# Letting 14yo quit an AP World Civ class? *Update*



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

My 14yo dd is in over her head with an AP World Civ class this year.

The class is VERY demanding. My 16yo dd actually took the same class last year but what a difference a teacher makes.

There is just too much work. Too much. If it were her only class, fine, she could devote all her time to it. But its too much. I'm having a hard time helping her muddle through this stuff. She is stressing alot over this class and the workload, her other classes are suffering, her main interest is drama and she doesn't have time for practicing for the school play she got a part in, she doesnt have time for Wednesday night church activities, ect....Her great GPA is gonna take a nosedive.

The teacher is not sympathetic to the workload, kids have complained alot but he just says "you all are the best and brightest in the school, this isn't too hard or too much."

She's just not ready for this class.
So, if it were your child, would you let her drop the class? I really don't like giving her the impression that if something is hard, then you quit.
BUT this is really over her head, maybe she could try it again next year. Heck, its over my head!

I know the school is going to give me a VERY hard time about letting her out of the class. But her best friend was let out last week, with a "secret agreement." (she is an office aid during that class time now) If they let one out, shouldnt they have to let all who want out, out?

Anyhow, anyone have any opinions?


----------



## Greenie (Sep 27, 2005)

I don't see why not! I, personally, dropped classes and changed my schedule w/o my parents knowing.. I just felt like my school time should be mine....

But I think that that they should be more than happy to let her out if you ask for it.


----------



## talk de jour (Apr 21, 2005)

Most schools don't even allow kids below junior level to take AP courses, and I really question their judgment at allowing your dd to enroll at all.

I would let her drop it in a second. It seems like too much, too soon.


----------



## terrordactyl (Jul 19, 2006)

let her drop it and try again next year it seems like its way to over her head and she needs to focus on other stuff. as for the school not letting her drop it if they have let other kids do it they have to let your daughter do it.


----------



## bu's mama (Mar 25, 2004)

Let her drop it!

I don't think you're teaching her to quit when something is too hard, but showing her how to prioritize...almost everything else is suffering and for what? Especially if she can enroll next year or the year after. As a teacher, I'm all for setting the bar high & expecting students to rise to that level, but there's also a point where the demands are unreasonable.


----------



## bu's mama (Mar 25, 2004)

Oh and the school not 'letting' her drop it...that deserves a phone call to the principal if that's really the case.


----------



## Moon Faerie (Aug 2, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *talk de jour* 
Most schools don't even allow kids below junior level to take AP courses, and I really question their judgment at allowing your dd to enroll at all.

I would let her drop it in a second. It seems like too much, too soon.









: I took a whole slew of AP classes in high school. I was basically a poster-child for over-extended over-achievers, and I think that's too early for a class that demanding.


----------



## Meg Murry. (Sep 3, 2006)

I teach AP, and I'll be honest with you: my first three weeks are spent weeding out the students who honestly should not be there, or should not be there _yet_. No offense to them, but the AP is nothing to mess around with. It is a difficult exam, and I have no desire to teach students who are either unwilling or unable -- for _their_ sakes as much as mine.

Really, I'd advise your dd to take it some other time, like when she's a junior. Hopefully, having had a taste of it already, she'll know what she's getting into and there won't be a conflict.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
My 14yo dd is in over her head with an AP World Civ class this year.

The class is VERY demanding. My 16yo dd actually took the same class last year but what a difference a teacher makes.

There is just too much work. Too much. If it were her only class, fine, she could devote all her time to it. But its too much. I'm having a hard time helping her muddle through this stuff. She is stressing alot over this class and the workload, her other classes are suffering, her main interest is drama and she doesn't have time for practicing for the school play she got a part in, she doesnt have time for Wednesday night church activities, ect....Her great GPA is gonna take a nosedive.

The teacher is not sympathetic to the workload, kids have complained alot but he just says "you all are the best and brightest in the school, this isn't too hard or too much."

She's just not ready for this class.
So, if it were your child, would you let her drop the class? I really don't like giving her the impression that if something is hard, then you quit.
BUT this is really over her head, maybe she could try it again next year. Heck, its over my head!

