh! why would dp surrender her urban soul?


----------



## farmama

MMM,








s

So glad they got out okay. and i'm so sorry to hear about all the damage and devastation. it's amazing how a 'natural' disaster can completely turn your existence upside down. thank you for keeping us posted.

maela,

Congratulations!!!







:

it's funny, i've been lurking but not posting (fly by







) and i was also nearly certain that i was pg last month--i was several days late and had a very similar experience to shanna. funny...

zb & piepie,

sorry to hear about your parental issues. lately i've been pretty lucky with mine, thankfully.


----------



## Maela

Thanks Farmama!

My nipples are killing me







, I'm EXHAUSTED :yawning:, but only have a bit of nausea







.


----------



## katt

MMM-
I am SO sorry to hear about the fires. I'm glad to hear that the parentals got relocated. I really hope their home is okay.
Hugs!


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, any update re your family? are the fires caused by arson or what? thinking of you every day.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*mujerista*, any update re your family? are the fires caused by arson or what? thinking of you every day.

NPR was reporting that "some" are. When we lived in California, I remember how common it was to have a huge wildfire start naturally, but have a lot of thrillseekers deliberately add to it. MMM, I'm just so...sorry







. I'm so glad you're safe, and so sorry that others weren't.


----------



## arelyn

MMM: I had NO idea it was so bad. I'm totally shocked!! So glad the parents are ok!


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm: i'm so glad that they are safe!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Happy Birthday Steph*! Here's to a day of love and smiles.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
MMM,








s

So glad they got out okay. and i'm so sorry to hear about all the damage and devastation. it's amazing how a 'natural' disaster can completely turn your existence upside down. thank you for keeping us posted.

Yeah - I was thinking about your flood the other day. The crappy thing about this natural disaster is that many of the fires were deliberately lit. Sick sick sick.

The fires are still raging and they're predicting a death toll upwards of 300 people. It's devastating.

DP's parents are still unaware of the fate of their house. The fires are still ravaging their town so there's little hope that there'll be any homes left by the end...not that anyone cares about the houses anymore - it's all about saving lives now.


----------



## Sihaya

*MMM* -







So glad DP's parents are okay! Thanks for the b-day wishes









Fly-by update: Propane tank ran dry, so no heat or hot water here. Feeling dirty and running out of clean diapers and dishes...


----------



## TinyFrog

MMM I hope all the firs are contained soon. That is so sad people would intentionally set a fire. I just don't understand.

Oh no Steph, is the propane company on the way to refill?


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 
Oh no Steph, is the propane company on the way to refill?









No, we can't really afford it right now and since spring is nearly here, we thought we'd try to find another solution. It turns out our wood-burning furnace needs a fairly expensive part as well, and we need to find a way to heat our water without propane too. I just hope we figure it all out before it gets much colder so our pipes don't freeze







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
No, we can't really afford it right now and since spring is nearly here, we thought we'd try to find another solution. It turns out our wood-burning furnace needs a fairly expensive part as well, and we need to find a way to heat our water without propane too. I just hope we figure it all out before it gets much colder so our pipes don't freeze







:

The forcast looks like you'll be hovering on okay, at least for a while.







. But I'm not sure if you're remembering how long winter can go on here







:

So...I'm pregnant







: I haven't tested, and it's been calming to have the knowledge slowly unfold. I started to feel all of my miscarriage anxieties start to well up when I thought about testing, and then had the epiphany that I didn't have to test. I feel blissfully exhausted and slightly nauseous, which, with my history, is a blessing.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna*!!! That's awesome. Good job!


----------



## PiePie

omg shanna! that is so awesome! i am so happy for you and dh!







:







:


----------



## cking

Oh Shanna that's so wonderful!





















So happy for you.

MMM, so glad DP's parents are safe.

My big news is that we've caught every morning poop for the past two weeks. Except for Saturday when DH was with DD for an hour.







And a couple evening extras that caught me by surprise. But what a relief, not having to dunk those diapers.


----------



## witchygrrl

woo, shanna, that´s fabulous!







congrats!

and that´s really great for you too, cking!

I´ve been really stressing on the whole solids situation. So I haven´t given DD any yet, even though I think in reality she´s probably ready. I guess I´m not.







DH wants to be around for the first time, which is sweet, and I know that I want to give her some avocado. It´s all about when.

Also, we´re stressing aout the school budget where DH teaches. They want to trim $2 million. I hope this means they don´t trim him!


----------



## TinyFrog

:







:







: Shanna







:







:







:

Nice catch Christina.
















: for you Witchy!


----------



## Maela

Yay Shanna!!!!







:







:







: So very happy for you!

Cking, that is one of the first consistent times of the day that Dd would use the potty. It was so nice not to have to take care of those poop diapers! I'm happy for you too!









Witchy, I hope your Dh is okay with his job. We have been having the same worries.


----------



## Maela

The nausea is getting worse, and I've had a nice sinus headache for the past 4 days to go with it.









Dh's grandpa passed away today. He had Alzheimers and couldn't do anything besides lie in bed all day. We're sad of course, but happy that he is at peace now and no longer suffering.


----------



## Holiztic

Wow Shanna!!! Congratulations!

I am still in disbelief when any of my mom friends that had their DC1 around the same time as me (or after, Maela!!) announce that they are pregnant. I am still completely infertile (not even a hint of cycle returning) and am starting to feel like I'll never have one! Sex is STILL uncomfortable (probably because there's no fertile CM) and I am nursing 'round the clock still. Maybe I am just meant to have my kids spaced out. I always wanted 3 years between kids, so that's still in play, but starting to seem unlikely if I don't have AF soon!!

Okay, little freak out, thanks for listening, not trying to steal your thunder Shanna, I promise! On that note....

YAY SHANNA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!







:







:







:







:







:







:







:


----------



## katt

Congrats Shanna!!!! I'm so jealous/happy for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!

on US news Teo is potty learning/training. He's spent the last few days dry dry dry (even through last night, which is good cause he just had a bumkins on, no night-time diaper)

I'd say for the past month or more he's been really good about telling us and going to the bathroom for the potty, ESPECIALLY when he' naked. So, he spends most of his time at home naked.








the last 2 days, when we go out, he does NOT want a diaper on, so he's been commando. AND he's told me every time when he needs to go potty. AND he's been able to hold it until we get to a potty.

One hand I'm happy for him, the other hand.... i kinda like cloth diapering, i'm going to miss it until we ever have another baby. AND, he has a little tiny butt, his pants sag low. lol


----------



## witchygrrl

maela, I'll keep my







: for your dh, too. Teachers need their jobs!!

we're hosting a party at our house tomorrow--should be fun







it'll be the first since having Rhea, so this will be interesting, to say the least. I know she won't be the only babe there, though.

wow, katt, that's quite the accomplishment!!! Go Teo!

Sihaya, I hope you've been keeping warm!!


----------



## PiePie

*Liz*, I am right there with you EXCEPT that we don't nurse round the clock -- i woh 4 days a week and stopped pumping more than a month ago! and still no blood!! it's weird because i am not ready to be pregnant again, emotionally, but i am still jealous of fertility.


----------



## farmama

Congratulations Shanna!







:


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 

I´ve been really stressing on the whole solids situation. So I haven´t given DD any yet, even though I think in reality she´s probably ready. I guess I´m not.







DH wants to be around for the first time, which is sweet, and I know that I want to give her some avocado. It´s all about when.


I felt the same way, if you recall. I guess the main thing to remember is that at this age, it's just for fun/exploration. It took a month before dd really tasted/swallowed anything (pear & apple, right on the core) and another month before she started grabbing for things. (pizza crust







). We started with avocado too - she was like wth is this thing that you are trying to put in my mouth? And now avocado is probably her favorite food. It was hard at first because she couldn't pick it up and didn't really want to be spoon fed, but now that she has her grasp down, she loves it.

So anyway, I say just relax and do what you feel is right. And if you're not ready, she's not really going to miss out on anything if you wait a little while to introduce them.

Katt, that's so cool that Teo is potty learning! It must feel good when your child is really communicating.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
AND, he has a little tiny butt, his pants sag low. lol









so cute!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
The nausea is getting worse, and I've had a nice sinus headache for the past 4 days to go with it.









Dh's grandpa passed away today. He had Alzheimers and couldn't do anything besides lie in bed all day. We're sad of course, but happy that he is at peace now and no longer suffering.

I'm so sorry about DH's grandpa.

Sorry about the nausea too. It has to be esp hard with a LO.


----------



## ~Shanna~

nak

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Fly-by update: Propane tank ran dry, so no heat or hot water here. Feeling dirty and running out of clean diapers and dishes...

How are things going over there?









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 







*Shanna*!!! That's awesome. Good job!









Yes, it's probably the only thing I accomplished that day.
















Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
My big news is that we've caught every morning poop for the past two weeks.

Hur-RAY! Fenton thinks "Potty" means "take off my diaper and run around naked, eluding mama".







My goal is for him to use the toilet before he leaves for college.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Also, we´re stressing aout the school budget where DH teaches. They want to trim $2 million. I hope this means they don´t trim him!











Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I am still in disbelief when any of my mom friends that had their DC1 around the same time as me (or after, Maela!!) announce that they are pregnant. I am still completely infertile (not even a hint of cycle returning) and am starting to feel like I'll never have one!

I know - a woman who gave birth ~ 3 days after me has a 9 month old as well. That freaked me out. I don't think af came for me until F was sleeping 4-6 hour stretches. And you could catch the first egg - it's been known to happen







.

So Fenton is a) really into counting and b) obsessed with telling me that "that's where the milk comes from" when he sees my breasts. He then proceeds to count...3 breasts. I should be so lucky...If only I could have another pair of arms.


----------



## Maela

I think I'm miscarrying. I'm pretty sure actually.







The night before last I had a little bit of cramping, but I wasn't sure what it was. Then yesterday morning, more cramping, but it was different. It was like sharp needles going through my belly button to my back. And in the afternoon, pink spotting. And last night bloody mucous.







Nothing more yet, except a little cramping throughout the night. We did DTD yesterday morning, but with the cramping and spotting, I'm pretty sure it's miscarriage.
So what happens now? What can I expect? i was 7 weeks yesterday. The really sucky thing is that my nipples are still really hurting and I'm still a little nauseas. I'm so glad that we haven't told the parents yet. But will I be able to keep it from them? We'll be with them all week planning out the funeral for Dh's gfather and seeing relatives from far away.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I think I'm miscarrying. I'm pretty sure actually.







The night before last I had a little bit of cramping, but I wasn't sure what it was. Then yesterday morning, more cramping, but it was different. It was like sharp needles going through my belly button to my back. And in the afternoon, pink spotting. And last night bloody mucous.







Nothing more yet, except a little cramping throughout the night. We did DTD yesterday morning, but with the cramping and spotting, I'm pretty sure it's miscarriage.
So what happens now? What can I expect? i was 7 weeks yesterday. The really sucky thing is that my nipples are still really hurting and I'm still a little nauseas. I'm so glad that we haven't told the parents yet. But will I be able to keep it from them? We'll be with them all week planning out the funeral for Dh's gfather and seeing relatives from far away.









Oh sweetheart...









I'm so, so sorry.

The hardest physical part is over. The bleeding will continue until your uterus is empty. You'll want to watch for light-headedness, excessive blood loss (it will be obvious) and any smell that doesn't seem right. A fever is also something to watch out for - it's rare, but is a warning that tissue remains in the uterus.

Emotionally...it will probably feel really awful for a long time. And people will say stupid things because they don't know if it's like a death to you or not. It's up to your family, obviously, about whether to share this with your family or not. I've done it both ways, and neither is easier.









I'm pming you with my phone number - please call me if I can help. We have free long distance, I can call you back.


----------



## witchygrrl

I'm so sorry Maela, for your dh's grandfather and for this probable miscarry. That's too much at once, for sure.


----------



## cking

I'm so sorry Maela.


----------



## Maela

I still haven't had anymore cramping or bleeding (just some light light brown mucous). Is that normal for a miscarriage? I thought that once you started bleeding, it wouldn't stop? I hate the waiting because it's giving me hope







when, logically, I don't think there is any.

Sorry to be such a downer.

Thank you Shanna for the pm.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I still haven't had anymore cramping or bleeding (just some light light brown mucous). Is that normal for a miscarriage? I thought that once you started bleeding, it wouldn't stop? I hate the waiting because it's giving me hope







when, logically, I don't think there is any.
.

I'm not sure - at first I thought it was unusual that you still had pg symptoms, but then I remembered I had them for a couple days after too. How heavy was the bleeding total - about a menstruations-worth? I'm so sorry, I don't know how else to ask that...









Do you want to go in to have your hcg levels checked?


----------



## Maela

No not a menstruations-worth at all. Just pink mucous and then last night mucous with bright red streaks. Today not much at all. No cramping.

I don't have a ob/gyn. Would my family practice dr be able to check hcg levels?


----------



## farmama

Maela,

Blessings. My thoughts are with you, and i will keep hoping for the best for you!








:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
No not a menstruations-worth at all. Just pink mucous and then last night mucous with bright red streaks. Today not much at all. No cramping.

I don't have a ob/gyn. Would my family practice dr be able to check hcg levels?

I think it's really possible that you're not, especially if you had sex. Your family practice doc could order the hcg levels. You and the baby are in my prayers.


----------



## Maela

I don't know if I'm just being unrealistic and too optimistic or what, but I feel like maybe I'm okay. I think that my plan is going to be to wait and see for a week. If I see no more spotting and don't have more cramping than usual for a whole week, I'll tell my mw that I would like to get an u/s to check. I think that she has the ability to order u/s's now. With my last pg I had to see an ob/gyn for blood work and u/s, but I'm pretty sure she can order them herself now. I just e-mailed her to let her know what was going on.

I'll just think positive thoughts in the mean time...


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
How are things going over there?









Things are relatively better now. We were pretty cold there for a few days, but DH is a miracle-worker and fixed the wood-burning furnace for a fraction of the estimate the chimney cleaner quoted us, so we are toasty now (if toasty = 62 degrees). We're still without hot water, but there was an unbelievable chain of events Friday morning that led to me getting a shower and getting all of the dirty diapers washed. So, now it's a little easier to keep up with things. Having to heat water on the stove to do dishes and wash diapers isn't glamorous, but we could have it much much worse.

Oh, and I don't think I said CONGRATULATIONS, SHANNA!!!







:

*Maela*,







The only remotely helpful thing I can offer is that spotting or mini-periods are not unheard of in some women's pgs. I am hoping and praying that's what's going on for you.


----------



## Maela

Thank you everyone for the hugs and blessings. I had some dark brown CM last night and light brown this morning. No more cramping since Saturday. Although I was worried because my back is aching this morning; but then I just read somewhere that that is common in mid-1st trimester due to the uterus starting to put pressure on your spine, so who knows?

I spent most of last night and this morning online trying to figure out if I am miscarrying or not.







I don't think I'm going to know until at least a few days from now, so I'm going to get off the computer now and start living again.









Oh and sorry for all the TMI posts.









Okay, don't let me come back here for at least two days.


----------



## cking

Maela, thinking good thoughts for you.
















Steph, glad to hear you were able to get some heat.


----------



## Maela

Okay, I know I'm back early, but I had to share something cute about Maev. This week for the first time she said, "Love you Mama." and just now when I gave her some water she said, "Thank you Mama." We never "force" her to say thank you. I usually just say, "Say 'thank you Mama'." She usually doesn't, and that's fine with me. But today I didn't even say "say thank you" and she just said it. So Cute!!

We also just had our first middle of the night vomit on the bed. Her not me. It wasn't too bad to clean up. Of course Dh cleaned up most of it.







She seems fine this morning. Maybe it was because she'd been nursing almost all night.


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, i am optimistic for you and thinking of you.


----------



## Maela

I have an u/s appt for Friday. Mw says it sounds like it might be a blighted ovum, but that you never know unless you wait or get the ultrasound. I decided on the u/s. I'm thinking it's a bo after doing a search online.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Okay, I know I'm back early, but I had to share something cute about Maev. This week for the first time she said, "Love you Mama." and just now when I gave her some water she said, "Thank you Mama." We never "force" her to say thank you. I usually just say, "Say 'thank you Mama'." She usually doesn't, and that's fine with me. But today I didn't even say "say thank you" and she just said it. So Cute!!

We also just had our first middle of the night vomit on the bed. Her not me. It wasn't too bad to clean up. Of course Dh cleaned up most of it.







She seems fine this morning. Maybe it was because she'd been nursing almost all night.









That's so cute. Sorry about the vomit. We had that last night and tonight too.









I'll be thinking of you. I agree, the u/s is a good option right now.









So after all this time not getting any use, I discovered that a pouch sling is perfect for a 10-month old who is having a bad day. Glad I decided to hold onto it after all.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I have an u/s appt for Friday. Mw says it sounds like it might be a blighted ovum, but that you never know unless you wait or get the ultrasound. I decided on the u/s. I'm thinking it's a bo after doing a search online.

Oh Maela....







. I think I would have decided to U/S too. I'll be thinking of you - and wishing curses on whoever couldn't get you in before Friday







:.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
We also just had our first middle of the night vomit on the bed. Her not me. It wasn't too bad to clean up. Of course Dh cleaned up most of it.







She seems fine this morning. Maybe it was because she'd been nursing almost all night.









Isn't it awful? There are few things I find more upsetting than having to do an entire bed and clothing change in the middle of the night. And who knew that I would patiently hold my child while he vomited all over me? And then tell him how brave he is? Parenthood is a mighty thing....

On that note, I feel as though I've aged decades since I last popped in here. On Tuesday I had a phone consultation with Dr. Cowan regarding Fentons food sensitivities. Both DH and I agreed to stop trying to chase these as if they are "allergies" and to consult with someone who could help advise us on healing the core issues. Cowan is an holistic doctor that is schooled in Anthroposophy and the Nourishing Traditions emphasis on nurtition - plus he went to Michigan State (go green!). Anyway, he did 3 things: 1) Agreed with what I was afraid of, that Fenton should start the diet that I was on to heal my own gut issues







2)Agreed with my concerns about getting enough nutrients and calories while pg if I'm avoiding eggs because Fenton is sensitive to them (and soy and wheat, but I'm worried about the eggs, as well as the possibility that Fenton will start to react to the goat dairy that I've been able to do up until now - the eggs feel like the "gateway" concern) and 3) Shocked me by suggesting that I consider helping Fenton to wean, mostly to help me and the baby get everything that we need. I started to cry immediately, and told him that this would be devestating to my son and that I won't do it. As I've been able to sit with it for longer...I'm feeling very conflicted, torn already between both of my children







Every time I think about it, I feel this sick feeling that Fenton is going away somewhere, as if I'm going to abandon him in another location. And yet I see that I'm failing in the metaphor of securing my own oxygen mask before assisting others. And that nagging voice in my mind is getting louder, that I'm not entirely confident that it's a good idea for me to nurse while pregnant. The approach I took today was to see how he does with nursing when he isn't bored, I'm not on the phone, I offer food often, etc. And he's nursed twice today: nap and once in the evening when he asked repeatedly. Oh, and before bed, so 3 times. The bottom line is that I can't give up any more nutritious food, but I also can't force him to wean. So we're going to wait and see. We're starting the diet on Monday, with me not doing the more radical beginign day of detoxing with only meat soups, vegetables and probiotics, I'll just stick with what is legal on the diet in the later stages. And the doctor did say that with how mild his symptoms are, it is possible he'll only need to be on the diet for a few weeks (can I hope? I was on this for 18 _months_), and he may even grow to tolerate eggs soon, in a couple of weeks. If that's the case, I wouldn't worry about this at all because the diet is a great diet for a pregnant woman if it can include eggs.

So there you have it, all of the agonizing I've been doing over the last 24+ hours. I feel exhausted, sick with worry and guilty.

But do you know what else? Today Fenton asked if I would take a picture of Daddy rubbing his back so he could have it







. It was really amazing to see him put together a desire to have a memento of something that makes him feel loved and close. I'm crying now, I better go...


----------



## Holiztic

oh shanna, i am so sorry you are feeling so conflicted b/w your kids' needs, you are such a good mommy and should never feel that way!!! that being said, I feel I should share this fact (as you know I am a fellow TFer--6+ years now): I am not even considering for a moment getting pregnant while still nursing. I believe I need to be devoting all my nutrition to the growing fetus. I know my immune system has taken a beating while nursing and my weight is still (just barely) coming off--this convinces me even further. I know many many moms on MDC would take issue with this stance but I feel very strongly about it. I am planning on weaning Quinn around 2 (yes, it will be hard on all of us) and TTC about 6 months later (I actually want several months to really build my nutritional stores back up after weaning). Hate to be a downer, but wanted to share. I think you need to follow YOUR gut (ha, no pun intended) not mine, though!!! I support you no matter what and want to reiterate what a great mommy you are no matter what you decide!


----------



## Maela

Shanna,







s







s I'm so sorry you're feeling so conflicted. That would be so hard!

I also get this nagging feeling that nursing was not meant to happen while pg. I know that all the studies say it's okay (or is there just a lack of studies saying it's bad?), but I still get the feeling. Why does it hurt so much?







Well, we are still nursing, but I have to be honest: I've been offering a snack first when Dd asks to nurse (unless she hasn't nursed in many hours), and most of the time she accepts the snack. I think that one of the reasons she nurses SO often is because she's bored and/or getting hungry. So I'm trying to play with her more often and make sure she gets three meals and some snacks. I'm just so used to relying on nursing to appease her and sometimes I forget to feed her snacks.














I need to remember that toddlers eat little, but often. Good news is she's 26 lbs. now.

Brown discharge has stopped. No cramping since Saturday. So, obviously, my hopes are up. Not sure if that's a good thing. We told SIL yesterday. It was nice to have someone else share the worry with us. Still don't want to tell the parents though.


----------



## katt

Shanna - HUGS!!! I so hope you are able to come to a conclusion that suits your family.

On an us note, i'm in the midst of packing/selling/donating most of Teo's diapers. I'm going to keep out night-time diapers and a small handful (like 5 or 6) daytimes diapers. But, he's been either commando or in b.b. underwear for the past week-week1/2.


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna -







Been looking into the GAPS diet here too







I am hoping and praying that Fenton only needs to be on it for a few weeks







: I hope you're able to tune into your instincts amidst all the other static right now. I'm thinking of you, dear!









ETA a quick update: We have heat here, as well as a new (to us) minivan! Still no hot water, but making due. Seriously considering getting licensed as a home daycare provider this fall.


----------



## ~Shanna~

On watch for Maela's little one...







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

I know these were meant to be helpful. And I also know the temptation to share when one feels as though one has it all figured out. My baby is already growing, so it doesn't help me to be given advice about how irresponsible it is to get pregnant while nursing, not waiting, etc. I'm not angry, but I need to not be kicked while I'm down. I know this situation is just a bit of trivia if it's not you, but this approaches a devastating situation for me, and I can't entertain thoughts of whether #2 is a mistake. I know part of what you may have been trying to say is that I shouldn't feel bad if I encourage Fenton to wean, and I appreciate that. It's just hard for me to entertain detached discussion about the morals of child spacing. Like Maela, I'm surprised to find my intuition on tandem nursing so different now that I'm pregnant. But I don't think I'm foolish for having believed differently before I was pregnant.


----------



## TinyFrog

Shanna

Thinking of you today Maela.







:


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I know these were meant to be helpful. And I also know the temptation to share when one feels as though one has it all figured out. My baby is already growing, so it doesn't help me to be given advice about how irresponsible it is to get pregnant while nursing, not waiting, etc. I'm not angry, but I need to not be kicked while I'm down. I know this situation is just a bit of trivia if it's not you, but this approaches a devastating situation for me, and I can't entertain thoughts of whether #2 is a mistake. I know part of what you may have been trying to say is that I shouldn't feel bad if I encourage Fenton to wean, and I appreciate that. It's just hard for me to entertain detached discussion about the morals of child spacing. Like Maela, I'm surprised to find my intuition on tandem nursing so different now that I'm pregnant. But I don't think I'm foolish for having believed differently before I was pregnant.

I was afraid that might be your response, and to be honest I wouldn't have said it to just anyone, but sometimes I feel like some of you (you know, the ones I've "known" for 4 years!!!) are like online sisters, and maybe it was a bit too frank. Really, though, its like when I read that the "V" in kids bottom teeth is linked to Vit A deficiency in mom (Q definitely has a V) and my stomach sank. But now I know for next time that what I was doing didn't quite cut it. Ultimately, though, it wasn't about where you come from (that you already ARE pregnant) but more my input on where I would go if I was you, and finally a big cheer for you no matter what you do, because really I believe you could nurse F all the way through this pregnancy and you'll still have a healthy and happy baby. I think we're talking nit picky level here, like Q's V--doesn't seem to have come with any health problems or issues at all, just a V.

Did I mention I love you Shanna (I think its been about 3 years since I did that, BTW)


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Too busy to think but sending love and support to maela and shanna xox


----------



## Maela

My intuition was that the baby was there and fine. Especially after I stopped spotting a couple of days ago. And I was right!! Dd and I (Dh had to work after taking the day off yesterday for the funeral) got to see the baby and his/her little heartbeat (155 bpm). The technician was really nice. She let Maev sit right next to me on the exam table while she did the u/s. And we got a picture! Of course, you can't really tell what it is.







We think we're going to tell the rest of the family this weekend, since we know there's a heartbeat. I'm so happy!







:


----------



## Maela

Shanna, I didn't realize we were in the same DDC!

I'm watching Mary Poppins with DD (well, she's not as interested as I am - she watches bits here and there). I love that movie!

Morning sickness is worse today. But I'm in a pretty good mood today. I could throw up five times and still be happy.







I better watch what I say.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: such good news *maela*!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Did I mention I love you Shanna (I think its been about 3 years since I did that, BTW)



















































Thank you







. I'm not angry and I understand the intention. I'm just feeling more vulnerable than was maybe apparent, and I wanted to be honest about where I am.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
My intuition was that the baby was there and fine. Especially after I stopped spotting a couple of days ago. And I was right!! Dd and I (Dh had to work after taking the day off yesterday for the funeral) got to see the baby and his/her little heartbeat (155 bpm). The technician was really nice. She let Maev sit right next to me on the exam table while she did the u/s. And we got a picture! Of course, you can't really tell what it is.







We think we're going to tell the rest of the family this weekend, since we know there's a heartbeat. I'm so happy!







:

Maela, this is such joyous news! I was hoping it would work out this way!


----------



## PiePie

*Maela*, WOOT! What a relief. I know we shouldn't compare babies, but I can't believe how big Maev is. DD is just 22.8 lbs.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, it may help to think of weaning on a continuum and not as an either/or proposition. for example, i in no way consider myself weaning dd at this time. however, as of yesterday, i had to admit that there is no way i can wear her on teh front -- my back just can't take it (and frankly it probably wasn't so great for me to have done so this long). because i have had little luck growing boobs on my back, when she is in teh ergo she will just have to wait to nurse until i can find somewhere to sit down. i was totally terrified of sch pickup today for that reason, but it worked out fine (or as fine as sch pickup can be these days). fenton's language abilities seem very advanced -- perhaps he could understand a deal such as only 2 nursings per day (an mdc friend of mine did that when her dd turned 1 because she wanted to conceive and didn't have af; they kept nursing for 3 mos. thereafter on that reduced sched). not saying you have to do that -- just that there are shades here.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*Maela*, WOOT! What a relief. I know we shouldn't compare babies, but I can't believe how big Maev is. DD is just 22.8 lbs.

Everyone always tells me she's big for her age. I think she's tall for her age too. I don't really know where she is on the charts. She rarely goes to the dr (she just went last week for the first time in 8 months) and when she does the dr never says anything about how she compares to other babies. But Dh and I were both big for our age until we hit high school. Now we're just average-sized. I'm thinking that's what will happen with Dd.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Maela, this is such joyous news! I was hoping it would work out this way!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 







: such good news *maela*!

Thanks!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*shanna*, it may help to think of weaning on a continuum and not as an either/or proposition. for example, i in no way consider myself weaning dd at this time. however, as of yesterday, i had to admit that there is no way i can wear her on teh front -- my back just can't take it (and frankly it probably wasn't so great for me to have done so this long). because i have had little luck growing boobs on my back, when she is in teh ergo she will just have to wait to nurse until i can find somewhere to sit down. i was totally terrified of sch pickup today for that reason, but it worked out fine (or as fine as sch pickup can be these days). fenton's language abilities seem very advanced -- perhaps he could understand a deal such as only 2 nursings per day (an mdc friend of mine did that when her dd turned 1 because she wanted to conceive and didn't have af; they kept nursing for 3 mos. thereafter on that reduced sched). not saying you have to do that -- just that there are shades here.

Thanks Pie Pie - my beloved LLL leader counseled me in my frantickness on the same thing, and you're right. He does seem to be doing well with distraction, and I think he might do well with negotiating..._during the day_. Nighttime is a different story







I guess what is so difficult about this situation is that the biggest point of weaning in my mind (as opposed to what the doctor worries about) is Fenton being sensitive to foods that I consider essential to healthy pregnancy, and the gradual weaning doesn't help that. My concerns about how taxing it is to both nurse and be pregnant can mostly be satisfied by exceptional nutrition, and I haven't experienced uterine contractions, which would be my other issue. I'm trying to take a longer view on the egg issue and I'm doing a lot of seafoods and roe, etc. to replace what I'm missing with the eggs, but our family's approach to nutrition isn't so much about the chemical components, so it makes eggs unique and irreplaceable. But obviously people have healthy pregnancies without eggs from fowl, so I'm trying to lose my tunnel vision. But I think I've been so focused on it because I'm worried he's going to start to show sensitivity to other foods that I can't replace, such as raw dairy. Anyway, this is OT to what you were saying. Basically I need to stop worrying about things that haven't happened yet







.
I'm sorry I'm so







about this...


----------



## witchygrrl

*maela*, I'm so happy for you! do they know what caused the bleeding and pain then? or is it just a mystery? regardless, I'm glad things are fine.

*shanna*,







i'm sure that with your diligence, you will find the right balance for all of your needs (I'm including fenton and your lil one on the way here). I might suggest looking into how vegans approach their dietary needs healthfully during pregnancy, since they don't do dairy or eggs. just a thought...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
*maela*, I'm so happy for you! do they know what caused the bleeding and pain then? or is it just a mystery? regardless, I'm glad things are fine.

I don't know. I have this feeling it was from the *clears throat* fun Dh and I had on Valentine's day during Dd's nap. I just didn't think it would last that long (the spotting). But it did turn brown right away and it was less and less every day, so maybe that's normal. Of course, now I am afraid to have sex again. The cramping I was never sure if it was actually my uterus or not. I have a really hard time telling for some reason. So







Hopefully it doesn't happen again.

We are having the parents and my brother and sister over for dinner tonight. Dd is going to be wearing her "I'm going to be a big sister" shirt. We'll see how long it takes everyone to notice it. I think they'll notice right away.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Everyone always tells me she's big for her age. I think she's tall for her age too. I don't really know where she is on the charts. She rarely goes to the dr (she just went last week for the first time in 8 months) and when she does the dr never says anything about how she compares to other babies.


The CDC charts from 2000 (last census) are in the back of Sears' _Baby Book_, if you are interested. Note that they are different for girls and boys. DD measued 32.25 inches at 18 mos., which put her at 70th %ile! We are in shock (in a good way, I guess), as she has never measured more than 50th %ile for height and at 16 mos. was at 24th %ile. DH keeps saying that my brother's genes kicked in. I've really gotta purge her wardrobe of all 9-12 mo. clothes. Sigh.


----------



## cking

Maela, that is wonderful! So happy to hear it.







Good luck tonight!

Shanna,







That is a tough place to be. I hope you find a balance that's right for you.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
The CDC charts from 2000 (last census) are in the back of Sears' _Baby Book_, if you are interested. Note that they are different for girls and boys. DD measued 32.25 inches at 18 mos., which put her at 70th %ile! We are in shock (in a good way, I guess), as she has never measured more than 50th %ile for height and at 16 mos. was at 24th %ile. DH keeps saying that my brother's genes kicked in. I've really gotta purge her wardrobe of all 9-12 mo. clothes. Sigh.

Wow, she really had a growth spurt! I would say that I'd borrow the clothes, but I think J is about to grow out of that size. Not sure though - her growth it slowing down.

I'm curious - once your LO is walking, do they measure their height standing up? Probably a silly question.







Whenever we stand J next to the growth chart on the wall, she doesn't measure nearly as tall as at her wb visits, measured lying down.

J is sick. It's just a cold (which I have now too.














, but man, she is miserable. She's been waking up screaming every night, and isn't nursing very much. That worries me a little. I've actually had to pump several times, which I haven't had to do in months. A few nights, i stayed with her in her room (futon on floor, for naps) and she slept pretty well there. I tried to bring her back into our room last night, and it didn't work out - she woke up inconsolable after a couple hours. (and DH really pissed me off







, but that's another story) So we went back to her room. I wonder if she's starting to prefer sleeping there - a little more room to move around. (?) I'm not ready for that.


----------



## arelyn

Meala: I'm so glad everything is doing well!!







:

Shanna: I'm not sure what your diet looks like these days but I know from experience that it's possible to have a egg free, wheat free, meat free, mostly seafood free pregnancy and still have a healthy baby!

Liz: Can you give me a link to the Vit A info? I tried google but it isn't doing me any favours tonight and I'm curious. I can't imagine having a Vit A deficiency but Kai's front teeth look funny. I think it's genetic though (DH and FIL and BIL all have the same front teeth).


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
We are having the parents and my brother and sister over for dinner tonight. Dd is going to be wearing her "I'm going to be a big sister" shirt. We'll see how long it takes everyone to notice it. I think they'll notice right away.

Oh that is fun! Congrats if I haven't said it already. And please fill us in on the story of how they noticed and how you told them and their reaction!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

I suppose I should be grateful that my son sleeps 6 hour stretches every night but I'm feeling a wee bit ripped off because at 9weeks postpartum, 3 weeks since I stopped bleeding, MY PERIOD IS BACK! I'M in shock.


----------



## witchygrrl

oh my goodness, MMM! yikes!

but while we're on the subject, while AF has not returned for me yetwa, pretty much since Rhea was born, my uterine region has been twingey off and on. Like it REALLY wants to get things going again, but is thwarted by nursing. Am I just oversensitive after months of comtemplating my navel and then healing, or am I not alone here?


----------



## farmama

Maela,

Hooray!







: I'm so glad to hear all is well.

Shanna,

i am sorry that you're dealing with all the food sensitivities again. i know how difficult it is to not know the exactly right thing to do. but you are an amazing mom just for noticing Fenton's sensitivities in the first place, and taking the steps necessary to help him and you. i am completely confident that you will find the best path, and everyone will be healthy and perfect.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I suppose I should be grateful that my son sleeps 6 hour stretches every night but I'm feeling a wee bit ripped off because at 9weeks postpartum, 3 weeks since I stopped bleeding, MY PERIOD IS BACK! I'M in shock.









BTDT - AF returned at 11 weeks for me and I'm convinced it is linked to hypothyroid, which I remember you dealing with. PLEASE be super-attentive to your milk supply! I'm pretty sure that AF's early return is what nearly ended our nursing relationship and resulted in supplementing with donor milk for so long.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
oh my goodness, MMM! yikes!

but while we're on the subject, while AF has not returned for me yetwa, pretty much since Rhea was born, my uterine region has been twingey off and on. Like it REALLY wants to get things going again, but is thwarted by nursing. Am I just oversensitive after months of comtemplating my navel and then healing, or am I not alone here?

I cannot tell you how many times (from about 16 months pp) I have said/thought "oh, I think I just ovulated"!! I could always feel it before getting preg, so it wouldn't exactly be a shock to feel it, but alas, not so. Does it mean my body is "trying"? Perhaps, but Q is definitely being antagonistic to that process. Seriously, how is he STILL nursing every 2 hours!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Maela

I was surprised by how long it took our parents to notice the shirt. My sister noticed right away. But all the parents needed a hint to look at the shirt. And then my mom's reaction was a little...unexcited, which was weird. I could tell my dad was pretty happy though. And, of course, the ILs were very excited.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
.

I'm curious - once your LO is walking, do they measure their height standing up? Probably a silly question.







Whenever we stand J next to the growth chart on the wall, she doesn't measure nearly as tall as at her wb visits, measured

yeah they lay them down and stretch! so not a silly question -- one could argue that the stretching makes it all a highly subjective science.


----------



## Maela

so sick.







for the last hour, i've felt like i'm just about to throw up. the sight/thought of food makes it so much worse. I just told dh I don't think I can do this again. Knowing i have another 8 weeks of this to go (that's how long it lasted last pg) is not helping. The house is aready a mess.








what was i thinking?

just needed to complain...


----------



## arelyn

The pregnant mamas might want to skip this post. It's very sad and kinda scary.

I had a dear friend die yesterday with almost no warning. We're still not sure why it happened. It seems she picked up a really bad infection in the hospital and it severely damaged her heart. She left behind a newborn ds and 4yo dd. My supply has been doing much better lately and I'd love to donate my milk if her DH wants it (he might be too weirded out) but I was wondering if "toddler" breastmilk is ok for newborns. It seems like it'd be better than formula at any rate and I don't know if I'd be able to make enough to be more than a suppliment anyway. I don't know. my head is still spinning. This was all so sudden. What do you all think?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
The pregnant mamas might want to skip this post. It's very sad and kinda scary.

I had a dear friend die yesterday with almost no warning. We're still not sure why it happened. It seems she picked up a really bad infection in the hospital and it severely damaged her heart. She left behind a newborn ds and 4yo dd. My supply has been doing much better lately and I'd love to donate my milk if her DH wants it (he might be too weirded out) but I was wondering if "toddler" breastmilk is ok for newborns. It seems like it'd be better than formula at any rate and I don't know if I'd be able to make enough to be more than a suppliment anyway. I don't know. my head is still spinning. This was all so sudden. What do you all think?

Arelyn, I'm so sorry. This is horrible. I donated Toddler milk to a newborn, and while I'm sure it's not optimal, it's definately better than nothing. I seem to remember Jack's parents kept it in the freezer for a little while while they scoped a better source, but they only had a few hours to look. It's a wonderful gift to give them.

Again, I'm so, so sorry







.


----------



## PiePie

*Arelyn*, I think that an offer to donate milk would be huge and one for which I, if I were her father, would be forever grateful. I do know that milk composition varies depending on babe's age, but I too have a gut feeling that it would be better than formula.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 

i am sorry that you're dealing with all the food sensitivities again. i know how difficult it is to not know the exactly right thing to do. but you are an amazing mom just for noticing Fenton's sensitivities in the first place, and taking the steps necessary to help him and you. i am completely confident that you will find the best path, and everyone will be healthy and perfect.









Thank you







. We started the GAPS diet today, and I'm feeling completely overwhelmed. If I thought this was hard for me, I couldn't have imagined it for a toddler. On top of that, the "dairy free" probiotic had a note when it arrived, $80+ later, that it may contain "traces of dairy and soy" and now I'm not sure if I'm seeing a slight reaction, or if I'm just paranoid. In the meantime, I'm sneaking off to the bathroom every so often to eat foods he can't have right now, but can later. What a comedy. If it wasn't me.

Blah.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Thank you







. We started the GAPS diet today, and I'm feeling completely overwhelmed. If I thought this was hard for me, I couldn't have imagined it for a toddler. On top of that, the "dairy free" probiotic had a note when it arrived, $80+ later, that it may contain "traces of dairy and soy" and now I'm not sure if I'm seeing a slight reaction, or if I'm just paranoid. In the meantime, I'm sneaking off to the bathroom every so often to eat foods he can't have right now, but can later. What a comedy. If it wasn't me.

Blah.

you sound like me eating chocolate in the pantry and then when Q sees me chewing he calls it gum and I don't correct him.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
you sound like me eating chocolate in the pantry and then when Q sees me chewing he calls it gum and I don't correct him.









Yeah, except imagine doing it with avocados and navy beans







.


----------



## Maela

Arelyn, I am so sorry to hear about your friend and her family.







That is so sad. I think it's wonderful that you want to donate some milk to them. Definitely better than formula.

I think I have the stomach bug that Dd had a few days ago; not just morning sickness. So I guess that's good news. My mom came over this morning and cleaned and cooked for us. So our house doesn't look as bad anymore. Dd and I just took a three hour nap together, and I am feeling so much better. Still queasy, but able to get up, move around, and eat a little.


----------



## katt

Still around
Hugs to everyone!!!

I officially got my period back 1 month before Teo turned 2 years old. I'm pretty sure I was fertile before then, but let me tell you, I LOVED not haveing it and am pretty bummed it returned.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Katt, that is so cool that Teo is using the potty - how did it go?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Arelyn - such awful news. Your friend and her babes and dh are in my thoughts. Donating milk sounds like a very lovely and totally appropriate thing to do.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Cracked nipples! I am so mad with dp about this. We argued over introducing a pacifier to squeak and 2 weeks ago I caved in. Now his latch has turned to shit and I'm suffering the consequences. Admittedly, it has really helped with bedtime but nothing is worth the hell of cracked nipples. How can I let this useless anger go? Right now I'm really having to remind myself of all her good qualities to keep from really losing the plot.


----------



## witchygrrl

*arelyn*, many







to you. I also think donating milk would be wonderful to do for the poor babe.

*mmm*, ouch! I'm sure something can be done to help the latch issue and save your nipples! mine never fully cracked, but they did get chapped and scabby several times, and it sure did hurt. lanolin and cloth breast pads did the trick for me to help them heal.

me news: my FP called me as my bloodwork from my physical came back. My TSH is 145!!! So he wants to do some more testing on my thyroid. I knew something was off a long time ago, but my old doc just said since my blood tests were "fine" despite a slight goiter, I was also "fine". Now I feel like there's something to work with here.


----------



## PiePie

cracked nipples hurt worse than most of labor, i swear. I did the following: 1. LC to correct the latch, 2. dixie cups of warm saltwater on them, 3. walk around topless. it was recommended that i use the pump in lieu of nursing once a day for a week or so but that didn't really work for me. on the attitude, at least you have nursed without this pain so you know it can be better. that is a huge piece to hold onto.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
cracked nipples hurt worse than most of labor, i swear.


----------



## arelyn

Her DH gave the ok. Now I just need to find a pump I can borrow. Part of me is really happy to be able to do something to make a difference, most of me is just heartbroken that it's come to this.

So, I'm nursing a newborn. No cabbage or broccolli. Easy on the dairy. Eat more oatmeal and regular snacks. Drink fenugreek tea. Anything else I should be doing?


----------



## accountclosed3

arelyn:

i'm sorry for your loss, but i'm also thankful that you have something so proactive to do for the family. i often find that when i loose a friend or a friend looses someone, there is so little that i can do for them (i mean, i do things like cooking, cleaning, and helping with various arrangements), but i always feel like that is meaningless. I feel that what you are giving is so meaningful--partly because milk is so powerful. i can never describe how or why milk is so powerful, but i feel that it is!

anyway, it sounds like you are doing great, but i would recommend getting a pump from the hospital or lactation consultant. they have the big, fancy ones that are super quiet and do the best job of getting out the most milk (including the hind milk!). i think we were able to rent the one we used for $30/mo or something. i felt that it made a huge difference.

mmm:

my recommendation is to find a way to get the venom out without taking it out on her. it will subside, then, and you'll be back to normal.

and yes, i agree that cracked nipples hurt far worse than labor or birth--because, guess what? something is 'not right.' whereas, birth and labor are right. it's like 'good pain vs bad pain' or, as i describe it in yoga, discomfort vs pain. discomfort can be extreme, but pain indicates and injury.

so, you defninitely have injury, and i can understand your anger/frustration when it wasn't your idea in the first place.

no worries, this too shall pass. it will all get better!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Cracked nipples! I am so mad with dp about this. We argued over introducing a pacifier to squeak and 2 weeks ago I caved in. Now his latch has turned to shit and I'm suffering the consequences. Admittedly, it has really helped with bedtime but nothing is worth the hell of cracked nipples. How can I let this useless anger go? Right now I'm really having to remind myself of all her good qualities to keep from really losing the plot.

I had killer cracked nipples and Q never had a pacifier or bottle, though he was a bit tongue-tied which likely caused it. I used Lansinoh like mad, seriously I put that stuff on every hour and that helped some. There is also a homeopathic for healing wounds, I can't remember off the top of my head but I'll think about it/research it. Until then, I so sympathize with you, that was damn painful!!! I used to scream when he latched on (I am sure he enjoyed that)


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Hey steph, I forgot to thank you for the milk/thyroid/period warning. I'll keep on it - cracked nipples or not!

And thanks all for your sympathy and suggestions for my poor sore nips. Liz, arnica and hypericum, right? Thanks for the reminder, I hadn't thought of raiding the homeopathics but I will now! I've also been rubbing lots of hind milk and the weleda nipple cream in and it's helping lots. The boy is also being kinder with his latch. Here's to this being a short and easily remedied foray into breastfeeding drama!


----------



## Holiztic

AFAIK Arnica and hypericum are great for healing from surgery and such, but I am not seeing much on them for cracked nipples. I have not run across info on the remedy I used (darn it!) but I am reading a number of other recs (of course with homeopathy there is no one answer!). Calendula (topical), Camomilla, and Phytolacca Decandra (never heard of it, but read this on several pages) are turning up, obviously you can google as well as I can, so have at it, but I think you should give something homeopathic a shot (along with lanolin!!!) and maybe some latch correcting work with an LC or LLL leader?


----------



## katt

Shanna -
SUPER easy. I just put him on the potty when he was around 18 ish? Months??? something like that. I made it fun, we read books a lot, I tried to put him on when I KNEW he'd pee (before and after naps) but, if nothing happened, nothing happened. Nothing consistant though. After we moved to where we are now (no carpet) he was naked a lot. When we was/is naked he'd notice he needed to pee right away and use the potty. Sometimes I noticed pee in the potty and didn't remember helping him.
After a while he wanted to use the big potty, I'd help him. He sometimes stands on the rim. We're working on aiming right now. He squats on the rim to poop. kinda funny. He is always telling me about his big poops. lol
My mom got the boys (grandsons) a plastic step-stool for x-mas. Best thing ever. It lives in the bathroom. Now, if he could just reach the light switch and work his pants he could do this all by himself.

He usually goes Commando and depending on the undies (if he chooses to wear them) he forgets. I think those undies are to constraining and he forgets. I have no problem w/ the commando thing. I'm going to make him some super cute boxer briefs. THe ones I like are like 10$/pair OR don't come in his size.

I never pushed him or used any type of language to make it seem like it was a bad thing to wear diapers. I never said anything about accidents or how BIG Boys wear underware. I call his undies his Big-Boy undies, but i never said 'babies wear diapers and big boys wear underware, you want to be a big-boy don't you?' (or any variation thereof). I was never super consistant about timing to put him on the potty (cause after he started to 'get it' on his own, he would be very adamant about when he did or didn't need to use the potty.

He tells me when he needs to go and signs too (his Potty and Daddy sound very similar) then takes off for the potty. When we're in public he tells me and signs and then can hold it till we get to a potty. (i'm super impressed by this boy all the time)

Okay, can you tell I'm pretty excited about this? Sorry to write a novel about my son's bathroom habits.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Sebby has a cold and has lost his voice. We both have thrush which explains a lot of things (thought I had psoriasis on my nipples, stabbing pains in back and boobs, painful letdown - stoopid me for not realising a whole lot sooner).

Not catching many breaks this week...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Sebby has a cold and has lost his voice. We both have thrush which explains a lot of things (thought I had psoriasis on my nipples, stabbing pains in back and boobs, painful letdown - stoopid me for not realising a whole lot sooner).

Not catching many breaks this week...

MMM,







s I'm sorry your having such a rough time! Hope things start improving soon!

Katt, that is so cool how easy it's been for Teo on the potty!

Maev has good days and bad days. We have had a few no accident days in the last month. One time at the grocery store, she actually told me she had to go and then held it until we found the bathroom! And then there are days where we try o nthe pottym, and then a minute later she goes in her panties/diaper/on the floor. Oh well. Most of the time she tells me right after she goes if she has a diaper on. I'm not pushing it or anything. Just hoping







: that she's in panties (I hate that word btw,








but she picked it up from everyone else and that's what she calls them) full time by the time the baby comes.

Pg symptoms at a low today. I should be happy to be able to nurse without cringing and look at food without gagging, but the worrywart in me is nervous of course.







I remember I had days like this last pg too, so I should just be grateful.


----------



## arelyn

MMM:







s At least you know how to treat the problem now!

Meala: Where did you find baby undies?


----------



## arelyn

zoe: Your post is so sweet. Thank you. You know, Sri Lankans believe there is emotional healing power in milk too (and to a lesser extent lactating women and water since it is the earth's milk). It's one of the few local beliefs the indigenous churches have incorporated and I'm thinking they're onto something.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Meala: Where did you find baby undies?

Target. The smallest size they have is 18-24mos., but Dd's been wearing them (off and on) since she was 12(?)mos. They're just a little baggy in the butt. So cute though. In the baby section. They're padded just barely.


----------



## arelyn

Awsome! The smallest I've seen is 2T-3T which would be ridiculous on Kai. He's all legs, hardly any bottom at all. We'll check the next time we're near one (it'll be a while, they don't exist in little towns like we have up here).

Baby awake...juts like he was all night







head


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Awsome! The smallest I've seen is 2T-3T which would be ridiculous on Kai. He's all legs, hardly any bottom at all. We'll check the next time we're near one (it'll be a while, they don't exist in little towns like we have up here).

Baby awake...juts like he was all night







head

Yes, usually all they have is the 2t-3t, but every once in a while I'll see the 18-24mos size.

Sorry about your rough night!


----------



## witchygrrl

Maybe they'll have the right size undies online?


----------



## Holiztic

I LOVE Hanna Andersson's organic cotton training undies (Quinn's are collecting dust in his drawer, of course, but for the 2 weeks he was potty trained they were so cute on him!) They come as small as size 80-90 (like a small 2T)


----------



## katt

My newest plan is to make baby boxer-briefs. i've got some cute knits and I'm going to do self covered elastic. oh so cute! I can't wait.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
My newest plan is to make baby boxer-briefs. i've got some cute knits and I'm going to do self covered elastic. oh so cute! I can't wait.

That will be so cute!! I wish I could sew that well!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *katt* 
My newest plan is to make baby boxer-briefs. i've got some cute knits and I'm going to do self covered elastic. oh so cute! I can't wait.

What a cute idea!!!

Anyone have any suggestions for improving Strep + status? I was strep + last time and used a hibicleanse during labor. I want to avoid it this time, as I'm certain it didn't help our current situation







... Right now I'm doing external washes 4X a day with yogurt and a commercial probiotic, plus consuming tons of kraut, yogurt, and fermented beverages. Is there anything else I can do? I want to not just fix the test....I'll poke around elsewhere when the Boy allows, but thought I'd check here first.

Good news and bad news: He's tolerating my consumption of goat dairy still, so we don't have to abruptly wean as I was terrified we might (as that's 600 hard-won calories for me on this diet). Bad news is that I can't tolerate him nursing at night and he's not getting any milk anyway, so neither of us is happy. He awoke at 2:45 this morning and....it went downhill from there.







Starting a new plan tonight that sucks, but I should at least get 6 hours of sleep on it. But eczema is under control, dipe rash is under control, is no longer sucking on fingers and complaining of "itchy ears", and he doesn't seem to be missing illegal foods yet. THough we're avoiding most social situations, which isn't helping my depression







.

"I can do hard things. I can do hard things. I can do hard things..."







:


----------



## farmama

arelyn,

i am so sorry for the loss of your friend. what an unexpected sadness for the little ones and their papa. and what an amazing offer to share with the little one who needs it so.

shanna,

be strong, brave one! as someone who has unsuccessfully dealt with (or not dealt with














candida for WAY TOO LONG, i really respect your ability to alter your diet so dramatically.

does your dh eat whatever he wants, or is he sort of going along? just curious, because mine is quite the sugar guy, and if i tried to tell him no more ice cream he'd probably laugh at me.









i khow i don't post a lot, but i often try to check in on you all, and i want to let you know that i appreciate the strong women that you all are. i get excited about your good news, and am saddened by your grief and struggles. even if we're not face-to-face irl friends, i still think of y'all as i go about my days. okay, enough sappiness.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Shanna - garlic suppositories every night for the weeks before you test. Also know that you don't have to treat it if you are positive. The chances of it affecting the babe are extremely low though the cost is high if your babe does catch it...but there are ways to monitor and treat the babe after birth if necessary.

Thrush sucks.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Starting a new plan tonight that sucks, but I should at least get 6 hours of sleep on it.

what's the plan?


----------



## accountclosed3

you know, it's very cool when you feel very wealthy. we feel very wealthy.

feeling so good! i write this in celebration of being and feeling abundant "even in this econmy."

i'm grateful for my husband's job, as well as for the increase in my own work. i'm thankful that we have our investments (home, retirement), and that each has managed to basically maintain their value. i'm thankful for our savings, which just keeps growing, and the ability to do what we need to do to live well.

i'm prepping our taxes and it always makes me feel good. with this, the goal or work for this year is about me taking full measure and responsibility (emotionally--i already do it physically) for the finances! it's been amazing work so far and it has created more abundance!

wow! i just feel SO amazing. and it's so funny, i seem to be the only person who feels happier and excited about our finances during tax season! LOL


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
you know, it's very cool when you feel very wealthy. we feel very wealthy.

feeling so good! i write this in celebration of being and feeling abundant "even in this econmy."

i'm grateful for my husband's job, as well as for the increase in my own work. i'm thankful that we have our investments (home, retirement), and that each has managed to basically maintain their value. i'm thankful for our savings, which just keeps growing, and the ability to do what we need to do to live well.

i'm prepping our taxes and it always makes me feel good. with this, the goal or work for this year is about me taking full measure and responsibility (emotionally--i already do it physically) for the finances! it's been amazing work so far and it has created more abundance!

wow! i just feel SO amazing. and it's so funny, i seem to be the only person who feels happier and excited about our finances during tax season! LOL

your home and investments have maintained their value?? huh??

we feel blessed, too that we have not been hit by this recession in any way that compromises our standard of living, but nonetheless our home and 401 (k) have absolutely lost value!!


----------



## witchygrrl

I know my ILs have a financial guy who moves their monetary investments around quite often, so for the most part, they have not lost much value. So it can be done.

I had 3 fillings done today, so I have a sore mouth. Rhea didn't sleep all that well last night either, so I've been super tired all day (I can't nap during her naps--I just don't fall asleep well during the day). Hopefully she sleeps better tonight--for all of our sakes!


----------



## cking

Tonight J clearly said Dada, Mama and Baby all in a row, right before bed time.







:


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, too cute. i am getting all teary.

i have dx'd dd (prolly paranoidly) with fifth disease. nothing to do but scary sounding, no?

my 401k etc. has taken a 40% hit. so bad i do not even want to talk about it.







housing value has held so far -- manhattan is a unique market -- so far has only wonked out at the very high end. cross fingers for us.


----------



## ~Shanna~

nak

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
does your dh eat whatever he wants, or is he sort of going along? just curious, because mine is quite the sugar guy, and if i tried to tell him no more ice cream he'd probably laugh at me.









He asked how he could help with this, and I said I just needed him to not complain because I already know how hard it is, and to look out for himself. He eats what we eat while at home, but keeps a huge stash of illegals at work and in the basement for when F is asleep, which is better than I get. We also bumped his dining out for lunch budget substantially. So he's getting by, but home feels like a war zone to him.
We miss you here, friend







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Shanna - garlic suppositories every night for the weeks before you test. Also know that you don't have to treat it if you are positive. The chances of it affecting the babe are extremely low though the cost is high if your babe does catch it...but there are ways to monitor and treat the babe after birth if necessary.

Don't the garlic suppositories kill both "bad" and "good"? I know we don't have to treat if I am positive, but I'm preparing for Dh not being comfortable with doing nothing - we're going to talk with the midwives about the options and I'll probably test close to 40 weeks so we at least know if I'm negative.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
what's the plan?

I got o bed with him at 9 pm, Dh takes him if needed between 11 and 1, and I take him the rest of the night if he's inconsolable without nursing at night. We determined that Fenton is confused by a gradual approach to nightweaning, so we went cold-turkey the last 2 nights after explaining to him what was changing. I slept the best last night than I have in months, which is very encouraging. He was up 3 times, but all times he could be consoled within about 15 minutes and went to sleep cuddling his daddy. I think DH is adjusting to what is means to sleep with a toddler wedged up next to you...hence, my great sleep. Last night went well enough that I'm hoping that soon I wont' need to go to bed with him at 9 to guarentee some sleep for me. But last night I got a good 8 or 9 hours, albeit spread out. But: I got to sleep on my stomach! Comfortably!!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
wow! i just feel SO amazing. and it's so funny, i seem to be the only person who feels happier and excited about our finances during tax season! LOL

I love tax time too, but mostly because we usually get a fat refund









Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I had 3 fillings done today, so I have a sore mouth. Rhea didn't sleep all that well last night either, so I've been super tired all day (I can't nap during her naps--I just don't fall asleep well during the day). Hopefully she sleeps better tonight--for all of our sakes!

Oh sister....I'm so sorry.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Tonight J clearly said Dada, Mama and Baby all in a row, right before bed time.







:

I was just thinking to myself that J isn't the newborn that I still picture. <sniff>


----------



## accountclosed3

well, we have lost some value, but certainly not what most people are talking about! i think our home value went down $4k (we live in a desirable area where there are very few homes at our price point, so our condos sell really fast. for example, the last one sold in three weeks, and there's one that's been on the market for 10 days and has an offer). the 401k and stuff went down about $10k, which isn't all that bad. it has held most of it's value.

we also get a nice, fat refund usually--so we reinvest that.







it's awesome.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
well, we have lost some value, but certainly not what most people are talking about! i think our home value went down $4k (we live in a desirable area where there are very few homes at our price point, so our condos sell really fast. for example, the last one sold in three weeks, and there's one that's been on the market for 10 days and has an offer). the 401k and stuff went down about $10k, which isn't all that bad. it has held most of it's value.

we also get a nice, fat refund usually--so we reinvest that.







it's awesome.









I can say the same about our condo all the way until the time on the market and prices (the important stuff!) We live in one of the most expensive zip codes in Maryland (umm, I mean in the country) and have more million dollar mansions than condos, great schools, open spaces, always on the "best places to live" lists, yada, yada, yada. But like everywhere else (mostly everywhere, I mean) prices have dropped about 15-20% from the very top of the market. While that means we'll barely break even on on our condo (which we have thoroughly renovated), it DOES mean we got a pretty nice deal on our "new" house! On the flip side, we got an offer at just 4 days on the market (negotiating currently). Wish us luck!


----------



## Sihaya

Back from an unplanned internet hiatus and pleasantly surprised to see so much to catch up on here. Keeping busy with the 15 new chicks that arrived in the mail yesterday. They're so cute they're actually helping the baby fever a little bit


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 









Back from an unplanned internet hiatus and pleasantly surprised to see so much to catch up on here. Keeping busy with the 15 new chicks that arrived in the mail yesterday. They're so cute they're actually helping the baby fever a little bit









Oooh, that sounds like fun!

Big news for us today. We actually left the house before 10AM!














It's been hard since I've been pg. I'm just SO tired and so lazy!! Anyway, we spent some time at the park and then went to the grocery store. I feel like a good mother today.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Big news for us today. We actually left the house before 10AM!














It's been hard since I've been pg. I'm just SO tired and so lazy!! Anyway, we spent some time at the park and then went to the grocery store. I feel like a good mother today.









this would be big news for us on any non-work/sch day, and i am not pregnant. dd has the pukes, so we didn't go much of anywhere today. just the grocery store. twice. because i somehow walked out without the yogurt i had paid $$$$$ for.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 









Back from an unplanned internet hiatus and pleasantly surprised to see so much to catch up on here. Keeping busy with the 15 new chicks that arrived in the mail yesterday. They're so cute they're actually helping the baby fever a little bit









aww, so cute. Good luck with the chicks!

Maela, that is a feat indeed.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Keeping busy with the 15 new chicks that arrived in the mail yesterday.

Make that 14









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oooh, that sounds like fun!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
aww, so cute. Good luck with the chicks!

Thank you both. They are lots of fun and very cute!

*Maela* - Color me impressed, that only happens here once or twice a week, on the days we have to leave at 7:30am to bring DH to work so we can have the car.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Make that 14









Thank you both. They are lots of fun and very cute!

*Maela* - Color me impressed, that only happens here once or twice a week, on the days we have to leave at 7:30am to bring DH to work so we can have the car.

Oh, Steph I'm so sorry about the chick.







That part of it would be hard for me. BTW, are you raising them for eggs or meat too?

We also have to leave at 7 sometimes to take Dh to work on rainy days! But I guess I didn't count that because I'm usually still in my pajamas.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Make that 14









Oh Steph, I'm so sorry







. With getting 15, that's about what you'd expect (that some die anyway, through no fault of your own). Still, it had to be sad.

We got chicks too, only 2, and Fenton is in love. While the weather is still a little cold, we have them in a big chick box in our laundry room in the basement, and he insists that we eat our lunch down there so we can watch the "baby chickens". He's also recently fallen in love with space shuttles (














and runs around yelling "10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1- BLASTOFF!". Which is funny, because he usually misses a number if he counts forward







. Nightweaning is going well, though he usually pounces on me as soon as he sees a glimmer of light. Last nigth was the roughest, he woke ~midnight and was having a tough time, so we were up ~30 minutes reading, getting a snack and blasting off. But he's definately reacting to something still, and I know it's the goat dairy I'm eating. I can't give it up, there's no way I can get enough calories without it since he's also sensitive to other caloric things like nuts, coconut, etc. So begining Monday, we are weaning completely







. I don't know if "m more sad or anxious - both, I guess. I just can't believe that this part of our life is going to be over in just 3 days. I feel sick whenever I think about it and I'm crying constantly...We're intending to wean cold-turkey after talking with him about it since yesterday. This is against all advice I've gotten and we'll certainly re-evaluate if we need to, but I simply can't continue to give him my milk when I see that it's toxic to him, especially when I know his personality and it seems that doing anything gradually is more confusing to him. With the weather turning warmer I'm more optimistic. But I'm pretty much clearing my calendar for the next couple of months and planning on just showering him with attention. I'm mostly worried about the afternoon nap, as it's the one sleep that is impossible to get him into without nursing, unless we get into the car. The carrier _might_ work, but I won't be able to do that more than a couple more months. We had such a rough start to our nursing relationship - I can't believe it's going to end this way. I really had hoped that I would never know when the last time was going to be







. I feel better knowing that most nursing mamas aren't happy with how weaning went, but I really wanted it to be on his own initiative, or at least until it wasn't quite so important to him. This is the most difficult thing I've ever gone through. I'm going to continue to pump for the first week, just in case a miracle comes through. But I'm trying to figure out how to move on during all of this. So....wish me luck


----------



## witchygrrl

Oh Shanna, I am so sorry.







I hope you can come to some sort of peace about it. You're such a great mama!


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oh, Steph I'm so sorry about the chick.







That part of it would be hard for me. BTW, are you raising them for eggs or meat too?

We're raising these ones for eggs. If it had been a meat chick, I probably wouldn't be as sad because I won't be bonding with them at all. Next year, we'll get another ~15 chicks for eggs and then a different batch for meat.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
We also have to leave at 7 sometimes to take Dh to work on rainy days! But I guess I didn't count that because I'm usually still in my pajamas.









Pajamas - how nice! If we take DH, we are usually gone at least until noon but often all day since we live a ways from "the city" now and I try to bunch all of our appointments, classes, playgroups, and errands together. I can't wait until our second car gets fixed. Having only one car in such a rural area is just not practical at this point.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Oh Steph, I'm so sorry







. With getting 15, that's about what you'd expect (that some die anyway, through no fault of your own). Still, it had to be sad.

I expected 1-2 casualties, it just didn't occur to me that one of my favorite breed would be the first to go. It was a bit of a consolation that it died of a birth defect and not because of something we did, but I'm still a bit sad about it.

*Shanna* - Lots of







luck, and good thoughts coming your way. I know it probably doesn't feel like it, but I think you're so strong to handle your circumstances the way you are.


----------



## Maela

s







s shanna


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Pajamas - how nice! If we take DH, we are usually gone at least until noon but often all day since we live a ways from "the city" now and I try to bunch all of our appointments, classes, playgroups, and errands together. I can't wait until our second car gets fixed. Having only one car in such a rural area is just not practical at this point.

This reminds me--I need to get my car fixed, as much as I'd rather just junk the thing. It's not quite dead yet, though--there's still plenty of life in her. I just feel like we've poured so much money into a car we barely use, and it bothers me.

Raising chicks sounds like a great adventure! I'm sorry that one of your favorite breed was such a quick casualty. But overall, this sounds like fun. I'd love to hear more about it.


----------



## PiePie

omg *shanna*, how sad. i came here to ask you 2 qs re nightweaning but they have quite flown from my head. fwiw, i am jealous of your child spacing. you are giving him a lifetime gift of a sib close in age. i worry i won't be able to in part because of lactational amenorrhea.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, so you are still cosleeping but not night-nursing? how does that work?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Tonight J clearly said Dada, Mama and Baby all in a row, right before bed time.







:

I read this, but forgot to comment on it! Awwww!!! I loved hearing those first words! Congratulations.







:

Re: nightweaning. I think I'm finally ready. Dd is still getting some more teeth (seems as though she's been teething for months nonstop now), but I think that in a month (dh's spring break) we are going to nightwean. I'm not big or anything yet, but my back is already bothering me and I really need some space in bed. I'm not sleeping well at all. And I think she can do it, although I know it will be hard for her at first. I've been saying for about six months now that I want to nightwean her, but I just didn't feel right about it. Now I finally feel okay about it. A little anxious, but okay.







I'm not sure what our method will be yet. I'll have to give it some thought.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Thanks for all the







s.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*shanna*, so you are still cosleeping but not night-nursing? how does that work?

Yes! And it's working great, even during this transition. When he wakes up and is upset that "the sun isn't up yet", he says "cuddle Daddy" and usually rolls over to cuddle daddy. Sometimes he wants Daddy to "picka him up", which means for DH to sit up against pillows and hold him that way. Sometimes he says "cuddle mama", but usually it's Daddy. This is better than I could have hoped - some nights are a little rough like last night, but no where near what I was afraid of so far. We're keeping a plan of DH sleeping with F in one room and me sleeping with the new LO in another in our back pocket, as I'm afraid of them waking each other up. it's nice to know that that 'worst case scenario" is a possibility even this early in the game. Could see some regression with total weaning though







. Loving him up a LOT today.


----------



## witchygrrl

cking, I also meant to comment on J's verbiage--that's so great! I was just thinking about how close to a year old she is now. They grow up so fast!

Shanna, sounds like you're making great plans. You'll all do just fine, I'm sure.

Rhea tried her first big ppl food this week. Avocado. I tried it both by giving t her on a spoon and by giving her hunks of it in the skin to see what she did with it. And...she hates it in her mouth, but man is it fun to squish! We tried it for 3 nights in a row, so we're going to take a little break, and attempt sweet potato next week.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Trying to catch up here.

*MMM*- Congratulations on the birth of your son. That day is mine & DH's wedding anniversary.

*Shanna & Maela*- Yay for #2s on the way!


----------



## cking

Oh Steph, I'm sorry about the chick.









Shanna, lots of







s. You are so strong. I know you will all get through this.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl*
cking, I also meant to comment on J's verbiage--that's so great! I was just thinking about how close to a year old she is now. They grow up so fast!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela*
I read this, but forgot to comment on it! Awwww!!! I loved hearing those first words! Congratulations.

Thanks.







It's funny, it's hard to say when her first word really was, since she's been saying something for a while, but this was so deliberate. I'm also getting all teary over how close her birthday is - I feel like I need to 'close out' a lot of stuff before we move onto toddlerhood. At least with photos (and birth story!), but with non-material stuff as well. Anybody else?

Oh, and she still only has four teeth, but now she has started getting a molar. Weird!

Witchy, congrats on starting the solid food. Avocado is still one of J's faves, even though she didn't actually consume it for a few months. Before you know it Rhea will be grabbing food out of your hands.









Nice to see you Alice!


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 







Trying to catch up here.

*MMM*- Congratulations on the birth of your son. That day is mine & DH's wedding anniversary.

*Shanna & Maela*- Yay for #2s on the way!

Hello! I was thinking about you the other day. I forget what sparked my memory but I was wondering how you were doing. I'm glad you're still around and lurking too!


----------



## arelyn

Shanna:







and prayers that you will have peace and Fenton will have a healthy tummy.


----------



## Maela

Dd has taken a regular 2 hour nap at approximately the same time every day for over a month now!!







:

*Shanna*, how are things? I've been thinking about you and Fenton today.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Shanna*, how are things? I've been thinking about you and Fenton today.









I literally think I had divine intervention







:







:







:







:







:







:







:







:

On Friday, Dh and I were both puzzled to see that Fenton's eczema was looking a lot better. We started going through what had changed, and it took us forever to figure out that, with the goats that we get our milk from out of milk until the babies came, I had switched to a goat cheese. Long story short, we're almost positive that he was reacting to an additive in the yogurt culture that I use! I've had this yogurt every day of his life, so that's frustrating, but that's the nature of what we're dealing with: the trigger foods expand "all of a sudden". So, I'm able to get enough calories, and Fenton is still nursing!!!!!!!!Although, I'm spending $90 a month just on cheese







0.7 cents per calorie a day....

Going to experiment some with kefir in the milk, or just straight up milk, as it's cheaper, organic and has about 200 more calories a day (I fight for every one) - it's even a possibility that he can tolerate goats milk himself and it's been the yogurt culture that bothered him when we tried a while ago. Having minor setbacks with _Brassica_ veggies which is frustrating, but I'm trying to remember how close we came to abruptly weaning.

Nightweaning is still going great, last night he slept 8 hours before awaking, and we didn't have to leave bed to comfort him. I'm trying to count my blessings because I'm definately getting some breaks here. But I'm feeling quite a bit depressed to see so much of my daily work disappear - so much of the food preparation that I did is no longer relevent, and even so much of my spring projects are irrelevent: He can't have eggs so the chickens we're raising are more pets (at least for a while - maybe only until they start laying ~ Fall














, and the cabbage and tomato seedlings that I've started he can't have either. I'm trying to find other things that make me feel like I'm productive and more than just a playmate. But for the first time in 2 years, I'm feeling that SAHM boredom









Maela, congrats on the naptime! I find that in pregnancy, my sleep patterns are exactly the same as a Toddlers








Hi Rico's Alice!!! We've missed you! Also been wondering about JodiB andBeccaBear....


----------



## Maela

: Yay Shanna!! I was hoping something freaky like that would happen and you wouldn't have to go through that.


----------



## PiePie

OMG, *Shanna*, I feel like a weight has been lifted, i was so sad for lil F.


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna, hooray for being able to still nurse. I know there is still a long way to go, but you're making progress. I hear you on the SAHM boredom, though. I'm sure there will be other projects that you can come up with (are there other veggies that you can plant, for instance?)

So I decided to break down and take the Synthroid. My tsh levels were out of control, and after reading the Thyroid thread, it seemed to me that most people who were having issues were having them on a borderline (at least according to the lab, and so no one would take them seriously). I've been having issues all winter, but no doctor doubts my lab results! I have been taking steps to nourish my body and glands correctly, but I guess it hadn't been enough







I just want to feel like I have enough energy to be as engaged a mommy as I feel I need to be.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 







: Yay Shanna!! I was hoping something freaky like that would happen and you wouldn't have to go through that.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
OMG, *Shanna*, I feel like a weight has been lifted, i was so sad for lil F.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Shanna, hooray for being able to still nurse. I know there is still a long way to go, but you're making progress. I hear you

I know - I can't believe how much that has helped. I was literally crying all the time







. I can't help but think it was a prayer answered, because there is _no_ reason we should have pieced this info together.

On the bad mommy front, I'm contemplating going out to dinner with Dh for my birthday and having some "illegal" food. It's a terrible idea from a chemical perspective (since some of it will get in my milk), and I wouldn't do it if I _knew_ that it would set us back healing even a day. Apparently, ignorance is bliss. But I can't tell you how hard it is on morale to have him react to Kale or broccoli when I'm choking down food every meal of the day - I think to myself "hell, I could have had the pizza. And the hot dogs. And the 2 boxes of Deluxe Kraft Mac and Cheese". I don't know if I'm just fantasizing or if we'll actually do it. DH thought a compromise would be a dairy free and gluten free birthday meal (Mexican! Can I dare to eat something that doesn't make me wretch?). It's the most selfish thing I've considered in months







.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
So I decided to break down and take the Synthroid. My tsh levels were out of control, and after reading the Thyroid thread, it seemed to me that most people who were having issues were having them on a borderline (at least according to the lab, and so no one would take them seriously). I've been having issues all winter, but no doctor doubts my lab results! I have been taking steps to nourish my body and glands correctly, but I guess it hadn't been enough







I just want to feel like I have enough energy to be as engaged a mommy as I feel I need to be.

Were you torn because of nursing?


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Were you torn because of nursing?









Not exactly. Synthroid is one of the safest things to take while nursing, from what I've read. It was more my reticence to take a non-natural medication, and be pretty much told I'd have to do this forever. But it has seemed that since giving birth and nursing my child that my hormones had gone completely out of whack, no matter what herbs or foods I had been eating. I've been mildly depressed, I have skin issues like I've never had before, etc. etc. Whereas before getting pregnant, I felt that I was really getting a handle on them with natural supplements and the right foods. I had no idea that my body chemistry would change this way.

The other problem is Rhea. She's TINY. And I always feel like I'm questioning my supply. So while she's meeting her milestones and such, I feel like she's just barely getting enough, even though she is on the breast almost constantly. So I started taking fenugreek again. Thankfully I seem to respond to that quickly. But I also read that being hypothyroid can lead to supply issues. I just feel like I was denying what was going on, chalking it up to the bad winter or even mild PPD, when it was my thyroid, which I was supposedly nourishing, all along. Sigh.


----------



## Sihaya

*Shanna* -







: I have been thinking of you often, especially since Monday. SO GLAD to hear weaning is not necessary now. What a fantastic turn of events! As far as "cheating" for your birthday, is it an option to pump ahead of time and offer a sippy of pumped milk until the "illegal" foods are out of your system (or in more acceptable levels)?

*witchygrrl* -







on making the decision to take synthroid. I stopped taking it a few months ago when my BBT suddenly randomly jumped from low to normal, but I waver about going back on it if/when my symptoms return. FYI, though the Synthroid did alleviate many if not all of my other thyroid-related issues, it did not improve my milk supply. I have heard the same thing from other hypothyroid mamas with milk supply issues.

News here - Calvin has mastered going up and down our stairs to the basement by himself! Now we frequently find him visiting the chicks without us. Guess it's time to build a door/gate at the top of the stairs - one more project to add to the neverending list!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*Shanna* -







: I have been thinking of you often, especially since Monday. SO GLAD to hear weaning is not necessary now. What a fantastic turn of events! As far as "cheating" for your birthday, is it an option to pump ahead of time and offer a sippy of pumped milk until the "illegal" foods are out of your system (or in more acceptable levels)?

I was thinking that we'd go in the evening and I'd have DH put him to sleep at night, so that I'd have about 12 hours to work it out of my system, with probably a pump-and-dump in there somewhere - I didn't think about pumping before hand, thanks for the idea







Not sure if it will be worth it, all this planning for one meal that is over a month way. But to actually eat something that tastes good....








: I literally go to bed every night, fantasizing about food the way other people do about sex. I'm convinced this diet begets eating disorders. It's more than I can manage to picture doing this diet for 18 months like I did before. I pray every day that it's over before the baby comes.

Witchy, I'm so sorry for all of the turmoil







. This is probably only a drop in a bucket, but could cod liver oil help? (Can't remember if you're veggie or not - I think yes, in which case, forgive me). I was just thinking between skin and depression - the Vita A and D might smooth out some edges.


----------



## cking

Shanna, that's wonderful!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm trying to find other things that make me feel like I'm productive and more than just a playmate. But for the first time in 2 years, I'm feeling that SAHM boredom









Please tell me you weren't this productive a year ago? I feel like we're still getting the hang of things over here. And I still haven't finished a book. In 11 months. But anyway, not so much boredom, more frustration here.







:


----------



## PiePie

I am very proud of Master Calvin's climbing prowess.







DD is the best climber in her school, including the pre-K. God has a sense of humor to give *us* an athlete!

*Shanna*, stop wasting energy on guilt! as you may recall, i spent 2 weeks on the dairy-free diet testing whether DD's reflux was a dairy intolerance. It was torture! I would have continued it if it worked, but it didn't. I was doing the fantasizing about pizza, etc. thing too.

*cking*, when I was home with DD, i got frustrated when I tried to do too much. Just keeping the baby alive and one project each day. some projects count double.


----------



## Maela

About SAHM boredom: Wow, shanna I'm impressed. I am not doing any of those things you were doing (well, we did have a small garden this summer) and I still don't get everything done. Not even close. I guess it's good, cause I don't get bored.







I was just starting to get the hang of things (house was clean most of the time, healthy dinner made by me every night, clean clothes to wear, etc.) when I got pg. Now the house is a mess again. It will be better in the second half of the pg. And then it will be messy again for another year or so after the baby's born.







Oh well.

I'm also impressed with your food discipline.







I have no food restrictions and I still can't manage to eat healthy.







I keep telling myself as soon as the morning sickness is over, I am going to eat SO well and exercise daily. I'm actually really looking forward to it. I just can't bring myself to do more than the bare minimum (keep house sanitary, take care of Maev) right now. Soooo tired...

We just lost Dh's grandpa last month and now each of us has a grandmother in the hospital right now. It's hard knowing that in the next five years Dh and I are likely to lose the rest of our grandparents.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I was thinking that we'd go in the evening and I'd have DH put him to sleep at night, so that I'd have about 12 hours to work it out of my system, with probably a pump-and-dump in there somewhere - I didn't think about pumping before hand, thanks for the idea







Not sure if it will be worth it, all this planning for one meal that is over a month way. But to actually eat something that tastes good....







: I literally go to bed every night, fantasizing about food the way other people do about sex. I'm convinced this diet begets eating disorders. It's more than I can manage to picture doing this diet for 18 months like I did before. I pray every day that it's over before the baby comes.

Witchy, I'm so sorry for all of the turmoil







. This is probably only a drop in a bucket, but could cod liver oil help? (Can't remember if you're veggie or not - I think yes, in which case, forgive me). I was just thinking between skin and depression - the Vita A and D might smooth out some edges.

Shanna, you are a strong woman.

I did start taking fish oil (vit D3 only), as I'm a little squicky on adding more vitA beyond my prenatal which I'm still taking. I think it's helped some, as is the returning sunshine. Being able to take walks again is such a small thing, but so wonderful. I definitely think I was getting deficient, especially after cutting out most dairy for Rhea's sake.

Sihaya, I'm glad I decided to continue the fenugreek then if the synthroid won't help the supply issue.


----------



## Maela

I had my first appt with my mw this morning! It went really well. She's the same one we used for Dd, so I already knew she was great. I had good urine and a good blood pressure. Everything's going well so far. She gave me some tips on eating healthier with morning sickness and said that she thought hypnobabies was great. (I asked her about it because I've been thinking about using it, but I wanted to know if she had had any clients who have used it and what she thought.) So I'm pretty sure I'm going to be getting the home study course soon. I'm excited to try it out.
anyway, I'm just happy because it went so well. Ms isn't too bad today either.









eta: I'm really hoping to have a "boring" pg this time!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

DS and DP are sleeping in so I may actually get 5 minutes to write this post...

*Shanna* - I've been following your weaning/diet drama. So so happy that you don't have to wean before you're both ready...I too cannot ever imagine being more productive than just keeping Sebby alive. I did buy a novel the other day but I'm feeling like that may have been a little too adventurous just yet!

*Witchy* - Try selenium. I've been off my synthroid since my first trimester and I'm pretty sure it's the selenium heavy multi I take that fixed my hypothyroid. (And don't worry about what I'm about to write - the selenium has nothing to do with it!!!)

AFU - we're keeping our heads above water though we're still battling with a few challenges.

Thyroid - Somehow, my hypothyroid has swung right up and gone hyperthyroid. It's off the charts. It's pretty bizarre given that I have confirmed Hashimoto's. Apparently pregnancy can play havoc with your endocrine system... Anyway, I'm not having any symptoms so I'm not panicking yet and haven't decided yet what I'm going to do to fix it - anyone here got any ideas?

My nipples are a mess - no longer cracked but still thrushy AND now covered in psoriasis. I'm not really sure what to do. I'm not thrilled about using steroid creams but I feel as though I haven't got a choice 'cos the problem is so acute and immediate.

Homeless - We've got to be out of our house in a month and at this point it looks like we're putting all our stuff in storage and going to stay with my Mum. I cry every time I think about it. There's just no rental properties around at the moment, even ones that are way too expensive. I feel like everyone is laughing at us because we've always been so defiant about not buying a house before we had kids. (Because we know that it'll take us 10 more years to save the kind of money you need to buy a house in an area we want to live in.) The thought of moving into my mothers house makes me feel like such a loser. Not to mention the severe inconvenience of it all. How am I going to pack? I don't have 2 hands available ever!!

Sleep and me time - It occurred to me last week that I'm actually really tired. I do not get a break, ever. Sebby doesn't sleep during the day - we get 5 and 10 minute cat-naps but never a solid sleep and always on me. He's also starting to get very Mama-centric so I'm the only one who can soothe him. It's draining.

BUT - I'm about to go to yoga with him and determined to feel good today and on that note I better wake and dress the boy.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, it gets easier around 4 mos -- he will start to sleep in 2 longer chunks. not easy enough to be an equal partner in parentuing, and not the same me time as pre baby but it does get better when naps consolidate and regularize. i thought about what nap sched would work best for me and lay down with her at those times. oila, a schedule!


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, so sorry to hear about all of your troubles.







and getting alone/"me" time is the toughest part of parenting for me. It's why right now that I think I might only want two kids. It *does* get better as they get older though. I have no ideas for you. I'll be thinking sleepy thoughts for Sebby (not for you







). Hopefully, he'll start sleeping longer stretches soon!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I saw 2 robins this morning!!!!!







:
It's not that I'm feeling guilty for not being productive, it's that the things I used to do really made me feel fulfilled in what I did. I parent best when I'm slightly distracted, when Fenton and I are working together (or parallel) for a household. Right now I'm feeling like I just follow him around, staring at him, waiting for him to stray to the dark side for a second. It makes me tense and much less patient with him than when I had other things to focus on as well. I think I need to figure out what other things I've wanted to do that I felt like I couldn't because I was so home-bound with my work. Thinking about making a committment to take Fenton on a hike each afternoon or something like that. Milk supply is getting worse and getting us more frustrated when milk runs out before he falls asleep at nap time, etc.

I wasn't very productive until he was about a year or so (until he could stand on a chair at the counter and help), and even then I wasn't ever as productive as I intended to be. I would slowly work through a do-to list over the week and welcome the interruptions.

MMM, it sounds like things are really rough over there. I sympathize with that feeling of never getting a break, though I never had the hardship of a child that didn't nap in stretches - I can't imagine how much harder that makes it







. I'm not sure if you're open to it, but I found a swing really helpful. Fenton napped well in one for a few months, and it allowed some "me" time.

First pre-natal appointment on Tuesday







: Already feeling uterine stretches, sometimes I even feel like I feel movement already, though it seems unlikely that it's "movement". Kind of excited to wear maternity clothes, all my regular clothes are wearing out and I don't want to buy new







.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I parent best when I'm slightly distracted, when Fenton and I are working together (or parallel) for a household. Right now I'm feeling like I just follow him around, staring at him, waiting for him to stray to the dark side for a second. It makes me tense and much less patient with him than when I had other things to focus on as well.

You know, I think I would enjoy parenting more if I tried to work along side dd more often. I'd probably get more done too.








I think the daily hike/walk idea is great.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
First pre-natal appointment on Tuesday







: Already feeling uterine stretches, sometimes I even feel like I feel movement already, though it seems unlikely that it's "movement". Kind of excited to wear maternity clothes, all my regular clothes are wearing out and I don't want to buy new







.

Yay! My clothes are also wearing out. I only have one pair of pants that even remotely fits me. So I went out the other day and bought myself a pair of maternity cropped pants. Sooooo comfy! I love maternity pants! Definitely not big enough to wear the shirts though.


----------



## accountclosed3

so, ryan and i are talking about moving to NZ. i'm excited about everything except the taxes. i'll have to pay taxes for two countries (as far as i can tell). obviously, where i live (NZ), and then of course, US taxes!

i do have a good CPA, and so he's going to help us figure it all out, financially. what the benefits and drawbacks are, and so on.

ryan figured out that a lot of his anxiety has come from a strong sense of feeling like he's not doing what he wants to do. he feels that he works very, very hard for very little pay off, and has very little life-work balance. i think he's right, honestly.

we both feel that wellington is a better choice for us than LA. wellington has wellywood and from a yoga perspective, there are great prospects for me too (i may buy an existing yoga studio and run that). ryan could get a day job like here, but the whole culture of NZ is more family oriented anyway, and it's the 12th most livable city in the world (or something like this) and the WHO says it's one of the safest in the world too.

and, we've been there and we like it.

so, we're starting the process. ryan has already applied for two jobs; i've contacted the yoga studio about buying the place (they aren't ready to sell until autumn or spring of next year); and we've contacted immigration to find out what that process is (their web site is GREAT, but one quesiton wasn't answered and they were so polite).

you're the only folks we're telling; i'm assuming yhou don't know anyone around here. LOL

we haven't told anyone else because we want to see how it pans out, and if we do decide to go, we'll tell our families a month or two before hand. we're hoping to move next Jan, but no earlier than Sept of this year. we want to have hawk's first b-day here.

it's exciting and scary! but, the dollar is strong so the money we earn on the house as well as rolling over our savings and retirement funds...everything doubles in value (1 US = .50 NZ). so, that's kinda cool.


----------



## Maela

*ZB* that does sound exciting! If I could bring the ILs (yeah they're okay







) and my parents with me, I'd want to move to NZ too! I haven't been there, just seen pictures and heard lots of good things.

Maev is starting to use the words I, a, you, etc. Most of the time not correctly. But it is so cute that she's making this conscious effort. Today while she was nursing, she stopped to say, "I nurse Maev little girl."









Also Dh and I have started asking her "do you want me to tell you a story?" She will say yes and sit and listen to our made up story (usually about someone named Maev







) for 5 or so minutes. I love it. I have fun telling her stories and it forces me to be creative; something I'm not usually very good at.


----------



## PiePie

*zoe*, wow on the big change possibility!! mum's the word, sister.


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, that's great!

If you start a real yoga class for mums with babies and toddlers I'll go!








I miss yoga, have only been a few times since DD was born (DD isn't happy with babysitters, and with DH's schedule it is difficult to arrange. There is a mum and baby yoga we went to a few times, but she uses a combination of yoga and pilates, and it is in a smelly community room in a dark basement. One thing I used to love about the yoga classes I went to was the atmosphere, the lightness, the freshness, the cds playing in the background).

Welcome to Windy Welly!







:

BTW, NZ and US have a double taxation agreement, so if I understand it right, you shouldn't need to pay tax in both countries. http://news.abaconda.info/2008/09/ne...ion-agreement/


----------



## witchygrrl

Best wishes on emigrating to NZ, Zoe! It sounds like you'll really enjoy it there! Let us know how that works out.

Rhea is crawling! She had going backwards for about a month now, but in the past few days she has made up her mind to move forward.


----------



## accountclosed3

thanks for that, AC!

can i say that you totally read my mind? we're hoping to buy a yoga studio there and add some family classes (3 x per week). these are classes where you can bring your kids and they can do yoga with you or not. there is one class in our area like this, and it's ok.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Rhea is crawling! She had going backwards for about a month now, but in the past few days she has made up her mind to move forward.

Yay Rhea!!


----------



## accountclosed3

it's hard to believe that our babes are already crawling. well, my guy is just scooting, but he's getting closer! crazy


----------



## Holiztic

so have i yet mentioned that we have bought a house, started renovating, sold our condo (under contract, settlement in 2 weeks) and are moving into the new house this weekend! Oh, and DH's sister and BIL are going to be with us for a few months.

Every time I have tried to type an update to you all something happens and I have to abandon it. If that happens this time, I'm posting it unfinished--be forewarned.

So Quinn is 2 next month! He's talking up a storm, saying 4-5 word sentences, he's staring to understand number (mostly one and two), color (blue, red, green, white, orange, brown, black) and seems to understand plurality and possession. An example, he sees a red pickup truck and says "red truck", then sees another nearby and says "two red trucks". He's blowing me away! Yesterday he said "Mommy eat Quinn's cheese" when I took a bite of his cheese.

So back to the house: we are going from 990 sq feet 2BR/2Ba to 2000 sq ft 4 BR/3Ba with 2 car garage, finished basement and .5 acre lot. I have no idea what we are going to do with all that space (it will be half empty for months if not years!) But we feel so blessed and we're so thrilled!

ZB: MIL and SIL/BIL went to NZ a few summers ago and LOVED it, I really wish we could have gone, but Q was 2 months old. I look forward to hearing your updates!

Shanna: I have been reading your news with great interest, I am SOOO happy for your divine intervention!


----------



## accountclosed3

two, already?!

congrats on the new house and all of that too.

we also really loved NZ while there. it's a beautiful place and very family-friendly.


----------



## Maela

Holiztic, I am incredibly jealous of the size of your new house and yard!! Congratulations!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Such exciting stuff in the updates! Crawlers, moving....

I only have a sec, but thought you might interested since I may be the first to embark on this adventure:
Divine intervention was limited - Fenton's sensitive to yet more foods and frankly, I'm starving with having to drop even more - my half a stick of butter a day trick isn't even working anymore because I don't have anything to put it on. We're starting to help him to wean, my intention that I completely stop making milk available in a week and a half. It's far from ideal (too soon, not soon enough) but it's the best I can do. I have a lot of clarity now that I've tried *everything*, and my sadness is definately overshadowed by how hungry I am. He's holding up well so far with the limitations - we're down to 2 nursings a day, and on Thursday we'll be doing away with the naptime one. No idea how I'm going to get him to sleep. The last one to go will be the early morning one, which will be easy, but wide fallout as he will probably want to get up ~ 6 am without nursing to keep him drowsy.

At this point, I just can't wait to eat. I'm sinking and can't help him this way.


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*, you sound so much calmer this time; I think that's good. Does it help that it's not quite so sudden of a weaning? Sounds like he's doing well with it so far.








So he'll be weaned right around his birthday right? Two years of bfing is amazing (although I know it's not how you wanted it to end







). I'm excited for you to be able to eat too!!

*I can't believe Fenton & Quinn are going to be two!!!*

I am hoping that I can bf Maev until she's two; I just don't know if my milk will last. I'm not sure if she's the kind of kid who would dry nurse. So far, I've only noticed a small drop in my supply, but I'm only 11 weeks.


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna,







I agree with Maela--you do seem calmer this time. Probably the divine intervention gave you enough time to be more okay with weaning. I hope it goes smoothly for all of you.

Holiztic--congrats on the house and Quinn turning 2!

I'm starting to look for a new place. We want to move closer to where DH works, so he doesn't have an hour commute, though we'd really like the teacher's union to hurry up and vote already, so we can be 100% sure if DH still has his job (the issue at hand is whether a pay freeze will go into effect--if it does then we're 100% safe. if it doesn't 16 teachers will lose their jobs, and we don't know who those 16 will be.)

MMM, I meant to comment back when you were talking about moving into your mother's house for awhile. I know it stinks, but you'll have some time to save and hopefully something will pop up. DH and I were homeless when we got married actually. We were staying in a friend's studio apt. that was cramped, lemme tell ya! Anyway, I hope your stay is short.







Also, could you pm me on how much selenium you had in your prenatal? Mine has 100 mcg, and I've been taking it since before I was pregnant. Not sure how much would work, ya know?


----------



## ~Shanna~

ZB, the baby that I used to pump for is moving to NZ with his Dad this year - his late Mama was from there, and Dad wants to raise Jack where is Mama grew up. It looks beautiful there, I hope you get to make this happen! I hear that the movie industry there has really taken off since LotR too.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Shanna*, you sound so much calmer this time; I think that's good. Does it help that it's not quite so sudden of a weaning? Sounds like he's doing well with it so far.







So he'll be weaned right around his birthday right? Two years of bfing is amazing (although I know it's not how you wanted it to end







). I'm excited for you to be able to eat too!!

*I can't believe Fenton & Quinn are going to be two!!!*

I am hoping that I can bf Maev until she's two; I just don't know if my milk will last. I'm not sure if she's the kind of kid who would dry nurse. So far, I've only noticed a small drop in my supply, but I'm only 11 weeks.

I do feel much calmer. I have tried _everything_, and I see what this is doing to our relationship to have me be so hungry, worried about the baby, and worried about how my milk might be impeding his healing. I'm also starting to see how much of this was happening anyway because my supply went way down, I feel cagey when he dry nurses...it seems silly to try to preserve something at _such_ high cost when it isn't even giving the benefits. I feel blessed to come into this with such acceptance now, and I do think that the "divine intervention" came to serve that purpose. It's going to happen in a shorter time frame than I would have liked - we initially ( a couple of days ago) decided to do it over 4 weeks, and since then I've seen that I can't hang on much longer. I need some complex carbohydrates and pulses, and soon. Teh shorter time frame has been helped by the fact that my milk is drying up and I feel like we're effectively giving up the early am nursing anyway (though I intend for it to be last) because he's not getting any milk and waking up at 5:15 anyway. My biggest concern at this point is sleep deprivation because he relies on the nursing to stay asleep in the early am. But we're getting a good 2-3 hour nap in the afternoon (both of us) - Tomorrow my mission will be to figure out how to get him to sleep for the nap. I feel a little sad, but it's mostly because I hate what is signifies: the passage of time, that our relationship is changing and that I won't see him nuzzled against me in that exact way again. I'm going to miss that so much.








A couple of well-meaning folks have reminded me that I'll get to nurse again very soon, but that's missing the point entirely.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I'm starting to look for a new place. We want to move closer to where DH works, so he doesn't have an hour commute, though we'd really like the teacher's union to hurry up and vote already, so we can be 100% sure if DH still has his job (the issue at hand is whether a pay freeze will go into effect--if it does then we're 100% safe. if it doesn't 16 teachers will lose their jobs, and we don't know who those 16 will be.)

I've never seen an economic situation affect so many people so personally (probably because I've always been too young during each recession). You're in my prayers, I know you must be so anxious. A move closer to work would be such a blessing for so many things, huh?

My little boy is going to be 2 next week! He's such a little man - I took him swimming yesterday and he _jumped_ in! Yesterday he told his Daddy that he misses him when he's at class







: I can't believe how willing I am to bleed myself dry for this little soul.

Starting a regime to help my former Strep + status (assuming it's still the same, but I was _much_ sicker then) - wish me luck.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I feel a little sad, but it's mostly because I hate what is signifies: the passage of time, that our relationship is changing and that I won't see him nuzzled against me in that exact way again. I'm going to miss that so much.







A couple of well-meaning folks have reminded me that I'll get to nurse again very soon, but that's missing the point entirely.

This is exactly what I think about when I imagine DD weaning some day. The other day I tried to tell myself that I would get to nurse again soon too, but it's just not the same. It is sad that you'll never again nurse _that_ baby, yk?

Sorry I didn't mean to bring you down or anything, just saying that I think I understand what you mean about missing the point.









ETA: oh and nursing is starting to bug me too when she's gotten all the milk and there's not really anything left. It's such a weird feeling to be annoyed by her nursing; I've never had that before.


----------



## Maela

*witchy* dh and I will be sending "keep the job vibes" to you and your dh. We just recently found out that Dh is keeping his job for next year. It is so stressful while you're waiting for the answer!


----------



## witchygrrl

*Maela*, I'm so happy for you! It IS stressful to wait like this. DH talked to his building rep and was told they're still waiting for all the numbers from the administration before they vote on any contract changes. DH is annoyed because a pay freeze would be simple and save ALL the jobs.

But I am glad that your DH is keeping his job, especially with a second babe on the way.


----------



## ~Shanna~

2 hours ago, I succeeded in getting Fenton to sleep for his nap....







:
without nursing!

It only took covering the skylight to make the room dark, talking to him incessantly for a few days that we weren't going to be nursing before our nap anymore, and 25 minutes of reading books quietly and patiently while he laughed and climbed all over me, ending with me singing over and over again the Silly Lullabye song at the end of Boyntons Snoozers. I know that tomorrow it could all fall apart, this may be never happen again...but I have seen that IT CAN BE DONE!!!! I'm so proud of him







:

And! Earlier today I had a chance to plug in an average daily diet for him into fitday.com, and it looks _so much_ better than I feared. He's actually way above the RDAs for children on everything but calcium, and covers most of them for adults. The calcium I'm pretty sure we're covering with bone broths, but I may introduce canned salmon with bones just to be sure.

Things are definately looking up







:

And my beloved midwive has given me a protocol to begin for strep - it looks fabulous. Er,







, not because I've yet seen that it works, but because it gives me a lot to do







. Homemade herbal suppositories, cranberry and garlic extract, herbal peririnses...

YAY!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Homemade herbal suppositories, cranberry and garlic extract, herbal peririnses...

YAY!

Just saw this for what it is, and had to laugh


----------



## Rico'sAlice

I did TTO suppositories and had some of the most ridiculous (erotically themed) dreams of my life.


----------



## farmama

Yay Shanna!







: i'm so impressed that it can be done. i've been wondering lately, as my lo is all about the milk any time anything is out of place. (spill water on the floor? milk. try to make dinner? milk. answer the phone? milk. can't read a book, cause i'm juggling dinner, spilled water, and the phone? milk. milk. milk!)

plus, i've finally gone on a restrictive diet, to get rid of the candida, and i'm HUNGRY. this is definitely NOT a diet for nursing mamas. it makes me appreciate your hard work all the more Shanna.


----------



## PiePie

Can I just say how much I love you women? I have been feeling really really isolated vis-a-vis my mothering beliefs, mostly around BFing. It helped me so much to read Maela's and Shanna's feelings about weaning, because I feel the same way -- in my heart, I never want her to nurse (or leave our bed). In my head I probably will reduce nursing at some point, in part related to my lack of fertility, and in part because, well, I do think she should get her calories from solids at some point and should separate from her parents' bed at some point. But my heart just says waaaaaaaaaaahh! Not to say I don't feel put upon when I just put her down and she cries again, interrupting my 5 minutes of personal time. But God I'll be sad when it's over.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
Yay Shanna!







: i'm so impressed that it can be done. i've been wondering lately, as my lo is all about the milk any time anything is out of place. (spill water on the floor? milk. try to make dinner? milk. answer the phone? milk. can't read a book, cause i'm juggling dinner, spilled water, and the phone? milk. milk. milk!)









Fenton is like this too. It's a common refrain in our house "Just because Mama's on the phone, doesn't mean we have to have milk". But I have tried to limit those activities that seem to inspire "thirstiness" in him, especially while we're weaning. Which is hilarious to explain to friends why I haven't called them back









Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
plus, i've finally gone on a restrictive diet, to get rid of the candida, and i'm HUNGRY. this is definitely NOT a diet for nursing mamas. it makes me appreciate your hard work all the more Shanna.

Oh sweetie







. Isn't it a huge groan? What are you doing, GAPS, just restricting sugar? We are planning our very last nursing session tomorrow morning and I already have food cued up for right afterwards







. Nuts sprouting, oatmeal soaking, eggs hardboiled - all things I can eat quickly while he's distracted with something else. Plus pizza dough for an entire homemade pizza for after he goes to bed tomorrow night. Which I reserve the right to eat entirely myself.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Can I just say how much I love you women? I have been feeling really really isolated vis-a-vis my mothering beliefs, mostly around BFing.

Oh, sing it sister







If I have one more person respond to my sadness about weaning with "Well, um, he _is_ 2, right?" I'm just going to scream.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
It helped me so much to read Maela's and Shanna's feelings about weaning, because I feel the same way -- in my heart, I never want her to nurse (or leave our bed). In my head I probably will reduce nursing at some point, in part related to my lack of fertility, and in part because, well, I do think she should get her calories from solids at some point and should separate from her parents' bed at some point. But my heart just says waaaaaaaaaaahh! Not to say I don't feel put upon when I just put her down and she cries again, interrupting my 5 minutes of personal time. But God I'll be sad when it's over.

I haven't been so surprised by how sad I feel (though I have been really surprised by how much my sadness is related to just the plain passage of time and how I'll never have the same little boy today that I had yesterday). But I have been surprised over the past week by what opportunities these new evolutions bring. Maybe it's wishful thinking, but I feel like I'm seeing Fenton just explode in independance all of a sudden. He seems to have more of an agenda in playing, making up stories and singing. When he gets hurt or gets scared he comes to me and often asks for a hug or to "kiss it" (his finger, regardless of where he got hurt







) instead of instantly asking for milk (though he's still asking often, but now with an impish smile that seems to suggest he knows it's not in the cards). And while I think he wasn't completely ready to wean, he was way more ready than I thought he was and seems to be flourishing with the nudge from us. That has really surprised me, given what a breast man he is. So it's hard to picture now, but there are amazing things that take the place of what you lose. He's attaching to his Dad in situations where the breast is the only thing that would do before, and that's awesome to see.

Whew, I smell a diaper







. Wish me luck on nap #2.

Quick cute thing: Yesterday he saw 2 small moles on my breast and told me "dots on milk".


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Can I just say how much I love you women? I have been feeling really really isolated vis-a-vis my mothering beliefs, mostly around BFing. It helped me so much to read Maela's and Shanna's feelings about weaning, because I feel the same way -- in my heart, I never want her to nurse (or leave our bed). In my head I probably will reduce nursing at some point, in part related to my lack of fertility, and in part because, well, I do think she should get her calories from solids at some point and should separate from her parents' bed at some point. But my heart just says waaaaaaaaaaahh! Not to say I don't feel put upon when I just put her down and she cries again, interrupting my 5 minutes of personal time. But God I'll be sad when it's over.

I'm very glad that I have some irl support when it comes to bf'ing, like my family and my upstars neighbor, but then there's most other people. I was SO sad to learn that an acquaintance of mine switched her son to formula at 5 weeks because she HATED nursing. I don't get it. Even with all of its difficulties, the look of joy on Rhea's face when she's having "tasty mommy booby" is worth all of it.

Shanna, I'm glad that you're able to see the silver lining in this situation.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
When he gets hurt or gets scared he comes to me and often asks for a hug or to "kiss it" (his finger, regardless of where he got hurt







) instead of instantly asking for milk (though he's still asking often, but now with an impish smile that seems to suggest he knows it's not in the cards).

So cute! Dd has never been one to fix "ouchies" with nursing - even when I offer; she always wants me to kiss it - even if it's her bottom.








That made me







reading about Fenton's impish smile!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Quick cute thing: Yesterday he saw 2 small moles on my breast and told me "dots on milk".









Dd always has to point out the big mole I have.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
So cute! Dd has never been one to fix "ouchies" with nursing - even when I offer; she always wants me to kiss it - even if it's her bottom.









You think that's funny, at the playground the other day Q wanted me to go down the tall slide with him on my lap, so we did, but I had keys in my back pocket and it hurt. So when we were done I said "ouch, that hurt mommy's butt" and he said "kiss" and without a pause rounded behind me and, well, you can guess!

so on the nursing at 2 front, both grandmas have started making comments. The other day when Q asked "nursey" and then said "pweese" MIL said, "oh gosh, he's saying please...he's getting too old [to nurse]" and at a family function last month when I disappeared to nurse in a back bedroom, I heard my mom explain to a relative "they're weaning soon."

Its funny, in some groups I feel like I'm nursing a college graduate with how they act about it, in other groups (LLL, and my natural parenting group) they ask "why so soon?" when I say we're weaning at 2.

HAPPY SPRING to all!!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Its funny, in some groups I feel like I'm nursing a college graduate with how they act about it, in other groups (LLL, and my natural parenting group) they ask "why so soon?" when I say we're weaning at 2.

HAPPY SPRING to all!!

Yes, yes!! Around my friends and family, I know I'm the weird one still nursing her 1 1/2 yo (although fortunately, they're pretty polite about it). In my LLL group though, I sometimes feel like if I do anything but child-led weaning, I'll be looked down upon a bit. Sometimes this makes me worry that I won't be thought of as a "good Leader" which I know is dumb, but it does cross my mind.

Happy Spring! I'm so excited that winter is over!!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Yes, yes!! Around my friends and family, I know I'm the weird one still nursing her 1 1/2 yo (although fortunately, they're pretty polite about it). In my LLL group though, I sometimes feel like if I do anything but child-led weaning, I'll be looked down upon a bit. Sometimes this makes me worry that I won't be thought of as a "good Leader" which I know is dumb, but it does cross my mind.

Happy Spring! I'm so excited that winter is over!!!

My leader, who I think is the best ever, did MLW with all 3 of hers.









Had success #2 today!







:
Talking a lot about how tomorrow morning is the last time we nurse.





















:


----------



## farmama

Happy Spring!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!







:







:

Shanna,

i've eliminated wheat, sugar, yeast, gluten, dairy (except yogurt), pretty much all refined food, vinegar, fruit, sweeteners...pretty much what i live on, or did until a few weeks ago. Now i eat a lot of rice cakes with almond butter, and beans, and vegetables, and MEAT. i miss the carbs, but the hardest part is having quick things to eat. i just don't seem to get anything done during the day, and then trying to cook things for every meal...how do people DO this? at least i'm mostly working at home. so again,









ZB, so exciting!

there are so many things i wanted to respond to, and they've all gone right out of my head...


----------



## Holiztic

So we were away from Quinn from 2:30 to 9:30 today. We went to an afternoon event followed by a 7 course (seriously gourmet) dinner all an hour away and left Q with the grandparents (at our house). He was asleep on my mom's lap when we got home







: I think he'll wean just fine--if I disappear for a few days!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
So we were away from Quinn from 2:30 to 9:30 today. We went to an afternoon event followed by a 7 course (seriously gourmet) dinner all an hour away and left Q with the grandparents (at our house). He was asleep on my mom's lap when we got home







: I think he'll wean just fine--if I disappear for a few days!

Some cultures do it this way (though the name they give it is awful















. What a fun day!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Does everyone remember that bizarre exchange I had last summer with my pregnant cousin and her L&D nurse sister? Cousin just gave birth. C-section.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
i've eliminated wheat, sugar, yeast, gluten, dairy (except yogurt), pretty much all refined food, vinegar, fruit, sweeteners...pretty much what i live on, or did until a few weeks ago.











As for me, about 8 hours until we nurse for the last time







And then I eat.


----------



## arelyn

Did you guys see this? Obama really is starting a kitchen garden on the South Lawn!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I'm very glad that I have some irl support when it comes to bf'ing, like my family and my upstars neighbor, but then there's most other people. I was SO sad to learn that an acquaintance of mine switched her son to formula at 5 weeks because she HATED nursing. I don't get it.

I know how she feels. I HATED HATED HATED nursing the first two, maybe even three months. My breasts were just really sensitive. I've always hated them being touched. Having Kai sucking on them all the time felt like torture. Gradually they got less sensitive. If I hadn't done my research I may have quit too.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

As for me, about 8 hours until we nurse for the last time







And then I eat.










I'm thinking about you.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~*
I have been really surprised by how much my sadness is related to just the plain passage of time and how I'll never have the same little boy today that I had yesterday









I've been thinking a lot about this lately. The past year has gone by so fast...it makes me a little sad to think that we might be half way done with our nursing relationship. But like Piepie said, I love that I can relate to all you mamas with this.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Does everyone remember that bizarre exchange I had last summer with my pregnant cousin and her L&D nurse sister? Cousin just gave birth. C-section.

Oh.







I feel so jaded about this now because it has happened to so many women I know.
We just learned my SIL is pregnant. Very excited for them, but she just picked her Dr from her insurance list; didn't interview him. I'm trying to stay neutral and just offer minimal advice, but really, I'm worried about her.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
Did you guys see this? Obama really is starting a kitchen garden on the South Lawn!


Heard about this today. Pretty cool.









Holiztic, congrats on your new house! Good luck with the move. Hooray on the fun day.

Farmama, good luck with your diet.









witchy, yay for Rhea crawling! Hope your DH gets to keep his job.

zoebird, hooray for NZ! So exciting!


----------



## ~Shanna~




----------



## farmama

Shanna,







s
just think of the great new things Fenton will do!!!

Excellent, a white house garden. dh was nominated to be the White House Farmer, which i thought was pretty cool. we didn't get nearly as many votes as the folks that won, but our local paper wrote an article about it. neat.









i.miss.my.coffee.


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna, thinking of you and Fenton.

farmama, I do not envy you. keep strong. But how cool would it have been to farm for the White House?


----------



## Maela

Wow that would have been so cool Farmama!

Shanna







s hope things are going smoothly.

We went hiking today with Dd and had a picnic. It was so fun! Dd got to see a frog up close and there were tons of wildflowers everywhere. It was very pretty!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thinking of you Shanna xxoo


----------



## ~Shanna~

Only have a sec, since I'm trying to stay off the computer and phone to facilitate....

We're doing really well. He hasn't nursed since Saturday, and he's still asking for it ~ 6 am (and then insisting on getting up when I remind him that we don't have milk anymore :yawning







but he's doing really well. And i feel 200% better: not hungry, weak, impatient and depressed.

Reading a fascinating book that I can't wait to tell you about - I'll hope to post after bedtime (and my nightly oatmeal







)

Craving of the day (back by popular demand - mine!): grilled cheese. I managed to cook one without being detected, and then ate it in the bathroom







:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Craving of the day (back by popular demand - mine!): grilled cheese. I managed to cook one without being detected, and then ate it in the bathroom







:









Oooh, grilled cheese sandwiches! I think that will be dinner tonight!

So glad you can eat more things now! And that things are going well so far!!


----------



## accountclosed3

i love grilled cheese.

ok, i have to get this out. i wish that when ry an goes grocery shopping, he'd remember to buy food for me too.

back when we were first together, he would only buy for himself. then, he started to figure out that i would eat it, which is why that amount of groceries wouldn't last him for the whole 10 days that he wanted it to last (it would last 4 or 5, tops). and this included with me grabbing food on the go and such too.

anyway, he finally started to buy enough food for both of us, and then i took over the shopping.

well, recently, we tend to go shopping together but hawk is usually sleeping in the car, so i stay with him. ryan goes in to shop.

i make a list, but he often doesn't follow it or he doesn't buy enough. i might put down "eggs" and that means, usually, 3 dozen per week, but he'll only buy two dozen. or if i say "fruit." he buys 5 or so apples and 5 or so oranges. except that i usually eat that in two days and he eats at least 3-4 pieces of fruit a day for himself. and if it's gone (you know, because i ate it), he fusses "what happened to all of the fruit?!" i only ate one piece!

as if he can't figure out who might possibly be eating food during the day in the house. i can't imagine who that might be, you know, after 12 years?

must be the fruit ghost or something.

it's such a mystery.

so, i'm off to the grocer again today, even though we just went yesterday.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hello my grilled cheese sisters - wasn't that tasty? I could go for another one, except I'm constantly torn between eating and sleeping. I think sleep is going to win out...

But before I go, I have to share this paragraph from this fascinating book I'm reading called "The Way We Never Were":

Quote:

Like most visions of a "golden age," the "traditional family" my students describe evaporates on closer examination. It is an ahistorical amalgam of structures, values, and behaviors that never coexisted in the same time and place. The notion that traditional families fostered intense intimacy between husbands and wives while creating mothers who were totally available to their children, for example, is an idea that combines some characteristics of the white, middle-class family in the mid-nineteenth century and some of the rival family ideal first articulated in the 1920s. The first family revolved emotionally around the mother-chlld axis, leaving the husband-wife relationship stilted and formal. The second focused on an eroticized couple relationship, demanding that mothers curb emotional "overinvestment" in their children. The hybrid idea that a woman can be fully absorbed with her youngsters while simultaneously maintained passionate sexual excitement with her husband was a 1950s invention that drove thousands of women to therapists, tranquilizers, or alcohol when they actually tried to live up to it.
She goes on to say

Quote:

Whenever people propose that we go back to the traditional family, I always suggest that they pick a ballpark date for the family they have in mind. Once pinned down, they are invariably unwilling to accept the package deal that comes with their chosen model.
For any of us constantly struggling between being a "good" partner and a "good" parent, isn't this fascinating?

Uh oh. I think the grilled cheese is winning out...


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i love grilled cheese.

ok, i have to get this out. i wish that when ry an goes grocery shopping, he'd remember to buy food for me too.

back when we were first together, he would only buy for himself. then, he started to figure out that i would eat it, which is why that amount of groceries wouldn't last him for the whole 10 days that he wanted it to last (it would last 4 or 5, tops). and this included with me grabbing food on the go and such too.

anyway, he finally started to buy enough food for both of us, and then i took over the shopping.

well, recently, we tend to go shopping together but hawk is usually sleeping in the car, so i stay with him. ryan goes in to shop.

i make a list, but he often doesn't follow it or he doesn't buy enough. i might put down "eggs" and that means, usually, 3 dozen per week, but he'll only buy two dozen. or if i say "fruit." he buys 5 or so apples and 5 or so oranges. except that i usually eat that in two days and he eats at least 3-4 pieces of fruit a day for himself. and if it's gone (you know, because i ate it), he fusses "what happened to all of the fruit?!" i only ate one piece!

as if he can't figure out who might possibly be eating food during the day in the house. i can't imagine who that might be, you know, after 12 years?

must be the fruit ghost or something.

it's such a mystery.

so, i'm off to the grocer again today, even though we just went yesterday.

omg, the (maybe 4 or 5) times DH has ever shopped for us (yes, in 7 years!) he goes with a list penned by me, a sample line: 5 granny smith apples (just writing "apples" would so not do it!)


