# airplane travel



## Three~Little~Birds (Jan 10, 2005)

We are planning a trip via airplane, then car rental and I am wondering what all you safety-conscious Mamas do wrt carseats. I am specifically wondering about my 4 and 6 yo.
I currently harness them both in a 5 pt. Should I take the carseats with me? Do I use them on the plane? If not, what about car rental companies - do they provide any? What have you done?
TIA


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## alysmommy2004 (Jun 23, 2006)

I always take my seats with me and use them on the plane. That way you know you have safe seats with you the entire trip. Don't check your seats, use them on the plane. Baggage handlers are very rough on luggage and you wouldn't want to risk damage to your seats.

Rental car companies do have seats you can rent, but most likely your kids would end up in boosters. They usually rent out inexpensive 40lb seats. I know that most Hertz locations rent out the Scenera. Also keep in mind that if you go this route you don't know the history of the seats. There are a lot of stories out there of people getting dirty, expired, and broken seats to use.


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Take the car seats on the plane. It's the safest. DO NOT rent a carseat from a rental company. You don't know what you'll get, if it'll have been in a crash, or even if it's expired. I've heard horror stories about rental seats. Plus, you'd be spending at least $20/day to rent seats, which seems like a huge waste of money.


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## Three~Little~Birds (Jan 10, 2005)

Thanks.

Maybe this is a silly question, but how do you strap the seats onto the airplane seats, FF? Is there a place to tether them?

Also - both ways of our trip have 3 different flights - short ones. One of the stop-overs is only 30 minutes and several others are extreamly tight also. I am just trying to imagine how my DH and I will get 3 kids (one baby), 3 carseats and all of our carry-on lugggage from one plane to the next in a hurry. Anyone BTDT? I am feeling a little bit overwhelmed with it all, I think...


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

You use the airplane seatbelt like you would if there was a lap only belt in the car. No tethers.

I would get a luggage cart that folds and bugi two of the seats to it. Then just book it between! Take as little other carry on as you can.


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## Keria (Sep 27, 2008)

You can try and ask also for first row seats, airplane seats beeing so close together, once you install the carseats its goign to be imposible to keep them from not kicking the seat in front of them unless they are sleeping.


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## Caneel (Jun 13, 2007)

We have travelled by air quite a bit in the past three years.

In our 30+ legs of flight, I have found airline employees, when treated with respect, to be amazingly helpful to people with young children. We have had great experiences.

Concerning the connections, you will likely board the plane ahead of everyone else. Try to to coozie up to one of the stewardesses and share your concern with her. Should things become really tight on the backend, they may be willing to call ahead to the next gate. I have sat on many flights were we waited for one or more passengers that were literally running thru the airport make their connection.

Keep everyone's stuff organized so you aren't searching for toys, boarding passes etc when you should be exiting the plane.

Get ticketed toward the front of the plane. Ask when you check in, the agent may be able to put you up front.

We have one so it makes it easier but another thing that works well for us is to divided the responsibilities and switch to it. Since I am better with the seat, I take the seat, my and DS carry-on's and DH handles DS and DH's carry on. That way there is no "who has DS's bag, where is this? where is that?"


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

What kind of seats do you have? I'm thinking specifically of the six-year-old... if s/he's in a Britax Regent by chance, it's not FAA-approved, so you can't use it on the plane. Pretty much every other harnessing seat is FAA-approved (though ones that convert to boosters are not approved *in booster mode*, which may confuse some flight attendants and make them think your seat is not allowed at all).

You may find it useful to print out the policy from the FAA website before you go. I think it's in one of the stickies up top.


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## roxyrox (Sep 11, 2006)

Personally I would rent a carseat at your destination. Every rental carseat I have ever had has looked brand new. If you don't want to rent, bring your carseats but I would gate check them. A 4yo and a 6yo are no safer in a carseat than in a regular belt on an plane and they will have a lot more room without the seats. The only reason I can think of for ever bringing a carseat on a plane is if it would help your child to sleep(which doesn't sound likely in your situation if you have 3 short flights each way!).


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

It is highly unlikely that any car rental company will be able to rent her high-weight harnessing seats. And, while I'm glad you've had good luck with rental carseats, that's simply not the case for everyone. It's a crapshoot.