I know the school is going to give me a VERY hard time about letting her out of the class. But her best friend was let out last week, with a "secret agreement." (she is an office aid during that class time now) If they let one out, shouldnt they have to let all who want out, out?

Anyhow, anyone have any opinions?


----------



## kimiij (Jun 18, 2006)

I have a slightly different answer. Before you decide to take her out (if you haven't already) I think you both need to sit down and determine if the class too much for her or if it is just different and challenging? If it is the latter, I think it would be great for her to stick with it. If it is too much, and would hurt more than help, then I would agree with taking her out.

Also, especially since school just started,the class may become easier as she gets used to the routine of the class and as the teacher lets down his guard (as they are sometime apt to do in an AP class).

Additionally, AP Classes are supposed to be college level, so its not surprising that the kids complain about there being a lot of work. I think that is completely normal and would be worried if the kids didn't do a little bit of groaning.

Just something to think about. Good luck!


----------



## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
I really don't like giving her the impression that if something is hard, then you quit.
BUT this is really over her head, maybe she could try it again next year. Heck, its over my head!

I think that sometimes in life we start things that we find out aren't a good fit for us and we should therefore stop doing them. It's unfortunate that this is called "quitting" and has such bad connotations, because sorting through what we want and don't want to put our time and engery into is complex, and there is a time to say "no, this isn't for me."

I think that having a real conversation about deciding when to step back from something is a good idea. People end up in jobs that take over their lives, but they feel they can't quit, people get sucked into volunteer organizations that just take and take and the person feels like they can't say no, there are people who stay in marriages where they are treated badly because they were taught to not quit, etc. Sometimes, quitting is a good thing.

Knowing when to quit and when to stay is difficult and I think that saying "don't be a quitter" ignores the real issue about making real choices with one's life.


----------



## Red (Feb 6, 2002)

I would let her drop it. WHy make her miserable and have her hate learning?


----------



## Tinas3muskateers (May 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Red* 
I would let her drop it. WHy make her miserable and have her hate learning?









:


----------



## 2mama (Feb 3, 2006)

I would let her drop it, she has proven that she is a hard worker (or just very gifted) by being able to even get into the class. Why make the year a nightmare? Enjoy the year and let her pick something she will enjoy and be successful in.


----------



## lisac77 (May 27, 2005)

I would definitely take stock and see if there's really too much work, but if that turns out to be the case, I say drop it like a hot rock!

I did this in college a couple of times. When I saw that a particular class was going to usurp an unusual amount of time to the point where I couldn't get everything done, I would drop it an schedule it as a lone class for a summer term or in a lighter semester. Since AP work is college level work, I see no problem with trying again next year (and possibly taking into account her other classes for next year and scheduling them accordingly).


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Thanks everyone.
She brought home her midterm today and she got a D for the class!!!

She's never, ever gotten anything lower than a B in anything, including advanced, gifted & talented classes, ect....

She has really, really put *alot* of time and effort into trying to make it work for this class. She's just not clicking with this college level stuff. Heck, I've been in college for almost 4 years now and I am very hard pressed to help her with this class. It is a very heavy workload, very heavy. Heavier than any classes I've taken in my nursing degree journey. The reading is very advanced and over her head. Truthfully alot of it is over my head & I have a very high reading level and she tested at a 12th grade reading level in second grade.

I agree that it doesnt make any sense to keep her in this. Like a pp said, maybe next year. Its causing her alot of stress, she's not getting enough sleep at night cause she's up past midnight working on writing papers and reading for this class. She's not comprehending alot of the material obviously.

So, I'm calling the counselor tomorrow. I'm expecting to be given a problem with withdrawing her. Apparently its not allowed??? Like I said in the OP, her best friend just dropped it last week and the counselor made her promise not to tell anyone and made a "secret deal" with her about it. She's now an office aide during that class period.