----------



## Maela

Just want to quickly report that I have not been sick all afternoon and evening!! I'm sure it will be back tomorrow morning, but the break has been SO nice! I cleaned the whole kitchen! It looks great.







:


----------



## Maela

Shanna that book sounds really interesting. I'm going to put it on my "to read" list. The grilled cheese sandwich was amazing! Thanks for the idea. Glad you enjoyed yours!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Help me not to throw something...

Rage is not something I ordinarily have a problem with but I'm struggling here. For the third day in a row, I've spent an hour getting Sebby down for a nap only to have the dog start barking constantly after he's been asleep for only 5mins. The poor kid then wakes up in shock and tireder and grumpier and even less willing to nap than before his sleep. I'm furious and frustrated and surprised by how often I've felt this rage. It's happened other times too since Seb was born - though I assure you, it's never been directed at him.

I really hope this is all just a stress response at the bigger picture which isn't so pretty for us at the moment...

still homeless, still sick, still desperate for some me-time...

Oh...and another thing...do you all get sick of feeling like you have to constantly defend the way you parent? If one more person asks me if Sebby can breathe when his head is tucked in the wrap carrier or suggests I stop feeding him on demand because he's soooooooo big I don't think I can be accountable for my actions. (He is big. 3 months old and 18 pounds, 25.5inches but he was born big....)

I try really hard to be positive and educate...I want people to see that what I'm doing is great for kids and parents and that they should see it as normal...because really, it's not radical or alternative it's just that we're all so disconnected from ourselves and each other that we've forgotten the soul gratification of human connectedness and interaction...blah blah...

*WITCHY*...250mg of selenium is what i was taking.


----------



## cking

mmmm, grilled cheese. guess i'll have to wait until morning. after i bake some bread.









that book does sound fascinating, Shanna.

Maela, I love Maev's new picture. so cute. glad you're not sick today.









MMM, i forgot to comment last time. I'm sorry for all the trouble you are going through now.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Help me not to throw something...

Rage is not something I ordinarily have a problem with but I'm struggling here. For the third day in a row, I've spent an hour getting Sebby down for a nap only to have the dog start barking constantly after he's been asleep for only 5mins. The poor kid then wakes up in shock and tireder and grumpier and even less willing to nap than before his sleep. I'm furious and frustrated and surprised by how often I've felt this rage. It's happened other times too since Seb was born - though I assure you, it's never been directed at him.









. I've had this too, and often mine has been felt towards another child (who has hurt DS or something like that). It's primitive to want to protect Sebby, and yourself (because when he wakes, you know what that means for you







).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Oh...and another thing...do you all get sick of feeling like you have to constantly defend the way you parent? If one more person asks me if Sebby can breathe when his head is tucked in the wrap carrier or suggests I stop feeding him on demand because he's soooooooo big I don't think I can be accountable for my actions. (He is big. 3 months old and 18 pounds, 25.5inches but he was born big....)

I try really hard to be positive and educate...I want people to see that what I'm doing is great for kids and parents and that they should see it as normal...because really, it's not radical or alternative it's just that we're all so disconnected from ourselves and each other that we've forgotten the soul gratification of human connectedness and interaction...blah blah...

Yes, I did get tired of it, so I stopped. If I am in a good mood, I'll say something with a smile like "Oh, we've done this before", or "Don't worry, I'm a professional!". If I'm not in a good mood, and I've only said this once, it'll come out more like "You know, I don't come to where you work and tell you how to do your job.". I usually don't have the cojones for that one, though it's much more effective. Myabe have a few pithy comments that still help you feel like you're being postive and educating - like "Oh, it's been done this way for thousands of years"or something that puts teh burden back on them to explain what their deal is?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Shanna that book sounds really interesting. I'm going to put it on my "to read" list. The grilled cheese sandwich was amazing! Thanks for the idea. Glad you enjoyed yours!

I'm so glad you felt well yesterday!!!!!!







: We're almost out of the woods on the first trimester


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Help me not to throw something...

Rage is not something I ordinarily have a problem with but I'm struggling here. For the third day in a row, I've spent an hour getting Sebby down for a nap only to have the dog start barking constantly after he's been asleep for only 5mins. The poor kid then wakes up in shock and tireder and grumpier and even less willing to nap than before his sleep. I'm furious and frustrated and surprised by how often I've felt this rage. It's happened other times too since Seb was born - though I assure you, it's never been directed at him.

I really hope this is all just a stress response at the bigger picture which isn't so pretty for us at the moment...


I think we cross-posted last night. I have had this too. In fact, yesterday was a pretty bad day/evening, which is why I was up at 1 am. We have been having trouble with naps - they aren't happening (at least not on days when we leave the house), and it's starting to affect her nighttime sleep as well. (and diaper changes and baths aren't much fun lately either...) It makes me angry, at DH, at DD and at myself. Anyway, I heard about this thread about rage. It's very long, but it's good to see that it's something that many parents go through - _good_ parents.


----------



## witchygrrl

Now I want a grilled cheese, and it's not quite 9 am!

MMM, thank you! Next time I go to the HFS, I'll check out the selenium supplements. FWIW, I feel mildly better, but it could be also due to Spring arriving. I







the spring!

But I totally get the rage thing. I have a bit of a temper, and when things feel like they're getting beyond my control, I flip out and become very angry. I'm trying to identify those things that set me off and why.

And yes, I'm also tired of defending how I parent, though it's mostly to MIL, who seems to promptly forget everything after I tell her our research and reasonings. Her latest concern is that Rhea will crawl out of bed without my knowing it while we're sleeping. She had watched a video while her mother was in the hospital about breastfeeding being good/cosleeping bad. Ugh. And why don't I feed her rice cereal? And on and on...


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm:

you took the words right out of my mouth!

for me, it's been with someone whom i have long thought to be a good ally, but now i'm finding that she's a bit odd about the way i parent, upset even.

before hawk was born, i explained to her and a couple of the other moms at the studio (children all older from college age to 4-5 and up) the philosophy that we were trying. most of them were some version of AP, but not CC and so on. it's a spectrum and i value people's choices and experiences.

in the last four weeks or so, though, i've gotten a lot of "suggestions" under the guise of "it would be great for hawk developmentally and give you some freedom!" except that, i'm not looking for any more freedom than i have (and i have a lot), and hawk is developmentally ahead anyway and it's working out for us without things like play pens or leaving him at the sitter or putting him onto solids each week (we're doing BLW, which is different) so that i can leave him with someone else for the day/weekend.

in regards to my work, she's suggested that i leave the baby at home with ryan while i teach, even though she said she wants him there and supports me, and of course that's not feasable for me nor am i comfortable with it yet anyway (i'm usually away 2-3 hrs per class). she also suggests a play pen, even though he doesn't leave the room and bothers no one.

this weekend is our retreat, and of course, i'm bringing hawk. on the one hand, everyone seems happy about this, but on the other, each has asked me "do you want me to bring a play pen? a crib? this thing i have to create a place space for him? all of these so that "you'll have the freedom to practice yoga without worrying about him" or "you can join us i the hot tub."

now granted, i only get 30 mintues of yoga a day by myself, but i also now do 30 mintues with him while he plays in the yoga room. he often imitates me and it's funny. he's very cute. and, if i was in the hot tub and he was fussy, i wouldn't just sit in the hot tub, anymore than i stay in a pose while he's playing. as soon as he gets frustrated or upset, i hop up and get him, potty him, nurse him, or whatever he wants. sometimes, he just wants me to touch and play with him.

it's fine, really, and i love being with him.

and so i figured out that this is relaly about how THEY are uncomfortable with the way that i parent. so, i j ust say "oh, no, we're fine."

i no longer educate, i don't defent myself, and i don't get snarky. i just say "oh, we're fine."

and if i have to assert myself--such as when she says "you need to get child care sorted for X class." i say "i am the child care, so if it's no longer ok for him to be in class, i'm ok to let that class go." she seems to think that this creates a "battle ground" over the class, but i told her it doesn't. if she no longer wants hawk to be there, then i need to be where he is. that is all. it's no big deal to me. i'll teach somewhere else (afterall, i also rent at a local dance studio and do quite well there, so i could just pick up more times there and take hawk with me. no boss can say otherwise).

anyway, that's me.


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, I can't count how many times (especially during that first year) that I have run after our cats yelling (in a whisper) bad words at them for being loud when dd was napping.







If something/someone woke dd up from a nice sleep, I was







. Other people (and especially animals







) don't realize how hard it is to put a baby down sometimes, and how desperately you might need some time to yourself. My MIL would be over and she KNEW dd was napping, but she would STILL walk into our room and peer over the bed at her and say, "oh she's so sweet." And then "oops, I guess I woke her up. I'm sorry. Don't worry I'll hold her; I don't mind that she's crying."







:














:
Can you tell it still makes me mad just thinking about it?









I'm tired of trying to defend my parenting; I've just started acting really confident in my decisions/actions and that has seemed to reduce the amount of questions/suggestions that I've gotten.

I'm sorry you're having a rough time right now.


----------



## farmama

nak w a grabby toddler.

mmm,







s

the 1st six months are really hard that way. it'll get better, really. and i wanted to beat on my dog for waking up the baby (but didn't, of course, though he got an earful).


----------



## ~Shanna~

I didn't yet get a chance to look at the rage thread, but I was struck by something MMM said about her rage never been directed at DS. I know it's taboo to say, but I do sometimes feel rage at DS. I don't act on it (with the exception of those times we've talked about when you change their dipe a little more brusquely than you ordinarily might, etc.). But it's really disturbing to me, having come from a spanking family (and inconsistently, mind you) to sometimes feel such anger towards DS. Dh and I have talked aobut this sometimes when he hears me getting really frustrated, and I have tos ometimes confess to him that I have my hands full simplyt keeping myself from not hitting. It's horrible to say out loud because I don't believe in it, but it''s like there's this primitive violent thing in me that wants to hit something that makes me mad - its the same instinct that makes me throw the TV remote when I'm frustrated by it.

I dont' write it here to defend it and obviously I work against this every day - but I'd hate to not share it if it could help someone


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I didn't yet get a chance to look at the rage thread, but I was struck by something MMM said about her rage never been directed at DS. I know it's taboo to say, but I do sometimes feel rage at DS. I don't act on it (with the exception of those times we've talked about when you change their dipe a little more brusquely than you ordinarily might, etc.). But it's really disturbing to me, having come from a spanking family (and inconsistently, mind you) to sometimes feel such anger towards DS. Dh and I have talked aobut this sometimes when he hears me getting really frustrated, and I have tos ometimes confess to him that I have my hands full simplyt keeping myself from not hitting. It's horrible to say out loud because I don't believe in it, but it''s like there's this primitive violent thing in me that wants to hit something that makes me mad - its the same instinct that makes me throw the TV remote when I'm frustrated by it.

I dont' write it here to defend it and obviously I work against this every day - but I'd hate to not share it if it could help someone



















She did not want to nap today. After nursing for a little while she got up and said, "Maev book." (And this had happened three times in the past 30 minutes) I said, "Fine! Have fun! I'm going to sleep!"







: in an irritated voice. I felt bad, but I was so frustrated! Then she said, "Have fun sleep Mama!" and I couldn't help but laugh.


----------



## accountclosed2

Hi everyone, I usually just read all your posts, but thought I might post myself today.









We are all very tired here. DD's uneven sleep (always hard work in itself) has turned crappy in the last few weeks. We live over our income, as DH's job (since his last contract ended 6 months ago) is really badly paid, and almost all goes to the rent of our tiny one-bedroom flat under MIL's house + heating. We hate living here, it is cramped, badly designed, the kitchen doubles as entrance and is really just a small passage way, the bathroom is a disaster, no bath, but a built in shower, with a high step. Zero storage. We're living off the savings, the ones we planned to use to buy a small place in the country.

I would like to go back to nannying (with DD), but I really don't have the energy for it now. Many days we end up sleeping in (or DD sleeping in, me lying next to her), because the night wakings have been so long (and, of course, DD won't go to sleep before 10 pm). Also her daytime sleep takes a lot of effort from me for it to happen - and only when she is really sleepy, which varies from day to day. I just can't make commitments to an employer the way it is.

My parents just went back to Sweden after a holiday here, first time they met DD. It was wonderful to have them here, now we miss them a lot. Relationships with FIL and SIL are strained, due to an argument (natural living, baby care, AP etc) at Christmas (It was awful, I never want to celebrate Christmas again).

MMM, it is funny how your baby's size always make people suggest you shouldn't breastfeed! I have a 16.5 lb 13-month-old - who always was little, but we got comments to, about formula being needed to "fatten her up". (I had low milk-supply, but we sorted that, used donated milk for a bit etc).

Witchygrrl, my mother has this same fear, that DD will crawl out of bed without us noticing!







That would be _after_ she kicks one of us in the head or chest, and tries to climb over the other?

shanna, I have felt rage against my beautiful little girl so many times, and I feel awful that I have yelled at her, more times than I want to remember







. I am usually very patient, and have worked with babies and young children for many years. It is usually extreme tiredness, frustration, and me struggling to cope with a situation. Motherhood can be really hard (I had no idea _how_ hard - I work ten times harder than when I worked 11 hour days with two toddlers and a baby!). (And, for the record, I don't hit, I don't even feel like hitting. I feel more like walking out and never returning!)


----------



## accountclosed3

i just taught hawk how to get out of the bed feet first yesterday. i'm still working on it today too.

there's really nothing that he can do to himself in the room, as i just figured out how to manage our cords. we have 5 cords in the room in three outlets. at each outlet, i put a used wipes box with the excess cord inside and the plug coming out of the hole in the top of the box and into the plug. pretty simple.

of course, there are piles of clean laundry everywhere now, but aside from that, i'm doing pretty decent.


----------



## witchygrrl

Zoe, I'm assuming your bed is close to the ground? Rhea's been pulling herself to stand quite a bit these days. I had seen her do it once with a full laundry basket a few weeks ago, and then didn't do it again for awhile, but now it's one of her favorite things to do. We've also been joking that she likes to put everything BUT food in her mouth, but that's quite alright.

Before Rhea was born, I worried about my temper being directed toward her but so far it's been only once or twice through tone of voice, which is bad enough.







I remembered a similar situation to MMM's problem with the dog, except it's my cat scratching the couch while we're nursing. It hasn't happened in awhile, but I'd yell at the cat to quit scratching, which would cause Rhea to pop off my nipple, and then I'd yelp in pain! Not fun. Of course, Rhea would do that if DH walked in the room, too. She's a little less distractable, and currently my nipples don't hurt, so that's something.

I think she has another cold, and she's been swishing her spit in her mouth. She had a rough night last night, and I wonder if at last she's teething her first.

AC, I hope you can find a more comfortable housing situation soon.


----------



## accountclosed3

yes, our bed is very close to the ground. he was scooting to the edge and trying to go head-first, so i taught him to turn around and scoot off that way. LOL

it's just the thickness of the mattress plus the slats under for air flow--so maybe 8 inches tops? not very far at all.

he wants to stand but hasn't figured out how to pull himself up yet. he gets to hands and feet, by a method we call "ninja feet." he'll be on his tummy with his legs behind him, then push up and sort of jump, getting his feet under him like a frog, and then he'll start to straighten his legs (like downward dog) and tries to stand, but can't figure out how to get up.

he likes it when we hold him to standing, for certain. he also will hold onto things and walk sideways, or walk if you're supporting him, which he prefers.

he can't really keep his knees under him to crawl yet, but he tries!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *AislinCarys* 
shanna, I have felt rage against my beautiful little girl so many times, and I feel awful that I have yelled at her, more times than I want to remember







. I am usually very patient, and have worked with babies and young children for many years. It is usually extreme tiredness, frustration, and me struggling to cope with a situation. Motherhood can be really hard (I had no idea _how_ hard - I work ten times harder than when I worked 11 hour days with two toddlers and a baby!). (And, for the record, I don't hit, I don't even feel like hitting. I feel more like walking out and never returning!)

I thought because I am usually so patient with children and because I worked with little children (special needs) that I would be the most patient and sweet mother. Ha! It's SO different when you are dealing with it 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

Dd just learned to climb up and off our bed a couple of months ago. But it's really high up.

*ZB*, what a great idea for the cords!

*AC*, sorry about the lack of sleep and poor housing situation.







Can I ask you if your username is your real name? (you can pm me if you want) We are trying to find a girl's name and Aislin/Aislinn/Aisling is on our list. Also do you pronounce it Ash-leen?

If anyone has any ideas to help us pick out a girl's name, please help! We are looking for an Irish/celtic/gaelic name that is not too popular in the US, but is not too different in spelling from pronunciation. Something to go with Maev. It's proving to be very difficult!!


----------



## accountclosed3

you should go with a good old norse name like Hawk. it's such a great name for a girl. i love that he's a boy, but i honestly thought that if he were a girl, it would have been an awesome name. LOL

anyway, a lot of irish/celtic names have relation to or are nordic names. a lot of english/irish words are rooted in norse. so, if you're looking for something truly unusual, hit the dictionary. some favored words will have unique origins that you can check out.

*and people always ask if we're native american. we explain that his name is actually old norse, refering to hawks, as it is their word for the bird too, which also means "to seize" in both old norse, and around the same time, turns up in northern germanic language.*


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Wow! You women are all so awesome. You totally rallied when I really needed it. I so appreciate all your reflections on parenting and rage...thanks Christina for the link to the thread. And Shanna - thank you too for your candidness. I've no doubt I'll be rabidly angry with Sebby many times in my parenting life. And there'll be guilt. And there'll be moments where I want to hit him or throw him or something. I'm just so surprised by the intensity of it all but I'm sure everything is heightened at the moment by the stressful life stuff that's going on.

I'm feeling a bit better this morning. Sebby, the boy who has never napped for longer than 20mins, had a 2hr nap yesterday after a great trip to the cranial osteopath and then my little boy who only wakes once or twice in the night returned too! His teeth have been bothering him so much and it's been upsetting his tummy and it's make him restless and wakeful at night...that osteo is gold...
poo blowout. gotta go x


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Maela* - I love the name Greer. Scottish celtic. Means watcher.


----------



## Maela

Thanks for the name suggestions.







I do like Hawk and Greer (although i have to admit I like them better as boy names).


----------



## ~Shanna~

Do you know what I'm doing right now? a nacho craving hit at 9 pm, and all I had in the house was corn tortillas, lard and some pintos in the freezer. I am deep-frying corn chips, thawing pintos and making refried beans. Dear god...









Maela, what about PiePie's middle name? I thought I remembered it's gaelic, but I can't remember how it's spelled - sioban? Am I making this up?


----------



## PiePie

It's Siobhan. Pronounced Sha-VAHN. It's also DD's middle. It was my first choice for DD's name but DH nixed it, perhaps because of the discrepancy in spelling vs. pronunciation. My confirmation name is Brigid, after the saint who lactated to feed poor children, and there are lots of cool nicknames of Brigid, like Brita, pronounced with either a short or long i and a d sound instead of a t. there is also bevin, a (male) poet's name, but I think of it more as a girl's name. and rhiannon, which was on my list but I think dh nixed it. and caitlin. and of course my first name! and nora (not my fave, personally). and gillian!! ooo, almost forgot, that was one of the few girls names dh and i both liked a lot. you could always go with reilly, or i guess dylan (although that sounds more boy to me). will keep thinking, and shaking down my family tree (although let's be honest, there are lots of popular in ireland but not celtic in origin names there, like patricia, marie, etc.) ooh, allison is irish. and how about alana.


----------



## Maela

Wow, *PiePie*, keep them coming!







I have always liked the name Caitlin. But I felt like it was too popular. Today I saw it somewhere online as just Cait, which I think I really like. Still a popular name, but spelled differently from the normal Kate, which I also really like. And it's Scottish/Irish.
Cait Rose G______ kind of goes with Maev Lin G_______

Anyway, that doesn't really matter because when Dh came home and I suggested it, his first reaction was to make a face.







:

Rose will almost definitely be the middle name. It's my grandmother's name.

Also on our list are:
Áine Rose,
Vianne Rose,
Aislinn Rose, and
Saoirse Rose.

Vianne is French I think, but I've always liked it ever since I saw the movie _Chocolat_. I do think it might make the name Maev seem too plain though...

I've still got six more months to decide....

I'll let you guys know our boy name when we find out what the gender is. We got some bad reactions to it during the last pg, but we really like it.

At first I didn't want to find out the sex, but Dh really wanted to, so I caved. Now that I'm used to the idea, I can't wait to find out!
*Shanna* are you going to find out?


----------



## Maela

I actually really like the name Nora. But it's my sister's name, and although I love her, I think it would be weird to have my daughter's first name be the same as her aunt's (someone she sees a lot). Kind of like if I named her Lila (my name), even though I do like it.







I don't know why I feel that way, but I do... but doesn't Nora Rose sound so pretty?


----------



## witchygrrl

Nora Rose is very pretty, though it might be weird to have an aunt Nora also. We really liked Rhiannon, but because the middle name was Ann, we thought that would be odd. Brigid was another choice, and I was very fond of Branwen, though DH nixed that.

Zoe, love the etymology of Hawk. It would have been a very cool girl's name also









I recently came across a website about the Greek pantheon, so I looked up Rhea. I was pleased to learn that the Titan was often pictured with lions, as my daughter is a Leo


----------



## PiePie

i woke up in the middle of the night and said you must name DD2 Edana, pronounced ay-DAHN-ah, teh feminine form of Aidan. and since then i have thunk of deirdre, of course. and yes you mustn't name her the same as her aunt, too weird.


----------



## PiePie

what about roisin as a first name?

there is also shannon, sinead, bronwyn (spelled a million different ways).


----------



## TinyFrog

: Fenton!








:


----------



## cking

:







: Fenton!!!







:


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i just taught hawk how to get out of the bed feet first yesterday. i'm still working on it today too.

very cool. J just started doing this about a month ago, with for the beds and couch. But that's the same time she started to do it with the futon matress on the floor - before that she would just crawl off.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I actually really like the name Nora. But it's my sister's name, and although I love her, I think it would be weird to have my daughter's first name be the same as her aunt's (someone she sees a lot). Kind of like if I named her Lila (my name), even though I do like it.







I don't know why I feel that way, but I do... but doesn't Nora Rose sound so pretty?

LOL. All of my siblings are named for one of my moms or dad's siblings. Except me, I was named for my grandfather's sister, whom I never met. We always have to add last names (or "great") to aunts and uncles names.

Piepie, my friend has two sisters names Siobhan and Deirdre, and another sister with a very Irish name. She, however, has a very common, universal name (which is the same as my Italian MILs name).









Mamas, if your DC has had a birthday party, did you open gifts during the party, or wait until after? My family all seems to take it so personally...they have to see you open the gift they brought you. And I get that. But to me, it seems very overwhelming for a LO. (as it's overwhelming to me....







)


----------



## Maela

: to Fenton!!!!








I cannot believe we have another 2yo on this thread!

*Cking*, in my family we open up gifts at the party. In fact we all sit down and watch as the kid goes through a huge pile of presents.







That is why we had a very small little dinner party with just her aunts, uncles, and grandparents (not my aunts/uncles and grandparents). We did open the gifts during the party, but it was only maybe 6-7 gifts.

*PiePie*, how do you pronounce Roisin? I do kind of like it, although don't think it would go with Rose as a middle name. I also kind of like Edana...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: Birthday love for Fenton.







:

*Maela* - I love Roisin too - pronounced Ro-sheen...but suspect you won't want to use it cos it's not so phonetic.


----------



## PiePie

rsoisin w accent on second syllable

dd opened gifts at her party but there were only 3 guests, 2 of whom had given their gidt 2 mos early and held off on their oyher gift for 6 more mos. my mom was kinda pissed that she played with our present instead of my brother's.


----------



## PiePie

trying to figure out a way to express anger at dh without settiing him off. but don't want to walk around with this anger either.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
That is why we had a very small little dinner party with just her aunts, uncles, and grandparents (not my aunts/uncles and grandparents). We did open the gifts during the party, but it was only maybe 6-7 gifts.

Tee hee hee. We are also only having aunts, uncles, Gparents and cousins, and it'll be about 20-25 people. (and that's not even all my siblings and their kids...)









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
trying to figure out a way to express anger at dh without settiing him off. but don't want to walk around with this anger either.

if you find one let me know....







:


----------



## Maela

*Cking* is it you that has 12 brothers and sisters?







yeah, I guess that wouldn't work.

I do like Roisin. But Dh doesn't. I don't mind a little divergence from spelling in pronunciation; we do have Saoirse on our list but it is going a little far for me though.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I move that we all recognize PiePie as the Name Goddess!







Those are gorgeous







. The name we have picked out for a girl is Gaelic, but my superstitiousness prevents me from sharing it until he or she is earthside. And when I say "we have picked out"....I really mean me. DH is infuriatingly non-commital about all names except the girl names I like that he thinks sound like porn stars.







Although he does like the name Noel for a boy. Which I put the KaBosh on, being that he would be likely to come in October, not around Christmas as the meaning would suggest. And I can't bear to subject a boy to being mistakenly called Noelle his whole life.

Thanks for all the birthday wishes







- we had a wonderful day yesterday. Fenton's only birthday wish was to go through the car wash







, and we did that on the way to the birth center to take his picture in the birthing tub. I have fun imagining me trying to coax at 20-year old Fenton to come home so I can take his picture in the tub







Tonight is the small party here with family, only about 8 of us. The eating restrictions proved to be quite a challenge, so Fenton will be blowing out a couple of candles stuff into a baby watermelon







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Shanna* are you going to find out?

We're not, which is going to send my family into orbit. With Fenton I had 3 - they were like a drug I was addicted to, I wanted to hear his heartbeat all the time. But each time I felt a little uneasy about it, and it didn't calm me down like I thought it would - I'd relax for a few hours, and they start thinking that something could have "happened to him" in the hours since the ultrasound. So we've just decided to not have ultrasounds this time. I'm shocked to find that it has made me more calm, which is not what I would have expected with my temperment.

Oops. my boys are back from the store with party hats! Have a wonderful weekend everyone!!!!


----------



## witchygrrl

I'm glad Fenton had a happy birthday and got his wish! Car washes are kinda fun







Enjoy the party!

We are supposed to go up to VT and tour maple sugarhouses (and taste test, of course). But Rhea has the sniffles still, so I don't think tramping through the snow would be the best idea. Not that colds are caused by cold weather, but still. At least this is a happy cold--not miserable and feverish like last time









I'm thinking that going where there is plenty of snow still might not be in my best interest anyway. I'm liking the springtime sun.

I agree that PiePie is the Naming Goddess--you have so many good ones!


----------



## PiePie

thank you all. *shanna*, would dh like nolan? it's gaelic. so jealous that you get to use a gaelic first name. dh was very opposed --he felt like it made the baby too much mine and not enough ours. (i'm part irish, he's not.) he feels the same way re naming after relatives.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Poor Sebby. We're up wayyyyyy too early because his teeth were really bothering him. All night I kept waking up with him grabbing at my fingers to chew on them. I thought we'd just get up, nappy change, teething homeopathic, nurse and sleep again but that damn homeopathic makes him the happiest little giggling babe and so he's now kicking around on the bed, smiling and chatting away. It's tres cute but would be so much cuter after 7am! (It's 6 now, we woke at 4.30.)

DP took Sebby for 4 hrs yesterday afternoon. I had a long bath, chatted on the phone, washed clothes AND hung them out, lazed on the couch and spent a lot of money online buying nappies thanks to our latest stimulus package. I had a ball.

And because our nappy service ran out last week, I still need to buy some more nappies so I'm interested in knowing what you all love?

Got 2 weeks to find a house but there's a great looking one becoming available next week on my birthday which i think is a good omen...'cos last year i found out i was pregnant on my birthday! Last year a baby, this year a house...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
thank you all. *shanna*, would dh like nolan? it's gaelic. so jealous that you get to use a gaelic first name. dh was very opposed --he felt like it made the baby too much mine and not enough ours. (i'm part irish, he's not.) he feels the same way re naming after relatives.

Whose last name does DD have?

I think that my husband defers to me alot about names because all of our children will have his last name as a "proper" last name (my last name is their second middle name). And while I would never want his child to have a name that he only thought







about, I do agree with him that it gives me a little more lattitude on the first name. Besides, hey! get an opinion about names! Poop or get off the pot!







He has a couple of names he _likes_: Noel for a boy, Kiera for a girl...I like those names okay, but can't imagine my child being called that. I get the sense that if I wanted to name our child Obidiah, he'd shrug and say "Eh. Okay". But not Savannah. That sounds like a porn star.









I shouldn't be online, but I'm hiding from Fenton. Eating nachos...







:


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Do you know what I'm doing right now? a nacho craving hit at 9 pm, and all I had in the house was corn tortillas, lard and some pintos in the freezer. I am deep-frying corn chips, thawing pintos and making refried beans. Dear god...









Maela, what about PiePie's middle name? I thought I remembered it's gaelic, but I can't remember how it's spelled - sioban? Am I making this up?

I fry sprouted corn tortillas in lard and use them as the base for huevos rancheros. Yumm!


----------



## Holiztic

Okay, so we are moved into our new house and feeling mostly settled. We now have the computer and TV in one of the extra bedrooms upstairs and so I am pretty much never on the computer (it used to be in the living room). I just browsed the last few days' posts and am loving the discussion of names. We love gaelic names (I suppose you could have guessed that, huh?) I wanted a non "American" name (whatever the heck that means) but DH said we could only use a culture that we had in our lineage. So it was Irish, Italian, German, or English. I have our next boy's name picked out (should we have one) but way too early to share it! I LOVE Siobhan, but I agree on the phonetic issue, I don't want my kid (and me!) to spend our lives correcting people.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Cking* is it you that has 12 brothers and sisters?







yeah, I guess that wouldn't work.

Yep, that's me. Which explains why our parties tend to be overwhelming.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
thank you all. *shanna*, would dh like nolan? it's gaelic. so jealous that you get to use a gaelic first name. dh was very opposed --he felt like it made the baby too much mine and not enough ours. (i'm part irish, he's not.) he feels the same way re naming after relatives.

I kind of felt the reverse of this. All of DD's names came from DH's side. But she looks so much more like me than him. Or rather, I felt bad that she doesn't look much like him, but then I remembered that she has his name, and the names of his great aunts.









Holiztic, welcome to your new home!
MMM, good luck finding your new home.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
but DH said we could only use a culture that we had in our lineage. So it was Irish, Italian, German, or English.

That's what I'd like to do. so Irish, Italian, English, French, Scottish, ... We have a lot to choose from.







Our last name is very italian, and I thought it would be cool if all of the children had irish first names. But if we can't find anything I'll choose from the other groups.

ETA: I'm glad you all like the name discussion; I was afraid I was hogging the conversation topic.


----------



## cking

It's funny, I never considered Josephine to be an Italian (or Italian-American) name....but so many people have told us that it was their Italian mother or grandmother's name.







And it is DH's Italian aunt's name...I guess maybe it was Americanized from Giusseppina (?)

Also funny, DH has been watching a British soap opera in which there is a character named Siobhan. He just informed me that that will be our next daughter's name.


----------



## witchygrrl

Rhea is Greco-Roman, and since DH is half Italian, we figured that worked out okay. Her middle name is my grandmother's name, and then she has DH's last name. And she mostly looks like me (at least for now). Her lineage also includes Romanian,Scottish, Welsh, English, Norweigan, and some unknowns (probably Irish, French, Native American). Yeah, she's a mutt!

Shanna, my FIL really wanted to name DH Obidiah, and MIL said no. So he ended up with a Scottish name instead-Evan.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Shanna, my FIL really wanted to name DH Obidiah, and MIL said no. So he ended up with a Scottish name instead-Evan.

Whew! That was close!







Dh particularly jokes about Obidiah when we talk about the possibility of homeschooling: Obidiah Ezikiah


----------



## PiePie

I love the name discussion too. DD has my last name and my middle name, so he picked the first name, after multiple nukes by me -- Giselle, Astrid, Esperanza, and Magdalena were in the running. He would still prefer Esperanza as his first choice for a DD2. I would prefer Eleanor (my grandmother's name) but neither of us is getting that. We have a girl's name and boy's name picked but subject to renegotiation should popularity rankings shift drastically. We didn't find out the gender before the birth, and for a girl we had "his" girl first name and "my" girl first middle, and for a boy "my" first and "his" middle. In retrospect I think that worked well...


----------



## witchygrrl

I've long liked "Mercedes" as a girl's name. I know it's a car name, but it means "graces" and sounds SOOO much better in Spanish.

Rhea had croup last night--after multiple steamy bathroom sessions and walks outdoors that lost their effect, we went to the ER where she was basically fine. Loved the vax lecture







: though I said that we had discussed it with her her dr who is fine with our decision. Anyway, she seems to be fine now, thank goodness.


----------



## PiePie

*witchy*, sounds like a scary night for your family. hugs. what a relief that she is on the mend.


----------



## katt

I LOVE names. Celtic names are all pretty popular at the moment, but they sound so nice, ya know?
Siobhan is one of my all time favorite names. (although DH won't go for it cause of the spelling/pronunciation difference)

Talen is another all time favorite.

Teotimo, is DH's grandfather's name, it was on the top of our boy name list while pregnant, but not a for sure thing until we met the boy. We both knew what his name was when we met him, so Teo is it.

Who knows for next time.


----------



## ~Shanna~

maaaannnnn.....
Fenton's college fund has lost half its value since July


----------



## PiePie

DD's is decimated. Thank God she is still young.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
maaaannnnn.....
Fenton's college fund has lost half its value since July









Yeah. It's good they are still young. My retirement, otoh, is in trouble. Since I'm NOT contributing to it now, there's no benefit of 'buying low'. It almost seems a better value to cash it in and use that for home repairs.









We are in an interesting place with our house. If we want to stay here, we'll probably need to make some changes to accommodate a growing family. But an addition/renovation would cost more than just moving to a new house (assuming we break even on our home sale). And then if our house doesn't sell, we're stuck here and need to figure out how to make those changes. <sigh> I have to remind myself that if we had waiting until now, we might have afforded an awesome house, but we probably would have this awesome daughter.

Oh and our next door neighbor says their house is on the market - as-is, and boy is it ever. But we can't find the listing. Toying with the idea of expanding our 'estate'. ha.


----------



## accountclosed2

Thanks for all support! Sorry I haven't checked in in a couple of days. We are considering moving overseas, to Sweden. I had thought we'd be here forever, and I love it here, so it is sad







. It's just that in Sweden my family can help us out a bit, housing and electricity is actually much cheaper, and DH would earn almost twice as much as in his current (very low pay) job. And of course I'd get paid maternity leave about 15 months (starting from whenever we get there), so that would give us an income to begin with. It is a huge decision to take, though, and loads of planning to do and stuff to arrange.

My real name isn't Aislin, it is just a name I love. DH and I both love Celtic names (although DD's name is French). Aishlin means dream or vision, which I find lovely, and I think it is supposed to be pronounced Ash-ling.

Another Celtic name I like is Alana, derived from the Celtic form of endearment for a child, a leanbh (pronounced alanna).


----------



## ~Shanna~

Aislin, that's so exciting about the possible move - maybe you could leave your house to ZB?







Is anyone here leaving Sweden?

So.....Guess who has slept through the night for 2 straight nights?







:
He's only sleeping a little over 9 hours at night, and I hope that shakes out soon ( I think his body is still programmed to wake up for "milk"), but it's very encouraging for how difficult his eating restrictions are to see how much they are helping. I never thought I would get to sleep the sleep of the dead again, but I slept like a rock last night







.


----------



## Holiztic

hey guys, we are thinking with the unexpected profit from selling our condo we might take a little trip. 4 nights, with quinn, prefer drive or short light from baltimore and want to stay under 2k. any ideas?


----------



## PiePie

please vote in my babywearing poll: http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1063186 my earlier poll, explaining the circumstances, got some action but this one is dead dead dead.


----------



## accountclosed3

so, i'm actually looking at a second, different business in NZ. it's a holistic health center run similarly to the yoga studio that i work for here, and there's a classroom where i could expand from their current pilates/qi gong offerings into a full-fledged yoga program. and, the business is DIRT CHEAP because of the strength of the US dollar. Also, i wouldn't have to be involved with crazy people.

i talked with all of my friends who know of the other studio--where i worked when iw as there, well, i worked in the first studio, this one is the second--and everyone says that i should stay away big time. i know that location is everything, and this second business is close to all major travel stops (train, bus, ferry, and a major car park), right in the middle of the central business district near both gov't and corporate offices and the main, high-end shopping district. there's pretty major foot traffic, too.

anyway, i'm psyched to travel to NZ to check it out. told the doc about it on friday at hawk's appt (he's very happy and healthy, that's what we were told), and so no necessary vaccines after thsi one (last DTaP). he thought it would be a good idea to "bring the doctor along, of course!" which was cute. he has a funny sense of humor.

also went to a retreat this past weekend with the gals from the studio. i only went for 24 hrs. it was good. did a bit of yoga, ecstatic movement, cranio-sacral therapy. enjoyed the chesapeake. hawk went too, of course, and everyone wanted to hold him. he got a good deal of attention, though on saturday, he wanted me me me.

for us, he was having a 'tough day' though according to all of the ladies there (all mothers), he was having a great, easy day. i just know how easy going he is, how much fun he is, and how happy he is ALL THE TIME, and he was having a trying day. trouble napping, wanting to stay close to me (so if i set him down or what have you, he would fuss, and then cling like a koala!), things like that. just noticed it was tough for him. anyway, it's not bad at all.







he's so easy. LOL

that's about all that's going on around here. lots to think about, lots to work on--as usual. ryan's doing well, too.


----------



## Maela

Yay Shanna for getting to sleep so long!!!







: How nice that must be.

We are getting closer to our set time (spring break) for nightweaning, and I'm starting to get nervous.







I told Dh last night that I was considering waiting until he was done with the school year (last week of May), as it's not that much further off. I really , really would love for this to happen, but at the same time, I'm sad for her. I know she doesn't really need the food at night. My supply has definitely dropped, she's eating solid food like crazy, and now that her last two teeth have poked through, she's waking up less at night. But I know that it will still be a big adjustment for her (and me). So I don't know exactly how or when it will happen, but we (dh and I) did agree that we want her to be nightweaned (including being able to fall sleep w/out nursing at night and for naps) by October. She'll be 26mo.

*PiePie*, sorry I don't think I know enough about the various kinds of slings to vote in your poll. Hopefully it gets some action soon.

*Cking*, I don't know enough about the east coast to answer. I hope you have fun where ever you do decide to go though!

Last night Dh thought of the name Vienna, and now he's in love with it. I do like it, but I really like Vianne better. I haven't decided whether or not I'm willing to give in. It's SO hard to find something we both like. We've kind of strayed from the Irish/Celtic/gaelic names. Which do you like better? Or do you like Aine better? That one's still high on our list too.


----------



## Maela

Dd wants the baby to be named "Baby Grapes". We asked her yesterday what she wanted to name the baby and she said baby grapes (she was eating some grapes). But then we were talking about the names again today and she remembered what she had said yesterday. She said "Baby Grapes!"


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quick post, my son is being a maniac....

Holiztic, is a coastal place within driving distance? Like North Carolina? Could be very fun with the boy, though I'm not sure if it's warm enough there for frolicking in the surf. I'd love to take a beach va-kay with my boy









Maela, I love Vienna, Vianne (I think I like this better - remind me how it's pronoucned?) too, but Baby Grapes is my favorite.

ZB, what exciting prospects!

Took Fenton to get our weekly goat milk delivery and he had a great time lookign around the farm - his talking is getting so conversational: "Oh, look at _that_!" "Goats tried to kiss Fenton!" "Bye bye Baby chickens - see you next week!" Some of it is the emerging sentence structure, but I'm surprised by how much is that adult-like inflection. I showed him to how to use one of his PlayDoh tools today and he exclaimed "Well, that's amazing!"


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Quick post, my son is being a maniac....

Holiztic, is a coastal place within driving distance? Like North Carolina? Could be very fun with the boy, though I'm not sure if it's warm enough there for frolicking in the surf. I'd love to take a beach va-kay with my boy









Ha! How funny. We go to the outer banks of NC every other year with my family (we're going in July this year), so that would be repetitive, and we also don't really love it all that much! We'd like either a nice city vacation or quaint big town or mountain getaway. If we can't do Caribbean then we don't really care for the beach (snobby?) I'd love do go to Jamaica or similar but I don't have a current passport and we want to go soon!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

*Cking*, I don't know enough about the east coast to answer. I hope you have fun where ever you do decide to go though!

I was







trying to figure out what you meant, and then I realized (after Shanna's post) that you were talking about Holiztic's vacation.









I like Vianne better.









Holiztic - Jersey shore? haha. No, wait, you can't get a place at the Jersey shore for <2k.







We are renting a beach house in VA with my sister's family in July. It's a huge house, so we need to have 6+ people to make it work. I wish there were still more bungalows for small families to rent. Good luck finding something!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Took Fenton to get our weekly goat milk delivery and he had a great time lookign around the farm - his talking is getting so conversational: "Oh, look at _that_!" "Goats tried to kiss Fenton!" "Bye bye Baby chickens - see you next week!" Some of it is the emerging sentence structure, but I'm surprised by how much is that adult-like inflection. I showed him to how to use one of his PlayDoh tools today and he exclaimed "Well, that's amazing!"
















So cute!







:

I wish I could get some video to share with you all of Josephine talking. She talks non-stop from the minute she wakes up. At the risk of being _that mom,_ she really does seem to talk more than other kids her age. She has just started to talk into the telephone receiver, using a deeper voice - I think that must be what she thinks we sound like on the phone. And now she likes to talk/sing into cups and jugs.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Ha! How funny. We go to the outer banks of NC every other year with my family (we're going in July this year), so that would be repetitive, and we also don't really love it all that much! We'd like either a nice city vacation or quaint big town or mountain getaway. If we can't do Caribbean then we don't really care for the beach (snobby?) I'd love do go to Jamaica or similar but I don't have a current passport and we want to go soon!

Philly?









Our neighbors took a vacation in New Hope, PA last summer. It's only 1/2 hour drive from here, but I thought it was a really cool idea. Their parents stayed with them, so they had a babysitter built in and could walk to restaurants, theatres, etc. We came up and met them for lunch one of the days.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Have some time to kill before my Kraft Macaroni and Cheese Deluxe is done cooking.







: I know, I know....but I'm starving, feeling like I want to puke and I haven't had anything naughty in over a week. So if I'm going to fall off the wagon, I'm going to hit the ground running. That _whole_ box is mine. Poor baby...







:

Maela, I'm so touched by all that you're debating with the nightweaning.







I never imagined the process would be so hard on us - I always envisioned being sad when DS decided to self-wean, and it's a different ball entirely when we are trying to encourage them. I think all the difference in the world is in temperment, but I thought I'd share some of my tips that I think really helped. We talked with Fenton for at least a couple fo weeks beforehand about the sun going night-night, and how soon (we gave him teh date, and showed him on the calendar each day) we were going to stop having milk at night when the sun was sleeping. We also had started to play up "cuddling Daddy" at night and during the day. All advice I had received strongly advised against going cold turkey, and I think that is true for most babes. Fenton's personality simply does not understand moderation - we tried a couple of nights with the Jay Gordon model of pushing the time back further and further before nursing, and it didn't take long to realize Fenton needed to know that nursing wasn't happening anymore at night. We also knew with his personality that when he gets upset at night, it sometimes works better to see the writing on the wall and get up with him rather than try to comfort him in bed. Comforting in bed can last hours, whereas getting up with him entailed reading a couple of books, getting a snack, and him realizing he was tired and wanted to cuddle Daddy (never more than 30 minutes). Every nigth before bed, I set up the table beside the bed with a cup of water, my glasses (I'm less grouchy if I can see right away and admit that I'm getting up) and a stuffed animal that he loves (in his case, 3 tiny little plastic lady bugs that he loves and constantly loses in our bed throughout the night, whereupon he cries out "missing one!" and we feel aorund the bed like fools for minutes on end trying to locate the damn things. But I digress...). And in the living room in our cuddle chair I set up a blanket, another water cup, his space ship, a couple of books and a bowl with grapes in it (or another snack that doesn't require refridgeration). I also made sure to have all of the annoying little electronics lights facing away from us, and anything else that could be a distraction from going back to sleep.The willingness to get out of bed was crucial for us, because I think for some babes it's necessary to get them out of the half-asleep, primitive -searching-for-milk mode and get them remembering that, oh yeah, the sun is asleep and we'll have milk in the morning.

I don't blame you for dreading it - you can't know how it's going to go, you're torn about doing it, and you're not in a great position to be sleep-deprived right now. If DHs spring break is in a few weeks, could be worth it to wait - we waited until DH was able to help a little more too. Do you ahve the sense that she's ready to night-wean? Fenton was a prime candidate for the months-on end screaming fit of nightweaning I had heard about, he's so headstrong. But I also knew that the night nursing was more a habit than a need, and I was shocked to see how right I was about it, and how much easier it made it that it really was a habit. If you think she's ready, it will probably be easier than you think. If you think she's not quite ready but you are, it will be a little harder. But my experience with all of the weaning is that he's been way more ready on all fronts than I expected.









So, what do you all sing to your LOs to get them to sleep? I need some new material. Our standards are Country Boy, Matthew (big John Denver fan, we're only a little embarassed), 'Ol 55, Time in a Bottle and Sweet Baby James. They're familier enough that he's starting to sing (shout, really







) along with us, which defeats the drowsy factor. So I'm looking for more material.

And I have to vent about something that happened at Church on Saturday night. We were hosting a benefit where there wasn't child care. I brought Fenton, and at one point went down to the toddler room to change his dipe. I was shocked to find one of the kids there, an 8 year old, down there and babysitting 2 other kids. One of the kids is the 3 year old daughter of a woman who has just started coming because she's dating a guy in the church. Her daughter started crying down there while I was there, and I seized the opportunity to suggest I take her back to her mother. The 8 year old said "no", that her mother has specifically said not to come get her, no matter how upset her daughter got. What the hell is the matter with people? You leave your 3 years old with an 8 year old you don't even know, and then instruct her to not bother you? This didn't help me in my quest to see other parenting styles as value-neutral....


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Ha! How funny. We go to the outer banks of NC every other year with my family (we're going in July this year), so that would be repetitive, and we also don't really love it all that much! We'd like either a nice city vacation or quaint big town or mountain getaway. If we can't do Caribbean then we don't really care for the beach (snobby?) I'd love do go to Jamaica or similar but I don't have a current passport and we want to go soon!


Dh and his family used to do the same thing, and someday he wants to do the same with us. But what about Asheville, NC or Williamsburg, VA? Or heck, Boston?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Ha! How funny. We go to the outer banks of NC every other year with my family (we're going in July this year), so that would be repetitive, and we also don't really love it all that much!

Dh and I have wanted to visit it as a vacation spot - what don't you like about it? Boston would be nice, I hear DC is good for kids too, but maybe for older. I'd vote for a palce where Quinn can run outside, maybe take him for hikes and bike ride? What aout someplace in the Poconos?


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, sorry, i haven't heard of any of the names on your current list. i looked them up, and i like aine best, because it's celtic for joy. oh, i found another site, it's pronounced anya (duh). i like it.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Maela, I love Vienna, Vianne (I think I like this better - remind me how it's pronoucned?) too, but Baby Grapes is my favorite.

I showed him to how to use one of his PlayDoh tools today and he exclaimed "Well, that's amazing!"
















Vianne is pronounced VEE-an. Sometimes I see it spelled as Vienne. (Vienne is the French name for the city Vienna, so maybe that would be a good compromise?) It's short for Vivienne, which means "alive."

I think we're going to call the baby "Grapes" until it is born, or until we know the sex.

That's so funny! - "Well That's amazing!" I love that they're starting to say such cute things now!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I was







trying to figure out what you meant, and then I realized (after Shanna's post) that you were talking about Holiztic's vacation.









Ooops!







Sorry.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
She has just started to talk into the telephone receiver, using a deeper voice - I think that must be what she thinks we sound like on the phone. And now she likes to talk/sing into cups and jugs.
















That is so cute!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Have some time to kill before my Kraft Macaroni and Cheese Deluxe is done cooking.







: I know, I know....but I'm starving, feeling like I want to puke and I haven't had anything naughty in over a week. So if I'm going to fall off the wagon, I'm going to hit the ground running. That _whole_ box is mine. Poor baby...







:

Don't worry, I've been eating badly too (I'm sure a lot worse than you have







). The morning sickness is slowly leaving (I think), so I'm soon going to start eating much healthier.

I planted our very tiny vegetable garden yesterday (just tomatoes, yellow bell peppers, eggplant, basil, and parsley) and it made me excited for all the wonderful yummy fruits and veggies that are available in the summer!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Maela, I'm so touched by all that you're debating with the nightweaning.







I never imagined the process would be so hard on us - I always envisioned being sad when DS decided to self-wean, and it's a different ball entirely when we are trying to encourage them. I think all the difference in the world is in temperment, but I thought I'd share some of my tips that I think really helped. We talked with Fenton for at least a couple fo weeks beforehand about the sun going night-night, and how soon (we gave him teh date, and showed him on the calendar each day) we were going to stop having milk at night when the sun was sleeping. We also had started to play up "cuddling Daddy" at night and during the day. All advice I had received strongly advised against going cold turkey, and I think that is true for most babes. Fenton's personality simply does not understand moderation - we tried a couple of nights with the Jay Gordon model of pushing the time back further and further before nursing, and it didn't take long to realize Fenton needed to know that nursing wasn't happening anymore at night. We also knew with his personality that when he gets upset at night, it sometimes works better to see the writing on the wall and get up with him rather than try to comfort him in bed. Comforting in bed can last hours, whereas getting up with him entailed reading a couple of books, getting a snack, and him realizing he was tired and wanted to cuddle Daddy (never more than 30 minutes). Every nigth before bed, I set up the table beside the bed with a cup of water, my glasses (I'm less grouchy if I can see right away and admit that I'm getting up) and a stuffed animal that he loves (in his case, 3 tiny little plastic lady bugs that he loves and constantly loses in our bed throughout the night, whereupon he cries out "missing one!" and we feel aorund the bed like fools for minutes on end trying to locate the damn things. But I digress...). And in the living room in our cuddle chair I set up a blanket, another water cup, his space ship, a couple of books and a bowl with grapes in it (or another snack that doesn't require refridgeration). I also made sure to have all of the annoying little electronics lights facing away from us, and anything else that could be a distraction from going back to sleep.The willingness to get out of bed was crucial for us, because I think for some babes it's necessary to get them out of the half-asleep, primitive -searching-for-milk mode and get them remembering that, oh yeah, the sun is asleep and we'll have milk in the morning.

I don't blame you for dreading it - you can't know how it's going to go, you're torn about doing it, and you're not in a great position to be sleep-deprived right now. If DHs spring break is in a few weeks, could be worth it to wait - we waited until DH was able to help a little more too. Do you ahve the sense that she's ready to night-wean? Fenton was a prime candidate for the months-on end screaming fit of nightweaning I had heard about, he's so headstrong. But I also knew that the night nursing was more a habit than a need, and I was shocked to see how right I was about it, and how much easier it made it that it really was a habit. If you think she's ready, it will probably be easier than you think. If you think she's not quite ready but you are, it will be a little harder. But my experience with all of the weaning is that he's been way more ready on all fronts than I expected.









Thank you so much for this. You gave me some good ideas. I would prefer to do it gradually (for me), but I think that Maev wouldn't understand unless it was an all night thing. And I think you're right about allowing them to fully wake up. Because otherwise she would be in that half-asleep phase where she wouldn't understand and would just be screaming, I think.

Don't have any song suggestions. I try to sing to Maev and she doesn't like it anymore when she's tired. She does ask me to sing in the car though (whatever music we're listening to). It makes me feel good, even though my voice isn't great.









That's awful about your experience at church.









*Holiztic* I also think Boston would be fun (one of the few places I've been), but how cold is it there still?


----------



## witchygrrl

It's n the low 50s and it's getting warmer. The birds are chirping and plants are coming up! I love this time of year. Now I do live north of Boston, so it's usually a little cooler here, but it's quite nice right now


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
It's n the low 50s and it's getting warmer. The birds are chirping and plants are coming up! I love this time of year. Now I do live north of Boston, so it's usually a little cooler here, but it's quite nice right now









That's great to hear! My SIL was getting very tired of all the snow!


----------



## accountclosed3

ok, say you were to take a family yoga class.

family yoga class is a class where children of all ages are allowed to attend--from new born to 80+. the teacher leads a sequence of postures, breathwork, and chants (om, really), and there is an area set up for quiet play/coloring in one area of the room. nursing is welcome, of course, and you have to potty your own kid. kids under 13 are not allowed to leave the room without a parent present.

now, what times would such classes be most excellent assuming that you're perfectly ok not having your child there due to school schedules, time with grandma, or whatever else, but you also dont' necessarily have child care for small children and infants, and they're not in preschool that day.

what times would make for the best times for you to attend family yoga with your under-5 child?

8:45-10
9:30-10:45
10:15-11:30
1:15-2:30
2:45-4:00

and if you were to attend with your school-aged child as well, would you attend a 4:15-5:30?

on the weekend, would you do a family yoga class in lieu of or before or after your normal religious routine (church?) such as at 8 am or 12 pm on a sunday? this would allow EVERYONE to come--dad, kids, grandma, etc.

Also, how often would you come? would you practice once in a while, once a month, once a week, more than once a week? if more than once, how many times per week would you practice?

if a small child care was offered during yoga time, would you attend class at that time? child care would be limited to a small number of children and would likely be a yoga-lite class with coloring and just fun (wooden/waldorf) toys to play with.

any other insights would be helpful.

thanks.

i'm so flexible with hawk's schedule that nap times aren't set, though he's a great sleeper and can sleep anywhere, and so sometimes i can make it to class and sometimes i can't depending upon the given day and what hawk is doing. here, there's family yoga on monday's at 11, and sometimes hawk is sleeping then and sometimes he isn't. if he isn't, then we'll go. if he falls asleep during, then great, if not, then great. just depends.

but others aren't like us. LOL so i wanna know about you and what you would do. SO, please assume that you love yoga and want to practice it at least once a week, but what would be realistic with your little one(s)?


----------



## Maela

If I had the money to take a family yoga class, I would want to go once a week to the 9:30-10:45AM. I would probably not use the child care if I could keep her in the room with me because she doesn't like being left with anyone besides gparents (and now Finally the church nursery staff!














. Weekends are too busy for us.

Of course, this would be different if I had a younger/older child or more than one. If I had a school-aged kid I might attend the 4:15-5:30 class, if we weren't too busy. Can't really say yet, I guess.


----------



## farmama

Zoe,

10:15-11:30 Once per week. we have a great yoga class on Sundays (10:30 start time), which works well for us, but i know it would interfere with church going for others.

i don't have a school-aged lo, but i don't think i'd do an after school more than once a week, just bc it would interfere with dinner/general scheduling.

Maela,

i like Vianne. or baby grapes.

Christina,

that is so cute! N is a chatterbox at home, but in public she clams up.









thanks all for sharing on the weaning front. we are working on some redirecting of nursing, as my dd is comfort nursing quite often, and asks for milk (not food) when she's hungry.


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird,

Around 10ish have usually worked well for us since DD was born (when it doesn't it is because she sleeps in until after 9, and we run out of time to get there with public transport!).

Those yoga classes sounds great, and we would go 1-3 times a week! Especially if DD really liked it there, which she probably would if there were other children and toys but still rather calm (no running around and screaming or noisy toys, that seems to scare her). We might go in the weekends sometimes, if that was on offer.

If in New Zealand, and you wanted to include mums with older children at school, as well as the LO to bring, remember schools start at 9 am and finish at 3 pm. Most 3-year-olds go to afternoon kindergarten 12.45-3.15 3 days a week, and most 4-year-olds go to morning kindy (which varies in start and finish time, sometime between 8 and 8.45 to between 11.30 and 12.45) 5 days a week.


----------



## accountclosed3

thanks for the info about schools. i'm putting that in my notes!

_Class Time_

i was thinking that a 9:30-9:45 time was better. here, the class is at 11, and that's tough.

i'm also thinking of simply asserting that it is "open for children" meaning that you can come with or without children, but children will be present. it sort of opens the field a bit. but, it might simply be better to have some designated for families and some not. i'm not sure.







i'll have to experiment.

_Noise Levels_

the class would definitely be quiet, but of course have child-noise. i likely wouldn't play music either, just to decrease the noise there, unless it was background noise such as ocean waves or rainforest sounds or something like that.

i have run a class in the past where mom's brought their kids. we set up a small play area in the corner where we asked them to play quietly. they would start class with us (oming, doing a few poses), and most would head over to color or play quietly. then, they might join us again, and then i invited themto help their moms by showing them an assist, and then they would Om with us at the end. class was 1 hr, which didn't seem to be too much for them; i would likely make class 1.25 hrs, to give time for everyone to settle before and share a bit while leaving.

it was really fun when i took it a few times, but the time here was awkward for us, and ultimately that class will be cancalled i think. i think that other moms would have fun.

_Class Pricing_

The policy that my friend has is that class is $15 for moms with children under age 1, and then after age one, it's $2 per child. I think that's too much.

I would charge just the parent, until the child is 8, and then charge a 'student rate.' around age 8, children actually start to study/learn on their own, not just following mom. Also at that age, they have more of a sense of decorum, so mom isn't having to watch behavior so much. of course, they are also welcome to sit out and color and such (should a child be homeschooled, or it's a holiday or what have you), but that parent would still be charged student price.

So, it would be $15 regardless of the number of children under age 8, and then for children over 8, it would be student price, and i might have a cap, say, of $25 for a "family" of 4 people over 8 or some such so that it's not an undue burden (if mom, dad, an 8 yr old and a 5 yr old come, it would likely cost $15 ea for mom and dad, plus $12 for the 8 yr old, and hte 5 yr old would be free. that's a lot of money--$42! so, if it's $25 or $30, it encourages the family to come and get a discounted rate. i just want people to come and experience yoga together.









_Sunday Yoga_

Right now, i'm thinking of offering a long sunday morning class once a month. it would be a 3 hr class. my current students are calling for it, and so i think it's something that i could put into the picture. personally, i love a 3 hr practice. LOL

of course, a lot of my students skip church whenever we have this. if it's once a month, that's not too bad. every 6 weeks maybe? i dunno. LOL anyway. . .

so many creative ideas in my head. must write about them! LOL


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

: Happy Birthday Josephine!







:


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, about the Sundays, I would be more concerned about weekend sports (school children), as most families here do not attend church (and I might say, especially the ones who are into "alternative" stuff!). Still assuming in New Zealand!


----------



## Maela

: to Josephine!!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

No way







:.....HAPPY BIRTHDAY JOSEPHINE!!!!!

Zoe, I had a long reply for your yoga question, and somehow managed to delete it. But pretty much it was the groupmomthink on naps times, etc.

Mmmmm.....pizza.....


----------



## PiePie

z.b., i'm catholic, as you know, so we have mass times around the clock. that would not influence my exercise schedule at all. were i to have an exercise schedule. just working with your hypothetical.


----------



## cking

Thanks all for the birthday wishes. we had a wonderful busy day and now I am :yawning:. I really can't believe it has been a year, but I am so in awe of the little toddler she is becoming.







:

ZB, it's hard to pick a time...we are struggling with this now. I'd probably say 1:15. Really earlier would be better - 10 or 11. BUT, we sleep late (8, sometimes 9) and by the time we eat breakfast, get cleaned up, poop, and get dressed, it's usually 10:30 or 11. And then when she does take a morning nap, it's around 11:30. (But she decides to skip the nap on the days when we do have a class at 1:30.







)


----------



## katt

Family Yoga-
Sounds like fun. We're late risers so an afternoon class would work great. Naptime starts anywhere from 2-4pm. Depending on what time he woke up. Although, if we are out and about, he sometimes skips his nap. no biggie.


----------



## PiePie

Liz, Here are my thoughts on vacation. if you were going this month, I would do Miami. Fun marine life stuff (what kid doesn't love that), awesome children's museum i hear, and interesting food i hear. i know you said you don't do non-carribean beaches (although really goa is pretty nice







) but warmth would feel good after such a loooong winter. and the flight would be short. if you were going in may, i would do boston -- it will be warm but not overly humid. tons of historic stuff, you can take him to the public garden and read about the ducklings, and you can do the tall ships. also good food for the grownups and good public transit so you don't need a car, you can just wander neighborhoods, and he will love the t. if you are going in summer, i would do toronto. tons of kids stuff like the science museum, the natural history museum, and a climbing kinda place on the lake, interesting city for grownups too, super clean, good public transit (hooray for street cars), and friendly and mellow (in contrast to boston, which i would not call mellow or particularly friendly). we are in fact doing toronto twice this summer. also a short flight.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Liz, Here are my thoughts on vacation. if you were going this month, I would do Miami. Fun marine life stuff (what kid doesn't love that), awesome children's museum i hear, and interesting food i hear. i know you said you don't do non-carribean beaches (although really goa is pretty nice







) but warmth would feel good after such a loooong winter. and the flight would be short. if you were going in may, i would do boston -- it will be warm but not overly humid. tons of historic stuff, you can take him to the public garden and read about the ducklings, and you can do the tall ships. also good food for the grownups and good public transit so you don't need a car, you can just wander neighborhoods, and he will love the t. if you are going in summer, i would do toronto. tons of kids stuff like the science museum, the natural history museum, and a climbing kinda place on the lake, interesting city for grownups too, super clean, good public transit (hooray for street cars), and friendly and mellow (in contrast to boston, which i would not call mellow or particularly friendly). we are in fact doing toronto twice this summer. also a short flight.

Thanks for the ideas, I am going to look into boston and toronto for may or june (stupid question--do I need a passport for Toronto?)


----------



## cking

Holiztic -
as of June 1 you will need a passport. But Quinn won't.
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cbpmc/cbpmc_2223.html


----------



## witchygrrl

There's also Nova Scotia--we're going there next year. We went for our honeymoon, and we want to revisit for our 5th anniversary--Rhea will be nearly 2 then, so we specifically want to stay at White Point so she can play with the bunnies that are everywhere!

www.whitepoint.com

The dollar is strong so Canada will be a good deal









If you do decide on Boston--let me know!


----------



## PiePie

I go to Toronto a lot (relatives there). Only needed passport to drive after 9/11, but to fly ALWAYS needed a passport -- nearly missed my grandmother's funeral because of it.


----------



## Maela

I'm jealous of all of the fun cities you guys have to visit over there!

Heard the heartbeat yesterday. Sounded great. Reminded me that there really is a baby in there.


----------



## farmama

doh! I missed Josephine's birthday!

Happy Birthday Josephine!!







:

i can't believe our babes are growing up!


----------



## farmama

demanding kiddo in my lap, but a quick and important question:
no af for six weeks, but a negative pg test. any thoughts?????


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
demanding kiddo in my lap, but a quick and important question:
no af for six weeks, but a negative pg test. any thoughts?????

Has it _just_ been six weeks? So if you _were_ pregnant, you'd be _just_ two weeks. And sometimes it takes a while for positives to show right? Don't some people take longer than 14 dpo to get the positive? I'm not sure, just thinking aloud...

ETA: No wait, I'm wrong aren't I? You should be getting a positive by now. I'm sorry I can't think this morning...

Do you chart? Are you sure of when you ovulated? Maybe you ovulated later than usual, which would push back your AF arrival?


----------



## cking

Happy Birthday MMM!!!

Sorry I missed it, i know it's already tomorrow there.









Had the big birthday party today. I'm exhausted. J had a blast.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
demanding kiddo in my lap, but a quick and important question:
no af for six weeks, but a negative pg test. any thoughts?????

I had this last month. It showed up right at six weeks though. I haven't been charting, so I'm not sure...but I was going to bring this up - anovulatory cycles while nursing? how common are they? Sorry I don't have an answer for you, but maybe it's just delayed O.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Happy Birthday MMM!!!

Oh







: MMM! I'm so bad about keeping up with the mamas birthdays!


----------



## PiePie

So, I am really freaking out that I don't have AF yet. Going to consult with an OBGYN about it in May (you may remember seeing this male OBGYN in The Business of Being Born -- he is my MW''s backup, and, importantly to DH, on our insurance, unlike the MW). DH may be up for trying in May -- he said we would discuss it later, which is way different than a big fat no, right? I really don't want to wean to TTC. I would not be willing to do so until DD's second birthday. Super sad contemplating weaning, but even more anxious about having kids be 4 rather than 3 grades apart.

I have done a ton of internet research into nursing and fertility, and annovulatory cycles are super common among women who get their periods back before 6 mos., and pretty common among women who get their periods back before 12 mos. Less common among women who get their periods back between 12 and 24 months. no data on women who get their periods back after 24 mos. *farmama*, when did yours come back? they can be wonky for quite some time after it comes back. i would not worry, but glad you tested.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
So, I am really freaking out that I don't have AF yet. Going to consult with an OBGYN about it in May (you may remember seeing this male OBGYN in The Business of Being Born -- he is my MW''s backup, and, importantly to DH, on our insurance, unlike the MW). DH may be up for trying in May -- he said we would discuss it later, which is way different than a big fat no, right? I really don't want to wean to TTC. I would not be willing to do so until DD's second birthday. Super sad contemplating weaning, but even more anxious about having kids be 4 rather than 3 grades apart.

I have done a ton of internet research into nursing and fertility, and annovulatory cycles are super common among women who get their periods back before 6 mos., and pretty common among women who get their periods back before 12 mos. Less common among women who get their periods back between 12 and 24 months. no data on women who get their periods back after 24 mos. *farmama*, when did yours come back? they can be wonky for quite some time after it comes back. i would not worry, but glad you tested.

Well, Quinn is 2 next week and I still have not had AF. I have day-weaned Q (as of 2 days) as it made more sense for us than night-weaning (though we plan to do that soon, too). I hope to see AF soon!


----------



## accountclosed3

i was looking up international vacation stuff and was under the impression that we need a baby passport. we just started filling out the form and are getting an appt with the regional office ASAP.

ryan applied for two jobs in NZ and so may have to interview soon; i'm also looking at a holistic business (well, the one yoga studio and this holistic business), and of course wanting to meet everyone whom i can there. We have four primary groups to meet: friends, social network (AC, et al!), work networks (interviews, businesses, fellow yoga teachers and related), pragmatic group--banking/real estate etc. So, we're looking at 3-4 weeks there. ryan can definitely do 3.

anyway, we need a passport for hawk. can you imagine his cutey passport picture? oh my goodness! LOL

anyway, sept at latest, though we may go in june. "horrible time of year to go" but i think it's a good choice to see the country at it's weather worst!


----------



## PiePie

we had dd's passport expedited (paid extra, but no in person appt necessary -- just dropped off app at post office), it came very quickly.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
anyway, we need a passport for hawk. can you imagine his cutey passport picture? oh my goodness! LOL

anyway, sept at latest, though we may go in june. "horrible time of year to go" but i think it's a good choice to see the country at it's weather worst!

Good luck on getting the passport quickly! I am SO jealous! It's been too long since we've been out of the country, and I would love to visit NZ someday. Maybe we'll visit you in a few years!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm avoiding the basketball game here







<whispers> Go State!

Thought I'd share with you the most successful toy in Fenton history, from his Grandparents for his birthday: Connect 4. He doesn't play it as a competitive game yet, but he will spend hours putting the checkers in and taking them back out. LOVES it! And today he discovered our now-not-working multimeter: today he watched me take it apart to try to fix it and then asked if he could "do his work". I took out the dangerous parts and gave it to him, he spent hours happily "fixing" it with screwdrivers, wrenches and anything else he's ever seen me use.

Hey, does anyone here use the oil cleansing method on their skin? Thinking about giving it a try, it's not a long shot from my current cold cream method, which is no longer working for me because it's getting lanolin on my family cloth (which is a worse idea than it even sounds like







). Anyone, wondered if anyone does this....

Holiztic, congratulations on day weaning














I had to laugh when I mentally compared the space here that you dedicated to it and the space I did







.

Pie Pie, I've been thinking of you since you started talking about being concerned about no AF - I hope your doc visit helps, but it does sound like it's really normal, if frustrating and inconvenient.







. Is your OB the guy who did the C-section on the director? That guy? I loved him....


----------



## Maela

I used the oil cleansing method on my face for about 2 months. It worked pretty well. I don't think my face was any better or worse for it. I did like how soft it made my skin immediately after though. I stopped because it was just too inconvenient for me. Maybe if I had done it while in the shower... I can't even remember how it's done







...it was about four years ago.


----------



## Maela

Maev's new thing is to ask people if they're "being good" or to tell people that she's "being good." She'll usually say it on the phone: "Hi Nana, how are you, being good?" or someone will ask, "what are you doing?" and she'll reply "being good!" It's weird because I usually try to stay away from saying "being good" but she's picked it up anyway.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i was looking up international vacation stuff and was under the impression that we need a baby passport. we just started filling out the form and are getting an appt with the regional office ASAP.

anyway, we need a passport for hawk. can you imagine his cutey passport picture? oh my goodness! LOL


For international air travel, you do. But for driving to Canada, only require for people over 16, according to DOS. Oh, his little passport picture will be so cute! We were thinking about getting one for J, and I was most excited about the picture. Instead, she got a Ymca membership card, but the pic did not come out so good.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hey, does anyone here use the oil cleansing method on their skin? Thinking about giving it a try, it's not a long shot from my current cold cream method, which is no longer working for me because it's getting lanolin on my family cloth (which is a worse idea than it even sounds like







). Anyone, wondered if anyone does this....


I do this, with coconut oil. I tried it once with the olive oil/caster oil combination I read about on MDC, but didn't like it. I do like the coconut oil - it leaves my skin very soft and moisturized, and in the morning it still feels smooth. I just rub it on, then run a washcloth through very hot water and put that over my face, then rub it off.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev's new thing is to ask people if they're "being good" or to tell people that she's "being good." She'll usually say it on the phone: "Hi Nana, how are you, being good?" or someone will ask, "what are you doing?" and she'll reply "being good!" It's weird because I usually try to stay away from saying "being good" but she's picked it up anyway.

It makes me crazy how often people say this to Fenton while we try to stay away from it. Sometimes I wish I could put him in a bubble until he could defend himself. Thankfully, no one has told him that he's "naughty" (that is going to send me through the roof), but I do find the constant "good boy!" to be insipid. They tell him that when he picks something up off the floor, for crying out loud. The other thing that makes me crazy is how often people describe to him the ways he's going to kill or maime himself if he so much as picks a foot up off the floor. Ever since the last time my mom came over for dinner, he tells me to "be careful" and "not to fall" whenever he stands on his dinner chair







. So now I'm constantly trying to undo it by telling him he's perfectly capable of standing on a chair without falling.

Thanks for the advice on the OCM - I think I might try it.

Sorry I'm no help on the travel and passport info - we flew once with Fenton at 9 months, called it a success, and vowed to rest on our laurels until he's 18


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
She'll usually say it on the phone: "Hi Nana, how are you, being good?"

I have to confess though, this is one of the cutest things I've ever heard - I like how it puts it back on Nana


----------



## accountclosed3

i think the "good boy" abd "good baby" stuff is terrible. it's so frustrating to redirect.

my parents and ILS are still driving me batty by being manipulative. i've finally started to call it what it is straight to their faces.

for example, i told my parents that it's stressful to have everyone over so often--his parents one day, my parents the next. so, we're going to put it to one weekend a month for our own sanity. i explain to them that it's stressful and my mother says "we're not trying to be stressful." and i say "yes, i know, but it is stressful to plan for guests every weekend or every other weekend, so this is what we're doing for our own family life. we do need our own time, you know." and then it's "i know, but..." and i tell her to stop trying to manipulate and guilt trip me and then it's "but i'm not trying to guilt you. . ." and i say "but you are..." it's SO annoying. just say "yes, i'm disappointed, but if it's what's best for you. . ."

so, then we get these weird weedlings such as my mother saying "well, i made a hair appt down there for this friday, and i have to pick up my glasses on that friday, and i need to do this on that friday. So, i thought we would visit!" and i have to say no because it's too much for me (and honestly, on these days, it's tough on hawk because he doesn't get his normal naps in).

then, my ILs start in on ryan and when he tells them which weekend we have set up for them, they sy "oh, we can't do that weekend, we're only available these other weekends." and instead of just saying "we want to come on this weekend" they then shoot down every available weekend until we "agree" to the one that they want, which comes with much guilt tripping too.

oh, and if my FIL mentions my weight one more time! this time, and it was horrible, he said right in front of my MIL "you don't want to be like MIL who just went to pot after the babies and never recovered. she's j ust not as cute as she was before. we don't want that for ryan."

bastard.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
oh, and if my FIL mentions my weight one more time! this time, and it was horrible, he said right in front of my MIL "you don't want to be like MIL who just went to pot after the babies and never recovered. she's j ust not as cute as she was before. we don't want that for ryan."

bastard.











So they're abusive to _everyone_. That clarifies things...


----------



## farmama

thanks for the input yall. still no af.
it returned 8 or 9 months pp, and it's always been pretty regular, so this is surprising.

who knows?









Zoe,

all i can say is wow. wow.


----------



## accountclosed3

they are, but they are completely unconscious about it.

yesterday, when they talked to ryan, they asked about the race he was in on sunday. he was very happy with the race. he hasnt' been training or anytthing and does it as a once-a-year fun run. he beat last years time without training or trying by about a minute. i think he came in the top 10 for the whole race too.

and his dad says "i did a mintue better time when i was 46!" ryan wasn't sure what that's about, except some competition thing that his dad has. he's always competing with ryan in some way, i guess because he's getting older.

i think we're supposed to see them this weekend, but ryan and i might talk about not doing that.


----------



## Maela

Wow. And I thought it was stressful being around _my_ parents and ILs.









About the "good girl": I have to admit that I sometimes say this. It's just habit from my job. But now I notice it at least and I







at myself. What I really hate is when we're leaving and my mom says, "Goodbye! Be a good girl!" or when we first get there and she says, "Have you been a good girl today?" Aaahhh!

And I also tend to say "be careful"







, but I usually try to say "pay attention" because I think it sounds better. I've also noticed though that I am much calmer about her getting hurt than most people I know. If she's not in _likely_ danger of _serious_ injury, I try to let her be. The other night we were at a restaurant with my parents and Dd was wandering around near our table. My parents were literally hovering over her the whole time to make sure that she didn't bump her head on the tables. So she gets a small bump; what's the big deal? Let the kid have some freedom. They were the same way with me, and I didn't know how to take care of/watch out for myself when all of a sudden at the age of 18, they gave me complete freedom. I don't want it to be that way with Dd.


----------



## Sihaya

The "good boy/girl" comments drive me crazy and it's the only thing my mom does that really bugs me. Thankfully, we'll be going to a LLL conference next month and I convinced her to sign up for the session about praise being harmful. I really don't want to tell her how to do things, but I know if she hears it from someone else (especially someone she perceives to have "authority"), she'll cut it out. The ILs, however, are another matter. Very hover-y, say "good boy" constantly, and are very concerned because we don't say "no" all the time







:

Instead of "be careful" and "no," I try to be more specific and give information instead of orders. For instance, if he's about to bump his head into the table, I might say "The table is right behind your head, buddy" but I try to do this only with things I think he doesn't already know. I don't like to use "no" a ton because I try not to say anything to him that I don't want directed back at me in the near future. I definitely don't want to hear the barked "NO!" he gets from the ILs and some parents at playgroups. Even in life-threatening situations, I'd rather use "stop" or "danger," but that's probably just me









*zoebird* - every time you post about your parents and ILs, it makes me want to kiss mine.







to you for having to deal with that.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm with ya'll about language.

a lot of folks ask me if he's a 'good baby.' and i say "goodness is his inherent nature; but yes, he is an easy baby to take care of." they look at me like i'm ntus.

with everyone else, i redirect as much as possible and do the same thing about explaining. if he's grabbing something that i don't want him to, i move it out of the way and say "this is mine! that is yours!' and hand him something that he can grab. i also use 'danger' and 'stop' instead of no.

it's funny, because my father pointed out that i rarely say no to him at all. i will say "ouch, that hurts" with a "please stop" when he gets very aggressive (he's the most aggressive hugger/kisser. he clamps onto your nose or chin and that's it. i have had bruises from it. when he has teeth, i don't know what i'm going to do about it.).

i think that language is SO important, so i try really hard with hawk to be clear. if that means wordy, it does. i'm not terribly worried about it all.

i really need to move to NZ. then, i'd only have to worry about family once a year or less (though, i'd miss them for all the trouble they bring).


----------



## TinyFrog

How is it possible that Josephine is already a year old? Didn't she just turn four months?









Happy Belated Birthday to her!!!







:







:





















:

Oh wow, talk of more second babies.







:


----------



## TinyFrog

: at the comments from your FIL ZB. How sad for your MIL, and him.







I am not sure how I would respond to such a comment.


----------



## accountclosed3

i wasn't sure how to either. i never am. ryan, apparently, has no problem with my body, and i am the original weight. body composition is still 'off' but it's going ok. he's just obcessive, my FIL. eating disorders and the whole bit.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm re-reading The Red Tent (







) and just happened upon a quote of

Quote:

Time is a mother's enemy.
It resonated with me so much, I feel choked up, and wondered if any of you are struggling with this. I wish I didn't say "struggle" because it's impossible to struggle against it. But the truth of it makes me so sad, I feel like I've felt melancholy over this since we weaned. It was always there, but it feels so...tragic lately







.


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, I arrived here in early July. It rained every day (at some point every day), but I've never wanted to leave!









Now it looks like we're leaving.







We just can't really see a way we can afford to stay...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
(he's the most aggressive hugger/kisser. he clamps onto your nose or chin and that's it. i have had bruises from it. when he has teeth, i don't know what i'm going to do about it.).

Oh, how did I forget about that! Dd was also a very aggressive kisser.







We had to teach her "gentle kisses." Now I can look back and laugh at how cute it was, but at the time it was frustrating because it hurt so much!


----------



## PiePie

the OB is the curly-haired one who did the photog's section. just watched it tonight. while in general i would not be into a male ob (understatement of understatments), i think i can live with him for just a pap smear and fertility consult. i now suspect that the amenorrhea and the postpartum weight gain are related to the minipill.

*maela*, your dd is so verbal!


----------



## cking

I agree on the 'being good' thing. It was incredibly frustrating to me when everyone's comments on our 8-_week_ old dd's baptism was "oh she was so good!". You mean patient?









zoebird, wow, your ILs are whack!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm re-reading The Red Tent (







) and just happened upon a quote of It resonated with me so much, I feel choked up, and wondered if any of you are struggling with this. I wish I didn't say "struggle" because it's impossible to struggle against it. But the truth of it makes me so sad, I feel like I've felt melancholy over this since we weaned. It was always there, but it feels so...tragic lately







.

Yes, totally. It's really been on my mind lately.


----------



## katt

I agree that language is SO powerful. I don't use good/bad boy at all. Occassionaly DH will ask ds if he's been a good boy. M and FIL are the worst w/ it, but I let it slide cause they would be SUPER offended and he doesn't see them a whole lot anyway. Although, I may say somthing if they get on him about being 'bad' if he's having a hard day.

I also try to use NO for super important things: knives, hot stoves etc... He does really well w/ Stop and wait. I've tried hard to explain things to him, i don't always succeed, but DH does really well w/ it. I've found that ds understands the explinations very well, and always has, even when he wasn't very verbal.


----------



## accountclosed3

AC: where do you think you're going to go? i know that there has been some interesting work shortages in NZ--they don't have people skilled for a lot of the jobs that they have, and the jobs that people are skilled for are hit by the recession. it's realy something else (according to what i'm reading anyway).

so, totally random (sort of), but i got the Road Runner totem last night as i was preparing for bed. i'm sick (and so is ryan and hawk--sinus cold thingies). i was running a fever,trying to get hawk to settle, and i had this strong feeling of hte road runner in my head. a red one, but nevertheless, the road runner.

so, the symbology is that the thoughts are very fast, and that in communication, one may need to slow down.

i thought that was interesting considering how we're talkign about communication AND how i'm dealing with folks these days. i think i have an expectation that they're "on the same page" and so i'm communicating/thinking too quickly and need to slow down for them.


----------



## witchygrrl

Zoe, your ILs boggle the mind...I'll be seeing mine this weekend for Passover/Easter. Should be interesting. Last time I saw MIL she asked if I had lost weight because I supposedly looked it. Personally I think it's code for asking if I gained weight as she only seems to ask that when I've put on a few. Ugh.

This discussion on language is very interesting to me. I've been thinking about how I talk to Rhea too. I do use 'no' now that she's mobile. 'Good' and 'bad' haven't entered into the equation. She's curious about her world, which is just plain normal, yk? But I hate the whole "is she a good baby?" that EVERYONE asks. It's so....insipid. Of course she's good--why would she be anything else?

Shanna, AC...







to you both.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

nak








: we found a house. thank the stars. and it's an awesome house too - 4 (!!!} bedrooms, gorgeous garden, amazing bathroom and kitchen and only 2 streets away from here...so still very much in my little urban village.

I had just booked a storage unit and removalists and made plans to go to mums. now we can cancel the storage. we move next weds.

Boy I was feeling so pathetic. I was sooooo stressed and crying all the time. And Sebby was onto his 5th day of uber grumpy, super needy...and now he's back to the smiley, giggly boy I used to know. It's amazing just how much they pick up on our moods and emotions.

*Re parents and in-laws and comments about weight* - My Dads wife is queen of weight comments. 6 hours after giving birth she asked me about weight loss. Now that I've actually lost a lot of weight (I'm way below pre-preg) thanks to my thyroid, the comments from DP's family and mine are endless. "You look so great, you must be thrilled..." And quietly, personally, I am happy to be down some weight. It had really crept up on me when my thyroid was hypo. BUT I'm also sick and stressed and I find it a little bit morbid to be celebrating weight-loss attached to an illness...

oh...and while I'm complaining about my Dads wife - her latest and greatest comment to Sebby "Oh look out the window Seb - there's a truck. That's a BOY thing."

DP's mum is not much better. Do you all have a hard time with people constantly trying to gender your kids? Or is this some kind of moral panic about two women raising a boy?

Despite these irks...today is a good day!


----------



## accountclosed3

oh geez--the gender stuff. ack! don't get me started! LOL my MIL constantly brings up gender stuff and freaked out because i put him in a pink footy PJ with a cat on it. he was comfortable, it's cute, who cares? she FREAKED. my FIL lectured ryan and i about it for weeks every phone call.

i'm so glad that you found a house MMM.

shanna: i can totally see/understand the sadness about weaning. one stage is over for you guys. that's the end. it's often sad when things end. when i started giving hawk food to play with, i realized that this is the beginning of the end. bfing is a major thing to me--emotional and stuff. yeah, it's tough to see him growing up, but i also want him to grow up, you know?

so confusing, those feelings.

so, after begging ryan to push off his parents to the 25, he decided that they should come this weekend because his dad is out of town on the 25 (and 18, and dthey didn't call to tell us until this monday, so of course the only available day is the 11, which they could have told us in march and i could have planned better, but whatever). it's so annoying!

but, ryan is going to be with them while hawk is awake. he is now awake (normally) during that class because it's so exciting, and so i thought they should play with him. ryan will hang with them during class and that's that. i want a quick lunch. i told ryan that i'm making plans for 2--so they have to leave by then at the latest.

still irks me. my mom is coming on the 24th, but then we shouldn't have any parents until the end of may, unless we're in NZ by then.


----------



## TwilightJoy

:

Hey NMY grads,

How did you all learn about the right ways to praise your kids, not saying no, genderization, etc? Books? Reading on here? I know I'm still years away from children of my own, but these are interesting things to think about-- and things I should probably learn and understand.

Thank you!

And now I'm off.







Have a good night, all!


----------



## PiePie

*MMM,* will write more on the gender stuff later (of course i have lots of thoughts on this) but in the meantime i am so friggin happy for you for finding a house. it sounds GINORMOUS! xoxoxo


----------



## witchygrrl

Congrats on the house, MMM--that's amazing!

Re: gender.We had purposefully not told our friends and family that Rhea was female because I had wanted to see how creative people would be. We have tons of artsy friends, and....sigh. Yellow and green city. I also get irked that the default gender seems to be boy unless Rhea is in the most girly of outfits. And why don't I put bows in her hair?!? I'd put her in more 'boy's' clothes except that I don't find them to be much better--trucks and sports seem to be common themes. Ugh.

TJ, I've been thinking about gender issues a long time, having had many gay/trans people in my adult life (and not being the straightest arrow myself, either). So I want to raise Rhea with that awareness, and to emphasize that she can express her gender in whatever way she feels most comfortable.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
nak








: we found a house. thank the stars. and it's an awesome house too - 4 (!!!} bedrooms, gorgeous garden, amazing bathroom and kitchen and only 2 streets away from here...so still very much in my little urban village.









:Yay!







: That's so great to hear!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
oh...and while I'm complaining about my Dads wife - her latest and greatest comment to Sebby "Oh look out the window Seb - there's a truck. That's a BOY thing."

DP's mum is not much better. Do you all have a hard time with people constantly trying to gender your kids? Or is this some kind of moral panic about two women raising a boy?

Yes! I mean, I'll admit I like to dress her in little dresses and I do say to her sometimes after she gets dressed, "ooh you look so pretty, do you want to go look in the mirror?" (







).
But I didn't want to tell anyone the gender of #2 when we find out because I know the first thing I'll hear if it's a boy will be, "Oh, now she'll have a strong brother to watch out for her" and if it's a girl, "Now she'll have someone to play dress up/dolls/house with!" It bothers me to hear _other_ people do the gender thing with her, but not when I do it.







: But I don't go overboard IMO.
For Dd's first birthday I told lots of people who asked what she wanted that she would love a little truck/car/train (she really liked things with wheels at the time and we had already gotten her gift) but no one wanted to get her that. I did end up convincing my SIL though and she got one for her. And, of course, Dd loved it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
still irks me. my mom is coming on the 24th, but then we shouldn't have any parents until the end of may, unless we're in NZ by then.

ZB, do your parents or ILs know about the potential move to NZ? What do they think?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 







:

Hey NMY grads,

How did you all learn about the right ways to praise your kids, not saying no, genderization, etc? Books? Reading on here? I know I'm still years away from children of my own, but these are interesting things to think about-- and things I should probably learn and understand.

Thank you!

And now I'm off.







Have a good night, all!

Hey TJ! I'd say most of it I learned from here, but a lot of it was just what felt right to me. And I'm still not very good at it.


----------



## accountclosed3

we have not told anyone except online folks like you and our friends in or from NZ. that's mostly to get advice from them and give me a place to share our excitement without getting people worked up.

our plan is to tell them when we go on the scouting trip. we're going to go when we have enough leads to go--interviews for ryan, enough info to go and check out the businesses i'm interested in "on the ground." right now, we don't have enough of both, but we're going in sept no matter what. so we'll buy those tickets in july or so.

and then we'll tell them.

truth is, when we came back from NZ the last time, we told both families that we want to move there. we did a lot of work in that first year to make it happen, but then we decided to get pregnant and such. Ryan did no more forward progress, and i hadn't even though about buying a business at that point. we couldn't just move on "nothing" at that point.

when we brought it up before, they were pretty upset about it. Ryan's mother would cry and guilt trip saying that she might as well not be alive, that she must hve been a horrible mother because her children want to live far away, and that we are terrible failures at family relationships and are shirking our duty to our families by wanting or even considering moving.

her bottom line is that she wants both ryan and SIL to live in lancaster, pa, perhaps in the wealthier neighborhood next to hers, and to go to the same church as them and have family dinner every sunday and so on--except that, as we've explained, ryan can'tget any work in that town that is what he is doing now or pays as well and is similar work, and certainly can't do work that he LOVES because there is no infrastructure for film there. her solution--keep your job and commute the 1.5 hrs. good one. we dislike the commute he has now--20-30 minutes.

my mom also cried and then considered moving to be nearer to us. this i thought was pretty unusual, because my parents are of the mindset that every other country sucks except the US and no one has a better quality of life than people who live here. beyond that, i couldn't imagine them leaving my sister anyway, as she is the favored one.

so, it came down first that they were upset that we would move, but then i explained that we couldn't live our dreams here. ryan needed to be either in LA or wellington, and wellington is a better family city (smaller, safer, cleaner, less expensive or just about the same depending on certain factors such as taxes). my parents moved from their families in order to live well, to live as they wanted to, so at a certain level, my mother understood, even though she would miss me.

my dad currently just goes on conservative-political rants. it's crazy. i think it's the only thing that he can deal with, emotionally. i think he's channelling all of his feelings into anger and shunting it out through political rantings.

now both families think that we're staying here. after hawk was born, we discussed it at length, and then realized that it just wouldn't be right for us. this meant that we had to find a way to move--by hook or crook. but we also decided to not tell either family until we had some discernable forward progress.

and then, we'll deal with how they feel about it once we have that sense of personal certainty that comes from having htat discernable forward progress.

so far, we've started the letter of intent to migrate, ryan's applied for two jobs (both seem interested), and i've contacted two businesses for sale. we want a job interview or the in-depth financials from both businesses in order to take the scouting trip.

after the trip, we'll have a clear view of the timing of the whole thing--when we'll move, what the process is, and then deal with family issues in depth.

one of the other things that i discussed with ryan was the fact that we really value travel. we've always wanted to see asia, and i really want to travel with hawk. i want him to grow up a world traveller. so, i don't want to be "tied down" to having to use all of our vacation time each year to "come home to see family." i may not want to do that every-other year even. so, part of the onus of seeing us (and mostly hawk as it seems that ryan and i really don't matter that much to them) will be on them to come to us, or to travel with us when we're travelling. not that we won't come back and visit, but that we need to prioritize our own family.

but, i also think we'll web cam and skype a lot too. we can do that each week. that's what a lot of my friends do.

so, yeah, i'm pretty sure they're going to freak out. but my mom told me that they're going to move to where alexis is and be with her family no matter what (even if we stayed here), and my MIL will be taken from that house in a box, so we gotta do what we gotta do.


----------



## cking

MMM, congrats on the house! I'm so glad you don't have to move from your neighborhood!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Hey TJ! I'd say most of it I learned from here, but a lot of it was just what felt right to me. And I'm still not very good at it.









Same here. it just feels wrong to hear someone remark that your (newborn) child is good - as if a child could be bad? I know people (GMIL) don't generally think of it that way, but it really bugs me.

As for gendered gifts - I was quite impressed that MIL was willing to give DD a racecar for her bday. I think she was ok with it b/c she thought it was something that DH would really like.


----------



## witchygrrl

Getting ready to go to the ILs for Passover/Easter. My MIL wanted to know what food to buy for Rhea as she had sweet potatoes in the house. I said to get her some apples and we can try some applesauce. I tried explaining that she's still not big on solid foods, and we're not forcing it.

MIL's comments to me--"Is the doctor okay with it?" and "I thought she would want a change of pace."







The first one, I can understand. I told her the dr told me that whatever I want to do regarding food is fine (he's pretty cool, actually). The second comment is just...sigh.


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, babies totally get tired or breastmilk. they're constantly demanding a change of pace.

i also noticed in rereading some stuff, that it was probably confusing about NZ and may. we might be scouting as early as May, but i can't imagine that we'd have to move that quickly. who knows though?

anyway, ryan does have an interview set up for "whenever we come" with a recruiting agency (which is great), and the other place said that they wouldn't be interviewing until may, probably june anyway, so we're doing well with that. i sent in the confidnetiality agreements to the two businesses, and so hopefully they'll send me their financials so that i can turn them over to our accountant to check out.

tonight is burrito nite. i love burritos.

ryan ruined our pizza last night. i made dough, etc, and he didn't cook the pizzas long enough, and as soon as he took them out, he put his chicken in. so, we couldn't take the chicken back out to put the pizzas in, and we couldn't fit the pizzas in with the chicken anyway. . .so we wasted all that dough. it was sad, because it smelled good. i told him to keep it in longer, but he was like "but it's already been 10 minutes and the book says!" well, it obviously wasn't cooked (the dough in the middle was literally raw), but he just couldn't handle keeping it in there. he was terrified it would burn. LOL


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
MIL's comments to me--"Is the doctor okay with it?" a.

This one actually drives me nuts. There are so many occasions where people ask me this and I know that the path of least resistance would be to say "yes". But it makes me crazy, this culture of expertism. Like the doctor knows better than i do. Despite all my intentions, I find myself saying "Because I'm the mom, that's why." And not to Fenton.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
This one actually drives me nuts. There are so many occasions where people ask me this and I know that the path of least resistance would be to say "yes". But it makes me crazy, this culture of expertism. Like the doctor knows better than i do. Despite all my intentions, I find myself saying "Because I'm the mom, that's why." And not to Fenton.









It bothers me too. Like I haven't read anything about babies at all. And the doctor's opinion is _everything_. I don't get what people are thinking because we all know different doctors will say different things. But everyone just trusts their own doctor like he/she's a god. I'd rather listen to what they have to say and then research it myself also.


----------



## Maela

*ZB*, I was just wondering because I was thinking about how much they are going to freak out. I know my ILs would. My parents would be sad too, but they would be fine with letting us decide and not trying to persuade us to stay. It annoys me when I hear my ILs make not-so-subtle comments to SIL about how SILs life would be easier if she just lived closer to them. "Well, if you lived here near us, you wouldn't have to worry about that cause we'd take care of it."









Dd used the word "actually" today.







Dh said, "Are you silly?" And Dd said, "Actually Maev."


----------



## farmama

mmm, congrats on the house!
zoe, hope the job/business scouting goes well.
everyone is so busy!

okay, i didn't think i'd say this, but here goes...

i really miss being pregnant. we're in this tight place where it would be really hard for us to have a second kiddo (i'd basically have to give up working, which isn't really in our business plan), and honestly, i can't keep up with the house work and my job work as it is. yet, i can't stop thinking about being pregnant. somehow, i just skip over the details of having a second baby, and how that would affect our lives and business. is this a hormonal thing, or what? anyone have any insight on this????









oh, and still no AF. getting a blood test on Monday, but i don't expect a +.


----------



## Maela

Farmama, I got that when Dd hit 15 months. I just all of a sudden wanted to get pg. Weird. I also wanted the baby... Now that I'm pg, I'm very excited, but I do have my moments of thinking "uh oh, what did we do?"









Anyway, I hope things work out for you and you have an answer soon to your missing AF.


----------



## PiePie

I too am starting to be able to imagine another child. Not being pregnant, that part I just skip over in my head because it was too miserable to contemplate -- if it did that, i would never have a second, which i clearly want.

had visit from out of town friends today: mom and 3 yo dd. she confided that she feels pregnant (too early to poas) but that she has had 4 m/c's in the past 12 months!!!! super







for her and super sobering re planning a 2nd. was surprised that my ap friend struck me as very un-gd. now that she is gone and i have had time to reflect, i think that the main issue is that she has very age-inappropriate expectations for my dd (19 mos.) to "share." interesting for someone with a degree in social work with a focus on special needs preschoolers!! well, i guess preschoolers are a different ballgame. she is also very big on "setting limits" and "consistency." so it did give me pause. and the m/c stuff sucked. she claimed she wasn't sad after the first one.


----------



## Holiztic

Quinn has been day-weaned (yeah, I said day-weaned) for 8 days, and I already have some very faint spotting


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
had visit from out of town friends today: mom and 3 yo dd. she confided that she feels pregnant (too early to poas) but that she has had 4 m/c's in the past 12 months!!!! super







for her and super sobering re planning a 2nd.

How sad.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Quinn has been day-weaned (yeah, I said day-weaned) for 8 days, and I already have some very faint spotting









Wow. Congratulations!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I too am starting to be able to imagine another child. Not being pregnant, that part I just skip over in my head because it was too miserable to contemplate -- if it did that, i would never have a second, which i clearly want.


I know NOTHING about the topic, but I thought I'd throw the idea out there for you to contemplate a bit more. Have you thought of adopting your 2nd? A very close friend of mine has a little sister that was adopted from Korea after his parents had 2 bio children.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Happy Easter!!!

I hope to come back on later to respond to some of the things said here, but I had a sec and had to share themost hilarious thing, which DH won't let me share with anyone IRL.

So Fenton is obsessed with ladybugs. Or, as his entomologist Grandpa insists he calls them, "lady beetles". He thinks everything is a lady beetle: the box elder beetles on the south side of the house, which he harasses. And thepolka dots on my underwear. Brandon got me a pair of underwear that have large, multi-colored polka dots on them with some contasting dots, and the red dots apparently resembles a lady bug to him. Every time he saw me change and I was wearing them, he'd shout "Lady beetle!" and have to come over and pet my hip. It was really funny, and we joked about how he'd be in therapy over it. Well, yesterday I took off the said underwear and Fenton decided his life wouldn't be complete unless he could wear these underwear around his neck like a necklace. He fished them out of the dirty clothes to do so, and it took me a good 20 minutes to distract him so I could get them down to the laundry room. There was something about the fact that they were dirty that just didnt' sit right with me. I thought it was a quirk of opportunity, but he has twice today gone down to the laundry room specifically to get these underwear to wear around his neck. He insisted on wearing them through lunch today, and i worry what's going to happen when we have guests over for Easter dinner tonight







. It's freaking hilarious, and I want desperately to take a picture, except it would mortify him when he's older. I think I'll just keep the pair clean and let him use them as he wants, but it will probably test my limits if he wants to wear them out in public  Poor kid. We think we're raising a great southern playwright









And since the underwear are keeping him occupied







, I thought I'd ask for you to help me think something through. We have 1 Queen mattress that we don't use right now, and 2 twin extra longs that we put together to make 1 King. We're starting to think about getting Fenton used to alternate sleeping arrangments for when the baby comes, and I can't decide if we should assume that we'l all be in the same room and start to get him used to sleeping on his own Twin next to our Queen, or if I should assume my fears of them waking each other up will be realized and that we'll need to have the kids in different rooms, Fenton on the Queen with his Dad in his room and me on the 2 Twins with Ku (this baby's operating name right now







) in our room. It's a question of preparing for the best or worst - any thoughts? I'm sure he's more flexible than this, but I honestly don't know which way I lean...He's sort of a light sleeper, but I hate to have us all in separate rooms if we don't have to be. I do seem to remember night nursing a newborn to be a fairly big production until they're big enough to nurse lying down though.....Hmmmmm......

MMM congrats on the gorgeous, nearby house!!!!
 






:







:







:

I just helped a close friend through her second miscarriage (in as many months) this weekend. It reminded me of how devestating and despairing it feels to go through that









Pie Pie, I've seen similar inappropriate expectations for sharing, but usually I see it from the childs own parents. I get the sense that they feel self-conscious about the other parents thinking they are a bad parent. It usually puts me in a bad spot, because I'm not really big on making kids share - they usually work it out themselves, and I try to make sure no one gets really hurt. I'm not sure its the best approach taht I have, especially when my child is a bulldozer. But it feels so wrong to police everything they do when they don't even understand the concept of fairness. What do you guys think?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
I know NOTHING about the topic, but I thought I'd throw the idea out there for you to contemplate a bit more. Have you thought of adopting your 2nd? A very close friend of mine has a little sister that was adopted from Korea after his parents had 2 bio children.


Have thought about it (it is DH's preference) but no, I want to give birth and BF (exclusively).


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Pie Pie, I've seen similar inappropriate expectations for sharing, but usually I see it from the childs own parents. I get the sense that they feel self-conscious about the other parents thinking they are a bad parent. It usually puts me in a bad spot, because I'm not really big on making kids share - they usually work it out themselves, and I try to make sure no one gets really hurt. I'm not sure its the best approach taht I have, especially when my child is a bulldozer. But it feels so wrong to police everything they do when they don't even understand the concept of fairness. What do you guys think?

I am so totally with you -- our kids should have a playdate! More on this anon.


----------



## cking

Shanna, that is hilarious about the underwear.









That reminds me, Josephine has been totally into clothes lately. She likes to pull hers out of her drawers, baskets, etc. and hold onto them and carry them around. She also seems to be fond of carrying my underwear around.









She's totally into birds lately. She makes the sign every time she sees or hears them. Even bird sounds on the radio or singing that sounds bird-like prompts the same response.







I think she's really ready to soak up some more signs - I just need to learn more!

Farmama, I hear ya. I think about it off and on. I definitely miss being pregnant. Not every aspect of it, but most. When af was late last month, I found myself secretly hoping I was....but at the same time kind of freaking out at the prospect, since I'm sure we're not ready yet.

Piepie, maybe your next pregnancy will be easier. (














I've heard of women having totally different experiences with their pregnancies.









We're off on a 5-hour flight tomorrow with a babe full of energy. Wish us luck. For once I'm actually thankful she's not walking yet. But I'm sure she'll want to cruise around the plane anyway.

pssst...we're going to CA. And we're going to meet Maela!!!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 

pssst...we're going to CA. And we're going to meet Maela!!!









Jealous! although not of the flight. anyone with travel toys for toddlers should post already.


----------



## Maela

*shanna*, that is SO funny about the underwear!!









*Cking*, we can't wait to meet you! Traveling with a one year old was hard. I don't even remember what we did to keep her busy. I think we got a snack on the plane and tried to keep her busy with the food, nursing, and taking her to the potty. She also loved it when we would hold her up so she could stare at/talk to the people in the other rows.









Dare I say it? At 15 weeks, I think my morning sickness is just about gone!!!! I still get a little sick when I am hungry, but most of my food aversions are gone and that awful, energy-draining, almost depressed feeling is gone!!! I actually want to get up and move around and get things done! And I feel way less bloated.







Yeah, I'm happy.









Easter was a lot of fun for us. Yesterday we dyed eggs, and Dd enjoyed eating one. This morning, we hid some eggs for Dd in the backyard and then went over to my gparents' house in the bay area where they did another egg hunt and we had a very yummy dinner (that I could fully enjoy cause no ms!). Dd had lots of fun and way too much chocolate.







She's not getting any more sweets for a while now.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

At age 1 we mostly did books. These peek-a-boo flap ones, and also the touch and feel books. They are very intereactive for him. I bought a whole bunch used, cheap from ebay/amazon marketplace. I made sure to save a few "new" ones for the ride home.
We also had one small shape sorter toy. Some of the time he just played with my bracelet, took the lid on and off an empty bottle that sort of thing.
Also for takeoff and landing when I made him stay in his carseat and he didn't want to I let him have foods that he normally wouldn't have, like gummi life savers and chocolate. I also put chocolate milk in a sports-bottle type sippie cup since he didn't like bottles and I wanted to really encourage him to do some sucking during take-off and landing. But sometimes I still ended up leaning over and trying to stretch my boob to him, he was rear-facing. I know some of you are more strict with food then we are so that might not work for you, but for us it seemed ok as a very rare thing.

And like Maela mentioned, trips to the potty. He loved going up and down the aisles and having people say hi.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am so totally with you -- our kids should have a playdate! More on this anon.

My DH and I basically agree with this article- Fair is Fair- Sharing is Hard
We've never made him share but will neutrally point out that someone else would like a turn. As long as he doesn't feel too pressured then he usually gives them the toy right away (I talking about communal toys at playgroup or something, not *his* precious monkey or something although sometimes he'll share those too. If they try and take it from him though he runs away with it and screams. Which I guess is providing natural consequences to the other child.








If it is a piece of equipment or something and there is a line then I am a bit more assertive about him moving along once he's done with the active part- ie must leave slide after getting to the bottom, must get off rocking horse when no longer rocking.
We do take his scooter to gym time play group and we discuss ahead of time that if we take it then other kids will use it when he's not. But he doesn't care at all about it since there are other things there he's rather be on. So he gets to practice seeing other kids use his stuff, but it's not like forcing him to share a current favorite.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
i really miss being pregnant. we're in this tight place where it would be really hard for us to have a second kiddo (i'd basically have to give up working, which isn't really in our business plan), and honestly, i can't keep up with the house work and my job work as it is. yet, i can't stop thinking about being pregnant. somehow, i just skip over the details of having a second baby, and how that would affect our lives and business. is this a hormonal thing, or what? anyone have any insight on this????









No real insight to share, just commiseration. I've missed being pg since DS was born. I thought the feeling would lessen as he got older, but instead it keeps increasing all the time. We still have a year left before we'll be in a place where we can TTC, and I tell DH every couple of days that I don't know how I'm going to wait that long.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
And since the underwear are keeping him occupied







, I thought I'd ask for you to help me think something through. We have 1 Queen mattress that we don't use right now, and 2 twin extra longs that we put together to make 1 King. We're starting to think about getting Fenton used to alternate sleeping arrangments for when the baby comes, and I can't decide if we should assume that we'l all be in the same room and start to get him used to sleeping on his own Twin next to our Queen, or if I should assume my fears of them waking each other up will be realized and that we'll need to have the kids in different rooms, Fenton on the Queen with his Dad in his room and me on the 2 Twins with Ku (this baby's operating name right now







) in our room. It's a question of preparing for the best or worst - any thoughts? I'm sure he's more flexible than this, but I honestly don't know which way I lean...He's sort of a light sleeper, but I hate to have us all in separate rooms if we don't have to be. I do seem to remember night nursing a newborn to be a fairly big production until they're big enough to nurse lying down though.....Hmmmmm.....

At the last LLL meeting I attended, one of the moms with a newborn was asked if her newborn ds wakes her toddler dd and said that she was really concerned about it, but that it was really only an issue the first couple of nights. As I remember, those were fairly sleepless anyway, with just one babe in the bed. Not sure how deep of a sleeper that particular toddler is, but thought I would share anyway.

*Sharing* - I like the article that Rico'sAlice shared. That's how I feel, but I've yet to behave precisely that way in a playgroup situation. I'm struggling a lot attending groups with more than 2-3 other kids right now for other reasons and the thought of alienating myself even more by being "that mom" makes me just want to stay at home, which isn't really a good choice if I want to retain my sanity.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Finally got some time to post, and now I"m feeling uke so I need to go lie down







. Hope to get a chance again soon, sorry to leave so many posts hanging.


----------



## cking

OMG, dd just heard a fire truck while nursing...stopped, looked up at me and signed Bird.







:


----------



## cking

We made it! Flight wasn't too bad. She did great, despite being woken at 3:30 am. Dh did some laps with her up and down the aisles. We got lots of comments on how 'good' and 'well behaved' she was.









Thanks for the toy recs, Alice. The biggest hit was probably a little photo album - she looooves pictures - of herself, her cousins, whomever. She talks to them.









eating on the plane was a mess. Oh yeah, we didn't get her a seat. God bless the woman sitting next to me - she was a dear. That's the last time we'll be able to fly w/o paying for a kid, for sure.









Now we just have to try to get our sleep patterns in some kind of order....


----------



## Maela

Yay! glad you made it. Welcome to CA!









That's so cute about the fire engine!!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
OMG, dd just heard a fire truck while nursing...stopped, looked up at me and signed Bird.







:

i love it!


----------



## PiePie

*Maela*, Where are you and DH on names? how about Nuala?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*Maela*, Where are you and DH on names? how about Nuala?

Speaking of that, how popular is Nadia these days? I love it, but DH is afraid it's the new Jennifer....


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Speaking of that, how popular is Nadia these days? I love it, but DH is afraid it's the new Jennifer....

I looked it up here and it's at 200 and rising. It's no Jennifer, but it's might be in ten years' time - you never know.

*Maela* & *Shantana* - have you seen/used Nymbler to get name ideas? You type in names you like and it spits out similar names. I like it because you can put in girls' names you like and ask it to give only boys' names (or vice versa). I've gotten a few good ideas from there as we've been discussing the next baby's name a lot recently.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*Maela* & *Shantana* - have you seen/used Nymbler to get name ideas?

Ooooh, never heard of it - thanks!!! (We were at Rayner park recently and I was reminded that Calvin's half birthday is coming up!







)

I turned 32 today (!) and it's been one of the worst birthdays ever







. About 3:30 this morning, Fenton started getting really restless and felt really warm. He's come down with something, I'm guessing the old-fashioned flu. He has a fever, is droopy, weepy...but no other symptoms (including for Meningitis, which was my first worry) that we can see, but I'm guessing he's achey. Contemplating giving him some Tylenol if he has trouble sleeping tonight. We had to cancel our prenatal appointment and our date to go out for dinner - which we can't reschedule for 2 weeks because DH is "all booked up" with classes and work









Poor little guy. I just hurt for him. His cheeks are all red, eyes are all droopy, and ambient light in the house is "too bright".


----------



## cking

Oh no! Sorry Fenton is so sick. I logged on to wish you a Happy B-day Shanna (














, but I'm sorry it is such a bad day. Feel better Fenton.









Met up with Maela and her family today.







:


----------



## PiePie

I personally do not see Nadia as the next Jennifer. haven't met one here, but I do concede that a. these things are very regionally specific (then again, aren't you moving for dh's sch?) and b. 10 years out is a long time in girls' names, which tend to be more volatile than boys'. here is another interesting name trends prediction: http://www.babynamesgarden.com/freakonomicswatch.aspx


----------



## Holiztic

I SO did not need to see the name Quinn listed under the girl's side, grrrr...... If any of your friends mention wanting to name their unborn daughter Quinn, tell them you hate it! Thanks!


----------



## witchygrrl

Happy belated birthday Shanna--I hope Fenton's feeling better soon!

cking--that's really cute









I survived the ILs, somewhat. MIL begrudgingly admitted that Rhea looks good for being breastfed







But everyone's SOOOO concerned about her diet, though it's amazing how much she's grown.

I swear, my head wants to explode.


----------



## accountclosed3

ryan has one interview in NZ so far; he's waiting to hear back about a second. one of the interviews is with a recruiting firm, and so they're also going to try and set up more interviews while he is there. i'm psyched for him!

also, we just got hawks passport photos. so adorable. the paperwork is filled out and we have our appt with the agency to get the forms signed and filed. so, we should definitely have his passport book in time.

and finally, we've started the 'expression of interest.' we both are well qualified (over qualified--if i'm calculating right, but i can't tell!), and i think everything will go smoothly on the immigration side. i have a few questions, but i learned that once we submit the EOI we'll get an immigration officer with whom we will work (just like when i worked there two years ago), and then s/he will answer any specific questions that we have.

i also sent confidnetiality agreements to both businesses in which i am interested, so hopefully they'll send the books soon so that i can get a good look; taxes came back FAB insofar as refunds go, and there's a nice pile of "found money" that just showed up too. looks like we can afford the trips, immigration, and buying the business before we even sell the house, which is perfect.

so, we're thinking about potentially keeping the house here as a rental for a bit, so long as the rent covers the HOA, mortgage, and taxes, and perhaps sell it when the market picks up, even though we haven't lost any value. there are a number of homes for sale in our neighborhood right now, so who knows? if we sell, we'll have more to invest and live on down there, though, and i'm sure the house well sell quickly in the summer.

we started packing this past weekend. i'm starting with the "guest room." most of our books are there, and so i packed the books and one of my friend's son's is getting is first apt, so he could use the shelves. he removes them this weekend. then, we're going to pack the ones downstairs (book cases). i need to redo the guest room (remove wall paper from two walls and paint them) and then rearrange the furniture in there once the book cases are out. i need to pack that closet too and get it to empty. then, one room done and ready for sale or rent or whatever happens.

i hope to have a number of the rooms done before we go to NZ on our scouting trip, and then when we come back, we'll basically just need to deep clean the place, perhaps do some repainting and general repairs, and put it on the market.

i'm giving my sister a lot of the furniture, though whatever she doesn't want, i'll probably give to my friend's kids or sell on craig's list or something.

i'm keeping my bed though. that's a nice mattress. and all of my books.


----------



## PiePie

*Liz*, Alas, there is a female Quinn in DD's class. DD called her Kin.







I personally see it as a male name -- perhaps because one good friend has a Quentin and another wants to name a son Quinton and call him Quin (or Quinn -- this was an oral conversation, so spelling didn't come up). I was worried for a while when folks started naming girls Aidan -- which, hello, had been my boys name since like age 10 (it's my grandfather's name and the name of the parish back in Ireland) but it didn't take as a girls' name. And I can tell you this because DH is not on board with Aidan for any gender.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
If any of your friends mention wanting to name their unborn daughter Quinn, tell them you hate it! Thanks!



















Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
And I can tell you this because DH is not on board with Aidan for any gender.

I've loved that name for a long time too (though not as long as you - I believe it was The Legends of the Fall that did it for me). I was surprised when it caught on because I thought "Why now?". So classic.

So is it true that Ayn Rand's "Atlas Shrugged" is on the best seller list? _Very_ interesting....any comments on this?

And has anyone read The Shack? I'm in the middle of it and, frankly, I'm puzzled as to why it has brought the fundies and Unies into one giant love fest. Taking a lot longer to read now that Fenton is weaned...

Man ZB, you don't mess around....

And Cking, I wonder if you're the one of us who has met the most of us.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Poor little guy. I just hurt for him. His cheeks are all red, eyes are all droopy, and ambient light in the house is "too bright".