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Yeah, never rent seats. I cannot imagine the liability of those nasty used seats, and you have NO idea how they were treated/cleaned/stored.

We always use our seats on planes


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## Lily's_Mom (Feb 11, 2008)

We traveled to Germany 2 years ago, and even though we told dh's parents we were bringing our carseat, they still got one with the rental car. They told the company how old dd was (18 months at the time) and we were provided with a filthy hbb that looked like it was from the 80s. Glad we had our own seat! That rental one was gross and obviously the company doesn't have an eye for safety if they think a booster seat is okay for a 1-year-old.


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## snoopy5386 (May 6, 2005)

where are you going? Will you have access to carseats on the other end of your journey? I would never put a 4 and a 6 yr old in a carseat on a plane. There is just not enough room for them to move, KWIM? We have used my 2 year olds seat on the plane and she literally couldn't move her feet without kicking the seat in front of her, I can't imagine a 4 or 6 yr old. She also couldn't use the tray table because the seat sat her up so high that the table couldn't lay flat. We use a CARES harness now but I think your kids might even be too big for that. Honestly in your situation I would be tempted to skip the carseats all together and put them in boosters at your destination. Certainly the 6 yo, the 4 yo would depend on size and maturity. If you feel you must bring the seats then either check them or gate check them. FWIW we travel frequently and it is rare to see another child that is in a carseat on a plane besides infants in a bucket.


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## snoopy5386 (May 6, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamatotwo* 
Thanks.

Maybe this is a silly question, but how do you strap the seats onto the airplane seats, FF? Is there a place to tether them?

Also - both ways of our trip have 3 different flights - short ones. One of the stop-overs is only 30 minutes and several others are extreamly tight also. I am just trying to imagine how my DH and I will get 3 kids (one baby), 3 carseats and all of our carry-on lugggage from one plane to the next in a hurry. Anyone BTDT? I am feeling a little bit overwhelmed with it all, I think...

Oh my goodness, I just read this part, oh then NO WAY would I bring the seats if I didn't absolutely have to and I would really never use them on the plane. When we have taken DD' seat on the plane we are always the LAST ones off it takes forever to get them undone, get the luggage out of the overhead, etc, etc. Think about it like this, once you get through security which is the first big hurdle, you then have to get on the plane and down the skinny narrow aisle. For us that means one person carrying DD's carseat over their head (not enough room for it in between the rows and she is in a tiny scenera). How are you going to carry all 3 seats, a baby, your carryons and corral your older 2 and try not to hit all of the other passengers in the head?
And FWIW I do consider myself to be a safety conscious mama, my rides in a BLVD at home, she will RF to the limit of her seat which with the way she is growing will be at least until 3.5 if not 4 years old. However I am very flexible and do be the rules when traveling by air. It is such a nightmare to begin with, don't make it any harder on yourself....we fly about 4x a year if that helps.


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## snoopy5386 (May 6, 2005)

I have also yet to be able to board early with DD, those days are over I fear.


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

I have flown alone with 2 young kids with a layover and no preboarding, and did just fine installing seats.

Either way you'll need seats at your destination, and I would NOT trust my seats going under the plane.


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## mamatoakd (Jun 11, 2008)

I've done quite a bit of airplane travel with the kids - with and without DH. I am also somewhat of a freak when it comes to safety (I even hate the idea of renting a car - nevermind the carseats - because I don't like the idea of riding in just any old car). However, the scene that is being set is starting to sound like a three-ring circus. I'll throw the following ideas out to consider...

Each of the carseats will need to be installed in a window seat.

Assuming all of your flights work out to be on time (HA!!!), a 30 minute layover is going to be TIGHT! Unloading a carseat (nevermind two) can be timeconsuming. We use Britax and the way the seatbelt secures to the seat makes unlatching it a real hassle.

Sitting in a carseat on a plane, the kids won't be able to move their legs at all. Small babies end up kicking the seat in front of them while in carseats - a 4 and 6 year old will be sitting cross legged. If the person in front of them chooses to recline, the kids will really be squished. You'd think that this would deter someone from reclining, but it's really amazing what people will and will not do.