I hate dealing with school officials.
Dd told me tonight that other kids had talked about dropping the course and the teacher chastised them in front of the whole class. Said things like "What are you going to do, be a quitter your whole life?" "Whats the matter, you dont want to work hard enough?" "Are you too lazy?"
And when my dd's friend dropped the course, the teacher took a plastic skull and put it on her empty desk







:

Wish me luck!


----------



## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Good luck!!! When you talk to the counselsor, let him/her know the whole story, including the skull.

If this is supposed to be like a college class, then dropping should encouraged! University professors usually state to be sure and drop before the drop date so you don't end up with an F. In college, dropping is normal, stopping going to class but not offically dropping is bad.

When she takes this again, is is possible to make sure she gets a different teacher? This one sounds a bit nuts.

Why can't she transfer into another history class? A nice normal one.


----------



## Meg Murry. (Sep 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
Dd told me tonight that other kids had talked about dropping the course and the teacher chastised them in front of the whole class. Said things like "What are you going to do, be a quitter your whole life?" "Whats the matter, you dont want to work hard enough?" "Are you too lazy?"
And when my dd's friend dropped the course, the teacher took a plastic skull and put it on her empty desk







:

Wish me luck!

Whoa! That is so uncalled-for. Speaking as a teacher, that's not only unkind, it's deeply unprofessional. I would seriously bring this issue up, frankly. That's WAY out of line. In all honesty, when someone drops my AP class, I'm glad. I'm not glad to see them go -- heck, early on, I hardly know them -- but I'm glad they're deciding for themselves early on before they get a grade that may mar their GPAs.

Selfishly speaking too, their AP scores are reported to the administration, so if they _don't_ score well, _I_ look bad. That may be my fault, sure, absolutely -- but if they're simply not ready for the class or don't have the time for it, it's *not,* but I'm still accountable for their scores.

I can't believe your dd's teacher's utter lack of professionalism. What a jerk.


----------



## Meg Murry. (Sep 3, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
It is a very heavy workload, very heavy. Heavier than any classes I've taken in my nursing degree journey. The reading is very advanced and over her head. Truthfully alot of it is over my head & I have a very high reading level and she tested at a 12th grade reading level in second grade.

I agree that it doesnt make any sense to keep her in this. Like a pp said, maybe next year.

It's amazing the development between 14 and (for example) 16 in terms of global understanding and sophistication. World Civ really requires both, IMHO, even though that's not the AP I teach. It takes a really extensive, broad history background to build the necessary supporting structures for the information she's getting. My really strong advice would be to have her study world civ. on her own this year and summertime, starting from where the AP starts and teaching herself the fundamentals. That way, if she takes it again next fall, she'll be way more prepared by having learned those basics.

Good luck.


----------



## PajamaMama (Dec 18, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
Her great GPA is gonna take a nosedive.

I would let her out of it. She's only 14!

I quoted you just because I want to ask if you are sure about this. Her AP class grade may be weighted differently than a mainstream history class. There were kids in my high school with weighted GPAs near 6.0 because they took nothing but AP/honors/etc classes. Of course my hs reunion is approaching and I don't work in the education field, so things may have changed a lot since then...

but maybe you should check into that, and even if she has to take a C or D for this quarter, it might not hurt her overall gpa as much as you think.

Oh...and the teacher sounds like a real ass. What a way to NOT motivate people!


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Well, this morning I left a message for the counselor asking that she be allowed to drop. It went as I expected it would. I got a call back with a message saying that its getting to be too late in the year to drop a class and so he's really reluctant to let her. He said he'll meet with her Thursday and discuss her options (what options?!) for continuing in the class for the rest of the year.

Ummm.....no, don't think so. I can't STAND this type of school authority bullcrap. I'm her parent, I don't want her in the class, take her out. Period, end of discussion. How is it too late in the year? School is 5 weeks in, all they do is give kids who drop a study hall or assign them to be office or library aides.

It makes me soooo mad, my dd is not their child.
Yes, I have school authority issues







:
So, now I have to get very demanding and be one of "those" parents and I have a hard time doing it and keeping myself levelheaded.