I was just stalking you all but thought I'd say that the red cheeks could indicate Fifth's disease...which is similar to Chicken Pox in that it's good to get it when you're little. If you get it when you're little it's just like the flu with a little face rash (first it looks like slapped cheeks, then it get's spider webby looking). So, it'll give you something positive to think about. Hope he's better soon!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm putting myself out there by linking to this, and if no one here ever feels this way, then, um, neither do I







. But I had to share.

And now I'm going to attempt to retreat from nausea and into sleep.


----------



## Maela

oh man I have so much to say, and now I don't remember everything...

*Cking*, we had fun! Thanks for the pictures; they're really cute. You have such a pretty baby. Maev keeps talking today about Josephine and Christmas (you







).

*Steph*, I've checked out Nymbler; it's really cool.

*ZB*, that's cool that things are moving along so fast for you guys!

*Shanna*, Happy (belated) birthday! I'm sorry your day wasn't so great.







I haven't checked out the link yet, but I will.








I like the name Nadia; I don't see it as a future Jennifer either.
I hope Fenton is feeling better...

*Witchy* sorry about your family's comments. That can get so frustrating...

Maeve is on that future popular name list!







: I hope they're wrong. At least it's not spelled the same.

*PiePie*, I like how Nuala looks written down (it looks very pretty to me), but I don't think I like the pronunciation all that much.

right now we're pretty sure it's going to be Vianne, Vienne, or Vienna. Just not sure which one. We haven't really been talking much about it lately. I think I needed to let those names just sit and marinate in my mind for a bit.

but I still love hearing suggestions!


----------



## accountclosed3

i think it's one of those things where, once the decision is made, you know what to do. i feel like we've been "messing around" for years. LOL so does ryan. and particularly since we left NZ--ryan's wanted to go back, but we never were so "active" about it. it was always passive. but, now we see the way.

i don't see Quinn as being an inherently feminine name. It's a boy's name to me, as is the name Leslie, though a lot of girls have that name too. you know, it goes abit gender neutral. it's particularly what i like about Hawk. it could easily go either way.

no vivianne? i love that name. i like the others too, of course. they just look like vivianne to me!


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, i like vivian. or bebhinn -- pronounced bevin. maybe bianca? i love brainstorming baby names


----------



## TinyFrog

Darn you ladies for getting me looking at baby names again!


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I SO did not need to see the name Quinn listed under the girl's side, grrrr...... If any of your friends mention wanting to name their unborn daughter Quinn, tell them you hate it! Thanks!









I like Quentin as a boy's name, but I have always liked Quinn for a girl. I don't see it as inherently feminine, and I won't ever use it, but I like it








:

*PiePie* - Thanks for linking that article with the chart. I think their predictions are dead on and that eliminates a few of the boys' names we've been tossing around.

*Shanna* - I







Lamott and that is a fantastic article. Thanks for putting yourself out there and sharing it


----------



## accountclosed3

ok, ryan now has two interviews and the possibility for 3. we're hoping that we leave NZ with a job offer. that would be cool!

also, i'm working with the second business and have let the first one go completely because the owner is whack-a-doodle. i'm so glad to be free of her. of course, once we move there, i'll be her competition and i think she's going to freak a bit because, when i was here and she was there, she still accused me of "poaching" her students, even though, you know, i live in PA and she was in NZ still as were all of her clients.

ah well. LOL


----------



## Rico'sAlice

*Shanna*- Yes. I definitely get that feeling! I'm glad you shared that article. I have been thinking it over a bit and think it is good to bring it up.

However, I would say that for me the "line not to be crossed" might be a little bit closer than hers. I mean I do 'get' losing your temper and all of that. But some of the things she quoted herself as saying to her kids would _feel_ verbally abusive coming out of _my_ mouth. For me, getting to the point of saying some of those things out loud to the child means you need to be taking more preventative action (which may mean getting more breaks, rescue remedy spray, going in the bathroom to say swear words, whatever works for you) Or the occasionally physical roughness the mentions. Yes it is normal for it to happen even with "good" mothers. But that doesn't mean that it is then OK.

The other thing is that I think that talking about rage with other mothers _can_ be therapeutic, BUT I think that it can also fall into a sort of venting session about how "bad" your kids are and can actually feed into feelings of "ill will" towards your children. I'd rather spend the time talking about how to prevent/better handle these bad situations and/or find ways to help each other out than spend time focusing on my angrer. Not that the mother's feelings aren't real or important. They absolutely are! And some people do need to say it aloud and also hear that it is normal. But I think that focusing on it can help it grow bigger.
I feel the same way about talking about problems with spouses, though. Sure if I have a friend/group that might have a good technique for dealing with an issue we're having and I'm in a space to be open and listen and actually follow the advice, then sure I'll talk about it. But if my real goal is just to gripe about how awful DH is b/c he forgot our anniversary, then I don't believe that is actually helpful or will go to strengthen our relationship in the long run.
I know this wasn't the point of the article, but it's just something I've seen happen and so while seeing the importance of recognizing the "anger is normal" (in the sense of being common) aspect I am always very cautious about the possibility of the anger becoming almost fetishized. NOT that I would really see that happening with the particular group in this thread, of course.








Do you see what I am trying to say, or am I being totally off base?


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Re *Quentin*- For a few days after J was born I kept dreaming/hallucinating that _his_ name was Quentin. And then I'd realize I was remembering the name Fenton and mixing it with Quinn. I don't know anyone IRL with any of those three names.And none of the names we considered were anything like that. (Our other two boys names were Sebastian and Rafael) So, I'm assuming it was related to this thread...


----------



## PiePie

*Alice*, I get what you are trying to say, but I do think that it may be personality-specific. A lot of women have very strong guilt mechanisms and for them (I should say us) letting it out can break through the shame. otherwise you can spend (I mean waste) loads of energy wallowing in the guilt. IIRC, guilt isn't a big emotion for you (forgive me if that is overstepping). For some of us it's bigger. In my case I think it was how I was brought up.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
(Our other two boys names were Sebastian and Rafael)

both were on my long list but dh nuked.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
*Shanna*- Yes. I definitely get that feeling! I'm glad you shared that article. I have been thinking it over a bit and think it is good to bring it up.

However, I would say that for me the "line not to be crossed" might be a little bit closer than hers. I mean I do 'get' losing your temper and all of that. But some of the things she quoted herself as saying to her kids would _feel_ verbally abusive coming out of _my_ mouth. For me, getting to the point of saying some of those things out loud to the child means you need to be taking more preventative action (which may mean getting more breaks, rescue remedy spray, going in the bathroom to say swear words, whatever works for you) Or the occasionally physical roughness the mentions. Yes it is normal for it to happen even with "good" mothers. But that doesn't mean that it is then OK.

This was pretty much how I felt. Thanks for sharing Shanna.
PiePie I can see how that could be a personality thing with the guilt. For me, I'm probably somewhere in the middle. I do have a lot of guilt sometimes, but I do better when I don't focus on the anger so much.


----------



## Maela

This morning I learned that just because I don't feel sick anymore it does not mean that I can have a glass of pomegranate juice with water and my prenatal vitamin and then try to go take a shower before Maev wakes up without eating a real breakfast. I had to take an unexpected and sudden detour to the toilet to throw up the juice and vitamin.










Other than that incident, I'm feeling great!!







: I got so much done today. And Dd and I have not watched TV in two days!







: It was pretty bad during those weeks with morning sickness.







I think we're back on track now.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Haven't slept more than an hour since we moved (last Wed). Sebby is beside himself with 4 monthdom - he's rolling and teething and generally terrorising me. He hasn't napped all week. I do not know how people cope with bad sleepers and am willing with my all that this is just a brief phase.

Tell me again why we can't feed him whiskey?


----------



## accountclosed2

MMM, I hear you about having a bad sleeper! In our case it did get better, it was actually worst around 3 1/2- 4 1/2 months, and it certainly is much much better now (although she still isn't a great sleeper, especially not in the daytime, it is still not easy to get her to sleep, and she is easily disturbed).

One thing that made it easier was when we found the one sling/carrier she liked, the Ergo. Other things, I guess, has just changed with time, as she got older, like the way she now falls asleep in my arms after a feed sometimes (which she didn't at all, ever, between 5 weeks and 10 months).

She sleeps A LOT more now at 14 months than she did at 4 months!


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, you are coordinated with national tv turnoff week!!







:







:

*mujer*, as i believe you once suggested to *shanna*, get dp or a friend or even a paid sitter to watch sebby for 4 consecutive hours so you can nap. it will bring things back into perspective.


----------



## Maela

I may be jinxing myself by saying this, but I think Dd _might_ be nightweaning herself. during the last two nights when she has woken up (well, really just fussed; don't know if she's actually awake), I have been able to just snuggle with her and she'll go back to sleep. I have been trying this for awhile now, but she usually starts saying, "Nurse, nurse" and I just nurse her. It usually doesn't work to just cuddle. But last night and the night before she's only needed to actually nurse once each night!

Probably has something to do with my almost non-existent supply.







She is nursing a lot less during the day too. but I'm happy about the nights!!







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Sorry I've been MIA - flu hit me too, and is still hitting. It's miserable









But i had to come to share: I got a Suse Kindercoat for my birthday!







:

Hope to be back soon, especially with hugs for MMM....


----------



## ~Shanna~

A few minutes to myself while I eat in private. DH brought me some food from a restaurant because I've had such a hard time with no appetite while sick. I won't gross you out by telling you where it's from....







:
We heard the baby's heartbeat today! I felt movement a couple of days ago, so gave the go-ahead for the doppler. I cried, I was so relieved. A friend just suffered a loss a couple of weeks ago, and it reminded me of how vulnerable I felt.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
However, I would say that for me the "line not to be crossed" might be a little bit closer than hers. I mean I do 'get' losing your temper and all of that. But some of the things she quoted herself as saying to her kids would _feel_ verbally abusive coming out of _my_ mouth.

It's funny, I felt the same way, but not because i'm "better" when I lose it. I tend to be more emotional rather than clever or sarcastic when I lose it, so my losing it never involves _what_ I say, but rather _how_ I say it. I'm more likely to shriek "Stop kicking me!" (and I really mean shriek














. I agree that one has to find a way to get ahold of it before one blows, but I'm honestly shocked by how sudden it feels







. It's like for the first 7 minutes of a temper tantrum i can be intellectual, I can be patient, I can say "I see that you're upset", I can evade his kicks. And on minute 8 I turn into a banshee. I've had some interesting schooling on this while I've been sick and too weak to be as active in these fights with him. If it sounds like this is happening a lot...it's because it is. Every diaper change. That's pretty much it. I've tried everything, including doing the change standing up (try that with a poopy dipe) and he just plain doesn't want to take time out to get a dipe change. Which I understand, but it doesn't change the necessity of it. I'd love suggestions for new tactics, if anyone has them. I've tried giving him choices (where, now or in 5 minutes, me or daddy, etc), tried the sneak attack, tried to have teh discussion about the alternative to dipe changes

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
This morning I learned that just because I don't feel sick anymore it does not mean that I can have a glass of pomegranate juice with water and my prenatal vitamin and then try to go take a shower before Maev wakes up without eating a real breakfast. I had to take an unexpected and sudden detour to the toilet to throw up the juice and vitamin.









I'm so glad you're feeling better. I'm also keeping my fingers crossed for you for nightweaning - what a blessing to have it go so smoothly if in fact that's what she's doing! I'm a little panicked at how fast this pg seems to be going.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Haven't slept more than an hour since we moved (last Wed). Sebby is beside himself with 4 monthdom - he's rolling and teething and generally terrorising me. He hasn't napped all week. I do not know how people cope with bad sleepers and am willing with my all that this is just a brief phase.

Tell me again why we can't feed him whiskey?

Oh MMM







. I'm so, so sorry. I never dealt with anything like that (an hour, really???







). But to answer your whiskey question, I'm a big proponent that whiskey is a safer numbing agent during teething that most OTC stuff, but you hardly need any at all to numb them. To get them to fall asleep, you walking really close to the line where it would be unsafe for them (the same as if you you drank enough to pass out). Sorry if you were only joking, but I considered it myself so thought I'd share what I had









So, funny story. Ever since Fenton was a mobile babe, if ever I "rescued" him from a fall, bonk or whatever, I would cheerfully say "Oh, I saved your life!". It helped me get my gasp reflex under control, for which I am notorious. Well, he started to take a nose dive off the ottoman last night, caught himself and said "Oh, I saved my life!"







. Oh, and he's really big on counting the "milks" lately. Apparently I have 5 breasts.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Oh, and I am so tired of peeing when I sneeze.

Carry on.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
We heard the baby's heartbeat today! I felt movement a couple of days ago, so gave the go-ahead for the doppler. I cried, I was so relieved. A friend just suffered a loss a couple of weeks ago, and it reminded me of how vulnerable I felt.

Yay!







: How exciting! I'm sorry for your friend.

I still have yet to feel any "for sure" movement at 16.5 weeks.







I first felt Dd at exactly 16 weeks and it was so obvious that that was the baby. I think that I've felt something every now and then, but I'm not sure. I will feel a lot better when I get a chance to hear the heartbeat next Tuesday at my mw appt. Meanwhile I'm trying to stay calm.







Maybe this is going to be a mellow baby?







:









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm so glad you're feeling better. I'm also keeping my fingers crossed for you for nightweaning - what a blessing to have it go so smoothly if in fact that's what she's doing! I'm a little panicked at how fast this pg seems to be going.

I think that I did jinx myself.







Last night the cuddling didn't work. We'll see how tonight goes.
I'm sorry about your rough diaper changes. We went through a rough time with diaper changes (especially poop) when Dd was about 12-16 months. Every time it was a battle. And almost every time I would lose my temper and end up yelling.








That's so cute what Fenton said about saving his life!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Oh, and I am so tired of peeing when I sneeze.

Carry on.

Boy do I hear ya!! Happens when I cough too. If I'm walking I have to stop and cross my legs before I sneeze. I must look ridiculous.







It's much harder to remember to do some kegels every day when you have a toddler to take care of.

*MMM*, I'm sorry things are rough right now. I hope you've gotten some good sleep by now.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
If it sounds like this is happening a lot...it's because it is. Every diaper change. That's pretty much it. I've tried everything, including doing the change standing up (try that with a poopy dipe) and he just plain doesn't want to take time out to get a dipe change. Which I understand, but it doesn't change the necessity of it. I'd love suggestions for new tactics, if anyone has them. I've tried giving him choices (where, now or in 5 minutes, me or daddy, etc), tried the sneak attack, tried to have teh discussion about the alternative to dipe changes









I'm right there with you. No suggestions, but hoping others have some to share. Prefolds with a prefold belt were working most of the time until he started with teething-related diarrhea Sunday that still hasn't gone away. We're using sposies til it does







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I still have yet to feel any "for sure" movement at 16.5 weeks.







I first felt Dd at exactly 16 weeks and it was so obvious that that was the baby. I think that I've felt something every now and then, but I'm not sure. I will feel a lot better when I get a chance to hear the heartbeat next Tuesday at my mw appt. Meanwhile I'm trying to stay calm.







Maybe this is going to be a mellow baby?







:









Could you have an anterior placenta? I've heard they can really affect how soon and often movement is felt.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna*...thanks for the comments re whiskey - I was joking re using it to knock him out but I'd be lying if I didn't say that the thought of overdosing him on rescue remedy wasn't attractive merely because eventually the brandy base would put him to sleep, if not the bach flowers.

Though it's currently 1.15am and we're up again, we are slightly more rested. I've actually just slept 3 hours in a row and he has slept almost 5. We also napped a bit better today. Hard to get a nap without him 'cos he's all about Mama right now and screams bloody murder for anyone else.

Poor kid.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Oh, and I am so tired of peeing when I sneeze.

Carry on.

Of the _many_ things I don't miss about pregnancy, this is at the top of my list!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Re baby names...love the convo that was going on earlier in the week!

It's funny that some of us have such similar taste!

I've been feeling a bit nervous about Sebby's name recently. I absolutely love the name and Sebby really suits him but I'm not so sure about Sebastian. Has anyone else had similar worries?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I've been feeling a bit nervous about Sebby's name recently. I absolutely love the name and Sebby really suits him but I'm not so sure about Sebastian. Has anyone else had similar worries?

You picked a great name that he can adapt to his personality: Sebby, Seb, Sebastian. And what's his middle name? That's one of the things we liked about Fenton, it could be formal or shortened to Fen if it turns out he's more of a...Fen.

Though, I'm always fascinated by the thread where the moms changed their kids names. Like, when the kid was 2.

Maela, my experience has been that docile fetus=maniac child. Others have corroborated that their serene child was acrobatic in utero. Hoping to feel some maniac contortions from the baby soon









Ugh....Just got my first "Hope you have a girl this time!







"









My sisters induction date is set, and I'm ready to videotape








Please send me all of your iron-stomach, non-fainting energy. I'm genuinely worried that I'm going to have a hard time watching all of the procedures and the business end. I'm so excited to be there, but I'll just be mortified if I faint


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Could you have an anterior placenta? I've heard they can really affect how soon and often movement is felt.

Yeah I guess that could be it. My mw picked up the heartbeat on the doppler pretty easily though last time; isn't it supposed to be difficult with an anterior placenta?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Maela, my experience has been that docile fetus=maniac child. Others have corroborated that their serene child was acrobatic in utero. Hoping to feel some maniac contortions from the baby soon









Oooh, I hope that's not true! Dd was *very* active in utero, and she's definitely not mellow (although she's also not the _most_ hyper kid I've met).


----------



## Maela

My sister and her boyfriend just took Dd for about four hours. It's her first time with someone other than me, Dh or her grandparents. She loves them, so i know she's fine, but it still makes me just a little sad. My sister's boyfriend has a nephew Dd's age, so they're taking her to play with him at the boyfriend's parents house.

What should I do for the next four hours?? dh is busy painting the outside of our house (







:looks great BTW!) with FIL. I'm thinking of going to the bookstore - I always enjoy reading for a couple of hours uninterrupted. Thought I might see a movie, but nothing playing appealed to me.


----------



## cking

I'm so behind....and I'm exhausted. I feel like I'm still catching up from our trip last week.

Maela, it was great to meet you! Maev is so sweet.







I hope you were able to do something fun today!

Shanna, hope you are feeling better.

MMM, I kind of have the opposite with J's name. We're still calling her Josephine, but now I'm not sure which if any of the possible nicknames will suit her.







DH calls her J, and I sometimes do as well, and she actually responds sometimes, so he wants to stick with that. We'll see.

Oh, and um, I still pee when I sneeze sometimes.







:


----------



## accountclosed3

ryan has 3 interviews; i just went over the books for the business and it looks pretty good. luckily, a client of mine is an accountant and he's going to do a trade with me--yoga for checking out the books for me. so cool.

we have theplane tickets, the passports, the housing set up, and i'm teaching (a surprise!). we're going to do a weekend retreat with some yoga teachers (free of charge for us! partly because i'm teaching), and i'm just psyched.

ryan's freaked out about the paperwork. he gets himself SO stressed out abuot filling out the expression of intent. last night, he had a meltdown because they ask for the date when you start and finish your university education. not just "august 1994" but "august 21, 1994." so, i told him to estimate it, as i'm sure that would be fine. and he goes "NO! i have to SIGN this!" and then starts stomping around and whining and crying and fussing about how hard and annoying it is.

so, i go and i look up their current calendar, and then go to 1994 and see what day might be close, and he goes 'ok, i'll put that in."

you know, august 21, 1994.

silly man. he freaks about every part: do i put my middle name or middle initial? it says i can do either? which is right?!

lets all freak about it!

the paperwork would take no time if he'd stop freaking. i already submitted mine for the business owner bit. didn't take me long, because i don't stress about it. name, address, phone, place of birth, etc. easy.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Oh, and um, I still pee when I sneeze sometimes.







:

Yeah, whoever referred to it as a pregnancy condion, I was "Huh?" It never went away for me.


----------



## Maela

Amelie. I just remembered that I really like that name. It sounds good with Rose, I am part French (a small part, but my maiden name is French), and Dh really likes it (as much as he likes Vienna).
It is rising in popularity though. But for some reason, as soon as it came to mind, I could totally picture myself with a baby girl named Amelie Rose. does it sound strong though? That's what I really liked about Maev; we named her after a character in a book that we like, and the character is a really strong woman.
Just thinking aloud...

BTW, how do you type accents over letters??


----------



## witchygrrl

*Maela*, Amelie is the title of a really wonderful French film that came out maybe 8-10 years ago, which may account for its rising popularity. It's a beautiful name, definitely. Are you having strong feelings that you have a girl baby inside there?

Rhea had such a big week last week. We were on vacation, and she really enjoyed herself. She also cut her first tooth finally on Thursday! I think she has another one in the works from the way she's been rubbing at her gums. She also told her first joke; she offers a toy and then takes it away again. The first time she did it, she started laughing when she took it away. Thing is, we never did this with her--she thought of it all on her own. Now we do it because she thinks it's funny if we do it to her







And finally, she climbed her first stair. We have a one floor apt, so it's not often that she gets to practice on stairs, but where we were staying did. SO that has all been really great to see her do


----------



## farmama

Maela,

I







Amelie

yay! Rhea!


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, no need to worry about dates, or about filling out everything exactly, if it doesn't seem to apply to you. Just explain why it doesn't or write a date close to when you think it was. Immigration couldn't care less! I have handed in 5 applications for student visas and permits, one for a working visa/permit for family reasons and one for permanent residency. My experience is that they are very human and personal, and not at all beaurocratic(sp?). They like things like letters from friends, landlords etc., bank statements, official documents, photos etc. Throw as much as possible at them. On the actual application I learnt that they really don't care about details, as long as it doesn't change your status as an applicant (i.e. a date would matter only if they had a cut-off date, say, you have to have entered university after 5 July 1969. I doubt they do, but anyway).

I







Amélie!!!! (I should!







) And the film is wonderful too!


----------



## accountclosed3

AC: that's what i kept telling him! i told him that they were very cool people. when i went two years ago, i had to get a work visa. i wasn't sure if i should get the work/travel or just the plain work, so i went with the work visa because it asked for more information. then, they called me and said "we think this work-travel visa would be better for you. " and i said "cool" and we had a nice chat.

he's just a worry-wort. gets it from his mother. he also noticed, btw, that when he's "just standing there" that he "tend to clench [his] butt." essentially, he's always a tight ass. it's true too. LOL anyway, he has started to try and consciosuly relax this area of his anatomy, to see if it has an effect on his mental state. as a yoga person, i say it does. LOL

---

i also like the name amalie. amalie rose is a very nice name. i met a little girl today named honey. i thought that was funny, a nick name, but the family said it was her name. Honey. her middle name was a long indian name, but her first was Honey.

is it a strong name? i think so. i mean, honey has so many healing properties, but it's also full of sweetness too. amazing stuff, honey. So, there you hvae it.

I like names like Rose, Lily, Willow, Rowan, etc. plant names are nice.









---

cutting teeth--i think hawk has one coming. there's a bit of a rougher patch on his gums and he's a bit fussier than normal (which is hardly fussy at all, people tell me). good to know that he's right around everyone else his age.









as for the poop issues--does he signal at all? can you observe for one? i think that ECing, at least temp, will work. you just have to look for the signal. there is one, i'm sure.

but then, it's hard for me to spot some of hawk's new signals. he's scratching at the diaper now when he needs to go. if i'm looking the other way, i miss it! used to be accompanied with a noise. now, just a scratch. and, he did remove his diaper the other day, crawl out of it a bit, and poop on the floor next to it. then, proud of himself, he crawled through it to let me know.

successful nonetheless.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
*Maela*, Amelie is the title of a really wonderful French film that came out maybe 8-10 years ago, which may account for its rising popularity. It's a beautiful name, definitely. Are you having strong feelings that you have a girl baby inside there?

The movie is one of the reasons that I like the name so much. It's one of my favorite movies; I love it.

I'm glad so many of you like the name. *ZB*, I also like plant names.


----------



## PiePie

re plant names: among my friends' we count a rose, a lily, a dahlia, and a willow.

i personally prefer amelia (was a proposed middle name from me but dh didn't love -- he is very difficult to please) to amelie but i think you should go with what moves you.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
It's like for the first 7 minutes of a temper tantrum i can be intellectual, I can be patient, I can say "I see that you're upset", I can evade his kicks. And on minute 8 I turn into a banshee.

I know exactly what you're talking about. When it's safe for me to walk away I will, but I don't say to him that I'm leaving him more that I have to go do something else for thirty seconds- "Mommy needs to get some water to cool off! Be right back." And he's mad that I'm leaving and still crying but I really do just go for thirty seconds get water and come back. And then leave again if I need to in another minute. It's not like I take off for twenty minutes.
[But the main thing _for me_ is not shaming him then ie "Mommy has to leave b/c she doesn't want to be around you when you're like this." Even though that might be true and if it were another adult (not self or DH) or another child then I would consider it a natural consequence. But _for me_ its seem like a punishment when I as his parent do it at this young of an age.]

But sometimes it's just not safe to walk away (like in public.) So sometimes what I try to do at minute 6 is to focus my thoughts on a sympathetic sad type of frustrated and let myself cry. Some of the books I read seemed to think it's important for the parents to stay in control of their emotions so the child feels secure, yadayada. But in trying to stay cool as long as possible I tend to overestimate my abilities and don't give myself enough time to execute a proper exit strategy. But by letting myself be frustrated but in a sad way before I am too crazy angry type frustrated I feel like I can share that with him. It's tricky though trying to be authentic in the moment, but also not wanting to use my tears to manipulate him at all. I obviously don't say stuff like "Oh, you're making mommy sad b/c you won't cooperate." It's more like "You don't want diaper, this is hard for mama too." Or I just hold him and sing and cry.

Quote:

If it sounds like this is happening a lot...it's because it is. Every diaper change. That's pretty much it. I've tried everything, including doing the change standing up (try that with a poopy dipe) and he just plain doesn't want to take time out to get a dipe change. Which I understand, but it doesn't change the necessity of it. I'd love suggestions for new tactics, if anyone has them. I've tried giving him choices (where, now or in 5 minutes, me or daddy, etc), tried the sneak attack, tried to have the discussion about the alternative to dipe changes.
Issues related to poop and/or clothing changes cause 90% of our difficult situations. We've tried most of the tactics you mention and they each work every so often. But mostly it's a painful process. The other day he pooped on the way to a restaurant and people must have thought I was beating him in the bathroom there!

For us much of the problem is that J gets very unhappy and physically aggressive (biting, hitting) when he has to poop. Also he won't fall asleep if he needs to poop, so often he's tired and ready to nap but won't go down without pooping first. He'll also tell me he has to poop and agree that we need to go use the potty and then start screaming and running off when we get there and I try to help him get his clothes off (I always ask him to take his pants down himself first- which he can/will do no problem if he is in a good mood. And he has lots of potty options- sink, little potty, toilet ring, standing in shower, etc.) But he screams and pulls his pants back up so I normally sit and use the toilet myself and occasionally that inspires him to take his turn. But mostly he just runs around for a few more minutes or we nurse and then he does poop (in the diaper) and then it is time to change it. And it's the screaming all over again. But I guess I am more motivated at that point and pretty much force the pants/diaper off of him (Esp. if I know he's had orange juice or Mexican food or something) If we're home though we almost always take a bath rather than trying to wipe. And then I don't try to get another diaper on him until later- usually after he's fallen asleep.
This morning was great though, it was warm out so he just ran outside w/o pants, pooped in the yard, and scooted his butt on the grass to get clean.









But the other thing is that if he's already naked and needs to pee/poop he won't let us put a diaper on him or put any other clothing on. If he would just get on board with using the potty when he needs it we'd have almost nothing particularly difficult to deal with but he'll refuse.
But most of the time now I just take him out to the car naked, and at the the last minutes say "oops! we forgot your pants!" and slip some trainers on just to protect his genitals from the car seat. When it was cold we'd be willing to put on his outerwear, so he just wore snowpants and jacket everywhere. Then I get him properly diapered and clothed after we arrive somewhere. B/C then he is motivated to get dressed so he can go play. (He can't yet put it together in his mind at home) Fortunately, he never pees in the seat (even w/ a diaper, unless it's hours and hours road trip.)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
You picked a great name that he can adapt to his personality: Sebby, Seb, Sebastian. (

If J had been a Sebastian we figured on Bastian for short, that's what all the German Sebastians that we know go by. Of course, we'd been figuring on Hannes for Johannes and instead he's called Jojo (Yo-yo)









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
MMM, I kind of have the opposite with J's name. We're still calling her Josephine, but now I'm not sure which if any of the possible nicknames will suit her.







DH calls her J, and I sometimes do as well, and she actually responds sometimes, so he wants to stick with that.

Josephine was my top choice for a girls name last name and I was counting on calling her Joey. (with a J sound, even though DH would pronounce her full name as yo-seph-een-eh. The eh- at the end is subtle, not a -ahh, like in Josefina) But now that we have a Jojo, I think that's off limits next time, especially since we already have a dog named Jo-Jo.







Right now I am thinking Gabriella. But I've still got years to work on that. (Well, hopefully)


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i personally prefer amelia

It is a lovely name, but for me, Amelia Bedelia is so strongly [ensconced, embedded, entrenched, what's that word?] in my mind that this wouldn't be an option, but maybe these books aren't as popular with the current generation of kids and it would be fine.

ETA- I just asked my mom what she thought of the name Amelia, and she said "It's nice but I'd have to give her the middle name Bedelia."







: But maybe it's just my family.


----------



## cking

I like the name Amelie too.







I prefer it over Amelia. Some friends named their daughter Amelia, and as soon as they announced it as a possibility, every one was bringing up Bedelia also.









We have similar diaper changing issues. I imagine it's just going to get harder with age. She doesn't want to use the potty much anymore - it seems like she needs to poop while standing. So I've been avoiding diaper free time, cause it's just not working right now.









Alice, Joey is my top pick for a nickname. But I called her that the other day. She looked up at me, but it felt a little weird. DH says he doens't like it. Family is already calling her Josie.







I dunno. Do you call him Jojo with a j sound or a y? [Funny, my top pick for a boy's name was Jesse - but I think that's out now, because Josie and Jesse would be silly. Even if we don't call her that.]


----------



## PiePie

i never much liked the amelia bedelia books, but they are still popular. totally dated to read -- job ads specifying "lady wanted" etc. i totally like the nickname joey. my mom was going to be named josephine (changed mind after birth) and she says she would have gone by joey. also my mom wanted to name me joelle.


----------



## PiePie

love gabriella!! it (i think i changed to gabrielle at some point during pregnancy) was on my list but dh was never really sold.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Love Amelie and Amelia and Gabriella...and LOVE LOVE Joey. Don't know of Amelia Bedilia - she obviously didn't make it down under!

In an effort to tire him out/get 10 mins of babe free time, we bought Sebby a Jumperoo - which is like a jolly jumper and exersaucer all in one. It's hideous and he ADORES it. And he's sleeping sooooooo much better.

Wish I had more time to contribute more but I've gotta get the nappies on the line while there's a break in the weather. We've had a cold snap and it's freezing and very wet!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Love Amelie and Amelia and Gabriella...and LOVE LOVE Joey. Don't know of Amelia Bedilia - she obviously didn't make it down under!

In an effort to tire him out/get 10 mins of babe free time, we bought Sebby a Jumperoo - which is like a jolly jumper and exersaucer all in one. It's hideous and he ADORES it. And he's sleeping sooooooo much better.

Wish I had more time to contribute more but I've gotta get the nappies on the line while there's a break in the weather. We've had a cold snap and it's freezing and very wet!


----------



## charliemae

I agree with Alice.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Alice, Joey is my top pick for a nickname. But I called her that the other day. She looked up at me, but it felt a little weird. DH says he doens't like it. Family is already calling her Josie.







I dunno. Do you call him Jojo with a j sound or a y? [Funny, my top pick for a boy's name was Jesse - but I think that's out now, because Josie and Jesse would be silly. Even if we don't call her that.]

DS is yo-yo. My brother started it. The dog is jo-jo. I'm thinking that as he gets older DS will start going by Hannes himself. Or he'll totally reject the German pronunciation of his name and go by Joe.







Or go by part of his last name.
My brother's name is Charles and he's been a Charlie, Chaz, and Chuck at different times with different people. I think kids figure it out for themselves eventually.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
We've had a cold snap and it's freezing and very wet!

Wow! And we are having a heat wave - over 90^F here since Saturday!







s

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
I think kids figure it out for themselves eventually.

yep. That's what I usually tell people if they ask what we're calling her. And I want her to learn her full name first.


----------



## accountclosed3

hawk's name doesn't lend to nick's, though FIL likes "hawk-y" and "hawk-ster" which i think are dumb.

i call him "bubs" and "bubsy." i don't know why. when he fusses, i say "what's a matter bubs?" and he smiles, and if he keeps going, i say 'oh, poor bubsy! what's wrong?"

my mom says she has no clue where that comes from. i don't either. i just started calling him that.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Love Amelie and Amelia and Gabriella...and LOVE LOVE Joey. Don't know of Amelia Bedilia - she obviously didn't make it down under!

In an effort to tire him out/get 10 mins of babe free time, we bought Sebby a Jumperoo - which is like a jolly jumper and exersaucer all in one. It's hideous and he ADORES it. And he's sleeping sooooooo much better.

Wish I had more time to contribute more but I've gotta get the nappies on the line while there's a break in the weather. We've had a cold snap and it's freezing and very wet!

amelia bedelia is a beginning reader book -- think like 60 pages double-spaced. not exactly missing out on great literature, m'dear. dd did not like the jumperoo -- i tried to use it while packing for the move. but whatever works for your little dude. also consider that 4 mos. is when naps are supposed to consolidate anyway.


----------



## Maela

I liked Amelia Bedelia as a child.









I gave Dd her first haircut yesterday - all by myself. It's not great, but it's much better than I ever thought I could do. Her hair was just so stringy and it was very noticeable because it was really blonde at the ends. I didn't want to cut her hair until she was 2-3, but this really looks better. I got her to sit still by letting her watch Lilo & Stitch.







I'll post a picture soon on my blog or FB or somewhere.


----------



## farmama

i have to share:

the other day, we had yoga class, and after class we were chatting and the kids were playing. out of the corner of my eye i saw dd walk behind a curtain. the other kids kept playing, and she didn't come out. after a few minutes i went to check on her, and she had hidden so she could poop in private (in her diaper, of course). she still refuses to use the potty.
too funny.


----------



## witchygrrl

I too liked Amelia Bedelia as a child.







There's worse to like, I suppose.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hiding out while I eat nachos. My food aversions are starting to become a major problem









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
We're still calling her Josephine, but now I'm not sure which if any of the possible nicknames will suit her.

Have you considerred:
"The Royal Toddler"?









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
It's hideous and he ADORES it. And he's sleeping sooooooo much better.

I'm so happy to hear it - Fenton had to tire himself out as well.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
[But the main thing _for me_ is not shaming him then ie "Mommy has to leave b/c she doesn't want to be around you when you're like this."

I grew up with very shaming parents, so I _truly_ get what you're saying. However, some of the issues we're dealing with lately is Fenton hitting and kicking me, often very deliberately with a smile on his face. When I try to redirect him or simply tell him that Mama would never hit him, I want you to stop, he laughs like crazy and tells me "Pretty funny". (His Dad was like this too - why didn't I think to ask about this on our first date???). My point is that the natural consequence of his behavior is that it is sometimes not safe (not to mention maddening) for me to be near him when he is like this, and I'm not sure I do him any favors if I don't point out to him that Mama doesn't want to be next to you when you are hurting me. However, I have allowed myself to be baited into talking really loudly (yelling) when we're having this discussion, and that clearly isn't helping either. I really do have a LOT of patience for these conversations, and I know in my head that it's normal and he's so obviously trying to test what will happen. But, like I said, on minute 8 I explode unexpectedly.







And I can't tell you how frustrating it is to struggle so much against my violent tendencies, only to have my child abuse me. In my irrational moments, I wonder if he does it because he senses the energy from me. But I can't believe there isn't any credit in the universe for how hard I struggle against it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i call him "bubs" and "bubsy." i don't know why. when he fusses, i say "what's a matter bubs?" and he smiles, and if he keeps going, i say 'oh, poor bubsy! what's wrong?"

my mom says she has no clue where that comes from. i don't either. i just started calling him that.

I love those nicknames that happen that way - I call Fenton "teddy" and I have no idea why.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I gave Dd her first haircut yesterday - all by myself. It's not great, but it's much better than I ever thought I could do. Her hair was just so stringy and it was very noticeable because it was really blonde at the ends. I didn't want to cut her hair until she was 2-3, but this really looks better. I got her to sit still by letting her watch Lilo & Stitch.







I'll post a picture soon on my blog or FB or somewhere.









I cut Fenton's myself (the one field trip to the barber did NOT go well) and I've only managed to do it in the bathtub (which makes the water pretty gross by the end). He has stayed more and more still as I've gotten better and better about talking about haircuts a lot when we're not doing them, about how "everyone gets hair cuts", and we go through the list of everyone we know, including dogs, who get haircuts







. Don't know why that works, but thought I'd share in case it helps. I also take every opportunity when DH and I are getting our hairs cut for him to go watch. Which, but the way, I got a crazy short haircut today. Still not sure if I like it.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I too liked Amelia Bedelia as a child.







There's worse to like, I suppose.

Yeah, I was reading VC Andrews when I was 8, and that's way worse.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I grew up with very shaming parents, so I _truly_ get what you're saying. However, some of the issues we're dealing with lately is Fenton hitting and kicking me, often very deliberately with a smile on his face. ....My point is that the natural consequence of his behavior is that it is sometimes not safe (not to mention maddening) for me to be near him when he is like this, and I'm not sure I do him any favors if I don't point out to him that Mama doesn't want to be next to you when you are hurting me.

I'm going to respond again, not because I'm disagreeing with you exactly, but b/c J really does do the same things and I'm finding it helpful to hear myself talk to you... Maybe I'm trying to see if I actually agree with myself or not. So please don't take it like I'm badgering you. Because I do get what you mean. And especially about *that* moment.
J bites me. Hard. And sometimes he's laughing and sometimes he's mad. And he knows biting is not ok and is really good about not biting other kids. Same with pinching and hitting. But he really gets very rough with me. [As I mentioned before it's mostly when he needs to poop.] But I still feel that _I_ shouldn't tell him that I don't want to be around him.
I DO make it clear that what he is doing is hurting. That mommy gets a booboo. That is hurts my feelings. And sometimes I will sort of plunk him down and sit on the other side of the sofa. Which I guess is sending the same sort of message. And again, if it's Uncle Bob or friend Lucy I totally support them saying that they don't want to be around him if he's going to be violent and then leaving. Yes, it is a natural consequence of his behavior that I won't want to be around him. But it's also pretty natural that I want to hit him back. But I guess I feel that in both cases the potential wounds (to psyche) are too deep to let him face those natural consequences. But maybe I just have personal issues with the phrase "don't want to be around you" and not all people 'take' it as badly. Sometimes when he is hitting and I give myself distance from him I will say that "Mama needs to keep herself from getting hurt." I certainly do put the boobs away if he's biting those. But there's just something about saying "I don't want to be around you" that sounds so rejecting _to me._

Although, honestly I guess I have to admit if I thought that telling him that I didn't want to be around him would "work" (to stop hitting, etc.) I would probably find a way to justify it to myself. But, I know J would just get more upset and it wouldn't 'teach him' not to hurt me. We've had the best luck with simply offering alternatives (hands are for clapping, snapping, saying hi, etc. or else giving him pillows to hit, bite, etc.)
But I really haven't found anything that can 'make' him stop hurting me or cooperate with getting dressed or whatever. Today I had to make in stay inside most of the day b/c he wasn't willing to put on clothes or sunscreen. He wanted to go out and knew that he needed the shirt on but he just couldn't seem to break out of his resistance, despite his strong desire to go out. Finally I got him dressed while he was napping.
I'm not really sure where I'm going with this. But I guess I keep thinking that if I type enough I'll get some sort of inspiration. B/C it does throw everything out of whack these days when we can't get anywhere or do anything b/c he won't go along with anything. B/C then he's not sleepy enough to nap well and then he's cranky and then I'm cranky. If he wakes up early then I can have DH get him dressed and put him in the car and then I just stay out of the house the rest of the day. But most of the time he's been up too late the night before to get up before DH goes to work.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Alice, i don't feel badgered about it at all







- it's good for me to flesh out too, as this is a difficult problem in my vocation right now.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
Sometimes when he is hitting and I give myself distance from him I will say that "Mama needs to keep herself from getting hurt." .

Ah, I don't think we disagree much - this is pretty much what I say to him if I need to be away from him. It doesn't feel right for me to say "I _don't want_ to be with you..." (because it's not even true, I just want him to stop), and it feels like all the difference in the world for me to say "It's not safe for me to be next to you when....".

And...it doesn't work anyway







But what it does help is me not feeling like I'm sending him the message that I'm his martyr mama. I'm really willing to go further than him when it's clear that I'm the adult and can handle more than he can. But getting kicked, hit (or bit...I'm so sorry







) I don't think I'm much more capable of dealing than he would be, especially while pregnant. Especially when I clearly have violence issues







.

I am so hungry for Cocoa Puffs right now....I used to consider it a blessing that we didn't keep crap food in the house. Now I'm considering calling my neighbor to see what crap food she has around...







:


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*,







s regarding the food aversions. I *do not* miss that! I just gave in and told myself I'd eat healthy once I wasn't sick anymore. And now I'm not sick, and I'm actually doing pretty good (for me anyway







).

*Farmama*, that's so cute about the pooping in private. I've seen other kids be that way too. Makes sense I guess. I wouldn't want to poop in public either. Except during labor







, then I didn't care much.

Spend three hours with friends tonight while Dh and Dd stayed home. So nice. My friends (from high school) and I don't get together much, Dh and his friends do once every couple of weeks or so; so this was really refreshing!

Right now Dh is in Dd's room with her trying to put her to sleep. He asked her if she wanted to cuddle with him in her bed and go to sleep and she said yes. We'll see how that goes. She's never gone to sleep at night w/o me, so I'm expecting to be called in any moment now.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Right now Dh is in Dd's room with her trying to put her to sleep. He asked her if she wanted to cuddle with him in her bed and go to sleep and she said yes. We'll see how that goes. She's never gone to sleep at night w/o me, so I'm expecting to be called in any moment now.

Wow they are still in there. And ... it's quiet. Never heard any crying, just Dd singing and yelling and playing. but it's been quiet for a good 10 minutes or so now.







:

It feels so weird to be the one sitting out here relaxing and waiting for Dh to get out so we can spend some time together before bed. I wonder if he fell asleep in there with her. Happens to me a lot.









OMG, do you know what this means?! Maybe he can do this every other night!







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Wow they are still in there. And ... it's quiet. Never heard any crying, just Dd singing and yelling and playing. but it's been quiet for a good 10 minutes or so now.







:

How did it go? We've gotten to the point where dh can put Fenton to sleep without me, but I can't get Fenton to sleep without DH, unless DH isn't home. He's really turned into a Daddy's boy.


----------



## Maela

Dd fell asleep around ten. Dh fell asleep with her, until I came in at 11 to wake him up to go back to our bed. I am SO happy about this! Just to know that she's okay going to bed without me (hopefully it wasn't just a fluke) is such a big relief. I asked Dh, "How?!" He said she eventually stopped playing and got in bed with Dh and started falling asleep.







But...How?!


----------



## PiePie

i go to book club once a month without dd and dh can get her to bed but it is not fun for either of them. what i mind is not that i am the one to get her down -- i mostly love it -- and not when she wakes up and i am sleeping, which i am oddly completely accepting of -- but when she wakes up when i am still up at night and having me time (or couple time). that i resent.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i go to book club once a month without dd and dh can get her to bed but it is not fun for either of them. what i mind is not that i am the one to get her down -- i mostly love it -- and not when she wakes up and i am sleeping, which i am oddly completely accepting of -- but when she wakes up when i am still up at night and having me time (or couple time). that i resent.

I am currently resenting it all! It took me 4 hours to get DS to sleep for longer than 20 mins last night! I've been going to bed with DS every night for weeks now and he is back to only napping on me. He will not transition without waking up so I gave up trying! My nipples are so sore because he's nursing A LOT but likes to twist and thrash about...you all know what that's about, I'm sure. He will only go to sleep with the boob.

I resent that DP has so much time alone and can't even help with sleep time.

However, I've just woken up from 6 solid hours for the first time since he was a perfect sleeping newborn! I feel almost new! Yoga today may not be a disaster. Last week I left in tears with a screaming boy who hadn't slept the night before.

But I still love it!







:


----------



## cking

Just heard that Monsanto is a sponsor of NPR's Marketplace.







:







:







: And they had bit about how envt'ly _responsible_ they are.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Dd fell asleep around ten. Dh fell asleep with her, until I came in at 11 to wake him up to go back to our bed. I am SO happy about this! Just to know that she's okay going to bed without me (hopefully it wasn't just a fluke) is such a big relief. I asked Dh, "How?!" He said she eventually stopped playing and got in bed with Dh and started falling asleep.







But...How?!









Wow, that's amazing! I'm looking forward to that time a little bit, even though I know it's a loooong way off.

I went out one night last week (for two whole hours!) but I got back right around bedtime, as DH was defrosting some milk. So he tried to give her the bottle anyway, but she just laughed and tugged at the nipple.









I am wondering what to do about this: a bridal shower for my friend, 2.5 hour drive from here. That would be about 8 hours away from DD. I don't think I want to subject her to that long of a drive in one day, and it's Memorial Day wkd, so I'm not sure if we could even find a hotel room. Do you think it's doable for a 13 month old? Again, she's only taken a bottle a handful of times. I'm sure she could just use a cup now, but she might not take any milk anyway.







It would still be daytime, so not as bad as going to bed without me.

Then we have to figure out what to do about the wedding.









Found out my SIL is expecting a _boy_!


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
a bridal shower for my friend, 2.5 hour drive from here.

If it's 2.5 hours North, you're welcome to stay here.







Josephine can even come to J's birthday party.

At a year, I wouldn't worry too much about the food aspect of it. I had to leave J here and there with DH or my mom for about that long and he just drank water and ate solids. Even though he was barely eating anything normally (quantity wise, he was eating a wide variety) when the boobs were away he ate what he needed to.
I'm assuming you would leave her home with DH?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Just heard that Monsanto is a sponsor of NPR's Marketplace.







:







:







: And they had bit about how envt'ly _responsible_ they are.

Great.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I am wondering what to do about this: a bridal shower for my friend, 2.5 hour drive from here. That would be about 8 hours away from DD. I don't think I want to subject her to that long of a drive in one day, and it's Memorial Day wkd, so I'm not sure if we could even find a hotel room. Do you think it's doable for a 13 month old? Again, she's only taken a bottle a handful of times. I'm sure she could just use a cup now, but she might not take any milk anyway.







It would still be daytime, so not as bad as going to bed without me.

I haven't left Dd that long yet, but I know she would be fine. I think that at 13 months and staying with Dh she'll be totally fine. Before my milk dried up, I never saw Dd eat a huge amount of food. But always when the grandparents were watching her they would talk about how much food she ate and it seemed to be a crazy amount (in just 4-6 hours!). I think most little ones will take the solids just fine if there's no milk around.

Dh put Dd to sleep again last night (I wanted to make sure this was real







), and it took him about 40 minutes - 5 min less than the night before. Yay! He said he has to tell her long elaborate stories.







and sing to her. Last night I did hear her cry for a minute, but not for me (I wouldn't have been able to keep myself from rushing in







); she just wanted out of the room. Didn't last longer than a minute though - apparently Dh offered to tell another story.









Dh is going to be really busy in the next 7 days with end of the school year stuff (he does the yearbook class and the deadline is soon). So I'm going to be on my own. I think I'll spend lots of time at my parents'. Wish me luck. Dd's pretty easy now, but thinking about spending the next seven days w/out any help scares me.









I'm feeling kicks multiple times a day now.







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Just heard that Monsanto is a sponsor of NPR's Marketplace.







:







:







: And they had bit about how envt'ly _responsible_ they are.

Naom Chomsky's rule of PR is that the more money a company spends to tell you about the good they do, the less it's true.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Fenton loves to run around the house naked after a bath, yelling "Naked baby!' Lately he's peed on the floor a few times and we've been talking about using the potty when we have to go. Today he said "I will not pee on the floor!" And I must have been very encouraging because he then went on to yell throughout the house "I will not pee on Mama!" "I will not pee on Daddy!"










He's also just discovered that his Duplos fit on it penis.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

nak

Sebby is forming a babies union after another wet, leaky, super stuffed night nappy. He's sick of wet PJ's, I'm sick of waking in a puddle.

Anyone got any fail safe ideas? He thinks it's my fault, i'm sure! I heard whispers of them staging a demo if the issue isn't resolved by next week!


----------



## PiePie

have you tried douple diapering him? that's what my mom suggested for dd's christening -- we were using a gown from ireland that was 200+ yrs old...


----------



## PiePie

i have thread in gd http://www.mothering.com/discussions...0#post13692880


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
He's also just discovered that his Duplos fit on it penis.









OMG, that is so funny!









Dd is down to nursing 3-5 times in a 24 hour period. That's a huge decrease for her. I am surprisingly not sad about it; although I would like it if she stayed at this frequency for a couple more months before decreasing even more.







It feels like it's been such a gradual change though, and I think that's why it's been fairly easy on me emotionally. And she doesn't seem to be upset about the milk being gone. It's just not as important to her now, I guess.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Dd is down to nursing 3-5 times in a 24 hour period. That's a huge decrease for her. I am surprisingly not sad about it; although I would like it if she stayed at this frequency for a couple more months before decreasing even more.







It feels like it's been such a gradual change though, and I think that's why it's been fairly easy on me emotionally. And she doesn't seem to be upset about the milk being gone. It's just not as important to her now, I guess.

Yes, you have been remarkably more adjusted about it than I was







. She turns 2 in August? IS that your goal, or just to keep her nursing as long as possible? It sounds like it's progressing in a really organic way.









MMM, I wonder if you're getting leaks because of either a)build up on the dipes (dipe cream? strip them?) of if the dips are so over-stuffed that a gap is getting created between his leg and the dipe. What are you stuffing with? I think hemp or microfiber is the thinest thing to stuff with that is most absorbant....Christina, any words from you? I seem to remember you had a little camel too


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Yes, you have been remarkably more adjusted about it than I was







. She turns 2 in August? IS that your goal, or just to keep her nursing as long as possible? It sounds like it's progressing in a really organic way.









She turns two on 7/17. I had always planned on nursing for 2-3 years, so yes I would like to make it to two. But I've come to terms with the fact that that may not happen. Plus, I know that there's not really any milk left, so...but I know it's an emotional/comfort thing too.
If we decide to get pg again, I think I would like to wait until this baby is at least 21 months. I wish that Dd had had just a little more mama's milk.


----------



## Maela

*Cking*, Dd still talks about you and Josephine. About riding in her stroller and playing at the playground.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Cking*, Dd still talks about you and Josephine. About riding in her stroller and playing at the playground.









Oh, that's is so sweet! That is so cool that she has such a good memory now. It does sound like things are progressing well with her (gradual) weaning. I hope it continues so.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Christina, any words from you? I seem to remember you had a little camel too









Well, she wasn't as heavy of a wetter as I thought...but one thing that helps are some fleece pants that I sewed for her, which she wears to bed. So I don't always know if it leaks. And I agree with Shanna, the gap could cause leaks. For some reason Fuzzi Bunz always leak for us - I don't think I get it tight enough.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
If it's 2.5 hours North, you're welcome to stay here.







Josephine can even come to J's birthday party.

At a year, I wouldn't worry too much about the food aspect of it. I had to leave J here and there with DH or my mom for about that long and he just drank water and ate solids. Even though he was barely eating anything normally (quantity wise, he was eating a wide variety) when the boobs were away he ate what he needed to.
I'm assuming you would leave her home with DH?

It is, actually. Thank you for offering! It's in SW CT, so it's still a bit of a drive. I'm sure Josephine would have a blast at J's party.







I just talked to my friend's mom, who told me to bring Josephine along, and DH too. I'll have to talk to him to figure it out.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I haven't left Dd that long yet, but I know she would be fine. I think that at 13 months and staying with Dh she'll be totally fine. Before my milk dried up, I never saw Dd eat a huge amount of food. But always when the grandparents were watching her they would talk about how much food she ate and it seemed to be a crazy amount (in just 4-6 hours!). I think most little ones will take the solids just fine if there's no milk around.

Alice and Maela, thanks for your input. I was thinking that she might be ok with it, especially being the middle of the day. I think she would probably eat more if I wasn't around too.

Josephine slept for 10 hours the other night - uninterrupted! I was shocked. We've been putting her to bed on the futon on the floor of her room, until her first awakening....but this time she didn't wake until morning. I'm starting to wonder if she does sleep better without us. She seems to like having room to flip and rotate.

Shanna, lmao about the duplo.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thanks for the nappy ideas folks! I've had two dry nights with a BumGenius stuffed with one large microfibre, one small microfibre and a bamboo insert. It's all about getting the right balance. Who'd have thunk it was such a science. We're also getting some much better night sleeps - I just have to get used to having such a snuggler (and therefore squashed and stuck in one position all night) and I'll be fine.

Sebby has become all about cuddles. It's beautiful. Until the last week or so, I could never get him to sit quietly on my lap. Now he seeks it out and wants to cuddle right in. I could get very used to it!

*Shanna*, are you having this LO in the same birth centre? Just wondering.

*Toys*- Sebby needs some. I want them to not be plastic-y or reminicent of the very ugly jumperoo that now graces our living room. Any recs for appropriate toys for 4, 5, 6month olds?

*Solids?* - Did y'all do baby led weaning? If not, why not. When did you start solids (blw or not)?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Toys*- Sebby needs some. I want them to not be plastic-y or reminicent of the very ugly jumperoo that now graces our living room. Any recs for appropriate toys for 4, 5, 6month olds?



DD loved this Gund caterpillar at that age: http://www.boydsbears.com/tinkle-cri...nd-squeak.aspx also liked some soft blocks that were not these but kinda similar http://uniqueandwoodentoys.com/SEC_S...%20Shape%20Set also consider rattles, stuffed animals, teethers, puppets.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
DD loved this Gund caterpillar at that age: http://www.boydsbears.com/tinkle-cri...nd-squeak.aspx also liked some soft blocks that were not these but kinda similar http://uniqueandwoodentoys.com/SEC_S...%20Shape%20Set also consider rattles, stuffed animals, teethers, puppets.

I knew you'd come through on this one! Thanks


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, we did a combination of giving her whole solid foods to play with/eat, making purees at home and letting her spoon feed herself, and actually spoon feeding her. Just depended on the food and how comfortable I was with it. She did have a few gagging/choking episodes (especially with apples - she loved them!), but overall I think it went well. I just made sure to really watch for her cues if I was spoon-feeding. I did not want to be just stuffing food in her mouth if she wasn't that interested.

Oh gotta go, Dd wants *me* to put her to bed tonight.


----------



## Maela

She fell asleep really quickly tonight. We had a very tired toddler.

I am _really_ craving some fruit right now! But we have nothing!!
Except raisins.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

MMM- We did BLW. In the beginning would just give him 1/2 a cooked sweet potato, a cored ripe pear, etc. and let him do whatever he wanted to with it. We never had any gagging/choking issues. We didn't do any spoonfeeding until he was a bit older and started wanting some of our applesauce, soup, yogurt, etc. but couldn't quite get it into his own mouth. Things were only pureed if the adults were eating them that way.

toys- soft noisy blocks, kitchen stuff especially metal colander,


----------



## ~Shanna~

Typing left-handed. Fenton & i in car accident yesterday. We're ok, but i had injuries to right hand and thumb, cuts on face. not a scratch on fenton. need surgery on tendon today and more stitches, dh off work cuz i can't lift, change dipes. car is probably totaled, so we'll have some decisions to make about sharing a car until we move (to more ped-friendly - hopefully ) area in ~ 18 months.

got an ultrasound right away, baby is fine, placenta is fine. wonderful nurse heard me say delivering at birth center, and she snuck in my room to give run down of what they would want to do, what was necessary and what wasn't. Rest of staff tried to give me morphine And other things not ok with. Nurse told me about homeopath antidote to the xray they did on my hand. Everyone marvelous. i lied to them about f's vax status, but confided to her and she







. nice to not feel alone.

Fenton was afraid, crying, breaking my heart. fireman carried him, carseat and all, in ambulence and he calmed down when i sang wheels on the bus. firemen all joied in. Trunk looks like an accordian, haunting me with how close to f it was. blood everywhere







and f still talking about "what a mess mama made". Astonishing the strength i had to protect hi8m - can't believe i didnt faint. not good with blood.

Anyway, sorry for random facts. still processing. taking as little tylenol as i can for pain. prescribed vicodin, trying to hold out. Ku moving still, no bad feelings about his or her well-being. Just bought rnew carseat for Ku, but now its Fentons.


----------



## accountclosed3

hawk's toys have been simple. he loves spoons, cups, bowls. he has a few small stuffed toys--his chewing giraffe (cloth) and his owl (cloth) are his two favorites. he also has two wooden rattles that he seems to enjoy.

right now, he's into this crumply, shiny-plastic paper. it's wrapping paper, and it doesn't tear. so, he can pull on it and make it crackle, he can wad it up and let go of it (and it sort of "explodes" toward it's full size), and so on.

he also likes to play "Dump" wherein i put the various toys "away" and he then comes and 'dumps' them or plays with them and sets them out or drags them around. then, after about 20 minutes, he's bored, so i go and pick them all up, and he starts over again.

we're doing BLW. right now, he gnaws on apples (we take a bit for him, then he gets the juice), carrots (raw), banana and avocado. the mushy stuff he mostly mushes. he has also had green bean and something else i can't remember--oh yeah, sweet potato (baked).

he has a STRONG interest in food, so i'm thinking of giving him a small spoon and pureeing a bit to see how that goes for him. often, he'll nurse while we eat anyway.

and, i've only been doing this about a month (or less) as he didn't seem that interested before. now, he wants wwhatever i'm having. i could pre-chew it for him, but i'm not comfortable with that yet.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Shanna-







I'm so sorry that you and F and Ku had to go through that! I'm so glad that everyone is (basically) fine. Good luck on working out the car logistics and hope surgery is easy/good and speedy recovery on the hand.


----------



## PiePie

wow *shanna* super duper scary! will be praying for your speedy recovery.

depends what you mean by blw. when she grabbed for food we didn't let her have any till 6 mos. she was on reflux meds and i wanted to know if any digestive symptoms meant we had to up the dose and not have that confused with food intolerances. i controlled what food she had because i was nervous about food allergies because i have family history. i relaxed around 10 mos. -- still relaxed about anything except nuts. we never spoonfed her -- when we went to give her her first solid (homemade applesauce) at 6 mos. she took the spoon right out of dh's hand and fed herself. she has been good with spoons since about 6 mos. did all of those homemade purees but she lost interest at about 10 mos. and wanted only our food. in retrospect i would probably go purely with our food. blw is so much easier. highly recommend the book _child of mine_ by ellyn satter for food issues generally -- definitely a feminist take on things, more concerned with relationship with food than with nutrition, written by nutritionist turned therapist specializing in eating disorders.


----------



## cking

Oh, Shanna, I'm sorry about the accident. How scary to go through all that. I'm glad you are all ok, and also praying for a quick recovery for you.

MMM, we also did BLW, starting at 6 months. It seemed to be the right thing for her, since she didn't want us to give her anything on the spoon. Like Alice said, it is actually easier to offer her spoonable food now, since she seems to understand that some things go on a spoon.

I also think it's important to distinguish between gagging and choking. Gill Raply talks about it in Baby Led Weaning, as well as on the BLW site.

Piepie had some good toy suggestions. At that age J really liked crinkly stuff. Also, some things she can play with on her belly and while sitting. We had a soft pyramid (with a mirror, crinkly animals, etc.) and a rolling piano (I think a tap-a-tunes style is good too) - not natural at all, I know, but at least they weren't electronic. She also really liked banging on things- drums, pots and pans, etc. and rattles.

Josephine is now officially walking. She started taking a couple steps at a time last week, then last night she took off. It is so hard to get video because she gets upset that we don't give her the camera. But I put one up on FB.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Oh Shanna huge hugs.







That is so super scary. Sending you prayers and hoping that you heal quickly.

Good luck with everything. I'm sorry that this happened to you.


----------



## Maela

Oh, Shanna that must have been so scary! I'm so sorry you had to go through that! I'm glad to hear that you three are okay. I hope you heal quickly.






























: Yay, Josephine!!


----------



## Maela

So I was looking through my pg journal from last pg and I saw that my ms didn't go away until 18 weeks, and I also didn't feel the baby kicking until then either. For some reason, this whole time I had thought it was 16 weeks. So actually I felt this baby for the first time at the same time that I felt Dd. Not later. I don't know why I had thought it was 16weeks. anyway, that made me feel a little better.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Oh...y'all are awesome. Thanks for weighing in on the toys and BLW. I think I may have been expecting Sebby to want more involved toys when in actual fact he has all that he needs! Am reading the BLW book now.

*Shanna*







s: How terrifying. Sounds like you're holding up well. So glad your precious babes are ok. Thinking of you. xox


----------



## ~Shanna~

Thanks for all the







. Holding up ok, got bad news yesterday that i need surgery, but can't do til Ku is out. going to have to advocate for myself on general anesth., dr. seemed clueless about what would affect bfing. No opposable thumb till surgery - will be interesting till then! Ku going to have to know how to take a bottle for surgery and while i pump and dump. calling LLL today for support.

good news on insurance though - car insurance covers our $5K deductible (we buy our own).

on my own tomorrow - dipe changes going 2 b....interesting.


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna--yikes! how scary to be in an accident. I'm glad everyone made it okayish, even if you need surgery. Good for you being proactive on this.


----------



## accountclosed3

shanna:

that accident sounds scary! i hope you're better soon!

i am very concerned about driving with hawk. i look forward to moving to a walk-able place too!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 

i am very concerned about driving with hawk. i look forward to moving to a walk-able place too!

ditto. dd has been in a car a total of 5 times. it is one of 3 things i worry about. proud it is only 3. i am a total worrywort and i try hard to keep my anxieties at bay so i can be calm for her.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Thanks for all the







. Holding up ok, got bad news yesterday that i need surgery, but can't do til Ku is out. going to have to advocate for myself on general anesth., dr. seemed clueless about what would affect bfing. No opposable thumb till surgery - will be interesting till then! Ku going to have to know how to take a bottle for surgery and while i pump and dump. calling LLL today for support.

good news on insurance though - car insurance covers our $5K deductible (we buy our own).

on my own tomorrow - dipe changes going 2 b....interesting.









i may need surgery so i looked into this. my doc is very knowledgeable re bfing. she said pump and dump for 48 hours after. so i may be delaying or never having said procedure.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I think I may have been expecting Sebby to want more involved toys when in actual fact he has all that he needs!


it all changes dramatically when they start sitting independently (as opposed to tripod). then you will want filling and spilling toys, stackers, balls. oh, and do you have a mirror? big believer in baby-safe mirrors from the start.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Thanks for all the







. Holding up ok, got bad news yesterday that i need surgery, but can't do til Ku is out. going to have to advocate for myself on general anesth., dr. seemed clueless about what would affect bfing. No opposable thumb till surgery - will be interesting till then! Ku going to have to know how to take a bottle for surgery and while i pump and dump. calling LLL today for support.

Did you do a search on breastfeeding and anesthesia here or at Kellymom? Obviously everyone has different comfort levels, but it seems like you should be able to find options that don't involve pumping and dumping. Maybe find out what sort of anesthesia is used at your hospital for emergency C-sections requiring general. Good luck figuring everything out!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i may need surgery so i looked into this. my doc is very knowledgeable re bfing. she said pump and dump for 48 hours after. so i may be delaying or never having said procedure.

is this for gen anesth? Does it matter which drug they use? Thanks for the info - i cried when they told me this, but now trying to see it all as a lot of little problems that have solution. working on willing my tendon to heal on its own.

MMM, you still dry at night? F is a cuddler at night too, though he's like a terrier







Made nightweaning much easier, plus...









I totally agree about having been nervous about driving with dc, and i live in car country. i've always been hyper-aware of what a dangerous activity it is, and now I'm even jumpier. will drive much less if down to 1 car - probablynot even church, due to logistics.

Maela, did you get some fruit?


----------



## PiePie

~Shanna~ said:


> is this for gen anesth? Does it matter which drug they use? UOTE]
> 
> yes and i don't know.


----------



## cking

Shanna, I'm sorry you may have go months without an opposable thumb! Much patience to you.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i look forward to moving to a walk-able place too!

This is my biggest goal/dream. Really. I mean, I know it can be done - we lived without a car in our last town. But we couldn't afford to live there. Our 450 sf apt would have cost more than our house.

When we went to CA I was all excited that we could actually spend a whole week without a car/carseat. We took the train from the airport to the city, so it was all going well. Until I realized that the train wasn't running early Sunday morning, to get us back to our return flight.







: Gah.


----------



## TinyFrog

Shanna. So sorry to hear about the accident and injury. Sending good vibes on a naturally healing thumb.







:







: The babies are okay.


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, wellington is walkable! we hope to be car free for a couple of years, renting when we want to go out and about. NZ has an organization called "plunket" where yo ucan rent car seats.

for this trip, our friend is renting a car seat for us and picking us up from the airport and also driving us to the yoga retreat out of town.

otherwise, walking, buses, and trains will do the trick. i think, though, that the trickiest is getting to the waldorf school. it's in lower hutt, so that means a train ride, but then i don't know how far the walk is to the school or what. hopefully, not far.









i'm so psyched.


----------



## witchygrrl

I wish we were in walking territory. Hopefully when we move, we can be.

Still waiting to hear about the budgets for school. Because DH's district is comprised of 3 towns, it takes longer I guess. I suppose I'm getting taught patience, but seriously, I'm done waiting.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Solids?* - Did y'all do baby led weaning? If not, why not. When did you start solids (blw or not)?

Yep, pretty much what Alice said:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
MMM- We did BLW. In the beginning would just give him 1/2 a cooked sweet potato, a cored ripe pear, etc. and let him do whatever he wanted to with it. We never had any gagging/choking issues. We didn't do any spoonfeeding until he was a bit older and started wanting some of our applesauce, soup, yogurt, etc. but couldn't quite get it into his own mouth. Things were only pureed if the adults were eating them that way.

He would gag, but then cough it up and be fine. We did push solids a little earlier than I had planned on due to the milk supply issues (6.5 months), but I think he was ready anyway.

*Shanna* -





















It sounds like we just missed each other at the hospital. We arrived at 5am on Monday morning. One car is doable, even out here. Especially if there is an end in sight, even if it is 18 months away. Thinking of and praying for you and yours. Calling you ASAP...

Update on us- I woke up early Monday morning (4am) to Calvin having a febrile seizure. DH called 911, told them not to send ambulance, we'd just drive him. Took C's temp after he stopped seizing and it was over 105. Called 911 back and told them to send ambulance after all. Wonderful EMTs, empty Ped. ER, good experience all around. Nurses and attending doc were all great. We were honest about C's no-vax status since it was so relevant to the situation and received no flak about it whatsoever. Tests were run - blood, urine, and x-ray and C just slept in between them. We were discharged after ~4 hours with scrips for antibiotics and eyedrops because he has pinkeye and an ear infection. Gave motrin and ibuprofen for first 48 hours to make sure fever didn't spike again and because he seems to be in a lot of pain. Still wondering if I should have fought more about antibiotics or if we did the right thing giving so much of the otc meds, but my intuition said just to do it. Need to look into counteracting the effects of the antibiotics on C's gut. Anyone have experience there?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Yep, pretty much what Alice said:
Need to look into counteracting the effects of the antibiotics on C's gut. Anyone have experience there?

Is he doing any dairy? You could do coconut milk kefir, water kefir (i have grains for both, call me). Also, do the lacto veggies in NT - saurkraut if he likes it,ginger carrots should ho over well - salt amounts are tempermental with no whey as starter, I'd follow Wild Fermentation as a guide. Poor little man....and poor mama









Car is totaled, going down to 1 car. Insurance will cover what we owe, birth center bill plus a few thousand for the bank. That car being totaled is the 1 silver lining. That, and seeing that I don't faint if my son needs me







Still shocked by how calm and together I was









Fenton consistently sleeping through the night!







: But taking 60-90 minutres to "get to bed". Has to be a better way...


----------



## Maela

Steph, how scary! Is he feeling any better yet?

Shanna, I did go and get some fruit. And now we're out again.







I think Maev and I are going to take a trip to the fruit stand nearby after her nap. Ha, ha. I mean after I take a nap. Maev has not taken hardly any naps lately.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 

Update on us- I woke up early Monday morning (4am) to Calvin having a febrile seizure. DH called 911, told them not to send ambulance, we'd just drive him. Took C's temp after he stopped seizing and it was over 105. Called 911 back and told them to send ambulance after all. Wonderful EMTs, empty Ped. ER, good experience all around. Nurses and attending doc were all great. We were honest about C's no-vax status since it was so relevant to the situation and received no flak about it whatsoever. Tests were run - blood, urine, and x-ray and C just slept in between them. We were discharged after ~4 hours with scrips for antibiotics and eyedrops because he has pinkeye and an ear infection. Gave motrin and ibuprofen for first 48 hours to make sure fever didn't spike again and because he seems to be in a lot of pain. Still wondering if I should have fought more about antibiotics or if we did the right thing giving so much of the otc meds, but my intuition said just to do it. Need to look into counteracting the effects of the antibiotics on C's gut. Anyone have experience there?

how terrifying!! i know they are totally common and all but wow how scary. i remember well our first er visit with dd -- also for a fever we couldn't get down with tylenol -- but no seizures -- dh and i were so scared. fwiw, i think you did the right thing using the tylenol (for future reference, feverall, in the rectum, works faster) and the antibiotics. dd was an antibx when she had pneumonia and her gut was fine. i tried to give her yogurt but she refused it -- all the mucus had gone down to her tummy and taken away her appetite, i guess. but no gut problems. will be praying for your lo's quick recovery.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
Maybe find out what sort of anesthesia is used at your hospital for emergency C-sections requiring general. Good luck figuring everything out!

Brilliant, I didn't think of this. THANK YOU!


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Is he doing any dairy? You could do coconut milk kefir, water kefir (i have grains for both, call me). Also, do the lacto veggies in NT - saurkraut if he likes it,ginger carrots should ho over well - salt amounts are tempermental with no whey as starter, I'd follow Wild Fermentation as a guide. Poor little man....and poor mama










Trying to avoid dairy. Have some water kefir grains I need to use asap so I'll see how he likes that once it's done. He loves sauerkraut and we have some Bubbie's store bought on hand, so I'll give him that for the time being. Thanks for the suggestions!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Steph, how scary! Is he feeling any better yet?


He slept a ton at the hospital, all the way home, and 2-3 hours after we got home. Woke up about 11am and was the same old normal DS. He's been himself ever since besides seeming to be in pain while laying down, which I assume is common with ear infections.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
how terrifying!! i know they are totally common and all but wow how scary. i remember well our first er visit with dd -- also for a fever we couldn't get down with tylenol -- but no seizures -- dh and i were so scared. fwiw, i think you did the right thing using the tylenol (for future reference, feverall, in the rectum, works faster) and the antibiotics. dd was an antibx when she had pneumonia and her gut was fine. i tried to give her yogurt but she refused it -- all the mucus had gone down to her tummy and taken away her appetite, i guess. but no gut problems. will be praying for your lo's quick recovery.


They gave rectal tylenol at the ER and it's on our list of things to buy asap, as well as an ear thermometer because we'd just been taking underarm temps.

Now that DS is better, DH seems to have the flu.







Since he is going to be laid off soon and just took off two days to stay home with me & DS, he can't take anymore time off. It's so frustrating to me that he seems to get sick when I need his help most. I know logically that his immune system is weakened by stress, but it's still really hard for me not to blame him or be upset with him. I do not make a good nurse and I'm having a hard enough time just getting by when he's well.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Now that Calvin is better, DH seems to have the flu.







Since he is going to be laid off soon and just took off two days to stay home with me & Calvin, he can't take anymore time off. It's so frustrating to me that he seems to get sick when I need his help most. I know logically that his immune system is weakened by stress, but it's still really hard for me not to blame him or be upset with him. I do not make a good nurse and I'm having a hard enough time just getting by when he's well.

Used to baby the heck out of DH when he was sick, pre-Fenton. Now I think "oh come ON!








:"


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 

They gave rectal tylenol at the ER and it's on our list of things to buy asap, as well as an ear thermometer because we'd just been taking underarm temps.

Now that Calvin is better, DH seems to have the flu.







Since he is going to be laid off soon and just took off two days to stay home with me & Calvin, he can't take anymore time off. It's so frustrating to me that he seems to get sick when I need his help most. I know logically that his immune system is weakened by stress, but it's still really hard for me not to blame him or be upset with him. I do not make a good nurse and I'm having a hard enough time just getting by when he's well.

i hear you on being a crappy nurse. i am too. dh is not the easiest patient -- he does not want to be babied, but then he holds the lack of babying against me. it's rough nursing 2 at once. why the ear thermometer? they are notoriously inaccurate? we use rectal. i know -- it sounds awful -- but you can get ones that do it super fast, like under 10 secs. i schmear it with petroleum jelly first.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Now I think "oh come ON!







:"

Exactly.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
why the ear thermometer? they are notoriously inaccurate? we use rectal. i know -- it sounds awful -- but you can get ones that do it super fast, like under 10 secs. i schmear it with petroleum jelly first.

Ear has got to be more accurate than underarm, though? Can only do oral or rectal if there are 2-3 people around so someone can hold him down. The hospital thermometers took less than 10 seconds (rectal) and they still had to take it twice every time because he'd force it out the first time, and he was really out of it then. I can't imagine when he's at full strength.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 

Ear has got to be more accurate than underarm, though?


I don't think so.


----------



## accountclosed2

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
yeah, wellington is walkable! we hope to be car free for a couple of years, renting when we want to go out and about. NZ has an organization called "plunket" where yo ucan rent car seats.

for this trip, our friend is renting a car seat for us and picking us up from the airport and also driving us to the yoga retreat out of town.

otherwise, walking, buses, and trains will do the trick. i think, though, that the trickiest is getting to the waldorf school. it's in lower hutt, so that means a train ride, but then i don't know how far the walk is to the school or what. hopefully, not far.









i'm so psyched.

Yep, Wellington is walkable, mostly. I don't drive, so it has to be







. We are ok, mostly. Though I would recommend buying or renting a car seat just to keep, so that your friends can pick you up sometimes. Thing is, It takes me over an hour and a train and a bus to get to Karori, which is only 15 min away by car. It would take longer walking, though. To get to a friend's place in Lower Hutt I need to take a train into town, then a train out to the Hutt, then a bus out to her place. It takes about an hour and a half. To Raphael House, well, it is out in Tirohanga. I don't know if there's a bus out there, can't find one. It isn't very far from central Hutt City, and Melling train station is just by the motorway (Tirohanga is on the other side of the motor way, up on a hill). Raphael House have the greatest school fairs (where, incidentially, we bumped into a lot of our friends, with toddlers and babies back in November), really lovely







!


----------



## accountclosed3

We're currently planning on keeping our car seat that we have now--it's great. but, we aren't taking it on this quick-trip.







too much baggage!

i'm so psyched. i need to PM you about get-togethers while we're there. and figure out how to get to that school. i read all of their newsletters on their web site, and of course we love the waldorf school here overall. their fair is really nice too.

i might be able to get a friend to give us a ride out there too.

i have so many things planned! i'm so excited about this business opportunity!


----------



## accountclosed2

Zoebird, one of my best mama friends used to teach at Raphael House (before her first child was born 3 years ago), and she is a Potty Babies mum too! Several of my friends plan for their children to go when they are older, and a lot of the Potty Babies mums are involved in a Steiner playgroup in town.

Bringing your own car seat is a good idea, especially if you want to rear-face past a year. Good car seats aren't very easy to get here, and no-one rear-faces past a year (I've been told to forward-face my 17 lb DD, just because she's over a year, and it is safer, right?







Never mind that her car-seat says not to forward-face in it before 26 lb...)

Yep, I look forward to meeting you too! BTW, there is a Potty Party on the 3rd of June if you are interested...

We've all been down with a cold this past week, first DH, then DD and last me. DD, as usual, was least sick, and DH worst!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I just choked down some kale!







:

Dealing with serious ammonia issues in cloth dipes right now, pulling out the big guns: Bi-O-Kleen Bac Out, washing every 2 days, line drying, AND adding oxygen cleaner. Have to laugh that the universe makes more work for me right now









Also, can anyone help me out over here?

What's new with everyone else? PiePie, hoping to get to read the story on lady bullying that you posted. Mean girls is a topic of particular interest to me.

Reading House on Mango Street. NOT helping my fears of poverty right now


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I just choked down some kale!







:

Dealing with serious ammonia issues in cloth dipes right now, pulling out the big guns: Bi-O-Kleen Bac Out, washing every 2 days, line drying, AND adding oxygen cleaner. Have to laugh that the universe makes more work for me right now









Also, can anyone help me out over here?

What's new with everyone else? PiePie, hoping to get to read the story on lady bullying that you posted. Mean girls is a topic of particular interest to me.

Reading House on Mango Street. NOT helping my fears of poverty right now









Funny, I came on MDC to find out what to do with my super stinky nappies! Wasn't expecting to find the answer in this thread! Should've know better.

House on Mango Street is a gorgeous book...

We're doing well. Getting decent sleeps most nights and DRY every night for a while now. Caught up with a girl I went to school with and who I've known since I was a babe but haven't seen in 15 years yesterday. She hasn't moved from the private school territory I used to inhabit and to be honest, I wasn't expecting much. She's awesome! Her babe is 3 weeks younger than S and she's a co-sleeping, breastfeeding, non-vaxing, gentle parenting devotee. I'm so so so happy to have reconnected. Facebook can be awesome!

Been working on some resentment issues (you may have noticed in the last few weeks







...) and mourning my loss of autonomy and now that I've managed to name it, I'm already feeling better about it. And DP has stepped up to the plate and is doing all she can to help me move forward positively.

Sebby just peed on our rug







He is nappiless on a giant rug of his own but manages to wriggle all the way over to get the non machine washable. Oh well. Better go clean it up.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Funny, I came on MDC to find out what to do with my super stinky nappies! Wasn't expecting to find the answer in this thread! Should've know better..

I strip ped them of the nasties before I started all of the preventative measures I mentioned. I strip by:
1) Cold wash with Charlie's soap
2) Hot wash with 1/4 c. borax, scoop of charlies soap and a bit of bleach. It's really hard on the dipes, so you don't want to do this often.
3) Hot wash with nothing

they're great right after I strip them, but we start getting ammonia problems the first pee after he poops in them. His diet makes for some pastey- hard-to-clean poop







. Are you rinsing with a sprayer first too? The poop, I mean. I didn't start this until after we started solids, but then it was crucial.

I'll report back on my success. It's so bad that we'll have to use disposies at night if I don't get this figured out.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Sister in labor on her own!!!!!
Going to hospital -so excited!







:


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Sister in labor on her own!!!!!
Going to hospital -so excited!







:

nak
Hope it's a quick and easy one!







:

Further to the name convo, thought Maela and PiePie and others might be interested in this.


----------



## ~Shanna~

She's a girl!!! Abigail Brooklyn! And...

I very nearly fainted







: I still don't feel quite right







. I was right, God puts that out of sight for a reason. But lord, I was back at home in bed by 2 am. My sister gits 'er done
















:


----------



## accountclosed3

congrats to your family for abigail brooklyn.









----

a/c: looks like we may take a trip to nelson afterall, but i'm not sure on dates yet. lets pm.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Finally getting back in my groove since the accident and, well, since pg. Ate healthy, got exercise and managed all of the herbals Im doing for strep. Going carless has meant that I've done what I always threated DH I'd do: I took Fenton to play at the nearby McMansion subdivisions private-looking playground. I'm sure someone will make trouble for me at some point over this, but I've got my gloves on. The whole concept is so unholy...Fenton loved it, and only wanted my help until a little 5-year-old named Colin showed up and I became chopped liver







. I love watching how independant he is.

So where does everyone go online to buy used baby carriers now? My link to babywearers is no good now, and I'm looking for a purdy german woven.

I made some peace with hospital births last night, hope to write more on it when Ihave more time. But my sister did everything abuot as opposite as I would, and...it was beautiful, she was strong and they were so kind to her. I know it works out different for others, but I had something exorcised out of me last night


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
So where does everyone go online to buy used baby carriers now? My link to babywearers is no good now, and I'm looking for a purdy german woven.

I've bought stuff FSOT on thebabywearer.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
I've bought stuff FSOT on thebabywearer.

My link was just bad, thanks.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~*
So where does everyone go online to buy used baby carriers now? My link to babywearers is no good now, and I'm looking for a purdy german woven.

So, I was going to say that I have one that's not getting any use, and you are welcome to buy it if you'd like. But.I.just.can't.do.it. too pretty. even if I'm not using it at all. what's wrong with me? At any rate, I got mine on ebay, new, for about 1/2 price. Good luck finding one.







(really, I would probably be willing to lend it to you, but suspect you may want one to keep as well. It's a Storch Anna, and I think it's 4.6m. Might be a little hard to do all of the carries with it. I've tried a back carry a couple times, and it seemed like I needed a little more length.

Thanks for posting your diaper washing and stripping routines. We are having some stink issues too, so i need to try some new stuff.

Quote:

I'm sure someone will make trouble for me at some point over this, but I've got my gloves on. The whole concept is so unholy...








:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~*
I made some peace with hospital births last night, hope to write more on it when Ihave more time. But my sister did everything abuot as opposite as I would, and...it was beautiful, she was strong and they were so kind to her. I know it works out different for others, but I had something exorcised out of me last night

Welcome to baby Abigail! Glad to hear this too. I'd love to hear more about it. And WOW, home by 2!!!?

Shanna, I am amazed with how well you are bouncing back from the accident.









I went to LLL mtg tonight, and one of the leaders asked if I'd be interested in becoming a leader. hmmm, I have to think about it. I feel very strongly about bfing, and love LLL, but I'm not sure if I'm leader material. Not to put myself down, but that's just something I've come to accept about my personality. Also, I feel like it would be hard for me to give advice to working mamas, since that's something I haven't been through. (I've never even used an electric pump







) But the other leaders do it, so I guess it's possible. Something to think about...

Maela, how is it going with your leader training?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I went to LLL mtg tonight, and one of the leaders asked if I'd be interested in becoming a leader. hmmm, I have to think about it. I feel very strongly about bfing, and love LLL, but I'm not sure if I'm leader material. Not to put myself down, but that's just something I've come to accept about my personality. Also, I feel like it would be hard for me to give advice to working mamas, since that's something I haven't been through. (I've never even used an electric pump







) But the other leaders do it, so I guess it's possible. Something to think about...

Maela, how is it going with your leader training?

I *completely* understand what you're saying. I sometimes think to myself: What the heck am I doing? I'm worried that I'm going to regret becoming a Leader. I'm worried that I don't always live up to all the ideals and that I will feel stressed out from all the work with more than one child and eventually homeschooling. But my leader now has two kids and she homeschools, so maybe I can do it too? Also, I'm shy and I have a hard time leading anything. I don't like to be the one in charge. So, basically, what am I doing?!














Anyway, I think that maybe my feelings will change once I'm thrown into the role and I'm used to mothering two children. If not, I can work through it for a few years and then decide to resign and help LLL in other ways. Because I really do think LLL is a great resource for mothers all over the world.

My work to become a leader is going very slloowwllyy. And I'm afraid part of it is because I'm unsure.







I think that I am going to dedicate a specific 2-3 hour block of time a week to it once Dh is done with the school year (next week BTW!














. I really want to have it finished before the baby is born.

Maev *did not* nurse last night!







: She woke up twice. She fussed and it seemed as though she was trying to get herself back to sleep, but she did not ask to nurse and I didn't offer. After a few minutes of fussing, I asked her if she wanted some water from her sippy cup. She said yes, drank huge gulps for a minute, and then fell asleep holding the cup both times. I'm trying not to get too excited about this just yet. Either way we're going to officially nightwean her next weekend when Dh's done with teaching. I have been telling her a story about a little girl wanting to nurse at night when she wakes up, but that her mama says she can have water and cuddles instead until it's not dark anymore. I was trying to prepare her. She's really interested in hearing the story several times a day and I think that maybe it's starting to stick and that is why she wasn't asking to nurse last night and trying to fall asleep on her own.







Not sure though.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
So, I was going to say that I have one that's not getting any use, and you are welcome to buy it if you'd like. But.I.just.can't.do.it. too pretty. even if I'm not using it at all. what's wrong with me? At any rate, I got mine on ebay, new, for about 1/2 price. Good luck finding one.







(really, I would probably be willing to lend it to you, but suspect you may want one to keep as well. It's a Storch Anna, and I think it's 4.6m. Might be a little hard to do all of the carries with it. I've tried a back carry a couple times, and it seemed like I needed a little more length.

Thanks for posting your diaper washing and stripping routines. We are having some stink issues too, so i need to try some new stuff.








:

Welcome to baby Abigail! Glad to hear this too. I'd love to hear more about it. And WOW, home by 2!!!?

Shanna, I am amazed with how well you are bouncing back from the accident.









I went to LLL mtg tonight, and one of the leaders asked if I'd be interested in becoming a leader. hmmm, I have to think about it. I feel very strongly about bfing, and love LLL, but I'm not sure if I'm leader material. Not to put myself down, but that's just something I've come to accept about my personality. Also, I feel like it would be hard for me to give advice to working mamas, since that's something I haven't been through. (I've never even used an electric pump







) But the other leaders do it, so I guess it's possible. Something to think about...

Maela, how is it going with your leader training?

I totally understand about reluctance to part with gorgeous, unused carriers. Took me months to part with my custom BabyHawk that I only used a few times. It was just too pretty. <sigh> I think I want this wrap - trying to decide between it and a bold red one. The decision is really about whether I want one that always coordinates with what I'm wearing, or if I want it to hide the boring stuff I usually wear.









Christina and Maela, I think your temperaments are a big reason _to_ become LLL leaders. I'm amazed at the diverse crowd our LLL draws, and much of it is because our leader isn't perfectly crunchy. I think a more calm, less holier-than-thou approach can serve a wider variety of situations, and I would never think that a WOHM couldn't be a great help to a SAHM, so I don't think it works the other way either. Most of LLL is collective trouble-shooting, so there's no reason to feel like it's you alone, leading a seminar. Would either of you be co-leading with someone else? That seems like a great way to make it a manageable job.

Maela, congrats on your first night without nursing! Your story idea is brilliant, I wish I had thought to do this. I made Fenton a "Fenton" story book a long time ago that ended with "and when Fenton was bigger, he could go night-night without having milk. Night Night Fenton!", but I never thought to construct it more specifically. It just occurred to me a couple of days ago that Fenton hasn't asked for Milk for weeks now.
















Having success with a new bedtime routine for night and nap: I read 3 books, sing 2 songs and then say "Mama needs to rest her words now", and we cuddle until he falls asleep. MUCH better than me singing him to sleep for sometimes up to 90 minutes. I'm so proud of him for getting to sleep just laying there. He has started this new ting where he tells me the order he wants things in, e.g "First read Puppies are Like That, then read Snoozers, 'kay?" He says the whole sentence in a normal voice, until he gets to "'kay?", which he says high-pitched. Does the same thing after he farts and says "Toot!" and then"excuse me" in a higher voice- took me a while to figure out that he's mimicking the way my voice must raise in pitch when I'm trying to encourage him: "okay?" and "Would you like to say 'excuse me'?" It's hilarious to see your own quirks reflected back to you









Went to get our belongings out of the totalled car today. It was even worse than I thought, with the under-chassis curling up into the trunk







. I was horrified, Fenton was fascinated by how "Mamas car is broke". He's been such a trooper, being fascinated by firemen and ambulences now







:







Such a brave little fella.

So...I've recovered from seeing my niece's birth







I now think that doctors and nurses are a cross between saints and aliens







. Much of what I knew about hospital birth was there and I wouldn't want it for myself (looking at a machine instead of at me, someone else telling me when to push, etc.). But it was much more tender and supportive than I pictured. They were all so kind to her, so genuinely excited when she made a lot of progress, so excited about this little baby girl. It was really beautiful to watch, and to know that this is exactly the birth my sister wants and that she gets to do it how she chooses. Since she got the epidural "late" (at 6 cm, instead of immediately at induction as with the first 2), she felt more of the movement and stretching than before. She had never felt the ring of fire before, and I was reminded of my own surprise that I had to just hang out with the stinging, baby half out, waiting for another contraction. It was almost comical, watching a veteran mom being shocked at child-birth







. But I was getting ready to pass out, so I didn't laugh...

I haven't shared my million-dollar story about my visit to the ER. When I was admitted, there were about 10 docs and nurses in the trauma room (2 of which seemed to be there solely because I am pg). The OB goes through her list of questions: Do I use drugs, do I have an STD...she asks if I drink and I say "I have about a half a glass a wine, maybe once a month." Absolute silence. She says "While pregnant????" and I say "yes". I am greeting by teh silence of being judged as a horrible mother. A few minutes later, they ask me where my pain is "on a scale of 1 to 10" and I say it's about a 2 or 3. A few minutes _later_ a nurse shows up with a bag for my IV and i stop her, saying I haven't discussed drugs with the doctor. She tells me it's "for my pain", and I ask her what it is. IT'S MORPHINE.







:
And _that's_ my issue with modern medicine.

Still having pain in my chin, I'm worried I cracked it or there's glass in it still







Going to see my doctor, but I'm certain I'll need an x-ray. Not sure how to proceed if that's the case. What a spectacular comedy this whole thing is









And....I think I've bored you all long enough


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna, I hear you on the whole medical world. Half a glass of wine a month is horrible while pregnant, but MORPHINE for a level 2 or 3 pain is okay? Overkill much?

The last two nights have been horrible. Rhea's had another cold, so it's been hard for her to nurse. And so she's now been biting me at night with her new teeth when trying to nurse. I kept trying to take off, tell her "no" and then put her back on because she's so hungry and tired. Every time I tell her no, she cries miserably







So anyway, last night, we moved to the other bedroom so DH could get some sleep (he had been at work from 7 am to 9:30 pm as they had an art show at school last night), and she kept biting me and grabbing at my nipple with her, and otherwise just taking my flesh off. And here's the worst part: I smacked her bottom once while saying "no biting!" I feel simply awful about it, though she didn't bite me again for the rest of the night. There has got to be a better way to do this, right?!?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
The last two nights have been horrible. Rhea's had another cold, so it's been hard for her to nurse. And so she's now been biting me at night with her new teeth when trying to nurse. I kept trying to take off, tell her "no" and then put her back on because she's so hungry and tired. Every time I tell her no, she cries miserably







So anyway, last night, we moved to the other bedroom so DH could get some sleep (he had been at work from 7 am to 9:30 pm as they had an art show at school last night), and she kept biting me and grabbing at my nipple with her, and otherwise just taking my flesh off. And here's the worst part: I smacked her bottom once while saying "no biting!" I feel simply awful about it, though she didn't bite me again for the rest of the night. There has got to be a better way to do this, right?!?

Oh sweetie







. I've come so close to being violent myself. I wonder if she's biting too because of the cold. I'm trying to remember what I did with Fenton when he had a cold - I think we had some luck trying to nurse more sitting up, so he could breathe better.

That feeling of rage when someone is hurting you is just so irrational. If you're worried you'll do it again, I wonder about lining up some other options that maybe aren't so paletable but are better than hitting: setting her down and going to "get a drink of water" (brilliant, Alice). Sometimes I w ould put Fenton over my shoulder and pat his back, grit my teeth and cheerfully say "Oh, I love you so much!". It got some of my aggression out and often helped me fake it till I made it. Probably a lot more ideas over in the nursing issues forum?


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
she kept biting me and grabbing at my nipple

It also helps to have something biteable around to shove, I mean gently place into her mouth as soon as you get your nipple out. wooden rattle, frozen washcloth, we also have a silicone toothbrush that looks like a banana that J loves to chew. Also, for J "no biting" sounds like "blahblah *BITING*!!!







" So this way I can say "We don't bite people, we bite *banana*" or "we bite *pillow*" or whatever.
I also try to immediately put the boobie away. That buys me some extra time before he can latch on again. Makes him have to ask to nurse again and wait for me to pull it back out. Sort of a little speed bump that sometimes helps him to realize whether he is hungry and is ready to actually nurse or if he'd rather just lay their and chew for a while.
Sometimes I have to just quit trying to nurse him to sleep and get up and walk around singing and patting for a while. After a bit of that he's ready to lay down and seriously nurse.

Do you have a humidifier going, that helps us with cold type stuff? Also, some sort of chest rub? We use this stuff- http://health-and-beauty.become.com/...es--c205252490


----------



## witchygrrl

the humidifier hasn't made much of a difference for her--I think the room is too big to do enough, honestly. the shower works better, but so temporary. I will look into the chest rub--all I have in the house is Vicks, and that's not a good idea.

good ideas, both of you. we shall see what happens tonight, but I was at my rope's end last night.

Also, we need to look into bed rails.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
It also helps to have something biteable around to shove, I mean gently place into her mouth as soon as you get your nipple out. wooden rattle, frozen washcloth, we also have a silicone toothbrush that looks like a banana that J loves to chew. Also, for J "no biting" sounds like "blahblah *BITING*!!!







" So this way I can say "We don't bite people, we bite *banana*" or "we bite *pillow*" or whatever.

yeah that


----------



## Maela

Third night in a row of no nursing with very minimal crying!







: Last two nights she's only woken up once. Last night she didn't even need the sippy cup, just George (her curious george stuffed monkey). I can't believe how well this is going.









*Shanna*, that's pretty crazy about the wine and morphine. My jaw dropped.








To answer your question, I would be co-leading my Group for at least a little while with 2-3 other leaders. So it won't be that hard in the beginning I guess. The thing that scares me is that they have all been leading for a long time now and I'm getting the feeling like they want to be moving on to something else in the next couple of years. But maybe I'll be used to it by then...
I don't know if I said this yet or not, but Congrats on your new niece!! I'm glad your sister had the birth she wanted and everything went well.

My cousin just had her second baby a week ago. she also wanted the epidural, but things moved too fast! I'm kind of glad because when I talked to her on the phone she sounded so happy and empowered. And nursing is going really well for her compared to last time (I think? partly due to the lack of pain med and the baby is ~2lbs bigger than her last).
My other friend has a 9 week old and says nursing is going really well too.







: She said she never had any problems from day 1! I wasn't even sure if she was going to bf, so hearing that made me SO happy.

*Witchy*, I'm sorry you had such a rough night. It's so hard to stay patient when they're hurting you.









*MMM*, thanks for sharing about that Irish name book. I think I need it.









A week from today is our u/s - the only one we're getting for the rest of the pg, so this baby had better have his/her legs open!! I'm very excited and of course a little nervous. I just want baby to be healthy. I'll be happy no matter what gender it is. If it's a boy, we'll need some new clothes and I'll need info from you moms of boys on taking care of the intact penis. If it's a girl, figuring out the name is going to be tough...


----------



## PiePie

*Maela*, I take it you already have a boy name from your pregnancy with Maev? I love Aine for your girl -- goes so well with maev.


----------



## ~Shanna~

It makes me crazy how much food toddlers waste.


----------



## witchygrrl

Alice, I found a similar product at Whole Foods, so I've been using that on her. I definitely think it helps. She hasn't been biting me since, either, so that makes the whole thing easier. But I feel like I have tools to use now. I have a pretty long fuse, and now that it went off, I can kinda start over again.

I saw a pregnant woman out and about today--she said she was due yesterday







She asked about my sling, saying that one of her friends gave her one, and wanted to know if I liked it or not. I told her I loved it, and encouraged her to definitely give it a shot.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~*
Christina and Maela, I think your temperaments are a big reason to become LLL leaders. I'm amazed at the diverse crowd our LLL draws, and much of it is because our leader isn't perfectly crunchy. I think a more calm, less holier-than-thou approach can serve a wider variety of situations, and I would never think that a WOHM couldn't be a great help to a SAHM, so I don't think it works the other way either. Most of LLL is collective trouble-shooting, so there's no reason to feel like it's you alone, leading a seminar. Would either of you be co-leading with someone else? That seems like a great way to make it a manageable job.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela*
To answer your question, I would be co-leading my Group for at least a little while with 2-3 other leaders. So it won't be that hard in the beginning I guess. The thing that scares me is that they have all been leading for a long time now and I'm getting the feeling like they want to be moving on to something else in the next couple of years. But maybe I'll be used to it by then...

I'm pretty sure I would be co-leading as well. The main leader at my group has been a leader for a while, and her youngest is 10 now. So I'm guessing she might want to move on too. I agree that it's good to have leaders who aren't totally crunchy, but I think the issue is that I tend to be a bit judgmental. And I also worry that I'm being judged, so I then feel responsible for people's perceptions. Something to work on, I guess.

Maela, I think it's good to take the leader work slowly. I'm pretty sure that's what I would do, and that way maybe you'll feel more sure about it once you get through. Good luck with your u/s next week!

Shanna, your ER story is crazy!

Witchy, sorry about the rough night - glad that she hasn't bitten since then. I was thinking something similar to what Alice said. I get the impression that when J bites, she is done nursing. But I think even if she is still hungry, her need to bite/chew is more immediate than her hunger, so I try to address that first. Then, she is usually a little more calm when she's ready to try nursing again.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I totally understand about reluctance to part with gorgeous, unused carriers. Took me months to part with my custom BabyHawk that I only used a few times. It was just too pretty. <sigh> I think I want this wrap - trying to decide between it and a bold red one. The decision is really about whether I want one that always coordinates with what I'm wearing, or if I want it to hide the boring stuff I usually wear.










That's a beautiful wrap. I don't think you can go wrong with any of them, they are all so gorgeous. I really wish there were more fabrics out there that were as beautifully made. I like the idea of using these as scarves. Hmmm&#8230;


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
worry that I'm being judged, so I then feel responsible for people's perceptions. Something to work on, I guess.

This is so me.


----------



## Maela

4 nights in a row of no nursing!!


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, on the LLL leader thing, i think you do have the personality to be a leader. i think your self-perception as introverted as not how you come across IRL. i think the lack of knowledge relevant to WOH is real but would be true for almost anyone with the time to be a leader, sadly. my city has like 10 LLL groups, and only 1 is led by a WOHM, and i would argue that she really didn't face the true challenges with regard to nursing as 1. she went back to work relatively late in the game, and 2. she worked relatively few hours, no where near 40 hours a week -- which i think is a whole different kettle of fish. i think that in the absence of experience, LLL leaders need to be non-judgmental toward WOHMs. i had a very bad LLL experience the first time I first went -- you could sense the scorn of the SAHM leaders toward all of the new moms, all of whom needed to go back to work. i think just echoing that it could be done and pointing to resources, like _nursing mother, working mother,_ or the working mamas forum here, would have been the best they could have done in terms of knowledge, but what was really needed was a welcoming attitude. and other stuff that is generally ap but especially important for working mamas like cosleeping and slinging.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i had a very bad LLL experience the first time I first went -- you could sense the scorn of the SAHM leaders toward all of the new moms, all of whom needed to go back to work.









I can't believe you would go through all the hoops of becoming a leader and not know how destructive this is.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Am I the only one who checks here to see if anyone has posted even if I have nothing to say?


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Am I the only one who checks here to see if anyone has posted even if I have nothing to say?









I check too! I just -don't- post that much.
But since I am here I'll mentione that J is turning 2 tomorrow and has chicken pox. He's totally great though. No fever, not tired, barely itching at all. If he's cleared up enough by Friday to not be contagious anymore we are going to Ocean City, MD for the weekend.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
I check too! I just post that much.
But since I am here I'll mentione that J is turning 2 tomorrow and has chicken pox. He's totally great though. No fever, not tired, barely itching at all. If he's cleared up enough by Friday to not be contagious anymore we are going to Ocean City, MD for the weekend.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY J!!!

Glad to hear that the chicken pox is going well!

I also come here several times a day to check.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
I check too! I just post that much.
But since I am here I'll mentione that J is turning 2 tomorrow and has chicken pox. He's totally great though. No fever, not tired, barely itching at all. If he's cleared up enough by Friday to not be contagious anymore we are going to Ocean City, MD for the weekend.

Congrats on both! I'm hoping Fenton gets Cp naturally, but it seems less and less likely.

Hey everyone, I had sex this week!!!!! It's big news, trust me......


----------



## witchygrrl

I check several times a day too...just don't always have something to say.









woot, shanna! I wish I could say that! I can't remember the last time....


----------



## Maela

Maev slept in her own bed the whole night last night.







: She woke up once at 4AM. I cuddled with her for a few minutes and she fell back asleep. It's been a week since she's nursed at night.

Okay, I'm going to stop giving daily updates now....


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Am I the only one who checks here to see if anyone has posted even if I have nothing to say?









I do this too, even if I do need to post something but don't have the time to write it out.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev slept in her own bed the whole night last night.







: She woke up once at 4AM. I cuddled with her for a few minutes and she fell back asleep. It's been a week since she's nursed at night.

Okay, I'm going to stop giving daily updates now....









That's great! Update all you want....I like hearing about it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
I check too! I just -don't- post that much.
But since I am here I'll mentione that J is turning 2 tomorrow and has chicken pox. He's totally great though. No fever, not tired, barely itching at all. If he's cleared up enough by Friday to not be contagious anymore we are going to Ocean City, MD for the weekend.

Glad it's going well for him so far. If you make the trip, you'll probably pass right by our house. Feel free to stop by. We're right about at the 1/2 way point. (assuming you're driving...) I guess J's bday party is cancelled (?). I think I've decided to just go to my friend's shower for the day - possibly taking the train. Josephine and DH are going to have a fun day. <nailbiting>







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
That's great! Update all you want....I like hearing about it.









I like hearing the updates too - I'm so glad it's going so well for you. I'm inspired on the bed issue - it's getting harder for me to cuddle Fenton all night like he likes, so I think about him being in his own bed. But he really does seem to need body contact all night long, so I think we're probably pointed toward he and Daddy in one room, and me and Ku in another. I'm okay with that, I think Brandon is okay with that. Trying to steel myself for the strong opinions from folks whose business it ain't.

Fenton told me today that he has a "baby in Fenton's tummy." A "brother or sister".









And on sex: I _do_ remember the last time we did. It was 17 weeks ago on Monday







I see the statistics on 2.3 times per week and I think "Who _are_ these people?" My hsuband would think I was a sex _machine_ if we did it that often...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

DS is 5 months today and I cannot, honestly, remember the last time we had sex. It was well before DS was born







- Cannot imagine when it might happen in the near future either because DS has become like a magnet and I am not getting ANY time without him on my body. Tired today. Think I'm going on a total elimination diet because I cannot cope with waking up every 20 mins like we did last night and there has to be a cause of SUCH shitty sleep. Beyond that, I'm seriously contemplating giving up on co-sleeping and the only reason I'm not more into the idea of sleep training is because I'm too tired and impatient to do it.

These are the days where I'm sure that DS will be an only child...and that I am definitely going back to work in November!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
DS is 5 months today and I cannot, honestly, remember the last time we had sex. It was well before DS was born







- Cannot imagine when it might happen in the near future either because DS has become like a magnet and I am not getting ANY time without him on my body. Tired today. Think I'm going on a total elimination diet because I cannot cope with waking up every 20 mins like we did last night and there has to be a cause of SUCH shitty sleep. Beyond that, I'm seriously contemplating giving up on co-sleeping and the only reason I'm not more into the idea of sleep training is because I'm too tired and impatient to do it.

These are the days where I'm sure that DS will be an only child...and that I am definitely going back to work in November!

Oh sweetie...








I'd be shocked if it's not food sensitivities - I've never seen a "poor sleeper" (especially that co-sleeps) where I wasn't convinced it was the case. If you're hesitant about the elmin. diet, maybe try going casein and gluten-free first. It's less of a commitment, and has decent odds of pulling out the offending food. It's still tough, but easier to commit to than the Big 8. I've had nights like that too and it made me a crazy monster







. Even the Geneva Conventions acknowledges it for the torture it is.

On sex, this issue came up at our Mothering conference a couple of weeks ago, and we all agreed that we didn't know anyone who did it twice a week. But one of the ladies said that she had a friend who said it had been a year for her, and everyone but me was appalled. I don't think I've ever gone a whole year, but I've come _way_ closer to that than 2.3 times a week. WAY closer. I haven't been in any place where I've felt we could have an honest discussion about the biological reality of why our bodies probably don't want sex when we're rearing young children. It's just so socially pervasive that sex defines intimacy with your (monogamous) partner - to suggest that consistent, frequent sexual contact isn't normal for a mother borders on treason in this culture. There are times where I understand serial monogamy or polygamy simply from the biological standpoint of how the differing sexual needs of 2 monogamous people in a long-term relationship cannnot be consistently met while gestating, birthing and raising children. It makes perfect sense to me that I wouldn't have sex for the next 3-4 years. Anyway, WOO HOO!, for me this week. Hoping some of those 2nd trimester hormones I had last time kick in...


----------



## Maela

*Sex*: I think I might have mentioned this before, but we try to DTD 2x a week. Usually we succeed.







But that doesn't mean I think everyone should do/want that. It's just good for us (dh and I). I did definitely notice a decrease in my sex drive after giving birth to DD up until I was ~10 weeks pg with #2. Now it's back up, and I'm loving it! We do it the same amount, but it's easier for me to "get in the mood" and I look forward to it. Before I got pg the second time, it was kind of more like "I'm not really feeling in the mood, but I'm going to because I know I'll be happy about it afterwards" Like exercising or something...


----------



## Rico'sAlice

We DTD a few times per week... and then not again for a couple of months. If I can manage once, then I tend to want more. But if it's been a while it's like I forget it even exists. And honestly the only times when it's been truly enthusiastic on my end is when I've been drinking.








I think part of the problem aside from the hormones are that I like a long, long lead up. I don't specifically mean foreplay. But rather spending the day together, teasing each other, romantic dinner, etc. And that part is what is pretty much impossible. We can find time enough to "get 'er done." But there's generally rushing involved somewhere in the process.

I find though that our actual _intimacy_ now come in relation to Johannes. Things like realizing we are both awake in bed watching him sleep and then we make eye contact and smile.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, i had a hard time getting back into it after dd was born. there was fear, there was tiredness, there were logistical issues due to cosleeping and different schedules. you just gotta jump back in! i don't mean forcing yourself if you don't want to, but i do mean making it a goal. it gets easier once the naps consolidate, especially for those of us who need more lead up time.

it is still not enough of a goal for us (2x a week would be my goal). and thanks to those of you who admit that it doesn't happen as much as it "should" according to whatever.

i totally agree with *alice* re better bond through dc.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
We DTD a few times per week... and then not again for a couple of months. If I can manage once, then I tend to want more. But if it's been a while it's like I forget it even exists. And honestly the only times when it's been truly enthusiastic on my end is when I've been drinking.








I think part of the problem aside from the hormones are that I like a long, long lead up. I don't specifically mean foreplay. But rather spending the day together, teasing each other, romantic dinner, etc. And that part is what is pretty much impossible. We can find time enough to "get 'er done." But there's generally rushing involved somewhere in the process.

I find though that our actual _intimacy_ now come in relation to Johannes. Things like realizing we are both awake in bed watching him sleep and then we make eye contact and smile.

This is my experience almost exactly. Except I'd replace "drinking" with "pregnant"







I'm definately feeling that 2nd trimester







, but the logistics are difficult. Only opportunity is night when we're both exhausted and I'm a bit nauseous. I've considered putting on a video for 20 minutes in the am, but like Alice said, I'm just not a 20 minute kind of gal...

Any thoughts on what learning to use the potty looks like if you dont' want to do a reward system like stickers or candy? I don't know why I'm not big on that, just a gut feeling that it's weird. But I've never seen it done any other way. Holiztic, isn't Quinn out of dipes? Katt, I remember you saying Teo just got more and more interested? I'm not really interested in pushing it, but he's rather plateued in his interest, e.g. that "use the potty" means "take my diaper off so I can run around naked and yell 'Naked Baby!' Oh, and poop on the floor".








I just wonder what it might look like to help him be out of dipes before he's 18









Scheduled surgery for Dec 4th. I never left Fenton that young, Ku will likely be a month or two old. I should only be gone for 6 hours, but...







Trying to fenangle an whole appt with the anesth. to discuss options, but he seems to think it's unnecessary. But I'm way more stubborn than an overpaid anesth.


----------



## Sihaya

Soaking it all in, but not a lot of time to post.

*Shanna* - I thought Diaper-Free before 3 was a nice middle ground between ECing and mainstream reward-based methods. I got the book from the library, but then damaged it







:, so I can lend it to you if you'd like. We're not really doing anything with the potty right now, but I want him dry during the day in about a year and dry at night in less than two, so we'll be revisiting it soon.


----------



## Maela

I'll have to check that book out. I'm also looking for a way to kind of encourage it a little more without using stickers, etc. We did have some chocolate covered raisins in our bathroom that I have used just to get her to sit on the potty and try. If she didn't want to leave what she doing, but I know she had to go, I might say "I think there might be some choc raisins in the bathroom."







: I never said, "You can get one of these if you go potty." But I feel like it's really the same thing and I really don't like doing that . I never planned on using rewards to PL, I just sort of fell into it.







The good thing is that now she seems to be fine going most of the time and she rarely asks for them anymore. So I feel lucky...


----------



## Rico'sAlice

J was EC'd until 10months, and once he started walking refused to go potty anymore. We just got back into it around Thanksgiving. When he was in hard core refusal mode I would keep a special snack (ok, it was my papya enzyme pills







) in the bathroom and I would never promise them or anything but he knew that having one while on the potty was part of the routine.
Now, I try to focus on the inherent rewards. "It feels so nice to let all the pee out in the potty." "Look how fun to dump out the potty and flush the toilet." Sometimes we read books.
I think at this point though J totally knows the whole premise and routine and just has no motivation. Like if anything more itneresting is going on he uses his diaper. It's probably confusing to him to b/c I am not consistent in my expectations/reminders/helping. I think that I may decide to just stop using diapers at some point now that the weather is warm and hope that he decides it is faster/easier to use the potty than to get changed all of the time. I am going to be at my mom's for three weeks in June and her BFs granddaughter who lives with them is a bit ahead of J in this area and maybe she will inspire him.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Rico'sAlice* 
Like if anything more itneresting is going on he uses his diaper. It's probably confusing to him to b/c I am not consistent in my expectations/reminders/helping. I think that I may decide to just stop using diapers at some point now that the weather is warm and hope that he decides it is faster/easier to use the potty than to get changed all of the time.

All of this is true for us too. I also think that I just need to commit to underwear full time. my mom said that was what worked the easiest with us (3 kids).

It's a boy!! The u/s tech was very sure and we got a picture that's very obvious. I think that everything looked healthy too! We'll know for sure when my mw gets the results. That's the only thing I'm worried about anyway. So yay!! we found out! woo hoo!

His name is Jaim Allen G_______. We've had Jaim picked out since before getting pg the first time. Allen is my dad's middle name.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
It's a boy!! The u/s tech was very sure and we got a picture that's very obvious. I think that everything looked healthy too! We'll know for sure when my mw gets the results. That's the only thing I'm worried about anyway. So yay!! we found out! woo hoo!

His name is Jaim Allen G_______. We've had Jaim picked out since before getting pg the first time. Allen is my dad's middle name.

Hurray!!!!!







:

Is it pronounced "Jame"?

DH I suspect doesn't think much about baby names. My evil plan is to keep quiet to birth day, pull my names out and say "Well, what have _you_ got?". Not sure if I'm kidding or not







. His tepidness on most names is frustrating.

I'm violating my intense superstition in asking this: If you saw a name printed as "Noel", what would your gut tell you in pronouncing it?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hurray!!!!!







:

Is it pronounced "Jame"?

DH I suspect doesn't think much about baby names. My evil plan is to keep quiet to birth day, pull my names out and say "Well, what have _you_ got?". Not sure if I'm kidding or not







. His tepidness on most names is frustrating.

I'm violating my intense superstition in asking this: If you saw a name printed as "Noel", what would your gut tell you in pronouncing it?

Yes, it's pronounced like "James" without the 's'. We have gotten quite a few negative reactions, but we don't care. SIL said she liked it - whether she does or not, it was nice to hear.







I think it sounds like such a strong name for a boy, but that's because the character in the book we got it from is that way.

I'm very excited to NOT circ!

I would probably at first pronounce it No-el until I got used to it. I believe that my great-grandfather's name was Noel though.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

DH I suspect doesn't think much about baby names. My evil plan is to keep quiet to birth day, pull my names out and say "Well, what have _you_ got?". Not sure if I'm kidding or not







. His tepidness on most names is frustrating.

I'm violating my intense superstition in asking this: If you saw a name printed as "Noel", what would your gut tell you in pronouncing it?

Noel I would unquestionably pronounce as one syllable, as in knoll.

And I think we are married to the same man! It drives me batty!! Except that my DH would never agree to a name that was "mine." His given reason is that the kids will have my last name (which, hello, was at his suggestion).