Given the number of connecting flights and time between, I'd check the seats. If you're feeling lucky, you could even gate check them (you'll still need to wait for them to be brought up from the baggage hold after each flight and carry them through the airport). At many airports, gate checking will mean that they'll be carried down to the baggage hold. This does not mean that they'll get great care, but at least if one gets lost along the way you'll have a headstart in having the airline look for them!!

I would also try and not stress too much over the decision. Air travel with small kids can be a real pain and stressing over the details isn't going to help.

I'd love to hear how it all works out. I'm always up for new ideas and hearing how things worked out for someone!

Good luck!


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## an_aurora (Jun 2, 2006)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamatoakd* 
Each of the carseats will need to be installed in a window seat.


Haven't read the rest of your post, but no they don't. Three car seats can sit next to each other in a row.


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *an_aurora* 
Haven't read the rest of your post, but no they don't. Three car seats can sit next to each other in a row.

The rule, actually, is something like a carseat cannot be installed between an adult passenger and the nearest aisle. So, a carseat can be installed in a window seat, *or* in the center seat of the center section on a jumbo jet with that row of five seats in the middle. You can also install seats next to each other, though I think the smallest passenger has to go in the least accessible position (so, baby in the window seat, four-year-old in the middle, six-year-old on the aisle).

I know the FAA Advisory Circular about carseats on planes is linked on this forum somewhere, maybe in the sticky on airline travel. I haven't looked at it in a few months, but I believe it covers installation positions.


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## melijack1 (Nov 18, 2008)

I am traveling alone with my son in 10 days. As I am traveling alone, and he is 3 years old, I am checking his seat. I have him, a stroller, my laptop bag and purse, and a backpack of his gear. I can't manage a carseat too. I will strap him into the seat belt and hope for the best. I want him to be comfortable and happy while we are flying. He will be buckled in in the event of turbulence, and I will not allow him to unbuckle at all.


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *melijack1* 
I am traveling alone with my son in 10 days. As I am traveling alone, and he is 3 years old, I am checking his seat. I have him, a stroller, my laptop bag and purse, and a backpack of his gear. I can't manage a carseat too. I will strap him into the seat belt and hope for the best. I want him to be comfortable and happy while we are flying. He will be buckled in in the event of turbulence, and I will not allow him to unbuckle at all.

Obviously, this is something that varies from child to child, but I'm curious as to your plan to keep him buckled. What will you do if he unbuckles his seat belt?


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## mamatoakd (Jun 11, 2008)

I'd suggest that if the 3 yo unbuckles the belt, you rebuckle it!


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## KsMum (Nov 1, 2006)

Do you know what size planes you're on? If they're short flights, then they may be the small planes, in which case it is harder to install the seats. Bring the baby's carseat, and check the 4 and 6 year old ones.


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## Three~Little~Birds (Jan 10, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *snoopy5386* 
How are you going to carry all 3 seats, a baby, your carryons and corral your older 2 and try not to hit all of the other passengers in the head?

This is my concern, too. Not to mention that we will have to do it quickly because of some tight connections (and with a disgrtuntled hubby, as he travels all the time and says that he never sees kids in carseats - so he'll be cursing under his breath, for sure







).

Quote:


Originally Posted by *KsMum* 
Do you know what size planes you're on? If they're short flights, then they may be the small planes, in which case it is harder to install the seats. Bring the baby's carseat, and check the 4 and 6 year old ones.

I don't imagine that they are large planes. We fly: Ottawa, Philladelphia, Charlotte, Pensicola,

The car rental place has car seats for rent, but as mentionned, I am concerned about the quality. I would obviously prefer that my kids ride in our seats. We are renting a van, so we should have room for all of our seats. The rental place said that they have infant buckets that go to 20lbs, toddler seats that go from 20-40 lbs, and booster seats. If we do rent, then I don't know what seats to get for my 4 & 6 year olds. They are both 40 lbs or under, but I am sure that they probably exceed the height requirements, in which case would a booster be safer? I am trying to find out what kind of seats they are, but I can't get through to anyone.

Our seats are 2 Radians and 1 Snugride. What are the concerns with checking these seats? Is it that they are thrown around? If so, would this damage the seat?