:


----------



## ledzepplon (Jun 28, 2004)

Here's another opinion, if you want it. I read that you've decided to take her out of the class, which sounds reasonable. Obviously, you know your dd better than any of us do, and perhaps she's just not quite ready for this class. But here's my two cents:

If she stays in the class, she'ss really have to struggle. She might work super hard and only get a C. I think kids who are smart have a very hard time with this--I did! But there is something to be said for the feeling of accomplishment one gets from taking a challenging class and getting through it. I was so used to breezing though classes in high school that college was kind of a blow to my ego: Here I was, surrounded by tons of people smarter than me, and I really had to work hard just to pass some classes. I did really poorly my first semester because I felt defeated before I even started. I wasn't really used to trying very hard, and I certainly wasn't used to failing when I put in effort. But life is like that!

That said, I'm not one of those people who believes you can never quit once you've started something. And again, you know your daughter, I don't. I hope everything works out for you both!


----------



## folkypoet (Apr 23, 2004)

Yay for you, Mama, for advocating for your daughter!







IMO, you've just shown her that you care about more than just her grades or school standing; you care about her as a person - whether she feels comfortable in a class, whether she enjoys her school experience, whether her needs are being met, whether her interests (drama, for instance) are being nurtured.... You respect her. To me, that lesson is far more important than "don't be a quitter."

If this teacher (putting a plastic skull on the desk?!?) offers the only AP World Civ. course, I'd make sure she knows that opting out of the class for as long as it is being taught by this man is an a-okay choice. If that's the case, she could simply take World Civ. in college (or at the community college during the summer, if that's an option where you live). No biggie. But I can't imagine having to put up with a teacher like that for a week, let alone nine months!







:

-Shana

P.S. Good luck with the principal. Just let those mama bear instincts kick in!


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Question before I call....do they HAVE to let her out of the class if I DEMAND it? If it comes to that, I'd like to be prepared and know how far I can go....
where does a parent find their rights in situations like this?


----------



## bu's mama (Mar 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
Question before I call....do they HAVE to let her out of the class if I DEMAND it? If it comes to that, I'd like to be prepared and know how far I can go....
where does a parent find their rights in situations like this?

Yes! You are advocating for your daughter and while they do like to make it difficult to drop ultimately it is your choice as the parent. If the guidance counselor refuses, let him/her know that your dd won't be attending class anymore and go the principal. If the principal doesn't handle it, go to the superindentent and then to the school board. Esp, in light of the teacher's actions when a student does drop, I wouldn't want my child in that class for those reasons in addition to the workload.

just wanted to add that I was a high school teacher & understand why they make it difficult to drop a class, and have no problem with a heavy workload, just not to the exclusion of everything else in life


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *bu's mama* 
Yes! You are advocating for your daughter and while they do like to make it difficult to drop ultimately it is your choice as the parent. If the guidance counselor refuses, let him/her know that your dd won't be attending class anymore and go the principal. If the principal doesn't handle it, go to the superindentent and then to the school board. Esp, in light of the teacher's actions when a student does drop, I wouldn't want my child in that class for those reasons in addition to the workload.

just wanted to add that I was a high school teacher & understand why they make it difficult to drop a class, and have no problem with a heavy workload, just not to the exclusion of everything else in life


Thanks.

I guess I'm not understanding why its such a problem to drop. Nor do I like the flimsy excuse of "its getting too late in the school year to drop." I'm a grown up, be straight with me. Sheesh.
And you know, knowing that this same counselor just let my dd's best friend drop the same class last week but made her agree to keep it a secret and made a "secret deal" with her just makes this counselor pretty uncredible with me.


----------



## PajamaMama (Dec 18, 2004)

I wonder if they are making it hard to drop because your dd needs 'x' amount of history credits, etc to graduate and this will make it difficult for her to get them? It does seem to me that if they let one girl drop it, they can't deny it to your daughter. I want to hear what they have to say to that!