----------



## PiePie

Also I would be rhyming Noel with Joel, which I always thought was monosyllabic because that's who Caucausian evangelicals pronounce it, at least in Western New York. Until I went to law school in Chicago and discovered that in the African American community it is pronounced Jo-EL. Who knew.


----------



## PiePie

So I asked my DH about your evil plan. He thinks it's a good strategy. he thinks there is a good chance your DH will have nothing, and you'll win. He also thinks there is a good chance your DH will start thinking about names in the last week, but before that he wouldn't have to be bothered with forcing conversations on him he doesn't want.


----------



## Sihaya

*Maela* - A boy - so exciting!

*Shanna* - I would pronounce it "knoll", but that's our pastor's name, so I'm probably not a good representation of the average person off the street.


----------



## Maela

Shanna, just wanted to add that I do like the name Noel. Do you have a middle name idea to go with it?

Thanks everyone for all the name ideas, BTW. I'm so glad I don't have to worry about it anymore. It was too hard to decide.









We went to a baseball game last night and our car got broken into.







They took our GPS thingy and our owner's manual that had our insurance and registration papers in it. So now I have to file a police report, call the DMV, call the insurance co. and worry about someone having our info.







: Luckily we were with friends so we switched Dd's carseat to their car because our window was smashed and we had to drive for 40 minutes at night to get home.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Until I went to law school in Chicago and discovered that in the African American community it is pronounced Jo-EL. Who knew.

I never knew that. But I do feel intensely midwestern when Joel comes out so "Jole!" out of my mouth.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
So I asked my DH about your evil plan. He thinks it's a good strategy. he thinks there is a good chance your DH will have nothing, and you'll win. He also thinks there is a good chance your DH will start thinking about names in the last week, but before that he wouldn't have to be bothered with forcing conversations on him he doesn't want.









I've already confessed the plan to DH, so it's not so diabiolical. But it is fairly evil, as it preys on his guilt of watching me labor for hours.







Which, frankly, I think is fair. I consider the laboring Mamas vote to be AT LEAST 51%.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Shanna, just wanted to add that I do like the name Noel. Do you have a middle name idea to go with it?

I do - DHs middle name. Which, oddly, he's fighting me on. He's really uncomfortable with naming children after onesself. Which is funny, he was fine with Fenton getting his Dads name as a middle name. I think he put it in terms of honoring someone versus narcissm. I might agree, except DH has a GREAT middle name. Wish I could talk him into it for a first name. Which, the concensus of anyone I've ever mentioned that to, is "Oh my, give it to the _second_ born son????







"







People are so funny.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
We went to a baseball game last night and our car got broken into.







They took our GPS thingy and our owner's manual that had our insurance and registration papers in it. So now I have to file a police report, call the DMV, call the insurance co. and worry about someone having our info.







: Luckily we were with friends so we switched Dd's carseat to their car because our window was smashed and we had to drive for 40 minutes at night to get home.

I'm so sorry. I'm glad things worked out so well with having Maev's carseat though. I've been shocked by how much paperwork things like that (like our accident) will generate. Just a big PITA, besides how scary the situation might have been. Which, slightly off topic, I am how committed to making sure my DH knows how to competently put the car seat in the car. So far, I'm the only one who was "trained " on how to do it. This made for a nightmarish situation at the ER when we had to move Fenton's carseat to DHs car, and I couldn't do it. Eventually got a carseat tech down from the maternity ward to help him, and now I'm on a mission to make sure he knows how to do it too. Which would have been prudent anyway, but just never seemed urgent....

Sooo...broke the seal on my libido last night. May have created a monster









Thanks for all the feedback on the pronounciation issue. I hate that it's such a big issue for me - I just hate to bequeth to my son a legacy of "It's KNOLL, and I'm not a girl". Anyone see the episode of Friends where Pheobe names her daughter Chandler? "Chandlers a girl! Chandler's a girl!".

Took Fenton to a homeopath for support on his digestion. And she told me how precocious he is







. She is SUCH a great doctor







Hoping to see a little improvement for him







:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I just hate to bequeth to my son a legacy of "It's KNOLL, and I'm not a girl". Anyone see the episode of Friends where Pheobe names her daughter Chandler? "Chandlers a girl! Chandler's a girl!".

I know this will be us. "It's Jaim not Jane, and I'm not a girl."


----------



## Maela

Happy Birthday to me.







I have the worst flu I've had since probably kindergarten. It started yesterday at 5PM, and it's just now slowing down (I think). I couldn't even keep water down last night.

My best gift so far has been DD and dh singing happy birthday to me this morning!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Happy birthday Maela! So sorry you're sick







. DH is coming down with something to







. All together now: "Oh, come ON







:"









I need some opinions over here, if you have time and interest. It's about birth announcements.


----------



## cking

I'm sorry you're sick too Maela. Hope you had a Happy Birthday anyway.









I like the name you've picked for your little boy!









I did it! I took a solo road trip yesterday and was away from dd for over 9 hours. and we both survived. It was nice to have a little break, but I did miss her. And I think she would have had fun playing with my friend's nieces.









Shanna, I'm pretty sure I would pronounce it Knoll. I like it either way, really. I think it would have to have the accent on the e for me to say No-ELL.


----------



## Maela

I'm feeling much better today; still a little queasy and weak though. We were just about to go out to dinner with my parents though when Dd threw up. I feel so bad for her. I really hope she doesn't have it as bad as I did. And I really wish I had breastmilk right now.







She nursed to sleep and is still sleeping now. Poor thing.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I'm sorry you're sick too Maela. Hope you had a Happy Birthday anyway.









I like the name you've picked for your little boy!









Thank you!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I did it! I took a solo road trip yesterday and was away from dd for over 9 hours. and we both survived. It was nice to have a little break, but I did miss her. And I think she would have had fun playing with my friend's nieces.









Yay! I'm glad it went well.

ETA: *Shanna*, how is your dh?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Glad you're feeling better Maela. Sorry though that Maev is now miserable. And YAY for Jaim. I'm glad you're through the name pain.

I've got a horrible cold so my lovely DP stayed home and I have the day off.







(I know that when she gets sick, however, that I'll be all about the 'oh, come on!!!') I'm just checking in here and going back to bed.







: It's awesome. There's a stupid little niggling thought in the back of my mind flashing 'swine flu' at me. Of course I don't have swine flu but there have been 13 cases in our area (literally, at the local schools) so my hypochondria is rife!


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, love the name for your baby boy! That sucks about the break-in though...I've had that happen, so I know how gut wrenching it can be. And happy belated birthday.

Hope all the sick people recover soon!

We went to VT to visit the in-laws. I decided to lend my MIL _In Defense of Food_ since she's all about health, though she has this habit of not reading ingredient labels.







I'm hoping she will learn from the book--I know I did!

Rhea was teething again all weekend, so she's now on tooth number three. She slept badly, which meant I slept badly. MMM, I totally hear you! But honestly, even when Rhea's sleeping well, I'm still having a tough time. I'm not entirely sure why, but it's really affecting me. But I'm hoping we can get a teething break soon, for all of us. Not likely, as I can see a fourth getting ready to break through any minute.


----------



## PiePie

reading _You Are Your Child's First Teacher_ and hating it. not only is it super anti-working mom (very common in the AP/GD genre) but it is very anti-gifted child. I never thought Waldorf fit my disposition but this really takes the cake. I feel like I need to keep reading it because it's for my parenting book club.

the stress of being a working mom is killing me.

i came here to solicit opinions: water guns -- pro? con? why? i know dd is still way to young but i like to live in the future.


----------



## witchygrrl

I'm pro water gun, but only because I had soooo much fun with them as a kid. I think they can be played without the emphasis on pretend "killing".

PiePie, I think that it's important to read books outside our comfort zone, if only to be able to say for certain that you do disagree with the author, and why. But yeah, I know what you mean...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
reading _You Are Your Child's First Teacher_ and hating it. not only is it super anti-working mom (very common in the AP/GD genre) but it is very anti-gifted child. I never thought Waldorf fit my disposition but this really takes the cake. I feel like I need to keep reading it because it's for my parenting book club.

I completely forgot how anti-WOHM the book was. I am so sorry that I didn't warn you







: I noticed at the time and was a bit...surprised







. As for my self-centered reaction to it, I just couldn't get over how not-inspiration it was for such a great title. But how did you think it was anti-gifted child? I have some arm-chair opinions about this that are not at all well-researched or thought out...









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
the stress of being a working mom is killing me.

Is it the trying to do too much, or the working itself that is so tough right now? I can definately see how crucial it is to have the right supportive job to be a WOHM, and how rare. When I think of all of the moms who feel as you do, I can't believe how rare it is to find a job supportive of WOHMs. The invisible hand has definately NOT improved things for workers, mamas or otherwise.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i came here to solicit opinions: water guns -- pro? con? why? i know dd is still way to young but i like to live in the future.









Pro to both (water guns and living in the future







). It''s probably not as far off as you might think - I just got one for Fenton. I've agonized over the weapon issue, and have ended up coming down trusting Fenton to know the difference between violent play and violence. I do have some concerns about making a toy of a weapon he could likely encounter at a friends house or what-not (we do live in Michigan) - just the safety issues of not having guns be taboo. I have a friend, middle aged gay man, who has been closely involved with raising the son of his very liberal best friend. He told me he has been amazed by how natural deestruction is to little boys. I have to say that in watching my niece, nephew and son grow that his words ring true: "YOu can have a little boy raised by the most peace-loving, pacifist vegans in the world, and he's _still_ going to take that sustainably-farmed incense stick and fashion it into a weapon!"







I think it may be true of children in general, and it takes some pressure off me to think it's a natural exploration and perhaps not a pathology. Sort of like the legos-on-the-penis issue I'm dealing with







.

But...I think water guns are fun







But you could have similar fun with something else. Like those eyewash water bottles come to mind, they can shoot a good distance.

The article in Mothering a few months back on the violent play issue was decent. DH grew up with the rule that he could have weapons, but he couldn't use them against people. I don't necessarily agree with this particular rule (Makes water guns incredibly boring), but I admired the spirit of setting some guidelines.


----------



## PiePie

yeah, i wasn't thinking actual gun in the sense of being shaped like an L, but more of a squirter. it still feels wrong to me somehow. the list of toys i come up with that would be cool for her far exceeds the number we actually get, due to $, space, and the sheer difficulty of keeping them organized.


----------



## Maela

Sorry to be "me, me, me" again, but I'm just interrupting to give an update on Dd. She only threw up 3 times last night (as opposed to my 10) and she hasn't had any diarrhea (also different from me







), so







:. She spent from 5PM to 8AM mostly sleeping. Today she woke up cheerful and hungry. We tried to make sure she didn't overdo it with the eating, but it's so hard to deny your child food when they are hungry. No throwing up today though so that's great. She still seemed not quite herself, but I have a feeling that tomorrow she'll be fine again.

I am feeling almost back to normal and Dh has not gotten it yet and hopefully won't. We're going to try for the third time tomorrow to celebrate my birthday.









Also, I like water guns.







I saw some cool squirter things the other day that looked less like guns and more like... I don't know, pumps? Anyway, I'll look for something like that as opposed to those ones that look exactly like guns (in shape _and_ color).

MW appt tomorrow. Should get full results from u/s. Hopefully, everything is well. I'm just a little nervous because this was the u/s during which they found the cysts on Dd's brain. I know this little guy doesn't have them (they told me that), but I want to hear that everything else is fine too. Like the heart; the tech spent some time looking at the heart and it seemed like it took forever. Just like when they looked at Dd's brain. I may just be over-anxious; I hope so.


----------



## cking

WTH?:

http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/...Id=533870#tabs


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
WTH?:

http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/...Id=533870#tabs









: I've seen this before. The first time I saw it I couldn't stop laughing for a half an hour. I just kept picturing it in my head and I'd burst out laughing. How ridiculous is that?

Thanks for the reminder!


----------



## PiePie

Parents here. Shocked I never developed a full-fledged eating disorder after observing my mom attempt to do battle with my daughter.


----------



## witchygrrl

oh my god--I can't believe someone thought that was a viable solution!!!!!!!

Maela, how was your appt?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
oh my god--I can't believe someone thought that was a viable solution!!!!!!!

Maela, how was your appt?

Oh yeah, I forgot to say that everything is just fine.







:


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Parents here. Shocked I never developed a full-fledged eating disorder after observing my mom attempt to do battle with my daughter.

I'm sorry. I hope you survived the visit.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oh yeah, I forgot to say that everything is just fine.







:

Hooray!


----------



## PiePie

parents' visit was actually excellent. i was just very aware of how not gd they are, and how excessively imho safety-conscious my mom is. we have dd wear a helmet when she rides her tricycle to condition her that bikes=helmets. so my mom saw that when dd was biking ot the playground, where she climbs like a 5 yo, and said, "a helmet for the playground, good, she needs it!" i would be more worried about how un-gd and un-up they are if they were around more often. but really dd sees them so little i don't think it will harm her. my mom was trying to get her to finish the food on her plate and dd looked at her and as if to say, "why are you acting so weird?"







my mom also was in check. she did make one comment re cosleeping about how the doctors put the fear of god into them when i was born about that. and a lot of comments along the lines of why don't you bathe this child every day. but really they were awesome with her. the first thing dd said when she woke up sunday morning was a great big smile and "bahbum!" (her name for my dad, i think it is a permutation of grandmom, which was always grandmom and grandpa). she likes to hug my mom but really grandpa is the apple of her eye. which sort of hurts my mom but he interacts more with her and is more physically adventurous so there you have it. i think my mom was also relieved that i put her in a flowered dress with matching bloomers and sunbonnet -- that was more like how she dressed me.

dd seems to be between sizes on shoes. the 6 skr come off of her.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*, glad to hear the visit went well!

Maev also loves both of her Papas. She'll go to them over the grandmas almost every time.

Yesterday, the "teacher" in our church nursery told us that Maev told her the color of something was "blackish-brownish." Isn't that crazy? She amazes me every day with her talking.

I ordered my hypnobabies self-study course yesterday. I'm so excited to start it! I also started the prenatal yoga class that I used to take when pg with Dd. It feels good to know that I've started preparing myself (mentally and physically) for the birth. I was starting to get scared knowing that it's only a few short months away, but now I feel better knowing I'm doing something about it. I'm really hoping to have a more peaceful birth this time.







:


----------



## Maela

Here's a belly pic: 20 weeks


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
reading _You Are Your Child's First Teacher_ and hating it. not only is it super anti-working mom (very common in the AP/GD genre) but it is very anti-gifted child. I never thought Waldorf fit my disposition but this really takes the cake. I feel like I need to keep reading it because it's for my parenting book club.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I completely forgot how anti-WOHM the book was. I am so sorry that I didn't warn you







: I noticed at the time and was a bit...surprised







. As for my self-centered reaction to it, I just couldn't get over how not-inspiration it was for such a great title. But how did you think it was anti-gifted child? I have some arm-chair opinions about this that are not at all well-researched or thought out...









As someone who knows "kids" ages 2-48 who are being/have been raised this way I think so much of it is where you come from with it, how you weave your own preferences, personality and pathologies in as a parent.

As far as the anti-giftedness, you'd have to be more specific. I didn't necessarily get that from that book but again, I guess it depends on what ideas you might already have as to the "right" way to support a gifted child..
I do strongly agree with the idea of not "teaching" reading to kids under seven (or maybe 5/6 or 8 depending on the kids). For some families this means largely eschewing the writing word, letters, etc. until school age. The adults have regular books, but all children's books are illustration only. The kids see the parents read, but aren't read to or with. Knowing people who have grown up this way in anthroposophical villages w/o TV, very little packaged stuff, etc. kids (including gifted children)can be perfectly content not to read until it gets taught in school. And then are perfectly competent readers, writers, etc. w/in a few years. It's really not a problem- unless of course you decide to move when the kids is 8 or 9. Generally, though kids with older siblings would end up reading a bit earlier.

I think one big problem is when a family is interested in Waldorf but not steeped in it, so the parents are doing mainstream stuff and then they are trying to force their children to be part of something that they aren't. So, at 5 or whatever the kids have friends who are learning to read at school and their parent is "not allowing" them to.
However, as someone who is not living an anthroposophical lifestyle by any means I fully expect that DS will be reading before he is seven. We do have blocks with letters on them but I never ever point that out to him. We also have ABC books, and he doesn't notice those either. We just go through and look for pictures of monkeys and airplanes and stuff. But I expect that at some point he will start asking what the letters are and I will certainly tell him. We do read lots of books w/ words together. But I won't send him to (or do at home) a program that actively works on letters, reading, or any academics until he is elementary aged.
So when he starts wanting to read I won't stop him at all! But I also don't plan to encourage it. Which will be hard since I was reading early and it will be tough not to expect that of him. But I really want it to be something that he just starts doing- like walking. And I don't believe that being gifted means that you should be pushed when you're young anymore than a non gifted kids. And I think this is some of what YAYTFT may have gotten into, that the academically gifted child may need to be gently steered towards more play. If they are a math savant, they don't need any encouragement to go and learn multiplication. In the interest of raising a good overall human, not just a math genius, what the parent needs to encourage are all the other things (art, movement, imaginative play, etc.)

YAYCFT definitely does show a preference for moms to stay home with kids especially when they are small. I thought there was a whole chapter though about the "best" (in the author's opinion) alternatives when mom is working. (Other caregiver in home, followed by mixed age home-based daycare.)

PiePie I'm going to really go out on a limb and say some more about specifics and am worried this won't come out right and offend you. It's not really personal to you though, I've been discussing it a lot with my brother who lives in Hell's Kitchen(we were having the what if we die and J comes to live with you conversation)
I really think that unless it was already your personal philosophy, that trying to take an anthroposophical approach to child rearing and especially the schooling aspect of it would be extremely difficult in the high-pressured NYC schooling environment. Of course it is possible to do differently, but everyone I know in the city with kids is very much taking the "hot house" approach to pre-school. Even if they don't think it is best they are too afraid not to. The Rudolph Steiner school does have a play-based preschool but not until age three. I'm guessing there are maybe some anthropop home daycares though? I mean you'd have to either really go with the Waldorf program or else not. As opposed to living in the country and being S/WAHM it is easier to do a little bit of this and a little bit of that. So, that we can have a seasonal nature table and wooden toys and still watch a video once in a while. And if I was working outside the home DS would be in a Waldorf-inspired home based play daycare) Whereas if we were in a different situation where DS was going to an academic preschool all day I wouldn't feel like having no-TV, dolls w/o expressions, etc. etc. at home could "undo" that.
Again, I feel bad that this isn't coming out right. I don't mean this in a "this way is better than that way" sense. BC there are sooo many things that DS misses out on with us living where we do- multiculturalism, museums, walking, etc. and I know we couldn't swing living in a more metropolitan environment unless both of us had careers.
And I also don't mean that b/c one lives in the city, WOHM, sends DC to academic preschool, etc. that they can't incorporate whatever Waldorf-type things they like into their lifestyle. But, no they aren't going to be fulfilling Steiner's ideals for early childhood. I also realize in many ways this sounds ridiculous, since the original Waldorf school was developed for the children of factory workers and this makes it seem like Waldorf is only for privileged suburbanites or something. And despite somewhat defending it here I really don't plan on sending J to the local Steiner School. I have issues with the conformity of it, that is is age-segregated after nursery and that there is a lot of sitting at desks.

Anyway, I found the book useful as a reminder of the importance of rhythm because that is MY weakest spot. It was helpful to see that the more I discipline myself the less I'll have to get into stuff with J.

Are the other parents in the book group mostly WOH? Sounds like you will be having an interesting discussion!


----------



## arelyn

Just poking my head in to stalk you all. Racing before Kai notices I'm online.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm violating my intense superstition in asking this: If you saw a name printed as "Noel", what would your gut tell you in pronouncing it?

Um...I'm afraid I'd say No-Well. Actually I know I would. I was writing children's names in Hindi for my friend's class that was studying India and after I passed them out Noel asked me to break his down letter for letter and he was polite but sad that I did it wrong.

ACK. GOtta run. Baby on phone.


----------



## TinyFrog

I just wanted to stop in and update. We received the certificate of occupancy today on our house.







: Only took three and a half years.







Though we can occupy it, it is not done.

There are no immediate plans to get knocked up just yet, DH just passed his tests to receive his administrator's card and will be starting his own electrical business. We need to get that off the ground.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 









I just wanted to stop in and update. We received the certificate of occupancy today on our house.







: Only took three and a half years.







Though we can occupy it, it is not done.

There are no immediate plans to get knocked up just yet, DH just passed his tests to receive his administrator's card and will be starting his own electrical business. We need to get that off the ground.

Congratulations!!









Dh finally got what's been going around (what Dd and I had). Poor guy.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *wateraddict* 









I just wanted to stop in and update. We received the certificate of occupancy today on our house.







: Only took three and a half years.







Though we can occupy it, it is not done.

There are no immediate plans to get knocked up just yet, DH just passed his tests to receive his administrator's card and will be starting his own electrical business. We need to get that off the ground.

Congratulations!!! I







your house.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Dh finally got what's been going around (what Dd and I had). Poor guy.









oh, i'm sorry. are you feeling better now?


----------



## cking

So, I'm pregnant.







:

That is all. Good night.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Arrrrrrrrrghhhhhhhhhhhhh!!! WOW Christina! How did that happen?















:
That's amazing. Have you been secretly trying? Or are you surprised?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
oh, i'm sorry. are you feeling better now?

Oh, I'm totally fine now - finally! I just feel bad for Dh.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 









So, I'm pregnant.







:

That is all. Good night.









OMG!!







Congratulations!! Please tell us more when you have the chance! How exciting!


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Yay Christina!


----------



## witchygrrl

Hooray Christina! Please more details!!!

For bad news, if you're not on Facebook, (or not often) DH was pink slipped yesterday. We're trying to figure out contingency plans.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
For bad news, if you're not on Facebook, (or not often) DH was pink slipped yesterday. We're trying to figure out contingency plans.

Oh I'm so sorry!! How likely is it that he could get a job next year in another district?


----------



## witchygrrl

I've identified those districts that are actually hiring art teachers, so he'll be applying to those soon. Of course, if the budget goes through and restores aid to the towns, he could actually be rehired--they've told him that if there is money, he'll be the first one they call.

So who knows--another summer of question marks for us. Only this time, I'm not about to give birth. Whee.


----------



## cking

Witchy, I'm sorry. I'll keep my fingers crossed that he gets hired in another district or rehired.

Still in shock here. This was a complete surprise. Of course, I knew there was a chance after some recklessness a few weeks ago (one time - that's all!), but was trying not to think about it. On sunday I had some spotting, and I thought AF was starting, but then it stopped. So I picked up a test yesterday, and took it last night. DH was the one who 'read' the test, he wouldn't show it to me for ages.....anyway, i'm still processing. I'm kinda freaking out and I feel a little bit like I'm letting DD down.







Read a little bit of the chapter on pregnancy and tandem nursing in Mothering your nursing toddler, and it was pretty discouraging. Basically, most cultures have a taboo against bfing during pregnancy, and there might be a biological reason for that. You can still do it, but it's hard....etc.







Need to lurk over in the BFing forum for encouragement.


----------



## cking

Has anyone else read Real Food for Mother and Baby? I really need to kick up my calories....


----------



## Maela

Christina, how old will Josephine be when the new baby is born?


----------



## TinyFrog

Wow Christina!







: Congratulations!







:


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Christina, how old will Josephine be when the new baby is born?

22 months. Maev's age!


----------



## PiePie

*christina*, i am so effing excited for you! i screamed out loud when i found out.l i am a tiny bit jealous but after what you went through getting preggo with j. you deserve this sooooo much! i have heard adventures in tandem nursing (also published by lll) is a good read.

alice, not ignoring you, have lots of thoughts in reply, will write later.

just sharing this little vignette: So today we were at the playground. there were a ton of kids (a daycare and a preschool) were there, including 3 elementary school-aged kids with some sort of neuro/behavioral disabilities there with their teachers aides. so dd, obsessed as she is with big kids, was following the girls around (the boy was totally out of it) but then it was time for them to leave and the girl who had appeared most functional had a full-on extreme tantrum. dd was staring, obsessed. (she doesn't really tantrum, cries yes, but not the full-body loss-of-control experience.) i was like this is so not what i want her to learn. eventually d turns to me and says, "why is she not nursing? she needs nur."


----------



## farmama

I'm still here...just crazy busy with the Summer season starting.

Christina!

Congratulations!!!







: It must be a little shocking, but it will be great to have the two close in age as they grow up...


----------



## Sihaya

Congrats, Christina!!! Sending you sticky, healthy baby vibes by the truck full!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Has anyone else read Real Food for Mother and Baby? I really need to kick up my calories....









I'm still reading it. Thought it was great, but really wish it had come out two years earlier!


----------



## witchygrrl

Ok, so someone gave me an awesome DDDDC--anyone wanna fess up? So very true, by the way. And thanks


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*, that's so cute!

*Christina*, I just finished skimming through _Adventures in Tandem Nursing_, and I thought it was a good (and fairly positive) book.

So Dh just got an email from his district office saying they were having a meeting soon to decided whether they need to get rid of more teachers. And they're talking about laying off 2 social studies teachers - one of them is sure to be Dh as he is at the bottom. He called around and found out this is real, but that he won't know for sure until July 26!







: So we basically have to assume now that he's not going to have a job next year. His plan right now is to throw himself into his side wedding video business (which is still just getting off the ground) and substitute as much as he can.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

So Dh just got an email from his district office saying they were having a meeting soon to decided whether they need to get rid of more teachers. And they're talking about laying off 2 social studies teachers - one of them is sure to be Dh as he is at the bottom. He called around and found out this is real, but that he won't know for sure until July 26!







: So we basically have to assume now that he's not going to have a job next year. His plan right now is to throw himself into his side wedding video business (which is still just getting off the ground) and substitute as much as he can.

Oh no! I will keep my fingers crossed for you!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Good lord, my computer goes on the blink for a few days and I miss all kinds of big news!

Christina!!! Congratulations!!!!!!!! I am so, so







: for you!!!!!! This is such great news!

Witchy, I'm so sorry about DHs job. I can't get over how many people I know who are losing their jobs - to me it feels like the unemployment rate is much higher than they are reporting. Of course, I live in Michigan....









Maela, I'm sorry you're dealing with this too







. Does DHs video business take care of your bills, or are you worried about that as well as loss of stability?


----------



## cking

Maela, keeping my fingers crossed for your DH as well. I'm sorry you have to deal with this!

Thanks everyone for the congrats.









Maela, I think I will try to borrow Adventure in Tandem Nursing from LLL next week. Oh how I need that meeting. It's funny, I was very careful about not telling anyone I was pregnant before the second tri last time, but now I feel like I really need the support.









Thanks Sihaya... I think I'm going to need that book too.

PiePie, I'm







: for you. I'm actually a bit jealous of you, in that you have made it this far with such a great nursing relationship with L. I'm a little worried that ours might be in jeopardy.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Congrats, Christina! I'm happy for you!









Not baby related at all, but DF (dear fiance







) and I just bought a house! We close July 2. I'm really excited.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Christina, I just requested "Real food for Mom and Baby" from my library - it looks really good, but I hadn't heard of it until you mentioned it. How are you feeling? Has it sunk in yet?









Does anyone use a backpack as a diaper bag? Can you recommend a good one?

So Fenton has transitioned to sleeping in his own room, of is own initiative. In fact, I tried to bring him into our room during a T-storm, and he came unglued. But....he wants one of us to sleep in his room with him







: So we have a Queen mattress in "his" room, and one of us adults sleeps alone each night in the King in "our" room. Dh and I both agree that this happened before either of us was ready. The first am that Dh woke up alone, he said "I felt so lonely. All my dreams that night were so lonely.







" Made us really think about what you ask a LO to do when you ask them to sleep alone before they're ready.

We went to TRU to get Fenton some Duplos that "go vroom vroom" (his request, he wanted some with wheels that could connect). The good people at Duplos are enormously stingy with wheeled blocks (or anything that isn't pre-fab, non-interchangeable for that matter, but I digress), so we couldn'[t find anything that fit the bill. We ended up leaving that store $130 lighter and with a train table and some train accessories for his train set. I'm appalled that we did this on impulse, especially when I specifically set out to NOT get Fenton one of those, as they are enormous, not to mention expensive and ubiquitous at every play are we visit. But he was in love and frankly, we have so much fun playing "train" with him. My living room now looks like a romper room







, which I had managed to keep under control until now. Incidentally, we found some old school duplos on ebay that fit the bill. For $5








:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Wish me luck on knitting some babylegs - I haven't knitted since the accident, and I'm having a hard time seeing how this will get accomplished without my right thumb. Or the knitted Christmas stocking I've have planned for Ku.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Christina, I just requested "Real food for Mom and Baby" from my library - it looks really good, but I hadn't heard of it until you mentioned it. How are you feeling? Has it sunk in yet?









I was going to mention it here when I learned about it a few months ago. I was sure everyone would have heard of it already.







I'm feeling pretty good. It hasn't really sunk in - probably because I'm still feeling good.







: that I'm one of those people for whom nursing helps to reduce m/s. hahaha.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
So Fenton has transitioned to sleeping in his own room, of is own initiative. In fact, I tried to bring him into our room during a T-storm, and he came unglued. But....he wants one of us to sleep in his room with him







: So we have a Queen mattress in "his" room, and one of us adults sleeps alone each night in the King in "our" room. Dh and I both agree that this happened before either of us was ready. The first am that Dh woke up alone, he said "I felt so lonely. All my dreams that night were so lonely.







" Made us really think about what you ask a LO to do when you ask them to sleep alone before they're ready.


This is also happening with us right now. I think it's way too soon, and J is still nursing, so I am always the one in there with her. I end up waking up over there most nights. But she also seems to come unglued in our bed. I think she gets confused about being in a different place - since she naps in her room and goes to sleep there in the beginning of the night, that's what she's used to now. I brought her in last night, and she was all over the place. I mean actually standing and climbing around. The we went back to her room and she went right back to sleep. I feel bad for DH having to sleep alone, and I often find it harder to fall asleep without J right next to me/nursing. Anyway, I think I know how you feel.









Good luck with the babylegs!


----------



## Maela

Maev loves those train tables too.

We may know more about Dh's job tomorrow.

*TJ*, congrats on the house!

*Shanna*, we use a backpack sometimes (for all day trips). I don't know what brand it is, but we got it at BRU 2 years ago.


----------



## cking

Maela, I think DD just sent you a text message (on your DH's phone). Oops!









I forgot to say, Congrats TJ on the house! Very exciting.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Maela, I think DD just sent you a text message (on your DH's phone). Oops!









Ahh, how nice of her!









It looks like Dh will probably have a job next year







:, but it's not 100% for sure. The board decided not to get rid of jobs today, but Dh thinks there's a chance they'll change their minds. It's so weird because last week, we were almost positive he wouldn't have a job. And here in CA, there's no chance that he would find a district looking for a social studies teacher. It's an awful time to become a teacher.









*Witchy*, we'll be thinking about your dh and hoping he finds a job quickly.







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I forgot to say, Congrats TJ on the house! Very exciting.









Mee too! TJ, did you get a good deal with the market the way it is? Sad to say it will work _against_ us next year....


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

*Witchy*, we'll be thinking about your dh and hoping he finds a job quickly.







:

Thanks--we're looking, and Dh is waiting for all of his rec letters to come in. There's a chance his pink slip could be rescinded, so that is preferable to anything else, but we'll see. Pickings are slim, though. We've also discussed me going back to work, and him being a SAHD. So we'll see.

I was going to say though, Maela, that DH's school district is actually looking for a middle school social studies teacher. I guess no one who was pink slipped fits the bill. Not that you would necessarily want to pick up and move to MA,







but...I'm glad that your DH will likely keep his job. I hope they don't change their minds.


----------



## Sihaya

Congratulations, TJ - that's so exciting!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Christina, I just requested "Real food for Mom and Baby" from my library - it looks really good, but I hadn't heard of it until you mentioned it.

Guess I'll have to return my overdue copy then so you can get it, huh?







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Does anyone use a backpack as a diaper bag? Can you recommend a good one?

Mine is a bit utilitarian, but I use a Musette Bag which I got from an online army surplus store for $13 + shipping. It doesn't have many compartments inside, but I do fine without them and for the money I saved, I could always sew or hire someone else to sew dividers for me.








to those whose husbands may be facing unemployment. I feel your pain and will be hoping and praying the best for your situations!

News here - FINALLY got seeds in our garden. DH doesn't want me to put the transplants in yet, but I don't think he realizes how far behind we are. Making good progress on other household projects. Starting to feel like things are a bit more under control in general. Calvin is doing great, will be 18 months old in a few weeks and is just a joy. Physically aching to add another babe to the mix, but waiting another year to do so.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Does anyone use a backpack as a diaper bag? Can you recommend a good one?

we just got one by dadgear that i love love love. dh likes it but has his criticisms, as he always does, i am learning. however, i warn against using amazon vendor calliope boutique. here it is: http://www.thegeargroup.com/gear_info.cfm?ID=127


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

So Fenton has transitioned to sleeping in his own room, of is own initiative.

! I cannot imagine DD doing that.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Does anyone use a backpack as a diaper bag? Can you recommend a good one?

we just got one by dadgear that i love love love. dh likes it but has his criticisms, as he always does, i am learning. however, i warn against using amazon vendor calliope boutique. here it is: http://www.thegeargroup.com/gear_info.cfm?ID=127


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*TJ*, congrats on the house!

Thank you! It'll be perfect for us for the next few years! We'll probably move to a larger house rather than a townhouse when DF finishes grad school and we want to start having kids.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
forgot to say, Congrats TJ on the house! Very exciting.









Thanks! I'm so excited I just think about it all the time!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Mee too! TJ, did you get a good deal with the market the way it is? Sad to say it will work _against_ us next year....

We did get a good deal, I think. The seller had reduced it a few times and we offered less than list price, plus closing costs. The big question is how resale on it will be. I guess we'll have to see. Townhouses are pretty underpriced right now so I'm hoping that'll change!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Congratulations, TJ - that's so exciting!

Thank you, Steph! I'm very excited!

We have pictures on my picasa album. PM me if you want a link.


----------



## accountclosed3

congrats christina!

i finally have a minute to chat and there is so much up and down news on here. jobs down, babies up!

we're almost finished with our scouting trip. we're going to move forward and see what happens.

we looked at an apartment that we really loved today, even though it's about 65k more than we want to pay. we can afford it (barely), but it's more than we want to pay. of course, it's a lovely, modern apartment with a view of the harbor, right across from te papa museum which has great "discovery" areas for little ones, a great park with both open space, a skate park, and a playground, 1 block from a regular grocery store, 3 blocks from a trader-joes styled one, 15 minute walk from where we would be working, 10 minutes from the library, and 5 minutes to our favorite cafe and movie theater.

is all of that worth 65k?

oh, and on a lease-hold property, which is a mess too. i think there are as many 'cons' as pros, and most of the cons are finances. ah well, we'll figure it all otu and find the right place!


----------



## arelyn

:Belated Congratulations Christina!!!







:

And I must run alerady. We're babysitting my friend's daughter and they're into everything!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Guess I'll have to return my overdue copy then so you can get it, huh?







:

They must have multiple copies because it's on its way. I was sure I was going to have to request that they buy it, so it was a nice surprise.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Mine is a bit utilitarian, but I use a Musette Bag which I got from an online army surplus store for $13 + shipping. It doesn't have many compartments inside, but I do fine without them and for the money I saved, I could always sew or hire someone else to sew dividers for me.

I thought you were just being admirably frugal, but we just returned from BRU to buy Ku's carseat (take 2!) and I priced the backpacks there - holy cow! $45 for a diaper bag????? DH has been mocking me all day because between that and looking for a used tricycle for Fenton, I've twice today said "I just refuse to pay it, it's not worth that much!". He thinks I'm channeling my cranky farmer grandma. Have I been asleep for 10 years of inflation or what?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
News here - FINALLY got seeds in our garden. DH doesn't want me to put the transplants in yet, but I don't think he realizes how far behind we are.

I'm not even there yet







. Garden got overrun by weeds and red raspberries before planting (after the accident), and now I'm so overwhelmed....I think I need to buckle down, committ to not doing a preservation-sized harvest, and just get my tomato seedlings planted. But now I'm worried it's too late, which feeds my procrastination. I don't genuinely enjoy the process of gardening like most gardeners. I always feel like I'm acting in a play because I've been dong this so long and haven't seemed to learn much in that time. I definately do it for the $$$ savings and health/nutrition benefits. Apparently, this isn't enough to inspire me. But, I've had a rough time of physical work lately







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
! I cannot imagine DD doing that.

YOu know, I would have said teh same thing 2 weeks ago, but that stage where they suddenly love the novel just comes out of nowhere. And, as I've said, he brings one of us along for the ride









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
we looked at an apartment that we really loved today, even though it's about 65k more than we want to pay. we can afford it (barely), but it's more than we want to pay. of course, it's a lovely, modern apartment with a view of the harbor, right across from te papa museum which has great "discovery" areas for little ones, a great park with both open space, a skate park, and a playground, 1 block from a regular grocery store, 3 blocks from a trader-joes styled one, 15 minute walk from where we would be working, 10 minutes from the library, and 5 minutes to our favorite cafe and movie theater.

is all of that worth 65k?

As someone who bought a home that weds her to her car: if you can at all afford the extra $ to be closer to where your life is centered, I say absolutely do it. The independance (not just from your car, but for your children as they grow up, being able to gradually extend their world without you mediating it) is one of the most important things we can support them in. And that's even aside from all of the financial, health and stewardship benefits of being centered around your community. I wish we had chosen differently, and intend to do much differently next time around.

Last night, getting Fenton ready for his bath, he was standing on his step stool (the only way he consents to diaper changes anymore. Is there a girl scout badge for learning how to do that?), he raised his eyebrows in such a way that reminded me of when he was a little baby. I said to him "Oh Fenton, when you do that, I can see the little baby in you!" He pointed at my belly and said "I see the baby in _you_, Mama!







"







: He's also started saying "Shall we...?"







.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
he raised his eyebrows in such a way that reminded me of when he was a little baby. I said to him "Oh Fenton, when you do that, I can see the little baby in you!" He pointed at my belly and said "I see the baby in _you_, Mama!







"







:

That is so DARN cute!!

I guess I spoke to soon about Dh's job.







It's complicated, but now it's looking like ~10% chance that he'll have a job next year. I'm starting to worry. He can sub a few days a week. But he also would have to do many more wedding videos - more than he could get I'm afraid. I'm just hoping that we can stay in our house. Luckily, ILs have money to help us out, but I hate to have to rely on that. I don't want them to just be making mortgage payments for us. So we have a lot to think about and discuss. dh isn't really in the mood to talk about it just yet though.

And another downer. I'm starting to dislike nursing - just at bedtime for some reason. It's slightly better when she nurses on the left side, but still irritating. It happened so suddenly just this week. It doesn't really hurt anymore, it's just so....I don't have the word for it...it makes me grind my teeth and want to push her away; that kind of feeling, yk? no matter, what I'm going to keep going for another couple of months, but I hope that she will not be resentful of the baby if I wean her just two months before he comes (when she turns two). The last couple of nights I have nursed her for a few minutes and then told her we need to just cuddle to sleep. She's okay with it most of the time. Her biggest nursing time now is in the morning when she wakes up. Sometimes she'll go the whole day without nursing again until bedtime. She's doing great with not nursing during the night.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
if you can at all afford the extra $ to be closer to where your life is centered, I say absolutely do it. The independance (not just from your car, but for your children as they grow up, being able to gradually extend their world without you mediating it) is one of the most important things we can support them in. And that's even aside from all of the financial, health and stewardship benefits of being centered around your community.

*ZB*, I agree with this.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Switching to disposies at night







Despite all of my efforts (dear God, ALL of my efforts) we're still getting ammonia issues at night (and only at night).


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
They must have multiple copies because it's on its way. I was sure I was going to have to request that they buy it, so it was a nice surprise.

I requested they buy it when I first it was coming out. I didn't realize they got multiple copies. Last night I pulled it out of my bag and had somehow spilled water on it, so I may be owning yet another library book
















Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm not even there yet







. Garden got overrun by weeds and red raspberries before planting (after the accident), and now I'm so overwhelmed....I think I need to buckle down, committ to not doing a preservation-sized harvest, and just get my tomato seedlings planted. *But now I'm worried it's too late, which feeds my procrastination.*

The part in bold I so very much understand.







Let me know if there's any way I can help you. One of the other GBC/LLL moms who lives near you (Matthew's mom) and I have been playing with the idea of trading/rotating child care so we can get groceries bought and chores done. Maybe we could do a three-way arrangement that would also help you and me who are sharing cars? PM/email/call me and we'll talk









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
he raised his eyebrows in such a way that reminded me of when he was a little baby. I said to him "Oh Fenton, when you do that, I can see the little baby in you!" He pointed at my belly and said "I see the baby in _you_, Mama!







"







:


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* i will make the opposite case, just to be me. buying less house than you can afford is the way to go. you and/or ryan may want to cut back on work (and hence income) at some point. i know that is very hard to imagine right now with your buying the biz and his career taking a new turn but i would give my eye teeth for my time with my lo. just sayin'. eta: i love how much you love your work -- you are such an inspiration to me. love love love.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*z.b.,* i will make the opposite case, just to be me. buying less house than you can afford is the way to go. you and/or ryan may want to cut back on work (and hence income) at some point. i know that is very hard to imagine right now with your buying the biz and his career taking a new turn but i would give my eye teeth for my time with my lo. just sayin'. eta: i love how much you love your work -- you are such an inspiration to me. love love love.

This is true for me too - I'm wondering if figuring out how much "barely affording it" means would be helpful for you ZB - does it lock you in with no options for cutting back on work, layoffs, or any other of the commonalities in this economy. But as someone who has a lot of time with her LO, I'd give my eyeteeth to be closer to the center of our community







.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

I guess I spoke to soon about Dh's job.







It's complicated, but now it's looking like ~10% chance that he'll have a job next year. I'm starting to worry. He can sub a few days a week. But he also would have to do many more wedding videos - more than he could get I'm afraid. I'm just hoping that we can stay in our house. Luckily, ILs have money to help us out, but I hate to have to rely on that. I don't want them to just be making mortgage payments for us. So we have a lot to think about and discuss. dh isn't really in the mood to talk about it just yet though.

I missed this the first time I scrolled through. Maela, I hope your DH is lucky enough to be in the 10%. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for you. But here are some thoughts that might be helpful. Could your DH give lessons to homeschooling groups for a fee? Also, he could list himself as a social studies tutor, and charge a bit more because he's a licensed teacher. These are the kinds of things we're considering over here.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*z.b.,* i will make the opposite case, just to be me. buying less house than you can afford is the way to go. you and/or ryan may want to cut back on work (and hence income) at some point. i know that is very hard to imagine right now with your buying the biz and his career taking a new turn but i would give my eye teeth for my time with my lo. just sayin'. eta: i love how much you love your work -- you are such an inspiration to me. love love love.

Me too, and I agree with PiePie here. I think it's better to be safe than sorry in case situations change.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I guess I spoke to soon about Dh's job.







It's complicated, but now it's looking like ~10% chance that he'll have a job next year. I'm starting to worry. He can sub a few days a week. But he also would have to do many more wedding videos - more than he could get I'm afraid. I'm just hoping that we can stay in our house. Luckily, ILs have money to help us out, but I hate to have to rely on that. I don't want them to just be making mortgage payments for us. So we have a lot to think about and discuss. dh isn't really in the mood to talk about it just yet though.










I hope he's in the 10% too.
Sorry about not liking nursing too. There are times when J isn't really getting milk - she just seems to be chomping down. it totally makes me grit my teeth. I usually take her off if I think she's doing this. it really bugs me.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
But as someone who has a lot of time with her LO, I'd give my eyeteeth to be closer to the center of our community







.

I have to agree with this.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
congrats christina!

i finally have a minute to chat and there is so much up and down news on here. jobs down, babies up!

we're almost finished with our scouting trip. we're going to move forward and see what happens.

we looked at an apartment that we really loved today, even though it's about 65k more than we want to pay. we can afford it (barely), but it's more than we want to pay. of course, it's a lovely, modern apartment with a view of the harbor, right across from te papa museum which has great "discovery" areas for little ones, a great park with both open space, a skate park, and a playground, 1 block from a regular grocery store, 3 blocks from a trader-joes styled one, 15 minute walk from where we would be working, 10 minutes from the library, and 5 minutes to our favorite cafe and movie theater.

is all of that worth 65k?

oh, and on a lease-hold property, which is a mess too. i think there are as many 'cons' as pros, and most of the cons are finances. ah well, we'll figure it all otu and find the right place!

I think it's relative. Are you looking at comparable places - similar neighborhood, size, etc. that are cheaper? Or is it just more than you intended to spend. When we bought this house - 4.5 years ago, we wanted to spend about $60k less. But when we really started looking, nothing was really available in that price range. Other houses were in similar neighborhood and similar size, and maybe cost a little less, but they needed so much work that it wasn't worth it. And fwiw this still isn't really anywhere close to ideal for us. In order to live in a community that I would really like around here, we'd have to double, or more likely quadruple our home price. So, considering that, $65k doesn't really sound like that much more to pay, kwim?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

So much to say but no time to say it. In the meantime, wanted to post this link as much for my reference as for those who are thinking about tandem nursing...

The whole series on preparing for number 2 on the above blog is great...I just spent (lots of broken) hours reading through it all and the comments too.


----------



## cking

MMM, thank you for this!


----------



## PiePie

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/16/ny...l?ref=nyregion


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/16/ny...l?ref=nyregion

Interesting. As a child, I would have been mortified to have her as a parent.

I do agree with what she's saying though.


----------



## Maela

Dd is going to be 2!! in a month!









Yesterday was the first day ever that Dd did not nurse at all. I feel like I should have been more upset about it than I was, but it was actually okay. I think that I'm going to start being serious about "don't offer, don't refuse." And in a month, I'm going to start trying distraction when she asks. Bedtime will be the hardest, but it's also the time that bothers me the most. Yesterday, we took a bike ride after her bath, and she fell asleep. We'll be doing a lot of that this summer. She won't let Dh put her to sleep anymore. He's a little hurt.









We still don't know about Dh's job. I haven't really been thinking about it much, just trying to spend as little money as possible.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Interesting. As a child, I would have been mortified to have her as a parent.

I do agree with what she's saying though.


I also agree with what she's saying, but I think she could be more constructive rather than fear-mongering.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I also agree with what she's saying, but I think she could be more constructive rather than fear-mongering.

Exactly.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Dd is going to be 2!! in a month!










How did that happen? I guess they all grow up sometime, right?

I'm getting asked about having a 1st birthday party for Rhea, though truth be told, I feel too stressed out about our situation right now to want to plan it. I'm just glad she's too young to really know what's going on.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
How did that happen? I guess they all grow up sometime, right?

I'm getting asked about having a 1st birthday party for Rhea, though truth be told, I feel too stressed out about our situation right now to want to plan it. I'm just glad she's too young to really know what's going on.









Can you just do something really small with just the grandparents?
We did not really do a big party for Maev (think we might have offended some relatives, but







). We just had our parents and my sister and brother over for dinner on her birthday. I made a couple of very simple cakes and put a Happy Birthday sign up and that was it. We ate dinner, had her blow out a candle, and opened some gifts. It was very simple and we liked it that way. So much less stress. If we had invited all of Dh's extended family and mine, it would have been this HUGE deal, and expensive and we wouldn't have been able to have it at our house. Maev had a good time anyway and that's all that matters. We're doing the same thing again this year.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 







Can you just do something really small with just the grandparents?
We did not really do a big party for Maev (think we might have offended some relatives, but







). We just had our parents and my sister and brother over for dinner on her birthday. I made a couple of very simple cakes and put a Happy Birthday sign up and that was it. We ate dinner, had her blow out a candle, and opened some gifts. It was very simple and we liked it that way. So much less stress. If we had invited all of Dh's extended family and mine, it would have been this HUGE deal, and expensive and we wouldn't have been able to have it at our house. Maev had a good time anyway and that's all that matters. We're doing the same thing again this year.

We did the big birthday party with ALL relatives for Fenton's first, at DHs insistance. For his 2nd, we did it my way, which was only grandparents and 1 aunt with her kids. SO MUCH calmer and enjoyable the second way, even DH agreed. If it offends relatives, I think it does so only mildly - with how out of control children's birthday parties are getting, people seem to be understanding if you go to the other extreme. Witchy, I'm so sorry for how much stress you're feeling right now







.

Just returned from a vacation for a few days, up to my ILs cottage. Fenton had so many new experiences in such a short time: fishing, boating, seeing a lot of types of wildlife for the first time. There were a few times he got really withdrawn and even demanded to go back home. I've seen this with other toddlers as well, and it surprises me every time, given that they're with their parents but also in a stimulating environment. I don't feel like I can predict what si going to be overstimulating for him, and it breaks my heart when I'm in a situation (like on a boat) when I can't get him in a familiar environment right away. Everyone was great, just held him close, and kept everything really calm until he was ready to explore again. FIL kept the boat at an idle until Fenton wanted to "go just a little faster". Fascinating to see what nuanced creatures they are







.

DH is on vacation this week







:. And he's sick now







. Again.

Gotta go see to both babies







.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
There were a few times he got really withdrawn and even demanded to go back home. I've seen this with other toddlers as well, and it surprises me every time, given that they're with their parents but also in a stimulating environment.

Dd has been saying this lately. "Go home!" if we've been out for a while.







Poor thing.

Glad you guys had fun on your vacation!! And yay for your dh being off! Hopefully he gets well soon.


----------



## PiePie

Hey there. DH is out of town for work, again. Tomorrow is going to be a make-or-break vote for him re his job. Think good thoughts, please! The house is a mess!! Which has me PO'd at him.

birthday parties: we had just my parents and brother; dh's dad was invited but didn't reply. dh also wanted something bigger, with his extended family, but you couldn't invite just some of them, and that would have made it grow out of control -- basically, not about dd, more about the grown-ups. as it was, my mom was more focused on my brother than on dd -- she was very upset that dd didn't play with my brother's present enough, in her opinion. so low-key is good. we did an ice cream cake, given the season. afterwards my brother and i took her to a local water playground. it was very chill and the big hit, from her perspective, was the helium balloons. definitely do those! the best 99 cents each ever! (we got 2, big spender that i am.) keeping it small means everybody interacts with her and not with each other, which was how i wanted it given that these are relatives who don't live nearby and therefore don't see her often. so many of the over-the-top parties are, imo, about the parents and not the kid.

this year she most definitely has peer friends -- she asks about them every night before bed -- where is so-and-so? what are they doing now? who are they with? -- runs through each child in her class as if saying prayers. i have been fascinated to see the order of the children evolving as her relationships do. even with those very close bonds, i am still leaning toward keeping the party small -- just grandparents. i feel like next year she will really know that it is her bday and expect a party. now, she has been to only one other child's party, and that was when she was 11 mos. and not cognizant of it. that was a catered affair with 50+ guests and a full day event. watching the mom organize the food and the favors gave me the heebie jeebies!!

plus, i will definitely have an event for her at school -- bring in cupcakes or maybe homemade ice cream? that is the practice -- parents who want to come for lunch on their child's birthday and bring stuff -- this is how dd met cupcakes, juice boxes, etc. i don't really mind because there are only 6 other kids in her class and not every family does it so i figure it is an irregular enough occurence that i don't want to be that mom about it. before i knew it was happening, the teachers had been giving her the cupcakes (these manhattan gourmet cupcakes are larger than her head, no joke!) with the icing wiped off, thinking i was that mom. as it is, i am already plotting our menu in light of one child's strawberry allergy and another fam's chocolate ban.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Interesting. As a child, I would have been mortified to have her as a parent.

I didn't really have her as a parent but i did have a mother who forbade me from having artificial coloring, preservatives, or sugar. i think it was really bad for my relationship with food and contributed to a sense that otherness=bad, given that i was in a social setting where such foods were generally considered desirable.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
the big hit, from her perspective, was the helium balloons. definitely do those! the best 99 cents each ever!


----------



## cking

: same here. loves balloons.


----------



## PiePie

craptastic day here. major rain. fussy sick kid. no word from hubby. major pressure at work. could it get any better??


----------



## PiePie

dh's job: unanimous yes!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dh's job: unanimous yes!

Yay!! Congrats!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
craptastic day here. major rain. fussy sick kid. no word from hubby. major pressure at work. could it get any better??











Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dh's job: unanimous yes!









: So nice to hear some positive employment news







.

I accidentally bought _white_ whole wheat flour - what the heck is this stuff?


----------



## cking

Shanna, it's whole wheat flour, just from white wheat - most reg wheat is red wheat. i think.

piepie: hooray!

sick baby, nauseated mama. boo.







not sure i'm ready for this.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
sick baby, nauseated mama. boo.







not sure i'm ready for this.

Don't even think of it as 1 day at a time - just 1 _minute_ at a time. You'll be fine. But you may get less dogmatic on some things. Like television







. My sister says during the first trimester she just "scattered some crackers on the floor and went to lie down".







That image makes me laugh every time, picturing her kids like pigeons.


----------



## PiePie

just got back from er with babe. she is perked up, thank god. at first they thought it was h1n1 but it turns out to be her first ear infection. i guess it could be both but they don't think so.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
just got back from er with babe. she is perked up, thank god. at first they thought it was h1n1 but it turns out to be her first ear infection. i guess it could be both but they don't think so.

So scary, I'm so glad she's ok. Are you okay?









Hey, I just finished Real Food for babies and I'm mentioned in it on pay 167-ish. Not by name, but I'm the mom who drove so far to give milk to Baby Jack right after Deidre passed away.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hey, I just finished Real Food for babies and I'm mentioned in it on pay 167-ish. Not by name, but I'm the mom who drove so far to give milk to Baby Jack right after Deidre passed away.

That's so nice!

PiePie--ear infections are lousy. Hope your dd feels better soon!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Don't even think of it as 1 day at a time - just 1 _minute_ at a time. You'll be fine. But you may get less dogmatic on some things. Like television







. My sister says during the first trimester she just "scattered some crackers on the floor and went to lie down".







That image makes me laugh every time, picturing her kids like pigeons.









:









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
just got back from er with babe. she is perked up, thank god. at first they thought it was h1n1 but it turns out to be her first ear infection. i guess it could be both but they don't think so.









How scary. Hope she's feeling better soon.

Super busy over here. SIL and her family are in town. Maev is having a great time with her cousins. It's so fun to watch them interact. I'm finding that my tolerance for chaos is much lower during pregnancy though. I'm worn out.


----------



## Maela

And I cannot sleep!!! I'm up every day between 2-5ish. I can usually go back to sleep around 5 something for a couple more hours, so it's not horrible. But I really don't like not being able to sleep when i need it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
And I cannot sleep!!! I'm up every day between 2-5ish. I can usually go back to sleep around 5 something for a couple more hours, so it's not horrible. But I really don't like not being able to sleep when i need it.

Having trouble over here too







. Hasn't helped that Fenton gets too busy during the day to eat enough, so the past couple of nights he's awoken ~2ish needing a snack.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Michigan's unemployment rate just jumped to 14.1%. This is really fueling some tensions between DH and I







.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Has anyone read "Opting In" by Amy Richards? I'm about halfway through, curious if anyone else has read it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Um, did I kill this thread?

I just bought 8 GREAT shirts (don't shrink, fit great, not see-through) for $114 US. Which I can't wear until next summer. It felt like investing in futures. But I couldn't turn down 50% off, especially when Eddie Bauer is filing for bankrupcy protection and I may not have a crack at this sale next year







.

Happy Fathers Day to all the Papas!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Sebby was 6 months yesterday! And DP and I celebrated our 8th anniversary too. (Yes, we got together at a Winter Soltice party!) Solstice, winter and summer, will always be special for us!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Has anyone read "Opting In" by Amy Richards? I'm about halfway through, curious if anyone else has read it.

I just ordered it. I quite like other stuff Amy Richards has done. What are your thoughts?

DS has his first sicky sick cold. His chest is full of phlegm and he's a wheezy, snotty mess. No fever though so I'm not worried about the piggy flu. (Melbourne is the world capital of swine flu now with 1000's of confirmed cases.) Actually, I'd kind of like him to get swine flu now, while it's not so serious and he's breastfeeding so much. Next year could be another story. Anyway, aside from no sleep last night, he's really very happy. I'm pleased 'cos I'm really not a good nurse.

Sleep in general here is improving. Thank the stars. We have sidecarred the crib again (after never using it and pulling it off after a week when he was newborn) and he's sleeping in it for 2-3 stretches of 2 or 3 and sometimes 4 hours. I think he's a kid that likes his space but also to know that Mama is nearby. He still comes in with us some time around 3 or 4 for snuggles and cluster feeding but we're all getting much better sleep with this set up and I'm a better Mama for it. He's also going to bed around 8, without me, so DP and I are getting some time alone which is awesome and much needed.

I have so much to say but never time to say it. I'm sorry I don't respond individually to more ppl. Quickly though, *Witchy*, I'm sure your stress and struggles coping are compounded now by DH's pending unemployment but I just wanted to say that I'm thinking of you and I'm sorry you've been feeling overwhelmed and I'm sorry that I didn't acknowledge it earlier. This is one tough job and it is truly impossible to fully grasp that until we're in it.
Let me know if you figure out a way to nurture yourself a bit more. I think we all need it!

I gotta go. Damn.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Michigan's unemployment rate just jumped to 14.1%. This is really fueling some tensions between DH and I







.

how do you mean?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I just bought 8 GREAT shirts (don't shrink, fit great, not see-through) for $114 US. Which I can't wear until next summer. It felt like investing in futures. But I couldn't turn down 50% off, especially when Eddie Bauer is filing for bankrupcy protection and I may not have a crack at this sale next year







.

Really?! I love Eddie Bauer. They're $$$ for me, but I buy when I can. I've been loving everything in their catalog lately, but I just don't know what size I'll be after this pg. So I'm afraid I'll guess wrong and waste money.







but 50% off? That's hard to pass up.


----------



## witchygrrl

Eddie Bauer, hunh? Maybe I should take a look...

I have officially thrown my hat in the ring. I've applied for two jobs thus far, each with its own advantages. But we've decided that if Iget a jhob, DH will happily collect unemployment and be a SAHD. That would be a huge adjustment for Rhea (and me), who still nurses constantly, but I'm confident we can make it work. Anyway, our hope of DH being recalled is shrinking daily.

MMM, thanks. I do need encouragement. I'm glad you're getting more sleep. I have been too, though my sleep issues have very little to do with Rhea.


----------



## Maela

Witchy,









MMM, hope DS gets better soon. Glad to hear you're getting more sleep.

Dd is sick AGAIN. Her cousins were sick when they first got here; I'm sure that's what she got. She was throwing up the night before last, had a medium to high fever all day yesterday, and woke up this morning still with a fever.







We've given her medicine when it gets really high, but it takes a long time to help. poor thing.


----------



## accountclosed3

well, we're back from NZ and had a week without internet. so annoying. LOL phone companies, man, what a crack up.

anyway, back online (yippie!) and getting ready to make an offer on a business in NZ. also starting the paperwork AND we started packing today. i'm just doing one room at a time, with my sitter. she's great. we take turns either playing with hawk or loading a box with books.

and, in more funny news, i finally feel up to DTD (not that i avoided in the past, but i dtd with less interest and grace. LOL), and DH freaks because so many of YOU are preggers. so, it's the NMYGrads fault. LOL he's now terrified of getting my pregnant, even though most of you were actually trying. duh. silly man.

what else...hmm. not much. i'm not sleeping well at the moment--probably because we have SO much to do and what feels like very little time in which to do it. but, we're moving right along anyway.

much love to all of you. i read, but it's hard to respond to everyone. perhaps now that i have more internet i'll be able to.


----------



## Maela

Dd was very very sick today. Dh took her to the Dr. this morning and she said that she has a bacterial infection in her head/nasal area? plus the stomach bug that's been going around. So she's taking antibiotics for the second time in her life.







Anyway, she was very lethargic and sleepy today - I've never seen her so sick. Then all of a sudden at about 6:30PM, she started having diarrhea (poor girl was on the potty for 20 min), but she was almost like her old self again!







: Now she's talking and playing and we even got a laugh out of her. We're guessing she had a very painful stomachache all day. She also had some food for the first time today. She hasn't thrown up since 11AM. So anyway, the diarrhea has started, but Dh and I are just so happy to see her talking and alert again.

We're supposed to go to Monterey tomorrow with Dh's family for a few days. We might have to push it back a day or two depending on how she feels tomorrow.

ETA: Never mind. She just threw up again.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hope to have time to post more soon. But had to







Maela. get her some yogurt, and just try to hang in there









Witchy, I've been thinking of you constantly and all the stress you're feeling right now with all the changes. Are you and DH hanging in there, or is there stress between you as well?









TJ, how's the house?


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Witchy, I've been thinking of you constantly and all the stress you're feeling right now with all the changes. Are you and DH hanging in there, or is there stress between you as well?










Thanks, Shanna. I know I'm not the only one in this situation, but we were just starting to feel like things were on the up and up for us. Guess I got too used to feeling secure already. DH was told yesterday that any and all callbacks will be done by July 6-he's decided that he's just going to think that he isn't on that list and move on, because he's done with the uncertainty. Whatever works for him

Between us? Yeah, a bit. I snapped at hime last night because I'm sooo sleep deprived, and he never wakes to help with Rhea. And of course I'm sleep deprived because I'm beyond stressed and no amount of proactivity helps.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Maela,







Hope Maeve feels better soon. Definitely start her on yogurt, though.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
and, in more funny news, i finally feel up to DTD

Woo hoo!







: Took me forever to not be in pain during, and then I was uninterested until 2nd trimester this time around. Good for you!!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
I just ordered it. I quite like other stuff Amy Richards has done. What are your thoughts?

I don't think it was quite what I was looking for - the title seems a little off from what the book actually was. I'm looking for a little support in finding that I'm ready to be a little more than just "Fenton's Mom". But I couldn't at all identify with her thoughts that earning money was the only way to feel useful to the society and to achieve parity within her partnership (but more on that later). I'm, perhaps typical of my generation, too suspicious of capitalism and the supposed "meritocracy" for that. I'm going to pick up "The Feminine Mistake: Are we giving up too much?" and see if that's more what I was looking for. However, she did give a great suggestion: chronicle for a day how I'm spending doing what task, as a way to account for that feeling that a parent runs all day but appears to get nothing done. She also helped to clarify what has felt like a major gas-lighting in my life: if my partner is so "involved" as a parent, why do I feel so alone much of the time? The answer is that the bar is laughably low for what makes an "involved" father. Even when he does something (change a diaper) I still end up feeling like I'm the one who did it because I still ended up managing the whole thing (monitoring whether it needs to be changed, asking DH to do it, prepping the materials for him to "help" and then helping him when my son is too much a maniac to hold still for it. Just as an example.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Michigan's unemployment rate just jumped to 14.1%. This is really fueling some tensions between DH and I







.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I have officially thrown my hat in the ring. I've applied for two jobs thus far, each with its own advantages. But we've decided that if Iget a jhob, DH will happily collect unemployment and be a SAHD. That would be a huge adjustment for Rhea (and me), who still nurses constantly, but I'm confident we can make it work.

I wrote about it at length here, when things were at their most dour and theatrical. I should preface it by saying what I wrote about here is probably the most personal thing I've ever posted publicly, and I'd hate to have anyone doubt the honor and responsibility of my husband, of which I usually have the utmost faith. But it's a tough situation. The update is that, as we've been able to get everything on the table and speak frankly, we've come to some conclusions. One of which is that, if he's accepted into a program, I will probably have to go to work, and I'm hoping that it can be in a WAH capacity. It's too difficult for me to contemplate right now going outside the home to work a job I don't want, with a nursling under a year old and a toddler who is so used to having me home. Since I'm hopeful that we won't need that much salary from me, the WAH option might work out. But we'll see. So to watch the unemployment rate creep up, knowing we're probably leaving the state but that the sale of our home is required for what the plan is....I have a hard time seeing it not end horribly with me having to refuse to take out a loans, and him feeling oppressed. And me having to go back to work regardless. If I can be completely honest, I have never for one moment since leaving my job and becoming a SAHM felt a challenge to my feminism. I've never felt like my work wasn't valuable, even from a $ standpoint, or that I didn't have absolute equality in nearly everything in our partnership ( it helps that I was the primary dollar earner the first 7 years). But this situation has left me feeling like a second class citizen. I understand that, if I'm asking my DH to earn the money, I can't ask him to tie one hand behind his back with all of my demands about where and how he earns that money. But neither can it be true that, as long as I stay home with our children, I don't have any say in where we live and certainly how we spend all of our life's savings. All that said, I feel at peace with the decisions and approach we're taking _right now_. But I'm anxious as hell for what happens when DH sees the financial writing on the wall and we can't sell the house, get what we need out of it, or get a salary for me that can allow his dream to happen. My line in the sand was 1)I will not take out loans to make this happen, but I will negotiate how much existing money we use to make it happen and 2) I will not have the LOs cared for by anyone other than me or him. It seems reasonable to him now, but I'm not sure it will hold up when reality starts to set in. If you're still reading, sorry to puke all that out. That's what keeps me up at night lately.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Is there anyone else thinking about Christmas already? I see a very cute toy already that I think Fenton _has_ to have


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 

and, in more funny news, i finally feel up to DTD (not that i avoided in the past, but i dtd with less interest and grace. LOL), and DH freaks because so many of YOU are preggers. so, it's the NMYGrads fault. LOL he's now terrified of getting my pregnant, even though most of you were actually trying. duh. silly man.

Mine is getting pretty paranoid too. He won't even go condomless on the day before my period.









Maela and Piepie: Hope the ladies are feeling better.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Wow, I just took top prize in the bad mama contest. For weeks, I've been certain there is a mouse in our kitchen, but the little booger is evading my trap and stopped leaving evidence (could be I'm just going crazy). At night we leave the trap on the counter and I forgot to move it this am. Fenton got a chair to check out this weird contraption, and it snapped on his thumb







Thumb is ok, nothing broken. Ice packs seem to be healing his soul, he's putting it everywhere







. Dh is going to be so sad, he worried about just this thing and I assured him that it wouldn't happen. Poor little guy









I'm going to go compensate for my guilt now. Maybe Fenton wants a pony....


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna,







This immediately came to mind. Hope you both feel better soon.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Is there anyone else thinking about Christmas already? I see a very cute toy already that I think Fenton _has_ to have









Yes, although really her birthday, which comes first (but isn't for another month and a half).


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

NAK..

So Sebby is super sick. He's got an ear infection and bronchialitis. Of course the GP has loaded us up with steroids and antibiotics and I am really unsure of what to do. The kids chest sounds like it's gonna cave in so I'm a little less reluctant to give him the steroids so he can breathe better but the antibiotics worry me a lot.

What have you folks done with your sick babes?

He already takes probiotics ... on the days i remember to give it to him!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Shanna,







This immediately came to mind. Hope you both feel better soon.

Thanks







. He doesn't seem to be too traumatized.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
NAK..

So Sebby is super sick. He's got an ear infection and bronchialitis. Of course the GP has loaded us up with steroids and antibiotics and I am really unsure of what to do. The kids chest sounds like it's gonna cave in so I'm a little less reluctant to give him the steroids so he can breathe better but the antibiotics worry me a lot.

What have you folks done with your sick babes?

He already takes probiotics ... on the days i remember to give it to him!

Poor Sebby







. And poor Mama. I know Dr. Mendelson's advice regarding ear infections is that they mostly cure just fine, even though no one takes antibx according to instructions. So headvises to forgo them. I don't know if I could do it if my LO were suffering and it was the only trick up my sleeve though







. If you do give it him, just be diligent with the probiotics and try to space it as far from the antibx a possible. On the steroids and bronchiatis, I'd definately trust your gut on that. Is there any concern for pertussis, or you know it's different? (NOt sure if bronchitis is a lab-verified diagnosis). So sorry sweetie. In case it helps, and because the contrary is often esteemed on these boards, you're not a failure if you use modern medicine. It sounds like a no-brainer, but I sometimes get a different message here at MDC.









Just realized both Lorelei and Maeve are almost 2!!!!!

Fenton taking 90+ minutes to get to sleep at night lately







. Really frustrated, I have no time with DH or alone anymore.


----------



## Maela

Maev is doing much better. Tuesday was the worst. she's just gotten better since then. We headed over to monterey wed night.

Farmama's LO is also going to be two the same day as Maev!


----------



## accountclosed2

MMM, I'm really against antibiotics, steroids etc (unless absolutely necessary), but for bronchialitis in a child that young, I'd give whatever they suggest. Several of my friends have had their babies hospitalized for a week or so, needing assistance with breathing, stopped breastfeeding etc (baby couldn't feed, needed a feeding tube, mum's supply dipped). It can be _very_ serious for infants.

I hope Sebby feels better soon, and that you get some sleep!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Farmama's LO is also going to be two the same day as Maev!

Oh, I was thinking Maeve and Lorelei have the same birthday for some reason. We've lost track of some of our LOs along the way too, like Becca and Jodi and others. It's just so weird to have 2 years go by so fast. I remember PiePie's husband's post that she was in labor like it was yesterday. And Calvin must be having his half-birthdya party soon too


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thanks *Shanna* and *AC* for chiming in. DP was pretty adamant that we go with the abx and steroids and in the end, I'm glad I decided not to battle...Especially once I realised that bronchiolitis is what my friends son went to hospital with 2 weeks ago...and just as AC said - feeding tube and ensuing breastfeeding issues. Sebby is improving now though not particularly quickly. He's been sick for over a week now and is just sooooo needy. And I've got cabin fever. And I'm sick.

*Maela* - how's DD? Sounds like her bug was nasty.

*ZB* - So is it definite? Are you joining us in the Southern Hemisphere? What's the time frame?

*Shanna* - how are you doing with the [potential] changes in your world? For what it's worth, I think you're amazing...frankly, I wouldn't have been prepared to negotiate and compromise to the degree that you have. Not now, not in this climate. You're brave and your DH is lucky to have you.

*PiePie* - how's work? You've been struggling, no?

*Steph* - Did you DH end up losing his job, I can't recall - anything on the horizon?

*Witchy* - Anything on the horizon for you or DH? Are you getting any sleep?

*Christina* - How are you feeling? How's BF'ing.

S is refusing to sleep - I'd better go and save DP.


----------



## witchygrrl

MMM, hope Sebby continues to improve. When Rhea had croup, she ended up with a dose of steroids to help her lungs, but yeah, she healed slowly from that.







to you.

Now it's just waiting for us. DH has applied to every full time art position available within New England that he's qualified for. School systems, at least around here, are painfully slow when it comes to hiring. But we should know next week if he's getting a call back or not. That would at least be progress of a sort. And I'm scouring the listing for jobs that wouldn't be miserable, at least on paper. I am starting to ge t more sleep, though, thankfully.

I can't believe how many two year olds we have,(or soon to be). And that Rhea will be one in just over a month!


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
And Calvin must be having his half-birthdya party soon too









With no hot water, DH's eternally impending lay-off, and zero working cars, we decided to skip it this year. I'm really sad about it, but hope we'll be in a better position to host one next year.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Steph* - Did you DH end up losing his job, I can't recall - anything on the horizon?

Not yet. Still in limbo, though. Feels like applying for other positions would jinx the possibility that he won't be laid off in the end. Lots of superstition and fear surrounding DH's job - mostly living in denial about the whole situation right now.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Not yet. Still in limbo, though. Feels like applying for other positions would jinx the possibility that he won't be laid off in the end. Lots of superstition and fear surrounding DH's job - mostly living in denial about the whole situation right now.

I remember when DH was laid off when we lived in Cali (company went bankrupt) it dragged on for months when he was going to be laid off. I think it made it even worse because you couldn't just move on.









Just finished "Feminine Mistake" and.....has anyone read this? I usually post a review on FB, but I can't possibly talk about it in less 1000 characters







.

DH had to review "Taken" for the magazine he writes for. What a horrible, horrible movie.







I've seen a few doozies lately and I'm starting to think I'll just give up on pop culture until the Office Season 5 comes out on DVD


----------



## ~Shanna~

Anyone here use FuzziBunz CDs? I'm getting really disappointed with how the velcro on our BumGenius are (not) holding up, and wonderful I've I'd like FB better. I'd miss one size though....


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm:

it is definite that we are moving to NZ. we put in our offer on the business today and asked them to provide a few things for us if they accept that we can put into our immigration application (their original business plan for example), and then it's a matter of paper and time.

I hope to have the house ready for the market in a few weeks. i was hoping mid-july, but i lost the last two weeks because my sitter was unreliable. but, she'll be more reliable in the next few weeks, and so i hope to have the house on the market in august.

if they choose not to sell to us (though they said they wanted to), we can still go under skilled migrants. it will be tougher, but it can be done.

but we want the business, and they want to sell it to us, so that should work out no problem!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Just finished "Feminine Mistake" and.....has anyone read this? I usually post a review on FB, but I can't possibly talk about it in less 1000 characters







.
l

Wow! you don't mess around, do you? Where do you find the time? Seriously. It's only been a couple of days since you were just entertaining the thought of reading this book. How can you be finished? Please tell me it's because F is older and one day soon, I'll be able to do this too!
Did you like it? Yes, no or kind of, will suffice!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Anyone here use FuzziBunz CDs? I'm getting really disappointed with how the velcro on our BumGenius are (not) holding up, and wonderful I've I'd like FB better. I'd miss one size though....

I like FB but I have ones with snaps that are OSFA. In fact, I'm about to order more. BG's are the best for night still but I like FB's for day.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
mmm:

it is definite that we are moving to NZ. we put in our offer on the business today and asked them to provide a few things for us if they accept that we can put into our immigration application (their original business plan for example), and then it's a matter of paper and time.

I hope to have the house ready for the market in a few weeks. i was hoping mid-july, but i lost the last two weeks because my sitter was unreliable. but, she'll be more reliable in the next few weeks, and so i hope to have the house on the market in august.

if they choose not to sell to us (though they said they wanted to), we can still go under skilled migrants. it will be tougher, but it can be done.

but we want the business, and they want to sell it to us, so that should work out no problem!

Wow! That's so great. I hope to live abroad again one day. It'd kill me to live in my hometown for the rest of my life (though it IS an awesome hometown!)

...which brings me to my latest new career aspiration...midwifery! Not such a stretch from community development or naturopathy and it's something I could definitely travel with - I'd love to get into international development...and public health is such a broad field...and I really need to go and attend to some nasty nappy rash but I SO want to talk this over more!


----------



## Maela

*MMM*, I hope Sebby is feeling better very soon! It's SO tough seeing them so sick.

Dd has made a full recovery now. It's great to see her back to her old stubborn self.







dh and I missed her!

We had a great time in Monterey, but I'm also glad to be back home. Dd asked several times "can we go home now?" even though I know she had a lot of fun. She and her cousins are so fun to watch. they have little conversations together and make each other laugh.







She even held hands with the one that's the same age as her while we took a walk. He ran away at one point and she yelled, "Come back here!"


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Fenton taking 90+ minutes to get to sleep at night lately







. Really frustrated, I have no time with DH or alone anymore.


can dh do bedtime? i find that i need 10 minutes of pesonal time each day or bad things happen!!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I just bought 8 GREAT shirts (don't shrink, fit great, not see-through) for $114 US.

linky to shirts?


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
...which brings me to my latest new career aspiration...midwifery! Not such a stretch from community development or naturopathy and it's something I could definitely travel with - I'd love to get into international development...and public health is such a broad field...and I really need to go and attend to some nasty nappy rash but I SO want to talk this over more!

so, how long has this idea been percolating? while pregnant i was totally into the idea -- now, not so much.







i chalk it (the fantasy -- because for me it was a fantasy) up to too many episodes of "house of babies."


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
NAK..

So Sebby is super sick. He's got an ear infection and bronchialitis. Of course the GP has loaded us up with steroids and antibiotics and I am really unsure of what to do. The kids chest sounds like it's gonna cave in so I'm a little less reluctant to give him the steroids so he can breathe better but the antibiotics worry me a lot.

What have you folks done with your sick babes?

He already takes probiotics ... on the days i remember to give it to him!

dd is on antibiotics (augmentin) now for her first ear infection. she was so lethargic i went to the emergency room, where the triage nurse diagnosed swine flu and sent me into a tizzy. i was very relieved it was an ear infection and hence treatable. no regrets on the antibiotics. did antibiotics (zithromax) once before when she had pneumonia. no gut reaction then and none so far now.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
so, how long has this idea been percolating? while pregnant i was totally into the idea -- now, not so much.







i chalk it (the fantasy -- because for me it was a fantasy) up to too many episodes of "house of babies."









Yeah - I've been thinking very hard for about 12 months now. I really wanted to ensure that it's not just because I'm currently obsessed with babies!! And I don't think it is. At first I thought I'd probably do doula training with a view to midwifery later on but it doesn't make sense for me to drag it out. If I start studying now, by the time I'm done having kids, I'll be ready to practice and earn a decent income. I'm currently investigating starting study (just one subject) in the July semester...just gotta find someone to care for the little squirmy thing!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 

*Christina* - How are you feeling? How's BF'ing.

Thank you for asking. I'm feeling ok. Incredibly tired, and constantly hungry. I've had a few moments of panic, thinking that I might have to wean dd soon, since it's really hard to get enough to eat. But sometimes I feel better, so I'm not too worried. Bedtime is the hardest. I'm a little worried that she's not getting enough nourishment, so I'm trying to encourage her to eat more. If I give her the foods she really likes, she usually eats plenty.

BFing actually relaxes me, and I'm likely to fall asleep with her at naptime now. BUT when I wake up, I have really low blood sugar and feel too weak to prepare myself some food. So, I just need to start planning ahead, right? Thankfully, I haven't had any vomiting yet. Just lots of food aversions.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Anyone here use FuzziBunz CDs? I'm getting really disappointed with how the velcro on our BumGenius are (not) holding up, and wonderful I've I'd like FB better. I'd miss one size though....

I'm having the same disappointment with BGs. I'm thinking of trying to convert them to snaps. IF I can find/borrow a snap press. I have one FB - I haven't been crazy about the fit - it was big on her until recently, and we've had some leaks. But I've found adding a BG infant insert helps with the fit and the leaks. I've also heard good reviews of their new OS pockets. Apparently you adjust the leg elastic instead of snapping down.

I really like Blueberry OS pockets, but they are majorly $$$. I just found some on DS, for the same price as new BGs.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

DH had to review "Taken" for the magazine he writes for. What a horrible, horrible movie.







I've seen a few doozies lately and I'm starting to think I'll just give up on pop culture until the Office Season 5 comes out on DVD









Didja know you can watch those on Hulu?
I saw a preview for Taken - looks pretty disturbing. Not what I need while pregnant.

MMM, hope Sebby is feeling better soon! I think you would make a wonderful midwife!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MMM*
Shanna - how are you doing with the [potential] changes in your world? For what it's worth, I think you're amazing...frankly, I wouldn't have been prepared to negotiate and compromise to the degree that you have. Not now, not in this climate. You're brave and your DH is lucky to have you.

Shanna, I wish I had more to contribute, but I must agree with MMM here.


----------



## witchygrrl

Shanna, I too want to reiterate what MMM had to say. Trying to negotiate and realize dreams is a tricky thing to do when more than one person is involved! We have a bit of that in the mix as well on our plate, and it's not easy.









Christina, I'm glad things are going okay. Can you have crackers nearby when you nap, so when you wake up there's at least a little something there?

Hoping all the sick babies have a speedy recovery! I'm worried that Rhea will likely catch DH's cold. And she's a bit constipated, too. I think she has a hard time with banana, which is too bad as she loves it!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Sorry about the length of the post. I started it this am and kept adding to it, and now it's huge. Like the chicken coop I tried to build once.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Shanna* - how are you doing with the [potential] changes in your world? For what it's worth, I think you're amazing...frankly, I wouldn't have been prepared to negotiate and compromise to the degree that you have. Not now, not in this climate. You're brave and your DH is lucky to have you.

Thanks for saying that







. I'm hanging in there, but I think it's going to be much harder next spring once we know if he's gotten in somewhere, if the house has sold and just how all of the logistics are going (or not going) to work out. We're talking with each other much more clearly about it, and I've been able to really take in (as opposed to just thinking it and still being angry) that he hasn't done anything in bad faith. It's still difficult for me that this isn't what we agreed to when I spent all that time being the primary $ winner in jobs I didn't like, but he's broken my heart with how important this is to him. I genuinely want him to have what he wants in life, especially if he agrees with my 2 (conservative) conditions. But I'm feeling much better being frustrated rather than angry.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
With no hot water, DH's eternally impending lay-off, and zero working cars, we decided to skip it this year. I'm really sad about it, but hope we'll be in a better position to host one next year.

I'm so sorry that things seem to be getting worse. Is the water heater gas or electric? I wonder about the ease of fixing it yourself, but have no advice on either.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Wow! you don't mess around, do you? Where do you find the time? Seriously. It's only been a couple of days since you were just entertaining the thought of reading this book. How can you be finished? Please tell me it's because F is older and one day soon, I'll be able to do this too! Did you like it? Yes, no or kind of, will suffice!

I've had ample time to read lately, the planets have been kind. MMM, it gets _so_ much better. The other day I think I read for an hour while Fenton played outside right by me, and it's commonplace now for him to explore on his own while I garden, cook or get other chores done - helps immensely when they're old enough to be interested in what you are doing and want to help. The tantrums are tough, but overall I find it just keeps getting easier and easier. Did I like the book







? <sigh> It definitely won't win any awards for not escalating the so-called "Mommy Wars". She's to working mothers what Dr. Laura is to the SAHM. She thinks staying at home has made me stupid and boring, that the job itself is easy and boring, and that I'm a fool to depend on my (presumably abusive) husband to pay the bills. I think parenting is a bizarre marriage of the absolutely magical and the brain-bleedingly mundane, so I can really see how women can divide on those poles. But I don't think the author really believes anyone could possibly like the process of doing what a SAHM does all day. I can sympathize somewhat, because before I read this book, I couldn't understand loving my job enough to not want to leave it if I could. It's not that I didn't believe women when they said this was true, but I couldn't really feel it because it's never been the case for me. Even before I had Fenton, my job interfered with what I wanted to be doing at home. She does a great job explaining and describing women where they find their jobs "exciting" and fascinating". I think, similar to how Dr. Laura thinks every woman's humanity is fulfilled by being at home all day, this author is romanticizing a bit how many women have careers like this. She talks about working outside the home like it's a primitive human need, which is bizarre to me given how recently in human history humans have started to do this. But where she really loses me is how she discusses what it does to the marriage dynamic. A lot of her reasoning sounds suspiciously similar to the diatribes my mother went on as a bitter, divorced woman: Half the species is worthless, you can't trust anyone, etc. I struggle a lot with hoarding ( I make a fetish out of NOT, which isn't much better), and the argument that both partners must work jobs that could support each of them independently sounds a lot like a scarcity mentality that&#8230;.just isn't where I'm at. I get the argument that having 2 incomes helps buffer against uncertain times like we're seeing now. But I can't see approaching my marriage as if my partner were untrustworthy. She calls this naïve, and indeed everyone thinks that divorce can't happen to them. But I think that approaching your partner as if they can't be trusted helps to make the war possible. This is my philosophy in everything from relationships to foreign policy, and it understands the risk that you might look like a fool. She has an entire chapter devoted to the way that sharing an income is infantizing for the SAHP, and it was laughable how I came away from reading it and asked DH if _I_ was oppressing _him_. Everything she was listing as typical of the wage-earner trying to control the SAHP was true of me (and many SAHPs that I know) as the SAHP who is responsible for the finances. DH suggested early on that whoever earns the most money, the other should be responsible for managing the budget. It's worked marvelously for us, because you don't have the primary $-earner being the hard-ass. So basically I have control of all the money, I take the lead on the investments, I give him an allowance out of the budget and he asks me when he needs something big that's not budgeted for "Can we find room for this in the budget?". We each have an amount budgeted that is our own personal money so you don't have to check with the other&#8230;.I just couldn't identify at all with what she was saying. It was even my Dhs idea that all of our retirement investments be in my name since I don't pay into SSI (great idea, I didn't think of it). I just can't relate to this idea that all SAHP have to justify every penny they spend and beg for their allowance along with the children.

Now, having said all that&#8230;what brought me to read the book? Feeling like I'm ready to be something a little more than just a mom, and a marital problem that was making me feel powerless in a major decision.







So clearly some of what she's talking about rings true to me, but I feel like she's killing a fly with a sledgehammer.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*MMM*, I hope Sebby is feeling better very soon! It's SO tough seeing them so sick.

Dd has made a full recovery now. It's great to see her back to her old stubborn self.







dh and I missed her

So many sick babes. It's been a tough summer for illness, very bizarre illness patterns.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
can dh do bedtime? i find that i need 10 minutes of pesonal time each day or bad things happen!!

We do take turns doing bedtime. I confided in him last night that when it's not my night to do bedtime, I feel just a little bit lighter that whole day. We have had good luck this week with a couple of adjustments that have made the bedtime go shorter: 1)We hung a heavy quilt over the curtains, I think the light was making it hard for him to go to sleep and 2) I've stopped napping with him, so he's waking up after 1.5 hours instead of 2.5 hours. Oh, and 3) the brilliant introduction by me of a character named "Jefferson the Happy Monster" who we sing songs about while we're going to sleep. (Jefferson likes to do a lot of the things that Fenton likes to do, but he's too big to fit down the slide







. He loves it, and DH thinks we should make some home videos about jefferson a' la the gnome joke in _Amelie_







. So tomorrow night, after our romantic dinner out for DHs birthday, we're on a scouting mission for a stuffed animal that looks like a "Jefferon".)I think he just wasn't tired at night. And Lord do I agree about getting some personal time. I've just started taking a walk alone after DH gets home from work, and it has worked wonders on my patience. DH isn't taking classes this summer, only working, so it practically feels like I'm on vacation. Well, practically









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
linky to shirts?

The Tees and Tanks are my favorite:
http://www.eddiebauer.com/EB/Women/S...Tops/index.cat

But if you go to the Eddie Bauer site, there's a bunch of different categories for "the Big Sale" - I think it lasts another week or so.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Yeah - I've been thinking very hard for about 12 months now. I really wanted to ensure that it's not just because I'm currently obsessed with babies

This is awesome, MMM. It's a great time for a career change if you want one. Are you still on leave from work? I can't remember what your setup is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Thank you for asking. I'm feeling ok. Incredibly tired, and constantly hungry. I've had a few moments of panic, thinking that I might have to wean dd soon, since it's really hard to get enough to eat. But sometimes I feel better, so I'm not too worried. Bedtime is the hardest. I'm a little worried that she's not getting enough nourishment, so I'm trying to encourage her to eat more. If I give her the foods she really likes, she usually eats plenty.

BFing actually relaxes me, and I'm likely to fall asleep with her at naptime now. BUT when I wake up, I have really low blood sugar and feel too weak to prepare myself some food. So, I just need to start planning ahead, right? Thankfully, I haven't had any vomiting yet. Just lots of food aversions.

It sounds like you're doing a great job looking out for Josephine - if she isn't getting as much milk as she wants, she'll get enough with the food. I totally know what you mean about getting so hungry that you're too weak to put something together. I found that having a jar of peanut butter and some carb like crackers or bread would get me through the crisis so I could have enough energy to make something more sustainable. Cheese too, if it's sounding good. I've lost most of my food aversions&#8230;except for greens. Kale and chard completely disgust me still. Good for you that Bfing is still so enjoyable! Could be you're one of those women who feels that way through the whole pregnancy!

Fenton is still talking a lot about Milk. He wants to constantly "hold the milk", and I'm working on him with "touching Mama's skin" right at my chest rather than down my shirt, which drives me a little nuts. I think he's thinking about it a lot because we've been talking a lot about how the baby will drink milk from Mama's breast and he'll have a snack on a plate, but I feel sad thinking he probably misses nursing. If his gut is healed by then and he wants to, I'd nurse him again in a heartbeat once the baby is here. Could be I'd regret it, but I can't help but still mourn what's probably gone forever.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I'm having the same disappointment with BGs. I'm thinking of trying to convert them to snaps.

Wow, thanks for sharing that. I'm going to have to consider it, the Velcro is getting obnoxious. I've been glad to hear, though, that it's universal and not something that I did wrong.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I saw a preview for Taken - looks pretty disturbing. Not what I need while pregnant.

Disturbing and completely irresponsible. With a major theme being this Dad's interest in protecting his daughters sexual purity uke. I'd send Liam some hate mail if I didn't feel so badly for him that this was what he was working on for the last months of his wife's life









Fenton has been an absolute joy today. Insisted on riding his trike the entire 1/2-3/4 miles to the "park" in the subdivision next door. Took a few hours







. I was exhausted, having carried the trike most of the way. Note for next time.









Are any of you working on nightweaning? I seem to remember it was on the horizon for a lot of us....Maela, how is Maeve doing with nursing at night?


----------



## Maela

*Shanna*, it was great to read a really long post from you again! I missed those.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Are any of you working on nightweaning? I seem to remember it was on the horizon for a lot of us....Maela, how is Maeve doing with nursing at night?

We had a setback from being sick. I (of course) let her nurse at night whenever she wanted and sleep all night in our bed while she was sick, and so it took a few days to get back to no nursing at night after that. But now she's pretty much okay with not nursing in the middle of the night. What we've just started working on now is not nursing to sleep. I still nurse her as part of the 'bedtime routine,' but sitting up and not in her bed. Then we get into her bed and cuddle to sleep. Last night was the first night and she didn't go to sleep until 10:45PM (it took an hour and a half). She cried off and on and got in and out of her bed to play in the dark (while I fell asleep in her bed







). But once she was asleep, she stayed asleep until 7:00AM! Woo hoo! I've been telling her more stories about the little girl who wanted to nurse to sleep, but her mama said no more nursing until morning, and how the little girl was okay and slept well and then woke up and nursed when the sun was up. I think the story really helps.
Tonight she was really tired and fell asleep in my arms before we got to the bed. But she started crying to nurse when I laid her down. She cried for maybe a minute and then cuddled with me and fell back asleep.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm so sorry that things seem to be getting worse. Is the water heater gas or electric? I wonder about the ease of fixing it yourself, but have no advice on either.

The water heater itself was fine. The issue was that our furnace was using too much propane and we ran out in February and couldn't afford to buy more. Then, when we could afford propane, our driveway was being worked on and the propane truck couldn't get to the tank. We finally got everything figured out and got more propane last Monday, two days _after_ we were going to have his party.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Wow, thanks for sharing that. I'm going to have to consider it, the Velcro is getting obnoxious. I've been glad to hear, though, that it's universal and not something that I did wrong.

It is extremely universal, to the point that Cotton Babies will send you replacement velcro tabs to sew on yourself.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Are any of you working on nightweaning? I seem to remember it was on the horizon for a lot of us....Maela, how is Maeve doing with nursing at night?

Not nightweaning, but working on weaning during the day here. Started a little over a week ago and plan to go _very_ slowly, cutting out one hour every 7-10 days. (So, right now we don't nurse between 10-11am or 7-8pm) Goal is to be weaned except for nighttime and naps by his second birthday in Dec and completely weaned by March or April so we can TTC #2.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Dh blogs for our church, and his latest (at the top) is one I thought might interest thoughtful parents.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Are any of you working on nightweaning? I seem to remember it was on the horizon for a lot of us....


We will be, concurrent with sleeping alone, which is the bigger issue, I suspect. We were going to start very soon, but are putting it off for a couple of weeks because we are having guests who wouldn't appreciate the crying and then we are going out of town and will all be in the same hotel room, so it would be very confusing to her. She really does not like DH at night (or really anything around sleep) so it will be an ordeal. ETA: the desire to nightwean is related to ttcing.

More from me later.


----------



## PiePie

had fabulous day with dd today. love her gymnastics class. it is crazy expensive, but the teacher and teh equipment and the activities are a perfect fit for her perosnality and her developmental stage (as opposed to, say, dance, which would be much cheaper, or soccer, which is much more popular even at this age in my hood). i hated gymnastics myself (not to mention that for older girls it butts into a lot of feminist ideals) so i think it is kind of amazing that i am so into it for her.







: i have so much work to do now it is simply stunning. having big old boy network issue at work but boss is backing me which makes me feel unbelievably gratified -- this never happens in real life. oh, i did mention to yall that i got my period back, right? i was totally ecstatic! dh a little less so.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking*
I'm feeling ok.

I probably understated this. It's hard. Nursing does relax me, but it's more like I can feel all of the energy draining out of me. I manage to get down a meal, then DD nurses, and it's all gone and I need to start over again. It just feels like the two of us spend the whole day eating. (dh says this is his dream.







) Looking forward to the day I like food again&#8230;

We had a really rough time getting her to sleep on Monday, and then realized what she needed was to bring a cup of water to bed. That made a huge difference. I think if she gets to about 3 or 4 nursings a day, I'll be fine, but we're far from that.

Shanna, it was nice to read your long post again too. It's good to hear your thoughts on that book and your take on SAHPing. I like the way you and dh handle your budget&#8230;.mental note to bring that up with my dh.

Piepie, glad you like the gymnastics class. I've come to realize that gymnastics is great for this age. Dd is climbing all over, it's amazing to see her muscle development happen so rapidly. (She just learned how to climb on and off the rocking horse by herself!) I'd like to do a gym class with her too, but I don't want to give up music class, and can't really swing both.

And why was your dh not so ecstatic over af returning?









Oh, and I keep forgetting to mention this: I am totally fascinated with J's verbal development lately. Wow! She's learning new words at a rate of about 1/day. She'll also repeat words pretty readily, even if she doesn't really 'learn' them. And she's making up her own phrases - like "nigh-nigh" for going to sleep. We never really used that - maybe it's her version of goodnight (?). She was going through Goodnight Gorilla, which we just got, and declared "keys!"...then when she got to the dark page with eyes: "nigh-nigh!"







I guess 15 months is normal for this leap?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
had fabulous day with dd today. love her gymnastics class. it is crazy expensive, but the teacher and teh equipment and the activities are a perfect fit for her perosnality and her developmental stage (as opposed to, say, dance, which would be much cheaper, or soccer, which is much more popular even at this age in my hood). i hated gymnastics myself (not to mention that for older girls it butts into a lot of feminist ideals) so i think it is kind of amazing that i am so into it for her.







: i have so much work to do now it is simply stunning. having big old boy network issue at work but boss is backing me which makes me feel unbelievably gratified -- this never happens in real life. oh, i did mention to yall that i got my period back, right? i was totally ecstatic! dh a little less so.

Congratulations on your period!!!!!!!







: I was surprised by how much I missed mine while it was gone. So.....TTC in the near future?







Dh should be happy about that







. Although we always got pregnant quicker than DH wished we did.

I'm so glad you're getting support at work from your boss - I naively am still shocked whenever I run into the Good Ol Boy network. Is it generational in your case? I've noticed that it's not as generational as is sometimes assumed, that men my age engage in it but it looks a little different: Less "We've always done it this way, this is the way it is little girl" and more "I want to work with people I 'gel' with.". Blech.

Reading "Queen Bees and Wannabees" - fascinating, but so sad to be reminded. I think I'm starting to panic that Ku could be a girl. More later, Thomas the train is driving on myzx keyboard







KJA`WZXAQWC


----------



## PiePie

*Christina*, 15 mos. is early for the language you are describing. 18 mos. would be typical. I think there is a huge bias in terms of what we read here in that the moms who talk abou their kids' development are likely to be kvelling so you get a skewed sample.

We are officially trying. DH would prefer an October baby because it works with his work schedule














: (SOMETIMES I AM SO JEALOUS OF HIS WORK!) -- I would prefer an April or even March baby, primarily because of I think that more closely spaced kids are more likely to be true compadres (although less than 2 year spacing simply wouldn't work for me) and have more in common developmentally but also because the weather would be best for my maternity leave, assuming a 6 mo. leave. (The less leave I have, the later I could go, but the idea would be to not waste it on November-early March. Not that DD and I couldn't have tons of fun in the children's museums, etc.) But we will see. I am trying to be zen about it and not get all







if it doesn't take, trying to be confident that I will give DD a sib by the end of 2010 (my goal) and that if not at least our life is complete with her.

We both have anxieties about upsetting our perfect little life now by throwing in an unknown element -- what if not as perfect as DD?? -- and also that we are pretty darn maxed out now, can't imagine how we would do more. I trust that 9+ mos. from now she will be more independent -- certainly all of our babes are mindblowing far from where they were 9 mos. ago today.

I also think that next time I am going to do things differently and prioritize date nights earlier on. I hope that doesn't sound anti-AP but I have found that it is much harder to separate from DD when I am separating to WOH.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*, yay for the return of AF!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Oh, and I keep forgetting to mention this: I am totally fascinated with J's verbal development lately. Wow! She's learning new words at a rate of about 1/day. She'll also repeat words pretty readily, even if she doesn't really 'learn' them. And she's making up her own phrases - like "nigh-nigh" for going to sleep. We never really used that - maybe it's her version of goodnight (?). She was going through Goodnight Gorilla, which we just got, and declared "keys!"...then when she got to the dark page with eyes: "nigh-nigh!"







I guess 15 months is normal for this leap?

This was right when things started to get exciting (language-wise) with Dd! You're going to have so much fun in the next few months! I







ed it! Dd is still blowing my mind every day.

I'm feeling a little overwhelmed with all the (extended) family-related stuff we've been doing lately. I haven't had any time to work on my LLL Leader stuff and Hypnobabies. It's stressing me out. I've only got 3 more months before it's baby time. Good news: I have a friend who's going to give me 10 newborn-size covers for free!


----------



## PiePie

had to endure enormous diatribe from my boss today against cosleeping friends of hers. i kept saying, what do the people who live in the house think? (because theirs is the only opinion that matters.) totally closeted with regard to ap at work. obviously pumping is well known. she was actually calling to ask my advice re babywearing. babywearing (the ergo totally trumps the bjorn) and nursing infants are the ap practices that are the norm in nyc. you just can't do public transit with a stroller here very easily. boss is on maternity leave but calls or emails like every day.


----------



## accountclosed3

we had a cool experience yesterday while at the chiropractor.

we met a couple having their first baby (she's 43 yrs old!), and we talked about a lot of AP stuff. she was totally into it, and we had a great conversation for a good hour and a half! traded numbers and everything. i'm so psyched for her!

we got to show breastfeeding and EC and baby-wearing first hand and talked about cosleeping. just talked about doing what feels right and natural for you, and not worrying too much about what others say. she said that helped her quite a bit!

also, i am thinking about doula training. don't know if it's right for me, but thinking about it. who knows? not like i don't have 10,000 things to do already.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Soooo sad there's nowhere here to talk about latest news developments


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm looking for some thoughtful advice before I ask the wider audience. Fenton is taking about 90+ minutes to get to sleep at night. We used to do a full routine of 3 books, 2 songs and cuddling until he fell asleep, until I started to see that I was exhausting myself and it didn't seem to help him fall asleep sooner. Now we read 1 or 2 books, sometimes sing a song, and then I eventually roll over and say "Mama needs to rest" and he stays in bed with me, playing with a toy until he eventually lays down and goes to sleep.
I feel like an idiot laying down with this child for an hour and a half, when he's playing with his toys anyway. I can't read, I can't do anything but lay there. DH usually falls alsleep, which is making him resentful. DH feels that we should start helping him to do this same routine (playing in bed until sleeping) but without us there. I agree it should be reasonable, but I have a strong suspicion that the relaxing doesn't start to happen for him unless we're there too. Any ideas or suggestions? I don't feel great about having him bring toys into bed, but it is no longer an option for me to be an active faciliator in this for 90 minutes. Pushing the bedtime back hasn't helped, and it doesn't appear that he can do without the afternoon nap.

I had a Sprite and some white bread with my dinner tonight. I feel awful







. Great weekend though, I hope all of you had a great one as well!


----------



## Maela

Shanna, Sorry can't help as we often have the same problem. Lately, since SIL has been here, we've been out late and she's fallen asleep on the way home in the car. But today she took an hour nap on the way home from the zoo, and then I couldn't get her to sleep until 11PM. I know that part of it is that she's learning to fall asleep w/o nursing, but she's also just been this way her whole life. And Dh and I are tired of it. She has her good days when it only takes 15-20 minutes to fall asleep (I could definitely live with that). The average day is probably 45 minutes. The bad days - an hour and a half like you.







My dh also thinks that now that she's (almost) two, we should be encouraging her to fall asleep on her own (how w/o letting her CIO?). I feel like we can't expect her to fall asleep completely on her own at this age. But I _do_ think that it shouldn't take longer than 20 minutes of me laying there with her. Of course, because we're slowly weaning, I don't know if it's going to get any better any time soon.














I'm sad that SIL and her kids will be leaving on Wed, but I'm also eager to try to get a bit of rhythm into our days. I feel like every day is so jam-packed and chaotic and it's really taking a toll on Dd's behavior and sleep. I know SIL feels the same way with her kids. The ILs just like to go, go, go whenever she is visiting, and I think it's hard for her to say no to them.

Anyway, just letting you know I sympathize with you.







If you figure something out let me know!


----------



## Maela

Today I am officially in the third trimester!!


----------



## PiePie

if dd is ACTIVELY playing, i decide that bedtime is not happening and everyone gets up for 10 minues and then we try again. last night we did that and before the ten minutes were up she was pulling my finger saying "mama come sleep!!"


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
if dd is ACTIVELY playing, i decide that bedtime is not happening and everyone gets up for 10 minues and then we try again. last night we did that and before the ten minutes were up she was pulling my finger saying *"mama come sleep!!"*

Oh, to hear those words from Dd!! I think I would faint.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Shopping tips:
-I just got an email from Eddie Bauer saying they have free shipping on all that clearance stuff, for 3 days only. Saves you an extra ~$10 or so.
-Victoria's Secret has discontinued their nursing bras, but you can still buy what they have left online. Never tried one, but I have it from good sources they are great, though $$$. They have one style with underwire (~$47) and one without (~$44).

Buying new nursing bras. Mine from Motherhood did NOT hold up well, and never fit well besides. I was measured late in pg with Fenton, and they told me to buy 38 EE, while I am a 34C prior to pg. Got measured again today and was told 36 C.







Sounds a bit like astrology to me.

Oh, and I'm thinking about doing a belly cast. Anyone do one? I have this beautiful image of a belly cast decorated with small silk sunflowers on the belly, and silk fall leaves on the rest of the torso, mostly reds. Fall baby is very inspiring 

Thanks for the tips on sleep. I might try the 10 minute rule PiePie, though I have a sense the clock starts at the last lie-down







. I'm really frustrated, and I share Maela's thought that he's too young to just go to sleep on his own without cio. Still....90 minutes is causing some major problems.

Still haven't caught that damn mouse, but now I'm certain he's here. He taunts me. I'm busting out my nuclear options tonight







:.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
-Victoria's Secret has discontinued their nursing bras, but you can still buy what they have left online. Never tried one, but I have it from good sources they are great, though $$$. They have one style with underwire (~$47) and one without (~$44).

Buying new nursing bras. Mine from Motherhood did NOT hold up well, and never fit well besides. I was measured late in pg with Fenton, and they told me to buy 38 EE, while I am a 34C prior to pg. Got measured again today and was told 36 C.







Sounds a bit like astrology to me.


They had nursing bras? For some reason I never thought they did. And of course now, they are discontinuing them. I am having a heck of a time with nursing bras. They all seem to roll on me. Argh.

Can't believe Maela's in the 3rd trimester now...Shanna, you are too now, right? Wow


----------



## Holiztic

Been lurking but had to jump in on the bedtime thing.

Until 1.5 weeks ago Quinn was taking 90 minutes to get down, too. He just wasn't tired enough.

He wanted to go downstairs, wanted to read more stories/a different story, etc. We were snacked/diapered/pajamaed, and toothbrushed by 8, then 3-6 stories, then rocking in the rocking chair, then "back on little bed", then "back in rocking chair", etc etc. until he finally couldn't fight it any longer and fell asleep in my arms (rocking chair or standing and swaying). This, BTW, was the first month of no nursing to sleep.

I was getting so frustrated!

So we started a multi-prong approach to solving this problem, I don't know which 1 or more solution solved it (or maybe ALL of them together), but here is our plan:

1) nutritional: Baby Calm (magnesium)--one dose anytime during the day
2) homeopathic: Hyland's Calms Forte for kids: 2 at 7, 7:15, 7:30 and 7:45
3) Bach Flower Essence: Oak: 4 drops in water 4 times per day
4) Herbal: Badger Sleep Balm (with sleepy herbs) rubbed on his chest, wrists, temples, and feet when he gets his PJs
5) Physical: DH (sometimes me) takes him outside for 1-1.5 hours after dinner to get fresh air and run out the last of his energy
6) NO MORE NAP! He was already showing signs of dropping it, but just couldn't quite make it to bedtime (napping at 4 or 5!), so now I do WHATEVER it takes to keep him asleep until 8+am, that way he isn't sleepy at 4) This means I spend 6:30 to 8 Shhhsh-ing and patting his back while he rolls around constantly, but he's asleep!
7) Environmental: put up curtains (not totally light blocking, but darker than the mini blinds were!

So this is how our evening looks now:

5:30 Dinner
6:00-7:15 Play outside with Daddy (Calms Forte at 7)
7:15 Diaper, Pajamas, Badger Balm, Calms Forte
7:30 Before bed snack, Calms Forte (not ideal with food, but oh well)
7:45 Calms Forte, Brush teeth (also not ideal homeopathically, but oh well again)
7:50 Read 1-2 stories until it is "too dark to read" (no lights! just the light filtering through the curtains)
around 8 when story is done, we get in the rocker with a pillow under his head and rock while I sing
8:10-8:15 He's asleep

So depending on what you call "getting him to sleep" I suppose you might call this anywhere from 25 minutes to 2 hours, but since it was taking 90 minutes of JUST stories and rocking and such all AFTER toothbrushing/pajamas, I consider it from 7:50-8:15, which we are LOVING! Also, he was going to sleep at 9:30 before, 8:15 now!

Don't know if any of this helps, but I hope so!!

NOTE: today is the first day in 1.5 weeks that I simply could not keep him asleep until 8, he was up at 7:15 and now at 4:15 he's acting awfully tired, think I'll move everything up by half an hour for tonight!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Can't believe Maela's in the 3rd trimester now...Shanna, you are too now, right? Wow









Um...I'm not sure







When does 3rd trimester begin? I think I'm 23 or 24 weeks. Or 25. It's on my calendar but I can't remember.

Taking the plunge on converting BG velcro to snaps.

Holiztic, thanks for the advice. Everyone suggests he doesn't need the nap, but I can't seen pushing him from 3 pm until bed.







He still seems so tired in early afternoon....


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Um...I'm not sure







When does 3rd trimester begin? I think I'm 23 or 24 weeks. Or 25. It's on my calendar but I can't remember.

Taking the plunge on converting BG velcro to snaps.

Holiztic, thanks for the advice. Everyone suggests he doesn't need the nap, but I can't seen pushing him from 3 pm until bed.







He still seems so tired in early afternoon....

I am 27 weeks, and I don't know where I found out, but I had it written down somewhere that on July 5th, I would be in the 3rd trimester.















So I'm guessing your just a couple of weeks away from it too Shanna.

Re: naps - We also do everything we can to keep her from napping now. I feel bad sometimes because she does get tired around 4PM. But if Dd naps anytime after 1PM for any length of time, she's up past nine _at least_ (usually 10 or 11PM). Now that we've mostly given up on the naps, she sleeps in later in the morning (8 or 9AM).


----------



## PiePie

i always counted it at 28w.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Interesting article in the New Yorker. Has me wondering if I'm somewhat alone in not seeing parenting as something that is difficult, technical and something I'm bad at? I feel like an alien when other parents cite research and data to back up parenting decisions they make - not as if it doesn't inform a lot of decisions we make, but I never feel like parenting has footnotes and a bibliography for me, I guess. There haven't been many issues in parenting where I didn't have a strong sense of how to do it or what to do, even if I couldn't tell you why. But maybe that's predicated on not having just a few ideas of how it's done? i'm remarkably forgiving of myself as a parent, maybe more than I should be







. Anyway, the article is a hoot.

It reminded me of perhaps the biggest beef I had with "Feminine Mistake" (which, by the way, it has only taken me 2 weeks plus a Feminist husband to notice the play on "Feminine Mystique".







). I share her opinion that benign neglect is a wonderful way to raise children: let them know you are there to love them, keep them out of danger, but pretty much let them explore on their own and not see me as their activity director. But the author seems to think that WOH is the only way to do this - there's no room in the book for SAHP who designs their life at home so that the LOs see themselves as part of something larger. I could go on, but I don't want to bore you. Sorry to keep rambling about this book - it had enough interesting things to say that I can't help but critique it rather than just dismissing it.

I drew the long straw on taking the car in for the oil change today - this means I got to drop off the car, and have breakfast alone in a cafe with my book to read!







: I can't believe how refreshed i feel.

Anyone see Food, Inc. yet? Torn between it and.....<ahem> Bruno for date night next week.







:. My lowbrow side usually wins out


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Re: naps - We also do everything we can to keep her from napping now.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
6) NO MORE NAP! He was already showing signs of dropping it, but just couldn't quite make it to

I'm going to try this tomorrow. I'm terrified. But today I spent 1 hour getting him to sleep at his nap, and started to wonder if he really isn't tired. It's confusing, because he's usually a mess by 3 without a nap. Wish me luck.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Anyone know anything about commercial carpet cleaning services? I'm being indecisive over here.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm going to try this tomorrow. I'm terrified. But today I spent 1 hour getting him to sleep at his nap, and started to wonder if he really isn't tired. It's confusing, because he's usually a mess by 3 without a nap. Wish me luck.

Do everything you can to get him to sleep 1 hour later than usual tomorrow morning! IF it doesn't work tomorrow that's probably because he napped today, but after a few days of no nap, he'll NEED the extra hour!

Good luck!!!!!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm going to try this tomorrow. I'm terrified. But today I spent 1 hour getting him to sleep at his nap, and started to wonder if he really isn't tired. It's confusing, because he's usually a mess by 3 without a nap. Wish me luck.

Good luck! Dd is/was the same way. It would take FOREVER to get her down for a nap, but then by 4 or 5 PM she was a wreck. IMHO there's a transition phase in there moving from one to no naps that's no fun for the parents or baby. She's better now, but I think we're still at the tail-end of that phase.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Do everything you can to get him to sleep 1 hour later than usual tomorrow morning! IF it doesn't work tomorrow that's probably because he napped today, but after a few days of no nap, he'll NEED the extra hour!

Good luck!!!!!

Yes to this!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Zoebird:* Have you told your folks that you're moving South? How did they react?

I woke in the middle of the night wondering that!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Mamas, I'd really appreciate you weighing in on our TTC #2 issues...I think we're in trouble.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Mamas, I'd really appreciate you weighing in on our TTC #2 issues...I think we're in trouble.









*MMM*,







I'm sorry I don't really think I have any useful advice, but I wanted you to know that I read it and I'm sorry you two are having this dilemma. It stinks; I don't know what I'd do. I hope you find a solution that satisfies both of you soon.

Just had a really fun one-on-one day with Maev. She's so sweet.


----------



## cking

MMM, ditto what Maela said.







I don't know what I'd do either.


----------



## Maela

I am very itchy on my arms, hands, legs and feet. When I scratch it a lot, light red bumps appear sometimes in lines, sometimes in groups. If I scratch really hard they turn whitish for a while. It doesn't hurt. It's slowly been increasing in the last couple of weeks. At first I thought they were just bug bites because we were outside so much.

Last pregnancy, I had something kind of similar but it was only on my hands and around my mouth and (*TMI*) my butt was itchy. It turned out to be a mango allergy that I had never known about because I had never eaten so many mangoes before. So maybe I'm just extra sensitive to some food/product in pregnancy? I rarely have problems with sensitive skin/food allergies...

What is this??

ETA: I have been swimming a lot in the IL's pool lately. Maybe there's something in the chemicals they use that I'm sensitive to during pg?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela, I have no idea.... But since you had something similar with Maeve, it seems unlikely that it's something like poison ivy (though you said it doesn't hurt...)

I know with all of my pg, I've known before BFP because I got a cold sore. Could be just one of those weird things that your body expresses when pregnant.

"No nap" experiment still going on. Need more data







. He slept great last night, but woke up 30 minutes _earlier_ this am. He didn't melt yesterday until about 4:30, and even then for only 30 minutes. I went upstairs around 7 to put clothes away, and found him asleep on the couch. I think I said _"Noooo!!!!!"_







. Woke him up and got him in the bath, I don't think he was asleep long because he woke right up. Biggest problem yesterday was that I needed a break. 12 straight hours of being climbed on and molested had me losing it at the end. I have some ideas, just need to implement.

Can't remember if Fenton is the only LO here who watches videos sometimes. We've been _really_ enjoying the Pixar shorts DVD. The videos are only 2-4 minutes long and don't have marketed characters in them. Fenton seems to really enjoy being able to follow the problem-solving in such a short story.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Oooohh!!!!! I just got a package from a friend! All her cloth dipe hand-me-downs! Including some Blueberries!!!!







:


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Maela* - itchy skin in pregnancy can be completely normal - and usually is. In rare cases, and my friend was one, it can indicate a prob with your liver. I've linked the basics here.