I am concerned that if we put the seats in the outside compartment of the plane (not sure what this is called) then we will miss our connection because I think that we have to wait for the entire plane to disembark before the attendants can retrieve it for us - costing precious time.

Thanks so much for all of your replies everyone - they are all helpful.


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

The Radians fold in half, don't they? That can make it easier to carry them.

Ask the airline how gate-checking works for them; you may be right about having to wait, which would defeat the purpose of checking the seats for speed.

Seats checked at the counter *will* get thrown, probably more than once. Remember that Samsonite commercial with the gorilla? There's a reason they used that device. ;-) They may not get damaged, but they also may... and it may be damage *you can't see*, so you can't just inspect the seat and be sure it's ok.

The rental car company may not know what seats they have. It's very unlikely that the harness will fit the six-year-old, and the booster is likely to be low-back. The harness *may* not fit the four-year-old either, and the same caveats apply to rental seats as to seats you buy at garage sales or off craigslist: you don't know the history. Worse yet, though, the company doesn't know the history either! They'll know if the seat was in an accident, sure... but not if it was damaged in other ways. Also, they may even be expired. I've heard several times (including from my best friend) that a reserved seat wasn't available when the car was picked up, too... so the kids had to wait while one of the adults went to a store and bought a brand-new seat.

I know it sounds like it's going to be difficult, but I don't think that checking the seats will be worth it. What you can do is have one of the adults go with the SnugRide and, say, the six-year-old and all the carry-on baggage as soon as the plane unloads, and leave the other adult to uninstall the seats and carry them with the four-year-old (or swap the older kids, depending on their maturity and what will be easiest). That way, someone can be at the gate to represent your family and assure personnel that the other person will be there soon. (If you can uninstall one Radian quickly and have it go with the first person, even better.)


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## EstoArtemis (Jan 10, 2009)

The best is to call the airline and ask what is allowed on the type of aircraft you will be on. We are flying on Saturday and for the particular plane we are on our FF seat is too large to be permitted in the cabin.
The airline did recommend that if we were checking the seat to put it in a large garbage bag to protect it from dirt and dust and to be sure we label the bag well with the destination information. We booked a toddler seat with the rental, just in case our seat winds up being "lost luggage" then we have a back up (if our seat makes it we can cancel the rental seat at the rental desk).


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## caro113 (Aug 25, 2008)

You need something specific for the plane ride and a lot of carriers have them for you to use. I'm planning a trip too and and my thread is under "life with a babe" titled "flying with an infant". I'm wearing my baby so I don't have to pay for a seat and I'm putting her carseat in checked luggage. I found a website though that was very helpful for such questions as yours and it also has some great advice!
www.flyingwithkids.com
Good Luck!!!


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## Ironica (Sep 11, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EstoArtemis* 
The best is to call the airline and ask what is allowed on the type of aircraft you will be on. We are flying on Saturday and for the particular plane we are on our FF seat is too large to be permitted in the cabin.

If your seat has the FAA sticker on it, and your child meets the height and weight requirements for the seat, and you've bought a ticket for the child, the airline MAY NOT bar your seat from being used.


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## melijack1 (Nov 18, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ironica* 
Obviously, this is something that varies from child to child, but I'm curious as to your plan to keep him buckled. What will you do if he unbuckles his seat belt?

Well, he's a pretty good listener...so I'll buckle him, remind him to leave it alone, and distract him with the stuff I brought for him to play with. Honestly, he never messes with his buckles and straps on his car seat, and I intend to lead by example by not unbuckling my own seat. I simply won't make it an option or a point for argument. He is pretty good about things when he has no choice in the matter.


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

The radian will fit in the overhead bin. So if you don't want to install it on the plane, you can just carry it on and stow it. Then it'd be quick to get down and make your connection.

When we gate check, usually the items are there before we get off of the plane. You can also let the flight attendent know about your connection and they will often phone over and let your next flight know you are on the way.

With that many connections, if you check your seats with luggage it's very likely they won't make it through.