----------



## bu's mama (Mar 25, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
Thanks.

I guess I'm not understanding why its such a problem to drop. Nor do I like the flimsy excuse of "its getting too late in the school year to drop." I'm a grown up, be straight with me. Sheesh.
And you know, knowing that this same counselor just let my dd's best friend drop the same class last week but made her agree to keep it a secret and made a "secret deal" with her just makes this counselor pretty uncredible with me.

Well, from the school's point of view, scheduling is a MAJOR headache. It is way more complicated than you can imagine, not only creating room for classes in the schedule, but also trying to balance the number of students in a class and teacher loads, which is why they discourage students dropping courses or switching sections.

In AP courses, the statistics are used to rate the school...how many courses are offered, how many students enrolled, what grades they get on the exams all come into play, so they do like to keep students in the courses.

The secret deal is ridiculous...I think the other students realize someone is missing and what exactly is the student suppose to say when asked? A specific counselor also does not want to have the reputation of constantly changing a student's schedule and may be called in by the department head or principal if they see too many changes.


----------



## oldcrunchymom (Jun 26, 2002)

I think there is a big difference between quitting something because you don't feel like doing it and dropping something when you realize you are in over your head and won't get anything positive out of the experience. IMO, this is a case of the latter and your daughter is perfectly justified in dropping the course.


----------



## wasabi (Oct 12, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PajamaMama* 
I wonder if they are making it hard to drop because your dd needs 'x' amount of history credits, etc to graduate and this will make it difficult for her to get them? It does seem to me that if they let one girl drop it, they can't deny it to your daughter. I want to hear what they have to say to that!

I would doubt that. The child is only 14 so I'm guessing she's just a freshman. Usually you only have to take a few civ type courses so I would expect she can take it later. I know for my senior year I only had to go a half day as did many other seniors so there would certainly be room for an extra class there.

Oh and as for the original question I absolutely support taking her out of the class. There's just no reason for her to be in it at this stage of the game.


----------



## Storm Bride (Mar 2, 2005)

I'd definitely let her quit. For one thing, her teacher sounds like a crazy woman. If I was working for someone who treated employees that way, I'd walk. I'm a _huge_ believer in "don't be a quitter", but that doesn't mean I think it should be used to justify treating people like crap. That plastic skull stunt and the public ridicule are completely out of line. In fact, the only place I've ever witnessed behaviour similar to it was...in high school classrooms. I've had a couple of really bad bosses, but even they weren't that blatant - maybe because they didn't have "this is your entire future in my hands" power and didn't have a school administration backing up their right to be jerks.


----------



## mommy2evan05 (Mar 13, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ledzepplon* 
Here's another opinion, if you want it. I read that you've decided to take her out of the class, which sounds reasonable. Obviously, you know your dd better than any of us do, and perhaps she's just not quite ready for this class. But here's my two cents:

If she stays in the class, she'ss really have to struggle. She might work super hard and only get a C. I think kids who are smart have a very hard time with this--I did! But there is something to be said for the feeling of accomplishment one gets from taking a challenging class and getting through it. I was so used to breezing though classes in high school that college was kind of a blow to my ego: Here I was, surrounded by tons of people smarter than me, and I really had to work hard just to pass some classes. I did really poorly my first semester because I felt defeated before I even started. I wasn't really used to trying very hard, and I certainly wasn't used to failing when I put in effort. But life is like that!

That said, I'm not one of those people who believes you can never quit once you've started something. And again, you know your daughter, I don't. I hope everything works out for you both!

I really have to disagree! I was in the OP's daughter's shoes when I was in high school with AP World History, the teacher I had sounds a lot like the "skull-bearer". I was already killing myself trying to get all of my homework done and 2 weeks in I dropped for an advanced history class. The AP courses are designed to challenge you, but it sounds like this teacher is taking his class WAAAAY to seriously! Like a PP said, there is a reason you are allowed to drop in college! OP, I hope the school doesn't give you too much hassle about getting your daughter out of the class and that she is much happier in a non-AP history! She can always try again later!