----------



## accountclosed3

MMM:

we have told them. they're not happy, but they are supportive and undertand our reasoning for wanting to go. we are getting a good deal of work done in that direction each day.

i can't speak specifically to the special dynamics of your TTC question, but i do see how hard that can be.

it seems to me that you two discussed a lot of life plans around both pregnancies, and now, for you, it feels like she's "renigging" or going back on your shared original agreement. and that can be difficult and frustrating!

with this, there are experiences that you agreed to, against your preferneces, on the belief that you would be able to have that experience later. so, there may also be some resentment about that.

i think that if you work through these feelings first, you'll begin to see clearly what the path for you both may be, that honors both of you. i know that's what you want, but working through the feelings is often the hardest and most difficult part!

aside from this, it may also be that she is simply considering that process, not actually desiring it. there is a vast distance between those two. so, in your discussions, really listen to her and ask her if this is really something that she wants, or something that she is just considering, and also ask her to be patient with you as you work through your feelings.

i think that you both will discover the right path for your family. it just takes a bit of effort, and i'm sure you're used to that.


----------



## accountclosed3

MMM:

we have told them. they're not happy, but they are supportive and undertand our reasoning for wanting to go. we are getting a good deal of work done in that direction each day.

i can't speak specifically to the special dynamics of your TTC question, but i do see how hard that can be.

it seems to me that you two discussed a lot of life plans around both pregnancies, and now, for you, it feels like she's "renigging" or going back on your shared original agreement. and that can be difficult and frustrating!

with this, there are experiences that you agreed to, against your preferneces, on the belief that you would be able to have that experience later. so, there may also be some resentment about that.

i think that if you work through these feelings first, you'll begin to see clearly what the path for you both may be, that honors both of you. i know that's what you want, but working through the feelings is often the hardest and most difficult part!

aside from this, it may also be that she is simply considering that process, not actually desiring it. there is a vast distance between those two. so, in your discussions, really listen to her and ask her if this is really something that she wants, or something that she is just considering, and also ask her to be patient with you as you work through your feelings.

i think that you both will discover the right path for your family. it just takes a bit of effort, and i'm sure you're used to that.


----------



## Maela

I'm seeing a slight improvement in Dd being able to fall asleep w/o nursing. I think she's getting used to it. Still taking longer than I would like, but there is improvement. We take a bath, brush teeth, nurse for 5 minutes (I set a timer







), and then we climb into bed read a book and then cuddle to sleep. Tonight, after we got into bed, it took ~25 minutes for her to fall asleep!









And I think I've finally made a decision on whether or not to tandem nurse. I was planning on weaning completely soon. But today I realized that I would totally be okay with keeping that one short (timed 5 min) session before bed for another year or so. It would just take 5 min every night to give her that one-on-one attention without having to actually nurse her to sleep. And she would always know that she had that time with me to look forward to. She is very much okay with the timer. She asks "where's the timer?" if she doesn't see it, and some days she even pops off and climbs into bed before it beeps. I think this would help her with the transition to big sister without making me go crazy. I feel like completely weaning just a month or two before the baby comes would be really hard on her. Also the thought of weaning is starting to make me sad. Up until now, I was surprised at how little I was bothered by it. But recently it's been making me feel panicky. I think I would be fine if she chose to wean, but I just don't know if I could cut her off myself (without a very good reason).Could be pg hormones. I have been feeling more emotional/anxious lately.

So now we just have to cut out that morning nursing. I'll try that in a week or two.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Maela* - itchy skin in pregnancy can be completely normal - and usually is. In rare cases, and my friend was one, it can indicate a prob with your liver. I've linked the basics here.

Thanks for this! I'm going to mention it to my mw on tuesday when i see her.


----------



## PiePie

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...=1247497307023


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...=1247497307023

I had this open on the computer planning on reading it, when dh saw it and read it. He asked me, "I forgot, why did we move her to her own bed?" And I told him that I was scared to have both Dd in bed with us with a newborn because we only have a queen. That we could put our floor on the bed and put Dd's twin mattress next to it, but our room wouldn't look nice for a couple of years, and I thought he wasn't willing to do that. Anyway, I guess he's re-thinking it now. We're still not sure what we're going to do, but I'm glad that we are more on the same page now. Thanks.


----------



## witchygrrl

thanks for that link, PiePie.

A mother I casually know was telling me how she lets her son CIO, but not to the point of gagging/choking. Because that's when something's actually wrong. Inside my heart was breaking, but I found it hard to say otherwise, especially as she's a single mother with a lot of challenges. She does know we cosleep, and is just too afraid of it herself, I guess.


----------



## accountclosed3

personally, i love it when people say "i don't CIO, i do CC--controlled crying." yeah, it's the same thing from what i can tell.

in regards to co-sleeping, i was talking to a neighbor about this. she's a cutie (about 25, unmarried, etc), and her friend was there. her friend is due any day now. so, my neighbor asks me about my birth, and i talk about UC. hawk is wrapped, so we talk about wraps, and then i ECed him while we were chatting (outside, becausse he likes that), and then he crawled around and gently patted her dog.

and then, we talked about co-sleeping. i talked about how awesome it is, how much i love it, how healthy it is, etc. and the girl was like "what?" as if all the other things--oh yeah, i breast fed too--were totally Ok with her, but the cosleeping was questionable. so funny.

maela--the nursing bit, that sounds like a good plan.


----------



## Maela

Oh my goodness it's quiet in here lately!!

HAPPY 2ND BIRTHDAY TO MAEV AND NATALINA (tomorrow)!!!!

We're having a little party for Dd - just close family. I made lasagna tonight and I just have to pop it in the oven tomorrow. It's my first time though and we're an Italian family, so wish me luck!







: For gifts, Dh and I got her these little sea animal figurines, some stickers, construction paper, child-sized scissors, a felt board, and Dh and I made little props out of felt to go with her felt finger puppets. We also made a cute card together. Tomorrow I'm baking two cakes, another thing to keep my







: for







. I'm not the best at baking.

I think I'm more excited than Maev is.









BTW, we have had four days in a row of it only taking us 30 minutes or less to put her to sleep.







: She's still waking up multiple times a night, but I've started bringing her back to our bed if it gets to be too much; so it's not awful. Hopefully, all four of us will fit when the baby comes. Baby boy is moving around like crazy today!! I







it.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
maela--the nursing bit, that sounds like a good plan.









Thanks.


----------



## cking

HAPPY BIRTHDAY MAEV AND NATALINA!







:







:

Maela, good luck with the party!

I'm on vacation this week, but will probably have a lot to write after we get back tomorrow.


----------



## witchygrrl

HAPPY BIRTHDAY to MAEVE & NATALINA!

Enjoy the party, Maela. I hope everything comes out well.







I can't wait for Rhea's first birthday in two weeks!

Poor Rhea has been miserable with a fever. She's been very drooly too, and I can't help but think she's got a molar or something. In typical fashion though, I can't find it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
BTW, we have had four days in a row of it only taking us 30 minutes or less to put her to sleep.







: She's still waking up multiple times a night, but I've started bringing her back to our bed if it gets to be too much; so it's not awful. Hopefully, all four of us will fit when the baby comes. Baby boy is moving around like crazy today!! I







it.

Congrats!!!! It's very freeing to have some time back







.
Ku has been moving often and more enthusiastically the past 2 days - I wonder if it's more than coincidence.

We're having mixed luck over here. We've definately done away with the nap (except on Thursday, which is errand day - he naps ~30 minutes around 10 am. last week it didn't seem to affect anything, but yesterday it took a LONG time to get him to sleep at night.). He's falling asleep in about 30 minutes, sleeping great. But he's waking up around 6:30 am (!) and we have to REALLY keep him going all day. I try to avoid being in a car after about 2 pm. It feels sort of off to keep him from sleep when he wants it so desperately around 4 (meltdown every day 4:30-5)....I feel like there are no good options here. My idealistic side tells me to stop managing it so tightly, but when I've allowed it to go pell mell, he's miserable AND I'm miserable AND there's no rhythm. He's geting about 10.5 hours of sleep either way, but now I'm not laying in bed with him for 2.5 hours each day, just waiting for him to fall asleep. So I guess it's an improvement. He doesn't seem to want more than 10.5 no matter what....curious how it will change when days are shorter.

Big strides in learning the potty. I've embraced letting him go commando when we're home after I saw how well it worked for him, and we've only had 2 accidents in a few days. But today he's started letting me know even with a dipe on. It's exciting to see how proud he is. Definately makes life a little more difficult, getting him there in time...And of course we're doing this just as I'm converting our velcro BG to snaps









Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY to MAEVE & NATALINA!

Enjoy the party, Maela. I hope everything comes out well.







I can't wait for Rhea's first birthday in two weeks!

Poor Rhea has been miserable with a fever. She's been very drooly too, and I can't help but think she's got a molar or something. In typical fashion though, I can't find it.

Happy birthday Maeve and Natalina!!!!!!!!!

Poor Rhea







That molar is a bear - DH and i were just talking about how we've already forgotten how hard those first 2 years are. I cant believe I'll possibly be reliving 7 pm fussy time again soon. I hope we've evolved a lot in knowing we can't eliminate all of DCs suffering - that was a lot of the anguish the first time, feeling like if I just did the right thing, he wouldn't suffer. I recently saw some like-minded friends who had #2 in October, and it seemed like they were much more calm about things like that, less solution-oriented. I aspire to that this time around.

I'm having that 6-month convergence of projects, that sudden realization that this pregnancy isn't going to last forever and I'm going to need to wrap up some of these plans and projects. I just finished my Continuing Education Units for the next 2 years, and am close to having all of Fenton's and Ku's dipes converted from velcro to snaps. I have a pair of babylegs I want to finish knitting (tough with my gimpy thumb), Ku's Christmas stocking (same), the regular cleaning and organizing pg projects, and initiate some WAH possibilities. An idea that I've kicked around since I was pregnant with Fenton was to go through the birth educator training with Birthing From Within. The situation with DHs post-grad plans has opened the possibility up more, ironically. I think I've definately decided I want to do it, and I'm still mulling over the logistics, commitment and cost. DH has been wonderfully supportive and I've been typically cautious - even to the extent that he thinks the return-on-investment is irrelevent, which is freeing. It's been good for us both to see him be enthusiastic and me be overly-cautious even when the shoe is on the other foot. Good to see it's temperment and not self-interest that has each of us viewing his situation the way we do. So anyway, exciting possibilities for me in that. It's sort of funny, I'm really not big on traditional birth "classes". But this philosophy was so incredibly supportive to me when I was working through intense birth fears, and I love how, as opposed to a lot of other preparation philosophies, BFW is more detached from outcome. I had a dream last week that I was teaching again and I was so happy doing it....There is a lot converging, it's difficult to ignore it.

There is a rootbeer float and The Big Lebowski calling my name. It's a crime not to answer


----------



## ~Shanna~

Fenton pooped in the potty!







:

It's a big day around here


----------



## PiePie

Yay Fenton! Yesterday dd asked to have her diaper off so she could use the potty -- she prefers the seat over the adult toilet -- and peed there. both times she haws peed in the potty it has been under dh's attention. this time at least i was home -- dh said i was a little too enthusiastic about it.

going to poas tomorrow. have 2 boy names and 2 girls names. girl middle is wide open. the fact that i actually got dh to talk about names last night is a miracle. if i get a positive, no more pressuring him until 20 weeks. won't find out the gender.


----------



## PiePie

i am a little concerned about gender dysphoria. dd will say she is a boy when asked. okay, sometimes she says she is a monkey or a sea lion or a baby. babies don't have gender -- so it's no to boy, no to girl, yes to baby. but i am concerned. i don't want her to have a narrow definition of what being a girl means -- i sometimes dress her as "boy" just to subvert that -- but i do want her to know she is a girl and to love being a girl. bff's dp is trans and frankly it was a super painful experience. please tell me i am overworrying this. interestingly, although she does not attach labels, she has shown strong gender awareness since early infancy -- preferring adult male strangers and older female children. true to this day.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Yay Fenton! Yesterday dd asked to have her diaper off so she could use the potty -- she prefers the seat over the adult toilet -- and peed there. both times she haws peed in the potty it has been under dh's attention. this time at least i was home -- dh said i was a little too enthusiastic about it.

going to poas tomorrow. have 2 boy names and 2 girls names. girl middle is wide open. the fact that i actually got dh to talk about names last night is a miracle. if i get a positive, no more pressuring him until 20 weeks. won't find out the gender.

Yay Lorelei! I was in denial for a long time that Fenton would only use the potty if he was naked. Now I (almost) embrace it. And yay for poas - you've been holding that card close to your chest, sister







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am a little concerned about gender dysphoria. dd will say she is a boy when asked. okay, sometimes she says she is a monkey or a sea lion or a baby. babies don't have gender -- so it's no to boy, no to girl, yes to baby. but i am concerned. i don't want her to have a narrow definition of what being a girl means -- i sometimes dress her as "boy" just to subvert that -- but i do want her to know she is a girl and to love being a girl. bff's dp is trans and frankly it was a super painful experience. please tell me i am overworrying this. interestingly, although she does not attach labels, she has shown strong gender awareness since early infancy -- preferring adult male strangers and older female children. true to this day.

Fenton does this too, along the same lines of confusing pronouns [he with she, you with I]. Also, and this may be OT, remember how long I had that middle-of-the-night fuzziness when I thought Fenton was a girl? I think there are a lot of things along the spectrum of understanding identity. And, frankly, she'll be who she is no matter what we worry about







. But yes, DH and i often talk about what it will mean if any of our children have anything in their life that brings them pain, with sexual identity often being the easiest thing for us to imagine.

Dry diaper still, and it's 4 pm!!!!! Thinking about getting some trainers, he's moved to letting me know even in public when he has to go and it takes me 5+ minutes to find a restroom. My life is SO different than it was 2 weeks ago







. Dreading spending $ on trainers, but I think he needs to be able to pull up and down.....


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Poor Rhea







That molar is a bear - DH and i were just talking about how we've already forgotten how hard those first 2 years are. I cant believe I'll possibly be reliving 7 pm fussy time again soon. I hope we've evolved a lot in knowing we can't eliminate all of DCs suffering - that was a lot of the anguish the first time, feeling like if I just did the right thing, he wouldn't suffer. I recently saw some like-minded friends who had #2 in October, and it seemed like they were much more calm about things like that, less solution-oriented. I aspire to that this time around.

Yes to this! I feel the same way.
Glad to hear the "no nap" solution just *might* be working for you!









We are going to be trying something a little scary tomorrow. Dd is going to spend the night at my parents.







We're going to be 8 minutes away at our house, and my mom promised to call if she gets very upset, but I'm still nervous about it. I think she'll be okay falling asleep, but I'm not sure how she'll react when she wakes up in the middle of the night and my mom comforts her instead of dh or me. We're going to go get her a little sleeping bag today with her birthday money. Wish us luck.







:

PiePie, good luck with the POAS!!
I don't have any advice about the gender thing. Dd talks a lot about boys and girls and who has a penis and who has a vulva.







Often in very public places.







But sometimes she is in one of her stubborn, oppositional moods and she'll insist girls are boys and boys are girls. She doesn't seem to have a preference for either one. I don't think there's anything to worry about at this age, as long as they seem happy in their body, right? I think that really enjoying being female will come when they are older? Heck, I don't even think I was happy being a girl until my late teens.

Shanna, I totally had that feeling with Maev. When she was a newborn, I would sometimes refer to her as "he" and I have no idea why.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Belated Birthday love for Maev and Natalina


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am a little concerned about gender dysphoria. dd will say she is a boy when asked. okay, sometimes she says she is a monkey or a sea lion or a baby. babies don't have gender -- so it's no to boy, no to girl, yes to baby. but i am concerned. i don't want her to have a narrow definition of what being a girl means -- i sometimes dress her as "boy" just to subvert that -- but i do want her to know she is a girl and to love being a girl. bff's dp is trans and frankly it was a super painful experience. please tell me i am overworrying this. interestingly, although she does not attach labels, she has shown strong gender awareness since early infancy -- preferring adult male strangers and older female children. true to this day.

At this stage, I do think you're over worrying this. Kudos to you for being aware, but with a 2 year old, I think 'alert, but not alarmed' need be the best approach.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I don't think there's anything to worry about at this age, as long as they seem happy in their body, right?

Yes, exactly.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
going to poas tomorrow. have 2 boy names and 2 girls names. girl middle is wide open. the fact that i actually got dh to talk about names last night is a miracle. if i get a positive, no more pressuring him until 20 weeks. won't find out the gender.

Fingers crossed. How exciting.

Our TTC #2 dilemma turned out to be a little less major than I had hyperventilated myself into believing. We talked about it a lot and the essence of DP's desire to TTC was actually about not feeling/being recognised as DS's mother. DP's family generally tend to forget that she has a baby and show little recognition/understanding of DP's family commitments, or why she's so tired or whatever. DP is working in her family business at the moment so she sees them all most days of the week. DP's mum has made the effort to visit once in almost 7 months. DP's dad won't even hold Sebby when we take him to visit them. DP's sister - who I might add, _used_ to be a lesbian too - won't even refer to DP as Mummy (rather than her first name) when interacting with Sebby, despite us having asked her to on several occassions...I digress. All this, coupled with some issues around not being able to truly equally parent while I'm still breastfeeding really fed into DP not feeling important/significant and also kind of feeling like she gets all the shitty 'support' jobs...which, really, she does but she also gets sleep and time alone and and and...
So, we're back on the same page and trying to work through/rectify some of the concerns DP has. I will birth the next babe but the book is not closed if DP decides she wants to try for a third, though she doubts she will because when she weighs it up with going hard at her career, career wins. Things change though...
And we've made a decision that we'll TTC#2 when DS is 2, though not to the detriment of breastfeeding. (I don't have my fertility back yet, despite thinking that some rogue post partum bleeding at 10 weeks was the return of my period.)

So that's us. And, after a night of no sleep, DP is hanging out with DS today and I'm trying to decide how best to spend my me time. The seedy desire to see Bruno is winning out, right now!

*Maela* - how's the itching? What did the midwife say?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
An idea that I've kicked around since I was pregnant with Fenton was to go through the birth educator training with Birthing From Within. The situation with DHs post-grad plans has opened the possibility up more, ironically. I think I've definately decided I want to do it, and I'm still mulling over the logistics, commitment and cost. DH has been wonderfully supportive and I've been typically cautious - even to the extent that he thinks the return-on-investment is irrelevent, which is freeing. It's been good for us both to see him be enthusiastic and me be overly-cautious even when the shoe is on the other foot. Good to see it's temperment and not self-interest that has each of us viewing his situation the way we do. So anyway, exciting possibilities for me in that. It's sort of funny, I'm really not big on traditional birth "classes". But this philosophy was so incredibly supportive to me when I was working through intense birth fears, and I love how, as opposed to a lot of other preparation philosophies, BFW is more detached from outcome. I had a dream last week that I was teaching again and I was so happy doing it....There is a lot converging, it's difficult to ignore it.

Sounds like an awesome idea! I'm torn between doing doula and birth education training now and midwifery later or just going straight for midwifery...I want to do it all and thus am not doing anything at all next semester - makes perfect sense, right?


----------



## Maela

MMM, so glad to hear that the TTC#2 dilemma wasn't as serious as you thought. That really stinks that your dp's family doesn't give her enough recognition as the parent. It doesn't make any sense.









I mentioned the itching to my mw and she didn't seem that concerned. She said that often in pg we're more sensitive to foods that we're not usually sensitive to, and that's probably it. Also, most of the itching has gone away now, so







. Who knows? I'm pretty sure now that it isn't anything serious.


----------



## PiePie

Unambiguous bfn here. I am a little sad but not totally disappointed. Mostly feel I missed the window of opportunity for the first half of my morning sickness to occur during my boss's maternity leave. on the other hand it seems that dd needs another month of my undivided attention, which i think is a good thing.







i had an inauspicious dream last night that i thought i was pregnant but the pregnancy had spontaneously aborted but i couldn't be convinced. also before i tested i lay in bed worrying that i had screwed up my perfect little family.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Unambiguous bfn here. I am a little sad but not totally disappointed. Mostly feel I missed the window of opportunity for the first half of my morning sickness to occur during my boss's maternity leave. on the other hand it seems that dd needs another month of my undivided attention, which i think is a good thing.







i had an inauspicious dream last night that i thought i was pregnant but the pregnancy had spontaneously aborted but i couldn't be convinced. also before i tested i lay in bed worrying that i had screwed up my perfect little family.

I was just coming in here to check







. I've been thinking a lot about how worried you must be about the morning sickness. This pregnancy could be entirely different - though that hasn't stopped me from worrying incessently about another nightmare breastfeeding introduction.







.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Pie Pie, I forgot to add: I've heard from a lot fo mamas who found that liver before and during pregnancy really helped their nausea and vomiting during pregnancy - it makes sense if it's adrenal related. You can get it in pills here, which I recommend







.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
So that's us. And, after a night of no sleep, DP is hanging out with DS today and I'm trying to decide how best to spend my me time. The seedy desire to see Bruno is winning out, right now!

I have so much more meaningful things to say about your post, but I had to interject before we leave for church: I can't recommend that movie. I just can't. I think Anthony Lane's review of it is spot-on.

But....do let me know what you think of it







!


----------



## PiePie

thanks *shanna*. i am pretty damn nervous about the m/s, still... i expect that i will at least be happier than last time around because of dd. i feel a little out of place ttc'ing when people say that they want this next one as much as they wanted #1, because the bfn just didn't feel







this time as last.


----------



## accountclosed3

mmm:

i'm glad that you and DP thought about it. ryan even talks about how he knows he is a distant second for hawk because of the whole BFing, etc thing. it is true--for now, i am the primary caregiver. ryan does get all of the 'crappy' jobs. and, he doesn't get any respect either. LOL

so, he can understand your DP's feelings, but not the depth because he's not a woman with a woman. he realized, or at least asserted in our discussion of it, that at least he gets the "new daddy" respect that a "other mommy" might not get at all!

and what we both think is *really* crappy is how your partner's family is all weird about it.

birthdays, babies, and ttcing. it's amazing in here!


----------



## PiePie

thinking of you all. swamped at work but want to come to you for your wisdom about dh's and my extended families. who are strange, but isn't that to be expected.


----------



## PiePie

so nauseated. serious meat aversion. are you sure i am not pregnant? dh is out of town on business for several days and dd may be on speed -- it was hop on mom (i tried to convince her it hurt me and she laughed?!), and now she has taken apart every suitcase in the house to make a fleet of boats. rowing while naked. and spinning at top speed to the grateful dead.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
mmm:

i'm glad that you and DP thought about it. ryan even talks about how he knows he is a distant second for hawk because of the whole BFing, etc thing. it is true--for now, i am the primary caregiver. ryan does get all of the 'crappy' jobs. and, he doesn't get any respect either. LOL


this evens out with time even when you are "still" nursing. each month seemed to tilt the balance, but by her first birthday i would say that he usually didn't feel like 2d fiddle. even with me spending way more time with her.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
it was hop on mom (i tried to convince her it hurt me and she laughed?!), and now she has taken apart every suitcase in the house to make a fleet of boats. rowing while naked. and spinning at top speed to the grateful dead.

You made tea come out of my nose







. How early did you poas? Twice I got negatives when I was pg, I think I tested the day af was due. But I also had serious food aversions and smell sensitivity that month I was _sure_ I was pg and i wasn't.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
this evens out with time even when you are "still" nursing. each month seemed to tilt the balance, but by her first birthday i would say that he usually didn't feel like 2d fiddle. even with me spending way more time with her.

This has ebbed and flowed for us. For a while, we were balanced, and now it seems like Fenton wants me more. Think he could be sensing that things are changing.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I need some advice. "Keeping" Fenton from napping has meant that we have to work really REALLY hard to keep this kid awake, though he falls asleep within ~30 minutes around 7:30. But given any reasonable opportunity (sitting still for any length of time), he's falling asleep ~2pm. Yesterday he fell asleep in a stadium chair at a baseball game while sitting up (SO not like him)and today I left him sitting on the couch while I went to the bathroom, only to find him asleep when I returned 5 minutes later. Both happened aroun d 2 pm, and he slept about 30 minutes. He was a bear to get to sleep last night, and it sounds like it may be shaping up the same tonight.

I don't know what to do. It feels fundamentally wrong to have to work so hard to keep him up, begining as early as 1:30 pm. I wonder if we should just let the nap happen if it happens, and resign ouselves to 60-90 minute sleep routine on those nights. But what to do with this resentment of how much time I spend lying with a child who seems not tired? And this strong sense that he needs a nap during the day, every day? On days he doesn't nap, I'm a monster with him by 7 pm. I'm exhausted, tired of being molested. I think the real problem lies with me thinking I have to manage this, but I don't know what else to do.

Last night was the worst. He was a bear to get to sleep 7:30 - 9 pm and I lost my cool







. Then I fell asleep while waiting with him and woke up at 11 pm. My evening was shot, my sleep was shot that night, and I was not the mother I wanted to be with him.

Using the potty is going great though!







:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I need some advice. "Keeping" Fenton from napping has meant that we have to work really REALLY hard to keep this kid awake, though he falls asleep within ~30 minutes around 7:30. But given any reasonable opportunity (sitting still for any length of time), he's falling asleep ~2pm. Yesterday he fell asleep in a stadium chair at a baseball game while sitting up (SO not like him)and today I left him sitting on the couch while I went to the bathroom, only to find him asleep when I returned 5 minutes later. Both happened aroun d 2 pm, and he slept about 30 minutes. He was a bear to get to sleep last night, and it sounds like it may be shaping up the same tonight.

I don't know what to do. It feels fundamentally wrong to have to work so hard to keep him up, begining as early as 1:30 pm. I wonder if we should just let the nap happen if it happens, and resign ouselves to 60-90 minute sleep routine on those nights. But what to do with this resentment of how much time I spend lying with a child who seems not tired? And this strong sense that he needs a nap during the day, every day? On days he doesn't nap, I'm a monster with him by 7 pm. I'm exhausted, tired of being molested. I think the real problem lies with me thinking I have to manage this, but I don't know what else to do.

Last night was the worst. He was a bear to get to sleep 7:30 - 9 pm and I lost my cool







. Then I fell asleep while waiting with him and woke up at 11 pm. My evening was shot, my sleep was shot that night, and I was not the mother I wanted to be with him.

Using the potty is going great though!







:

Shanna, I'm so sorry it's so tough for you guys right now.







I'm pretty sure we went through a similar stage. I knew she still kind of needed the nap (at least on most days), but she would refuse to take one until it was very late. So we started trying to keep her up. but of course, she would fall asleep so easily anytime after 3/4pm. It did feel wrong to me to keep her up when I know she just wanted to sleep. Sometimes if it was REALLY obvious that she was going to have a huge meltdown, we would just let it happen (the sleep i mean). But I would lay her down on our family room floor and we wouldn't try at all to be quiet like we usually would. So her naps were a little shorter (sometimes that helped her go down easier that night). But then after a couple of months she was okay staying up all day most days. I also had to adjust. It _is_ so hard not getting a break during the day! But I got used to it, and now I look forward to my evenings and early mornings alone.
I'm not saying that you should definitely keep going with the whole no nap idea; just letting you know how it turned out for us. Do what works for you guys.







s Hope things change soon for you.


----------



## Maela

So Maev spent the night at my parents' last night, and she did great!!







: My mom said she had one bad dream where she whimpered in her sleep for a few minutes and the rest of the night she slept fine! She slept with my parents on the floor of their bedroom (so she could use her new sleeping bag







). I am soooo happy about this! Next month we're going to try Dh's parents' house (which I'm pretty sure will be fine).
Dh and i had a great time. We saw Harry Potter, went out to eat, etc. It was a little weird in the middle of the night knowing Dd wasn't here, but I was okay. And of course she was happy.







: I thought that I might cry at some point (especially being pg







), but I didn't.

Her birthday party the other day turned out great. The lasagna I made was very tasty and the cakes were okay too. I'm going to post a few pictures on my FB page soon.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
But I would lay her down on our family room floor and we wouldn't try at all to be quiet like we usually would. So her naps were a little shorter (sometimes that helped her go down easier that night).

I'm thinking about trying this, and seeing if I can't encourage it a little earlier than 2. I might try coaxing him into his "chariot" and see if he'll go for a walk with me in the late am - I know he'd take a short cat nap if I could just get him in the stroller, but he seems to have decided they're for babies. Same with the carrier. My plan B is to see if we can have a "siesta" in the early pm - me reading on his bed, him playing. Could give him good opportunity lay down and sleep if he wants, and at least I'll attempt to have a break. I've decided I'll just try to give hima couple of opportunities, and let it go. But it sucks on days when he doesn't fall asleep for a short nap, and we have to get in the car any time after 2. It's insane to go all day with such a live-wire child, from 6:30 am until 7:30 pm. I felt wistful at what PiePie said about "perfect family" because I feel like I already have just a little more than I can handle.

It hasn't helped that we are having an inexplicable rash for the past week, which means there's something he's eating that's a problem, and I don't know what. Nothing new in the diet. Rash, fussiness, disrupted sleep....I start getting hysterical at this point. Only thing I can guess is I started pulling his seedless grapes apart, and there's something that looks suspiciously seedlike. But I never did this before there were problems , so I don't know if this is new or not.

Feeling a little hysterical today









Pie Pie, whats the scoop on family?

Maela, I'm so glad that the overnight went well - I've been waiting to hear, I'm wondering how this will go if we need it when Ku is born.

Going to be a long day.....


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hey maela, how was Harry Potter? A friend recently complained it was too long, but I'm delighted - DH is going to _pay_ for taking me to see Bruno







Actually, I was willing at the time but now I blame it on him.







MMM, did you see it? Was it all that I promised?

Date night with DH tonight - looking forward to eating a hot meal without little fingers in it







.

Pie Pie, did you poas again, or did af come? You know, there are people I've known a lot longer than you that I would _never_ ask that question.


----------



## Sihaya

No specific comments to share, but wanted to give out lots of







and









Also, if any of you experts in NFP were willing, I could really use some input here. I'm driving myself insane wondering.


----------



## accountclosed3

sihaya! i was justs wondering what was up with you, and here you are. i'll look at the link.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I need some resume help:
What is a word that describes "cradle to grave"? The context is work experience I have in writing health and science articles, and I can't figure out an elegant way to describe that my responsibility was from idea conception to publishing, including interviewing, writing and editing. Hmm, maybe I should just say it like that.

I know what you're thinking. Why does she always ask us when there are forums for this?

I know what else you're thinking, and the answer is: He's watching TV. Don't judge me.


----------



## witchygrrl

We have a slightly different solution to the sleep issues here. We keep Rhea up at night until about 9 or 10. Today she slept until 9:45 am, and she's currently down for another nap. We don't get much in the way of nighttime free, but my mornings (so long as I get up early) are peaceful. Usually she does take a second nap, and that way DH can occasionally take that nap with her (a highlight of his day, for sure!). I'm not sure if that would work for those of you with high-energy kids, but Rhea is a bit of a sleepyhead, like me.


----------



## Sihaya

DS is extremely high-energy and we do the same as you, witchy. Though, we never really did it on purpose. That has always been his natural rhythm and trying to get him to change to a "down at 7pm, up at 7am" rhythm as an infant was a miserable failure.

Right now, he goes down between 9-11pm and is up around 8am. He usually takes a nap at noon and another ~5pm, depending on how long he slept at night and how long his first nap was. He does seem to be in the process of dropping the second nap, though.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

I just started a "bedtime routine" last week. Yeah, I know... we should have done this when he's was a baby. I'm just not a very scheduled person myself. But decided we'd start with it now in a very loose way (meaning I don't look at the clock too much) and then maybe by fall I can get him more regular on times so that we can get to morning activities more easily. We basically follow what I read in _Heaven on Earth_ Dinner at 6, followed by a bath w/ one of us while the other cleans the kitchen, then he an Papa put toys away while I fix warm milk w/ honey and some WW toast w/ butter. Sometimes we eat it in front of a movie, which isn't good, but sometimes he seems to need it to get him to stop jumping around. Then we brush teeth, light a candle, turn all the lights out, tell a story, sing a song, say prayers, blow out candle, then nurses to sleep for like 10 minutes. It's supposed to take about an hour from finishing dinner to finish, but it's more like 2 for us. But it's not dark till 9 anyway. Mostly, the routine is to keep me from having to nurse off and on and off and on for those two hours, which is his plan.
Anyway, currently he is waking up between 8-9:30. He naps maybe 4 days a week. For anywhere from 20min to 3 hours. Sometimes 2 short naps. It really depends on what we've done in the am. If we go swimming or are active outdoors for several hours then he seems to really need a serious nap. Basically I let him nap as much as he needs until around 3pm. If he's hasn't napped by then I try to keep him up until 7. However, if we have evening plans (with him) then I let him take that 5pm nap so that he'll be in a good mood and then just deal with him staying up until 11.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hmm, maybe I should just say it like that.

yeah.

sheesh, i'm so behind, i don't think i could ever catch up.

Shanna, I think a short nap a little earlier in the day would be good. I can't imagine doing away with naps only a year from now.







She just started one nap/day and that is rough enough.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shanna*
Last night was the worst. He was a bear to get to sleep 7:30 - 9 pm and I lost my cool . Then I fell asleep while waiting with him and woke up at 11 pm. My evening was shot, my sleep was shot that night, and I was not the mother I wanted to be with him.

this happens to me, a LOT.







: DH is annoyed, impatient. He thinks we should be able to put her down and leave the room.







:


----------



## accountclosed3

well, we've just let hawk do his thing, sleep wise, and it's never been an issue, though it seems to be changing a bit right now. he's getting up around 10 am and going to bed around 10 pm. i'd prefer it to be the original 8-8:30 to 7-7:30 am. that was better for me!

so, we're going to see if he goes back to that or what. and, i think that we need a family rhythm, so we're trying to work on that. also, ryan and i could use more alone time.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
so, we're going to see if he goes back to that or what. and, i think that we need a family rhythm, so we're trying to work on that. also, ryan and i could use more alone time.

mmm, that would be nice.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Well, for all our sleep issues, and there are many, we finally have Sebby going to bed at night, usually around 6.30, always by 7.00 and sleeping until we go to bed...then we start the 1-2 hour waking tango....
but right now, my kid who only ever naps on me, and never for more than 40 minutes, has been asleep *in bed* for 80 minutes! Not quite sure what to do with myself...

I wonder whether he is a kid who might do better sleeping alone? I'm not sure how I feel about that!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
DH is going to _pay_ for taking me to see Bruno







Actually, I was willing at the time but now I blame it on him.







MMM, did you see it? Was it all that I promised?

Nope. Though I might still. Now I just wanna know what all the fuss is about. INstead I stayed on the couch, in my PJ's while DP took Sebby out. I didn't mean for that to happen but it's obviously what I needed!


----------



## farmama

hi everyone!

sorry for my long absence...the season has begun in earnest, and i'm dog tired.

have to say i'm grateful that other people's little ones are as..._spirited_ as n. i see what people mean about age 2. i have been trying hard to be patient, thoughtful, and calm lately...can't even count how many crying breakdowns we had today. milk seems to solve a lot, but i worry about what i'm getting myself into.

oh boy.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 









hi everyone!

sorry for my long absence...the season has begun in earnest, and i'm dog tired.

have to say i'm grateful that other people's little ones are as..._spirited_ as n. i see what people mean about age 2. i have been trying hard to be patient, thoughtful, and calm lately...can't even count how many crying breakdowns we had today. milk seems to solve a lot, but i worry about what i'm getting myself into.

oh boy.









Farmama, so nice to see (read from) you!! Yes, Dd is definitely that stereotypical 2 year old. It started about a month or two ago. She's very oppositional ("Look Maev it's bird!" "No it's not!"), emotional, and stubborn. She wants to do everything herself (which I think is actually very cute - until we're in a hurry). She also changes her mind A LOT. All this adds up to a few meltdowns a day. Like you, I just try my hardest to be as patient and calm as possible.


----------



## Maela

Shanna, Harry Potter was great. dh and I both really liked it. I think I liked it as much as the third one (my favorite). It was long, but I knew it would be and the only reason that I actually noticed I think was because I was hungry for dinner.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
well, we've just let hawk do his thing, sleep wise, and it's never been an issue, though it seems to be changing a bit right now. he's getting up around 10 am and going to bed around 10 pm. i'd prefer it to be the original 8-8:30 to 7-7:30 am. that was better for me!

so, we're going to see if he goes back to that or what. and, i think that we need a family rhythm, so we're trying to work on that. also, ryan and i could use more alone time.

we are similar with a 9:30 bedtime (originally imposed for consistency's sake but now she asks for it) and a 7:30-8 wakeup. dh falls asleep very early (and awakens obscenely early) so we don't have enough couple time. not sure how to work this. i am adamant that i don't want her going to bed earlier because we need the attachment time because i woh. also, nap was originally imposed from 1 to 3 for consistency's sake. recently naps have been effed up -- late and for less than an hour. this is only at home -- at sch she sleeps very well, as do all the children, in taht same timeframe.


----------



## accountclosed3

harry potter was great. it wass my first time away from hawk for more than 2 hrs. it worked out fine. my mother watched him.

she's such a busy-body though. our upstairs is a wreck because we're purging, and so i put everything that she would need downstairs. and she went upstairs anyway and then lectured us about how we have to keep the house clean and such "at least for hawk's sake" and so on. so annoying!

anyway, i enjoyed it. i'm thinking of trying a 'date nite' this weekend. our sistter amanda can baby sit hawk at their house, and we might be able to get home and dtd. it's been so hard to figure out the timing for that.

oh, and funny/not-funny. ryan woke twice in the night.

apparently i sat bolt upright sometime aroudn 1 am and said "where is he?" and i have no recollection of doing so.

not funny, at 5:12 am, hawk managed to sit up (while asleep) and head dive over the barrier at the edge of the bed where he sleeps, and land head first 7 inches down. i actually saw him sit up, and tried to grab him (he's been doing this a lot as how he adjusts in his sleep), but i missed and over he went.

so sad. he has a little red around his one eye, but otherwise is fine.

he landed on a soft pile of clutter (baby blankets).


----------



## accountclosed3

ryan is concerned about hawk at age two because hawk is "already willful."

what? he's a cutie.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
anyway, i enjoyed it. i'm thinking of trying a 'date nite' this weekend. our sistter amanda can baby sit hawk at their house, and we might be able to get home and dtd. it's been so hard to figure out the timing for that.

for those of you who get to dtd more often, what are your logistical secrets?


----------



## PiePie

*z.b.,* i would have killed my mother if she had said that. the last time they were here our whole apt. was a pigsty -- just totally focused on work and dd -- and they didn't say a word. i think they know better!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
for those of you who get to dtd more often, what are your logistical secrets?

Quick. Bathroom. Once while he watched TV in the am. _Almost always_ at night right after bedtime, never manage the morning. The other night we did in our bed and I couldn't believe how decadent it seemed.

I've been wondering if all parents think their child is spirited? I always think of Fenton as particularly energetic, but when I compare his cautiousness with other little boys I know, I think that maybe I have it easier than I think. Anyone here NOT think their child is spirited?

Tried setting the stage for a nap, and it didn't happen. He was exhausted by 3 pm, and we set an unprecedented early bedtime for 7 pm. I could be up at 5 am tomorrow.







I have a suspicion that Fenton would do well with a nap in late afternoon and a late bedtime, but I feel so unwilling to give up my only time alone with DH. I'd presumably still get some alone time myself during nap (if I manage to stay awake), but I just can't imagine never being alone with DH. I know it's a social construct that isn't common in other parts of the world, but it really seems like a need for me. I'm not willing to do what the rest of the world does and dtd in the same room as him....Frustrated. Wondering if I'm cutting off my nose to spite my face.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
for those of you who get to dtd more often, what are your logistical secrets?

Right now it's pretty easy because Dh is off for the summer. During the school year it's a little harder. But Dd goes to bed before 10PM (which is dh's bedtime when he has to work) at least 3-4 nights a week, and that's when we have the time. Cause she's in her own bed for at least half of the night now.

Dh and I both understand that it's going to be A LOT harder with two kids and that especially for those first 6 months or so, we're going to be DTDing a lot less. But our goal is once a week then. We'll see...

eta: Dh told me he's a lot less worried about it this time around because he knows it will only get better the older the dcs get. He said that last time (with Dd) it was harder because he wasn't sure that it would ever get better.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Quick. Bathroom. Once while he watched TV in the am. _Almost always_ at night right after bedtime, never manage the morning. The other night we did in our bed and I couldn't believe how decadent it seemed.

I'm impressed. I stink at quickies.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I've been wondering if all parents think their child is spirited? I always think of Fenton as particularly energetic, but when I compare his cautiousness with other little boys I know, I think that maybe I have it easier than I think. Anyone here NOT think their child is spirited?

I do think Dd is spirited - definitely. But she's definitely not the most spirited child I've met.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Tried setting the stage for a nap, and it didn't happen. He was exhausted by 3 pm, and we set an unprecedented early bedtime for 7 pm. I could be up at 5 am tomorrow.







I have a suspicion that Fenton would do well with a nap in late afternoon and a late bedtime, but I feel so unwilling to give up my only time alone with DH. I'd presumably still get some alone time myself during nap (if I manage to stay awake), but I just can't imagine never being alone with DH. I know it's a social construct that isn't common in other parts of the world, but it really seems like a need for me. I'm not willing to do what the rest of the world does and dtd in the same room as him....Frustrated. Wondering if I'm cutting off my nose to spite my face.









I feel for you. I'm sorry.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I do think Dd is spirited - definitely. But she's definitely not the most spirited child I've met.

Replace dd with ds and I completely agree.


----------



## witchygrrl

Rhea's pretty willful and spirited, too, though I'm sure not the most.

Shanna,







We've dtd in the same room as Rhea, but it still feels odd. Sometimes if she falls asleep, we'll go out in the hallway, so we can hear if she needs us. Not as comfy, but...









Job hunt has been full of rejections, but we remain hopeful.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Rhea's pretty willful and spirited, too, though I'm sure not the most.

Shanna,







We've dtd in the same room as Rhea, but it still feels odd. Sometimes if she falls asleep, we'll go out in the hallway, so we can hear if she needs us. Not as comfy, but...









Job hunt has been full of rejections, but we remain hopeful.

Hmm...I can't remember, but I think we've probably done it in the same room before she was about six months. After that, _for me_ it got to be uncomfortable. I wish I was more comfortable with it, but I'm not.









Witchy, we will be thinking about you and your dh and sending positive job-getting vibes to you!


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Witchy, we will be thinking about you and your dh and sending positive job-getting vibes to you!

Hoping that things are well for you in this department as well.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Anyone here NOT think their child is spirited?









, Not me. But it seems like the definition of spirited (from this book, at least) is pretty broad. I can't imagine too many kids who don't fit at least one of those categories.

I feel like I'm on the verge of getting a harness. DH thinks I'm nuts, since I was one of those people who swore I would never use one of those ridiculous things. But he doesn't see what we go through every day, and I don't want to risk the alternatives...








farmama!

Shanna, how are the snap conversions going? Do you have a snap press?


----------



## PiePie

Pregnant. In shock. Of course we were trying, but I thought the odds were low. I was actually angry with DH because we didn't DTD more.

Thinking about how to reduce nursing sessions and/or wean completely, down the line. Not I want to move her from the family bed. Kinda all over the map, huh?


----------



## Sihaya

Wow, PiePie!!! Huge congrats!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Pie Pie, CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!







:

How are you feeling so far?


----------



## Maela

Oh my goodness, another pregnancy!! Woo hoo! Congratulations PiePie!!


----------



## PiePie

DD will be 2 y, 7 m. Is that how old F. will be, *Shanna*?


----------



## accountclosed3

congrats piepie.

yeah, we hardly ever get to DTD. both of us require a lot of emotional intimacy for it to go anywhere or even work, and that cna take us a lot of talking and cuddling and well, yeah. so most of our DTD is actually just talking and cuddling. lame huh?

but, we usually manage when hawk is asleep at night, and if we get a sitter, we might get to at my favorite time of day--3 pm. 3 pm is a terrible time otherwise. ryan usually at work, parents usually visiting on saturday, and sunday we're with hawk and he wants to PLAY and play and play and play and, oh, guess what/ nurse and then play. so, yeah, that never works.

date night should be date afternoon, and then we can have some time and dtd and all of that.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

PiePie! That's awesome and you will think so soon too! Congratulations.







: - You are one fertile mama - I wish TTC could be so short-lived for everyone.

I'm jealous of all you preggo folks.


----------



## witchygrrl

congrats, PiePie.







:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
DD will be 2 y, 7 m. Is that how old F. will be, *Shanna*?

Exactly







. And so far I have a lot of indication its decent spacing. Fenton is understanding there's a baby in there (though I think he might be surprised when a baby actually comes out) and he's getting really independent, with intermittent intense needs for closeness. And the interest in using the potty has been, while labor-intensive, a sign of how much he's changing. The fatigue and nausea of pregnancy....he gradually plays more and more intendependantly, and I definately made use of nap time to nap with him. But I also used the TV more than I wanted to in my dogmatic-mind. Lorelei is such an independant spirit, I think you'll find she does really well. We have been really helped by Fentons' interest in his own bed, gives me more space in our King if I need it, though I've been the one sleeping with him in the Queen lately. I was anxious about DH and I in separate beds (it was my worst co-sleeping nightmare, to be honest), but it's been really great for our sex life, oddly enough. And it definately helps if the other partner sees the same thing that you do, that it's still a need for DC. Sorry, that was more than you asked







. I'm so excited for you!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
yeah, we hardly ever get to DTD. both of us require a lot of emotional intimacy for it to go anywhere or even work, and that cna take us a lot of talking and cuddling and well, yeah. so most of our DTD is actually just talking and cuddling. lame huh?

This was us until recently, and it made so much sense to me that it's so hard to emotionally connect through the background noise of a 2 foot tall maniac







, that in the finite amount of time, the emotional comes first. _Most_ of the time, DH agreed.

Fenton has put together that Dh stands up to pee (lots of interest in gender/genatalia differences lately. Especially when the ILs are over for dinner







). Fenton has put this together that he should stand up to pee _and_ poop. Disasterous







. He's also wanting to "hold the milk" a lot lately, and we're working a lot on the manners of him shoving his hand down my shirt. It makes me angrily crazy sometimes. Yesterday he had to go potty and I was touched out so I deliberately sat a distance away from him while he sat on the potty. And he asked me "Could you sit here so I can hold the milk? " I had to laugh....He's an honest little fellow. This morning, when DH asked him "Are you going to walk if I put you down, or run away like a crazy man?" A: "Run away like a crazy man!"

Going to do a pee test for strep this morning. Wish me luck


----------



## PiePie

http://www.cnsnews.com/public/conten...x?RsrcID=51509


----------



## witchygrrl

AF has returned, almost 1 year after DD's birth. I feel like a raging hormonal teenager, complete with pizza face. Thank the gods this wasn't yesterday during a family wedding. Anyone else feel this way with 1st postpartum AF?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
AF has returned, almost 1 year after DD's birth. I feel like a raging hormonal teenager, complete with pizza face. Thank the gods this wasn't yesterday during a family wedding. Anyone else feel this way with 1st postpartum AF?

I never had one.







But I have heard some people say that it was like that for them too.









OMG I'm 30 weeks today!


----------



## accountclosed3

wow, already 30 weeks?! time is flying.

ryan and i got a bit more done in regards to the paperwork for NZ immigration. it's a lot of work. LOL

i also found this great web site about the maramataka or matariki-based calendar of the maori. while we were there, it was time for the matariki festival (maori new year), and i learned about their calendar, the maramataka. except that, i couldn't find such a calendar anywhere.

so, i gave it up. but then, i foudn this great web site that promotes the maori way of life "for all new zealanders" and really talks about the underlying rhythm and spirituality associated with the people and the land.

we've been looking for a life-rhythm for our family, and most calendars didn't fit us very well, and since we would be flipping seasons, it didn't make sense to continue with christmas in summer and easter in fall, and thanksgiving in spring. so, we wanted to learn about the maramataka and figure out how to celebrate a year where the months and seasons are different.

so, yeah, matakite.


----------



## cking

wow, Maela, 30 weeks! You're getting so close! Did you ever find out what that rash you had was? I have a rash going on now, and it's driving me crazy. I'll see my MW on Thursday, so I can ask then, but I hope it's not serious.

witchy, I felt that way too. Mine started during the holidays, so there was also some added stress.


----------



## PiePie

exhausted, emotional, my work life is a mess. sigh. did i mention the exhausted part?


----------



## Maela

I just woke up this morning to find my computer, dining room table and the surrounding floor covered in ants.














Oh and some of the kitchen counters! So I guess my day is going to be spent cleaning like crazy. And we're going to have to be super vigilant about cleaning up Maev's sticky food messes. For some crazy reason, her high chair has been spared?! We have not had this big of an ant problem in the year that we've been at this house; I don't know what's going on!

Okay there are ants crawling across my screen and I've finished my breakfast; so off to work.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
wow, Maela, 30 weeks! You're getting so close! Did you ever find out what that rash you had was? I have a rash going on now, and it's driving me crazy. I'll see my MW on Thursday, so I can ask then, but I hope it's not serious.

I never did figure it out. It's not completely gone. Every now and then it pops up somewhere new on my body and then goes away after a few days. But it's not worrying me. Where is your rash? What does it look like? I'm curious to know what your MW says about it; mine wasn't too concerned.

*PiePie*,









s

Ant situation is better. And now we have a really clean house. We broke down and used ant spray. Dd and I left the house for a few hours to be safe. I hate using that stuff, but this was bad. Hopefully they don't come back.







:

going out with some friends tonight.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Fly-by post, I'm swamped.

Maela, we had a massive ant problem too. Still have a minor one, it seems all of a sudden and I wonder if a messy, wandering-while-eating toddler is the culprit. I sprayed too, though outside and in a small area. Hated doing it, but I can't do any of the natural things between Fentons diet restrictions and homeopathy







. Hope you got them - I awoke one morning to hear my son giggling and yelling "I'm running away from the ant! He's going to et me!!"

baby is head down already!







:

Pie Pie, hoping to hear more from you...


----------



## witchygrrl

Ants can be scary, and while I hate using chemicals, sometimes it's the only thing that works! Hoping that it gets under control, Maela.

And hooray for babies being so close to arriving! Time has passed soooo quickly.

Rhea's birthday is on Saturday. Thinking about making coconut orange cupcakes sweetened with agave nectar, and using coconut milk to make frosting. Dairy is still a little tricky for her, and I don't want to use too much soy with her. But I want to make something that everyone should find tasty. The ILs are bringing Rhea's great-grandmother with them for the weekend. House scrubbing has commenced!


----------



## accountclosed3

those sound very yummy.

you might try googling "vegan cake/frosting" recipes. you'll find some SUPER yummy ones. my friend made some chocolate-pumpkin ones (it's a chocolate cake mix and canned pumpkin!) that were divine.

we're doing cupcakes for hawk, too. caterpillar design.


----------



## cking

I heard the baby's heartbeat today!







Josephine heard it too.







:

Rash *might* be shingles.







Getting it checked tomorrow. It's on my lower abdomen/groin area. I thought it was poison ivy at first, (though lord knows how i would get it _there)_, but now it looks like 2nd degree burns.

And yesterday we discovered water in our basement. In our finished basement, the gem of our tiny house. _So_ not what we need.









Happy Birthday Rhea! Those cupcakes sound yummy.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
those sound very yummy.

you might try googling "vegan cake/frosting" recipes. you'll find some SUPER yummy ones. my friend made some chocolate-pumpkin ones (it's a chocolate cake mix and canned pumpkin!) that were divine.

we're doing cupcakes for hawk, too. caterpillar design.









I've been doing recipes from "Vegan Cupcakes Take Over the World", actually. Love them because they are dairy free, taste fabulous, and honestly, don't seem to go stale very fast. I made vanilla agave cupcakes that I topped with lemon curd (ok, not vegan), blackberries, and white icing. Super yum! Chocolate pumpkin sounds awesome though. Hmmmm. Something else to try...decorating I'm not so good at. How are you doing the caterpillar design?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yay Christina for the heartbeat, and boooo for shingles. Not good. I really hope it isn't that.


----------



## PiePie

shingles!?!?!?! say it isn't so.

i am doing better. i do have a short fuse lately. not today though. may be pregnancy related. sleeping like crap.

major increase in nursing from dd.

intestinal distress is my big pregnancy symptom.

i should go to bed. i do want to tell someone all the cute stuff my kid is doing, though!


----------



## Maela

Shanna, yay for head down! Our little boy has been transverse, but today was head down. We'll see if he moves back. Maev was the same way (going back and forth until about 34 weeks).

Cking, yay for the heartbeat! How far along are you now?

PiePie, glad today was better. I also have the intestinal stuff to deal with in early pregnancy.







:

All of those cupcakes sound sooo yummy!


----------



## accountclosed3

i love that cookbook. our library has it.









well, it's actually as basic as i can make it. LOL i'm using food coloring (bad, me), but, otherwise,ti's like so:

make cupcakes and frosting in three colors--pink, blue, and green.

then, i'm going to frost each cup cake "upside down" so it makes the body of the caterpillar. each one will be green as the base, with blue and pink spots as per this one caterpillar we saw on a hike. no one else might notice that it's a caterpillar. LOL

my friend has a big, green leaf tray, and so i'll put them on that. i thought of doing it like the hungry-hungry caterpillar too (rainbow colors).


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I heard the baby's heartbeat today!







Josephine heard it too.







:

Rash *might* be shingles.







Getting it checked tomorrow. It's on my lower abdomen/groin area. I thought it was poison ivy at first, (though lord knows how i would get it _there)_, but now it looks like 2nd degree burns.

And yesterday we discovered water in our basement. In our finished basement, the gem of our tiny house. _So_ not what we need.









Happy Birthday Rhea! Those cupcakes sound yummy.

Christina, you're all over the place!







How did Josephine react to baby's heartbeat? Does she seem to understand?







I don't think Fenton really got it until recently, and i still think he's going to be pretty surprised in october. I'm so sorry about the Shingles, I hope it's something else. Is it painful?

It reminds me, I just finished the article on Vaccines in the current Mothering. Anyone else read it? At first I wasn't impressed, but it wound up being a really good article. I'm tempted to send it to my FIL, who I adore and is very well-meaning when he sends me mainstream articles advocating vax. My only intention in sending it to him would be to remind him that, contrary to what he seems to think, we really do have access to pro information and truly agonized over the decision. Debating whether I want to even engage in a debate when i know we won't agree though. I hate to write him off, I love him so much. And, I'd be a titch embarrassed about a couple of the Jay Gordon quotes in it....They mention in it that a German manufacturer makes a Tetanus-only vax, I'm wondering if it's suitable for under 12. It's the one we're planning on doing when Fenton's health is more stable.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am doing better. i do have a short fuse lately. not today though. may be pregnancy related. sleeping like crap.

major increase in nursing from dd.

intestinal distress is my big pregnancy symptom.

i should go to bed. i do want to tell someone all the cute stuff my kid is doing, though!

My fuse shortened dramatically in first trimester







. Send cut Lorelei stories when you can - isn't this age so much fun? Today we're going to a baseball game and riding on public transportation, all by request by Fenton. I just love how responsive and curious they are getting!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i love that cookbook. our library has it.









well, it's actually as basic as i can make it. LOL i'm using food coloring (bad, me), but, otherwise,ti's like so:

make cupcakes and frosting in three colors--pink, blue, and green.

then, i'm going to frost each cup cake "upside down" so it makes the body of the caterpillar. each one will be green as the base, with blue and pink spots as per this one caterpillar we saw on a hike. no one else might notice that it's a caterpillar. LOL

my friend has a big, green leaf tray, and so i'll put them on that. i thought of doing it like the hungry-hungry caterpillar too (rainbow colors).

This sounds _really_ awesome! Me, I let my much-more-talented-than me sister make Fenton's cake.


----------



## accountclosed3

those are cool cakes.

i'm sorry if i seem so head-down about the pregnancies. i'm so happy for you all, and completely freaked out at the idea that any of us "should" be pregnant, even though i know it's healthy and normal and the right age for so many of our babes to be sibs, and all of htat.

i'm still way put off on the idea of doing it all again. LOL were any of you? did something just change and you knew you wanted to ttc again?


----------



## witchygrrl

:my baby is going to be one tomorrow!








:


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm sorry if i seem so head-down about the pregnancies. i'm so happy for you all, and completely freaked out at the idea that any of us "should" be pregnant, even though i know it's healthy and normal and the right age for so many of our babes to be sibs, and all of htat.

i'm still way put off on the idea of doing it all again. LOL were any of you? did something just change and you knew you wanted to ttc again?

Most of Fenton's life, I've wondered if it's just stubbornness that was going to lead me me to have more - that pre-conceived idea of how many kids I "wanted". Most of his life, I have had just a little more than I can handle. But I'm not kidding, my _first_ good night's sleep and I suddenly wanted another one. It's like I could glimpse normal life again. I'm still a little ambivalent about "starting all over" just when life is starting to get back to a semblance of normal (sleeping all night, getting some time alone, Fenton starting to be interested in specific outtings). But I'm also really excited to do it again, knowing now that nothing difficult lasts forever. Can't even remember when 7 pm fussy time stopped, but it did







. When I got married, I mourned a little the fact that I would probably never fall in love again. But we do get to again, and I'm excited to fall in love with Ku







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 







:my baby is going to be one tomorrow!







:

I know, I was just coming to wish you luck on the party! Happy Birthday Rhea!!!!

So today I am wearing concealer make-up. On my upper lip







I have two dark patches of skin there, pregnancy related. Never got that with Fenton, but I was pg mostly during the winter then. MW says it's estrogen-related (combined with sun) and not deficiency-related, but I still wonder. Anyway, I'm sporting a 'stache.


----------



## Maela

HAPPY BIRTHDAY RHEA!!!!

Last night Dd slept from 11pm - 7:30am!! Not exactly the hours I would like, but that's the longest she's slept without waking up. I _think_ we might be mostly sleeping through the night by September.







:

*zb*, I started wanting a second when Dd was about 14-15 months old. It was all of a sudden too, because until then I wanted to wait until she was 2yo and I was kind of dreading it. but She started being able to entertain herself sometimes. Made my day SO much easier.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Birthday love for Rhea! xxoo


----------



## Holiztic

ZB,

It was really a relief for me to read what you wrote, I have been hanging back mostly because I am not sure I can be as excited as I'd really like to be for the second-timers. I just don't want to be a downer. But since you spoke up I want to speak up to support you (and perhaps get a little in return







)

I cannot even imagine doing it all over again. I really want another kid (originally wanted 3, but that's quite a stretch now). From the blood pressure late preg/pp to the pp anxiety to the sleeplessness and breastfeeding difficulties to the crying and having a baby that hated the sling and never wanted to be put down to the weaning and sleep fighting (2 hours to go to bed) and now we are finally in such a good place I cannot imagine it all over again. Shanna and Maela both said the same thing, once it got easier they were ready for it to get hard again, but I don't get that (personally I mean), once it got easier (about a month ago at 26 months) I especially can't imagine giving that up!!

I am actually going to start seeing a therapist to deal with the more serious issues (the fear of blood pressure issues and anxiety returning) and the rest I'm just going to have to suck up I guess!

Either way its going to be several more months, spacing Q and the next 3.5 or 4 years apart, which I am kind of starting to like anyway.

I truly am happy for you guys (S, M, C, PP) but I just feel so disappointed in myself for not wanting to pop 'em out the way I always assumed I would.










Oh and I'll end on a







for Rhea's birthday!!


----------



## Maela

*Holiztic,*







I feel the same way as you sometimes, and I think I might be crazy to have another one so soon when I had a hard time PP and with the lack of time to myself. I think that I had all of your problems but to a lesser degree.

So why do I want a baby so soon?







I have no idea. But i have been really excited lately to meet Jaim. I've been nesting like crazy. I think we'll be pretty much ready for him in three weeks. We still have to figure out the birth pool and I have to wash some clothes, diapers, and blankets. But that's about it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
and the rest I'm just going to have to suck up I guess!

Is it possible that you really don't want anymore?


----------



## witchygrrl

Birthday celebrations for Rhea went well







She LOVED her coconut orange cake, even though I screwed up the recipe and didn't add the baking powder and soda. I was really distracted while making it, as DH had to have his brakes redone (they got really bad all of a sudden) and didn't get home until after 9 pm Friday. The ILs showed up later that night, and left this afternoon. We had a great day with them yesterday, and then they came to my great-aunt and uncle's house for part 2.

Re: ZB and Holiztic's posts. I can't imagine wanting to go through all this again for real, and I think I had it relatively easy! But I guess I'm odd in that I kinda wish I could be pregnant again, because I enjoyed it. I just don't want more than Rhea. It's interesting how biological drives compel people to make different choices.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Is it possible that you really don't want anymore?









Well, there's what I want (just thinking of me) then there's what I want for DH and then there's what I want for DS.

For Me: I am not sure, I am kinda split 50/50 right now

For DH: Definitely want 1-2 more

For DS: Cannot even imagine/consider not having 1-2 more.

So all in all I'd say its about 85% want more and 15% don't

Than again I think about how hard its been with Q, but I would kill before I'd let someone turn back the clock and erase him. Fast forward a couple years and I am sure I'll feel the same with the next, even if its as hard.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

I'm thinking of TTC #2 in 2011.
I am totally happy for anyone who is having their kids closer together and/or many kids! I know there are tons of positives with that approach.

But for me, I know that we are definitely only having two and I want to be able to focus on J for these first years. I also really want him to wean (hopefully on his own) and have a break from BFing before I get pregnant again. I am not very organized, am bad with housework, procrastinate, yadayada and I just don't think I would manage very well with a toddler and an infant. If #2 comes when J is 4/5 he'll be able to do more independently by then, I can see maybe enrolling him in some sort of part time preschool type thing, will be able to go places w/o having to carry him half the time, etc.

I'm also planning to start classes (part time) to finish up my bachelors (I went on leave as a Junior and never returned) and would like to be done before #2.


----------



## PiePie

thank you, *zoebird,* for bringing up the great unspeakable! i do not have the same lust for a baby the way i did before i had dd -- i just don't. if dh and i hadn't been able to conceive dd, we would have adopted, for sure. now i feel like my life is complete with dd and dh. however, i really want a sibling for her, and i want them 3 grades apart. i would have had no objection to 2 grades apart, but dd was an august baby, and i just couldn't imagine having another until she was about 20 mos. old. then she started playing more independently (although recently i am getting "Carry me! Carry me!" like CONSTANTLY -- what is that about? and by the way her demand excludes the sling). and while emotionally the concept of weaning (or moving her from the family bed) seems devastating to me, in theory i have no objection to weaning a 2 yo. (either mother-led or "child-led" but influenced by my pregnancy). there is also the fact that i may want a more demanding job at some point, but certainly not until after #2 has passed the age for which i feel compelled to pump, because i can't imagine starting a new job (again) with part of my brain devoted to pumping -- it is so consuming. and i want a moratorium on work travel until i have no child under the age of 3, which means putting off any really demanding jobs until then. my boss (i predict, based on knowledge of her dp's employment contract) will be at my current place of employment through approximately february 2012, so i would want to get all of my little baby time in before then, because this job is about as accommodating as a 4 day a week litigator position is going to be. also i feel like i am in a good position to exploit her maternity leave (going on till sept. 1) to work from home a little if my m/s rears its ugly head --- thus creating an accommodation for myself without asking for one. so this pregnancy and its timing was driven more by my brain, and my (and dh's) pre-dd commitment to 2 children, more than dissatisfaction with our present reality.

in fact, our present reality is PERFECT, and i am more than a little afraid that #2 will screw things up. dh opposed the pregnancy on those grounds, and it was only his desire to be able to have both kids out of college before he got "old" (he is already 42) that pushed things for now -- i am sure he would have been happy with just dd forever, he has said as much. i was also afraid that in light of our ages (i am 38), conceiving would take more time (shocked that it happened so quickly -- still doesn't seem real) and a loss is statistically more likely than for some of you (again, just because of age), and i am fixated on that 3 grades apart thing.

i know there are lots of good arguments for all types of spacing choices -- for me, i just couldn't do 2 under 2 (wanting to nurse #1 for 2 yrs plus just her basic needs felt so consuming, YK? i am sure it would be different if we lived near extended family, or if they were more involved, but they aren't, so oh well). and both dh and i had siblings for or more yrs apart and always wished for closer spacing.

for myself, i am mostly terrified of pregnancy -- i hated it! -- and morning sickness and depression. dh is afraid of that too, but mostly of the time crunch and relationship pressure re balancing 2 careers and childcare and his need for leisure time (something i both demand less of and get less of, but he feels this acute lack, i just don't).

dd waking up, gotta go. please pray for me that it didn't screw up my beautiful little family.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*PiePie* - are you entitled to any maternity leave? Will you be taking it? Of course, I don't have any experience of this but from what I hear, your fears are really normal and never realised. I'm sure if you posted a thread to that effect on the parenting board, you'd have a million people telling you the same thing.

We're planning to TTC around this time next year. Though I'm starting to question our logic. Plenty more time to think carefully about it though.

Sebby finally popped his first tooth yesterday. No respite from the fortnight of 45 minute wake ups though, there are 3 more sitting right under the surface and the kid is an uber cranky pants. I'm exhausted.


----------



## PiePie

entitled to 3 months paid. but my boss took 4 mos. so i expect she will give me that. and with vacation time, etc., i could get that much paid, for sure. what i really want is 6 mos. if she doesn't give me that we are going to go to war with regard to my pay. if she gives me that and gives me work at home accommodation for morning sickness, i will suck up the pay disparity because those things are more important to me. dh proposed that i work 3 days a week instead of 4 but make them long, 10 hour days. i have reservations about how that will work with pumping but i like the thought.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm having a pity party over in the cloth diapering forum, come join my rant.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
entitled to 3 months paid. but my boss took 4 mos. so i expect she will give me that. and with vacation time, etc., i could get that much paid, for sure. what i really want is 6 mos.

I wonder, with her being gone on maternity leave while you are most likely to be working at home with morning sickness, if you can keep it close to your chest on working at home during pg, so you have some leverage to work at home for the 2 month gap (she gives 4 months, you want 6). That could be a good compromise? Not that I find I can get much desk work done while my LO is home....







But working at home is a creative leveraging tool. DH is taking 2 weeks off as vacation when Ku comes, then "working at home" for two weeks, which basically means writing a sermon and preaching on sunday, so it's a creative way to get more time off because he can more easily do minimum.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Sebby finally popped his first tooth yesterday. No respite from the fortnight of 45 minute wake ups though, there are 3 more sitting right under the surface and the kid is an uber cranky pants. I'm exhausted.

Teething was the worst







. I forget how it was so continuous. It is better when they can pop a bunch through at once though - it's like BOGO









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
(although recently i am getting "Carry me! Carry me!" like CONSTANTLY -- what is that about? and by the way her demand excludes the sling).

Fenton has been doing this too - sometimes I gather that he wants to see things how I see them, like he thinks he's missing something from being smaller. I also think the slight regression associated with #2 begins earlier than we think. Lately, we're spending a lot of time "pretending we're drinking milk from Mama's breast".









I can really sympathize with how pumping is at the forefront of your mind with regards to career, Pie Pie. When I was pumping (first for finger feeding/nursing issues, then for Baby jack) I couldn't get over how consuming it was, and how strategic I constantly had to be. I can't imagine adding the burdens of collegues, privacy issues......

Can I take this child spacing conversation even further? Lately I've spent a lot of time with friends who don't have children, and it seems that often the conversation drifts to whether they will "regret" not having them or not. They always assume that I think everyone will regret not having children. The truth is that I can't imagine not having children, _knowing what I know now_. But I often think that I could have gone either way if I didn't know about the great parts about it, which you can't really know unless you have them. I knew parenting was going to be hard, and I really did get to peacefully say goodbye to the parts of my life that I don't have anymore. But it has been 50 times harder than I thought it was going to be, and when I imagine being ignorant of the magical moments in parenting, I think I could be just as happy without children and having a different "third thing" (Poet Donald Hall says that every couple has a "third thing" besides themselves that they are devoted to. Sometimes it's kids, and in the absence of kids they have a different "third thing".). This is galvanized when my childless friends say things that reflect that all they can see is the difficulty and monotony. I'm sure it changes some as childless people age, but in this moment I often wonder about equal happiness with an easier life.

But knowing what I know now, I couldn't be happy without a litle man saying "Can we play pitcher Mama? I'm going to strike you out!







".

I published my first 2 articles online for my WAHM job







:. Thinking about working on one about gentle discipline from a Christian perspective. Get SO tired of having my faith questioned because I don't hit or ignore my child.....
So far, I _really_ like doing this. Pay for this company is revenue sharing with ads, so I hope it ends up being worth my time. But the other company I write for dictates what you write about for a flat pay, and I'm much less excited about it.


----------



## PiePie

interesting twist *shanna*. i am hopelessly intolerant of people who do not want children. i find their career ambitions empty of meaning (because, ladies, i have done the hamster wheel and it feels old hat to me -- even when i was completely consumed with it, i always wanted something more, i.e., children) and their dating lives seem petty and their child-free entertainment seems like a misallocation of time. even political causes seem more...apart from me. i was thinking of how when i got married (pretty recently) i was very clear on who my 3 bffs were, and now i have 3 women who will come visit me if i get down in the dumps with m/s, and there is only one overlap among them! pretty shocking to me as those stale friendships lasted a LONG time. part of me wants to reconnect with them and part of me finds myself not having my heart in my throat over their latest grant proposal or published book. and of course i know that at least one of them just doesn't get what the big deal over dd is.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Sometimes I miss my misallocation of time







. But yes, I do have a couple of childless friends where the connection is pretty superficial. One in particular, my brain starts to bleed with the details she goes into about work. But I felt that way towards her before I had kids.

I recently saw a friend of mine be a surrogate, and it was astonishing how insensitive and unhelpful the the mother was to my friend. It did help me to see (and remember when I was childless) that some things are not intuitive and may defy logic (such as how helpful a meal or cleaning help would be while pregnant, for example). I honestly could never understand why every pregnant woman was asked how she was feeling, for example. Having gone through it, it's at the forefront of my awareness now. So, sometimes it's selfishness, but often it seems failure of imagination or inexperience.

But, all that aside, I love my childless friend who remind me that there are things that are important to me besides being a parent. And that someday I too will get to go on a vacation with just me and my girlfriend. Years and years from now  They're also the same childless friends who approach my difficulties with some humbleness, that they acknowledge that they don't know what it's like. I appreciate that.

Gotta go if I'm going to finish converting these damn diapers today. And I WILL finish today...


----------



## PiePie

perhaps i have lost the part of me that wants to vacation without my kid (isn't that what everyone warns about?) or perhaps i lack imagination. i can imagine traveling with dh, but my girlfriend ties just aren't there. a friend of mine's dh posted a fb note recently recruiting people to go out with his wife without him or their kid. i was like, and leave my kid? forget about it! obviously it is some huge hole in her life that her husband tagged people with this request, but i just can't imagine it.


----------



## Maela

So for about two to three weeks Dd has been falling asleep within 30 minutes. dh and I have been switching off with bedtime duty and things have been going great. Bathtime, bedtime snack with story, brush teeth, nurse for 5 min, and then tell her a story in bed with the lights out, and then she'd roll over and fall asleep. It was that easy. I was so happy thinking that we had this figured out before the baby came.
And now we've had four days in a row of it taking at least 45 minutes _and_ she won't let dh put her to sleep. She cries, "I don't want to go night night!" or she just talks to herself for a very long time before finally going to sleep. I just sit there silently and pretend that I'm sleeping because I know that if I talked I would be mean (and it would take even longer).
Tonight I felt like I was going crazy. It seems that no matter what I do, it doesn't make a difference. I'm at a loss.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
So for about two to three weeks Dd has been falling asleep within 30 minutes. dh and I have been switching off with bedtime duty and things have been going great. Bathtime, bedtime snack with story, brush teeth, nurse for 5 min, and then tell her a story in bed with the lights out, and then she'd roll over and fall asleep. It was that easy. I was so happy thinking that we had this figured out before the baby came.
And now we've had four days in a row of it taking at least 45 minutes _and_ she won't let dh put her to sleep. She cries, "I don't want to go night night!" or she just talks to herself for a very long time before finally going to sleep. I just sit there silently and pretend that I'm sleeping because I know that if I talked I would be mean (and it would take even longer).
Tonight I felt like I was going crazy. It seems that no matter what I do, it doesn't make a difference. I'm at a loss.









Oh sister....







. We're in a similar situation, but Fenton is more hyped up rather than too sad to go to sleep. And in the night there have been times when he only wants Mama. I think they're sensing divided loyalties coming up. We've determined Fenton definately needs a nap during the day, but it's leading to 60-75 minute bed routine. Going to try doing the nap earlier today....I don't have any suggestions, I would use them if I did. DH gets so frustrated, wondering why he can't go to sleep without us there as easily as us just laying there silently. Sometimes I feel like I'm going to go crazy and be violent. I just don't know what to do either.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
perhaps i have lost the part of me that wants to vacation without my kid (isn't that what everyone warns about?)

It's funny you should mention that in particular. One of the things I wanted to do before Fenton was born was to go to Spain. We went to seminary instead







. But we've been talking about doing it for a 10 (next year) or mostly likely a 15 year anniversary trip. And I can't imagine not having my little buddies with me for such a wonderful thing. DH agrees. So our romantic anniversary trip might be quite a caravan indeed







. I just can't imagine doing something so fun without them







.

A friend of mine once said that she's learning that an interesting life isn't the same as a happy life. I think of that often when I think about me having children versus not.


----------



## Maela

Shanna, thanks for the sympathy. I was just at the end of my rope last night, especially after a long rough day with her. I keep thinking, _we just need more routine_, but now I'm not even sure if that'll work.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
A friend of mine once said that she's learning that an interesting life isn't the same as a happy life. I think of that often when I think about me having children versus not.

I often tell myself something kind of similar. Yes, life would probably be easier without kids, but I don't think that I would be any happier, just because I would always feel like I was missing out on something that's such a huge part of what life is all about (IMO). I remember feeling that way before I had Dd.

We can't wait to travel with our kids!! We plan on going to Germany first, and then when they are older going everywhere else. I'd really like to go to Japan and New Zealand someday. Dh and I love to travel, but we tend to get really homesick when it's just the two of us. So I'm thinking we'll actually have more fun with kids in tow. Now if we could just find the money...


----------



## accountclosed3

ok, i'm still catching up on the reading, but i wanted to toss this up there.









first, rhea is one already! holy smokes. bound to happen, i know, but seriously, i wasn't ready for it. Lena will be next, and then hawk right after. so hard to believe.

of course, i am developing the menu for it, so of course i know it's happening, so hard to believe.

in regards to teeth, hawk has 4 in right now and it looks like another two coming through. 6 all in 3-4 weeks! he's not been unusually fussy though, so that's nice.

i think that, for me, the issue of the child isn't the big deal of having another, it's my own body issues. i just about have my body back to normal. the hip is realigning, the pelvic floor is getting back to normal (vagina with it), and my belly is looking great. i could stand to lean-up, but i think that's the fat the body holds onto for nursing, which is ok. i mean, i'm a size 4-6, so i'm happy.







i look good in a bikini.

but it was a hard road here, and i couldn't put in the work that i wanted to, and i'm really terrified of having to go through it again. i know it probably sounds completely stupid considering i basically followed the 9 months on/9 months off pattern. but, i didn't like that process at all.

the second thing that puts me off a bit is that for the first 9-10 months, my husband was a BEAR to live with and it's still hard sometimes. when hawk was born, i think he was so overwhelmed by the sense of responsibility that he just freaked out. he was angry and he would pick fights and freak out over the littlest things. i couldn't even say something nice to him without him freaking out about it.

i felt like someone had switched my husband. i went from having this great, awesome, totally cool guy to having this avoiding, angry, frustrated, mean guy. yeah, there were bright spots in there, but that's how i felt. sometimes i still feel that way.

i don't want to go through these things again. yeah, another baby would be great and perhaps we could adopt, but i'm happy with jut hawk and i look forward to my husband settling down a bit more and having a normal life with an integrated routine for all of us.

i don't think another baby would "mess it up" but i don't feel at all incomplete or what have you.

i do kind of feel guilty (or something) that i had such a great pregnancy, birth, and recovery but i don't want to do it again and again and again like so many seem to .LOL


----------



## accountclosed3

ryan pointed out that of all of his friends (his age), he's the only one with a child. his experience with them is that they have been angry with him for being unavailable for movie nights, poker days (literally 24 hr events), and coffee and other things.

ryan is busy. works 8-4, commutes 1 hr (total), works out twice a week, takes care of hawk while i work (3 times per week right now), and still is getting things together for NZ, does the trash, laundry, and cooks his meat, and still tries to make time for us. and of course, working through his anger/frustration. he didn't have a lot of time for friends before, but he certainly has less now because he wants to be with me and with hawk. so, we are doing what we can. and, i do try to make time available for him to see his friends at least once or twice a month (when not during a work day).

so, they really don't get it.

on the flip side, most of my friends are older and their children are grown (college age). i am doing things a lot differently than they did, and a lot of them were pretty natural/attachment parents. but, they don't get a lot of the things that i do, and so that has caued some tension. on the other hand, when i need to complain about the difficulty of husbands, they are helpful. lol!

i'm so happy to have hawk. he's such a delight. traveling with him is easy and fun, and even our date nights, we miss hawk a lot. it's really kind of funny. we look forward to be able to take him to movies. LOL


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
ryan pointed out that of all of his friends (his age), he's the only one with a child. his experience with them is that they have been angry with him for being unavailable for movie nights, poker days (literally 24 hr events), and coffee and other things.

ryan is busy. works 8-4, commutes 1 hr (total), works out twice a week, takes care of hawk while i work (3 times per week right now), and still is getting things together for NZ, does the trash, laundry, and cooks his meat, and still tries to make time for us. and of course, working through his anger/frustration. he didn't have a lot of time for friends before, but he certainly has less now because he wants to be with me and with hawk. so, we are doing what we can. and, i do try to make time available for him to see his friends at least once or twice a month (when not during a work day).

so, they really don't get it.

on the flip side, most of my friends are older and their children are grown (college age). i am doing things a lot differently than they did, and a lot of them were pretty natural/attachment parents. but, they don't get a lot of the things that i do, and so that has caued some tension. on the other hand, when i need to complain about the difficulty of husbands, they are helpful. lol!

i'm so happy to have hawk. he's such a delight. traveling with him is easy and fun, and even our date nights, we miss hawk a lot. it's really kind of funny. we look forward to be able to take him to movies. LOL

That's so rough. We were pretty lucky in that although we were one of the first to have a baby, many of our friends were close to TTCing or already TTCing or pregnant, so I think they "got it" a little more. We do parent kind of differently, and I'm pretty sure they think we're weird, but they're quiet about it and they are as supportive as possible without agreeing with us.

The last two nights have been better bedtime-wise. So maybe it was just a phase?








:


----------



## ~Shanna~

ZB, what you wrote about how a child has affected the partner relationship reminded me of a conversation DH and i had recently. I often joke that I haven't been able to poop alone for 2 1/2 years. My husband, on the other hand, says that it's a "boundary" for him, that he will not have a child in the bathroom with him while he is pooping. What this means is that, after an 8, 9, 10 hour workday, he then comes home and wants to lock himself in the bathroom for 30 minutes while I make dinner with a child climbing on me, crying for Daddy. I finally asked him to poop on his own time - do it at work, while Fenton naps, whatever, but stop thinking that you don't have to prioritize your "boundaries", because it makes a lot of work for me, this thing that you think should be a given and isn't a given for me. I'd love to have a boundary like that. I'd love to have all kinds of boundaries too, but I kind of have to pick one or two and let the rest go. And if he's going to ask me to keep Fenton occupied while he studies, keep him out of his innumerable CDs, etc., then maybe the solitary poop is a lower priority.

It wasn't an angry conversation, but it was difficult in that what I really meant was "why is it easier for me to sacrifice? Why do you think your life should change less than mine?"

Brandon isn't as busy with non-work stuff as Ryan is, but it's funny how "inequality of needs" being met comes up in all kinds of formats.


----------



## Holiztic

Shanna, I so hear you on the bathroom time, I don't even remember the last time I did ANYTHING in the bathroom with the door closed, and I often don't bother sitting I go so fast! DH spends longer looking for something to read while on the toilet than I spend actually on the toilet.

But I just decided that it is obviously more important to him than it is to me, so I let it go. Also, I find the less we try to keep score and the more we try to give each other time, the happier we both are.

So right now I have dinner ready when DH gets home, we sit down pretty much the second he gets through the door, then immediately after dinner I go upstairs to the office for TV/computer/reading while DH and DS have about an hour together doing dishes and playing.

Then I do before bed snack and toy cleanup, which gives him about 20 minutes. Then we reconvene for Q's bedtime.

DH is managing to get to poker night about once a month, he leaves the second Q is asleep (b/w 7:30-8) and once we get a table in the basement he'll be able to host (again, after 8 so DS is asleep and I can just relax).

Exercise time for DH is the current challenge (something I want for him as much as he wants it--not only for his health but for his mood!!)


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Shanna, I so hear you on the bathroom time, I don't even remember the last time I did ANYTHING in the bathroom with the door closed, and I often don't bother sitting I go so fast! DH spends longer looking for something to read while on the toilet than I spend actually on the toilet.

This just cracks me up. I've teased DH that men are clearly not familiar with the concept of "pushing"







. But I think I've been entirely too inappropriate for today....


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 

Exercise time for DH is the current challenge (something I want for him as much as he wants it--not only for his health but for his mood!!)


here here! do YOU exercise? if so, how? (logistically, i mean)


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
here here! do YOU exercise? if so, how? (logistically, i mean)

I am a SAHM to a 2 year old, my exercise is playing with him, running up and down the stairs a million times for clean underwear, toys, etc., carrying heavy grocery bags, cleaning house, cooking (yes, this can be exercise, today I whisked polenta non-stop for 20 minutes!), and carrying a 32 pound kid when he's fussy/tired. I also try to push him in the stroller for a walk 2-3 times a week (though he likes to walk, which slows me down, and I often have to "split" the walk with him).

It's not as much as I would like, but for now I at least know I am not anywhere near sedentary.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
here here! do YOU exercise? if so, how? (logistically, i mean)

I've had good luck dancing with Fenton - I can usually even manage to get him dancing long enough for a decent workout. Anything more conventional (like walking while pg), I've had to abandon the idea of establishing a routine for it, and just grab it whenever there's a free 20 minutes or so with DH home so I can go alone (Can't walk fast enough for good heart rate with Fenton). Manage a walk ~ 3 times a week with this method. Can't imagine finding time to get to a gym...Biking would be a good option too.

Hey Pie Pie, how are you feeling so far? Been praying for good health for you....Is it helping?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I've had good luck dancing with Fenton - I can usually even manage to get him dancing long enough for a decent workout.

Especially if you can get a musical instrument involved. I still practice middle eastern dance, and i swear that letting him play with my zils gets me 15 extra minutes at least







.


----------



## cking

Oh man, I wish I had time to be in on this conversation. My screen time has suddenly become very limited, mostly because dd has learned how to climb onto kitchen chairs, and then onto the table, and her primary target is the laptop. And she doesn't just type cute nonsense words like most kids - it usually results in Firefox disappearing; so I can't even read.

This pregnancy was a surprise; so I can't defend our reasoning for spacing, etc. In fact, it took me a while to be ok with it. I can't really call it unplanned though. We had planned to have another child, we just hadn't decided when. As I learned with TTC the first time, sometimes these things aren't totally up to us. I really wasn't much looking forward to ttc again, since the disappointment of the year of trying with dd was still fresh in my mind. So in a way, I'm relieved that we were surprised. However, whether or not we have a third child _will_ totally be up to us. (I am so not my mother.)

The thing is, after dd got a little older, I started to look forward to being pregnant again. I enjoyed being pregnant with J, and fortunately everything went pretty well for us. But after becoming pregnant, I suddenly remembered all the negative and annoying things, and started to panic that I'm not ready for it yet. I'm also pretty sure right now that I don't want to have more than two&#8230;so I'm starting to look forward to things we can do once our second child is a little older. I don't really want to go on vacation without our kids, but it is nice to think that it'll only be a few years until we can travel more easily with them. (or is this just wishful thinking?)

Like you, zb, I had just started getting my body back to normal. I just started working out, the month before I got pregnant, and I just started to get serious about getting the pc muscles back to normal. Fortunately, they seemed to respond very quickly, so I was actually able to enjoy DTD again, (which is probably why I got pg)&#8230;so that makes me feel better too. It would suck to get pg when dtd still didn't feel good. Anyway, it also gives me more confidence that I'll be able to do both of these things more easily next time. (as long as DH is willing to give me one evening/week without both kids&#8230;not an easy promise).

Also, I totally hear you guys on the private/bathroom time. DH has been giving me a hard time lately about not having my s**t together at home. It really pisses me off because he still has not had a full day alone with DD. AND even if he did, he would not have to deal with the same things - eating enough to feed 2 (now 3!) people, plus nausea, nursing breaks, etc. Plus, even when he's alone with her for the evening, he does not really get the importance of making sure she gets enough to eat for dinner - because when she doesn't, I'm the one who has to nurse her all night.

I also wish we had more time in the evening with DH. He doesn't get home until at least 6:30. He commutes >3.5 hours round trip, and it's rough. I've been trying to get dinner ready for dd and myself earlier in the evening, but it's hard to do when DD is clutching my leg (or climbing up to the stove&#8230;.)

Piepie, my exercise is a once weekly class given by my chiro. It's a bit of indulgence, but it's totally what I need. I don't have the self-discipline to stick to a workout at home. All the things holiztic mentioned were enough to help me lose weight, but I still had a totally weak core and it was pretty hard on me. It took me over a year before I felt like I was ready to be away from DD for 1 ½ hours a week&#8230;another woman in my class started when her 2nd was 10 weeks old, so that's inspired me to start much earlier next time.

sorry for the monster run-on post.


----------



## Maela

I've been spoiled this summer with Dh off from work. The three of us head over to the inlaws three times a week to go swimming. that's been my exercise the last two and half months. But he goes back to work on Monday.







I don't know how I'm going to find time to rest, exercise and do my Hypnobabies now. If I have another baby, it's going to be in the summer. July was perfect.


----------



## Maela

Witchy, has your dh found a job yet? or was he hired back? been thinking about you guys...


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, still nothing. He wasn't hired back and we're still hunting for something, whether for me or for him, or part-time for each of us. I had an interview this week, but it was basically a giant waste of my time as they don't actually have a position for me.

I'm trying very hard not to freak out.


----------



## PiePie

*witchy*, that sucks. but it will all work out. the whole unemployment extension thing is a good thing. you all will be fine. it might actually be great for rhea if you were to each get something part-time.

no m/s (though some twinges) so *shanna* your prayers must be working! i am pretty sure i am preggo because my lower belly hurts CONSTANTLY. i wonder if this means it's a boy and i am just super sensitive to some of those girly hormones. dh thinks 1. it may yet come or 2. it is just a different pregnancy, not to give gender undue importance.

late night trip to playground plus ice cream truck. my kid can spot one a mile away.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am pretty sure i am preggo because my lower belly hurts CONSTANTLY. i wonder if this means it's a boy and i am just super sensitive to some of those girly hormones.

My sister's first pregnancy (boy) was just average, second was miserable (girl). Third was more average, so we were shocked when baby came out and was a girl. But the interesting thing is that her second child has a MUCh different constitution than my sister, whereas the other two tend to take after her temperment more. It's the child that she has the hardest time understanding and is just really different from her tempermentally. I always think that's so interesting....could be just a coincidence of course.

Anyway, I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for you. I know how debilitating it was for you to be feeling so poorly for so long







.


----------



## cking

I'm so behind on actually replying.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Christina, you're all over the place!







How did Josephine react to baby's heartbeat? Does she seem to understand?







I don't think Fenton really got it until recently, and i still think he's going to be pretty surprised in october. I'm so sorry about the Shingles, I hope it's something else. Is it painful?

I'm not sure. I don't really think she understood - but whenever I'm seeing a health care provider (usually chiro) she gets very upset, as if the person is hurting me. So, she was right next to me on the table, and she looked intrigued. We've told her there will be a baby, but we don't remind her very often; i figure there is enough time for that. Maybe she'll start to understand as my belly button starts to disappear (which it seems to be doing already (?)). And as she gets a little older. I'm a little torn over whether to have her present at the birth - I feel like she'll still be too young for it.

I'm 14 weeks now! I survived the first tri. yay!

The word on the rash was that it *might* be shingles, or it might just be poison ivy. But that it didn't matter since it was almost done. It's better now, but I also have an all-over itching which is probably just some silly pregnancy thing, mixed with lots of bug bites. Still keeping an eye on dd to see if she gets chicken pox.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I published my first 2 articles online for my WAHM job







:. Get SO tired of having my faith questioned because I don't hit or ignore my child.....

This is very cool. (but the second sentence is very sad














Great that you have such awesome writing skill that you can make a job out of it. That's something I kid of regret, neglecting that side of my brain. The other stuff just came so much easier.







I still don't know what I could do for a pt/wah job.

Witchy, i hope something turns up for you or your DH soon.


----------



## PiePie

I had some weird vision problems this morning. Like a brightly lit C with flashing lights, turned into a streamer. It was still there when I closed my eyes, so it was neurological, but only through my left eye. Freaky.


----------



## witchygrrl

Pregnancy can sure do weird things to people. My cousin completely lost all ability to read one day, two weeks after getting struck by lightening, no less. She went to the neurologist who ran some tests, including a pregnancy test, which turned out positive. Thankfully the problem was short lived, though we do joke that her daughter was conceived by lightening









DH has a job interview this evening! It's an after school gig, but we'll take it







Things are looking slightly more up.


----------



## accountclosed3

i deserve a special badge for being extra good to my MIL this weekend.

ok, we obviously do GD, but there really isn't any discipline to do. i never say no to hawk because there's no reason to. i just redirect because it works and makes sense.

so, my MIL has a conversation with ryan about how he "needs to say 'no' to hawk for his safety." they were apparently at the park and hawk was climbing which is his favorite thing. ryan and i climb with him to keep him safe. when he gets to a height that we can't reach or keep him safe, we pick him up and say "down we go!" and then we let him climb up again.

well, my MIL was watching him and said "you have to say NO! firmly." but ryan disagreed and said, this is fine, mom. she said he'll never learn to not climb too high. but ryan asserted that eventually we want him to climb high and explore his boundaries, just as he is doing now, with our protection. that way, he'll have confidence. he told her that there's nothing immoral about climbing.

i was, btw, so proud of ryan for being able to fend off his mother.

well, he told me this and then we all went to lunch. at the lunch table (a picnic table), i let hawk stand on the seat because he's too little to sit on it and he currently doesn't want to sit in my lap to eat. i am right next to him so he can't fall.

we start eating and hawk is getting tons of praise from his grandparents. all unnecessary, but there you hvae it. we let that go.

while drinking, he decides that he is done. since we're sharing a drink, he starts to play with it while it is still full. i say "this is not the time for playing with the cups; are you still drinking?" and then i offer him the cup. he takes a drink and then starts to play. i repeat it, and then he gives the cup back to me. i set him on the ground so that he can play.

a bit later, he stands up and asks for a drink. i give it to him. he starts playing with it after taking a sip. and my mil goes:

NO HAWK! BAD! WE DON"T PLAY WITH CUPS!

hawk was scared (by her volumn) and then started to cry. i picked him up and was probably shooting eye daggers at her.

and then she said to us "see, that's how you do it."

and ryan said "that's really horrible and unnecessary. i think our method is much more effective. i mean, he does what we ask, happily, rather than being frightened. you don't want him frightened of you, do you?"

and she said "well, he needs to know that there is a consequence." and he said "but there isn't a consequence. it doesn't matter if he plays with the cup. there are times when it's appropriate to play with a cup and time when it isn't. and we're teaching him that."

she did "NO! NO!" again to him, and i didn't say a thing. Ryan stood up and told her to cut it out.

Yay Ryan!

and then, he told them to leave all discipline to us. we're doing fine.









i swear, i could have stabbed her with my little fork for being mean to the baby. he didn't do anything wrong. duh.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
he told her that there's nothing immoral about climbing.

This is the crux of it, imho.

Yay you two. She really is too much







:


----------



## cking

Witchy, how was the interview?







:

Yay Ryan!

We are starting to struggle with GD. It's something we need to discuss more. DD has really started to climb - onto chairs, tables, etc. It's fine with me, but it's suddenly become hard to keep things out of her reach (dangerous things...) and DH doesn't really get that it's ok to climb. But there are things that I think are very important, like not running into the street or running away from me in public, but she doesn't really understand. So I'm trying to work on techniques for that.

Anyway, maybe I'll share your post with DH.









*********

So cute: J has started carrying around soap & lotion bottles, opening the lid and pretending to put some on me and lather me up. And sometimes she pretends to rub lotion on her belly.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Speaking of things that aren't moral issues, I'm having some weird feelings toward my neighbor.

They have 2 boys, 6 and 3. Fenton has always been very interested in what goes on over there, and likes to wander over there. They've always assured me it's fine if he is in their yard and playing with their toys, but it's always had teh asterisk of "he's too young to know boundaries". I've tried to be ingratiating, always apologizing when he wants to be in their yard, and asking again and again, "are you sure?". I've had a couple of times where I felt that they weren't okay with it, and I've tried to be sensitive to this.

Today, Fenton wanted to play with their rocket sprinkler, which he just loves. They weren't outside, so I borrowed it for about 20 minutes and brought it to our yard. She was outside when I brought it back, and I told her we had borrowed it. She seemed kind of cool and I made an effort to ask if it was okay if we borrowed it. She fumbled around in a way that said no, it's not okay.

I know it's their right to decide that, it's just so different from how I do things and how I'd like our relationship to be. I feel obligated to keep Fenton out of their yard entirely now, and that is going to be really inconvenient for me. And I'm peeved that Fenton loves this silly sprinkler and I can't seem to find one similar anywhere. Which ticks me off that I would buy one just so that we didn't have to borrow the neighbors.

When I was growing up, we had such a casual relationship with our neighbors. The funny thing about this exchange today is that I invited her boys and her over to play this morning and we had a great time. It struck me as odd that it was so formally a "playdate" where she came too, but they seem to do things more formally. Anyway, I'm trying to remember that this isn't a moral issue, just temperment. Anyway....feeling a little weird about the whole thing. I'll probably apologize for overstepping boundaries, both because I'm genuinely sorry that we misunderstood each other, and to give her a chance to more clearly delineate her boundaries. But the more theatrical part of me just wants to sidestep the whole thing and not wander over at all.

This is how every yard in America ends up being an independent little village. It's just so different from how I would do things


----------



## accountclosed3

with hawk's climbing and crawling quickly away from us and so on, we simply remove him. when i do, i explain that it's about safety--that there are safe places to climb and crawl away from us, and that there are also unsafe places.

now, he won't climb the stairs without us there, and he's stopped climbing on the shoe rack too.

when we're outside, he won't crawl more than 3-4 feet away from us (he used to head straight for the street), and he'll always look back before moving foward or upward. he is looking for our permission or 'diagnosis' about safety.

with cupboards, there are some where he can play and some where he cannot. when he goes for one that he cannot play with, we just close it and give him the one he can play with or give him another activity altogether (more common). and we say "that cupboard isn't safe." and that's it. really, the whole thing is simple.

i've never had to yell at him or say no. and, wow, does it keep me peaceful. i mean, i listen to other mom's of kids his age. it starts like this:

no joey, don't play with the over (nice-ish tone; still seated on the couch or what have you)

then escalates: Joey, i said no! listen to mama.

then escalates: No Joey! I said NO! i'm going to COUNT.

then escalates (mother getting angry and frustrated): NO joey STOP NOW! one. . .two. . .

then escalates (mother exasperated gets off couch, roughly grabs joey): NO! mama said NO! that is BAD! i told you to STOP!

and then redirects. and says to me "he's so willful and spirited."

my process: hawk plays with oven (tries to open the oven door). i go to hawk and pick him up gently and say "the oven is dangerous hawk. lets play with this instead." and then i get him engaged in a game.

he's all smiles, i'm all smiles. no reason to go through all of that.


----------



## PiePie

ugh, i did a huge post on gd and lost it.







:


----------



## PiePie

definitely having supply issues here. i had once said i wanted her to self-wean on her 2nd birthday, and now that it is upon us i am torn at best. mostly i feel like a failure as a mom for not providing for her. she does not seem upset, which is GREAT, but is having more trouble getting to sleep, which is NOT.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
definitely having supply issues here. i had once said i wanted her to self-wean on her 2nd birthday, and now that it is upon us i am torn at best. mostly i feel like a failure as a mom for not providing for her. she does not seem upset, which is GREAT, but is having more trouble getting to sleep, which is NOT.











I still mourn that Fenton is weaned. I wonder when I'll be more at peace with it - anecdotally, I find that no mama is satisfied with how weaning went for them. The sleep issue is tough - I found that teh trick is to find something that gets them to sit still long enough in bed for them to fall asleep. We tried this, and it worked some. Singing seems to work best.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i've never had to yell at him or say no. and, wow, does it keep me peaceful. i mean, i listen to other mom's of kids his age. it starts like this:

no joey, don't play with the over (nice-ish tone; still seated on the couch or what have you)

then escalates: Joey, i said no! listen to mama.

then escalates: No Joey! I said NO! i'm going to COUNT.

then escalates (mother getting angry and frustrated): NO joey STOP NOW! one. . .two. . .

then escalates (mother exasperated gets off couch, roughly grabs joey): NO! mama said NO! that is BAD! i told you to STOP!

and then redirects. and says to me "he's so willful and spirited.".

DH has observed the same thing. He says that some parents, he gets the sense that they yell over at their kids every so often to demonstrate to the other parents there that they are paying attention. He's also made an interesting observation that often parents need the child to agree with them before they'll let them move on. For example, in a grocery store, instead of redirecting, they'll stand there and yell about it as if they expect the child to meekly say "Yes Mama, you're right, I don't want that toy." They seem unsatisfied when this doesn't happen.


----------



## cking

Redirecting is fine, but what to do when I'm trying to cook and she wants to be where I am, doing what I'm doing?


----------



## accountclosed3

that may well be true. hmm.

weaning, the idea saddens me. my boy seems no where near it. . .but the idea of it is so sad. like, he'll no longer be a baby then.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Redirecting is fine, but what to do when I'm trying to cook and she wants to be where I am, doing what I'm doing?

I had good luck having a spot at the counter when Fenton could stand on a chair and "help". Away from the stove and knives. Often all it took to make him happy was some herbs to pull the stems off of (plant special ones if you want) or even some ice and 2 cups to pour back and forth. We have a lot of counter space, not sure if this works for everyone.

Gotta run, naked baby on the loose.


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, find ways for him to 'help.'

one of my friend's gives her daughter a bowl with rice and beans. she gives her a second empty bowl and asks her to divide out the beans for her. each day, she has a different "cooking" activity for her.

i give hawk a dried apricot. he sits next to me and works on it. he's usually finished when the food is ready, adn then he eats dinner.


----------



## cking

Those are some good ideas. Thanks. I've had her stand on a chair to help a few times, and she liked it. But we don't have a ton of counter space, and often I need to do a lot of chopping, so it's hard to keep her away from knives too. [my latest obsession is planning a renovated kitchen that is more family friendly....] Last time we were just shredding chicken, and she had fun taking a bite of chicken, then putting it back.









So I realized today that it really just takes a lot of patience on my part. Went to a friend's condo pool, and J wouldn't let go of the food in her hand, and wanted to go back in the water. I just had to keep reinforcing that we couldn't bring food into the pool, so if she didn't want to put it down, we had to just sit and watch the others. And forget about my desire to get back in.







Same thing happens when we need to get back into the car. i indulge her for a bit, since she wants to climb around the seats, etc., but we can't do it indefinitely since we're wasting gas/battery for the a/c. So I just have to remember snacks to ward off tantrums.

Coincidentally, another mom was there with her little boy, who was playing with my friend's toys. She kept telling him not to throw the toys, that it was bad. J has started to repeat everything, and she said "frow" and "bad".







: Reminded me of you guys.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Same thing happens when we need to get back into the car. i indulge her for a bit, since she wants to climb around the seats, etc., but we can't do it indefinitely since we're wasting gas/battery for the a/c. So I just have to remember snacks to ward off tantrums.

This is one of my frustrations as a parent - I indulge these things way more than other parents do, and at some point, we have to do the boring thing like actually get in the car. When I see that it leads to a tantrum anyway, I sometimes feel frustrated that I don't get any credit for letting him do what other parents think I'm nuts to let him do.

I just learned a trick to compel Fenton into his carseat (because he does the same thing, wants to "drive" and sit in "Daddy's spot", which is the passenger seat). He's really into rockets, so I ask him if he can do a countdown to launch into the commanders seat. First time it worked, it surprised me and he nailed me in the nose







. He jumped into the seat. But if there's something she really likes that she can make part of getting into her seat.....

I feel ya sister







.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Trying a new bedtime routine tonight. Last night, the ridiculousness of lying still in the dark, trying not to fall asleep, while my son crawled all over me, kicked me and played with his trucks in bed for 90 minutes was just too much. I know, I know...it sounds like he's not tired. Except he clearly needs a nap during the day, and regardless of what time we get him to bed (tried 11 over the weekend) it takes him an hour to fall asleep. New routine is reading books downstairs at 8:30 plus a snack, heading to bed at 9. Singing 1 song, leaving the nightlight on and asking him to stay in bed while we go get a "drink of water". Telling him we'll be right back. I wanted to start at leaving him for 5 minutes, but DH insists on trusting him enough to start with 10. We'll see. I imagine the hour wind-down to bed will start only after we've returned, but at least we can start to make baby steps of him staying in his bed for a few minutes and not panicking that we aren't there to crawl on and kick. Wish me luck.

Weird day yesterday. Saw three different friends (separately) who are all dealing with fertility issues and had a strong sense that our relationships are tense because I'm pregnant. It makes sense, it's normal. But it was a little much to have it happen 3 times in a row







. Felt really alone yesterday.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
This is how every yard in America ends up being an independent little village. It's just so different from how I would do things









We're considering getting a swingset/play structure for our backyard - I can't convey how NOT in the budget this is. But it feels unbelievably cruel to have my son be able to see their swingset and not be able to go over. So far, I've had a nightmare of a day trying to keep Fenton out of our neighbor's yard. Feeling really angry at the culture I live in.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
We're considering getting a swingset/play structure for our backyard - I can't convey how NOT in the budget this is. But it feels unbelievably cruel to have my son be able to see their swingset and not be able to go over. So far, I've had a nightmare of a day trying to keep Fenton out of our neighbor's yard. Feeling really angry at the culture I live in.









I hear ya. Well, my sister (who lives 20+ miles from anywhere and has just that life that I never wanted part of) has offered us her kids' old swingset, since they've outgrown it. DH's first reaction was that it was against our principles, that we 'live in a town with playgrounds'; but in fact, the nearest playground is a mile away and it's not very nice. Anyway, it most likely won't fit in our little yard. So, if shipping was no issue, I would gladly send this one over to you.









Let me know how the new routine goes tonight. DH thinks we should be able to do this now, but it might be nice to know that it could be possible in a year or so.


----------



## PiePie

i am a big believer in climbing structures and slides for kids. we live in a city with playgrounds and we have no yard but we sprung for this http://www.step2.com/product.cfm?pro...orts%20climber for her bedroom and wow do we all love it. gets daily use. go for it!

i too struggle with when to say when on the child-led timing of daily life, and i feel guilty because i definitely feel that if i were a sahm everything would be pretty devoid of schedule and now we do have some things we have to do at certain times. but she is still tantrum-free and i attribute that to not deifying Setting Limits for the sake of setting limits. I do change my mind partway through (something DH doesn't love) if it seems that her feelings on a matter are stronger than mine and healthy and safety is not at stake and i take what is apparently a small view of safety compared to others' -- she does a tremendous amt. of climbing (e.g., on the subway) for which others give me dirty looks. but she is fine and dandy and happy and confident in her body, which is what i care about more than having knees that aren't skinned. i have more to say but have to use naptime for bills, which i have been neglecting.


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, for cooking, i try to set her up with art, which she loves. finger-painting is perfect for this age. she has her own little table and chair (mine as a child) which is usually in the kitchen near me. (okay, it hasn't been for a month, since i moved it to clean the kitchen, but that is where it should be.) others use a special (electronic?) toy that they don't see at any other time -- i could see resorting to that if you needed to. but they do need to be in the same room with you.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am a big believer in climbing structures and slides for kids. go for it!

Thanks







Feeling pretty sad about the whole thing, to be honest. Mostly because this is the first time my child has obviously been rejected.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i attribute that to not deifying Setting Limits for the sake of setting limits. I do change my mind partway through (something DH doesn't love) if it seems that her feelings on a matter are stronger than mine and healthy and safety is not at stake and i take what is apparently a small view of safety compared to others' -- she does a tremendous amt. of climbing (e.g., on the subway) for which others give me dirty looks.

I agree completely. DH taught Fenton to use the phrase "It's really important to me" so that he has a tool between asking nicely and throwing a tantrum. We change our mind all the time midway through what could be a battle, and I haven't regretted it.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, this was part of the ginormous post i lost (mostly about gd and "setting limits" but also in response to your neighbor conflict), but the short version is that my guess is that she is concerned about liability. the idea pops into my mind because i am reading louv's _last child in the woods,_ but it also sounds like something my mother said while i was growing up. specifically, the concern is that if you permit a particular child to play on your property (or with your sprinkler) and the child gets injured, you have opened yourself up to liability. i am not saying this is a fear that makes sense to have, just that the perception is out there (and, louv argues, widespread).


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
the idea pops into my mind because i am reading louv's _last child in the woods,_

How are you liking the book? I loved the interview with him in The Sun, but couldn't get through the book. Also wondering how your book group discussion of "You are your child's first teacher" went - I forgot to ask you way back then.

Bedtime experiment still going on, we're entering hour 2. Feeling committed to doing something different from what we have been doing. So far tonight, DH took him to bed at 9, put on his nightlight, and told him he'd be back in 10 minutes. Fenton went longer than 10 minutes before he called out for DH. Didn't seem upset, but played in his bed the whole time. DH went back in and laid with him, and got up just before F fell asleep. DH still went out, saying "Good night Fenton". Fenton came out 2 minutes later, bright-eyed saying "I woke up!". Dh laying with him now, I wonder if the 60 minute clock just started over. Still, it's a sign we could try just going in to check on him periodically.....Sorry, just thinking out loud









Is Fenton the only one here who goes to sleep without nursing?


----------



## Holiztic

Quinn has been weaned for 3 months now.

As long as he hasn't napped (sorry!) he has his bedtime snack at around 6:30 or 7, then diaper, pyjamas, teeth brushed at 7 or so, then 3 stories and he's out by 7:30. Until this week the books did it, he'd roll around between us while DH read and I rubbed his tummy and cuddled. He'd roll a little less, then a little less, until he stopped and fell asleep. This week he's been fidgeting more (not getting outside as much with the heat) and after 3 stories he's still going (eyes half closed) so we've had to rock him in the rocking chair or even "dance" him until he fell asleep (an extra 10 minutes or so).

If F needs the nap, then I don't know what to tell you, other then try to run him ragged in the late afternoon/early evening (of course that runs you/DH ragged too!)

Good luck!


----------



## witchygrrl

Poor Fenton. But yeah, I agree with PiePie that it's probably because of liability issues.









Rhea's been having sleeping issues in that she's now not wanting to go to sleep before midnight, even if we start at 10.







She used to just nurse and fall asleep. Now it's nurse, stay awake, turn over, start crawling around on the bed, stumbling because she's exhausted, but just dosn't wanna. Rinse, repeat. I'm not sure what to try next.

DH's first interview on Monday was meh. Pay is lousy, and he'd have to drive around to different towns to teach kids robotics after school. But it was something, ya know?

He just had one today, thinking that it was an after school art teaching position, but it seems like it's more of a directorship to RUN the art program. This, of course, sounds fabulous, and it went really well.







:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
He just had one today, thinking that it was an after school art teaching position, but it seems like it's more of a directorship to RUN the art program. This, of course, sounds fabulous, and it went really well.







:

Oooh, hopefully he gets that one! It does sound great!







:

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Is Fenton the only one here who goes to sleep without nursing?

Maev nurses for a couple of minutes (sometimes not at all) before getting into bed. So she doesn't nurse to sleep. I'm happy because dh can put her to sleep now too. And the grandparents - although she stays up much later with them.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
but the short version is that my guess is that she is concerned about liability.

I actually think it's not about this, only because the neighbors and I have had this exact discussion. I'm trying to stay non-judgemental about it - after all, it could cause _me_ some problems if neighbor kids were always in our backyard right at dinner time, nap time, etc. It's just so confusing to Fenton, so abrupt on their part and so inconvenient and sad on mine. I won't go too much into it, but I think DH hit it right on the head when he said this is a classic liberal/conservative struggle between community and private property/control.

But now the dilemma is that we've bought or committed to buy a couple of things similar to what they have so that Fenton at least has that element taken out of it....only to find that we're getting good deals on things that are quite a bit bigger or better than what they have. Which makes me really uncomfortable with the message it sends. The only thing we can do is to make sure to invite their kids over to play with the new stuff to try to extend the hand again, and hope it doesn't come off as snarky. Never had neighbor issues before. Well, except for those dopes on the 2nd floor back in '99 who didn't understand that dropping their cigarette butts meant they landed on our patio







.

Sorry to bore you with all of this.

Bedtime only went about 15 minutes longer than usual last night. I think I'm going to try a similar thing to what DH did, but I probably won't leave when I know he's still awake. I like seeing that he doesn't panic when left in his bed with the nightlight on, and I think it could start to help him feel comfortable falling asleep like that.


----------



## PiePie

http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1123950


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1123950

PiePie,







I had pretty much the same thing with this pg. I had light pink discharge then brown discharge; and then later that night when I saw a bright red glob of discharge I thought for sure I was miscarrying. But then all I had after that was brown discharge for 5 days. I'm pretty convinced it was from our umm...Valentine's Day celebration







that morning.
I hope it's nothing.







Did anything like this happen with your last pg? It didn't happen with my last and that's why I was so scared at first, but it seems like SO many women have spotting during the beginning of pg.


----------



## Maela

My daughter likes balsamic vinegar on raw spinach leaves. She chose that over rice just now. Yes she is an odd child. But I'm glad.


----------



## cking

Josephine hasn't nursed in almost 24 hours.









She has been feverish and cranky/clingy all day and night. She has been drinking water and some cow's milk. She's also been asking to nurse quite a bit, but when I offer, she says bye-bye to the boob. Is this a nursing strike? It's never happened before. I finally pumped this morning, and got barely 4 oz. From _Mothering your nursing toddler_ it says it could go on for days (?). Really wishing I had an electric pump right now....

I'm really hoping it's her molars. She's been working on them for 6 months, with nothing yet. We've had several rough nights so far, but nothing as bad as this. Yet, I'm starting to feel like she'll never get them. {which is impossible, right? she can't go through life with 8 teeth.}

Piepie,







thinking of you.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
My daughter likes balsamic vinegar on raw spinach leaves. She chose that over rice just now. Yes she is an odd child. But I'm glad.









Keep in mind that spinach has oxalic acid (the thing that makes some people's teeth/tongue feel weird). It binds with calcium and iron and therefore draws them out of your body. Sorry to be a downer, just wanted to let you know in case you didn't already! BTW, it is mostly removed by cooking it very well (not just wilting!)

On the balsamic thing, that's awesome!! When Q was about a 1.5 we brought a platter to a party, it was cherry tomatoes, basil leaves, mozzerella balls on tooth picks with a homemade balsamic dip that is both sour and sweet (touch of honey). The other toddlers all tried some of the dip in succession and each one made a horribly puckered sour face and wanted nothing to do with it. When it was Q's turn he licked his lips and asked for more!!

We have definitely made a point of getting him sour flavors from day 1 (of solids) and he still loves his plain yogurt, fermented veggies, and he downs plain kefir (8 oz in about 3 minutes yesterday!)


----------



## Maela

You're not supposed to eat spinach raw?! I've never heard of that before. I eat it raw all the time.









I'm gaining weight like crazy. What's wrong with me?? I'm not eating that unhealthy, although I'm not getting half as much exercise as I did when pg with Maev.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Pie Pie, I'm thinking of you. I didn't have anything new to offer in advice on the thread you posted. Please update us when you can? Praying for your little bean









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
You're not supposed to eat spinach raw?! I've never heard of that before. I eat it raw all the time.









We follow this rule of thumb too (of cooking it, I mean). You've probably heard not to drink milk and eat spinach together for this reason. Cooking the spinach (and doing raw milk with the enzymes) negates keeping them separate. I remember how I felt when I learned this too - it's the only vegetable DH will tolerate, so he thought I was making it up to mess with him









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I'm gaining weight like crazy. What's wrong with me?? I'm not eating that unhealthy, although I'm not getting half as much exercise as I did when pg with Maev.

This is my situation too. I'm not sure precisely how much I've gained at this point, but I'm pretty sure I passed my total last pg gain a couple of weeks ago. I'm eating very differently though (healthy, but with starches and grains that were missing last time). And exercising is definately more challenging. Don't forget how quickly the weight comes off with nursing, and that if you're eating healthy, it's good weight. That standard of being thin with just a basketball tummy really doesn't get you the extra body fat you need to regulate hormones, and build healthy brain and nerves for your little guy.