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## snoopy5386 (May 6, 2005)

You said you have two radians correct? I believe they fold up. I would fold them up and put them in a large duffle bag and gate check them. Are you going to be taking a stroller? You'll have to gate check them too. The gate check stuff is almost always there waiting for you when you get off the plane. We had to wait 5 mins for it once. I think that is your best bet. That way you know the seats are making it from plane to plane with you. You can always send one parent ahead with the kids while the other waits for the stuff if it isn't there right away. My biggest issue would be the time it takes to install/uninstall the seats on the plane and the space for your kids. The seats are soooo close together I would want to give my kids as much space as possible. I would bring the baby's snugride on the plane with me though.
Heck, you installing the seats could possibly result in one of your planes being late! Let's say you barely make one of your connections and are the last ones on the plane. You have to install 3 seats, get your kids in them and get yourself seated and your carryons stowed before the plane can back away from the gate. I see this taking no less than 10 mins. This could cause the plane to lose its "spot" in the lineup to take off and get bumped to the end of the line delaying it for quite a while if the airport is busy. I have flown several times where the flight attendants are practically yelling at folks to get seated and buckled so we can back away from the gate and not lose our space in the lineup.


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## EstoArtemis (Jan 10, 2009)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ironica* 
If your seat has the FAA sticker on it, and your child meets the height and weight requirements for the seat, and you've bought a ticket for the child, the airline MAY NOT bar your seat from being used.

The OP is Canadian (as I am), our flight regulations are bit different.
The flight I am on will not allow the FF car seat we use because of the maximum dimensions allowable on the particular type/size of plane we are on.
Our flight compliance stickers are also a bit different - we have a code number to show aircraft compliance rather than the phrase the FAA requires it to have (some may have it up here but most don't the FAA style). Without the FAA style sticker the seat maybe asked to be checked as luggage if any of the connecting flights choose to be sticklers about the "proper" labeling.

Mamatotwo - Florida regulations allow booster seats for kids at the age of 2, but I'm still keeping with a 5-point for my 4 yo. If your kids fit the 20-40lb seats here it should be no different with the toddler rental seats there - they should be the same style of seat as we have here. The car company we are renting from guarantees infant and toddler seat availability if they were reserved with your booking - they didn't guarantee booster seats.


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## marrymeflyfree (Jan 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *mamatotwo* 
Thanks.

One of the stop-overs is only 30 minutes and several others are extreamly tight also. I am just trying to imagine how my DH and I will get 3 kids (one baby), 3 carseats and all of our carry-on lugggage from one plane to the next in a hurry. Anyone BTDT? I am feeling a little bit overwhelmed with it all, I think...

You can call the airline and request electric cart assistance. Also...did you book this reservation directly through the airline? If not (if you used a travel agent or Orbitz, Priceline, etc), you can call the airline and ask if your short stopovers are legal connect times. There are minimums set at each airport, and some travel agents and discounters occasionally ignore the rules. If it is not a legal connect time, they may be able to help you with a more doable itinerary.


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## marrymeflyfree (Jan 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ironica* 
The rule, actually, is something like a carseat cannot be installed between an adult passenger and the nearest aisle.

Not necessarily...this may vary depending on the airline. Where I work, we encourage car seats to be at the window. However, they can be in the center or aisle *if* they do not completely block one's exit *and* if the people behind the car seat(s) are adults who are directly responsible for the child.


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## DahliaRW (Apr 16, 2005)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *marrymeflyfree* 
Not necessarily...this may vary depending on the airline. Where I work, we encourage car seats to be at the window. However, they can be in the center or aisle *if* they do not completely block one's exit *and* if the people behind the car seat(s) are adults who are directly responsible for the child.

I've also heard that ffing car seats don't have to be by the window, but rfing ones do. My kiddos always want to sit by the window anyways, so it's not an issue!


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## marrymeflyfree (Jan 5, 2008)

Quote:


Originally Posted by *DahliaRW* 
I've also heard that ffing car seats don't have to be by the window, but rfing ones do. My kiddos always want to sit by the window anyways, so it's not an issue!

There's no hard and fast rule on RF vs FF at my airline, just that the exit not be totally blocked. Our RF infant seat does totally block the exit, so she goes by the window.

(The RF seat also prevents the person in front of the car seat from reclining...so what we do is release the belt and turn the seat to face us between takeoff and landing, and we let that person know that they won't have to be fully upright the whole time!)


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