ETA: Some students (I was this way) think that if they get a C in any class, no matter how hard, there is just no way to recover from that, emotionally and psychologically. I got a D in a pre-calculus class that I struggled mightily with and was absolutely miserable for the entire year. (The teacher was also of a very close bloodline with a certain horned underworld leader, I am very sure!) But I never trusted myself to take an advanced math class again. I took whatever I needed to get by and show the colleges that I took a math, which actually turned out well for me, but I still get scared attempting a math class that I don't have a lot of experience with. I have this great fear of failing because of the one time that it did happen. (This was in no way my parent's pressure BTW--mom was so proud that I didn't get an F, because she never passed algebra.)


----------



## Linda on the move (Jun 15, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 
knowing that this same counselor just let my dd's best friend drop the same class last week but made her agree to keep it a secret and made a "secret deal" with her just makes this counselor pretty uncredible with me.


the 'secret' deal can't be very secret since there is a plastic skull on her desk.


----------



## a-sorta-fairytale (Mar 29, 2005)

I am glad you are helping her to understand her limitations. I think this is so important. I never learned that in HS. I got straight A's. I also got ulcers. When i went to college and got a B in a class my third semester i was crushed. I am finally starting to "get it." This semester i enrolled for a class that was too much. After much discussion with dh and my dad they convinced me to drop and enroll in a diff class. I am so gald i did. While i am still challenged, super busy and stressed i dont feel like i am getting an ulcer again.

It is important to learn when to bow out of something that is really messing with your quality of life.


----------



## PajamaMama (Dec 18, 2004)

So...were you able to help your dd get out of the class?


----------



## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

Quote:

Dd told me tonight that other kids had talked about dropping the course and the teacher chastised them in front of the whole class. Said things like "What are you going to do, be a quitter your whole life?" "Whats the matter, you dont want to work hard enough?" "Are you too lazy?"
And when my dd's friend dropped the course, the teacher took a plastic skull and put it on her empty desk
I'd report the teacher to the school board, or whoever the appropriate authority is, we homeschool so I am not familar with the hierarchy. That teacher is so utterly out of line that IMO they should be teaching at all. Although I'd do it after you secured your childs drop from the class.

But then my goal is to raise a child able to judge her own abilities and think for herself, not a little sheeple that will do what she told by any person in "authority". Yes I have school authority issues too.

You sound like an awesome mom to me!


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Thanks everyone!

I've been VERY busy this week and haven't been able to get into touch with the counselor when I've been able to use the phone (nursing school, exams, clinicals....)
I'm writing a letter tonight, and calling the counselor back tomorrow during my lunch period at school, so we'll see!

If he gives me problems, I'm just going to politey thank him for his time and ask him to refer me on to someone who can help me if he can't.


----------



## a-sorta-fairytale (Mar 29, 2005)

Good. I am so against teachings kids to push themselves to stress and to do something just to please a teacher or peers.


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Well, this dd was gone all weekend for a church activity, so we got to talk this afternoon.
Apparently she was called to the counselors office and they talked. What it boiled down to was him looking through the computer to find a place to put her if she was going to drop. He offered her agriculture and she declined, he offered her weight lifting and there are girls in that class that wanted to "beat her up" because she was a "goodie-two-shoes"







: so she told him about that (ugh....so dislike the public school environment!) then he told her that if she could find a teacher to use her as a teacher aide, then she would need to get a note from the teacher and she could be their aide for the class time formally known to her as AP World Civ.
So, she *thinks* she's found a teacher and will give the counselor the note when they go back to school Tuesday (have Monday off).

Hopefully this will all end very smoothly and without me having to beat anyone up.... LOL....just kidding....

I was surprised when she told me how this all turned out because when he left his message for me, he was sounding like there was no way he was going to let her out of the class. Which makes me very happy because I tend to be not so graceful at confrontation with "authority people" and I was definately not looking forward to it.

Dd is very relieved. However, her father and evil stepmother are giving her a hard time about being a "quitter."







:







To be expected from them....