A day full of blessings yesterday. We found a great play set for Fenton. My Dad went with me to go pick it up with his trailer, so we didn't even have to take it apart and put it together. I got to spend lots of time in a car with my Dad, which is the only way to have a conversation with him







. While I was gone, our neighbor called DH and apologized for miscommunicating her intentions for our kids playing together. Her kids came over when the play set got here, and it felt like things were smoothed over. AND my in-laws paid for the play set.


----------



## PiePie

love fentom\n's playset. sure it will get a lot of love. especially the periscope. love that it's also a little houser for dramatic play. it will really grow with him. lotsa room for neighbor kids


----------



## Maela

I agree with PiePie. Very cute too!

*Cking*, I hope the nursing strike ends soon! Has she nursed at all today since you posted? Has your supply dropped since becoming pregnant - I can't remember if you've mentioned that?


----------



## accountclosed3

you might try freecycle and craigslist for sets as well.

hawk started pointing out other sets in people's back yards. i say to him "yes, that's a swing set, but it belongs to those people. we go to public play sets." i also use this "yours/theirs" or "yours/mine" in regards to stuff around the house, etc. it seems to have worked well for him.

of course, we werent' in the situation where you can use then can't use something.


----------



## cking

Happy Birthday Lorelei and Kai!

That's a nice playset Shanna. Good work getting it all together, so nice the ILs paid for it too.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Cking*, I hope the nursing strike ends soon! Has she nursed at all today since you posted? Has your supply dropped since becoming pregnant - I can't remember if you've mentioned that?

No, she still hasn't nursed. She'll ask to nurse, but still says bye-bye when I offer - i think she just means she wants to cuddle. I don't think she's ready to wean, I think there is something wrong.







Pumping is hard because she doesn't want to leave my side. I'm pretty sad about the whole thing.

eta: I'm sure my supply has reduced quite a bit since becoming pregnant, but up until Friday she was still nursing every 3 hours, or less.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*PiePie:* Any news? Thinking only good thoughts for you...

And sending lots of birthday love to *Lorelei*.

And birthday love for *Kai* too! xxoo

*Christina:* I have no experience, but I do know that with persistence, nursing strikes end. I can imagine you must be feeling very stressed about it.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Christina* - re pumping - can you hire a super powered electric pump? I know we can hire them from the Aust Breastfeeding Ass. (our LLL equivalent).


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

An update at PiePie's request:








I went to the uni open day and info session for my potential midwifery degree yesterday. Was so inspired but now also terrified and quite sure I won't get in. 900 applicants, 40 accepted. Still, I'm definitely applying to start in Feb next year. It's a 3 year degree but I'll be part time so it'll take a bit longer. It's so exciting. Of course, I have no idea who will care for Sebby - the childcare waiting lists in my area are 2 years long and Sebby isn't on any yet. Oops.







And my mother is not up for regular babysitting - which is fair enough, but sucks!

If I don't get in, I think I'll probably do doula training and lactation consultant training so I can have some income and experience and then apply again for midwifery once I'm done with my own babies.

I don't know if I've mentioned it here before but independent midwifery (thus homebirth unless you freebirth) is about to be outlawed in Australia







:







- there's a lot of lobbying and activism going on but no one is particularly hopeful. It's a very sad state of affairs. If it happens, I think there'll be a resurgence of birth centres here - but I do wonder what it means for someone graduating from midwifery 4 or 5 years from now.

*Shanna*...following your conversation re community closely. Though we only moved two streets away, we're now on a semi-main road. I've never even seen our neighbours, let alone spoken to them. This compared to the entire street playing football and cricket on the road in our old street is very sad to me. Though living on the main road puts us much closer to our little village of shops and cafes and the sense of community, just 25 steps from my house, is very much alive and well....a shame though that it centres around the transfer of capital.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Happy Birthday Lorelei and Kai!

No, she still hasn't nursed. She'll ask to nurse, but still says bye-bye when I offer - i think she just means she wants to cuddle. I don't think she's ready to wean, I think there is something wrong.







Pumping is hard because she doesn't want to leave my side. I'm pretty sad about the whole thing.

Happy birthday Lorelei and Kai! It gets me wondering how long we've all known each other







.

Christina, I'm so sorry for the nursing situation and how confusing it is right now







. Does she seem like herself otherwise? Is she eating more solids? Does she have ways to tell you if the milk tastes different to her? I also wonder what she'd do if you pumped in front of her, provided she doesn't climb all over you and make it impossible (which I'm familiar with ;-)

I have an appointment with the midwife in a couple of weeks and I think I'm going to ask her my Big Question. My libido when not pregnant is virtually non-existent







When I'm pregnant it's definately.....healthy. Bordering on unhealthy, iykwim







Doctors have been so unhelpful in helping with this ("does your husband beat you? No? Well, I'm out of ideas!"), and I can't believe that the difference between pg and not pg doesn't offer some clues. When I'm not pregnant, it feels like something is wrong - Not only am I completely uninterested, but I even on occasion feel agitated when I'm trying to get in the mood. An ill-placed elbow or him accidently pulling my hair will abruptly end any attempt. When I'm pg, it feels like something gets knocked back into place hormonally or something.....Anyway, it's beyond the purview of her job, so it has taken me a while to decide to ask her if she has ideas for what these clues mean.

I'm reading Bad Mother - anyone read?


----------



## PiePie

i am sure i miscarried and am still passing the uterine lining. i am alternately depressed, angry at unrelated things, and unbelievably tired. and did i mention in tremendous pain?

dd had a good birthday anyway -- she loved her scooter and her grandfather's visit. my mother and brother she didn't dislike but nothing like my dad. i felt very happy to see her so happy.


----------



## cking

She nursed! Right after she fell asleep. And...she slept all night. She's still sleeping. Let's just hope this continues. Shanna, she definitely has not been herself.

oh, gotta go...bbl


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i am sure i miscarried and am still passing the uterine lining. i am alternately depressed, angry at unrelated things, and unbelievably tired. and did i mention in tremendous pain?

Pie Pie, I'm so sorry. I've been checking here so often, praying for good news. Come back and talk when you're ready?

The pain _is_ unbelievable, I was surprised by how close to labor it is. Bathtub and heating pack help some, but not for sadness







. Nettle tea with some molasses stirred in helped some with the exhaustion/lightheadedness. Is Monday your day off, or can you take today off?


----------



## Holiztic

I am so sorry Pie Pie! I'll be thinking about you and your family today and sending healing vibes your way!!


----------



## witchygrrl

Belated birthday wishes to Lorelei and Kai!








to PiePie. I'm so very sorry.


----------



## cking

I'm so so sorry Piepie.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm sorry for your loss, piepie.

----

paperwork for NZ is almost finished.


----------



## arelyn

Thank you for the birthday wishes! Kai had a great birthday picnic with our families.

piepie: Hi birthing buddy. Sorry about the miscarriage.









MMM: How exciting! Well, going to midwifery schoo is exciting. Graduating and not being able to get legal employment would suck.

Someday I'll find enough time to do more than lurk here! Probably when Kai goes off to college. I believe it was Shanna who said she missed all the time she had before she was a parent to talk about the stuff she'd do once she was a parent. It's so silly but so true!


----------



## Maela

PiePie, I'm so sorry.







I was really hoping that it was nothing.








I'm glad to hear Lorelei had a great birthday though.

Cking, so glad to hear she's nursed!!

Happy (late) Birthday to Kai and Lorelei!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Checking on Pie Pie.









Christina, is J nursing consistently again?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

PiePie







Crap. I'm so sorry. We're here. xxoo


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Checking on Pie Pie.









ditto.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Christina, is J nursing consistently again?

She is. In fact, she nursed pretty much non-stop today. I think she was fighting a virus, because I seem to have picked it up.







But I'm so glad she's back to nursing, and my nipples seem to have recovered well during their three days off. She's still not back to herself, but at least she's not afraid of my breasts.


----------



## accountclosed3

man, the oven is dirty.

i finally broke down and bought chemicals. i haven't cooked in so long, and i figured ryan was cleaning (bad idea), and so i didn't clean it for the last year. yucky yucky yucky and we're lucky we didn't have a grease fire!

anyway, one full can of easy-off and we're about 1/2 of the way done. horrors! i think ryan should do the rest. honestly.

whew. i have guests this weekend AND ryan wants his parents to come. madness. if i sub two classes, i can at least get out of the parents. LOL


----------



## PiePie

hi friends. i am having a rough time finding words right now. here is the short version: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1#post14257201 i will be back later with more.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
hi friends. i am having a rough time finding words right now. here is the short version: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1#post14257201 i will be back later with more.

I've been so worried about you







. Going to read.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
hi friends. i am having a rough time finding words right now. here is the short version: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1#post14257201 i will be back later with more.


----------



## witchygrrl

PiePie, lots of love and healing energy to you. Please take good care of yourself, and know that we're all here to support you.


----------



## cking

I'm so sorry Piepie. Wishing you peace and healing.


----------



## Maela

PiePie, I don't know what to say. I'm so sorry you're having to go through this.


----------



## Maela

I just have to share. Tonight when I nursed Maev before bedtime, she popped off before the five minutes were over (like she almost always does now) and said, "There was milk." I said "really?" and checked and out came some colostrum! I asked her if she thought it tasted good or bad and she said "good."

I told my LLL Leader today that I want to put my application on hold. There's just no way I'm going to finish it before the baby, and I feel like I just have too many things going on right now in my life to add something else. I've been getting overwhelmed easily lately, and I'm really feeling the need to cut out most of my outside obligations. I'm worried about how I'm going to handle two little ones... Anyway, I feel like a weight has been lifted from my shoulders ever since I decided to wait on becoming a Leader.
*Cking*, I can't remember if you have said or not; but did you ever decide whether or not you wanted to be a Leader?

*PiePie*, I've been thinking about you today.


----------



## PiePie

Just checking in to say I am still alive, barely functioning, I think most of the issues right now are physical.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I told my LLL Leader today that I want to put my application on hold. There's just no way I'm going to finish it before the baby, and I feel like I just have too many things going on right now in my life to add something else. I've been getting overwhelmed easily lately, and I'm really feeling the need to cut out most of my outside obligations. I'm worried about how I'm going to handle two little ones... Anyway, I feel like a weight has been lifted from my shoulders ever since I decided to wait on becoming a Leader.

So wise to see that was what you needed. I still keep Fenton's half-finished baptism bunting to remind me that I _can_ let let things go. I'm trying to decide whether to let one of my current projects go.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Just checking in to say I am still alive, barely functioning, I think most of the issues right now are physical.









I can't imagine what it adds to have a LO while going through this. Some things would be easier, but a lot of things would be harder. Dh and I spaced out together on the couch for about a week both times. I'm hoping you're getting time off work, but I remember you were worried about how swamped you are too. It wouldn't at all be inappropriate, if $ isn't an issue, to call a post-partum doula for help. You need to be mothered for a while.

Christina, how is J? And how are you, did you get the virus?


----------



## farmama

Piepie,

I'm so sorry. Do your best to rest-I know how hard it is to take a break, but a litle rest may help keep you from being overwhelmed.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I just helped Fenton make a make-shift car with "trailer" (orange cozy Coupe with wheelbarrow tied to back). He wanted to pretend he was launching a boat off a trailer and into the water like he saw his papa do this weekend. I had to laugh when I realized that part is the worst part of boating in most people's minds.







But then, he also loves to pretend he's cleaning poop off the floor....

I just realized I'm going to have to update our family trust document after Ku is born. I think most of the hard part was done the first time around, but I've sort of blocked that whole experience out of my mind, it was such a PITA. We did it ourselves with software and a notary, and later I realized the software we could have gotten from the library instead of purchasing. In case that helps anyone.

It's so quiet in here - Pie Pie, we miss you







.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I just have to share. Tonight when I nursed Maev before bedtime, she popped off before the five minutes were over (like she almost always does now) and said, "There was milk." I said "really?" and checked and out came some colostrum! I asked her if she thought it tasted good or bad and she said "good."

I told my LLL Leader today that I want to put my application on hold. There's just no way I'm going to finish it before the baby, and I feel like I just have too many things going on right now in my life to add something else. I've been getting overwhelmed easily lately, and I'm really feeling the need to cut out most of my outside obligations. I'm worried about how I'm going to handle two little ones... Anyway, I feel like a weight has been lifted from my shoulders ever since I decided to wait on becoming a Leader.
*Cking*, I can't remember if you have said or not; but did you ever decide whether or not you wanted to be a Leader?


So cute about Maev and the milk. Do you remember when you stopped having milk? Did it hurt to nurse?

I sort of decided I want to do it (become a LLL leader); but all plans are pretty much on hold too. I think having a second child is going to be a huge transition, and I don't think I can focus on much else right now. Sounds like you feel the same way.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Christina, how is J? And how are you, did you get the virus?

We're both doing much better, thanks for asking. I was only sick that one day, so I'm not sure what it was. Josephine is still quite clingy - it's as if she's going through even more separation anxiety - maybe she's preparing for a big leap (18 months...) or senses the new baby. (?) But it does seem like she's going through some big changes - she has definitely had a language explosion lately. So maybe that was all wrapped up together. No molars yet - just two points of one molar on the bottom. They are taking for.evar!

Oh, Shanna, you've reminded me that we haven't even updated our trust for Josephine. And now it would seem it's not worth doing until the new baby comes. (probably not a good idea, but that's most likely what will happen...) So much to do...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
So cute about Maev and the milk. Do you remember when you stopped having milk? Did it hurt to nurse?

I sort of decided I want to do it (become a LLL leader); but all plans are pretty much on hold too. I think having a second child is going to be a huge transition, and I don't think I can focus on much else right now. Sounds like you feel the same way.

I can't remember exactly when, but I think it was gone by May? It hurt from day 1 - ovulation - and got worse and then better by about halfway, when it started to be really irritating.







But we're still going just 0-2 times a day, and I'm really happy with that amount and I think I can keep it up after baby is born.

Does it hurt for you? How far along are you now?


----------



## arelyn

DH took Kai out to a concert (Indian of course) so I get an hour and a half all to myself. This has never happened before and I'm totally







: .

First order of business, update you all on our lives since Kai doesn't let me type more than four sentences at a time and Shanna politely rebuked me for keeping you out of the loop.

DH was offered a position as staff ethnomusicologist with a missions agency who wants to contextualize their work in South Asia. It doesn't really pay much at all (travel, living and resonable medical expenses are covered) but DH is absolutely thrilled. This is his dream position, the reason he got the major he did and chose his particular thesis topic.

The catch: They want me to go back to school for at least a year.

Now, I don't really want to go back to school. I LOVE being a SAHM and I hated college. I hemmed and hawed and fussed about it for a while but here I am, typing this from our dorm room in Minnesota (home of the only affordable Bible school with a one year certificate program that will let me be the primary student and let DH be a homemaker). Starting tomorrow I am back in school and DH is a SAHD. I'm still pretty much in denial. It just seems crazy but if it means moving back overseas surely I can slog through for eight months!

We're dormmates with another couple who have young children. I can't believe I'm living with another breastfeeding, baby-wearing, cloth diapering mama! What are the odds of that?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
DH took Kai out to a concert (Indian of course) so I get an hour and a half all to myself.

You don't know what to do with yourself the first time this happens, huh?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
First order of business, update you all on our lives since Kai doesn't let me type more than four sentences at a time and Shanna politely rebuked me for keeping you out of the loop.

I believe my quote was "What?! How the heck did I miss this????? "








OH, and speaking of keeping people out of the loop, Arelyn, Sihaya and I got to meet last week! With Calvin, Kai and Fenton!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *arelyn* 
We're dormmates with another couple who have young children. I can't believe I'm living with another breastfeeding, baby-wearing, cloth diapering mama! What are the odds of that?









Awesome! So glad the living situation is working out


----------



## Maela

Wow, *Arelyn*, that's crazy! I think it sounds fun! Something different for a short, defined amount of time; and then moving overseas! Hope things go well for you!

Maev just said this to me, after asking me to do something that I wasn't really feeling like doing: "Come on, be a good Mama - just for now" with a totally straight face. I have no idea where she got that phrase from, but both dh and I were







:.


----------



## accountclosed3

that's a riot, funny baby.

and, i think i'm teaching hawk to swear. he was going a little nuts with the wiggle-in-my-lap/nursing/not-nursing thing, and i finally said "stop f-ing with me and either nurse or play." it wasn't mean or anything, it was just what it was. i happened to be at the studio with a couple of other teachers.

and they go "you know, he's going to learn taht word." and i'm like "yeah? so?" but whatever. anyway, he got down and played then. LOL

it worked. so, i have a feeling i'll get "momma, stop f-ing with me and do x." at some point. LOL


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
so, i have a feeling i'll get "momma, stop f-ing with me and do x." at some point. LOL











I have a mw appointment today. Hoping to find out what position this baby is in (Head down!).


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
and, i think i'm teaching hawk to swear. he was going a little nuts with the wiggle-in-my-lap/nursing/not-nursing thing, and i finally said "stop f-ing with me and either nurse or play." it wasn't mean or anything, it was just what it was. i happened to be at the studio with a couple of other teachers.

and they go "you know, he's going to learn taht word." and i'm like "yeah? so?" but whatever. anyway, he got down and played then. LOL

it worked. so, i have a feeling i'll get "momma, stop f-ing with me and do x." at some point. LOL

Reminds me of a conversation DH and I have every few months about the nature of profanity, and how funny it is that they're all just strings of letters that elicit such a response.

I get a perverse joy out of imagining Hawk saying the F word to your MIL, and you looking on serenely.....







:

Any pg mamas thinking about getting a present for your older LO for when the baby comes? I think we may do this, but any gift ideas I have seem so trite for the event it celebrates.

Major paradigm shift in how we're approaching Fenton's health issue. I'll write more soon, but pray for me tomorrow


----------



## Maela

Head down!!!

Gift for older dc:
Oh have to go, peepee accident!


----------



## PiePie

my mom got me a new doll when my little brother was born and i loved it.

i am going to be out of town for 4 days (visiting friends), so if i don't get back on tonight, see you all sunday night/monday morning.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Head down!!!

Hurray!!!!!! My little one keeps head-butting my cervix.....Never had that with Fenton until the day before labor began. Since I could barely recognize labor when I was in the midst of it, this has me worried I wouldn't recognize pre-term labor if it hit me upside the head. Hopefully it doesn't (or isn't)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Oh have to go, peepee accident!

It's an hourly occurence with me now. DH has started imitating me sneezing and then groaning, and running to the bathroom









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
my mom got me a new doll when my little brother was born and i loved it.

i am going to be out of town for 4 days (visiting friends), so if i don't get back on tonight, see you all sunday night/monday morning.

Have a great time Pie Pie. Hope your friends are nurturing







.


----------



## cking

Arelyn, that's very interesting. Good luck with your program. So does DH start his position after you are finished? Very cool that you got to meetup with Shanna and Sihaya&#8230;I assume during your drive west?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I can't remember exactly when, but I think it was gone by May? It hurt from day 1 - ovulation - and got worse and then better by about halfway, when it started to be really irritating.







But we're still going just 0-2 times a day, and I'm really happy with that amount and I think I can keep it up after baby is born.

Does it hurt for you? How far along are you now?

I'm 16 weeks. It does hurt, but I suppose it's livable. It actually helped me to have that 3 day break during the nursing strike, to see that the pain/soreness will go away very quickly. Now I just need to find a gentle way to get her to cut down on the number of sessions.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev just said this to me, after asking me to do something that I wasn't really feeling like doing: "Come on, be a good Mama - just for now" with a totally straight face. I have no idea where she got that phrase from, but both dh and I were







:.

So cute.

J has started to repeat everything, and we're pretty sure she's picked up on the s word. Although it sounds a lot like sheet, shirt and sheep anyway. It's also pretty funny to hear her efforts at pronouncing fork.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Reminds me of a conversation DH and I have every few months about the nature of profanity, and how funny it is that they're all just strings of letters that elicit such a response.

I get a perverse joy out of imagining Hawk saying the F word to your MIL, and you looking on serenely.....







:

Any pg mamas thinking about getting a present for your older LO for when the baby comes? I think we may do this, but any gift ideas I have seem so trite for the event it celebrates.

Major paradigm shift in how we're approaching Fenton's health issue. I'll write more soon, but pray for me tomorrow









Not sure yet about a gift when the baby comes, but we got her first real doll last week. Seemed like she was more than ready for it, since she's been kidnapping other kids' dolls for months, and that it would help her to learn about babies before the new one comes. So far she's a fan. She's an even bigger fan of babies (which to her is anyone under ~5).









I got J to help me make cornbread batter tonight, for a tamale pie. What a mess! But lots of fun. She loved it, didn't want me to clean up her hands.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shanna*
It's an hourly occurence with me now. DH has started imitating me sneezing and then groaning, and running to the bathroom.









I assumed she was talking about Maev, but this totally made me laugh.







I've been peeing every 1/2 or so lately.









Have a good trip Piepie!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Hurray!!!!!! My little one keeps head-butting my cervix.....Never had that with Fenton until the day before labor began. Since I could barely recognize labor when I was in the midst of it, this has me worried I wouldn't recognize pre-term labor if it hit me upside the head. Hopefully it doesn't (or isn't)

I get pressure on my bladder and cervix a few times a day that really hurts! I guess it's his head. I don't really get kicked in the ribs like everyone else talks about, but I didn't with Dd either - just pressure. Maybe it's just something weird with my body.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 







I assumed she was talking about Maev, but this totally made me laugh.







I've been peeing every 1/2 or so lately.

















I was talking about Maev. But I often have accidents myself these days.









I don't really have a specific gift in mind to give Maev. I plan on setting up a little basket with a few cheap little toys/books that she can play with only when i'm nursing the baby - hoping that will help with him nursing so much. And I bought one of those big kids wall calendars (like the kind you see in preschools) and I'm going to put it up sometime in Nov. when I'm feeling up to it. I think that she would enjoy doing something like that with me when we have a few free minutes. You know, put the date up on the calendar, talk about what day it is, etc. I doubt she'll understand, but she seems to be interested in what day it is. I also plan on getting her some "big girl" underwear (non training pants) in Oct. or Nov. when she's (hopefully) fully (day) potty learned.
ETA: Just a bunch of little "special" things for us to do together or to make her feel important. I also got doll when my sister was born and I liked it, but Maev already has three(!), and I don't really want another one!


----------



## witchygrrl

Ok, quick update: Dh and I both have jobs, me in the mornings teaching ESL to adults, him in the afternoon teaching K-1st grade (not his usual population, but it'll work for now). They schedule PERFECTLY!

The bad part--we need to be out of our apartment by Monday, and have no place yet to move to. A potential landlord really screwed us and left us high and dry. Ugh. Hopefully, DH can find something and we can take it Sunday instead of Tuesday (which is one possibility).

Oh, and Rhea didn't nurse the whole night last night. That was a first.


----------



## cking

Witchy, congrats on both your jobs!














'm so glad the schedule works out! I hope you find an apt soon...are there any temporary options available? Ugh, how stressful!


----------



## Maela

*Witchy*, that is SO great about the jobs! Is he teaching art to the k-1st or is he the main teacher? that is a big difference from before. My uncle (in-law) went from teaching 6th for many many years to K. He said it was really hard but a fun change.







: Hope you find a place soon!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Ok, quick update: Dh and I both have jobs, me in the mornings teaching ESL to adults, him in the afternoon teaching K-1st grade (not his usual population, but it'll work for now). They schedule PERFECTLY!

Witchy, congrats on the jobs!!!!!!!! This is wonderful news, and it sounds like it will suit you both to split staying at home and working outside!!!! This is such great news...It sounds like you're feeling ambivalent about Rhea not nursing last night









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 







I was talking about Maev. But I often have accidents myself these days.

















So I have the bladder of a 2-year-old!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I got J to help me make cornbread batter tonight, for a tamale pie. What a mess! But lots of fun. She loved it, didn't want me to clean up her hands.

How is it going with Josephine helping in the kitchen? I'm looking forward to getting back to that. We've had some major changes happen in our house in the last 2 days, I wrote more about it here. The update is post #7. I'm trying not to get my hopes up, but even so I'm seeing signs that things are getting much better.

I had a moment of inspiration this week and took Fenton to a pet store to look around. He LOVED it, I wish I had thought of it sooner. He's a fan of reptiles, the birds not so much







. Did you know you can buy a $2500 bird?









I had such a wonderful appointment with my midwife last night. I have apparently hit my "cramming" mode, because I'm suddenly full of questions. I also asked her about the wild libido swing, and I was surprised to hear it's really common. She agreed that pursuing the testosterone theory is the obvious one, but didn't know much about natural ways to boost testosterone. And I'm convinced a clue also lies with symptoms of weak adrenals: low blood pressure, etc.

Continued my tradition of abandoning a knitting project while pregnant. Abandoned the babylegs project, but am still committed to the Christmas stocking project. I'm starting to switch into nesting high gear - I defrosted the freezer on Wednesday in preparation for stocking it.

Gotta go, rented The Reader - I loves me some Kate Winslet.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Funny story:

Fenton is in love with the music video for REMs "Stand" - has people jumping around, dancing. Plus there's a globe in it, which makes it extra-special. We have this video as part of a documentary, and there is not a chapter break on it. So when he wants to watch it, we have to fast-forward through about 22 minutes of a documentary. And when he wants to watch it again, if you haven't caught it just in time before the documentary ends....you get the idea.

DH found a button on our DVD remote that allows you to bracket a section of a video and it will loop, so we sometimes do that for a few times through. I thought it was brilliant and said "It's a toddler button!







". DH looked at me sheepishly and said "I"m pretty sure it's not a toddler button". He looked so serious that I must have looked at him quizically because he just stared at me for a long time and then said with pity "I'm pretty sure it's a _porn_ button."







:

And for the umpteenth time in my marriage, I told him how men seem to spoil everything.


----------



## witchygrrl

SHanna: HILARIOUS!

So Rhea did nurse a few times last night. I think she is pretty restless, as we all are. But yeah, I was a little sad because that will happen more and more.

Maela, DH's going to be a team teacher with the afterschool program, and I'm hoping he''ll mostly be able to focus on art and nature stuff. It is MUCH different than what he's been doing, but I think he'll enjoy it. And I thought of you as our new place is down the street from the restaurant I met you at before Rhea was born









That's the best part--we finally have an apartment. They won't offiicially rent it until I see it, but the pictures and description are exactly what we were looking for.







DH was thrilled when he saw it, and it's walking distance to the train and downtown. Very important!

Thanks for all the well wishes! We've needed it.


----------



## Maela

*Witchy*, that's so great about the apartment. What a good location! I liked the restaurant too.









*Shanna*, I hope the food issues continue to improve or at least stay where they are and not get worse. I don't think I'd ever have the discipline that you seem to have.

Maev often gets a rash around her mouth after eating. At first I was trying to figure out what it was, but it seems that every food triggers it. And it doesn't seem to bother her. I'm assuming she just has sensitive skin on her face??

That is very funny about the 'porn button.'









I am also in super-nesting mode. I was totally into nesting a month ago, and then it went away for a couple of weeks. Now it's come back - I'm loving it. The only thing is that I'm not really interested in doing the day to day housework.







I just want to work on a bunch of little projects to make our house look nicer or work more efficiently for us. Oh, and I am cooking like crazy! I think because I know how hard it's going to be to enjoy cooking in a month; so I'm really having fun with it right now. What I would really like to accomplish before baby comes is Christmas shopping. We don't buy for a lot of people, but it's always something I procrastinate on; I can't imagine being able to do it with a baby and toddler in tow.

I'm working on making christmas stockings for the four of us too. Just sewing, not knitting. Hopefully, I can at least get the kids' finished before christmas. I have to go to my mom's to use her sewing machine (mine is broken) and I'm not very good at it, so it'll take a while.


----------



## arelyn

Witchy: Congrats on the perfect jobs!! That's just awsome!

BTW can you pm me a good webpage about Wicca. The stuff kids believe about it here is just ridiculous and I want some info so I can try to dispell the ignorance when the topic inevitably comes up around Halloween.


----------



## witchygrrl

Saw the apartment and love it!!! Also got movers last minute. Miracles happen people! I'm not going to be online for a few days, but I'll update everyone when I get back.

Arelyn, I'll PM right now. That's such a great thing because the ignorance just abounds about Wicca, paganism, etc. Thank you for doing that!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Exhausted from my intense nesting that kicked in last week. DH was grumpy with me last night because I required his help lifting







. He says to me "Do you know how unreasonable and insane this is?







:". As if I didn't know. So I agreed, of course it's unreasonable and insane. Now submit to my insanity.

More to say, good things happening here. Be back later.


----------



## accountclosed3

witchy: hooray for the perfect schedule! i do hope you find perfect housing too!

what's up around here? hawk had an awesome birthday, and our household is really doing well overall.

i'm cooking again, which makes me *extremely* happy and it looks like i m ay be working more soon too.

we found out that one of our pinch-hitting sitters just got a job at the gym where i used to work. this gym is also looking for more yoga teachers, and may reinstate me with a raise (sinc ei trained the other two yoga teachers, and they're being paid $25 which is a lot in our industry for a gym teacher, and so might get $45 or $50 per plus free child care with a sitter whom hawk knows and loves!).

so, i'm thinking of adding two or three morning classes per week there, and then continuing with my normal weekend schedule. it's currently friday night, saturday morning, sunday night--and i'm getting good numbers again finally after a thin summer--and i have my private clients on tuesday. so, i'm thinking monday, wednesday, and either thursday or friday mornings.

hawk's birthday went great. ryan put a picture up on his blog. just one, but it's cute. he got the few gifts that we wanted--tops from the ILs, blocks from my parents, stacking toy from sister, the xylophone (wooden) in the picture from SIL, and a drum from 10,000 villages from us and my aunt edna.

it went very well and we had a great time. hawk had such a blast that he fell asleepw ithout nursing around 8, slept until 1 am, then nursed a bit and fell back to sleep until 7. then, he woke and napped from 9:30-11:30 and keeps taking cat naps between nursing, eating watermelon, and playing with his new toys.

i got rid of all of the old things that he played with except some of the dishes, and so now he just has his instruments, fun wooden toys, and stuffed toys from when he was born. he has two stuffed rabbits, and one he carries around the house in a grocery bag. LOL


----------



## cking

Happy Birthday to Hawk!







:

I'll be back.


----------



## Maela

*ZB*, that's great that Hawk had such a fun birthday!! I can't remember if I've said happy birthday or not yet so : Happy Birthday Hawk!!!







: I can't believe he's already a year old!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Happy Birthday Hawk!!!!!!!







:


----------



## accountclosed3

he's still tuckered out from the weekend. he had a lot of excitement. first, my parents came to babysit him on friday--ryan and i had dinenr together, and then we went to yoga (i taught). hawk had so much fun. then on saturday, he haung out with ryan's family while i taught, and then ryan's sister came out with us to his favorite park and they played together. (sheepish--i seriously considered a quickie in the car, but it being a crowded pllace and mid-day. . .well anyway. dtd is nice and i haven't had enough these past two weekends because of our company!).

hawk stayed up lateon saturday too "helping" with the cupcakes. then sunday was his birthday, and after the party i took left over cupcakes to my yoga class where the prenatal clas before us had some, in addition to my class after.

during my class, he splashed in the bird bath (it's low to the ground) and had a great time, and then, quite literally, fell asleep next to it.

slept deeply all night, had two long naps yesterday, slept well last night, and now he's back on his normal schedule. but man, he had a whirlwind weekend. LOL


----------



## PiePie

I am "supposed" to wait for 3 "regular" cycles after the D&C to try to get pregnant again. Not sure what "regular" would mean as I have had only 1 cycle since November 2006 (pregnant with DD, then lactational amenorrhea), then 1 cycle, then pregnant again). But anyway I am GUESSING we will be trying again in December.

Honestly right now I feel to angry at DH for not being on the same page with me (with regard to grieving this loss -- I experienced it as a BABY and he didn't, not even sure he is sad about it, except for my sake) that the chances of an oops baby are zilch.

I have to say I am horrified that I am supposed to wait 3 mos. (or I guess 4 mos.). My MWs are adamant about it. I do have to admit if unrecuperated uterine lining would lead ot another m/c that would just put me over the edge, so we do want to avoid that, for real. And my MW insists that placenta previa is much more likely if you get pregnant right after a m/c, and I would really like to avoid a C-section. But I am really bummed about what the m/c plus the waiting means for child spacing.


----------



## Holiztic

PP--While I realize its NOT the same thing at all, I do remember when we were trying for DS and it didn't happen the first month, the day I got my period I remember looking at the calendar thinking about how we weren't even going to be together at ovulation the next month so it would be TWO months before possible conception. I remember at the time thinking I would die if I had to wait 2 whole months.

Take care of yourself, mama! The time will come before you know it!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am "supposed" to wait for 3 "regular" cycles after the D&C to try to get pregnant again. Not sure what "regular" would mean as I have had only 1 cycle since November 2006 (pregnant with DD, then lactational amenorrhea), then 1 cycle, then pregnant again). But anyway I am GUESSING we will be trying again in December.

Honestly right now I feel to angry at DH for not being on the same page with me (with regard to grieving this loss -- I experienced it as a BABY and he didn't, not even sure he is sad about it, except for my sake) that the chances of an oops baby are zilch.

I have to say I am horrified that I am supposed to wait 3 mos. (or I guess 4 mos.). My MWs are adamant about it. I do have to admit if unrecuperated uterine lining would lead ot another m/c that would just put me over the edge, so we do want to avoid that, for real. And my MW insists that placenta previa is much more likely if you get pregnant right after a m/c, and I would really like to avoid a C-section. But I am really bummed about what the m/c plus the waiting means for child spacing.

PiePie, I'm so sorry.







That really stinks.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am "supposed" to wait for 3 "regular" cycles after the D&C to try to get pregnant again. Not sure what "regular" would mean as I have had only 1 cycle since November 2006 (pregnant with DD, then lactational amenorrhea), then 1 cycle, then pregnant again). But anyway I am GUESSING we will be trying again in December.

Honestly right now I feel to angry at DH for not being on the same page with me (with regard to grieving this loss -- I experienced it as a BABY and he didn't, not even sure he is sad about it, except for my sake) that the chances of an oops baby are zilch.

I have to say I am horrified that I am supposed to wait 3 mos. (or I guess 4 mos.). My MWs are adamant about it. I do have to admit if unrecuperated uterine lining would lead ot another m/c that would just put me over the edge, so we do want to avoid that, for real. And my MW insists that placenta previa is much more likely if you get pregnant right after a m/c, and I would really like to avoid a C-section. But I am really bummed about what the m/c plus the waiting means for child spacing.

We got the same 3 month advice after both of our losses. Our midwife confessed that mostly it was so that you had a more accurate last menstrual period for dating the subsequent pregnancy, but I didn't have a D&C. It makes sense in that case that you want to allow your body to heal a greater loss of uterine lining, but its heartbreaking to wait so long. After our second loss and I was sure I had a health issue involved, it hurt me so much to wait even the 3 months that we did. I felt such despair.







. I remember it was really important to you to have a certain spacing between Lorelei and this LO. I think you'd be mourning even without having your heart set on that, but I wonder if that goal is making it even harder for you? It's already so hard...









I've heard of so many couples going through the difference in grief that you wrote about. Men that are otherwise caring, sensitive and wonderful fathers. I imagine it can make you feel really alone. It's so cliche, but I think it only begins to feel real to them with milestones that pull at them - feeling movement, even actually seeing the baby earthside. Women are blessed to feel a broader spectrum of life, but it's lonely there


----------



## ~Shanna~

Yesterday:

Fenton: (Screaming because he's displeased)
Me: Fenton, I can't understand you when you're screaming
Fenton: (More screaming)
Me: (Frustrated) Fenton, I'm not going to talk to you about this while you're screaming.
Fenton: (sweetly) Mama?
Me: Yes, Fenton?
Fenton: (Screams at me)

I about laughed beans out of my nose. DH couldn 't control himself and I had to kick him under the table.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Yesterday:

Fenton: (Screaming because he's displeased)
Me: Fenton, I can't understand you when you're screaming
Fenton: (More screaming)
Me: (Frustrated) Fenton, I'm not going to talk to you about this while you're screaming.
Fenton: (sweetly) Mama?
Me: Yes, Fenton?
Fenton: (Screams at me)

I about laughed beans out of my nose. DH couldn 't control himself and I had to kick him under the table.











I found Maev in the clothes dryer today.







I kind of scolded her, but then I said, "Stay there for a second, I want to take a picture." How's that for mixed messages? It's so hard not to laugh sometimes...

Ugh, I'm up at 12AM because I have the worst acid reflux right now!







:


----------



## witchygrrl

I have Internet finally! Now I feel like I can keep up with the world again. Though I should probably be spending my time writing up the syllabus....









Rhea's having a hard time adjusting to me being gone in the mornings. I've had to go in for orientation and such, so she was either with DH or my cousin. Tough on both of us, really.







But we'll figure it out.

I'm loving the new place!

A belated happy birthday to Hawk!

And a







to PiePie. That really does stink.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
I'm loving the new place!

That's great!!

Every night right at about this time, the baby gets hiccups.









Maev's new thing is to walk around the house with her stomach sticking out and grunting. Then she hands me something pretend and says, "The baby came out!" She's been watching lots of birth videos on youtube with me.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'm in the process of getting more work too.

i've added workshops to my schedule for the fall (2 hr workshops during which hawk normally naps--i have 5 of those). i'll nurse him and play with him in between class (9:30-11) and the workshop (11:30-1:30). he'll be with his dad, but likely be asleep, so it won't matter either way to him. he has no problem being away from me for a few hours now.

one of my student-teachers is working at the gym where i used to workk; she said that one of the child care providers is great. she's even more picky about child care than i am, such that they don't even have babysitters that they like. they only leave their children with one friend, who also has children of the same age. so, she is very picky. so, she likes this one woman.

the gym is looking for more teachers again, so i'm thinking of doing class 2-3 mornings a week so long as the right child care provider is there. i don't think hawk will have a problem with her, and i'll probably do the usual introduction--ask to meet her outside of work, take her to lunch with hawk and i, and let them play a bit outside while i read or whatever. and then he'll be happy to see her at the child care when the time comes.

also, since classes are just an hour and i know he can handle about 2 hrs with a sitter (actually, up to 3.5, but i only push it on date days), i might work out after my class for 30-45 minutes. i'll do the barest of routines, but that will feel good. and, ryan agrees that i can go to class once a week. i can also take the other yoga classes at the gym if i want, or take one a week while ryan cares for hawk.

i'm excited to get back to my old routines of working out. i really enjoy it. i'm getting tired of endless walking. LOL by myseld, well, with hawk sleeping.


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, that's way too funny. Such a cutie! I remember (as an older child) being fascinated with the pregnant form and constantly pretending that I was having a baby. Pillows under the shirt!

Zoe, sounds like you are reaching a nice equilibrium between Hawk and work. That's fabulous. I hope I can get there too. Thankfully, DH and I have a 4 day weekend ahead


----------



## Maela

Oh my gosh, what's happened in here?!


----------



## cking

:

busy weekends...hope you all are well.


----------



## ~Shanna~

My nephew started kindergarten today. I feel so sad


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
My nephew started kindergarten today. I feel so sad









Yeah, I feel that way about kindergarten, too!

Oh, wait, did you mean you miss him


----------



## PiePie

I am back at work after 2 weeks away and 1 week barely here (m/c). It is weird.

DD started in a new classroom at sch -- they move all the kids together on an academic year calendar rather than having them age out. DH did not find one of the new teachers very welcoming, is pissed that the class size is larger (which I expected -- don't love, but expected, it is typical for 2 yo classes to be larger). DD was thrilled to see her old friends and had no separation anxiety. I was freaking out about it because the first thing she said this morning was to ask about AJ, who was in her class last year but not this year. And she has been uncharacteristically clingy since the m/c (perhaps because I have been more self-absorbed and less focused on her?








)


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, busy weekend here.

i'm having trouble dealing with the passive-aggressive behaviors of the collective owner. there's a lot of inequality in the business that i overlook (eg, everyone else's web site is linked from their bio, except mine), but what is worse has been the passive aggressive stuff and i'm not sure how to respond to these.

opinions would be helpful.

basically, the owner lives at the studio. upstairs, she has a room that is her bed/living room and an office loft. she also uses this room as a massage room. up stairs from that (3rd floor) are her children's bedrooms (off limits).

now, for the past two years (how long the studio has been open), the office loft area is considered an "open area" where people can wait for class, wait for their massage, etc. when we provide child care or when we bring our children to the studio with a sitter, we are allowed to use her room as the play space if it is raining, cold, or dark, so long as the massage room is not in use. If the massage room is in use, then we are asked to use the entrance/massage room.

now, ever since hawk was born, we've been allowed to use this room when i teach--thursday mornings, friday evenings, satruday mornings, and now sunday evenings (i let go of thursday am because i didn't have a sitter anymore). typically, ryan takes the baby out on the town until it gets dark at which point he takes im upstairs to this room. if it's raining, the go directly up there. hawk's favorite activity is to watch trucks drive by, which you can only do from the windows of that room.

sunday night, i go to teach class. ryan and hawk are outside until the sun goes down, and then they come inside and go up to this room. we knew that both the owner and her son would not be in the room, and that there wasn't a massage, so we assumed--as we have for the last year--that we were allowed to use it. it has been this way the whole year.

i didn't get the text until this morning (on account of forgetting where my phone was and hawk hid it in my shoe again), and it was ssent at 11 pm on sunday night: "sorry if i woke you, but were you in my room tonight?"

i got that message at 7 am this morning. i checked when she sent it (thinking perhaps she sent it yesterday and there was a problem), and discovered she meant sunday. i write back "yes, r and h were there sunday night during class."

she then writes back "yeah, jen. i had the door closed. i expect that you would respect my privacy."

i'm not sure how i was supposed to divine that after a year. i asked ryan, was the door closed (i never went upstairs). he said the door was ajar, but also that it's never been a problem--door opened or closed--in the past. she has never mad emention of it, and ryan left the room exactly as he found it, which he said was basically that the bed was unmade.

i'm not sure how to respond to it.

i don't know how i was supposed to know we weren't allowed to use the room, when we have always been allowed to use the room. there has never been a statement that "if the door is closed, you cannot use the room" only that if there is a massage going on, then you cannot use the room.

likewise, ryan said that the door wasn't closed, it was ajar, and he knew no one was home, and there was no masssage, so he assumed it was--as usual--ok to use the room.

i have had recent other situations with her that were similar. for example: this summer, she started wanting the door to be locked. the prior policy is that you leave the door unlocked *unless* she was out of town. she would email us when she was going out of town.

one saturday a few weeks ago, she was in town. she was upstairs in her room doing whatever. i didn't disrupt her, i just left the door unlocked which is what we have done for the last two years--if she is there, then you leave the door unlocked. and to be truthful, the prior activity was to leave it unlocked if she was in town but not at home. i don't know why, it's just what we did (even though we would prefer to lock it).

so, that saturday, i leave the door unlocked and go about my day. about an hour later, i get a nasty text "why didn't you lock the door?" and i answered "because you were home, am i supposed to lock the door every time now?" and she said "yes, that's a good policy, that way we can have some privacy!"

ok, no prior notice, just a p-a text about it after the fact. soi wrote back "ok, no problem." and now, i lock the door every time i leave.

another instance was that part of our studio is a kitchen. you come in the back door (which is a mud-room turned into a massage room and the bathroom is back there) walk into the kitchen where you sign in, and then the class is in the living room/dining room space.

over the last two years, i've cooked in this kitchen, brough food, carbonated water, fresh fruit, you name it. i bring it for the collective, for the students. after hawk's birthday, i brought the left over cupcakes for everyone to have. (i had 18 left over cupcakes). so, sunday night's classes (prenatal, mine) and friday morning's classes. also, she and her son could have them, etc. i also left the extra soda (limaide, two bottles), and the paper goods sinc e we have parties there. i put the papergoods where we keep them.

i put out 1/2 the cupcakes on a tray for the sunday classes and put the rest in the fridge. i left the limeaide out where we usually put the beverages for after class. i washed some glasses and put them out where the lime aide was.

this is all normal. i've been doing this sort of thing for two years, and in fact i do it more than any other person in the collective because i enjoy "pitching in."

later that week, i happened to buy the wrong bread. i take it over to the collective and put it in the breadbox where i would normally do such a thing. i left a note saying "ryan didn't want this bread; i thought you could use it."

i then get a nasty text "i'm on a diet; why did you leave the bread? and why do you keep bringing junk food over?"

first, i didn't know she was on a diet. she hadn't mentioned it at all. and, i figured that since we have a lot of other things there for the clients (both healthy and junk foods) that it wouldn't be an issue. she said "we run a healthy collective here; it's time you started recognizing that!"

and i'm like, wait, just two weeks ago we had the "pizza and beer" night, and we had smores earlier in the summer, and we just planned our anniversary celebration (in october) which includes pizza and beer night, a wine-tasting party, the smores with the fire pit, and a number of other "goodies" throughout the week. and, honestly, of everyone in the collective, i'm least likely to eat junk food!

so, i wrote back "no problem, i'll come by and get the bread, etc." and make a special trip and pick up the stuff. she wasn't home at the time, so i let myself in and then locked up when i left.

For the most part, i've just let stuff go. i mean, she wants what she wants and that's fine. i don't like the p-a behavior, but i'd rather just get my stuff and let it go or say 'ok' and let it go.

but this one, for some reason, really upset me. ryan said that they left the room as they found it, and so on. the door was ajar, but whether or not it was or wasn't isn't the issue.

i think my issue is that there was no expectation of privacy that i knew of. of course, we try to respect her privacy in her own home. for example, there are no classes there on monday nights and no massages there after 2. even though she teaches a class off site on monday nights, and i know she isn't there, i wouldn't dream of using the space or going into her home.

whenever i am there, i clean up after myself and hawk. i don't even leave a dirty diaper (when that happens), and i always clean the bathroom and kitchen before leaving (even though there's no policy for that). i sweep the floors after my class, i never use her computer unless i ask and it's for a specific reason/moment. i pay my rent on time or early, i sub when i can, i pay for my part of the marketing (even though she doesn't ask for that), and of course, i bring food and stuff to the studio for parties and treats. i attend all of the staff meetings, and i have helped to interview all but one of the teachers who are there. i am involved and interested and proactive.

we have never had a policy manual of any kind, and i've mentioned at each staff meeting that we should have one. i have a lot of questions and i take these to each meeting. according to my files, i have questions such as "how do we answer the phone or do we answer the phone?" and "should we participate in the farmers market/first friday on a specific rotation? and can i schedule that up front?" as well as "are we going to split the care of the facility and garden among us?" and "can we have regular staff meetings? eg, 3rd monday of th emonth?" and i even have "what is the expectation of privacy and the balance of your privacy needs with the use of the studio space?"

every time i've brought up these questions or brought up writing a policy manual, it's been brushed off as "do whatever" and 'we don't need a manual." well, this summer, she's been in party mode, and by that i mean, not present at the business and partying. i have no problem with someone gong on vacation and all of that, but this summer has been tough for the business because we've been without a head present.

the garden went to shambles--i would weed and rake and pick up trash that might blow in, but i didn't feel comfortable getting into her tools and mowing the lawn, and i couldn't do it with hawk there anyway. i also didn't have any fire nights or anything extra ordinary because she wouldn't answer those emails or approve of my ideas or market them when she did say i could do those things.

also, i would notice things like dishes stacking up and so i would do those, the bathrooms needed to be cleaned more often and i would do that, and i would sweep the floors every other day (thursday, and saturday when i was there) because they needed it.

but i felt really frustrated that it seemed like no one was around, that the studio didn't have the 'life' that it had last summer, and that i was getting p-a texts after my time there.

i ask another teacher who works there whether or not she got similar messages, and she didn't, so i don't know what the deal is.

well, anyway, i know that i need to address it--at least in regards to this privacy thing. i got the text and i was like "how do i respond to this?" do i say "ok, no problem, thanks for the heads up" or do i go 'well, i didn't realize you had an expectation of privacy since we've been allowed to use the room all year regardless of the status of the door. but in the future, i'll follow this missive?"

i'm just tired of it.

anyway, on the flip side, at our last staff meeting, i mentioned a policy manual. it got brushed off again, but then another teacher forwarded to her the policy manual for a studio where she works. that studio was recently purchased by another studio, and it has very clearly defined policies for all kinds of things such as teacher rights and responsibilities (right to take as many classes as you want for free, but absolutely must take 1 class every 12 weeks and participate in 1 workshop for free each year; answer the phone if the desk person isn't available to answer it; etc). it has scripts for answering the phone, FAQ, etc.

all of the stuff that i've written up for the studio in NZ, btw. it's a great manual. i even took some ideas from it.

well, she sent around a draft based on that manual saying "i think this will help us form a better collective and move forward as a more cohesive group." yes, thank goodness, i like that. and we have another staff meeting in two weeks (third monday of the month, which she's now going to do every month--i don't need credit, or anything, i'm just glad it's happening), and she wants our "notes" on it.

i need to write an email to her today that includes other stuff--our schedule of live musicians and their bios and links, the revised class descriptions for the web site, the inclusion of my link on my bio, the description and marketing for my thyroid and woman-of-power workshops, my "article" for the next newsletter, and so on.

i have notes o the policy manual that i could send her in an attachment, which includes notes on her priavcy needs, and i could include in that her expectation as per her text. . .

or, i could also confront her about the p-a issue directly using this as an example, or what.

i really don't know what to do.

i know i only have a few months left, but i would prefer not to get these texts once a month. i also get emails to this effect every month or two. it's only been going on since may, really, so, i don't know.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
Oh, wait, did you mean you miss him









I just can't believe how the time has flown.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am back at work after 2 weeks away and 1 week barely here (m/c). It is weird.

DD started in a new classroom at sch -- they move all the kids together on an academic year calendar rather than having them age out. DH did not find one of the new teachers very welcoming, is pissed that the class size is larger (which I expected -- don't love, but expected, it is typical for 2 yo classes to be larger). DD was thrilled to see her old friends and had no separation anxiety. I was freaking out about it because the first thing she said this morning was to ask about AJ, who was in her class last year but not this year. And she has been uncharacteristically clingy since the m/c (perhaps because I have been more self-absorbed and less focused on her?







)

Welcome back







How are things going, health-wise and emotionally?









Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i'm having trouble dealing with the passive-aggressive behaviors of the collective owner.

I'm wondering if you'll have the best luck if you approach her in a "I think we're having some misunderstandings", that will force her to delineate her boundaries, which seem to be ever-changing. If you only respond to each with a "Thanks for the heads up" on each nasty email, there's no pressure on her to form a proactive policy. She's reminding me of a particular parent I know who seems to develop "policies" based on what kind of day she's having.

I'm sorry if this is causing you child-care issues besides all the other stuff. Kind of a pain for Ryan to not have a comfy place to take Hawk when it gets dark







.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am back at work after 2 weeks away and 1 week barely here (m/c). It is weird.

DD started in a new classroom at sch -- they move all the kids together on an academic year calendar rather than having them age out. DH did not find one of the new teachers very welcoming, is pissed that the class size is larger (which I expected -- don't love, but expected, it is typical for 2 yo classes to be larger). DD was thrilled to see her old friends and had no separation anxiety. I was freaking out about it because the first thing she said this morning was to ask about AJ, who was in her class last year but not this year. And she has been uncharacteristically clingy since the m/c (perhaps because I have been more self-absorbed and less focused on her?







)

What kind of school is she going to? I have never heard of "classes" "classroom" "academic calendar" "class size" and "teachers" used in refernce to the daycare set (1 and 2 year olds). Is it like a prep school daycare or something? I'm really curious! I am picturing toddlers in uniforms!!


----------



## accountclosed3

when i have approached her like that in the past, she essentially assert sthat as the new policy, but in a way that states that it should have been obvious to me. so, the long and short of it is that i end up having to go "ok, good to know." or whatever. so, i got into that.

i've been pushing for her to be proactive, and even asked specific questions, and i get non-answers. "we don't need one" and "i don't think that's necessary" and so on.

i'm glad we're going to work on a manual, but things in the draft are very vague. it says things like "be sure to know how to sign everyone in." ok, well, i know how to do that, but there are two ways. 1. the current method is honor system. there's a box and a person puts the $ in and takes out the change. there's a hole punch to punch the class cards. we allow students to do this themselves. or 2. we would take the mone and count the change and punch the cards for them.

there have been some pretty big accounting issues over the summer, and she brought a lot of these up to us. i've recommended different ways of doing it, handling the money, but she just wants us to "be more aware." but i don't know what that *means* practically speaking. some days, i go in and there's over $100 in the box. other days, there are just a few meager coins. i'm supposed to take my pay from the box at the end of each class, and on the day when there is $100 in there, that's easy. when there is only change and everyone is on a punch card, i can't. so i wait for her to cut a check. it's a mess.

but, i can't get her to commit to anything.

and the last staff meeting, she complained about the debt the business is in, how there's no money for marketing, etc. i asked if she had a business plan, a marketing strateg, a cash-flow analysis, and a budget. she doesn't have any of these things. i told her i'd be happy to help her develop it and then we could--as a collective--understand and divide up costs or increase rent or whatever needs to be done.

another teacher agrees, it's the only way we know that we're moving forward profitably. but, she's brushed both of us off in that regard too. so, i don't think i'm going to get anywhere.

i guess the real answer is to just pretend that it doesn't exist as i have been all summer. she is p-a and i just let it go.


----------



## witchygrrl

jeez, and I thought I could be passive-aggressive...









honestly, though, I believe that there are people in the world that are just on another planet, and real communication with them is next to impossible. hopefully your last few weeks, months are tolerable until you're off to NZ.

Rhea had a great day with DH. I think it was really important that she woke up before I left and could nurse first. But it was sad to leave her, though. Hopefully more days can be this good for the two of them.


----------



## Maela

Maev is sick.







She's stuffed, runny, coughing a little bit and has watery eyes. Bad timing. I'm worried about her being sick when the baby is born, but that probably won't happen; I'm only 36 1/2 weeks.

I'm not feeling ready for this birth or baby at all, emotionally. I've got almost everything ready, but I just don't _feel_ ready for this. And I feel like a bad mama for not exercising enough, eating well enough, and practicing my Hypnobabies enough.

*Steph*, are you still there? Was it you that used Hypnobabies? Did you practice it/listen to the scripts as often as recommended? And how much do you think it helped when you were birthing?

I'm just feeling so unsettled...









Complaining over. Sorry.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Maev is sick.







She's stuffed, runny, coughing a little bit and has watery eyes. Bad timing. I'm worried about her being sick when the baby is born, but that probably won't happen; I'm only 36 1/2 weeks.

I'm not feeling ready for this birth or baby at all, emotionally. I've got almost everything ready, but I just don't _feel_ ready for this. And I feel like a bad mama for not exercising enough, eating well enough, and practicing my Hypnobabies enough.

*Steph*, are you still there? Was it you that used Hypnobabies? Did you practice it/listen to the scripts as often as recommended? And how much do you think it helped when you were birthing?

I'm just feeling so unsettled...









Complaining over. Sorry.









Oh sweetie...







. My theory for why we feel so unsettled this time around is we know what's ahead soon and we know that preparation is fruitless.

I did Hypnobabies but not religiously, and not the formal program (just listened to the CD 30 minutes or so a day). I felt like it helped get me to calm down during labor, DH even said I said things during labor like "sink the boat" and other images from it. In case this helps: DH recently shared with me (cuz I sure don't remember it) that during contractions he would moan with me and he felt me obviously relax. Birthing From Within mentions the phenomenon too. Thought I'd share.

You're doing great and you're going to do great. Baby is being born into a human world where people don't eat perfectly or exercise enough. Or have floors clean enough (guess what I'm worried about?







). Maeve will feel better way before the little man shows up, and you might even be glad you "got it out of the way" - cause flu works that way sometimes.

Had a great dinner with my sister and Little Baby Gabriel (and his younger sisters too







). So nice to hear about his first day. But I spent much of the time correcting my sister on wacky socialist-takeover rumors she's heard about the Presidents speech. I"m exhausted, but can't seem to keep my $0.02 to myself. Little Baby Gabriel is going to one of those schools that chose not to show the Prez's speech. How can someone I love so much be so....


----------



## Maela

Shanna, thank you!!

I was so calm at the beginning of this pregnancy (so unlike my pg with dd), but now I'm freaking out (also unlike my pg with dd - I was completely calm by the end). I'm just second guessing my ability right now because of what happened last time. (mw thinks I have one really narrow part of my pelvis that made it hard to push dd out - great labor up until the almost 4 hours of pushing with no urge to push). So now I'm thinking, How will that not happen again? No matter how much I prepare myself, won't the same thing happen this time? I was talking with the back up mw about a year ago and she said to me, "You will _not_ have to push like that the next time." It made me feel so relieved to hear she believed that, but now I can't help thinking that that's wishful thinking. I really want to believe that if I'm calm enough and really believe that I can do it more easily this time, that that's what will happen. I just keep getting that nagging voice in my head telling me it's not true.
I've been afraid to say any of this out loud because I feel like that will make it more real, but maybe saying it will allow me to just let it go...

Thanks for listening.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
*Steph*, are you still there? Was it you that used Hypnobabies? Did you practice it/listen to the scripts as often as recommended? And how much do you think it helped when you were birthing?

I'm still here, when I get a free moment. I used Hypnobabies. I started really early and did it nearly as much as recommended right up until my due date. The last week or so before he was born, I slacked off a bit, and I was never able to keep on top of the finger drops. It helped immensely! I never want to attempt birth without it. But don't beat yourself up about not doing it as much as they tell you to. Any practice is helpful as long as you really let yourself get into it and do it whenever you are able to. I hope that makes sense. If it helps any, I was never able to keep up with exercising, eating well, and Hypnobabies. Always one, maybe two, but never all three.







I'm thinking of you!


----------



## accountclosed3

sorry maev is sick, and i can imagine that one would feel unsettled knowing more about what is coming this time.

honestly, i'm really hesitant to have another child because of what happened when i had this one. it was too much, and i don't want to go through it again.

it's good to hear that i'm not alone in thinking that my coworker/boss is p-a. i identified it in that way, but you wouldn't really think that knowing her. she's actually a really cool, fun person, but then this stuff comes out of left field.

in talking to ryan about it, he asserted that she both relies on and reviles me. i'm probably the one who gets this the most because i'm the one who has the real go-getter attitude about the whole thing with lots of ideas, plans, hopes, dreams, and practices that are discsernable that grow my business. she wants that stuff, but she wants to be the origin of it, and she wants to not do the work.

i jut got an email from her (in response to my notes on the procedures), in which she says "I"LL be writing up the procedures after i hear from everyone and we talk about it at the meeting. and THAT will be the standard."

so, because there were other things to respond to, i responded to those things and said "i just thought you'd want the notes ahead of time, for your consideration. it's just stuff off the top of my head." and it was. i didn't really take any time for it. just joted stuff into a word document. so, i get the first email of "give me your notes on this" and then i give the notes and i get "it' MY project and I'LL do it." ok, yeah, fine have your cake and eat it too. *eye roll*

ah well, at least it helped me out. i have a huge policy manual already about 1/2 written. mission statements, defining the collective and how it functions, the work/study program, and so on. i don't have operations sbecause we're not on site yet. but there's also a due process part--how to deal with complaints both internal and external--and so on.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
in talking to ryan about it, he asserted that she both relies on and reviles me. i'm probably the one who gets this the most because i'm the one who has the real go-getter attitude about the whole thing with lots of ideas, plans, hopes, dreams, and practices that are discsernable that grow my business. she wants that stuff, but she wants to be the origin of it, and she wants to not do the work.

I bet that's exactly what it is. I have had a couple of passive-aggressive bosses too. We got along pretty well, but they really annoyed me sometimes. I don't have much of a go-getter attitude (I wish I did), but I can see how that would make her feel more insecure around you.


----------



## Maela

I just saw Maev pulling down her underwear, and so I asked her what she was doing. She said, "I'm just getting..." and then an almond falls out onto the floor, "Oh, there it is!" Okay, let's not put any more almonds in our panties though.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I am back at work after 2 weeks away and 1 week barely here (m/c). It is weird.

DD started in a new classroom at sch -- they move all the kids together on an academic year calendar rather than having them age out. DH did not find one of the new teachers very welcoming, is pissed that the class size is larger (which I expected -- don't love, but expected, it is typical for 2 yo classes to be larger). DD was thrilled to see her old friends and had no separation anxiety. I was freaking out about it because the first thing she said this morning was to ask about AJ, who was in her class last year but not this year. And she has been uncharacteristically clingy since the m/c (perhaps because I have been more self-absorbed and less focused on her?







)

I'm so glad to hear that she settled in well. How much bigger could her class be? The max is 12 kids/3 teachers...not that much bigger than the infant class of 10 babies/3 teachers.

I hope you're starting to feel better too!

*Meala:* Too funny about the almond! And you shouldn't get too worried about the possibility of tough pushing. Most mamas I've talked to with lots of kids say each labor is different and the first is almost always the toughest (except one friend who describes her last labor as traumatizing and doesn't want to talk about it but always gives me this look like, "Yeah, you're not such a crazy homebirther afterall" I feel bad for her.







) But I'm rambling and Kai wants me. I'm sure you'll do great!


----------



## PiePie

last year we had 4 teachers in the morning and 3 in teh afternoon. 6 kids, but 3 left at 3, so from 3 till pickup it was 1 on 1. this year we have 3 teachers, 4 on mondays, for 8 kids. definitely not huge by national standards but it is different. in a lot of ways i think it is better for her but i can't explain now because i have to fly out the door to get her.







:


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
last year we had 4 teachers in the morning and 3 in teh afternoon. 6 kids, but 3 left at 3, so from 3 till pickup it was 1 on 1. this year we have 3 teachers, 4 on mondays, for 8 kids. definitely not huge by national standards but it is different. in a lot of ways i think it is better for her but i can't explain now because i have to fly out the door to get her.







:

Wow that is a great ratio!!

I never thought I'd say this (okay I say this every year in September), but I can't _wait_ for it to get







: (which is in the 40s for me over here in CA







)!!

I had my 36 week appointment with my mw yesterday, and I talked with her about some of my worries. She said that there's a good chance that the narrow part of my pelvis may not be so narrow anymore after giving birth. She also said that this time if I have a hard time pushing, we'll know sooner what to try (lying flat on my back







was our last resort and it worked), so she's sure it won't take as long as last time. I'm starting to feel a little better about it. Thanks for all the advice and hugs!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I mentioned to DH that I was looking for some fiction to read because I'm burned out on non-fiction. He gave me Remains of the Day, which I'm loving. But I was starting to realize, with his expectation of keeping his books in perfect condition, that this was not conducive to reading in small snippets with a toddler on the loose. So I just requested it from the library so I don't "ruin" (by his standards) his copy.

My point is that I'm grumpy that my husband still keeps so many of his expectations from before we had children. It galls me to no end that I'm requesting from the library what we have in our own house (that I have to store, clean around and just generally own) but it's sort of off-limits to me because I do the messy job of taking care of children all day.

How on god's green earth does he get to read and NOT worry about a child getting it dirty, wet, mess, etc.? I just know this comes down to how he gets to poop with the door closed here at home, and I don't.....Sorry for the rant.


----------



## PiePie

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...5#post14363785


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, I ended up pushing flat on my back too with Rhea. It felt comfortable as I needed constant pressure on the back of my hips during contractions anyway. It worked out, even though it's normally "ideal".

Shanna,







. I hear you on that because I feel like DH thinks we can do the same level of weekend activities that we did pre-baby, and it's just not the case. He only seems to remember that when Rhea is falling apart. Yes, I'd like to have a fun lifestyle with the whole family, but Rhea has more limits than we do.


----------



## accountclosed3

right, and i'm often still learning those and my limits as well. last night was a case-in-point.

i find that hawk can handle a lot of things with no real problem, but that often it's a lot of extra work for me. so, i end up exhausted.

what also happens is that ryan gets angry. for example, i left the baby's bag with diaper supplies in the room. i had settled us in the front row (since the activity of puja's and the like tend to keep hawk interested/occupied), and so i couldn't just go in there with the baby and grab the bag when i needed it. i was pretty successful at pottying him yesterday, but at one point he was playing and went in his diaper. so, i needed a new one.

i walked to the door and got his attention. i pointed at the baby's bottom, and he came out. he was really angry, and took the baby to change him. i told him i would do it, but he said "what difference does it make now? i'm already missing out!"

now, there's no acknowledgement of the fact that i'd been "missing out" from the beginning and that there was still an hour to go! that i was walking in circles around a library for goodness sake!

if we have to pause a movie to potty him, or if he gets clingy and wants ryan to play with him so he can't read his book or whatever, then he gets angry. it's not with hawk or with me, b ut at the fact that he "can't do what he wants."

well, i'm sorry, but i did think that was part of being a parent. that sometimes what you want gets set aside for what other's need. and that one can do that without being angry or pissy about it.

he has been better about this over the last few weeks, but it was something else. and, i do try to allow ryan to do the things he wants to do without interruption and so long as it doesn't negatively affect me.

and i didn't figure that hawk would need so much movement between 6-9 pm yesterday that we couldn't be in there. he's usually mellowing out by 7:30, and asleep between 8 and 9 anyway, so i had figured that he would be a bit mobile for the first bit (the talk), but that i'd be able to do the meditation and healing part at least. unfortunately, i wasn't able to, and i didn't have any other option than to over extend myself. when i asked ryan if we could go (when he came out to potty hawk), he said he wanted to stay.

that was tough too. it was exhausting. so, i'm also learning my limits.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*,







are things improving? Be easy on yourself.


----------



## PiePie

i've had 4 really good days in terms of m/c sadness. however i had my follow up visit with my mw and that was depressing. dd kept saying "fun fun" during my pelvic exam and i was like, um, not. nothing wrong physically but the reminder to wait for 3 cycles is a bummer. thanks for asking. i suspect, as zoebird said, i was on a massive hormonal swing for the past month and am just now coming out of it. also communications with dh about it are better. dd is less needy except when she doesn't get a nap, when i would say she is prone to meltdowns (severe for her, not by other kids' standards, but for her, and hence for me, it's a bad ending to a good day). i have thrush (in my nipples) but have a script called in for a specially formulated cream -- now if i could find time to leave work and so i could pick it up, that would be great. i had a friend coming this weekend -- she had originally scheduled this visit to help me with m/s -- but she has the flu so she is staying the heck away. dh is going out of town next week so that will be rough. dd is adjusting beautifully to her new teachers and i love them, want to write more about this, but later. did yall see that alfie kohn's op ed was the most emailed in yesterday's nytimes?


----------



## PiePie

hi everyone. today was a really rough day for me. plus i got af (my first since af). sigh. i will recover though. tomorrow is the little red lighthouse festival (we live near the site of the famous children's book) and sunday i am planning to take dd to the arboreteum. i was also brave and reached out to some pre-kids non-mama friends for help with the m/c, got delayed responses, 1 a little puzzling, not sure what to make of it (putting everything off for a phone call, as if i have time to talk on the phone -- i swear my childless friends are on another planet). looking forward to vacation in puerto rico -- anyone have any suggestions??


----------



## Maela

oooooh, a vacation in Puerto Rico? I'm jealous. I hope you have lots of fun.







I'm sorry I don't really have any advice for you re your rough day yesterday. I hope you had more fun today at the festival.

Maev said "damn" the other day. We don't cuss much, but I guess she's heard it enough to know how to use it. She dropped a grape on the floor and said, "Damn, I dropped my grape" very clearly and with a completely straight face.









One more funny story: She was at the ice cream shop with Dh. He took her to use the restroom and the toilet had some of that bright blue cleaner in it. Maev said, "Look at that blue peepee. He must have blue penis."









I get so much joy out of hearing her talk.


----------



## Sihaya




----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 

























Oh wow! Exciting, but not quite the plan, right? How are you feeling about it?


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Oh wow! Exciting, but not quite the plan, right?

Right, we were planning on waiting another 8-9 months. I wanted C weaned, done with his molars, and closer to pottying independently. But, as a friend pointed out, I still have 9 months to do those things









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
How are you feeling about it?

Very ambivalent. I was







when I saw the test, but it's probably going to take a while to "try on" the idea and let all of the







dissipate. Especially since the "oops" was 100% on me this time.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Is there ever really a 'right' time? I'm not convinced. And you do have 9 whole months to get what you gotta do, done.

I'm gonna go with a YAY and a congratulations! Some oops' really are a very cool thing.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 



































I'm going to go with a Congratulations too.
















It'll be ok.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Especially since the "oops" was 100% on me this time.

This, you have to forget about. I think about this sometimes, but it can be really hard on you and your relationship with dh to see it as anyone's fault. It might take him a while to come around, maybe 9 months, but he will. And in the grand scheme of things, 8 or 9 months isn't that long. After a while I realized I totally couldn't call this an unplanned pregnancy, since we had totally planned to ttc again, we just weren't sure when. yk?


----------



## cking

Piepie, Puerto Rico sounds awesome. Hope you have a great time!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Maev said "damn" the other day. We don't cuss much, but I guess she's heard it enough to know how to use it. She dropped a grape on the floor and said, "Damn, I dropped my grape" very clearly and with a completely straight face.









One more funny story: She was at the ice cream shop with Dh. He took her to use the restroom and the toilet had some of that bright blue cleaner in it. Maev said, "Look at that blue peepee. He must have blue penis."









I get so much joy out of hearing her talk.









so cute. I was thinking J said damn it a few times, but the way she says pajamas sounds kindof like it. It does seem to be my swear word of choice these days - maybe i feel like it's less harsh?

Maela, have you decided on a gift for Maev yet? What about an accessory for her dolls, like a pouch sling? Something that she can use to care for them the way she sees you caring for Jaim? I'd like to make one for J -- she spent all yesterday trying to put her baby on her back with my mei tai and ring sling.


----------



## Sihaya

Thanks so much, Christina!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
This, you have to forget about. I think about this sometimes, but it can be really hard on you and your relationship with dh to see it as anyone's fault. It might take him a while to come around, maybe 9 months, but he will. And in the grand scheme of things, 8 or 9 months isn't that long.

DH has already joked that C was his fault and this one is my fault. But he's not upset, in fact, he's elated. He's the one who doesn't care when we get pg again. He's fine trying at 3mo pp if I want and he's fine waiting 5 years between kids if I want. *I'm* the one who was really hell bent on the 3-4 year spacing. I don't eat enough, I've had thyroid and milk supply issues, and I get overwhelmed easily. I thought the spacing would help with some of those issues. Now I'm pissed at myself for trying to be "proactive" and get my cycle back in shape well before we started TTC. I took a supplement to move my O date, but didn't use protection accordingly, and now I'm knocked up and any difficulties that result from the closer spacing are all. my. fault. Sorry to vent a little, like I said, it may take a few weeks for me to be all joy and no rage.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
After a while I realized I totally couldn't call this an unplanned pregnancy, since we had totally planned to ttc again, we just weren't sure when. yk?

IKWYM exactly! We don't have unplanned pregnancies here, just early ones


----------



## cking

oh ok, I can understand that. For me, getting enough to eat during the first trimester while nursing was really hard. You are more than welcome to vent, that's what we're here for.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Congrats, Steph! That's so exciting! I'm a chart stalker... so you DTD on CD10 and O'd on CD 15?


----------



## Sihaya

Yep! FF wouldn't even give me _any_ pregnancy points because we didn't DTD within my "fertile window"







Ha! What does FF know? Anyway, I'm really hoping that means it's a girl. We already have our girl name picked out...


----------



## Maela

Yay Steph!!


----------



## witchygrrl

Congrats Steph!









Sorry haven't been on here much. Went to see Susun Weed talk today...twice!







She is amazing, and in two hours learned quite a bit. I would LOVE to be an apprentice of hers...maybe that's a goal I can work toward.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

oh my stars *Maela*...i vagued out for a few weeks...
look how close you are!!!!







how are you feeling?
*Shanna*, you can't be far behind?

We're going away this week - I've got some serious decisions to make re work and study and babies and self. I want it all. And I want none of it too! I'm 95% sure that I don't want to go back to my old job but now that we're 6 weeks away from my hypothetical return date, I'm wavering and I don't know why. It was almost a none issue because there's a 2 year waiting list on childcare centres around here but then my Mum changed her mind and my sister piped in too and they're happy to do childcare (for free!!!). I'm also thinking that studying midwifery next year is too much. I'm a big one at biting off more than I can chew and failing at it all. So maybe I'll just hang out at home with Sebby and start planning TTC #2. Maybe I'll do doula training? I don't know. These are the hardest decisions I've ever had to make. It all seems a little too grown-up for me!

When we're back, I'm serious about getting post baby fit. I need to get some tummy muscles back before I destroy them all again with another pregnancy!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Hey ladies,

This is kind of a shot in the dark... awhile back (maybe 2 years) one of the NMY posted a wedding picture and I absolutely LOVED her hair. I think it was a destination wedding somewhere tropical (Hawaii?).

I'm gathering pictures of wedding hairstyles I like (only 3 months till the big day!) and I remember that one. But I don't remember WHO it was. I don't think it was one of you regular posters...

If you could help me out by reminding me who it was, that would be super great. Hopefully one of you has a better memory than me!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
Hey ladies,

This is kind of a shot in the dark... awhile back (maybe 2 years) one of the NMY posted a wedding picture and I absolutely LOVED her hair. I think it was a destination wedding somewhere tropical (Hawaii?).

I'm gathering pictures of wedding hairstyles I like (only 3 months till the big day!) and I remember that one. But I don't remember WHO it was. I don't think it was one of you regular posters...

If you could help me out by reminding me who it was, that would be super great. Hopefully one of you has a better memory than me!

Hmmm....wasn't me. I hope you figure it out. When is your wedding?

I know, I'm so close!! aaahhh! No really, I'm actually getting excited. I want it to happen next week ideally, but I know that I really have no choice. Friday, for about a half hour in the evening I thought I might be in labor. I was having the tightening without having done anything physical like housework or exercise. and the slightest bit of back pain. But then it went away. I was surprised at how disappointed I was about it. After having been so freaked out just the week before. anyway, I know I'm only 38 weeks, but this week I'm going to try to walk a ton and eat lots of pineapple and drink lots of my RRL tea. We are almost completely ready (do still need to mop the floors and get my comforter washed), and I'm eager to meet this little guy.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 

























Congratulations Stephanie!!!!






























Sorry I'm MIA - Fenton has the puke crud going around








MMM - yes, I'm close. Too close







I'm 36 weeks today, and was supposed to have my Strep test today but I need to put it off to keep Fenton home and calm and healing hopefully. Getting nervous of how Ku is going to affect Fenton, and of all the things I did for Fenton that are impossible for Ku (quiet atmosphere, etc.).

My house is a pigsty, I'm letting it go to pot before I start big cleaning in a week or so. Was sure baby was coming yesterday with how obsessed I was with bizarre chores. Is it a bad idea to split wood while pregnant?


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Getting nervous of how Ku is going to affect Fenton, and of all the things I did for Fenton that are impossible for Ku (quiet atmosphere, etc.)

I'm having the same feelings.


----------



## accountclosed3

wow! another pregnant one!







congrats!

witchy--so cool that you were hanging/studying with susun weed. she's really something!









man, and some getting so close! and, worrying about things that i worry about even though i'm Not pregnant. thankfully. though i am back to fertile. text-book cycles these. and super-erotic dreams. i mean, crazy-so. and wow, sex is way better with fertility. LOL

what else? oh yeah--we mail our NZ paperwork tomorrow. We get birth certs next (mine and ryan's from the state) which we will forward to NZIS, and then the police character thingies through the FBI (sent directly to NZIS), and our transcripts are on their way to NZIS right now.

and, i start working more this week. it's great. but, i'm super-duper busy and it freaks me out. i have three things tonight; three tomorrow morning; two one wednesday, nothing on thursday (how did that happen?), two on friday, one on saturday, and one on sunday.

so, there it is. busy busy. oh, and i hope that next weekend we do another big purge n pack, and then we'll bring in painters and a cleaning cvrew and my mom is going to help us stage everything. . .and then the house should go on the market in early oct at the latest.

oh, and my mom is mad at me because i'm doing a week's vacation with my great aunt when she comes to VA. my mom's vacation is two weeks earlier, and i told her to go ahead and move it, but she won't. not that she 'can't' because they'd just give her work to someone else that week, but that she won't because "well, they may not do it right and it's already scheduled and . . ." and so she's mad at me about it. silly.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
though i am back to fertile. text-book cycles these. and super-erotic dreams. i mean, crazy-so. and wow, sex is way better with fertility. LOL

It sure is!







I've been enjoying it since December. It is starting to go away now though. Same thing happened at about this time last pg.







Oh well, at least dh and I know this time that it'll come back.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Hmmm....wasn't me. I hope you figure it out. When is your wedding?

Wedding is 3 1/2 mos away. I'm so excited!







We've been engaged for about 10 1/2 months now (I think I posted when we got engaged). Wedding planning is going well. The guest list is BY FAR the most stressful part.

And I found the wedding pictures!
Post:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1&postcount=29

Pictures:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeniac/...7602814633571/

I'm hoping Binkin doesn't mind.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
It sure is!







I've been enjoying it since December. It is starting to go away now though. Same thing happened at about this time last pg.







Oh well, at least dh and I know this time that it'll come back.

I'm still as enthusiastic, but it's requiring more creativity than I remember last time. There's just no easy way to...manage it.

I don't remember this from last time: It's hard to breathe after I eat or drink. This is normal, right? I also don't have much of an appetite lately, don't remember that either....

I was on fire today - car seat check scheduled, oil change scheduled, bank book balanced, stocking the freezer, grocery list made, plans made for belly cast this weekend, packed bag for birth center, bills paid...I feel as though everything left to do is stuff that, ideally, would be done RIGHT before labor so that the house is freshly clean, the oil is newly changed, etc. Had to just jump in and realize it's not all going to be perfect and just get it done as best I can. Realizing that Fenton came either right on his edd or 2 days earlier than we expected (depending on if DH is right or I am about the edd. We disagree about Ku's too







). Puts things into perspective.


----------



## accountclosed3

preparing is fun. i remember it, though i wasn't entirely 'don'e with all of my stuff.

so, remember a while back when i talked about my passive-aggressive "boss" at our collective? well, i've been hit with three more email bombs in the past week, and so i've decided that it's confrontation time.
and i'm not entirely sure how to approach it.

foremost, i have no problem accepting various policy as they "come down" so long as it doesn't go against my conscience. of course, things like "arrive 15 minutes before class time" wouldn't anyway, and most policies are of this sort.

i feel that an email communicating "please be sure to arrive 15 minutes before your class start time" does not require a negative statement such as "it's just bad form not to be there when people are relying on you; it's affects your reputation in the studio, and ultimately, if you can't commit to this value, you will not be able to continue to work here!" followed by "i know i've been perfectly clear with you on this subject in the past."

i told her that the statements did not say anything about arrival times, and she said "it's obvious, implicit, intuitive." and well, guess what? it's not intuitive to me.

my plan is to express that i would like these sorts of messages delivered in person, that the current method is creating confusion and distrust (as well as a frustration with the workplace), and finally, that i will not be shamed or treated unfairly.

i really asked for the meeting to talk about NZ, marketing, and class scheduling, but now i have to add in this. i wonder if i should lead with it or end with it? i think we should leave the meeting on a "high" note, so probably not the last thing that should be stated.

i think i'll do it first.


----------



## accountclosed3

oh, and for the record, the last three emails were not about arrival times. LOL it was about other stuff that are as small and yet important as locking the door or arriving on time.


----------



## cking

My SIL had her baby yesterday morning. His name is Augustine. She was 38 weeks - due right around the same time as Maela.

Maela and Shanna, what are your plans for Maev and Fenton during the birth?







: So far from a decision on that, but I'm thinking 22 months might be too young to be present.

I'm so excited for both of you.







I'm starting to get newborn fever, seeing lots of pics of other people's babies. We might get to visit our new nephew in the hospital on Thurs.









I think J might be starting to wean. For the past week or two she is down to 3x/day. I'd be fine if she stuck with that for a while. But Sun and Mon she napped in the car and stroller, resp., so she only nursed twice those days. She gets so busy that she doesn't seem interested&#8230;but she also gets cranky if she hasn't nursed in a while.


----------



## Maela

We're planning on having Maev here with us. My sister will be here to take care of her and keep her out of the way. I think that I'll probably not want her in the room until the very end, not sure though. As long as everything is going well, I really want her to see her little brother being born. She's watched many many youtube videos of gentle homebirths. She's talking a lot about how the baby comes out of my "gina."


----------



## ~Shanna~

We are planning on calling DHs parents (who Fenton feels really comfortable with) to come be with him from when we leave for the birth center to whenever we call them to have them bring him to the BC to meet Ku. (if last time is any indication, he'll be with them for about 12-15 hours total). Before Fenton was weaned, I was really toying with the idea of having him there because I was so anxious about him being away from us when he was still nursing. Now I'm feeling really confident that he thinks it's always a party when Grandma and Papa are over, I think he'll do fine. The bottom line (can I admit this here?) is that I really don't want him there. I think he's of a temperment that wouldn't be really excited to be there, and would probably be really distracting for me whilst in labor. I imagine him trying to climb on my back during contractions, and bring his trucks in the bath







. I've even hoped that I can hold off on calling my ILs to bring Fenton until after DH, Ku and I have had a chance to rest, nap and eat a meal because I know it's going to be the only time that we can get such supported rest and be able to give Ku just a small part of that undivided attention that Fenton got. But, I'm prepared to feel emotional and want all my baby chicks with me at such a sensitive time, so I've just asked DH and my midwives to gently remind me of what I wanted if I start to call the ILs immediately after and have them bring Fenton, but to get out of my way if I'm determined.

Had my strep test today. It's out of my hands now.

Some interesting possibilities opening up with schooling options for DH. Feeling very hopeful. And, as these things happen, I'm trying to support my sister through a really tough time in _her_ marriage right now. Is there something about the 7-9 year marriage mark that brings partnership into crisis? Is this a ripe time for change?


----------



## cking

those both sound like good plans. Maev is so cute, it's great that she's been watching birth videos with you. Shanna, I can totally see what you mean about not wanting the LO there during the birth. Josephine has been incredibly clingy lately, and if it's just me and DH here, she's excited that he's here, but still needs me by her side all the time. Of course, this could change before Feb, and she does get really excited to see my sister or MIL, so it's possible that she could spend time with them outside of the house.

My mom asked me about it the other day, and offered to come spend time with Josephine during the birth (I guess on another floor from where I am). But then she also said "You're not going to do like (my older sister) did, and have her older son present...?" in a condemning tone. Well, since you put it that way, Mom, maybe I won't need your help.







And my MIL is 45 minutes away, so that would be a long drive back and forth for them. I have a friend who lives 3 miles away - J adores her and her daughter and likes playing at their house, and she has offered to help, so I think she might be my first choice. And it all depends on the time of day that this is happening and her temperament at the time as well. So, I guess time will tell...

I'm kind of excited to see how she reacts to her newborn cousin.









Shanna, have you gotten to practice wrapping with your new niece?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shanna*
Is there something about the 7-9 year marriage mark that brings partnership into crisis? Is this a ripe time for change?

I think so. But I've also heard that 10-12 years is very hard as well. We've just hit 7, so time will tell.


----------



## witchygrrl

so exciting that we have two babies so close to arriving in our little group!









my friend's SIL is on her THIRD DAY OF INDUCTION. She was 41 weeks this past Sunday. What kind of midwife supports that?!? The hospital she's at has a really high c-sec rate, too, and it seems they're not letting her eat while she hangs out all day not laboring on these induction drugs.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
My mom asked me about it the other day, and offered to come spend time with Josephine during the birth (I guess on another floor from where I am). But then she also said "You're not going to do like (my older sister) did, and have her older son present...?" in a condemning tone. Well, since you put it that way, Mom, maybe I won't need your help.









I've had a few people look worried when I tell them our plan to have Dd there. They usually say something like, "Don't you think she'll be scared?" Like I'm this horrible parent...







Yes, I think there's a small chance she could get scared if I'm having a difficult time, but that's why my sister will be there. But really I think that she would need to be another year or so older for her to be scared. It's just not really her personality, especially after we've explained to her what's going to happen and that I might be loud because I'll be working so hard. We'll see how it goes...

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
my friend's SIL is on her THIRD DAY OF INDUCTION. She was 41 weeks this past Sunday. What kind of midwife supports that?!? The hospital she's at has a really high c-sec rate, too, and it seems they're not letting her eat while she hangs out all day not laboring on these induction drugs.
















She's not being allowed to eat?! for three days?! I would be dying. I can't go 3 hours without food.


----------



## accountclosed3

ok, weird. our 7th year was tough, and so what our 12th (which was 2009!). both were transitional times for us, and also important 'growth spurt' times for us individually and as a couple. they both worked out, btw.

my meeting went amazingly well. i focused on my issues and my feelings (eg, i tend to react this way; or, i don't know why i do this, but i know it's creating my own suffering. . .), and it was so awesome! everything went exactly as i wanted times 100!

want to hear scary?

i woke up about three days ago going "omg, i could be pregnant." didnt' say a thing to a soul. my friend (an intuitive) called me later that day and goes "girl, are you pregnant?" and i'm like "ack! not that i know of!" and then the next day, i ran into another friend, and she said "are you pregnant?" and i'm like "no, i don't think so."

my intuitive friend says "be careful; or you wil be." ryan thinks they're just picking up on my new fertility. but he said "i'm willing to keep my penis to myself for a while if that will make you feel more secure." LOL he's so funny.

so, now i'm terrified. if i am or will get pregnant (even though we're charting and using back up!), hawk won't even be two by the time things come around.

but on second thought, everyone keeps saying "oh, but you'd have a girl." and i'm such a sappy romantic about that. but r yan say i can't name her RebelJane.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I've had a few people look worried when I tell them our plan to have Dd there. They usually say something like, "Don't you think she'll be scared?" Like I'm this horrible parent...







Yes, I think there's a small chance she could get scared if I'm having a difficult time, but that's why my sister will be there. But really I think that she would need to be another year or so older for her to be scared. It's just not really her personality, especially after we've explained to her what's going to happen and that I might be loud because I'll be working so hard. We'll see how it goes...

She's not being allowed to eat?! for three days?! I would be dying. I can't go 3 hours without food.









Maela, I think you've taken into account Maev's personality as best as you possibly can in this situation, and obviously there's no way to know until the day finally comes.

And yeah, the doctors have sent her home again today from a 4th failed induction. They weren't letting her eat while on the Pitocin, I guess. Cruel and inhumane, IMHO. Ugh.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
but on second thought, everyone keeps saying "oh, but you'd have a girl." and i'm such a sappy romantic about that. but r yan say i can't name her RebelJane.

Awwww, why not?

I find being fertile again....strange. I'm not sure why, but I haven't felt very in tune with it yet.


----------



## Maela

My little girl is almost potty-trained (learned, whatever word you want to use)!!







She was dry for 6 days in a row. Then she had two days of a couple of accidents. And then yesterday she was dry again. Plus she's been dry for the last 9! nights. I really didn't expect the night dryness yet, it just happened all of a sudden!

We'll see what happens when the baby is born...


----------



## Maela

I'm going to be 39 weeks on Sunday. The house is pretty much spotless. Come on out baby, before the house gets messy again!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
My little girl is almost potty-trained (learned, whatever word you want to use)!!







She was dry for 6 days in a row. Then she had two days of a couple of accidents. And then yesterday she was dry again. Plus she's been dry for the last 9! nights. I really didn't expect the night dryness yet, it just happened all of a sudden!

We'll see what happens when the baby is born...

That. Is. Awesome!!!! Fenton has been interested for over a year, was doing great for about 2 weeks.....and is _completely_ uninterested now









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I'm going to be 39 weeks on Sunday. The house is pretty much spotless. Come on out baby, before the house gets messy again!









Maela, you're getting close enough that when I've seen you've posted, I get a little rush of adrenaline









I know what you mean about "come on out before the house gets messy again". I'm worried this thinking is going to leave me cleaning 2 minutes before I leave for the birth center. Committing to starting the cleaning on October 1.


----------



## PiePie

i cannot believe your dd has potty learned. mine is nowhere near.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i cannot believe your dd has potty learned. mine is nowhere near.

Well, not completely. And we do have to remind her often to use the potty. I know some people don't really count that as "potty-learned." The two days she had accidents were because I tried completely relying on her to tell me if she had to go. She tells us most of the time, but if she's doing something she really likes, she is likely to have an accident. What's funny is that she says, "I'm not going to go peepee/poopoo in my panties." And that's how I know she has to go; so then we rush to the potty.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Well, not completely. And we do have to remind her often to use the potty. I know some people don't really count that as "potty-learned." The two days she had accidents were because I tried completely relying on her to tell me if she had to go. She tells us most of the time, but if she's doing something she really likes, she is likely to have an accident. What's funny is that she says, "I'm not going to go peepee/poopoo in my panties." And that's how I know she has to go; so then we rush to the potty.
















Love it!

DH really wants to get Rhea a potty to start learning on when we're all unpacked. We're super late on ECing, but really early on more traditional potty learning. Should be interesting as I have never found a consistent signal that she uses.

Maela, you are REALLY close now. Wow.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Just finished my belly cast!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
My little girl is almost potty-trained (learned, whatever word you want to use)!!







She was dry for 6 days in a row. Then she had two days of a couple of accidents. And then yesterday she was dry again. Plus she's been dry for the last 9! nights. I really didn't expect the night dryness yet, it just happened all of a sudden!

We'll see what happens when the baby is born...

Shortly after Q was potty trained he started being dry at night. I was stunned! We didn't even talk to him about not peeing at night, we expected it for several more months! And I would have expected him to wake up asking for the potty, but no, he's dry for 12 hours at night then pees a ton when he wakes up. I was actually worried about it at first, but its seems to be fine.


----------



## PiePie

DD hasn't gone during the night since May (when she was 21 mos.) but has resistance to the potty. I am not going to push it. Well, I am going to buy more potty books to see if she is interested in hearing about it, to keep it on her radar screen. I figure she will train eventually. Don't think it helps that her BFFs are boys who I expect will train later (Q being an exception, of course). She is one of the youngest in her class and none are potty trained, at all. I think having gone on the potty ever puts her in the lead, ha ha. Lots of beginners luck in June when we got the potty but then resistance kicked in. "Let's go on the potty." "NOOOOO!"


----------



## Maela

Dd does not always want to go either.







I admit to using bribery. My parents got her this cute sticker book for her birthday. Every time she sat on the potty and was dry, she got to do a sticker. She didn't have to go (because I didn't think that was fair), just be dry. And when she wasn't, I didn't make a big deal about it. I just said, "I bet you'll get a sticker next time!" And we would read a book while she sat.

At first I wasn't okay with using rewards, especially food ones - so I stopped that. But then I felt like it would be okay _if_ they were used in an appropriate (IMO) way that did not make her feel bad. She never cried about not getting a sticker, so I felt good about it. I think it would have been different if it had really upset her.

Anyway, that's my confession.


----------



## Maela

As nervous as I am about this birth...I want him out!!







We're all ready now. Today I feel a little different, maybe something will happen tonight.


----------



## accountclosed3

i hope you have an awesome birth Maela, whenever it comes.

and i would totally have hawk there if i birthed again. i know that he can handle it--i don't think it would scare him--but even so if i were to birth again, and i'm not saying i will, i would have someone there to help him out (doula/friend).

though, having someone there kinda freaks me out. our UC was so private and perfect, the idea of having someone there for hawk seems weird, but having ryan try to manage (within himself) both hawk's and my needs might be overwhelming for him (ryan). but, who knows.

i think children "should" be at the birth (in quotes because there are always exceptions). i feel that it is valuable for them spiritually, emotionally, socially, and so on. it also helps them learn about natural birth!

it's partly why, if i choose not to have any more children, i'm considering becoming a doula (and perhaps narrowing my services into the child-minding, light cleaning, quiet, background support side of things) and integrating hawk into that so that he can 'be present' for births without being actively involved. there's a doula here who brings her kids or doesn't depending upon what the mother will accept.

i would probably only doula very occasionally and very specifically. but i think it would be very healthy to expose hawk (and any other children that we may have by whatever means) to birth.


----------



## accountclosed3

oh, and potty learning. hawk is in no way a "grad" but he's a good signaller. he is dry most nights (i'd say 9 out of 10 now), and we normally catch about 90% of pee and usually 95-100% of poop.

he just doesn't use the little potties. he prefers to be held over the toilet now. though occassionally, he wants to poop in the tub (which i then clean), and play while doing that. i'm trying to get him to use the toilet exclusively at this point.


----------



## Maela

ZB, I forgot to say that I'm glad your meeting with your co-worker(?) went so well!

Lots of Braxton-Hicks today. I think they're just BH, but I guess I'm not totally sure. I just feel like something is going on or will be soon. Just lots of pressure (no pain) at irregular intervals. No other signs.


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, I have to admit the timestamp whenever you post always gets me thinking the baby's coming. Because we're on different coasts, I always have to remember that no, you're not posting in the middle of the night!









Sounds exciting though!!

So my friend's SIL had a CS. I think they outright tortured her with all of those inductions, not letting her get proper rest or proper food intake. So finally when they "offered" a CS, she just took it.







But the baby is beautiful and they seem relieved that she's here.


----------



## Maela

I went to bed last night and listened to my hypnobabies and some relaxing music, and I didn't feel any more. But then I just woke up about a half hour ago and I'm feeling pressure waves again!







I don't know it seems that it's already been quite a few. Maybe I just have to go to the bathroom...


----------



## cking

Maela, that's exciting! Sending you peaceful labor vibes.









Witchy, my SIL also had a CS last week. I felt enraged and disappointed at first, but it was her experience so I just have to let it go. It does sound like your friends' SIL was put through a lot of torture. I imagine she was exhausted. I hope she's healing well.

Well, since we were on the topic of potty learning, I have my own experience to share. We've had a stressful morning so far, so I'm going to try to come back to type it up.


----------



## Maela

I called my mw to let her know that this could be it. I can't believe that I could have a baby today! Can you tell I'm a little excited? I don't want to tell to anybody (except Dh, Dd, and my sister) IRL yet, just in case it's not really it. So you guys are the only ones I have to talk to!


----------



## witchygrrl

oh my goodness! yes, peaceful labor vibes to you, Maela!


----------



## Maela

They're a little bit stronger now. Still about the same distance apart. Mw says I'm 3cm.


----------



## accountclosed3

today/tomorrow, huh? it's exciting! hard to believe!







i hope everything is fab and i can't wait for the birth story.

on a selfish note, i finally came to some good peace about the "possibility of another" question. 1. it's ok if i don't want another; 2. i can handle it if i do want another. so, duh, i know. but i had to get there.


----------



## Maela

Ugh!! I guess I'm just being really impatient; but I feel like nothing has changed in the last 5 hours. Maybe a little stronger... I'm feeling a little down with the lack of progress.









Maybe we'll go take a walk.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I've been gone too long, I missed the opportunity to obsess with maela! How are you doing right now, I wonder?







And now????









Yesterday I had a panic that my bag of waters was slowly leaking, but I think it was just incontinence







. Which is normal for me, except usually I feel it happen. This I didn't, and right after I think I felt the baby drop.

Needless to say, I'm a maniac today, thinking that the baby could come "early". Was a bit panicked, but DH has suggested that we hire a person to do the cleaning that I'm convinced I can't get done in time. I swear, I fell in love with him again when he said this. Even so, I'm thinking I will barely have time to get done everything that "needs" to get done (Clean up garden, compost, clean chicken coop, get rolling some major projects related to fundraising for birth center, car seat check, stock freezer, somehow manage to rest so I don't feel exhausted going into labor....). Calling Dh at work (for the, ahem, 4th time today), he said that we should sit down tonight and figure out what needs to get done and what doesn't. And I felt panic that he's going to look at my list and say "Well, none of this _needs_ to get done.". And some things that's true, I just want it done. But most of it has to get done at some point, and I'd rather now than when I have another LO and a gimpy thumb again (surgery in December). He conceded that he's of little use to me between now and the birth with finishing his classes up, so we're hiring help. Yay! And, providence of providence, my ILs are back from Florida, a day earlier than I thought. Which is great when you think (erroneously) you might be in labor.

Wow. Sorry to puke all that out. But seriously, I'm a mess today. Scheduled a haircut and a massage for next Friday, I feel so pampered. I shouldn't be rewarded for such craziness







I seriously have a hard time with priorities right now.


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, thinking of you. YOU CAN DO IT! we are all here rooting for you. can't believe you said "pressure waves."

weird etiquette question: in late june went to cousin's wedding. in lieu of gifts, we were supposed to donate to a charity of their choice. i think it may be a charity with which she has a closer connection, not sure. anyway i hadn't gotten around to doing so, and now i hear they are divorcing! so do i do the wedding donation?

*shanna*, you need that massage, girlfriend.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*maela*, thinking of you. YOU CAN DO IT! we are all here rooting for you. can't believe you said "pressure waves."

weird etiquette question: in late june went to cousin's wedding. in lieu of gifts, we were supposed to donate to a charity of their choice. i think it may be a charity with which she has a closer connection, not sure. anyway i hadn't gotten around to doing so, and now i hear they are divorcing! so do i do the wedding donation?

*shanna*, you need that massage, girlfriend.

Hmm.. that is an odd situation. I'm not sure what I'd do.

Thanks for the encouragement everyone. I'm going to bed tonight without a baby in my arms.







he is kicking around safely inside me though, so I should be grateful for that. I'm alternating between being fine with it and feeling depressed.


----------



## witchygrrl

Did things settle down Maela? I know how that feels









PiePie, that IS weird. Is it a charity you'd want to donate to anyway? If so, then I'd do it, but not in their name.

And Shanna, I second PiePie. You definitely need a massage.


----------



## Maela

Things stayed pretty much the same the whole day until about 9pm when the contractions spaced out to about 10-15 minutes apart. Then when I went to bed they disappeared completely. This morning they are still gone.







I guess this baby is teaching me patience.


----------



## accountclosed3

the body is preparing. i think it makes labor easier, though i suppose it makes patience harder. LOL

exciting though.

as to the etiquette question, i'm a sucker for charities so i would give anyway, but if they are divorcing and i havent' given, i might not, you know? i don't think you're under an obligation either way though.


----------



## Sihaya

PiePie, from my wedding planner days, you are not obligated to give a gift if they divorce in the first year. Also, they (according to etiquette, they probably won't) should give back all gifts they received or give back cash to equal. I wouldn't give in their names and would only give at all if I really wanted to anyway.

Maela,







for stop and start labor. I hope this happens for you soon!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela watch...









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
PiePie, from my wedding planner days, you are not obligated to give a gift if they divorce in the first year. Also, they (according to etiquette, they probably won't) should give back all gifts they received or give back cash to equal. I wouldn't give in their names and would only give at all if I really wanted to anyway.









I can't believe there is an etiquette rule for this! A distant cousin has had the same thing happen: married in April, divorced by August.









Speaking of etiquette, my sister threw me a blessingway on Friday night. It was really awesome: no gifts (except that literally every attendee came bearing something that I am borrowing for the baby), a chocolate fountain, no games (except a "Bad Mother" discussion where you had to share a moment when you were not your best mama self) and a masseuse for everyone. My sister gently mentioned in the invite that it probably wouldn't be appropriate for kids, and we were surprised when a friend showed up with her LO. Wasn't a problem, I was just really glad to know the official etiquette ruling on it, as it made my friend look less rude when I mentioned it to my sister: A nursing baby is always invited along with their mama, no matter the invitation. I'm not much for etiquette rules, but I'm always glad to have this info to spread around whenever people expect to be able to control whether kids will be at an event or not.

Got the garden cleaned out today, just need to compost and mulch. And, as if I need another project to obsess over...I think we have another mouse in the house. And I'm worried it's more than one







All God's creatures and all that, but I still confess it creeps me out.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 







I can't believe there is an etiquette rule for this!


I can't believe I still have that info in my head when I can't remember anything important









Shanna, your blessingway sounds awesome! I went to a baby shower last year with a masseuse and I think it's an amazing idea!

It just occurred to me that I'm going to have *a child*, another baby that isn't DS that will be living here, with us


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
It just occurred to me that I'm going to have *a child*, another baby that isn't Calvin that will be living here, with us









I know....and can you believe you're going to love him or her as much? I just can't get my brain around that. I also can't believe that this baby is going to come out and look different. Steph, is the idea sinking in more?

Witchy, how is the job going? Does Rhea love her Daddy time?

Also wondering about MMMs vacation and decisions on work - any revelations?


----------



## Sihaya

Honestly, I'm afraid that if it's a girl I'm going to love it more







I haven't even got to the looking different part. The idea is definitely sinking in, slowly but surely.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I know....and can you believe you're going to love him or her as much? I just can't get my brain around that.

I struggle with this, and specifically with the fear that another child's personality will not be as good of a fit with us. dd is so perfect, it's just hard to imagine that another won't get the short end of the stick.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Honestly, I'm afraid that if it's a girl I'm going to love it more







I haven't even got to the looking different part. The idea is definitely sinking in, slowly but surely.


Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I struggle with this, and specifically with the fear that another child's personality will not be as good of a fit with us. dd is so perfect, it's just hard to imagine that another won't get the short end of the stick.

I don't worry about loving another one more exactly, but I do wonder what will go on in my head if this one is easier. Fenton is just.....so much







. I worry about thinking in my head "Fenton, why can't you be more like Ku?". But my MIL has an interesting take, having had the maniac (DH) and the very reserved "potted plant" child (BIL) that I would wish for. She says that while my DH was way harder energy-wise, she worried about his brother so much more. She says it's so much easier to gently reel a child in than to gently propel them out into the world. Truly, it's a tough world for the introvert.

I also think it's interesting how parents, even late in the pregnancy, will talk about subsequent children in relationship to the first. That they wanted another baby to have a playmate _for_ #1, etc. But I have it from good authority that as soon as you see the face of your subsequent children, you feel even a little _more_ protective of them because you see your older children as being rougher, harder and just generally more destructive towards this wee baby. Not looking forward to that first moment when I think I have to protect one from the other....Got a taste of it last week when I walked in on Fenton enthusiastically pushing Baby Abigail (niece) in the swing. It was a bit....dangerous.

Pie Pie, I have with Fenton the situation that you probably worry about. His temperment is so different from ours, he's loud where DH and I like quiet. He loves being outdoors and rough-housing whereas we are more indoor folk. I could go on and on - the point is that you end up really admiring the ways that they are different from you, and you even feel protective of their right to be different. It's like you still "get" them as much as you do Lorelei, and you feel compelled to make sure they get to be themselves the way Lorelei does. I can't explain it better than that - it sounds so simplistic to say that they end up being a good fit because it's your child, but it does feel that way sometimes. It's a pretty powerful thing to understand a child so well, even when they are so different from you.

Funny story: My sister's middle child loves her baby sister. And is learning to use the potty by running around naked. My sister reports that Gianna.....wait for it.....peed on her 4 month old sister. My sister said she came out into the living room and smelled urine. Assuming Gianna had had an accident, she looked for it and found baby Abigail wet in a place that was impossible for her to have done herself. As my sister says "YOu know, you leave them alone in what seems like a child-proof situation, and they always surprise you. Didn't even occur to me that one child would pee on another."


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Witchy, how is the job going? Does Rhea love her Daddy time?

The job is going okay. I have one student who is completely clueless, and the other 4 understand what's going on most of the time. Honestly, I wish they were more engaged, but at the same time, I know they've been failed by the system, and that alone keeps me going. I really am considering writing to the governor to see if I can somehow become a consultant on 2nd language education, particularly ESL, because I feel like these students are not being properly assessed (i.e. I think they have learning differences that are not being taken into account because the focus is on getting them English skills). But that's some time down the road. I'd like more research first before I go down that road.

Rhea is totally loving Daddy time in the mornings. A lot of the time I'm feeling like chopped liver though







But she is having fun going to the playground most days and just getting more equal time with us. Her personality is really coming through now.


----------



## Maela

*Shanna,* what a great blessingway! Sounds very relaxing and peaceful.
Oh, and the peeing story had me laughing for a while!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I know....and can you believe you're going to love him or her as much? I just can't get my brain around that. I also can't believe that this baby is going to come out and look different. Steph, is the idea sinking in more?

It is hard for me to believe that I'll love him as much as Dd. But I've heard SO many people say they thought the same thing, and it just happened, yk? So I'm okay with that feeling for now.
What's weird is that I imagine him looking very different from Dd. Maybe because my sister and I look so different (people have questioned whether one of us is adopted). I think I'd be more surprised if they looked very similar.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
I struggle with this, and specifically with the fear that another child's personality will not be as good of a fit with us. dd is so perfect, it's just hard to imagine that another won't get the short end of the stick.

Dd is not very similar in personality to Dh and I, but her personality is so fun and she's pretty advanced language-wise. I worry that this new LO might not be as fun (is that mean?). It's just that I don't want him to get compared to Dd constantly... I think I'm going to be really sensitive about that. Some heads might get bitten off if anybody makes a comment like that.









Nothing more today except what I think is some of the mucous plug.


----------



## accountclosed3

you have the 2000 post!

i don't think it's mean to worry/speculate about the new baby. i mean, you did it with the first baby--we all did. why not the second? and i think it's normal to have fear s or not know how it's going to work out and be a bit worried about that.

and i use these words, but i know that these feelings are not overwhelming like worry and the like often are.







just that, they are there and real and it's ok.

we all have colds. ryan is home from work. my teeth hurt--which means the cold is in the sinuses. i have to go and buy some soup fixings.


----------



## farmama

just checking in...maela? anyone? bueller? bueller?

much lurking, little to say. been kinda rough around here, and i complain enough irl









hope everyone's doing well!


----------



## cking




----------



## witchygrrl

hoping there's some good news soon!


----------



## Maela

Nothing.







I have been having contractions every now and then and some of my mucous plug every time I go to the bathroom. Sometimes I feel like I'm starting labor, but then the next hour I'll feel like I still have weeks to go.


----------



## farmama

i know we're not helping at all with all our excitement, but do try to relax and enjoy your time with maev. pretty soon you'll _really_ have your hands full!


----------



## Maela

Full moon and my due date this weekend, so maybe that will get him to come out.


----------



## accountclosed3

sweet.

we're all watching and waiting and sending vibes and thoughts and stuff.







have a great birth!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Full moon and my due date this weekend, so maybe that will get him to come out.


















sending you lots of







vibes.

Shanna, the blessingway sounds great. even cooler that _your sister_ threw it for you.









DH felt the baby kick last night!







Of course, that just made him freak out a little about the reality of this.









And DD saw me rubbing my belly, so she came over and rubbed it for me.









So, here's our potty story:
We did some casual p/t ECing earlier this year, with some success. So she's familiar with the potty and has used it before. At this point, she stays dry most nights (!), goes at fairly predictable times, and often tells me just before or after she goes.

BUT, she won't use the potty, and she often will absolutely refuse to have a diaper put on (and sometimes will pull off her diaper - usually when it's wet.) She'll sit on the potty for fun, usually clothed, and will talk about the potty. But, eg, if she tells me _Poop, Potty_, and I get her undressed and offer her the potty, she'll freak out, and usually hold in the poop until she has a diaper on. But, getting a diaper on is a huge struggle, so that stresses her out more, so she'll hold it longer. I'd be happy to just put the potty away and forget about it, but the alternative is not so easy either.

I got some waterproof training pants, so I'll try those around the house - maybe she'll like being able to step in/out of them instead of laying down for a diaper.

Anyway, this has been the source of much frustration around here, and screaming on dd's part. Also, she has been unhappy about getting dressed in general and bath time, and she is getting about 6 teeth at once right now. (I WISH I was exaggerating...)


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, similar potty resistance here. i have heard from many moms that they had initial success before age 2, then resistance, then renewed interest and success about 6 mos. after the resistance set in.


----------



## Maela

*cking*, Maev also went through a somewhat similar phase. She never completely refused the potty or diapers. But diaper changes and getting dressed and potty time often involved lots of tears (even on my part







).

I think you're right about the waterproof training pants. It sounds like she would really enjoy those and how you put them on and take them off like underwear. I'm sorry you've been having a rough time - I understand.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*cking*, similar potty resistance here. i have heard from many moms that they had initial success before age 2, then resistance, then renewed interest and success about 6 mos. after the resistance set in.

Exactly our experience! Though there was an infection under his foreskin that made peeing hurt and he associated it with the potty (happened 10 days into being potty trained), so had that not happened, I don't know if he would have reverted to diapers.


----------



## Maela

I started having contractions at 8AM and he was born at 11:35AM!
7lbs 14oz, 22 in long and he's very handsome!!








I tore just in the same spot that I did with Maev. Not bad, no stitches needed.
Such a better birth than last time!!














I'm really really happy with how the birth went.


----------



## cking

WOW!!!

Welcome Jaim!!!





















Congratulations Maela!
















Amazing - 3 1/2 hour labor!







I guess the full moon really helped, huh?









Happy Babymooning!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Congrats, Maela!

Welcome Jaim!


----------



## PiePie

congratulations *maela*! i am very happy for you. and happy that the birth went so much more smoothly for you.


----------



## accountclosed3

congratulations and welcome baby jaim!







soudnss like an amazin birth (what, about 3 hrs?); so incredible! can't wait to hear the whole story!

i bet all of that 'false' and pre-labor helped a lot too. amazing.

i think potty resistance is normal. hawk had a phase where he wouldn't go unless i was holdin him over a toilet. he doesn't ever use a little potty (didn't you know that's a drum?), and he will go in the tub (squat style), too, if i need him too.

i'm sure it will pick back up no problems.


----------



## Sihaya

Congats Maela!

Welcome Jaim!


----------



## witchygrrl

Congratulations Maela and welcome Jaim!!! I'm soooo glad the birth went well for you!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Welcome baby Jaim!!!!!! Maela, can't wait to hear the details!






























I'm so silly - I feel slightly disloyal that I saw this first on fb


----------



## ~Shanna~

I had to come back to say:
Jaim is our first #2!!!!!!!!!









Seems like just yesterday I was waiting to hear about Teo, our first #1


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

I'm so silly - I feel slightly disloyal that I saw this first on fb









Well I'm completely disloyal then because I congratulated them on fb and not here! eeek.


----------



## TwilightJoy

I thought you needed some dancing fruits and veggies, Maela. Congrats again!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

So, decision made. Maybe.

I am not going back to work, HOWEVER, I have applied for another 12 months of unpaid leave, just to keep my options open. I will know whether it's been granted by the end of the week. Meanwhile, I am open to a 1 day a week job, in my current field, if it comes to me.

I am not going to study midwifery. Not yet. I'm going to wait until babe number 2 is born and then reassess.

I am going to do doula training in 2010! And I'm really excited about it. The training itself is pretty painless. 1 day a month for a year. Then we have to rack up a heap of births before we can practice unassisted. I'm also going to look into childbirth education too.

more to say but grumpy kiddo. back later.


----------



## farmama

Congratulations Maela!









Welcome Jaim!!!


----------



## Maela

Thank you everyone for the congratulations!!

Things are going well here. He's nursing like crazy, and my milk is coming in today - thankfully much more gradually than last time (last time I woke up in the middle of the night to find HUGE, rock hard breasts all of a sudden). Having a little bit of nipple pain because he doesn't open his mouth wide enough every time, but we're working on that. Mw checked his mouth out and said all looks normal; I just need to be stricter about requiring a wide open mouth before allowing him to latch on.

He finally pooped this morning - A LOT. Dh was the lucky diaper changer for that one (2 actually), as I was using the bathroom myself.









Maev did great during the birth. She wasn't in the room when he came out, but she was in the room right next to us the whole time, and my sister said she didn't even flinch with all the noise I was making. I had told her that I would be making lots of noise, and I had never used the word pain in front of her. During labor, I made an effort to not yell 'ouch' or cuss (because last time I sure did







) because I wanted her to hear only positive things. I was loud, but it was all moaning, groaning, and roars.







I think it actually helped me to not freak out. But the biggest help was that the whole birth was shorter than just the pushing phase of my last one! What an amazing difference!! The mws said my birth was fun! I can't say enough how grateful I am to have had a better experience this time.


----------



## Sihaya

Maela, that is so wonderful to hear! I'm so happy you had such a fantastic birth







I'm wondering what you have to say about Hypnobabies and whether you think it helped this time around.


----------



## accountclosed3

sihaya: it's o cool that you are on number 2, too. wait--how many are prenant now?


----------



## Sihaya

zoebird - well, three who have announced here that I know of. In order of due dates - shanna, cking, and me.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Maela, that is so wonderful to hear! I'm so happy you had such a fantastic birth







I'm wondering what you have to say about Hypnobabies and whether you think it helped this time around.

I think hb helped. I definitely did not have a painless or even comfortable birth, but it was short and fairly easy. I didn't really use the switch that much, but I listened to the scripts for the entire last two hours. didn't really listen much to what she was saying, but it was comforting to hear her voice and the background music; and i panicked a bit when i came to end of a script and had to start a new one.

want write more but i really need to take a nap before he wakes up. I'm still getting used to having to be so much at night. can't wait until we're nursing pros and i don't have to actually sit up to feed him


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I'm still getting used to having to be so much at night. can't wait until we're nursing pros and i don't have to actually sit up to feed him









I just today put the flashlight near my bed in preparation, remembering how much I needed to see in the begining.