----------



## lorijds (Jun 6, 2002)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KentuckyDoulaMama* 

I guess I'm not understanding why its such a problem to drop. Nor do I like the flimsy excuse of "its getting too late in the school year to drop."


Where else will she go? I think part of the problem with changing classes in the middle of a semester is that what will she do with that hour now? If she is enrolled in the school as a full time student, then they have to do something with her for that hour, they can't just let her roam the halls. If even 10% of the students decide after the drop date that they can't take a class and drop it, is the school supposed to hire more staff to deal with them? If a kid can just drop a class whenever they want, what is the school supposed to do with all these unoccupied kids? Where exactly should they put them? Is it fair for another teacher (never mind a probably contract violation) to have to absorb her into a class and catch her up, spending how many hours of their plan and personal time to do so? Is it fair for the studens in that class to have to take in someone who is not up to the rest of the class, who will slow them down until she is caught up?

Not every teacher wants an aide (I know my husband stopped accepting them unless they had already met certain requirements, and never if they were a freshman or sophomore). Some aides are hard working to be sure, some are there because theywant to have as few classes as possible. In my dh's school, aides are generally seniors who have taken a series of classes for several years and now help out in a lower level class--for my dh, for example, his seniors who hav taken 4-5 years of a foreign language can be an aide in his lower level foreign language classes. They aren't any help to him if they can't help the students with the content and help him with the class. Why would he have an aide who he has to babysit and find busy work to kid him/her occupied?

I think this is probably the reason behind the "no drop after a certain date" rule. It's not like college where they can just be on their own during the time of a dropped class. The school has to be responsible for her during that time. So what will they do with her? You might have more success if you can line up something else for her--is there a teacher who *will* give up his/her time after school to catch her up for a class? Or who will actually allow her to be a class aide? DOes the school offer classes that are short-- six or nine weeks, or on-line, or self directed? She could enroll in one of those as an alternative to the class she wants to drop.

Good luck, I'm sorry she's in over her head, and I'm sorry the teacher is such a jerk. That is totally out of line. I'm not excusing the teacher's behaviour at all; I'm just addressing the reasoning behind why kids aren't allowed to just drop whenever they want. There are very real logistical issues that the school has to deal with when kids are allowed to drop at any time during the semester. Some districts do not have the resources allocated for addressing this, and thus after a certain date kids just have to suck it up and deal with it until semester.


----------



## Arduinna (May 30, 2002)

I can't speak for the OP but the school would not be my top priority my kids would be. I question why they are even letting 14 year olds sign up for AP world Civ in the first place. And really they should have a better solution in place. Kids should not be forced to "suck it up" and end up with a poor grade on their permanant record especially when the class is optional. It's not like she is required to take this class. Maybe they should have some sort of admission requirement or something, like a teacher recommendation or a placement test, I don't know.

But it isn't the childs fault that the school doesn't have a well thought out solution and policy for dealing with this. It isn't the first time nor will it be the last.


----------



## Ellien C (Aug 19, 2004)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *lorijds* 
Where else will she go? I think part of the problem with changing classes in the middle of a semester is that what will she do with that hour now?

At my school, we weren't allowed to leave the grounds - but we could be in study hall (formal classes you reported to in certain rooms - attendance was taken) or at the library or working on a special project in our free period such as year book or literary magazine or there was the computer lab. In a school offering AP civics to 14 year olds, I'd expect there would be some options. It's probably more work for the guidance counselor to find them though!

Good luck to the OP. I think it's fine for children to learn boundaries early on. It's good to make choices and focus on certain things. I dropped dance class at about that age. Just wasn't going to be my thing going forward. But I picked up computers, year book and forensics.


----------



## KentuckyDoulaMama (Mar 11, 2004)

Thanks everyone. The situation ended peacefully today









Dd is very relieved to be out of the class, though I'm not sure how much of a hard time her father (my ex) will give her about being a quitter. But, hey I've got sole custody, so oh well..........


----------



## lorijds (Jun 6, 2002)

I'm glad you all were able to work something out. I hope she's happy with her new class load and that she enjoys the rest of her semester.


----------