Came down with a minor cold today, trying to be grateful it's not the crazy flu everyone seems to be getting. But I'm really hoping I'm not sick during labor.







Oh, and while I'm complaining: Message from my mom today asking if I was having any contractions or in labor. I'm a week and a half before my guess date







. I vowed to not return messages like that, I'm so damn irritated.

Carpets getting cleaned tomorrow, then a massage and haircut on Friday.
Just watched Pregnant in America and reading "Pushed" - not for obvious reasons. Having trouble sleeping at night if I nap with Fenton, so I have to have something that keeps me resting during nap but not sleeping. So I'm only reading and watching what I can get from my MW







Anyone read or see this?


----------



## witchygrrl

I've only seen the trailer for Pregnant in America, and thought it looked really good. I didn't realize the movie had come out.

Shanna, I was just coming here to see how you're doing. Sorry to hear about your cold--I hope that goes away fast!


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, that's amazing. so Maela is our first, then Shanna, then cking, then you. and, i think, a few are TTC?

it's hard to keep up with.

we had colds last week. ryan's was from Thurs-Mon; hawk and i had it Thurs-Sat.

and, we're getting ready to put the house on the market. so, we're decluttering up to sunday, then our agent comes out on tuesday to check the place out and offer us advice on colors and such, and then we have a garage sale on oct 17.

the week that i'm away (oct 18-22), ryan will host the painters (who will also remove wall paper), cleanin crew, and tub refinisher. finally, we'll have a cleaning crew in on friday, oct 23. on sat, oct 24, that's when we'll replace fixtures, and on sunday, we're going to stage the place.

the agent comes again on the 26th for any final touch ups, and then the house goes on the market. it's an agressive schedule, but i think we can do it. at least, we've otten some stuff decluttered already and are moving forward.

and ryan is driving me nuts. he can't seem to see beyond the end of his nose.


----------



## Maela

It hurts badly to nurse Maev with sore nipples.







I thought she would be a welcome break from a newborn with a small mouth that was still learning to nurse. I thought she would help with engorgement. Instead, it almost hurts more to nurse her and she doesn't seem to get any more out of me than Jaim does. I guess her latch just isn't the same as it used to be? Maybe she's forgetting how to latch on correctly?? I've tried working with her on it (even before the birth because I suspected something was wrong), but she usually just gives up. So I told her that my nipples need to get better and then she can start nursing again. She doesn't seem upset, but I'm upset that her weaning (if that's what ends up happening) will coincide with Jaim's arrival. I'm worried how it will affect her (or their relationship) in the long run.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Rant:
I'm a grumpy pregnant woman today - I don't remember feeling so impatient last time around.

Carpets were cleaned yesterday am, and are still wet now. Feels like there's still soap residue, so it's wet, sticky and attracting even more dirt. Looks worse now than it did before, so I now I have to wrangle with the company, which doesn't open again until Monday. And in my irrational 39 week brain, it feels like a catastrophe that the baby will come while the carpets are dirty.

Fenton and I are getting over our colds, but DHs is carrying on and is worse - he's lost his voice, is sick to his stomach, is gone all day to Chicago tomorrow and, through a series of unfortunately events, has to preach at all 3 services on Sunday. I feel like the point where I can finally relax keeps getting pushed back, that I'm forever in the position of "If this baby comes at X time, it's going to be catastrophic for Y". Which is ridiculous, they come when they come. But I'm 39 weeks, grumpy, and taking care of the needs of a grown man who keeps coming up with more needs







He's working on a paper for a class and I (benevolently, I thought) offered to keep Fenton out of the house from 8 until 5 today so he could get work done. I fished for "Hey, wasn't that nice to be able to work more than an hour here, and hour there?" and he basically told me it was the bare minimum of what he needed. Do you any idea what a pita it is to keep a toddler out of their house for the entire day? Whilst 39 weeks pregnant? And then to be asked where the clean towels are? They're in the clean clothes basket buddy, unfolded, with the rest of this weeks laundry. Which i would have folded if I hadn't been keeping your son off your lap all day today, or when I was keeping him off your lap while you studied for the GRE earlier this week, or taking care of you while you're sicker than average because yoru nutrient intake is 0.









He's just being human. But so am I, and sometimes humans are....as mean as me.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Do you any idea what a pita it is to keep a toddler out of their house for the entire day?

Yes I do it every Sunday, while DH works from home. Fortunately I never start that early. Nothing before 10. For any reason. But can stay out past 5. I sometimes insist on coming home for nap if I can't get her to nap while out.


----------



## PiePie

so we never really had a bedtime routine until very recently. i am not sure what caused me to start it -- perhaps thinking about weaning while pregnant -- but i am very pleased with how it is working out. we do diaper change, clothing change, 2 gummy vitamins, brush teeth, read goodnight moon, turn out light, turn on putumayo dreamland cd. after just a couple of nights she started using "2 vitamins" or "goodnight moon" as shorthand for wanting to go to sleep, and is very insistent on the order in which things must take place and which parent does what. i will definitely start with a routine earlier with any subsequent child. i am hoping that having sleep associations in addition to nursing (we still cosleep and nurse without limitation) will enable me to turn bedtime over to daddy at some point.

definitely have started tantrums. nothing before the 2nd birthday. but now they definitely happen. i think i am dealing with them pretty well but i want to read more Emotion Coaching stuff. how do you all deal specifically, and what have you read on it that you find helpful?

in other reading news, read most of _packaging girlhood: rescuing our daughters from marketers schemes._ for those of you who are trying to go gender-free and/or anti-consumerist, it is a worthwhile read. not saying i agreed with every point, but lots to chew on. we are still tv-free but i not committed to staying that way forever.

her best friend has 2 moms and she is obsessed with that.

her spanish is coming along quite well, even though i have been massively delinquent at speaking to her in it. we have 1 spanish book, which she has memorized -- was so pleased to hear her reciting it to herself, and i have checked a few spanish or spanish-english books out of the library. made a big stink at back to school night about speaking to them in spanish. in favor. last year some parents has blocked it on the theory that 2 of the 3 teachers' spanish was not native in that they were born in nyc rather than latin america (but into spanish-speaking homes). so now those parents are not present or are silenced, who cares, and she is getting spanish. plus her music teacher's latest cd is in spanish. i love hearing her random spanish phrases "se fue" or counting in spanish. will try to speak to her in only spanish when we go to puerto rico later this month.

she is way into singing songs and doing the hand motions. we have sung to her from the beginning, but it is jus tin the past month or so that she sings spontaneously and with the words correct, more or less. very very into the hand motions.

has been asking for violin lessons almost daily since july but i have been pushing it off. i expect we will start suzuki when she turns 3. for now i just cannot stomach power struggles over practicing.

since she was about 18 mos., i have been doing a lot of remediation style discipline -- you spilled it, you clean it up, no judgmental, all calm. well recently she has started saying no! i just sort of demur and don't lock horns with her. what would you do?

got her a balance bike because it was on supersale used by a neighbor. she was very into her scooter around her birthday but still doesn't have stamina on it (so i wind up carrying her and the scooter, nice). now seeing renewed interest in tricycle and plastic ride-in car. it's a mystery.


----------



## PiePie

oh, and we are not among the ttc'ers. are waiting for my uterine lining to heal. not sure if there are any if you count me out.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
her spanish is coming along quite well, even though i have been massively delinquent at speaking to her in it. we have 1 spanish book, which she has memorized -- was so pleased to hear her reciting it to herself, and i have checked a few spanish or spanish-english books out of the library. made a big stink at back to school night about speaking to them in spanish. in favor. last year some parents has blocked it on the theory that 2 of the 3 teachers' spanish was not native in that they were born in nyc rather than latin america (but into spanish-speaking homes). so now those parents are not present or are silenced, who cares, and she is getting spanish. plus her music teacher's latest cd is in spanish. i love hearing her random spanish phrases "se fue" or counting in spanish. will try to speak to her in only spanish when we go to puerto rico later this month.

That's great about the spanish! I wish I was fluent. Dh is pretty good with german, but not really fluent. So dd knows a few words and how to count to ten in both languages but that's it. I'm hoping we can all learn both languages better as a family someday. Unless she'd rather learn another one, of course.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
since she was about 18 mos., i have been doing a lot of remediation style discipline -- you spilled it, you clean it up, no judgmental, all calm. well recently she has started saying no! i just sort of demur and don't lock horns with her. what would you do?

We do this too. We've taught her to say, "no thank you" when she doesn't feel like doing somethgin we ask her to do. We try to honor that if it's not an important request (like "time to get in the car" or "hold my hand when we're in the parking lot" or even "you spilled your milk, I need you to help me clean it up now before it makes the floor all sticky"). Most of the time she'll go ahead and do it if we word it like that. Sometimes she continues to say no and we're struggling too to figure out the best way to deal with that. (if it's a safety issue, we just pick her up and she has no choice of course)

So nursing is already improving!!







I think the worst might be over. I was even able to let Maev nurse last night and tonight. and she is helping with engorgement now. woo hoo! She made me cry tonight though - not from pain. She was nursing and I said, "ow, it's starting to hurt." She looked up at me with tears in her eyes and said, "but i'm not going to hurt you!" So I hugged her and tried to explain that it's not her fault; I'm just sore because I just had a baby. We still continued because it wasn't that bad, and I tried not to show that it hurt. I had thought that she was okay with taking a break because it was hurting me, but I guess it had hurt her feelings.







It broke my heart seeing her sad like that. It was the first time that she's really shown concern like that when I'm upset.

So far she's taken the whole new sibling thing very well. I haven't really noticed a change in her behavior, until tonight. I think it might be taking a toll on her. dh is home with us for two weeks and He's been playing with her and taking her to the park as much as he can, but he's also taking care of me. I'm mostly in bed for a week to help heal the small tear. So i haven't been able to do much with dd besides reading books to her and having conversations with her. And I'm obviously having to give lots of attention to the baby. I can't wait to feel normal again and play with her more. Luckily, ds seems to be a very laid back little guy. I hope it lasts.









Ds h as already gained back his weight plus 6oz!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela, I'm so glad that nursing is getting better!







You're a poster child so far for things being easier the second time around.

Pie pie, I dont' have any advice about the "No" issue, Fenton doesn't usually resist that way. But Maela's advice sounded great to me.

I'm human again today, being 30 minutes away from all high-stress obligations being completed. And the carpets are taken care of







Thanks for listening to me vent. Now I'm just concentrating on maintaining the house, not letting anything get to out of control (laundry, dishes). Fenton is a little cranky lately, I wonder if he knows something I don't...


----------



## cking

Maela, I'm also very glad nursing is going better. Also glad that Maev is handling things well. She is such a sweetheart. And i love the pics on FB of the two of them together.









Shanna, glad you're feeling better also. Your DH sounds a lot like mine at times.







Sending relaxing vibes your way.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 

Ds h as already gained back his weight plus 6oz!









that's awesome!









MMM, sounds like some good decisions. So cool that you are going to do doula training.

DD loves matchbox cars. She puts them into the bib of her overalls and shakes them out of the leg.


----------



## ~Shanna~

At the risk of boring you all withe minutae of my life, this is too funny not to share. And when I say funny, picture me cackling like an insane pregnant woman. My husband came home from work early today. Because now he's sick with something else. Last week it was a minor cold, this is looking like it could be the flu.

Figure I'll just run away with my Midwife.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
At the risk of boring you all withe minutae of my life, this is too funny not to share. And when I say funny, picture me cackling like an insane pregnant woman. My husband came home from work early today. Because now he's sick with something else. Last week it was a minor cold, this is looking like it could be the flu.

Figure I'll just run away with my Midwife.

















I'm sorry. Glad the carpets are okay though!

I updated on FB, but in case anyone didn't see, we are at the hospital right now because Jaim has something with his heart that causes him to have episodes of very high (like 300) heart rate. He is going to be okay with medicines to keep this from happening again, and most likely it will resolve itself by a year old. We're just working on finding the right combination of medicines right now, and he has to have 48 hours free of these episodes before we can go home. Right now we're still on the meds that have very little to no side effects, so I'm really hoping that these work and we don't have to use the stronger ones. It's been 18 hours since his last episode! Oh, and they are not life threatening if caught with in ~15 hours. Which they will be from now on because we are going to be checking his heart rate periodically.

They hospital staff has been great about bfing. I have been able to nurse him whenever I want (as long as they are not checking him, etc.). And I've been pumping (their electric pumps are wonderful!!) just in case and also for the nights they give him a bottle of my milk. I am still sore and bleeding obviously from the birth, so I'm trying to make sure that I get enough sleep to keep me healthy and keep up my milk supply. I'm away from him a total of seven hours at night.







I can't believe he's already spent the night away from me when Maev _just_ spent her first night away from us a few months ago. Maev is spending every other night with us and the other nights with her grandparents. I miss her so much!!







Can't wait to be home...


----------



## PiePie

I will be praying for Jaim.


----------



## PiePie

So here is where I am these days with regard to pregnancy loss: http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1148683


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela, I'm so sorry








. I can't imagine how you're feeling right now. I'm so glad that the hospital is being so supportive. Post more as you can, we're not going to be able to stop worrying about your family







.


----------



## witchygrrl

Much love and prayers toward your family, Maela.


----------



## arelyn

Maela,







I saw that on FB and had to rush over here to see what was going on.

I'm so glad the hospital is being so helpful. I hope everything settles down and you can get home soon. You're all in my prayers.


----------



## cking

Maela,







This must have been very scary. I'm glad he's doing better now and that the hospital has been helpful.


----------



## Maela

I just wrote a long post talking about how we got to go home last night, and then I lost it.







Short story, we're home. The cardiologist thought he was doing really well even though he had had some short episodes of the SVT. He's taking 2 medicines - one is three times a day (12am, 8am, 4pm) and the other is 2 times a day (noon and midnight) - until he's at least 6mo.


----------



## Maela

And he only had 4 bottles the whole time. Doesn't seem to have m essed with his latch. Oh and a pacifier. So much for waiting on that. Luckily, he wasn't too interested in it unless i was out of the room.


----------



## PiePie

Can someone elighten me on what is going on wiht judgment against ap'ing, specifically as it appears in my boss? I just had to listen to an hour and a half screed against babywearing. Before it was extended nursing. Oh, and as usual HB and cosleeping. I am not clear on why this is so threatening to her, or to other vociferous critics of ap. What is at stake for them emotionally to generate this level of animosity? I do not believe it is genuine concern about the health or safety of the child -- that would merit a comment against, say, cosleeping and fear of rollovers (ignorant, but whatever) and then moving on. She is *obsessed*!! With the babywearing there is definitely a huge amount of defensiveness: she totally planned to babywear and now she is a stroller addict. I feel badly for her poor little baby, not even 6 mos., not being held, but I don't spend more time thinking about it than I took to type that sentence. She kept saying it was too "earthy-crunchy" as if her opposition were some sort of fashion statement (went so far as to say the only men who do it are, she knows for certain, gay), and I do know some women who obsess about fashion -- in my old office, for example, women could spend hours discussing a stray hair on a woman's chin, like it was the measure of her character or something. That was a similar sort of misplaced waste. It seems very different than, say, my mother, who does not approve of cosleeping (or nursing this long?) but is genuinely motivated by what she thinks is best for dd, because she actually cares about dd rather than the act of passing judgment.

Sort of sad because I had been thinking I wanted to invest a little more in my coworkers' perception of me and go on a social outing with them, and they are planning one dd could go to, but no way do i want gossip about nursing, babywearing, etc., going back to my boss.

I'll be honest: I am super-judging of anti-AP practices, but I just think that's wrong when it comes up, I don't spend hours obsessing about it. It does leave me with enormous feelings of alienation and does influence whom I want to be friends with, though.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Can someone elighten me on what is going on wiht judgment against ap'ing, specifically as it appears in my boss? I just had to listen to an hour and a half screed against babywearing. Before it was extended nursing. Oh, and as usual HB and cosleeping. I am not clear on why this is so threatening to her, or to other vociferous critics of ap. What is at stake for them emotionally to generate this level of animosity? I do not believe it is genuine concern about the health or safety of the child -- that would merit a comment against, say, cosleeping and fear of rollovers (ignorant, but whatever) and then moving on. She is *obsessed*!! With the babywearing there is definitely a huge amount of defensiveness: she totally planned to babywear and now she is a stroller addict. I feel badly for her poor little baby, not even 6 mos., not being held, but I don't spend more time thinking about it than I took to type that sentence. She kept saying it was too "earthy-crunchy" as if her opposition were some sort of fashion statement (went so far as to say the only men who do it are, she knows for certain, gay), and I do know some women who obsess about fashion -- in my old office, for example, women could spend hours discussing a stray hair on a woman's chin, like it was the measure of her character or something. That was a similar sort of misplaced waste. It seems very different than, say, my mother, who does not approve of cosleeping (or nursing this long?) but is genuinely motivated by what she thinks is best for dd, because she actually cares about dd rather than the act of passing judgment.

Sort of sad because I had been thinking I wanted to invest a little more in my coworkers' perception of me and go on a social outing with them, and they are planning one dd could go to, but no way do i want gossip about nursing, babywearing, etc., going back to my boss.

I'll be honest: I am super-judging of anti-AP practices, but I just think that's wrong when it comes up, I don't spend hours obsessing about it. It does leave me with enormous feelings of alienation and does influence whom I want to be friends with, though.

It blows me away too? The only answer that I can come up with is that some parents are so insecure in their own parenting choices that they feel the need to project onto others. I know for certain that DP's mum does this. She oscillates between really admiring our parenting choices and blaming them for all and any small issue we may be dealing with.


----------



## PiePie

rereading a childhood favorite -- homecoming by cynthia voigt. remember dicey everyone? lovely from a gd perspecitve.

it seems that my m/c has unleashed a bevy of anxieties about whether i am good enough parent. you all have written about these before but until very recently i have felt immune to it. uncharacteristic, no? anyway, any tips of tamping that anxiety down and just loving what you've got instead of worrying about the future? i love dd without reservation; the worry is that i am not doing ENOUGH for her. crazy, i know, but it's there.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
rereading a childhood favorite -- homecoming by cynthia voigt. remember dicey everyone? lovely from a gd perspecitve.

I loved that book!!

gotta go...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Can someone elighten me on what is going on wiht judgment against ap'ing, specifically as it appears in my boss? I just had to listen to an hour and a half screed against babywearing. Before it was extended nursing. Oh, and as usual HB and cosleeping. I am not clear on why this is so threatening to her, or to other vociferous critics of ap. What is at stake for them emotionally to generate this level of animosity? I do not believe it is genuine concern about the health or safety of the child -- that would merit a comment against, say, cosleeping and fear of rollovers (ignorant, but whatever) and then moving on. She is *obsessed*!! With the babywearing there is definitely a huge amount of defensiveness: she totally planned to babywear and now she is a stroller addict. I feel badly for her poor little baby, not even 6 mos., not being held, but I don't spend more time thinking about it than I took to type that sentence. She kept saying it was too "earthy-crunchy" as if her opposition were some sort of fashion statement (went so far as to say the only men who do it are, she knows for certain, gay), and I do know some women who obsess about fashion -- in my old office, for example, women could spend hours discussing a stray hair on a woman's chin, like it was the measure of her character or something. That was a similar sort of misplaced waste. It seems very different than, say, my mother, who does not approve of cosleeping (or nursing this long?) but is genuinely motivated by what she thinks is best for dd, because she actually cares about dd rather than the act of passing judgment.

Sort of sad because I had been thinking I wanted to invest a little more in my coworkers' perception of me and go on a social outing with them, and they are planning one dd could go to, but no way do i want gossip about nursing, babywearing, etc., going back to my boss.

I'll be honest: I am super-judging of anti-AP practices, but I just think that's wrong when it comes up, I don't spend hours obsessing about it. It does leave me with enormous feelings of alienation and does influence whom I want to be friends with, though.

I have to agree with Ayelet Waldman that there is no one more sanctimonious than an AP parent ( myself included, and I'm working on it). My first thought is that this woman is probably responding to that, and I feel some sympathy. Then I saw that she went on and on for 90 minutes







. Wow. Don't lawyers get paid by the hour?









Speaking of AP, this article in the new Yorker got my panties in a twist. I'm composing a letter to the New Yorker. Which I'm sure won't be published. But may make me feel better









Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
it seems that my m/c has unleashed a bevy of anxieties about whether i am good enough parent. you all have written about these before but until very recently i have felt immune to it. uncharacteristic, no? anyway, any tips of tamping that anxiety down and just loving what you've got instead of worrying about the future? i love dd without reservation; the worry is that i am not doing ENOUGH for her. crazy, i know, but it's there.

Doing enough? Or being enough? Most of my anxieties are over not being enough (patient enough, usually). Is it connected with your anxiety over having another child, or that you feel like miscarriage was a failure of you? Or....none of the above









Having a more and more difficult time with Fenton and napping. I'm at a loss as to how to handle it, the only thing I know is that a)He needs a nap (I wish he didn't, it would make this easier) and 2) I refuse to be assaulted while I try to help him fall asleep. Contemplating having a policy where, if I have to leave him because he's hurting me (jumping, kicking....he thinks its a funny game, especially if I get angry. Which i do), he needs to stay him his room for X amount of time so that I can still rest. It's the only logical thing I can think of







. Thinking of checking out Love and Logic for some inspiration. But it's also an interesting exercise in humility to see the ways in which some of my dogmas (AP) don't fit my child well. Strange place to be: My mainstream friends think I'm an indulgent wuss, and my AP parents think I'm pretty authoritarian







.


----------



## PiePie

i think of it as doing the wrong thing -- e.g., being the last in her class to pick her up at sch. i suppose i could think of it as being the wrong thing -- being someone with a longer commute and less non-W2 wealth. or is it that i do work, or or i am a working mother? because i definitely feel like a mother who works, if that makes sense. my biggest anxieties concern education. we are not able to afford to live in one of the "good" sch catchment areas, and accordingly are counting on her testing into one of the "good" schs. well, the word on the street is that to do that she should optimize her chances by going to a special presch (not an academic presch, but a reggio one, but one with more selective admissions and teachers with phds instead of bas). that presch is only part day and would require our having a nanny or au pair for the remainder of teh day, whikch would be financially wise if we had 2 kids but suicidal if we had 1 (because we would have the pay the nanny/au pair for the hours when dd was in special, not specially cheap sch). the weird thing was that i felt very good about her sch -- so it was the shoulds of the world (the "better" sch) vs. what i knew was working (as dh is constantly reminding me, we have the happiest kid ever).

then on friday night i had a total meltdown, and i mean total meltdown, when i learned that dd's class had combined with the 4 yos to watch a dora dvd! now we are tv-free and we feel surprisingly strongly about it. to be honest, i would have expected that we would be permitting some by 2. heck, i know that when i was her age i saw sesame st., mr. rogers, and the elec. co. 5 x a week. that is 2 hours a weekday. and i don't think mr. rogers is awful. but in observing how actively engaged she is with the world, we have fallen so passionately in love with that trait we don't want to do anything to turn it off. so that is where we are. we both sort of expect that she will get screen time when she gets older -- i expect to be much more limiting about it than dh -- but for now we are anti-tv. back when i was interviewing at schs, no tv was one of my litmus tests -- it was on par, for me, with not smoking. now before any tv-permitting parents get their panties into a twist, let me clarify that i think there isa very huge difference between a parent permitting tv and sch permitting it. if i were to turn on tv as a distraction so i could do something i deemed more important, that is my perogative as a parent balancing conflicting needs. however, the teachers are paid to have needs higher than the kids'. so i wigged out, and had not 1 but 2 miserable conversations iwth the director. i have never liked her one bit -- i interviewed with, and fell in love with her predecessor, a very down-to-earth phd in education who wore tweed and no makeup. this woman is dressed to the 9s with the perfectly coiffed blonde of a manhattan socialite -- her purpose is to improve exmissions with private schools in the most elite neighborhood in town, as opposed to teh second most elite, where many graduates go. as we are committed to pub sch for many reasons, her raison d etre does not interest me. she also just rubs me the wrong way, but i sometimes just get that feeling around don't hate me because i'm beautiful superrich people (my class issues, i know). i didn't talk to the teacher because she was with other colleagues, a lot of them, and i didn't want to bawl her out in front of them, yk? but i feel like i was deceptive because i said something like "okay" -- i was in shock -- but then complained to her boss. the good news is that the 2 parents i have spoken with are as shocked and as horrified about this as i am and are committed to doing something about it. further good news is that there is zero percent chance that this will happen next year if she stays in the sch because the 2 of the 3 teachers are anti-tv to the point where they want all of teh parents to remove them from their home. (this year's head teacher wants all parents to throw away their strollers, because she is big into strength and endurance. i haven't, but i love her point, and i make a point of using ours only once a week, and i do think her stron gposition on that keeps me on the right path.)

so any advice on how to handle this tomorrow?? dh and another parent, who is way way way more anti-tv than i but who also is a heck of a lot more politic -- she is a professor of education and her job is to observe and train teachers so she is perhaps better at communicating with them than i am -- i find communication with them not nearly so fraught as my nanny -- it is just a much more prof'l relationship -- but still way loaded because they have my baby all day -- not that i think they would ever hurt her but it might deter intangibles like communication with me... i feel like given that i have alreadhy spoken with the director -- and she clearly thinks i'm nuts, creating a luddite, etc.: nothing could be further from the truth: my husband's dissertation was on community groups' use of the internet for political organizing -- clearly we use technology -- look at how i met all of you! anyway now that i have spoken with the director we should speak with the teacher tomorrow am. the other mother and dh think we should wait for curriculum night, which is wednesday, and which is specifically devoted to such issues. dh thinks we can organize by wednesday and if there are enough parents saying no way they will not do it again. now the director;s position is that it happens fewer than 5 times a year. dh thinks if it is that infrequent dd can just be put in with the 3 yos for those half hours and that can be our backup accommodation demand (assuming we can't get the 2 yo teachers to promise no screen time ever). i do not love that solution although she has a close friend in the 3 yo class and would probably experience it as a special treat. i guess for me different was always treated as bad so it is hard for me to conceptualize how such an arrangement would feel to her.

i guess i feel horribly guilty about working in general but i felt good that she was in such a high-quality place but then to have this -- i just feel like tv, like smoking or time-outs or corporal punishment -- is a hallmark of poor quality childcare. and that somehow this infects the whole school -- which is crazy, i know (come on, talk me down people) it can't erase the other million and one wonderful things about the sch, in the same way that when i raise my voice it doesn't erase all of the other connections i have with her. wow, this is really all over the place, i am way less freaked than i was friday night but i am obviously still processing it.

and then there is the crisis about future years. if she is to apply to other schs, i need to take off work tomorrow or tuesday and do applications all day. i also have to arrange to get her a stanford-binet and a wipsii like yesterday. dh's point is that we know the 3 yo class is tv-free and the teachers are so wonderful, so can't we just chill on that. also he says he has no objections to dvds at 4 as long as they are a component of the curriculum -- which would make ore sense if they were watching jaques costeau but not dora. (their comeback will be that they are teaching spanish, per my request.)

okay, i am going to go into denial again and read a novel. will someone please tell me i am not foreclosing my child's educational future.


----------



## PiePie

*shanna,* _connection parenting_ by pam leo is great on balancing mom's needs vs. balancing kids' needs.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Pie Pie, I can't post long because Fenton is about to color on the laptop with a sharpie







. But I wanted to say
1) I'd be upset about the TV watching too - you're absolute right about the difference between parent ok'ed and school ok'ed, when they specifically said they don't do it. Plus, I think in a perfect world no one would watch anyway, so I applaud you for having stuck to it.







You shouldn't be undermined by your school who professed equal committment.
2) Lorelei isn't getting less because you work. She gets to see her mama serve the rest of the world instead of just her family, something that SAHMs struggle so hard against. She's happy, curious and knows she's loved. You're doing a _great_ job.
3) The money/education issues are more complicated, I'll try to write more later - we're struggling with this too, but on a much smaller (Midwestern) level. Be back soon, unless I am pushing a baby out. Or at the Olive Garden. The two options for tonight


----------



## ~Shanna~

My son just told me to get lost for the first time







. We were in the office and I asked him if he wanted to come downstairs to help me fix the queen from his chess set (trying to entice him with glue projects always works to get him away from the computer and other equipment). He told me no, that he wanted me to go downstairs and him to stay in the office. Puzzled, I started to walk out to see what his plan was and saw him go right for the iPod I'd just told him not to play with







He laughed when he saw I was watching.
You can't help but admire how they put it all together







Yesterday he called to me from the living room to "come see what I'm doing" and then he cheerfully showed me how he was standing on the rocking chair arm like I'd just told him not to do







. This child is too proud to be secretive when he's doing something forbidden. God help me









And....we have a mouse again. My efforts to beat back nature are fruitless


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, i love you.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*shanna*, i love you.

I know, right?









Shanna, is today your due date (or one of them)? If so, happy due date.









how did your gbs screening go? just curious.

taking care of sick toddler and sick husband today. i'm just waiting for it to hit me, just in time for him to feel better and go back to work. Actually, dd seems to be better already (







) after just getting sick last night - funny how that works.


----------



## witchygrrl

That's sooo funny about Fenton! And you are just about there, Shanna....how exciting!

Rhea's language is starting to explode. She's picking up so much









Okay, I feel like I'm getting way too oversensitive about what MIL does, but sometimes, she really drives me batty. We saw her this weekend, and wanted to give Rhea food, and asked me about every little thing. Now we keep telling her about how varied Rhea's diet is at this point. Does she have to ask me about pears and cinnamon? Really?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Pie Pie, I can't post long because Fenton is about to color on the laptop with a sharpie







. But I wanted to say
1) I'd be upset about the TV watching too - you're absolute right about the difference between parent ok'ed and school ok'ed, when they specifically said they don't do it. Plus, I think in a perfect world no one would watch anyway, so I applaud you for having stuck to it.







You shouldn't be undermined by your school who professed equal committment.
2) Lorelei isn't getting less because you work. She gets to see her mama serve the rest of the world instead of just her family, something that SAHMs struggle so hard against. She's happy, curious and knows she's loved. You're doing a _great_ job.
3) The money/education issues are more complicated, I'll try to write more later - we're struggling with this too, but on a much smaller (Midwestern) level. Be back soon, unless I am pushing a baby out. Or at the Olive Garden. The two options for tonight 

This woman is really smart. We're blessed to have her. So sad that she's probably about to go on hiatus. Lucky she's got a good excuse!









*PiePie* - don't forget all the research suggesting that educational outcomes are equally, if not more, a product of the home environment. I cannot imagine being in the pressure cooker of NYC schooling so don't presume to know what it's like but knowing what I do of you and DH and your values, I imagine that Lorelei is being provided so many awesome developmental and learning experiences that will be of far greater value than you even realise.

It really sucks that she's 2 and you already have to be thinking about this stuff. The world has gone crazy.

Incidentally, I too would have been furious re the TV at childcare and I'm a bit lax on the no TV thing - Sebby definitely sees TV - not much or often and he never actively watches (though philosophically I'm all for no TV.) ANyway - I was thrilled and horrified to hear that childcare centres here are to be banned from TV showing. I cannot believe that they ever were allowed to.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Shanna, is today your due date (or one of them)? If so, happy due date.









how did your gbs screening go? just curious.

taking care of sick toddler and sick husband today. i'm just waiting for it to hit me, just in time for him to feel better and go back to work. Actually, dd seems to be better already (







) after just getting sick last night - funny how that works.

Due date was either Saturday or yesterday - I think yesterday. Not feeling anything yet, except that certain recreaational activities are nearly impossible now







. Comical. GBS screening......








I'm positive, though at least I didn't test positive in my urine in 1st trimester like I did with Fenton, so my microflora has gotten better. We're going to do hibicleanse at labor onset (rather than wait for risk factors, which we debated), both DH and I are in agreement. If it wasn't flu season, I think we'd wait for risk factors, but knowing that if Ku were to have a fever or other flu symptoms, we'd worry about meningitis....I'd rather not paint us into a corner. We're also going to culture breastmilk (kefir, yogurt) for Ku and give a little bit of that every so often. Everyone keeps telling me that using the hibicleanse doesn't affect baby's gut flora, but that just doesn't make sense to me, and when you have the history that Fenton and I have...I'll feel much better.

So much sympathy on taking care of two "babies" at once. DH is still coughing at night, and in my grumpy state it makes my head explode







. Fenton sleeping well with Daddy these days though







Oh, and funny story: We have a baby bucket carseat we borrowed for Ku, and we had to take the bucket out to fit a rug in the car on Sunday. Until we replaced the bucket in the car last night, Fenton kept telling me that the baby was going to be "so sad when she saw that we broke her carseat". He keeps referring to baby as a girl, so I'm intrigued. But he also says that he's "going to have a brother, Daddy's going to have a sister, and mama's going to have a baby". Dear god, please don't let three babies come out of my body....

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Rhea's language is starting to explode. She's picking up so much









Okay, I feel like I'm getting way too oversensitive about what MIL does, but sometimes, she really drives me batty. We saw her this weekend, and wanted to give Rhea food, and asked me about every little thing. Now we keep telling her about how varied Rhea's diet is at this point. Does she have to ask me about pears and cinnamon? Really?









Isn't that awesome when they're language just takes off? It's like it's overnight. Incidentally, I read a homeopath make an interesting observation that mild illness in children always precedes major developmental changes. I thought it was interesting. On your MIL, sounds like she's practicing some passive resistance to me







.

Nap difficult with Fenton again yesterday, I was calm and collected for 1 hour 15 and then I completely lost it. Screamed at him







. I need to figure out a better way....Good support and advice from DH over dinner last night - I'm so lucky that we each feel compassion for Fenton when the other one isn't.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'm obsessed with pooping today. Sorry, I can't tell this to anyone else. Anyone else have a terrible time with BMs after birth? It's just so....scary. I seem to think the more I poop now, the longer I have before I have to do it following birth


----------



## PiePie

So the school situation is solved. Although there will be fallout. Apparently a parent I had spoken with (I approached him a little out of the blue, although I had seen his wife using a lot of GD language once after school in Central Park -- their DS is 2 yrs older than DD and hence they have very little interaction), and I had spoken to the dad exactly once almost 12 mos. ago -- he set in motion (which means I set in motion) some complaints and organizing (by other parents? of older children? by anti-TV teachers in the 3 yo room? I don't know). Apparently there were like 30+ emails about it yesterday morning, which I am not on the in club enough to be bcc'd on, and the result is no tv/dvd/movie/whatever ever again. DH is very proud of me -- "You blew up the daycare1" were his last words before falling asleep. I totally got the cold shoulder from the teachers, including last year's teachers, at pick-up, so that is the fallout. Plus I will really really really never like the director for how she treated me, even though she has reversed course. What I would love to know is whether she reversed course because other parents complained in enough numbers (the what you are doing Shanna pointed to -- ie., organizing) or that they were donors (i.e., who you are). One parent in DD's class last year coincidentally gave $600K at the time of her application to ensure that her DD got in. We are not in a position to be able to do that, ever. Although I swore up down sideways backwards and forwards I would be on all sorts of committees when we applied, I have done relatively little of the parents' activities -- it is either PTA meetings during my workday (when I have to be at work -- do I really want to use my vacation time for that), or wine tastings in the evenings (when I want to be with DD), or things like buy a Christmas present for a needy child at our "sister school," with most gifts on the list $300+, which is more than I spend on my own child, or get together with the other parents and wrap said gifts which means missing my own kid and basically the thought of it makes me feel like I have woken up as a Stepford wife and will be exposed soon (pretty wrapping is not a strength). So the dad I complained to is running the sch's big fundraiser. Will try to get him to forward me the emails because I am dying to know the inside scoop. A little tricky since I only know him as [kid's name]'s dad.









As a legal matter, NYC has what is considered a model policy: no TV for kids under 2, no commercials for any age ever, kids 2+ can have half an hour a day of "educational programming" (this would include Dora). Which means that literally every in-home family daycare I looked or heard about should have its license revoked, and legally they were within their limits, and that we are behind Australia, but of course.

OK, now on to a productive day at work.


----------



## farmama

not lurking to keep an eye on Shanna


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm obsessed with pooping today. Sorry, I can't tell this to anyone else. Anyone else have a terrible time with BMs after birth? It's just so....scary. I seem to think the more I poop now, the longer I have before I have to do it following birth









I remember being told to not be afraid of pooping after birth. So of course I was.







It took me a few days before things started getting back to normal, for sure.

Hoping labor comes soon and is peaceful...


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm obsessed with pooping today. Sorry, I can't tell this to anyone else. Anyone else have a terrible time with BMs after birth? It's just so....scary. I seem to think the more I poop now, the longer I have before I have to do it following birth









I was really worried the first time, but it turned out okay. Nice and um...soft. I drank prune juice and ate prunes in the days leading up to the birth and right afterward. Also drank lots of water. Did the same thing this time and it was okay. Still some constipation in the week after the birth, but it wasn't too bad coming out.







Sorry for the TMI. You had a tough time last time didn't you? I hope it's better for you this time.







I also thought the more I poop now, the less I'll have to go later.









Complaint:
Taking care of two kids is hard! Jaim is getting fussy. Not as bad as Maev was, but definitely in the last 4 days (exactly when Maev became fussy), he's been crying a lot more. My overactive letdown and the cold that Maev gave him isn't helping. I think my letdown was the cause of most of Maev's crying. Nice thing is Jaim can usually be consoled(sp?). Maev was inconsolable many times. Really need to find a good sling I can nurse in...


----------



## Maela

Cute story:
At the dr's office today, the nurse asked Maev if she helped to feed her baby brother. Maev gave her a weird look and said "no." The nurse asked why and Maev said, "Because I don't have nipples" with a duh! look on her face. Then she added, "I have nipples for my dolls though!"


----------



## PiePie

maev is really funny


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Cute story:
At the dr's office today, the nurse asked Maev if she helped to feed her baby brother. Maev gave her a weird look and said "no." The nurse asked why and Maev said, "Because I don't have nipples" with a duh! look on her face. Then she added, "I have nipples for my dolls though!"











Really wanting this baby to come out. Not particularly uncomfortable, just tired from being on high-alert all the time (thinking of my exit strategy in any situation, keeping the house in better shape than normal so we can start with a respite, worrying every time DH goes to class an hour away, etc.). Shocked this baby is coming later than I expected, as I'm certain he or she is bigger than Fenton was







. Got some brand spankin-new stretch marks!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 









Really wanting this baby to come out. Not particularly uncomfortable, just tired from being on high-alert all the time (thinking of my exit strategy in any situation, keeping the house in better shape than normal so we can start with a respite, worrying every time DH goes to class an hour away, etc.). Shocked this baby is coming later than I expected, as I'm certain he or she is bigger than Fenton was







. Got some brand spankin-new stretch marks!


I understand. Hopefully he/she comes soon!

I also got some new stretch marks this time. My tummy looks great!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 

Hoping labor comes soon and is peaceful...

This, too.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
Cute story:
At the dr's office today, the nurse asked Maev if she helped to feed her baby brother. Maev gave her a weird look and said "no." The nurse asked why and Maev said, "Because I don't have nipples" with a duh! look on her face. Then she added, "I have nipples for my dolls though!"

Maev is awesome.









to J, mine are called "nurses"; but Dada has three belly buttons.







The other day after she finished nursing she kissed my nipple.







She's really into kissing, she lines up all her stuffed animals and kisses and hugs them. when she hurts herself, she asks us to kiss her hand - doesn't matter if she hurt her toe.

So I was right and wrong. I picked up this virus this morning; but thankfully DH stayed home to take care of us. So uncharacteristic, I actually even feel bad.

Witchygrrl, my MIL drives me crazy too. She's just _so_ negative sometimes.


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, way too funny. Maev's hilarious. Couldn't have said it better myself









cking, that's adorable. Rhea rarely gives kisses., though sometimes she'll lean in open-mouthed








I always tell her we're not making out, and then she giggles. Such a silly girl. But now she's into dramatic hugs, complete with sound effects.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Maev*, you're divine!

I just threw an infant book out that showed a bottle, with the caption 'milk' underneath.









*cking* - I remember when I was pregnant or Sebby was very young you said something about feeding J while she was standing up. Just now, I was sitting on the couch and up cruised Sebby, pulled my top down, and latched on. There he stayed, standing the whole time, for 10 minutes. I thought of you immediately.

I cannot believe my kid is this big already!!!!!! 10 months yesterday - we're already planning his 1st birthday party!

And waaaaaaay off topic but *PiePie* - have you been watching greys? i'm loving it.


----------



## PiePie

Yes, I am watching Greys. Although will miss the next 2 weeks because will be in Puerto Rico. We watch it on hulu.com so it's a day late. OMG I think I hear DD.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 









not lurking to keep an eye on Shanna









ditto









And I didn't have a pooping problem. It was a little tricky but nothing like pushing a baby!

Back to homework.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
Although will miss the next 2 weeks because will be in Puerto Rico.









How have you _not_ mentioned this???? Have a _great_ time!!!!! Is it for work, or for fun?

No baby yet.....Feeling impatient, yet scared. Not as scared as I was last time though. But you know how everyone talks about what a blessing it is that you forget the pain? It also means that you can't remember how you did it last time. I feel so unprepared all of a sudden. Trying to remember that last time i felt very calm, never even considered wanting pain medication, and that I was genuinely surprised when Fenton was actually coming out "so soon". Still, Im feeling nervous, little cagey like I can't believe there's only one way out.


----------



## Maela

You'll do great Shanna!







I felt the same way, but when the time came, I was just excited to meet him.


----------



## Maela

PiePie, I am jealous!


----------



## Maela

I think I'm done bleeding, after only 2.5 weeks pp! Woo hoo! Last time it was close to 7 weeks before it went away.

I'm feeling just about back to normal. I can sit cross-legged and even squat!







Still being a little careful not to push it of course...


----------



## PiePie

*maela*, i would trade this vacay for a viable pregnancy. sigh. had fascinating discussion with dh tonight about his feelings about m/c and ttc'ing. it seems that he cannot think of it as a death because death is too awful to him. perhaps because i am christian, i do feel that death is part of the cycle of life, and while i would prefer to have my baby here with me, i can live with having a dead child. dh simply can't. hence he won't participate in a burial, etc. also he is way scared to ttc again because he can't deal with me having another m/c. he would rather have just one than run the risk. i was aware of the risk always, so i don't see it the same way.

still unclear on what baby carrier i am bringing to pr. the frame backpack would be best for hiking the rainforest, but it is bulky and we are bringing the carseat, which is a huge pita.

okay, i have been procrastinating on packing for too long.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Almost 24 hrs since we've heard from Shanna...


----------



## ~Shanna~

Just lost my mucous seal.







Not feeling any action though.

I'd love to go into labor during daytime, so Fenton wasn't without us at night. But I doubt Ku is thinking about that.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*maela*, i would trade this vacay for a viable pregnancy. sigh. had fascinating discussion with dh tonight about his feelings about m/c and ttc'ing. it seems that he cannot think of it as a death because death is too awful to him. perhaps because i am christian, i do feel that death is part of the cycle of life, and while i would prefer to have my baby here with me, i can live with having a dead child. dh simply can't. hence he won't participate in a burial, etc. also he is way scared to ttc again because he can't deal with me having another m/c. he would rather have just one than run the risk. i was aware of the risk always, so i don't see it the same way.











ds's favorite time to be awake and alert: 4-6am


----------



## PiePie

Major oil refinery explosion just outside of San Juan, where we were supposed to fly into tonight and stay for the next week!!





















Not good....


----------



## cking

Yay mucous seal!
















piepie, oh no! Any alternatives?


----------



## PiePie

air quality where we are going to stay is so far unaffected, but it depends on the wind. we can't really change accommodations without losing $ so dh doesn't want to.


----------



## arelyn

Yay! You'll do great Shanna!


----------



## ~Shanna~

No baby, no contractions yet. Intermittent backache though.

And....
1) DH broke out in hives over about half his body last night
2)We lost power at our place for about 9 hours today

God keeps sending me the same memo over and over


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna. It was only 5 hours over here, but bedrest with no power is no fun. I'll be thinking and praying that the baby will come at the best time possible, dear.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
No baby, no contractions yet. Intermittent backache though.

And....
1) DH broke out in hives over about half his body last night
2)We lost power at our place for about 9 hours today

God keeps sending me the same memo over and over 

Oh boy...you do not want to go into labour now. I don't know if I ever mentioned it, but DP came down with shingles about an hour into my labour. Thank the stars we had a doula. Needy partners in labour are unbearable - even if the need is genuine!

Thinking of you xx

And thinking also of you Steph - looks like you're having a shitty time of it.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 







Shanna. It was only 5 hours over here, but bedrest with no power is no fun. I'll be thinking and praying that the baby will come at the best time possible, dear.

Steph, how did I miss you are on bedrest?







Point me to where I can read the story, I'm worried about you. I'm so sorry







.

Thinking of Pie Pie, hoping she's getting a restful vacation.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Oh boy...you do not want to go into labour now. I don't know if I ever mentioned it, but DP came down with shingles about an hour into my labour.

My first worry was that it was shingles, but luckily he says they aren't painful and don't even itch that often. It looks like hives from a drug reaction, which is almost impossible. My guess is that the stress finally caught up with him







. Which is funny how the body works, because he was much more stressed a week ago







.

I never knew that about your DP - it sort of makes sense. I often feel like I have an easier job, laboring, instead of having to watch my partner labor. I can't imagine having to watch DH go through that, not having any way of knowing that he's okay, that it's manageable....


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Needy partners in labour are unbearable - even if the need is genuine!









My sentiments precisely.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
And thinking also of you Steph - looks like you're having a shitty time of it.










Thank you! Right now, it sounds a lot worse than it is.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Steph, how did I miss you are on bedrest?







Point me to where I can read the story, I'm worried about you. I'm so sorry







.


You missed it because I've only been posting about it on Facebook. Short story: started spotting last Saturday (very light & pink-colored), hadn't stopped and got a tiny bit heavier by Tuesday. Called midwife who made several suggestions including ordering bedrest. My mom came and helped with DS Tuesday and Wednesday. Then we discovered that spotting seemed to be directly related to nursing







So, made decision to wean DS completely and sent him to grandma's for a few days in hopes that night-weaning would go more smoothly. Fortunately, the spotting stopped once he was gone (returned only briefly during a bowel movement and has been completely gone ever since), and grandma reports that he has been doing very well at night. He should be home either today or tomorrow depending on DH's work schedule.


----------



## Maela

Steph,







I'm glad to hear that you and Calvin are doing okay though.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Steph, I'm so sorry







. If it helps you at all, I have yet to meet a mama who is happy with how weaning went for them. We had to wean pretty cold-turkey too







Still breaks my heart when I think of it, but Fenton seemed to actually do better that way. Plus, I still let him "pretend" and he seems so happy to sit on my lap and put his mouth way up nearly on my clavical.

Starting to get uncomfortable. My pants won't stay up. I can't really complain, I'm not nearly as uncomfortable as most ladies I know even at 36 weeks. But I wrote a lot in my journal last night about how, when I was pregnant with Fenton, he got to see/feel all my best intentions for how I wanted to parent, and Ku is seeing and feeling me in all my realistic imperfections. Every time I lose it with Fenton, I mourn not just having lost it with Fenton but also that Ku is seeing this in me so early. A part of me feels like that's why he or she won't come out. I know it's melodramatic, and surely they can both sense how hard I strive.

Going to nap and cuddle my little monkey. I hope he doesn't get it in his head again today that it's funny to kick me....


----------



## cking

Steph, I'm sorry too. I saw your post about weaning but didn't know the rest of the story. I'm glad that you are both doing better so far.









Shanna,


----------



## ~Shanna~

Contractions coming ~every 7 minutes, getting a little more intense. I think probably today.

Going to take a nap.


----------



## cking

Shanna! I hope your nap is restful _and_ productive. Sending lots of peaceful labor vibes and keeping you in my prayers.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Contractions coming ~every 7 minutes, getting a little more intense. I think probably today.

Going to take a nap.











So exciting! Said a prayer for you, Shanna! Hope labor is going well!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Shanna! So much love and luck to you. Can't wait to hear all on the flipside!


----------



## farmama

Shanna,

















Wishing you a wonderful birth!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Still here. Contractions go to about 20 ish minutes apart when I'm resting, and I can still talk through them. Just sent the ILs home, thinking it's going to be a while. Not exhausted or in pain, just anxious to meet this little spirit. And to stop worrying about whether Fenton will wake up in the night to us being gone.







Oh, and to stop putting my toothbrush in a bag, taking it out....

He's doing great though, telling me all about everyone who is going to help the baby out







He went on a labor walk with me and kept handing me rocks, which is somehow hilarious when you're in labor









Managing to get last minute things done: laundry, dishes, changing sheets, feeding chickens. DH keeps admonishing me to stop being a hero, he honestly doesn't believe that it feels better in labor to have something to do







. He's being great though, going to work from home tomorrow if we're still plodding along.

Going to go to bed early.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Thanks for the update. Can't stop thinking about you. Hope it doesn't go on for too long. Good Luck!


----------



## Maela

Oooh shanna , how exciting!! Hopefully, it'll happen soon!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Leaving for birth center.


----------



## Sihaya

Yay, Shanna! Hope you were able to rest last night. I woke up several times thinking of you. Can't wait to hear about Ku's arrival


----------



## farmama




----------



## Maela

sending you happy labor vibes!


----------



## farmama

Not lurking.


----------



## witchygrrl

go Shanna go!


----------



## cking

Yay Shanna!









Wasn't Fenton born on the 26th? and a Monday?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Hoping that Ku is safely in your arms by now, Shanna. Can't wait to hear all about it.


----------



## charliemae




----------



## Maela

just checking in...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo




----------



## arelyn

Shanna: I certainly hope you're enjoying Ku right by now! Can't wait to hear all about it when you find a free minute!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Reece Porter G-- G-- was born yesterday!!!!!!
I'm in bed and working on his birth story - it was longer and harder than Fenton. I can't believe he's finally out! And that he's a he









AND:
9 lbs. And 4 ounces.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Yay Shanna!









Wasn't Fenton born on the 26th? and a Monday?

















I didn't put this together - you're right


----------



## Sihaya

*







Yay!!! Congratulations Shantana, DH, and Fenton! Welcome baby Reece!







*

I was so certain you had a baby girl in there. I was shocked when I found out you had a boy.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Reece Porter G-- G-- was born yesterday!!!!!!
I'm in bed and working on his birth story - it was longer and harder than Fenton. I can't believe he's finally out! And that he's a he









AND:
9 lbs. And 4 ounces.

































WELCOME Reece. I love the name (I have a nephew named Reece).

Rest and enjoy mamma!


----------



## Maela

CONGRATULATIONS SHANNA!! WELCOME REECE!!

I also like his name! How much did Fenton weigh?


----------



## Sihaya

Since Shanna might not be back for a while, I did some digging and Fenton was 7lbs 8oz. Wow! That's an almost 2lb difference


----------



## cking

Congratulations Shanna!!! Welcome Reece!!!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Since Shanna might not be back for a while, I did some digging and Fenton was 7lbs 8oz. Wow! That's an almost 2lb difference









Thanks, Steph. Wow!


----------



## TinyFrog

Congratulations Shanna! Welcome baby Reece!


----------



## witchygrrl

*Welcome baby Reece! Congrats Shanna!!!!*


----------



## arelyn

*Welcome baby Reece!!!*









Congrats Shanna, uh...DH, and Fenton!!!

2lbs more...holy moly!! Nice work!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Since Shanna might not be back for a while, I did some digging and Fenton was 7lbs 8oz. Wow! That's an almost 2lb difference









Yeah,







is right







I gained ~44 lbs this time around, compared to 25 with Fenton. But I was so food-restricted with Fenton that I was working so hard for every calorie. Calories came easier this time around









Waiting for my milk to come in, he seems hungry. But his latch looks great already







And, my best mundane news of yesterday: no stitches! Just a little skid mark! The delivery was so much harder, but I think the recovery will be easier between nursing and pooping. Just resting and writing his birth story (before I forget). We've decided to move his baptism to February, it made us feel better with regards to flu season. Select family coming tonight to see him, with strict orders to leave us alone for a while after that.

how is everyone else? Sihaya, is Calvin back? I've had good luck letting Fenton "pretend" to nurse, though we didn't start that right away - in truth, he'd probably forgotten how to nurse by the time we started that. But it seems to have filled the need for him, and we had to wean only a titch later in age than you guys are doing. I've been thinking of you, remembering how hard that was.

Our midwife was insistant that we have caregivers take Fenton out of the house for a few days after the birth - I agree that its better to get him out than to expect him to be gentle with me, but we've modified it so that he'll be with the ILs tomorrow and Friday, from after breakfast to after dinner. It was too much to have him gone right after being apart all day yesterday, and he's not ready to be gone overnight. Its been a combination of sweet and difficult having him here. He's very interested in his "Baby brudder", but he's also rambunctious. At lunch he leapt into bed with me, right in the middle of my soup, and woke Reece up. So yes, some time apart will be good too.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
how is everyone else? Sihaya, is Calvin back? I've had good luck letting Fenton "pretend" to nurse, though we didn't start that right away - in truth, he'd probably forgotten how to nurse by the time we started that. But it seems to have filled the need for him, and we had to wean only a titch later in age than you guys are doing. I've been thinking of you, remembering how hard that was.

Yep, he came back Sunday afternoon. He was gone 4 days/3 nights and I'm pretty sure it would be a lot of work to get him back to nursing again if we wanted to (a combination of my supply and his latch). Yesterday I let him look at, touch, and kiss the nursies. Today he pretended to nurse by licking the sides of my breasts a bit, but he kept gravitating toward the nipples, so I think I'm going to have to brainstorm a different way of pretending that also doesn't involve me being topless (as giving him access to my collarbone would).

Shanna, I don't want to intrude with an email or phone call, but if you need a break from Fenton that his grandparents can't provide, please call. Also, I know F's food restrictions make it impossible to ask for meals from a lot of people, but I am more than willing to work around your restrictions if you guys need a couple of meals here and there. My only limitation is not having a car unless DH is home.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Another beautiful boy Shanna! For some reason I knew, with no uncertainty, that Ku was a boy. Congratulations and welcome little [big] Reece Porter.









And exactly the same weight that Sebby was! HUGE. Be warned, at 10 months I'm lugging almost 29 pounds and 31 inches around. I'm terrified at what I could get with number 2!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Steph, glad to hear that DS is doing ok. I hope you're feeling alright about it too.


----------



## PiePie

honestly, i am a little scared at how big R is compared to F. I had read that the second child is an average of 3 oz. bigger, controlling for gender and gestational age. But R. is already off the charts! also surprised (and a little disheartened) to hear it was harder the second time around. on a happier note, i can tell from your BC webpage that at least you got the waterbirth you wanted. and i have heard that bigger babies latch better.

dh and i are doing very well, after a little blowup yesterday. thinking about gd'ing my husband.

has anyone read the emotion coaching literature (gottman, but i would also say how to talk to your kids to get them to listen) and if so what do you think of it? because in theory i am all DD has a right to her feelings, any feeling, but with DH I am like, get it together, stop getting so upset about every little thing! is that awful of me or what? his take on it is that he can't express his feelings per my restrictiveness so it comes out as explosion. i think any objective observer would see that he has a lot more of what he would call frustration and what i would call anger than the average bear. he is very passionate about everything and he just does not chill. i am trying to figure out what it would feel like for me to just listen and affirm his anger/frustration/disappointment. to me it feels like he is disturbing the peaceful envt i want for my dd. not that he is violent physically, it is just that his emotions feel so overwhelming to me. perhaps because i wrongly take responsibility for them when he doesn't want me to?

also thinking critically of a certain gd theory of tantrums which i will call the empty cup in pam leo's terminology. (dh's things feel like oral tantrums.) that theory, as i understand it, is that the tantrum is because of a bunch of stuff built up and the catalyst isn't the real cause. like a kid who is "good" in school all day and then melts down upon return from home, releasing pentup emotion from keeping it in all day. the theory is to just go with the tantrum and then reconnect and refill their cup of connectedness. but isn't that sort of like saying that the catalyst to the tantrum doesn't matter? because to dd is really does matter if she gets a whole food item or if it is cut up into pieces heaven forfend. usually i reconsider the importance of what she is demanding and often change my mind because i hadn't realized how important it was to her. with dh, the actual catalyst needs to be taken seriously on the surface (if i point out how trivial it is or disagree with him on the merits it just inflames him) -- this time, i entertained changing it but he was able to decide that it wasn't desirable to change it -- but the underlying issue is related only in his mind. but do i kind of need to get into the tantrum and engage with it to get there or do i just sit idly by while he vents a la pam leo or do i affirm his feelings a la how to talk to your kids.


----------



## accountclosed3

hi everyone. it's amazing that shanna's baby reece is already here. i'm SO behinD! CONGRATULATIONS!

ok, i love you guys, but evertything has gone crazY-busy here. so, i can't read or write as much as i want to!

first, vacation with aunt edna was great; hawk is an amazing traveller. weather was *perfect*.

second, got home to get the house ready for sale. our original deadline was last weekend, btu the rain put off the yard sales to sunday. my MIL made that a nightmare byu mixing our keep/use, keep/NZ, and keep/store piles with the SELL piles. she mostly tossed my stuff in. i learned a lot about it all through People of the Lie (a book. good.)

third, we got a painter who said he would strip paper and paint tues through fri this week. he was inexpensive too. he worked all day yesterday and 1/2 the day today, and then decided that he couldn't do it and needed to be in TN tomorrow. so, he left for TN. luckily, he didn't charge us, btu our house is a MESS. he stripped the paper in the kitchen and downstairs bathroom, and then half of it in our upstairs bathroom. and then LEFT.

so, we have to call the second painter who will come and finish the job, but may not be able to until next week. which sets us back two whole weeks. so annoying.

otherwise, everything is great. hawk has a little cough, but that's it. he's a fun one.


----------



## farmama

Congratulations Shanna!





















Welcome Reece!!























and a special one for Shanna...


----------



## TwilightJoy

Dancing fruit and veggies for Shanna and Reece!






















































































Congratulations and welcome!!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

I pooped yesterday!









Sorry to share, it's sort of big news for me. Er.....um


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I pooped yesterday!









Sorry to share, it's sort of big news for me. Er.....um


















yay!!! Seriously, this is big news for _me_ these days too.









Shanna, I loved your pictures on FB. Absolutely beautiful. I'm amazed at how much vernix Reece had!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I pooped yesterday!









Sorry to share, it's sort of big news for me. Er.....um


















Yay! I'm assuming it went well!!


----------



## TinyFrog

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I pooped yesterday!









Sorry to share, it's sort of big news for me. Er.....um


























Well, it is important!
















He's so adorable. And chubby!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Birth story

Milk came in yesterday am, feeling engorged but staying vigilant. Reece is a great nurser while nursing, but he's a better sleeper. I feel as though he's sleeping 23 hours/day. Pumping often, and I'm not sure my pump is working right. I remember it as being more efficient.

Pooping went great!







But I've been taking stool softeners - I wish I had done that last time. But have I mentioned the afterpains? Oh. My. God. I hate to take ibuprofen for them, but I'm tempted, having midwives bring over an afterpain remedy this afternoon (will share name when they remind me - worked great for right after birth). But I can see the wisdom of the greater pain - bleeding is tapering off much faster, per Maela's experience. They're so bad that I feel like I want to throw up for a brief second each time. And then, magically, they're gone.

Having a little tough time with an issue with Fenton. For a long time he's been getting worse and worse about diaper changes, running from me giggling, thrashing, making it literally impossible to get a diaper on the kid. This started....well, a year ago and has gotten worse (but not worse since Reece). In the past couple of months I've literally had to sit on him to get a dipe on him, and even then I'm getting a terrible fit and thus, leaks several times a day. It's such a violent wrestling match, so ineffective and so...frustrating doesn't begin to describe. I get so angry that I want to hurt him, especially when he thinks its devilishly funny. I'm down to my last two ideas: Going to try pullups that a friend lent me, and if they are absorbant enough, it could be enough to have a dipe that goes on like undies. But after a long talk with DH last night (because now he's feeling violent towards him, having dealt with it alone the past couple of days) and we're at a loss as to what a logical consequence for Fenton is in this situation. I feel like I've tried everything, and frankly this is a somewhat unique discipline issue because he must wear a diaper. He's still too unreliable to go naked.....So today we started a sticker chart. Theres no reward for the stickers, just the ritual of putting a sticker on a piece of paper if he's cooperative during a dipe change. But can anyone think of another good idea if this and the pull ups fail? I'm at a loss, and loathe to come to an action that is so damn contrived. But something has to give, I'm afraid I'm going to hit him.


----------



## ~Shanna~

PS Reece is so. damn. cute.









And Christina is right, the amount of vernix was astonishing. Worthy of it's own picture.


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna,







for pooping and your milk coming in







for the issue with Fenton.

I can only tell you what I've been doing with DS. He comes to me to let me know he needs his diaper changed. I say "I will change your diaper when you lay down" ad nauseum until he lays down calmly. If he doesn't lay down, he is choosing to stay in a wet/poopy diaper. When he lays down, I change his diaper as quickly as humanly possible. This has reduced the power struggles from every single diaper change to 1-2/day and some days none at all. We do deal with more diaper rash, but not enough to concern me and it's a tradeoff I am willing to make if it means I'm not screaming or being tempted to get physical.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
He comes to me to let me know he needs his diaper changed.

Wait....WHAT??!









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I say "I will change your diaper when you lay down" ad nauseum until he lays down calmly. If he doesn't lay down, he is choosing to stay in a wet/poopy diaper. When he lays down, I change his diaper as quickly as humanly possible. This has reduced the power struggles from every single diaper change to 1-2/day and some days none at all. We do deal with more diaper rash, but not enough to concern me and it's a tradeoff I am willing to make if it means I'm not screaming or being tempted to get physical.

Good advice, I'm going to have to think about this. I think for us it would mean going to disposies if we did this because his bladder is holding so much these days that the dipe won't hold if I have to wait for him. But this is interesting......and vastly superior to what we are doing.


----------



## Holiztic

Shanna,

Q's last 6 months or so in a diaper would have been the same, but here's what I did:

I got really good at doing "stand-up diapers". I brought the diaper to where he was and all he had to do was stand still. He was generally fine with it. Asking a toddler to lie down is about like asking him to go to sleep.

If you need notes on going a stand up diaper (with seventh generation disposables or anything with that kind of shape/closure), happy to oblige. I could have done it with cloth, too, if the cloth was already in the cover.


----------



## charliemae

Congrats Shanna!
I just had to say that I think the sticker chart is a great idea. It's hard to go to a reward system sometimes from an AP mindset, but some kids really need that validation to know that what they did was worth while. If he really hates it then it makes sense that he will need a little more to do it, and maybe even learn to enjoy it. I'm also really impressed that your sticker chart doesn't get any other reward. We do something similar in the 1st grade class I'm in now and the kids love it, and don't need anything more then the tangible acknowledgment that they did what was expected.


----------



## PiePie

wait, quinn is out of diapers?! we are nowhere near that. am confident it will be before 3 though.

like liz*,* i have been doing exclusively standing up diaper changes for what feels like forever, probably for 14 mos. or so. dh still does lying down for poop and standing up for pee. She poops only once a day so it isn't such an issue. as a point of reference, her classroom last year did lying down diaper changes (and she always would lie down for them!) but this year all of the children (who are all younger 2s) do it standing up. Unlike *Liz*, I often do bring her near the diapers, wipes, cream rather than bringing them to her. She fought it for a while and then it was over. It's a mystery.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Holiztic* 
I got really good at doing "stand-up diapers".

Ah, you validate my frustration. These issues are _with_ me doing stand-up dipe changes. For over a year now







.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Charliemae* 
I'm also really impressed that your sticker chart doesn't get any other reward..

We'll see where it gets me. My sister does rewards, but right now I feel like that's not a sustainable option. I considered giving him pennies for his piggy bank, until I realized, um, that's paying him for diaper changes









I'm hopeful for the pull-up option, I'll have to see how well that holds for him. But I'm definately intrigued with Sihayas suggestion. We have the best luck with Fenton when we are divorced from outcome, which I can't be with our current dipe setup. Thanks for the advice, and keep any new ideas coming.


----------



## Sihaya

Popping in to add that we use prefolds and covers at home and I just can't get them to work if he's standing. When we're out & about we use the one-size Bum Genius's and do stand-up changes exclusively unless he's poopy. We simply can't afford the number of diapers we would have to buy to switch from prefolds to exclusively BG's, especially if he's still in dipes in June.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
wait, quinn is out of diapers?! we are nowhere near that. am confident it will be before 3 though.

Well, Q was first out of diapers at 18 months. One morning I took of his night dipe and just decided to put sweat pants on (it was Nov). I said "If you need to go pee pee, take me to the bathroom and you can pee pee in the toilet like Mommy and Daddy" I then put him on the toilet (first time ever) and asked if he had any pee pee. He let a drop go. Throughout the next half hour I reminded him of what we were doing, but gently without pressure.

Then he soaked his sweat pants. Of course, I expected this. So I took him to the toilet and gently reminded him where his pee pee could go, I put him on, nothing came--it was all on his pants! So we put on new pants. Since I did this on the spur of the moment, I didn't have any underwear! The next one was a half hour later and all over his pants. No biggie, did the same thing. By the third, he let a little go (ounce or so) and then took me to the toilet and let the rest go in the toilet. Fast forward like this a day (dipe overnight of course, and stayed home all day) and he was getting about 80% in the toilet, the 20% not, but the 20% wasn't whole pees, just the little start of them---he was stopping himself and finishing in the toilet. Poop was never a problem, from the very first one, they all went in the toilet/potty with one or two exceptions when I didn't hear him calling for me.

By the one week mark he was totally potty trained, in underwear, and even dry at night. It was amazing. I was so not expecting it to be that easy. I guess he was just really ready.

Then he got a yeasty infection under his foreskin that made peeing hurt really badly. Only 1.5 weeks into using the toilet was just bad timing and he associated the pain with the toilet, so he went back in diapers full time for about 6 more months.

Then around his second b-day we got a couple "froggy" potties and started over, but much slower as he was showing some mild resistance. We stayed home for a week, went bottomless (okay, not "we"







) He already had the seeds planted, so he didn't have many accidents. Then we put underwear on (at home) diapers when we went out. Week by week we added something new. The third week I bought a travel potty for the van and started venturing out in underwear. I had him use the van potty every time we got out of the van (unless it had only been 10 minutes or so).

At first he was peeing little bits every 20 minutes or so. He also felt the poop coming but wasn't great about knowing it was ready. He wasn't too late, but always too early, so we'd make 3-5 trips to "Froggy" before the poop came. For a while I thought I was living in the bathroom!

But here we are at 30 months and he's just wearing a diaper at night, sometimes dry in the morning and sometimes not. He wears training undies from Hanna Andersson (just an extra layer of cotton in the pee zone) during the day and occasionally he lets a little (dime sized) bit go while procrastinating, but then he says "uh oh, I peed in my underwear" and he runs to Froggy.

I don't know why its been so easy for us. I have wild theories, but ultimately I think all kids are just different.


----------



## cking

Shanna, I really enjoyed your birth story. Thanks for sharing!

lurking on this potty discussion. Elizabeth, thanks for sharing your experience. I was hoping that's how it would go for us (like last fall for you). She has every sign of readiness, except for willingness to use the potty.







Our diaper changes probably aren't as bad as Fenton's, but there is usually at least one diaper-change-induced tantrum per day.







I like the idea of the froggy potty...I've been thinking we should try a more substantial potty (than our BBLP). I wish they sold these in the US.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Birth story

Milk came in yesterday am, feeling engorged but staying vigilant. Reece is a great nurser while nursing, but he's a better sleeper. I feel as though he's sleeping 23 hours/day. Pumping often, and I'm not sure my pump is working right. I remember it as being more efficient.

Pooping went great!







But I've been taking stool softeners - I wish I had done that last time. But have I mentioned the afterpains? Oh. My. God. I hate to take ibuprofen for them, but I'm tempted, having midwives bring over an afterpain remedy this afternoon (will share name when they remind me - worked great for right after birth). But I can see the wisdom of the greater pain - bleeding is tapering off much faster, per Maela's experience. They're so bad that I feel like I want to throw up for a brief second each time. And then, magically, they're gone.

The first few days when my milk came in (when I was pretty engorged), it was really hard for me to pump anything. I don't know why, there was obviously so much in there







. But then the pump worked better for me the next week.

Shanna, I am so glad pooping is going well for you.
I was having a perfectly normal time pooping for the first two weeks, and for some reason _now_ it's hurting! Can you get hemorrhoids days after the birth?? Yesterday and today it really hurt to go.







I'm not understanding. I haven't been eating very well lately, so that could be part of it. How do I know if I have hemorrhoids; do I have to look or feel around down there?







It makes me queasy just to think about it.









ETA: And I started bleeding again the next day after I thought I was finished.







Since then, I've been having a day every so often where there is absolutely no bleeding and then it starts up again (lightly). It's such a disappointment. This happened last time too.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
I was having a perfectly normal time pooping for the first two weeks, and for some reason _now_ it's hurting! Can you get hemorrhoids days after the birth?? Yesterday and today it really hurt to go.







I'm not understanding. I haven't been eating very well lately, so that could be part of it. How do I know if I have hemorrhoids; do I have to look or feel around down there?







It makes me queasy just to think about it.









These are a major problem for me right now.







I was hoping I would avoid them before the birth this time, but no go. I think food is a major part of it; i need and crave protein, but i know i need more fresh veggies and such. I totally understand not wanting to feel around down there. you might be able to just tell by the way you feel - itching? pain in sitting, etc? My mw gave me medication for them after J's birth...i needed help in applying it.







Anyway, it's totally possible to get them after the birth, mine certainly stayed around, and I believe that weak pc muscles help to prolong them. Sorry you're dealing with this too.


----------



## ~Shanna~

naking









Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
The first few days when my milk came in (when I was pretty engorged), it was really hard for me to pump anything. I don't know why, there was obviously so much in there







. But then the pump worked better for me the next week.

Shanna, I am so glad pooping is going well for you.
I was having a perfectly normal time pooping for the first two weeks, and for some reason _now_ it's hurting! Can you get hemorrhoids days after the birth?? Yesterday and today it really hurt to go.







I'm not understanding. I haven't been eating very well lately, so that could be part of it. How do I know if I have hemorrhoids; do I have to look or feel around down there?







It makes me queasy just to think about it.









ETA: And I started bleeding again the next day after I thought I was finished.







Since then, I've been having a day every so often where there is absolutely no bleeding and then it starts up again (lightly). It's such a disappointment. This happened last time too.

My pump is "working" now, interesting that you had same issue. I'm so sorry about thw bleeding - I've always heard this is a sign that you're doing too much, does that seem possible?

I struggled so much with getting enough fiber while pg (didn't taste good) and now (veggies not my caretakers forte, kind of putzy when he's taking care of 2 of us). I need to stop the stool softeners soon







. i'll miss them.

Highly recommend having this product around following birth.

Horrible sleep night with F last night. He finally went to bed at 4







He's acting like he's eaten something that triggers him, but damn if i can figure it out, especially with confounding factors. DH pretty frustrated.


----------



## ~Shanna~

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/31/bu...ef=todayspaper

I didn't know the new toy safety law affected thrift stores, anyone know any more?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Can anyone offer nursing bra shopping help here? Those bastards at Victorias Secret got me hooked and then yanked my fix....

Good sleep last night for Fenton! Afterpains getting.....well, better at least.


----------



## Maela

I hated the afterpains, which lasted about four days for me. I took the ibuprofen for the first three days, taking less each day. They still hurt a lot even with the medicine.


----------



## cking

Hmm, maybe it's the momnesia thing, but i don't remember afterpains being that bad...immediately after the birth they were, but not in the days after. I was taking Alleve...maybe it helped. And maybe the sore nipples distracted me? At any rate, it sounds like they get worse with subsequent births? Good to know. And thanks, Shanna, for the recommendation. I'll be sure to order some of that when i order my homebirth kit from that site.









Men are funny....after nineteen months DH still doesn't get it. He didn't realize the time change was tonight, and then he said o_h, so we get an extra hour of sleep?_ ha.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 

Men are funny....after nineteen months DH still doesn't get it. He didn't realize the time change was tonight, and then he said o_h, so we get an extra hour of sleep?_ ha.









DH and I have the discussion EVERY year!

Speaking of the extra hour of sleep. Its 5:45 and I'm awake, and not newly.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Mastitis symptoms







So disappointed, besides feeling terrible. My nipple on that side is hurting as bad as with Fenton. Praying this is temporary.


----------



## Maela

Shanna, I hope it goes away soon!







Not fun.


----------



## Maela

Jaim is crying more and more every day. Sometimes I feel like I'm losing it.







He's made me cry three nights in a row now. I start out every day trying to be positive and have a good attitude (he's pretty happy in the mornings), and I end it feeling horrible and so negative. I'm feeling sorry for myself because I never thought I would have two babies that cried so much. I thought after Maev, I would get an "easy" one. I wouldn't care if he wanted to nurse all day or even be held all day, but the inconsolable crying every night is really hard for me to deal with.

There must be something wrong with me to have two babies that are so fussy, right? I want to try changing my diet, but what should I eliminate first?

Maev's behavior is changing (regressing). She's had quite a few accidents lately and she's crying/screaming more often. I know she misses being the baby. She's always telling me, "But you're my little baby!"







I feel so bad for her; like I'm being an awful parent.

I told Dh that I cannot do this again. I know he wants three kids (I do too actually - maybe even more), but I can't take another four months of morning sickness and this newborn stage. It makes me into a bad mom. I can't take care of my other kids when I'm sick or trying to keep a baby from crying all the time. I hate the fact that Maev's going to have gone through almost a whole year of not having a mom that's really there for her.

the good thing is that if Jaim is like Maev was, then he'll be a pretty happy baby in 2-3 months. I just have to get through these next couple of months without going crazy.


----------



## Sihaya

*Shanna*,







for mastitis. I hope it gets better very quickly. I'm thinking of/praying for you.

*Maela*, I'm sorry to hear about Jaim's sleep issues and Maev's behavior issues. My thoughts and prayers are with you too, dear









*Me update:* After I was sure the spotting was gone and I'd done 7 days off bedrest, I started bleeding red flow (instead of the pink spotting I had before). Midwife wants me back on bedrest either until I miscarry or until we can listen with the doppler around 12 weeks (I'm 9.5 now). There's no good way to be on bedrest at home, so DS and I are going to stay with my mom for a while. Just wanted to give you all a head's up that I may not be around for a bit.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
*Shanna*,







for mastitis. I hope it gets better very quickly. I'm thinking of/praying for you.

*Maela*, I'm sorry to hear about Jaim's sleep issues and Maev's behavior issues. My thoughts and prayers are with you too, dear









*Me update:* After I was sure the spotting was gone and I'd done 7 days off bedrest, I started bleeding red flow (instead of the pink spotting I had before). Midwife wants me back on bedrest either until I miscarry or until we can listen with the doppler around 12 weeks (I'm 9.5 now). There's no good way to be on bedrest at home, so Calvin and I are going to stay with my mom for a while. Just wanted to give you all a head's up that I may not be around for a bit.

Oh no, Steph!














I hope things turn out all right and you hear that heartbeat in 2-3 weeks. And I hope your mom takes good care of you. I'll be thinking good thoughts for you.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Dark days on this thread







.

Maela, I have so much I want to say to you, I'll try to be back on later. But I wanted to







and say that I think I felt the same sense of entitement for an "easy" baby, and Reece is getting fussier than I think I deserve. As fussy as average, but still....And I know completely what you mean about turning into a bad mom. I grabbed Fenton by the arm yesterday to stop him from what he was doing







With teeth clenched.

Steph, I'm so sorry, I can't imagine how you're feeling right, being in limbo and wondering if you can prevent this. I'm praying that the bedrest helps.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Maela, try eliminating dairy to see if it helps. I think I've only met 1 nursing mom (who is open to the suggestion) who has been able to do cow dairy while nursing.


----------



## farmama

Steph,








s. Rest up-it's nice that you have your mom close.

Maela,

it has to be hard to divide your attention between two little ones who need you. Maev has an adjustment to make, too, but she will be thrilled (& irritated







) to have a baby brother soon enough. Jaim will be someone she will love and protect for her whole life-another member of her loving family. don't be too hard on yourself-it's a lot of work, and exhausting.

shanna-







no mastitis, no, no.


----------



## PiePie

oh no *steph*. thinking of you.

*maela*, i think it is too early to judge whether Maev will have an easy or hard adjustment. hang in there.

if anyone desires more upbeat distraction, please vote in my tao poll: http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1156760


----------



## PiePie

hey, we got pro photos of dd back from photog. pm me if you want the linky.

just took her to the grocery store for an overly ambitious attempt to stock up after vacay. whoa. i am in recovery from wrangling her.


----------



## Holiztic

First ER trip, ambulance and everything.

Only have a minute, but... He fell in the garage and whacked his forehead on a metal rod. 2 inch gash--6 stitches. They had to strap the poor lad into a cradle board/straight jacket thingy to sew him up. He was screaming and crying, of course, but just kept saying "I would like to get out please" (sobbing it, though). Heartbreaking! The little bugger's so strong it took 4 nurses to hold him down while they wrapped him. Did I mention heartbreaking? It was.

Now his eye is half swollen shut, but seriously, once he had his popsicle and was out of the ER, he was running and jumping around like nothing had ever happened.

We looked a motley crew, though. He was covered in blood, orange popsicle, and urine (peed himself in the straight jacket, even said/cried "mommy, I need to go pee pee" poor guy!) and me covered in blood. Standing out in front of the hospital waiting for DH to pick us up.

Funny thing about the TV and the popsicle: TV in the waiting room, Q says "what's that?" He sees our TV everyday, but its rarely on and if it is its always music. Tom and Jerry was on and he acted like he saw an alien!! He wasn't into it though! Wanted to read books instead!!!









When the nurse gave him a popsicle, he didn't even know to hold the stick, he just grabbed the frozen part and was surprised when it was cold.

I think the staff thought we were Amish or something









I have been thinking about all of you that are having a hard time, I do have to wonder what going on astrologically and such! Things will look up soon--I know it!


----------



## Maela

piepie, sent you a pm

Holiztic - how scary! and how sad that he had to be strapped down - it's especially hard when they're asking so nicely for something and you just can't give them what they want!







I'm glad to hear he's okay.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Oh boy. Not much niceness happening here. So sorry that everyone is struggling so much. Thinking of you all and sending you all love.

I'm in a miserable place too. Sebby is such hard work right now. We've just been away with friends for 5 days and they all agreed that Sebby is sooky and needy whenever he sees me. I've been saying this for weeks. We can be out and he can be having an awesome time - confident, happy, playing and talking to adults and other kids but the minute we're home or having a quiet moment together he loses it and starts whining and moaning as though he's being tortured. And if he's not needing me to hold him, then he's tearing the house up and constantly injuring himself (the kid can get the child locks open on all the kitchen draws and cupboards and keeps jamming fingers and hands) - which I know is normal but combined with the neediness, it's unbearable. Can anyone help with some support or suggestions? What am I doing wrong? Why so needy? Is this normal for a 10 month old?

I'm starting to think I've made the WRONG decision re work. My patience and energy and confidence is not what I thought it was. I cannot stand it when he's whinging. I am not being a nice Mama. I don't know if I can do this.


----------



## witchygrrl

a big







for everyone going through a tough time right now. weird how so many of us are struggling with one thing or another.

DH and I are fighting a lot over very minuscule stuff. then we apologize. then we fight about something else that's stupid. I sure hope we can get out of this cycle soon.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, dd had separation anxiety from 9-11 mos. it stopped the day she learned to walk.

*witchy*, i bet both you and dh are having a bit of trouble adjusting to the new work/childcare sched. it is stressful but worth it in the end. dd will have a much better relationship with dh at the end of this, i promise.


----------



## Sihaya

Oh, my! I'm thinking of everyone and am hoping this bad streak is over soon









I decided to go into the ER tomorrow and get an u/s. I will update as soon as we get back. Continued thoughts & prayers would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## witchygrrl

hoping for good news, Sihaya. many goodvibes your way.

PiePie, you're probably right. I know Rhea is thriving, though I fel bad that she sees us fight over so many things. I know it's better in many respects than keeping it all bottled up, but still.


----------



## Maela

Steph, thinking about you! I hope you're hearing good news right now.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Steph watch









Things are better here. Infection lasted 1 day, but I rested and it passed by the next day. Lots of pain in that side, but it's dissipating. Fenton with G&G today, and I missed him as soon as he was out the door. We went out to eat with Reece, it was nice to get out for an hour or so.

Holiztic, I'm so sorry for Quinn. It sounds like it was a nightmare - how is he doing now? Fenton talked about his ride in the ambulence for months, I dare say it was bitter sweet for him because he was both fascinated and scared. It's funny how common it is to hear people describe childhood stories that are horrid, and they laugh about it. You lose sight of how ghastly it was at the time.

Maela, how are things going? I want to offer some comfort on what you were feeling, and my own experience is showing that some days are horribly difficult, some days it all seems to "fit", but most days are a combination of moments. My worst moments come when Fenton is particularly wild/upset that seems to come from food reactions, do things seem particularly difficult when Jaim is fussy? His fussiness is likely to be very temporary, like you said - is it mostly evening fussiness? It seems like this could give some clue as to whether it is food related or not. Does white noise help? How's his poop and gassiness? Fenton was a bear in the evenings, and it seemed related to how his naps got shorter and shorter as the day went on - I think he was ready for bed much earlier than we thought. Anyone else have suggestions? Swaddling might work too.....I've had good luck with Reece, putting him in my lap facing me and sort of jiggling him just enough to make his head bob a little from side to side. He goes into a bit of a trance. Taking Fenton outside sometimes worked......Both boys have done better burping if I put them high up over my shoulder, so their tummy is pressing on my clavical/shoulder. Have you tried a swing? Gripe water......throwing out everything I have







Also wonder about.....teething. It seems early, but not for some kids.

MMM, I wish i had advice about a clingy "stage". Fenton's clingyness hasn't been in stages, more circumstantial. But it sounds like it's really common at this age, per Pie Pie. But that doesn't help in how to deal with it.









Had 4 of us in bed the other night. It was gorgeously beautiful, with me snuggling my newborn in front of me, and my older son cuddled against my back with his arm around my neck.....for about an hour. By hour two, Fenton had moved to have me in a headlock, and my newborns beautiful cooing sleep sounds were keeping me awake.







Reece and I headed to Fenton's bed, and I vowed that cosleeping with the whole family never works out for teh Mama, everyone in bed naturally seeks her out.

Christina, thanks for the bra rec, I'm wearing it now and love it.

Witchy,







on the marriage dynamic right now.


----------



## TinyFrog

Thinking good thoughts for you Steph.


----------



## Sihaya

Thanks, all!









The ultrasound showed a baby measuring 5 weeks. I was going to be 10 weeks tomorrow, so it looks like the baby had been gone for a while. The progesterone and other supplements I've been taking probably helped keep things going this long. I've stopped taking all those things and am going to take some herbs my mw recommended to get things going.

Thanks again for all the thoughts, prayers, and support. I am doing okay so far, and am a little relieved to have a second shot at the timing we had wanted, though I know it's going to be hard, especially since a good friend is due the same day I was


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

oh steph, sorry to hear that news. we're all here if you need a sounding board or a shoulder. thinking of you.


----------



## witchygrrl

so very sorry, steph. ditto what mmm said.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Steph, I'm so, so sorry. Everyone feels the poverty of their words at times like these....You're in my thoughts.

When the baby is ready to let go, a hot bath will help. Really, anything that helps during labor.







I seem to remember you have a shower instead of tub, please give a call if I can bring a hot water bottle or heating pad out to you.

Your baby knows they can come back when they're ready. I'm so sorry you have to say goodbye for now.


----------



## cking

I'm so sorry Steph.


----------



## PiePie

*witchy*, i have come to believe it is not whether the parents fight but how we do it that affects the child.

*steph*, oh this brings up so much for me. i disagree with *shanna* on the hot water bottle -- it will make you bleed more and won't affect how much of what needs to exit does, according to the nurse in the er. anyway, i really liked one book -- i can look up the title for you. and i wish someone had told me earlier to supplement with calcium! i had major moodiness for about a month afterward (until right before i got my cycle back -- coincidence? i doubt it) and i later learned that insofar as it was hormonal calcium can help even things out. also you will need a ton of rest -- you should arrange for dh to take calvin and just lie down for a couple of days, preferably with netflix selections and a laptop. it helped me some. xox


----------



## Sihaya

Thanks so much, everyone.

I am still at my mom's house, ostensibly so I can have someone watch DS 24-7 and also be able to rest and eat well and all that. But, since we found out the baby is gone I've felt like a huge burden. No idea if it's how she feels, but it seems like now that she's not making sure her grandchild is born healthy, my mom just doesn't want to take care of me anymore. I want to rest. I want time alone. I just want to veg out in front of the tv with the laptop exactly like you suggested, PiePie, but my mom and brother are getting exasperated that I'm not cooking and picking up after DS. They seem to think that because I don't have to be on bedrest for the baby anymore, I should just go back to normal immediately. It's frustrating. I appreciate that I can vent to you ladies here.

PiePie, I really appreciate the advice about Calcium. I was taking a cal/mag supplement and stopped taking everything but prenatals after we got back from the ER yesterday. I think I'll add the cal/mag back in tonight, and I should probably take my CLO and butter oil to help with depression. Sean will be coming over some time this weekend and I'm having him bring some liquid chlorophyll and the tincture that was made from DS's placenta. I'm hoping that all of those things will be some help.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Maela, how are things going? I want to offer some comfort on what you were feeling, and my own experience is showing that some days are horribly difficult, some days it all seems to "fit", but most days are a combination of moments. My worst moments come when Fenton is particularly wild/upset that seems to come from food reactions, do things seem particularly difficult when Jaim is fussy? His fussiness is likely to be very temporary, like you said - is it mostly evening fussiness? It seems like this could give some clue as to whether it is food related or not. Does white noise help? How's his poop and gassiness? Fenton was a bear in the evenings, and it seemed related to how his naps got shorter and shorter as the day went on - I think he was ready for bed much earlier than we thought. Anyone else have suggestions? Swaddling might work too.....I've had good luck with Reece, putting him in my lap facing me and sort of jiggling him just enough to make his head bob a little from side to side. He goes into a bit of a trance. Taking Fenton outside sometimes worked......Both boys have done better burping if I put them high up over my shoulder, so their tummy is pressing on my clavical/shoulder. Have you tried a swing? Gripe water......throwing out everything I have







Also wonder about.....teething. It seems early, but not for some kids.

Things are getting a little better - not really with Jaim's fussiness, but with mine and Dh's attitude toward it. I think we've come to terms with the fact that our second baby is like this too. So that seems to help. We've just accepted it. It is mostly evening (like after 4pm) fussiness, but sometimes it starts around noon. Haven't tried gripe water, what exactly is that? White noise helps a bit especially if we're bouncing on the exercise ball at the samw time and letting him suck on our finger. When he's like this, he'll be trying to suck on anything he can get in his mouth, but then he'll get "mad" if I try to nurse him for more than a minute. Maev did the EXACT same thing. Only, like I've said before, she was a lot harder to console.
And, you're right, it's the worst when Maev is also being needy/"unruly". She's going to through a phase right now where if I ask her to do anything, she says "No! I'll never _____." Which is funny, when you're not in the moment.









Oh, and I'm so glad the mastitis is already gone for you!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Thanks so much, everyone.

I am still at my mom's house, ostensibly so I can have someone watch Calvin 24-7 and also be able to rest and eat well and all that. But, since we found out the baby is gone I've felt like a huge burden. No idea if it's how she feels, but it seems like now that she's not making sure her grandchild is born healthy, my mom just doesn't want to take care of me anymore. I want to rest. I want time alone. I just want to veg out in front of the tv with the laptop exactly like you suggested, PiePie, but my mom and brother are getting exasperated that I'm not cooking and picking up after Calvin. They seem to think that because I don't have to be on bedrest for the baby anymore, I should just go back to normal immediately. It's frustrating. I appreciate that I can vent to you ladies here.

OMG, what is their problem?! I'm so sorry You're feeling like a burden! If anything you should be even more taken care right now. I wish we could all be there for you IRL!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Thanks so much, everyone.

I am still at my mom's house, ostensibly so I can have someone watch Calvin 24-7 and also be able to rest and eat well and all that. But, since we found out the baby is gone I've felt like a huge burden. No idea if it's how she feels, but it seems like now that she's not making sure her grandchild is born healthy, my mom just doesn't want to take care of me anymore. I want to rest. I want time alone. I just want to veg out in front of the tv with the laptop exactly like you suggested, PiePie, but my mom and brother are getting exasperated that I'm not cooking and picking up after Calvin. They seem to think that because I don't have to be on bedrest for the baby anymore, I should just go back to normal immediately. It's frustrating. I appreciate that I can vent to you ladies here.


Again, so reminiscent. I had this with DH too. He got when I was in physical distress but not the rest. It took my MW "prescribing" 2 days of nothing out of bed and lots of DVDs to get him to take care of me. She viewed this as a physical necessity.


----------



## witchygrrl

Sihaya, I can't believe they think you're a burden! I hope they can be there for you the way you need them too. It just makes teh whole thing worse, IMHO.









Dh's grandmother died this morning. Dh is okay--he's been long expecting it, but MIL is a wreck. This is not going to be a good weekend.


----------



## Maela

Is it okay that Jaim has been sleeping almost ALL DAY? He's been staying awake more during the day lately, so this is like it was back when he was really new. He doesn't seem to be hurting or anything and he was really happy and awake for an hour or so this morning, and now it's just nap, nap, nap... Not that I'm complaining...it's just weird.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Does anyone use a one-size cover with their cloth diapers? I'm looking for opinions over here.

Maela, did Maeve teethe early? The change in sleep pattern makes me wonder if there's something like that going on with Jaim. Definately sounds like a growth spurt at the very least - i can't believe how big he looks in the chair picture already. I just can't get over how fast it all goes







I had forgotten how sweet this newborn phase is. During crowning I said to DH, "I can't do this again. I just can't." Now I can't imagine this being the last time I do this.


----------



## Maela

No maev got her first tooth at ~6 months. I'm thinking maybe it's a growth spurt too. Although he did stay up late last night to get me back.















Hardly any fussing yesterday!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Witchy, I've been thinking of you and DH this weekend.









Tonight is my first night of getting both boys to bed on my own - this is necessary because DH works late on Sundays and has class late on Tuesdays. I don't even have a game plan. I thought I'd try to get Reece to sleep first, and prayed he stayed asleep for at least the hour it usually takes me to get Fenton down. But that hasn't worked the last few nights. I'll probably take Reece into Fenton's room with me, and that will work fine for when Reece is an immobile newborn. Not a long-term solution though.....I worried about this problem as soon as I was pregnant, and I can't believe I am _no_ closer to a solution, 10+ months later


----------



## Sihaya

Well, I'm back home again. Had a big fight with my mom and was told I was selfish and spoiled because all I had done all week was sit on the laptop in front of the tv and use the internet and play computer games. Silly me, I thought that was the whole idea behind staying with her







I know she has her own issues and I shouldn't take it personally, but I'm having a hard time feeling okay asking my "village" for help now since it was "only" an early miscarriage.

I'm really sorry not to have been offering more hugs or advice here, but you are all in my thoughts.


----------



## PiePie

oh *steph*. that is so hard. as i told you, i had similar issues with dh. i ultimately realized that i should have reached out more. honestly, for the first 3 weeks afterward i just wanted to crawl under a rock. but who would be supportive was just so unpredictable. it was crazy. in retrospect i see it was a bit like dating -- you have to cast a wide net so that the numbers work in favor of getting someone. i also had a hard time feeling like it was "just" a m/c -- a much earlier loss than a lot of the frequent posters on the loss forum here, for example. one thing that really helped me was to do a low-key trip out of town to stay with friends -- the change of scene really helped. maybe moving back home will do the trick for you. for me it was weeks of anger and low energy and self-absorption. and i can honestly say that it ended. not that i don't think about it -- i do -- but it's not the same dominant force in my life as before. it took a month, pretty much to the day.

okay, she needs to nurse, more later.

lmao -- the buzzer rang indicating someone trying to come in and dd said "food." she is going to be sad when people visit -- "you're not food."


----------



## PiePie

frivolous question here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...5#post14645215


----------



## cking

Steph, I'm sorry your mom treated you that way.


----------



## farmama

Steph,

I'm so sorry to hear about your loss, and your lack of support from your mom. I hope you can rest well at home for a bit.


----------



## PiePie

*steph*, the book i was thinking of is called _about what was lost_. and if you feel like crawling under a rock, that's normal.

who else is nursing a 2 yo?


----------



## TinyFrog

Oh Steph, I am so sorry for your loss. It is sad too that you were not given the proper environment to enable some healing. I fail to understand the modern day thinking. So sorry your "tribe" could not be there for you when you needed it.


----------



## Sihaya

Thanks, everyone. The good news is that after putting myself out there to about 20 friends, a few of them have volunteered to bring meals, take DS for a couple of hours, and one even came over and helped wash our dishes today (we don't have a dishwasher and every dish in our house was dirty). Several different ladies even thanked me for asking for help, which really diminished the feeling of taking advantage of people.

Thanks for the book rec, PiePie.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Thanks, everyone. The good news is that after putting myself out there to about 20 friends, a few of them have volunteered to bring meals, take Calvin for a couple of hours, and one even came over and helped wash our dishes today (we don't have a dishwasher and every dish in our house was dirty). Several different ladies even thanked me for asking for help, which really diminished the feeling of taking advantage of people.

Thanks for the book rec, PiePie.

This is good to read Steph. It's so hard to ask for help - and I imagine even harder after the response you had from your mother.xo

So HOT here folks. Just like when S was newborn. We're cooped up in the house with every blind and window closed. We're in for a killer summer if this is November. What do you do during the day with an almost toddler when it's too hot to leave the house? Currently he's playing with containers of water on the kitchen floor. Fun and cool but not many minutes worth of entertainment in that!


----------



## farmama

Quote:

who else is nursing a 2 yo?
me! me!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
who else is nursing a 2 yo?

me too; although it's only once a day before bed and I'm planning on weaning completely in January.


----------



## Maela

MMM, we would play outside with a container full of water. Usually at some point she would get in it too. If you have a shady tree to do this under, it's a lot of fun for a good half hour or more. And we'd go outside for walks or to work on the yard early in the morning (like 8-9AM) before it got too hot. Also do you have an air-conditioned bookstore/library nearby that you could go to for an hour or so? Maev always loves that. During the hottest hours we'd stay inside and play with her toys/read books. When I was pregnant we'd watch movies.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 

who else is nursing a 2 yo?

Still nursing
some days it's








other days it's









Hugs Steph. Glad you found ladies who were happy to help out!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Good ideas, thanks Maela. Playing in the garden and tending the vegie patch in the early morning on these days is my complete joy. So is going to the pool at the end of the day! Now if only I could find enough inside activities between 9 and 5! But your library suggestion is a good one - and works beautifully with the pool plan because it's across the road! We also spent the 20 bucks and got him a clam shell splash pool which he thinks is pretty cool!


----------



## PiePie

arelyn said:


> Still nursing
> some days it's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other days it's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/QUOTE
> 
> yes, or rather, it's both at different times of the same day.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

DS is almost 2.5 now and still nursing quite a bit. We just started night weaning a few weeks ago. (Nurse to sleep and then bubbies go to bed until the sun comes up.) Which has resulted in a couple nights of him waking up and crying and me having to walk with him, get him some water, etc. But for the most part he's started sleeping through. [Which is about 8 hours, since the sun comes up well before we get up & he goes to bed late]
We don't nurse at activities anymore (except church, doctor's waiting rooms, etc. when I just need him to be still and quiet whatever it takes) so On busy days he may not nurse at all, takes cat naps in the car. But when we are home he nurses at least every hour and takes 2+ hour naps in my lap or in bed with me where he dream feeds almost the whole time.

Sometimes I get tired of it. but overall am pretty glad he is still nursing. Especially with all the colds and everything, it really seems to help him not get hit so hard. He had H1N1 flu in August and it was so mild compared to DH and the man who lives with us.
Also it's the fastest way to diffuse a meltdown.


----------



## Maela

Ugh, I didn't think about H1N1. Maybe January would be a bad time to wean? Or does nursing once a day for 3 minutes even help?
I'm just really ready to be done nursing her. I've never had a problem seeing people nurse their 2 yo's and older, and I thought I would be fine going to 3yo with my own; but lately she just seems so old. It doesn't feel right, and it bothers me.







It might just be having a newborn to compare her to, but if I still feel the same way in December, we'll be weaning completely in January.

Dh is cleaning our bathrooms right now!







They haven't been cleaned since the day before Jaim was born.


----------



## PiePie

i have been having mixed feelings on weaning/ebf. i know that for me the first step is developing clarity about what i want. i now think that i am not ready to wean. i believe it is really important to her emotionally -- she kisses the boobs good-bye -- and i also have discerned that for me, as of today, the inconvenience (she is big, damn near impossible to nurse and carry without a sling, and front carries aren't sustainable for my back based on her weight, which is at least 25 pounds. even sitting on the subway with her facing me means her feetsies intrude into the space belonging to the people on either side of us. but i love lying in bed with her nursing her and feeling her warmth as she falls asleep on my arm -- that feeling is the meaning of life! and i do love how quickly it diuffses a meltdown. i think it is 1 reason my kid has hardly any tantrums compared to most 2 yos.

in other, certainly related news, bfn this morning.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Oh my stars, this is a hard job. DS is kicking my ass. I am not being a patient, gentle, calm parent right now. My kid is on the verge of walking and I am really hoping that the screaming is frustration which will dissipate as soon as that happens. What I'm fearful of is that this is what our toddler years are going to look like. He has a shocking temper. He's back to waking every hour all night long. He only naps in a moving car. I am not going to survive.

I have just put him in his crib - where he NEVER goes, has never slept - and closed the door. I am letting my baby scream and I hate it but I can't do anything else.

Tell me it gets better.


----------



## farmama

it _does_ get better. N is like that before every physical break through-she's easily frustrated and takes it out on mama. I, too, have had my leave them somewhere safe and walk away moments. it's completely overwhelming.


----------



## Maela

MMM -














You _are_ a good parent. I *try* to remind myself during hard times such as these that it will all change in a few days or at least weeks. Usually I get so upset because I am thinking that this is how it's going to be for the rest of my life and then I remember he/she will probably change in days/weeks. The great thing about parenting is that things change so often! What's hard one month changes to something else being hard the next month. I know that's really hard to remember _during_ the rough times, though. I'm working on that right now.







I just keep telling myself _this too shall pass_.

right now Dh and I are in complete agreement that we will only have two kids. Maybe we'll change our minds in a couple of years. I don't think so...


----------



## witchygrrl

MMM, a big







It does feel completely overwhelming when you can't seem to solve their needs, no matter what. It will pass, I promise.


----------



## PiePie

*mujerista*, the toddler years are terrific, be not afraid. a bit of perspective: the time is nigh when he will no longer look like a baby, so get that shutter clicking mamacita!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*mujerista*, the toddler years are terrific, be not afraid. a bit of perspective: the time is nigh when he will no longer look like a baby, so get that shutter clicking mamacita!

I agree!!

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've started trying ECing with Jaim today. Two accidents so far. No catches. We just started an hour ago.









*ZB,* what's your favorite pottying position for Hawk? I'm finding it's different with boys. with maev I sat backwards on the toilet with her facing away from me and kind of leaning back into my chest so she wouldn't flop foward. but with Jaim I'm thinking that'll just make a mess.


----------



## Maela

First pee catch ever with Jaim a few minutes ago!!


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

You women are so awesome. Thanks for your support. The last two days have been much better and I'm feeling a bit more capable.

Went into (ex) work today for a committee meeting. This Monday was my official return date. I'm still not sure if resigning was the right thing to do. Walking in there made me feel sick in a sad and regretful way. I think I'm going to check out the openings in my field...maybe...

I am not ready to be a grown-up and make all these decisions. It's hard!


----------



## PiePie

wow i am amazed you are able to feel a longing to be back at work. at that point i wanted to be all dd, all the time. but going back to work (as i did at 7 3/4 mos.) and realizing that that part of my brain still functioned was an ego boost... i think it is a testament to how much you love your field that you are even contemplating it.


----------



## accountclosed3

when i potty hawk, i just hold him over it, him facing the back. i used the sing for a long time when he was little, and a small container (a square one from wipes because it was easier to hold between my knees. he's too big for that now, though).

we sold our house and are moving out Dec 18. we hope that the visa comes through between now and then. it should, so long as the FBI cooperates. ryan's finger prints didn't take the first time, so we're in our second processing with that. once that comes through, they can process us completely.

can't wait!


----------



## PiePie

huge stuff zoe. congrats on selling the house. you sound like you are thriving on all that change! the thought of all that curls my tummy. i'm kind of craving stability now.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
when i potty hawk, i just hold him over it, him facing the back. i used the sing for a long time when he was little, and a small container (a square one from wipes because it was easier to hold between my knees. he's too big for that now, though).

we sold our house and are moving out Dec 18. we hope that the visa comes through between now and then. it should, so long as the FBI cooperates. ryan's finger prints didn't take the first time, so we're in our second processing with that. once that comes through, they can process us completely.

can't wait!

congrats!!!


----------



## Sihaya

*Zoebird* - Congratulations and best of luck in having everything line up for you.

*PiePie* - I wanted to thank you again for that book recommendation. I read half of it last night and it was the perfect thing.

Found out today that the friend who was due the same day I was lost her baby. Having a hard time not blaming myself and feeling like I somehow caused her baby to m/c too. We even both had the same issue (blighted ovum). I know it's illogical, but grief so often is


----------



## PiePie

*steph*, glad you liked it. for the first month or so, i just wanted to obsess on it, which i determined was healthy, i.e., not stuffing the grief down for it to come back later. that book was just right because no one wanted to talk about m/c as much as i did. i could also skip around to which stories felt more like me (some didn't, obviously). i was also relieved when a month passed and i was on to new things. in a weird way, i am much more chill about ttc'ing than i ever have been. i think that the m/c helped me be more accepting of not having control over everything.







not saying this will last -- i might be freaking out if i have month after month of failure, but right now i am optimistic.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Keeping in mind that Sebby has only 4 days btw his birthday and Christmas, what do you folks think are some must haves for him between now and age 2? Just in the process of putting a wish list together for him. I'm expecting people to buy him a birthday gift AND a christmas gift. I feel such guilt about his crappy b'day.

*Steph:* How do you make sure Calvin's b'day is properly observed?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*PiePie, Snozz* (where are you, Snozz?) and others might be interested in this piece - http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critic...urrentPage=all


----------



## AsYouWish

Thought I'd let you all know that I'm a graduate now.







I became a Mama to DonnaLucia S----- D----- on September 14th. She is a delight!







I just.....there aren't words. I just love her so much.

The birth was not a good experience. I ended up with a c-section, and not for lack of a stellar effort on the part of my midwife to try and give me the natural birth I wanted.....and not for lack of effort on my part either! I'm told I pushed nonstop for almost six hours, without ever experiencing even one second of relief, even between contractions. The baby was placing constant pressure on my bulging disc at L5-S1. Apparently, the pain was so extraordinary that my brain just blocked out the entire experience altogether: I have no memory at all of my 16 hour labor, and -- due to exhaustion -- can recall only fuzzy snippets of the birth itself. I wasn't even able to keep my eyes open when my daughter was first brought to me to kiss and admire. I couldn't stay awake to even look at my newborn daughter.









Then in post-op my head, then my shoulders, then my arms, hands and fingers, and then my torso started jerking and thrashing around uncontrollably. It was terrifying! It took quite a while for staff to figure out that I was reacting to the anti-nausea drug that was administered before I went into the OR. Already completely exhausted, I spent nearly three hours with my head and upper body thrashing around in repeated, non-stop spasms. And I wasn't able to hold my newborn daughter.









After a consult with a neurologist, valium was prescribed as the remedy to the apparent drug reaction. After the valium was administered through the IV line, it was only a matter of seconds really before all of the spastic craziness finally started to abate. What a relief!! I was finally able to hold DonnaLucia. But because of the drug, I wasn't able to immediately nurse my newborn daughter.









Once we made it up to our hospital room, DP and I spent a couple of hours snuggling our baby girl and celebrating and picture-taking with family. But by the time everyone left and the nurses prepared me for bed, I had been awake and/or laboring and/or in pain and/or convulsing for over 36 hours. Same went for DP (well except for the laboring/pain/convulsing part....but he was still exhausted). We decided it just wasn't safe to have DonnaLucia room-in with us, because we might not hear her if she cried. And I wasn't allowed to nurse her anyway because of the valium, so she spent her first night in the nursery (where they gave her formula that she apparently threw up all over the place







). Through her first night in the world, I wasn't able to hold and cuddle my newborn daughter.









Then, in the first 6 weeks after her birth, I stumbled along the edge of some scary Depression, all an extension of my experience during the pregnancy.







I still can't really talk about that; my current sense of wellness is just so fragile.

BUT....

I have a beautiful, strong, healthy baby girl. She's always so alert and relaxed. So much like her Daddy that way. She's just so content to be up and facing the world and looking around, taking it all in. And then when it is time to sleep, she sleeps deeply and soundly and hardly fusses at all. She is seriously an amazing sleeper! (The Universe must have thought it owed me one after a pregnancy plagued by major depression, anxiety, and grief, all followed by an awful birth experience and frightening post-partum.) Breastfeeding is going great too, and DonnaLucia is turning into quite the little Chunky Monkey. I feel so humbled and honored that I get to be the source of nourishment to this amazing little person.









I am so thankful. So thankful.

My daughter's birth story -- and the story of my birth as a mother -- is bookended by loss. It was only 18 days after my mom died that I found out I was pregnant. And this past Saturday, exactly 18 days after I finally and suddenly started to feel well and whole and happy and possibly even capable of motherhood, my NaNa died. My mother was 71 when she died after suffering for nearly a decade from Alzheimer's Disease. The illness stole so much of her memory that her body forgot how to live. My NaNa was 100 years, 1 month, 1 week, and 2 days old when she died. And she was sharp as a tack until almost right to the very end, when she died essentially of old age. The world is incomprehensible to me sometimes.

But all this loss, it only accentuates how grateful I am. So grateful that I knew those women, that I loved them and, especially, that I was loved by them. And so grateful that I know this new woman in my life, that I get to love her, and that by experiencing this sort of love -- in all of its fierce, animal intensity....in its seeming boundlessness -- I get to know how much those older women actually loved me. And I am so, so grateful. So thankful.

Despite the heartache of loss, it will be a good Thanksgiving. I hope you all enjoy your Thanksgiving, too.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Congratulations AsYouWish - and welcome DonnaLucia









Your story sounds horrific - I'm so sorry to hear it. Sending you all the healing in the world.


----------



## witchygrrl

AsYouWish, you've made it through quite the ordeal with the most beautful gift of your DonnaLucia. You are a strong woman. I am deeply sorry for your losses, but also glad that you have had such courage even through the dark.

Congratualations on your daughter. Thanks for updating us!


----------



## Maela

*As you wish*, Wow! I'm so sorry you had to go through that!








Congratulations though on your new little baby!! I really like her name. And I'm so glad to hear that bfing is going well for you two, even after the rough start.


----------



## Maela

Dare I say it? Don't tell him I told you this because he'll want to prove me wrong, but I think his fussiness is starting to go away. The last week he has been extremely less fussy at night than he used to be. The episodes of inconsolable crying haven't lasted more than a few minutes each night. Isn't it too early for this? He's not even two months yet. I stopped drinking milk and am using way less butter and eating way less cheese, but didn't give up dairy all together. I'll save the joy smilie for when I'm sure the fussiness is gone for good. for now,


----------



## cking

AsYouWish, congratulations on your baby girl. I'm sorry you had such a bad experience for the birth and the time surrounding it. I hope it continues to get better for you. So glad that breastfeeding is going well. And sorry about your Nana's death. It sounds like she had a full, wonderful life.









Maela, I remember reading that the fussiness typically peaks at 6 weeks. I think Jaim is just past that, right? Could be he's past the peak and on his way to being a very content child....







: for you.









MMM, trying to think of toys that J has come to really like in the past 6 months....
blocks - stacking, nesting, duplos, things of that sort
Little People or similar people/animals/play house/farm, etc.
dolls and stuffed animals
tool boxes, medical kit
wood puzzles
play tunnel (I think she'd love a tent to go with this too)

and she's really really ready for a play kitchen. we're planning to make one like this for her.

I also think she would really like a play broom & dustpan. Of course, she is happy improvising with the full size broom and the full size kitchen.


----------



## arelyn

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
when i potty hawk, i just hold him over it, him facing the back. i used the sing for a long time when he was little, and a small container (a square one from wipes because it was easier to hold between my knees. he's too big for that now, though).

we sold our house and are moving out Dec 18. we hope that the visa comes through between now and then. it should, so long as the FBI cooperates. ryan's finger prints didn't take the first time, so we're in our second processing with that. once that comes through, they can process us completely.

can't wait!

Hooray! I'm excited for you! It makes my travel bug start nipping me.

To potty little Kai I did pretty much the same thing except I never thought to try the wipes container (mental note for next time though). The sink was so much easier for me than the real potty at least when he was tiny.


----------



## arelyn

I should have read all the way first.

AYW...who is still R. in my mind: I have no idea what to type. I just want to hug you and cry with you. I'm so glad your little girl is such a blessing to you but just so saddened by your story. Life can be such a heady mix of grief and beauty. Words just aren't enough.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Steph:* How do you make sure Calvin's b'day is properly observed?

Sorry not to answer this earlier, MMM.







Partly it was because I don't have a good answer and partly because I've been dealing with my own TWW drama and been pretty self-absorbed lately







The first year we had a half-birthday party in June but weren't able to host one this year. I'm hoping to do one again for his 2.5 birthday, but if I'm 7.5 months pg, it might fall by the wayside again. One of the big reasons I like the 1/2 birthday party is because the weather is so much nicer and I know it's completely the opposite for you. I've been considering pushing the festivities back a month and doing a little party at the end of January, but I'm still undecided.

*AYW* - I really don't know what to say. Thank you so much for coming here and sharing your story with us


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
I've been dealing with my own TWW drama and been pretty self-absorbed lately

















Chart stalking you!

Are you TTC or TTA this month?


----------



## PiePie

*as you wish,* i am so happy you are falling in love with your daughter and so sad to hear about your traumatic birth experience and its bookends...

*steph*, TWW!!??!! jealous you tried so soon...

i am having some frustration with bedtime, specifically, why it is taking her so long. we had it down to 15 minutes with the creation of a ritual but now it is up again! i am currently hitting the reset button after 60 minutes of trying, i don't think having a frustrated mommy can be helping matters... seriously, i need time alone with dh, it is not happening, i don't know what to do. i also need me time, and putting her down is taking so long i wind up staying up too late, and then needing to sleep in, which pisses dh off... anybody know what is going on? she is 2 y, 3 m. it is not that she is bouncing on the bed or anything, she asks about various sounds, but basically is nursing and i think trying to sleep, although tonight there was a fair amount of kicking me involved, i believe it was accidental...

mujerista, i think it is a mistake to think of toddlers as having the same toy needs for the whole second year. at 12 mos., dd was in a very different space than 16 mos., and again in a very different space at 18 mos. at 12 mos., what worked best was a wooden activity cube like this one http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=263602_263622 seriously she played with it every single day (except when i was out of rotation) from 10 mos. till this day, 2 years, 3 mos. seriously a great toy. also she loved her wagon http://www.google.com/products/catal...wAQ#ps-sellers which doubles as a building toy -- it had 2 lives, depending on her developmental stage. she also loved balls, again a toy that can be used on many levels. my brother gave her something like this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Manhattan-Toy-...item20ad295184 when she turned 1 and she loved it. the little people toys that *cking* mentioned are big here but not before 18 mos. -- she just didn't have the expressive language capacity to be engaging in pretend play at that level. stacking and nesting blocks were very big well before the first birthday but got some play thereafter -- we have this one with mother goose rhymes from the sylvia long illustrated one http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Manhattan-Toy-...item20ad295184 and this one by eeboo, which is good for knowing and naming http://www.amazon.com/eeBoo-Read-Me-...9464161&sr=1-9 for dd, they were used most at the post-sitting, pre-walking phase of life. but if you don't have some they are worth getting in part because they take up very little space, since they nest. duplos, which cking mentioned, were not a hit until after the 2nd birthday -- now they are HUGE -- before that she preferred mega blocks first and then legos larger quattros. we bought her 1 yo classroom a play tunnel when the kids were mostly 18 mos. plus, with a tent to go with, and it was huge -- i think i got it from discountschoolsupplies.com. when buying, look for easy of assembly -- her school had another one they never used because the set-up took too long.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 







Chart stalking you!

Are you TTC or TTA this month?

We were TTS (trying to survive!) this month







We weren't watching my chart closely enough and since I was still spotting, I wasn't checking CM, so we have the same timing as we did last pg/cycle. We were throwing around the idea of not avoiding but not placing the emphasis on trying next cycle, but I honestly think it's moot at this point - feeling quite pg. Dr's appt Thursday, and beta results should be back early next week.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*steph*, TWW!!??!! jealous you tried so soon...









No trying involved. One act of DTD, 5 days before O (again). The timing (due-date, specifically) is actually terrible, but I can't help wanting to be pg despite it.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
MMM, trying to think of toys that J has come to really like in the past 6 months....
blocks - stacking, nesting, duplos, things of that sort
Little People or similar people/animals/play house/farm, etc.
dolls and stuffed animals
tool boxes, medical kit
wood puzzles
play tunnel (I think she'd love a tent to go with this too)

and she's really really ready for a play kitchen. we're planning to make one like this for her.

That kitchen is awesome! I'm printing it out in case it's gone when we need it! The actual ikea kitchen is pretty expensive I think - if I was gonna pay a lot, I think I'd want one that was a little less ikea and mass produced! I'm kind of hoping we can hold off for a year on a kitchen though. I know he'd be into in but I feel pretty sure he'll love it for a few years and I'm hoping to rotate some other bigger toys out before we introduce this one!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Sorry not to answer this earlier, MMM.







Partly it was because I don't have a good answer and partly because I've been dealing with my own TWW drama and been pretty self-absorbed lately







The first year we had a half-birthday party in June but weren't able to host one this year. I'm hoping to do one again for his 2.5 birthday, but if I'm 7.5 months pg, it might fall by the wayside again. One of the big reasons I like the 1/2 birthday party is because the weather is so much nicer and I know it's completely the opposite for you. I've been considering pushing the festivities back a month and doing a little party at the end of January, but I'm still undecided.

Hmmm - yes. It's a tricky one. He's having his party on the 20th Dec this year but in the future we may bring it forward a month. Of course, he doesn't have to have a party every year!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
mujerista, i think it is a mistake to think of toddlers as having the same toy needs for the whole second year. at 12 mos., dd was in a very different space than 16 mos., and again in a very different space at 18 mos.

That's exactly my point PiePie - the kid only has one opportunity for gifts each year thus I want to be sure to ask for things that will become useful over the year.
Your ideas are great, thanks. I think an activity cube is perfect. It's definitely going on the list. He already has a wagon and a tunnel and LOVES them both.


----------



## PiePie

ita re play kitchen for later. we acquired a very small one -- just a stovetop, really -- http://www.amazon.com/Alex-Wooden-Co...ref=pd_sbs_t_1 -- for free back before her 2nd birthday because that was when the neighbors were unloading it -- it was either us or the garbage -- but it is at my parents' in reserve for her 3rd birthday. it is not that she wouldn't be into it now, i just think she will be more into it later, when she will have outgrown, say, the activity cube and the fort/ball run. or maybe my child is totally deprived -- not!


----------



## witchygrrl

PiePie, that kitchen is sooo cute! And it might even fit in our space, unlike so many others that are just humongous.

Poor Rhea's been sick since last Wednesday. High fever for 2 days, now just icky stuffy cold-ness. I hope this clears up soon.

Frends of ours who were trying to get pregnant at the same time we were but couldn't just finished their foster care homestudy last week, and then yesterday were given a newborn baby girl! They have to foster for 6 months before they can adopt, and then only if the birth parents are cooperative, but I am so excited for them!


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
PiePie, that kitchen is sooo cute! And it might even fit in our space, unlike so many others that are just humongous.


yes it folds flat, and accessories store inside.


----------



## PiePie

mujerista, by dd's 1st bday, she had 3 construction toys: classic wooden unit blocks (my old ones), which were not a big hit and still aren't; mega blocks, which were a hit, and kiddy connects by edushape (http://www.target.com/Set-36-Edushap..._baby_connects) (though she does not have as many as in the link). I know it says 2 yrs and up but she could do it at 12 mos. and most of the kids in her class could do it by 18-23 mos.


----------



## accountclosed3

crazy busy around here trying to move out and organize for our move in the process--that is, all holiday gifts focused on what we will need gear/clothing wise in NZ. i know that there is clothing/gear there, but if i can get some good deals on basic (eg, my winter coat for $40!), then why not?

as far as toys, since there is some discussion on that, hawk really only has a few toys.

he has blocks (and a thing to separate them or push the shapes through), tops for spinning, a stacking toy (with three posts and three different stacking shapes), and his instruments.

he also colors a bit, and now he is getting into books--both being read to and "reading." we read to him and he "reads" to us. he's also into counting--he counts the pages of the book. i think he can understand quantity up to four or five, because after five, he starts over. he started doing this himself, and when ryan encouraged him to six, seven, and eight, he looked a bit confused. so, we've let it go (educationally speaking), and then noticed that he picked up six seven and eight. LOL

but, his real preferences are for being outside and playing outside anywhere, in any environment, in any weather. he loves rocks, sticks, plants, nuts, and what not. he loves mud, water puddles, and just running around and hiking. he likes birds and trees quite a bit. the beach seemed a bit daunting, but the sand was ok. LOL

the other preference are his instruments. he has an african drum and a peruvian rattle. he plays them every day, about 2 hrs total. i just foudn a drum circle that he can join and he totally digs that. he's in love with our friend chris's guitar, so my sister and bil are getting him a ukelele for christmas.

he's just now into wooden cars and such, os my FIL is making him one of those.

our aunt is giving him rain gear ofr christmas, thank goodness, because i keep him in when i t rains (because of his poss swine flu/poss cold thing), and i don't have gear to keep him dry and warm. he needs it!

but in all honesty, toys aren't so much to him. he prefers outside or instruments. so, we keep it simple and keep it that way.

also, on the EC front for those of you who EC--i have a post in that forum about graduating (me) to trainers. LOL hawk could care less what he's wearing. but we're thinking of transitioning over, particularly with the move. so if you could put your two cents in over there, that would be cool.


----------



## accountclosed3

oh, and thankfully our move-out date moved to jan 4, so that gives us a bit more time!

and firebird is dec 12, so we're psyched for that. we're doing our "christmas" that weekend.


----------



## Sihaya

Quick update for chart-stalkers (or any other kind of stalkers







): BFN this morning, followed by AF. A little disappointed, but very relieved. The plan now is to sit out next month to let my body recover a little, then not try and not avoid in Jan & Feb, then reassess the TTC situation in March.


----------



## accountclosed3

much love sihaya. i've been thinking about you, even if i haven't written about it. i'll firebird for you (intentions are burned with the bird. it's pagan-crazy. you ok with that? if not, then i won't firebird for you, nd just keep thinking).


----------



## Sihaya

I'm definitely okay with that, zoebird. It sounds awesome. Thank you


----------



## accountclosed3

here's a link to the firebird festival. it's, like, my holiday.

did i mention that i've let go of christmas. it's nice. that is, my mom now has all of my christian stuff and i've given it up because i just realized that i don't want it and dont' really believe in it anymore.

but we really, really love the firebird festival, so when we move, we're going to continue with it and invite our friends to join us. it will be our holiday of the season.

there are a few concessions, though. first, i will get hawk's picture taken with santa even though we're not doing 'santa' seeing as we are not doing christmas, etc. it's really for my parents and ILs--it means a lot to them to have that picture. so, i can do that. second, while we are here, we will do christmas with them, and ryan wants to spend a holiday season in europe on of these years, in a "christmas" way. i can do that because in the first case, i don't care, and ini the second case, it's like "these are the local customs" so they can learn about how it's done there vs our house, etc.

i'm thinking that our firebird will be decorated up like midsummer decorations from scandinavia--swedish probably. that and paper mache (sp?) firebirds to burn. a friend of mine is going to teach me how to make them. and who knows, we may not burn one for quite a while, but burn our intentions in a safe way or something.

anyway, yeah, it's a cool celebration. and it includes the story of the firebird, so it has the most important part: a mythos.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Quick update for chart-stalkers (or any other kind of stalkers







): BFN this morning, followed by AF. A little disappointed, but very relieved. The plan now is to sit out next month to let my body recover a little, then not try and not avoid in Jan & Feb, then reassess the TTC situation in March.

Steph, i was just coming here to ask - couldn;t wait for LLL next week. so glad for the peace you;ve found - i think that eluded me for too long. Disappointed for you - our conversation last week reminded me of the month prior to reece when i was certain i was pg and my own ambivalence.

Typing one-left-handed while lie-down naking. sorry for typos. surgery yesterday on thumb (car accident) went well, but i need another surgery in 2 months. things have been very difficult in caring for both boys, I called in backup today for the 90 minutes i was alone between helper shifts. dh off next three days, so today was probably hardest. painful, but managing without vicodin, which would have me anxiou about sleeping with reece.

most days doing remarkably well with 2 boys. Fenton is a magnificent older brother. i'm shocked at how much he's grown up. Last week when reece was crying he told me "i think he wants you to pick him up" and i fell in love with how mature and giving he has been. Reece is such a joy - very much an old soul, so calm and easily content. i had forgotten how riveting that newborn stare can be.

We've had some pitfalls. dh and i still struggle with constantly falling into "reece is my responsibility, fenton is his". i try t resist this and i can see how frustrating it is for dh (Fenton is more demanding, plus it's been harder for dh to know reece as well as he knew fenton). But i've also had to remind dh that much of what i do for reece cant be done by anyone else. There isnt much that we can trade, only what can add to my half. it's probably been a shock to dh that, with Fenton, whenever i was nursing he got to have some free time. now when i'm nursing reece, he's on his own with fenton. it;s comical to me that dh finds this infancy so much more difficult, while i think its about the same.

Another challenge has been being haunted by the ways that fenton was so challenging, and not want to do anything that plants the same thing in reece. i've found myself deliberatrly putting reece down more, considering introducing a pacifier and qustioning whether to co-sleep with him if he's indifferent...all because somewhere in my mind i wonder if _we_ created fentons intensity. so far we've stayed true to our gut, but i've definately entertained some options that didn't feel right, mostly out of fear. having an intense child first has, in some ways, made me _less_ confident the 2nd time around.

anyone read the Time cover story on hothouse parenting? i haven't gotten hold of it yet but i'm delighted to see the topic get some press, if only so many of my more free-range philosophies get less raised eyebrows. we;ve been letting fenton start to play outside alone in parts of our yard for short stretches, and i think my sisters head is going to explode. from where i sit, however, i think the press is missing a huge swath of the "mindful neglect" movement. just finished "a nation of wimps" on the topic, and she lumps ap parenting, homeschooling, etc. as the ultimate in hothouse parenting. I think she's missing how many of us feel that we have to opt out of convention in order to allow our kids to be left alone, as she clearly agrees is best for children. it was a frustrating read. in case you can't tell by the title









First snowfall tonight! The look on fentons face when he touched and tasted it was utter bliss. he asked to take a bowl of snow to bed with him







. which we indulged. Poor dh


----------



## PiePie

*shanna* (and others), but *shanna* in light of her doubts re fenton: you *must* read the atlantic story. print version is called orchid children, online version is called the science of success.

The Scene: DD's school around the time of pickup.
The Sound: Baby, about 6 mos. old, wimpering a little.
DD: Baby cwying! He needs to nurf!
Other mother [_apologetic_]: You are never going to believe me, but I am still nursing.
Me: Oh, I believe it.
DD: No, don't hide the baby! Nurf him! [_in reference to the nursing cover_]


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
*shanna* (and others), but *shanna* in light of her doubts re fenton: you *must* read the atlantic story. print version is called orchid children, online version is called the science of success.

Thanks, I'm bookmarking to read.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
The Scene: DD's school around the time of pickup.
The Sound: Baby, about 6 mos. old, wimpering a little.
DD: Baby cwying! He needs to nurf!
Other mother [_apologetic_]: You are never going to believe me, but I am still nursing.
Me: Oh, I believe it.
DD: No, don't hide the baby! Nurf him! [_in reference to the nursing cover_]










A mom kicked out of Target in my neck of the woods for not covering while nursing







. Doing exactly what I've done millions of times. Hope I'd have cojones if I were ever confronted. Cojones AND eloquence.

Fenton has asked to nurse Reece countless times, which I help him "do". Last week he saw me pumping after I nursed R (in prep for sugery) so now he asks to nurse Reece and then follows with "and now I need my breast pump!"







He thinks the pump is a "neat little machine"







.


----------



## accountclosed3

i'll look up that atlantic monthly article.

people think i'm such a strange, strange mom.

i never hover when hawk plays outside (or inside at the indoor playgrounds that we go to) unless there are a lot of larger, older children running around. i only do that because i know that those older children are doing no wrong, but that hawk can get pretty badly hurt if i'm not close by to block the odd foot or excited arm wave.

but where things get weird is that when i am out and hawk is in a playground that is fenced or even a more open area like the nature center we go to, i let him roam. i'll sit in one spot, and i watch him, but i let him roam. of course, if there are a lot of people around, the distance that i let him roam is shorter/closer, but i free range him. i want him to explore and play.

but other parents are *on top of* their children and giving me *dagger eyes* for even allowing my son to explore the play area, introduce himself to other children, and feel and assert himself openly and nonviolently.

as an example, he walked up to a girl about his height, and about 4-5 months older than him. she bared her teeth and growled, then pushed him. he obviously didn't understand, and the mother was right there and said "no.". hawk then handed her his toy, and she took it, and then hit him. and the mother just said "no" and that was it.

anyway, he then goes to the play structure and wants to slide. he climbs up and slides himself (it's steps, not a ladder), and the little girl was up there. she displayed aggression again, and he looked confused. then she pushed him off the low step and knocked him on his backside. her mom said "no."

he looked stunned, then stood up and took three deep breaths. he got up on the play structure again, and went right up to her. got to his fullest height, and said "BA!" the little girl rocked back, got out of the way, and he went on to play. later, the two were playing together fine.

during this exchahange, the other mother was very near. when hawk asserted himself to her daughter, she said "i was scared he would hurt her; you should watch him."

i looked at her like she was bonkers. her daughter knocked my son off the play structure. he didn't require comfort, so i didn't go to him. he mastered his own feelings and took action. the action he took was assertive and nonviolent, and didn't require any input from me.

it was freakin' weird. i swear to god these other parents make me NUTS sometimes. just let the kids play for goodness sakes, or explore and have fun.

we have put on our list that we either want a large, safe balcony or a small yard at our place in NZ so that hawk can have some safe space to play outside without me having to take him there or be there.

he plays on his own so well, and the grandmothers who were at the play area (and not hovering) noticed and said to me "he's such a sweet, kind, self-assured boy." i know part of it is his temperment, but the other part is allowing him his feelings, helping him process, and also allowing him to interact freely without my constant policing or intervention.

anyway, i came to ask about books regarding developmental stages, gentle discipline, free ranging, and so on for this 1 and up set. any good suggestions?


----------



## witchygrrl

PiePie, read the orchid article. absolutely fascinating (DH got a subscription to the Atlantic Monthly from an NPR donation--way cool). There are just so many different levels to who we are.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
anyway, i came to ask about books regarding developmental stages, gentle discipline, free ranging, and so on for this 1 and up set. any good suggestions?

_
becoming the parent you want to be_ is good for toddlers, but i consider it wrong-headed (to the point of being upsetting to me) on sleep. if you can forgive that part there is lots of good stuff in there -- a lot of stuff that is likely to be up your alley. the other one i can think of is _parenting your toddler_ by the barnard toddler ctr. folks. there was a lot of stuff i did not like there -- but i wasn't really the target audience, i suppose?? -- although the chapter on socialization is GREAT and speaks to the situation you were describing above. i got some other useful tidbits like re traveling with toddlers but most of the book was a waste, i would say the socialization chapter only was worthwhile.


----------



## accountclosed3

do those books have chapterss specifically on socialization or is it more mixed through and so i have to put up with the "that which doesn't apply" material? i hate wading through stuff that i don't agree with. i should probably just go to the library and read those chapters, huh?

and, we will be travelling to NZ with him. i know he'll be awesome (he is a good traveller), but i do have to find a way to allow him to burn off energy when he can, and hopefully sleep through most of the flight to NZ. he's such a good sleeper.

he's getting to the point where he exerts his own will, and one other weird thign is happening. he'll just start screaming. i don't know what that is about. he'll be fine (not injured, not really frustrated with a toy or whatever), but he just starts screaming. i try to nurse, and no dice. i try to engage him in another game, sometimes works. it's very weird.

tends to be worse on days when we dont' get outside time (rain right now is too cold and i don't have rain gear for us), so i think that might be the "fix."

but i'm also curious as how to teach him new "doing" words. he knows "gentle touch" and he's very good at that one. we use "drop it" and "leave it" and "not for hawk" and "dangerous." we're trying also to get "wait" and "stay" but those two aren't taking. i'm not sure if he gets those and i'm not sure how to demonstrate it.

his grandparents (my ILS) insiste that he hold both of their hands when he walks anywhere outside of the house, and i understand that it contains/controls him, but i would rather him free range a bit with me following when it is safe, and only holding hands when it is unsafe. is the inconsistancy a problem for him? because he won't hold hands with us, we have to hold him or wrap him if it is unsafe, otherwise he ranges.

and i know he's only 15 months, so i can't expect everything. i jsut need to know where he is developmentally and how i can appropriately respond so that he learns and is safe.

it's weird because, you know, i never raise my voice to him or even use "no," and he really understands what i'm asking of him and he is very helpful (eg, he helps set and clear the table, he helps cook, he helps clean the bathroom and kitchen --he's in charge of the spray bottle of water and vinegar) and he's an all around active, easy-going and fun kid.

but there are times when he needs to be safe, and i'm having trouble commnicating danger and safety to him.


----------



## witchygrrl

zoebird, usually we tell Rhea, "no thank you" when she does something we'd rather she didn't, and "ouch" if it could potentially be painful consequences.

We also insist on hand holding if she is walking with us, unless it's at the fenced in playground or in the backyard, because we live on a busy street and she could very easily run off. Otherwise, she's in the sling or being held. She's pretty free range in the house, though. We currently do not have any baby gates.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
do those books have chapterss specifically on socialization or is it more mixed through and so i have to put up with the "that which doesn't apply" material? i hate wading through stuff that i don't agree with. i should probably just go to the library and read those chapters, huh?


the latter book has a chapter entitled socialization. the former book has a chapter entitled sleep, which you can skip. the former book breaks stuff down more by developmental stage (birth to five); the latter book just addresses 18-36 mos in a big lump. hth.


----------



## accountclosed3

really, where hawk is walking, we generally wouldn't have those problems. it really is only specific to certain places--like when the mall is busy or when we are at a place with a very busy road near-by.

our house also has no baby gates. stairs are no problem for him! we don't have any "baby proofing" in our house, though we may need to get one of those knob covers for the front door. LOL aside from that, it's no problem.

he understands a lot of simple statements easily--but right now he is getting into dangerous activities: standing on the coffee table, hanging on the unlockable door to the oven, trying to grab hot pots off the stove, etc. we are trying to use "dangerous!" and redirect his activity, but it's not working out.

and the holding hands thing he has limited tolerance for. i'm starting to think, though, that walking and hand holding might be essential. i think i have to choose a way and go with it.


----------



## accountclosed3

btw, by 'not working out' i mean...

i'm getting tired of it. LOL

that is, he keeps doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it. and i keep stopping him and saying "not for hawk, dangerous!" and moving him to another place with a safe activity. but seriously, i could do it a million times.

he does udnerstand "not for hawk" but he just seems to think that this is a fun game. and it's not like he is doing it to get attention, typically he does it while we are plaing together anyway.

so, i'm not getting it. LOL and i'm getting frustrated.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
btw, by 'not working out' i mean...

i'm getting tired of it. LOL

that is, he keeps doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it and doing it. and i keep stopping him and saying "not for hawk, dangerous!" and moving him to another place with a safe activity. but seriously, i could do it a million times.

he does udnerstand "not for hawk" but he just seems to think that this is a fun game. and it's not like he is doing it to get attention, typically he does it while we are plaing together anyway.

so, i'm not getting it. LOL and i'm getting frustrated.

i think you get it exactly and that is just how it is. we have gone through phases with various things (resistance to diaper changes, helmets while riding wheeled vehicles) and it's just repeat and repeat until you can't count any more and then it's over and you forget it was ever an issue because you are on to your next issue.









there is some on-point stuff in _becoming the parent you want to be_ on this, on what is going on inside their little brains. there is also some stuff in _the emotional life of the toddler_ on this, but there were other parts of that book that i didn't love, so that was why i didn't recommend it in the first instance.


----------



## PiePie

dd holds hands only while crossing a street; on the sidewalk she can be on her own. she is excellent at distinguishing what's a street and what's a sidewalk. i can't remember when we stopped having her hold hands on the sidewalk; i bet we still were at your ds's age?


----------



## Maela

I wish I had more time to join in the conversation!
Dd has to hold our hands when crossing the street or if we are in a _very_ crowded area.

I'm also having a hard time getting in any reading time lately. There isn't much time where neither Dd or Ds are awake. If Ds is sleeping I feel like I need to play with Dd or clean the house. And if Dd is sleeping, I feel like i need to spend some one-on-one time with Ds. Very rarely will he take a long nap in my arms when Dd is sleeping. It was much easier to read with just one child. Oh well, I'll read in two years....poor me









I am taking an hour every Friday though to hang out in my bedroom (with my ipod on) to read or do whatever I want on the computer. When ds is older I'll feel more comfortable leaving for more than an hour in my bedroom.









*Shanna,* I hope your thumb heals quickly.







It must be so hard; I can barely handle my own two with both hands working fine.







I'm glad you're getting help for the next few days.


----------



## accountclosed3

it's ok. just, i turn my back and he is literally hanging form the chandelier above the DR table. it takes about 2 seconds for that.

and, he has figured out holding hands. we hold hands crossing the street and in busy areas. he isn't resisting it anymore. so, that one is done. LOL

i suppose it's all good. i'm just learning patience.


----------



## Maela

It's snowing here in the central valley of California!







Crazy. I've only seen it do that one other time here - when I was a little girl. I took Maev out to see it and she wasn't too impressed. Probably because it's melting as soon as it hits the ground, so it doesn't look like snow. And she's seen snow before in other places.


----------



## accountclosed3

we got 4 inches here, and most of it has stuck since saturday when it fell. hawk *loves* it.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

We're in the middle of our worst ever drought and it's been raining for 12 hours, solid! My vegie patch is looking very happy.

Sebby has rubella. He's much happier now but the first few days were hellish and I've been letting him watch tv by ways of getting myself some respite














. Poor kid is one giant red spot!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Hurray for snow! Remind me of this in march....

Poor sebby. Anything besides rash?

I need to talk through something, get your advice. bear with me, i'm typing with 1 finger....

Dipe changes are still going poorly. They vary along the "bad" spectrum, but the gist is that F vacillates between not wanting to be disturbed to do them, or he gets drunk on the power of laughing like a maniac, running and forcing us to chase and wrestle him to the ground in times where they _have_ to be done. Efforts to appear disinterested have not worked either. becoming a major source of frustration, tension for both dh and i. letting him go without changes until he asks is not an option because he leaks before then, causing more work, more frustration, more anger.

I'm considering suggesting to dh that we offer a reward for using the potty. I am completely against offering rewards for basic human behavior. But i'm more against being violent with my son. i'm wondering if it's irrationally dogmatic to not consider it when he clearly knows how to use the potty, he's merely decided that it's a rather boring effort. I'm also wondering if eschewing reward for performance is most imortant to me when I want him to do a certain thing (apologize, act compassionately, eat his carrots) because he _wants_ to doit versus doing it just to please me. Frankly, i could care less why he uses the potty, it's not a _moral_ value to me. i'm just tired of fighting to do something neither of us wants to do. And i don't see a huge risk of this getting worse out of rebellion. i guess the biggest risk is to me if i see the tactic works...

thoughts? warning? opinions?

Packing away nb dipes today







Reece gave an audible chuckle today and i vowed to have 50 more just like him







Fenton still doing great where he's concerned, i've been so lucky.

Christina, you get the snap press yet?


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Christina, you get the snap press yet?

I did. Thanks for reminding me to let you know I got it. And thanks for sending it - I'll let you know how it goes.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shanna*
letting him go without changes until he asks is not an option because he leaks before then, causing more work, more frustration, more anger.

I feel your frustration here. I have thought about trying to let it go until she asks, but with poop this is not an option - I can't take the smell, and since she's just getting colostrum from me they are particularly messy diaper changes, just adding to the frustration. I wish I had advice for you, but I don't think there is anything wrong with trying rewards.

MMM, sorry about Sebby being sick! How's he doing?

Zoebird, wow, 4 inches? I'm only ~40 miles from you and we just got a dusting (maybe an inch). Josephine still managed to eat about a cup of snow yesterday though.









Maela, wow, I can't believe you got snow! And I just have to say I'm impressed that you were able to read so much even with one child. I haven't finished a book in almost 2 years.







:


----------



## PiePie

*shanna*, i love that you feel safe to be so vulnerable with us.







here is the brazelton argument against rewards for potty use: for children with a strong drive toward autonomy (ahem!) the rewards lets them know it is about pleasing you rather than doing what thye want, and it will produce a counter-reaction. the idea is to be completely agnostic with regard to the potty and let them take ownership of it. i can't say i have been agnostic on it -- some encouragement and praise -- perhaps that is why our efforts are going so poorly. well, not going, that is, not that that is a bad thing. these kids are 2, you know. it is a rough in between place to be. my friend k. reminded me that both of her boys reverted to baby talk at this age to express their desire to be a baby, alternating with their desire to be a big boy.

in this vein, i have been struggling with dd's increased dependency on me. going to revert to more babywearing in an effort to meet those needs in a way that doesn't breed my resentment, which carrying her does.

perhaps due to the energy suck she is, or perhaps due to the energy suck tha twork is, or perhaps due to how much it sucks to have a dp working so hard and absent so much and (relatedly) sick so much, i am having a mini meltdown tonight. i hate ttcing!! i also wonder if i can actually handle 2 kids because as it is i feel like i am going ot break. ttcing is a giant stressball and i hate it. dh said this was the worst part about the m/c.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
perhaps due to the energy suck she is,











DH says that F's needs expand to fit how many adults are at hand










more to say, be back later.


----------



## accountclosed3

our guy is younger and ECed, but what worked for us was to create a "potty rhythm." no matter what, we stop to potty at certain times of the day.

since he's very little, we do that every hour/1.5 hrs, but you can do it every two or what works for you guys.

it is quite literally, we put the toys aside, say "potty time" and we take him to the potty. sometimes he fusses, but usually, he goes and it's no problem at all.

other things that work are going without dipes/trainers/pants, and having potties where he is playing.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
other things that work are going without dipes/trainers/pants, and having potties where he is playing.

This worked well back with warmer weather, but I'm going to have to figure out how to accomplish this after xmas even though our house is chilly. reward or not, we're going dipeless after xmas. going dipeless worked great before, then not at all. going to have to encourage it again.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
our guy is younger and ECed, but what worked for us was to create a "potty rhythm." no matter what, we stop to potty at certain times of the day.

this is briliant, i'm going to try this before revisiting a reward. he's been very interested in time as it relates to when he can do other things, so i'll maybe show him the "hands on the clock" for this too.

Pie Pie, i felt panic when we were pg because i was already beyond overwhelmed. It's a mystery how, but it just ends up working out, even when it seems impossible, like our night routine. your inadequecies end up making room for dc's advancement, and you lower your standards where necessary, but not necessarily where comfortable. fenton has grown up so much since becoming concerned with reece's welfare. i think it goes in differing ratios for different families, but as all children, it bends toward independance. yesterday i hit my perfect storm of adversity in the nap routine, and my inability to stay with fenton made way for him to show me he can fall asleep on his own, even without being upset (which, frankly, was gravy). i'm still shocked, so much so that i know i wouldn't have given him the opportunity except under duress.

reece sleeps _so_ restlessly when i've eaten the usual suspects: cabbage, broccoli, beans, tomatoes. hard to adjust diet to nb tummies. thought i'd remind anyone who finds it useful, could save some heartache.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
reece sleeps _so_ restlessly when i've eaten the usual suspects: cabbage, broccoli, beans, tomatoes. hard to adjust diet to nb tummies. thought i'd remind anyone who finds it useful, could save some heartache.

I'll have to watch for these. I'm not so sure about the no milk, cheese, etc. anymore being what makes him fussy. Sometimes he's fussy and I haven't had any of these. And other times I'll forget and eat something with milk in it, and he won't be fussy at all. Either way, he seems to be past the inconsolable crying now, so that's great! He still requires us to walk him around the house almost constantly though in the afternoon and evening. But as long as we do that, he's not crying.









So So So busy these days. Doesn't help that Maev's been sick and Jaim won't take a nap for longer than 30 minutes - even when I'm holding him. And when he's not napping I have to be up walking him around...









*Shanna* I am so amazed that you are able to want more babies during this phase. I am just not a newborn person, and I am definitely only wanting two kids. at least at this point in time. I cannot wait for him to be older!!


----------



## witchygrrl

Maela, I can feel your frustrations. Hopefully Maev gets better soon and things can resettle. When children are sick, no matter how many you have, it can throw things out of whack.

So yeah, last time the ILs were visiting, Rhea was sick (she's finally over it, but what a long cold/flu she had). And I finally got the comment I was most dreading. Why don't you just let her CIO? I said no way, and thankfully MIL let it drop. But seriously? When Rhea is moaning because she can't breathe well, eat well, and has an upset tummy on top of things because of the tylenol, that's the time to just let her CIO alone? Now she was crying a lot and trying my patience because she was not communicating what her needs were, and nothing we were doing seemed to help much, but yikes. No thank you.

Anyway, I've just started reading Diaper Free Before Three. And I haven't gotten to any of the techniques in there yet, but the history the author gives about toilet learning is soooo interesting!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
Anyway, I've just started reading Diaper Free Before Three. And I haven't gotten to any of the techniques in there yet, but the history the author gives about toilet learning is soooo interesting!

oh yeah i read that part of the book on amazon, and now i really want to buy it. my library doesn't have it.

Maev was much better today.


----------



## arelyn

Wish I could post more. Kai has been a trip since getting back from visiting the grandparents at Thanksgiving. Hope your sick little ones are feeling better soon, especially Sebby!


----------



## witchygrrl

yeah, really. How is Sebby doing, MMM?

Had my first success with the potty.







We had some near misses earlier, but it was clear that Rhea was making the connection. Now that I'm home for 5 weeks, I'm hoping that we can make some progress. Obviously, I'm sure this will be the long haul, but hey, I'm okay with that


----------



## ~Shanna~

What does everyone know about the IUD? Pros, cons, safety of?


----------



## ~Shanna~

Ugh never mind. My midwife enthusiastically endorsed them today at my pp visit, so I thought i must have been thinking of a different super-creepy method. Cursory research shows I was thinking of the right one.....


----------



## witchygrrl

that good shanna? I'v heard reasonable things about the copper iud, but in general I'm wary of sticking things up my cervix. but I've had friends who really don't want children be very happy with them.


----------



## farmama

for dd

Shanna,

don't know much about the iud, except i hear it can make cramps more intense. are they POSITIVE you can't get pg with it in? just checking


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Sebby's all better! The spots were gone by yesterday and he had one of his best sleeps ever last night. Slept a 5 hour block and only woke up 3 times in 12 hours!

How nutso is this time of year? We've got first birthdays parties and xmas shin-digs coming out of our ears. I thought I'd be over ambitious and sew and screen print gift bags for Sebby's party next Sunday. I also just put together a senate submission to the homebirth inquiry that's going on right now (I told you that they're effectively banning homebirth from 2012, didn't I?)...in trying to find some balance and get some of the synapses reconnecting in my brain, I may have taken a bit too much of a mouthful...but boy do I feel better when I'm productive and useful.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
What does everyone know about the IUD? Pros, cons, safety of?

So glad this is something I never have to worry about...sounds awful!

Sorry, no help here.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
are they POSITIVE you can't get pg with it in? just checking









are you telling us something?


----------



## Maela

Yay for Sebby being well again!!!

I don't know much about IUDs. Dh and I were just talking about bc tonight. We hate condoms and withdrawal, but I'm not going back on hormonal bc. If I didn't get my fertility back until 17 months after Maev's birth, how likely would it be for me to get it back before 12 months after this birth? Do we really have to worry just yet? We've DTD once so far without any sort of bc, but now I'm worried to do it like that again. Watching for CM doesn't help because I already have it and I had it this early last time too. I REALLY don't want to get pg again. We are considering a vasectomy, but don't want to do it for at least a year or two in case we change our minds.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
What does everyone know about the IUD? Pros, cons, safety of?


With getting married soon (22 days-- eek!) BC has been a big topic on my mind lately. I decided to go with the paragard.

I chose it because it's non-hormonal, less of a hassle than condoms, and better protection than NFP. I'll still temp I think and avoid my most fertile days because we REALLY don't want kids till our mid to late 20s- a few years away.

Putting the rest under a spoiler in case those of you don't want to read the gory details.
Warning :: Spoiler Ahead! Highlight to read message!

My doctor's office has an ARNP (nurse) insert them rather than a doctor. They do it during your period. I got mine inserted end of November right before Thanksgiving. She told me biggest risks were perforation (goes through the uterus) and my uterus rejecting it and pushing it back out, but small chances of each. Neither happened with me.
Procedure took about 5 minutes. It was NOT fun; she said some women describe it as 1 contraction, but I've never had a baby so nothing to compare that to. Oh- because I've never been pregnant, she said changes of rejection were greater and it would hurt more. I can still feel the strings, so I know it's still up there. When inserting, first thing she did was measure the depth of my uterus. That hurt more than the actual insertion.

Bad cramps came and went for about 6 hours. They lasted 2-10 min each. I had 1 bad cramp the next day and that was it. Haven't had AF since then, so can't tell you what my next one will be like.

I have a followup appointment next week to make sure it's all fine and dandy. I can let you know about the appt and my next AF if you really want.

However, I hear lots of horror stories of getting pregnant with an IUD, so just remember nothing is 100%!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Day 4 of F putting himself down for nap







. We had a conversation about how I was willing to nap with both boys, but it isn't safe for me and R to lay in bed with him if he's going to kick, walk on, jump on us. New routine is 3 books, get a toy to take in bed, tuck in, kiss goodnight and put music on for him, reminder that he can do anything he wants as long as he stays in bed. He's doing great, even slept 2-3 hours yesterday (don't know exactly when he actually falls asleep). I'm overjoyed. Had similar conversation about dipe changes, and that has vastly improved: told him dipe changes are required if he's poopy or leaking, but other than that its his call.

Also starting to see how often he gets so busy he forgets to eat the meal that is on his little table, as we let graze as desired during a meal time. If he doesn't eat enough, he suddenly becomes weepy and manic and it has taken us a while to figure out why in the past. Will have to revisit grazing policy.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *witchygrrl* 
that good shanna? I'v heard reasonable things about the copper iud, but in general I'm wary of sticking things up my cervix. but I've had friends who really don't want children be very happy with them.

The hormone version isn't an option for me, and the non-hormonal is made of copper, which doesn't seem like a good idea in an acidic environment like the uterus. The side effects sound awful to me: the rare ones that TJ mentioned, plus much heavier bleeding during (longer) menses, cramping. Anecdotally i hear of high failure rates (which data doesn't back up). Sounds like not a good fit for me at all.Besides that, my midwife conceived her 4th child while using it, so her rec is...suspect







Cervical cap and diaph. have failure rates approaching 25-30%....Thinking about charting to see what my temps do during bfing, but I'm hesitant this soon after birth to use this method. Guess I'll stick with abstinence for now









Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
are they POSITIVE you can't get pg with it in? just checking









Are you pg???????









Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Sebby's all better!

Hurray!!!

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
With getting married soon (22 days-- eek!) !

TJ, congratulations!!!! Details? Going on a honeymoon? Feeling nervous, confident, manic? All three?


----------



## PiePie

cervical cap and diaphragm have pretty high failure rates but reasonably low if combined with condoms.

we are trying and that is going miserably -- don't know if i will ever O -- but my plan for after a second child is to rely on lactational amenorrhea for the first 6 mos. and then, ideally, DH would get a V. Ideally in MY mind -- he agrees in theory but in practice is very squirmy about it. Taking a pill every day is such a PITA, and I am not good about it. On the upside, the minipill may have increased my milk supply, and I will be working and pumping, so that is not a bad thing. I would much prefer the vaginal ring, but that, like the regular pill, is not great while BFing. Most women I know who are BFing use either the Mirena IUD or the minipill.


----------



## TwilightJoy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Details? Going on a honeymoon? Feeling nervous, confident, manic? All three?









Can hardly believe it's been over a year since we got engaged. Seems like we still have so much to do! My to-do list has about 30 wedding things on it.

The church we're getting married in will still be decorated for Christmas, so we're sticking with that theme, just doing darker colors: wine and pine. Bridesmaids and flowergirl are all wearing wine. Honeymoon to St. Lucia; leaving day after the wedding and staying there for 7 days 6 nights. Looking forward to laying on the beach! Will be a nice change to get away from the snow! Feeling nervous and like I have so much to do (dreaming about being unprepared on wedding day







) but so excited to finally be MARRIED. We have a lot of family and friends flying in from around the US, so I'm excited to see all of them again as well.
We're thinking around 150 people, which is a good number I think. Reception is a plated meal-- meal and cake are totally not TF, but hey, a girl has to splurge a little.
Let me know if you want to know any more details. I love talking about it!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *TwilightJoy* 
Can hardly believe it's been over a year since we got engaged. Seems like we still have so much to do! My to-do list has about 30 wedding things on it.

The church we're getting married in will still be decorated for Christmas, so we're sticking with that theme, just doing darker colors: wine and pine. Bridesmaids and flowergirl are all wearing wine. Honeymoon to St. Lucia; leaving day after the wedding and staying there for 7 days 6 nights. Looking forward to laying on the beach! Will be a nice change to get away from the snow! Feeling nervous and like I have so much to do (dreaming about being unprepared on wedding day







) but so excited to finally be MARRIED. We have a lot of family and friends flying in from around the US, so I'm excited to see all of them again as well.
We're thinking around 150 people, which is a good number I think. Reception is a plated meal-- meal and cake are totally not TF, but hey, a girl has to splurge a little.
Let me know if you want to know any more details. I love talking about it!

How exciting!! I had the same dreams of not being prepared on my wedding day. I was so nervous, but finally being married is totally worth it. Congratulations (soon)!


----------



## PiePie

http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1172332


----------



## ~Shanna~

I think i might have started my period today. waiting to see, but pp bleeding stopped weeks ago, and this was pink. not good for our birth control quandry.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Definately started my period. Which is nuts, it didn't come back until at least 18 months with Fenton, but I think it was longer. And definately longer than 6 weeks. The really nutso part is that I would have felt conservative using lac. annom. for only 6 months. I could have been possibly pregnant again by now







.

Wonder why it came back so soon. Reece goes longer stretches, especially at night, but don't think it was much different with Fenton at this point. Worried about my milk supply







.


----------



## PiePie

My plea for suggestions or insights over in the GD forum: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1#post14797321


----------



## PiePie

and another: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...4#post14797414


----------



## cking

Shanna, that is nutso. Well, I was coming here to say I didn't think it was your period. TCOYF (and another book, the Art of NFP) say to ignore any bleeding that occurs in the first 56 days post-partum. I know you are close to that, but I was going to say maybe it's just the very end of pp bleeding. At any rate, it also says that if your period returns within 6 weeks, (mainly for non-EBFing women) it is very unlikely that ovulation occurred before it.

I have so much more to say, but wish I had more time....









I know I'm in the minority here, but I think I will be comfortable using FAM long-term. It worked well for us for 4 years. I *know* it is not nearly so easy to use after having a child though. (I can't call this pregnancy a failure of that method, since it wasn't really being implemented, and I was so clearly at the middle of my cycle







). But IUD and vasectomy both creep me out, and fortunately V. is not at all an option since DH is not interested. I am bothered by the fact that the PP website and a few others post such high failure rates for FAM. These are _user_ failure rates, not method failure. Anyway.....

TJ, so exciting that your wedding is coming up so soon! Congrats, and have fun!


----------



## accountclosed3

we haven't quite figured out "final" BC either. i do FAM very well and enjoy it; Dh doesn't completely trust it so he uses condoms as back up. he says he's happy with it, and i'm not unhappy with it, so it will likely be this.









oops! gotta jump offline to get a phone call.

love "ya'll" amd hope everyone is having a great holiday season so far. (we are doing awesome here, thx!)


----------



## farmama

Quote:

Are you pg???????








no, but i'm thinking about it...


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Definately started my period. Which is nuts, it didn't come back until at least 18 months with Fenton, but I think it was longer. And definately longer than 6 weeks. The really nutso part is that I would have felt conservative using lac. annom. for only 6 months. I could have been possibly pregnant again by now







.

Wonder why it came back so soon. Reece goes longer stretches, especially at night, but don't think it was much different with Fenton at this point. Worried about my milk supply







.

I bled for 3 days at 10 week pp and then not again until last month (~11mths)... ??


----------



## PiePie

I am pretty down about ttc'ing and crazy late or annovulatory cycle.









something is wrong with dd and i am not sure what it is. clingy, impatient. overtired? bothered by dh's business trips? bothered by our working?


----------



## ~Shanna~

pie pie, it sounds like you're under a lot of stress, could be contributing to late O. (I know, tat's like someone admonishing you to relax







) Are you charting or using predictor kit?

I'm so sorry that L isn't feeling like herself







. I read your thread regarding, and could only come up with waking up early to spend time together, but a) that's at odds with real life and b) i've found that when F is in that place, nothing is ever enough







. It could be that being with her in her suffering, doing exactly what you're doing, is what she needs. Will you have time off over holidays to see if more time together helps? I doubt she's clingy because you're working, but I understand mama guilt. my first thought when Fenton is sad and clingy is wondering if staying at home doesn't give him enough opportunity to grow in independance







. We're damned no matter what we do.


----------



## Maela

*PiePie*







I'm so sorry things aren't going well for you right now. I wish I had advice to give...

bad news: Jaim is sick with whatever Maev had I think. we all slept poorly because of it. Calling the dr this morning. He's only ten weeks.







Maev didn't get her first cold until she was almost six months.

good news: there is the most beautiful rainbow outside here right now!!


----------



## Sihaya

I just realized that I've been unsubscribed from this thread for two weeks







So sad I missed out on all the recent conversations.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
I know I'm in the minority here, but I think I will be comfortable using FAM long-term. It worked well for us for 4 years.


You're not the only one. It is true that every time I've gotten pg we've been CTA with FAM, but both times were definitely a user failure issue, not method failure. And with DS, it wasn't user failure so much as user choosing to blatantly disregard the rules







I have no interest in other forms of BC so our choice is FAM/NFP or abstinence (which is what we used a lot during DS's first year due to my fear of closely spaced babies).

*Shanna*, I think it could be your period. I wouldn't rule it out, but I wouldn't say it was for sure either. You probably just need to wait it out with the assumption that you're possibly going to ovulate, and see if you get a second period after the 56 day mark. That said, while I got my period back at 11 weeks and had ovulatory cycles every single time thereafter, my body still wasn't fertile enough to sustain a pg until long after my fertility returned. Not sure if that helps at all, but it was my experience.

In this neck of the woods, we are also flirting with the idea of potty training/learning as I see many of you are. I'm waiting for a potty chair to arrive (DS's holiday gift from us) and the holiday chaos to subside, and then it's on.

In other news, it looks like I ovulated yesterday, so as soon as I can confirm it, we are officially not avoiding until I give birth







Considering that we've been avoiding since I went off of the nuvaring 3 years ago (besides when I was pg of course), it is a hugely freeing prospect to not worry about where I am in my cycle and to be able to throw out the condoms. I'll still be temping and monitoring other fertility signs, but not recording them in chart form until after that cycle is over. I'm still harboring lots of hope of getting pg right away, but trying not to obsess about it.


----------



## accountclosed3

i think that ec/early learning techniques are really healthy for the kiddos. they have a greater sense of personal power, i think. and it's far les mess.

now that hawk's tooth is through (one of th e back teeth), he's back to signaling. it's so interesting how he doesn't signal when teeth are coming.


----------



## PiePie

not charting, just using clear blue easy fertility monitor. not really trying any more as it was too darn stressful. just counting this month as an off month and getting back in the game next time. will still be dealing with dh;s crazy work trips so who knows.

i was right that something was wrong with dd -- she is sick. hence the inarticulate fussing and clinginess. dh and i split today and i will be home with her tomorrow. have asked him to come home early so i can get some needed work calls in but i am not counting on it happening. she has yellow not so solid poop and a mild fever of 99 and was asking to sleep at abnormal times for extra long. in fact i had such a brutal wednesday and dh was all down on me for how short with her i was and then i was like, you'll see when it's your turn tomorrow. and she slept till 9, got up for 20 minutes and did puzzles, and then slept till i got home at 1! (and i was on duty) today she is much less grouchy than yesterday and was running figure eights and dancing tonight so maybe she is on the mend? at any rate i have got to get out of the house tomorrow, assuming she is up for it. thinking library would be low-energy and not involve exposure to other children but would give both of us a much needed change of scene. and then twice she said her ear hurts so maybe i should take her to the ped? again, fever is low, 99.5.

*shanna*, i think your diapering solution is the bomb. it wouldn't work here because dd poops only once a day if not sick, and never leaks (just doesn't pee as much?) but i think it's a very respectful answer to your conflicts.

i really should tackle the christmas presents needing to be wrapped but i feel wiped.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

So sebby is turning one on Monday and I'm a wreck. Is this normal? I can't stop thinking about his birth and I just can't get enough of him. I feel like a psychotic ex or something!!!


----------



## cking

Totally normal, MMM. i did the same thing.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
So sebby is turning one on Monday and I'm a wreck. Is this normal? I can't stop thinking about his birth and I just can't get enough of him. I feel like a psychotic ex or something!!!

Oh my goodness; he's going to be one already?! Wow.
I'm sure what you're feeling is normal, but I was/am totally the opposite. I'm not much of a baby person, and I was so excited for Maev to turn one. I'm counting down the days until Jaim is one (9.5 more months!). Is that awful? It makes me feel mean sometimes.


----------



## PiePie

*mujer*, i cried on her bday, also when she walked. but it gets more fun as they get more words, i promise!

af today. not sure what's up, if it was a very late o and then a very short lp or if it was annovulatory or what. thank god it's over. here's to a better next one! (okay, i am more bummed than that.)


----------



## cking

Sorry about af Piepie.







Of course you're bummed. You need to allow yourself to be. It's good that it was a short cycle - a long anovulatory cycle is incredibly frustrating! Also, it is still possible that you O'd normally. This was your first month with the monitor, no? I've heard that is common as the machine is calibrating to _your_ hormone levels. (again, frustrating.) Hopefully it'll work better next time. And, um, you could always try temping a few days just to confirm.


----------



## Maela

My biggest pet peeve: People trying to get me (by doing things behind my back, teasing me, lecturing me, or just making me feel like I don't know my own kid) to parent differently than the way Dh and I want to.









Okay, vent over.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela* 
My biggest pet peeve: People trying to get me (by doing things behind my back, teasing me, lecturing me, or just making me feel like I don't know my own kid) to parent differently than the way Dh and I want to.









Okay, vent over.

Ah, the holidays are here









I've had a couple of instances where a coy "you know, I've actually done this before







" has worked well and given people an out from their rudeness.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Not sure if it's *quite* the 22nd there but...
*HAPPY BIRTHDAY CALVIN!*
Sebby is sending you lots of Christmas birthday love.
xo


----------



## witchygrrl

happy birthday to calvin and sebby!


----------



## cking

Happy Birthday Calvin and Sebby!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Happy birthday from me too!!!!!

*********

Day 10 of af. Crazy.


----------



## Maela

Happy Birthday!!!!









Shanna, have you asked your midwives? When did it start? How long had you not been bleeding? Is it possible you just did too much?

Last night I realized that Maev hadn't nursed in 5 days due to us being out almost every night (she only nurses right before bed), and she hadn't asked for it. So I asked her last night if she wanted to nurse one last time and then be all done nursing. I have been telling her a story about a little girl being all done with nursing and all the fun things she can still do with her mama even though she isn't nursing anymore. Maev said okay, so I think last night was the last time.







Hopefully, tonight goes well. She seemed to get it. She nursed and then during her bedtime snack she said (with a smile), "I don't nurse anymore!" And she gave me a hug and played with my hair (two things we talked about that she could do instead of nursing).
I was surprisingly okay with it. Nursing her just hasn't felt quite right since I was about half way through the pregnancy, but I/she wasn't ready to quit then. So I've been dreading and looking forward to this day at the same time.

Also, the last two nights after we read stories, we've been giving her some books to read in her bed and leaving the room with the light on, and *she has put herself to sleep*! Dh has been asking and asking when I think we can do this, and I finally decided to give it a try even though I didn't think she'd be ready. But the last two nights went well. We'll see if it continues.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
Hopefully it'll work better next time. And, um, you could always try temping a few days just to confirm.










Well in light of my viral gastroenteritis my temps would be 100 to 103, which I hope is not a baseline for anything long-term. I have been down for the count since Saturday night, after what I thought was just a vasovagal collapse and vomiting episode on the subway platform (DD: "Mommy yacked the yuckies on the platform!" You're supposed to hold hands on the platform, not lie down!") DD had had a tummy bug but I got it way worse. Her immune system must rock. On Sunday DH was princely and took care of her, although he violated our no TV rule but introducing her to a bit of ballet via youtube -- his logic was that I had already okayed her seeing it live, so how different was this? I am glad he did something when he was at his wits end. The big problem was that he did not enjoy his day with her.







(He is rarely singly responsible for her like that.) It has provoked huge soul-searching on his part about TTCing #2 (because that would mean more 1-on-1 time for him with #1) and therefore on my part about being with him. I am sure we will power through but blech. I am just surprised because now that she can do puzzles, play board games, do more imaginative play, and be more fun for him, I thought he would be more into it than he is.

I am home sick today -- trying to clean for my family's arrival, trying to wrap presents, got frustrated, so taking a break to address cards, which makes me happy.


----------



## cking

Yes, Shanna, I agree with Maela, I think you should ask your midwives also.

Oh, Maela, I cried







: when I read your post. Congrats on being finished nursing Maev. She is so precious. So awesome that she is putting herself to sleep.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Maela*
was surprisingly okay with it. Nursing her just hasn't felt quite right since I was about half way through the pregnancy, but I/she wasn't ready to quit then. So I've been dreading and looking forward to this day at the same time.

I completely understand this. Lately it just really hurts, and even though I try to explain to her how to latch better, and she listens and tries it, it still hurts. This morning she actually didn't nurse, just snuggled with me for a while after she woke up, and it was nice.

Piepie, so sorry your sick. We've noticed that with Josephine as well, she will be just mildly sick (usually first) and then either of us (or both) gets hit really hard. I hope you feel better soon. Try not to get too stressed over your family's visit. (advice I need to follow)

And this is totally irrelevant right now, but if you want to do just the minimum of temping, I'd do it on the same days you do your fertility monitor sticks, and then for a few days after the peak reading just to confirm the temp rise over the cover line. (and also in case you get several high readings and no peak again.)


----------



## Sihaya

Thanks everyone for the birthday wishes! We aren't doing anything special since we're attending five different holiday celebrations (plus Christmas Eve service at church) this Thurs-Sun. We got DS a potty and his own bed (to put next to ours) as gifts and will probably also be getting him a table and chairs in the next month or so.

As soon as this crazy cycle is over, we'll finally be not avoiding - I can't wait! I was *certain* I had O'd, even stopped taking OPKs, just to have a "warm-up" peak and now I'm not sure when I O'd. Doesn't matter since we were avoiding, but I was hoping it would be clear this cycle so I could be sure of my LP length. Anyway, hoping my next cycle will start around New Year's and fantasizing about a BFP before my birthday...

*Maela*, what huge milestones for you and Maev. So exciting!

*Piepie*, that stinks that you're sick. Hope you start feeling better very soon!







for issues with DH. I hope you're able to work through them.


----------



## Maela

Last night went well! She didn't even ask. So I said that I'd like to cuddle with her before bed since we're not nursing anymore, and she was very happy about that. I'm sure she was ready now.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

10.40pm Christmas Night...
Xmas is soooooooooo fun with a kid! (Sebby was 4 days old last Christmas, I was still delerious!) We had a gorgeous day.

As I flop into bed, most of you will just be stirring and soon to wake on Christmas morning. I hope you day is as magical as ours was!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Merry Christmas!!!!!!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Wonderful Christmas this year, so fun to have a toddler that is starting to understand all of the fun! We abstained from the larger family gatherings (which was brilliant, I wish I had done this years ago), and all of the parties were spaced out over several days. Very laid-back and kid-friendly (thus parent friendly). And, I'm not as inundated with junk like I usually am. Only a few things went straight into the Goodwill box. Fenton got a remote-control car that we are ALL enjoying. And a tent-tunnel combo that takes up the entire living room.







Which he loves and has already incorporated into all of the (very active) pretending he's engaging in lately







.

I need to figure out a game plan for how to deal with my mom. Picture a woman who is stooping over while children are opening gifts, thrusting a camera up and in their face, shouting at them "Woo hoo! Over here! Smile! Smile for Grandma!". Made gift opening tense and grumpy for me, though Fenton just calmly walked away from her each time. Wouldn't you know, we gave her a digital camera for Christmas.....Talk about buyers regret....DH said it's as if she buys gifts and thinks it buys her entitlement to a certain reaction from the kids. Common, but given my mom's mental and emotional limitations, I'm trying to figure out a "rule" to talk with her about (only 1 picture, click away but stop shouting at the kids? She's does NOT understand nuance). Taps into my moral outrage at people being more concerned with evidence of having a good time rather than actually having a good time.

Funniest moment yesterday: Eating christmas dinner, and DH leaves the table to see what "the boys are up to". Comes back to regretfully tell us that the boys have opened every package under the tree. And my mother, desperate to preserve her camera moments, goes about re-wrapping the gifts







.


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
Funniest moment yesterday: Eating christmas dinner, and DH leaves the table to see what "the boys are up to". Comes back to regretfully tell us that the boys have opened every package under the tree. And my mother, desperate to preserve her camera moments, goes about re-wrapping the gifts







.

We have a similar story here. I found Maev a few days ago with her stocking pulled down from the mantel (so relieved she didn't hurt herself







) and she was playing with the little figurines of sleeping beauty and cinderella that were in there. (Yes, we love disney and she loves princesses







) She said, "my stocking just fell down, and I got cinderella!"

We had a great christmas too! I'm really looking forward to next year though when Jaim will be probably walking and opening up his presents too.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Thought I'd pop over here while I am on MDC looking for pink eye remedies. Going to try breast milk and wait and see until tomorrow.


----------



## ~Shanna~

AAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Have any of you ever tried to put drops in a toddlers eyes????????????????????
I'm at a loss, it's been nearly impossible to get breast milk in Fenton's eyes, and going to the dr. is going to mean.....drops in the eyes. We've even tried sitting on him an just generally manhandling him, but you really can't force someone's eye open. I think I got a little in, but

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!! !









So, so grumpy. Trying to remember that my big fear this year is complications from swine flu, so this should be a cake walk. But the funny thing is that... its not. And keeping Fenton away from Reece is heartbreaking


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

*Shanna*, you could try bathing F's eyes in aloe vera juice. I've had luck with that for myself before and it may be easier to bathe as opposed to drop-in.

Love love love your present/christmas tree story. My mother would have done exactly the same thing!

Has anyone seen _Away We Go_? I'd been waiting for it to be released here forever and Mum took S so DP and I could go on a date. I loved it - _except_ for that one bit with the continuum parents - I really felt as though that whole section wasn't true to the film. Those parents were like caricatures whereas the other parents were loads of fun, and interesting and far more 'real'. I was really disappointed.

I got DP a Wii for xmas. I've never been into video games and was nervous about introducing them into our house - especially now that we have a kiddo but DP has wanted one forever and ever and she never gets what she wants (and I always do...) Anyway...we've been having sooooooooo much fun with it! I love the interactivity of it. We haven't laughed so much in ages. The down side is that we're both sporting Wii Tennis shoulder injuries...and that's kind of embarassing!

Heading down the coast with my molar cutting, grumpy, snotty babe for xmas with my Dad tonight. This should be fun.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
*Shanna*, you could try bathing F's eyes in aloe vera juice. I've had luck with that for myself before and it may be easier to bathe as opposed to drop-in.

Thanks - F is notoriously cautious about these things, not sure if it would be better or not. Manhandled him one more time with bm, now I'm not sure if I'm seeing low-level pink eye or red/puffy/watery from his cold. Never saw mucous from eye.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Has anyone seen _Away We Go_? I'd been waiting for it to be released here forever and Mum took S so DP and I could go on a date. I loved it - _except_ for that one bit with the continuum parents - I really felt as though that whole section wasn't true to the film. Those parents were like caricatures whereas the other parents were loads of fun, and interesting and far more 'real'. I was really disappointed.

Cant wait to see this. i have the hots for Jim and Maggie. Interesting plot to me.

Congrats on the Wii - I'm not a gamer either, but I hear they are great fun. Must try.

Felt a little blue this chtistmas: between Fen's diet and my hand recovery, I couldn't do _anything_ for the holidays with Fenton that I've looked forward to doing "once he's old enough". We're on month 11 of his diet and will be introing "illegal" foods in a month or two, trying not to get my hopes up. told DH that i want to celebrate "Christmas in July" if Fen's eating is less restrictive and I have an opposable thumb. Can't wait to decorate a gingerbread house or train with him









Have to decide soon about whether I want to go through childbirth educator training with Birthing From Within. Training is in May at The Farm.








I'll feel moreconfident once I know more about DHs grad school acceptances, hopefully before the March deadline. Have a _lot_ of big ideas on hold until I know if we have to move or not.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

Cant wait to see this. i have the hots for Jim and Maggie. Interesting plot to me.

Have to decide soon about whether I want to go through childbirth educator training with Birthing From Within. Training is in May at The Farm.








I'll feel moreconfident once I know more about DHs grad school acceptances, hopefully before the March deadline. Have a _lot_ of big ideas on hold until I know if we have to move or not.

This movie made me not be so in love with Maggie. Perhaps that's why I feel so disappointed!

Training at the farm...wow...I know what my decision would be!


----------



## PiePie

so far the transition to the family bed has not been going well. it's hard to say, because there is a lot of other stuff going on right now -- post-Christmas excitement, post-visit from my family, having both parents home all day to play with her, no school and with that comes less reliable naps, but so far putting her down takes forever. i rock her in the rocking chair and read stories and then turn off the lights and listen to the same lullabies we have for a while while rocking and nursing. she is ricocheting between which parent she wants, which i interpret as nothing more than a delay tactic but dh fee;s it is really important that we are there for herf upon her request so she doesn't feel abandoned in her time of transition. my rule is that she can be on the lap or in her bed -- i don't care what she does in her bed but she has to be there, not on the floor. the first night she rocked to sleep eventually and i put her in the big girl bed where she slept until 2:30 when she needed to nurse and i took her into the family bed so that i could lie down while nursing (parenting fail?). last night she didn't go down so after an hour and 10 minutes i told her i was going to sleep in the family bed so she could either stay up and play or stay in her big girl bed or come with me i didn't care but i was going to sleep. she opted to come with me and as soon as we were in our familiar position she was asleep in seconds, although i couldn't sleep for hours. just going to keep riding out the great experiment. fortunately we have all of this week off work, so that is great in terms of having a flexible schedule to work around her sleeping times. i keep remembering that i cannot make a child sleep but i do secretly wonder if i effed her up by nightnursing, etc.


----------



## cking

MMM, I was disappointed with that part of the film too. Tom was esp pissed about their (main characters) comment about midwives and doulas. (he loved our doula and is pushing to hire her again). Also disappointed with Maggie - watched a bit of the commentary on dvd where she said she made the part more real b/c is already a mom - like knowing how to tie a sling - but the crappy way she modeled the Moby wrap with a _sleeping_ babe also







me.
Sorry, hope that didn't spoil it for anyone.









Shanna, OMG, you would be freaking awesome at teaching BFW. We loved our class (cbe was also our doula








). And training at the Farm would rock too.
I've been leafing through Ina May's guide... and I can't help but chuckle at how stereotypically hippy the language is...but it's so nice to hear so many positive stories in one place.
_eta: it was Spiritual Midwifery. I thought I had remember that the language in her Guide was a little more modern...._

Also enjoyed your Christmas stories, Shanna and Maela. We had a very nice Christmas, and loved watching J take it all in. It's weird, I kinda felt like we're more of a family this year than last year. I really think Josephine enjoyed most of her gifts, including a couple homemade: play kitchen and ergo-style doll carrier.







(I will post pics on FB soon.) And some MIL stories too.









Quick question on gift etiquette: what to do when someone gives your child a gift that you already have? I think I messed this one up by not mentioning it right away..then i felt it was too late, and the wrapping was taken off already rendering it unreturnable.









And, a little late, but







Teo!!! Can't believe he's three.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
i do secretly wonder if i effed her up by nightnursing, etc.

Is there a co-sleeping, breastfeeding Mama alive who doesn't wonder this? I recently started a natural parenting playgroup and have felt so relieved to know that I'm not the only one who constantly questions my parenting choices. When it's good it's great but the hard bits and the transitions are really, really tough. My recent mantra 'think big picture.' This is such an intense time, but it's so short and I'm already seeing a really gentle, secure, confident, independent little boy emerging...imagine what a great big kid he's gonna be!
[Listen to me, like I've got my shit together and am an expert. It's amazing the difference a few weeks can make. A month ago, I was struggling soooooo much and today, the fact that I have a teething, cranky toddler and haven't slept for 2 nights is just rolling off me. This trip is SUCH a trip!]


----------



## cking

Oh, and I had a confrontation with my SIL and brother re: starting solids for their three-month old (they are planning to start next week







) I lent her my copy of Baby-Led Weaning and sent them a copy of Sears' Baby Book, but not sure that will help. Most info I can find is geared toward breastfed babies, which this little boy is not. Also mostly annoyed with my mom for chiming in (along with my two other SILs) about how wonderful starting solids is and how she thinks he's ready for it...since I've heard her talk lately about how she wishes she hadn't started so early with her kids, but didn't know better at the time. wth, mom?


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

PS - I love our little tribe. It's so incredible that we all came together around being childless and are now growing these awesome, amazing little people...and that we all share a history and values and genuinely like and respect one another. Thank You.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Indeed! *HAPPY BIRTHDAY TEO*!


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
Is there a co-sleeping, breastfeeding Mama alive who doesn't wonder this?

true, true (esp when DH has made such accusations.







) I do think the week off can be both a help and a hindrance. DD is totally enjoying her time with Dada home - in fact they both took a nap *_without me_* today. But I think next week will be a big step back.

This is totally random, but I wonder if transitioning her is harder now since it's winter? There have been several nights recently when dd woke up, but just wanted us to cuddle with her - I think she's just cold. (and one early morning when DH was actually able to pull this off and I got to stay in bed! another first.) Could you try transitioning her to her bed in your room? (barring space limitations...)

It's funny - J is pretty much transitioned to her own bed; but at this point with baby2 coming so soon, I've been wondering how we'll handle morning nursing and/or cuddling - I've been coming to her for a while, so I'm trying to see if she'll be able to come to me. Wishing we had a bigger bed b/c four in a queen just won't do it.


----------



## PiePie

seriously desperate for some more words of wisdom re the sleeping thing. dh is starting to question whether moving her from the family bed is the right move. mind you this whole thing was his idea. i am frustrated at her and at myself. apparently i have an hour and 45 minutes before i surrender and need to take some personal time. going to try to read to myself. dh is asleep and dd wants my attention.


----------



## PiePie

*cking*, depends on what the gift is. if it is something huge and giant that you could only possibly want one of, then regifting is cool, or selling. i bought dd's tonka truck off of a mom who was given it for kids who were too old for it. but if it is something small, you might want one on each floor or one for the diaper bag. we got 4 duplicate board books when she was a baby and i don't regret not returning them. also surprised re 3 mos. the aap recs differ from 4 mos. to 6 mos. -- the nutrition comm. says 4, the bfing comm. says 6, don't know any mainstream rec for under 4.


----------



## cking

Piepie, how long have you been trying the transition? Maybe it just needs more time. I know, not exactly words of wisdom.











Well, the gift isn't huge, but not sure we need a duplicate. It's the bee bop band - instruments in a drum. Kinda clunky, plastic instruments; plus we have a ton of other instruments, and she just got some more for Christmas. DH suggested leaving it at MIL's house, so we might do that. I just never realized how $$$ it was, as the other one was a hand-me-down. And we're both surprised that the gift givers never noticed the set that has been prominantly displayed in our living room for the past year.

Shanna, so sorry you're dealing with pink eye. I have trouble putting anything in my own eyes. I can imagine how hard it is with Fenton.


----------



## witchygrrl

cking, Rhea got that for Xmas, and she loves it. I would probably leave it elsewhere too. We're talking about how we need to go through Rhea's toys and start putting some of them in other houses (like the ILs) as we just don't have the room. Of course, we could just give them to other kids as well. We'll see how that goes.

Xmas was pretty good, though it stretched out until yesterday so that we could see ALL of the family. We were supposed to go to VT for some R and R, but it's going to snow for the next 4 days, so I think we're just going to go back home for the rest of winter break.

The other night, DH started talking about the eventual transition of nightweaning and total weaning. Nearly broke my heart, even though there are plenty of nights I wish that I had nightweaned DD already. I just feel like she still NEEDS it, so I shouldn't. But I don't want to be a martyr, either. Dh's aunt and uncle were asking us about our family bed situation (and they're totally supportive of it), and basically our answer was that she'll sleep in our bed until she asks to do otherwise. I don't know how this will play out, but it's our hope. Of course, we're also not looking to have other children, so I think it'll be simpler in that respect. Our old upstairs neighbors also had a family bed, with multiple beds pushed together, so I think their family of four (Maybe 5 now--she was pregnant when we moved) all slept in the same room together. They seemed to be okay with it, although I kinda thought that was pushing my limits.

I wish I had some wisdom, but as my DD is younger, I don't have anything to add here other than what we're hoping for. but I echo MMM's sentiment. I







this group!


----------



## accountclosed3

i would say that--for the first time in a long time--it was a really nice christmas. no family crazy even!

ok, i did feel like i wa sherding cats at times, but all in all, it was really a nice holiday. probably because no one wants drama at what could be a last xmas together.









it was also nicely spread-out. thursday, my father, ryan and i took hawk to his first movie--the princess and the frog. he *loved* it. as you might recall, he is obvcessed with music. watched the whole thing sitting in my father's lap, except the most tense part where he darted across our laps and nursed. LOL my father really enjoyed taking him to his first movie.

then on friday, we went to my ILs. because i'd made an extensive list of what we needed for NZ (clothing wise, etc), and a clear ssuggestion as to what to get the baby as a toy, we got a lot on our lists that are just perfecto. i was unhappy with the camoflage shirt that MIL gave him, but otherwise, it's all good. the big hit from that family was the harmonica that his aunt got him (also a small set with maracas, a tamorene (sp?), and a recorder that soudns like crap. but he figured out the harmonica in about 20 mintues and LOVES it).

then on saturday, my parents came down and gave hawk his gifts. more clothes (and gift cards for us), a teddy bear (i ordered a musical box windy thingy to sew into it), and the ukulele that my sister got for him. we got the case and extra strings. hawk went ape-poop crazy over the uke. played it, wanted everyone else to play it.

by sunday, not wanting the uke to get destroyed and also tired of 'playing' the poor out of tune thing, we came up with "uke needs a nap!" and so we put uke back in the box with a "blanket" (pillowcase) and hawk gave it a nice kiss "goodnight." later, i took it out and learned to tune it and we all played the various instruments with abandon and taking turns with which instrument. then, we put uke to bed.

so, we sold our house and closing is on modnay, thus this holiday season has been nuts because of that. getting the house ready, packing, all of the inspections (i felt like they wanted to see the place a million times), and just getting things ready to go has been a lot of work.

this weekend, we move out and move in with friends temporarily. ryan is off on thurs so we finish packing then. on friday, i pick up the old footlocker/trunks i found on craigs list (which will fit al of hawks toys and instruments save the uke in one, and that gives us a second o ne for "whatever."), pack up whatever else might be left, and divide it into the right "piles"--storage, donation, going with us, and going to auction.

saturday i teach and then we move our stuff over to our friend's house (the bed and bedding, toys and clothes that we're taking with us), my parents come to take stuff to storage, and the moving guys come to take everything left to the auctioneer.

we'll spend the night at my parents (having unloaded our stuff into their storage), and then come back on sunday for a final cleaning, and then do more shopping for the odds and ends that we need.

next week, we have closing on monday, banking on tuesday, and lawyer on wednesday, ryan's fittings on thursday (for his clothes, they always have to get taken in, up, around, whatever. LOL). friday and saturday i work again, but we also have friend's coming that weekend.

then, we hope that the visa will come. the FBI's stuff is due "any day now" (we're in the 9th-10th week of waiting and it is supposed to come in 8-10 wks); and we're talking with immigration tonight to figure out if we can come early with a temp work visa or as tourists.

also, ryan's entering a screenwriting/film contest in NZ, winners have to be there Jan 18, so if he wins, he'll have to be there. and, we have to tell them that we have new contact info!

whew. so much fun.


----------



## Maela

So much to read in just a few days! You guys have been writing a lot!

I agree with MMM. I love this little tribe we've got here too! You guys make me feel normal.







Even a little mainstream sometimes.









Shanna, sorry about the pink eye. That stinks.

PiePie, I think it just takes time. (moving out of the family bed) Maev still isn't fully "transferred." She's nightweaned and she still wakes up at least once a night! Once she wakes up, we move her to a sleeping bag on our floor because our queen is not big enough for the four of us.

ZB, everytime you post about your move I get so excited (and a little jealous)!


----------



## PiePie

we have tried the independent sleep thing for only 3 nights so far. my big issue is getting her down. i try to nurse her in teh rocking chair but she has the option of being in her bed by herself but not elsewhere in her room, and she can't bring delicate dollhouse accessories into the bed. she switches between which parent she demands and that is annoying to me. i have found that i am willing to try for an hour and 45 minutes and then i revert to the tried and true. but thanks for the reality check, i needed it! maybe she just needs more time and i should work the 2 hour nightly routines into my schedule until it works. dh is supposed to take over taking care of her during nightwakings starting tonight -- i give that zero percent chance of happening, though.


----------



## Maela

Oops! I also meant to say Happy (belated) Birthday to Teo!!!


----------



## Maela

Jaim's Birth Story

It's kind of long.


----------



## accountclosed3

yeah, i only write so that people will be jealous. LOL









i read, quite a bit, but if i have nothing to add--pink eye or what have you--then i can't say much, can i? lol

i have two questions though:

1. how do you exfoliate a dry baby? i can oil him no problem, but he hates baths (so no oatmeal soak) and i don't want too rough of an exfolation cream on his skin (he won't like that i'm sure!).

and

2. how do you keep your clothes and sweaters from pilling and linting up? i can't tand my clothes looking like this.


----------



## accountclosed3

good birth story, too. i love reading HB stories.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
1. how do you exfoliate a dry baby? i can oil him no problem, but he hates baths (so no oatmeal soak) and i don't want too rough of an exfolation cream on his skin (he won't like that i'm sure!).

and

2. how do you keep your clothes and sweaters from pilling and linting up? i can't tand my clothes looking like this.

I've heard of people using something like a "skin brush". I don't know if that's what they're called, but it exfoliates and is said to be invigorating - you brush your entire body as you would your hair. Maybe google different permutations of that concept? As for pilling, I take a disposable razor and shave my knits, though I'm not sure it would work well for weaves. Tshirts come out looking pretty newish after that, just make sure they're lying flat and taut.

Our birth center Yahoo group is swtiching to a vBulletin-like discussion format this week and in some fog of insanity I agreed to moderate the health forum. This puts the volatile topics of both circ AND vax in my corner. I don't know what I was thinking, our birth community gets hot around the collar on both issues......Guess I'm going to get good at confrontation.

Barely holding pink eye at bay, starting to wonder if it's something else. If it doesn't look remarkably better tomorrow, I think I'm going to push for us to go to urgent care (assuming I can't get into ped that day). His eyeballs are looking clear, but he looks so red and swollen around his eyes. Which could be his cold, but a couple of patches of red and abrasive have me nervous. Could just be from him rubbing, but I'm picturing all sorts of exotic things I've never heard of.


----------



## cking

Maela, thanks for sharing Jaim's birth story . I really enjoyed reading it.









Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I've heard of people using something like a "skin brush". I don't know if that's what they're called, but it exfoliates and is said to be invigorating - you brush your entire body as you would your hair. Maybe google different permutations of that concept?

I use a skin brush (sometimes) and it works well. Maybe a very soft brush for baby? Also, I use baking soda to exfoliate my face - maybe that would be more gentle for baby skin too...?

For pilling, I have a sweater stone. I think it's a very smooth pumice. It seems to work well, and lasts a long time.


----------



## TwilightJoy

zb- I have both a skin brush and a facial skin brush. The facial one is softer. I think mine came from frontier. LMK if you want links or something and I'll try to find the time to find them. It's wedding craziness here.


----------



## accountclosed3

i have one, i'll try the brush!









but here is the BIG NEWS.

Ryan needs your votes!

here's his note to all of you (and everyone):

Dear Friends,

I've entered the Your Big Break filmmaking competition in New Zealand and would love to have your vote!

Voting is simple. Check out my entry, "Capturing the Spirit," at http://nzt.strutta.com/entries/10773 and click the big green button! When you register, you'll be entered into the sweepstakes to win a trip to New Zealand !

Voting closes at 11:59 AM PST on January 15, 2010. Thank you for your support!

Ryan

P.S. Please feel free to pass this message on to your friends!

-----

i hope that you enjoy his script, his pitch film, and all of that. And when you win your trip to NZ, you can visit us. We'll feed you, we'll baby sit your baby for a night on the town. it'll be awesome!


----------



## accountclosed3

a sweater stone? you save my existence.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I dont know if its the new year, or the fact that I'm still losing baby weight, but I'm feeling blue about how frumpy parenting is making me feel lately. I feel like everything about how I look is linked to parenthood. I miss carrying a purse instead of just my wallet in the diaper bag. I'm tired of short hair that's "easier". And I miss the clothes I could wear before I had to have access to my breasts every hour and a half, and before I could count on my toddler wiping his nose on me..

I'm not particularly vain, but it's hard enough to have my sleeping, eating, conversation, viewing and reading patterns taken over by parenthood. But when it takes over my lingerie too.....

What do all of you do to deal with this? Anyone else feel this way? I just knew I shouldn't have looked through that Eddie Bauer catalogue!

~
I'm playing with my Christmas present today: Photoshop Elements. I've started digital scrapbooking with it. I know, i know...."how quaint". But I really love being able to integrate journaling with pictures, and I was never really into the kitschiness of reg scrapbooking. I'm loving digital because it's perfect if you love the product but hate the process. and i can nak.








~
I'm putting together a 6 week workshop on "Parenting for Peace and Justice" that DH and I are going to lead after Easter. I'm feeling like most of the resources we're drawing from are heavy on inter-family peace (conflict resolution, etc.) but there's little out there on activism for families. Feeling a little at a loss given that my kids are so young so I don't have a lot of experience with integrating children into activism beyond just bringing them along. Do you guys have any ideas for what you'd be interested in on this topic? Any stories on how you've approached it?

Going to read about Jaim's birth!


----------



## Sihaya

I just wanted to echo MMM's sentiment. I am still amazed at how frequently I learn new things or am reminded of something really cool and/or important by you ladies. I know I don't contribute much and am not always a ray of sunshine, but I appreciate this group more than I can put into words.









*Maela* - Thank you for sharing Jaim's birth story!

*zoebird* - I'll third the skin brush. I don't use it for exfoliation, but DS begs me to brush his skin when I'm using it. He loves it! Your upcoming move sounds so exciting - I'll be living vicariously through you









An embarrassingly late







to Teo.

On the bed-transitioning front, we are in no hurry to get DS in his own room. My goal is to have no more than 3 children in the bed at once (including a 3+ month pg belly as a child), meaning my general goal is to have DS (and most likely #2 with him) in a different sleeping space from us by the time he is 7-8yo. Of course, our eventual bed solution is three mattresses (1 King with a twin on either side) on the floor of a sleeping loft, which I realize is really not an option for most people.

DS's bed actually just came in the mail yesterday. He fell asleep in it last night, but gradually made his way across and we woke up on the other side of the big bed together







Glad to transition him out of the hammock, though, as he is starting to get too heavy for it.

On the TTC front, AF came a few days ago and so we are officially not avoiding this cycle. My last cycle was wonky with a short LP and spotting for 4 days before AF, so I'm concerned that a pg this month would result in another m/c, but at the same time I don't want to take a bunch of supplements before my body has had some more time to even itself out... Feeling







but wishing I could be a bit more







about the whole thing.


----------



## Maela

*Shanna,* yes I have been feeling the same way lately. Since this is most likely our last baby, I've been able to cheer myself up with the thought that it will only get better from here on out (frumpiness-wise). I've started exercising every other day for half an hour, and as soon as i lose a bit more of the baby weight, I'm going shopping with my chruistmas money! right now i feel like i have nothing to wear (I have two pairs of pants that i can wear out of the house - and they are maternity







). My underwear is old and holey... And I am SO tired of having to watch what i wear to make sure it works well for bfing discreetly. I never was much of a dress-wearer before having kids, but now I can't wait to wear them again. I had a brief couple of months when i could wear thejm this summer because maev wasn't really nursing during the day anymore. It was so nice!! I also can't wait to carry a purse again someday. right now my wallet is just a pouch that came with my diaper bag.







It looks really fasionable when i run to the store real quick while dh watches t6he kids.







But usually i'm just so happy to get out of the house...

~~~~~~~~~~~

I was just sitting here complaining, and I got a call from someone from church letting us know that our mutual friends' son's cancer has returned.







He's only four. He was adopted by our friends a couple of years ago. so he had arough start already, and now there's this. He had eye cancer and now it is in his arm. Please think good thoughts for him...


----------



## PiePie

omg i am super frumpy, super fat, thanks to BFing eating habits and sedentary job, no clothes fit, don't want to spend $ on clothes because want to be in maternity clothes, ugh ugh ugh. woh makes it so much worse because everyone i work with is in a different stage of life -- mostly size zero petite singles, and then one new mom but via adoption and therefore no body changes, and one other mom but her kid is way old and she doesn't have custody. so i am alone, with the adoptive new mom, in having to choose between working out and time with child. guess what wins. i did go on one shopping spree to get work appropriate clothes -- my advice to you is do not by from j. jill -- their stuff does not hold up at all. in fact i am going to buy a sweater for myself as a post-christmas present, will take survey as to which to get, just to be frivolous. even if i do get pregnant i will need new sweaters to get through the winter. even my boss makes comments on how i need to buy clothes to fit the body i have now, quoting somebody from tv. nice.


----------



## PiePie

*sihaya*, it is really hard to be zen about ttcing. sometimes i am, sometimes i'm not.


----------



## ~Shanna~

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
even my boss makes comments on how i need to buy clothes to fit the body i have now, quoting somebody from tv. nice.

I'm with you: i'm willing to buy clothes for the body I have, but I'm not willing to buy clothes for the body I have now, then buy more clothes for the body I have in 2 weeks. wish i knew if it was wishful thinking that I'll fit into my pre-pg clothes again. Thought I had got around it for a while by buying DH some new jeans with the understanding that I got to wear them until I lost weight. But now those are a little too big, and my pre clothes are still too small. Ugh. I can't bear to have 5 different sizes of things in my wardrobe. So tired of feeling frumpy. When Dh and i were on our honeymoon in Paris 9 years ago (and can I say that I miss that life sometimes?







), I bought this great pair of black suede knee-high boots with a killer heel. naughty boots. Boots I wonder if I'll ever wear again. Even a great pair of shoes isn't working for me - carrying a baby or chasing a toddler in shoes like that? So even getting past nursing doesn't feel like the real issue. I'm just trying to figure out how to feel like myself for the long parenting haul in front of me. Because fenton will probably continue to wipe his nose on me for the forseeable future







. And, for the record, those boots weren't that practical even before I had kids, maybe that's what I need to keep in mind. I wasn't exactly wearing thongs 4 years ago anyway.....But I could if I wanted to.

The punchline to this little frump crisis of mine is that I'm reading The Feminine Mystique. Somehow that makes this even funnier.

Maela, I'm so sorry about your friend's little boy.


----------



## accountclosed3

it took me 15 months. i'm still fine tuning, but overall, i feel very good about my body now. in August, no.

everything down under is back to normal. belly looks good. size 4 jeans fit a bit baggy (which is how they fit pre-preg, but i was and am too big for size two, and most are too short anyhow). breasts a little saggy but i'm doing some specific muscle work to get a bit more lift (and a good bra goes a long way).

i've been wearing heels since hawk was on the move. i thought it would help me adapt. i wore wedges first; i found i had more balance. now, i can do well even in 3-4 inch heels so long as i'm not on the grass and it's not icy. of course, i don't like to wear those for too long, except my favorite pair of wedges that are super comfortable.

i tend to wear t-shirt material clothes. skirts and dresses (usually wearing a fitted short-short underneath so i can be more active), either heels or sporty flats when i'm going to be active-active (or hiking; i can hike in nearly anything though--though i wear jeans and hiking shoes when going on longer, heavier hikes), and other times just jeans and T-s.

i don't mind if hawk wipes his food, nose, or whatever on me. i carry wipes that i made that are basically detergent/soap and a bit of water. quick rub-rub and everything comes out. it's the tiniest bit of soap because otherwise it looks oily. but, it works well for me.

i try to keep it simple.

skirts/dresses helped me feel less frumpy.


----------



## Maela

Happy new year!!! Dh and I have been married for six years today.









My goal is to feel less frumpy by the end of the year!


----------



## Maela

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
i have one, i'll try the brush!









but here is the BIG NEWS.

Ryan needs your votes!

here's his note to all of you (and everyone):

Dear Friends,

I've entered the Your Big Break filmmaking competition in New Zealand and would love to have your vote!

Voting is simple. Check out my entry, "Capturing the Spirit," at http://nzt.strutta.com/entries/10773 and click the big green button! When you register, you'll be entered into the sweepstakes to win a trip to New Zealand !

Voting closes at 11:59 AM PST on January 15, 2010. Thank you for your support!

Ryan

P.S. Please feel free to pass this message on to your friends!

-----

i hope that you enjoy his script, his pitch film, and all of that. And when you win your trip to NZ, you can visit us. We'll feed you, we'll baby sit your baby for a night on the town. it'll be awesome!

I just finished reading the script, and I liked it! Hopefully I'll win the trip and see you in NZ!!


----------



## ~Shanna~

AF again. 21 days after it came back, which i bled for half of. do cycles ever go shorter before they level out? Starting to think something is a bit off.


----------



## Sihaya

Shanna, IME luteal phases tend to be shorter when cycles come back while bfing. So if you are ovulating mid-cycle, it can result in a shorter cycle. Also could be anovulatory still, in which case length can vary widely.


----------



## accountclosed3

not ryan's film or anything, but such a lovely ad/video, we had to share: 100% Pure New Zealand: Forever Young.

we're moving out of our house tomorrow (had to move it back a day because hawk got vomit/diarrhea--he's fine). we have about 25 boxes for storage, our art, and a chair i can't let go of. 12 bags to carry with us. it's something else--liberating.


----------



## PiePie

just wanted to thank yall for the advice on the transitioning out of the family bed. it seems to be working. caveats that i have to get up in the early morning repeatedly to nurse her and that she fights going down. not that she never had trouble getting to sleep before and we didn't bail on the bedtime routine and hit the reset button when we were in teh family bed, it just seems more frequent now. hard to say if it is related to the transition or to the many other changed circumstances due to holidays, extended family visits, etc. hoping that when school starts she will snap back into her old school.


----------



## Maela

I just wanted to ask you all what you would do in these situations. I'd like to try the gentlest methods first, but I don't know what they would be. I'm not the best at gd (although there definitely has never been hitting/spanking).

Maev is hitting, throwing, kicking, and screaming - not just when she doesn't get her way (although that does seem to be the cause many of the times) - sometimes it just seems to be out of the blue.
Some examples -
She threw a small plastic tractor at my sister last night (no idea why).
Dh saw her throw a book at the nursery teacher at church as he was coming in to pick her up (he didn't see what happened before).
She kicked Jaim in the head (he's fine) last night when we were all sitting on her bed reading bedtime stories.
She asked me where one of her toys was today, and I said I didn't know (I truly didn't), and all of a sudden she screamed at me, "Where is my toy!!"

This behavior is SO not like her. She's always had a little bit of a temper (like her mama








), but this is weird. And it's not okay that she's hurting us and others. It's been happening for about a week. So far we've tried ignoring the behaviors, giving her extra hugs (when it's happening), explaining why it's not okay, leaving the room, and traditional time-outs where she sits in a certain spot for two minutes. We haven't been really consistent in anything. Although we did just decide to take a second to ask her if she needs a hug as soon as she starts "misbehaving" (I hate that word). We are going to be consistent on that.

Anyway, what would you do?


----------



## accountclosed3

like you, i would ask her if she wants some of your attention. Jaim is probably taking a lot of it, and it might be helpful for you or her father to say "do you want me to hold Jaim so that you can be with mommy?" and so on. sometimes, they just need one on one time with mommy. they just want those hugs and attention.

it might also be that you can direct with specifics--only throw soft balls! be mindful when moving and kicking your feet! keeping language in the positive is really helpful. hawk gets excited and starts "hitting." he's not tryin to, he just gets excited with certain touching motions (stroking your face or hair), and starts to go faster and harder. so we say "gentle with bodies, gentle touching" and he immediately gets it (gentle touching being one of the first "cues" he got).

now, a long term element that we implement is our meditation space. right now--living with friends and their immense clutter, plastic noisemaking toys and such--it's hard to carve out a space, but we were able to create a small space in our room that is the meditation corner.

thich naht hahn (vietnamese zen monk, author) talks about having a meditation space in your home (a separate room if you can), where you can go to meditate. he recommends meditating as a family--inviting young children to sit with you in that space.

he recommends that it is a no-anger/negative emotion space. to demonstrate how this is the case, if you feel angry, you say "i am feeling angry. i will go to the meditation space to be quiet until it transitions into understanding." then, you go to the meditation space.

what we discover in practice is that 1. hawk invites us to meditate when he feels us getting too stressed (eg, during our move, he kept trying to draw us into the meditation room/yoga room of our old house, and he would want to sit in our laps for a time--we took turns meditating with him), 2. older children will go there themselves to process their emotions.

you may not be a meditator, but even calling it a quiet space, or a place of peace, or whatever might work for you may be a good option for any time the feelings--any feelings at all--are getting strong and overwhelming.

the fact that both ryan and i identify our feelings and then utilize the space (or the practice of meditaiton in ryan's case; he doesn't always meditate in the meditation room that we had, though he did use the corner we set up today), we find that hawk will also use it or invite us to use it.

in other families who use it, older children will go there to "avoid being in trouble"--if they have done something wrong, they'll go there and then no one can be angry. but after a time of quiet, they can peacefully talk about what happened and how everyone was affected (after the age of reason).

i have to go. hawk has gotten over stimulated by this place. we all need some time in nature.


----------



## farmama

Hey all,

just want to echo the sentiments of others that this is an awesome group of ladies









i know i'm mostly a lurker, but i do fly by to check in on everyone, even in the crazy summer season.

i'm having some issues with dd, mostly because she gets over the top emotionally with increasing frequency. she loves to get into everything, and after redirecting her energy constantly (and gently reminding her that standing on her toys with wheels isn't safe) i develop a screechy tone that i grit my teeth against even as i'm doing it.

we're also going through the nap/no nap issues that you had shanna...i decided on no nap today, because i'm so tired from last night's tossing and turning that i'd rather have screaming and breakdowns, if only i can sleep









she's in a stage of rejecting dh, so i also get the needy/clingy crying and the "i want MAMA to do it" in regards to everything.

i love her so, and i always feel badly that i'm not my best and most zen self when she's at her most needy.

this too shall pass...this too shall pass...this too shall pass...


----------



## Sihaya

farmama,







I could have written your post. DS is in the same "Mama do it" stage, we finally just decided on no nap so he'll sleep at night, but that means no riding in the car after 3pm, which is just unreasonable, so when we have to go somewhere in the evening, he falls asleep and then bedtime is horrendous. Thanks for popping in, it's good to hear from you


----------



## PiePie

really behind in reading -- SORRY!! -- work has been hell for the last 2 days and today dd is not napping







but anyway i am stopping in with something light and diverting. let's say i want a non-frumpy sweater (per our earlier discussion). we know that even if i get pregnant like today i will not be showing for sweater weather. so what would you suggest?? linkies please







price range negotiable but ideally 60 or under.

gotta get her out of the house for my own sanity so off we go to the library


----------



## PiePie

on the hitting, throwing, kicking, we have a special pillow that she can do whatever with -- we direct her there. it hasn't been used in ages and i do not even no if i could find it if i had to. but it's a way of saying physical expression of anger, etc. is okay and here's how to direct it. i also try to label her emotions for her when she is in that space. that is not our issue now but we, like everyone here, are having our own. more anon.


----------



## ~Shanna~

I'll add only wasn't hasn't been said on hitting, since we first try redirecting, distraction, assuming it was an accident and asking him if he'd like to apologize:

If all the above fail, I tell Fenton that I can't allow him to hurt others and we'll need to go somewhere where everyone is safe. If he's hurting others, I'll offer to stay in his room with him until he feels like he can stop hitting. If it's me, he goes in there alone and I tell him cheerfully (well, not all the time) to please come out when you can stop hitting because it's not safe for me to let him hit me. I'm not big on time-outs, but I do think it's different when it's a logical consequence such as needing to keep violence away from others. Often, we do this over and over because he'll say he wants to come out and can stop himself from hitting, and then it will start all over.

This almost always happens if he's hungry, tired, or in his case, reacting to a food he's eating.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
really behind in reading -- SORRY!! -- work has been hell for the last 2 days and today dd is not napping







but anyway i am stopping in with something light and diverting. let's say i want a non-frumpy sweater (per our earlier discussion). we know that even if i get pregnant like today i will not be showing for sweater weather. so what would you suggest?? linkies please







price range negotiable but ideally 60 or under.

gotta get her out of the house for my own sanity so off we go to the library

Do you want a light sweater or a heavy one? Here are a few cute ones I saw:
http://www1.macys.com/catalog/produc...tegoryID=43837
http://www1.macys.com/catalog/produc...ategoryID=4098
http://oldnavy.gap.com/browse/produc...scid=696867002

I tried to find the sweater MIL gave me as it is super cute, but one I never thought I could pull off, and can. And I am totally frump-tastic. Alas, I can't seem to find it.


----------



## cking

Dd has starting saying "Big Sister!" at random times.







I guess she really _is_ listening to us. Or maybe it's because every stranger we run into asks her if she's going to be a big sister very soon.









I'm totally amazed by how observant she is. She has a little shopping basket that she uses to carry toys around. it also doubles as a doll bed. This morning she put the doll in, turned the basket upright and put a little towel over the basket. I was a little puzzled until I remembered that she saw a baby sleeping in a bucket seat with a blanket draped over her at a meeting the other day. [But also a little sad that she's seen this scenario more often than say, a baby sleeping in a sling. ] I wonder if she'll start draping blankets over the new babe.









edd is one month from today. i'm in denial.


----------



## accountclosed3

wow, already! amazing!

so hard to believe! freaks me out.









ryan said today "i think it would be cool if we adopted a little girl."

what? silly man. i've only been saying that for a decade too. what is happening? first, he wants to live clutter free. second, he wants to adopt a girl. what next? who is this man?


----------



## Maela

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...00&postcount=7






Thank you everyone for the advice. I'm trying to stay on top of things and give her lots of extra attention. It seems to be helping a bit.

*cking*, I can't believe how far along you are!


----------



## cking

So cute Maela!


----------



## TwilightJoy

Hi everyone! I have a few wedding and honeymoon pics up on facebook. I see a few of you have already found them.









Hope you're all well!


----------



## Holiztic

Not sure who administers the NMY group on Facebook, but thought I'd give a heads up that I just requested to join, my initials are EMM. Thanks!


----------



## accountclosed3

we have a facebook group? how do i find it?







i'm so new to facebook, it's ridiculous.


----------



## Maela

congratulations tj! you looked beautiful!


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *zoebird* 
we have a facebook group? how do i find it?







i'm so new to facebook, it's ridiculous.

me too!


----------



## ~Shanna~

Do you guys all remember my L&D cousin who expressed concern that I was going to deliver at a birth center?

She just gave birth to her first this week. Elective C-section. Anaphylactic shock. Hemhorage (sp?). She counts it as a success and will do it this way again.

How is Lorelei doing? Did the holidays shake out the challenges you were facing?


----------



## farmama

Quote:

She just gave birth to her first this week. Elective C-section. Anaphylactic shock. Hemhorage (sp?). She counts it as a success and will do it this way again.
Oh.My.Goodness. i'm hoping she was the one who went into anaphylactic shock and not the lo.









i just don't get it.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *farmama* 
Oh.My.Goodness. i'm hoping she was the one who went into anaphylactic shock and not the lo.









i just don't get it.

ditto.


----------



## witchygrrl

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 

She just gave birth to her first this week. Elective C-section. Anaphylactic shock. Hemhorage (sp?). She counts it as a success and will do it this way again.

Yikes. I don't get how people can justify this at all as being okay.


----------



## ~Shanna~

The thing that is making me nuts is that doctors are agreeing to do this despite the evidence and their vow to do no harm. When I see the same community who refuses to do VBAC because it's so "risky" then do elective Csection, I just don't get it.

My midwife, at the panel discussion following The Business of Being Born, responded to comments made during the movie about how the hormone concert of labor facilitates bonding. My MW said that she believed this was true, but that it didn't _preclude_ mothers from bonding with their babies if they had interventions. She said she simply believed that those mothers had to work harder. And she said that, in her experience, they did. Certainly I know of endless examples of parents who had interventions and are intuitive parents. And I also know the norm of interventions versus the norm of non-intuitive parenting. But I wonder, do the parents who "work harder" do so only because they know they have to? Does my cousin somehow know she has to work harder, or is she less likely to because she thinks there is no difference between disturbed and undisturbed birth? I've been thinking about this a lot, as I'm challenged with what I believe to be true about birth and the reality that I know so many parents who ended up with interventions that are still very intuitive with their children.

I'm aware that my cousin probably feels defensive about her choices towards me - she has acted that way in the past (remember the "epidural" high five?). I'm planning on taking them a meal soon, and feel awkward about how to relate to her. Do I ask about the birth? I'd like to spout the politically correct "I respect her choices", but frankly her choice breaks my heart. I'm so sad she lives in a world where she doesn't trust trust birth. I don't know what form my diplomacy will take when I see her. I'm just so sad.

PS Yes, she was the one who had all of the reactions.


----------



## Angelorum

Can I join you ladies? I used to post in the NMY thread way back before there was a graduates thread, but I can't really post there anymore as I finally graduated last July! I've just been feeling like I need some sisterhood lately. I saw this thread on New Posts and it was great to read about the new things all of you are up to.

On the frumpy front: I too, need more clothes. I have an embarrassing tendency to wear my pajama pants and a zippered hoody all day if I'm not going anywhere







. That makes me feel frumpy and lazy! I got a couple of pairs of good jeans post baby, but I really need more tops that I can nurse in. I have a few nursing tops MIL gave me from her store (bless her!). My favorite one didn't wash up very well and is now all pilly







. I have a couple that are ok, but sort of look like nursing shirts, and not like something I would have worn before. I miss dresses. I had (have) some super cute dresses that I wore before pregnancy, but there's no way I could nurse in them. We are trying to dig ourselves out of debt right now, so I can't really go shopping. I've been experimenting with things I can make. I have plans to make a nursing dress and sweater soon, crossing my fingers it will be a success. Oh, but I was ecstatic to find this dress. Completely nursing accessible (it's a super stretchy knit, the sides pull away easily) and just my style! They had it at the store I do alterations for, so I used my monthly bonus and got it for free!

Babe's asleep, gotta go get things done.


----------



## Rico'sAlice

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
But I wonder, do the parents who "work harder" do so only because they know they have to? Does my cousin somehow know she has to work harder, or is she less likely to because she thinks there is no difference between disturbed and undisturbed birth?

I can't answer your question univesally, but for me I defintely felt strongly that the way J was brought into the world was not right/ideal/normal and also did feel a great pain at the separation we experienced shortly after his birth. [Imediately after bitrht he was on the other side of the curtained being wiped off anfd I could hear him crying and I remember just crying to Enrcio, "My baby. I want my baby" over and over. And then he was broguht to me but I was still lying down and couldn't exactly hold him, more like he was sort of held on me. And that was for a minute or two and then they took him to be weighed and such while they stitched me up. And we met back in the room 30min later or so. Which was not "bad" for a CS compared to others' stories, but still lightyears from my ideal of going straight from vagina into DS's hands and then directly onto my chest and remaining there for a good long while!] I definitely felt a need to compensate for that. I was planing on kangaroo care, nursing, cosleeping, etc. beforehand anyway, but this made it feel all that more imperetive. Like I better not fail him any further.

But that feeling definitely came from a feeling (IMO knowledge] that the birth was very not ideal. And even though the separation wouldn't have been such and issue in a vaginal hospital birth, I would have felt that was a non-as-gentle-as-possible entrance as well, b/c of the lighting and such. Whereas if I thought that any live birth was a terrific birth then I don't see any reason why I would have worked harder to bond.

It may be that some mothers that have intervention filled births but are planning to breastfeed find breastfeeding more difficult b/c of the interventions. So they have to work harder, spend more time at nursing and that equals more bonding? While I didn't have any serious challenges with breastfeeding, I do know that nursing was the main thing in helping me heal from the birth. And what made me feel like I was actually J's mother, not just his incubator (since I had failed to "give birth" to him.) And so for _me_ nursing is the thing that facilitated our bonding.

But it is just always hard to talk about any of this without seeming to put certain categories of parent in the non-bonded category, or rather trying to find a way that counts for intention and effort. (Since we don't always _choose_ to have intervention filled births or not to breastfeed, etc.)
And there is also such a difference between the people I knoiw IRL, and what I find online. IRL, the poeple I know who didn't breastfeed either choose not to or "tried" but found it "too hard" or "didn't have any milk" after a couple of weeks (or even days!). The women who work tirelessly to feed their babies, pumping around the clock, trying every supplement, seeking help from LLL and lactation consultions, feeding donor milk with an SNS, and still not be able to have a fully successful nursing relationship, I've only encountered on the internet.

But there are many other things besides birth where you could pick one and say "that harms the bonding process" but still there are bonded mothers/parents that did that. And they don't think what they did was wrong or harmful to the bonding process, so they certainly were not conciously making up for it. (I'm particularly thinking about circumcision at the moment.)

There are certain practices though where I've never met anyone who really did them and has seemed really bonded to their baby. (Like CIO) In my perception of people I have known personally the mother surely loves the child, but doesn't seem to have the whole "heart wallking around outside of my chest" feeling.

Although someone else might think that is is impossible to spank if you're really bonded, and I've lost myself a couple of times and hit J. (Of course this was followed by lots of crying and apologizing, so maybe that's differenct from a bonding perspective than a routine administration of spanking for infraction XYZ.)

I have more, but it's trickier amount of time being separated from the baby/child stuff which I want to word just so. So, I will stop now, sleep, and try again tomorrow.


----------



## Angelorum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
I'm aware that my cousin probably feels defensive about her choices towards me - she has acted that way in the past (remember the "epidural" high five?). I'm planning on taking them a meal soon, and feel awkward about how to relate to her. Do I ask about the birth? I'd like to spout the politically correct "I respect her choices", but frankly her choice breaks my heart. I'm so sad she lives in a world where she doesn't trust trust birth. I don't know what form my diplomacy will take when I see her. I'm just so sad.

PS Yes, she was the one who had all of the reactions.

I wouldn't ask about the birth. I would just ask how she's feeling, gush over how cute the baby is and leave it at that.


----------



## witchygrrl

Angelorum, congrats on your baby! Come on in







We haven't had any newbies come join us so please do!

Shanna, yeah, I would try to keep it as neutral as possible even though it makes you cringe.


----------



## PiePie

We are doing well. DD's sleep is still not ideal, by which I mean bedtime resistance. I know that we had some of that before the transition from the family bed so I am trying not to blame it on that. DH thinks it is obviously that and I am in denial about it due to my guilt. Anyway, although she is up when she "shouldn't" be she is incredibly fun and I have decided to just enjoy her (while still encouraging sleep). I mean, most kids have trouble with bedtimes at some point in their lives, so it is not like I totally broke her by doing this weird thing, yk? She outed herself as a former cosleeper at school the other day, and I felt embarrassed, which DH found really odd.


----------



## accountclosed3

i, too, would just gush about the baby and tell the mother that she looks fabulous and you are so happy for her and happy that she is doing so well (unless she's complaining, in which case you can say in a more sympathetic tone, "you're doing so great; i'm proud of you.")

honestly, ive been in similar situations with other mamas and this is how i function. i was a the play-cafe on saturday, and talked to a mama there who launched into her birth story to me after i complemented her on her cutie pie baby.

it was a nightmare. i listened intently and i noted where she seemed upset and said "that sounds pretty traumatic; i'm so thankful that you are both safe and on the mend."

of course, she was a stranger. she then asked me about my birth, and i said "we were blessed that it was very uneventful." and left it at that. Ryan noted that she seemed so much more comfortable and grounded after that, and she and i exchanged emails and have chatted a bit. and he said he was very proud of me for listening so intently, supporting her gently, and completely avoiding a comparison game or spouting off about my awesome, playful, pleasurable UC.

i talk to hawk about it quite a bit though.

----

anyway, we're moving next week. we were told we can come on a tourist visa for 3 months and the LTBV should be through before that ends.

YES!


----------



## ~Shanna~

RA, I'm so grateful for your thoughtful response. I want to say more, but.....worst parenting night ever last night and I can barely string to thoughts together. Hope to be back soon.


----------



## Holiztic

Quote:


Originally Posted by *~Shanna~* 
RA, I'm so grateful for your thoughtful response. I want to say more, but.....worst parenting night ever last night and I can barely string to thoughts together. Hope to be back soon.

Oh Shanna, worst parenting night ever means a lot coming from anyone, but from you? I really hope everyone is all right and gets some sleep tonight!

So thought I'd drop in to update you all on Quinn. The good: He's 33 months, size of a 3.5-4 year old, speaks like a 4 year old--we have incredible conversations!--and eats everything I give him (like sardines, oysters, beets, artichokes, olives, etc.). He even sits at the table for an hour at every meal and talks with us while cleaning his plate. He's also officially diaper free all the time now (wears underwear to bed!) Really incredible! The bad: he's got some real aggression issues we're trying to work through. He rarely actually hits, but he speaks in a very angry tone when he's upset about anything (like a very hard "NNNNO! that's NNNNNOT okay" if a baby even looks at him! And BTW its about every other hour of the day that he's 'upset' about anything) and he pretends to hit or kick a lot (like he does the motion in your direction, just no contact, and often accompanies it with an aggressive word like BAM!). He's even pushed a few just kids over if he thinks they are at all in his way. We're trying to identify the causes of this (overtired Quinn and stressed Mommy and/or daddy spring to mind).

I'm well, finally not frumpy! I've been watching your discussion a bit. I got a haircut (just some long layers) and went shopping for some fashionable clothes (ohhh, ahhh) and even started wearing make-up again. I guess its a last ditch effort before thinking about getting pregnant again, which we are starting to do now that Q's so verbal, potty-trained and becoming more independent. Hopefully sometime this year, we'll see...

That's us, wish I kept up better with you ladies, but the time just goes so fast!


----------



## farmama

Home with my girl today after days of seed ordering and cataloguing. won't be back to seed drama until monday!

shanna,








Thinking of you. hope you're doing okay.

Zoe, i just keep getting more and more excited for you!

i almost applied for a job this week. key motivator: benefits. it was only a part time position, but it's a little scary to have cheap health insurance for us only. i didn't do it though.


----------



## cking

37 weeks today.


----------



## Angelorum

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 









37 weeks today.


























so exciting!

Anyone have any book recs for starting solids? Westley will be 6 mo in just a week, and I really should figure out how we are going to do the whole food thing. I think I've been in denial about him growing up so fast and so I haven't wanted to research it.


----------



## MujerMamaMismo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Angelorum* 







so exciting!

Anyone have any book recs for starting solids? Westley will be 6 mo in just a week, and I really should figure out how we are going to do the whole food thing. I think I've been in denial about him growing up so fast and so I haven't wanted to research it.

We did Baby Led Weaning with the assistance of the book of the same name - by Gil Rapley, I think...
It's perfect for us.


----------



## accountclosed3

we did baby led weaning without any book at all. we just let him start eating when he was ready. it was about 8 months, he started grabbing food off of our plates and that was that.


----------



## cking

Quote:


Originally Posted by *MujerMamaMismo* 
We did Baby Led Weaning with the assistance of the book of the same name - by Gil Rapley, I think...
It's perfect for us.

Yes, I was going to recommend the same book. I didn't get the book until she was a few months older, but I think if it had, I would have been more relaxed about it - I definitely feel more relaxed this time, and this LO hasn't even been born yet. lol. I was just upset about her eating something other than *my* milk, worried about what foods to start when, etc. She wasn't really interested in actually eating the food for a few months. She liked playing with it; around 7 months she chewed on my apple & pear a bit, then around 8 months she was interested in feeding herself a bit more. very gradual.

I also have a few recipe books that were gifts. I wasn't really interested in them at first, since we didn't do purees and such, but when she was a little older - 10-12 months, I found some good ideas for baby-friendly family meals like stews & snacks in them.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 
37 weeks today.









Wow! I can't believe it's come up so fast. Do you feel ready?

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Angelorum* 
Anyone have any book recs for starting solids? Westley will be 6 mo in just a week, and I really should figure out how we are going to do the whole food thing. I think I've been in denial about him growing up so fast and so I haven't wanted to research it.

I didn't read any books, but did read recs online from places like kellymom and some british child-led solids site (no links right now, sorry!). Our situation was a little unique since I was having issues with my milk supply and it was only once he started solids that he was able to wean off of donor milk and thrive on my milk alone. We started at 6.5-7 months IIRC with a pear and then an avocado a few days later. He's been an excellent eater ever since









AFM, this is our first cycle ever actually TTC (as opposed to getting pg despite avoiding the last two times







) and I can't help obsessing a bit. Getting pg made me realize how much I wanted to be pg, give birth, and have a newborn again. Calvin isn't helping asking for a baby every. single. day. Ah well, it won't be long. I'll let you guys know in about 10 days


----------



## accountclosed3

that's sweet sihaya.









we are doing IPods tonight. Hawk is playing with some noisy toy. looking forward to being away from noisy toys.

anyway, life.







will be soon anyway.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *cking* 









37 weeks today.



















!!!


----------



## PiePie

bedtime issues are back. i need some good empathic hearts and minds on this.


----------



## PiePie

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Sihaya* 
Calvin isn't helping asking for a baby every. single. day. Ah well, it won't be long. I'll let you guys know in about 10 days









steph, i soooo hope we are due date buddies. dd said that she has a surrogacy arrangement with a teacher at school (4 yos) who is pregnant -- she is going to get dd a baby. at least the pressure is off! horribly, i had to apply for a spot when we were ttcing and unsuccessful and now her teachers attribute any fussiness to the number 2 they think is coming. awkward!


----------



## farmama

PiePie,

we just stopped pushing the nap over here. so some days (3 out of 5) she doesn't nap at all, and she goes down tired, so that helps some. she's in her own bed for the first 3-4 hours each night (mostly). we do have a screechy, fussy struggle for an hour or so in early evening, so i don't know how practical it would be for you (NOT the sort of thing you'd want to do on the subway). but it's taking some of the pressure off. on days she does nap, she goes to bed later, and often just sleeps with us.








win some, lose some.

SHANNA?????


----------



## farmama

CKing, i'm so excited for you!!! Sleep a LOT. Right NOW.


----------



## Sihaya

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
steph, i soooo hope we are due date buddies.

Me too!








Quote:


Originally Posted by *PiePie* 
dd said that she has a surrogacy arrangement with a teacher at school (4 yos) who is pregnant -- she is going to get dd a baby. at least the pressure is off!


----------



## ~Shanna~

cking, I can't believe it's almost time! How do you feel? How is Josephine? How is night parenting? How is DH? This adjustment is probably going to be hardest on him, at least that was my experience. It seems to be hard on the non-nursing partner to be on their own so much.

RA, I really appreciated how honest your response was, about everything.

Pie Pie and Sihaya, I'm holding you in the light this ttc cycle and your entire pregnancy - pregnancy after loss is so exhausting spiritually.

Zoe, good luck on your move - I can't believe I've witnessed this from wild idea" to fruition









Ah, me:
This past month has been THE most challenging of my parenting life. The cliff Notes version is that Fenton has had a cold for the past month, and whlle teh cold symptoms were gradually easing ,(though never disappearing), his behavior and sleep were atrocious. Aggressive/violent behavior, 5 minutes couldn't pass where he wasn't screaming or crying about something. We hadn't had a passably human night's sleep in over a month, including 2 nights where he was waking up every 45 minutes, only to shriek and cry for anywhere from 1 to 3 hours. DH and I were becoming hostile to him, and I was becoming a parent bordering on criminal. I started to nwonder if he had a sinus infection, even though he was missing key symptoms. Everyone treated me like a lunatic who thinks her child can only be a jerk when he's sick - but I just knew something was wrong. Took him to urgent care to rule it out, she said she was sure he did not. With his gut issues, she advised against using antibiotics when we were so uncertain. A week later, I took him to his Ped, who said the same thing - but he gave me an antbx prescription "if I insisted". We didn't use it. Contacted his "gut" doctor in San Fran, he said teh same thing. I've tried everything: Vit C, golden seal, echinacea....everything but netti which....was so not going to happen. Finally on Saturday night we had 1 of the worst nights ever, and I noticed a lot of coughing when he was lying down, and whenever I tried to force him to lie down (Yes, you read that right







), he scrambled to sit up as if he was in pain. The next morning I insisted to my husband that we give him the antx, as I was certain he had a sinus infection and none of my natural remedies were helping after a month. We gave it to him, and within an hour I could see a marked difference. He's back to being himself, and i'm marveling that I had to advocate for my child in that direction - which is as it should be. We regret that this may set his gut healing back months, but I've prayed so hard over him, to please understand my intentions and helps us to heal him. I'm praying that, despite my understanding of the theory behind his digestive issues, that he continues to heal with diligent probiotic use after the antbx are done on Friday (5 days total). We're withn a month of starting to test new foods (he's been on the diet a year now), and I'm trying to just let go that we made the best decision of 2 poor options. So the moral of the story is that we diagnosed a sinus infection that showed nothing at this point but behavior issues. It seems the "pink eye" was not, but instead was sinus inflammation. Poor, poor child.

Reece has been a joy, and last night slept in his crib next to my bed from 7 pm to 6 am. I'm so conflicted about him sleeping in his crib, as I love sleeping with a newborn, it's easier nursing (especially with upcoming surgery), and I believe it really is protective from SIDS. But he sleeps so well in the crib that I can't bear to think that I will create a habit where a desire doesn't exist. I worry that by the time it's difficult t sleep with a baby, they've decided it's a habit. I've been bringing him to bed with me after the first nursing (usually sometime between 1 and 3 am, but today was 6 am). He's also gradually tolerating me eating beans, tomatoes, etc. He's such a happy little guy. He sleeps so well, but not when we're out in public, so that's been challenging.

On me news, i took my nose ring out to change it and can't get it back in







. Trying to decide whether to have it re-done. My ILs hired someone to help me a couple of hours a week, mostly folding laundry and washing pots and pans. And I'm gestating a hair-brained idea that I'll move on once I know whether we're moving due to DH starting a PhD program. I'll share more if I start to work on it.

Sorry for all of the navel -gazing, but I thought some of the details we've dealt with lately could help someone.


----------



## PiePie

We have been trying to skip the nap as a temporary measure. The problem is, she goes down on her own, as she would in the middle of a five alarm fire (this week, it was while eating a pretzel (I had to extract it from her sleeping mouth and while doing the hokey pokey -- -usually she will ask to nurse, I will defer, and then she will got to sleep anyway within 15 minutes) at about 4:30-4:45 and will not be wakened by any means. This is not down for the night but instead means that she is up even later (or possibly just as late as she would have been sans nap, who knows). DH thinks I //

gotta go.


----------



## PiePie

big talk with dh about dd's crises, he thinks she is feeling anxiety. going to give dd a choice with regard to family bed vs. big girl bed and with regard to pull-ups vs. diapers.


----------



## georgia

Hi, everyone! It's time to please start a new thread. We ask that members keep threads to less than 2,000 posts because it makes threads less unwieldy and is easier on our server. Please feel free to start a new thread and link back to this one. Please PM me with any questions!

Update's update: SO sorry for the inconvenience. Please start a new thread and then this one will be closed


----------



## Sihaya

Hi all! I'm ready and willing to start a new thread if no one minds. It will just take a few minutes and I'll post the link when it's ready


----------



## Sihaya

All right, it's all set! The new thread is here.

If you have time, please take a look at the Graduates list and the Links list, especially if you had a baby in the last year, and PM me with changes. I will be trying to add them on my own as I have time, but they will get updated faster if you can just send me the info. Thanks!


----------



## georgia

Thanks so much


----------

